# 19 custom IEM/TF10/Shure/IE8 cables reviewed (Effect Pearl, Apollo, & Odin added 3/20/13)



## average_joe

[size=14.0pt]Multi-aftermarket cables for custom IEMs and TF10 evaluation thread[/size]
  
 average_joe’s (my google+ page) custom IEM aftermarket cable thread:  Many custom IEMs come with detachable cables, and as I own many custom IEMs that have detachable cables such as the JHA JH16, Rooth LS8, Starkey SA-43, EarSonics EM3 Pro,and Thousand Sound TS842 among others, but there are several aftermarket cables on the market that may improve looks, ergonomics, and possibly sound, not to mention replacement out of necessity if a cable goes bad.  My custom IEM review and resource thread is here.
  

  
 Cables evaluated:
 1) Several stock custom IEM cables
 2) Whiplash Audio TWag V2 OM (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
 3) Beat Audio Cronus (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
 4) Beat Audio Ruby Supreme (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
 5) Effect Studio Athena for Ultimate Ears TF10 (tested pin compatibility: TF10)
 6) Effect Studio Crystal for Ultimate Ears TF10 (tested pin compatibility: TF10)
 7) Jaben ES8 for Ultimate Ears TF10
 8) Null Audio Lune for Ultimate Ears TF10
 9) Null Audio Arete for Ultimate Ears TF10
 10) Chris_Himself cable for JHA, Westone, UE
 11) Moon Audio Silver Dragon for JHA, Westone, UE, UM, Rooth, Earsonics
 12) Crystal Piccolino for JHA, Westone, UE
 13) Double Helix Symbiote IEM cable for JHA, Westone, UE, Rooth, Earsonics, etc
 14) Uber Muzik V5f cable for TF10
- AudioSonus UE TF10 cable for TF10
 15) Whiplash Audio Hybrid V3
 16) Whiplash Audio TWag V3
 17) Effect Studio Pearl
 18) Effect Studio Apollo
 19) Effect Studio Odin
 20) Effect Studio Thor Silver
 21) Whiplash Audio TWau Reference Gold
 22) Whiplash Audio TWag V2 GOLD
  
kenman345's cable thread that lists information about the available aftermarket cables
 ​ *Science of Sound - cables*
 What is the science behind any possible sound differences between cables?  This Gizmodo article covers the topic in an understandable way, explaining that there is proven physics behind changes in sound.
  
 If you want to dive a little deeper you must start by understanding an analog signal, which is a very complex signal composed of different voltages and currents moving at different speeds (frequencies) representing different parts of the audio signal.  If you want to further understand analog signals, you can read here.
  
 The slower frequencies (bass) usually have more power than higher frequency signals (midrange and treble) and are therefore affected less from signal degrading factors such as resistance, capacitance, and impedance.  Conversely, fine details have less power than the main note in music so that would be the first thing that is lost.  Also, a primary tone can have harmonics at various levels that are much weaker than the main signal which are easier to affect with degrading factors.
  
 As the Gizmodo article mentions, there is resistivity, capacitance, inductance, dielectric, and skin depth can all affect the cable transmission properties.  Resistivity will only change significantly with different material properties, so let’s take a quick look at the differences from TBITECH innovations site (table has been simplified), especially between silver and copper which are used for the various cables tested.
  

 *[size=10.0pt]Material[/size]*
 *[size=10.0pt]Electrical conductivity[/size]*
 *[size=10.0pt]Electrical resistivity[/size]*
 *[size=10.0pt](10.E6 Siemens/m)[/size]*
 *[size=10.0pt](10.E-8 Ohm.m)[/size]*
  
  
  
 [size=10.0pt]Silver[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]62,1[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]1,6[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Copper[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]58,5[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]1,7[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Gold[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]44,2[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]2,3[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Aluminium[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]36,9[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]2,7[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Brass[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]15,9[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]6,3[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Nickel[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]14,3[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]7,0[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Tin[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]8,7[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]11,5[/size]

 [size=8.0pt]http://www.tibtech.com/conductivity.php[/size]
  
 Interpreting the chart, silver has the best electrical conductivity and therefore the least electrical resistivity.  This means that there is less resistance for an amp to push a signal through a wire.  The difference between copper and silver is very small, however I have read many times that silver is brighter than copper, which makes sense as the weaker signals (as mentioned above) pass through easier and at closer to their original power levels even when compared with copper with similar characteristics.  The increase in percent of power of the bass signals will be smaller, giving a perception of a brighter sound.
  
 How about the plug?  There are three typical types of plating on a plug, gold, silver, and nickel.  The primary reason for the plating is to protect the conductor from oxidization.  While this will affect the signal transmission as there are dissimilar metals present, leading to capacitance, the amount of increased resistance is small due to the very thin coating usually applied (gold can be deposited as thin as one atom thick).  The biggest issue is the actual material used for the connector as I have seen some cheaper connectors that have used bronze, however in the high end world of connectors I have not seen this.
  
 I won’t go into any additional technical details, as I am only intending to make a point that cables are different from an analog signal perspective.  You must decide if you can hear any differences.  It is my belief that humans can distinguish between tiny changes in sound that are hard to measure as proven by people that can echolocate with training, but somewhat difficult to determine the audible differences as human auditory memory of complex sounds is poor, but can be improved with practice.
  
Rating explanation
 - Ergonomics: Overall measure of ease of use of the cable in part due to length,  weight, ear hook/memory wire (if any), tangle resistance, feel, and memory effect.  A higher score on a scale of 1 to 10 indicates the cable is easier to.
 - Tangle Resistance: How easily the cable tangles after winding and with regular usage.  A higher score on a scale of 1 to 10 indicates that the cable is less prone to tangling.
 - Memory Effect: Over time, does the cable remember how it is twisted/bent and will it tend to bend that way even after straightened.  A higher score on a scale of 1 to 10 indicates less memory effect.
 - Build Quality: How well is the cable built which includes the plugs, connectors, Y-split, braiding, overcoat, and anything else that makes up the cable.  This is somewhat subjective as I don’t have the opportunity to use the cables for extended periods of time as they are loaners.  A higher score on a scale of 1 to 10 indicates a better built.
_*Note*_: Free form pictures are what the cable looks like after taking it out of a case where it was wrapped around 3 fingers before placing in the case.
  
*Cables*
*1) Stock custom IEM twisted cable*
 Many custom IEMs come with detachable cables.  These cables are usually twisted, lightweight, very flexible, and have great ergonomics.  There are two styles: silver and black.  While both are similar, they do have their differences and many manufacturers sometimes allow the buyer to select between the two styles.  Other than the style, the biggest difference between cables is the memory wire length and shape, making for a somewhat different fit, affecting how the cable stays on the ear, how easy it is to put on/take off, and how well it works with glasses.  Typically, the longer the memory wire the better the cable will stay put, but the more time it takes to put on and take off.
  
 Ergonomics is generally very good with stock twisted cables due to the extreme flexibility, light weight, and low amount of memory.  Durability seems average and I have had some of the braiding unravel to an extent, but I can always twist it back to normal.  The thickness of the cables is on the thinner side of the spectrum for the black cables and about average for the silver cables, but both seem durable and without issue.
  
 I have noticed usability differences between the silver and black wires, as the black wires use black plastic and the silver wires are clear coated.  In my general experience with both, the black cable seems a little more tangle resistant with less memory effect.  Given a choice I would take black over the initially better looking silver cables.
  
     
Images from left to right: Starkey SA-43 cable, Earsonics EM3 Pro cable, JHA JH16 cable, Kozee Infinity X3 cable, Rooth LS8 cable, silver cable turns green
  
 Ergonomics: Depends on the ear hooks/memory wire
 Tangle Resistance: ~7 (depends on the cable)
 Memory Effect: ~10 (depends on the cable)
 Build Quality: Average (depends on the cable)
 Options: Depends on the manufacturer; sometimes a choice between either black or silver and different lengths
  
 Stock Pin Size Chart (all 4 pins measured):

*Cable*​*Size (inches)*​*Size (mm)*​Jerry Harvey Audio JH160.029​0.75​Ultimate Ears Reference Monitor0.029​0.75​Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 100.027​0.68​Thousand Sound TS8420.028​0.72​Rooth LS80.029​0.75​Ear Sonics EM3 Pro0.029​0.74​Starkey SA-430.029​0.73​Kozee Infinity X30.029​0.75​
  
  
 1a) Ultimate Ears In-Ear Reference Cable $40
 Why does the UERM cable (and all new UE monitors after September 1, 2010) have their own entry?  Because they are different and IMO better than other stock cables in many ways.  First, the shell connectors fit over a protruding socket for a secure fit with a great angle that works well in my ears.  Next the actual cable uses a very tight braid for the area between the nice looking 3.5mm plug and the Y-split and then after the Y-split the cable uses a very tight twist.  The cable uses 4 wires to avoid issues that can be caused by splitting one wire to two at the Y-split.
  
  
  
 The cable is built like a tank, has no memory, isn't easy to tangle, and ergonomically is very nice.
  
 Ergonomics: 10
 Tangle Resistance: 9
 Memory Effect: 9.5
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: No, protruding sockets
 Options: 48" or 64"; black or clear
  
*2) Whiplash Audio TWag v2 OM*_  - $325_
 TWag indicates twisted stranded silver wire (AG is the acronym for silver on the periodic table), and the TWag v2 uses 4 individual wires that are braided from the plug, which is a Oyide 90° plug, and then breaks out to twisted pairs of wire after the Y-split.  The Oyide connector is very solidly constructed and is about as long as a Neutrik 90° plug but with a flat profile which can be good or bad depending on your equipment.  The flat profile will interfere if there are knobs or switches on the plug side of your source, such as the Pico Slim which has a volume knob on one side of the jack and the power switch on the other therefore  when used with the Pico Slim the connector must be at a certain angle.
  
