# Calling All "Vintage" Speaker Owners



## cifani090

This thread was inspired by the great ***Calling All "Vintage" Integrated/Receiver Owners*** to show all the great speakers out there that are vintage. Ill start off with my B&W DM610i and i will be soon adding a pair of Klipsch Heresy's in birch still looking for a good pair of vintage speakers. I have some crappy vintage Omega speakers currently


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## scompton

My wife won't let speakers in the house 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  That's why I listen to headphones.  My neighbor gave my his Polk 5.1 system and my wife was OK with the small speakers, but she nixed the sub until I demonstrated it to her.  She's deaf and can only hear bass and she like the sound but I still had to hide it.  She hates the rear speakers even though they're only 8 inches by 4 inches.


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> This thread was inspired by the great Calling All "Vintage" Integrated/Receiver Owners to show all the great speakers out there that are vintage. Ill start off with my B&W DM610i and i will be soon adding a pair of Klipsch Heresy's in birch


 


  I've a pair of Pioneer CS-99a's.
   

   
  They're special to me because they were the speakers that were part of my first "real" stereo system that I bought back when I was 16, shortly after I got my first "real" job.
   
  The system included a Pioneer SA-7700 integrated amplifier...
   

   
   
   
  ...a Pioneer turntable the model number of which escapes me, and a Pickering phono cartridge the model number of which also escapes me.
   
  I was bit by a bit of nostalgia four or five years ago and purchased a near mint pair of them from a local guy off Craig's List.
   
  I fired 'em up and found they were just as fun in 2006 as they were back in 1976.
   
  I have 'em in my office which is rather small, but that works to the advantage of the 15 inch woofers which are in sealed enclosures. Just as they're starting to fall off, the room gain starts picking up so they integrate very well.
   
  So that's my vintage speaker story.
   
  se


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## scompton

You must have pretty good sound proofing in your office.  Every time I've tried playing music without headphones, someone has complained.  I don't listen very loud either, 65-70dB with headphones.


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## cifani090

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> I've a pair of Pioneer CS-99a's.
> 
> They're special to me because they were the speakers that were part of my first "real" stereo system that I bought back when I was 16, shortly after I got my first "real" job.
> 
> ...


 

 Those are some pretty nice looking speakers. I wouldn't mind a pair, more research is needed


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





scompton said:


> You must have pretty good sound proofing in your office.  Every time I've tried playing music without headphones, someone has complained.  I don't listen very loud either, 65-70dB with headphones.


 

 Well, by "office," I meant the extra bedroom in my home that I use for my office. That's why I'm able to get away with it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Those are some pretty nice looking speakers. I wouldn't mind a pair, more research is needed


 

 When I first started looking for them some years back, I was quite surprised to find that they were still commanding good prices on eBay. They seem to be one of the most popular and highly regarded of the Pioneer vintage speakers. I've seen MIB's (Mint In Box) sell for as much as I paid for my whole system back in '76.
   
  se


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## cifani090

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> When I first started looking for them some years back, I was quite surprised to find that they were still commanding good prices on eBay. They seem to be one of the most popular and highly regarded of the Pioneer vintage speakers. I've seen MIB's (Mint In Box) sell for as much as I paid for my whole system back in '76.
> 
> se


 

 There are a pair of CS-99 on my craigslist for $90,they aren't as nice as the 99A's so ill pass


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *cifani090* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> There are a pair of CS-99 on my craigslist for $90,that aren't as nice as the 99A's so ill pass


 

 Good idea. The 99's aren't nearly as way bitchin' cool as the 99a's. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
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## RexAeterna

it's cause of the drivers. drivers in the pioneer CS-XX line are pretty rare and one of the kind really especially the midrange and woofers. you don't see midrange and woofers made with cloth surrounds. also pioneers tweeter horn or aka super tweeter compression driver is not made anymore. lot of vintage speakers have rare hard to find drivers. also the cabs are built strong and very pleasing to the eyes.

   i have pair of cs-77a's i found in perfect condition. they are nice sounding if you put them on stands with great soundstage performance. they are also pretty heavy of 40lbs.per speaker. 
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> When I first started looking for them some years back, I was quite surprised to find that they were still commanding good prices on eBay. They seem to be one of the most popular and highly regarded of the Pioneer vintage speakers. I've seen MIB's (Mint In Box) sell for as much as I paid for my whole system back in '76.
> 
> se


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## Foress

i have a Sonic Gear - Sonic Power P320R. 

   
   

 Frequecy Response Range (KHz) 60 Hz - 18 KHz
 
 USB Compatible ไม่มี
 
 Number of Subwoofer 1
 
 Subwoofer Output Power (watts) 18 วัตต์ RMS
 
 Number of satellite 2
 
 Satellite Output Power (Watts) 10 วัตต์ RMS
 
 Other  Power : 28 Watts 
 Wooden subwoofer with enhanced bass reflex 
 Low harmonic distortion at near full volume 
 Magnetically shielded subwoofer and satelite 
 Bass, treble and master volume control 
 Headphone jack 
 Frequency response : 60 hz - 18 Khz 
 FM Radio Built-in (P320R)

   
  Pardon the language, I could only find the specs on this site.
   
  Probably very crappy, and not considered "vintage."


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## RexAeterna

have you ever tried recapping the crossovers? i'm this weekend recapping my CS77a's speakers and gonna pull the JBL thing too by adding bypass caps between the big 50uf and 30uf caps i'm ordering. tons of people tell me they had very very good results from restoring the crossovers in the pioneer speakers and well worth the effort. i'm gonna give it a try. if i yield great results these will be a keeper for me and i will not be giving them to my brother to use.
  
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> I've a pair of Pioneer CS-99a's.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





rexaeterna said:


> have you ever tried recapping the crossovers? i'm this weekend recapping my CS77a's speakers and gonna pull the JBL thing too by adding bypass caps between the big 50uf and 30uf caps i'm ordering. tons of people tell me they had very very good results from restoring the crossovers in the pioneer speakers and well worth the effort. i'm gonna give it a try. if i yield great results these will be a keeper for me and i will not be giving them to my brother to use.


 

 Actually the gentleman that I bought them from had already replaced the electrolytics. He had a little side business buying, refurbishing and reselling vintage gear.
   
  Since these were just my "fun" speakers, I didn't bother going in and tweaking anything.
   
  se


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## RexAeterna

that's cool. my cs-77a's aren't my main speakers but they have very good rare drivers,especially the midranges and woofers.they are nice sounding drivers. it's they are limiting by the cab size and crossovers. i'm also gonna work on the cabs insides and replace the speaker stuffing with carpet or some wool at home deport for fun.
  
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Actually the gentleman that I bought them from had already replaced the electrolytics. He had a little side business buying, refurbishing and reselling vintage gear.
> 
> Since these were just my "fun" speakers, I didn't bother going in and tweaking anything.
> 
> se


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## cifani090

Quote: 





rexaeterna said:


> that's cool. my cs-77a's aren't my main speakers but they have very good rare drivers,especially the midranges and woofers.they are nice sounding drivers. it's they are limiting by the cab size and crossovers. i'm also gonna work on the cabs insides and replace the speaker stuffing with carpet or some wool at home deport for fun.


 

 The stock drivers are rare? Or what other ones did you put in there?


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## RexAeterna

the pioneer FB drivers were only used in the CS series of the speakers. lot of vintage speakers have hard to come by drivers. you can find  them on ebay every now and then but sometimes they'll charge you a good price for it cause drivers today aren't made like the fb drivers(from what i seen) especially the the use of cloth for the surrounds on the midranges and woofers. in good condition and weight the CS-XX line of speakers can go for some good change selling online especially your cs-99.

 i didn't use any other drivers in my cs-77a cabs but i did use a large vintage technics floor speaker cabs as an experiment with the fb drivers. giving the super tweeter more height gave it better on axis dispersion and bigger soundfield and since the technics cab were ported on the bottom the woofers had better push-pull excursion. so i'm gonna get better materials and experiment with some wool or carpet and replace th original stuffing used. not only does stuffing reduce cabniet resounce but gives the drivers the illusion it's in a bigger box.
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> The stock drivers are rare? Or what other ones did you put in there?


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## ert

Quote: 





scompton said:


> My wife won't let speakers in the house


 
  Oh, rough.  I knew someone in a similar situation because his wife "decorated" the living room her way and didn't want speakers.  It frankly looked like crap anyway and told her as much.  I am not allowed to visit any more.


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## scompton

There's not a good room in the house for speakers anyway.  The finished basement is a large, T shaped room.  I could, possibly set something up in the spare bed room, but it's a pain with 3 doors.


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





rexaeterna said:


> you can find  them on ebay every now and then but sometimes they'll charge you a good price for it cause drivers today aren't made like the fb drivers(from what i seen) especially the the use of cloth for the surrounds on the midranges and woofers.


 

 Actually cloth surrounds are routinely used on pro audio drivers (woofers, mid-bass and midrange drivers). Though they're typically pleated, and not the simple roll surround that Pioneer used.
   
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## RexAeterna

thanks for letting me know man. i didn't know. i just know the ''FB'' drivers are pretty uncommon since they were only made for the CS line of speakers. they are good drivers.
  
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Actually cloth surrounds are routinely used on pro audio drivers (woofers, mid-bass and midrange drivers). Though they're typically pleated, and not the simple roll surround that Pioneer used.
> 
> se


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## mrarroyo

I still use my DCM Time Windows 1A (circa 1985) on a daily basis as my front speakers in the 5.1 setup.


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## Frank I

Quote: 





mrarroyo said:


> I still use my DCM Time Windows 1A (circa 1985) on a daily basis as my front speakers in the 5.1 setup.


 


  That was my first high end speaker and I gave them away 2 years ago what a dumb move that was. I miss them and if I find a used pair cheap would buy them again they were that good. The pair I bought though was in 1980. I guess it may have been the original


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## unchain

My vintage setup is a Harmon Kardon PM 665 feeding a pair of Design Acoustics PS-10s. I just picked these guys up and they are wonderful, I really dig them. They've got a great tweeter and midrange driver in the front, with a 10" downfiring woofer. The whole thing is very small, about a 12" square face and 14" deep. For what they are, I couldn't happier with my purchase. Picked them up for $120 a couple weeks ago, and they had just been refoamed. After I built some DIY speaker stands, they are just what I needed. I'm at work right now, but I'll snap a picture when I get home.

I've also got a pair of Sensui SP-X8900s that have a 4 way crossover, a mid range driver, 3 tweets, a horn and a 16" woofer. They look killer with the grills off, but they don't exactly sound hi-fi, haha. They're my work out/party speakers.


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## lordsegan

My grandpa has several fully functioning stereos around his house from the 1950s and 1960s. Some of them are tube amps.
   
  One is a HUGE Packard Bell unit from the early 1950s with what looks like two 12" woofers.
   
  In fact most of his systems seem to have 12" woofers.


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## mythless

I currently use Pioneer HPM-60, Burhoe Acoustic Blue, ADS L-690.  But, I have a lot more....


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## Zacorias

I inherited this from my dad: http://www.jackbergsales.com/electronics/TechnicsSC3200.htm
   
  I love listening to them


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## Adda

Oh cool a vintage speaker thread!
  More pictures are needed, here is a pic of my 1975 GAMMA 50 speakers designed by AudioScan, sold as a DIY kit and built by my dad.
  They use Bulgarian GAMMA VLD-12 ribbons and BK-138a mid-woofers that have alnico magnets, one of the bass-woofers blew last year, so they where replaced with some skytronic ones.
  GAMMA VLD-12 ribbons are excellent, highly dynamic, detailed and airy, just wonderful!
  I have owned these speakers for most of my life, but they continue to impress me today.


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## Adda

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> I've a pair of Pioneer CS-99a's.


 

 Excellent, those are beautiful speakers.


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





adda said:


> Excellent, those are beautiful speakers.


 


  Thanks.
   
  Though I have five cats so I don't often get a chance to listen to them "naked" like in the photo. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
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## Philimon

DCM TimeWindows 1 owner (can't remember if I have "a" version or not). My first pair of hi-fi speakers (bought 2-3 years ago). Love them! 
   
  Recently, Paradigm Eclipse bipolars. 90's vintage. Used speakers are such good deals, though new Magnepan MMGs look very interesting and may be my next speakers. I only have room for two speaker systems, but I wouldn't make the mistake of selling the TWs just because I bought a third set of speakers. I've read too many comments on Audiokarma (and now on Head-Fi too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) of how people regret selling their original TWs. The only way I would get rid of the TW1s is if I got very lucky and came across a pair of TW3 or TW7, or one of the other rare versions for a less than market price on Craigs...


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## Skylab

Quote: 





adda said:


> Excellent, those are beautiful speakers.


 

 They sure are.  I want a pair of those.  I'm not even sure why


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## BmWr75

Man.......ya'll gone and done it now.  Vintage speakers were my obsession before tube amps, which was before HPs/HPamps.  Here's some of the collection.  Many more nice vintage speakers have come and gone.  Will share more pics later..........
   
  ADS L1230
   

   
  Dynaco A35s
   

   
  JBL L112s


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## BmWr75

Thump....thump.....is this thing on??!!


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## BmWr75

Dahlquist DQ-10s


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## BmWr75

Ohm Walsh 2s


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## GrandZechs

I have dome Burhoe Acoustic Green Series speakers, sound amazing though they look horrid, they have had a hard life although my dad said he had them reconed once. Ill get pics up when I get home.

  What they should look like


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## Uncle Erik

How old do speakers have to be to be considered vintage? I have a couple older pairs.

One pair is the Quad ESL-63s I have. I believe they were built in the mid-1980s, so they're pushing 25.

The other pair are ESS AMT-1 speakers, circa 1972. I don't really "have" them since my parents "borrowed" them. I'll get them back some day. I love those AMTs, the mids and treble are _almost_ as good as ribbons, but easier to live with and much more efficient.


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## 9pintube

Sorry no photo, but in my 2nd system I still use my REVOX "Symbol B" Floor Standers.   1982 model..........  1 Soft Dome tweeter, 1 Soft Dome Mid range (think Dyna- Audio) 1- 13" Paper cone with rubber/pvc surrounds + 1- 13" Passive Radiator....... Yep 13'' Bass Drivers remember where Revox are made......   They stand about 46" tall x 16" at the bottom and taper after the Bass units and slim down to 12'' x 10"  (Think early Wilson watt puppies) but the cabinet is one piece...weight 125lbs ea.     Killer speakers!    They were 1800 bucks each in 1982......beautiful walnut cabinets... Don't make speakers like these anymore........I got to get a photo of them for you guys!


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## Skylab

Quote: 





uncle erik said:


> How old do speakers have to be to be considered vintage? I have a couple older pairs.
> 
> One pair is the Quad ESL-63s I have. I believe they were built in the mid-1980s, so they're pushing 25.
> 
> The other pair are ESS AMT-1 speakers, circa 1972. I don't really "have" them since my parents "borrowed" them. I'll get them back some day. I love those AMTs, the mids and treble are _almost_ as good as ribbons, but easier to live with and much more efficient.


 



 I think of 25 years for sure as being "vintage".  And those are both really great speakers, I have heard both on numerous occasions.


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## james93

Wow, great pictures and a great thread.
   
  I have a pair of Klipsch Cornwall Decorator from 1968.
   
  Also a pair of Cornwall Decorator w/grills from 1971.
   
  Last I have a pair of Klipsch Heresy from 1981.
   
  All are setup in different rooms for 2-channel listening.
   
  James


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## Skylab

I've started thinking I want to get a pair of Pioneer HPM-100's. Any comments? Anyone own a pair?


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I've started thinking I want to get a pair of Pioneer HPM-100's. Any comments? Anyone own a pair?


 

 The HPM-100's are a great speaker of you want something a bit more "serious" than the CS-99a's. My only quibble with them is their ported bass. My preference is for sealed, which is one reason I like the 99a's so much. But that's just me. Bottom line, if you're wanting a nice vintage Japanese speaker, you really can't go wrong with the HPM-100's.
   
  se


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## Skylab

Thanks Steve! That's good to know. I'm keeping my eyes out for a local pair, wish me luck


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Thanks Steve! That's good to know. I'm keeping my eyes out for a local pair, wish me luck


 

 Good luck, Rob! I got my 99a's locally from someone on Craig's List. Being in such a large metropolitan area, there's a much greater chance a pair will turn up for you. Hopefully a pair in great condition.
   
  se


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## BmWr75

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I've started thinking I want to get a pair of Pioneer HPM-100's. Any comments? Anyone own a pair?


 


  Rob, I owned a pair of 100s for a while.  They didn't make the cut.  I's look for a pair of JBL L112s instead, will never sell mine.


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## Steve Eddy

Quote:  





>





> Rob, I owned a pair of 100s for a while.  They didn't make the cut.  I's look for a pair of JBL L112s instead, will never sell mine.


 


  Yeah, but the JBL's aren't a vintage Japanese speaker. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  If you want vintage JBL, then don't go halfway. Go full crazy with a pair of 4350's!
   

   




   
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## Skylab

Well, there are a couple pairs of CS-99a here locally right now...might have to consider those too...

BmWr75, thanks for the reply...but I specifically want to try some vintage Pioneers


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## BmWr75

Oops!!  Didn't notice they needed to be Pioneer........in that case I'd be looking for HPM-100s then.


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





bmwr75 said:


> Oops!!  Didn't notice they needed to be Pioneer........in that case I'd be looking for HPM-100s then.


 

 And he'd still be getting a kinda-sorta-somewhat JBL speaker seeing as the HPM-100's were designed by former JBL engineer Bert Locanthi.
   
  se


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## scompton

Someone on the DC Craigslist is selling a pair, but he lives an hour or more out of town.  Someone else has put pictures of 2 pair in his listing for 2 Pioneer SA-9500 amps  and 2 Technics SL-1100 turntables.  The pictures in that listing are worth looking at.  The guy has a tower of 5 turntables.  http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/ele/2417077549.html


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## GrandZechs

So here are my poor burhoe speakers, I am really considering re-cabing them. I love their sound out of my old Sony STR-V5


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## BmWr75

Quote: 





scompton said:


> Someone on the DC Craigslist is selling a pair, but he lives an hour or more out of town.  Someone else has put pictures of 2 pair in his listing for 2 Pioneer SA-9500 amps  and 2 Technics SL-1100 turntables.  The pictures in that listing are worth looking at.  The guy has a tower of 5 turntables.  http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/ele/2417077549.html


 


  Lots to be learned in those pics about how not to place a speaker in a room.  Bet the bass is boomy as hell being reinforced by those corners.


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## cifani090

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Yeah, but the JBL's aren't a vintage Japanese speaker.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Those are some huge speakers


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## Lazerboy2000

Anybody know about Advent Legacy speakers? There's a pair locally for about $40  and they need  new woofers but I'm looking for a summer project to do anyway. Would these be worth fixing up and maybe trying to resell later down the road?


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## mythless

Quote: 





grandzechs said:


> So here are my poor burhoe speakers, I am really considering re-cabing them. I love their sound out of my old Sony STR-V5


 

 You should refurb the cabinets.  I do love those old Burhoe Speakers.  I'll have to post my Blue one day, they're pretty beat too but they sound great!


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## GrandZechs

I just may, I need to wait untill I get some more funding, As luck would have it I know a killer woodworker that would do the woodwork dirt cheep. Should I referb them factory fresh or modern them up a bit? I'd love to get my hands on a pair of Blues to go with my Greens!


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Those are some huge speakers


 

 Oh yeah! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  se


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## mythless

Quote: 





grandzechs said:


> I just may, I need to wait untill I get some more funding, As luck would have it I know a killer woodworker that would do the woodwork dirt cheep. Should I referb them factory fresh or modern them up a bit? I'd love to get my hands on a pair of Blues to go with my Greens!


 


  You could just get a new cab, and replace the caps on the crossover to make them shine like new.  If you go the custom route you can always put the drivers in vertical alignment if you want.
   
  Here is a picture of my Blue:


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## LFF

Here are my babies:
   
  I have 7 of these running in my 7.1 home theater set-up and 4 as an inverted pair running as my main stereo set-up:
   
  JBL 4311

   
  Then I have two of these running in my second stereo set-up.
   
  Akai SW-170 Studio Monitors.


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## GrandZechs

Quote: 





mythless said:


> You could just get a new cab, and replace the caps on the crossover to make them shine like new.  If you go the custom route you can always put the drivers in vertical alignment if you want.


 

 Most likely I will just go the factory fresh route. New cabs and I forgot about the caps, so ill need to do that as well.
   
  Love those blues!


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## Skylab

Those were the speakers I grew up with in a way, in that they were my Dads stereo in the 70's and early 80's, driven by Dyna tube gear and a Dual TT with Shure cartridge. That was actually a very sweet sounding rig.


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## 9pintube

Finally found my pictures!!
  
  Quote: 





9pintube said:


> Sorry no photo, but in my 2nd system I still use my REVOX "Symbol B" Floor Standers.   1982 model..........  1 Soft Dome tweeter, 1 Soft Dome Mid range (think Dyna- Audio) 1- 13" Paper cone with rubber/pvc surrounds + 1- 13" Passive Radiator....... Yep 13'' Bass Drivers remember where Revox are made......   They stand about 46" tall x 16" at the bottom and taper after the Bass units and slim down to 12'' x 10"  (Think early Wilson watt puppies) but the cabinet is one piece...weight 125lbs ea.     Killer speakers!    They were 1800 bucks each in 1982......beautiful walnut cabinets... Don't make speakers like these anymore........I got to get a photo of them for you guys!


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## mythless

Being an official owner of a pair of 901 series IV, they're pretty good for what they were designed to be.  From what I've read about them Dr. Amar was quite spot on when he wanted to design a speaker to give a "live" presentation.  It's very pleasant to listen too, excellent when playing some celtic women.  Accurate sounding?  No, but innovative and highly creative in their design.  It may not be for everyone, but that goes with lots of speakers.
  
  Quote: 





cliffroyroycole said:


> I am old enough to have owned a Dual TT and Shure cartridges. The speakers we had in the early 1970s were AR bookshelf speakers. Others that I recall were Cerwin-Vega, and of course, the large Advents.
> 
> I remember seeing the first pair of Bost 901s even way back then. The guy who owned them in my fraternity house thought he was hot stuff. I guess we thought he was hot stuff too. LOL. No one had ever heard of Bose, and they were so different looking. Hard to believe they have been around so long - and THEY STILL MAKE THEM (Cost, $1,398.85), I just checked. Ahhhh!


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## Skylab

Well, I picked up my Pioneer HPM-100's yesterday.  Overall very nice condition for a CL buy at $240.  Drivers are perfect.  One cabinet has a major corner ding on the bottom but where they are in my room you can't see it at all.  I did the cabinets up with Old English wood scratch remover, and I think they look nice.
   

   
  These are serious speakers.  It's amazing how heavy they are! I didn't expect them to sound nearly as good as they do. I was very pleasantly surprised. Imaging was very good, tonality was good, and they were even reasonably clean sounding.  And they just seem RIGHT for the vintage rig


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## Steve Eddy

Cool beans, Rob!
   
  se


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## Adda

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Well, I picked up my Pioneer HPM-100's yesterday.  Overall very nice condition for a CL buy at $240.  Drivers are perfect.  One cabinet has a major corner ding on the bottom but where they are in my room you can't see it at all.  I did the cabinets up with Old English wood scratch remover, and I think they look nice.


 

 Oh yes, another pair of great looking vintage speakers, congrats!
  I'm feeling the urge to seek out a pair of vintage Pioneers as well, but rebuilding my Gamma's is probably a better idea.


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## Skylab

Thanks guys. There is just something more harmonious about having these in my vintage rig man cave than the stand mounted B&W monitors I was using


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## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Thanks guys. There is just something more harmonious about having these in my vintage rig man cave than the stand mounted B&W monitors I was using


 

 Oh hell yeah. Those B&W's were throwing your vintage chi all out of whack. 
   
  se


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## Adda

But it is true isn't it, vintage speakers just sound more dynamic, new speakers just lack personality and complexity, maybe I'm just used to my tweeters.
  I can recommend that anyone who is in to vintage audio, should try a pair of good vintage ribbon tweeters, along with a mosfet amp, that is just a mind blowing combination.


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## Steve Eddy

Personally, I think the most dramatic shift was when they made the big shift from light, efficient paper cone drivers to heavy, inefficient plastic cone drivers.
   
  se


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## Steve Eddy

So Rob, now all you have to do to achieve full vintage Nirvana, is get yourself a pair of these! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

   
  Actually in spite of the smiley, I'm quite serious.
   
  se


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## Skylab

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> So Rob, now all you have to do to achieve full vintage Nirvana, is get yourself a pair of these!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Funny you should say that - I was seriously considering a pair!  Those are SE-50's, yes?  I for sure need a pair of vintage headphones.

  
  Quote: 





adda said:


> But it is true isn't it, vintage speakers just sound more dynamic, new speakers just lack personality and complexity, maybe I'm just used to my tweeters.
> I can recommend that anyone who is in to vintage audio, should try a pair of good vintage ribbon tweeters, along with a mosfet amp, that is just a mind blowing combination.


 


  There is no doubt that these have a sound that is very appealing, and it does have a kind of sound that I think was unique to that era of high-end speaker...maybe it is the paper + ribbon drivers...not sure...but me likey!


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Funny you should say that - I was seriously considering a pair!  Those are SE-50's, yes?  I for sure need a pair of vintage headphones.


 
   
  Yup!
   
  Paper cones for the bottom end and a horn loaded driver for the highs.
   
  Grew up with a pair of those. My father brought them back with him from a tour in Korea back in '71.
   
  se


----------



## Adda

Quote: 





skylab said:


> There is no doubt that these have a sound that is very appealing, and it does have a kind of sound that I think was unique to that era of high-end speaker...maybe it is the paper + ribbon drivers...not sure...but me likey!


 

 You might want to get those speakers elevated off the floor, concrete blocks are ideal for this, it should improve the bass a lot, at least it did with my speakers, I don't see why it would be different with yours.


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





adda said:


> You might want to get those speakers elevated off the floor, concrete blocks are ideal for this, it should improve the bass a lot, at least it did with my speakers, I don't see why it would be different with yours.


 


  No doubt, that needs doing, I just hadn't decided how to do it yet.  Concrete blocks are a no-go - has to look better than that. So I have to figure out what to use.


----------



## Adda

What about the foot and hydraulics from an old office chair?
  Just remove the wheels and chair and put a plate on top for the speakers to stand on.
   
  Edit: a pair of chairs of cause.


----------



## Skylab

How far off the floor is ideal, any idea?  3-4"?


----------



## Adda

Experiment with different heights until you find out what works best for your room.
   
  Edit: By the way, a good place to start is to have the tweeters at eye height, relative to your listening spot, ribbons tend to be very directional.
  Also pointing the speakers towards your listening spot might improve the upper ranges as well, again because ribbons tend to be directional.


----------



## GrandZechs

So I have a chance to of Bic Venturi Formula 6 Speakers locally for $100. Anyone have any experience with these?
   
http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/96020-bic_venturi_formula_six/
   
  Link for reference. Only issue with the ones for sell is the dustcaps are pushed in on the woofers.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





grandzechs said:


> So I have a chance to of Bic Venturi Formula 6 Speakers locally for $100. Anyone have any experience with these?
> 
> http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/96020-bic_venturi_formula_six/
> 
> Link for reference. Only issue with the ones for sell is the dustcaps are pushed in on the woofers.


 

 Too be honest, Bic speakers are not worth their weight in that kinda of money.  They're not really popular over on AK other than party speakers.  Wait for something better to come, like an Onkyio Model 20 speakers, haha.


----------



## Blue Meanie

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Well, I picked up my Pioneer HPM-100's yesterday.  Overall very nice condition for a CL buy at $240.  Drivers are perfect.  One cabinet has a major corner ding on the bottom but where they are in my room you can't see it at all.  I did the cabinets up with Old English wood scratch remover, and I think they look nice.
> 
> 
> 
> These are serious speakers.  It's amazing how heavy they are! I didn't expect them to sound nearly as good as they do. I was very pleasantly surprised. Imaging was very good, tonality was good, and they were even reasonably clean sounding.  And they just seem RIGHT for the vintage rig


 


 Damn, what a SWEET vintage rig!!  And is that an SX-1980 I see (OMG!!)?  Are you considering recapping your HPM-100's?  I haven't done either of my pairs yet, but I'm told it makes a huge difference.


----------



## Skylab

Thanks!  Yup, a SX-1980 driving the HPM-100.  I haven't recapped them, just got them last week, but I might at some point, I also heard makes quite a difference.


----------



## cifani090

How are "our" HPM-100's


----------



## Skylab

I've been absolutely loving the HPM-100.  I put them on 12" high stands and they are even better.  I'm tempted to buy another pair and do a bunch of the tweaks recommended over on AudioKarma and see how they compare.


----------



## spacemanspliff

Good to see you got them on stands. That really helps. I got a pair of polk audio monitor 10As which are circa 1987?ish. On the floor, they kind of suck bass wise. Putting them up on stands and they are currently doing HT 2.0 duty downstairs. Reason being is they hit hard all the way down to 40hz. Plus, they sound great with crappy source material. Very forgiving. However, they are also really musical and a flat out blast to play jam and jazz type music on.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I've been absolutely loving the HPM-100.  I put them on 12" high stands and they are even better.  I'm tempted to buy another pair and do a bunch of the tweaks recommended over on AudioKarma and see how they compare.


 

 Why type of stands are they? I wish i had $200 or so to spend, but im not sure if they'd fit on my desk. Ill have to measure


----------



## Skylab

HPM-100's will for SURE not fit on ANY desk.  They are VERY big speakers.
   
  The "stands" are just black plastic bins from Target, but they are the perfect size.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> HPM-100's will for SURE not fit on ANY desk.  They are VERY big speakers.
> 
> The "stands" are just black plastic bins from Target, but they are the perfect size.


 






measured and figured ill need something about 7 inches or higher for ear level. I found a pair locally, but they didnt answer so ill be calling back later. $100


----------



## Skylab

If you can get a pair for $100, I would RUN to get them - that's a great price.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> If you can get a pair for $100, I would RUN to get them - that's a great price.


 

 Oh yea, they didn't answer the first time so ill have to call again.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> If you can get a pair for $100, I would RUN to get them - that's a great price.


 

 Called him the 4th time and he answered. They were on my craigslist for 2 days, and the guy had had them for along time. They SOLD


----------



## Lavcat

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> This thread was inspired by the great Calling All "Vintage" Integrated/Receiver Owners to show all the great speakers out there that are vintage. Ill start off with my B&W DM610i and i will be soon adding a pair of Klipsch Heresy's in birch


 


 I just noticed the thread.  Sorry to be late to the party.  Most everything about my life is vintage.  My main speakers are B&W original 801's in rosewood  (I subsquently upgraded the tweeter to a newer part version).  Next to me are sitting a pair of AR 3a's, but they are unfinished plywood designed for studio use (I was a starving student at the time).  I also have a pair of Jenson (or is it Janson?) that I got around 1960 as a present, but I don't feel up to digging them out to check the model number.
   
  In high school I had a huge Electro-Voice (we're not talking stereo here) and horn tweeter in a mahogany cabinet that I built myself.  Wish I still had it.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Called him the 4th time and he answered. They were on my craigslist for 2 days, and the guy had had them for along time. They SOLD


 


  SCOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEE!
   
  Or am I reading your devil smiley the wrong way?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  se


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Lavcat* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I also have a pair of Jenson (or is it Janson?) that I got around 1960 as a present, but I don't feel up to digging them out to check the model number.


 

 You mean JanZen electrostats?
   
  se


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> SCOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEE!
> 
> Or am I reading your devil smiley the wrong way?
> 
> ...


 

 Steve...im sorry to say... im not the owner


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





lavcat said:


> I just noticed the thread.  Sorry to be late to the party.  Most everything about my life is vintage.  My main speakers are B&W original 801's in rosewood  (I subsquently upgraded the tweeter to a newer part version).  Next to me are sitting a pair of AR 3a's, but they are unfinished plywood designed for studio use (I was a starving student at the time).  I also have a pair of Jenson (or is it Janson?) that I got around 1960 as a present, but I don't feel up to digging them out to check the model number.
> 
> In high school I had a huge Electro-Voice (we're not talking stereo here) and horn tweeter in a mahogany cabinet that I built myself.  Wish I still had it.


 

These are the original 801's for those who dont know what they look like.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *cifani090* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Steve...im sorry to say... im not the owner


 

 Aw man, I'm sorry to hear that.
   
  It was a devil SMILEY so I thought you were devilishly happy that you'd scored them.
   
  Ah well. I'll put my SCOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEE! away and hope I can rightfully use it for you soon. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Good luck!
   
  se


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Aw man, I'm sorry to hear that.
> 
> It was a devil SMILEY so I thought you were devilishly happy that you'd scored them.
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks Steve, i guess it could of been put to use when i got a pair of B&W DM610i's for $60. But for some reason they were hard to sell, and im stuck with some crappy Omega speakers and a real nice Sansui.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I've been absolutely loving the HPM-100.  I put them on 12" high stands and they are even better.  I'm tempted to buy another pair and do a bunch of the tweaks recommended over on AudioKarma and see how they compare.


 

 I found a pair


----------



## Skylab

Yep, I saw those...tempting.


----------



## Lavcat

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> You mean JanZen electrostats?
> 
> se


 


 Nope.


----------



## Lavcat

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> These are the original 801's for those who dont know what they look like.


 


 Yup.
   
  ...but mine are rosewood.


----------



## cifani090

Have a pair of Pioneer CS-77A's on hold for Tuesday for $40.


----------



## jtaylor991

I have a pair of Polk Audio Monitor 10s.
   
   
  Pic (they're in the front there angled towards the recliner I'm standing behind):
   
   
   


   
   
   
  I have read that there are different sub models, but the one on this escapes me. Only thing I can see on it is Polk Audio (even that is only on the speaker screed/cover thing) and MONITOR10 in the top right cornet on the back. Above the speaker wire inputs there is a SERIAL: and then there is a piece of long plastic, with rounded edges covering it up for some strange reason. 
   
  So, I have no idea if they are 10a or 10b or what, I just know they have a 1inch tweeter, 4 or 5inch mid drivers and a 10in passive radiator. I found out that its a radiator when I took it out to have it tested because it was hardly doing anything and there was like no bass you can feel type bass with these speakers and I thought maybe the 10inchers were partly blown or bad or something, and then I'm like "Oh, they're radiators, no wonder they don't really do anything."
   
  I hate how they have a radiator because I love to blast hip hop music, and I want bass you can feel, and to get to that level of bass you are basically on the edge of possibly blowing the mid drivers from them flexing so much. I can see both things of rubber coming in an out 3/4inch or so. They sound amazing on vinyl though, even with bass (as long as I turn up the bass knob most of the way on my old Sony receiver) because vinyl doesn't really do boomy type bass, just nice, deep, extended bass.
   
  Anyway, I still love them, and I just might have to get a pair of subwoofers for the boomy bass I am looking for. I want two (one for each side so I have stereo) and under $500 for both total would be nice. Any suggestions? Do I even need two? I've read that most stuff nowadays isn't mastered with stereo bass, and I listen to mostly indie hip hop from my hometown of KCMO so it's even less likely to have that, I bet.


----------



## jtaylor991

I forgot to mention how I got these. So remember that Filet o Fish super bowl commercial from 2009?
   
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bJOIqVAD-s
   
  The guy with the long black hair eating the sandwich is someone I met. His grandmother lived next door to me and she passed away, so he was around for a while to take care of the house, clean stuff up, etc (this was before the commercial BTW  ) and I liked big speakers so he gave me these Polk Audio Monitor 10s with a JVC R-X500 vintage receiver, and a Dual CS5000 turntable and a tape deck, the whole deal, that was his grandmothers. This was before I became a head fier or even appreciated speakers and knew anything beyond "MOAR BASS" and "louder the better". Now that I know what this stuff is and how old and legitimately vintage it is, I'm gonna take good care of it


----------



## cifani090

These aren't my pictures, but this is what my Pioneer CS-77A's look like.


----------



## Skylab

Is that the actual pair? If so those will need a lot of work.


----------



## mrarroyo

Rob did you ever try the Howard's Restor-A-Finish on your speakers?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Is that the actual pair? If so those will need a lot of work.


 

 Yes... I remember my brother touched the tweeter and it looked less dented in than the one above, but he used tape to fix it. All the woofers,etc look good (right?). The boxes need a bit of work, what do you think i should do as far as those go? Also the grills need to be washed or new material put on? What material if so?


----------



## Skylab

That tweeter has much worse problems than the dented dust cap. The foam surround is completely rotted away. It would need to be refoamed. The picture isn't high enough resolution to see of the other drivers have foam rot or not.

Miguel I use Old English scratch remover on my HPM-100's - really did the trick!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> That tweeter has much worse problems than the dented dust cap. The foam surround is completely rotted away. It would need to be refoamed. The picture isn't high enough resolution to see of the other drivers have foam rot or not.
> 
> Miguel I use Old English scratch remover on my HPM-100's - really did the trick!


 

 I saw that right after i typed that and looked at the pictures more closely. I talked to JBL Judy and she said for a 5-6 inch refoam job it would be $50, so this is probably only $20-40. She lives right down the street from me, so ill probably just have her conquer that. I'll definitely use some sort of scratch remover for these. How shall i fit that veneer part? Should i even try?


----------



## Skylab

OK so you have a way to get the refoam done that's good. I can't help on the wood part, perhaps others here can offer ideas.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> OK so you have a way to get the refoam done that's good. I can't help on the wood part, perhaps others here can offer ideas.


 


 Do you think $40 is pretty fair for these speakers, including all the work that needs to be done?


----------



## Skylab

I don't know. I've not researched that model. I took a look on eBay and it looks like in very good condition they go for $200-300 a pair. So the question really is how much work and money they will really take to get working well. The cabinets seemed pretty rough, so these will never be perfect, but heck, $40 doesn't even buy a sushi dinner for one. At that price it might be a very fun project, just depends if you enjoy that sort of thing or not.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I don't know. I've not researched that model. I took a look on eBay and it looks like in very good condition they go for $200-300 a pair. So the question really is how much work and money they will really take to get working well. The cabinets seemed pretty rough, so these will never be perfect, but heck, $40 doesn't even buy a sushi dinner for one. At that price it might be a very fun project, just depends if you enjoy that sort of thing or not.


 

 When i get them ill take some better photos. Hope not all the woofers are crumbling to pieces, other wise Judy will be making a heck of a profit, and the work wont be worth it in the long run. It looks like the cabinets are a veneer, so i could probably sand them down and re-stain it, if i even need to stain it? First time, ill be sure to take it easy.


----------



## mrarroyo

Rob, glad your speakers are looking good.


----------



## Skylab

mrarroyo said:


> Rob, glad your speakers are looking good.


Thanks Miguel. Right now I am listening to a reel to reel tape of Led Zeppelin 1 on my Teac through the Pioneer SX-1980 and the HPM-100. This exact stereo could have been owned and played back in the day. There is nothing "modern" at all here, except for a few parts in the SX-1980. And let me tell you, it sounds KILLER!


----------



## cifani090

Ok, im thinking i may sell/trade my Sansui AU-999 integrated amp for Klipsch Heresy's, JBL 100's, or HPM-100's or 150's? What do you guys think, any recommendation would be appreciated.


----------



## Adda

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Ok, im thinking i may sell/trade my Sansui AU-999 integrated amp for Klipsch Heresy's, JBL 100's or 150's?, or HPM-100's? What do you guys think, any recommendation would be appreciated.


 


  Go for something with a true ribbon tweeter, the kind that has an ultralight ribbon of aluminum suspended vertically by the ends.
  None of the speakers you list use this kind of tweeter, but believe me, true ribbons will blow your mind!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





adda said:


> Go for something with a true ribbon tweeter, the kind that has an ultralight ribbon of aluminum suspended vertically by the ends.
> None of the speakers you list use this kind of tweeter, but believe me, true ribbons will blow your mind!


 

 What kind of speakers have that?


----------



## Adda

Hmm I have been looking around and it seems true ribbons are rare, but the Pioneer S1010's fit the bill.
  Take a look at this thread http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=76378&page=4


----------



## Adda

I should have looked more at that thread!
   
  Pioneer HPM-1100 uses true ribbons as well.
   
  Edit: So does HPM-300, HPM-500, HPM-700 and HPM-900.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Thanks Miguel. Right now I am listening to a reel to reel tape of Led Zeppelin 1 on my Teac through the Pioneer SX-1980 and the HPM-100. This exact stereo could have been owned and played back in the day. There is nothing "modern" at all here, except for a few parts in the SX-1980. And let me tell you, it sounds KILLER!


 


  If you wish to be surprised pick up an old Minimus 7W version A or B by Radio Shack. This sound amazing (about $50 of eBay) specially if the crossover ($25 per pair) has been upgraded.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

I love this thread ...so many memories brought back to life. Anyone have the Yamaha NS-1000's back in the day ? The only vintage gear I have left (not sold or blown up) is a set of '89 JBL LX 44's an '82 M&K Goliath passive sub and a See Corp Revolver TT ( '82 vintage). I did have a set of Alnico Electrovoice 12 inchers (with whizzer cones) hooked up to a heath kit EL84 tube amp my dad built in '73 (all long gone)...the speakers came from a console of late 50's vintage...the combination although restricted in freq range sounded amazing at low volume but fell apart when cranked a bit. I built my own speakers throughout the 70's and used them for a number of years before getting a set of StudioLAB's (model number escapes me) amped by an SAE preamp and amp combo (late 70's vintage picked up from a pawn shop for peanuts).
   
   
   
  Sky I bet a complete xover overhaul would really blow your mind with those lovely Pioneer speaks....it's highly likely the caps and resistors are out of spec...the inductors are likely quite inferior to today's Air core or foil types. It would certainly be a worthwhile investment. I bet those speakers would compete quite well with your main setup once reworked with the updated/upgraded xovers.
   
   
  Peete.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Right now I am listening to a reel to reel tape of Led Zeppelin 1 on my Teac...


 
   
  One of those 7" pre-recorded tapes from back in the day, or something else?
   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> Sky I bet a complete xover overhaul would really blow your mind with those lovely Pioneer speaks....it's highly likely the caps and resistors are out of spec...the inductors are likely quite inferior to today's Air core or foil types. It would certainly be a worthwhile investment. I bet those speakers would compete quite well with your main setup once reworked with the updated/upgraded xovers.


 

 That is in the plan.  I actually scored a pair of crossovers alone on eBay cheap.  I plan to take these and completely rebuild them, and then when they are done, swap them into my speakers.  Just need the time...
   


  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> One of those 7" pre-recorded tapes from back in the day, or something else?
> 
> se


 

 Yep, that's it indeed.  Sounds remarkably good.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> One of those 7" pre-recorded tapes from back in the day, or something else?
> 
> se


 

 Wouldn't it be cool if it was a 15 ips master....droooool.
   
  I still view a properly setup RtR using quality prerecorded tape as the pinnacle, nay, the holy grail of analog.
   
  Peete.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Yep, that's it indeed.  Sounds remarkably good.


 

 Coolio! See a lot of those for sale on eBay.
   
  I assume you're familiar with The Tape Project?
   
  se


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> Wouldn't it be cool if it was a 15 ips master....droooool.


 

 *sigh*
   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> Wouldn't it be cool if it was a 15 ips master....droooool.
> 
> I still view a properly setup RtR using quality prerecorded tape as the pinnacle, nay, the holy grail of analog.
> 
> Peete.


 

 Yep.  But my deck only plays 3.75 ips and 7.5 ips.  The 7.5 ips tapes sound killer, though!  And Reel decks are really, really cool


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Coolio! See a lot of those for sale on eBay.
> 
> I assume you're familiar with The Tape Project?
> 
> se


 

 Yes, I am familiar...but sadly it is out of my price league.  As mentioned my deck doesn't do 15 ips, only the very expensive ones do, and they charge $500 PER TITLE for the tapes...


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Yes, I am familiar...but sadly it is out of my price league.  As mentioned by deck doesn't do 15 ips, only the very expensive ones do, and they charge $500 PER TITLE for the tapes...


 


  
  I never looked into it that deep. ****!
   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Yeah, it is truly for the well-heeled only...


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Quote: 





skylab said:


> That is in the plan.  I actually scored a pair of crossovers alone on eBay cheap.  I plan to take these and completely rebuild them, and then when they are done, swap them into my speakers.  Just need the time...


 

 Excellent.......I look forward to your impressions.
   
  Peete.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Yes, I am familiar...but sadly it is out of my price league.  As mentioned my deck doesn't do 15 ips, only the very expensive ones do, and they charge *$500 PER TITLE* for the tapes...


 


  Egad is that what they are going for nowadays ? Sigh...
   
  I know tracking down an old RtR that's worth it's salt (for 15IPS) isn't cheap either.....ah well...c'mon lottery numbers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Peete.


----------



## Skylab

Just to be clear, only "The Tape Project" tapes are $500 per title. Normal vintage pre recorded reel tapes range widely from a few dollars to maybe a hundred dollars for the most desireable titles. I've only bought a couple dozen of these, mostly for $10-20 each.

My Teac X-10R was bought freshly serviced for $400. Not so bad.


----------



## BmWr75

I paid $75 for my Teac A-3300SX 2TR that does 15 ips.  Had to spend about $150 to get it running right.  Now, if I only had some high quality 15 ips recordings.........


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





bmwr75 said:


> I paid $75 for my Teac A-3300SX 2TR that does 15 ips.  Had to spend about $150 to get it running right.  Now, if I only had some high quality 15 ips recordings.........


 

 Get some pictures up here ASAP!


----------



## BmWr75

Here's a not so great picture.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Great find... you lucky person  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  It's hard to find 15 ips tapes but not impossible..dig around your local used vinyl shops, ask around ...
   
  Peete.


----------



## jtaylor991

Does anyone here even care for my Polk Monitor 10s??


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Does anyone here even care for my Polk Monitor 10s??


 

 Their so good, that their is a pair of ebay for $1?


----------



## jtaylor991

Link or I don't believe 
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Their so good, that their is a pair of ebay for $1?


----------



## jtaylor991

Oh this:
   
http://cgi.ebay.com/Polk-Audio-Monitor-model-10-speakers-/260827071050?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item3cba81424a#ht_1279wt_1396

  There is that $80 shipping. These are getting like $150/pair which sounds reasonable considering they are SO OLD and they were $370/pair in the 70s.
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Their so good, that their is a pair of ebay for $1?


----------



## jtaylor991

Maybe 80s, not quite sure.
  
  Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Oh this:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Polk-Audio-Monitor-model-10-speakers-/260827071050?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item3cba81424a#ht_1279wt_1396
> 
> There is that $80 shipping. These are getting like $150/pair which sounds reasonable considering they are SO OLD and they were $370/pair in the 70s.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Link or I don't believe


 

 Spoke too soon
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Oh this:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Polk-Audio-Monitor-model-10-speakers-/260827071050?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item3cba81424a#ht_1279wt_1396
> 
> There is that $80 shipping. These are getting like $150/pair which sounds reasonable considering they are SO OLD and they were $370/pair in the 70s.


 

 $70 shipping for me, but they do have the stands, your's dont (i assume). I wouldn't pay more than $100, at at that id be think about it.
   
  Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Maybe 80s, not quite sure.


 

 Yes 80's, and FYI their is a paperclip and you can edit your previous post, so it doesnt look like your intentionally getting your post count up.


----------



## jtaylor991

Never noticed that, thanks!


----------



## RexAeterna

i forgot about this thread. well only vintage speakers i have still operating is a pair of late 70's pioneer cs-77a speakers. they sounded pretty bad untill i just got done stuffing them today and man do they sound pretty **** good now. i was gonna sell these at first but i think i'm gonna keep them now. stuffing them made the biggest noticeable difference and the vibrations(resonances) is gone down to the deepest bass notes of 40hz(as far as they can extend to the most) , all i used was just some polyfill from some extra pillows and stuffed toys around the house. works wonders for acoustic suspension cabs(especially subwoofers) and it's very cheap to grab or can even find in your house. this stuff can absorb vibrations down to 20hz pretty **** well. thing is,it doesn't itch like fiberglass does. and safe around animals and people.


----------



## Skylab

Hmmmm...maybe I should try that with my HPM-100's.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Hmmmm...maybe I should try that with my HPM-100's.


 


  Rob, I wouldn't try it.  HPM-100s are in a different class of Pioneer speakers than the CS line.


----------



## Skylab

Yeah, I think you are right. And I LOVE the sound of the HPM-100


----------



## RexAeterna

bmwr75 said:


> Rob, I wouldn't try it.  HPM-100s are in a different class of Pioneer speakers than the CS line.




even if it is, stuffing is good for any acoustic suspension cabinets. it prevent resonances and keeps the soundwaves ''out'' and not in. great for ported cabs as well. i stuffed my technics sb-t200 cabs and the clarity just shot through the roof in the treble and midrange areas. the bass tighten greatly(these speakers are known to have hard hitting heavy bass for floor towers) as well.

cab resonance can affect the sound quality big time especially if the speakers use real wood and not simulated veneer stuff. you can even make cheap speakers sound amazing cause in cheap speakers they always never apply acoustic treatment in the cabinets.


----------



## BmWr75

Rex,
   
  Did either of the speakers you referenced already have any acoustic damping material in them?  I've see some vintage speakers that were just any empty cabinet with drivers installed.  Am sure some stuffing would have made them sound better.  I use Acoust-Stuf from Parts Express when refurbing speakers.
   
  My comment to Skylab was because my opinion is the HPM-100s already have adequate stuffing from the factory.
   
  Scott


----------



## RexAeterna

bmwr75 said:


> Rex,
> 
> Did either of the speakers you referenced already have any acoustic damping material in them?  I've see some vintage speakers that were just any empty cabinet with drivers installed.  Am sure some stuffing would have made them sound better.  I use Acoust-Stuf from Parts Express when refurbing speakers.
> 
> ...




i know. just sometimes when buying speakers from people just make sure they are stuffed is all i'm saying. i usually just rip speakers apart and just restuff them as usual. and no my technics had horrible acoustic damping. just had some foam stuff at the bottom of the cabs so i stuffed them more and stuffed the top part as well. i had these speakers for a year as a well before i decided to stuff them(since most of time i used them for the powerful woofers they had.) the pioneer cs-77a had some thick wool material but seemed very worn out so i decided to stuff them with polyfill and they sounded much better after the restuff. the cabs were more calm as well while i noticed more control in the woofer but required more power to be pushed. the pioneer cs line has wonderful speakers(especially the woofers) but the cabs they were put in are too small so putting more stuffing will help greatly on their part. i usually just suggest re-stuffing but it's optional. it also don't hurt to add more either if you can. best test is feel the cabs playing music loud(especially bass heavy tracks that play below 40hz)


----------



## trog

New to forum and not sure my speakers i nabbed are considered vintage but they are no longer produced hehe I was on Dell speakers that came with my PC for the whole time and after hearing real speakers at hifi shops and friend's places i upgraded and boy am i stoked wee~
   
  Polk Audio M3 Monitor Series 2 
   
  Got em cheap at some house moving sale and they were dusty and look beat up but nothing some TLC couldn't fix ^^


----------



## francisdemarte

I've never been a fan of vintage speakers but I couldn't resist picking up a set of AR-4x's from the local thrift store the other day. They need some minor work but sound very good. They remind me a little of my HD-650's in speaker form, warm laid back and a little rolled off in the highs which makes them easy to listen too. Wife's probably going to kill me.
   
  Pictures to follow.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





francisdemarte said:


> I've never been a fan of vintage speakers but I couldn't resist picking up a set of AR-4x's from the local thrift store the other day. They need some minor work but sound very good. They remind me a little of my HD-650's in speaker form, warm laid back and a little rolled off in the highs which makes them easy to listen too. Wife's probably going to kill me.
> 
> Pictures to follow.


 

 I look forward to the pictures! I started off as well as not liking the looks of vintage stuff, but i started off with buying (with what i thought was a good deal) B&W DM610i's for $60 on my craigslist. After that i bought a Rotel 1062 intergrated amp and soon followed my vintage path of my Kenwood KR-9000 receiver. Personally i love the looks of vintage, but you really have to look out after those audio dealers. Always remember, vintage in only what you are willing to pay!


----------



## WarriorAnt

Wow I just found this thread.  I picked up a Pair of large Advents for $25 that  just need refoaming.   I'm going to start working on them in a few weeks refoaming the woofer and maybe updating the crossovers and refinishing the cabinets.  I don't usually go for vintage speakers but I couldn't pass up the Advents for $25.
   
  I'm going to have to read through this entire thread now.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Wow I just found this thread.  I picked up a Pair of large Advents for $25 that  just need refoaming.   I'm going to start working on them in a few weeks refoaming the woofer and maybe updating the crossovers and refinishing the cabinets.  I don't usually go for vintage speakers but I couldn't pass up the Advents for $25.
> 
> *I'm going to have to read through this entire thread now.
> 
> ...


 

 That's what im talking about!


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Be careful with cab stuffing...you can over-dampen the cabs which then screws with the bass output/mid bass region. It's best to start off with a small amount , listen , then add little bits at a time until it sounds right. You will know when too much has been added it's fairly obvious. Acoustic fill mimics a larger cab than what the drivers are actually in. It's kind of hard to explain.
   
  Peete.


----------



## Skylab

I looked, plenty of stuff in the HPM-100 as it is.  So I am leaving them alone.


----------



## mythless

Haha, even this thread is growing!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Haha, even this thread is growing!


----------



## mythless

Be sure to keep an eye out for some obscure brands.  Many are underrated and can be found for pretty cheap.  Haha, I wonder if I should list some.


----------



## Skylab

You should! 

I had a pair of Realistic speakers back in the day that were remarkably good. I don't recall the model number - need to look it up...


----------



## shipsupt

Great thread.  Lots of serious vintage speakers.  They built 'em big and bold back in the day, that is for sure... 
   
  Any ideas/recommendations for something vintage but more desktop/monitor sized?  I'm a little tight on space.


----------



## mythless

Well, like everything there are some Japanese name brand speakers that are pretty good but do not share the same spot light of Pioneer.  Technics made some good ones, same with Radio Shack.  But, some like Hitachi, and certain Sonys aren't as discussed.  There are so many that it's hard to list them all.  I have a soft spot for Magnat and Winslow Burhoe speakers.


----------



## Skylab

Today I put re-capped crossovers in my HPM-100's. It does actually make a difference. There is a little more transparency and delicacy now. It is not a night and day difference - it is still the same speaker. But it is an improvement.

There is a very healthy amount of fiberglass stuffing inside the HPM-100. The midrange driver is also in it's own sealed sub-enclosure, and there is some cross-bracing - signs of a really well engineered and made speaker. I was impressed at the internals!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Today I put re-capped crossovers in my HPM-100's. It does actually make a difference. There is a little more transparency and delicacy now. It is not a night and day difference - it is still the same speaker. But it is an improvement.
> 
> There is a very healthy amount of fiberglass stuffing inside the HPM-100. The midrange driver is also in it's own sealed sub-enclosure, and there is some cross-bracing - signs of a really well engineered and made speaker. I was impressed at the internals!


 

 Any **** pictures? If its that good, i may have to look more in depth for a pair, they were very competitive with JBL back that, thats why they look so similar.


----------



## 9pintube

I just had the dynaudio woofers surrounds refoamed and installed the tweeters and soft dome mid ranges in my "Shun-Mook References". They came out in the mid 90's. A nice sounding 3 way floor stander. I'm using them in my art room system....... I'll try to get some pics... If interested you could google Shun-Mook Speakers..... Just might sell them.......


----------



## Skylab

I should have taken some pics while I was doing it. Shame on me!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I should have taken some pics while I was doing it. Shame on me!


 

 Now you get to re-do it


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Sky...I bet in a couple of weeks that x-over rebuild should refine even further. Did you replace the inductors as well ? A swap of the stock units for Jantzen Air cores  would likely yield another level of performance combined with the new caps. That way you get to take some pics while you are at it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Tweaking sure is fun...cheers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Peete.


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> Sky...I bet in a couple of weeks that x-over rebuild should refine even further. Did you replace the inductors as well ? A swap of the stock units for Jantzen Air cores  would likely yield another level of performance combined with the new caps. That way you get to take some pics while you are at it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Y'know, it's funny...there is a sizable enough faction of people that says NOT to replace the inductors that I did not replace them.  Seems that some consider the inductors to be very good.  The caps in the stock HPM-100 crossover are actually very good too...the only reason to replace them is age.  They are nice mylar caps, though.


----------



## BmWr75

Mylar caps typically age well. In comparison, electrolytics age much worse.


----------



## jtaylor991

Any more pictures here guys? That's why I subbed in the first place.


----------



## Skylab

Here is what my HPM-100's look like now that they are on stands...apologies if this is a re-post, don't think so...


----------



## jtaylor991

^ I reek of jealousy. How do you have so much gear Skylab????


----------



## Skylab

jtaylor991 said:


> ^ I reek of jealousy. How do you have so much gear Skylab????




Easy - I drive cheap cars and spend all the money on audio gear!

Funny, almost all of the gear in that picture was either dirt cheap or relatively cheap. $45 cassette deck, $65 EQ, $400 reel to reel, $240 for the speakers. Only the receiver was expensive, since It is the mighty SX-1980, but when I had the SX-1250 in that position, it was $550, and that made the whole mess of stuff under $1,400, for a pretty kick-butt stereo. Heck the most expensive thing I had in that rig until the 1980 was the DAC! Darned modern gear 

Seriously, vintage gear can be a nice way to set up a great rig for not much money...


----------



## jtaylor991

I just got my Wood Technologies speaker stands that I ordered 3-4 weeks ago that didn't ship until like 1.5weeks ago. That already makes me mad a little. I go to put it together, and I am told by the instructions to screw but not tighten everything then put it horizontally on the carpet and push down towards the floor to align everything. I go to screw in and the holes are messed up. When I went to put it horizontal on the floor I heard the screw holes screw up and loosen, etc. I just decide to screw in anyway and the wood splits! I am SOO p*ssed!!!!!!!! I have much better things to do and I wasted plenty of my time to get that done and it's screwed up already. Now I might have to wait more WEEKS for two pieces. *sigh*.... at least I know how NOT to do it - follow the instructions - when and if I get my replacement parts. I'd better get one day shipping though on those new pieces. I will talk and yell until I get what I want 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  And yeah. Plus vintage looks cool too! Win win!
   
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Easy - I drive cheap cars and spend all the money on audio gear!
> 
> Funny, almost all of the gear in that picture was either dirt cheap or relatively cheap. $45 cassette deck, $65 EQ, $400 reel to reel, $240 for the speakers. Only the receiver was expensive, since It is the mighty SX-1980, but when I had the SX-1250 in that position, it was $550, and that made the whole mess of stuff under $1,400, for a pretty kick-butt stereo. Heck the most expensive thing I had in that rig until the 1980 was the DAC! Darned modern gear
> 
> ...


