# ASIO4All Explanation



## EnOYiN

[size=small]*Disclaimer: This article is partially outdated because there are newer and better versions of ASIO4All available right now. I will not continue to update this article because I lack the time (and the motivation) to do so.*[/size]

*Introduction:
*This post will tell you a bit about how the audio architectures of XP and Vista work. It is however mainly meant as a guide to set up ASIO4All in XP. I can not say how much of a difference installing ASIO will make in your system. Some of you might not be able to hear even the slightest difference while others will hear a clear improvement. Obviously the more resolving your system is the more likely it will be for you to hear a difference. I can hear a small improvement when using ASIO instead of DS.

 If you are using Vista I can't really recommend installing ASIO for playback solely any more because there are several tests which have shown that there is no audible difference between using the normal settings and using ASIO. (I'll try to find a decent link for you guys)

 If you think I wrongfully copied parts of other guides and/or websites do not hesitate to PM and I will change it. The main thing I have been trying to do here is organise some data for others so it will be easier to understand the benefits and drawbacks of using ASIO for playback in XP.

 I will start off with a bit of information and some terms I will be using throughout the rest of the guide. 

 Thank you for reading!
*

 Bit-perfect:*
 Bit-perfect is how the audio will stream to your device. By using this you will have a more true reproduction of the actual medium. So you will get the exact reproduction of everything which has been extracted or played from the CD. This will include every error which was on the CD originally. 
 The quality of a sound card can have an effect on the quality of the output, even with bit perfect playback enabled. The timing and/or jitter can vary between sound cards, usually with the lower end sound cards having a higher likely hood of jitter.
 The only thing changing this signal is your DAC. The quality of your DAC will still affect the actual output.


*Kmixer:*
 The KMixer is a part of Windows that enables your computer to take multiple audio sources and play them back at the same time and at the same bit rate. The KMixer is also how Windows handles your volume control. Regular CD audio is 44.1 kHz. Many times, due to poorly written drivers, sound cards that will interact with the KMixer will cause this 44.1kHz data to be resampled to 48kHz. Obviously this will result in an undesirable result when trying to achieve the utmost in sound quality. The mixing algorithm as implemented by Microsoft has been shown in many cases to only have a signal to noise ratio of about 92dB. CDs have a signal to noise ratio of about 96dB (technically 97.5dB). The KMixer effectively reduces the data from 16bit to 14 bit.
 To bypass the Windows KMixer you either need to use ASIO or Kernel Streaming.


*ASIO:*
 ASIO stands for Audio Stream Input Output

 ASIO is a professional audio standard that provides for a low-latency audio stream from the computer. ASIO bypasses the KMixer entirely. ASIO is used by the recording industry as a standard. You can get ASIO here: 
ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver

 There are other ASIO drivers than ASIO4All. Two of them are worth mentioning. USB-ASIO and ASIO2KS. Here are the links to their websites:
USB 2 Audio - low latency audio
ASIO2KS - Generic ASIO driver for WDM soundcards.

 USB-ASIO is selling a program which will provide true ASIO. This program costs €59 / $76. It is better than ASIO4ALL, but it is far from free. If you are thinking about using it, I can advice you to test it first. You can download a trial version from their website.

 Currently ASIO2KS is only available as beta-version. I have no idea whether this project is still alive or if it died a long time ago. The beta version does not provide true ASIO like USB-ASIO does. The beta-version runs 10 minutes without limitations. Afterwards every 30 seconds a one-second beep-tone will be played into all input and output channels.


*XP Audio:*
 Here is a simple picture of how the audio-architecture in XP works:








 As you can see only ASIO and OpenAL will go straight to the lowest level of driver and bypass everything else.


*Vista Audio:*






 (updated): I made a simplified picture of the Vista audio architecture to avoid further confusion about it. This picture shows just one audio application. What should be clear about this is that for every single audio application lauched a seperate WASAPI instance will be launced as well. The original version of this image can still be found in this thread on page 17.

 For people who are using either ASIO or OpenAL there will be no significant changes. However, there is quite the change in using Direct Sound. There is no possibility anymore to go straight from a Direct Sound application to the audio drivers or the hardware. This results in the following: no more hardware acceleration. The point of Direct Sound acceleration is to let the hardware process unmixed audio content. For more information you can go here. This link will take you to the Creative forums.

 The meaning of the abbreviations used in this model:
 WASAPI - Windows Audio Session API
 API - Application Programming Interface
 APO - Audio Processing Object
 CPT - Cross Process Transport
 KST - Kernel Streaming Transport

 Not all soundcards are capable of bit-perfect output. Some of them will change the information even when it’s delivered to them bit-perfect. There is nothing you can do about this other than buying another soundcard.

 You can adjust the volume when using ASIO. This will not affect the 'bit-perfectness' of your signal.


*Kernel Streaming:*
 Kernel Streaming is just about the same thing as ASIO. It is Microsoft’s answer for being able to play audio files in a bit perfect format on a Windows machine. Kernel Streaming makes efficient real-time streaming of audio possible. However, Kernel Streaming is not an industry standard. ASIO will have many more supported plugins available for various media players. Kernel Streaming requires less CPU time than the regular 'wave out' method.


*Setting Up ASIO4All:*
 Some soundcards have their own ASIO driver installed already. You should not install the driver again when this is the case. The cards that support ASIO natively are always better than cards which do not. True ASIO has no interference of the OS at all. You can skip this part and go on to to the part where the Foobar/WinAmp set-up is explained.

 I am going to tell you how to set up ASIO4All for bit-perfect playback. Note that this is not a setup for recording and also note that I will be using version 2.7 here.

 Start with installing ASIO4All. This shouldn’t be too hard. I expect you are all able to do this. I will continue with the configuration of ASIO4Alls Off-Line Settings. After you just installed the program the Off-Line Settings should look something like this: (it looks like this on my laptop)






 Now you are going to configure it for bit-perfect playback. After you did this it should look something like this:






 First click on advanced. Then make sure the following things are set to the right value.
 The latency should be on 2048.
 The latency compensation should be on 0.
 Leave “hardware buffering” unchecked.
 Set kernel buffers to 4.
 Leave the AC97 functions unchecked as well.

 Only enable the devices you want to use. I do not want to use the Realtek HDA, so I disabled it. I do want to use the USB-DAC, so I enabled that.


*Setting up Foobar with ASIO4All:*
 This part will explain you how to set up ASIO4All with Foobar. I am using version 0.9.4.2. of Foobar and version 2.7 of ASIO4All. 

 Download the plug-in for ASIO from this site.

 When you did this, unpack the file and place it in your components directory. Mine is called:
 C:\Program Files\foobar2000\components

 I am assuming you already installed ASIO4All like I explained above. Now you are going to File --> Preferences --> Output.

 There should be a tab called ASIO Virtual Devices. Select it and add a new virtual device. Once you did this edit ASIO4ALL v2.
 What you see now should look something like this:






 I want to activate my USB-DAC so I mapped left and right on there. Press save all and you are done.

 Go to the main output tab and select your output device. If you want to use ASIO4All then you should select the following:





 Select ASIO: ASIO4ALL v2 as output device.


*Setting up WinAmp with ASIO4All:*
 This part will explain you how to set up ASIO4All with WinAmp. This is so easy that it makes me wonder why I even use Foobar. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Download the plug-in for ASIO from this site. There is also another plug-in for ASIO. Some people haven't been able to get things to work with the plug-in which is linked here, so I will give you a link to a post made by Terry which contains a link to another plug-in. It's located here.

 Install the plug-in. 

 Start WinAmp and go to Options --> Preferences --> Plug-ins --> Output.
 Select ASIO4All and press close. It should look like this:
 Note:I uninstalled all the other output plug-ins. You do not have to do this for ASIO to work.






 Now restart WinAmp and everything should work fine.


*AC97 Troubleshooting*
 Always Resample 44.1<->48 kHz
 ASIO4ALL can do real time resampling of 44.1 kHz audio to/from 48 kHz. Resampling will automatically take place whenever ASIO4ALL is opened for 44.1 kHz and the WDM driver does not support this sample rate. There may, however, be instances in which case an AC97 will support 44.1 kHz by resampling internally. More often than not, however, AC97 resampling quality is extremely poor and/or prone to stability issues. To work around this, you can enable this option. With at least one incarnation of the SoundMax WDM driver (smwdm.sys), this option absolutely must be enabled in order to make it work at 44.1 kHz at all.

 Force WDM driver to 16 Bit
 This option only has an effect if the supported bit depth of the WDM driver is larger than 16, but less than 24. Some AC97 devices report e.g. 20 Bits resolution but cannot actually be opened for more than 16 Bits resolution. Should this be the case on your system, this option provides a workaround. Originally, this was introduced as a workaround for an issue with the SigmaTel AC97 WDM driver.



 WEEHOO. You have just installed ASIO4All. If you’ve got any problems with it you can look them up in the instruction manual or post here in this thread.


*FAQ:*

 Q: Will I still have bit-perfect playback when using DSPs?
 A: No. It's all lost. Down the drain. (In my opinion however, an EQ might make more of a difference than bit-perfect output.)

 Q: My .wav file doesn’t work. Why Oh Why?
 A: A .wav can only be played bit-perfect if it has the following specifications:
 - Stereo format
 - PCM audio data
 - Min: 16-bits Max: 32-bits.
 - 44.1, 48, 96 kHz

 Q: My volume is not what it’s supposed to be. How can I fix this?
 A: Windows is changing the volume sometimes, just for fun. You can change this in the menu “Sounds and audio devices” in your configuration window.

 Q: Does device X work with ASIO?
 A: I simply do not know everything. I suggest you look up the specifications on the particular device to see if it supports ASIO natively and if so just download the ASIO plug-in for Foobar. If it does not support ASIO natively than I suggest you download ASIO4All and the plug-in and try that. The only way to be sure is to try.



*Resources:*
FAQ: What is Bit-Perfect? - MP3Car.com
Winamp 2 Kernel Streaming Output Plugin - Hydrogenaudio Forums
Perfect Volume Control? - Hydrogenaudio Forums
Envy24HT-S - The Definitive Source - AVS Forum
USB 2 Audio - low latency audio
ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver

 Suggestions are welcome.

 Cheers.


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## EnOYiN

The images are not working like I want them to. Can someone tell me how I am suppose to post pictures in this thread? Thank You.


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## agile_one

I believe pasted images are limited in size. Best way to get images in a post is to get them on a server somewhere, then link to them with an html tag (this is automated with the 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 image icon when editing or creating posts.


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## EnOYiN

I used that but the images are only links instead of the real images.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Anyways, everything is working like it should now. Enjoy the thread!


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## socrates63

Thanks for organizing the info and posting here. It'll come in handy when I reinstall the OS on my notebook later this week.


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## socrates63

.


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## EnOYiN

I made this thread because a lot of people asked about this subject. And I rather make a good thread than explaining it over and over again. Thx.


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## Cid

You might want to include that if your soundcard supports ASIO you don't need to use ASIO4ALL (Just the foobar plugin is enough). I think that's confusing a lot of people.


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## agile_one

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I made this thread because a lot of people asked about this subject. And I rather make a good thread than explaining it over and over again. Thx._

 

Excellent job, EnOYiN. This should benefit any first time user who doesn't have patience or experience to diy.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Cid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You might want to include that if your soundcard supports ASIO you don't need to use ASIO4ALL (Just the foobar plugin is enough). I think that's confusing a lot of people._

 

Good point, Cid. I believe many are confused by this, and start messing about with ASIO4ALL when they don't need to.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Cid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You might want to include that if your soundcard supports ASIO you don't need to use ASIO4ALL (Just the foobar plugin is enough). I think that's confusing a lot of people._

 

Added it. Thank you for pointing that out.


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## floydenheimer

I nominate this for sticky-ization.

 Great guide!


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## xenithon

Nice post here! It might be worth adding to that, as good as ASIO4ALL (and ASIO2KS) are, they are still wrappers which at some point use the OS audio stack. If your device supports true ASIO it would be superior as it allows the application to talk directly to the hardware, bypassing any kernel interference.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *floydenheimer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I nominate this for sticky-ization.

 Great guide!_

 

I think it's way to early for something like that. There should at least be a winamp section. (which I am working on right now) And some troubleshooting/FAQ kinda thingemabob thingie.

 Thank you either way.


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## floydenheimer

Sure it isn't all-encompassing, but it's easy to follow and answers an oft-asked question. More work can be done to improve it pre or post-sticky.


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## zyxwvutsr

When I start playing music on winamp through the asio plugin (otachan), the asio4all (v2.7) offline settings control panel says that my alien dac is "beyond logic". Is this normal? everything seems to be working fine, and the volume control in windows doesn't affect the volume level.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zyxwvutsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When I start playing music on winamp through the asio plugin (otachan), the asio4all (v2.7) offline settings control panel says that my alien dac is "beyond logic". Is this normal? everything seems to be working fine, and the volume control in windows doesn't affect the volume level._

 

This is indeed normal. When using kernel streaming you can only access the device once. Anything else trying to get information from the device will be ignored. This has mainly to do with Asio trying to get around the OS but using the OS to access the device.

 Hope I made something clear there. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Clear anwer: It's normal.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *floydenheimer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sure it isn't all-encompassing, but it's easy to follow and answers an oft-asked question. More work can be done to improve it pre or post-sticky. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Luckily it wasn't made to be all-encompassing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edot: I am still working on it though. It will become a more encompassing.


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## zyxwvutsr

After some more tinkering, I noticed that I could still change the volume through the windows volume control by adjusting the master volume while using ASIO. Changing the volume in winamp and adjusting the wave volume has no effect though.
 If I want to output bitperfect, should I just set the master volume to maximum? Or am I completely misunderstanding the problem?


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## shoenberg3

I finally got my bithead to work with the ASIO4ALL! But there is still a small problem. When the music becomes quiet (or just before it starts) I can hear a high-pitch noise. By playing with the low-gain/high-gain switch on the bithead, and volume control, i minimized this tone to quiet levels. But it is still there... 

 BTW, will EQ defeat the purpose of ASIO?


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## madwolfa

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zyxwvutsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After some more tinkering, I noticed that I could still change the volume through the windows volume control by adjusting the master volume while using ASIO. Changing the volume in winamp and adjusting the wave volume has no effect though.
 If I want to output bitperfect, should I just set the master volume to maximum? Or am I completely misunderstanding the problem?_

 

Yeah, I have same kind of question, as there's still a working volume bar control in FB2k and I was wondering if it affects the quality in any way.. for now I've just put it to MAX (0.0dB).


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zyxwvutsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After some more tinkering, I noticed that I could still change the volume through the windows volume control by adjusting the master volume while using ASIO. Changing the volume in winamp and adjusting the wave volume has no effect though.
 If I want to output bitperfect, should I just set the master volume to maximum? Or am I completely misunderstanding the problem?_

 

You can adjust the volume without the signal changing. You will still have bit-perfect playback.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shoenberg3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I finally got my bithead to work with the ASIO4ALL! But there is still a small problem. When the music becomes quiet (or just before it starts) I can hear a high-pitch noise. By playing with the low-gain/high-gain switch on the bithead, and volume control, i minimized this tone to quiet levels. But it is still there... 

 BTW, will EQ defeat the purpose of ASIO?_

 

Err.. I haven't got a TBH myself but I might be able to think of a few things that might be wrong.

 1. You might be hearing a harddrive or another component (fan maybe) in your computer. USB devices sometimes do have this problem. Take it up with headroom. They might have a solution for it.

 2. It could be that your are hearing white noise. If so this is caused by cheap components in the the TBH. I can't imagine that headroom put really expensive components in a $200 amp. (no offense - I think the TBH is a great amp) Once again. Take it up with headroom.

 3. The Asio driver does not support the TBH well. Take it up with the guy who made asio. There is a forum on the asio4all website. You can post your problem there.

 I think it has to do with either the first or the second thing I described. So you can try asking Tyll or someone else of headroom. Maybe they've got a solution for you.

 EQ does indeed alter the signal. It will not be bit-perfect anymore. It might however not even be audible so if you think you need an EQ then just use it. If however you really want to use bit-perfect playback you can not use EQ.

 Edit: Some soundcards have their own EQ. If this EQ is placed "after" the DAC you can use it without losing any quality since it is only changing the analog signal. This is not common for a soundcard though. Most soundcards have their EQ placed "before" the DAC.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xenithon* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nice post here! It might be worth adding to that, as good as ASIO4ALL (and ASIO2KS) are, they are still wrappers which at some point use the OS audio stack. If your device supports true ASIO it would be superior as it allows the application to talk directly to the hardware, bypassing any kernel interference._

 

I thought about it for a while. And this is what I came up with:

 If you do not own a card which supports true asio you're ****** either way. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So your only option is to install a virtual device like asio4all. I will edit my post to make that a bit clearer though. Thanks for pointing it out.


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## cooperpwc

My Total Bithead also had never worked well with asio4all and I had given up on it and gone back to DS. I very much appreciate this thread which I have bookmarked. My Bithead is in for service but as soon as I get it back I will apply your knowledge and post back on how these settings work out.


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Total Bithead also had never worked well with asio4all and I had given up on it and gone back to DS. I very much appreciate this thread which I have bookmarked. My Bithead is in for service but as soon as I get it back I will apply your knowledge and post back on how these settings work out._

 

I am working on this thread right now so do not be surprised to see some sudden changes. I hope you will get your TBH working.

 Good luck.


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## xenithon

Quote:


 I thought about it for a while. And this is what I came up with:
 If you do not own a card which supports true asio you're ****** either way. So your only option is to install a virtual device like asio4all. 
 

Lol....point taken, but not entirely true. There is the commerical USB driver from USB-Audio, which replaces the generic USB driver and allows the application to talk directly to the hardware, bypassing the kernel, EVEN if the hardware does not have its own ASIO driver. Seems to give very good results, but I think it has limited compatibility (i.e., will not work on ALL devices with USB input). I think I will be trying it out (trial version available) and see how it compares to digital input.

 Cheers,
 X


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xenithon* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lol....point taken, but not entirely true. There is the commerical USB driver from USB-Audio, which replaces the generic USB driver and allows the application to talk directly to the hardware, bypassing the kernel, EVEN if the hardware does not have its own ASIO driver. Seems to give very good results, but I think it has limited compatibility (i.e., will not work on ALL devices with USB input). I think I will be trying it out (trial version available) and see how it compares to digital input.

 Cheers,
 X_

 

Do you happen to have a link to that? I am interested in trying that.


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## xenithon

Indeed. USB-Audio. You can download a trial for whicever OS you use which I believe beeps every 30 seconds. If you buy it you get the unlocking code which eliminates the beeps and gives access to future updates IIRC.


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## EnOYiN

Thanks. I am trying it right now.


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## EnOYiN

I made a mistake since I am too, learning while I go. I am sorry if I confused some people with previous answers.

 You CAN adjust the volume and can apply EAX effects. This will not affect the digital output signal.

 Once again. Sorry for that.

 Edit: I edited the post about the volume question above.


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## Andrew_WOT

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shoenberg3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I finally got my bithead to work with the ASIO4ALL! But there is still a small problem. When the music becomes quiet (or just before it starts) I can hear a high-pitch noise. By playing with the low-gain/high-gain switch on the bithead, and volume control, i minimized this tone to quiet levels. But it is still there... 

 BTW, will EQ defeat the purpose of ASIO?_

 

Dirty USB Power

 Try this
http://www.headphone.com/products/he...al-bithead.php
  Quote:


 Total BitHead filters, re-regulates, and runs of the computers USB power bus. If, however, you are of an audiophile mind, turn the power switch on and the Total BitHead’s digital-to-analog converter (DAC) and power amp section will run off the internal batteries for ultra-clean performance and lower power drain on your computer.


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## lessblue

This thread is much appreciated. Thanks EnOYiN for putting it together and everyone else who is adding to it.


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## shoenberg3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Err.. I haven't got a TBH myself but I might be able to think of a few things that might be wrong.

 1. You might be hearing a harddrive or another component (fan maybe) in your computer. USB devices sometimes do have this problem. Take it up with headroom. They might have a solution for it.

 2. It could be that your are hearing white noise. If so this is caused by cheap components in the the TBH. I can't imagine that headroom put really expensive components in a $200 amp. (no offense - I think the TBH is a great amp) Once again. Take it up with headroom.

 3. The Asio driver does not support the TBH well. Take it up with the guy who made asio. There is a forum on the asio4all website. You can post your problem there.

 I think it has to do with either the first or the second thing I described. So you can try asking Tyll or someone else of headroom. Maybe they've got a solution for you.

 EQ does indeed alter the signal. It will not be bit-perfect anymore. It might however not even be audible so if you think you need an EQ then just use it. If however you really want to use bit-perfect playback you can not use EQ.

 Edit: Some soundcards have their own EQ. If this EQ is placed "after" the DAC you can use it without losing any quality since it is only changing the analog signal. This is not common for a soundcard though. Most soundcards have their EQ placed "before" the DAC._

 

Hey thanks for your reply. I am just baffled at why the Bithead has this pitch only with ASIO; it works completely fine with DS (it does not play with KS however).


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shoenberg3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey thanks for your reply. I am just baffled at why the Bithead has this pitch only with ASIO; it works completely fine with DS (it does not play with KS however)._

 

Thanks for asking. I put the DSP question in the FAQ.

  Quote:


 This thread is much appreciated. Thanks EnOYiN for putting it together and everyone else who is adding to it. 
 

You better appreciate it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 @ Xenithon
 I tried USB-ASIO. It works well with my Porta Corda MkIII-USB. However I doubt if it's worth the extra $76. Maybe ASIO4All comes up with the same thing. Let's hope for the best since I can't afford to spend so much money on a program which has a free equivalent which is nearly as good. ( the beeps make you not want to buy it - bloody annoying 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )


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## GreatDane

Hi EnOYiN,

 I followed your guide and did everything(I think...I have Asio4all and the plug-in installed in foobar components) and get to the point where I must map the ouput, here:






 ...but my "USB audio DAC" doesn't show in the box. I'm using a Porta Corda USB DAC/amp and it only works when I select " DS :USB audio DAC" in the ouput device box.

 Do you have any advice?


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## LFC_SL

My Edirol comes with Asio drivers, so I don't need Asio4All, but I messed about with it for my onboard laptop sound card as per 1st post. For some reason it must have convert 44.1 <> 48 switched on otherwise Foobar won't play files. No biggie seeing as I have a external sound card, just curious


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## agile_one

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...but my "USB audio DAC" doesn't show in the box. I'm using a Porta Corda USB DAC/amp and it only works when I select " DS :USB audio DAC" in the ouput device box.

 Do you have any advice?_

 

Did you set up asio4all with the Porta Corda USB *before* you started foobar? If not, that is your problem. Close foobar, have the Porta Corda hooked up to the USB and turned on, then go into asio4all and *Enable* the USB device, and *Disable* any other sound devices asio4all sees. 

 Then close asio4all, and restart foobar - you should now see the Porta Corda as a device, unless its USB drivers just don't play nice with asio4all.

 Good luck.


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## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *agile_one* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Did you set up asio4all with the Porta Corda USB *before* you started foobar? If not, that is your problem..._

 

*[size=small]BINGO![/size]*





 I was hoping it was something as simple as that.

 Thank you !


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## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LFC_SL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Edirol comes with Asio drivers, so I don't need Asio4All, but I messed about with it for my onboard laptop sound card as per 1st post. For some reason it must have convert 44.1 <> 48 switched on otherwise Foobar won't play files. No biggie seeing as I have a external sound card, just curious_

 

Some soundcards have a problem using ASIO. This is why the fucntion is there. I am working on a part that explains these options. Sadly I do not have unlimited time to add things so it will take a while. I am editing as fast as I can. Thanks for pointing it out. 

  Quote:


 BINGO!

 I was hoping it was something as simple as that.

 Thank you ! 
 

I am not sure about the order in which I described it. And I did not yet describe that you will have to add a new device before you can edit it. If the order of some things seem wrong to you somehow please tell me so I can edit it. When I install everything again it will automatically add device and use them and map the devices. So I can't see in what order you will have to install things. Thanks in advance.


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## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_


 I am not sure about the order in which I described it. And I did not yet describe that you will have to add a new device before you can edit it. If the order of some things seem wrong to you somehow please tell me so I can edit it. When I install everything again it will automatically add device and use them and map the devices. So I can't see in what order you will have to install things. Thanks in advance._

 

It all seems to be working properly and i'm using iTunes w/ foobar. 

 I see that you're using the same amp that I am??? with your PC. I'm trying to understand just how using this "bit perfect" output will give me better SQ into the Porta-Corda MkIII-USB. Is this a correct way to use foobar with ASIO outputing the signal via USB as I am?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It all seems to be working properly and i'm using iTunes w/ foobar. 

 I see that you're using the same amp that I am??? with your PC. I'm trying to understand just how using this "bit perfect" output will give me better SQ into the Porta-Corda MkIII-USB. Is this a correct way to use foobar with ASIO outputing the signal via USB as I am?_

 

I do use the same amp as you do. The Porta Corda MkIII-USB. You will indeed get better SQ by using ASIO because you are streaming through a virtual device instead of the Kmixer which is the windows default.

  Quote:


 The KMixer is a part of Windows that enables your computer to take multiple audio sources and play them back at the same time and at the same bit rate. The KMixer is also how Windows handles your volume control. Regular CD audio is 44.1 kHz. Many times, due to poorly written drivers, sound cards that will interact with the KMixer will cause this 44.1kHz data to be resampled to 48kHz. Obviously this will result in an undesirable result when trying to achieve the utmost in sound quality. The mixing algorithm as implemented by Microsoft has been shown in many cases to only have a signal to noise ratio of about 92dB. CDs have a signal to noise ratio of about 96dB (technically 97.5dB). The KMixer effectively reduces the data from 16bit to 14 bit.
 To bypass the Windows KMixer you either need to use ASIO or Kernel Streaming. 
 

This part was taken fromt the original post. It says that the Kmixer will resample your data even if this is not necessary. Resampling (all resampling - upsampling, downsampling - sampling to the side if you like 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) will decrease the SQ. The Kmixer even resamples when you change the volume. ( I am talking about the the slider that says "wave" - not the one that says "volume") You want to avoid all the resampling since you do not have a need for it. You want a file which has 16-bits and 44.1 kHz to play like this. You do not want it to play like 14-bit / 48 kHz. If it does play like the latter it will have a decrease in SQ since it has been resampled. (without the need for it)

 ASIO4All is not the best way of doing this. There is a better program right now. It's called USB-ASIO. There is a link in the original post. This program will provide true ASIO for USB devices. It does not use a virtual device like ASIO4All does. By creating the virtual device it will still have to use the OS. The main downside of USB-ASIO is that it costs $76USB. I wrote a little piece about it in the original post.

 I am sorry if you missed some of these things. Some things have been edited after you read it most likely. Thanks for replying. I hope I made some things clear here since it is kinda hard to explain all this in plain english. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Here is the answer in plain english: YES!