 The wires are fairly thick for a custom IEM cable, but not too thick to detract from ergonomics.   No memory wire is used at the IEM connector, but this is not an issue.  The cable did develop some memory of the way they are bent around my ear but didn’t develop memory when wrapping it for storage.  Durability does seem great with the TWag cable as the thick cables and overall design seem like they can take some abuse and I have not encountered any unbraiding in my 6+ months with the cable, unlike stock cables.
  
 The cable looks amazing and is a piece of eye candy with quad braid of the main cable and a wooden cable cinch, which is a nice touch.  Combined with the Oyide plug, it draws even more attention to a custom earphone when in public.  However, as copper turns green, silver turns black and my TWag now has a slight black tinge near the plug on all 4 wires going up about an inch, although you have to look for it to see it. 
  
     
Images from left to right: Free form shape, shell connectors, 3.5mm plug, slider, oxidation, with EM3 Pro
  
TWag with the EM3 Pro: Sonic differences with the TWag cable have been discussed in length, and I have also evaluated the performance of the TWag with my EM3 Pro.  The EM3 Pro has a very thick and rich presentation, sacrificing clarity for ambiance.  With the TWag vs. the stock cable the EM3 Pro improves in clarity, increasing instrument separation and micro-detail of instruments.  This comes with a slightly brighter presentation, larger overall soundstage and faster leading edge.  While I wouldn’t term these changes as large, I would say they greatly affect my enjoyment of the EM3 Pro and make some sources I didn’t think were a good match work for me.
  
TWag with the LS8: Now, moving to the TWag with the LS8, which is the opposite of the EM3 Pro, with a bright, spacious and crystal clear presentation, the TWag cable changed several characteristics.  It improved the treble smoothness, speed, and instrument separation, although less than with the EM3 Pro, but it also changed the soundstage shape to something that didn’t sound as natural of dimensionally accurate.  Because of the negative effect on the soundstage I prefer the stock cable over the TWag with the LS8.
  
TWag with the Infinity X3: Due to the X3 having a clear shell, the TWag cable looked great when attached, but wasn’t a huge step up in usability vs. the stock cable.  Sonically, the X3 has a grain to the sound with an aggressive sound signature and the cable didn’t change the sound much if at all.
  
 Here is a PM comment from a well respected head-fi member that borrowed my TWag cable for use with his Westone ES5: “[size=9.0pt]I love the TWAg w/ the ES5 tbh.  I was hoping it would be the last piece of the puzzle to enhance the treble and clarity even further and balance out the bass a bit.  Definitely the missing link I was hoping they would be.  That extra Nth degree of perfection.”[/size]
  
with SA-43: The TWag fits the SA-43 nicely and looks great with the clear colored shell.  Sonically the treble is accentuated and brought forward while the overall clarity is increased a bit, although not by a large margin.  The treble quality retains its high level of smoothness along with detail giving very good results.  The soundstage really isn't changed, which isn't a bad thing as the SA-43 soundstage is great.  Detail levels are improved a bit both in ease of hearing the details and marginally to the recreation of micro-details.  Dynamics are slightly improved with lower end sources.
  
with JH16: With a perfect fit the TWag is a great match looks and fit wise with the JH16.  Sonically the overall presentation gets filled out both in note thickness and in soundstage depth.  While the note thickness change is minor, it makes a noticeable difference for long term enjoyment and adding a liquidity and richness to the sound.  The biggest improvement however is the depth of the soundstage which I found relatively on the shallow side when compared with other similarly priced custom IEMs.  The changes aren't huge, but with spacious tracks the improvement is noteworthy and brings the performance about on par with the stock LS8.
  
with UERM: Fit is fine with the UERM protruding sockets, although not quite as nice as the stock cable fit.  Sonically the TWag adds ambiance to the presentation and adds noticeable improvements to instrument separation and clarity.  It does this while adding to the bright, leaner sound (for a custom IEM at this level) which can be a turn off as it accentuates the already accentuated parts of the UERM frequency spectrum.  Although the treble quality is improved with the TWag.
  
  
with EM4: The TWag fits the recessed sockets of the EM4 very securely and match well with the EM4.  The TWag cable brightens the EM4, adds speed, detail, bass weight, and impact to the sound.  With the TWag well mastered tracks exhibit more detail, but the sound becomes more analytical, and poorly mastered tracks sound worse due to the imperfections being brought out.  Essentially, the TWag pushes the sound of the EM4 closer to that of the JH16.  Inverting the polarity of the TWag (note the dot location of the EM4 cable; the TWag shares the polarity) pulls back the midrange and keeps the treble closer to stock, but the sound is just slightly off.
  
with 8.A (vs. Magnus 1): The TWag doesn’t fit the 8.A too tightly, so a slight flattening of the pins and/or bending of the pins will create a more secure fit.  Note I am comparing the TWag with the Magnus 1 cable from Heir Audio.  The TWag adds brightness, some added detail and refinement within the soundstage, which can have a good deal more depth with spacious tracks.  However, there is less bass emphasis and the bass control is a good deal worse with poor mastered tracks.  The performance continues through the rest of the spectrum, as bad tracks give bad results while well mastered tracks reap small benefits.  Bass is punchier and in general more well defined with the Magnus 1, but the TWag will brighten the presentation for better or worse.
  
*Summary*: The TWag cable is a nice looking cable with very good ergonomics, a great look, great build quality, and a large price tag.  Depending on the sound signature of the paired IEM, the TWag can add clarity and add refinement to the sound leading to more musical enjoyment and better pairing with lower end sources.  Combine that with all the options and the TWag cable is a strong contender in the aftermarket cable world.
  
 Ergonomics: 8
 Tangle Resistance: 5
 Memory Effect: 8
 Build Quality: 10
 Price: $325
 Options: connectors – ViaBlue 3.5mm, Oyaide Straight 3.5MM ($30), Oyaide Right Angle 3.5MM ($30), CryoParts Custom Cryo'd XLRs ($30), Furutech XLR ($80), CryoParts Custom Carbon 1/4" ($30), Switchcraft Right Angle 3.5MM ($15), Protector Balanced, 6Pin iBasso ($15); Cable length – 48 inches, 64 inches ($50); wire type - TWag v2 Eclipse (black), TWag v2 Clear, TWSpc (-$26), TWcu (-$50)
  
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*3) Beat Audio Cronus*_ - $289.00_
 The Cronus is a thick all black cable that used to be the Beat Auido flagship, however it is not 2nd in the line below the new flagship Oslo cable (the Oslo, and Hera are available with a balanced connector for the Protector and SR-71B).  The plug on the Cronus I auditioned was terminated with a ViaBlue 3.5mm plug and the shell connectors are relatively large with a beveled end for use with recessed sockets.  They don't use memory wire but have a permanently curved plastic ear guide that conforms to your ear which works well with my ears.  Even though the cable is thick and coated, it is still flexible.
  
     
Images from left to right: free form, ear guides, 3.5mm connector, Y-split, with Rooth LS8, with Starkey SA-43
  
Cronus with LS8 and SA-43: I tried the cable with my Rooth LS8 and Starkey SA-43.  The pins are slightly larger in diameter than the stock pins of both which did two things: it formed a very tight bond with the jack and it loosed the shell contacts slightly.  Therefore, since the Cronus is a loaner I have decided not to do serious A/Bing to save stretching my pins in the jacks any more than they already have been stretched.
  
Cronus with EM3 Pro: I did try the Cronus on the EM3 Pro which did fit well and did not cause a problem with the stock cable or TWag cable after use possibly due to the socket being recessed and helping to hold the cables in place.  My source was the HUD-MX1 with OPA1611 op amp installed via FLAC and mp3 files through Winamp.  In comparison with the stock cable, the Cronus clears up the top end and results in a smoother presentation overall (I thought the EM3 Pro already smooth) while bringing additional clarity and resolution.  The differences when A/Bing is readily apparent to my ears in the smoothness and treble presentation.  For example, the ticking at the beginning of Epica Indigo was not well defined with the stock cable, but it was very articulate with the Cronus cable!
  
 Although I could not compare the TWag with the Cronus since my TWag is on loan, from memory they both perform differently.  The Cronus didn’t seem to increase imaging or change the soundstage in any way while the TWag did.  Now that the Cronus has been sent back I can’t do a direct comparison.
  
*Summary*: The Cronus cable is surprisingly agile given the thickness and is pleasant to use, however it did retain memory of the wrapping which caused it to want to coil.  Overall the cable offer nice elegance and sonic improvement to go along with the looks and very good tangle resistance.  While priced high, the Cronus is a nice aftermarket cable for those that want elegance, stellar build quality, and something that will add refinement to the sound of their custom IEMs.  You can read Project86's thread here.
  
 Ergonomics: 7
 Tangle Resistance: 8
 Memory Effect: 6
 Build Quality: 10
 Price: $289
 Options: Shell connector - UM, JH, UE, TF10, IE8, SE535, or other; socket connection - flat or recessed; audio jack – Beat Audio 3.5mm, ViaBlue 3.5mm, Protector/SR-71B balanced
  
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*4) Beat Audio Supreme Rose*_ - $99.00_
 The Supreme Rose draws oohs and aahs with a great designer look.  Part of the Supreme series which comes in various colors, the Supreme Rose is ruby red and black that is intertwined and then single color after they Y-split.  So, aside from the eye candy aspects, how does feel and is it worth the $100 over the stock cable?  First, the 3.5 mm connector is a Sennheiser straight plug that is aesthetically pleasing and the cable and the shell connectors are good looking, although rather large. 
  
 Ergonomically the Supreme rose is above average in terms of overall ease of use.  The cable doesn’t have the flexibility of a stock twisted cable but the build quality seems much better for the long term.  There is some memory effect with the cable after having if coiled in a case, but it isn’t too bad.  Tangling, while not impossible, is better than the majority of cables I have used throughout the years.
  
