# 2.0 Speakers Compilation: Best for <$500



## Xombie11

[size=13.0pt]I am on a quest to find the *best* set of 2.0 desktop speakers, and only 2.0 speakers. They must be active and self-powered, as subs are big, bulky and often overpowering.[/size]

  [size=13.0pt] [/size]

  [size=13.0pt]I've been through dozens, and still haven't found the perfect pair.[/size]

  [size=13.0pt] [/size]

  [size=13.0pt]Readers, I do hope this thread saves you some valuable time and money. [/size]

  [size=13.0pt] [/size]

  [size=13.0pt]Without further adieu, here is the compilation of all the speakers I’ve heard thus far (in order of sound quality and personal preference):[/size]

  [size=13.0pt]*Please keep in mind that sound quality is often subjective. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





[/size]

   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
1. M-Audio BX5a Deluxe
   




  Best sounding of the bunch; truly studio-grade "reference monitors." Crisp and forward, with great clarity, thanks in part to its silk tweeters and kevlar woofers. Bass is very tight, and these are capable of getting really, really loud. MSRP of $400 but can be had for just over $200 online. Very large and grills are unavailable.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
2. Swans D1080MKII08
   




   
  I had a bunch of issues with these; namely a persistent, yet nearly inaudible hiss and a weak internal amp--I believe to be a design flaw. Despite these issues, they sound very good, but muddy in comparison to the BX5as. Due to the weak internal amp, they cannot get very loud without the use of a soundcard or USB DAC; as such, their potential is wasted if you are planning to use them alongside a notebook or your desktop's onboard sound. They are just slightly larger than the BX5as (in depth). Very, very stylish with excellent build quality. Great value regardless. $200 after S&H.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
3. Audioengine A5
   




  I've only heard these in-store (at J&R in NY) and, quite frankly, I was unimpressed. Perhaps it may have been because I was running them off of my iPhone, but I found them muddy with mediocre highs, and so did my friend. No doubt worse than the Swans. Personally I find Audioengine to be a bit like Bose... MSRP of $400. Can be found for $325 online. Worth $250 tops.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
4. M-Audio AV40
   




   
  These are a very popular desktop solution for users looking to step up beyond mainstream Logitech/Creative products. In my experience with the AV40s, they sound very good--but nowhere near as good as the BX5as (or even the Swans). The difference is well worth $100. Still, these are the best 2.0 speakers at the <$150 mark. And while they're much smaller than their big brothers, they still take up a huge amount of space. Headphone jack and volume knob on the front is a plus.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
5. Audioengine A2
   




   
  I had a similar experience with these as I did with the A5s. Sound quality was not as good as I expected, and I found them incredibly overpriced at just under $200. Mids and highs were ok. Bass wasn't particularly good, but that was to be expected considering the size. If you're running low on space and really need bookshelf speakers as small as these, I guess they are fine. But there are better options.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
6. Creative T40 Series II
   




  The T40s surprised me. I didn't expect a whole lot from Creative, but they certainly delivered. The Series II is Creative's second revision, one in which they removed an annoying blue LED and tweaked its settings. Bass is acceptable. Very full, lively sound (the kevlar drivers are quite nice). Distorts at high volumes. Around $140. Good for those looking for something a bit smaller than the AV40s, with much of the sound quality.  Includes a headphone jack in front as well.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
7. Logitech Z10
   




   
  I used these for 4 years without a hitch; just recently they've been having some issues (sound artifacts, etc.). For USB speakers, these sound surprisingly good in comparison to the competition. Their screen is quite neat; being able to quickly tell which song is playing is a huge plus, and the clock is always helpful. After years of using its display, I've found it difficult to part ways with this excellent speaker system. Sadly, these were discontinued. Originally had for just under $100, now they're incredibly hard to find and ridiculously overpriced.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
8. Creative T20
   




  The T40's little brother. These are an AMAZING value. Sound quality is superb for the price (listed at $100, can be found as low as $50). Bass lacks punch. Distorts at high volumes. A great set for budget minded individuals who do not need big sound, but are looking for something better than the crappy 2.0s that come free with every new PC. Includes a headphone jack in front.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
9. Logitech Z520
   




  First and foremost, DO NOT BUY THESE. Yes, they look nice, but that's only without the grills. They are fingerprint magnets and, more importantly, sound HORRIBLE. At around $130, these are ridiculously overpriced. I bought them expecting them sound not much unlike my Z10s, as they are now Logitech's flagship 2.0s just as the Z10s were four years ago. They have a large soundstage, mainly due to a feature called 360 degree sound, but--trust me--this not sound you want to hear. Distortion is a mess. Avoid these like the plague.
   
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   
  Well, those are all the speakers I've gone through so far. And I still have not yet found the perfect pair. 
   
  Any suggestions?
   
  To help me update my list, please let me know which additional speakers you've heard and where you think they'd fit.
   
  Other speakers I'd like to check out (or perhaps hear of others' experiences with):
  1. B&W MM-1
  2. Genelec 6010a
  3. Mackie MR5
  4. KRK Rockit 5 G2
  5. Swans M200MKII/III
  6. Scandyna Drops/Smallpod
   
  More to come...
   
  Thanks for reading!


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## a_recording

Nice thread Xombie11! I'm glad that you enjoyed the T40s/T20s - for a while before I really got into audio, I had a pair of T20's and to be honest was blown away by their sound moving up from a horrible cheap Logitech 4.1 sat/sub system. I then bought a pair of T40 Series 2, and then as a birthday gift received a pair of Aktimate Mini active bookshelf speakers.
   
  These are definately worth a listen, though I didn't get a chance to compare against much besides systems like the Focal XS and B&W Zepplin. While I'm not sure they fit under the $500 dollar mark (I have never seen American prices for them, but my ones were $550 Australian dollars) they have an amazing punchy, dynamic sound with a surprising amount of soundstage and imaging. My only mark against them is that because they are rear ported, they need a fair bit of room to breathe, and the metallic tweeter can be a little shrill.
   
  I don't know where they will fit in your line-up, except that I have heard an opinion that they are better than the Audioengine A5's.


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## darcyb62

I have a pair of these that I'm quite content with:
   

   
http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?type=34&cat=20&id=332
   
  They run about $400 a pair.


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## ROBSCIX

Infrasonic has a set of monitors with a built in DAC, you might want to check them out.  I heard a set in a buddies recording studio and they sound very good.
  They are called the Blow5D's and they produce some excellent sound.  Have a look here: B5D Monitors


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## KaraSinek

good collection,
  i totally agreee with you about AudioEngine A2 and A5
creative t40>AudioEngine A2 & M-Audio BX5a > AudioEngine A5
   
  i use Fostex nearfield Studio Monitors and i love them,,,


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## AhhHoNG

i though the A5 would be the best choice out of these but seems like you didnt like them using iphone. Maybe you should try using them with a CD player or amp over at the shop? there are so many hypes here in headfi for A5 so things shouldnt be that bad?


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## vinnievidi

Thanks for your research! I totally agree with you on the Audioengines. Looking forward to your further reports.


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## DaveBSC

Swan M200 MkIII. Well worth the $400 price, they outperform everything else listed here.


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## miyinan

Well, I was gonna get AV40 and then looked at A2 as well. But now, I think I am getting the BX5a (or maybe some Swans, lol, I am undecisive). What is the difference between the BX5a and BX5a deluxe? Noticeable? worth the extra cost?
   
  Thanks


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## yliu

Bowers & Wilkins MM-1.


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## tony22

Quote: 





davebsc said:


> Swan M200 MkIII. Well worth the $400 price, they outperform everything else listed here.


 


 I have the MkII and like them very much.


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## 3X0

Thanks, I was afraid that the people believing Audioengines to be overrated were a minority.


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## Ypoknons

You should try more studio monitors, the Adam A5X and A7X are on my hit list for example.


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## Jubei

Nice thread. I have been looking to upgrade my PC speakers for some time, but most that sound good are abit too big for my desk. At any rate, good to see some comparisons!
   
  Currently using a 8 year old Altec Lansing 221 2.1 speaker set.


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## desktophifi

I'd go for swans...they do sound fantastic...and they last long.


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## AhhHoNG

Was looking at the BX5a but found out it doesnt have a central volume control. u have to adjust volume at the bak of each speaker so unfortunately i have to cancel this off my list. I do not have a AMP/DAC and plan on using my soundcard. Then i look at the Swan MKII and found out its not available in singapore. argh so what other alternatives do i have other than the AE5?


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## vinnievidi

If your computer has a remote or keyboard volume controls (like the Mac lines) then you can keep the BX5a volume up and control the system volume via the remote or keyboard.


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## AhhHoNG

I heard its not advisable to control thru the windows volume? and yeah my keyboard can control the volume


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## dfkt

Nice thread, Xombie11. Have you considered giving Adam speakers a try? They're some of the best I've heard (A5 and A7, that is). And they're made in Germany, built like a tank.
   
  http://www.adam-audio.com/en/pro-audio/products


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## Dalamar

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> I heard its not advisable to control thru the windows volume? and yeah my keyboard can control the volume


 

 I wouldn't worry about windows volume too much unless you're taking it under 50%. If you're obsessed with bit-perfectness, don't use it, but imo you won't hear a difference.


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## AhhHoNG

I have done some  research and discovered some good active bookshelves below 500.
   
  Markie MR5/8
   
  KRK RP5/6 GEN 2
   
  Behringer 3030A 3031A
   
  JBL LSR2325P
   
   
  wonder if these few are better than the Audioengine 5. I am looking for something better than AE5 but it as to be 300-400 price range for a pair.


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## The_X

Sorry, I sort of have to nitpick here...
  Quote: 





> They must be active and self-powered, as subs are big, bulky and often overpowering.


 
  What?  A subwoofer has nothing to do with being active/self-powered.  If you don't mind getting a receiver, there are lots of options out there for bookshelf speakers.
  Quote:


> Due to the weak internal amp, they cannot get very loud without the use of a soundcard or USB DAC; as such, their potential is wasted if you are planning to use them alongside a notebook or your desktop's onboard sound.


 
  What does a sound card or USB DAC have to do with loudness?
   
  Thanks for the recommendations though!  But I think you're a bit confused.  For my apartment, I just use a Yamaha stereo receiver and a pair of B&W 686's.  The 686 list at $480 I think, but you could probably find a good receiver and the 686's for under $500 on the used market.


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## Dalamar

Sound cards can have a higher output than some other devices, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_level
  However, that can just make it easier for the amp/speakers to go into clipping I believe. Higher end soundcards and almost all dacs are 2 vrms.
   
  You will be fine with the BX5A, just adjust the volume digitally in Windows. If your sound card's output is not 2 vrms then it will probably be 3-6 decibels lower in max volume than one that is.


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## Xombie11

the_x said:


> Sorry, I sort of have to nitpick here...
> What?  A subwoofer has nothing to do with being active/self-powered.  If you don't mind getting a receiver, there are lots of options out there for bookshelf speakers.
> What does a sound card or USB DAC have to do with loudness?
> 
> Thanks for the recommendations though!  But I think you're a bit confused.  For my apartment, I just use a Yamaha stereo receiver and a pair of B&W 686's.  The 686 list at $480 I think, but you could probably find a good receiver and the 686's for under $500 on the used market.







 Haha, sorry about that initial sentence. It used to be two sentences, one explaining my want for an active set of speakers rather than a passive set with an amp, the other expressing my disdain for subs. I combined them into one sentence, using 'as,' and one sentence that really makes no sense when you read into it.

 Regarding my comment about the Swans, I standby the volume issue. For more information, please see my thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/501233/dac-for-macbook-swans

 Btw this thread is in for a major rehaul, which I'll do shortly.


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## ccbass

As for the BX5a no having a central speaker control.....
   
  Many monitors are meant to be controlled by a mixer console, with volume control there, however since most of us don't mix/have consoles, I'd buy the TC Electronic Level Pilot.
   
  Completely passive, uses a high quality Bourns Pot, and is completely balanced.  If you're not using a DAC, then....
   
  Assuming you are using a 3.5mm out...
   
  3.5mm TRS/Y-cable unbalanced XLR out > Level Pilot > BX5a
   
  You would set your volume on your computer to 100% then use your level pilot for volume control, and set your BX5a to where ever you like.  I found dead center on the volume knobs is perfect for me.


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## RonaldDumsfeld

http://www.adam-audio.com/en/pro-audio/products/a3x/description
   
  New  ADAM A3X. These are nice. Just within budget, similar size (1" taller) than the AV40, go down to 60hz flat (+/-2dB), biamped (25W+25W+25W+25W) and come with a 5 year guarantee. balanced XLR or phono - with phono volume control on one controls both.
   
  Very flat and accurate frequency response. Forensic level of detail. Do poor sources no favours. Which you'd expect.
   
  edit : they are not smaller than the AV40. They are in fact 1" taller. thx to xombie11 for the correction.


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## Dalamar

Getting a volume knob is a total waste of money. All it does is reduce the signal. If the volume won't go loud enough to begin with the knob won't help at all. What a block-worthy post.
   
  If your volume goes loud enough - then you can use windows or foobar volume with no sq loss at all. Replaygain scanning in foobar helps a lot for tracks that are super quiet and nowhere near peak, as well as songs that are way too loud.


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## loveholic

Adam A5 or Quad 11L/12L active(a little over $600 for a used pair for the 12L's) or NHT M-00.


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## loveholic

Quote: 





dalamar said:


> Getting a volume knob is a total waste of money. All it does is reduce the signal. If the volume won't go loud enough to begin with the knob won't help at all. What a block-worthy post.
> 
> If your volume goes loud enough - then you can use windows or foobar volume with no sq loss at all. Replaygain scanning in foobar helps a lot for tracks that are super quiet and nowhere near peak, as well as songs that are way too loud.


 

 Getting a volume knob isn't wasre of money if your DAC doesn't have pre-amp function.. I had to use a pre amp for my Dyn MC15's to finally get the sound qualified for my ears.


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## Xombie11

Are these really smaller than the AV40s? I find that hard to believe.
   
  They do look quite interesting, however. I'd like to try them out. 
   
  Quote: 





ronalddumsfeld said:


> New  ADAM A3X. These are nice. Just within budget, smaller than the AV40, go down to 60hz flat (+/-2dB), biamped (25W+25W+25W+25W) and come with a 5 year guarantee. balanced XLR or phono - with phono volume control on one controls both.
> 
> Very flat and accurate frequency response. Forensic level of detail. Do poor sources no favours. Which you'd expect.


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## RonaldDumsfeld

Quote: 





> Are these really smaller than the AV40s? I find that hard to believe.


 
   
  Dimensions in inches HxWxD
   
   ADAM    A3X -  10 x 6 x 7.5
   
  M-Audio AV40 -  9 x 6 x 7.25
   
  So. Yeah. My bad - The ADAMs are actually an inch taller. They seemed smaller to me because they have front as opposed to rear ports and all the controls are in the front panel so I find they are more convenient to position.
   
  The point is there really isn't much in it. The AV40 go down to 85hz flat vs 60hz for the ADAMs. Decent deal for an extra vertical inch.


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## ClieOS

Just got the T40 Series II last week directly from Creative's Singapore store and S$50 off from the regular S$250 price tag. Seriously good sounding 2.0 speaker and I even pickup a small Creative sub to pair with it as well, totalling around US$210.


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## Defenestrator

My apologies if I should have started a new thread for this, but I've heard in a few reviews that the M-Audio Studiophile AV40s have an buzzing/humming noise, is this the case with all of them? Is it bad?


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## wgb113

If you like the sound of the Quad Studio 11L/12L Active but want to save some coin and don't care about plain black boxes definitely check out the Wharfedale Pro Diamond 8.1/8.2.  They use the same drivers and amps as their Quad cousins.
   
  Bill


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## ccbass

Quote: 





defenestrator said:


> My apologies if I should have started a new thread for this, but I've heard in a few reviews that the M-Audio Studiophile AV40s have an buzzing/humming noise, is this the case with all of them? Is it bad?


 

 I have nothing like that. Even with volume max'ed out and connected to an RCA source.
   
  The people having issues probably have a ground loop or interference.


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## bixby

Most of what you will find under $500 is fairly inaccurate and have some warts.  I shopped and heard lots of actives in your price range and above.  I ended up going passive.  
   
  My advice if you care is to try and find a used set of active speakers.  Something like the the Mackie HR624mkII for example should go for around $500 used.  Another option might be new Adam A5s if you like a very detailed sound.
   
  Next stop would be Dynaudio bm5 mkii, but even used they may be closer to $700.  I also might check out the new Adam A3x.
   
  Skip Yamaha, JBL, KRK, M-Audio, Swans, etc in this price range as all have significant flaws
   
  oops almost forgot the Focal CMS 50s.  I have only heard the CMS 65 and rank it up at the top of my list for the price.  If the 50 gets close it could be a great monitor to use for years.


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## AhhHoNG

Quote: 





bixby said:


> Most of what you will find under $500 is fairly inaccurate and have some warts.  I shopped and heard lots of actives in your price range and above.  I ended up going passive.
> 
> My advice if you care is to try and find a used set of active speakers.  Something like the the Mackie HR624mkII for example should go for around $500 used.  Another option might be new Adam A5s if you like a very detailed sound.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Have you heard the Mackie MR5/8 series? how isit? i read it is 1 of the best under the 500 price range


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## bixby

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> Have you heard the Mackie MR5/6 series? how is it? i read it is 1 of the best under the 500 price range


 

 I did hear the MR5s a while ago.  They sounded fairly thick like someone else mentioned above.  Perhaps it was because they were sitting right on the desktop and not up off of it.  This is a common mistake when using nearfield monitors and makes speakers like the MR5s and Audio Engines sound even more bloated on the bottom than they already are.  
   
  As for the 6 series, I suppose you mean the 624s?  Yes I have heard them and although the Dynaudios would be my preference, I think I could probably settle for the 624s.  You will get good bass from these and the mids are not nearly as colored as the KRKs.
   
  Hope this helps, but do try to hear them on your own and form your own opinion.  There is no substitute for that.
   
  EDIT:
   
  I see you edited your post on the mackie to the 8 series.   Come to think of it now that I looked them up I do believe I heard them too and did not care for them.  Same bass issue.


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## AhhHoNG

Oh maybe the MR5 you heard was eq-ed in the bass section ? to be frank my budget would only allow me up to 400. Other than the bass bloated issues, are there any positive impression? Those you recommended are very expensive to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 thanks !


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## Kawai_man

Ok maybe I can shed some light on this subject, I've been researching monitors and the best ones almost always use torroidal transformers, in fact the first three from the list use torroid transformers the rest as far as I know use regular EI transformers. Usually only higher end monitors like genelecs and dynudios use them because torroids are more expensive, only a few monitors under 500 use them which I will list below. The audioengines and swans are overated IMO, not that they are bad and these also use torroid transformers, but they use passive crossovers to separate the highs from the lows and use one amp to power both speakers. Active speakers use active crossovers which don't suck clarity from sound like passive ones do and each speaker has its own amp and power supply, as some of you may know in audio getting good clean power and good power distribution is like 50% of the battle to getting good sound. By design an active speaker is always going to sound better.
   
  These are the top 4 best sounding monitors IMO under 500 in ranking order these all use torroid transformers as well.
   
  JBL 2325p
  Tapco S5  ( identical to MR5's)
  Mackie MR5
  BX5a


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## AhhHoNG

what do you mean by, identical to MR5's? the ranking?


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## bixby

If I were doing a decent desktop system for $400 I would buy this 
   
  Qinpu 6000
   
http://www.head-direct.com/product_detail.php?p=62
   
  and something like this: PSB Image 15
   
http://www.psbspeakers.com/products/Image-Series/Image-B15-Monitor#product_detail
   
  or something similar from Energy or Paradigm.  Another possibility would be Klipsch although I am not sure how accurate the lower end models tend to be.  
   
   
  You can get quite a good sounding system for $400 now.  This little amp sounds great and can be used as a headphone amp as well.  And the PSB speakers are the model down from what I use the PSB 25s.
   
  The recommended system above will do much better than most $500 a pair actives, except for sheer loudness.
   
  I am sure not all of these brands may be available in Singapore but you should be able to source something like Wharfedale or Quad passives that may get close to the PSB in neutrality.
   
  Good luck in your search and let us know what you choose!


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## Kawai_man

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> what do you mean by, identical to MR5's? the ranking?


 

 Tapco is owned by mackie the Tapco S5 are pretty much the same as the MR5 with just different looks, I've heard both and they pretty much sounded identical i couldn't tell them apart. They are in racking order.


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## ThinJ

I went through a bit of a quest for a 2.1 setup for my computer recently and came to similar conclusions, though I didn't get to test any KRK or Swan stuff. I found a place that had KRK's monitors but couldn't test them, and nobody local carries Swan.

 But Audioengine and the others were fairly easy to locate dealers for and test.
   
  I ended up with a pair of BX5a's and have been pretty much ecstatic ever since.


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## wgb113

I'm telling you, they're not much to look at but for $300 they're definitely worth your consideration:
   
http://www.wharfedalepro.com/Home/Products/STUDIOMONITORS/DIAMONDSTUDIOPRO8/DiamondStudio82ProActive/tabid/277/Default.aspx


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## Defenestrator

I've been considering checking out genelec. Is that crazy? Could the sound really be that much better?


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## AhhHoNG

thanks but i really prefer actives. will read around at your recommendations


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## anwaypasible

there really arent many 2.0 speakers made that are good for bookshelf full frequency response.
   
  what i would suggest is four 8inch woofers (two per side) and then a single 5.25 inch midrange on each side (with a tweeter of course)
  this will allow you to keep the speakers as 'bookshelf' units (rather large, but they still fit !!)
  the bass extension will be far superior to anything in that price range already pre-built.
   
  you can find a used sony receiver with a blown surround channel or blown center channel for cheap to power the speakers .. or you could look into some sort of bash amplifier and put one in each (or just one) bookshelf cabinet.
   
  you have a chance to really stretch your dollar.. why not take it?


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## cheaphifi

Quote: 





xombie11 said:


> Well, those are all the speakers I've gone through so far. And I still have not yet found the perfect pair.
> 
> Any suggestions?
> 
> ...


 
  Swans M200 MKIII is one of the best active Bookshelf Speaker I've Ever Heard !, i think it must be in the upper steps on this podium !
  Swans M200 MKII are very different, the sound is less precise, there's less volume even at low sound-level...


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## wgb113

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> thanks but i really prefer actives. will read around at your recommendations


 

 ????  
   
  Both the Genelec and Wharfedale Pro speakers are active speakers...


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## bixby

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> thanks but i really prefer actives. will read around at your recommendations


 

 Cool, in the end you have to be happy that is all that matters!
   
  Good luck and let us know what you end up with.
   
   
  EDIT:  
  WGB113- I think he was responding to my rec of looking at passives as well.
   
  cheers


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## loveholic

Quote: 





cheaphifi said:


> Swans M200 MKIII is one of the best active Bookshelf Speaker I've Ever Heard !, i think it must be in the upper steps on this podium !
> Swans M200 MKII are very different, the sound is less precise, there's less volume even at low sound-level...


 

 I've had the MK1/MK2 as well as the t200a many years back and all I can tell you is that you need to try other speakers. They aren't even close.


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## clickhere

Can you get the Genelec 6010a for sub $500?


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## loveholic

Quote: 





clickhere said:


> Can you get the Genelec 6010a for sub $500?


 

 You would have to ask for a discount or find a used pair.


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## Defenestrator

Quote: 





clickhere said:


> Can you get the Genelec 6010a for sub $500?


 




  Quote: 





loveholic said:


> You would have to ask for a discount or find a used pair.


 

  
  Ye mean for two of them?


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## Defenestrator

What is the usual price for a pair of 6040As and the accompanying subwoofer? In euros if possible.


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## Defenestrator

EDIT: Can't we delete posts?


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## MikeW

So what's the best Active monitor pair under 300$ /w Front Ports. I guess that leaves  few options eh? 
   
  KRK and Behringer? that's about it


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## Defenestrator

Ports are where you plug in the power cable?


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## Steve-o27

How does the BX8a Deluxe compare to the BX5a Deluxe? I know the first one has a larger low frequency speaker and goes a bit lower but is it really worth the extra money? I'm thinking of replacing my AV40s and I'm in search for some decent near field monitors. My budget is around 300€, give or take 15€ for shipping.


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## ccbass

Quote: 





steve-o27 said:


> How does the BX8a Deluxe compare to the BX5a Deluxe? I know the first one has a larger low frequency speaker and goes a bit lower but is it really worth the extra money? I'm thinking of replacing my AV40s and I'm in search for some decent near field monitors. My budget is around 300€, give or take 15€ for shipping.


 

 They're near identical minus the BX8a's better low range.  Mind you that they pack a WHOPPING 8" driver.  Not exactly desk friendly.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

Quote: 





defenestrator said:


> Ports are where you plug in the power cable?


 

 The ports are bass reflex ports.  Most speakers are ported like that.  The port can be located on the front of the speaker, rear of the speaker, or even the side (though I can't think of a speaker right now that has the port on the side).  Rear ported speakers need to be located 6" or 12" or more from the wall so the port can breathe.  Put the speaker too close to the wall and you get bloom in the bass.  Front ported speakers are more flexible in placement since the port isn't going to get restricted by a wall next to it.
   
  Front ported speakers are more difficult to design cause there is not that much space on the front of a speaker cabinet, both physically and structurally, for a port.  So front ported speakers often have to make specially shaped ports which adds complications and cost in building the speaker.  The back of the speaker has lots of open space and it is easy to put a simple round port there.  There is also an issue with the wave from the port interacting with the wave from the driver so there are sonic complications to a front port as well.


----------



## Kawai_man

Quote: 





kawai_man said:


> Ok maybe I can shed some light on this subject, I've been researching monitors and the best ones almost always use torroidal transformers, in fact the first three from the list use torroid transformers the rest as far as I know use regular EI transformers. Usually only higher end monitors like genelecs and dynudios use them because torroids are more expensive, only a few monitors under 500 use them which I will list below. The audioengines and swans are overated IMO, not that they are bad and these also use torroid transformers, but they use passive crossovers to separate the highs from the lows and use one amp to power both speakers. Active speakers use active crossovers which don't suck clarity from sound like passive ones do and each speaker has its own amp and power supply, as some of you may know in audio getting good clean power and good power distribution is like 50% of the battle to getting good sound. By design an active speaker is always going to sound better.
> 
> These are the top 4 best sounding monitors IMO under 500 in ranking order these all use torroid transformers as well.
> 
> ...


 


  
  The speakers with the 8" woofers you will be sacrificing some midrange for more bass, the ones with the smaller woofers will have better midrange but a little less bass , I've owned or listened to all those monitors above and they have more  enough bass for small to medium rooms I wouldn't want more bass, the 2325p's in have the best bass, while the tapcos and mackies and m-audio bx5a's have best midrange, you cant go wrong with any of them IMO.
   
  the 8" versions of those monitors also use toroidal transformers


----------



## Souji

I just came back from GuitarCenter.
   
  I went to check out the BX5a Deluxe and whatever else they had in the same price range.
   
  I was glued listening to both the BX5a Deluxe and Yamaha HS50M.
   
  They both sounded very good, but IMHO the Yamaha HS50M were definitely better.
   
  The clarity of the mids and highs were so crisp and clear. I fell in love.


----------



## MikeW

I also went to guitar center today, had a brief listen to the KRK RP5's and I was quite impressed. Im pretty sure those are going to be my next set of computer speakers. Got to love the front port, no placement problems, they go quite loud and seemed to have a surprising amount of bass output, i was looking for a subwoofer. Though, they only extend to about 55 hrz, they do that really well.


----------



## kimragone

My journey in powered monitors started about 3 years ago when I picked up a pair of Audioengine A2's. Nice little speaker considering the size, but a sub is definitely  recommended. Then I came across a pair of KRK V4 and the Audioengine quickly went to a spare guest room. Much better definition in the KRK's and bass was present enough that I could almost turn off the old B&W subwoofer. 
  Fast forward to the present where a pair of Event Tuned Reference 8 are sitting on each side of my monitor. For me, this is as good as it's gonna get without breaking the bank. The subwoofer has been turned off permanently and every time I listen to them I'm surprised how pleasant they sound. Never harsh, never dull, just right.


----------



## cheaphifi

Quote: 





kawai_man said:


> The audioengines and swans are overated IMO, not that they are bad and these also use torroid transformers, but they use passive crossovers to separate the highs from the lows and use one amp to power both speakers. Active speakers use active crossovers which don't suck clarity from sound like passive ones do and each speaker has its own amp and power supply, as some of you may know in audio getting good clean power and good power distribution is like 50% of the battle to getting good sound. By design an active speaker is always going to sound better.
> 
> These are the top 4 best sounding monitors IMO under 500 in ranking order these all use torroid transformers as well.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Swans M200 MKIII do have Bi-amplification and Active Crossover, they're very different than the M200 and M200 MKII, here are the specs :
   
  M200MKIII

          
 
 




 General Data Model HiVi M200MKIII System Series 2.0 Professional active electron filter multimedia speaker system Acoustic System System Type 2-way, 4th order active vented box speaker system Drivers Configuration 5.25" mid range,25mm dome tweeter Frequency Range 53Hz-20kHz Sensitivity 87dB (2.83V/1m) Nominal Impedance 4Ω Power Range 10-80W Amplifiers System Rated Power 60W for single channel 120W for two channels Active Crossover Frequency 1.8kHz Bass Adjust ±3dB (100Hz) Treble Adjust ±3dB (10KHz) Separation >56dB Signal-to-Noise >85dB Distortion THD<0.1% ( 8Ω、10W ) Input sensitivity 680mV Input impedance 32kΩ Other Parameter Finished Matte black finish and solid wood side panels Dimension (W×H×D(mm)) 192×335×270 Net Weight Active Speaker : 8.0Kg 
 Passive Speaker : 5.8Kg


----------



## t1337Dude

I own both the BX5a Deluxe and the A5's. I think the A5s were much better (especially at louder volumes). There's a certain charm to the laid back sound and the vocal clarity was perfect. I use the BX5a's in the basement now.


----------



## wgb113

Quote: 





cheaphifi said:


> Swans M200 MKIII do have Bi-amplification and Active Crossover, they're very different than the M200 and M200 MKII, here are the specs :
> 
> M200MKIII
> 
> ...


 
   
  Those are NOT bi-amped.  A bi-amped speaker would have separate amplifier ratings for the tweeter and woofer in each speaker.  For example, my Quad 12L Actives have 40W going to each tweeter and 60W going to each woofer.


----------



## Kawai_man

Quote: 





kimragone said:


> My journey in powered monitors started about 3 years ago when I picked up a pair of Audioengine A2's. Nice little speaker considering the size, but a sub is definitely  recommended. Then I came across a pair of KRK V4 and the Audioengine quickly went to a spare guest room. Much better definition in the KRK's and bass was present enough that I could almost turn off the old B&W subwoofer.
> Fast forward to the present where a pair of Event Tuned Reference 8 are sitting on each side of my monitor. For me, this is as good as it's gonna get without breaking the bank. The subwoofer has been turned off permanently and every time I listen to them I'm surprised how pleasant they sound. Never harsh, never dull, just right.


 

 yeah the V4 are also fantastic and uses the high quality torroid transformers,  I would have added them to my little list I made but its discontinued speaker
   
   
  Those M200 MKIII are not active speakers


----------



## Ham Sandwich

Quote: 





wgb113 said:


> Those are NOT bi-amped.  A bi-amped speaker would have separate amplifier ratings for the tweeter and woofer in each speaker.  For example, my Quad 12L Actives have 40W going to each tweeter and 60W going to each woofer.


 

 The product page at Swan Speaker and the manual available at Audio Insider indicate that it is an active bi-amped speaker with an active crossover and four channels of amplification.  The speaker with the amps has 4 channels of amplification inside.  60W at 4 ohms for the woofer and 60W at 4 ohms for the tweeter.  The cable that connects from the amped speaker to the non-amped speaker has four wires so it's powering the woofer and tweeter separately.  Interesting design to stuff all the amps in one speaker.  Makes for a more computer speaker friendly setup since there can be one volume knob that controls both speakers.  Would save on costs as well since you would only need one power supply for all the amps rather than having a power supply in each speaker.


----------



## bixby

Quote: 





ham sandwich said:


> The product page at Swan Speaker and the manual available at Audio Insider indicate that it is an active bi-amped speaker with an active crossover and four channels of amplification.  The speaker with the amps has 4 channels of amplification inside.  60W at 4 ohms for the woofer and 60W at 4 ohms for the tweeter.  The cable that connects from the amped speaker to the non-amped speaker has four wires so it's powering the woofer and tweeter separately.  Interesting design to stuff all the amps in one speaker.  Makes for a more computer speaker friendly setup since there can be one volume knob that controls both speakers.  Would save on costs as well since you would only need one power supply for all the amps rather than having a power supply in each speaker.


 
  Not to nitpick but I used to own the mark 2 version of this speaker and it was certainly not a bi-amped speaker nor did it have an electronic crossover.   I read your linked material for the Mark 3 and could not find any mention of of it in any of the specs or user guides.  There is only a vague mention of 120 watts total.  Certainly NO mention of 4 channels of amplification.
  EDIT:
   
  It is mentioned in the text preceding the specs.
   
  EDIT:
   
   
  APOLOGIES to the Pork man
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I know the reviews also say they are biamped and use an active crossover,  but why don't they make it perfectly clear in the specs.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

They are not clear at all in the marketing material or the manual about what exactly the speaker system is doing.  I had the piece the info together from multiple locations.  They need to work on their marketing.  Being active differentiates it from speakers like the AudioEngine which are passive speakers that happen to have an amp inside.
   
  The last page of the manual (PDF file at Audio Insider) mentions the power specs to each driver (60W to woofer and 60W to tweeter).
  It also says the woofer is magnet proof.  I assume that's engrish for magnetically shielded.


----------



## kite7

Quote: 





t1337dude said:


> I own both the BX5a Deluxe and the A5's. I think the A5s were much better (especially at louder volumes). There's a certain charm to the laid back sound and the vocal clarity was perfect. I use the BX5a's in the basement now.


 

 That's the only thing the A5 was good at, vocals. Anything upbeat like modern rock sounds much better on the BX5a. The tweeter in undeniably better on the BX5a. The BX5a is also much crisper to my ears. If you listen to slow tunes, I can understand why you would prefer the A5. Anything that is speedy and requires a certain energy spark the BX5a is far better to me in that aspect. Ultimately, the A5 sound too warm for me which I am not too keen about. The rounding of the transients and mid bass hump is colorization that sealed the A5 off for me.


----------



## bixby

Quote: 





ham sandwich said:


> the woofer is magnet proof.


 
  I almost fell out of my chair with that one.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  If I had a dollar for every poorly translated sentence.


----------



## wgb113

Thanks for the clarification Ham Sandwich...that's on lousy manual/spec sheet.  Swan Product Literature = FAIL.
   
  Chalk it up to the typical poor English translation...
   
  Bill


----------



## MikeW

KRK RP5 G2 imrpessions please! I guess no one has heard them.


----------



## Kawai_man

I heard them at guitar center, I cant give specifics because I heard them a while back, I thought were pretty good but I liked the other ones I listed on the previous page more.


----------



## cheaphifi

Quote: 





wgb113 said:


> Those are NOT bi-amped.  A bi-amped speaker would have separate amplifier ratings for the tweeter and woofer in each speaker.  For example, my Quad 12L Actives have 40W going to each tweeter and 60W going to each woofer.


 

 On the Swan European Page they are described as Bi-Amped, and i own them i can assure you that they're Bi-Amped, just take a look at the Cable Which Connect the 2 Cabinets.
  And the sound is completely different from the M200 MkII, clearer, heavier, better instrument separation and wider soundstage.
   
  (Source http://www.swans-europe.eu/swans-monitor-lautsprecher+M52087573ab0.html)
   








 
 *Swans M200MKII* active high-end compact monitor has a wide range of uses. Whether as a near-field monitor in the recording studio and other professional installations, as high-value multi-media speakers or as an I-Pod companion, there is an almost unlimited number of applications this monitor can be used for. The M-200MKII provides an extremely neutral sound reproduction. It has a surprisingly high output level especially considering its size. Exacting volume, treble and bass controls are located on the front of the main speaker. The integrated amplifier is constructed with high-quality components and is phonetically in no way inferior to an external hi-fi amplifier. The M-200MKII closes a market niche in which until today affordable high-quality speaker systems couldn't be found. 






​ 

​ 

​ 

​ 

​ 

​ ​   


     
  
 *Swans M200MKII High-End Active Monitor* *Specifications:*  

 2-way / 4.Order active bass reflex system
 Frequency Response: 56Hz-20kHz +/-3dB
 Efficiency ( 2.83V/m ): 87dB
 Nominal Impedance: 5 Ohm
 Tweeter: Swans 25mm doped silk 
 Bass/Mid: Swans 5" HighEnd-Midwoofer 
 Amplification: 2x35 W/RMS
 THD: <0.06% (8 Ohm, 1 KHz, 10W)
 Input Sensitivity: 650mV/22KOhm
 Controls: Volume, Highs, Bass
 Size: 192x233x350mm
 Weight: 6 Kg
 Cabinet Finish: Walnut Design Real Wood/Flat Black
 








 
 We are 'sad' to announce to all amplifier manufacturers that the fully active stylish version of the M200 is available for sale   
 
 Offering an amazing sound, the M200 MKIII brings out the soul and essence in everything played through it.  
 Let us start with the electronics... There are four per side (!) bi-amped tweeter as well as bi-amped Mid/Bass chassis for the MKIII version. The bass is a long-throw design which sounds like there is a much larger unit playing. The dynamic range of our new 'active' speaker astonishes. The decorative real wood side panels are not only attractive but help lower the resonances of the massive MDF enclosure.  
  
