# Nordost Silver Shadow VS Valhalla digital?



## Patrick82

I'm still a skeptic and using stock yellow video cable. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Is Valhalla really better than Silver Shadow or is it just there to fill up the space in the Valhalla line? I'm not interested in placebo.

 If the goal is to get exact 75 Ohms impedance then how can Valhalla be better? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 See the review.

 I haven't found any reviews of the Valhalla so it makes me a bit suspicious. Also, someone said that the customers (ignorant?) had requested a Valhalla digital cable to be made.


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## Zorander

"I'm not interested in placebo"

 You should indeed get serious with that statement.


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## GoRedwings19

I use a silver shadow, Personally couldn't tell the difference between the two. You might be able to. It just I couldn't. Having said that the source that I use it for is not really a detail orientated type source.


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## Patrick82

Uh, I have been reading some more and I hope my mind isn't too clouded by skeptics now. It seems like Silver Shadow is the way to go.

 Anyone knows where to buy it? Audiogon seller only sells to USA.
 I could also buy it new, but bang for buck guy doesn't buy new. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I hope I don't need to wait forever...at least it gives me time to save up for Valhalla.

 Is AES/EBU better than RCA?


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## GoRedwings19

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Uh, I have been reading some more and I hope my mind isn't too clouded by skeptics now. It seems like Silver Shadow is the way to go.

 Anyone knows where to buy it? Audiogon seller only sells to USA.
 I could also buy it new, but bang for buck guy doesn't buy new. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I hope I don't need to wait forever...at least it gives me time to save up for Valhalla.

 Is AES/EBU better than RCA?_

 


 I bought my last two from the US. You should be able to find a used one and they usually willing to ship anywhere as it is light and small.

 When connecting it, Just use whatever gives you 75ohm impedance. I use the electrical digital connection (coaxial) method.

 I thought AES connection was 150 ohm?


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## hoosterw

I can contribute some experience with the Vahalla digital.

 I presently use this one on my home HiFi set, to connect a TAG Mclaren AV192R and DVD32R. I also use a clock sync between these two.
 Before, I tried many cables, van den Hul, Chord, No names, but none suited my ears.

 The NordOst Valhalla digital brought stability and easiness to the sound. Before I got tired after listening for an hour or two, but after the Valhalla I can listen for hours and hours.

 The soundstage and sound in all did not change much it was mostly the 'silences between the notes' that got me.

 Rgds Hans


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## kuma

Quote:


 I thought AES connection was 150 ohm? 
 

It's at 110 ohms.


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## Patrick82




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## hoosterw

Congratulations. I think (hope) you will be impressed.

 Hans


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## Thaddy

You should rewire your TV with some of that stuff.


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## Patrick82

Wow, it's still unreal, everything happened so fast, I don't believe it until I have the cable in my hands.
 Imagine if I clicked 1 second too late and was forced to spend twice as much from other seller. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I had to let fate decide, that's why I waited until the last second. Good to get that adrenaline pumping you know...


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## krmathis

Oh man, you seem to be *really* hooked on Nordost cables! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Congrats though...


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## Patrick82

I plugged it in and didn't get a night and day improvement like with my other Valhalla cables. I guess I finally entered the point of diminishing returns. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 It made my Benchmark DAC-1 sound horribly warm, maybe it needs some burn-in...


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## Patrick82

OMG warmth problem is solved!

 I disconnected another conductor of my Valhalla power cord for my DAC1 and it opened up the window to the music pretty good. I also did the same with my Cary 303/300 transport and it got little better there.

 Optimizing the conductors makes night and day improvements! OMG. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Here's what I use now:

*DAC1:* 1 red + 1 black + 1 ground

*Cary:* 2 red + 2 black + 1 ground Update: With 55cm instead of 160cm 1+1+1 is best! Update2: Using 105cm and 1+1+1, but it needed ERS Paper.

*GCC-100* Left channel: 1 red + 1 black + 1 ground
*GCC-100* Right channel: 1 red + 1 black + 1 ground
 7th conductor for ground.

*Power Plant and Ultimate Outlet:* Stock (3+3+1) Update: Using 2+2+1 now, 1 meter instead of 2 meters. Update2: Using 1+1+1 after wrapping it with ERS Paper.



 [size=xx-small]Click for bigger pictures[/size]


 [size=medium]*Benchmark DAC-1*[/size]




 Transformer has opposite color wiring.



*[size=medium]Cary 303/300[/size]*




 Bend the 2 conductors into shape and insert into the crimp thing. It gets tight when done correctly. No soldering needed. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 [size=medium]*PS Audio GCC-100*[/size]




 Coming out of skin like snake.


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## derekbmn

Patrick you truly are a MADMAN !!!


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## Patrick82

I have some first impressions of the Valhalla digital, but I don't take more pictures yet, it's not yet worthy. It took a year until I knew what Valhalla power cords were doing. I would be ashamed to post pics of placebo cable that does nothing.

*Valhalla digital XLR impressions:* When I listen to my most sibilant albums they have too little sibilance for my taste, it sounds kind of dull, boring and relaxing. But detail is still there. It seems that I like colored emphasized detail better, it makes it sound more transparent and like real life.
 Perhaps the Valhalla digital revealed problems in my system, real life has more sibilance than this!


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## revo_909

your courage to mess around with those expensive toys deserves a thumbs up or two from us


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## Patrick82

OMG.


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## Patrick82

Hardwiring speaker cable is crazy. A whole new world of detail and speed has opened up. It's one of the biggest improvements I have heard. Now I want to remove the RCA connectors too...

 Anyone who considers upgrading to Valhalla digital, do these tweaks first!


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## BrianS

patrick, what solder do you use?


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BrianS* 
_patrick, what solder do you use?_

 

WBT Silver Solder.