     
Images from left to right: free form, ear hooks, 3.5mm plug, Y-Split, with SA-43, with EM3 Pro
  
Supreme Rose with the EM3 Pro: Comparing with the stock cable for the EM3 Pro didn’t result in much audible difference.  What I did detect was a little wider but flatter soundstage and a little more clarity, but lower in magnitude compared with the Cronus or TWag cable.  Again, with the ticking at the beginning of Epica – Indio (as mentioned in the Crouns review) there was improvement in the ability to make out the fine details in the song, but not nearly as large.  
  
Supreme Rose with the JH16: Due to time restrictions I only A/Bed one song with the JH16 (Anedio D1 as a source): Eric Clapton - Layla.  The biggest change was in his voice as the Rose smoothed a slight edge I didn't know was there until I compared the two.
                                                        
 The changes with the Supreme Rose are not in the order of those experienced with the TWag or Cronus cables, but are there as an added bonus to the great looks.  For the price, the Supreme series is a viable choice if you are looking for a great look, good ergonomics, and possibly a little better sound quality.
  
*Summary*: The Supreme Rose not only looks amazing, is ergonomically pleasing in general operation, and built to last, but it does offer some sonic benefits over stock cables at a very reasonable price.  The Supreme series is easy to recommend if you need to replace your stock cable and should be given strong consideration if you want to upgrade with something flashier!  You can read Project86's thread here.
  
 Ergonomics: 6
 Tangle Resistance: 7 
 Memory Effect: 6
 Build Quality: 9
 Price: $99
 Options: Shell connector - UM, JH, UE, TF10, IE8, SE535, or other; socket connection - flat or recessed; audio jack – Yarbo, Beat Audio 3.5mm, right angled Neutrik; different colors are available in different “supreme” variations.
  
 Additional Pictures, Supreme - Rhyme:
   
  
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*5) Effect Studio Athena V1.1*_ - $79.90_
 The Athena uses silver stranded wire and come in 3 versions, quad braided (Athena V1.1), 6 wire braided (Athena), and 8 wire braided (Athena V1.2); I have the V1.1.  The Athena looks great in person with good construction and ergonomics.  The weakest part of the build quality is the IEM connectors which are encased in heat shrink, not molded plastic like the other cables I have.  A long/short pin confiruation is used to indicate polarity with the XXX pin indicating positive.  but encased in heat shrink with a long pin indicating polarity.  However, they do seem like they will last if taken care of.  Pin compatibility is for UE connectors, so they only work with my Thousand Sound TS842 and my universal TF10.  The internal wire is stranded silver, so the price for stranded silver is excellent.
  
    
Images from left to right: free form, 3.5mm plug, Y-split, with TS842, stock, Crystal, and Athena with TF10 and TS842
  
Athena with TS842: Using the Athena with the TS842, which has an edge to it when compared with custom IEMs that cost significantly more, resulted in a smoother and more refined sound overall.  The characteristics across the mids and treble improved by smoothing out the presentation while improving imaging and detail.  Using the 801->Pico Slim as a source, currently my most detailed setup, the improvement was very good, pushing the performance of the TS842 closer to the higher priced competitors, however still not reaching their levels.  The detail differences between  the 801->Pico Slim and HUD for example were more noticeable with the Athena cable.  Frequency response didn’t change much, but the bass was quicker with a better leading edge resulting in more impact and the overall, but the treble was still as prevalent as with the stock cable.
  
Athena with TF10: Using the Athena cable with the TF10 resulted in an improvement, but the improvements weren’t as large as with the TS842.  The TS842 is better overall in detail, transparency, soundstage, size, and many other factors and appears to have more headroom for improvements.  None-the-less, the overall clarity improved as did bass impact and the treble was cleaned up.  There were arguably no changes in the midrange presentation. 
  
*Summary*: The Athena cable is a nice looking and very functional cable with a great affordability and readily apparent sonic benefit for the TS842 and some benefit to the TF10.  However, build quality isn’t stellar but the cable does seem like it will be at least as durable as a stock cable, but more than likely better.  If you have a TF10 style connector for a custom IEM the Athena is a great value!
  
 Ergonomics: 6
 Tangle Resistance: 6
 Memory Effect: 6
 Build Quality: 5
 Options: Colors – gold or orange; memory wire ($5); Pailiccs straight plug
  
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*6) Effect Studio Crystal*_ - $34.90_
 Before I received the entry level Effect Audio Crystal cable I thought it looked amazing in pictures and since I know several people that want a low priced cable to replace their stock TF10 cable, the Crystal seemed like it may be a great choice.  The braiding and look are impressive in person, but in use the Crystal cable had some issues.  First, the connector for the IEM shell is a little on the large side and isn’t as aesthetically pleasing as the rest of the cable, and the biggest issue I had with the cable is the memory effect and the cable did have more than its fair share of tangles.  The issues stem from the flat braiding, so if the cable is twisted the wrong way it is problematic.  Over time I did learn how to best use the Crystal cable which allowed me to raise the ergonomics score to 4/10.  
  
 Build quality seems good for the most part except for IEM shell connector, which is not molded plastic but heat shrink.  While I don’t think this will be a long term durability issue, it isn’t as sturdy as molded plastic jacks.  The actual cable is a little on the stiffer side, so it isn’t as flexible as others.  The Neutrik plug is sturdily attached with good strain relief.  The Crystal cable was made for a TF10 and the TS842 pins are slightly larger resulting in a somewhat lose fit, however I was able to use the Crystal with the TS842 for sound testing.
  
   
From left to right: free form, 3.5mm plug, shell connector with TF10, Y-split
  
Crystal with the TS842: Performing listening tests against the TS842 stock cable, the crystal cable changed the sound slightly as well in a different way vs. the Athena.  The sound was “cleaned up,” adding a little clarity and some added speed in the bass region.  The bass increase in bass speed resulted in more bass impact while changing the tonal characteristics a little toward the bass presentation.  A little bit of the treble edge was removed on some of the tracks where it was more noticeable, although I could consider the change very small.  The improved clarity didn’t result in much of a change in the imaging, but instrument separation and micro-detail was easier to hear.  
  
*Summary*: There are tradeoffs with the low priced Crystal cable as you will get a better looking cable but the ergonomics aren’t up to par with a stock twisted cable.  However, they are close to a TF10 cable.  The biggest issue with the Crystal cable is the memory effect and twisting due to the flat braid of less flexible wire.  For the price you aren't going to get the best ergonomics, you get great looks and possibly some small sonic improvements.
  
 Ergonomics: 4
 Tangle Resistance: 3
 Memory Effect: 2
 Build Quality: 5
 Options: Multi-color ($5); memory wire ($5); Pailiccs straight plug
  
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*7) Jaben ES8*_ - $38 (2 for 1 special while supplies last)_
 The ES8 is a replacement cable for the UE Triple.fi 10 that uses a 3 wire twisted design similar to the standard black custom IEM cable.  Stock TF10 cables are not very ergonomically friendly and therefore many people look to upgrade from the stock cable.  Build quality of the cable seems to be OK as the connectors and plug seem durable, the memory wire is done well, but the wire twisting is not very tight, especially above the Y-split.  This leads to a less than quality look and the cable is more prone to catch on something than a well twisted cable.  The lack of tightness may also lead to premature unraveling, but I have not experienced this in my usage to date.  And if it does unravel it is usually easy to twist back into form.
  
       
Pictures (from left to right): ES8 cable; Y-split and plug; free form; picture showing the loose twisting/braiding; with TF10; with TS842; connected to the TS842; cable comparison between the SE 5-way cable (top) and ES8 cable (bottom)
  
 Upon inspection of my 2 UE cables, both that came with TF10s, the iv version has recessed sockets and the regular version does not.  The ES8 cable does have recessed sockets which do fit the TF10 much better than non-recessed sockets.
  
ES8 with TF10: From a sound quality perspective I found no discernable difference between the stock TF10 cable and the ES8 cable.  From a usability standpoint the ES8 cable is ergonomically much better due to the flexibility and lack of a memory effect/spring effect.
  
ES8 with TS842: The ES8 does fit the TS842, but the pin length is relatively short since the shell plug pins are recessed.  Even thought the pins are recessed the cable seems stable and did not come lose or come off during use over several days.  The stock TS842 cable is similar to a stock TF10 cable but does sound better, and without the recessed pins.  Sound quality wise the ES8 sounds about the same as the stock TS842 cable, although there may or may not be a slight improvement in the treble smoothness with the ES8 cable.  Ergonomically the ES8 is a big step up IMO.
  
*Summary*: From a price/ergonomic standpoint the ES8 cable is a nice, affordable replacement cable for a TF10 or a custom like the TS842, although the recessed jacks do present a potential issue.
  
 Ergonomics: 7
 Tangle Resistance: 6
 Memory Effect: 1
 Build Quality: 5
 Options: None
  
 -------------------------
  
*8) Null Audio Lune* series $128.40 USD
 [size=11.0pt]Null Audio is a household name for cables on head-fi so it is only natural to test some of their cables and Kevin agreed to send me the Lune and Arete to review.  The review sample Lune is fully enclosed in a nylon sleeve from connector to connector over silver wire.  Construction is of a high quality with solid pins and the nice smaller than I have seen Viablue 3.5mm connectors; the biggest build quality nit-pick I have is the Y-split, which is heat shrink over a plastic tube that covers the actual split.  It appears solid but I have seen nicer designs.  There is a piece of heat shrink tube after the Y-split for a cable slider.[/size]
  
       
Pictures (left to right): Cable 3.5mm plug, Y-split, & shell connectors; free form; with JH16; with TS842; with SA-43; with TF10; with customized TF10 (used for sound testing; sockets are shallow); example of a kink
  