  






​ 

​ 

​ 

​


​ 

​ 

​ 

​ 
 ​   




​ 

​ 

​ 

​ 

​ 

​ ​


----------



## wgb113

Yeah Ham Sandwich cleared it up.  Just poor translations and marketing literature that's not seamless.


----------



## prozach1576

Man, I really want those Swans. Are they good for both classical and rock? I'm looking to spend around $400 and they seem perfect for me. What else should I be considering in that price range or less? I'm a little turned off by all the talk of studio monitors being "clinical" and "cold." I really want something with some warmth and a natural-sounding low end to make up for the bright sound of my Alessandro MS2s.


----------



## Sotiris

what u have to say comparing genelec 8020 to all of the above?


----------



## Kawai_man

Quote: 





prozach1576 said:


> Man, I really want those Swans. Are they good for both classical and rock? I'm looking to spend around $400 and they seem perfect for me. What else should I be considering in that price range or less? I'm a little turned off by all the talk of studio monitors being "clinical" and "cold." I really want something with some warmth and a natural-sounding low end to make up for the bright sound of my Alessandro MS2s.


 
   
  I've never found studio monitors to sound cold at least not the ones I've owned, IMO I think this misconception comes from when you listen to them at somewhere like guitar center where they basically have one source like a cd player. The signal from that source gets split many times to feed it to all the different speakers they have in there and each signal has to travel through long cables to reach the speaker, so what you hear is usually a thin sound.
   
  If you want natural sounding low end then studio monitors will be you're best bet because they a flat frequency response, the bass is very detailed like you can distinguish the notes from a bass guitar and hear the difference between a bass drum and bass guitar.


----------



## Ishnaya

Not too relevant of a post.


----------



## prozach1576

Well, just gave in and ordered the Swans. Hopefully they don't disappoint (and hopefully I can figure out how to fit them on my desk...).


----------



## satkinsn

I know it breaks the spirit of the thread, but I own two 2.1 sets that are special. The Acoustic Energy Aego-Ms are as good a purpose built computer speaker as I've heard, and like the original poster I have listened to a lot of active speakers.
   
  The other is the sadly out of production Monsoon series - I have the MH 500s, and I recommend anyone who runs into one in the series (I think there were 700s and 1000s as well) give them a try. The desktop parts were flat panel, and you can think of them as very distant cousins to maggies.
   
  All that said, I like the Audioengines better than a lot of folks posting in this thread. My experience is that they're clear and accurate, and don't try to pretend to be bigger than they are.
   
  Scott A.
  Watertown NY


----------



## Skoobs

rti a1 or a3 in combo with a small tube amp =)


----------



## tmars78

Quote: 





ishnaya said:


> ​  ​  ​ I love them! They look great on my desk next to my MacBook Pro. Nice and small/compact. LOADS of sound come out of these!​ *Made of wood instead of plastic as with the M-Audio equivalent.*​ Available in many colors, but the white is very sexy!​ MRSP less than $200 CND​  ​  ​


 

 Sounds like you are pitching these things, and the M-Audio's are not made of plastic.


----------



## lozanoa11

Oh this is just the thread I needed right now. With the M-audio Bx5a's does it come with RCA to 1/4" or XLR cables or will I need to make them?


----------



## prozach1576

Quote: 





lozanoa11 said:


> Oh this is just the thread I needed right now. With the M-audio Bx5a's does it come with RCA to 1/4" or XLR cables or will I need to make them?


 

 It doesn't come with cables - I was just looking at them on Amazon the other day and it specifically said so.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

None of the studio monitor style speakers like the BX5a and similar will come with audio cables.  However they should all come with power cables (each speaker is individually powered so each speaker needs a power cable).
   
  MonoPrice has professional style cables (XLR, 1/4 inch TS, 1/4 inch TRS).  Look under "Audio Cables - Professional"
  You can also get inexpensive pro-audio cables like Hosa from places like Guitar Center
  You can also use a 1/4 TS to RCA adapter and use regular RCA cables
   
  XLR is for balanced audio
  TRS (Tip Ring Sleeve) is for balanced audio
  TS (Tip Sleeve) is for unbalanced audio (normal consumer audio as you'd do with regular RCA audio cables)
   
  Most studio monitor speakers can do either balanced or unbalanced audio


----------



## Skoobs

can do either balanced or unbalanced? is there another kind? or do you mean that each individual pair is capable of both setups, depending on the cable used?


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

Quote: 





> do you mean that each individual pair is capable of both setups, depending on the cable used?


 
   
  He did. Well sort of.
   
  It doesn't just depend on the cable. It also depends on the circuitry at both ends. For the circuit to be truly balanced both ends have to be balanced and the cable TRS.
   
  So if your source component output is unbalanced (i.e. consumer grade) you might as well use RCA to RCA as RCA to TS.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

Quote: 





ronalddumsfeld said:


> He did. Well sort of.


 

 I was aiming for the Cliff Notes version of an explanation on cables.  A full explanation of balanced and unbalanced cables and connections when mixing consumer and pro-audio gear gets to be a rather more complicated thing to explain.
   
  It is neat how gear like studio monitors are able to take either balanced or unbalanced signals based on whether you use a TS or TRS plug.  It's almost magic.
   
  The easy way to go for most people is to just use unbalanced all the way through to the monitor speakers.  Most people have DACs and other sources that are unbalanced (regular RCA). So just keep it all unbalanced all the way to the headphone amp and the speakers.  It's much easier that way.


----------



## Skoobs

ah indeed. i wasnt considering that for some reason.


----------



## germanium

I got a chance today to listen to The Mackie MR5's Tannoy Reveal 510A's & the JBL 2325 monitors. All of these are in the price range you were looking at.
   
  In a word skip the Mackie MR5's. Bloated muddy bass period. Any positives are overshadowed by this huge flaw.
   
  The JBL 2325 are much better in this segard & have strong but very well balance & articulate bass, Where they fall down is in the mids which are quite lifeless, like there is a suckout in the upper mids. Imaging seemed a little flat & 2 dimentional as a result. They do hold good promise for modding but the next speaker on this short list really caught my attention.Overall I prefered the sound of my modded BX5's due to the more open sounding mids & the Yamahas for the same reason butthe lack of bass power on these 2 speaker models is why I'm looking at other speakers. I wanted speakers with bass good enough to work well with or without a subwoofer. I may put whatever speakers I get in the living room or I may just sideline my BX5's. either way they need to do well.
   
   
  Here it is the Tannoy Reveal 501A's The only flaw that I found with these speakers was being a little short on the power side, IE. the power amp was probably the lowest power of the lot & it showed by clipping rather early compared to the others. However kept within ther power capability they were by far the best sounding of the lot. They had really solid bass without being overblown or muddy (similar to the JBL in this regard) & a wide open fully fleshed out midband that was lively & articulate like the Yamahas' I also heard there, the Yamahas were lacking on the bass end however putting them out of my cosideration. The  Tannoys also had a highly detailed treble but were smoother sounding to me than the Yamaha's.
   
  Overall my pick is the Tannoy Reaveal 501A's. They do just what the name implies & that is reveal your mix good or bad. They are extremely well balanced & detailed without excessive harshness. I just wished they had a little more power however my room is smaller than the room where I heard them so it is probably not an issue. I may get them next week.
   
  I also listened to the KRK Rockit 5's & were not impressed at all with them. Very little bass to speak of . Mids & Treble ok but lack of any meaningfull bass killed these from cosideration. Worse than the Yamaha's in this regard & not as lively too boot. Dead on both counts.


----------



## AhhHoNG

Wad if you -1 or 2db for the LF for mackie mr5, would it be better since the bass is its only weakness? i was planning to pair it with a sub so lowering the LF would help i guess? Other than the bass for mackie mr5, anything positive?


----------



## matthewh133

The MR5 was garbage in comparison to both the Yamaha HS50M and the KRK Rokit RP6 when I tested them out. Muddy as anything..


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> Wad if you -1 or 2db for the LF for mackie mr5, would it be better since the bass is its only weakness? i was planning to pair it with a sub so lowering the LF would help i guess? Other than the bass for mackie mr5, anything positive?


 

 1-2 db attenuation would not fix the obnoxious bass of the MR5's. Perhaps cutting the bass off at 100 Hz would help. The muddiness of the bass seemed to emminate from the 75 to 150 Hz range. The JBLs that I heard had similar deep bass output without the muddiness of the MR5's indicating the problem was a midbass problem. This muddyness completely overshaowed everything else to the point that I couldn't tell what was going on very well higher up.


----------



## Souji

@germanium
   
  Definitely pick those Tannoy Reveal 501a's up! I was at the Guitar Center multiple times, listening to various monitors including the Yamaha HS50M, JBL LSR2325P, M-Audio BX5a Deluxe for hours.
   
  I love my Tannoy's to death, I am very glad with my purchase.


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





souji said:


> @germanium
> 
> Definitely pick those Tannoy Reveal 501a's up! I was at the Guitar Center multiple times, listening to various monitors including the Yamaha HS50M, JBL LSR2325P, M-Audio BX5a Deluxe for hours.
> 
> I love my Tannoy's to death, I am very glad with my purchase.


 

 Looked at my finances & determined I wouldn't be able to swing getting a pair of Tannoy reveals in the next month or so so broke out the old soldering iron to see if I could get the sound I wanted from my BX5's IE more bass without compromising the fantastic mids & treble on these.
   
  In a word, success!!
   
  I disabled the subsonic filter which was definately cutting into the audible bas that these speakers could generate. Before there was a pretty good rolloff below 100 Hz that got pretty steep around 80 Hz & a very sharp rolloff after that. Not much was audible below 70Hz. By diabling the subsonic filter on the EQ board inside the speaker I was able to get pretty solid response down to 50 Hz & some output down into the 40Hz range which makes music all that much more enjoyable. Especially now that I have stereo bass that extends that low instead of mono bass through my subwoofer. I will still be using the sub for frequencies below 50Hz but not above. The best thing is is the the mids & low treble is even better sounding than before.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

So you turned your BX5's into BX8's with a soldering iron?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  My brother has an older pair of Tannoy monitors (I don't know what model).  He calls them "annoys" as a joke.


----------



## prozach1576

Wow, these Swans are absolutely great. Great soundstage, crisp highs, full midrange, decent enough bass for my purposes. They look incredible too.


----------



## jjmai

Do you guys leave your speakers on all the time?
  I noticed the back of my BX5a runs a little warm when on.  Since I leave my PC on most of the time, I was hoping to leave Bx5a on as well.
  Don't know which is worse - constant high temperature, or frequent power cycles.


----------



## prozach1576

Seems like you would be burning a lot of unnecessary electricity leaving them on all the time. If they're warm it means they're using energy. I can't imagine the electronics in this class of speakers is even remotely delicate enough to make excess power cycles a serious concern.


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





ham sandwich said:


> So you turned your BX5's into BX8's with a soldering iron?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Doing some listening at my normal volume & your discription in largely correct . Not quite the volume capability but better mids than BX8. Everything from the lower mids down has more body yet detail is not lost at all. Bass drum hit much harder than before. It is really amazing how good these little speakers are given a little work. The bass is very well balanced & extended for the size of the speaker with these mods These speakers are good enough now to do mixing on & making value judgements as to how much bass to put on a track & you would be very close to ideal. I believe that these little ones modded are significantly better than the BX8's.


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Do you guys leave your speakers on all the time?
> I noticed the back of my BX5a runs a little warm when on.  Since I leave my PC on most of the time, I was hoping to leave Bx5a on as well.
> Don't know which is worse - constant high temperature, or frequent power cycles.


 

 It is normal to run somewhat warm even at idle & they can get quite hot when run hard. They are class AB amps which have some idle current draw


----------



## cheaphifi

Quote: 





prozach1576 said:


> Wow, these Swans are absolutely great. Great soundstage, crisp highs, full midrange, decent enough bass for my purposes. They look incredible too.


 
  You've inverted the right and the left speaker, Normally the Speaker with Switch and control must be located at Right
   
  It seems you have the MkIII Model, it's completely different than the Swans M200 and M200 MkII, on the MkIII There's much more Power in the amp and Bi-Amping with Active Filters : The sound is one step above the other models, sound very good with all my DACs, and with the Audio-GD DAC-19 DSP, it's just "exceptional"


----------



## Ham Sandwich

Quote: 





germanium said:


> Doing some listening at my normal volume & your discription in largely correct . Not quite the volume capability but better mids than BX8. Everything from the lower mids down has more body yet detail is not lost at all. Bass drum hit much harder than before. It is really amazing how good these little speakers are given a little work. The bass is very well balanced & extended for the size of the speaker with these mods These speakers are good enough now to do mixing on & making value judgements as to how much bass to put on a track & you would be very close to ideal. I believe that these little ones modded are significantly better than the BX8's.


 

 Neat.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  One thing I've noticed with my BX8a is that the sound does clean up if you do some high pass (low cut) to remove some of the low bass extension.  I have a hardware EQ that has an adjustable high pass filter for the bass.  I use it when I'm feeling like cleaner sound.  If I'm feeling like more bass I turn it off.  I don't have (or want) a sub.  The downstairs neighbors wouldn't appreciate me having a sub.


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





ham sandwich said:


> Neat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Carefull tuning of the sub can realy work wonders for deep bass extension without overdoing it. Many people look for impressive bass rather than accurate bass that is just extended In my caseI have reduced the crossover frequency to 50Hz & the volume just barely above the place where the is no volume at all from the sub. Many people give thier sub way too much volume & the bass ends up sounging thick instead of accurate. In many cases it is not the fault of the sub, just that of tuning.
   
  That said most of my listening since doing this last mod has been without the sub & have felt very little need for it. I find only certain music the really benefits from the sub after these mods. That is quite impressive for such a small speaker.


----------



## prozach1576

Quote: 





cheaphifi said:


> You've inverted the right and the left speaker, Normally the Speaker with Switch and control must be located at Right
> 
> It seems you have the MkIII Model, it's completely different than the Swans M200 and M200 MkII, on the MkIII There's much more Power in the amp and Bi-Amping with Active Filters : The sound is one step above the other models, sound very good with all my DACs, and with the Audio-GD DAC-19 DSP, it's just "exceptional"


 

 I know, but I plugged the left channel RCA cable into the right channel input (and vice versa) to compensate. Having the amp/inputs on the left just makes for easier cable management.
   
  And yeah, these things get loud as hell. They also definitely push my uDAC to the limit. I'm thinking about upgrading to a Asus Xonar Essence STX as a source soon and dedicating the uDAC to my laptop.


----------



## germanium

Been doing more listening to the modded BX5's since my last mod & all I can say is WWWOOOOOWWWWWWW. The extra body is really revealing of the studio room acoustics. The inaging is also substantially better from side to side & there is better sense of depth as well. The sub couldn't help these kind characteristics, only the deep bass extension without messing up other things. Voices sound really fleshed out without sounding boomy or chesty. No need to upgrade here now afterall, got the sound I was looking for. I'm really Impressed with what these speakers are capable of. I heard similar type of sound from the Tannoys so I think most people would be really happy with them. I think my modded BX5's may be a little better now though than the Tannoys Though the Tannoys have good potential.
   
  The nice thing of the Tannoys is they show more of their potential in stock form as they come from the factory so no one would have to mod them to get really good sound to start with though minor mods can improve certain aspects of them. I could hear on them minor intermodulation that may be caused by power supply fuses between the power supply filter caps & the amps. This type of modulation distortion is easy to pick out once hear it & find the cause like I have with other amps. It may also be caused by too short of voice coil for the low frequency extension but I don't think that is the case with the Tannoys. I heard the same type of distortion on the Adcom GFA 545 when I had that. I removed those fuses and soldered a buss bar in thier place & lowered the current rating slightly on the A.C. power fuse to compensate& that fixed the intermodulation distortion on that amp. Now I get rid of them wherever I see them used in that location.
   
  These fuses existed on the BX5's also & they were the first things to go with my mods. The modded BX5's do not have this issue at all


----------



## AhhHoNG

I bought myself a pair of Mackie MR5 even after i read those negative reviews. Yeah there is a little bit too much bass, 50-100 hz mark. But the soundstage is really nice, wider den KRK Rokit 5. highs are smooth. I am paring it with a subwoofer soon so i could crossover the bass at 80hz for the Mackie Mr5 so it shouldnt be a big problem i guess.


----------



## bixby

Congrats,  be sure to get them up off the desk that will improve resolution and definition in the bass and mids.  5-10 inches high should be adequate


----------



## AhhHoNG

Thanks! What should i buy to make a 5-10 inch lift? can i buy a plastic rectangle container?


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> Thanks! What should i buy to make a 5-10 inch lift? can i buy a plastic rectangle container?


 

 I'd like to know too.  What difference does material make (metal, wood, plastic)?  Hollow/solid?
  I wish I have the carpenter skill like this guy: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/498804/my-custom-m-audio-av-40-speaker-stands


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I'd like to know too.  What difference does material make (metal, wood, plastic)?  Hollow/solid?
> I wish I have the carpenter skill like this guy: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/498804/my-custom-m-audio-av-40-speaker-stands


 

 Most solids will have pretty much the same issue of transfering sound vibrations to the surface below hence causing it to vibrate & giving secondary radiation of sound that is unwanted. The harder the surface the greater the transfer of vibration to the surface below all other things being equal. Most studios use foam because it absorbs the vibration without transfering it to the surface below hence you don't get unwanted secondary sound radiation from the desktop surface or in tier case the meter bridge of the mix board. Foam is not pretty but is better for sound than any solid. Also placement can help reduce unwanted reflections that can alter the perceived frequency balance of the speakers. Placing speakers close to the front edge of the desk reduces the surfaces that can reflect sound thus making them sound more neutral if they are truely good speakers to begin with.


----------



## Ham Sandwich

The general goal with positioning 2-way nearfield monitors is to get them at a height so that your ear level when at your listening position is between the tweeter and the woofer.  You can do that by putting them on stands and lifting them up high enough.  Or you can keep them low and angle them back so that they aim at your ears.  That's just a general rule.  Some tweeters and speakers are more directional than others and will be more picky about placement and height.  Experiment.  If the tweeter is right at ear height you may find the speaker to be too bright.  If the tweeter is too high or too low you may find that the highs roll off or soften.  So proper height affects the tonal balance.
   
  You also want to angle the speakers in so that they aim towards you.


----------



## Lucias_D

Quote: 





germanium said:


> I disabled the subsonic filter which was definately cutting into the audible bas that these speakers could generate. Before there was a pretty good rolloff below 100 Hz that got pretty steep around 80 Hz & a very sharp rolloff after that. Not much was audible below 70Hz. By diabling the subsonic filter on the EQ board inside the speaker I was able to get pretty solid response down to 50 Hz & some output down into the 40Hz range which makes music all that much more enjoyable...


 

 Where is this EQ board inside the speaker cab? I've definitely had these for years and have pulled them apart but don't remember there being anything really adjustable internally. In addition, a large part of the electronics are dipped meaning permanent install... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//frown.gif" title="
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" width="" />. These babies have plenty of power and I know that low end can be extended by what I've heard at loud listening volumes. SHOW ME THE MOD!


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





lucias_d said:


> Where is this EQ board inside the speaker cab? I've definitely had these for years and have pulled them apart but don't remember there being anything really adjustable internally. In addition, a large part of the electronics are dipped meaning permanent install...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  These are the BX5's not the BX5a. the newer ones don't have the four switches in the back. The BX5's have an EQ board with four switches that stick out the back. One called acoustic space, the secocond one is for tweeter level, third one is for mid boost & the last on is for low frequency cutoff. The low frequency cutoff is what I disabled. By the way the newest CX5's have these switches again. On the BX5 the low frequency cutoff levels are stated to be 56Hz, 80Hz & 100Hz but even on the 56Hz cutoff there is very little if anything below 70Hz coming out of the speakers. These speakers are capable of much more. I disabled the low frequency cutoff by removing 2-56 nanofarad caps & puting a single wire in that went around both caps by attaching it to the lower most terminal & the upper most terminal bypassing the 2 center terminals. This feeds the output of the one amp that includes some EQ directly to the input of the following amp instead of going though the 2-56 nanofarad caps which blocks the low frequencies.
   
  This mod allong with getting rid of the coupling caps on the main amp board as well as removing all the caps going to ground from the negative feedback loops & putting wire in thier place on the main board means that the woofer amps are fully D.C. amp capable & even the tweeter amp would be D.C. amp capable if not for the crossovers. I found that D.C. capable amps have a much better sound than most amps that are not D.C. capable. The only exceptions being Tube amps & amps that use very high qualty metalized film caps going to ground from the negative feedback loop. These caps are very large & expensive & will not fit within these speakers in the spaces that they would need to go so full D.C. coupling is the only way to get the best sound from these speakers
  
  These mods are not recomended for novices that lack experience tracing circuits & soldering in tight places as well as knowing what to look for when making measurments. One slip with the measurement probe in the wrong place even & the amp is history.
  
  The Bx5a's had much more bass response than the BX5 as they came from the factory


----------



## bixby

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> Thanks! What should i buy to make a 5-10 inch lift? can i buy a plastic rectangle container?


----------



## tmars78

Quote: 





ahhhong said:


> Thanks! What should i buy to make a 5-10 inch lift? can i buy a plastic rectangle container?


 

 I used plastic containers with mine when I had them. I now have the CX5s and use 2 bricks, and these foam pads I made at work....which i could make you for free, and make thicker if anyone would be interested. Also made to the size you want. Costs me nothing.


----------



## ccbass

I built a pair of wood stands and they came out great.  However the most important thing you want to do is minimize vibration from the speaker to your desk.  I'd get some foam pads or professionally built Auralex Mopads and put them on top of stands.


----------



## Danno

How's the Swans T200B compare to the speakers on this list? Or Adam A3X?


----------



## AhhHoNG

Quote: 





tmars78 said:


> I used plastic containers with mine when I had them. I now have the CX5s and use 2 bricks, and these foam pads I made at work....which i could make you for free, and make thicker if anyone would be interested. Also made to the size you want. Costs me nothing.


 

 Thanks but i bought my own plastic container haha. And we are obviously at different place of the world.


----------



## ozz

Another player from a well known brand. http://broadcastengineering.com/products/neumann-announces-kh-120-studio-monitor-20100926/


----------



## AhhHoNG

If i am not wrong, the Adam A3X would sound identical to the A5X except for its bass response right?


----------



## MikeW

I decided on the KRK RP5's.. got them from Guitarcenter for 137.99 ea. Im very satisfied with them, they sound quite abit better after 120 hrs of burn in. I was a little disapointed at first, but they have really came into their own, I ended up putting them on some Auralex Mopads, made a huge difference, my desk was very resonant. They are very loud and clear, good soundstage and imaging, my only complaint is the bass could be a bit cleaner down near the bottom range, it can be a little muddy at times, it improved drastically with the Mopads, and probably would be even better with room treatment. I've got them hooked up to my Heavily modded Teradak Chameleon, they sound pretty damn good, no speaker in this price range is perfect, and I really like the front ports and RCA input. Alot of monitor's lack unbalanced RCA inputs. I upgraded from some Klipsch Promedia's and these are in another league all together, not even close. I did notice with these that speaker placement is absolutely critical, moreso then most other speakers i've owned, you really need to get the tweeters at ear level or you miss out on alot. I think it's a common trait with near field monitors.


----------



## matthewh133

It hurts me inside how cheap Americans can get these kind of things for. In the U.S. you can get the RP8s for like $450 a pair if you look hard enough. In Australia the cheapest you can get is the equivalent of around $710 U.S. Ridiculous.
  
  /shakes fist


----------



## germanium

Had a second listen to the Tannoy Reveals 501a's & discovered some things I really didn't like about them. They seem to have low power & significant bass boost EQ built into them making them clip very obnoxiously at volume levels that other speakers had no problem playing at. It was the deep bass frequencies that was causing this & the woofer was moving close to its limit which is what makes me think that they have some killer bass EQ in there. Even my little speakers had no issues with lack of volume compared to these. I will admit though that even with the mods they don't put out the bass like the other speakers I tested , However in my room they do very well delivering tight clean bass that really doesn't sound all that rolled off. Where they do need help at home here the sub fills in nicely. With my current settings on the sub the sub is very discrete only coming in where needed & not over doing it so it sounds very well balanced. Too much bass  below 50Hz would sound tubby & my system with current setting is anything but tubby sounding with the sub on.  It is very tight & clean with excellent extension when the sub is on
   
  As a reference for balance I use my Ety ER4P earphones which I found nearly perfectly balanced in live verse recording testing & here the modded speakers do quite well, only lacking in the very deepest bass. below 50 Hz. The speakers sound slighly warmer in the lower mids & upper bass than the ER4P's & a little less forward in the upper mids & lower treble. Detail is there but not as pronounced on the speakers. Speakers are more listenable in the long run than the ER4Ps as a result. I can get them to sound even closer to the ER4P if I set the acoustic space control for more output above 250Hz  & have improved detail but for the listenability I leave then set where they are. Human voices sound thier best to me on my system with my current settings.They sound too thin otherwise.  Given this result I believe many manufacturers  going for what sells & impressive bass sells whether or not it is balanced instead of what truely accurate & that seems to include Tannoy. Mid bass level on my current speakers compared to the ER4P is pretty much a deadon match from 50-100 Hz at matched volumes. This is without the sub.
   
  My favorate speakers at Guitar Center changed to the  KRK Rockit RP5's. They sound the closest to accurate & thier bass output is not excessive at the bottom compared to the rest of the bass.


----------



## Lucias_D

I must have a revision/late model? version of the BX-5. I have a different m-audio logo on the front and the LF switchable cutoff goes to 49Hz for me instead of the normal 56 I hear form most. Hence 2 of my caps have different values. I'll have to do some extra research and tracing before I start this mod. I didn't even know they made a revision, but that appears to be what I have


----------



## germanium

Quote: 





lucias_d said:


> I must have a revision/late model? version of the BX-5. I have a different m-audio logo on the front and the LF switchable cutoff goes to 49Hz for me instead of the normal 56 I hear form most. Hence 2 of my caps have different values. I'll have to do some extra research and tracing before I start this mod. I didn't even know they made a revision, but that appears to be what I have


 


 Note, that the disabling the low frequency cotoff is not the only mods I have done to these All electrolytic couple caps have been replaced with wire, even the ones going to ground from the negative feedback loops that control the gain of the amps. This was nessessary to get the soundstage & imaging as well. These cap removals were done a quite a while ago by me but the disabling the low frequecy cutoff was just recently completed.
   
  Do you have the ones you linked in your recent activity? If so then they should be just like mine. If not you may have the new CX5's which have the same switches in back but likely different values for the settings. Just checked out the CX5's specs & thier lowest cutoff freqency just says flat. I have 2 pair of BX5's of slightly different vintage & yes they have different logos but both have the same 56Hz low frequency cutoff. The BX8's have a lowest low frquency cutoff of 38 Hz so it can't be those either. Maybe some really early version had an optomistic cutoff of 49Hz?. Even at 56Hz the cutoff frequency was really optomistic by the way. A not so optimistic lowest cutoff would have been 80 Hz. Port tuning on these speakers was way optomistic at less than 30Hz according to the manufacturer. With an optomistic 56Hz cutoff for the subsonic filter combined with a port tuning of less than 30Hz  the port becomes useless as to providing any usefull support near the bottom of the mid basses usefull range. A more apropriate tuning would have been 50Hz for such a small driver as that would have provided near flat response to the cutoff frequency unless of coarse the tuning was too sharp that it causes a lumpy response instead. I do get resonable response though definately still not flat to 50 Hz with the subsonic filter removed though & there is definately more warmth to human voices  than with the subsonic filter in place so there was definately some damage being done to the usefull range of the speakers by the filter. Note however that you really don't want perfectly flat anachoic response anyway from a speaker anyway as that would result in excessive bass in real world environments due to room boundary reinforcment.
   
  With the large magnet on the back of the midbass unit the need for such restictions are minimal as the back-electromotive force of the driver tends to restrict excessive driver movement when a flat signal is provided. In otherwards big magnet equals rolled off bass anyway. As the driver begins to have significant movement the amp has to fight large voltages being fed back by the driver hense instead of a real 15 volts driving the speaker you have to take 15 volts minus the back-electromotive force of the driver for example 10 volts and that leaves only 5 volts left to drive the speaker. This degree of back-electomotive feedback would cause about 10 db of roll off to the driver at that frequency. With such large magnet this scenerio is not unusual.


----------



## thuantran

First post in this thread, but from reading this I have already bought a pair of Yamaha HS50M, IMO it outclasses the Mackie MR5 which I had the chance to audition, too. Compared to it, the Mackie at first seems to sound fuller especially the lower end, but it's overall muddier, has a narrower sound stage and a somewhat diffused presentation of each instruments. I being the instrumental music guy (from soundtrack to modern orchestra music), the HS50M serves me well. I don't think I even need a sub as in the picture being too close to the wall it produces enough low end for my taste. Otherwise adding a sub to it my give you best of both world if you like more bass. Here's the crappy picture of them and my PC from my cell.
   



   
  P.S. You don't need to mention the DAC, isolation or how close they are to the wall. Will fix these sometimes. If you have other recommendation then please do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## moonboy403

Quote: 





thuantran said:


> First post in this thread, but from reading this I have already bought a pair of Yamaha HS50M, IMO it outclasses the Mackie MR5 which I had the chance to audition, too. Compared to it, the Mackie at first seems to sound fuller especially the lower end, but it's overall muddier, has a narrower sound stage and a somewhat diffused presentation of each instruments. I being the instrumental music guy (from soundtrack to modern orchestra music), the HS50M serves me well. I don't think I even need a sub as in the picture being too close to the wall it produces enough low end for my taste. Otherwise adding a sub to it my give you best of both world if you like more bass. Here's the crappy picture of them and my PC from my cell.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 You should get your monitors off your desk (reflection off desk/comb filtering) and put the tweeters at ear level. Create a virtual equilateral triangle with your monitors as the base of the triangle and aim your monitors so that the virtual axis created by your monitors cross just behind your head.


----------



## thuantran

Quote: 





moonboy403 said:


> You should get your monitors off your desk (reflection off desk/comb filtering) and put the tweeters at ear level. Create a virtual equilateral triangle with your monitors as the base of the triangle and aim your monitors so that the virtual axis created by your monitors cross just behind your head.


 
  I know about the equilateral triangle stuff, it is mentioned in the manual, these speakers are actually nearly creating that setup from their perspective, at the moment the tweeters are around 5cm to around 10cm lower than exactly at my ear level. So I think I only need to move it off my desk, is putting something higher under these speakers good enough as that as far as I can go with my desk space?


----------



## tmars78

Quote: 





thuantran said:


> I know about the equilateral triangle stuff, it is mentioned in the manual, these speakers are actually nearly creating that setup from their perspective, at the moment the tweeters are around 5cm to around 10cm lower than exactly at my ear level. So I think I only need to move it off my desk, is putting something higher under these speakers good enough as that as far as I can go with my desk space?


 


  I would say yes. And if you don't need them to go all that high, you could use bricks. They are inexpensive. I bought 4 bricks for like a dollar and some change, and spray painted them black.


----------



## MikeW

hard things like bricks are pretty terrible for isolation, and glass is really really bad surface to set a speaker on. It's extremely resonant. A brick is a cheap way to raise them, but the sound will travel right though it like it was not there at all. It's to dense and hard. I was refraining from saying anything as I did read your last qoute, but I had to say it since everyone else was putting in there cents. Tmar's it looks like you've actually put some time and effort into creating a bass trap, and room dampening, you should get some real isolation under that speaker instead of a brick. Thick rubber, neoprene, or foam is ideal, like the Auralex pads, there are some far better solutions as well that are quite abit more expensive, via foam and steel but I don't think they are worth it until your using 800$+ ea. monitors.


----------



## tmars78

Quote: 





mikew said:


> hard things like bricks are pretty terrible for isolation, and glass is really really bad surface to set a speaker on. It's extremely resonant. A brick is a cheap way to raise them, but the sound will travel right though it like it was not there at all. It's to dense and hard. I was refraining from saying anything as I did read your last qoute, but I had to say it since everyone else was putting in there cents. Tmar's it looks like you've actually put some time and effort into creating a bass trap, and room dampening, you should get some real isolation under that speaker instead of a brick. Thick rubber, neoprene, or foam is ideal, like the Auralex pads, there are some far better solutions as well that are quite abit more expensive, via foam and steel but I don't think they are worth it until your using 800$+ ea. monitors.


 


  Believe it or not, they aren't sitting directly on the bricks. There are 1/4" foam pads between the monitor and the brick.


----------



## thuantran

Now I use two small plastic chairs that is  around 10cm tall to lift my speakers up, between them and the speakers I put some isolation rubber (took at my work place, isolation for use with cluster rack and cluster node) that is also around 1/4" thick. Working nicely.


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

Costs money but these work well on a desk.
   
http://www.gale.co.uk/1268.html


----------



## AhhHoNG

I sold my Mackie MR5 and got myself the Focal CMS40 stuidio monitor. A big jump from 3xx dollars range speakers. Sounds fantastic is the only thing i can describe the CMS40


----------



## Glitched

To prop my bx5a deluxe's off my wooden desk I used the foam packaging material that came with the speakers.  I think it's helped clear up some base resonance from the desk, but acoustically I'm not sure if it is really helping any?


----------



## PurpleCow

why do you guys prop up your speakers?


----------



## juman231

.


----------



## DougofTheAbaci

Second the Bowers & Wilkins. Not heard myself but I've heard great things.


----------



## Somnambulist

Quote: 





purplecow said:


> why do you guys prop up your speakers?


 


  1) stop sound from transferring energy directly from the speaker into the surface it's sitting on - to stop my desk/cupboard turning into a resonator
  2) lift speakers so tweeters are at ear height
  3) reduce the amount of sound coming from the speakers and bouncing off the surface of the desk in front of me ('desk reflections')
   
  I've basically copied the Primacoustic Recoil Stabilizer stands, which are around £80 each here in the UK, for a DIY pair that cost less than half of that, plus extras:
  a) some concrete bricks, wrapped in a thick fabric to protect the surface of the desk and look less ugly
  b) Auralex Mopads (I could have bought high density foam but the Mopads are easily accessible and have the angle adjustment stuff
  c) 10mm steel plate, painted black - this helps set the speaker into the foam and stops the cabinet vibration from moving the speaker about when it's in use
  d) rubber mat (comes with speakers)
  e) speaker
   
  I'm still buying the parts and saving for the speakers (Focal CMS 50s), but this should raise them to a nice height and isolate pretty well.


----------



## Angelbelow

Cool stuff, will check this thread out later when I get a chance.


----------



## bixby

Quote: 





purplecow said:


> why do you guys prop up your speakers?


 


  The reason is not to isolate the speaker from the desktop nor to couple it per se, but rather to get rid of the horrible frequency response abnormality that occurs when you have a speaker on or close to a flat surface like your desktop.  Nearly all small bookshelf speakers with the exception of some pro audio or other powered speakers with shelf controls for the bass, need to be at least 6 inches off the desk to get rid of the muddy unnatural coupling that occurs and to preserve the clean open response in the lower mids and bass.  
   
  WE spend all this money worrying about which dac to buy and what chip it has in it and then we just throw the speakers on some 2 inch foam or right on the desk and think we are doing it right..............NOT!
   
  BTW-  I love the brick idea but I would get it much higher if you really want clean response.
   
  eg.  http://www.head-fi.org/gallery/image/view/id/5540


----------



## Somnambulist

The Focals have shelf controls but I'll be using a 2x2 arrangement of bricks, plus whatever the Mopads are in thickness (an inch or two) plus 1cm of steel, plus the mat, although I can't imagine that being thick, so it won't be too far off that image, although it should look a little prettier!


----------



## bixby

Quote: 





somnambulist said:


> The Focals have shelf controls but I'll be using a 2x2 arrangement of bricks, plus whatever the Mopads are in thickness (an inch or two) plus 1cm of steel, plus the mat, although I can't imagine that being thick, so it won't be too far off that image, although it should look a little prettier!


 

 I love the Focal CMS sound.  I heard the CMS 65s and they smoke everything that the guitar shop sells as monitors.  Fantastically good monitor that I might put up against my main system if I had the chance.


----------



## Somnambulist

Yeah I spent ages reading up about nearfield monitors for my computer set up (as I spend most of my time in front of a screen rather than sat in a chair with my feet up) and under my budget, which would be around <£1000, everything I read always seemed to keep coming back to the Focals as they were generally praised for being accurate, musical and non-fatiguing if used as a desktop hifi speaker rather than for home production.
   
  I got to audition the 40's, 50's and Twins the other week in a basement studio, just to see if they'd live up to the hype. I thought they were fantastic and left me sure that I wouldn't feel like I was missing out on bass response, despite listening to several genres of music where deep bass is prevalent. The Twins, like the 65s are too big for my desk (I physically can't put them on stands either side of it either), they're enormous, however fantastic they sounded - as they should for around £1000 per speaker in the Twins case - but the gap between them and the CMS50s wasn't so great I'd feel like I was missing out greatly. Hearing the 40s next to the 50's however, the obvious difference in low end was enough that I felt I had to get the 50s. I'm sure the 65's would be better still in this regard, but I can only work with the space I've currently got. In a bigger space with more room however, I'd definitely consider a future upgrade to the Twins, although I'm sure at that price range there's probably a lot of competition as well.
   
