# Chromecast audio - can anyone comment on sound quality?



## Peddler

Hi there. 

I've bit posted for quite some time. I have become a professional lurker. Does anyone have the new Chromecast Audio device yet and, if so, could they comment on the sound quality please. 

I've tried several different 30 pin Bluetooth dongle thibgs on my Sony IPod dock system and have only managed to get one working - unfortunately it doesn't have aptx so the sound quality tends to not be that good. Any comments would be appreciated.


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## yay101

Sound quality through which? It uses wifi and no extra containers or formats are used for the data so there is no conversion. As long as you use digital out it should sound exactly the same as if you were playing out of a computer to the dac.


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## koadan91 (Jun 18, 2019)

deleted


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## kundica

It definitely supports 24/96.  I've spent the past 2 days streaming local FLAC and Tidal through it to my studio monitors via 3.5 to dual TS 1/4".  As far as I can tell it's quite transparent, and for $35 it think it sounds great.  Just for fun, I sent it a few local files that were 24/192 and it took them without any issues. I suspect it's downsampling, but it's good to know that I can cast it larger files without it bugging out.
  
 For HiFi, you need to go into the Chromecast app, select your CC Audio, and enable "high dynamic range." In order to use Tidal with it, you need to download the newest beta version of BubbleUPNP.
  
 As a side note, I saw the CC Audio pop up in bluetooth when I was pairing my phone with my Moto 360.  A quick search online revealed it has some sort of bluetooth capability, however, I'm not sure what it's for.  I wasn't able to successfully pair but I didn't bother to disconnect it from my local wifi.  I might mess around with it some more later.


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## santacruise

ifixit opened the chromsecast audio today. The specs:
  
• Marvell Avastar 88W8887 VHT WLAN, Bluetooth, NFC and FM Receiver
• Nanya NT5CC128M16IP-DI/EKDDR3L 2Gb SDRAM
*• AKM AK4430 192kHz 24-Bit Stereo DAC*
• Marvell Armada 88DE3006 1500 Mini Plus dual-core ARM Cortex-A7 media processor
• Toshiba TC58NVG1S3H 2 Gb NAND Flash Memory


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## Peddler

Whilst the IPOD Dock-based Sony system I'm using is nothing to write home about, it doesn't sound too bad. I've been using the bluetooth dongle for quite some time but the drop outs are really starting to driving me a little crazy. I don't actually spend much time listening to music through loudspeakers (I tend to get moaned at by the rest of the family because of my taste in music and the volumes I tend to listen at).

I've ordered a Chromecast Audio and should be getting in on Friday. I'm really looking forward to upsetting the family for quite some time over the weekend. Good times.

Thanks for the replies folks.


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## markbrauer

Sounds pretty good, I'd say.
  
 Got my Chomecast Audio yesterday at Best Buy. Also purchased an $8 adapter so my regular optical cable could be used.
  
 For initial setup I plugged my HD 555s directly into the Chromecast. First thing I tried was my phone's Spotify app and I was stunned at how good it sounded. Better than my phone or laptop. And plenty of volume. Might make a decent "desktop" headphone DAC/amp.
  
 I then connected it to the analog input of my Burson DAC/amp and it indeed still sounded pretty good. (At this point I had not read this thread and did not know about the "high dynamic range" option, so that was not set.)  I didn't listen for long because what really intrigued me was the optical digital output. Connected to the Burson's optical input the sound quality was real good. I was able to directly compare to my regular streamer, a Squeezebox Touch connect to the USB input, and it sounded the same. As yay101 said it should.
  
 But this was using 320 kbps Spotify. So I next found an app called LocalCast on the Android Play Store. This app connected to my DLNA server and read my music library. FLAC and WAV files up to 192/24 play fine and again sound the same as the streams through the Squeezebox. This Chromecast really works!
  
 After reading about the "high dynamic range" option (thanks kundica) I enabled it and reconnected to the Burson with an analog cable. It did sound good, actually great on most material, but it choked a bit on real high dynamic range files like Reference Recordings orchestral stuff where the loud tympani sound somewhat muddy. And the loud passages in Lilya Zilberstein's very dynamic Beethoven piano sonatas started to get a little harsh. But overall it sounds pretty good and I think most would find it acceptable, especially considering the price.


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## markbrauer

Sorry, corrected HD 650 to be HD 555. Will give 650s a try and report.


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## windowing

High Dynamic Range option is meant to increase loudness, not necessarily enhance sound quality. I also noticed that it muddies up the sound, so I keep it in the OFF setting, and increase volume through the amplifier instead. 
  
 Here's a quick run-down of what HDR audio does. 
 http://designingsound.org/2013/06/finding-your-way-with-high-dynamic-range-audio-in-wwise/


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## kundica

windowing said:


> High Dynamic Range option is meant to increase loudness, not necessarily enhance sound quality. I also noticed that it muddies up the sound, so I keep it in the OFF setting, and increase volume through the amplifier instead.
> 
> Here's a quick run-down of what HDR audio does.
> http://designingsound.org/2013/06/finding-your-way-with-high-dynamic-range-audio-in-wwise/


 
 Interesting.  I didn't know how this related to the Chromecast Audio.  I should run a few tests and see how it sounds with it off.
  
 Thanks!


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## markbrauer

windowing
 The Chromecast Audio instructions make High Dynamic Range sound like something very different from what's described in your link. They say:
  
*High Dynamic Range*
 Chromecast Audio supports high dynamic range output. This provides premium and professional audio equipment such as HiFi audio systems, AV receivers, and monitor style speakers with the highest quality sound output.
When connecting your Chromecast Audio to such sound systems using 3.5mm or RCA analog cable (see here for compatible cables), you can enable Chromecast Audio’s High Dynamic option:
-From your Android or iOS device, open the Chromecast app ￼.
 -Touch the DEVICES tab.
 -Scroll to find the device card for your Chromecast Audio.
 -In the top right corner of the device card, touch the settings gear ￼.
 -Look for High Dynamic Range, and toggle the setting On.
 Note:  Many common speaker systems such as desktop computer speakers, docking speakers, portable and Bluetooth speakers are not built to support such a high dynamic range, causing the volume level to be very loud and sound to be somewhat distorted. Please avoid turning this setting on in those cases.
 When Chromecast Audio is connected through an optical interface (see here for compatible cables), it will always use High Dynamic Range. Setting the High Dynamic Range to OFF won't have an effect.
  
 Google says the goal is the highest quality sound output, not more loudness.
  
 I have been using the digital output of the Chromecast (meaning the HDR is active) and the resulting sound is indistinguishable from the digital output of my Squeezebox Touch, which I believe performs bit-perfectly. And I'm using some very high dynamic range recordings.
  
 Being curious, I reconnected the Chromecast using analog cable and switched the HDR *ON* and *OFF*. There is a very definite difference with the ON being open sounding and dynamic and the OFF being veiled and compressed in comparison. This is true even when compensating with the amp volume control. The ON position sounds nearly as good the digital output.


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## windowing

Sure, to each their own. I personally prefer to have HDR switched off - the sound quality is perfectly fine without it imo. Been running it through my headphones and studio monitors, and it sounds great.


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## markbrauer

windowing, a question
  
 To each his own for sure - and certainly system synergy plays a big part too - but...
  
 Overnight I got to thinking and remembered a few years ago I found a website that touted HDR processing for music. They offered sample files of familiar music both with and without their processing applied. I downloaded the files and those with the HDR processing files sounded as you described - muddy. Actually, I'd go further and say the processing seemed to ruin every aspect of the music. This company was touting their system for use at radio stations as a way to achieve a "punchier" sound and decrease bandwidth. Their explanation of HDR processing was pretty much the same as that in your link to designingsound.org.
  
 And besides, I highly doubt the humble Chromecast Audio has the computing power to perform HDR processing as described in the designingsound link. Especially considering that it would have to do it on-the-fly with all the data in hi-res (say 96/24) music files.
  
 *So, my question is, are you actually using the new Chromecast Audio device and enabling and disabling it's "High Dynamic Range" functionality through the setup menu or are your comments based on using some other sort of HDR processing? You did not make that clear.*
  
 To me, the Chromecast's HDR OFF setting sounds like it is applying some relatively simple volume leveling and possibly some equalization, both of which can sound fine when done intelligently (and indeed it does sound fine.) Conversely, with the HDR ON, the dynamic character of the output sounds the same as a known bit-perfect source indicating that no processing is being applied to the music.
  
 Thanks. Just wanted to clear this up so others can better understand Chromecast Audio's capabilities.


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## classicalguy

Is there a way to tell the cromecast to play music from your network drive. For example, I imagine installing a foobar driver that would play through the cromecast?


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## kundica

classicalguy said:


> Is there a way to tell the cromecast to play music from your network drive. For example, I imagine installing a foobar driver that would play through the cromecast?


 
 Not exactly, but you can easily cast music from a local drive(managed library) to Chromecast other ways.  In order to do this your library needs to be managed by a UPnP server.  Foobar, Minimserver, Asset UPnP, etc, are all good options and cheap or free.  Next you need a control point on your network that can cast to the Chromecast.  If you're on Android, BubbleUPnP is an excellent control point app.  So basically, BubbleUPnP will see and connect to the Chromecast and also allow you to browse the music library located on your computer.  Find the music you want to listen to and send it to your Chromecast.  You can also build playlists, etc.  In my opinion, this is the best method to achieve the highest audio quality.
  
 Another option that might work from the computer is to use Plex since it allows you to browse your library within a browser tab.  The browser interface can see your Chromecast and will cast to it using the Google Cast extension.  Unfortunately, I think this does some audio conversion and you most likely will not be streaming in your original quality.
  
 I made a short video the other day to show people how to cast Tidal to their CC Audio using BubbleUPnP since Tidal does not yet support it.  The process is pretty much the same for a local server except you connect to your server instead of Tidal with the app. I can share it with you if you want.


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## peter123

Subbed


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## classicalguy

Kundica: I would like to see your video. Are there good windows upnp control pointa? I have a hard time getting androis to see my nwtwork files.


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## kundica

classicalguy said:


> Kundica: I would like to see your video. Are there good windows upnp control pointa? I have a hard time getting androis to see my nwtwork files.


 
 Here's the video: https://youtu.be/UfygXym0Ypw
  
 There are a few decent control points for Windows, however they don't cast to Chromecast.  The only one I know that does is Plex, but I think it might be converting the audio unless you use the mobile app.  I don't know for sure.


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## yay101

Foobar 2000 has upnp compliant plugins for serving, and rendering. It can even do upnp radio sending all tracks as one stream to a renderer. Bubbleupnp etc work well with it and can cast.


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## hd1080ts

I just got a Chromecast Audio, working well via 3.5mm analogue, also tried hooking up via 3.5mm optical and it's outputting 48Khz not 44,1Khz, Chromecast 1 passes 44.1Khz via HDMI, not checked Chromecast 2.
  
 Google appear to be aware and say next update will fix it.
  
 https://productforums.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!topic/chromecast/k6JZRM2TUco;context-place=topicsearchin/chromecast/category$3Acasting-from-a-supported-app


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## gsswallow

I got a Chromecast Audio yesterday and did some very quick tests. I'm a Tidal user and whilst I knew that Casting isn't directly supported, that using BubbleUpnp was a workaround. Didn't take too much faffing around to get BubbleUPNP server and client setup, and the Tidal integration worked pretty well.
  
 However, in the Chromecast App on the device you can choose to 'Cast' all audio from the device (ie phone), meaning I can just as easily cast Tidal direct from the phone, regardless of whether its directly supported by the Tidal app or not.
  
 I didn't have enough time to check for any SQ differences, but does anyone know if there is some difference in the stream quality being passed by the 2 methods (ie UPNP v Local audio casting)?
  
 Seems a lot of the reviews and comments are missing this fact. It doesn't seem to matter whether any app supports the Chromecast protocol or not as the global Device Cast option gives the same outcome. Am I missing something?


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## yay101

From the engineering standpoint, there is no limits within android for bitrates. BUT almost all devices are locked to 16:44100/44000 for simplicities sake unless an app does some voodoo to bypass the mixer.
  
 Upnp has no such limits and can pass anything, even documents/ data files if you really wanted.
  
 Both can give you tidal rates of 16:44xxx, but any difference at that rate will be from the mixer and compression if any, if the data is wav then obviously the only variable is the mixer.


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## markbrauer

I did experiment with the native Google cast function and it worked with everything I tried - both audio apps and sound from websites. And it seemed to sound as good as UPnP streaming, but I have read that Chromecast Audio is restricted to 48 kHz so it makes sense that quality would be about the same. If Google ups the supported bitrate (the internal DAC is said to go to 192/24) there could be a noticeable difference.
  
 The big thing I did notice was that casting from the phone sucked juice from the battery at an unprecedented rate - from nearly full to nearly empty in a couple hours. I'm guessing that battery consumption is the same as when using the phone as a WiFi hotspot.
  
 When casting from Google Drive, BubbleUPnP casts from the phone and is a battery hog, and the phone must remain on and connected to the network or the streaming stops. When using BubbleUPnP to cast the same material from a DLNA server on my local network battery drain was negligible and, as expected, once the streaming starts the phone is out of the loop and can even be turned off.


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## markbrauer

Can Chromecast Audio be used successfully as a headphone amp?
  
 As promised in an earlier post, I finally got around to using my Chromecast Audio as a streamer/DAC/amp. I first plugged my Sennheiser HD 650s straight into the 3.5mm jack and was impressed that it worked - and quite well. I was able to achieve lifelike sound levels on most pop, jazz, and classical material with the volume "slider" at about 3/4 of max. This with a headphone that is 300 Ohms and is noted for being somewhat difficult to drive. On very high-dynamic-range recordings (like Reference Recordings _Exotic Dances from the Opera_) the volume at max was adequate, but there are only a few recordings like this. Dynamically compressed pop hits required only about 2/3 on the slider and could easily be set to higher-than-reasonable levels. And I have to say the overall sound quality was not all that far behind that of my regular DAC/amp, a $1400 Burson Conductor SL 9018. Often times an amp can attain reasonable volume but produces a strained and wimpy sound. Not this Chromecast, it is full-bodied and dynamic. Much better in every way compared to the output of my Nexus 5 phone or my laptop. In all, pretty impressive for a $35 product. It would be interesting to see someone compare the sound of the Chromecast to one of the USB thumb-drive-sized DAC/amps.
  
 I'm not sure it was necessary but I also tried the Sennheiser HD 555 and also the HiFiMan RE400 iems. As expected, the Chromecast drove them both to higher volumes than the HD 650 and they sounded fine.
  
 To answer my question - yes, many might be completely happy with the Chromecast Audio as a headphone amp. Put it near a comfy chair, away from the computer, relax and listen.


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## phile1

hi
how do you power the CCast Audio ? using a computer or a charger ? in those cases power is from SMPS thus expected to be noisy for digital streamer like the CC.
Usually the best option is to power that kind of device with a battery, a fairly basic power bank for smartphone will do the job. 
Did someone try to power it using a power bank ? does it sound better than thru computer or charger ?
thks


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## EH-Yeon

phile1 said:


> hi
> how do you power the CCast Audio ? using a computer or a charger ? in those cases power is from SMPS thus expected to be noisy for digital streamer like the CC.
> Usually the best option is to power that kind of device with a battery, a fairly basic power bank for smartphone will do the job.
> Did someone try to power it using a power bank ? does it sound better than thru computer or charger ?
> thks


 
 It would depends on the design of dc-dc converter inside the power bank.


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## markbrauer

phile1
  
 Being I use the CC nowhere near the computer it is powered by the wall wart that came with it. What surprised me about the CC Audio is that a very inexpensive combination streamer/DAC/amp, intended mostly for use with a home stereo or powered speaker, can be successfully used to drive some difficult headphones and produce very reasonable sound.
  
 But your battery-power question has me intrigued. As I explained in an earlier post, I got the CCA mostly for it's streaming capabilities. Using the CCA as a streamer only, feeding a quality DAC through the optical output, results in excellent sound. In that setup, being I am bypassing the internal DAC, would battery power make a difference? I fully understand how power supply noise could affect the internal DAC, but passing the stream along optically is just sending bits to the outboard DAC which is then responsible for playing them properly. Am I correct here?


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## phile1

hi Mark,
i just ask about battery powered because on my main hifi source all digital devices are battery powered. The result is less harsh sound. 
To be precise : i don't use car or truck battery in my flat, but simple power banks that deliver 5V, 5V typical of USB plugs. Many network cards and devices can be battery powered using these simple and fairly cheap batteries. 
Well, not a big deal if no one tried it. I'll receive a CCA tomorrow, I'll do the test and will keep you informed if it is better with battery or not. 

I plan to use it like you Mark : basic streamer using its optical output. 
I don't have DAC. The CCA will feed a full digital amplifier (QLS-HiFi QA100, 333USD on AliExpress). A really good amplifier that replaced a 5kUSD setup of DAC/digital interface/analogical amplifier 3months ago. You should have a try ! Sound is precise detailed timbres are very accurate. 

As I'll use the CCA as a digital streamer, I hope Google will upgrade the firmware ASAP to stop the resampling in 48kHz... stupid feature. 
Rgds


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## Ggroch

phile1 said:


> hi Mark,
> i just ask about battery powered because on my main hifi source all digital devices are battery powered. The result is less harsh sound.......
> As I'll use the CCA as a digital streamer, I hope Google will upgrade the firmware ASAP to stop the resampling in 48kHz... stupid feature.
> Rgds


 
  
 I have been using the chromecast audio both on a 5V power pack battery and off its charger.  Both work great, I have not heard noise either way.  
  
 The  battery option is quite convenient if you have a portable speaker with a built in USB power tap and an AUX input.   Some JBLs have this, as does my TDK A360.  This makes a totally portable solution that is far better sounding than blue-tooth.
  
 I am surprised that there has not been more discussion of this little device so far on Head-fi.  They have totally replaced my old Squeezeboxs, they sound great now with an external dac, and will probably sound even better with the firmware update that is promised to  allow direct play rather than resampling to 48khz.     I love these things.


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## peter123

Got mine today but I'm npt able to set it up due to some network problems at home. Hopefully I'll be able to make it work this weekend


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## kbuzz

hd1080ts said:


> I just got a Chromecast Audio, working well via 3.5mm analogue, also tried hooking up via 3.5mm optical and it's outputting 48Khz not 44,1Khz, Chromecast 1 passes 44.1Khz via HDMI, not checked Chromecast 2.
> 
> Google appear to be aware and say next update will fix it.
> 
> https://productforums.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!topic/chromecast/k6JZRM2TUco;context-place=topicsearchin/chromecast/category$3Acasting-from-a-supported-app




Same here. Wonder when an update is coming and whether it will stream hi Rez. My inky issue at this point is it really only works well with paid versions of Deezer, Pandora etc. I may have to spring for tidal as a test. I wanted it to play flac without downscaling the Rez but have figured out how to do that with iOS phone. I can confirm that p,Es definitely downs ales quality.


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## betweentheears

My 1st impression is that it is designed/intended for casual listening. I'm hoping that an app for Tidal or some other lossless streamer will show up in the near future. It is easy to use with my iPad streaming Spotify Premium. Drop outs were minimal, and the sound quality is acceptable. For $45 Can. it is cheap enough. Keeping in mind that listening was done via 3.5 input>Audioengine5+. Will report back once I hook up to main system via toslink/optical connection.


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## Ggroch

betweentheears said:


> My 1st impression is that it is designed/intended for casual listening. I'm hoping that an app for Tidal or some other lossless streamer will show up in the near future.......


 
 While it's difficult to view a $35 item as audiophile, the hardware is capable of much better than casual listening.   I am optimistic, because of the hardware design, that things can get much better very fast with firmware updates and better hi-def audio streaming software support. 
  
 I think Its better than casual already, if you consider that  "Casual" = Bluetooth for most people, CCA already beats that by a lot. 
  
Why include the Toslink output if the end goal was purely casual?   Everyone else is taking digital audio outputs off their new models (see the new FireTV and Apple TV). 
  
The internal DAC supports 192kHz/24bit, and the Hi-Dynamic Range mode is apparently capable of 96kHz/24bit if they get the down sampling worked out.    
  
 What has been frustrating is that the technology for streaming uncompressed audio has become very cheap.  There is 1/10th the data in high-res audio as there is in Hi-Def video, and a $30 FireTV stick can do 1080P video. 
  
 To this point none of the major's has given a damn about audio enough to implement a solution, so we are left with $350 Sonos Connect boxes that functionally should cost $60.  I agree CCA is not there yet, but only a month into its release, I am very hopeful for improvements well before Christmas. 
  
 On a side note, BubbleUpNp streams Tidal great....well, OK since it is down sampled.  Point is we may not have to wait for Tidal direct CCA support to get Hi-res streaming when the down sampling gets fixed.


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## tekwrx

ggroch said:


> On a side note, BubbleUpNp streams Tidal great....well, OK since it is down sampled.  Point is we may not have to wait for Tidal direct CCA support to get Hi-res streaming when the down sampling gets fixed.


 
 I thought Tidal was only CD quality (44.1 , 16 bit)? So isn't the Chromecast Audio technically _up-sampling _by going to 48kHz? Anyway, I'd still prefer it to just pass the correct sample rate to my AVR, hope the update comes soon. It bugs me when I play hi-res 24/96 FLAC of concerts I've recorded and the display says 48kHz....


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## betweentheears

Tried the Chromecast Audio in my main system with a Toslink cable through the DAC. Sound is basically the same as when streaming through iPad.
 So for a small investment I get to reclaim an iPad to use elsewhere.


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## mobbaddict

> Originally Posted by *Ggroch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I think Its better than casual already, if you consider that  "Casual" = Bluetooth for most people, CCA already beats that by a lot.


 
  
 I'm wondering how the CCA would compare with a high quality bluetooth receiver like the Arcam miniblink. I was about to pull the trigger on the latter for my headphone rig but the CCA makes me think twice now. Wifi / random DAC versus Bluetooth / Burr-Brown DAC...
 Anyone knows the voltage output of the CCA?


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## Ggroch

mobbaddict said:


> I'm wondering how the CCA would compare with a high quality bluetooth receiver like the Arcam miniblink. I was about to pull the trigger on the latter for my headphone rig but the CCA makes me think twice now. Wifi / random DAC versus Bluetooth / Burr-Brown DAC...
> Anyone knows the voltage output of the CCA?


 
 I have not heard the Arcam, but its limitations are not its DAC, which is excellent, but bluetooth, which is not. 
  
 Normal bluetooth has a 345 Kbs limitation in transmission speed for stereo audio, APTx ups that to 384Kbs.   Theoretically that is enough under perfect conditions to transmit Spotify High Quality Sound (called Xtreme quality on a mobile device) which has 320Kbs bitrate.
  
 HOWEVER....Spotify uses Ogg Vorbis compression a good but lossly compression which bluetooth can't handle directly, so it will re-compress using SBC or APT/x codecs, both lossy, and then uncompress again....the result is significantly less than Spotify Quality under the best circumstances. Lossy compression added to lossy compression and re-compressed.
  
 By contrast, there is no bandwidth limitation for Chromecast relative to audio... (uncompressed CD quality sound is 1.5 Mbs (1500Kbs) and Chromecasts 802.11AC is capable of more than 433MBs)
  
 So, while I think it is great that there are high qualiy DACs for bluetooth, which will make bluetooth the best it can be,  they are not solving the real problem.   Kind of like putting a real fancy saddle on a horse, it will not make it faster than a race car. 
  
 That said, I think some bluetooth devices sound pretty good, (and horses run pretty fast).  They are just not at all comparable to uncompressed/lossless compressed audio.


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## mobbaddict

Thanks Ggroch, that's good to know. My phone doesn't even seem to be compatible with Apt-x so the Chromecast definitely looks like a safer bet. I might buy one today and will report my impressions through my Stax rig later!


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## Ggroch

mobbaddict said:


> Thanks Ggroch, that's good to know. My phone doesn't even seem to be compatible with Apt-x so the Chromecast definitely looks like a safer bet. I might buy one today and will report my impressions through my Stax rig later!


 
  
 I think for $35 you do not have much to lose.   Note that while it works for most people, including myself, on my IOS tablet,phone, it works best, with most playback options, on an android phone or tablet.


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## mobbaddict

ggroch said:


> I think for $35 you do not have much to lose.   Note that while it works for most people, including myself, on my IOS tablet,phone, it works best, with most playback options, on an android phone or tablet.


 
 Thanks, I have an Android phone!
  
 I just found a brief comparison with the Arcam Miniblink in the French CNET review (take it with a pinch of salt) :
  


> _We were curious to know how the Chromecast Audio would fare against a high end Bluetooth dongle like the 150€ Arcam MiniBlink. The MiniBlink had a generous bass. Compared to Chromecast, it didn't reproduce vocals as well._


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## betweentheears

What is the best/easiest way to stream Tidal through iPad to CCA?
 I hear there will be an app coming along shortly, looking for an alternative in the now.


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## mobbaddict

Okay so I bought the CCA yesterday and listened to it through my Stax rig (SRM-212 > Lambda Nova Signature) during the evening. Cute little set-up. I compared it with my s:flo2 which was considered to be a bargain on head-fi a few years back. The s:flo2 had a great line out and good Wolfson chips for a cheap price.
  
 Regarding sound quality, I think the CCA is fairly close to the s:flo2 with similar output power in HDR mode (I believe it has 2V RMS according to the DAC specs). Detail and soundstage were comparable, however I think the s:flo2 had more body and texture, and a more solid / deeper sound overall. So I'm slightly disappointed but I guess it's fair for the price. I might have to do more comparison with HDR off just to make sure this option actually enhances sound quality.
  
 In terms of streaming performance, it was fine using Deezer but there was a 2 seconds lag everytime I skipped a track, and a few bugs as well, nothing too bad overall. Might have to try Spotify too. My only regret is that we can't stream Youtube.


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## markbrauer

mobbaddict said:


> My only regret is that we can't stream Youtube.


 
 On my Nexus 5 Android I installed the Google Cast app. When the app is activated it casts all audio to the CCA. With Youtube the video is shown on the Android screen while the audio was "cast" through the CCA. On the material I tried the video/audio sync was off, which doesn't surprise me. But the audio itself was fine.


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## Ggroch

mobbaddict said:


> In terms of streaming performance, it was fine using Deezer but there was a 2 seconds lag everytime I skipped a track, and a few bugs as well, nothing too bad overall. Might have to try Spotify too. My only regret is that we can't stream Youtube.


 
  
 Most of us cannot get Deezer yet in the US (unless we own a Sonos, which kind of defeats the purpose of the CCA).  No lag in Spotify relative to playing direct.  My phone does occasionally lose its control..that is, If I use the phone for other things occasionally I will have to disconnect and reconnect the CCA to regain control.  But, it is far more convenient and sounds better than bluetooth.
  
 Remember, at the moment it is downsampling your Deezer, and that is supposed to change within the next month or so.  Hopefully Youtube sync, Delays, and Deezer sound will get better.  
  
 If you have a DAC with Toslink input try that, I only used the CCA audio out for a short test, sounded fine but I figured my headphone amps were probably better than the built in.


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## mobbaddict

markbrauer said:


> On my Nexus 5 Android I installed the Google Cast app. When the app is activated it casts all audio to the CCA. With Youtube the video is shown on the Android screen while the audio was "cast" through the CCA. On the material I tried the video/audio sync was off, which doesn't surprise me. But the audio itself was fine.


 
  
 I can't find this app on the Playstore, are you talking about the Chromecast app? I have no such option in the Chromecast app though.
  


ggroch said:


> Most of us cannot get Deezer yet in the US (unless we own a Sonos, which kind of defeats the purpose of the CCA).  No lag in Spotify relative to playing direct.  My phone does occasionally lose its control..that is, If I use the phone for other things occasionally I will have to disconnect and reconnect the CCA to regain control.  But, it is far more convenient and sounds better than bluetooth.
> 
> Remember, at the moment it is downsampling your Deezer, and that is supposed to change within the next month or so.  Hopefully Youtube sync, Delays, and Deezer sound will get better.
> 
> If you have a DAC with Toslink input try that, I only used the CCA audio out for a short test, sounded fine but I figured my headphone amps were probably better than the built in.


 
  
 That's good to know regarding Deezer. I don't have any DAC with optical input but it would be a good solution indeed. I tried HDR mode off yesterday and to me it sounds pretty much the same, minus the volume gain.


----------



## markbrauer

Quote:


mobbaddict said:


> I can't find this app on the Playstore, are you talking about the Chromecast app? I have no such option in the Chromecast app though.


 
 What I'm talking about is the cast function that shows up when you swipe down from the top of an Android screen.
  

  
 I believe it is native to the Android as it also shows up on my wife's tablet that DOES NOT have the Chromecast app installed.  But one thing I read indicated that the Chromecast app was needed to activate it. When "turned on" it casts audio to the selected CCA. I assume with a video Chromecast it would cast the screen also. Might be a function of Android version? Or the specific device? Google it.


----------



## musicfreak

markbrauer said:


> Might be a function of Android version? Or the specific device? Google it.


 
 This function is available from Android 5.0 (lollipop) onwards.


----------



## titaniumx3

When using the cast entire screen (or all audio in this case), does anyone know what the output quality is like? Does it compress the audio (e.g. into AAC) and then stream it? Was hoping it would send it as a PCM 44.1khz stream, but I doubt it very much.


----------



## mobbaddict

markbrauer said:


> What I'm talking about is the cast function that shows up when you swipe down from the top of an Android screen.


 
 Thank you, I believe it's only in the stock version of Android, but on Touchwiz I have access to this option in the Chromecast app > Cast screen / audio


----------



## markbrauer

titaniumx3 said:


> When using the cast entire screen (or all audio in this case), does anyone know what the output quality is like? Does it compress the audio (e.g. into AAC) and then stream it? Was hoping it would send it as a PCM 44.1khz stream, but I doubt it very much.


 
 If The Android casting function is altering the stream in any way I could not hear it.
  
 Not a scientific test but, using my Nexus 5 
  - running Android _Bubble UPnP_ as the server (which uses the Android cast) 
  - streaming FLAC and WAV files from my local library 
 I was able to compare the sound quality of
  - the optical output from the CCA
  - to the USB output from my Squeezebox Touch (with the Hi-Res Audio mod installed) streaming the exact same files. 
  
 My DAC/amp has optical and USB inputs and I was able to instantly switch between them. Streaming 44/16 and 96/24 material I was not able to hear a difference. So it seems to me that the Android cast function is not doing data compression on the stream sent to the CCA.
  
 As a side note, when using the audio output from the CCA, files higher than 44/16 do seem to lose something but that would be expected as the CCA is reported to downsample those files to 48/16.
  
 The biggest downside of casting directly from your Android device is that it eats battery like crazy. Best to have it on the charger.


----------



## Ggroch

Thank you for the analysis Mark.  Theory is important, understanding compression can be a useful, but actual A/B listening comparisons are the most valuable I think.
 I am also sure that others will hear greater differences than you did.
  
  I am also transitioning from a Squeezebox (though without the Hi-Res mod) and have been pleased with the sound quality.  Most of my local music is on high bitrate MP3 files, so while it is not the toughest test, I am quite satisfied with what I hear now through TosLink, a moderately priced DAC, and an unnecessarily large collection sub $500 headphones.
  
 I do not agree that "The biggest downside of casting directly from your Android device is that it eats battery like crazy."  I think having calls interrupt the music and notification beeps and buzzes is the biggest downside.    
  
 I am using Plex from a desktop most of the time for local files to avoid these problems. I would be surprised if Plex provides the same quality on uncompressed files as Bubble, but it also sounds fine without the cast from phone issues.


----------



## titaniumx3

markbrauer said:


> If The Android casting function is altering the stream in any way I could not hear it.
> 
> Not a scientific test but, using my Nexus 5
> - running Android _Bubble UPnP_ as the server (which uses the Android cast)
> ...


 
 Thanks. Just to confirm, was your testing done using the cast/mirror function? As in, did you stream music using the "Cast" button on your notification bar (as seen in the picture you posted above)? Or, was it using casting directly from a app such as BubbleUPNP?
  
 I know that using something like BubbleUPNP will stream the file directly, i.e. the original audio file is sent to chromecast, which decodes it itself, but I doubt this happens with the cast/mirror function I'm talking about. This function has to send all the sounds made by your android device (e.g. your phone) to the chromecast, which means the device itself would have to decode everything and send it to the chromecast as a single stream. The question is, is that stream something uncompressed such as PCM audio or compressed such as AAC.


----------



## yay101

titaniumx3 said:


> I know that using something like BubbleUPNP will stream the file directly, i.e. the original audio file is sent to chromecast, which decodes it itself, but I doubt this happens with the cast/mirror function I'm talking about. This function has to send all the sounds made by your android device (e.g. your phone) to the chromecast, which means the device itself would have to decode everything and send it to the chromecast as a single stream. The question is, is that stream something uncompressed such as PCM audio or compressed such as AAC.




FYI the mixer itself will likely do as much damage as any compression used while you are streaming device audio. It will likely be pass through pcm at 16:44 while only one sound is playing, but as soon as multiple hit the mixer will be losing bits all over the place.

Use a network monitor app to work out what you are streaming. I don't have a CCA yet, even my cc2015 is taking forever to get to Australia.


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## markbrauer

titaniumx3 said:


> Thanks. Just to confirm, was your testing done using the cast/mirror function? As in, did you stream music using the "Cast" button on your notification bar (as seen in the picture you posted above)? Or, was it using casting directly from a app such as BubbleUPNP?
> 
> I know that using something like BubbleUPNP will stream the file directly, i.e. the original audio file is sent to chromecast, which decodes it itself, but I doubt this happens with the cast/mirror function I'm talking about. This function has to send all the sounds made by your android device (e.g. your phone) to the chromecast, which means the device itself would have to decode everything and send it to the chromecast as a single stream. The question is, is that stream something uncompressed such as PCM audio or compressed such as AAC.


 
  
 I have tried both.
  - using BubbleUPnP to cast the stream directly from another (local) DLNA server and
  - using it to channel everything through the Android, which uses the Android casting function in a cast/mirror fashion. 
 To test the second situation I streamed directly from Google Drive so there was no server or music software involved except BubbleUPnP on the Android. I listened for a couple hours this way, playing many favorites, and noticed no problems - except battery drain.
  
 I have no way to prove that the stream is the same but listening comparisons sure seem the same. I notice no degradation to sound quality due to data compression, while I definitely do hear differences with other comparisons. I don't doubt that others, with different equipment will report differences.
  
 A side note...  I started out with an Android app called LocalCast. In tests it did stream 192/24 files successfully. BubbleUPnP only seems to handle 96/24. Not an issue for me as I only have a few 192/24 demo files. But using LocalCast, the CCA streamed those 192 files just fine. With BubbleUPnP they just don't play.


----------



## markbrauer

ggroch said:


> Thank you for the analysis Mark.  Theory is important, understanding compression can be a useful, but actual A/B listening comparisons are the most valuable I think.
> I am also sure that others will hear greater differences than you did.
> 
> I am also transitioning from a Squeezebox (though without the Hi-Res mod) and have been pleased with the sound quality.  Most of my local music is on high bitrate MP3 files, so while it is not the toughest test, I am quite satisfied with what I hear now through TosLink, a moderately priced DAC, and an unnecessarily large collection sub $500 headphones.
> ...


 
 High bitrate MP3s are nothing to be ashamed of. They can sound great. I listen to a lot of Spotify (approximately 320kbps OGG compression) and find it to be near CD quality as advertised. But my main system does pass bit-perfect streaming data to my DAC - no Windows mixer or other stream-altering "pass-through" as most experience.
  
 I find the Hi-Res mod for Squeezebox is only incrementally better - but it is better. Triode rules!
  
 I guess I don't get that many notifications so I haven't noticed that problem. Kudos to you.
  
 I tried Plex a while back for video streaming and abandoned it because it doesn't start on computer boot - a deal-breaker for me as I have multiple users and cannot predict Windows updates/restarts. Googled that problem and tried a "fix" for that - ended up having to rebuild Windows 7 from a restore point. Found another server.


----------



## phile1

hi
i confirm the feedback regarding that casting drains the battery of my smartphone, galaxy note2 in my case.
to solve this point, ans as i listen to web radio and often the same one for long runs i do the following :
1. i launch the cast using TuneIn app
2. i cut the wifi on the phone 
3. then as the cast is running as itself i can shut down the app on the phone 
4. i put the wifi on back on the phone for standard use
then, casting is running from TuneIn to the CAA thru the web, the phone doesn't interact and battery is ok.

otherwise it is true that battery drain is quite impressive and you nearly need to keep your phone on its charger.
rgds


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## yay101

Launch a bug report with tunein developers then, unless the media is physically on your phone OR you are casting local media (from a nas) WITHOUT bubbleupnp server installed on a desktop/ nas machine you shouldn't get battery drain at all.


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## wersus

I'm wondering that if I plug Chromecast audio to mic in of my sound card and play microphone sounds trough my speakers, how much it would affect sound quality compared to playing with native Windows player? I want to use my phone as music remote and my sound card is Asus STX II.


----------



## brymuse

Hi
I don't post much, but just received my CCA and hooked it up to the HiFi and really surprised at the quality and am now wondering about using it with a DAC.
How much would you have to spend on a DAC to improve the SQ? Is it good enough that you would need a fairly decent model to hear noticeable differences. I've yet to test it with my HD650s but remember that using a cable to the headamp (without a dac) sounded rather muddy.
Any thoughts/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## markbrauer

wersus said:


> I'm wondering that if I plug Chromecast audio to mic in of my sound card and play microphone sounds trough my speakers, how much it would affect sound quality compared to playing with native Windows player? I want to use my phone as music remote and my sound card is Asus STX II.