 [size=11.0pt]With the TF10 I found absolutely nothing wrong with the ergonomics, however with custom IEMs the shape of the ear guide isn't ideal and is at a non-standard angle as it is bent sideways but it still works (Null Audio informed me that you can use a hair dryer to gently heat the ear guide and reshape it, and make sure to not heat the connector).  This cable _is_ for a TF10, so this really isn't an issue, however you can flatten the pins ever so slightly with pliers which will make the cable stay put in larger sockets but eliminate TF10 compatibility.  The cable is extremely flexible with no memory effect and very light weight making for a very good cable experience.  The biggest usability issue with the Lune is that it can kink, as the cable will sometimes wrap around and if pulled form a permanent kink.  It is worth noting that I have spent countless hours over my life untangling headphone cables and the Lune is pretty much immune to tangling.  [/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with TF10[/size][size=11.0pt]: Fit with the TF10 is very tight and although the shell plugs on the Lune don’t cover the part of the connector for recessed pins, it is not coming loose (sockets of the reshelled TF10 used for testing are very shallow).  Use with the TF10 is a vast improvement over the stock cable in usability and the cable has a nice look and feel.  Compared with the stock cable the Lune brings the mids more forward and cleans up the entire spectrum, smoothing the edges of the treble and improving the deep bass performance to go along with a little better clarity.  Overall the Lune is a winner with the TF10 in form, fit, and function (sound).[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with SA-43[/size][size=11.0pt]: I thought I would try a custom IEM even though the Lune is made for the TF10.  The cable is slightly loose with the SA-43, but still stays put well enough for this testing and may for light use if you bend the cable pins, but a shell did come off during extended use.  When A/Bing with the stock cable, the biggest improvement was with the width of the presentation, however the midrange becomes more forward changing the definition of the space resulting in what sounds like incorrect placement to my ears.  [/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with JH16[/size][size=11.0pt]: The fit is slightly tighter than with the SA-43, which may be because I stretched the SA-43 sockets with the Cronus.  Anyways, the Lune is usable with the JH16 form a fit perspective and more than likely would not come off during use, especially if you bent the pins.  As with the other IEMs, the Lune brings the mids more forward, but at the same time the overall soundstage is slightly flattened.  I didn’t notice any additional changes in the sound.  For the reasonable price and ergonomics, the Lune can be used if you want a more mid-forward presentation at a reasonable price.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: The Lune has the best ergonomics of any cable I have used; combine that with great build quality and no memory effect to go along with improved sound with the TF10, which it was designed to be used with.  The only usage issue I had was possible kinking, but that is easily avoidable.  The cable also comes with a Shure connector option, but I have not tested the Lune with Shure IEMs since I don't own any.  Benefits with custom IEMs are marginal and dependent on the model, however Null Audio makes other cables that are designed for custom IEMs.  Overall, it is hard to beat the Lune as a TF10 upgrade cable.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 9.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 9[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: No[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: Connector shell plug: TF10, Shure, or Livewire T1; 3.5mm plug: Viablue (straight), Neutrik (right angle); Nylon sleeve, yes or no (-$7.07 USD)[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]---------------------[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]*9) Null Audio Arete* $82 USD[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Not yet released at the time of writing, the Arete cable uses a premium grade OFC wire with a small Viablue straight plug and nylon overbraid up to the Y-split where it then uses black twisted wire.   There is a piece of heat shrink tube after the Y-split for a cable slider.  Ear guides made from shaped plastic keep the Arete in place and work quite well with a TF10 (Null Audio informed me that you can use a hair dryer to gently heat the ear guide and reshape it, and make sure to not heat the connector).  Look, feel, and ergonomics are good, but a step below the Lune since the twisted cable above the Y-split does tangle more than the Lune, although it isn't too bad but any tangling is more than the Lune since it doesn't tangle.  I highly recommend requesting the nylon sleeve if you order the Arete.[/size]
  
      
Images (left to right): Arete cable; Cable 3.5mm plug, Y-spit, & shell connectors; free form; with TF10; with reshelled TF10; with TS842l with JH16
  
 [size=11.0pt]The weakest part of the cable is after the Y-split as the twists weren’t the tightest and did untwist.  In use the cable is very light and ergonomically pleasing, but not quite as good as the Lune with the overbraid after the Y-split.  Overall the cable is very good for the price and a joy to use and can be used with other custom IEMs with larger sockets by flattening the pins ever so slightly with pliers.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with TF10[/size][size=11.0pt]: Ergonomically the Arete is far superior to the stock cable and fits perfectly (sockets of the reshelled TF10 used for testing are very shallow).  Sonically I was surprised by the improvement with the Arete cable; the mids are slightly pulled forward, the bass is more defined, deeper, and punchier, and there is overall better clarity to go along with a more focused and airy/spacious presentation due to better imaging.  The differences aren’t night and day, but they are very noticeable to my ears; with the Arete cable the TF10 is more competitive in the world of high end universals.  The combo of sound and ergonomics for the price are extremely impressive.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with TS842[/size][size=11.0pt]: The fit with the TS842 is tight and the cable stays put.  Sound wise the Arete cable pulls the TS842 mids forward although the bass is somewhat tamed.  The stock cable has slightly smoother treble and a slightly wider presentation with a more laid back overall sound.  One of the results of the Arete cable is the TS842 sound signature is more coherent across the frequency spectrum.  While there are some minor sonic improvements, this is more of a different sound than an improvement IMO, although ergonomically the improvement is huge.  [/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with EM3 Pro[/size][size=11.0pt]: While it doesn’t stay in the recessed socket, the pins are long enough to use with the EM3 Pro for a quick test.  I decided to do this just for the results with detachable cable custom IEMs that have a darker signature and may fit.  The soundstage space improved quite a bit including the imaging, instrument separation, and instrument placement.  Clarity is improved as well and if it fit, this would be a very good combo, especially for the price.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with JH16[/size][size=11.0pt]: As with the Lune, the Arete works with the JH16, although the pins aren't as snug as the stock cable.  Sonically the Arete brings the mids of the JH16 more forward compared with the stock cable but also adds a bit of smoothness and refinement to the sound as well as additional air.  If you are looking for a slightly more mid-forward presentation from your JH16, the Arete will deliver while improving other aspects of the sound and not flattening the sound as the Lune does.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]Comparing the Arete with the Lune using the TF10[/size][size=11.0pt]: The Arete cable gives a more spacious and concise/focused presentation than the Lune cable, which may or may not sound a little more bass heavy.  The Lune is more mid-forward than the Arete, but overall I hear the Arete cable as technically better, but more laid back yet with better clarity.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: The Arete is not only cheaper than the Lune, but sonically I find it superior, not only with the TF10, but when paired with custom IEMs.  Ergonomics are almost on par with the Lune, but if an overbraid is used after the Y-split it would also achieve the same perfect 10 score.  The Arete is great from a cost/performance perspective.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 9[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 8[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 9.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 7[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: No[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: TBD[/size]
  
 ---------------------
  
*10) Chris_Himself's Cable* [size=11.0pt]$75 + shipping[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]I first saw the Chris_Himself (CH)cables by accident and with a little more research found that Chris (and Ted) make silver cables at low prices with an amazing warranty, and Chris is also very nice and responsive!  Ted put a had written note in with the cable explaining the cable pin orientation, a nice touch (red is right ground, blue is let ground among other things).  The cable looks good, but isn't quite the eye candy that some of the others are, although the wooden Y-split and cable cinch are classy.  Chris will ship anywhere.  [/size]
  
        
Images (from left to right, click on image to enlarge): cable; cable un-tied; free-form; 3.5mm jack; Y-split and cable cinch; shell connectors; with UERM; with UERM; with JH16
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomically the cable isn't the best as it uses solid core silver wire that is noticeably stiffer than stranded wire, but is usable.  The stiffer wire results in a memory effect and the cable doesn't just fall to where you would expect it to go as the stock cables do.  With much less flexibility than all the other cables I have tried to date the cable can be unwieldy at times and has more microphonics than other cables during movement.  However, when properly bending the memory wire into place, which is more difficult than is typical due to the very stiff memory wire, the microphonics go away.  It is more difficult to get the memory wire to conform to the ear as I had to over-bend the memory wire, but it is necessary to get a good fit due to the microphonics.  This is a case where a little longer bit of memory wire would be nice.  [/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Another ergonomic issue is kinking, which is not necessarily more prevalent than other cables, but possible due to the stiffness if the wire retains a shape, as it will, and then you straighten the cable.  However, due to the memory effect and stiffness the cable is very tangle resistant.  With all that said, the CH cable is user friendly enough for daily use, especially at a desk and light walking.  Build quality looks good and Chris told me he builds them to last since he can't afford to replace them at the prices he sells at.  Ted will repair the cables if something should fail, but of course this only covers the workmanship and not rouch use.  [/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Before any testing I did burn the cable in for about 300+ hours.  During my testing I did encounter an intermittent failure on the right channel near the shell connector, seemingly in the cable area covered by the memory wire.  Chris will repair the cable after I send it back to him and I think this may be more the solid core wire than the build quality.  This is something I experienced when I worked with solid core silver wire, which is a random break in the wire every once in a great while.  This isn't common, but more common than with stranded wire (although I have had many people contact me because their stock/aftermarket cables have had issues), so it didn't take the build quality score down too much.  I will get the cable repaired and test longer term to see if I can repeat the issue.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with SA-43[/size][size=11.0pt]: The cable fits the SA-43 pins well, is very secure, and doesn't easily come out.  Sonically space and instrument placement improve with the CH cable vs. the stock cable resulting in higher definition of the already good recreation of space.  Clarity is also increased as is treble presence resulting in a more refined sound with more apparent detail.  Bass is more powerful and enhanced as well and the sound and overall the sound is a little more punchy and dynamic, adding a nice touch to the more neutral sound with the stock cable. A nice upgrade strengthening some of the SA-43 attributes while keeping the strengths intact.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with JH16[/size][size=11.0pt]: The cable fits very well and looks great with the JH16.  Sonically the JH16 is taken to another level of refinement and the soundstage space improves in proportion, recreating a more 3D space, which is the biggest weakness of the JH16 in my opinion.  The changes have a trickledown effect improving the realism, clarity, instrument placement and instrument separation.  Highly recommended for any JH16 owner that doesn’t want to spend a lot.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with LS8[/size][size=11.0pt]: Unfortunately the connectors don't fit in the recessed sockets.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with EM3 Pro[/size][size=11.0pt]: Unfortunately the connectors don't fit in the recessed sockets.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with UERM[/size][size=11.0pt]: The cable fits the UERM fine and won't fall off even though the sockets are extended vs. flush.  Sonically the CH cable has a brighter and even more analytical presentation than the stock cable as well as expanding the soundstage and adding clarity to the already clear presentation.  Bass is more impactful and improves the texturing, treble is slightly smoother with more apparent micro-detail to go along with a small bump in dynamics.  While the changes themselves aren't large, the overall affect when switching back to the stock cable leaves me wanting the CH cable even though it is brighter.  The sound signature can be bothersome to me with brighter songs when using the CH cable, but overall it is still difficult for me to go back to the stock cable as the overall presentation is more refined and realistic.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with TF10 Reshell[/size][size=11.0pt]: The pins don't fit all the way into the sockets in the Kozee reshell, but the fit is secure.  Sonically the TF10 improves dramatically with a more 3D presentation, better clarity, and an overall more refined and smoother sound.  The midrange is brought to a more forward position, more than likely because the added soundstage depth.  Switching back to the stock cable is a huge disappointment, but with the CH cable the TF10 actually takes a step up the performance ladder and stops me from wanting to take the TF10 out of my ears after a few seconds of listening.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with Infinity X3[/size][size=11.0pt]: The fit is the same as with the Kozee TF10 reshell, the pins don't go in all the way but the fit is secure.  As far as the sound goes, the changes aren't all that large here with a slight increase in the depth of the presentation and a bit of added clarity and smoothness.  [/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with wx i9pro[/size][size=11.0pt]: The pins are a little looser than that of the stock cable, so the fit isn't all that secure.  Of course you can use pliers to expand the pins and get them to stay.  The stock cable uses FST, so this is more than a difference in cable quality.  And with the stock cable the i9pro does sound more spacious and more alive than the CH cable.  The CH cable does have a more traditional flatter presentation and the i9pro is brightened with better instrument separation and the detail levels are taken up a notch, but at the expense of the spacious and dynamic presentation the FST gives. This might be a cable to try with the i9pro to get a different sound.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]with aud 5X[/size][size=11.0pt]: Fit with the CH cable is extremely tight and will not come off in use as the cable is a little difficult to change for my testing even though the pins don't go in all the way.  Sonically, as with most other IEMs the CH cable offers a noticeable difference with a larger space and a little more treble presence.  The larger space results in more instrument separation, clarity, and apparent detail.  Overall the presentation is improved and refined, again boosting performance.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: One of the best sounding cables I have heard at a very affordable price and synergizes well with most of the custom IEMs I have paired it with.  But the ergonomics make this cable one of my least favorite to use.  Chris is very nice, responsive and the warranty seems pretty good with Ted repairing the cables if anything happens.  I did have an issue with this cable, but per Chris that is not normal.  For this price and performance, if you can deal with the stiff wire, you may want to get 2 so you can have a backup just in case![/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 9[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 3[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 7 (was 9.5 until I had the issue)[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: No[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: Chris will work with you[/size]
  