  The other thing I liked about the Focals was they're designed and made in France, so it's not like they have to travel far if there's any problems. You don't read too much about them here, but I think that's more down to the currency conversion making them quite expensive for US customers, lack of availability compared to things like KRKs e.t.c. (although the Apple Store stocks them). I'd thoroughly recommend anyone looking for desktop speakers to consider them, as they're designed for non-optimum rooms/placement - which is what most of our desks and rooms are - and they seemed to hit all the right boxes in terms of sounding very enjoyable yet accurate and unforgiving. Viva la Focal!


----------



## Jubei

Just a warning for the Swans HiVi D1010MKII 08 : I bought a pair in mid March, they look nice and sound great, especially since I paid a good price for them. BUT it's been barely 3 months and the left speaker has blown for no reason at all. It was still fine last night when I was listening to music, but no sound came out of them this morning.
   
  I called up the shop I got them and the dealer no longer carries Swans speakers so I might be out of luck with warranty / repairs ... really really sucks.


----------



## Tsuyosa Eternal

Bad luck on the Swans 
   
  I have had my Behringer's for 4 years now, at least 3/4 hours play time a day and always left on, no issues what so ever. They have paid for themselves a few times over in my opinion  They have been in 3 different setups now (renting sucks)
   

   

   
  Ill get around to upgrading once these fail, given how they have been going that could be a while.


----------



## Jubei

Re-connected my ancient Altec Lansng 221 speakers and boy, do they sound boomy by comparison! On the plus side, they're side working 7+ years later, while the Swans blew on me within 3 months ...


----------



## Jubei

Went to get a new pair of speakers yesterday and ended up getting M-Audio AV40. I'm currently trying to run them in - and at the moment, I can't say they're better than the Swans HiVi D1010MKII 08. The bass port at the back of the AV40s make them more fussy in terms of placement and found the bass a bit overwhelming and not too tight. I've stuffed some socks into the port and the bass improved somewhat.


----------



## Riverback

Hi guys,
   
  I'm looking for a good pair of 2.0's and I'm wondering if anyone has heard the Audioengine A2's and the KRK Rockit Gen 2's?


----------



## Lazerboy2000

I have a pair of KRK RP6G2's and absolutely love them. They're super clear with plenty of bass and more power than I could ever need.  Even though they're professional grade monitors, they don't need perfect FLAC to sound great and are very forgiving. I highly recommend them.


----------



## pwrusr

The room I have these in is roughly 9.5Lx7Wx7.5H. Smaller then some peoples closets!
   
  I had gotten the dynaudio BM5A MKII because of it's compact size, yet still able to ROCK the room it was in (about 10 times the size of my "closet office"). Had them for a week until I decided they were simply WAAAY too much speaker for such a small room.

 Anyway I just wanted to pass along some advice with this post for anyone looking for a set of speakers to go into a smaller room...
 DO NOT let the salesman tell you that you need big speakers. Anything with over a 6.5" woofer will likely be too much.
*TRUST your ears.* This goes without saying. Go for something that sounds slightly bass shy in the show room. Believe me it will sound fine once you get it setup in the small room 
 Bring a bunch of your favorite high quality music. I'm not talking rap or techno. I like alot of that kind of music, but not much of it is high quality and most of it relies on bass to sound good.

*What I ended up with...*
 After doing a ton of reading on line on different speakers with woofers of <6.5" in size one speaker kept coming up, The Yamaha HS50M. This speaker has a nice flat response and adjustments in the back for much better "room control" to lower bass below 500Hz by 0, -2 and -4dB in case things are a bit too exciting down low. It also has adjustments for mid EQ (+2dB, 0dB & -2dB at 2kHz), high trim (+2dB, 0dB & -2dB at 3kHz) and low-cut (for use with sub) at ether flat (bypass low-cut filter) 80 or 100Hz. Pic below:



*"So now that you swapped speakers how do the new ones sound?"*
 They sound like the speakers I was looking for from the beginning. I have all the controls on the back of the speakers flat with no EQ added. I really hate to sound like people who've just bought their first pair of really high end speakers, but really guys... I'm hearing things I have never heard before. Those things just jump out at me in the mix of the songs and greet me with a friendly "hi". The bass is well controlled and not over bearing like it was with the bm5a's sounded in this room. IMHO the BM5A's sounded a little too "hi-fi". Not very studio monitor sounding. The HS50M is another story altogether. They sound great just sitting back listening to music, but their main job as a studio monitor is apparent in the way they sound "Just the facts no BS". That deliver in spades! To me that isn't a bad thing. It's great to hear things the way the studio engineer thought it should sound.

 I also have a couple pairs of Beyerdynamic headphones, the DT770 and DT880. I'm bringing this up because it's what I have to compare to the speakers. The HS50M is like the DT880. Pretty analytical sounding with highs that are are reproduced the same way the recording was done. Just very "revealing" is the best way to describe it. I also heard the HS80M in the store and I'd say they are the DT770's of monitor speakers. With a low end to die for! The texture of bass with the HS80M is ubergood. Overall the HS80M was my favorite speaker in the store in the big room (roughly 20Lx12Wx14H) that they were in.

 The main reason I went with the BM5A's to begin with was because they were smaller then the HS80M's. This was a case where I didn't follow my ears. And spent more on a set of speakers that didn't sound quite as good and revealing to get a smaller speaker. Also went with the salesman's recommendation to get the BM5A's because "they were a smaller speaker for a smaller room." Honestly they are in the same size class because the woofer is fairly large. Though the BM5A does have a 6.9" woofer where the yammy's had a 8" woofer. They both had a very healthy bottom end. Though I thought the HS80M just like the HS50M really allow you to hear into the mix more.

 My dumb self didn't even think about the HS50M because it didn't put out enough bass for some of the electronic music that I sometimes like to listen to. Frankly I did myself a disservice. These speakers are a a true bargain! They sound fantastic in this little room. For me and my intended uses these were the right ones.

 So if you're looking around for something to put in front of you on your desk give these a listen. Don't let the low price make you think they are "bad". Yes, they are made in China and the Dynaudio speakers are made in Denmark. That's part of the reason why the yammys are so low in price.

 If you have a much larger room and plan to sit a bit further away from them check out the HS80M. Chances are good you will NOT need a sub with them.

 Speaking of price, I was able to find the HS50M's for $142 per speaker on amazon.com. Guitar center matched the price no question 

 Excuse the mess, I had to take a pic as soon as I plopped them on the desk


----------



## bixby

I really like your diy desktop speaker stands, much nicer looking than my cinder blocks!
  
  Quote: 





tsuyosa eternal said:


> Bad luck on the Swans
> 
> I have had my Behringer's for 4 years now, at least 3/4 hours play time a day and always left on, no issues what so ever. They have paid for themselves a few times over in my opinion  They have been in 3 different setups now (renting sucks)
> 
> ...


----------



## xMisterVx

Sorry to revive an old thread, but it seems like it comes up on searches quite a lot, and is quite useful. Mostly just checking if this is up to date...
  I'm looking for some speakers that would make use of the sound quality of my Xonar Essence. I mainly use it with headphones, but sometimes it's nice to have background music without wearing anything on your head, - so basically I'm not in for anything professional, just speakers that would have a nice, clear sound; though I wouldn't be extremely picky, it means a lot to have something that performs well for its price.
   
  So far the M-Audio AV40s seem to be the best option... but their size could definitely be an issue... so maybe the Creative T40s?.. or is there a better alternative on the market?..
   
  And I'm only making my first steps towards understanding good audio, so please bear with me.


----------



## bala

Has anybody tried the Teufel VT11? for about 100 euros seems to be a good alternative to the usual suspects!


----------



## Mauricio

Here's another endorsement for the Yamaha HS50M, but to really take them to another level, they should be paired with the Yamaha HS10W subwoofer.  In the $500/pair and below price bracket, the HS50M are the active monitor/speaker to beat.


----------



## grokit

In the 2.1 category the Bose Cinemamate is a real sleeper as a desktop/computer speaker setup. It goes very well with the television as well.


----------



## Mauricio

Simply looking at a picture of that Bose system, one can begin to see technical drawbacks.  Just look at the size of those satellites.  If it's a sleeper, it's probably for a reason, significant Bose advertising and hype notwithstanding...


----------



## grokit

I have one, it sounds great, and its simulated surround is very effective. The subwoofer is a monster, no need for bigger satellites.


----------



## DougofTheAbaci

Satellite size does not equate quality. My Aego M has small satellites but pretty big sound. Bose headphones are almost pure hype. Their speakers, not so much. Though, if you look around you might be able to find better.


----------



## grokit

Agreed as far as 2.0 stereo imaging goes, I'm sure that there is better out there for $500. My JBL Control 2+ powered monitors are very nice in this regard. Where the Cinemamate system really excels is in how clean and natural it can make any surround format sound, and it's utter simplicity of operation. The JBLs are currently in storage.


----------



## Mauricio

Quote: 





grokit said:


> I have one, it sounds great, and its simulated surround is very effective. The subwoofer is a monster, no need for bigger satellites.


 
   
  So you think that a "monster" of a subwoofer can make up for small satellites?  Interesting proposition.  Perhaps a few basic info about sound and 2.1 systems is in order.  For reasons of stereo imaging, efficiency and distortion, a subwoofer should be restricted to reproducing frequencies below 100Hz.  Why?  For one, above 100Hz sound starts becoming directional meaning that the human ear can detect its direction.  If your subwoofer is reproducing significant volume above 100Hz, this will have deleterious impact on stereo imaging.  The imaging will be in a real sense _smeared_.  For two, a subwoofer's large driver becomes more and more inefficient the higher it goes in frequency, thereby taxing the amplifier into putting out more power.  This will result in harmonic and intermodulation distortion.  Capisce?
   
  What does this have to do with the satellites?  The foregoing discussion calls for the subwoofer staying below 100Hz.  This means that the satellites must be capable of reaching down to at least 100Hz.  Small satellites with small drivers and small amplifiers are unlikely to be able to do so.  For all of these reasons, one should stay away from small satellites, and certainly away from satellites as small as that Bose system.  Now, any monkey engineer should know about these fundamentals of physics.  Why they persist in making these impossibly flawed systems I can only attribute to wanting to make a quick buck off less descriminating and less knowledgeable consumers.


----------



## grokit

I take it you've never listened to the Bose Cinemamate. Thanks for your opinion.


----------



## Mauricio

I take it that you've never heard a proper 2.1 system if you think that a "monster" subwoofer can substitute for satellites with sufficient and credible upper bass extension.
   
  And it's actually not opinion, but rather unavoidable limitations imposed to the laws of physics.  You (and Bose) are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own laws of physics or to capabilities beyond that which evolution endowed on the human auditory system.  Simple as that.


----------



## DougofTheAbaci

I wouldn't say Bose does a "monster sub" with tiny satellites that put out bad sound. And trying to play off your opinions as physics shows a lack of understand of the physics. Yes, above 100 Hz and things become more directional, but there are still things you can do about that, both software and hardware things. This is why you can get surround-sound headphones that have only one driver per ear. Your head, after all, works in stereo but calculates directionality based on things like the dopler shift and the delay between left and right ear.
   
  And speaker size is only one factor among many. It's something you can get around by materials. Like the bass guitar I heard that had a body the size of a ukelele (coolest thing ever, by the way).


----------



## grokit

Geez, get off the monster thing. I just meant that it throws off considerably impactful bass for its size. It's nowhere near my 15" sub though, that's the real monster. Anyways I'll trust Bose's R&D department, and my own ears on this one.


----------



## Mauricio

Quote: 





dougoftheabaci said:


> I wouldn't say Bose does a "monster sub" with tiny satellites that put out bad sound. And trying to play off your opinions as physics shows *a lack of understand of the physics*. ... Your head, after all, works in stereo but calculates directionality based on things like *the dopler shift* and the delay between left and right ear.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Please explain how, with a stationary speaker and a stationary listener, the sound is doppler shifted.  If someone doesn't know physics, it is not I.
   
  The human auditory system determines the direction of sound by two mechanisms and two mechanisms alone.  One is the relative difference in magnitude/amplitude of the sound reaching the ears.  Two is the relative difference in time of the sound reaching the ears.  That's it.  No hardware, software or DSP can change that.


----------



## DougofTheAbaci

I said said like, not actually using. You can simulate the Doppler shift by changing the pitch slightly. This is how surround sound headphones work and why there are bit in The Final Cut by Pink Floyd where things appear to happen behind you.

So while they can't change how you ears work, clever speakers can trick them into reporting the wrong things back to you brain.


----------



## willmax

I've lived with my Creative i-Trigue 3200 for too long now so I'm thinking about getting some 'Studio Monitor' speakers for general listening.
  I've narrowed down my search to a few models that I can reasonably priced under $500 here in Australia.
  Do you guys have any experiences with the following models? Also if you can comment on sound signature and why should I buy one versus the other that would be really helpful.
   
  - *KRK Rokit 5 Studio Monitors* - $425
  - *Behringer Truth B1030A* - $349 
  - *JBL LSR2325P Powered Active Studio* - $439
  - *Alesis  M1Active 520 USB 60W* - $279
  - *Samson GT Active Studio Monitors USB* - $250
  - *MA-15D ROLAND CAKEWALK* - $278
   
  So far I'm leaning towards the Rokit and Behringer


----------



## Mauricio

I'd, myself, narrow it down to the JBLs, the KRKs and the Yamaha HS50W or Yamaha MSP5 Studio.  Those three brands happen to have competent, matching subwoofers that you can add later.


----------



## Mauricio

Quote: 





dougoftheabaci said:


> I said said like, not actually using. You can simulate the Doppler shift by changing the pitch slightly. This is how surround sound headphones work and why there are bit in The Final Cut by Pink Floyd where things appear to happen behind you.
> So while they can't change how you ears work, clever speakers can trick them into reporting the wrong things back to you brain.


 
  Let's make something clear.  The human ear did not evolve the capacity to detect sound direction based on doppler shift.  Period.  The human ear evolved to detect the direction of sound based on the relative difference in magnitude and time delay of sound at each ear.  The human ear does not detect sound direction by the shifting of frequency.  If a stationary signal emits a shifting frequency, the human ear perceives it as just that, as a change in frequency, not as a change in the location of the signal.  If a moving signal emits a single frequency, the sound is perceived as raising or lowering in frequency (depending whether it is moving away or towards you), but the ear detects the direction of said signal, not on doppler shift, but rather by the fact that the signal magnitude is increasing or that the signal is reaching each each at a different time.


----------



## willmax

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> I'd, myself, narrow it down to the JBLs, the KRKs and the Yamaha HS50W or Yamaha MSP5 Studio.  Those three brands happen to have competent, matching subwoofers that you can add later.


 
  Good point I had almost forgot about the subwoofer, although I'm not keen on spending all that money right now, but possibly a nice addition for the future.
  I originally left the Yamahas out of the equation since they are very expensive here in Australia. 
   
  The other thing is I'm gonna be connecting these to my computer via DAC, I currently have a CEntrance DACport and the ODAC distributed by JDS Labs on order so do you guys see any issues with my approach?


----------



## Mauricio

If you plan to control volume via the computer, make sure the DAC is capable of 24-bit depth.  Otherwise get a DAC with a preamp function that allows you to control the line output level.


----------



## willmax

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> If you plan to control volume via the computer, make sure the DAC is capable of 24-bit depth.  Otherwise get a DAC with a preamp function that allows you to control the line output level.


 
   
  The DACport has its own volume control as it is a DAC/amp in one piece, on the other hand from what I read the ODAC has no volume control but can be controlled from the master volume control of the computer.
   
  I've been reading a bit more and I'm narrowing down between the KRK Rockit 5 and Behringer B1030a, both seem to be great but the Rockit is quite a bit more popular, particularly in the US and on Amazon, the Behringer is a bit cheaper here in Australia thought. 
   
  It would be great if someone who actually had both could shine in since I don't think I would be able to audition them here in my home town.


----------



## Mauricio

The DACport has a headphone amplifier output which is *not*, for optimal sound quality, what you want to connect to active monitors.  For optimal sound quality, you will want to connect the monitors to the line output.  I, myself, would get the DACport LX and a separate volume control unit.


----------



## grokit

Many powered monitors have their own volume control, my JBLs do.


----------



## Mauricio

Adjusting volume in each monitor is certainly possible for all of them have volume control.  The question is whether you want to do that given that each time you want to change volume you'll have to get up and change the volume in both monitors.  Unless the volume knob is detented, you may run into balance issues where one channel is at a different volume.
   
  Unless you are using some JBL and Adam models where both left and right channel monitors can be connected to one another thereby allowing for volume control for both via one single knob, you will want a single volume control in addition to each monitor's volume control.


----------



## grokit

That's how my JBLs work, I guess it depends if each speaker has its own amp or not.


----------



## willmax

Have come across lots of reviews both praising the Rokits and trashing the Behringers, so since the price is quite similar I'm seriously considering the Rokit for now.
   
  I was looking at photos of the back panel for both Studio Monitors, and the Behringers look to have much more control and adjustments, are these adjustments really useful? By the way I really like the fact that the Rokit speakers have the bass port positioned at the front since with my setup they might be fairly close to the wall


----------



## antberg

i was wondering about almost the same question:if the bass port is on the front side is the bass more punchy keeping the same level of clarity?
  Salute


----------



## willmax

Quote: 





antberg said:


> i was wondering about almost the same question:if the bass port is on the front side is the bass more punchy keeping the same level of clarity?
> Salute


 
  Saudações brasileiras,
   
  From what I've been reading having the bass port at the back increases the chance of bass build up, particularly when the speakers sit close to the wall.
  With the Rokits it is recommended to have the speakers sitting a little bit above the surface of the table to prevent bass clipping as well.


----------



## antberg

haha,you know some portuguese!
  i was thinking that the port on the front would have more "impact",more punch-ness,for example punching your chest while listening some dubstep.
  Salute


----------



## Cat Steps

RThe E_:The  9. Logitech Z520_
   
   
_First and foremost, DO NOT BUY THESE. Yes, they look nice, but that's only without the grills. They are fingerprint magnets and, more importantly, sound HORRIBLE. At around $130, these are ridiculously overpriced. I bought them expecting them sound not much unlike my Z10s, as they are now Logitech's flagship 2.0s just as the Z10s were four years ago. They have a large soundstage, mainly due to a feature called 360 degree sound, but--trust me--this not sound you want to hear. Distortion is a mess. Avoid these like the plague._
_   -----------_
     
      Well, I bought these recently. As a non-audiophile (I have some Grado sr80i's, and that's as high as I go), I am pleased with them. I recommend them to people looking for decent sounding 2.0 speakers for computer/portable use. 
      
      I agree completely that $130 is overpriced, but now that it is 2012, bestbuy.com is selling them for $80 (I think they are re-furbished), which is much more reasonable.  The build quality is solid, they are heavier than you would think and seem like they will last for a few years at least. They come with a 2-year warranty from the manufacturer. I appreciate the  option with the removable grills. At this point I prefer them on, they do not hinder the sound. The headphone jack and line out jack  on the side are great too and convenient.
   
  On the sound: I have no idea what the reviewer had these hooked up to, but I disgree about the distortion. I am using these with an ipod classic 80gig (sometimes with an old apple ipod dock with a line out), apple laptop , or a Sony portable CD player. With playing portable players  plugged in, they have been sounding great.  There CAN be distortion, based on the recordings played (some recordings are more compressed/less dynamic than others), or the volume levels of the _source (the computer would be more of an issue here)_, and it seems the Equalizer settings on the players can also play a part in distortion. With some music I noticed it is better to leave the equalizer flat, especially if  the recording has less dynamic range. They do get _plenty_ loud without having to turn the knob nearly all the way up, though. Overall, I have not had any incurable distortion problems. 
   
       The sound is great to my ears, and I would recommend them as speakers for _music_ (that's what I bought them for) in a single room that you do not want a loud subwoofer to shake the walls. There is plenty enough low-end bass to satisfy for music listening in the vicinity of the speakers, though ( unless you _have_ to feel your ass vibrate from the bass to enjoy your music). I appreciate the simplicity of not having a subwoofer, for my space at least. For speakers of this size, they have very large sound.
   
       
       I have not had these long, and are still breaking in, but even at this point I am pleased with my music on these. They sound great, dammit. 
   
  tags or whatever: logitech z520 2.0 speakers


----------



## Phos

How do the Airmotiv4's measure up?  Even the 5's fall under the thread's price cap.


----------



## julioforo

Hi.
  this is a very interesting post but hasn't been updated since July.
  Any new model to consider? Any update?


----------



## jalva

Quote: 





julioforo said:


> Hi.
> this is a very interesting post but hasn't been updated since July.
> Any new model to consider? Any update?


 
   
   
  Equator Audio D5 seem to be the rage on internet right now. I havent heard them but would love to get some inputs here. They surely have lots of details and clarity, but do they sound enjoyable?


----------



## suica

This thread was definitely a most interesting read. I really didn't know about the positioning of the speakers and I usually just placed it far above my head because of this IKEA desktop table -- I'll probably have to invest in a different one now.
  I'm not sure if I missed it, but has there been a comparison on the BX5A Deluxe and the A5+? I'd like to know how much better they are in comparison to the A5's and if it's still worth getting the BX5A over it.
   
  Edit: Re-read some of the posts and now the Swan MkIII looks really good, too. Could I get somebody's opinion of these three being compared to each other?


----------



## rfvijn

So what's the current recommendation for speakers in the ~$200 range (+/- $50)?
   
  Looking for something to complement my Senn HD598's for when I want to play some games, listen to music, or watch downloads and not wear the phones.


----------



## Koui

Equator D5 Studio Monitors at $299/pr and the JBL 2325Ps are the best I've heard for less than $500 in my project studio.

Room treatment is as important as speakers if accurate sound is what you're after. DIY solutions are inexpensive but it's easy to spend $500+ on professional products.


----------



## jakarujakpala

I currently use 1st gen KRK RP 5, it's nice for what's it worth. But I can't comment much, because I'm not an audiophile and moreover I've really limited experience with speakers. My last experience was Kurzweil KS-40A, it's really nice for the price. Need to search another speaker now, because my KRK's quite old and I think I need replacement soon. Thinking about getting nicer near field monitor.


----------



## jakarujakpala

*sorry for double posting


----------



## Headzone

Quote: 





jakarujakpala said:


> I currently use 1st gen KRK RP 5, it's nice for what's it worth. But I can't comment much, because I'm not an audiophile and moreover I've really limited experience with speakers. My last experience was Kurzweil KS-40A, it's really nice for the price. Need to search another speaker now, because my KRK's quite old and I think I need replacement soon. Thinking about getting nicer near field monitor.


 
  There's alot of info about studio monitors and placement/acoustics at gearslutz. 
   
  I think that if you want to get really good sound you also must treat your room acoustics. Bad room + 1000$ monitors = money pretty much wasted.


----------



## ROBSCIX

I wouldn't go that far, you can still have great sound without room treatment...


----------



## Headzone

Quote: 





robscix said:


> I wouldn't go that far, you can still have great sound without room treatment...


 
  I don't know, but my Behringer B2030's sound totally rubbish in my room. The echo is terrible, and I can barely hear any details in the music. That's why they've been in the closet for 6 months now. The biggest problems are in the bass region, where I think they have at least 10dB boost at some frequencies (standing waves in the room). But i'm not expert so I'm not trying to start an argue


----------



## jakarujakpala

Quote: 





headzone said:


> There's alot of info about studio monitors and placement/acoustics at gearslutz.
> 
> I think that if you want to get really good sound you also must treat your room acoustics. Bad room + 1000$ monitors = money pretty much wasted.


 
   
  Yep, I know that site. A lot of information there, but that site is as dangerous as this site. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  As for room acoustics, I know that it's really important. It's just I can't do anything much to treat my room. It's just to cluttered and I've no other room left in my house. And acoustic foam (bass trap, etc) is not cheap. And I think I can get really nice sound with headphones for a way less money.
   
  So yeah, maybe that's the reason I pick headphones over speakers nowadays. Still, I want a set of nice of speakers someday.


----------



## Pippin76

Quote: 





earcandy07 said:


> Great recommendations! I stumbled across these...they're front ported and sound awesome:
> Focal XS Book
> http://www.squidoo.com/focal-awesome-mini-monitors


 
  Agreed, they are awesome!


----------



## H8rsama

Ive read all this thread and i need to wake up EARLY, darn it!
   
  Great info all around so i guess i have only 2 candidates on my price range.
   
  *The Bx5a deluxe edition (specially after this guy talking about some mods)
  *Tannoy reveal 5 (nobody seems to had a bad experience with this)
   
  Im looking for something decent for my computer that i use for entertainment and so far hea-fi had help me with all my audio setup.
   
  Asus Xonar Essence ST
  Beyerdynamic DT880pro 250
   
  Im pleased, in deed cuz ive found a whole new world in sound and thats why im looking for a good sound time without my headphones on and getting a replacement for my old logitech G51 (started to die about 1 year ago. Now i can only use a 2.1 setup) but WITHIN a limited budget <200usd 250 top(new or a good used, wont matter much)
   
  Any help is appreciated, thnx


----------



## seekadds

I think this thread will be very useful for a lot of head-fi'ers. I personally had a pair of bx5a deluxe and I agree they are great for the price.


----------



## Nirvana1000

I'm also looking for new computer speakers and i've narrowed it down to four.Which are all under $500.And all active.
   
  AudioEngine A5+
  iKey-Audio M-505v2 Active Studio Monitors
  Alesis - M1 Active MK2 Biamplified Reference Monitors
  Yorkville Sound - YSM5 - Powered Studio Reference Monitors
   
  I have A-B demoed the Alesis and Yorkville along with KRK,Yamaha,Behringer and a couple of other similar priced  active monitors.And to me,the Alesis and Yorkville sounded the most well balanced and fully dynamic.I have not heard the iKey and AudioEngines yet.


----------



## anwaypasible

note something..
   
  you can hear a pair of speakers in a big open space and listen for realism, but that doesn't answer a serious question:
   
  is there a pocket inside the speaker holding agility?
   
  why is that question serious?
  because a speaker that sounded realistic in the big open space will not sound the same in a smaller room.
  you will need to adjust the frequency response a little bit to bring the realism back, but maybe the speaker doesn't have a big pocket of agility to allow said adjustments.
  seriously..
  you try to adjust the frequency response because of the smaller room and the sound from the speaker simply isn't as good because the speaker can't keep up with the demand placed upon it.
  then you bring those speakers back to the store and bring home a different set of speakers, only to find out adjusting the frequency response for the room makes the second set of speakers sound the same or better than what you heard at the store.
   
  if i confused you, think about this little example..
  back in time people used to adjust their carburetors or twist the ignition coil to make the engine more powerful.
  a valid question is..
  how much room for adjustment is there?
  (kinda like asking how many times can you twist the screw before the screw runs out of threads)
   
  why is the question valid?
  well.. maybe because some of the more expensive speakers come with screws that twist a lot more than the cheaper speakers.
  it is certainly one good way to get the same audio quality without spending the same price.
   
   
  you also need to think about audio mastering techniques..
  because those techniques will get the speaker cone moving really weird looking, and if you stand right next to it you might not hear audio that makes any sense .. but if you walk away from the speaker, you get closer to the sweet spot and the audio you hear makes sense again.
  see,
  some speakers don't need to do that much work.
  some techniques require one speaker to do 3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12-etc. different things all at once.
  when your speaker is only needed to do 1-2 things, the design is going to be a lot different.. and the sound from the speaker when simply connected with music playing is also going to sound different.
   
  i'm trying to say..
  you hooked up an mp3 player to a $30,000 speaker and thought it sounded like crap.
  but that is only because the speaker wasn't doing the long list it was designed to do.
  yeah.. it could be possible to view an expensive speaker as something worth only $5
   
  hopefully you can gather the opposite information there about a speaker sounding realistic in a big open room, then bringing it home and frustrated about the value because the sound is different and it wont adjust enough.
  how can that happen?
  because maybe the speaker has a minimum room size and your room is smaller.
  it isn't the speakers fault .. and it isn't the speaker manufacturer's fault either .. you simply need to bring the speaker back and exchange it for another pair that is designed to work with your room size.
  it is hard to argue, because the speaker manufacturer's don't tell you what the ideal room size is for every speaker anyways .. so they aren't really guilty of fraud, it is simply a matter of trying to make a match but you missed.
   
  if they were selling the speaker and not allowing you to return it because you found out the room size wasn't a match.. then fraudulent action would come to light.
   
  i hope this is a note of lesson for everybody talking about these pre-made computer speakers.. because a wise person supervising the industry needs to demand a match for the many different room sizes.
  what might sound good to one person in their room might not be a match for your room size, and that is simply how problems happen.. it isn't always because one person has better ears than the other.


----------



## H8rsama

Thing is i CANT take it home, try, and return it if didnt like it.


----------



## anwaypasible

when there isn't a return policy, that is when the seller should go the next step and inform the buyer what the speaker is ideal for (room size, all the way to atmosphere pressure, and maybe something about humidity and temperature too if things are really serious) .. otherwise the seller needs to make the speaker adjustable to prevent a bad match of the list said above.


----------



## H8rsama

Man, im buying from ebay and waiting an overseas shipping.
  But my room is small 4.5x3.5mts and has no accoustic treatment.


----------



## kore

how about T&V Kurbis?


----------



## euthenia

Paired Asus Xonar Essense STX with Focal XS Book and the details are very nice and dynamic. Although i miss the bass from previous 2.1 setup, I still prefer this set of speaker. In fact I experience discomfort when i switch back to my old z2300 2.1 speaker after few days of listening to Focal speaker. Recommended for those with less desk space


----------



## anoxy

This thread needs to be revived. I'm looking for the best 2.0 speakers under 500 bucks. Help


----------



## Kawai_man

Im selling these bad boys
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/657379/fs-ft-fostex-pm-1-active-speakers-free-shipping


----------



## Jackeduphard

Thank you for the list!  
   
  I got the M-AUDIO BX5   <3   them!


----------



## shado

Has anyone been lucky enough to compare the original M-Audio BX5A Deluxe with the new generation ?
   
  http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MAudioBX5D2New.html
   
  My experience with audio products is that newer models aren't always better....
  I can get the original model for $100 used locally and the new generation for $250 new....


----------



## H8rsama

I'm using the tannoy reveal 501a with a xonar stx and they're clear and very detailed. .. Sometimes too much. 


Also bought the b8xa in a good deal but shipment is too expensive so I'm waiting


----------



## Swordsman

Hi,
   
  New here.
   
  Does any of the speakers mentioned are good for gaming ?
   
  I'm looking for bookshelf speaker or monitor studio that are excellent for gaming.
   
  I don't really listen to music so it doesn't matter.
   
  what i want is tight and precise bass. Bass that can hit hard with a quick attack and doesn't have the boomy background and dies off quite fast. And bass that doesn't leak into  mids and highs.


----------



## spunnik

hello guys I wanted an opinion on these:
   
  Yamaha HS 5 (2013 - second generation)
   
  and a comparison  Yamaha HS 5 vs M-Audio BX5 D2


----------



## H8rsama

swordsman said:


> Hi,
> 
> New here.
> 
> ...




My tannoys are great for gaming and music. Best buy ever in price /performance ratio


----------



## link1393

I'm looking for good speaker at 150-200$ and I have this DAC :
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NW-SMSL-SD-793II-DAC-PCM1793-DIR9001-OPA2134-Coax-Optical-Input-Headphone-amp-B-/321119953758?pt=US_Home_Audio_Amplifiers_Preamps&hash=item4ac43da35e
  and I am connected in optical.
   
  Thanks.
   
  Sam


----------



## cel4145

link1393 said:


> I'm looking for good speaker at 150-200$ and I have this DAC :
> http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NW-SMSL-SD-793II-DAC-PCM1793-DIR9001-OPA2134-Coax-Optical-Input-Headphone-amp-B-/321119953758?pt=US_Home_Audio_Amplifiers_Preamps&hash=item4ac43da35e
> and I am connected in optical.
> 
> ...




These Monoprice Studio Monitors seem like they might be a knockoff of the M-Audio BX-5. See this discussion on head-fi: http://www.head-fi.org/t/647965/monoprice-just-came-out-with-5-3-studio-monitors-165-75

Otherwise, you might also consider pairing a t-amp with a pair of passive speakers. For example, see this CNET article: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57439115-47/build-your-own-desktop-stereo-for-under-$70/ With your budget, you could get a better t-amp and better speakers, or add a sub to the Lepai/Dayton setup.


----------



## AladdinSane

I'll throw a vote in for the Vanatoo Transparent One at the upper end of this price range. Really enjoy mine. These are musical, accurate and detailed.  Bass should be enough for most but sub out is nice. Don't know how long I'll be able to leave that alone just on principle. CONS: No RCA inputs, volume/treble/bass on the back could be an issue for some. As near field speakers these are excellent. If you can get a listen I would encourage you to do so. I auditioned Kanto Yumis as well which are in this price range (cheaper). I liked them okay but not nearly as much as the Vanatoos. The Yumis have some slick hookups and a remote but they were brighter/harsher and just didn't do it for me. VTOs are definitely a step up. 
   
*Vanatoo Transparent One*
   
  > Four input options

 Analog input (direct connection to your player´s 3.5mm headphone jack)
 3 digital inputs: USB audio, TOSLINK® optical, and Coax
  > 60 watts per channel D2Audio® Class D amplifier with integrated Digital Signal Processor (DSP) for superb sound, exceptional frequency response, and high efficiency
  > Smooth and extended frequency response - 49 to 20,000 Hz +/- 2 dB
  > Patented 5 ¼ inch XBL™ woofer for deep bass and clear midrange
  > 1 inch silk dome tweeter for smooth, sweet highs
  > Custom long-excursion passive radiator for extended bass response
  > Volume, treble, and bass controls lets you adjust the sound to your liking
  > Left/Right switch lets you select the position of the active speaker for proper stereo imaging
  > Convenient auxiliary AC power out connector for your Apple Airport Express other powered device
  > Optional subwoofer output (and we mean optional!) with automatic subwoofer sensing and crossover switching
  > Automatic low power sleep mode consumes less than a standard nightlight
  > Real cherry wood veneer in black or hand rubbed natural stain
  > Compact size - 6 1/2" W x 10" H x 8 1/8" D
  > Thick, ¾ inch resonance-free MDF cabinet for better acoustical characteristics
  > Ships with the following cables:

 AC power cord
 3.5 mm to 3.5 mm cable (plugs into headphone jack)
 3.5 mm to RCA "Y" cable
 Speaker wire


----------



## link1393

Spoiler: Warning%3A%20Spoiler!



 
  Quote: 





aladdinsane said:


> I'll throw a vote in for the Vanatoo Transparent One at the upper end of this price range. Really enjoy mine. These are musical, accurate and detailed.  Bass should be enough for most but sub out is nice. Don't know how long I'll be able to leave that alone just on principle. CONS: No RCA inputs, volume/treble/bass on the back could be an issue for some. As near field speakers these are excellent. If you can get a listen I would encourage you to do so. I auditioned Kanto Yumis as well which are in this price range (cheaper). I liked them okay but not nearly as much as the Vanatoos. The Yumis have some slick hookups and a remote but they were brighter/harsher and just didn't do it for me. VTOs are definitely a step up.
> 
> *Vanatoo Transparent One*
> 
> ...


 
   
   


  No the this price is too hight for me.


----------



## AladdinSane

Sorry. Was going for the under $500! Now I see your post.
   
  If you can stretch just your budget just a bit I kept running into favorable reviews for the PSB Alpha PS1 when I was doing research. Else you might look at used to get a good speaker in your price range.
   
  Good luck.


----------



## Pirakaphile

I've got a really simple question here; I want to spend $200-$300 on a 2.1 set just for casual listening. Don't need it to be blaringly loud, but I want a subwoofer that'll pack a punch without taking up too much of the budget. I'm gonna play everything from the Blade Runner soundtrack with ambient sounds and stuff, to jazz fusion, to dubstep. I guess versatle would come to mind. Any thing that fits in my pathetic budget?


----------



## cel4145

pirakaphile said:


> I've got a really simple question here; I want to spend $200-$300 on a 2.1 set just for casual listening. Don't need it to be blaringly loud, but I want a subwoofer that'll pack a punch without taking up too much of the budget. I'm gonna play everything from the Blade Runner soundtrack with ambient sounds and stuff, to jazz fusion, to dubstep. I guess versatle would come to mind. Any thing that fits in my pathetic budget?




A subwoofer that "packs a punch" is relative to

1) Your expectations, what that means to you.
2) The size of your room *if* you are looking for one that can give that punch in the chest feel. That might be hard to accomplish unless your room is the size of a walk in closet. Typically that requires a sub that can pressurize a room. 

See, a subwoofer is an amp AND a speaker. The better SQ and more powerful bass you want from it, the more it costs, and often relative to room size.


----------



## Pirakaphile

The room isn't too big, and it dosen't actually need to be as powerful as I made it seem.


----------



## cel4145

pirakaphile said:


> The room isn't too big, and it dosen't actually need to be as powerful as I made it seem.




The Dayton SUB 800 and SUB 1000 are very good subs for building a budget setup. You could pair them with active or passive speaker setups. Here's a review of the 8": http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57558460-47/dayton-audios-almost-too-good-to-be-true-sub-800-subwoofer/


----------



## Pirakaphile

Probably will get that SUB 800 thing, looks real nice, and that review is good too. Thanks!


----------



## link1393

Thanks for the fast answer


----------



## cel4145

pirakaphile said:


> Probably will get that SUB 800 thing, looks real nice, and that review is good too. Thanks!




Glad to help 

Good pairing with that sub could be NHT SuperZero 2.0s and a Topping TP21 t-amp. NHT just updated the SuperZeroes (again--they've been making this model forever it seems) to 2.1, so discount on the 2.0. 