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Here is what my HPM-100's look like now that they are on stands...apologies if this is a re-post, don't think so...


 

 Too bad you cant veneer them to be the same wood as the HPM's. Nice table
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> ^ I reek of jealousy. How do you have so much gear Skylab????


 

 Ive donated a few pieces, he told me the others ones pretty much fell from the sky


----------



## WNBC

Those HPM-100s look fantastic.  A guy wanted to trade me straight up for my AU-717 but I decided not to.  Is $400 to much to pay for a pair of HPM-100s?  Usually what I see them going for.  I need some good speakers to go with my AU-717/TU-717.  I have some Technics SB-2840s and Polk M5Jr hooked up to the AU-717 but probably not as good as it can get.  There are a lot of vintage Sansui speakers on Craigslist but when I google them they tend to get bad reviews.  Next time I see some HPM-100s I'll see if I can do a little negotiating.  
  
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Here is what my HPM-100's look like now that they are on stands...apologies if this is a re-post, don't think so...


----------



## Skylab

If they are in good condition, then I would not hesitate at all to buy pair for $400. They will smoke anything else you could get for that price, IMHO. I have seen them lower for sure, but I just plain got lucky on the pair I got for $240. I've never seen a pair for that low since, except for a few that were really in rough shape.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Those HPM-100s look fantastic.  A guy wanted to trade me straight up for my AU-717 but I decided not to.  Is $400 to much to pay for a pair of HPM-100s?  Usually what I see them going for.  I need some good speakers to go with my AU-717/TU-717.  I have some Technics SB-2840s and Polk M5Jr hooked up to the AU-717 but probably not as good as it can get.  There are a lot of vintage Sansui speakers on Craigslist but when I google them they tend to get bad reviews.  Next time I see some HPM-100s I'll see if I can do a little negotiating.


 

 I smell an audio reseller, IMO i think its double what you shall pay. When you get into that range id be looking into JBL, Klipsch,etc.


----------



## Skylab

You can get used Kilpsch Heresy's for $400-500/pair, yes...but I think the HPM-100 is a better speaker.


----------



## WNBC

The guy said he just has a bunch of stuff in storage and selling it off.  I think he's a collector of vintage stuff like all of us rather than a reseller.  He would buy my AU-717 or trade it outright for the HPM-100 but really thought I should hold onto it which is what I ended up doing in the end.  He sold the HPM-100 and they went quick so he probably got the $400.      
  
  There's a lot of vintage speakers on Craiglist so it can be difficult weeding out what is good and bad.  I'll post on here to get some opinions when I run across something I might purchase.  I don't need big sound, I live in an apt. so I'm only going to utilize a small fraction of any speakers' power.  For me, headphones are for loud listening and I'll use the speakers for low to moderately loud listening.  Vintage speakers seem like the best way to go for good sounding speakers for the buck.  When we move into a house we can worry about the ground-shaking, earth-moving, dolphin-killing, alien-signaling speakers
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> I smell an audio reseller, IMO i think its double what you shall pay. When you get into that range id be looking into JBL, Klipsch,etc.


 
   
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> You can get used Kilpsch Heresy's for $400-500/pair, yes...but I think the HPM-100 is a better speaker.


----------



## WNBC

$175 too much for Pioneer CS-77A speakers?
  http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/ele/2573308343.html


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> You can get used Kilpsch Heresy's for $400-500/pair, yes...but I think the HPM-100 is a better speaker.


 

 Heresy's in mint condition $400, Heresy's with boxes, manuals etc $500. I found some JBL L100's for $100, todays the day
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





wnbc said:


> $175 too much for Pioneer CS-77A speakers?
> http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/ele/2573308343.html


 

 Its fair, get him down to $140-150 you'll have a little more room later when selling them.


----------



## mythless

Pricing on speakers can be subjective, it all about your area and the sound signature.  Research it, but ultimately go listen.  If you like it and like the price, go for it.


----------



## WNBC

Speak of the devel, Heresy's in Fair condition for $395, http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/ele/2569254057.html
  Probably means they'll require some work, which will not be something I can tackle.
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Heresy's in mint condition $400, Heresy's with boxes, manuals etc $500. I found some JBL L100's for $100, todays the day
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Yup, will eventually go have a listen.  You know how it is, you go hear them, chat it up, maybe you don't want them but you feel bad for wasting the guy's time and just buy them.  Next thing you know you have 5 pairs of speakers at home 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





mythless said:


> Pricing on speakers can be subjective, it all about your area and the sound signature.  Research it, but ultimately go listen.  If you like it and like the price, go for it.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Speak of the devel, Heresy's in Fair condition for $395, http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/ele/2569254057.html
> Probably means they'll require some work, which will not be something I can tackle.
> 
> 
> Yup, will eventually go have a listen.  You know how it is, you go hear them, chat it up, maybe you don't want them but you feel bad for wasting the guy's time and just buy them.  Next thing you know you have 5 pairs of speakers at home


 

 As i was told, vintage is all in whatever your willing to pay, theirs no price guide on what you sell something for, its whoever will pay the most. Ive had someone offer me Heresy's at $300 and passed, they were HIP's, but with no trim or handle. I passed, i didn't have the money anyways and he wouldn't trade.


----------



## roadcykler

I bought four of these recently but one had a replacement woofer and in 2 of them the tweeters don't seem to work. They make the crackling sound when you turn the power on to them (they have a separate plug that powers the electrostatic tweeters) so the problem may be in the crossover. They are Realistic Electrostat 2a.


----------



## Skylab

That sounds like the electrostatic elements may be damaged due to having arced when they were used previously.


----------



## WNBC

I think I settled on some KG4s, reviews are pretty stellar.  Anybody want to talk me out of a pristine pair for $225?  I already asked for less but he's not budging.  This would be it for a while unless some HPM-100 show up on CL.
   
  http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/ele/2548041376.html


----------



## Skylab

Well, they sure LOOK nice!


----------



## cifani090

WarriorAnt....


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> WarriorAnt....


 


  The dots...   JBL's?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> The dots...   JBL's?


 

 Yaaa, you made it
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Do why do you think my JBL's are a bad buy? What are they asking for the L100's by your house?


----------



## Skylab

I scored a pair of HPM-60's off Craigslist today. Almost mint. Wanted a pair for the basement. These are same drivers as HPM-100 except 10" woofer, and the cabinet is vinyl woodgrain not real wood veneer like the 100's. Still, they sound killer. I am so in love with the Pioneer HPM sound. It's nutty.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I scored a pair of HPM-60's off Craigslist today. Almost mint. Wanted a pair for the basement. These are same drivers as HPM-100 except 10" woofer, and the cabinet is vinyl woodgrain not real wood veneer like the 100's. Still, they sound killer. I am so in love with the Pioneer HPM sound. It's nutty.


 







 I was looking through a Pioneer catalog, and i liked all the different types of HPM speakers. I be they sound good with the 1250 and better with the 1980?


----------



## Skylab

Only tried them with the SX-1250. It lives in the basement now - in the finished part of course! But yeah it drives the HPM-60's nicely


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Yaaa, you made it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Don't know what they are asking.  Its a listing of used vintage gear they post.  They also sell vintage gear from the 70's there.     It's just that the JBL's are common enough where you can find a pair in way better shape than the ones you were talking about.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Only tried them with the SX-1250. It lives in the basement now - in the finished part of course! But yeah it drives the HPM-60's nicely


 

 Congrats, how do they compare to the HPM-100's?


----------



## Skylab

Well the rooms they are in are different, different sources, different receivers, and my HPM-100's are now recapped. So I guess it's not real surprising I think the HPM-100's sound better - but the 60's are very good! They are smaller so probably better for smaller rooms. Too bad they don't have real wood veneer


----------



## cifani090

What do you guys think of me possible getting LaScala's in my tiny 12 by 12 room? Is it a bad thing that their so big?


----------



## Il Mostro

Are my ML CLS 1's vintage?   They are paired with Kinergetics SW800 subs.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





il mostro said:


> Are my ML CLS 1's vintage?   They are paired with Kinergetics SW800 subs.


 

 Don't know if they are vintage yet.  I had all the iterations of the ML CLS II's with 2 Janis subwoofers, Krell amps.  I sure do miss them.  should have NEVER gotten rid of them.  It's the one decision I always regret. Almost daily too.  I'll be out somewhere and I think about how I sold them and I'll just shout out "IDIOT"!


----------



## Il Mostro

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Don't know if they are vintage yet.  I had all the iterations of the ML CLS II's with 2 Janis subwoofers, Krell amps.  I sure do miss them.  should have NEVER gotten rid of them.  It's the one decision I always regret. Almost daily too.  I'll be out somewhere and I think about how I sold them and I'll just shout out "IDIOT"!


 

 I feel your pain, man.  You had a nice set up.  I have heard CLS's with Krell amps -- this is a really nice pairing.  I am running the CLS's with tube (EL34's) and using a Kinergetics KBA75 on the subs.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





il mostro said:


> I feel your pain, man.  You had a nice set up.  I have heard CLS's with Krell amps -- this is a really nice pairing.  I am running the CLS's with tube (EL34's) and using a Kinergetics KBA75 on the subs.


 

 It wouldn't be so bad but Martin Logan sold out to the home theater crowd and they don't make any full panel speakers anymore except for the CLX Art and thats $23K.    Had I know they would have gone completely hybrid I wouldn't have done what I did. I just thought there would be a CLS III.     The Hybrids are lame in my opinion.


----------



## Il Mostro

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> It wouldn't be so bad but Martin Logan sold out to the home theater crowd and they don't make any full panel speakers anymore except for the CLX Art and thats $23K.    Had I know they would have gone completely hybrid I wouldn't have done what I did. I just thought there would be a CLS III.     The Hybrids are lame in my opinion.


 
  Yes, sad to see another legendary manufacturer go the home theater route.  Actually, Martin Logan has a long history of hybrids, going back to the Monolith.   Those were pretty darn good speakers.   Interestingly, because my SW800's approximate a line source, I can cross over at 100 Hz with 18db Butterworth high/low pass slopes which was recommended to me by Tony DiChiro (Kinergetics). This takes a lot of energy off the panels, so I can run my tubes in 2/3 triode for most genres. Coincidentally, the Monoliths also crossed over at 100Hz.  The new stuff is mass-market garbage, but ML survives and still supports their old designs.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





il mostro said:


> Yes, sad to see another legendary manufacturer go the home theater route.  Actually, Martin Logan has a long history of hybrids, going back to the Monolith.   Those were pretty darn good speakers.   Interestingly, because my SW800's approximate a line source, I can cross over at 100 Hz with 18db Butterworth high/low pass slopes which was recommended to me by Tony DiChiro (Kinergetics). This takes a lot of energy off the panels, so I can run my tubes in 2/3 triode for most genres. Coincidentally, the Monoliths also crossed over at 100Hz.  The new stuff is mass-market garbage, but ML survives and still supports their old designs.


 

 A good friend of mine had the Monoliths.  He used Golmund Amps to run them.


----------



## Il Mostro

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> A good friend of mine had the Monoliths.  He used Golmund Amps to run them.


 

 You rub elbows with all the good stuff


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





il mostro said:


> You rub elbows with all the good stuff


 
  I once saw and listened to a pair of Martin Logan speakers that were one of a kind.  They were CLS's on mega steroids.  Imagine a CLS 8 ft high and 3X as wide with two Bass/Subwoofer towers.  Never made available to the public.  They were to be the answer to Dave Wilson's WAMM system which I had the pleasure to listen to once a week for many months.  They were also to be the answer to some mega system that Infinity had at the time also. I guess it was around 1988.  The Infinity-IRS, it had 76 EMIT tweeters, 36 EMIM midrange drivers, and twelve 12" polypropylene woofers in four towers.  A professional acquaintance of mine owned those Infinity's but I never got to hear them.  It was a real exciting time in high end audio. Like the golden years of the hobby.  Krell was hot, THETA was making the scene and The Wilson Tiny Tots and pups were revolutionizing high end speakers for the home.
   
  Anyway these Martin Logans were HUGE!  Redunkulous in size and I believe only one pair was ever made and they were on display at a high end store in Scarsdale NY not too far from Mamaroneck Hi FI where the Wilson WHAMMs were on display.
   
  Being a CLS owner you would have loved to see these gargantuan CLS's on mega steroids.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> I once saw and listened to a pair of Martin Logan speakers that were one of a kind.  They were CLS's on mega steroids.  Imagine a CLS 8 ft high and 3X as wide with two Bass/Subwoofer towers.  Never made available to the public.  They were to be the answer to Dave Wilson's WAMM system which I had the pleasure to listen to once a week for many months.  They were also to be the answer to some mega system that Infinity had at the time also. I guess it was around 1988.  The Infinity-IRS, it had 76 EMIT tweeters, 36 EMIM midrange drivers, and twelve 12" polypropylene woofers in four towers.  A professional acquaintance of mine owned those Infinity's but I never got to hear them.  It was a real exciting time in high end audio. Like the golden years of the hobby.  Krell was hot, THETA was making the scene and The Wilson Tiny Tots and pups were revolutionizing high end speakers for the home.
> 
> Anyway these Martin Logans were HUGE!  Redunkulous in size and I believe only one pair was ever made and they were on display at a high end store in Scarsdale NY not too far from Mamaroneck Hi FI where the Wilson WHAMMs were on display.
> 
> Being a CLS owner you would have loved to see these gargantuan CLS's on mega steroids.


 

 No Pictures!?


----------



## cantsleep

thiel cs2 $500
  thiel cs1.5 $500
  vandersteen 2c $350
  magnepan mmg $450
   
  room dimension about 17x15x8
   
  i have a peachtree nova 
   
  which one should i go for?
  or just forget about those speakers. isnt going to be ideal for me, at least for now.
   
  thanks,


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> No Pictures!?


 

 I wish I had a picture to show of that one of a kind pair.  Back in the 80's image taking was not as easy or as prevalent as it is today.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cantsleep said:


> thiel cs2 $500
> thiel cs1.5 $500
> vandersteen 2c $350
> magnepan mmg $450
> ...


 

 They are all good choices.  In this case it depends on what type of sound you like.  The maggies are good for a large airy soundstage.  The Vandersteens are very musical speakers, I only have experience with the Vandersteen 3C's but I'm sure the 2C's have the same mojo.   In fact if I ever see a used pair of 3C's for sale near me I'm getting them in a flash.    The thiels are also good.  More of a precision speaker but musical in that way.  
   
  I am not familiar with the Peachtree but the maggies might need some current to drive them, The Thiels may also need a little muscle.  The Vandersteens are most likely the easiest to drive.


----------



## roadcykler

If you have the opportunity to listen to them, choose the ones that sound the best to you playing the music you would be most likely to play. If listening isn't an option, it's basically a crap shoot. You can look at frequency graphs and all the other stats about them, but that won't tell you how they'll sound to you or how they'll sound in your house/apartment. 
  
  Quote: 





cantsleep said:


> thiel cs2 $500
> thiel cs1.5 $500
> vandersteen 2c $350
> magnepan mmg $450
> ...


----------



## cantsleep

maggies may need more room
  thiel may need more power than just 80wpc
  then vandersteen?
  or just mirage OM15 for $1000? since peachtrees usued demo their products with mirage speakers..
   
  i can audition them for a short period of time but it will sound differently when they come to my place with my setup
  as gallos sounded nice at my old place and not so great in my small apartment.....


----------



## classicalguy

I also have an original pair of b&w 801 series 80s, powered by a more modern (as in 1980s) Adcom GFA 585 amplifier.  The Adcom had leaking caps, which were replaced, but I get a lot of noise when I turn it on until it warms up.  A new amp to power these babies would be expensive because they require a lot of power.  Once the amp warms up, they sound great.  I'm interested in hearing about the tweeter replacement and other upgrades.  I think mine are entirely original.  I don't have the hoods.  There is a richness to the sound that I really like, and they are no slouches in detail and transparency.  The woofers are sealed.  A great classic design.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cantsleep said:


> maggies may need more room
> thiel may need more power than just 80wpc
> then vandersteen?
> or just mirage OM15 for $1000? since peachtrees usued demo their products with mirage speakers..
> ...


 


  When you get into the $1k mark you have many more choices and more serious consideration to do.   The vandersteen 2c  at $350  seems a good bargain.  There are 2 pairs for sale near me for $500 qnd $550.


----------



## Il Mostro

Co-sign on the little Vandies.  Stands are essential -- I think Sound Anchor made dedicated stands that were not expensive even when they were new and can probably be had very much on the cheap now.  Match them to a small REL sub and you have an extremely competent small speaker system.  REL's were the subs that Richard recommended with his products, and they integrate wonderfully.


----------



## cantsleep

yup, tons of speakers on $1000 range.
   
  well then, ill try vandersteen first and move on if it doesnt sound good on my setup.
   
  thanks for your inputs


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cantsleep said:


> yup, tons of speakers on $1000 range.
> 
> well then, ill try vandersteen first and move on if it doesnt sound good on my setup.
> 
> thanks for your inputs


 


  II Mostro is right about the subwoofer and the stands.  That should be a sweet setup for sure and good in a small area too.


----------



## cifani090

All right for $100 JBL score, the left speaker looks good but had a big wood gash. The right had the torn woofer that was fixed


----------



## Skylab

Wow, is that woofer really "fixed" ? Looks rough...otherwise nice looking though.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Wow, is that woofer really "fixed" ? Looks rough...otherwise nice looking though.


 







 Their is some black foam stuff underneath the woofer where he "fixed it". Its solid, and feel right, just not aesthetically pleasing. Any idea of how to clean the right brown spots on the driver? I think the woofer, and the tweeters (bend in (both)) both need to be replaced, and of course the woofer if need to be. The big piece of wood missing i can just use putty and re-stain everything. This guy was a real ******* telling me that he was going to educate me because he supposedly told me that the speaker were damaged, but i was thinking real deep gouges, not a huge piece of wood missing! So he wouldn't lower his price to $80 or anything


----------



## Skylab

Well, the good news is that the L100 in mint condition sell for $1,000/pair or more. And you can easily buy replacement drivers. The bad news is the replacement drivers are on the expensive side. I would start by replacing the one woofer if the tweeter and mids are actually working. Then, if you like the sound, replace the other drivers as you are able. The mids if they work look OK but at least one of the tweeters also looks rough.

Don't worry about the brown spots on the other woofer. Best not to mess with it for just cosmetics.

Someone else will have to advise you on the cabinets, I have no clue how to repair veneer.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Their is some black foam stuff underneath the woofer where he "fixed it". Its solid, and feel right, just not aesthetically pleasing. Any idea of how to clean the right brown spots on the driver? I think the woofer, and the tweeters (bend in (both)) both need to be replaced, and of course the woofer if need to be. The big piece of wood missing i can just use putty and re-stain everything. This guy was a real ******* telling me that he was going to educate me because he supposedly told me that the speaker were damaged, but i was thinking real deep gouges, not a huge piece of wood missing! So he wouldn't lower his price to $80 or anything


 
  So did you end up buying them?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Well, the good news is that the L100 in mint condition sell for $1,000/pair or more. And you can easily buy replacement drivers. The bad news is the replacement drivers are on the expensive side. I would start by replacing the one woofer if the tweeter and mids are actually working. Then, if you like the sound, replace the other drivers as you are able. The mids if they work look OK but at least one of the tweeters also looks rough.
> 
> Don't worry about the brown spots on the other woofer. Best not to mess with it for just cosmetics.
> 
> Someone else will have to advise you on the cabinets, I have no clue how to repair veneer.


 

 I just looked at the right speaker (the one with the bad woofer) and the connections on the mid range broke. So its only 50% of the sound. So the two tweeters and the woofer i shall replace,right? I do like the sound, not as dark as the Sansui 2500 speakers, and sync really good with the 1250.
  
  Quote: 





warriorant said:


> So did you end up buying them?


 






 I'll send them to you


----------



## Skylab

What I was saying is you need to listen and see what is working and what isn't. The one woofer clearly needs replacing. One of the tweeters looks rough. The mids LOOKED ok from your pics, but the question is how do they sound? You seemed to indicate that one of them now isn't working?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> What I was saying is you need to listen and see what is working and what isn't. The one woofer clearly needs replacing. One of the tweeters looks rough. The mids LOOKED ok from your pics, but the question is how do they sound? You seemed to indicate that one of them now isn't working?


 

 They both work, but the right mid's terminal is broken. The tweeters need to be changed because they are badly dented in, and the woofer, is well the woofer.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> They both work, but the right mid's terminal is broken. The tweeters need to be changed because they are badly dented in, and the woofer, is well the woofer.


 

 Cifani did you buy those they sound abused!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Cifani did you buy those they sound abused!


 
   
  For $100, it would be stupid if i didn't. First time JBL owner, it will be fine


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> For $100, it would be stupid if i didn't. First time JBL owner, it will be fine


 
  maybe you can find a spare on the bay and swap out some parts.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> maybe you can find a spare on the bay and swap out some parts.


 

 I have a woofer for $80, mint. And tweeters are hard to find non-bend in. Maybe i can sell my broken terminal'd mid and get new ones


----------



## Lavcat

Quote: 





classicalguy said:


> I also have an original pair of b&w 801 series 80s, powered by a more modern (as in 1980s) Adcom GFA 585 amplifier.  The Adcom had leaking caps, which were replaced, but I get a lot of noise when I turn it on until it warms up.  A new amp to power these babies would be expensive because they require a lot of power.  Once the amp warms up, they sound great.  I'm interested in hearing about the tweeter replacement and other upgrades.  I think mine are entirely original.  I don't have the hoods.  There is a richness to the sound that I really like, and they are no slouches in detail and transparency.  The woofers are sealed.  A great classic design.


 


  I hope this does not come up a double post, I think I lost my first reply.  I replaced the tweeters in my 801's sometime in the mid 1980's.  I can't say it made a lot of difference to the sound, but it was not hard to do and the upgraded tweeters were not expensive.
   
  Originally I used a pair of Kenwood L-05M to drive the 801's.  Then I went to a pair of Denon POA-6600.  Eventually one POA-6600 died and the other developed a bit of hum.  Probably needs new electrolytics.  For a couple years I used headphones for all my serious listening but I missed my 801's.  New monoblocks were out of the question financially.  After some consideration I bought a Crown D-75A for the 801's.  Technically the Crown is underpowered, but I find the power more than adequate for my apartment.  Any more and the police would come.  I have been asked if I have a piano, which I don't (though I do have a guitar).  When I got the Crown I figured someday I could get another, bridge them, and use them as monoblocks.  As it turns out one D-75A is plenty.
   
  An unexpected benefit is that the Crown makes a lovely headphone amp that effortlessly drives loads from D7000 to Koss pro 600a.
   
  From the picture your 801's look quite close to the wall.  I have mine out in the room about four or five feet.  Have you tried increasing the distance from the rear wall?


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> I have a woofer for $80, mint. And tweeters are hard to find non-bend in. Maybe i can sell my broken terminal'd mid and get new ones


 


  Well, the good thing is that any LE25 series can work with it.  The problems is that they highly sought after and a bidding frenzy can take place if you use ebay.  If you are good enough you can remove the dustcover, pop out the dent and re-attach it.  It can be done but takes a skilled hand, the tech I take my gear can do it and I've seen the final result and it looks very good.  Did they come with the grills?  Those are seriously fixer-uppers.


----------



## NA Blur

Polk Audio 5A officially vintage.  I love 'em still.


----------



## Manyak

Here are mine: Marantz HD880's and some random Sony's with no model number.
   
  I need some vari-q plugs for the Marantzes though.... I hate the sound of ported subs :/


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Well, the good thing is that any LE25 series can work with it.  The problems is that they highly sought after and a bidding frenzy can take place if you use ebay.  If you are good enough you can remove the dustcover, pop out the dent and re-attach it.  It can be done but takes a skilled hand, the tech I take my gear can do it and I've seen the final result and it looks very good.  Did they come with the grills?  Those are seriously fixer-uppers.


 

 Any idea of how to do that? I would do that for the dustcover, and one of the small tweeter woofer things. They sadly didn't come with the grills, and it was the first question that came out of my mouth. Why do you say they are "Serious fixer-uppers."?


----------



## Skylab

I have pulled out pressed-in dust-caps by using a vacuum cleaner. This requires a very steady hand and a light touch, but it is very effective. The key is to use something to reduce the suction to a size that roughly matches the dust cap. There are lots of helpful threads on AudioKarma on how to do that.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Any idea of how to do that? I would do that for the dustcover, and one of the small tweeter woofer things. They sadly didn't come with the grills, and it was the first question that came out of my mouth. Why do you say they are "Serious fixer-uppers."?


 


  Well, given the overall condition and what is needed to be done not to mention what haven't been seen yet, it's going to be a lot of work.  Either new woofers or reconing, new midrange terminal, new foam on the tweeters, unless you go with new tweeters or new drivers all around, it's going to a bit of work.  I'm not trying to talk down your purchase, the L100 do hold some value, but I probably wouldn't do such a venture due to the overall condition, lol and that I have other projects to get too.  You might want to examine the crossovers too.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Well, given the overall condition and what is needed to be done not to mention what haven't been seen yet, it's going to be a lot of work.  Either new woofers or reconing, new midrange terminal, new foam on the tweeters, unless you go with new tweeters or new drivers all around, it's going to a bit of work.  I'm not trying to talk down your purchase, the L100 do hold some value, but I probably wouldn't do such a venture due to the overall condition, lol and that I have other projects to get too.  You might want to examine the crossovers too.


 

 This is what i was going to do;
   
  -New woofer, pain in the ass because i have to get it refoamed into the speaker
   
  -New terminal for the mid range, not sure where i can get one
   
  -New felt for around the tweeters, and take out dents
   
  -Paint new black face, and puddy and sand the cabnits


----------



## mythless

Don't forget to upgrade the cap and clean the pots while you're at it!  Since, majority of the woofers will be out, might be a good idea, as well change the binding post if they're the crappy push ones.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Don't forget to upgrade the cap and clean the pots while you're at it!  Since, majority of the woofers will be out, might be a good idea, as well change the binding post if they're the crappy push ones.


 

 On the crossovers? Where can i get terminals of the mid rage, ratshack?


----------



## mythless

Yeah, change out the capacitors on the crossovers, and upgrade the speaker binding post (especially if it is the push ones, high probability it is the horrible push ones).  Regarding the midrange, no clue.  Post a picture.  The Canadian ratshack isn't as well stocked compared to the American so I wouldn't know.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Yeah, change out the capacitors on the crossovers, and upgrade the speaker binding post (especially if it is the push ones, high probability it is the horrible push ones).  Regarding the midrange, no clue.  Post a picture.  The Canadian ratshack isn't as well stocked compared to the American so I wouldn't know.


 

 Hmmm, i just took a look at them, and it their is a screw at the bottom where i would have to desolder and resolder to redo the terminals. :Im not very good at soldering:...


----------



## mythless

I don't think you'll find the OEM replacement other than ebay, off forums or maybe try contacting several shops or JBL.  But, you can install new ones.


----------



## cantsleep

got vandersteen 2c running with peachtree nova.
  small apartment so i guess it will be okay for now.
  they sound better than i expected


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cantsleep said:


> got vandersteen 2c running with peachtree nova.
> small apartment so i guess it will be okay for now.
> they sound better than i expected


 

 Oh yeah!  good move.  They will continue to grow on you.  Musical speakers with good tonal balance. Always pleasurable.


----------



## randerson07

I was beginning to think that I just lived in a part of the world that just doesn't toss out Audio gear, or that someone else was just beating me to all the deals. Ive been stopping at 1 of 3 thrift stores on my way to work daily for a month or two now with nothing to show for it, mainly looking for a receiver. But today I think I scored pretty well. I found a pair of Pioneer HPM 100s at a thrift store for $30. There were a few guys that seemed to be eying them so I didn't test them and didn't hesitate, just put them in the cart and left. They look to be in pretty good shape, the cabinets are filthy, but all of the drivers look good and none of the cones or dust covers, whatever you call them are pushed in and all of the surrounds look good too. Here's a few pictures while they wait impatiently in the back seat of my car for work to end
.
   
  Upon closer inspection I only see a couple of things, first the woofers are faded pretty good. Theres that pink thingy(pictured) sticking out of one of the woofers, i flicked it with my finger it seems like its either part of the speaker or its firmly attached. And on the other speaker the super tweeter screen is ever so slightly pushed in(also pictured but not very well), hopefully neither of these are big issues.
   
  Hopefully I can figure out whats wrong with my dads SA-9500, seems like they would be a good match.


----------



## cifani090

randerson07, very nice fine. Easily $300, the problems i dont think are bad at all


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I scored a pair of HPM-60's off Craigslist today. Almost mint. Wanted a pair for the basement. These are same drivers as HPM-100 except 10" woofer, and the cabinet is vinyl woodgrain not real wood veneer like the 100's. Still, they sound killer. I am so in love with the Pioneer HPM sound. It's nutty.


 

 I just saw a pair of these on Craigslist today for $50. The guy said they had a minor tear in one of the cones that had been professionally repaired, still awaiting photos. Good deal?


----------



## scootermafia

The drivers themselves look very clean, honestly whoever had that took care of it.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> I just saw a pair of these on Craigslist today for $50. The guy said they had a minor tear in one of the cones that had been professionally repaired, still awaiting photos. Good deal?


 

 You sure your not robbing the guy and leaving him $50 in his pocket?


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> You sure your not robbing the guy and leaving him $50 in his pocket?


 


  lol those photos aren't of the actual speakers, those belong to Skylab. How much do HPM-60s usually sell for?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> lol those photos aren't of the actual speakers, those belong to Skylab. How much do HPM-60s usually sell for?


 

 $250-350.


----------



## Skylab

Getting a pair of HPM-100's for $30 or HPM-60's for $50 is like stealing. Nice scores guys!


----------



## randerson07

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Getting a pair of HPM-100's for $30 or HPM-60's for $50 is like stealing. Nice scores guys!


 


 And they sound pretty awesome, even on my dumpster diving treasure of an RCA HTIAB receiver.  I only have a few speakers to compare to, the Cerwin Vega RE25s I bought 15yrs ago that are currently the front channel in my 5.0 setup, the Klipsch RB51s I'm currently using on my computer rig with the said dumpster receiver, and the JBL L100s my dad had(and still has collecting dust in his basement) when I was a kid. I don't have much to say about dads JBLs as I just didn't really pay that much attention, they were big and cool and dad liked to crank em up LOUD.
   
  I listened to all kinds of stuff on these HPM-100s today for a good 3 hours. Without being able to listen side by side with my other speakers, they sound better in all regards than the CVs. Comparing to the RB51s, I never felt I was really missing much but bass. And I was right, except for some friends car stereos 10+ years ago I haven't experienced bass like this before, shelves were a'rattlin. These speakers are just fun. I was first thinking Id sell them and make a few bucks, but I think they are gonna stay awhile.
   
  I just need to get them up off the floor and paired with a respectable Amp/Receiver.


----------



## Skylab

Paired with a good receiver, the HPM-100's sound very, very good indeed. And they are a full-range speaker with a lot of bass weight, but it's pretty good quality bass too. Play with the midrange and tweeter controls to find the best balance for your room, and you may find the HPM-100's stay a long, long time


----------



## jtaylor991

I scored this thing for $75 USD (extra $15 for gas to come to me since he's like 20min away and busy a lot).
   
  http://kansascity.craigslist.org/ele/2547936311.html
   
  Jelly??


----------



## mythless

Sadly the HPM-60 do not fetch a high price point, at most they usually sell between $100-150.  They are nice speakers, I have a pair, but I prefer my other speakers.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Sadly the HPM-60 do not fetch a high price point, at most they usually sell between $100-150.  They are nice speakers, I have a pair, but I prefer my other speakers.


 

 I saw some on da bay go for $327...


----------



## mythless

Ebay doesn't always set the trends, especially if you're opening doors to international buyers and people who may not want to wait.  Selling locally vs ebay can be two different worlds.  Not to mention bidding wars between bidders and substantially mark up the overall price.  I would never pay over $200 for a set of HPM-60.  They are are solid $150 speakers but, in the used market speakers can be had for good prices.  It all depends if you want to wait or not and how deep your pockets are.


----------



## cifani090

Quote:


mythless said:


> Ebay doesn't always set the trends, especially if you're opening doors to international buyers and people who may not want to wait.  Selling locally vs ebay can be two different worlds.  Not to mention bidding wars between bidders and substantially mark up the overall price.  I would never pay over $200 for a set of HPM-60.  They are are solid $150 speakers but, in the used market speakers can be had for good prices.  It all depends if you want to wait or not and how deep your pockets are.


 

 I know what you mean, id definitely never pay over $150 IMO for HMP-60's, but as you said international buyers do pay what they want.


----------



## Skylab

Meh. HPM-60's will wipe the floor with any speaker you could buy for under $300. In nice condition they are easily worth that. I wouldn't pay that for one that looked ugly or needed work, but for a nice condition HPM-60, well worth it IMHO.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Meh. HPM-60's will wipe the floor with any speaker you could buy for under $300. In nice condition they are easily worth that. I wouldn't pay that for one that looked ugly or needed work, but for a nice condition HPM-60, well worth it IMHO.


 

 Are you saying you'd pay more for HPM 60's than 100's? Theoretically the 100's shall be more...


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Meh. HPM-60's will wipe the floor with any speaker you could buy for under $300. In nice condition they are easily worth that. I wouldn't pay that for one that looked ugly or needed work, but for a nice condition HPM-60, well worth it IMHO.


 


  lol depends what you can find, haha.  When I first started the vintage trail, for $300 I saw a pair of magnepans, ess-amt1b, klipsch forte and other higher end speakers for under $300.  Sadly, I cannot find any speaker deals as of late.


----------



## Skylab

Myth less, quite true...but if you look at what a NEW set of speakers would cost, you can't come close to the HPM-60 for $2-300, IMO.

But no, Cifanni, I prefer the HPM-100. If I could get either one for the same price, I would choose the 100over the 60.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Myth less, quite true...but if you look at what a NEW set of speakers would cost, you can't come close to the HPM-60 for $2-300, IMO.
> 
> But no, Cifanni, I prefer the HPM-100. If I could get either one for the same price, I would choose the 100over the 60.


 


  That is very true.  I am waiting for some of the bigger HPMs to show up in my city.  While I think the 60s are good speakers in their own right, I want to hear some of the bigger HPMs.


----------



## jtaylor991

Does anyone have an opinion on my reel to reel deck? The few times I have posted here I've just been ignored except for one sarcastic comment about my Monitor 10s. I really need help on this.
   
  Worth $70?:
   
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/ele/2547936311.html


----------



## mythless

lol I know nothing about RTR, sorry can't help.


----------



## jtaylor991

I passed on it, since it was apparently a low quality portable single motor one. I'd rather save up and get a good one if I find myself still interested when I do have the money for a good deck.
   
  Back on track, I just got some new Pioneer CS-M555s at a garage sale up the street. Not amazing, but they sound mighty fine for the price. The left tweeter is blown though, which I am pretty sure I didn't do, and there are a couple of cave ins in the foam surrounds, or you could say parts that stick out from the driver flexing, which I probably did do, considering they weren't very valuable speakers, and I know when too much is too much, and put my receiver volume high enough coming out of my phone with some hip hop on maxed out bass to get my whole house booming to see how far they go and to have some fun.
   
  I did have the bass boost on and knob maxed for a few seconds, and they sounded like tey were ready to blow, and they were flexing a TON, so I turned it down. I bet I just stretched out the foam surrounds, which I didn't know were foam and I wouldn't have done what I did if I realized that they were foam, from flexing the woofers so much. I bet I did it and oh well, they still play great except for that blown tweeter that is still stocked by Pioneer for like $30 anyway, which I know I didn't do because the highs sounded funky since I turned the speakers on anyway.
   
  I could have them re foamed, fix the tweeter and hook them up to my main rig at the back into the second output on my receiver (mine has one of those speaker 1 and 2 switches if you know what I mean) and keep them both on for a four speaker, more room filling sound. I tried this with some other speakers and they were so much lower quality and lower volume than the fronts that I couldn't even tell, so maybe these will fare better. If not, I'll find a place for them, or sell them. Anyone here wanna buy em?


----------



## Pricklely Peete

jtaylor991
   
  Looks like a treated fabric surround (although with my crappy eyesight it could be foam) that has deformed, most likely from less than careful storage by the previous owner(s). It should not effect the sound any.
   
  On another note it's been a few months since I made the local second hand shop sweep in my stomping grounds (for anything worthy). Reading this thread this evening has got me pumped up for a look see tomorrow morning 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





   Hopefully I'll be able to find some power amps (for the cottage system) and maybe a decent sub (if I'm really lucky).
   
  Peete.


----------



## jtaylor991

Yeah it feels more like that fabric surround you mentioned than foam, but I only knew of foam and rubber surrounds existing, so I assumed it was foam. I have felt foam surrounds, and this feels like something else but feels like foam (kinda) when you push on it. Also, the deformation fortunately hasn't seemed to affect the sound. Good luck on your hunt!
  
  Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> jtaylor991
> 
> Looks like a treated fabric surround (although with my crappy eyesight it could be foam) that has deformed, most likely from less than careful storage by the previous owner(s). It should not effect the sound any.
> 
> ...


----------



## mph101

Hi I thought I would post some of my vintage speakers I still use daily.  Enjoying this thread big time.
   
  The HPM-900's I bought new for my 13th B-day in 1983.  In the garage loft I still have a pr of HPM-1100's but they are for another day long away if I can find parts to repair them.  Ignore the sputnik looking wall  candle holder and the Jack Daniels bandana as the HPM's are sitting on cinder blocks and its more to protect the speaker case from the brick then red neck look.  These HPM -900's have just suffered a terrible hard life but still sound very good.  I mean they still pound metal just like in 1983, however I am getting them repaired.  Of course the  polymer graphite  woofers were destroyed when I brought them in for the first refoaming by a guy who said he knew what he was doing.  That was a major hit, the same problem to the HPM-1100's  but those 15" woofers are even harder to get going and $$$$. 
  A excellent local speaker shop is local, Simply Speakers and the HPM's are going to be put back the best I can woofer wise.  The recone Kevlar woofers still sound decent in the nest.  Notice how small the HPM's look next to my 1992 Cerwin Vega VS-150's!  But they are not.  The HPM's produce a better quality range, even a better bass range with the kevlar woofers but nothing I mean nothing tops what the CV VS-150's can do.    This is my PC sound , but its where I spend most of my time as I slug down Vodka.  I have found that I still enjoy the carver TFM-45 as a decent amp to use hooked on to a ASUS xonar ST.  Though here is a not bad Audiosource amp-310 hooked up to the HPM-900's.  I never thought any of this stuff would still be sounding so good after all these years.


----------



## WNBC

Cool, never heard of Cerwin Vega but now they're on my watch list.  Almost ready to pounce on some speakers for my 717.  In negotiations for HPM-100 and HPM-900.  If those fail I'll end up with some Klipsch Quartets.
  
  Quote: 





mph101 said:


> Hi I thought I would post some of my vintage speakers I still use daily.  Enjoying this thread big time.
> 
> The HPM-900's I bought new for my 13th B-day in 1983.  In the garage loft I still have a pr of HPM-1100's but they are for another day long away if I can find parts to repair them.  Ignore the sputnik looking wall  candle holder and the Jack Daniels bandana as the HPM's are sitting on cinder blocks and its more to protect the speaker case from the brick then red neck look.  These HPM -900's have just suffered a terrible hard life but still sound very good.  I mean they still pound metal just like in 1983, however I am getting them repaired.  Of course the  polymer graphite  woofers were destroyed when I brought them in for the first refoaming by a guy who said he knew what he was doing.  That was a major hit, the same problem to the HPM-1100's  but those 15" woofers are even harder to get going and $$$$.
> A excellent local speaker shop is local, Simply Speakers and the HPM's are going to be put back the best I can woofer wise.  The recone Kevlar woofers still sound decent in the nest.  Notice how small the HPM's look next to my 1992 Cerwin Vega VS-150's!  But they are not.  The HPM's produce a better quality range, even a better bass range with the kevlar woofers but nothing I mean nothing tops what the CV VS-150's can do.    This is my PC sound , but its where I spend most of my time as I slug down Vodka.  I have found that I still enjoy the carver TFM-45 as a decent amp to use hooked on to a ASUS xonar ST.  Though here is a not bad Audiosource amp-310 hooked up to the HPM-900's.  I never thought any of this stuff would still be sounding so good after all these years.


----------



## killertofu

Slight cross-post from another thread I started, a user suggested I post in here.
   
  I have a question for all vintage speaker fans!
   
   I inherited a pair of HPM-60 from my father and did some minor repairs to them to bring them back to life. Several years ago, the 10" woofers dried out and were removed so I purchased a pair of Dayton Audio SD270A-88's to replace them. Unfortunately since I haven't heard the original woofers, I can't compare the two. The Daytons work well in my opinion but the speakers lack low end.
   
  Anyways, I am confused as to why these woofers do now provide much low end! I figured since the speakers were 10's and had a starting frequency of 26hz, that they'd be able to provide more than enough bass.
   
  Can someone school me on audio physics and how to get more bass out of these units, if it's even possible? I figured it might be because the boxes are ported, or that I might have bought the wrong woofers. I do not want to do any mods to the units besides possibly replacing the Daytons with better drivers.


----------



## randerson07

I see 3 original woofers for sale on ebay...
  http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=pioneer+hpm+60&_sacat=See-All-Categories
   
  Sorry cant provide any other help.


----------



## Skylab

Killertofu,

The issue is that You can't just drop in any old 10" woofer and expect the same results as the original woofer. There are a bunch of things that must be considered. First of all, the replacement woofer would have to be the same impedance and sensitivity/efficiency. But moreover, woofer performance in a given box is determined Thiele-Small parameters, which are very complex.

Bottom line: you need original woofers like in the link above.


----------



## randerson07

off topic but, I didnt even notice your name was killertofu, I suppose thats a Doug reference? I had an AIM screename of Killertofu2 for a while.


----------



## killertofu

Good find randerson! I may have to pick up a pair of those before they become harder to find than they already are. Thanks for the response Skylab, I figured it would be something complex that couldn't be easily replicated without original hardware. I'm curious how they sound from the factory, I never had the opportunity to appreciate them before they went into storage.

 And yes, its a doug reference! Honk-Honk!


----------



## Skylab

I like the way the HPM-60 sound - I have a pair that is completely stock, although I plan to recap the crossovers like I did on my HPM-100. The HPM-60 woofers are really nice - very heavy magnets, carbon fibre cones...and the bass is very strong. No one should hear HPM-60's as bass shy


----------



## moodyrn

Wow, I can't believe this thread has been going on for this long and I didn't know about it. Well I guess it shows how often I visit this side of headfi.

Well I have a pair of klipsch epic cf-2's. Maybe not quiet vintage(1994), but they sound better than any klipsch I've listened to the last several years. The epic line was an attempt by klipsch to produce an "audiophile" sounding speaker. This was a turn off by some klipsch fans because it wasn't the typical klipsch sound. Which IMO was a good thing. Most klipschs I've listened to, other than the vintages of course, sounds bright, thin, and lacking in bass extension. These are very accurate, musical sounding speakers IMO. With plenty at both ends. The two 8in drivers actually sounds like 8in drivers.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Wow, I can't believe this thread has been going on for this long and I didn't know about it. Well I guess it shows how often I visit this side of headfi.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Good to see you


----------



## moodyrn

Thanks!


----------



## WNBC

Silly Noob Question.
  What type of connections are you guys making to the push-pin terminal connectors of your HPM-100?  Bare wire or twist crimp connector?
  The seller suggested sticking with 12 guage wire with these speakers.  I have some Blue Jeans Cables 12-gauge but it can be a 'b' to work with so I may need to get a more flexible 12-gauge (if possible - Maybe Axiom bulk cable suggested by WAnt).
   
  On a side note, I got to listen to some of his vintage gear and he had a lot.  I didn't catch the models but he had a really transparent sounding Tandberg receiver and ADS speakers.  Really cool stuff, never heard anything vintage other than my Sansui.  Lots of different flavors of receivers and amps out there.  I thought I was done but now I got another itch.............


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Silly Noob Question.
> What type of connections are you guys making to the push-pin terminal connectors of your HPM-100?  Bare wire or twist crimp connector?
> The seller suggested sticking with 12 guage wire with these speakers.  I have some Blue Jeans Cables 12-gauge but it can be a 'b' to work with so I may need to get a more flexible 12-gauge (if possible - Maybe Axiom bulk cable suggested by WAnt).
> 
> On a side note, I got to listen to some of his vintage gear and he had a lot.  I didn't catch the models but he had a really transparent sounding Tandberg receiver and ADS speakers.  Really cool stuff, never heard anything vintage other than my Sansui.  Lots of different flavors of receivers and amps out there.  I thought I was done but now I got another itch.............


 

  A couple pairs of 5 way binding posts makes life a lot easier. You keep the original back plate on the speakers but drill two holes in the cab back to install the new binding posts. Here is what I use when I come across those god awful spring posts. http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=091-1250
   
  All you have to do to make the switch is to relocate the wiring from the original posts to the new ones. If you want to go back to stock look then remove the aftermarket posts and fill in the holes with plastic wood....I can't imagine why anyone would want to go back but you never know with some collectors (insisting on all original or nothing).
   
  It's a decent cheap upgrade that leaves you free to experiment with cable choices and there termination options. Bare wire is best (but it oxidizes over time), spades are second best, while banana lugs and pins are least desirable (although it's hard to hear any real difference between each type as long as it's a good tight connection).
   
  Peete.


----------



## 5aces

Recollected this thread and have access to these rare vintage speaker bits,if anyone is doing a build,I'm presently not up for the project:

  

All working,four Goodmans Axiom 80 drivers,two Trebax horns and all electronics-not often found but a real pleasure to listen to.


----------



## WNBC

Thanks for the advice.  If I can't tackle this I know a local shop that should be able to do the job.  
  
  Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> A couple pairs of 5 way binding posts makes life a lot easier. You keep the original back plate on the speakers but drill two holes in the cab back to install the new binding posts. Here is what I use when I come across those god awful spring posts. http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=091-1250
> 
> All you have to do to make the switch is to relocate the wiring from the original posts to the new ones. If you want to go back to stock look then remove the aftermarket posts and fill in the holes with plastic wood....I can't imagine why anyone would want to go back but you never know with some collectors (insisting on all original or nothing).
> 
> ...


----------



## WarriorAnt

[size=medium]Nothing thrills me more than getting vintage gear really cheap.  I put together a little system for one of my flat screens for $20.   $5 for a Marantz 2215B and $15 for a pair of Bose 301 Series II.    But I want a subwoofer now.  Any suggestions for a subwoofer that can be used with a Marantz 2215B?   ​[/size]


----------



## Skylab

Try to find one of the Definitive Technology Pro Subs. Those will accept speaker level so you can connect to the "B" speakers of the Marantz. Nice little subs, and should be cheap used or on eBay.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Try to find one of the Definitive Technology Pro Subs. Those will accept speaker level so you can connect to the "B" speakers of the Marantz. Nice little subs, and should be cheap used or on eBay.


 

 Cool.  How does the receiver amplify when choosing "A&B" speakers?    Are there 2 sets of transistors amplifying the output or is all through one set.


----------



## Skylab

One set, but the thing about a powered sub is it will present basically no meaningful load on the amp, so it's not an issue.


----------



## Uncle Erik

My Dad and I got the KLH 23s playing again today. A friend gave him the pair and we refinished the nice walnut cabinets.

He wanted a stereo in the house we're (slowly) rebuilding, so we found a battered old Realistic receiver (with an 8 Track!) and I soldered together a coule speaker cables since it has RCA jacks for output.

We hooked it up and those old 23s sound pretty damned good. They're even-handed and accurate. The woofers make nice bass, too. Mighty fine for free.

I'll finish off the restoration shortly. The crossovers are just a coil and a 4.0uf cap. Coils are fine, but the caps are ancient. Since they sound so nice, I'll spend a few extra bucks to put some nice Jantzen caps in there. I'll replace the stuffing and might line them with Dynamat, too. These are nice speakers and deserve it. The grilles need a little surgery and I might dump the 70's cloth for a nice cream cloth. That would look nice with the walnut.

Also need to look into a suitable system to power these. The old Realistic looks like hell. An older NAD unit would be fine. Dad would like it. Though I'm tempted to hook up an Adcom GFA-535 driven by a DIY tube preamp. That would be sweet. And my parents are doing pretty well with audio gear. Mom goes out walking with an iGrado, Dad likes his SR-125, they have ESS AMT-1s in their main system and PSB Alpha B1s on their TV. With these 23s, they're doing pretty well!


----------



## calipilot227

Not sure if these are vintage (late 1980's), but I just scored a pair of Onkyo Fusion S-39 speakers from Salvation Army. $30 for the pair. Cabinets are like-new. Anyone know how much these are worth?
   

   
  Driven by my Sony GX-800ES receiver (1994 model)
  Sorry about the sideways photos, does a mod know how to fix this?


----------



## WarriorAnt




----------



## calipilot227

Thanks


----------



## cifani090

uncle erik said:


> My Dad and I got the KLH 23s playing again today. A friend gave him the pair and we refinished the nice walnut cabinets.
> He wanted a stereo in the house we're (slowly) rebuilding, so we found a battered old Realistic receiver (with an 8 Track!) and I soldered together a coule speaker cables since it has RCA jacks for output.
> We hooked it up and those old 23s sound pretty damned good. They're even-handed and accurate. The woofers make nice bass, too. Mighty fine for free.
> I'll finish off the restoration shortly. The crossovers are just a coil and a 4.0uf cap. Coils are fine, but the caps are ancient. Since they sound so nice, I'll spend a few extra bucks to put some nice Jantzen caps in there. I'll replace the stuffing and might line them with Dynamat, too. These are nice speakers and deserve it. The grilles need a little surgery and I might dump the 70's cloth for a nice cream cloth. That would look nice with the walnut.
> Also need to look into a suitable system to power these. The old Realistic looks like hell. An older NAD unit would be fine. Dad would like it. Though I'm tempted to hook up an Adcom GFA-535 driven by a DIY tube preamp. That would be sweet. And my parents are doing pretty well with audio gear. Mom goes out walking with an iGrado, Dad likes his SR-125, they have ESS AMT-1s in their main system and PSB Alpha B1s on their TV. With these 23s, they're doing pretty well!






skylab said:


> One set, but the thing about a powered sub is it will present basically no meaningful load on the amp, so it's not an issue.




Wow, my two favorite people just posted ontop of each other


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Are those 15 in woofers or 12's in the Onkyo cabs ? I bet they do a darn good job...for 30 bucks a pair in that condition...you did good Calipilot...real good.
   
  Uncle E...good score with the KLH speakers ! Once you replace those ancient 4uf caps you'll likely be pleasantly surprised.
   
  Peete.


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





pricklely peete said:


> Are those 15 in woofers or 12's in the Onkyo cabs ? I bet they do a darn good job...for 30 bucks a pair in that condition...you did good Calipilot...real good.
> 
> Uncle E...good score with the KLH speakers ! Once you replace those ancient 4uf caps you'll likely be pleasantly surprised.
> 
> Peete.


 

 Thank you! I believe they are either 10's or 12's. Sounds great, and I guess that's all that really matters


----------



## cifani090

@Skylab;
   
  Do you know of any good DIY wood horn speakers? I remember reading about some EVR wood horn speakers, or something like that, that it was called. And what do these kits go for?


----------



## Skylab

I have no clue about that.


----------



## cifani090

skylab said:


> I have no clue about that.




Well you are a DIYer, any wooden horn speakers at all than?


----------



## Skylab

Not my area of expertise. Lots of vintage horn speakers, and of course the king of the horn is Klispsch. I was considering Heresy's before buying my HPM-100's. But I have not heard much in the way of horn speakers. I am sure others here must have, though.


----------



## NU62

Just noticed this thread and saw there is a lot of commentary regarding Pioneer CS 99 speakers.  I have a pair of Pioneer CS-63DX speakers in storage.  This is the big brother of the CS 99 and is relatively rare in the U.S.  The CS-63DX is a 4 way, with a 15" woofer, 2 5" midranges, a horn tweeter and 2 super tweeters.  Each speaker weighs about 63 lbs and cost around $700 when new.  (Manufactured from 1971 thru 1973)  I also have a pair of Electro Voice 12TRXB speakers in custom Aristocrat cabinets in storage.  One of the speakers in the pair was the first high end speaker I bought about 1956 - the other I found on Ebay 4 years ago. Finally, one of the systems in my home has a pair of Altec 601C speakers in custom cabinets made from Altec plans.  I power them with a Yamaha M65 amp through a Marantz 8T preamp.


----------



## MrQ

My HPM-100's have arrived. 

The Fed-Ex guy says "Thank god you're in! I thought I was going to have to drive around with these in the back of my van all day. Put something on your feet I'm going to need a hand carrying these in."

Following a couple dead lifts up the stairs (by myself) and a shower, they are now in place. 

Now I think some stands are in order. about 8-10 inches should do it. Skylab, those plastic bins you used, did they belong to Thor? How do they stand the weight? I think I may get some stone blocks or something.


----------



## Skylab

The stands I got are just black plastic bins from Target (big discount store chain here in the US). They work perfectly.


----------



## MrQ

^ Thanks. 

I've really been enjoying these today, especially when played quietly.


----------



## jtaylor991

For electronics and accessories they are anything but that however. All the electronics stores in the US seem to have the same prices give or take ten bucks here and there.
  
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> The stands I got are just black plastic bins from Target (big discount store chain here in the US). They work perfectly.


----------



## WNBC

Finally got the HPM-100s hooked up to the Sansui 717.  Best pair of speakers I've ever owned.  I wasn't expecting them to be so clear and airy.  Most noticeable was that these speakers could keep up with the speed of the music I was playing.  Bass is out of this world deep and detailed.  My downstairs neighbors would agree as well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Finally got the HPM-100s hooked up to the Sansui 717.  Best pair of speakers I've ever owned.  I wasn't expecting them to be so clear and airy.  Most noticeable was that these speakers could keep up with the speed of the music I was playing.  Bass is out of this world deep and detailed.  My downstairs neighbors would agree as well
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH NICE!    Those look like a real find!   Should they be straight on like that or turned inward a bit.    They come with those stands?


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Finally got the HPM-100s hooked up to the Sansui 717.  Best pair of speakers I've ever owned.  I wasn't expecting them to be so clear and airy.  Most noticeable was that these speakers could keep up with the speed of the music I was playing.  Bass is out of this world deep and detailed.  My downstairs neighbors would agree as well
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  SWEET!
   
  Yeah, there's just something about paper cone drivers and cloth surrounds. At least for me anyway. They just seem to have a presence and liveliness that I don't get with plastic cones and rubber surrounds.
   
  se


----------



## MrQ

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> Finally got the HPM-100s hooked up to the Sansui 717.  Best pair of speakers I've ever owned.  I wasn't expecting them to be so clear and airy.  Most noticeable was that these speakers could keep up with the speed of the music I was playing.  Bass is out of this world deep and detailed.  My downstairs neighbors would agree as well
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Where did you get those stands? Mine need that lift.


----------



## Skylab

Very very nice, WNBC!  Congrats.  I also agree the stands look excellent.
   
  There is a reason the HPM-100's continue to be popular after all these years - they're darned good speakers.
   
  The other reason is the drivers, which were some of the first to use carbon fiber, are basically indestructible, having, as Steve mentioned, treated cloth surrounds.  Speakers from that era with foam surrounds basically all had those rot and had to be reconed.  That's always dicey no matter how well done.


----------



## WNBC

*Thanks, the guy I bought them from kept them pristine and he repairs speakers so I knew I would be getting them in great shape.  Stands purchased from a buy on Ebay.  He did a custom job for me.  Not necessarily the ones in this link but you can contact him about desired dimensions and color.  On the sides of my stands there is about an inch of play.  No biggie.  In front there is about 3-4 inches.  So, if you have kids who might lean on your speakers then I don't recommend buying them because they will fall over with enough weight put on them.  It's possible I didn't give him the correct dimensions for the front or he was not capable of making anything larger.  These stands would be even better on hardwood rather than carpet.  I like Skylab's speaker stand idea so I may make a trip to Target.  Good to know, I didn't know that they should be turned inward.  Learn something new everyday.*
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-gorgeous-Solid-Wood-Tilt-back-Speaker-Stands-Cherry-stain-/320767198981?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item4aaf370705#ht_500wt_1413

 Quote:


warriorant said:


> OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH NICE!    Those look like a real find!   Should they be straight on like that or turned inward a bit.    They come with those stands?


 
   

*These do sound pretty sweet.  Gentle giants that sound lively at low volume and can get angry yet controlled when I pump them up.*
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> SWEET!
> 
> Yeah, there's just something about paper cone drivers and cloth surrounds. At least for me anyway. They just seem to have a presence and liveliness that I don't get with plastic cones and rubber surrounds.
> 
> se


 

  
*Contact the guy who I linked to but I think the Target stands may be the best route for carpets and if there are people inclined to touch your speakers.*
   
  Quote: 





mrq said:


> Where did you get those stands? Mine need that lift.


 

  
*Very happy with these speakers.  It was a bit good luck that I didn't end up with the Klipsch KG4.2 (guy was asleep when I showed up to buy them) and then these showed up a week later on Craigslist.  The first guy who responded to the ad didn't show up and I swooped in!*
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Very very nice, WNBC!  Congrats.  I also agree the stands look excellent.
> 
> There is a reason the HPM-100's continue to be popular after all these years - they're darned good speakers.
> 
> The other reason is the drivers, which were some of the first to use carbon fiber, are basically indestructible, having, as Steve mentioned, treated cloth surrounds.  Speakers from that era with foam surrounds basically all had those rot and had to be reconed.  That's always dicey no matter how well done.


----------



## WarriorAnt

I don't know if they should be turned inward or not but I guess as with any speaker you have play with them in the listening space to get optimum performance.  Most speakers benefit from some degree of toe-in but some do not.


----------



## Skylab

I like the 100's with a bit of toe-in, myself.  Maybe 20 degrees or so,


----------



## MrQ

Quote: 





wnbc said:


> *Contact the guy who I linked to but I think the Target stands may be the best route for carpets and if there are people inclined to touch your speakers.*


 
   
  Thanks for the link. US delivery only though. Looks like I'm going to have to get some custom made over here.