 
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]If you take the audio-output from the CCA and connect to the audio-input of your sound card, realize that your music goes through a D to A conversion and analog stage in the CCA, then an A to D conversion in the sound card, then another D to A conversion and analog stage before being sent to your amp/headphones/speakers. Sound quality is lost in each conversion. This can't be good.[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]Conversely, when using the "native" Windows player, the music is run through an internal digital "mixer" which converts all sounds from the computer (music, sounds from any open programs, [/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]notification beeps, startup/shutdown sounds, etc.) to a common bit rate and combines them into one stream that is sent to the sound card where it goes through a D to A conversion and analog stage before being sent to your amp/headphones/speakers. Here the big sound quality hit is in the bit rate conversion and mixing steps. This also can't be good.[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]With so many factors involved there's be no way to predict which setup would result in higher quality without actually trying them out. Which you could do.[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]But...[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]If concern is sound quality, I would get an alternate Windows player that can bypass the native Windows audio mixer and have the ability to send "bit perfect" data directly to your sound card for a single D to A conversion and output. Many recommend JRiver or Foobar2000. Both offer remote control via smartphone app.[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)][/color]
 [color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]Or if you really feel compelled to use the CCA, get an inexpensive digital optical to coaxial converter that would allow you to connect the digital optical output of the CCA directly to the digital coax input of your sound card for a single D to A conversion and output[/color][color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]. This option should maintain high quality sound and also offers the ability to cast anything you can access on your phone to your sound card.[/color]


----------



## wersus

Thanks for clarifying things up! Sadly my sound card doesn't have digital input so I guess that CA isn't for me .
 By "native windows player" I meant all players which work with Windows. Sorry about that, I should be more clear. I do most of my listening with Qobuz streaming service and it has an WASAPI output option.


----------



## mkozlows

brymuse said:


> I don't post much, but just received my CCA and hooked it up to the HiFi and really surprised at the quality and am now wondering about using it with a DAC.


 
  
 Comparing the CCA straight into an amp vs. through a DAC (Schiit Bifrost Multibit), the difference was immediately audible and significant in a way that I don't usually find DAC upgrades to be. I think it's fair to say that the analog out on the Chromecast is fairly compromised, which shouldn't be surprising -- it's a $35 USB-powered, Wifi-enabled, ultra-mini Llinux computer that oh yeah also happens to have a DAC in it. And the design use case for the analog out is powering low-quality portable speakers (a fact reflected in the default settings enabling dynamic range compression).
  
 If you are concerned about sound quality, I think you'll definitely want to use the optical out at all times.
  
 (Here's what's inside the Chromecast Audio; that line driver mentions a -90dB S/N ratio, which is worse than the -96dB that 16-bit audio can give you.


----------



## Ggroch

New Offer - *$6 added to your Google Play account* for each Chromecast Audio (and Nexus and Chromecast) you have.
  
 Google has added a new offer that gives you $6 in play store credit to use on Android apps, music etc for each chromecast.  The offer says it is limited to $12 max, but I have 2 Chromecast audios and 1 Nexus player hooked up, and it worked for all three of them for $18 credit.  Purchased over a month ago, so they do not have to be new.
  
 For windows desktop: you need to go to this url using the Chrome Browser (with Chromecast plugin installed): https://cast.google.com/chromecast/offers/ 
  
 You should see the $6 credit offer, when you click it asks you to pick your chromecast device and then gives you credit.  If you have more than one device, go through the process for each device, picking a different one each time. 
  
  
 I have not tried with an an android device, but it should work through the Chromecast app there (I think there is a special offers tab).


----------



## ACDOAN

Some posters said they used the Ipad w/o any issue. Has anyone tried with the old Apple Iphone 4 wireless?


----------



## jjmai

How does sound quality compare between Chromecast audio and bluetooth AptX?
 Does Chromecast Audio work at all without wifi?  Can it stream directly with a phone, without a wifi router?


----------



## mkozlows

jjmai said:


> How does sound quality compare between Chromecast audio and bluetooth AptX?
> Does Chromecast Audio work at all without wifi?  Can it stream directly with a phone, without a wifi router?


 
 Chromecast audio is not compressed like aptX is, and is much better. It requires Wifi.


----------



## spanner43

Thought i would just chime in with my experience with Chromecast audio. I have a headphone station in the living room away from my computer. I had been feeding my HD650s with a Fiio x3 through a shiit Asguard 2 amp. My music is all 16 bit flac with some higher res albums. This setup was sounding perfect to me, but I was looking for a way to stream some music without taking up to much space in the living room. I played around with my android phone , but it seemed less than perfect. I connected the Chromecast audio with the analog cable and was very pleased with the sound from  the higher bit rate options on both rhapsody and spotify. I then connected it with my schiit modi optical dac and felt a bit of improvement but couldn't really tell the deference from my streaming services. where it did shine for me was when using BubbleUPnp. Very nice user interface, I was able to access my entire music collection in flac using foobar from my home office computer. The music was streamed as 16 bit flac except for my hi res stuff which was converted too 16 bit WAV. I A/B tested the streamed flac files with the same music on my X3 and could not tell a deference. This is just my impression and obviously not a technical review, but for a nice little headphone station away from a computer this has impressed me.


----------



## brymuse

Just Hooked up CCA to HD650s via Graham Slee Solo SRG2 and have to admit to being disappointed at the SQ, especially the bass which I found muddy and a bit hollow. I don't have the cash to spend in a DAC in the hundreds, but could I get a significant worthwhile improvement with, say a SMSL Sanskrit or Project Dacbox E? Both of these I can get online for around £70/80. 

Or would even a new DAC/amp work ala Little Dot etc?


----------



## spanner43

brymuse said:


> Just Hooked up CCA to HD650s via Graham Slee Solo SRG2 and have to admit to being disappointed at the SQ, especially the bass which I found muddy and a bit hollow. I don't have the cash to spend in a DAC in the hundreds, but could I get a significant worthwhile improvement with, say a SMSL Sanskrit or Project Dacbox E? Both of these I can get online for around £70/80.
> 
> Or would even a new DAC/amp work ala Little Dot etc?


 

 Just curious what service/source was your music from? was the muddiness from all sources? I found possible muddiness when l listened to free Pandora , but found it quite clear with the 320 files from spotify. and very clear streaming local flac, even with the analog cable. Also was this with the higher quality setting on or off in the Comcast audio app? I don't doubt your findings just curious.


----------



## brymuse

spanner43 said:


> Just curious what service/source was your music from? was the muddiness from all sources? I found possible muddiness when l listened to free Pandora , but found it quite clear with the 320 files from spotify. and very clear streaming local flac, even with the analog cable. Also was this with the higher quality setting on or off in the Comcast audio app? I don't doubt your findings just curious.




Thanks for the post. Just reevaluating now. I must admit that I can't now hear much of what I described before. The sound seems clearer, although I still hear little lower mid muddiness. A couple of caveats are that I listen to a lot of complex orchestral music where detail in that region can get lost and also I've only just dug the headphones out after moving house 6 months ago. I've been using the speaker system, so perhaps I didn't give it a fair chance. Need to burn my ears back into the HD650s perhaps...

As you asked, I'm using Nexus 6P with Chromecast (high quality enabled) and streaming with a mixture of Local Cast and Allcast as I have a lot of recordings that are 'sideloaded' so Google won't play them!
The recordings themselves are a mixture of Amazon mp3 downloads and ripped cds. Haven't tried Spotify as I'm not a big radio listener...

Still keen on the idea of whether a cheap DAC would be a good idea though?


----------



## spanner43

brymuse said:


> Thanks for the post. Just reevaluating now. I must admit that I can't now hear much of what I described before. The sound seems clearer, although I still hear little lower mid muddiness. A couple of caveats are that I listen to a lot of complex orchestral music where detail in that region can get lost and also I've only just dug the headphones out after moving house 6 months ago. I've been using the speaker system, so perhaps I didn't give it a fair chance. Need to burn my ears back into the HD650s perhaps...
> 
> As you asked, I'm using Nexus 6P with Chromecast (high quality enabled) and streaming with a mixture of Local Cast and Allcast as I have a lot of recordings that are 'sideloaded' so Google won't play them!
> The recordings themselves are a mixture of Amazon mp3 downloads and ripped cds. Haven't tried Spotify as I'm not a big radio listener...
> ...


 
 I have not tried all cast or local cast. You might want to try one of the apps that supports the chomecast audio natively. I found sound quality improvement when using google play music,spotify,rhapsody or BubbleUPnp server, over using the android casting option. some apps will convert the stream to other formats some wont, not sure if that is the same thing as local cast or allcast, but might be worth a try


----------



## mkozlows

I think the CCA benefits from a DAC, certainly. But also: Did you make sure you turned on the "high dynamic range" option in the Chromecast software?


----------



## ngsm13

Currently using CCA with 3.5mm to RCA output. 
  
 I'm considering purchasing the Google hardwired ethernet adapter, just because it's literally located right next to my 24-port gigabit switch and quite a distance away from my Wifi Router. 
  
 What is recommended for Optical DAC? I'm looking at something as cheap as the Fiio D3, and up to the Schiit Modi 2 Uber or AudioEngine D1? Thoughts...


----------



## codyrigg

I'm planning to get some speakers for Christmas, and would like to add a some sort of receiver to stream music, movies, and games. 
 Would I be able to use the CCA to stream all of my sound to the speakers rather than choosing what to cast? If not, can I cast youtube, netflix, itunes, foobar, and games?


----------



## brymuse

mkozlows said:


> I think the CCA benefits from a DAC, certainly. But also: Did you make sure you turned on the "high dynamic range" option in the Chromecast software?



Hi

Yes High Dynamic Range is on. I think I'm veering towards a DAC now, to get the best out of it


----------



## phile1

brymuse said:


> Hi
> I don't post much, but just received my CCA and hooked it up to the HiFi and really surprised at the quality and am now wondering about using it with a DAC.
> How much would you have to spend on a DAC to improve the SQ? Is it good enough that you would need a fairly decent model to hear noticeable differences. I've yet to test it with my HD650s but remember that using a cable to the headamp (without a dac) sounded rather muddy.
> Any thoughts/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.



hi brymuse,
my advise : no dac but full digital amplifier (FDA). 
thus : sell your analog amp, to get some cash back. 
then buy a FDA like I.AM.D v200 or stuff like that at 110usd on aliexpress.
plug your headphones on the speakers output. that's it. 
then, connect your CCA on the toslink input of the FDA, since CCA has the nice feature of having a combo output analog /digital. 
then : enjoy the music with large and flat audio spectrum.
Rgds


----------



## mkozlows

valiant66 said:


> Interesting. So if you've started a track using your phone, then taken a photo, done some editing, posted it to Facebook, answered a phone call, and made a new calendar entry, the hard volume controls will still be controlling the stereo? Or does the Chromecast app have to be the last app you used, so it's still "in front" as it were? ...
> 
> I may be wrong, but using your Chromecast means that there's no Schiit in the reproduction chain, doesn't it? You're depending on the wifi (and DAC?) in the little thumb drive, and if it uses Bluetooth it's a lossy signal, and doesn't it have to be plugged into your TV? I'm trying to control my Plex server or my iTunes server playing lossless and going through my receiver, and either using my Apple TV (in which I'm in a similar situation to you) or going from my Schiit DAC through audio cable to a motorized analogue volume control. The software I have to use to do all that doesn't seem lock-screen friendly.


 
  
 To the first: The app you're using to play music to the Chromecast will only disappear if it's killed for memory pressure reasons. On my Nexus devices (5, 9, and 6P), I've had this happen when I've played games (which can be memory-hungry for obvious reasons), but not for other apps and not even for all games. As long as the app doing the streaming is still open, it'll appear on the lock screen and in the notification bar with playback controls.
  
 To the latter: The Chromecast Audio has S/PDIF output, that can go to an external DAC (I'm using the Bifrost); there is no Bluetooth involved. You can use Plex to stream raw PCM or FLAC to the Chromecast; the one caveat is that there's a bug right now that will resample content to 48Khz regardless of its original sample rate. Google has confirmed this and says it will be fixed in an upcoming update.


----------



## valiant66

mkozlows said:


> To the first: The app you're using to play music to the Chromecast will only disappear if it's killed for memory pressure reasons. On my Nexus devices (5, 9, and 6P), I've had this happen when I've played games (which can be memory-hungry for obvious reasons), but not for other apps and not even for all games. As long as the app doing the streaming is still open, it'll appear on the lock screen and in the notification bar with playback controls.
> 
> To the latter: The Chromecast Audio has S/PDIF output, that can go to an external DAC (I'm using the Bifrost); there is no Bluetooth involved. You can use Plex to stream raw PCM or FLAC to the Chromecast; the one caveat is that there's a bug right now that will resample content to 48Khz regardless of its original sample rate. Google has confirmed this and says it will be fixed in an upcoming update.


 
  
 Thanks for the clarification. I haven't had time to try testing this on my rig yet, but I think the Apple TV similarly passes raw PCM through (in my case) the HDMI connection to the receiver, in which case I'm listening to the receiver's DAC, not the Schiit DAC. It would take a bunch of re-jigging to use the optical out and get the Schiit DAC in the loop. Right now the DAC lives in my home office - the obviously better place, since I spend a lot more time there in a day than in the living room.


----------



## codyrigg

codyrigg said:


> I'm planning to get some speakers for Christmas, and would like to add a some sort of receiver to stream music, movies, and games.
> Would I be able to use the CCA to stream all of my sound to the speakers rather than choosing what to cast? If not, can I cast youtube, netflix, itunes, foobar, and games?


 
 Here's answering my own question in case it helps anyone. 
 It looks like you can stream all of your audio to the CCA but you have to use a 3rd party tool called airparrot2. The problem being that it struggles when your computer is at full throttle. So during games, there is a lag. Itunes, would be fine though. 
 For just internet, you can cast your entire chrome browser, although you can't cast netflix or youtube individually.


----------



## Ggroch

phile1 said:


> hi brymuse,
> my advise : no dac but full digital amplifier (FDA).
> thus : sell your analog amp, to get some cash back.
> then buy a FDA like I.AM.D v200 or stuff like that at 110usd on aliexpress.
> ...


 
 That I.AM.D v200 looks like a nice unit, particularly for use with speakers.  I had not seen that before.
  
 The headphone jack on it is on the back and with no specifications for the headphone output listed, I would be concerned that it would not be a good match with the 300Ohm moderate efficiency HD650s.  Speaker outputs are not designed for 300 Ohms.  they might work, but would not be optimal. 
  
 In my experience with the CCA, hooked to a lower priced DAC like the SMSL Sanskrit 6th Anniversary, and into my Objective 2 sounds much better than direct from the CCA audio outs into an amp or headphones.   My guess is it is not the DAC in the CCA that is the problem, but the tiny preamp/headphone amp in it.   So, my advice to brymuse is go for it.
  
 When the CCA firmware updates to allow higher bitrate non-coverted digital out, the sound, and the difference with a good amp/dac, will be even greater.


----------



## saj2001ind

Hey guys I just got this... Where can I find a 3.5mm to optical converter to use with optical speakers 

And if I use 3.5mm jack will it loose audio quality compared to optical?


----------



## Ggroch

saj2001ind said:


> Hey guys I just got this... Where can I find a 3.5mm to optical converter to use with optical speakers
> 
> And if I use 3.5mm jack will it loose audio quality compared to optical?


 
 Its not a converter, it is just a smaller plug, everything stays optical, Plugs into the CCA headphone jack.  You lose no quality.
  
*Like this one.   (the example is pretty and gold, but that makes no difference on an optical cable)*


----------



## kbuzz

any word on when google will issue the CCA update-to ensure highest bit rate....


----------



## markbrauer

saj2001ind said:


> Hey guys I just got this... Where can I find a 3.5mm to optical converter to use with optical speakers
> 
> And if I use 3.5mm jack will it loose audio quality compared to optical?


 
 I got mine at Best Buy when I purchased the Chromecast. Paid more than online but it was convenient.
  
 With a 3.5mm optical adapter you lose no quality - digital data is sent directly to your DAC. If you use a 3.5mm analog output you are using the internal Chromecast DAC which may or may not be better than your external DAC. Why not try both options?


----------



## brymuse

Hi again.
So with regards Dac, I am now looking secondhand at a couple of possibilities, a Musical Fidelity X24K or a Benchmark Bushmaster Mk2 TC 7533. Both affordable for me. One is however, a lot older, although it was a very good model when released. Is there a comparison to be had here, or does the age rule out the Musical Fidelity?
Cheers


----------



## saj2001ind

http://www.amazon.in/gp/product/B007KBNNCO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00
  
 I hope this works ?


----------



## ngsm13

Hooked up my CCA with Schiit Modi 2 Uber, LARGE improvement for my application. 
  
 I'm using it to drive whole home audio currently, 12-channel amp with 6 zones throughout the house. Previously with the standard 3.5mm output, I suffered from lack of detail without High Dynamic Range turned on, and early clipping/distortion with HDR turned on. With the optical output to the Schiit DAC, it's great. More detailed, accurate reproduction with ability for full adjustment at each zone with no distortion even at high volumes. 
  
 Highly recommend using with optical DAC.


----------



## Ggroch

If you got your $6 in Google Play credits (see below) and not used them to buy music yet, now is the time.   Google is running a 50% off any music album promo til Dec 1.  Details here:
  
https://play.google.com/store?code=50ALBUM2015

 Use code: *50ALBUM2015* 
  
 You should be able to purchase most albums with just the credit. 
  
 Quote:


ggroch said:


> New Offer - *$6 added to your Google Play account* for each Chromecast Audio (and Nexus and Chromecast) you have.
> 
> Google has added a new offer that gives you $6 in play store credit to use on Android apps, music etc for each chromecast.  The offer says it is limited to $12 max, but I have 2 Chromecast audios and 1 Nexus player hooked up, and it worked for all three of them for $18 credit.  Purchased over a month ago, so they do not have to be new.
> 
> ...


----------



## SojiOkita

Hello everyone,
  
 I'm thinking of buying a chromecast audio, mostly to get spotify on my current hi-fi system (i.e an "old" home cinema amplifier + speakers).
  
 As i will use an HC amp, I can either use a Chromecast Audio (via RCA or Optical) or a Chromecast 2 (via HDMI).
 Has anyone made a comparison between CCA and CC2 for audio quality?


----------



## yay101

HDMI as a standard is terrible for audio transmission and is only a standard because it allows DRM. It is horrible in every technical way, even at its latest iteration.

Stay away at all costs.


----------



## god-bluff

Would this offer better sound quality than a bluetooth DAC like my Arcam MiniBlink (with aptX) which I do find great ?


----------



## Gallagher

396629 said:


> Would this offer better sound quality than a bluetooth DAC like my Arcam MiniBlink (with aptX) which I do find great ?


 
 Wi-Fi will always trump Bluetooth, it is simply a better technology with more bandwidth.
 My Sonos 5 (though comparatively expensive) will always outplay pretty much any Bluetooth speaker.
 This will be more evident when streaming FLACs, wav files, or pretty much anything high-resolution over standard MP3 and radio streaming.


----------



## Peddler

ggroch said:


> New Offer - *$6 added to your Google Play account* for each Chromecast Audio (and Nexus and Chromecast) you have.
> 
> Google has added a new offer that gives you $6 in play store credit to use on Android apps, music etc for each chromecast.  The offer says it is limited to $12 max, but I have 2 Chromecast audios and 1 Nexus player hooked up, and it worked for all three of them for $18 credit.  Purchased over a month ago, so they do not have to be new.
> 
> ...




What cheeses me off is that they will only let you exploit these free offers once (unless you use a different gmail account) which is a little unfair because I am still purchasing the new hardware just like the next person. Currently working through a 3 month free trial of deezer because I purchased the Chromecast Audio - not bad but I am not overly keen on the user interface.


----------



## phile1

hi
fyi on google forum some people mentioned the new firmware is coming! News, 2 days ago. 
It seems it brings bitperfect, out the resampling to 48kHz.
On chromecast web page Google states that when a new firmware is released it takes 1 to 2 weeks to be implemented to all devices. My cca is still waiting for it.
Hope we will notice the difference. ...
Rgds


----------



## Ggroch

One of my CCAs got the update,  Firmware starts with 1.17 vs older 1.16.    There was a confirmation on the Google forum that Test files in various formats 16b44 /48 /96 & 24b24 /48/96 play at source rate via optical. 
  
Update: Yea!  My CCA with 1.17a firmware plays at the correct un-resampled bitrates through optical.  Only 1 of my 3 CCAs has been updated so far.
  
 No support for synchronized play of multiple chromecasts yet
﻿


----------



## erssn

ggroch said:


> One of my CCAs got the update,  Firmware starts with 1.17 vs older 1.16.    There was a confirmation on the Google forum that Test files in various formats 16b44 /48 /96 & 24b24 /48/96 play at source rate via optical.
> 
> Update: Yea!  My CCA with 1.17a firmware plays at the correct un-resampled bitrates through optical.  Only 1 of my 3 CCAs has been updated so far.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi!
  
 Could you check if you are able to play spotify to the cca through spotify connect from a pc with the new fw?
  
 It's so dumb that it requires a mobile device in the middle to do that right now.


----------



## Ggroch

I tried, no change.  Cannot cast to the CCA within the Windows Spotify app.
  
  
  
 However, on a Windows PC I can cast Spotify to a Chomecast audio using the  Spotify Web Player  (play.spotify.com) in Chrome browser, and just casting the tab.
  
 Not as nice as the native app perhaps, but it seems to work fine. 
  
  
 Quote:


erssn said:


> Could you check if you are able to play spotify to the cca through spotify connect from a pc with the new fw?


----------



## erssn

ggroch said:


>


 
  
 Thanks! Okay, that's a shame.. 
  
 How is the sound quality when casting the web-player?


----------



## Ggroch

erssn said:


> How is the sound quality when casting the web-player?


 
 

It sounds OK, I have not done critical listening on the Web Player.

Theoretically it is 160KBS Ogg Vorbis compression - I imagine that is better than bluetooth.   

 

The Spotify Specifications:

Spotify uses 3 quality ratings for streaming, all in the Ogg Vorbis format.


~96 kbps
Normal quality on mobile.

~160 kbps
*Desktop and web player standard quality.*
High quality on mobile.

~320 kbps (only available to Premium subscribers)
Desktop high quality.
Extreme quality on mobile.


----------



## Hank_Venture

I just picked one up and I'm on a free premium subscription for a while. Hooked it up (3.5 to RCA) to my old Marantz 2325 going out to a pair of JBL L20T3', simple setup but I really like what I'm hearing. The update today was welcomed.


----------



## daellis130

I'm loving my CCA. Has anybody experienced the multi room audio yet which I understand was released a couple of days ago? For as long as I can remember I've pined after a Sonos bridge type system to link my hifis, but it looks like a second / third CCA is the way to go. Any experiences?
 **Apologies if anyone has already commented on this, didn't have time to read all the posts - bad form I know**


----------



## Pott

Question about it: does it only work with online services? I do 99% of my listening through my own music (either Mediamonkey for MP3s or Foobar for FLAC).
 Can it simply stream whatever sound my computer is playing? Or can I setup MM/Foobar to stream through wifi to a chromecast?


----------



## daellis130

You can stream local content using apps like local cast from mobile devices. You can cast local music from your pc using plex media server, or even type //C:/yourmusic.mp3 and then use the cast button in chrome browser to cast. This last option is cool, but probably more suited to videos with the full Chromecast. But have no experience of the programs you mention. There are im sure, many more ways.


----------



## spanner43

pott said:


> Question about it: does it only work with online services? I do 99% of my listening through my own music (either Mediamonkey for MP3s or Foobar for FLAC).
> Can it simply stream whatever sound my computer is playing? Or can I setup MM/Foobar to stream through wifi to a chromecast?


 

 I use the BubbleUPnp app,and it lets me stream over wifi in flac, my music stored on my main computer including my foobar playlists


----------



## Ggroch

spanner43 said:


> I use the BubbleUPnp app,and it lets me stream over wifi in flac, my music stored on my main computer including my foobar playlists


 
 Yup, Android  BubbleUPnp streams local servers like Foobar, Plex, NAS DNLA, etc, as well as some cloud sources like Tidal, Google drive, dropbox.  I have not tried MediaMonkey, but because it is DNLA compatible, it would probably work fine with that too.
  
 CCA comes with 3 months (i think its still 3) of GooglePlay Music, so you could upload your library, or a chunk of it, there too and play it from Chromecast directly on GooglePlay. 
  
  
 BTW, since the firmware upgrade to 1.17a, referencing the title of this thread, CCA through a DAC now sounds to me the same as direct from USB.   I do not listen to H-Res better than CD files much, but my library of hi-bit MP3 and some CD quality FLAC all sound perfect to me.


----------



## mkozlows

ggroch said:


> CCA comes with 3 months (i think its still 3) of GooglePlay Music, so you could upload your library, or a chunk of it, there too and play it from Chromecast directly on GooglePlay.


 
  
 Note that Google Play Music will compress FLACs to high-bitrate MP3. So while you can play your FLACs losslessly and bit-perfect on the Chromecast, you can't do it through Google Play Music without going through an MP3 compression step.


----------



## Pott

I gotta say I'm a bit lost... bubbleUpnp is an android app. Why would I need my phone to stream my own PC's music to another set of speakers?
 Is there then no way to do it without a smartphone? I never have my phone with me when I'm home.


----------



## Ggroch

pott said:


> I gotta say I'm a bit lost... bubbleUpnp is an android app. Why would I need my phone to stream my own PC's music to another set of speakers?
> Is there then no way to do it without a smartphone? I never have my phone with me when I'm home.


 
 You may not fit the demographic Google targets for Chromecast audio.   As I am sure you are aware, a lot of people keep a phone or tablet with them all the time, and IOS and Android tablets make extremely capable and convenient audio controllers if you are one of them.  Google probably hopes everyone is like that. 
  
 If you are not, you can still use Chromecast audio by installing the "Google Cast" extension on the Chrome desktop browser.   This will let you cast music from any Chrome browser window.  so, a browsed music server (like Plex media manager) could play your computer music from within the Chrome window.  Spotify and Google Music browsers work the same way for those streaming sources.
  
 That's still dorky. Apparently Google has not released a desktop SDK (??) for direct playback from Windows computers.
  
 NOTE: There was a discussion earlier about a similar problem....Spotify Windows desktop app not being able to cast directly to Chromecast, and for the same reason (no SDK).   There is a workaround, start Spotify casting from your phone, and then you can switch to desktop control as a "proxy". (which just means it offers to letyou continue playback on the chromecast).
  
 Sonos is still a more advanced than Chromecast audio for desktop playback....but is also a lot more expensive.


----------



## yay101

It should be said though that sonos can be 99% replaced by some raspberry pi's and your own equipment, if they are more attractive than chromecasting.


----------



## Koyote

I hooked up the streamer yesterday and downloaded the app -- it was easy and I had it running in just a few minutes. 
  
 I had been streaming Spotify Premium through my home stereo's AUX input via a short cable. The big advantages of the Chromecast streamer are (1) using my iPod as a remote, and (2) not depleting the iPod's battery, since the Chromecast device does the streaming and the DAC work.
  
 The Chromecast sounds great to my ears. In a much earlier post in this thread, someone recommended plugging headphones directly into the Chromecaster -- I tried this with my Grado SR80e 'phones, and WOW!  Sounds outstanding, better than plugging them into my Apple devices directly.
  
 For $35, this is a winner -- if you use one of the supported music services.


----------



## hundsboog

Hi there folks,
  
  
 this is my first post ever to head-fi and please don't mind my english-writing, since I'm from Germany.
 So, actually I used the CCA before directly connected to my SMSL Sanskrit 6th anniversary/LUA tube amp and that really sounded great. I also used BubbleUpnP to stream it over there with my android tablet. This was very easy and convenient. So, after a while I decided to plug my Sanskrit to my PC, because I just wanted to create myself a sweet little Headphone station because the integrated soundcard was really crap and the Little Dot MKIII which I was using there  emphasized the bad quality of it (by the way, Sanskrit and little dot are like an old couple, they are just great together). I really wondered if the CCA will sound acceptable without the Sanskrit on my LUA tube amp. But hey, it does. The only thing I personally noticed was just a lack of punch (but very slightly) and so far, I'm pretty happy with that set-up.
  
 Tom


----------



## Ggroch

Thanks for the report Tom, I am using the Sanskrit 6 too with a Matrix audio amp, sounds great. Your English writing is better than  mine, and I am a native speaker.


----------



## hundsboog

ggroch said:


> Thanks for the report Tom, I am using the Sanskrit 6 too with a Matrix audio amp, sounds great. Your English writing is better than  mine, and I am a native speaker.


 
  
 No Problem and thank you very much for your kind words! Well, if you would hear me talking in reality, you would just laugh your a** off because my terrible accent 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. At least my big advantage was to grow up near Europes biggest american training area, so I had a lot of american friends (well, I still have) and that's why I'm able to communicate in a pretty decent way. Thanks to them and their sheer endless patience to help that little Kraut learning English 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 Apropos decent: Pretty decent sweet little amp, which you got there!


----------



## Ggroch

I see that the newest update of the Chromecast app offers a "Group" option in device configuration.  You can also adjust the timing slightly.   I have not tried it, but it appears that multi-room synchronized play has been enabled.


----------



## greenhenry

Hi, guys. Trying to connect my new CCA (firmware v.1.17a) via Audioquest Forest Green TOSLINK to Schiit Yggdrasil DAC. Not having much luck - any advice vis a vis troubleshooting? Thought this would be plug-n-play... thanks!!


----------



## Ggroch

greenhenry said:


> Hi, guys. Trying to connect my new CCA (firmware v.1.17a) via Audioquest Forest Green TOSLINK to Schiit Yggdrasil DAC. Not having much luck - any advice vis a vis troubleshooting? Thought this would be plug-n-play... thanks!!


 
 No tricks, as long as you see the bright red digitals streaming out of the cable and have the correct Schiit input selected it should work, showing 44.1K signal most of the time with that firmware. 
  
 Do you get sound with headphones plugged into the CCA directly?  If it is brand new, make sure you follow the directions for switching the source output to the correct CCA, and that it shows connected on the app.


----------



## greenhenry

ggroch said:


> No tricks, as long as you see the bright red digitals streaming out of the cable and have the correct Schiit input selected it should work, showing 44.1K signal most of the time with that firmware.
> 
> Do you get sound with headphones plugged into the CCA directly?  If it is brand new, make sure you follow the directions for switching the source output to the correct CCA, and that it shows connected on the app.




Got it going, thanks! So I surmise BubbleUpnp is best for streaming from local network?


----------



## Ggroch

greenhenry said:


> Got it going, thanks! So I surmise BubbleUpnp is best for streaming from local network?


 
 bubble is working great for me.  It also streams Tidal well.


----------



## greenhenry

ggroch said:


> bubble is working great for me.  It also streams Tidal well.


 
 Thanks, Ggroch... only issue for me: the entirety of my digitally archived music files = AIFF! =(


----------



## trapnel

Super helpful thread, everyone! I have a question about getting a cheap DAC vs not, which has perhaps already been answered ("yes"), but if anyone could address my specific case I'd very much appreciate it.
  
 Here's my use-case: I'm putting together an audio system for our living room, almost from scratch. The inputs will be 1- a turntable (model TBD, maybe the Audio Technica AT-LP120-USB I've seen well-reviewed), 2- audio split out from the HDMI of a Roku 2 box (probably -- I know it's not ideal, but the problem is that our projector the Roku would be feeding has HDMI in, but no audio-out. The Roku 1 has RCA outputs, but it's supposedly rather sluggish), and most importantly 3- a Chromecast Audio to pull music from our music collection on a Synology NAS. I'd like to minimize cost while still sounding good. I'll be getting Elac Debut 6 bookshelf speakers (I think they're €350 here), and I need to decide what to do about an amp. I was originally thinking one of the new, cheap digital ones (Topping, Dayton Audio) I've seen recommended, but it looks like I need more inputs than those are meant for, so now I'm looking for used "real" amps. (I'm slightly limited by the fact that I *don't* want a tuner, because then I'd have to pay a radio license fee.)
  
 Right now I'm seeing locally available a used NAD 314 for €130, and a used Technics SU-X502 for €65. The NAD seems well-reviewed (I can't find any reviews on the other) so I'm assuming it's better quality, but it only has analog inputs, while the Technics has digital, too.
  
 Do you think I would be better off with the NAD, even though it means using the CCA's own DAC/pre-amp, or going with the Technics' DAC? Thanks!


----------



## Ggroch

trapnel said:


> Right now I'm seeing locally available a used NAD 314 for €130, and a used Technics SU-X502 for €65. The NAD seems well-reviewed (I can't find any reviews on the other) so I'm assuming it's better quality, but it only has analog inputs, while the Technics has digital, too.
> 
> Do you think I would be better off with the NAD, even though it means using the CCA's own DAC/pre-amp, or going with the Technics' DAC? Thanks!


 
  My vote is with the NAD for sure.    The NAD will have a better quality Amp, phono pre-amp, and everything else.   Like the NAD, the Technics is an older model (I could not figure out the year it was released).   DACs have changed a LOT more than amps in the last 10 years.   So, the one built into the CCAudio is likely significantly better than the one in the Technics...because of age, and because the Technics stuff then (unlike now) was not mostly high end.
  
 The NAD should sound great with those speakers on all of the inputs.     Plus, if you decide later to add a DAC you still could.   The CCA sounds great without a DAC.  My Vote GoNad! (hmmm, made a joke there).


----------



## yay101

Yeah NAD for sure. Don't discount cheap type D amps these days as amps, the high end ones from topping and smsl have power for days and sound genuinely amazing. As I just wanted an amp to be fed from my bifrost I went with a smsl and a topping in different parts of the house and both aren't even touched by anything I could buy locally for several times the price. 

But when you need more features theres no question, the NAD is a great all in one product that won't disapoint.


----------



## astropuppy

Used a battery pack and a pair of akg's streaming (subscribed) Pandora. Listened most of last night. Sounded very good. 
  
 This morning A-B'd the main system I was hoping to move out of the living room, leaving only the amp and chromecast. No dice, streaming jriver flac's definitely sounds slightly better through a schitt wyrd modi. Not a lot better, but worth the effort.
  
 Likewise my schitt Fulla, headphone amp, sounds slightly better streaming flacs then the chromecast audio. Pandora streams sound about the same with either device.
  
 For portability and mp3 streams, I do not think chromecast audio can be beat. I plan on buying a couple more for syncronizing music through the whole house. Simply a great product for what it is. Especially for $35 a copy.
  
 About me: Old and deaf, consumer grade equipment and +800 CD's ripped to flac.


----------



## Ggroch

astropuppy said:


> Simply a great product for what it is. Especially for $35 a copy.


 
  
      Have you tried the Chromecast optical out into one of your dacs?    Not clear from your description.  
  
 The best sound on the Chromecast is definitely thorugh the optical out.  I do not think the issue is so much the chromecast DAC, which is pretty slick, but the preamp/headphone amp analog sections.


----------



## peter123

I'm experiencing constant drop outs with my CCA, anyone else having the same issue? 


Any ideas on a solution is welcome. I've restarted it and made the set up process multiple times.


----------



## APRisti

Been having trouble with dropouts on my chronecast as well. Im getting a new router next week and i hope that problem goes away


----------



## Ggroch

This on Chromecast Audio Dropouts since 1.17a firmware update:
  
https://productforums.google.com/forum/#!msg/chromecast/SMRX6JAtJbE/gdtpHbI0BgAJ
  
  
 I see that for at least 1 owner, restarting their router solved the issue.   Another notes a blinking status light and another that it occurs on h-def music files.
  
 My 2 have been fine.


----------



## peter123

Thanks for the reply. I do use the optical out on mine and it seems as if that could be a part of the problem.

I did actually change my router before Christmas but the problem still exists.

I'm pretty sure that buffersize is not the problem but rather the network in some way. I use Bubbleupnp as casting up and I get an error message there saying "Chromecast error" when it stops working........


----------



## rider

I am casting tidal through the web player and listening using Grado SR80.No dropout for me. Using a power bank to power the CCA. Nice portable headphone solution


----------



## spdtdl

Just found this thread. Quick question...
  
 I've just bought the new ifi Audio iCAN SE amp, and I'd like to use it with the chromecast.
  
 My 2 options
  
 Option 1) Optical - This Dac (FIIO D03K) then connect to the iCAN SE 
  
 or
  
 Option 2) 3.5mm to Phono plugs Cable > iCAN SE (this would use the chromecast as the dac?)
  
 I will be using BubbleUPnP for FLACS and Google music the rest of the time.


----------



## markbrauer

free1066 said:


> Just found this thread. Quick question...
> 
> I've just bought the new ifi Audio iCAN SE amp, and I'd like to use it with the chromecast.
> 
> ...


 
 Certainly try Option 2 first. The Chromecast Audio DAC is really quite good and the cable doesn't cost much. It may be completely satisfactory.
  
 As far as Option 1 goes, I have a cheap DAC very similar to the Fiio and have not been impressed with it's audio performance when connected to my desktop headphone amp. It's analog output is about of the same quality as my laptop - i.e. not very good - and no where near the quality of the Chromecast. The FIIO is mostly intended to be used to connect a TV digital output to an older analog stereo receiver. The FIIO may be better than the one I have, but it is not sold as a hi-fi component.
  
 If it was me, I'd go with Option 1 and save up until I could get a DAC on the same quality level as the excellent iCAN.


----------



## rider

using bubble upnp on the chromecast audio to stream tidal and connected my Senn HD650 (mobius cable) direct to it. Wow the chromecast audio drives it with plenty of power to spare. Amazing.


----------



## MAlanL

Question: I have my CCA running into NAD C356BEE via RCA. I am looking at buying an external DCA with Coaxial and Optical inputs allowing me to channel CCA and TV through NAD amp. To those that own a Schiit DAC - what would you recommend? Is the Modi 2 Uber significantly better sound quality than CCA via RCA? Is it worth doubling-down and saving the pennies to buy a Bifrost? Curious about people's experience.
  
 Cheers


----------



## Smithington

In case this is of interest to those in the UK, both Curry's and Argos are selling the cc audio for £15 right now. I picked one up and echo an early post - it drives headphones surprisingly well! My dt 770 pro 80 ohms sound great through it.

Oh, and recent updates to it added multiroom capability - you can cast the same music to multiple cc audios.


----------



## slackerpo

just a quick comment of my experience with the unit. i've been shelving it for months since i havent really been into the whole cloud streaming stuff. i decided to give it a shot, since i kinda had enough of my kardon bluetooth in the office. with my z1 (2013) and android 5.1.1 google play music sucks mayor ass, i just cant have a decent performance, although i get good audio, the app just disconnects and i loose control over the playing and scrobbling (lat.fm). with chrome browser cast, everything runs really smooth, i love it. i've been having no problems with localcast and bubbleupnp for local streaming either.
  
 i love this unit, this is the perfect solution for my listening at the office.
  
 im sold on cloud streaming too, not going back. hopefully im not too late for the party.


----------



## Geraffe

I wonder why mine is still up/down sampling to 48Khz. Anybody else having this issue?


----------



## yay101

Source?


----------



## Geraffe

Tidal, screencasting from Galaxy 4, and Tunein Radio cast from router.