Here are reviews of the SuperZero 2.0s: http://www.hometheater.com/content/nht-superzero-20-speaker-system
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20020422-47.html (same CNET reviewer as the SUB 800)


----------



## sixly

I have a set of Logitech Z-2300 2.1 THX Certified computer speakers with an upgraded control pod that I absolutely ADORE.  They actually sell more used on Amazon now then they cost when I bought them new 5 years ago.  I think they go for between $150-$170 maybe a bit more with a new pod like mine.  I don't intend to ever give them up


----------



## Nirvana1000

I highly recommend The Earthquake IQ-52 ipod docking active bookshelves.I demoed them a few months ago with my ipod and was very impressed.Very powerful,dynamic and they filled the big storefront demo area with undistorted clean sound with about 70% volume.And they seem very well made,with a lot of features.

http://www.earthquakesound.com/iquake.html


----------



## PurpleAngel

Are the Monoprice 5' studio monitors considered a good value?


----------



## bixby

If this is any indication of Monoprice quality, then no
  
http://www.noaudiophile.com/Monoprice_2Way/


----------



## cel4145

bixby said:


> If this is any indication of Monoprice quality, then no
> 
> http://www.noaudiophile.com/Monoprice_2Way/




I'm not saying the Monoprice speakers are great (I have not heard them), but that reviewer is as questionable as he makes the speakers out to be. He calls the tweeter wave guide a "strange protective grill"--obviously has no clue what a wave guide is. Polymer based cone materials are used in many speakers effectively (my Ascends have polymer cones). How can one know the port tuning needs without the TS parameters for the driver? And I've seen ports that size in other, more expensive, good sounding bookshelves. He's harping on the response he gets at the listening position where obviously room acoustics are going to dramatically influence how the speakers sound. He knows just enough to put together that crap, but not enough to really know what he's talking about. :rolleyes:


----------



## PurpleAngel

Any opinions on the Fostex PMO.4 studio monitors ?
 (they are selling for $130)


----------



## Migou67

I do not know the Fostex, but I'm really happy with the Behringer B3030A, you can find them for under 400$.
  
 - 140-Watt Bi-amp
 - 2" velocity ribbon tweeter
 - 6 ¾" woofer Kevlar and aluminum frame
  
 http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/B3030A.aspx
  
 Very good value for money.


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

> Any opinions on the Fostex PMO.4 studio monitors ?


 
  
  
http://www.soundonsound.com/forum/showflat.php?Number=561884


----------



## BetaWolf

I'm looking for good compact 2.0 speakers less than $200. These are for my bedroom to put on a dresser/headstand to help me relax. They must be self-powered and have RCA audio input capability. The source is going to be streaming MP3's at 192 and above kbps from a Blu-ray player. Not going to be playing it loud, just at comfortable listening levels. Bass must be recessed or have fast response. I cannot relax to boomy bass.
  
 I'm looking the AV40, but I'm not sure how those will fit. Something about the size of typical Logitech/Creative desktop speakers will do. It doesn't really have to be anything special, just something with a good sound:size ratio.


----------



## PurpleAngel

betawolf said:


> I'm looking for good compact 2.0 speakers less than $200. These are for my bedroom to put on a dresser/headstand to help me relax. They must be self-powered and have RCA audio input capability. The source is going to be streaming MP3's at 192 and above kbps from a Blu-ray player. Not going to be playing it loud, just at comfortable listening levels. Bass must be recessed or have fast response. I cannot relax to boomy bass.
> 
> I'm looking the AV40, but I'm not sure how those will fit. Something about the size of typical Logitech/Creative desktop speakers will do. It doesn't really have to be anything special, just something with a good sound:size ratio.


 

 A few minutes ago I setup my new MP5 (Monoprice 5") studio monitors, so far they seem to sound fairly good, have not done any tweeking with the setup yet (if there is any tweeking to be done).
 The MP5s appear to be rebadged M-Audio BX5s (A? or D2?), currently Monoprce is selling them for $165, some other websites are selling the MP5s for over $185.
 http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=115&cp_id=11504&cs_id=1150401&p_id=605500


----------



## piccolochimico

I've read a lot of discussions and i'm get confused.  
 I need a 2.0 stereo system, no sub or other stuff, with  USB plug and built in DAC  to improve the digital sound.
 I'm looking for something above 5", with the genelcs or dynaudio quality but for 1/3 or the retail price  :atsmile:


----------



## ZenocideZ

B&W mm1 +1
  
 Got it in 2012. After burn in 500 hours, it sounds so heavenly.


----------



## Audio Jester

I had the Swan M200 MkIII's, my mother now has them (she said she needed them more than me).  They are great speakers for the money with a nice level of clarity in the mids and treble range.  The treble is smooth and clear, but not overly sparkly or bright which suited my tastes.  I found they responsed well to having a decent DAC in the chain (who doesn't?) and they can offer good imaging if setup correctly.
  
 One point I would make is that they are big and they do require a decent sized desk to allow for proper listening distances.  Mine is 1200mm (or 47" for the Imperials) and it was a bit of a squeeze to fit them on; for a proper listening setup you would want a desk a little wider than that (1500mm should do it).  Another point that was a positive for me, but I am sure it won't suit everyone, is the limitation in the bass frequency reponse.  The swan website states that they have a frequency response of 53Hz - 20KHz, which is perfect if you live in a sharehouse and don't want to disturb others.  If you are looking for sub-bass you will have to look elsewhere.  Obviously these are designed for use at a computer and I can personally confirm that these speakers will not be adequate for a large party in a large room (doesn't hurt to try these things LOL).
  
 I miss them, and I have not got around to replacing them.  I had a listen to some B&W speakers recently (A7 and A5 I think) and they really did not grab me.  I know they are not really the same but the A7 retails for around $1000 in this neck of the woods.... the Swans are 499(AU$) currently.


----------



## ogarmi21

I think the BX8 d2 is a better choice for BX5 d2. But people say the build quality isn't that good. Would have a high rate of being not working. Is it true?


----------



## PleasantSounds

Depending on where you are, you may be able to get PreSonus Eris E8 close to $500. Here in Australia they are around $600, but we pay extra for nearly everything.
  
 These monitors are used by some professional studios, and if you want something going as low as 35Hz, you'll be hard pressed to beat them in this price bracket. Front-firing bass port is also a benefit if you're considering placement close to wall.


----------



## BruntFCA

zenocidez said:


> B&W mm1 +1
> 
> Got it in 2012. After burn in 500 hours, it sounds so heavenly.


 
 Some of the Best Buys near me are selling these open-box but in mint condition for $270 which seems like a good price.


----------



## germanium

Km



ogarmi21 said:


> I think the BX8 d2 is a better choice for BX5 d2. But people say the build quality isn't that good. Would have a high rate of being not working. Is it true?




Don't know about the D2 series but I have the original BX5'S with the silver ring around the woofer & it had problems with power supply filter caps going bad as well as the 2 layer circuit board developing an open circuit causing one of the power supply filter cap to reverse charge as well as blow one of the tiny 12 volt voltage regulators. This took a few years to happen but still can be an issue. I went ahead & replaced all the large power supply filter caps & bypassed the bad trace that was on the top side of the pcb. No more issues since then.

I have heard of issues with the D2 series as well so your milage may vary.


----------



## yay101

Could not possibly disagree more about the Audioengines. I bought the a5+ a couple of years ago and have been very happy since, positioning them properly on solid speaker stands is a must.


----------



## gus6464

My favorite small speaker for the past year and half has been the Audioengine A2 with a sub but yesterday they were dethroned by an unlikely candidate:

Tannoy Reveal 402

I heard other speakers in the same price class from Mackie, KRK, Yamaha, and JBL and the Tannoy's are just in a whole different league. Needless to say the A2's are being relocated and adding 2 small sealed subs to the Tannoy.


----------



## myap2328

Hi All, to revive this thread. I have owned a Swan M200Mkiii but not exactly impressed as it's rather warm for my tastes. I have a Harman Kardon micro system iirc is MAS100? And it definitely triumphs them but it's 3 times the price MSRP.

I liked the Swans for it's overall unopposing sound signatures but I yearn for something clearer, anybody have any suggestions??


----------



## cel4145

Budget? 

Also, I haven't heard the M200s, but they have an excellent reputation. I wouldn't expect to do better by spending similar money unless you can listen before buy and find something that perhaps fits your particular tastes a little better.


----------



## myap2328

Well, I honestly think swans are overhyped. Because I paired it with an Emotiva XDA-1 Dac, a Dac that is of high fidelity calibre. So anything would be either amps or speaker.

Source is a desktop; but not many have a fancy source at this stage either.

I'm looking at the Focal Alpha 50, XS Book,
Fostex 0.X series, budget is about 200-300 usd.


----------



## Destroysall

To pick with sincerity, I believe in the KRK Rokit 5 G2 for hi-fi playback. Adequate amount of bass for a small pair of speakers and the colored sound perfectly caters for hi-fi listening, despite that they are marketed for studio use. You can always add the accompanying KRK sub if you feel the need for more bass.


----------



## DADDYDC650

JBL LSR305. Pair for $224 baby.


----------



## cel4145

daddydc650 said:


> JBL LSR305. Pair for $224 baby.




Yep. Sweetwater has a great deal right now.


----------



## listen4joy

I think microlab solo 6c preety good too.


----------



## myap2328

Thanks to all who helped but jus wanted to point out that I live in Singapore and hence some of the brands mentioned are not available and shipping speakers are not exactly very cost effective. The JBLS seems like I possible option will keep it in mind thanks. Other than that any other recommendations?


----------



## yay101

Yeah those jbls look like they could make a sweet home theater system.


----------



## astrallite

Picked up a pair of used Genelec 8020s on craigslist for $300. I see they usually go for about $400 on ebay, brand new they are $1150/pr. I believe when Best Buy was doing clearance on its Musical Instruments Dept these were going for about $500 new. Very good if you are looking in the small speaker category, and definitely blows away the B&W MM-1s I was using earlier on my laptop.


----------



## SoAmusing777

I'm looking for a setup for under $500 if anyone has some info.


----------



## xedjflowx

destroysall said:


> To pick with sincerity, I believe in the KRK Rokit 5 G2 for hi-fi playback. Adequate amount of bass for a small pair of speakers and the colored sound perfectly caters for hi-fi listening, despite that they are marketed for studio use. You can always add the accompanying KRK sub if you feel the need for more bass.


 

 Oh god. I don't understand why people recommend these except for bass. I went into GC to buy these, left with a pair of Mackies. A truly overhyped monitor imo


----------



## Jubei

I upgraded from a pair of M-Audio AV40 to RuarkAudio MR1. They're definitely more refined.


----------



## SoAmusing777

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ErisE4.5 $130 for the pair. Wonder how they fare vs lsr305


----------



## SoAmusing777

Well I just got the LSR305'S from JBL for $225 new shipped from http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ All I had to reference was the deal they had going on in Feb. that was seen on the 305 page in the reviews section. Stoked!


----------



## Koss02

I just purchased the Creative T40 2.0 speakers and I can say that I'm really disappointed in them....anyone else feel similarly ?

 They just don't perform as well as I thought.


----------



## Allanmarcus

not sure if anyone pointed these out yet, but Emotiva has great powered monitors ranging in price from 284-474/pair. These all have Air Motion Transformer tweeters, so they are going to be very detailed.
  
 https://emotiva.com/products/emotiva-pro/powered-monitors-0
  
 I've read many good reviews of these.


----------



## xedjflowx

allanmarcus said:


> not sure if anyone pointed these out yet, but Emotiva has great powered monitors ranging in price from 284-474/pair. These all have Air Motion Transformer tweeters, so they are going to be very detailed.
> 
> https://emotiva.com/products/emotiva-pro/powered-monitors-0
> 
> I've read many good reviews of these.


 

 the Stealth 8's look nice. But so damned expensive (for me)


----------



## Allanmarcus

deal alert:
  
 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051WAM64
  
 M-Audio Studiophile AV 40 Active Studio Monitor Speakers
  

  
 Amazon Lightning deal at 12:00 Noon, MST


----------



## cel4145

xedjflowx said:


> the Stealth 8's look nice. But so damned expensive (for me)




Get the Airmotiv 5s and then add a sub later


----------



## Allanmarcus

I forgot about swan. Anyone have anything for swan, or heard them? 

http://www.chanemusiccinema.com/swan-multimedia


----------



## Allanmarcus

Not sure if these are any good, but they have ribbon tweeters, which I love
  
 https://www.massdrop.com/buy/samson-resolv-rxa5-reference-monitor?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Personalization%20Email%2020141203%20%28Unpersonalized%29&utm_campaign=Product%20Announcement%202014-12-03%20unpers&mode=guest_open


----------



## andrei0635

Hey everyonbe, i was looking to buy some new speakers and i found an M-audio *Bx5 D2 *set for 100€ used but practically new.
 are there any diferences between b5a deluxe and these ones?


----------



## sizzlincok

The D2 is newer and much better. Many reviews say they're excellent and for the price too.


----------



## valtopps

ive owned the swam 200mkIII for a couple of years they sound wonderful, very powerful with plenty of bass. I was wondering if the kef 300x compare to the mkIII?


----------



## andrei0635

I decided to buy the bx5 d2. I will connect them to my motherboard output. Do I need a dac or audio interface or is not needed, just an 1/8 to 2 1/4 adapter? I'm no expert


----------



## cel4145

An external DAC might improve the audio quality a bit. I wouldn't worry about it for now. Try them and see how they sound.


----------



## BigTerminator

I loved my M-Audio's. Were not perfect without an eq but are a great value. My Emotivas are better but not too much better to justify double the cost.


----------



## xedjflowx

bigterminator said:


> I loved my M-Audio's. Were not perfect without an eq but are a great value. My Emotivas are better but not too much better to justify double the cost.


 

 I just got the Yamahas HS8's. IMO, you can't get a better value. Sounded marginally better than all the 8" monitors I compared them to, and for doubling the cost to monitors like Adams, I couldn't deem them worth it.


----------



## Destroysall

xedjflowx said:


> Oh god. I don't understand why people recommend these except for bass. I went into GC to buy these, left with a pair of Mackies. A truly overhyped monitor imo


Its all based on an individual's ear. I love Mackie, but I personally only prefer them for mixing.


----------



## Koss02

jubei said:


> I upgraded from a pair of M-Audio AV40 to RuarkAudio MR1. They're definitely more refined.




These speakers look amazing. Any way to get them shipped to the States? It looks like the brand is Europe only


----------



## SoAmusing777

So just what in the hell is the low pass filter on this Presonus Temblor T10. Go look at an image of it. Huge gap between the 50 and 60hz setting, tiny gap between 60 and 80, and a medium-ish one between 80 and 130. There's no way for me to tell what I'm setting it at unless it's one of those numbers. What a terrible design. Any help?


----------



## cdsa35000

Nothing wrong with, its abit logarithmic scale with better randscale finetuning from 50Hz-60Hz:


----------



## SoAmusing777

cdsa35000 said:


> Nothing wrong with, its abit logarithmic scale with better randscale finetuning from 50Hz-60Hz:


 
 I see. Nice image! Did you make it yourself?


----------



## cel4145

soamusing777 said:


> So just what in the hell is the low pass filter on this Presonus Temblor T10. Go look at an image of it. Huge gap between the 50 and 60hz setting, tiny gap between 60 and 80, and a medium-ish one between 80 and 130. There's no way for me to tell what I'm setting it at unless it's one of those numbers. What a terrible design. Any help?




Just curious why you need to see the frequencies more precisely? 

If you are trying to match up your speaker roll of with the sub, manufacturer specs can often be off at least a little or a lot, and you need to know the slope of the roll off to figure out where to match. And even then, if the manufacturer provides frequency output graphs, they are most likely anechoic; room acoustics will likely affect the frequency response of the sub and the speakers from anechoic, so the only way to really match things up well is with a mic or SPL meter. Otherwise, you might as well do it by ear.


----------



## SoAmusing777

cel4145 said:


> Just curious why you need to see the frequencies more precisely?
> 
> If you are trying to match up your speaker roll of with the sub, manufacturer specs can often be off at least a little or a lot, and you need to know the slope of the roll off to figure out where to match. And even then, if the manufacturer provides frequency output graphs, they are most likely anechoic; room acoustics will likely affect the frequency response of the sub and the speakers from anechoic, so the only way to really match things up well is with a mic or SPL meter. Otherwise, you might as well do it by ear.


 

 To setup a proper crossover. That sounds complicated and like a pain, plus a lot of research and buying more stuff. I'll just go by ear. I have it set at 70hz now. Good enough for me.


----------



## xedjflowx

Anyone know what I can do to connect a spare set of monitors to my PC without using a preamp?
  
 Can I just buy a 3.5mm to dual XLR or TRS?


----------



## SoAmusing777

xedjflowx said:


> Anyone know what I can do to connect a spare set of monitors to my PC without using a preamp?
> 
> Can I just buy a 3.5mm to dual XLR or TRS?


 

 Not sure about the preamp bit, but yes I believe so, I'd reccommend this - http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=115&cp_id=11509&cs_id=1150905&p_id=601045&seq=1&format=2


----------



## xedjflowx

soamusing777 said:


> Not sure about the preamp bit, but yes I believe so, I'd reccommend this - http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=115&cp_id=11509&cs_id=1150905&p_id=601045&seq=1&format=2



Exactly where I was gonna go. Monpprice for the win!


----------



## SoAmusing777

xedjflowx said:


> Exactly where I was gonna go. Monpprice for the win!


 
 Indeed. Glad I could help. Just bought that as well as some 6ft. premium XLR's male to female.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Hi,
 I am planning for swan M200MKII.
 But confused with Bose c20 and audioengine A2+. 
 Which is the best one with respect to SQ?
 Planning to couple with IBasso D zero MK2 DAC.
 Regards,


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Any opinion please?


----------



## myap2328

kiranjoshi7 said:


> Hi,
> I am planning for swan M200MKII.
> But confused with Bose c20 and audioengine A2+.
> Which is the best one with respect to SQ?
> ...




Focal XS Book beats the m200mkiii. Audioengine and bose is hype ****.


----------



## yay101

I certainly wouldn't group them, when bose can deliver audioengine sound for even only twice as much let me know.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Hi,
I am thinking of swan MK 2 as MK 3 is out of budget. I shall pair it with I basso Dzero MK 2.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

I did not find single review of swan M 100 Bluetooth desktop speakers?
Does anyone has idea how do these sound?
Regards,


----------



## Oktyabr

I'm really a speaker guy, and a headphone guy second.  I haven't read this entire thread (yet) but wonder, why self powered?  T-amps are cheap as dirt these days and can produce remarkable sound quality in a 2.0 situation...


----------



## kiranjoshi7

oktyabr said:


> I'm really a speaker guy, and a headphone guy second.  I haven't read this entire thread (yet) but wonder, why self powered?  T-amps are cheap as dirt these days and can produce remarkable sound quality in a 2.0 situation...


 
 Hi,
 Kindly suggest good 2.0 desktop passive speakers with amp. Budget is 250-300USD.
 Will i basso D zero MK 2 will function as good amp for same purpose?
 Regards,


----------



## kiranjoshi7

hi.
 Any experience of swan M 100 Bluetooth desktop speakers?
 Is it worth purchasing? Regards,


----------



## Oktyabr

kiranjoshi7 said:


> Hi,
> Kindly suggest good 2.0 desktop passive speakers with amp. Budget is 250-300USD.
> Will i basso D zero MK 2 will function as good amp for same purpose?
> Regards,


 


 For speakers these are highly rated:

 I think the Infinity Primus line are excellent.  More than a few pair have moved through my collection over the years but people who hear them keep buying them off of me!  An older version won high accolades from Stereophile back in the day:  http://www.stereophile.com/standloudspeakers/404infinity/  
 Most of the various sizes are available many places online, including Amazon.  Shop around for the best price (Amazon is $120-$160 a pair, depending on the size.)

 I haven't owned any new Pioneers in over 20 years that truly impressed me.  These are actually VERY good.  $127/pair :  http://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-SP-BS22-LR-Designed-Bookshelf-Loudspeakers/dp/B008NCD2LG/ref=pd_bxgy_indust_text_y

 These Polk are also very good and arguably some of the better looking speakers you could put on/near a desk.  $129/pair:  http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00192KEY0?psc=1

 The Dayton Audio B652 are silly cheap and have been reviewed many, many, many times, being preferred to much more expensive speakers in blind A/B tests.  Less than $40 a pair!: 
 http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-b652-6-1-2-2-way-bookshelf-speaker-pair--300-652

 If you can find them somewhere, at a good price, even USED, try to check out the Paradigm Atoms.  I really don't like Paradigm but the Atoms are superb.

 Amps?  I like the Dayton Audio DTA-100 but there are many affordable ones to choose from.  For near field/desktop use I'd recommend any of the T-Amps for great sound (potentially) at a rock bottom price.  The Pioneers, up above, are often bundled with a Lepai T-amp that costs only a dollar a watt ($20 for 20 watts).  The Dayton Audio DTA-1 was the first T-Amp I ever heard and I enjoyed it very much.  Be advised that even with amps this cheap, while the sound quality can be VERY good, you may end up with a very cheap, weak overall build.  Good connectors, controls, case and power supply can double the price or more.  It's up to you, how durable you need something to be.

 This is one of the best values in bookshelf speakers + amp but the connectors on the amp are QUITE flimsy.  I'm not sure you could buy anything that sounded better for under $150.  Bonus, it can run for hours on batteries too!

 http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-t-amp-and-b652-portable-speaker-system-package--300-650


----------



## Oktyabr

kiranjoshi7 said:


> hi.
> Any experience of swan M 100 Bluetooth desktop speakers?
> Is it worth purchasing? Regards,


 
 I have no experience with any desktop bluetooth speakers.  I always figured it was much cheaper to use wire when possible, rather than pay for a chip to do it for you.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Hi, 
 @ oktyabr, Thanks a lot.
 Shall update regarding my purchase for sure.
 Regards,


----------



## cel4145

kiranjoshi7 said:


> hi.
> Any experience of swan M 100 Bluetooth desktop speakers?
> Is it worth purchasing? Regards,




The best bluetooth speakers typically perform worse than the best wired speakers. The bluetooth technology is part of the cost.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Thanks a lot.
Among active speakers, which is to pick up?:
 *Swan M200MKII  (Higher cost)OR
 *Swan D1080 (affordable)
 Is SQ difference between two is very significant?
 Regards,


----------



## cel4145

kiranjoshi7 said:


> Thanks a lot.
> Among active speakers, which is to pick up?:
> *Swan M200MKII  (Higher cost)OR
> *Swan D1080 (affordable)
> ...




That's a relative question based on listener preference. Only you could make that determination. 

Personally, I would go with the higher model. The Swan M200s have an excellent reputation for being a good desktop multimedia speaker. However, if they are in the same price range for you, I would go with the JBL LSR305s.


----------



## Oktyabr

The JBL's are also a speaker I would like to hear one day but they look awful large for desktop or _very_ near field.  

 These are also an interesting speaker I'd like to know more about, that I stumbled across while doing a bit of research for this thread...  The original Micca MB42 was love/hated by various reviewers and the improved version, the Micca MB42x seemed to have fixed most of it's problems with the addition of a real crossover (including a zobel network) *but *also seems impossible to find these days.  While looking for another source I stumbled across the exact same speaker except in a *powered* version.  At $100/pair these might be worth checking out too, and with Amazon's money back guarantee I might just have to audition some:

 http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NXAEPDC?tag=mygapa-20


----------



## cel4145

oktyabr said:


> The JBL's are also a speaker I would like to hear one day but they look awful large for desktop or _very_ near field.




They are studio monitors designed for near field use.


----------



## Oktyabr

cel4145 said:


> They are studio monitors designed for near field use.


 
 Near field _in a studio _is rarely as close as most people would put them in a "desktop" application, hence why I said "_*very*_ near field".

 How closely any "near field monitors" are designed to the intended purpose is debatable but the "golden triangle" formula is golden because it seems to be the norm...  Same distance apart as they are from your ears, same height as your ears and far enough away from your head that you can not distinguish the sound from one driver from the other (it should sound like one speaker, not two speakers in the same area). Further, if they are closer to your ears than any of the walls (or other large, reflective surfaces in the room) you are then technically in "near field".  A triangle five feet on a side is pretty popular as far as "ideal", for most such monitors.  There used to be a rule of thumb about calculating the minimum distance based on the distance from the center of the tweeter to the center of the woofer too but with newer wave guide technologies (and horns) this one sort of got thrown by the way side.  Last but not least these should be placed in such a way that early reflections are minimized, ie, on stands, suspended from the ceiling, or at the edge of a surface, not on a flat surface with a large, radiating expanse out in front of it (like flat on a desk?)

 Mostly the JBL interests me... and worries me... because out of all the speakers I've read about in this thread so far, they may actually be the closest to a _real_ studio monitor, rather than a great choice for smaller rooms and/or on a desk.


----------



## xedjflowx

oktyabr said:


> Near field _in a studio _is rarely as close as most people would put them in a "desktop" application, hence why I said "_*very*_ near field".
> 
> How closely any "near field monitors" are designed to the intended purpose is debatable but the "golden triangle" formula is golden because it seems to be the norm...  Same distance apart as they are from your ears, same height as your ears and far enough away from your head that you can not distinguish the sound from one driver from the other (it should sound like one speaker, not two speakers in the same area). Further, if they are closer to your ears than any of the walls (or other large, reflective surfaces in the room) you are then technically in "near field".  A triangle five feet on a side is pretty popular as far as "ideal", for most such monitors.  There used to be a rule of thumb about calculating the minimum distance based on the distance from the center of the tweeter to the center of the woofer too but with newer wave guide technologies (and horns) this one sort of got thrown by the way side.  Last but not least these should be placed in such a way that early reflections are minimized, ie, on stands, suspended from the ceiling, or at the edge of a surface, not on a flat surface with a large, radiating expanse out in front of it (like flat on a desk?)
> 
> Mostly the JBL interests me... and worries me... because out of all the speakers I've read about in this thread so far, they may actually be the closest to a _real_ studio monitor, rather than a great choice for smaller rooms and/or on a desk.


 
 Why do you say "real?"


----------



## Oktyabr

xedjflowx said:


> Why do you say "real?"


 
 Because most that are advertised as such seem to be targeted towards exactly what this thread is about.  A perceived idea of what a "studio monitor" is without actually having the capabilities to serve as one.  If you have read any of the reviews on the JBL in question, however, it's VERY flat, which is something a real studio monitor needs to be.  After all, they are intended to be as neutral as possible, so as not to color the sound that is being mixed (in a studio, right?)  The fact is that most people prefer some coloration in the sound reproduction when they are listening to the final product.  And most of the speakers listed in this thread offer that.

 In my opinion you only really buy studio monitors because they will help you do a job, usually related to mixing, mastering, producing, etc.  I don't think the OP is looking for such qualities.


----------



## cel4145

oktyabr said:


> Because most that are advertised as such seem to be targeted towards exactly what this thread is about.  A perceived idea of what a "studio monitor" is without actually having the capabilities to serve as one.  If you have read any of the reviews on the JBL in question, however, it's VERY flat, which is something a real studio monitor needs to be.  After all, they are intended to be as neutral as possible, so as not to color the sound that is being mixed (in a studio, right?)  The fact is that most people prefer some coloration in the sound reproduction when they are listening to the final product.  And most of the speakers listed in this thread offer that.
> 
> 
> In my opinion you only really buy studio monitors because they will help you do a job, usually related to mixing, mastering, producing, etc.  I don't think the OP is looking for such qualities.




The LSR 305s sound quite good. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone for music listening.


----------



## Oktyabr

cel4145 said:


> The LSR 305s sound quite good. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone for music listening.


 
 I'm quite sure I would like them a good deal.  I may eventually get around to trying them.  Ultimately the best speaker is the one that sounds good to *you*, no matter what the opinions of others may be.


----------



## kiranjoshi7

I am thinking of getting Swan M200 MK 2. My listening distance in front of desk would be around 3 feet. There is wooden cupboard behind me (behind which is brick wall). Distance between speakers and cupboard would be hardly around 6 feet. 
Whether powerful speaker like model of swan would be overkill? Or should I go for speaker with small sized drivers?
Regards


----------



## Oktyabr

kiranjoshi7 said:


> I am thinking of getting Swan M200 MK 2. My listening distance in front of desk would be around 3 feet. There is wooden cupboard behind me (behind which is brick wall). Distance between speakers and cupboard would be hardly around 6 feet.
> Whether powerful speaker like model of swan would be overkill? Or should I go for speaker with small sized drivers?
> Regards


 
 6moons reviewed the M200 MK3 and liked it quite well on the desktop, in a smaller room (7' x 7' I think), saying they behaved even better in that environment than they did in a larger room on stands.  The swans are good looking speakers and I like the fact that the front baffle is tipped back.  On stands this may improve time alignment but on a desktop they are likely to be pointing more *upwards* towards you rather than broadcasting towards your chest...  a GOOD thing!  This tilt should also help minimize early reflections from being placed directly on a large, flat surface.

 http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/swans2/2.html

 That said and knowing you are working with a $500 budget I wonder if I wouldn't take a good look at some of the KEF offerings too, primarily because not only are they usually highly regarded for their SQ but also because they use a coaxial driver arrangement, which should technically be much better in a very near field environment.  Might be out of your budget but these looked interesting enough to read some reviews on and hunt down a deal, anyway:  http://www.amazon.com/KEF-X300A-Digital-Speaker-System/dp/B00AXYKF30

 After thinking about the KEFs for awhile I think personally I would (actually might do this, for real) take a look at some DIY options using higher end "full range" single drivers like the Mark Audio, maybe something from Jordan, etc.  This of course means you would need at the minimum some wood working tools, premade cabinets, or someone to cut some for you (got any friends with a CNC machine?)  That's probably just for the real oddballs like me though...  I built three different full size floor standing models before settling on the ones I have now!


----------



## kiranjoshi7

Thanks a lot for prompt response and suggestion


----------



## jay628

Hey guys,
 I am currently looking for some powered speakers for my computer. I have narrowed down to these and I could really use your professional advice!!
 1. Focal XS Book
 2. Fostex PM0.5d
 3. Emotiva Airmotivs 4/5
  
 The Focal XS Book seems to be the most simple/convenient choice and also the easier to get for me, but I have also read good things about the airmotivs and pm0.5...
 I do have the Modi/Magni stack for my headphones, can I make use of them for these speakers?
  
 Thanks in advance!!


----------



## SoAmusing777

This setup still rocks. My laptop comes back in from repair tomorrow. I know someone was asking me to take pictures. I'll do it tomorrow or new years day


----------



## myap2328

jay628 said:


> Hey guys,
> I am currently looking for some powered speakers for my computer. I have narrowed down to these and I could really use your professional advice!!
> 1. Focal XS Book
> 2. Fostex PM0.5d
> ...


 
  
 The Focal XS Book is really good trust me... I am a hifi enthusiast and this is a scaled down hifi system. I AM NOT A FOCAL SALESPERSON OR A FOCAL SALES REPRESENTATIVE.I have friends with speaker setups costing 6 digits and up and they are full of praise with the focals


----------



## Oktyabr

I have to agree with the above poster.  I've NEVER heard this particular pair of Focals or any of their smaller speakers.  I earned respect for them after I heard the cleanest, most life like play back of Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon in a weird shaped room with $10,000 worth of amps, pre, turntable (yeah, it was VINYL! With a $800 cartridge on it, *used*)... and a pair of Focal Chorus floor standers (706 I think).  SUPERB!

 I know other companies have made stellar audiophile equipment and then went on to slap their names on plasticized junk but Focal is one company I *might* take a gamble on.


----------



## cel4145

I have not heard the Focal XS Book, but people I trust recommend them. I don't think you could go wrong with them for a 4" driver speaker. 

I have heard the Airmotiv 4s. I'd go with the JBL LSR305s over them if you can get them *if* bass response is important. I thought the midbass response quality (not quantity) was OK with Airmotiv 4s (I tend to like 5 or 6" driver speakers better for that).


----------



## jay628

thanks for the replies. can I add a sub to the setup if I'm going to use the xs book? can I make use of my modo and magni with the setup?


----------



## cel4145

jay628 said:


> thanks for the replies. can I add a sub to the setup if I'm going to use the xs book? can I make use of my modo and magni with the setup?




I'm assuming you have the original Magni. To use the Modi and Magni with the speakers, you will have to split the output from the Modi and run it to both the Magni and the speakers, or get a switch. 

To use a sub, you would either (a) split the output from the Modi and run it to both the speakers and the sub or (b) buy a sub that has line level inputs and outputs, and run the Modi to the sub, and then hook the speakers to the sub.


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

Excuse me please but I would like to sound a word of caution at this point. Particularly as regards the suitability of using the XS as the basis for a cheap full range system by adding a sub. 
  
 Focal certainly enjoy a very good reputation but they are not usually regarded as inexpensive. The XS are also the least sophisticated design. At least in a technical sense.
  
 For a start they are not really active a all. They are powered speakers. There is a 20wpc stereo amp in one enclosure which feeds a passive crossover to the drivers in each. It's like a regular stereo with the amp hidden in one of the boxes.
  
 The other two options are genuine actives. They have an active crossover in each box and a separate amp for each driver (i.e. 4 amps). They are also twice as powerul on average.
  
 Also Focal have been a bit creative when they quote a mid driver size of 4 inches. If it was measured using the same standard as the other two products (the basket rather than the entire assembly) it would only count as 3 inches.
  
 That said I would add that it is the concept of near field listening that is so attractive price/performance wise rather than the brand So I'm sure all the above would offer immense satisfaction.
  
 I'd go for the XS if the style and appearance was important and/or I was moving them around a lot. As the basis of a full range system though I'd prefer the Fostex. I don't know emotiva as they don't sell in my territory but they appearto be a knock off of classic ADAM designs and therefore should be excellent also.
  
 If you really want to stick with Focal take a look at the CMS40. Similar spec to the fostex and emotiva but with a step up in grade (project studio vs entry level) but they are signficantly more expensive.


----------



## jay628

Thx for the replies and suggestions. I would really love to try the fostex too as they are cheaper as well. the cms40 is just way over my budget


----------



## jay628

May I ask what exactly is the differences between the cms40(being studio) and the fostex and emotiva speakers?


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

The most obvious difference is that they have a cast aluminum body. Like Genelecs.
  
 The more complex answer has to do with price points and overall quality.
  
 Once you eliminate the models aimed at those who cannot afford the real thing (i.e. M-Audio, Berhinger) and those who have too much money (i.e. PMC, ATC) the manufacturers of studio monitors divide their ranges into 3 main categories. Entry level or bedroom studio (Mackie MR, Yamaha HS, JBL LSR, ADAM F). Midrange or project studio (ADAM AX, Mackie HR, EVE SC, DYNAUDIO BM). High end or professional studio (ADAM SX, DYNAUDIO Air, Focal SM, Neumann & Genelec). They usually have 3 sizes as well (4-5", 6-7", 8"+).
  
 As the price goes up so does the quality of the components and workmanship. You can tell they are serious about this distinction because the length of the guarantee goes up as well. 1-2 years for entry level, 3-5 years for project studio and up to 6-8 years for studio studio.
  
 The key point here for you to notice is that no one makes well regarded entry level 4" monitors. To get a driver of sufficient quality you need ADAM A3X, Focal CMS40, EVE SC204, Genelec 8320). This is important because to get a clean 110dB+ full range playback system, even with a sub, you generally need a standard quality driver of at least 5" (i.e. JBL LSR 305 etc) or a significantly dearer (longer excursion, higher power handling) 4" driver as a minimum.
  
 So that's why I say that if you want to build yourself something of proven quality that will give years of trouble free pleasure without having to sell parts each time you upgrade you should start with either entry level grade 5" speakers or project studio grade 4" speakers if space is at a premium. It is a personal opinion of course but if you intend to add a sub(s) anyway you might as well start with a higher grade 4" rather than a standard 5" because the price difference isn't that great and you get a better overall product in the end - plus the piece of mind of a longer guarantee.
  
 Does that make sense?


----------



## sealman

I have 2 pairs of the Airmotiv 4's and a pair of the 5;s as well.
 The 5's sound MUCH better to my ears in the bass and midrange.
 They also play louder than the 4's which isn't a big deal for nearfield (computer setup) listening but may be a factor depending on what someone wants to use them for.
  
 With all the Emotiva powered monitors on sale atm you can actually get the 6's for just under 500 beans and the 5's for under 350 beans.
 With a 30 day return policy and free shipping the only thing you are out would be return shipping.
  
 I too have had a pair of A2's in the past. At the time I thought they sounded pretty decent for their size. At least until I tried some other offerings.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 I have also tried (in no specific order).
 B&W Dm601's and DM600's
 Energy XL 150's
 Boston Acoustic CR6's and CR4's
 Mirage Omnistats
  
 I powered these with 
 Pioneer VSX??? 400.00 receiver
 Integra DTR 50.2
 Marantz SR7001
 Marantz AV 550 preamp and Rotel RB993 anp
 Bose AM3
  
 These were all Computer setups over the last 15 years or so. 
 The Omnisats were an attempt to downsize that was a waste of time.The A2's followed and were such an improvement over the omnisats I lived with them for 2 years.
  
 All of these had the use of a small sub (except for the bose module!)
  
 My current setup is the Airmotiv 5's in front and the 4's in the rear using an Audioengine wireless sender/receiver.
 Sub is a DIY Triska Sub
 They are all run from an Emotiva UMC-200.
 My phones are some old Senn HD 570's. I also use a modmic.
  