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## Patrick82

I replaced the 24 AWG input signal wire of the GCC-100 amp into 22 AWG Valkyrja and it made it sound worse. I didn't know that optimizing conductors was this important! Then I figured out that the thinner wire was just compensating for a *too fat interconnect*. So I modded the Valhalla and tried to hardwire it but it was too stiff and came loose. So I tried my Valkyrja speaker cable without any shielding and it sounded great, but there was background noise that masked detail, I tried wrapping half of it in ERS paper but it still sounded bright, I needed a blacker background.

 So I went back to Valhalla and soldered back the Eichmann Bullets using 1 conductor per channel instead of the normal 4. It gave a blacker background and loads of detail. Bass is still great compared to the stock Valhalla, I hear no weaknesses, it sounds better in every way. This is the biggest improvement I have heard.

*First impression Valhalla 1 conductor interconnect:* Everything is distinct, it sounds like the bass, mids and highs are played back from a separate audio system, it sounds weird. Nothing blends together.
 Layering is now very clear. Vocals are smoother and shimmer more. Everything sounds sharper and hairier without being harsh or fatiguing.
 The improvement in resolution is the biggest I have ever heard, everything else doesn't even come close!



*Replace input signal wires of GCC-100*




 I wrapped Valhalla power cord with ERS paper but it made it too muddy so I removed it.




 I had to do this job twice because amp didn't work. There was a small piece of solder creating a short, lucky that ICEpower amps have short-circuit protection! This job took 18 hours, those pins are crazy small to solder to. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I also replaced the DC wire to the Gain Cell. First I tried 3 conductor Valkyrja (the one on picture) but it was too muddy and bass was emphasized, then I tried 1 conductor and highs were emphasized, 2 conductors is optimal for that DC power.



*Valkyrja homemade interconnect*




 Same wire in and out, why not!

















*Valhalla interconnect 1 conductor mod*

http://poollogics.is-a-geek.net/pict...re.attempt.JPG
 Hardwiring Valhalla didn't work, other end inside amp had come loose and no sound came out from either channels. Back to RCA plug. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	













 Now the input (amp) and output wire (K1000) is a single 22 AWG Micro Mono-Filament conductor and there is synergy! *Muddiness is finally gone!*


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## yo2tup2

you are insane


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## BrianS

you are a tweaker with balls

 i guess no connector is better than any connector
 so are you considering a new source or just continue tweaking?


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BrianS* 
_so are you considering a new source or just continue tweaking?_

 

I will get new source when Benchmark DAC1 becomes the weakness. Or when Nordost releases a DAC with silver plated circuit board paths, I would pay $10k for that.

 I will keep tweaking until I stop hearing a difference.


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## Patrick82

It seems like the homemade Valkyrja interconnect has a lot of potential. It had more detail than 1 conductor Valhalla before I removed the ERS paper, but it sounded bright and edgy.

 I ordered a couple sheets of ERS paper and will try a toilet paper roll mod. I don't want anything touching the cable. The dielectric could also be completely removed. Just a bare wire floating in air with toilet paper roll around it and not touching. The toilet paper rolls would be heavily wrapped in ERS paper.

 Later I will do it with my headphone cable, I can suspend the wire inside the rolls with rubber bands. It will take a long time until I have enough toilet paper rolls for 3 meters.


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## setmenu

Patrick it looks like you are having great fun with yours cable adventures!
 A few years back I went through a cable worship phase with siltech 4/120.
 I even made up a pair of ics with it to link my portable dac to my stax 
 001 electrostatic phones, complete with wbt toplines.[the ic and connectors 
 weighed more than the pdcp !

 I even tried plugging those little 3 inch lengths of cable in line with other 
 different cables, boy did it make a difference.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 But after a while it began to annoy me that I heard such a 
 difference.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 I spent quite a bit on the siltech and still use with my big stax rig.

 But these days I am more of an 'objectivist', especially since I got into the 
 diy electronics side of things.
 I still believe quality cables are a good idea but prefer not to loose perspective.
 It's fun to dive into the technical side of this stuff, for me more fulfilling than
 endless blind tweaking.
 I ended up designing and making my own [ribbon] headphones from scratch.
 [A project that still has masses of development potential ]

 It will be interesting to see when or if you emerge from your exotic cable rapture
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 In the mean time keep up with those highly entertaining threads
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 .


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## Patrick82

The Valhalla 1 conductor is warm now, it was a little cold yesterday but I liked it. After I wrapped the Eichmann Bullet connectors with ERS paper it seemed to give a subtle improvement in warmth, but I wasn't sure. Detail was the same.

 I'm impressed of the high frequencies, amazing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Now the difference between mp3 and WAV isn't insignificant anymore!


 I did a quick ABX test between Valhalla digital and cheap Toslink. The difference was only subtle.

 Amethystium - Odonata (track13, first 40 seconds)

*Valhalla:* Highs shimmer more.
*Toslink:* Highs are just a stable beep with slow shifting between frequencies.

 Valhalla also seems to be smoother and less fatiguing, I like it.


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## Patrick82

Either I magically got used to the colder sound in a day or the ERS paper plug wrap made a difference. It could also be the burn-in of connectors after plugging them back in, but that usually takes only 5 hours until brightness is gone. Maybe it's more revealing now and takes longer to burn-in.
 It's starting to sound as warm as real life now!


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## Patrick82

Today I switched from Valhalla interconnect to my homemade Valkyrja speaker wire. The ERS paper hasn't arrived yet, but even without shielding I like the Valkyrja better because of more detail and transparency. It makes the modded 1 conductor Valhalla interconnect muddy in comparison, amazing!

 The speaker cable has thinner Mono-Filaments wound around the conductor. With the interconnect they are thicker, I don't like it. Interconnect also has pieces of paper and thin silver wire shielding, I don't like it. No wonder the speed is only 87% speed of light with all that stuff jammed inside! Speaker cable is 96%.