----------



## Skylab

There is a very nice looking pair in the Chicago Craigslist today for $200/pair - I bet those don't last long.  Amazes me how much price variation there is in the HPM-100 both on CL and EBay.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> There is a very nice looking pair in the Chicago Craigslist today for $200/pair - I bet those don't last long.  Amazes me how much price variation there is in the HPM-100 both on CL and EBay.


 

 Very true, the prices are soo much higher on ebay, but i hate selling on there; and shipping is alot for speakers,receivers,etc.


----------



## Imonfire

I got a pair of Jamo CL 25 that I need to refoam (I made a topic about that here). I found them in a flee market for 50 bucks. Are they good speakers? I had never heard of Jamo before.


----------



## sluker

I finally got on the HPM-100 bandwagon.
  Once my SX1250 comes back from the shop my vintage speaker rig will be complete.
  Although I think $360 is on the high side these are near mint, the pictures don't do them justice.


----------



## cifani090

^^^Very nice! Get them from an audio dealer?


----------



## Skylab

Slurker, how do you like the sound?


----------



## sluker

I only heard them briefly at the house of the person who I bought them from so I know they work but they were set up outside in the driveway. 
  Unfortunately, I won't get to listen to them in my system until the WE.
  He did turn them up quite loud and there was no distortion what so ever, a good sign I think.
  By the way, he also has a minty looking SX1080 he has listed for $400 on CL, but would be willing to ship if anyone is interested. 

  
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Slurker, how do you like the sound?


----------



## sluker

Thanks.
  I found these on CL, in fact the original listing was for a SX1080 which mentioned he had the speakers as well. I called him to ask and he said he had sold them to a friend but had another pair in better condition which he was thinking about selling, two weeks of haggling and we agreed on a price.
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> ^^^Very nice! Get them from an audio dealer?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





sluker said:


> Thanks.
> I found these on CL, in fact the original listing was for a SX1080 which mentioned he had the speakers as well. I called him to ask and he said he had sold them to a friend but had another pair in better condition which he was thinking about selling, two weeks of haggling and we agreed on a price.


 

 Gotca, very nice speakers, as well as the great condition of them. Not sure if the price if me, but if you want perfect looking speakers than these are them.


----------



## sluker

OK, working from home today so first impressions on the HPM-100's in between conference calls.
  As an aside I went to the Foo Fighters show at the Forum last night (with ear plugs) so I think the impressions may be tainted by my ears being tired, but at the same time it gives me a reference point to live sound.
   
*The space:*
  Is a home office with carpeted floors except for where the speakers are there is a granite platform (see pictures in my previous post), there are wood doors directly across from the speakers behind the listening position. the space is more wide than long with 11ft ceilings. Not ideal but all that I have to work with at this time.
   
*Equipment:*
  ALAC-------->Ipod------->Onkyo ND-S1coax------>Harmon Kardon CD330 (DAC portion of transport)------>Toshiba SA-7100 (temporary until the SX1250 comes back)
   
*Impressions:*
   
*[size=10.5pt]Bass:[/size]*
  Deep is the key word here, at lower volumes it is fairly tight and punchy, but as I turn the volume up it becomes more muddy. A sub in this set would be redundant (perhaps in a bigger room).  
  It feels like the granite floors are dispersing the bass at higher volumes, so I think I need to lift these up on stands to improve the base. A trip to Pier 1 or Target may be necessary.
   
*Midds:*
  The guitars sound awesome through these speakers, as close to live as i have heard from speakers. The crunchy sound of live guitars and the clank of cowbell seem to be fairly accurate to my ears.
   
*Highs:*
  This is where I need to do more tweaking. Depending on the recording, sometimes the treble can be quite shrill. This can possibly be attributed to the Toshiba as it is on the bright side compared to the pioneer and the Sansui (AU717).
   
   
*Overall:*

 The soundstage height and depth appears to be quite accurate; Clapton's MTV live feels like I am in the third row.
 Vocals sound awesome, Johnny Cash's version of One is haunting, there is a feeling of regret and sorrow in his voice that I never picked up on before.
 Voice decay is excellent, Margo's voice on Trinity Revisited carries to the rafters of the church (it helps to have 11 foot ceilings) Cymbal decay seems to be  accurate, as well.
   
  I have been listening to the first 30sec of Crazy Train for the last ten minutes with a big grin on my face. When the guitars come in you can tell where the amp is in reference to the vocal mike and the drums and the bass amp. I feel like I am in the studio. No regrets so far.
   
  Skylab, I would love to learn more about the crossover recap you did, is there a source you can point me to?
   
  More to come.


----------



## Pricklely Peete

Well through some rather good luck and a little elbow grease (did a favor for a friend by mounting an HDTV Antenna at his cottage last weekend) I managed to secure a 1978 Vintage Pioneer SA7700 amp for free (in good working order, other than a few lights being out which will be swapped for LEDs) which was a pleasant surprise to say the least. Of course it needs a little clean up and some internal/external TLC but for the most part it's a good start to the vintage system. I have been keeping an eye on the HPM-100's in my local area and if a pair pops up within driving distance I'll be on them faster than Oprah on a baked ham.
   
  Sluker...some stands would definitely help with the muddy bass issue at medium volume levels. Floor coupling/reflections with full range speakers was one of the drawbacks way back when which was solved with the use of stands which in turn opened up an entire market in the late 70's early 80's. I'd try out some Sound Anchor types with the HPM-100s if Sound Anchor has a suitable candidate.
   
  Peete.


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





sluker said:


> Skylab, I would love to learn more about the crossover recap you did, is there a source you can point me to?
> 
> More to come.


 


  Here you go:
   
  http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120454


----------



## RexAeterna

cifani090 said:


> @Skylab;
> 
> Do you know of any good DIY wood horn speakers? I remember reading about some EVR wood horn speakers, or something like that, that it was called. And what do these kits go for?




i never heard of wood before. i knew of the legendary Altec horns were made out of some heavy metal with tar inside that acted like some acoustic filter of some sort. they were known to be massive weighing about 150-200lbs just for the horn alone i believe. they are extremely rare to get actual authentic ones cause lot of people only have or sell replicas of it and some scammers try to sell replicas as the ''real'' thing lot of times.

also i believe Altec Lansing made the world famous ''Voice Of The Theatre'' speakers which was used for movies back then and was known for their massive soundstage and on and off axis dispersion. i think Altec Lansing already revived them as well and selling around 4000 per speaker but need to be specially ordered from Altec lansing themselves.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





rexaeterna said:


> i never heard of wood before. i knew of the legendary Altec horns were made out of some heavy metal with tar inside that acted like some acoustic filter of some sort. they were known to be massive weighing about 150-200lbs just for the horn alone i believe. they are extremely rare to get actual authentic ones cause lot of people only have or sell replicas of it and some scammers try to sell replicas as the ''real'' thing lot of times.
> also i believe Altec Lansing made the world famous ''Voice Of The Theatre'' speakers which was used for movies back then and was known for their massive soundstage and on and off axis dispersion. i think Altec Lansing already revived them as well and selling around 4000 per speaker but need to be specially ordered from Altec lansing themselves.


 

 Thanks for the the info. I know Altec made some great speakers in their time. These were similar speakers i was mentioning.
   
  http://www.audiosmile.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20871


----------



## WarriorAnt

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/18/business/edgar-m-villchur-hi-fi-innovator-dies-at-94.html
   
  A great vintage speaker innovator passed away.   Edgar M. Villchur.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/18/business/edgar-m-villchur-hi-fi-innovator-dies-at-94.html
> 
> A great vintage speaker innovator passed away.   Edgar M. Villchur.


 

 Saw that in the other vintage thread. Thanks WA, RIP Mr. Villchur.


----------



## moodyrn

I've added a pair a klipsh kg-4's to my collection. It's recommended on the klipsch/audiokarma forums to replace the tweeter on a lot of the vintage klipschs with Bob Crites titanium diaphrams. Well now I see why. The treble response is much improve and is a lot smoother and extended. Imaging is much better as well. These aren't as good technically as my epic cf-2's but they are really fun to listen to. I listen to these more than my psb T65 floorstanders.


----------



## sluker

Thanks Rob,
  I recapped one of the speaker cross overs and left the other to see if I can tell the difference.
  I wonder how much time for new caps to burn in?


  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Here you go:
> 
> http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120454


----------



## Skylab

Looks like you did a nice job.  The caps maybe need 50 hours or so?
   
  Looking forwa to your comments!


----------



## Meewoo

Hello, guys, I just found out this sister thread of "vintage receiver/amp", great read!
   
  As you guys refer "vintage" speakers, which time period fall in "vintage" category? Before 1985??
   
  I have a general question about speakers. What the benefit of bookshelf speakers other than size? I am asking the "obvious" question since I have a superb bookshelf speakers Celestion 100 (BTW, they are $1200 per pair in 1992). They are small but the sound-stage is so damn good with wide 3-d effect. When I am listening to music, I feel as I am in live. Although it doesn't have the "front row" image as Allison CD9 and CD6, it definitely beat my JBL L7, Heresy, even my beloved KEF q-90 (I need try to place q-90 differently).
  I googled and found out Celestion bookshelf speakers all have superb soundstage, and Celestion made more bookshelf models than floor speakers. So my first conclusion, they product bookshelf because bookshelf is good at image. If my first conclusion was wrong, then i have my second conclusion. Does 2-way can produce good image than 3-way? Since most of Celestion speakers are 2-way (even their floor-standing one). I don't think this makes any sense, Allison CD6 is 2-way, CD9 is 3-way, and they share almost same sound-stage. Can someone enlight me of sound-stage of speakers???


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Hello, guys, I just found out this sister thread of "vintage receiver/amp", great read!
> 
> As you guys refer "vintage" speakers, which time period fall in "vintage" category? Before 1985??
> 
> ...


 

 I made this thread, as even my B&W DM610i's that i sold were made in the early 90's, but my L100's beat them by 100. The Clestions look alot like my DM610's that i had. All it matters is that you enjoy them.


----------



## Meewoo

Thanks, Cifani! I really enjoy my Celestion 100. I just want to know what makes the little bookshelf  speakers render sound-stage so well. I haven't have chance to listen to famous B&W DM602 S3 yet, but one day I will.
   
  I had tried B&W DM620 floor-standing speakers (brother of your DM610), but I sold them due to not well controlled bass. I tried B&W DM 310 bookshelf speakers too. They sound very good in small area but couldn't fill middle size room. So I sold them too. Celestion 100 can really fill middle size room!!  I also tried Pioneer CS-88a, but never like them.
   
  My vintage speakers are 1977 Heresy and 1982(?) Polk monitor 10. I had ADS L-710 before, but I like Polk more than ADS, so I sold them too. I just wondering why no one talks ADS here.


----------



## TC44

I've owned a handful of vintage speakers, but the ones I enjoy the most are my Yamaha NS1000M.  Coupled with tubes, the dynamics and timbre are outstanding.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





tc44 said:


> I've owned a handful of vintage speakers, but the ones I enjoy the most are my Yamaha NS1000M.  Coupled with tubes, the dynamics and timbre are outstanding.


 

 Interesting, wonder how they compare to some good ol' vintage JBL studio monitors.


----------



## Skylab

Very popular speaker, the NS1000M.  Definitely a classic.  I would like to hear a pair one day.  They have their devotees, and detractors, like most classics.


----------



## BmWr75

Just finished refurbishing these JBL L40s this weekend.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





bmwr75 said:


> Just finished refurbishing these JBL L40s this weekend.


 

 Very nice, i need to do than on my L100's. What did you do exactly? So you can inspire me to get to it sooner.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Very nice, i need to do than on my L100's. What did you do exactly? So you can inspire me to get to it sooner.


 

 Refoamed the woofers.  Refreshed the cabinets with Howard's Restor-a-Finish (dark walnut) and Feed-n-Wax.  Restretched and reglued the grill cloth.


----------



## Skylab

VERY nice work, Scott! They look great.


----------



## BmWr75

Thanks Rob.  Speakers are a lot of fun to work on.......because unlike tube amp restoration, I almost always know what I'm doing when working on speakers.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Interesting, wonder how they compare to some good ol' vintage JBL studio monitors.


 


  I absolutely hate JBL studio monitors.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> I absolutely hate JBL studio monitors.


 

 Excuse me, but that word it not aloud.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote:  





> I absolutely hate JBL studio monitors.


 

 Yeah?
   
  How could anyone hate a pair of these babies?
   

   
  se


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Yeah?
> 
> How could anyone hate a pair of these babies?
> 
> ...


 
  Well it's not so much the speaker itself I hate but the fact that every edit house in NYC uses them with crown amplification and always in some absurd room configuration.  Usually way too close for hearing comfort.   2.5 decades of that combo can create a lot of disdain.  And you wouldn't believe the configurations.  some rooms would have them 3 feet above ear level near the ceiling and way off axis to actually mix with.  when asked the engineer would always say something ridiculous like "they're up there so the client can here them in the back".  Hey don't worry about the guy who is doing the mixing.  Some houses put them right in front of the edit console just a few feet from your ears so they blow you away with sound pressure levels as you fast forward or rewind the tapes.   So after  so many years having been sonically battered by them I simply came to hate JBL's.  I know it's not rational...


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> I've added a pair a klipsh kg-4's to my collection. It's recommended on the klipsch/audiokarma forums to replace the tweeter on a lot of the vintage klipschs with Bob Crites titanium diaphrams. Well now I see why. The treble response is much improve and is a lot smoother and extended. Imaging is much better as well. These aren't as good technically as my epic cf-2's but they are really fun to listen to. I listen to these more than my psb T65 floorstanders.


 


  Cool, I too have recently picked up a pair of KG-4, while I found the treble to be wide it lacked height and extension.  The Bob Crites titanium diaphrams upgrades seem to correct those as you mentioned.  Though, I still need to try them out with a tube amp.


----------



## jtaylor991

How would these be considered studio monitors again?
  
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Yeah?
> 
> How could anyone hate a pair of these babies?
> 
> ...


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> How would these be considered studio monitors again?


 

 Shows earlier in the thread, they go in the wall.


----------



## jtaylor991

Good to know, but how can they be effectively used as studio monitors if they are so incorrectly out of place up so high in the wall?
  
  Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Shows earlier in the thread, they go in the wall.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Good to know, but how can they be effectively used as studio monitors if they are so incorrectly out of place up so high in the wall?


 

  
  Exactly what I was moaning about but typical!   They seem to have 3 setups in this room.  One set up is too high up and the others a bit too close to the seating position for comfort during a long session for the mixer/editor/whoever.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> How would these be considered studio monitors again?


 


  Those are more sophisticated than most JBL studio monitors I've seen used.  But they are intriguing though.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Well it's not so much the speaker itself I hate but the fact that every edit house in NYC uses them with crown amplification and always in some absurd room configuration.  Usually way too close for hearing comfort.   2.5 decades of that combo can create a lot of disdain.  And you wouldn't believe the configurations.  some rooms would have them 3 feet above ear level near the ceiling and way off axis to actually mix with.  when asked the engineer would always say something ridiculous like "they're up there so the client can here them in the back".  Hey don't worry about the guy who is doing the mixing.  Some houses put them right in front of the edit console just a few feet from your ears so they blow you away with sound pressure levels as you fast forward or rewind the tapes.   So after  so many years having been sonically battered by them I simply came to hate JBL's.  I know it's not rational...


 
   
  Aw man, sorry to hear that. But I completely understand.
   
  se


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Shows earlier in the thread, they go in the wall.


 


 The technical term is "soffit mount." Pretty much der regeur in most recording studios.
   
  se


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Aw man, sorry to hear that. But I completely understand.
> 
> se


 

 For 10 years I freelanced. I would be in a different room in a different house every few days.  The setup configuration wasn't the hard part, getting quickly aquatinted with the room acoustics was.  Every room had such different acoustic characteristics. Even harder was doing a job all day in one suite only to find out that the same job was moved to another suite the next day because of a prior booking. This could mean that the first room was sort of comfortably small and intimate the second room was 5 times bigger and more cavernous. The mix has to end up sounding the same thru both days between the two rooms and you can bet the speakers were not going to be in the same location between the two rooms.  Usually the board will be different and the metering also.  That's just par for the course though.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> For 10 years I freelanced. I would be in a different room in a different house every few days.  The setup configuration wasn't the hard part, getting quickly aquatinted with the room acoustics was.  Every room had such different acoustic characteristics. Even harder was doing a job all day in one suite only to find out that the same job was moved to another suite the next day because of a prior booking. This could mean that the first room was sort of comfortably small and intimate the second room was 5 times bigger and more cavernous. The mix has to end up sounding the same thru both days between the two rooms and you can bet the speakers were not going to be in the same location between the two rooms.  Usually the board will be different and the metering also.  That's just par for the course though.


 

 Gotta wonder how anything of any quality ever manages to get produced.
   
  se


----------



## PhaedraCorruption

Anyone else here use good ol' Altec Horns from the VOTT cabinets? I have 2 of them stacked on top of each other, one for mid range and one smaller one as a tweeter.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jtaylor991 said:


> Good to know, but how can they be effectively used as studio monitors if they are so incorrectly out of place up so high in the wall?


 

 In most studios, the VIP's/customers sit on a couch which it on the right of the photo, but cant be seen. It is that, where the speakers are best directional. I believe in studios all 3-5 pairs of speakers can be ran at once.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> In most studios, the VIP's/customers sit on a couch which it on the right of the photo, but cant be seen. It is that, where the speakers are best directional. I believe in studios all 3-5 pairs of speakers can be ran at once.


 

 Often after I finished a mix down I would stand in the back of the room with the clients to actually hear the mix the way they were able to hear it a nice distance from the speakers.  this would usually be the very first time I'd get to hear how the mix sounded to the clients behind me.


----------



## moodyrn

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Cool, I too have recently picked up a pair of KG-4, while I found the treble to be wide it lacked height and extension.  The Bob Crites titanium diaphrams upgrades seem to correct those as you mentioned.  Though, I still need to try them out with a tube amp.


 


  The Bob Crites does wonders for the treble response. Wednesday I'm going to pick up a pair of forte II's. If they are as good as people say, they should be a huge upgrade over both my epic cf-2s and kg4's. I'm really looking forward to it. Some say with the crites tweeter and crossover upgrades, they compete with speakers costing thousands more. I don't know if that's an exaggeration, but I hope not. But I don't have room for this many speakers since I'm already running a 9.2 psb setup in my family room with an addition 5.1 polk setup in my bedroom. So the kg4's will probably go up for sale on either cl or ebay. But I do really love the kg4's though.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Often after I finished a mix down I would stand in the back of the room with the clients to actually hear the mix the way they were able to hear it a nice distance from the speakers.  this would usually be the very first time I'd get to hear how the mix sounded to the clients behind me.


 

 You also own a studio?


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> You also own a studio?


 

 No. I either worked in editing/mixing suites on staff or walked in as a freelancer to edit/mix both video and audio.  Some rooms are a nightmare to work in while others are bliss.  You have to adapt to each room, the acoustics and the gear.   For me the most important part of the room was believe it or not the type of chair I was going to have to work in for endless hours at a time.  Knowing, learning and using different gear was just part of the job and you had to make due with whatever was in that particular suite, but the chair, that was always the deciding factor for me.  If the suite had a terribly uncomfortable chair in it I would not take the job.  You have to draw the line somewhere.


----------



## melomaniac

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> This thread was inspired by the great ***Calling All "Vintage" Integrated/Receiver Owners*** to show all the great speakers out there that are vintage. Ill start off with my B&W DM610i and i will be soon adding a pair of Klipsch Heresy's in birch still looking for a good pair of vintage speakers. I have some crappy vintage Omega speakers currently


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> The Bob Crites does wonders for the treble response. Wednesday I'm going to pick up a pair of forte II's. If they are as good as people say, they should be a huge upgrade over both my epic cf-2s and kg4's. I'm really looking forward to it. Some say with the crites tweeter and crossover upgrades, they compete with speakers costing thousands more. I don't know if that's an exaggeration, but I hope not. But I don't have room for this many speakers since I'm already running a 9.2 psb setup in my family room with an addition 5.1 polk setup in my bedroom. So the kg4's will probably go up for sale on either cl or ebay. But I do really love the kg4's though.


 


   That's what I'm after as well, a set of Forte.  It gets harder and harder to depart with speakers of the same caliber since they all offer something different and not necessarily worse than the other.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> No. I either worked in editing/mixing suites on staff or walked in as a freelancer to edit/mix both video and audio.  Some rooms are a nightmare to work in while others are bliss.  You have to adapt to each room, the acoustics and the gear.   For me the most important part of the room was believe it or not the type of chair I was going to have to work in for endless hours at a time.  Knowing, learning and using different gear was just part of the job and you had to make due with whatever was in that particular suite, but the chair, that was always the deciding factor for me.  If the suite had a terribly uncomfortable chair in it I would not take the job.  You have to draw the line somewhere.


 

 What was your favorite type of chair? I love Herman Miller chairs, just dont have that type of money to shell out yet. I bet some have vintage MCM lounge chairs...
   
  Quote:  

 I just dont know about them electrostatics. I have some L100's now, but it seems like electrostatics need monoblocks or some special amp, im an amature when it comes to this type of speaker.


----------



## moodyrn

Well I couldn't wait until Wednesday to pick up the forte II's. At 400.00 I was afraid they wouldn't last till then(they go for close to 1000.00 on ebay). When I got there to try them out, I noticed one of the high frequency horns was out. The seller dropped to price 50.00, and that makes this a even better steal. I was already planning to upgrade the diaphrams to the Bob Crites, so now I'm only out 10.00 since the Crites only cost 60.00. Since these are the same diaphrams in the kg4s I just swapped them when I got home. I was first surprised how similar they sounded to the kg4's. But they sounded way better. The soundstage is much bigger, much deeper and tighter bass. The mids are sooo much more refined now since these not only have horns for the treble, but also have mid horns. Although they share a similar sound signature they are in another league. But like the kg4's the epics have a completely different sound signature, and it's a pitty kilpsch only made these for a short period. But I do prefer these to even my epics which I love. I think the epics sound much better than their 2000.00 msrp would suggest. The forte II's with the Bob Crites just sound gorgeous!!


----------



## mythless

Cool!  At least the seller is reasonable.  I've dealt with some with non-functioning tweeters and they barely dropped the price due to whatever justification they had in their minds.  Even if the horn was completely dead, $50?  Hard to pass on that!


----------



## sluker

pictures please.
  
  Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Well I couldn't wait until Wednesday to pick up the forte II's. At 400.00 I was afraid they wouldn't last till then(they go for close to 1000.00 on ebay). When I got there to try them out, I noticed one of the high frequency horns was out. The seller dropped to price 50.00, and that makes this a even better steal. I was already planning to upgrade the diaphrams to the Bob Crites, so now I'm only out 10.00 since the Crites only cost 60.00. Since these are the same diaphrams in the kg4s I just swapped them when I got home. I was first surprised how similar they sounded to the kg4's. But they sounded way better. The soundstage is much bigger, much deeper and tighter bass. The mids are sooo much more refined now since these not only have horns for the treble, but also have mid horns. Although they share a similar sound signature they are in another league. But like the kg4's the epics have a completely different sound signature, and it's a pitty kilpsch only made these for a short period. But I do prefer these to even my epics which I love. I think the epics sound much better than their 2000.00 msrp would suggest. The forte II's with the Bob Crites just sound gorgeous!!


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> What was your favorite type of chair? I love Herman Miller chairs, just dont have that type of money to shell out yet. I bet some have vintage MCM lounge chairs...


 
  Herman miller chairs are pretty to look at but not very comfortable for the long haul.  The best chair has good lumbar support to keep your lower back position in the proper lordosis, a seat that doesn't extend to far out to cur off circulation to you legs, and a good back support so your upper back can get support when you need it.  Sessions can go 10-12 14 or more sometimes.  A bad chair can kill you.
   
   
   



> I just dont know about them electrostatics. I have some L100's now, but it seems like electrostatics need monoblocks or some special amp, im an amature when it comes to this type of speaker.






  Here are my most favorite electrostatics.  The Martin Logan CLS II.  You can drive them with a Krell KSA 80.  Which is an 80 watt amp or pretty much anything worthy of high end.  It's not so much that they need current as much as they need a very good high end amp.  something with great transparency and resolving power.    What is an "amature"    

 If I were to get back into speakers again I'd have to buy a used pair of these (because they don't make them anymore) and send them to Martin Logan to refurbish.   If I couldn't go electrostatic with Martin Logan CLS II's my second choice would be one of the high end maggies.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Cool!  At least the seller is reasonable.  I've dealt with some with non-functioning tweeters and they barely dropped the price due to whatever justification they had in their minds.  Even if the horn was completely dead, $50?  Hard to pass on that!


 

 Same with me, when picking up the L100's i noticed no grills, more thick damage than i imagined (thought it would be more scratches, but i had a chunk missing) and he was giving me the lecture, in person, that he told me that these problems were there, he didn't really, and so he would not drop the price at all. He tried threatening me saying that he could at least double what he was asking (got em for $100) so i just bought them at $100 and left.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Herman miller chairs are pretty to look at but not very comfortable for the long haul.  The best chair has good lumbar support to keep your lower back position in the proper lordosis, a seat that doesn't extend to far out to cur off circulation to you legs, and a good back support so your upper back can get support when you need it.  Sessions can go 10-12 14 or more sometimes.  A bad chair can kill you.
> 
> Here are my most favorite electrostatics.  The Martin Logan CLS II.  You can drive them with a Krell KSA 80.  Which is an 80 watt amp or pretty much anything worthy of high end.  It's not so much that they need current as much as they need a very good high end amp.  something with great transparency and resolving power.    What is an "amature"
> 
> If I were to get back into speakers again I'd have to buy a used pair of these (because they don't make them anymore) and send them to Martin Logan to refurbish.   If I couldn't go electrostatic with Martin Logan CLS II's my second choice would be one of the high end maggies.


 

 "Amature" i meant as i dont know much about electrostatic speakers. Are you familiar with the Steelcase Think chair? Those are also im my book of chairs that im looking at. Old 1990's electrostatics you can find commonly for $100-200, whether or not they play, is another subject in itself.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> "Amature" i meant as i dont know much about electrostatic speakers. Are you familiar with the Steelcase Think chair? Those are also im my book of chairs that im looking at. Old 1990's electrostatics you can find commonly for $100-200, whether or not they play, is another subject in itself.


 

 Wit which 1990's electrostatics are you talking about?   I might be interested in something.    I never se any ads for electrostatics...
   
   
     the only way to pick a good chair is to go sit in it.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Wit which 1990's electrostatics are you talking about?   I might be interested in something.    I never se any ads for electrostatics...
> 
> 
> the only way to pick a good chair is to go sit in it.


 

 The Maggies, you can find them on craigslist and estate sales for that type of speaker. I saw a craigslist ad about 7-8 months ago on a pair for $200 and i called them, but they were gone. That was the time i wanted a pair of speakers tall than me


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> The Maggies, you can find them on craigslist and estate sales for that type of speaker. I saw a craigslist ad about 7-8 months ago on a pair for $200 and i called them, but they were gone. That was the time i wanted a pair of speakers tall than me


 

 Ah, I hope I wasn't misleading placing the maggies in the same sentence as the Martin Logan CLS II's since they are not electrostatics but magnetic planars.  I 'm not too keen on buying Magnapans used myself.  They can be abused more than some speakers might be and so I'd always go for them new.  I've had maggies where I've driven the panels to arc and spark causing pinholes in the mylar.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Ah, I hope I wasn't misleading placing the maggies in the same sentence as the Martin Logan CLS II's since they are not electrostatics but magnetic planars.  I 'm not too keen on buying Magnapans used myself.  They can be abused more than some speakers might be and so I'd always go for them new.  I've had maggies where I've driven the panels to arc and spark causing pinholes in the mylar.


 

 Ya, they are pretty fragile and thats why one of the panels usually have to be replaced.


----------



## Skylab

Just to be clear, Maggies are planar magnetic, and not electrostatic, and as such, the panels cannot and do not arc.  That is a problem exclusively for electostats.  Maggies are actually remarkably tough speakers.  With electrostats, however, you can arc them, and cause small holes in the diaphragm, which clearly isn't good.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Just to be clear, Maggies are planar magnetic, and not electrostatic, and as such, the panels cannot and do not arc.  That is a problem exclusively for electostats.  Maggies are actually remarkably tough speakers.  With electrostats, however, you can arc them, and cause small holes in the diaphragm, which clearly isn't good.


 

 Sorry rob I was thinking about the tweeter ribbons in the maggies of which I have melted my share. Usually by running the volume way too high and not using the correct fuse for the tweeter (trying to cheat death).   I have seen problems such as holes occur in the maggies mylar and what appears to be some sort of sparking or maybe more to the point sparking snapping sounds when driven way with high current amps at very high volumes.    Never did see my CLS II's spark though.


----------



## Skylab

Yeah, that can be a big problem, melting the wires on the ribbon by juicing them and not having a low enough fuse value.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Yeah, that can be a big problem, melting the wires on the ribbon by juicing them and not having a low enough fuse value.


 


  Guilty as charged!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Yeah, that can be a big problem, melting the wires on the ribbon by juicing them and not having a low enough fuse value.


 

 Wow, that seems pretty serious. Ill be sure not to do that!


----------



## ccklone

Hey Now,

I have a pair of KEF Reference 103.2's that are just superb. I have used them daily since the early 80's. I believe they started production in 1979. Do they qualify as vintage? I am on the verge of snagging a pair of KEF Reference 101's to use as my near field computer monitors. I guess I love that KEF sound signature. 

--
Finest kind,
Chris


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





ccklone said:


> Hey Now,
> I have a pair of KEF Reference 103.2's that are just superb. I have used them daily since the early 80's. I believe they started production in 1979. Do they qualify as vintage? I am on the verge of snagging a pair of KEF Reference 101's to use as my near field computer monitors. I guess I love that KEF sound signature.
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yup, those qualify. What are you running them with?


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Wow, that seems pretty serious. Ill be sure not to do that!


 


  Well you don't start out to do it....
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








    


   
  i think I did it a lot with the Maggies because although I love their sound I guess I was always trying to get more dynamic slam out of them so I would at time turn up the volume more and more until..
   
  I  went through a lot of ribbon tweeters on my maggeis for sure. i've had the large maggies one per side and the four 
   
  I had two kinds of maggies in the 80's  the MG 3's which are two panels, one right speaker and one left speaker like you see today and the Tympani I's.

 You have to see the tympani I's to believe them. Here is a link or two.
  http://www.msshifi.com/crazy-super-insane-sales/speakers/floorstanders/magnepan-tympani-1-speakers-not-working.html
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Magnepan-Tympani-1-speakers-not-working-/350500025365#ht_1404wt_1398


----------



## treal512

I guess I should work my way in here since I'm needing some speakers in the near future and my dad won't give me his La Scala IIs


----------



## sterling1

I think it was sometime in the summer of 1974, I was at a backyard party. The guy throwing the party had a pair of JBL L100's on his terrace. As I recall, he had em hooked up to a Marantz 2270 Receiver inputting  a Dual 1219 Record Changer. I really can't recall what LP's were spinning that night; but, I do remember, as I listened to the music, I said wow. I'm still  wowed by those speakers.   I think JBL L100's are just awesome.
   
   I could  not afford to buy JBL L100's at that time; but, later, I got a pair of  L100t3's,  which I'm not sure sound quite like the original L100's, although I'm not complaining. My L100t3's are paired with L20t3's, a JBL Cinema Center, and a JBL B380 passive sub-woofer, for a really spectacular HT system. Piano, cello, guitar, and vocal solos are too real on this system. Last night I played Yo-Yo-Ma's--Bach: Cello Suites, from computer to the JBL 100t3's;. and, it really wowed me too.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Well you don't start out to do it....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Wow, replacing panels is a few hundred dollars too now adays. Those are some odd looking speakers, they fold up and are 6 feet across by the looks of it...
  
  Quote: 





sterling1 said:


> I think it was sometime in the summer of 1974, I was at a backyard party. The guy throwing the party had a pair of JBL L100's on his terrace. As I recall, he had em hooked up to a Marantz 2270 Receiver inputting  a Dual 1219 Record Changer. I really can't recall what LP's were spinning that night; but, I do remember, as I listened to the music, I said wow. I'm still  wowed by those speakers.   I think JBL L100's are just awesome.
> 
> I could  not afford to buy JBL L100's at that time; but, later, I got a pair of  L100t3's,  which I'm not sure sound quite like the original L100's, although I'm not complaining. My L100t3's are paired with L20t3's, a JBL Cinema Center, and a JBL B380 passive sub-woofer, for a really spectacular HT system. Piano, cello, guitar, and vocal solos are too real on this system. Last night I played Yo-Yo-Ma's--Bach: Cello Suites, from computer to the JBL 100t3's;. and, it really wowed me too.


 

 I had the same setup, not really a Marantz guy, got my L100's for $100. You'll find a pair, just gotta give it some time.


----------



## sterling1

I'm real happy with my L100t3's. Supported by a B380 sub, a Cinema Center, and L20t3's used as surrounds, I've got an awesome sound from my HT. My neighbor has original L100a's though and there is something about those that still appeal to me.


----------



## saujamhamm

i have two sets of vintage speakers:
   
  the [original] large advent [which i love...] and a MK sat and sub combo - the original satellite-1 with the volkswoofer
   
  the advent is a classic, does any and everything i ask of it from home theater to guitar to vocals etc, and the MKs are such a surprise every time i listen to them, they both image and stage very well - those are mainly for music


----------



## ccklone

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Yup, those qualify. What are you running them with?


 

 Hey Now,
   
  The KEFs are juiced by a Hafler DH-220 and a Bottlehead Quickie pre-amp. I primarily use a Rega Planar 2 w/Grace 707 tonearm and AT-M440MLa cartridge via my Margules Magenta FZ47 phono stage or a Harman Kardon HD990 CD player/DAC with ALAC files. Mostly vinyl lately. I bought the speakers new and used it with an NAD7120 integrated for many, many years. Since upping the juice with the Hafler it has scaled up quite nice I must say 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  --
  Finest kind,
  Chris


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





ccklone said:


> Hey Now,
> 
> The KEFs are juiced by a Hafler DH-220 and a Bottlehead Quickie pre-amp. I primarily use a Rega Planar 2 w/Grace 707 tonearm and AT-M440MLa cartridge via my Margules Magenta FZ47 phono stage or a Harman Kardon HD990 CD player/DAC with ALAC files. Mostly vinyl lately. I bought the speakers new and used it with an NAD7120 integrated for many, many years. Since upping the juice with the Hafler it has scaled up quite nice I must say
> 
> ...


 

 Very cool, im finally diving into right now as i got a great deal on a ADC 1600DD turntable with a Stanton EEE cartridge. FMI what does the phono stage perfect?


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Very cool, im finally diving into right now as i got a great deal on a ADC 1600DD turntable with a Stanton EEE cartridge. FMI what does the phono stage perfect?


 


  First thing you might want to do is get a better mat and dampen the plinth.  It has a decent arm and motor but the entire body is plastic and will resonate easily.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Iv'e got a large pair of Advents in my garage that need the woofers to be re-foamed but now I'm no longer interested...    Maybe if I buy the kit I'll get interested in doing it again...


----------



## MorbidToaster

Figured I should check in here. 
   
  I've got a set of JBL 4301Bs in my living room. They're used exclusively for the TV right now but I'll be revamping my speakers system over the next year or so along with wrapping up my headphone one. 
   
  I need quite a few things to get it rolling though. I've got my CD player now, but I recently received a Pioneer PL518 TT that needs a new cartridge. I also need to rebuild and re-cap my Marantz 2238.
   
  Hopefully in around 6 months I'll be looking at something like this...
   
  Marantz SA8004 / iMac > W4S DAC 2 / PL518 > Marantz 2238 > JBL 4301B
   
  And then I'll probably replace the JBLs...


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





mythless said:


> First thing you might want to do is get a better mat and dampen the plinth.  It has a decent arm and motor but the entire body is plastic and will resonate easily.


 

 Thank you and ill look into these. FMI, have you looked at this turntable? I know it can resonate, but the body is solid, stated by some...


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Thank you and ill look into these. FMI, have you looked at this turntable? I know it can resonate, buy the body is solid, stated by some...


 


  I have and removed the tonearm for project use.  I still have the dustcover lying around here and I kept the feet as they seem to be half decent, the rest has been recycled.  I think I have the platter somewhere too but I found it to be quite light in comparison to other turntables of that same era.  The tonearm is the only positive quality of that table, imo, it's still not a bad starter table but no where near the quality of my other tables. 
   
  The plinth may look the part but it's hollow inside.  Which is why I suggest you get a better platter mat and dampen the plinth.  A good quality rubber mat and some clay or putty and you're good to go.


----------



## BmWr75

*SOLD on November 23, 2011*
   
  Head-Fi doesn't have a vintage speaker section in the For Sale forum.  So, I'll make you aware of these in this thread.  If this is not allowed, mods please delete the post.
   
   
[size=1.2em] FS: JBL L40 speakers[/size]  $100, local pickup preferred in western PA area. Will ship if you pay the UPS packing/shipping fee, which could run in the neighborhood of $100 (a guesstimate based on past experience).

 Specifications are listed in the attached PDF file.

 I'd rate these 8.5 out 10 on cosmetics and 10 out of 10 on functionality. One grill cloth has a very small snag. There are a couple of small nicks in the veneer. The marks on the black baffles will come off. I had just finished waxing them when the pictures were taken.

 The drivers are all original, woofers refoamed by me. They sound great.


----------



## Meewoo

Wow, some one got really good deal on JBL L-40. If I don't have too many speakers, I will jump on the deal at first glance.
   
  Anyway, I have Pioneer HPM 60 recently picked up. I think only difference between hpm 60 and 100 is woofer size. Or maybe the wood veneer?


----------



## Skylab

Right, the HPM-60 is a smaller cabinet that is vinyl veneer, and not wood, and a smaller woofer.  Otherwise the same.  I have a pair of HPM-60's as well, and they are very nice.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Wow, some one got really good deal on JBL L-40. If I don't have too many speakers, I will jump on the deal at first glance.
> 
> Anyway, I have Pioneer HPM 60 recently picked up. I think only difference between hpm 60 and 100 is woofer size. Or maybe the wood veneer?


 
  Recent grad from Ohio State bought them.  He's going to have a nice first system.  Saw a Micro Seiki TT in his trunk with a nice tonearm......said he picked it up for $40.  Will be using a Luxman integrated amp.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Right, the HPM-60 is a smaller cabinet that is vinyl veneer, and not wood, and a smaller woofer.  Otherwise the same.  I have a pair of HPM-60's as well, and they are very nice.


 

 How do you compare 60 and 100? Do you happen to have JBL L-100 also, I am very curious about HPM-100 and L-100, I learned pioneer stole the designer from JBL to develope HPM-100.
   

  
  Quote: 





bmwr75 said:


> Recent grad from Ohio State bought them.  He's going to have a nice first system.  Saw a Micro Seiki TT in his trunk with a nice tonearm......said he picked it up for $40.  Will be using a Luxman integrated amp.


 
  This guy has nice taste! He posted on AK that you even gave him speaker stands. What a holiday gifts!!


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> This guy has nice taste! He posted on AK that you even gave him speaker stands. What a holiday gifts!!


 

 Passing on the good karma.


----------



## Skylab

The biggest difference between the HPM-100 and the 60 is the 100 has both more bass weight and deeper bass.  Other than that they are quite similar, but for me the extra bass matters a lot.  I prefer the 100, but both are very good.  I have not heard the JBL.


----------



## Jacques

I do have a pair of Rogers Export Monitors, circa 1976. I haven't use them for a long time but they still have a sentimental value. I used to drive them with a Quad 33/303 combo.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





skylab said:


> The biggest difference between the HPM-100 and the 60 is the 100 has both more bass weight and deeper bass.  Other than that they are quite similar, but for me the extra bass matters a lot.  I prefer the 100, but both are very good.  I have not heard the JBL.


 

 Skylab, thanks for your input!!
  I didn't listen much bass heavy stuff, but I felt the bass is just a little light. But I really like the mid and clear high of those speakers. They are totally different from CS99 and CS88A I heard before. The CS99 and CS88a have muffled sound to me(I listened some 70's Sansui speakers too, and they are all muffled.), may recapping open up the sound. The HPM-60 is truly good!!


----------



## ccklone

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Very cool, im finally diving into right now as i got a great deal on a ADC 1600DD turntable with a Stanton EEE cartridge. FMI what does the phono stage perfect?


 


  Hey Now,
   
  I don't have a phono-stage (pre-amp) in the Quickie so I needed an outboard phono-stage. Most vintage receivers/amps have a phono stage (pre-amp) built in. The Margules Magenta name is not very known in the States, it is a Mexican audio company. They have been around for three generations dating back to 1926. The FZ47 pre-amp/phono-stage is a pretty good little unit. It has it's own separate power supply. Nice treble and bass is full. Decent for a budget phono pre-amp.
   
  I just snagged a pair of Polk Audio SDA CRS+ (Stereo Dimensional Array Compact Reference System) speakers with stands. I think they were made from the mid-to late 80's. They didn't come with the important inter-connect cable, I called Polk and they still sell them. A bit pricey, but it was delivered to me in 3 days! WHOO-HOO talk about soundstage and 3 dimensionality. SDA is a concept that Matthew Polk came up with that is quite interesting. Here is a quick definition of these types of speakers:
   
_. . . . . Later Polk speaker models used arrays of drivers, called SDA for Stereo Dimensional Array, to modify the crosstalk from the left speaker to the right ear and from the right speaker to the left ear, so as to expand the stereo image beyond the space between two stereo speakers. The SDA concept is still used in some current Polk branded speaker products. . . . . . _
   
  With some recordings it doesn't do much, but on many the soundstage is incredible. Some Pink Floyd has imaging beyond my listening room way to the left and right of the speakers and deep staging. The instruments often felt a bit congested at times through the KEFs when compared to the SDA CRS+s. I don't have a large listening area, 14'x22', but I think I am going to try and find a pair of the floor standing models. Enjoying these speakers quite a bit right now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  --
  Finest kind,
  Chris


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





ccklone said:


> Hey Now,
> 
> I don't have a phono-stage (pre-amp) in the Quickie so I needed an outboard phono-stage. Most vintage receivers/amps have a phono stage (pre-amp) built in. The Margules Magenta name is not very known in the States, it is a Mexican audio company. They have been around for three generations dating back to 1926. The FZ47 pre-amp/phono-stage is a pretty good little unit. It has it's own separate power supply. Nice treble and bass is full. Decent for a budget phono pre-amp.
> 
> ...


 

 Congrats, i just confirmed with a vintage Head-Fier (
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) that my SX-1250 was built in an age of great phono stages. So thats one less thing i have to think about.


----------



## Questhate

Hey guys,
   
  This is probably not the best place to post this, but seeing that this thread has a steady flow of traffic, maybe someone will know the answer to my question.
   
  Someone local to me is selling a pair of Magnepan MMG speakers for $300. He told me that they were five-years old, and in good working order. For 50% off the retail price, I figured this is a good deal.
   
  Since I don't know anything about speakers, I was wondering what the typical lifespan of them are -- especially regarding Magnepan. Are there any typical things to look out for with a 5-year-old speaker, or would it be generally a good bet that these will be fine? 
   
  Thank you in advance!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





questhate said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> This is probably not the best place to post this, but seeing that this thread has a steady flow of traffic, maybe someone will know the answer to my question.
> 
> ...


 

 This thread fits yor question in just perfectly. Magnepan speakers you have to be very careful with, if the owner says they are good than hopefully he's not lying to you. The best way to obviously check that is to listen to them, but also take the grills off and make sure the panel speaker is looking fine and isnt broken. $300 is a good deal on them, only if they are in good working condition, otherwise $20-$50 since its about $200-300 to fix them. Also 5 years old, is conservatively not very old.


----------



## Questhate

Awesome. Thanks for the response. 
   
  My apartment is a bit small for Magnepans, but since these seem like a good deal, I'll take a chance on them. 
   
  Thanks again.


----------



## mythless

Most modern made Maggies are generally trouble free, it's the older ones that you have to be careful and suffer from delamination of the wires.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





questhate said:


> Awesome. Thanks for the response.
> 
> My apartment is a bit small for Magnepans, but since these seem like a good deal, I'll take a chance on them.
> 
> Thanks again.


 

 Did you get them? And your in Michigan, aren't you?!


----------



## Jacques

Quote: 





questhate said:


> Awesome. Thanks for the response.
> 
> My apartment is a bit small for Magnepans, but since these seem like a good deal, I'll take a chance on them.
> 
> Thanks again.


 


  The MMG still should sound good even in smallish room. They scale very well and if they are well kept, they will be good for years. My 1.6QR are 12 years old and still are going strong. Best of all is that Magnepan services even their older models from the 70's.


----------



## Questhate

Quote: 





cifani090 said:


> Did you get them? And your in Michigan, aren't you?!


 

  
  Oh, unfortunately, I did not end up getting them -- but that was due to scheduling conflict. The seller posted them on craigslist the day before he was leaving for a 2-month trip to Cairo and I didn't want to cancel my plans just to see the speakers. Ahh, well. It wasn't meant to be. I'm going to keep an eye out for another set nearby (in California, btw).


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





questhate said:


> Oh, unfortunately, I did not end up getting them -- but that was due to scheduling conflict. The seller posted them on craigslist the day before he was leaving for a 2-month trip to Cairo and I didn't want to cancel my plans just to see the speakers. Ahh, well. It wasn't meant to be. I'm going to keep an eye out for another set nearby (in California, btw).


 

 I understand, there was a pair on my craigslist (Michigan) for $300 as well.


----------



## melomaniac

Quote:


questhate said:


> Oh, unfortunately, I did not end up getting them -- but that was due to scheduling conflict. The seller posted them on craigslist the day before he was leaving for a 2-month trip to Cairo and I didn't want to cancel my plans just to see the speakers. Ahh, well. It wasn't meant to be. I'm going to keep an eye out for another set nearby (in California, btw).


 
   
  although you are allegedly hating the quest, how about a JBL Paragon cabinet? very high WAF: see it here


----------



## jc9394

I have a Marantz 2265B and looking for a pair of nice bookshelf/monitor to match it.  I don't want to spend over $500, what do you guys recommend?


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jc9394 said:


> I have a Marantz 2265B and looking for a pair of nice bookshelf/monitor to match it.  I don't want to spend over $500, what do you guys recommend?


 

 Where are you located?


----------



## jc9394

Boston


----------



## Skylab

I haven't really checked out vintage bookshelf speakers.  Small bookshelf speakers really didn't exist much back in the day - as it was not really possible back then to get much bass from them, and there really weren't subwoofers.
   
  That said I would love to have a pair of vintage Rogers LS-3/5A's, which are small bookshelf speakers, and sound great with no sub, but they go for $1,500-2,500/pair.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





jc9394 said:


> Boston


 

 Maybe look at studio monitors as they are very neutral but in your size. Adam, Genelec, etc all make speakers as such. Also look into vintage B&W for vintage bookshelf as they did make some good stuff!


----------



## Skylab

Good point about some vintage B&Ws - that could be a great way to go.


----------



## Meewoo

Check this http://boston.craigslist.org/sob/ele/2758751027.html
  Klipsch KG4 for $100
   
  and this http://providence.craigslist.org/ele/2723583812.html
  B&W DM602 for $199.


----------



## BmWr75

Passive woofer domes on the KG4s are easily fixed with a vacuum cleaner hose judiciously applied to pull them back out.  Killer price!!!


----------



## jc9394

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Check this http://boston.craigslist.org/sob/ele/2758751027.html
> Klipsch KG4 for $100
> 
> and this http://providence.craigslist.org/ele/2723583812.html
> B&W DM602 for $199.


 

 Thanks, I'm actually getting in touch with the B&W owners.  Too bad the location is over two hours from where I'm now and wonder it he can meet me in between.


----------



## jc9394

How are these two?  I know they don't consider vintage...
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/586185/fs-unisound-au265-speakers
http://www.head-fi.org/t/584919/fs-swans-m1s-speakers-in-piano-black


----------



## Lavcat

For a vintage bookshelf consider AR 3a's.


----------



## treal512

Over the week, I was able to get my mom to part with my grandfather's speakers he built (he assembled the cabinets with the speakers) in the early 60s. After a little searching and reading, it seems the Electro-Voice SP12B is a well thought of speaker for its time. I don't intend to alter the original build too much, but I would like to improve the sound.
   
  Since I don't know much when it comes to speakers, any input is welcome. It looks like the cabinet has room to grow in the top (horn?) and in the middle/side (tweeters?). I just don't know if that would be good or necessary in my current environment. These speakers will be used in a small living room (11.5x13) with wooden floors, a high ceiling, and powered via Marantz 2275. So far, the only mod I have in store is a Vibrapod (http://www.vibrapod.com/) of sorts for the base.


----------



## Skylab

As you probably have seen from your internet research, the SP12b is a well regarded "full range"driver.  It doesn't have a lot of very top end treble, or super deep bass, but should produce a pretty pleasant sound overall.  If you wanted to add a super tweeter you could, but you would have to fuss with some sort of high pass filter for it and cross it over very high, maybe at like 8-10K or something.
   
  How do they sound now?


----------



## treal512

Another person suggested I add a super tweeter too. How difficult would it be to add a high pass filter and crossover?
   
  The sound, as is, is good (but I also don't have any loudspeakers to reference it too). Right off the bat, I did notice the top end being slightly smoothed over. Also, the shy sub bass was taking away from the sound's authority and presence (realism?), but I was able to remedy that by using the loudness bump on the 2275. After adjusting a few more knobs, the sound is really there. It sounds good now. On a few tracks, I've found the sub bass to lack the proper oomph of a bass guitar, but overall, the speakers haven't disappointed


----------



## Lavcat

In the early 1960's I built an enclosure (singular, as in mono) using a 12 inch Electro Voice driver and an Electro Voice horn tweeter.  Can't recall the model numbers.  Thought it sounded pretty good at the time, but then I didn't know much better.  Powered it with a Scott Kit amplifier.


----------



## Skylab

So my NOS Infinity Kappa 6's arrived. They were for sure NOS - absolutely look unused and in original packaging.  Hard to imagine, really...I guess just discovered sitting in some warehouse...and the seller had 5 pairs! I was a little worried at first, but I am glad I took the chance.
   
  They sound GREAT.  I am really impressed.  The Kappa was Arnie Nudell's last great speaker line at Infinity...and these things are terrific...amazing for the $560 I paid INCLUDING shipping of the 90 pound box...


----------



## Meewoo

The Kappa look great and new to me!!! Congrats
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




!
   
  How do you compare Kappa to HPM-100?


----------



## Skylab

Thanks Meewoo 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  They certainly sound different! I like them both quite a bit.  The Kappa 6 definitely is a little more refined.  That EMIT tweeter is something special.  But the HPM-100 has a very robust sound I really enjoy.  I will keep the HPM-100 in my main vintage rig upstairs, and the Kappas will live in my basement system.  I am lucky to have a couple of places to put stereos


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Thanks Meewoo
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 You have quite the leniency to have several systems... Lucky you.


----------



## WarriorAnt

The Kappas bring back memories for me.  I had two different pairs of the Kappa 9's   I bi amped them with two Krell 80 stereo amps  that I eventually turned into  Krell 160 mono blocks.
   
  I only had them for about 6 months because one of the drivers failed on the first set and by the time I realized it Infinity had already put out a "B" revision of the Kappa 9's and so they sent me the "B" revision pair instead.   They were very dynamic speakers and excellent for Jazz but I was more fond of planars so I sold them for the top of the line Maggies at the time which I then proceeded to burn out the tweeters at least once a month.  
   
  The Kappas had this control on the back of the speakers  (none of these photo are my own)   I didn't really like messing with all the controls another reason I traded them in.


----------



## Skylab

Wow, those are beauties, WA. I understand why you didn't keep them, the 9's were a beast!  Sounded great I am sure but dipped to like 1 ohm, so I have read.  The little brother Kappa 6 are much easier to deal with


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Wow, those are beauties, WA. I understand why you didn't keep them, the 9's were a beast!  Sounded great I am sure but dipped to like 1 ohm, so I have read.  The little brother Kappa 6 are much easier to deal with


 
   
  Those were my bachelor days.   I lived by myself and rented a house just for listening so space wasn't a problem.  I had a bed, a table to eat at, a couch and one system or another.  The 1 ohm dip wasn't a problem for the Krells.  I actually had my heart set on the Infinity RS 1 B's at the time but then Magnepan, The Wilson Tiny Tots & Pupps, and Martin Logan came into the picture.  For a while the Infinity RS 1B's were all the rage in the audio world.  To me those were the best days in audio.  It was still a time were a working man could get a really good system before the price of everything went into the 6 figure stratosphere.   The same thing is happening to headphones and headphone amps now.


----------



## treal512

So I joined the club and purchased a set of HPM-100s last week. Finally found some acceptable stands for them too.
   

   
  Right now they're being powered by a Marantz 2275. The HK730 and SX650 shown here need a bath before they can play


----------



## trog

Got these babies for almost nothing last weeks of 2011 wee~ Now serving as TV/HTPC speakers in one of the rooms in my place hehe Those monstrous 12" woofers really rock the house!


----------



## ccklone

Hey Now,
   
  I have an opportunity to get a vintage Wharfedale W70D speakers for $125, anyone know anything them? Thanks.
   
  --
  Finest kind,
  Chris


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





treal512 said:


> So I joined the club and purchased a set of HPM-100s last week. Finally found some acceptable stands for them too.
> 
> 
> Right now they're being powered by a Marantz 2275. The HK730 and SX650 shown here need a bath before they can play


 

 Looks great, Treal!


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





ccklone said:


> Hey Now,
> 
> I have an opportunity to get a vintage Wharfedale W70D speakers for $125, anyone know anything them? Thanks.
> 
> ...


 

 Id grab them, hopefully the cabnits are in good condition. $400-1000 resale


----------



## Wil

Instead of showing you a photo of my system, here's a recording of it playing vinyl (Albiet a very shaky one)
   
  Goodmans Axiom 201 in bass reflex cabs
  Almarro 318B
  Technics 1210MK5G + Nagaoka MP150
  Jolida JD9
   
  I was running a pair of Fostex 206Es in ML TL cabs and while they sound slightly faster (read: Clinical), these Axioms are the bomb man...vocals are surreal.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





ccklone said:


> Hey Now,
> 
> I have an opportunity to get a vintage Wharfedale W70D speakers for $125, anyone know anything them? Thanks.
> 
> ...


 

 If all the drivers are working and original then that is a great price.  I have a set of the W90s and they have a lovely midrange.  More of a Classical, Jazz, Opera type of speaker.  But, some love them, some hate them.  I enjoy the W90s, full and soft sounding!  Excellent napping speakers and they do look lovely!  I over kill mine with my Pioneer receiver, need to get my tube receiver recapped one of these days...
   
  There is potential resale, but it's for a particular buyer.  So, location pending you can ask for quite of bit of coin.


----------



## cifani090

Quote: 





wil said:


> Instead of showing you a photo of my system, here's a recording of it playing vinyl (Albiet a very shaky one)
> 
> Goodmans Axiom 201 in bass reflex cabs
> Almarro 318B
> ...


 

 Wow! Very nice... i like the speakers, and you should just turn the lights off and sleep with them tubes that beautiful. Do you have alot of vinyl?


----------



## Wil

Cifani, i used to buy vinyl on a regular basis but i have been cutting down on costs..
   
  I probably have a 150++ with most of them being Jazz..
   
  The tubes run extremely hot! Seeing that i live in the tropics i don't think i would want to run them all night....haha.


----------



## Wil

Some actual photos of the my setup.


----------



## treal512

Very nice. What kind of stands are those?


----------



## Wil

I got them off a local forum for 20 bucks....no idea what stands they are!
   
  The previous owner used it for vintage Tannoys apparently.


----------



## mythless

Very nice setup!


----------



## wotts

Hello all! I have been on the hunt for a nice pair of vintage speakers since I picked up my 2265b. I was pointed over here from the vintage receiver thread. I read through, found what people were really digging, and got to looking. I found a pair of Pioneer HPM-100s on my local craigslist, and I'll be picking them up this weekend or next. Can't wait! Thanks for all the input everyone!
   
  Here's a picture from the ad:


----------



## Zetsumei

I personally got a pair of these

 Quad ESL 57's Mine are from somewhere around the early 70ies I believe.


----------



## wotts

I've seen picutres of those around. Are they electrostatic?


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





wotts said:


> Hello all! I have been on the hunt for a nice pair of vintage speakers since I picked up my 2265b. I was pointed over here from the vintage receiver thread. I read through, found what people were really digging, and got to looking. I found a pair of Pioneer HPM-100s on my local craigslist, and I'll be picking them up this weekend or next. Can't wait! Thanks for all the input everyone!


 


  Cool! Let us know what you think.


----------



## wotts

Definitely will. I got a line on an SX-1250 too. I might have a pretty nice combo then. Not the Marantz is anything to shake a stick at.

  
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Cool! Let us know what you think.


----------



## wotts

BIG!! HEAVY!!
   



   
   
  I'm headed to Lowe's this afternoon to buy a 2x12. I plan to build a box for these to sit on. I'll get some more pictures posted when I get the speakers settled in.


----------



## Skylab

Big and heavy they are! But really awesome


----------



## BadassBob

My coaxial EV 12TRXBs the day I brought them home.  I searched for cabinets for a good month.

   
  Now I have them in 6cu ft Barzilay cabinets, powered by a 6B4G SET with a benchmark DAC1 as the source.  SET + high efficiency coaxial point source driver = heaven


----------



## claybum

A pair of HMP 1500 are up on CL in  my area. Damn, I'd have to sell some stuff if I wanted to pick these up. Not sure how much these usually go for.
   
  http://eugene.craigslist.org/ele/2845745299.html


----------



## claybum

Quote: 





badassbob said:


> My coaxial EV 12TRXBs the day I brought them home.  I searched for cabinets for a good month.
> 
> 
> Now I have them in 6cu ft Barzilay cabinets, powered by a 6B4G SET with a benchmark DAC1 as the source.  SET + high efficiency coaxial point source driver = heaven


 


  Those cabinets look great!!!!


----------



## Skylab

Badassbob, those look...well...badass! Very nice!
   
  Claybum, the HPM-1500 are supposed to be absolutely AMAZING.  They typically go for at least $1,500, and sometimes more, depending of course on the condition.  That seems like a hell of a good deal to me at $750.


----------



## claybum

Thanks Skylab, I might have to give it a go.


----------



## BadassBob

Heres the amp I use to drive my Electro Voices.  Its a 6B4G SE with a 6SL7 driver, and a 6AX5 rectifier.  The 6B4G is essentially a 6.3V 2A3 in an octal socket, they sound very close.  I built this one a couple years ago, and its been my main amp since.  Usually, I rotate amps a couple of times a year, but this is a definite keeper.