 Sorry for the long post but I didn't want you to write off the Emotiva's out of hand.
 Of course YMMV


----------



## jay628

Base on your detailed explanation. I am now choosing between these similar priced monitors,

1. Fostex pm0.5d
2. Tannoy Reveal 602
3. Adam a3x/f5

Anyone have thoughts on these? how are they compared?

Thanks


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

It is unlikely anyone here has direct experience of all those options. I don't and anyway they will all sound different in my room than they do in yours.
  
 So it's down to reputation and opinion.
  
 Fostex are a huge company. They manufacture many of the drivers and other components OEM manufacturers use in their own designs. Their own products have a reputation of being excellent no frills value. Short on marketing hype and styling but strong on everyday performance and reliability.
  
 I don't like to write knocking copy, especially when I don't have direct experience, but the Tannoy Reveal range doesn't seem to have caught the buying public's imagination. The was some concern they had cut too many corners to meet a price point and self noise was an often quoted concern. They may well have sorted this out or it might have been overstated but why take the risk? Do a search and decide for yourself.
  
 I have to admit to a personal preference for ADAM gear. I now own 2 sets of their monitors and two subs. I love the A3X to bits. Fantastic on the desktop and along with the 2 subs also an excellent area playback system. So take my recommendation with a pinch of salt.


----------



## lamode

See if you can get a pair of Adam A5X for $500. Might be possible if you shop around.


----------



## jay628

Thanks for the suggestions. I have read about those speakers on sound on sound, and they are all getting good reviews being nice at their price range. I am wondering if any of the three is speicifally weak in bass response?I dont need huge bass but I prefer to have deeper and tighter bass, I am only familiar with fostex as I have some knowledge in headphones, I guess their speakers are tuned to have better bass as well?


----------



## lamode

jay628 said:


> I am only familiar with fostex as I have some knowledge in headphones, I guess their speakers are tuned to have better bass as well?


 
  
 That's a huge assumption.


----------



## jay628

Ya I am just assuming base on their headphones...hope I can get some feedbacks from people with more experience with speakers


----------



## glow9

You guys like Fluance SX6's?


----------



## cel4145

myap2328 said:


> The one thing that the other guy in the forums here seem to knock me down for is the Focal XS Book. Yes I am completely aware it is marketed as a lifestyle product but for goodness sake... Their flagship is one of the best speakers in the world and I believe all are aware of trickle down tech? Eg. LCD-3 to LCD2?




While I don't doubt that the Focal XS Books are good, your "trickle down tech" premise doesn't hold up very well in the audio world. I wouldn't base a purchasing decision on that.


----------



## gus6464

BTW massdrop has the JBL LSR308 speakers right now for a really really good price. I have the LSR305 and they are fantastic for the money. The LSR308 are huge but if you got the room you won't find a better speaker for $360/pair.


----------



## H8rsama

I have the Tannoy Reveal 501 and...i love em. Maybe ill swap for the LSR ones. but im quite happy with these.


----------



## aairria

I second this. Had a speaker-hunting quest at one time and after weeks of struggling I picked a pair of Tannoy Reveals 501a. These are of outstanding quality for their price, have a nice minimalistic design and a bass reflex port in front. Both musically and as studio monitors they never fail me.


----------



## pigmode

I'm looking for active computer speakers, for mainly jazz, classical, and 80's-90's pop. I guess the Yamaha HS5M is on the list. Are monitors too revealing for direct computer connection (macbookpro)? What other options? Budget is $150-275, but I'll go higher if need be.


----------



## xedjflowx

pigmode said:


> I'm looking for active computer speakers, for mainly jazz, classical, and 80's-90's pop. I guess the Yamaha HS5M is on the list. Are monitors too revealing for direct computer connection (macbookpro)? What other options? Budget is $150-275, but I'll go higher if need be.


 
  
 Yamaha's are the ones for sure. Don't think they make the HS5M anymore. I have the HS8's. Highly recommended.


----------



## pigmode

xedjflowx said:


> pigmode said:
> 
> 
> > I'm looking for active computer speakers, for mainly jazz, classical, and 80's-90's pop. I guess the Yamaha HS5M is on the list. Are monitors too revealing for direct computer connection (macbookpro)? What other options? Budget is $150-275, but I'll go higher if need be.
> ...


 
  
  
 Thanks. I had just ordered from Sweetwater, but they called and asked if I really wanted only the one speaker I had ordered (doh). They also mentioned the HS5M might not be the best speaker for direct [size=12.8000001907349px]connected[/size] laptop sourced music listening (too revealing).
  
Asked for a recommendation, they suggested the Focal XS Book. Not sure which way to go, or where to order the HS5M.


----------



## aairria

pigmode said:


> Thanks. I had just ordered from Sweetwater, but they called and asked if I really wanted only the one speaker I had ordered (doh). They also mentioned the HS5M might not be the best speaker for direct [size=12.8000001907349px]connected[/size] laptop sourced music listening (too revealing).
> 
> Asked for a recommendation, they suggested the Focal XS Book. Not sure which way to go, or where to order the HS5M.


 
  
 Did you order only one speaker? Studio monitors are priced per single speaker so you probably need to order two of them. I'm just guessing that's what Sweetwater was asking about.


----------



## pigmode

aairria said:


> pigmode said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks. I had just ordered from Sweetwater, but they called and asked if I really wanted only the one speaker I had ordered (doh). They also mentioned the HS5M might not be the best speaker for direct [size=12.8000001907349px]connected[/size] laptop sourced music listening (too revealing).
> ...


 
  
  
 Right, but they still dis-recommended the Yamaha.


----------



## xedjflowx

pigmode said:


> Right, but they still dis-recommended the Yamaha.


 

 They want you to buy a preamp basically.


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

Or a monitor controller. Or maybe an out-board interface (DAC) with it's own volume pot.
  
 Perhaps they did say 'too revealing' but what they probably mean is 'we are worried you will send them back and we will have to re-sell them as B stock' because the only way you can control the overall volume is either via software app (inconvenient)  or on the back panel of the Yamahas. Separately for each channel. (even more inconvenient). There are two amplifiers in each enclosure. So you need to set the overall level before it reaches the speaker itself.
  
 Doesn't need to be expensive. Something like this Fostex PC-1e will do ~$20.
  

  
  
  

  
  
http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/products/PC-1eBW.shtml


----------



## Nova40

I think my B&W 686 (S1) may be one of the best 2.0s under $500. I highly recommend it.


----------



## oopeteroo

what is the best speaker I can get for 120 USD or less for a pair ?

is Simple Audio Listen good for 120 usd ?
http://www.corsair.com/en-us/simple-audio-listen-stereo-speakers-with-bluetooth


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

This is the thread for people who are willing and able to pay up to $500.
 It's a valuable long term resource.
  
 Please feel free to start a thread called 'Best speakers for < $100' or ask your question in a separate thread.
  
 Otherwise everything just gets messed up for everyone else.


----------



## matthewh133

How are the KRK RP5 G3s viewed in this thread? I realize they are monitors, but they are only $300 retail I believe and I loved mine.. when paired with a sub.


----------



## BigTerminator

matthewh133 said:


> How are the KRK RP5 G3s viewed in this thread? I realize they are monitors, but they are only $300 retail I believe and I loved mine.. when paired with a sub.


 
 I do not know about this thread but generally (typically in reddit) the most recommended entry level monitor is the JBL LSR305. Those will always be recommended over KRK's. At $350 Emotiva Airmotiv 5S is the next upper tier of monitor. Of course you have all the other higher end monitors that go up in price from there. I loved my M-Audio's, KRK's are probably decent speakers as well. Most studio monitors are competitively good amongst another but the JBL's took the lead.
  
 What subwoofer are you using?


----------



## matthewh133

bigterminator said:


> I do not know about this thread but generally (typically in reddit) the most recommended entry level monitor is the JBL LSR305. Those will always be recommended over KRK's. At $350 Emotiva Airmotiv 5S is the next upper tier of monitor. Of course you have all the other higher end monitors that go up in price from there. I loved my M-Audio's, KRK's are probably decent speakers as well. Most studio monitors are competitively good amongst another but the JBL's took the lead.
> 
> What subwoofer are you using?


 
  
 Before I moved country and had to sell it all I was using the KRK RP10S.


----------



## Tablix

As an owner of the RP6's I can say they are a worthy upgrade over the 5" cone, with deeper base and IMO more detailed in the mids.  I bought them as an impulse buy to work as a 2nd set along side my adam A7x, and find them warmer and more forgiving.  I have also listened to the entire JBL range and found them to be more neutral like my adam's, but the rear port puts me off as my desk is against a wall and find front ported monitors are better suited to my set-up.   
  
 I would always recommend getting the biggest driver size your desk can manage, or if budget allows add a sub.  I dont see much benefit in stretching yourself beyond $5-600 unless you really want to go all out and sink $1k+


----------



## matthewh133

tablix said:


> As an owner of the RP6's I can say they are a worthy upgrade over the 5" cone, with deeper base and IMO more detailed in the mids.  I bought them as an impulse buy to work as a 2nd set along side my adam A7x, and find them warmer and more forgiving.  I have also listened to the entire JBL range and found them to be more neutral like my adam's, but the rear port puts me off as my desk is against a wall and find front ported monitors are better suited to my set-up.
> 
> I would always recommend getting the biggest driver size your desk can manage, or if budget allows add a sub.  I dont see much benefit in stretching yourself beyond $5-600 unless you really want to go all out and sink $1k+


 
  
 I am thinking of buying the RP5s with the intention of getting the RP10s sub. Before I moved overseas I had the RP6's + RP10s, I just figured the 5s would do the same job if there was a sub involved?


----------



## BigTerminator

I know I have them, but try getting the Airmotiv 5S with Presonus T10. The Presonus T10 in the few reviews there are has been better head to head when compared to the KRK sub. The Airmoitv 5S is in Adam territory, which is beyond the entry level of the KRK's. If your in America than you can get the Presonus T10 for $265. I love my setup to death, I think you would to. The tweeters on the Emotivas are to die for. Got the monitors and sub for $600 total.


----------



## wakkaday

are bt3 acoustics any good? or ruark mr1


----------



## macabong

Have anyone mentioned Paradigm Shift A2? Just ordered mine for sub-$500/pair. Usually those beasts are out out range of $500 but price changing recently. Can't wait to test them here.


----------



## SoAmusing777

bigterminator said:


> I know I have them, but try getting the Airmotiv 5S with Presonus T10. The Presonus T10 in the few reviews there are has been better head to head when compared to the KRK sub. The Airmoitv 5S is in Adam territory, which is beyond the entry level of the KRK's. If your in America than you can get the Presonus T10 for $265. I love my setup to death, I think you would to. The tweeters on the Emotivas are to die for. Got the monitors and sub for $600 total.


 
 My monitors and sub were $484 shipped new  Cords were $23 shipped; splurged for the premium monoprice XLR's plus I needed the 1/8inch to dual 1/4inch adapter cord . That set me over budget by $7, but I didn't have any room for the monitors plus was considering getting pads for them so I just bought stands. Think those were $60 shipped together new. Besides, I went over budget on my headphones $65, so why not the speakers too? lol. Great way to spend $567 I feel.


----------



## Magihyren

are the Swan MK200MKIII still a good buy at under $400, or is there something better in that range?


----------



## tony22

From what I remember the Swans IIIs are still pretty okay, but for that kind of money you might want to consider the Emotiva Airmotiv 5S. I have the 4S and IMO it is much better than my old Swans MK200MKII.


----------



## macabong

Swan MKIII $350 ending in 4 days https://www.massdrop.com/buy/swan-m200-mkiii-speaker-system


----------



## BigTerminator

macabong said:


> Swan MKIII $350 ending in 4 days https://www.massdrop.com/buy/swan-m200-mkiii-speaker-system


 
 Why would anyone get those when you can get the Emotiva Airmotiv 5S or JBL LSR305? Emotiva has fast shipping, 30 day trial, 5 year warranty, better sound. List one thing the Swan has on it.


----------



## yay101

I recently purchased some BS22LR and a WAY overkill class D amp from ebay, the SMSL SA-98E.
  
 Apart from only being able to use 5% of the volume pot, i have no complaints. Gorgeous lush sound. The imaging on these is probably the best i have heard anywhere near this price point.


----------



## vlenbo

I own a pair of sony sscs5s.
  
 They are pretty awesome sounding for the price they are retailed at. The MSRP is at $220, which I think might be a smudge overpriced. They deserve to cost $180 in my opinion.
  

 bestbuy has them for $164, but I have seen it go as low as $150. Wait for some time and you'll be able to pay for a PAIR of sony bookshelf speakers for $150-160.


----------



## misobol

Hi All
  
 I have a problem and I hope you can help me solve it.
 I've bought Philips Fidelio X2 headphones, and I feel in love with how they sound with the music and games.
 However I can't use them too much as I get headache, I think it's mix of clamp and perhaps some particular frequency they produce.
  
 So I've decided to replace them with speakers. I'm listening to lots of EDM but all other genres too, X2 makes me dance.
 To throw into mix I play a lot of Battlefield 4 and the headphones are making me expect where enemy comes from as they
 very accurate with positional queues.
  
 Are there speakers that are similar to X2 with how they sound (fun, with nice bass extension, but not overpowering )?
 My room is about 4,5m x 3.8m big and I'm thinking that top budget be $500/£320 but less would be welcome.
  
 Thanks a million upfront


----------



## BigTerminator

You need a subwoofer. Grab some JBL LSR305's and a Presonus T10 subwoofer for $500 total. Go to Pro Audio Star and tell them you want it all for $500, they will hook you up. For an extra $100 you could get Emotiva Airmotiv 5S's and run my setup.


----------



## cel4145

misobol said:


> Hi All
> 
> I have a problem and I hope you can help me solve it.
> I've bought Philips Fidelio X2 headphones, and I feel in love with how they sound with the music and games.
> ...




Subwoofers are big drivers in big enclosures that weight a lot (expensive to ship) with a good amp. For your size room, a 10" sub is probably the minimum size.And if you want good sounding bass--rather than a budget, one note wonder sub--it won't be cheap. 

This UK Internet direct company makes excellent subwoofers, but it will take a lot of your budget to get a basic model: http://www.bkelec.com/hifi/sub_woofers.htm I'd go for their 275 watt model if you want to make sure you have enough bass to fill your room at louder volumes. 

You might also seek advice at AVForums. They are a UK based audio/video community, and they'll have more recommendations for what is available to you than you can get here.


----------



## misobol

bigterminator said:


> You need a subwoofer. Grab some JBL LSR305's and a Presonus T10 subwoofer for $500 total. Go to Pro Audio Star and tell them you want it all for $500, they will hook you up. For an extra $100 you could get Emotiva Airmotiv 5S's and run my setup.


 
 I'm surprised on the answer, two with recommendation for sub-woofer.
 I thought that X2 didn't have that much bass and that monitor speakers would easily produce that level.
  
 I do have to say that I love sub-bass and sweet rumbling ( thought not killing mids etc is important) 
 However I will be standing next to the speakers, so is their bass that weak that I will need sub?
  
 Also will having sub will require some additional equipment more then the sound card?


----------



## cel4145

misobol said:


> I do have to say that I love sub-bass and sweet rumbling ( thought not killing mids etc is important)
> However I will be standing next to the speakers, so is their bass that weak that I will need sub?




Bass nearfield (within about 3 feet or less) is definitely different from trying to fill a room with bass. Easier for a speaker (or sub) to do. 

Speakers vary in their low end bass extension. If you want good deep sub bass, a subwoofer is often the best choice, although there are certainly some speakers that play down to 40hz with decent authority. 

Be wary of overly trusting manufacturer specs of their speakers (and subs). Some are honest. Some are misleading (purposely) since there are different ways to measure and specify the speaker (and subs) frequency response.


----------



## BigTerminator

misobol said:


> I'm surprised on the answer, two with recommendation for sub-woofer.
> I thought that X2 didn't have that much bass and that monitor speakers would easily produce that level.
> 
> I do have to say that I love sub-bass and sweet rumbling ( thought not killing mids etc is important)
> ...


 
 No bookshelf speaker will reach 30hz or below comfortably especially for your budget. If you want that deep thick bass you need a subwoofer. My Emotiva's have great bass for their size, but my sub doubles my music listening experience. Without the subwoofer it just sucks. A subwoofer is almost half the battle so do not skimp out on one. 
  
 Now If you want easy integration between your mains then you need to get a studio subwoofer because they have bass management. These subs are meant for studio monitors in a studio environment. Not the best value though. If you lived in America you could get the Presonus T10 for $265. With other subs you could simply split an audio channel and use the subwoofers crossover. For $200-300 look for a really good HT sub. BIC PL200, Polk DSW, NXG BAS 500. You really do not have to spend a lot to get some decent bass especially for small rooms.


----------



## cel4145

bigterminator said:


> No bookshelf speaker will reach 30hz or below comfortably especially for your budget. If you want that deep thick bass you need a subwoofer. My Emotiva's have great bass for their size, but my sub doubles my music listening experience. Without the subwoofer it just sucks. A subwoofer is almost half the battle so do not skimp out on one.




+1

What he said 

For a speaker that should have good low 40hz range bass extension, the JBL LSR308: http://www.thomann.de/gb/jbl_lsr_308.htm. Bit over your budget, though.


----------



## misobol

cel4145 said:


> +1
> 
> What he said
> 
> ...


 
  
 I was looking at that one but 305 as I've got feeling standing next to 308 would be an overkill.
 Few that I've put down on check out list are: M-Audio bx5, Behringer NEKKST K5, KRK Rokit 5 and JBL LSR305.
 At the beginning the speakers will have to do, when budget allows I'll buy decent sub.
  
 Also, how would I connect speakers to Asus STX, should it be via left/right RCA ports?


----------



## cel4145

misobol said:


> Also, how would I connect speakers to Asus STX, should it be via left/right RCA ports?




Yes.


----------



## misobol

cel4145 said:


> Yes.


 
 Where would sub then go when purchased?


----------



## cel4145

misobol said:


> Where would sub then go when purchased?




a) you split the output from the STX and run it to both the sub and the speakers. note that you need a sub that has left and right inputs (some HT theater subs only have one LFE input) 
b) you buy a sub with line outs that pass through the audio. then wire it STX->sub->speakers


----------



## BigTerminator

cel4145 said:


> a) you split the output from the STX and run it to both the sub and the speakers. note that you need a sub that has left and right inputs (some HT theater subs only have one LFE input)
> b) you buy a sub with line outs that pass through the audio. then wire it STX->sub->speakers


 
 You can get away with splitting a channel of audio that goes to the subwoofer and use the subs crossover. My subwoofer as well as cel4145's have bass management but it is not necessary. Running the monitors full range with the sub crossedover is how I run my setup. 
  
 Also you can get a Xonar ST or Xonar STX II with an H6 add on card. That card has bass management built in. That is what I used for my cheap Yamaha sub which did not even have a crossover.


----------



## starfly

Anybody here have the Tannoy Reveal 402? What are your thoughts on those? I'll soon be in the market for a very compact set of active monitors. Ideally I want a front firing bass port, as they'll be very close to a wall.


----------



## taiz

If the M-Audio M3-6's are anything like their bigger 8" siblings, they are worth serious consideration. Loud enough for pretty much any home application, self powered, and quite nice looking as well.
  
 I got the 8s for my bedroom setup without actually realizing how big they are. They are really quite large and much louder than I need. I think I have the volume turned to 2 in the back of the speakers and use a DAC/amp to control volume, and it never goes more than 6/10 of the way. The 6s would probably have been the better choice.


----------



## starfly

taiz said:


> If the M-Audio M3-6's are anything like their bigger 8" siblings, they are worth serious consideration. Loud enough for pretty much any home application, self powered, and quite nice looking as well.
> 
> I got the 8s for my bedroom setup without actually realizing how big they are. They are really quite large and much louder than I need. I think I have the volume turned to 2 in the back of the speakers and use a DAC/amp to control volume, and it never goes more than 6/10 of the way. The 6s would probably have been the better choice.


 
  
 thanks for the suggestion, but I fear they'll be way to big for the desktop setup I'm envisioning. And also these have rear-firing bass ports, which will sound horrible given that they'll be right up against a wall (only way my setup works).


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

Prices for the Tannoy Reveal 400 series are currently tempting. They were not expensive on release and have since fallen. There may be a good reason for that. So be sure to do though research and have a listen before purchase.
  
 If small size really is vital you can find very high quality 4" speakers that go low(ish) and loud. Adam A3X, Eve SC204, Focal CMS40, Genelec 8020 etc but they tend to be more expensive than standard 5" designs.  So if you can stretch to an inch or so all round you need to be looking at JBL 305, Adam F5, Yamaha HS5, Mackie MR5, if you like house and techno KRK RP5 might be also be a good choice.
  
 I think only the Adams are front ported but I wouldn't get over obsessed about that.. Using XLR or even 1/4" jacks will mean they will be 3" or so out from the back wall. Which is generally enough.


----------



## starfly

ronalddumsfeld said:


> Prices for the Tannoy Reveal 400 series are currently tempting. They were not expensive on release and have since fallen. There may be a good reason for that. So be sure to do though research and have a listen before purchase.
> 
> If small size really is vital you can find very high quality 4" speakers that go low(ish) and loud. Adam A3X, Eve SC204, Focal CMS40, Genelec 8020 etc but they tend to be more expensive than standard 5" designs.  So if you can stretch to an inch or so all round you need to be looking at JBL 305, Adam F5, Yamaha HS5, Mackie MR5, if you like house and techno KRK RP5 might be also be a good choice.
> 
> I think only the Adams are front ported but I wouldn't get over obsessed about that.. Using XLR or even 1/4" jacks will mean they will be 3" or so out from the back wall. Which is generally enough.


 
  
 Thanks, appreciate your thoughts. I definitely plan on visiting a GuitarCenter soon and will give a few of these things a good listen.
  
 The only criticism I've read on the Reveal 402 is that sometimes they suffer from noise even when there is no
 input signal. So I'll definitely test for that.
  
 Anyone have any experience with the Alesis Elevate 5?
  
 Today my Schiit Magni 2 Uber will arrive which I'll use for driving whatever monitor I end up getting. Eventually I'll get a Modi 2 Uber as well, which should make for a nice desktop setup. I don't do any actual producing/mixing so the speakers are purely for enjoying music when I don't want to use a headphone.


----------



## raghunath

I know KRK 5" and 6" are covered, but I didn't see anything on 8". Whats your opinion on those? I have their 1st gen, and I like it so far. I got them used but in very good condition for $250. My reference point is not very good though - I generally listen to Indian Classical Music (Hindustani) and most of it is converted from vinyls and such, some of it is CD quality but no higher. I like that they are forgiving on that kind of music. You think they are overly warm?
  
 Edit: I have a Ross Martin between my laptop and these.


----------



## starfly

starfly said:


> Thanks, appreciate your thoughts. I definitely plan on visiting a GuitarCenter soon and will give a few of these things a good listen.
> 
> The only criticism I've read on the Reveal 402 is that sometimes they suffer from noise even when there is no
> input signal. So I'll definitely test for that.
> ...


 
  
 Just went to the local Guitarcenter to give a few speakers a test drive. They didn't have the Reveal 402, but they did have the 502.
  
 Anyway, I've decided to go for the JBL LSR305. The Mackie MR5 sounded pretty good to, but a bit lacking in the bass department. And the JBL's just had a serious amount of bass for such small speakers. I was really surprised. The 502 just didn't really do it for me and I didn't like the Yamaha HS5 at all. I can see how they might be good for mastering a recording, but for just pure music enjoyment they sound kinda off.
  
 Another bonus of the JBL is that you can trim the bass by 2dB (not a lot, but still something) using a switch on the back, so since they'll be fairly close to a wall it might help with reducing any boominess.


----------



## cel4145

Congrats on the speakers! A lot of people seem to find the LSR 305 a great buy at ~ $300.


----------



## starfly

cel4145 said:


> Congrats on the speakers! A lot of people seem to find the LSR 305 a great buy at ~ $300.


 
  
 Thanks. I haven't actually bought them yet, will probably do so next week. And they're a bit cheaper on Amazon at ~$130 a piece, so might just get them there instead.
  
 Will also get a couple of Mopads for them and then I should be set to go!


----------



## cel4145

OK. Also check Sweetwater right before you buy. They have put them on special a few times in the last year: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LSR305


----------



## starfly

cel4145 said:


> OK. Also check Sweetwater right before you buy. They have put them on special a few times in the last year: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LSR305


 
 I will. Thanks!


----------



## starfly

starfly said:


> I will. Thanks!


 
  
 Well, due to some goof I was able to get the JBL 305 brand new for $113 a piece! Good deal!!  Should have them next week. Also went ahead and ordered the Schiit Modi 2 Uber. Already have the Magni 2 Uber. That should make for a very nice budget friendly setup!


----------



## cel4145

That's awesome! I bet it will all sound great.


----------



## cel4145

Oh, did you get the cables you need for connecting an unbalanced source to a balanced speaker input? Pretty sure you'll need those for the 305s.


----------



## starfly

cel4145 said:


> Oh, did you get the cables you need for connecting an unbalanced source to a balanced speaker input? Pretty sure you'll need those for the 305s.


 
 Yep got a set of RCA > 1/4" TS cables. Ordered them along with the speakers.


----------



## Igor01

Is there a significant benefit in choosing Adam A5x over A3x (or going with A7x) when used with a good sub (SVS SB2000) for use as multimedia speakers with a computer?  The speakers would be fed by a Woo Audio WA7tp tube amp using its built-in DAC.  I like the way the amp extends the sound spectrum and adds dynamism to my current Klipsch ProMedia 4.1 but it's time to replace them with something better.  I already have the SVS SB2000 sub and just need to decide what powered speakers I should couple it with.  The main uses will be music (all genres), some movies and games. 
  
 Until I get some stands, the speakers would sit on my computer desk so it's pretty much in the nearfield territory, even when I will pull the chair back to watch a movie (the monitor I use is 30" 2560x1600).  Ideally, I'd want the speakers to be highly resolving, clear, as musical as possible and non-fatiguing.  Basically, looking for a non-congested, non-strained, very effortless and clean sound.  The space on the desk won't allow anything bigger than A5x although if it turns out that I get a very significant benefit by going with A7x, I won't rule out getting them and some speaker stands instead.  Budget-wise I am pretty flexible but if there's hardly any advantage of getting a larger Adam speaker pair since the sub will be doing all the heavy lifting below 80Hz then I guess it would make sense not to burn cash for no good reason.  Heck, I've even considered Event Opals but it looks like they will be a huge overkill in my computer den which is approximately 3x4 meters (9'x12').
  
 I can get brand new A5x for Cad $450 each, curiously enough the A3x are more expensive at Cad $480 each in the stores, but there's someone in my area selling a pair of used A3x for Cad $800.  The A7x are Cad $980 each.  Unfortunately, buying from the US is not a great option because of low Canadian dollar and significant shipping and duties/taxes.
  
 Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated!


----------



## cel4145

Since you have the SB-2000 (great sub!), you have the option of running amp->sub->speakers and using the 80hz high pass filter. Generally, you want speakers that are tuned to roll off a bit below 80hz so that you get a smooth crossover if using that. The Adam 5X are rated 50 Hz - 50 kHz, the 3X 60 Hz - 50 kHz. Hard to know for sure without measurements to see where the tuning point is (where it starts to roll off). I'd probably go with the 5X since they are cheaper. 

Otherwise, the primary difference between smaller and larger driver speakers will also be their ability to get loud. You've got the SB-2000, which can fill a medium sized room with bass, so I'd definitely go with the 5X over the 3X to get the extra volume in case you want to crank it up


----------



## BigTerminator

Can you get the Emotiva Airmotiv 5S in Canada? That or the Adam F5 will get you so much of the Adam A5X's sound for half the price. You will have such a bad ass setup. 
  
 As for the Adam A3X, crossing at 80hz should be fine. My worry is if the small speakers still have the same sound characteristics as the A5X minus the bass. 
  
 If you can get the Emotiva speakers for close to exchange rate of $350 then I would get them.


----------



## cel4145

bigterminator said:


> If you can get the Emotiva speakers for close to exchange rate of $350 then I would get them.




+1

The Airmotivs are good speakers


----------



## Igor01

Thanks for the suggestions, guys.  Unfortunately, there's no easy (and economical) way of getting Emotiva speakers in Canada, so I guess it's down to A3x vs A5x for me.  I am leaning towards A3x because I could get a used pair cheaper than the A5x from a store and because the smaller footprint should go better with my ginormous monitor.  I am just worried that the midrange on the A3x may not be convincing enough.  Granted, the subwoofer should perform well at keeping the sub-80Hz part of the spectrum filled out nicely, but the larger driver on A5x should in theory do a better job with mids.  If anyone has experience with both the sets, is that the case or should I just grab the A3x?


----------



## soulorc

Hi guys,
  
 I am also looking for a nice pair of active speakers. My current setup is Master 7 as dac and Master 9 (as preamp or headphone amp). My budget is around $1000, but I can go as high as $1500. I understand that this is a thread for speakers <$500, but I am sure that people here know much more about speakers than I do. Can anyone give me some recommendations?  
  
 The good speakers at this price point that I know are Adam A5X (Amazon $549); Focal CMS 50 ($595); Dynaudio BM5 MKIII ($730). But I never tried any of these. I hope some expert can give me some advice and other choices. Thank you!


----------



## yay101

Located in america?


----------



## soulorc

Yes.


----------



## cel4145

Why limit yourself to powered speakers? Get some Ascend Acoustic Sierra 1s with the NRT upgrade or Philharmonitors and add an Emotiva mini-x a-100 for power.


----------



## sailcat9

For a 24 hour period the Kanto YU2 powered desktop speakers will be on sale at WOOT for about $149.99. That is a pretty good deal on some pretty darned good speakers. Well worth a look. 
  
 If it weren't for a set of Swan M10 speakers I ordered off of Massdrop recently, I would be snagging the Kantos. Definitely.


----------



## Tablix

@soulorc in reply to your info request:
  
 You get what you pay for in monitors there are generally a few price ranges, the sub $1k market tends to be good value for money but you get what you pay for. I own  some krk rp6 g3's that I bought as an impulse buy that I am glad I made. They are not perfect for music production but they are the bedroom DJ's pocket rocket in terms of budget.  The JBL LSR305's are more neutral in "color" I find the KRK warm, but others call them bassy but IMO they are just warm not inflated response.
  
 Then you move into the $1k-3k range where you will be looking at the likes of ADAM dynaudio Focal EVE and Genelec.  These speakers will generally be 6-8" drivers putting out "pristine" sound at similar money people will pay for a TV.  I will not tell you how awesome it is to be sat a few feet from some Focal Twins, but even I wont stretch my budget that far.  I really like my ADAM a7x, having owned the a fair while now.  I feel they are the best "without a dedicated sub" option.  By choosing not to have a sub, and having the space, a  felt I could use the extra budget to get the best speaker for my money.  I spent literally a year of my life reading and researching and listening before I spent my cash.  I wanted something detailed for mixing and mastering and they are perfect for that, but is everyone going to want something like these, maybe not.  
  
 Beyond $3k is when you are paying for those diminishing returns and unless you are earning money from them probably not a good investment.  I have had the pleasure of hearing some very fine monitors to the point where my ears are probably the weakest link in the audio chain.
  
 There are lots of monitors to choose from, and its not just as simple as how much of I got and what do i buy.  You need to consider placement of your monitors and how much space you have on your desk.  Do you buy front or rear ported.  If limited space will you need a sub and whats your budget for that.
  
 You can get amazing sound on a budget if you shop with patience and research.  Good luck.


----------



## pigmode

I recently picked up a set of Yamaha NX50, but want to upgrade to JBL LSR305. this will be for a Macbook Pro/iTunes/AAC.
  
 Can I get some recommendations for a suitable and appropriately priced DAC? BTW my hearing is rolled off at the top, so I'm assuming the LSR305 would be a good choice?


----------



## cel4145

pigmode said:


> Can I get some recommendations for a suitable and appropriately priced DAC?




"Appropriate" pricing is relative to the individual. What amount were you thinking of? 



pigmode said:


> BTW my hearing is rolled off at the top, so I'm assuming the LSR305 would be a good choice?




They are fairly neutral speakers. I would assume that they would be fine for you. And definitely a step up from the NX50s. Sweetwater has a deal right now: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LSR305


----------



## Tablix

If you want a good price/performance ratio a basic audio interface will work well as you DAC, I have a couple of entry level AI's the roland quad capture and the focusirite 2i4, both suitable for your needs.  Personally I would never spend more than 20% of my total budget on the DAC, you want the majority of your budget to go on your monitors, I would make a guess that more "audiophile" dac's may be more suitable to your needs as you dont need any recording ability but there are plenty of options available for less than $250.


----------



## pigmode

^ Thanks for the advice.
  
 I just put up a classified for an Anedio D1. The neutral sound signature of the Anedio and LSR305 should work well for my situation. Updated my system in signature below.
  
 Anyone is welcome to recommend a neutral sounding DAC up to $600 used.


----------



## Halonoonan

Been reading this thread and had a question. I'm deciding between the JbL lsr305 and emotiva 5s. My question is, is there a way to control the volume besides something on the actual speaker? Would a fostex volume lot work? I want to control the volume from my couch and won't be by my speaker, computer, tv etc.


----------



## AladdinSane

Emotiva Control Freak
Schiit Sys
Fostex Pc-1e  
 among others


----------



## Halonoonan

aladdinsane said:


> Emotiva Control Freak[/UR
> Schiit Sys
> Fostex Pc-1e
> 
> ...




Awesome, thanks.
Will these work for any of the studio monitors?


----------



## mistersprinkles

I'm using Presonus Eris 4.5 studio monitors with my PC. I wouldn't say they sound fantastic but they are definitely worth the $200.


----------



## radosuaf

mistersprinkles said:


> I'm using Presonus Eris 4.5 studio monitors with my PC. I wouldn't say they sound fantastic but they are definitely worth the $200.


 
  
 How's bass with them? I am considering buying those.


----------



## mistersprinkles

The bass is entirely dependant on placement, and waiting for the 4.5's to break in.
  
 They sound good from day 1, don't get me wrong. But they do need a WHILE to break in. A long while. I must have put a good 50-60 hours on mine before they started sounding bassy and full. 
  
 The placement is everything with these. Too close to a wall? You'll get reflections from the rear bass port and whompy bass. Too close together? No stereo image. Not toed in a little? Distant bass. 
  
 I've used them on my desk as well as on speaker stands. I find that they sound best on speaker stands, moved away from the wall. They sound as good as some $250 2.0 passive speaker sets. For a $200  self amplified speaker, 
  
 that's nothing to shake a stick at.
  
 On a desk they do present more bass, quite a sufficient amount, but again, this comes after 30-50 hours. You won't like the sound the first day. You have to trust that there is a night and day difference before and after the break-in process.
  
 Once broken in they are full sounding, well rounded, and have very revealing high end.  Tracks that have a very high treble extension, particularly in vocals like "Rub Mah Boobies" (Spotify it. Hilarious) sound more revealing on these speakers than they do
  
 on my $700 KEF Q300s. That's not bad. 
  
 If you put them close to a wall, make sure to adjust the low end gain on the back of   the left speaker. If it is set too high you will get whompy bass as it reflects off the wall. I have them 7" from the wall on my desk with the low end gain at the middle position and they sound just about right.
  
 If you need to put them right up against a wall, these are not the speakers for you. I'd suggest putting them at least 5" from the back wall in my experience. I have mine on monitor isolation pads which I found really improved the sound. I also have them angled back so they point right at my ears. 
  
 All of that makes a cumulative difference.
  
 They do benefit from a proper source. I had them hooked up to a $300 USB DAC and they sounded great. I traded the DAC for a subwoofer for my main stereo and now they are running off my Realtek ALC892. They sound acceptable, but a $5 source can't hold a candle to a $300. Stands to reason.
  
 They may be for you they may not. All I can say is that if you are disappointed, for $200, your expectations are too high/unrealistic.
  
 Here they are running off the rPAC. Recorded with an iphone. Less than ideal but you get some idea...
  
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVkqeqQtdHM


----------



## radosuaf

Thanks for the VERY comprehensive answer! Unfortunately, I plan to put them quite close to the wall and also in the corner:
  

  
  
 Will I be able to use them with such placement? I plan to buy isolation pads as well. Source will be my X-Fi XtremeGamer, at least in forseeable future.


----------



## mistersprinkles

Would you be able to put foam sound dampening material behind the speakers? If you did that, odds are you would be ok. Try to keep the speakers 5 or 6" from the wall/corner regardless. 
  
 I think you can pull it off with isolation pads and sound dampening foam.


----------



## Faceman

You've got to check out the Samson MediaOne 4a's.  I got these when on sale for a crazy low price of $80 via Amazon.  They have since gone back up, but if you can find them for <$100, you have to pick them up.


----------



## BigTerminator

radosuaf said:


> How's bass with them? I am considering buying those.


 
  
 No 4.5" speaker will get you bass. My Emotiva's go much lower and I consider it puny. You will need a subwoofer regardless to get true representation of the frequency range. There are times when I want my Presonus T10 to go lower and that is a 10" sub, but that has more to do with my small room and my obsession with deep bass. Get a 5" studio monitor. If you can spend some extra get the JBL LSR305's, should not be hard to get them for $240, and $220 is doable. If that is too much than get the M-Audio BX5 D2's or Presonus Eris 5's. 
  
  


> They do benefit from a proper source. I had them hooked up to a $300 USB DAC and they sounded great. I traded the DAC for a subwoofer for my main stereo and now they are running off my Realtek ALC892. They sound acceptable, but a $5 source can't hold a candle to a $300. Stands to reason.