----------



## Yen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ASIO4All is not the best way of doing this. There is a better program right now. It's called USB-ASIO. There is a link in the original post. This program will provide true ASIO for USB devices. It does not use a virtual device like ASIO4All does. By creating the virtual device it will still have to use the OS. The main downside of USB-ASIO is that it costs $76USB. I wrote a little piece about it in the original post._

 

Does it work with AlienDAC?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Yen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does it work with AlienDAC? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It probably does. ( I assume you mean USB-ASIO) The best way to check this is to grab the trail version from the website of USB-ASIO. You should try it first before buying it in my opinion. If you think it's worth the $76USD than you can always buy it afterwards. Better save than sorry.

 I do know for a fact that AlienDAC supports kernel streaming.


----------



## Suzuka

How do I know if I already have Asio or not? I have X-fi card xtremegamer by creative.


----------



## Suzuka

I am guessing x-fi supports asio, I installed asio component to foo bar but all I got was this, and got 24bit locked in.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Suzuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How do I know if I already have Asio or not? I have X-fi card xtremegamer by creative._

 

 Quote:


 Technical Specifications

 24-bit Analog-to-Digital conversion of analog inputs at 96kHz sample rate

 24-bit Digital-to-Analog conversion of digital sources at 96kHz to analog 7.1 speaker output

 24-bit Digital-to-Analog conversion of stereo digital sources at 192kHz to stereo output

 16-bit to 24-bit recording sampling rates: 8, 11.025, 16, 22.05, 24, 32, 44.1, 48 and 96kHz

 ASIO 2.0 support at 16-bit/44.1kHz, 16-bit/48kHz, 24-bit/44.1kHz 24-bit/48kHz and 24-bit/96kHz with direct monitoring

 Enhanced SoundFont support at up to 24-bit resolution 
 

I think it does. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The easiest way to check this is to install the ASIO plug-in in Foobar or whatever you are using and see if your soundcard produces any sound. If it does then it supports ASIO.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Suzuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am guessing x-fi supports asio, I installed asio component to foo bar but all I got was this, and got 24bit locked in._

 

You can change this on the menu of X-Fi itself. If you want 16-bits you've got to select it there.


----------



## Suzuka

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can change this on the menu of X-Fi itself. If you want 16-bits you've got to select it there._

 

Do I need to change it though? isn't 24 bit better or same thing anyway?

 edit: another question., about volume control. Do I need to keep it maxed? Meaning both in foobar and windows volume control knob or it doesn't matter? I can control my volume from my speaker pre amp so, was wondering if keeping preset windows volume affects anything, and if it does, at what do I need to keep it.


----------



## Yen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It probably does. ( I assume you mean USB-ASIO) The best way to check this is to grab the trail version from the website of USB-ASIO. You should try it first before buying it in my opinion. If you think it's worth the $76USD than you can always buy it afterwards. Better save than sorry.

 I do know for a fact that AlienDAC supports kernel streaming._

 

Yeah, I mean USB-ASIO.

 I did download the demo, and during installation it required to plug the DAC and the software recognized the DAC. Everything worked well.

 I will test it now, but #"%¤%#¤ the 30 sec beep of this demo is annoying...


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Suzuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Do I need to change it though? isn't 24 bit better or same thing anyway?

 edit: another question., about volume control. Do I need to keep it maxed? Meaning both in foobar and windows volume control knob or it doesn't matter? I can control my volume from my speaker pre amp so, was wondering if keeping preset windows volume affects anything, and if it does, at what do I need to keep it._

 

If all your files are 24-bit you shouldn't change it. However I guess they are not. (I am pretty good at guessing) Most files are 16-bit since they have been extracted from CDs. CD = 16-bit. Because of this mp3 = 16-bit and FLAC = 16-bit and everything else you extract from CDs is 16-bit. To get bit-perfect output you will need to set your output to 16-bit.

  Quote:


 Q: Will I be able to maintain bit-perfect playback when I am adjusting the volume?
 A: Yup. 
 

It's in the FAQ but I only added it recently so maybe it wasn't there when you read it. The digital signal does not change when adjusting the volume.

 However, I think you should use max volume to get better quality. This has nothing to do with a bit-perfect output but with the way your cmoy amplifies the signal. (assuming that you mean cmoy when you said preamp) I am not sure about this since I never used anything else than USB output. I am sure there are other people who do know this for sure. As long as you do not get any distortion I would set your volume to max untill you know for sure.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Yen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, I mean USB-ASIO.

 I did download the demo, and during installation it required to plug the DAC and the software recognized the DAC. Everything worked well.

 I will test it now, but #"%¤%#¤ the 30 sec beep of this demo is annoying... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I'd give at least $5USD to make it stop. Sadly that's not enough.


----------



## Yen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'd give at least $5USD to make it stop. Sadly that's not enough. _

 

Dunno is it better or worse, but USB-ASIO seems to widen the soundstage a tad and brings out more details. The bass of my DT880s have more body.

 But definately a good thing to pass through windows mixer. The price is however really high, compared to the "improvements" and free ASIO4ALL...

 EDIT: 

 Listened to Matt Mays & El Torpedo - "Cocaine Cowgirl". Result: OMG the highs! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The price came a bit closer to acceptable...


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Yen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dunno is it better or worse, but USB-ASIO seems to widen the soundstage a tad and brings out more details. The bass of my DT880s have more body.

 But definately a good thing to pass through windows mixer. The price is however really high, compared to the "improvements" and free ASIO4ALL...

 EDIT: 

 Listened to Matt Mays & El Torpedo - "Cocaine Cowgirl". Result: OMG the highs! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The price came a bit closer to acceptable... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, the advantage is definitely there. USB-ASIO actually bypasses everything and goes straight to the audio device. In Vista this will be really interesting because there are even more mixers and other APOs for a signal to go through. I added a picture to the original post to make it clearer.

 Just start listening to Britney Spears and you will save yourself $75.


----------



## hithere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Suzuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am guessing x-fi supports asio, I installed asio component to foo bar but all I got was this, and got 24bit locked in. 




_

 


 Suzka, you don't need anything special to get bit-perfect playback on the X-fi. Go into "Audio Creation Mode", select "output" (I think that's it, it's on the lower left of the Audio Creation Mode control panel) then select "bit matched playback" at whatever the bitrate is of your source (44.1 khz for CD, FLAC, mp3 from CD sources). 

 Be aware all eq functions and software volume control will go away...but that's what you want...you want to control volume and eq in the analog domain, to avoid having to resample and losing information in the process. Not only are you avoiding the horrible re-sampling done in k-mixer, but you're avoiding resampling altogether (hopefully you're using the analog volume on an external amplifier).

 You can use ASIO to achieve bit-perfect playback, but ASIO != bit perfect. Often, ASIO is simply used to handle resampling outside of Windows K-mixer, or to provide low latency (for applications where latency is a factor) to recording devices and the like. To have bit perfect, you have to have a soundcard or device that doesn't internally re-sample to 48 khz as a hardware function. Most Creative Labs soundcards prior to X-Fi, and the vast majority of USB soundcards are worthless when it comes to trying to achieve bit-perfect playback, because they resample to 48khz irregardless of how you feed them (If you own an Audigy 2 NX, Extigy, or Turtle Beach Roadie, I don't think there's anything you can do to achieve bit-perfect sound from 44.1 sources...you could, however, perform software resampling of your files outside of k-mixer, IIRC). If you want a cheap means to get bit-perfect playback from a PCI soundcard and stream it digitally to an external decoder/reciever via optical, then check out the Chaintech AV-710. It's $25.

 I believe it's not an issue in Vista because the new version of k-mixer simply uses floating point math to determine the optimum numbers to send out in the resulting digital stream, when you're doing something like asking windows to control volume or eq. Yes, there can be numeric differences in the result, but these differences are well, well below the level of human hearing, and this process is nothing like the butchery exhibited by k-mixer. For handling audio, Vista is a fine craftsman where XP is a hamfisted dolt.


----------



## tbritton

I'm lost in one regard. Why does resampling to a higher bit rate negatively affect sound quality? Rounding errors? Phase errors? Nyquist errors and jitter? How?

 I hope we are not confusing sampling rate (number of samples per second) with bit depth (16-bit vs 24-bit vs 32-bit) - using a larger "word" size should not resample anything, should it, but would merely fit the top 16 bits up front into the 24-bit word, right? The extra bit depth is very useful for performing DSP calculations with greater accuracy, so I certainly hope it is considered a good thing, especially since every single professional grade plug-in performs a bit-depth conversion upwards to 24-bit or 32-bit before applying its DSP algorithms (some automatically converting back down to 16-bit as an option afterwards). The bit depth permits finer variation between the sampled levels, since it permits many more numerical values, being a higher bit-depth word.

 Terry

 PS - I do see the value of avoiding resampling down to 15-bits by windows, and the benefits of ASIO there and elsewhere, just missing why the Creative Labs cards of yore that always resampled up to 48 were considered troublesome.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I do use the same amp as you do. The Porta Corda MkIII-USB. You will indeed get better SQ by using ASIO because you are streaming through a virtual device instead of the Kmixer which is the windows default...


 I am sorry if you missed some of these things. Some things have been edited after you read it most likely. Thanks for replying. I hope I made some things clear here since it is kinda hard to explain all this in plain english. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Here is the answer in plain english: YES!_

 

Thanks and I appreciate your time on this topic, seeing this thread got me to finally try ASIO with foobar.

 I plan to compare the ASIO to the "stock" SQ.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks and I appreciate your time on this topic, seeing this thread got me to finally try ASIO with foobar.

 I plan to compare the ASIO to the "stock" SQ._

 

Thx m8.

 @ Terry

 I expected someone to show up with that question. If I described some things not exactly as I should have to be exactly correct I did it to make this thread readable and to keep it somewhat more simple.

 Now, for the answer. Resampling is not necessarily a bad thing. Not at all. Conventional resampling however will never increase the SQ and if done by Windows it will actually decrease the SQ. ( I am talking about bitdepth here) You are aware of this ofcourse.

 If the resampling is done by a good soundcard like some X-Fis this should work really well. The main problem however is that, when using DS, the Kmixer allready resampled the bitdepth. Only afterwards the X-Fi will resample the signal which has already been set to 15-bit. (for example)

 If you are using ASIO all the resampling will be done by the soundcard. (driver) And then there is no problem at all.

 The new audio-architecture which is implemented in Vista will maybe present a problem for Creative. I am not sure whether they made a driver they are happy with or not.

 Here is a link about resampling. According to Creative they will be able to make a better SQ than the original using some advanced resampling techniques.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...tive-x-fi.html

 And another one providing some information about the Vista audio-architecture.
http://forums.creative.com/creativel...essage.id=1694

 In short: Resampling wouldn't be a problem if only the drivers used to do this in Windows would be better. I do not expect Microsoft to change this anymore since they, most likely, will concentrate on Vista now.

 I hope this answer satisfies you a bit.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thx m8.


 If the resampling is done by a good soundcard like some X-Fis this should work really well. The main problem however is that, when using DS, the Kmixer allready resampled the bitdepth. Only afterwards the X-Fi will resample the signal which has already been set to 15-bit. (for example)

 If you are using ASIO all the resampling will be done by the soundcard. (driver) And then there is no problem at all._

 

You can always use software resampler like this one http://www.mega-nerd.com/SRC/fb2k.html to avoid all resampling woes, hardware or kmixer based.


----------



## tbritton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thx m8.

 @ Terry

 I expected someone to show up with that question. If I described some things not exactly as I should have to be exactly correct I did it to make this thread readable and to keep it somewhat more simple.

 Now, for the answer. Resampling is not necessarily a bad thing. Not at all. Conventional resampling however will never increase the SQ and if done by Windows it will actually decrease the SQ. ( I am talking about bitdepth here) You are aware of this ofcourse.

 If the resampling is done by a good soundcard like some X-Fis this should work really well. The main problem however is that, when using DS, the Kmixer allready resampled the bitdepth. Only afterwards the X-Fi will resample the signal which has already been set to 15-bit. (for example)

 If you are using ASIO all the resampling will be done by the soundcard. (driver) And then there is no problem at all.

 The new audio-architecture which is implemented in Vista will maybe present a problem for Creative. I am not sure whether they made a driver they are happy with or not.

 Here is a link about resampling. According to Creative they will be able to make a better SQ than the original using some advanced resampling techniques.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...tive-x-fi.html

 And another one providing some information about the Vista audio-architecture.
http://forums.creative.com/creativel...essage.id=1694

 In short: Resampling wouldn't be a problem if only the drivers used to do this in Windows would be better. I do not expect Microsoft to change this anymore since they, most likely, will concentrate on Vista now.

 I hope this answer satisfies you a bit._

 

Sure, EnOYiN, I understood the benefit of avoiding letting Windows get its mits on the signal. As you felt might be coming across, there was a general impression that all Creative cards that upsampled were "bad" (they did this to match the audio to their soundfont standards, as one reason, and because for a time there was a popular movement in favor of 48 over 44.1 for any card that did recording, and for direct support of SPDIF.) If Windows gives even the old AWE-32 a good signal, it can do a fine job with it - as fine as one usually would need (though its digital out for some reason had worse distortion specs than the analog out! But we're talking inaudible differences there.)

 Anyway, this is a great article (and is evolving nicely!) and I hope it will get everyone to using this little piece of software! 

 (BTW, DTS stands for "Digital Theater Systems" sound.) http://www.google.com/search?client=...=Google+Search

 Terry


----------



## Joshatdot

SB Live! 5.1 (SB0100), latest drivers from Creative (5.12.2.252), Foobar2000 v0942, ASIO4All v2 (ASIO Virtual Devices), 

 SB Live! Audio [9000] 1 - 32 bit - Left
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 2 - 32 bit - Right
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 3 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 4 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 5 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 6 - 32 bit - <None>

 + and - in Foobar works volume fine, Windoze WAV/MP3 Volume does not work ... does that mean I got it working correctly? And the Offline settings are what you said to do.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbritton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_(BTW, DTS stands for "Digital Theater Systems" sound.) http://www.google.com/search?client=...=Google+Search

 Terry_

 

Yeah I knew that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Quote:


 SB Live! 5.1 (SB0100), latest drivers from Creative (5.12.2.252), Foobar2000 v0942, ASIO4All v2 (ASIO Virtual Devices),

 SB Live! Audio [9000] 1 - 32 bit - Left
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 2 - 32 bit - Right
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 3 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 4 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 5 - 32 bit - <None>
 SB Live! Audio [9000] 6 - 32 bit - <None>

 + and - in Foobar works volume fine, Windoze WAV/MP3 Volume does not work ... does that mean I got it working correctly? And the Offline settings are what you said to do. 
 

I guess it does. You can always try to set the latency and buffers really low to check it. If you will get distortion then it most likely works.

 The best way is still to play a DTS file from a CD.


----------



## hugz

One thing I never understood, that hopefully you can answer

 If ASIO replacements (eg asio4all) aren't bit-perfect, then whats the point of them at all? why did someone go to the effort of making a program that doesn't acheive its purpose?

 Thanks


----------



## EnOYiN

Here is something I posted in another thread:

  Quote:


 Asio4all was not made to fullfill the audiophile needs. It was made for recording in studios. Using asio4all will enable you to sychronise output and input and mix this the right way without having to worry about windows which will give different latencies to different devices. So if you've got multiple devices you can give them all the same latency and latency compensation. I'll give you an example if you have lost it here somewhere.

 Example: (something that might happen in studios)

 Suppose you've got 3 devices. Two soundcards for recording and another one for another one for playback. If you are using windows this is what will happen:

 Device 1: Latency 128 (samples)/ Latency compensation 0
 Device 2: Latency 1024 (samples)/ Latency compensation 0
 Device 3: Latency 512 (samples)/ Latency compensation 0

 You can see that all of them have a different latency and will have to be synchronised afterwards. Windows will give the appropriate latency for every single device. ( it will also change the signal from and to the device - but lets not whine about that right now)

 When using asio4all this is what you can do:

 Device 1: Latency 1024 (samples)/ Latency compensation 1024
 Device 2: Latency 1024 (samples)/ Latency compensation 1024
 Device 3: Latency 1024 (samples)/ Latency compensation 1024

 Now you can see that all the devices are using the same latency and because of this every signal will "play" at the same time. Using latency compensation you can compensate the latency. (pure logic there ) So the latency in the end will be 0. You will not have to synchronise anything anymore. Note that you will have to take the highest latency to get this to work. If you take a lower latency the device which needs 1024 will start distorting.

 This will not alter the playback quality. (it will still be bit-perfect) The only thing which is really changing is the latency. Note that it is only interresting to do this when you are recording from more than 1 device. ( so that would be in a studio most likely)

 Audiophiles use asio4all just because asio can bypass windows. (to make the output signal bit-perfect) It does not matter what latency you are using and because of this you want to use the highest latency possible. (2048) It does not matter since you are not trying to synchronise anything. You just don't want windows to touch your signal. You can compensate the latency but again: It doesn't matter since you are not trying to synchronise anything.


----------



## hugz

makes sense, thankyou. time to return to linux on my music box


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hugz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_makes sense, thankyou. time to return to linux on my music box_

 

Vista will handle audio completely different. (better) And there is also a driver from usb audio. This driver will provide true ASIO and is therefore bit-perfect. Sadly it is far from free.


----------



## hithere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbritton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm lost in one regard. Why does resampling to a higher bit rate negatively affect sound quality? Rounding errors? Phase errors? Nyquist errors and jitter? How?

 I hope we are not confusing sampling rate (number of samples per second) with bit depth (16-bit vs 24-bit vs 32-bit) - using a larger "word" size should not resample anything, should it, but would merely fit the top 16 bits up front into the 24-bit word, right? The extra bit depth is very useful for performing DSP calculations with greater accuracy_

 

...I thought we were talking about sample rate conversion from 44.1 khz to 48, where the important thing is the math used when the number of samples at the new, higher, rate are not integer multiples of the number of samples in the rate being converted from, therefore some kind of interpolation must be used lest the new output show patterned errors and not fairly represent the original input to the best of it's ability. Separate issue from bit depth (16 vs. 24 vs. 32, etc.) Sure, increasing bit depth is as easy as adding zeros, then using whatever math to cut the sample down for volume control and the like.

 I don't know if the k-mixer makes an audible difference in most cases, I've read reports of audible differences, but then I've read reports of people claiming to hear audible differences between digital cables, which I've never seen demonstrated in a blind test (and suspect I never will). I have read things that lead me to believe that it doesn't work properly for someone who wants nothing more than to pass exactly what's on a CD over a digital interface to an outside decoding mechanism. According to some documentation, k-mixer doesn't perform SRC if there is only one stream present and/or hardware mixing is enabled on the card.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hithere* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...I thought we were talking about sample rate conversion from 44.1 khz to 48, where the important thing is the math used when the number of samples at the new, higher, rate are not integer multiples of the number of samples in the rate being converted from, therefore some kind of interpolation must be used lest the new output show patterned errors and not fairly represent the original input to the best of it's ability. Separate issue from bit depth (16 vs. 24 vs. 32, etc.) Sure, increasing bit depth is as easy as adding zeros, then using whatever math to cut the sample down for volume control and the like.

 I don't know if the k-mixer makes an audible difference in most cases, I've read reports of audible differences, but then I've read reports of people claiming to hear audible differences between digital cables, which I've never seen demonstrated in a blind test (and suspect I never will). I have read things that lead me to believe that it doesn't work properly for someone who wants nothing more than to pass exactly what's on a CD over a digital interface to an outside decoding mechanism. According to some documentation, k-mixer doesn't perform SRC if there is only one stream present and/or hardware mixing is enabled on the card._

 

I do not mean to offend you or anything, but I simply have no idea what you are trying to say here. If you mean to say that the post I wrote contains errors or wrong statements please tell me. 

 However I doubt there is any faulty information in there since I checked everything 3 times from different credible sources.


----------



## seefeel

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xenithon* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There is the commerical USB driver from USB-Audio, which replaces the generic USB driver and allows the application to talk directly to the hardware, bypassing the kernel, EVEN if the hardware does not have its own ASIO driver._

 

Is this really true? Does the USB-Audio driver really bypass the kernel even if the USB DAC you're using doesn't support ASIO?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *seefeel* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is this really true? Does the USB-Audio driver really bypass the kernel even if the USB DAC you're using doesn't support ASIO?_

 

It's true. This application was invented by steinberg as an addition to Cubase. I think it was version 3.5 (of Cubase) 

 Here is the site of steinberg. There are some parts in german though. 
http://www.steinberg.de/23_1.html


----------



## seefeel

I'm referring to the usb-audio.com driver. If I use this driver with a Scott Nixon USB DAC that doesn't support ASIO I'll be bypassing the kmixer and getting bit-perfect output?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *seefeel* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm referring to the usb-audio.com driver. If I use this driver with a Scott Nixon USB DAC that doesn't support ASIO I'll be bypassing the kmixer and getting bit-perfect output?_

 

I am reffering to the same driver. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 This driver was invented by steinberg.

 Yes, you will get bit-perfect output. You can download a trail, if you like, to see if it will work with your DAC. I would like to advice you to try it first before you buy it. It isn't cheap. The beep is kinda annoying but at least you can try it.


----------



## xenithon

seefeel - yes it is true. Unlike ASIO2KS and ASIO4ALL, which are wrappers for KS, the usb-audio driver talks directly to the hardware completely bypassing the OS audio stack.


----------



## EnOYiN

So.

 I am pretty much out of ideas about any other stuff I can add.

 If you've got any suggestions please tell me. There should be something else I can add here. If there will be no other suggestions I will quit editing the original post since this has been somewhat timeconsuming.


----------



## Joshatdot

I was getting distortion and what not when I set buffers and stuff to 0

 btw, what are some examples of a DTS CD track? .. does that mean any CD's that are DDD? you mean .dts files extracted from a DVD?


----------



## tbritton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So.

 I am pretty much out of ideas about any other stuff I can add.

 If you've got any suggestions please tell me. There should be something else I can add here. If there will be no other suggestions I will quit editing the original post since this has been somewhat timeconsuming. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks, you've done a truly great job with this!

 Terry


----------



## Gnus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can change this on the menu of X-Fi itself. If you want 16-bits you've got to select it there._

 

It's been awhile since I've fiddled with the X-Fi configurations, where can I find the option to change this? In foobar, mine is locked to 32-bit.

 Also, someone mentioned selecting Audio Creation mode -> bit-matched playback will essentially do the same thing as manually changing it to 16-bit, is that correct?

 Keep up the good work!


----------



## hithere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gnus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's been awhile since I've fiddled with the X-Fi configurations, where can I find the option to change this? In foobar, mine is locked to 32-bit.

 Also, someone mentioned selecting Audio Creation mode -> bit-matched playback will essentially do the same thing as manually changing it to 16-bit, is that correct?

 Keep up the good work! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

In bit matched mode, the card will read out exactly what is in the file, at the bitrate the file indicates. Yes, getting bit-perfect output from the X-fi is that easy.

 Enoyin: I don't mean to offend either, or imply that anything written is incorrect. The only thing I would want to steer people away from is the incorrect assumption that if they are using kernel streaming or ASIO to output bit-perfect information to a sound card, then the sound card will automatically be outputing analogue or digital based on that bit-perfect information, unaltered. _Some_ soundcards and most audiophile-grade DAC's will do so; Others, such as just about everything Creative produced prior to X-fi, will internally resample to 48 khz, no matter what, and there's nothing the user can do to bypass it. As far as USB consumer-grade soundcards, I know the M-audio Transit can pass bit-perfect 44.1 khz information from a CD to, say, an outboard reciever or dac; I also know the Creative Audigy 2 NX _cannot_, at least not using ASIO, ASIO wrappers, or Kernel Streaming (It resamples everything to 48khz internally, regardless of whether it's talking to k-mixer or not). Regardless of what the NX ouputs over the optical/digital coax, it has at some point been resampled, in some cases twice (44.1-->48-->44.1), internal to the card. In the NX's case, whether or not its resampling has any impact on sound quality is something I don't know.

 When I talk about the sampling rates not being integer multiples of each other, I mean that to go between two such rates requires precision math and can be computationally intensive. It has nothing to do with failing the nyquist rate, it has to do with the fact that if the two sampling rates don't "match up" nicely, then you have to sit and figure out what's the best way to render the new samples in the final rate based on where they fall in time in relation to the samples in the old rate. Sample rate conversion is entirely the reason to bypass k-mixer, I don't see why one would do all that work to bypass it, only to hand the info off to a soundcard that's going to do the same thing anyway...and I think it would be remiss to suggest that once you bypass k-mixer, all is well with regards to getting your original digital stream out un-molested.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Joshatdot* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was getting distortion and what not when I set buffers and stuff to 0

 btw, what are some examples of a DTS CD track? .. does that mean any CD's that are DDD? you mean .dts files extracted from a DVD?_

 

It's normal to get distortion when setting the latency to 0. That is what the latency is for. Just keep it at the highest value (2048 samples, 4 buffers) and you will be allright.

 DTS is Digital Theater Sound. It's the sound file provided by some DVDs. It's a 16-bits/ 44.1 kHz file.( .dts indeed)


----------



## EnOYiN

@ hithere

 Right. I got it now. Maybe I'll write a small part about it. It never really occurred to me because my card will definitely output bit accurate signals if I deliver it bit accurate signals. 

 Thanks for pointing it out. Now I will only have to find the time to edit the original post.


----------



## hithere

Glad we're all in agreement, sorry if I was unclear in earlier posts. Here's some more on the subject of early Creative cards:

 from digital life http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...tive-x-fi.html
 : 

 "_....damaging the image of Live/Audigy cards, has been the uninterruptible mediocre hardware resampling of all frequencies into the reference frequency of 48 kHz. In order to get high quality playback of 44.1 kHz format (the majority of records), users started installing DirectSound or ASIO SSRC plugins (software sample rate conversion) for popular mp3 players - Winamp and Foobar._"

 --In this case, the author is saying that rather than have the older Creative card do Sample Rate Conversion (SRC) in hardware, people started using software SRC plug-ins with ASIO...this is a more complex and accurate approach to SRC (44.1->48) than either Windows k-mixer or the Creative cards (prior to X-fi) use. Using the plugins, you avoid having the soundcard do SRC, and using ASIO, you avoid having k-mixer do SRC. The _best_ way would be to not have to resample at all (by, say, using an Envy24-based card, or X-fi, instead), but this is the next best thing.

 @ Suzaka: Here is an interesting discussion on digital volume control at hydrogenaudio:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=47597

 I think it's best to simply use whatever analog volume you have to adjust volume, and leave whatever digital volumes you have maxed. If you have reason to use digital volume control, then don't worry about it so long as you are using one of the methods described above.


----------



## tbritton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hithere* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 @ Suzaka: Here is an interesting discussion on digital volume control at hydrogenaudio:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=47597_

 


 Thanks from me, also! This is a great discussion - including some major developers' contributions!

 Terry


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hithere* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=47597

 I think it's best to simply use whatever analog volume you have to adjust volume, and leave whatever digital volumes you have maxed. If you have reason to use digital volume control, then don't worry about it so long as you are using one of the methods described above._

 

I will write a part about this in the original post later on today. I will just have to find the time to do so.