----------



## yay101

Screen casting passes through the internal android resampler. You need to cast just audio using something like bubble.


----------



## Geraffe

It`s the same with bubble, and it sounds worse, for some strange reason.
  
 Edit: Just installed Bubble, and it is 44.1 now. Thanks.


----------



## joeike

The C C audio sounds great to me with my agk553s right now I have it wired up to my home stereo through the fiber optic cable & using bubble.Here is a image of my mobile rig using the cc audio.


----------



## markbrauer

joeike said:


> The C C audio sounds great to me with my agk553s right now I have it wired up to my home stereo through the fiber optic cable & using bubble.Here is a image of my mobile rig using the cc audio.


 
  
 Just wondering...  
  
 My headphones (Sennheiser HD650, AudioTechnica ATH A700, and RHA MA750) all sound better when plugged directly into the CCA than they do when the CCA is feeding the analog inputs of my desktop DAC/headphone amp. The CCA alone (with "Full Dynamic Range" turned ON in settings) has plenty of volume to drive even the 300 Ohm HD650, and does it with dynamics and quickness that belie it's size and cost. And the ATH A700 actually sound better driven by the CCA than they have with anything else. Also, the digital volume control in the CCA behaves very well, having no adverse effects on the sound quality even when set all the way down to 1/4 of maximum. 
  
 Have you tried your headphones plugged directly into the CCA instead of feeding it through your FiiO? How does the sound compare?
  
 I'm thinking that in my case there must be some sort of mis-match between the CCA analog output and the line-level inputs of the amp. 
  
 Of course the sound quality is superb when using the CCA optical output into the DAC/amp.
  
 What we need next is a CCA with USB output to take advantage of all the nice USB DAC/amps out there. Are you listening Google?


----------



## henriks

It is doing with optical in My Chord 2Qute..


----------



## joeike

The AKG cans sound very good also right into the CCA. I like the option to have my music in any room or in the yard.


----------



## slackerpo

Well i also have the HD650 and i think it sucks straight out of the CCA. I would use a Fiio E12 with it everytime.


----------



## markbrauer

I'm just curious, do you have the HDR option turned on? When I have it off, I agree the sound quality is poor.
  
 I would not have believed that the CCA could drive the HD650 at all, expecting the same sound quality I get with a smartphone - i.e. unacceptable. But I have a policy of trying every combination. I was shocked that it never needs more than 3/4 volume to play really loud. Most recordings are plenty loud at about 1/2 volume. And the sound is not at all wimpy, but rather full bodied and dynamic.


----------



## slackerpo

markbrauer said:


> I'm just curious, do you have the HDR option turned on? When I have it off, I agree the sound quality is poor.
> 
> I would not have believed that the CCA could drive the HD650 at all, expecting the same sound quality I get with a smartphone - i.e. unacceptable. But I have a policy of trying every combination. I was shocked that it never needs more than 3/4 volume to play really loud. Most recordings are plenty loud at about 1/2 volume. And the sound is not at all wimpy, but rather full bodied and dynamic.




Yes i tested it with HDR on. You are right, its kinda surprising the unit is able to drive the HD650, although by no means i would caracterize the sound as full bodied. More like kinda sterile and lackluster imo.


----------



## Gino

I am amazed the Chromecast Audio can drive an HE-400s directly. I stacked it with a powerbank for portable use around the house. I use Spotify for online streams and AllCast for iPhone local files. Wonderful.


----------



## comzee

Bought a Chromecast Audio today to use as a remote digital endpoint. Running mini toslink to toslink to my Schiit Yggdrasil.
  
 The first thing I noticed immediately was the potato sound. Figured it was the A/C, it was the A/C.
 Powering the CCA with a battery pack, potato sound gone. Hope this impression helps others using it as a digital offboard.


----------



## Ggroch

comzee said:


> The first thing I noticed immediately was the potato sound. Figured it was the A/C, it was the A/C.
> Powering the CCA with a battery pack, potato sound gone. Hope this impression helps others using it as a digital offboard.


 
  
 Hmm, I use both of mine exclusively as  digital sources through toslkink powered by ac.  No potatoes (you mean like Harley Davidson Potato sound? I am sure that I an other users would have noticed that).
  
 Perhaps the A/C adapter is defective, or exceptionally noise line, or some incompatiblity with that specific DAC when both are powered though AC. I just think others would have heard it if it was common.


----------



## comzee

ggroch said:


> Perhaps the A/C adapter is defective, or exceptionally noise line, or some incompatiblity with that specific DAC when both are powered though AC.


 
 Nope, A/C sounds normal. No noise etc. I apologize, I'll clarify, when I say "potato" I don't mean defective or bad. I mean by comparison within the HiFi realm.
  
 My chain in Yggdrasil -> Kgsshv Carbon -> Stax 009. With this system I can easily hear nuanced differences upstream in my chain, for example the Chromecast.
  
 If your chain isn't good enough to hear the difference, it's not necessarily a bad thing, it just is what it is. The whole chain has to be better then what you're comparing.
 If I had the CCA feeding a Modi ($100), and the amp I was using was a Magni ($100), I probably couldn't tell a difference between A/C and battery power for the CCA.
  
 There are many electrical components crammed into the CCA. Processor, WiFi, Amp, DAC. It's devices like this, in my opinion, that benefit the most from cleaning up the power. 
  
 Most HiFi equipment already have $150+ power supplies, and ample room to design circuits without interference.
  
 I'm an Audio skeptic, I believe any cable more expensive then those made by BJC is a scam. I think crap like bybee and offboards are for the poor of mind.
 Just so you know where I'm coming from. I have a low post count, I only give impressions I think are real.


----------



## Ggroch

OK, that all makes sense.   I have middle range somewhat better than Modi/Magi stuff and the Chromecast Sounds fine, but sadly my ears are not as Hi-Res as they used to be.  that's my limiting factor.
  
 For a $35 device Chromecast sounds surprisingly great, particularly since many users like me us it primarily for streaming Spotify/Tidal. 
  
 Sounds surprisingly good considering.


----------



## yay101

There's a reason good 5 volt PSU schematics are everywhere these days, the raspberry pi/hifiberry output crowd found early on our phone chargers are beyond rubbish and belong on the scrap heap, but they are great at charging phones.


----------



## gwompki

Howdy all.  I've been lurking a long time but this is my first post.
  
 I recently got a Chromecast Audio and really enjoy it.  I primarily use it for streaming Spotify, but have also been experimenting with Tidal and Bubbleupnp.  I felt the sound was a bit lacking going directly into my headphone amp (little dot 1+ > senn hd598), so I decided to take the plunge and buy my first external DAC, an SMSL Sanskrit 6th.  I was waiting for a big improvement in sound but cannot discern any difference over the internal DAC.  
  
 As an experiment I connected my laptop directly to the input of the Little Dot 1+ to see if there was a difference.  That didn't sound great either as expected.  However, when I connected the laptop to the USB input of the DAC > Little Dot, the difference was huge!  Now I've been switching back and forth between the Chromecast/optical and laptop/USB playing the same track on spotify and the laptop is clearly the winner.  Sound is much fuller, better instrument separation, and overall just much more natural sounding.  The Chromecast sounds way too bright/tinny to my ears, very little punch.  I don't want to say the sound is muddy but it just sounds...inarticulate if that makes sense.  I'm really terrible at describing what I'm hearing, but I know there is definitely a clear difference between the two.
  
 Could someone explain to me why that would be the case?  I understood that streaming to a DAC, as long as the source (spotify extreme quality) was identical, the sound should be the same.  It is just bits after all right?  Could the Chromecast and laptop be processing the raw data differently?  It is pretty perplexing to me, but like I said I'm rather new to all of this.  
  
 Cheers.


----------



## peter123

> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Hmm, I can think of a couple of thigs that might explin it. I'm sure that others can fill in with more.
  
 1. Your laptop has some kind of sound "enchancer" turned on and you prefer that sound.
  
 2. The DAC has better USB circiut than optical circuit making the sound from USB better. 
  
 3. There's something wrong with the optical output on your CCA.
  
 4. There's something wrong with you optical cable. 
  
 These are actually the only things I can think of causing the difference.


----------



## gwompki

I didn't consider the laptop might be doing something to alter the sound.  I will dig into that.  Thanks!


----------



## sonci

gwompki said:


> I didn't consider the laptop might be doing something to alter the sound.  I will dig into that.  Thanks!


 
 Have you enabled full dynamic range in CCA settings?


----------



## gwompki

sonci said:


> Have you enabled full dynamic range in CCA settings?


 
 I do have it enabled, but my understanding is that if you use the optical interface it is enabled by default:
  
 https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/6290498?hl=en


----------



## gwompki

peter123 said:


> Hmm, I can think of a couple of thigs that might explin it. I'm sure that others can fill in with more.
> 
> 1. Your laptop has some kind of sound "enchancer" turned on and you prefer that sound.
> 
> ...




So it does appear the windows drivers are doing some sort of eq'ing. In the advanced settings there are a few options such as bass boost which appear to be disabled. However the interface seems poorly designed and some of these options actually are enabled. The bass boost is set to +6db by default. 

I wonder if the CCA will implement some sort of eq some day. Maybe that would resolve issues I have.

Edit: Looks like there is an open issue on the Googlecast SDK project page requesting an EQ. Issue #705. I would post a link but am not able to  If you Google Chromecast Audio Equalizer, that is the first result that pops up


----------



## markbrauer

gwompki,
 
If you want a fuller sound with more bass maybe you should consider different headphones. The HD 5XX series of Sennheisers have always been noted for being somewhat bass light. Back when I had the HD 555 it worked great for chamber music and jazz combos but it really sucked for rock and orchestral. Just sounded thin and whimpy. The 555 also had the ability to highlight any brightness or harshness in the system or recording. I ended up getting the closed-back Audio Technica ATH A700 to use for musical styles that required more "umph". (With the A700, the cello in string quartets sounds bloated and out-of-place. Ditto for the bass in jazz combos.) I still use the A700 and it sounds great straight out of the Chromecast - even better when amped.
 
Keep lurking on Head-Fi, read all the great reviews, and find a phone that does just what you need.


----------



## gwompki

Oh believe me I have definitely considered upgrading my headphones .  I'm not quite ready to give in to upgrade-itis yet though!  I'm really happy with the HD598 via laptop/dac.  Also with my turntable setup the 598's are very satisfactory.  I am a tweaker by nature though and like the ability to change different parameters of all my devices.  The headphone amp has had quite a few tubes and opamps rolled through it.  I built my own phone pre, and have modified it several times.  My turntable has had multiple cartridges on it and i've experimented with various vtf and cartridge alignment.  Etc.  I guess I'm just slightly frustrated because at this point there is nothing I can do to tweak the CCA.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  If I weren't having the same experience of the CCA through my amp/speakers, I would definitely lean on the headphones as the weak link.  
  
 Granted my ears are probably severely damaged from years of playing in punk bands and not wearing ear protection at shows.  Take anything I say about critical listening with a grain of salt.
  
 Thanks for the advice on the A700's though, I will definitely look into them.  I know eventually I will breakdown and try a different set of headphones, but want to make sure i'm squeezing all of the performance out of the system that I can before dropping another significant chunk of change.


----------



## Smithington

Once again, £15 in Curry's in the UK. Remember folks, the CCA is a marked improvement over the headphone amp in most smartphone.

http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and-home-entertainment/digital-and-smart-tv/smart-tv/google-chromecast-audio-10137628-pdt.html


----------



## TheCrusher

I wonder if there has been any consensus about what their "Full Dynamic Range" does?
  
 I read the stuff back on page one about "High Dynamic Range" but this leads me to wonder if Google's "Full Dynamic Range" actually means the _*exact opposite*_ of "High Dynamic Range".  That is, turning _*ON*_ "Full dynamic range" is really turning _*OFF*_ HDR.
  
 Here's why I think this might be the case:
 HDR is really limited dynamic range—the total range is reduced to keep the loud parts quieter.  Given that Google's product derives from a video player, this makes perfect sense—I _hate_ that so many movies are mixed with very loud sound effects and music, and very soft dialogue.  That may be appropriate in a movie theater, or other very loud setting, but for most in-home viewing where the entire house doesn't want to hear the movie, this leaves me turning the volume up for dialogue and down for "the loud stuff".  HDR is the solution that was designed for this exact problem.
  
 It would make sense for Google to have HDR on by default in a video entertainment product.  And it would make sense for them to recommend that you turn it off if you are using high-quality audio equipment.  This would be sensible advice for both a home-theater application, as well as hi-fi audio listening, where HDR kills the dynamics that classical musicians (as one example) work so hard to produce.  And these exact scenarios, where HDR should be turned OFF is where they recommend that you turn Full Dynamic Range ON.  The even make FDR ON the default for the digital audio out (i.e. home theater and hi-fi applications).
  
 And the literal meaning of "Full Dynamic Range" is that you are not limiting the range, while HDR's job is to limit the range.
  
 So between the literal meaning of the terms, and the application of their advice, that's why I think Google's FDR is the opposite of HDR.
  
 So has anyone done this test to see which way is up for this setting?  All the discussions I've seen here talk about fuller, brighter, muddier, etc.  But I'm curious if people notice a real difference in absolute volume between the two settings.


----------



## markbrauer

thecrusher said:


> I wonder if there has been any consensus about what their "Full Dynamic Range" does?
> 
> I read the stuff back on page one about "High Dynamic Range" but this leads me to wonder if Google's "Full Dynamic Range" actually means the _*exact opposite*_ of "High Dynamic Range".  That is, turning _*ON*_ "Full dynamic range" is really turning _*OFF*_ HDR.
> 
> ...


 
 Please refer to Post #13 in this thread.
  
 HDR was the name used for a compression process in a software product marketed a few years ago that DID limit dynamic range. The company seemed to be aiming it at those producing or distributing music, and looking to make things LOUDER. You know - to win the loudness war. I did download the before/after HDR sample files of familiar popular music that the company provided and thought the HDR process ruined the sound of music in all sorts of ways. It was REALLY bad. The unprocessed sample always sounded better.
  
 Currently, a company named Designing Sound uses the term HDR to describe their dynamic compression process which seems aimed more at integrating sound loud effects into a movie soundtrack in an intelligent way.
  
 I believe that Google just did a poor job of picking the HDR name for the functionality in the Chromecast Audio. Most reviewers/posters seem to agree that the difference with Chromecast HDR on or off is minimal, other than the obvious change in overall volume. Some think that on gives a slightly more dynamic presentation. I feel HDR on is a bit more dynamic but I think the improvement is caused by better synergy with my other equipment when HDR is on. Many think that Google's HDR is just a volume limiter of the type that lets you set levels for your kids so they are less likely to blow out their eardrums.
  
 But there is a much simpler answer to the question... all you have to do is listen with it on and then listen with it off - make your own decision about which is better.


----------



## Tuco1965

If you use the SPDIF the setting has no effect.


----------



## 6month

Hello All, 
I'm just want to listen to Internet jazz from iPod to Emotiva UMC 200 processor. Which connection 3mm to stereo or optical sounds the best?


----------



## yay101

Depends which is the more competent DAC, I would assume the umc but the Chromecast audio was obviously designed by someone who knows audio design because it is no slouch.

Try both and see which you prefer.


----------



## Gino

The Chromecast Audio lineout is pretty good but can be better. I'd try the optical route and compare.


----------



## joeike

I would go with the optical out.mine sounds sweet on my Yamaha RXV481.


----------



## 6month

Hello All, the station I really need only comes via premium only thru chromecast. Jazz Radio isn't worth $$ a month. Anyone tried Veetop? That will let me stream AirPlay.


----------



## yay101

Airplay is an inferior protocol to even its own sibling upnp.

I'm not sure I understand your issue though, are you trying to find a free jazz internet radio station?


----------



## 6month

Yes, mainly Smooth Jazz Vocals.


----------



## 6month

Hello All, my 2 stations are only available thru premium services. Any suggestions for free smooth jazz vocals?


----------



## 6month

Thanks All,
  
 I exchanged the Chromecast for an AirPort Express. That did the trick!!


----------



## MothAudio

Picked up CCA  a few days ago and initially was having major drop out issues. This was with *Samsung Avant */ *Poweramp* [FLAC] with a generic  RCA>3.5MM "Y" adapter coupled to the O.E.M. [yellow] cable. Replaced the generic "Y" adapter with a *KabelDirekt* (0,5 ft) (1 x 3.5mm female to 2 x RCA male) - PRO Series "Y" adapter and problem solved [OEM cable still in the loop]. This combo is feeding my *Denon *AVR / *Signet* sl260 speakers / home theatre. SQ is impressive, limited by the source material and to a lesser extent the Signets. * 
 
Next up I switched the RCA cable for optical cable. Initially the presentation was less refined but seems to be improving with more air time. **
 
*Update:* Due to the limited selection of supported apps I was using the "cast" feature. Then discovered the *UPnP Monkey app*, purchased the *BubbleUPnP for DLNA/Chromecast app *and began streaming - MUCH Better! Haven't A/B'd analog vs toslink cable because the my current set up gives me no reason to. 
 
 
* These are mid-'90 [$500] speakers using source material I'm familiar compared to Silverline Audio [$4k] speakers. I'll have to snag another CCA and plug it into my SET tube amp/Silverline combo to see what it can really do.


 ** Definite improvement as I approached 10 hrs.


----------



## Jam_Master_J

I am trying to decide between Chromecast 2 and Chromecast Audio for my application.  I have a Pioneer Elite reciever /w HDMI I want to use to play music on speakers.  Currently using an aptX bluetooth unit via digital coax.  Is there any likely sound quality difference between CCA on optical versus CC2 on HDMI? Purely for music streaming.  The extra features on the CC2 are nice but only if it can pass a good clean PCM signal via the HDMI.


----------



## kfarndog

jam_master_j said:


> I am trying to decide between Chromecast 2 and Chromecast Audio for my application.  I have a Pioneer Elite reciever /w HDMI I want to use to play music on speakers.  Currently using an aptX bluetooth unit via digital coax.  Is there any likely sound quality difference between CCA on optical versus CC2 on HDMI? Purely for music streaming.  The extra features on the CC2 are nice but only if it can pass a good clean PCM signal via the HDMI.


 
 YMMV as always.  I have and use both - the Chromecast Audio sounds better in my application.  Don't quote me on this, but I think Chromecast audio supports hi-res music whereas Chromecast does not?


----------



## Jam_Master_J

Thanks for the input, is that on digital signal path for both?  
  
 As well, On a 7.1 reciever, does the CC2 open up a full 7.1 PCM stream or does it switch to stereo PCM as needed?


----------



## Ben Che

Honestly its not the best. For its price point and convience though its worth a look


----------



## kfarndog

jam_master_j said:


> Thanks for the input, is that on digital signal path for both?
> 
> As well, On a 7.1 reciever, does the CC2 open up a full 7.1 PCM stream or does it switch to stereo PCM as needed?


 
 Unfortunately, I don't know on your second question as I use a simple two channel setup.  I tested with digital path, but the Audio is pretty solid out of analog too.  Guess that will depend on how good your receiver's DAC is vs the Audio.


----------



## Jam_Master_J

Prefer to keep to digital only because I apply room correction in the receiver so if I can avoid any extra A to D conversions in the chain.  I think I will lean towards the CCA, thanks.


----------



## markbrauer

Just used the Android app to access device settings for my Chromecast Audio and notice they have changed the name of the dynamic range setting from "High Dynamic Range" to "Full Dynamic Range". I haven't noticed any change in sound quality but this new name should cause less confusion about the effect this option is intended to have.


----------



## slex

Hi, has anyone compare sound quality of the digital out against ipad 4 which i believe will output default 16bit/44.1khz against 24bit/96khz of this chromecast audio?


----------



## buchignani

I've had one of these tiny things for just 24 hours but have to say that I am astonished at its capabilities.
  
 Because my chief intended use for it is to drive a very good headphone amp in a location away from my main setup I did however immediately come across one issue: *no equalization. Ditto other DSP effects.*
  
 As of yet, I can't seem to find any Android apps that can 'cast' local music files with equalization. The equalizers packaged into those players that are chromecast ready do not seem to work when casting. Neither do the so-called universal equalizers that I have tried that are intended to affect the audio of the whole android platform.  This holds true even for playing files located right on the same device. This sucks.
  
 People seem to have been complaining to Google about this far before the Chromecast Audio version came out, obviously to no effect.
  
 To me, this is a serious issue. We all know how dramatically different the sound of different headphones are, and I have grown accustomed to developing an equalization for each of those I use.
  
 Does anyone out there have a solution? As I said, I am only 24 hours into this world and may have missed something.


----------



## yay101

buchignani said:


> I've had one of these tiny things for just 24 hours but have to say that I am astonished at its capabilities.
> 
> Because my chief intended use for it is to drive a very good headphone amp in a location away from my main setup I did however immediately come across one issue: *no equalization. Ditto other DSP effects.*
> 
> ...




System casting will allow you DSP. It will also limit you to your OEMS bitdepth:rate and drain your battery and may sound worse. There is no equalisation because when you cast a file that isn't local the Chromecast plays from the source, not from your phone just like upnp. In theory a developer could make their app do DSP then cast "locally" but it will just destroy your battery life for the gain of DSP.

Just a FYI, google could implement DSP on the Chromecast if they wanted, alsa has a whole chain of DSP options but since 99% of users won't use them I wouldn't count on them being added.


----------



## buchignani

yay101 said:


> System casting will allow you DSP. It will also limit you to your OEMS bitdepth:rate and drain your battery and may sound worse. There is no equalisation because when you cast a file that isn't local the Chromecast plays from the source, not from your phone just like upnp. In theory a developer could make their app do DSP then cast "locally" but it will just destroy your battery life for the gain of DSP.
> 
> Just a FYI, google could implement DSP on the Chromecast if they wanted, alsa has a whole chain of DSP options but since 99% of users won't use them I wouldn't count on them being added.


 
  
 Thanks for the quick reply. I think I am about 80% of the way there, understanding wise.
  
 I can see the issues that could arise when, like me, you are controlling the casting process on a tablet, but when the music files are elsewhere on the local system (an NAS, another computer, etc.). But I can't fully understand how there would be any issues when casting files that actually are in residence on the tablet. They after all have to be grabbed by the player and sent along by WiFi to the Chromecast Audio device  whether there is DSP added via a tablet app or not.
  
 In my case I've got about 100GB of audio files on the tablet in question linked for updating to Dropbox. In my now 48 hours of Chromecast Audio experience casting maximum quality mp3 files from the tablet to the CA device works flawlessly (hint: you have to change the default mp3 settings in the Chromecast app to the maximum). It does not seem to drain the battery quickly. Certainly the battery demands are less than when playing the same files from the tablet directly into insensitive earphones. So unless I am missing something adding and equalizer to play same device files shouldn't be any burden at all.
  
 Have I got something wrong here?


----------



## yay101

buchignani said:


> Thanks for the quick reply. I think I am about 80% of the way there, understanding wise.
> 
> I can see the issues that could arise when, like me, you are controlling the casting process on a tablet, but when the music files are elsewhere on the local system (an NAS, another computer, etc.). But I can't fully understand how there would be any issues when casting files that actually are in residence on the tablet. They after all have to be grabbed by the player and sent along by WiFi to the Chromecast Audio device  whether there is DSP added via a tablet app or not.
> 
> ...




The problem is its not as easy. To add casting playback to a music app is as simple as copy/ pasting the api into your app and adjusting for your media type. As soon as you want to do DSP you have to manually write the library to do so yourself, and as its one area I haven't looked into android app wise I'm not even sure how easy that would be. At the very least you would need 2 different casting functions based on whether the user is using DSP or not.

Re battery draining, its relative. You are comparing local playback to local playback, there shouldn't be a big difference there. The difference is from users casting from a nas or cloud storage/ streaming service to the Chromecast. In that case the device just sends a link telling the Chromecast where to grab the data from, after that you could turn off your phone for all the Chromecast cares, its got its link. If you do DSP however even from a streaming service battery drain will be at least as bad as it is with local playback.


----------



## markbrauer

buchignani said:


> As of yet, I can't seem to find any Android apps that can 'cast' local music files with equalization.... Neither do the so-called universal equalizers that I have tried that are intended to affect the audio of the whole android platform.  This holds true even for playing files located right on the same device. This sucks.


 
  
 I would have replied sooner but I was out of town and I wanted to try this out to make sure it worked...
  
 I use an app called _Folder Player_ to play local music on my Android.
 https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.folderplayer&hl=en
 It has a simple built-in equalizer.
  
 The app itself does not have a casting option, but Androids have "screen casting" as a native capability - the ability to cast audio (video too) directly from the Android to a Chromecast device. It seemed to me that any equalization applied in the app should be cast by this method.
  
 I tried it - and it indeed works!
  
 I do not have any "universal" equalizers to try but it seems they should also work using this method, as should any other local music players with equalizers. You could even just ignore the casting abilities in players for music services, apply equalization on the Android, and use screen casting instead
  
 Hope this help your enjoyment of Chromecast.
  
 A warning though, whenever I have used the Android to both play and cast, the battery charge drops precipitously. Best to have it on the charger.


----------



## MothAudio

CCA sounds cleaner with fewer artifacts than I remember. Firmware: 1.19.62825. Anyone else notice this?


----------



## buchignani

> The app itself does not have a casting option, but Androids have "screen casting" as a native capability - the ability to cast audio (video too) directly from the Android to a Chromecast device. It seemed to me that any equalization applied in the app should be cast by this method.
> 
> I tried it - and it indeed works!
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks for the reply. I initially was trying to avoid using the local cast option. After your post I tried local casting of local files with several non-Chromecast ready player (PowerAmp, Neutron, etc.] and it worked just fine. The internal equalizer in Neutron worked also.
  
 So I am quite content just now. I have a few minor beefs--particularly that player (whether Chromecast read or not) seem to sometimes lose control over volume in Chromecast  (always available in the Chromecast app), and that calling up a music file takes a lot longer than when playing the same file without Chromecast. FYI flac files seem to play just fine. On my Samsung Galaxy Tab S2 tablet battery drain seems unimportant: about 2-4% per album equivalent of Chromecast playing of local files.
  
 I have been also playing music from my PC via WiFi and Serviio and that works fine also. Next stage: trying an NAS, which  is just now coming in the post.


----------



## yay101

As I said previously, remember that when using screen casting you are limited to the depth:rate your OEM has set, and all music goes through the android mixer before getting cast, but if you are happy with these limitations then more power to you.


----------



## MothAudio

.


----------



## aeonman

Just.wow. Streaming Google Music. Relaxing Piano Radio. With optic. Be amazed.


----------



## Tadamn

Sound quality is wonderful. I am gonna get one for my parents soon.


----------



## tonehk

for anyone who may be interested, chromecast audio now works with tidal. i just checked with IOS. just update tidal app.


----------



## Geraffe

Not with Android yet. At least not here.


----------



## comzee

geraffe said:


> Not with Android yet. At least not here.


 
 Yea IOS has the best plug-n-play support for audio devices.
 I own an iPhone and an Android phone (work / personal).
  
 Android is designed more modular, this gives the power to the user, but the downsides are incompatibility.
  
 I use a DragonFly Red DAC, works on maybe 1-2 apps properly on Android.
  
 All apps, and all system components, automatically work perfectly using the dragonfly (or literally any DAC I've thrown at it) without flaws on IOS. 
  
 To give some data, my Android phone is on 6.01 Marshmellow, the older Android versions were substantially worse too for DAC support.
 I think since early IOS 8 all usb DACs have ran perfectly from my iPhone/iPad (Dragonfly/Chromecast Music/Yggdrasil/Master7/WA7/ the list goes on).


----------



## MothAudio

Anyone plugging CCA mini-toslink>toslink into their A/V receiver via optical input?


----------



## henriks

yes, to my Onkyo 876


----------



## Matro5

tonehk said:


> for anyone who may be interested, chromecast audio now works with tidal. i just checked with IOS. just update tidal app.


 
 OK, so I updated the app and now I can't believe I'm going to ask, but... now what? How do I stream to my CCA? 
  
 A sheepish thanks in advance....


----------



## tonehk

matro5 said:


> OK, so I updated the app and now I can't believe I'm going to ask, but... now what? How do I stream to my CCA?
> 
> A sheepish thanks in advance....




Make sure you have google cast app installed and set up. Also update tidal app. Then go into tidal and play track. Go into playing track ( the screen with revolving record). Middle of screen, left most icon should be a google cast icon. Press that and select chromecast. Should then play out of cca. Works same way as tunein radio and Spotify.


----------



## Matro5

thanks! I thought I'd updated but apparently, I was two updates behind somehow. Just a glitch but we're working perfectly now. 
  
 This is actually a great update for my intended usage. Psyched.


----------



## rage3324

When hooking up the chromecast via optical to a DAC, I don't see the dynamic compression setting anymore. Is that normal? Is there anyway to confirm that audio is not being resampled?
  
 Currently I am using plex on my iphone to cast flac audio, but oddly, I can still control the volume from my phone. I would think the main volume control would be my amp..


----------



## Tuco1965

There is no compression when using optical with chromecast.


----------



## rage3324

tuco1965 said:


> There is no compression when using optical with chromecast.


 
  
 Right. Any idea why I can still control the volume via plex on my phone? Is plex acting as a pre-amp somehow? Plex says it is doing direct play


----------



## chjan

Yes, the "global" casting will adopt whatever equalizing or other DSP you implement in your app. Problem solved, except that it should be added to the CC API an option to "system broadcast" when clicking on the CC button IN THE app actionbar. Why? Because it is indeed a cumbersome solution to be dependant on the ChromeCast app for supervising the use of CC when actually using another multimedia app. The whole purpose of the "action bar" button is to make things easy, isnt it? Hence, this design looks a bit hasty.


----------



## audiojun

I get tons of jitter from chromecast. So sound quality is meh. But it sure is cheap though.


----------



## Ggroch

audiojun said:


> I get tons of jitter from chromecast. So sound quality is meh. But it sure is cheap though.


 
 Can you elaborate on that.  How are you experiencing the jitter?


----------



## audiojun

You get a sort of haze, reminds me of a time when usb to spdif convertors where schiit. If you want to listen to jitter just listen to chromecast audio vs not using chromecast audio.
  
 edit quick google search found this.
 http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html


----------



## MothAudio

audiojun said:


> You get a sort of haze, reminds me of a time when usb to spdif convertors where schiit. If you want to listen to jitter just listen to chromecast audio vs not using chromecast audio.
> 
> edit quick google search found this.
> http://*archimago.blogspot.com/*2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html


 
  
_"A couple of weeks ago in the __post about MQA__, in the comments, I mentioned that this blog is about "perfectionist" audio and objective testing to tease out subtle effects and the minutiae. To the perfectionist, we can of course pick apart performance in all kinds of ways. With that mindset, I suppose I could express a dissatisfaction with the level of jitter found. But the truth is that there's just no need to apply that level of scrutiny to a device like this given the level of quality achieved at this price point. Other than the audiophiles, nobody cares. And other than objective audiophiles where we can actually demonstrate the imperfection and reliably "grade" quality of gear based on these results, practically, *it's just inaudible*.

 I'd be absolutely happy with the Chromecast Audio's analogue output in my secondary stereo system. *And I don't believe anyone is really going to notice the jitter in day-to-day use*. Heck, it's only US$35.00; probably less than the amount one pays for coffee a month!

 Well done Google! Now if you could tighten up that TosLink timing accuracy a bit in the next version, you'd really make the final 0.1% of audio lovers (the "perfectionist") really quite happy ._
  
_Posted by Archimago"_


----------



## Ggroch

I found that article too after audiojun's initial remark.  He does say it is at least 70DB below the signal and should be inaudible.  What is and is not inaudible varies by individual I am sure.  The article is great, well worth reading and the author is very impressed by the bit-perfect performance of this cheap device. 
  
*Stutter Anyone? *
  
 I have another problem that is definitely audible, Played through toslink and my Yulong D200 DAC I am now getting *stutter *(not jitter) after about 3 minutes of use.   The stutter is brief pauses (maybe 1/4 second) where the DAC loses the 44K signal (the LCD and input lights briefly dim and sound stops for just a bit).  This may happen twice in about 4 seconds....and then again a couple of minutes later. 
  
 I have tried 2 different CAs (same problem). The Yulong play other sources (Optical from my soundblaster and USB) just fine.  Anyone have Stutter?   I have only noticed this since the last firmware update.  I am hoping the Yulong is not bad, cause its supposed to be under warranty but I would have to ship it to China. 
  
 I do not hear the problem through the other DAC I have tried.  Just the Yulong.


----------



## markbrauer

audiojun said:


> I get tons of jitter from chromecast. So sound quality is meh. But it sure is cheap though.


 
 I can't say whether it's jitter or not, but I get a big improvement in sound quality with battery power. My son loaned me one of those USB battery packs to charge my smartphone on a trip. When back at home I thought "why not try it with the Chromecast". It really does sound better - everything is smoother and more controlled. Dynamics seem better too. I went out and bought a 12,000 mAh model on sale for $20 and based on the built-in charge monitor it is good for about 40 hours of streaming between charges. I do need to unplug it when not playing music as the Chromecast seems to draw the same amount whether streaming or not.


----------



## audiojun

For everday normal use for normal people the jitter won't matter much, but for the audiophile it matters a lot. But for $35 it sure is great at the price point.


----------



## hifi808

audiojun said:


> I get tons of jitter from chromecast. So sound quality is meh. But it sure is cheap though.


 
  
 Any chance you could post up your jitter measurements so they can be compared with Archimago's. Would be interesting to see the severity of any unit to unit variations.


----------



## audiojun

No, measuring jitter properly requires $100,000 lab equipment. Most manufactors don't even report jitter numbers.

By ear the chromecast audio was tied for the most jittery source with my motherboard s/pdif optical output. (drop outs make chromecast less reliable than an computer optical connection, but even the computer is prone to drop outs. Coaxial is just about always better than optical if you ever had a choice of inputs.)

Then the m2tech USB interface on my DAC is leagues better than it, (like way better).

Then followed by a uptone regen USB reclocked into that m2tech USB interface that further reduces the jitter.

Lastly mutec 1.2 usb s/pdif convertor was the best source I have tried.

Reducing jitter makes things clear, the background is blacker, the edges are sharper. There is a haze with chromecast that is very noticable when I switch my source from my USB regened input to chromecast optical.

Chromecast is useful to get audio out over WiFi, but I wouldn't use it for high end audio.


----------



## reginalb

For what it's worth, I just use the analog output, with the supplied 3.5mm to 3.5mm cable on one, a monoprice 3.5mm to RCA, and a Sony speaker with Google Cast built in, and none of the 3 have audible jitter. 
  
 If you're curious what jitter sounds like, here you go: http://www.sereneaudio.com/blog/what-does-jitter-sound-like
  
 I haven't tried the optical output, so I can't comment on that, just the analog.
  
 Also, I use Play Music All Access. While my library is actually available to my Plex server, I've never actually played my library that way through the CC audio. I have also used Apple Music, Tidal, and Deezer through it. And at some point will be trying Spotify (going to write up a comparison).
  
 So with my far different playback system, there isn't audible jitter.


----------



## noshortcuts

good chromecast audio jitter read: http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html


----------



## REXNFX

audiojun said:


> You get a sort of haze, reminds me of a time when usb to spdif convertors where schiit. If you want to listen to jitter just listen to chromecast audio vs not using chromecast audio.
> 
> edit quick google search found this.
> http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html


 
 Archimago says he hears no difference between USB>DAC and CCA>DAC. I think your findings are either due to using a poor Toslink cable or your DAC has a poor Toslink input. Try the CCA with a battery pack and use the analog out, I think you'll be surprised at the SQ.


----------



## stouf78

ggroch said:


> I found that article too after audiojun's initial remark.  He does say it is at least 70DB below the signal and should be inaudible.  What is and is not inaudible varies by individual I am sure.  The article is great, well worth reading and the author is very impressed by the bit-perfect performance of this cheap device.
> 
> *Stutter Anyone? *
> 
> ...


 
 Hi,
  
 Got the same issue since the last update. My problem is with an Audio GD DAC with ES9018 chip. I contacted Google about that on their forum, they seemed very awake at the beginning then nothing changed.
 So, I replaced my Chromecast Audio by a Sonos Connect, and no more issue.


----------



## Ggroch

stouf78 said:


> Got the same issue since the last update. My problem is with an Audio GD DAC with ES9018 chip. I contacted Google about that on their forum, they seemed very awake at the beginning then nothing changed.
> So, I replaced my Chromecast Audio by a Sonos Connect, and no more issue.


 
  
 Thank you very much for taking the time to reply   My Yulong uses an ES9016 chip so it is possible the programming and stutter issues are similar.  I have other DACs with no problem.  Knowing others have the issue means I do not have to worry about sending the Yulong back to China for repair.   I will stick with Chromecast for now because of the price difference, but will provide input on the forums on this issue.


----------



## stouf78

Hi,
  
 The forum is here for that 
 I thought too my DAC had an issue, especially when I tested the Chromecast simultaneously plugged to a Cambridge DAC Magic who didn't dropped at all.
  
 Here is the link of the thread on the Chromecast forum: https://productforums.google.com/forum/?hl=fr-CA#!topic/chromecast/rHtqtn08RpI;context-place=topicsearchin/chromecast/ess9018


----------



## Ggroch

Thanks for the link. I see the last posting was June 1 and there has been at least 1 firmware update since then.  So I have rehooked the Yulong and will test it with the newest firmware so I will have something to contribute to the thread.


----------



## Simon Morris

Linn do a 320 Kbps Jazz (and Classic as well as Contemporary) available via TuneIn


----------



## Simon Morris

Anything encountering a similar issue to me?
  
 I'm playing FLAC 96/24 from my PC via Foobar and Bubble uPnP to my CCA and using my Fiio E17 as DAC/AMP
  
 CCA->E17 via analogue sounds great
 CCA->E17 via optical is noisy as hell - clicks, hiss, audio cutouts - virtually unlistenable
  
 but CCA->E17 via optical 48/16 playing playing 320kbps MP3 or M4A sounds great
  
 I've tried listening to the FLAC 96/24 files PC->E17 via USB - the occasional stutter, can even manage to downsample 192/24 FLAC sample files pretty well with only occasional stutter


----------



## RobertUSA

*CCA* sound quality is quite acceptable.
  
 I use *CCA* optical and/or analog output for driving AV, HiFi, and Cambridge Audio radios - whole house simulcast sound managed by Chromecast Groups.