----------



## BmWr75

These are not vintage, but I picked them up today.  Heavy bastards, 70 lb. each.
   
  Tyler Acoustics PD10s (file picture)


----------



## Skylab

Wow...very cool, Scott. How do you like them?


----------



## BmWr75

Haven't had a chance to give them a serious listen yet.  Hooked them up to a Pilot SP-210 pre and SA-232 amp to make sure all the drivers were in good working order.  They are 97 dB efficient, so not many watts required to drive them.  Got a 5.5 watt single ended ultra-linear amp with them.  Will give the amp a try with them tomorrow.  Will report back when I get some more time listening.


----------



## wotts

I've gottena  littel listening time in with teh HPM-100s and teh 2265b, and so far I am very impressed. After the first hour, I was left wondering why companies stopped making such great speakers. I recently setup an inexpensive 5.1 system, and I think my vintage rig just blows it away. I think I might have to locate some more of these! When I get my speaker stands built and the audio rack come in, I'll be sure to add some pictures.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Wow...very cool, Scott. How do you like them?


 

 My wife listened to them yesterday........then asked for me to move them into the family room.  That is quite an endorsement.  They sound great being driven by tubes.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





wotts said:


> I've gottena  littel listening time in with teh HPM-100s and teh 2265b, and so far I am very impressed. After the first hour, I was left wondering why companies stopped making such great speakers. I recently setup an inexpensive 5.1 system, and I think my vintage rig just blows it away. I think I might have to locate some more of these! When I get my speaker stands built and the audio rack come in, I'll be sure to add some pictures.


 


  There are tons of companies that make great speakers today.  There are plenty that will sound better than the HPM-100 and majority of vintage speakers.  You just need the extra cash to get them.


----------



## claybum

So the seller of the HPM 1500 (posted above) is bringing them over to my house tomorrow night for an audition and potential sale.
   
  I'm pretty happy about that.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





claybum said:


> So the seller of the HPM 1500 (posted above) is bringing them over to my house tomorrow night for an audition and potential sale.
> 
> I'm pretty happy about that.


 


  Always the best when they come to you!  Those are big speakers so in some ways I am sure the seller is more inclined to sell them to you if he/she is bringing them over.  lol, worst case is he/she will have to put it back in their car and go home.


----------



## wotts

That's how I ended up getting mine. The seller was going by my town and offered to deliver. Saved me three hours driving and I offered $25 for gas.

  
  Quote: 





mythless said:


> Always the best when they come to you!  Those are big speakers so in some ways I am sure the seller is more inclined to sell them to you if he/she is bringing them over.  lol, worst case is he/she will have to put it back in their car and go home.


----------



## claybum

I was wondering how much you tip the speaker delivery guy.
   
  Turns out the speakers are a few hours away. Some gas money might be in order.


----------



## wotts

I figured $25 was what I would have spent on gas if I drove, and he said he was driving past my town anyhow. It worked out well for me that way. But if the speaker delivery guy is traveling pretty far, again I'd offer to pay what I'd have spent myself, or at least half. I hope that doesn't make me sound cheap.


----------



## trog

I am now a full convert of big ole' speakers and after taking a gamble (auditioned 1st though hehe) on the Kenwood LSK-727 with 12" woofers i would go with stuff like these unless room prevents it


----------



## Skylab

Cool! We need pics


----------



## claybum

The HPM 1500's landed last night and I am psyched.
   
  I had a brief listening session last night and I am adjusting to the sound. Very positive so far.
   
  Today I hope to get them up on their stands and figure out positioning. Our living room is not that large and introducing these monsters has upset the feng  shui a bit. My partner is the decorator and organizer so I will be deferring to his needs quite a bit. I was very nervous about his reactions to this purchase but so far he has been very sweet.
   
  Pics and thoughts to come in the next few days.


----------



## Skylab

Awesome!  Can't wait to see the pics.


----------



## wotts

+1
  
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Awesome!  Can't wait to see the pics.


 


   
  The audio rack is coming this week and my dad is building the stands for me (I don't have a table saw). Once its completed I'll add pics of my little setup.


----------



## MrQ

Quote: 





claybum said:


> The HPM 1500's landed last night and I am psyched.
> 
> I had a brief listening session last night and I am adjusting to the sound. Very positive so far.
> 
> ...


----------



## sluker

Recap the HPM-100's *(CHECK)*
 Get stands *(CHECK)*
 Restore the SX-1250 *(CHECK)*
  The vintage Pioneer rig is complete (for now
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## claybum

Good job!!!
   
  That stand for the 1250 is especially cool.


----------



## claybum

@ MrQ   exactly...I definitely don't want to end up in the dog house over audio. It's a fine line. Purchasing vintage speakers for myself on valentines day was a risk for sure.


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





sluker said:


> Recap the HPM-100's *(CHECK)*
> Get stands *(CHECK)*
> Restore the SX-1250 *(CHECK)*
> The vintage Pioneer rig is complete (for now
> ...


 

 NICE!!!!!!  Congrats.  That's awesome stuff there!


----------



## wotts

Man that is a sharp setup. I should have bought the 1250 I saw last week. It went for $350 >_<


----------



## sluker

Thanks
  The stand for the 1250 is only temporary. I think I need a rack or a low bench that can support it's weight, that "cardboard box" from Target will not last plus it blocks the bottom vents.
   
  I also paid $350 for mine, plus another $600 to get it tuned up and (some new caps and new transistors). My repair guy insisted that I only replace the bad caps and transistors and only with the same or exact parts. He is pretty hard core when it comes to restoration philosophy and maintaining the original sound signature. But he also said it's one of the best units he has seen in a long time and his shop is packed with a two month backlog and tons of restored units for sale (including a mint looking G-8000).
   
  Quote: 





wotts said:


> Man that is a sharp setup. I should have bought the 1250 I saw last week. It went for $350 >_<


----------



## treal512

Where is this guy located, sluker?
   
   
  Beautiful setup, btw. Where did you get your stands?


----------



## sluker

The guy is Howard of Audio Specialist in Los Angeles.
http://www.audiospecialist.com/
  He is fairly well known around here and is sort of an institution. The problem is that he has a long waiting list and I do not know if he accepts work from outside LA but it's worth asking.
   
  The stands are $20each IKEA kids benches (I need to look up the Ikea name). These come in unfinished with a red plastic cover. I simply applied a couple of coats of tint to get them darker.
  Quote: 





treal512 said:


> Where is this guy located, sluker?
> 
> 
> Beautiful setup, btw. Where did you get your stands?


----------



## WarriorAnt

Anyone know a good source for high quality speaker posts?   I redoing the post on various speakers I have.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Anyone know a good source for high quality speaker posts?   I redoing the post on various speakers I have.
> 
> Thanks.


 


  Parts Express


----------



## WarriorAnt

Thanks.  I have a large pair of Advents I'm working on restoring.


----------



## Skylab

Better get some Howard's Restore-a-Finish!


----------



## wotts

I thought about replacing the posts on my HPM-100s, but didn't want to be heretical. I just hate the spring-posts. I wanted to put in some nice 5-way, but wasn't sure if I could reuse the mount the current posts are on.


----------



## WarriorAnt

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Better get some Howard's Restore-a-Finish!


 


  Thanks for the tip.  Besides the cabinets I'm re foaming the woofers and if I feel up to it maybe something updated in the crossovers.  
   
  Don't know where I'll use them though.  I just added a pair of Gallo Strada's to my home system.
   
  I got these large Advents at the Goodwill for $24 and couldn't resist.   Damn that Goodwill!  Every once in a blue moon you can find something good there and because of that one gets compelled to visit the place way more than anyone ever should.  Am I right?


----------



## Skylab

I replaced the posts when I re-capped the crossovers in my HPM-100's.  WAY better to have nice 5-way binding posts.


----------



## wotts

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Thanks for the tip.  Besides the cabinets I'm re foaming the woofers and if I feel up to it maybe something updated in the crossovers.
> 
> Don't know where I'll use them though.  I just added a pair of Gallo Strada's to my home system.
> 
> I got these large Advents at the Goodwill for $24 and couldn't resist.   Damn that Goodwill!  Every once in a blue moon you can find something good there and because of that one gets compelled to visit the place way more than anyone ever should.  Am I right?


 

 About three weeks ago I spent a few hours digging through the LPs at one of the Goodwill shops here in town. The electronics were just _hit_, but there was a decent pair of speakers. Pioneer CS-something. Not the 99s. I plan to go hit some of them again this weekend.
  
   


  Quote: 





skylab said:


> I replaced the posts when I re-capped the crossovers in my HPM-100's.  WAY better to have nice 5-way binding posts.


 

 I'm going to have a look back in the thread. I recall you doing that now. I'll make sure to take pictures all through the process. Do you happen to have the parts list for the re-cap?


----------



## Skylab

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120454
   
  Pretty much step by step instructions.


----------



## wotts

Awesome. Thanks!


----------



## claybum

Here are some pics of my HPM 1500 I purchased a couple weeks ago.
   

   

   

   

   
  These speakers sound fantastic. I am very happy with my purchase, However, I don't understand these super tweeters. I don't hear any sound from them when I put my ear real close. I asked the seller what was up with that and he replied the super tweeters were for subtle accents to the high frequencies. I thought he might be feeding me a line but I purchased the speakers anyway based on price and how great they sounded. When I have the time I will take them into the local stereo repair guy and have him take a look. At this point, I am not too motivated to haul them around. I'm having too much fun listening.
   
  The mids and highs on these speakers are super fine. I come from a collection of dark headphones(hd 650, lcd 2, dx1000) so it is nice to fall in love with the higher frequencies. Bass just seems right and can go deep. I really have no reference point as these are the best speakers I have owned. If I have to sink some money into them at some point, I won't mind.
   
  Alrighty..........time to que up some pink floyd!!


----------



## Skylab

Claybum, those look awesome!  Very nice. 
   
  Regarding the supertweeter, I am sure they're working.  There are quite a few threads about HPM supertweeters on AudioKarma if you want to feel better about it.  The supertweeter ONLY covers ultra high frequencies - 12 kHz and above.  If you are trying to hear the supertweeters while the rest of the speaker is playing music, you almost surely won't.  If you have the Stereophile test CD, try playing a 16 kHz tone.  Then see if you hear it.  Of course, the other question is - can YOU hear that high?  Not sure how old you are, but men progressively lose their HF hearing.  I can hear 19 kHz in my right ear, but not my left (I am 45).  I can only hear to about 17 kHz in my left ear.


----------



## claybum

Skylab, I appreciate your info on the super tweeter! You have cleared up my confusion with these tweeters. As a 49 year old, my hearing is pretty shot. I spent my younger years playing drums in several bands. I also used to see about 60 concerts a year. These days I have to be careful what I subject my ears to. Only reasonable listening levels for me. The imaging on the treble is so nice that it was hard to believe there is anything wrong with these speakers. Thanks for the response.


----------



## Magna224

I'm always at goodwill/garage sales/swap meets and such and always see old speakers and subs. I want to pick up a good set but need to know what to look for, are there any brands or specific styles I should keep an eye out for? Thanks!


----------



## publicholiday

Any of yall know how to remove a real tight rusted screw on speaker? I have tried spraying some penetrating oil but it doesn't work.


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





publicholiday said:


> Any of yall know how to remove a real tight rusted screw on speaker? I have tried spraying some penetrating oil but it doesn't work.


 


  Impact driver.


----------



## Meewoo

I sold my HPM-60 early. But I came across Pioneer HPM-900 last weekend

   
  Here is my current stereo setup, my surprising good Design Acoustics PS-10 speakers on the top of HPM-900.


----------



## wotts

^ Those look nice. What all is in the (Sanus?) rack?
   
   
  I might try to pick these up this weekend. They are at an auction:
   

   
  Sansui SP-X8


----------



## Skylab

VERY nice, Meewoo!


----------



## Wil

Tannoy 15" Royal Monitors in Lancaster Cabinets


----------



## trog

after dipping into vintage floor standers : big ole sound ftw


----------



## Skylab

Beautiful Tannoys, Wil! Nice looking system in general.

Trog, I agree


----------



## mac336

anyone know much about the marantz PM 325 amp.  How good would you say it is with its headphone output?


----------



## jbusuego

These was my set up when we were still living is Sacramento.  Now that were living in San Diego and we don't have enough space for dedicated listening area I have decided to trade the ESS Amt 1d speakers for Onkyo this(tuner not in pics). BTW I got the speakers for $50 bucks and I refinished the cabs.


----------



## Skylab

Wow! Nice job on the restoration.


----------



## Rawrbington

Anybody got any experience with Norman Labs or Snell?
  im either gonna pick up  a pair of Norman labs model 82 or Snell JII.
   
  just trying to get some opinions on either.
  they aren't in the same place so i can't A/B them directly and figure they both sound very good and similarly priceSUBMIT


----------



## wotts

Quote: 





rawrbington said:


> Anybody got any experience with Norman Labs or Snell?
> im either gonna pick up  a pair of Norman labs model 82 or Snell JII.
> 
> just trying to get some opinions on either.
> they aren't in the same place so i can't A/B them directly and figure they both sound very good and similarly priceSUBMIT


 

 I loved the Snell JII. I'm 90% sure that was the model. I was house sitting for a older couple and he had a Marantz 2230B running to the the Snells. I know they were from the middle 70's and were maybe a little over 24" tall. It's been a while since I've been out there. That receiver/speaker combo is what started the whole vintage gear chase for me.


----------



## Rawrbington

excellent.
  these are about 2 feet tall, they just a two way with i think a 10" woofer.  and they have a stand which for some reason i think they came with stands back then.  not sure htese are that old though.  i will find out tomorrow.  what makes them more tempting now is that i plan on running them off a 2245.  but in OK its hard to pass up a good working pair of Norman Labs.  we'll see.  probably just go with whichever will give me the lowest price lol


----------



## wotts

Well, if you pass on the snells, please let me know! The ones I was referring to were indeed two-way and had stands. I'll look and see if I have a picture of them.


----------



## Rawrbington

heres a pic of the ones for sale.
  you may have talked me into them.
 

  he wants 200$ for them.
  im hoping i can talk him down to 150 or 160
  thing is i don't have any idea what they are worth


----------



## wotts

Unfortunately, I can't help you on price. I was able to get my HPM-100 for $350 delivered from about 1.5hrs away. But that's not exactly apples to apples. They do look very nice. the stands aren't like what I had seen, but the gent is quite the woodworker, so they might have been of his own creation.


----------



## Rawrbington

I went with Braun ads L700a.
They mids and highs on the ads were just too sweet.
Just got them home and set up. Will report more plus pics later


----------



## manveru

I've found some JBL 4406 Studio Monitors that I can take home for free tonight. I'm not sure how "vintage" they are, but just curious if anyone knows about them or if they're any good?


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





manveru said:


> I've found some JBL 4406 Studio Monitors that I can take home for free tonight. I'm not sure how "vintage" they are, but just curious if anyone knows about them or if they're any good?


 

 Haven't heard them, but they look good. At that price, I would say just grab them and let your ears decide


----------



## manveru

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Haven't heard them, but they look good. At that price, I would say just grab them and let your ears decide


 

 Oh I will regardless. Just curious


----------



## jbusuego

free is good


----------



## Teufelshunde

Purchased JBL L-36s in 1975, along with a JVC JR-S400 receiver and a Dual 1249 turntable.
  Still own these great representatives of the '70s Hi-Fi scene.


----------



## wuwhere

That JVC even has an equalizer type tone control. That Dual can also play 45 but not 78.


----------



## Chromako

ZOMG! So ugly!
   
  By my logic: that must mean that they sound awesome 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





wotts said:


> ^ Those look nice. What all is in the (Sanus?) rack?
> 
> 
> I might try to pick these up this weekend. They are at an auction:
> ...


----------



## lee nottingham

$200 they are well worth that mate. I would love them for that kind of money and even have them shipped over the England. Beautiful sounding speaker with a good valve amp.


----------



## wotts

I think I might pick up some HPM-60s. I found a pair for $60. We'll see if they are taken.


----------



## Skylab

Holy cow that's a GREAT price for HPM-60's!!!


----------



## wotts

I also found some mint CS-99As, but I forget the price...$450 maybe? They are immaculate. If I hadn't have just gotten the W3000ANV, I'd get em.
   
   
  Edit: http://saginaw.craigslist.org/ele/2948799561.html


----------



## trog

Hmm somewhat related:
   
  Suppose u nab those dream vintage floor standers and are just looking for a cheap 2 channel amp to fill a small/medium room: consider T-Amps!
   
  My recently acquired Kenwood LSK-727s @ 92dB with the little TA2020 wonder 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 These run 24/7 efficiently/cool and are barely warm to the touch!

   

   
   
  For beefier T-Amps USA peeps have the option of the Dayton DTA-100A while globally ebay has these with free international ship 
   
   
  TDA7492
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/50Wx2-TDA7492-Class-T-Amp-Tripath-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-Gold-24V-Adapter-/250955775744?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a6e213f00#ht_6189wt_932
   
  TPA3123
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/MUSE-M50-TPA3123-2x50w-T-AMP-MINI-Stereo-Amplifier-S-/250879380212?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a69938af4


----------



## Meewoo

Do you guys think $200 plus 150 miles round trip is a good deal for JBL L-166?  The seller said they were re-foamed recently and everything is excellent, and also include the glass tops.
   
  I don't need speakers now (already too many and no place), I just want to try them.


----------



## calipilot227

Found a pair of Pioneer CL-70s locally on Craigslist. The guy is asking $30 and they appear to be in good condition. Anyone have experience with these? They look like the HPM-60 without the supertweeter.
   
  Here's the ad http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/ele/2982903009.html


----------



## BmWr75

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Do you guys think $200 plus 150 miles round trip is a good deal for JBL L-166?  The seller said they were re-foamed recently and everything is excellent, and also include the glass tops.
> 
> I don't need speakers now (already too many and no place), I just want to try them.


 
  I'd say yes for that price!!


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





bmwr75 said:


> I'd say yes for that price!!


 
  Aha, a little late! Thanks!
  I already informed seller that I won't buy them.  I believe they won't fit me well. I had JBL L-7, but easily got fatigue after one or two hours listen. I sold them due to the forward sound. From impression online, I conclude that L-166 would be brighter than L-7. I think I am a guy of east coast sound.


----------



## trog

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Found a pair of Pioneer CL-70s locally on Craigslist. The guy is asking $30 and they appear to be in good condition. Anyone have experience with these? They look like the HPM-60 without the supertweeter.
> 
> Here's the ad http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/ele/2982903009.html


 
  O_o for $30? I'd grab them in a snap


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





trog said:


> O_o for $30? I'd grab them in a snap


 
   
  And that's exactly what I'll do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I should have them by tomorrow evening


----------



## BrownBear

I'm in. I picked up my Pioneer CS-77's last summer in a thrift store. I love them. I think they sound quite nice and smooth. (Quite similar to my SE-50's from about the same era.)


----------



## wotts

Quote: 





brownbear said:


> I'm in. I picked up my Pioneer CS-77's last summer in a thrift store. I love them. I think they sound quite nice and smooth. (Quite similar to my SE-50's from about the same era.)


 
   




   
  I saw a pair of those on my craigslist a while a back. At the time I was still looking for another set of the HPM-100s. I may have to look into these as well.


----------



## Skylab

Ruh-roh...look what followed me home...























The cabinets were a bit rough looking, but after a full treatment of Howard's Restor-a-finish and Feed'n'Wax, they look very good. Remarkably smooth sound from these big beasts. They weigh about 100 pounds each, massive magnets on the 15.7" woofers, and a true ribbon super tweeter.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Ruh-roh...look what followed me home...


 
   
  You can keep 'em, but you're going to have to be responsible for feeding them and cleaning up after them. If you don't, I'm taking them straight to the pound. Got it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Beautiful, Rob!
   
  Are those really 18's? Look more like 15's to me.
   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Thanks Steve!  Actually you are right, they are closer to 15 - they are 40cm, so about 16".  Man they look bigger than that in person


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Thanks Steve!  Actually you are right, they are closer to 15 - they are 40cm, so about 16".  Man they look bigger than that in person


 
   
  It's because you've been living with those girly-man 12's in your 100's for so long. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Same with the 15's in my 99A's. They just look bigger in person.
   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Indeed they do.

These were listed on Craigslist here for $350. I was really surprised to see them for that low. The issues were that the cabinets needed some real TLC. No massive gouges, but pretty scratched up. I had to carefully use 0000 steel wool in applying the Howard's. But that basically did the trick. The 1100 also have a short "built in" stand/base of about 2", and one of those is in super bad shape. I have ordered some walnut to rebuild those, shouldn't be hard - they're not real visible, either.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Indeed they do.
> These were listed on Craigslist here for $350. I was really surprised to see them for that low. The issues were that the cabinets needed some real TLC. No massive gouges, but pretty scratched up. I had to carefully use 0000 steel wool in applying the Howard's. But that basically did the trick. The 1100 also have a short "built in" stand/base of about 2", and one of those is in super bad shape. I have ordered some walnut to rebuild those, shouldn't be hard - they're not real visible, either.


 
   
  Sweet! Guess they previous owner just didn't want to apply a little elbow grease to pretty them up a bit more and get a higher price. All the better for you.
   
  se


----------



## BrownBear

Wow Skylab, they're awesome looking units. Great find.


----------



## estreeter

Great stuff, Rob - hard to say what you'd pay for speakers of that calibre today. Harbeth and Spendor seem to charging by the freaking *pound* ...... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  (dont know what sort of kickback Stereophile get from Harbeth, but they get a lot of ink for a small manufacturer from England)
   
  For something a little friendlier in terms of real estate, the Spica TC-50 presents an interesting profile:


----------



## Skylab

Nice! That Spica is a very classic design. Cool.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





> The cabinets were a bit rough looking, but after a full treatment of Howard's Restor-a-finish and Feed'n'Wax, they look very good. Remarkably smooth sound from these big beasts. They weigh about 100 pounds each, massive magnets on the 15.7" woofers, and a true ribbon super tweeter.


 
  Wow! Nice looking and A beast!! Congrats!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I think those will rock your house hard! My hpm-900 is very easy to drive and sounds huge.
   
  Did you take picture after TLC? I couldn't see any scratch. How did you handle 100lb speakers? Does each speaker weight more than your B&W? My Cornwall is my heaviest speaker ans really hard to move also due to it's size.
   
  Do you know more info about HPM series? I think 60, 100, 150 is first generation, then 900, 1500 the second. I saw some with super tweeter at the top separately (hpm-9000?) in this thread, are those third generation?


----------



## Skylab

Thanks Meewoo!  Yes, the pictures for sure are after my woodworking 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  HPM-1100 was the same era as the 700 and 900 - the last era of the HPM, from 1980-1982.  More laid back than the HPM-60/100/150.
   
  I had to use a dolly to wheel the 1100's into place.  But no, my B&W's are 275 lbs each!


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





claybum said:


> A pair of HMP 1500 are up on CL in  my area. Damn, I'd have to sell some stuff if I wanted to pick these up. Not sure how much these usually go for.


 
  Skylab,
  Which generation is this one?
   
  Wow, I never though B&W is near 300lb!


----------



## Skylab

I think the 1500 is same generation as 100/150.


----------



## BrownBear

This isn't my picture, but I forgot about this model of Kenwoods I picked up a few months ago. Nothing spectacular, but for what I paid, they're amazing. And I kind of like how they look. They don't look as nice as my CS-77, but something about them (with the covers off) I like.


----------



## Il Mostro

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Great stuff, Rob - hard to say what you'd pay for speakers of that calibre today. Harbeth and Spendor seem to charging by the freaking *pound* ......
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Very nice set up.  TC-50 and Angelus both still have fanatical followings.  And, for good reason -- Spica's are terrific speakers.


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Ruh-roh...*look what followed me home...*





>


 
   
   





 The Bear or the speakers? Kidding, nice pick-up for you!


----------



## Skylab

Thanks! They actually really sound very good, too. No doubt their bass is prodigious, but it's remarkably well controlled. This particular speaker has a good rep, and I'd say it's well deserved.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





il mostro said:


> Very nice set up.  TC-50 and Angelus both still have fanatical followings.  And, for good reason -- Spica's are terrific speakers.


 
   
  I read a very recent interview with John Bau, the designer behind the TC-50, and he seemed fairly pessimistic about the future of 2-channel audio, He was asked if he had any plans to return to speaker design, and said that he lost interest the day audio became nothing more than a tool to sell video. Its not the first time I've heard that sort of sentiment from the 'old guard', but its sad when that sort of engineering talent is lost to the 2-channel community.


----------



## estreeter

I'd like to add that I am really enjoying this thread, and I really wish Jude would consider starting a *sub-forum dedicated entirely to vintage gear* of all types. Granted, it might put a dent in sales for Head-Fi sponsors, but many of them already style their gear along vintage lines anyway. Just a suggestion.


----------



## trog

Quote: 





brownbear said:


> This isn't my picture, but I forgot about this model of Kenwoods I picked up a few months ago. Nothing spectacular, but for what I paid, they're amazing. And I kind of like how they look. They don't look as nice as my CS-77, but something about them (with the covers off) I like.


 
  Wow those look in pretty good shape and gratz on your find


----------



## Meewoo

There is an interview of Infinity co-founder Arnie Nudell at Stereophile June 2012 (VOL. 35 NO.6).
  At the end of article, Mr Nudell said:"Infinity is now a commodity. They're not much of a company anymore. It's a damn shame. We were tops."


----------



## toxaco

Hi everyone,
   
  i found a pair of Pioneer HPM-100s being thrown out a few christmas' ago and i am very impressed by their sound and weight! Are they the little brother of the HPM-1500s i guess?
   
  Also i have some goodmans 201s and would like to know where to have cabinet designs
   
  thanks in advance


----------



## Skylab

Several of us here own HPM-100's. I love mine. They need a little care to get the best out of them, but having done so, a great speaker, especially for rock and jazz.


----------



## toxaco

>They need a little care to get the best out of them<
   
  do you modify the cross-overs, replace capacitors etc?
   
  any info would be great ?
   
  thx


----------



## Skylab

Recapping the crossovers helps a lot, as does setting them on 10-12" stands, and of course, like any speaker, carefully positioning them in the room.  Also, very important to play with the mid and treble pots that they have to get the balance right for the room.


----------



## Rawrbington

Picked up these Forte II's a couple weeks back.  perhaps the best purchase i've made in a LONG  time.  Ranks right up there with my 45$ TS 5998 matched pair.
   
  anyways, they were cheap because the cabinets are rough.  poor things were battered and abused.  Maybe the original owner didn't like horns?
   



   
  not sure exactly what happened to the woofer.  why its discolored like that.  Accoustically I love them.  I just wish the cabs were in better shape.
   
  anybody have any simple easy ideas i could try to clean them up a bit?
  I don't mind putting in some effort but i took enough wood tech in high school to know that woodworking is not a strong suit of mine.
   
  These things have made me a big Paul Klipsch fan. 
  a friend of a friend of mine has a pair of 1977 Klipshorns that he MADE with PWK while working at the plant in Hope.  he says everytime he has company over he covers them with a table cloth and puts random crap on them so people don't set drinks on them.  They are probably the most incredible looking speakers i've ever seen.  And they sound well, great.  But much more intimate than i had expected.  they sound stupid good at moderate to lower listening volumes.  Which surprised me.  Not bad for a speaker designed 65 years ago.
   
   
  but yeah, any ideas or insight on cleaning these cabs would be much appreciated.


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





rawrbington said:


> Picked up these Forte II's a couple weeks back.  perhaps the best purchase i've made in a LONG  time.  Ranks right up there with my 45$ TS 5998 matched pair.
> 
> anyways, they were cheap because the cabinets are rough.  poor things were battered and abused.  Maybe the original owner didn't like horns?
> not sure exactly what happened to the woofer.  why its discolored like that.  Accoustically I love them.  I just wish the cabs were in better shape.
> ...


 
   
  A Klipsch fan here. Congrats on the pick up!


----------



## Skylab

Actually, those look like they will clean up GREAT with the following. Buy some Howard's restore-a-finish. Be sure to get the one that best matches the wood color (I use dark walnut on my Pioneer stuff). They get some 0000 steel wool, and apply the Restor-a-Finish with the steel wool (it must be 0000). Allow to set in, 30 mins at least. Then apply Howard's Feed-n-Wax. And then post pics of the after. You will be amazed, I promise.


----------



## Rawrbington

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Actually, those look like they will clean up GREAT with the following. Buy some Howard's restore-a-finish. Be sure to get the one that best matches the wood color (I use dark walnut on my Pioneer stuff). They get some 0000 steel wool, and apply the Restor-a-Finish with the steel wool (it must be 0000). Allow to set in, 30 mins at least. Then apply Howard's Feed-n-Wax. And then post pics of the after. You will be amazed, I promise.


 
  awesome.  Do i want to kind of scrub the cabs with the steel wool and the restore-a-finish abraisively?  what do you apply the feed-n-wax with?


----------



## Skylab

Quote: 





rawrbington said:


> awesome.  Do i want to kind of scrub the cabs with the steel wool and the restore-a-finish abraisively?  what do you apply the feed-n-wax with?


 
   
  You will see that when you apply a liquid with steel wool, there is only so much you can do.  It will become natural.  The wax goes on with a soft cloth.  There are detailed directions on the back of both products, I suggest to follow them carefully  I have had GREAT results with them, and it's a very common treatment over on AudioKarma (where I learned of it).
   
  Here is a before and after pic of my HPM-1100 that I did this to:
   
  before:
   

   
  After:
   

   
  I know the lighting wasn't the same (the before pics were not mine), but you get the idea anyway.


----------



## Rawrbington

wow.  those results speak volumes.  Those HPM's are incredible looking now.  I'll have to pick up some of the howards this weekend.   The forte's are consecutive serial numbers and the wood veneer is matched.  hopefullly it will bring them back to a presentable form. 
  Thanks again for the tip.
   
   
   
  Did the top of one speaker tonight.  waiting for the wax to dry a little.  then gonna wipe off.
   
  Interestingly enough my car died in the drive thru at a chicken restaraunte immediately after purchasing the Howards products.  Well didn't die just blew a fuse that let the gear shifter know my foot was on the brake.  so my car was immobile for about an hour in the drive thru.  LOL  i went inside, ordered food, called my brother, talked to the manager.  then sat at a window seat and ate my chicken as i watched to see how long it took people to realize they needed to go around my car. 
  got a ride to walmart grabbed a couple fuses, swapped it in got the car out of park and it blew again.  So i def have other issues.  I did find a work around to the break switch park locking mechanism.  it requires a screw driver pushed into a hole i uncovered from around my gear shifter.  
   
  tldr; Life happened tonight.


----------



## Rawrbington

Before:
  Quote: 





rawrbington said:


>


 
  After:

   
  HUGE improvement.  Still need to do some work on the right side corners front and back.  But yeah.  good stuff.  Can't wait to get the rest done.
  Thanks again Skylab!
   
  and the other speaker:


----------



## trog

Wow looks great


----------



## Skylab

NICE! Well done. It really does make a big difference, doesn't it?


----------



## trog

Hmm just a suggestion : perhaps members could share what amp/receiver they finally settled for to drive their vintage beauties


----------



## Rawrbington

For me I prefer marantz 2245 over everything else I've got. The pioneer 950 and sansui 8080 go back and forth.


Got a pair of jbl l110 the other day. Did a comparison of the jbl and klipsch forte ii with some friends who appreciate higher quality audio over just bassy audio. 

I had them listen to one using whatever music they wanted through the pioneer 950. They each scribbled down a few observations for each and then after hearing both sets twice they wrote down which they would take home if they could.

Interestingly enough all 3 said they'd take the Fortes. everybody but one person felt the jbl had a little more resolution and detail. But that was trumped by the musicality and warm fuzzyness of the klipsch. 

As for me I think I too prefer the klipsch. The jbl has awesome detail and instrument separation for days but they are a bit sterile in comparison to the klipsch. The klipsch can't quite pull as much out of the music but what it does pull out is so sweet. The sound seems to hug you and take you to a happy place.

Love both. But if I could only keep one the klipsch would stay right here in my living room.


----------



## moodyrn

I too love my forte ii's. They sound outstanding from my marantz 2325. I do prefer my fisher integrated with them overall though. A few suggestions though. There a many upgrades you can add. The first one is to replace the diaphragms in the tweets with bob crites titaniums. Trust me, you will thank me later. It takes them up 5 levels. You can also replace the mid horn diaphragm as well. It will be better, but the difference won't be as great as with the tweets. Also, you can either rebuild or replace the crossovers with bob crites crossovers with autotransformers. That's also a pretty significant upgrade. If nothing else, get the titaniums for the tweets. It only cost 60.00 and takes very little time to install.


----------



## Rawrbington

I've been thinking about ordering the tweeter diaphragms from crites. Do they really make much difference?

Funny thing about the fortes. I had to have some friends help and a truck to go get them. There was 3 of us and they all told me I was crazy to dump 280$ for these beat up old horn speakers. They said everything bad you can imagine. From horns sound like poop to newer speakers have better tech behind them. 
We got them home and hooked up and we sat there all night. Just listening. Well drinking too but yeah, no tv no Internet, just Music. Still today anytime someone is over and music is played I get compliments on how good they sound. They are the smoothest horned speakers I've ever spent time with.

Kinda makes me want to try cornwalls


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah, of you're on the fence, go for it. It really does improve the imaging and smooths the high frequency response a great deal. One of the smoothest high ends I've heard short of 10,000.00 speakers. If you go all the way with the upgrades, you would have to spend more than 10,000.00 to get better speakers. IMO of course. 280 was a great deal, even considering the condition yours were in.


----------



## ccbass

So, I just inherited a pair of KLH Model 6's from my parents and I'd really like to refurbish them and start using them.  It seems like they have been neglected, but not damaged.  Front covers are dirty, and the body of each speaker has some minor damage.  What should I be looking at and looking for in order to get them back up?  This is all assuming that the tweeter and woofer are undamaged in both.


----------



## Rawrbington

Upgraded the tweets with crites ti diaphragms. And rearranged my listening area. Man these fortes image like crazy. Such awesome speakers. My hd 650 out of my WA2 can't touch these things out of my 8080 or 2270. And at a fraction of the cost. I know its apples to oranges but jeez I'm impressed


----------



## moodyrn

Lol.....told ya.


----------



## trog

gratz on your happy vintage adventure


----------



## RaymondLeggs

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Though I have five cats so I don't often get a chance to listen to them "naked" like in the photo.
> 
> ...


 
  My cat peed on the side of my Vintage sony Speaker.  I had to clean the grille before it left a a stain, since the Grilles are the White linen type.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





raymondleggs said:


> My cat peed on the side of my Vintage sony Speaker.  I had to clean the grille before it left a a stain, since the Grilles are the White linen type.


 
   
  Either that or get 'em to pee on the rest of it so it all matches. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  se


----------



## calipilot227

Drove to San Francisco yesterday to pick these up (excuse the crappy photos. My good camera is at my parents' house). Vintage JBL P40's. $40 including stands 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

   

   
  Powering them with a Pioneer SA-6500 II integrated amp that I found today at Salvation Army ($35). The power lamp is burned out, but it sounds great. All the pots are clean, no static anywhere.
   

   
  Seen here with my Pioneer PL-518 turntable (Shure M97xe cart), Technics SL-MC4 CD changer, and Cambridge Basscube 8 (not currently hooked up).
   

   
  Anyway, just thought I'd share these two great finds. Long live budget-fi!


----------



## Hibuckhobby

Apologize in advance for lack of pics . I have a pair of Cornwalls and redid the crossover caps with mundorfs and obligattos.
Had a guy over the other day buying my Audio Research amp and he was stunned...couldn't get over how big and smooth they sounded. His comment was that he didn't think horns could sound like that.

Also have a pair of KEF 105.2's with redone crossovers...erse coils, and dueland caps. Sound reat with SS amplification.
Hibuck...


----------



## moodyrn

Quote: 





hibuckhobby said:


> he was stunned...couldn't get over how big and smooth they sounded. His comment was that he didn't think horns could sound like that.


 
   
  LOL, that's a comment I've read sooo many times about people listening to the vintage klipsch horns. How I wish klipsch wouldn't have completely gone in a different direction with the speakers they make now. There are horns, then there are the klipsch heritage line horns. That's a sound that simply can not be reproduced by anyone, and unfortunately I guess that includes klipsch as well.


----------



## Skylab

calipilot227 said:


> Anyway, just thought I'd share these two great finds. Long live budget-fi!




Awesome stuff! Very nice.


----------



## Rawrbington

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Drove to San Francisco yesterday to pick these up (excuse the crappy photos. My good camera is at my parents' house). Vintage JBL P40's. $40 including stands


 
  40$ for a pair of old jbls?  im jealous!
  and a pioneer SA 6500 for 35$!?!?
   
  why can't this stuff happen to ME?
   
  finished the refinishing of my fortes.
  Befores:

   
  afters:

   
  Well i guess im not 100% finished with the Klipsch.  the second one is missing its stand.  thing had split.  so i pulled it off and am sanding off the old glue, then gonna glue the split back together and restaple the khorners, then put back on.
   
  and my next project:


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





rawrbington said:


> 40$ for a pair of old jbls?  im jealous!
> and a pioneer SA 6500 for 35$!?!?
> 
> why can't this stuff happen to ME?
> ...


 
   
  Thanks! This combo sounds truly amazing with vinyl. It's hard to beat that warm, analog sound.
   
  Those fortes came out really nice. I should probably pick up some Howard's Restore a finish and see what it can do for my JBLs. The cabinets are in good shape already, but I'll give it a try and see if they can improve even more.


----------



## jjacq

I just got my Sansui restored and it's back to me now. I'm hearing some hissy highs and I have no idea why so I'm letting go of the baby because I don't need it since I already have the Kenwood. Anyone know what tubes these are though?


----------



## trog

Hohoho nice amp @ stunning price! Gratz on your captures 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Powering them with a Pioneer SA-6500 II integrated amp that I found today at Salvation Army ($35). The power lamp is burned out, but it sounds great. All the pots are clean, no static anywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, just thought I'd share these two great finds. Long live budget-fi!


----------



## Golden Ears

Quote: 





warriorant said:


> Those were my bachelor days.   I lived by myself and rented a house just for listening so space wasn't a problem.  I had a bed, a table to eat at, a couch and one system or another.  The 1 ohm dip wasn't a problem for the Krells.  I actually had my heart set on the Infinity RS 1 B's at the time but then Magnepan, The Wilson Tiny Tots & Pupps, and Martin Logan came into the picture.  For a while the Infinity RS 1B's were all the rage in the audio world.  To me those were the best days in audio.  It was still a time were a working man could get a really good system before the price of everything went into the 6 figure stratosphere.   The same thing is happening to headphones and headphone amps now.


 
  I have 2 sets of Infinity Reference Standard 1b's, IMHO they still hold their own against all other speakers at any price point, plus they can play at life like levels (rock concert)  if needed. They only issue with these speakers is that they want a nice flat wall to reflect the rear wave off off (similar to Magneplanars and other dipole radiator loudspeakers). I used to get flown around to set these up.
   
  I probably am going to sell off one pair of mine in the next few weeks when I get around to posting them on Ebay. The last set of RS1's (RS1-a) ended up getting crated and sent to British Columbia.
   
  When dialed in,,, nothing else gets the highs lows, mids correct and blended seamlessly  without giving oversized images and still ahve a true unified wave launch out sound. Listening to Asassin's Tango (Mr & Mrs. Smith soundtrack) you hear and feel the impact of the opening Piano notes as if they just came off the the open piano and hit you in the chest. No other speaker is capable of doing what these do. 
   
  Listen to Pink Floyd Dark Side of the Moon, and Brain damage has the voice floating about 3 feet above the speakers as it was mastered, not a lot of drivers that have the magnetic strength of the EMIM in combination with a nearly massless diaphram that can reproduce these sort of subtleties. Magneplanars have a heavier diaphram and much weaker magnetic field per sq inch.  Yet Maggies still sound very good (I also own Magneplanar Tympani's in my ski house)- so imagine a much faster, forceful, delicate, and resolving maggie...but with bass...real authoritative delineated bass.
   
  Unfortunately (big WAF negatives) few speakers are as huge as these, and parade into your room about 38" either, so that's why I am selling a pair. But they really are everything they were cracked up to be. Many record reviewers still use them, and speakers that were once  "flavor of the month" have come and gone and lost value compared to these speakers.
   
  Mine are in Corona Del Mar, Newport Beach California, perfect weather for these. sad to sell them but I need a deposit for a Tesla Model X. These and the IRS were what Infinity was all about, but few people had a room large enough for the IRS.


----------



## trog

Looking forward to more good ole' big sound treats and sharing


----------



## jjacq

So I got this Marantz amp for cheap($40) but the sound is really low at max volume. Can anyone tell me what this may be because? I bought it with the seller describing the volume needle(right volume needle) broken but he says it's not supposed to affect the sound coming from it. Can anyone tell me what it may be?

 Here's a pic of the baby btw:


----------



## Skylab

That post really belongs in the vintage receiver thread. Please repost there and I will comment as best I can.


----------



## jjacq

^whoops thanks I'll move it right now.


----------



## Lincoln94117

I have a VERY nice set of Marantz Imperial 1 speakers.  The foam on all of the speaker is still really pliable and the only damage to the cabinets is one of the upper corners has a 1x1mm chip.  I have searched over the years and they are extremely difficult to find info on and I have NEVER seen another pair except in old print ads.  I am moving to a much smaller house so the speakers will have to find a new home.  Does anyone have an idea of what they are worth?


----------



## gfox

Just Curious if you were still planning on selling the RS-1?
  Thanks


----------



## 17trevop

.


----------



## Philimon

90s vintage MMGs. New to me a few weeks ago. The rolled off bass is good for an apartment, and I really don't miss deeper bass for most music. I'll add subs in future if situation allows.


----------



## Golden Ears

Quote: 





golden ears said:


> I have 2 sets of Infinity Reference Standard 1b's, IMHO they still hold their own against all other speakers at any price point, plus they can play at life like levels (rock concert)  if needed. They only issue with these speakers is that they want a nice flat wall to reflect the rear wave off off (similar to Magneplanars and other dipole radiator loudspeakers). I used to get flown around to set these up.
> 
> I probably am going to sell off one pair of mine in the next few weeks when I get around to posting them on Ebay. The last set of RS1's (RS1-a) ended up getting crated and sent to British Columbia.
> 
> ...


 
  Still selling these- priced fair at $4200. Guaranteed to make all your headphones worthless.


----------



## 17trevop

.


----------



## Skylab

Wow that's very nice!


----------



## Rawrbington

They look like what would happen if a heresy ate a Cornwall in my mind and it had recently eaten a jbl l100 too

And I mean that as a complement. With them being legendary speakers and all


----------



## calipilot227

Picked up a pair of Polk Monitor 7's today for $60. Did I do alright? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  edit: Monitor 7C's, to be exact. The tweeters are of the SL2000 variety, circa 1987


----------



## Taowolf51

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Picked up a pair of Polk Monitor 7's today for $60. Did I do alright?


 
   
  That's a good price. I paid $125 for mine (though speakers seem to be more expensive in my area). There are a ton of upgrades you can do on a pair of 7s that turn them into an even more amazing speaker. Check out Club Polk, I'm sure they'll be happy to see another 7.


----------



## calipilot227

Jeez, it's been raining Polks on my local Craigslist these past few weeks! At $50, I couldn't possibly pass these up.
   
   

   
  For a pair of Monitor 10A's at this price, it was worth the 2-hour drive to the city of meth labs and sex offenders (aka Antioch, CA) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The Monitor 7's have found a happy home in the bedroom rig.


----------



## Skylab

Nice!  I have to keep away from CL...there are so many nice vintage speakers that one could score cheap and fix up with just a little work...but speakers take up a lot of space...


----------



## wotts

My CL doesn't have many speakers, but that probably a good thing since I'd try to buy more of them. I did miss a really nice pair of immaculate Sansuis - wood was perfect and had the grills, etc. Kind of kicking myself for not jumping on them.


----------



## Philimon

I had a chance to buy a pair of Acoustat 1+1s on CL, but opted to buy the seller's Paradigms instead because they would fit in my car. I wish I could take that back.


----------



## Blue Meanie

Quote: 





philimon said:


> I had a chance to buy a pair of Acoustat 1+1s on CL, but opted to buy the seller's Paradigms instead because they would fit in my car. I wish I could take that back.


 
   
   
   
  Which Paradigms?


----------



## Philimon

Paradigm Eclipse BP
   
  They are being used as surrounds in this photo (not mine). I didn't quite enjoy my time with them, but they did teach me about deep bass. Rated down to 18Hz.


----------



## trog

Wow some gems bought on the cheap there..must...resist..temptation...argghh


----------



## Philimon

JBL Paragon on my Craigslist. Only $25,000. 
   
  http://reno.craigslist.org/ele/3254748640.html


----------



## NiRo

I stumbled on this thread yesterday and it got me thinking about the vintage hifi system that's been sitting in the living room in my parent's place for years.
  I assume it's vintage at least, I'm fairly sure they got it before I was even born!
  It's a Technics system, the speakers are SB-3110s and there's an old school tuner, cd player and tape deck, but the amp is an SU-Z25.
  Anyone know if these are any good? They've not been used for years, and I've no idea how they sound!!
  Obviously they won't be nearly as good as most of the beasts on display in this thread but any info would be appreciated!
   
  Here's some pics!


----------



## calipilot227

Calling all Magnepan owners!
   
  There's a pair of MG-II's and MG-IIb's on my local Craigslist for $40. $40 for both pairs! However, only one panel is functioning properly. Two work intermittently (will probably require a rewire), and one might as well be scrapped as it is missing a large section of the mylar driver.
   
  At this price, would they be worth fixing? I've got until Tuesday to decide.


----------



## Taowolf51

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Calling all Magnepan owners!
> 
> There's a pair of MG-II's and MG-IIb's on my local Craigslist for $40. $40 for both pairs! However, only one panel is functioning properly. Two work intermittently (will probably require a rewire), and one might as well be scrapped as it is missing a large section of the mylar driver.
> 
> At this price, would they be worth fixing? I've got until Tuesday to decide.


 
   
  The repair kits are $50 or so, so I'd say definitely.


----------



## vintagenut

newbie here, this is my kind of site, I am an average stereo buff, with a BIG thirst for vintage audio! now if I can find out the reason I can't post pictures


----------



## Spriggs

guys ready for my trump cards ?
   
  here ya guys go
   
   

  1920's baby 
   

   

   
  revive this thread before its tooo late


----------



## calipilot227

Oh man, are those Altecs in the third photo?

And here's my recently-repaired Maggies (MGII). Loving the larger-than-life presentation, and in my smaller room, they're really not bass-light by any means.
Please excuse the pathetic excuse for a photo. Cover is off of the left one for testing.


----------



## Spriggs

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Oh man, are those Altecs in the third photo?
> 
> And here's my recently-repaired Maggies (MGII). Loving the larger-than-life presentation, and in my smaller room, they're really not bass-light by any means.
> Please excuse the pathetic excuse for a photo. Cover is off of the left one for testing.


 
  Oh man cool you know what they are. yea they are altecs. nice i have maggies also but not in my pics cause they arnt that vintage.i have some pics of my esl though. rewireing the maggies are a pain cause the wire is soooo thin


----------



## calipilot227

spriggs said:


> Rewireing the maggies are a pain cause the wire is soooo thin




Oh, tell me about it! Forget trying to do it without silver solder either. Hopefully I won't need to do it again for a good while.


----------



## calipilot227

Double post, again. iPad version of the site has been doing that a lot lately.


----------



## Spriggs

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Oh, tell me about it! Forget trying to do it without silver solder either. Hopefully I won't need to do it again for a good while.


 
  you and me both.


----------



## Skylab

Nice looking speaks there, fellas!
   
   
  I finally took the plunge into refoaming. I have been looking for a pair of Infinity Kappa 5's for quite a while, as I want to give a pair to my brother.  I have Kappa 6's and love them.  But the Kappa 5 is a bit of a rare bird, and even moreso as I wanted them in oak. Finally scored a pair at a decent price, but the reason was the woofer foam was totally shot.  
   
  I have never refoamed woofers before, so I was a bit nervous.  I've read up a lot on it, and decided to try.  I ordered the appropriate kit from Simply Speakers.  The kit was good, as were the instructions, but its still not the easiest thing in the world.  Including waiting for the first dry cycle, it took 2.5 hours start to finish.  I am sure smaller woofers like this 6.5" are easier than the big ones. I did have to work hard on one to ensure no voice coil rub (I did them "by feel"), but I seem to have succeeded.  They sound great!!!! Going to be tough letting them go, but I think my brother will be psyched.  I won't claim that my refoam job was the prettiest, but its not horrid. Final product:


----------



## shrimants

I have pioneer HPM60. they sound OK and would be much better in a big room with a proper subwoofer. But these ones had a driver replacement so the bass is all wonky. I sold the audioengine A5's and i'm looking for some sort of smaller bookshelf that can replace them but reach about as low and meld well with my dayton titanic MKIII sub.

http://imgur.com/a/a5cFq#0


----------



## Skylab

HPM-60's really shouldn't need a subwoofer at all.  You should look for a set of the original woofers.  They come up on eBay quite often.


----------



## digitalmind

Quote: 





spriggs said:


> guys ready for my trump cards ?
> 
> here ya guys go
> 
> ...


 
  How does that sound? I would love to have huge horns once I get some space to put them in. That's beautiful.
   

 My speakers:


----------



## Skylab

Very nice, Rik!!!!


----------



## Spriggs

Quote: 





digitalmind said:


> How does that sound? I would love to have huge horns once I get some space to put them in. That's beautiful.
> 
> 
> My speakers:


 
  The Horns sound absolutly amazing all of the vintage western electric stuff sounds amazing.


----------



## digitalmind

Can you compare them with large DIY horns using 6" or 8" fullrange drivers?


----------



## penmarker

Guys, has anyone ever heard of the speaker brand Lotte? Someone is selling it locally for $60. They're floorstanders, no pictures though because the lister had to delete the ad to update with new pictures.


----------



## digitalmind

Did you go and take a look?


----------



## Ruben123

Guess the Jamo 704s from the 80s are some kind of vintage too! -which are the speakers I use.


----------



## MrLazyAnt

I have an unusual problem. I don't know what brand my speakers are. I bought  them 2nd hand when I was 17 based solely on sound and price. I'm fairly sure they belong to the 70's based on build, size and sound (and the not-very-nice-looking fabric cone-cover), but they are sealed speakers with the backboard nailed down. I'm very happy with them, I love their sound even if the soundstage is a bit lacking. Any idea how I can find out? Thanks =)
   
  EDIT: I bought them used from a store. I have no idea how many previous owners they had.


----------



## randerson07

Post up some pics over at Audio Karma, someone other there will probably be able to help you out.


----------



## MrLazyAnt

I can't. Registration has been disabled, and I'm not a member.


----------



## randerson07

Post some photos here then, many of us here are also members there.....


----------



## MrLazyAnt

I can't do that either...... no permission to create attachments
  EDIT: My bad here's what one looks like
   
   

   

   
  So.... Any one have a clue who made these?


----------



## Skylab

Those look like late 60's vintage.  As for who...no clue.


----------



## Blue Meanie

Quote: 





mrlazyant said:


> I have an unusual problem. I don't know what brand my speakers are. I bought  them 2nd hand when I was 17 based solely on sound and price. I'm fairly sure they belong to the 70's based on build, size and sound (and the not-very-nice-looking fabric cone-cover), but they are sealed speakers with the backboard nailed down. I'm very happy with them, I love their sound even if the soundstage is a bit lacking. Any idea how I can find out? Thanks =)
> 
> EDIT: I bought them used from a store. I have no idea how many previous owners they had.


 
   
  Nevermind.  Just saw that you posted photos.


----------



## 17trevop

Picked up a pair of these the other day.


----------



## penmarker

So anyone got the Braun speakers by Dieter Rams?


----------



## MrLazyAnt

Hello again, hope I'm not being a nuisance here
  I would really appreciate help identifying my battered and beloved old speakers, having bought them used based on budget and sound, and the shop I bought them from has been closed for a while now.
   



> Here's what one looks like
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## DogMeat

They look sort of like the old Utahs.
   
  I'm into Celestions,(Sl6 SI's), and vintage Polks.
   
  I remember seeing something like your photos at a buddie's house, he resurrected them from a basement and cleaned them up, they were Utahs.
  Late 60's early to mid 70's speakers... lot of them had that fabric screen on them. I think some of the old Pioneer speakers used that cover too.
   

   
   
  Nothing inside them to give you a clue?


----------



## MrLazyAnt

dogmeat said:


> Nothing inside them to give you a clue?


 
  The back is nailed down, and I'm afraid to remove the screen for fear I won't be able to put it back 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  EDIT: If this is any help, the tweeters are on the upper left hand corner and are 6cm (~2.5 inches) wide including the fitting hole. The mid-conehas a 13.5 cm (~5.5 inches) diameter fitting hole and is on the right, slightly higher than the middle, and the hole for the bass driver is approx 27cm (~11 inches) across. The bass cone itself has got a whole bunch of holes in the middle of the dust cap, which has metal ring around it (brass I think), the mid-range has a grill dust cap also with a metal ring, and I can't get a good look at the tweeter, seeing how I gleaned this by shining a light through the screen, but the hole for the tweeter is too small to both shine a light, and look.

   
  Dimensions: 60x40x22, (~23x15x8.5)
  MDF with a "real-wood" cover


----------



## DogMeat

Here is a listing on ebay for some vintage Utahs, they have a similar look to them.
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Utah-Heritage-Speakers-Vintage-/171011092607?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item27d10e307f
   
   
  Maybe that will help.
   
  Good luck.


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





penmarker said:


> So anyone got the Braun speakers by Dieter Rams?


 
  Electrostats?


----------



## Spriggs

Quote: 





penmarker said:


> So anyone got the Braun speakers by Dieter Rams?


 
  No need for them got my self some real quads.


----------



## calipilot227

SPLs have climbed to dangerous levels... (seriously! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
   
   

   

   

   
  I know, I know. They're supposed to go on the angled stands on the floor. Tried that, and I like these "stands" better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Spinning Dire Straits - "Love Over Gold" at the moment. If I turn the volume up more than halfway, they'll probably blow the windows out.


----------



## ri_toast

i once heard of the police coming to tell a person to turn it down, he was wearing headphones. just keep an eye out for villagers with torches and pitchforks. hehe they look nice, sound better and can be driven with a tiny amp as long as you don't send a clipped signal.


----------



## rprokop63

Calipilot,
What model Klipsches are those? I need to find a pair for a second room and as I love my Cornwalls those look very interesting. (Cornwalls won't do very well on stools.  ) This could be my new CL search mission.
Thanks,
Bob


----------



## Golden Ears

A lot of speakers from that vintage had woven grills were nailed on. You can remove them carefully using automobile interior panel plastic pry tools. 

My guess is it is a Henry Kloss design likely an old KLH or Advent. I had a similar looking pair. Could e a KLH model 6 or Mdel 17. Not a bright souring 2 way speaker but with decent mid bass punch , tonally pleasing but far from accurate. When solid state came out it was really harsh in HF. So these were a ok match. The larger tweeter beamed lower down in frequency and lacked sparkle....but being larger it played louder and lower giving better midrange clarity while rolling off harsh highs from the nasty near lifeless Sony receivers. , Also being efficient were good with a 20 watt receiver and had some bass that groups like the Beatles were lacking as well as groups like he Carpenters, John Denver, Bob Dylan etc....had. The LP s with pop music back then wanted more songs per side ..most songs were short, so cutting less bass in the grooves let groove pitch be tighter and allowed even poorly designed turntables' tone arms to track well. It's as if they ignored the RIAA Eq curve.Real bass for pop LP s came back strong with 45rpm 12" singles but that was not until nearly 1980". ( you could see the synthesized bass grooves for instance on a 12" Soft Cell Tainted love single) So speaker manufactures made speakers to try and put the dance eat back into music for those late 1960's to early 1970's cocktail parties. Ths was pre disco.


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





rprokop63 said:


> Calipilot,
> What model Klipsches are those? I need to find a pair for a second room and as I love my Cornwalls those look very interesting. (Cornwalls won't do very well on stools.
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  They're the Heresys, first series (1957-1985). You could always move the Cornwalls to the second rig, then you'd have an excuse to get La Scalas or K-horns for the main rig 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I really want a pair of La Scalas.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But for now, I'm definitely happy with the Heresys


----------



## rprokop63

calipilot227 said:


> They're the Heresys, first series (1957-1985). You could always move the Cornwalls to the second rig, then you'd have an excuse to get La Scalas or K-horns for the main rig
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I have looked at the K-horns and lusted over them or the La Scalas. I'm a bit short on space and they really need more room than I have. Now a set of the Hereseys to sit on top of my Cornwalls might be fun....

Thanks for the response and the pictures!


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I too, want K-horns and/or La Scala's. Not sure how my new mate(s) will feel about speakers. Will see what the second half of '13 and 2014 looks like. I'm definitely ready to chase 'em but I don't want to pay for storage (the K-horns).


----------



## AyeCee

Not quite vintage, but almost there. This stereo system is actually my mum's, which she purchased in the late 80's. The Speakers are Wharfedale Delta 50's, and the components are all Yamaha; of which there is a tuner, CD player, cassette player and a graphical equaliser. I managed to find a 3.5 to RCA adapter cable, and was able to plug my Sansa Clip+ into one of the free channels. It's quite a nifty setup if you ask me


----------



## ri_toast

not trying to make this a Klipsch thread, found a set of Heresys in birch. These were made in 1980 so its the first iteration. Purchased from a woman in her 80s? Only played Nat King Cole (joking) but not abused.(serious)
  Used some watco after a quick sanding. The horns are just about what you'd expect, present and forward. The 12 inch woofer you'd think there would be more air movement. Like most acoustic suspension speakers they will play a 30 Hz tone when placed against a wall; reduced level but present. This is unlike ported speaker which fall off quickly where the ported cabinet is tuned.
  I always wanted the biggens but these fit nicely into a small room.
   
  Planning to make some speaker stands but presently sitting on baskets.
   

   
  and fini
   

   
  this speaker has really grown on me. i guess its the horns; sharp details.