----------



## hithere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will write a part about this in the original post later on today. I will just have to find the time to do so._

 

...just wanted to say thanks for putting all this together. I know such posts take time and effort, and I think we all appreciate it.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hithere* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...just wanted to say thanks for putting all this together. I know such posts take time and effort, and I think we all appreciate it.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thank you guys for providing additional information. I like writing this and I learned a lot myself from doing it.


----------



## EnOYiN

I edited the original post again. I wrote a really small part about it. People willing to know more about it will have to look it up for themselves. I would still like to stay on-topic and write a simple guide to setting up ASIO.

http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...tive-x-fi.html

 Now that link seems familiar. I linked to it before in this post.


----------



## Vitor Machado

Thanks for the guide, EnOYiN!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Even while I only have here an AC97 onboard and a Philips HP250, decided to try ASIO4All and see what happens.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Everything seems to be working ok, I just needed to enable the resampling to 48KHz, or foobar2k would crash. Probably because the crappy onboard requires this (hence the name 'AC97 Troubleshooting' for that function...).
 Well, didn't really notice difference in the sound, but will keep it I think.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ah, interestingly, the AC97 driver Equalizer still works... The master volume too, WAVE volume does NOT work. I think it is allright, correct? At least I'm bypassing the KMixer right?

 EDIT: Strange, sometimes at the beginning of the playback, the audio starts "cracking", and only stops if I stop and play again, or if I seek. Any ideas? Maybe a latency or buffer problem?

 EDIT 2: Disabled the foobar Resampler and it seems to have resolved the problem... Strange isn't it?
 I thought it would be better to use foobar Resampler before, instead of letting ASIO resample it for AC97... but I think ASIO didn't liked that.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 EDIT 3: Oops, happened again, even with foobar Resampler turned off. But it seems to happen MUCH more with the Resampler turned on... What should I try? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Is this normal when ASIO is started and there's some high CPU usage going on? This could be the problem with the Resampler...


----------



## EnOYiN

Thanks. I like helping people. It's good for my ego. It makes me feel like I am doing something useful with my life. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's quite common that when starting a track you will hear a small "crack". Not that it is a good thing. Most likely it has to do with the quality of the soundcard. It has indeed to do with the latency the soundcard can handle at the start.

 You can try another resampler if you like. Here is a link:
http://www.mega-nerd.com/SRC/fb2k.html

 The normal Foobar resampler is not that great. (nor is AC97 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) It should however do the job. I didn't write a part about the AC97 features yet. I will when I find the time.

 It is normal that the WAVE volume slider does not work anymore. This happens when you bypass the Kmixer. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can also try to not use the mixer features at all by turning them off completely. This is however not recommended when using an internal soundcard. There is a link somewhere in this thread about it. Let me try to find it.........................................found it......

 Here it is:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=47597

 Like I wrote in the original post: You can just set your everything to max volume, but ofcourse this will present a problem if you haven't got analogue volume control. This would mean you will have to listen to max volume the entire time. And I can't recommend that at all ofcourse.

 As long a you like the placebo it does not matter whether you hear the difference or not. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Loads of people use FLAC to encode their music without being able to hear the difference. It could however be that subconsious you are able to hear it and maybe this will provide you with this (extra) great feeling you get when hearing a good song.
 Or maybe it will cause less mental stress. Who knows. I haven't read anything concrete about this so I think I will try to find some information about it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The way I look at it is this: 
 Even if I would not be able to hear it ( I am btw) I would install it because it is free and it does give extra SQ. In combination with FLAC it could be even better. It's just a small change. Same as changing from mp3 to FLAC. Every small change is one. And they will add up to one major change.

 Good luck with setting it up.


----------



## jdimitri

Thanks a lot for this
 I figured it out (took me hours) and i wish i had this guide instead


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I like helping people. It's good for my ego. It makes me feel like I am doing something useful with my life. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 ^^


----------



## cooperpwc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am working on this thread right now so do not be surprised to see some sudden changes. I hope you will get your TBH working.

 Good luck._

 

I got my Bithead back and in 5 minutes with your instructions got it working perfectly. I honestly don't know yet if there is any audible improvement - just made the switch - but it's glitch free so I'm sticking with it. When my new DT880s arrive, it just might make the difference.
 Thanks!

 EDIT: I do use replaygain in Foobar - and I like it. I know it's an open question as to how the volume adjustment may be affecting things.


----------



## Vitor Machado

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I like helping people. It's good for my ego. It makes me feel like I am doing something useful with my life. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It's quite common that when starting a track you will hear a small "crack". Not that it is a good thing. Most likely it has to do with the quality of the soundcard. It has indeed to do with the latency the soundcard can handle at the start.

 You can try another resampler if you like..._

 

Thanks for the post, and the Resampler, I'm using it right now.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm not worried about the volume at all, there is analog control here both in my speakers and headphones...

 And I agree with you, placebo is our best friend.


----------



## EnOYiN

Another "Thank you, I appreciate it" post and I will come to your house and stab you with a fork.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 @ Cooperpwc
 I am researching the influence of replaygain of the signal right now. I suppose it's the same as regular volume change and hence will lead to decay of SQ.

 I am using the DT880s as well. And I am able to hear the difference. 

 @ Vitor Machado
 So I suggest you just keep everything maxed and don't worry about it anymore. It's way easier when there is an analog volume control.


----------



## zigo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks. I like helping people. It's good for my ego. It makes me feel like I am doing something useful with my life. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thankyou VERY much EnoYiN, finally I can hear music with ASIO and it's incredibly better


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zigo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thankyou VERY much EnoYiN, finally I can hear music with ASIO and it's incredibly better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I will break into your house at night, crawl under your bed and stab you with the nearest blunt object. I might encourage your dog to do so as well. I'll think about that.

 .....


----------



## zigo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will break into your house at night, crawl under your bed and stab you with the nearest blunt object. I might encourage your dog to do so as well. I'll think about that.

 .....




_

 

hahaha, I was talking sincerly 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm really grateful!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zigo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hahaha, I was talking sincerly 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm really grateful!_

 

At least I didn't write the whole piece for nothing.


----------



## mADmAN

im just wondering why this thread isnt a sticky yet...

 itd be a shame to see it drown in the sea of threads in this forum


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mADmAN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_im just wondering why this thread isnt a sticky yet...

 itd be a shame to see it drown in the sea of threads in this forum_

 

Oh well, I've still got it linked in my signature. So people will be able to go here anyway. I hope it will be around for a little while though.


----------



## EnOYiN

I made the final edit right now. I will not keep on editing unless it's requested by someone. The link to this thread can still be found in my link.

 Cheers.


----------



## Patu

I'm still not sure about this but is there any difference in sound quality if I use ASIO4ALL vs. ESI Juli@'s own ASIO support? In current foobar2000 version, I can't get Juli@'s ASIO to work without it crashing the foobar2000 every now and then. There's something wrong with Juli@'s ASIO driver. I've been using Kernel Streaming lately.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm still not sure about this but is there any difference in sound quality if I use ASIO4ALL vs. ESI Juli@'s own ASIO support? In current foobar2000 version, I can't get Juli@'s ASIO to work without it crashing the foobar2000 every now and then. There's something wrong with Juli@'s ASIO driver. I've been using Kernel Streaming lately._

 

Native ASIO support is more direct than ASIO4All. ASIO4All uses a wrapper, a virtual device. Signals will go from your audioplayer to the wrapper and than to the actual ASIO. Native ASIO and kernel streaming will go straight to ASIO. In my opinion the best way is to get as few devices as possible between the digital signal and the DAC. It does not matter whether these devices are virtual or not. In general it's like this. (I am not saying resampling or whatever SRC is bad. It can be very useful.)

 You can deduce from this that native ASIO is better. The main problem with direct ASIO or kernel streaming is that you lose a lot of control. You can't change anything anymore. With ASIO4All you can change the signal as much as the Offline configuration allows. With direct ASIO you can't change anything on the fly. Because of this direct ASIO will always crash easier than a wrapper would. ( this shouldn't happen, but since software always contains bugs it does)

 A problem with kernel streaming it does not work with a lot of devices. This is because of the latency. (which can't be changed on the fly - or sometimes not at all)

 The solution:
 The best way to do this would be use USB-ASIO. This program will install usb drivers which will allow direct ASIO even if the device you are using does not have native ASIO support. This program was invented by Steinberg ( from Cubase) and works really well. The main problem with this program is that it is not free.

 I hope this answers your question quite well.

 Cheers

 Edit:
 So in plain English: There is AFAIK no audible difference between direct ASIO and an ASIO wrapper. I tried ABXing this and I couldn't hear any difference. ( I can hear the difference between v0 and lossless - I'm not telling you this to brag, just to make myself look like a credible source 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) I do not know anyone who has been able to hear the difference either.


----------



## Patu

Thanks for clarifying things for me. I think I'll stay with KS for now. It just sucks that you must stop music in foobar if you want to check some video from youtube (with sounds) or something like that. With ASIO I can hear both at the same time. It seems like that Kernel Streaming takes control and won't let any other sounds pass through while it's playing.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for clarifying things for me. I think I'll stay with KS for now. It just sucks that you must stop music in foobar if you want to check some video from youtube (with sounds) or something like that. With ASIO I can hear both at the same time. It seems like that Kernel Streaming takes control and won't let any other sounds pass through while it's playing._

 

That's correct. Please note that everything I say here is not exactly correct, but it's slightly simplyfied. You can tell this to your neighbours and friends, you can even tell anyone who is working in a studio recording music and using Cubase, but PLEASE don't tell Mr Steinberg about it because he would start laughing at you when you describe it to him this way.


----------



## ecclesand

I just installed ASIO4ALL (Thanks for the How-To!) with my old Turtle Beach Santa Cruz soundcard and not only does it sound better thru my Headsave Classic and HD580, but I can get more volume. Is that supposed to happen?

 Also, does this indicate my soundcard really sucks? I'm looking into getting a USB DAC to bypass my card altogether...just curious if I need to spend the cash and if it will make a difference.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ecclesand* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just installed ASIO4ALL (Thanks for the How-To!) with my old Turtle Beach Santa Cruz soundcard and not only does it sound better thru my Headsave Classic and HD580, but I can get more volume. Is that supposed to happen?

 Also, does this indicate my soundcard really sucks? I'm looking into getting a USB DAC to bypass my card altogether...just curious if I need to spend the cash and if it will make a difference.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You are welcome. 

 This is quite common. I've got a Porta Corda MkIII-USB and that will also play louder with ASIO than without. Does this mean my USB/DAC sucks? Nah..

 The turtle beach card isn't that bad, but a USB/DAC would do better. Something like the Total Bithead is doing better just because you can amplify it as well as get a better signal. It's a completely different price range though, so differences in SQ can be expected.

 Just a USB-DAC(without the amp) will make it sound better for the reason that it's a better DAC. Once again it's in a completely different price range.

 There are people who are way more knowledgeable on the amp & dac thing so I would ask it in the amps subforum if you are really intending to buy something like that. I think it will increase the SQ quite a lot since the 580 is a pretty high impedance headphone. (300 Ohm I think? - not sure)

 Cheers.

 Edit: nevermind the last part of this post. I missed the headsave there.


----------



## ecclesand

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You are welcome. 

 This is quite common. I've got a Porta Corda MkIII-USB and that will also play louder with ASIO than without. Does this mean my USB/DAC sucks? Nah..

 The turtle beach card isn't that bad, but a USB/DAC would do better. Something like the Total Bithead is doing better just because you can amplify it as well as get a better signal. It's a completely different price range though, so differences in SQ can be expected.

 Just a USB-DAC(without the amp) will make it sound better for the reason that it's a better DAC. Once again it's in a completely different price range.

 There are people who are way more knowledgeable on the amp & dac thing so I would ask it in the amps subforum if you are really intending to buy something like that. I think it will increase the SQ quite a lot since the 580 is a pretty high impedance headphone. (300 Ohm I think? - not sure)

 Cheers.

 Edit: nevermind the last part of this post. I missed the headsave there._

 


 Thanks for the info! I already have an amp...the Headsave Classic with AD8620/AD8610 op-amps that I'm quite happy with. I was just questioning the DAC and it sounds like it would be a good idea to get one. Back into the old wallet!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Edit: Oops...didn't see your edit.


----------



## shoenberg3

For asio, If i want to revert back to the default soundcard (not usb channels set to left and right), how should I set the 8 channels (which now all have "none")?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shoenberg3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For asio, If i want to revert back to the default soundcard (not usb channels set to left and right), how should I set the 8 channels (which now all have "none")?_

 

I send a pm.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ecclesand* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the info! I already have an amp...the Headsave Classic with AD8620/AD8610 op-amps that I'm quite happy with. I was just questioning the DAC and it sounds like it would be a good idea to get one. Back into the old wallet!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Oops...didn't see your edit._

 

I happens to all of us I guess.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I send a pm._

 

Which is here for everyone else who might be interested in setting this up:

 You can map as you like. I am sure that's not the asnwer you would want me to give you, but in the end it's true. I will provide you with a link to wikipedia and I will give you the most common used settings.

 Here are the standard settings I am using myself. Note that these settings are dependant on my (very limited) crappy on-board soundcard settings. If you can use other channels with your soundcard I would recommend it. I will give you some other possibilties as well.

 My (limited) settings are:

 Channel 01: Left
 Channel 02: Right
 Channel 03: Center
 Channel 04: LFE

 It just doesn't have more settings on my laptop. I can't help it either. The fun trivia here is that it actually is a 8 channel card. Just not from one output.

 Standard (better settings) are:

 Channel 01: Front Left
 Channel 02: Front Right
 Channel 03: Center
 Channel 04: Side Left
 Channel 05: Side Right
 Channel 06: Surround Left
 Channel 07: Surround Right
 Channel 08: LFE (bass)

 This is standard setup for speakers. However for headphones I would just map the "normal" left and right. Since you've just got 2 channels when using a headphone; a left and a right, it would seem like the logical thing to do for me. Actually, it is. There is for as far as I know only one exception on this which is a gaming headphone made by Razer, the Barracuda, which has more than 2 channels.

 Now the link to wikipedia, our friend in times of trouble. ( aside from mother Mary ofcourse)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surroun...ls_to_speakers

 And another, also to wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_channel_audio

 I hope I informed you well enough with this. If not do not hesitate to ask in the thread or pm me.

 Cheers.

 P.S. I thought it was fun reading about the 22.2 Channel Surround Sound. You might like that aswell.


----------



## rb67

Thanks for the tutorial! I spent a good part of an hour trying to figure out how to output asio in foobar until I found your post. (I forgot to change the asio4all component to my usbdac) Thanks!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rb67* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the tutorial! I spent a good part of an hour trying to figure out how to output asio in foobar until I found your post. (I forgot to change the asio4all component to my usbdac) Thanks!_

 

You are welcome.


----------



## yanfeng

I'm confused again. Is ASIO4ALL sonically inferior to USB-ASIO or hardware ASIO. What kind of evil will the "wrapper" do?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yanfeng* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm confused again. Is ASIO4ALL sonically inferior to USB-ASIO or hardware ASIO. What kind of evil will the "wrapper" do?_

 

A wrapper will, at some point, have to use the audio-architecture made by Windows. USB-ASIO or native ASIO will be more direct. It can truly bypass everything and communicate directly with a device. 

 Will it sonically be inferior? Well, I can't hear the difference for one, but it's there. Audible or not. 

 So why would I use USB-ASIO instead of ASIO4All? When recording something and using an external device you don't really want to start losing quality just because the OS isn't helping. The thing you should try to consider is that ASIO was made for professional use. Studios don't want to lose quality and are willing to spend a bit of money to make sure of that. ASIO was never made to serve other purposes other than getting bit-perfect output and to be able to control the latency given to certain devices.

 If you want a recommendation on what you should use, then here it is: Don't use USB-ASIO unless you think it's audible or if you want to throw some money away. If you've got a studio it is adviceable to use the best there is. If you don't use it for that purpose than just use ASIO4All.


----------



## KrooLism

please.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *KrooLism* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_please._


----------



## yanfeng

Thanks EnOYiN. I really like this thread even if I can't get any audible sonic improvement over that. Very enlightening.

 Another question. Using ASIO4ALL, I can't control the volume of the digital output of UD-10 within windows, but I can still control the volume of its analogue output. I will see the analogue out as working under the "wrapper", but is the digital out bypassing it?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


 With ASIO installed, and the Windows sound system disabled, there is no control of the sound level output (via the PC) so I installed a passive volume control between the UD-10 and amplifier. 
 

Taken from the website of the people who made the UD-10. I think this answers your question. I am not entirely sure though since I didn't really get the last sentence.

 This one:
  Quote:


 I will see the analogue out as working under the "wrapper", but is the digital out bypassing it? 
 

If you can rephrase that, I'll try to answer it again.


----------



## Joshatdot

Has anyone got ASIO4ALL to work with AV-710? (w/o prodigy)


----------



## yanfeng

Sorry for my poor English, EnOYiN. MY question is whether through ASIO4ALL, the digital out of UD-10 has completely bypassed windows kernal mixer, while its analogue out has not.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you can rephrase that, I'll try to answer it again. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Joshatdot* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone got ASIO4ALL to work with AV-710? (w/o prodigy)_

 

Make sure you've got the latest version of ASIO4All, the latest Via Envy HT24 drivers.

 Now set the sample rate to auto, select PCM out and enable digital out.

 I hope that does the trick for you.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yanfeng* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry for my poor English, EnOYiN. MY question is whether through ASIO4ALL, the digital out of UD-10 has completely bypassed windows kernal mixer, while its analogue out has not._

 

Took me a while to figure out what you meant since my English isn't that great after all. I got it now I think. I haven't got a UD-10 myself, so I'll answer it with the knowledge I've got. Note that it might not be correct. (most likely it is though)

 Both of the outputs will bypass the kmixer. Most likely the volume control will determine how much power is send to the USB device. I am still trying to figure this out. If you want to be sure keep your volume maxed at all times. Then you will avoid decrease in bitdepth for sure.

 There might be a difference between USB devices and regular soundcards as well. Like I said I am trying to find that out. I'll post something more conclusive when I am sure.


----------



## EnOYiN

So, something more conclusive right here:

 You CAN adjust volume when using a USB device. You will still have bitperfect output. The only thing you are changing by adjusting the volume in Windows is how much power is send to the USB port.

 I will try to find out whether you can change the volume on regular soundcards as well. ( and keep the same bitdepth)


----------



## oqvist

Thanks for the guide. Hoped it would help my crackles but still got them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.

 Anyway the X-meridian has it´s own ASIO drivers I think (currently running my X-fi).

 Do I need to uninstall Asio4all or is it enough to just deselect it in foobar?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oqvist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the guide. Hoped it would help my crackles but still got them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Anyway the X-meridian has it´s own ASIO drivers I think (currently running my X-fi).

 Do I need to uninstall Asio4all or is it enough to just deselect it in foobar?_

 

Since the X-meridan (AFAIK) supports ASIO natively you should uninstall the ASIO4All drivers. After this you should be able to select the ASIO in foobar. This should work.

 As far as the cracks are concerned. This might have something to do with the sampling rate this cards uses. I am not sure about this however and I suggest you look it up in the manual of the card itself. Since this cards is pretty much a clone of the creative X-fi it might use 48 kHz instead of 44.1.

 Here is a link to a good resampler for foobar:
http://www.mega-nerd.com/SRC/fb2k.html

 I am not sure about this but you can try to resample it and see if the cracks stop. If that doesn't help I suggest you start a new thread where you can ask this question again and get help from other people who are more knowledgeable about this particular card.


----------



## tbritton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oqvist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the guide. Hoped it would help my crackles but still got them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Anyway the X-meridian has it´s own ASIO drivers I think (currently running my X-fi).

 Do I need to uninstall Asio4all or is it enough to just deselect it in foobar?_

 

Did you increase the buffers sizes? I have the ASIO buffers set at 2048 for my Aardvark Direct Pro to work nicely with Winamp, with its Direct Sound hardware buffer size in the same range, at 2368. Till I increased this, I got crackles from that card through Asio4All. (Winamp doesn't recognize the Direct Pro's native Asio drivers except as emulated through Direct Sound.) I lower them back down for recording work to 512.

 Terry


----------



## EnOYiN

Once again I am done with this thread. I will not be editing it and I will not be taking any suggestions. I hope this thread has been of some use to some of you.

 I'll be leaving this forum since it has been taking up way too much of my precious time. 

 Cheers.


----------



## tbritton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Once again I am done with this thread. I will not be editing it and I will not be taking any suggestions. I hope this thread has been of some use to some of you.

 I'll be leaving this forum since it has been taking up way too much of my precious time. 

 Cheers._

 

Yeah... this place is addictive, isn't it?!

 You'll be missed. Come around as often as is "safe" to appear without it turning into a crazy habit! And keep checking the Binaural thread.

 Terry


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbritton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah... this place is addictive, isn't it?!

 You'll be missed. Come around as often as is "safe" to appear without it turning into a crazy habit! And keep checking the Binaural thread.

 Terry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I most likely will check that thread every once in a while indeed. I have really been enjoying those links over there.

 Aside from this forum costing too much of my time I am mainly leaving because I am suffering from severe depression. Don't start worrying about me though since I have been suffering from depression for years now. Maybe I will return to this forum again when I am feeling a bit better.

 Thx for making me feel welcome Terry.

 Cheers.


----------



## db597

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Aside from this forum costing too much of my time I am mainly leaving because I am suffering from severe depression. Don't start worrying about me though since I have been suffering from depression for years now. Maybe I will return to this forum again when I am feeling a bit better._

 

Sorry to hear about your depression. Hope you have a good recovery. Listen to some good uplifting music!


----------



## Cid

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I most likely will check that thread every once in a while indeed. I have really been enjoying those links over there.

 Aside from this forum costing too much of my time I am mainly leaving because I am suffering from severe depression. Don't start worrying about me though since I have been suffering from depression for years now. Maybe I will return to this forum again when I am feeling a bit better.

 Thx for making me feel welcome Terry.

 Cheers._

 

I can relate. I too suffer from severe depression and also Agoraphobia (haven't been out the house in 3 years, except for doctors appointments etc), but I find these forums as a good "escape" from my problems. It's places like head-fi that keep me going.

 I hope you change your mind and decide to come back. I for one really enjoyed reading your posts.


----------



## tbritton

Heh... we should start our own thread then! I'm another one in that boat!

 I found an article going into another method of doing Asio4All out of Winamp besides using the plug-in available from the Winamp plug-ins site. It uses a different version altogether from a Japanese author that worked with my Aardvark Direct Pro where the Winamp-site one would not. Read the post I made over at the Crackles due to PCI Bus Noise thread, rather than me repeating it all here. You may be doing another edit after all, EnOYiN! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Terry


----------



## redrich2000

When I set up ASIO4all in winamp initially it wouldn't play at all. I had to click configure in the Output dialog box and select the plug-in as driver, then it worked.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Cid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can relate. I too suffer from severe depression and also Agoraphobia (haven't been out the house in 3 years, except for doctors appointments etc), but I find these forums as a good "escape" from my problems. It's places like head-fi that keep me going.

 I hope you change your mind and decide to come back. I for one really enjoyed reading your posts._

 


 You guys did change my mind about this. I just shouldn't spend too much time here. I think I'll try that for now and see how it works out.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbritton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Heh... we should start our own thread then! I'm another one in that boat!

 I found an article going into another method of doing Asio4All out of Winamp besides using the plug-in available from the Winamp plug-ins site. It uses a different version altogether from a Japanese author that worked with my Aardvark Direct Pro where the Winamp-site one would not. Read the post I made over at the Crackles due to PCI Bus Noise thread, rather than me repeating it all here. You may be doing another edit after all, EnOYiN! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Terry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I see what I can do about it. I won't start editing like a madman right now but, I will try and write a part about it in the original post.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *redrich2000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When I set up ASIO4all in winamp initially it wouldn't play at all. I had to click configure in the Output dialog box and select the plug-in as driver, then it worked._

 

Isn't that the idea of the output tab in winamp?


----------



## ack_0220

Hi there,

 I have been playing with asio4all for months, and i am able to get it up and running, can hear audible SQ difference. However there are still a few question i would like to make clear? 

 1. What does the Hardware buffer does, i tried switching it on and off and i can hear difference, with hardware buffer on i can hear the vocal to be more focus. Should i leave it on or off?

 2. The volume level too loud or should i said bright, it is not loud but just too bright especially vocals, i can't listen to the volume level i wanted to because the high frequencies are just too loud. I tried adjusting any digital volume on foobar, and it seem to lose SQ after -5dB. I've setup the replay gain at foobar to run at -7.0 to -10dB and the main volume to -5dB, that lowers the volume a little, but will it affects the SQ?

 3. I also used the channel mixer dsp on foorbar to redirect the bass from the sattelites to my subwoofer, will that affect bit-perfect?

 Thanks.


----------



## EnOYiN

1. A buffer stores input or output data in memory for a short while. It makes sure that your device won't have any problems using this data. I suggest you keep it on as long as you use your device just for playback.

 2. I don't know. If you can tell me what device you are using I might be able to tell you a bit more.

 3. Not necessarily. It depends on how this is done. You can however use the channels provided by ASIO4All to avoid this problem.


----------



## ack_0220

I have an analog control on my amplifier and connected to a citypulse DA 7.2x external DAC. The DAC is connected to my PC via a USB-S/PDIF converter as a transport. There are only 3 places where i can adjust my volume. Analog control at my amp, main volume at foobar and replay gain. Which would be the best option?

 Mixer at ASIO?? i din't see any mixer before? Is there any?

 Enoyin, 

 I also read an article you post on Hydrogen audio about volume controls, it was said the attenuation degrades bit depth, so what you can do is to increase the normal CD bit depth from 16 -24bit and do some digital attenuation to compensate for the loss. How true is that? And what bit depth is ASIO4ALL working at?


----------



## EnOYiN

I suggest keeping every digital volume control maxed and just using the analog volume control.

 You can asign channel in foobar by editing the ASIO4All virtual device. All the channesl have to be available as true device channels though.

 Let get this clear first: I did not post anything in the thread at HydroGen Audio. It's just a discussion about these things. I had nothing to do with it.

 I have no idea about the how true all of this is. It might work and it might not work. It's just a thread I linked to for all the people who might be interested in this.

 ASIO4All is working at the bitdepth of the files you play. Hence bit-perfect. Most likely this will be 16-bits/ 44.1 kHz since this is commonly used on CDs. It can change depending on what files you are playing. If you play 32-bits/ 192 kHz it will work with that. It will just play everything like it is without changing it. ( assuming the device you are using is capable of of the sample rates etc)


----------



## ack_0220

Sorry about that, what i ment was the link to the forum you posted on this thread. 

 Thanks for your advice. 

 I am no audio engineer, can't tell anything theoretically, so i guess i'll just try it out and see if there is any difference. 