 I use a separate *CCA* for "roaming" use, plugging into headphones (*Philips SHP9500*) or earbuds and the analog power is *substantially* more powerful and cleaner than what is available on my phone or tablet. When "roaming" I either plug in using the a USB charger, a power brick, or laptop/netbook usb port.

 If you are really getting into digital audio _*on-the-cheap* the *$30 CCA *_and _*existing earbuds/headphones *_will suffice. Of course, SHP9500's, SR850's, HD681's, or other modestly priced headphones might be a step up if you are using inexpensive earbuds

 Really, you are getting better dynamic range, lower distortion, and higher volume compared to your smartphone/tablet. And by auditioning and upgrading headphones, you may get the a very good improvement in sound for $30 plus the cost of headphones.

 Not bad for an introduction to digital streaming, without purchasing more expensive digital components.

 In fact, you *might only own a smartphone* and *simply add Chromecast Audio* and a *decent set of headphones* and have *a great digital audio experience for $100 *


----------



## markbrauer

simon morris said:


> Anything encountering a similar issue to me?
> 
> CCA->E17 via optical is noisy as hell - clicks, hiss, audio cutouts - virtually unlistenable


 
My CCA optical output plays 96/24 perfectly into my Burson DAC/amp. 192/24 also works but I'm not sure if conversion to 96/24 happens along the way - like in the server or streaming/player software.
 
Looking on HeadFi at least one reviewer has reported similar problems with the E17, reporting "some crackling/distortion".
http://www.head-fi.org/products/fiio-e17
 
First thing I would do is feed the E17 from another optical source - some older desktops and laptops have optical output, as do many TVs and home theater devices.
 
I'd also swap out the optical cable.
 
Good luck.


----------



## RobertUSA

Sound quality and power is excellent, however the *Google developers arrogantly made a bad product management "go-to-market" decision regarding EQ* * 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



*
  
 It looks like Google has no intent to add EQ software to the CCA device and controller software within the Chromecast app ;(

 Bummer, there was so much *promise for CCA* streaming to *self-powered monitor speakers, component power amps, headphones, and earbuds* 
  
*https://code.google.com/p/google-cast-sdk/issues/detail?id=705*
  
*Project Member* #63 sya...@google.com

```
Chromecast Audio was designed to provide streaming content from the service provider. Processing of that content is not part of the feature set. Chromecast Audio is designed to feed audio systems of a very broad variety, across a wide range of user tastes, and many of those provide their own post-processing feature sets. Chromecast Audio was not intended to provide redundant capabilities in that regard.
```
  
  
*I guess we can ask the question why google play music still doesn't have EQ built in 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I can look into Amazon products to see what kind of digital streaming and DSP they support. If they can't do it, maybe there's a "me too" product coming from China soon *


----------



## rbc3585

Hi! First time poster here and I'm very new to hifi audio generally. I'm looking to use the chromecast audio as part of a portable streaming solution around the house. Couple of questions for anyone who has done so.
 1. Has anyone used it extensively with a power bank, and if so do you have battery capacity to playtime ratios? I'm thinking I'll go with a 5000-10000mah pack, but wondering how small I can go without having to recharge too frequently.
 2. Has anyone tried outputting audio to the Teac Ha-P50 via toslink? (smallest decent dac I've been able to find that has both an  internal battery and optical input, though if anyone can think of any others let me know!)
 Thanks!


----------



## markbrauer

rbc3585 said:


> 1. Has anyone used it extensively with a power bank, and if so do you have battery capacity to playtime ratios? I'm thinking I'll go with a 5000-10000mah pack, but wondering how small I can go without having to recharge too frequently.


 
  
I have used a power bank quite a bit. First and foremost the Chromecast Audio sounds better when powered by the batteries rather than the wall wart. To be cliched - it sounds more analog.
 
My power bank is a REV brand, purchased for around $20 on sale at Best Buy. It is rated at 12,000 mAh. It has a constant digital readout of charge remaining, in percent.  When powering the CCA it takes over 20 minutes* to drop 1%. I have timed this when the battery is full and when it is almost empty, and the rate of drop is consistent. The discharge rate is also the same whether or not the CCA is playing music or just plugged in and idle. It is also the same whether using the analog or optical output.
 
1% of 12,000 is 120 mAh so the CCA uses 120 mAh every 20 minutes, or 360 mAh in a hour.
 
If you want the power bank to last say 10 hours, it should have a capacity of at least 3600 mAh. Simple calculation. With my 12,000 mAh unit I get over 33 hours.
 
As far as a DAC/amp, I would advise giving the internal one in the CCA a try. I use my CCA mostly as a headphone amp and find that the sound quality is more than acceptable. It has none of the whimpyness you get when driving headphones out of a phone or laptop. It does a great job on my hard-to-drive 300 Ohm Sennheiser HD650, my 32 Ohm Noontec Zoro II, and my 16 Ohm RHA 750. Plenty of volume and a full-bodied sound. If you look on the web you can find many others CCA owners who find this is true. The CCA's internal volume control is up to this use, sounding good throughout it's range.
 
So, get yourself a real short USB cable, lash the CCA to a pocketable power bank and start wandering the house. You may find that's all you really need.
  
 * It is actually more like 24 minutes for each 1% but I'm trying to be conservative in my calculations.


----------



## rbc3585

Thanks for the battery stats! I'll probably go with the anker powercore 10000. I'm using Sony mdr-1as, which my phone and computer do a pretty good job of driving (huge upgrade from the Sennheiser in-ear momentums anyway). So I'll test them with the chromecast before investing in a dac.


----------



## peter123

rbc3585 said:


> Hi! First time poster here and I'm very new to hifi audio generally. I'm looking to use the chromecast audio as part of a portable streaming solution around the house. Couple of questions for anyone who has done so.
> 1. Has anyone used it extensively with a power bank, and if so do you have battery capacity to playtime ratios? I'm thinking I'll go with a 5000-10000mah pack, but wondering how small I can go without having to recharge too frequently.
> 
> 2. Has anyone tried outputting audio to the Teac Ha-P50 via toslink? (smallest decent dac I've been able to find that has both an  internal battery and optical input, though if anyone can think of any others let me know!)
> Thanks!




The iBasso D14 seems to be ever so slightly smaller. Could at least be an alternative (it has a combined coaxial/optical input)......


----------



## rbc3585

peter123 said:


> The iBasso D14 seems to be ever so slightly smaller. Could at least be an alternative (it has a combined coaxial/optical input)......


 

 Not a bad idea. I'm slightly put off by the dated mini usb port, but at least charging can be turned off on the D14.


----------



## Ggroch

Slightly larger than the Teac...only slightly, but with a richer feature set and about double the battery and max output is the XDuoo XD-05.  I have had great results with Chromecast on it for about the same price.


----------



## Ggroch

A chromecast competitor, the *Echo Dot* is out and mine arrived yesterday.  $50 (or $40 if you buy through your existing Echo).   No optical output - Aux out only. 
  
 Compatible with Spotify, Amazon Music (reg and unlimited) and Pandora. Not compatible with Google Music, Tidal,
  
 A bit smaller than a hockey puck (so lots bigger than Chromecast Audio). 
  
 I mention it because the smart voice control is pretty slick.   You can sing the lyrics to a song and Alexa can find the song on Amazon or Spotify.  Or say "Alexa, play Janis Ian radio on Spotify" and it will.  I think voice control will be a major in home interface going forward.   The dot shows up on Spotify as a connect device so if you like the Spotify app its compatible. 
  
 Perhaps the upcoming Google Home hub thing will be the best of all worlds (have not seen yet if that has optical out).  
  
 So far I like the dot. Sound quality from the aux out is good. But it will not replace the CCA at this point.


----------



## dmance

The latest firmware 1.21.74816 sounds fantastic. Did they fix the dynamic range, jitter? No comments on the forums...but have a listen (you may have to request access to the preview builds to download it)


----------



## Ggroch

dmance said:


> The latest firmware 1.21.74816 sounds fantastic. Did they fix the dynamic range, jitter? No comments on the forums...but have a listen (you may have to request access to the preview builds to download it)


 
 Dmance, thanks for the heads up.
  
 I agree that something in the signal has changed / improved with Preview Firmware 74816..  Earlier in this thread I  with another owner that the gorgeous sounding but signal quality sensitive Yulong D200 DAC stuttered (sound cut out) 3-4 times every five minutes or so with earlier CCA firmware using the TOSLINK output.   It was a serious and consistent bug with the D200 and other DACs using the ES9016 chip, and was evident but not as frequent with the more common ES9018 chipset DACS.
  
 I just re-connected my D200 with the a CCA 74816 firmware and no stutters at all in 40 minutes.  I will keep monitoring but am very pleased with the change as the D200 is the best sounding Dac I own and was unusable with CCA.
  
 So something has definitely changed.   I am not convinced that you can hear the level of Jitter that was in older CCA firmware, but something has improved and perhaps you can hear jitter (or your DAC is more sensitive to jitter) than most.


----------



## dmance

I have an exaSound e22..and yes, I should have added that it now plays almost perfectly with only 1-2 stalls at the start of a song, vs every 30 seconds. I thought the sub second delays was attributable to internet buffer starvation...not jitter. I imagine Google had to do work on their network to rush my song to my nearby ISP hub, just guessing.


----------



## Ggroch

On further listening with my ES9016 DAC and the 74816 firmware the stuttering still exists but not as bad.  Problems start happening after the 1st 30 minutes or so (Trump debate syndrome??).  I will keep trying.


----------



## dmance

I don't think it's jitter that stalls playback. It's the demands on your home network for streaming. Well my guess. Try the $19 Google ethernet wired charger.
https://store.google.com/product/ethernet_adapter_for_chromecast
This seemed to help my situation.


----------



## almarti

Has anyone paired CCA through TOSLINK to Chord Mojo? If so, which are the results?

I use Mojo from USB laptop and iPad/iPod with HD600 and Etys ER-4PT, but lately Mojo driving stereo amp Marantz PM-17 KI Series to speakers Chario Lynn. I am looking for a wirless connectivity for amp/speakers, and it is not clear for me about differences of CCA to Airport Express, Fon Gramofon and other alternatives than price comparison.

Any help and recommendation on this is very welcome. Thanks


----------



## Ggroch

almarti said:


> Has anyone paired CCA through TOSLINK to Chord Mojo? If so, which are the results?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 My Chord Mojo and CCA through toslink work together flawlessly and sound great to me.   I mostly use Spotify and to me it sounds identical to a direct Spotify link (ie, like Spotify through USB from a computer). There is no pausing, skipping through the CCA/Toslink.  I have read that CCA passes through a bit perfect copy of the 44.1K Spotify stream and have no reason to dispute this...so the CCA/Toslink.  I do not stream many Hi-Def files so I cannot comment on that. 
  
 Advantages of CCA over some other options include a a pretty wide selection of source options..(Spotify, Tidal, Pandora, BubbleUPnp, GoogleMusic) and the fact that Google has a team constantly improving the firmware for quality and functionality.   Downsides would include poor itunes/apple music integration, lack of Amazon music integration. 
  
 Certainly, with your investments so far it would make sense at least to try a CCA.   Your out $30 and a little time if you do not like it.   I can tell you the chord DAC and CCA play together great.


----------



## markbrauer

ggroch said:


> I have read that CCA passes through a bit perfect copy of the 44.1K Spotify stream and have no reason to dispute this...


 
  
 I have no reason to dispute either, but has anyone been able to check if this is really true? I do think the CCA sounds great using Toslink and, to my ear, exactly the same as my Squeezebox streamer, which is also said to be bit perfect. What makes me wonder is the fact that one can control the volume from the CCA (using the phone app). This means the CCA has the capability to preform calculations on those bits. Now, I know that at 100% volume the bits passed should be perfect and that there is no good reason to think that it's not the case. But has anyone checked? I always use the CCA at 100%, controlling the volume at the preamp. At any CCA volume setting less than 100% the bits are assuredly not perfect.


----------



## Ggroch

markbrauer said:


> I have no reason to dispute either, but has anyone been able to check if this is really true?


 
 This link is the most rigorous testing I have seen. 
  
http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html
  
 You will find a comparison in Table "A" of the measurements of a 16/44 signal direct from USB, through CCA Toslink, and through CCA Analogue (using the CCA DAC). 
  
 He also passes a DTS signal (which the CCA cannot decode) to his receiver and it works fine.
  
 This is not surprising to me.  Passing even a HiDef Digital Audio signal requires much less Wifi bandwidth than streaming HD video.
  
 What is surprising is why the majority of music listeners seem satisfied with Bluetooth which is far inferior to modern Wifi solutions (Sonos, Airport Express, CCA)  
  
 The fact that your 10 year old technology Squeezebox could do it is proof it is not that hard to do (CCA retired my Squeezeboxes).


----------



## almarti

ggroch said:


> My Chord Mojo and CCA through toslink work together flawlessly and sound great to me.   I mostly use Spotify and to me it sounds identical to a direct Spotify link (ie, like Spotify through USB from a computer). There is no pausing, skipping through the CCA/Toslink.  I have read that CCA passes through a bit perfect copy of the 44.1K Spotify stream and have no reason to dispute this...so the CCA/Toslink.  I do not stream many Hi-Def files so I cannot comment on that.
> 
> Advantages of CCA over some other options include a a pretty wide selection of source options..(Spotify, Tidal, Pandora, BubbleUPnp, GoogleMusic) and the fact that Google has a team constantly improving the firmware for quality and functionality.   Downsides would include poor itunes/apple music integration, lack of Amazon music integration.
> 
> Certainly, with your investments so far it would make sense at least to try a CCA.   Your out $30 and a little time if you do not like it.   I can tell you the chord DAC and CCA play together great.




Just I got CCA and connected to Mojo and to my stereo amp, result is impressive!!! Tested with Tidal 16/44 and 25/96 FLAC from NAS, both with Bubble UPnP in my Android phone.

Now I want same, Tidal and NAS from iOS, which applications have I to install?

Thanks in advance


----------



## almarti

Hi all again,
  
 since yesterday testing things with CCA and in the way I test more I realize how worth is this $35 gadget, really impressive. I have found the cast icon/bottom in iOS Tidal and everything works fantastic, even if Tidal app is open in Android smartphone and iPad I can see in both of them what it is being played independently of which device launched the play. So I don't need any answer on how to make Tidal work from iOS (thanks!)
  
 So, can I understand Google cast bottom forces a direct connection for Tidal web cloud/server with CCA? The only thing I couldn't get work is to play offline playlists. Do you have this issue as well?
  
 Last test has been replace Mojo with a very old Zhaolu D3 DAC (http://www.decibelhifi.com.au/zhaolu-digital-analog-converter/) 24/192 with specs of Receiver Chip Cirrus Logic CS8416 (192kHz), D/A Chip: Analog Devices CS4398 (24Bit/192kHz), Analog Op-Amp: Burr Brown OPA2604, S/N Ratio: 120dB, THD: 102dB and Dynamic Range: 117dB. The result is a little more of bass but with globally a little of more darkness across all frequencies but good enough for not focused listenings as the good ones are made with Mojo and headphones.
  
 My last question is I would like to buy a DAC (without any amp phase) to pair with stereo amp and CCA, with only 2 inputs, TOSLINK and USB, and RCA output for stereo amp. Which one do you recommend to me? Preferably under $300 but reach $500 would not be a problem.

 Thanks.


----------



## noshortcuts

almarti said:


> .....
> My last question is I would like to buy a DAC (without any amp phase) to pair with stereo amp and CCA, with only 2 inputs, TOSLINK and USB, and RCA output for stereo amp. Which one do you recommend to me? Preferably under $300 but reach $500 would not be a problem.
> 
> Thanks.


 
 There may be only one right answer: http://schiit.com/products/modi-2, and make sure to go with multi-bit option at $249 total.
 Or, if you stretch to $599: http://schiit.com/products/bifrost. That is with multi-bit also.
 There are plenty of Schiit threads if you aren't up on this fantastic USA audio company.


----------



## almarti

Thanks a lot!


----------



## almarti

noshortcuts said:


> There may be only one right answer: http://schiit.com/products/modi-2, and make sure to go with multi-bit option at $249 total.
> Or, if you stretch to $599: http://schiit.com/products/bifrost. That is with multi-bit also.
> There are plenty of Schiit threads if you aren't up on this fantastic USA audio company.


 
  
 How worth is the $300 difference betwwen Modi 2 Multibit and Bifrost Multibit?
 When to use Bifrost over Modi?
 Thanks


----------



## noshortcuts

almarti said:


> How worth is the $300 difference betwwen Modi 2 Multibit and Bifrost Multibit?
> When to use Bifrost over Modi?
> Thanks


 
 I own the Yggy and follow several Schitt threads so I know the reputation of everything they make is excellent. But I haven't absorbed the differences between Modi and Bifrost (usually called Bimby in forums). Best is to search or read Schitt threads or just post your question in a Schitt thread.
 I'd suggest asking here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/815368/happy-as-a-pig-in-schiit-introducing-modi-multibit
 I'd suggest reading up on all things Schitt, here and here:
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/784471/what-a-long-strange-trip-its-been-robert-hunter/1260
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-of-the-worlds-most-improbable-start-up/13845


----------



## Gjoel

I have been using a Bifrost and a Nuforce dac 80 with CCA. I did prefer the nuforce over the schiit. 
But the remote control was also a plus for me.


----------



## rbc3585

Me again, back with more annoying questions  Does anybody know whether the wifi of the device used to control a CCA matters? I know that having dual band capabilities is important, but if my phone doesn't support 802.11ac, will that limit the streaming capabilities of the chromecast? Unfortunately I can't test this out myself, I haven't got a chromecast yet (waiting for sales lol).

 Edit: asking because I want to buy a cheap android phone to use as a dap, and as far as I can tell the only thing missing from the Galaxy S5 Mini is 802.11ac wifi.


----------



## dmance

rbc,
CCA is fully isolated from your phone's wifi performance. Your phone just initiates a playlist of sorts to the CCA...which then autonomously retrives songs from the cloud. Also the CCA has an Ethernet adapter (from Google store) if bandwidth is a concern.


----------



## rbc3585

Thanks. Just remembered that if I want to cast audiobooks from a phone the data will have to be uploaded and then re-downloaded though, so 802.11ac might be a good idea anyway.


----------



## markbrauer

rbc3585 said:


> Thanks. Just remembered that if I want to cast audiobooks from a phone the data will have to be uploaded and then re-downloaded though, so 802.11ac might be a good idea anyway.


 
 Audio books stream at a very low bit rate (32 kbps?) so require very very little bandwidth. Any working WiFi connection should handle them easily. I purchased a $40 non-contract Sprint Motorola Moto G to use as a music controller. Never activated it. I use the native Android functionality to cast from the phone to the CCA. The smartphone runs Android 5.x and the network is 802.11g. It performs flawlessly casting music (much higher bandwidth than an audio book) files. Today, if I was buying a phone dedicated to be a "controller" I would look for a cheap Android 6 device.


----------



## rbc3585

Right, yeah fair point. I also plan to use the phone as my main portable device, and the S5 Mini uses the same Wolfson dac as the S5 (and is much more pocket-friendly). My preference would really be the Xperia Z5 Compact but apparently it has serious bluetooth issues.


----------



## SP Wild

Man, how cool is this little bugger. Someone in the HD650 thread mentioned this device as possibly a better alternative to the logitech Bluetooth stereo adapter. So I bought one. 

Ha, it even took the wifi password from my phone... Setup was a breeze. Thank goodness. Bluetooth was driving me insane. 

Google is doing some great things. But bad things to my savings. Trial google play for free my phone said. Includes adfree you tube it said. 

Why not, I thought, what harm could it possibly do? 

Several thousand dollars later... Holy crap. Damn you google!


----------



## k2doggo

I wonder if anybody could help me with this. I bought a Chromecast Audio the first week of release, and was pretty excited to control streaming wirelessly, after using a USB hookup for the longest time.
  
 I was disappointed by the sound of the analogue output, and then to my surprise didn't do a whole lot better with optical into a Maverick DAC, hearing a compressed and very lossy sound, roughly what you'd hear from the headphone jack of an average laptop going into the preamp.
  
 I just thought, well ok, it's $35, and have put up with it for the convenience. But now I see this thread, and other reviews, sounding as if my results should be VERY much better than what I'm getting.
  
 Can anybody give me a clue as to where I'm going wrong?


----------



## dmance

K2, use the Chromecast settings to enable high dynamic range. I get great sound from mine.


----------



## k2doggo

I don't doubt that you do! The high dynamic range option doesn't apply, as I understand it, to the digital output, since it's the only setting possible in that mode.


----------



## Ggroch

k2doggo,
  
 You are correct that the HDR option will not impact CCA sound using its optical output.  
  
 On the other hand, the optical out of the CCA is theoretically a bit-perfect copy of the original input it is receiving. So, it should have no real "sound" of its own at all (any more than an optical cable has a sound.*)   You are basically hearing the sound of your source.
  
 That said...the source sound quality can vary a lot.  What are you listening to?  Streaming services, or your own files, and what are the settings of the compatible software?
  
 In streaming sources, Tidal could sound better than Spotify because it can transfer a higher quality bitrate/signal.  However, I expect your Tidal settings (and subscription type) could impact that. 
  
 On your own files CCA is capable of at least CD quality sound from your own files using the right compatible software, but I do not know how it handles HD Audio files.  
  
 If you are hearing lossy and compressed, (like FM radio for example) then there is something wrong with your setpu (wifi quality at the CCA location?).  
  
 I have only heard this complaint 1 other time and it was from a Napster (formerly Rhapsody) user.  Napster does not have native CCA compatiblility but sort of works casting using CC Video casting.
  
 Note, there have been numerous updates to CCA firmware.  They happen automatically but the CCA must be on to receive them.
  
 Perhaps with more info on your sources and software we can be more help. 
  
 *Some could argue this...but they would be insane imho


----------



## tmann

k2doggo said:


> I wonder if anybody could help me with this. I bought a Chromecast Audio the first week of release, and was pretty excited to control streaming wirelessly, after using a USB hookup for the longest time.
> 
> I was disappointed by the sound of the analogue output, and then to my surprise didn't do a whole lot better with optical into a Maverick DAC, hearing a compressed and very lossy sound, roughly what you'd hear from the headphone jack of an average laptop going into the preamp.
> 
> ...


 
  
 How are you casting? If you are you doing it from within a supported app (Spotify, Pandora, Google Play, etc.) you should be getting good sound from optical out, or from analog with High Dynamic Range enabled (it comes with that turned off) since in this case the stream is coming from the internet, not your phone. 
  
 But if you are doing it from "Cast screen/audio" in the Home cell phone app, then the quality will not be as good, since mirroring your phone takes a lot more processing.
  
 I asked this in a Google help forum.


----------



## atarione

does anyone know why Spotify won't add casting to the windows client?? super irritating...


----------



## MothAudio

sp wild said:


> *Man, how cool is this little bugger. *Someone in the HD650 thread mentioned this device as possibly a better alternative to the logitech Bluetooth stereo adapter. So I bought one.
> 
> Ha, it even took the wifi password from my phone... Setup was a breeze. Thank goodness. Bluetooth was driving me insane.
> 
> ...


 
  
*Six month update*: In my case it was only $800, after picking up a couple of CCA pucks.
 
Since the acquisition of the Chromecast Audio I've made a number of system upgrades; Schitt Modi Multibit DAC, PS Audio Ultimate Outlet, JJ 2A3 power tubes, Sys. Concepts digital cable and iFi S/PDIF iPurifier reclocker/jitter filter. Couldn't be more pleased with the performance and bang for buck value the Schiit Modi Multibit provides IMS.

 The iFi was only received yesterday. Until it stabilizes the full benefit won't be realized but straight out of the box I was making unexpected discoveries from familiar source [pleasant discoveries].* For my 9k system it was easy to appreciate where the extra $800 [total cost of all 5 upgrades] went.* At this very early stage I'm unable to measure the value of the iFi but thus far IMS it's not a component I would suggest is critical to the performance of the Multibit.

 The iFi reduces the noise floor even further, something that wasn't lacking in my system previously. While sibilance wasn't minimized to the level I was hoping it was reduced. Overall there was a greater cohesiveness to the presentation that made you rely less on the suspension of disbelief to lose yourself into the music. The supplied PS is plugged into the Hydra PLC.
 
Speaking of line conditioners, the Multibit PS is plugged into the PS Audio PLC which in turn is daisy-chained into the Shunyata Hydra PLC. The only other component in the chain [tube amp] is plugged straight into the Michael Brinkman Acme Audio 15amp silver-plated 'Cryo-treated' duplex [along with the Hydra].







 Here's a photo of the iFi S/PDIF iPurifier [Bifrost DAC]. The Multibit is configured in a similar way; coaxial in / toslink out.


----------



## k2doggo

ah, seems the device wasn't receiving updates properly, and now that it's reinstalled it sounds startlingly better!  thanks all for your help.


----------



## SP Wild

mothaudio said:


> *Six month update*: In my case it was only $800, after picking up a couple of CCA pucks.
> 
> Since the acquisition of the Chromecast Audio I've made a number of system upgrades; Schitt Modi Multibit DAC, PS Audio Ultimate Outlet, JJ 2A3 power tubes, Sys. Concepts digital cable and iFi S/PDIF iPurifier reclocker/jitter filter. Couldn't be more pleased with the performance and bang for buck value the Schiit Modi Multibit provides IMS.
> 
> ...




So you think the modi multibit, is OK? My dilemma is Bifrost multibit or modi multibit. Seriously considering a major sell off to fund a yggdrasil, just go the whole hog and be done with it.

I had an awesome sound coming off the CCA optical into AGD reclocker into an AGD Reference 7 PCM1704UK dac. 

Why does anyone still bother with DS dacs?


----------



## MothAudio

Anyone try the ethernet adapter? Compare / contrast vs wi-fi.


----------



## markbrauer

There's an Ethernet adapter?


----------



## dmance

$19
  
 https://store.google.com/product/ethernet_adapter_for_chromecast


----------



## MothAudio




----------



## noshortcuts

dmance said:


> $19
> 
> https://store.google.com/product/ethernet_adapter_for_chromecast



That's a simple/elegant solution for anybody with connection issues but I doubt it sounds better otherwise. Maybe.


----------



## markbrauer

dmance said:


> $19
> 
> https://store.google.com/product/ethernet_adapter_for_chromecast


 
 Followed the link and it appears that this adapter only works with the video Chromcast models.
 This copied from the link
  
Requirements 
Chromecast or Chromecast, 1st Generation




  
  
  
  
   
Google usually is quite specific when noting compatibility.

  
 On the other hand, I see no reason it should not work with Chromecast Audio.


----------



## dmance

Mark,
I have three Chromecast Audio and three Ethernet adapters. Works 100% and I think improves sync and latency when grouped. Google messed up (unusual) documenting support here...
Dan


----------



## hopkins

I use the ethernet adapter and it works well. No changes in SQ noted.


----------



## rbc3585

Anyone else have issues when streaming stuff from a phone's internal storage? Play/pause functions from my sony music app work spottily at best and sometimes disrupt the chromecast, and often when I unlock the phone after a while it says "connecting" forever and I have to restart casting for it to sync back up properly. Not sure whether it's because my phone doesn't have 802.11ac.


----------



## SP Wild

Weird huh. It doesn't stream what's on your phone. 

It's not perfect... Sometimes it disconnects itself. Play another track and it plays on the phone while chromecast continues playing the track you wanted to skip. 


Yeah technology.


----------



## tmann

I tried Pandora with the CCA the other day and wondered why it didn't sound that great, and learned that from a phone the max quality is 64kbps, even with the paid version. However, on a computer the paid version is 190kbps. 
  
 I found this as a workaround: http://www.howtogeek.com/185314/ask-htg-can-i-improve-the-quality-of-pandoras-music-streaming/
  
 Has anyone tried this? Experience with Dolphin vs. Puffer or other browsers on the phone to get Flash on Android and to mimic desktop to get the 190 quality?


----------



## tmann

ggroch said:


> A chromecast competitor, the *Echo Dot* is out and mine arrived yesterday.  $50 (or $40 if you buy through your existing Echo).   No optical output - Aux out only.
> 
> Compatible with Spotify, Amazon Music (reg and unlimited) and Pandora. Not compatible with Google Music, Tidal,
> 
> ...


 
  
 Can you (or anyone) comment on the Spotify sound quality between the Dot and the Chromecast Audio when hooked up to a stereo system? (I know that the Dot is analog only and I don't have an external DAC anyway so I am interested in the sound of each of them connected directly to a stereo input.)
  
 I know the Spotify Connect stream is supposed to be 320kbps but the CCA comes with dynamic range limited which you can change to High Dynamic Range in the app settings. Wondering if the Dot is handicapped as well and you can't change it, and also the internal DAC would affect the sound as well. 
  
 Also, does the Dot hear you speak commands when you are playing music from it through the stereo? Thinking that if it is near the speakers, this could be a problem. 
  
 Had my CCA at my parents' place over the holiday and got them a Dot, kicking myself for not comparing them side to side on their stereo.


----------



## tmann

tmann said:


> Can you (or anyone) comment on the Spotify sound quality between the Dot and the Chromecast Audio when hooked up to a stereo system? (I know that the Dot is analog only and I don't have an external DAC anyway so I am interested in the sound of each of them connected directly to a stereo input.)
> 
> I know the Spotify Connect stream is supposed to be 320kbps but the CCA comes with dynamic range limited which you can change to High Dynamic Range in the app settings. Wondering if the Dot is handicapped as well and you can't change it, and also the internal DAC would affect the sound as well.
> 
> ...


 
 Bump. Has anyone compared the Dot and CCA for sound quality into a stereo system? 
  
 Edit, found one guy on AVS who compared them and finds the CCA much better. (Would still be interested in another opinion.)
  
 http://www.avsforum.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=48494913
  
 "I fell in love with the original Amazon Echo in my kitchen. I use it for timers and streaming with Spotify or podcasts. The voice interface is perfect for Spotify. When the new Dot came out I bought a few for the house and put one on my bedroom audio system. 
  
 Sad realization time. The audio output from it is crap as far as I can tell. It doesn't have a toslink output so I have it hooked up with a 3.5mm to RCA wire. After a short while of "What is wrong with this" I switched in a Chromecast audio. It's a night and day difference (once full dynamic range output was enabled). The Dot sounds like the Chromecast did before enabling full dynamic range.
  
 Maybe I'm missing something but the sole purpose of the Dot version of the Echo is to connect to external audio systems, and it sounds terrible! It's a shame, because the Echo is by far my preferred interface for streaming but it is unusable. Anyone else try this and come to any conclusions? I didn't see any Echo threads here, only Chromecast. Now I know why!"


----------



## SP Wild

Connected the HD800S straight to the line out of the CCA....In other words straight to the dac not designed for driving headphones with a highish output z.

It sounded really good. A fairly neutral, not too lean sounding dac. Not as thick as other dacs either. I think the HD800S really take well to high z output!


----------



## yay101

Do we know what DAC the dot uses? All i can find is a unknown Texas Instruments chip.

The CCA has a AK4430 which is known as a great chip solution.

At least on paper the CCA is way better at audio, it has a decent DAC after all.


----------



## tmann

yay101 said:


> Do we know what DAC the dot uses? All i can find is a unknown Texas Instruments chip.
> 
> The CCA has a AK4430 which is known as a great chip solution.
> 
> At least on paper the CCA is way better at audio, it has a decent DAC after all.


 
  
This teardown has it listed as 32031 TI 68k CQ61, for whatever that's worth. 
  
 http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/news/teardown-tuesday-amazon-echo-dot-v2/


----------



## Peddler

REVIEW
Preamble

Whilst I have been an audio enthusiast for many years now, I must admit I have never really been all that interested in using any kind of esoteric cables with my systems. I have always felt that as long as the cable has a good solid connection and is undamaged - then that will do. In fact, to be completely honest, in the past when I have tried slightly more expensive than normal cable, I can’t say I really truly noticed any difference. You could say that I’m a kind of ‘high-end cable sceptic’.

One thing I do believe is that my portable MP3 players are capable of very high quality playback - assuming the file being played is of sufficient quality. I have been into high quality audio since the early 80’s and have progressed from a nasty ‘music centre’ to a really nice analogue turntable-based system - Logik DM-101, Linn Basik LVX, Nagioka MP-11 Boron, NAD 3020 and Heybrook HB1’s - those were the days. The system sounded great because I took care to set it up as best I could with a proper turntable shelf with ceramic discs underneath the shelf resting on inverted spikes (cost 75 quid if memory serves), decent shelving for the electronics and proper loudspeaker stands with the spikes. My point being that back in the day you really had to work at achieving (and maintaining) that good sound. Not to mention that the turntable was completely manual in operation and you had to get off your lazy arse every 25 minutes or so to flip sides or change the record.

Now, all you have to do is press a couple of buttons and you get high quality sound - in fact very high quality sound, with none of the fuss and bother. What’s more, you can easily get access to all of your media and have pretty much unlimited and inexpensive storage for about the same price as my turntable and loudspeaker stands had cost me back in the 80’s - and that’s not adjusting for inflation.

I have to admit that these days I tend to do most of my music listening through headphones - specifically the following:

Ultimate Ears Triple Fi-10 iem
1More 1001 Triple Driver iem
1More iBFree Bluetooth iem
V-Moda Crossfade Bluetooth Wireless
1More MK-802 Bluetooth Wireless
Audio Technica ATH M50X Full Sized Wired

The reason why I have mentioned my old analogue system and my currently used headphones is really to show that I know what good sound sounds like. I completely understand that people have different tastes and that different genres favour different sound shapes. This is perhaps why I use so many different headphones - each have their own character and, with the exception of the bitchingly bass-driven V-Moda’s, all sound fairly flat and reasonably neutral.

My current (and probably for the foreseeable future) loudspeaker based system is a Sony Micro system connected to the excellent Google Chromecast Audio and an old pair of Mission loudspeakers. As I do most of my listening now through portable players and headphones I feel that this is sufficient for my needs when I need to ‘rock out’ and annoy the neighbours. To be honest, the speakers are not ideally placed and the system tends to lack power (although more on this later). In its defence however, I feel the overall sound characteristic is reasonably neutral and flat.



Please excuse the poor quality pic - not really enough light this time of year. Will take more when I can.


The Burson Audio Cable is much more than just a good quality length of cable. It’s designed to increase the output from portable players to that normally found on full-sized components. This, they claim, improves resolution, clarity, bass - well pretty much everything audio. Well…...it works. It definitely works.

The cable features an active section which ‘amplifies’ the signal up - there’s no controls on the active box - just a Micro USB socket for power. The cable is reasonably unobtrusive and has enough length to effectively be hidden away. Everything about the cake screams high quality from the material used for the outer sleeve to the high quality plugs.

The improvements made to the music isn't subtle - it’s like the system has been completely upgraded. Bigger speakers, more powerful amplifier and improved signal source. There isn't just one aspect of the sound that's been changed either. Bass is deeper and more controlled, mids and vocals are clearer and the top end shimmers with detail without becoming too bright. This cable offers my loudspeaker based system the chance to produce the same resolution and detail that I normally get with my high quality headphones. Although the cable is designed to offer more volume to the sound, the truth is that even at low volume levels the improvements are still apparent.

Listening to familiar music is a revelation - I know of the phrase ‘hearing things I've never heard before’ is a bit of a cliche but it's totally true with this cable. Additional depth in the sound field, solidity in positions of performers and instruments (this is usually the first thing I look for when evaluating audio equipment) and micro details come through with ease. It's almost like I have found new high quality recordings of my favorite albums.

When I was originally asked if I would be interested in reviewing Burson cable I was not overly enthusiastic about it because I've never really been interested in cables and the like because they're kinda boring and not sexy, however I'm so glad they sent it to me. This has to represent one of the most effective single solution upgrades I have ever come across in a the years I have been interested in audio. It works extremely well with the Chromecase Audio and the combination beats much of the competition which actually costs considerably more. Very highly recommended indeed.


----------



## Ggroch

RE- Burson Cable+ review
  
 Its great that the Cable+ you got free improved your CCA sound so much.  I had not heard of the Cable+ so I learned a lot. Thanks for posting.
  
  
  
 I do not think it is a good choice to improve CCA sound for those of us who have to pay for it.   The analog output of the CCA (which would connect to the Cable+) is highly compromised compared to the optical out which is near bit perfect.   Instead of spending $150 on a cable, spending $99-150 on a carefully chosen DAC + Optical cable would create a much more accurate source for your amp than a device that is designed to "fix" a bad source. 
  
 Does this mean the dac output will sound better to you?  No, I am sure you know what you like.  But it WOULD produce a more *accurate * signal.  More like the original recording.
  
 I admit I am very skeptical of the Cable+.  I am skeptical of their explanation of how it works...not skeptical that it sounds "better" or different".  A boost in volume matched with tonal changes can often sound better.   How about this_* Boomcloud 360 enhancer *_on sale at Amazon for just $58 dollars.  
  
  
 Regardless of my skepticism, unless you get it free, there is no way a device claimed by its manufacturer to overcome problems with lousy sources will be more accurate to the original sound that switching to a more accurate source (the CCA Optical Out).


----------



## markbrauer

I just posted a review of the Burdon Audio Cable+ used with the Chromecast Audio. Does the Cable+ turn the CCA into a hi-end source? Read it here
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/burson-audio-cable/reviews/17844
 Spoiler - I liked it a lot!


----------



## tmann

Does anyone know what bitrate the paid Pandora stream is on CCA? 

From the web: "Pandora on the Web plays 64k AAC+ for free listeners and *192kbps* for Pandora One subscribers. All in-home devices play *128kbps* audio, and mobile devices receive a variety of different rates depending on the capability of the device and the network they are on, but never more than 64k AAC+."

Is it 128 or 192 ??


----------



## snoroqc

ggroch said:


> RE- Burson Cable+ review
> 
> Its great that the Cable+ you got free improved your CCA sound so much.  I had not heard of the Cable+ so I learned a lot. Thanks for posting.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Allo group, Thank for the add. I read almost the whole thread. 
  
 My source
 - MP3 320kbps (can rip my cds in flac if it help).
 - on a portable hard drive (can have a computer with Bubbleupnp DLNA server if it help). 
 - connect VIA USB2.0 to a router (tp-link AC1750) with built in DLNA server 
 - ....CCA ? 
 - ..  DAC ?
 - ... amplifier (To be determined)
 - Magnepan MMG speaker (brand new, receive it today WAAAAAA)
  
  I now control and access the MP3s with Bubbleupnp via android phone (nexus 5x) with Chromecast audio in another system . 
  