 ---------------------
  
*11) Moon Audio Silver Dragon V1 IEM Cable* $175
 The Silver Dragon (SD) looks different than all of my other custom IEM cables in that it uses a dual cable system where each channel is in a separate jacket. The dual cables are molded together below the Y-split and separated (of course) above the Y-split.  The cable is fairly thick and has a slight stiffness to it.  It isn't the most flexible cable, but it also doesn't tangle easily nor does it have much memory. The shell connectors are molded and fit in recessed sockets.
  
      
Images (from left to right, click for larger picture): free-form; plug, Y-split, shell connectors; plug, Y-split, shell connectors; with EM3 Pro; with UERM; with JH16; with LS8
  
 Ergonomics are good due to the lack of memory and tangling, however the lower flexibility doesn't allow the cable to disappear in use as much as some of the other cables.  Above the Y-split the cable has a seam where the cable was once joined, however this seam is smooth and not an issue at all.  The Y-split itself is small and has heat shrink over it.  Overall the SD is nice to use and the molded plugs appear well constructed and compact.  Build quality looks excellent.
  
with JH16: The pins fit perfectly with no need to be concerned about the shell coming off.  When A/Bing with the stock cable, the first thing I noticed was additional warmth and bass weight the SD cable added to the sound.  This difference, while not huge, is due to the bass with the SD cable is presented in a more forward way, as is the rest of the frequency spectrum.  Because the presentation is more forward and the depth remains about the same, the overall presentation is more 3D while retaining and even adding a bit to the width.  Harshness in less than perfect recordings is smoother leading to go along with better clarity, however there isn't much improvement in instrument separation.
  
with UERM: Fit is secure with the UERM as any other aftermarket cable I have come across, but not as secure as with the stock cable.  Sonically the SD adds a bit of spaciousness to an already spacious presentation while smoothing out the treble a bit.  Even though the SD smoothes the treble, it is also has a little more brightness which results in a more revealing treble, good or bad.  While the combination is a slight improvement on most tracks, the changes are relatively small.
  
with SA-43: Fit is similar to the stock cable and offers good security.  The SA-43 has a great soundstage and the SD cable builds on that as well as adding a bit more punch and brightness to the SA-43.  The clarity is ticked up a notch, but not by much.  All of these things are welcome and unlike with other cables the SD doesn't affect the ambiance portrayal of the SA-43.  Overall this is a good combination that will add more life to the neutral presentation of the SA-43.
  
with LS8: The fit is just as good as with the stock cable in the recessed socket.  The first thing that hit me was the improved bass thump to go along with better dynamics for the already dynamic LS8.  The volume seems a bit louder overall with the SD cable.  The overall presentation is more spacious by a bit without changing the proportions.  However, the ambiance that is recreated with the stock cable is reduced with the SD, taking away from the realism of the performance.  While I do like the improvements the SD cable makes, there is a tradeoff.
  
with EM3 Pro: The fit is just as good as with the stock cable in the recessed socket.  Bass is improved with the SD cable but not much else is changed.  There is a bit better clarity, especially in vocals, but the ambiance the EM3 Pro recreates is reduced resulting in a less natural presentation.  The SD cable does seem to bring the presentation more into "focus," not unlike focusing a camera lens.  The EM3 Pro has a slightly recessed upper midrange and the SD cable does help bring the upper mids more in line with the rest of the frequencies.  While there are improvements, the overall sound doesn't change all that much and I don't think this is as good of a match as some other cable options.
  
with Infinity X3: The cable fits just like the stock cable, which is secure in the slightly protruding socket.  The SD improves the soundstage of the X3 in all directions, giving it a wider presentation with more depth.  The dynamics are tamed a bit with less overall impact and punch, but still plenty to go around, making the sound with the stock cable seem overdone.  The improvement is impressive, adding to the instrument separation, giving the X3 better clarity, and greatly reducing the grain of the midrange and treble.  This is the best pairing with the X3 I have heard to date.
                 
with reshelled TF10: The reshell was made with a Westone style socket so the pins fit fine.  The cable makes a very large difference with the TF10, adding space, bass depth and punch, and clarity.  The overall presentation is more laid back and spacious with a good amount of depth added to the presentation.  There is an impressive improvement with the SD for my reshelled TF10, making the overall sound significantly more enjoyable over the stock cable.
  
with i9pro: Fit is similar to the stock cable, both of which are not extremely secure in the i9pro sockets.  The sound is different between the stock cable with FST and the SD cable as is to be expected.  The spacious presentation of the stock cable is surprisingly not too far off from that of the SD cable, more than likely because the strength of the SD cable is the improvement of the soundstage size and depth, however the FST does add more overall projection to the soundstage.  The stock cable has more bass impact but less clarity and the sound isn't quite as precise.  I prefer the stock cable with the FST technology, but the SD cable presentation is a nice alternative.
  
with aud-5X: The cable fits the 5X like a glove.  Sonically the Silver Dragon adds additional space to the presentation improving instrument separation and spacing between instruments.  Bass punch is improved a bit as is transparency.  Overall the sound is more engaging and sounds more open.
  
[size=10pt]with Alclair Reference[/size][size=10pt]: The Silver Dragon fits well into the recessed socket of the Alclair Reference.  Sonically, the SD cable improves the bass quantity and depth, dynamics, and spaciousness while bringing the bass a bit more forward.  Fast, bass heavy music sounds much more exciting with the SD cable.  With other music, such as acoustic, there are minor changes including a slightly better clarity and focus as well as a slight shift forward of the midrange.  Depending on what you listen to, the cable either makes the Reference more dynamics and exciting, or offers only a quite small improvement.[/size]
  
*Summary*: The Silver Dragon cable expands the space of presentations both in width and in depth while other changes are dependent on the custom IEM used with the cable.  Some custom IEMs such as the JH16, SA-43, and Infinity X3 benefit without a doubt, but others have tradeoffs.  Ergonomically the cable is top notch and appears to be built to last.  Overall the Silver Dragon cable can be a great addition to a portable system when matched well.
  
 Ergonomics: 8
 Tangle Resistance: 10
 Memory Effect:  8.5
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: Yes
 Options: Length: 48", 64" (+$15), 80" (+$30); Connection type: JHA/Westone/UE, Livewires (+$10); Connector type: right angle mini plug (premolded), Oyaide straight (+$10), Oyaide right angled 1/8" mini plug (+$10), RSA Protector/SR71B (+$10), mini 4 pin male XLR for adapter system (+$10), iBasso hirose connector (+$20), dual 3 pin male XLR (+$30), dual 3 pin female XLR (+$30), Furutech Rhodium plated XLRs (+$125)
  
 NOTE: Beware of fakes!
  
  ---------------------

  
  
12) Crystal Piccolino (Jaben cables) - $800+
  
 The Piccolino cable uses a silver core with a gold outer fill with a single smooth outer jacket.  The cable looks nice and feels nice and ergonomically is very good, offering exceptional tangle resistance.  It is a little on the stiffer side compared with stock cables, but nothing that will really affect cable ergonomics.  There is very little memory effect and the cable is easy to use.  Unfortunately the shell pins won't work with recessed socket custom IEMs.  Build quality appears to be top notch.  The cable I received had the outer jacket on which can be removed for portable use greatly increasing the flexibility.  
  