 Cheers.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ack_0220* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry about that, what i ment was the link to the forum you posted on this thread. 

 Thanks for your advice. 

 I am no audio engineer, can't tell anything theoretically, so i guess i'll just try it out and see if there is any difference. 

 Cheers._

 

I think that is the best way no matter what. If you can make it sound good to your ears than that is what you should use.


----------



## vold

now you say something about the way windows vista processing the sound differently than xp. im using vista right now with asio4all applied i think successfully through winamp and using my av710 soundcard. what is the difference between vista and xp if you can explain briefly


----------



## EnOYiN

I will make a part about Vista. I don't know how fast I will be able to make it. Maybe tomorrow or the day after.

 In short: When using kernel streaming or asio there will be no problem at all. It's mainly the direct sound etc which really changed.


----------



## EnOYiN

I made the part about Vista. If you want more explanation on that subject I suggest you go to the link I provided. Since this is not a thread about the audio-architecture of Windows, but about ASIO I would like to stay at least a tiny bit on-topic.

 Cheers.


----------



## cooperpwc

Just thought I would report in that your instructions, which worked perfectly with the Bithead, work equally well with the Micro DAC. Well done!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cooperpwc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just thought I would report in that your instructions, which worked perfectly with the Bithead, work equally well with the Micro DAC. Well done!_

 

Thanks. Happy listening.


----------



## penger

I took a look at the thread and searched around the forum and could find a solution to this problem. Hopefully, I'm just missing something. Here goes. Currently, my setup is from my laptop -> silverstone eb-01 -> gilmore lite. I have everything set up the way it was detailed in the beginning of this post, but the volume that comes out is very quiet. I'm not used to turning my amp up so high to hear. Is there a fix?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


 Q: My volume is not what it’s supposed to be. How can I fix this?
 A: Windows is changing the volume sometimes, just for fun. You can change this in the menu “Sounds and audio devices” in your configuration window. 
 

This is one suggestion taken from the FAQ.

 I experienced the same thing when hooking up my USB-DAC. Restarting your computer might do the job as well.

 If these things do not work post here again and I will try to think about something else.


----------



## scompton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *penger* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I took a look at the thread and searched around the forum and could find a solution to this problem. Hopefully, I'm just missing something. Here goes. Currently, my setup is from my laptop -> silverstone eb-01 -> gilmore lite. I have everything set up the way it was detailed in the beginning of this post, but the volume that comes out is very quiet. I'm not used to turning my amp up so high to hear. Is there a fix?_

 

I got no sound out of the eb01 until I disabled the onboard sound and a reboot. Since then it's worked fine.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *scompton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got no sound out of the eb01 until I disabled the onboard sound and a reboot. Since then it's worked fine._

 

That's pretty much what it says in the main thread.....


----------



## scompton

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's pretty much what it says in the main thread....._

 

Yeah, I know I read it someplace. I wouldn't have known to do it otherwise.


----------



## penger

Hey Enoyin,

 I seem to have fixed the problem. In Sound and Audio devices, under Audio, my sound playback default device was not set to USB speakers. Thanks for reminding me to take a look at this again.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *penger* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey Enoyin,

 I seem to have fixed the problem. In Sound and Audio devices, under Audio, my sound playback default device was not set to USB speakers. Thanks for reminding me to take a look at this again._

 

It's just that Windows has 10 sliders to do the exact same thing. It's pretty annoying some times. It gives you a good idea why people in studios always use MAC instead of Windows. 

 Glad I could be of some help.


----------



## musicmind

Dank u wel EnoYiN

 This came in very handy


----------



## tomjonesrocks

I consider myself technically competent, but I simply cannot get this to work. SO frustrating.

 I downloaded the latest version of Foobar (0.9.4.3) and downloaded the ASIO link here as directed, and all Foobar says is that there's a problem loading the ASIO driver (actually, it says "An error occurred while querying ASIO drivers", and to stop ASIO playback and shut down any other software using ASIO) even when I'm on a fresh restart with nothing else open. When I tried to downgrade to 0.9.4.2, Foobar says the ASIO driver is designed for a newer version of Foobar.

 The old version of Foobar I had (before I uninstalled and reinstalled the newest version to try to configure ASIO) was a buggy mess as well.

 Has anyone managed to configure ASIO in 0.9.4.3? I'd love to get this set up with ASIO so I could set my PC with Itunes as the front end and Foobar as the back, but I'll be damned if I can get Foobar to do anything I want without throwing errors all over the place. 

 ANY assistance someone could offer would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## EnOYiN

I am still running 0.9.4.2 but I am willing to try the newer version later on today. After I have tried that I will post here again and you will see if I got it to work.


----------



## decayed.cell

"The latency should be on 2048."
 This should be ASIO Buffer Size


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjonesrocks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone managed to configure ASIO in 0.9.4.3? I'd love to get this set up with ASIO so I could set my PC with Itunes as the front end and Foobar as the back, but I'll be damned if I can get Foobar to do anything I want without throwing errors all over the place._

 

I got it working without anything going wrong. So, I'll just give you my version off the ASIO plug-in and then it should work fine.

 My version is 1.2.4. The version of foobar is 0.9.4.3.

 I am using the same plug-in as I was using for 0.9.4.2. It's the plug-in I linked to in the first post of this thread. I hope this helps.

 BTW. What are you using aside from the default Foobar? Some kind of panelUI or ColumnsUI? I have no errors whatsoever in foobar so I think that would have something to do with other plug-ins you might be using.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *decayed.cell* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"The latency should be on 2048."
 This should be ASIO Buffer Size 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

ORLY?


----------



## tomjonesrocks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got it working without anything going wrong. So, I'll just give you my version off the ASIO plug-in and then it should work fine.

 My version is 1.2.4. The version of foobar is 0.9.4.3.

 I am using the same plug-in as I was using for 0.9.4.2. It's the plug-in I linked to in the first post of this thread. I hope this helps.

 BTW. What are you using aside from the default Foobar? Some kind of panelUI or ColumnsUI? I have no errors whatsoever in foobar so I think that would have something to do with other plug-ins you might be using._

 

The problem must have something to do with my setup then. That is the ASIO plugin version I am using.

 Actually, I removed and reinstalled Foobar for this, so it's clean with no other plugins at all. I'm using ASIO4ALL v2. The plugin and setup for Winamp works fine. Unfortuantely, no matter what I try I get that same "An error occurred while querying ASIO drivers" error over and over in Foobar.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjonesrocks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The problem must have something to do with my setup then. That is the ASIO plugin version I am using.

 Actually, I removed and reinstalled Foobar for this, so it's clean with no other plugins at all. I'm using ASIO4ALL v2. The plugin and setup for Winamp works fine. Unfortuantely, no matter what I try I get that same "An error occurred while querying ASIO drivers" error over and over in Foobar._

 

Errr...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am sorry, but in that case I don't have a clue about what's going on then. You can still try asking at Hydrogen Audio.

 It did work when using 0.9.4.2 I assume? So, if you wouldn't mind too much I think I would install the older version. (it's a poor alternative - I know)


----------



## tomjonesrocks

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It did work when using 0.9.4.2 I assume? So, if you wouldn't mind too much I think I would install the older version. (it's a poor alternative - I know)_

 

No, it didn't work in 0.9.4.2 either--in fact the component said it was written for a newer version and incompatible or something.

 I can't get this to work in *any* version of Foobar. It was painless in Winamp though.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjonesrocks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, it didn't work in 0.9.4.2 either--in fact the component said it was written for a newer version and incompatible or something.

 I can't get this to work in *any* version of Foobar. It was painless in Winamp though._

 

Did you also try the other link in the first post? This one. In that post is a link to another ASIO plug-in.

 If that doesn't work I'm out of ideas and your only option would be to ask someone at HA.


----------



## karma

I have a strange problem when using ASIO and Winamp. I have everything setup according to the guide (using the out_asio.dll plug-in from the Japanese site), and things are working great except certain songs refuse to play in Winamp. 

 There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as it can happen on certain songs from an album but not others from same album. These are various mp3s, mostly ripped at VBR. Re-ripping doesn't seem to fix the problem. Winamp doesn't crash, it just stays stuck at 0:00. I can switch to other songs just fine when I hit one of these non-playing tracks.

 Does anybody have any insight on this? I can't stick with ASIO as some of my favorite songs just won't play under it.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *karma* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a strange problem when using ASIO and Winamp. I have everything setup according to the guide (using the out_asio.dll plug-in from the Japanese site), and things are working great except certain songs refuse to play in Winamp. 

 There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as it can happen on certain songs from an album but not others from same album. These are various mp3s, mostly ripped at VBR. Re-ripping doesn't seem to fix the problem. Winamp doesn't crash, it just stays stuck at 0:00. I can switch to other songs just fine when I hit one of these non-playing tracks.

 Does anybody have any insight on this? I can't stick with ASIO as some of my favorite songs just won't play under it._

 

If that happens there are a few options:

 1) The device can't handle the latency.

 2) The device can not handle the sample rate.

 3) There is a bug.

 4) You are not using a decent program. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I can't think of anything else than these options. I am assuming that you set the latency right and that most of your CDs are 44.1/ 16 so that leaves option 3 and maybe 4 if you are willing to switch. 

 You can also try kernel streaming. You can set that up in pretty much the same way as ASIO.

 If someone else might have any ideas on this please do tell.


----------



## el_matt0

ive got a bit of a problem with my winamp/asio/bitperfect situation, trying to get it to work with my m-audio transit to my zhaolu dac. kinda got it working but dont think its playing in bit perfect, the surround test i downloaded failed HORRIBLY! also wondering if upgrading to the chaintech av710 (flash prodigy) or something similar would improve my bit-perfect playback situation in winamp (without however harming the audio quality when gaming or watching movies in different applications). check out the thread here and please offer any advice you can! this has been a bit frustrating for me and id appreciate help! check the thread here


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_matt0* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ive got a bit of a problem with my winamp/asio/bitperfect situation, trying to get it to work with my m-audio transit to my zhaolu dac. kinda got it working but dont think its playing in bit perfect, the surround test i downloaded failed HORRIBLY! also wondering if upgrading to the chaintech av710 (flash prodigy) or something similar would improve my bit-perfect playback situation in winamp (without however harming the audio quality when gaming or watching movies in different applications). check out the thread here and please offer any advice you can! this has been a bit frustrating for me and id appreciate help! check the thread here_

 

I am going to check that thread out right now. I'll give you the answer there if I can.


----------



## EnOYiN

I have removed the picture below from the original post.







 I have done so to avoid further confusion about it. I didn't make this thread to explain about the audio architectures in the first place and the pictures I made are a very simplified version of what is actually going on. The original can still be found here.

 If you want more information about this subject I think one of the best sources to start is the AVS forum. 

 I would also like to ask whether it is possible to add this thread as a link in the computer audio essential links thread. I PMed rickcr42 before, but since he isn't a moderator any more he couldn't add it there.

 If there are any other suggestions for this thread I am still willing to add other things to the original post. 

 Cheers.


----------



## djray

this question may sound stupid, but if you do not have a USB DAC, is there any point in trying USB-ASIO?

 btw, i'm currently using ASIO4ALL with XMPlay.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djray* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_this question may sound stupid, but if you do not have a USB DAC, is there any point in trying USB-ASIO?

 btw, i'm currently using ASIO4ALL with XMPlay._

 

Nope. It is a driver specifically made for USB devices. If you would want a 'regular' sound card which is able to use ASIO 2.0 it shouldn't be too hard to find one.

 Then again, since there is a free trail, you can always try.


----------



## Chri5peed

I just selected Kernel-streaming in foobars output[Ch34 is the Optical-out of my Juli@]. No other setting up.

 I got the KS-use warning in foobar prior to play-back.

 Is everything okay? XP sounds are cut-off.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just selected Kernel-streaming in foobars output[Ch34 is the Optical-out of my Juli@]. No other setting up.

 I got the KS-use warning in foobar prior to play-back.

 Is everything okay? XP sounds are cut-off._

 

Everything is fine. Windows systems sounds (or anything else for that matter) won't play if you use KS. KS sort of takes 'control' over your audio device.


----------



## Chri5peed

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Everything is fine. Windows systems sounds (or anything else for that matter) won't play if you use KS. KS sort of takes 'control' over your audio device._

 

Danke...is that how you spell it?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 I've used KS for ages, just wondering. ASIO locks up foobar, my soundcard says its ASIO2.0 compliant. Any ideas?

 I do like how KS 'takes 'control' over your audio device'.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Danke...is that how you spell it?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

"Danke" would be german. "Dank je" or "Dank je wel" would be Dutch. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've used KS for ages, just wondering. ASIO locks up foobar, my soundcard says its ASIO2.0 compliant. Any ideas?_

 

It could be the ASIO plug-in you use for Foobar. I linked to 2 of them in the original post of this thread. Maybe you should try another.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I do like how KS 'takes 'control' over your audio device'._

 

Since I have yet to hear a windows system sound which is useful I agree with you.


----------



## d.phens

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Err.. I haven't got a TBH myself but I might be able to think of a few things that might be wrong.

 1. You might be hearing a harddrive or another component (fan maybe) in your computer. USB devices sometimes do have this problem. Take it up with headroom. They might have a solution for it.

 2. It could be that your are hearing white noise. If so this is caused by cheap components in the the TBH. I can't imagine that headroom put really expensive components in a $200 amp. (no offense - I think the TBH is a great amp) Once again. Take it up with headroom.

 3. The Asio driver does not support the TBH well. Take it up with the guy who made asio. There is a forum on the asio4all website. You can post your problem there.

 I think it has to do with either the first or the second thing I described. So you can try asking Tyll or someone else of headroom. Maybe they've got a solution for you.

 EQ does indeed alter the signal. It will not be bit-perfect anymore. It might however not even be audible so if you think you need an EQ then just use it. If however you really want to use bit-perfect playback you can not use EQ.

 Edit: Some soundcards have their own EQ. If this EQ is placed "after" the DAC you can use it without losing any quality since it is only changing the analog signal. This is not common for a soundcard though. Most soundcards have their EQ placed "before" the DAC._

 

How much do FooBar's own DSPs plugins change the bit perfection? I bet the signal should stay perfect (except for the DSP processing) because the correction is done on application layer. Am I wrong (I might be 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) ?

 Thanks!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *d.phens* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How much do FooBar's own DSPs plugins change the bit perfection?_

 

It changes the audio content completely. It will not be bit perfect any more.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *d.phens* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I bet the signal should stay perfect (except for the DSP processing) because the correction is done on application layer._

 

There is nothing wrong with the signal or not having bit perfect output. Since you are using software to alter the actual output it will indeed change some bits. Will it still stay at 44.1/16? Yes, it will stay at the same sample rate and bit depth as it was before. (unless you are using a resampler of course) It doesn't necessarily harm the sound quality. It can actually make some music sound better. (with proper use of EQ, etc, etc)

 I think that that was what you actually wanted to know. 

 You should realize that having a bit-perfect output is not the most important thing for regular playback. If the music sounds better to your ears when using a DSP then I will be the last person to say that you shouldn't use it.

 There are however a few exceptions which can not be resampled. DTS is one of them. You CAN NOT use DSPs with DTS because it alters the signal and because of that a (DTS compatible) receiver will not be able to recognize the DTS file.

 I hope I made it a bit clearer for you.

 Edit: You should still use ASIO or KS to avoid the Kmixer though. Depending on the hardware you are using that is. (DAC1 comes to mind)


----------



## Chri5peed

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *d.phens* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How much do FooBar's own DSPs plugins change the bit perfection? I bet the signal should stay perfect (except for the DSP processing) because the correction is done on application layer. Am I wrong (I might be 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) ?

 Thanks!_

 

I use EQ and Noise sharpening DSPS in foobar, which sound better ON than OFF anyway.
 Like I said I like KS audio being exclusive to foobar. Does ASIO do this?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I use EQ and Noise sharpening DSPS in foobar, which sound better ON than OFF anyway.
 Like I said I like KS audio being exclusive to foobar. Does ASIO do this?_

 

Yup.


----------



## Chri5peed

^ Sweet, I might give ASIO another try then.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_^ Sweet, I might give ASIO another try then.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Just to make sure we understand each other here.

 ASIO will give you no advantage over KS for as far as bypassing the kmixer goes. The only advantage ASIO has over KS is that you can change your latency (in and output) which would only be interesting for recording purposes.


----------



## Chri5peed

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just to make sure we understand each other here.

 ASIO will give you no advantage over KS for as far as bypassing the kmixer goes. The only advantage ASIO has over KS is that you can change your latency (in and output) which would only be interesting for recording purposes._

 


 Heh, maybe not then! I got the latest ASIO plugin for foobar, it doesn't freeze now, its just quiet.


----------



## RedLeader

I was looking on asio4all faqs and foobar faqs and everything, when I shouldve just come here first! I don't even need asio4all, gooo emu asio! Thanks for the guide sir!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *RedLeader* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was looking on asio4all faqs and foobar faqs and everything, when I shouldve just come here first! I don't even need asio4all, gooo emu asio! Thanks for the guide sir!_

 

You are welcome sir.


----------



## Colscot

Guys :

 I loaded Asio4All on my main PC and it works well with Foobar2000 via the onboard Realtek HD sound card. Sound quality is another issue but I have recently ordered an iBasso D1 which I will connect to the S/PDIF out on the soundcard and I'm hoping this should improve matters.

 However, when I load Asio4All on my laptop with a Sigma Tel sound card I see, as below, that it is sampling at 48Khz. I assume there is nothing I can do about this other than change the sound card. Am I right ?

 Colin


----------



## EnOYiN

For as far as I can see it's the only sampling rate of the soundcard. So, if you want to feed a DAC another signal than the 48kHz you would indeed need another card unless there is an option to change this.

 My realtek card has the option of choosing between several sampling rates.


----------



## Chri5peed

So does my Juli@, but thats not helping is it!


----------



## squall343

i have a problem

 The ASIO4ALL sometimes does not able to detect my USB DAC (citypulse) when i first start up the windows.

 Then i have to plug and replug the usb connection for it to detect the USB DAC

 is there any ways to remedy it?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *squall343* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i have a problem

 The ASIO4ALL sometimes does not able to detect my USB DAC (citypulse) when i first start up the windows.

 Then i have to plug and replug the usb connection for it to detect the USB DAC

 is there any ways to remedy it?_

 

The remedy is called Linux. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Seriously now, it might be an I/O conflict. If you use a lot of USB devices these might get in the way of the DAC. I can't be sure of this though. I don't think this problem is related to ASIO4All. Most likely it has something to do with Windows.

 Maybe you should ask again in a separate thread in the dedicated source forums. I am sure there are other people who will be able to give you some better advice than I am able to do concerning such matters.


----------



## elnero

I haven't had a chance to read through this whole thread but I set up ASIO4ALL with foobar on my computer last night following the instructions in the first post. One question, in the ASIO4ALL setup the devices were Realtek whatever and USB Audio Codec not USB Audio DAC. Is there something wrong there or is that fine? The DAC I have set up is a Headroom Micro DAC.


----------



## baglunch

Regarding needing to unplug and replug USB, yeah, I have that problem too. With my keyboard (Microsoft Natural Pro). WinXP. I don't think it's the keyboard's fault, I don't think it's ASIO nor your DAC's fault. I think it's Windows. Just happens sometimes.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *elnero* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't had a chance to read through this whole thread but I set up ASIO4ALL with foobar on my computer last night following the instructions in the first post. One question, in the ASIO4ALL setup the devices were Realtek whatever and USB Audio Codec not USB Audio DAC. Is there something wrong there or is that fine? The DAC I have set up is a Headroom Micro DAC._

 

If it works I think you shouldn't worry about it too much. For as far as I know it has something to do with the way the DAC is implemented. I don't own a headroom amp so I can't check it for you. Maybe Tyll will be able to tell you more about it, but like I said before I wouldn't start worrying about it too much because it most probably works like it should.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *baglunch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Regarding needing to unplug and replug USB, yeah, I have that problem too. With my keyboard (Microsoft Natural Pro). WinXP. I don't think it's the keyboard's fault, I don't think it's ASIO nor your DAC's fault. I think it's Windows. Just happens sometimes._

 

It most likely has to do with small I/O conflicts. Either way it's a problem that just occurs in Windows when using more then one USB device. Gotta love Bill for putting out a kernel like Windows. Thx Bill. WE LOVE YOU.


----------



## ttan98

I configure Asio4all as per instruction on the first page.

 I am getting high quality music o/p but I am also getting noise in the form of ticks? 

 any answer please, i have not read through all the postings, too many to read.


----------



## elnero

Thanks for the response EnOYiN, it's does seem to work fairly well, the difference in sound is fairly dramatic when using the Micro DAC. One thing I've noticed though is every so often I get a hiccup, probably once or twice in the span of an album. Any idea what this might be related to and is there a way to eliminate it?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ttan98* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I configure Asio4all as per instruction on the first page.

 I am getting high quality music o/p but I am also getting noise in the form of ticks? 

 any answer please, i have not read through all the postings, too many to read._

 

You should check this thread. It has some suggestions on that topic. Also you could do a search for "cracks" in this forum. There have been a few good threads on this topic.

 There are loads of things which can cause this kind of noise. (harddrives, fans, PCI bus noise, CPU, etc, etc) You can also set a higher priority for your media player. If you do a search you should be able to find a lot more suggestions.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *elnero* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the response EnOYiN, it's does seem to work fairly well, the difference in sound is fairly dramatic when using the Micro DAC. One thing I've noticed though is every so often I get a hiccup, probably once or twice in the span of an album. Any idea what this might be related to and is there a way to eliminate it?_

 

Most likely there still isn't enough buffer. You can try changing the buffer in Foobar. Just set it to 8000 ms and check if the problem persists. If it does I can't really be sure because it might one of many other things.

 Depending on how you are using the Micro DAC ( I mean whether you connect it with a USB cable or an optical or coaxial cable) you can use KS. If you are using optical or coaxial from a soundcard you should be able to use KS. KS however doesn't work all that well with USB devices.


----------



## elnero

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Most likely there still isn't enough buffer. You can try changing the buffer in Foobar. Just set it to 8000 ms and check if the problem persists. If it does I can't really be sure because it might one of many other things.

 Depending on how you are using the Micro DAC ( I mean whether you connect it with a USB cable or an optical or coaxial cable) you can use KS. If you are using optical or coaxial from a soundcard you should be able to use KS. KS however doesn't work all that well with USB devices._

 

I did try increasing the buffer but only to about 2000 ms (as suggested in the window) but I did wonder about cranking it up further I just didn't get a chance to try it. I should also mention that when it's happened I've been sitting listening not using the computer for anything other than to run foobar.

 I'm using the Micro via USB, I've heard rumblings that the USB implementation on the Micro may not be that great (although I don't really claim to understand why) but it's just on loan for a few days so I'm not terribly concerned with the DAC itself. I do have a HeadAmp Pico on order though so I was hoping to get familiar and deal with some of the issues with ASIO beforehand.

 If the problem with persists when using the Micro is it possible it's just the Micro's USB implementation itself?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *elnero* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If the problem with persists when using the Micro is it possible it's just the Micro's USB implementation itself?_

 

Yes, very possible as well. I used a Porta Corda with USB as well with my laptop which had similar cracks sometimes. (when not using the computer for anything else) Now, that I've got a Stello DA100 I have yet to hear a single crack.

 Most likely higher end USB DACs are better suited to reduce or completely get rid of jitter or the likes. Don't ask me how that works exactly as I am not knowledgeable enough on that subject to give an answer that will be a 100% correct. There are other people here however that can.


----------



## elnero

It's not really a crack per say, more like a skip but it's interesting to note that you've had similar issues that went away with a new DAC.


----------



## Strings

I have the 24 bit 96000Hz FLAC vinyl rip of Tool's Lateralus.

 Basically SACD style quality.

 But I can't get it to work with my Headphone/DAC amp.

 It's going out through the USB but it just doesn't work.

 The only way I can get it to play is if I resample it (via Foobar) to 48000Hz... but wouldn't that sample it DOWN and make the quality less than it should?

 This is my ASIO4all screen







 I'm using the iBasso D1 amp, if that's any help.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Strings* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The only way I can get it to play is if I resample it (via Foobar) to 48000Hz... but wouldn't that sample it DOWN and make the quality less than it should?_

 

The iBasso is simply not able to play such files. Your only option is to resample them so that it can. This will decrease the SQ. If you want to play these files without resampling you will need another DAC.


----------



## Strings

That's a relief to be honest mate. 

 I've just been debugging some major Linux problems, so I'm glad this isn't in the realms of fixing.

 Will be using the D1 for portable w/optical mostly... so having it for my PC is a bonus.

 Thanks again


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Strings* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's a relief to be honest mate. 

 I've just been debugging some major Linux problems, so I'm glad this isn't in the realms of fixing.

 Will be using the D1 for portable w/optical mostly... so having it for my PC is a bonus.

 Thanks again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

On average you will be able to use it with your computer since most files (most likelyl; I am just assuming this) come directly from a standard CD (which is 44.1 kHz/16-bit) and the iBasso shouldn't have any problems playing those.

 There is always the option of using the analog outputs of your soundcard.

 Edit: assuming your soundcard is able to play higher bit and sample rates.


----------



## ttan98

I thought I will contribute on how I get rid of my ticks and pops noise.

 1. If you are using a desktop or laptop which does not have too much horse power, eg pentium III or II then do the following:

 a. get rid of any unwanted programs ie those running in the foreground or 
 background.
 b. defrag the harddisk so that retrieving music files would be much quicker
 c. make the music frontend, winamp, foobar running above normal priority,
 I think this is optional. Run one music frontend one at time, ie close 
 those unwanted ones.
 d. use enough data(music)buffer size, eg. 2 Mbytes from foobar

 the last few are specified by Steve Nugent from this writeup


 e. Insure a large RAM size for data caching 

 f. Specify fast seek-time and fast spindle rate hard disk drive 

 I use a fairly low speed laptop, 900Mhz PIII, IBM - T22 running windows XP pro. The HD is running at 5400rpm. There are some HD running at lower speed, eg 4200rpm

 It runs very well, using Flac, Wav, directly from HD or directly from an external or internal DVD or CD ROM. There does not seem to be any break in the music unless one is assessing files or execute another program. If it running by itself ,it runs smoothly without any interruptions in the music.

 Thanks, Enoyin for your input.


----------



## EnOYiN

Thank you for your contribution ttan98. Very informative.


----------



## jirams

I am unclear in my understanding of how asio4all will or will not be effective using a USB DAC (iBasso D1 or Opera) with Vista operating system and FooBar2000 - can anyone help me with this?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jirams* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am unclear in my understanding of how asio4all will or will not be effective using a USB DAC (iBasso D1 or Opera) with Vista operating system and FooBar2000 - can anyone help me with this?_

 

Can you be slightly more specific in what you actually want to know, since I am unsure about this.

 I'll try to answer it anyway though.

 Will it work with Vista?

 Yes, I think it will. 

 Will there be an audible difference?

 I doubt it. Vista's audio architecture is a lot better than the one made for XP.