 What do I need to keep the highest quality sound the the speakers ??! 
 1- CCA -- DAC -- AMPLIFIER - MAGNEPAN
 2- CCA - AMPLIFIER -MAGNEPAN 
 3- (??)
  
 I'M LOST. 
  
 Thank you


----------



## EElegances

snoroqc said:


> Allo group, Thank for the add. I read almost the whole thread.
> 
> My source
> - MP3 320kbps (can rip my cds in flac if it help).
> ...


 
 Use a quality toslink cable and Option #1 and you are golden.


----------



## jcn3

snoroqc said:


> Allo group, Thank for the add. I read almost the whole thread.
> 
> My source
> - MP3 320kbps (can rip my cds in flac if it help).
> ...


 
  
 definitely re-rip your cds in flac at full 16/44.1 with no compression.  maggie's are revealing so they deserve your material to be as good as possible.


----------



## snoroqc

jcn3 said:


> definitely re-rip your cds in flac at full 16/44.1 with no compression.  maggie's are revealing so they deserve your material to be as good as possible.


 
  
 Thank I'll. Is it worth it to use another DLNA server (bubbleupnp server) instead of the router AC1750 dlna server built in ? 
 What dac around 200 $ I don't need amplification/portability. Only need optialcal in . RCA out.


----------



## jcn3

snoroqc said:


> Thank I'll. Is it worth it to use another DLNA server (bubbleupnp server) instead of the router AC1750 dlna server built in ?
> What dac around 200 $ I don't need amplification/portability. Only need optialcal in . RCA out.


 
 I think you would be much better served using Minimserver (dlna server) and bubbleupnp server. What's in your router in typically not that robust.
  
 For a dac, get in Schiit Modi Multibit. It's $250 and much loved. Check out the thread here.


----------



## joeike

I'm using option #2 with Elac UF5 tower's & Yamaha RX-V 481 & bubble upnp app.Hi res FLAC / wave sound great!


----------



## snoroqc

snoroqc said:


> Thank I'll. Is it worth it to use another DLNA server (bubbleupnp server) instead of the router AC1750 dlna server built in ?
> What dac around 200 $ I don't need amplification/portability. Only need optialcal in . RCA out.


 
  
 If a got
  
 DLNA server - AC1750 router - Chromecast Audio digital to -- DAC RCA to -- Amplifier - 
  
 What device control the volume ? I would like to control the volume with CCA is that possible ?  The amplifier volume must be at a fixed level (low, middle , high )? Any recommandations ?


----------



## Ggroch

Yes, You can control the volume in your described setup with the Google "Home" app (which is what they call the chromecast app now).  You can also control the volume with your BubbleDNLA app from your phone (or most other DNLA apps I expect). Should sound great.


----------



## snoroqc

ggroch said:


> Yes, You can control the volume in your described setup with the Google "Home" app (which is what they call the chromecast app now).  You can also control the volume with your BubbleDNLA app from your phone (or most other DNLA apps I expect). Should sound great.


 
 The amplifier volume should be at (relatively) fixed volume. What are you recommending ? For best sound (*all* other *things being equal)*
 1- Highest possible ?
 2- Lowest possible ?
 3- Dont do any difference?


----------



## markbrauer

snoroqc said:


> What device control the volume ? I would like to control the volume with CCA is that possible ?


 
 I find the CCA digital volume works quite well, with no discernible degradation of sound quality even at low volume settings.
  
  


ggroch said:


> You can also control the volume with your BubbleDNLA app from your phone.


 
 The BubbleUpNp app for Android controls the volume of the CCA with 50 steps rather than the usual 20 steps or so of other smartphone music players. Eliminates the too-loud / too-quiet problem when setting volume.


----------



## SP Wild

Digital is supposed to be easy... But DLNA... Bubblepop this.. Usb convertor that, mqa, bit perfect... 

I am thinking about buying a record player... Can't be anymore confusing right?


----------



## buchignani

Sprinkled through the postings here are some concerns about the quality of the power supplied to the CCA. I thought that I would try the option of improving the output of a typical charger supply by filtering and adding a reserve bank of capacitors. I started with a short USB extension cable that already had a ferrite bead on it. I then opened up the cable midway and added 10,000 mF of audio grade storage capacity and a set of progressively smaller bypass caps. The lower value bypass were film caps. 

The neat thing with this option is that I can shift it around to wherever I need it. 

To be honest I did not think that this device would improve the quality of the audio output of the CCA but I am pretty sure that it does. I will try switching it in and out over the next few days and report back.


----------



## SP Wild

Usb power supplies... 

Here us a strange one. I bought a powerboard that incorporates 2 x 2 amp usb charging ports. 

My phone touchsreen goes bonkers when connected to those ports. 

Then the battery life turned schiit... Out of nowhere... Having consistent battery performance for years. 

Realising these two strange occurrence happened at the time I bought the power board... I figured the usb ports are killing my phone. 

The battery life was restored finally... After I let the phone run down in power and switched off. I used the supplied charger to charge from complete empty. Battery was back to normal. 

Must be a very bad charger to shorten battery life and mess with the touchsreen. I still don't understand it.


----------



## yay101

sp wild said:


> Usb power supplies...
> 
> Here us a strange one. I bought a powerboard that incorporates 2 x 2 amp usb charging ports.
> 
> ...




That's pretty standard for putting phones that came before fast charging on fast charging ports. Older phones don't usually support more than 1 amp from a charger without overheating/ not charging/ causing issues like touchscreens playing up while plugged in.

A lot of people in the android community learnt about this way back when the one plus one came out.


----------



## SP Wild

yay101 said:


> That's pretty standard for putting phones that came before fast charging on fast charging ports. Older phones don't usually support more than 1 amp from a charger without overheating/ not charging/ causing issues like touchscreens playing up while plugged in.
> 
> A lot of people in the android community learnt about this way back when the one plus one came out.




Interesting. My Nexus 5 phone supports two amp charging... But the usb ports are actually 2.4 amps. 

I suspected that it was poor voltage regulation with ripples and peaks in the output and the phone only reading the peak voltage with no clue of RMS voltage and assumed phone was charged with false voltage reading. The higher voltage might mess with the phone circuitry. But I can't see how a well regulated voltage output could cause any problems no matter how high the amperage.


----------



## sonci

ggroch said:


> Yes, You can control the volume in your described setup with the Google "Home" app (which is what they call the chromecast app now).  You can also control the volume with your BubbleDNLA app from your phone (or most other DNLA apps I expect). Should sound great.




I don't want to ruin the party, but shouldn't the volume on the source be 100%? If you want every bit of music to go to the amplifier, you should only use amplifier volume, maybe you wont hear any difference either, but in theory this is the audiophile way..


----------



## markbrauer

sonci said:


> I don't want to ruin the party, but shouldn't the volume on the source be 100%? If you want every bit of music to go to the amplifier, you should only use amplifier volume, maybe you wont hear any difference either, but in theory this is the audiophile way..


 
 sonci,
  
Technically speaking, you are correct. Any data that has been modified (in this case the volume info) is not "bit perfect". And we audiophiles do demand bit perfect.
 
Practically speaking (hearing?), the Chromecast Audio does volume control really well. I have been using mine for over a year and have yet to hear any distortion of the music, using either the optical output or analog output. To my ears, whatever math the CCA performs on those volume bits does no more harm than a quality analog volume control. 
 
This is especially noticeable when using the CCA directly into headphones (it performs as a decent headphone amp). With my various headphones, the volume control needs to be set anywhere between 20% and 60%, never any higher. The resulting sound quality is the same as the CCA set at 100% optically feeding my Burson DAC/amp using it's analog volume control.
 
It used to be that all digital volume controls adversely affected the timbre and the dynamics of the music, and don't doubt that some still do. But lately, numerous hi-end devices are implementing digital (and therefore not bit perfect) volume. Even Burson, always noted for their excellent analog controls, have digital volume control on their latest DCA/amps/preamps. It is amazing that the CCA, at $35, is able to implement quality digital control.
 
That said, when using the optical output I do tend to set the CCA volume at 100% and use my amp's analog knob. But that's mostly because the knob is more convenient, and it allows for finer control. Most control apps for the CCA only implement a 20 step volume control - that's not enough to get it just right. BubbleUPnP somehow implements 50 steps, which is almost enough.
 
Ultimately, the proof is in the listening. Give it a try. After all, isn't that what being an "audiophile" is all about.


----------



## SP Wild

That is good to hear. I did notice notice too much difference, although I didn't Carry out any critical listening. 

It is really handy because a remote volume is the handiest thing and a lot of headamps with pre outs don't have a remote control for volume.

Currently using schiit Valhalla2 as a preamp to studio monitors with the chromecast in the path going optical into mojo dac. I then can use the phone to control volume. Excellent sound enjoyment.


----------



## Hikoki

Hi everyone. I'd like to ask those who have been using CA with an external DAC about the increase in sound quality. I know there are many different Dacs, hence different results in SQ. Yet I'd be interested to know generally if there is any point in getting a DAC. I personally plan on picking up the Schiit Modi 2 uber. I'm also asking since some time ago I accidentally came across a website which wasn't very positive about the optical out implementation in CA. 
Looking forward to hearing from you, 
Ivan


----------



## almarti

Hikoki said:


> Hi everyone. I'd like to ask those who have been using CA with an external DAC about the increase in sound quality. I know there are many different Dacs, hence different results in SQ. Yet I'd be interested to know generally if there is any point in getting a DAC. I personally plan on picking up the Schiit Modi 2 uber. I'm also asking since some time ago I accidentally came across a website which wasn't very positive about the optical out implementation in CA.
> Looking forward to hearing from you,
> Ivan



Hi @Hikoki, I am using CCA for more than 6 months with excellent results. I always use it with external DAC, mostly Schiit Modi Multibit (Mimby) that I strongly recommend you to purchase instead of Modi 2 Uber, and with Chord Mojo, through an optical connection to both of them.
CCA supplies analog 3.5mm output and optical connection in the same hole; analog output (using CCA internal DAC) is below average and this may be the no good comments you can find, but the optical one is bit perfect so I support your decision of using with external DAC, SQ is impressive. I power the CCA from a power bank to reduce the RFI issues.


----------



## markbrauer

Hikoki said:


> Hi everyone. I'd like to ask those who have been using CA with an external DAC about the increase in sound quality. I know there are many different Dacs, hence different results in SQ. Yet I'd be interested to know generally if there is any point in getting a DAC. I personally plan on picking up the Schiit Modi 2 uber. I'm also asking since some time ago I accidentally came across a website which wasn't very positive about the optical out implementation in CA.
> Looking forward to hearing from you,
> Ivan


I have been using the CCA optical output for well over a year now and find it sounds excellent, and way better than the analog output. But I believe that in my situation, the difference in sound quality is caused by an impedance mismatch with the line-level input of my amp, and not the quality of the CCA's internal DAC. The frequency response ot the analog signal is not balanced and dynamics are screwed up - making the music sound just plain "wrong" - classic symptoms of impedance mismatch.
Archimago's Blog has good articles on both analog and digital output of the CCA, with measurements. Of the the CCA's analog output Archimago concludes "_I would certainly have no qualms about using the analogue output from this remarkably economical device to feed a good stereo system_". Of the optical output, he finds that it has somewhat more measured jitter than other Toslink devices he has tested but still concludes "_I don't believe anyone is really going to notice the jitter in day-to-day use_". In my own experience, comparing the CCA optical output directly to that of my Squeexebox Touch (which measures very good) , I cannot hear a difference.
Overall, I suspect that if you are lucky enough to have a good electrical match from your CCA to your amp you might hear very little or no difference. If, like me, there are impedance matching problems, an external DAC will be a big improvement.
http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio.html
http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio_27.html


----------



## EElegances

I use CA as a temporary solution. It's crazy how well it works and sounds, especially at the price.
I've upgraded it two ways to make sure it's doing it's best into my Schiit Yggy.
1. Lifatec Glass Toslink cable. 
2. iFi SPIDF iPurifier
 The costs are big compared to CA but small enough overall that I just accepted my initial impressions as being good and didn't get caught up in comparing so I just set and forget so I can listen to music.


----------



## Hikoki (May 29, 2017)

Hi and thanks a lot for your very quick and useful comments and suggestions. I basically mostly use CCA to feed my DT 800 600ohm through  ifi iCan headamp. I guess I might appreciate the addition of an external DAC despite these 57 old ears. I have used the coax digital output on my Fiio X5 to feed the headamp, and compared with the analogue out on CCA using the same music the difference was there, but rather very subtle.
BTW, Almarti, you say you are using  CCA with  Bimby or Chord Mojo. Do you find a difference in SQ between these 2 Dacs when fed from CCA ?
Cheers


----------



## almarti

Hikoki said:


> Hi and thanks a lot for your very quick and useful comments and suggestions. I basically mostly use CCA to feed my DT 800 600ohm through  ifi iCan headamp. I guess I might appreciate the addition of an external DAC despite these 57 old ears. I have used the coax digital output on my Fiio X5 to feed the headamp, and compared with the analogue out on CCA using the same music the difference was there, but rather very subtle.
> BTW, Almarti, you say you are using  CCA with  Bimby or Chord Mojo. Do you find a difference in SQ between these 2 Dacs when fed from CCA ?
> Cheers



Absolutely, internal CCA DAC chip is far away of Schiit Multibit and a little more far away of Mojo FPGA. Additionally, Mojo provides a lot of power to drive big cans. Yours of 600 need a lot of power, even a dedicated wall powered DAC/Amp
I would be using CCA Analog output only with sensitivity IEMs.


----------



## Hikoki

Thanks a lot, almarti. Happy listening in whatever scenario you'll be using with CCA. Cheers. ☺️


----------



## MBit

Hi, it seems to me that this is the biggest CCA thread on Head-Fi so maybe someone can help me out even if my question is not on sound quality:
My smartphone (Huawei P9 lite) doesn't support OTG and its DAC is not worth its name. At home, or anywhere with a wireless network, I can easily connect to my CCA and have good quality music. But on the go, with no network around, that connection is not possible - or is it? Might there be a way to set up a closed network using my phone as router for it to connect to the CCA? Has anybody tried that?
Thanks for any thoughts!


----------



## rkw (Nov 10, 2017)

MBit said:


> My smartphone (Huawei P9 lite) doesn't support OTG and its DAC is not worth its name. At home, or anywhere with a wireless network, I can easily connect to my CCA and have good quality music. But on the go, with no network around, that connection is not possible - or is it? Might there be a way to set up a closed network using my phone as router for it to connect to the CCA?


I can't think of any way to use the CCA as you want. However, it seems possible to enable OTG on a Huawei P9 Lite (and use an external DAC) if you are willing to root the phone: https://androidtutorial.net/2017/03/02/enable-otg-support-huawei-p9-lite/ (additional articles on this topic if you Google).


----------



## MBit

rkw said:


> I can't think of any way to use the CCA as you want. However, it seems possible to enable OTG on a Huawei P9 Lite (and use an external DAC) if you are willing to root the phone: https://androidtutorial.net/2017/03/02/enable-otg-support-huawei-p9-lite/ (additional articles on this topic if you Google).


Thanks rkw!
I actually thought about rooting before but I remember reading somewhere, that the Netflix and/or Spotify apps might check on that before playback. Some licencing or security issue? Anyway, I need them to work properly, so no messing around


----------



## kellte2

Just learned of the ifi ipurifier for SPDIF. MY WALLET!!! 

How much of a difference in SQ are we talking?


----------



## rkw

kellte2 said:


> Just learned of the ifi ipurifier for SPDIF. MY WALLET!!!
> 
> How much of a difference in SQ are we talking?


My biggest complaint about Chromecast Audio is that it doesn't support gapless playback. I haven't gotten an iPurifier because I've read that it makes gapless playback even worse. However, otherwise reviews have been positive. I'd be more willing to try the iPurifier if it wasn't 4x the cost of a CCA itself (really more of a testament to the incredible value of CCA), but I'm actually pretty happy with the sound quality from the CCA Toslink.


----------



## almarti

MBit said:


> Hi, it seems to me that this is the biggest CCA thread on Head-Fi so maybe someone can help me out even if my question is not on sound quality:
> My smartphone (Huawei P9 lite) doesn't support OTG and its DAC is not worth its name. At home, or anywhere with a wireless network, I can easily connect to my CCA and have good quality music. But on the go, with no network around, that connection is not possible - or is it? Might there be a way to set up a closed network using my phone as router for it to connect to the CCA? Has anybody tried that?
> Thanks for any thoughts!



Have you tried to enable your smartphone as wifi hotspot with your same home wifi SSID and password? This should cheat CCA to think it's at home and can transmit.

I use this trick for my wifi-only devices on the GO to use my cellular data plan on a transparent way for those devices. Not yet tested with CCA but it should work.


----------



## almarti

Just replying to myself to confirm the configuration I previously explained it works perfectly with Tidal for both online and Offline tracks. Under streaming (online) data cellular plan is spent but not in offline (only the wifi link between the smartphone and CCA).

This setup avoids the default Android audio driver to be used and not upsampling is got.

Nice setup.


----------



## rkw (Nov 12, 2017)

almarti said:


> Have you tried to enable your smartphone as wifi hotspot with your same home wifi SSID and password? This should cheat CCA to think it's at home and can transmit.
> 
> I use this trick for my wifi-only devices on the GO to use my cellular data plan on a transparent way for those devices. Not yet tested with CCA but it should work.


I just tried it, and it works brilliantly!

If you don't want to change your SSID's, it would be worth getting a second CCA for travel (they're cheap). Then configure your travel CCA to use your phone's hotspot SSID. To configure the travel CCA, you'll need do it from another Android phone/tablet while it's connected to the phone's hotspot, but you only need to configure it once and you'll be all set.


----------



## almarti

rkw said:


> I just tried it, and it works brilliantly!
> 
> If you don't want to change your SSID's, it would be worth getting a second CCA for travel (they're cheap). Then configure your travel CCA to use your phone's hotspot SSID. To configure the travel CCA, you'll need do it from another Android phone/tablet while it's connected to the phone's hotspot, but you only need to configure it once and you'll be all set.



Yes, another alternative.
By the way, I always power the CCA through external power bank and ferrita rings in the USB cable. This helps to avoid RFI and ensure better CCA behavior if possible.


----------



## Ggroch

I see the newest version of the home app/firmware has added bass and treble tone controls (in an "Equalizer" setting) to Chromecast audio.  It works both with analog and digital optical output.   Of course, if you use them on the optical you are no longer bit perfect...but since they are totally digital there is no reason they should impact accuracy when zeroed out.

Can be a major benefit in real world use I think.   Lets you compensate for less than perfect rooms, hearing, speakers, headphones.   I have not experimented with it much yet, but my aged ears appreciate a slight treble boost on a lot of headphones...but my audiophile type amps do not have that option.


----------



## MBit

almarti said:


> Have you tried to enable your smartphone as wifi hotspot with your same home wifi SSID and password? This should cheat CCA to think it's at home and can transmit.
> 
> I use this trick for my wifi-only devices on the GO to use my cellular data plan on a transparent way for those devices. Not yet tested with CCA but it should work.



Sorry for my late reply and thanks a lot for the idea! This sounds like a plan and I will try it out soon. It's good to be here


----------



## MBit

almarti said:


> Yes, another alternative.
> By the way, I always power the CCA through external power bank and ferrita rings in the USB cable. This helps to avoid RFI and ensure better CCA behavior if possible.



Which output of the CCA do you use? Optical or analog? I started using a power bank for that purpose as well and using the otical output, would those ferrita rings help anway?


----------



## MBit

Ggroch said:


> I see the newest version of the home app/firmware has added bass and treble tone controls (in an "Equalizer" setting) to Chromecast audio.  It works both with analog and digital optical output.   Of course, if you use them on the optical you are no longer bit perfect...but since they are totally digital there is no reason they should impact accuracy when zeroed out.
> 
> Can be a major benefit in real world use I think.   Lets you compensate for less than perfect rooms, hearing, speakers, headphones.   I have not experimented with it much yet, but my aged ears appreciate a slight treble boost on a lot of headphones...but my audiophile type amps do not have that option.



Thanks for the info, that is great news! I just tried pulling the bass all the way up to 6db but the sound only gets distorted on my setup... Treble sounds better so far.


----------



## Ggroch

The tone controls did not work well on my setup either.  Bass boost is mid bass, not deep.  I am hoping the controls will improve on future firmware updates.  A parametric equalizer would be nice


----------



## almarti

MBit said:


> Which output of the CCA do you use? Optical or analog? I started using a power bank for that purpose as well and using the otical output, would those ferrita rings help anway?


Same configuration as yours.
Ferrita rings reduce on the USB cable potential RFI. They are minimal when using power bank as there is not AC/DC conversion but it could rise if you use a wall USB charger.


----------



## Baroninkjet (Nov 30, 2017)

Does anyone have any experience with CCA in a car? I'm getting a Pixel 2 w/o headphone jack, and was thinking it might be a better approach that BT, dongles, etc. For example, Phone hotspot connection to CCA, then either plug CCA into car jack or maybe add dragonfly, etc. Mostly streaming Spotify and Tidal. I've seen some old posts about how it can be done, but not much feedback from how well it works.

I'm a little leary, as it kind of reminds me of old iphone streaming, where content comes to phone, then gets sent out to receiver, etc. and burns your finger if you touch it. So just curious if anyone has done this and how practical it is.

Thanks!


----------



## rkw

Baroninkjet said:


> Does anyone have any experience with CCA in a car? I'm getting a Pixel 2 w/o headphone jack, and was thinking it might be a better approach that BT, dongles, etc. For example, Phone hotspot connection to CCA, then either plug CCA into car jack or maybe add dragonfly, etc. Mostly streaming Spotify and Tidal. I've seen some old posts about how it can be done, but not much feedback from how well it works.
> 
> I'm a little leary, as it kind of reminds me of old iphone streaming, where content comes to phone, then gets sent out to receiver, etc. and burns your finger if you touch it. So just curious if anyone has done this and how practical it is.


Configure the CCA to use your phone's hotspot — see above (from post #316 onwards). In the car, connect the CCA to power and to the car's aux input, and turn on your phone's hotspot. Your phone should see the CCA and you should be able to use it just like a CCA at home. Quite frankly though, I see no advantage to using CCA in a car and I'd just use Bluetooth.


----------



## Baroninkjet

The main advantage I see is that there is no compression. I will also be using BT for phone audio... and my car system does not have aptX, etc. I believe Android can support separate BT channels for music and phone ( though iPhone cannot ) and if so something like Astell & Kern BT receiver might be an option too. If CCA works Ok, it seems like  would be cheaper and higher quality.


----------



## Roscoeiii

I'd be surprised if there is an audible difference between Blutooth and WiFi hotspot in a car. Such a noisy environment.


----------



## Baroninkjet

I tried it with regular aptX when I had Galaxy S3 and difference was very pretty noticeable. Maybe better BT receiver and aptX HD would make a difference -- don't know.


----------



## rkw

Baroninkjet said:


> The main advantage I see is that there is no compression. I will also be using BT for phone audio... and my car system does not have aptX, etc. I believe Android can support separate BT channels for music and phone ( though iPhone cannot ) and if so something like Astell & Kern BT receiver might be an option too. If CCA works Ok, it seems like  would be cheaper and higher quality.


A CCA will work fine, but just don't expect it to make an improvement over Bluetooth in a car. Even if you have a high end car stereo, the environment noise and poor acoustics will completely overwhelm any differences. As for cost, there are inexpensive (less than $30) aptX and even aptX HD receivers (check Amazon).


----------



## Ggroch

It may work less well.  "Compression" in car audio (meaning in this case dynamic compression) is a good thing.  Experiencing the full dynamic range of live music in a car ranges from inaudible ( low levels masked by road noise) to dangerous (high levels masking sirens).    No reason not to try it, and you can choose to limit dynamic range in the chromecast settings if you are using the analog outputs.


----------



## Baroninkjet

By compression, I meant how BT (even aptx HD) compresses file size 4:1 to send, then expands it after received.


----------



## Ggroch

Baroninkjet said:


> By compression, I meant how BT (even aptx HD) compresses file size 4:1 to send, then expands it after received.



I understood that.  I was making a parallel point using the same term a different way and perhaps trying to be too clever.  

I concur with those who have said that the effects of  data compression while audible in a home environment should not impact the quality of the mobile audio experience, unless the vehicle  is parked with the engine off in a quiet place. 

However, it sounds like it would not be too expensive or time consuming to try it out.  I would be interested to hear what you discover.


----------



## gibby (Dec 3, 2017)

I'm happy with this setup.  Sounds great.  Using Plex.


----------



## Hikoki

MBit said:


> Thanks for the info, that is great news! I just tried pulling the bass all the way up to 6db but the sound only gets distorted on my setup... Treble sounds better so far.


I haven't tried going all the way to 6db, but I am extremely excited about this new feature ( it's been a long time coming) which finally gives me enough bass for my DT880 600ohm. I actually find the bass rather good, definitely not distorted in my setup and on my phones.


----------



## MBit

Hikoki said:


> I haven't tried going all the way to 6db, but I am extremely excited about this new feature ( it's been a long time coming) which finally gives me enough bass for my DT880 600ohm. I actually find the bass rather good, definitely not distorted in my setup and on my phones.



What's your source? I used Spotify Premium for my first test. Doing it again with Tidal Hifi seems different though - a bit muffled at +6db but not much distortion if any. So the CCA EQ might make compressed material sound worse...
And would you also agree with *Ggroch* on an increase in mid-bass on your setup?


----------



## Hikoki (Dec 9, 2017)

MBit said:


> What's your source? I used Spotify Premium for my first test. Doing it again with Tidal Hifi seems different though - a bit muffled at +6db but not much distortion if any. So the CCA EQ might make compressed material sound worse...
> And would you also agree with *Ggroch* on an increase in mid-bass on your setup?


Hi. I am using Spotify Premium mostly, but stream also flac music off my server. I might have done the testing using uncompressed music, don't remember, really, so you might be right. As for the mid-bass increase, I might not be that much of a discerning listener, or it might be the rather bass shy DT880, but I just appreciate the overall warmness and fullness of the lower register as such that I can't really tell exactly.  But maybe, because the mid-bass  is  what the DT880 600ohm lack a great deal , they do benefit from the increase in this area more than other phones and, as a result, improve the overall SQ in the bass register. So yes, Ggroch might be right. But it's not a big deal for me, anyway.


----------



## jgazal

Sorry to make such a noob questions.
I have an old dac that only converts LCPM to analog.
I want to use Spotify.
Would CCA transcode AAC from Spotify to LCPM that my dac understand?
If not, is there any device besides a computer that does that in real time? For instance, a blue ray player?
Do I really need to buy a new DAC that accepts AAC?


----------



## gibby

jgazal said:


> Sorry to make such a noob questions.
> I have an old dac that only converts LCPM to analog.
> I want to use Spotify.
> Would CCA transcode AAC from Spotify to LCPM that my dac understand?
> ...



Do you have a CCA now?  Spotify see's my CCA on my network and asks to stream to it.  Have you connected a CCA to your DAC yet?  If it works with CCA alone, it should work with Spotify.


----------



## jgazal

I don’t have cca yet.
I read cca can cast LPCM files from a local library.
If cca keeps the AAC code in the toslink output then my DAC won’t decode it.
I cannot find this spec anywhere.
Perhaps is better to buy it anyway...


----------



## Baroninkjet

I'm dumbfounded that nobody has done a quality add-on Spotify Connect receiver yet. I have had a Yamaha receiver with it built in for years now -- would be better for 44.1 than Goog-A.


----------



## Ggroch

Chromecast Audio's Digital Output is LPCM, not AAC, and should work with any DAC.   I have not heard of a DAC that it was not compatible with as long as it has an Optical Toslink Input. 



Baroninkjet said:


> I'm dumbfounded that nobody has done a quality add-on Spotify Connect receiver yet. I have had a Yamaha receiver with it built in for years now -- would be better for 44.1 than Goog-A.



Coincidentally I had a conversation today with the owner/founder of a company that makes Wi-Fi Speakers that have the DTS Play-Fi System ( a CCA competitor) built in.  He told me that whether you are using a Play-Fi compatible product, or an Amazon Echo Product, or CCA, they all use the same Spotify Connect system, not their own systems, when playing Spotify.  That is why you do not have to fire up the Play-Fi App, or Google Home, or the Alexa App to play Spotify on your wireless speakers.   Just fire up the Spotify App and you see the speakers under available devices.  The Google Home/Alexa/Play-Fi Software literally just kicks you over to the Spotify System.  (I think Sonos may work differently and have more total integration, but the others don't).

SO, there would be little purpose to creating a Spotify ONLY add-on receiver when these other systems all do the same thing...but with the benefits of additional streaming sources.   I own several speakers that use the Linkplay (also called Audiocast) system, and some of their Add on receivers have, like Chromecast, Optical Digital Outputs.   The limitation is that the Spotify system is not designed to be super high resolution (like say DSD), but rather universally compatible.   So, I am not sure there would be a sonic benefit to creating a $500 audiophile Spotify add on, when the signal itself is so limited.

That said, there are $500 "Audiophile" Bluetooth only receivers.  IMHO that's ridiculous, no matter how great the receiver is, Bluetooth signals (at least until the new Bluetooth formats released in the last year or so) have been so compressed it could not possibly sound as good as a $35 CCA.  Same reason you do not see to many Audiophile AM radios.     The limitation is the signal, not the decoding receiver.


----------



## rkw

Baroninkjet said:


> I'm dumbfounded that nobody has done a quality add-on Spotify Connect receiver yet. I have had a Yamaha receiver with it built in for years now -- would be better for 44.1 than Goog-A.


What do you mean by a quality add-on Spotify Connect receiver? There are many multi-function streamer products that support Spotify Connect, and they are available at all levels up to high end. Some are listed here. Nobody is interested in making a receiver that is only for Spotify Connect. Also, I didn't understand what you meant by "_would be better for 44.1 than Goog-A_".


----------



## Baroninkjet

That is fascinating, and it makes perfect sense since they do pretty much the same thing. 

I'm curious how the 44.1/48k gets handled. Isn't Chromecast Audio 48k only? 

A big disadvantage of Chromecast is Google restrictions on using it in a car setting with a phone hotspot. I read someplace that an update had broken this unofficial functionality, and have yet to find anyone who is still using it currently. I have some free Google $$ to spend, might buy one to see.


----------



## Baroninkjet

rkw said:


> What do you mean by a quality add-on Spotify Connect receiver? There are many multi-function streamer products that support Spotify Connect, and they are available at all levels up to high end. Some are listed here. Nobody is interested in making a receiver that is only for Spotify Connect. Also, I didn't understand what you meant by "_would be better for 44.1 than Goog-A_".



I looked at a lot of those. Most are no longer available, or not in the US. And only one or two would work for what I was looking for -- a car setup.

Spotify content is all CD quality or compressed from CD quality, hence 44.1 sampling rate.


----------



## gibby

jgazal said:


> Sorry to make such a noob questions.
> I have an old dac that only converts LCPM to analog.
> I want to use Spotify.
> Would CCA transcode AAC from Spotify to LCPM that my dac understand?
> ...



By the way, I have this $20 DAC connected to my CCA and it works perfectly.  https://www.amazon.com/D03K-Digital...TF8&qid=1513570055&sr=8-1&keywords=fiio+dac+d


----------



## Ggroch

Baroninkjet said:


> That is fascinating, and it makes perfect sense since they do pretty much the same thing.
> 
> I'm curious how the 44.1/48k gets handled. Isn't Chromecast Audio 48k only?..



No, about a year ago Chromecast had a firmware update that now passes through the Spotify 44.1 signal, it does not convert to 48K


----------



## almarti

Baroninkjet said:


> I looked at a lot of those. Most are no longer available, or not in the US. And only one or two would work for what I was looking for -- a car setup.
> 
> Spotify content is all CD quality or compressed from CD quality, hence 44.1 sampling rate.



Spotify is not CD Quality as the format of song files is AAC or MP3, I mean, compressed and with losses. I use CCA with Tidal (that it's CD Quality in FLAC format) and I get bitperfect digital output to Mojo. It sounds impressive


----------



## rkw (Dec 18, 2017)

Baroninkjet said:


> A big disadvantage of Chromecast is Google restrictions on using it in a car setting with a phone hotspot. I read someplace that an update had broken this unofficial functionality, and have yet to find anyone who is still using it currently.


Was that concerning Chromecast, or Chromecast *Audio*? I saw this article, which is not about Chromecast *Audio*, where the issue was reported to be fixed.

Earlier in the thread, @almarti said he uses Chromecast Audio with a phone hotspot, and I posted in post #318, that I tested it and it worked.



Baroninkjet said:


> Spotify content is all CD quality or compressed from CD quality, hence 44.1 sampling rate.


All Spotify streams are lossy compressed data, not CD quality. Its maximum data rate (Extreme Quality on Premium) is only 320 kbps, far below CD quality. For streaming to Chromecast, maximum rate is 256 kbps: https://support.spotify.com/us/using_spotify/system_settings/high-quality-streaming/

Which output do you intend to use on the Chromecast Audio (analog output from its built-in DAC, or toslink output to an external DAC)?

What phone do you have? If you have an Android phone that supports Bluetooth aptX, I would just use that with a Bluetooth aptX receiver. How good is your car stereo?


----------



## Baroninkjet

You folks have got to get out more! Spotify has been beta testing lossless for close to a year now.

https://www.engadget.com/2017/03/01/spotify-hi-fi-leak/

It should be coming to everyone soon.


----------



## rkw

Baroninkjet said:


> You folks have got to get out more! Spotify has been beta testing lossless for close to a year now.
> 
> https://www.engadget.com/2017/03/01/spotify-hi-fi-leak/
> 
> It should be coming to everyone soon.


I've been following it ever since reports first appeared. I have both Spotify and Tidal subscriptions and would be happy to ditch Tidal if Spotify offers lossless.

Spotify was primarily doing market research and trying to gauge interest. The problem is that the demand for lossless streaming is relatively low. Spotify will be busy in the coming year (including an IPO) and lossless will be low on their list of priorities.


----------



## Hikoki (Jan 1, 2018)

The problem is that as you get older and your hearing gets inevitably worse,  you are hard-pressed to discern any difference between a well recorded high bit rate mp3 (or even ogg, for that matter) and a CD quality track. This has been covered a zillion times. So I wouldn't be surprised if Spotify ditched the whole flac thing altogether.


----------



## gvl2016

Apparently Spotify is bleeding money, rolling out lossless doesn't sound like a good way to help with that. Big investment low return. Heck, they can't get bit-perfect playback in their desktop app working, thankfully CCA is a reasonable workaround for that with Connect.


----------



## gvl2016

rkw said:


> For streaming to Chromecast, maximum rate is 256 kbps: https://support.spotify.com/us/using_spotify/system_settings/high-quality-streaming/



It is 256 kbps AAC, which is probably as good if not better than 320 kbps OGG.


----------



## maxh22

Just finished reading this entire thread. I have to say that I'm really impressed with the optical out of the CCA and its analog out is quite good for the money as well.

I've read a lot of conflicting information about this product but it seems a lot of that is irrelevant since the firmware updates seemed to improve the sound quality. 

The first thing I noticed when listening to the CCA as a source into my Hugo TT and Mojo is the amount of clarity it provides, nothing sounds congested or cluttered, it sounds pretty transparent tbh. After some nitpicking and several hours more listening I determined it sounded leaner than some of my other sources and the sound sometimes had an edge to it. So I plugged out the wall wart, took out my portable 3000mah battery and plugged it in. This eliminated most of the edginess I was hearing and calmed the sound down, definite and worthwhile improvement. Next  came the cables.

I have been experimenting with different cables and adapters powering the CCA and to my surprise they all have an effect on the sound. The stock cable sounds neutral but a little bit lean, the cable that comes with my Mojo sounds more full bodied and warmer but comes across as a little less dynamic, I tried using an Uptone Audio USPCB adapter along with an AQ adapter to power the CCA and the sound had the best PRaT by far but came across a little edgier and more brittle than the other cables. I then tried adding a jitterbug prior to the USPCB and once again it affected the sound and brought back some body and warmth but some brittleness remained (RFI entering?) More experimentation is needed...

The EQ is also interesting, lowering the treble and increasing the bass helps compensate for other issues in one's setup and I'm glad they recently added that.

I'm surprised no one has tried modding the CCA, if you remove the AK 4430 and the Texas Instruments DRV632 stereo line driver from the circuit, the sound of the optical output may become more transparent because less componentry is adding it's own sound to the circuit. Interesting stuff to consider


----------



## Ggroch

Good Points maxh22.   The CCA sounds great to me, both using the optical out with my DAC, and pretty fine with the analog out also.

Question on removing things from the circuit (from one who is relatively ignorant on much of this stuff).  The ability to change volume and adjust tone, (including through the optical output), means the CCA is not just passing on an unaltered digital signal it receives.  I would guess that volume and tone adjustments occur entirely in the digital domain which is then fed either the optical output or the DRV632.    

Regardless of how it works the result is to my ears excellent, and I think they did a great job of providing very subtle tone adjustment steps so that the result is still very hi fi.


----------



## maxh22

I saw a few posts from several users recommending the IFI SPIDIF iPurifier, I might pick one of those up later on to further refine the sound but for now I am happy with the performance of the device


----------



## gvl2016

maxh22 said:


> I saw a few posts from several users recommending the IFI SPIDIF iPurifier, I might pick one of those up later on to further refine the sound but for now I am happy with the performance of the device



I'm lazy to confirm it but based on what I read about Chord designs they should take care of jitter internally, no need to waste your money on iPurifier.


----------



## maxh22

gvl2016 said:


> I'm lazy to confirm it but based on what I read about Chord designs they should take care of jitter internally, no need to waste your money on iPurifier.



Yes I'm aware, unfortunately for my wallet, I can very easily hear the difference between different quality optical sources, some being better than others. I'm not sure if the differences are down to Jitter or something else entirely, but if there's one thing I know for sure it's that everything sounds.

For example: The toslink out from my PC motherboard sounds warm, a little euphonic , but also smeared in comparison to the CCA. The CCA sounds more transparent, neutral and less confused in comparison.


----------



## gvl2016

Some mobo chipsets are known to resample internally on the way out, even if you get the format you wanted in the end.


----------



## maxh22 (Feb 9, 2018)

gvl2016 said:


> Some mobo chipsets are known to resample internally on the way out, even if you get the format you wanted in the end.



I'm using a Z77 mobo, format is set to 16bit 44khz with all enhancements off, background processes have been terminated, Mojo and Hugo have a red light confirming the output is PCM 44khz. If it were resampled to anything else ,E.g 48 khz, the light would be orange not red.