 
  
 I used to think that until I tried out my Gigabyte Gaming 7 Z97 Motherboard which uses the Realtek ALC1150 codec.The DAC is extremely close to my $300 DAC and my speaker system would expose those differences more so than the Presonus Eris 4.5's would alone. My $300 DAC was a little smoother and more consistent, but the onboard DAC held its own with a more in your face punchier sound that sometimes was funner to listen to.


----------



## mistersprinkles

no 4.5" speaker will give you bass? You've never listened to Totems, have you?


----------



## JML

I just got a pair of the Definitive Technology Incline active speakers for my office.  Truly excellent near field sound for a great price; the soundstage is great (they're bipolar, with an added tweeter on the rear) and the bass is surprisingly deep and fast.  I run them via USB from my laptop; but the internal DAC is not going to work with hi-res files.  The limitation on them is how far they'll be from a wall, because the rear drivers need adequate space behind them.  I've not heard anything this good from so-called "computer speakers" since my Monsoons died several years ago (the Incline reminds me very much of those flat panel bipolar speakers).
  
 These aren't going to rival something like a pair of Adam Audio active speakers (which I'm considering for my home desktop setup), but they're far smaller and cheaper.  Definitely worth auditioning.


----------



## radosuaf

bigterminator said:


> No 4.5" speaker will get you bass. My Emotiva's go much lower and I consider it puny. You will need a subwoofer regardless to get true representation of the frequency range. There are times when I want my Presonus T10 to go lower and that is a 10" sub, but that has more to do with my small room and my obsession with deep bass. Get a 5" studio monitor.


 
  
 I would consider Alesis Elevate 5, as they're 5" and front-ported, but was told that E4.5s are actually much better. Have no possibility to listen to them .


----------



## Brooko

For anyone considering purchasing a studio monitor set-up, and unable to go somewhere to compare, I found this site (http://www.sonicsense.com/resourcecenter/app/audio?load=category&key=active-monitors.html&source=result) to be invaluable.
  
 Pick your speakers to compare, and then you can listen to them compared to the actual recording, and also to another set of speakers.  Of course the whole thing is coloured by the medium you are listening through - but it still gives a relative idea of what to expect.  I was tossing up between JBL lsr305s, Rokit R5s, and Mackie MR5s.  After using the app, I chose the JBLs, and couldn't be happier.  Really good resource.


----------



## radosuaf

mistersprinkles said:


> Would you be able to put foam sound dampening material behind the speakers? If you did that, odds are you would be ok. Try to keep the speakers 5 or 6" from the wall/corner regardless.
> 
> I think you can pull it off with isolation pads and sound dampening foam.


 
  
 1. No chance for rear dampening.
 2. 5" might be difficult, but doable.


----------



## cel4145

brooko said:


> For anyone considering purchasing a studio monitor set-up, and unable to go somewhere to compare, I found this site (http://www.sonicsense.com/resourcecenter/app/audio?load=category&key=active-monitors.html&source=result) to be invaluable.
> 
> Pick your speakers to compare, and then you can listen to them compared to the actual recording, and also to another set of speakers.  Of course the whole thing is coloured by the medium you are listening through - but it still gives a relative idea of what to expect.  I was tossing up between JBL lsr305s, Rokit R5s, and Mackie MR5s.  After using the app, I chose the JBLs, and couldn't be happier.  Really good resource.




I strongly discourage most people from using that site, and most speakerphiles do as well. It's just fraught with so many potential problems that bias the evaluation, that unless one really understands all those problems, it could steer one to make a poor purchasing choice. It's not just the frequency response that will be colored by whatever speakers or headphones one listens to the tests with, but also it will give no clear indication of soundstage or imagining capability. And then transient response is likely to be off as well, and unless the equipment used to evaluate it is more resolving, then detail resolution and clarity evaluation may be impossible. Finally, there is whatever coloring that is added by Sonic Sense's recording equipment and process (if any). 

So while you may feel comfortable after doing tons of headphone evaluation with doing the mental gymnastics necessary to take meaningful, accurate information from such comparison tests by applying your own mental compensation curve, and you may have highly resolving equipment with near neutral response that only adds only a bit of coloring, many people who are drawn toward using that site will lack the audio experience necessary to discriminate from the false positives and false negatives that such comparisons yield, and they are often likely to use headphones or speakers that are highly colored in their evaluation, making it even harder for them than your equipment did for you.


----------



## starfly

If you find bass important, hands down you'll want to go for the JBL LSR305.  They produce an amazing amount of good quality bass for 5" speakers.  That's why I went for them as I will not be getting a sub in the foreseeable future.  With a bit of toe-in you get very good imaging/soundstage.


----------



## Brooko

cel4145
You'll note - if you re-read what I wrote - some key points. 
* Can't get to a place to try and compare speakers because of my isolated location
* I mentioned the possible colouration of my gear, but I see no way around this. As long as you know it is there you can compensate
* I mentioned relative comparison - ie being able to compare two speakers relative to each other on the same equipment
* The site also has the original recording so you can compare that relatively as well

It's not perfect (I did mention the flaws) but I found it brilliant to get an idea of what to expect. I bought the JBLs and couldn't be happier with my choice. 

Given my situation - what is your suggested alternative to the site?


----------



## enkidu

jml said:


> I just got a pair of the Definitive Technology Incline active speakers for my office.  Truly excellent near field sound for a great price; the soundstage is great (they're bipolar, with an added tweeter on the rear) and the bass is surprisingly deep and fast.  I run them via USB from my laptop; but the internal DAC is not going to work with hi-res files.  The limitation on them is how far they'll be from a wall, because the rear drivers need adequate space behind them.  I've not heard anything this good from so-called "computer speakers" since my Monsoons died several years ago (the Incline reminds me very much of those flat panel bipolar speakers).
> 
> These aren't going to rival something like a pair of Adam Audio active speakers (which I'm considering for my home desktop setup), but they're far smaller and cheaper.  Definitely worth auditioning.


 

 I'll second that recommendation. I've been running the DT Incline's at home for a year or so, and they are great. Great complete frequency reproduction with good tight bass. I liked them so much I just got a pair for work. DT puts reconditioned units up on eBay which are a great buy. I'm driving them off of a Schiit Magni2U at home and an old Headroom Micro amp at work.


----------



## cel4145

brooko said:


> cel4145
> You'll note - if you re-read what I wrote - some key points.
> * Can't get to a place to try and compare speakers because of my isolated location
> * I mentioned the possible colouration of my gear, but I see no way around this. As long as you know it is there you can compensate
> ...




As I pointed out, maybe you might be able to pull it off and not be biased by the coloring, but for many people, it would provide more disinformation than useful information because they wouldn't know what to ignore and how to mentally subtract the necessary compensation curve to understand how they really sound. 



brooko said:


> Given my situation - what is your suggested alternative to the site?




In home demos, subjective reviews, or anechoic measurements.


----------



## Gordhifi

I'm looking for an  pair of powered speakers to hook up to my I Basso DX90. The bx5a's sound like the ticket. Any thoughts?


----------



## cel4145

gordhifi said:


> I'm looking for an  pair of powered speakers to hook up to my I Basso DX90. The bx5a's sound like the ticket. Any thoughts?




Do you mean the BX5 D2? I might be wrong, but I think the BX5a were an older model. In fact, the BX5 D2 are getting really hard to find now. I think M-Audio might have replaced them with the BX5 Carbon.


----------



## Gordhifi

Either would be fine. But I did find a used pair of bx5a for a reasonable price. Im primarily looking for a good pair that is compatible with my dap. in connectability and sound quality.


----------



## cel4145

gordhifi said:


> Either would be fine. But I did find a used pair of bx5a for a reasonable price. Im primarily looking for a good pair that is compatible with my dap. in connectability and sound quality.




Note that the opening post in this thread is from 2010. The market has changed a bit since then, and there are many more good options than what is listed there. 

What is your budget?


----------



## Gordhifi

I did realize it is an older thread but it has been a good jumping off point.Under 500.00 but quality trumps price for me.


----------



## cel4145

gordhifi said:


> I did realize it is an older thread but it has been a good jumping off point.Under 500.00 but quality trumps price for me.




Emotiva Airmotiv 5s, JBL LSR305, and Adam F5 would be a few to look into.


----------



## Gordhifi

Thanks I'll check them out now online.


----------



## jgf29

I have the psb alpha i really enjoy them


----------



## Gordhifi

I think the
 Emotiva Airmotiv 5s are the ones for me but good luck finding them. Sold out everywhere I looked.


----------



## jgf29

2 Time I bought them on Amazon the next day they told me they were out of stockI got 25$credit but not the EmotivaBut i like the psb alpha.Enjoy the Emotiva lucky you


----------



## cel4145

gordhifi said:


> I think the
> 
> Emotiva Airmotiv 5s are the ones for me but good luck finding them. Sold out everywhere I looked.




They are an Internet direct brand, so main place to get them is Emotiva's website. You could contact Emotiva to see how long before they expect to have them back in stock.


----------



## soulorc

radosuaf said:


> Thanks for the VERY comprehensive answer! Unfortunately, I plan to put them quite close to the wall and also in the corner:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 My situation is almost exactly the same as yours. I currently set my eyes on Focal XS Book because of its compact size. People said it is a good pair of desktop speakers for music enjoyment.


----------



## radosuaf

soulorc said:


> My situation is almost exactly the same as yours. I currently set my eyes on Focal XS Book because of its compact size. People said it is a good pair of desktop speakers for music enjoyment.


 
  
 I was thinking the same (I had much smaller desk in the same place), but opted for a bigger desk to fit in something bigger, 5" preferably.


----------



## JML

enkidu said:


> I'll second that recommendation. I've been running the DT Incline's at home for a year or so, and they are great. Great complete frequency reproduction with good tight bass. I liked them so much I just got a pair for work. DT puts reconditioned units up on eBay which are a great buy. I'm driving them off of a Schiit Magni2U at home and an old Headroom Micro amp at work.


 

 I bought a second pair, too.


----------



## enkidu

jml said:


> I bought a second pair, too.


 
 Ha Ha. That's great!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm mulling pulling the trigger on a small sub for home use... Egad, this never ends, does it?


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> Ha Ha. That's great!  I'm mulling pulling the trigger on a small sub for home use... Egad, this never ends, does it?




What kind of sub are you buying?


----------



## JML

cel4145 said:


> What kind of sub are you buying?


 

 Considering the smallest Definitive Tech sub, perhaps???  $399.
  
 http://www.definitivetech.com/products/prosub-800


----------



## cel4145

Definitive Technology subs are a good bit over priced at full MSRP. This Outlaw M8 is easily as good for less money: https://www.outlawaudio.com/products/m8.html. See these two reviews:

http://www.cnet.com/news/outlaw-m8-easily-the-best-budget-subwoofer/
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-subwoofers-bass-transducers/1462383-definitive-technology-prosub-800-vs-outlaw-m8-wip.html

I know of someone else that demoed both the ProSub 800 and the M8 and returned the ProSub. 


If it has the connections you need, this HSU STF-2 is better than the M8 and the ProSub 800: http://hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html


----------



## enkidu

jml said:


> Considering the smallest Definitive Tech sub, perhaps???  $399.
> 
> http://www.definitivetech.com/products/prosub-800


 

 Good guess! I got a reconditioned one for about half the MSRP and if it really really sucks I'll eat the shipping to return it. I saw that poor review, but I also saw some others which were pretty complimentary. For full price I'd definitely be looking at the SVS SB1000 but I think 'twould be overkill.


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> Good guess! I got a reconditioned one for about half the MSRP and if it really really sucks I'll eat the shipping to return it. I saw that poor review, but I also saw some others which were pretty complimentary. For full price I'd definitely be looking at the SVS SB1000 but I think 'twould be overkill.




For half price, seems like you got a good deal


----------



## el-jorge

These suggestions are al voor a pc right?
  
 How do you connect these active speakers to your computer. Let's say I would buy 2 JBL LSR 305. How do I connect those to my Auzentech prelude audiocard?


----------



## radosuaf

You'd have to start with buying a soudcard or DAC with balanced output.


----------



## Koss02

I highly suggest the Def. Tech Incline speakers. They have their quirks, but the audio quality for a 2.0 speaker is amazing.


----------



## Tablix

@the above poster... compared to what?  They are $400 and and I cant even find details of their frequency response on their website.  Heck they dont even have EMI shielding after reading this in a review "Most modern speakers are well-shielded from cell phone interference, but our review unit had interference problems when a phone placed nearby received text messages. This is a bizarre operational issue that is rarely seen for speakers in this price range." Honestly this speaker offers nothing for the money being asked.  For the same money you could buy 2xJBL 305 and still have $100 for a dedicated dac/interface.  The enclosures are plastic.  Add to that the internal DAC that will most likely flavour the sound I see no reason to choose these over something like the JBL's or some audioengines....


----------



## Koss02

tablix said:


> @the above poster... compared to what?  They are $400 and and I cant even find details of their frequency response on their website.  Heck they dont even have EMI shielding after reading this in a review "Most modern speakers are well-shielded from cell phone interference, but our review unit had interference problems when a phone placed nearby received text messages. This is a bizarre operational issue that is rarely seen for speakers in this price range." Honestly this speaker offers nothing for the money being asked.  For the same money you could buy 2xJBL 305 and still have $100 for a dedicated dac/interface.  The enclosures are plastic.  Add to that the internal DAC that will most likely flavour the sound I see no reason to choose these over something like the JBL's or some audioengines....




Woah nelly, chill out. 

First and foremost, they're the best 2.0 speaker system out there. 

Secondly, don't get frustrated because your Googling abilities are inept. I'd also like to add that I keep my cell phone right next to my speakers and never notice any interference. They're also close to my monitors, and I don't get any interference. 

I'd also like to kindly inform you that these speakers can be had for less than $240 on Amazon.

As for the frequency response...I'll let you try to figure that one out, Sherlock. 

In summary, if you're looking for an amazing 2.0 speaker system, one that has a built in DAC, and can reproduce low frequencies...buy the Definitive Technology Incline speakers.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> Woah nelly, chill out.
> 
> First and foremost, they're the best 2.0 speaker system out there.




While I don't doubt that they might sound good to you, have you compared them to other speakers? That's a pretty strong claim. For example, Innerfidelity said the Polk Hampden was better: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/desktop-usb-speaker-roundup-polk-hampden-and-summary. Not doubting you might feel they are the best compared to what you heard--after all, speaker choice is a bit subjective--but it would help to know what you are comparing them to. 



koss02 said:


> I'd also like to kindly inform you that these speakers can be had for less than $240 on Amazon.




That's good. Like most brick and mortar store home audio speaker companies, Def Tech's speakers are usually a good bit overpriced at full MSRP, IMO. Generally very good products. But overpriced. 



koss02 said:


> As for the frequency response...I'll let you try to figure that one out, Sherlock.




It's a reasonable request. Def Tech is known for playing fast and loose with speaker frequency responses. They'll list a low end sometimes with a frequency response range that is not usable, based on independent measurements. The fact that they don't provide a frequency response range on their web page is certainly reason to question how low they go. John Grandberg at Innerfidelity said that they seemed linear down into the 60hz range.


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> While I don't doubt that they might sound good to you, have you compared them to other speakers? That's a pretty strong claim. For example, Innerfidelity said the Polk Hampden was better: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/desktop-usb-speaker-roundup-polk-hampden-and-summary. Not doubting you might feel they are the best compared to what you heard--after all, speaker choice is a bit subjective--but it would help to know what you are comparing them to.
> That's good. Like most brick and mortar store home audio speaker companies, Def Tech's speakers are usually a good bit overpriced at full MSRP, IMO. Generally very good products. But overpriced.
> It's a reasonable request. Def Tech is known for playing fast and loose with speaker frequency responses. They'll list a low end sometimes with a frequency response range that is not usable, based on independent measurements. The fact that they don't provide a frequency response range on their web page is certainly reason to question how low they go. John Grandberg at Innerfidelity said that they seemed linear down into the 60hz range.




I've compared the Incline system to the Klipsch Pro Media, Polk Hampden, and Logitech Z623 systems, in addition to several Bose desktop speakers and my pair of Klipsch bookshelf speakers. 

While each speaker offers certain advantages over the other, the most complete, sound; highs, mids, and lows, was had with the Incline system. Keep in mind, you're listening to these sitting at your desk or a few feet from your workspace. 

The Incline speakers have a built in DAC, they have dedicated amps in each speaker, and have a wider frequency response that just about every 2.0 speaker on the market ...especially the AudioEngines. They even compete with 2.1 systems in terms of bass. 

The Polks have a few more bells and whistles (Bluetooth, etc...) however the Inclines reign supreme when it comes to audio quality.

All of this leads me to declare that these are, in my opinion (obviously), the best 2.0 speakers available on the market. 

ps - you can also alter the bass response via the driver that installs when you plug the Inclines into your PC.


----------



## enkidu

tablix said:


> @the above poster... compared to what?  They are $400 and and I cant even find details of their frequency response on their website.  Heck they dont even have EMI shielding after reading this in a review "Most modern speakers are well-shielded from cell phone interference, but our review unit had interference problems when a phone placed nearby received text messages. This is a bizarre operational issue that is rarely seen for speakers in this price range." Honestly this speaker offers nothing for the money being asked.  For the same money you could buy 2xJBL 305 and still have $100 for a dedicated dac/interface.  The enclosures are plastic.  Add to that the internal DAC that will most likely flavour the sound I see no reason to choose these over something like the JBL's or some audioengines....


 
 Have you heard them? Honestly, without listening to them I don't see how you can pass any sort of judgment. MSRP is $400, but the Inclines can be found for about what the JBL LSR305 go for, less even. I got mine (albeit refurbished) for under $200. The Inclines take up exactly 5" x 4" each of desktop space in comparison to the 7.28" x 9.88" for the 305's (40 sq in for Inclines vs 150+ for the 305's). They are definitely much smaller than JBL or AudioEngine offerings. And because they're already angled, you don't need to get additional bases to get proper position for on-desk listening.
  
 WRT to EMI, I haven't had any interference ever from my Inclines and other than that one review, I have yet to read of any complaints of EMI. I just put my phone right next to the right speaker for this morning to see if I could get some EMI, but haven't been able to create any, either with LTE on or off.
  
 As for being "plastic", well, MDF/HDF is particle board; so what? The specs describe it as "polystone" which I'm not familiar with, but definitely isn't a milk carton or something. In the smaller sizes, composites can offer much better price to performance ratios than the standard MDF/HDF speaker assembly.
  
 Of course, if you don't mind giving up a whole square foot or more of deskspace to your speakers there are plenty of options out there. I think that the small footprint, very good sonic range, built in quad amp'ing, and DAC make the Inclines a great choice for people looking for a sweet spot of price, size, and sound.


----------



## Tablix

You CANNOT get a good sonic range with a 4" driver, I dont need to listen to them to know that.  I currently have some KRK RP6 g3's and a set of ADAM a7x sat on my desk..... I stand by my comments.  The website doesnt even show the frequency range.
  
 Have you compared them to other monitors in a similar price range?  I have worked with countless monitors from low end Mackies up to ADAM's S range and Focal twins. 
  
 In this price range you should be able to get a pair of active monitors with a 5" driver that will out-perform these.  If you need a small footprint speaker then you are going to need a sub too or you wont be getting the full audible range.
  
 As for polystone it is "polyurethane resin mixed with powdered stone additives to give a stone-like finish"  ie plastic.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> I've compared the Incline system to the Klipsch Pro Media, Polk Hampden, and Logitech Z623 systems, in addition to several Bose desktop speakers and my pair of Klipsch bookshelf speakers.




Basically, the only decent desktop speakers you have compared them to are the Polk Hampden. Many people find that Klipsch bookshelf speakers (if the reference series) are not good for nearfield use because they can easily be fatiguing, so not a good comparison. Bose desktop speakers are meh, with popularity due to their branding/marketing (of course some people might prefer them). And the Logitech and Klipsch Pro Media are not even close the same class as many of the speakers discussed in this thread. 

Now, one again, I'm not saying that the Inclines aren't decent. Just pointing out that there are many very good speakers in this under <$500 range discussed in this thread, and it appears you have very little experience with ones that would be considered contenders. Better just to say that they are the best you have heard. Not "the best available on the market." 



koss02 said:


> The Incline speakers have a built in DAC, they have dedicated amps in each speaker, and have a wider frequency response that just about every 2.0 speaker on the market ...especially the AudioEngines. They even compete with 2.1 systems in terms of bass.




What is that "wider frequency response?" What are you basing that opinion on?


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> The Inclines take up exactly 5" x 4" each of desktop space in comparison to the 7.28" x 9.88" for the 305's (40 sq in for Inclines vs 150+ for the 305's). They are definitely much smaller than JBL or AudioEngine offerings. And because they're already angled, you don't need to get additional bases to get proper position for on-desk listening.




That's nice that they are angled, although I'm sure it's a one size fits all solution. Might not be the optimal angle for everyone. 

One thing to note is that because they are the bipolar design, they will be more finicky on placement than the other speakers regularly discussed in this thread because of the way that the rear driver interacts with boundaries behind the speaker. It's the same issue with Def Tech's bipolar towers (among other issues with those). In other words, probably sound great if properly setup, and not if poorly placed.


----------



## enkidu

tablix said:


> You CANNOT get a good sonic range with a 4" driver, I dont need to listen to them to know that.  I currently have some KRK RP6 g3's and a set of ADAM a7x sat on my desk..... I stand by my comments.  The website doesnt even show the frequency range.
> 
> Have you compared them to other monitors in a similar price range?  I have worked with countless monitors from low end Mackies up to ADAM's S range and Focal twins.
> 
> ...


 

 Very nice speakers both. But much much bigger than the Inclines in size and budget. Feel free to stand by your comments; stand on them, sit on them, put them on your head, whatever position you desire. And it's nice that you've worked with countless monitors of all types. I'd love to hear your impressions of them. However, you haven't heard the Inclines so your words about them don't carry much weight, do they?
  
 I'm far from a professional audio engineer, but I have compared them to the what Best Buy, Frys, Apple Store etc have on display. Sound quality is among the best that I've heard, but the environments are admittedly far from ideal. And yes, all things being equal, larger, bi-amped drivers will out-perform these. Like your ADAM A7X's. BTW, you did know that the A7X's weren't shielded, right?
  
 Yeah, plastic. And HDF is sawdust mixed with glue. Saying "plastic" or "polyurethane resin" doesn't say anything with regard to material properties. PU has an incredibly wide range of formulations and are used in areas requiring extremely high rigidity and strength. Areas where HDF would completely disintegrate.


----------



## Tablix

For info the krk RP5's are exactly within the same budget range and the ADAM's are certainly shielded, so maybe do your research.  I own the 6" KRK's which are a little beyond the $500 budget but we were talking about, compared to over-priced multimedia speakers.  
  
 Wood absorbs sound (to a degree), and in turn reduces reflection which would distort what you are listening to.  You think companies like Focal, Genelec, KRK and Dynaudio dont understand how cabinet materials affect sound reflections?


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> Basically, the only decent desktop speakers you have compared them to are the Polk Hampden. Many people find that Klipsch bookshelf speakers (if the reference series) are not good for nearfield use because they can easily be fatiguing, so not a good comparison. Bose desktop speakers are meh, with popularity due to their branding/marketing (of course some people might prefer them). And the Logitech and Klipsch Pro Media are not even close the same class as many of the speakers discussed in this thread.
> 
> Now, one again, I'm not saying that the Inclines aren't decent. Just pointing out that there are many very good speakers in this under <$500 range discussed in this thread, and it appears you have very little experience with ones that would be considered contenders. Better just to say that they are the best you have heard. Not "the best available on the market."
> What is that "wider frequency response?" What are you basing that opinion on?


 
  
 My opinion's based on my personal listening experience.
  
 It's also based on the build of the speaker.  Each speaker contains the following:
  

one 4" bass/midrange driver
one 4" pressure-coupled bass radiator
one 3/4" silk dome tweeter
one 2" rear-facing full-range driver
  

 In addition, each speaker is bi-amped + audio is driven through a built in DAC.

  

 These speakers (the Inclines) are by far the best 2.0 system I've ever listened to.  I wouldn't hesitate to call them the best 2.0 speaker system on the market either.


----------



## Koss02

tablix said:


> For info the krk RP5's are exactly within the same budget range and the ADAM's are certainly shielded, so maybe do your research.  I own the 6" KRK's which are a little beyond the $500 budget but we were talking about, compared to over-priced multimedia speakers.
> 
> Wood absorbs sound (to a degree), and in turn reduces reflection which would distort what you are listening to.  You think companies like Focal, Genelec, KRK and Dynaudio dont understand how cabinet materials affect sound reflections?


 
  
 You're talking about a completely different type of speaker.
  
 I'm not the kind of person who wants an overpriced box that takes up most of my desk space in front of me.  Not to mention, most of the speakers you mention require a separate DAC, amp, and a separate sub woofer to even compete with the Def. Tech Incline speakers.  
  
 As someone who sold home audio (B&W, Klipsch, Marantz, etc ... ) I realize that certain speakers outperform others.  
  
 That being said, we're talking about computer speakers, not the big bulky bookshelf speakers you're referencing.
  
 FYI, KRK is overrated, especially the set you referenced above....unless you're a DJ and need to pump hot electro music from your rig while mixing.


----------



## sia rezaei

tablix said:


> For info the krk RP5's are exactly within the same budget range and the ADAM's are certainly shielded, so maybe do your research.  I own the 6" KRK's which are a little beyond the $500 budget but we were talking about, compared to over-priced multimedia speakers.
> 
> Wood absorbs sound (to a degree), and in turn reduces reflection which would distort what you are listening to.  You think companies like Focal, Genelec, KRK and Dynaudio dont understand how cabinet materials affect sound reflections?


 
 MDF is the ideal material for speaker cabinets, but if designed properly, plastic enclosures can work just as well. Recently one of the engineers at Edifier gave me a demo of their Exclaim speakers and they sound very good considering their price. He told me their solution to manage enclosure resonances was to use 2 layers of plastic and inject a gel-like substance in between.
  
 I actually had a chance to listen and measure the KRK Rokit 6. They are very good speakers all around, and have very clean bass. However, the one I measured had a peak in THD right in the midrange between 1Khz and 3Khz. I suspect the crossover point is too low and is stressing out the tweeter. I want to attach the THD plot, the website doesn't let me.


----------



## Tablix

What is a computer speaker? a speaker connected to a computer.  An active monitor is exactly what you are both talking about so we are talking about EXACTLY the same thing except your "best in market" speaker has a DAC built in, funnily enough a soundcard (in every PC whether onboard or not) contains.
  
 You lack of understanding astounds me, considering you apparently sold similar equipment.
  
 Please explain how they are a different type of speaker?
  
 BTW my krk RP6's dont "need" a dedicated sub, but would perhaps benefit from one if you a basshead, maybe look up the frequency range.
  
 for the post above, the reason they use the resin is as a dampener, which with MDF is included in terms of the glue of the wood cabinet.


----------



## JML

For near-field use, the Inclines sound better than the AudioEngines I've listened to (both sizes, active and passive).  They sound better than the B&W MM-1 I tried, too.  They fit on my desk easily, image beautifully, and the bass is less finicky than the MM-1.  The MM-1 is $500, and the Incline from Amazon is only $229, which is a killer price for what you get.  The Inclines' weight feels like twice that of the MM-1, by the way. These are solid, hefty, real speakers, not plastic toys.
  
 Would I like the Adam A5x or A7x, running balanced from my Oppo HA-1?  Sure; that would be better for hi-res playback and the highs would be more prominent.  I do love the Adams, but it is impossible to seriously audition them in a dealership, because they're carried in the USA only by places that cater to musicians and not audiophiles.  But I don't have the room for them on my desk, they'd be overpowering in the room I need them for, wall mounts would add more cost, they're much more expensive than the Inclines, and I'd rather put those funds towards something else (like the really big Adams for home and not studio use).  I can get a sub for the Inclines without breaking the bank, and I'd really like to hear how much better they can be once the drivers are freed from the need to go so far down.


----------



## enkidu

tablix said:


> For info the krk RP5's are exactly within the same budget range and the ADAM's are certainly shielded, so maybe do your research.  I own the 6" KRK's which are a little beyond the $500 budget but we were talking about, compared to over-priced multimedia speakers.
> 
> Wood absorbs sound (to a degree), and in turn reduces reflection which would distort what you are listening to.  You think companies like Focal, Genelec, KRK and Dynaudio dont understand how cabinet materials affect sound reflections?


 

 Thanks! I just did: Adam A7x Page: http://www.adam-audio.com/en/pro-audio/products/a7x/description (wrong link: http://www.adam-audio.com/en/pro-audio/products/a7x/technical-data is the page with the exact table).
  

*General data* Frequency response42 Hz - 50 kHzTHD 90dB/1m > 100 Hz≤0.5 %Max SPL with sine wave acoustic 100Hz to 3kHz at 1m≥106 dBMax SPL per pair at 1m≥114 dBCrossover frequencies2500 HzInput impedance30 KOhmWeight20.3 lb (9,2 kg)*Magnetically shielded**No*Height x Width x Depth13.5" (337 mm) x 8" (201 mm) x 11" (280 mm)Warranty5 Years
  
  
 And yes, I'm sure they understand cabinet materials. I think that Definitive Tech knows what's up also. A7x and KRK's are large. The Incline is small. HDF makes sense for large assembled speaker cabinets. Poly composites+metals make sense for smaller speakers.


----------



## Koss02

tablix said:


> What is a computer speaker? a speaker connected to a computer.  An active monitor is exactly what you are both talking about so we are talking about EXACTLY the same thing except your "best in market" speaker has a DAC built in, funnily enough a soundcard (in every PC whether onboard or not) contains.
> 
> You lack of understanding astounds me, considering you apparently sold similar equipment.
> 
> ...


 
 You come into a conversation comparing Def. Tech Incline speakers (which you haven't listened to) to similar 2.0 computer speaker setups and start claiming "my KRK studio monitor's would blow these out of the water".  It was standoffish.  
  
 I don't jump into a thread discussing studio monitors to inform people that "my B&W CM9's are going to blow your setup out of the water".
  
 Furthermore, you are missing the point here; Definitive Technology Incline speakers do not require a separate amp, a separate DAC, a separate sub, or separate speaker stands.  
  
*For $229 you are getting the most complete 2.0 computer speaker available.  *
  
 I'm sure your KRK's are great speakers; however they are studio monitors and I doubt they can compete with the Def. Tech Inclines in terms of clarity or value.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> My opinion's based on my personal listening experience.
> 
> It's also based on the build of the speaker.  Each speaker contains the following:
> 
> ...




None of those things in of themselves make them the best 2.0 speaker on the market. For instance, those specs prove nothing about the quality of the drivers or their implementation with the enclosure design, which are probably the most important factor in speaker design. 

None of it is proof of "wide frequency response." 

And as you have already proven, your "personal listening experience" is pretty limited. 

So great. You like them. I'm sure they are pretty decent. But that's different from making some of the claims you have made. I think I'll take the word of Innerfidelity that the Polk Hampden's are better.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> You come into a conversation comparing Def. Tech Incline speakers (which you haven't listened to) to similar 2.0 computer speaker setups and start claiming "my KRK studio monitor's would blow these out of the water".
> 
> ....
> 
> I'm sure your KRK's are great speakers; however they are studio monitors and I doubt they can compete with the Def. Tech Inclines in terms of clarity or value.




Ummm....you haven't indicated that you have listened to the KRKs. Plus, you have claimed the Def Techs are the "2.0 speaker system on the market" even though you have limited experience, as I have been trying to point out to you. 

Once again, it wouldn't surprise me if they are very good speakers. But "best ever" type hyped claims are immediately a turn off to me when I read a consumer testimonial. Now a professional reviewer with experience with a significant part of the market, that's a bit different.


----------



## enkidu

cel4145 said:


> So great. You like them. I'm sure they are pretty decent. But that's different from making some of the claims you have made. I think I'll take the word of Innerfidelity that the Polk Hampden's are better.


 
 Although the review prefers the Polks, he makes it pretty clear that the quality is high for both, but he prefers the sound of the Polks in exchange for giving up the larger soundstage of the Inclines. Or at least that's how I read it:
  


> The Definitive Technology Incline is a very competent desktop speaker system. You could certainly do a lot worse - I'd chose the Inclines over the older but still competent B&W MM-1, to pick just one example. The nature of their bipolar design necessitates ample room to the rear which precludes them from working well in certain situations. But if you've got the space to accommodate them, and if having a very large soundstage tops your list of sonic priorities, I'd definitely consider giving the Inclines a shot. If you can snag them at a discount then all the better - it's looking like the official price may have recently dropped down to $249.
> 
> Last but not least, the Polk Hampden is a quite simply a killer desktop solution. It beats the Definitive Inclines in multiple (but not all) key areas and for my tastes looks better doing it. Ample space is once again the name of the game, but if you can make it work I highly suggest giving the Hampden a try. As a relatively affordable all-in-one DAC/active speaker solution they are without peer, and have single-handedly revived my faith in the affordable side of the Polk brand. While not matching the Adam Audio offering in sheer sonic prowess I find the Hampden good enough in its own way to merit a spot on the Wall of Fame.
> 
> Read more at http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/desktop-usb-speaker-roundup-polk-hampden-and-summary#BXu2CswG3K84zE6z.99M


 
  
 Personally, I like the looks of the Inclines better.


----------



## jay628

Anyone recommends Fostex PM0.4D?
 or any monitors about that size?


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> None of those things in of themselves make them the best 2.0 speaker on the market. For instance, those specs prove nothing about the quality of the drivers or their implementation with the enclosure design, which are probably the most important factor in speaker design.
> 
> None of it is proof of "wide frequency response."
> 
> ...


 
  
 Actually the specs and build indicate these speakers can produce a wider frequency range than most other 2.0 speakers.
  
 Even your speaker guru at Innerfidelity states: "if having a very large soundstage tops your list of sonic priorities, I'd definitely consider giving the Inclines a shot." 
  
 With that said, saying *the Inclines are the best 2.0 speakers on the market* isn't a far out claim.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> Actually the specs and build indicate these speakers can produce a wider frequency range than most other 2.0 speakers.




What specs? You haven't shown any specs for frequency response. What? Is it the passive bass radiator you are all excited about as some kind of proof? Just because something has a passive radiator doesn't mean it has deep bass extension. My TDK A33 bluetooth speaker has a passive bass radiator, and I doubt it has any usable output below 100hz.


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> What specs? You haven't shown any specs for frequency response. What? Is it the passive bass radiator you are all excited about as some kind of proof? Just because something has a passive radiator doesn't mean it has deep bass extension. My TDK A33 bluetooth speaker has a passive bass radiator, and *I doubt it has any usable output below 100hz.*


 
  
 I think you're confusing yourself.  
  
 First, you're incapable of doing your own research on a product.
  
 Secondly, you contort your own views to support sub-par KRK monitors you own.
  
 On top of all of that, you argue endlessly that a computer speaker you don't own, is incapable of reproducing a wide frequency response.
  
It's like arguing with a child who continues to ask "why?".
  
 To supplement your apparent lack of knowledge on this speaker, and speakers in general I have linked reviews that not only discuss the low frequency range the Inclines can produce, but also provide the specs from Definitive.  
  
 Innerfidelity:  "It sounded very linear into the mid 60Hz range, and even had *usable output at 45Hz.*
 Read more at http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/desktop-usb-speaker-roundup-definitive-technology-incline#5vJ5JyhRvBzuqr1E.99"
  
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/desktop-usb-speaker-roundup-definitive-technology-incline#zEQmdJpEMDXtdl8X.97
  
 AudioHolics:  "_Because I found the bass response to be surprisingly good, I ran the Inclines through my Revel LFO Test CD, which has a series of low frequency patterns. *I was shocked when I got the speakers to give me a (faint) response all the way down to 38Hz*.  If I listened very, very carefully and put my ear close to the speaker, I even got an oh-so-faint response at 36Hz."_
  
_"The Incline’s official frequency response measurements from Definitive came in at: _*30Hz – 20KHz, 45Hz - 18kHz +/– 5dB in full range (no subwoofer) mode."*
  
 http://www.audioholics.com/computer-speaker-reviews/definitive-technology-incline-desktop-speakers-review/conclusion
  
  
  
  I truly wish you the best, and hope you are capable of doing some of your own research on the next pair of speakers you buy.  
  

 ps - you should trade your KRKs in for some Inclines.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> I think you're confusing yourself.
> 
> First, you're incapable of doing your own research on a product.
> 
> ...




You are confused. You can't seem to remember who you are talking to or what people have said. I don't own any KRKs. I didn't claim that the speakers didn't have a wide frequency response. I've just been asking you to support YOUR claim that



koss02 said:


> .
> The Incline speakers have a built in DAC, they have dedicated amps in each speaker, and *have a wider frequency response that just about every 2.0 speaker on the market* ...especially the AudioEngines. They even compete with 2.1 systems in terms of bass.




At first I asked because I was curious. DT has no specs on their website, and I thought you might know something since you are making such grandiose claims. However, you have been unable to support that claim. 



koss02 said:


> To supplement your apparent lack of knowledge on this speaker, and speakers in general I have linked reviews that not only discuss the low frequency range the Inclines can produce, but also provide the specs from Definitive.
> 
> Innerfidelity:  "It sounded very linear into the mid 60Hz range, and even had *usable output at 45Hz.*.




You seem to have also forgotten I already referenced that review in our discussion: 



cel4145 said:


> John Grandberg at Innerfidelity said that they seemed linear down into the 60hz range.



(Incidentally,this suggests that the DT Inclines won't measure any better in low end extension than the JBL LS305s)

Perhaps you might want to review the thread so you can remember what you said, what others said, and who said what. :rolleyes:


----------



## Tablix

Confusing Cel with me, the guy that has worked with almost every sub $2k studio monitor on the market, but hey I dont know anything because I have never listened to the speaker you are recommending.  I am sure they sound ok, but I dont trust anything with an in built DAC or without using my own ears. 
  