 Should you install ASIO4All?

 Well, only if you intend to use it for recording purposes or intend to use it with a DTS compatible receiver. (and most likely the last will work without ASIO) 

 I hope that answers your question. If not do not hesitate to ask here or by PM.


----------



## jirams

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can you be slightly more specific in what you actually want to know, since I am unsure about this.

 I'll try to answer it anyway though.

 Will it work with Vista?

 Yes, I think it will. 

 Will there be an audible difference?

 I doubt it. Vista's audio architecture is a lot better than the one made for XP.

 Should you install ASIO4All?

 Well, only if you intend to use it for recording purposes or intend to use it with a DTS compatible receiver. (and most likely the last will work without ASIO) 

 I hope that answers your question. If not do not hesitate to ask here or by PM._

 

Many thanks - this answers the points exactly that I was uncertain about.

 Best regards

 IanRtt


----------



## IPodPJ

Excellent thread! I had no intention of installing this before I read this thread. Until I get my M-Audio card, I have been using my built-in sound card since my Audigy is garbage. Using this program even with my crappy $60 computer speakers makes the music sound much more natural and spacious. I guess you never really think about how polluted audio can be until you hear it bit-perfect. I'm really amazed. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The listening experience just keeps getting better and better.

 Now all they need is an ASIO plug-in for iTunes. Foobar doesn't have an impressive GUI (like Cover Flow) for ease of use.

 If you use a sound card which has built in ASIO, will it work with iTunes?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *IPodPJ* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you use a sound card which has built in ASIO, will it work with iTunes?_

 

For as far as I know you would still need some kind of plugin to make it work. (and sorry for the extremely delayed reply 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) Must have had something to do with a small outage.


----------



## Ice Max

I have an X-fi Xtreme Music sound card and use Winamp. I tried using the Winamp plugin with the creative AISO driver, but i get really bad popping noises with it. What could be causing this? and should i try using AISO4all instead?


----------



## ZepFloyd

whats a good sound card to get? my Realtek AC97 doesnt support ASIO...I dont need a card to record or anything, just something that will allow me to tinker with the stuff and actually work


----------



## jterp7

wow this made a huge difference for my TBAAM..and all this time I thought I was using ASIO when I didn't even have it running. Thanks EnOyin


----------



## HardHeadCase

A good sound card to get is an external DAC,,,,be it usb or coax or optical.


----------



## tea-head

FWIW, I use ASIO4ALL with a Lenovo T-60 running XP pro into an external USB DAC (Peter Daniel Deluxe or Paradisea+). I have no pops, or crackle after tweaking a bit (disabled k-mixer, windows volume control no longer functions, and playing with buffers, etc in ASIO4ALL). I run WAV files from a 500G external HD. Sound is excellent into toobs, chip, or ss amps...

 tea


----------



## gallardo88

hi, i have vista and had the whole crackling/popping problem. So I read the thread about that and ended up here. I did everything the 1st post says. I'm running foobar now and the sound is really choppy, as if it was slowed down. I'm sure I mistakenly did something wrong, but seeing I'm no computer wizard I'm afraid to tinker with it and mess it up. Anyone know what I did wrong?
 thanks

 nevermind... figured it . sorry for the waste of space


----------



## ZepFloyd

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HardHeadCase* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A good sound card to get is an external DAC,,,,be it usb or coax or optical._

 

so once i get my pico, i will be able to set my pico up with ASIO?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jterp7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_wow this made a huge difference for my TBAAM..and all this time I thought I was using ASIO when I didn't even have it running. Thanks EnOyin_

 

You are welcome!

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gallardo88* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hi, i have vista and had the whole crackling/popping problem. So I read the thread about that and ended up here. I did everything the 1st post says. I'm running foobar now and the sound is really choppy, as if it was slowed down. I'm sure I mistakenly did something wrong, but seeing I'm no computer wizard I'm afraid to tinker with it and mess it up. Anyone know what I did wrong?
 thanks

 nevermind... figured it . sorry for the waste of space_

 

Here is at least the proof that you did some searching before you asked. Are there is no such thing as a stupid question.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZepFloyd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so once i get my pico, i will be able to set my pico up with ASIO?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *First post in this thread so you should've read it by now* 
_ Q: Does device X work with ASIO?
 A: I simply do not know everything. I suggest you look up the specifications on the particular device to see if it supports ASIO natively and if so just download the ASIO plug-in for Foobar. If it does not support ASIO natively than I suggest you download ASIO4All and the plug-in and try that. The only way to be sure is to try._

 

I am sticking with this. I would be very surprised if you wouldn't be able to use ASIO4All with a Pico, but I am not sure since I don't own one. Just try and see.


----------



## elnero

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am sticking with this. I would be very surprised if you wouldn't be able to use ASIO4All with a Pico, but I am not sure since I don't own one. Just try and see. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

My Pico should be here any day now so I'll be able to see whether it works.


----------



## nettuno65

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZepFloyd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so once i get my pico, i will be able to set my pico up with ASIO?_

 

Of course you can, I'm using right now Foobar2000 + ASIO4ALL with my new Predator and it sounds damned good!


----------



## GreatDane

I'm using Foobar2000 v0.9.5 and ASIO4ALL v2.8 Beta 2 with my Pico and all is well.


----------



## iceman23

Just set up foobar with ASIO today and it seems to be working perfectly up until 1 minute into any song. Once it reaches that point there are audible pops in the song. They aren't very noticeable but enough to make me want to switch back to kernal streaming. Any idea why this is happening?


----------



## Brian loves music

i'm still getting cracks in pops especially when i surf the web..even with high buffer

 dumb question: whats the difference between asio4all and just regular asio plugin for winamp or foobar? 

 still looking for someway to get rid the pops when i surf the web...if only i could just tell my comp to giver priority to audio 

 real


----------



## gallardo88

i'm still having problems ( sound is really choppy). I'm gonna try what the person right below me posted, and if it doesn't work i'm giving up.


----------



## lepax

Try this (worked for me):

 Install ASIO2KS (http://www.asio2ks.de/beta/asio2ks_beta.zip) and change latency to biggest possible values

 Then configure ASIO4All in foobar2000 and choose ASIO Kernel-Streaming driver in there

 Problem solved! (Hopefully)


----------



## gallardo88

I tried everything mentioned in this thread and my sound is still really choppy, slowed down. Anyone know what I did wrong? I installed asio4all like shown in the first post, and then configured it as I was supposed to. THis problem happens only when I select asio4all as the output device. ughhh


----------



## gallardo88

bump


----------



## HardHeadCase

How bout everyone buy a new computer with Vista and be done with all this,,,LOL


 <~~~Ducking


----------



## YouSpentHowMuch?

Hmm I can set the ASIO4All buffer size down to 88 samples without any noticible degredation. Would this possibly provide any benefits over setting it to its highest value. Or is low latency only important for recording and not playback.


----------



## gallardo88

okay, I figured out I get the choppy sound I was taking about when I leave the "use hardware buffering" box unchecked. Will leaving it selected ( use hardware buffering on) cause any problems s.q.-wise? and if it's fine, what should I put the slider on? thanks


----------



## jilgiljongiljing

From what I remember, higher latency does not affect playback unless you use several DSP effects. These effects will be delayed with a higher latency and the more effects you use, the more likely you are to notice this. But IMHO, it doesnt make much of a difference.


----------



## Ricey20

i cant seem to get asio4all to work with my Pico GreatDane, it keeps showing up as Beyond Logic. How did you set yours up to work?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *YouSpentHowMuch?* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm I can set the ASIO4All buffer size down to 88 samples without any noticible degredation. Would this possibly provide any benefits over setting it to its highest value. Or is low latency only important for recording and not playback._

 

Lower latency does not matter at all when using ASIO for playback only.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gallardo88* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_okay, I figured out I get the choppy sound I was taking about when I leave the "use hardware buffering" box unchecked. Will leaving it selected ( use hardware buffering on) cause any problems s.q.-wise? and if it's fine, what should I put the slider on? thanks_

 

Nope. No differences. Just the same thing but with more buffers.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i cant seem to get asio4all to work with my Pico GreatDane, it keeps showing up as Beyond Logic. How did you set yours up to work?_

 

When using your device ASIO will 'take control' off the device. Even ASIO will show it as 'beyond logic'. If there is sound coming out of the Pico and you've got ASIO selected as your preferred output chances are pretty good that ASIO is working just fine.


----------



## Ricey20

when i try to configure foobar with the virtual ASIO device thing to use ASIO4ALL it says the editor says not connected for the left and right channels


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_when i try to configure foobar with the virtual ASIO device thing to use ASIO4ALL it says the editor says not connected for the left and right channels_

 

For as far as I know it will only say so if the left and right channels can not be assigned. In other words: when the device is not connected.

 Now I am pretty sure you did in fact connect whatever it is you want to use ASIO with to your computer so I would try a restart of Foobar or maybe follow the steps as described in the guide again. If the problem persists after you have tried both don't hesitate to ask again. (here or by PM)


----------



## MikoLayer

hmmm. Last I read about Asio4all pointed that it is nothing more than a wrapper for a directsound to make it compatible with ASIO...
 Since usb DACs are incapable of working in KS mode, should I try Asio4all with my monica 2 USB and vista x64?


----------



## Ricey20

tried everything i could think of; uninstalled the driver and let windows reinstall, reinstall asio4all, disable other sound devices, reconnect the device a hundred times, i dunno what else i can try. Running Vista x64, other people have gotten it to work with the pico but not sure what else i can do.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MikoLayer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hmmm. Last I read about Asio4all pointed that it is nothing more than a wrapper for a directsound to make it compatible with ASIO...
 Since usb DACs are incapable of working in KS mode, should I try Asio4all with my monica 2 USB and vista x64?_

 

Well, it's not DS any more *because* it is compatible with ASIO. The kmixer will not touch the audio content any more. ( mostly because you can't mix anything any more) It cannot be accelerated by the hardware any more which was the advantage of DS. (well, that was supposed to be the advantage of DS)

 Should you try ASIO4All when using Vista if you are using it solely for playback?

 Well, I wouldn't. The audio architecture of Vista is a lot better than the one in XP. (although Creative wasn't too happy about it) There are some topics on the AVS forums if you want to read up on it.

 Edit:
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_tried everything i could think of; uninstalled the driver and let windows reinstall, reinstall asio4all, disable other sound devices, reconnect the device a hundred times, i dunno what else i can try. Running Vista x64, other people have gotten it to work with the pico but not sure what else i can do._

 

The above. Since you are running Vista I wouldn't bother with ASIO or ASIO4All or KS or the likes. Vista is pretty good already.

 EditII:
 I should make a part about this in the first post. ASIO just doesn't change that much soundwise in Vista.


----------



## MikoLayer

Perfect! Hey, I dont mind fiddling around with it if need arises, but the best is when everything works fine without hassle! I knew it sounded good from get go once I moved to Vista, so I will let it rest at that


----------



## Ricey20

ah in that case i gladly say I GIVE UP, hah.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MikoLayer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Perfect! Hey, I dont mind fiddling around with it if need arises, but the best is when everything works fine without hassle! I knew it sounded good from get go once I moved to Vista, so I will let it rest at that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yeah, in a few years there will be a Windows version which will work even better. It's called linux. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ricey20* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ah in that case i gladly say I GIVE UP, hah._

 

Heh, sorry. I should've written that part somewhere in the first post a while ago. I've said it before somewhere in this thread, but I assume no one is going to read through 10 pages (edit: make that 20) to find out.

 But I'm tired and lazy so I'll just go to sleep.


----------



## gallardo88

enoyin, I now only get a very slight crackle, but I have vista and the sound to me seems the same with or without so i give up


----------



## gallardo88

wait....
 ARRRRGHHHH !!!! NO!!!
 I forgot: I have the vista crackle/ noise problem. When I don't use ASIO I get sometimes white noise first in one channel, and then the other. If I use Asio I get a constant crackle type of sound. 
 And to think I was trying to bulid a computer rig. Now i'll have to spend even more money just to get a CD player. I hate you head-fi!!!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gallardo88* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_wait....
 ARRRRGHHHH !!!! NO!!!
 I forgot: I have the vista crackle/ noise problem. When I don't use ASIO I get sometimes white noise first in one channel, and then the other. If I use Asio I get a constant crackle type of sound. 
 And to think I was trying to bulid a computer rig. Now i'll have to spend even more money just to get a CD player. I hate you head-fi!!!_

 

Before doing that you can always check this post first. There are some suggestions of what you can do about cracks etc.


----------



## gallardo88

i tried doing the things listed and it didn't change much...


----------



## xnothingpoetic

Maybe it's a huge placebo, but I noticed a huge increase in detail and clarity.

 I had problems getting it to work at first in Winamp, so I'm afraid to go back and AB test it but damn I hear things I thought even mics couldn't pick up! (also do to source and amp upgrade)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I should make a part about this in the first post. ASIO just doesn't change that much soundwise in Vista._

 

Hmm that's odd because I am using Vista. 

 Now I am going to go back to my notes and music, once my amp warms up, and make sure what I hear is real.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xnothingpoetic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe it's a huge placebo, but I noticed a huge increase in detail and clarity.

 I had problems getting it to work at first in Winamp, so I'm afraid to go back and AB test it but damn I hear things I thought even mics couldn't pick up! (also do to source and amp upgrade)_

 

The difference in XP shouldn't be huge. Maybe there are some other settings you should look at in Vista. For as far as I know the difference between using Vistas normal audio architecture and ASIO shouldn't be audible.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xnothingpoetic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ Hmm that's odd because I am using Vista. 

 Now I am going to go back to my notes and music, once my amp warms up, and make sure what I hear is real._

 

It could be placebo. But if the differences are really that huge I doubt it. Like I said before, it might be some other setting somewhere. It still is Windows after all. (meaning that there are 10 buttons and sliders which do the exact same thing and because of it you might miss one 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## xnothingpoetic

It could also be a new album I used to listen to it with- Nirvana Unplugged. (first time on new rig).

 Which naturally has crazy detail! I can hear whispers, people talking, stools creaking, light breaths, individual claps, fingers going across guitar strings/ ext.

 I uninstalled the old plugins so I can't test it unless I reinstall. Also all other media players aren't working anymore for some reason?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xnothingpoetic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It could also be a new album I used to listen to it with- Nirvana Unplugged. (first time on new rig).

 Which naturally has crazy detail! I can hear whispers, people talking, stools creaking, light breaths, individual claps, fingers going across guitar strings/ ext._

 

Might just be it. It's a good album indeed.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *xnothingpoetic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ I uninstalled the old plugins so I can't test it unless I reinstall. Also all other media players aren't working anymore for some reason?_

 

Erhm. I think you should try a restart. Seems like ASIO is still working.


----------



## sschmeichel

Just want to say thanks. Followed the steps, and the music is definitely coming across more defined and even positioning and layer has improved on my AC97 crap card. I am not sure if that's what this ASIO4ALL is suppose to do, but it sure feels this way! THanks!


----------



## rmh1

It is stated in this thread that ASIO4ALL will not do 24/96:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/as...o-work-284443/

 Is this the case? Jon L says he tried to contact the author and got no response. Any light you can shed on this?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rmh1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It is stated in this thread that ASIO4ALL will not do 24/96:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/as...o-work-284443/

 Is this the case? Jon L says he tried to contact the author and got no response. Any light you can shed on this?_

 

For as far as I know this is indeed the case. I have never been able to get that to work anyway. I will look in to it some more.


----------



## asainz

I have just received an iBasso D1 and I was having problems using windows xp+foobar+asio4all (last versions): random little stops in the sounds, glitches .... I configured asio4all using your guide and for now (listening in this moment) everything is solved!

 Thank you very, very much!!!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *asainz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have just received an iBasso D1 and I was having problems using windows xp+foobar+asio4all (last versions): random little stops in the sounds, glitches .... I configured asio4all using your guide and for now (listening in this moment) everything is solved!

 Thank you very, very much!!!_

 

You are welcome.


----------



## dragonchi

why isn't this stickied?!
 this would have been fantastic to have impletmented when i first got my laptop.

 only thing is that i get some clicks now during playback through winamp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i'm on a d630. hopefully it'll improve some more when i get my hippohifi 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 bass on my a900 has imporved soo much, thought i had wasted my money on some bass aniemic phones! i was about to sell it off for some beyer's until i started using asio.

 thank you , thankyou, thank you!!!

 edit2: im' running xp also


----------



## apnk

Wow! I just got my Pico a few days ago and I was having a hard time setting it up with Asio until I found your guide! Awesome! Thanks for taking the time to explain it to us dumb asses!


----------



## eruditass

i've heard otachan's winamp plugin is much better, but gapless doesn't work with it enabled :\ also how do i set the buffer size to 2000 ms? one of my plugins requires it. do i take the sample rate * asio4all's buffered samples * buffer settings in out_asio?

 and what is direct input monitor, convert 1ch-2ch, etc?


----------



## variable114

edited


----------



## siddiquehanif

Hi,

 Need Help!!!

 i just received my pico few days ago but i am having hard time to set it up with asio, i dont know whats the problem!

 i have foobar 9.5 with asio 2.8 downloaded form asio4all website. i followed all the steps explained on the 1st page of this thread but duno wats the problem. foobar and asio both are installed properly but In the foobar/preferences/output menu there is no any tab of Asio virtual devices so i canot access Asio virtual device editor. In the output device menu there are only four options coming:

 Null Output
 Primary Audio Driver
 soundmax HD audio
 Usb audio Dac


 help is highly appreciated!

 thanks,


----------



## jterp7

I did the same thing as you before (only dled the asio driver), you need to download the asio4all v2 program. After installing it, it will show up in foobar.


----------



## siddiquehanif

thanx jterp7 for the response.
 From which site can i get asio4all v2 download?


----------



## siddiquehanif

before i already tried asio v2.8 and v2.7 with foobar v9.5. i downloaded this from asio4all website (ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver) but it wont show up in foobar!


----------



## chesebert

bit perfect output from ALC889A; thank you.


----------



## jterp7

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *siddiquehanif* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_before i already tried asio v2.8 and v2.7 with foobar v9.5. i downloaded this from asio4all website (ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver) but it wont show up in foobar!_

 

oops, I actually got it backwards for you..you already have the asio program, what you need is the foobar plug in for asio

http://www.foobar2000.org/components/foo_out_asio.zip


----------



## jterp7

Enoyin- Since I got my Pico, I have that hooked up to the HD650s, and left my TBAAM connected to the audio in for my TV. To make things simpler I have foobar dedicated to the pico/hd650 and winamp for my "speakers". I've tried to configure the asio plug-in to work with both enabled but when I set it up in winamp no sound goes through. Also the second link you have for the asio plug in for winamp leads to a post about a sony DAP, i'm assuming this is a side effect from the downtime for head fi from the fall.

 nevermind: it looks like asio is against more than 1 device enabled at once. This may be slightly annoying as the plug in will need to be reenabled in both whenever I switch. The other alternative is to run everything through the pico...but is it good to constantly plug in and remove alternating between my "speakers" and the hd650s.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jterp7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Also the second link you have for the asio plug in for winamp leads to a post about a sony DAP, i'm assuming this is a side effect from the downtime for head fi from the fall._

 

Ai...

 Yeah, I suppose that's the downtime indeed. It'll take some time to find that post. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jterp7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nevermind: it looks like asio is against more than 1 device enabled at once._

 

That is correct. Both the advantage and disadvantage of ASIO.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jterp7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This may be slightly annoying as the plug in will need to be reenabled in both whenever I switch. The other alternative is to run everything through the pico...but is it good to constantly plug in and remove alternating between my "speakers" and the hd650s._

 

I am using a autohotkey script to switch between audio output devices. Works quite well if you ask me.


----------



## jterp7

alright What..now my winamp using asio skips now and then..and it seems directly related to me doing other things, nothing intensive, even surfing the web seems to cause it to skip...foobar didn't do this..are there other settings i'm supposed to change?


----------



## jiiteepee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jterp7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_alright What..now my winamp using asio skips now and then..and it seems directly related to me doing other things, nothing intensive, even surfing the web seems to cause it to skip...foobar didn't do this..are there other settings i'm supposed to change?_

 

Hmm... those issues comes mostly from too low latency settings / priorities (have you set priority to background services) but, are you sure TBAAM WDM drivers are 'fully' KS compatible? You can check this by selecting Kernel Streaming output mode.

 jiitee


----------



## jterp7

perhaps..but I think i'll just stick with foobar and change the settings there. I don't think its the TBAAM since it has never skipped in foobar


----------



## lromlin

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jiiteepee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm... those issues comes mostly from too low latency settings / priorities (have you set priority to background services) but, are you sure TBAAM WDM drivers are 'fully' KS compatible? You can check this by selecting Kernel Streaming output mode.

 jiitee_

 

Should it prio to background services or not? Ty


----------



## jiiteepee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lromlin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Should it prio to background services or not? Ty_

 

Yes, background services.

 jiitee


----------



## lromlin

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jiiteepee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, background services.

 jiitee_

 

Thank you.


----------



## Lew

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*
Setting Up ASIO4All:
 Some soundcards have their own ASIO driver installed allready. You should not install the driver again when this is the case. The cards that support ASIO natively are always better than cards which do not. True ASIO has no interference of the OS at all. You can skip this part and go on to to the part where the Foobar/WinAmp setup is explained.*_*
*
*


I have a X-Fi XtremeMusic. I believe that it supports ASIO. Should I be using the ASIO from the soundcard or ASIO4ALL?

 Which drivers do you refer to? 

 And which is "True ASIO"?*


----------



## Shahrose

thanks enoyin. got asio setup on my computer and there was a significant increase in sq. more details, larger soundstage, more texture to music and actually more dynamic range in a lot of my music. i switched back and forth and there is a clear audible difference (the things i outlined above). safe to say it isn't placebo. my sound card supports asio natively so i didn't need asio4all.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a X-Fi XtremeMusic. I believe that it supports ASIO. Should I be using the ASIO from the soundcard or ASIO4ALL?_

 

It does support ASIO. You do not need to install ASIO4All.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Which drivers do you refer to?_

 

I am referring to ASIO4All.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Should I be using the ASIO from the soundcard or ASIO4ALL?_

 

You should be using ASIO 2.0. (the soundcard)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And which is "True ASIO"?_

 

True ASIO is a card/device which already supports ASIO.(like your XtremeMusic)


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Shahrose* 
_thanks enoyin. got asio setup on my computer and there was a significant increase in sq. more details, larger soundstage, more texture to music and actually more dynamic range in a lot of my music. i switched back and forth and there is a clear audible difference (the things i outlined above). safe to say it isn't placebo. my sound card supports asio natively so i didn't need asio4all._


----------



## Shahrose

one thing i should say though. my music scroll/track bar stopped working in foobar after i switched to ASIO. it's strange. my visualization also stopped working/responding to music in foobar (that's not a big deal, but the trackbar is)

 the scroll bar (which u can drag to play any part of a song on the main foobar screen) is just permanently stuck at 0. it doesn't move, i can still move it myself to any part i want and it will play that part, but since it doesn't move on its own i don't know the progress of the song. also, the timer at the bottom shows 0/5:50 (the song is 5:50 min long) and doesn't start the countdown as the song plays, just stays at 0. 

 switching back to DS, the problems go away. has anyone found this when using ASIO with foobar? any advice to fix these issues?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Shahrose* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_one thing i should say though. my music scroll/track bar stopped working in foobar after i switched to ASIO. it's strange. my visualization also stopped working/responding to music in foobar (that's not a big deal, but the trackbar is)

 the scroll bar (which u can drag to play any part of a song on the main foobar screen) is just permanently stuck at 0. it doesn't move, i can still move it myself to any part i want and it will play that part, but since it doesn't move on its own i don't know the progress of the song. also, the timer at the bottom shows 0/5:50 (the song is 5:50 min long) and doesn't start the countdown as the song plays, just stays at 0. 

 switching back to DS, the problems go away. has anyone found this when using ASIO with foobar? any advice to fix these issues?_

 

Never happened to me before. It might be the ASIO driver you are using, but I can't be sure.


----------



## Shahrose

i'm using the one that was linked on your tutorial, the one on the official foobar page to add ASIO support. i'm surprised noone else has found this. this only happens when i'm using ASIO.


----------



## lromlin

I have the same problem, but only when using flac. not mp3


----------



## Lew

Is there a proper way to set up ASIO on a X-Fi XtremeMusic card?

 Enabling Bit-Match playback on Creative Audio Console?
 " " " " "Creative Console Launcher?

 Downloading foobar2000 ASIO support plugin?
 Downloading foobar2000 Kernel Streaming support?

 Setting Creative clock Master Sampling Rate -> ? 44.1 kHz?

 Setting foobar2000 preference Output Device to 
 DS: SB X-Fi Audio [E400] ?
 or KS: SB X-Fi Audio [E400] ?
 or Null Output ?

 Buffer Length on foobar2000 - 2040-2060ms?


----------



## basman

Please help!

 Whenever I select ASIO as output device in Foobar, it wont work. Sorry, noob here in computer audio.

 My set up:

 PC SPDIF out > D1 > Amp > Headphones

 Thanks a lot!


----------



## EnOYiN

Sorry guys. I missed these posts for a while. If you want a faster answer you should send me a PM.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Shahrose* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i'm using the one that was linked on your tutorial, the one on the official foobar page to add ASIO support. i'm surprised noone else has found this. this only happens when i'm using ASIO._

 

I haven't got a clue. You should start a new topic either here or on HydroGen Audio. I am sure there are other people who've had this problem before.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lromlin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have the same problem, but only when using flac. not mp3_

 

Same answer as above. I just don't know what's up.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is there a proper way to set up ASIO on a X-Fi XtremeMusic card?_

 

Yup. There is.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Enabling Bit-Match playback on Creative Audio Console?
 " " " " "Creative Console Launcher?_

 

Bit-matched playback is something you would definitely want enabled when using your X-Fi as a transport. (when connecting another DAC to it with a digital cable)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Downloading foobar2000 ASIO support plugin?
 Downloading foobar2000 Kernel Streaming support?_

 

Downloading foobar2000 ASIO support plugin. <-- That one is the right one. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Setting Creative clock Master Sampling Rate -> ? 44.1 kHz?_

 

Haven't got a clue. Maybe you should ask someone with a X-Fi card. I don't own one myself so I don't know all the specs and options it has to offer.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Setting foobar2000 preference Output Device to 
 DS: SB X-Fi Audio [E400] ?
 or KS: SB X-Fi Audio [E400] ?
 or Null Output ?_

 

None of the above. Have you read the guide? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Get the ASIO output plug-in for Foobar. Here it is.

 Put that file. (the dll) in your components directory and select it as output device.

 All of these things are written down in the first post. I would really like it if you read that first instead of me having to repeat myself every time. I mean no offence if you actually did, but I just don't like repeating myself. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Buffer Length on foobar2000 - 2040-2060ms?_

 

Good. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Shouldn't matter that much. Just use the default. (which is 2000ms for as far as I know)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *basman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please help!

 Whenever I select ASIO as output device in Foobar, it wont work. Sorry, noob here in computer audio.

