# Review of Little-Dot MKIVse



## Penchum

I posted this review over on the LD site a few weeks ago and several folks have asked me to post it here as well. This review takes you from ordering through burn-in and tube rolling. You will see time breaks, these are from additional postings that updated the review as I went along. I freely gave my impressions as they happened so that all types of users would get something from it. So, here it is...

 Review of Little Dot MK-IVse Headphone Amp/Pre Amp 

 Out of box experience: 
 I ordered my LD MK-IVse on a Wednesday and received it on the following Tuesday! This really surprised me because it came from China to Arizona in such a short time! The box was in great shape and I started un-boxing immediately. The MK-IVse was cradled in poly-foam inserts that keep it centered in the box, away from the sides and tops with about 3 inches clearance all around. The contents of the box were the unit, connecting cords, ¼ headphone adapter and English user manual. The tubes that come with the MK-IVse are pre-installed in their sockets, ready to go. 

 Impressions on initial power up: 
 I ordered my MK-IVse with a green power LED. I could have chosen red, yellow or blue, but I like to listen in the dark at night and green is the least bright of the color selections. After hooking up my Creative Zen Vision player and plugging in my Sennheiser HD-650 headphones, I reached back and flipped the power switch. Power came up without incident and I took a long listen while looking over the unit. Everything about the unit externally is as pictured on the Little Dot Forum, except the volume knob. It has been improved on the “se” model. It is larger with a brushed convex aluminum face that matches the front plate perfectly. The sound tracks I’m using are MP3s at 320kbps, created using my Creative X-FI Music soundcard in my desktop PC from a digital source. I set the volume on my Creative Vision to 23 of 25, which is just under distorting and gave the MK-IVse volume knob a twist to the 12:00 position. WOW! At this level, it is showing off its superior power compared to my old LDII++ unit. The song that was playing first was ZZ Top’s “Give it up” and the first thing that struck me hard was the depth of the bass. Way down there subterranean bass! It was slightly messy, but not excessively. As the song continued, it was apparent that the mids were clean and clear with highs up around 14k. Beyond that, things were too messy to determine any kind of accuracy. As with my LDII++, it was obvious the tubes and the unit needed some burn-in time before I could proceed. I setup the Creative Vision to random play the 450 songs on its hard drive and let the unit play away. 

 Impressions after 100 hour burn-in: 
 At this point, the MK-IVse might as well be a completely different unit! Gone are the messy low bass, replaced with accurate, tight and solid bass. The highs now cleanly extend beyond normal hearing. Accuracy throughout the entire spectrum has tightened up and revealed some shocking revelations. The first revelation was the presence of a wide but pleasing sound stage. It was neither too much nor not enough. The second revelation was the fine nuances that most headphone amps can’t reproduce accurately, like the sound of the drummers stick hitting the ride cymbal, and you can tell if the stick was plastic tipped or wooden tipped. The vocals are so accurate that you can tell if the lead vocalist is facing forward or not. You can hear the bass player’s fingers move to the next note (usually, you only hear the lead guitar do this). Later piano passages sound so real it will make your jaw drop! This was totally unexpected!! I wanted to see if the revelations would continue to reveal themselves when amplified harder, so I ran the volume knob to the 3:00 position. Good Lord! The strength of amplification was outstanding! No distortion, no sign of strain or over accentuation! I had no idea the Sennheiser HD-650s would take this much super clean amplification! This was all just a little too much, so I decided that I should take steps to prevent over stating my findings, so I walked away and returned in a few hours to see if my impressions still matched. They did and more! Considering I am using just the Creative Zen Vision as a source, I can only imagine how great this unit will sound with a good DAC and Disc, Tape or LP source. One thing is for certain, I’m going DAC shopping soon! 

 Impressions after 200 hour burn-in: 
 This turned out to be the fun part. As it was with my LDII++ headphone amp/pre-amp, this MK-IVse has matured into one outstanding headphone amp/pre-amp! That’s right! I have tested it as a pre-amp as well. Here is how I handled the testing. I hooked the MK-IVse up to the AUX2 in on my Pioneer Spec-1 pre-amplifier and decided I would do a direct comparison between headphone results and pre-amp results. Using the same tracks to listen too, I piped the Creative Zen signal through the MK-IVse, and into my main system (Pioneer SPEC 1&4 to Pioneer HPM-100s). I expected there to be quite a big difference between how the system sounds and the Sennheiser HD-650s sound. Wow, was I ever wrong. All of the positive attributes noticed with the HD-650s were present across my main system!! It was clean, clear, tight and wholesome. What I wasn’t expecting was the digital source roughness (even though only slight with the Creative Zen Vision) was completely gone. It sounded very similar to a track off of my Technics RS-1700 Reel to Reel! The sound stage was almost an exact match, with spatial positioning being slightly clearer to distinguish than with the HD-650 headphones. I pretty sure this is due to the HPM-100 speakers and their exceptional high end clarity. Now I just had to try a different source. I piped the output from my Technics RS-1700 Reel to Reel through the MK-IVse and plugged in the HD-650s. Another surprise! I was expecting the MK-IVse to make the highs a little less clear, but that didn’t happen. I was rewarded with the usual “yummy” sound of the Reel to Reel, but I also received the improved sound stage and positioning of the MK-IVse! This is a great combination I plan to listen too often! 

 Other Headphones and the MK-IVse: 
 I kept going back and substituting my Sennheiser HD-650s with my Sennheiser HD-580s, to see if I could find a weak spot in the listening enjoyment. What I discovered was that the HD-580s mirror imaged my findings on the HD-650s, but made the overall sound seem more “Rock” oriented. It was just different, not better or worse. I was totally thrilled with the results! The adjustable “gain” on the MK-IVse was set to “high” for the 300ohm rating on both headphones. 

 Lasting impressions: 
 I have read where the DarkVoice 33x series (latest models) sound great with headphones, but don’t sound very good as a pre-amplifier. Some DV owners have speculated that this problem is not due to the inferior default tube selection by DV, but the design of the pre-amp section of the unit. According to users, if they roll in some superior tubes, the pre-amp problem persists. Combine this with mediocre default tubes and you are in for disappointment right out of the box. The LD MK-IVse exhibits no such deficiencies and sounds almost identical using either the headphone out or pre-amp output. This is obviously due to the MK-IVse’s superior design and build quality. One peak inside this unit and you are treated to some of the best components and craftsmanship on the market. The MK-IVse does not get hot, even if you are taxing it to the maximum (unlike the LD II++ unit), and it has truck loads of headroom for those super dynamic passages! There is NO grounding noise, line interference or RF intrusion either! The locking headphone jack is a really nice feature and the selection of default tubes for the “se” model is superior to all of its competitor’s default selections that I have seen. I consider the fit and finish of the MK-IVse to be superior to others on the market, in the same class. The type of case, paint and polish are clean and professional looking. The golden plate with attached golden tube guards looks very cool, especially at night when they give off a nice golden glow! Tube “rolling” possibilities are restricted to the same family of tubes, but it is this family of tubes that helps achieve the superior sound quality in the first place, so not much “tube rolling” will be necessary anyway! Now I’m sure you are wondering if there is a negative side to the MK-IVse. To put it succinctly, no. Every tasking I threw at the MK-IVse, it responded with superior sound quality that will not disappoint even the most demanding of audiophiles. Some users might want additional analog or digital in jacks for their other equipment to be hooked up. Once you realize that the “cost” of producing the MK-IVse has gone into “ultra-quality” components, those jacks don’t seem quite as important. It would make better sense to purchase a high quality multi-featured DAC to use with the MK-IVse. This is what I plan to do so I can run optical digital in and listen to headphones. Price wise, the LD MK-IVse is on par with competing units, but represents a better “bang for the buck” in power, quality and support. 

 Conclusion: 
 For the headphone amp and tube pre-amp buyer who wishes to purchase a unit, plug it in, burn it in, and then just enjoy the music, the MK-IVse is an outstanding unit to fulfill your needs. You will have everything you will need for years of uninterrupted enjoyment. For the buyer who wishes to dabble in tube rolling a little, listen to headphones some, use the pre-amp some and generally use a new unit to its fullest extent, the MK-IVse is a custom fit for your needs too! For the buyer who is a “Tube Rolling Fanatic”, I would recommend the MKIV regular version. It has the ability to switch from the default family of tubes (like the “se”) to the same family of tubes used by the LD II++ unit. This will give you an additional 10-15 possible tube selections. 

 The MK-IVse is a “muscle car” in the power department, which will blow you and your favorite music away! For the first time in a long time, I can say with absolute confidence, get out your wallet and purchase the superior LD MK-IVse. You will not be disappointed. Congratulations go out to David, Sword and the others at Little Dot. You have once again proven that audio done right, has great might! 

 UPDATE 6 DAYS LATER...

 Well, the MKIVse is turning out to be a far better unit than I could ever hope for. Everything seems past any kind of break-in period and I have about 300 hours on it. Last week, I ordered a setup of tubes (Phillips Jan 5687WB) to take the place of the Mullards. I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE WHAT I'M HEARING! These tubes sound better right out of the box than the Mullards did after 200 hours break-in. I ran them for @ 50hours and they improved even more. I turned right around and ordered another set for spares! So completely High-Fidelity these new tubes are, I'm done tube rolling power tubes from now on. I have some GE 408A's, WE 408A's and Sylvania 408A's coming, so it will only be driver tube rolling from now on. I have never heard a tube like those Phillips 5687WB's before! They are top dog on my list now! Extremely Highly Recommended even at the higher cost.

 UPDATE 4 DAYS LATER...

 Well, I’ve been using my MKIVse for over 400 hours now. I believe it is done burning in. From the 200 hour mark, there have been final “icing on the cake” changes I had not expected. The most obvious has been an increase in headroom (The amplifiers ability to cleanly drive music without draining its reserves and distorting). I can now turn it way up, to the point of hurting my ears (just once to find out), and it did not distort or become shrill. It just amplified it more and remained clean. The second most noticeable has been a final improvement in the lower end bass. If I had to describe it, I would say it is reproducing the bass without coloration or over amplification. Nice clean, tight and subterranean bass. My favorite!! 

 I would also like to offer up a little advice for those who are shopping for an excellent headphone amp. If you are looking for the best bang for the buck, buy the MKIII. If you have the extra money and want something slightly more powerful and refined, buy the MKIV(standard). If you are not concerned so much about the cost, and want one of the best tube headphone pre-amp / amps on the market, buy the MKIVse. Whichever model you choose, you will NOT be disappointed!

 UPDATE 7 DAYS LATER...

 Well, the Tong-Sol's are burned in. Every part of the audio spectrum has tightened up. They reach WAY down to subterranean bass levels and extend up to super high levels, cleanly, without any drop off. They are fantastic tubes. At first, I thought they would just be "rock" tubes, but once the burn-in was done, I tried Rock, Jazz, Soft Rock, Classical and orchestra. All of these sounded amazing!! They are not mellow like the Mullards. They are crisp, clean and detailed.

 So far, here is what tube rolling has revealed to me: 

 Power Tubes 
 E182CC Mullards = Mellow and beautiful to all kinds of music 
 5687 WB Phillips = Clean, wide sound stage, increase in dynamics for all music 
 5687 WB Tong-Sol = Crisp, clean, detailed and dynamic for all music 

 Driver Tubes 
 408A W Elect = Best definition and punch through out. Very full spectrum 
 408A G Elect = Less over all definition, punch still on bass end of spectrum 
 408A Sylvania = Almost identical to G Elect 
 408A G Elect 5 star = Almost identical to W Elect, slight improvement in vocals 

 As you can see, one noticeable trend is that the Power Tubes (no matter which) work well with all types of music. Very cool indeed! 
 All of the Driver tubes sound wonderful, so interesting changes between them, but all are great tubes. What is fascinating to me, is when you mix one set of Power Tubes with a different set of Driver Tubes. Some very interesting combinations can be made!!! My favorite so far is pairing the E182CC Mullard Power Tubes with the 408A G Elect 5 Star Driver Tubes. WOW! What an amazing sound combination! I still can't identify what I'm hearing, but it sure is sweet! Second favorite would be the 5687 WB Tong-Sol Power Tubes with the 408A W Elect Driver Tubes. It is more of a "super" all around combination. I could listen to this combo from now on, and never roll another tube! (maybe) 

 Anyway, I hope this can help some other MKIV users get an idea of what tubes to be looking for. They may sound different to you than with me, but I will say that none of them will sound average or poor after burn-in. I am sure of that! I'll update this list as I do more. 

 Dave McLaughlin 
 LD MK-IVse owner and 
 Audiophile since 1977

 *****UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE AS OF 01-11-08 UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE*****

 Word from DavidZ at Little-Dot, about the MKIVse and it's default tubes:
 "The WE408A is a 20V filament tube so the front driver tube voltage is modified to 6.3V for the M8100. The rear 6H30PI has a different pin-out and characteristics from the E182CC. At this point we are completely out of the E182CC vacuum tubes, and we have a few months supply of the 6H30PI left. Therefore all MK IV SE from this point on will be M8100 and 6H30PI version until we run out of 6H30PI tubes, at which point the MK IV SE will be discontinued. I hope this helps!"

 So, from now on, the MKIVse will be hard wired to use the M8100 and 6H30PI tubes. When Little-Dot runs out, the "se" version is all gone. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The MKIV and MKIVse are real power savers!!! The average power usage is only 30 watts!! 1/2 a light bulb! Love it!!!


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## PascalT

Thanks for the very extensive review, nice work. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Looks like I might need to buy an MKIV once I get "bored" with the MKIII


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## Capunk

You Sir! are excellent salesman!
 I'm totally buy it! This gonna be my next amp. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Pretty intensive review (hardcore) 
 I wonder the tubes isn't explode after tremendous intense testing? 
 Have you tried any low impedance headphones with this amp? (Like my Denon D2000, or such?)


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## tomjtx

Excellent , well written and thorough review. Thanks for that.
 It sounds like you got one great amp.

 I am curious if you have directly ab'd the LD with any of the DV amps extensively in your own system or were you basing those DV comments on what you have read from DV owners.

 Comparisons can be very enlightening when carefully done, AKA skylab and marroyo.
 However , comparisons done w/o personal and lengthy listening are more in the realm of speculation, aren't they?

 I say this because , as a recent DV 337 purchaser I would love to see a full comparo.
 It would be interesting to get a MKIVSE to skylab to compare to his DV337,

 as if he doesn't have enough to do already 

 Anyway, congrats on your purchase , it is a lovely looking amp.


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjtx* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Excellent , well written and thorough review. Thanks for that.
 It sounds like you got one great amp.

 I am curious if you have directly ab'd the LD with any of the DV amps extensively in your own system or were you basing those DV comments on what you have read from DV owners.

 Comparisons can be very enlightening when carefully done, AKA skylab and marroyo.
 However , comparisons done w/o personal and lengthy listening are more in the realm of speculation, aren't they?

 I say this because , as a recent DV 337 purchaser I would love to see a full comparo.
 It would be interesting to get a MKIVSE to skylab to compare to his DV337,

 as if he doesn't have enough to do already 

 Anyway, congrats on your purchase , it is a lovely looking amp._

 

Thanks for the kind remarks! I haven't been able to get my hands on a DV (sure would like to though) and my comments about the pre-amp section were based on owners here. I did manage to continue testing the MKIVse as a pre-amp and it is really astounding. I have a vintage Pioneer SPEC stack and the other day I was using the MKIVse directly to the SPEC-4 amplifier.
 I was expecting it to "show" a weakness since I was not running it through the SPEC-1 pre-amp first. After a short time testing, my wife came in my home office and said, "what the hell is wrong with you?", because I was having a giggling fit!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Here was my little Creative Vision, hooked to the MKIVse, hooked to the big SPEC-4 amp and it was pumping about 50w RMS and it sounded so good, so full! I was dumbfounded. I'm going to repeat all my tests again when my Zero DAC arrives, using 3 different digital sources.
 Have a good one!

 Dave McLaughlin


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## Negatron

Exceptionally well written review Dave. You covered a lot of ground in a very detailed and informative way.
 It's good to hear that the new SE matures in the same glorious fashion as it predecessors.
 The MK line has turned out to be quite a set of amps. Thanks for the write-up.


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## HK_sends

Thanks for bringing the review over Penchum! I think more people needed to read it.

 Excellent!

 -HK sends


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## tomjtx

Dave,
 Thanks for the clarification.

 The LD is one good looking amp that I almost bought a few months ago but at the time there were no reviews here about it .

 It's great that you have written such a thorough review that can help others.


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## unkle11

nice review! but i don't think the senns you mentioned are 600 ohms are they? or are there 600 ohm versions like with Beyers? i would really like to know how they would handle sextetts is the reason i ask


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *unkle11* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nice review! but i don't think the senns you mentioned are 600 ohms are they? or are there 600 ohm versions like with Beyers? i would really like to know how they would handle sextetts is the reason i ask_

 

Hi! Well, my fading memory thought they were.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'll double check and get back to you.
 Thanks

 Dave McLaughlin


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi! Well, my fading memory thought they were.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'll double check and get back to you.
 Thanks

 Dave McLaughlin_

 

Ok, my bad memory! Both are 300 ohm. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Sorry about that!! Review updated with proper ohms.

 Dave McLaughlin


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## Skylab

Excellent review! Congrats. It would be great if you could add some pictures.

 For the record, I have only ever seen one particular person claim the DV amps don't work well as preamps (I have never tried it myself, and perhaps I have missed other people making that comment), But I think it might be a wee bit of a stretch to say:

  Quote:


 Combine this with mediocre default tubes and you are in for disappointment right out of the box. The LD MK-IVse exhibits no such deficiencies and sounds almost identical using either the headphone out or pre-amp output. This is obviously due to the MK-IVse’s superior design and build quality. 
 

unless you have actually had a DV amp in your possession. The LD MK IVse may indeed be better in all those ways, but until one actually compares the two, it's a little hard to say.

 The MkIV is a nice looking amp - tempting to try one. Thanks again for the insightful review.


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## tomjtx

X2


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Excellent review! Congrats. It would be great if you could add some pictures.

 For the record, I have only ever seen one particular person claim the DV amps don't work well as preamps (I have never tried it myself, and perhaps I have missed other people making that comment), But I think it might be a wee bit of a stretch to say:



 unless you have actually had a DV amp in your possession. The LD MK IVse may indeed be better in all those ways, but until one actually compares the two, it's a little hard to say.

 The MkIV is a nice looking amp - tempting to try one. Thanks again for the insightful review._


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## Penchum

Not a problem. I ran into several and they were about 2 of the newer models. But, it might not be important. The aspect I can say for sure is that the MKIVse works extremely well as a pre-amp and I assume there are others that also work well, or we'd hear about them more. Thanks for the comments, it is nice to hear other reviewers like my review!!

 Dave McLaughlin


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## HK_sends

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The MkIV is a nice looking amp - tempting to try one._

 

Skylab, you should definitely try the MK IV SE and the MK I. LD keeps getting better. My MK IV SE has been burning in (along with my K-701s) at 50% volume for over 50 hours. Even with the stock tubes, I hear a well balanced sound including a good bass (not punchy or overwhelming) presence, even with the AKGs.

 But 50 hours of the Lord of the Rings soundtracks (the first two being the complete recordings) can drive you crazy being in the same room (no, I wasn't wearing the headphones). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 -HK sends


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HK_sends* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Skylab, you should definitely try the MK IV SE and the MK I. LD keeps getting better. My MK IV SE has been burning in (along with my K-701s) at 50% volume for over 50 hours. Even with the stock tubes, I hear a well balanced sound including a good bass (not punchy or overwhelming) presence, even with the AKGs.

 But 50 hours of the Lord of the Rings soundtracks (the first two being the complete recordings) can drive you crazy being in the same room (no, I wasn't wearing the headphones). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 -HK sends_

 

Skylab,
 I know you have been mostly dealing with portable goodies, but it might be refreshing to those wanting (looking) for desktop goodies to hear your impressions as well. What do you think? X2 what -HK sends.


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## Skylab

Thanks for the kind words, but work commitments prevent me from taking on a massive project like that. In addition, it would be far too costly for me to buy a whole bunch of desktop amps, and so I would have to try to secure review samples from their makers, and I am nor so sure they would want to do that.


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## Mulo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the kind words, but work commitments prevent me from taking on a massive project like that. In addition, it would be far too costly for me to buy a whole bunch of desktop amps, and so I would have to try to secure review samples from their makers, and I am nor so sure they would want to do that._

 

Why don't you try the new LD Mk I portable? That should be in your reach... And it's one very interesting new portable amp - a potential class champion.


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mulo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Why don't you try the new LD Mk I portable? That should be in your reach... And it's one very interesting new portable amp - a potential class champion._

 

Mulo, How long have you had yours? Could you write a review for us? I'm very curious about the MK1. Very nice looking indeed! I'd love it if it could drive more expensive headphones. What do you think?


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## Bozz_Keren

Hi
 i just received MKIV last week, it's good amp, but i feel getting less tubey sound, i'm kinda hoping it will be lush like LD2++, does the tube responsible for this?


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## Danika k

How does the MKIV compare to the LDII++? Is it worth the increase in cost to a newbie?


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How does the MKIV compare to the LDII++? Is it worth the increase in cost to a newbie?_

 

Hi! The MKIVse is far more powerful and in a whole different quality sound level compared to the LDII++, and it is worth every penny. Now, having said that, you must understand that the second part of your question is a tough call. Since I don't know what source and headphones you have, I can't tell how you are approaching your audio goals. Many here want "newbies" to take a slow costly upgrade path. I don't condone this because it expends to much money while on the path to achieving your goals. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I would say to you, purchase what you can afford and don't look back. The LDII++ is no slouch and many fall in love with it permanently. I'd be glad to give you better advice if you could tell me what you already have and where you would like to be. PM me if info is sensitive and not good for posting here.

 Dave McLaughlin


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## iozz

Tx for the review Dave!

 I'm very interested in this amp but I read elsewhere that it was lacking bass impact... That bothers me a lot, as I'd like to pair it with my Alessandro MS-Pro and gain some punch...


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## Bozz_Keren

MKIV didn't add much low in my setup, with stock tubes that is


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## Von Soundcard

I would be curious if there are differences in sound between the MkIV and the MkIV SE. That is, how does the pre-amp section influence the rest of the amp ?

 Also, I would be curious if there are big differences between the III and the IV. Allright, more power, more refined but is the IV clearly better, more transparent, dynamic, rich or full than the III ? Also do they share the same sound signature ?


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## ounkchicago

I recently had the opportunity to test the MK IV SE (which I own) against the MK III. I didn't have the MK III long enough to do any extensive testing, but I did manage to sneak a few listening sessions. Testing was done using a CA 640c and a CA 840c and AKG K701 headphones.

 I would describe the MK III as warmer sounding, but with less bass and overall headroom than the MK IV SE. I suspect that most audiophiles on this forum would far prefer the MK IV SE, as it sounds more reference-like while still retaining a nice tube sound signature.

 With a mid-fi source such as the CA 640c, there was not a huge difference between the two amps. But with the CA 840c, the MK IV SE sounded far better than the MK III.

 All in all, I was very impressed with these two amps. The MK III seems like a good deal at $199 plus shipping, but if it was my own money I prefer the MK IV SE at $399 plus shipping. The difference between the two models (with the right source) is a lot bigger than I thought.


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## ounkchicago

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Von Soundcard* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would be curious if there are differences in sound between the MkIV and the MkIV SE. That is, how does the pre-amp section influence the rest of the amp ?

 Also, I would be curious if there are big differences between the III and the IV. Allright, more power, more refined but is the IV clearly better, more transparent, dynamic, rich or full than the III ? Also do they share the same sound signature ?_

 

I am also curious. I would love to hear some feedback about the MK IV vs. the MK IV SE. But until then, I'll be enjoying my SE.

 The difference between then III and the IV are substantial. Which model is right for you depends on your budget and your source. For mid-fi sources, I think the MK III is a better match, as it won't reveal as many of the "flaws" of the mid-fi source. For hi-fi sources, it's a no-brainer, the MK IV is far better.

 Another comment that is often overlooked: on the little dot website, the MK III and the MK IV look very similar. But in fact their dimensions are different -- the MK IV is significantly larger. I think of them as two different classes of amps, but of course this distinction often gets lost in forum posts.


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## Penchum

Thanks for the kind words guys. Your questions I find very interesting and some I might be able to help with. MKIVse owners: Once past 200hrs, pick up some tung-sol tubes. You are in for a treat once they burn-in. Bass for days!!

 MKIII vs MKIVse. The MKIVse is a higher-end design (OTL) and has extremely high end components. That alone is the cost increase. If you have a really excellent source (or plan too), then the MKIVse is the right choice. Also, the pre-amp section of the MKIVse is every bit as excellent as the headphone section. I drove my Pioneer SPEC4 amp with it and it was real sweet!! The MKIII is made from high end components and has an excellent pre-amp section as well. It is NOT supposed to be the highest end amp. It is designed to give the average audiophile and his/her hi-fi equipment some serious enjoyment without breaking the bank.

 MKIV vs MKIVse. I would have to defer this question to David Z at Little-Tube. He can describe the sonic differences between the two with ease.
 I haven't tried the MKIV yet, so I'm lacking to answer this question.

 Newbies and the LDII++ vs MKIVse. I own both. When I got the MKIVse, I just couldn't part with the LDII++. The LDII++ has a unique sound and improves dramatically with proper tubes. Having said that, the LDII++ is not in the same league as the MKIII or MKIV series. It doesn't have the power, headroom or fidelity to compete at that level. It shouldn't!! It is an extremely good buy right now because it is being discontinued. The MKIII is the new "sweet spot" for Little-Tube. For most newbies, I'd have to say, spend the extra $50 and get the MKIII. This will give you some absolute improvements and you might never want to replace it, later on down the road.

 It is good to see users interested in Little-Tube. The default recommendation seems to be "run out and buy a DV". While I read very good things about DV units, they do come at a price. I'd rather see users get the best bang for their money and then enjoy their music. After all, it's all about the enjoyment of music. Doing so using the least amount of cash is icing on the audio cake!

 Dave McLaughlin


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## ounkchicago

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ Also, the pre-amp section of the MKIVse is every bit as excellent as the headphone section. I drove my Pioneer SPEC4 amp with it and it was real sweet!!_

 

I've also been using my MK IV SE as a preamp with very favorable results. I have a question though. The pre-amp out is controlled by the main volume control knob. I don't know much about pre-amps, but how should this volume be set (when not plugging in headphones)?

 If I turn the volume up too high, then the volume control on my downstream amp/speakers is too sensitive. Aside from downstream volume control, are there any guidelines for using higher or lower volume on a MK IV SE?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ounkchicago* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've also been using my MK IV SE as a preamp with very favorable results. I have a question though. The pre-amp out is controlled by the main volume control knob. I don't know much about pre-amps, but how should this volume be set (when not plugging in headphones)?

 If I turn the volume up too high, then the volume control on my downstream amp/speakers is too sensitive. Aside from downstream volume control, are there any guidelines for using higher or lower volume on a MK IV SE?_

 

All I did was source match the volume to match other components like my R2R or CD player. I figured that was safest. Just switch sources back and forth until you have the same volume set.


----------



## iozz

Are there some MKIVse still available? I cannot find one on ebay anymore, nor regular version. Is there another place on the web to buy one of these?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iozz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Are there some MKIVse still available? I cannot find one on ebay anymore, nor regular version. Is there another place on the web to buy one of these?_

 

The easy way is to email David Z at Little-Tube. His link is on the Little-Tube forum. Have a good one!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iozz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Are there some MKIVse still available? I cannot find one on ebay anymore, nor regular version. Is there another place on the web to buy one of these?_

 

I just found it. little.tube@gmail.com Just tell them what you want and they will get back to you. PayPal is best.


----------



## iozz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just found it. little.tube@gmail.com Just tell them what you want and they will get back to you. PayPal is best._

 

Tx 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I still don't know what to do, I'm not sure how the MKIV will pair with my MS-Pro and Darth. The fact that the bass seems to be a bit shy bothers me... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'd really like to have an impactful bass response with the Alessandro...


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iozz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Tx 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I still don't know what to do, I'm not sure how the MKIV will pair with my MS-Pro and Darth. The fact that the bass seems to be a bit shy bothers me... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'd really like to have an impactful bass response with the Alessandro..._

 

Thats interesting. Honestly, my MKIVse gets way down subterranean bass and it isn't shy at all. That would be with the HD-580s or 650s. I never expected the MKIVse to "add" bass, due to it's high-end design, but you can swap tubes and get even more bass if needed. The stock Mullards are great, but they keep things flat (which is good thing for some music). When I put in my Phillips tubes, it is like flipping a switch to "rock and roll" setting! Jazz is great with them too. It is possible that sources make a big difference too. I try to run all my sources flat and let the tubes do their magic. Usually this works great. A few albums I have are poorly recorded and I have to boost things a bit, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Let us know how things go!!


----------



## iozz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Let us know how things go!!_

 

I asked David from Little Tube about my doubts and he told me that maybe the newly MKV was a better choice for me. But it's not a tube amp.
 I don't want to add bass, I'd just like to have a punchy bass response, rock n' roll 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The MKV costs the same as the regular MKIV... Hmmm I think I'm going to make something stupid


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iozz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I asked David from Little Tube about my doubts and he told me that maybe the newly MKV was a better choice for me. But it's not a tube amp.
 I don't want to add bass, I'd just like to have a punchy bass response, rock n' roll 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The MKV costs the same as the regular MKIV... Hmmm I think I'm going to make something stupid 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

He,he,he, well, judging from the specs, maybe he's right. The MKV looks totally powerful! If you get it, a review would be nice!!
 Good luck either way!!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iozz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I asked David from Little Tube about my doubts and he told me that maybe the newly MKV was a better choice for me. But it's not a tube amp.
 I don't want to add bass, I'd just like to have a punchy bass response, rock n' roll 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The MKV costs the same as the regular MKIV... Hmmm I think I'm going to make something stupid 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hey, did you ever decide what you were going to do, yet? In a funny way, I was hoping you would pickup the MKV.
 Just curious!! Thanks!


----------



## Penchum

I sometimes like to modify the exterior of my amps to improve on their looks or to match a theme that is already in place. When I bought my MKIVse, it seemed so complete that I couldn't think of anything right away. Then one night, it hit me... replace the stock volume knob with something heavy, smooth and beautiful. Here is a pic of what I did:






 A gold knob to match up with the gold tube guards and plate. I purchased the knob came from one of the HeadFi supporters, Parts conneXion.


----------



## Bozz_Keren

wow that's just beautiful Penchum, do u need to open the front chassis first to change the knob?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_wow that's just beautiful Penchum, do u need to open the front chassis first to change the knob?_

 

Ow, no, it's dead simple. The original knob has a set screw. A very small Allen wrench. Once you have that loose, then make sure the pot is on 0, line up the new knob, slide it on the shaft and set it's Allen screw. Thats it!
 That gold one is top quality! It is the 30mm one they sell (biggest).


----------



## Bozz_Keren

is it universal fit? if so i'll find here at my local store


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_is it universal fit? if so i'll find here at my local store 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

They are a 6mm shaft diameter, which I think is 7/16 US. Most are in mm though, so it shouldn't be a problem.


----------



## Bozz_Keren

nice, thanks


----------



## wae5

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I sometimes like to modify the exterior of my amps to improve on their looks or to match a theme that is already in place. When I bought my MKIVse, it seemed so complete that I couldn't think of anything right away. Then one night, it hit me... replace the stock volume knob with something heavy, smooth and beautiful. Here is a pic of what I did:






 A gold knob to match up with the gold tube guards and plate. I purchased the knob came from one of the HeadFi supporters, Parts conneXion. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hi Penchum:

 Thank you for the very seductive pix -I immediately ordered the knob before it's sold out. I also sent Parts Connexion this page address so they can see how nice it looks. Thanks again for pointing this out.


----------



## spud36

Hi

 I have one of these amps on its way to me and I was wondering if there a list of tubes somewhere which can be used with it. 

 Cheers for any help


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *spud36* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi

 I have one of these amps on its way to me and I was wondering if there a list of tubes somewhere which can be used with it. 

 Cheers for any help_

 

Up on the Little-Tube forum, I believe one of the users there is building a list.


----------



## Penchum

I have been testing my new Zune 80 (Z80) MP4 player hooked up to the MKIVse. It has been an excellent test. The Z80 is an incredibly clean source with a steady frequency response from one end of the spectrum to the other. The MKIVse has always been a very "revealing" headphone amplifier and the matching of these two units is like a match made in heaven. When I first paired them, I had the Philip's power tubes and the GE 5 star driver tubes in the MKIVse. Using my HD-650s, the sound was like that of a really fine solid state amplifier, only warmer and smoother. Excellent for more detailed music. Then, I switched back to the default tubes (Mullard E182CC and WE408a) and this combination really floored me! If there was ever a true "tube" sound you hear described, this was it! Warm, butter, deep, liquid, flowing and on and on. With a good source like the Z80 and the right tube combination to suit your tastes, you can have your cake and eat it too. Lately, I have been reading posts stating that the Little-tube amps are not tube sounding or you can't find tubes, or they don't tube roll well. Don't let the falseness of such unsubstantiated claims steer you away from an excellent brand of tube headphone amplifiers. With sources improving constantly (like the Z80), having a tube amplifier that can be accurate like the source and tube sounding at the same time is becoming more and more important. This is a sweet combination that will leave some cash in your pocket and put a smile on your face.


----------



## Penchum

I didn't catch this until today. On the Little-Tube site, on the SPEC sheet with photos for the MKIV & MKIVse, it says the MKIV has a one year warranty and the MKIVse has a two year warranty. This is something else people should consider when trying to decide between the two models.
 Have a good one!


----------



## Danika k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *spud36* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi

 I have one of these amps on its way to me and I was wondering if there a list of tubes somewhere which can be used with it. 

 Cheers for any help_

 

I found this thread (http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/lit...olling-276757/) to be very useful.


----------



## Penchum

Ok, some of you must have done some mods to your MKIV's. Where are the pics?? Inquiring minds want pictures!!


----------



## YouSpentHowMuch?

Hi Penchum ,

 I just wanted to say that it was your reveiw that pushed me over the edge in my decision to get this amp. It'll be my first tube amp and I could'nt be more excited. 

 Thanks and God bless

 PS: Wallet: "Why do you encourage him?! WHYYYYYY *sobs* "


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YouSpentHowMuch?* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi Penchum ,

 I just wanted to say that it was your reveiw that pushed me over the edge in my decision to get this amp. It'll be my first tube amp and I could'nt be more excited. 

 Thanks and God bless

 PS: Wallet: "Why do you encourage him?! WHYYYYYY *sobs* "_

 

Thanks for the compliment. You are about to be pleased on a level you haven't been too before. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Let us know how things go when your amp arrives.


----------



## Danika k

Has anyone tried to tube roll the MkIVse?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone tried to tube roll the MkIVse?_

 

I have, or I guess I should say, I still am. I've tried Philips, Tung Sol, Mullard and have Amperex on order, for the power tubes. I've tried GE, WE, Sylvania and GE 5-star for driver tubes. None are bad, all are great. The original Mullard power and WE driver are still one of my favorites though. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Word has it, the Amperex are "the bomb", so I can only hope so. They cost a little more than I like to pay. So, tube rolling is "on going" and not likely to stop unless I've tried them all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 See ya!


----------



## YouSpentHowMuch?

Hey Penchum I just got my amp!
 Right out of the box I was nearly moved to tears by my music. It's amazing to think that it can only get better. I think I'm going to fully burn in these tubes before I consider any tube rolling. 
 I may have just become a tube convert


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YouSpentHowMuch?* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey Penchum I just got my amp!
 Right out of the box I was nearly moved to tears by my music. It's amazing to think that it can only get better. I think I'm going to fully burn in these tubes before I consider any tube rolling. 
 I may have just become a tube convert 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That feeling, that amazing feeling when your brain doesn't believe what your ears are hearing and logic can't find a grip on the moment. The only thing left is the emotion reserved for music. There is no other emotion like it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Enjoy the burn-in!


----------



## Seba

I'm so loved in my friend's LD II+ that I'm going to buy MKIV SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Tubes make my RS-2's sound so wonderful...


----------



## RogerB

Anybody besides me amazed at how BIG and heavy these amps are when you first take them out of thye box? I mean....yea...I saw the dimensions and weight on the spec sheet, but....dang these amps are something else up close and in person!!


----------



## Bozz_Keren

@Seba
 LD2+ is quite different from MKIVSE, if u like LD2+ why don't u give the new MKII a shot


----------



## YouSpentHowMuch?

Just a quick question: How long can I have my amp on? Its been burning in all day and I'd like to have it playing music over-night. Is this okay?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YouSpentHowMuch?* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just a quick question: How long can I have my amp on? Its been burning in all day and I'd like to have it playing music over-night. Is this okay?_

 

It should be no problem. I've run mine for days at a time without any problems. As long as it has adequate cooling space around it, you should be fine. I have mine stacked on top of other goodies and this was adequate for cooling too.


----------



## Xoen

So is this amp a good combo with the HD650? Right now, I have my 650's connected to my Little Dot II++ (with Ulyanovsk 6S19's and CV131 tubes) and looking to upgrade pretty soon. While it sounds really good, I felt that my HD650's still has more potential than it has with the LDII++ now. How does it compare with more expensive amps like WooAudio6 (the other amp I'm also considering)?

 Oh, and does this get very hot like the LDII++? I could fry eggs and bacons with mines! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (Not really but you get the idea)


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So is this amp a good combo with the HD650? Right now, I have my 650's connected to my Little Dot II++ (with Ulyanovsk 6S19's and CV131 tubes) and looking to upgrade pretty soon. While it sounds really good, I felt that my HD650's still has more potential than it has with the LDII++ now. How does it compare with more expensive amps like WooAudio6 (the other amp I'm also considering)?

 Oh, and does this get very hot like the LDII++? I could fry eggs and bacons with mines! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (Not really but you get the idea)_

 

I think the MKIVse would compete well with the WooAudio2 and not the 6. The MKIII would be a close match to the WooAudio6. The MKIVse is an overachiever that is designed with the HD-650 in mind. I'm sure you can get better, but not even close to the MKIVse's price point. It easily competes with units costing twice as much, so it is hard to dismiss. The OTL circuitry design gives it an edge over many units and puts it in the "higher" class of tube amps. The stock tubes are fantastic, and there are other choices out there if needed. Sword Yang, the designer, is a talented amp wizard and his work on the MKIVse shows just how excellent he can be. The MKIVse is one beautiful unit and LD is backing up their work on it with a two year warranty instead of the usual one year. 

 Ow, and it doesn't get as hot as the LDII++, I have one too and ya, that little guy gets cooking! Have you tried the Mullard M8161 driver tubes in the LDII++ yet? For me, that was the top driver to get, even better than my Mullard CV131s. When I upgraded, I had to keep the LDII++. I just couldn't part with it and I make time to listen too it when I can.


----------



## Xoen

Hey thanks Penchum! Looks like I'll be buying the MKIV SE then before they run out of their 500 units (hoping they haven't lol)!!! That's great it's designed with the HD650s in mind, so hopefully they'll sound great with my own pair which I'm sure it will. 

 I haven't tried the M8161s with my LDII++ yet, but I heard the're very detailed and analytical sounding tubes. I bought the CV131 tubes from a fellow Headfi'er here since I needed something warmer sounding for my AD700's, and turned really great!

 Thanks to you, Penchum! Now I plan on getting that LD MKIV SE if it's not too late lol! Hopefully it'll get here in Virginia in the same time span as yours! Cheers mate!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey thanks Penchum! Looks like I'll be buying the MKIV SE then before they run out of their 500 units (hoping they haven't lol)!!! That's great it's designed with the HD650s in mind, so hopefully they'll sound great with my own pair which I'm sure it will. 

 I haven't tried the M8161s with my LDII++ yet, but I heard the're very detailed and analytical sounding tubes. I bought the CV131 tubes from a fellow Headfi'er here since I needed something warmer sounding for my AD700's, and turned really great!

 Thanks to you, Penchum! Now I plan on getting that LD MKIV SE if it's not too late lol! Hopefully it'll get here in Virginia in the same time span as yours! Cheers mate!_

 

You bet! Let us know when it gets here next week.


----------



## Xoen

Yes!!! I finally took the plunge and purchased the Little Dot MKIV SE...kinda. I just PM'd David about me wanting the SE version, so hopefully he'll PM me anytime now (Geez I just wished he'd PM me NOW!!! Argh lol) Anyways, do you get to choose your own LED colors? Because I kinda added that in as well as my country's voltage spec and my contact number like he specified.

 I'm hoping David would still have some more SE's in stock. If not, then I hope the MKIV would be at least anything like the SE version just minus the different tubes. Damn, I'm pretty excited!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes!!! I finally took the plunge and purchased the Little Dot MKIV SE...kinda. I just PM'd David about me wanting the SE version, so hopefully he'll PM me anytime now (Geez I just wished he'd PM me NOW!!! Argh lol) Anyways, do you get to choose your own LED colors? Because I kinda added that in as well as my country's voltage spec and my contact number like he specified.

 I'm hoping David would still have some more SE's in stock. If not, then I hope the MKIV would be at least anything like the SE version just minus the different tubes. Damn, I'm pretty excited! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I always forget that they are on opposite day/night from us.


----------



## vinho83

im soo gonna get one too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i just sent him a mail on his gmail account. xoen wld u mind informing me when he replies? i'll let u know too when he replies me ya.. thanks ! cant wait hehe


----------



## Xoen

Yea, he just responded to me several times. It was around 10AM Eastern when he replied! Hehe I guess it's a day and night thing like Penchum said. It's all good though, I was at work anyways and couldn't check my emails not till 12 noon during my lunch break! 

 Oh, and I'm definitely getting the SE version with the blue led like I requested! Only problem is, I'll probably get it like maybe 8-10 days later since I had to use echeck on my Paypal account. It has to clear out before David sends it out. Dammit! There was a slight problem sending cash through my credit, and I had credit, lots of it. 

 It's okay, though, since 8-10 days wait is NOTHING compared to the MONTH AND A HALF wait for my Russian tubes for my LDII++ I ordered couple months ago!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's okay, though, since 8-10 days wait is NOTHING compared to the MONTH AND A HALF wait for my Russian tubes for my LDII++ I ordered couple months ago! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Haha, that's happened to me several times. That's why I try to buy my tubes from US sellers when possible.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yea, he just responded to me several times. It was around 10AM Eastern when he replied! Hehe I guess it's a day and night thing like Penchum said. It's all good though, I was at work anyways and couldn't check my emails not till 12 noon during my lunch break! 

 Oh, and I'm definitely getting the SE version with the blue led like I requested! Only problem is, I'll probably get it like maybe 8-10 days later since I had to use echeck on my Paypal account. It has to clear out before David sends it out. Dammit! There was a slight problem sending cash through my credit, and I had credit, lots of it. 

 It's okay, though, since 8-10 days wait is NOTHING compared to the MONTH AND A HALF wait for my Russian tubes for my LDII++ I ordered couple months ago! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

When I ordered my MKIVse, I asked for the green LED. I don't remember why, but it looks nice! During that waiting period, they will build up your MKIVse, change the LED, bench check it, due a 48 hour burn-in, bench check it again, then pack it all up. So, your new unit will get the "close eyeball" before it leaves their place.


----------



## Seba

I asked David which one to choose: green or red LED and he suggested red so I gone for that. He also said that he has red versions ready.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I asked David which one to choose: green or red LED and he suggested red so I gone for that. He also said that he has red versions ready._

 

Ow, that's cool! Ready to go means faster to your door!


----------



## Xoen

Would I have to remove/switch any jumpers inside the MKIV SE for use with my HD650's just out of the box? I remember I had to remove the jumpers in my LDII++ so it'll perform best with high impedance headphones. Just wondering.


----------



## Seba

There are DIP switches underneath the unit which you can set the gain factor appropriate.


----------



## Penchum

I just received this from DavidZ at little-dot:

 "The WE408A is a 20V filament tube so the front driver tube voltage is modified to 6.3V for the M8100. The rear 6H30PI has a different pin-out and characteristics from the E182CC. At this point we are completely out of the E182CC vacuum tubes, and we have a few months supply of the 6H30PI left. Therefore all MK IV SE from this point on will be M8100 and 6H30PI version until we run out of 6H30PI tubes, at which point the MK IV SE will be discontinued. I hope this helps!"

 So, the last of the "se" will be hardwired to work with M8100 and 6H30PI and when they run out of tubes, the "se" goes away for good!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Grab them while their hot, before their not!


----------



## orkan70

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just received this from DavidZ at little-dot:

 "The WE408A is a 20V filament tube so the front driver tube voltage is modified to 6.3V for the M8100. The rear 6H30PI has a different pin-out and characteristics from the E182CC. At this point we are completely out of the E182CC vacuum tubes, and we have a few months supply of the 6H30PI left. Therefore all MK IV SE from this point on will be M8100 and 6H30PI version until we run out of 6H30PI tubes, at which point the MK IV SE will be discontinued. I hope this helps!"

 So, the last of the "se" will be hardwired to work with M8100 and 6H30PI and when they run out of tubes, the "se" goes away for good!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Grab them while their hot, before their not! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 



 Dave,

 Wow, I am really confused now. I'm thinking about purchasing the MKIVSE but
 I don’t now what is added value to the exclusivity of SE version ? The difference with ordinary version IV is according few owners not so exclusive anymore. The second point is that the possibility for tube rolling by MK4 better is than by SE version. What is your opinion regarding all this. 

 As you can see Little Dot made noticeable tube and hard wire changes. Now lot of us are very confused and uncertain over the sound quality of the amp. The question is , is the quality still same as mentioned by previous review’s mainly based on others, stronger tube’s ?
 Also tube’s rolling possibility’s for both amps and version’s remain unclear. Maybe something for David Z to explain this confused situation. We are also interesting in the Little Dot plans regarding the future of the IV SE amp.

 Dave. You give us really fantastic feedback. We really appreciate it. Thank you for your time and this outstanding job. Many warm greetings.


 Marek


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just received this from DavidZ at little-dot:

 "The WE408A is a 20V filament tube so the front driver tube voltage is modified to 6.3V for the M8100. The rear 6H30PI has a different pin-out and characteristics from the E182CC. At this point we are completely out of the E182CC vacuum tubes, and we have a few months supply of the 6H30PI left. Therefore all MK IV SE from this point on will be M8100 and 6H30PI version until we run out of 6H30PI tubes, at which point the MK IV SE will be discontinued. I hope this helps!"

 So, the last of the "se" will be hardwired to work with M8100 and 6H30PI and when they run out of tubes, the "se" goes away for good!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Grab them while their hot, before their not! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

So is that why they only had 500 of these amps?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So is that why they only had 500 of these amps?_

 

I really don't know for sure. I know it was a "limited edition" from the beginning, but I have no idea where the "cut off" point was.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *orkan70* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dave,

 Wow, I am really confused now. I'm thinking about purchasing the MKIVSE but
 I don’t now what is added value to the exclusivity of SE version ? The difference with ordinary version IV is according few owners not so exclusive anymore. The second point is that the possibility for tube rolling by MK4 better is than by SE version. What is your opinion regarding all this. 

 As you can see Little Dot made noticeable tube and hard wire changes. Now lot of us are very confused and uncertain over the sound quality of the amp. The question is , is the quality still same as mentioned by previous review’s mainly based on others, stronger tube’s ?
 Also tube’s rolling possibility’s for both amps and version’s remain unclear. Maybe something for David Z to explain this confused situation. We are also interesting in the Little Dot plans regarding the future of the IV SE amp.

 Dave. You give us really fantastic feedback. We really appreciate it. Thank you for your time and this outstanding job. Many warm greetings.


 Marek_

 

Here is my response from the other thread:

 I see your point for sure. It may make more sense to purchase the MKIV standard and spend the extra saved on better tubes. At this point, the true differences are "different motherboard & components", "better RCA jacks", "Two year warranty". If you plan to tube roll a bunch, the standard is what you should get. If tube rolling is not in your plan, then the "se" may still be worth the extra. Hope this helps some!!


----------



## Xoen

I take it your review is based on the later versions of the MKIVSE, right? I ordered mines on the 8th of this month, and the echeck still needs to be cleared before Little Dot sends it out. I'm hoping I get the same version you have. I'm also hoping David will clear all this confusion up soon.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I take it your review is based on the later versions of the MKIVSE, right? I ordered mines on the 8th of this month, and the echeck still needs to be cleared before Little Dot sends it out. I'm hoping I get the same version you have. I'm also hoping David will clear all this confusion up soon._

 

Yes, mine was based on the E182CC & 408A tube version.

 Please email him and ask specifically about your unit. He is the only one that can tell you if you have the E182CC & 408A tube version or not. The timeframe on these changes make it impossible to tell from here.


----------



## Xoen

Well, I just received a message from David after asking him what version amp I have. Looks like I'm getting the M8100 and the 6H30PI tube version. Hopefully the sound would still be impressive!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I just received a message from David after asking him what version amp I have. Looks like I'm getting the M8100 and the 6H30PI tube version. Hopefully the sound would still be impressive!_

 

I don't think there is any doubt about that!! I know they wouldn't use them if they didn't meet the standard.


----------



## Bozz_Keren

if i may suggest, IMO it's better to get MKIV that has more tube-rolling posibilities, u can buy M8100 for driver and 6H30Pi for power at ebay, 
 still if you want the RCA & Motherboeard upgrades, i think SE is better choice


----------



## orkan70

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Here is my response from the other thread:

 I see your point for sure. It may make more sense to purchase the MKIV standard and spend the extra saved on better tubes. At this point, the true differences are "different motherboard & components", "better RCA jacks", "Two year warranty". If you plan to tube roll a bunch, the standard is what you should get. If tube rolling is not in your plan, then the "se" may still be worth the extra. Hope this helps some!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Dave,

 I understand now why you and other owners are so positive regarding David’s outstanding service minded attitude. Within few minutes I received his e-mail with answers regarding my previous post over Little Dot hardware and tube changes.
 This is his response ;

*Actually the Little Dot MK IV SE originally was designed around the WE403A (M8100 equivalents) and 6H30PI, and the earliest models included these tubes. If you read the early reviews like from Headphonesrock, you'll see the M8100 and 6H30PI listed as the stock vacuum tubes. The move to WE408A and E182CC tubes was because at one point, it looked like our supply of 6H30PI tubes had been completely cut-off so we needed to move to another set of premium vacuum tubes with a similar sound characteristic and performance. Given that we initially shipped the M8100/6H30PI version, then the WE408A/E182CC, and recently (actually for more than a month now) back to the M8100/6H30PI set, there actually are more M8100/6H30PI version out in the wild than the WE408A/E182CC. The return to the M8100 and 6H30PI tubes simply brings the MK IV SE back in line with the original design and the rest of the MK-series. 

 In our tests the differences in sound quality and power output are minimal as this was a priority requirement in finding a new tube complement. All the original specs listed are for the M8100/6H30PI tubes. With the M8100/6H30PI version, the tube-rolling abilities are back as well. 

 I hope I've answered your questions clearly, if you have any others, please let me know!

 Best Regards,
 David*

 His answer is very clear and no space for any confusing or uncertainty anymore. I will order the amp next week and this will be my first confrontation with tube sound. You all know how important the first experience is. This was probably the reason for my unnecessary uncertainty. I hope that you will understand me. 
 The statement remains unchanged. Little Dot’s are outstanding, high quality amps. The company deliver high service standard. .

 Thank you David !!! Also many thanks to Dave ,our Little Tube guru on this site. Because of his outstanding posts, feedbacks, reviews etc the amp selection was much easier.
 Thank you everyone and till next time. Best greetings to all of you 

 Marek


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *orkan70* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dave,

 I understand now why you and other owners are so positive regarding David’s outstanding service minded attitude. Within few minutes I received his e-mail with answers regarding my previous post over Little Dot hardware and tube changes.
 This is his response ;

*Actually the Little Dot MK IV SE originally was designed around the WE403A (M8100 equivalents) and 6H30PI, and the earliest models included these tubes. If you read the early reviews like from Headphonesrock, you'll see the M8100 and 6H30PI listed as the stock vacuum tubes. The move to WE408A and E182CC tubes was because at one point, it looked like our supply of 6H30PI tubes had been completely cut-off so we needed to move to another set of premium vacuum tubes with a similar sound characteristic and performance. Given that we initially shipped the M8100/6H30PI version, then the WE408A/E182CC, and recently (actually for more than a month now) back to the M8100/6H30PI set, there actually are more M8100/6H30PI version out in the wild than the WE408A/E182CC. The return to the M8100 and 6H30PI tubes simply brings the MK IV SE back in line with the original design and the rest of the MK-series. 

 In our tests the differences in sound quality and power output are minimal as this was a priority requirement in finding a new tube complement. All the original specs listed are for the M8100/6H30PI tubes. With the M8100/6H30PI version, the tube-rolling abilities are back as well. 

 I hope I've answered your questions clearly, if you have any others, please let me know!

 Best Regards,
 David*

 His answer is very clear and no space for any confusing or uncertainty anymore. I will order the amp next week and this will be my first confrontation with tube sound. You all know how important the first experience is. This was probably the reason for my unnecessary uncertainty. I hope that you will understand me. 
 The statement remains unchanged. Little Dot’s are outstanding, high quality amps. The company deliver high service standard. .