----------



## funkthumb

I'm looking at getting some older speakers, not sure if any of these count for vintage but if somebody knows anything about any of these models or brands and can tell me, that would be great.
I don't know enough about speakers to make any intelligent decisions. I have nothing but Paradigms for my main/HT system. That's all I have to compare to. I'm setting up a second system for all my vinyl. I have an Optonica SM and ST 1400 with my Strathclyde STD 305M and my Dual 1264 ( soon to add a 1019 to the fold ). Right now I just use my ATH-50s, Grado 325si, or Samson SR850 headphones but I will want speakers REAL soon and saw these up for sale. 
Paisley SPL-3000 - SPLs are 150$ mint condition and all original - Advent Legacy II - Advents are 100$ new foam on bass drivers and recapped with an upgrade kit from ebay- Clements 208di - Clements are 150$.
ANY advice or opinions. Thanks.


----------



## Golden Ears

I used to sell Optonica in NYC in High school... now that is vintage, it was this store , Audio salon
owned by a weird guy Jim Kraznee on 2nd ave in Manhattan with the most abrasive sales style I have ever had the horror to witness.. For Japanese stuff it was better than most of mid fi -we called it poor mans Luxman.

I would seriously consider a non vintage speaker over your existing choices. I owned vintage Advents, (with the doped linen cloth surrounds and orange tweeters under some strange looking hard to remove grill) and while they have a sweet sound, they are far from resolving or accurate, and its just the mid bass that is musically involving. That doesn't mean I was not bummed out when they were stolen from my giant railroad flat apt by the maids wayward son, I just can't say I really enjoyed them. Their best use was adding fill at a loud party . 

At $299 the few sets of Masterclass 2504 demo speakers from CEntrance are an affordable plunge into modern high end. Pair them with a fast 7" sub like a Scan Speak 18w/8545 and you have a punchy dynamic system .. If you want spend even less you could pair them with Peerless SLS which are laughably cheap. It won't play as loud, but they will be far more musically satisfying, ...than the Advents, which are just a party speaker.

Great vintage ..Quad - ESL-63 ESL-57, Magneplanar tympani (any model) , older infinity RS1, RS1-b , any of these coherent speakers driven with the right combination of modern gear easily offers hi-end sound as good as or in some cases surpassing the majority of what is currently available at 5-15. times the price depending on the speaker.


----------



## ValeTudoGuy

steve eddy said:


> Yeah, but the JBL's aren't a vintage Japanese speaker.
> 
> If you want vintage JBL, then don't go halfway. Go full crazy with a pair of 4350's!
> 
> ...




Old JBL's give me a twinge, LOL. 
They are awesome, don't think I could sneak them passed the Mrs though


My vintage audio kit is a pair of Leak 2020 (sandwich) Speakers, a Rotel RT222 tuner and a Pioneer SA-5300 integrated amp. My grandad has owned them all since new, they were entry level stuff at the time but for FM they kick ass. I have NEVER heard a better radio (To my ears.) and see no need to upgrade these as my go to radio listening gear....... DAB........ No thanks.


----------



## Golden Ears

I used to have a set of JBL Paragons which were modified with more drivers. JBL bullet super tweeter some crazy midrange horn, a 12" mid bass, and a pair of 15" woofers per side, all plunked into 4 150lb each fiberglass cabinets. These were particularly sweet sounding, and though had horrible hiss from a JBL electronic crossover, were ultimately near high end in SQ and could play " blow you outta the f'ing room loud" and that was with 18 year old ears. We were living the MAXELL tape ad dream only on a larger scale with these as kids in boarding school- no parents to tell us to turn it down. Though we were suspended when we put them in the corners of our schools Gunn dorm upper windows at The Gunnery ...using the building as an acoustic horn, and 1600 watts we got complaints from 2 miles down the road. It was near perfect acoustic coupling ....the grass shook underfoot in the quad...only the large elephant size rock wasn't shaking- every window in the building was buzzing like mad. Our impromptu high school day dance lasted about 5 minutes ...,before the Dean of Students shut us down and confiscated our third set of speakers that semester.

My high school room mate bought them used for the ridiculously low price of $2500 in 1981 and I bought some 18" JBL twin loaded drivers in scoop bins.,, made a hell of a racket...louder than what we had at school...but it really sounded amazing. Very high quality crossover in those..never saturated at deafening levels. Timbre was the best I have ever heard from pro audio,(Andy Schulman (the guy who sold them) was the sound engineer for the Bottom Line jazz club in NYC where they made up the left channel ) but micro detail...gone. Fine to low micro detail........ at those volume levels who wants to hear a squeaky orchestra chair that sounds like Godzilla was leaning back in it anyhow at 135db?

I wish I knew who has those speakers now, trimmed in white fiberglass- they were the size of refrigerators .


----------



## funkthumb

Didn't get the Paisleys, Clements or the Advents - because I was given a pair of older speakers to play with for now.  They are - at least to me - a no-name.  I have to replace the tweeters in them and I was wondering if anybody knows or recognizes them.  On the back of the tweeter it says "Polydax" and underneath it - Made in France.  I will include pics.  Anyone have any clue to what they are or where they came from?????

   

   

  Front without the tweet, 10" and 6"

  Back with 10".

  Strange little pinch type connects.  Push the button and put the wire through and it springs back pinching the wire.


----------



## ValeTudoGuy

Made by Audax of France, good quality stuff and normally reasonable efficient.


----------



## PhoenixG

Hey guys,
  I've been offered a set of Kevek ES-10's and I can hardly find anything on them. Does anyone know how they sound or have them? Can you compare what they sound like to what I have? Also, what range should I expect to pay for them? I'm running a SX-1980 with HPM 150's, Sansui SP-5500x, and JBL L100's.


----------



## Skylab

Never heard of those, but given your current stable of speakers, can't see how you could find a vintage speaker that was much better


----------



## MrQ

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


> Hey guys,
> I've been offered a set of Kevek ES-10's and I can hardly find anything on them. Does anyone know how they sound or have them? Can you compare what they sound like to what I have? Also, what range should I expect to pay for them? I'm running a SX-1980 with HPM 150's, Sansui SP-5500x, and JBL L100's.


 
   
  Tell me, between the HPM 150's, Sansui SP-5500x, and JBL L100's, which are the best match with the SX1980? I have an SX-1980 with HPM100's, but those Sansui's look sweet


----------



## PhoenixG

I hate to say it, but the Sansui SP 5500x speakers probably edge out the HPM150's by the tiniest margin, but at 1/20th the cost - maybe that is just my wallet breaking the tie. The HPM's and the Sansui's both have incredible clarity all the way up and 15 inch woofers that allow fantastic resolution all the way down into the bass range. The HPM's have a slight advantage in the extreme high range due to a higher roll off frequency, i.e. better resolution with the timbre of sounds above, say, 15kHz. The main problem with Sansui speakers is the range of product they made. They obviously managed to produce some extreme quality pieces, but they also produced a lot of garbage sounding things with very similar item numbers (5-way 6x midrange anyone? sounds like being across the house when you're in the same room)
  I hate to say it again, but the JBL l100's don't have nearly the same clarity/fidelity. They have a distinct signature, are still great and pleasant for most music, and the bass is seriously damn near as good, but they distort just slightly more.


----------



## Skylab

I've changed the speakers in my vintage rig. The HPM-100's are gone, as much as I liked them, and they have been replaced by the MUCH better (but still vintage!) Pioneer DSS-9's


----------



## Silent One

Sweet Home Chicago!


----------



## calipilot227

Skylab: Did you have that wood case custom-built for your RT707? Looks beautiful! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  (and on a side note, it feels as if the repair of my Teac A4070 is taking an eternity! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## Skylab

Thanks! Yes, I did have that case custom built. It's solid walnut! 

That's a bummer about your TEAC but I bet it will be great when it's done


----------



## funkthumb

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I've changed the speakers in my vintage rig. The HPM-100's are gone, as much as I liked them, and they have been replaced by the MUCH better (but still vintage!) Pioneer DSS-9's


 
   
   
  Drool,
             ,
              ,


----------



## ValeTudoGuy

God I love silver fascias in wooden boxes! It just oozes class.... I'm truly jealous... It's all in such good/clean condition too, this also reminds me that I have been meaning to get a reel to reel for years. I'm just going to have to take the plunge I reckon.

Any chance you could give a rundown of the equipment?


----------



## Skylab

Thanks, and sure! It's almost all Pioneer - the only exception is the EQ.

PL-570 Turntable 
RT-707 Reel deck
Sansui SE-8X EQ
CT-F1000 Cassette deck

SX-1980 Receiver
SD-1100 Oscilloscope 
SR-303 Reverberation Amplifier
RG-2 Dynamic Range Expander

The last three are not in the signal path, they are just for the light show 

And then the aforementioned DSS-9 Speakers.

I can't recommend highly enough having a reel to reel deck. They are really, really fun, and tape can sound absolutely phenomenal.


----------



## ValeTudoGuy

That CT-F1000 reminds me quite a bit of the Phase Linear 7000 from Risky Business. I love the open mech, it has massive cool factor to me.

I love the fact that you have equipment there just for the visual factor! Lol
To my shame I have never heard Reel to Reel but I have been told by a few people that they can sound as you say phenomenal. I have seen some Akai units going for pocket change prices and I have a specialist R2R repair shop within 20 miles of my house, so I don't really have any excuse to at least try one out.


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I can't recommend highly enough having a reel to reel deck. They are really, really fun, and tape can sound absolutely phenomenal.


 
   
  I can't swim......... without $$$ strapped 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 to a Life-vest. But, I am looking to stick my BIG toe in the R2R pool 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




and see what I think.


----------



## Skylab

I encourage both of you to do so!!! It's really great. And if you happen to like classical music, you can buy some of the greatest recordings ever made for very little money on 7.5 ips reel on eBay that will absolutely blow your socks off. Rock and Jazz tend to be a little pricier, but still sometimes some great stuff there for not terribly much money.


----------



## Silent One

There's some pre-recorded Jazz @ 7.5 ips? Hmmm, looks like I'll have to get in the pool!


----------



## Skylab

Oh yeah. There is LOTS of pre-recorded jazz at 7.5 ips. We are talking here of original factory tapes from the late 50's through the early 70's. This was an awesome period for jazz IMHO, and there are some great titles. Some can be a bit pricey, especially the super popular ones. Expect to pay between $100-200 for something like Brubeck's Time Out or Davis's Kind of Blue.

On the other hand, I'm listening right now to a killer early 60's Stan Getz on Verve that I got for $13.


----------



## Silent One

I'd best chase "Craig" down-the-street!


----------



## moodyrn

My lastest find, well....more like project lol. I bet can't many guess what these are. One hint; very, very rare.


----------



## moodyrn

Double post :mad:


----------



## Skylab

Those look like McIntosh XR-7 "Isoplanar Radiator" speakers to me. Yes? If so, Very cool!  They do look like a "project", though...


----------



## moodyrn

Lol, I should have known you would recognize them. I almost fell out my chair when these came up in my area. The previous owner told me his wife got mad and took a blade to the drivers knowing they were his most prized possessions(ouch).

Obviously all of four of the 12in bass drivers need to be replaced along with both of the 8in mid bass drivers. I got lucky and found two of the 12s and both 8s on eBay. Although they do need to be refoamed. I have that kit on the way too.

That leaves two remaining 12s. Can't decide whether to get them reconed for 90.00 or replaced to 350.00. All of the tweeters work, but one of the dome midrange is also blown too. I already have it in the mail to be repaired. I also have a mq107 coming too, which corrects the in room freq response and makes them flat all the way down to 20hrz!! It's going to be a very extensive project. But from what I know amount them, it will be more than worth it.


----------



## Skylab

Those will be AWESOME when you get them all working.
   
  If the magnets and voice coils are good in those 12" drivers, I would have them reconed.  Those magnets are absolutely awesome.
   
  How cool!  I hope you will post progress pics as you go along.


----------



## moodyrn

Most certainly will. Thanks.

Oh year, those drivers weight a ton. They need a bit of cosmetic work as well. I'm in search of some grill cloth as well, I think I'm going to go with some from parts express. The cabinets have walnut veneers, but instead of being oiled, they covered them with a clear vinyl. That's both good and bad. The clear vinyl provides more protection than any clearcoat but but is a pain to remove to refinish. 

I wouldn't even worry about it if the vinyl itself didn't have scratches on it. But on the positive side, the part I've been able to remove has revealed an untreated walnut veneer that looks brand new. Should look awesome after I get it all off and refinish them.


----------



## Skylab

I bought grill cloth from Parts Express, it's nice. 

Fun fun!!!


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Lol, I should have known you would recognize them. I almost fell out my chair when these came up in my area. The previous owner told me his wife got mad and took a blade to the drivers knowing they were his most prized possessions(ouch).
> 
> Obviously all of four of the 12in bass drivers need to be replaced along with both of the 8in mid bass drivers. I got lucky and found two of the 12s and both 8s on eBay. Although they do need to be refoamed. I have that kit on the way too.
> 
> That leaves two remaining 12s. Can't decide whether to get them reconed for 90.00 or replaced to 350.00. All of the tweeters work, but one of the dome midrange is also blown too. I already have it in the mail to be repaired. I also have a mq107 coming too, which corrects the in room freq response and makes them flat all the way down to 20hrz!! It's going to be a very extensive project. But from what I know amount them, it will be more than worth it.


 
   
  Amazing, moodyrn! I would have never gotten close. Something from JBL was my first wild guess.




   
  And poor fellow...
   
*"Heaven has no rage like love to hatred turned, Nor hell a fury like a woman scorned." - William Congreve, 1670-1729*


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah, I felt really bad for him. Especially after he told me the whole fiasco ended leading to divorce. Another thing that's a bit surprising is he's also 50+ years old. So I guess drama really don't have an age limit.


----------



## PhoenixG

O. M. G.
  I came online today to ask if I should pull the trigger on a pair of XR-7's. I think I found my answer already. Long story short - fully working, recently refoamed, owner former mcintosh repair shop owner and also has XR-14's. Equalizer included.
  Which (both?) should I get?
  What's a fair price?
  I'm willing to give them an audition at joining my setup, otherwise I'll pass them on to some other audio guy out there.


----------



## moodyrn

Lol, wow. Well in that condition, of course, pull the trigger.


----------



## Rawrbington

nice find moodyrn!
  i picked up a project this week  as well.  Not intentionally though.  I was in a rush, had storms rolling in.  was in a borrowed vehicle trying to not get it hailed on.  1 frozen woofer and an oddly warped mid driver in mine and the rear cabinet panels were loose.  How i missed all of this i don't know.  just a reminder for me to SLOW DOWN


----------



## Skylab

That's a lot of Klipsch there!!!! Cool.


----------



## moodyrn

rawrbington said:


> nice find moodyrn!
> i picked up a project this week  as well.  Not intentionally though.  I was in a rush, had storms rolling in.  was in a borrowed vehicle trying to not get it hailed on.  1 frozen woofer and an oddly warped mid driver in mine and the rear cabinet panels were loose.  How i missed all of this i don't know.  just a reminder for me to SLOW DOWN





Thanks. Good luck with your current project, I've never listened to a vintage klipsch I didn't "love". I can't say the same for their current stuff unfortunately.


----------



## Rawrbington

i didn't realize the XR 7  was that big!
  compared to the forte's they look huge.
  dual 12's + 8 in each cab.
  theres been a pair knocking around my local craigslist.  but they've been price prohibitive for me.  i never knew they were 12's. that explains a lot.
   
  are your forte's I's or II's?
  any mods?


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah, even though I knew the the woofers were 12s, I was still quiet surprised to see how massive they were. And as you can see by the first pic I posted, they make my fortes look small.

I have the forte ii's with crites titanium tweets and the k53ti titanium mids. Have you forgotten I was the one who put you on to the crites upgrades? And I also gave you the last nudge to pull the trigger on your fortes.


----------



## Rawrbington

i was thinking that was you but couldn't remember.  my brains getting forgetful!
  doing the Ti tweeters was nice, but the mids were HUGE upgrade.
  well actually, i've got the Ti mids in my chorus, but still much better upgrade over the tweeters to my ears.
  but also nearly 3 times the price.
   
  be sure to keep us updated on the mac's.  im highly interested since theres a pair floating around my area.


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah, those mids were much more expensive and took me months to get my hands on a set. The only thing left are the crossovers, can't decide who I want to go with for those.

How do you like the chorus, they pretty hard to come locally here.


----------



## Rawrbington

I'm thinking I'm gonna go with ALK just because it seems more like an upgrade than a refurb. Do you have the filter on your crossover for the mids? I don't and it still sounds great.

Chorus sounds a lot like the forte. The only reason I'm using the chorus as my mains is they are in like new condition.
But oddly enough I feel like the forte has slightly more bass and digs a little deeper.
Haven't tried the ti in the mids of the forte.
No real reason other than condition and the chorus are tougher to stuff away in a closet.

I just got my mid diaphragms couple weeks back. Love them. And they will slot right into the KLFs when I get them put back together.


----------



## moodyrn

I'm leaning towards alk myself. I much prefer the caps they use. No I don't have the band pass which is why I did consider the crites crossover. But I know it really doesn't matter. And like you, I find the mids to be a huge upgrade even without it. Should be that much better once everything in place.

I'm still impressed every time I listen to them. A friend of mine have some very impressive 5500.00 harbeth hl5. But even if the price were equal, I would still pick my klipsch. They are just a wonderful sounding pair of speakers, especially with all of the upgrades.


----------



## Rawrbington

Indeed. Super impressive I think and I love the way they react to different amps. My Yamaha A S500, Marantz 2245, Kenny 9050 and Scott 200b all give them a unique sound that's so good.

I've got a buddy who has a recording studio with crazy hi end monitors, and he loves coming over, drinking some scotch and admiring the Klipsch.

For the price of admission(especially on fortes) even with upgrade expenses, they are tough to beat. Unless you don't like crisp, clear, detailed upfront mids. But music lives in the mids, so I'm not sure how anyone dislikes it.

Let us know when you tackle on the xovers. I was planing to do that this June, but couldn't turn down the KLFs. So it's been back burnered for now.


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah, that's my next goal after the mac project which is coming alone, but slowly. It took 2 days just the get the clear vinyl off of one speaker. My fingers and hands are still sore. I ended up whimpering out on some around the house stuff my wife wanted me to take care of.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I agree about the different presentation with different amps. Some of the things such as how the voices just float in space, and that very deep sound stage is pretty constant, but I disagree with some over at ak who says tubes are a must. Yes they do sound excellent with tubes, and do sound like a match made in heaven, but these unlike some of the other klipsch, have sounded great with every amp I've tried them with. The tonality has gone from dark, to bright depending on the amp. They do what speakers should do....take on the sound signature of whatever amp you have on them. Sounds simple, but plenty transducers just misses the boat in that aspect.


----------



## PhoenixG

I've had a very productive day. I met a guy with the most impressive radio setup I've ever seen or dreamed of. Oh and I got some speakers. Check these out!

  These McIntosh XR-7's are absolutely massive. They are about 2 inches taller than my HPM-150's and 40 lbs heavier each. Great shape. Better shape than I had hoped, recently refoamed, fuses, original manuals and service manuals included, MQ 102 equalizer included, McIntosh loudspeaker switching console included, and a pair of XR-14's with all manuals were included. You can just see the tops of the XR-14's behind the XR-7's.
  These things look so good that they make everything else I have look shabby.  I'm just waiting for my -1980 to get back from the shop to give them a good thorough test.I can't wait to hear these things. I'll keep you all updated.


----------



## moodyrn

That's great Phoenix! They look a lot better than mine. Please keep us posted. Can't wait the read your impressions, and especially how they compare the the 150s.


----------



## claybum

Ha, there's a pair of XR-7 for sale in my neck of the woods. Price is $900 and they need a refoam. Given the size, I have no place to put them in my house. I have the HPM 1500 in my living room so yeah, a comparison would be great. Congrats on everyones acquisitions!!


----------



## Skylab

Those look great, Phoenix! Congrats.


----------



## PhoenixG

Now I just have to keep the kitten off of them haha.


----------



## Silent One

Rounds      1    -    2    -    3
   
           Kitty    1
  PhoenixG       0


----------



## PhoenixG

Just got the XR-14's back from being refoamed. I managed to find a local guy that does them and he is FAST! He had them back to me in 36 hours and they look great. I'll put up my impressions once I hook them up.


----------



## Skylab

Ruh-Roh...the vintage speaker bug bit me again! I picked up a pair of @1981 B&W DM-16's. Got them home, and did a complete clean-up: Howard's Restor-A-Finish on the cabinets, light soapy water on the lower grilles (which are around the base), and Meguiar's #40 on the rubber surrounds, which were very dirty. Overall they cleaned up nicely! They sound quite good although I need to listen more to get the full measure of them. I was shocked that they are taller than my Pioneer S-1010's, and are almost as heavy at 75 pounds each.


----------



## Silent One

Yeah... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 someone got BIT!


----------



## Rawrbington

man i love B&W's style.  they look super clean and that wood! beautiful. 
  excellent score Skylab.
  its not a bug, its just that speakers are freaking awesome.  the soundstage and imaging is what i fell inlove with.  then when you get a detail moster, ohh, headphone like detail with speaker imaging.  heaven.  maybe maybe maybe maybe awesomer than headphones?
  whats the process like cleaning up fabric speaker grills?  ive never attempted.  My KLF's grills def need it for when they go up for sale or into storage.
  just finished up the cabs and replacing the drivers today.  all sewn up, just in time for my chorus to wipe the floor with them...
  brought out the forte's too.
  chorus smoked them both.
   
  BUT BUT BUT, the chorus have about 250$ worth of Ti diaphragms in them.  so, i'll have to give the others a fair shot with the Ti before i make a final decision.


----------



## Skylab

Yup, that's a fact...speakers are awesome! And these are proving to be VERY good! In fact, better than I expected. Not sure why I didn't expect more, but they are really very good. They don't have as deep a bass as any of my big Pioneer speakers, but the minds are better than any of my Pioneers except the DSS-9. Very balanced. 

And yeah, they do look very nice! I'm such a sucker for walnut-clad speakers 

Rawr, for cleaning grilles, first I vacuum them thoroughly. Then damp a towel with warm soapy water. Usually does the trick.


----------



## Silent One

They look nice indeed! I'm headed to Craigslist after dinner!


----------



## TheAnalogman

Woo Hoo! I still have my Kef Corelli's from 1981. I worked in a stereo shop outside of Chicago and got them for $330. That would be like $820 today!


----------



## Skylab

Nice! I bet those sound good.


----------



## TheAnalogman

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Nice! I bet those sound good.


 

 Thanks! They do. The smooth British sound for small to medium sized rooms only. I certainly couldn't afford the 105's!


----------



## zeroibis

Marantz HD 880


----------



## moodyrn

Wow, been away for a couple of days and great finds popping up everywhere lol. Well, I do have a good excuse though. Just brought home a new baby boy. At 38 I thought I was done, so now I'm definitely done.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  TheAnalogman those are some great looking bookshelves, and Skylab those look absolutely stunning!! Definitely a big thumbs up on those. Congrats all!!


----------



## Skylab

Thanks Moody, and a BIG congrats to YOU!!!!


----------



## moodyrn

Thanks!!


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Wow, been away for a couple of days and great finds popping up everywhere lol. Well, I do have a good excuse though. *Just brought home a new baby boy. *At 38 I thought I was done, so now I'm definitely done.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  CONGRATS on your own contribution.


----------



## Rawrbington

Congrats moodyrn!
A future audiophile no doubt.


----------



## ValeTudoGuy

When you say that you "Just brought home a new baby boy." 

Did you pop out for some vintage speakers and come back with a baby instead? Lol


----------



## TheAnalogman

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Wow, been away for a couple of days and great finds popping up everywhere lol. Well, I do have a good excuse though. Just brought home a new baby boy. At 38 I thought I was done, so now I'm definitely done.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks moodyrn. And congrats concerning your boy!


----------



## Skylab

A note to our UK members, there is a pair of Pioneer HPM-70X for sale on eBay right now. That's a pretty unusual vintage speaker - not sure if its closer to HPM-100 or HPM-60. But I know that many UK folks lament the lack of vintage audio that comes up. According to the listing these are in Blackburn Lancanshire (of the famous Mullard tube factory and the 1,000 holes in the Beatles "Day In The Life"). I've never even heard OF the HPM-70X, much less heard a pair, but both the HPM-60 and HPM-100 are excellent speakers, IMO.


----------



## PhoenixG

I saw that listing. Judging by the size and specifications, I would say it's closer in size and power to HPM 60's.


----------



## Steve Eddy

Just a quick nit to pick, but it was 4,000 holes. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  se


----------



## Skylab

Yes yes, silly me! 4,000 holes in Blackburn Lancashire. Easy to get confused, as the holes were rather small


----------



## moodyrn

Thanks everyone for the kinds words of my recent addition.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





valetudoguy said:


> When you say that you "Just brought home a new baby boy."
> 
> Did you pop out for some vintage speakers and come back with a baby instead? Lol


 
   
  I would be remiss-ed if I didn't admit that my vintage speakers may have a direct correlation to my new arrival. 
  Marvin Gaye does sound pretty darn good on my klipsch's.


----------



## Skylab

LOLOL!!!! Nice


----------



## digitalmind

Ha, very nice Rob! I never realized your S-1010's are so large. Makes me wonder, how does your vintage set stack up to the 800's? I have one system, but I could imagine it being hard to really enjoy a vintage system when you have another, very high end system. I've listened to 800's only once for a couple of hours, but long enough to give me the impression that not very many speakers will come close. 
   
  A little bit offtopic, but I'm looking to replace my 12 watt class-a poweramp with something else. What would suit my Tannoy's (Berkeley, 15")? I'm not sure, but I'm getting the feeling that something with a bit more power will suit them better. Not interested in tubes. Not looking to spend a very large sum of money, but would like to buy something that I would keep for a long time. Quad? Or rather something modern?


----------



## Skylab

Thanks Rik! Yes, the B&W N800's are of course in a totally different league than any of my vintage speakers, you're absolutely right. But the vintage speakers I have all have a very FUN sound, that is sometimes just the ticket. It's a real luxury for me to have three different systems on my house! 

I'm not sure if I can offer you any help on amping your big Tannoys. I've never heard good things about Quad SS amps, though. Are you thinking integrated amp?


----------



## digitalmind

Besides my main system I have a second smaller system with some DIY horns and an old Marantz amp. It sees no use at all. I also still have the Tannoy SRM-10b's. I can't get myself to sell them because I really like them, but they don't get used either. Multiple systems don't work for me, I suppose. 
   
  I've also read a lot of mixed things about Quads... but also that many people pair them with older Tannoys and have good results. 
   
   
  Not really looking for an integrated as I like my preamp a lot and use its MC input for my turntable. I'm starting to settle at a speaker rig that is meant for long term. Besides recently swapping the 10" Tannoys for the 15" bigger brothers, I haven't changed anything in over four years. I figure if I get the right poweramp, I'll be done for a decade or so.


----------



## PhoenixG

My SX-1980 is back from the shop and good as new - partially recapped, a few new bits here and there, and back up to spec!
  Anyways, I have some testing that I've been putting off. Not anymore.

  Here's what I think. The HPM 100's have a distinct signature that is a bit more different from the HPM 150's than I was hoping - still plenty of bass, slightly higher distortion though... Identical mid range sound, slight decrease in very high freq performance that has the most effect on sound signature. They were good to listen too, but I think there are other vintage speakers out there in the same price range that might be better for me. I noticed that the HPM 100's seemed slightly directional, and sounded most different based on where I was in the room and how I faced them. That makes me think they might have a "sweet spot" from which to listen to them. Maybe in a foam room somewhere someone can figure that out...
   
  The Sansui SP-5500x speakers are still very good all around. Slightly lower distortion than the HPM 100's and quite a bit more clear, with better resolution into the deep bass frequencies. Still planning on keeping those things around.
   
  The McIntosh speakers stole the show today. Both the XR-16 and XR-7 have less distortion (more clarity) than the HPM-100 and SP-5500x speakers. They were so clear, I felt like I could hear the singer's teeth chattering and lips closing. Despite being close sizes, the XR-7 (the larger one) sounds much bigger. No surprise there - the XR7 has something like 2x as many active drivers, and a passive one to boot (and weighs 125 lbs/per). There is a bit of phase interference between the active woofers and passive radiator that makes great deep bass imaging, but you have to be across the room before the dephasage evens out. On the other hand, these speakers seem to attenuate less. I go across the house and I still get clear, consistent sound, at a higher level and quality then I expected. The XR-7 sounds very similar to the HPM-150's, but is just a very little bit less boomy. About even in clarity and accuracy. Very close in high frequencies. 
  You might be wondering, "What does that MQ 102 equalizer do?" A lot apparently. Looking at the power meters, when the bass kicks it, it adds  3-20 db, or 2x-10x the power compared to a channel without the equalizer. Sounds good too.
   
  The XR-16 is great for music and fantastically clear. It is slightly thinner in the bass range than the XR-7 (with the mq 102 equalizer), but slightly better in the medium/midrange clarity and imaging. Interestingly enough, I can equalize the xr-16 to have almost the same bass response as the XR-7's, but not quite. I think that adding a satellite woofer would make it a better "all around" speaker. 
   
  Anyways, I'm going to put these speakers all away (hopefully) before my back craps out.


----------



## Skylab

Very cool, Phoenix!!! That's a nice looking wall of sound


----------



## Silent One

WOW... what a demo!


----------



## PhoenixG

Haha, here's the story. My wife and I have an agreement that I can have 2 pairs of speakers at a time with a few transients here and there. Since the 1980 was in the shop, I have a few more than normal that I've picked up. Sometime you just gotta act when you see something and she understands that. She actually likes the 1980 since it has (prettymuch) stopped me from looking for a 'better' receiver. I still end up bringing one home every now and again, but the -1980 has never been at risk.
  I fix these things/get them as good as they're going to get -new foam, minor cabinet repair, deoxit, track down correct replacements any missing/damaged parts, full driver testing, etc. The HPM 150's took months to complete. Really rare or exceptional speakers can take forever to get complete, but it's a hobby regardless and the search is half the fun. Sometimes I just pick up pairs I know will be fun and worth fixing, even if I already know the sound won't be what I'm looking for (JBL L100's I'm looking at you).
  Anyways, then I put them head to head and see what I like best. The losers might be very good, but they still get sold/given away. I've been getting some of my friends in to vintage audio so I have people to give things to, but the rest filter out through other sites we all know.


----------



## Silent One




----------



## moodyrn

Great impressions PhoenixG!! Now I'm really looking forward to getting my xr7's completed. But they may be put on the back burner for a short while if the deal I just made on some very rare cornwall(the one with the vertical horns..wow!) don't fall through.
   
  They are pretty much the best pair of cornwalls I've seen and the crossovers alone have about 500.00 worth of parts. Tweets and woofers been upgraded as well and internal bracing added to the cabs. He have  over 1000.00 invested in upgrades. I'm suppose to be trading my heavily modded forte II's plus a good amount of cash for them. Suppose to pick them up Wednesday, but I really hope no one comes alone with a truck load of cash and still them from me.


----------



## moodyrn

Oh, I almost forgot. Phoenix are you sure your xr7 have passive radiators? They don't suppose to. They come with two full 12in drivers in each cabinet. I have pulled up the manual to make sure there weren't any other versions of the xr7 and there's not. All of them comes with a total of four 12in drivers.


----------



## PhoenixG

Good catch Moodyrn! I just pulled out the schematics and sure enough, they are all active. The guy I got them from thought there was a passive radiator, but the speakers all sounded active to me.
  In that case, the phase shift between the active and what I thought was the passive woofer must be the result of position distortion and not inversion distortion, which could help explain why it was strongest around 2kHz (didn't measure exactly, it's just right in the middle of the vocal range) and not 500Hz. I can't believe I didn't check that haha. Sorry, don't want to bore y'all with engineering mumbo jumbo.


----------



## PhoenixG

Oh man. HPM 150's that just need refoaming for $800 buy it now.
  *breathe*
  I would get them in a heartbeat if they were local, but I don't want to go through that kind of pain with shipping. Someone is going to get a great deal on a great pair of speakers. It's worse because I already know how good they sound haha.
  I'm going to have to stay away from ebay for a bit.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pioneer-HPM-150-/230997799405?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item35c88ab1ed


----------



## Destroysall

Deleted post.
  My apologies, wrong thread..


----------



## joehalo

HPM-60s Love at first sight


----------



## Skylab

Very nice! HPM-60's are really nice sounding speakers.


----------



## joehalo

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Very nice! HPM-60's are really nice sounding speakers.


 
  Thanks Skylab! I really like them. My goal is to find a pair of HPM-100s


----------



## moodyrn

Those look really great, nice looking set up as well. Congrats.


----------



## moodyrn

Well I've had my cornwalls a couple of days now. I was hesitant to trade my heavily modded forte II's plus cash for them. I read quiet a few people prefer a tricked out forte over a stock cornwall. But these cornwalls are so far beyond stock, and are also a very rare model(vertical horns). So I decided these were too good to pass up. And wow did this turn out to be one of the best decisions I've ever made. I really, really loved my tricked out fortes and would put them up against  most speaker costing upwards of 5k. So I thought with all of the upgrades and mods these would be just a step above.
   
  Boy was I wrong. These sound so much better than my fortes, it's shocking. I guess all of the mods really paid off big time. It's been a long time since I've listened to a stock cornwall, but I don't remember them sounding anywhere near this good. These have a much higher level of refinement, bass that extends way down low, and  resolution galore. They can play at  earth shattering levels without a hint of distortion. The treble is extended, lifelike, and delicate all at the same time. The mids have he-6 level transparency. It's amazing how effortless the bass sounds. It's very punchy, full, deep, and also as tight as the bass from so called bass lite speakers and headphones, with a very naturalness to it. As deep as it is, it never dominates any other part of the freqency range.
   
  The woofers have been upgraded to crites custom made cast frame woofers(basic stamped steel on stock ones). The tweeter have been upgraded to crites as well. But unlike for other klipsch which only the diaphragm is upgraded, the entire driver assemble is replaced. Another rarity about these are the horns. Most of the cornwall uses horns made of plastic, but these have the metal horns(the upgraded crites tweets does as well). Also the crossover have been completely rebuilt into something totally different from the stock ones. Internal bracing has been added with very high quality banana post. I initially though the back of the cabinet had been replaced, but the original is still in place, instead someone added a solid piece of hardwood to reinforce the cabinet structure. All internal wiring has been replaced with most if it being silver plated copper.
   

   

   
  These may be the best sounding cornwalls in existence and probably to most rare at that. The cabinets are in excellent shape, but was a little dull. So I have them a good rub down with steel wool and howard's restore followed by howards' feed n wax.

   


   
   
  These things are so massive, it's are to get both of them in one shot. Please excuse my speaker cables. I custom made them for my fortes with the terminal being on the bottom. They're on the top with these and are now a couple of feet too short.


----------



## Skylab

Wow, VERY nice Moody. I bet that set up is phenomenal.


----------



## moodyrn

Thanks my friend. I must admit, with listening to cornwalls in the past, I wasn't prepared at how good these would sound. I've listened to a lot of speakers in the past between 5000.00-40,000.00. These are one of the 7-8 best speakers I've ever listened to. I really feel like I just won the lottery with these. Sounds better and I ever thought  I would be able to afford. I initially thought I would be taking a chance on trading my fortes for these. Now I don't even give them a second thought. I kind of feel bad for the previous owner though. He was really strapped for cash, and really wanted cash only, but was able to talk him into a trade plus cash. The fortes were great, but I definitely got the better end of this deal.


----------



## Skylab

That's awesome. Cornwalls have a great rep, never heard a pair though. Looks like you did a nice job on the cabinets with the Howard's


----------



## moodyrn

Never would have known about it if it wasn't for you. Now I always keep a bottle around.


----------



## Rawrbington

you already know im jealous!


----------



## moodyrn

Lol, yeah I know we are both klipsch lovers. I got really lucky with these. Now I need to catch a great deal on another pair of fortes.


----------



## Silent One

While we're on the subject of Klipsch speakers, I would like to know if my first run-in with Klipschorn's was normal. At the time, I had never heard or heard of a "folded-horn" before. 
   
  Upon my introduction to the pair, I looked-listened-studied them for seemingly hours. And with the owner's permission, I caressed 'em
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, too. Never before had I spent a significant amount of time in front of a speaker I was not buying. Or being entertained with before that day.


----------



## joehalo

Anybody know if the HPM-900s are as good as the HPM-100s and what's a fair price for a good working pair?


----------



## Skylab

I think the general consensus is that the 900's are better sounding than the 100's. I had the even bigger 1100s and they were definitely better sounding than the 100's. 

The 900s generally don't come cheap though. In very good condition, you would be doing well to get a pair for under $500.


----------



## joehalo

Thanks for the info. Sounds like I should jump on this. Guy is asking $275 for a nice pair.


----------



## Blue Meanie

Quote: 





silent one said:


> While we're on the subject of Klipsch speakers, I would like to know if my first run-in with Klipschorn's was normal. At the time, I had never heard or heard of a "folded-horn" before.
> 
> Upon my introduction to the pair, I looked-listened-studied them for seemingly hours. And with the owner's permission, I caressed 'em
> 
> ...


 
  In the mid 70s when I was a teen, our next door neighbor had a pair of Klipschorns.  I finally got to hear them in person after a couple years.  I don't recall the specific ancillary equipment used, but remember a huge reel to reel, and a smallish, relatively low wattage class A amp.  Anyway, I was so floored by the sound of those K-horns, that even talking about it now almost 40 years later still gives me goose bumps.  Still the most "live" sounding experience of recorded music in my life, and I still wish I could afford a pair.


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Blue Meanie* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> In the mid 70s when I was a teen, our next door neighbor had a pair of Klipschorns.  I finally got to hear them in person after a couple years.  I don't recall the specific ancillary equipment used, but remember a huge reel to reel, and a smallish, relatively low wattage class A amp.  Anyway, I was so floored by the sound of those K-horns, that even talking about it now almost 40 years later still gives me goose bumps.  Still the most "live" sounding experience of recorded music in my life, and I still wish I could afford a pair.


 





 Cheers to your experience!
   
   
  Secretly, I'm always lusting for them. But in reality, even if they were gifted to me, where on Earth 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




would I put 'em?


----------



## joehalo

Got these speakers In a trade. Don't really know anything about Frazier Speakers. They sound good but had no grills. I read somewhere about using screen window frames to make speaker grills, so I decided to give it a try. I couldn't have done this without my wife, so a big thanks to her for helping. Here are a few pictures of the process.


----------



## moodyrn

Very nice work!!


----------



## joehalo

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> Very nice work!!


 
  Thank you! It was actually quite fun and not too difficult. I am very pleased with how they look!


----------



## Trav

Moody I want to hear those Cornwalls. When I was on my full range driver kick I thought the Dallas II Horns were amazing. Interested to compare.


----------



## moodyrn

Yeah we set something up when you have the free time.


----------



## Trav

Set of Birch La Scala on EB right now for $1699...caveat, pickup only in Maine. If only I were closer..


----------



## GrindingThud

Not sure if they're vintage enough, but My Mission 700s are still going strong...


----------



## calipilot227

Heads up: I may be picking up a pair of Realistic Mach Ones in the next couple of days. Anyone know these speakers?


----------



## Skylab

Yup. Pretty famous speaker. LOTS of info on AudioKarma on them, definitely worth reading. I'm not very knowledgable about them myself but I do know that they have a rabid following in some circles.


----------



## PhoenixG

I've almost always been satisfied with Realistic's sound reproduction, despite their lowly reputation. Like always, make sure you give them a listen first.


----------



## calipilot227

MOTHER OF GOD...   
  Picked them up for $80 (seller was asking $110).
   


Spoiler: Reaction%20after%20the%20first%20album...



"I don't ********* believe this..."





Spoiler: Reaction%20after%20the%20second%20album...



"I don't ********* believe this..."





Spoiler: Reaction%20after%20the%20third%20album...



"I still don't ********* believe this."


   
  My neighbors are gonna hate me.
   
  Dustcap on the right woofer is dented, otherwise they're in great shape. The previous owner definitely knew what he was doing; he recapped the crossovers, replaced the foam gasket on the mid horn that is notorious for wearing out, and refoamed the woofers.

   
  Can't bring myself to sell the Maggies just yet, but they're going into storage.

   
  Driving with a Hafler DH220 (bottom shelf) and XiangSheng 728A preamp (second shelf) with NOS Mullard tubes.

   
  And my Teac A4070, just to top off the vintage awesomeness.

  (Sorry about the awful photos. My DSLR is packed away from the recent move).
   
  Back to the speakers. Are they the last word in resolution or transparency? Heck no. But are they the most fun speaker I've ever listened to? An absolute YES!!! They've definitely got a warm, 1970's HiFi sound, but not at the expense of clarity. All in all, an excellent impulse purchase.


----------



## Silent One




----------



## uchihaitachi

Quote: 





calipilot227 said:


> MOTHER OF GOD...
> Picked them up for $80 (seller was asking $110).
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Beautiful


----------



## calipilot227

Forgot to mention, MUCH less bright than the Klipsch Heresy. They were probably my least favorite speaker that I've owned. I think someone on AK mentioned that they sound best face down on the floor :veryevil:


----------



## Skylab

Calipilot, ya done good, brotha!!!!! Those look great, super great price, and I'm sure they sound awesome. nice!!!!


----------



## Trav

Fu





calipilot227 said:


> MOTHER OF GOD...
> 
> 
> Picked them up for $80 (seller was asking $110).
> ...


Fun ain't it! They look killer. I'm about board an AA flight home and get to hear my Dynacos for the first time!!!


----------



## captouch

I didn't know this vintage speaker thread existed until Skylab pointed it out after I posted some speaker pics in the Vintage Receiver thread.  Anyway, here's some pictures of transmission line speakers from a relatively short lived (~15yrs) British company called IMF.
   
  First up are IMF TLS 50 IIs, vintage late 70's/early 80's.  Being transmission line designs, these go deep down to 23Hz according to specs:

   
  They didn't come with speaker stands (though a later version did), so I built my own wood stands.  About 5-7 degree tilt-back.
   
  Close up of drivers.  The tweeter (rectangular one) is a replacement Audax tweeter from Falcon UK that's supposed to match the original pretty closely (original was an Audax as well).  The circular one up top is a supertweeter.  I re-foamed the mids after I got them as they were cracked.

   
  I also re-capped the crossovers.  
  Before:

   
  And After:

   
  Next up are IMF RSPM IV (also late 70's/early 80's), with three of four drivers upgraded at some point by the dealer to Improved model drivers - the tweeter was left original (I believe due to mounting differences of original versus Improved drivers).  These are spec'd to go down to 17Hz.  Behind the removable metal plate at the bottom are 3 adjustments (bass cutoff/filter, tilt, and slope).
   

   

   
  Both of my IMF models are mirror imaged, with high frequency drivers inward:
  Left speaker:

   
  And Right:

   
  Crossovers are pretty elaborate, with the various adjustments bringing in and out the various electrolytics:
  Before re-cap:

   
  and after re-cap:

   
  What's cool about this model is they veneer the backside as well - only a close up shot since it's hard to move these 100 lb speakers to get a wide shot:

   
   
  Last up, though I'm not sure early 90's is vintage, are Acarian Alon II, which are descendants of Dahlquist and designed by Carl [size=small]Marchisotto who went on to the Nola brand.[/size]

   
   
  Woofers were re-foamed by Miller Sound. Mids and tweeter use an open baffle design, with backside looking like this:


----------



## Skylab

Cap touch those look GREAT. Nice work.


----------



## moodyrn

Wow!!!


----------



## calipilot227

Way to 1-up me, Captouch... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I kid, I kid. Those are STUNNING! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'll definitely keep my eyes open in case a pair ever drifts my way.


----------



## captouch

There's so much great stuff out there. My exposure has been pretty limited - would love to hear some of the classic vintage lines: KEF, Magnepan, Klipsch, some of the Pioneers and Yamahas, etc. 

Trouble is you can have meets and get together a bunch of headphones, amps, DACs, etc, but lugging full size speakers isn't really practical.


----------



## Destroysall

Hey guys, I found a pair of Ohm C2 speakers on CL for only $80.  The seller is stating that the woofers have been refoamed and the cabinets are in great condition.  Is it worth the price?
   


Spoiler: CL%20ad



http://phoenix.craigslist.org/cph/ele/3849834977.html


----------



## PhoenixG

At $80, that's prettymuch just the cost of his refoam job. Your call bud.


----------



## Destroysall

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


> At $80, that's prettymuch just the cost of his refoam job. Your call bud.


 

 The fact that one speaker has two mids instead of the normal mid and a tweeter is just odd for me. I'm not sure if this is how the speaker set is or if the guy couldn't find a replacement.


----------



## MattTCG

Okay guys, I'm looking for a little help. I have a sweet Pioneer sx-650 receiver. I'm looking for a nice pair of vintage speaker to pair up with it. Here's what's on my wish list:
   
  1. Smaller is better-bookshelf size
   
  2. Wooden cabinets a must
   
  3. Darker warmer is preferred sound signature
   
   
  I'm looking for suggestions. Just the other day I heard a pair of Grundig speakers...box series. LOVED them!! They seem to be hard to come by. I guess that I could accomodate floor standing speakers if they were reasonably sized. So that is an alternative but still prefer bookshelf sized. 
   
  thanks...


----------



## calipilot227

See my earlier post 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 They aren't ridiculously huge, but they definitely are floorstanders.


----------



## PhoenixG

I have a few suggestions for you I suppose. If you want wood cases and good vintage sound with a warmth to it, look to the 60's. I have a pair of Jensen TF3 that would be perfect for you if you wanted them (or look online, idk) - only about 20 inches tall, thick *solid walnut* cabinets, famous 10'' woofers, good sound with the warm signature you're looking for. Make sure you get ones with the original woofers though - the woofers are worth more than the rest of the speaker combined since they were also used in fender amps, so it's common for people to part out the original woofer and replace it with a cheaper one.
   
  Still looking for small, try Pioneer HPM 40's. Those guys are fairly small and underrated - not to mention super common/cheap to buy online and easy to find parts on if you ever blow something up. They are veneered particle board (fairly standard) with a walnut look. Only about 18'' tall, fairly light, but still kick like a mule when you turn them up. I have about quadrupled their rated power without popping anything on those (funny story actually, the volume caused a good chunk of my friend's ceiling to fall, haha). Those guys sound on the warm side too.
   
  Final suggestion, look at JBL L26 decade series speakers. They are a little larger, but still quite underrated and underpriced, but usually slightly more expensive than the Pioneers. They are also veneered particle board. They have the stereotypical warm signature you might be looking for with a high-end aesthetic.
   
  Otherwise, many other things built in the 60's will probably have the cabinet quality/type, size, and sound you want.


----------



## Skylab

Knowing your desired price range would really help. The HPM-40 is a GREAT suggestion though. They are bigger than your typical bookshelf speaker, but not a big floorstander for sure. But they are remarkably full range. Very satisfying sound. I bought a pair locally for $80 a couple years ago, cleaned them up and gave them to my son, who is now 14, and LOVES them. They are pretty efficient so not a huge amount of power required.


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks for the replies guys. Looking into those now. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Would like to spend up to $300.


----------



## Skylab

There is a nice looking pair of B&W DM-1400's on eBay right now that doesn't have any bids...those are about the right size too...if you could "steal" those that would also be awesome as long as you are not using them in a huge room or wanting to have DJ parties, as they are more power hungry than the Pioneers.


----------



## Trav

Matt I've finally made it home and TBH the Dynaco A25s might fit the bill. I prefer them with SS amps over the tube setup I ran them with a few years ago. Last night I stacked them with HPM 100's and I am we'll satisfied with the synergy.


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks again guys. Checking those now.


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I bought a pair locally for $80 a couple years ago, cleaned them up and *gave them to my son*, who is now 14, and LOVES them. They are pretty efficient so not a huge amount of power required.


 
   
  Skylab, will you be my adopted dad?


----------



## MattTCG

^^ Nope...I've already got dibs.


----------



## Skylab

LOL! Probably not surprisingly, both my kids are as into music as I am. Which is cool! I made sure they have decent stereos in their rooms, and they both use them a lot, which is also very cool.


----------



## PhoenixG

Let's talk speakers - I have my eye on a pair of S-710's. They are in flawless shape, including the supertweeters, grills and badges, except the woofers are non-OEM replacements (vintage Rolas I think judging by the look). I am OCD as heck about having all OEM parts in my speakers and I can't find replacements anywhere. Does anyone know where I might find a pair of woofers for these guys? They certainly deserve it, but I won't get them unless I think I can find them. Alternatively, are they worth buying even if I can't replace the woofers? Are there suitable pioneer replacement parts that may have different part numbers but the same specs?


----------



## Destroysall

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


> Let's talk speakers - I have my eye on a pair of S-710's.


 
  Mind me, but is the S series worth the money?  There is a pair of S-510 (http://tucson.craigslist.org/ele/3897864260.html) on sale for $100.  They look to be in pristine condition.


----------



## Skylab

I have S-910's and S-1010's. both are excellent speakers. The S-1010 is actually spectacular. Most expensive speaker they ever made until the recent TAD stuff. 

The whole line benefits from versions of the same excellent ribbon tweeter, and the PG cone woofers. Phoenix, every now and then you see the woofers on eBay. I wouldn't pay a lot for one with replacement woofers. 

On the other hand, Destroysall, I would RUN and put down $100 for those S-510's if they look as good in person as they do in the pics.


----------



## Destroysall

Quote: 





skylab said:


> On the other hand, Destroysall, I would RUN and put down $100 for those S-510's if they look as good in person as they do in the pics.


 
  Those are words of inspiration, Skylab. I'll definitely need to make the two hour drive there ASAP then.


----------



## PhoenixG

Annnnnnnnd I bought them. As suspected, the woofers were Rolas. Now I'm on the hunt for S-710 woofers. I'll put up pictures and impressions once I have time to thoroughly test them out.


----------



## Skylab

Nice guys!

Phoenix, I think the HPM-700 woofers also fit but need to check that.


----------



## SpeakerBox

First post to this wonderful thread.  Thought all you vintage speaker people might recognize the woofer in my speakers:

   
  Trouble is that they are 35 years old (give or take) and have followed me around since college.  Unfortunately over the years they have been damaged, first when my Amber amp blew lunch and warped a voice coil and again when my 1st NAD M15 let out a loud white noise like  pulse that cracked a woofer also took a tweeter out.  So need to decide if I will get another pair of B139s off of Ebay or move to a more modern driver that will tolerate the enclosure size and still provide the .707 system Q I am getting now (very flat - tight response).  Decisions - decisions!


----------



## GrindingThud




----------



## GrindingThud

http://compare.ebay.com/like/221162114457?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/drivers/B139_substitutes.html


speakerbox said:


> First post to this wonderful thread.  Thought all you vintage speaker people might recognize the woofer in my speakers:
> 
> 
> 
> Trouble is that they are 35 years old (give or take) and have followed me around since college.  Unfortunately over the years they have been damaged, first when my Amber amp blew lunch and warped a voice coil and again when my 1st NAD M15 let out a loud white noise like  pulse that cracked a woofer also took a tweeter out.  So need to decide if I will get another pair of B139s off of Ebay or move to a more modern driver that will tolerate the enclosure size and still provide the .707 system Q I am getting now (very flat - tight response).  Decisions - decisions!


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





grindingthud said:


> http://www.t-linespeakers.org/drivers/B139_substitutes.html


 
  Yes, have been to that link and have had to eliminate those drivers from contention for one reason or another.  Thanks, though.


----------



## Skylab

I have to say, those are very cool looking!


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I have to say, those are very cool looking!


 
  Thanks - Skylab.  The only thing in the box are the B139s (no port), some bracing, crossovers, and lambs wool (great for damping).  The mid and tweeter are on the top as a separate unit and are physically time aligned to the woofers.  I use linkwitz-riley xovers which still benefit fro time alignment.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Bad picture - but here are my Advents in the man cave.  Got them for $30 of Ebay with local pickup about 5 years ago.  Sound fantastic!   The Fisher console id my father-in-laws (he lives with us now).  Just re-tubed it and it sounds very good (approximately 50 years old).


----------



## MattTCG

I got some Pioneer HMP 100's today on a local pickup knowing that they might be too big for my man cave. If anyone is interested before they go up on CL shoot me a pm. I'm in the Atlanta area. 
   
  Would trade for smaller vintage speakers.


----------



## ev13wt

Technics totl from 1977. SB-6000








Almost finished with the entire selection of totl gear from technics of that year. Technics 1977: RS-1506 // 2x SE-9060 // SU-9070 // SH-9010 // SH-9020 // ST-9030 // SB-6000

Living room today:






Living room before the pro series:









Only missing the turntable sl-1420 and THE DAMN HEADPHONE of that year. I've been trying to find it for ever. I don't even care how it sounds, I just want it.


Bedroom setup now with SL-BL3: totl 1977 tuner 9600 and 8600 integrated.







Recording playlists from computer to R2R.


----------



## Silent One

Nicely executed.


----------



## PhoenixG

I'm a dead man if I pick these up, but I have my eyes on these.
  Recognize them?

  Spoiler alert
  Stacked McIntosh XR 7's. As in, 4 of them. Just 5 hours away in Jacksonville. 520 lbs of speaker muscle that just want me to want them. They're taunting me with how close-ish they are. If there's anyone driving from Jacksonville to Pensacola, message me. I'm drooling over these things.


----------



## ev13wt

silent one said:


> Nicely executed.




Thanks man!



phoenixg said:


> I'm a dead man if I pick these up, but I have my eyes on these.
> Recognize them?
> 
> 
> ...




Don't stack speakers, soundstage and instrumentation will suffer. 

Get all 4, pick out the 2 nicest and sell the other 2.


----------



## PhoenixG

Funny thing is that these speakers are designed to be stacked... just not the way this guy did it. He just put them right on top of each other with a piece of cardboard in-between. The top actually comes off and so does the base to make one integrated unit. Buuuut he didn't have the manuals and this is one time that might have actually helped. If I close that deal, it'll take a few weeks, but I'll keep y'all up to date.


----------



## ev13wt

I didn't know that. Interesting.


----------



## bce22

Was given a vintage Realistic hi-fi setup from 1979 in excellent condition.  It's the STA-2100D receiver and pair of Mach One floor standing speakers.  
   
  I can't believe how good these speakers sound.   They are slightly warm but they have plenty of detail in the upper mids and high.  The bass is the best ive ever heard from towers though i have little experience with high end speakers.
   
  i love them and am wondrring if there is anything i should do to maintain them to keep them operating at their best.
   
  i will submit pictures soon.
   
  thanks


----------



## calipilot227

As long as the driver gaskets and woofer surrounds are intact (push on the woofer, you should feel some back pressure), they should be good to go. If you want to check the crossover components, you can. They sometimes drift out of spec over the course of 30 years, mine still measure fine though.


----------



## MattTCG

My quest for vintage speakers continues. I'm open to suggestions as always...of course. Originally I was planning to spend about $250-$300. I was looking for:
   
  *sweet mids (primary)
  *silky darker treble
  *nice tight bass but some presence (nothing boomy or loose at all)
  *vintage look (wooden cabinets and 60's-70's looking grills)
  *smaller in size
   
  Through the suggestions from you guys, Trav and Rob among others, I came to the conclusion that I needed to find a pair of Dyanco A25's. And in fact I'm trying to win pair on ebay today. I'll have to spend my max budget to get them though. 
   
  Now that  I've had a chance to listen to actually listen to some good vintage speakers, my opinion on them has changed. I have thought for years that hp's gave me the experience that I was after. Now I realize of course that "the right" full sized speakers can offer the same experience. 
   
  So my question is, if I'm not able to win the Dynaco is there another speakers that might give me even a little more in a larger size? I might be able to increase my budget a bit.  The Pioneer HMP 100's, while a great speaker, are not for me. Great bass and awesome design. Great for being played loudly, but I never listen loudly. I listen to a lot of jazz at soft to medium levels. Lot's of vocals. A little indie pop, country, blues and some classical. 
   
  Thanks in advance for the help guys!!


----------



## PhoenixG

If you're ready to front some money, the JBL L100 speakers have everything you're looking for. You might get lucky and find a pair for $400, but they usually go for $500-$950. I've gotten a few good deals on them in the past because people don't realize how easy they are to repair.
  Otherwise, I stand behind my suggestions for the HPM 40's or Jensen TF3's.


----------



## Skylab

Maybe a pair of Infinity Kappa 6's or RS6B.


----------



## MattTCG

I thought that the Infinity line had a reputation for being bright on the treble?


----------



## Skylab

I don't think of the EMIT tweeter as bright. But the real key there is the independent mid and tweeter level controls. You can make it sound a lot of different ways. And the EMIT tweeter and Polydome mid are superlative drivers.


----------



## ev13wt

You could rebuild the crossover aka put in new electrolytics. They could be off value or dried out after all those years.

You can expect many more years of service. and if they where off by a large factor, your drivers will be back to their proper crossover points. You might even get some more treble response out of them.


----------



## Trav

Matt KLH 6 will work too. Kloss got it all right on that model.


----------



## MattTCG

Okay, I've got my radar on for the KLH.


----------



## BearWant

Anyone know anything about the JBL Control 10 monitors.  A pair popped up on CL for $300.  From what little I've been able to garner they sound like nice speakers.   I haven't heard enough JBL that era to know their house sound.  I did read that they were designed for tv and radio station rooms, so are conducive to small space which I would need.


----------



## DrWebster

The Control 10s aren't what I'd consider suited for a small space, they have pretty large cabinets. Honestly the only times I've seen them used is for PA or commercial background music installations. If you want something from the classic JBL Control line, look for a set of Control 1s or 5s. I recently got a set of rare Control 1 Plus (which I'll post about eventually) and they're fantastic bookshelves if you can find them.


----------



## MattTCG

Hey guys...where might one find vintage speaker grill cloth. I've got a pair of KLH speakers that I'd like to recover the grills on. I'm looking for something that's inexpensive but that looks vintage.
   
  thanks...


----------



## Skylab

You can get a bunch of different grill cloth types at partsexpress.com


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks for that Rob!!


----------



## bce22

There are a pair of hpm 900 available locally for $250.  They have slit damage to the dust cover.  Do you think this is a good price?
   
http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/ele/3911362553.html


----------



## Skylab

That's absolutely worth it IMO. Those dust caps are not original anyway and can be replaced. Those go for much more than that typically. If they work well it's a nice price for a very nice speaker!


----------



## bce22

Thanks Rob!
   
  Coming from you that means alot. I'm going to see about purchasing them then.
  The other option
   
  Edit: the other option is a pair of excellent condition B&W DM3000 for $350.  Theres also a listing for one owner cornwalls in excellent condition for just under $600 though thatsabovemy limit unfortunately.


----------



## MattTCG

Need some advice guys. There is a pair of Pioneer CS A31 in mint/near mint condition going for $150 locally. Worth it?


----------



## Skylab

Nope. I wouldn't pay more than $30 for those.