 My set up:

 PC SPDIF out > D1 > Amp > Headphones

 Thanks a lot!_

 

Hmm. A bit more info than: "It won't work" would really be appreciated. 

 I'll give you a few suggestions:

 - Have you checked (and double checked) that everything is set like it should be? (like latency in ASIO, latency in Foobar, the right setting for the output channels)
 - Does Direct Sound work without a problem?
 - What soundcard are you using?
 - What version of Foobar are you using?
 - What version of ASIO4All are you using? (if needed for your soundcard)
 - Have you read the entire first post?


----------



## nettuno65

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Shouldn't matter that much. Just use the default. (which is 2000ms for as far as I know)



 - Have you checked (and double checked) that everything is set like it should be? (like latency in ASIO, latency in Foobar, the right setting for the output channels)



_

 

Hi, the default value buffer lenght on Foobar 0.9.5 is 500ms, is it better 2000ms?

 Is this the latency setting in Foobar?

 Thanks for your help


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nettuno65* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi, the default value buffer lenght on Foobar 0.9.5 is 500ms, is it better 2000ms?_

 

Good. good. I never knew that. But no. It's not better. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nettuno65* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is this the latency setting in Foobar?_

 

Yah, Something like it anyway. Never really figured out much about it because it just isn't doing what it's supposed to do.. It doesn't give a latency of 8000ms. Although I think that is the purpose of it was anyway. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nettuno65* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for your help
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I didn't help out here, but thanks anyway.


----------



## Ice Max

i got asio4all working with winamp with flac and some other lossless files, but nothing with mp3s. is it possible to get it to work with mp3s?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Ice Max* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i got asio4all working with winamp with flac and some other lossless files, but nothing with mp3s. is it possible to get it to work with mp3s?_

 

Yeah, it's supposed to work just as well with mp3s or any other lossy file as long as your audio application can decode the format.


----------



## tha_dude

Hi, I'm trying to use the native Creative ASIO driver on my X-Fi to a USB DAC. However, the DAC doesn't show up as a device channel when I try to edit the settings in foobar.

 If I try ASIO4ALL then the DAC shows up. Anyone know how to get the Creative ASIO driver to recognize the DAC?

 Thanks


----------



## jiiteepee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi, *I'm trying to use the native Creative ASIO driver on my X-Fi to a USB DAC.* However, the DAC doesn't show up as a device channel when I try to edit the settings in foobar.

 If I try ASIO4ALL then the DAC shows up. *Anyone know how to get the Creative ASIO driver to recognize the DAC?*

 Thanks_

 

That's not possible ... since, all native drivers are card specific.

 jiitee


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jiiteepee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's not possible ... since, all native drivers are card specific.

 jiitee_

 

Thanks for clearing that up. The first post mentions that if our card supports ASIO then we don't need ASIO4ALL. I've installed the foobar asio output to the components directory but am not sure how to configure the output in foobar to go through the DAC. Trying to add a new device doesn't list the DAC. Any help would be appreciated.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for clearing that up. The first post mentions that if our card supports ASIO then we don't need ASIO4ALL. I've installed the foobar asio output to the components directory but am not sure how to configure the output in foobar to go through the DAC. Trying to add a new device doesn't list the DAC. Any help would be appreciated._

 

It shouldn't list the DAC. It should list the soundcard. Or am I misunderstanding something here?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It shouldn't list the DAC. It should list the soundcard. Or am I misunderstanding something here?_

 

EnOYiN, I'm pretty sure it did list the soundcard (at work right now so can't check), but when playing files I got no sound which led me to believe that the soundcard was doing all of the decoding and not the DAC.


----------



## Manny Calavera

Thank you for the Tutorial op !!


----------



## tha_dude

Just how much of a difference is there in sound quality when using ASIO4ALL as opposed to the soundcard's ASIO drivers? So far, the only way i can get music through my usb dac is with ASIO4ALL. But I'd like to use my SoundBlaster X-Fi's ASIO drivers instead. Any X-Fi owners or non-ASIO4ALL people here that might be able to help me out?

 Thanks in advance


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just how much of a difference is there in sound quality when using ASIO4ALL as opposed to the soundcard's ASIO drivers? So far, the only way i can get music through my usb dac is with ASIO4ALL. But I'd like to use my SoundBlaster X-Fi's ASIO drivers instead. Any X-Fi owners or non-ASIO4ALL people here that might be able to help me out?

 Thanks in advance_

 

I doubt the differences between the native ASIO and ASIO4All are actually audible. They are subtle between DS and any method of ASIO. 

 I haven't got an X-Fi myself so I'm afraid I can't help you any further. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Maybe you should start a new thread to get some more replies. Good luck.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Manny Calavera* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thank you for the Tutorial op !!_

 

Thanks. You are welcome.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I doubt the differences between the native ASIO and ASIO4All are actually audible. They are subtle between DS and any method of ASIO. 

 I haven't got an X-Fi myself so I'm afraid I can't help you any further. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe you should start a new thread to get some more replies. Good luck._

 

thanks for your input, I'll do that. also, nice job on the asio4all guide


----------



## jung

Is there any way to enable ASIO in WMP?

 Or, how to change my following internet radio links for WMA to play in foobar?
http://radiobit.50webs.com/


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is there any way to enable ASIO in WMP?

 Or, how to change my following internet radio links for WMA to play in foobar?
http://radiobit.50webs.com/_

 

If you can download a Foobar PLS file, which is no more than a textfile called pls really, you can use Foobar for internet radio.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Example PLS file* 
_[playlist]
 NumberOfEntries=1
 File1=http://shoutcast.omroep.nl:8114/_


----------



## Rempert

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for clearing that up. The first post mentions that if our card supports ASIO then we don't need ASIO4ALL. I've installed the foobar asio output to the components directory but am not sure how to configure the output in foobar to go through the DAC. Trying to add a new device doesn't list the DAC. Any help would be appreciated._

 

If your DAC is plugged to the computer via USB, and you are listening to the computer through the DAC, then you aren't using your other sound card for anything whatsoever. To run sound through the other sound card into the DAC, you would have to run a cable from the sound card's digital output to the DAC's digital input.

 That would be fairly pointless for just listening to music. But if you are gaming through your DAC and you have an X-fi sitting there doing nothing, that would be quite a shame.


----------



## STONER1

I installed asio4all and it killed my volume. I have to max out the vol. on my little dot MK 1 on a gain setting of 8 to get a decent listening level from my Senn EH150's. I originally thought it was my amp. I uninstalled asio4all and now my amp is giving my plenty of vol. at 12 o clock and gain setting of 2. My setup consist of the following
 foobar+keces 151+LD MK1.

 Im still waiting on my Little Dot MKIII and Denon D2000 to get here later this week thus why Im using the MK1 for now. I would really like to take advantage of asio, but would like to know what I was doing wrong or if its still OS related and I should switch to ASIO-USB.


----------



## Ice Max

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, it's supposed to work just as well with mp3s or any other lossy file as long as your audio application can decode the format._

 

I finally got foobar2000, and AISO playback works without a hitch on Mp3 as well as Flacs. I guess Winamp is just stupid sometimes

 now i just have to get foobar2000 setup and working like i want it to (Similar to Winamp if i can)


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *STONER1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I installed asio4all and it killed my volume. I have to max out the vol. on my little dot MK 1 on a gain setting of 8 to get a decent listening level from my Senn EH150's. I originally thought it was my amp. I uninstalled asio4all and now my amp is giving my plenty of vol. at 12 o clock and gain setting of 2. My setup consist of the following
 foobar+keces 151+LD MK1.

 Im still waiting on my Little Dot MKIII and Denon D2000 to get here later this week thus why Im using the MK1 for now. I would really like to take advantage of asio, but would like to know what I was doing wrong or if its still OS related and I should switch to ASIO-USB._

 

There must be some kind of volume slider in Windows somewhere which isn't maxed. I can't think of anything else to be honest.


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you can download a Foobar PLS file, which is no more than a textfile called pls really, you can use Foobar for internet radio._

 

Actually I should not change the links. Otherwise those who do not use foobar won't be able to play in WMP.

 So is there a way to setup foobar to play the WMA internet radio links?
http://radiobit.50webs.com/


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Actually I should not change the links. Otherwise those who do not use foobar won't be able to play in WMP.

 So is there a way to setup foobar to play the WMA internet radio links?
http://radiobit.50webs.com/_

 

Well, yes and no. If you are asking whether Foobar supports the mms:// protocol then the answer would be no I'm afraid. If you are asking whether you can play radio stations in Foobar then the answer would be yes.

 As long as there is a direct location from which you can stream you can add it in Foobar. (add location --> add the url there)

 An example of an URL that will work in Foobar is:
http://kexp-mp3-128k.cac.washington.edu:8000/

 Sadly this is a 128kbps link for mp3. The wma links for this radio station are using the mms:// protocol which you can not play in Foobar. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 There is however another way to get these streams to play in Foobar which is to rip the original streams with something like the stream ripper and then convert them to a protocol/ file format which Foobar can play. Quite the hassle though.

 This is getting a bit off-topic for this topic btw.

 Edit: Note the beginning of the URL. It is using the http:// protocol.


----------



## STONER1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There must be some kind of volume slider in Windows somewhere which isn't maxed. I can't think of anything else to be honest._

 

Well that was my first thought, but ASIO took total control, the system volume has been disabled. ANd on foobar the volume is maxed.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *STONER1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well that was my first thought, but ASIO took total control, the system volume has been disabled. ANd on foobar the volume is maxed._

 

One of the system volume sliders should still work. The main volume slider that is. The wave slider should indeed be disabled.


----------



## STONER1

Ill try reinstalling asio and posting a pic of what the main vol and other sliders look like. I dont disagree that I should still have vol. control within the system settings. Ill play around with it.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *STONER1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ill try reinstalling asio and posting a pic of what the main vol and other sliders look like. I dont disagree that I should still have vol. control within the system settings. Ill play around with it._

 

Should. I'm not saying that you actually do when you say you don't.


----------



## ted betley

With respect to asio drivers with foobar and a benchmark usb dac, EnOYin, are you saying that one doesn't need the asio drivers? I tried to d/l the asio drivers and while they show in components, they do not show in preferences. So I don't know if foobar is optimized or not. Is it? BTW I really enjoy your posts, I have learned alot from you, thanks!!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ted betley* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_With respect to asio drivers with foobar and a benchmark usb dac, EnOYin, are you saying that one doesn't need the asio drivers? I tried to d/l the asio drivers and while they show in components, they do not show in preferences. So I don't know if foobar is optimized or not. Is it?_

 

For as far as I know the Benchmark DAC1 can have a bit-perfect output without ASIO. You can just use DS for it. However, I am not an expert on the matter so I think you should try asking EliasGwinn to be sure about it.

 What version of Foobar are you using and which version of the ASIO plug-in are you using?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ted betley* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_BTW I really enjoy your posts, I have learned alot from you, thanks!!_

 

Thanks. You are welcome.


----------



## ted betley

Hi EnOYin. I have foobar 0.9.5.1. ASIO is 1.2.6. I believe that wmp11 sounds better than foobar which is counter to many other reports. So I conclude foobar is not set up correct especially wrt asio.


----------



## ricmat

Hi Guys!


 First, let me thank you and congratulate you for this great tutorial!


 Second, I was trying to follow all of your steps, and I did everything. Everything seemed perfect, but when I got back to Foobar to play a music, *there was no sound at all!

*I have the latest version of foobar, and according to ASIO, my sound card is Conexant HDA-Venice 5045.

 Do you have a clue about what's happening?


 Cheers!


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ricmat* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Second, I was trying to follow all of your steps, and I did everything. Everything seemed perfect, but when I got back to Foobar to play a music, *there was no sound at all!*_*
*
*


Try enable Hardware Buffer.*


----------



## Audax

I installed the ASIO output plugin 0.67 for winamp. My sound card is a Creative X-fi Platinum so it supports ASIO and i don't need ASIO4All. I then double clicked on the plugin in the list of preferences and chose "Creative ASIO". 

 I can't adjust the volume in winamp anymore, but i can still adjust the volume in windows. I guess it doesn't bypass the K-mixer as it normally should.

 Can anyone help me on this ?

*EDIT* : Apparently bit-matched playback in creative X-fi does the same as ASIO. What should i use ?


----------



## Audax

bump ! 

 After reading the whole topic it is still unclear whether i should use Creative's "bit-matched playback" or the ASIO protocol.


----------



## jiiteepee

Why not both? I suppose bit-matched mode needs the output driver to be selected as well.

 'bout bit-matched mode - Creative Labs Europe Knowledge Base - Customer Support KnowledgeBase, Troubleshooting, and Technical Articles

 jiitee


----------



## Audax

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jiiteepee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Why not both? I suppose bit-matched mode needs the output driver to be selected as well.

 'bout bit-matched mode - Creative Labs Europe Knowledge Base - Customer Support KnowledgeBase, Troubleshooting, and Technical Articles

 jiitee

 Thanks Jiiteepee , i will use both_

 

*HELP !*

 I tried Both Creative's ASIO and ASIO4all with output plugin 0.67 and 0.70 for Winamp. The explanation says that the windows volume slider shouldn't work anymore. Winamp's volume is maximized but i can still adjust the master volume in control panel..


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Audax* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*HELP !*

 I tried Both Creative's ASIO and ASIO4all with output plugin 0.67 and 0.70 for Winamp. The explanation says that the windows volume slider shouldn't work anymore. Winamp's volume is maximized but i can still adjust the master volume in control panel.._

 

It is working correct. You shouldn't be able to adjust the volume with the 'wave' slider, but the master volume should still be working.

 I suppose I should edit that.


----------



## Audax

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It is working correct. You shouldn't be able to adjust the volume with the 'wave' slider, but the master volume should still be working.

 I suppose I should edit that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 


 Yes the wave slider is maximized, can't adjust the volume with it anymore. The bypass is working. *Thanks* for the Help Enoyin, i really appreciate. 

 Using X-fi Platinum, bit-matched playback, 0 effects, 0 EQ, ASIO protocol, lossless (1st copy from Original CD), AKG k701. My first impression on the K701's is confirmed , they need an amp and maybe cables for better bass. but midrange and treble are godly.


----------



## dandi

I downloaded AISO4ALL and am using it with Winamp. I notice a lot more 'skipping' or stuttering in playback when using AISO4All than the default. When Winamp is the only application running or when I am checking email or surfing it seems to happen. With email and browsing the stuttering occurs when I open a program, send/receive mail or change web pages. With just Winamp running I still experience this when the screen saver mode goes on. Any suggestions??


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dandi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I downloaded AISO4ALL and am using it with Winamp. I notice a lot more 'skipping' or stuttering in playback when using AISO4All than the default. When Winamp is the only application running or when I am checking email or surfing it seems to happen. With email and browsing the stuttering occurs when I open a program, send/receive mail or change web pages. With just Winamp running I still experience this when the screen saver mode goes on. Any suggestions??_

 

Yup. Buy a Mac or get linux. There is some problem with Windows which causes your network adapter to influence the output signal of several devices. (including USB devices and sound cards)


----------



## dandi

Hummm??!!
 I like the perceived difference in SQ from ASIO4all but, most likely, will not be going Mac or linux. Is there an alternative audio drive offering a superior SQ? I might just have to live with the stuttering


----------



## ted betley

EnOYin: I am using j river with a usb benchmark dac. I tried d/l-ing asio4all, followed the 9 page documentation but can't seem to get it to work. I get an error diagnostic saying 'direct show filters not available...'or something like that. Can you help me with this?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ted betley* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_EnOYin: I am using j river with a usb benchmark dac. I tried d/l-ing asio4all, followed the 9 page documentation but can't seem to get it to work. I get an error diagnostic saying 'direct show filters not available...'or something like that. Can you help me with this?_

 

For as far as I know the Benchmark DAC1 is an exception on the rule. It will output bitperfect when using DS. To be sure about this you should read the huge DAC1 thread or PM Elias.


----------



## ted betley

Well maybe I'm paranoid about trying asio but I'll take your word and leave well enough alone. Thanks Enoyin.


----------



## oatmeal769

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dandi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I downloaded AISO4ALL and am using it with Winamp. I notice a lot more 'skipping' or stuttering in playback when using AISO4All than the default. When Winamp is the only application running or when I am checking email or surfing it seems to happen. With email and browsing the stuttering occurs when I open a program, send/receive mail or change web pages. With just Winamp running I still experience this when the screen saver mode goes on. Any suggestions??_

 

I've been following this (and several other) threads regarding use of Winamp with X-Fi Extreme Music. I too had the stuttering weirdness with ASIO4All, so I switched to Kernel Streaming, which works fine.

 However, I'm still able to get windows sounds during playback, (IE the 'ding' when adjusting volume from the taskbar) and a DTS audio file I downloaded plays as static. How can I be sure this is working, or have I done something wrong?
 Does anyone have a link to how to make bit perfect work with an X-Fi Extreme Music? Or is it working already and how do I test?


----------



## EBisky

ASIO support is so easy with foobar and foobar is a superior player. Why use Winamp?? Upgrade!

 -E


----------



## oatmeal769

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EBisky* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ASIO support is so easy with foobar and foobar is a superior player. Why use Winamp?? Upgrade!

 -E_

 

This really isn't what I asked. 
 Actually, I'd prefer to continue using WMP, but it apparently cannot output 'bit perfect'.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Well, we have to use WMP to load the kid's Verizon cell phones with music, so I moved the darn PC out of my theater room and to my son's room. I am not going to bother cr*ppy PC's with ASIO4ALL and foobar and my PICO to DV336i, but will just keep using the iBook and Macbook to feed the PICO and DV336i instead, since they work like they should.


----------



## oatmeal769

Well, again, this really isn't what I asked. I'm sure the Mac OS works great for some, but it's worthless for what I mostly do with computers (Gaming, etc.) I'm trying to test my current setup for 'bit perfect' output, and if it isn't there, any suggestions on how to configure my current setup for Bit Perfect output.
 I have an X-Fi Xtreme Music, with the I/O box. Winamp, and the Kernel Streaming plug-in. 
 I do not want Foobar, because I already have other of hobbies outside of spending hours on chatboards trying to configure media players.
 I hope this doesn't come off wrong, it's just that I've spent much of the last week searching here and elsewhere for a solution.
 Thanks!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oatmeal769* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, again, this really isn't what I asked. I'm sure the Mac OS works great for some, but it's worthless for what I mostly do with computers (Gaming, etc.) I'm trying to test my current setup for 'bit perfect' output, and if it isn't there, any suggestions on how to configure my current setup for Bit Perfect output.
 I have an X-Fi Xtreme Music, with the I/O box. Winamp, and the Kernel Streaming plug-in. 
 I do not want Foobar, because I already have other of hobbies outside of spending hours on chatboards trying to configure media players.
 I hope this doesn't come off wrong, it's just that I've spent much of the last week searching here and elsewhere for a solution.
 Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, I am just saying I'm giving up trying to get WMP to sound good, and staying with Mac - meaning I won't be able to help. Not saying Mac is your solution, it was mine...


----------



## dandi

Firstly thanks to Enoyin for a great OP I vote for a sticky.
 I have just switched to Foobar 2000 with AISO4ALL.
 I still need Winamp, or another media player, to play streaming audio I think. Is it possible to stream audio say from radio stations with Winamp with ASIO4ALL I am getting a high speed fast forward playback when trying to use Winamp and ASIO4ALL.


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dandi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have just switched to Foobar 2000 with AISO4ALL.
 I still need Winamp, or another media player, to play streaming audio I think._

 

Foobar plays MP3, OGG, and AAC radio links on my page fine.
http://radiobit.50webs.com/

 Both Winamp and Foobar can not play all the WMA or RA radio links. I need WMP and RP.


----------



## shinew

Just to report that Corda 2Move works great with ASIO4ALL! And thanks for the guide!

 I've tested it with Foobar2000 plugin for bitperfect playback and Synthogy Ivory for midi play back(w/ 128 buffer, virtually no latency) flawlessly. 
 Haven't compared the playback quality with Itunes though...


----------



## shinew

apparently according to the engineer for the DA-151 DAC -> http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/ke...ml#post3663957
 DACs which use PCM2702(like 2move, Cantate, DA-151 & earlier model of Microdac) will not need foobar or winamp plugin to get bit-perfect output under windows as long as the source is 32/44.1/48KHz. 

 Oh Well, I just spent hours setting up the foobar with my preferred layout, now going back to itunes...


----------



## The Legend

Great guide and very informative.


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shinew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_apparently according to the engineer for the DA-151 DAC -> http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/ke...ml#post3663957
 DACs which use PCM2702(like 2move, Cantate, DA-151 & earlier model of Microdac) will not need foobar or winamp plugin to get bit-perfect output under windows as long as the source is 32/44.1/48KHz. 

 Oh Well, I just spent hours setting up the foobar with my preferred layout, now going back to itunes... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Many, maybe most, systems do not need ASIO to output bit perfect. On these systems, ASIO is an insurance, not an absolute neccessity. 

 If you play 44.1kHz music, and at the same time Windows play some 48kHz sound, then DS will resample your music to 48kHz, destroying bit perfect. With ASIO, DS will not resample the ASIO stream.


----------



## dandi

Need some help: I have asio4all installed on Foobar and Winamp
 when I go to a web radio stream, WKCR 89.9 FM NY for example, winamp is my default player there. The stream runs fast sounds like chipmunks. Worked fine before the asio install. What am I missing? Should I be able to stream with winamp asio or can I set winamp to its default so asio is used with foobar and not with winamp?


----------



## shinew

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you play 44.1kHz music, and at the same time Windows play some 48kHz sound, then DS will resample your music to 48kHz, destroying bit perfect. With ASIO, DS will not resample the ASIO stream._

 

I see. So when there is some 48kHz sounds playing while I'm listening to 44.1kHz music, _everything_(including the 44.1 music) will be converted to 48kHz? If so, what happens to the 44.1kHz music immediately after the 48kHz sounds have stopped playing? Is it going to be continuely converted to 48kHz or going back to its native 44.1kHz?


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shinew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I see. So when there is some 48kHz sounds playing while I'm listening to 44.1kHz music, everything(including the 44.1 music) will be converted to 48kHz? If so, what happens to the 44.1kHz music immediately after the 48kHz sounds have stopped playing? Is it going to be continuely converted to 48kHz or going back to its native 44.1kHz?_

 

If the sound output has only one DAC chip capable of only one stereo stream, then the computer has to digitally mix together all the sounds into one stream. Resampling everything in the mix to the highest rate in the mix makes sense. I don't know whether Windows would stop resampling when the highest sample rate stream is no longer there.


----------



## shinew

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If the sound output has only one DAC chip capable of only one stereo stream, then the computer has to digitally mix together all the sounds into one stream. Resampling everything in the mix to the highest rate in the mix makes sense. I don't know whether Windows would stop resampling when the highest sample rate stream is no longer there._

 

Thanks! anyone else can answer this?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I think it resamples them all up to whatever the highest one being mixed is at, but kmixer does a poor job of it. ASIO4ALL prevents kmixer from screwing it up, I thought.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shinew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I see. So when there is some 48kHz sounds playing while I'm listening to 44.1kHz music, everything(including the 44.1 music) will be converted to 48kHz? If so, what happens to the 44.1kHz music immediately after the 48kHz sounds have stopped playing? Is it going to be continuely converted to 48kHz or going back to its native 44.1kHz?_

 

Music will play for a little while longer at 48 kHz after the actual 48 sound stopped. Just a little while though. I tested this with an external DAC which was only capable of 44.1 kHz. The time I didn't get any sound at all was the lenght of the soundfile + a little while for Windows to try and figure out what it was doing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shinew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks! anyone else can answer this?_

 

Yup.


----------



## shinew

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Music will play for a little while longer at 48 kHz after the actual 48 sound stopped. Just a little while though. I tested this with an external DAC which was only capable of 44.1 kHz. The time I didn't get any sound at all was the lenght of the soundfile + a little while for Windows to try and figure out what it was doing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 Yup._

 

cool thanks!


----------



## ted betley

ENoyin I finally got asio4all to work in j rivers by disabling midi and by unmapping my Dac in windows. And yes it sounds great but when I go to my desktop Asio4all settings it still shows the Benchmark disabled. Is that normal? Am I or am I not going thru Asio4all?


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Music will play for a little while longer at 48 kHz after the actual 48 sound stopped. Just a little while though. I tested this with an external DAC which was only capable of 44.1 kHz. The time I didn't get any sound at all was the lenght of the soundfile + a little while for Windows to try and figure out what it was doing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I don't know whether your DAC tells Windows that it can not play 48kHz, and whether Windows react differently based on that info.

 It would be a better test with a DAC that supports both 44.1 and 48 kHz, and can display the actual sampling frequency of the incoming digital stream. It would be helpful if someone can try this, and let us know the frequency the DAC shows.


----------



## tjumper78

thanks for the guide. asio4all is working nicely with my laptop and keces dac-151.
 i am using it with winamp.
 sorry if this has been asked in the thread already (i only read up to page 10) when i start playing a file, winamp plays a split second of a previous file before it starts playing the file i choose to play. it only happens when i click the "next track" button or double click on a different file. not a big deal but is there a way to fix this?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ted betley* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ENoyin I finally got asio4all to work in j rivers by disabling midi and by unmapping my Dac in windows. And yes it sounds great but when I go to my desktop Asio4all settings it still shows the Benchmark disabled. Is that normal? Am I or am I not going thru Asio4all?_

 

It's working just fine for as far as I can tell. I think they fixed this issue in the new ASIO4All. (not sure though)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't know whether your DAC tells Windows that it can not play 48kHz, and whether Windows react differently based on that info._

 

It tells Windows that it can't play 48 kHz and with good reason for it as well. It simply can't you see. It's a 44.1 kHz DAC. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It would be a better test with a DAC that supports both 44.1 and 48 kHz, and can display the actual sampling frequency of the incoming digital stream. It would be helpful if someone can try this, and let us know the frequency the DAC shows._

 

I agree, but people have been testing this already. You should check the AVS forums for the test results. They even measured the length of time it takes Windows to get back to the 'real' sampling rate. (in ms for as far as I can remember) I can't find it right now, but I am sure it's there. Look it up if you are interested. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tjumper78* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_thanks for the guide. asio4all is working nicely with my laptop and keces dac-151.
 i am using it with winamp.
 sorry if this has been asked in the thread already (i only read up to page 10) when i start playing a file, winamp plays a split second of a previous file before it starts playing the file i choose to play. it only happens when i click the "next track" button or double click on a different file. not a big deal but is there a way to fix this?_

 

Yeah, there have been some people reporting this issue before. I am not sure whether they did so in this thread or in other ones though and nor do I know the solution for it right now. Sorry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## jung

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It tells Windows that it can't play 48 kHz and with good reason for it as well. It simply can't you see. It's a 44.1 kHz DAC. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Then Windows is very stupid. Your DAC already tells Windows that it does not support 48kHz. Windows should resample 48kHz to 44.1kHz for your DAC, instead of resampling 44.1kHz to 48kHz and causing your DAC to output no sound at all.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jung* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Then Windows is very stupid. Your DAC already tells Windows that it does not support 48kHz. Windows should resample 48kHz to 44.1kHz for your DAC, instead of resampling 44.1kHz to 48kHz and causing your DAC to output no sound at all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, not that stupid actually. The DAC was made way before Windows was made. Not saying that the kmixer was a great invention, but it does explain why they didn't care about such things. Almost every newer DAC does support both 44.1 and 48.