    
  
Pictures (from left to right): cable; free-form; plug, Y-split, cable cinch; with UERM; with JH16
  
with JH16: Fit of the pins is fine and the cable looks very nice paired with the JH16, especially with my titanium artwork.  A/Bing with the stock cable, the sound seems to lose some height to the presentation with the Piccolino while the mids are pulled more forward.  The upper mid peak is accentuated and actually sounds rougher with the Piccolino .  Overall this is more of a sidestep or even a slight downgrade with the JH16.
  
with UERM: The cable fits the UERM well with no issues and a secure fit.  The UERM sound is thickened and moves from analytical to more of a liquid sound.  As with the JH16 there is a boost in the upper midrange, however this boost fits well with the UERM frequency response.  This gives the Piccolino a little more forward presentation but also brings more detail to the forefront.  The liquidity helps smooth the rougher, analytical treble presentation I hear with the UERM.  Overall the sound is improved to my ears with a more liquid sound with a little more upfront presentation while not losing any of the good qualities of the UERM.  This is the best combination I have heard with the UERM as it adds just the right elements to the UERM without  taking anything away.
  
with SA-43: The fit is as secure as the stock cable.  Sonically the Piccolino adds to the upper midrange vs. the stock cable and accentuates the Ss in lyrics.  The overall presentation is brought more forward treble to the SA-43, but it also makes it harsher.  With the more forward presentation and added upper mids the sense of space is slightly diminished.  Add to that a slight decrease in the sub-bass and I would say the synergy isn't great.
  
with reshelled TF10: Why not, a $99 IEM reshelled for another $90 with a cable that is 3.5 times the price (best case)!  Fit is fine.  This cable does help the TF10 and makes it sound a good deal better with a more mid-forward sound, actually the TF10 sounds mid-forward with the cable!  Bass is more impactful and the overall balance is much improved.  Also the depth of the presentation improves giving an overall sound a big boost.
  
with wx i9pro: Fit is fine and on par with the stock cable.  I did want to test this cable with the i9pro due to the dynamic driver and see what magic, if any, there was.  Since the stock cable has FST technology it is not really easy to compare apples to apples.  The first two things I noticed was the stock cable has more bass and more space than the Piccolino cable, but that is the case for other aftermarket cables with the i9pro.  The i9pro did sound better than the TF10 with the Piccolino , which I tested just prior to the i9pro.  Overall I prefer the stock cable.
  
with aud-5x: Fits as secure as the stock cable.  The treble is smoothed a bit, there is a bit more space, instrument separation, and definition of the presentation in space resulting in better clarity.  However the differences are relatively small.  
  
*Summary*: The Piccolino cable is not a great match with most of the custom IEMs I tested it with except for the UERM.  That is unfortunate since it really is ergonomically nice, although it does have a very high price tag.  With the UERM it transforms the sound from that of an analytical reference monitor with treble that is on the harsh side to my ears with anything but very well mastered tracks (in comparison with other high end custom IEMS) to a musical beast that keeps the strengths and fixes the issues I have with the UERM.  I really can't recommend this cable for anything other than the UERM, and at the price it really is up to you if you want to spend a grand total equal to a much more expensive custom IEM, or the price of two custom IEMs.  However, if you do have an opportunity to try this cable with a UERM, I highly recommend doing so!
  
 Ergonomics: 9
 Tangle Resistance: 10
 Memory Effect: 9.5
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: no
 Options: 
  
  ---------------------

  
13) Double Helix Symbiote IEM cable - $225
  
 Double Helix has a strong following on head-fi and Peter is a very nice and funny guy.  The Symbiote is a change from many of the other high end cables I have reviewed as cryo treated OCC copper is used vs. silver.  The individual wires in the cable are 24 gauge making the Symbiote the thickest cable I have tested.  How does copper compare with the silver in an aftermarket cable from an audio standpoint?  Before we get there, the cable is well made with a very good look and nice braid between the Y-split and 3.5mm plug and twisted wire from the Y-Split to the shell connectors.  The Y-split is formed with heat shrink with tubing for a cable cinch.  The 3.5mm plug is of the Valab copper/rhodium/carbon fiber type and very nice, although not for minimalists.
  
    
 Pictures (from left to right): Symbiote cable with accessories; free form; Y-split and cable cinch; cable with NT6
  
  
 Ergonomically the Symbiote is very good as it doesn’t tangle, but it does wrap around itself a bit which would could result in kinking if pulled tight, although it is probably not likely due to the thickness of the cable.  There is very little memory effect and the cable isn’t all that springy which is a great combination.  Even though the Symbiote uses a larger gauge, it isn’t too heavy, but doesn’t quite disappear like some other smaller cables.  All in all this is one very nice cable to use.
  
 The shell connectors are longer than the stock shell connectors on all my stock cables which, other than changing the look, doesn't have much impact otherwise for my ears.
  
 
Pictures (left to right): Rooth LS8 stock cable and Symbiote; comparison of shell connectors: Silver Dragon on top, Symbiote on bottom
  
with SA-43: Fits as well as the stock cable.  Compared with the stock cable, the biggest differences are that the presentation is brought a little more forward and deep bass impact and weight is increased.  This gives the Symbiote a sense that it is slightly louder along with less emphasis on the treble.  Clarity and instrument separation are also improved, but the differences are somewhat dependent on the source with the better sources showing less improvement.  Overall soundstage size is the same as the stock cable.  
  
with JH16: Fits as well as the stock cable.  Compared with the stock cable, the midrange is brought closer and there seems to be a slight veil with the Symbiote cable.  Wait, what?  OK, let's try a different source (from the D1 to the 801).  Same thing but to a lesser extent (the D1 has better clarity than the 801).  The more laid back presentation with the stock cable is slightly more spacious in width and also has more treble emphasis, however the Symbiote does have better treble smoothness and a slight bit more depth.  The differences really aren't large and more of a preference.
  
with UERM: While the pins fit the sockets fine, the length of the shell connectors combined with the protruding pins makes for a very long area before bending over your ears.  Compared with the stock cable the Symbiote tames the treble a bit while smoothing it out and making some of the unpleasant tracks more pleasant, although there is an ever so slight bit less detail.  The Symbiote sounds more 3D and holographic and has better deep bass definition and impact.  Overall the Symbiote adjusted the frequency response in way that compliments the UERM, at least to my taste, but isn't a large improvement technically, but improvement nonetheless.  
  
with LS8: Fits well, but is slightly looser than the stock cable in the recessed sockets.  Compared with the stock cable, the bass impact is a good deal better and more dynamic to go along with a little less treble emphasis.  This shift in frequency response and bass response make the LS8 even more punchy than with the stock cable.  The soundstage isn't improved with the LS8, similar to many other cables, as the space is ever so slightly smaller in width but there is an added depth from a more mid-forwardness to the Symbiote.  There is improvement here, and many aftermarket cables don't see to work well with the LS8. 
  
with NT6: Fits as well as the stock cable.  Compared with the stock cable the sound is more spacious yet having a more forward presentation at the same time.  There is more bass authority and less treble that is slightly smoother.  Overall the changes are not large, but I think the Symbiote cable adds to the sound of the NT6.
  
with reshelled TF10: Fit is for Westone cables and the pins for a TF10 will be too small, however this cable fit my reshelled TF10 fine.  This cable synergizes well with the TF10 as it brings the midrange more forward and adds missing depth to the presentation, clearing everything up.  There are minimal improvements to the smoothness of the treble as well as overall bass presentation and depth.
  
with aud-5X: Fits as well as the stock cable.  Compared with the stock cable, the Symbiote adds a bit more mid-forwardness to the sound, but not too much and clears up the soundstage and slightly improves the clarity as well as bass texture.  While the differences aren't huge, they are improvements that incrementally help with an overall more realistic sound.
  
with i9pro: Fits as well as the stock cable.  Compared with the stock cable with FST technology the Symbiote cable doesn't sound as spacious or as focused.  The bass is similar and there is more treble with the Symbiote, but the midrange is brought a bit more forward.  Due to the smaller space the overall presentation is more constrained.
  
*Summary*: If you are looking for a nice improvement in the look and ergonomics of your cable the Symbiote cable will get you there.  Sonically, the Symbiote gave me different sonic traits than the silver cables I have tested, resulting in a sound closer to stock, not adding brightness and additional space that silver cable can add.  Adding the Symbiote cable to your portable rig will surely grab the attention of many when you venture out in public!
  
 Ergonomics: 9
 Tangle Resistance: 9
 Memory Effect: 10
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: Yes
 [size=10.0pt]Options: Color - Classic clear Nucleotide, transparent black; Length - 3' extension cable ($79), headphone type - JH/UE/Westone, Livewires (Fidelity), Shure 435/535; termination - 4-pin mini XLR (for use with DHC adapters), DHC custom black aluminum 1/4", DHC custom black aluminum 1/8", Pelican/Toucan 6-pin balanced (+$25), Neutrik 3-pin XLR, Neutrik 4-pin XLR, RSA SR71b/Protector connector (+$15), Switchcraft right angle miniplug (+$20), Valab tellurium copper/carbon fiber 3 pin XLRs (+$60), Viablue miniplug (+$25)[/size]

  
 ---------------------------
  
  
 [size=14.0pt]14) Audiohub Uber Muzik V5f[/size] ($150 SGD) $120 
  
     
Pictures (left to right); free form; plug and Y-split; shell connectors; with TF10; with UERM; with JH16
  
 The Audiohub is one of the many shops in Singapore that specializes in products for the audio enthusiast.  The V5f cable is their new IEM cable and this particular version is made to fit the TF10.  The entire cable has black heat shrink over it with a very large and sturdy Y-split that is sealed on both ends with epoxy.  Under the heat shrink, the cable past the Y-split is extremely tightly twisted.  The 3.5mm connector is an extremely nice looking connector with a design I have not seen before.  Above the Y-split there is a cable cinch from red heat shrink, the only real color on the cable.  The shell connectors are made for a TF10 and there is a very thin piece of wire that acts as the memory wire.
  