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks for getting my back Rob!! The guy was quite a salesman. He said that that they were basically LNIB and that he had the original receipt. Said that you couldn't find a pair like this anywhere. 
   
  Anyway thanks for the backup...


----------



## Trav

Matt what KLH did you get?


----------



## bce22

So the owner of the Klipsch Cornwalls returned my call. If these one owner speakers are in good shape are they worth the $600 asking price? Anything specific I should look at/for if I go see them tomorrow afternoon?


----------



## calipilot227

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> So the owner of the Klipsch Cornwalls returned my call. If these one owner speakers are in good shape are they worth the $600 asking price? Anything specific I should look at/for if I go see them tomorrow afternoon?


 
   
  Oh, absolutely. I see them go for $800-$1200 locally all the time.


----------



## bce22

I've started doing some research and the little I've read so far seems to say these horn loud speakers benefit alot from tunes. I have headphone tube amps but have no interest (read bankroll) in getting a speaker tube amp. 

Does anyone have an opinion on whether vintage Solid state can do them justice or should I hold out for pioneer hpms or equivalent?


----------



## Trav

BCE I agree with CP on the price. Moody is driving his CW with his 9090db (ss), if I'm correct and loves them.


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





trav said:


> Matt what KLH did you get?


 
   
  I picked up the KLH model 38. They are not the ones I was looking for but they came up locally for about the cost of lunch so I decided to give them a shot.


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





trav said:


> BCE I agree with CP on the price. Moody is driving his CW with his 9090db (ss), if I'm correct and loves them.


 
  Thanks Trav!
   
  If Moody likes it, thats good enough for me!


----------



## moodyrn

Well the new toy syndrome has past, and you know what? I still put them in the top 5 speakers I ever listened to and that includes speakers ranging all the way up to 40,000 Utopias. Of course those were better, but I would say they easily compete with 10,000-15,000 speakers. But also keep in mind that mine are a very rare version with an additional 1000.00 worth of upgrades. So take that with a grain of salt.

I think the tube thing is a myth. Before I got mine I read a pro review of someone greatly preferring ss amps for them. He said the transient response was much better along with deeper much tighter bass. After trying both, I would agree. My vintage tube amp has a very pleasing tonality which I love with the cornwalls. But the bass has a bit too much bloom and lacking a bit of extension. And they don't sound as fast as they do with either of my ss amps.

But I do understand why some people swear by tubes with them though. One reason is the lushness and holographic mids they provide, the other reason is the fact they really don't need but about 5 watts to really sing. But a good warm ss amp kind of give you the best of both worlds.
But there's no denying my 9090db is over kill since it don't give me a lot of headroom on the volume pot. But the combo just sounds sublime.


----------



## Silent One

A very pleasing read, moodyrn. I happen to think Saturdays were made for College Football, College Basketball and pursuit of vintage electronics.


----------



## Skylab

I'm certainly looking forward to the return of college football


----------



## MattTCG

War Damn Eagle!!


----------



## Silent One

Go OU Sooners, SC Trojans & Cal Bears!


----------



## Craigster75

I just came across this thread.  95% of my music listening is on headphones now just based on lifestyle changes from when I was a teen/twenty-something.  I have superb classic tower speakers purchased about 25 years ago that are still going strong as my L&R speakers in my home theater setup.
   
  If anyone is familiar with Advent, they once made excellent loudspeakers, primarily two-way.  I own the Advent Maestro which is, I believe, the only three-way tower speaker they ever produced.  They sound fantastic and really bring movie soundtracks to life.  I occasionally take a trip back in time with them and blast some Tom Petty, Boston or The Who.
   
  About 10 years ago, my nephew cranked up the bass and volume to ridiculous levels while listening to hip hop.  He blew out the original woofers.  After I stopped sobbing, I found replacement parts through Jensen in Canada who purchased Advent years ago (that was the end of quality Advent speakers), but they are good as new.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





craigster75 said:


> I just came across this thread.  95% of my music listening is on headphones now just based on lifestyle changes from when I was a teen/twenty-something.  I have superb classic tower speakers purchased about 25 years ago that are still going strong as my L&R speakers in my home theater setup.
> 
> If anyone is familiar with Advent, they once made excellent loudspeakers, primarily two-way.  I own the Advent Maestro which is, I believe, the only three-way tower speaker they ever produced.  They sound fantastic and really bring movie soundtracks to life.  I occasionally take a trip back in time with them and blast some Tom Petty, Boston or The Who.
> 
> About 10 years ago, my nephew cranked up the bass and volume to ridiculous levels while listening to hip hop.  He blew out the original woofers.  After I stopped sobbing, I found replacement parts through Jensen in Canada who purchased Advent years ago (that was the end of quality Advent speakers), but they are good as new.


 
   
  Yup - got a pair of the New Large Advents in my basement system.  These are the two ways with the fried egg tweeter.  Awesome sound!


----------



## bce22

Oh Boy! Papa got a new pair of shoes. Driving home with 1971 Cornwalls in pretty awesome shape! Cabinets have some scratches and a small chip. Small tear in one of the grill covers but that's it. They are beautiful. 

Not even going to set them up. Gonna give them the restore a finish treatment. 

Lots of pics will be posted later. 

Oh by the way I paid $550


----------



## MattTCG

Not sure if that's a fair price but great speakers for sure!! Can't wait for pics. Post some before & after.


----------



## moodyrn

That's a steal, they easily go for twice that. I've seen some mint go for as high as 2500 to 3000.00. Don't forget that klipsch still make these and a new pair will set you back 4000.00. And those are said to be better than the cornwall II but not as good as the original cornwalls. If you by chance got the originals, then that's really a steal. Congrats on a great find.


----------



## bce22

Cornwall I. Serial starts with J. I think that means 1971. 

There worth putting in crite cross overs and ti tweeters.


----------



## moodyrn

Wow, that's a stupid good deal then. I've seen fortes go for much more than that. In fact, someone offered me 700.00 for a pair I use to own. And yes the crites treatment will be more than worth it. Congrats. Looking forward to your impressions.


----------



## Oregonian

First of many posts to come here but first things first - 

GO DUCKS !


----------



## Oregonian

Secondly - I read his whole thread and not once read Cerwin Vegas being discussed! My roommate in the early 80's had what I think was D-5's and they rocked! 

Anyway, since I got the Pioneer rack system (Spec1 pre/Spec2 amp @250 WPC) that came with no speakers, two buddies came to my aid. One gave me a 1992 Klipsch KG 3.2 pair and the other gave me a pair of Sansui S-1500 towers from early 1980! GAVE me them. Love those guys! 

Both handle the Spec 2 well and thump the house nicely. No, the decibel levels stayed sane and wasn't using 500 watts of power but still. 

May look for some Cerwin Vegas from a nostalgia perspective. I'm a headphone lover and my newly modded D7000's sound amazing but sometimes a speaker is the answer........like last night when my Eagles One of these Nights album arrived. Man they sounded good. 

Could not pick one over the other at first test. The Sansui are a bit brighter and the Klipsch may thump better but both are good. Pics to follow.


----------



## MattTCG

^^


----------



## Craigster75

Quote: 





oregonian said:


> Secondly - I read his whole thread and not once read Cerwin Vegas being discussed! My roommate in the early 80's had what I think was D-5's and they rocked!


 
  The Cerwin Vegas were the Sony XBs of speakers.  I recall their trademark was red rubber trim around the 15" woofers of their top models.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





oregonian said:


> Secondly - I read his whole thread and not once read Cerwin Vegas being discussed! My roommate in the early 80's had what I think was D-5's and they rocked!
> 
> Anyway, since I got the Pioneer rack system (Spec1 pre/Spec2 amp @250 WPC) that came with no speakers, two buddies came to my aid. One gave me a 1992 Klipsch KG 3.2 pair and the other gave me a pair of Sansui S-1500 towers from early 1980! GAVE me them. Love those guys!
> 
> ...


 

 Pics..............


----------



## Silent One

Rack 'em! I could easily see myself in that room with Champagne & Pizza on a Saturday nite!


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





oregonian said:


> Pics..............


 
   
  Dang, why can't I ever score like that? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The really good stuff that I come across are things that I don't need. And I'm just not into flipping for a profit.


----------



## bce22

Hi Head-Fiers. 
   
  I would like to share with you some pictures of my recent acquisitions.  Last Saturday I was given a pair of Realistic Mach Ones from 1978 in pretty great condition.  The only issues are a small dent in one of the woofer dust caps, the cabinet needed some TLC and a small tear in one of the grill covers.  
   
  Also, today I purchased the Klipsch Cornwalls as well.  My brother and I gave both pairs the Howards Restor-A-Finish and Feed-and-Wax treatment.  That stuff is so easy to use and the results are absolutely amazing!!!  I really can't believe how amazing the cabinets of both pairs look after the job.
   
  I took pictures during the process.  Unfortunately the end result photos of the Cornwalls really came out crappy (bad lighting).
   
  Tomorrow (while it's light out) I will take some excellent photos of my revitalized Cornwalls that I will post.  Tonight I will share with you my Mach Ones and a comparison shot of them with the Cornwalls before I worked on either of them.
   
  I hope you enjoy!!!!


----------



## moodyrn

Beautiful


----------



## MattTCG

^^ Good times brother....very good times. Enjoy!!


----------



## Silent One

Great effort bce22!!!


----------



## MattTCG

Hey, a pair of CS 99a's just popped up on my radar. How do these rate and what a fair price on some in very good condition?


----------



## bce22

Thanks everyone!  More pics tomorrow!!!!!
   
  So, just to tell you.  I just fired the cornwalls up for the first time.  I have never owned or knew anyone that owned high end speakers.  I have never had a better musical (besides live shows) experience in my life!   I am so hooked on my vintage setup!!!!!!!


----------



## Skylab

Great looking indeed!!!! Very nice


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> Thanks everyone!  More pics tomorrow!!!!!
> 
> So, just to tell you.  I just fired the cornwalls up for the first time.  I have never owned or knew anyone that owned high end speakers.  I have never had a better musical (besides live shows) experience in my life!   I am so hooked on my vintage setup!!!!!!!


 
   
  Now Rhode Island has two attractions for me - The Carey Mansion and your setup!


----------



## Craigster75

Those Mach One pics are giving me a serious 80's flashback.  Now where did I put those two-tone Sergio Valente jeans?


----------



## moodyrn

matttcg said:


> Hey, a pair of CS 99a's just popped up on my radar. How do these rate and what a fair price on some in very good condition?




I owned a pair and got rid of them quick. They go for insane prices because of their Beauty and build quality. But the hpm100 beat them handily. Although they have 15in drivers, they have the bass weight of speakers with 6in drivers because of how small the cabinets are. The bass does improve with and eq, and going that route does improved the bass response a great deal, but still fall way short of what a 15 inch driver is suppose to sound like.

I thought I was getting a great deal at 240 but I still feel like I paid too much. Just head over to audiokarma and they will tell you every thing you need to know. But they don't sound bad. They do have a nice, lush tonality to them. But IMO they are way overpriced for their overall performance. I think you can get much better for less money unless you get a really killer deal for them. But there are some who love them, so you may at the very least wont to give them a listen.


----------



## calipilot227

Dang, I gotta give my Mach 1's the Howard's Restore-a-finish treatment now!


----------



## Craigster75

I consider my Advents to hold their own against current models and don't feel like technology related to sound quality has changed much with modern mid-level speakers like Definitive Technology or Polk.  Also, classic brands like JBL and Infiniti put out inferior products today compared to 25  years ago IMO.  I do feel the top end speakers are stellar today (a.k.a. B&W)      
  I still remember how good the high end was with my old Inifiniti EMIT tweeters.  What does everyone think about general sound of today's loudspeakers vs. a generation ago?


----------



## MattTCG

I hesitate to ask this question, but...most of the heavy gauge speaker wire that I have is difficult to use with vintage speakers and amps due to the smaller  binding post. I was thinking of grabbing some of this:
   
http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm
   
  If you guys have better suggestions, please let me know. Soft and flexible/smaller gauge is my objective and I'm not looking to spend lot's of money.


----------



## Oregonian

matttcg said:


> I hesitate to ask this question, but...most of the heavy gauge speaker wire that I have is difficult to use with vintage speakers and amps due to the smaller  binding post. I was thinking of grabbing some of this:
> 
> http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm
> 
> If you guys have better suggestions, please let me know. Soft and flexible/smaller gauge is my objective and I'm not looking to spend lot's of money.




I'm using some thick yet extremely soft and pliable Monster cable I found at Best Buy for my vintage hook ups. It fits the tiny hole.....barely. I also use banana clips whenever I can as well like on the Klipsch speakers. It didn't say what gauge it was anywhere on the reel BTW.


----------



## PhoenixG

Another few weeks go by, and I find myself building another wall of sound. I picked up some Kenwood KL-777's and Pioneer S-710's and decided to compare them to what I have setup, the McIntosh XR-16's with the SX-1980.
   
   

   
   
  I also got a set of McIntosh XR-14's, but they showed up a bit broken, so I'll compare those another day after I get the parts in to fix them.
   
  As expected (for Kenwoods and 15's), the Kenwoods are on the warm side. There is a very strong bass response all the way down and a balanced midrange and highs. There is definite overlap on the crossover frequencies that causes voices to sound "large." I'm not sure how to describe it, It's like listening to a tube amp, distortion-wise, though I know the inputs are clean from the SX-1980. The detail level is very good, but the noise floor keeps them from perfect resolution.. It would be good for vinyl, rock, club/house, and probably live recordings, but maybe not electronic/other music with a lot of headroom.
   
  The Pioneer S-710's have replacement woofers in them so take anything bass related with a grain of salt. From the ribbon tweeter, the highs were impressive. Incredibly clear highs. Really spot on clarity. I can see why people pull these tweeters to put in other speakers. The midrange was near-clinical with low, barely noticeable distortion. Good resolution of details, but not quite as outstanding as the tweeter. The replacement woofers are good quality vintage Rolas, look like fiber-added sandwich manufacturing, have very heavy drivers, and are probably an appropriate and good replacement. HPM woofers might be more brand appropriate, but these are the ones I have now. They cost about the same either way. Speaking of the bass, it was still good. Since the woofers are smaller than the kenwoods, the bass sounds best when the highs are turned down on the speakers (giving it a little help). The total clarity of the highs make these speakers winners. The speakers were overall low distortion and would be good for most music and amp types.
   
  Regarding the McIntosh XR-16's - they're perfect and you can't have them haha. They are easily in the top 3 speakers I have ever listened to. They have no noticeable distortion, good tight bass, mid, and high response, and are perfectly flat from about 20 hz to 50khz. If you like the heart stopping bass, you can equalize up the very low bass a bit. I like to add ~3db to the 15-50 hz range with music so that I can feel the deep bass in my chest even at low levels. I'm hoping the XR-14's are as good as the 16's once I get them going.
   
  Hiding in the corner there are some Jensen TF-3's. I couldn't find parts so I'm parting them out so other people can find parts for theirs. They sounded pretty good, even down a tweeter. Very warm, good for rock/classic rock/guitars.


----------



## PhoenixG

Quote: 





oregonian said:


> I'm using some thick yet extremely soft and pliable Monster cable I found at Best Buy for my vintage hook ups. It fits the tiny hole.....barely. I also use banana clips whenever I can as well like on the Klipsch speakers. It didn't say what gauge it was anywhere on the reel BTW.


 
  That's the same cable I use, Monster-XR. I found 50ft on sale at radio shack for $11 once haha! I was extremely excited about that. It doesn't say a gauge, but it is 14 gauge. Nice, low capacitance and well made. If you need it to be slightly smaller, you can find/cut out the strengthening cord they wrap the wires around (only at the tips!). That'll get you a final half millimeter or so to play with.


----------



## captouch

matttcg said:


> I hesitate to ask this question, but...most of the heavy gauge speaker wire that I have is difficult to use with vintage speakers and amps due to the smaller  binding post. I was thinking of grabbing some of this:
> 
> http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm
> 
> If you guys have better suggestions, please let me know. Soft and flexible/smaller gauge is my objective and I'm not looking to spend lot's of money.




How about pin termination? The ends are small enough to fit into vintage speaker outputs and would work with just about everything except screw outputs. And you could use as thick wire as you wanted.

I've thought about this, but been too lazy to buy the parts.

From a signal integrity standpoint, I don't know how pins compare to bananas, spades, etc, but just seems like a more flexible firm factor.


----------



## bce22

Wowza phoenix!
   
  Thanks for the impression. Those McIntosh XR-16s sound super sweet.  If you don't mind me asking, what did they cost?


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> I hesitate to ask this question, but...most of the heavy gauge speaker wire that I have is difficult to use with vintage speakers and amps due to the smaller  binding post. I was thinking of grabbing some of this:
> 
> http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm
> 
> If you guys have better suggestions, please let me know. Soft and flexible/smaller gauge is my objective and I'm not looking to spend lot's of money.


 
   
  I use clear day cables (silver).  The guy who makes them is just about the nicest person I have ever dealt with and his prices are very reasonable for what you get.  He will terminate them however you want so that you can make then fit and are quite flexible.  They are well reviewed on AudioGon - that is where I found out about them.  http://www.cleardaycables.com/


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks guys!! Much appreciated.


----------



## Trav

Matt I'm doing the "White Lightning" cables when I get home.


----------



## MattTCG

Can you only get those in Alabama? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I can make that joke because I'm from there.


----------



## Trav

Lol found the thread on 6 Moons. I think TSA would find them suspect. BTW WAR EAGLE!


----------



## BearWant

Somebody better snatch "the wall of sound" up while they still can http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/mld/ele/3921897167.html


----------



## calipilot227

14 speakers wired in parallel.... assuming 8-ohm impedance per speaker.... sounds like a great way to blow up an amp!


----------



## PhoenixG

HAHA! Next up on "what not to do"...


----------



## PhoenixG

The replacement part came in for the McIntosh XR-14's! So of course it's in and I took them for a spin.
   
  I compared them to the XR-16's and my Sansui SP5500x speakers, AKA my "keeper" system. The Sansui's are a lot more efficient, but have a distinct, slightly warm-ish signature. They're clear with good full range resolution, but they aren't as transparent as the Mc's. They're definitely not quite in the same league as the Mc's, but they're still very good (and good value too!) and deserving of a spot in my keeper system.
   
  The XR-14's have the typical (for the brand) low near-zero distortion that I was hoping for. Very flat response down to about 100hz, with sweet (but even and balanced) highs and mids. They sound similar to the XR-16's except for low and very low bass response. Long story short, they are kinda thin in the deep bass department. They really do need the MQ102 equalizer that was designed for them, but in a pinch, adding 6-10db of very deep bass and 3db around 100 hz will do most of it (or just using the loudness button the the 1980 - that was pure magic). On an aside, when I had them apart, I looked at the crossovers. Those things are incredibly complex. Looked like over a dozen discrete components. Very beefy too.


----------



## NU62

I use Blue Jeans speaker cable (Belden 10 gauge 5T00P) on my vintage floor standing Altecs.  Excellent quality and great customer service.  I looked at the Blue Jeans website recently and noticed that they are now offering pin terminations for speaker cable.  Recommend without hesitation.


----------



## MattTCG

^^ I ordered the bluejeans speaker cables. They should serve my purpose well. 
   
  Secondly, I got in my KLH model 38 speakers today. Expectations are exceeded. The sound is just wonderful...smooth, mellow, tight deep bass, non fatiguing...just what I was looking for.  I picked them up for $125 shipped. The cabinet are mint. Today is a good day.


----------



## MattTCG

Can I get some opinions on where the best placement is for the new speakers? 

They could go on stands far left and right. They could also go on the bar.


----------



## Silent One

At this point, MattTCG, in the middle of the fairway.... literally! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Your spree will soon have your gear outdoors. Let me revisit the pix though, and weigh-in shortly...
   
   
  Size? Your selected "Sweet spot?" How much audible territory are you being given from your most wonderful partner?
   
   
   
  Update: 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Yes, I decided to scroll "up" and got my answer. And you're "up" to some good stuff btw!


----------



## MattTCG

Well, the desk is about 6 feet wide. I could put them on the desk itself on the far left and right corner but they are largish and would be really close to me. 
   
  I think that up on the bar would be a nice large sound stage. It's about 10 feet and would put them just above my shoulders. Most importantly though, the bar crosses into the little woman's domain. She would most certainly give me the serious stink eye and could possibly put the full on ki-bosh on me. 
   
  Ultimately I guess that I've got to just set them up in different places and audition them. Good grief these sound sweet!! I haven't even heard them on the Sansui yet, just the Pioneer. Pics coming up...


----------



## MattTCG

If you don't find these "vintage sexy" you need to check your pulse.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Can I get some opinions on where the best placement is for the new speakers?
> 
> They could go on stands far left and right. They could also go on the bar.


 

 Far left and right................no way they go on the bar.  The little woman would not like that infringement.  Get some stands and put them on the floor.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> If you don't find these "vintage sexy" you need to check your pulse.


 

 Hard to get a perspective on size.  How tall are they?  28"?


----------



## MattTCG

22x12x9 I believe. I'm just amazed at the condition. The pictures really don't do them justice. You'd be hard pressed to find a mark on them. 
   
  So who has some speakers stands for sale?


----------



## Silent One

Vision ~
   





 To see those speakers set on the bar would be to see your belongings set on the porch!


----------



## MattTCG

silent one said:


> Vision ~
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Ahhh...I see that you must be married.


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Ahhh...I see that you must be married.


 
   
  I've not yet had the experience. However, being _silent_ has allowed me to take in a great deal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 through observation.


----------



## MattTCG

Screw it. I'm putting these speakers where I think that they'll sound best. I can sleep on the couch. I've had plenty of practice.


----------



## moodyrn

Those are really nice looking speakers Matt!! I second the recommendation on getting some nice stands and stretch them wide. But I would also experiment and find the best place both sonically and what the wife would allow. And hopefully you can stay away from the couch. I got really close to the couch when I brought home the massive cornwalls.


----------



## MattTCG

Okay, I'm in a bit trouble. When you're married to a real Southern girl and you hear these words, "oh, hell no you didn't." There's bound to be a little trouble. 
   
  In all seriousness they do sound good on top of the bar. Maybe they lost a little bass impact  because there is no wall behind them. So where do I get some nice wood stands from? Does anyone have some for sale?


----------



## Skylab

How high off the flow do you want the speakers?


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Okay, I'm in a bit trouble. When you're married to a real Southern girl and you hear these words, "oh, hell no you didn't." There's bound to be a little trouble.
> 
> In all seriousness they do sound good on top of the bar. Maybe they lost a little bass impact  because there is no wall behind them. So where do I get some nice wood stands from? Does anyone have some for sale?


 
  Well... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 that Southern girl WAS the imaginary wall behind them! With a bad vibe no less. I know, I hail from a NOLA family.


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





skylab said:


> How high off the flow do you want the speakers?


 
   
  The bottom of the cabinet should be approximately 24" or so off the floor. 
   
  Gentleman, I feel like I'm hearing speakers for the first time. I am now and always will be a headphone guy. It is my passion for which I'm truly dedicated to...but I must add that the vintage speakers have opened my eyes to what "real speakers" can do. The imaging and sense of space is just jaw dropping. What scares me is that these are just lowly KLH mid-sized bookshelf speakers.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> The bottom of the cabinet should be approximately 24" or so off the floor.
> 
> Gentleman, I feel like I'm hearing speakers for the first time. I am now and always will be a headphone guy. It is my passion for which I'm truly dedicated to...but I must add that the vintage speakers have opened my eyes to what "real speakers" can do. The imaging and sense of space is just jaw dropping. What scares me is that these are just lowly KLH mid-sized bookshelf speakers.


 

 What's the WPC of that SX-650?  And the Sansui?


----------



## Skylab

Ok, sorry, I don't have any stands that tall.


----------



## MattTCG

oregonian said:


> What's the WPC of that SX-650?  And the Sansui?




The Sansui is about 125 and the Pioneer is rated at only 35 wpc but feels like a lot more than that. Which amp is best suited for the KLH's?


----------



## pfloyd

Quote: 





speakerbox said:


> Yup - got a pair of the New Large Advents in my basement system.  These are the two ways with the fried egg tweeter.  Awesome sound!


 
   
  Quote: 





craigster75 said:


> I consider my Advents to hold their own against current models and don't feel like technology related to sound quality has changed much with modern mid-level speakers like Definitive Technology or Polk.  Also, classic brands like JBL and Infiniti put out inferior products today compared to 25  years ago IMO.  I do feel the top end speakers are stellar today (a.k.a. B&W)
> I still remember how good the high end was with my old Inifiniti EMIT tweeters.  What does everyone think about general sound of today's loudspeakers vs. a generation ago?


 
    I grew up listening to 4 original advents stacked in a parallel array jamming to pink floyd, elp and elo.  I recently ran into a pair of new advent loudspeakers at a consignment store with the traditional dried out woofer surrounds that I refoamed and now currently use them as my mains as my klipsch rf82's were relegated to surround duty as the advents blow them away! In the garage I have a pair of Infinity RS-7's (with emit tweeters) paired with a pair of cambridge soundworks ensembles ( also designed by henry kloss of advent fame) powered by a kenwood super eleven receiver that absolutely rocks!  Ain't vintage AWESOME!


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> The bottom of the cabinet should be approximately 24" or so off the floor.
> 
> Gentleman, I feel like I'm hearing speakers for the first time. I am now and always will be a headphone guy. It is my passion for which I'm truly dedicated to...but I must add that the vintage speakers have opened my eyes to what "real speakers" can do. The imaging and sense of space is just jaw dropping. What scares me is that these are just lowly KLH mid-sized bookshelf speakers.


 
   
  If you want a real jaw dropper - but still vintage try Dahlquist DQ10s.  Awesome!


----------



## ev13wt

matttcg said:


> Gentleman, I feel like I'm hearing speakers for the first time. I am now and always will be a headphone guy. It is my passion for which I'm truly dedicated to...but I must add that the vintage speakers have opened my eyes to what "real speakers" can do. The imaging and sense of space is just jaw dropping.




Happens every time I turn on my main rig to listen to some music.


----------



## MattTCG

Based on suggestions here, I decided to try some bluejeans cable speaker wire. I received the cable and it appears well built. Even though I ordered a higher gauge cable to be sure that it would fit the binding post on the speakers, it doesn't. The back of my KLH speakers only has a small screw and a small washer with "teeth." What can I do or buy to make it easier to attach the cable to speakers posts? 
   
  thanks..


----------



## BearWant

Speaking of Dahlquist... Just ran into Dahlquist dq18s in excellent condition buyer wants 300 locally. Couldn't find too much regarding pricing and there was conflicting info.. However reviews that I could find stated clarity and detail which got me excited as I'm an ety guy moving to speakers 

What is a reasonable offer or should I be running to pick them up at that price... Also I only have a Nad 7150 and as of yesterday a pioneer sx-650 (don't worry matt I'll soon introduce her in the receiver thread)... Will these power them reasonably well they seem to need a lot? I do plan acquiring more power in the future


----------



## Oregonian

matttcg said:


> Based on suggestions here, I decided to try some bluejeans cable speaker wire. I received the cable and it appears well built. Even though I ordered a higher gauge cable to be sure that it would fit the binding post on the speakers, it doesn't. The back of my KLH speakers only has a small screw and a small washer with "teeth." What can I do or buy to make it easier to attach the cable to speakers posts?
> 
> thanks..




Radio Shack has quality spade terminals you can use for that. I think they are stainless or something like that. Crimp to the wire and easy.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





bearwant said:


> Speaking of Dahlquist... Just ran into Dahlquist dq18s in excellent condition buyer wants 300 locally. Couldn't find too much regarding pricing and there was conflicting info.. However reviews that I could find stated clarity and detail which got me excited as I'm an ety guy moving to speakers
> 
> What is a reasonable offer or should I be running to pick them up at that price... Also I only have a Nad 7150 and as of yesterday a pioneer sx-650 (don't worry matt I'll soon introduce her in the receiver thread)... Will these power them reasonably well they seem to need a lot? I do plan acquiring more power in the future


 
   
  Not familiar with the 18s, but know the 10s are fairly power hungry (friend had them in college and drove them with GAS Ampzilla).  As a side note - many say that the DQ 20s were even better than the 10s.  Hoping I stumble on a pair to audition at some point.


----------



## MattTCG

I'm struggling to place my KLH speakers in the right/best location. Ultimately this is an experiment of trial and error to find that best performance. My question is this...how important is it for the KLH or any speakers to be placed near a back wall? I speculate that this effect bass response the most. In my bedroom which is carpet...with the speakers forming a triangle with my chair and about foot from the back wall is where the KLH sound the best. 
   
  I just don't have the right space in my computer room to set them up for the best sound. They are placed about two feet too high and are sitting on the bar over my computer desk with no wall behind them. 
   

   
  They are not pictured here but you get the idea.


----------



## Meewoo

If your KHL is sealed box, then you don't have to worry about back wall too much. It surely affects sound image (a little?), but I don't think you will notice the difference (at this level). I think you already know that ideal speaker placement is that tweeters are horizontal with your ears. So I don't think putting them on the bar will satisfy you. Maybe upsidedown placement solve problem for you.
  Haha, i am still a newbie in speakers placement.


----------



## MattTCG

They cabinets are sealed afaik. I wonder what flipping them upside down would actually do. If it sounded "right" then I could just flip the grills and be done.


----------



## lugnut

Matt, this link  is to classic speaker forum. It covers vintage speakers what is referred to east coast sound, speakers. It covers KLH, Advent, Allison, Acoustic Research and many more from the vintage era. Each brand of speakers has its own forum and there is great information in them. 
  Sorry if this web site has already been mentioned. Thanks 
http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/IP.Board/index.php?act=idx


----------



## MattTCG

^^ Thank you kindly for link. Headed to get a little education.


----------



## Meewoo

Check Misssion speakers http://www.mission.co.uk/Default.aspx?lang=En
  Most their bookshelf speakers are woofer top, tweeter beneath design.


----------



## MattTCG

I'll try them upside down as well as on their side. I know that KLH made some models that were meant to be positioned horizontally.


----------



## Trav

You find a set of KLH 9 under a grand under a grand let me know? Lol


----------



## joehalo

An idea what kind of speakers these are?


----------



## Meewoo

Could this be Bozak Symphony like this one http://app.audiogon.com/listings/full-range-bozak-b-4000a-symphony-no-1-2013-04-15-speakers-03269 ?


----------



## MattTCG

Need some opinions please. A pair of Sansui sp1200's popped up for a local sale. The condition is almost mint. I know nothing about these is terms of sound signature or fair price. Any advice is appreciated. 
   
  Oh, the speakers are offered for $175 with local pickup.


----------



## PhoenixG

I see those a lot. They are neutral warm, without too much distortion. I think a fair price is more like $80 for the pair, though I often see people ask $200/pair. If you want sansuii's hold out for sp5500x's. They're just.... better.


----------



## MattTCG

Where does one acquire cloth for vintage speakers grill for a restoration project? 
   
  thanks...


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Where does one acquire cloth for vintage speakers grill for a restoration project?
> 
> thanks...


 
   
  Check here http://www.parts-express.com/cat/speaker-grill-cloth-fabric/319


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks Meewoo...I think that I asked this question several weeks ago but didn't end up needed to do the restoration. Sorry for the redundancy.


----------



## MattTCG

Oh crap, nobody is bidding on another pair of speakers that I low balled on ebay. 12 hours left. If I win another pair I will need to sleep on somebody's couch for sure. On the bright side, I'll be bringing some sweet speakers with me.


----------



## MattTCG

Lets say for giggles that I was thinking of mounting some dynaco's near the ceiling corners in my bedroom. How would they sound up there provided that they were angled properly? And how would you go about mounting them there?


----------



## Skylab

About the only advice I can give you is that if you do that, make sure the tweeters are down and the woofers are up toward the ceiling.


----------



## BearWant

Anyone else know anything about the Dahlquist DQ-18?  They are back for sale locally on craiglist again for $270, something about them just calls to me, and I'm chomping at the bit.  I know I wouldn't be able to power them appropriately, but I'm looking down the road here.


----------



## MattTCG

If I wanted to add a small sub to my vintage speaker/receiver setup, is this possible? There is no sub out on the receiver of course. The sub is a Polk PSW10 active.
   
  thanks...


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> If I wanted to add a small sub to my vintage speaker/receiver setup, is this possible? There is no sub out on the receiver of course. The sub is a Polk PSW10 active.
> 
> thanks...


 

 When I was picking up my Spec 2 amp last Saturday there was a guy talking to the Guru about this................all I overheard was "use the B speaker connections via RCA/Lineout"...................sorry I wasn't part of the conversation but I'm sure someone here or on AK can guide you. 
   
  It can be done is what I believe.


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks O...I'll check into it.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Thanks O...I'll check into it.


 

 Post up what you find.  I'm interested in it for my computer room TV system.


----------



## Skylab

That's the right way - assuming you have a receiver with both an A and B speaker out, get a sub that is powered of course but has speaker-level inputs, which must do.  Very easy.


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





skylab said:


> That's the right way - assuming you have a receiver with both an A and B speaker out, get a sub that is powered of course but has speaker-level inputs, which must do.  Very easy.


 

 So how close was I?  Do you use a Schosche line out thingie into RCA's into the powered sub?   Or are you saying the sub should be speaker wire acceptance type?  (Sorry, kind of butchered that question).   That may be very interesting to try myself. 
   
  By the way Skylab - did you sell all your Darth Beyers?  I have a pair on the way..............going to try to revive that niche!


----------



## Skylab

Just to be clear, many if not most powered subs have speaker level inputs, which are simply converted in the subwoofer to line level before amplification.  This allows a very easy connection scheme to a vintage amp or receiver that has A/B speaker inputs where the user is only connecting one pair of speakers - the sub gets connected to the B speaker terminals, but because it it powered, essentially presents no load on the amp/receiver.


----------



## MattTCG

Another question guys. I have two pair of Vintage speakers. One KLH 38's and Dynaco a25's. Overall, I enjoy the KLH more. It just seems to suit my ear better for tone particularly with the mids. I tried stacking the KLH and Dynaco and while I did enjoy the increased "presence" of sound, the tone got kinda wonky. So now I'm thinking to sell off the Dynaco's and get another set of closely matched KLH to stack. 
   
  If I'm way off on this, feel free to say so.
   
  thanks...


----------



## Skylab

I have never understood the idea of running two pairs of speakers full range at the same time.  I DO run my S-901's at the same time as my B&W DM-16's *BUT* basically only as a non-powered subwoofer - I have an 80 Hz low pass filter in line with the S-910's.


----------



## MattTCG

Could I do the same thing with the Dynaco's? Just use them to add a little bottom end?


----------



## Skylab

Indeed you could.  You just need to add a pair of these in line:
   
  http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=266-442


----------



## PhoenixG

I'm a little blue today - someone offered me a crazy fistful 'o money for my favorite speakers (that I didn't even have for sale...), so I had to say yes. Now I'm down to one pair of McIntosh's. I hope I find another set of XR-14's/16's soon...


----------



## MattTCG

It's hard to let go of favorites. I've got a guy offering me crazy money for my Sansui 9090db. I'm completely in love with the Sansui but I have to admit that he has my attention.


----------



## PhoenixG

Amen to that, haha. I've got a friend with a 7070db kicking around that he'd part with if your friend wants to make an offer. He's always been more of a JBL guy.


----------



## Trav

matttcg said:


> It's hard to let go of favorites. I've got a guy offering me crazy money for my Sansui 9090db. I'm completely in love with the Sansui but I have to admit that he has my attention.


Sell it and start a SX 1980 savings account...


----------



## MattTCG

^^ Don't need one. You'll understand once you get my bill for the package I sent you.


----------



## Silent One

Should someone leave their M3 parked in my driveway with the Pink slip, I'll call them a cab for the G-22K.


----------



## PhoenixG

Funny you should mention that - wanting to get this guy played a major role in my decision to sell my XR-16's


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





oregonian said:


> >
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sorry to go of topic
   
  Oregon, I still own mine and i have to say i will never sell my deep cup and custom made snakewood and ebony darths.
   
  i love them and think they sound better out of my realistic and luxman vintage receivers than from any other amp ive tried.
   
  i like them better than my he500s with some music and just as much as others.
   
  when you take into account i also own the pioneer se-a1000s i could live without my he500s pretty easily.  They will be the first thing i sell if i need cash to finance my new vintage obsession.
   
  oh and Larry is one hell of a great guy!
   
  back to the normally scheduled program


----------



## Skylab

I did sell all my Darths, but sometimes I wish I had kept the deep cup Cocobolo ones


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





skylab said:


> I did sell all my Darths, but sometimes I wish I had kept the deep cup Cocobolo ones


 
   
  Oh I remember those!
   
  Truly they were one of the most beautiful headphones ever made!  Cocobolo FTW!


----------



## Oregonian

skylab said:


> I did sell all my Darths, but sometimes I wish I had kept the deep cup Cocobolo ones




I've read the pics thread and saw your collection. Amazing. And the Cocobolo's........tasty.


----------



## calipilot227

New covers and stands for the Mach Ones, and a new Speedlite for my camera


----------



## Skylab

Man those look GREAT! Nice.


----------



## bce22

Cali,
   
  I have Mach Ones. What stands are those?


----------



## calipilot227

These appear to be the same stands. I bought them on eBay. They were hand-made by the seller in his metal shop, filled with sand and powder coated. The craftsmanship is excellent, well worth the price 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Metal-Speaker-Stands-11-0-D-X-14-0-W-X10-75-H-Vintage-Audio-Home-Theater-Sys-DJ-/261257432610?pt=US_Speaker_Mounts_Stands&hash=item3cd4280e22
   
  Edit: I have confirmed, these are indeed the same stands. Well worth the price.


----------



## PhoenixG

Just brought this guy home today. I sold my Mac's to get this, but it has a HK sound system. So that counts as speaker stuff, right?


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


> Just brought this guy home today. I sold my Mac's to get this, but it has a HK sound system. So that counts as speaker stuff, right?


 
   
  Congrats! my fellow BMWCCA'er...


----------



## PhoenixG

It was between that and an M5, and after a thrilling test drive, my wife put the kebash on the M. To be fair, it had like a 45lb clutch, exhausting in the local traffic. Um, er, the M5 had the better sound system by a little, but it had an already outmoded touch screen interface, and you couldn't hear it over the car. The 330i ZHP had the premium HK sound as well, but fewer speakers and easier to hear.
  Both sound better than my current BMW convertible, since you can't hear jack over the wind and these cars have roofs. 
  There. Tied it in.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Hi all, got tired of my old KEF speakers being unstable on the stands I had, and decided to make some home made outriggers.  Here are some pictures.  The picture below shows them shortly after assembly.  I found the metal brackets in the trash, cleaned them up, painted them, and mounted them to two hunks of oak cut to the size of my speakers.  Also put a brace on the underside to prevent bowing and cut two holes in the middle to allow them to be thumscrewed into the speaker base.
   

   
  Here you see the underside of the speaker with threaded inserts added to allow the thumbscrews to be attached.

   
  Here is one with the heavy duty spikes added.  This essentially anchors the speakers to the wood floor.
   

   
  Here is the speaker attached and ready to go....
   

   
  I noticed an immediate improvement in base definition and overall clarity due to lack of vibration.  Even my wife commented that it sounded better.


----------



## MattTCG

Question...I recently, yesterday, picked up a nice pair of Large Advents...the newer ones. Will the Pioneer sx-1280 be a good match. I usually listen at about 10:00 on the pot. 
   
  thanks...


----------



## PhoenixG

The nice thing about those pioneers is that they have a fairly flat response, which means you're hearing more of the speaker's signature. If you like how the speaker's generally from any neutral receiver, then you'll like how they sound.


----------



## MattTCG

Thanks for the input Phoenix!!


----------



## digitalmind

Yey new amp day,
   
   

   
   
  Subtle improvement compared to the 12 watt Hiraga. Bit less up front but the idea of having plenty headroom is nice.


----------



## Skylab

Nice, Rik! Is that a POA-1500?


----------



## digitalmind

>


 
   
  Oh wow!


----------



## digitalmind

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Nice, Rik! Is that a POA-1500?


 
   
  Yes Rob, with a PRA 1000 pre. I'm not sure the preamp can match the one that I already had, so there's some swapping to do.
  The guy I bought it from had a beautiful black Akai system, all with wooden panels in perfect shape. Didn't know they made that kind of quality stuff..Looked very very nice.
   
  I think I will start looking for a DCD-1800 to match the set.


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





digitalmind said:


> Yey new amp day,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Oh my!! The meters are luscious...


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





digitalmind said:


> Oh wow!


 

 Is that a short person or are those MASSIVE speakers?


----------



## MattTCG

The guy is very tall!!


----------



## bce22

Those Cornwalls are pretty massive, but also that's my brother Scott and he's short. No more than 5'6".

Sent from my HTCEVOV4G using Tapatalk 2


----------



## moodyrn

I'm 6'1" 300lbs and my cornwalls make me look pretty small lol. The funny thing is, they take up less space in the room than any floor standing speakers I've owned because they sit up right against the wall. That's one thing I really love bout them.


----------



## scottiebabie

hey guys, ive been away for abit...new city new job & now new house to be moved into in end of Sept. in anticipation of added space, ive been on the watch on the local buysell (kijiji is big here) for a pair of klipsch heritages esp LaBelles -lov da look- til i came across whats shown below. price was right so i couldnt help myself but dip into the cookie jar for some honey.........
   

   

   

   
  freakin thangs are insanely heavy & i seriously huffed & puffed bringing them from the sellers apt to my car & then to the house! dont have them placed anywhere close to optimum as yet as i dont move to the new house til end of Sept but where i have them now, they are seriously rock! very extended & can be even aggressive up top, forward but smooth mids & tight bass though ive heard deeper from others. big full soundstage & super detailed (as good as anything ive heard & even approaches T1/HD800 territory). 
   
  due to the old school spring loaded binders, im only using cheap radio shack 18g cords & ive only got sitting on a coupla bricks for the moment. despite all that, im amazed how they sound despite the age. top of cabinet has some fairly bad scratches so i will have to look into restaining or even refinishing. otherwise im pretty stoked!!!


----------



## bce22

My brand new Crites cornwall crossovers and new tweeter horns arrived today.  No time to install until Sunday.  pics and first impressions to follow before the weekend is out.


----------



## Skylab

Very nice, Scottie!!!! The fabled NS-1000. Never heard a pair but would sure like to someday! Congrats. And it's nice to "see" you here!


----------



## bce22

Scottie,
   
  Those are MEAN looking.  i want more impressions STAT!


----------



## scottiebabie

now for part deux......got these as a package deal for song & a dance + sellers delivering them to my city on labor day weekend (2weeks from now). photos are from seller & he says they belonged to his grandpa who recently passed. cant wait for a showdown with the Yamis


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





skylab said:


> Very nice, Scottie!!!! The fabled NS-1000. Never heard a pair but would sure like to someday! Congrats. And it's nice to "see" you here!


 
   
  hey Rob, thxs for the welcome...home! hahaha. i figure if im gonna come, best come big!! yaa been hearing about these yamis for the longest but never thought i'd have the opportunity to own a pair. i'd never pay what ppl are asking on ebay but hey, when opportunity arises, how can i but not strike! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Quote: 





bce22 said:


> Scottie,
> 
> Those are MEAN looking.  i want more impressions STAT!


 
   
  thxs bud. there are pretty intimidating in the studio monitor kinda way!


----------



## Steve Eddy

scottiebabie said:


> now for part deux......got these as a package deal for song & a dance + sellers delivering them to my city on labor day weekend (2weeks from now). photos are from seller & he says they belonged to his grandpa who recently passed. cant wait for a showdown with the Yamis




Puttin' my bet on the Pioneers (I own a pair of those).

se


----------



## scottiebabie

u got it Steve...they are Pioneer CS-99a with a SA-8100 thrown in for good measure. seller says they are mint with the top of the cabinet slightly faded so i hope some wood oil will make it shine! since u have it, how does it sound to u? boys at AK pans them quite a bit but they seem to fetch big bucks on ebay. at the price i got them, i thought its worth it to try em out. tell me wotcha think of them sonically as i love the esthetics.
   
  on the subject of sound, i wasnt bowled over at the initial 5mins but after 3hrs of continuous listening (on crappy speaker cables i mite add), im really likin the Yami NS1k. horns sounds amazing on them & they bring a new level of excitement to the table, its almost like a live performance. clarity, speed & micro details are off the charts & while bass seems a tad short at 1st, one realizes after getting into the music that its all there but its just that the NS-1k are so overwhelming in mids & esp highs that the bass is less noticed.
   
  listening to them in the dark is a thrilling experience indeed!


----------



## Steve Eddy

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> u got it Steve...they are Pioneer CS-99a with a SA-8100 thrown in for good measure. seller says they are mint with the top of the cabinet slightly faded so i hope some wood oil will make it shine! since u have it, how does it sound to u? boys at AK pans them quite a bit but they seem to fetch big bucks on ebay. at the price i got them, i thought its worth it to try em out. tell me wotcha think of them sonically as i love the esthetics.
> 
> on the subject of sound, i wasnt bowled over at the initial 5mins but after 3hrs of continuous listening (on crappy speaker cables i mite add), im really likin the Yami NS1k. horns sounds amazing on them & they bring a new level of excitement to the table, its almost like a live performance. clarity, speed & micro details are off the charts & while bass seems a tad short at 1st, one realizes after getting into the music that its all there but its just that the NS-1k are so overwhelming in mids & esp highs that the bass is less noticed.
> 
> listening to them in the dark is a thrilling experience indeed!


 
   
  I quite like them. They're a good "fun" loudspeaker. Great for crankin' up some rock, funk, or other lively music while you're up out of your seat air guitaring or just moving to the music. But then I'm a bit biased toward them as they were the speakers I got with my first "real" stereo system (paired with an SA-7700 and a turntable whose model number escapes me now) back in '76 shortly after I got my first "real" job. I traded that system for a guitar and amp several years later and soon regretted it. I bought the pair I have now about 5 or 6 years ago and they're now being powered by a not-quite-so-vintage TEAC A-H500 integrated.
   
  se


----------



## Trav

Wow NS 1k in the house! One of my all time favs! They look very nice. Good score.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> Puttin' my bet on the Pioneers (I own a pair of those).
> 
> se


 
   
  Quote: 





steve eddy said:


> I quite like them. They're a good "fun" loudspeaker.


 
   
  Yeah, I was shocked by your bet. Now "fun" makes sense. I heard CS-88a ans CS-99, I never understand why they fetch such high price. I think they are just like Justin Bieber, I just can't understand. I also tried Hpm-60 and HPm-900, they were considered a little better than CS series. But I still can't like them. Those HF and MF off axle designs just destroy sound image when playing complex music. Although they can reproduce sound almost similar to  the sound of garage band. In one sentence, they are not hi-fi speakers.
   
  @scottie,
  Wow, you sir can really describe the sound, just amazing!!


----------



## scottiebabie

hahaha thxs guys. the pair of NS-1k arent in the best of condition esthetics wise - top of cabinet has some nasty scratches & paint chips while a coupla edges are chipped. hopefully i fill up some with wood putty & repair it. worse case, i can get it re-veneered. i think the NS-1k would look hot with some burled wood finish 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  sonically, they seem to be spot on, very revealing of upstream gear. with the wrong amp (& lousy source), i can see how some mite find the NS-1k harsh & screechy. on mine, some recordings can be a bit too "aggressive" but overall, they are damn good even compared to modern audiophile speakers. 40yrs ago, these things are wayyy beyond its time. IMO bad press is cos folks drive em with un-synergistic ancillaries.
   
  im guessing this is Yamaha's interpretation of the GIGO principal. but when they get it right, they GET IT RIGHT! to my ears this is Grado PS1000 + Beyer T1 in sonics. the music is so alive & sounds incredible with unplugged albums.


----------



## PhoenixG

I am laughing terribly here. I've gotten familiar with all of those pioneer models you just mentioned (HPM, CS) and I completely agree with your impressions. Apart from the HPM 150's (top 3 of all time), I have to say that the HPM series was fun, but not what I was looking for ( a bit too warm), while the CS series were just not as good (almost like listening to good speakers that have been wrapped in single ply saran wrap), but decent for good energetic loud music. I had someone offer me a free set of the CS-16G's (or a number similar to that) and I didn't want them. I gave them to a friend who is just getting his first vintage rig together.
   
  I have high hope for those yamahas!


----------



## moodyrn

I hate to pour water on a drowning horse, but I owned the cs99a for maybe a week. I really wanted a pair based on the looks and apparent build quality. But after reading how much people over at ak hated them, I decided to wait until I could score a pair cheap. I ened up scoring a decent pair for 180.00, a steal compared to ebay prices where I've seen some go for a grand. Wow was I disappointed. The 180.00 I paid was too much. I priced them really cheap just to get rid of them fast. They didn't sound nearly as good as they looked. Though the build was excellent, and they looked really cool. The sound wasn't horrible. I can see somebody putting them in a garage just to play them really loud to rock out. But other than that......
   
   
  Wow welcome back Scottie!!  Glad to see back around these parts.


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





moodyrn said:


> I hate to pour water on a drowning horse, but I owned the cs99a for maybe a week. I really wanted a pair based on the looks and apparent build quality. But after reading how much people over at ak hated them, I decided to wait until I could score a pair cheap. I ened up scoring a decent pair for 180.00, a steal compared to ebay prices where I've seen some go for a grand. Wow was I disappointed. The 180.00 I paid was too much. I priced them really cheap just to get rid of them fast. They didn't sound nearly as good as they looked. Though the build was excellent, and they looked really cool. The sound wasn't horrible. I can see somebody putting them in a garage just to play them really loud to rock out. But other than that......
> 
> 
> Wow welcome back Scottie!!  Glad to see back around these parts.


 
  thxs for the welcome Moodryn, am glad to be back in these parts too. been away too long but Scotties BACK & hopefully in a big way! lols.
   
  yaa theres so much controversy on these CS99a that i dont know which way to turn except to take a gander at them myself. i hope they turn out good as im really diggin the kabuki stylin! if not, then i'll blow em out as i snagged them at a stonkin deal with a SA-8100 included. im sure i can easily get back what i paid.
   
  its sunday & i finally found some time to place them NS1ks a bit better -bout 18" from the back wall away from any side walls. ive been listening to "Salsa, Samba & Santana" & the NS1ks are seriously ROCKIN' IT!!! most systems ive listen with this album either makes me crinch or fall into a coma. Santana can be so dynamic, so quick with so much going but the NS1k isnt losing a beat. everything is so... ......ALIVE (for lack of a better word).  
   
  but ofcos, im (slightly 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) augmenting the 50hz roll off with one of these....
   

   

   
   
  not quite vintage but its all i can some up with in a pinch


----------



## scottiebabie

WOW just WOW! somewhere btwn 12pm noon to 5pm, the sound of the NS1k just "opened" up! left it running & went out & just came home a few mins ago & i coulda swear these are not the same as before i left the house!
   
  similiar (albeit via seat of pants dbmeter) volume only takes 1/3 less travel on volume knob. bottom filled out & highs got smoother! how the "ell did this happen?? these are amost 40yr old speaker fer gads sake! maybe the previous owner hasnt run it for a while & it takes a coupla days to "loosen" up the drivers?? whatever, it sounds amazing now! ive also moved it to approx 8" from the wall which augments the bass response even more. i dont need no subs now!
   
  to be absolutely honest, i was never a Yamaha speaker fan but only got these NS1k in part for its iconic status, its collectability, my curiousity, it was a local pickup & cos i didnt have to pay the crazy ebay prices. from research, i was expecting some quick extended mids/highs but possibly harsh highs & less than optimum or even non existent bass. on 1st 10mins listening, i gotta admit my expectations wasnt too far off - better than i read but no where close to its rep as one of the best speakers for its time. more listening revealed more of its good qualities - lightning quick mids&highs that launches micro details out at me, good but not outstanding soundstage, better bass but still considered less than adequate esp for its 12" woofers (which was why i hooked up the sunfire sub for some added body).
   
  5hrs of continous playing later, my NS1k is now a beast! all the +ve's minus the -ve's thats was apparent even this morning! clean, clear, articulate, detailed, fulled bodied, slamming bass (though not as deep as i can hear on the HD800) & now added mid sweetness & smoother highs. the differences are now in the amplification.
   
  driven by the 150w@8ohm LSA/DK Design VS.1 MkIII integrated, the NS1k are very detailed, big sounding, wide stage, tight bass but very upfront in yourself ala grados. on the Audio Space 300b 21w@8ohm P/P, everything is softer, mellower (if thats possible with NS1ks) more organic with less in your face mids ala son of HD650/T1 hybrid. all still on shack wires.
   
  just got a call from a speaker repair/refinisher from an inquiry i made yesterday about options on
   
  1.refinishing the cabinet in original black
  2.refinish in exotic burled wood of some sort (am thinking birds eye veneer)
  3.recapping Xover & new 5way binding posts instead the cheesy spring clippers
   
  im thinking i will be into these NS1ks about $1k (or slightly more depending on parts as the yamis cost me $650) when alls said & done but these are keepers boys & gals! they sound amazing & im thinking will kick anything for the money i spent & how often can a person get to own a "legend" which lives up to its rep!
   
  sorry steve (eddy), them incoming CS99a's will have to be incredible to beat the legend.


----------



## Skylab

​Nice, Scottie! Personally I think the NS1000 just scream for some exotic burl wood 

There is a guy in Japan who sells exotically finished NS1000s on eBay...for $5K+ a pair...


----------



## scottiebabie

hey Rob, u gotta start looking for a pair of these thangs! i didnt steer u wrong on the Pioneer monsta receivers did it? so....just saying u mite wanna pull out the check book on a pair of NS1k. they are good GREAT! i swear! lols
   
  just checked ebay on them redone NS1ks....holyyyyy shytessss batman! dude wants $6.6k + $1k shipping = $7.7k!!!! What??? 
   
  hmmm in that case, i mites well spend the money on refinishing recapping rewiring replacing binding posts. if buddy in japan can ask $7k, i can easily ask 1/2 that!!! hahahaha


----------



## Skylab

No doubt! I have looked for a pair of those locally for quite some time but not seen one yet. I'm pretty smitten with my Pioneer DSS-9 speakers but I would still jump on some NS1k if I could get the bargain you did!!!


----------



## scottiebabie

just did a google on them pioneer dss9's u have & its very highly thought off. seems like an improved hpm100! nice.....! pretty rare as well. did u sell the big B&W nautilus ?


----------



## Meewoo

@Scotti,
   
  I always love to read your post, man Stereophile should hire you as a reviewer or something!!!
   
  I am glad that your n1km "opens up", I have a 2-way Yamaha NS-4 which is precedent of NS-10, it didn't roll off until 40hz or something. So I don't believe your N1km rolls off around 50hz. There is one pair NS-1k floating around local for $700, but I think Monitor version should be better than consumer version. And I am not in mood to pursue another pair of speakers since I have another legendary speakers KEF 105.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 And I bet my KEF will eat your Yammy for breakfast.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  By the way, your Sunfire sub looks badass, could you recommend some Sub-woofer here. I might consider buying one to pair my beloved Celestion 100. Haha, I am really digging British sound.


----------



## Skylab

scottiebabie said:


> just did a google on them pioneer dss9's u have & its very highly thought off. seems like an improved hpm100! nice.....! pretty rare as well. did u sell the big B&W nautilus ?




Nah, two separate stereos...one mostly vintage Pioneer and one mosly modern stuff, including the big B&Ws. And actually I've got a third in the basement again now! I'm lucky both that my house lends itself well to that, and my wife is quite nice about it...as long as stuff is neat and clean, and everything I have is actually in use, she's cool with it.

The DSS-9's are definitely a big step up from the HPM-100. I like the 100's, but the DSS-9 are really special.


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> @Scotti,
> 
> I always love to read your post, man Stereophile should hire you as a reviewer or something!!!
> 
> ...


 
  gosh...Meewoo, u have me speechless! lols. thxs for the nice thoughts but im no way no how close to being as articulate as guys like Skylab who can hear & describe minute differences & nuances. indeed i feel i have wooden ear & its on the shoulders of others (&ofcos google is an intimate friend as well) that i can enjoy this journey of musical discovery.
   
  that Kef 105 of yours is a beast indeed. im sure it would be fun doing a comparo with that, the NS1k & perhaps Skylabs Pioneer DSS9 although i gotta say to my ears, the NS1k is as far from the "british" sound as i think it can get. 
   
  to be honest, i know bubkas about subs. i just happen to chance upon the Sunfires in the local buysell & after doing some googling & more bargaining, decided to pull the trigger on it. i like it as it seems to not impose a signature on the music but instead deceptively add body (& rumble ...lots lotsa rumble!) when i feel the need. regardless google's your best friend & i'd put my money in DA GOOD STUFF. 
   
  Quote: 





skylab said:


> Nah, two separate stereos...one mostly vintage Pioneer and one mosly modern stuff, including the big B&Ws. And actually I've got a third in the basement again now! I'm lucky both that my house lends itself well to that, and my wife is quite nice about it...as long as stuff is neat and clean, and everything I have is actually in use, she's cool with it.
> 
> The DSS-9's are definitely a big step up from the HPM-100. I like the 100's, but the DSS-9 are really special.


 
   
  thxs for the tip Rob - am gonna keep my eyes wide opened for a pair of em DSS9. unlike the NS1k, they seem a sleeper so i mite be able to snag em if they ever show up locally. 
   
  meanwhile these Yamis are so good that i think they better my set of Eminent Technology LFT18b's hybrid plannar which i mite add, is no slouch as they designed by Bruce Thigpen - the inventor of the worlds best subwoofer (hint hint...Meewoo  ). i find the yamis more alive & i love how micro details are literally flying at u.


----------



## PhoenixG

Scotti - I kinda sounds like you had a cold solder on your x-overs. It would definitely be worth doing a once over to keep them sounding good!


----------



## scottiebabie

hey PhoenixG, im not getting what u meant by "cold solder on crossovers" - can u rephrase? regardless i do agree that recapping is usually a good thing although ive been doing more research on recapping my NS1k. it would seem that these speakers have a more complicated X-overs than usual eg. theres 6caps in parallel for the low bass filter! all together, theres like 9 caps in total for just 1 speaker!!! What???
   
  also, theres this opinion of some at AK that the NS1k has "self healing" caps & to replace them is a waste of time & money - kinda like dont fix if it aint broke. will def look into this alot more. meanwhile ive just ordered replacement 5way binding posts with a bracket that is specifically for the NS1k. should then be able to hook some "pythons"!