 Best in market is a WILD claim unless you have used everything available, and there are literally dozens of speakers in this price range.
  
 For jay628, the Fostex PM's really do need a sub if you like rumbling bass but the mids are pretty accurate.  Not highly recommended in home recording circles but I cant explain why, people recording tend to lean more in favor of brands like ADAM Focal or Genelec, but they are in a different price bracket.  This review may be of use, and was written shortly after the Fostex range were released IIRC http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb11/articles/fostex-pm04n.htm


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> You are confused. You can't seem to remember who you are talking to or what people have said. I don't own any KRKs. I didn't claim that the speakers didn't have a wide frequency response. I've just been asking you to support YOUR claim that
> At first I asked because I was curious. DT has no specs on their website, and I thought you might know something since you are making such grandiose claims. However, you have been unable to support that claim.
> You seem to have also forgotten I already referenced that review in our discussion:
> (Incidentally,this suggests that the DT Inclines won't measure any better in low end extension than the JBL LS305s)
> ...




At this point, you're trolling. 

In the post above you were whining that you can't believe that the Def. Tech produce a frequency response below 100hz. Since you're incapable of doing your own research, you call people out for "lack of evidence" to support their own thoughts on a piece of audio equipment. 

Once "evidence" is produced that these speakers produce a great bass response, well below 100hz, you deflect the topic to focus on other speakers....its asinine.

Not to stray too far off topic; if you want the best 2.0 computer speakers you can buy, spend $229 ($400 MSRP) and get the Definitive Technology Incline speakers.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> At this point, you're trolling.
> 
> In the post above you were whining that you can't believe that the Def. Tech produce a frequency response below 100hz.




I obviously didn't say that either. Reading comprehension problems? Or are you intentionally making strawman arguments? 



koss02 said:


> Not to stray too far off topic; if you want the best 2.0 computer speakers you can buy, spend $229 ($400 MSRP) and get the Definitive Technology Incline speakers.




Clicking your heels together and simply repeating this over and over does not make it true in other people's minds.


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> What specs? You haven't shown any specs for frequency response. What? Is it the passive bass radiator you are all excited about as some kind of proof? Just because something has a passive radiator doesn't mean it has deep bass extension. My TDK A33 bluetooth speaker has a passive bass radiator, and *I doubt it has any usable output below 100hz*.




When I provided direct quotes from reviewers stating the speakers can achieve a usable output well below 100hz, you claim to have already read and referenced them. 

Which begs the question; did you miss the part of the review discussing the bass response? Or are you just unable to comprehend what you see written? Maybe you're just trolling? 

Take a walk, Toto


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> cel4145 said:
> 
> 
> > What specs? You haven't shown any specs for frequency response. What? Is it the passive bass radiator you are all excited about as some kind of proof? Just because something has a passive radiator doesn't mean it has deep bass extension. My TDK A33 bluetooth speaker has a passive bass radiator, and* I doubt it has any usable output below 100hz.*
> ...




So I was right. Reading comprehension problem


----------



## Tablix

CEL dont worry he completely skipped my reply where I pointed out he was arguing with the wrong poster, and then backed up my claims by explaining I have worked with literally dozens of different monitors.  
 This is your typical "defend my purchase" kind of arguing, as he is quoting reviews from online sites that you cannot guarantee have not been paid reviews.  I never trust any review, even from long established sites such as computer audiophile or sound on sound as you have no idea if the reviewer is getting kickbacks or the site is getting sponsorship or has advertising deals.  Also some of the comments made in the reviews are almost amusing, the reviewer can hear frequencies even the manufacturer doesn't claim. 
 On top of that I never tell people what to buy, just what to try, and what sort of thing to consider when shopping, so maybe I am biased


----------



## Koss02

cel4145 said:


> So I was right. Reading comprehension problem




You drew a parallel between the bass radiator your bluetooth speaker has and the one listed on the Def. Tech lnclines. Then claimed the existence of one doesn't result in frequency reproduction below 100hz, implying the existence of a bass radiator on the Inclines does not result in reproduction below 100hz. (Can you follow your own logic?) 

I provided evidence that the Inclines do produce frequencies well below 100hz and happen to have a bass radiator. 

As I said before, it's like having a discussion with a child


----------



## Koss02

tablix said:


> CEL dont worry he completely skipped my reply where I pointed out he was arguing with the wrong poster, and then backed up my claims by explaining I have worked with literally dozens of different monitors.
> This is your typical "defend my purchase" kind of arguing, as he is quoting reviews from online sites that you cannot guarantee have not been paid reviews.  I never trust any review, even from long established sites such as computer audiophile or sound on sound as you have no idea if the reviewer is getting kickbacks or the site is getting sponsorship or has advertising deals.  Also some of the comments made in the reviews are almost amusing, the reviewer can hear frequencies even the manufacturer doesn't claim.
> On top of that I never tell people what to buy, just what to try, and what sort of thing to consider when shopping, so maybe I am biased




Please don't mischaracterize my opinion that the Inclines are the best 2.0 speakers on the market with "defending my purchase". 

As I stated before, the Inclines are the best 2.0 speakers on the market. This thread asked for recommendations, I provided mine


----------



## cel4145

tablix said:


> CEL dont worry he completely skipped my reply where I pointed out he was arguing with the wrong poster, and then backed up my claims by explaining I have worked with literally dozens of different monitors.
> This is your typical "defend my purchase" kind of arguing, as he is quoting reviews from online sites that you cannot guarantee have not been paid reviews.  I never trust any review, even from long established sites such as computer audiophile or sound on sound as you have no idea if the reviewer is getting kickbacks or the site is getting sponsorship or has advertising deals.  Also some of the comments made in the reviews are almost amusing, the reviewer can hear frequencies even the manufacturer doesn't claim.




Yep. Some people are here just to hype, and are not interested in actually discussing and trying to figure out what some of the best speakers are. As I said repeatedly, I don't doubt that the DT Inclines probably sound very good. But the "best on the market" type rhetoric is typically used to feel good about one's purchase. Not to mention that it completely ignores individual subjective tastes. I have no doubt we could take what are generally considered the top speakers in this $500 class, put 100 people in a room testing them, and we'd have trouble getting a clear winner from a very large majority. 

Plus, when talking about the DT Inclines, it's notable that all the Incline fans in this thread completely ignored my point that those speakers are going to be rather finicky about placement and setup because of the bipolar design. For many setups, a direct radiating nearfield monitor will work much better. Any recommendation of the Inclines should caution people on that, just like recommendations of the DT bi-polar floorstanding speaker series. 



tablix said:


> On top of that I never tell people what to buy, just what to try, and what sort of thing to consider when shopping, so maybe I am biased




I respect that opinion. I don't personally think it's a problem if people say that they liked something the best or that a speaker is popularly reviewed and would be a good buy. But insistence on "best on the market?" That's just naive. 

BTW: Prior to hearing the JBL LSR305s, the KRK Rokit 6 were my favorite studio monitor that one can buy and hear locally. I think it's good to recommend the Rokit series because they are often easy to demo at Guitar Centers here in the US.


----------



## cel4145

koss02 said:


> You drew a parallel between the bass radiator your bluetooth speaker has and the one listed on the Def. Tech lnclines. Then claimed the existence of one doesn't result in frequency reproduction below 100hz, implying the existence of a bass radiator on the Inclines does not result in reproduction below 100hz. (Can you follow your own logic?)




Straw man argument. That's no implication that the DTs can't reproduce below 100hz; just that the presence of a passive radiator doesn't guarantee very low bass extension. 

This is tiring. Welcome to my ignore list


----------



## Tablix

The KRK's have their downside also, as they are not really suitable for mixing/mastering as they are pretty warm and can result in thin and bass-light recordings when transferring to more Hi-Fi speakers.  I use them as a comparison when working on my ADAM's, and tbh I prefer them for casual listening as they dont give any fatigue even with 5+hours of listening.
  
 I respect you have an opinion Koss, but you also need to consider you are forming your opinion from a narrow field, considering you mention only 2 or 3 other speakers.   Best in market means they surpass everything else, on every level.... thats just not the case.  If you had said "best I have heard" you would get no animosity or people trying to debunk your claims.


----------



## cel4145

tablix said:


> The KRK's have their downside also, as they are not really suitable for mixing/mastering as they are pretty warm and can result in thin and bass-light recordings when transferring to more Hi-Fi speakers.  I use them as a comparison when working on my ADAM's, and tbh I prefer them for casual listening as they dont give any fatigue even with 5+hours of listening.




That makes sense. I don't do mixing and mastering, so I liked them for pleasure listening.


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

New product alert!! Take a look at the specs for the Eve SC203.
  
http://www.eve-audio.com/index.php?page=SC203
  
 KMR have them for £345 the set. That's about $525 or E450 at current exchange rates.
  
 Small desktop speakers with quality written all over them. They are genuine actives (4 amps, one for each driver) but operate in a master/slave fashion. Seems odd at first but it has a real advantage for home users. You don't need a separate analogue volume control. Not only that you can connect them directly via optical S/PDIF or USB. So you might not even need an audio interface either! They don;t look so expensive now do they? Sub out too....
  
 60Hz min and 95dB max ain't gonna turn your desk into a nightclub but it's pretty decent for nearfield listening and they don't take up much space and don't need you to spend extra on wedge to get the best listening angle.
  
 I haven't heard them yet but I do have a pair of SC204 and a TS107 which I;m delighted with so far.
  
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar14/articles/eve-sc204-ts107.htm


----------



## radosuaf

ronalddumsfeld said:


> They don;t look so expensive now do they?


 
 No, for 3" woofers they DO seem to be expensive .


----------



## Tablix

I suspect they are designed to work in conjunction with a sub, which would further add to the cost, 60hz is hardly any bass at all. Normally I would look at something going as low as 45hz range before I think about not using a sub, even then its not thumping bass. From EVE's own tech speak "And for optimal connectivity, the SC203 houses three inputs – analog RCA, digital optical and USB – which will allow you to conveniently connect a wide range of sources. Furthermore, a volume controlled subwoofer output lets you connect an additional subwoofer (TS107 und TS108) to the master speaker and create a powerful 2.1 system. A DIP switch located at the speaker's back panel allows you to select the SC203's to work as "satellites" from 80Hz and upwards, or as a full range units." If you already own a sub perhaps they could be worth a look if space is an issue.  Sadly I have not had the chance to play around with any EVE speakers.
  
 Another thing that puts me off is the mesh covers for the drivers, while I am sure they took distortion into consideration its something I never like.


----------



## enkidu

cel4145 said:


> Plus, when talking about the DT Inclines, it's notable that all the Incline fans in this thread completely ignored my point that those speakers are going to be rather finicky about placement and setup because of the bipolar design. For many setups, a direct radiating nearfield monitor will work much better. Any recommendation of the Inclines should caution people on that, just like recommendations of the DT bi-polar floorstanding speaker series.
> I respect that opinion. I don't personally think it's a problem if people say that they liked something the best or that a speaker is popularly reviewed and would be a good buy. But insistence on "best on the market?" That's just naive.


 
 Agree on all points. Didn't answer the question about setup because I don't know much about it and you guys were getting so, uhm, animated that I figured that more fat didn't need throwing in the fire.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 To answer the question:
  
 Imaging in my system with the Inclines set back about 17" and 30" apart, toed in to point directly at me works really well. Moving around between the speakers doesn't seem to change the coloration that much, but then again, I'm not blessed with golden ears. Did take delivery of a ProSub800 this week and will be setting up with some sound-test software (first time!) to see how the current setup reproduces vs with the sub etc. etc. Will post measurements after the weekend of putzing around.


----------



## JML

Most of these speakers are subject to placement issues, not just the Inclines.  Any of the active pro monitors with a rear port (or similarly configured passive audiophile speakers that can be used for near field listening) probably cannot be placed close to a wall.  Even if you reduce or shelve the bass output from the speakers' control settings, there are likely to be problems.  So if your desk is near a wall, front ports are likely to be much better sounding.  The B&W MM-1 was awful near a wall, frankly.
  
 And let's not forget the thread title: under $500.  Once you go from a 2.0 setup to a 2.1 the price will likely climb.


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> Agree on all points. Didn't answer the question about setup because I don't know much about it and you guys were getting so, uhm, animated that I figured that more fat didn't need throwing in the fire. To answer the question:
> 
> Imaging in my system with the Inclines set back about 17" and 30" apart, toed in to point directly at me works really well. Moving around between the speakers doesn't seem to change the coloration that much, but then again, I'm not blessed with golden ears. Did take delivery of a ProSub800 this week and will be setting up with some sound-test software (first time!) to see how the current setup reproduces vs with the sub etc. etc. Will post measurements after the weekend of putzing around.




Did Def Tech provide instructions on optimal setup? I know that the biploar floorstanding speakers have to be placed out a good bit from the wall, and they need space around them in order for the bipolar design to do its magic with the expanded soundfield.

I'm sure that ProSub will be a nice addition


----------



## cel4145

jml said:


> Most of these speakers are subject to placement issues, not just the Inclines.  Any of the active pro monitors with a rear port (or similarly configured passive audiophile speakers that can be used for near field listening) probably cannot be placed close to a wall.  Even if you reduce or shelve the bass output from the speakers' control settings, there are likely to be problems.  So if your desk is near a wall, front ports are likely to be much better sounding.  The B&W MM-1 was awful near a wall, frankly.




The Inclines will be more finicky than most other speakers because of the rear firing full range driver.


----------



## enkidu

Got around to doing measurements. Be gentle 'cause it's my first time doing this. I downloaded and figured out, sort of, how to run REW, http://roomeqwizard.com, set up my Apogee One as a mic and did a few measurements of the Inclines through my M2U/M2u stack. Here's a graph of the response. I suspect that the Apogee One's built-in mic is poorly suited to 1k and above frequencies, which is why the graph goes all poopy above there. Using a 20-20k Hz sweep, with four passes (much to the annoyance of the SO as I figured out how to run the damn thing) this is the resultant graph. Disregarding the crap above 1k since I think the mic is more at fault here, the response from 60-1k is pretty flat. The base response doesn't really start until around 50 Hz which confirms my impressions while listening to it, although it definitely does produce sound above 45Hz or so. Any talk of 30Hz or even 40Hz is crazy talk in my opinion. But my ears tell me via the sine wave generator that 45Hz definitely does produce a sound and above 50Hz it gets pretty robust with 60Hz and above being pretty normal volume.


----------



## sia rezaei

enkidu said:


> Got around to doing measurements. Be gentle 'cause it's my first time doing this. I downloaded and figured out, sort of, how to run REW, http://roomeqwizard.com, set up my Apogee One as a mic and did a few measurements of the Inclines through my M2U/M2u stack. Here's a graph of the response. I suspect that the Apogee One's built-in mic is poorly suited to 1k and above frequencies, which is why the graph goes all poopy above there. Using a 20-20k Hz sweep, with four passes (much to the annoyance of the SO as I figured out how to run the damn thing) this is the resultant graph. Disregarding the crap above 1k since I think the mic is more at fault here, the response from 60-1k is pretty flat. The base response doesn't really start until around 50 Hz which confirms my impressions while listening to it, although it definitely does produce sound above 45Hz or so. Any talk of 30Hz or even 40Hz is crazy talk in my opinion. But my ears tell me via the sine wave generator that 45Hz definitely does produce a sound and above 50Hz it gets pretty robust with 60Hz and above being pretty normal volume.


 
  
 Interesting measurement. How was everything placed? Distance of the speaker and microphone to reflective surfaces (walls, floor, ceiling)? Distance of speaker to microphone?
 Also did you measure one speaker or both were making sound at the same time?


----------



## enkidu

sia rezaei said:


> Interesting measurement. How was everything placed? Distance of the speaker and microphone to reflective surfaces (walls, floor, ceiling)? Distance of speaker to microphone?
> Also did you measure one speaker or both were making sound at the same time?


 
 Thanks! Both speakers were driven since I don't know how to configure REW to only drive one at a time, the microphone was level in height with the middle of the speakers at the edge of the desk; the speakers are set back 14" and 30" apart, toed in to point directly at the mic. Room is very large being in one corner of a loft with 2 story high ceilings and an open living + dining + working area. Desk is set against window but there's a good 18" of distance between them and the back of the speakers.
  
 BTW, just ordered a calibrated mic from parts-express so I'll be redoing the measurements with it when it comes. I'll be comparing the last run and also against the setup with a ProSub800 underneath. The ProSub makes a huge difference with the low end as is to be expected.


----------



## sia rezaei

enkidu said:


> Thanks! Both speakers were driven since I don't know how to configure REW to only drive one at a time, the microphone was level in height with the middle of the speakers at the edge of the desk; the speakers are set back 14" and 30" apart, toed in to point directly at the mic. Room is very large being in one corner of a loft with 2 story high ceilings and an open living + dining + working area. Desk is set against window but there's a good 18" of distance between them and the back of the speakers.
> 
> BTW, just ordered a calibrated mic from parts-express so I'll be redoing the measurements with it when it comes. I'll be comparing the last run and also against the setup with a ProSub800 underneath. The ProSub makes a huge difference with the low end as is to be expected.


 
 I just found out about REW 3 days ago. It looks powerful for a freeware. The type of measurement for measuring speakers is different from those of measuring rooms. For speaker measurement you should test one speaker. In Windows, I mute the other channel by adjusting the balance in Windows' Sound settings. 
 Also, if you want to measure the speaker more accurately without the influence of the room, you should do a gated measurement. It would get rid of the irregularities you have been getting here.
 There is a good explanation of how do it with REW on miniDSP's website here. The downside of measuring speakers indoors is that you can't get accurate bass response.
 Basically the lowest frequency that you can measure with accuracy is (speed of sound)/(length of the shortest path for reflected sound). For example, if the floor is the closest surface and the path length from the speaker to floor and back to mic is 2 meters, then your measurement won't be good below 170Hz. 
 When I want to take more accurate bass measurements. I go outside (on a sunny day  ), set the mic and speaker 3 meter off the ground, and 10 meters from other reflecting surfaces. 
  
 I wish we could see more measurements in audio forums. I think it would settle a lot of arguments such as the one we have had here for the past couple of days


----------



## cel4145

sia rezaei said:


> The downside of measuring speakers indoors is that you can't get accurate bass response.
> Basically the lowest frequency that you can measure with accuracy is (speed of sound)/(length of the shortest path for reflected sound). For example, if the floor is the closest surface and the path length from the speaker to floor and back to mic is 2 meters, then your measurement won't be good below 170Hz.
> When I want to take more accurate bass measurements. I go outside (on a sunny day  ), set the mic and speaker 3 meter off the ground, and 10 meters from other reflecting surfaces.
> 
> I wish we could see more measurements in audio forums. I think it would settle a lot of arguments such as the one we have had here for the past couple of days




This is good advice for direct radiating speakers. 

But the Inclines are bipolar. In addition to the front tweeter, midrange driver, and passive bass radiator, they have a rear firing full range driver:
https://www.definitivetech.com/products/incline (see specs)

It would be very difficult to measure them accurately individually using typical anechoic measurement processes because the rear driver is meant to reflect off boundaries. So measuring them properly setup from a listening position is probably the only way to get a realistic sense of how they measure.


----------



## sia rezaei

cel4145 said:


> This is good advice for direct radiating speakers.
> 
> But the Inclines are bipolar. In addition to the front tweeter, midrange driver, and passive bass radiator, they have a rear firing full range driver:
> https://www.definitivetech.com/products/incline (see specs)
> ...


 
 You are right, bipolar are a bit messy that way. They interact with the room more than a direct radiating speaker. I have never measured bipolars, so I don't know what the best approach is. Maybe a listening window average?
 But in the bass and lower midrange region, they should be identical to direct radiating speakers.


----------



## cel4145

sia rezaei said:


> You are right, bipolar are a bit messy that way. They interact with the room more than a direct radiating speaker. I have never measured bipolars, so I don't know what the best approach is. Maybe a listening window average?
> *But in the bass and lower midrange region, they should be identical to direct radiating speakers.*




It depends on how "full range" that rear driver is. Unlikely it's doing a lot for bass, but could be adding to midrange.


----------



## enkidu

sia rezaei said:


> I just found out about REW 3 days ago. It looks powerful for a freeware. The type of measurement for measuring speakers is different from those of measuring rooms. For speaker measurement you should test one speaker. In Windows, I mute the other channel by adjusting the balance in Windows' Sound settings.
> Also, if you want to measure the speaker more accurately without the influence of the room, you should do a gated measurement. It would get rid of the irregularities you have been getting here.
> There is a good explanation of how do it with REW on miniDSP's website here. The downside of measuring speakers indoors is that you can't get accurate bass response.
> Basically the lowest frequency that you can measure with accuracy is (speed of sound)/(length of the shortest path for reflected sound). For example, if the floor is the closest surface and the path length from the speaker to floor and back to mic is 2 meters, then your measurement won't be good below 170Hz.
> ...


 

 Thanks! That is some great information! My mic should be arriving in a few days and I'll be able to do a few passes, hopefully mono and mono+sub measurements with 20-20k sweeps and perhaps different mic positions (above desk, close in, far back, above speakers, below desk etc). At least until the SO puts the foot down. REW is very cool, able to generate sweeps and tones, different color noise etc. All the other stuff I found was at least $40 to start, and $100+ for any decent capability.
  
 As for anechoic measurements, that isn't a high priority for me. I'm interested in measuring how stuff sounds in my setup, not so much testing audio equipment for their theoretical performance, although here finding sunny days is never a problem . Finding a large quiet open space with power + no noise restrictions, not so simple. I recall that Apple has a bunch of completely crazy anechoic rooms where they test electronics. They'd be perfect for speaker testing. However, 'twould be tricky to sneak into them for testing, even for an Apple employee.


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> Thanks! That is some great information! My mic should be arriving in a few days and I'll be able to do a few passes, hopefully mono and mono+sub measurements with 20-20k sweeps and perhaps different mic positions (above desk, close in, far back, above speakers, below desk etc). At least until the SO puts the foot down. REW is very cool, able to generate sweeps and tones, different color noise etc. All the other stuff I found was at least $40 to start, and $100+ for any decent capability.
> 
> As for anechoic measurements, that isn't a high priority for me. I'm interested in measuring how stuff sounds in my setup, not so much testing audio equipment for their theoretical performance, although here finding sunny days is never a problem . Finding a large quiet open space with power + no noise restrictions, not so simple. I recall that Apple has a bunch of completely crazy anechoic rooms where they test electronics. They'd be perfect for speaker testing. However, 'twould be tricky to sneak into them for testing, even for an Apple employee.




You should try using REW for what it is generally used for--smoothing the frequency response using EQ at the primary listening position. You'll need a tripod to position your mic where your head would be, though


----------



## enkidu

cel4145 said:


> You should try using REW for what it is generally used for--smoothing the frequency response using EQ at the primary listening position. You'll need a tripod to position your mic where your head would be, though


 

 I see how it is; first I do a few measurements, then I get a tripod and set up EQ on my laptop, then before I know it, I'm installing an 8x8 miniDSP and multi-channel amp, bi-amping my speakers, and spending weekends with a mic and laptop tweaking my home theater setup. I'm on to you Interwebs!


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> I see how it is; first I do a few measurements, then I get a tripod and set up EQ on my laptop, then before I know it, I'm installing an 8x8 miniDSP and multi-channel amp, bi-amping my speakers, and spending weekends with a mic and laptop tweaking my home theater setup. I'm on to you Interwebs!




No need for a miniDSP. Equalizer APO!

http://sourceforge.net/projects/equalizerapo/ :etysmile:


----------



## sia rezaei

cel4145 said:


> It depends on how "full range" that rear driver is. Unlikely it's doing a lot for bass, but could be adding to midrange.


 
 What I was trying to say is that at low frequencies, it actually doesn't matter how much the "full range" contributes to the bass, a bipolar speakers would still be identical to a direct radiating speaker, because at low frequencies sound will be dispersed uniformly.
  
 btw, have you used REW to do what enkidu is trying to do here? If yes, I'm curious to see what your experience has been.


----------



## cel4145

sia rezaei said:


> What I was trying to say is that at low frequencies, it actually doesn't matter how much the "full range" contributes to the bass, a bipolar speakers would still be identical to a direct radiating speaker, because at low frequencies sound will be dispersed uniformly.




Eh...wonder if that's true when it comes to taking anechoic measurements. I've seen discussions about how difficult it is to take readings from dual driver opposing subs, for example. 



sia rezaei said:


> btw, have you used REW to do what enkidu is trying to do here? If yes, I'm curious to see what your experience has been.




I'm not sure on what he's trying to do here


----------



## sia rezaei

cel4145 said:


> Eh...wonder if that's true when it comes to taking anechoic measurements. I've seen discussions about how difficult it is to take readings from dual driver opposing subs, for example.
> I'm not sure on what


 
 To be honest, now that I think about it I have never tried to measure my speakers from extreme angles! Ahh if only we had this discussion a week earlier, I would have taken measurements from side and back of my speakers when I was in the field last Thursday. I'll do it next time  
  
  


cel4145 said:


> *You should try using REW for what it is generally used for--smoothing the frequency response using EQ at the primary listening position.* You'll need a tripod to position your mic where your head would be, though


 
  
 I thought you might have done this


----------



## cel4145

sia rezaei said:


> I thought you might have done this




I have measured, but I use Audyssey MultEQ and an Antimode with my primary home audio setup. One day, maybe I'll get a different receiver that has better EQ capability


----------



## enkidu

Pox, measurements are on hold for now. The mic arrived, but is not recognized by my MacBook Pro. Interface _should_ be TRRS, but doesn't work. Verified that standard Apple headphone does work so the socket is ok. Looking more closely at the documentation the mic (Dayton Audio iMM-6) specifies as designed for Android and Apple Devices, but the web page seems to mean Apple iOS devices, not Mac devices. Gah. I do have a Yamaha YPAO mic which came with my home theater amp and I think it'll fit in the Apogee One with a 1/4" adapter. Will try that when I get a chance.


----------



## enkidu

Did a few measurements with Yamaha setup mic through the Apogee One. For all the measurements, The upper frequencies on all three graphs are pretty uniformly crappy. I'm still not sure the cause of this. First two measurements were taken more or less where my head is when I'm working. I turned off the left channel by unplugging it. The first is the right Incline only, no sub.

 The Inclines alone definitely don't have much beneath 40Hz, but have decent response above 50Hz.
  
 Then I plugged in the ProSub800 which has been set to something around what seems to sound balanced with the Inclines:

 As we can see, the response begins around 30Hz and is pretty good around 33Hz.

 This last is with the ProSub800 connected and the mic placed very close to the sub:
  

  
 Adding the ProSub800 definitely improves the response down to 33Hz or so. Nothing super low, but I wasn't expecting it to. Well worth the addition I think.


----------



## cel4145

enkidu said:


> Did a few measurements with Yamaha setup mic through the Apogee One. For all the measurements, The upper frequencies on all three graphs are pretty uniformly crappy. I'm still not sure the cause of this. First two measurements were taken more or less where my head is when I'm working. I turned off the left channel by unplugging it. The first is the right Incline only, no sub.
> 
> 
> The Inclines alone definitely don't have much beneath 40Hz, but have decent response above 50Hz.
> ...




That's good. Were you able to get the Dayton Audio iMM-6 to work, then?


----------



## enkidu

cel4145 said:


> That's good. Were you able to get the Dayton Audio iMM-6 to work, then?


 

 Nah, refused to connect to the MacBook. I suppose it could work if I back-engineered how the headset works vs the iMM-6 but I'm not that dedicated to the cause. Dug up the Yamaha auto-configuration mic and connected it to the Apogee One as an "instrument" and that seemed to work fine. Still a bit puzzled by the high frequency measurements, but not really curious enough or willing to risk the wrath of the SO to continue poking at it.


----------



## cel4145

Unless you have found calibration files for it, there's no telling how far off that YPAO mic is. YPAO itself will have the calibration built into the software, so they don't need to have the mic measure linearly. They just need it cheap.


----------



## HiCZoK

Hey guys. I am looking for something to replace my old and trusty 5.1 (later reduced to 2.1) set of creative cambridge dt2200 speakers.
  
 As for headphones I have awesome brainwavz hm5 btw (not that it matters)
  
  
 Now, I don't have a big budget. Around 100 euro. I only want something 2.0... to finally minimalize the cable mess. I've been looking at creative gigaworks t40 II. Are those reasonable option ? or should I get cheaper t20 ? maybe there is not so much difference.
  
 At first I wanted to get M-Audio AV40. But I can't seem to find them anywhere reasonable in Poland and those are a bit wide for my setup.


----------



## radosuaf

Currently selling mine on allegro . Probably the best you can get if you need to go THAT narrow with that budget, but I'd take something from Edifier, with bigger 4" woofers if you can fit them.


----------



## HiCZoK

Thanks for not selling  me on Your auction  (not looking to buy used equipement)
  
 So You had t40 and wand edifier ? 
 My desk is kinda narrow and even if I would fit normal sized speakers, the controls would have to be on the front


----------



## radosuaf

Actually, I decided to go big and changed the desk and speakers to Alesis Elevate 5s that came in post today .


----------



## JML

I had the T40 series I at work before I bought the Definitive Tech Inclines.  The T40 are surprisingly good sounding inexpensive desktop speakers; neutral, with clean mids and highs.  The bass is limited, but for an inexpensive 2.0 system, they're pretty good (the T20 has far less bass).  The T40 series II is supposed to have more bass than the original T40.  When I ran the T40 out of my Meridian Explorer's line out, they were very much better sounding than when I ran them from my MacBook's headphone jack.  Everything improved significantly, especially imaging and sound staging.


----------



## HiCZoK

Thanks.
 I have e10k so source is pure digital to analog
 But back on topic. I am looking at t40 so deeply, because of their dimensions. 18cm wide like av40 is just too much. But I don't want to sacrifice too much sq for versitality.
  
 Versitality and less clutter is why I am looking for new speakers in the first place. My current 2.1 have thousands and thousands of cables, huge incredibly hot power brick and separate volume control on yet another cable. I like to watch movies, ofc play games and so on.
  
 but Brainwavz hm5 is there for heavy, real tasks. When i play something (or watch) "for real" I always go for headphones, to immerse myself and don't disturb my gf. And in most cases, when we watch movies, we go hdmi out to tv anyway, So those speakers are just for general use of movies/music/gaming. I like bass tho and don't want to sacrifice all of it.
 edit: Also just noticed t30 speakers... which creative claims to have some bass port x mumbo jumbo. They look even more versitale and can be wireless I guess


----------



## radosuaf

hiczok said:


> But back on topic. I am looking at t40 so deeply, because of their dimensions.
> 
> Versitality and less clutter is why I am looking for new speakers in the first place.
> 
> edit: Also just noticed t30 speakers... which creative claims to have some bass port x mumbo jumbo. They look even more versitale and can be wireless I guess


 
  
 1. There are also Edifier Exclaim speakers, even narrower, I think, and with 3" woofer + passive radiator, so should output more bass than the T40s. They get good reviews, but hard to get in Poland (I found only one shop in Poznań that has them) and the price is not too special. The official Edifier dealer for Poland does not sell them. Also, due to passive radiator being on the side, they need some space. which is not an issue with T40s (bass port on the top). They come also in a Bluetooth version.
  
 2. BassXPort or however Creative calls it is simply a bass reflex port . Also, these are no longer Gigaworks as are not designed by Cambridge Soundworks.


----------



## HiCZoK

The Edifier Exclaim are super ugly for me so I wouldn't get those anyway 
  
 I am not sold on t40 too anyway yet, so I am still looking around. I still see occassional opinions that t40 II have no bass whatsoever. Those people say that t20 and t30 sounds better. Other people adore t40 ii... that's internet right there


----------



## radosuaf

T20 is not likely to sound better (I'm 99% sure) than T40. Not sure about T30, but doubt it.


----------



## HiCZoK

T30 is interesting. I am not interested in it's wireless capabilities but it does looks like something betweeb t20 and t30.
  
 There is also bose 2 companion iii that suits my price tag and dimensions. Wonder how it fares


----------



## radosuaf

Bose Companion 2 do not have tweeters.


----------



## HiCZoK

radosuaf said:


> Bose Companion 2 do not have tweeters.


 
 Wow. I thought tweeters are maybe hidden or something...
  
 Then T30 are growing on me. Their size is perfect. They are not as freakishly tall as t40 and are just "deeper" instead. It is such a pain in the ass, to not have a  place for bigger monitors.
 Edit: At some point, I've even considered a soundbar but that would make e10k front headphone jack unreachable on my desk
 edit2: here is a picture of my setup. sorry for crappy quality. You can see how little space I have and where the subwoofer is... and tons of cables on top of it. Fiio is on the display stand, power brick is where right leg would be and volume controller is on the right hand side underneath the desk... just having 2.0 setup would be a relief


----------



## HiCZoK

Actually. M-Audio AV30 is 13cm and AV40 is 15cm wide.
 How are those compared to each other and to creative t20-t40
  
 Also, there are few speakers on m-audio site. also new av42 and av32 models. Those look even better... tho I am still not sure if their size would be ok... and if I need speakers like that at all. Guess I will have to do some mall listening and report back


----------



## radosuaf

You can have a look at Alesis Elevate 3 - they are 127 mm wide and have a decent (for a 3" woofer) frequency response,down to 80 Hz + dedicated subwoofer output, so if you decide you need more bass, you simply connect the sub and voila .
 MSRP in Poland is 349 PLN. You can find their review on bonedo.de.


----------



## PhilipDelCampo

If your looking at the M-AudioBx5a's and have a $500.00 budget you should also consider the Bx8 D2's. They retail for $395.00 on Amazon and can also be found on E-Bay for some screaming deals! I have both the M-Audio Bx5a's and Bx8 d2's and don't think I paid more than $300.00 all in. I am very happy with both the bx5a's for their clarity and midrange punch and the bx8 d2's for their 8" woofers low end thump. I listen to mostly rap and some electronic so I favor a lot of bass I also  have the Dayton sub1000 and sub1200 subwoofers to give some great lows for super cheap. I think I want to build my own 18" Dayton Sub with a 500 watt amp and hopefully that will be enough considering my room size is only 10'x15'!Anyways good luck in your journey I think your on the right path with m-audio.Last year I was in a similar position looking at the same speakers: audioengine a2 a5, presonus, and krk .I made my choice after looking at power output and woofer size and obviously price I went with the m-audio line and have been happy ever since. I'm no audiophile and this is my first ever post on this site but I hope it helps.


----------



## paulguru

which is the best 2.0 set around 4-5" not biamplied ?


----------



## radosuaf

Presonus Eris E4.5 get good reviews.


----------



## paulguru

radosuaf said:


> Presonus Eris E4.5 get good reviews.


 
 analytical products ?
 sounds good also with low bitrate tracks ?


----------



## radosuaf

Never heard them - bass-relfex ports on the back, unfortunately...


----------



## HiCZoK

radosuaf said:


> You can have a look at Alesis Elevate 3 - they are 127 mm wide and have a decent (for a 3" woofer) frequency response,down to 80 Hz + dedicated subwoofer output, so if you decide you need more bass, you simply connect the sub and voila .
> MSRP in Poland is 349 PLN. You can find their review on bonedo.de.


 
 Never heard of this brand.
 The price is good
 volume control knob in front
 good size
  
 Is that something like m-audio knock off ?
 I am interested. Are they active ? I don't see jack input on the back of the right speaker. how do they connect to pc ?
 And I will not add subwoofer to them.
 edit: Just seen the reviews... meh... not so cool anymore.
 Think I will just end with new m-audio av32 or one of the creative products. Will look into listening them at a mall or something. But av32 looks really neat.


----------



## HiCZoK

Just to finish off my set of questions... I have to settle for something cheap... as I am buying a flat this months it seems, so thats a costly surprise  (actually I've been waiting for a developer contract for months and it's due this months, so I will need some money)
  
 So I will get creative T20. Cheapest of the bunch. Thanks for help everyone


----------



## soulorc

paulguru said:


> which is the best 2.0 set around 4-5" not biamplied ?


 
 Focal XS book?


----------



## RonaldDumsfeld

The new Eve Audio SC203 is pretty impressive.
  
http://www.eve-audio.com/index.php?page=SC203


----------



## Zack Foo

is there any difference between d1080mkII and d1080-iv? or just the design difference?


----------



## Valens7

Serene Audio's Talisman near-field speakers are pretty boss, IMHO. They are superior in many respects to Audioengine's A5, from what I can remember. Mind you, that's the A5, not the A5+ revision, which I haven't heard. Also, they flat-out crush the A2 (again, from what I recall), and make hash of the ProMedia 2.1 that I currently use for multimedia duties. Sub-bass performance is minimal, but one can always add a subwoofer to compensate for that (unavoidable) shortcoming. Frankly, I'm glad that Serene Audio opted for authentic bass rather than DSP-induced flubber. Overall, enthusiastically recommended!


----------



## paulguru

*Best musical speakers around 4 inch woofer not bi-amplified ?*


----------



## cel4145

paulguru said:


> *Best musical speakers around 4 inch woofer not bi-amplified ?*




Not powered, but passive? Otherwise, bi amplification is the better design choice for powered speakers. So not clear on what you are after here.