 Thank you David !!! Also many thanks to Dave ,our Little Tube guru on this site. Because of his outstanding posts, feedbacks, reviews etc the amp selection was much easier.
 Thank you everyone and till next time. Best greetings to all of you 

 Marek_

 

They are the best!!!


----------



## Xoen

Wow! I guess that settles everything! Now on to the hardest part of ALL this good stuff...waiting.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow! I guess that settles everything! Now on to the hardest part of ALL this good stuff...waiting. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The shipping (EMS Air) is extremely fast. Much better than HK post shipments! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 5-7 business days is normal to US, others are fast too!


----------



## Seba

I got my tracking number today and it seems that the amp has left from David's hands on Friday. If I'm lucky, I can get the amp here this week.


----------



## Xoen

Nice! Mine's still with David. The echeck I used to pay him via Paypal hasn't cleared yet. It's been 3 business days. The estimated clearing date is today so hopefully he'll ship out today or tomorrow. Then I have to...wait some more.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got my tracking number today and it seems that the amp has left from David's hands on Friday. If I'm lucky, I can get the amp here this week._

 

If postal is equal to or better than USPS, you may see it this week! If tracking allows, watch to see when it hits your postal system (usually after customs, but sometimes at the same time). This will give you an "idea" of how much longer.


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If postal is equal to or better than USPS, you may see it this week! If tracking allows, watch to see when it hits your postal system (usually after customs, but sometimes at the same time). This will give you an "idea" of how much longer. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I have read that EMS will ship the package to your door. In good case it will go just like that and I don't have to pay tax. In bad case the amp will go to my local custom agent and I have to pick it up from there.

 BTW I haven't received replys for two of my e-mails regarding the Zero DAC. I'm a bit worried that when I'm going to get it or if I'm going to get it at all.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have read that EMS will ship the package to your door. In good case it will go just like that and I don't have to pay tax. In bad case the amp will go to my local custom agent and I have to pick it up from there.

 BTW I haven't received replys for two of my e-mails regarding the Zero DAC. I'm a bit worried that when I'm going to get it or if I'm going to get it at all._

 

Look back on the review thread. I think someone said he was working up the next batch of 50 and they were due out this week? Something like that.


----------



## Penchum

I just received my Amperex 7119/5687 power tubes in the mail. I swapped out my Mullards and put the Amperex in and gave them a try. WOW, they sound extremely good right out of the box. These were NOS, so I'll be burning them in for a little while. I have my last two WE 408A's in as driver tubes, so this appears (so far) to be a winning combination!


----------



## Seba

What! My Little-Dot is already at the customs in Helsinki. Now I have to get it to Tampere's customs and collect it.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What! My Little-Dot is already at the customs in Helsinki. Now I have to get it to Tampere's customs and collect it._

 

I don't understand. It doesn't leave customs and get delivered to you?


----------



## Seba

We have a ridiculous tax-free price limit for goods outside EU. I think it's something like 45 euros. I hope that they'll ship the amp fast from Helsinki to Tampere so I can collect it from Tampere's customs agent.

 So no delivery to my door


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_We have a ridiculous tax-free price limit for goods outside EU. I think it's something like 45 euros. I hope that they'll ship the amp fast from Helsinki to Tampere so I can collect it from Tampere's customs agent.

 So no delivery to my door 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, that's really different. I had ASSumed that postal Air was always door to door everywhere, or at least honored by delivery services as Air priority. Ow well. Hopefully you don't have to go far and the weather will be nice. Have a good one, and keep us posted!


----------



## TKvC-SainT

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_We have a ridiculous tax-free price limit for goods outside EU. I think it's something like 45 euros. I hope that they'll ship the amp fast from Helsinki to Tampere so I can collect it from Tampere's customs agent.

 So no delivery to my door 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You´ll probably get it delivered to the door anyway. Just that your countries post will deliver it, not EMS themselves 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 When me and I friend bought our L D amps, they were delivered to the door by the swedish post, unfortuneatly my friend weren´t home, so then we had to go and get them at the post office ourselves.

 Also for ridiculous tax-free I totally agree, 500SEK for us which is ~US$77. And also our customs held the package for like a week, then sent a letter to my friend asking what the package contained and what it´s value was, so that made our delivery kinda slow


----------



## Seba

I'm certain that they won't deliver it to my door. I have to go to customs, wait for 30 minutes minimum to get service and then they will look me like I'm some weirdo and I have to show them a receipt which shows the price of the package.

 I'll call to Helsinki's customs just in case that they will send the package to Tampere's customs.


----------



## Seba

Well, it looks like my package has been released from customs and they're delivering it to my door today


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, it looks like my package has been released from customs and they're delivering it to my door today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Excellent! Let us know so we can stop chewing what is left of our finger nails!


----------



## Seba

Bad news. I was promised that the amp will be delivered by 2 PM today. Nobody came and my amp wasn't even in local post office.

 They better deliver it tomorrow or my weekend is going to be boring


----------



## Xoen

That sucks! Hopefully it'll come later that day or early tomorrow. But then, no one can actually promise an exact time when your item is gonna get delivered. Trust me, I've been promised several times when my package is gonna be delivered to me. It comes to me either a couple hours late or the next day. It just depends on what goes on in the shipping service. 

 Oh and since I've read before about tubes having a life span of 3,000 hours or so, and David says he's running low on the type of tubes he's using in our MKIV SE's, would that mean that these amps would become useless after spending nearly half a grand on something that may become obsolete? Or is this something we won't have to worry about? Just curious.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That sucks! Hopefully it'll come later that day or early tomorrow. But then, no one can actually promise an exact time when your item is gonna get delivered. Trust me, I've been promised several times when my package is gonna be delivered to me. It comes to me either a couple hours late or the next day. It just depends on what goes on in the shipping service. 

 Oh and since I've read before about tubes having a life span of 3,000 hours or so, and David says he's running low on the type of tubes he's using in our MKIV SE's, would that mean that these amps would become useless after spending nearly half a grand on something that may become obsolete? Or is this something we won't have to worry about? Just curious. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

No worries for us users. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The tube market is FULL of tubes for us! DavidZ's problem is that the initial bunch of tubes they bought, are almost gone. They have decided not to order more in bulk, so once he runs out, the "se" model will be no more. We will have the best unit they have ever made, and no one will be able to buy them new anymore. Not a bad position to be in either!!


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No worries for us users. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The tube market is FULL of tubes for us! DavidZ's problem is that the initial bunch of tubes they bought, are almost gone. They have decided not to order more in bulk, so once he runs out, the "se" model will be no more. We will have the best unit they have ever made, and no one will be able to buy them new anymore. Not a bad position to be in either!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Good! I just hope there are plenty of tubes compatible with our amps, despite the claims that tube rolling isn't as expansive in the MKIV SE as with the regular MKIVs. Good thing is, I don't really plan on tube rolling with this amp anyways, unlike my LDII++.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good! I just hope there are plenty of tubes compatible with our amps, despite the claims that tube rolling isn't as expansive in the MKIV SE as with the regular MKIVs. Good thing is, I don't really plan on tube rolling with this amp anyways, unlike my LDII++._

 

How true! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Did you find out when your's is due in? Also, when yours arrives, it will have some really great tubes already in it, so "maturing" the whole thing at once, is the way to go. When it arrives, post up what tubes came in it stock, and I'll check to see what tubes sound like a good idea for you to buy/try whenever you want too.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How true! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Did you find out when your's is due in? Also, when yours arrives, it will have some really great tubes already in it, so "maturing" the whole thing at once, is the way to go. When it arrives, post up what tubes came in it stock, and I'll check to see what tubes sound like a good idea for you to buy/try whenever you want too. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yea, I just did. I just emailed David about the shipping status since it's been 2 days with no emails from him about the shipping. Well, he replied back to me pretty fast saying that he hasn't shipped out my amp yet since it has to go through "quality control" first before they can ship it out. I guess they're thoroughly inspecting my amp before I get it? I'm not much in a rush, though, since I still have my new HD650's and my lovely little Little Dot II++.

 Oh and I'll definitely post up what tubes I have as well as my impressions on it!


----------



## TKvC-SainT

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good! I just hope there are plenty of tubes compatible with our amps, despite the claims that tube rolling isn't as expansive in the MKIV SE as with the regular MKIVs. Good thing is, I don't really plan on tube rolling with this amp anyways, unlike my LDII++._

 

There´s no worry about that, the "new" SE models are basicly just standard Mk4's, with the difference beeing better tubes, real Neutrik jack and CMC/VdH RCA connectors. So it will have the same tube rolling options as the ordinary Mk4.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yea, I just did. I just emailed David about the shipping status since it's been 2 days with no emails from him about the shipping. Well, he replied back to me pretty fast saying that he hasn't shipped out my amp yet since it has to go through "quality control" first before they can ship it out. I guess they're thoroughly inspecting my amp before I get it? I'm not much in a rush, though, since I still have my new HD650's and my lovely little Little Dot II++.

 Oh and I'll definitely post up what tubes I have as well as my impressions on it! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes indeed! The quality check every unit including running it 48hrs before shipping. That way, you get a better end product.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* 
_There´s no worry about that, the "new" SE models are basicly just standard Mk4's, with the difference beeing better tubes, real Neutrik jack and CMC/VdH RCA connectors. So it will have the same tube rolling options as the ordinary Mk4._

 

Nice! But I could've sworn someone said this amp isn't good for tube rolling, while the regular MKIV is. Oh well, as long as what you say is true, there's nothing to worry about! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes indeed! The quality check every unit including running it 48hrs before shipping. That way, you get a better end product. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That's great! As long as my amp is running in perfect condition when I get it, they can take their time quality checking my amp thoroughly! After all, I did spend $444 on this amp and I've never spent that much on an audio equipment ever since I first joined Head-Fi, so I do expect high quality in which I'm sure Little Dot is very good at anyways!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nice! But I could've sworn someone said this amp isn't good for tube rolling, while the regular MKIV is. Oh well, as long as what you say is true, there's nothing to worry about! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 That's great! As long as my amp is running in perfect condition when I get it, they can take their time quality checking my amp thoroughly! After all, I did spend $444 on this amp and I've never spent that much on an audio equipment ever since I first joined Head-Fi, so I do expect high quality in which I'm sure Little Dot is very good at anyways! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It's funny you mentioned the expense part. For Head-Fi related goodies, my MKIVse is the most I've ever spent too! I have never, ever, for even a moment, regretted buying it. If the house was on fire, it would be tucked under my arm as I ran out the door!


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's funny you mentioned the expense part. For Head-Fi related goodies, my MKIVse is the most I've ever spent too! I have never, ever, for even a moment, regretted buying it. If the house was on fire, it would be tucked under my arm as I ran out the door! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Haha, make sure you don't leave your headphones behind! I'm sure you've payed a lot for that, too!


----------



## dantztiludrop

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes indeed! The quality check every unit including running it 48hrs before shipping. That way, you get a better end product. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Wow! That is very cool. I cannot imagine that there are very many dealers out there who would take that kind of extra time & care like that. It's the type of thing that really makes you want to support a company & give them your $. I've already heard nothing but great things about David's customer service & support, but that just tops it off! **He says as he switches over to the window running Little Dot's ebay site & pushes the "Buy It Now" button....LITERALLY!** Unfortunately(?) I am not buying the MKIVse, but the more affordable MKIII. But I've read a lot of great reviews about it & I'm pretty damn excited! Well, gotta go to ebay!


----------



## dantztiludrop

OMG....this is the 1st time I've been to the LD ebay site & the MKIII wasn't up there! It was just there 2 hours ago. Oh well, I know he'll just put another up after putting a request thru to him, but that's a little too funny.

 So, now that I have to wait until tomorrow...can anyone talk me into why I should get a MKIV(se) instead???


----------



## YouSpentHowMuch?

Hi,
 I just wanted to tell everyone about the tube options mentoined in the instruction manual of the current SE (and standard) model MKIV. The following is taken directly from the manual:

 Driver Tube Selection:
 Inside the chassis on the circuit board, there exist two jumper swicthes which may be configured to use two different "families" of driver tubes:

 a) Open Circuit (Jumper Removed):
 Driver Tubes: WE301A/B, GE5654, M8100, CV4010, EF95, 6J1 and all equivalents, replacements, and derivatives.

 b) Short Circuit (Jumper in place over both pins):

 Driver Tubes: EF92, EF91, CV138, CV131 and all equivalents, replacements, and derivatives.

 (The factory setting is a)

 Hope this helps!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YouSpentHowMuch?* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi,
 I just wanted to tell everyone about the tube options mentoined in the instruction manual of the current SE (and standard) model MKIV. The following is taken directly from the manual:

 Driver Tube Selection:
 Inside the chassis on the circuit board, there exist two jumper swicthes which may be configured to use two different "families" of driver tubes:

 a) Open Circuit (Jumper Removed):
 Driver Tubes: WE301A/B, GE5654, M8100, CV4010, EF95, 6J1 and all equivalents, replacements, and derivatives.

 b) Short Circuit (Jumper in place over both pins):

 Driver Tubes: EF92, EF91, CV138, CV131 and all equivalents, replacements, and derivatives.

 (The factory setting is a)

 Hope this helps!_

 

I'm curious. If you flip yours over and look with a flashlight or something, I bet you'll find the dip switches but NO jumpers. Let me know, ok? Thanks.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dantztiludrop* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OMG....this is the 1st time I've been to the LD ebay site & the MKIII wasn't up there! It was just there 2 hours ago. Oh well, I know he'll just put another up after putting a request thru to him, but that's a little too funny.

 So, now that I have to wait until tomorrow...can anyone talk me into why I should get a MKIV(se) instead???_

 

I really believe you'll enjoy the MKIII to death! I'm sure you would enjoy the MKIVse too, but instincts do play in this kind of purchase, and you were ready to grab up the MKIII. Everyone I know who has picked up a MKIII has fallen in love. It is hard to beat that kind of feedback!!
 Have a good one!!!! Let us know!


----------



## Seba

Okay, this is what you and me have been waiting for... I collected my MKIV SE from customs today.

 What can I say, this thing is noticeably better than LD II+ even though it has only couple of hours on the clock. I can hear Kraftwerk's "The Robots" details that I haven't heard before.

 I'm very satisfied with my purchase. The amp looks and sounds beautiful and is better than my previous Corda Headfive and Heed Canamp.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay, this is what you and me have been waiting for... I collected my MKIV SE from customs today.

 What can I say, this thing is noticeably better than LD II+ even though it has only couple of hours on the clock. I can hear Kraftwerk's "The Robots" details that I haven't heard before.

 I'm very satisfied with my purchase. The amp looks and sounds beautiful and is better than my previous Corda Headfive and Heed Canamp._

 

Sweet! Can you list what tubes came with it? Post more impressions if you can! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I'm probably not gonna receive my MKIV SE until sometime next week, hopefully. I'm hoping David would ship mines out today, if not, Monday, though that's a holiday! It's been almost two weeks, if only Paypal would accept my debit card on the first day I bought it, then I wouldn't have to wait this friggin long!


----------



## dantztiludrop

Noob ?: It's obvious to me the effect that upgraded tubes will have, but could someone explain to me how significant of a SQ improvement it is for the SE's other upgrades, such as the Neutrik HP jack & the Van Den Hul RCA jacks? I'm trying to figure out cost/performance.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

I think the other upgrades are a bit dubious to be honest. I've never heard an audible difference between jacks... so I think it's fair to say that the improvement in SE is in the premium tubes, whether or not the upgraded tubes warrant the additional cost is a value judgement for the individual to decide.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay, this is what you and me have been waiting for... I collected my MKIV SE from customs today.

 What can I say, this thing is noticeably better than LD II+ even though it has only couple of hours on the clock. I can hear Kraftwerk's "The Robots" details that I haven't heard before.

 I'm very satisfied with my purchase. The amp looks and sounds beautiful and is better than my previous Corda Headfive and Heed Canamp._

 

Congrats on the new amp. Glad to hear that you like it more than the HEED.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay, this is what you and me have been waiting for... I collected my MKIV SE from customs today.

 What can I say, this thing is noticeably better than LD II+ even though it has only couple of hours on the clock. I can hear Kraftwerk's "The Robots" details that I haven't heard before.

 I'm very satisfied with my purchase. The amp looks and sounds beautiful and is better than my previous Corda Headfive and Heed Canamp._

 

Congratulations!! I know exactly how you are feeling!


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sweet! Can you list what tubes came with it? Post more impressions if you can! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm probably not gonna receive my MKIV SE until sometime next week, hopefully. I'm hoping David would ship mines out today, if not, Monday, though that's a holiday! It's been almost two weeks, if only Paypal would accept my debit card on the first day I bought it, then I wouldn't have to wait this friggin long!_

 

It came with Mullards and Electro-Harmonix gold pins. I have slept about 5 hours and couldn't sleep anymore so I decided to power up my equipment and start enjoying the music. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My one "benchmark album" is called Club for Five. It's a finnish accapella group and it really opened up with LD II+ but is a whole another story with MKIV SE. Whole sound spectrum comes with ease and makes the music dynamic. My Heed made the music sound a little flat with Grados.

 I'm right now at my parents house and I will be taking my equipment to my brother to test his new AKG K271's and demonstrate the advantage of owning a headamp.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It came with Mullards and Electro-Harmonix gold pins. I have slept about 5 hours and couldn't sleep anymore so I decided to power up my equipment and start enjoying the music. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My one "benchmark album" is called Club for Five. It's a finnish accapella group and it really opened up with LD II+ but is a whole another story with MKIV SE. Whole sound spectrum comes with ease and makes the music dynamic. My Heed made the music sound a little flat with Grados.

 I'm right now at my parents house and I will be taking my equipment to my brother to test his new AKG K271's and demonstrate the advantage of owning a headamp._

 

Electro-Harmonix. Hummmm. So far, I have no exposure to this brand. Can anyone share what they think of them? I know they come in a sexy box, but that's about all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks!


----------



## LostOne.TR

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After all, I did spend $444 on this amp..._

 

Kind of off topic, but is that the normal going rate for US customers? Just wouldn't expect a Chinese company to be selling at that specific price. Not saying it's high or low, but rather the number "4" especially three of them in a row, would generally be something to avoid. The pronounciation of "4" in Chinese is similar to the pronounciation of death.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LostOne.TR* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Kind of off topic, but is that the normal going rate for US customers? Just wouldn't expect a Chinese company to be selling at that specific price. Not saying it's high or low, but rather the number "4" especially three of them in a row, would generally be something to avoid. The pronounciation of "4" in Chinese is similar to the pronounciation of death._

 

You're kinda creeping me out here with the "death" thing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 That's what is listed in my Paypal account. I guess the shipping fees and the item itself just added all to $444 dollars.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LostOne.TR* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Kind of off topic, but is that the normal going rate for US customers? Just wouldn't expect a Chinese company to be selling at that specific price. Not saying it's high or low, but rather the number "4" especially three of them in a row, would generally be something to avoid. The pronounciation of "4" in Chinese is similar to the pronounciation of death._

 

Well, that's a new one for sure!


----------



## Bozz_Keren

now that he brings it up, i'm interested as well, why use number IV, in chinese customs, no. 4 is prohibited, because people believe it will bring bad luck, yes no 4 is spelled similar to death
 but in this case MKIV sure is great sounding amp and nothing will hold me to purchase the amp


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why use number IV, in chinese customs, no. 4 is prohibited_

 

Because IV comes after III?


----------



## Bozz_Keren

@DoA
 yeah usually chinese skip on no. 4, maybe IIIA or goes on to V


----------



## Caribou679

Hi!

 I have been following these reviews about the different LD MK tubes amp with alot of interest. They are great!

 My main question is this: I use a Sony MDR7509HD headphone with 24 ohms of impedance. I read the requirements with these amps are 32 to 300 ohms. What would happen if I use my headphone with them. Can I dammage the amp or the headphone?

 Also what would happen if the driver tube was inverted( by error?) with the power tube?

 regards,


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Caribou679* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi!

 I have been following these reviews about the different LD MK tubes amp with alot of interest. They are great!

 My main question is this: I use a Sony MDR7509HD headphone with 24 ohms of impedance. I read the requirements with these amps are 32 to 300 ohms. What would happen if I use my headphone with them. Can I dammage the amp or the headphone?

 Also what would happen if the driver tube was inverted( by error?) with the power tube?

 regards,_

 

Hi! I'm really not sure about the headphone situation, but your best bet is to go to little-tube.com and send a MSG to DavidZ and ask him directly about your headphones. He will know for sure if anything special needs to be done.
 On the tube question, the driver tubes are smaller and can't fit the larger sockets of the power tubes. Good thing too, or I might have done this myself!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Caribou679* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi!

 I have been following these reviews about the different LD MK tubes amp with alot of interest. They are great!

 My main question is this: I use a Sony MDR7509HD headphone with 24 ohms of impedance. I read the requirements with these amps are 32 to 300 ohms. What would happen if I use my headphone with them. Can I dammage the amp or the headphone?

 Also what would happen if the driver tube was inverted( by error?) with the power tube?

 regards,_

 

The lower impedance shouldn't hurt the amp, I think the specs were listed like that because all Grados are 32 ohms and most Sennheisers are 300 ohms, so it's just convenient to choose those two points for reference. Theoretically speaking, TOO low of an impedance will drain more current from the amp than it can provide and cause it to clip, but I think the LD amps are plenty powerful enough that it shouldn't be a problem, besides, tube amps clip nicely.

 About inverting the tubes, it's impossible. On the Mk-series, all the driver tubes are 7-pin and the power tubes are 9-pin as well as having incompatible sockets. The power tube and driver tubes look different too, so you won't confuse them. The main thing to worry about is making sure the internal jumpers are set to take the right kind of driver tubes (EF95 or EF92 or EF91), I don't know what would happen if the jumpers were set to the wrong type of driver tubes, so that's worth asking David about.

 - DoA


----------



## Seba

I only have few hours on my unit and I noticed that mids are a bit sucked-away right now. Singer comes much closer when I switch to my SACD-player's own hp jack. Guess I'll have to connect my MKIV SE to computer and let it play songs all night long.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I only have few hours on my unit and I noticed that mids are a bit sucked-away right now. Singer comes much closer when I switch to my SACD-player's own hp jack. Guess I'll have to connect my MKIV SE to computer and let it play songs all night long._

 

Yep, you got it. There are some huge caps in that amp, and it takes time to heat form them, so run it, run it, run it. Somewhere around 65-85 big changes happen and can go on as far as 125-140. Hang in there! Glad it arrived!!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The lower impedance shouldn't hurt the amp, I think the specs were listed like that because all Grados are 32 ohms and most Sennheisers are 300 ohms, so it's just convenient to choose those two points for reference. Theoretically speaking, TOO low of an impedance will drain more current from the amp than it can provide and cause it to clip, but I think the LD amps are plenty powerful enough that it shouldn't be a problem, besides, tube amps clip nicely.

 About inverting the tubes, it's impossible. On the Mk-series, all the driver tubes are 7-pin and the power tubes are 9-pin as well as having incompatible sockets. The power tube and driver tubes look different too, so you won't confuse them. The main thing to worry about is making sure the internal jumpers are set to take the right kind of driver tubes (EF95 or EF92 or EF91), I don't know what would happen if the jumpers were set to the wrong type of driver tubes, so that's worth asking David about.

 - DoA_

 

When I first got my MKIVse, I purchased a matched set of RCA 5654's and put them in the amp (mine takes only 408A's) and turned it on. Those little RCA's were like mini flashlights!!! I turned it off and took them out after cooling, but it was funny! 6volt vs 20volt I think.


----------



## Xoen

Well, it's been over 2 weeks since I last purchased my Little Dot MKIV SE. David finally shipped it out last Friday, and when I track it on USPS, this message appears: "Origin Post is Preparing Shipment". I'm not sure what that means but I sure hope it means it's on it's way here. Anyone know what it could mean? I searched around the web but found no answer.


----------



## YZHI

Does anyone knows the difference in SQ between 5654 and WE403A in LD MKIV?


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YZHI* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does anyone knows the difference in SQ between 5654 and WE403A in LD MKIV?_

 

The 5654 is the generic US tube, it can sound fine depending on the manufacturer. 403A was made by Western Electric with the 403B being an improved version and the B version was much better and subsequently adopted by other manufacturers. In my experience the 403B sounds more accurate and more dynamic than the stock 5654's.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, it's been over 2 weeks since I last purchased my Little Dot MKIV SE. David finally shipped it out last Friday, and when I track it on USPS, this message appears: "Origin Post is Preparing Shipment". I'm not sure what that means but I sure hope it means it's on it's way here. Anyone know what it could mean? I searched around the web but found no answer._

 

Not sure, but it sounds like they are about to hand it over to USPS. Did you try the tracking at EMS? It will tell you more, same tracking number.


----------



## Seba

I let my amp burn in for 10hrs last night playing "Dark Side of the Moon" SACD on repeat.

 Mids are coming up but maybe not enough still. Highs are cleaned up nicely.


----------



## Bozz_Keren

@Seba
 what is the gain of your amp?
 but from my experience MKIV did not made the mids on RS2 fuller


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_@Seba
 what is the gain of your amp?
 but from my experience MKIV did not made the mids on RS2 fuller_

 

Default gain, I think it is the lowest. I'm still burning it in. All I can say that I've never heard so much detail from music before. So MKIV SE is a definate upgrade to my previous amps.


----------



## Bozz_Keren

in my previous setup was MKIV -> RS2
 IMO, the setup is not to my liking, MKIV have better synergy with HD650, but your taste maybe different from mine


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_in my previous setup was MKIV -> RS2
 IMO, the setup is not to my liking, MKIV have better synergy with HD650, but your taste maybe different from mine_

 

What made you not to like RS-2's with MKIV (do you have the SE or non-SE?)


----------



## Bozz_Keren

non SE, hmm, the mids kind of lean, and the bass doesn't extend too low, the amp made the sound smooth but lean, 
 later i discovered HD650 and been happy since then


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_non SE, hmm, the mids kind of lean, and the bass doesn't extend too low, the amp made the sound smooth but lean, 
 later i discovered HD650 and been happy since then_

 

I don't think tube rolling would compensate enough for those kinds of deficiencies either. Even if tube rolling could, a person might spend a couple of hundred trying to find the right combination. It would make more sense to pick up a pair of HD-650s used or new and never look back. IMHO, YMMV.


----------



## Xoen

Wow, this sucks... David shipped out my package last Friday, and yet I still haven't received it yet. It's been over two weeks since I last ordered, part of that time was my echeck needing to be cleared and Little Dot QC checking my amp. I kinda expected the shipping to be a lot faster than this. The tracking info indicates it's still in transit between Shenzhen and the US for the past 3 days now. Are they traveling by boat? Well, I can't say I'm impressed with the shipping performance since everyone here boasted about how fast Little Dot can ship items. Not for me. I emailed him about this and he told me that shipping may be slow due to Lunar Chinese New Year coming. But to be _very_ honest, I really don't care about that. I was already told earlier by him in this _same_ week that my amp would arrive sooner anytime. Guess not... Sorry for this pointless (and kinda childish) rant, but I had to let it out somehow and share my current experiences. 

 Little Dot is still a great company, but I only wished this never happened.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, this sucks... David shipped out my package last Friday, and yet I still haven't received it yet. It's been over two weeks since I last ordered, part of that time was my echeck needing to be cleared and Little Dot QC checking my amp. I kinda expected the shipping to be a lot faster than this. The tracking info indicates it's still in transit between Shenzhen and the US for the past 3 days now. Are they traveling by boat? Well, I can't say I'm impressed with the shipping performance since everyone here boasted about how fast Little Dot can ship items. Not for me. I emailed him about this and he told me that shipping may be slow due to Lunar Chinese New Year coming. But to be very honest, I really don't care about that. I was already told earlier by him in this same week that my amp would arrive sooner anytime. Guess not... Sorry for this pointless (and kinda childish) rant, but I had to let it out somehow and share my current experiences. 

 Little Dot is still a great company, but I only wished this never happened. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, we share your dislike for waiting. No doubt about that! When you check status, is it with EMS or USPS? I do know that once it has cleared customs, and USPS actually has it, it is treated like Air Priority shipping. For me here in Arizona, it was 3 business days or less from San Fransisco to my door. In each case, USPS's system was never updated in time to be useful. They have a 24-48 hour lag in their updates, so I consider their system to be useless for us. If you have received today's mail already, there is a good chance it will arrive with Saturday's mail. Hang in there!


----------



## Xoen

The thing is, I'm not fed enough info on what's going on. I guess I'm just used to UPS's tracking than USPS or EMS. At least UPS provides good enough info on tracking which sometimes lessens the anxiety. 

 Anyways, I use EMS and it shows the same info for the past 3 days. Oh well, it better arrive here next week.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The thing is, I'm not fed enough info on what's going on. I guess I'm just used to UPS's tracking than USPS or EMS. At least UPS provides good enough info on tracking which sometimes lessens the anxiety. 

 Anyways, I use EMS and it shows the same info for the past 3 days. Oh well, it better arrive here next week._

 

I agree. I like UPS and FedEx for their tracking quickness. I got angry with USPS about 6 months ago and emailed them about their tracking lameness, their response was nothing more than a canned response telling me to write a letter to the PMG. Figures!


----------



## orkan70

Hello everyone. I’m another new Little Dot family member LOL On 19th of January I placed my order for IV SE version. I made this decision after reading significant number of post’s and reviews. Lot of comprehensive reviews on this forum was really helpful to me. Many thanks for everyone, especially for Dave ( PENCHUM )for his excellent work on this forum regarding Little Tube products. Dave covered a lot of well written detailed information in a good informative way. Dave, thanks again for your work. 

 I also noticed lot of good words and compliments regarding David’s outstanding customer service. Till now I’m very positive impressed regarding his service and it is really pleasant to do a business with him. David responded very quickly to all my emails and his technical support is excellent. 

 According David’s last message they testing the amp right now and will ship out very soon. This is standard procedure before the shipment to the customer. Good service.
 This will be my first confrontation with the tubes based amp. I’m really excised about this first experience. I’m sure, this amp will be an awesome experience that I can enjoy for long time.
 DAVID, I can’t wait longer !!! LOL

 Lot of greetings to all of you. Ciao.


----------



## YZHI

Just bought WE 403B to replace the stock tubes for MK IV,

 Can I ask a question: how do you manage to take the stock tubes out?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YZHI* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can I ask a question for MK IV, how do you manage to take the stock tubes out?

 It seems I have to de-assmble the golden frames._

 

I took a small sheet of that anti-slip shelf liner, cut it into 1 inch strips, then I feed one down in between the tube and the guard on the front, then one down in between the tube and the guard on the back. Then I use my fingers to squeeze the anti-slip up against the tube and move it as work it up and out of it's socket. This really does work. Other than that, I try to not replace or swap them as often as my other tube amps!


----------



## YZHI

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I took a small sheet of that anti-slip shelf liner, cut it into 1 inch strips, then I feed one down in between the tube and the guard on the front, then one down in between the tube and the guard on the back. Then I use my fingers to squeeze the anti-slip up against the tube and move it as work it up and out of it's socket. This really does work. Other than that, I try to not replace or swap them as often as my other tube amps! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks for the tips. I think I really prefer the MK III looks, but the IV sounds much better even with the stock GE 5654 tubes.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YZHI* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the tips. I think I really prefer the MK III looks, but the IV sounds much better even with the stock GE 5654 tubes._

 

It is a serious OTL design with excellent everything! Darn thing should cost twice as much as it does! Thank goodness it doesn't.


----------



## Xoen

Yea, I'm glad, too, it wasn't too pricey, but it still expensive (for me at least!) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyways, my amp finally arrived at the JFK airport in NYC last Friday night. What a sigh of relief I had the next day after tracking it! I was already getting dead worried that the shipping service may have diverted somewhere because of snow or something. Now it just needs to clear customs and then bring it over here in VA! Hopefully, it won't take long now!!!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yea, I'm glad, too, it wasn't too pricey, but it still expensive (for me at least!) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyways, my amp finally arrived at the JFK airport in NYC last Friday night. What a sigh of relief I had the next day after tracking it! I was already getting dead worried that the shipping service may have diverted somewhere because of snow or something. Now it just needs to clear customs and then bring it over here in VA! Hopefully, it won't take long now!!!_

 

Fantastic! That is very good news! Keep us informed!!


----------



## Xoen

Wow...just wow! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Call me stupid all you want but I just now realized that I've already received my package!!! So after coming home from work earlier today, I wasn't really expecting much, ate dinner, then hopped onto my computer. Surfed the web a little, visited Head-Fi, then I decided hell, why not just track my package? It's been over two weeks, almost three, so I just wanted to see what's up. Well, I noticed that it said "Delivery" and that it has been here since 11:52 AM this morning. Huh? What? Hmmm...

 So I wondered why I haven't seen the box, and then I noticed a small box just behind my treadmill. I quickly grabbed it, opened it up, and what's this big, black box thing with a gold piece in the middle? Hmm, looks my my Little Dot MKIV SE I've been waiting ages for!!! I guess someone wanted to surprise me or something, but they noticed anyways!

 I looked at it for a while and it did indeed come with 6H30PI and M8100 tubes. Did I mention how big and heavy this thing is? It was A LOT bigger than I expected. It's almost twice the size of my Little Dot II++! From the pics, it sure did look small, but damn! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It does look beautiful, though! I love the gold tube guards since it really does add to the impressive look! 

*My new Little Dot MKIV SE*





 So I hooked it up, plugged it in, and first thing that came to my mind was if David and his crew put in a blue LED like I requested. Well, I flicked the switch in the back, and...YUP! It's blue! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I just like blue leds in my electronic devices! I

 Okay, on to my first impressions. (I have little experience with describing sound but I'll do the best I can.) I use my Sony PS3 as my CDP and DMP, hooked up to my new MKIV SE, and out to my stock HD650's. My PS3 does sound better than my iPod and a Zune and many low to mid priced CD players so I thought it could be a good reliable source. I looked it up on avsforum.com to see what they may have thought about it as a source, and they say it's a pretty fine sounding CD player. Of course, there's better, but I like how it sounds. I'll find a link to it later. 

*My Senn HD650 hanging out with a new friend!*





 Anyways, this amp pretty much sounded like how Penchum described it during his first impressions. The bass does indeed have a nice impact to it, and does extend deep. I use some of my trance songs as reference like Oceanlabs "Clear Blue Water" and you could almost feel every beat. Hard hitting, tight, deep, and clean sounding bass. 

 Then, I played the song "To really love a woman" by Brian Adams since I found this song to be highly resolving and the first thing I noticed was the detail. Very analytical. I could hear every percussion instrument included in the song, and even revealed some small details that I never heard of from my LDII++. The highs were much crispier, which kinda made my HD650's slightly sibilant in some cases, but nothing that'll slice your eardrums. Everything just sounded so much cleaner, clearer, bold and solid. The mids are smooth as it can ever be, and this is good because this amp seemed to have kept the lushiness of the mids that I loved about my LDII++. This did made my HD650's slightly forward sounding, but by a small margin. 

*The PS3 (left) is also used as my CDP and DMP.*






 Oh, and the soundstage is pretty wide as well, but right now it felt a bit the same as my LDII++. Maybe it'll improve later on as I continue to burn it in. But it's nothing that's narrow. I played some of my tracks that sounded spacious like Heart "There's a girl" and it did have a nice instumental separation to it. Nothing narrow. 

 Well, this my first impression so far with my Little Dot MKIV SE with M8100 and 6H30PI tubes. Enjoy!!!


----------



## Penchum

Great first impression review! Ya did good!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Now the fun part: MKIVse + 100hrs = Yummmy! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Have a good one!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Do some MkIVse's ship with M8100 and others with 403A's?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Do some MkIVse's ship with M8100 and others with 403A's?_

 

They have switched back to the original tube set. The "se" is hard wired for the M8100 now. DavidZ said that when they run out of Russian power tubes and M8100s, the "se" goes away for good!


----------



## TKvC-SainT

After reading Xoens nice little mini review, I´m so eager to get my hands on my new L D Mk4SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 And also about the tube switching. There are 2 screws on top that hold the whole thing down. So just unscrew those two and then the whole gold base plate and tube guards come off. Tube changing just got easy people! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *Edit* Thought about that nightshot thing, well here´s a pic of my old Mk4.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After reading Xoens nice little mini review, I´m so eager to get my hands on my new L D Mk4SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And also about the tube switching. There are 2 screws on top that hold the whole thing down. So just unscrew those two and then the whole gold base plate and tube guards come off. Tube changing just got easy people! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *Edit* Thought about that nightshot thing, well here´s a pic of my old Mk4.




_

 

Thats it!! I'm going to have to get my camera out again! I'm a sucker for tube "night" shots!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I feel a thread coming......


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Great first impression review! Ya did good!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Now the fun part: MKIVse + 100hrs = Yummmy! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Have a good one! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks! I got almost 10 hours in it now, playing my trance music continuously. I can start to hear it open up a little. 

 Is it safe to leave this thing on overnight? Isn't that what Little Tube did during the quality check, running it 48 hours straight? Just wondering. I'll probably just turn it off for safety reasons for now before going to bed. 

 Here's another pic just because I felt like sharing it:

*Little Dot MKIV SE with its little brother Little Dot II++. It gives a good idea about the size comparisons between the two amps. *






 Please excuse the little mess! And no that's not my computer. It's simply my portable DVD player I use as a monitor for my PS3 (not shown) using it's built in web browser. I'm planning to buy a new desk soon, and it'll be dedicated as my listening station.


----------



## Capunk

Please compare your MKIVSE with your LD 2++


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Capunk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please compare your MKIVSE with your LD 2++ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, since I did not fully compare my LD MKIV SE to my LD II++ in my mini review, I'll just go ahead and compare them one on one. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Do note, however, that I'm NOT using the stock tubes on my LD II++. Currently, it has the Russian Ulyanovsk 6C19P-V power tubes from ebay, and the Mullard CV131 driver tubes I bought from a fellow Head-Fi'er here a couple of months ago. It has been fully burned in, over 500-700+ hours in it. My MKIV SE has only been burning in for a little over 20 hours, not continuous, but at least 12 hours a day at the most. 

 I did a little side by side comparison between the two amps, critically listened to both of them using certain tracks I use as reference such as Brian Adams "To really love a woman" for high resolution, Survivor "Burning heart" for depth, Oceanlab "Beautiful Together (Sigma Remix)" for bass extension, and Oceanlab "Clear Blue Water" for bass impact. I'm telling you right now the MKIV SE is a far better amp than the LD II++ from what I heard in the comparison. The LD II++ is just not in the same league as the MKIV SE. Entry level vs top of the line, I don't think it's really fair to compare the two together. Whatever good the LD II++ did to the sound, the MK IV SE did much better. That's not to say the LD II++ is a bad sounding amp compared to the MKIV SE. It just doesn't have the same tightness, detail, soundstage, and bass in comparison. The LDII++ sounded kinda dull and the soundstage is narrower, and the bass is leaner in all the songs played. 

 For the song"To really love a woman" by Brian Adams to test for high resolution, the MKIV SE brought out more details and crispier, metallic highs, whereas the LDII++, while it did sounded detailed, kinda dulled out the highs making it less analytical. 

 In Survivor "Burning Heart" to test for depth and soundstage, the MKIV SE seemed to 'surround' you with music and there was a greater sense of space. The drums and vocals seem to play just about 10-20 feet from you. The LDII++ narrowed all this in comparison and closed everything in, and sounded a bit more "stereo" than 3D, though it kinda surrounds you a bit as well, but just not as much. 

 In Oceanlab's "Beautiful Together (Sigma Remix)" trance song to test for bass extension, the bass extends really deep and is very punchy in the MKIV SE. The LDII++ in comparison sounded leaner on the bass, didn't extend as deep, but it sounded tight and fast, but not as punchy. 

 In Oceanlab's "Clear Blue Water" trance song to test for bass impact, the bass hits really hard and deep that I could almost feel it in my ears. In the LDII++, the bass didn't quite have the punching power and like the last trance song, it sounded leaner, yet tight and fast. 

 There goes my comparison between the two amps using my stock Sennheiser HD650 with my Sony PS3 with stock cables as my CD player.


----------



## Penchum

Very well done!


----------



## Xoen

I appreciate that! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh and when you bought your Tung Sol tubes, how long did you have to wait? Did you buy it from ebay? I'm considering those tubes once I get used to the sound of my amp as well as having it fully burned in.


----------



## dgbiker1

My wallet hates people like you
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks for the review, now I'll be looking at this amp very closely.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I appreciate that! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh and when you bought your Tung Sol tubes, how long did you have to wait? Did you buy it from ebay? I'm considering those tubes once I get used to the sound of my amp as well as having it fully burned in._

 

I did purchase them on ebay. They were sent priority, so I got them in like 5 business days. They took about 40 hours to mature, but they sound pretty good right away! They glow very nice too!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Nice review Xoen. Can you specify which tubes you are using in either of the amps? The tube compliment does affect the sonics a bit.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nice review Xoen. Can you specify which tubes you are using in either of the amps? The tube compliment does affect the sonics a bit._

 

Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 For the LD MKIV SE, it currently has the stock M8100 and 6H30PI tubes, and in the LD II++ it currently has upgraded Ulyanovsk 6S19P-V and Mullard CV131 tubes. 

 The tubes in the LD II++ were put in just so to add a bit of low end in my AD700's without sacrificing much of the high end frequencies, and it did quite a bit. This was at the time before I ever bought the HD650's, and I upgraded the tubes just to make my AD700's sound their best, and it did, to my ears. I was impressed by the results since the new tubes did add a bit of low end in the AD700's, since they were kinda lacking bass a little. The LDII++ is not a bad sounding amp at all, nowhere near it. Now that I upgraded, I had to give my honest thoughts about the two amps and I still don't think it's fair to compare the two together. It's like comparing a Lexus to a Ferrari. Both have their ups and downs, but one has more advantages over the other.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 For the LD MKIV SE, it currently has the stock M8100 and 6H30PI tubes, and in the LD II++ it currently has upgraded Ulyanovsk 6S19P-V and Mullard CV131 tubes. 

 The tubes in the LD II++ were put in just so to add a bit of low end in my AD700's without sacrificing much of the high end frequencies, and it did quite a bit. This was at the time before I ever bought the HD650's, and I upgraded the tubes just to make my AD700's sound their best, and it did, to my ears. I was impressed by the results since the new tubes did add a bit of low end in the AD700's, since they were kinda lacking bass a little. The LDII++ is not a bad sounding amp at all, nowhere near it. Now that I upgraded, I had to give my honest thoughts about the two amps and I still don't think it's fair to compare the two together. It's like comparing a Lexus to a Ferrari. Both have their ups and downs, but one has more advantages over the other._

 

Well said. I have found that at low to moderate listening levels, if I run into a situation where it is hard to tell differences between two amps like this, drive the amps up. It will become obvious immediately who has better dynamics and less distortion. Having said that, the LDII++ is still a keeper!! Sometimes, I listen to it late at night just to have that "special" sound take me away for a while!!


----------



## Caribou679

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_... It's like comparing a Lexus to a Ferrari. Both have their ups and downs, but one has more advantages over the other._

 

I'll take a Lexus anytime!

 regards,


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

double post.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh and when you bought your Tung Sol tubes, how long did you have to wait? Did you buy it from ebay? I'm considering those tubes once I get used to the sound of my amp as well as having it fully burned in._

 

Make sure you have an MkIVse that's wired specifically for the 5687 tubes.


----------



## davve

How are the MKIV vs darkvoice 332??


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *davve* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How are the MKIV vs darkvoice 332??_

 

I don't think you are going to find any direct comparisons. Too much money involved in getting those two in the same place.


----------



## tunes

Has any compareed the Woo 6 to the D MKIV SE?


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tunes* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has any compareed the Woo 6 to the D MKIV SE?_

 

Not many people, at least from what I've seen around here, have the Little Dot MKIV SE, so I doubt there would be any comparisons between the two amps you mentioned. Maybe someone could let another head-fi'er with a WA6 borrow his MKIV SE and compare the two? I've seen people lend their prized headphones/amps to another person just so they can review them.


----------



## shotmaker

I recently bought a used MKIV SE. While I'm waiting for it arrive, I am wondering how will it sound as a preamp with my dad's old integrated amp (a Sanyo dca 411). Sure Sanyo has never been as good as Marantz or Sansui, but the amps from this period (70's) all had a somewhat similar sound, kinda tubey, warm and rich, and I would like to know how these amps sound as power amps with the Little dot (or any tube amp). Is it too tubey? If so, what would you recommend as a not so expansive solution (200-250) to make sure the Little Dot is well heard through speakers ? 

 I have another question: could the Little Dot be used as a phono preamp (with no other preamp between the turntable and the little dot..) ? 

 Thanks!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I recently bought a used MKIV SE. While I'm waiting for it arrive, I am wondering how will it sound as a preamp with my dad's old integrated amp (a Sanyo dca 411). Sure Sanyo has never been as good as Marantz or Sansui, but the amps from this period (70's) all had a somewhat similar sound, kinda tubey, warm and rich, and I would like to know how these amps sound as power amps with the Little dot (or any tube amp). Is it too tubey? If so, what would you recommend as a not so expansive solution (200-250) to make sure the Little Dot is well heard through speakers ? 

 I have another question: could the Little Dot be used as a phono preamp (with no other preamp between the turntable and the little dot..) ? 

 Thanks!_

 

Hi! It will sound great as a pre-amp, or through a pre-amp. I have used mine on 3 different vintage amps and with great success. I think you'll find the sound is not nearly as "tubey" as you think, but trying it is the only way too be sure. You won't have any trouble hearing the "MKIVse" sound. I've had my SPEC-4 amp up over 125w RMS using only the MKIVse to drive it with. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 You need to have a turntable phono stage. Whether from a receiver, integrated amp or separate unit. There is no phono stage built-in to the MKIVse. Have a good one!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I recently bought a used MKIV SE. While I'm waiting for it arrive, I am wondering how will it sound as a preamp with my dad's old integrated amp (a Sanyo dca 411). Sure Sanyo has never been as good as Marantz or Sansui, but the amps from this period (70's) all had a somewhat similar sound, kinda tubey, warm and rich, and I would like to know how these amps sound as power amps with the Little dot (or any tube amp). Is it too tubey? If so, what would you recommend as a not so expansive solution (200-250) to make sure the Little Dot is well heard through speakers ?_

 

I used to use my Little Dot to drive my vintage Marantz for a while, it sounds great, never too tubey. A great advantage of having this set-up is the ability to tune the sound of your amp by rolling the driver tubes on the Little Dot. 

 By the way, a tip, the pre-amp out on Little Dots are driven by the signal tubes only (the smaller tubes in front), and given the transparent nature of Little Dots you can really hear the difference between signal tubes that way.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ I have another question: could the Little Dot be used as a phono preamp (with no other preamp between the turntable and the little dot..) ?_

 

Like Penchum said, you'd need a phono stage between your TT and the little dot for the record to sound right.


----------



## shotmaker

Thanks to both of you for the all the info! I wanted to be sure I can actually hear the thing and not only the vintage amp.


----------



## Lainar

First Off I just want to say hi. I'm brand new here and I also want to thank you all for making my wallet much lighter then it was a week ago. My LD MKIVse should be in today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm so excited. This is my first foray into headphone amps period so It'll be all good.

 Thanks all and Hi from Canada


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lainar* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_First Off I just want to say hi. I'm brand new here and I also want to thank you all for making my wallet much lighter then it was a week ago. My LD MKIVse should be in today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm so excited. This is my first foray into headphone amps period so It'll be all good.

 Thanks all and Hi from Canada_

 

First off, welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about your wallet! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Congrats on your new LD MKIV SE! It's a great sounding amp that performs above its price range, great competition for amps costing $600 and more. It'll be nice to hear your first impressions once you get it! Cheers!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lainar* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_First Off I just want to say hi. I'm brand new here and I also want to thank you all for making my wallet much lighter then it was a week ago. My LD MKIVse should be in today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm so excited. This is my first foray into headphone amps period so It'll be all good.

 Thanks all and Hi from Canada_

 

Wow! Congratulations! That is a heck of an amp for a first amp! You are going to be one happy camper, for sure!


----------



## Lainar

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow! Congratulations! That is a heck of an amp for a first amp! You are going to be one happy camper, for sure! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You absolutely right 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I recieved my se on Wednsday and plugged her in and I was amazed right from the get go. I'm running some hd600's through her and while I have nothing to compare to this amp sounds very very good. Been burning her in now for the last few days and every morning I go listen for a while and it's getting better every day. Took 12 days to get to me and that's quicker then most things I get from the US. I'm in Canada so most things take a while. I think it was $400 well spent and want to thank you guys for turning me onto this amp. The choices are plentiful for amps and it's real hard to buy one without listening to it first. This forum is an excellant place to come and find out information. 

 Thanks to Davidzhezhe at Little Dot for providing us with an outstanding product, who told me every step that the order would take. I'll be honest, that kind of service is a rarity in this day and age so it was very pleasant to dela with david. I never had to worry about my order at all.

 Now I'm off to go listen to some music 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lainar* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You absolutely right 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I recieved my se on Wednsday and plugged her in and I was amazed right from the get go. I'm running some hd600's through her and while I have nothing to compare to this amp sounds very very good. Been burning her in now for the last few days and every morning I go listen for a while and it's getting better every day. Took 12 days to get to me and that's quicker then most things I get from the US. I'm in Canada so most things take a while. I think it was $400 well spent and want to thank you guys for turning me onto this amp. The choices are plentiful for amps and it's real hard to buy one without listening to it first. This forum is an excellant place to come and find out information. 

 Thanks to Davidzhezhe at Little Dot for providing us with an outstanding product, who told me every step that the order would take. I'll be honest, that kind of service is a rarity in this day and age so it was very pleasant to dela with david. I never had to worry about my order at all.

 Now I'm off to go listen to some music 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don_

 

I've been using my HD-600s more and more with my MKIVse. They are proving to be very nice with all my amps! I hadn't expected this, so it feels good that buying them wasn't a waste of money. They really like the rich deep bass on the MKIVse too.


----------



## devito_dk

Where to buy it ??? I have searched with google and on ebay but i can´t find a dealer


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *devito_dk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Where to buy it ??? I have searched with google and on ebay but i can´t find a dealer 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

If you are talking about the MKIVse, then you'll need to understand a couple of things. They are out on Chinese New Year right now. No eBay sales, but they will take direct orders through their site: Little-Tube


----------



## devito_dk

yah i am... thx for the link... found what is was looking for..


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *devito_dk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yah i am... thx for the link... found what is was looking for.._

 

Good. Let us know if you have any questions we might be able to answer.


----------



## Seba

I won GE Five Star 6AK5 NOS tubes from eBay and I'm eagerly waiting them for testing them against stock M8100's...

GE Five Star 6AK5 Tube Little Dot Amp MkIII MkIV EF95 - eBay (item 280197518782 end time Feb-08-08 17:46:28 PST)


----------



## Seba

And now I won some russian tubes that Penchum is raving about:

6AK5-EF95-5654 Russian Tube 6Zh1P-EV. Lot of 8 - eBay (item 330209977725 end time Feb-12-08 13:01:11 PST)


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And now I won some russian tubes that Penchum is raving about:

6AK5-EF95-5654 Russian Tube 6Zh1P-EV. Lot of 8 - eBay (item 330209977725 end time Feb-12-08 13:01:11 PST)_

 

You are just a tube buying machine!!!


----------



## Seba

I like to have some options changing the sound in LD aswell. Zero has now 2xLT1028 in the DAC burning in...


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I like to have some options changing the sound in LD aswell. Zero has now 2xLT1028 in the DAC burning in..._

 

I know.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Me too!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Those little Russian tubes are going to make your day!


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## Seba

I'll probably match them because I know someone in this town who has the equipment to do it (for a fee of course). After that I'll probably sell two pairs and keep me the other two pairs.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'll probably match them because I know someone in this town who has the equipment to do it (for a fee of course). After that I'll probably sell two pairs and keep me the other two pairs._

 

I've been telling myself for a while now, that I should invest in a tube tester, but I always do something else instead. I guess I should zero in on it and get it done.


----------



## Xoen

My MKIV SE has almost 200 hours in it now and I definitely heard some improvements along the way. I haven't burned it in continuously, mostly about 6-8 hours a day after work. The treble is sweeter, more airy and has better transparency all around while still sounding smooth. The mids hasn't changed much and still sounds a lot like my LDII++'s mids. It's still smooth, warm, and slightly forward sounding, just how I like it. The vocals seem very lively in almost every song. There's better texturization on the bass as well as extending a tad bit deeper, though the impact remains the same as before. The most noticeable improvement, however, is the cavernous soundstage. Warmer, nothing excessive, and surrounds you pleasantly while still retaining the detail and dynamics of the music. Very enjoyable to hear the swirliness of my ambient music tracks!!

 Anyone know if the Tung Sol tubes would work with MKIV SE's wired for M8100 tubes?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My MKIV SE has almost 200 hours in it now and I definitely heard some improvements along the way. I haven't burned it in continuously, mostly about 6-8 hours a day after work. The treble is sweeter, more airy and has better transparency all around while still sounding smooth. The mids hasn't changed much and still sounds a lot like my LDII++'s mids. It's still smooth, warm, and slightly forward sounding, just how I like it. The vocals seem very lively in almost every song. There's better texturization on the bass as well as extending a tad bit deeper, though the impact remains the same as before. The most noticeable improvement, however, is the cavernous soundstage. Warmer, nothing excessive, and surrounds you pleasantly while still retaining the detail and dynamics of the music. Very enjoyable to hear the swirliness of my ambient music tracks!!