 I didn't like the non shielded Valkyrja earlier because I thought the system was damaged because I heard so much new detail I never heard before. I thought it was picking up radio channels or something.
 I think the problem was those solder joints that had to burn in. Now it sounds too warm again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , but that extra detail still remains. Bass is crazy heavy and strong, it's those isolation feet that does it. Nordost makes their cables too fat so it hides the problems of vibration.


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## Patrick82

I waited a whole week before continuing my daily mods, my previous mod (1 conductor Valhalla interconnect) gave so big improvement...

 I replaced fuses inside the amp and I found a way to mess up that simple job. Amp wouldn't start because there was a piece of solder making a short again. I removed it and no sound came out, I automatically assumed amp was the problem and then *5 hours* of testing begins... Problem wasn't amp at all, my computer didn't output audio anymore, I never had that problem before. It worked again when I restored windows. At least I got some good exercise from all that.
 After 7 hours of tweaking I moved on to my Cary transport and it took only 15 minutes to replace those two fuses without problems.

 Instead of spending $30 for a frail fuse that breaks when feeding it too much voltage I'm using my Valkyrja speaker wiring (I use it for everything). It has no protection but I don't care because I tweak too extreme anyways.

*First impressions hardwired homemade Valkyrja "fuse":* More vocal information! With frail fuses I couldn't hear what vocalists where singing, now I can hear new words! Bass is more solid and faster. Everything sounds louder. There is some "solder sibilance" that needs to burn-in...


 Edit: I have loaned out my camera and can't take pictures yet. So I made this drawing instead:







 This made a bigger improvement than Valhalla digital, that's why I'm posting here. $0 VS $2000, bang for buck!


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## n_maher

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Instead of spending $30 for a frail fuse that breaks when feeding it too much voltage I'm using my Valkyrja speaker wiring (I use it for everything). It has no protection but I don't care because I tweak too extreme anyways._

 

Patrick, I think lots of your ideas are bad... but seriously, this is a *REALLY* bad idea.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *n_maher* 
_Patrick, I think lots of your ideas are bad... but seriously, this is a *REALLY* bad idea._

 

Why? Getting better sound is bad idea? I'm more worried about my power cords than the equipment, because each power cord costs more than the component it is plugged into.

 I have bypassed the rest of the fuses long ago, no problems. Only 1 fuse to protect the whole system is needed, the one in my Ultimate Outlet, it also has MOV's for extra protection.

 Power, cables and vibration isolation, it's all that matters to me. Anything else is insignificant. After the problems are fixed, all equipment sound almost the same, at any price. That's why I choose the ones that take the least electricity and heat. DAC1 + ICEpower, bang for buck!


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## setmenu

I reckon the next step is to get yourself a Small generator and run your exotic
 power cable directly from it to your hifi. [with suitable filtering/conditioning in 
 between of course!] 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Ever looked into battery supplies?

 But in all seriousness, be careful about removing safety devices,whilst they 
 may 'only' appear to protect the gear, they may also reduce the risk of fire!
 No matter how hardcore your audiophile credentials,they ain't worth jack if 
 all you do is end up toast!

 .


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## Patrick82

Uh, all this time I had been using wrong power cord conductor amount for Cary 303/300 transport, and I kept wondering where deep bass and dynamics went. I thought it was placebo of my Cary internal Valkyrja DC wiring that had worn off, but NO, it wasn't placebo, it was real!

 A couple weeks ago after I had done my Cary Valkyrja mod (see pics) it gave too much bass so I modded the Valhalla power cord from 2 red + 2 black + 1 ground to 1+1+1, but it sounded too lifeless and boring, deep bass and dynamics were gone, I could also hear background noise. When I put it back I wired it wrong and it got 2+1+1, after lack of bass I figured out I wired it in reverse and switched it to 1+2+1 and I kept that for weeks. I thought I wired it correctly because there was little more bass.

 Today I shortened my power cords from 160cm to 55cm (Cary) and from 105cm to 50cm (DAC1). I also wired the Cary correctly into 2+2+1 this time. 

*First impression:* OH MY GOD the dynamics are back! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Background is BLACK again. There are blacker blacks and whiter whites, amazing. Deep bass vibrates again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But detail is lacking badly, I think it's a side effect from more dynamics and heaviness. Even with less detail I like it better because it hides the background noise, hmm, maybe that noise was emphasizing detail.


 Edit: I wonder if I can use 1+1+1 for Cary now when the power cord is 1/3rd in length, I will try it again after a few months of tweaks.

 After re-arranging my setup I'm now finally able to try Valhalla for my cheap projector. But first I will try DualValhalla for the wall.


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## Jeff Wong

Patrick - Your solder joints don't look quite right judging from the pics... you might want to check them or redo them. A cold joint could be introducing noise.


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## derekbmn

Thank's for the new sig !!!


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jeff Wong* 
_Patrick - Your solder joints don't look quite right judging from the pics... you might want to check them or redo them. A cold joint could be introducing noise._

 

Hmm maybe. I didn't solder the interconnect to the XLR pins properly. I went back to Valhalla interconnect now because it is easier to tweak my system, background is blacker, but that's mostly from the shielding.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_But first I will try DualValhalla for the wall._

 

I was using 2 meter stock Valhalla for wall. I replaced it with 1 meter DualValhalla.
 I tried 4 red + 4 black + 2 ground. (Separate Valhalla power cord for hot and neutral signals.)

*First impression 4+4+2 for wall:* Little deeper bass, same detail. Almost no difference.




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_I wonder if I can use 1+1+1 for Cary now when the power cord is 1/3rd in length,_

 

It works!

*First impression 1+1+1 for Cary:* More open and revealing! Little less dynamics, bass is less emphasized. Better synergy.






 I went back to stock 2 meter Valhalla for wall and it sounded almost the same, but with little more detail than before.
 After what happened to Cary I did the same mod, I replaced 2 meter with 1 meter and disconnected a conductor to make it 2+2+1.