 This cable has been well used as it was the demo unit for a while and it appears to be built to stand up to abuse.  Ergonomically the cable isn't the easiest to use due to the memory effect and will not fully straighten when using it.  This presents a problem with the not so stiff memory wire as the cable didn't want to sit against my ears and there was some cable noise, however it wasn't all that bad.  The biggest issue was that the cable would not say flat against my body and has a chance of catching on objects that stick out.
  
with TF10: The fit is as secure as the stock cable.  The first thing I noticed sonically was the bass response improved noticeably with more punch and depth.  The overall presentation is a little wider and the midrange is pulled a little forward, but the depth of the presentation is about the same.  One thing that does improve a good deal is the level of detail, as nuances become more apparent to go with a small bump to the brightness which amplifies the harshness of the TF10 treble on some tracks to my ears.  Overall this is a nice combination, especially if you want to increase the detail and bass punch.
  
with TS842: The fit is not as secure as the stock cable due to the plugs being made for the TF10, but it still fits.  The volume difference is easily discernable between the stock cable and the V5f, with more bass punch, a smoother sound, and a wider and deeper soundstage.   Details are easier to hear, and while there is a bit more brightness, as stated, the presentation is smoother.  Another thing the V5f cable does well with the TS842 is add to the cohesion of the presentation, lowering the differences between the presentation style of the dynamic bass driver and the mid/treble driver.  This is a very good pairing.
  
with SA-43: The fit is not very secure as the sockets are slightly larger than that of the cable pins and the pins are recessed.  Sonically the V5f cable doesn't match all that well with the SA-43.  Bass is reduced, especially deep bass, the soundstage is slightly smaller, and there is a tonal shift that doesn't sound as natural as the stock cable.  Not a good match.
  
with JH16: The fit is not very secure as the sockets are slightly larger than that of the cable pins and the pins are recessed.  Sonically the V5f cable adds dynamics to the JH16 with more bass punch and body as well as adding some depth to the presentation.  The overall presentation is smoothed out while not losing detail, but actually adding to the clarity and apparent detail.  This is a good match.
  
with UERM: The fit is better than with other custom IEMs due to the protruding sockets, but not a perfectly secure solution.  Sonically the V5f adds a dimensionality to the presentation that adds realism as well as dynamics.  When switching back to the stock cable the sound was a bit on the dull side in comparison to when the V5f cable was attached.  Tonally the presentation doesn't have quite the brightness which results in a more forgiving sound, however the smoothness difference is minimal, however it is easier to make out details in the music with the V5f cable.  If you can get the V5f cable terminated for the UERM, this isn't a bad combo for the price.
  
with aud-5X: The fit is not very secure as the sockets are slightly larger than that of the cable pins and the pins are recessed.  The V5f cable adds a little more dynamics, volume, and clarity to the aud-5X.  
  
*Summary*: The V5f cable is the latest from Uber Muzik and has a place in the aftermarket cable spectrum with its ability to increase the level of perceived detail while adding dynamics and some spaciousness to the presentation of most custom IEMs I tested it with.  The TF10 connectors didn't allow for use with my recessed socket CIEMs and the pins didn't make for the best connections.  Ergonomically the V5f cable is not the most friendly due to the stiffness and memory effect so it doesn't fall into place but will stick out away from the body, but on the other hand it does seem to be built to last.
  
 Ergonomics: 4
 Tangle Resistance: 9
 Memory Effect: 3
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: No (EM3 Pro, EM4, LS8)
 [size=10.0pt]Options: Ask Louis from the Audio Hub[/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]--------------------------[/size]
  
 [size=10pt]Whiplash Audio Hybrid V3 and TWag V3[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]Note from the manufacturer[/size][size=10.0pt]:  About 20 months ago, I starting thinking about how to improve the already popular "TWag" lineup. My first goal was to better the key performance characteristics of the cables.  After a few attempts, I realized I was changing the characteristics, but not improving the product and I didn't see it as a v2 to v3 accomplishment. Since my hybrid design started to get better recognition, I almost gave up on developing the v3 products since the cost was adding up.  Then I decided to change the gauge from 26awg to 24.5awg which added 55% more strands, equal to 55% more physical metal, and the results were promising. With the new gauge wire, I then started working toward changing the characteristics to what I had envisioned.  Once I had finally succeeded, I then made a v3 copper with the same 24.5awg with similarly impressive results for both the 4 conductor TWcu cables and 8 conductor hybrid cables. [/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]While a lot of time and money was invested in the new v3 cables, I wanted to keep pricing as close as possible, and was able to lower the price on the v2 cables.  The TWag v2 cable is now available at a lower cost with the same great performance.  I will be offering both TWag v2 eclipse and luminous with the addition of my new TWag v3 24.5awg OCC silver eclipse and TWcu v3 OCC copper!!! [/size]
  
  
*[size=16.0pt]15) Whiplash Audio TWag Hybrid V3[/size]*[size=16.0pt] $550[/size]
  
  
     
Pictures (left to right); free form; plug, Y-split, and shell connectors; TWag V3 and Hybrid V3; with Rooth LS8; with UE IERM; with JHA JH16
  
 [size=10.0pt]The first thing I thought when I laid eyes on the Whiplash Audio Hybrid V3 cable was “wow!”  The cable is thick and the color scheme is rich looking.  While the Double Helix cable is thick, the Hybrid is larger overall due to more individual, albeit smaller gauge wires.  There are four each of silver and copper wires which make it a hybrid.  The silver wires are the same as the TWag while the copper wires are the same as the TWcu, and both types are 24.5 gauge.  Since I have a pre-production unit, it came with a straight plug, but the production version will have all available options.  Clear heat shrink is used for the Y-split allowing the cable to maintain its great looks and keeps the Y-Split clean and streamlined.  The wooden cable cinch both works well and looks good as it matches the color scheme of the Hybrid cable.  The shell connectors are beefy, with a heatshrink over memory wire and the wire end of the shell connector.  Due to the pre-formed memory wire construction, adjustments can be made for different ear shape/CIEM design, but the memory wire can’t be flipped to adjust for CIEMs that have the negative socket on the upper part of the shell.  The cable appears to have an extremely high build quality.[/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]Ergonomics are good, especially considering the size of the cable, but due to the larger size, it isn’t as easy to use as a think stock cable.  However, I didn’t have any issue using it on the go.  While it doesn’t have memory effect, it does have the propensity to keep its twists from when it is wrapped, but it is easy to twist it back the opposite way and remove the twists.  Microphonics are low, but it is not the most silent cable I have.  For the size, it is very ergonomic![/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]UE PRM[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits securely on the PRM’s protruding sockets.  If you plan on getting the Hybrid for the PRM, Craig can put the positive pin in the correct orientation* and should have access to the UE style connector.  Sonically, the Hybrid cable has a bit more forward and slightly higher presentation while still adding a bit of space to the overall presentation.  The slightly closer presentation helps to articulate details within the already very good soundstage.  With the Hybrid cable, the sound is more engaging from a smoother yet more dynamic sound combined with a more enveloping sound.  Bass is quite similar, although there is a slight bit less but more detailed and well controlled bass with the Hybrid cable.  Although the changes seem subtle at first, they all add up to make the PRM more musical and enjoyable. [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]UE IERM[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits securely on the IERM’s protruding sockets.  If you plan on getting the Hybrid for the IERM, Craig can put the positive pin in the correct orientation* and should have access to the UE style connector. The Hybrid cable pulls the IERM sound closer forward while retaining the space.  The Hybrid cable doesn’t change much with the IERM, and unfortunately while it does improve the often harsh treble, it doesn’t improve it all that much while making it a bit more prominent.  Overall, the presentation is a bit more focused, clean, and clear, but the changes come with a caveat if the IERM treble bothers you. [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]SE 5-way[/size][size=10.0pt]: The 5-way has recessed silicon sockets and while the left channel fit perfectly, the right channel would come loose due to the size of the recessed socket and the heat shrink over the shell connector.  This made it impossible to A/B the cables.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]SA-43[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits on the SA-43 as well as the stock cable; however, the polarity is switched*.  Sonic changes include the way the midrange is presented, bringing it a bit more forward while adding a brightness yet still preserving the spacious presentation.  Bass is a bit more dynamic and impactful, but the quantity remains about the same.  Within the soundstage, the background sounds become improved in the articulation with a better focus and more amplitude.  Live sounds a bit more “live” and natural sounds a bit more “natural’ with the Hybrid cable.  If you want a slightly brighter tone and a little less laid-back presentation, the Hybrid cable will give you that along with an overall improvement in technical presentation.  [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]JH16[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid fits the same as the stock cable and is secure.  Sonically, the Hybrid is a step up from the stock cable in many ways, with an increased depth of presentation and better instrument separation giving well mastered acoustic music more realism and life.  The presentation has better focus resulting in a cleaner and more effortless sound.  Sub-bass is significantly increased yet still very clean with the Hybrid cable.  Songs with a lot of deep bass sound like different songs compared with the stock cable due to the extra oomph.  While the Hybrid increases the sub-bass more than any aftermarket cable I have tried with the JH16, the presentation is still clean yet full.  The midrange is slightly more forward, but there really isn’t any change to the treble quantity, however the quality is improved.  Benefits to the midrange include increased instrument separation and depth of the presentation, making it easier to hear harmonics, soft notes, and background sounds.  The treble is also smoother and more musical due to a more natural sounding decay.  Overall, the Hybrid makes some great improvements to the JH16, especially if you want to increase the sub-bass and improve the overall sound quality.  [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]LS8[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits similarly to the stock cable within the recessed sockets of the LS8.  One of the few cables that improve the LS8, the Hybrid cable gives a better focus to the presentation while adding an impressive amount of spatial depth.  The Hybrid cable makes the LS8 sound more dynamic and convincing with a very natural presentation in part by taming and smoothing the treble. The midrange positioning changes more with each track when using the Hybrid vs. stock, which is a very good thing.  Details are more articulated and easier to hear, but in a very natural way.  The sub-bass is increased by a bit, but not like the JH16 or NT-6 pro.  Overall, the presentation is improved with small changes that all add up to an improved listening experience.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]EM4[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits similarly to the stock cable within the recessed sockets of the EM4; however, the polarity is switched*.  The Hybrid cleans up the EM4 from top to bottom, tightening the bass slightly while adding a bit of impact and quantity, clearing up the midrange a bit, and smoothing the treble, all resulting in a more liquid presentation that retains the detail and improves articulation.  One of the weaker traits of the EM4 is the coherence, and the Hybrid cable helps improve that trait.  The cable also helps make the EM4 sound more effortless and dynamic while adding some additional depth to the presentation, although not quite as much improvement as other CIEMs used to test the cable.  Overall, the Hybrid V3 does provide worthwhile improvements to the EM4.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]8.A[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits securely just like the Heir Magnus 1 cable, which came with my 8.A.  Sonically, the Hybrid improves upon the already good Magnus 1 cable by offering a clearer, cleaner sound with better focus, imaging, and coherence.  The 8.A can be a bit on the thicker side in comparison with many of my other CIEMs, but the Hybrid cable clears things up a bit, brings the presentation a slight bit more forward, and adds a nice amount of additional soundstage size and space.  Within that space, the Hybrid cable improves instrument separation and imaging.  Contrary to the NT-6 pro and JH16 pairing, the bass is actually slightly more polite with the Hybrid cable, yet more detailed and refined.  Using the Hybrid cable with the 8.A vs. the Magnus 1 is like going looking through a camera lens that is slightly out of focus, but you don’t realize it until it improves giving a worthwhile change.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]NT-6[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid fits the NT-6 well, although the plug is slightly protruding and the sockets of the stock cables are slightly recessed, but I am still confident the Hybrid will hold up.  Compared with the Hidition upgrade cable, the microphonics are much better and ergonomics are slightly better with the Hybrid.  The Hybrid cable changes the sound in many positive ways, smoothing out and lowering the treble presence while increasing the sub-bass slightly resulting in a more natural and balanced sound to my ears.  Everything is articulated better with the Hybrid and the already clean and clear presentation is cleaned up even more resulting in better resolution and detail, but with an even more musical presentation.  The NT-6 pro still retains its neutral presentation and I would still call it reference with the Hybrid, but it is more enjoyable.  Spatially the Hybrid doesn’t change much with most tracks, but with more spacious tracks, the Hybrid recreates a deeper soundstage.  Instrument separation is better as is the recreation of a blacker background and the space between instruments.  The biggest problem with the cable is that the imperfections within my tracks are more noticeable even though the Hidition upgrade cable is a bit brighter and colder sounding.  The Hybrid improves the overall sound not only from an enjoyment perspective but also by improving the NT-6 as a reference monitor.  This is an excellent pairing I can’t recommend enough!  [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]NT-6 pro[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid fits the NT-6 well, although the plug is slightly protruding and the sockets of the stock cables are slightly recessed, but I am still confident the Hybrid will hold up.  Compared with the Hidition upgrade cable, the microphonics are much better and ergonomics are slightly better with the Hybrid.  In similar fashion to how the Hybrid performed with the bass enhanced JH16, the sub-bass of the NT-6 pro was amplified, really showing weight and authority down low.  It does so while cleaning up the sound, adding clarity and articulation.  The overall presentation is a bit more laid back and spacious than the Hidition upgrade cable and the upper midrange/treble is slightly less present with the Hybrid cable.  Both cables have a smooth presentation, but with better clarity and better balance between the midrange and treble vocals/midrange instruments sound more realistic and detailed with the Hybrid cable.  Overall, the Hybrid improves the strong point of the NT-6 pro, clarity while emphasizing sub-bass and giving a more natural balance from top to bottom adding even more realism to vocals. [/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]* The bottom socket of the CIEM shell is the positive channel vs. the traditional top socket.  Normally, the memory wire would need to be bent the opposite way, but due to the stiffness and pre-formed shape, I wasn’t able to reverse the bend.  I wore the cable without it going over my ear, and since the CIEMs fit perfectly in my ears, they didn’t come loose.  If you want the Hybrid cable for a CIEM with a positive socket on the bottom (UE, Starkey, Earsonics), ask Craig to have the memory wire orientation reversed.[/size]
  