 Anyone know if the Tung Sol tubes would work with MKIV SE's wired for M8100 tubes?_

 

What is the number on the Tung-Sols?


----------



## snoop_005

Yep the amp sounds amazing..too bad im selling mine, too much bills stacked up....


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What is the number on the Tung-Sols?_

 

5687 WB. Never mind, though, since I kinda overlooked the part in this thread where DoA told me I need an MKIV SE wired for 5687 tubes. It's okay, though!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_5687 WB. Never mind, though, since I kinda overlooked the part in this thread where DoA told me I need an MKIV SE wired for 5687 tubes. It's okay, though! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

This is true! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 However, LD is looking into whether or not they can make adapters for us, which is totally cool, and one of our users here is getting parts to make an adapter. So, hopefully soon, we will have the ability to get some plug in adapters and use the 5687's, E182CC's, 7119's and 7044's.


----------



## TKvC-SainT

Wohoo! I finally got my return Mk4SE today (my Mk4 broke, so I took the opportunity and traded up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





). Been playing some music, not alot 'cause today has been busy. But so far I´m loving what I´m hearing with both my K701s and my all new ESW9s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One thing that surprised me when I unboxed it was that I noticed that I had the Electro Harmonix 6H30PI power tubes, combined with the Western Electrics 408A driver tubes, don´t think I´ve seen that combo before ( ? ). Only negative thing about the WE 408As are that these don´t glow as much as my previous Mk4s 5654 tubes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Might as well ask you guys too, what sort of tube rolling will I be able to do with this unit (other HQ tubes such as WE 408As)? As when I looked on eBay about a month ago, the availability of WE 408As weren´t plenty (found 2 total, 2 guys selling 1 tube each). Though I probably won´t be needing new driver tubes any time soon, as those have really high estimated life lenght.


 Well I´ll be doing some heavy burn-in for a couple of weeks, so I get a good amount of hours on this one, just as my returned Mk4, and then I´ll probably return with some more in-depth opinions about this abso f-ing lutely fabulous head amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 *Edit* Also expect a reviving of the Tube glow thread real soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 *Edit2* Uploaded pics in the "Night Time Shots Of Our Tubes Glowing..." thread


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wohoo! I finally got my return Mk4SE today (my Mk4 broke, so I took the opportunity and traded up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). Been playing some music, not alot 'cause today has been busy. But so far I´m loving what I´m hearing with both my K701s and my all new ESW9s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One thing that surprised me when I unboxed it was that I noticed that I had the Electro Harmonix 6H30PI power tubes, combined with the Western Electrics 408A driver tubes, don´t think I´ve seen that combo before ( ? ). Only negative thing about the WE 408As are that these don´t glow as much as my previous Mk4s 5654 tubes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Might as well ask you guys too, what sort of tube rolling will I be able to do with this unit (other HQ tubes such as WE 408As)? As when I looked on eBay about a month ago, the availability of WE 408As weren´t plenty (found 2 total, 2 guys selling 1 tube each). Though I probably won´t be needing new driver tubes any time soon, as those have really high estimated life lenght.


 Well I´ll be doing some heavy burn-in for a couple of weeks, so I get a good amount of hours on this one, just as my returned Mk4, and then I´ll probably return with some more in-depth opinions about this abso f-ing lutely fabulous head amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 *Edit* Also expect a reviving of the Tube glow thread real soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 *Edit2* Uploaded pics in the "Night Time Shots Of Our Tubes Glowing..." thread_

 


http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZyen1233


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wohoo! I finally got my return Mk4SE today (my Mk4 broke, so I took the opportunity and traded up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). Been playing some music, not alot 'cause today has been busy. But so far I´m loving what I´m hearing with both my K701s and my all new ESW9s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One thing that surprised me when I unboxed it was that I noticed that I had the Electro Harmonix 6H30PI power tubes, combined with the Western Electrics 408A driver tubes, don´t think I´ve seen that combo before ( ? ). Only negative thing about the WE 408As are that these don´t glow as much as my previous Mk4s 5654 tubes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Might as well ask you guys too, what sort of tube rolling will I be able to do with this unit (other HQ tubes such as WE 408As)? As when I looked on eBay about a month ago, the availability of WE 408As weren´t plenty (found 2 total, 2 guys selling 1 tube each). Though I probably won´t be needing new driver tubes any time soon, as those have really high estimated life lenght.


 Well I´ll be doing some heavy burn-in for a couple of weeks, so I get a good amount of hours on this one, just as my returned Mk4, and then I´ll probably return with some more in-depth opinions about this abso f-ing lutely fabulous head amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 *Edit* Also expect a reviving of the Tube glow thread real soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 *Edit2* Uploaded pics in the "Night Time Shots Of Our Tubes Glowing..." thread_

 

Congratulations! (Again) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I'm trying to understand the tube situation you have. Are you sure those are 408A's, not 403B's????


----------



## TKvC-SainT

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Congratulations! (Again) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I'm trying to understand the tube situation you have. Are you sure those are 408A's, not 403B's????_

 

Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As said it clearly says 408A on the tube, so I think this might be yet another new variant of the Mk4SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Also thanks to DoA, though not sure those are compatible with my amp. Will have to send David an email asking which my options are


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As said it clearly says 408A on the tube, so I think this might be yet another new variant of the Mk4SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Also thanks to DoA, though not sure those are compatible with my amp. Will have to send David an email asking which my options are 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

A cool one though! The 408A is very musical!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TKvC-SainT* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As said it clearly says 408A on the tube, so I think this might be yet another new variant of the Mk4SE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Also thanks to DoA, though not sure those are compatible with my amp. Will have to send David an email asking which my options are 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

No sweat, I would send a message to that ebay seller, he's helped me out a few times before when I had questions.


----------



## Seba

I have now GE Five Stars in stead of M8100's. It sounds a bit harsh straight from the box but I think I can hear more details from music. Have to burn in them more to evaluate them properly.

 I also got 10 pcs of those Russian 6Zh1P-EV tubes today. I'll match them before I'll start using them.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have now GE Five Stars in stead of M8100's. It sounds a bit harsh straight from the box but I think I can hear more details from music. Have to burn in them more to evaluate them properly.

 I also got 10 pcs of those Russian 6Zh1P-EV tubes today. I'll match them before I'll start using them._

 

I'm pretty sure those 5-stars are going to be brighter, but the harshness should pass soon. I can't wait to hear what you think about the 6Zh1P-EV's.


----------



## Danika k

Has anyone tried the International 403B tubes? If so how do they sound? I have a pair of Tung-Sol 403B's and love 'em thanks to you guys!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone tried the International 403B tubes? If so how do they sound? I have a pair of Tung-Sol 403B's and love 'em thanks to you guys!_

 

I have a pair, they're a bit brighter than the Tung-Sols, quite good synergy with my Senn 650.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And now I won some russian tubes that Penchum is raving about:

6AK5-EF95-5654 Russian Tube 6Zh1P-EV. Lot of 8 - eBay (item 330209977725 end time Feb-12-08 13:01:11 PST)_

 

I know it's been a while, have you received these tubes and burned in a pair yet? I'm curious to hear your impressions with the headphones you have.


----------



## Seba

Oh sorry, I haven't keep you updated. I gave those tubes for matching and I should get them next week. I want to get the most out of them and I will be probably selling couple of pairs ahead to cover the expenses of matching.


----------



## sunseeker888

Hey Penchum, when you tested the preamp function, did you feed the LD's output into the AUX input? If so, you are utilizing two preamps, which would not really yield accurate test results. Instead, you should try feeding the LD's pre into your Pioneer's "Power-in" jacks, so that you are driving the power amplifier directly. 

 BTW, SPEC gear is incredible stuff-- had a SPEC-4 once and it was awesome. 

 Great review, too--Can't wait til my new LD amp comes!


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *snoop_005* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yep the amp sounds amazing..too bad im selling mine, too much bills stacked up...._

 

I just bought this amp from him! I can't wait to get my eager hooves on it!


----------



## Seba

Please let us (and especially me) know what do YOU like the combo MKIV SE + RS-2.

 BTW I managed to win Amperex 5654's from Yen Audio at eBay.

 Penchum, do you like those russian 6Zh1P-EV tubes more than Amperex 5654?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh sorry, I haven't keep you updated. I gave those tubes for matching and I should get them next week. I want to get the most out of them and I will be probably selling couple of pairs ahead to cover the expenses of matching._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please let us (and especially me) know what do YOU like the combo MKIV SE + RS-2.

 BTW I managed to win Amperex 5654's from Yen Audio at eBay.

 Penchum, do you like those russian 6Zh1P-EV tubes more than Amperex 5654?_

 

Hi! Those 6Z tubes are the bomb! If you haven't purchased the Amperex yet, wait and see how much you like the 6Z's first. They are very dynamic and come close to the expensive tubes for sure.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sunseeker888* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey Penchum, when you tested the preamp function, did you feed the LD's output into the AUX input? If so, you are utilizing two preamps, which would not really yield accurate test results. Instead, you should try feeding the LD's pre into your Pioneer's "Power-in" jacks, so that you are driving the power amplifier directly. 

 BTW, SPEC gear is incredible stuff-- had a SPEC-4 once and it was awesome. 

 Great review, too--Can't wait til my new LD amp comes!_

 

Thanks for the kind words! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I did try the MKIVse's output to drive the SPEC4 amp directly, and it worked great! I had my Cerwin-Vega S-1's pumping over 100w RMS, but stopped so the neighbors won't turn me in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm now using the MKIVse as my primary headphone amp, hooked to my computer via Zero DAC/Amp. The sound still blows me away!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just bought this amp from him! I can't wait to get my eager hooves on it! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Congratulations! It is one fine amp for sure!


----------



## webghost

i´ve received my MK IVse today (ordered at 29.02) i can only say 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 wow that thing looks and sounds impessive. (LD MK III for sale 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 the MK III is very good, but ist really worth to buy the MK IV - the endless
 Power and lightness of playing, still 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 greets
 Stefan


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *webghost* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i´ve received my MK IVse today (ordered at 29.02) i can only say 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 wow that thing looks and sounds impessive. (LD MK III for sale 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 the MK III is very good, but ist really worth to buy the MK IV - the endless
 Power and lightness of playing, still 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 greets
 Stefan_

 

Hi Stefan,

 Congratulations!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Un-boxing a MKIVse and hooking it up and listening for the first time is always a great experience! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It takes about 100 hours for the MKIVse to "mature" all the way, so listening gets more enjoyable as the hours tick away.


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## dan_can

Penchum, which gain do you use or think the best for HD650?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Penchum, which gain do you use or think the best for HD650?_

 

5 or 10 works fine. For me, I have one source that has a lower output, so I leave mine at 10 to accommodate it. SQ and noise wise, it will not make a difference which one you have it on.


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## shotmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi! Those 6Z tubes are the bomb! If you haven't purchased the Amperex yet, wait and see how much you like the 6Z's first. They are very dynamic and come close to the expensive tubes for sure. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks for the tip. I received my 6ZH1P-EV today and for now the only difference I see with the Mullard M8100 is the better price of the 6Z's ! 

 As for tube rolling of power tubes, my LD MKIVse came with the Mullard E182CC so I ordered two 1955 TUNG-SOL USN-5687 WA tubes with Black Plate + D getter.. and I was disappointed with their sound. It's too clear/dry for my taste; I really prefer the smooth, warm and sweet sound of the Mullard, so I was wondering if someone knew a good tube alternative to the Mullard E182CC ? I don't mind sticking with the Mullard but it could be nice to hear a tube that is even "better" (warmer/sweeter) or just to hear what you think of other tube in the 5687, 7044, 7119, 6900, ECC182 tube family.


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## Danika k

Has anyone tried the Sylvania Gold Brand 6AK5 on their Little Dot? I heard that Sylvanias are great for vocals and I happen to listen to a lot of light vocal music... 

Sylvania Gold Brand NOS 5654 / 6AK5 Little Dot Amp EF95 - eBay (item 280205414049 end time Mar-08-08 15:11:00 PST)

 what do you guys think? thx


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## ethebull

$$$$$$ I'm sure they are wonderful, just question the price/performance given the many EF95's I enjoy that ran $3-10/unit. 

 2 cents


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone tried the Sylvania Gold Brand 6AK5 on their Little Dot? I heard that Sylvanias are great for vocals and I happen to listen to a lot of light vocal music... 

Sylvania Gold Brand NOS 5654 / 6AK5 Little Dot Amp EF95 - eBay (item 280205414049 end time Mar-08-08 15:11:00 PST)

 what do you guys think? thx_

 

I wish I knew. They always extract a high price, so I've passed on them. An alternative would be the GE "Mobile Audio" 5654's that pop up on eBay from time to time. They are excellent in the "vocals" range and higher.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the tip. I received my 6ZH1P-EV today and for now the only difference I see with the Mullard M8100 is the better price of the 6Z's ! 

 As for tube rolling of power tubes, my LD MKIVse came with the Mullard E182CC so I ordered two 1955 TUNG-SOL USN-5687 WA tubes with Black Plate + D getter.. and I was disappointed with their sound. It's too clear/dry for my taste; I really prefer the smooth, warm and sweet sound of the Mullard, so I was wondering if someone knew a good tube alternative to the Mullard E182CC ? I don't mind sticking with the Mullard but it could be nice to hear a tube that is even "better" (warmer/sweeter) or just to hear what you think of other tube in the 5687, 7044, 7119, 6900, ECC182 tube family._

 

The Amperex 7119 and the Arcturus 7044 are the two that come to mind for warmer/sweeter.


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## TheMarchingMule

I have the amp with me in my house right now, but I can't hook it up right now because my girlfriend is over. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But can somebody please see if something moves inside their amp when you pick it up and move the case around? Tilting forward and backwards makes something small inside slide, and every now and then when I tilt it left and right, it sounds like a small something is bouncing and tumbling around. But nothing has fallen out of the gaps underneath, which is puzzling.

 Thanks!

 EDIT: Never mind, I opened it up and a piece of hot glue fell out. Do you think I should be concerned about that? The way it was formed was at a right angle, so I assume it was used to hold a cable somewhere.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have the amp with me in my house right now, but I can't hook it up right now because my girlfriend is over. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But can somebody please see if something moves inside their amp when you pick it up and move the case around? Tilting forward and backwards makes something small inside slide, and every now and then when I tilt it left and right, it sounds like a small something is bouncing and tumbling around. But nothing has fallen out of the gaps underneath, which is puzzling.

 Thanks!

 EDIT: Never mind, I opened it up and a piece of hot glue fell out. Do you think I should be concerned about that? The way it was formed was at a right angle, so I assume it was used to hold a cable somewhere._

 

That might be from where the LED meets the back of the faceplate? I don't think I'd worry too much. Glad to hear it arrived!!


----------



## sacd lover

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Amperex 7119 and the Arcturus 7044 are the two that come to mind for warmer/sweeter. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Arcturus was a rebrander so the tube was something else; probably a GE or Sylvania. The GE 7044's are the warmer of the two. There is a true RCA 7044, which can be hard to find that I have never tried. RCA's tend to be warmer sounding tubes in general so the RCA would be another possibility. From what I can tell GE, RCA and Sylvania were the only ones who made this tube. I have some Tung Sol branded 7044's but they were rebranded Sylvania tubes.


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## sacd lover

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the tip. I received my 6ZH1P-EV today and for now the only difference I see with the Mullard M8100 is the better price of the 6Z's ! 

 As for tube rolling of power tubes, my LD MKIVse came with the Mullard E182CC so I ordered two 1955 TUNG-SOL USN-5687 WA tubes with Black Plate + D getter.. and I was disappointed with their sound. It's too clear/dry for my taste; I really prefer the smooth, warm and sweet sound of the Mullard, so I was wondering if someone knew a good tube alternative to the Mullard E182CC ? I don't mind sticking with the Mullard but it could be nice to hear a tube that is even "better" (warmer/sweeter) or just to hear what you think of other tube in the 5687, 7044, 7119, 6900, ECC182 tube family._

 

If you can find a true RCA 5687 they have the warmest sound of the 5687's. The older square getter Raytheon 5687 is another 5687 that has a richer, darker signature. The TS, Sylvania, Raytheon 5687WA O getter and GE 5 star 5687's are brighter, cleaner sounding tubes in my Singlepower gear. 

 Unfortunately, with all the rebranding you are never sure what you will get. TS made most of the 5687's and I routinely find them rebranded in all the other major makers boxes. Moreover, make sure whatever tubes you buy are construction matched pairs. These tubes began manufacture in 1948 and had numerous revisions over the years; especially TS. You can have, say two Raytheon 5687's .... and they can be completely different tubes .... or one may not even be a Raytheon. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The 6900 is VERY expensive and hard to find. Moreover, the operating point for the massively constructed 6900 is different from the 5687 and usually will not sound that good in a 5687 circuit. Even when the 6900 is operating optimally this is another cleaner, clearer sounding tube.

 The warmest 5687 sub that comes to my mind is the GE 7044. The GE 7044 is a warm, smooth sounding tube with a slightly bigger soundstage vs the 5687's; again mainly in my Singlepower PPX3 SLAM.


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sacd lover* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Arcturus was a rebrander so the tube was something else; probably a GE or Sylvania. The GE 7044's are the warmer of the two. There is a true RCA 7044, which can be hard to find that I have never tried. RCA's tend to be warmer sounding tubes in general so the RCA would be another possibility. From what I can tell GE, RCA and Sylvania were the only ones who made this tube. I have some Tung Sol branded 7044's but they were rebranded Sylvania tubes._

 

I've been watching eBay for 7044's for over 6 months, and the only one to show up has been the Arcturus. It is warm and sweet, so I guess it must be a GE then. Hopefully, others will show up before too long.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone tried the Sylvania Gold Brand 6AK5 on their Little Dot? I heard that Sylvanias are great for vocals and I happen to listen to a lot of light vocal music... 

Sylvania Gold Brand NOS 5654 / 6AK5 Little Dot Amp EF95 - eBay (item 280205414049 end time Mar-08-08 15:11:00 PST)

 what do you guys think? thx_

 

That's actually not a bad price for Gold Brand tubes, like Penchum said they always tend to be at a premium because it's the TOTL from Sylvania. The starting price is basically $24 per NOS tube matched, and that's somewhat of a good deal IMO as I've seen other tube dealers charge easily twice that price.

 As far as the sound goes, you're right, Sylvania and vocal go together well on my MkIII.


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## Ricey20

Just emailed to try and get a MKIV SE. Currently have W5ks and a HA5000 and bought a HD650 for a different sound a few weeks back. They sound terrible with my HA5000 so wanted to get something that works well and I haven't tried tubes before so here's my chance. 
 So whats the verdict on good tubes for the HD650? Read through this whole thread but theres so many tubes I kinda got lost.

 Edit: HOLY CRAP. I emailed David like 5-10 mins ago and he already relied.

 "Thank you for your interest in the Little Dot MK IV SE, and I"m more than happy to be of service!

 The Little Dot MK IV SE is $399 plus $51 shipping to anywhere in the USA (Hawaii included). A blue power LED is no problem at all, and is actually the default color. We currently are running a bit behind on MK IV and SEs but we expect to be able to take orders beginning Monday of next week. Please also allow 3-5 days for testing and quality control before we ship, and in general I recommend 4-10 business days transit time, although Hawaii should be toward the lower end of that range."

 Thats some quick response time.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just emailed to try and get a MKIV SE. Currently have W5ks and a HA5000 and bought a HD650 for a different sound a few weeks back. They sound terrible with my HA5000 so wanted to get something that works well and I haven't tried tubes before so here's my chance. 
 So whats the verdict on good tubes for the HD650? Read through this whole thread but theres so many tubes I kinda got lost.

 Edit: HOLY CRAP. I emailed David like 5-10 mins ago and he already relied.

 "Thank you for your interest in the Little Dot MK IV SE, and I"m more than happy to be of service!

 The Little Dot MK IV SE is $399 plus $51 shipping to anywhere in the USA (Hawaii included). A blue power LED is no problem at all, and is actually the default color. We currently are running a bit behind on MK IV and SEs but we expect to be able to take orders beginning Monday of next week. Please also allow 3-5 days for testing and quality control before we ship, and in general I recommend 4-10 business days transit time, although Hawaii should be toward the lower end of that range."

 Thats some quick response time._

 

Yea, I was pretty surprised at how quick David replies to emails. The first time I purchased my MKIV SE, he replied to my email at around 10 minutes tops. 

 Looks like you're getting your MKIV SE with the blue LED, too. Mine looks great with it and just matches well with my PS3 (my CD source) as well as my other electronics with blue LEDs. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Cheers mate!


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just emailed to try and get a MKIV SE. Currently have W5ks and a HA5000 and bought a HD650 for a different sound a few weeks back. They sound terrible with my HA5000 so wanted to get something that works well and I haven't tried tubes before so here's my chance. 
 So whats the verdict on good tubes for the HD650? Read through this whole thread but theres so many tubes I kinda got lost.

 Edit: HOLY CRAP. I emailed David like 5-10 mins ago and he already relied.

 "Thank you for your interest in the Little Dot MK IV SE, and I"m more than happy to be of service!

 The Little Dot MK IV SE is $399 plus $51 shipping to anywhere in the USA (Hawaii included). A blue power LED is no problem at all, and is actually the default color. We currently are running a bit behind on MK IV and SEs but we expect to be able to take orders beginning Monday of next week. Please also allow 3-5 days for testing and quality control before we ship, and in general I recommend 4-10 business days transit time, although Hawaii should be toward the lower end of that range."

 Thats some quick response time._

 

DavidZ handles the customer service for LD and he is really excellent. Their whole customer first point of view is really refreshing, especially these days.


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## Xoen

How do you open this amp? Would you have to unscrew the two screws on the front plate as well as the back? I see the two screws next to the tube guard but I think those holds the circuit board.


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How do you open this amp? Would you have to unscrew the two screws on the front plate as well as the back? I see the two screws next to the tube guard but I think those holds the circuit board._

 

The rear panel screws will let you see inside, I believe the front panel screws will allow the faceplate and board to slide out the front. I haven't actually slid mine out (no need) but I have looked in from the back. There are some MONSTER caps in there!!


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## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The rear panel screws will let you see inside, I believe the front panel screws will allow the faceplate and board to slide out the front. I haven't actually slid mine out (no need) but I have looked in from the back. There are some MONSTER caps in there!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yea, I think I can see them just by looking through the small holes in where you adjust the gains. Yea, it's definitely got some high end components in it!


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## Seba

Couple of days I have listened music with only Zero DAC's headamp and thought the sound was great.

 Now today I turned on my MKIV SE and boy what a difference in the sound! Bass tightens up noticeably and the lowest notes will come to RS-2's if the album has some very low notes. Female singers sound much more realistic.

 I got my Amperex 5654 today and collected my matched 6Zh1P-EV tubes. I'll probably start with Amperex and then give those russian tubes a chance.


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## Penchum

I started cleaning up my Home Office/Lab for a few minutes today, and decided to try a USSR extravaganza! I put in the 6H30PI-DR's power tubes and a matched set of 6Zh1P-EV driver tubes. Flicked on the power switch and I swear I almost heard "Comrade!" through the HD-650's! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Man, this combination is powerful and dynamic as it gets, and this was feeding them from my Zune80. I just switched over to my Zero DAC and spooled up some lossless files. I have never heard my MKIVse sound like this. The fullest, deepest and most accurate bass, with punch; warm but clear mids with detail; fully extended highs that are clear and without spikes, anywhere. The sound stage is huge yet engaging, nothing is lost and every instrument gets to play itself accurately and with proper dynamics. I am really floored!

 I just had to share.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe I'll put in my Sylvania Gold 5654's after a while.


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## Ghoul

hey, if anyone is interested in a pair of sovtek 6h30's PM me. Unfortunately I got a pair before finding out about the the compatibility issue with the Mk III. On the brighter side I'm really getting into my Mk III and am still on the stock tubes. Can't wait to start rolling...good times


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## Pricklely Peete

Very interesting, I wonder if the 6N6P's are what is holding back the
 6Zh1P-EV's in the MK III. Have you tried your Sylvania golds or TS 403B's with the DR's yet ?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pricklely Peete* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Very interesting, I wonder if the 6N6P's are what is holding back the
 6Zh1P-EV's in the MK III. Have you tried your Sylvania golds or TS 403B's with the DR's yet ?_

 

Ya, who knows yet. I will when I get my resistors in next week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I ran the Sylvania Gold 5654s in the MKIII last night and still am. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Very nice indeed. The are now the best EF95 driver tube I have. Sure were expensive though.


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## Pricklely Peete

Those DR's are too rich for my blood......I'll have to settle (poor me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) for the EH golds...lol.

 The Syl's are wonderful. I wonder what the diff is between the gold pins and reg 5654's (like I have). Maybe that last bit of silvery sweetness in the top end and better noise rejection...? Guessing of course.

 We need a CanJam North....The CaneriCanZorama -sponsored by HooTeRs


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pricklely Peete* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Those DR's are too rich for my blood......I'll have to settle (poor me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ) for the EH golds...lol.

 The Syl's are wonderful. I wonder what the diff is between the gold pins and reg 5654's (like I have). Maybe that last bit of silvery sweetness in the top end and better noise rejection...? Guessing of course.

 We need a CanJam North....The CaneriCanZorama -sponsored by HooTeRs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You could be right. The glow differently than the regulars too. There is a difference in the plate, but I can't seem to figure it out. They need an "online CanJam".


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## dan_can

What kind of tool do you guys use to put on/take off jumpers? Pictures would be nice. Thanks in advance.


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## Kpt_Krunch

So, I've been thinking now of finally getting a headphone amp to complement my Grado RS/2's (they were expensive enough I may as well enjoy them to the fullest).

 So far, the Grado's have disappointed me as I feel for what I hear they are not worth the money, but that's because I'm just using the amp output of my receiver. I'm not saying the Grados sound bad, I'm saying they don't sound any different to me than a Rat Shack $50 pair, and they are not as comfortable. 

 So, this amp, the MKIV SE by LD, seems to be the best amp available for the money? One poster on this thread though did not like the LD MKIV with their Grados, but preferred the Sennheiser HD 650's instead. 

 I've notice a few posters here with the Grados that I have. So, is this amp worth it? Does it take you to an entirely new level? For almost $500 it better. In fact, I know what to expect. 

 I heard the song "So Far Away from Me" by Dire Straits (BIA SACD) on a McIntosh uni player, going through a McIntosh Tube tuner, finally to a tube amp, and then to Monster Eleganza $7000 7 foot speakers (line array). The guitar that cuts in and out in this track was really haunting and extremely detailed, like Knoffler was right in the room with you playing it while you were listening to the SACD. It's hard to describe, but I cannot duplicate that sound at home on my Grados using my H/K 520 AVR as the source of amplification and an Oppo 980H as my player.

 Has anyone with the the Grados and the MKIV SE listened to this SACD? If so, was that guitar very distinct? I don't mind paying the $500 for that sound, but if I don't get that sound, I won't be a happy camper. 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh, btw - the McIntosh player was $5300, the processor was $5999, the speakers (as mentioned) were $7499, and the tube amp (2 channel) that I cannot recall off the top of my head was another $1200. Total package value (retail in Cdn $'s) was about 20 grand. Will the RS/2's and the LD MK IVSE sound like a 20 grand (about 13 grand US or in that ballpark anyway) system?


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Hey *Kpt_Krunch*, welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about your wallet! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm planning to write a review on the LD MK IV SE, as soon as I pass the 200 hour mark; I think I have around 100 right now.

 Initial impressions are that first, this amp does need burn-in. When I first got it with ~60 hours on it, the midbass was overwhelming on a MFSL of Eric Clapton, and I was dissapointed.

 But add +40 hours on it, and everything sounds pretty much balanced now; very smooth, but sweet and musical at the same time. In fact, now I can't stand to listen to the Sennheiser HD 580, because everything sounds smeared to heck and back. BUt the Grado is bright, fast, detailed bass, enriching treble, very very faithful to the recording...I'm really looking forward to any futures changes within the next 100 hours!

 But yes, it does sound nice with a Grado RS-2. I can't say it's the best matchup, since my being around amps is extremely limited, but so far I am very pleased and happy to have the LD MK IV SE in my office.


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## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey *Kpt_Krunch*, welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about your wallet! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm planning to write a review on the LD MK IV SE, as soon as I pass the 200 hour mark; I think I have around 100 right now.

 Initial impressions are that first, this amp does need burn-in. When I first got it with ~60 hours on it, the midbass was overwhelming on a MFSL of Eric Clapton, and I was dissapointed.

 But add +40 hours on it, and everything sounds pretty much balanced now; very smooth, but sweet and musical at the same time. In fact, now I can't stand to listen to the Sennheiser HD 580, because everything sounds smeared to heck and back. BUt the Grado is bright, fast, detailed bass, enriching treble, very very faithful to the recording...I'm really looking forward to any futures changes within the next 100 hours!

 But yes, it does sound nice with a Grado RS-2. I can't say it's the best matchup, since my being around amps is extremely limited, but so far I am very pleased and happy to have the LD MK IV SE in my office. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hey MM,

 I'm glad the burn-in is progressing nicely. The MKIVse has some seriously large caps in it, which accounts for the longer burn-in time. My first one, seemed complete at 145 hours, but my second (newest version) took more like 200 hours. You will know you are getting close to the end, when those HD-580's start to sound excellent again. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Even though the stock tubes are nice, they are not necessarily the best for all headphones and systems. There have been some changes in what tubes were supplied during this models lifetime, so it can be hard to guess. Can you tell me what tubes came with yours? I might be able to suggest some NOS tubes that will improve the overall output, more to your liking (after burn-in of course 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, I've been thinking now of finally getting a headphone amp to complement my Grado RS/2's (they were expensive enough I may as well enjoy them to the fullest).

 So far, the Grado's have disappointed me as I feel for what I hear they are not worth the money, but that's because I'm just using the amp output of my receiver. I'm not saying the Grados sound bad, I'm saying they don't sound any different to me than a Rat Shack $50 pair, and they are not as comfortable. 

 So, this amp, the MKIV SE by LD, seems to be the best amp available for the money? One poster on this thread though did not like the LD MKIV with their Grados, but preferred the Sennheiser HD 650's instead. 

 I've notice a few posters here with the Grados that I have. So, is this amp worth it? Does it take you to an entirely new level? For almost $500 it better. In fact, I know what to expect. 

 I heard the song "So Far Away from Me" by Dire Straits (BIA SACD) on a McIntosh uni player, going through a McIntosh Tube tuner, finally to a tube amp, and then to Monster Eleganza $7000 7 foot speakers (line array). The guitar that cuts in and out in this track was really haunting and extremely detailed, like Knoffler was right in the room with you playing it while you were listening to the SACD. It's hard to describe, but I cannot duplicate that sound at home on my Grados using my H/K 520 AVR as the source of amplification and an Oppo 980H as my player.

 Has anyone with the the Grados and the MKIV SE listened to this SACD? If so, was that guitar very distinct? I don't mind paying the $500 for that sound, but if I don't get that sound, I won't be a happy camper. 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh, btw - the McIntosh player was $5300, the processor was $5999, the speakers (as mentioned) were $7499, and the tube amp (2 channel) that I cannot recall off the top of my head was another $1200. Total package value (retail in Cdn $'s) was about 20 grand. Will the RS/2's and the LD MK IVSE sound like a 20 grand (about 13 grand US or in that ballpark anyway) system?_

 

Hi KK,

 From what you've said here, sound stage seems to be very important to you. You are not alone. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Nothing straight out of the box, is going to sound the way you are hoping. Every higher end tube amp is going to require burn-in time in order for it to show it's full potential. Almost all of them will require changing the tubes to better ones, to achieve that special sound you are after. Knowing all this and the patience required to see it through, I highly recommend the MKIVse. It does indeed rank with headphone amps costing much more. I'm not sure what information you have seen on it (other than my review) so I'll give you the link to the Little-Dot information page:
Viewing a thread - New Little Dot MK IV Pictures
 Later...


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, I've been thinking now of finally getting a headphone amp to complement my Grado RS/2's (they were expensive enough I may as well enjoy them to the fullest).

 So far, the Grado's have disappointed me as I feel for what I hear they are not worth the money, but that's because I'm just using the amp output of my receiver. I'm not saying the Grados sound bad, I'm saying they don't sound any different to me than a Rat Shack $50 pair, and they are not as comfortable. 

 So, this amp, the MKIV SE by LD, seems to be the best amp available for the money? One poster on this thread though did not like the LD MKIV with their Grados, but preferred the Sennheiser HD 650's instead. 

 I've notice a few posters here with the Grados that I have. So, is this amp worth it? Does it take you to an entirely new level? For almost $500 it better. In fact, I know what to expect. 

 I heard the song "So Far Away from Me" by Dire Straits (BIA SACD) on a McIntosh uni player, going through a McIntosh Tube tuner, finally to a tube amp, and then to Monster Eleganza $7000 7 foot speakers (line array). The guitar that cuts in and out in this track was really haunting and extremely detailed, like Knoffler was right in the room with you playing it while you were listening to the SACD. It's hard to describe, but I cannot duplicate that sound at home on my Grados using my H/K 520 AVR as the source of amplification and an Oppo 980H as my player.

 Has anyone with the the Grados and the MKIV SE listened to this SACD? If so, was that guitar very distinct? I don't mind paying the $500 for that sound, but if I don't get that sound, I won't be a happy camper. 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh, btw - the McIntosh player was $5300, the processor was $5999, the speakers (as mentioned) were $7499, and the tube amp (2 channel) that I cannot recall off the top of my head was another $1200. Total package value (retail in Cdn $'s) was about 20 grand. Will the RS/2's and the LD MK IVSE sound like a 20 grand (about 13 grand US or in that ballpark anyway) system?_

 

If your H/K AVR520 sounds the same as my AVR645 then your RS-2's will sound like some cheap 20$ headphones. I have never heard my Grado's sound so bad from any source than my H/K HT receiver.

 On the other hand I'm very much enjoying my RS-2's with my MKIV SE. I can hear the difference straight away when I change some op-amps to my Zero or if I change some driver tubes to my LD. I can't imagine what aspect I would want to improve in my system. Everything sounds so right and my system sounds very good with all kinds of music.

 So, go for it...


----------



## Hopstretch

I just got my MK IV SE yesterday and had a few hours to listen to it last night on my own RS-2s. It is my first tube amp and I was immediately struck by how much more involving music was through this combo. I'm very happy with it.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got my MK IV SE yesterday and had a few hours to listen to it last night on my own RS-2s. It is my first tube amp and I was immediately struck by how much more involving music was through this combo. I'm very happy with it._

 

Congratulations! You are in for a treat as the MKIVse "matures" in the first 100 hours. Have fun, and let us know how things are going.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Congratulations! You are in for a treat as the MKIVse "matures" in the first 100 hours. Have fun, and let us know how things are going. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Actually, I think this one is pretty well broken in, as I am the third Head-Fi owner of record. Though I have no idea what the actual hours are on it.

 Meant to add, it has the EH 6H30 and Mullard 8100 stock.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Actually, I think this one is pretty well broken in, as I am the third Head-Fi owner of record. Though I have no idea what the actual hours are on it.

 Meant to add, it has the EH 6H30 and Mullard 8100 stock._

 

That's cool. Congratulations anyway! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If it sounds "mature", nice and full bodied, then tube rolling the driver tubes could be done right away. Lots of possibilities in the EF92 and EF95 families of tubes. There are many posts about these two families of tubes in the MKIII tube rolling thread.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey *Kpt_Krunch*, welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about your wallet! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm planning to write a review on the LD MK IV SE, as soon as I pass the 200 hour mark; I think I have around 100 right now.

 Initial impressions are that first, this amp does need burn-in. When I first got it with ~60 hours on it, the midbass was overwhelming on a MFSL of Eric Clapton, and I was dissapointed.

 But add +40 hours on it, and everything sounds pretty much balanced now; very smooth, but sweet and musical at the same time. In fact, now I can't stand to listen to the Sennheiser HD 580, because everything sounds smeared to heck and back. BUt the Grado is bright, fast, detailed bass, enriching treble, very very faithful to the recording...I'm really looking forward to any futures changes within the next 100 hours!

 But yes, it does sound nice with a Grado RS-2. I can't say it's the best matchup, since my being around amps is extremely limited, but so far I am very pleased and happy to have the LD MK IV SE in my office. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks for responding MM, yeah, it's hard on the wallet. I prefer to listen to my music on my main system sans cans, but when you're wife and little one is in bed, that's not the smartest thing to do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - so HP it is. Looking forward to your review but from what you've told me so far it looks like you're very happy with the sound and well worth the money. I started looking at the LD MKIII, and look where it took me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But, I'm only buying one, and Pencham had mentioned far earlier in this thread it's a lot cheaper to get the best now than to buy a cheaper one and keep upgrading as time goes on. Makes sense to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey MM,

 I'm glad the burn-in is progressing nicely. The MKIVse has some seriously large caps in it, which accounts for the longer burn-in time. My first one, seemed complete at 145 hours, but my second (newest version) took more like 200 hours. You will know you are getting close to the end, when those HD-580's start to sound excellent again. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Even though the stock tubes are nice, they are not necessarily the best for all headphones and systems. There have been some changes in what tubes were supplied during this models lifetime, so it can be hard to guess. Can you tell me what tubes came with yours? I might be able to suggest some NOS tubes that will improve the overall output, more to your liking (after burn-in of course 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)._

 

Normally, I don't believe in break-in. At least, not where the sound has an audible improvement (i.e. same speakers, same room same position, one with 200 hours on it, one brand new - no one can usually tell which is which consistently).

 However, with my research on tubes (and I'm a total noob here, at least I've learned what tube rolling is all about now.... I think 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) it's pretty obvious you do need to break them in and there is a significant improvement in sound quality once that occurs (your review originally bears that out).

 Right now it looks like the amp is shipping with the original setup - the 6H30PI for the 'power' tubes and the M8100 for the driver tubes. 

 What exactly does this mean - 'Power' vs 'Driver'. I think I know just based on the description, but want to be clear. Also, which contributes most to the sound? Do both contribute equally, or is it more in how it's used (as a preamp vs an amp)? 

 Also, from what I've read, you can use this as a preamp on your home system. You would plug in your source player into the LD's inputs, and use rca cables from the LD's output to your inputs on your AVR or amp (in my case it would be an amp as I use a two channel amp to power my mains). In this case, I would not even need to turn my AVR on. Is this correct? 

 Lots of questions, sorry, but you should have seen how many I had before I started reading


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 Normally, I don't believe in break-in. At least, not where the sound has an audible improvement (i.e. same speakers, same room same position, one with 200 hours on it, one brand new - no one can usually tell which is which consistently).

 However, with my research on tubes (and I'm a total noob here, at least I've learned what tube rolling is all about now.... I think 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) it's pretty obvious you do need to break them in and there is a significant improvement in sound quality once that occurs (your review originally bears that out).

 Right now it looks like the amp is shipping with the original setup - the 6H30PI for the 'power' tubes and the M8100 for the driver tubes. 

 What exactly does this mean - 'Power' vs 'Driver'. I think I know just based on the description, but want to be clear. Also, which contributes most to the sound? Do both contribute equally, or is it more in how it's used (as a preamp vs an amp)? 

 Also, from what I've read, you can use this as a preamp on your home system. You would plug in your source player into the LD's inputs, and use rca cables from the LD's output to your inputs on your AVR or amp (in my case it would be an amp as I use a two channel amp to power my mains). In this case, I would not even need to turn my AVR on. Is this correct? 

 Lots of questions, sorry, but you should have seen how many I had before I started reading 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hi! It's ok. Many don't believe in "burn-in" and I like to think of it as "maturing". It seems to fit better with what is going on inside. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The power tubes are the two larger tubes in the back. It is estimated they have 15-20% effect upon the final output. The 6H30PI Gold power tubes are excellent, and IMHO will not need to be replaced for improvement reasons.
 The driver tubes, the smaller guys up front, have a much larger roll in the final output. After tube rolling on 4 different tube amps, it is obvious to me, that they command the largest changes. The M8100 driver tubes are considered better than the "normal" EF95 tubes like GE or RCA's. I have found there are many other EF95 tubes that sound even better, and don't cost very much to obtain.

 The RCA outputs on the MKIVse can be used as a pre-amp function, or as another input to a pre-amp or receiver. This can be a lot of fun and sometimes solves brightness problems with CDs. Having the signal "tubed" before amplification does have some nice end results. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Another favorite hook-up situation is this: Take the "record out" from Tape 1 or 2 on a receiver, run this to the input of the MKIVse. Take the MKIVse output and run it to an AUX input on the receiver. This way, you can listen to the MKIVse with any source hooked to the receiver. If you have multiple sources, this isn't a bad way to go. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can drive an amplifier directly and I have tested this with my system here. Little-Dot doesn't skimp or neglect the pre-amp output, so it is very nice, clean and quiet, and is adjustable with the volume control on the front panel.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi! It's ok. Many don't believe in "burn-in" and I like to think of it as "maturing". It seems to fit better with what is going on inside. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The power tubes are the two larger tubes in the back. It is estimated they have 15-20% effect upon the final output. The 6H30PI Gold power tubes are excellent, and IMHO will not need to be replaced for improvement reasons.
 The driver tubes, the smaller guys up front, have a much larger roll in the final output. After tube rolling on 4 different tube amps, it is obvious to me, that they command the largest changes. The M8100 driver tubes are considered better than the "normal" EF95 tubes like GE or RCA's. I have found there are many other EF95 tubes that sound even better, and don't cost very much to obtain.

 The RCA outputs on the MKIVse can be used as a pre-amp function, or as another input to a pre-amp or receiver. This can be a lot of fun and sometimes solves brightness problems with CDs. Having the signal "tubed" before amplification does have some nice end results. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Another favorite hook-up situation is this: Take the "record out" from Tape 1 or 2 on a receiver, run this to the input of the MKIVse. Take the MKIVse output and run it to an AUX input on the receiver. This way, you can listen to the MKIVse with any source hooked to the receiver. If you have multiple sources, this isn't a bad way to go. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can drive an amplifier directly and I have tested this with my system here. Little-Dot doesn't skimp or neglect the pre-amp output, so it is very nice, clean and quiet, and is adjustable with the volume control on the front panel._

 

Fantastic stuff - thanks for all your help! I'm not experienced at all with tubes but break-in seems to be the mantra and I'm not in any kind of position to challenge that. This 'little' amp looks great and IMO is priced fine. I'm looking forward to following threads and trying out different tubes in the future, maybe even contributing to some once I get experience in this 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . Looks to me like you can get a new amp for $50 or so (in terms of sound) any time you want with tube rolling - very attractive indeed.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If your H/K AVR520 sounds the same as my AVR645 then your RS-2's will sound like some cheap 20$ headphones. I have never heard my Grado's sound so bad from any source than my H/K HT receiver.

 On the other hand I'm very much enjoying my RS-2's with my MKIV SE. I can hear the difference straight away when I change some op-amps to my Zero or if I change some driver tubes to my LD. I can't imagine what aspect I would want to improve in my system. Everything sounds so right and my system sounds very good with all kinds of music.

 So, go for it... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Hey Seba - sorry, somehow missed your post earlier. Boy, am I ever glad you posted that. Come to think of it, my Grados sound a lot better on my old (very old) analog Yamaha Receiver (5.1 - all video connections are S-video, that tells you how old it is) but I don't listen there that much. Here I thought it was the 'phones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . Never really thought about it until I read your post. H/K must really cheap out in that regard. Between your post and Pencham's invaluable info, I'm having a very hard time stopping myself from ordering.

 Great feedback - I'll be sure to (hopefully) add something once I get mine


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey Seba - sorry, somehow missed your post earlier. Boy, am I ever glad you posted that. Come to think of it, my Grados sound a lot better on my old (very old) analog Yamaha Receiver (5.1 - all video connections are S-video, that tells you how old it is) but I don't listen there that much. Here I thought it was the 'phones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . Never really thought about it until I read your post. H/K must really cheap out in that regard. Between your post and Pencham's invaluable info, I'm having a very hard time stopping myself from ordering.

 Great feedback - I'll be sure to (hopefully) add something once I get mine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yeah, I have to turn the volume all the way up to get some sound from Grado's. If I accidentally unplug headphones, my speakers will play very loud. It was the same thing with AKG K701 also. I'm thinking of buying RA-1 and connect it to my H/K's pre-outs to get decent sound from it.

 All of you RS-2 and MKIV SE owners here: My preference is: M8100 < GE Five star < Amperex 5654

 So if you want just one pair of driver tubes that are easy to get and sound good straight from the box, get Amperex 5654's.

 I haven't yet tested my 6Zh1P-EV's.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, I have to turn the volume all the way up to get some sound from Grado's. If I accidentally unplug headphones, my speakers will play very loud. It was the same thing with AKG K701 also. I'm thinking of buying RA-1 and connect it to my H/K's pre-outs to get decent sound from it.

 All of you RS-2 and MKIV SE owners here: My preference is: M8100 < GE Five star < Amperex 5654

 So if you want just one pair of driver tubes that are easy to get and sound good straight from the box, get Amperex 5654's.

 I haven't yet tested my 6Zh1P-EV's._

 

Have you tried any EF92 driver tubes with those phones yet?


----------



## Seba

No, I don't have any EF92's. My cousin has LD II+ but it has basic EF92's (6CQ6, W77) so I haven't bothered testing them.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, I don't have any EF92's. My cousin has LD II+ but it has basic EF92's (6CQ6, W77) so I haven't bothered testing them._

 

When you have time, check out his 6CQ6. The Mullard of that version is pretty nice. Maybe a set of M8161 if he has any. I've found that my HD-600s really like the EF92 compatibles in the MKIVse. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It might be worth your time.


----------



## ham069

Hey been lurking here for a while and figured I would finaly post

 Got my MKIV about a month ago and just had to send it back as it is defective
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 David has been awsome about the whole thing and I have decided to upgrade to the SE. Canada post messed up and sent it by ground (called me after I left and said they can't ship by air to china
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 I have to say now that I am used to the sound quality of my amp going back for a few weeks is going to be very hard. had a listen this morning and nearly cried. 

 I can't stress enough the level of customer service I have receved is so far beyond what I was expecting. a number of my friends and coworkers are thinking of picking up little dot amps after hearing the amp.

 The Ham


----------



## [S]uds

Pardon my ignorance, but I need to have something cleared up:

  Quote:


 So, from now on, the MKIVse will be hard wired to use the M8100 and 6H30PI tubes. 
 

When you say that they are "hard wired", do you mean Tube Rolling will be much more limited? And would you still recommend the SE version over the regular for the extra $100, or is the difference for that price not that noticable? I'm looking to pick up a good Tube Amp in that price range(For DT880's) and from your review, I believe this amp is the best bang for my buck. Thanks.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *uds* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Pardon my ignorance, but I need to have something cleared up:



 When you say that they are "hard wired", do you mean Tube Rolling will be much more limited? And would you still recommend the SE version over the regular for the extra $100, or is the difference for that price not that noticable? I'm looking to pick up a good Tube Amp in that price range(For DT880's) and from your review, I believe this amp is the best bang for my buck. Thanks. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_




It means the power tubes will be the 6H30PI-Golds, 6H30PI-NOS's or 6H30PI-DR's only. The great part is the expansion of tube rolling for the Driver tubes. The board now has jumpers for using EF95's and EF92's. There are a great many tubes to choose from, between these two tube families, and these two families are used by every MK series tube amp, so information on all the tube possibilities is being posted by MKII, MKIII and MKIV users! It is a much better setup than the original IMHO. Yes, I still think the "se" is worth the extra. Better components, the Gold Power Tubes and a 2 year warranty. It still makes good sense IMHO. Have a good one!!


----------



## [S]uds

Ah, that sounds great, Penchum. Thank you for the clarification. Now all I have to do is sell my Corda 2Move and Audio Line Out Cryo Doc. Thanks again.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ham069* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey been lurking here for a while and figured I would finaly post

 Got my MKIV about a month ago and just had to send it back as it is defective
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 David has been awsome about the whole thing and I have decided to upgrade to the SE. Canada post messed up and sent it by ground (called me after I left and said they can't ship by air to china
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 I have to say now that I am used to the sound quality of my amp going back for a few weeks is going to be very hard. had a listen this morning and nearly cried. 

 I can't stress enough the level of customer service I have receved is so far beyond what I was expecting. a number of my friends and coworkers are thinking of picking up little dot amps after hearing the amp.

 The Ham_

 

Yes - I agree about David. Has been very very helpful with me. Very patient in answering my questions and I'm sure I'll have a lot more........... when my MKIV SE arrives in a few weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Yep, I ordered it. I'm taking a big leap in faith here, but from what I've read here and on another site I'm sure I'll be quite happy. Though I'm very new to all this, I especially like the fact that you can use a variety of tubes to acheive different sounds. I can see how/why audiophiles would prefer this, you could have different tubes for different styles of music, depending on your preference. 

 Your comments Ham make me even happier - I'm sure it's a (and the whole little dot family) a great amp. I'll definitely post my thoughts on here once I get it and have experimented with it. I just hope I have some time to listen (work keeping me very very busy).


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, I have to turn the volume all the way up to get some sound from Grado's. If I accidentally unplug headphones, my speakers will play very loud. It was the same thing with AKG K701 also. I'm thinking of buying RA-1 and connect it to my H/K's pre-outs to get decent sound from it.

 All of you RS-2 and MKIV SE owners here: My preference is: M8100 < GE Five star < Amperex 5654

 So if you want just one pair of driver tubes that are easy to get and sound good straight from the box, get Amperex 5654's.

 I haven't yet tested my 6Zh1P-EV's._

 


 I've noticed the volume thing too. Even on my Yammy I have to turn the volume up to almost halfway, but it starts distorting at that point even though it's not 'loud'. I could take a bit more volume, but not the distortion. I can put my H/K to -5 and I still could use more there too. If the headphone became unplugged, it would be extremely loud in the room and that much power so suddenly may damage the speakers. 

 Have you tried your Little dot with your H/K - or just direct from the source?


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've noticed the volume thing too. Even on my Yammy I have to turn the volume up to almost halfway, but it starts distorting at that point even though it's not 'loud'. I could take a bit more volume, but not the distortion. I can put my H/K to -5 and I still could use more there too. If the headphone became unplugged, it would be extremely loud in the room and that much power so suddenly may damage the speakers. 

 Have you tried your Little dot with your H/K - or just direct from the source?_

 

No I haven't bothered testing LD from H/K. When I had Corda Headfive I had it briefly connected to tape-out and it sounded good. I'm so impressed with the combo: Zero DAC + MKIV SE that I won't be separating them.


----------



## Penchum

I am curious. What gain settings do you guys have your MKIVse set to?
 Thanks!


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am curious. What gain settings do you guys have your MKIVse set to?
 Thanks!_

 

Lowest (default)


----------



## Seba

Oh, I forgot asking this: When I turn on my MKIV SE one of my Amperex's lights up like a light bulb and then it dims slowly to normal glow. Is that normal? I have also noticed that the other tube glows slightly dimmer than the other.

 Those Amperex's are Yen's matched pair.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, I forgot asking this: When I turn on my MKIV SE one of my Amperex's lights up like a light bulb and then it dims slowly to normal glow. Is that normal? I have also noticed that the other tube glows slightly dimmer than the other.

 Those Amperex's are Yen's matched pair._

 

My Amperex Bugle Boys (EF92) do the same thing. I checked and there is nothing wrong with this happening. I also have a few M8100's that do it too. The difference in glow intensity has nothing to do with a pair matching electrically. I too was worried when I bought my 6H30PI-DR's. Their glow is different and for what they cost, I just had to inquire and find out for sure. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I was going to mention to you those Amperex EF92 Bugle Boys. The are extremely nice, and somewhat rare. If you see a set, jump on them (or PM me so I can 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) because the sound they have is unique in the EF92 family. More like an excellent EF95, but with the wider sound stage and better dynamics. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Have a good one!


----------



## Seba

I have now installed those mysterious 6Zh1P-EV tubes in my LD. Sounds great from the box. I have to listen them more to say anything about them.

 I made an Excel document from my tubes so I can see how good they match each other:







 Obviously I have tubes number 1 & 2 installed because they are the closest match.

 Edit: I looked those specs closely and found out that switching couple of pairs gave me more results under the 10% limit.


----------



## TylerEaves

Well, I just pulled the trigger on my mkIVse 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks to this thread (and especially penchum, via PM) for guiding me to this unit 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Couldn't believe the service I got ordering this. Total time from first contact to confirmation of payment was under 2 hours, despite it being something like midnight over there


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TylerEaves* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I just pulled the trigger on my mkIVse 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks to this thread (and especially penchum, via PM) for guiding me to this unit 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Couldn't believe the service I got ordering this. Total time from first contact to confirmation of payment was under 2 hours, despite it being something like midnight over there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

This is how they are. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now for the "waiting". The EMS shipping LD uses is the fastest thing I've ever seen. As long as customs doesn't hold anything, it has been 6-7 business days from date shipped, to your door. They say it could take 10 days, but I haven't heard of it taking that long before. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You will get a tracking number that works on EMS's tracking and most major postal outfits, like USPS. Have a good one!