*First impression 2+2+1 for wall:* OMG more detail! Little less bass and more open. It sounds faster too! I will keep this. OMG it sounds acceptable!

 Background noise is reduced now even with less conductors, shortening the power cords did this!! Longer power cord gives more RFI? I need to do the ERS toilet paper roll mod with power cords too...





 Display of Power Plant says 0-40 watts, 13 watts average with MWAVE4 setting, but display isn't accurate.
 When Cary 303/300 is in stand-by it shows 0-10. It's amazing how little DAC1 + ICEpower amp takes! My Krell power amp used to take 100+ watts and stock Valhalla was too thin for it. 

 Uh, I think my ICEpower amp has too fat conductors now. 18 AWG instead of 16 AWG should be better. I need to make special order from Nordost... Or maybe I can use 22 AWG Valkyrja with 3+3+1 conductors, but I don't have enough of it left, and it doesn't have dual threads 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .
 I want a 7 conductor 22 AWG speaker cable with *Dual* Micro Mono-Filaments instead of single (power cord and digital have Dual). Then I can use it for everything!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Do you think Nordost would create this cable for me? Is $10k enough for 100 meters? 

 Edit: Or maybe I should buy tools and build it myself, then I can go out and re-wire the street (I will mod street at night with night vision goggles so nobody sees...).


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## n_maher

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Edit: Or maybe I should buy tools and build it myself, then I can go out and re-wire the street (I will mod street at night with night vision goggles so nobody sees...)._

 

It is moments like this (and also ones that involve you removing fuses from devices) that make me so very happy that you live in Sweden 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_After re-arranging my setup I'm now finally able to try Valhalla for my cheap projector._

 

This is scary. As a joke I hardwired Valhalla into projector and wrapped the ends with ERS paper. I'm using a cheap Tupplur screen from Ikea and cheap 720p projector, this projector is way too soft so it is hard to read text.

 Panasonic PT-AE900E -> 1 meter Valhalla -> JuiceBar -> 2 meter Valhalla -> Ultimate Outlet -> 1 meter Valhalla -> wall.


*First impressions:* OH MY GOD! It is super sharp all over the screen instead of only in the centre, what is going on?? Are my eyes different now? Colors look too bright that it's unreal, it doesn't look like real life. Colors are much cleaner than before. What has happened to picture? OMG how is this possible? I don't believe it. Do I need to buy another Valhalla power cord now? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Arghh, I need this one for my computer damnit!!


 Uh, now I also need to buy Stewart Firehawk screen to take advantage of this, I don't have the cash!


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## Curt Palme

Speaking as a board level tech that has been soldering for over 30 years, I have to be really honest and say that Patrick's soldering is some of the worst that I've seen. While tweaking itself is fine and encouraged, I daresay that the resale value of a couple of his pieces have dropped to $0, at least for me.

 Let's not forget the missing AC cord strain relief that now creates a potential fire hazard once the Valhalla gets scraped along the metal edge of the chassis.

 Buyer and tweakers beware!


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## Tachikoma

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Curt Palme* 
_Speaking as a board level tech that has been soldering for over 30 years, I have to be really honest and say that Patrick's soldering is some of the worst that I've seen. While tweaking itself is fine and encouraged, I daresay that the resale value of a couple of his pieces have dropped to $0, at least for me.

 Let's not forget the missing AC cord strain relief that now creates a potential fire hazard once the Valhalla gets scraped along the metal edge of the chassis.

 Buyer and tweakers beware!_

 

Enjoying his posts at AVS I see? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 if I were him I'd be building DIY amps from scratch solely using valhalla cords. See, it could be worse


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Curt Palme* 
_Speaking as a board level tech that has been soldering for over 30 years, I have to be really honest and say that Patrick's soldering is some of the worst that I've seen. While tweaking itself is fine and encouraged, I daresay that the resale value of a couple of his pieces have dropped to $0, at least for me._

 

I have been soldering few months... At least it gets the job done and makes an improvement.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Curt Palme* 
_Let's not forget the missing AC cord strain relief that now creates a potential fire hazard once the Valhalla gets scraped along the metal edge of the chassis.

 Buyer and tweakers beware!_

 

I have some scratches on my old Valhalla power cords from squeezing them through the hole of my closet. The teflon is way too thick for scratches to pierce through it, and then each of the 7 conductors are surrounded with teflon too. It was hard to cut through the teflon when I tried it.
 I have black tape at every place where the cables make contact to the chassis. But even if there was a fire hazard, would I care? If I get a few weeks of great sound and then it burns up it is worth it! Because memory lasts forever... unless I get memory loss disease, so I need to be quick anyway, why spend 30 years learning how to solder properly if you can get better sound today?


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## setmenu

Personally when I read the words 'fire hazard' , the first thing I think of is the 
 risk to other household members, myself and the property before I consider 
 the piece of hifi itself.

 But that's just me.


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## Patrick82

I have taken out my 9 years old digital camera from my closet and made some videos.

 DualValhalla power cord 2 MB DOWNLOAD



 Ignore the beginning where I bend over table, it was my previous hobby.


 Valhalla projector + audio system 11 MB DOWNLOAD



 In the end you see a glimpse of Valhalla digital XLR, soon it becomes worthy! (More testing required)


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## Patrick82

Here is a 29 MB video of me re-terminating Valhalla power cord with Marinco plug. The cutting and twisting of the conductors isn't included, but that's the easy part. Before I did the twisting by hand so that the silver plating of the ends didn't get scraped off, but now I just don't care and just grip the ends with a tool and twist it many turns. It goes faster too.
 The correct way to insert the conductors into the holes is where the shape of the 3 conductors is the opposite of the shape of the hole that grips them. Otherwise it comes loose.



 This is going to save someone thousands!