I also have an Oppo BDP 105 which also has a toslink out and it to sounds a little different than the CCA but closer in sound to the CCA than the mobo.


----------



## gvl2016

maxh22 said:


> I'm using a Z77 mobo, format is set to 16bit 44khz with all enhancements off, background processes have been terminated, Mojo and Hugo have a red light confirming the output is PCM 44khz. If it were resampled to anything else ,E.g 48 khz, the light would be orange not red.



It could resample to say 48kHz first, then to 44.1kHz on the way out.


----------



## Ggroch

A bit off topic but interesting I hope:

RE: IFI SPIDIF iPurifier and similar......Do they make a difference.  
I can answer that definitively.   maxh22  would definitely hear an improvement. gvl2016 will not.      Not because of what it does, but because of how we hear. 

That is, if you are not doing a double blind test, then we all hear what we expect to hear.  J.J. Johnson, an engineer with DTS has done a lot of work on audible perceptions, and has one of his discussions posted on youtube *HERE.  The most relevant section starts at about 1:00 minute in and goes til about 5:00 minutes in. *The whole video of the panel discussion is interesting I think.  Our brains are hard wired to always hear things in context.  (google the McGurk Effect for proof). 

For many years I sold audio components and was intrigued by the fact that almost none of the really expensive cables we sold ever got returned. I knew many of my customers did not have very discerning ears.  Since these customers expected to hear improvements, they did.    Today with digital sources this kind of discussion focuses more on DACs and digital conditioners, most of these sources measure incredibly well,and their sales also benefits I am sure from our expectations. 

But that is also is part of the fun...and there is no way around how we perceive, so if it is in your budget and makes you happy go for it.  Until manufacturer's provide proof with double blind testing, I will remain a skeptic on most of this stuff.

I can definitely hear the improvement when I correctly adjust CCA's tone controls.  If that means its not bit-perfect, I will try not to let that bother me. 

...Climbing off the soap box now.  Watch the video, fascinating I think.


----------



## gvl2016 (Feb 9, 2018)

Meh, I was the one who recently reported the improvements with the iPurifier. I didn't need a blind test to hear them as it wasn't one of those "maybe" cases. The sound is much more in focus with the iPurifier, the fuzziness is gone. Thing is the DAC I now use is almost 30 years old and has no jitter correction. Whatever clock is recovered from the SPDIF signal is used throughout the DAC so jittery sources IS an issue. Expensive modern DACs with DSP like those from Chord usually have built-in measures to deal with jitter, so there is no benefit to be realized with the iPurifier or very little. If one has the budget to give it a shot sure, just need to set the expectations right based on the rest of the gear.


----------



## maxh22

Ggroch said:


> A bit off topic but interesting I hope:
> 
> RE: IFI SPIDIF iPurifier and similar......Do they make a difference.
> I can answer that definitively.   maxh22  would definitely hear an improvement. gvl2016 will not.      Not because of what it does, but because of how we hear.
> ...



Thanks for linking the video, lots of relevant info for sure. Ironically enough, when I pulled the trigger on the Chromecast I had a negative expectation that its optical out would be just okay and its analog out would be muddy garbage and that it wouldn't even be worth listening to; imagine my surprise when the CCA didn't just meet my expectations but actually exceeded them on both fronts! 
In other words, I had a negative bias going in and upon delivery and use of the product my feelings changed dramatically.


----------



## maxh22

gvl2016 said:


> It could resample to say 48kHz first, then to 44.1kHz on the way out.



I use Tidal exclusive mode which takes exclusive control of the Spdif driver, this avoids any windows processing.



gvl2016 said:


> Meh, I was the one who recently reported the improvements with the iPurifier. I didn't need a blind test to hear them as it wasn't one of those "maybe" cases. The sound is much more in focus with the iPurifier, the fuzziness is gone. Thing is the DAC I now use is almost 30 years old and has no jitter correction. Whatever clock is recovered from the SPDIF signal is used throughout the DAC so jittery sources IS an issue. Expensive modern DACs with DSP like those from Chord usually have built-in measures to deal with jitter, so there is no benefit to be realized with the iPurifier or very little. If one has the budget to give it a shot sure, just need to set the expectations right based on the rest of the gear.



Good point about it impacting DACs more that have little to no Jitter correction, I'm gonna give it some more thought and time before I buy it but its good to know Amazon has a thirty day return policy.


----------



## gvl2016 (Feb 10, 2018)

maxh22 said:


> I use Tidal exclusive mode which takes exclusive control of the Spdif driver, this avoids any windows processing.



Understood. Sadly it can also happen in audio hardware and driver behind the WASAPI interface.


----------



## rkw

maxh22 said:


> I saw a few posts from several users recommending the IFI SPIDIF iPurifier, I might pick one of those up later on to further refine the sound but for now I am happy with the performance of the device


Something that has stopped me from getting an iPurifier is that Chromecast Audio doesn't support gapless playback, and I've read that the iPurifier makes it even worse. That and the thought of buying an accessory for the Chromecast Audio that costs over 4x as much as the CCA itself.


----------



## gvl2016 (Feb 10, 2018)

^^^ That is certainly true. My DAC often goes crazy between songs with the iPurifier and CCA, blinking all lights. Fortunately not audible, there were reports of DACs making noise.


----------



## ginetto61

Hi to everyone and thanks a lot for the very great thread.  I am really sorry to jump in like this ... but is there any good soul that can direct me to the most extensive review in this huge thread focusing the CCA sound quality ? thanks a lot.  Kind regards, gino


----------



## maninthehighcastle

I'm tested the Chromecast Audio with the Android Tidal App yesterday. This is so simple and work with qobuz too because they both can handle Chromecast streaming. I connected the ifi idsd micro with spdif. The sound is top notch. i compared it to my raspberry roon endpoint and can't tell any diffrence.


----------



## Ggroch

I see a that there is a new 2018 version of Chromecast Video that will probably be announced on Oct. 9.   Apparently Target stores are currently closing out the CC audio.  

* Does this mean the Chromecast Audio will be updated or discontinued?*

My guess is that it will be discontinued.   Google is pushing their Home devices...like the Home Mini pretty hard. It now has bluetooth audio transmitting capability and for many non-audiophiles that may be all they want.   They could also come out with a Google Mini version 2 with audio outputs (but I bet no optical outputs). 

Would you be happy with an updated Mini?   This thread in an audiophile community has slowed down a lot.  Perhaps for many Bluetooth sound and functions are good enough.


----------



## nickv

Ggroch said:


> I see a that there is a new 2018 version of Chromecast Video that will probably be announced on Oct. 9.   Apparently Target stores are currently closing out the CC audio.
> 
> * Does this mean the Chromecast Audio will be updated or discontinued?*
> 
> ...



I hope this isn't the end for the CCA. It's such a useful and cost effective device.


----------



## Ggroch

Amazon will ship on Dec. 2 their shot at a Chromecast Audio like Alexa device with no built in speakers: Echo Input. 

Pluses over Chromecast Audio: Alexa voice control functionality  (with 5 mic array), Bluetooth (both source receive and audio transmit to speakers), access to Amazon streaming music services and interfacing with Alexa multi-room audio functionality. 

Not so great is no digital output (3.5mm analog only), no current access to Tidal, Deezer or any HD audio services (and of course no Google/Youtube music)  On the other hand, Amazon just made available the Alexa Audio Skill API  which may allow for rapid deployment of new services (or not). 

Price $35...which makes one wonder about any real advantages over a sale priced or Gen 1 Dot. However...the Echo Input page now shows bundles with 5 small self powered speakers from Bose, B&O and Marshall and others...where the bundle price gives you the Echo input basically free.

What do you think?


----------



## nickv

Ggroch said:


> Amazon will ship on Dec. 2 their shot at a Chromecast Audio like Alexa device with no built in speakers: Echo Input.
> 
> Pluses over Chromecast Audio: Alexa voice control functionality  (with 5 mic array), Bluetooth (both source receive and audio transmit to speakers), access to Amazon streaming music services and interfacing with Alexa multi-room audio functionality.
> 
> ...



Interesting, but with no digital out I think I'll stick with the CCA which sounds great to my ears when the DAC capabilities are managed by a Modi 3.


----------



## Roscoeiii

nickv said:


> Interesting, but with no digital out I think I'll stick with the CCA which sounds great to my ears when the DAC capabilities are managed by a Modi 3.


Agreed. No digital output is a deal breaker for me.


----------



## Edogawan77

nickv said:


> Interesting, but with no digital out I think I'll stick with the CCA which sounds great to my ears when the DAC capabilities are managed by a Modi 3.



It HAS digital out. You must use mini tostlink to toslink cable. I'm using GCC to connect to DAC, sound very nice.


----------



## Ggroch (Nov 13, 2018)

Edogawan77 said:


> It HAS digital out. You must use mini tostlink to toslink cable. I'm using GCC to connect to DAC, sound very nice.



Of course it does....the poster you quote was referring to the not yet released "Echo Input"....not the CCA.  Not an auspicious first post...but welcome anyway.

I see Amazon is packaging the Input free with certain speakers.  1/2 off with others.  And its not even released yet.


----------



## aerospace33

Based on https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ents-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/ it looks like the digital ouput of the chromecast can be quite good. However, Google's CAST functinality measured quite poorly, especially when compared to Roon's streamcast streaming implementation.


----------



## rkw

aerospace33 said:


> Based on https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ents-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/ it looks like the digital ouput of the chromecast can be quite good. However, Google's CAST functinality measured quite poorly, especially when compared to Roon's streamcast streaming implementation.


He only tested casting from a Chrome browser. He is going to test casting from Tidal app, but hasn't done it yet.

I get excellent results casting from apps (Tidal, Spotify etc). Qobuz even casts at 96k, but glitches occasionally.


----------



## audiobomber

I've had a good deal of trouble casting and streaming (DLNA) 24/88.2 files to CCA, but only when I use an outboard DAC. Sometimes I get a popping noise in the music, sometimes dropouts, sometimes complete signal loss. With 16/44.1 and lossy compressed files, it plays reliably. This gets better/worse depending on the Toslink cable. The best performance I've had is with a glass Toslink and mini-adapters. 

If I use the CCA internal DAC, all of my files play reliably, including hi-rez.


----------



## Ggroch

audiobomber said:


> I've had a good deal of trouble casting and streaming (DLNA) 24/88.2 files to CCA, but only when I use an outboard DAC.......



What DAC/DACs are you using?


----------



## markbrauer

_Audiobomber,
"I've had a good deal of trouble casting and streaming (DLNA) 24/88.2 files to CCA, but only when I use an outboard DAC. Sometimes I get a popping noise in the music, sometimes dropouts, sometimes complete signal loss."_    -   I have the same problem, usually short dropouts.

_"With 16/44.1 and lossy compressed files, it plays reliably."_    -   Not mine. I get dropouts with 16/44 and even 320Kbps (Spotify). 

_"This gets better/worse depending on the Toslink cable." _   -   I have tried cables of varying quality and the problem persists. 

_"If I use the CCA internal DAC, all of my files play reliably, including hi-rez." _ -   Same here.

I think it is my DAC. While the actual sound quality is excellent using Toslink from the CCA, the DAC evidently has trouble dealing with the CCA's relatively high jitter (as measured by Archimago) and the dropouts make the results un-listenable.. My Squeezebox Touch, using Toslink to the same DAC, has no such problems. Also, when using the CCA with a $20 optical DAC, the kind designed to convert TV optical-output to analog, I get no dropouts. The sound quality with the cheap DAC sucks but it has no dropout problems.

It seems some DACs have a low tolerance for jitter on Toslink inputs.


----------



## audiobomber (Nov 16, 2018)

Ggroch said:


> What DAC/DACs are you using?



Audiolab 8200CD and iFi Audio iOne. I also had a Sabaj D3 for a week before I returned it.



markbrauer said:


> I think it is my DAC. While the actual sound quality is excellent using Toslink from the CCA, the DAC evidently has trouble dealing with the CCA's relatively high jitter (as measured by Archimago) and the dropouts make the results un-listenable.. My Squeezebox Touch, using Toslink to the same DAC, has no such problems. Also, when using the CCA with a $20 optical DAC, the kind designed to convert TV optical-output to analog, I get no dropouts. The sound quality with the cheap DAC sucks but it has no dropout problems.
> 
> It seems some DACs have a low tolerance for jitter on Toslink inputs.



Jitter is my conclusion as well, and as measured by Archimago, it's especially prominent with hi-rez files. I am told that the Audiolab DAC has three firmware settings to set tolerance levels for jitter, but raising it from the default minimum setting lowers the sound quality of the DAC.

I don't use CCA in my main system with the Audiolab anyway, it was just a test. The secondary system I use it in sounds OK with the CCA's internal DAC. I don't want to complain too much about Chromecast audio. For the price it is quite an amazing little machine. I power it with an iFi Audio iPower 5V, which makes the SQ a bit more robust.


----------



## Ggroch

Chromecast Audio is now Black Friday priced at Google,  Bestbuy, and Google through eBay at $15.    Shipping is free through Googles eBay store, but they charge you direct unless you order over $35.


----------



## audiobomber (Nov 22, 2018)

Thanks for the update Ggroch. I ordered three CCA streamers two days ago from Google Store Canada. I've requested the discount. I should have thought of Black Friday when I ordered, but my main concern was the Canada Post strike.


----------



## Sound Eq (Dec 10, 2018)

need help how to use chrome cast audio to its fullest with mac book pro and iphone xs max,

where is this dynamic setting i can not find it on google home iphone app


----------



## maxh22

CCA  analog output sounds pretty remarkable  when it’s fed clean power from a power bank along with some clip on ferrites on the micro usb cable .

I would take it over the Fiio x5 iii and Dragon flys any day.

But with the stock ps it sounds a little edgy in the high end which is just RF noise..


----------



## buchignani (Dec 12, 2018)

maxh22 said:


> CCA  analog output sounds pretty remarkable  when it’s fed clean power from a power bank along with some clip on ferrites on the micro usb cable .
> 
> I would take it over the Fiio x5 iii and Dragon flys any day.
> 
> But with the stock ps it sounds a little edgy in the high end which is just RF noise..



A quick upgrade is to add a staggered series of capacitors to the USB line between the stock power supply and the chromecast: say, 470 mF, 47 mF, 4.7 mF and a smaller good poly cap. Works great, and you can use the same cable on other power supplies.

By the way, it is important to note that the USB cable I got with the last chromecast audio I bought had ONLY the two power supply wires (and no signal wires). Obviosly you don't want to use that cable for other data operations.


----------



## maxh22

buchignani said:


> A quick upgrade is to add a staggered series of capacitors to the USB line between the stock power supply and the chromecast: say, 470 mF, 47 mF, 4.7 mF and a smaller good poly cap. Works great, and you can use the same cable on other power supplies.
> 
> By the way, it is important to note that the USB cable I got with the last
> 
> chromecast audio I bought had ONLY the two power supply wires (and no signal wires). Obviosly you don't want to use that cable for other data operations.



How does this modification improve the sound? What differences are you hearing?

I'm using a better-shielded cable than the stock one but the stock one isn't half bad either.


----------



## Ggroch (Dec 12, 2018)

maxh22 said:


> But with the stock ps it sounds a little edgy in the high end which is just RF noise..



Hmmm.  Are you a science guy or an "I believe my ears" guy or both?

Are you using the built in Chromecast DAC (Analog 3.5mm out) or Toslink with an External DAC?
Have you seen any measurements that show RF Noise leaking into the signal?
Sorry for all of the questions...but there are a lot of variables here.

There have been some recent CCA measurements by Amir at Audio Science Review of both the _Analog Outputs._ and the_ Digital Toslink Output_.
Recent is good because there have been a lot of firmware improvements since the CCA's release...including implementing bit-perfect transmission (depending on source/software).

*Interesting in the Analog Measurements:*

.0027% THD + Noise
91.2 dB S/N ratio.
Jitter and Noise  110dB down.   So in this test...any RF noise or other power related issues are far below audibility.

These are very very good numbers.  Not the equal of the best Dacs...but equal or better than some very expensive ones like the Schiit Yggdrasil.
Note he did not use the stock USB power adapter (he lost it) but used another inexpensive switching power adapter.  I have never noticed any 60Hz noise or other distortion on my CCAs using the stock power adapter.  I did get some noise when I tried some random other cheap USB P/S.

*Interesting in the Digital Measurements:*

In the 1st Test of the CCA Toslink outputs the results were TERRIBLE.  It turns out the problem was not the CCA at all....but Google's Implementation of Casting Audio from within the Chrome Browser.
When he switch his source to a signal cast by Roon the results were once again....nearly perfect.  Other well designed casting software like  Hi-Fi Cast, BubbleUPnP, Media Monkey that use the Chromecast API get similar great results.  So the problem is the Chrome Browser Casting function. I wish he would test Spotify Connect Streaming...because I use that most of the time. My guess would be it is as good as spotify direct...which is plenty for me but definitely not Hi-Res. 

Another interesting note on the CCA Toslink out is that it has some jitter which really well designed DACS (like the Topping D50) can totally handle.  Other less well designed DACS may show some small jitter effects.  Rather than purchase a bunch of anti-jitter add ons...it makes sense to choose a DAC with good jitter reduction for use with CCA's toslink.  They do not have to be expensive.


----------



## Ggroch

There appears to be two new Amazon Streaming Devices designed with audiophiles in mind.  Unlike the just released Echo Input, the *Echo Link ($200) and Echo Link Amp ($300) *have Digital Coaxial/Toslink In & Out, a headphone jack, Preamp and Subwoofer outputs, and a volume knob.    In addition to Prime Music they support Spotify, Tidal, Deezer, Pandora, and soon Apple Music.  No Google Music of course.

Compared to the equivalent Sonos devices they are a bargain...but no compared to CCA.   What do you guys think?


----------



## maxh22

Ggroch said:


> Hmmm.  Are you a science guy or an "I believe my ears" guy or both?
> 
> Are you using the built in Chromecast DAC (Analog 3.5mm out) or Toslink with an External DAC?
> Have you seen any measurements that show RF Noise leaking into the signal?
> ...



Thanks for the info on the CCA, it was a good refresher; I have read Amirs review of the CCA previously as it was of interest to me. I'm well aware of its early limitations as well but for the price of entry, it really offers a lot.

Btw, my impressions are purely subjective so take them with a grain of salt if you wish. But IMHO the battery and ferrites are the final icing on the cake without doing any other mods to the chromecast itself. The sound is smoother, lusher, and has better flow. It's still not as good as my Chord Mojo for example, but with the right setup, it can be really relaxing and enjoyable.


----------



## gvl2016

Ggroch said:


> There appears to be two new Amazon Streaming Devices designed with audiophiles in mind.  Unlike the just released Echo Input, the *Echo Link ($200) and Echo Link Amp ($300) *have Digital Coaxial/Toslink In & Out, a headphone jack, Preamp and Subwoofer outputs, and a volume knob.    In addition to Prime Music they support Spotify, Tidal, Deezer, Pandora, and soon Apple Music.  No Google Music of course.
> 
> Compared to the equivalent Sonos devices they are a bargain...but no compared to CCA.   What do you guys think?



Sadly no DLNA support or so it seems.


----------



## Sound Eq

Ggroch said:


> There appears to be two new Amazon Streaming Devices designed with audiophiles in mind.  Unlike the just released Echo Input, the *Echo Link ($200) and Echo Link Amp ($300) *have Digital Coaxial/Toslink In & Out, a headphone jack, Preamp and Subwoofer outputs, and a volume knob.    In addition to Prime Music they support Spotify, Tidal, Deezer, Pandora, and soon Apple Music.  No Google Music of course.
> 
> Compared to the equivalent Sonos devices they are a bargain...but no compared to CCA.   What do you guys think?



that looks interesting, just making sure can i use my own dac with it


----------



## ginetto61 (Dec 13, 2018)

Ggroch said:


> ....  There have been some recent CCA measurements by Amir at Audio Science Review of both the _Analog Outputs._ and the_ Digital Toslink Output_.
> .... in this test...*any RF noise or other power related issues are far below audibility*...


Hi and thank you very much for the very interesting information.
Still i wonder if more in general RF noise can have some kind of impact on *dac clock stability/precision* even if is below or beyond audibility ... i am just asking.
I understand the very good dac are very very stable.  But i am afraid are also very very expensive ?  any specific recommendation ?
I wonder if the Gustard x20u that i have packed away now (i am always on the move) is one of those.  That would be fantastic.
Thanks a lot


----------



## Ggroch

ginetto61 said:


> ......I understand the very good dac are very very stable.  But i am afraid are also very very expensive ?  any specific recommendation ?
> 
> I wonder if the Gustard x20u that i have packed away now (i am always on the move) is one of those......



Wow....if you are having trouble finding storage space for your Gustard I will be happy to store it for you 

I do not think that price of a DAC is always directly related to Jitter Rejection/Stability.   My most expensive DAC is a Yulong D200 (using I think an ESS 9016 chipset). it actually skips/blanks about once every 3 minutes in the middle of songs when using the CCA Toslink.   

 Most of my DACs seem to work fine...but the previously mentioned Topping D50 and the new cheaper Topping DX3Pro have great Jitter specs as tested by Amir at ASR.   I have not seen a test of the x20u...but some technical DAC reviews should have a jitter measurement.  Nearly all ASR  DAC reviews include jitter measurement.


----------



## ginetto61 (Dec 13, 2018)

Ggroch said:


> Wow....if you are having trouble finding storage space for your Gustard I will be happy to store it for you


Hi ! thank you very much for the kind offer of help    i am looking for a place in Torino Italy.  Now all my personal audio toys are stored in another city.
The Gustard should be the best dac i have.  On the basis of what i read here.  Actually i bought it after reading some very positive reviews.



> I do not think that price of a DAC is always directly related to Jitter Rejection/Stability.   My most expensive DAC is a Yulong D200 (using I think an ESS 9016 chipset). it actually skips/blanks about once every 3 minutes in the middle of songs when using the CCA Toslink.
> Most of my DACs seem to work fine...but the previously mentioned Topping D50 and the new cheaper Topping DX3Pro have great Jitter specs as tested by Amir at ASR.   I have not seen a test of the x20u...but some technical DAC reviews should have a jitter measurement.
> Nearly all ASR  DAC reviews include jitter measurement.



yes i was referring to jitter rejection.  For me it is a very welcome thing.  I could use almost any usb to spdif converter i have.  I have already a Gustard U12 and a Yellowtec PUC2 to try out.
Hopefully one of the two will output a decent digital signal.  However now that i think better i could always buy a better usb to spdif interface with less jitter ?
Thanks again.


----------



## audiobomber

Ggroch said:


> *Interesting in the Analog Measurements:*
> .0027% THD + Noise
> 91.2 dB S/N ratio.
> Jitter and Noise  110dB down.   So in this test...any RF noise or other power related issues are far below audibility.
> These are very very good numbers.  Not the equal of the best Dacs...but equal or better than some very expensive ones like the Schiit Yggdrasil.



Are you saying that these measurements determine the sound quality of a DAC? Do you really believe a CCA can compare in SQ with a Yiggy? I have four DAC's, five counting the one in the CCA. The CCA DAC is easily the worst of these. It sounds fine in my lower resolution secondary system. In my main system, even fed with a high quality LPS, it is obviously compromised; grainy, lacking detail, collapsed soundstage.



Ggroch said:


> *Interesting in the Digital Measurements:*
> In the 1st Test of the CCA Toslink outputs the results were TERRIBLE.  It turns out the problem was not the CCA at all....but Google's Implementation of Casting Audio from within the Chrome Browser. When he switch his source to a signal cast by Roon the results were once again....nearly perfect.  Other well designed casting software like  Hi-Fi Cast, BubbleUPnP, Media Monkey that use the Chromecast API get similar great results.  So the problem is the Chrome Browser Casting function.



Amir did not find the problem with CCA digital streaming because he only tested at 48kHz. Mine works fine at 48 kHz, but very spotty with hi-rez (Minimstreamer DLNA). Archimago measured excessive jitter with 24/96 files. http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio.html This was a well deserved positive review of CCA, but only in terms of value, not performance. 



Ggroch said:


> Another interesting note on the CCA Toslink out is that it has some jitter which really well designed DACS (like the Topping D50) can totally handle.  Other less well designed DACS may show some small jitter effects.  Rather than purchase a bunch of anti-jitter add ons...it makes sense to choose a DAC with good jitter reduction for use with CCA's toslink.  They do not have to be expensive.


How much jitter a DAC will accept is not related sound quality, it is a design decision. My Audiolab 8200 CD is factory set to work with low jitter sources. There is a firmware setting to allow pairing with a high jitter source, but it affects SQ negatively. Again, this streaming issue is only on high resolution material, so not tested by Amir and not relevant to anyone streaming CD quality or Spotify.


----------



## rkw

Chromecast Audio is being discontinued.
https://variety.com/2019/digital/news/chromecast-audio-discontinued-1203105595/
Your last chance to get one, $15 at the Google Store and other retailers. Google has $35 minimum order for free shipping.
I ordered an extra one for myself at Staples (no minimum for free shipping with in-store pickup).


----------



## Ggroch

Thank you for the heads-up rkw!  I just ordered from Google's direct listing on  their eBay store where shipping is free.  

I posted your news on the head-fi deals thread.

I feel a little like I did when Logitech discontinued Squeezebox.   That was worse because there were very few streaming options then. But, I still think CCA fills an important niche.  Very few Google smart speakers have audio out jacks, and none that I know of have toslink.  

Plus,  since you can designate a CCA as the default music playback device for Google Smart speakers...they work very well together.


----------



## EElegances

I ordered direct from Google and even though it looked like they would charge shipping, they did not. It arrived the next day for $15. I already have one but got this one as a gift.


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## rkw (Jan 13, 2019)

Google had already dropped the price to $15 (from $35) a couple of months ago. With the announcement that it would be discontinued, all of the $15 deals suddenly sold out within a day. Judging from comments posted on the web, most of the sales went to people who already own one, and some ordered 3 or 4 at a time. It's a testament to what a great little device and incredible value it is, that owners felt compelled to stock up on more of them before they're gone.


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## Slater

rkw said:


> Google had already dropped the price to $15 (from $35) a couple of months ago. With the announcement that it would be discontinued, all of the $15 deals suddenly sold out within a day. Judging from comments posted on the web, most of the sales went to people who already own one, and some ordered 3 or 4 at a time. It's a testament to what a great little device and incredible value it is, that owners felt compelled to stock up on more of them before they're gone.



I didn’t even *own* one, and right after the announcement I went to the eBay listing and it was 98% sold so I ordered 2 just to play with and try out.

I’m sure a lot of those buyers were 3rd party resellers that will be turning around and reselling them on eBay at $25 to make a quick buck. There are a lot of those nowadays, doing it with everything from Monopoly Millennial Edition to Paw Patrol toys.


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## bode (Jan 26, 2019)

audiobomber said:


> I have four DAC's, five counting the one in the CCA. The CCA DAC is easily the worst of these.



Which of your DACs provided a noticeable improvement in detail/ SQ over the CCA's DAC? I'm wondering how much I would need to spend? Would a budget Topping D50, Topping DX3 Pro or perhaps a Schit Modi Mulitibit do the job?


----------



## Ggroch

bode said:


> Which of your DACs provided a noticeable improvement in detail/ SQ over the CCA's DAC?......



Good Question:

A recent test by Audio Science Review showed the CCA *analog outputs* had THD+ Noise distortion of .003% (totally inaudible). It also measured 91.5dB down in Noise...which is not excellent for a DAC...but probably also inaudible (at least if you are breathing). 

Another test by Audio Science Review of the CCA *Digital Outputs * had a THD+ Noise distortion of .0004% (totally inaudible).  It measured (using both the APx555 analyzer and a Topping D50) 107. dB down in noise. Totally inaudible. The interesting thing is he also tested the Digital out through a Schiit Modi 2 Uber which did not fare as well (no real improvement over the CCA analog output).  BUT, it probably still sounds the same, it just doesn't measure as well.   

The CCA has a bit more jitter through the Toslink than some sources...so picking a perfect match in DACs would mean choosing one that handles jitter well...and a lot of cheap but well designed DACS do.  So the D50, DX3 Pro, and even the SMSL Sanskrit 10th anniversary, would have no problems.  Whether you can hear a difference (in an objective blind A/B test) is another matter.

ASR did notice that you get much worse results casting from a Chrome Browser window, than by using dedicated software like Roon, BubbleUpnp, Hi-Fi Cast or the dedicated Spority, Tidal apps etc.  

I use a D50 because I like the control and design. I am not sure it sounds better than the CCA analog out because I have never done an objective blind A/B test.


----------



## bode

Ggroch said:


> Good Question:
> 
> I use a D50 because I like the control and design. I am not sure it sounds better than the CCA analog out because I have never done an objective blind A/B test.



I've probably spent more time reading this thread than I have listening to my new CCA! But through my analogue Densen B100 amp/ Triangle speakers...the CCA sounds fantastic with a little bump in the CCA's treble EQ. Plugging my Beyerdynamic DT 770 pros into the CCA, sounds very harsh and narrow..these may well get replaced as I primarily bought these for my bass guitar headphone amp.

The Aurender FLOW DAC/ amp is on massdrop for 499 USD at present...I'm very tempted.


----------



## rkw

bode said:


> Plugging my Beyerdynamic DT 770 pros into the CCA, sounds very harsh and narrow


Do you mean headphones plugged directly into the CCA? The CCA is designed as a source device (its analog output to an amp or digital output to a DAC), and it isn't surprising that the CCA doesn't have adequate power to properly drive full size headphones.


----------



## Ggroch

bode said:


> .....Plugging my Beyerdynamic DT 770 pros into the CCA, sounds very harsh and narrow......The Aurender FLOW DAC/ amp is on massdrop for 499 USD at present...I'm very tempted.



Using the CCA analog output as a headphone amp is an entirely different matter, it certainly was not designed to do that.  If you do not need portability, the JDS Labs Atom amp, directly connected to the CCA, or with any of the previously mentioned DACS, should be perfect for the DT 770 Pro, or nearly any other headphones.


----------



## audiobomber

bode said:


> Which of your DACs provided a noticeable improvement in detail/ SQ over the CCA's DAC? I'm wondering how much I would need to spend? Would a budget Topping D50, Topping DX3 Pro or perhaps a Schit Modi Mulitibit do the job?


I would say any of the above would sound better than the CCA DAC. Measurements are pretty much useless for determining the sound of a DAC.

I own a Sabaj Da2, iFi Audio iOne, Korg DS-DAC-10R and Audiolab 8200CD DAC/digital preamp. They all have great specs/measurements and all sound quite different in a high resolution system.


----------



## almarti

bode said:


> Which of your DACs provided a noticeable improvement in detail/ SQ over the CCA's DAC? I'm wondering how much I would need to spend? Would a budget Topping D50, Topping DX3 Pro or perhaps a Schit Modi Mulitibit do the job?


I combine CCA with Schiit Modi Multibit for speakers and with Mojo when headphones. In all cases I love the global sound.


----------



## InAnimaTed

Yeah please don't use the CCA DAC if using high quality equipment/headphones. Use the Optical cable to your own dedicated DAC; have had wonderful results with this!


----------



## ggetzoff

FWIW, I just tried the CCA in my main rig. It does not hold a candle to a dedicated Roon / Tidal / Qobuz to an Ipad to an XMOS DDC to my dac setup, as you would expect, but it's not bad! Certainly listenable. I would want glass toslink with it.


----------



## Ggroch

ggetzoff said:


> FWIW, I just tried the CCA in my main rig. It does not hold a candle to a dedicated Roon / Tidal / Qobuz to an Ipad to an XMOS DDC to my dac setup, as you would expect, but it's not bad!.........



According to Amir's testing using Roon and the CCA's Toslink with a quality but not expensive DAC (Topping D50); the resulting signal is extremely close to direct.

His conclusions:
1. The CAST audio functionality of Google Chrome Browser is horrid. There is no excuse for it to be butchering even simple 16-bit signals as it did. While audibly it is not as dire as it looks, I still would avoid it if you can.
2. Roon's implementation of Chromecast streaming is superb. It is bit accurate up to 24 bits and 48 kHz that I tested. Congratulations to Roon for job well done. I assume they received support from Google to implement it as the protocol otherwise is not open to the public.
3. The Chromecast output has more jitter than an audiophile/instrument grade Toslink output. This is evident when used with low quality DACs like Schiit Modi 2 Uber.
4. Using a well-designed Dac like the Topping D50, there is no difference at all between Toslink from Chromecast or higher fidelity sources. All the jitter is filtered out resulting in the performance of the DAC itself being the limit.
#4 is a great news here. It means that if you have a good DAC and use Roon, you can turn your DAC into a streamer/renderer using the Chromecast Audio. For just $35, that is a superb addition. As such, the combination of Roon and Chromecase audio is highly recommended!

So, at least in his tests it works much better than you would expect...measuring bit perfect.  The variables are the quality of the casting software (Chrome Browser being horrible, Roon being great) and the jitter rejection of the DAC.  He disses the Modi 2 Uber here, but primarily because its optical jitter rejection is not great in this test.


----------



## ggetzoff

Well, Amir is a man after my own heart, testing and validating data and performance, except when it comes to actual listening. That is where he and I differ. Again, he provides a great service but my ears are sure different then his.


----------



## nickv

I really enjoy the sound of my CCA with a Modi 3 but it's the only streaming combination I've tried with a DAC.

I'm poised to try out an Allo Digione with the Modi 3 but not sure whether this will improve upon the SQ I'm getting with the CCA? I hope it does of course.


----------



## rkw

nickv said:


> I'm poised to try out an Allo Digione with the Modi 3 but not sure whether this will improve upon the SQ I'm getting with the CCA?


How would you directly compare those two? Is there a way to Google Cast to the DigiOne?


----------



## nickv

rkw said:


> How would you directly compare those two? Is there a way to Google Cast to the DigiOne?



I meant compare:
CCA -> Modi 3 -> amp
to
Digione -> Modi 3 -> amp


----------



## InAnimaTed

ggetzoff said:


> FWIW, I just tried the CCA in my main rig. It does not hold a candle to a dedicated Roon / Tidal / Qobuz to an Ipad to an XMOS DDC to my dac setup, as you would expect, but it's not bad! Certainly listenable. I would want glass toslink with it.



Um, you mean using the CCA's DAC vs yours? Yeah, yours is going to win. Using the CCA w/ Optical to your DAC shouldn't yield any difference really, unless your DAC just doesn't do Toslink input well (which would be unfortunate)


----------



## ggetzoff

No, thats not what I meant. The CCA as an endpoint for my dac, as opposed to my normal endpoint.


----------



## InAnimaTed

What DAC are you using? There really should be no difference.


----------



## Ggroch

InAnimaTed said:


> .....Um, you mean using the CCA's DAC vs yours? Yeah, yours is going to win. Using the CCA w/ Optical to your DAC shouldn't yield any difference really, unless your DAC just doesn't do Toslink input well (which would be unfortunate)



Yeah, that was my point too.  Since the output of the CCA optical using Roon is bit perfect...(that is, digitally exactly like the original signal), then the only possible differences between the two would be:

1. From a DAC that does not handle jitter well.
2. Expectation/Confirmation Bias - this would require blind A/B testing at the same levels to test.

A lot of audiophiles get P/O'd when Confirmation Bias is mentioned.  They shouldn't, it happens to everyone. Or more precisely, to every human.  We cannot avoid it.  

That is why many objective science guys like Amir at ASR do so few subjective listening tests. Even science guys have listening bias...especially after they just measured something.  I did not see any listening tests in the linked CCA/Digital Out review.


----------



## ggetzoff

Well, it should not sound different but it does. Not even close. Same receiver chip, but very different sonics. 

I build speakers, amps, and dacs. My ears like low levels of negative 2nd order harmonics (dirt) in the grass. My amps and speakers measure very well, but not my dac; it would rank at the bottom of of his chart. 

Cheers,

Greg


----------



## tlainhart

ggetzoff said:


> FWIW, I just tried the CCA in my main rig. It does not hold a candle to a dedicated Roon / Tidal / Qobuz to an Ipad to an XMOS DDC to my dac setup, as you would expect, but it's not bad! Certainly listenable. I would want glass toslink with it.



On one input (BNC SPDIF) to the Yggdrasil I have a CCA using glass Toslink (Silflex) to an iFi SPDIF Purifier.  On another (RCA SPDIF), I have a Teac CD player serving as transport, that takes input from an iPad playing Tidal, using a specialized iPod/Pad USB jack on that player.  I put the output of that into the iFi SPDIF purifier as well.  I connect to the CCA using Tidal's Android app.

The iPad => transport => SPDIF purifier sounds better to me.  But all-in-all, I'd rather be listening to a CD.


----------



## rkw

tlainhart said:


> I have a CCA using glass Toslink (Silflex) to an iFi SPDIF Purifier


Is the iPurifier a worthwhile upgrade? I've considered it, but hesitate to buy a $150 accessory for a $15 (originally $35) device. Also, the CCA doesn't support gapless playback and someone said the iPurifier makes the gaps even worse. Do you experience this?


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## gvl2016 (Feb 2, 2019)

rkw said:


> Is the iPurifier a worthwhile upgrade? I've considered it, but hesitate to buy a $150 accessory for a $15 (originally $35) device. Also, the CCA doesn't support gapless playback and someone said the iPurifier makes the gaps even worse. Do you experience this?



A good DAC should deal with CCA's jitter just fine. I have an iPurifier and it did make a difference with a vintage DAC with the CCA, but modern DACs have much better SPDIF interfaces and possibly other means onboard so the jitter is not of much a concern. If your DAC is problematic I'd save the money for a better DAC instead of buying an IP. The details are escaping me but I did think at the time that iPurifier exacerbated the gapless issue with the DAC I was using, it worked but the DAC was going crazy showing errors between tracks, but audibly it was ok. This is DAC dependent of course, I'm sure the majority of DACs would be fine.


----------



## tlainhart

rkw said:


> Is the iPurifier a worthwhile upgrade? I've considered it, but hesitate to buy a $150 accessory for a $15 (originally $35) device. Also, the CCA doesn't support gapless playback and someone said the iPurifier makes the gaps even worse. Do you experience this?



I believe that it makes a subtle difference, but confirmation bias may be at play.  It's enough of a benefit that I ended up keeping it, if just for SPDIF. For me, I'm not sure that there's any fixing CCA/Toslink.  I'm waiting for the next USB interface for the Yggdrasil, and then I'll just connect my phone to tablet via USB, get my streaming that way.