----------



## [S]uds

I just pulled the trigger on a Little Dot MKIV SE as well and it was literally less than 2 minutes before confirmation(Using different emails as well). Can't wait to receive it! It was quite pricey, but I don't think I'll be disappointed. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: I'll be using the Little Dot MKIV through my computer, and I was just wondering if my source(Creative X-Fi ExtremeGamer) is going to be a bottle neck in my system. It'll be something like this:

 Creative X-Fi -> Little Dot MKIV SE -> DT880

 I'll be using the Mini to RCA Interconnects Jan Meier has for sale on his website.


----------



## TylerEaves

Might want to consider an outboard DAC. PC audio tends to be less than stellar (and Creative isn't really audiophile grade stuff either). I'm going to be using the DAC section of my Zero to drive mine.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *uds* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just pulled the trigger on a Little Dot MKIV SE as well and it was literally less than 2 minutes before confirmation(Using different emails as well). Can't wait to receive it! It was quite pricey, but I don't think I'll be disappointed. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: I'll be using the Little Dot MKIV through my computer, and I was just wondering if my source(Creative X-Fi ExtremeGamer) is going to be a bottle neck in my system. It'll be something like this:

 Creative X-Fi -> Little Dot MKIV SE -> DT880

 I'll be using the Mini to RCA Interconnects Jan Meier has for sale on his website._




Yes, I agree with TylerEaves. Ordering a Zero would Maximize your source signal and give you more choices in the future.


----------



## tjumper78

ordering mkivse as soon as my glite sells.
 i hope i am doing the right thing.


----------



## tcp56

Have had my Little-Dot MKIVse about 1 month, second owner, had about 100hrs on it. it ran very hot-- the whole body of the amp hot when I got it, sounded fine, now it runs cool. the volume is less, and noticable distortion when turning up the volume to the old output level. when it first started this problem, the volume seemed to be undulating up and down slightly. Any thoughts would be appreciated...


----------



## tjumper78

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Have had my Little-Dot MKIVse about 1 month, second owner, had about 100hrs on it. it ran very hot-- the whole body of the amp hot when I got it, sounded fine, now it runs cool. the volume is less, and noticable distortion when turning up the volume to the old output level. when it first started this problem, the volume seemed to be undulating up and down slightly. Any thoughts would be appreciated..._

 

think you should send an email to david at littletube. he'll be m ore than happy to help you out.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Have had my Little-Dot MKIVse about 1 month, second owner, had about 100hrs on it. it ran very hot-- the whole body of the amp hot when I got it, sounded fine, now it runs cool. the volume is less, and noticable distortion when turning up the volume to the old output level. when it first started this problem, the volume seemed to be undulating up and down slightly. Any thoughts would be appreciated..._

 

Yes, tjumper78 is right. Email DavidZ. He'll have a solution for you.


----------



## tcp56

Just a follow up to my previous post here. Talked to David but he wasn't sure what was going on with my MKVIse. even though I'm not the first owner it is still covered under the warranty. so it is on its way to ohio to get checked out. Guess I need a back-up amp.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am curious. What gain settings do you guys have your MKIVse set to?
 Thanks!_

 

Highest. I'm running HD650's on my amp.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just a follow up to my previous post here. Talked to David but he wasn't sure what was going on with my MKVIse. even though I'm not the first owner it is still covered under the warranty. so it is on its way to ohio to get checked out. Guess I need a back-up amp._

 

That is GREAT! Not that it needs fixing, the fact that they are covering it anyway! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Those guys are so great! Let us know when you get it back!


----------



## Xoen

I guess I'll be joining in with the people/person who's sending their MKIV SE for repair. Just this morning I heard a loud buzzing on my left channel. It's sounds like a grounding problem and it's definitely not my source. I'll contact David about this problem, but if anyone, maybe you Penchum had this sort of problem before and had fixed it, I'll very much appreciate that you post it here. Again, there's a loud buzzing noise from my left channel. Switching tube positions didn't help much either. Thanks for any replies and I sure hope this is covered by the warranty.

*EDIT:* Ok, when I switched the power tubes from their positions, the buzzing is now on my right channel. Then I noticed the volume is a little lower than usual. Turning it up only caused distortion when I'm sure last time I turned it up, it would hurt my ears. My best guess is that maybe the tubes are starting to wear out. I've had this amp since January 28, 2008 and I turn it on almost everyday, after work around 5pm and off around 12. I never have it on 12 hours straight, just about 4-6 hours a day at the most.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I guess I'll be joining in with the people/person who's sending their MKIV SE for repair. Just this morning I heard a loud buzzing on my left channel. It's sounds like a grounding problem and it's definitely not my source. I'll contact David about this problem, but if anyone, maybe you Penchum had this sort of problem before and had fixed it, I'll very much appreciate that you post it here. Again, there's a loud buzzing noise from my left channel. Switching tube positions didn't help much either. Thanks for any replies and I sure hope this is covered by the warranty.

*EDIT:* Ok, when I switched the power tubes from their positions, the buzzing is now on my right channel. Then I noticed the volume is a little lower than usual. Turning it up only caused distortion when I'm sure last time I turned it up, it would hurt my ears. My best guess is that maybe the tubes are starting to wear out. I've had this amp since January 28, 2008 and I turn it on almost everyday, after work around 5pm and off around 12. I never have it on 12 hours straight, just about 4-6 hours a day at the most._

 

You have a power tube going funky on you. It happens. Even though I'm sure David will send you another, I recommend buying a matched second set and burning them in and holding the others (unmatched) as spares. The volume drop in one channel is a dead give away that this channels power tube is going bad.


----------



## Xoen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You have a power tube going funky on you. It happens. Even though I'm sure David will send you another, I recommend buying a matched second set and burning them in and holding the others (unmatched) as spares. The volume drop in one channel is a dead give away that this channels power tube is going bad._

 

The entire amp's volume got low, and there's definitely some distortion in the music. It's weird because just last night, things were fine. Though, I did have the buzzing problem which started just 2 weeks ago which usually went away and then comes back. Only this time, it's louder and things just got worse. 

 It's alright, though, since David agreed to take my amp and repair it since it's still under warranty. Good thing, it's in Ohio so I wouldn't have to pay high international shipping charges to China.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The entire amp's volume got low, and there's definitely some distortion in the music. It's weird because just last night, things were fine. Though, I did have the buzzing problem which started just 2 weeks ago which usually went away and then comes back. Only this time, it's louder and things just got worse. 

 It's alright, though, since David agreed to take my amp and repair it since it's still under warranty. Good thing, it's in Ohio so I wouldn't have to pay high international shipping charges to China._

 

Ow, ok. I sure am glad they take the warranty seriously. It is great of them to ship and fix with no cost to the owner. I'm not sure anyone else does that. Let us know how this process works out.


----------



## Xoen

Sure will. I'm sending out the package on Monday, as much as I hate to wait that long. But at least I have a back-up amp, my Little Dot II++ in which I was supposed to sell last weekend, but ended up doing something else. I guess keeping it for a little while longer helped out a bit!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Xoen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sure will. I'm sending out the package on Monday, as much as I hate to wait that long. But at least I have a back-up amp, my Little Dot II++ in which I was supposed to sell last weekend, but ended up doing something else. I guess keeping it for a little while longer helped out a bit! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Having a back-up amp just makes great sense. Not only in your situation, but any other situation that might come up. If you do mods, or loan out to a friend, or like me, experiment with different usages, the back-up amp comes in very handy.


----------



## tjumper78

this is great!!!
 the item was shipped out from shenzhen china on 3/29, and i just received it at 10:40am 3/31. =D
 it now seriously blows to be at work today. 7 more hours until i get to test this beast.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_this is great!!!
 the item was shipped out from shenzhen china on 3/29, and i just received it at 10:40am 3/31. =D
 it now seriously blows to be at work today. 7 more hours until i get to test this beast._

 

I detect a "sick day" coming on......


----------



## tjumper78

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I detect a "sick day" coming on......
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

dont give me ideas!!
 if i knew that i was getting the amp today, i wouldve come into the office with a i-am-sick-frown on my face. however, i came into the office all hyper like a 7 year old on sugar rush.


----------



## TylerEaves

I'm about to go nuts too. Mine got into JFK yesterday...no idea when it will show up.


----------



## [S]uds

I just received mine and HOLY crap that was fast shipping. 4 Days from China to my door(Florida). It took a week including weekends since I ordered for it to arrive. Amazing service, thank you David!

 As for the sound... Simply Amazing! Of course I only have one set of HP's(DT880's) to test it on, and only one amp to use as a reference(Corda 2Move), but it still sounds amazing. I can't wait to get it fully burnt in and hear the difference.

 Now I just need a good DAC(Zero DAC?). It might be a month or so before I can afford more though, the MKIV SE killed my wallet. Anyways, great review, great amp. I couldn't be happier.


----------



## tjumper78

got home from work, opened up the box and hooked it up.








 the sound is LOUD but smooth and warm. i think i can enjoy music for hours and hours with this beast. lacking some details compared to gilmore lite but maybe i'll hear some improvements after some burn-in.
 and did i say this thing was loud? because it is! i set the gain at 10 b/c i have hd650 and dt990 250ohm. i cant go past 25/100 or its too loud. 

 a few questions:
 1. for gain, there were two red switches on the bottom. each switch had 2 buttons(?). i figured i set all 4 buttons at off position for gain of 10. can anyone explain what should be set at on and off to lower the gain? the manual says things like 1on and 2 off, 1off and 2on, and so on. but there are 4 friggin buttons!!
 2. i have my littledot connected through gilmore lite's loop-out. will that degrade the sound by any chance?
 3. what is the recommended warm-up time for tube amps? i gave my littledot for about 3 minutes before i started playing music. =p

 thanks in advance.


----------



## onlychild

Hi TJumper78, 

 That is the exact setup I am trying to do. Just ordered my HD650s today and was thinking about getting the Keces DAC to match with a MKIV.

 How do you like the Keces DAC with a tube amp?


----------



## tjumper78

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *onlychild* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi TJumper78, 

 That is the exact setup I am trying to do. Just ordered my HD650s today and was thinking about getting the Keces DAC to match with a MKIV.

 How do you like the Keces DAC with a tube amp?_

 

i must say it is fabulous! such smooth sound that is so easy to listen to! i think littledot matches with da-151 better than gilmore lite.
 after 1.5 hour of listen, gilmore lite sounds cold. although glite is still giving me better trebles and details, i am already liking this guy better.
 i am praying that the treble/detail will improvement with burn-in. OH PRETTY PLEASE!!! with a little more treble and details, this amp can be everything that i wanted in an amp.


----------



## [S]uds

How much heat can this bad boy take? It seems incredibly hot, with the back tubes actually burning my fingers. It's got plenty of air and space around it, but it's still pretty hot.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i must say it is fabulous! such smooth sound that is so easy to listen to! i think littledot matches with da-151 better than gilmore lite.
 after 1.5 hour of listen, gilmore lite sounds cold. although glite is still giving me better trebles and details, i am already liking this guy better.
 i am praying that the treble/detail will improvement with burn-in. OH PRETTY PLEASE!!! with a little more treble and details, this amp can be everything that i wanted in an amp._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *uds* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How much heat can this bad boy take? It seems incredibly hot, with the back tubes actually burning my fingers. It's got plenty of air and space around it, but it's still pretty hot._




tjumper, hang in there, many good changes coming before 100hrs. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Suds, those back power tubes will run 230-250 F, so don't touch them. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The amp will have no trouble running hard for 8 hours. After that, I would cool it to room temp before continuing. Have a good one!


----------



## tjumper78

mr. penchum, can you please read my post on the previous page? post #310. i had a few questions there. thanks.


----------



## tjumper78

grrrrrrrrr..
 i had the mkiv se on for about 5 hours straight. just now, the sound slowly died out with some distortion, and theres no sound now. i turned it off to see if the heat was causing this. i'll have to find out in an hour or so. 
 has anyone else experienced this?


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_grrrrrrrrr..
 i had the mkiv se on for about 5 hours straight. just now, the sound slowly died out with some distortion, and theres no sound now. i turned it off to see if the heat was causing this. i'll have to find out in an hour or so. 
 has anyone else experienced this?_

 

Wow, that's interesting. I'd contact David about that. I wonder if it's too hot or if something got loose in there. 

 Mine shipped on March 28th - I can' believe how fast you got yours(3 days???). I probably won't get mine until the end of the week by the earliest, if I'm lucky. 

 I'll definitely test it though to see if I get the same problem. Hopefully it's nothing serious, but if it is, I'm sure David will look after you pronto.


----------



## [S]uds

Yeah, I was surprised how fast I received it. I've ordered from plenty of places in the States with UPS Ground and received it slower.


----------



## dan_can

Mk IV SE is a very good amp with good driver tubes for HD650. My favorite tubes so far are WE 403B and GTE Sylvania 6AK5WB. I got mine over a month ago. Sometimes I leave it on for 48 to 72 hours straight, no problem. Latest shipments seem to have some quality issues. Hope they can be resolved soon. It's a wonderful amp for the price.


----------



## dreamwhisper

wow at the beginning of this thread there is a post about how 4 is a taboo chinese symbol for death, and how the MKIVse sells for $444

 I just went to little-tube.com and:

 Little-Tube BBS information center
 Little-Tube BBS welcomes our newest user, unfxtrader!
 1023 posts in 207 threads across 3 forums.
 There are 666 registered users.
 There are no upcoming calendar events.

 666 Registed users!@!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i must say it is fabulous! such smooth sound that is so easy to listen to! i think littledot matches with da-151 better than gilmore lite.
 after 1.5 hour of listen, gilmore lite sounds cold. although glite is still giving me better trebles and details, i am already liking this guy better.
 i am praying that the treble/detail will improvement with burn-in. OH PRETTY PLEASE!!! with a little more treble and details, this amp can be everything that i wanted in an amp._

 

Try a pair of RCA 5654 driver tubes, they're quite a bit more detailed than the stock. EF91 family of tubes will have much better treble extension (by virtue of their larger current draw), so you might want to consider giving those a try. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh and by the way, the little dot tube guide is coming out this Friday. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - DoA


----------



## tjumper78

just got a reply back from david.
 he said one or both power tubes might have died. also told me to hold onto the amp for now, and he'd send a replacement soon.
 the weird thing is that all 4 tubes are lit when i turn on the unit. (?)
 arghhh more waiting....


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 a few questions:
 1. for gain, there were two red switches on the bottom. each switch had 2 buttons(?). i figured i set all 4 buttons at off position for gain of 10. can anyone explain what should be set at on and off to lower the gain? the manual says things like 1on and 2 off, 1off and 2on, and so on. but there are 4 friggin buttons!!
 2. i have my littledot connected through gilmore lite's loop-out. will that degrade the sound by any chance?
 3. what is the recommended warm-up time for tube amps? i gave my littledot for about 3 minutes before i started playing music. =p

 thanks in advance._

 

The "dip" switches can confuse at first. Think of each pair of little white switches as a bank. Two banks, one left channel and one right channel. You have 4 combination choices in each bank. On + On, Off + On, On + Off, Off + Off. These make the four gain choices in the manual. You do the identical settings for each channel.

 If the loop-out is clean, it should be ok. Once the MKIVse is "matured", you can A/B this with a direct to source hookup. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I usually give my MKIVse about 1 minute to warm up. However, I don't "crank-it" unless it has been up and hot for at least 10 minutes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 This is only a personal preference thing.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_just got a reply back from david.
 he said one or both power tubes might have died. also told me to hold onto the amp for now, and he'd send a replacement soon.
 the weird thing is that all 4 tubes are lit when i turn on the unit. (?)
 arghhh more waiting...._

 

Wow! I hope the replacement MKIVse gets to you as fast as the first one. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The possibilities of both tubes going at once are slim, so he's doing the right thing.
 Hang in there man, keep us posted!!


----------



## tjumper78

so i guess the tube being lit doesnt necessarily mean that it is working?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so i guess the tube being lit doesnt necessarily mean that it is working?_

 

Correct. I had a power tube go once, and it looked just like the one that was still working. DavidZ is being very smart in your situation. He's going to send you a replacement just in case the issue is deeper than that! That is so excellent!! Their customer service just gets better and better!


----------



## Seba

You can improve the sound greatly by swapping those M8100's for GE Five Star, Amperex 5654 or 6Zh1P-EV tubes.

 I would rate Amperex's and those russian tubes above the GE's.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can improve the sound greatly by swapping those M8100's for GE Five Star, Amperex 5654 or 6Zh1P-EV tubes.

 I would rate Amperex's and those russian tubes above the GE's._

 

Those Russian tubes are really something! A friend came over the other night and asked it I had a tube that was great with Rock and Roll. I stuck in the Russian 6Zh1P-EV's, plugged in my HD-600's and had him select which song he wanted to listen too. He was totally blown away! I gave him my extra set I had reserved for my MKIII and he ran home to put in his MKIVse, excited like some little kid with two new candy bars!


----------



## Occidio

Just another story about LD's customer service.

 I purchased a SE from David and received it with damage to the front face plate. First thought that came to mind was how this was going to be resolved, afterall, it's easy for the manufacturer to claim it was the customers fault. (On a side note, I'm surprised something like this got through QC).

 After contacting David, he sent a face plate out immediately and now I have a SE that not only sounds great but looks great too. 

 All correspondence with David have been prompt and as a result I have no problem recommending their products to anyone. I was NEVER left guessing. 

 It's rare to find a company that has a great product and is willing back it up. I know it has been a repeated theme through out this thread but David and Litte Dot have earned it.


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Those Russian tubes are really something! A friend came over the other night and asked it I had a tube that was great with Rock and Roll. I stuck in the Russian 6Zh1P-EV's, plugged in my HD-600's and had him select which song he wanted to listen too. He was totally blown away! I gave him my extra set I had reserved for my MKIII and he ran home to put in his MKIVse, excited like some little kid with two new candy bars! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yesterday I listened to Diablo (some say they are finnish Metallica) and boy how aggressive those guitars sound. Whatever I play with my gear, everything plays beautifully. I think that RS-2's are great all-rounders.


----------



## tjumper78

woohoo! 
 i thought they were out of stock but david said he would send me his reserve mk iv se after a quick qc. 
 i still hate waiting.


----------



## TylerEaves

Just got my IVse home from the post office and rigged up. Not going to post any impressions yet as I've A: Only been listening about 5 minutes and B: It isn't burned in yet. But my unit has arrived, it glows properly, it makes noise...

 (Ok I lied, I will share one impression: K701 has BASS????!?!)


----------



## dan_can

If you like vocal, try to find a pair of Sylvania 6AK5WB. I got a pair of Sylvania Gold Brand 5654 yesterday for cheap (6 bucks), and I think 6AK5WB sounds sweeter. But gold pins do look better.


----------



## [S]uds

Was I the only one who was surprised by the size of this amp? After looking at the pictures, I thought it might be around 1/2 to 2/3 of the size that it was! Man was I wrong. It's not a problem, it just surprised me. I think they should include a familiar object in their pictures to use as a reference for size for people like me.


----------



## TylerEaves

I was slightly surprised. I was expecting good size, but it was maybe 20-25% larger than expected.

 Btw, after about 2 hours of listening: I'm in love. This has done exactly whatI was hoping for. My K701s are still very "reference" sounding and detailed, but they've mutated into some seriously ROCKING phones now. Great detail, nice bass (not exaggerated, but much more present, and more sensation of pitch).


----------



## ethebull

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you like vocal, try to find a pair of Sylvania 6AK5WB. I got a pair of Sylvania Gold Brand 5654 yesterday for cheap (6 bucks), and I think 6AK5WB sounds sweeter. But gold pins do look better._

 

X2 on the Sylvania 6AK5WB's. They have become my favorite drivers. Outstanding!


----------



## TylerEaves

Hate to be the bringer of bad news, but it looks like the run of the MKIVse may be over. Here's an e-mail replay I just got from David over @ LD.

  Quote:


 Hello Tyler,

 Ah that's excellent news! I'm happy to hear your Little Dot MK IV SE is finally in your hands and that you are so pleased with it - even right out of the box!

 Things are a bit unsure at the moment, but you may actually have one of the last Little Dot MK IV SEs. We do still have a small stock to satisfy warranty purposes, but as for retail models, this *may* have been the last run!

 Please enjoy your new Little Dot MK IV SE, and if you have any questions, please do not hesitate to ask!

 Best Regards,
 David


----------



## Trapper32

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ethebull* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_X2 on the Sylvania 6AK5WB's. They have become my favorite drivers. Outstanding!_

 

Great news...Can't wait till mine get here later this week...


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you like vocal, try to find a pair of Sylvania 6AK5WB. I got a pair of Sylvania Gold Brand 5654 yesterday for cheap (6 bucks), and I think 6AK5WB sounds sweeter. But gold pins do look better._

 

dc,
 Don't forget that tubes NEED 40-50 hours of break-in. Direct comparisons with any less time on them will not tell you how they are going to sound. Many sound like crap for quite a while, until they mature.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TylerEaves* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just got my IVse home from the post office and rigged up. Not going to post any impressions yet as I've A: Only been listening about 5 minutes and B: It isn't burned in yet. But my unit has arrived, it glows properly, it makes noise...

 (Ok I lied, I will share one impression: K701 has BASS????!?!)_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TylerEaves* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was slightly surprised. I was expecting good size, but it was maybe 20-25% larger than expected.

 Btw, after about 2 hours of listening: I'm in love. This has done exactly whatI was hoping for. My K701s are still very "reference" sounding and detailed, but they've mutated into some seriously ROCKING phones now. Great detail, nice bass (not exaggerated, but much more present, and more sensation of pitch)._

 

"Welcome, to the machine!" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Now you know why those of us who have one, love it! Have a great burn-in!


----------



## Occidio

Wow, this may be the end? I'm sure glad I picked one up while I had the chance!


----------



## Danika k

Hi guys, whats the word on the mobile audio GE 6AK5 tubes? I looked at all the threads but couldnt find an impression...


----------



## ethebull

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys, whats the word on the mobile audio GE 6AK5 tubes? I looked at all the threads but couldnt find an impression..._

 

Very similar but perhaps just shy of the GE 5-Stars performance. Good balance from top to bottom and really pure top-end with out being bright or overly forward.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Well my LD MKIV SE arrived yesterday. Only got a chance to listen to it a bit (and yes Penchum one of the disks I listened to was Signals - New World Man 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). 

 It is a bit early to tell for me as well on what my impressions are, as the tubes need burning in. But out of the box it sounded just fine. I have the gain at 50, can even go to 60 or 65, and though that starts getting too loud, there is absolute ZERO distortion with this. I don't hear any 'tube' noise either, at least, nothing worth noting (a very slight hiss).

 Build quality is solid! Everything lines up very well, the components used are to notch! I agree with the size, it is larger than the posted pictures lead to you believe.

 So far - I've listened to:

 Reg Cd's
 Live (throwing Copper)
 Rush (Signals

 SACD's
 Patricia Barber (Cafe Blue)
 Dire Straits (Brother in Arms Anniversary Edition)
 SRV (Texas Flood)

 Initial impressions are smooth, all the detail is there but I don't find any more detail then listening to it though my Yamaha receiver, but I don't feel I'm missing any either.

 As for the smoothness, Throwing Copper is the best way to describe it. I can't listen to a lot of the tracks, as it's not a very well recorded album IMO and it can get very busy and very fatiguing, especially at louder volumes. The Little Dot is no exception, except for the fact I an listen to it louder and longer than I can on my SS gear with my headphones, so I know the tubes are making a difference.

 I hope the amp doesn't fail, like others have reported. So far (2 hours roughly) so good, and since we got the last of them, IMO this will be considered a 'vintage' amp before long. 

 Oh, thanks for the tips on the Sylvannia tubes. Can these tubes be run on the factory seetings, or do you need to put the jumpers in?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well my LD MKIV SE arrived yesterday. Only got a chance to listen to it a bit (and yes Penchum one of the disks I listened to was Signals - New World Man 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). 

 It is a bit early to tell for me as well on what my impressions are, as the tubes need burning in. But out of the box it sounded just fine. I have the gain at 50, can even go to 60 or 65, and though that starts getting too loud, there is absolute ZERO distortion with this. I don't hear any 'tube' noise either, at least, nothing worth noting (a very slight hiss).

 Build quality is solid! Everything lines up very well, the components used are to notch! I agree with the size, it is larger than the posted pictures lead to you believe.

 So far - I've listened to:

 Reg Cd's
 Live (throwing Copper)
 Rush (Signals

 SACD's
 Patricia Barber (Cafe Blue)
 Dire Straits (Brother in Arms Anniversary Edition)
 SRV (Texas Flood)

 Initial impressions are smooth, all the detail is there but I don't find any more detail then listening to it though my Yamaha receiver, but I don't feel I'm missing any either.

 As for the smoothness, Throwing Copper is the best way to describe it. I can't listen to a lot of the tracks, as it's not a very well recorded album IMO and it can get very busy and very fatiguing, especially at louder volumes. The Little Dot is no exception, except for the fact I an listen to it louder and longer than I can on my SS gear with my headphones, so I know the tubes are making a difference.

 I hope the amp doesn't fail, like others have reported. So far (2 hours roughly) so good, and since we got the last of them, IMO this will be considered a 'vintage' amp before long. 

 Oh, thanks for the tips on the Sylvannia tubes. Can these tubes be run on the factory seetings, or do you need to put the jumpers in?_

 

The factory setting should be for the EF95 family, which the Sylvania's belong to, so press on! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As a side note, the amp itself has HUGE capacitors in it and will need time to mature. The NOS tubes, will need time too. I recommend sessions lasting no longer than 8 hours at a time, with a cool down to room temperature in between each session. You will find that the amp starts to change it's sound around the 55+/- hour mark. It gets so good so quick, it still amazes me each time I've matured an LD tube amp. Have fun and keep us posted as time progresses.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys, whats the word on the mobile audio GE 6AK5 tubes? I looked at all the threads but couldnt find an impression..._

 

I'm sorry, I forgot what other tubes you said you have, so I'm not sure where these would stand in your line up. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I do know that the GE Mobiles could easily become "everyday" listening tubes, because they lack nothing and cost very little. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I seem to remember they were pretty good with all types of music too. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Looks like Ethebull called it right on the nose.


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Is it normal for the LD MK IV (SE) to make a kind of "light bulb filament" noise through the headphone when everything is turned on? It only happens when I knock on the side of the unit, or the desk shakes slightly.

 The sound only comes through the right side of my headphone, btw. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm guessing that a tube on the right side is prone to vibrating, and thus sends it along to what I hear?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Occidio* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, this may be the end? I'm sure glad I picked one up while I had the chance!_

 

I agree. It was a very good option deal and will be missed. Thank goodness the MKIV standard is no slouch! This will allow others to get in on the excellent MKIV sound and they can upgrade tubes and such whenever they like.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is it normal for the LD MK IV (SE) to make a kind of "light bulb filament" noise through the headphone when everything is turned on? It only happens when I knock on the side of the unit, or the desk shakes slightly.

 The sound only comes through the right side of my headphone, btw. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm guessing that a tube on the right side is prone to vibrating, and thus sends it along to what I hear?_

 

Yes, that is pretty normal for NOS tubes. Some of that might diminish with more hours on them, and sometimes it won't. It is microphonics, but it is ok unless the tube is making the sound all by itself. I have a set of Hytrons that are so sensitive due to microphonics, I can't even touch anything on the amp or near where the amp is sitting.


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, that is pretty normal for NOS tubes. Some of that might diminish with more hours on them, and sometimes it won't. It is microphonics, but it is ok unless the tube is making the sound all by itself. I have a set of Hytrons that are so sensitive due to microphonics, I can't even touch anything on the amp or near where the amp is sitting. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Ah phew, thank you for alleviating my fears of a return. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 BTW, you have a quick PM coming your way, if you don't mind. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks for replying...I primarily use Grados, so they won't really work out for me or my ears.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah phew, thank you for alleviating my fears of a return. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 BTW, you have a quick PM coming your way, if you don't mind. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

No problem! I'm always here to help if I can.


----------



## Pierre59

Excuse-me I have made a transfer my reply int the appropritate post.


http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/rev...5/index17.html


----------



## oldson

hi
 this is one of 4 amps i am considering to buy.
 i have 40ohm cans, would the power output of the amp have good volume for these?
 cant find them on ebay so cant find price for amp and shipping to uk?
 how would it compare to a dv332?
 i have read many specs on different amps on here and elsewhere. it seems that ss amps offer greater power output to lower imp cans than tube units!
 why is this or am i missing the point?
 my cans are closed (ath-a900) and many say have a "warm" sound, as in that associated with tube amps! would i be better going with tubes or ss to compliment them?
 i have been researching now for a good couple of months, and while i have leant a lot, i dont feel any nearer to deciding on which amp to go for! (or dac for that matter! though i think it will be a keces 131)
 any input welcome.


 btw my amp shortlist is:
 SS LDmkv or GS solo intro
 tube LDmk 4se or DV332


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oldson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hi
 this is one of 4 amps i am considering to buy.
 i have 40ohm cans, would the power output of the amp have good volume for these?
 cant find them on ebay so cant find price for amp and shipping to uk?
 how would it compare to a dv332?
 i have read many specs on different amps on here and elsewhere. it seems that ss amps offer greater power output to lower imp cans than tube units!
 why is this or am i missing the point?
 my cans are closed (ath-a900) and many say have a "warm" sound, as in that associated with tube amps! would i be better going with tubes or ss to compliment them?
 i have been researching now for a good couple of months, and while i have leant a lot, i dont feel any nearer to deciding on which amp to go for! (or dac for that matter! though i think it will be a keces 131)
 any input welcome.


 btw my amp shortlist is:
 SS LDmkv or GS solo intro
 tube LDmk 4se or DV332_

 

Thats a pretty good short list. Here is something that might help a little. With an SS amp, you are pretty much locked into how your source sounds. If you have a good source, the SS amps will do their thing with very little changes to the sound. Tube amps are only locked into which tubes you have installed. They are much more forgiving when it comes to the sound of your source. You can change tube sets and make a completely different sound output. This is a very attractive "variable" to have at your command. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 All Little-Dot tube amps have variable gain adjustments, so there will be plenty of output for your phones. The MKII, MKIII and MKIV all share the same tube family usage (EF95 & EF92), and this is a plus in many ways. Postings by users who find a new tube set and like it, will most likely give you similar results on any of the three models of tube amps. This makes tube rolling a community affair and has helped hundreds of users save money on tube rolling.

 The MKV dual mono SS amp is an amazing headphone amp. It does require a good clean source (most quality SS amps do) in order to appreciate it's finer points. It is a steal at it's price point, and hard to dismiss. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Those who have one consider it to be one of the best SS headphone amp they have ever had. It is super clean, quiet and dynamic with all types of music. It works well with almost all headphones and doesn't seem to have any issues with more or less demanding headphones.

 Avoid the "equipment for a specific headphone" trap if you can. You will be saving yourself from a bunch of grief. In your situation, I don't think you could go wrong with either the MKIV or the MKV. Maybe you could get one now, and the other later? I have both and can't imagine selling either one. They both bring a different presentation to my music and I like both presentations very much.


----------



## oldson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thats a pretty good short list. Here is something that might help a little. With an SS amp, you are pretty much locked into how your source sounds. If you have a good source, the SS amps will do their thing with very little changes to the sound. Tube amps are only locked into which tubes you have installed. They are much more forgiving when it comes to the sound of your source. You can change tube sets and make a completely different sound output. This is a very attractive "variable" to have at your command. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 All Little-Dot tube amps have variable gain adjustments, so there will be plenty of output for your phones. The MKII, MKIII and MKIV all share the same tube family usage (EF95 & EF92), and this is a plus in many ways. Postings by users who find a new tube set and like it, will most likely give you similar results on any of the three models of tube amps. This makes tube rolling a community affair and has helped hundreds of users save money on tube rolling.

 The MKV dual mono SS amp is an amazing headphone amp. It does require a good clean source (most quality SS amps do) in order to appreciate it's finer points. It is a steal at it's price point, and hard to dismiss. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Those who have one consider it to be one of the best SS headphone amp they have ever had. It is super clean, quiet and dynamic with all types of music. It works well with almost all headphones and doesn't seem to have any issues with more or less demanding headphones.

 Avoid the "equipment for a specific headphone" trap if you can. You will be saving yourself from a bunch of grief. In your situation, I don't think you could go wrong with either the MKIV or the MKV. Maybe you could get one now, and the other later? I have both and can't imagine selling either one. They both bring a different presentation to my music and I like both presentations very much. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Penchum
 thanks for the advice.
 after reading your reviews i am set on something from the LD family!
 i still have a shortlist of, mk3 , 4se and mk5.
 i will be using pc as source only initially. then later adding a dac (keces 131 or zero). 
 my pc has onboard sound(ac97) . this has optical output. when i come to add a dac would i be wise to add a better sound card also, ie prelude?

 i assume from your reviews my mp3 collection (all 320kb) would be a bit naff for the mk5?
 so as i see it i have 2 options.
 re-rip my collection to lossless for the mk5, or buy the mk4se!
 trouble is the mk4's seem scarce at the moment!?!?
 wish i could buy both, but no chance.
 thanks again
 simon


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oldson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Penchum
 thanks for the advice.
 after reading your reviews i am set on something from the LD family!
 i still have a shortlist of, mk3 , 4se and mk5.
 i will be using pc as source only initially. then later adding a dac (keces 131 or zero). 
 my pc has onboard sound(ac97) . this has optical output. when i come to add a dac would i be wise to add a better sound card also, ie prelude?

 i assume from your reviews my mp3 collection (all 320kb) would be a bit naff for the mk5?
 so as i see it i have 2 options.
 re-rip my collection to lossless for the mk5, or buy the mk4se!
 trouble is the mk4's seem scarce at the moment!?!?
 wish i could buy both, but no chance.
 thanks again
 simon_

 

Well, you have a good point about the lossless vs 320s. With the MKV, you would notice a big difference between the two. I have this same problem. I haven't had time to re-rip my collection either. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But, now that I have both the MKV and MKIVse, I know that investing the time to re-rip them will not be a waste. I think you would draw the same conclusion whether you had the MKV or MKIV. The MKIV is going to be more forgiving if you do play some 320s to get you by, until all of them have been re-ripped. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 On the MKIVse, it looks like the "se" option is all done. You could email DavidZ and ask him for sure on this, but others have posted about the end of the "se".

 The MKIV is an excellent amp and it is compatible (driver tube wise) with the MKII and MKIII. It is also an OTL designed amp like the MKIVse was, so you don't really loose anything SQ wise. It doesn't have the same stock tubes the MKIVse had, but most users plan on buying better tubes anyway, so this isn't really a bad thing.


----------



## Hopstretch

Hey all. I've been loving my MKIVse for the last month, but today all is not well with the little guy. Sudden large decrease in volume across the board -- turning up the pot doesn't help, just starts to grossly distort the sound.

 This is my first ever tube component, so I'm clueless here. All the tubes still light, but I'm guessing one is going bad? How do I tell which? I have the EHs and Mullards. 

 Glum.


----------



## verbaan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oldson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Penchum
 thanks for the advice.
 after reading your reviews i am set on something from the LD family!
 i still have a shortlist of, mk3 , 4se and mk5.
 i will be using pc as source only initially. then later adding a dac (keces 131 or zero). 
 my pc has onboard sound(ac97) . this has optical output. when i come to add a dac would i be wise to add a better sound card also, ie prelude?

 i assume from your reviews my mp3 collection (all 320kb) would be a bit naff for the mk5?
 so as i see it i have 2 options.
 re-rip my collection to lossless for the mk5, or buy the mk4se!
 trouble is the mk4's seem scarce at the moment!?!?
 wish i could buy both, but no chance.
 thanks again
 simon_

 

Be sure to order LME49710 opamps with your KECES. You're in for a treat. Really amazing.  BTW I have the LDMKIII and K601. With the KECES a very good combination indeed.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey all. I've been loving my MKIVse for the last month, but today all is not well with the little guy. Sudden large decrease in volume across the board -- turning up the pot doesn't help, just starts to grossly distort the sound.

 This is my first ever tube component, so I'm clueless here. All the tubes still light, but I'm guessing one is going bad? How do I tell which? I have the EHs and Mullards. 

 Glum. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

If it was in one channel, I would suspect that channels EH power tube. But, if it's both channels, you should email DavidZ with complete details and see what he says. It could be a number of different things if both channels are involved.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If it was in one channel, I would suspect that channels EH power tube. But, if it's both channels, you should email DavidZ with complete details and see what he says. It could be a number of different things if both channels are involved._

 

Thanks. Will do. It is affecting both channels equally.

 Should add that up until now I've really enjoyed the amp and think it's a great little piece for the money. Hope to have it back up to 100% soon.


----------



## tjumper78

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey all. I've been loving my MKIVse for the last month, but today all is not well with the little guy. Sudden large decrease in volume across the board -- turning up the pot doesn't help, just starts to grossly distort the sound.

 This is my first ever tube component, so I'm clueless here. All the tubes still light, but I'm guessing one is going bad? How do I tell which? I have the EHs and Mullards. 

 Glum. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

uh oh, thats almost what happened to my mk iv se. that symptom lasted for about about a minute than it completely died.
 glum indeed....
 but david said he was shipping out a replacement to me this week so i have something to look forward to. =)


----------



## dan_can

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey all. I've been loving my MKIVse for the last month, but today all is not well with the little guy. Sudden large decrease in volume across the board -- turning up the pot doesn't help, just starts to grossly distort the sound.

 This is my first ever tube component, so I'm clueless here. All the tubes still light, but I'm guessing one is going bad? How do I tell which? I have the EHs and Mullards. 

 Glum. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Unfortunately it was what happened to me two days ago. Check the running temperature of the amp, in my case, it's completely cold. It was running hot before. I'm going to send it back to David. Seem like some components used are defective. Great amp, but...


----------



## Hopstretch

Bummer for all concerned. Perhaps a parts issue if it's only the Special Editions that are going belly up? Anyway, credit to Little Dot for responding to my email immediately (on a Sunday) and for their "don't worry, we'll sort you out" stance.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Bummer for all concerned. Perhaps a parts issue if it's only the Special Editions that are going belly up? Anyway, credit to Little Dot for responding to my email immediately (on a Sunday) and for their "don't worry, we'll sort you out" stance._

 

I imagine it is difficult on them as well. They QC and bench test each unit, then find out later that a transformer or something had a bad batch. I just hope it is isolated to just a few MKIVse's (which seems to be the case). I know DavidZ will take care of each one quickly.


----------



## dan_can

Wow, just checked out the postage, it's going to cost me $33 bucks to send the amp to Ohio from BC, Canada. I'm listening to List III now, already missing my Little Dot. It's not List III is bad, I just love tubes. It's going to be at least four weeks before I get it back. A long and painful wait is ahead.


----------



## ham069

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, just checked out the postage, it's going to cost me $33 bucks to send the amp to Ohio from BC, Canada. I'm listening to List III now, already missing my Little Dot. It's not List III is bad, I just love tubes. It's going to be at least four weeks before I get it back. A long and painful wait is ahead._

 

Are you talking Ohio in the states? I had to send mine to china and Canada post messed up and sent it by ground so its been gone for like 2 weeks and it still hasent left canada according to my tracking number. 

 going to have to call Canada post and find out what is going on with it because I kind of want them to just send it back to me and refund most of the 90 dollars I spend shipping it so I can send it UPS air or something. I can't even listen to my 595s after hearing them on the MKIV and my 650s are on order so they will come in soon.

 David has been awsome but canada post is making me angry.

 The Ham


----------



## dan_can

Yes, I sent it to David in Ohio this morning.


----------



## tjumper78

wait... so why are people sending the defective items to ohio?
 arent these products from china?
 does david have an office or something in ohio?


----------



## dan_can

I just followed instructions by David.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just followed instructions by David._

 

Ditto. Was asked to return to Ohio address and would rather do that than ship to China! We'll see what the next step is.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_wait... so why are people sending the defective items to ohio?
 arent these products from china?
 does david have an office or something in ohio?_

 

My bet is he has a 'repair' depot in Ohio. Or, at least, someone he knows whom he trusts to repair any 'defective' units without having to ship it back to China. 

 They are originally made in China though, and I belive that that is where David is. So far so good for me, I have about 5 hours on mine so far with no ill affects. I hope it lasts... though not too worried with the two year warranty and David's quick response to bad units, it shouldn't be a problem. 

 It does concern me though that this latest batch is defective. Obviously, there is something bad in there that they call got. 

 I'm hoping that whatever it is you guys will post it once and if you find out. If for some reason I do have something weird go on with my unit I'll post about it right away.


----------



## ham069

Mine was working fine but I started smelling burning electronics after it was on for like 10 minutes. mine is just the standard MKIV which may be why he is having me send it all the way to him. the shipping is far more expensive though so it is a little strange.

 The Ham


----------



## Penchum

Good new about the volume dropping issue! Here is a link to the official message from DavidZ: Viewing a thread - Little Dot MK IV SE Owners: Volume drop issues

 And here is the text of the message:

 "It's come to our attention that several Little Dot MK IV SE owners have experienced the volume either gradually getting lower or just an immediate drop in volume levels. The issue appears to be caused by a resistor degrading. It seems the issue occurs mostly in recent Little Dot MK IV SEs and to a lesser extent, normal MK IV models.

 Any Little Dot MK IV and SE users experiencing this problem are encouraged to contact us at little.tube@gmail.com to have their Little Dots replaced with new a new one. Depending on the status of your warranty and where we ask you to ship to, your return shipping may also be reimbursed. Thank you for the attention, and we apologize for the inconvenience.

 Other Little Dot tube amplifier models (i.e. MK 2, MK 3, etc) are not affected by this issue."

 These guys are so great!


----------



## Hopstretch

They have certainly handled the issue with class so far.

 Do wonder how they'll be able to replace affected SEs if they don't currently have the parts to build new ones? Hopefully they still have a few in reserve.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They have certainly handled the issue with class so far.

 Do wonder how they'll be able to replace affected SEs if they don't currently have the parts to build new ones? Hopefully they still have a few in reserve._

 

I would imagine the resistor in question is not one of the back-ordered parts. I'm trying to find out which specific resistor has the issue, so I can peak at mine. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have tons of hours on mine, so I don't think it has a resistor from the bad batch of resistors.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would imagine the resistor in question is not one of the back-ordered parts. I'm trying to find out which specific resistor has the issue, so I can peak at mine. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I have tons of hours on mine, so I don't think it has a resistor from the bad batch of resistors. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hope that's the case. Though David appears to indicate in the post you quoted and elsewhere that they might be swapping out entire units. Personally I don't care, unless there's a much longer turnaround time one way or the other.

 Will just use the hiatus to make up some o' them newfangled BullPlugs.


----------



## ham069

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would imagine the resistor in question is not one of the back-ordered parts. I'm trying to find out which specific resistor has the issue, so I can peak at mine. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have tons of hours on mine, so I don't think it has a resistor from the bad batch of resistors. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Two of the resistors on the back of mine were burning out so it may well be the same ones causing the issues. When I get to work I will see about posting pictures of them if I didnt delete them.

 The Ham


----------



## tcp56

Tjumper, Sent my SE to David Pang in Ohio. DavidZ in China? All I know is I want my new amp.


----------



## Olev

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ham069* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Two of the resistors on the back of mine were burning out so it may well be the same ones causing the issues._

 

Those look like ordinary resistors, my MK IV SE has brown high quality resistors back there - like the ones you can see on the manufacturers page.


----------



## TheMarchingMule

*@ham069's picture:* Huh...I never really peeked into my LD MK IV SE, but I never expected it to look so...empty!


----------



## ham069

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Olev* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Those look like ordinary resistors, my MK IV SE has brown high quality resistors back there - like the ones you can see on the manufacturers page._

 

two of the three are burning out, all three are ment to be blue instead of only the one on the left. When I get back to work from my days off I can zoom in on the area to give you a better idea of what is going on.

 Called Canada post yesterday and I am told that my Amp is finaly on a ship heading out of the country. God only knows where its going to go from there
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The Ham


----------



## Danika k

How much do the 6H30Pi from electro harmonix usually go for?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*@ham069's picture:* Huh...I never really peeked into my LD MK IV SE, but I never expected it to look so...empty! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You are only seeing the very rear of the mainboard. There is much more forward of that.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How much do the 6H30Pi from electro harmonix usually go for?_

 

Unmatched are $17-$28 each. Matched will be a little higher.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Danika k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How much do the 6H30Pi from electro harmonix usually go for?_

 

$60 for a matched pair is about right.


----------



## Hopstretch

David reached out today to let me know they got my returned amp and were just testing the replacement before shipping it out. He said Little Dot keeps a stock of new units in reserve specifically in case of warranty issues like this and will be drawing from that pool to take care of those of us affected by resistor failures.

 This more or less confirmed my initial impressions that 1) LD is a pretty well-run outfit and 2) it's much more pleasant as a consumer to deal with the focused, hungry little guys than the complacent giants like, say, Sony -- who I've futilely butted heads with in the past on warranty claims.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_David reached out today to let me know they got my returned amp and were just testing the replacement before shipping it out. He said Little Dot keeps a stock of new units in reserve specifically in case of warranty issues like this and will be drawing from that pool to take care of those of us affected by resistor failures.

 This more or less confirmed my initial impressions that 1) LD is a pretty well-run outfit and 2) it's much more pleasant as a consumer to deal with the focused, hungry little guys than the complacent giants like, say, Sony -- who I've futilely butted heads with in the past on warranty claims._

 

Man! Isn't that the truth!


----------



## Hopstretch

Anyway, back onto the topic of using and enjoying the amp. I've just picked up a pair of HD650s, assume I'll want both the dips off on the MKIV for max gain?

 PS: Penchum, in general do you prefer your MkIV or MKV with the Senns?


----------



## tjumper78

it was not for long but hd650 sounded amazing when it was powered by mk iv se. i cant wait till i get the replacement on my desk again.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyway, back onto the topic of using and enjoying the amp. I've just picked up a pair of HD650s, assume I'll want both the dips off on the MKIV for max gain?

 PS: Penchum, in general do you prefer your MkIV or MKV with the Senns?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it was not for long but hd650 sounded amazing when it was powered by mk iv se. i cant wait till i get the replacement on my desk again._

 

Oddly enough, I like the HD-650 with my MKIVse and my HD-600 with the MKV. Even with this preference, I still use the HD-650s with the MKV late at night. Ow, and the dip switch settings for the HD-650 should be at gain 5 or 10. I leave all my amps at 10, so they behave like each other.


----------



## Hopstretch

Warranty replacements are shipping out now. Well done Little Tube!


----------



## Penchum

That is excellent news! I did get confirmation from DavidZ that it is the first row of resistors you see, looking from the back. Also, it was only the last few that were shipped out since the parts backorder happened. This should only be a few owners.


----------



## tjumper78

the replacement amp arrived in the u.s. this morning!!!
 the weird things is...
 my original amp flew straight to j.f.k airport and got delivered to me on the same day.
 this time, the amp has been sitting at san francisco customs since this morning.
 arghhhhhh


----------



## dan_can

Lucky you. My replacement unit is in testing stage.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lucky you. My replacement unit is in testing stage._

 

Shouldn't be long. Mine was on its way within three days after that. Hold fast!


----------



## TylerEaves

To add a new datapoint:

 MKIVse works well with D2000!

 (Note: D2K is only 26Ohm impedance, so actually slightly outside of rated range). 

 Got my D2000 today. Compared to some other sources I have lying around (e.g. headphone jack on my H/T receiver), the MKIVse not only drives the D2K well (no hint of hum or hiss at high volume with no signal), but they cure the massive bass bloat the D2K is (in)famous for. They're still bassy phones, but at a GOOD level, rather than massivly bloated and veiled.

 Listening to "Soul Intro / The Chicken" off the Jaco Pastorius Birthday album right now, and it's wonderful. Jaco's bass is deep and punchy, and the horns have great texture. Soundstage is decent, not on-par with my K701, but it's not "in your head" bad or anything. Can't wait to see how this combo matures. Only have about 3 hours on the phones, and I've heard good things happen around the 100-150 mark.


----------



## Hopstretch

Got my replacement today! Appears brand, spanking new, as promised. Came with the EH power tubes but CV4010 drivers, rather than the standard 8100s.

 Anyway, I've been A/Bing against the Duet amp for about a half hour and there's not a doubt in my mind that the SE adds far more than just warmth/coloration. On the Senns, there's considerably more weight and presence to the music. Vocals, particularly, jump out of the mix, where before I thought they were very recessed on the 650s. I am a happy camper. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Please don't leave me again, Little Dot!


----------



## tjumper78

ohhhh nice~!
 mine arrived at my local post office at 10am this morning. i am praying that it'll be waiting for me when i get home after work.
 *fingers crossed*


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my replacement today! Appears brand, spanking new, as promised. Came with the EH power tubes but CV4010 drivers, rather than the standard 8100s.

 Anyway, I've been A/Bing against the Duet amp for about a half hour and there's not a doubt in my mind that the SE adds far more than just warmth/coloration. On the Senns, there's considerably more weight and presence to the music. Vocals, particularly, jump out of the mix, where before I thought they were very recessed on the 650s. I am a happy camper. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Please don't leave me again, Little Dot!_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ohhhh nice~!
 mine arrived at my local post office at 10am this morning. i am praying that it'll be waiting for me when i get home after work.
 *fingers crossed*_

 

Man, that is excellent news! Hang in there you guys, a nice "maturing" and you'll be in headphone heaven.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my replacement today! Appears brand, spanking new, as promised. Came with the EH power tubes but CV4010 drivers, rather than the standard 8100s._

 

That's strange, do the driver tubes have the Mullard logo on them? 

 - DoA


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's strange, do the driver tubes have the Mullard logo on them?_

 

No names. No logo. Just the designation KODD/K 34-C. Quick Google suggests they are Mullards, though.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No names. No logo. Just the designation KODD/K 34-C. Quick Google suggests they are Mullards, though._

 

Sometimes, the export tubes from Mullard didn't have the logo on them. I have a couple of Mullards from South America, that only have the numbers on them.


----------



## tjumper78

got the replacement amp.
 the person who prepared the package only wrote down the city, state, and zip code. no street address -.,- the post office called me and i had to ask my wife to pick it up. 
 took out the amp out of the box. it does not look new. =( marks and dust around the unit. =( maybe they got on the amp while the qc.
 no biggies but i still emailed david and complained a little bit. i hope he understands and addresses the problems for the future customers.
 the new amp sounds fine... so far.. it's been playing for about 30 minutes. i'm gonna have to keep playing it to make sure it doesnt die after 5 hours like the last one. i'm not really worried b/c david assured me that there wouldnt any problems with the replacement.
 now... i gotta figure out whether i want to keep or sell my gilmore lite. =)


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_got the replacement amp.
 the person who prepared the package only wrote down the city, state, and zip code. no street address -.,- the post office called me and i had to ask my wife to pick it up. 
 took out the amp out of the box. it does not look new. =( marks and dust around the unit. =( maybe they got on the amp while the qc.
 no biggies but i still emailed david and complained a little bit. i hope he understands and addresses the problems for the future customers.
 the new amp sounds fine... so far.. it's been playing for about 30 minutes. i'm gonna have to keep playing it to make sure it doesnt die after 5 hours like the last one. i'm not really worried b/c david assured me that there wouldnt any problems with the replacement.
 now... i gotta figure out whether i want to keep or sell my gilmore lite. =)_

 

Sounds like someone forgot to give 'er a bath before boxing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Glad to hear you have it in hand. Now you can get on with burn-in and tube rolling later. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You're lucky your wife didn't decide to keep it for herself!


----------



## tjumper78

alrighty!!!!!
 about 4 hours of music playing, and everything seems to be ok.
 and i got an email back from david. a prompt reply as usual.
 david offered two things that i didnt even expect.
 1. he told me to keep the m8100 driver tubes from the original unit. 
 2. he said he'd reimburse the shipping cost when i send the defective unit back to him.

 AMAZING!!!

 so now...... you guys need to help a newbie out.
 this is my first tube amp and i have 0 knowledge on tubes.
 1. the smaller tubes are driver tubes. correct?
 2. do i need to remove the gold plate thingy before i do anything? 3. is there any other things that i need to do before i remove or place the tubes?
 4. how do i remove and place tubes into the amp? do i pull them out? 
 help! i am scared to do anything!!
 =( =)
 thank you!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_alrighty!!!!!
 about 4 hours of music playing, and everything seems to be ok.
 and i got an email back from david. a prompt reply as usual.
 david offered two things that i didnt even expect.
 1. he told me to keep the m8100 driver tubes from the original unit. 
 2. he said he'd reimburse the shipping cost when i send the defective unit back to him.

 AMAZING!!!

 so now...... you guys need to help a newbie out.
 this is my first tube amp and i have 0 knowledge on tubes.
 1. the smaller tubes are driver tubes. correct?
 2. do i need to remove the gold plate thingy before i do anything? 3. is there any other things that i need to do before i remove or place the tubes?
 4. how do i remove and place tubes into the amp? do i pull them out? 
 help! i am scared to do anything!!
 =( =)
 thank you!_

 

David is SO good to his customers! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 1. Small front tubes are driver tubes.
 2. I remove the two screws and lift the plate up. I just makes tube changing easier. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 3. Read the owner's manual. It details what to do if you change driver tube families from EF95's to EF92's.
 4. Pull straight up slowly, with slightest of wiggles. After a few, you'll have it down to a science. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Plug in and enjoy!!