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## Tachikoma

Why not buy a source 2x better (stock) than the DAC-1, then plug in power cords for the gear to scale up to 4x its value?

 DAC-1 + powercord = source 4x DAC-1's value
 Source 2x better stock + powercords = source 8x DAC-1's value but only at 2x the price of the DAC-1


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Tachikoma* 
_Why not buy a source 2x better (stock) than the DAC-1, then plug in power cords for the gear to scale up to 4x its value?

 DAC-1 + powercord = source 4x DAC-1's value
 Source 2x better stock + powercords = source 8x DAC-1's value but only at 2x the price of the DAC-1











_

 

I don't need better than DAC1 because it lets me hear problems in the system so I can fix them. And I don't think the DAC1 will ever become the weakness, it's very sensitive yes but that doesn't make it a weakness IMO, it makes it a strength!

 Imagine buying 1 Valhalla power cord used for $1300 and cutting it into 4x 53cm lenghts or 3x 70cm. It's possible with small headphone gear because you can stack them next to each other. If this isn't the greatest bang for buck I don't know what is!


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## tourmaline

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_This is scary. As a joke I hardwired Valhalla into projector and wrapped the ends with ERS paper. I'm using a cheap Tupplur screen from Ikea and cheap 720p projector, this projector is way too soft so it is hard to read text.

 Panasonic PT-AE900E -> 1 meter Valhalla -> JuiceBar -> 2 meter Valhalla -> Ultimate Outlet -> 1 meter Valhalla -> wall.


*First impressions:* OH MY GOD! It is super sharp all over the screen instead of only in the centre, what is going on?? Are my eyes different now? Colors look too bright that it's unreal, it doesn't look like real life. Colors are much cleaner than before. What has happened to picture? OMG how is this possible? I don't believe it. Do I need to buy another Valhalla power cord now? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Arghh, I need this one for my computer damnit!!


 Uh, now I also need to buy Stewart Firehawk screen to take advantage of this, I don't have the cash!_

 


 No wonder if you buy that much valhalla's.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but i know how good Nordost kabels are, i have some myself, also reference.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 In my opinion the differences between analogue kabels are more evident then between digital cables. The differences between analogue kabels kan be night and day but between digital cables differences are minimal to noticable.


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## Patrick82

Wow, I haven't been tweaking my audio rig for 8 days! It's not that I'm too lazy or anything, it's just that I don't need to. It sounds good enough. The previous tweaks really made a huge difference, especially bypassing the fuses of amp! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I can't remember it ever sounding this good a couple weeks ago. The only thing that beats this was my power conditioned "ValhallaPC" with the fat Valhalla power cords and computer's thin black hairs.
 In other words, 3 conductor Valhalla has a blacker background because it hides detail (and reduces more RFI?). Computer makes everything thinner which emphasizes subtle detail. When I get the Premier Power Plant I will bring the ValhallaPC back!
 With Cary as transport I have to use less conductors to compensate for the extra body. I still don't think 3 conductor Valhalla is neutral, 1 conductor is, it just needs the ERS toilet paper roll treatment. I have collected 8 rolls already.

 I'm starting to get used to the Valhalla digital XLR cable now, soon I will make blind tests, it should be easy to just let someone flip the switch of the DAC1. Maybe the test will be too easy though. Does anyone want video of me making the blind test? Maybe someone will say it is fake video anyway, so why bother. I will put camera up anyway, I have 60 minutes of tape.

 Edit: Wow I have made 1092 posts already, when did I go over 1000? I tweak too extreme I don't even see!


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## Patrick82

The background noise didn't come from the cables after all! When I went from 4step to 5step isolation for DAC1 the background was much blacker, amazing. I don't need to do the ERS toilet paper roll mod for the Valhallas then! Unless my ears improve that is.

 For every conductor that I disconnected from Valhalla power cables I needed to add one extra isolation step to compensate for it!! With the stock 3 conductor Valhalla I needed 3 step isolation to get a black background, with 2 conductors I needed 4 steps, and with 1 conductor I need 5 steps. *Numbers add up to 6!* (3+3, 2+4, 1+5)










 DAC1
 5) Feet Of Silence
 metal plate
 4) Feet Of Silence
 GCC-100 amp
 3) Feet Of Silence
 2) Suspension shelf
 1) Disc Of Silence


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## Patrick82

OH MY GOD!!!!! The difference between digital cables is now night and day! I flip the switch on DAC1 bending down under table with headphones on, and I hear huge differences!!

*Coax:* HORRIBLE brightness and edginess. Lots of background noise. Highs sound very cheap and thin.
*Toslink:* Edgy and bright but sounds acceptable. No background noise but jitter. Blackness + thin edgy brightness. This explains why I like it for computer!
*Valhalla digital XLR:* Smoother, faster and more detailed. Very warm but not muddy. Background is dead black! Amazing cable!!!


 I don't need to make the blind test anymore, it would be kinda pointless. I need to find something harder.


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## HumanMedia

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_OH MY GOD!!!!! The difference between digital cables is now night and day! I flip the switch on DAC1 bending down under table with headphones on, and I hear huge differences!!_

 

After thinking digital cables shouldnt make any difference, I tried swapping some and found major differences also. Differences that cant just be jitter. There is absolutely no correlation to cost. A cheap Monster optical is noticeably better than the popular 'glass' brand. And a cheap 75 ohm BNC coax from the hardware store walks all over a custom made Furutech/Pulsar that I put together. There was so much difference here I thought I had a fault in my assembly, so I stripped it down completely and rebuilt it. It had the same sonic characteristic after it was rebuilt and triple checked.

 And speaking of digital connections, replacing the RCA connectors on source and DAC with proper 75ohm BNC, and using coax from the connectors to the PCB, along with a BNC coax interconnect was one of the most effective (and cheapest) upgrades I have ever done. Just make sure that all the components are 75ohm which can be a bit tricky because 95% of the BNCs out there are 50 ohm and not recommended.