----------



## tjumper78

are the usb dac users supposed to benefit from using asio?


----------



## movie_fan

Hi,

 I'm trying to get my HagUsb working with the USB-AUDIO drivers in Foobar2000.

 I've installed it and chosen "DS: AudioDevice on USB Bus" as the output device, and all I can hear is the 20 second beeping of the unregistered drivers. When I press play in Foobar2000, the file doesn't play.

 If I use the ASIO4ALL drivers, everything works fine.

 Operating system is Windows XP.

 Any ideas?


----------



## movie_fan

Strange.... I just got it working in Winamp.

 So, is this an issue with Foobar2000??


----------



## movie_fan

Ok, finally got it working.... Had to choose "ASIO: usb.de audio driver" as the output device..


----------



## apnk

I just installed Winamp and the volume is louder than both Foobar and Mediamonkey. Weird, also Winamp and Mediamonkey both use the exact same plugin. Any ideas?


 EDIT: Nevermind, I figured it out. It was not reading the volume leveling, needed to turn that option on.


----------



## John E Woven

Can't seem to find anything on this, but does asio4all work in windows vista 64 bit?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *John E Woven* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can't seem to find anything on this, but does asio4all work in windows vista 64 bit?_

 

I haven't got a clue and since I haven't got a 64 bit Vista machine at hand right now I can't find it out straight away.

 Why don't you try it yourself and see if it works?

 P.S. I would like to say that I don't see any need for ASIO4All to achieve better sound quality in Windows Vista.


----------



## Dominat0r

I just installed ASIO4ALL and Foobar2000. 

 I got it setup right i think, however when i play music and open up the ASIO4ALL settings, the DAC shows up with a red X on it. However, when i stop the music and look, its green. Is this normal?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HighLife* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just installed ASIO4ALL and Foobar2000. 

 I got it setup right i think, however when i play music and open up the ASIO4ALL settings, the DAC shows up with a red X on it. However, when i stop the music and look, its green. Is this normal?_

 

Yes, it's normal. I am not sure which version you are using, but they said they fixed that bug in the newest version.


----------



## Dominat0r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, it's normal. I am not sure which version you are using, but they said they fixed that bug in the newest version._

 

Ahh, yes its in the beta version, i didnt use the beta. If it still working i guess its ok for now. I will wait till the beta comes out in final version. 

 However as long as it plays its working correct?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HighLife* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ahh, yes its in the beta version, i didnt use the beta. If it still working i guess its ok for now. I will wait till the beta comes out in final version. 

 However as long as it plays its working correct?_

 

Yes, most likely it is. As long as you followed the guide and you hear music I think you are just fine.


----------



## skeptic

Should the volume control in foobar be disabled/not function if ASIO is setup correctly? I believe I have followed all of the steps in setting up my X-fi for foobar ASIO, but the volume control still works - and unless this is adjusting the overall system volume, doesn't this mean that the sound is still passing through the Kmixer?

 I generally use Winamp for ASIO, and there my volume control is disabled.

 Thanks in advance for any guidance/answers you can provide.


----------



## Dominat0r

i think the volume control should work in foobar but not in the windows volume control panel, this means you bypassing the kmixer. I could be wrong though.


----------



## skeptic

Good thought! I'll have to open the control panel tonight while I've got foobar up and running to see whether the wave volume or system volume is changing when I move the foobar slider.


----------



## andrew3199

I set up winamp as per the guide but I can still change the volume with the "Windows" volume control. Does this mean that Winamp is still using Kmixer?

 Great guide by the way...


----------



## skeptic

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *andrew3199* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I set up winamp as per the guide but I can still change the volume with the "Windows" volume control. Does this mean that Winamp is still using Kmixer?

 Great guide by the way...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





_

 

Sounds like you've got it setup correctly. The windows volume control should work, but the slider in winamp should be disabled.

 Here's some further info on the various options in the Winamp ASIO configuration tab:: Winamp Tweak Guide - TechSpot


----------



## apnk

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skeptic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sounds like you've got it setup correctly. The windows volume control should work, but the slider in winamp should be disabled.

 Here's some further info on the various options in the Winamp ASIO configuration tab:: Winamp Tweak Guide - TechSpot_

 

Wah?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 On my computer using winamp, the slider in winamp works (changes the volume) but the windows volume does not (you can move it but it does nothing to the volume).


----------



## oatmeal769

Anyone have any experience using this:
ASIO2KS - Generic ASIO driver for WDM soundcards.
 Rather than ASIO4ALL?


----------



## ted betley

Mister Enoyin: I have run into difficulty using asio4all. When I use with j river or cicsplay I ocassionally get pops/crackles that are very loud. At times it has shut down my usb line into my benchmark. When I switched from asio4all to direct sound the pops go away in j river. So any ideas? Sometimes it works for days with no pops then out of nowhere they return. Some have advised me that I should try different asio programs such as asio for usb or asio2K. Should I? Another question can I d/l another asio program and use it without unistalling asio4all? Any other light that you could shed on this would be appreciated.


----------



## Mudshark

Thanks for the guide. I tried running ASIO4ALL with Foobar and get this error message:

 Unrecoverable playback error: Device has 10 output channels, expected 8

 Any ideas? Thanks in advance.


----------



## direcow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mudshark* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the guide. I tried running ASIO4ALL with Foobar and get this error message:

 Unrecoverable playback error: Device has 10 output channels, expected 8

 Any ideas? Thanks in advance._

 

it happens to me when my PC doesn't detect my audio device properly. a reboot usually solves the trick.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ted betley* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Mister Enoyin: I have run into difficulty using asio4all. When I use with j river or cicsplay I ocassionally get pops/crackles that are very loud. At times it has shut down my usb line into my benchmark. When I switched from asio4all to direct sound the pops go away in j river. So any ideas? Sometimes it works for days with no pops then out of nowhere they return. Some have advised me that I should try different asio programs such as asio for usb or asio2K. Should I? Another question can I d/l another asio program and use it without unistalling asio4all? Any other light that you could shed on this would be appreciated._

 

If you are using a Benchmark DAC1 (which I think you are referring to) there is no need for ASIO according to Elias. Send him a PM for more info.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *oatmeal769* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone have any experience using this:
ASIO2KS - Generic ASIO driver for WDM soundcards.
 Rather than ASIO4ALL?_

 

Yeah, tried it. It works just fine, but I haven't got a clue whether the project is still alive because it seems dead.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mudshark* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the guide. I tried running ASIO4ALL with Foobar and get this error message:

 Unrecoverable playback error: Device has 10 output channels, expected 8

 Any ideas? Thanks in advance._

 

This might happen for a few reasons. The most important ones are that you have been switching an external device on or off, Windows didn't get why you had to do that so it gives an error or, secondly, your device driver isn't working properly or something went wrong within the OS. (the communication between the device driver and the OS)

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *direcow* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it happens to me when my PC doesn't detect my audio device properly. a reboot usually solves the trick._

 

Agreed on the above. A reboot does the trick 9 out of 10 times when facing this problem.


----------



## Mudshark

UPDATE: 

 Thanks very much to those who responded to Post #367, above. Okay, I think I figured it out. I assigned L & R channels in the Virtual Device Editor's Channel Map and that seems to have solved the problem.


----------



## ted betley

Enoyin: I reported on an interupt/pop/crackle problem a few weeks ago. Initially thought to be asio4all it was in fact caused by a defective optical usb extender. Question though about the highest sample rate capability of asio4all--is it 24/48 or is it really 24/96 (which I have reason to believe it is)? Reason I believe this is asio4all panel shows sample rates up to 96, player is feeding it 24/96 and everything works and sounds wonderfull. Hopefully you can add some clarity to my observations.


----------



## riverrat

Just a quick note to say THANK YOU to ENoYin for taking the time to share your knowledge with such detailed yet concise guidance on ASIO and related topics regarding why we might want or need it. As a confirmed techno Luddite who is nevertheless trying to stay abreast of some of the best new developments in digital audio, your post was like a breath of fresh air for me.

 Your instructions have allowed me to apparently get ASIO working with Foobar2000 and the USB DAC I bought from another head.fi member. I can hear the difference.

 Thanks a bunch ENOyIn!!


----------



## jcfs

Hey guys, I am a total newb around here, so I'm seeking your help after searching for solutions to no avail...

 I'm having trouble setting up ASIO
 1.I use ECHO Indigo DJ soundcard
 2.When I go to preferences and then to ASIO Virtual Device Editor, it shows the following:
_
 Indigo dj 1-2 Virtual Ou 1 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 1-2 Virtual Ou 2 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 5-6 Virtual Ou 1 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 5-6 Virtual Ou 2 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 7-8 Virtual Ou 1 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 7-8 Virtual Ou 2 ...... <none>_
 3. So I changed it to:
_
 Indigo dj 1-2 Virtual Ou 1 ...... Left
 Indigo dj 1-2 Virtual Ou 2 ...... Right
 Indigo dj 5-6 Virtual Ou 1 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 5-6 Virtual Ou 2 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 7-8 Virtual Ou 1 ...... <none>
 Indigo dj 7-8 Virtual Ou 2 ...... <none>_

 Can anyone guide me..? Aprreciate it


----------



## audible

Extremely useful guide! Thanks.

 This should definitely be stickied.


----------



## TDRKZ

I have turtle beach usb sound card/dongle thingy. I think ASIO4ALL worked because my foobar now ignores all changes to the "wave" option in my sound settings (though the volume control still works).

 What I'm not sure about is, is it suppose to work in normal windows too? AKA when I am doing other things, the sounds still depend on the "wave" option it seems like. When I am watching something in media player classic "wave" still changes volume. 

 Furthermore, all other sounds cease to work when I am using foobar generally giving me some sort of error generally saying it cannot find audio output or something.

 Any advice would be appreciated. It definitely has helped my foobar tons.


----------



## musicaltunes

okay, i'm just kind of a visitor here, as i don't have any really "good" audio components. all i have right now is a gamer headphone and a seperate usb soundcard which is then connected to a speaker amp that powers some old speakers i got/headphones. i'm also using the drivers that came with it, and i'm using the drivers that came with it. planning on getting an HD600 soon, and possibly seperate usb dac/headphone amp depending on my financial limitations.
 but on to the question. i'm wondering if this asio thing works ONLY from your audio player. say i've got all this asio stuff setup including foobar for example (which i don't), will ALL the audio coming out of my computer be a direct signal from audio application to the soundcard? like say foobar setup for asio will send out a "pure" signal, but if i got windows media player playing a movie, will the audio from that be bit-perfect? i'm completely new to this whole hi-fi stuff, so yeah. be nice. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 *edit*
 reading the post above mine, it seems my questions have been answered already... so i'm assuming you can't hear any other audio from your computer if you're using foobar/winamp with asio?


----------



## ted betley

Enoyin: I tried downloading asio4all to a flash drive so I could install on another computer (with no internet access) and I cant get it to work. Is there a trick to do this? I d/l ed to a flash drive, moved the flash drive to another computer, opened it then try to set it up and I failed. Am I doing something wrong?


----------



## Meliboeus

hi, this issue is not strictly related to asio4all but it't bette not start a new topic on the subject...i have an audiotrak prodigy 7.1hifi, and i use winamp as a source...well i downloaded the asio plugin, which is essential for me to have an independent volume control as i use a digital dac...but i have a strange problem, when i start the first track it plays flawlessly, but when it switches to another one sample rate ( even when set to auto, i am able to see the actual setting in the audiotrak control panel ) drops to 22khz and it plays at half speed...the only solution i found is manually locking sample rate to 44.1khz and it works...i tried asio4all drivers and the issue goes away, but it adds a strange lag when messing around with winamp...anyone having the same issue ?

 p.s. don't tell me to update soundcard drivers because audiotrak support s**cks, and there aren't any driver updates


----------



## Nocturnal310

The Links just aint working... 

 i tried foobar.org for ASIO plugin ..but it doesnt work.

http://pelit.koillismaa.fi/plugins/redir.php?id=788


----------



## randomasdf

Don't want to make a new thread, so I'll post here.

 I'm currently using a zero DAC with the included usb/optic cables and the such, but when I try to play a 24-bit/96000Hz file, I get this error message with ASIO
  Quote:


 Unrecoverable playback error: The ASIO device does not support specified sample rate (96000Hz); please configure resampler appropriately 
 

Is this a software issue, or do I need to buy new cables?

 Thanks in advance.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *randomasdf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't want to make a new thread, so I'll post here.

 I'm currently using a zero DAC with the included usb/optic cables and the such, but when I try to play a 24-bit/96000Hz file, I get this error message with ASIO


 Is this a software issue, or do I need to buy new cables?

 Thanks in advance._

 

How do you connect your DAC to your computer? Through your soundcard or with USB?

 Edit: What I'm trying to say is that if you use a optical cable your internal soundcard might be the problem. It might not be able to output 24/96 correctly. If this is not the case the problem is most likely software related.


----------



## randomasdf

I'm using this:
Xitel MD-Port DG2 USB optical fibre sound blaster - eBay (item 110257056094 end time Oct-25-08 07:04:31 PDT)

 So I think that would be through USB


----------



## Svirre

I have now set up MediaMonkey with ASIO4ALL and everything is sounding great. Here is how everythin is set up atm:






 Is everything set up for optimal sound quality? If not, what should I change?

 I have one aditional question. If I manually select another song, I get this little crackle. It doesn't happen when one song ends and another begin, only when I manually select another song. Is this normal?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *randomasdf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm using this:
Xitel MD-Port DG2 USB optical fibre sound blaster - eBay (item 110257056094 end time Oct-25-08 07:04:31 PDT)

 So I think that would be through USB_

 

It could be that the Xitel MD-Port DG2 is USB 1.1 instead of USB 2.0. USB 1.1 doesn't go higher than 48 kHz/16 bit for as far as I know. That might be the problem here.

 Edit: The above is completely wrong btw. I figured that out a while ago. Sorry for the misinformation.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Svirre* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is everything set up for optimal sound quality? If not, what should I change?_

 

Looks good to me for as far as quality goes.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Svirre* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have one aditional question. If I manually select another song, I get this little crackle. It doesn't happen when one song ends and another begins, only when I manually select another song. Is this normal?_

 

That happened to me as well. I can't remember how I fixed it then though. I think it was turning 'full file bufferring' on in Foobar. I don't know if MediaMonkey has such an option, and once again, I'm not sure that this fixes the problem. There are quite a few threads on this issue on these forums. You can try to do a search. (use google, because the head-fi search won't work)


----------



## randomasdf

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It could be that the Xitel MD-Port DG2 is USB 1.1 instead of USB 2.0. USB 1.1 doesn't go higher than 48 kHz/16 bit for as far as I know. That might be the problem here._

 

Thanks, I'll look into it.


----------



## Zulli85

I've got a few questions here about ASIO as I do not fully understand it. Is it better to use your sound card's built in ASIO if it has one? Does analog or digital connection make a difference? Does it work for 5.1 setups? I have had difficulty getting ASIO4ALL to work with all five of my speakers, but I am also using a HT Omega Claro Plus+ sound card so it probably isn't needed anyway. I am also using the Z-5500s and F2K. There is an option for HT Omega ASIO in Foobar. Can anyone clarify a bit for me?


----------



## Jaw007

ASIO4ALL made my computer crash for some reason running windows XP.
 I believe this program is poorly designed!


----------



## vYu223

So! Since this guide is "outdated," that is, dated for use for past versions of the softwares, where can I find a guide for the current versions? I type, "asio4all foobar2000" without quotations, into google. However, I'm not sure which guide(s) I should trust...


----------



## powerslave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vYu223* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So! Since this guide is "outdated," that is, dated for use for past versions of the softwares, where can I find a guide for the current versions? I type, "asio4all foobar2000" without quotations, into google. However, I'm not sure which guide(s) I should trust..._

 

I took a quick glance and even though the version is newer, the steps are pretty much the same. I think they mostly changed the GUI and how it starts. With older version of ASIO4ALL, you could open and configure anytime. Now, it opens in system tray and only when music is playing and can be configured at that time. The latest version has a good manual though as well. If you have specific questions regarding your setup, please ask and maybe someone can help.


----------



## vYu223

Ah, you are right. Today, I installed Foobar2000+asio4all on my laptop. Only the gui and the ui in general slightly changed. With my ER-4S, my laptop sounds great now!

 With Foobar2000's volume control at max, and window's volume control at minimum, the volume is still too loud (with my ER-4S). Too bad window's volume control sucks.


----------



## yugiyao

the masters volume on windows xp is not affecting too much unless you mute it. Else you still can hear sound.


----------



## bubblegummy

newbie question. I just installed Foobar+Asio4all and played it through USB into my DAC. Does it pass through my soundcard at all?


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bubblegummy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_newbie question. I just installed Foobar+Asio4all and played it through USB into my DAC. Does it pass through my soundcard at all?_

 

Not at all. (unless you've got a USB soundcard, but I'm assuming that's not the case)


----------



## yugiyao

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bubblegummy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_newbie question. I just installed Foobar+Asio4all and played it through USB into my DAC. Does it pass through my soundcard at all?_

 

nope as the ASIO will detect your DAC through USB then the sound signal will transmit to your DAC without the need of passing through your soundcard again.

 Cheerz.


----------



## yugiyao

Double posted


----------



## powerslave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bubblegummy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_newbie question. I just installed Foobar+Asio4all and played it through USB into my DAC. Does it pass through my soundcard at all?_

 

While music is playing, you can open the ASIO4ALL GUI from the system tray and it will show the devices it's seeing. If you move your cursor next to the plus sign for each device, it will show the device status as either active or idle. If it's idle, it's not in use.


----------



## chinesekiwi

*XP Audio:*
 Here is a simple picture of how the audio-architecture in XP works:







 As you can see only ASIO and OpenAL will go straight to the lowest level of driver and bypass everything else.


*Vista Audio:*






 This picture shows just one audio application. What should be clear about this is that for every single audio application launched a separate WASAPI instance will be launched as well.

 For games that use OpenAL there will be no significant changes. However, there is quite the change in using Direct Sound or EAX in games. There is no possibility anymore to go straight from a Direct Sound application to the audio drivers or the hardware. This results in the following: no more hardware acceleration. The point of Direct Sound acceleration is to let the hardware process unmixed audio content. For more information you can go here. This link will take you to the Creative forums.

 The meaning of the abbreviations used in this model:
 WASAPI - Windows Audio Session API
 API - Application Programming Interface
 APO - Audio Processing Object
 CPT - Cross Process Transport
 KST - Kernel Streaming Transport

 Originally sourced from this post.

_[size=xx-small]Sorry to repost this but I only an adaption of the post for a piece I'm writing. Thanks. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/size]_


----------



## EnOYiN

You could get the original .vsd files if you like. I'm pretty sure I've got those around somewhere.


----------



## n0ah

i'm sure this has been answered a hundred times in this thread, but can someone explain how asio4all benefits your sound when you're already using an external DAC? i thought the point of the DAC was to bypass anything going on in the computer.

 also - are the links in the OP still good and up to date if i choose to attempt the setup?


----------



## n0ah

so i had a half hour to spare and decided to set this up via foobar with no issues.

 i'm using foobar 0.9.6.1 with asio4all 2.9. i followed everything in the first post to get it set up. is all the asio settings and whatnot still up to date or are there better ways to set up at this point? i do notice on the screenshot that says "kernel buffer" it goes up to 4 max, where as on 2.9 that section is now called buffer offset and can go all the way up to 20. are they even the same and if so, should i stick with 4?

 i'm only using a 3move and don't have time to get any listening in right now to see if i can hear a difference, should i be able to?

 also what buffer length does everyone use? i'm not sure what it is. i also noticed dither was unchecked but what is that?


 i'd still like to know briefly though how asio is beneficial when using an outside DAC.

 edit: i noticed it's playing in 44100Hz stereo, the same Hz it was playing in before i installed asio4all, is this right? obviously you can tell by now i know nothing about this stuff but just trying to verify it is actually working correctly.


----------



## inF

Hello,

 I'm using *out_asio(exe).dll (exe version) Ver. 0.70* and *ASIO4ALL 2.9* on Windows XP, Winamp 5.541, with Creative Audigy 2 ZS. I have a few problems:

 1) When I select Creative ASIO, Winamp doesn't play anything unless I enable resampling and choose 48000Hz as sample rate. I've read that no resample gives the best sound. Why can't I disable resample?

 2) When I select ASIO4ALL, I can disable resample but the major problem is that everytime I minimize or maximize any windows to/from taskbar, the song skips, it jumps for a very short moment. Is that normal?

 Any feedback will be welcomed and greatly appreciated.

 And


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *inF* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1) When I select Creative ASIO, Winamp doesn't play anything unless I enable resampling and choose 48000Hz as sample rate. I've read that no resample gives the best sound. Why can't I disable resample?_

 

Hi.

 For as far as I know there is an option which disables resampling on your soundcard. You should try to find someone with a Creative card like yours and ask them since I don't own the card myself. 

 It could also be that you can't disable the resampling because I know creative really likes to do so.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *inF* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_2) When I select ASIO4ALL, I can disable resample but the major problem is that everytime I minimize or maximize any windows to/from taskbar, the song skips, it jumps for a very short moment. Is that normal?_

 

Only thing I can think of right now is a buffersize which is too low. Might also be other things though. I've had cracks when using Java on the internet. Try linux. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If the buffersize doesn't fix it try looking up threads on this subject. There have been quite a lot of them.


----------



## inF

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi.

 For as far as I know there is an option which disables resampling on your soundcard. You should try to find someone with a Creative card like yours and ask them since I don't own the card myself. 

 It could also be that you can't disable the resampling because I know creative really likes to do so._

 

There is a section "SPDIF I/O" in Creative Audio Console and under it, "Digital Output (PCM) Sampling Rate Settings" can be set to either 48 Khz or 96 Khz, but changing it makes no difference to my ears. I think it's related to this setting, but how can it be impossible to disable resample in Creative ASIO, but possible to disable it in ASIO4ALL?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Only thing I can think of right now is a buffersize which is too low. Might also be other things though. I've had cracks when using Java on the internet. Try linux. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If the buffersize doesn't fix it try looking up threads on this subject. There have been quite a lot of them._

 

Bingo! 896 samples avoid skips, thank you very much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But that's a relatively high value, isn't it?

 Finally, which ASIO do you recommend me to use, and with which settings? At the moment, they are as follows:

*Creative ASIO:*





*ASIO4ALL:*








 Thank you.


 EDIT: I apologize if I'm asking things explained before - which is probably the case 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm browsing the topic at the moment.


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *inF* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There is a section "SPDIF I/O" in Creative Audio Console and under it, "Digital Output (PCM) Sampling Rate Settings" can be set to either 48 Khz or 96 Khz, but changing it makes no difference to my ears. I think it's related to this setting, but how can it be impossible to disable resample in Creative ASIO, but possible to disable it in ASIO4ALL?_

 

Good question. No idea really. I think you should be able to disable it somehow. I just don't know how myself since I don't own the card.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *inF* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Bingo! 896 samples avoid skips, thank you very much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But that's a relatively high value, isn't it?_

 

Nah, for playback it's just fine. Only when using a device for recording purposes you would want to set your latency much lower.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *inF* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Finally, which ASIO do you recommend me to use, and with which settings_

 

I would recommend you use the Creative ASIO if you can get it to play at the orginal bitrate of the song. If you can't just stick with ASIO4All.


----------



## plonter

HI. bumping this great thread, i just installed asio4all with foobar and configured all the settings like in the explanation section.
 the music works fine, but i noticed that there is no response from the windows volume control at all, even the master volume doesn't effect the volume, the only thing that do effects the volume is the foobar volume slider, it is ok? am i bypassing the kmixer for sure? should i figure the usb audio coded in the windows sound settings? (control panel>sound,speech...>and there select usb audio codec.? or just leave it at the default realtek audio codec?)
 right now the foobar is the only player that works with asio, all the other players and windows applications(games) are going through the default realtek device. 


 another issue is the pop noise i hear every time i open a track on foobar.
 any advice about this? when foobar switches songs by its own this is doesn't happen but only when i push the buttom by myself or using the stop/play button or the quick fw slider.

 thanks!


----------



## EnOYiN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_the music works fine, but i noticed that there is no response from the windows volume control at all, even the master volume doesn't effect the volume, the only thing that do effects the volume is the foobar volume slider, it is ok? am i bypassing the kmixer for sure?_

 

Hi, the master volume is supposed to not work any more since you are bypassing that part. You can be pretty sure you are bypassing the kmixer indeed.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_another issue is the pop noise i hear every time i open a track on foobar.
 any advice about this? when foobar switches songs by its own this is doesn't happen but only when i push the buttom by myself or using the stop/play button or the quick fw slider._

 

I suggest you try to seach for threads with "cracks/pops" There have been quite a few threads about this. All with several suggestions about how you can deal with such things.


----------



## plonter

thanks anoYIn, i will try to search for answer for the pops.
 but the one thing that i still don't understand is, why when the foobar is off i still can't hear anything through the dac. At first i thought that only when the asio is active than it bypasses the windows kmixer,and now i realize that i can't hear any application at all (games,winamp etc.). not that it's bad, its just that it's frustrating not to understand how the whole thing works.
 do you have some explanation for this?

 by the way..when i tried the asio in the past the window's master volume did work and also in this thread others say that the master volume is working in their setup as well...it's the wave slider that supposed not to work...isn't it? what is the different between my setup and others'?


----------



## plonter

HEY! i think i know what is the problem. every time when i switch track in foobar or fw or something like that...the asio icon in the system tray pops every time. when i let the album flow by itself,this doesn't happen.
 it's like the asio plug-in is turning on every track i switch. it starts to resample maybe...

 I am 99% sure that this is where the pops sound come from, because it happens only when the asio icon is poping up again...what can i do to make it not happen? to make it work continuesly? also notice, when i stop the music the asio also turn itself off, and come back to work only when there is music playing.
 maybe a foobar setting?

 please,you gotta help me sort it out guys!


----------



## plonter

anyone have a solution for this issue?...


----------



## plonter

sorry for the amount of posts,but i search for hours over the net and couldn't find any answer for this problem. any asio/foobar experts here that can help resolve this?


----------



## Patu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_sorry for the amount of posts,but i search for hours over the net and couldn't find any answer for this problem. any asio/foobar experts here that can help resolve this?_

 

1. Try to increase the buffer size from ASIO control panel. Default is 512 IIRC. 

 2. Check out that you don't have multiple digital connections from same source at the same time. Once I had USB and coaxial both connected at the same time from same PC to two different DACs and that caused popping and cracking.