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my replacement today! Appears brand, spanking new, as promised. Came with the EH power tubes but CV4010 drivers, rather than the standard 8100s.
_

 

I'm new to this tube thing, so please bear with me. However, I checked my LD and I also have the same designation on the driver tubes. AFAIK, that is the Mullard 8100 tube, it just doesn't have the Mullard stamp for some reason. 

 Here is a webpage I found with pic's after a simple google search:

CV4010 / 6096 / M8100

 Penchum, did I nail this one, or do I have no idea as to what I'm talking about yet?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm new to this tube thing, so please bear with me. However, I checked my LD and I also have the same designation on the driver tubes. AFAIK, that is the Mullard 8100 tube, it just doesn't have the Mullard stamp for some reason. 

 Here is a webpage I found with pic's after a simple google search:

CV4010 / 6096 / M8100

 Penchum, did I nail this one, or do I have no idea as to what I'm talking about yet? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You nailed it Kpt! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Two types of "no shield" tubes I know about so far. One is an "OEM" version, where they ship out box loads to specific buyers under contract, the other is export models to certain parts of the world. I have no idea why (cost savings maybe), but they should perform like the original shielded ones.


----------



## tcp56

My Replacement amp (or is it refurbished?) Is in town also. I'll pick it up at the P.O. in the am. Am curious if it is my old amp with the same tubes or a different one. 

 tjumper, looks like the Gilmore is going.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Replacement amp (or is it refurbished?) Is in town also. I'll pick it up at the P.O. in the am. Am curious if it is my old amp with the same tubes or a different one. 

 tjumper, looks like the Gilmore is going._

 

Where did it get sent too? Ohio or China? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Sounds silly doesn't it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Never mind, I found your post. I think the ones that went to Ohio, are getting their original amp back.
 Someone correct me if I'm mistaken. Thanks!


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm new to this tube thing, so please bear with me. However, I checked my LD and I also have the same designation on the driver tubes. AFAIK, that is the Mullard 8100 tube, it just doesn't have the Mullard stamp for some reason. 

 Here is a webpage I found with pic's after a simple google search:

CV4010 / 6096 / M8100

 Penchum, did I nail this one, or do I have no idea as to what I'm talking about yet? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The CV4010 and the M8100 are the same tube and have a distinct design compared to other EF95 tubes. Generally speaking the ones manufactured in Mullar'ds facilities in England have the Mullard logo stamped on, there are many other CV4010/M8100 tubes made in other facilities in other parts of the world (like some of the cheaper ones on sale now on ebay) and those to the best of my knowledge do not have the stamped logo and don't sound as good as those made in England.


----------



## Hopstretch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Never mind, I found your post. I think the ones that went to Ohio, are getting their original amp back.
 Someone correct me if I'm mistaken. Thanks!_

 

Mine went to Ohio and I got a new one. My impression is, based on conversations with David, that _all_ the replacement units are new and are drawn from a separate stock maintained against warranty returns.

 Whatever the case, Little Tube's warranty policies are a lot more friendly than most, particularly their extension of coverage to subsequent owners. I bought mine used from another Head-Fier but was treated exactly the same as if I'd got it new from David.

 Thanks for the details on the CV4010. I'm very happy with the sound right now, but will probably roll a few others some time for fun. If I was looking for anything, it would be just a little more bass control -- any likely candidates?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hopstretch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Mine went to Ohio and I got a new one. My impression is, based on conversations with David, that all the replacement units are new and are drawn from a separate stock maintained against warranty returns.

 Whatever the case, Little Tube's warranty policies are a lot more friendly than most, particularly their extension of coverage to subsequent owners. I bought mine used from another Head-Fier but was treated exactly the same as if I'd got it new from David.

 Thanks for the details on the CV4010. I'm very happy with the sound right now, but will probably roll a few others some time for fun. If I was looking for anything, it would be just a little more bass control -- any likely candidates?_

 

As your new MKIV matures, the bass will become tighter and more controlled with the stock tubes. Say, 100hrs worth total. With mine, there were big changes around the 50-75 hours mark. I'll draw up a short list of tubes and post it to you after while. Gotta find that coffee!


----------



## Hopstretch

Thanks. I'll be giving it some serious burn-in this week.

 As an aside, this morning I got around to hooking up the LD as a preamp in my desktop speaker system, too, with excellent results. It now lets me feed my Audioengine A2s from the Duet rather than straight out of the Mac, which together with the tube buffer makes a very notable and pleasant difference.

 Just a terrific piece of kit and a flat-out steal for what I paid for it.


----------



## tjumper78

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Replacement amp (or is it refurbished?) Is in town also. I'll pick it up at the P.O. in the am. Am curious if it is my old amp with the same tubes or a different one. 

 tjumper, looks like the Gilmore is going._

 

Yep, it's going for real this time. Last time I put it up for sale, I got cold feet and withdrew. Good thing because the first LDMKIVSE was defective and I would've been left without a desktop amp for 2 weeks. 
 LDMKIVSE is giving me the sound that I always wanted, and it's just right out of the box. Compared to LDMKIVSE, there is just something that Gilmore Lite is missing. Plus wifey is trying to kill me just because I have two desktop amps now. What the heck!?
 I think I will be getting a Pico and use it as DAC + preamp that feeds into my Little-Dot via mini-to-RCA cable.

 Btw, how long are the tubes supposed to last in LD amps? I hope I won't have to switch them to new ones every few months.


----------



## tcp56

tjumper78;4095675 said:
			
		

> Yep, it's going for real this time. Last time I put it up for sale, I got cold feet and withdrew. Good thing because the first LDMKIVSE was defective and I would've been left without a desktop amp for 2 weeks.
> LDMKIVSE is giving me the sound that I always wanted, and it's just right out of the box. Compared to LDMKIVSE, there is just something that Gilmore Lite is missing. Plus wifey is trying to kill me just because I have two desktop amps now. What the heck !
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yep, it's going for real this time. Last time I put it up for sale, I got cold feet and withdrew. Good thing because the first LDMKIVSE was defective and I would've been left without a desktop amp for 2 weeks. 
 LDMKIVSE is giving me the sound that I always wanted, and it's just right out of the box. Compared to LDMKIVSE, there is just something that Gilmore Lite is missing. Plus wifey is trying to kill me just because I have two desktop amps now. What the heck!?
 I think I will be getting a Pico and use it as DAC + preamp that feeds into my Little-Dot via mini-to-RCA cable.

 Btw, how long are the tubes supposed to last in LD amps? I hope I won't have to switch them to new ones every few months._

 

When I asked David that question, he said that they should last a few years at least (3000 hours or so). The power tubes would give out first if/when they do. Here's his exact quote (not sure where "I" got the 3000 hours, I thought it was from his email to me but I must have read it in a thread somewhere):

_Generally speaking the tubes likely won't need to be replaced all at once. After a couple of years, you'll begin to hear cut-outs and random noises signaling one or more of the tubes need to be replaced. Likely the power tubes will require replacement first. It's no harm to your Little Dot unless you try to run a burnt out tube extensively for long periods of time after it goes out, but it should be fairly obvious well before you get to that point_


----------



## Penchum

tcp56;4095731 said:
			
		

> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The CV4010 and the M8100 are the same tube and have a distinct design compared to other EF95 tubes. Generally speaking the ones manufactured in Mullar'ds facilities in England have the Mullard logo stamped on, there are many other CV4010/M8100 tubes made in other facilities in other parts of the world (like some of the cheaper ones on sale now on ebay) and those to the best of my knowledge do not have the stamped logo and don't sound as good as those made in England._

 

What makes them different? Have you A/B's the two tubes directly blind and noticed the difference with the same amp? 

 And what particularly is the sonic difference you find between the two type? 

 I ask as my LD MKIV SE is performing very nicely right now, and I'm quite happy with the sound, but I have nothing to compare it to as this is my first and only Headphone amp. I'm currently trying to find time to audition a TNS amp locally but haven't been able to find the time yet as my work is keeping me extremely busy. 

 Thanks


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What makes them different? Have you A/B's the two tubes directly blind and noticed the difference with the same amp? 

 And what particularly is the sonic difference you find between the two type? 

 I ask as my LD MKIV SE is performing very nicely right now, and I'm quite happy with the sound, but I have nothing to compare it to as this is my first and only Headphone amp. I'm currently trying to find time to audition a TNS amp locally but haven't been able to find the time yet as my work is keeping me extremely busy. 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I have seen this oddity with the M8161 (EF92) Mullards before. The none shield wasn't quite as "lush" as the shielded one made in England. I could never find a proven explanation for this, but the differences were not very big, so I kept them anyway. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I run them in my old LDII++ headphone amp and the shielded version in my MKIVse from time to time. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Speculation was that quality control played a part in this. With that in mind, I can say for sure that every Mullard I have purchased, that has a shield, has been great sounding and long lasting. Many feel this makes the higher priced shielded version well worth the cost.


----------



## tjumper78

tcp56;4095731 said:
			
		

> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## Hopstretch

Tjumper crazy like fox!


----------



## tcp56

Picked up my replacement amp this a.m. It appears new, and has the cv4010 driver tubes. can't make out the markings on the power tubes I'll have to pull one out. sounds better than my first one ever did .not sure if those resistors were in the signal path or not.

 have used HD-600 and some D-5000s that I did a partial Markl mod to. I was never really satisifed with the D-5000Ms and the original amp. thin bass and alot of harsh highs. with the little listening I've done, they now sound right, smooth tight bass that I was after with the mod. and the high end has smoothed out also. and that is just out of the box. I'm running it in at about 6hrs at a time.still kind of paranoid. can't wait to explore some new tubes.


----------



## tjumper78

i really love my dt990 250ohm (2005 model). however, sometimes its treble and highs were just too harsh. 
 when driven by mkivse, dt990's harsh highs have calmed down a lot without losing any details.
 i love my new amp!!!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tcp56* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Picked up my replacement amp this a.m. It appears new, and has the cv4010 driver tubes. can't make out the markings on the power tubes I'll have to pull one out. sounds better than my first one ever did .not sure if those resistors were in the signal path or not.

 have used HD-600 and some D-5000s that I did a partial Markl mod to. I was never really satisifed with the D-5000Ms and the original amp. thin bass and alot of harsh highs. with the little listening I've done, they now sound right, smooth tight bass that I was after with the mod. and the high end has smoothed out also. and that is just out of the box. I'm running it in at about 6hrs at a time.still kind of paranoid. can't wait to explore some new tubes._

 

Doing 6 hour sessions is a good idea. The max anyone should do is 8 hour sessions, with a complete cool down to room temperature between each one. It goes much faster than you think. While mine as maturing, I decided to rip some additional albums to my PC. That project seems like it will never be complete! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hang in there and let us know how things go!


----------



## tjumper78

last night, i swapped the power tubes to see if they were indeed the problem with the original unit. it turned out that the power tubes were fine. it was actually the amp that had a problem.
 david told me to remove power tubes and driver tubes, and KEEP them both!!
 now i have an extra complete set of tubes for reserve.
 heheheheheheheheehe i love this company.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_last night, i swapped the power tubes to see if they were indeed the problem with the original unit. it turned out that the power tubes were fine. it was actually the amp that had a problem.
 david told me to remove power tubes and driver tubes, and KEEP them both!!
 now i have an extra complete set of tubes for reserve.
 heheheheheheheheehe i love this company._

 

They are great, for sure! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 There was some speculation that dirty pins played a small role in the resistor burn-out. I guess it wouldn't hurt to clean them up good before using them. I use Deoxit 5 to clean mine, then treat them with Deoxit Gold. Any tuner/electronics cleaner should get them clean though.


----------



## tcp56

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_last night, i swapped the power tubes to see if they were indeed the problem with the original unit. it turned out that the power tubes were fine. it was actually the amp that had a problem.
 david told me to remove power tubes and driver tubes, and KEEP them both!!
 now i have an extra complete set of tubes for reserve.
 heheheheheheheheehe i love this company._

 

I should have asked to keep my tubes before sending it back.


----------



## tjumper78

i didnt ask. david just offered them.

 is anyone here concerned about using LD tube amps in the summer?
 my mk iv se gets pretty hot. my room is not really refrigerated in the summer, and i am worried about this treasure exploding in heat or something. maybe i shouldnt even use it during the summer.


----------



## tcp56

I'm not concerned about it I doubt that that would make much of a difference. Maybe if you left it out in the sun......


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i didnt ask. david just offered them.

 is anyone here concerned about using LD tube amps in the summer?
 my mk iv se gets pretty hot. my room is not really refrigerated in the summer, and i am worried about this treasure exploding in heat or something. maybe i shouldnt even use it during the summer._

 

During the summer, if heat still concerns you, just get one of those cheap small desktop fans and point it in the amps general direction. They are made to run hot, so even a weak flow of air will keep them cooler.


----------



## ham069

WOOT, canada post finaly shows that the amp left canada, only took them a month. David should be getting it in the next few days me thinks, too bad im moving right away here so im not even sure which addy I should get him to send it to
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The Ham


----------



## tcp56

Just make it difficult, Live in canada and start moving around...aye


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i didnt ask. david just offered them.

 is anyone here concerned about using LD tube amps in the summer?
 my mk iv se gets pretty hot. my room is not really refrigerated in the summer, and i am worried about this treasure exploding in heat or something. maybe i shouldnt even use it during the summer._

 

I wouldn't worry about it, as it runs hot anyway. It it couldnt' handle the heat, it wouldn't last no matter what, as a hot room to you or me wouldn't necessarily be 'hot' to that amp. Penchum is right about the fan, but I wouldn't worry about the amp, I'd have the fan blowing on me


----------



## vvanrij

Great amp for arizona, about june.


----------



## oldson

would really like one of these "se" amps but it dont look like they will be available again
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 is it much of a compromise in going for a standard mk4?
 (1st tube amp!)
 thanks


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Great amp for arizona, about june._

 












 Ya, guess who has central air conditioning! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It is so ridiculous here. We've already had the "air" on each day for a month. You are right, June is pretty crispy, but the worst is usually mid July thru August. I usually switch to my notebook computer and solid state amps for less heat.


----------



## tjumper78

been enjoying this beast, and extremely happy. gilmore lite is gone.
 i just want to add one more thing.
 little-dot's customer service is just amazing.
 david asked me to let him know how much the shipping came out to be after i shipped the defective item back to him.
 it was a lot more than i expected it to be but david refunded it right away, no questions asked.
 just shows how much this company cares about customers' satisfaction.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_been enjoying this beast, and extremely happy. gilmore lite is gone.
 i just want to add one more thing.
 little-dot's customer service is just amazing.
 david asked me to let him know how much the shipping came out to be after i shipped the defective item back to him.
 it was a lot more than i expected it to be but david refunded it right away, no questions asked.
 just shows how much this company cares about customers' satisfaction._

 

I agree. This is why I would rather see new folks getting recommendations for less expensive quality LD amps, instead of sending them to the for sale area, or perhaps some other tube amp companies. Most new folks are on a budget and need that "umbrella" of protection and great customer service. IMHO of course.


----------



## dan_can

Got my SE replacement back a couple days ago. One thing I noticed the three big caps on the back are Nippon Chemi-Con rather than Rubycon caps. Anyone else noticed this change?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dan_can* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my SE replacement back a couple days ago. One thing I noticed the three big caps on the back are Nippon Chemi-Con rather than Rubycon caps. Anyone else noticed this change?_

 

I did on mine too, so I guess it was a change a while back. They are good caps, so I'm not worried at all.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Anyone else having issues with their MKIV SE? I don't know if I'm lucky, or if I'm just not running it as long (most I do is about 2 1/2 session at a time, if that).

 But so far, with about 60 hours or so on my amp, no issues whatsoever. And what a great sounding amp! It's too bad more won't be made (but I guess you never know).


----------



## Trapper32

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ And what a great sounding amp! It's too bad more won't be made (but I guess you never know)._

 


 They're back in stock now.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Trapper32* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They're back in stock now._

 

Yes! Excellent! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm glad they are not "gone" yet! I really thought this last parts thing was the end of them. Whew!

 I've got to email my brother, he's been on the fence waiting to see if he could get one.


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Trapper32* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They're back in stock now._

 

Wow - that's great news for those that were sitting on the fence with this! Good to see David was able to source more parts for the amp. I hope the new batch doesn't have the same problems as the last one did, I'm sure it won't though!


----------



## dan_can

MK IV SE is a great amp for the price. I really liked it with HD650/60 plus the great service from Little-Dot. If you'd like to try the tube amp out and you love your Sennheiser's, don't hesitate to grab one.


----------



## cooperpwc

Quote:


 "The WE408A is a 20V filament tube so the front driver tube voltage is modified to 6.3V for the M8100..." 
 

Does anyone know if this move from 20 volt driver tube to 6.3 volt mean potentially less slam? I am specfically looking for lots of power to get impact with my 600 ohm DT880s.

 Edit: Reading more of the thread, its seems that this is a return to the originals configuration. I'm still curious whether the voltage difference might be relevant driving 600 ohms.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does anyone know if this move from 20 volt driver tube to 6.3 volt mean potentially less slam? I am specfically looking for lots of power to get impact with my 600 ohm DT880s.

 Edit: Reading more of the thread, its seems that this is a return to the originals configuration. I'm still curious whether the voltage difference might be relevant driving 600 ohms._

 

I've had both models, and I don't think it has any impact. I'm using Senns at 300ohms. The latest model (6H30s, EF95s) has plenty of power to drive your DT880s.


----------



## cooperpwc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've had both models, and I don't think it has any impact. I'm using Senns at 300ohms. The latest model (6H30s, EF95s) has plenty of power to drive your DT880s. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks. I may pull the trigger on this. The current included NOS tubes are good?


----------



## Kpt_Krunch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I may pull the trigger on this. The current included NOS tubes are good?_

 


 I think they sound great -even though I haven't fully broken them in yet (have about 75 hours or so on them now). 

 It can go very loud (I tried once, my ears still hurt) with zero distortion and plenty of slam (which my eardrums can attest to). It has a very smooth sound
 and is very detailed with an excellent presence and sound stage. I use Grado RS2's with the amp. IMO - one of my better audio purchases. No regrets buying it, and am enjoying every minute of it that I can!


----------



## tcp56

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I may pull the trigger on this. The current included NOS tubes are good?_

 

My replacement amp has about 150 hrs on it now. I think they sound as good as the originals. but I sent those back with the first amp. I think tjumper kept his original set and got the new ones as well. wonder which ones he uses? might be telling....


----------



## Czilla9000

Where do you buy Little Dot amps online?


----------



## Ragonix

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Czilla9000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Where do you buy Little Dot amps online?_

 

Either ebay or email them direct at little.tube@gmail.com.


----------



## fuzydice

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Czilla9000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Where do you buy Little Dot amps online?_

 

(posted this in your other thread, too, but this might help more people here..)

 You can order the little dot products directly from Little-Tube. See the Purchasing Information sticky for specs, pics, warranty and how to order.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I may pull the trigger on this. The current included NOS tubes are good?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kpt_Krunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think they sound great -even though I haven't fully broken them in yet (have about 75 hours or so on them now). 

 It can go very loud (I tried once, my ears still hurt) with zero distortion and plenty of slam (which my eardrums can attest to). It has a very smooth sound
 and is very detailed with an excellent presence and sound stage. I use Grado RS2's with the amp. IMO - one of my better audio purchases. No regrets buying it, and am enjoying every minute of it that I can!_

 

Yepper! The KPT said it all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Later on, you can try some different driver tubes to further refine the sound to your tastes. There are many great tubes talked about, over in the MKIII tube rolling thread.


----------



## Alfisti

Hey all, noob member, first post whatever....

 This thread and a couple of others has been enough to make me pull the trigger on an SE (and a Keces DA-131, totally anniahlated my motorbike fund) about... ohh... two hours ago. Can't wait for it to turn up, and I'll back up what others here have said about David's customer service and speed. I expected to have to wait a day or so for him to get back to me on the SE version, but 20mins later there was an invoice in my email, couldn't belive it.

 Anyway, had a question:

 I'm gathering from what's been written that tubes need a burn in period, bit like an old car engine after a rebuild, of not stressing them too much with listening sessions longer than a few hours. Is there a set number of hours for this to go on, and afterwards can the listening periods be extended? Just I've gone crashing into the end of a uni semester, which means doing multiple all-nighters and I like to listen while I work. Should I start schedueling meal breaks?

 Sorry if it's a dumb question, but this is my first foray into the world of doing anything more than plugging my cans directly into the back of the PC.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Alfisti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey all, noob member, first post whatever....

 This thread and a couple of others has been enough to make me pull the trigger on an SE (and a Keces DA-131, totally anniahlated my motorbike fund) about... ohh... two hours ago. Can't wait for it to turn up, and I'll back up what others here have said about David's customer service and speed. I expected to have to wait a day or so for him to get back to me on the SE version, but 20mins later there was an invoice in my email, couldn't belive it.

 Anyway, had a question:

 I'm gathering from what's been written that tubes need a burn in period, bit like an old car engine after a rebuild, of not stressing them too much with listening sessions longer than a few hours. Is there a set number of hours for this to go on, and afterwards can the listening periods be extended? Just I've gone crashing into the end of a uni semester, which means doing multiple all-nighters and I like to listen while I work. Should I start schedueling meal breaks?

 Sorry if it's a dumb question, but this is my first foray into the world of doing anything more than plugging my cans directly into the back of the PC._

 

The consensus is no more than 8 hours at a time, with a cool down to room temp between sessions. This should do just fine.


----------



## tjumper78

does anyone have some extra driver tubes to sell?
 i am looking for a pair of soviet tubes 6ZH1P-EV, or a pair of Tung-Sol 5654. shoot me a pm if you have them.
 i'm also gonna try the fs section.


----------



## Gradofan2

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_does anyone have some extra driver tubes to sell?
 i am looking for a pair of soviet tubes 6ZH1P-EV, or a pair of Tung-Sol 5654. shoot me a pm if you have them.
 i'm also gonna try the fs section._

 

Well... those are the right tubes... without a doubt - the best you'll find with the DV332 - Svets and Tung Sols. Should be good with the MKIV also.


----------



## nspindel

Hi guys, haven't posted much on head-fi for the last few years, I actually sold my headphone gear a few years back to start building up a 2-channel loudspeaker setup, and now I've just stepped back into the headphone arena.

 Long story short, here's a link to the polk audio forums where I've got a whole thread on my system:

I'm done! The coolest 2-channel stereo I've ever owned - Club Polk

 Highlights of this setup are that I'm using the LDMKIVSE as my pre-amp, with a boldercable mod'ed/Welborne Power-Supply'd Squeezebox as the source, feeding a somewhat mod'ed nad 2200 powering a pair of polk sda 2b's that I've completely rebuilt. All the cables are Signal.

 Reason I've just now jumped back over to headfi is I've added a few new toys to the mix: Stefan Equinox Grado GS1000's, as well as a pair of Senn 650's. I still need to figure out a cable for the Senn's, I'm relaxing with the wallet for a while. But man those Senns can sound so much better, in my old setup I had the Cardas cable. I'm thinking about an Equinox for the Senns. I can't say for certain that I'll keep both the Grados and the Senns. But I need a real cable in order to fairly compare the Grados to the Senns with the LD. Right now the Grados blow the Senns away, but the Grados are using a wire that cost what the Senn 650 costs new!

 Interesting thing that I can say starting off with the LD as a pre-amp and then comparing the sound to these most-excellent headphones is that y'all don't even realize what the LD is even capable of doing! As amazing as it sounds with headphones, as a pre-amp for my loudspeaker system this thing can reach points that can just blow your mind. The kind of stuff that would make you deaf if you tried it with cans 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It is simply a stellar piece of gear, an utter steal at $399. I'm still using Mullard M8100's and EH 6H30PI, although I have a pair of Raytheon 6AK5W's (I prefer the Mullards for the loudspeakers). I also have a pair of Mullard M8161's, but I've yet to start playing with the jumpers.

 Final point to make is that David is simply the best. He and I have been emailing constantly for several months back and forth. He has been unbelievably helpful. A level of customer service that you couldn't possibly dream of from a "normal" company.

 Anyways, check out my Polk thread, it's a cool system...


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i am looking for a pair of soviet tubes 6ZH1P-EV, or a pair of Tung-Sol 5654. shoot me a pm if you have them. i'm also gonna try the fs section._

 

The 6ZH1P also goes by 6J1P, you can find them pretty handily on ebay.


----------



## vvanrij

Wow, the MKIVse also is an amazing pre-amp. My speakers have never sounded this good, just wow. Anybody else had this experience?


----------



## tjumper78

sadly, i am selling my mk4se b/c i got rid of my hd650.
 gonna go with cans that are easier to drive with smaller amps.
 if anyone's interested, you can grab my almost new mk4se in the FS section.


----------



## vvanrij

Hmm why did you get rid of the HD650? And why not go for some real good cans


----------



## vvanrij

Has anyone noticed a lack of bass with low impedance phones? If I use my 325i's with the MKIVse (6h30p/m8100) I notice a lack of mid-bass + low-bass. This is very easily noticable when I switch between my Zero's amp (627+1364) to my MKIVse, there really is alot of bass missing. Offcourse could change to some more 'bass-heavy' tubes, but I don't want to, because the tubes sound great with my sextett and K601, not lacking bass at all. I tried changing the dipswitches, but besides a change in volume, there is nothing happening that I hear. Any idea's??


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone noticed a lack of bass with low impedance phones? If I use my 325i's with the MKIVse (6h30p/m8100) I notice a lack of mid-bass + low-bass. This is very easily noticable when I switch between my Zero's amp (627+1364) to my MKIVse, there really is alot of bass missing. Offcourse could change to some more 'bass-heavy' tubes, but I don't want to, because the tubes sound great with my sextett and K601, not lacking bass at all. I tried changing the dipswitches, but besides a change in volume, there is nothing happening that I hear. Any idea's??_

 

There are so many variables, I'm not sure one idea would fit most of them. The question that doesn't get asked, is: "What amount of bass, was intended during the recording?" Folks in Asia believe we westerner's like too much bass. I'll even admit that I like bass very much. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I do however, have my own "reality" check for this syndrome. I use my MKV as a "standard" for how much bass is intended. So, I'll A-B tubes in my MKIVse with the MKV, to determine where I stand. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It isn't fool proof, but better than nothing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Pick one dynamic reference track, that you know like the back of your hand. Use it to determine what is going on between the different headphones. It has been my observation, that the higher quality the headphones are, the higher the impedance is, generally. There are exceptions, but only a few. A true lack of proper bass in lower impedance headphones, would be a signal to me that they just can't reproduce proper bass as well as the higher impedance headphones can. YMMV and IMHO for sure, but you may find this to be "not so far off track" when you do some more evaluating.


----------



## nspindel

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, the MKIVse also is an amazing pre-amp. My speakers have never sounded this good, just wow. Anybody else had this experience?_

 

Read my post two up from yours! It's an outstanding pre-amp, I love the thing.


----------



## vvanrij

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There are so many variables, I'm not sure one idea would fit most of them. The question that doesn't get asked, is: "What amount of bass, was intended during the recording?" Folks in Asia believe we westerner's like too much bass. I'll even admit that I like bass very much. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I do however, have my own "reality" check for this syndrome. I use my MKV as a "standard" for how much bass is intended. So, I'll A-B tubes in my MKIVse with the MKV, to determine where I stand. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It isn't fool proof, but better than nothing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Pick one dynamic reference track, that you know like the back of your hand. Use it to determine what is going on between the different headphones. It has been my observation, that the higher quality the headphones are, the higher the impedance is, generally. There are exceptions, but only a few. A true lack of proper bass in lower impedance headphones, would be a signal to me that they just can't reproduce proper bass as well as the higher impedance headphones can. YMMV and IMHO for sure, but you may find this to be "not so far off track" when you do some more evaluating._

 

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/rev...r-325i-330397/


----------



## fuzydice

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It has been my observation, that the higher quality the headphones are, the higher the impedance is, generally. There are exceptions, but only a few. A true lack of proper bass in lower impedance headphones, would be a signal to me that they just can't reproduce proper bass as well as the higher impedance headphones can._

 

I think we need to send you pairs of:
_- Audio Technica L3000 [48ohm]_
_- Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro [80ohm version]_
_- Denon D5000 [25ohm]_
 - Grado GS1000 [32ohm]
 - Grado HP1000 [40ohm]
 - Grado RS1 [32ohm]
 - Sony Qualia 010 [70ohm]
_- Ultrasone Edition 9 [30ohm]_

 .. etc etc. A few of those are definitely known for their bass, as well (L3000, Ed9, dt770, etc). Maybe all these and the other high-end grados are the exception 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyways, the point is that there are bass-light and bass-heavy phones on both ends of the impedance spectrum, with a few specific examples of the low-impedance end listed above. I don't think there's enough evidence to support a general claim about correlation between high-impedance and bass reproduction, but maybe there is and I've just not studied enough.

 Sorry, I just thought that statement was a bit odd, even with the 'generally' and 'there are exceptions' thrown in. I'm not attacking ya in any way


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone noticed a lack of bass with low impedance phones? If I use my 325i's with the MKIVse (6h30p/m8100) I notice a lack of mid-bass + low-bass. This is very easily noticable when I switch between my Zero's amp (627+1364) to my MKIVse, there really is alot of bass missing. Offcourse could change to some more 'bass-heavy' tubes, but I don't want to, because the tubes sound great with my sextett and K601, not lacking bass at all. I tried changing the dipswitches, but besides a change in volume, there is nothing happening that I hear. Any idea's??_

 

I always did find the bottom end kind of missing/lacking when I listen through the LD MK IV SE.


----------



## vvanrij

Well it was only with the grado's, my sextetts *definetly* don't lack bass haha 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Anyway, since I woodied my 325i's the bass is excellent, no more complaints. It wasn't the 'deep bass' that was missing, it was the 'high-bass, lower-midrange', and it was more a 325i problem than a LD.


----------



## nspindel

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I always did find the bottom end kind of missing/lacking when I listen through the LD MK IV SE. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

If you've ever heard it as a preamp, you would know it's not the LD. It's got plenty of bottom end...


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nspindel* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you've ever heard it as a preamp, you would know it's not the LD. It's got plenty of bottom end..._

 

(iMod) - (cable) - (LD MK IV SE) - (RS-2)

 EDIT: Forgot to mention that I am currently starting to sniff out a spare $250 to buy the *KECES DA-151 DAC*, so that should be a crazy good combo.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fuzydice* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think we need to send you pairs of:
- Audio Technica L3000 [48ohm]
- Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro [80ohm version]
- Denon D5000 [25ohm]
 - Grado GS1000 [32ohm]
 - Grado HP1000 [40ohm]
 - Grado RS1 [32ohm]
 - Sony Qualia 010 [70ohm]
- Ultrasone Edition 9 [30ohm]

 .. etc etc. A few of those are definitely known for their bass, as well (L3000, Ed9, dt770, etc). Maybe all these and the other high-end grados are the exception 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyways, the point is that there are bass-light and bass-heavy phones on both ends of the impedance spectrum, with a few specific examples of the low-impedance end listed above. I don't think there's enough evidence to support a general claim about correlation between high-impedance and bass reproduction, but maybe there is and I've just not studied enough.

 Sorry, I just thought that statement was a bit odd, even with the 'generally' and 'there are exceptions' thrown in. I'm not attacking ya in any way 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 






 You sure could send me some, that would be cool! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 This kind of thing isn't talked about very much, if at all. I have always wondered if there was a bigger picture here, that is not easy to see. There may not be enough evidence to support a solid claim, true enough, but I wonder how the total numbers would add up? There sure is a bunch of headphones out there! The cost of acquiring headphones probably keeps this kind of topic from being explored. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Have a good one!


----------



## lbcpc

my Little Dot MK-IVse + 880 sound very good


----------



## Penchum

Good news! 

 The MKIV's on average, only use 30 watts of power!!
 I think that is pretty decent for the old electric bill! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I've updated the review to reflect this good news.


----------



## VeipaCray

I'm using the Keces DA-131 (upgraded to the DAC chips from the 151), LD MKIV, and RS1's. I couldn't be happier with the setup. Go for the Keces, you'll love it in your rig. 



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_(iMod) - (cable) - (LD MK IV SE) - (RS-2)

 EDIT: Forgot to mention that I am currently starting to sniff out a spare $250 to buy the *KECES DA-151 DAC*, so that should be a crazy good combo._


----------



## nismohks

is the price difference of the mkiv and mkivse worth it?

 what are the key differences?


----------



## vvanrij

Better connectors, better tubes, 2 year warranty. I did it especially for the tubes, because I didn't want to search for tubes etc., and because I like to have the 'TOTL'.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Better connectors, better tubes, 2 year warranty. I did it especially for the tubes, because I didn't want to search for tubes etc., and because I like to have the 'TOTL'._

 






Hold tight to that wallet!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If you truly want the absolute last drop of high end performance out of your MKIVse, then you'll be interested in the 6H30PI-DR power tubes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Warning, not for the faint hearted, weak kneed, or thin of wallet! PM me if you'd like to hear my impressions.


----------



## nismohks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Better connectors, better tubes, 2 year warranty. I did it especially for the tubes, because I didn't want to search for tubes etc., and because I like to have the 'TOTL'._

 

it is a noticable difference to a normal mkiv with changed tubes though?

 or is the price difference mainly due to its limited availability?

 also how would the mkivse compare to the darkvoice 332?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it is a noticable difference to a normal mkiv with changed tubes though?

 or is the price difference mainly due to its limited availability?

 also how would the mkivse compare to the darkvoice 332?_

 

There is an audible difference between the tubes used. The price spread has been the same since the models came out, no increases so far. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 These two amps appear to be direct competitors with each other. I haven't seen a direct comparison between the two yet.


----------



## nismohks

how much are replacement tubes roughly for the mkivse or mkiv?

 also for the 332.

 i have no experience with tubes 

 Thanks for your help!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_how much are replacement tubes roughly for the mkivse or mkiv?

 also for the 332.

 i have no experience with tubes 

 Thanks for your help!_

 

Normal eBay prices,
 For the MKIV, power tubes are $36 pair, driver tubes maybe $10 pair.
 For the MKIVse, power tubes are $65 pair and driver tubes $35 pair.

 Prices vary greatly, depending upon the sellers.
 Prices also vary due to which model tube you are purchasing.
 I'm not sure about the 332's tube compliment.


----------



## nismohks

oo so the mkivse uses a diff style tube (or adaptor?) to the standard mkiv?

 how do the stock tubes of the mkivse compare to the mkiv?

 i mean, if i buy the mkiv then replace tubes, the price would be quite similar to buying a mkivse from the start...

 would a mkiv with changed tubes sound better than the mkivse with stock tubes?

 so was just wondering which is the better value?


----------



## vvanrij

Imo the MKIVse is better values, because it already has the 100$ tubes (which imo are great, so you don't have to upgrade them, unless you really want to), you also get the Neutrik locking headphone jack, the better connectors, the extra year of warranty.


----------



## nismohks

ahh ok, that puts things into better perspective

 now i just gotta decide between the darkvoice 332 and the ld mkivse


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_how much are replacement tubes roughly for the mkivse or mkiv?

 also for the 332._

 

The DV332 uses the 6S19P/EF95 compliment, the same driver tubes as the Mk-series and the same power tube as the LDII++ series.


----------



## nismohks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The DV332 uses the 6S19P/EF95 compliment, the same driver tubes as the Mk-series and the same power tube as the LDII++ series._

 

so i guess i would be looking at similar prices in terms of upgrading tubes between the darkvoice and LD right?


----------



## Rocky

Sold my Heed CanAmp last week and ordered the MK IVse 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Can't wait to try it out. Hope I won't regret selling the Heed though.


----------



## vvanrij

I'v never once doubted my purchase on the MKIVse, just make sure you use the right 'GAIN' setting for your headphones. My sextetts have never sounded this fantastic.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote:


 I'v never once doubted my purchase on the MKIVse, just make sure you use the right 'GAIN' setting for your headphones. 
 

X2...Great amp...


----------



## Rocky

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'v never once doubted my purchase on the MKIVse._

 

Sweet! Very pleased to hear that


----------



## nspindel

I've seen many questions in my reading along the lines of "is the SE really worth the extra money over the MKIV?"

 The tubes alone are about $50-$60 more expensive than the tubes with the MKIV. The headphone jack is an upgrade, and the warranty is much better, so I personally feel that the extra $100 on the price tag is justified.


----------



## wae5

I have the SE and recently bought the Beyerdynamic HT880. My SE didn't come with a manual so I don't know what switch settings are best for it. Can someone please tell me what switches to flip and where I can get the manual so I never need to ask this question again? Thank you for your help.


----------



## vvanrij

You should mail that LD guy for a manual, I also did so, so I could also mail it to you. Finding the gain is a p in the a, I just know now that my sextetts (600ohm) definetly work best at the highest gain (10). But now I'm gonna have to do the whole testing sh!t again when my K701's arrive


----------



## vvanrij

Btw any K701 + MKIVse owners here, how is the 'synergy' between these too, and what gain do you use??


----------



## HeatFan12

vvanrij, wae5...
 PM your email to me and I'll send you the reference manual..
 Jes


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote:


 Btw any K701 + MKIVse owners here, how is the 'synergy' between these too, and what gain do you use?? 
 

Don't have K701s, however, my gain is at (10) for K501s, HD580s & DT880...

 Jes


----------



## vvanrij

Yeah I think I like gain 10 the best too. And I have the manual, but thanks for the offer. Is it true the K501 and K400 are comparable?


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote:


 Yeah I think I like gain 10 the best too. And I have the manual, but thanks for the offer. Is it true the K501 and K400 are comparable? 
 

I really don't know, have never heard the K400, however, they do look alike
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The gain at (10) is a good choice, unless you use low imp. phones. With the K501s (120 ohm), my volume pot does not go past 10-11...


----------



## Radioheadache

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nspindel* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've seen many questions in my reading along the lines of "is the SE really worth the extra money over the MKIV?"

 The tubes alone are about $50-$60 more expensive than the tubes with the MKIV. The headphone jack is an upgrade, and the warranty is much better, so I personally feel that the extra $100 on the price tag is justified._

 

Man, you're making me regret my decision to purchase the MKIV.


----------



## nismohks

i just bought a mkivse 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait to test it out!

 any recommendations on burnin or setting it up with my hd600?


----------



## flintoff2020

Sorry folks...I didnt knew how to post a new thread and so posting in between your thread..I am very sorry for that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I am looking out for a best sounding headphones that will chill and thrill you with amazing detail, depth, clarity, Natural Sounding, LIVELY, LIVELY, LIVELY and Good Deep SOLID Beast bass sounding headphones which will not rumble or break at any frequency,,,Its too much to ask in a headphone but dont know if those type of headphones are ever made and if you know then I am the most happy one to buy them...

 I will be waiting for your responses......

 God Loves Us
 Flintoff


----------



## TheMarchingMule

You'll have better luck here: Headphones (full-size) - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio

 And yes, you are asking too much. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *flintoff2020* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry folks...I didnt knew how to post a new thread and so posting in between your thread..I am very sorry for that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I am looking out for a best sounding headphones that will chill and thrill you with amazing detail, depth, clarity, Natural Sounding, LIVELY, LIVELY, LIVELY and Good Deep SOLID Beast bass sounding headphones which will not rumble or break at any frequency,,,Its too much to ask in a headphone but dont know if those type of headphones are ever made and if you know then I am the most happy one to buy them...

 I will be waiting for your responses......

 God Loves Us
 Flintoff_


----------



## wae5

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *flintoff2020* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry folks...I didnt knew how to post a new thread and so posting in between your thread..I am very sorry for that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I am looking out for a best sounding headphones that will chill and thrill you with amazing detail, depth, clarity, Natural Sounding, LIVELY, LIVELY, LIVELY and Good Deep SOLID Beast bass sounding headphones which will not rumble or break at any frequency,,,Its too much to ask in a headphone but dont know if those type of headphones are ever made and if you know then I am the most happy one to buy them...

 I will be waiting for your responses......

 God Loves Us
 Flintoff_

 



 Welcome to HeadFI where you don't have to worry about your wallet because we do that for you!

 You sound like a Grado man so if your wallet's as a flush as your first post, I'd recommend the Grado SR325i @ $300 or if you're a little less flush than you seem, the Grado SR60 @$70 may be just what you want.

 This site is broken down into various equipment catagories and you inadvertantly landed at the tail end of a discussion about an obscure chinese tube headphone amplifier, the Little Dot MKIV SE, so you may want to look here Headphones (full-size) - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio so you can ask your question in the right forum.

 You're off to a very auspicious start so good bye and good luck!


----------



## vvanrij

MKIVse + K701 is excellent synergy, anybody else here have the same combo?


----------



## nismohks

is there an english instruction book for the mkivse?

 mine is in chinese, and i have no idea what it says.

 what is the gain setting and how can i change it?

 thanks

 edit: i just emailed little.tube@gmail.com to request and english manual. is that the right communications channel to reach them?

 also, atm i am using it with my ipod classic and LOD connected directly to the mkivse and i can hear a slight buzzing in the background with my hd600. Is this normal given that the amp is brand new with under 1 hour of time on it?


----------



## nismohks

also does anyone's mkivse make any noise in the headphones even when nothing is played?

 mine makes a slight buzzing and staticy noise even when nothing is plugged in or played....

 any ideas?


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote:


 also does anyone's mkivse make any noise in the headphones even when nothing is played?

 mine makes a slight buzzing and staticy noise even when nothing is plugged in or played....

 any ideas? 
 

nismohks

 Make sure all the tubes are pushed in all the way in the sockets. The MK IV SE should be dead silent....


----------



## nismohks

does it make a click when its all the way in?

 at the moment, they can still wiggle slightly when i tought them with my finger, however i will try again once the damn tubes cool down 

 will report back later


----------



## vvanrij

Don't push em in too far, don't force anything, just push it to the stop. Anyway, disconnect your source (the input rca's) to isolate the problem. My zero dac makes some slight noise at volumes above high listening volume, so I should never listen to it that loud, but my MKIVse is as said before 'dead-silent'!


----------



## nismohks

yer i fixed the tubes by pushing them more firmly and i can say that its MUCH MUCh better.

 virtually all static is gone so its all good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 one thing, how do i clean the damn tubes? im pretty sure i got some hand oil on some of them. so just want to give them a nice clean just for safe guarding.

 also, do i have to feed music through it to make it count as burn in? or just leave it on?

 is it just me or does the unit get warm on the case etc ...? im running it at 240V australian voltage


----------



## TheMarchingMule

1.) Clean the tube contacts, or the glass?

 2.) Burn-in, you need music running through it; the IV cannot just be on

 3.) Yes the unit does tend to get warm, but it's nothing to be alarmed about

 4.) Can you stop saying 'damn'?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yer i fixed the tubes by pushing them more firmly and i can say that its MUCH MUCh better.

 virtually all static is gone so its all good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 one thing, how do i clean the damn tubes? im pretty sure i got some hand oil on some of them. so just want to give them a nice clean just for safe guarding.

 also, do i have to feed music through it to make it count as burn in? or just leave it on?

 is it just me or does the unit get warm on the case etc ...? im running it at 240V australian voltage_


----------



## nismohks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1.) Clean the tube contacts, or the glass?

 2.) Burn-in, you need music running through it; the IV cannot just be on

 3.) Yes the unit does tend to get warm, but it's nothing to be alarmed about

 4.) Can you stop saying 'damn'?_

 

1) glass, but also just realised the contacts arent in the best shape either...

 2) yer tahts what i thought 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 3) yer it gets quite warm. nothing too hot to touch however but now i absolutely gotta remember to turn it off at night 

 4) if you insist  take in mind i havent slept for around 40 hours (cant sleep on plane and woke up early on the date of departure and its not night here in australia yet ) so sorry, my vocab aint in the best state at the moment

 Cheers!


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1) glass, but also just realised the contacts arent in the best shape either...

 2) yer tahts what i thought 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 3) yer it gets quite warm. nothing too hot to touch however but now i absolutely gotta remember to turn it off at night 

 4) if you insist  take in mind i havent slept for around 40 hours (cant sleep on plane and woke up early on the date of departure and its not night here in australia yet ) so sorry, my vocab aint in the best state at the moment

 Cheers!_

 

For the tube glass, windex type cleaners are ok, but these may remove some of the printing on the tube. A soft dry cloth will remove most finger prints without messing with the printing. For tube pins, use Deoxit or some type of "tuner/electronics cleaner" and lightly brush them with an old tooth brush.

 A quick burn-in rule of thumb: No more than 8 hours in one session, with a complete cool down to room temperature, before starting the next session. I use the alarm in my cell phone, to remind me when to cool the unit off. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The heat from tube amps always seems excessive when you don't have a tube based reference to compare it with. It will most likely be the hottest piece of audio equipment you own. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Best practices: Never leave it on while you are gone. Don't touch the tubes while it is running. Make sure it has plenty of free space around it, so it can shed it's heat to the open air. Don't feed it a pint because it is your new best friend.


----------



## vvanrij

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't feed it a pint because it is your new best friend. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

*GUILTY!*


----------



## wae5

I usually use my MKIV SE as a pre amp for my MKV. Today, I discovered I don't need to turn on the MKIV SE to listen to the MKV. To do this I must turn the SE volume control all the way up and when I do the MKV sounds just as good as it always does. Has anyone else tried this? Does it affect the sound?


----------



## vvanrij

You mean, you can pass sound through your MKIV, without having it on :| I gotta try this


----------



## wae5

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You mean, you can pass sound through your MKIV, without having it on :| I gotta try this 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I suspect if the MKIV SE is used this way the SE's volume control acts as a passive, variable resistor so when the volume is turned all the way up there's unity gain or so I've heard.


----------



## vvanrij

I tried it, but the volume is really really low, and I also got some unpleasent pops, so I wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I prefer connecting source -> receiver -> MKIVse instead of the other way around


----------



## wae5

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I tried it, but the volume is really really low, and I also got some unpleasent pops, so I wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I prefer connecting source -> receiver -> MKIVse instead of the other way around 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That's strange because the MKV sound is neither too low nor distorted when I do this. Normally I listen at a level of 30 on the MKV when the MKIV SE is turned on and used it as active pre amp. When the MKIV SE is turned off in pass through mode, I turn its volume control all the way up and listen at a setting of 50 on the MKV. I don't think this can do any harm so if you want to daisy chain amps this is a good way to do it. BTW, my Stax SR-1/MK-2 amp does this too (Stax lists it as a feature) so I doubt if it's harmful to do this with the MKIV SE. I'm now listening to my MS1 this way and it never sounded better and even my fussy HT880 purrs nicely along.

 PS I may have a MKIV SE V2.


----------



## Rocky

I finally got my MK IVse yesterday!
 It was shipped on june 27th and arrived yesterday, july 8th. The norwegian customs decided to keep it to themselvs for a few days, so it was actually in Norway july 2nd. 
 When I got the package I noticed it was pretty banged up. There was even a small hole in one of the corners of the package. This all scared me a bit, and I was afraid the amp might be damaged. I was very pleased to find out that it was in perfect condition after tearing up the cardboard box.

 I set the amp up on my desk and hooked it up to my audiotrak hd2 soundcard. Plugged the power in and turned the amp on. Everything worked perfectly. 

 I sold my Heed CanAmp to purchase this amp, and I was a little worried I might regret selling it. But the MK IVse has totally reassured me that I have nothing to regret. This amp sounds so good with my hd650's. Im already more pleased with the sound coming from this non-burnt in amp than I was with my fully burnt-in Heed. Im not good at describing sound, so I won't do it 
 But all I can say is that this amp was totally worth replacing with the canamp. Im gonna enjoy this one tremendously. Thanks alot to Penchum for this great review, which made me buy this wonderful amp!


----------



## vvanrij

Awesome, glad to hear you like it! It does defintly get better with burn in, most noticble thing to me was that the bass was muddy, and is now very accurate, and that the high's extend further. Enjoy!


----------



## nismohks

did anyone else's mkivse came with tubes which had oxidised contact legs?

 i took my tubes out and found that the legs was not the usual shiny gold colour, but more of an oxidised yellow brown colour. it is not rusted, but you can see where it has made contact with the actual connections within the connector by shiny gold being revealed.

 how can i clean this? should i jsut hit it with some fine grade sand paper?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_did anyone else's mkivse came with tubes which had oxidised contact legs?

 i took my tubes out and found that the legs was not the usual shiny gold colour, but more of an oxidised yellow brown colour. it is not rusted, but you can see where it has made contact with the actual connections within the connector by shiny gold being revealed.

 how can i clean this? should i jsut hit it with some fine grade sand paper?_

 

It is common for the pins to get "funky" during shipping, depending upon the humidity and other changes. Use Deoxit or a tuner/electronics cleaner and an old tooth brush. Brush very lightly with the cleaner and they will clean up very nicely.


----------



## nismohks

i have no idea what deoxit is nor do i know of any tuner/electronics cleaner.

 deoxit is not sold here in australia i think. are there any alternatives?

 also, does the "funkiness" influence sound quality?

 what i did realise is that the tube placement and seating is absolutely critical so that there is no hiss or static through the headphones.

 even the slightest shift will cause the static noises. is it safe to assume that these may be caused by this oxidisation?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i have no idea what deoxit is nor do i know of any tuner/electronics cleaner.

 deoxit is not sold here in australia i think. are there any alternatives?

 also, does the "funkiness" influence sound quality?

 what i did realise is that the tube placement and seating is absolutely critical so that there is no hiss or static through the headphones.

 even the slightest shift will cause the static noises. is it safe to assume that these may be caused by this oxidisation?_

 

Yes, the sensitivity you are experiencing is due to the oxidation on the pins. Once they are cleaned, this problem is gone totally. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm sure they sell Deoxit in Australia (others from there have commented on this) but "almost" any tuner cleaner or electronics cleaner will do. Most electronics supply companies sell these products and some repair shops do as well.


----------



## nismohks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, the sensitivity you are experiencing is due to the oxidation on the pins. Once they are cleaned, this problem is gone totally. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm sure they sell Deoxit in Australia (others from there have commented on this) but "almost" any tuner cleaner or electronics cleaner will do. Most electronics supply companies sell these products and some repair shops do as well._

 

so is this sensitivity a common problem? it is REALLY ANNOYING.

 i will try and hunt for these tuner cleaner or electonics cleaner products at a local electronics store. you reckon methylated spirits would work?


----------



## vvanrij

How about Cola penchum?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so is this sensitivity a common problem? it is REALLY ANNOYING.

 i will try and hunt for these tuner cleaner or electonics cleaner products at a local electronics store. you reckon methylated spirits would work?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvanrij* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How about Cola penchum?_

 






Hehehe!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I wouldn't recommend using anything that might leave a residue behind. Anything that remains would end up in the socket, which wouldn't be easy to clean. In a pinch, you could use a softer wire brush, like one of those copper wire brushes and get most of it off that way. Just go easy on the pins and you should be OK, if you did this only once or twice. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The idea is to get them clean without inducing any wear on the pins.


----------



## vvanrij

Ok another weird thing. I did a strange test, connected my MKIVse to my NAD receiver. Then played some Pirates OST, and did some side-by-side comparisons of:

 -PC -> Zero -> MKIVse -> K701
 -PC -> Zero -> MKIVse -> NAD -> K701

 and... it actually sounds better with the extra step (NAD), just a little fuller and more musical in general. Could someone with a decent amp/receiver also try this, it almost seems to me that the output of the mkivse is better than the headphone out... or something, maybe the NAD just smoothes things out, anyway, I love what I'm hearing !!


----------



## nismohks

i picked up some DeoxIT and ProGold at a local electronics store.

 i'll post back on my results later ! 

 also i made a different thread on tube cleaning too! : http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f6/how...ntacts-342349/


----------



## Hopstretch

Bummer, I'm starting to randomly lose the left channel on my MkIVse. Sometimes when I switch on, sometimes after it's been in use for a while. Just as randomly comes back. Connections test out fine, so it seems likely to be an internal issue. Any thoughts?


----------



## nspindel

Email David...


----------



## gi330i

I've had similar issues with crackling and hissing with my MKIVse. I found that one of my M8100 driver tubes was causing the crackling and it persisted despite cleaning the pins. David from LD was able to help me determine this by having me swap the tubes' positions in the amp and see if the crackling then became present in the other channel (which it did). I thought the issue was solved. I then placed a different set of driver tubes in and found that the crackling/hissing was still present but not as loud. I remembered David mentioned previously that I might try to swap the positions of the power tubes as well. When I swapped the positions of the power tubes, lo and behold, the crackling became noticeable in the other channel (persisted despite also cleaning the pins with Deoxit). I then decided to replace the M8100 driver tubes as they were when I first noted the crackling and found that there was the previously noted loud crackling in the other channel and the newly found lower level crackling in the other channel. David advised me that it appears I have both a bad driver and power tube. He then offered to replace my tubes. Unfortunately, they are out of the 6h30PI power tubes.

 With bad power tubes I have also read that it may begin to cut out the signal to the channel it is "powering". So you might try to swap the positions of the power tube and listen if the opposite channel now begins to lose its signal, it may be that you just have a power tube issue.