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## yo2tup2

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HumanMedia* 
_After thinking digital cables shouldnt make any difference, I tried swapping some and found major differences also. Differences that cant just be jitter. There is absolutely no correlation to cost. A cheap Monster optical is noticeably better than the popular 'glass' brand. And a cheap 75 ohm BNC coax from the hardware store walks all over a custom made Furutech/Pulsar that I put together. There was so much difference here I thought I had a fault in my assembly, so I stripped it down completely and rebuilt it. It had the same sonic characteristic after it was rebuilt and triple checked.

 And speaking of digital connections, replacing the RCA connectors on source and DAC with proper 75ohm BNC, and using coax from the connectors to the PCB, along with a BNC coax interconnect was one of the most effective (and cheapest) upgrades I have ever done. Just make sure that all the components are 75ohm which can be a bit tricky because 95% of the BNCs out there are 50 ohm and not recommended._

 

what is the length of the pulsar/furutech you made?

 i'm using a 1.5m bluejeans digital cable w/ bnc teminations.. which replaced the more expensive 1m stereovox hdvx cable i had. i've been considering building 1.5m pulsar/furutech. i read that the pulsar cable in the digital position is really prone to reflections, so at least a 1.5m cable is a must.


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## HumanMedia

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yo2tup2* 
_what is the length of the pulsar/furutech you made?

 i'm using a 1.5m bluejeans digital cable w/ bnc teminations.. which replaced the more expensive 1m stereovox hdvx cable i had. i've been considering building 1.5m pulsar/furutech. i read that the pulsar cable in the digital position is really prone to reflections, so at least a 1.5m cable is a must._

 


 Its 0.5m. Yes I know about the length issue. I checked in with Chris VH before I made it and whilst he originally specified 1.5 for digital pulsar, he now says 0.5m and less is absolutely fine and not inferior to 1.5 (this was about 5 weeks ago). I had 1.5m of pulsar on hand and specifically decided to go with the shorter length on Chris's advice.

 Maybe the length really does make a difference. Or maybe those bulky bling Furutechs are not the best bnc's.

 Ya know, all this talk of the Furutech/Pulsar Im thinking that maybe I didnt give it long enough to burn-in. Now that I have some new interconnects to the poweramps, I might put the Furutech/Pulsar back into the system and let them burn-in some more. (Although the cheap hardware store connector needed very little time to settle sonically)


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## yo2tup2

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HumanMedia* 
_Its 0.5m. Yes I know about the length issue. I checked in with Chris VH before I made it and whilst he originally specified 1.5 for digital pulsar, he now says 0.5m and less is absolutely fine and not inferior to 1.5 (this was about 5 weeks ago). I had 1.5m of pulsar on hand and specifically decided to go with the shorter length on Chris's advice.

 Maybe the length really does make a difference. Or maybe those bulky bling Furutechs are not the best bnc's.

 Ya know, all this talk of the Furutech/Pulsar Im thinking that maybe I didnt give it long enough to burn-in. Now that I have some new interconnects to the poweramps, I might put the Furutech/Pulsar back into the system and let them burn-in some more. (Although the cheap hardware store connector needed very little time to settle sonically)_

 


 Did you ever get to try this cable again?


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## Patrick82

Time to tweak Power Plant to pieces too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . I had to melt the plastic connectors inside to hardwire the Valhallas there (the pins were too deep inside the plastic). 


*1)* Removed the stock "Monster Special" internal wiring from the path that I had previously soldered my amp's Valhalla power cord into.
*2) *Removed step-up transformer of Power Plant for DAC1. Removed Marinco plug and Power Port from path. Changed DAC1 from 220v into 110v.
*3)* Hardwired amp and DAC1 into pins inside Power Plant.

*4)* The plate of the Power Plant is a few cm open at the side.
*5) *Removed "Monster Special" wiring (hardwired to UO) between Ultimate Outlet and Power Plant. I replaced it with 55 cm Valhalla but I added Wattgate plug and Power Port into the path.
*6)* Computer and Power Plant share the same Power Port in the Ultimate Outlet.
*7)* Changed Cary transport's Valhalla from 55cm into 105cm. Changed Wattgate into Marinco plug.

 [size=xx-small]*Green* = Better
*Red* = Worse
*Magenta* = Both[/size]


*First impressions:* More low-level detail. More smoothness. Faster bass. Less fatigue. More vocal information, I hear new words. More open.
 More background noise. It sounds blacker and noisier at the same time.
 It got better and worse at the same time, it sounds weird.

 It was disappointing, I had expected more. Bypassing fuses inside amp made a bigger difference. But it still made a bigger improvement than Valhalla digital cable.



 I couldn't get camera to work so I can't post pictures yet. It has been slowly dying for a few months now. Too much picture taking of my tweaks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Edit: Projector is now using stock cord again. Uh, I didn't expect it to be this blurry, I get headache from trying to read blurry text, bottom of screen looks very bad, only middle is sharp enough. But audio is more important than video anyway, who cares of headache when it sounds like this!


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## HumanMedia

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yo2tup2* 
_Did you ever get to try this cable again? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Yes I put another 100 hours on it and still no joy. The basic Pulsar cable is fine but I dont have faith in the Furutech BNCs (I love just about all of their other stuff). Even a Blue Jeans BNC coax sounds better.

 Better still (methinks) is a commercial variant on John Risch's digital interconnect from DIY Cable - "Bitstream Digital Cable" with high spec coax, foil and braid shield tied to ground with a capacitor and terminated with canare BNCs. 

http://www.diycable.com/main/product...roducts_id=135


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## Patrick82

Removing pounds of blocky plugs and AC receptables really made a difference. Burn-in now makes the biggest difference in my system! It's amazing what a few hours can do to the solder joints.