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1. Try to increase the buffer size from ASIO control panel. Default is 512 IIRC. 

 2. Check out that you don't have multiple digital connections from same source at the same time. Once I had USB and coaxial both connected at the same time from same PC to two different DACs and that caused popping and cracking._

 

thanks for the reply patu. the buffer size on asio is in 2048 (max) as the explanation in the first post. maybe i should lower it down? anyway,i tried to play with the buffer in foobar and that doesn't change anything.

 I have only the usb cable connected from the pc to the dac, no other usb or any digital connection. should i try another cable? (although i am pretty sure it caused by the asio driver). i don't think that there something wrong with the usb hub.

 I am 99% sure that the popping noises between songs is caused by the asio driver,because every time i change track it goes off and on again,and that's what causing this popping noise. only if there was a way to make the asio keep working all the time, and not only when you play songs.

 anyway,i am working right now on kernel streaming, but it doesn't work in foobar nor with winamp,not through usb!


----------



## SemiAudiophile

does anyone else experience intermittent skips when playing music through ASIO? i'm using foobar on my desktop right now, but i did notice the same thing when i used my laptop as the source.


----------



## plonter

there is no way that this is can't be stopped. there must be someone that knows what to do, and besides...i don't nelieve that everybody who uses asio and a usb dac is having this issue.


----------



## Patu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_there is no way that this is can't be stopped. there must be someone that knows what to do, and besides...i don't nelieve that everybody who uses asio and a usb dac is having this issue._

 

I've used ASIO with laptops and never experienced this problem with them. 

 Try with other output options from foobar2000 to see if it really is ASIO causing the popping. If DS output works fine then it's ASIO. 

 Try also altering the priority option from foobar2000 advanced options. Also terminate all unnecessary processes running on the background of your laptop. And as you said, try with other USB cable.

 EDIT:

 Try usbaudio driver also. You can try it for free but it costs if you want to use it longer.

http://www.usb-audio.com/


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've used ASIO with laptops and never experienced this problem with them. 

 Try with other output options from foobar2000 to see if it really is ASIO causing the popping. If DS output works fine then it's ASIO. 

 Try also altering the priority option from foobar2000 advanced options. Also terminate all unnecessary processes running on the background of your laptop. And as you said, try with other USB cable.

 EDIT:

 Try usbaudio driver also. You can try it for free but it costs if you want to use it longer.

USB Audio - the low latency experience_

 

I am listening with the DS output on foobar right now and no problems there,no popping noises. and not only that,when i change tracks the player operates much more faster than with the asio plugin, the switching between songs is in lightning speed.

 but i still want to use the asio in order to nypass the kmixer.
 there must be some way to make the asio plugin work continuously without restart itself all the time.


----------



## plonter

I can't find any priority settings for the asio (or for any output device for that matter) in foobar. I thought that amybe if i put the asio priority in foobar to high level than maybe it will not reload it every time and instead will use it as its primary sound driver/plugin. 
 anyway...i couldn't find such setting on foobar.


----------



## plonter

another idea i thought of that might help...is there any way that i can disable the asio resampling process? I don't need that anyway because my dac already do this.


----------



## EnOYiN

That's really an odd problem. I've never experienced it before. I've had skipping audio when the buffer was too low, but never skipping before starting a song. Because of that it's kinda hard for me to help you with it.

 Either way, what do you mean by 'the asio resampling process'? ASIO isn't resampling anything unless you've got the AC97 troubleshooting options on. You can turn this off in the menu of ASIO4All. This menu might have changed a bit over the years, but it still has pretty much the same options.


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EnOYiN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's really an odd problem. I've never experienced it before. I've had skipping audio when the buffer was too low, but never skipping before starting a song. Because of that it's kinda hard for me to help you with it.

 Either way, what do you mean by 'the asio resampling process'? ASIO isn't resampling anything unless you've got the AC97 troubleshooting options on. You can turn this off in the menu of ASIO4All. This menu might have changed a bit over the years, but it still has pretty much the same options._

 

all the ac97 options are unchecked...but when i listen to music, and the asio icon appears on the system tray, it says: "samples 44.100 hz 2048" so i thought it might be resampling automatically.
 If it doesn't do resampling or any kind of sampling...than why is it always reloading itself with every song i switch? (you can see the icon disappears and coming back again...and that slows the process down and makes the popping noises).


----------



## SemiAudiophile

mines doesn't skip at the beginning of the song, it skips when the song is playing. but its not that big of a problem since it's less than a second and happens every once in a while but does get a little annoying.


----------



## Patu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_another idea i thought of that might help...is there any way that i can disable the asio resampling process? I don't need that anyway because my dac already do this._

 

You can change the resampling option from Asio4all control panel. It's either 48khz or 44,1khz. I never checked the 48khz upsampling when I used Asio4all. 

 Thread priority option for foobar2000 (0.9.6.8):

 Preferences --> Advanced --> Playback --> Thread priority

 Try to make it higher. 

 Could it be that your laptop just isn't powerful enough to play the files with Asio4all? I don't believe so. ASIO takes much more power than DS or Wave.


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You can change the resampling option from Asio4all control panel. It's either 48khz or 44,1khz. I never checked the 48khz upsampling when I used Asio4all. 

 Thread priority option for foobar2000 (0.9.6.8):

 Preferences --> Advanced --> Playback --> Thread priority

 Try to make it higher. 

 Could it be that your laptop just isn't powerful enough to play the files with Asio4all? I don't believe so. ASIO takes much more power than DS or Wave._

 

I checked, and the thread priority on foobar is the highest possible. I also set the thread priority in the windows task manager to high.
 by the way, i use a desktop pc and not laptop. my pc is pretty powerful (intel quad 2.4 and 2 GB ram) so this is not an issue either.

 Oh man...i am so bummed by that. everything is perfect except that popping noise when moving between songs. I checked and it is not the usb cable either.
 thanks for the help anyway. If you have more suggestions you are more than welcome to post them becasue i am out of ideas.


----------



## Patu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *plonter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I checked, and the thread priority on foobar is the highest possible. I also set the thread priority in the windows task manager to high.
 by the way, i use a desktop pc and not laptop. my pc is pretty powerful (intel quad 2.4 and 2 GB ram) so this is not an issue either.

 Oh man...i am so bummed by that. everything is perfect except that popping noise when moving between songs. I checked and it is not the usb cable either.
 thanks for the help anyway. If you have more suggestions you are more than welcome to post them becasue i am out of ideas._

 

You have probably already reinstalled the drivers many times. Remember to also delete all previous audio drivers completely and check BIOS if there's some audio settings (disable onboard audio). 

 Did you try those usb-audio drivers I linked earlier?


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You have probably already reinstalled the drivers many times. Remember to also delete all previous audio drivers completely and check BIOS if there's some audio settings (disable onboard audio). 

 Did you try those usb-audio drivers I linked earlier?_

 

first of all thanks for all the help. if you are refering to the usb audio driver, than i don't want to pay for it so i didn't see a point in trying it.

 would you recommend to delete and than reinstall the asio driver again?


----------



## rickdanger

I'm currently using a USB DAC for all my audio; Internet Explorer, PowerDVD and Foobar for music.

 If I install ASIO4ALL, will I still get sound when using Internet Explorer etc? Or is it one or the other?

 Cheers


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rickdanger* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm currently using a USB DAC for all my audio; Internet Explorer, PowerDVD and Foobar for music.

 If I install ASIO4ALL, will I still get sound when using Internet Explorer etc? Or is it one or the other?

 Cheers_

 

you can set it both ways. if you want to hear all windows applications through your dac just set your dac to be the windows' default sound device.
 and if you want it to be only for music (foobar)than keep your onboard soundcard as the default and set the dac onlt in asio settings,like i did.


----------



## rickdanger

Thanks, although if mean if I install the ASIO driver and leave the DAC as a windows default sound device, will it still work with all windows applications? (I have no other sound device) Or maybe this question is not relevant.


----------



## HeatFan12

Hi plonter

 I just read your dropout problems. Just to confirm that this is only happening with ASIO4ALL? DirectSound is fine? You have mapped your device (left and right) in ASIO4ALL?


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rickdanger* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks, although if mean if I install the ASIO driver and leave the DAC as a windows default sound device, will it still work with all windows applications? (I have no other sound device) Or maybe this question is not relevant._

 

yes,you will be able to hear all windows applications through your dac.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi plonter

 I just read your dropout problems. Just to confirm that this is only happening with ASIO4ALL? DirectSound is fine? You have mapped your device (left and right) in ASIO4ALL?_

 

yes...with directsound the tracks are going smooth and much more faster than with the asio. with the DS it's only the foobar working... no asio to load itself over and over again.
 I have mapped one channel to the right and the other to the left.

 although..in the "asio virtual devices aditor" , the "device channe"l column is empty. (instead of: usb dac or something like that...)


----------



## plonter

i will try to install the driver again..although i don't believe it is gonna help.


----------



## HeatFan12

There should definitely be a device or two there (onboard audio and usb dac)...Device-Format-Mapping....You map left and right on the device you are using and the others "none".

 I'm assuming you're using XP?

 What version of Foobar?


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There should definitely be a device or two there (onboard audio and usb dac)...Device-Format-Mapping....You map left and right on the device you are using and the others "none".

 I'm assuming you're using XP?

 What version of Foobar?_

 

xp indeed,and foobar version 0.9.6.8 with the latest asio plugin.

 I can't copy and paste the foobar device editor so i will describe it to you like this: (hope you can understand) 
 if you go: file> preferences> output> asio virtual devices> and than you choose the ASIO4ALL V2 and click EDIT it looks like this:




 DEVICE CHANNEL FORMAT MAPPING



 32-bit left

 32-bit right

 I don't know if these settings are related to the problem,but please tell me if this is the way it should look like. there is nothing under "device channel"
 is it ok?

 EDIT:nevermind the description...it came out wrong in the post. the point is that there is no description under device channel


----------



## HeatFan12

YGPM

 Asio virtual devices--add new--add your dac--map left and right--configure--wdm device list--enable your dac--leave the buffer at 512 to start--close asio control panel--ok on the editor--closeASIO4ALL--close Foobar--start Foobar


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_YGPM

 Asio virtual devices--add new--add your dac--map left and right--configure--wdm device list--enable your dac--leave the buffer at 512 to start--close asio control panel--ok on the editor--closeASIO4ALL--close Foobar--start Foobar_

 

when you say add your dac , you mean the asio driver...right? I did it and the device channel is without any name in it. only the 32-bit and the left and right.


----------



## HeatFan12

It should say usb dac or something to that effect....If you right click your volume icon in the taskbar--adjust audio properties--audio--default device---from the drop down, see what your usb dac is named...That should appear in the device in ASIO


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It should say usb dac or something to that effect....If you right click your volume icon in the taskbar--adjust audio properties--audio--default device---from the drop down, see what your usb dac is named...That should appear in the device in ASIO_

 

it says: usb audio codec. but i don't know exactly how i supposed to get it in there. how can it be that i can listening to music through the dac without that name appearing in the list? do you think it's related?
 maybe i should uninstall and reinstall the asio all over again.
 do you think i should do the same thing with my dac? maybe it is not configured right in windows?


----------



## HeatFan12

Set it as default in your audio properties. Go into Foobar ASIO4ALL, double click ASIO4ALL and see if it appears as a device. If so, map left and right on the dac. If not, add new in ASIO4ALL and see if appears then......Let's try this step by step to zero in on the prob....


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Set it as default in your audio properties. Go into Foobar ASIO4ALL, double click ASIO4ALL and see if it appears as a device. If so, map left and right on the dac. If not, add new in ASIO4ALL and see if appears then......Let's try this step by step to zero in on the prob...._

 

well..I set the USB AUDIO CODEC, which i hope means my dac, as default in windows audio properties instea of my realtek HD audio output which is my onboard soundcard.
 I went to foobar,and deleted the ASIO4ALL V2 from the virtual devices list and pressed "Add new" and added it again but it is still only gives me the bit rate and the mappping. in the device channel colums nothing seems to appear.


----------



## HeatFan12

Okay.....it's not being recognized.....what do you see when you hit configure above the channel window?


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay.....it's not being recognized.....what do you see when you hit configure above the channel window?_

 

it takes me to the asio settings.


----------



## HeatFan12

by any chance do you see your dac in the wdm device?

 If not just close foobar, turn your dac off then on then open foobar and see if it recognizes it in ASIO4ALL...
 You have to isolate the prob and get your device recognized.


----------



## plonter

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeatFan12* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_by any chance do you see your dac in the wdm device?

 If not just close foobar, turn your dac off then on then open foobar and see if it recognizes it in ASIO4ALL...
 You have to isolate the prob and get your device recognized._

 

yes,i can see my dac in the wdm list. it is called usb audio codec.
 I can see the usb audio codec in the wdm list even when the dac is off.
 the "usb audio codec" is the dac's driver in windows, that way windows can "see" it. maybe the whole dac installation is wrong...
 I think i will try to delete this usb audio codec from the windows driver list and hook my dac to the computer so it will install the driver again.

 and than maybe i will reinstall the asio all over again also.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Can anyone explain clearly for me the meaning of buffer size? What's the difference between 512 samples and 2048 sample?


----------



## Ham Sandwich

Buffer size in the driver has to do with the amount of latency that will be caused by the driver and also the amount of CPU load that will be caused by the driver. A larger buffer size will cause more latency but reduce the CPU load.

 People who do recording or live performances through a computer interface care about latency. They generally want the latency as low as possible so there is no noticeable delay between what they do and what they hear. People who just use a computer interface to play music (like us) don't really care much about low latency. We just want enough of a buffer so that there are no drop-outs or glitches in the audio. If the buffer causes a longer latency that is not an important issue.

 In addition to the buffer within the driver, applications like Foobar and others also include their own buffer for audio. That buffers audio within the application and also adds latency.

 For audio playback I max the buffer within the driver and set a reasonable buffer in the playback application (Foobar, J River Media Center, etc.).

 Sound On Sound has an article on latency and talks about the buffer with the driver and how it adds to latency: Optimising The Latency Of Your PC Audio Interface


----------



## jiiteepee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can anyone explain clearly for me the meaning of buffer size? What's the difference between 512 samples and 2048 sample?_

 

If you mean driver buffers then, basically, difference between 512 samples and 2048 samples is that you get 1536 samples longer delay with the bigger value. Good point is that the delay happens only when the first buffer filling is done). 
 What this means in practise is, that delay with 512 samples is around 11.6 ms and with the 2048 samples around 46,4ms ... @ 44.1kHz (conversion formula is "sample buffer size"/samplerate (kHz)). 
 You sure notice this difference when pressed the play button on your playback software. 

 Anyway, in playback situation, sample buffer size is not important unless you go to too small values which starts cause distortion in audio playback and drop-outs for playback because of the system (software/driver/OS data path/CPU) can't handle "realtime" processing (remember that the CPU time is shared with all running processes... system audio "architecture" may be quite complex as it is on Windows (Compared to lets say ASIO arcihtecture) ... ). 

 jiitee


----------



## Lil' Knight

Excellent explanations. Thanks guys.


----------



## shawn_low

This is a great thread. While the original poster has screen grabs from an older version, the steps are similar for the latest version (2.10 beta).

 I managed to set up ASIO4ALL on my USB Dac in 5 minutes!


----------



## leeperry

in case it hasn't beeen said, you can easily disable the tasktray icon in the latest beta:
  Quote:


 1.) Run "regedit" -> HKEY_CURRENT_USER/Software/ASIO4ALL v2 by Wuschel/ 
 There should be a number of sub keys, e.g. "AE42F7B3"... and a single "Defaults" one 

 2.) Under each of these sub keys (including "Defaults" ) change the "flags" value (if any) by adding "4" to it. "0x00000000" becomes "0x00000004" and "0x80020000" becomes "0x80020004" ... and so on. But do _not_ touch the "flags" in any sub key deeper down the hierarchy!


----------



## music_man

the asio plugin for winamp lets you reample to 192khz. asio4all only supports up to 48. how do i get this to work?

 thanks,
 music_man


----------



## leeperry

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *music_man* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_asio4all only supports up to 48._

 

urban myth, this is not true.


----------



## music_man

so why if i set the asio plugin above 48 there is no sound? i really want to try 192.

 music_man


----------



## leeperry

what ASIO plugin? on what card?

 I can use A4A's latest beta in 96kHz, and that's its coder reply:
  Quote:


 ASIO4ALL does _not_ have such limitations that you may have read about. More or less the available range of sample rates/bit depths entirely depend on the capabilities of the individual audio devices.


----------



## mattkosem

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *leeperry* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can use A4A's latest beta in 96kHz, and that's its coder reply:_

 

QFT! I'm using the latest release version and am able to play 96Khz without an issue as well. I don't have a DAC that supports 192Khz, so I can't comment on anything beyond that.

 --Matt


----------



## music_man

it must be the soundcard drivers then. even though it does suppoort 32/192.

 i tried using cplay but i couldnt get it working.

 music_man


----------



## mattkosem

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *music_man* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it must be the soundcard drivers then. even though it does suppoort 32/192.

 i tried using cplay but i couldnt get it working.

 music_man_

 

Can you post screenshots of your ASIO4ALL config page and the output tab(s) of whichever player you're trying to use?

 --Matt


----------



## music_man

i could but i figured it out. it is indeed the sound card drivers. with the av-710 on 2chan auto it will play from foobar with sox resampler at 44.1. to allow the soundcard to play at 192 i would have to switch to the hi-sample rate tab on the soundcard. that causes asio4all to go beyond logic. since it was expecting 8 outputs and now all of the sudden sees two.

 it is because the card has two dacs. for some reason it cannot seperatly addresse the hi-res dac. this must be the way the drivers are written.

 if anyone knows how to upsample with asio4all and a chaintech av-710 please let me know.

 thank you,
 music_man


----------



## leeperry

you need to check "hi samplerate" in the VIA drivers to get 96kHz, but it won't do 192 AFAIK...and neither 44.1 or 48...this button forces 96 all the time, on the Tremor Envy24 VIA chipset anyway.


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## music_man

if i check hi-sample rate asio4all will not communicate with the soundcard. the whole trick with this card was using the standard 2 channel.
 apperently this card will not work with asio4all above 48khz. unless someone knows different.

 the card will do 192khz, just not with asio4all or ks.

 intrestingly, now i lost the analog out with the 4.73 drivers and asio4all. that app is very picky. i wish there was a way to get steinbergs asio without installing vst.

 music_man


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## music_man

i simply could not get asio4all to work at higher than 44.1 in any player.

 the good news is that the foobar ks allowes me to do 32/192 with sox.

 question: how can i be sure that it is infact kernal streaming and bypasing the windows mixer? my dac does not decode dts.

 thank you,
 music_man


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## music_man

i am now reasonably certain that the directsound mixer is not in use with foobar when set to ks. that is because the card will not communicate if sox is set to 192 unless the card is set to accept 192. plus there is no analog output even from the wolfson. which leads me to thinking i should flash it to prodigy perhaps. than i probably could use the asio driver.

 i just do not understand why the asio driver will not communictae with the card at a frequency above 48khz. does anyone have this card operating with asio4all at 192khz?

 music_man


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## shimm

Could it be depend of bit depth? Try 24, 32-bit output formats in your player.


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## music_man

that is possible. i unstalled it. asio4all did say 32 bit though. so i imagine it supports it. the card has a native 32 bit dsp. so no way around that.

 ks is working real good for me. the wolfson sounds good at 32/192 and the dac1 is working at 32/192. i have confirmed that it is bypassing the windows mixer.
 i don't see why i need asio. since asio4all is not the exact standard of steinberg. asio drivers can be all over the place as far as performance. there is only one real one. i could install vst i guess. i don't see why ks is not fine though.

 i guess i will reinstall it and try 24 just out of curiosity.

 music_man


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## Neet

This usb-audio.de driver has screwed up my Dacmagic. I uninstalled the usb-audio driver but now my Dacmagic will not get recognised.


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## leeperry

clean up the *.inf files in your windows dir...yes, that ploytec thingie is completely worthless...it crashed one of my machines badly several times at the installation w/ an M-Audio Audiophile USB 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 you can also specify the driver manually as not being PNP, click on "have disk"


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## Neet

Yeah it won't uninstall. The Dacmagic works fine on my laptop but I can't get the old drivers back on my PC. Which inf files is it

 Phew got it working again.

 Not sure what I did but maybe it was deleting some of the inf files (some wouldn't let me) also went to device manager and clicked uninstall and checked delete software.

 That usb-audio driver sucks, they tried to keep it on my PC so I had to buy it!!


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## leeperry

/windows/inf/oem*.inf

 open them all, delete those that say ploytec, then wipe the matching .pnf files too

 but you can also go the "have disk" way, it will disable the PNP detection.


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## Neet

Thanks leeperrry


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## music_man

i got asio4all working at 32/192 finally. i had to regedit and disable the soundcards control gui. then i had to remap the output since there was none. i am sticking with ks though. with out the control panel i can only have sound from a asio enabled app. ks is working great. i find dumping 32/192 into the dac1 toslink provides better sound than bit perfect. it's just for radio which sounds pretty bad anyways.

 i just got a kimber ag mini since i did not think i would find a small enough toslink cable to go through the floor. now i just wasted another few hundred bucks. oh well. no, i don't sell stuff i bought for less money sorry.

 music_man


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## haloxt

ploytec usb-audio has crashed my computer many times during installation. Over a year ago mbd2884 (now banned and posts deleted) brought it up in the old compass thread and everyone who tried it liked it better than asio4all, but some people's computers had major issues installing.


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## music_man

i am assuming it only works with usb devices?

 i'll add, the wolfson in the chaintech is not very short of the dac1. of course i am playing 128kbps radio. so i might not be able to really judge that.

 music_man


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## haloxt

Sorry for the late reply, didn't subscribe, but yes, usb-audio asio only works with usb. Asio4all still sounds great though, and it doesn't crash your computer during installation .


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## leeperry

2.10 final's out btw: http://www.asio4all.com/


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## tusk

I have a question about bit perfect. I listen at work and was using kernel streaming and I used Wasapi at home with foobar 1.7 and mostly flac files. I was listening to the National, and everything just sounded awful. It hissed about as loud and evenly with the lyrics, and anything that went low did the same. So I bought a behringer A202, and had the same problem. I figured then that KS, and WASAPI must be the problem and so I tried ASIO4ALL. It sounds just like it should now. No hiss, or noise, or at least not enough to notice, and definitely not enough to ruin the sound. So I'm wondering why do KS and WASAPI leave hiss and ASIO4ALL don't. I thought they all bypassed the Windows mixer, offering bit perfect audio. Is this common, and why would that happen?


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## Roller

Quote: 





tusk said:


> I have a question about bit perfect. I listen at work and was using kernel streaming and I used Wasapi at home with foobar 1.7 and mostly flac files. I was listening to the National, and everything just sounded awful. It hissed about as loud and evenly with the lyrics, and anything that went low did the same. So I bought a behringer A202, and had the same problem. I figured then that KS, and WASAPI must be the problem and so I tried ASIO4ALL. It sounds just like it should now. No hiss, or noise, or at least not enough to notice, and definitely not enough to ruin the sound. So I'm wondering why do KS and WASAPI leave hiss and ASIO4ALL don't. I thought they all bypassed the Windows mixer, offering bit perfect audio. Is this common, and why would that happen?


 


  There are devices that have compatibility issues with WASAPI, having distorted sound after some time, and Kernel Streaming was never a long term solution, as it is the output method with the most issues.


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## My3uka

...


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## devhen

Hey guys. I've been using ASIO for some time now (currently running ASIO4ALL v2.11 Beta2) and I love it. It does sound better than going through the Windows sound mixer (although not a huge difference) and I've gotten into the habit of always using ASIO when I'm listening to music. I have the HRT MS2 and MS2+ USB DACs as well as an iBasso D-Zero.
  
 I just upgraded from an Nvidia GTX 470 to a GTX 770 and I'm getting a lot of dropouts, clicking, and buzzing through both ASIO and WASAPI. It seems to be worse when I'm listening to larger files (24/96 for example). It appears to me that the GTX 770 is introducing too much latency into the system. I've already given away the GTX 470 to a friend but I put an old 8500 GT that I had lying around into the computer and the problem went away and everything worked fine, as it did on the GTX 470. So it appears the GTX 770 is causing too much latency and pretty much ruining my ability to listen to bit-perfect streams because while the static and dropouts are not constant its enough to really bother me.
  
 By the way, I'm using the MSI Gaming N770 TF 2GD5/OC. When I have the 770 in, LatencyMon shows a higher max execution time for nvlddmkm.sys, the Nvidia driver. With the 8500 GT in it maxed out at about 0.45ms and was the 2nd in the list. With the 770 it maxes out at about 0.7ms and on other occasions has reported well over 2ms and is always at the very top of the list.
  
 So I'm wondering if anyone else has come across something like this? Currently my plan is to order a new GTX 770 today, this time an EVGA branded GTX 770, and hope that that doesn't have the issue but in the back of my mind I can't escape this worry that this is something all of the 700 series struggle with. One of the recommendations I found online for dealing with ASIO/WASAPI/realtime audio dropouts is to disable CPU power management or downclocking so that makes me wonder if Nvidia's new GPU Boost 2.0 is causing the problem (GPU Boost constantly adjusts the GPU frequency based on usage). GPUs tend to not be very different from one manufacturer to the next, at least for the same GPU chip, but the MSI does have a custom PCB and cooler. I'm really hoping a GTX 770 from a different brand won't have the same problem.
  
 Anyway, any thoughts on this would be appreciated. I've tried everything else I can think of so its looking like I'll have to buy a new one and see if the problem goes away and then return the MSI 770 to Amazon. I'll let you guys know if I do that and what happens, in case others run into the same problem.
  
 Thanks
  
 BTW, I'm on Windows 7 SP1 64bit
 Gigabyte EX58-UD3R motherboard
 Intel i7-920, not currently overclocked
 MSI GTX 770 (N770 TF 2GD5/OC)
 16 GB RAM
  
 HRT Music Streamer II
 HRT Music Streamer II+
  
 The ASIO & WASAPI crackling, buzzing, and dropouts that happen with the GTX 770 happen equally on both the MS2 and MS2+. I haven't tried the D-Zero but I'm assuming it will have the same issues.
  
 Things I've tried so far:
  
 * Updated to the latest BIOS for my motherboard, didn't help.
 * I'm using the latest Nvidia drivers. I am going to try an older driver today so I'll let you know.
 * I was originally overclocking the card to roughly 1100MHz base clock. Using its original settings makes no difference. BTW, the card has a slight factory overclock of ~ 1080Mhz base.
 * Plugged the card into a different PCI-Express slot, didn't help.
 * Used a different set of power cables to connect to the card's two 8-pin PCI Express power connections, didn't help.
 * Uninstalled MSI Afterburner (overclocking and GPU monitoring app), didn't help.


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## ScareDe2

I installed ASIO on my computer and the difference is MASSIVE. The image and sound are MUCH clearer now. I did read about it by accident the luck it was for me.


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