----------



## Hopstretch

Thanks. David also suggested it was probably a power tube issue and, having cleaned, switched and reseated them, so far it seems that's it.

 Probably worth noting again how good LD's support is. Don't think I've ever had to wait more than an hour or so for an answer to an email. Real pleasure to deal with. Kudos!


----------



## senns&nonsense

Can someone confirm that the SE that incorporated 408A tubes used 7119 / E182CC tubes in the power slots?

 And are there any other designations (5687?) that will work as power tubes? I believe 6H30Pl are not compatible.

 Thanks.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *senns&nonsense* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can someone confirm that the SE that incorporated 408A tubes used 7119 / E182CC tubes in the power slots?

 And are there any other designations (5687?) that will work as power tubes? I believe 6H30Pl are not compatible.

 Thanks._

 

Hi!

 Yes, the version that has the 408a drivers and E182CC power tubes, can't use the 6H30 family. But, look around for E182CC, 5687, 7119 and 7044 power tubes. There are MANY excellent sounding tubes using these numbers.
 Here is a short list of the ones I found when I had my first MKIVse:

 Amperex 7119
 Arcturus 7044
 Arcturus 5687
 GE 5687 Mil-Spec (1943)
 GE 5687 5-Star
 Mullard E182CC
 Philips JAN 5687-WB
 Tong-Sol JTL-5687 (1941)

 Have a good one!!


----------



## di_andrei

I'm considering a Mark IVse and I'm curious whether anyone is using it with Audio Technica AD900's (open). Most people in this thread seem to use them with Senn 650's and to my limited knowledge, the impedance is very different between the two headsets, and to a lesser extent the frequency response too.

 Would my experience be significantly different?


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *di_andrei* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm considering a Mark IVse and I'm curious whether anyone is using it with Audio Technica AD900's (open). Most people in this thread seem to use them with Senn 650's and to my limited knowledge, the impedance is very different between the two headsets, and to a lesser extent the frequency response too.

 Would my experience be significantly different?_

 

I use it with my MS2i which is 32ohms with great results, the Mk amps come with adjustable gain so it's designed for headphones of all impedance values.


----------



## shadowmoses

After listening to the Mk IV SE, i wished i could trade in my Mk III and V for one of those. It sounded sooo good...


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shadowmoses* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After listening to the Mk IV SE, i wished i could trade in my Mk III and V for one of those. It sounded sooo good..._

 

Could just be the Mullard M8100 that the MkIVse ships with, it does make quite a big difference sonically speaking especially compared with the GE5654 on the MkIII.


----------



## punk_guy182

Yeah! I have two MKIV SE. The amp is so powerfull and has a great sound. i have one that I am using and the other that has not been used, burned or turned on yet. I am waiting to get 50 posts or replys to sell it on head-fi.org. If anyone is interested, let me know.


----------



## senns&nonsense

Penchum, thanks for the advice about the tubes.

 I have already purchased some GE 408As and I am thinking about some Kuhl tube cryoed version as well. Now I have a nice selection of power tubes that I know will work as well - thanks.


----------



## glitch39

how hot does the chassis need to be? is it normal for it to be hot to touch?


----------



## nismohks

my MKivse just died....

 only had it for 2 months or so...

 i noticed the sound was distorting and then i cleaned the tubes and everything and it still didnt fix, so i decided to just take off the rear cover via the 2 screws to see what was happening and then to my horror i found that one of the components had burnt to a crisp.

 not exactly sure what component it is, but it looks like a fat resistor without the stripes. When viewed from behind there are 3 from left to right on the back edge of the board.

 i cant see their labels, but on the middle one, it says RLR32C. it is the one on the right which is burnt up! cant even see any marking on it whatsoever. there seems to be a line right through the middle of it and then white stuff sortta spewed out slightly.

 not sure what else is broken but thats all i can see ...

 anyone know?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_my MKivse just died....

 only had it for 2 months or so...

 i noticed the sound was distorting and then i cleaned the tubes and everything and it still didnt fix, so i decided to just take off the rear cover via the 2 screws to see what was happening and then to my horror i found that one of the components had burnt to a crisp.

 not exactly sure what component it is, but it looks like a fat resistor without the stripes. When viewed from behind there are 3 from left to right on the back edge of the board.

 i cant see their labels, but on the middle one, it says RLR32C. it is the one on the right which is burnt up! cant even see any marking on it whatsoever. there seems to be a line right through the middle of it and then white stuff sortta spewed out slightly.

 not sure what else is broken but thats all i can see ...

 anyone know?




_

 

Yes, those are the resistors in the output stage. Contact DavidZ and he'll get if fixed right away for you. It has happened before, but not for a long time now. Once replaced, it's like nothing happened.


----------



## nismohks

can anyone tell me the exact part number of that?

 reason being is that i want to get it fixed at a local electrician if i can, because i would rather not sending it overseas and pay shipping both ways if i dont need to.

 also why do they blow? is there any particular reason? i mustve had at most 100 hours on it, more like 50 hours and never for more than 5 hours at a time which is under the suggested 8 hours max. Also, it is freezing in australia atm since its winter


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_can anyone tell me the exact part number of that?

 reason being is that i want to get it fixed at a local electrician if i can, because i would rather not sending it overseas and pay shipping both ways if i dont need to.

 also why do they blow? is there any particular reason? i mustve had at most 100 hours on it, more like 50 hours and never for more than 5 hours at a time which is under the suggested 8 hours max. Also, it is freezing in australia atm since its winter_

 

Ow, I hear ya! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I checked mine, to see if I could glean the numbers, but the unprinted side is facing me. If you email DavidZ, tell him what's up, I'm sure he'd give you the part numbers and also ask him for permission to have it repaired local, so you can keep your warranty intact. I don't think he'll have a problem with this, but then again, I haven't ever tried it. He's a fair guy, so I think you'll be ok. I did notice my resistors were up off of the board by about 8-10mm, to allow air to get fully around them. They look like the same ones, and mine look prestine. Perhaps, this is what got yours too hot?


----------



## nismohks

not too sure. 

 i emailed david yet i am waiting for a response...


----------



## silverrain

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *glitch39* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_how hot does the chassis need to be? is it normal for it to be hot to touch?_

 

I want to know this, too. 

 Is this normal with all tube amps, maybe?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want to know this, too. 

 Is this normal with all tube amps, maybe? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The default answer is "Yes", but with some understandings.

 Hot to the touch seems to mean different things to different folks. The MKIVse has an aluminum body, which gets rid of heat for the entire unit. If it didn't get good and warm, or slightly hot, it wouldn't be doing it's job. For those that worry a bunch about this, there is nothing wrong with keeping a ceiling fan on low, or blowing a breeze in the direction of the amp, to help it dissipate heat. As long as you have left room all around the amp, so it's body can dump the heat into the room, you should be good to go.


----------



## Trapper32

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want to know this, too. 

 Is this normal with all tube amps, maybe? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Been listening to mine for a few hours tonite and its barely warm....


----------



## nismohks

one thing i noticed when my resistor was blown was that the unit didnt get anywhere near its normal operating temperature. in fact it became just moderately luke warm...


----------



## vvanrij

It gets hot, but I can still touch it.


----------



## nismohks

i got a reply from David.

 What he said was that i may have an earlier revision of the circuit board which contains differently rated resistors and that i am missing some extra filtering capacitors which are included in a newer design.

 He gave me several options including replacing the resistors with 5W versions (?) of the 150k and 180k Ohm resistors which can be purchased and repaired locally.

 the other option would be to send it back to factory where they will upgrade the circuit board and resistors etc. All i gotta do is pay for the shipping both ways.

 What do you guys think i should do?


----------



## glitch39

so which components is the chassis serving as a heatsink to? looking at some pics, the components are mounted on PCB - i doubt those would be it as the PCB would also heat up and burn up the traces in the process. 

 Tubes? but the bases are isolated from the chassis.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nismohks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i got a reply from David.

 What he said was that i may have an earlier revision of the circuit board which contains differently rated resistors and that i am missing some extra filtering capacitors which are included in a newer design.

 He gave me several options including replacing the resistors with 5W versions (?) of the 150k and 180k Ohm resistors which can be purchased and repaired locally.

 the other option would be to send it back to factory where they will upgrade the circuit board and resistors etc. All i gotta do is pay for the shipping both ways.

 What do you guys think i should do?_

 

If your budget is tight, then the local fix might be the least expensive.
 I have to say though, if the shipping doesn't bother you, getting the latest board and components installed sounds very tempting! If you consider your MKIVse to be a keeper, then send it in. I think I would do this (if shipping wasn't a problem).


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *glitch39* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so which components is the chassis serving as a heatsink to? looking at some pics, the components are mounted on PCB - i doubt those would be it as the PCB would also heat up and burn up the traces in the process. 

 Tubes? but the bases are isolated from the chassis._

 

Ow, I caused confusion. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My bad.

 Heat from all the components and some from the tubes and some from the transformer (via transference), is trapped inside the unit. The aluminum case helps transfer this trapped heat to the outside. Only the transformer and the board are directly bolted to the case (thank goodness).


----------



## nismohks

yer ill most probably be sending the unit back in.

 he says there are new filtering caps as well as the updated resistors so taht will help in the long run i guess  the labour and parts costs will be free as well! so all i gotta do is pay for shipping both ways... which is probably like $100US i THINK....


----------



## kevinvisionm

hey guys, i just ordered my 3 days today. David sent me the reference guide. I have a few things i'm not sure. They talked about the Gain Control. What does it do? I have the Sen Hd650, what gain should i put 10, 5,4,3? Also I have the AV Reciever Onkyo TX-NR 801 which has the preamp output. Can i connect them to my mkivse? does it damge the amp? Will it improve sound quality?


----------



## Danika k

Has anyone tried the LM Ericsson 403B tubes?


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kevinvisionm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hey guys, i just ordered my 3 days today. David sent me the reference guide. I have a few things i'm not sure. They talked about the Gain Control. What does it do? I have the Sen Hd650, what gain should i put 10, 5,4,3? Also I have the AV Reciever Onkyo TX-NR 801 which has the preamp output. Can i connect them to my mkivse? does it damge the amp? Will it improve sound quality?_

 

Hi KV,

 The gain control is for adjusting the amp to your headphones. In the case of the HD-650's, a gain of 10 is usually used.

 The best way to hook up your MKIVse to the receiver, is by using one of the tape loops. Let's say Tape 2. REC OUT would go to the input of the MKIVse, and the PLAY would go to the output of the MKIVse.

 This will allow you to listen to any source connected to the receiver, with the MKIVse, and it will also allow you to listen to speakers, with any source playing, and the MKIVse adding a "tubed" sound to it, if you want, by monitoring Tape 2.


----------



## kevinvisionm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi KV,

 The gain control is for adjusting the amp to your headphones. In the case of the HD-650's, a gain of 10 is usually used.

 The best way to hook up your MKIVse to the receiver, is by using one of the tape loops. Let's say Tape 2. REC OUT would go to the input of the MKIVse, and the PLAY would go to the output of the MKIVse.

 This will allow you to listen to any source connected to the receiver, with the MKIVse, and it will also allow you to listen to speakers, with any source playing, and the MKIVse adding a "tubed" sound to it, if you want, by monitoring Tape 2. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 thanks Penchum, i thought the output of mkivse is only function for preamp which i dont need. My reciever got the preamp output so i would use it as preamp and then connect to input of the mkivse. I'm sorry but i do'nt get the part where you said rec OUt and Play. Can't i just use the preamp from my reciever instead of the the REc you said? Thanks Penchum again


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kevinvisionm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_thanks Penchum, i thought the output of mkivse is only function for preamp which i dont need. My reciever got the preamp output so i would use it as preamp and then connect to input of the mkivse. I'm sorry but i do'nt get the part where you said rec OUt and Play. Can't i just use the preamp from my reciever instead of the the REc you said? Thanks Penchum again_

 

The input on the MKIVse is meant for line level signals. The output is variable with the volume knob, so it can act as a pre-amp for a separate amplifier, if needed.

 On your receiver, look to see if it has Tape 1 and Tape 2 selections. If it does, and you look at the rear of the unit, you'll find the REC OUT and PLAY RCA jacks there.

 I don't know of anyone who is using the receiver's pre-outs to the input of the MKIVse. It would be like having 2 pre-amps, when only one is necessary.

 The idea of using the tape loop, has advantages. One, the REC OUT signal is a line level signal, which you would have going to the input of the MKIVse. Two, the MKIVse's output would be going to the PLAY or input of the receiver. All you would have to do is turn the MKIVse's volume knob up far enough, to match the level of the other "line level" sources you have hooked up to the receiver. If you listen to speakers at all (I'm assuming you do), you can select a source on the receiver, and press to monitor Tape 2, and you will get the sources signal enhanced by the MKIVse, and hear it over your speakers. If you want to listen with headphones to any of those sources with the MKIVse, you would select the source, and plug your headphones into the MKIVse, and turn up it's volume. Very easy and simple to do. This is worth trying, if your receiver has the tape loop(s).


----------



## kevinvisionm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Penchum* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The input on the MKIVse is meant for line level signals. The output is variable with the volume knob, so it can act as a pre-amp for a separate amplifier, if needed.

 On your receiver, look to see if it has Tape 1 and Tape 2 selections. If it does, and you look at the rear of the unit, you'll find the REC OUT and PLAY RCA jacks there.

 I don't know of anyone who is using the receiver's pre-outs to the input of the MKIVse. It would be like having 2 pre-amps, when only one is necessary.

 The idea of using the tape loop, has advantages. One, the REC OUT signal is a line level signal, which you would have going to the input of the MKIVse. Two, the MKIVse's output would be going to the PLAY or input of the receiver. All you would have to do is turn the MKIVse's volume knob up far enough, to match the level of the other "line level" sources you have hooked up to the receiver. If you listen to speakers at all (I'm assuming you do), you can select a source on the receiver, and press to monitor Tape 2, and you will get the sources signal enhanced by the MKIVse, and hear it over your speakers. If you want to listen with headphones to any of those sources with the MKIVse, you would select the source, and plug your headphones into the MKIVse, and turn up it's volume. Very easy and simple to do. This is worth trying, if your receiver has the tape loop(s). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Cool, i get it now. thanks very much


----------



## nismohks

so i just received my repaired mkivse yesterday, and one of the things i noticed was that this unit does not get as hot as my previous unit!

 without too much testing, this newer unit only gets lukewarm at best, whereas my previous unit got quite warm to the touch!


----------



## yossi126

Do you guys think the SE is still available?


----------



## yossi126

Well, Still available as i just bought one!
 Great service from David!
 Mind the people who are wondering, only a very few pairs of 6H30PI tubes left so IV SE is soon to be sold out.


----------



## sinisterm

MMmmm, makes me want to get one... NOW... I guess it is time for my MKIII to give space for his big brother.


----------



## nismohks

how is the mkivse with the akg k701?

 i want to get a k701 but was wondering how this amp handles the low impedance k701


----------



## apatN

Count me in the MKIV SE camp! This things sounds great and is a big improvement over my akai amp. 
 Can anyone perhaps email me the user manual? Also, I need to go in a few minutes. All the switches should be put to off with my 250OHM DT880, right?


----------



## apatN

Okay, so I got the manual. I'm a bit hesitant to change the gain switches. I believe it's now set at a gain of 10. Should I leave it there or put it to gain 5 for my DT880s?


----------



## say3true

Hello to all,

 Some months ago I purchased a Little MKIVse from the classifieds here. I love the sound of the amp, the price/performance ratio is, for my ears, terrrific.

 However--

 When I first got the amp, a crackling/hissing appeared in a short time in the right channel. Got on the Little Dot website. Was advised by David from Little Dot that I could send it back, they would transfer warranty coverage and fix it for me. 

 This was evidently an earlier MKIVse which needed a redesigned circuit board to fix varying voltages from the power tubes.

 Got the amp back, settled in to listen. A week or two later it started to crackle again. This time I reversed position of the power tubes and it appeared that I had a bad power tube (6H30PI). Ordered a pair of Sovteks and installed. In a short time, the amp started to crackle again, I reversed the power tubes again and thought I must have gotten a bad tube. So I just bought another one and the crackling might have improved, but is still there.

 Maybe I am slow to catch on as to what the real problem is. Should I just ditch this amp? I DON'T want to spend another $100+ to ship it back to China for another fix. It sounds great (other than the crackling) but my patience is running out....

 Thanks for any help.


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Try a pair of the higher quality Electro Harmonix 6H30Pi. You can find it on ebay at Yen Audio's store.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Clean the pins on the driver tubes ? They are NOS tubes and may need some pin lovin' 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Peete.


----------



## say3true

I appreciate the suggestions on the Little Dot. The noise in the right channel has actually diminished quite a lot since I posted about the problem--I hear a faint crackle occasionally now. I have left the amp on for the last several days after putting in the new Sovtek 6H30PI on the right side, thinking that further burn-in might settle down some of the noise. Maybe that's happened to some extent.

 Will try cleaning the driver tube pins as suggested. Busy work hours and will try to do that later tonight or tomorrow afternoon when I get home. Will report on that. If that doesn't make a difference I'll consider upgrading the power tubes to the Electro-Harmonix gold pin 6H30PI.

 A point of note though, or a question. I read a post by Kevin Deal at Audio Asylum, I think, in which he stated that the Electro-Harmonix Gold Pin 6H30PI is identical to the Sovtek 6H30PI, with the exception of the better gold pins. So, I am not sure if the gold pins are that important in resolving the noise in the Little Dot. ??


----------



## eboy2003

Can anyone recently bought MK IV or SE check whether your board have Dale resistors, Mallory and Solen capacitors as advertised? I bought a MK IV (non-SE) version three weeks ago, and found the board is full of normal 5-band resistors, and use Rubycon instead of Mallory, even worse, the output capacitor is Phoenix instead of Solen. I checked with David before making the purchase and he is saying the MK IV and SE uses the exactly same board and internal components, only differences are tubes and RCA connectors and phone jacks. A little bit disappointed...


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *say3true* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I appreciate the suggestions on the Little Dot. The noise in the right channel has actually diminished quite a lot since I posted about the problem--I hear a faint crackle occasionally now. I have left the amp on for the last several days after putting in the new Sovtek 6H30PI on the right side, thinking that further burn-in might settle down some of the noise. Maybe that's happened to some extent.

 Will try cleaning the driver tube pins as suggested. Busy work hours and will try to do that later tonight or tomorrow afternoon when I get home. Will report on that. If that doesn't make a difference I'll consider upgrading the power tubes to the Electro-Harmonix gold pin 6H30PI.

 A point of note though, or a question. I read a post by Kevin Deal at Audio Asylum, I think, in which he stated that the Electro-Harmonix Gold Pin 6H30PI is identical to the Sovtek 6H30PI, with the exception of the better gold pins. So, I am not sure if the gold pins are that important in resolving the noise in the Little Dot. ??_

 

Hey S3T,

 Sorry to hear you are having difficulties! It looks like (and I hope) things are working out better now. That statement from KD isn't entirely the whole story on those 6H30PI tubes. The "gold" tubes are supposed to have better tolerances internally, and the gold pins to make sure you get to hear the difference. The other side of this is, the 6H30PI-NOS's were made in the 1970's usually, and many argue that they are superior because of this.

 My testing has shown me that there is an SQ difference between all the models, so that can be important. The gold ones have one big problem though, which is a higher failure rate. I would recommend getting a matched set from Yen Audio (I had to do this too) and clean the pins prior to installing them. They will need at least 45 hours to mature, but a good set will behave themselves during that time.

 Earlier in this thread, there are pictures of three resistors located at the very back of the mainboard, with one of them toasted big time. As a last resort, please check your three resistors by carefully removing the back plate and looking with a flashlight. I hope they are ok, but if not, LD knows exactly what caused this and can help you get back on your feet.

 I hope this helps some!!


----------



## Bozz_Keren

yesterday i have this crackling noise through left channel, is my tube going to go out or the pin is dirty?


----------



## say3true

Just an update. I haven't heard more noise.

 I cleaned the pins on the driver tubes. 

 Will keep listening....


----------



## eboy2003

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *eboy2003* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can anyone recently bought MK IV or SE check whether your board have Dale resistors, Mallory and Solen capacitors as advertised? I bought a MK IV (non-SE) version three weeks ago, and found the board is full of normal 5-band resistors, and use Rubycon instead of Mallory, even worse, the output capacitor is Phoenix instead of Solen. I checked with David before making the purchase and he is saying the MK IV and SE uses the exactly same board and internal components, only differences are tubes and RCA connectors and phone jacks. A little bit disappointed..._

 

Just confirmed with David and Mr Yang the non-SE MK IV uses less hi-fi quality components (resistors and capacitors) on board. This is not mentioned anywhere in their description. I did not purchase the SE version because I have a big collection of tubes from tube rolling on my MK III. Now I'm regretted for not getting SE. Probably will have to do all component upgrades myself now...


----------



## Bozz_Keren

@eboy2003
 IMO MKIV is the base for modding, why spend another $100 for tubes and better components when you can mod them yourself with half the price
 i'm looking forward to modding them when i got the chance


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *eboy2003* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just confirmed with David and Mr Yang the non-SE MK IV even uses less hi-fi quality components (resistors and capacitors) on board. This is not mentioned anywhere in their description. I did not purchase the SE version because I have a big collection of tubes from tube rolling on my MK III. Now I'm regretted for not getting SE. Probably will have to do all component upgrades myself now..._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bozz_Keren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_@eboy2003
 IMO MKIV is the base for modding, why spend another $100 for tubes and better components when you can mod them yourself with half the price
 i'm looking forward to modding them when i got the chance_

 

WOW! That is new news to me! That has to be a recent change, because some folks with the standard MKIV have posted pics, and their internals look just like the MKIVse's did (a few months back).

 BK is right on the modding idea, since you have the MKIV in hand. Sorry it had to be you to find this out, but I'm glad you have quickly shared it here! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One of my many backlogged projects, is to do a simple cost effective upgrade to my MKIVse. Replace a few caps, and bypass those and others with PIO Russian caps. PP has helped me figure out which ones are the "biggest bang for the buck" on this project, so I have all the parts here, waiting for it's turn on the work bench. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 When completed, matured and tested properly, I'll be posting a DIY review of the project, so others can take advantage of the same ideas.


----------



## eboy2003

I am not blaming Little Dot, with USD:RMB exchange rate dropping to 6.8 comparing to 7.3 a year ago, the manufacture will have to cut some cost if they choose not to raise the item price here in US. I will upgrade all caps and resistors myself to have better matched pairs anyway.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *eboy2003* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am not blaming Little Dot, with USD:RMB exchange rate dropping to 6.8 comparing to 7.3 a year ago, the manufacture will have to cut some cost if they choose not to raise the item price here in US. I will upgrade all caps and resistors myself to have better matched pairs anyway. _

 

Good points.....we often forget economic realities dictate certain decisions. In many instances the difference between a premium cap and it's lesser cost sibling is very little in the overall scheme of things. Although top shelf parts are a difference maker, the real keys are further DIY mods such as those you've outlined plus a few tricks I use to great effect (cost wise these tricks and tips are relatively cheap with an aural reward out of all proportion to money spent).

 Most of the cost of amps is R&D, labor and chassis......something most consumers don't really take into account when inspecting the contents.....LD has managed to stuff their low cost offerings with a pretty fair selection of quality parts. It's admirable to see that in a budget offering.

 Peete.


----------



## eboy2003

Just report the story of my continuing mod for MK IV. 

 MK IV uses unregulated AC for 6H30Pi heater, so put a resistor of 1 - 1.2ohm in series is absolutely necessary if you are using 110V AC version but your AC is actually 120V. For 6AK5 heater, it uses a 7805 + 2 IN4001 on the ground to regulate output about 6.1V. This design is fine, unfortunately the 7805 heatsink is just way too small to handle ~400ma heater current from 2 6AK5. It's so hot to touch and doom to fail in long run. The heatsink is also uninsulated and just about 1mm to touch the pin 1 of 6H30Pi. FYI Pin 1 is the plate for one of the triode section of 6h30 that carries ~200V, if the heatsink (7805 ground pin) ever touches it, you will see fireworks...

 I have changed the 7805 and two 1N4001 circuit to LT1084 with 169ohm and 681ohm resistor, and 10uf tant Cadj, which outputs about 6.25V with 400ma load. You can also use LM317 or lower current LT1086/LT1085 with the same resistor value to do the job. The nice thing of LT1084/LT1085/LT1086/LM317 is their pin out is reversed comparing to 7805, well not exact reverse, you will have to alternate Vout and Adj pin to fit the board's trace. But this orientation allows you installing a big heatsink towards outside of the board. MK IV case is quite roomy, a big heatsink can easily fit.

 OK, now pictures:





 See how small the original heatsink is...
 The picture also shows a bunch of other resistors and capacitors I have changed. My original MK IV non-SE version uses less quality components than SE version. Also installed a switch instead of the jumper pins for EF92/EF95 selection. The 2.2uf capacitor is removed/shorted, this is the coupling cap between volume pot and 6AK5. It's not necessary if your source device already has an output coupling capacitor to block DC. And taking the lesson of my MK III, I changed the 150ohm cathode and plate resistors to 2W ones.





 The reverse side.


----------



## punk_guy182

Man that is some serious modding that you are doing.
 Eveer thought of making your own amps and compete with Little Dot?


----------



## eboy2003

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *punk_guy182* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Eveer thought of making your own amps and compete with Little Dot?_

 

No, I think use MK IV as the base to mod and improve sound quality is much better and fun. For DIY projects, chassis and transformer is not easy to get quality like Little Dot.

 MK IV basically uses MJ circuit similar to this, just a few resistor value changes for 6AK5 and 6H30.

 So far I have changed:

 1. Added 1.2ohm/3W resistor on 6H30Pi heater (absolutely necessary)
 2. Replaced 150ohm/1W plate and cathode resistor to 2W ones (highly recommended)
 3. Replaced 7805 + 2 x 1N4001 for 6AK5 heater to LT1084 w/ bigger heatsink (recommended)
 4. Changed 1000uf/35V and 220uf/25v 7805 power filter cap to panasonic FM (stock was UCC KYZ, probably OK quality)
 5. Changed all 1/4w resistors to good quality dale, irc, and m/e ones, with hand matched on left/right channel. The only 4 left (2x 220K, 100K) near the dip switch are for lower impedance headphones, which I don't have to change. (not necessary if you already have IV SE)
 6. Replaced the EF92 selection jumper to good quality switch.
 7. Replaced the cathode capacitor 220uf/16V UCC SMH to Elna Silmic II 220uf/25V.
 8. Shorted the input coupling capacitor 2.2uf MKP.

 Next I will try to play with power filter caps (3 x 470uf/250V, 2 x 0.047uf) and output capacitor (2 x 330uf/200v, 2 x 2.2uf WIMA MKS4, 2 x 0.22uf) and the feedback capacitor 0.47uf/250v between 6H30 upper and lower section after my 6H30-DR and Silmic II caps burn in. The output cap probably will be the most bang of bucks. Ultimately I probably will build an external power supply or internal regulated power supply for 200V.


----------



## punk_guy182

THat is a lot of modding and your remarks are very interetsint but I'm curious as how SQ has improved with the changes you have made.


----------



## Nidhogg22

Would DT-990 Pro 250ohms be a good idea with this amp?


----------



## kevinvisionm

hello guys, my replacement amp just have been great but i feel it's a bit unbalanced. the sound on the right is a bit louder than the left. is anything i can do to help? thanks


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kevinvisionm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hello guys, my replacement amp just have been great but i feel it's a bit unbalanced. the sound on the right is a bit louder than the left. is anything i can do to help? thanks_

 

Try swapping the driver tubes first, and see if the imbalance moves with the tubes. If not, then swap the power tubes (large in back) and see if the imbalance moves with them. It usually isn't a big thing. The tubes will need 45 hours to mature, and sometimes the imbalance will go away once they are mature.


----------



## Penchum

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nidhogg22* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Would DT-990 Pro 250ohms be a good idea with this amp?_

 

Hey Nid,

 I noticed that you were also looking at the MKV. Both amps should work well with your headphones. The question of the day is, "Do I want tube sound or Solid State sound?" There is a bunch of reading on HeadFi, that will help you decided which is more in line with your tastes.

 If you read my reviews closely, they will give you a good starting point for your research into this. I suffer (or enjoy) both platforms, so I have both.


----------



## Alfisti

Seen a few people mentioning a crackling coming out of one chanel or the other. I had a similar problem a few months back. Crackling, moved the tubes around which made the issue better or worse to varying degrees depending on what tube was where. Talked to David, cleaned the tubes off...

 ...plugged the tubes back in, started them warming and about 30secs in the whole thing went pop. As in quite litterally pop: sound, acrid smoke, hissing, the whole schomozzle. Needless to say I turned it off and unplugged with a quickness.

 Long story short it's gone back to Little Dot. Don't know what's wrong with it yet (shipping mixup, no-one's fault), but there's a replacement coming. 

 Have to mention: David at LD's been absolutely fantastic with the whole thing. Couldn't be more helpful if he tried.


----------



## punk_guy182

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kevinvisionm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hello guys, my replacement amp just have been great but i feel it's a bit unbalanced. the sound on the right is a bit louder than the left. is anything i can do to help? thanks_

 

I am having the same problem since I received it last summer. I'm suspecting the power tubes to be at fault but I'm not 100% sure. I'm guessing the internal components of the AMP are responsible for sound imbalancement. I'll wait for a price drops on those Russian Supertubes and I'll know for sure if the power power tubes were at fault or not.


----------



## hombretranquilo

_*Another port over the gain settings...*_ with AKG K701

 I read to owners who have their AKG K701 with the Little Dot IV gain settings to _minimum_, while others have fixed it a 10 ... David (from Little Dot) has recommended me to put the gain as low as possible so that my listening level was between _"10 and 14 hours" _at the potenciometer.

 Well, if I put the gain to a minimum (as it comes from factory), my level of listening to my 701 is located on the 12 o'clock of the potentiometer ... but several users talk that a higher gain give more "punch" to the sound

 What's your recommendation and / or experience with the *gain settings and AKG 701*? 
 Thank you


----------



## oldson

sorry guys if you have covered this, but this is a long thread to treck through.
 can you tell me if this amp would pump enough power to drive my ath-a900 cans (40 ohm), without it having to be at full volume, all the time?
 many thanks

 my ldmkv is great but i just fancy a tube amp!!


----------



## SoundCheck88

Hello ,Audiophiles.!Had to comment on the LD -MK IV -a great work of art.!!That knob completes the amp.Just Beautiful.i have a question when i purchase the Little Dot SE-IV what conections will i need to use with my PC.?My PC sound better than my Apple I-POD or my I-PHONE.Thank You in advance .Take care .George.


----------



## closdubois

Penchum,
 You have been helpful to me before on headfi.org. , informing me about the Zero with Lawrence's upgrades and then advising when I experienced some power failure issues with the Zero.

 Anyway, if I could ask you for some additional advice, I want to buy a LD MK IVse but don't know that I can connect it in the system I want to use it in. Currently, I have my cd player connected to an Onix/Melody SP3 integrated tube amp. Since the Little Dot only has analogue inputs I'm wondering if I can go from my cd player to the Little Dot and then out of the Little Dot and into the integrated amp? Or will this damage the int. amp?

 Thanks for your time and expertise,


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can improve the sound greatly by swapping those M8100's for GE Five Star, Amperex 5654 or 6Zh1P-EV tubes.

 I would rate Amperex's and those russian tubes above the GE's._

 

I think the Amperex is warmer than the GE 5 Stars and the 6ZH1P-EV's which is good if you listen to music where bass is important like rock and hip hop. Sometimes I feel like the 6ZH1P-EV is a bit too analytical with Grados.


----------



## HK_sends

Hey Penchum! Its been a while.
 So is my MK IV SE still a good choice of full size amps? Or is there anything to upstage it?

 Still in stock tubes,
 -HK sends


----------



## SilverShadow

Penchum,
 Thanks for an exellent review! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 This review is actually the thing that made me choose the MKIV(normal, not SE) over the other amps I was considering as my first amp. After ~100 hours of burn-in it sure seems very good for the price. I just picked up AKG K701s from a local hi-fi shop a few hours ago. Based on a couple of hours of listening this rig, it sounds like it has much to offer after the K701s get their necessary ~300 hours of burn-in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One thing in the review caught my attention, though. You were using a Zero DAC for most the review, right? That's pretty much in the same league with my E-MU (see sig). Neither of them are considered exactly high-end... I'm *very* happy with my rig as it is, but if I choose to become even happier with it in the future, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I might consider uprading my DAC.

 So, if choose to get a new DAC sometime in the (very distant) future, would a better DAC like for example, Stello DA100 go to waste with the MKIV? Where is the point where the MKIV itself would become a bottleneck in the system?

 Hmm... Just got a new amp and 'phones and asking guestions about a DAC upgrade already.... I'm starting to see the forum slogan in a whole new light. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, thanks everyone, for contributing to the discussion and helping us noobs enjoy music at its best!


----------



## MatthewK

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hombretranquilo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I read to owners who have their AKG K701 with the Little Dot IV gain settings to minimum, while others have fixed it a 10 ... David (from Little Dot) has recommended me to put the gain as low as possible so that my listening level was between "10 and 14 hours" at the potenciometer.

 Well, if I put the gain to a minimum (as it comes from factory), my level of listening to my 701 is located on the 12 o'clock of the potentiometer ... but several users talk that a higher gain give more "punch" to the sound_

 

When I received my MK IV SE I immediately set the gain to 3 (lowest setting) because I wanted the highest quality sound possible. I didn't mind having to turn the volume knob quite a distance to get acceptable volume to my HD650's. However, I was disappointed with the bass performance. Bass that my MK V could easily handle was getting really distorted and flabby.

 After a while it really started to get to me. I wanted better bass performance. So I contacted David about the issue. As always he responded very quickly. It only took two messages for him to figure out the issue. The gain needed to be set to 10 for my HD650's. I was always under the impression that it was just for volume, but apparently it can have a huge impact on things like bass.

 So I set the gain to 10, turned everything on including my Aphex 204 for bass enhancement, and ... whoa! HUMONGOUS DIFFERENCE! No more distortion, very powerful bass, and the mids and highs sounded better too. This was just my experience, so of course YMMV with different 'phones.


----------



## jontti

So is there a big diffrence betwen the MK IV SE and the regular MK IV? I'm new to this and I don't have an amp ( I don't even have the phones yet (AKG 701)) yet but I'm considering the MK III/IV/IV SE. So do you think it is worth paying the +100$ for the SE?


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jontti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So is there a big diffrence betwen the MK IV SE and the regular MK IV? I'm new to this and I don't have an amp ( I don't even have the phones yet (AKG 701)) yet but I'm considering the MK III/IV/IV SE. So do you think it is worth paying the +100$ for the SE?_

 

I'd advice you to consider the fact that the biggest difference between SE and non-SE are the tubes, and since both amps use the same tube families, you could tube roll the non-SE with the SE stock tubes anytime and have the exactly same sound as the SE.

 Okay, the SE version does come with longer warrancy (2 years) and premium connectors. If these differences matter, go for the SE. If not, go for the non-SE and use the extra cash to buy some tubes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I would have gotten the SE myself if I had had the money.

 Heh, I feel kinda stupid answering a fellow Finn in English, but it'd probably be a bit impolite to use a language 99,9% of the people reading this thread wouldn't understand. And besides, I have no idea if your mother tonque is Finnish or Swedish. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: I just realized you have your home city visible in your profile - in Finnish.


----------



## Seba

Let's make this a Finnish conversation in English... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I had the MKIV SE for almost a year and was very happy with it. The general consensus over here thinks that the best bang-for-the-buck Little Dot is the MKIII.

 Oh, and if you buy a Little Dot amp, I have good tubes I could sell you because I don't have a tube amp anymore.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, and if you buy a Little Dot amp, I have good tubes I could sell you because I don't have a tube amp anymore._

 

Seba, what tubes do you have? It's probably pointless for me to start tube rolling before I burn in my K701s for at least 300 hours but after that I could definitely think of getting some new tubes.

 I know this post was primarily intended for jontti, but I can't help taking the opportunity. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 jontti, it seems like you'd better PM Seba and snatch the best tubes before I make up my mind about wheter to save my money to buy a new DAC in the future, or to buy new tubes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 Edit: When I wrote my first post to jontti I was going to advice jontti to forget the MKIII but I forgot the whole thing then. IMHO, K701s deserve a good amp and would probably go to waste using 'the second-best alternative' like the MKIII. Seems like our opinions differ here, Seba.


----------



## jontti

I don't think I'll buy any tubes soon, I won't put any more money into this system for now, maybe in a couple of months i will start doing some changes


----------



## Seba

PM sent to both of you.

 I was first considering MKIII but then lunacy striked and decided to go for the best, MKIV SE. It's up to your own budget what you want to buy.


----------



## nigeljames

Is nobody concerned about the reliability of these amps?
 So many people on these threads have had problems with reliability with Little Dot amps (although a fair few are tube related and not the amp itself) that I seriously hesitate purchasing one myself. I have a GS Solo and have no problems with reliability and do not expect any. I am interested in a tube amp but the Little Dots seem far to unreliable to me given the posts on this site. Are all tube amps at around this price prone to failiure?


----------



## Dept_of_Alchemy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nigeljames* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is nobody concerned about the reliability of these amps?
 So many people on these threads have had problems with reliability with Little Dot amps (although a fair few are tube related and not the amp itself) that I seriously hesitate purchasing one myself. I have a GS Solo and have no problems with reliability and do not expect any. I am interested in a tube amp but the Little Dots seem far to unreliable to me given the posts on this site. Are all tube amps at around this price prone to failiure?_

 

Not sure where you're getting this information from. I would check to see if the people making these claims actually own or had owned an LD in the past. Most of the time it seems to me those claims are made by people as a way to push their own favorite brand of amps. That said, as someone who follows LD threads, as far as I can remember I've actually never heard of a reliability complaint of the new Mk series of amps other than the occasional tube hiss, which are always resolved quickly by LD.

 To be fair, LD did put out one product that had a systemic problem with flashing tubes (LD II+), but that product was discontinued a long time ago and there's in fact been THREE generations of new LD amps since the LD II+. Refer to this thread (http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/lis...t-amps-355789/) for more details on the flash problem.

 - DoA


----------



## Trapper32

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nigeljames* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is nobody concerned about the reliability of these amps?
 So many people on these threads have had problems with reliability with Little Dot amps (although a fair few are tube related and not the amp itself) that I seriously hesitate purchasing one myself. I have a GS Solo and have no problems with reliability and do not expect any. I am interested in a tube amp but the Little Dots seem far to unreliable to me given the posts on this site. Are all tube amps at around this price prone to failiure?_

 


 Are you sure you're talking about Little Dot and not the Zero?? If indeed you're talking about Little Dot, what exactly are the reliability problems you've read about... From what I've read and experienced, Little Dot has one of the best customer relations around...


----------



## nigeljames

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dept_of_Alchemy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Not sure where you're getting this information from. I would check to see if the people making these claims actually own or had owned an LD in the past. Most of the time it seems to me those claims are made by people as a way to push their own favorite brand of amps. That said, as someone who follows LD threads, as far as I can remember I've actually never heard of a reliability complaint of the new Mk series of amps other than the occasional tube hiss, which are always resolved quickly by LD.

 To be fair, LD did put out one product that had a systemic problem with flashing tubes (LD II+), but that product was discontinued a long time ago and there's in fact been THREE generations of new LD amps since the LD II+. Refer to this thread (http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/lis...t-amps-355789/) for more details on the flash problem.

 - DoA_

 

My info does come from this site and other reviews of LD amps. If you read the various threads on this site alone I think you will see quite a few people who have or have had LD amps have had problems with reliability. Even if you discount tube related issues its still to many for my liking especially when the amps have to shipped back to China at the owners expense to be fixed. I have no concerns that the LD customer service is not top class but I would prefer poor customer service that I would never need to use! I remember one post, can't remember what site it was on, where his amp (MkIII or MkIV) had a part that burnt out. He took the back off to find the part and then sent pictures to LD who replied that either the wrong part was used or he had been given an older motherboard design that they no longer use! He was then told he could have it repaired easily himself or send it to LD to have the motherboard replaced but would have to pay postage both ways!! Maybe LD should give a 2 year warrenty as standard. I wanted to buy a tube amp to complement my SS amp and after looking at the reviews I was set to buy a MkIV but the more I looked the more this problems reared their heads. If they were made in UK I probably would of gone ahead anyway but made in China means more problems if anything does go wrong.


----------



## MatthewK

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nigeljames* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is nobody concerned about the reliability of these amps? ..._

 

I used to own the Little Dot MK V and now I own the Little Dot MK IV SE. I've had no hardware related issues at all with either one. Customer service is absolutely top notch, I can't think of any other company that matches my experiences with Little Dot's customer service (David). He always answers very promptly and accurately.


----------



## atomiccow

At nigeljames:

 Sounds just like my problem which I posted here:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/any...iii-iv-375469/
 and here:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/adv...37/index3.html

 I agree entirely with you that unused bad customer service is better than used good customer service lol. I must have exchanged 20 or 30 emails with David when I had this problem. Sure he replied me promptly, almost instantly, but in the end his answer did not change: try to fix it yourself or ship it to us with no shipping compensation. The same for my previous DOA Darkvoice Figaro. I exchanged many promptly replied emails with Jasmine but in the end her answer was also the same: ship it back to us for refund with no shipping compensation. 

 A lot of people rave about the great Littledot and Darkvoice service because they are 'nice.' I agree that they are nice to talk to (as in polite) but in the end they must follow the business model of the companies they work for, neither of which I think care for he reliability of their products.

 At Dept_of_Alchemy:

 Look on the Little-Tube forum. Theres plenty enough problem posts there lol. Also, as I recall, a bunch of LD MK IVs were recalled due to volume drop issues which resulted from some resistors degrading after a period of time, posted here:
Viewing a thread - Little Dot MK IV SE Owners: Volume drop issues
 I believe this shows a lack of proper testing after changes are made to the design of their amps.


----------



## nigeljames

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *atomiccow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_At nigeljames:

 Sounds just like my problem which I posted here:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/any...iii-iv-375469/
 and here:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/adv...37/index3.html

 I agree entirely with you that unused bad customer service is better than used good customer service lol. I must have exchanged 20 or 30 emails with David when I had this problem. Sure he replied me promptly, almost instantly, but in the end his answer did not change: try to fix it yourself or ship it to us with no shipping compensation. The same for my previous DOA Darkvoice Figaro. I exchanged many promptly replied emails with Jasmine but in the end her answer was also the same: ship it back to us for refund with no shipping compensation. 

 A lot of people rave about the great Littledot and Darkvoice service because they are 'nice.' I agree that they are nice to talk to (as in polite) but in the end they must follow the business model of the companies they work for, neither of which I think care for he reliability of their products.

 At Dept_of_Alchemy:

 Look on the Little-Tube forum. Theres plenty enough problem posts there lol. Also, as I recall, a bunch of LD MK IVs were recalled due to volume drop issues which resulted from some resistors degrading after a period of time, posted here:
Viewing a thread - Little Dot MK IV SE Owners: Volume drop issues
 I believe this shows a lack of proper testing after changes are made to the design of their amps._

 

Exactly makes you wonder what they actually do at the 24-48 hour QC stage. Maybe they just power them up and hope they don't explode!!
 Its a shame as they sound like good amps (when working). As I said before they should increase the warrenty to 2 years (excluding tubes) but they probably do not have enough confidence in their own amps to do that. It looks like if I decide to buy a tube amp I will need to examine the WooAudio amps instead.


----------



## nigeljames

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MatthewK* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I used to own the Little Dot MK V and now I own the Little Dot MK IV SE. I've had no hardware related issues at all with either one. Customer service is absolutely top notch, I can't think of any other company that matches my experiences with Little Dot's customer service (David). He always answers very promptly and accurately._

 

I am pleased that you have had only good experiences with LD amps but I think if you view a number of treads on this site alone you will see an abnormal number of reliability issues raise their heads. I would be grateful for your opinions of the Mk V and Mk IV sound wise. I have a GS Solo and HD650 with Equinox cable and K701 headphones and I am looking for an alternative amp( not a replacement, I love my Solo) and thought I would give a tube amp a try, never heard one before and like the tube tolling options. However I do listen to Rock/Metal primarily and wonder how a tube amp would go with this compared to a SS amp. Your thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Nigel and Cow......


 The problem with this thinking is...if this amp was made in the UK it would cost 3-5 times what is does coming from China....so in reality are you really saving anything by buying locally made stuff ? I can say without a doubt you'll not get a tube amp built like this in UK for 400US...no way.

 The beauty with tube amps is they are relatively easy to repair, the LD stuff is very straight forward with quality pcbs and good parts 90 % of the time. Unforeseen lots of bad parts get through when you are buying them by the 1000's which I bet they are. It's a matter of the supplier not making sure the parts they sell to the builder being up to snuff. This happens all over the world to all makers of amps, and other gadgets and is not confined to just Chinese made gear. If you check your warranty with most brand name gear they require you pay for the shipping to their service department with no refund of that cost...that is standard practice. You are confusing retailer policy with manufacturer policy. LD sell factory direct and pass the savings onto the customer.

 Peete.


----------



## atomiccow

At Pricklely Peete:

 Chinese made products and Chinese designed products are two different things. I don't think LD's low reliability is a result of them being made in China, its a result of them being designed and built by a company that is run in China. As I've posted before, the ethical standards the Chinese run their corporations on is different from those of American, British, Japanese, etc companies.

  Quote:


 The beauty with tube amps is they are relatively easy to repair, the LD stuff is very straight forward with quality pcbs and good parts 90 % of the time. Unforeseen lots of bad parts get through when you are buying them by the 1000's which I bet they are. It's a matter of the supplier not making sure the parts they sell to the builder being up to snuff. 
 

If 10% of all electronic components were defective, we would have a big problem.. lol. What would happen if 10% of all resistors made were bad? Given that most electronics contain hundreds of resistors and that resistors aren't individually checked before being used, our electronics would be falling apart left and right. Its not a fault of the components manufacturing but how these components are used in the amp design. They fail due to being used under conditions they are not rated for. 

 Well either that or you're implying LD uses especially low quality components that really do have a 10% chance of being defective.

  Quote:


 You are confusing retailer policy with manufacturer policy. LD sell factory direct and pass the savings onto the customer. 
 

I am not confusing the two. I'm saying many people here probably note LD's great service due to interactions between them and David, who is a plenty nice guy to talk to, but might not reflect the views of his company. I only wish whoever is in charge of LD's quality control be as caring for their customers as David is. A good man retailing a bad product is still retailing a bad product. People shouldn't confuse great customer service with a great quality product.


----------



## nigeljames

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pricklely Peete* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nigel and Cow......


 The problem with this thinking is...if this amp was made in the UK it would cost 3-5 times what is does coming from China....so in reality are you really saving anything by buying locally made stuff ? I can say without a doubt you'll not get a tube amp built like this in UK for 400US...no way.

 The beauty with tube amps is they are relatively easy to repair, the LD stuff is very straight forward with quality pcbs and good parts 90 % of the time. Unforeseen lots of bad parts get through when you are buying them by the 1000's which I bet they are. It's a matter of the supplier not making sure the parts they sell to the builder being up to snuff. This happens all over the world to all makers of amps, and other gadgets and is not confined to just Chinese made gear. If you check your warranty with most brand name gear they require you pay for the shipping to their service department with no refund of that cost...that is standard practice. You are confusing retailer policy with manufacturer policy. LD sell factory direct and pass the savings onto the customer.

 Peete._

 

Maybe the parts they are buying in the first place are not of a good enough quality. European companies buy parts in the thousands as well with fewer quality or reliability issues. I don't doubt that a european products are generally more expensive than those from the far east so you have to ask yourself why. Cheaper parts, cheaper labour and lower quality of that labour are the 3 main reasons for this. If these companies payed wages similar to european wages and bought the same parts at the same prices they would have to charge a similar amount for the goods. This all brings me back to the simple fact that generally Chinese electronincs are made to a lower standard and with cheaper parts but at a much lower price. You say that LD stuff is simple and easy to repair well that maybe so but as a consumer I would want to use it and not have to repair it! (even if I knew how to) or send it to be repaired thousands of miles away at my expense.


----------



## baronbeehive

Hi, this is my first post as a newbee and I wanted some advice about tubes. The sound of the mk iv se is fantastic but with my audio technica ath ad2000's I would like a little more detail to go with they tuby sound. Penchum in his review mentioned the 5687 WB Phillips and the 5687 WB Tong-Sol as being detailed and dynamic but with my latest version of the little dot what equivalents are there. I hope this post would help other later little dot owners as well


----------



## SilverShadow

Oh, we were talking about power tubes here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Should have read more carefully... Nevermind then.


----------



## shotmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *baronbeehive* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Penchum in his review mentioned the 5687 WB Phillips and the 5687 WB Tong-Sol as being detailed and dynamic but with my latest version of the little dot what equivalents are there. I hope this post would help other later little dot owners as well_

 

If your MKIVse came with the 6H30PI power tube you cannot use the 5687 type of tube. However, if it came with the Mullard E182cc, then you can use the 5687, 7119, 7044, 6n6p, 6900 tubes. As for equivalents of the 6H30PI, I have no idea, mine came with the E182cc.


----------



## baronbeehive

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shotmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If your MKIVse came with the 6H30PI power tube you cannot use the 5687 type of tube. However, if it came with the Mullard E182cc, then you can use the 5687, 7119, 7044, 6n6p, 6900 tubes. As for equivalents of the 6H30PI, I have no idea, mine came with the E182cc._

 

Yes mine is the recent 6H30PI variant and I'm looking for a 5687 equivalent to bring out slightly more detail and dynamic range, fingers crossed this se thread is the place to look!


----------



## shotmaker

Since you cannot use the 5687 and its equivalent in your amp, I recommend you to check for driver tubes that are more detailed, like the National 403B, the LM Ericsson 403B and the Tung-sol 6AK5.


----------



## cswann1

I think shotmaker is right. Driver tube rolling should be the place to start. I don't remember who said it (probably Penchum) that the driver/power tube impact on overall sound is 85%/15%.


----------



## Vandal

Penchum; how does the LD MK IV SE do with lower impedance cans? Because I'm considering a tube amp but it has to do well with both the HD 650 and my SR225/A900 combo which are much lower impedance. Have you done any such testing? Know anyone who has?

 Does the gain switch really help shuffling between high/low impedance cans?


----------



## kds5000

Hi everyone. 

 This is also my first post in Head-fi. I've been enjoying my stock LD MK IV SE for 2 months now and can no longer resist the itch to start tube-rolling. My SE is the version with CV4010 (Mullard M8100) driver tubes and 6H30PI power tubes, and it's a little frustrating for me because the tube-rolling database on this thread is mainly for the other SE version. I wonder if someone here can start with Penchum's tube recommendations and suggest the equivalent for my SE version? I'm sure other tube-rolling newbies here with the 6H30PI SE will appreciate this as well.

 More specifically, I would like a recommendation to bring the mids forward in my SE. As smooth and sultry as my SE sounds, the one thing that bothers me is that the mids (especially female vocals) seem to be a couple of paces behind the instruments. In this respect, the much more forward vocal presentation of my Heed CanAmp is preferred. Can anyone here help with a tube recommendation that will suit my specific needs? Please remember that I have the 6H30PI version and wouldn't know the equivalent if you recommend tubes for the other version.

 Thanks for your time and look forward to your help.


----------



## Seba

CV4010 are probably the darkest sounding tubes...

 GE 5-stars are a bit too bright for Grado's IMO
 Amperex 5654 or russian 6Zh1P-EV are good and clear sounding driver tubes.


----------



## kds5000

Thanks for your suggestions Seba. 

 Guess I'll probably try the Amperex 5654 tubes first then. However, I see the following 5654 tubes mentioned in my SE Reference Guide: "5654, CK5654, GL5654" - I don't suppose they're the same tubes? Are they just different brands, or different types?


----------



## baronbeehive

Appreciate that shotmaker and Cswann1. If the 85%/15% split is right then it looks like I have a good chance of finding a tong sol equivalent sound mentioned by Penchum that will give the clarity I'm looking for but using driver tubes.

 I agree with kds5000 about the smooth nature of the ld mids but have the opposite problem with my audio technica cans which have the vocals right next to your ears which is quite exciting. What is needed is to disentangle everything that is going on in the mids clearly. If I can achieve this then I may have succeeded in matching the sound of the ld mk v but with the advantage of being kinder on lossy files such as 320 mp3's.

 Will let you know if anything transpires from this.


----------



## GuruSY

Ok, I had a thought to get a 2nd PA2V2 amplifier, and thought to myself: "I wonder if their is something slightly better out now". I came to head-fi, after research I decided on a LDIII, and just now I impulse purchased a LD MKIV (non-SE though). 







 @ my wallet head-fi!!!










 [size=xx-small]I can't wait to get it now though lol.[/size]


----------



## intoart

Now that I am switching from 80-Ohm phones (perfect for my I+, which is designed for low impedance) to 250-Ohm phones, I am considering going from a hybrid to a pure tube amp.
 At nearly 3X the price of the I+, would the MKIV SE be a correspondingly huge upgrade?