*2nd impressions hardwired Valhalla power cords:* It's like listening to music for the first time, a new world of detail has opened up. I need to keep pausing music every few seconds to confirm that the sounds come from the recording and not real life. It's kind of annoying. I keep writing the improvements into my logs like crazy.



*Fanless Power Plant*

 Because the plate of Power Plant is open I tried it fanless again and it works! It's just barely warm after running my system 6 hours. (DAC1, GCC-100, Cary 303/300.)
 Now my room is quiet with no noise anywhere.

 Problems: The background noise in music is giving me a headache!
 Cary transport uses more watts than my amp and DAC combined, so using 1 conductor Valhalla (1+1+1) didn't make sense. It sounded little dull and lifeless, but man the detail was crazy.
 I went back to 2+2+1 conductors and OMG so heavy and black it sounds like, but all the detail is gone. That's why it sounds black with fake dynamics. Hmm colored music, oh well, at least it doesn't sound annoying anymore, I think I will keep it.


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## slwiser

I am wondering if a re-cabled AKG K81DJ with a Valhalla cable would be a R10 or L3000 killer. Based on the magic here it may very well be.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Problems: The background noise in music is giving me a headache!
 Cary transport uses more watts than my amp and DAC combined, so using 1 conductor Valhalla (1+1+1) didn't make sense. It sounded little dull and lifeless, but man the detail was crazy.
 I went back to 2+2+1 conductors and OMG so heavy and black it sounds like, but all the detail is gone. That's why it sounds black with fake dynamics. Hmm colored music, oh well, at least it doesn't sound annoying anymore, I think I will keep it._

 

Ok, back at 1 conductor again!

 For a few days I have been listening to my computer transport (Toslink + stock Valhalla) which has thinner bass, then I changed to Cary 303/300 + Valhalla digital AES/EBU and the heavy bass made me too sick, it was horrible! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			











 I gave it an hour and it didn't help, bass was muddy and huge but detail seemed as good as computer. Too much bass doesn't sound realistic.
 Then I disconnected a conductor of Cary's Valhalla power cord and it was like a breath of fresh air, aaahhhh 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . Problem was gone and I had no complaints of the heaviness anymore. I can listen for hours!!
 Uh, now background isn't black anymore. $3k Valhalla power cable no good? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I need to try ERS paper toilet paper roll mod and see if EMI/RFI is the problem with these cables. I hope I haven't reached the noise floor of Redbook CD.

 It is weird that $30k worth of cables are the weaknesses in my system. PS Audio GCC-100 amplifier is amazing that shows it all.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_I ordered a couple sheets of ERS paper and will try a toilet paper roll mod. I don't want anything touching the cable. The dielectric could also be completely removed. Just a bare wire floating in air with toilet paper roll around it and not touching. The toilet paper rolls would be heavily wrapped in ERS paper.

 Later I will do it with my headphone cable, I can suspend the wire inside the rolls with rubber bands. It will take a long time until I have enough toilet paper rolls for 3 meters._

 

Seems like the cable manufacturers didn't allow the store to send me ERS paper (or then store just forgot to send). They are afraid to go out of business when I show my cheap toilet paper roll cables that everyone can build themselves.
 I bought a few dozen sheets from overseas instead, "_______" store , soon they will arrive in mail. (paranoid)

 I will also wrap my Benchmark DAC1 with many layers of ERS cloth. That should do it.


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## Tachikoma

Quote:


 It is weird that $30k worth of cables are the weaknesses in my system. PS Audio GCC-100 amplifier is amazing that shows it all. 
 

How did you come to that conclusion?


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Tachikoma* 
_How did you come to that conclusion? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

6 months of cutting cables to pieces.

 After I got my 'Solid-tech Rack Of Silence' the differences between cables became obvious, and sources started sounding the same. I remember I was still sick from the tight and fast bass two months after I got the isolation rack. The increase in resolution was that big.

 The difference between 1 conductor Valhalla and 1 conductor Vishnu is bigger than 4 step VS 5 step vibration isolation. So yes, cables make the biggest difference in my system.
 But Nordost doesn't have proper shielding of their cables, the stock fat Valhalla sacrifices detail and hides the problem good. It's dead black.


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## tourmaline

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_6 months of cutting cables to pieces.

 After I got my 'Solid-tech Rack Of Silence' the differences between cables became obvious, and sources started sounding the same. I remember I was still sick from the tight and fast bass two months after I got the isolation rack. The increase in resolution was that big.

 The difference between 1 conductor Valhalla and 1 conductor Vishnu is bigger than 4 step VS 5 step vibration isolation. So yes, cables make the biggest difference in my system.
 But Nordost doesn't have proper shielding of their cables, the stock fat Valhalla sacrifices detail and hides the problem good. It's dead black._

 

So, you're saying patrick that those cables could be even better! They are already better then most of the cables.

 Why don't you submit your findings to Nordost?!


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tourmaline* 
_So, you're saying patrick that those cables could be even better! They are already better then most of the cables.

 Why don't you submit your findings to Nordost?!_

 

Yes. They should make a Valhalla in the Vishnu design and sell it for $1300 or so. But the problem is that with 99% of the customers there will be too much detail and it will sound thin, bright and lifeless because of the lack of bass. Vibration isolation is needed for that, so Nordost needs to make their own isolation rack to match the thinner cable. It isn't going to happen. People are already complaining about the lack of body with the stock Valhallas! I found that 3 step isolation for source and 2 step for amp was a great match with stock Valhalla, but 4 step isolation was not, it sounded way too heavy so I had to make Valhalla thinner to compensate for it.