----------



## MusicJunky

Hey guys I am looking into buying a pair of powered speakers for around $500aud. Does anyone have experiences with these speakers:
Yamaha hs8
Emotiva Airmotiv 6s
Swan M200 mkiii
Which one would have the best sq out of this list and more recommendations are also welcome. Cheers


----------



## MusicJunky

musicjunky said:


> Hey guys I am looking into buying a pair of powered speakers for around $500aud. Does anyone have experiences with these speakers:
> Yamaha hs8
> Emotiva Airmotiv 6s
> Swan M200 mkiii
> Which one would have the best sq out of this list and more recommendations are also welcome. Cheers


 also forgot to add focal xs book to the list


----------



## cel4145

I'd go for the Airmotiv 6s.


----------



## MusicJunky

cel4145 said:


> I'd go for the Airmotiv 6s.


 can you explain why? I cant actually get to listen to them in person where I live so I'm baseing the sq on other ppl's comments/reviews. From that list I can only find yamaha hs8 ( actually $800) and the focal xs book in stores near me.


----------



## BigTerminator

musicjunky said:


> can you explain why? I cant actually get to listen to them in person where I live so I'm baseing the sq on other ppl's comments/reviews. From that list I can only find yamaha hs8 ( actually $800) and the focal xs book in stores near me.


 
 Question is why not. The Airmotiv line is amazing, and it is heavily discounted right now. You can always send them back if you end up not liking them.
  
 It would be better to get the Airmotiv 5S and pair it with a good quality subwoofer vs. the Airmotiv 6S.


----------



## MusicJunky

bigterminator said:


> Question is why not. The Airmotiv line is amazing, and it is heavily discounted right now. You can always send them back if you end up not liking them.
> 
> It would be better to get the Airmotiv 5S and pair it with a good quality subwoofer vs. the Airmotiv 6S.


thx for the comment. I'm actually reconsidering n thinking about getting airmotiv 5s right now due to table limitations. Which subwoofer do you think would pair well with them? Do you also think that the airmotiv line would compete and beat other competitors at this price point. They are also not in stock right now so I guess i'll wait.


----------



## Soriordan

I've used the Focal XS book for quite some time, and I would recommend it for 2.0 speakers in your budget. If you're willing to be flexible with your budget, I also have used the original Emotiva Airmotiv 6's and they were much better than the Focals. The amplifier is much better inside the emotivas, and the ribbon transducers really reproduce great Highs 
 
The Focals also do have a bit of static noise from the amplifier which is noticeable if you're sitting right in front of them.


----------



## MusicJunky

Well I could get the emotiva airmotiv 6s cause its $399 a pair which works out to be $550aud. So the new versions would obviously only be an improvement over the originals? I believe it has one rca input on each speaker; one for the left and one for the right so ur standard red and white cables? Do you also know how much extra they charge for international shipping? Thanks man.


----------



## Soriordan

I purchased two Airmotiv 6s and the XDA-2 DAC. I was charged 47$ in duties, 33$ brokerage and 72$ in freight... and I'm in Canada. It certainly wasn't cheap!


----------



## BigTerminator

musicjunky said:


> Well I could get the emotiva airmotiv 6s cause its $399 a pair which works out to be $550aud. So the new versions would obviously only be an improvement over the originals? I believe it has one rca input on each speaker; one for the left and one for the right so ur standard red and white cables? Do you also know how much extra they charge for international shipping? Thanks man.


 
 I would wait for the Airmotiv 5S to be back in stock. What improvement over the originals? The S denotes the newer line of monitors from Emotiva. Each monitor has an RCA and XLR input. I like the XLR to RCA cables better, but RCA to RCA would be fine. Shipping might be a lot so email or call Emotiva for info on that. If you were in America, you could get my speakers and subwoofer for $530.
  
 How much do the JBL LSR305's cost in Australia? Might be a much better deal if you do not have to pay crazy shipping.


----------



## Teraflame

Consider LSR305 or 308, they sound fantastic. Flat, cheap, and has a waveguide that makes a huge sweet spot.


musicjunky said:


> Hey guys I am looking into buying a pair of powered speakers for around $500aud. Does anyone have experiences with these speakers:
> Yamaha hs8
> Emotiva Airmotiv 6s
> Swan M200 mkiii
> Which one would have the best sq out of this list and more recommendations are also welcome. Cheers


----------



## MusicJunky

Damn yea those airmotivs will be to expensive to get shipped to australia. So now its between the jbl LSR305 ($449), the focal ex book ($499) and the swans m200 mk3 ($525).


----------



## senator52

musicjunky said:


> Damn yea those airmotivs will be to expensive to get shipped to australia. So now its between the jbl LSR305 ($449), the focal ex book ($499) and the swans m200 mk3 ($525).


 
  
 I thought I'd already posted in this thread, but it appears I have not. 
  
 I've got the JBL LSR305's hooked up to my PC and they are fantastic. Highly highly recommend them. I got mine from JB Hifi (with gift cards, yeah!) so you can find them locally fairly easily.


----------



## MusicJunky

senator52 said:


> I thought I'd already posted in this thread, but it appears I have not.
> 
> I've got the JBL LSR305's hooked up to my PC and they are fantastic. Highly highly recommend them. I got mine from JB Hifi (with gift cards, yeah!) so you can find them locally fairly easily.



Yea im looking at them for $449 from jbhifi. What is the sound like? From youtube they sound quite warm and bassy with as much clarity as I would like but they may have been fiddling with the bass knobs at the back. How do you connect the jbl speakers to each other tho and then to the computer?


----------



## MusicJunky

musicjunky said:


> Yea im looking at them for $449 from jbhifi. What is the sound like? From youtube they sound quite warm and bassy with as much clarity as I would like but they may have been fiddling with the bass knobs at the back. How do you connect the jbl speakers to each other tho and then to the computer?


* not as much clarity


----------



## senator52

musicjunky said:


> What is the sound like?


 
  
 I'm not really one to go into details as I haven't heard too many monitors in this price range. I will say that I like them very much and haven't felt like I've had any issue with clarity at all. 
  


musicjunky said:


> How do you connect the jbl speakers to each other tho and then to the computer?


  

 I have an ASUS Essence STX sound card, and you can plug them straight into that, you don't need to connect them to each other. I do run them with a SVS SB-2000 sub though so I actually run them to a Drawmer MC2.1 Monitor Controller I got from a friend. However straight to a soundcard is fine for just the 2.0 speakers, if you don't have a soundcard you could always pick up a Schiit box or something.


----------



## MusicJunky

Great thx for the help and suggestion. I'll be picking these up soon hopefully. And thanks to everyone else as well.


----------



## cel4145

bigterminator said:


> Question is why not. The Airmotiv line is amazing, and it is heavily discounted right now. You can always send them back if you end up not liking them.
> 
> It would be better to get the Airmotiv 5S and pair it with a good quality subwoofer vs. the Airmotiv 6S.




Because I have been impressed with the Airmotiv's I have heard and feel they are easily some of the best in their price/performance class. I have not been impressed with the Yamaha studio monitors I have heard. Don't get me wrong. The Yamahas I have heard are OK, but nothing to get excited about. 

I can also second the recommendation for JBL 305s. Excellent speakers.


----------



## cel4145

musicjunky said:


> Yea im looking at them for $449 from jbhifi. What is the sound like? From youtube they sound quite warm and bassy with as much clarity as I would like but they may have been fiddling with the bass knobs at the back. How do you connect the jbl speakers to each other tho and then to the computer?




Be aware that shopping for speakers via YouTube videos can provide as much misleading information as it can reliable information, for a variety of reasons. About as useful as trying to shop for a new TV by watching videos of other TVs on your TV. (lol)


----------



## MusicJunky

Haha you got a point there mate but I'll actually be able to try these out in store because its quite close to where I live.


----------



## cel4145

musicjunky said:


> Haha you got a point there mate but I'll actually be able to try these out in store because its quite close to where I live.




Nothing beats trying them out in person


----------



## AladdinSane

I have the 4S at work for near field enjoyment. Although they lack sub bass (somewhat obvious with 4" drivers) I like them quite a bit and occasionally I have heard sublime treble coming from those ribbon tweeters. I wouldn't hesitate to step up the Emotiva chain given the excuse. I am curious how the larger Emotiva models and the JBLs compare to my Vanatoos which are awesome to my ears on my home rig.


----------



## BigTerminator

aladdinsane said:


> Although they lack sub bass (somewhat obvious with 4" drivers) I like them quite a bit and occasionally I have heard sublime treble coming from those ribbon tweeters.


 
 Coming from my Airmotiv 5S, it is not really that they lack sub bass, but they lack all bass. Turning my subwoofer off, the speakers sound so cold, 2 dimensional, and just lifeless. With the sub on, the speakers shine through, especially that tweeter. But being at work, your coworkers probably won't appreciate it.


----------



## Teraflame

They're monitors so made to have great clarity and soundstage. Very neutral and the bass is not muddy, very tight. The trim controls on the back are +/-2dB so not much difference. 

Honestly they quite easily blow away all headphones I've heard under $500. 



> quote name="MusicJunky" url="/t/503088/2-0-speakers-compilation-best-for-500/540#post_12140123"]
> Yea im looking at them for $449 from jbhifi. What is the sound like? From youtube they sound quite warm and bassy with as much clarity as I would like but they may have been fiddling with the bass knobs at the back. How do you connect the jbl speakers to each other tho and then to the computer?


----------



## AladdinSane

bigterminator said:


> Coming from my Airmotiv 5S, it is not really that they lack sub bass, but they lack all bass. Turning my subwoofer off, the speakers sound so cold, 2 dimensional, and just lifeless. With the sub on, the speakers shine through, especially that tweeter. But being at work, your coworkers probably won't appreciate it.


 
  
 I'd say they hint at bass which would not be uncommon for the form factor. For low volume near field listening they do fine. They'd kick butt with a sub. Sorry coworkers!


----------



## cel4145

bigterminator said:


> Coming from my Airmotiv 5S, it is not really that they lack sub bass, but they lack all bass. Turning my subwoofer off, the speakers sound so cold, 2 dimensional, and just lifeless. With the sub on, the speakers shine through, especially that tweeter. But being at work, your coworkers probably won't appreciate it.




Here are independent measurements for the Airmotiv 4S


http://www.stereophile.com/content/emotiva-audio-pro-airmotiv-4s-powered-loudspeaker-measurements#77k8v3YJWUeWs1v7.97

It seems highly unlikely that the 5S would "lack all bass" given that on would expect that they would perform a bit better than the 4S, and the 4S measurements don't "lack all bass." Here are the specs for each

4S -- 58 Hz to 23 kHz +/- 2 dB
5S -- 52 Hz to 23 kHz +/- 2 dB

So probably 55 to 60hz extension for the 5S. Not doing much into sub bass range, but definitely should be fine for mid bass.


----------



## BigTerminator

I have tested my Airmotiv 5S, they go down to 50hz, but after that it rolls off like a brick wall. You have a SVS SB1000 so you know the difference a sub adds. It is so much more than just a harder kick. If you are not used to a sub, then the speakers will seem like they have enough. Once you add one you can't go back. Technically my sub only adds 20-25hz of depth to the speakers, so it shouldn't have that much of an impact on sound, but it does. It adds meat on the bone. 
  
 My DT990's have decent bass, but it doesn't go low. The depth add so much to the music, that's why I love Audeze.


----------



## Enkaydian

Hey BigTerminator, i notice you have the 5s and bx5a. I own the bx5a, I was looking to upgrade, is this a good upgrade? I am wanting a little more of a fun listen, i love the m-audio's but kind of want a more fun listen. I am fine with the bass of the m-audio's. Treble and mids are great too. either the 5s or vanatoo.


----------



## cel4145

bigterminator said:


> I have tested my Airmotiv 5S, they go down to 50hz, but after that it rolls off like a brick wall. You have a SVS SB1000 so you know the difference a sub adds. It is so much more than just a harder kick. If you are not used to a sub, then the speakers will seem like they have enough. Once you add one you can't go back. Technically my sub only adds 20-25hz of depth to the speakers, so it shouldn't have that much of an impact on sound, but it does. It adds meat on the bone.




I have an SB1000 for my desktop setup. Good sub. 

What you are describing, though, is a bit different from a lack of mid bass. For nearfield usage, the 5S should be able to produce a linear response through the midbass region and certainly would be able to provide a bit extra bass using EQ, depending on the listening volume. That being said, a sub can be calibrated to increase the bass for nearfield usage up to the sub's crossover point if that is what someone wants. And of course, a sub will help fill a room with bass more. 

But I'm not saying don't buy a sub. I also have two 18" subs in my living room 

BTW: That steep roll off at 50hz is pretty typical for a ported design for 5" driver speakers.


----------



## Stonewater

Hey guys!
  
 Long time lurker and I'm finally back in the market to purchase a new 2.0 speaker system.  I'm not a bass freak and have neighbors downstairs, so I'm leaning towards avoiding a subwoofer all together.
  
 I work at home mostly and looking for a pair of speakers around the $200 - $250 price range to sit on my desk as I work through the day and I can't decide what to get!
  
 At first I thought I was going for the Audiomachine A2+, but I've found some negative reviews lately stating that the sound quality isn't up to par with the price.
  
 I would consider monitors, but I'd prefer a smaller set if possible.  However, if they are the best bang for the buck I'm on board!
  
 I've seen some deals like the HiVi M10 for $90, but I'm willing to pay more of a premium if it means I'm getting a big increase in quality.
  
 Thanks for any help in advance!
  
 EDIT:  Also came across this deal on amazon for a pair of JBL 305s bundled with cables for $250.  Is this the way to go?


----------



## AladdinSane

Oh yes by all means get subs. My work (where the Emotivas are) is the only listening station I have that lacks a sub. Pretty sure that won't last forever. Subs add too much to the enjoyment equation.


----------



## cel4145

stonewater said:


> EDIT:  Also came across this deal on amazon for a pair of JBL 305s bundled with cables for $250.  Is this the way to go?




Yes. The LSR305s are one of the best price/performance values out there.


----------



## yay101

I feel like the elacs might be the champion of this price range now they are finally out and reviewed, I know I will be getting a pair at Christmas.


----------



## cel4145

yay101 said:


> I feel like the elacs might be the champion of this price range now they are finally out and reviewed, I know I will be getting a pair at Christmas.




There is a lot of heavy hype about the Elacs right now. Based on what I have read, seems like they are right in there with the Wharfedale Diamonds, EMP Teks, Chane, HSU, and Ascend Acoustics offerings in this price range. Which you would like best would probably depend on personal listening preferences and room influence.


----------



## MusicJunky

The jbl lsr305 where only available online at jbhifi while this other shop didnt havent stock. He did however recommened the yamaha hs5 tho. Anybody have experiences with those?


----------



## noxa

Wharfdale Diamond 220 for me


----------



## Stonewater

I'm thinking I'm going to go with the Polk Hampden's in the end.  A bit more convenient for me with their size, a great $200 price, and - I know it shouldn't be much of a factor - but it gets bonus points for its look as well.
  
 Is there a glaring reason why I shouldn't have my heart set on this pair of speakers?
  
 Thanks for all of your help!


----------



## starfly

stonewater said:


> Hey guys!
> 
> Long time lurker and I'm finally back in the market to purchase a new 2.0 speaker system.  I'm not a bass freak and have neighbors downstairs, so I'm leaning towards avoiding a subwoofer all together.
> 
> ...


 
  
 For that price, definitely go for the JBL 305s.  They are very good speakers in that class and especially for that price.  The imaging on these speakers is very good and they put out an impressive amount of bass (with good quality too) for such relatively small speakers.


----------



## cuiter23

My favorite speakers at the $500 mark would be the B&W 686 s2.


----------



## chazb11

I've been lurking here on Head-Fi for quite awhile now and haven't made any posts because when it comes to headphones I've been in learning mode. But speakers are something I'm very familiar with so I'll offer my thoughts.
  
 One of the best speakers under $500 is the Pioneer SP-BS22 and at $129 it's way under $500! The Pioneer is NOT a powered speaker but you could buy a pretty decent amp with the money you save.
  
 Another good choice is the Thonet & Vander HOCH2 powered speaker. I haven't heard these for myself but have read many, many good reviews about them. Like the Pioneers these are true "budget" speakers selling for only $129, sometimes less.
  
 IMO, truly good self powered speakers are few and far between. I would (and did) go the separate desktop amp route. Even one of the under $100 Topping amps are far better than what you find built into a powered speaker.


----------



## TLN

chazb11 said:


> IMO, truly good self powered speakers are few and far between. I would (and did) go the separate desktop amp route. Even one of the under $100 Topping amps are far better than what you find built into a powered speaker.


 
 Think so?
 I'm looking for some 2.0 setup for under $300. What will sould better, JBL 305 suggested above or say Audooengine A5, or some cheap amp and passive speakers?


----------



## cuiter23

tln said:


> Think so?
> I'm looking for some 2.0 setup for under $300. What will sould better, JBL 305 suggested above or say Audooengine A5, or some cheap amp and passive speakers?




Decent Passive > A5+ > JBL


----------



## BigTerminator

cuiter23 said:


> Decent Passive > A5+ > JBL


 
 Expensive passive > Emotiva Airmotiv 5/6S > JBL LSR305  > Audioengine A5+


----------



## cuiter23

bigterminator said:


> Expensive passive > Emotiva Airmotiv 5/6S > JBL LSR305  > Audioengine A5+




For HiFi, the rule of thumb is to always go for passive. Active monitors are a different story


----------



## TLN

cuiter23 said:


> For HiFi, the rule of thumb is to always go for passive. Active monitors are a different story


 
  
 I'm in search for good speakers/amp in 200-300 range. Can anyone advise some good brand to look at?
 I also think of replacing my DAC/headphone amp with something all-in-one, like: Sony UDA-1, Teac 301/501, NAD 3020/7050, etc.. mean anything with amp, so I can connect speakers there. Do you think this is a way to go, or better grab a dedicated amp?
 I'm not going to set a high-end system, but want something good instead.


----------



## cuiter23

tln said:


> I'm in search for good speakers/amp in 200-300 range. Can anyone advise some good brand to look at?
> I also think of replacing my DAC/headphone amp with something all-in-one, like: Sony UDA-1, Teac 301/501, NAD 3020/7050, etc.. mean anything with amp, so I can connect speakers there. Do you think this is a way to go, or better grab a dedicated amp?
> I'm not going to set a high-end system, but want something good instead.


 
  
 200-300 including speakers as well?


----------



## Teraflame

You are not going to find anything close to the quality of LSR305 for $300, especially if you go passive and need a separate amp.


----------



## TLN

cuiter23 said:


> 200-300 including speakers as well?


 
  
 Well.. it depends. Preferably yes. I can stretch a bit more, but prefer not to spend alot.
 I have only USB DAC/headphone amp now, so I either need to get amp+speakers or active speakers. Or replace my DAC with something with speaker amp inside.
  
 You can read my thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/790958/advice-on-home-audio-needed-get-a-extra-amp-or-buy-a-dac-amp-combo
 Not many people answered it though.
  
 Now I have: 


teraflame said:


> You are not going to find anything close to the quality of LSR305 for $300, especially if you go passive and need a separate amp.


 
 Hm.. What's that special about them? Need to listen to them in person somewhere.


----------



## Teraflame

They're neutral and excel at detail without being harsh. Imaging is great and the waveguide is especially amazing at making a wide sweet spot. No other speaker has that in this price range, powered or not. You can try them out if you have a guitar center nearby.
  
 this is a decent review for them: http://noaudiophile.com/JBL_LSR305/
 Quote:


tln said:


> Hm.. What's that special about them? Need to listen to them in person somewhere.


----------



## cuiter23

tln said:


> Well.. it depends. Preferably yes. I can stretch a bit more, but prefer not to spend alot.
> I have only USB DAC/headphone amp now, so I either need to get amp+speakers or active speakers. Or replace my DAC with something with speaker amp inside.
> 
> You can read my thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/790958/advice-on-home-audio-needed-get-a-extra-amp-or-buy-a-dac-amp-combo
> ...




The ELAC B6 is better than the JBL.


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## yay101

An SMSL or Topping amp will do for any speakers in this price range. Just make sure you read reviews, they make several models each and not all are their best work.


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## cel4145

cuiter23 said:


> The ELAC B6 is better than the JBL.




The ELAC B6 is a passive speaker and would require an amp. 

Have you heard the B6s? Or just tagging onto the current hype bandwagon? I know that the B6s are probably pretty good, but right now, they seem to be over hyped by a lot of people who haven't even heard them.


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## cuiter23

cel4145 said:


> The ELAC B6 is a passive speaker and would require an amp.
> 
> Have you heard the B6s? Or just tagging onto the current hype bandwagon? I know that the B6s are probably pretty good, but right now, they seem to be over hyped by a lot of people who haven't even heard them.




My local hifi store is a authorized reseller for ELAC. Ive listened to most of their line-up including the B5 and B6. They do not dissapoint.


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## TLN

But this ELAC's B5 cost same as JBL 305's. And I will need an amp for them.
 So does ELAC B5 + Amp sounds better to satisfy extra $100 on amp?


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## Teraflame

The ELACs are good for home theater (that bass) but for near field JBLs are better.


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## cuiter23

tln said:


> But this ELAC's B5 cost same as JBL 305's. And I will need an amp for them.
> So does ELAC B5 + Amp sounds better to satisfy extra $100 on amp?


 
  
 You don't need an $100 amp. I believe you can find one on amazon for around $50. Should be sufficient for the B5s.


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## TLN

cuiter23 said:


> You don't need an $100 amp. I believe you can find one on amazon for around $50. Should be sufficient for the B5s.


 

 I got it.
 Will see, I still have an idea of replacing my DAC with Sony UDA-1, which can drive speakers as well. This will be perfect for me then.


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## cel4145

tln said:


> I got it.
> Will see, I still have an idea of replacing my DAC with Sony UDA-1, which can drive speakers as well. This will be perfect for me then.




Depends on what speakers. One test of the UDA-1 indicates it starts clipping at 12 watts into 8 ohms. Since Sony rates it 10% THD into 4 ohms at 23 watts, this does seem likely. A $25 Lepai t-amp could perform as well, so don't base your purchasing decision of the UDA-1 on the fact that it has some great amp in it.


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## cuiter23

tln said:


> I got it.
> Will see, I still have an idea of replacing my DAC with Sony UDA-1, which can drive speakers as well. This will be perfect for me then.




I own the UDA-1, it is an amazing dac and amp combo. The new high end Sony amps/ dacs are an example of how measurements only tell you so much. As innerfidelity puts it, measurements dont really mean anything, your ears do. 

Dont be put down by its low power, you will never need to use that much, especially in a bookshelf. My UDA-1 drives my LS50s completely fine, and so does my HAP-S1. It may not be the last word in refinement but the details resolved from my speakers rival many of the current top contenders who have much better distortion tests on paper.


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## cel4145

cuiter23 said:


> I own the UDA-1, it is an amazing dac and amp combo. The new high end Sony amps/ dacs are an example of how measurements only tell you so much. As innerfidelity puts it, measurements dont really mean anything, your ears do.




That's perhaps one of the dumbest things I've ever heard about audio equipment. Are you sure Innerfidelity said it exactly like that? Measurements for amps/dacs can reveal a lot; they just don't always tell the whole story. But I can guarantee you if an amp has been measured to clip at 12 watts into 8 ohms, one's ears are going to confirm that. 



cuiter23 said:


> *Dont be put down by its low power, you will never need to use that much,* especially in a bookshelf. My UDA-1 drives my LS50s completely fine, and so does my HAP-S1. It may not be the last word in refinement but the details resolved from my speakers rival many of the current top contenders who have much better distortion tests on paper.




How can you possibly know that? That depends on the sensitivity of the speakers he selects, the distance from the listening position, and his desired listening volume.


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## cuiter23

cel4145 said:


> That's perhaps one of the dumbest things I've ever heard about audio equipment. Are you sure Innerfidelity said it exactly like that? Measurements for amps/dacs can reveal a lot; they just don't always tell the whole story. But I can guarantee you if an amp has been measured to clip at 12 watts into 8 ohms, one's ears are going to confirm that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Watch his big sound 2015 video, he mentioned it in one of his videos regarding headphones and headphone amps. You will definitely hear the distortion if cranked up but I've yet to crank it up that high lol. The UDA-1 is by no means a powerful amplifier but the power it delivers is clean. The UDA-1 is built around a dual-mono design and its components used are of quality. I don't know why Sony chose to use the shameful JEITA test though.
  
 The ELAC B5 is a relatively low resistance and average sensitivity speaker. You wouldn't want to sit further than 2 metres away or else you'll get no bass, I know this from my experiences with bookshelf speakers.


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## cel4145

cuiter23 said:


> Watch his big sound 2015 video, he mentioned it in one of his videos regarding headphones and headphone amps.


 

Well, if he did in fact say that, you should know better and not repeat it. LOL




cuiter23 said:


> You will definitely hear the distortion if cranked up but I've yet to crank it up that high lol. The UDA-1 is by no means a powerful amplifier but the power it delivers is clean. The UDA-1 is built around a dual-mono design and its components used are of quality. I don't know why Sony chose to use the shameful JEITA test though.




A t-amp can deliver clean power at low wattage like that. 



cuiter23 said:


> The ELAC B5 is a relatively low resistance and average sensitivity speaker. You wouldn't want to sit further than 2 metres away or else you'll get no bass, I know this from my experiences with bookshelf speakers.




You've already decided he's buying the ELACs, huh? LOL

BTW: the B5s are 6 ohms. 8 ohms and 6 ohms are average, so not particularly "low resistance" for a speaker.


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## cuiter23

He says he got it, so I'm not sure if he implied the B5s.
  
 I've never really got into the measurement kind of things. Measurements for a lot of headphones are horrible... But they sound amazing.


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## TLN

KEF Q100 may be? 
 http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CE3LHQW/ref=psdc_172563_t1_B00EPDMDZ8


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## cel4145

tln said:


> KEF Q100 may be?
> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CE3LHQW/ref=psdc_172563_t1_B00EPDMDZ8




That's a good price for those. You should also look at the other speakers regularly recommended in that ~ $300 price range as best price/performance value: HSU HB1, Ascend Acoustic CBM-170 SE (I own these), EMP Tek R5Bi, and Chane A1RX-C. These are Internet direct speakers that are a fantastic value because they do not have to work in extra markup for a middle man to sell them to you. They are regularly regularly recommended over at AVS Forum and other A/V forums as competing with traditional speaker brands sold in brick and mortar stores for twice the price MSRP, and they have been for several years. 

This is why I've said there seems a lot of hype about the ELACs (which is common with the new FOTM). People are describing them as best ever speakers for the money. The hype seems to be from people comparing them to brick and mortar store speakers, not the actual contenders for best price/performance value in that price range; people upgrading from less expensive speakers; and/or people that are Andrew Jones fans (he's the designer). My sense is from the very few comparisons I have seen is that the E6s fit somewhere within that class of speakers by Ascend, HSU, EMP Tek, and Chane, which is echoed in this discussion: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-speakers/2142978-hsu-hb-1-mk2-vs-ascend-cbm-170-se-vs-elac-b6.html. 

I would suggest doing research over at AVS since AVS is to speakers and other home audio equipment as Head-Fi is to headphones: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-speakers/


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## cuiter23

tln said:


> KEF Q100 may be?
> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CE3LHQW/ref=psdc_172563_t1_B00EPDMDZ8


 
  
 Just buy one and test it. If you don't like them then return it. We can only tell you so much but you need to listen to them personally.
  
 What I can tell you is that I don't think you could go wrong with the B5, or Q100s since it's your first speaker (I can only recommend you these as they are the only one's I've heard) in your price range.
  
 I'm sure cel also has some good suggestions, they are seldom found where I live so I haven't auditioned them/ can't recommend them.


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## zackzack

M Audio & Audioeengine can be great desktop speakers but why these typically, typically have to look so uh-glay?


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## BigTerminator

zackzack said:


> M Audio & Audioeengine can be great desktop speakers but why these typically, typically have to look so uh-glay?


 
 Are Emotiva Airmotiv speakers ugly to you?


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## Spartoi

Anyone have experience with the Edifier Exclaim E10?  Would they be a better buy than the Creative T20 and T40?


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## brent75

I'm looking for some powered monitors to put on my office desk for casual listening. Mostly at ambient levels and predominantly downtempo EDM, jazz, classical and some occasional acoustic stuff. 90% without vocals because I don't want the distraction. Music comes out of a Macbook Air into a Micca OriGen and from there into whatever I buy. After tons of online research it seems like my best bets are PreSonus E4.5 ($159)...the Airmotiv 4s ($299)...and the Equator D5 ($399). Do any of these stand out over the others based on my desired uses + equipment?
  
 (I didn't include the JBL305s because they'll be too big of a footprint on the desk space I have, and I didn't include the Vanatoos because I don't feel I need to spend $500)


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## fuego

tln said:


> KEF Q100 may be?
> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CE3LHQW/ref=psdc_172563_t1_B00EPDMDZ8


 
 I have this set of speakers at home


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## murphythecat

new or used
  
 jbl lsr 305 or 308
 Yamaha hs7 or hs8


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## brent75

I ended up going with the Adam F5 for a great deal.


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## cel4145

I prefer the JBL's over the Yamahas.


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## paulguru

Anyone have Q-Acoustics 3010 or 3020 ?
 Some feedback about ?


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## genclaymore

murphythecat said:


> new or used
> 
> jbl lsr 305 or 308
> Yamaha hs7 or hs8


 
 If you check around you should be able to find some deals on the JBL LSR 305's on ebay or maybe amazon. Might be able to save some cash that way. I would say the JBL 305's but to be fair I have not used the yamaha's and the 308's was outside my price ranges at the time. the 305's are very wonderful studio monitor's.


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## paulguru

Excuse me guys
*Anyone know the Eve SC204* ?
  

  
  
*Im looking for* a musical sound, smooth and forgive, i would avoi a too analitic sound, tipical of studio monitors only for professional recording, but im interested only for listen the musics.
  
*1 )* Can be great for my tastes or not ?
 2 ) How is its sound signature ?
 3 ) How is compared to the famous Adam A3x ?


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## Scrimstar

What are the best speakers for ~$400, and should one use RCA, TRS, or XLR for quality and no feedback


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## semaj8james

No mention of Kanto here? Nice looking, compact, great sq speakers. Initially was unimpressed with the YU2s until they burnt in and then with a Sub8 added, oh man they were creamy. I preferred them over my M-Audio BX8A's almost always.


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## semaj8james

scrimstar said:


> What are the best speakers for ~$400, and should one use RCA, TRS, or XLR for quality and no feedback


 
 Consider M-Audio BX8 A/D2, BX5a, KRK Rokit, Audioengine speakers, Kanto speakers, etc. If you're okay with big as **** speakers, BX8As are great


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## Scrimstar

would the krk5 or krk6 be more appropriate for a 20 sq ft room? And what cables and sourcing should I get? I want to use TRS or XLR to avoid any kind of feedback. i also have an AT2050, Sennheiser hd600

 I was thinking of getting a schitt stack 2, and maybe a Focusrite Scarlett 6i6

 no clue on which cables are good


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## LouisLoh

Sorry for this noob question, but would my Chord Mojo be capable of driving a pair of passives like the Debut B6s? If not would it suffice as a pre-amp? And what should I get for an amp? Or should I get active speakers instead?


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## BigTerminator

All the Chord Mojo could do is act as a DAC, with volume control being done by windows. You do need a speakers amp, no headphone amp will do a speaker justice with appropriate amounts of power. 
  
 I would just recommend getting powered speakers. What's your budget and how big is your room?


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## TLN

Just FYI. I've got a pair of JBL LSR305 and they sound amazing. I'm using it with Audinst MX-1 DAC, with RCA-TRS cable. You will need a different cable (3.5 jack to TRS) but the rest is the same.


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## LouisLoh

bigterminator said:


> All the Chord Mojo could do is act as a DAC, with volume control being done by windows. You do need a speakers amp, no headphone amp will do a speaker justice with appropriate amounts of power.
> 
> I would just recommend getting powered speakers. What's your budget and how big is your room?


 

 Thanks for the reply. 
  
 I'm looking at a studio apartment and a budget of ~$500.


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## BigTerminator

I love my Emotiva's a lot. Maybe get the Airmotiv 6S if it will be a sizable room, and then later on get a subwoofer.


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## ruleof72

Best powered monitor under 7 inches wide?
  
 After a change in my work to a new company I am spending a lot more time working from home. That means I can now justify an upgrade in my computer audio system. I'd like to find a quality monitor for the desktop that is <$300-$350. The JBL LSR305's look great except for their size. I have fairly limited space and it looks like the 305's (at 9+ inches wide) might not fit. I could go larger but only if I get stands and set them up behind the desk which is not my preferred solution. My max speaker width looks to be about 7 inches and max depth of maybe 8-9 inches. 
  
 Any suggestions on possible candidates? I'll probably be connecting them to a Schiit modi DAC and the vast majority of listening will be nearfield. Music is a mix of classic rock, classical, jazz and blues.
  
 Thanks for the help!


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## cel4145

Check out the Emotiva Airmotiv 4S: https://emotiva.com/products/powered-monitors/speakers/airmotiv-4s


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## Randos

just curious has anyone used the creative gigaworks t40 and find them good, thinking of getting it.


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## radosuaf

I would recommend them ONLY if space is an issue. Otherwise - get some Edifiers.


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## Randos

radosuaf said:


> I would recommend them ONLY if space is an issue. Otherwise - get some Edifiers.


 
 the only edifiers i can get my hands on is the *Edifier R1700BT *and the *Edifier R1280T, *are any of them good ?


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## radosuaf

Both of them are fine, with the 1280s having a bit better value/price ratio - choose whichever you prefer.


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## LikesSlowCars

I'm contemplating buying used* 2x **Mackie HR624 mk2* speakers for around $350. Is that a smart move? Just curious on what you guys think. I'm contemplating pairing it with a USB DAC I have called "The Element" from JDS Labs. Which has RCA outputs. The price sounded way too cheap, but then I looked on ebay price history, and the norm is around 350-400 for a used pair of these $500 MSRP speakers.
  
 Supposedly a capacitor will stop working intermittently when you amp this speaker out, but I highly doubt it.
  
 Alternatively I was looking at buying 2 brand new Mackie MR5mk3 speakers. Although they don't have as many features.
  
 My room is kinda weird. I have a huge desk with a 55 inch curved 60 hz 4K TV. Kinda waiting for slow poke DisplayPort/HDMI to invent a new standard that will allow both GameSync, and 120 Hz minimum at 4K. I drive the TV right now with a 750 Ti, but I already have on order two Titan X video cards for SLI.
  
 The motherboard I'm using is the ASUS x99 Deluxe II. (Has a ALC1150 7.1 with 112dB SNR w/ gold plated jacks)


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## Randos

thanks for the reply i will look into it later.
  
 However my dad told me why dont check out the mackie Cr3 studio speakers has anyone use those one.


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## radosuaf

Don't go for anything smaller than 4 inch woofer.


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## Randos

ok is 3" that bad?


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## radosuaf

There is simply not enough bass below 4" (see T40s for example).


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## cel4145

I just compared the Mackie CR5BT with the JBL LSR305. No comparison. The LSR305 are a far better speaker. If you can swing a pair of LSR305, they are definitely worth it. Though the CR5BT wouldn't be bad with the current $50 rebate.


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## Randos

nice bought them to day and i like it sounds good


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## Flak

Has anyone heard the Swan/Hivi D1010IV?  It looks like they are on sale right now for $90, was going to get them as my first experience with studio monitors or something as a step up from the Logitech Z2300 I'm using now.


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## cel4145

Been comparing the Emotiva Airmotiv 5s with the JBL LSR305 trying to decide which to keep for a bedroom setup. I'd say that they are comparable in SQ for those that are considering these two. And you should be if shopping for monitors in the <$500 range


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## Flak

I ended up getting the Swan D1010IV for $104 shipped.  Will pair them with a Polk PSW10 I have laying around.


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## HiCZoK

Hi everyone.
I am yet to read through the whole topic but i recently moves and now my pc is in living room on black ikea malm desk. On desk is just fractal 3000 case on rhe right and 23inch iiyama screen so I like to keep thinga simple.
For Last years I was using 5.1 dt2200 system as 2.1 system. I have not connected this after moving since they have so many cables. Thats why I want 2.0

It have to be black, sound good and have volume knob. As in thread only active.

Price up to 100 but the room is only 20 sq meters so not big to fill.
How are this for a start:
Logitech z200, creative t20ii, t40ii and so on


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## GorPud1

Hi Guys, 
  
 I recently bought a pair of the audio engine A2+ 2-ways to use with my computer at home and I'm absolutely in love with. Crisp, clear and controlled sound and they look great too. They cost $250 and there's the option to get an additional sub woofer component if you fork out an extra $150 for the W3 wireless USB adapter. 
  
 The thing that makes these guys so great for the price is the digital-to-analog converter. This works by connecting them via usb instead of the usual 3.5mm output jack. The improvement in quality is extremely noticable. 
  
 I found them whilst scouring the review sites and came across this site:
  
 http://soundgenetics.com/best-computer-speakers/
  
 There's a few other speaker sets reviewed here and the reviewer helps explain the differences between the various products a lot which I found really helpful. I'm sure you might be able to find something that suits.
  
 Good luck!


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## radosuaf

No, no and no . Look for 4" (or bigger) studio monitors.


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## HiCZoK

I see. I was looking for something quite small.
Besidea I am not looking for monitors as I am not creating music and dont like flat sound.
For example i replaced brainwavz hm5 with porta pro because hm5 was too flat


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## radosuaf

It's easier to equalise the source with flat speakers than to correct strangely designed speakers. T20s and T40s have such a huge mid-bass spike that it's impossible to correct that.


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## conquerator2

Resurrecting this thread, I own the D5 and love them. Very large sweetspot, great and accurate tonality. Even harder to beat for the often discounted price and the freebies thrown in


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