----------



## PhoenixG

A cold solder could influence the sound the way you experienced. It is basically a cracked solder joint somewhere in your crossovers. It tends to happen when components cycle through high heat cycles. It might have reheated and resealed, thus improving your sound, but it is likely to re-crack unless you find and replace it. It would look like concentric circles around a solder joint on a component.


----------



## scottiebabie

i see. thxs for the heads up, never thought of cold solder reconnecting but it does sound logical - will definitely check out the Xover carefully when i get the chance. 
   
  on the subject of sound, something happen that i never thought was possible. my T1/HD800 combo is renowned in these parts for its clarity & transparency. well after a coupla days of intensive joy listening to the NS1k, i decided to put on HD800 late last night....lo & behold, it sounds off like.... veiled! listened for a bit & then hooked up the T1 & it still seems veiled! dont get me wrong as all the details & the usual goodstuff are still there but there seems to be a covering over clarity & transparency. 
   
  it then hit me how clear & transparent the NS1ks are!!! its no mean feat to do that to the "dynamic duo"!!!!!! sound is so dynamic & transients are so quick  ... courtesy of the beryllium mids & treble drivers.
   
  me thinks the chink in the NS1ks armor is its soundstage. width is good but nothing spectacular & aft depth is its big weakness. that said, it does throw a very forward & exciting live sound that gives a great up-on-stage-concert effect. these are really good speakers. i cant stop listening to them


----------



## Meewoo

Hey, it's Yamaha NS, *N*atural *S*ound.
  And they are monitor (near field) speakers, never heard near field speakers have sound-stage depth. They are required to be pin-point accurate, and on-stage sound image. If you want front row (second row) sound image, may I suggest one pair of Allison speakers, or those bipole speakers like your country product Mirage?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Man, I really hope I can snap one Classe amps cheaply.(I know I'm daydreaming, but I keep hunting). Canadian really put some fine audio products like British!! Hey, but you can't have Stanley Cup!!!


----------



## scottiebabie

i forgot the NS1k is a studio monitor & hence u are correct in that its not designed for the greatest of soundstage effects. its just that im so used to the bipolar Eminent Tech LFT18b which is great in soundstage width & depth with pin point imaging. however they very smooth laid back speakers (ie British sound) rather than the west coast "in your face" sound of the NS1k. 
   
  the bass of the NS1k kinda reminds me of the HD800 in that its more quick rather than full. im hoping the incoming Pioneer CS99a will complement it when i just wanna rock out to pop & dance.


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> i forgot the NS1k is a studio monitor & hence u are correct in that its not designed for the greatest of soundstage effects. its just that im so used to the bipolar Eminent Tech LFT18b which is great in soundstage width & depth with pin point imaging. however they very smooth laid back speakers (ie British sound) rather than the west coast "in your face" sound of the NS1k.
> 
> the bass of the NS1k kinda reminds me of the HD800 in that its more quick rather than full. im hoping the incoming *Pioneer CS99a will complement it when i just wanna rock out to pop & dance.*


 
   
  Not sure about pop and dance but you can definitely rock out to some rock.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The 99a's are some of the best out there for rock.


----------



## Meewoo

@scottie,
   
  Did you mean Eminent Tech LFT 8b? I couldn't find anything as 18b. 8b looks very interesting, reading stereophile review now.


----------



## scottiebabie

oppps my bad! yaa bud u are right - its the LFT 8b with the upgraded tweeters not reviewed by Stereophile. while not the greatest in bass or extension, the LFT8b does throw an awesome soundstage that (given the right placement &or room treatment) can turn your room into a music hall. its great for small ensemble jazz/vocal IMO. however i do find it lacks that extra pizazzz that i personally like in the I'm there "live" action.
   
  otoh, the NS1k is all about being THERE! in front of u up on stage! Scottie likes!
   
  ps:check out the *TRW-17 Subwoofer! *its very unique & by most accounts also the best subwoofer period!


----------



## scottiebabie

hey guys, anyone here with experience on NHT 3.3 speakers? these are only 20yrs old so may not be vintage but theres a pair of these available locally with some small front of cabinet chip at the bottom (supposedly common when these 125lbs@ behemoths are moved). my research reads these full range & are the very best NHT has produced.  if im not wrong, they are also Stereophile Class A recommended if that means anything.
   
  buddys asking $1200 with all original packaging & stands. would be great if anyone can chip in with opinions on sonics, price &or anyother interesting (even if not so useful) info & tips. if these are as good as i read, then i'd probably sell everything else (except the NS1k for they are very special even if they are less stellar in some areas) & live happily.....hopefully!!! 
   
  chime in guys


----------



## bce22

So on Sunday I decided to open up the Cornies and install my new Crites crossovers and tweeters.  The crossovers are Type B and the tweeter horns are model CT-125.
   
  i also replaced the rubber gasket between the mid and horn.
   
  All in all quite easy mod and so far the results are impressive.  Bass has really benefited the most as it is definitely faster and much more punchy rather than boomy.  The highs are less shouty with the new horns.  Ive only listened for a couple of hours so i need more time for a true imlression.
   
  Also, after looking at some photos online of the original B crossovers i believe mine had been recapped sometime in the past.
   
  Anyway here are some pics of the job.


----------



## Meewoo

@Scottie,
  I bet few people will chime in for NHT 3.3, and I bet not many people even heard the brand name NHT.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Did you check online review, most people say NHT requires musical amps, haha, I know Classe is very musical amp.
   
  @Bce22,
  Congrats, many people prefer Crites upgrade. I am just wondering why Klipsch didn't change the design for so many years, Klipsch may prefer their design than Bob Crites. How did you compare your four amps with Cornwall?


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> @Scottie,
> I bet few people will chime in for NHT 3.3, and I bet not many people even heard the brand name NHT.
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Thanks MeeWoo,
   
  To be honest I've acquired and changed too much, too quickly to give an honest subjective opinion of my amps with cornwalls.  Prior to the Crite upgrades i would say the Realistic was rhe most solid state sounding.  It's FAST, powerful and forward.  It was very accurate and sounded fantastic with well recorded jazz and acoustic.  Sounded shouty with Rock.  Was great with hip hop like Kanye.  I would say it was lacking in soundstage (which i am kind of a soundstage whore).
   
  The Luxman really warmed up those cornwalls!  The R-1120 is also so well balanced with them.  All music sounds great even classic rock/prog rock which has a tebdancy to sound bright.  Imaging is great but i found the soundstage to be even smaller than the realistic.  I cant compare it to the 70's Marantz but i would defi tely call the Luxman sweet!  if i could cboose only one word it would be sweet, if i could choose a second it would be versatile.
   
  I only listened to the au-517 after the crites mods.  im not ready to say anything until i can compare them all again.
   
  The scott i refuse to hook up until it has been restored by Craig at NOS Valves, so maybe a month or so.  Stay tuned.


----------



## scottiebabie

lols yaa Meewoo, it would seem so! yes ive been doing alot of googling & reading on it & its a BEAST for sure. most of the reviews says its incredibly accurate, transparent, super revealing with BIG BIG DEEP DEEP BASS. though awkward in its form, placement seems much less critical as these NHTs are meant to be right up against the back wall without toe in as the front panel is angled. im just concerned that my room isnt big enough for these monstas. O & the 3.3 goes 120db without breaking a sweat (or distortion)!!!
   
anyways i emailed the owner of the NHT 3.3 & he says i can have it for $1k for a local pickup. have to plan the trip even if i want it as the freakin things weigh like 130lbs@ & its in his basement so lots of sweat & grunt for sure/
   
  as for powering it, im using this
   

   
  with this power supply
   

   
  though its only rated at 150W@8ohm, it also spec'd at 800W@1.5ohm!! its the most authoritative yet musical amp ive owned. it tames even the notoriously ruthless revealing NS1k  to make it sound sweet smooth & musical with a solid bottom. nevertheless, most likely, im gonna drop by the sellers house this sunday for a audition & all 80lbs of amp is tagging along to see how it powers the 3.3s. hope it works out so i can have my end game full size rig all done. i believe im also done with headfi with the HD800/T1 powered by the Audio Space 300b amp.....atleast until the "itch" starts again! lols
   
  btw for the curious, NHT = Now Hear This!!!
   
  ps:the crites crossover looks sick!!! love it. i was looking for a pair of Klipsch Heritages but its now redundant with the arrival of the NS1k which i think is a better Klipsch than a Klipsch! believe or not, i got the Audio Space amp specifically in anticipation of the Klipsches but it turned out to be a great headamp as well so im keeping it. bet the cornwalls will sound great with the HH Scott!


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> The Luxman really warmed up those cornwalls!  The R-1120 is also so well balanced with them.  All music sounds great even classic rock/prog rock which has a tebdancy to sound bright.  Imaging is great but i found the soundstage to be even smaller than the realistic.  I cant compare it to the 70's Marantz but i would defi tely call the Luxman sweet!  if i could cboose only one word it would be sweet, if i could choose a second it would be versatile.
> 
> I only listened to the au-517 after the crites mods.  im not ready to say anything until i can compare them all again.
> 
> The scott i refuse to hook up until it has been restored by Craig at NOS Valves, so maybe a month or so.  Stay tuned.


 
  Yes, your realistic might be OEMed by Pioneer. It should have wider stage than Luxman.
  To be honest, I find that Luxman soundstage is narrowest in all vintage stuff I've heard. But man, Luxman has the best depth in all vintage stuff. Like I said to you, Luxman's image is a bend picture, lost 2-d width, but put out 3-d depth. That can be heard easily from old Jazz or classic records. When I said old record, I mean when they put a microphone stander before a Saxophone, not clipped on the horn of Saxophone. You can hear Saxophone player swings in Luxman, but not in other stuff. In modern recordings, Luxman may suffer since there's no depth in most of them. Yes, Luxman also very forgiving, it rounds digital rough.BTW, I sold marantz 240 and 2325 too, I only keep 1070 for brand variety. Marantz is not my cup tea.
  Hope you find your sound soon!!


----------



## bce22

Scottie, thanks for the kind words.
   
  Those NHTs sound awesome even if they're not 25 years old.  Did your current modern amp and psu really cost upward of 10k? It does look super sweet but assuredly that is a ton of greenbacks, certainly not for the common man.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> anyways i emailed the owner of the NHT 3.3 & he says i can have it for $1k for a local pickup. *have to plan the trip even if i want it as the freakin things weigh like 130lbs@ & its in his basement so lots of sweat & grunt for sure/*
> 
> as for powering it, im using this
> 
> ...


 
  That's the spirit!!! And hope your back is fine when you come back!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  From what I've read, it sounds like your Yammy, so I bet you will like it. Hoho, you planned to have Klipsch heritage? I just sold my Cornwall and try to sell Forte 2. I also flipped one pair heresy and heresy 2. I just don't like recess mid of Klipsch.
  This amp is badass, is it mosfet?


----------



## scottiebabie

naaah i didnt have to spend that much money. its all about buying "pre-owned" & snagging it when the right deal comes along! the missus would have had my left nut if i spent $10k on an amp!!! wait....she does have both nuts anyways!!! hahahaha. eg. this NHT 3.3 sold for >$4k back in the early nineties but now i can pick it up for $1k or maybe even less! 
   
  anyways i dont have much vices except coming home to sweet sounds of good tunes. life is goood!


----------



## scottiebabie

hahaha yaa Meewoo my back will be fine cos i'll be using a portable foldable hand truck/dolly. Scottie aint no fool to carry no 80lbs worth of amp!!!!! 
   
  the DK Design VS.1 mk3 Signature (phew...quite a mouthful) is a hybrid integrated amp with dual mono power supplies. its uses a pair of 6922 (am using NOS Siemens) in the preamp section & Solen Bipolar output devices so im guessing its bipolar output transistors.
   
  no more plans to get a pair of Klipsches as my NS1k sounds awesome. no lack of mids with them beryllium mid drivers!!!


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> naaah i didnt have to spend that much money. its all about buying "pre-owned" & snagging it when the right deal comes along! the missus would have had my left nut if i spent $10k on an amp!!! wait....she does have both nuts anyways!!! hahahaha. eg. this NHT 3.3 sold for >$4k back in the early nineties but now i can pick it up for $1k or maybe even less!
> 
> anyways i dont have much vices except coming home to sweet sounds of good tunes. life is goood!


 
  LOL, I figured you scored on those LSAs.  I'd love to hear them with your Yammies and can't wait for your NHT impressions (if you get them).
   
  In regards to recessed mids on heritage Klipsch,that is the one thing i don't find my Cornwalls to have.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> In regards to recessed mids on heritage Klipsch,that is the one thing i don't find my Cornwalls to have.


 
  Haha, you caught me generalizing things!
  I would say Cornwall is still a little bit mid recess, the gents who bought mine said he would use tone control a little. Sorry, mate, I am "British sound" digger, so they may spoil my MF-hungery.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  BTW, I found many rappers put good mastering albums, Kanye is one, 50 cents is another, early Eminem. And some supposed to be sound artist has so bad recording, yes, I am talking to you Adele. Her 21 is just so bad, I always thought her recording should be very good. So when I listen to them in my Sony x-1051, I thought my MP3 format is bad. One day, I put her 2 albums in CD changer and listened them. Holy ****t, 21 is so bad, stitched sound and off balanced sound stage. Since I couldn't bear it, I googled online, gees, many people complaint about it. So this is an example how modern mastering ******** things up. End of rant.
   
  @Scottie, educate me with those questions,
  Is open-buffer speakers one of dipolar design?? I think it is, it's just a dynamic dipolar speakers. Why the ****** they put so many name on one thing.
   
   
  Another one: Do the speakers in concert influence people's taste??
  I think this is one big questions, welcome everyone to chime in!!
  I raise this question since many review would describe speakers vivid, live, accurate etc. Did they compare the sound to the recording gears or live concert gears? suppose there are a band B, a review R, one pair reference speaker A (B's album was finished with A), another speakers C (which was reviewed by R). So how could R say C is accurate, live, vivid etc? I know flat response etc, but they are not everything. If a rock band always put JBL speakers in their concert, could any reviewers find dark speakers vivd, live, accurate playing this band live album?? Haha, I find many old R'nR people like JBL speakers.
  BTW, I am not musician or audio major. so please forgive my ignorance or idiocy!!!


----------



## scottiebabie

Meewoo im far from being any authority on speaker design or speaker physics. as far as i understand it, dipole or bipolar = sound emanates from both front & rear with by using dual opposite facing drivers (usually tweeters as hf sounds are very directional). the point im guessing to use the rear walls to reflect sound slight out of phase thereby increasing the illusion of a deep(er) soundstage.
   
  open baffle design = front facing driver with an open back much like open headphones which are by default baffleless. again im no expert & im sure others can elaborate on the physics of sound & enclosures but im guessing open baffle (like open headphones) creates a bigger illusion of space or soundstage again by out of phase sound reflection via the negative throw of the drivers. 
   
  just different designs to achieve similar ends which is why speaker set up is soo important to getting the perfect sound. indeed IMO the true game changer is room treatment which literally turn average speakers into good speakers.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> naaah i didnt have to spend that much money. its all about buying "pre-owned" & snagging it when the right deal comes along! the missus would have had my left nut if i spent $10k on an amp!!! wait....she does have both nuts anyways!!! hahahaha. eg. this NHT 3.3 sold for >$4k back in the early nineties but now i can pick it up for $1k or maybe even less!
> 
> anyways i dont have much vices except coming home to sweet sounds of good tunes. life is goood!


 
   
  That is how I have done it.  Picked up two Jeff Rowland M1s for $1K each and then designed my own speakers to compliment them (run them in bridged mono for 240WPC).  And I have a used NAD M15 as preamp (very rarely for surround sound - don't really watch many movies or TV for that matter).  The M15 has great analog bypass mode that is outstanding for audio.


----------



## scottiebabie

good score on the JR M1s! havent heard them but just froogled them & they look sick! good stuff surely 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  theres no reason why this hobby has to be huge dollars unless
   
  a)1 has loads of cash
  b)1 is an audio snob
  c)1 is a FOTM rainbow chaser
   
  theres loads of reasonably valued vintage stuff that still sound great even by today standards or even with the new stuff, there's bargains galore if one is handy with the mouse & intimate with uncle google. more than price, i believe its about getting quality components, synergistic matches, knowing oneself & preferences, wise with research, prudent when purchasing & ultimately, just trying it out in your own evironment for theres no substitute for listening!
   
  however i do feel that the one game changer thats not discussed much is room treatment. some feel its a tweak but its more like an essential component.


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> LOL, I figured you scored on those LSAs.  I'd love to hear them with your Yammies and can't wait for your NHT impressions (if you get them).


 
   
  no worries, if u are in my part of the great white north, i'd be more than happy to serve up some good ol canuck hospitality. besides pounding tunes, i'll throw in a few brewskis & a great Albertan steak! commmmme onnnnnn down! the price is rightttttt!!!!! lol


----------



## SpeakerBox

Agree with what Scottie said about system matching - very important, and yes the room is part of the system!


----------



## MattTCG

Just heard my first pair of vintage kef speakers yesterday at a local meet. Wow!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Call me impressed. I must find a pair on CL on somewhere local for cheap. I believe that they are model 104 ab.


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Just heard my first pair of vintage kef speakers yesterday at a local meet. Wow!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Cool beans Matt! Vintage KEFs are nice speakers.
   
  What was the rest of the equipment.in the chain driving those KEFs?  What speakers are you using now? I am certain you've said it, but for the sake of the conversation it makes senseto ask again.


----------



## MattTCG

The amp was an incredibly impressive Aragon that had been modded and restored to a level that I can not begin to explain here. When the cover was pulled off the amp I pretty sure that it "glowed" like a exposed pot of gold. No joke, this guy just had mad skills. The dac was an audio-gd...not sure which one.
   
  So of course the amp definitely had something to do with the magic coming out of the kef's, but I still want them.


----------



## captouch

matttcg said:


> Just heard my first pair of vintage kef speakers yesterday at a local meet. Wow!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




There's a set of those locally (Bay Area CA) for $350. I previously passed up offers to buy 105.2's for $450 and refoamed 107/2's for $650. Kind of regret passing on both of those. Still haven't heard KEFs myself, though some of my speakers may use KEF drivers.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> The amp was an incredibly impressive Aragon that had been modded and restored to a level that I can not begin to explain here. When the cover was pulled off the amp I pretty sure that it "glowed" like a exposed pot of gold. No joke, this guy just had mad skills. The dac was an audio-gd...not sure which one.
> 
> So of course the amp definitely had something to do with the magic coming out of the kef's, but I still want them.


 
   
  I think some of the Aragon amps were designed by Dan D'agostino at the time of Krell.  That guy knows what he is doing.


----------



## scottiebabie

the high end vintage KEF's are highly rated & very affordable. a set KEF104ab just sold on CAM in Quebec for $215 - alot of sound for very little money indeed!
   
  i just returned from an audition with the 25yr old (dont know if that counts as vintage) NHT 3.3 with my own DK integrated amp.
   
  the good
   
  1.my amp drove the 3.3 extremely well extremely loud - we measured 120db on track just to test the dynamic range of the speakers with my amp
  2.bass was incredible! alot of ppl use "Hotel California - Hell freezes over" as test track for bass response dynamics. i can safely say i have never heard the kick drums thunder this hard, this deep with this much impact! it was crazy.
  3.the 3.3s are very detailed & revealing
  4.the 3.3 is truely a full range speaker
  5.the 3.3 is the least fussiest speaker to setup besides the Yami NS1k in my experience. we had the 3.3 directly vertical & placed 3"-5" from back wall with atleast 3ft from any side walls. i wish all speakers were this simple to place.
   
  the bad
   
  1.i could detect a slight sibilance on some tracks
  2.soundstage though intimate, can be small at times
  3.soundstage depth is definitely its weakest area
   
  the unknown
   
  no time nor opportunity to determine causes of sibiliance. it could be speaker (it would seem aluminum tweeters are well known for sibilance) itself or the cheap cable we used or the source or perhaps the speakers are so revealing that it shows the recording warts & all.
   
  conclusions
   
  based on my short time with the 3.3s i can certainly see how bass can be light, highs can be thin or even harsh if the right ancillaries arent synergistic. however with my amp, this pair of NHT 3.3 has some of the biggest & best sounds i have heard. the mids are as detailed, as clear, as musical as the beryllium mids of my Yami NS1k. the bass is simple....INCREDIBLE, big huge & deep. the highs are very extended & detailed but with a penchant for sibiliance & its precisely this that i am concerned about. 
   
  i can safely say its not my amp as the same amp on the very revealing NS1k is not sibilant. but all in all, the NHT 3.3 are very impressive speakers & does seem a great deal for the money. now its down to working the fine details as its likely that i will be an owner of these 3.3s. theres a possibility that we will do a trade of my ET lft8b hybrid mag planars for the NHT3.3 as well.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Very interesting.  Sounds like these are very good speakers.  Just watch out for the sibilance issue.  I know that any edgy sound in the upper mid-range or highs drives me nuts.  I think that is why I like my Rowland amps because they tend to be a little on the dark side and VERY smooth sounding.   That said, I am sure I could pick a speaker that would change that if I tried.


----------



## Meewoo

Scottie,
   
  You were spoiled by dipole speakers, don't be fussy about depth, depth....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Anyway, I think you have a fine Sunday afternoon!!
   
  There is one pair of NHT M-100 speakers 100 mile away for $75, I may consider a road trip based on your impression.


----------



## scottiebabie

yaa i guess i am abit spoilt as panel type speakers excel in soundstage, imaging & perhaps even imitate houdini & his famous disappearing act. i cannot help but enjoy that aspect of music. its no wonder that the 2 headphones i have are the HD800 & T1.
   
  that said, i also understand & realize that life is all about compromises esp on a limited budget. even if i can find a great set of speakers that can do it all, i wont have the space that it requirements. in light of that, its my opinion the NHT3.3 are awesome set of speakers. what it does well, it does WELL. bass lovers, rock & metal lovers, symphonic lovers will be extremely pleased. even on vocal & small ensemble jazz, its very good. on this audition, on unfamiliar grounds & ancillaries (exceptin my amp), there is a concern of sibilance. i just havent figured it out if its bcos of material, the ancillaries or the speaker itself.
   
  that said, i wonder how the 3.3 would compare to the Kef105/7 & the B&W 801 matrix or yore. it would certainly be fun finding out!
   
  ps:theres a fully restored mint (from pics) Altec Lansing "Voice Of The Theatre" that just became available locally for $3k! now if only i had my own private theatre room


----------



## MIKELAP

Does anybody ever listen to kef 104 and also what year are those from  i could get a pair for $300.00 are they worth it  i would use these with my Pioneer SX750 any input would be appreciated i remember from back in the 70's that Kef were very efficient speakers use to run JBL'S L100 with a  Quad 405 amp back then  that was nice and still is but my boy has it now ,sometimes i would like it back but its his now or is it ! hmmm.....                                                                                                                       .


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Just heard my first pair of vintage kef speakers yesterday at a local meet. Wow!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Funny just wrote something regarding Kef's 104 before i read the thread so there nice because a seller would lend them to me for listening interesting might call him tomorrow could you describe the sound clean sounding i bet .Thanks


----------



## MattTCG

Mike...I was very impressed with the KEF's. Enough so that if I found a pair local for $300, I'd be all over the them. Smooth silky treble, forward mids and tight bass with presence. They sounded about twice the size of the cabinets. I'd love to own a pair.


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> Mike...I was very impressed with the KEF's. Enough so that if I found a pair local for $300, I'd be all over the them. Smooth silky treble, forward mids and tight bass with presence. They sounded about twice the size of the cabinets. I'd love to own a pair.


 
  Thanks i will call him first thing tomorrow


----------



## MattTCG

If you don't like them, I'd take them. Free shipping right?


----------



## MattTCG

Can someone look at this ad and tell me which AR speakers those are?
   
http://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/gms/4027658649.html


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





matttcg said:


> If you don't like them, I'd take them. Free shipping right?


 
   
  At 35 pounds each speaker only let me think about it 





.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> Does anybody ever listen to kef 100


 
   
  They are KEF reference 104, not 100. Check http://www.kef.com/html/en/explore/about_kef/museum/1970s/Reference_Series_104/index.html


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> They are KEF reference 104, not 100. Check http://www.kef.com/html/en/explore/about_kef/museum/1970s/Reference_Series_104/index.html


 
  Yes thanks


----------



## SpeakerBox

A good par of B139s (the oval woofer in the 104) and T27s (the tweeter) are worth more than $300 alone.  If nothing else you buy the 104s for the drivers.  I have KEF 139s, sp1044 in my speakers and they are great.  They make outstanding transmission line subs too!


----------



## MIKELAP

[size=x-small][/size]


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> Got the Kef's 104 today very nice sound and bass to die for
> this is with a Pioneer SX750.


----------



## MattTCG

**drools on keyboard**


----------



## Oregonian

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> [size=x-small][/size]


 

 Tasty.............unique..................


----------



## analogsurviver

Quote: 





speakerbox said:


> A good par of B139s (the oval woofer in the 104) and T27s (the tweeter) are worth more than $300 alone.  If nothing else you buy the 104s for the drivers.  I have KEF 139s, sp1044 in my speakers and they are great.  They make outstanding transmission line subs too!


 
  + 1000.


----------



## SpeakerBox

@mikelap  - congrats.  You won't regret your purchase.  I have been working with the drivers in that speaker for 35 years and love them.


----------



## PhoenixG

I'm going to fess up that I made a [declined] offer on these guys here -
http://www.ebay.com/itm/111148140327?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
   

  These are basically holy speaker relics, rarer than a unicorn and more perfect IMHO. $4k would not take them away, but I figured I'd show you guys what I've been drooling over. These were hand built by my speaker icon Roger Russell for himself. They don't look half bad either.


----------



## MattTCG

If I buy those can they be powered with my ipod?


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


>


 
   
  How about this http://www.roger-russell.com/xrt20.htm
   
  I had a chance briefly listen to them in a relatively large room. The air pushed by woofer can blow your pants away. They sounds great, but they intimidated me.  I felt I was pressed by sound and the pressure is like standing before Hoover damn.
  I think only mansion can house them, they belong to that 0.5 percent people. Normal people can't enjoy them, or we may can, just put them outside as outdoor speakers.


----------



## PhoenixG

Yeah, I know what you all mean haha. This is probably the only time I have wondered if my sx1980 wasn't worthy of a pair of speakers.
  I just sold my car so I figured I'd make an offer with the cash I had from it, but no dice.


----------



## MattTCG

Finally got the voice coil rebuild in my large advents. Been playing them for about half an hour...sweet!!


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





phoenixg said:


> I'm going to fess up that I made a [declined] offer on these guys here -
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/111148140327?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
> 
> 
> These are basically holy speaker relics, rarer than a unicorn and more perfect IMHO. $4k would not take them away, but I figured I'd show you guys what I've been drooling over. These were hand built by my speaker icon Roger Russell for himself. They don't look half bad either.


 
  man those beasts reminds me of a "son" of Infinity RS1! lov it lov it lov it!!!


----------



## Meewoo

@scottie,
   
  How are your CS-99a and SA-8100?
   
  BTW, does NS-1000m sound well at very low volume? By very low volume I mean listening music in mid-night but doesn't annoy anyone? My KEF 105 is good at low volume that I don't need headphone anymore. If Yammy is good, I may buy one which is asking for $600.


----------



## scottiebabie

dont have it yet as buddy is delivery the CS99a + SA8100 to me over this labor day weekend. will see how it sounds. for the money i paid, i can easily blow it out with no loss.
   
  if u can pick a pair of working NS1k in good working condition for $600, run dont walk & get it! its an amazing set of speakers. cant tell u much about low level listening as i never listen at that level - thats why i still have headphones for those "quiet" times!
   
  the mids on it is a good as anything out there. its very quick & very detailed. the bass is slightly lacking in extension & weight but only compare to the incredible mids. i have heard that it can be harsh & thin when paired with unsynergistic upstream gear.
   
  it out does both my dynamic duo cans in most all categories.


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> @scottie,
> 
> How are your CS-99a and SA-8100?
> 
> BTW, does NS-1000m sound well at very low volume? By very low volume I mean listening music in mid-night but doesn't annoy anyone? My KEF 105 is good at low volume that I don't need headphone anymore. If Yammy is good, I may buy one which is asking for $600.


 
  I noticed that atso with my  Kef's 104 low volume sounds good


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> I noticed that atso with my  Kef's 104 low volume sounds good


 
   
  Cheers!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  How about Bass? Do they have tight controlled crispy bass??


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> dont have it yet as buddy is delivery the CS99a + SA8100 to me over this labor day weekend. will see how it sounds. for the money i paid, i can easily blow it out with no loss.
> 
> if u can pick a pair of working NS1k in good working condition for $600, run dont walk & get it! its an amazing set of speakers. cant tell u much about low level listening as i never listen at that level - thats why i still have headphones for those "quiet" times!
> 
> ...


 

 Asked boss and she said no. She also made me realize that I couldn't enjoy many of my speakers.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Rotating them is time-and-body consuming!!!


----------



## MattTCG

The kef 104's that I heard over the weekend delivered tight crispy bass and wonderfully so. I'd like to own them if anyone has a pair for sale.


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Asked boss and she said no. She also made me realize that I couldn't enjoy many of my speakers.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  LOL MeeWoo this made me laugh.
   
  I find the cornwalls sound nice at low volumes but i still like the added headroom i have with headphones when i dont want to disturbe the housemates. plus i feel more comfortable that i am not disturbing anyone.


----------



## Meewoo

Quote: 





bce22 said:


> I find the cornwalls sound nice at low volumes but i still like the added headroom i have with headphones when i dont want to disturbe the housemates. plus i feel more comfortable that i am not disturbing anyone.


 
   
  +1!!
   
  But speakers presence is different from headphone. I sometime really hate the headphone sound-stage over my head. I know, I know,  life is full of compromise!!


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Cheers!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  What i will tell you is true it has been a long time that i had  listen to speakers when i heard that bass it brought a tear to me eye the bass goes deep its the texture of it not boomy at all but massive but under control  i tried old tunes i use to listen with the JBL's i tought that my JBL L100 had incredible bass with those  12inch speakers and bass reflex boy did it bring me back in time i guess i missed listening with speakers but the 104's when i first met the guy he told me they where $300.00 but after the next day he revised is price and he was asking $400.00 man i paid and was very happy with the deal . the only thing i can tell you for shure if you love bass youll say WOW to these speakers imo


----------



## bce22

It's hard to mess with displacement!  Those woofers move alot of air compared to any phones.  Headphones arent any true substitute for bass.  What they offer is amazing range and stereo imaging!  instrument sepaeration and space works wellwith phones.
   
  True sounding soundstage and bass response can only be represented when the speaker is larger and moved much further from your ears.


----------



## Trav

phoenixg said:


> I'm going to fess up that I made a [declined] offer on these guys here -
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/111148140327?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
> 
> 
> ...


 Beautiful. Is that a TL setup?


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> What i will tell you is true it has been a long time that i had  listen to speakers when i heard that bass it brought a tear to me eye the bass goes deep its the texture of it not boomy at all but massive but under control  i tried old tunes i use to listen with the JBL's i tought that my JBL L100 had incredible bass with those  12inch speakers and bass reflex boy did it bring me back in time i guess i missed listening with speakers but the 104's when i first met the guy he told me they where $300.00 but after the next day he revised is price and he was asking $400.00 man i paid and was very happy with the deal . the only thing i can tell you for shure if you love bass youll say WOW to these speakers imo


 
  +1000


----------



## scottiebabie

Quote: 





meewoo said:


> Asked boss and she said no. She also made me realize that I couldn't enjoy many of my speakers.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  hahaha too bad bud, its a stonkin deal at $600!! i cant say it'll pawn your kef105s, i can safely say it'll provide a window into an alternative reality. so far, its been very addicting to me so much so i dont enjoy my headphones as much. lol
   
  as a side thought, maybe we can trade in "the boss" instead!!!


----------



## scottiebabie

let me see if i can keep this thread alive....dont know if it qualifies as vintage (built btwn 1993 - 2004 i think) but i finally made a deal for the NHT 3.3. wont be picking it up til very end of Sept or even early Oct. 
   
  as mentioned, though slim and narrow, the 3.3s weighs 123lbs@ so there are certainly not for the casual collector. i auditioned them last sunday & til, i cant get the bass out of my mind. hmm did i say bass i meant BAD ASSSSSS BASSSSSSS!!!!! they are the  most thunderous thangs ive ever listened to sans subs (even at high end treated dealer showrooms). from memory, they also super detailed, very clear, extended & seemingly accurate. again, they were abit sibilant on some material but i managed to wrangle some 6922 preamp tubes from seller to roll in my amp.
   
  i hope these will be my end game setup. if they are good enough, then i mite even sell the Yami NS1ks. 
   
  did i mention they have bass? well they have BASS & go LOUD!!! with very quick transients! now for the month long wait..........


----------



## Skylab

The NHT 3.3 were all the rage when I started reading Stereophile in the early 90's.  I never heard a pair - back then they were way out of my price range. But I bet they rock! Scottie you have their backs to the wall, which was how they were supposed to be used?


----------



## scottiebabie

well Rob, the NHT 3.3 are impressive enough for me to pull the trigger on them. to my ears, they supercede the NS1k esp in the bass dept. and its not a boomy bass but something so massive so ridiculously impactful, tangible & viseral that i cant get it out of my mind. i cannot say if the mid/highs of the 3.3 are better than the NS1k but my memory tells me that its of equal quality at the very least (except for the sibilance issue). 
   
  the other reason i bought it  as im also happy that my DK amp drives it with great authority. i read that alot of amps just dont have enough juice (im thinking current here instead of just wattage) & hence, can sound very bright & thin.
   
  both the NHT 3.3 & Yamaha NS1000 are accoustic suspension designs & hence sound best augmented by the back wall. indeed NHT recommends the 3.3 to be 3" off the back wall & directly perpendicular to it. best 6+' apart. the NS1000 also sounds best (to my ears) about 8" off the back wall as well.
   
  i think the NHT 3.3 sold for around $4k back then & im paying about 1/4 of that now. i think its an awesome deal at that price point & is competitive with just about anything <$10k still.


----------



## wotts

I picked up another pair of HPM-100s last weekend. These are the 100w version vs the 200w I already have. Cabinets are heavier (or so I'm told - injured my back, so I didn't move em) than the other pair. They sound excellent!


----------



## scottiebabie

nice! them HPM100s look mint. are there any sonic differences btwn the 100w vs 200w versions?


----------



## Silent One

Beautiful appointment.


----------



## wotts

These are quite minty! The cabinets have a deep, rich walnut color and are rather glossy. The other pair is like a medium oak or cherry and the finish seems un-laquered. And there is one condensation ring from a philistine I had over to check them out. He set he drink on a cabinet. I was planning to use the wood product everyone uses to bring back some luster. Sound wise, it's been a while since I had the 200w hooked up, I started a cross-over recap project and then life happened. If anything, I think the 200w was bassier.


----------



## wotts

Hmm... those pictures are rather grainy. i'll get out the DSLR later and do something proper.
   
  Quote: 





silent one said:


> Beautiful appointment.


 
   
  Thanks SO!


----------



## Silent One

And take care of that back!


----------



## MIKELAP

You older guys remember this http://youtu.be/B2WcBi9mu6A   we saw mostly the picture in magazines i wonder if you know what speaker is in the picture answer soon !


----------



## Skylab

wotts said:


> These are quite minty! The cabinets have a deep, rich walnut color and are rather glossy. The other pair is like a medium oak or cherry and the finish seems un-laquered. And there is one condensation ring from a philistine I had over to check them out. He set he drink on a cabinet. I was planning to use the wood product everyone uses to bring back some luster. Sound wise, it's been a while since I had the 200w hooked up, I started a cross-over recap project and then life happened. If anything, I think the 200w was bassier.




Very nice looking pair you got there! Congrats. Recapping the crossovers will definitely improve the sound. I like the HPM-100 - it's a very fun listen!!!


----------



## Silent One

Quote: 





mikelap said:


> You older guys remember this http://youtu.be/B2WcBi9mu6A   we saw mostly the picture in magazines i wonder if you know what speaker is in the picture answer soon !


 
   





 No idea........ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 great commercial, though!


----------



## MIKELAP

Quote: 





silent one said:


> No idea........
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Those where  JBL L100  i had a pair of those that i bought in 1977 back then i paid $1000.00 for the pair and there still working today by the way


----------



## Silent One

Lookin' good!


----------



## MattTCG

+1 real good!!


----------



## PhoenixG

Those were the speakers that got me started! I've had three pairs over the years!


----------



## Trav

Just scored a set of NHT Super Zeros, if they image well with my Sansui 881 ill prolly seek out a sub to finish the presentation.


----------



## scottiebabie

good stuff! ive heard nothing but great things about the Super Zero's. with the accompanying sub, they are supposed to be up there with some of the big boys. factor in the the prices one pays (or not pay), tis smokin speakers. i hear they like lots of juice though. let me know how it sounds.
   
  i dont get my big 3.3 til the beginning of OCT. will def do a quick impression review with the 3.3, NS1000 & the set of ET LFT8b (most likely will be sellling them) if anyones interested.


----------



## bce22

I actully would love to pick up some big and obnoxious Bozaks in decent condition.  Maybe in the autumn.  Cant wait to see pics and hear more impressions on the NHTs for sure!


----------



## scottiebabie

am sitting listening to the Pioneer CS99a after picking them up 1/2 hr ago. they look mint!!! i dont think anyone can get 40yr old speakers in better condition than these. guys selling it for his Grandma cos they belonged to his deceased Grandpa. only thing wrong is some slight fading at the top of the cabinets - something im sure wood restorer & a good waxing will easily fix. they are very good looking kabuki speakers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  i have them on the floor for now & quick impression shows they are far behind my NS1000 in almost every dept except soundstage. these CS99a's throws a very wide soundstage with better than average depth as well (placement is far from being optimum mind u). bass isnt anywhere near earth shaking or deep but whats there is very tight. mids are warm & highs arent the most detailed. 
   
  but they are very musical & forgiving. they look darn fine & is decently imposing in size. i can see alot of ppl being happy with them ...so long as they dont hear better, ignorance is bliss!


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> am sitting listening to the Pioneer CS99a after picking them up 1/2 hr ago. they look mint!!! i dont think anyone can get 40yr old speakers in better condition than these. guys selling it for his Grandma cos they belonged to his deceased Grandpa. only thing wrong is some slight fading at the top of the cabinets - something im sure wood restorer & a good waxing will easily fix. they are very good looking kabuki speakers
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Ouch, so in other words for furniture, they are really nice!  Speakers.............not so much.  Thanks forthe mini review


----------



## MattTCG

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> am sitting listening to the Pioneer CS99a after picking them up 1/2 hr ago. they look mint!!! i dont think anyone can get 40yr old speakers in better condition than these. guys selling it for his Grandma cos they belonged to his deceased Grandpa. only thing wrong is some slight fading at the top of the cabinets - something im sure wood restorer & a good waxing will easily fix. they are very good looking kabuki speakers
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  No pics? Do we even have to ask? (rhetorical question)


----------



## scottiebabie

lols @BCE22 i wouldnt quite put it that way but yes, compared to the NS1000 the CS99a are lacking in the analogical sense that HD650's arent that good a headphone compared with a HD800. im pretty sure when its optimized with appropriate stands & placement, they would sound more than adequate (probably darn good in & of itself).
   
  edit: just came home from a long day at work so am lazy to take pics. will do so in a more opportune time but they are in very very good condition. except for slight fading up top. i'd venture they can be as new.


----------



## bce22

Quote: 





scottiebabie said:


> lols @BCE22 i wouldnt quite put it that way but yes, compared to the NS1000 the CS99a are lacking in the analogical sense that HD650's arent that good a headphone compared with a HD800. im pretty sure when its optimized with appropriate stands & placement, they would sound more than adequate (probably darn good in & of itself).
> 
> edit: just came home from a long day at work so am lazy to take pics. will do so in a more opportune time but they are in very very good condition. except for slight fading up top. i'd venture they can be as new.


 
  I've always heard that the cs-99a's where beautiful looking and C+ sounding but because they are so nice looking, sized right and pioneers there was little risk in picking up a cosmetically perfect pair at a decent price since they sell quickly.    Awaiting NHTs with baited breath!


----------



## scottiebabie

dont know if the CS99a are "C" speakers but i will know more once i get a chance to set it up correctly. they sound quite decent with my tube amp.
   
  yes i too anxiously await then NHT 3.3's. i just hope my living room has the space for it to breath. i have no doubt its gonna sound awesome. even now, im still under the spell of its incredible bass response. i have heard nothing that can do bass quite like the 3.3s. dont get me wrong as every part of the FR isnt lacking at all. from memory, it was super detailed, transparent & seemingly very accurate as well. its just that to me, the bass is so definitively superior i cant get it out of my mind.
   
  cant wait to have a shootout with the rest of my speakers although i have no doubt which speaker will rule them all.


----------



## 99-1

hi every body
what do you think of my speaker box color ? i made it recently but i can't make up my mind whether to choose black or wood (self color)?:confused_face_2:


----------



## MIKELAP

99-1 said:


> hi every body
> what do you think of my speaker box color ? i made it recently but i can't make up my mind whether to choose black or wood (self color)?


 
  
 Definitely not black


----------



## MattTCG

Looking great. Just a medium oak would look nice. Interested in hearing how they sound.


----------



## Skylab

I agree - go for medium oak, dark oak, or walnut. NOT black!


----------



## analogsurviver

99-1 said:


> hi every body
> what do you think of my speaker box color ? i made it recently but i can't make up my mind whether to choose black or wood (self color)?


 
  


99-1 said:


> hi every body
> what do you think of my speaker box color ? i made it recently but i can't make up my mind whether to choose black or wood (self color)?


 
  
 Anything but black. Manufacturers have one "safety zone exit" with speaker finishes: if it turns out gaudy for whatever reason - they can always sell it as BLACK !


----------



## 99-1

mikelap said:


> Definitely not black


 
 thank you
  


matttcg said:


> Looking great. Just a medium oak would look nice. Interested in hearing how they sound.


 
 thank you my friend ,
 the sound is not bad...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


skylab said:


> I agree - go for medium oak, dark oak, or walnut. NOT black!


 
 thank you
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, walnut is so dark...
  


analogsurviver said:


> Anything but black. Manufacturers have one "safety zone exit" with speaker finishes: if it turns out gaudy for whatever reason - they can always sell it as BLACK !


 





thank you...
  
  
 i have made these sample colors,which one is better?
  

  
  
 it is also possible to made some darker color...


----------



## MattTCG

I would say that some of the color choice would be dependent on the acoutriments of the room. The red oak of #1 looks good to me.


----------



## MIKELAP

99-1 said:


> thank you
> 
> thank you my friend ,
> the sound is not bad...
> ...


 
  
 #1


----------



## 99-1

#1 is a bit red that is not clear in the picture
 like #10 too...


----------



## analogsurviver

99-1 said:


> thank you
> 
> thank you my friend ,
> the sound is not bad...
> ...


 
  
 It also has to be taken in account whatever finish chosen will turn out a bit darker if there will be clear protective coat over it. Depending on your room colours, I would go with something usually not available commercially - and finish it off to perfection every one  would notice to be over the usual level in 
 speaker cabinets.
  
 Then again, piano lack, polished to perfection, most commonly unfortunately BLACK, is difficult to improve upon...


----------



## SpeakerBox

I like the darkest color you have.  Did you design these yourself - if so what type of crossover are you using?


----------



## MIKELAP

Gotta say this about about the Kef 104 those speakers and the sx750 never cease to amaze me especially wih SURVIVAL FROM MUSE ,BOZ SCAGGS, RUNNIN BLUE bass on these speakers is WOW so nice just had to say it again.


----------



## SpeakerBox

The B139 woofer can really move some air!


----------



## Oregonian

A friend found these at a garage sale for me for $20.................Cerwin Vega DX-3's with the 10" woofer.  
  
 Foam is in great shape and they sound like they should - highly efficient thumpers.


----------



## MattTCG

oregonian said:


> A friend found these at a garage sale for me for $20.................Cerwin Vega DX-3's with the 10" woofer.
> 
> Foam is in great shape and they sound like they should - highly efficient thumpers.


 
  
 I like 'em!!


----------



## joehalo

Finally found a pair of HPM-100s after months of searching! Man do they sound awesome. 

 The three brothers lined up


----------



## wotts

joehalo said:


> Finally found a pair of HPM-100s after months of searching! Man do they sound awesome.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> ...


 
  
  
 Looking good! I love how the HPM line looks.


----------



## joehalo

Thank you. I agree, they are very eye catching speakers not to mention great sounding.


----------



## MattTCG

Nice score Joe!! Enjoy...


----------



## Skylab

That's a great shot, Joe, with all three HPM's! Very cool. Congrats - the HPM-100 is a great speaker.


----------



## MIKELAP

I saw a pair of HPM100 FOR $550.00 in good condition whats the going rate on these here are a few pictures. Thanks


----------



## Skylab

Those look pretty good, but the price is high. The midrange dust caps are a bit wrinkled, so it's not like those are stone mint. $400 would be more reasonable if the wood cabinets are in good shape. Those are also the "100W" versions which tend to have a slightly lower resale value for no real reason.

I sold a pair at least that nice a few weeks ago for $200...


----------



## MIKELAP

skylab said:


> Those look pretty good, but the price is high. The midrange dust caps are a bit wrinkled, so it's not like those are stone mint. $400 would be more reasonable if the wood cabinets are in good shape. Those are also the "100W" versions which tend to have a slightly lower resale value for no real reason.
> 
> I sold a pair at least that nice a few weeks ago for $200...


 
  
 Thank you good to know.


----------



## wotts

I bought both pairs of mine for $300: 200w version in good condition and a 100w version that is quite minty.


----------



## MIKELAP

wotts said:


> I bought both pairs of mine for $300: 200w version in good condition and a 100w version that is quite minty.


 
  
 Thats a good deal just saw another pair of HPM 100 $1000. Thats crazy.


----------



## Skylab

At $300, the HPM-100 is a great speaker for the money. At $500, it's a decent speaker for the money. At $1,000, one can do significantly better.


----------



## PhoenixG

Wow, I need to start buying speakers from Moody (holler if you're getting rid of something haha). 
 Really though - That $550 is full blown retail going price on those assuming that everything not pictured is perfect. Usually though, if they don't show it, it's not great. Damaged cabinets and missing/damaged grills could bring the $$ value down to around $300 (though they still sound the same, so might be a bargain for you).
 For 1k, you can probably bide your time and get a set of HPM 150/1500's. Those bad boys are head and shoulders better than the 100's (literally. and you'd be surprised by the differences). As moody might say - significantly better


----------



## MattTCG

There is a guy that I talked to at a local speaker store who mentioned that many of the AK guys are modding the Large Advent with a horn type tweeter and that they were getting fantastic results. 
  
 Any thoughts?


----------



## Trav

Econowave mod. I think BmWr75 had a set for sale a while back.


----------



## SpeakerBox

You should be able to get a pair of Dahlquist DQ-10s for less that $1000 (currently looking for a pair myself).  I would think they would best anything from the HPM series.  I do love my Advents too!


----------



## moodyrn

phoenixg said:


> Wow, I need to start buying speakers from Moody (holler if you're getting rid of something haha).
> Really though - That $550 is full blown retail going price on those assuming that everything not pictured is perfect. Usually though, if they don't show it, it's not great. Damaged cabinets and missing/damaged grills could bring the $$ value down to around $300 (though they still sound the same, so might be a bargain for you).
> For 1k, you can probably bide your time and get a set of HPM 150/1500's. Those bad boys are head and shoulders better than the 100's (literally. and you'd be surprised by the differences). As moody might say - significantly better


 
  
 Lol, I sold mine  in anticipation of getting my xr7 restored. All I'm really lacking is a dome midrange which hardly ever come across ebay. The few that have, have gone for large amounts of money(buyitnow). A pair finally came up that was a bid listing. I was prepared to throw a max bid of 100.00 since it was for a pair. With 8 minutes left, my 3 year decided to throw a hissy fit. Once I calmed him down, the auction had ended for 50.00+ dollars. My mouth was wide open. A buyitnow had previously sold for 100.00 for one. If you could have seen the look I gave him afterwards lol. But oh well, maybe another one will come available soon.


----------



## MIKELAP

moodyrn said:


> Lol, I sold mine  in anticipation of getting my xr7 restored. All I'm really lacking is a dome midrange which hardly ever come across ebay. The few that have, have gone for large amounts of money(buyitnow). A pair finally came up that was a bid listing. I was prepared to throw a max bid of 100.00 since it was for a pair. With 8 minutes left, my 3 year decided to throw a hissy fit. Once I calmed him down, the auction had ended for 50.00+ dollars. My mouth was wide open. A buyitnow had previously sold for 100.00 for one. If you could have seen the look I gave him afterwards lol. But oh well, maybe another one will come available soon.


 
  
 Wait till he's 16 keep smiling my friend ,keep smiling.!


----------



## PhoenixG

Yep - I had to get a dome tweeter replacement on mine. I put a watch out on them and got it as soon as it popped up on buy it now. I think it was $40-something. Will it help if I tell you it will all be worth it?


----------



## moodyrn

Lol, yeah patience is a virtue. It's crossed my mind a few times just to scrap them for parts since the drives are so hard to come by, they can go for a premium. But given everything I've read, it will be worth the wait. So they are sitting in my garage for now.


----------



## GREQ

Just thought I'd share something I bought on a whim recently.
 Nothing amazing, just a decent bit of kit from Germany
  
 Saba Ultra Hifi Box705
  

 Unusual varnished chip-board finish. I kinda like it.
  
 I'm no speaker expert, but I havn't seen this before except on celestion guitar speakers. 

 (Two photos of the same cloth-mesh dust cap)
 Probably reduces weight and allows for some airflow so the speaker can move more freely.


----------



## PhoenixG

I see the cloth mesh dust cap fairly regularly on higher-high end speakers, Especially larger woofers. It helps keep them from getting so dang hot inside the driver, especially on acoustic suspension designs. Also, it keeps the dust caps from crumpling at high powers (inverting), allowing them to be just a tiny tiny bit lighter.
 I've seen the full mesh cap on McIntosh and Rola designs, and mesh vents in paper dust caps on Kenwood and Sansui's 15'' high end woofers. 
 Those are a good find! How do they sound?


----------



## GREQ

phoenixg said:


> I see the cloth mesh dust cap fairly regularly on higher-high end speakers, Especially larger woofers. It helps keep them from getting so dang hot inside the driver, especially on acoustic suspension designs. Also, it keeps the dust caps from crumpling at high powers (inverting), allowing them to be just a tiny tiny bit lighter.
> I've seen the full mesh cap on McIntosh and Rola designs, and mesh vents in paper dust caps on Kenwood and Sansui's 15'' high end woofers.
> Those are a good find!* How do they sound?*


 
 I was A/B'ing them quite a lot with my Jamo Power 120B (which are basically large 80's teenager speakers) because I was wondering if these would make suitable upgrades despite being about 4 years older. (also puts comparisons into context)
 They both have 7" woofers, but the Jamo's enclosure is about twice the cubic volume and front ported and has only one tweeter vs. the two on the Saba (and no bass port)
  
 The Sabas actually sound pretty good. Anything instrumental or acoustic is great, although there was a bit of a spike around 4Khz which made some vocals too hot. 
 Clearly the Saba has more detail retrieval which is no surprise having two superior tweeters, but I feel these small enclosures don't do the drivers any justice. I think in a larger box, perhaps ported, these would REALLY sing.
 There was clearly a big bass roll-off starting around 100hz, so even rock music sounded thin and less impressive. After an EQ bass boost the volume was there without a struggle, but it couldn't produce a good textured sound - bass guitar riffs just sounded muffled. 
 It was like with the jamos I was being immersed in a large dynamic musical space, and with the sabas I was listening to music analytically in the background. I can see them working well in a very small room or in a very large room at higher volumes. 
 But maybe they just didn't like my small living room.


----------



## Trav

Keeping in mind this a "vintage" speaker thread ill be brief. Got to finally hear my NHT Superzero 2.1's today and all I can say is these things image incredibly well and possess a transparency with my Sansui 881 that will have picking up the matching sub.


----------



## scottiebabie

trav said:


> Keeping in mind this a "vintage" speaker thread ill be brief. Got to finally hear my NHT Superzero 2.1's today and all I can say is these things image incredibly well and possess a transparency with my Sansui 881 that will have picking up the matching sub.


 
  
 congrats on the NHT score. for the price u paid, i seriously doubt they can be beat! all u need is a SW2P subwoofer to have full range rig - am sure u'll be super happy. i cant wait to pick my 3.3s soon.
  
 back to topic, this is what i picked up after work this evening for $65. to say the least, cabinet's not minty & there some chips here & there but overall, its not too bad. the woofers need refoaming (the cones seems good) which will be a project when i have sometime. all in all, i'd say its not quite a steal but its a decent score (according to AK)


----------



## Meewoo

@Scottie,
  
 Nice score, if you don't have WAF, the cabinet should not be a problem. In the end, we listen to sound.
  
 You haven't post your impression about SA-8100 yet, any thoughts?


----------



## scottiebabie

yaa i read the JBL's are well thought of at AK though ive never owned a set before. this L96 came up on the local buysell and is quite highly rated as well so i thought it would be a good 1st project to try out refoaming, refinishing & perhaps recapping. im sure i can sell it easily if i didnt like the sound.
  
 as for the SA8100, i've busy with work & finalizing the move to my new place that i havent had a chance to touch it, nevermind listen. perhaps in Oct when i have a bit of time, i'd do a total deoxit & have a listen. reviews at AK have been good on it though.


----------



## PhoenixG

I find that the JBL l100's don't quite have the detail in the bass range that I want, but have a very pleasant sound signature that works well with rock and pop music. I imagine the 96's will be similar. At the least, they are easy to sell if you do end up with that route.


----------



## Trav

I have a technical question. Could it be the JBL and HPM excel in the rock genres d/t the fact they use such a small midrange driver in comparison to the size of the woofer and number of the tweeters? IMO rock is a much less mid focused genre.


----------



## PhoenixG

I'm not sure it's the size of the components, but how the crossovers are built. Those lines were created by the same guy who clearly had a certain sound profile he liked. There are designs for modern crossovers for those drivers on the internet that really take advantage of them and give a better (less wooly) sound I enjoy, but the ones in there now just don't do it for me. However, there are a ton of people out there who like how they sound now, so I never had the heart to change mine out.


----------



## petemac110

Here are my restored EV Interface A Series III speakers which I bought with perished woofer and passive radiator foams, perished foam lenses for the superdome tweeters, and in dirty condition overall.









Recapped EQ unit with signal-path electrolytics replaced with film caps, and power supply caps replaced. The EQ units are essential to getting the most out of the Interface A-D series of speaker. 












The crossovers have been recapped using AXON polypropylene caps throughout. This was a fairly straight-forward job.






I also replaced the original metal binding posts with proper 5-way binding posts which will accept banana plugs.






The tweeter foam lenses have been fitted, and new foam surrounds installed on the woofers and passive radiators. 










How do they sound? Very nice indeed! Not as refined as my Focus Audios, but they sound as 'big' as they look. Colour me impressed! They suit my various Sansui amps quite well. 

All I need is a bigger house to set them up permanently. This cramped rental property is frustrating the heck out of me. Not long now.


----------



## Wil

15" Tannoy Golds Baby! A very rough gauge of how they sound.
  
 I wouldn't trade them for anything in the world (will except perhaps a 15" Canterbury SE...
  
 Pardon the noise of the focus ring, i was using the video on my camera for the very 1st time.


----------



## scottiebabie

phoenixg said:


> I find that the JBL l100's don't quite have the detail in the bass range that I want, but have a very pleasant sound signature that works well with rock and pop music. I imagine the 96's will be similar. At the least, they are easy to sell if you do end up with that route.


 
  
 i think the L100 has the paper tweeter while the L96 has the 044 (alu-phenolic resin tweeters). while i have zero experience personally, dudes at AK compares the L96 more to L112 or 4410 (O44Ti tweets). L96 has 10" woofers while the L112 has the 12". L112 has bigger bass while L96 is tighter seems to be the prevalent opinion. 
  
 regardless i got this for a taste of the JBL sound but primarily as a project to hone my skills at refoaming, recapping & refinishing cabs before i work on the Yam NS1k. im sure i can get all the money back if i didnt like the L96.


----------



## Trav

wil said:


> 15" Tannoy Golds Baby! A very rough gauge of how they sound.
> 
> I wouldn't trade them for anything in the world (will except perhaps a 15" Canterbury SE...
> 
> Pardon the noise of the focus ring, i was using the video on my camera for the very 1st time.


Sick! I'm sure the wonder boy from Tx sounds incredible there.


----------



## MIKELAP

scottiebabie said:


> i think the L100 has the paper tweeter while the L96 has the 044 (alu-phenolic resin tweeters). while i have zero experience personally, dudes at AK compares the L96 more to L112 or 4410 (O44Ti tweets). L96 has 10" woofers while the L112 has the 12". L112 has bigger bass while L96 is tighter seems to be the prevalent opinion.
> 
> regardless i got this for a taste of the JBL sound but primarily as a project to hone my skills at refoaming, recapping & refinishing cabs before i work on the Yam NS1k. im sure i can get all the money back if i didnt like the L96.


 
  
 Back in 1977 when i got the L100 i chose them over a few other brands mainly because of the bass had a Quad 405 AT 100WPC to drive those man it was great theres always better but for punch and 100 db a 1 metre loved those speakers one tune i loved with those was SILENT FURY by GARY WRIGHT bass was great on that tune and its also pretty impressive with the Kef's 104.


----------



## scottiebabie

im pretty sure the L96s will sound nice after a refoam & xover recap. but i gotta say my NS1000M are sounding pretty amazing right now & its really kinda hard to accept lesser SQ. its so clear, transparent & detailed that its like im listening to a giant set of HD800s.
  
 color me crazy but here's an interesting development to the NS1000 - for whatever reason,  the volume opened after a couple days of initial usage but i found the bass lacking in respect to the stunning mids/highs. then after 2+mths of ownership, the bass popped out of nowhere yesterday & im getting some big bottom end kick. the kick drums is blowing my mind on Hotel California (Hell Freezes Over). i do not recall hearing this amount of bass punch & depth before yesterday!
  
 What...these are 30-40yrs old speakers! how can they still break in???


----------



## SpeakerBox

Scottie - I assume that when you do a recap on the xover you also replace iron core coils with air core - makes a huge difference.


----------



## scottiebabie

no i didnt know i should replace the inductor coils too. what particular brand and specs should i use?