----------



## yossi126

NO.
 Tubes aren't for a huge difference in these price tags.


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Now that I am switching from 80-Ohm phones (perfect for my I+, which is designed for low impedance) to 250-Ohm phones, I am considering going from a hybrid to a pure tube amp.
 At nearly 3X the price of the I+, would the MKIV SE be a correspondingly huge upgrade?_

 

For Grado's MKIV SE makes a way better sound than I+ despite the fact that MKIV SE gives "only" 100mW of power compared to I+'s 800mW. Bass may be a wee bit of less powerful but everything else in the sound are miles ahead the I+.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For Grado's MKIV SE makes a way better sound than I+ despite the fact that MKIV SE gives "only" 100mW of power compared to I+'s 800mW. Bass may be a wee bit of less powerful but everything else in the sound are miles ahead the I+._

 

LD I+ is designed primarily for portable use, right? That alone should mean that there's a significant difference in sound, correct? I don't have personal experience on LD I+ but I do have a MKIV. I can't possibly imagine that a portable amp could come even close to MKIV in terms of sq.

 Would it be a huge upgrade? Someone wiser with more experience better chime in here, but I do think it indeed would.

 BTW, which 250-ohm 'phones are you switching to?


----------



## SilverShadow

Whoops, double post. This is the first time this happened to me, actually.


----------



## mbd2884

LD 1+ is a desktop amp. Would be damn hard to transport a tube amp also, how would you prevent the tube from breaking? That and it needs a sufficient power source.

 Its just a hybrid amp is all, not a true tube amp.


----------



## kds5000

Seba,

 I'm thinking of getting either the RS-1 or MS-Pro to pair with my MkIV SE (CV 4010 version). What are your thoughts on both? 

 My listening preferences are very similar to yours i.e. predominantly Rock, Metal, Electronica / Trance.

 Many thanks.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mbd2884* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LD 1+ is a desktop amp._

 

Oh, thanks for the info. I stand corrected.


----------



## intoart

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SilverShadow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_BTW, which 250-ohm 'phones are you switching to?_

 

I have switched from the 80 Ohm Beyer DT770 Pros to the DT150s. I love them so far, and am interested in anything that will improve the sound even further.
 At this point, I think I will probably buy a MKIV SE when I get my tax return (Unless, for exactly the same price, a Cambridge DAC Magic would give me a bigger audible improvement?)


----------



## Seba

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kds5000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Seba,

 I'm thinking of getting either the RS-1 or MS-Pro to pair with my MkIV SE (CV 4010 version). What are your thoughts on both? 

 My listening preferences are very similar to yours i.e. predominantly Rock, Metal, Electronica / Trance.

 Many thanks._

 

I preferred the MS-Pro's much more because of their improved clarity compared to RS-1's. MKIV SE warms up the sound just a bit and it was perfect for my ears. If you like the MS-1's from your MKIV SE you will love the MS-Pro's.

 I suggest you buy MS-Pro's and get RS-1's for a loan somewhere and compare them. I think you can sell MS-Pro's much easier than RS-1 because they are more rare phones and doesn't show up in FS threads that often.


----------



## kds5000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Seba* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I preferred the MS-Pro's much more because of their improved clarity compared to RS-1's. MKIV SE warms up the sound just a bit and it was perfect for my ears. If you like the MS-1's from your MKIV SE you will love the MS-Pro's.

 I suggest you buy MS-Pro's and get RS-1's for a loan somewhere and compare them. I think you can sell MS-Pro's much easier than RS-1 because they are more rare phones and doesn't show up in FS threads that often._

 

Thanks Seba.

 You're right in that it's the MS-1 that got me thinking of going all the way to the MS-Pro. But having read the threads and reviews at Head-Fi, I thought that the RS-1's coloration might suit my music with the MKIV SE more. 

 I'll definitely audition both first before buying, but many thanks your frank views on the two so that I know what to look out for.

 I do hope I prefer the MS-Pro though, because they're probably cheaper over here. A popular local shop sells it as a bundle for a great price - not sure if it'll let me swap the MS-Pro for the RS-1.


----------



## Possede

Hello,
 I was wondering if I purchased the Little Dot MK IV, if I could replace the generic (Neutrik looking 1/4" connector) with the genuine Neutrik Connector? Would it be difficult to do this? Are they the same size? Is the 1/4" jack connected to the PCB using wires? 

 Any input is appreciated.


----------



## GuruSY

Sorry I have a newbie question. Tried to use the forum search and google but couldn't find my answer. I'm sure this has been asked before. I (will) have a MKIV non-SE.

 I want to try some Mullard M8161's. When I go on ebay I notice that their are many different markings like:

  Quote:


 CV4015 M8161 EF92 9D6 MULLARD QDD PRINTED "6065 CV4015 KB/QDD" 
 

and 

  Quote:


 CV4015 M8161 EF92 9D6 MULLARD KQDD/K PRINTED "CV4015 KQDD/K" 
 

and others.

 Are they all compatible with the MKIV as long as they say EF92 and M8161? What do these cryptic markings such as K##/## and CV#### mean?


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GuruSY* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Are they call compatible with the MKIV as long as they say EF92 and M8161? What do these cryptic markings such as K##/## and CV#### mean?_

 

I'm an amateur myself but I'll try to forward to you what I've read here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Apparently guite a few (only western?) tubes have a bunch of different designations even though it's really the same tube type. Now, to my knowledge EF92 is the general designation used for the tube family, M8161 is a (british only?) military designation for (only Mullard?) EF92 tubes. CV4015 is Mullard's own designation for the particular product for civilian market(where reliability and overall quality were not as important as in military use...).
 Well, okay, civilian market CV4015 were probably the same tubes as the military ones. Most Mullards on the market seem to be military branded tubes anyway, though. Even if the product name says only CV4015 it's probably exactly the same as military M8161. So, M8161 and CV4015 mean Mullard-made EF92 family tubes.

 I have no idea about that K##/## marking, though. Well, someone with more experience and knowledge will probably help us with that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One more thing: does anyone know if there is a Soviet/Russian NOS equvalent to EF92?


----------



## GuruSY

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SilverShadow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm an amateur myself but I'll try to forward to you what I've read here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Apparently guite a few (only western?) tubes have a bunch of different designations even though it's really the same tube type. Now, to my knowledge EF92 is the general designation used for the tube family, M8161 is a (british only?) military designation for (only Mullard?) EF92 tubes. CV4015 is Mullard's own designation for the particular product for civilian market(where reliability and overall quality were not as important as in military use...).
 Well, okay, civilian market CV4015 were probably the same tubes as the military ones. Most Mullards on the market seem to be military branded tubes anyway, though. Even if the product name says only CV4015 it's probably exactly the same as military M8161. So, M8161 and CV4015 mean Mullard-made EF92 family tubes.

 I have no idea about that K##/## marking, though. Well, someone with more experience and knowledge will probably help us with that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 One more thing: does anyone know if there is a Soviet/Russian NOS equvalent to EF92?_

 

Thank you for the info. So it is safe to say that this tube will work with the MKIV, being that the CV marking sounds like a marketing number more than a technical description.


----------



## SilverShadow

^^
 Well, the CV marking is just as technical as the military designation but yes, those tubes will work if they are what the seller says (which is the case 99.5% of the time).

 If you prefer to play it safe, wait for someone with more knowledge to comment on this.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

First off, I just wanted to say thanks to everyone on this thread who has helped guide me in purchasing a Little Dot MK IV SE. It was head-fi that originally convinced me to buy the Little Dot II++ a couple years ago!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've started tube rolling already, and I just bought the 6N30-DR supertubes after everyone's glowing (pun?) reviews of it. However, An Audiogon user selling these tubes at $179 each (youch!) is saying that the 4-digit code on the front is the manufactured date (seems about right), but also that "It may be tempting to opt for the lower priced 6H30's or even the newest versions of them but don't believe anyone who instructs you that doing so will give you the same sound quality. This tube is light years above the 6H30P-EB or EV versions or the recent nearly exact 6H30P without the diamond etching that are being passed off as early production tubes." Here's the link for reference: 
AudiogoN ForSale: Reflektor 6h30 6h30dr 6h30n-dp modwright

 So this is where it gets a little interesting. These are the tubes that I purchased: 6N30P-DR = 6H30Pi-DR USSR 2 tubes TESTED NOS + sockets - eBay (item 330291648649 end time Mar-03-09 11:39:34 PST)

 Have I been duped into buying fake or "inferior" tubes? If I follow the date stamp guidelines, this picture would mean that these tubes were made either in 02/2009 or 09/2002. I feel like these would still be the same tubes since they came from the Reflektor plant, though. 

 What do people think about this?


----------



## yossi126

Seems like a keeper!
 I'd get that if i had the bucks


----------



## cswann1

My MKIVse was shipped from China on the sixth of Feb. It arrived at my house yesterday, the ninth. Now that was fast!! All the comments about David Zhe's and Little Tubes customer service being first rate are certainly true from my own experience.

 I've been listening for about an hour and a half now with my K701's. The gain settings are at the lowest impedance setting, and I have to use the whole knob to really make it growl. I'm going to try the next highest gain setting since these AKG's really seem to act like a higher impedance can than the 62ohm rating would suggest.

 This is not my first experience with a tube amp, but it is my first one to own. I can tell the tubes are very new. They just have a bit of edge but the buttery-warm tube sound is very apparent. Me like
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 For now I have no plans to tube roll because I want to get very familiar with this amps sound over the next several months.

 I'll post again after a couple of weeks, when there is a 100 or so hours on these tubes.


----------



## intoart

I have been considering the MKIV as a possible upgrade from my I+ (and hoping it is enough better to justify the price!)

 I am concerned, however, about the unusual looking headphone jack (neutrik?) Is it compatable with the standard 1/4" plug on my phones?


----------



## wizia

Is it worth the difference ($200) between MKIII and MKIV SE? I'm still undecided.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have been considering the MKIV as a possible upgrade from my I+ (and hoping it is enough better to justify the price!)

 I am concerned, however, about the unusual looking headphone jack (neutrik?) Is it compatable with the standard 1/4" plug on my phones?_

 

I'd imagine the MKIV is quite a step upwards from I+. I haven't heard the I+ so I can't say anything for sure.

 The headphone jack is certainly compatable with any standard 1/4" connector. The jack is genuine Neutrik on MKIV SE and a similar looking no-name connector on MKIV.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *wizia* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is it worth the difference ($200) between MKIII and MKIV SE? I'm still undecided._

 

That's a tough call. And ultimately you are the only one qualified to make that decision. Penchum wrote a paragraph in his review (in the OP) that pretty well sums up his take on the MKIII-IV-IVse lineup. It's, of course, just an opinion of one guy, so you can put as much stock in it as you feel comfortable. 

 He seems to be a fan of Little Tube products, and there is nothing wrong with that (I am too), but you must consider any gear purchase as objectively as possible imo. 

 Personally: I thought the $200 was worth it. I don't want to buy a product and think, "It's nice, but would I be happier with the higher-end model". Of course the answer to that is almost always yes for me. Then it just comes down to, can I afford the additional cost. If I can, I do it. Is it twice the amp? No, but with almost anything audio, there are diminishing returns the higher in price you go.



*EDIT:* SilverShadow. I have a question for you. What gain setting do you use when you run your K701's through your MKIV? And does your amp run hot with this pairing? I've got mine on the gain setting of 10. I usually don't have to go past 12 o'clock on the volume knob but the amp gets very warm.


----------



## Rinshin

Long time lurker, first time poster here. After a lot of reading here, I decided to take the plunge and buy a Little-Dot. I went from thinking of a LD II.. to the III (which I was sure I was going to get), then I read this thread and decided on the MKIVse! Ouch to my wallet.

 I received my MKIVse from David a few days ago and just wanted to reiterate how great David was with customer service! I've been putting some hours on the amp and can't wait to hear what it sounds like after more maturing.


----------



## wizia

Thanks for your opinion cswann1, I will consider it.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rinshin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Long time lurker, first time poster here. After a lot of reading here, I decided to take the plunge and buy a Little-Dot. I went from thinking of a LD II.. to the III (which I was sure I was going to get), then I read this thread and decided on the MKIVse! Ouch to my wallet.

 I received my MKIVse from David a few days ago and just wanted to reiterate how great David was with customer service! I've been putting some hours on the amp and can't wait to hear what it sounds like after more maturing._

 

Welcome!! What took you so long?


----------



## intoart

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's a tough call. And ultimately you are the only one qualified to make that decision. Penchum wrote a paragraph in his review (in the OP) that pretty well sums up his take on the MKIII-IV-IVse lineup. It's, of course, just an opinion of one guy, so you can put as much stock in it as you feel comfortable. 

 He seems to be a fan of Little Tube products, and there is nothing wrong with that (I am too), but you must consider any gear purchase as objectively as possible imo. 

 Personally: I thought the $200 was worth it. I don't want to buy a product and think, "It's nice, but would I be happier with the higher-end model". Of course the answer to that is almost always yes for me. Then it just comes down to, can I afford the additional cost. If I can, I do it. Is it twice the amp? No, but with almost anything audio, there are diminishing returns the higher in price you go.



*EDIT:* SilverShadow. I have a question for you. What gain setting do you use when you run your K701's through your MKIV? And does your amp run hot with this pairing? I've got mine on the gain setting of 10. I usually don't have to go past 12 o'clock on the volume knob but the amp gets very warm._

 


 If I were to buy the MKIII, I would probably end up buying the MKIV SE later anyhow, and therefore spending the money twice. The I+ is good enough to satisfy me in the meantime. (I have ruled out the MKV and MKVI. The V is solid state, and my experience with the I+ has taught me that I prefer tubes. The VI is balanced, and that would require an expensive recable for my phones.)


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If I were to buy the MKIII, I would probably end up buying the MKIV SE later anyhow, and therefore spending the money twice. The I+ is good enough to satisfy me in the meantime. (I have ruled out the MKV and MKVI. The V is solid state, and my experience with the I+ has taught me that I prefer tubes. The VI is balanced, and that would require an expensive recable for my phones.)_

 

X2

 In fact, I'd probably buy MKIV SE instead of MKIV with the experience I have now gained. I thought that I can always buy better tubes later and the connectors don't matter. "Connectors can't possibly make a difference in overall (esp. sound) quality." Well, as it turns out, the plating on the connectors is slowly but steadily wearing off because of my overly tight Schulz cable's connectors. I have to move the amp and disconnect the cables every now and then. I bet things like that don't happen with Van Den Hull RCA jacks...

 Well, connectors could always be replaced later but IMO, overall, MKIV SE would be well worth the extra price. I agree totally with _cswann1_:
  Quote:


 I don't want to buy a product and think, "It's nice, but would I be happier with the higher-end model". 
 

 There's a Finnish proverb that fits in perfectly here. I'll do my best to translate it: "Poor man can't afford to buy cheap stuff". In the long run it's more economical to buy good products in the first place and save you from (some of) the money you'd otherwise have to spend on future upgrades.

*intoart*, if my memory serves, I have my MKIV set to lowest gain setting. But, my DAC has adjustable output power up to pro audio standard +4 dBu so I have set the output power to half the maximum. So, I have no idea if the signal level fed to my DAC is anywhere close to the typical -10 dBV cosumer line-level signal. All I can tell you is to experiment. K701s seem pretty sensive, so the defalt setting, max gain, is probably too high. Sorry I can't be of more help.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rinshin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Long time lurker, first time poster here. After a lot of reading here, I decided to take the plunge and buy a Little-Dot. I went from thinking of a LD II.. to the III (which I was sure I was going to get), then I read this thread and decided on the MKIVse! Ouch to my wallet.

 I received my MKIVse from David a few days ago and just wanted to reiterate how great David was with customer service! I've been putting some hours on the amp and can't wait to hear what it sounds like after more maturing._

 

Welcome to Head-Fi, and I urge you to take this seriously, you've apparently already seen what I mean: sorry for your wallet. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I myself was first just planning to get a cheap amp to get the best out of my K141 Studios. I was considering an LD II+, then MKIII... When I finally got the amp I listened to it for some minutes and thought: "I seriously need better headphones". And here I am, hoping to get some money to buy a new DAC in the next few months. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And X2 to your impessions of David's customer service. He sure is a great guy to do business with.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rinshin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Long time lurker, first time poster here. After a lot of reading here, I decided to take the plunge and buy a Little-Dot. I went from thinking of a LD II.. to the III (which I was sure I was going to get), then I read this thread and decided on the MKIVse! Ouch to my wallet.

 I received my MKIVse from David a few days ago and just wanted to reiterate how great David was with customer service! I've been putting some hours on the amp and can't wait to hear what it sounds like after more maturing._

 

Welcome! I haven't done much posting, but I plan on changing that soon myself!

 As a previous LD II++ owner, the first thing I noticed with the IV SE was the *HUGE *difference in power & presentation, and the forceful bass! Even though the MK IV SE comes with some nice stock tubes, I would recommend upgrading the driver tubes as soon as you can. There's nothing _wrong_ with the stock M8100s, but you'll notice some dramatic (IMO) changes in how the sound tightens up and sounds even more detailed, revealing, and natural. it certainly helps the focus of the imaging, too. As I'm sure you've noticed, the folks on this thread have done an *incredible *job of documenting all the types of tubes you can use, and the impact they'll have on the sound. I ending up buying the Russian Super Tubes (power tubes) b/c of everyone's opinions of them.

*Side Note:* IMO Those Super Tubes just _sound _cool, don't they? _"Originally manufactured for use in Soviet space and military operations, these tubes are hand selected for the utmost quality control"_ I love it


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SilverShadow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_X2

 In fact, I'd probably buy MKIV SE instead of MKIV with the experience I have now gained. I thought that I can always buy better tubes later and the connectors don't matter. "Connectors can't possibly make a difference in overall (esp. sound) quality." Well, as it turns out, the plating on the connectors is slowly but steadily wearing off because of my overly tight Schulz cable's connectors. I have to move the amp and disconnect the cables every now and then. I bet things like that don't happen with Van Den Hull RCA jacks...

 Well, connectors could always be replaced later but IMO, overall, MKIV SE would be well worth the extra price. I agree totally with cswann1:
 There's a Finnish proverb that fits in perfectly here. I'll do my best to translate it: "Poor man can't afford to buy cheap stuff". In the long run it's more economical to buy good products in the first place and save you from (some of) the money you'd otherwise have to spend on future upgrades._

 

*SilverShadow*: I heard that proverb for the first time last year, and it really is one of the most accurate things you can say! I've found that out the hard way, by buying a less expensive thing, realizing exactly _why_ it was cheaper, than only recouping some of the costs when upgrading to something else. I suppose what this hobby is all about some times, though... At least it's great for the experience and knowledge
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Also, in regards to your worn-down connectors. You may already know this, but I thought I would share this nice, cost-effective performance enhancer: cleaning the terminals and connectors with something (I use Kontac). If you've got worn looking terminals, then you've probably got all sorts of tiny particles of gunk and metal on the jacks and on the cable. By doing two cleans of both of those, you may find that the sound was either increased back to the performance it used to be (but you hadn't noticed the slowly declining quality b/c of the dirty jacks, or it opened up to sounds you never even heard before!


----------



## Rob T

Newbie here. How would the Little Dot MK IV compare with something like the Gilmore Lite? I know the latter is SS, but what about other differences, such as power output? The Gilmore Lite says it outputs 1 watt of power: HeadAmp - Audio Electronics (Gilmore Lite Headphone Amp)

 How does that compare with the MK IV, and how much difference will it make in sound quality?


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Newbie here. How would the Little Dot MK IV compare with something like the Gilmore Lite? I know the latter is SS, but what about other differences, such as power output? The Gilmore Lite says it outputs 1 watt of power: HeadAmp - Audio Electronics (Gilmore Lite Headphone Amp)

 How does that compare with the MK IV, and how much difference will it make in sound quality?_

 

The Little Dot MK IV outputs this for power:
 # 500 mW @ 300/600 ohm
 # 300 mW @ 120 ohm
 # 100 mW @ 32 ohm

 Remember that as a general rule, though, 4 solid state watts = 1 tube watt. 

 A concern with some tube head-amps vs solid state is that the bass/overall power is inferior. I can tell you from personal experience comparing the LD MK IV SE to a Creek OBH 21 SE Creek OBH 21 SE 800-229-0644 Creek OBH 21 SE Creek OBH 21 SE, the Little Dot wins hands down. The bass and power is even stronger than some of these higher end solid state head-amps, and you don't have to deal with over-analytical brightness that comes from CDs when you've got a tube amp. Hope this helps!


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Little Dot MK IV outputs this for power:
 # 500 mW @ 300/600 ohm
 # 300 mW @ 120 ohm
 # 100 mW @ 32 ohm_

 

This explains much to me. I've noticed that I really have to crank the volume knob to get a significant output to my K701's. There impedance is 62Ohms and have been told that pairing these cans with an OTL tube amp will yield mediocre results.

 I more or less agree with that. I really love the sound of this combo, but these headphones really seem to me like they'd shine more with a SS amp. I say this because when I plug them into the headphine jack of my Logitech PC speakers wired remote, I can go as loud as I want without going past 2 o'clock on the knob. It may not be a dedicated hp amp but it gives the power.

 J&R Music World has new HD650's for $319. I think I may get a pair to use with the LD. I've been considering building an M^3 or a single ended Beta 22 and I think the K701's would probably benefit more from either of these.

 Thoughts and opinions on any of this?? 

 Note: K701 haters please do not respond. I don't want to sound rude but it seems every time I mention these AKG's I end up trying in vain to defend them to someone who dislikes them.


----------



## GuruSY

My Little Dot MKIV just came in today. So far I am not impressed. The soundstage seems week, and I have the thing at about 70% which I think is too high for my HD580s (gain is set correct). Of course I have only been listening for 10 mins. And this is my first tube amp so I just might not be used to the sound.

 The manual says to clean the tube tips. I have de-oxidizer, but I'm not sure how to safely remove the small tubes with the metal grill thing in the way. Am I supposed to take that off first?


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GuruSY* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Little Dot MKIV just came in today. So far I am not impressed. The soundstage seems week, and I have the thing at about 70% which I think is too high for my HD580s (gain is set correct). Of course I have only been listening for 10 mins. And this is my first tube amp so I just might not be used to the sound.

 The manual says to clean the tube tips. I have de-oxidizer, but I'm not sure how to safely remove the small tubes with the metal grill thing in the way. Am I supposed to take that off first?_

 

That seems kind of odd... About getting in there, I would definitely recommend removing the tube grills before you do anything. They come off easily with a screwdriver. You may be able to get the power tubes off without removing it, but those driver tubes were in mine really tight, it would have been impossible without it.

 In regards to cleaning, make sure you do two rounds of cleaning! That second round helps quite a bit. Also, some people recommend round #1 using de-oxidizers; round #2 using a cleaner like Kontak. I only use cleaner, but that seems to work great for me if you use something as powerful as Kontak!


----------



## GuruSY

Yeah something is definitely wrong with this. I tried a Rammstein song instead of the Opera that I was initially listening to... it sounds horrible. The volume is fading in and out a bit, like I need to smack it to come in or something.

 I can't even hear the vocals in a 3rd song that I tried, even though the guitar and drums are loud!!! When I play it unamped the vocals are front and center!!

 Hopefully cleaning the pins will solve this otherwise I'm sending it back.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This explains much to me. I've noticed that I really have to crank the volume knob to get a significant output to my K701's. There impedance is 62Ohms and have been told that pairing these cans with an OTL tube amp will yield mediocre results._

 

Holy crap, I didn't realize the K701's impedance was 620 Ohms! You'll need your own nuclear power plant to run those things!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GuruSY* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah something is definitely wrong with this. I tried a Rammstein song instead of the Opera that I was initially listening to... it sounds horrible. The volume is fading in and out a bit, like I need to smack it to come in or something.

 I can't even hear the vocals in a 3rd song that I tried, even though the guitar and drums are loud!!! When I play it unamped the vocals are front and center!!

 Hopefully cleaning the pins will solve this otherwise I'm sending it back._

 

GuruSY, don't send it back, I beg you! David is absolutely phenomenal with assisting everyone, I'm sure he would be more than happy to replace it for you. When I bought my LD II++, I got a DOA unit that he not only replaced, but comped the shipping charges back to China. He's even fulfilled warranties on 2nd buyer units before. They're one in a million, I'm telling you!

 Sounds like more than dirty/bad tubes, though...


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Holy crap, I didn't realize the K701's impedance was 620 Ohms! You'll need your own nuclear power plant to run those things!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Not 620 Ohms, 62 Ohms 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I just got through listening to Nora Jones, Come Away with Me (the whole album) on the MKIVse and the K701's.

 OH MY GAWD!! On Painter Song, I could almost feel her breath on my skin. This is one of the most phenomenal recordings I've ever heard from a technical standpoint, but this amp, even with the stock tubes (not fully burned in I might add) makes listening this album a truly moving experience.


----------



## GuruSY

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_GuruSY, don't send it back, I beg you! David is absolutely phenomenal with assisting everyone, I'm sure he would be more than happy to replace it for you. When I bought my LD II++, I got a DOA unit that he not only replaced, but comped the shipping charges back to China. He's even fulfilled warranties on 2nd buyer units before. They're one in a million, I'm telling you!

 Sounds like more than dirty/bad tubes, though..._

 

Yeah I pulled out a power tube and it was perfectly clean. Then I pulled out a little driver tube... the pins look like they were dipped in tar lol. I'm betting once I clean these real good I'll be fine. Sorry for being a tube amp noob!

 I'll report back if this fixes it.


----------



## Rob T

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Little Dot MK IV outputs this for power:
 # 500 mW @ 300/600 ohm
 # 300 mW @ 120 ohm
 # 100 mW @ 32 ohm

 Remember that as a general rule, though, 4 solid state watts = 1 tube watt. 

 A concern with some tube head-amps vs solid state is that the bass/overall power is inferior. I can tell you from personal experience comparing the LD MK IV SE to a Creek OBH 21 SE Creek OBH 21 SE 800-229-0644 Creek OBH 21 SE Creek OBH 21 SE, the Little Dot wins hands down. The bass and power is even stronger than some of these higher end solid state head-amps, and you don't have to deal with over-analytical brightness that comes from CDs when you've got a tube amp. Hope this helps!_

 

Yes, it helps and I appreciate the response. Yet, you also certainly raised more questions too! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 "4 solid state watts = 1 tube watt". Really? Like I said, I am a newbie, but why is this exactly? So watts are not created equal? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This explains much to me. I've noticed that I really have to crank the volume knob to get a significant output to my K701's. There impedance is 62Ohms and have been told that pairing these cans with an OTL tube amp will yield mediocre results.

 I more or less agree with that. I really love the sound of this combo, but these headphones really seem to me like they'd shine more with a SS amp. I say this because when I plug them into the headphine jack of my Logitech PC speakers wired remote, I can go as loud as I want without going past 2 o'clock on the knob. It may not be a dedicated hp amp but it gives the power.

 J&R Music World has new HD650's for $319. I think I may get a pair to use with the LD. I've been considering building an M^3 or a single ended Beta 22 and I think the K701's would probably benefit more from either of these.

 Thoughts and opinions on any of this?? 

 Note: K701 haters please do not respond. I don't want to sound rude but it seems every time I mention these AKG's I end up trying in vain to defend them to someone who dislikes them._

 

We are in a similar boat, as I also have the K701's. I've only had them for a few days. Initial impressions are very positive overall. The detail and clarity is amazing. Very revealing, and the separation of instruments is impressive.

 Yet, I do feel that they are slightly on the harsh side at times. I'm hoping that they will warm up slightly once broken in. I'm currently using the built in headphone amp on my Anthem Statement D2, but I want another setup in my bedroom, where I will need an external headphone amp. 

 Why do you think that a SS amp would be better with the 701's? I was thinking something like the MKIV's would give them a little more warmth? But do they have enough power to push them? Or would something like the Gilmore Lite be better?


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Why do you think that a SS amp would be better with the 701's? I was thinking something like the MKIV's would give them a little more warmth? But do they have enough power to push them? Or would something like the Gilmore Lite be better?_

 

The MKIVse has the warmth alright. For acoustic, choral & string classical this amp/headphone combination is a very strong pair imo.

 I just put in disc 2 from Pink Floyd's, The Wall. It just seems like it's underpowered for this material to me. I'm listening to the same CD on my PC as I type this and the drum beats have more punch and the symbols have more brilliance.

 Although the Little Dot is only two days old I just don't see it making that drastic of an improvement as the tubes mature.

 I listened to my same K701's on Pete Millets Starving Student hybrid amp at the recent DFW meet and that thing really impressed me. The hybrid design uses tubes for the signal gain, but the power comes from SS components, as I understand it. So that's why I think that for a do-it-all headphone rig the K701's really need a SS or hybrid amp. 

 If I didn't want to crank up the rock sometimes, I could happily live with the MKIVse and K701 combo though.

 Edit: As to the harshness your hearing, I have a theory. The K701 puts your source under a microscope. Bad recordings that sounded Ok before will be revealed for what they are through these cans. I found out that much of my digital library is really sub-par after I got my AKG's.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Not 620 Ohms, 62 Ohms 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 ._

 

Oh boy, where did I learn to read? I'm a Sennheiser guy, so when I read that number, it didn't make me think "how is that possible? That can't be right."

 Thanks for the clarification!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, it helps and I appreciate the response. Yet, you also certainly raised more questions too! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 "4 solid state watts = 1 tube watt". Really? Like I said, I am a newbie, but why is this exactly? So watts are not created equal? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

OK, I can't claim these words as my own, but here's the reason:

 "Watts" is a mathematical calculation of power consumption, not a measure of loudness. Loudness is measured in "decibels". Though higher watts does certainly mean higher volume, the only actual way to compare the volume output of any two amps is to measure the decibels they produce, for each amp, or type of amp, may have a different "efficiency".

 It's just like the fact that light bulbs are described per wattage, but the brightness of light is actually measure in "lumens". That's why a the new compact fluorescent light bulb listed as 15w (power consumed) puts out the same light as an old style 60w incandescent bulb (950 lumens).


----------



## Rob T

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The MKIVse has the warmth alright. For acoustic, choral & string classical this amp/headphone combination is a very strong pair imo.

 I just put in disc 2 from Pink Floyd's, The Wall. It just seems like it's underpowered for this material to me. I'm listening to the same CD on my PC as I type this and the drum beats have more punch and the symbols have more brilliance.

 Although the Little Dot is only two days old I just don't see it making that drastic of an improvement as the tubes mature.

 I listened to my same K701's on Pete Millets Starving Student hybrid amp at the recent DFW meet and that thing really impressed me. The hybrid design uses tubes for the signal gain, but the power comes from SS components, as I understand it. So that's why I think that for a do-it-all headphone rig the K701's really need a SS or hybrid amp. 

 If I didn't want to crank up the rock sometimes, I could happily live with the MKIVse and K701 combo though.

 Edit: As to the harshness your hearing, I have a theory. The K701 puts your source under a microscope. Bad recordings that sounded Ok before will be revealed for what they are through these cans. I found out that much of my digital library is really sub-par after I got my AKG's._

 

Thanks for the response, it's nice to have someone with the same 'phones that I have using this amp. 

 At this early point in my head fi career, I would probably not want to go with a DIY type of amp like the Starving Student Hybrid. I need the confidence of buying something already fully built! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Any other recommendations for a pre-built hybrid?

 Also, I tend to agree with your theory about the 701's putting the music under a microscope. This can be a good thing with the very best recordings, but not so good for other stuff. I'm going to give them a chance though.


----------



## Rob T

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OK, I can't claim these words as my own, but here's the reason:

 "Watts" is a mathematical calculation of power consumption, not a measure of loudness. Loudness is measured in "decibels". Though higher watts does certainly mean higher volume, the only actual way to compare the volume output of any two amps is to measure the decibels they produce, for each amp, or type of amp, may have a different "efficiency".

 It's just like the fact that light bulbs are described per wattage, but the brightness of light is actually measure in "lumens". That's why a the new compact fluorescent light bulb listed as 15w (power consumed) puts out the same light as an old style 60w incandescent bulb (950 lumens)._

 

So is the MKIVse as "powerful" in terms of db's it will produce as the 1 watt Gilmore Lite, even though it only puts out about half the power?


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So is the MKIVse as "powerful" in terms of db's it will produce as the 1 watt Gilmore Lite, even though it only puts out about half the power?_

 

At 300 ohms it would technically be twice as powerful (500mw x 4 the output of a solid state watt = 2 watts), but I doubt that would line up directly with the "o'clock" reading of a volume knob.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 At this early point in my head fi career, I would probably not want to go with a DIY type of amp like the Starving Student Hybrid. I need the confidence of buying something already fully built! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Any other recommendations for a pre-built hybrid?_

 

It's odd but hybrids seem to be almost solely in the DYI realm. Pete Millet has several designs and offers them up to the public and asks nothing in return. Pretty cool I think.
 But I understand you wanting to get a good amp, that you know you can enjoy right away. 

 Penchum, writes a lot of reviews and I remember that he said the Little dot MKV had a tubey sound for a SS amp. So that may be something for you to look at more.

 Just now I was reading the Little Tube forums, and there are a few guys who relly like there K701/MKIVse combos. That's making me think that the line out from my Denon player is maybe just too low a signal. I'm going to do a little experimenting with my MKIVse and my PC and see if there is a big difference in gain. I may just need an outboard DAC in my signal chain.

 More toys!!


----------



## GuruSY

Well no dice on cleaning the pins. I'm going to have to email Dave. I do have new tubes coming in shortly so I will try those also.

 It sounds like a little kid randomly played with the EQ. Some frequencies sound loud, others don't... and the soundstage is like the music is being played in a closet. Very weird.


----------



## cswann1

The gain is about the same for the PC and the Denon. I still may get a DAC, although the Denon player I have has an extremely clean sound. The silence between songs is absolutely pitch black, and detail it brings is impressive. I'd really rather not have to mess with the signal path by introducing another component.

 GuruSY, I have very little experience with tubes personally, but I'm a PC tech and I troubleshoot for a living, and I just have a feeling that a faulty tube may be the problem with your amp. I guess I think that because it's sounds like common sense. Tubes are the most fragile part of the amp and the most likely to suffer trauma during shipping.
 I really hope that's all it is. Rest assured David will do all he can to help, but I hope you don't have to pay to ship back to China and then wait a while.


----------



## GuruSY

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The gain is about the same for the PC and the Denon. I still may get a DAC, although the Denon player I have has an extremely clean sound. The silence between songs is absolutely pitch black, and detail it brings is impressive. I'd really rather not have to mess with the signal path by introducing another component.

 GuruSY, I have very little experience with tubes personally, but I'm a PC tech and I troubleshoot for a living, and I just have a feeling that a faulty tube may be the problem with your amp. I guess I think that because it's sounds like common sense. Tubes are the most fragile part of the amp and the most likely to suffer trauma during shipping.
 I really hope that's all it is. Rest assured David will do all he can to help, but I hope you don't have to pay to ship back to China and then wait a while._

 


 Yeah being that it was an EQ problem, it had to be the tubes. But good news! It appears that all of the taking the tubes in and out removed enough of the oxidation that it sounds perfect now! This thing is rocking now!


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GuruSY* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah being that it was an EQ problem, it had to be the tubes. But good news! It appears that all of the taking the tubes in and out removed enough of the oxidation that it sounds perfect now! This thing is rocking now!_

 

Fantastic!!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GuruSY* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah being that it was an EQ problem, it had to be the tubes. But good news! It appears that all of the taking the tubes in and out removed enough of the oxidation that it sounds perfect now! This thing is rocking now!_

 

Hey, great!


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Also, in regards to your worn-down connectors. You may already know this, but I thought I would share this nice, cost-effective performance enhancer: cleaning the terminals and connectors with something (I use Kontac). If you've got worn looking terminals, then you've probably got all sorts of tiny particles of gunk and metal on the jacks and on the cable. By doing two cleans of both of those, you may find that the sound was either increased back to the performance it used to be (but you hadn't noticed the slowly declining quality b/c of the dirty jacks, or it opened up to sounds you never even heard before!_

 

Well, the connectors aren't degrading the sound quality _yet_. Or at least I haven't heard anything like that. I'll probably try cleaning them nevertheless. (The classic audiophile "what if...?"-thinking 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) Well, I'd better do it just for mechanical reasons. If they keep wearing down for some months/years, the connectors may end up being loose with anything less tight than these (pretty darn tight) Deltron Emcon connectors used on Schulz cables. Thanks for reminding me of this option. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I was actually considering replacing the connectors with Van Den Hull RCAs but I realized I don't have the skill to solder the cables reliably enough.


----------



## intoart

I am actually beginning to lean more toward the MKIII. The only differences I can see between it and the MKIV are the connectors, the jack, and the cages around the tubes. None of these seem like they would have much impact on SQ.
 Besides, after reading the paragraph cited above, I think I fall into the "looking for the best bang/buck" category.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am actually beginning to lean more toward the MKIII. The only differences I can see between it and the MKIV are the connectors, the jack, and the cages around the tubes. None of these seem like they would have much impact on SQ.
 Besides, after reading the paragraph cited above, I think I fall into the "looking for the best bang/buck" category._

 

Don't forget though: the MK IV SE also has an ALPS-27 potentiometer, those *HUGE *Mallory caps, and also I believe higher model Rubycons. Take a look at the pictures of the two boards, you can see the differences between the two. Those insides, along with the external differences (jacks/tube cage (kind of a waste, I've put dampeners on mine anyways)/tubes) make up the difference, and I think it was worth it to step up to it. It's your call, though!

 LD MK IV SE






 LD MV III


----------



## kds5000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've noticed that I really have to crank the volume knob to get a significant output to my K701's. There impedance is 62Ohms and have been told that pairing these cans with an OTL tube amp will yield mediocre results.

 I more or less agree with that. I really love the sound of this combo, but these headphones really seem to me like they'd shine more with a SS amp. I say this because when I plug them into the headphine jack of my Logitech PC speakers wired remote, I can go as loud as I want without going past 2 o'clock on the knob. It may not be a dedicated hp amp but it gives the power.

 Thoughts and opinions on any of this??_

 

I run my K702 through either my MKIV SE or Heed CanAmp (SS) and I prefer the sound through the SE. You are of course aware that the CanAmp is the amp most recommended on Head-Fi for the K701/702, so it's not as if I had paired it with an unsuitable SS amp.

 To me, the K702 just sounds warmer and smoother through the SE than the CanAmp, especially with Jazz or Female Vocals. With the CanAmp, there is a graininess at the higher frequencies, although you do get more aggressive mids and a slightly heavier bass. Bottom line (as always), try your K701 through a compatible SS amp - you may just find that you prefer it with the SE... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh ya, as a reference (sort of), the gain setting on my SE is 10 (max) and I can't tolerate the volume past 10 o'clock on the knob when using the K702.

 As for the SE's heat, I had written to David of Little Tube and he said it's a class A amp so it dissipates alot of heat. Also, I read a post somewhere (quite likely the Little Tube Forums) by Sword Yang, the LD's designer, that the LD IV's temperature may reach 50 degrees Celsius. Bottom line, it should feel very warm to the touch, but not so much that you can't hold it while it's on...


----------



## intoart

Hmm. I didn't realize there were such large internal differences. Something to consider.
 It now becomes a matter of my ability to save instead of spending. I can afford a MKIII tomorrow. I would have to wait another _month_ before affording the MKIV SE!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm. I didn't realize there were such large internal differences. Something to consider.
 It now becomes a matter of my ability to save instead of spending. I can afford a MKIII tomorrow. I would have to wait another month before affording the MKIV SE!_

 

Oh the agony of having to wait... It really does burn. Let us know which way you decide!


----------



## intoart

A general question about the MKIV (this applies to the MKIII as well.):
 Can the outputs be used passively, to send an unmodified signal from my CD player to my integrated amp? I ask because I would love to be able to switch between headphone listening and speaker listening without disconnecting/reconnecting the interconnects every time (as I currently have to do with my I+.)


----------



## tescosamoa

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh the agony of having to wait... It really does burn. Let us know which way you decide!_

 

Wait the month. It will be worth it. And then down the road you will not have to justify with yourself why you have a mkiv and a mkivse on order.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A general question about the MKIV (this applies to the MKIII as well.):
 Can the outputs be used passively, to send an unmodified signal from my CD player to my integrated amp? I ask because I would love to be able to switch between headphone listening and speaker listening without disconnecting/reconnecting the interconnects every time (as I currently have to do with my I+.)_

 

I haven't tried it with my MK IV SE, but I do remember it working just fine with my LD II++ when I used to own a NAD cd player. Personally, I didn't like the unit as a pre-amp, but who knows what it would sound like with the MK IV!

 You should give it a try and let us know how it sounds, though!


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kds5000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 Oh ya, as a reference (sort of), the gain setting on my SE is 10 (max) and I can't tolerate the volume past 10 o'clock on the knob when using the K702.
_

 

Ok. I think there is something wrong with my SE. Aside from the heat, which is not really alarming as it takes a good half hour or more before it reaches it's warmest temperature, there are two other things.

 First, the chrome tops if the driver tubes turned a very dark color right away. The tops of the power tubes are still bright chrome.

 Second, there is a very small difference between the lowest and highest gain settings. Even with both jumpers set to ON for a setting of 10, unless I go to 12 o'clock on the dial, I can hardly hear the music. This is confirmed on two sources. I have to go to at least 3 o'clock to get any significant volume through my K701's. Slightly less (1-2 o'clock) for my Grado SR60's.

 I'm going to take a pic of the tubes and send it along with a description of these gain issues to David this evening. I'm hoping that a couple of new driver tubes will fix, what I now believe to be a problem with my amp.

  Quote:


 A general question about the MKIV (this applies to the MKIII as well.):
 Can the outputs be used passively, to send an unmodified signal from my CD player to my integrated amp? I ask because I would love to be able to switch between headphone listening and speaker listening without disconnecting/reconnecting the interconnects every time (as I currently have to do with my I+.) 
 

Penchum seemed to like the MKIVse as a preamp, but another option to consider is to buy, or make, some RCA splitters. That way you can just split the signal off and connect to two different devices without having to pass the signal through one to get to the other.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_First, the chrome tops if the driver tubes turned a very dark color right away. The tops of the power tubes are still bright chrome._

 

As far as I understand, that's a good sign. It means that the vacuum was solidified. if they never change color, then you've got a problem.
 I don't know how long it's supposed to take, but I assumed that it shouldn't take very long for this process to happen?


----------



## punk_guy182

My MK IV SE is a lot cooler since I tube rolled it with the Russian DR Supertubes and the Sylvania 5654 with round getters and black plates. I had to RMA mine last week because I noticed for a very long time a sound imbalancement towards the left channel.
 David told me that they would update it to the lastest version and circuitry.

 BTW, where is Penchum? I don't see him much often these days. Last time I heard of him is when he got back from the hospital. I hope he's alright. This guy helped me a lot with audio related questions.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As far as I understand, that's a good sign. It means that the vacuum was solidified. if they never change color, then you've got a problem.
 I don't know how long it's supposed to take, but I assumed that it shouldn't take very long for this process to happen?_

 

Well if the driver tubes change in color is normal, should I expect the same from the power tubes?

 If there was a problem with the power tubes, that would make sense. The amp sounds fine, musically, it's just that it seems weak. I wouldn't think I'd have to crank the volume knob so much to get a decent output, and kds5000 reports 10 o'clock on the knob is as loud as he can go with virtually the same headphone, given the same gain settings as I have.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well if the driver tubes change in color is normal, should I expect the same from the power tubes?

 If there was a problem with the power tubes, that would make sense. The amp sounds fine, musically, it's just that it seems weak. I wouldn't think I'd have to crank the volume knob so much to get a decent output, and kds5000 reports 10 o'clock on the knob is as loud as he can go with virtually the same headphone, given the same gain settings as I have._

 

You can assume that for every two years of a tube's age (if it's still new), it needs about 2 hours to utilize the getter and eliminate the contaminants (air included). If your power tube is a stock, new-production model, it should have completely sealed the vacuum and incinerated the contaminants (causing the coloration) by now, too. If it hasn't, you might assume that you've got leaky tubes!

 I've also heard that brand new tubes straight from the factory to your door need 6-8 hours, though.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *intoart* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm. I didn't realize there were such large internal differences. Something to consider._

 

Yeah, certainly! I was under the impression that the only differences between current production MKIV and MKIV SE were connectors and tubes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 In fact, during the email exchange with David when I bought my MKIV, he himself said that connectors and tubes are the main differences. His exact words copy pasted from the email: "_the main differences between the Little Dot MK IV and the SE version are the RCA jacks, the headphone jack, and upgraded tubes._" I do know that SEs from 2007 or so (for example the one Pench reviewed in this thread) have very different internals compared to normal MKIV. But, I was under the impression that MKIV and SE now use the same PCB and components as the cost of the original SE version's components became significantly higher circa 2007. All this is info picked up from this thread. Have I misunderstood something here or what? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 EDIT:

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...but I named the picture wrong accidentally. It's corrected now, thanks._

 

I thought it was something like this. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Okay, nevermind. Ignore this post.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can assume that for every two years of a tube's age (if it's still new), it needs about 2 hours to utilize the getter and eliminate the contaminants (air included). If your power tube is a stock, new-production model, it should have completely sealed the vacuum and incinerated the contaminants (causing the coloration) by now, too. If it hasn't, you might assume that you've got leaky tubes!

 I've also heard that brand new tubes straight from the factory to your door need 6-8 hours, though._

 


 Thanks very much for your help here. I'm going to email David now and explain my concerns and see what he says. There really should not be a need to send a picture. He seems like a pretty sharp guy


----------



## Max F

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SilverShadow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, certainly! I was under the impression that the only differences between current production MKIV and MKIV SE were connectors and tubes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 In fact, during the email exchange with David when I bought my MKIV, he himself said that connectors and tubes are the main differences. His exact words copy pasted from the email: "the main differences between the Little Dot MK IV and the SE version are the RCA jacks, the headphone jack, and upgraded tubes." I do know that SEs from 2007 or so (for example the one Pench reviewed in this thread) have very different internals compared to normal MKIV. But, I was under the impression that MKIV and SE now use the same PCB and components as the cost of the original SE version's components became significantly higher circa 2007. All this is info picked up from this thread. Have I misunderstood something here or what? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That picture is for the Little Dot III NOT the Little Dot IV. 

 From the Little Dot website:
 Please note that the photos shown are from both the Little Dot MK IV and the Little Dot MK IV SE. The appearance of both versions is virtually identical with only the following differences:


 SE version has label "Little Dot MK IV SE" instead of "Little Dot MK IV" on the front panel. 
 SE version has Neutrik-branded headphone jack 
 SE version has American CMC or Van Den Hul branded RCA jacks 
 SE version ships with different driver and power vacuum tubes


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Max F* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That picture is for the Little Dot III NOT the Little Dot IV. _

 

Thanks, Max! I was replying to intoart's question about the MK III, and I correctly describe the difference between the III & IV SE, but I named the picture wrong accidentally. It's corrected now, thanks!

 That could have stirred up quite a bit of confusion.


----------



## Rob T

I think I am more confused that ever!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think I am more confused that ever! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

What's confusing? I'm sure we could help sort it out for you.


----------



## Rob T

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What's confusing? I'm sure we could help sort it out for you._

 

Sorry, I was just making a general comment in terms of I have no idea which amp to go with at this point! 

 Using k701's, which I really like in terms of detail and instrument separation, but I find to be a tad harsh.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Rob T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry, I was just making a general comment in terms of I have no idea which amp to go with at this point! 

 Using k701's, which I really like in terms of detail and instrument separation, but I find to be a tad harsh._

 

Oh, gotcha! It's always so hard to decide... I think a lot of people on here have the same mentality about it, though: there's always the "what if" that will burn you until you break down and upgrade anyways, thus spending more money than you would have in the first place. Everyone's different, though!


----------



## Rob T

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, gotcha! It's always so hard to decide... I think a lot of people on here have the same mentality about it, though: there's always the "what if" that will burn you until you break down and upgrade anyways, thus spending more money than you would have in the first place. Everyone's different, though!_

 

I'm a pretty big believer in trying to do it right the first time, and buying it once! I hate buying the "cheap" alternative, to only turn around and sell it at a loss because of not being satisfied, then buying the more expensive (better) item later. It's obviously more expensive in the long run.

 That said, it is not so easy to do that in this hobby. You can't simply throw money at some headphones or amp and claim that you have the best. There are too many variables and personal preferences at play.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

On a side note, I've got 4 NOS Mullard M8100 CV4010 tubes that I'm not going to be needing. If anyone's looking to grab them from me, send me a PM! Not looking for much, either $20 for all 4 shipped or $10 for 2 shipped. I don't know if it's inappropriate to post them in this thread, so don't stone me if I've wronged, please!


----------



## kds5000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ok. I think there is something wrong with my SE. Aside from the heat, which is not really alarming as it takes a good half hour or more before it reaches it's warmest temperature, there are two other things.

 First, the chrome tops if the driver tubes turned a very dark color right away. The tops of the power tubes are still bright chrome.

 Second, there is a very small difference between the lowest and highest gain settings. Even with both jumpers set to ON for a setting of 10, unless I go to 12 o'clock on the dial, I can hardly hear the music. This is confirmed on two sources. I have to go to at least 3 o'clock to get any significant volume through my K701's. Slightly less (1-2 o'clock) for my Grado SR60's.

 I'm going to take a pic of the tubes and send it along with a description of these gain issues to David this evening. I'm hoping that a couple of new driver tubes will fix, what I now believe to be a problem with my amp._

 

I have the same experience with regard to your first "problem". I've emailed David on the driver tube discolouration and he says it's normal. So long as the tops of the tubes don't turn white (indicating a loss of vacuum), your tubes are fine (even if one driver tube is visibly darker than the other). My SE sounds fine, so I left it at that.

 Your second problem is a concern. There's a big jump between my lowest and highest gain settings. With my Grado SR 80 (32 ohms) for example, the volume pot is seldom past the 12 o'clock position (lowest gain) while at the highest gain, it seldom passes 9 o'clock. Do let us know David's diagnosis of your problem. Hope it's just a simple matter of replacing your tubes.


----------



## intoart

I thought that I preferred tubes, but that was based on different headphones than my current pair. The DT150s sound better with SS.
 At this point, if I buy a new amp at all, it will likely be the MKV.


----------



## cswann1

I can't believe I did this, but somehow I just got it in my head the the ON position of the gain switches was for the maximum gain. I should have double-checked the manual on my MKIVse.

 Anyway, I have the switches back on the OFF position and there is plenty of volume now. 

 While this amp, paired with my K701's is definitely not a rock lovers dream come true, it does a good job for that genre. And for material that is not bass heavy, well let's just say I'm more than happy. I'm delighted with what this combo does with acoustic and vocal tracks. 

 Thanks to all who offered advice while I worked out my constipation-of-the-brain issues.


----------



## kds5000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cswann1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can't believe I did this, but somehow I just got it in my head the the ON position of the gain switches was for the maximum gain. I should have double-checked the manual on my MKIVse.

 Anyway, I have the switches back on the OFF position and there is plenty of volume now. 

 While this amp, paired with my K701's is definitely not a rock lovers dream come true, it does a good job for that genre. And for material that is not bass heavy, well let's just say I'm more than happy. I'm delighted with what this combo does with acoustic and vocal tracks. 

 Thanks to all who offered advice while I worked out my constipation-of-the-brain issues.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It happens to the best of us... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Glad you've sorted this out.

 I definitely prefer my SE at its max gain setting - even with very low impedence phones like the Grados / Alessandros and Denons. With no perceptible distortion (to me at least), the max setting gives my music more punch at all frequencies.

 For those of you who have yet to play with your MKIV's gain settings - try it with your favourite pair of phones... you may be surprised at the difference you hear.


----------



## MatthewK

I too noticed a big difference by increasing the gain.

 When I received my MK IV SE I put it to the lowest gain possible right away since I read that's _supposed_ to be the best quality. Bass and punch was a bit lacking, so I contacted David and he instructed me to increase the gain to the maximum setting (HD650's) as the manual says. Huge difference to my ears, everything was much better, I just couldn't turn the dial as far.


----------



## SilverShadow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MatthewK* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I too noticed a big difference by increasing the gain.

 When I received my MK IV SE I put it to the lowest gain possible right away since I read that's supposed to be the best quality. Bass and punch was a bit lacking, so I contacted David and he instructed me to increase the gain to the maximum setting (HD650's) as the manual says. Huge difference to my ears, everything was much better, I just couldn't turn the dial as far._

 

X2 (or is it X3? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)

 I noticed the same: the gain settings do affect the sound quality. The thing is, I'm using 62-Ohm AKG K701. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Not exactly the best situation when it comes to volume control. The 9:00 position, is the loudest I can use. But it's worth it.


----------



## zombie1210

I purchased one from David this afternoon. I've read every post on every page of this thread, and you guys sold me on it. Now......THE WAIT.


----------



## zombie1210

WOW!

 I ordered it on saturday, and it came this morning (thursday). I can't even get shipping that fast out of Californica.

 I plugged it in and listened for a little while, and my first impressions are very favorable. The bass on my HFI780's tightened up very nicely. Definition of each instrument is superb. 

 Now for the burn in.....

 David is the man!