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## tourmaline

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Yes. They should make a Valhalla in the Vishnu design and sell it for $1300 or so. But the problem is that with 99% of the customers there will be too much detail and it will sound thin, bright and lifeless because of the lack of bass. Vibration isolation is needed for that, so Nordost needs to make their own isolation rack to match the thinner cable. It isn't going to happen. People are already complaining about the lack of body with the stock Valhallas! I found that 3 step isolation for source and 2 step for amp was a great match with stock Valhalla, but 4 step isolation was not, it sounded way too heavy so I had to make Valhalla thinner to compensate for it._

 

I am not complaining at all, most of the problems tend to be with solid state equipment, wich in itself lacks the right body most of the time! With tubes you can tuberoll the sound you want; some tubes sound like solid state, some tubes have full lush body.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Also, some amps and sources have more body then others, so, with good matching it shouldn't be a problem to find the right mix!


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tourmaline* 
_I am not complaining at all, most of the problems tend to be with solid state equipment, wich in itself lacks the right body most of the time! With tubes you can tuberoll the sound you want; some tubes sound like solid state, some tubes have full lush body.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Also, some amps and sources have more body then others, so, with good matching it shouldn't be a problem to find the right mix!_

 

Yes, before I got the isolation rack I was using Mullard tubes, but after the rack I didn't need tubes anymore!


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## tourmaline

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_Yes, before I got the isolation rack I was using Mullard tubes, but after the rack I didn't need tubes anymore!_

 

Some say that tubes are still better then solid state equipment.

 Fill me on how an isolation rack can do such big improvents...cdplayer i understand, the transport mechanism is having less fibration when using vibration pods or a vibration rack. I never heard any difference in putting an amp(tube amp, wich are more sensative then solid state anyway) on those feet or a rack. i use headphones...so there is no vobration from speakers that can go back into the soundsystem.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tourmaline* 
_Some say that tubes are still better then solid state equipment.

 Fill me on how an isolation rack can do such big improvents...cdplayer i understand, the transport mechanism is having less fibration when using vibration pods or a vibration rack. I never heard any difference in putting an amp(tube amp, wich are more sensative then solid state anyway) on those feet or a rack. i use headphones...so there is no vobration from speakers that can go back into the soundsystem._

 

The problem is ground bourne vibrations and vibrations from the transformers inside the chassis.
 Here's an article about resonance in solid-state amplifiers: http://www.soundstage.com/maxdb/maxdb111998.htm


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## Patrick82

I don't hear much background noise anymore. Few days ago I wondered why it sounds so bad, then I looked at rack and noticed that the roll of coins on top of DAC1 had rolled back and was touching the top shelf. I put some blutac behind it so it stays still. Afterwards I didn't hear much noise anymore, hmm. Maybe I got used to the background noise and it doesn't bother me anymore. It doesn't feel like I need to upgrade anymore.




 I need to use that weight on top of DAC to suspend Feet correctly.


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_I don't hear much background noise anymore. Few days ago I wondered why it sounds so bad, then I looked at rack and noticed that the roll of coins on top of DAC1 had rolled back and was touching the top shelf. I put some blutac behind it so it stays still. Afterwards I didn't hear much noise anymore, hmm. Maybe I got used to the background noise and it doesn't bother me anymore. It doesn't feel like I need to upgrade anymore._

 

The reason for this was colder room temperature that masked the background noise:

http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showt...65#post2419965
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_I paused music for 1 hour and it sounded blacker and whiter. Background was black and treble was brighter, but bass was still warm. I liked that sound better! It was fake but it sounded more transparent.

 After 30 mins of listening I paused it for 2 hours more and the blackness had turned into coldness and low-level detail was gone! Bass was cold too. It sounds analytical.

 So first the highs get bright and edgy and later the bass gets cold. It sounds cold from top to bottom. 
 After only 3 hours it went from musical warmth into analytical coldness._

 

In a warm room the background noise was back.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 __________________________________________________ _

*ERS Paper*

 I got 32 sheets and used half of them to treat half of my system. It removed loads of background noise! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My system has never sounded this black before. There's still some noise left though, I believe it's AC noise.
 Deep bass of Benchmark DAC1 used to be empty, but it's now deeper and fuller than it ever was with Cary 303/300 CD player. Transients sound both sharper and rounder because of higher resolution, it sounds crazy. Highs are cleaner and I can hear the signature of Valhalla cable now. It sounds like the silver plating makes the highs separate from the bass, it sounds weird and unreal but I like it (for electronica this is THE cable!). It sounds very smooth and relaxing, grain is reduced and detail is improved.

 ERS Paper is definitely the best tweak ever, especially when combined with Valhalla!

 Weaknesses: None! The paper shouldn't be touching anything, putting paper too close makes it muddy. Half inch separation seems to be good enough.
 __________________________________

 Anyone who considers Valhalla digital cable, buy ERS Paper instead! It seems like digital cable is the least important part in my system. It still makes a huge difference but other tweaks are more huge.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Edit: Here are pictures and videos of ERS Paper: http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=205316


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## Patrick82

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Patrick82* 
_It is weird that $30k worth of cables are the weaknesses in my system. PS Audio GCC-100 amplifier is amazing that shows it all._

 

Ok, I figured it out. 1 conductor Valhalla power cord isn't possible without wrapping the cable in ERS Paper to remove background noise.

 I wrapped the 2 conductor Valhalla (2+2+1) between wall and power conditioner and it gave emphasized bass, detail was lost in background because of it. Less RFI/EMI gives more bass...
 So I disconnected a conductor and made it 1+1+1 like the rest of my system.

*First impressions 1+1+1 for wall (ERS):* OMG background is blacker and more revealing! Bass isn't emphasized anymore, there is more detail.

 You know what this means? You can buy a 2 meter Valhalla, cut it to 3x70cm, slice open the teflon and separate the 7 conductors, twist 3 conductors together like in the Vishnu. And then you have *7 Valhalla cables for the price of 1*, and you get better sound. If this isn't the greatest bargain I don't know what is!


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## BrianS

CRAZY NESS


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## Balisarda

Patrick: are you the one who tried the Brilliant Pebbles?


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