I don't know about gapless.  You could buy the Purifier from some place with an evaluation period, and return it if it doesn't give you the benefits you're hoping for.


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## gvl2016 (Feb 3, 2019)

Keep an eye on eBay, they pop up used there every now and then and there doesn't seem to be much demand. I got mine for under $50 I think. If nothing else, it is a handy Toslink to Coax SPDIF converter that I like to keep around. And it also comes with a 5V iPower wallwart you can re-purpose for other things.


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## InAnimaTed

Heads up most CCA's are exhibiting issues with Hi-res (over 48khz) audio streaming (since ~mid 2018) and Google is working on it. If anyone is experiencing this, please jump in this thread and send feedback from the Google Home app.


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## Zenithcric

Never heard any ‘issues’ with mine, and have three in different systems, with different DACs ... but figure all will die one day and wonder what my options will be for simple network streaming. Otherwise as Schiit would say “the music I have” satisfies me; may one day burn the interesting CDs (or resurrect my crates of vinyl) but no DLNA needs yet. I’ve at times used Apple TV gen 3 out via optical but Airplay’s been more wonky than GCA. Any suggestions for possible/ eventual replacements?


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## Ggroch (Feb 17, 2019)

RE: Any suggestions for possible/ eventual replacements?

While CCA is still available at higher prices on eBay. That will be the best choice for many for a while.

The most similar device I know of are the Linkplay system WiFi receivers.

One example is the Dayton Audio WBA31. This is the only WiFi Audio adapter I know of with Digital Optical Out.  You can get it under different names from China for less money (Like Here)  I do not know the quality of the Optical Out. That is, I have one and the Optical sounds great, but I do not know if it is bit perfect, or how it handles hi-res files.   These Linkplay devices do some but not all streaming services.

Amazon recently had a sale on the Echo Input at $20 (now not on sale). No Digital Out. Lacks some CCA streaming options. But, voice control which is nice.

I know of nothing that does everything the CCA does.


----------



## audiobomber

Zenithcric said:


> Never heard any ‘issues’ with mine, and have three in different systems, with different DACs ... but figure all will die one day and wonder what my options will be for simple network streaming. Otherwise as Schiit would say “the music I have” satisfies me; may one day burn the interesting CDs (or resurrect my crates of vinyl) but no DLNA needs yet. I’ve at times used Apple TV gen 3 out via optical but Airplay’s been more wonky than GCA. Any suggestions for possible/ eventual replacements?


Just for clarity, are you streaming DSD or hi-rez files (i.e. sample rates higher than 48kHz)?

I replaced Chromecast Audio with a Raspberry Pi 3 B+ and very happy with it. About double the cost but more reliable streaming for hi-rez and better SQ from USB with minor tweaking.


----------



## Zenithcric

Thanks!  So far no DSD or hi-rez stuff, the DACs i have with indicators never go above 48 ... but of course would like to sample some in the future ... which with three GCAs might be awhile, unless i get antsy for experimentation and try either of the above, or Tidal or now Qobuz. Anyone actually use the Dayton Audio for say, Spotify out the optical? I was just listening to one of the 20-something versions of Parsifal ... there’s a wealth of obsessive listening i’’m relieved from needing to purchase ...
Yeah, i guess i’m thinking of trying some high-rez streaming at some point, though i’m not sure my silver ears would hear a difference. I’m reminded of reading (somewhere) of a blind study that showed those tested couldn’t reliably tell the difference between SACD and standard. That said i thought i’d free up the optical input of my DAC by getting a mini-stereo Y and connecting the GCA  directly into the preamp; right away i preferred the Modi to the GCA’s internal. I have a mid/late 90s Denon DCMDCM-370 which has an “HDCD” decoder, and recall having listening joy, & looking up to see the HDCD indicator light on: “aha.” That player also has some hybrid multibit - DS DAC chip, and when i A-B between the player directly into the preamp’s CD input & the auxiliary input via coaxial out to the Modi — it’s not blind, since i know what i’m manually switching - but i cannot say i truly hear a difference. Score one for the old gear, or mourn the ears i don’t know ... i know i seem to be able to get used to almost anything but am often satisfied with none ... i just put on a burned “old “Yessongs”” DVD and was struck immediately that it sounded like utter crap ... but after having it on, basically as background, a half hour later i was into the music / performance ... count my blessings


----------



## audiobomber

Zenithcric said:


> Thanks!  So far no DSD or hi-rez stuff, the DACs i have with indicators never go above 48 ... but of course would like to sample some in the future


Yes, as I suspected. Playing 44/16 or 48/24 music through Chromecast Audio into an external DAC is reliable. It's only with high resolution files into an external DAC that it starts to drop out.

I know what you're saying about getting into the music even with a lower quality source. It's the music that is most important, not the means. However that doesn't stop me from tweaking and improving my systems. I'm an audiophile, it's my cross to bear.


----------



## Zenithcric

I followed that link Ggroch — that is one cheap Chi-Fi gadget, & yeah, looks like a Dayton, in fact those WBA31s are probably made there. I had looked into the Dayton, & the price (relative to the GCA) & the app dissuaded me ... & WhyTF does it have those never-heard-of-in-the-US Chinese streaming options?
Then i flashbacked to an Amazon review of a Pyle streamer that said 

“Upon booting this device immediately starts making network connections to servers in China. (I see connections to servers in Hangzhou and Beijing as well as servers owned by Baidu and Amazon in the US. Some of these are on tcp port 80 and others on 8020.) There is no warning about this in the documentation or on Pyle's web site, and no option to turn off these connections.
It is extremely unscrupulous for Pyle to do this. As long as your firewall allows outgoing connections, and almost all of them do, then this little agent can give those servers access to the local network. I expect (and hope) Pyle would claim this is something innocuous, but for all you know this device is opening your home network to foreign actors.”

Gotta wonder about the Dayton & it’s knock-off ... not only do i have that audio-obsessive thing going but a touch of paranoia to “boot” ...


----------



## Zenithcric

audiobomber said:


> However that doesn't stop me from tweaking and improving my systems. I'm an audiophile, it's my cross to bear.



Tell me about it. On the way to planning to tank my 90’s gear and so researching for what would be an end-game sys, starting with fresh speakers, i realized i have a daughter graduating from college, so guilted myself into more delayed gratification. $250 for Mimby is in the neighborhood of what i was thinking for speakers, then etc. etc. First the gift though. But a Vali 2 to play with would help hold me over ...


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## Ggroch (Feb 26, 2019)

I just spotted another possible CCA replacement.   The Nexum Tunebox2 TB20 WiFi Music Receiver has both Coaxial and Optical Digital Outputs (plus analog of course).  Costs $80...so more than CCA, but with a wood/leatherette/stainless steel exterior.

They also make a companion model TB21 that has analog inputs so you can transmit traditional sources into the system. Specs on both here. 

It is not clear to me what WiFi software system is in use, BUT, I see now they have been out since 2016. 

They make a WiFi Speaker called "Memo" that uses Linkplay/Alexa, but I do not think these Tunebox2 modules are compatible.

Still, Interesting.


----------



## Zenithcric

Thanks for the heads-up Ggroch. I have two stationary CCAs in systems ready to roll yet, and one that i manually move from one system to another, so that does leave a spot for this device; i can see myself eventually pulling the trigger for one, not so much out of immediate need, but out of curiosity, since i see it uses the same ES 9023 chip as my beloved Peachtree DAC-iTx.  No doubt with a different implementation — hence the curiosity.  Like my Modi 3 and SMSL S10 having the same AK4490 chip, at essentially the same price ($100 - $93); i thought i’d A-B them but pretty much chose not to hassle over it since the S10 has that very bedroom-friendly remote control. I wonder if, using different apps, Spotify & Amazon Music, i could stream the same music simultaneously to the CCA-Peachtree/ES 9023 and a Nexum TB20 straight from it’s 9023?  Since i have the mini—>stereo RCA cable. The same one i used to decide i preferred the CCA through the Peachtree, vs it’s own (older) AK chip. + like you pointed out, those digital outputs give the option to bypass that internal Sabre if i don’t love it. & despite my seeming plethora of listening locations i have no use for ‘whole house’ connectivity, and what’s the point of listening to vinyl in a different room? Something for someone else to play with i guess, like i do with moving stuff around ...


----------



## maxh22

This product is also a good chrome cast alternative: https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/223240674533

Plus it can store local files on a micro sd card.


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## Slater (Mar 1, 2019)

maxh22 said:


> This product is also a good chrome cast alternative: https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/223240674533
> 
> Plus it can store local files on a micro sd card.



That looks like a nice device. Besides the sdcard, support for AirPlay/iOS sells it for me.

I’m not saying the CCA is a bad device. But I was disappointed after buying CCA at the closeout price, only to find out iOS support (iTunes/Apple Music) is nonexistent.


----------



## Ggroch

maxh22 said:


> This product is also a good chrome cast alternative: https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/223240674533.



Yes, I pointed to this just a few posts up Here.  I have the same thing under the Ider brand name.  They are LinkPlay system devices...so if you search for Linkplay you will get more details.  Mine sounds fine, but there are very few spec available. For example, I have seen no discussion as to whether LinkPlay's Optical out is bit perfect like the CCA.

RE: Apple support.  Last week Google announced their assistants will be adding Apple Music as a streaming service. (Amazon did this last month).  Most probably CCA will get that too.  The LinkPlays do not do Apple Music so far as I can tell.


----------



## gwertheim

Do any of these replacement devices work within the Chromecast ecosystem? I am looking for a cheap roon alternative and I can't find anymore CCA's


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## gvl2016

And do they support Spotify Connect proper?


----------



## Slater

Ggroch said:


> RE: Apple support.  Last week Google announced their assistants will be adding Apple Music as a streaming service. (Amazon did this last month).  Most probably CCA will get that too



Now that is good news!


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## rkw (Mar 1, 2019)

Slater said:


> I was disappointed after buying CCA at the closeout price, *only to find out iOS support is nonexistent.*


In what way? The iOS versions of Tidal, Spotify, Qobuz and other apps support Google Cast. I can cast from iPhone/iPad to my CCA.


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## Slater (Mar 1, 2019)

rkw said:


> In what way? The iOS versions of Tidal, Spotify, Qobuz and other apps support Google Cast. I can cast from iPhone/iPad to my CCA.



iTunes/Apple Music

Sorry I didn’t name the distinction earlier. I edited my post above to clarify my previous statement.


----------



## Ggroch

Sadly, it now appears that the rumor Apple Music was coming to Google Home & possibly CCA was* false*. 

The above Dayton Audio/Ider Linkplay devices have Airplay (v1 not 2). Unlke CCA they also have a built in Bluetooth receiver, you can listen to anything that way, but it does not multi-room broadcast the Bluetooth signal. 

Linkplay and CCA can both play music stored on your device through DLNA.  This usually involves other apps like BubbleUpn on Android and Apps like this for IOS.  I do not have any IOS devices so I cannot say it works for sure. 

Amazon Echo Input now has Apple Music (but not Airplay). 

CCA/Echo/Linkplay devices do not see each other.   However, I believe that some apps, like Spotify, will let you broadcast to multiple device types simultaneously.


----------



## Zenithcric

Ggroch said:


> I just spotted another possible CCA replacement.   The Nexum Tunebox2 TB20 WiFi Music Receiver has both Coaxial and Optical Digital Outputs (plus analog of course).  Costs $80...so more than CCA, but with a wood/leatherette/stainless steel exterior.
> 
> They also make a companion model TB21 that has analog inputs so you can transmit traditional sources into the system. Specs on both here.
> 
> ...



Thanks again — interesting enough for me to order one; done this Friday morning, Amazon delivery by Sunday night, God willing ... whether i prefer it’s internal DAC analog out to my 2-channel systems i’ll find out; too curious, & so can’t wait to compare it’s same-ESS chip-as-my-Peachtree DAC iTx ... either way i see no reason why it wouldn’t stream like it’s supposed to, and that way i can leave my other CCAs where they are. I realized - duh - that with simultaneous outputs (if i read correctly) i could potentially do eight other A-B comparisons with the three other DACs i have, all of those in that $100 sweet spot for budget audio enthusiasts. Not sure i’ll go to all that hassle since i enjoy them where they are, but it’s possible ... If i ultimately get a Mimby though, the A-B function that this thing would seem to allow, vs say, my Modi 3, would be a necessary exercise ...

It seems you head-fi freaks have an obsessive streak — i won’t assault my wallet with updated cans until some other goals are achieved — but did you know Spotify can stream approx. 33 versions of Wagner’s “Parsifal” (not including excerpts, or the ‘42 Act III)??  Only two of which span 3 CDs; the vast majority encompass 4. There’s not enough lifetime ...  Thank God for my wallet that my son turned me on to streaming! as i’ve only 6 CD versions myself, but those (+ incomplete “bleeding chunks”) include one that’s not available to stream, & which i’m listening to now, on a used-for-$30 ‘91 CD player with a multibit DAC chip (BB PCM61) that i believe Mike Moffat was involved with developing back in the day.  I’m buffering it, since it sounded a bit dry/thin to me, through a $47 (with the ‘upgraded’ JAN 5654W tubes) FX-Audio Tube-01 preamplifier. (IMHO achieving a cheap Schiit house sound, sans Schiit itself, for the time being) listening via old, mid-90s Radio Shack Linaeum tweeter speakers, the signal first funneled through a no-name passive subwoofer, as the LX5’s range extend to only about 70Hz, + i don’t want to blow them with too much juice. I figured the FX-A was an immediate gratification way to make sure a Vali 2, at 3X the cost would do what i want — plug right into an extra, separate power amp, in an extra, cobbled together Frankensystem, and control the volume. The FX does, and sounds sweet, smoothing the digital burrs of historical recordings especially. I’ll presume the Vali will only be better, & w/ only one tube to roll.  I also got a $50 SYS to add to the options, since the amp has one set of RCA inputs; and discovered that for now i prefer the sound of my Modi 3 streaming directly, without the tube buffer; it’s clean and clear, and the SYS can attenuate the volume directly from the DAC on the through my also-early-90s Rotel RB-960BX.  From what i can see on the Head-Fi ‘New Member’ forum there are a lot of confessed budget audiophiles among us, and there’s no shame in the game of buying whatever our budget & other responsibilities permit. We all do it. Money is ever an object, for the vast majority of us i’d say. The challenge is to defer gratification & save for the Big Rig Fix. I’m trying to do that, but need to feed “the itch” too.  My next scratch should be the Vali 2. As a preamp. Before I pull the whole thing apart for a private HP rig ...  But my priority is an end-game 2 channel sys. I pity you can-obsessed audiophools


----------



## JamieMcC (Sep 12, 2019)

Picked up a new CCA of off ebay for £21 the other day been trying it out with different bits of kit in the house using Roon.

Having a lot of  fun pairing it with my Oppo PM3 plugged staight in to the CCAwith a battery power bank for power. Ive been roaming round the house, cooking, chilling out with in my pocket listening to tunes controlling with the roon app on my cell phone. For the price the performance has surprised ok not proper hifi but easily adequate for many other uses garage, bedroom, second system, kids room etc what a neat bit of kit


----------



## markbrauer

JamieMcC said:


> Picked up a new CCA of off ebay for £21 the other day been trying it out with different bits of kit in the house using Roon.
> 
> Having a lot of  fun pairing it with my Oppo PM3 plugged staight in to the CCAwith a battery power bank for power. Ive been roaming round the house, cooking, chilling out with in my pocket listening to tunes controlling with the roon app on my cell phone. For the price the performance has surprised ok not proper hifi but easily adequate for many other uses garage, bedroom, second system, kids room etc what a neat bit of kit


I too use my CCA as a streamer/headphone amp. I first mentioned it in this thread way back in Post #7.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chr...omment-on-sound-quality.782899/#post-11979624
It works extremely well with everything from 16 Ohm IEMs to the 300 Ohm Senheiser HD650, giving clean sound and more-than-adequate volume even on high dynamic range classical recordings. I keep it rubber-banded right to a battery power pack so it's "portable" - I can sit anywhere in the house, or out on the deck. I mostly use the Tidal HiFi app's built in cast function but also BubbleUPnP to cast files from my server. SQ from the CCA is not really that far off what I get from my desktop Burson DAC/amp fed by a Bluesound streamer. I also use the CCA when traveling, setting it up on the local WiFi. Much better headphone sound than I get straight out of my phone. BubbleUPnP even lets me stream my full-resolution backup files residing on Google Drive.


----------



## Xanthophyll (Sep 25, 2019)

markbrauer said:


> I too use my CCA as a streamer/headphone amp. I first mentioned it in this thread way back in Post #7.
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chr...omment-on-sound-quality.782899/#post-11979624
> It works extremely well with everything from 16 Ohm IEMs to the 300 Ohm Senheiser HD650, giving clean sound and more-than-adequate volume even on high dynamic range classical recordings. I keep it rubber-banded right to a battery power pack so it's "portable" - I can sit anywhere in the house, or out on the deck. I mostly use the Tidal HiFi app's built in cast function but also BubbleUPnP to cast files from my server. SQ from the CCA is not really that far off what I get from my desktop Burson DAC/amp fed by a Bluesound streamer. I also use the CCA when traveling, setting it up on the local WiFi. Much better headphone sound than I get straight out of my phone. BubbleUPnP even lets me stream my full-resolution backup files residing on Google Drive.



Jamie - this is a great idea and I'm very interested in hearing more about it.... As somebody who is brand new to this hobby....  Can I ask what may be perceived as a stupid question?    How do you control the volume?    (Sorry)


----------



## Ggroch (Sep 25, 2019)

Xanthophyll said:


> How do you control the volume?


  Perhaps Jamie will have a different answer...but the Chromecast Audio has a volume control.  It is accessible in the Google Home App, and probably also accessible from any other source app you would use, for example, I use Spotify to stream to the CCA, and I can control the volume from the Spotify app on my phone, or PC, or whatever else is the source.  

The hookups described above seem to use the CCA's analog output. But, the Optical Digital out also has volume control that you can use when feeding it to a DAC.


----------



## Xanthophyll

Ggroch said:


> Perhaps Jamie will have a different answer...but the Chromecast Audio has a volume control.  It is accessible in the Google Home App, and probably also accessible from any other source app you would use, for example, I use Spotify to stream to the CCA, and I can control the volume from the Spotify app on my phone, or PC, or whatever else is the source.
> 
> The hookups described above seem to use the CCA's analog output. But, the Optical Digital out also has volume control that you can use when feeding it to a DAC.




Ahh....that makes perfect sense.  Of course.     And I'm assuming if you're using the optical out, you will then obviously need a DAC *and* an amplifier, correct?    Thank you for replying Ggrouch, and helping a new guy out...!


----------



## JamieMcC (Sep 25, 2019)

Yes volume can be controlled via the Google Home App, I can also control the volume via my roon app.
 Volume control on both apps mirror each other so if I adjust on the roon app then the level on the Chromecast Home moves as well.

Yes need a dac if using optical. How ever don't be put off using a  headphone jack straight into the Chromecast its honestly surprisingly good. Just turn down the volume plug in your cans and adjust volume up to suit.


----------



## JamieMcC

Also you can use a 3.5 trs to 2 x rca so you can plug into a amp and use the CCA dac to provide analogue input  for your amplifier.






​


----------



## Ggroch

Just announced...a great speaker to connect to your Chromecast Audio's Optical Output!

The new Amazon Studio Smart Speaker has a toslink optical input!

Only sort of kidding.  With 5 drivers and built in auto-room equalization it is intriguing at $200 retail.


----------



## Slater (Sep 25, 2019)

Ggroch said:


> Just announced...a great speaker to connect to your Chromecast Audio's Optical Output!
> 
> The new Amazon Studio Smart Speaker has a toslink optical input!
> 
> Only sort of kidding.  With 5 drivers and built in auto-room equalization it is intriguing at $200 retail.



You can run 2 as a stereo pair. That’s pretty badass as a replacement for small bookshelf speakers.

I wonder how running a pair works if you’re planning on using the CCA toslink? Does they each connect together like a daisy chain?

On a side note, I personally wouldn’t trust the “mic off” button. I could see a scenario where the mics could get accessed remotely and turned on. If I ever got any sort of echo device, I’d open it up and disable/disconnect the microphones myself. Call me paranoid, but having been in IT security I’ve seen plenty of things that would make anyone paranoid lol


----------



## markbrauer (Sep 25, 2019)

Just a couple words about volume control. In most Android apps the hardware volume control uses at most 20 steps going from dead quiet to full loud. These same large steps are used when controlling the Chromecast Audio. This often results in one step being too quiet and the next too loud. If you control volume using the Google Home app you get the full 100 steps that the CCA is capable of, so you can set it to the exact level you want.


----------



## dosley01

Added this Music Hall 25.2 DAC to my CCA.  I feel no need to spend more on a streamer.  Sounding great!  These are a great deal on the used market around $200.


----------



## mobbaddict

Anybody experiencing playback issues on Spotify with the Chromecast audio? I've tried using an Android and an iPhone and I often have the same issue with both, tracks being skipped with no reason. I don't have any other streaming service to compare to so I don't know weather this is a Spotify issue or worse-the CCA OS getting all buggy.


----------



## gvl2016

Yeah, it can be temperamental. Lately I also noticed Spotify plays at a noticeably lower volume than say Tidal through the CCA at the 100% volume setting. There was also an issue recently when I couldn't play tracks from my library but those that were not in my library played fine. May also be a wi-fi problem.


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## mobbaddict (Jan 14, 2020)

gvl2016 said:


> Yeah, it can be temperamental. Lately I also noticed Spotify plays at a noticeably lower volume than say Tidal through the CCA at the 100% volume setting. There was also an issue recently when I couldn't play tracks from my library but those that were not in my library played fine. May also be a wi-fi problem.


I wonder if this has not to do with the guest mode. I deactivated it yesterday after posting and didn't have any issue after. I will test further tonight.

Edit: false trail...


----------



## Zenithcric

Thanks for keeping this thread alive, & reminding me of the CCA used in its simplest configuration —HP minijack stabbed straight into its dead-in-the-market heart! It’s been a long time since I did that, and you know, it doesn’t suck. I’m just enjoying music with it, which is what this is all about. & while it does sound different than what I’m used to, its a good thing. I decided long ago I preferred the CCA optical-out through any DAC i have in any two channel system I’ve configured, but this is fun. 

I have three CCA’s and am waiting on a fourth to hold in reserve, as it was a steal of a deal. The only strange thing that has happened was I thought two of them had utterly died, on the optical side: no red light, no sound. At least into my DACs. Knowing they were no longer being made, I had planned to replace them with Nexum’s Tunebox TB20s. Eventually I tried the CCAs again and after some spotty connections they’ve functioned just fine. I only plug them in when in use, hoping that will prolong their usable life. The TB20s are good sounding and more versatile, but I no longer see them on Amazon (or eBay), only the TB21 and I don’t need it’s star function, which is analog to digital conversion so that you can play vinyl in one room and stream that to a TB20 in another room or floor. 

I had a two channel system in an attic bedroom, but when my daughter moved back home from college I moved that down to my ‘sound cave’ in the basement and set up a parallel stereo system to compare the sound of the different tower speakers — since the TB20 has both an analog or optical output (like the CCA’s) and a digital coaxial I fed the optical to a Schiit Modi 3 on one side, and the coaxial to an SMSL S10 on the other. As i recall they sounded very similar; they both use the same AK4490 chip, though configured differently. I tried to keep this comparison as apples-to-apples as possible — & have two identical power amps which at another time were bridged mono, but for this back to stereo.  So the same music stream, simultaneously into two pairs of speakers, set next each other. I level matched the systems by ear and could listen to them both at once or one then the other, though to listen to a particular set I’d have to get up and hit the Schiit SYS that’s in one system to effectively mute that one. Then sit back down, etc. 
That was fun, and I learned that I wanted tone controls for the most recent speakers, but this — headphone right into a CCA listening to one of my found-on-Spotify favorites, Dieter piano trio “Parsifal” front to back, is also great fun!


----------



## Zenithcric

That’s Dieter Ilg, & he’s the bass player of the trio ... the piano player is good; the drummer very good IMHO. Ilg has a solo acoustic double bass album called simply “Bass” & it’s not boring, if you like the sound of that instrument ...


----------



## thamasha69

gvl2016 said:


> Yeah, it can be temperamental. Lately I also noticed Spotify plays at a noticeably lower volume than say Tidal through the CCA at the 100% volume setting. There was also an issue recently when I couldn't play tracks from my library but those that were not in my library played fine. May also be a wi-fi problem.



I have noticed Spotify play at a lower volume too thru the CCA. Seems to be an ongoing issue upon doing a Google search. I run an optical cable out of the CCA to a HifimeDIY S2 9038 DAC to my 2 channel stereo and I love the setup and sound but the low Spotify volume bugs me. Casting BubbleUPNP and Radio Paradise FLAC and there are no such issues. Does anyone know a fix or workaround?


----------



## rkw

InAnimaTed said:


> Heads up most CCA's are exhibiting issues with Hi-res (over 48khz) audio streaming (since ~mid 2018) and Google is working on it.





audiobomber said:


> Yes, as I suspected. Playing 44/16 or 48/24 music through Chromecast Audio into an external DAC is reliable. It's only with high resolution files into an external DAC that it starts to drop out.


Stuttering on hi-res streams has apparently been fixed with a recent firmware update: https://support.google.com/chromecast/thread/5205344
I followed instructions to update the firmware by doing a factory reset and joining the Preview Program, but the support post said it may take a couple of days for the update to be pushed to the device. The product was discontinued over a year ago and I'm pleasantly surprised that they continued to work on it.


----------



## audiobomber (Mar 6, 2020)

rkw said:


> Stuttering on hi-res streams has apparently been fixed with a recent firmware update: https://support.google.com/chromecast/thread/5205344
> I followed instructions to update the firmware by doing a factory reset and joining the Preview Program, but the support post said it may take a couple of days for the update to be pushed to the device. The product was discontinued over a year ago and I'm pleasantly surprised that they continued to work on it.


I attempted to update my two Chromecast Audio devices. Factory Reboot on the first CCA worked fine, still has the older firmware, hopefully will be updated in a couple of days as you stated.

The second CCA took the Factory Reset, but now I can't set it up again. The Home app finds the device but stalls on the "Connecting To Chromecast Audio" screen. I disconnected and powered it up again, no luck. I tried the manual reset button with the same result. I brought it downstairs and connected it in place of the first CCA, no joy.

I cannot see Preview Program in my Home app. I don't know what to do next. I really need that second CCA. So disappointing that they discontinued this amazing little dongle. I'd buy another in a heartbeat.

EDIT: Chatted with Google Service. He had me connect my Android phone directly to the Chromecast Audio device instead of my home network for the setup. All good now.


----------



## bode

audiobomber said:


> Android phone directly to the Chromecast Audio



How do you avoid the network? I can't connect my CC to the office wifi due to softAP not allowing shared access.


----------



## audiobomber

bode said:


> How do you avoid the network? I can't connect my CC to the office wifi due to softAP not allowing shared access.


When CCA is searching for a host during setup, it broadcasts an IP address. Disconnect your phone from the wi-fi network and connect directly to the CCA IP address. After you finish setup, it asks to link with wi-fi. I don't know if you can ignore that step and continue to control Chromecast from your phone. I've had enough trouble for today, not going to try it.


----------



## Slater

bode said:


> How do you avoid the network? I can't connect my CC to the office wifi due to softAP not allowing shared access.



Just bring your friendly IT Network Admin a couple cases of a nice craft beer or a bottle of bourbon and show them the CCA and nicely explain what you want to do. I’m sure they’ll be able to get you all set up on the DL


----------



## al2813

Hi, I have been using a CCA as my main streamer (Deezer Hifi and FLACs from my NAS). CCA is connected over optical to a Topping D50s NAS. A couple of weeks ago I took a Mac Mini that I had around and connected it over USB to the D50s playing both the FLACs (using Audirvana test account) and Deezer deskstop client. I A/Bed the two options and to my not very objective ears, the Mini sounded better. This is killing me since from a usability perspective CCA is much better for me (I can operate everything from my iPhone at ease). Last night I powered the CCA with my powerbank which is already powering the D50s (I have two USB outs and enough power for both). I believe this has resulted in an improvement, although I still need to A/B with the Mac mini. 

Am curious to see of other folks reached the same conclusions with the CCA. If they looked for ways to improve the SQ on CCA or what can be an alternative not so expensive source.


----------



## mobbaddict

al2813 said:


> Hi, I have been using a CCA as my main streamer (Deezer Hifi and FLACs from my NAS). CCA is connected over optical to a Topping D50s NAS. A couple of weeks ago I took a Mac Mini that I had around and connected it over USB to the D50s playing both the FLACs (using Audirvana test account) and Deezer deskstop client. I A/Bed the two options and to my not very objective ears, the Mini sounded better. This is killing me since from a usability perspective CCA is much better for me (I can operate everything from my iPhone at ease). Last night I powered the CCA with my powerbank which is already powering the D50s (I have two USB outs and enough power for both). I believe this has resulted in an improvement, although I still need to A/B with the Mac mini.
> 
> Am curious to see of other folks reached the same conclusions with the CCA. If they looked for ways to improve the SQ on CCA or what can be an alternative not so expensive source.


To be honest I can barely distinguish the CCA's analog output from its optical output connected to my K5 pro. So I'm surprised you can spot the difference using optical only. Can you try a blind test?


----------



## markbrauer

mobbaddict said:


> To be honest I can barely distinguish the CCA's analog output from its optical output connected to my K5 pro. So I'm surprised you can spot the difference using optical only. Can you try a blind test?


I have found the CCA analog output sounds great connected to some devices and decidedly second rate connected to others. A good example of how important component matching is. The optical output is indistinguishable from two other (much more expensive) streamers I own.


----------



## markbrauer (Apr 14, 2020)

al2813 said:


> Hi, I have been using a CCA as my main streamer (Deezer Hifi and FLACs from my NAS). CCA is connected over optical to a Topping D50s NAS. A couple of weeks ago I took a Mac Mini that I had around and connected it over USB to the D50s playing both the FLACs (using Audirvana test account) and Deezer deskstop client. I A/Bed the two options and to my not very objective ears, the Mini sounded better. This is killing me since from a usability perspective CCA is much better for me (I can operate everything from my iPhone at ease). Last night I powered the CCA with my powerbank which is already powering the D50s (I have two USB outs and enough power for both). I believe this has resulted in an improvement, although I still need to A/B with the Mac mini.
> 
> Am curious to see of other folks reached the same conclusions with the CCA. If they looked for ways to improve the SQ on CCA or what can be an alternative not so expensive source.



I have a streamer with both optical and USB outputs. My DAC has both optical and USB inputs. The USB definitely sounds better. Is it the streamer or the DAC causing the difference? I can't say for sure but USB is the preferred option. Many implementations of Toslink optical are reported to have SQ problems, usually related to jitter.

I have often powered my CCA with a powerbank and I think the sound quality is slightly better. If you have "noise" on your AC lines it can get through the wall wart power supply and cause jitter problems. Battery power, or a quieter power supply could help.


----------



## al2813

markbrauer said:


> I have a streamer with both optical and USB outputs. My DAC has both optical and USB inputs. The USB definitely sounds better. Is it the streamer or the DAC causing the difference? I can't say for sure but USB is the preferred option. Many implementations of Toslink optical are reported to have SQ problems, usually related to jitter.
> 
> I have often powered my CCA with a powerbank and I think the sound quality is slightly better. If you have "noise" on your AC lines it can get through the wall wart power supply and cause jitter problems. Battery power, or a quieter power supply could help.



Thanks for the feedback. I think indeed USB sounds better. I think I will get a Raspberry pi and play a bit with it.


----------



## rkw

al2813 said:


> Hi, I have been using a CCA as my main streamer (Deezer Hifi and FLACs from my NAS). CCA is connected over optical to a Topping D50s NAS. A couple of weeks ago I took a Mac Mini that I had around and connected it over USB to the D50s playing both the FLACs (using Audirvana test account) and Deezer deskstop client. I A/Bed the two options and to my not very objective ears, the Mini sounded better. This is killing me since from a usability perspective CCA is much better for me (I can operate everything from my iPhone at ease). Last night I powered the CCA with my powerbank which is already powering the D50s (I have two USB outs and enough power for both). I believe this has resulted in an improvement, although I still need to A/B with the Mac mini.
> 
> Am curious to see of other folks reached the same conclusions with the CCA. If they looked for ways to improve the SQ on CCA or what can be an alternative not so expensive source.


Some streaming services stream at lower quality in Chromecast. Spotify streams up to 320 Kbps Ogg Vorbis but their Chromecast streaming is 256 Kbps AAC.

For many years, CD quality streaming on Deezer was only on the desktop app (streaming on mobile and web player was only 320 mp3). Last year Deezer finally made CD quality available on mobile. It is possible that Deezer does not offer full quality on Chromecast.


----------



## audiobomber

markbrauer said:


> I have a streamer with both optical and USB outputs. My DAC has both optical and USB inputs. The USB definitely sounds better. Is it the streamer or the DAC causing the difference? I can't say for sure but USB is the preferred option. Many implementations of Toslink optical are reported to have SQ problems, usually related to jitter.
> 
> I have often powered my CCA with a powerbank and I think the sound quality is slightly better. If you have "noise" on your AC lines it can get through the wall wart power supply and cause jitter problems. Battery power, or a quieter power supply could help.


I use an SOTM SMS-200 Neo and CCA in my main system. Both are powered by linear power supplies, with conversion via an Audiolab DAC. CCA is connected via glass Toslink cable, SMS is USB. There is a clear difference in audio quality, both playing zero compression FLAC files at CD to 96/24 resolution. USB beats Toslink on my DAC, but the streamer does matter. Regardless, the little CCA is a miracle for the price. I have two now, with a third on the way.


----------



## rkw

InAnimaTed said:


> Heads up most CCA's are exhibiting issues with Hi-res (over 48khz) audio streaming (since ~mid 2018) and Google is working on it. If anyone is experiencing this, please jump in this thread and send feedback from the Google Home app.





rkw said:


> Stuttering on hi-res streams has apparently been fixed with a recent firmware update: https://support.google.com/chromecast/thread/5205344
> I followed instructions to update the firmware by doing a factory reset and joining the Preview Program, but the support post said it may take a couple of days for the update to be pushed to the device. The product was discontinued over a year ago and I'm pleasantly surprised that they continued to work on it.


Follow up...
My firmware never got updated (still stuck at version 1.42.172094, fixed version is supposed to be 1.44.185164). I searched the web and could not find a single user who said they received the update. In the past couple of months, two separate Google support threads on the topic have become closed to new posts.

Unfortunately, the realistic conclusion is that the update was never released to the public and nothing will be forthcoming.


----------



## audiobomber

rkw said:


> Follow up...
> My firmware never got updated (still stuck at version 1.42.172094, fixed version is supposed to be 1.44.185164). I searched the web and could not find a single user who said they received the update. In the past couple of months, two separate Google support threads on the topic have become closed to new posts.
> 
> Unfortunately, the realistic conclusion is that the update was never released to the public and nothing will be forthcoming.


I believe you are correct. I jumped through all the Settings hoops they described in Home and CCA; still 1.42, no firmware update.


----------



## Slater

rkw said:


> Follow up...
> My firmware never got updated (still stuck at version 1.42.172094, fixed version is supposed to be 1.44.185164). I searched the web and could not find a single user who said they received the update. In the past couple of months, two separate Google support threads on the topic have become closed to new posts.
> 
> Unfortunately, the realistic conclusion is that the update was never released to the public and nothing will be forthcoming.



Yeah, that’s bullcrap. My (2) CCAs have been stuck on that 1.42 version for a while. Nothing I do updates them to 1.44 (at least not in the app).

I’d love to find a way to update them; perhaps directly connected USB to a computer?


----------



## audiobomber

I found this, but I don't have time to play around with CCA now.


----------



## Slater (Apr 14, 2020)

I tried the method in that video (which is also the defacto method cited all over the web), and I get a 403 error.

Apparently, Google did an update and broke the remote command functionality (at least on port 8008).

Details are here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Chromecast/comments/c8msan/reboot_api_removedrestricted_403_forbidden_with/

The last comment on that Reddit thread pointed to this Github thread: https://github.com/rithvikvibhu/GHLocalApi/issues/39

In that thread, a user posted this curious tidbit (https://github.com/rithvikvibhu/GHLocalApi/issues/39#issuecomment-533307194):

"_ive got build version 1.42.168007 and i dont need to send any auth token, just need to use insecure flag. all commands previously used with 8008 needs to be done to 8443 and https, but no token required._"

So previously, the Powershell command was:

*Invoke-WebRequest -Method Post -ContentType "application/json" -Body '{"params": "ota foreground"}' -Uri "http://xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx:8008/setup/reboot" -Verbose -UserAgent "curl"*

and now according to that guy it's:

*Invoke-WebRequest -Method Post -ContentType "application/json" -Body '{"params": "ota foreground"}' -Uri "https://xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx:8443/setup/reboot" -Verbose -UserAgent "curl"*

Note the change from http to https and port 8008 to port 8443.

However, I am not a Powershell expert and I am unsure how to implement the curl insecure flag as it pertains to curl via Powershell (ie how the guy said "_just need to use insecure flag")._

So the bottom line is that hopefully someone could take the info I dug out so far and figure out the rest as we should be really close...

I will also add that I've seen it recommended to be on "Preview" firmware builds (by going to Settings - Preview). Supposedly, that always forces the latest firmware updates. It may be the best way to force the update to 1.44.185164. However, as @markbrauer pointed out below, that can also break as many things as it fixes).


----------



## markbrauer

audiobomber said:


> I believe you are correct. I jumped through all the Settings hoops they described in Home and CCA; still 1.42, no firmware update.


I too am at 1.42.172094. To me there were 2 critical Chromecast Audio updates. One back a couple of years ago ruined the Chromecast. After that update, the Toslink output developed  intermittent dropouts when streaming 96/24 files. I reported the issue a number of times and there are many threads where you can confirm users started reporting this as a problem. It may or may not have been limited to ESS Sabre Dacs. Prior to that update 96/24 Toslink was no problem (it always continued to work without dropouts on the internal Chromecast DAC). I had given up on this ever being fixed. And then a few months ago 96/24 started working perfectly again. I do not know what the update versions they were, but I'm happy where I am, and fearful that any future updates could cause problems.