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


 Well, the MKIVse is turning out to be a far better unit than I could ever hope for. Everything seems past any kind of break-in period and I have about 300 hours on it. Last week, I ordered a setup of tubes (Phillips Jan 5687WB) to take the place of the Mullards. 
 


 I ordered a pair of these Phillips tubes and they got here today. I must be missing something because they are not a drop-in replacements for the EH 6N30P's that came with my MKIVse. Yes, I saw that Penchums amp has Mullards, but I'm a tube-noob.

 I'm thinking that my amp is not configured the same as Penchums. can anyone advise me about these Phillips tubes? Do I just need to make a jumper setting change or are these tubes not going to be compatible?

 Thanks in advance
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






*Edit*: Ok. I did a little research and it looks like my MKIVse is hardwired for the Russian power tube. The jumpers on mine are only for changing driver tube families. Oh well. I've heard great things about the 6N30P-DR "supertubes". I just wish they weren't so pricey.


----------



## FSonicSmith

I would be interested in hearing from owners of the Mark IVse who have had theirs for three months or more as to their experiences with reliability and their satisfaction overall.


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FSonicSmith* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would be interested in hearing from owners of the Mark IVse who have had theirs for three months or more as to their experiences with reliability and their satisfaction overall._

 

On this subject: I've had my MKIVse only a couple of weeks, but when I first got it I was concerned about the heat it generated. Heat is slow death to electronics. 

 I've converted a spare bedroom to my listening room and there is no ceiling fan. The air in this room does not move much at all even when the air-conditioning system runs.

 There happened to be a stand-mounted oscillating fan in the corner so I turned it on it's lowest setting pointed it at my Little Dot across the room from it. 

 It's amazing how well the aluminum case dissipates heat. With just a very gentle amount or air moving across the amp, it is quite cool to the touch now.

 It is standard practice for me to run the fan while listening to music. With my K701's open design I can hear it between songs and during silences though. But I think that an active cooling method like this will increase the amps life-span.

 BTW. I've been listening to a Metallica compilation CD this morning. I read all the time that K701/2's do poorly with OTL amps especially for rock music.
 As I have only spent time with the MKIVse, I can't confirm or deny this, but I'm enjoying the s**t out of this CD on this system. Penchum was not exaggerating when he said this amp was a "muscle car". I agree.


----------



## punk_guy182

How many of you are using the MK IV SE as a preamp? I'd like to have your comments and concerns.


----------



## FSonicSmith

When I posted my question I had not yet seen a thread that is not worth copying here, but essentially questioned the Little Dot phenomenon and devolved into ugliness. That said, it does concern me that the Little Dot reviews, whether by Penchum or anyone else generally fail to compare the performance of the unit to any others of similar price, not to mention higher priced units. This aspect of performance review is critical. In order for a review to be truly helpful, it is vital to know whether a further investment of money will provide a big step up or a little one. The professional reviewers of Stereophile do this almost without exception. It appears to me that with the Little Dot products, mostly newer entrants into this hobby (which includes me) are buying the products and they therefor have little or nothing to compare them to. Because of the extent of LD threads on this forum, it would be of immense help if one or more of the very experienced contributors borrowed a couple of the "top end" LD units and gave us their input. Are they solid in terms of sound quality? Does the Mark IVse give an enthusiast on a budget 90% or more of the very hi-end, or less? I would rather wait until I can order an RSA Raptor without guilt than make an impulse purchase of a Mark IVse (despite being a third of the price) and regretting it.


----------



## baronbeehive

That's a very interesting point FSonicSmith.

 I did say I would get back to you now that I've tried the Tong-sol 6A5KW driver tubes. The information on other similar Tong-sols (I can't remember the id number) by previous contributers is right when they say that they are less smooth than the mullards - so much so that I gave them some extra, post 50 hour, burn in time which has helped. In my (amateurish but enthusiastic opinion), for what it's worth, I think that the 6A5KW's are similar - slightly less smooth and slightly more detailed and forward sounding with slightly more attack. However to my ears the difference is less important because the volume can be turned up on the smoother mullards without the pain and so you hear a wonderful well rounded sound which is excellent for all you mp3's and older music, while the Tong-sol's are probably better for a rock sound with slightly more of an edge. I would emphasise that the differences are small - at least to me. I certainly didn't hear spadefuls of bass and treble that I did not hear before.

 Thanks everyone for the accurate and imformative threads here without which it would have been difficult to find out anything. One thing I did notice on the little tube forum - the 6H6Pi tubes were not recommended for the mk iv se by David so I am having difficulty finding an alternative power tube to try. Any suggestions?


----------



## punk_guy182

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FSonicSmith* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ That said, it does concern me that the Little Dot reviews, whether by Penchum or anyone else generally fail to compare the performance of the unit to any others of similar price, not to mention higher priced units. This aspect of performance review is critical. In order for a review to be truly helpful, it is vital to know whether a further investment of money will provide a big step up or a little one._

 

I agree. We need some thorough price and performance comparison.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *baronbeehive* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ One thing I did notice on the little tube forum - the 6H6Pi tubes were not recommended for the mk iv se by David so I am having difficulty finding an alternative power tube to try. Any suggestions?_

 

I'm waiting on my Soviet super-tubes to get here. Apparently, there isn't a single tube out there that fits that MKIV SE that is as good as these:

6n30p-dr, Electronics, Computers Networking items on eBay.com


----------



## baronbeehive

Quote:


 When I posted my question I had not yet seen a thread that is not worth copying here, but essentially questioned the Little Dot phenomenon and devolved into ugliness. That said, it does concern me that the Little Dot reviews, whether by Penchum or anyone else generally fail to compare the performance of the unit to any others of similar price, not to mention higher priced units. 
 

Has FSonicSmith seen the head-fi review by tbonner1 which does do this.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f14/re...e-amps-228751/


----------



## cswann1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm waiting on my Soviet super-tubes to get here. Apparently, there isn't a single tube out there that fits that MKIV SE that is as good as these:

6n30p-dr, Electronics, Computers Networking items on eBay.com_

 

You don't read about it much on Head-fi (I haven't at least), but I've read on another OLF that the Electro-Harmonix 6H30PI that the SE comes with, are sonically very close to the Russian "supertube". It's the very strict quality control necessary for military and aerospace applications that makes it desirable and expensive, since it's rated to 10,000 hours. 

 I haven't been able to experience this tube yet and I'll change that in due time. Right now I'm just enjoying what this amp does. It would be awesome if the supertube could take this amp to another level.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

I've been waiting on my Super Tubes to get here from Russia for the past 2 weeks now, the anticipation is killing me!

 For drivers, I ordered the Russian 6Zh1P (4 of them for $17, shipped from the Ukraine). Due to that bastardy Audiophile thinking, it's hard to believe that these tubes are going to be as good as some of the other $40-$60 tubes out there, but I love the inexpensive surprises!
 I ordered these 6Z's b/c I read on this thread that there's a lot of punch, bass extension, and overall nice fast sound. If I want to switch them out for the *complete opposite* (smooth and relaxed), what are people's choices?
 It seems like the popular picks are:
 GE 5-Star 6AK5
 Tung-Sol 5654 / 6AK5W

 No one talks about the Telefunken 6AK5W's much, are these any good? Their 12AX7 tubes are some of the most desired out there, does this not apply to their 6AK5W/EF95 tubes as well? They're about 35+shipping on ebay.

 Like I said, in buying another pair I want the sound to be as completely opposite to the 6Z's as possible, so I'm curious to hear what people's opinions are. Thanks!


----------



## Max F

Wow, who's paying for $40-$60 tubes? Seriously, live by Penchum's rule - try not to spend over $8 dollar a tube including shipping! I've only had my MKIII for a few weeks and I have bought 14 tubes for an average of 4-6 dollars a tube.

 BTW the Russion Vohods are nice! I Just got the same set you ordered. They came in yesterday. Sweet mids and nice details. The bass is pretty wooly - i hope that settles down a bit. Excellent for jazz.


----------



## Max F

Oh and the 5-stars which i have sound similar enough with the Voshods but will less bass and bit more treble detail. At least thats my initial impression. Got to keep moving along with the burn in!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Max F* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, who's paying for $40-$60 tubes? Seriously, live by Penchum's rule - try not to spend over $8 dollar a tube including shipping! I've only had my MKIII for a few weeks and I have bought 14 tubes for an average of 4-6 dollars a tube._

 

Going by everyone's love on Yen1233 on ebay, these are the tubes that he's selling for the Little Dot right now:
eBay Seller: yen1233: little dot, Electronics items on eBay.com

 It looks like the majority of the LD MK tubes are a static 48+shipping, but I wonder if those prices exist because head-fi'ers are continuously willing to pay that much?

 Thanks for the insight on the GE 5 stars, I'll probably skip those since they're similar to the Voshods.

 Still looking for suggestions for the darkest and smoothest tube though to contrast the Voshods, though!


----------



## jdc65

FSonicSmith asked about my experience w/ the LD MK IV SE, I thought I might as well post my response here. I got mine from davidzhezhe on ebay Feb 18th, so 8 days ago. The shipping was fast and the unit arrived in good condition. There is some very minor scuffing on the outside (rounded) edges of the front panel.

 The amp has been completely functional from the moment I first turned it on. This amp has only a few ten's of hours of burn in. I am still running the stock tubes, and probably will for a while. I haven't heard any left/right volume discrepancies or static. There is minor background noise at full volume. The background is quiet at anything like sane volumes.

 I have two decent headphone amps, the LD and a Shanling PH100. Each of them are fed by a Compact SUPER DAC 707U, purchased from ALO audio (I have two of these, one per amp). These are fed typically by Itunes 256 kbps AAC via usb. My better headphones are (and I feel so cliche) Grado RS 80s, AKG 701s, and Senn HD650s.

 As far as the LD and the Shanling: I would rate the LD as a better amp than the Shanling, but they have different strengths. To my ears, the LD has more detail, a more expansive sound stage, and generally a richer sound. The Shanling seems to bring more power to lower frequencies. It is slightly less detailed than the LD, and the sound is somehow less rich. The LD brings out the detail and soundstage of the AKGs, but it also w/ some recordings at least can lead to the 'headphone w/ no bass' sound. The LD sounds truly wonderful w/ the Senns. The Shanling, combined w/ decent source recordings, can make the AKGs absolutely thump along with bass. The Senns seem to be a bit dark with the Shanling, and I have to turn the volume up a bit to break the 'veil'. Both of these amps are quite powerful, and I generally listen at 20% volume or less.

 I've had no quality problems w/ any of this equipment, yet. Most of this stuff is fairly new, and the equipment and yours truly will benefit from more burn in. Mid-fi headphone audio has been my wintertime electronic toys project this year! It is a pleasure to have a variety headphones and amps to listen to. They all have their strengths; I enjoy hearing a wide variety of music styles through different amps and different phone. I think it keeps it interesting and keeps my hearing 'in tune'.

 Thanks for the learning experience!


----------



## Max F

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Going by everyone's love on Yen1233 on ebay, these are the tubes that he's selling for the Little Dot right now:
eBay Seller: yen1233: little dot, Electronics items on eBay.com

 It looks like the majority of the LD MK tubes are a static 48+shipping, but I wonder if those prices exist because head-fi'ers are continuously willing to pay that much?_

 

Those are yen's prices not regular prices. Consider those boutique prices! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 He's offering a service to those who don't want to bother looking very hard.


----------



## 928GTS

Yen's prices are always quite inflated,shop around and with a few minute's work you'll find some great deals.


----------



## FSonicSmith

Quote:


 FSonicSmith asked about my experience w/ the LD MK IV SE, I thought I might as well post my response here. I got mine from davidzhezhe on ebay Feb 18th, so 8 days ago. The shipping was fast and the unit arrived in good condition. There is some very minor scuffing on the outside (rounded) edges of the front panel. 
 

Thanks for the update JDC65. At least you have something similar to compare things to. I have an RSA Predator as my only other headphone amp.


----------



## jdc65

I do have an iBasso D3, a portable DAC/Amp. I don't know how it compares to the Predator; I suspect the RSA is a better amp.

 To my ears, I wouldn't put the D3 in the same category as the LD or Shanling. It just doesn't have to power, and in comparison doesn't bring out the full sound of the HD650 or AKG701. I also used it as the DAC behind the Shanling for before I got the second Super DAC. I think the Super DAC noticeably outperforms it as a pure DAC.

 I think there is a chance you will like the LD better than any portable amp, but of course everyone has their own preferences.


----------



## FSonicSmith

Quote:


 I think there is a chance you will like the LD better than any portable amp, but of course everyone has their own preferences. 
 

At least for me, the portable amp and the full size amp will fulfill entirely different functions. Until something like the Sooloos Music Server becomes much more affordable, I will continue to use my cdp as my source for home listening, going through the tape loop out of my Audioprism Mantissa into the headphone amp. My RSA Predator, on the other hand, is for using with my MacBook Pro and iPhone when on the go. I would hope the two sound different even if there were some way to easily hook up the Predator to the home system, and as good as the Predator sounds, I might be a bit disappointed by the results! But my main point is that the portable amp "sees" compromised signal from even the MB Pro, and certainly from the iPhone.


----------



## ManAtWork

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It looks like the majority of the LD MK tubes are a static 48+shipping, but I wonder if those prices exist because head-fi'ers are continuously willing to pay that much?_

 

Try this vendor, n7rk's booth - n7rk's Bonanzle booth - Phoenix. I just bought several pairs of 5654 NOS tubes from him, while he has a big stock of NOS tubes produced prior to '70. Ask him to show you some more not be shown on the web page. Usually, he can bundle the goods into one single charge of shipping.

 I bought a pair of '73 GE 5 Stars 5654 NOS Matched, a pair of '62 RCA 5654 Black Plate NOS Matched, and another '62 WE403A Black Plate, square getters NOS Matched. He also shows me some WWII age 5654 NOS JAN tubes too.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ManAtWork* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Try this vendor, n7rk's booth - n7rk's Bonanzle booth - Phoenix. I just bought several pairs of 5654 NOS tubes from him, while he has a big stock of NOS tubes produced prior to '70. Ask him to show you some more not be shown on the web page. Usually, he can bundle the goods into one single charge of shipping.

 I bought a pair of '73 GE 5 Stars 5654 NOS Matched, a pair of '62 RCA 5654 Black Plate NOS Matched, and another '62 WE403A Black Plate, square getters NOS Matched. He also shows me some WWII age 5654 NOS JAN tubes too.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks a lot for the link, I'm gonna have to order some of these ASAP!


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Max F* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Those are yen's prices not regular prices. Consider those boutique prices! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 He's offering a service to those who don't want to bother looking very hard._

 

This is good info, thanks! I can't believe I succumbed to internet laziness, I just assumed these would be the most reasonable way to get them. I was obviously wrong!


----------



## baronbeehive

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BombayTheIndian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered these 6Z's b/c I read on this thread that there's a lot of punch, bass extension, and overall nice fast sound. If I want to switch them out for the *complete opposite* (smooth and relaxed), what are people's choices?
 It seems like the popular picks are:
 GE 5-Star 6AK5
 Tung-Sol 5654 / 6AK5W_

 

I hope this doesn't appear twice because I posted it once but it must have got lost in the ether! I wanted to reply to BombayTheIndian to advise him not to go for the Tong-Sols for smoothness. From what I have read they appear to be less smooth - though not harsh by any means. Penchum described the 5687 WB Tong-Sol as crisp, clean, detailed and dynamic with an extended frequency range and IMHO this also applies to the 6AK5W that I recently bought. Apologies for my earlier identification error - I was talking about the 6AK5W not the 6A5KW.

 I believe the best way to describe the difference between the Tong-Sols and the ultra smooth Mullards is that the Tong-Sols are more forward with slightly more edge which makes them perfect for rock. With the Mullards the mid base to mids are rounder and fuller - rather as if they were wrapped in a warm blanket. Whereas the Tong-Sols are flatter throughout the frequency range which extends further both ways. I think this gives a better balance with no emphasis one way or the other. The dynamics are incredible, for example when there is a good strong base pumping out you can easily distinguish a quiet Tibetan bell amongst the other instruments. Also the headroom is so vast that a low powerful base is produced exceptionally without detriment to the other frequencies in the music. Furthermore the cleanness and accuracy are such that every instrument is easily defined as that particular instrument, eg guitar, piano, violins etc.

 I believe I have found the perfect combination for my set up and am so happy with it I may never want to change it - I said "may!"

 I hope I haven't bored you guys but I just had to share the pleasure I get from this amp bearing in mind my source is a humble Ipod. God only knows what it would be like with a decent source!

 Let us know what the 6Zh1P's are like.


----------



## Max F

baron what headphones are you using? Thats really crucial to know what these tubes are doing.


----------



## McPanse

Help! My LD MKIV is smoking!

 I posted this under amp forum but thought it might get a better response here.

 My LD started smoking after producing some terrible distortion in the right channel.

 I use it as a preamp in combination with a Trends power amp.

 First sign that anything wrong was that it produced static after I powered on the Trends. I powered down the Trends, waited a few minutes, powered it back on and no problem. 10 minutes later, loud distortion from the right channel. Powered everything down and noticed smoke coming from beneath the LD and an acrid burning smell.

 David said to send it back for inspection and repair. Anybody ever experienced or heard of anything like this?


----------



## SilverShadow

McPanse, have you used the LD with the Trends before? If not, my guess is that your MKIV SE doesn't like your power amp for some reason...


----------



## Max F

Does the Trends amp run DC by chance? My MKIII manual says that it is not recommended to be used with a DC or direct coupled power amplifier.


----------



## McPanse

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SilverShadow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_McPanse, have you used the LD with the Trends before? If not, my guess is that your MKIV SE doesn't like your power amp for some reason..._

 

My LD and Trends have been making beautiful music together since last summer. I'm thinking something blew inside. There's still an acrid/burnt smell coming off the unit.


----------



## baronbeehive

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Max F* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_baron what headphones are you using? Thats really crucial to know what these tubes are doing._

 

Audio Technica ATH-AD2000. The rest of the rig is Ipod Classic with apple lossless files, and ALO vampire copper rca connecters.


----------



## jc9394

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *baronbeehive* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Audio Technica ATH-AD2000. The rest of the rig is Ipod Classic with apple lossless files, and ALO vampire copper rca connecters._

 

What gain did you set on your IV SE? x3 or x4?


----------



## jc9394

Where is the best place to buy backup and upgrade tubes for LD IV SE?


----------



## sillysally

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *McPanse* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Help! My LD MKIV is smoking!

 I posted this under amp forum but thought it might get a better response here.

 My LD started smoking after producing some terrible distortion in the right channel.

 I use it as a preamp in combination with a Trends power amp.

 First sign that anything wrong was that it produced static after I powered on the Trends. I powered down the Trends, waited a few minutes, powered it back on and no problem. 10 minutes later, loud distortion from the right channel. Powered everything down and noticed smoke coming from beneath the LD and an acrid burning smell.

 David said to send it back for inspection and repair. Anybody ever experienced or heard of anything like this?_

 

Same here. I have to send my LD MK IV SE back. 

 Do your tubes still glow? But no sound and the amp does not get hot now.


----------



## baronbeehive

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jc9394* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What gain did you set on your IV SE? x3 or x4?_

 

I haven't changed it from 3. Despite what has been said earlier I can't see the point, especially with the Audio Technica's. The maximum volume I use is 10 or sometimes 11 oclock making it unfeasable to raise the setting.


----------



## tescosamoa

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jc9394* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Where is the best place to buy backup and upgrade tubes for LD IV SE?_

 

Ebay has a ton of them

 Here is a good key word search

 (*403A, *403b, 408a, 408b, *415A, 5654*, *5654, 5591, CV4010, CV5216, CV8246, 6069, CV10442, EF95*, M8100, 6AK5*, CV10100, CV8159, CV8225, CV850, 6J1, EF92, 6CQ6, CV2023, V884, VP6, M8161, CV131, 9D6, W77)

 This will get you started ... Lots of tubes out there.


----------



## FSonicSmith

Maybe I should start a separate thread about this, I dunno. I recently splurged on a pair of 6H30DRs to replace the EH gold pins that come standard on the Mark IVse. At first, I feared I had wasted my money because the sound was substantially the same, particularly with my AKG701s which are not yet fully broken in. But after about 15 hours of burn-in for the new tubes, things changed dramatically, and particularly with my stock Denon 2000s. I should note that the stock driver tubes were replaced with NOS Voshods right out of the gate when I received my amp more than a month ago. Signal is coming from my Classe CDP.5 thru DH Labs ICs purchased custom from Moon Audio. I was not thrilled at all with the sound of the Denons with the EH 6H30PIs. The bass was bloated and not well controlled and the treble was harsh. With the DRs, the treble is silky smooth and the bass is tight and powerful. Right now I am listening to Andrew Bird's Noble Beast and the sound is rich, organic, and has cohesion that I was not getting with the EH stock tubes. The second track of Drive By Trucker's "The Dirty South" is called "Tornadoes" and opens with a startlingly thunderous set of drum strikes that are both tuneful and powerful, and oh so pleasing with the Denon 2000s. This is great synergy, and most unexpected since the D2000s are thought to need solid state. I was beginning to believe the naysayers of the LD line-up, and was beginning to have doubts about the ultimate sound quality of the Mark IVse. Time will tell as to durability and reliability, but there should be no doubting the potential SQ once source, tubes, and phones choices are matched up. I just hope my 701s eventually flesh out and give as much pleasure as the Denons.


----------



## ManAtWork

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FSonicSmith* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe I should start a separate thread about this, I dunno. I recently splurged on a pair of 6H30DRs to replace the EH gold pins that come standard on the Mark IVse._

 

I haven't considered to roll the power tube, because I don't know if the improvement is justified for more than $300/pair expense.


----------



## FSonicSmith

Quote:


 I haven't considered to roll the power tube, because I don't know if the improvement is justified for more than $300/pair expense. 
 

I don't think the difference is likely worth $300. I got a good deal and paid half that for a pair of 6H30DRs. If you have D2000s and are not happy with the sound, you might want to think about finding a pair of DRs at a decent price.


----------



## McPanse

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sillysally* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Same here. I have to send my LD MK IV SE back. 

 Do your tubes still glow? But no sound and the amp does not get hot now._

 

Do they still glow? Once it started smoking, I powered it down and did not power it back on. It's in China with David now. He hasn't said what was wrong with it. Last word from him was an e-mail saying he had reimbursed my return shipping and that my replacement unit was being tested. 

 If I get any more useful information, I will post it here.


----------



## sillysally

Yes the Tube's still glowed. 

 I think I got my LD about the same time as you. I think August of 08. 

 Anyway my LD is on its way back to China.

 Don't think there is much to worry about. 
 David really try's to do things right. 

 And its because of David I got the LD.


----------



## McPanse

Roger that. David does seem committed to make things right. That said, I would like to know what went wrong with the amp. Don't want a repeat once I'm out of warranty.


----------



## McPanse

So, what caused my Little Dot to smoke out and die?

 According to David, "Higher than normal outlet voltage (~130V) caused the heater voltage to oscillate too high, causing eventual failure of the power tubes and burn out of the circuit. The circuit has since been revised to accommodate such conditions."

 130V isn't that far outside the normal operating range of a 120V outlet, from what I can tell and I did have my amp and other equipment connected to a home theater-grade surge protector. Whether the protector had been degraded by absorbing multiple surges, I can't rightly say. Nothing else in the chain is exhibiting any problems.

 To be on the safe side, I have another surge protector on its way and an electrician coming out to upgrade my outlets from two-prong to grounded three-prongs. This is as much a matter of convenience and safety as real concern about leaking voltage. I'm also considering having a whole house surge suppressor installed.

 Any thoughts, advice, similar experiences out there?


----------



## sillysally

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *McPanse* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, what caused my Little Dot to smoke out and die?

 According to David, "Higher than normal outlet voltage (~130V) caused the heater voltage to oscillate too high, causing eventual failure of the power tubes and burn out of the circuit. The circuit has since been revised to accommodate such conditions."



 Any thoughts, advice, similar experiences out there?_

 

I have a PS Audio - Premier Power Conditioner. 

 Really does a nice job. Holds volts at 121v. Plus It takes noise out of the current among other things.


----------



## nigeljames

Do anybody use a tube amp and LD amps in particular with extreme metal/rock. Or is it a no no with tubes.


----------



## McPanse

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sillysally* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a PS Audio - Premier Power Conditioner. 

 Really does a nice job. Holds volts at 121v. Plus It takes noise out of the current among other things._

 

For $2,000, I should hope so!

 But seriously, for the ultimate in clean, steady power, you should consider upgrading to a radioisotope thermoelectric generator, or RTG. Finding plutonium-238, however, can be a pain.


----------



## Max F

You can get a voltage regulator from APC or similar. They will step down the voltage if too high. I have the APC line-r 1200 and seems to work pretty well for a reasonable price. I don't run my amp through it but I do run my digital audio equipment through it. I can actually here it click on sometimes. My voltage runs around 120-126v depeding on whether poeples air conditioners are running or not. 

 If you want to test you power filter to see if it works, then just stick multimeter probes in it and see what it measure. Try it before and after the filter.


----------



## McPanse

My electrician actually talked me out of a whole house surge suppressor. His reasoning is that surges that can take out sensitive gear are most likely to enter through the ground line, not the two 110V current carrying lines that whole house suppressors protect. His strong preference is to intercept a surge between the outlet and the gear.


----------



## Max F

I thought we were talking about chronic line voltage variation rather than voltage spikes (power surges).


----------



## jc9394

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *McPanse* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My electrician actually talked me out of a whole house surge suppressor. His reasoning is that surges that can take out sensitive gear are most likely to enter through the ground line, not the two 110V current carrying lines that whole house suppressors protect. His strong preference is to intercept a surge between the outlet and the gear._

 

Your electrician is very honest, not so much with the one I last dealt with.


----------



## .Sup

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FSonicSmith* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe I should start a separate thread about this, I dunno. I recently splurged on a pair of 6H30DRs to replace the EH gold pins that come standard on the Mark IVse. At first, I feared I had wasted my money because the sound was substantially the same, particularly with my AKG701s which are not yet fully broken in. But after about 15 hours of burn-in for the new tubes, things changed dramatically, and particularly with my stock Denon 2000s. I should note that the stock driver tubes were replaced with NOS Voshods right out of the gate when I received my amp more than a month ago. Signal is coming from my Classe CDP.5 thru DH Labs ICs purchased custom from Moon Audio. I was not thrilled at all with the sound of the Denons with the EH 6H30PIs. The bass was bloated and not well controlled and the treble was harsh. With the DRs, the treble is silky smooth and the bass is tight and powerful. Right now I am listening to Andrew Bird's Noble Beast and the sound is rich, organic, and has cohesion that I was not getting with the EH stock tubes. The second track of Drive By Trucker's "The Dirty South" is called "Tornadoes" and opens with a startlingly thunderous set of drum strikes that are both tuneful and powerful, and oh so pleasing with the Denon 2000s. This is great synergy, and most unexpected since the D2000s are thought to need solid state. I was beginning to believe the naysayers of the LD line-up, and was beginning to have doubts about the ultimate sound quality of the Mark IVse. Time will tell as to durability and reliability, but there should be no doubting the potential SQ once source, tubes, and phones choices are matched up. I just hope my 701s eventually flesh out and give as much pleasure as the Denons._

 

Have you tried changing gain?


----------



## FSonicSmith

Quote:


 Have you tried changing gain? 
 

I'm not sure I follow you. I am very happy with the sound and am not looking for help or complaining. I was remarking that with the Denon D2000s, the DR tubes *do* make a significant difference. 
 But, to answer your question, I had set the gain for 10X right away based on David's (of LD) recommendation to use 10x for the Denon 2000, AKG 701, and even my humble Audio Technica ATH-AD700s, well before I installed the Voshod drivers and 6H30DR powers. I see no reason to back the gain down now at this point.


----------



## sillysally

One thing is for sure. And that is LD/David service is second to none.
 What a quick turn around time for repairs on my MK IV SE.

 Thanks, David.


----------



## atbglenn

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *McPanse* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My electrician actually talked me out of a whole house surge suppressor. His reasoning is that surges that can take out sensitive gear are most likely to enter through the ground line, not the two 110V current carrying lines that whole house suppressors protect. His strong preference is to intercept a surge between the outlet and the gear._

 

I have a few Brickwall Filters protecting my equipment. Probaby the best protection you can buy without spending a fortune. They are not based on MOV's which are prone to failure and possible fire hazard. Check out this website..

How It Works - Brick Wall


----------



## McPanse

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Max F* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought we were talking about chronic line voltage variation rather than voltage spikes (power surges)._

 

Fair enough! I replaced my outlets with ungrounded GFCIs and bought a 2,160 joule surge protector with a voltage meter that's been reading a steady 122 volts, so I'm not so worried about voltage variation at this point.

 Plus, I received assurances from David at LD that the problem shouldn't reoccur since "the incoming heater voltage is going to be regulated." He said in a previous e-mail that the circuit had been revised to accommodate higher than normal outlet voltage (130v or so) which he believes caused the heater voltage to oscillate too high and eventually led to the failure of the power tubes and burn out of the circuit. 

 Anyway, the amp is still under warranty for another 4 or 5 months. If it fails again after that, I'm not sure I'd be willing to pay to have it fixed, given that I'd be paying $100+ round trip shipping to China plus repair costs.


----------



## apatN

Okay you guys. I have a question. One of my 6H30Pi tubes decided to kill itself. The volume is a lot lower in that tube. Obviously I need a new tube. Now I can buy either another Electro-Harmonix or get a Sovtek one. I spoke with David from Little Dot about this and he said that it shouldn't be a problem to mix the two different brands.
 My question to you is should I buy the Sovtek or the Electro-Harmonix one? What is the better one? I am about to order from here.


----------



## BombayTheIndian

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *apatN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay you guys. I have a question. One of my 6H30Pi tubes decided to kill itself. The volume is a lot lower in that tube. Obviously I need a new tube. Now I can buy either another Electro-Harmonix or get a Sovtek one. I spoke with David from Little Dot about this and he said that it shouldn't be a problem to mix the two different brands.
 My question to you is should I buy the Sovtek or the Electro-Harmonix one? What is the better one? I am about to order from here._

 

I don't know if you've already purchased your single replacement tube, but I've got an odd number of relatively new Sovtek 6H30Pis. I don't use any of the three since I bought the Russian 6N30P-DR Reflektor Plant Supertubes, but I wanted to keep 2 of them for burning in new driver tubes. Do you want it? I don't want any money for it, just the cost of shipping it to you!

 But in response to your original question, I've read that only 5-10% of the sound is really affected by the power tubes, so it probably won't hurt it noticeably to have 2 different brands of the same type of tube in there. If you mixed a DR tube in there with a PI, that would be a different story. As long as they output the exact same power (which they technically should do), it should be fine!


----------



## punk_guy182

For those interested, I'm selling my brand new Little Dot MK IV SE (latest revision) with the the Russian 6N30P-DR Reflektor Plant Supertubes and sylvania tubes.


----------



## SengChangKo

Am planning to get MKIV SE real soon, can anyone advice me on the configuration I planning below?

 ipod >ipod LOD>ibasso D10 (DAC)>ipod mini jack to RCA cable>MK IV SE (AMP)>Sennheiser HD650


----------



## tripleR6

USA little dot owners, did you get hit with any customs fees on delivery?

 I have a III on the way and im worried ill have to pay up :/


----------



## JackKander

Where can I get me a set of 408A G Elect 5 star?


----------



## nismohks

whats the longest period of time you guys have had your mkivse on for?

 i accidentally left mine on for 2 days idling....

 ... literally scared the crap out of me when i remembered! lucky no damage, thank god!


----------



## rosgr63

You are lucky, I usually don't leave it on more than 4 hours


----------



## meatwad

Just purchased my brand new MK IV SE from David. This will be my first dedicated headphone amp. I can't wait!


----------



## rosgr63

meatwad, well done, enjoy it!
 Next is tube rolling, waiting for your impressions.


----------



## sizwej

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tripleR6* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_USA little dot owners, did you get hit with any customs fees on delivery?

 I have a III on the way and im worried ill have to pay up :/_

 

No.


----------



## Horio

Decided to go with the LD MKIV non SE and use the extra $100 for tube rolling. Love what I'm hearing with my new AKG K702's thus far. Seems to be a great match for my preferences.


----------



## CQ DX

For preamp use only (with a CD player source... redbook, HDCD, SACD), would there be a sonic difference between the MKIII and the MKIV? And would there be a sonic difference between the MKIV and the MKIVSE? I'm currently using the MKIII as a preamp only, in a system with McIntosh amplification and Magnepan speakers (MG12's). I want to upgrade to a MKIV or MKIVSE. I already have Tung-Sol and Hytron EF95 tubes ready to be rolled into the amp I choose. Which would you go for and why? Thanks for your input and opinions!


----------



## luiztfc

So, is the MK IV much better than the MK III? I think I'll buy the IV but I don't know if it is THAT better.


----------



## wudai_e

It's ok to left ur LDIVSE for extended period of time, I usually let it warm up for an hour, sometimes over night, then it sounds like heaven. Yes, I ran through 2 pairs power tubes already within a year, don't if it's because of my use or the quality of the tube, one tube that came with the amp is still going strong tho.


----------



## McPanse

Anybody else having problems accessing the Little Dot website and forum at http://www.little-tube.com/? I've been unable to pull it up for a couple of weeks now and after a year or so of just enjoying the MK IV I'm back to wanting to read about it and other LD gear.


----------



## rosgr63

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *McPanse* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anybody else having problems accessing the Little Dot website and forum at http://www.little-tube.com/? I've been unable to pull it up for a couple of weeks now and after a year or so of just enjoying the MK IV I'm back to wanting to read about it and other LD gear._

 

Yes I can't access it a few days now.


----------



## jro7563

Hi all,

 Been looking through the posts here regarding the Little Dot MkIV-SE and finaly took the plunge and placed my order for one on Monday, have just received an e-mail from David letting me know that its now on its way after being QC'd 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 This is my first encounter with a tube amp (or even dedicated headphone amp for that matter) so am quite looking forward to hearing whats its like, will be using it with my Beyer DT880's (250Ω)

 Will let you know how i get on. 

 John


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jro7563* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi all,

 Been looking through the posts here regarding the Little Dot MkIV-SE and finaly took the plunge and placed my order for one on Monday, have just received an e-mail from David letting me know thats its now on its way after being QC'd 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 This is my first encounter with a tube amp (or even dedicated headphone amp for that matter) so am quite looking forward to hearing whats its like, will be using it with my Beyer DT880's (250Ω)

 Will let you know how i get on. 

 John_

 


 Welcome jro7563

 You and your Beyers will love the MKIVSE...


----------



## jro7563

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Welcome jro7563

 You and your Beyers will love the MKIVSE...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Many thanks for the welcome.


----------



## Bowedtoothdoc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rosgr63* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes I can't access it a few days now._

 

They changed their web address:

Little Dot Amplifiers &bull; View forum - Little Dot Models and Pricing


----------



## jro7563

Just tracked my MkIV at Heathrow airport 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 now, will Gordon Brown want to charge me an arm and a leg in duty


----------



## kwang411

I just received my LD Mk4 SE yesterday, it sounds fantastic with K701!!
 The sound is much less harsh and the bass is more than enough for most of the genres I listen to (but it's not as tight, maybe needs more burn in).

 Any suggestions for gain setting from K701 + mk4 users out there? There's a pretty significant difference from default setting to 5X, but not sure about 5x to 10x. Thanks!


----------



## rosgr63

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kwang411* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just received my LD Mk4 SE yesterday, it sounds fantastic with K701!!
 The sound is much less harsh and the bass is more than enough for most of the genres I listen to (but it's not as tight, maybe needs more burn in).

 Any suggestions for gain setting from K701 + mk4 users out there? There's a pretty significant difference from default setting to 5X, but not sure about 5x to 10x. Thanks!_

 

Enjoy it.
 Just try out which setting works best for you, it's relatively easy to change gain settings. Make sure you have the same setting for both channels.


----------



## waha

I just got my MK IV SE to replace my MK III, and I have to say... wow, what an improvement. Using the stock tubes atm, but I'll soon migrate my 6N30P-DR + Mullard EF92 combo from the MK III.

 The MK III made my K701s sound great, the MK IV makes them sound totally awesome!

 Obligatory pic together with the DAC_I:


----------



## rosgr63

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *waha* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got my MK IV SE to replace my MK III, and I have to say... wow, what an improvement. Using the stock tubes atm, but I'll soon migrate my 6N30P-DR + Mullard EF92 combo from the MK III.

 The MK III made my K701s sound great, the MK IV makes them sound totally awesome!

 Obligatory pic together with the DAC_I:_

 

Nice setup, enjoy it.
 IMHO you'll experience more improvement/difference by trying various drivers than power tubes.


----------



## waha

I got a whole bunch of driver tubes already, but somehow I found myself enjoying the Mullard EF92s the most on the MK III at least. Still need to get a pair of EF91s though.


----------



## rosgr63

Try a matched pair of Mullard M8100 if you have them.


----------



## lromlin

What about the 120 Ohm impedance adapter that comes with it? I have a pair of Denon D5000 (And D2000, D1000), which has only 25 Ohm impedance. Is there ANY reason not to use that adapter or does it work flawless?


----------



## alanbeeb

So how did you get on with it then?


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jro7563* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just tracked my MkIV at Heathrow airport 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 now, will Gordon Brown want to charge me an arm and a leg in duty 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## Rocky

Hi.

 Well, I've had the MKIV se for well over a year now, and one of the powertubes has now quit on me. 
 So I'm looking to buy replacement powertubes for the amp, but can't really find any.
 I find it really confusing figuring out which tubes would fit the MKIV se as this is my first tube amp,
 and I don't really know all that much about different tubes.

 Therefore I am hoping someone would give me a direct link to some powertubes that definitely would fit the MKIV se. 
 Preferably somewhere in europe, but at this point I'm no longer very choosy. 
 The make of the tube does not really matter either, as I just want a working tube(s) as soon as possible.

 Any help will be greatly appreciated.


----------



## rosgr63

Look for a matched pair of 6N30P-DR or 6H30 Pi from ebay.


----------



## badspell68

Can burn-in be done with one CD set to replay so that it repeats over and over?


----------



## McPanse

Sure, why not? Just don't listen the whole time. No telling what could happen.


----------



## kiynoj

new to this forum and a fellow LD MK IV SE user...

 has anyone try to drive a HD800 with the little dot mk IV SE?? how does it sound?


----------



## yossi126

Having owned the amp for 7 months I suggest at this budget to look for an M3 build.
 The LD is a nice beginner's amp but not one for the HD800.


----------



## Denys

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yossi126* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Having owned the amp for 7 months I suggest at this budget to look for an M3 build.
 The LD is a nice beginner's amp but not one for the HD800._

 

I second that. I own HD800 and LD (I use with my Grados)...Does a terrible job with Sennheiser due to their high impedance...

 Denys


----------



## tjumper78

you can always change the gain to your likings. 
 when i had it, i used it with hd650 and i heard nothing but amazing sound. it also worked well with sensitive IEMs and grados in low gain mode.


----------



## johangrb

I echo that - just doesn't seem to work well with my HD800's (Though messing with the gain might help). Marvelous with my ATH-W1000 though.
  
  Quote: 





yossi126 said:


> Having owned the amp for 7 months I suggest at this budget to look for an M3 build.
> The LD is a nice beginner's amp but not one for the HD800.


----------



## edmondwolfman

You said at one point when you tested the preamp that you hooked it into the AUX of an exising preamp, Pioneer I believe. When you do that do you not have 2 different volume controls, 1 on the Little Dot and 1 on the Pioneer? If so how do you handle that?


----------



## jr41

Well after reading all the useful information in this and other threads, and Penchum's great review of course, I've decided to plump for the IV SE and sent David an e-mail last night. This will be my first serious foray into Head-Fi so I'm pretty excited to hear the results. I'll be pairing it with the HD 650 and Little Dot DAC_I. I'll post a follow up with my initial impressions once the amp arrives.


----------



## fanglekai

I have Sennheiser HD 600s and I'm planning on buying a little dot mk iv se and dac 1 soon. This thread has been helpful.


----------



## jr41

Quote: 





fanglekai said:


> I have Sennheiser HD 600s and I'm planning on buying a little dot mk iv se and dac 1 soon. This thread has been helpful.


 
   
  Let us know if you take the plunge and what your impressions are fanglekai, we can compare notes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . If nothing else it'll provide another data point in the never ending 600 vs. 650 discussion!


----------



## nismohks

my MK IV SE broke again....
  first time a resister blew and had to send it to china to get it fixed
  and this time im not sure..
  it makes a loud buzzing noise in my earphones and sound quality is dimishied.
  anyone have any idea or whether someone has encountered this issue before?
   
  thanks


----------



## nismohks

also i cant seem to find David Zhe Zhe's email anymore, can someone PM that to me please?
  i hope the repairs wont cost too much... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thanks!


----------



## ford2

Quote: 





nismohks said:


> also i cant seem to find David Zhe Zhe's email anymore, can someone PM that to me please?
> i hope the repairs wont cost too much...
> 
> 
> ...


 


   You have pm.
   
  And LD do not charge for repairs.


----------



## .Sup

That's really bad luck nismohks. I never had any issues with mine but I do everything according to manual- headphones plugged in and sources on before powering it and letting it couple minutes to warm up.


----------



## jr41

I'm sorry to hear that nismohks, I recently brought the MK IV SE and was only able to enjoy it for an evening before it developed a problem. It's on its way back to Little Dot as I type.
   
  By the way, it may not help, but there's an updated manual for this amp on Little Dot's website which has more troubleshooting information in it, might be worth a shot.
   
  I hope you get the issue resolved without too much hassle.


----------



## Elythor

Reading the forum it seems like there may be reliability issues with the Little Dot. If I buy a used one (to save money) rather than straight from David Zhezhe, can anyone foresee potential problems I may face down the road?
   
  Right now I am undecided between getting a used LD MkIV-SE or the new Shiit Valhala. I couldn't find any direct comparison between the two amps on the forums so can anyone shed some light on which is a better option?


----------



## codeninja

What DAC are using with your mkivse?  I need a dac from iPad.


----------



## johangrb

I bought mine from a fellow headfi'er - had it for over 12 months - no problem. I keep the headphones plugged in and let it warm up for 5-15 min before use. I love it in my living room setup (one of 3). Fingers crossed.


----------



## n5750547

Just wanted to find out if the IV/IVSE is really that much better than the III. I have $200 to spend on an amp, but would be willing to fork out more if it is truly worth it.
   
  For reference my setup will be MBP----> HeadRoom Portable Micro Amp with DAC (using the line out)--->(LD III/IV)--->D5000
   
  Current Prices are $195 for the III, $289 for the IV and $389 for the IVSE
   
  So basically, If I can get 90% of the IVSE performance  with the III for half the price, that's the way I'll be heading.
   
  Edit: I guess its also worth mentioning that if I get the III I still have cash left over to get some Markl mods done to my D5000 (chasing tighter bass, forward mids, cleaner highs)...
   
  Thanks
  Phil


----------



## gavinfabl

Just a few comments on my new Little Dot MKIV. I upgraded from a Fiio E7/E9 combo to Musical Fidelity V-DAC/V-PSU with the Fiio E9, and then replaced the E9 with the Little Dot MKIV. I have been using the LD for nearly 3 weeks now. My source is a MBP using optical out to the V-DAC.

I have used the LD with Fischer Audio FA-003 and FA-011 (now sold these) and later this week I should have a pair of Sennheiser HD558 to try with the LD.

So what do I think.

One word. Marvellous. Sounds, looks and build quality are excellent. David at LD was superb to deal with too. 

Since I have had the amp, it was excellent from day 1, but today it suddenly changed into something sounding more delightful. Bass, midrange and treble are so clear, involving and dynamic. This amp is the best purchase I have ever made.

My wife who doesn't care for specs, also finds the amp a pleasure to listen too. She also likes the aesthetics in our lounge.


----------



## mab1376

I just bought a LD MK IV SE and i have the new version that is hard wired for the M8100.
   
  any suggestions on some tubes?
   
  i was looking at these for power tubes based on the review: http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-matched-1950s-Tung-Sol-5687-tubes-Black-Plates-Top-Fat-D-Getter-/270843060314?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item3f0f81205a
   
  and these for driver tubes: http://www.bonanza.com/listings/Western-Electric-6AK5-403B-EF95-Little-Dot-Amp-Tubes-2/16230112


----------



## derbigpr

I just got this amplifier, used, and I have a slight problem.   It sorts of hisses...or buzzes.  But the thing is, I'm not sure whether its the amps fault or its my source.  I'm using Asus Xonar D2X sound card as a source. 
  I know its well known that Mk5 hisses with some low impedance headphones, however, I'm using HD650's, and they arent low impedance.  The hiss is present even when volume control is completely turned off, and its very silent, but audible,  and it gradually increases as the volume knob is turned up. It becomes very noticeable when its turned all the way up.   However,  when I unplug the input RCA's,  hiss is gone. Completely dead silent, even on full volume.  All i hear is a very silent "click" when powering on the amp, then a usual click from the amp unit itself, and after that its silent.
   
  So, my question is, is it possible that the hissing I hear doesnt come from the amp, but from the source?  Because I have another amplifier which doesnt produce the same hiss when its connected to the soundcard.


----------



## McPanse

Do you have another source and pair of RCAs to try with the LDMKIV? If so, you should start there.
   
  There also are gain switches inside the amp (see manual) that you can try adjusting.
   
  Not exactly the same issue, but I can tell you that my higher sensitivity headphones don't pair well with the LDMKIV. I'm thinking in particular of my ATH-M50s and Ultimate Ears IEMs. Very noisy.


----------



## derbigpr

Quote: 





mcpanse said:


> Do you have another source and pair of RCAs to try with the LDMKIV? If so, you should start there.
> 
> There also are gain switches inside the amp (see manual) that you can try adjusting.
> 
> Not exactly the same issue, but I can tell you that my higher sensitivity headphones don't pair well with the LDMKIV. I'm thinking in particular of my ATH-M50s and Ultimate Ears IEMs. Very noisy.


 


   
   
  I have tried with different RCA cables, some really cheap ones, and some pretty expensive ones, same thing, although the hiss is less apparent with cheaper cables.  I also tried various headphones, hissing is identical is both my 30 Ohm headphones and 300 Ohm ones.
  I sadly have no other source I could use now...maybe a DVD player...hmm...
   
  Anyway,  one more thing I noticed, when I shut down the PC, and RCA cables are connected and amp turned on,   hissing disappears as the PC turns off.  In addition, when I turn the PC on,  hissing appears again,  and it changes as the PC turns on, it becomes higher and lower in frequency as the system is firing up. It is especially apparent when all coolers (especially the one on graphics card) start rotating very fast for a second or two.   Which leads me to believe that the problem is somewhere in the PC.
   
  By the way, is there a place where I could download a manual of this amp?  I don't have it, i bought a used unit and didn't get any papers with it.


----------



## McPanse

Sounds like your computer is the source of your interference. My experience with computer audio is limited to Apple products -- via wireless streaming or toslink out to an external DAC.
   
  As for the manual, I don't have an electronic copy. If you turn over the LDMKIV, there are a couple of holes near the front. Look in there and you will see two pairs of red DIP switches. Using a small tool:
   
  Switch 1 off Switch 2 off for a Gain of 10
  Switch 1 on Switch 2 off for a Gain of 5
  Switch 1 off Switch 2 on for a Gain of 4
  Switch 1 on Switch 2 on for a Gain of 3
   
  I would try Gain of 3 and see if that reduces your noise floor. If its currently set to 3 (LD's factory gain setting) raise it to 10. 
   
  If you haven't already done so, hook up your DVD player or other source (no iPod?) and see if the noise persists. If it doesn't, then at least you can focus your trouble shooting on the PC>RCA>LD chain.
   
  Good luck.


----------



## yinyang69

I would like to try Phillips Jan 5687WB on my little dot se. could you kindly tell me where I can get those?


----------



## Zigalk

I'm new to this and I have B&O H6, which have a flat bass. Would this Little dot make them sound awesome, but H6 has only 30 ohm. This review made it sound really something to try.


----------



## nightskyraven

A few years ago I used to own a Little Dot MK myself. Back in 2010, to be precise.
  
 I was pretty hyped when I ordered it for a portable solution for my first pair of Senns HD800. However, when I received it and tried it out, there was this weird channel imbalance present, and that really threw me off. It wasn't anything really drastic, but it was noticeable enough to be audible and mildly irritating.
  
 Have the engineers of Little Dot fixed that in the current versions?


----------



## MIKELAP

nightskyraven said:


> A few years ago I used to own a Little Dot MK myself. Back in 2010, to be precise.
> 
> I was pretty hyped when I ordered it for a portable solution for my first pair of Senns HD800. However, when I received it and tried it out, there was this weird channel imbalance present, and that really threw me off. It wasn't anything really drastic, but it was noticeable enough to be audible and mildly irritating.
> 
> Have the engineers of Little Dot fixed that in the current versions?


 
 Sometimes its the tubes sometimes its the amp for my part ive had an mk3 for several years with no problems and friends of mine also have MK4 and MK4SE and i will probably by an extra one soon just in case it does kick the bucket one day i love this little amp and all its tube rolling possibilys check out page 77 and page 1 for the regular tubes but the better sounding tubes are on page 77 of the Littledot tube rolling guide for cheap, heres the link i use Senns also with my amp and it sounds great  for the price and the tubes on page 77 are compatible with several Littledot models: the LD1+,MK2+, MK3,MK4 AND MK4 SE. So its tempting lol here's the link.   its post #1154      have fun .                                                                                                               
        http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/1140


----------



## el donkey

I currently have a Martix M which I have been very impressed with. As well as using Q701s I am also using the Matrix to drive a Golden Tubes Audio power amp. The sound is impressive and the two inputs useful.
However, im itching to try a valve pre amp with the power amp.
I can either look for a dedicated pre amp or go for a 1Vse.
anyone have experience of the Martrix and LD. Am I likely to get a different sound or an improved one? Im aiming for a smooth sound with exceptional imaging. I listen to a range of music from dance to acoustic/ voice. Thanks.


----------



## Lord Raven

Hi Guys,
  
 I have read all the three reviews about little dot mk II, III, IV. From reviews it looks like all are very good amps. My question is, what is the best amp for the price, and that could be tuned well after tube rolling in future for a beginner like myself. Their specs are almost the same either. What else is comparable to little dot? I have seen tons of Chinese amps on ebay that I don't trust since they don't have any review.
  
 Kindly suggest before I can make an order. Which one would serve me for an year or two?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Xdaggersoul

lord raven said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I have read all the three reviews about little dot mk II, III, IV. From reviews it looks like all are very good amps. My question is, what is the best amp for the price, and that could be tuned well after tube rolling in future for a beginner like myself. Their specs are almost the same either. What else is comparable to little dot? I have seen tons of Chinese amps on ebay that I don't trust since they don't have any review.
> 
> ...


 
 What headphones are you using?


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## Lord Raven

xdaggersoul said:


> What headphones are you using?



Hi, 

I'm using Focal Spirit One headphones. 

Thanks


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## Xdaggersoul

lord raven said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm using Focal Spirit One headphones.
> 
> Thanks


 
 Personally I would go for LD amps instead of China amps that arent so well known. They are value for money. 
 Tube rolling will change some of the sound signature. Different tubes have different impacts on sound. Do research more on tube amps before purchasing. Some competitors like Schiit, Darkvoice offer tube amps of the same price range as the MKIVSE. Do check on the Schiit thread.


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## Lord Raven

xdaggersoul said:


> Personally I would go for LD amps instead of China amps that arent so well known. They are value for money.
> Tube rolling will change some of the sound signature. Different tubes have different impacts on sound. Do research more on tube amps before purchasing. Some competitors like Schiit, Darkvoice offer tube amps of the same price range as the MKIVSE. Do check on the Schiit thread.


 
 Thanks dear, I have made up my mind for Feliks Elise and I am getting it soon 
  
 I considered everything from Schiit, Darkvoice, LDMK. After reading forum posts and getting personal advice from forums members, I have decided that Elise would be a better option out of all these tube amps.
  
 This is going to be my first tube amp and my first headphone amp. Wish me luck!


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## Xdaggersoul

lord raven said:


> Thanks dear, I have made up my mind for Feliks Elise and I am getting it soon
> 
> I considered everything from Schiit, Darkvoice, LDMK. After reading forum posts and getting personal advice from forums members, I have decided that Elise would be a better option out of all these tube amps.
> 
> This is going to be my first tube amp and my first headphone amp. Wish me luck!


 
 I checked it out and it really looks good! Did not know of its existence till now. Good luck with it mate!


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## Lord Raven

xdaggersoul said:


> I checked it out and it really looks good! Did not know of its existence till now. Good luck with it mate!


 
 You're welcome, and thanks  It is coming soon!


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## Metrops

Not sure if I should revive this thread, as it is still valid today for being a review. However is there a massive difference between the MKIII and MKIV, will be using the HD 700 for gaming and mostly Pop music
  
 The MKIII will be around £270 with the MKIV being around £380 after delivery charges and import fees/VAT have been added, as I am in the UK


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## serman005

Looking at getting a MkIVSE and am wondering about how to connect my ipod Classic to it. Is it 3.5 mm out to 3.5 mm in on the amp, or is it a different kind of in jack? Many thanks for the help.


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