----------



## SpeakerBox

You only replace if the xovers have iron core coils.  So if you have a 1mH iron core coil, you want a 1mH air core (will be much bigger and probably cost more).  The iron core causes hysteresis which almost always changes the sound for the worse.  If the coils are already air core you don't need to worry.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Due to being air core the coils are quite large as shown in my DIY speakers below:


----------



## trinhsman

Who is the music from?  LP name?


----------



## 99-1

finally:


----------



## scottiebabie

the cabinetry is gorgeous! what model of Yami tower is that?


----------



## analogsurviver

> What...these are 30-40yrs old speakers! how can they still break in???


 
 Been there, done that. PRECISELY because they are 30-40 years old. Electrolytic capacitors are the culprits. When I finally received my long time sought after Technics SB RX 50s, I almost broke into tears how crappy did they sound. Crappy as crappy, not crappy versus the fame behind the RX series...
  
 It turned out speakers had to be played at least 10 hours before coming kind of together - and they kept on improving for about 3-4 days and lthen levelled off. Take them out of operation for a day or two or simply not play them for that time - procedure repeats itself ALL OVER AGAIN. Funny thing is that capacitor values were still pretty much spot on, no appreciable discrepancy from nominal value, tightly matched channel to channel.
  
 Total recap with film capacitors; now you can have this pair - over my dead body only!


----------



## scottiebabie

@analogsurviver, thxs for the explanation - i think the fog is clearing up (abit atleast) for me. based on my research,  both the tweeters & woofers use electrolytics while the mids use "self healing' films. so based on what u just explained, the bass (woofers) opening up is the electrolytic caps "reconditioning" itself after some usage.
  
 its easy to get good films for the 2.7uf tweeter caps, its not so simple to fit films with the 94uf (2x47uf OEM) due to size. also wouldnt changing electrolytic to films change the sound signature also?


----------



## analogsurviver

scottiebabie said:


> @analogsurviver, thxs for the explanation - i think the fog is clearing up (abit atleast) for me. based on my research,  both the tweeters & woofers use electrolytics while the mids use "self healing' films. so based on what u just explained, the bass (woofers) opening up is the electrolytic caps "reconditioning" itself after some usage.
> 
> its easy to get good films for the 2.7uf tweeter caps, its not so simple to fit films with the 94uf (2x47uf OEM) due to size. also wouldnt changing electrolytic to films change the sound signature also?


 
  
 Larger values of film capacitors can be PITA - if one gets hold on them at all. Physical size, size of the hole they burn in the pocket - and one aspect most seem to be unaware of - the slew rate spec. If power amp driving these caps has say 120 W, that means approx + -70 V power supplies - and assuming amp to have 5 microsecond rise time, that means crossover can see 140/5 V per microsecond. Not all film capacitors can do that, the larger the value, the slower they are. There are fast high quality caps "available" - yet when one learns of the price, a compromise is usually in order. It is highly unlikely to see really good film caps in audio equipment - regardless of price.
  
 Film vs electrolytics - yes, there is a change of the sound signature. For the MUCH BETTER.. Trouble is, you have to go trough the entire system - from the microphone to speakers/phones in order to really get all the benefits. $$$$$. Very $$$$$. Reason why it is (almost) never done commercially..


----------



## PhoenixG

Just picked up three pairs of Sansui SP-XXXX series speakers. What can I say - I'm a sucker for the lattice grills. Anyways, they each need some TLC to get them fully functional, but I'll put up pics and impressions once I finish the repairs.


----------



## lotech

I have my original pair of Allison IVs from 1977, haven't listened to them in a while as the woofers ripped when I last moved, I need to find at least
 one replacement and preferably two. I liked the idea of the matched speaker components but probably have to give that idea up.


----------



## Meewoo

lotech said:


> I have my original pair of Allison IVs from 1977, haven't listened to them in a while as the woofers ripped when I last moved, I need to find at least
> one replacement and preferably two. I liked the idea of the matched speaker components but probably have to give that idea up.


 
  
 What do you mean "woofer ripped"? If it's the surround of woofer deteriorated, you can buy re-foam kit from ePay and re-form yourself.
  
 And, the tweeters alone are worth lot of money.
  
 I am asking since I have Allison 1, 2 and 3, and hate to see such wonderful speakers not used. (Although I must confess I didn't rotate mine also since I have to reform them).


----------



## lotech

One woofer needs refoaming the other has a tear in the woofer cone itself, so that one needs to be replaced. 
I love the Allison sound and one of my biggest regrets is missing a pair of Allison Ones that sold tor $100 off craigslist here and were in pristine condition. The ones were the first true high end speaker I ever spent time listening to, being a poor college student at the time I settled for the fours which weren't too much of a step down as I prefer mid and high frequency more than bass.
Currently I have a pair of Sonus Faber Concertos which are 15 years old so not quite vintage.
Marty


----------



## bliss53

Here is the current collection


----------



## Trav

bliss53 said:


> Here is the current collection


Got Klipsch?


----------



## moodyrn

Wow!


----------



## claybum

Nice!!!   Love the Klipsch sing on your mantle.


----------



## wotts

I picked up a pair of Pioneer S-1010 from Skylab earlier today. Here's a shot of my temporary bedroom setup:



They sound great! The HPM-100s seemed bassy/boomy in comparison, but it might be the less than ideal placement everything has.


----------



## Skylab

Looking good, Tim! And it was nice meeting you. The S-1010 is for sure a much better speaker than the HPM-100. But you could use the HPM-100 as subwoofers driven of your SX-1250 buy picking up some low pass filters from parts express.


----------



## wotts

skylab said:


> Looking good, Tim! And it was nice meeting you. The S-1010 is for sure a much better speaker than the HPM-100. But you could use the HPM-100 as subwoofers driven of your SX-1250 buy picking up some low pass filters from parts express.




Thanks, Rob! I'm glad we were able to meet.

I'll have to give that a shot. After seeing the way you had then S-910 configured in person (people, an SX-1980 is a beautiful thing) I think I might copycat. Rather than a tv, I'll have the receiver on top.


----------



## wotts

So, I found the Loudness button and stopped being a wussy with the volume knob. Well. 

:eek:

These rock.


----------



## Oregonian

Nice poster by the way.


----------



## wotts

oregonian said:


> Nice poster by the way.


 
  
  
 Thanks! I saw one on AK and had to have it. The girlfriend has banished it from the bedroom. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I have a Hubble image coming to replace it.


----------



## harrinj

Hello, I recently got a pair of B&O S60's at Audio Specialties in Portland, OR and the right speaker is making a vibrating sound on any music I think it might be the tweeter. is it blown out? The guy has a 90 day parts and warranty. I've tried them with all my amps, Kenwood KA-7100, Marantz 4400/4240 and HK 670 and it does it on all and on all inputs. the speaker will also do it at any volume while music is playing. I don't seem to recall this when he demonstrated them in his store and I certainly didn't blow it out.


----------



## PhoenixG

It's hard to say without hearing it. That could be a a few things. Check for a blown speaker by playing some music at a decent volume and listening to each driver individually. Don't hurt yourself though, just put your ear to each driver. If it sounds funny, listen to it's partner on the good sounding speaker to compare.
  
 If the sound is coming _from_ a driver, it could be a loose part internally to the driver or something more complex happening inside the crossover circuit. If you can localize the sound to a specific driver, try pulling that driver and looking at it carefully. Look for anything stuck to it (like a screw to the magnet, etc) or something behind the cone (damping material, dust bunnies, whatever). If there is no obvious problem, try gently pushing in on the cone to check for a voice coil rub. The cone should glide or even bounce, but definitely not scratch.
  
 If all the drivers work, it could be a loose piece inside the case. Diagnose by pulling the woofer and taking a look inside. You might have to pull everything off to get the best look. It's not uncommon for the internal bracing to come unglued and slap. Also check that everything is firmly attached to your crossovers by gently touching each piece on it and checking if it is loose. Make sure it's unplugged for that. This is a good time to check and replace fuses. If they are foggy or burst, replace them with proper replacements - fast acting fuses of the right rating. Also, if you have an ohmmeter, you can also check again that all drivers are working. Finally, make sure there isn't any loose junk in the bottom of the inside of the case that could be vibrating harmonically. If there's nothing loose inside, put all the damping material back in the case the way it came out, give it one last college try, and return it to the store if the noise is still there.
  
 Hope to hear that everything works out for you.


----------



## harrinj

phoenixg said:


> It's hard to say without hearing it. That could be a a few things. Check for a blown speaker by playing some music at a decent volume and listening to each driver individually. Don't hurt yourself though, just put your ear to each driver. If it sounds funny, listen to it's partner on the good sounding speaker to compare.
> 
> If the sound is coming _from_ a driver, it could be a loose part internally to the driver or something more complex happening inside the crossover circuit. If you can localize the sound to a specific driver, try pulling that driver and looking at it carefully. Look for anything stuck to it (like a screw to the magnet, etc) or something behind the cone (damping material, dust bunnies, whatever). If there is no obvious problem, try gently pushing in on the cone to check for a voice coil rub. The cone should glide or even bounce, but definitely not scratch.
> 
> ...


 
 I unscrewed the tweeter and took it out and it appeared to be the wires that were vibrating against the side? anyways i put the wires kinda to the side and it's no longer making the rattling noise! the speakers sound amazing it's a shame B&O modern stuff is crap when their 70's stuff is awesome. I have S45's as well and when I get a pre-processor I want to use them S45/S60's for a Quad system with my Marantz 4400.


----------



## Trav

Ran across some really cohesive synergy today. I've moved my HPM 100's to the living room, so my Dynaco A25's and recently acquired NHT SuperZero 2.1's are still in the bedroom. Today I decided to try the NHTs and the Dynaco stacked and have been nicely surprised. The imaging of the NHT and the richness of the Dynacos are currently presenting a sound I really didn't expect. Everything thus far is relatively seamless integration of each speakers strengths.....more to come.


----------



## KyungMin

Speakers: Eminent Technology LFT-3
 Cables: Audioquest midnight hyperlitz X4
 CD player: Yamaha CDX-1120
 Amp: B&K EX-442
 Preamp: Dynaco PAS-3 series II
 Tuner: B&K TS-108
  
 Bought these off a coworker for $1200.. Don't know how good the system is but I love how it sounds...
 He said he has kids and don't have room for them at his new house.. SO he'll cut me a deal..


----------



## Xovaan

I recently acquired a pair of Polk Monitor 5's for free with a broken tweeter. Fixed the tweeter and recapped and they're being used for my girlfriend's computer and PS3 with an HDMI splitter. They sound pretty great in my opinion but the soldering experience gained from the project was worth more than the sound, hah.
  
 Afterward, I bought some A/D/S B8's from a friend for $40. I just recapped them and now they're currently being used for my friend's garage DJ setup. Gotta say that the quality is pretty great given I paid about $100 total after custom made cables, parts, shipping, and gas to pick them up!


----------



## PhoenixG

NICE! Good to hear speakers getting a new home and some TLC!


----------



## kenshinhimura

speaking of some polk love, i bought my first speakers ever in the last 2-3 months. started with some polk sda crs. then came the cs400 center speaker, followed by sda2 speakers. not a bad little vintage surround sound system.


----------



## Kachui

sorry double post


----------



## Kachui

My vintage speakers...JBL L101.


----------



## Destroysall

Question: What are the Klipsch KG 5.2 loudspeakers worth today? I want to make an offer on the speakers alone from this ad → http://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/ele/4110119210.html


----------



## PhoenixG

Looking at the ol'bay, $200-350 seem to be the going price. But looking at that guy's price compared to the value of his lot of stuff, he probably values them on the lower end. You might be able to get them for a bargain.


----------



## KyungMin

Got this from a coworker..


  
 Speakers:
 Eminent Technology LFT-3
 Cables:
 Audio Quest Midnight Hyperlitz
 Hardware:
 Yamaha CDX-1120 (CD player)
 B&K TS-108 (tuner)
 B&K EX-442 Sonata Series (amp)
 Dynaco PAS-3 series II (preamp)
  
 Sorry for the phone pics...


----------



## harrinj

.


----------



## kernel8888

Anyone have any experience with speakerlab super 7's? I found a pair in great condition (minus a small stain on the top of one) at a local thrift stor for $30. I love em, will have to post some pics eventually


----------



## PhoenixG

Nice!


----------



## captouch

This thread has been awfully quiet.  Here's a couple of recent acquisitions:

 Wharfedale Rosedales (W70's):

  
 These were recapped with KBG oil filled caps (for tweeters) and just new (and maybe temporary) electrolytics (for mids).
  
  
 And also ESS AMT-1b's, which were refoamed (woofers and PR's) and recapped with electrolytics for now.

  
 And without the grills:


----------



## Skylab

Wow, those are awesome!


----------



## wotts

I love the look of the Wharfedales!


----------



## captouch

wotts said:


> I love the look of the Wharfedales!


 
  
 They're nice sounding too.  Not the last word in detail, but very smooth and laid back, without feeling like there's a big veil over the music.  Definitely furniture like in look.


----------



## PhoenixG

Well, I said something big was coming, and by that I meant physically large. And heavy.
 It was a package deal. I really just wanted the tuner, but hey, it's all good.
 MR-78 Tuner!
 MC-2125
 C-32
 Klipsch Cornwall


----------



## moodyrn

Great setups guys, and what a way to bring this thread back to life. Of course I love the Mac and cornwalls Phoenix, being a Mac and cornwall owner myself. I'm looking forward to your impressions of both.


@ Captouch: Man, I'm really digging the ess speakers. A very underrated speaker with tech that was way ahead of its time. I nearly scored a pair of those ones. Congrats to both of you.


----------



## captouch

moodyrn said:


> Great setups guys, and what a way to bring this thread back to life. Of course I love the Mac and cornwalls Phoenix, being a Mac and cornwall owner myself. I'm looking forward to your impressions of both.
> 
> 
> @ Captouch: Man, I'm really digging the ess speakers. A very underrated speaker with tech that was way ahead of its time. I nearly scored a pair of those ones. Congrats to both of you.


 
  
 Thanks Moodyrn.  The ESS acquisition was purely incidental.  I bought the Wharfedales via CL from this retired gentleman who is moving overseas soon, and he also happened to be selling two pairs of ESS AMT-1b's, one pair which needed refoaming.  But I was only after the Wharfedales at the time.  He played some music on the good pair of ESS's while I was there, but it wasn't music I was familiar with and it was more than I wanted to spend in any case.
  
 We talked awhile, he was a very nice guy.  He asked me if I wanted to take any records from his LP collection, which I almost didn't take the time to browse through, but ended up taking a bunch of them, all pristine and some really good ones.  Then on the way out, he offered me the vintage receiver he was demoing the speakers on.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  I asked him if he was sure, and he said yes.
  
 A week or so later, he emailed me and asked me if I wanted the pair of ESS's that needed refoaming since he wasn't getting any bites of CL.  So that's how I got these.  I wasn't sure if I was going to keep them at first, because the Wharfedales completed my last system and I didn't need an extra pair of speakers.  But after refoaming, replacing the crossover caps, and listening to them for the last week or so, I really don't see how I can let them go.  This Heil tweeter is awesome.


----------



## ferday

in case any of the vintage speaker guys are still trolling this thread, i scored some mint sansui sf-x7 for free.  just curious if anyone knows anything about these guys or if they are considered "valuable" vintage gear, it's hard to find much on the net about them.  i've only listened to them briefly, they seem to sound pretty nice with a heavy emphasis on the midrange, i was thinking about building a near-field setup with them...was trying to score a local sansui 9090 but the deal fell through, i got some advice that it's a great amp and i thought it would be fun to match the speakers


----------



## Skylab

Those are definitely not "valuable" speakers, no. But if you like the sound of them, then let the music play!


----------



## PhoenixG

ferday said:


> in case any of the vintage speaker guys are still trolling this thread, i scored some mint sansui sf-x7 for free.  just curious if anyone knows anything about these guys or if they are considered "valuable" vintage gear, it's hard to find much on the net about them.  i've only listened to them briefly, they seem to sound pretty nice with a heavy emphasis on the midrange, i was thinking about building a near-field setup with them...was trying to score a local sansui 9090 but the deal fell through, i got some advice that it's a great amp and i thought it would be fun to match the speakers


 
 Some research is saying that those might be the driver set from a SP-5000x with a POS crossover, meaning they have the potential to sound decent, but it is squandered without a new set of crossovers. You got a good deal at "free," but I wouldn't pay the $150 they go for online. I would save that for a better pair, maybe like my favorite sansui's, the sp-5500x. (I have two pairs of them, the only sansui's I have kept because they are so damn good for their price point, and easy to find parts for if you fry them)
 The 9090 db is, however, a fantastic amp. When restored, it's every ounce as good as a SX-1980. If you like the sound of that, maybe consider an early sony ES series - STR 6060, 6065, 6120, etc. They're not quite monsters, but they'll do about 70 true WPC and never ever clip, which is more than plenty for most uses. And they sound just as good in every sense except power as the 9090db. Oh, and they're cheap too. Like $150 for a decent one, $200 for a great one.
 Hope that helps, cheers.


----------



## ferday

phoenixg said:


> Some research is saying that those might be the driver set from a SP-5000x with a POS crossover, meaning they have the potential to sound decent, but it is squandered without a new set of crossovers. You got a good deal at "free," but I wouldn't pay the $150 they go for online. I would save that for a better pair, maybe like my favorite sansui's, the sp-5500x. (I have two pairs of them, the only sansui's I have kept because they are so damn good for their price point, and easy to find parts for if you fry them)
> The 9090 db is, however, a fantastic amp. When restored, it's every ounce as good as a SX-1980. If you like the sound of that, maybe consider an early sony ES series - STR 6060, 6065, 6120, etc. They're not quite monsters, but they'll do about 70 true WPC and never ever clip, which is more than plenty for most uses. And they sound just as good in every sense except power as the 9090db. Oh, and they're cheap too. Like $150 for a decent one, $200 for a great one.
> Hope that helps, cheers.




Thanks for the info! If it's just a x-over maybe I'll tear them down and build some new ones, a new project never hurts especially when the donor parts were free!


----------



## PhoenixG

Pair of these on the way. It has taken an amazing amount of willpower to not spill the beans on these until the deal was final.


----------



## ferday

phoenixg said:


> Pair of these on the way. It has taken an amazing amount of willpower to not spill the beans on these until the deal was final.




I'll admit I've never heard those but I do want to say how amazingly beautiful they are!


----------



## PhoenixG

I'm always willing to try something, but I hope that these xr-250's will be here to stay permanently. I think that they will...


----------



## analogsurviver

captouch said:


> Thanks Moodyrn.  The ESS acquisition was purely incidental.  I bought the Wharfedales via CL from this retired gentleman who is moving overseas soon, and he also happened to be selling two pairs of ESS AMT-1b's, one pair which needed refoaming.  But I was only after the Wharfedales at the time.  He played some music on the good pair of ESS's while I was there, but it wasn't music I was familiar with and it was more than I wanted to spend in any case.
> 
> We talked awhile, he was a very nice guy.  He asked me if I wanted to take any records from his LP collection, which I almost didn't take the time to browse through, but ended up taking a bunch of them, all pristine and some really good ones.  Then on the way out, he offered me the vintage receiver he was demoing the speakers on.
> 
> ...


 
 An interesting anectote regarding the ESS speakers. It happened at the Salone Internazionale della Musica ( SIM ), the famous show held every year in Milan, Italy.
 I no longer remember whether it was 1979 or 1986, but they were demonstrating the big Transar speaker system, with Heil drivers full range, not just tweeter as in AMT series. These are very rare to be seen, here the pic from the http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue65/ces2012.htm - the big dipole to the right :
  

  
 The inventor, Mr. Oscar Heil, was present at the show and I found him a very good spirited , and above all, highly enthusiastic gentleman. He explained, in greater detail that I could stomach at the show, the theory behind the midrange/bass Heil Driver and the associated amplifier; it is a VERY dedicated amp and you can not use anything else to drive these speakers. All you need is a decent preamp - from there on, It is Heil all the way.
  
 Demonstration went well, while I was there (morning/noon). These truly are amazing sounding speakers. However,  in the afternoon or the next day, a friend witnessed Transar speakers ( midrange ) catching fire 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 during a loud crescendo of symphonic music !!!
  
 I have heard about  reliability problems with the Transar rather frequently after this public display; I sincerely do hope ESS was able to root out the source of this unrealiability, as speakers, when they do work, trully are something special.


----------



## Skylab

Those look very cool, Phoenix! Will look forward to more pics once they are in your place. Congrats !


----------



## moodyrn

Congrats Phoenix. Those are beautiful speakers.


----------



## wotts

phoenixg said:


> Pair of these on the way. It has taken an amazing amount of willpower to not spill the beans on these until the deal was final.


 
  
  
 My 1051s are jealous! They look very nice.


----------



## PhoenixG

wotts said:


> My 1051s are jealous! They look very nice.


 
 Hehe, I hinted at it when I said I had one more Mctrick coming.


----------



## PhoenixG

GAH! Ok, so I have two identical pairs of the same speaker. One pair sounded amazing, and the other sounded like hot poop in comparison. Ok, well honestly they sounded fine. Passable, but not really great or what I was expecting. Anyways, I pulled all of them apart to try to figure out why there was a difference. Long story short, somebody had installed both midranges 180 out of phase and incorrectly.
  
 Long story long, I checked everything. I even dug into the crossover and cleaned every connection with deoxit. What I found was that on these midranges, each connector has two prongs; one prong is painted over to indicate the polarity of the connection, but could still be hooked on to if you weren't paying attention. On both midranges, the polarities were reversed and the painted prong had the connector on it. Once the mid was correctly installed, the speakers just opened up and sounded EXACTLY like their brothers. 
 I'm just baffled. Why on earth would anyone ever put a connector on over paint? It obviously was wrong. 
 And because y'all love photos...


----------



## wotts

I love it!
  
 I had a similar thing going the day I brought home the XR 1051s. They were in the room with the HPM-100s and S-1010s, all hooked to the 1980. I wish I had snapped a photo.


----------



## moodyrn

I've been working on two vintage electrostatic projects lately and here are two post about them  from the vintage receiver/integrated thread. I thought it was time to post to the appropriate thread. For now I will mostly update my progress with the quads since the acoustats are mostly finished and required much less work.
  
 IQuote:


moodyrn said:


> Just want to make quick post of some vintage electrostatic speakers I've been playing with the past few weeks. They are acoustat spectra 11 esl hybrids, featuring a four foot tall esl panel on top of a bass unit with an 8 inch driver. Everything I've read about them points to the esl panel being gold and the bass unit being horrible. I will say I think both are under statements.
> 
> The sound coming from the esl panel is as good as "any" electrostatic I've listened to. But the bass is just atrocious. I mean probably the worse bass I've listen too which is why probably 99% of all owners replace the driver with something else. This gave me an opportunity to play around(a lot) with winisd, and over the last couple of weeks I've gone through 5 sets of drivers. But I will say with all of the ones I've tried, modeling with winisd has been spot on with the response I've gotten from each one of them.
> 
> ...


 
  
  


moodyrn said:


> Thanks guys for the kind words and advice. I just got them in the house, so here are a few pics snapped with my phone. I hadn't put the legs on yet though.


----------



## moodyrn

As of now, I've pretty much gutted the quads and found that one of the mains transformers was fried, I have a ripped/torn dust cover from a bass panel of each of the speakers. The good news is there is no damage from arcing so I won't have to rebuild any of the panels. A replacement mains transformer was a bugger find. No quad repair shop in the US had one since it's something that rarely fails. No Shop in England or AUS had one either. I was fortunate enough to source one from Germany. I also have to parts coming to rebuild the power supply and crossovers which should arrive today. I rebuilt the dust covers earlier today and waiting for the glue to dry to finish those up. I hope to get started with the crossover rebuild today as well. I hope to have everything finished by this weekend and will update later today with pics of the teardown process.


----------



## moodyrn

Here's a pic of the torn dust cover, and pics with the torn plastic removed from both along with removal of the input transformers and power supplies.
 .
  

  
 The next pic really shows the importans of the dust covers as the electrostatic panels are a magnet for dust. 

 It took while to get all of the dust off, the rear was even worst with layers upon layer of dust on everything.

  
 And finally pics of the fried mains transformer. This thing was totally fried!
  

  

  
 More more to come.


----------



## JamesHuntington

I'm a huge fan of vintage speakers. I currently own a pair of AR-2ax and rectilinear mini III. I love the sound of them with vinyl. 
I offered to sell my friend a pair AR-2a that I got at a thrift store and had cleaned. I set them up in his room to his Cambridge amp. He was using new paradigms and a Polk audio sub at the time. He never switched back and is also now a believer.


----------



## moodyrn

Well, I'm finally fished with the quads. Here are a few pics of the rebuilt crossovers, power supply, and dust panels.





I do plan to build clamp boards sometime later. As a temporary solution, there's a mod to the crossover by placing a gas bulb between pin 7 and 9 that will clip them at 1.5kv volts where the treble panel will arc at around 2.2kv.


----------



## PhoenixG

I saw these and almost had a spit-take. Brand spankin' new hotness with all the gadgets- ipod, wifi, bluetooth, but the classic L100 styling! 

 I'm starting to think we're really on to something with the vintage speakers. Kinda like the people who collect the old comic books eh?


----------



## JamesHuntington

phoenixg said:


> I saw these and almost had a spit-take. Brand spankin' new hotness with all the gadgets- ipod, wifi, bluetooth, but the classic L100 styling!
> 
> I'm starting to think we're really on to something with the vintage speakers. Kinda like the people who collect the old comic books eh?


 

I used a program called sketch up a few years ago to make these. I have very little design or dimension experience but hope it inspires someone. I wanted to make the oldie style one piece stereo like the one in my grandparents house, but more up to date, elegant and hifi.


----------



## PhoenixG

jameshuntington said:


> I used a program called sketch up a few years ago to make these. I have very little design or dimension experience but hope it inspires someone. I wanted to make the oldie style one piece stereo like the one in my grandparents house, but more up to date, elegant and hifi.


 
 NICE LOOK!
 I think the only way I could justify a project like that with vintage parts is if a set of fantastic speakers came up for sale without a cabinet.
  
 On an unrelated note - I had some time to listen to my xr-250's and found them to be a little soft in the midrange, so I did what anyone would do: I took them apart. I found pretty much what I was expecting for a 20+ year old set of speakers. At least one of the woofers was installed backwards (+/- reversed), plenty of the crimped connections were loose, the damping material had sagged and moved about, and a few items had come unglued from the x-overs and had the potential to jangle. I cleaned (deoxit) and recrimped _all_ the crimp connections, re-installed the woofer that was backwards, re-glued loose x-over items, and rearranged the damping material. I've seen these problems plenty of times in the past. These problems are all very common on speakers that have been moved around a lot, serviced a few times, or are just plain old. 
  
 End result: I found the response to have a few more dB's in the midrange, allowing the sound to be a bit more open and less 'distant'. Also, the bass was more controlled as well. I think it brought them into the flat response balance they were designed for with much more overall listening pleasure for me.


----------



## PhoenixG

So my cat managed to knock over one of my xr-16's the other day, impaling the midrange and busting the grill. Obviously I'm super bummed as they were some of my favorite speakers. I think I can fix them, so I made a trip to home depot to repair the grill with some pine 1/2x3/4'' and ordered mellotone grill cloth from adorama. Fixing the grill was easy enough. I even recovered the other one so they'd match. Now I don't have to constantly be reminded of how broken they are with the grills back on.
  
 However, I'm not just looking for nice furniture, I want them to sound the same again. The real quandary I had was repair vs replace on the busted driver. I was able to find a replacement online, but it was a slightly older variant of the driver and the part numbers will never match again. I also got a mailer with one of the little fly out ads for reconing speakers from parts express. Serendipity? I hope so. I'm giving it a shot and I'll tell you all how it goes.


----------



## joehalo

Good luck with the fix. Anyone ever heard a pair of infinity kappa 7s? Does $300 for a mint pair sound fair?


----------



## PhoenixG

I think Inifnity has made a LOT of decent speakers. Their house sound is very pleasing to me. However, I've been more drawn to their newer items with the CMMD drivers more so than their older items.
 That being said, I think your price is right. Be aware of condition, as always.
 This guy had a great article about reconditioning a pair that sounded "off".
 http://www.soundfountain.com/infinity/kappa7a_1.html


----------



## joehalo

Well I got them and wow. They sound incredible. These are by far the nicest speakers I've ever owned. So smooth. Thanks for the link. Lots of useful info!


----------



## imeem

Technics sb 2520. Running it in a mono setup because the other speaker's speaker partially don't work.


----------



## PhoenixG

imeem said:


> Technics sb 2520. Running it in a mono setup because the other speaker's speaker partially don't work.


 
 Strange that it would partially not work. Did you try cleaning the contacts between the drivers and leads? Deoxit works on speakers too and I've had it work miracles.


----------



## imeem

phoenixg said:


> Strange that it would partially not work. Did you try cleaning the contacts between the drivers and leads? Deoxit works on speakers too and I've had it work miracles.


 
 Nope maybe i will try. The last time i try using the other speaker, the largest and i think second largest woofer doesn't make sound. Only the tweeter does.


----------



## PhoenixG

OK, cool. Well, if you do have them apart. also check for continuity across the speakers. After the driver is puller, you can use a multimeter to check if each individual driver is blown, and check the crossover for burnt/blown components.


----------



## joehalo

The bass is so tight and controlled on the kappa's compared to the hpm.


----------



## randerson07

joehalo said:


> The bass is so tight and controlled on the kappa's compared to the hpm.


 
 That rooms looks fantastic.


----------



## PhoenixG

joehalo said:


> The bass is so tight and controlled on the kappa's compared to the hpm.


 
 Congrats on the find. I also found the hpm's to have a muddy bass and a lot more distortion than average infinity speakers. I've had the hpm 100's, 60's, and 150's. The 100's & 60's were very similar in sound with what you heard, but the 150's were really superb.


----------



## joehalo

There are a pair of HPM 150s on my local craigslist for $1000. A bit over my budget Lol.


----------



## PhoenixG

Ehhhh, that's prettymuch the going rate. If you got them for $600, you'd be doing well. That's how much mine were after all the repairs. They sound about as good as klipsch cornwall I's, but getting parts is hit or miss.


----------



## Skylab

I have a pair of Kappa 6's. Great speakers. Much better than HPM-100's. I agree. The Kappa 6 is a remarkable speaker for the size and era. Truly a great sounding speaker even by today's standards.


----------



## analogsurviver

skylab said:


> I have a pair of Kappa 6's. Great speakers. Much better than HPM-100's. I agree. The Kappa 6 is a remarkable speaker for the size and era. Truly a great sounding speaker even by today's standards.


 
 Infinity did produce very good speakers, although not all were top notch, on average much better than average. Personally, I am clueless how the (likes of ) HPM 100's
 are held in so high esteem/command the prices they do. Although Infinitys may well have some rough edges here and there, it is hard to find a model that did not subscribe to the widest/flattest response maxima, given the cost. But on average, they do like above average powered amps to give their best.
  
 No idea exactly when Infinity got sold and became - ahem - *slightly* less high quality product. But good ol' models are worth seeking and ressurecting - if one goes to
 investigate what did change from the original IRS V from 40 years ago to the present version, Genesis 1.2, there is unbelievably little - and although no doubt the latest incarnation is an improvement, I doubt anyone would mind having IRS V as the main speakers. 
  
 Similar can be said about Infinity smaller lower priced models - they have withstood the test of time.


----------



## PhoenixG

My wife brought home some speakers that she thought would look "cute" as end tables or bedside tables. They're wharfedale 60's with cabinet trim. They have a simple crossover with only 3 components for a two way speaker. My wife likes them and since she got them for damn near free, I don't mind them. They are heavy and literally full of sand (made that way for damping).
 One came without any wires, so I completely rewired it with monster cable. Here's what it looks like inside and installed.


----------



## Skylab

Cool! How do they sound?


----------



## PhoenixG

skylab said:


> Cool! How do they sound?


 
 Errrr, to put it politely, good enough, but not amazing. The sound comes out very colored towards warm. There seems to be a substantial gap between where the woofer rolls off and where the tweeter picks up. The bass extends down to about 60 Hz. One of the tweeters seems to be having a problem, maybe the surround has separated or something is stuck in the voice coil, as it gets scratchy at high volumes. I think the potentiometers are bungling the sound, as no amount of deoxit will make them less scratchy. The caps are good though. I suppose it's not too important how they sound all together. My wife thinks they're adorable and now I get to have a system in the bedroom. If I want better sound quality, I'll just install some small infinity's (or something similar) and keep using the wharfedales as bed-side tables.
 Right now, I'm just using a sony str-6040, an average vintage amp that can do about 20W cleanly per side.
 The good news is that they are unobjectionable for background music, and maybe with a few repairs/mods I can have them sounding a bit more lush and a bit less scratchy.
 So far, I've put four whole dollars in to them, and at that price, I really can't complain. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Here's what the system looks like:

  
 And here's the required EQ to get a flat response (approx)


----------



## Skylab

That's not surprising...speakers really started to become good in the 70's, with of course a few very notable earlier exceptions.


----------



## PhoenixG

Let's talk quickly about maintenance for older acoustic suspension speakers. I have a number of mcintosh xr-16 speakers and I just love them to death. The problem is that whenever I put more than 25-ish watts to them, they made a horrible noise.  It sounded like the woofers were bottoming out even though I knew for a fact that they weren't. 
 Here's what I found: every speaker with a problem had started to come apart in the back. There's a distinct line around the back surface that traces the outline of the wood panel that makes the back of the speaker cabinet on every problem speaker. You can clearly see this line in ebay/CL listings selling many different mcintosh speakers. I even found a set of xr-14's that are for sale now that have the symptomatic line on them clearly shown. (not my listing...)

 You can just barely see the line working its way up the right edge of the right speaker. I've seen the problem personally on xr-7,14 and 16's, and I suspect it exists on all similar mcintosh speakers. I was able to solve the problem on my xr-16's by re-gluing all the seams from the inside with woodglue. I think many speakers in the same situation could use the same treatment to recover from the years of aging and coming apart. I had to remove the drivers to get the glue in there, but it is making an enormous difference to the sound. No more bottoming noise and much better power handling. Better sound makes me happy.


----------



## purplegoat

Hi guys just in case this can help anyone out: I have a pair of Kevek ES-10 speakers (amped from Denon PMA-750) and they sound great. They don't have the high frequency of high end studio speakers as far as I can tell but everything sounds 10/10 on them and never harsh. Absolutely swear by them


----------



## roskodan

hi, need help identifying a vintage speaker's woofer driver unit,
  
 btw, any more appropriate place (site, forum, community) where i could get infos about it?
  
 pics in spoiler
  
 woofer is 7-8 inch, made in canada, and what i guess are it's part number PL9C4 and serial 4DR51745, got em in the early '90
  
 also, i could really use a pair, or at least one, celestion SP5875 metal dome tweeter, in good shape, if anyone has some spare or knows where to get em, let me know 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


Spoiler: woofer and tweeter pics


----------



## PhoenixG

Wish I could be more helpful, but when I'm looking for a hard to find part, I start with google, then check with the original manufacturer, then ebay, then look for a recone from parts express. You can also set up an alert in ebay to find specific items.


----------



## roskodan

thx, the speakers were a project by a local hobbyist, don't know the manufacturer of the woofer driver... no label on the units...


----------



## Destroysall

Any comments for the Klipsch KG 3.2? There's a Mint condition looking pair available off Craigslist for only $200.
 http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/ele/4578825904.html
  
 I feel like the asking price may be a bit much, but I also thought these would pair well with my Marantz 2220B receiver.


----------



## PhoenixG

I've got a set of the KG 3's, not -.2 I haven't heard them in a while, but I haven't heard a bad klipsch. I would recommend adding a fuse on the tweeter though. They blow out (or at least are blown on mine).


----------



## Oregonian

destroysall said:


> Any comments for the Klipsch KG 3.2? There's a Mint condition looking pair available off Craigslist for only $200.
> http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/ele/4578825904.html
> 
> I feel like the asking price may be a bit much, but I also thought these would pair well with my Marantz 2220B receiver.




I have the 3.2's and love them. Not sure on that $200 price but they are quality and the wood work is first rate.


----------



## moodyrn

200.00 isn't bad, but not what I would call a great deal either. Some times you can score a pair of kg4s for that price, and those are much better speakers and just outside of the heritage line. But you won't find a better pair of modern speakers for 200.00 though. So I would at least make the trip to have a good listen.


----------



## calipilot227

destroysall said:


> Any comments for the Klipsch KG 3.2? There's a Mint condition looking pair available off Craigslist for only $200.
> http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/ele/4578825904.html
> 
> I feel like the asking price may be a bit much, but I also thought these would pair well with my Marantz 2220B receiver.


 
  
 The 3.2s are good, but if you look around (somewhere other than eBay, of course), you might find a pair of 5.2s for that price. And they're a whole lot better.


----------



## Destroysall

moodyrn said:


> So I would at least make the trip to have a good listen.


 
 I am thinking I just might go ahead and do that. It'd be nice to try them, if anything at least.
  


calipilot227 said:


> The 3.2s are good, but if you look around (somewhere other than eBay, of course), you might find a pair of 5.2s for that price. And they're a whole lot better.


 
 I've read great reviews for the KG 5.2 speakers, so I indeed will keep an eye out for them. Thanks!


----------



## joehalo

JBL L-166 and Boston Acoustics A-100


----------



## SpeakerBox

joehalo said:


> JBL L-166 and Boston Acoustics A-100


 
  
 Always wanted to hear the A100s.  Are they on the warm or brighter side?


----------



## joehalo

The A100 are warm and smooth. Polar opposite of the JBL.


----------



## SpeakerBox

Sounds like they might be a good match for my sx-1250.


----------



## joehalo

Anyone have any experience with JBL 4311? Is $350 for a minty pair a good price?


----------



## mrtim6

My lovely vintage Sony SS-G7a 15 inch woofers yet the midrange is to die for.
Soundstage fit for a Super Bow

l


----------



## SpeakerBox

mrtim6 said:


> My lovely vintage Sony SS-G7a 15 inch woofers yet the midrange is to die for.
> Soundstage fit for a Super Bow
> 
> l


 
  
 I like the speaker stands.  Very nice!


----------



## mrtim6

Thanks the speaker stands were made by Setty (of Paul Masion furniture) a master furniture maker here in Sydney he is semi retired. The design is very similar to the speaker stands which came with the NSX10000 limited edition Yamahas


----------



## mrtim6

Yamaha NS-2000 heaven - they are 33 years old and they are fantastic - easily match 30k speakers I have heard for transparency, dynamics, timing and speed. They have the clarity of electrostatic speekers & yet the're bass response is not lacking at all.
One of the biggest bargains ever in audio IMO


----------



## Destroysall

Quick question: what is the general consensus on the Infinity Qa speakers? I recently got handed down a pair from a friend who found them at a Goodwill. I haven't tried them out yet since my Marantz 2220b is being cleaned and repaired right now. They have Infinity's famous tweeters from the looks of it, but are they worth keeping or refurbishing? Silly question I know, so please forgive me.


----------



## Skylab

Try them out. They are decent speakers for sure if fully functional.


----------



## analogsurviver

destroysall said:


> Quick question: what is the general consensus on the Infinity Qa speakers? I recently got handed down a pair from a friend who found them at a Goodwill. I haven't tried them out yet since my Marantz 2220b is being cleaned and repaired right now. They have Infinity's famous tweeters from the looks of it, but are they worth keeping or refurbishing? Silly question I know, so please forgive me.


 
 Qa http://www.bobbyshred.com/infinity/Qa.html  is a very nice speaker. It likes being pushed by a powerful amp - and your Marantz is at the lowest power output recommended by Infinity for this speaker, 15-150 W RMS. 
  
 So, not to be true to your name on head-fi, a word of wisdom. Back in the day (late 70s), a friend had Qa speakers - and a small amplifier, around the spec for your Marantz. Long story short - he blew the EMIT tweeters a few times due to amplifier clipping - ALL the distortion of a heavily clipped signal results in tons and tons of harmonics of the original signal ( usually some kick bass drum and similar ) - ALL landing on the poor tweeter. Although EMIT is tougher than most, it is not indestructible. Back then, it was  ( writing to Infinity for an invoice, scraping together the money, buying the hard currency ( that was in Yugoslavia) , paying trough bank, waiting and paying for the customs - before the EMITs could be rebuild and playing again - the whole process took using snail mail some 2 months) _*relatively *_easy - no idea how it is today with EMIT replacement diaphragms vintage say 1977. You can always use conductive glue/paint for minor repairs - but it will no longer be the same speaker.
  
 Then this friend got Marantz DC 170 power amp (and its preamp - 150 W RMS or so ) ) - and no time this combo has been in his possession, did the EMITs go to the hounting grounds again. Despite we were not exactly easy on the volume knob for quite a few times - to this day I can remember one Yes "session" that did surpass anything usually thought of as being "normal" - but it was pure, unbridled fun
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
  
 Long story even shorter - try to get something more powerful to drive the Qa's. Despite being the smallest/cheapest speaker in the Infinity line, it was STILL a relatively large speaker by today's standards - so treating it with some due respect definitely is in order.
  
 BEFORE you fry the EMITs...


----------



## sludgeogre

Recently got my Dad's old setup running. McIntosh C26 preamp, McIntosh MC2105 power amp, and Magnepan Tympani 1D speakers. The preamp is a bit screwed up (volume pot has a lot of noise on it and channel imbalance), but the power amp and speakers work flawlessly. My Bifrost through a SYS into the system is pretty incredible. The soundstage, obviously, is absolutely monstrous. The only thing I'm missing is some extra dynamic impact, which I know planars lack, but the newer 1.7 Magnepan speakers definitely have a better sense of impact over these guys. Still, liquid smooth and MONSTROUS sound from these guys. Really enjoying it.


----------



## PhoenixG

sludgeogre said:


> Recently got my Dad's old setup running. McIntosh C26 preamp, McIntosh MC2105 power amp, and Magnepan Tympani 1D speakers. The preamp is a bit screwed up (volume pot has a lot of noise on it and channel imbalance), but the power amp and speakers work flawlessly. My Bifrost through a SYS into the system is pretty incredible. The soundstage, obviously, is absolutely monstrous. The only thing I'm missing is some extra dynamic impact, which I know planars lack, but the newer 1.7 Magnepan speakers definitely have a better sense of impact over these guys. Still, liquid smooth and MONSTROUS sound from these guys. Really enjoying it.


 
 WOW! What a nice system to inherit! Consider cleaning out the c-26 with some deoxit to help with the scratchiness and imbalances. It's a piece of cake on that unit, the hardest problem I had with mine was keeping the chrome chassis from getting deoxit schmutz on it.


----------



## sludgeogre

phoenixg said:


> WOW! What a nice system to inherit! Consider cleaning out the c-26 with some deoxit to help with the scratchiness and imbalances. It's a piece of cake on that unit, the hardest problem I had with mine was keeping the chrome chassis from getting deoxit schmutz on it.


 
 Thanks! Luckily the inheritance is a living one. I'm taking the preamp to a stereo guru here in Eugene since my dad is also paying for the repair. I'm glad that I may not have to replace that volume pot.
  
 Also, the headphone section on the MC2105 is ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE. It makes my LCD-2 sound scarily good. Its so good it actually pissed my girlfriend off. She really enjoys the LCD-2, but she said the level of realness with the MC2105 combo is so intense that she doesn't want to listen to her music any other way! She said she hates the fact that she has paid for all of this music and can't hear all of the detail without a system like this one.


----------



## SpeakerBox

One interesting thing I have noticed lately is vintage audiophiles congregating at the vinyl records in Goodwill.  I tend to make a sweep through GW every week or so to look for vintage audio and embellish my record connection.  At that time I usually run into another audiophile perusing the records.  The subject of vintage and a general dislike for CDs will generally come up.  This past weekend a guy was telling me that someone just gave him a Sansui 9090 (I told him to hold on to it as it was a keeper).
  
 I am building the original Leach phono stage so my interest in vinyl has been re-ignited.  I bought the boards from Professor Leach back in 1977 and just never got around to building them.  Anyway the power supply is nearing completion and the phono stage works.  Hoping that the better parts I am using will yield improved sound (all film caps for EQ and Elna Silmic II for coupling - toroid transformer to boot).  Going to set it up to run with dual mono PS so that should help.  Right now just running with one supply.  Having a great time with this.


----------



## Oregonian

A craigslist find yesterday...................two Polk Audio M5JR bookshelfs from 1990 added to my family room system with the Pioneer SX-1050 driving them.  Very sweet sound and thump plenty good enough for me.  And meet the WAF.


----------



## willmax

oregonian said:


> A craigslist find yesterday...................two Polk Audio M5JR bookshelfs from 1990 added to my family room system with the Pioneer SX-1050 driving them.  Very sweet sound and thump plenty good enough for me.  And meet the WAF.


 

 Those Polk Audio look sweet particularly when sitting alongside a SX-1050.
  
 Can anyone tell me if the Yamaha NS-G40 speakers are any good for a vintage receiver setup? I know these are not exactly vintage speakers but I just thought I'd ask you clever folks.
 Cheers


----------



## PhoenixG

willmax said:


> Those Polk Audio look sweet particularly when sitting alongside a SX-1050.
> 
> Can anyone tell me if the Yamaha NS-G40 speakers are any good for a vintage receiver setup? I know these are not exactly vintage speakers but I just thought I'd ask you clever folks.
> Cheers


 
 Decent modern speakers can absolutely sound good on vintage gear. My favorite combo is modern infinity cmmd speakers with old sony gear.


----------



## wotts

I just swapped my Wharfedale Diamond 10.1s to the Marantz 2265 and it sounds excellent. Much more neutral than the Aleph 3, but that combo was damn good too.
  
 Also, the McIntosh XR 1051s sounds nice on the Aleph, but it's seems to be missing some bass. It could be this head cold too.


----------



## bikerboy94

My Klispch Quartets. 20 years old this year and going strong.


----------



## willmax

phoenixg said:


> Decent modern speakers can absolutely sound good on vintage gear. My favorite combo is modern infinity cmmd speakers with old sony gear.


 

 I completely agree with you as far as decent modern speaker goes, the question is whether the Yamaha NS-G40 are considered of a decent quality or whether they are just an average speaker – sorry about the poorly worded query in my initial post.

  
 I did a quick google search and it did not yield a lot of results but it looks like these speakers were mainly made in Finland if that is anything to go by.


----------



## PhoenixG

willmax said:


> I completely agree with you as far as decent modern speaker goes, the question is whether the Yamaha NS-G40 are considered of a decent quality or whether they are just an average speaker – sorry about the poorly worded query in my initial post.
> 
> 
> I did a quick google search and it did not yield a lot of results but it looks like these speakers were mainly made in Finland if that is anything to go by.


 
 Sorry I don't have any personal experience with those models. Yamaha makes some nice speakers, so it might be worth a listen. If it sounds good on modern equipment, it will sound just as good on vintage.


----------



## pippen99

My first system back in the day:  Sansui 5000a receiver + Pioneer PL- a45 turntable + Wharfedale W60E speakers + Koss ESP9 headphones.  I loved the W60s and still wish I owned them.  I do still have the ESP9 headphones though I haven't used them in years.  What I do listen to everyday are my ADS.  I have two ADS Braun L810 that I got around 1977 and two ADS L810 I bought off Ebay about 8 years ago.  If I didn't have these my favorite audio memory is  of my two friends back in Phoenix.  One had a pair of Ess AMT1 and the other had a pair of Rectilinear III Highboys.  I really loved the Highboys.


----------



## KurtTennant

I'm only 18, but when I recently got an Audio-Technica LP60 turntable my dad dig up some of his old stuff. He's got a few vintage receivers and speakers. The current receiver we use is the Pioneer Sx-770 I believe, with some really old modded bose 301 speakers and some JBL decades for the bass. When the tweeters wore out in the Bose my dad replaced the cones and added extra tweeters to them. Really a great system!


----------



## PhoenixG

kurttennant said:


> I'm only 18, but when I recently got an Audio-Technica LP60 turntable my dad dig up some of his old stuff. He's got a few vintage receivers and speakers. The current receiver we use is the Pioneer Sx-770 I believe, with some really old modded bose 301 speakers and some JBL decades for the bass. When the tweeters wore out in the Bose my dad replaced the cones and added extra tweeters to them. Really a great system!


 
 Nice! You might like some of the things going on at the vintage receiver forum.
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/537704/calling-all-vintage-integrated-receiver-owners/14685#post_11764280


----------



## KurtTennant

I have been there before, and it is rather interesting!


----------



## michigannick

golden ears said:


> I have 2 sets of Infinity Reference Standard 1b's, IMHO they still hold their own against all other speakers at any price point, plus they can play at life like levels (rock concert)  if needed. They only issue with these speakers is that they want a nice flat wall to reflect the rear wave off off (similar to Magneplanars and other dipole radiator loudspeakers). I used to get flown around to set these up.
> 
> I probably am going to sell off one pair of mine in the next few weeks when I get around to posting them on Ebay. The last set of RS1's (RS1-a) ended up getting crated and sent to British Columbia.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 Lots of cool gear guys!
  
 Golden Ears those infinities look  awesome .. my first  post here so of course i bump an ancient thread   what type of finish is on them? oil? poly?


----------



## joehalo

My ADS 910. Love them,


----------



## Oregonian

Joe...............those are gorgeous! This thread has been dead for so long..................great job reviving it!


----------



## fliz

Exemplar horns (w/ vintage Altec Lansing Voice of the Theater drivers) and Karlson subs


----------



## davelarz

Still own a pair of Infinity RSIIIa's and I still think that, if you have a room where their size isn't prohibitive, they are an incredible bargain. Can be found used in the 300-400 range and their performance is equal IMO to many speakers in the 2000-3000 range today. I have a pair of Triton Twos now and though these speakers best the Infinities it's not by a wide margin... and the Tritons for almost 3k new.


----------



## DamageInc77

I got a pair of TDL Reference Standard speakers in British racing green.







Replacement drivers can be had except for the woofers, which worries me slightly.


----------



## DogMeat (Jun 26, 2017)

Celestion SL6'ers.
LOVE THEM.
Lots and lots.
Can be tricky to drive.....




They are my "desktop" speakers for music from my Mac, usually powered by a Carver amp, dac'd by a Schiit Bifrost.


----------



## SpeakerBox

DamageInc77 said:


> I got a pair of TDL Reference Standard speakers in British racing green.
> 
> 
> Replacement drivers can be had except for the woofers, which worries me slightly.




What is the woofer?  Does not look like a KEF B139 (can be obtained on Ebay).


----------



## DamageInc77

SpeakerBox said:


> What is the woofer?  Does not look like a KEF B139 (can be obtained on Ebay).



http://www.falconacoustics.co.uk/tdl-3021gt-16-ohm-pair.html


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## SpeakerBox

Wanted to add a vintage, period correct pair of speakers to my SX-1250.  Enter the EPI 100 series 3:

 

Quite an amazing sounding small speaker IMHO.


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## SpeakerBox

Now on stands (yet to be painted or spiked):


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## SpeakerBox

It turns out that these EPIs were built by Harmon industries shortly after they aquired EPI.  Not the same quality as the original 100s.  Sound is ok, not great.  More listening needed.


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## SpeakerBox (Jan 20, 2020)

So any of you you looking for EPI 100s.  Don't get the series three.  Not very good!  Boomy bass and sucked out mids.


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## Oregonian

Been using Klipsch 3.2's and Cerwin Vega DX-3's for the past few years and finally found my dream set this past summer..................Cerwin Vega DX-5's (big bro to the DX-3's).  Pristine condition though they did need the rubber surrounds replaced.


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## SpeakerBox

Very nice @Oregonian !


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## SpeakerBox

I am going to do some upgrades on my EPI 100 IIIs.  They have used some very cheap parts in the crossovers (electrolytic cap and iron core coil) and I have parts laying around so will rebuild the crossover.  Also Human Speakers sells parts allowing people to build there own authentic EPI 100 speakers so if I don't like the results with the crossover change I will ditch the drivers and replace with some from HS (thereby reusing the old series three box).

For anyone interested: https://www.humanspeakers.com/index.htm


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## SpeakerBox

Well, I dumped the EPIs.  These were the cheap versions sold after EPI was acquired by Harmon industries.  But now I have a mint pair of KEF Q10s that I like very much:


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## SpeakerBox

Swapped out the Q10s for a pair of Infinity RS-2001 speakers.  Sounds good so far.  Unfortunately not very impressed by the Q10s.


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## SpeakerBox

Turns out that the problem with the KEF Q10s was that the crossovers were way out of spec.  Some of the cheap electrolytic caps were more than 30% off.  Some that were said to be 16uf measured in at 25uf!  The 7uf caps were found to be more than 10uf.  No wonder the sound was bad!  I recapped and they sound very nice now.  Will probably keep them.


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## SpeakerBox (Nov 1, 2020)

The recap of the Q10s helped, but I think they are just not for me.  So now I have B&W DM 602 S2 in the house!


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## PhoenixG

I've moved to a new place and the whole kit and kaboodle came with me. For the most part, everything was fine, but the speakers had some mild damage in transit.
Somehow about a fourth of the drivers stopped working on the right speaker. After a few days fretting and unpacking, I finally found my tools and multimeter. I had to do some surgery to get them singing again. It seems they had been jostled a bit and a few of the internal connectors came loose. Also, one of the midrange drivers totally had failed. Since these speakers use a series-parallel scheme, one driver failing turns off three others.
Fresh driver is on the way, and once it gets here I'll send the old one off for repairs. For now, it's bypassed so I can still play music. Here's how it looks all together.
Cheers


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## SpeakerBox (Aug 10, 2021)

So, as you may have guessed I am pretty fussy about speakers.  The B&W 602 S2 are very nice but still not what I am looking for as a match for my DIY F6 (Thanks Nelson!).   So I started to wonder why the Infinity RS-2001s I was given for free sounded so bad.  Went back and took a closer look and discovered two things:

1.) The woofer had been replaced with an after market version that was entirely a wrong match for the xover and box, and
2.) Both tweeters were blown.

So I had a choice, dump them or bring them back to spec.  I chose the latter even though I would be putting more into them than they are worth.  I am retired with time on my hands and needed a project.  So I decided if I was going to fix them I would do it right.  I bought a pair of original re-foamed woofers off of that auction site and then skipped right over dome tweeter replacements and grabbed a pair of Infinity EMIT tweeters.

The trick with EMIT tweeters is that the xover expects to see 6 ohms for the tweeter and the EMITs are 3.4 ohms.  So at the risk of knocking down the tweeter output a bit I put a two ohm resistor in series with the EMIT to get the impedance closer to what the xover wants to see.  I also doubled the amount of damping inside the enclosure as it was a bit boomy sounding.  The result is awesome!   I am also going to add some internal bracing to further settle the enclosure down.


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## SpeakerBox

Have now added some bracing to the RS-2001 enclosure.  Shaping up very nicely.


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## CJG888

RSR-2001, so to speak…

(Sorry, Porsche joke!)


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## SpeakerBox

CJG888 said:


> RSR-2001, so to speak…
> 
> (Sorry, Porsche joke!)



Wish I had one!


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## bagwell359

joehalo said:


> My ADS 910. Love them,


Whoa.  Had 710 and 810 and knew the 1010, never saw a 910.  Nice.


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## bagwell359 (Nov 25, 2021)

Past speakers:

Dyna A25
ADS 710
ADS 810
ADS 810 X 2
LG WALNUT ADVENT X 2
CIZEK 1 X 2
MAGNEPAN MG -1
MAPNEPAN. MG-2 X 2
DCM TIME WINDOW
ROGERS LS-35A + HOME MADE 2 X 10" WOOF
PRO AC EBS & PRO AC TABLETTE
DUETTA
QUAD ESL-57 & DQ-10 VERY MODDED
ML CLS II Z
ML SLA 3
ML VANTAGE
VERITY PARSIFAL
TRIANGLE 202 - LOTS OF MODS

Pretty nuts....


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## SpeakerBox

bagwell359 said:


> Past speakers:
> 
> Dyna A25
> ADS 710
> ...


What do you have now?


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## bagwell359 (Nov 26, 2021)

SpeakerBox said:


> What do you have now?


Triangle 202 w Fountek Neo 3.0 & rebuilt x-over

Cizek I 100% rebuilt stock

Pro Ac Tablette rebuilt

Best:

1 Verity Parslfal (any version 2 and up)
2 ML CLS
3 Magnepan 3.5 (current 3.7i is best speaker under $10k IMO)
4 Pro Ac EBS
5 DQ-10 (most modded ever by anyone)


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## red71rum

I just found this thread, I have several vintage speakers. i got these several years ago when I got my Sony STR 6055. I sold them soon after I got them, Harman Kardon HK40 -


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## red71rum (Dec 24, 2022)

I got these nice Dahlquist DQM 9 with stands and Nextel finish with the stands for nothing several months ago. I had read about them before and was lucky enough that they became available near me. I use these in my other two channel setup and they sit alongside some massive Yamaha S4115H PA speakers (Paradigm CC 390 V6) that I will post later. Anyone else have this Dahlquist model?


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## DaveStarWalker

bagwell359 said:


> Pro Ac Tablette rebuilt


Great (very) little pretty beasts.

Magical timbres and tones...


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## bagwell359

red71rum said:


> I got these nice Dahlquist DQM 9 with stands and Nextel finish with the stands for nothing several months ago. I had read about them before and was lucky enough that they became available near me. I use these in my other two channel setup and they sit alongside some massive Yamaha S4115H PA speakers (Paradigm CC 390 V6) that I will post later. Anyone else have these Dahlquist model?


DQM-9's not that common.


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## bagwell359

DaveStarWalker said:


> Great (very) little pretty beasts.
> 
> Magical timbres and tones...


I used them as the main on top these push/pull subs I built that were flat to 25 Hz, and crossed over at 150 at 18 db.  Theubs were more efficient so it took a lot of padding down with resistors to get them to play nice.  Subs long gone but still use the ProAc's as my 2nd/3rd speaker.

I used to have the EBS which was the first gen Tablette with a very good woof.  Something like a Snell A with better timbre.  I do miss them


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## bagwell359

bagwell359 said:


> I used them as the main on top these push/pull subs I built that were flat to 25 Hz, and crossed over at 150 at 18 db.  Theubs were more efficient so it took a lot of padding down with resistors to get them to play nice.  Subs long gone but still use the ProAc's as my 2nd/3rd speaker.
> 
> I used to have the EBS which was the first gen Tablette with a very good woof.  Something like a Snell A with better timbre.  I do miss them


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## red71rum

bagwell359 said:


> DQM-9's not that common.


That's true I guess, I had only seen the DQ 10 in my area prior to these.


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## red71rum

Here is a pair of Magnepan SMGa that I got for near to nothing last year. I had them this close just for the picture, not how I had them set up: )


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