----------



## thamasha69

thamasha69 said:


> I have noticed Spotify play at a lower volume too thru the CCA. Seems to be an ongoing issue upon doing a Google search. I run an optical cable out of the CCA to a HifimeDIY S2 9038 DAC to my 2 channel stereo and I love the setup and sound but the low Spotify volume bugs me. Casting BubbleUPNP and Radio Paradise FLAC and there are no such issues. Does anyone know a fix or workaround?



Just wanted to report back on this, issue has been resolved:

https://community.spotify.com/t5/On...e-casting-with-Chromecast-Audio/idi-p/4890085

I have tested and volume is no longer attenuated (??) like it was prior and sounds much better. 

The CCA outputting to my HifiMeDIY 9038 is the only source I have connected to my 2 channel stereo and I love having access to all my tunes streaming and controlled via a repurposed Android device. Still have not seen later updates to the CCA as others have mentioned.


----------



## al2813

I moved to Deezer Hifi from Qobuz due to catalogue issues. As I am moving away from bluesound (separate discussion to be had here), I have been relying on CCA as my streamer connected over Toslink to my DAC (Topping D50s). After numerous testing against a mac mini streaming Qobuz with Audirvana, and a RPI streaming Qobuz with Volumio - both over USB, I could not find any major difference in SQ on my setup. What made it for me with the CCA was switching from the default delivered power supply (USB charger + cable) to a powerbank. This gave the CCA the bit of extra clean sound I was looking for. 

Obviously I will be revisiting this, but for now, I am concentrated on improving SQ on my core setup (currently looking at upgrading speakers).


----------



## markbrauer

al2813 said:


> I moved to Deezer Hifi from Qobuz due to catalogue issues. As I am moving away from bluesound (separate discussion to be had here), I have been relying on CCA as my streamer connected over Toslink to my DAC (Topping D50s). After numerous testing against a mac mini streaming Qobuz with Audirvana, and a RPI streaming Qobuz with Volumio - both over USB, I could not find any major difference in SQ on my setup. What made it for me with the CCA was switching from the default delivered power supply (USB charger + cable) to a powerbank. This gave the CCA the bit of extra clean sound I was looking for.
> 
> Obviously I will be revisiting this, but for now, I am concentrated on improving SQ on my core setup (currently looking at upgrading speakers).


The only gripe I have against the CCA is its lack of gapless playback. SQ is indeed great, especially with a powerbank. But too many of my favorite albums require gapless and my core setup delivers. So the CCAs are only suitable for secondary systems.


----------



## thamasha69

Anyone have their CCA connected via ethernet a'la:

https://darko.audio/2018/07/letters-to-the-editor-3-ways-to-juice-your-chromecast-audio/

Mine is exclusively connected via ethernet, have not tested over WiFi to determine if there is a sonic benefit, but I like the idea. Have not upgraded powersupply, just using an Amazon Basics USB charger. Outputting optical to my DAC. Considering maybe upgrading power supplies for both the CCA and the DAC as they are my only connected source to my stereo .


----------



## 474194

I moved on from the CCA after a few weeks of testing, but if anyone experiments with the Ciunas Supercapacitor Power Supply please tag me.

Basically, Powerbank -> Supercapacitor -> CCA

https://www.ciunas.biz/product-page/copy-of-supercapacitor-power-supply-dual-voltage-outputs


----------



## visanj

I bought chromecast audio recently (quiet expensive though as its very rare). I plugged in my Brainwavz B400 earphones and disabled High Dynamic Range

Sound quality is really good even for 90 eur device. sound is very open, superior soundstage and bit on warmer side.  also when compared to ibasso DC01 this is the only source where I felt real sonic difference in hi-res files. hi-res files via ibasso DC01 was not all good, may be something to do with android settings. 

Quiet happy with chromecast audio.


----------



## audiobomber

Anyone else noticed that Chromecast Audio no longer has trouble casting hi-rez files optically to an outboard DAC?


----------



## markbrauer

visanj said:


> I bought chromecast audio recently...
> Quiet happy with chromecast audio.



Visanj,
I'm thinking you must have meant that you *enabled* High Dynamic Range, to get the best sound quality.

As I have said in earlier posts, I am a big proponent of using the Chromecast Audio as an all-in-one streamer/DAC/headphone amp - with headphones plugged directly into its 3.5mm output. Used that way, the sound quality is very near as good as my $1500 desktop setup, which includes a standalone streamer and a combo DAC/amp. The only place it falls down a notch is on very loud orchestral music and aggressively-played solo piano, where there could be some distortion and smearing of the sound. Typical recordings of jazz, pop, acoustic, chamber music, etc are all reproduced with no issues.

I have usually powered my CCA with a battery powerbank, feeling that it made for a slightly cleaner sound. Being the CCA came with a 1 amp "wall wart", I always used a 1 amp powerbank. Recently I had occasion to use a powerbank rated to provide 2.4 amps and I was somewhat shocked to find out the loud-passage distortion was eliminated. Evidently the CCA can draw more than 1 amp when called upon to deal with difficult passages. I listened to nothing else for a full week, with a wide variety of music, and never heard a problem. When I went back to my desktop system I did not notice any great improvement. The CCA really shines when more amperage is available.

Now, I realize that synergy between amp and headphone can have a big effect on SQ, but I find the CCA does work well with the half-dozen headphones I have used with it, varying from 16 to 300 Ohms. So YMMV. On the other hand, I find the audio output of the CCA exhibits no synergy with any of the amps I have used it with.  Sound quality, while listenable, is unremarkable. I suspect it has to do with an impedance mismatch or somesuch. As many others have pointed out, the SQ when using the optical output with an external DAC is great.

I honestly feel that, SQ-wise, the CCA could suffice as my only "system". What it lacks is the ability to do gapless playback. That's a dealbreaker for me.

Happy listening


----------



## mobbaddict

markbrauer said:


> Now, I realize that synergy between amp and headphone can have a big effect on SQ, but I find the CCA does work well with the half-dozen headphones I have used with it, varying from 16 to 300 Ohms. So YMMV. On the other hand, I find the audio output of the CCA exhibits no synergy with any of the amps I have used it with.  Sound quality, while listenable, is unremarkable. I suspect it has to do with an impedance mismatch or somesuch. As many others have pointed out, the SQ when using the optical output with an external DAC is great.Happy listening


Yes the chromecast audio apparently has a 34 ohm impedance which is quite high for planars for instance:
http://archimago.blogspot.com/2016/02/measurements-google-chromecast-audio.html
It sounded a bit strange with my 16 ohm Quad Era-1. It should work fine with high impedance headphones on the other hand.


----------



## markbrauer (Jun 5, 2020)

audiobomber said:


> Anyone else noticed that Chromecast Audio no longer has trouble casting hi-rez files optically to an outboard DAC?


Yes, thankfully they finally fixed that issue.

I looked back and found that Google was getting complaints about this as far back as 2016. It was sometime in 2019 that it finally started working again for me.


----------



## rkw

audiobomber said:


> Anyone else noticed that Chromecast Audio no longer has trouble casting hi-rez files optically to an outboard DAC?





markbrauer said:


> Yes, thankfully they finally fixed that issue.


What music player are you using? It still stutters for me if I cast from the Qobuz app at 24/96. No problem at 16/44 (well, except for gapless ).

Also, my firmware never updated and has remained at 1.42.172094.


----------



## audiobomber (Jun 5, 2020)

rkw said:


> What music player are you using? It still stutters for me if I cast from the Qobuz app at 24/96. No problem at 16/44 (well, except for gapless ).
> 
> Also, my firmware never updated and has remained at 1.42.172094.


Firmware is the same here. I use Bubblesoft, QNAP Music Station and QNAP QMusic music controllers, via DLNA/MPD from a QNAP NAS to my DAC's (Audiolab 8200CD, Schiit Modi 3, iFi nano iOne).

I have a lot of LP's ripped to 24/88.2 and a handful of DSD files, that play with no dropouts.


----------



## markbrauer

rkw said:


> What music player are you using? It still stutters for me if I cast from the Qobuz app at 24/96. No problem at 16/44 (well, except for gapless ).
> 
> Also, my firmware never updated and has remained at 1.42.172094.


Mine CCA firmware is also at 1.42.172094. I use BubbleUPnP to play high-res files from my server. I also use and app called Hi-Fi Cast to play high-res files from my phone. It sets up the phone as the "server" and casts bit perfect over local WiFi to the CCA.  Both of these play 24/96 with no dropouts. Finally, I use Tidal but my understanding is that their streamed file size maxes out at 24/48, so not a true test. (I have never been able to do dropout-free streaming of 24/192 files to the Chromecast or either of my other 2 streamers. I blame the local network.)


----------



## c4sadler

Is there anything that replaces Chromecast Audio?


----------



## audiobomber

c4sadler said:


> Is there anything that replaces Chromecast Audio?


Nothing I've seen, certainly nothing from Google.


----------



## rkw

c4sadler said:


> Is there anything that replaces Chromecast Audio?


There won't be a replacement. It never became popular, and the market and industry have gone in the direction of smart speakers.


----------



## mobbaddict

rkw said:


> There won't be a replacement. It never became popular, and the market and industry have gone in the direction of smart speakers.


What is very strange is that the headphone market is the only one where all manufacturers seem to ignore the Google cast technology. On the other hand it's easy to find speaker amps with Chromecast built in.


----------



## dosley01

c4sadler said:


> Is there anything that replaces Chromecast Audio?



Just started using this setup so that I can cast Spotify from my Macbook without having to go through my phone.  Firestick -> HDMI Audio Extractor -> SPDIF -> DAC.


----------



## rkw

dosley01 said:


> Just started using this setup so that I can cast Spotify from my Macbook without having to go through my phone.  Firestick -> HDMI Audio Extractor -> SPDIF -> DAC.


It is also possible to do a similar setup using the regular (TV) version of Chromecast. Definitely a workaround compared to Chromecast Audio.


----------



## SCOTTBALL

Wow I didn't even realise the Chromecast Audio was phased out. I bought one a while back to attach to my amp just as an easy way for people to connect spotify and I really liked it (of course turn the high dynamic range option on)


----------



## markbrauer

Seeing that the title of this thread indicates it is about sound quality, the posts about using a video streamer got me wondering what audio bitrate is passed through the HDMI output of such a device. I found this Roon thread that indicates the maximum audio bitrate out of a video Chromecast is 24/48. 
https://community.roonlabs.com/t/chromecast-sample-rates/45615
I know that the HDMI spec allows for much a higher audio bitrate so maybe the Fire TV device is different? 
I also ran into an article which indicated that some HDMI audio extractor devices can alter the bitrate.
I know that none of this matters one bit (pun intended!) when streaming Spotify, or 16/44 "CD quality" for that matter. I'm just being curious.


----------



## dosley01

markbrauer said:


> Seeing that the title of this thread indicates it is about sound quality, the posts about using a video streamer got me wondering what audio bitrate is passed through the HDMI output of such a device. I found this Roon thread that indicates the maximum audio bitrate out of a video Chromecast is 24/48.
> https://community.roonlabs.com/t/chromecast-sample-rates/45615
> I know that the HDMI spec allows for much a higher audio bitrate so maybe the Fire TV device is different?
> I also ran into an article which indicated that some HDMI audio extractor devices can alter the bitrate.
> I know that none of this matters one bit (pun intended!) when streaming Spotify, or 16/44 "CD quality" for that matter. I'm just being curious.



I can't comment since I really only need Spotify support, but I do find it interesting that Amazon's HD music service isn't supported on the Firestick.  At some point I might cave and buy a Echo Link but I'm a big fan of Spotify's Discovery algorithm, I've found so much new music that I can't imagine I would have ever listened to.


----------



## markbrauer

dosley01 said:


> At some point I might cave and buy a Echo Link...


I did buy an Echo Input (when some "refurbished" units were selling for $10) to assess its viability as a general purpose music streamer and specifically as a Chromecast Audio replacement. The SQ seemed OK, maybe even on par with the Chromecast. Analog only - no optical output. At the same time I signed up to trial Amazon Music HD. The Amazon Music app will cast to the Echo but the app's interface is awful. The Echo does not support casting directly from the Spotify app or the Tidal app. One must install "skills" for those services in the Alexa app and then use voice commands to play music. There is no way to browse or search. I quickly found out that Alexa isn't very "smart". Once I figured how to set Tidal as the default for Music, I spoke "play beethoven piano sonata number 23 by alicia silverstein" in an attempt to stream one of my favorites for checking sound quality. Alexa played something by a group called "silverstein". I tried various permutations on the request with no success and finally gave up. 

I also looked into ways to stream from my own server and, while evidently possible, the recommended way is to install Plex server on my network and set up the Plex "skill" in Alexa. It was not clear whether I could cast directly from the Plex app. And I doubt that Alexa would understand complicated vocal requests any better in that scenario. I was not willing to go the effort to find out.

WIth these and other issues I ran into, I never really was able to assess the SQ of the Alexa Input other than to say "it seemed OK". I found that playing music I wanted to hear was next to impossible.

With its digital coaxial and optical outputs I would expect the Echo Link to deliver good SQ, but with all the issues around streaming from anywhere but Amazon, not to mention its cost, I would definitely avoid it.


----------



## rkw

markbrauer said:


> With its digital coaxial and optical outputs I would expect the Echo Link to deliver good SQ, but with all the issues around streaming from anywhere but Amazon, not to mention its cost, I would definitely avoid it.


The information I see on the web is that Echo Link supports Spotify Connect. But it seems that it doesn't even support their own Amazon Music UHD yet at hi-res (24/96).


----------



## mobbaddict (Jun 8, 2020)

rkw said:


> What music player are you using? It still stutters for me if I cast from the Qobuz app at 24/96. No problem at 16/44 (well, except for gapless ).
> 
> Also, my firmware never updated and has remained at 1.42.172094.


I have this one too, it's the current production firmware. *1.44.185164* is the preview firmware, you can try to subscribe here
https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/7124014?hl=en


----------



## Slater

mobbaddict said:


> I have this one too, it's the current production firmware. *1.44.185164* is the preview firmware, you can try to subscribe here
> https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/7124014?hl=en



I’ve had the preview firmware selected since I got mine, and it’s never updated to 1.44.

I’ve reset and rebooted a billion times. At this point, I think it’s a bug where no one has 1.44.


----------



## rkw

mobbaddict said:


> *1.44.185164* is the preview firmware, you can try to subscribe here
> https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/7124014?hl=en


This was discussed earlier in the thread (beginning post #467). Several of us joined the preview program but none of us ever received the update. On the Google support forums also nobody was receiving the update. I searched the web and could not find a single customer who reported receiving the preview firmware. There are several Google support threads on this topic and they have all been closed to new posts, which may mean that Google has ended support for Chromecast Audio.


----------



## markbrauer (Jun 9, 2020)

It could be your specific DAC chip.

I first started experiencing dropouts on Toslink back in June of 2016. They were servere, happening on all formats and bitrates from 192 Kbps MP3s to 24/96 FLAC and WAV. I followed complaints on the Google support forum and other forums and started to notice a pattern. Most of the issues were related to DACs using ESS Sabre chips. There were a few users reporting dropouts with other DAC chips, but not too many. By November 2016 there was no resolution to the problem and the various threads seemed dead so I tried to wake things up by posting this.
https://support.google.com/chromecast/forum/AAAAt7PFQG4NxI-KjqRVKA/?hl=en&gpf=#!topic/chromecast/NxI-KjqRVKA;context-place=forum/chromecast
I'm not sure my complaint had any effect but somewhere along the way the dropout issue was "fixed" for MP3 and 16/44 playback. It took until sometime in 2019 for the fix to hi-res streaming to show up.

So it seems entirely possible that the dropouts some are experiencing has to do with their particular DAC?

Now, I only know enough about this stuff to be considered dangerous, but I believe there is an "optical interface", a device that sits in front of the DAC chip that converts the Toslink light pulses to a electronic S/PDIF signal which goes to the DAC chip. If I am correct about this it seems the dropouts could be related to that conversion device.

Here are links to a couple of the threads from back in 2016 where other DAC chips are mentioned
https://support.google.com/chromeca...ontext-place=topicsearchin/chromecast/ESS9018

https://support.google.com/chromeca...st/DVSee-AfPDY;context-place=forum/chromecast


----------



## audiobomber (Jun 9, 2020)

Chromecast Audio is known to have elevated jitter with a high resolution stream. I had dropouts streaming hi-rez files from a NAS to Chromecast Audio, via Tosink to an iFi nano iOne. The iOne uses a Burr-Brown DAC chip, not Sabre .

My main DAC is an Audiolab with Sabre 9018 Pro chips. The Audiolab DAC has a feature that allows the user to select how much input jitter the DAC will accept: Auto, Low, Medium or High. According to the Audiolab manual, the level of jitter a DAC will tolerate is a design decision, but settings that accept higher jitter sources negatively impact sound quality. Changing the digital input tolerance from default "Auto" to "Medium" eliminated the dropouts.

But all this is history for me. The Audiolab is back to its default jitter setting, and I have no more ticks, dropouts or lockups with either DAC, nor with a Modi 3. It is my firm opinion that Google resolved the issue, and did not bother to update the firmware version. 

For anyone still experiencing casting problems, I would be looking at network strength. Maybe you need to move Chromecast or your router for better reception, or buy a more powerful router or a network extender.


----------



## markbrauer

"Maybe you need to move Chromecast or your router for better reception."

Indeed, just the other day I took my battery-powered Chromecast out on my deck, plugged in my headphones, and immediately experienced constant dropouts. The router is less than 20 feet away. Fortunately I only had to move the Chromecast about 10 inches to achieve perfect reception.


----------



## iFi audio

audiobomber said:


> The iOne uses a Burr-Brown DAC chip, not Sabre



That's factual, yup.


----------



## visanj

markbrauer said:


> Visanj,
> I'm thinking you must have meant that you *enabled* High Dynamic Range, to get the best sound quality.
> 
> As I have said in earlier posts, I am a big proponent of using the Chromecast Audio as an all-in-one streamer/DAC/headphone amp - with headphones plugged directly into its 3.5mm output. Used that way, the sound quality is very near as good as my $1500 desktop setup, which includes a standalone streamer and a combo DAC/amp. The only place it falls down a notch is on very loud orchestral music and aggressively-played solo piano, where there could be some distortion and smearing of the sound. Typical recordings of jazz, pop, acoustic, chamber music, etc are all reproduced with no issues.
> ...



No. HDR is disabled. I'm scared to enable it as I'm using IEMs and it says clearly that HDR is for good Amplifiers/AV Receivers. so I don't know how it sounds if I enable it. I just like it the way how it is. 

Regarding sound quality, after more listening,  the words coming to my mind is 'Open', 'Strong', 'Hard', 'Raw', 'Dry but not analytical'. I'm very happy with the sound quality. Now since corona times I don't have office commute. But when I have office commute I will seriously miss chromecast audio. My so called good bluetooth headphones Sony WH1000XM3, Sennheiser Momentum True Wireless are lying in dust


----------



## cmrheadphones

I am experimenting with a CCA as headphone amp. Apart from nearly being deafened and then learning to control the volume it works very well with my ATH-M50x's. I use them with the 3.5mm output and a new 1000mah powerbank. I am still experimenting and wondering if I dac would be needed. Would it be possible to use it with the apple 3.5mm to usb c dongle and then connect that to my phone - or have I totally lost the plot!?


----------



## rkw

cmrheadphones said:


> Would it be possible to use it with the apple 3.5mm to usb c dongle and then connect that to my phone - or have I totally lost the plot!?


I don't understand what you want to accomplish.

If you want to use the CCA with your iPhone while you are mobile, you can turn on the wifi hotspot on your phone, and the CCA can connect to it. See the discussion starting post #316. Personally, I would use instead a Bluetooth receiver as discussed in this thread.


----------



## exander

al2813 said:


> I moved to Deezer Hifi from Qobuz due to catalogue issues. As I am moving away from bluesound (separate discussion to be had here), I have been relying on CCA as my streamer connected over Toslink to my DAC (Topping D50s). After numerous testing against a mac mini streaming Qobuz with Audirvana, and a RPI streaming Qobuz with Volumio - both over USB, I could not find any major difference in SQ on my setup. What made it for me with the CCA was switching from the default delivered power supply (USB charger + cable) to a powerbank. This gave the CCA the bit of extra clean sound I was looking for.
> 
> Obviously I will be revisiting this, but for now, I am concentrated on improving SQ on my core setup (currently looking at upgrading speakers).



What power bank are you using?


----------



## stephenlee2801

Hi all - this thread has inspired me to explore using a chromecast audio as at-home / at-office wireless setup. Have people noticed a difference in sound quality when using different power outputs in their powerbanks? Wondering if I could get away with an older powerbank with a lower output for this setup.


----------



## audiobomber

stephenlee2801 said:


> Hi all - this thread has inspired me to explore using a chromecast audio as at-home / at-office wireless setup. Have people noticed a difference in sound quality when using different power outputs in their powerbanks? Wondering if I could get away with an older powerbank with a lower output for this setup.


As long as the output voltage is 5V and current is rated for at least 1A, it will work fine.


----------



## audiobomber (Sep 13, 2020)

audiobomber said:


> For anyone still experiencing casting problems, I would be looking at network strength. Maybe you need to move Chromecast or your router for better reception, or buy a more powerful router or a network extender.


A further observation. Casting from the Chromecast Audio browser "Cast" tab results in severe dropouts. Casting from the various apps I use works fine, no dropouts.

On another topic, can anyone tell me what bitrate CCA plays when casting Amazon HD or Ultra HD?


----------



## MattAu

Hello, 

Newbie here, I have read through the last 5-6 pages and the first couple pages here.  I picked up a CCA and am happy using it with Spotify.  I use the analogue out and use a adapter cable to RCA into my integrated amp.  Everything sounds fine.  

I have started ripping my CD collections into FLAC and would like to (ideally) play those with the CCA as well.  I have tried VLC Player casting and although I heard the blip (to indicate that my desktop computer is connected to the CCA) I don't hear anything and the time bar isn't moving (i.e. file not playing).  The file plays fine locally.  I have also tried playing the file on my Chrome browser and it plays fine.  When I tried to cast it to my CCA, nothing happens.  Interestingly, it casts fine to my Google Home speakers.

Finally, I have a handful of 24/96 FLAC files that I would like to listen to.  How do I cast those?  I have tried using Desktop Audio Streamer but I am uncertain it is streaming at 24/96 as the highest rate is wav at 44.1.

What's the easiest way to accomplish what I want?  Thanks in advance!

Matthew


----------



## audiobomber (Nov 13, 2020)

MattAu said:


> Hello,
> 
> Newbie here, I have read through the last 5-6 pages and the first couple pages here.  I picked up a CCA and am happy using it with Spotify.  I use the analogue out and use a adapter cable to RCA into my integrated amp.  Everything sounds fine.
> 
> ...


I have had very poor performance casting from my Windows laptop and tablet to CCA. Casting from my phone OTOH is pretty much flawless, even with hi-res FLAC files.

Using BubbleUPnP on your phone should work. Foobar2000 mobile version may also work, but I'm not certain about that one. I use QMusic mostly, but I believe it requires a QNAP NAS to work properly.


----------



## MattAu

audiobomber said:


> I have had very poor performance casting from my Windows laptop and tablet to CCA. Casting from my phone OTOH is pretty much flawless, even with hi-res FLAC files.
> 
> Using BubbleUPnP on your phone should work. Foobar2000 mobile version may also work, but I'm not certain about that one. I use QMusic mostly, but I believe it requires a QNAP NAS to work properly.



I have tried using VLC on my iPhone to access the files on my HDD and cast to the CCA.  It worked but the sound quality was horrid - like I am listening in a tunnel! I suspect the problem is the file is being streamed from my drive to my phone and then stream to the CCA.  I also don't know if it's because the CCA DAC and the iPhone DAC are both being used .


----------



## audiobomber

MattAu said:


> I have tried using VLC on my iPhone to access the files on my HDD and cast to the CCA.  It worked but the sound quality was horrid - like I am listening in a tunnel! I suspect the problem is the file is being streamed from my drive to my phone and then stream to the CCA.  I also don't know if it's because the CCA DAC and the iPhone DAC are both being used .


Try BubbleUPnP. It is strictly a controller, the music never goes through your phone.


----------



## markbrauer

MattAu said:


> Hello,
> 
> Newbie here, I have read through the last 5-6 pages and the first couple pages here.  I picked up a CCA and am happy using it with Spotify.  I use the analogue out and use a adapter cable to RCA into my integrated amp.  Everything sounds fine.
> 
> ...


I have my music directory set up as a Network Share on the computer. I then set up Bubble UPnP controller app on my phone to access that Share. No need for any sort of server software. My Chromecast shows up in Bubble as an available renderer. The phone is then the controller and the music travels directly from the computer to the CCA. Plays 96/24 files bit perfect. Works great. Sounds great. I have my music files mirrored to Google Drive and BubbleUPnP very nicely plays music from there too.


----------



## markbrauer

I just read some recent entries and it appears you may be using an iPhone. No BubbleUPnP available there, so my suggestion is not feasible. Then again, you could beg/borrow/steal an old Android from someone. Or buy a cheap one. I recently helped a friend set up a Tracfone model that was surprisingly decent, and it cost only $25 at Best Buy. He's used it for months as nis only phone and it works fine. Pretty cheap for a controller. You would not need to purchase any service, just use it as a WiFi device. Many get Amazon Fire tablets to use as controllers (I have one and it works great). This site shows the price for the 7" model sometimes drops to $30. https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B07FKR6KXF?context=search Bubble UPnP is available in the Amazon app store https://www.amazon.com/Bubblesoft-BubbleUPnP-UPnP-DLNA/dp/B01AANGKVY


----------



## MattAu

markbrauer said:


> I just read some recent entries and it appears you may be using an iPhone. No BubbleUPnP available there, so my suggestion is not feasible. Then again, you could beg/borrow/steal an old Android from someone. Or buy a cheap one. I recently helped a friend set up a Tracfone model that was surprisingly decent, and it cost only $25 at Best Buy. He's used it for months as nis only phone and it works fine. Pretty cheap for a controller. You would not need to purchase any service, just use it as a WiFi device. Many get Amazon Fire tablets to use as controllers (I have one and it works great). This site shows the price for the 7" model sometimes drops to $30. https://camelcamelcamel.com/product/B07FKR6KXF?context=search Bubble UPnP is available in the Amazon app store https://www.amazon.com/Bubblesoft-BubbleUPnP-UPnP-DLNA/dp/B01AANGKVY




Thank you Mark.  I might do that.  I had a Amazon Fire and sold it when I bought my iPad Mini.  

Just to clarify, I have my HDD plugged in to my router and have it setup for network share - I can access the files from my iPhone, iPad, laptops, etc.  I don't need to install any software whatsoever except for BubbleUPnP on the Amazon Fire tablet?  And then I can use the tablet like a remote control to pick the songs I want to cast to my CCA and I can cast songs up to 24/96 which I understand is the max allowed from the CCA if I don't want to use a separate DAC?  What music player would I use on the Amazon Fire?  Like how do I pick the files to cast to the CCA?


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## markbrauer

MattAu said:


> Thank you Mark.  I might do that.  I had a Amazon Fire and sold it when I bought my iPad Mini.
> 
> Just to clarify, I have my HDD plugged in to my router and have it setup for network share - I can access the files from my iPhone, iPad, laptops, etc.  I don't need to install any software whatsoever except for BubbleUPnP on the Amazon Fire tablet?  And then I can use the tablet like a remote control to pick the songs I want to cast to my CCA and I can cast songs up to 24/96 which I understand is the max allowed from the CCA if I don't want to use a separate DAC?  What music player would I use on the Amazon Fire?  Like how do I pick the files to cast to the CCA?


BubbleUPnP is a full function music player. No other software needed. You open the app, select the Library option to point it to your network shares, and select your CCA as renderer. Then use the app pretty much like any other music player. You may want to peruse the settings to customize how the app and interface works, there are tons of them. True the CCA can only output 96/24, but I just tried it and it will actually play 192 files by down sampling them, of course your network has to be able to support transporting that bitrate. I am also pretty sure the CCA limit is 96/24 even when sent to an outboard DAC.


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## markbrauer

If you had a Fire you know they leave a lot to be desired when used as a general-purpose tablet. But when using them for specific purposes like a music controller, they can work as good as anything.


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## thamasha69

Good discussion here. I use a CCA outputting to a HifiMeDIY S2 (Sabre 9038) DAC in my 2 channel stereo. I carry an iPhone 6S daily in my pocket, but have repurposed a Nexus 6 strictly as a remote/frontend for my stereo via Bubble UPNP/Spotify/Radio Paradise etc.


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## MattAu

I gave up and got myself a Node 2i and sold the CCA within minutes of listing it.  LOL


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## h1p8r10n (Apr 26, 2021)

For information, about Chromecast sound :

- Chromecast protocol allow both source and renderer to select a codec : PCM, MP3, FLAC,  ...

- In case you cast local FLAC files directly : usually FLAC is transmitted untouched if the renderer can read FLAC,  else the FLAC is decoded on the source and casted in PCM : you get FLAC quality.

- In case you cast local MP3 files directly : usually MP3 is transmitted untouched if the renderer can read MP3, else the MP3 is decoded on the source and casted in PCM : you get MP3 quality.

- In case you cast Deezer, Qobuz, Tidal, ... : the renderer get the files directly from the music service : AAC for Spotify, MP3 or FLAC for Deezer, etc... : you get exactly the quality of the music service.

- If you use the "share audio" (aka Smartview for Samsung, or Google Home Screen Sharing) : MP3 192kbps is used for casting : it means that no matter what quality you play while casting globally in "share audio" mode : the sound is reencoded in MP3 192. In case you play FLAC : you get 192kbps MP3 quality , In case you play AAC 256 :  you get even worse : double LOSSY encoding.

So, Chromecast can be lossless for everything but the screen sharing : in this case, like for Bluetooth : you should never cast anything else than FLAC if you don't want your (for example AAC) file to be encoded once again in MP3 192, which is crappy double LOSSY encoding. Casting FLAC, even encoded in MP3 192 is not bad : not fantastic, but acceptable for most.


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## markbrauer

h1p8r10n​Thanks for posting this. 

I will point out that if one is streaming local files from an Android device, and is concerned about audio quality, there's the app _Hi-Fi Cast _that sends bit-perfect streams to Chromecast. It will work to play files from DLNA/UPnP servers too, although the casting is done from the Android device, rather than directly from the server.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.findhdmusic.app.upnpcast&hl=en_US&gl=US


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## Maxxis

h1p8r10n said:


> - In case you cast Deezer, Qobuz, Tidal, ... : the renderer get the files directly from the music service : AAC for Spotify, MP3 or FLAC for Deezer, etc... : you get exactly the quality of the music service.


What about Apple Music lossless using ALAC?


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## rkw

Maxxis said:


> What about Apple Music lossless using ALAC?


Chromecast Audio doesn't support ALAC: https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/6279377

When casting, Chromecast gets a stream directly from the server. The Apple server would decide which format to send, depending on the device. It appears that Apple sends AAC to Chromecast Audio devices:
https://www.reddit.com/r/AppleMusic..._music_lossless_on_chromecast_audio/?sort=old


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## audiobomber

I use a heavily tweaked Chromecast Audio streamer in my main system, beside an exaSound Playpoint, because the Playpoint can't stream YouTube Music. The Chromecast dongle is connected to an UGREEN ethernet adapter, which turns off the noisy internal wi-fi radio. I recently added an iFi SPDIF iPurifier2, connected via Glass Toslink cable. Both Chromecast and iPurifier are powered by a Topping P50 linear power supply.

I tried converting from optical to coaxial by plugging the iPurifier directly into my exaSound e32 Mk II DAC, but this made the bass sound too fat. Staying with Toslink was easily beter, despite my long-held belief that coax is superior.


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## mainguy

Guys, how does the compression via chromecast compare to LDAC bluetooth, im guessing its better by a big margin?


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## audiobomber (Mar 31, 2022)

mainguy said:


> Guys, how does the compression via chromecast compare to LDAC bluetooth, im guessing its better by a big margin?


.Compression like AAC or MP3 removes part of the data (music). Chromecast does not compress.

Chromecast Audio streams up to 24/96, regular Chromecast up to 24/48. No compression, but potential downsampling if the source exceeds these values, i.e. 192/24, DSD, etc.


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## gvl2016

One scenario when it will compress is casting from Chrome.


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## rkw

gvl2016 said:


> One scenario when it will compress is casting from Chrome.


The Chrome browser casts compressed audio. Chromecast Audio itself tries to play at whatever resolution it receives, up to 24/96.

However, I've always experienced stuttering whenever I've tried casting 24/96. It works well for me up to 24/48. Others have reported the same experience.


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## gvl2016

rkw said:


> The Chrome browser casts compressed audio. Chromecast Audio itself tries to play at whatever resolution it receives, up to 24/96.
> 
> However, I've always experienced stuttering whenever I've tried casting 24/96. It works well for me up to 24/48. Others have reported the same experience.



Chrome will compress even if it plays uncompressed, at least in some cases as evidenced here: https://audiosciencereview.com/foru...ents-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/


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## audiobomber (Apr 1, 2022)

gvl2016 said:


> Chrome will compress even if it plays uncompressed, at least in some cases as evidenced here: https://audiosciencereview.com/foru...ents-of-chromecast-audio-digital-output.4544/


Truncating 24 bits to 16 bits is not compression, it is downsampling. Totally different.
Aside from that, ASR was casting via the Chrome browser. I don't use that, because of unreliability and stuttering. I use UPnP exclusively and have no trouble streaming 96/24.


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## gvl2016

audiobomber said:


> Truncating 16 bits to 24 bits is not compression, it is downsampling. Totally different.
> Aside from that, ASR was casting via the Chrome browser. I don't use that, because of unreliability and stuttering. I use UPnP exclusively and have no trouble streaming 96/24.



16 to 24 is neither truncation nor downsampling. The ASR result is clearly compression. Casting from Chrome is just an example when compression can occur.


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## audiobomber (Apr 1, 2022)

gvl2016 said:


> 16 to 24 is neither truncation nor downsampling. The ASR result is clearly compression. Casting from Chrome is just an example when compression can occur.


24 bit to 16 bit is called downsampling. Simply truncating will cause ugly distortion. Dithering removes the distortion, which is surely what the Chrome browser does. The simple solution is, don't use Chrome for casting audio. I use BubbleUPnP and QMusic.

_"There appears to be nothing broken in the design of the Chromecast Audio DAC as long as you use the right software to drive it._"
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-of-chromecast-audio-analog-performance.4562/


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## gvl2016

audiobomber said:


> 24 bit to 16 bit is called downsampling.



No, it’s called truncation. Dithering doesn’t remove distortion but rather hides it in the elevated noise floor. The ASR data shows that it’s actually compression and not simple truncation. But yes, not using Chrome will avoid these issues.


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## Sphere 57

I use a Chromecast Audio and Chromecast built-in (Primare NP5) nearly every day. I never cast from Chrome browser. Bandcamp, SoundCloud, to name just two of many sources, enable casting direct from their servers. If you cast from the browser, all you are doing is mirroring your phone's (or whatever) audio, like a rubbish version of AirPlay, I can get better sound with Bluetooth.


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## nerone1

Hello everyone, for a few days now my Chromecast Audio has been transmitting from the Usb Audio Player pro app up to 96 khz without interruptions.
Did you have the same experience?


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## Sphere 57

nerone1 said:


> Hello everyone, for a few days now my Chromecast Audio has been transmitting from the Usb Audio Player pro app up to 96 khz without interruptions.
> Did you have the same experience?


Are you using files stored on your android device? I tried using UAPP to cast Tidal and Qobuz but couldn't get it to work


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## nerone1

I use Tidal, in the menu there is the cast function to activate.
Here is a screenshot


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## iFi audio

nerone1 said:


> Hello everyone, for a few days now my Chromecast Audio has been transmitting from the Usb Audio Player pro app up to 96 khz without interruptions.
> Did you have the same experience?



I don't use Chromecast, so let me ask whether there's anything unusual about this bitrate? Was it unsupported thus far?


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## nerone1

iFi audio said:


> I don't use Chromecast, so let me ask whether there's anything unusual about this bitrate? Was it unsupported thus far?


I don't know, I'm a common listener, I can only judge from what I read on the Topping E30 and what I hear in my ears.


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## iFi audio

nerone1 said:


> I don't know, I'm a common listener, I can only judge from what I read on the Topping E30 and what I hear in my ears.



Understood, thanks and now I have one more reason to properly get to know Chromecast


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## nerone1

I don't understand, what do you mean?
Thank you


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## iFi audio

nerone1 said:


> I don't understand, what do you mean?



I meant that your post was a nice incentive for me to read what Chromecast can and can't do


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## Sphere 57

iFi audio said:


> I don't use Chromecast, so let me ask whether there's anything unusual about this bitrate? Was it unsupported thus far?


The bitrate is not unusual, but Chromecasting is a new feature in UAPP.


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## iFi audio

Sphere 57 said:


> The bitrate is not unusual, but Chromecasting is a new feature in UAPP.



OK, now I think I understand, it's all about their integration. Thanks a lot!


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## ekjellgren

Sphere 57 said:


> I use a Chromecast Audio and Chromecast built-in (Primare NP5) nearly every day. I never cast from Chrome browser. Bandcamp, SoundCloud, to name just two of many sources, enable casting direct from their servers. If you cast from the browser, all you are doing is mirroring your phone's (or whatever) audio, like a rubbish version of AirPlay, I can get better sound with Bluetooth.


Would you say there is a sound quality difference between the CCA and NP5 for streaming, something like Spotify Connect?


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## Sphere 57

ekjellgren said:


> Would you say there is a sound quality difference between the CCA and NP5 for streaming, something like Spotify Connect?


I haven't used Spotify for years, but generally speaking the NP5 does sound better than a CCA when used with revealing gear.

Recently I swapped the CCA in my bedroom system with the NP5 from the living room. In the bedroom system there wasn't much difference, but in the more expensive living room system the CCA sounds relatively flat and less spacious in stereo, and there seemed to be a lack of variation in the timbral/tonal qualities of the music compared to the NP5.

I only use Chromecasting for lossy streaming such as SoundCloud and BBC Sounds (I use an Auralic Aries for lossless), so upgrading from one of my CCAs to the NP5 was somewhat of an exercise in 't*rd polishing', it would be a more worthwhile upgrade if I was using these devices as my main streaming renderer, not least because the NP5 offers Bluetooth, AirPlay 2 and gapless UPnP as well as Chromecast.


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