*[size=10.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=10.0pt]: With a rock solid build quality, very good ergonomics, especially considering the size of the cable, and a fantastic look, the Whiplash Hybrid cable is a real contender.  Add the sonic improvements and you have a winner by knockout!   Providing a different sound than the TWag cables, the Hybrid V3 is warmer and very musical compared with what initially seems like subtle changes in contrast to the brighter, more open and airy sound from the TWag.  The Hybrid retains much of the sound signature of the original cable configuration making differences seem subtle.  But, subtle they are not when you switch from the Hybrid back to the stock cable and wonder what happened to the clean, clear, musical sound you were hearing.  [/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]While the Hybrid cable didn’t perform the same with all CIEMs I tested, it did significantly improve every CIEM compared with the stock cable, and some of my bass enhanced CIEMs performed like never before in the bass department, making me think they had excellently controlled dynamic bass drivers!  I found that when the Hybrid cable was paired with a brighter CIEM, the presentation became more effortless, natural, and balanced while improving the performance technically.  As with most aftermarket cables, the Hybrid V3 improves with both high end sources, and makes lower end sources sound a good deal better.  The Hybrid V3 cable is a fantastic cable and I highly recommend it![/size]
  
 Ergonomics: 8.5
 Tangle Resistance: 9
 Memory Effect: 9
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: Yes [size=10.0pt](EM4, LS8, etc.)[/size]
 [size=10.0pt]Options: see product page[/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]---------------------------------------[/size]
  
*[size=16.0pt]16) Whiplash Audio TWag V3[/size]*[size=16.0pt] $325[/size]
  
  
      
Pictures (left to right); free form; plug, Y-split, and shell connectors of TWag V2 (top) and V3 (bottom); Y-Split and cable cinch; TWag V3 (left) and TWag V2 (right); Compared with the Silver Dragon; with UE IERM; with Rooth LS8
  
  
 [size=10.0pt]The Whiplash Audio TWag V3 cable increases the size of the wires vs. the TWag V2 slightly while improving the ergonomics of the cable.  The cable is made from four stranded 24.5 gauge stranded silver cables.  The Y-split is made from heat shrink and is very unobtrusive and the cable cinch is made from wood and looks and works well.  Between the plug and the Y-Split, the four wires are braided together and after the Y-Split they are twisted pairs.  The memory wire is pre-formed and while it can be adjusted, the amount of possible adjustment is limited.  This does not affect fit for me as the cable bends enough for my ears and I don’t foresee issue with other ear sizes, but it can’t be switched with CIEMs that have opposite polarity.  Build quality, as will all the Whiplash cables I have is very high quality.[/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]In use the TWag V3 doesn’t quite disappear, but it doesn’t bring attention to itself and I would have to look to see if the V3 or stock cable is connected.  The ergonomics are actually better than the TWag V2, even with the larger wire gauge, and the build quality is very high.  The V3 is more ergonomic because the cable seems to have less memory and is more supple and less prone to tangling with no[/size][size=10pt] microphonics.  [/size][size=10pt]There isn’t much to say as the V3 is a pleasure to use and looks great!  See the Hybrid V3 cable above for a note from the manufacturer.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]JH16[/size][size=10.0pt]:  The TWag V3 cable fits just like the stock cable.  Sonically, the first thing I noticed was the brighter and more spacious sound from the V3 cable vs. the stock cable.  The V3 cable cleans up the presentation offering better clarity and a smoother yet more detailed presentation that is more enjoyable than the stock cable, even if you don’t care for the extra bit of treble.  Switching back to the stock cable is somewhat painful when you are used to the clean, clear, and 3D presentation from the TWag.  Spatially, the overall presentation is pushed back a bit.  In the bass region the V3 provides more headroom while at the same time recreating more detail within the already detailed bass region.  The overall sum of the improvements is an impressive improvement across the frequency spectrum as well as an improvement to the presentation space; highly recommended combination.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]EM4[/size][size=10.0pt]: The TWag V3 cable fits similarly to the stock cable within the recessed sockets of the EM4; however, the polarity is switched*.  Sonically, the V3 cable moves the midrange slightly forward but adds additional depth to the presentation resulting in a larger and more airy sound and a larger overall soundstage.  Due to the larger overall soundstage, the bass with the V3 isn’t quite as pronounced but is better controlled and more detailed.  Transparency and coherence are improved with the V3 cable.  If you don’t mind the lower bass focus, the TWag V3 cable makes some nice improvement to the EM4.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]UE IERM[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits securely on the IERM’s protruding sockets.  If you plan on getting the TWag for the IERM, Craig can put the positive pin in the correct orientation* and should have access to the UE style connector. Sonically, the TWag V3 improves the dynamics, instrument separation, and overall sense of power and dynamics.  However, the sound is brighter and a bit warmer, not that those changes are usually bad.  However, with the IERM, the treble (at least on my set) is already hot, so the added brightness and accentuation of the details makes less than perfect mastering sound even worse.  If you have issues with the IERM treble, I would stay away from the V3, but if it is OK, the V3 improves some of the finer points, increasing the performance of the IERM.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]LS8[/size][size=10.0pt]: The TWag V3 fits the recessed sockets of the LS8 securely.  Sonically, the stock cable has a slightly more laid back sound that is less engaging than the V3 cable, which improves the clarity and depth of the presentation giving a more enveloping and immersive listening experience.  Bass is more prominent and very well controlled and detailed.   Articulation of each note is better with the V3 due to better instrument separation within a deeper soundstage.  While harsh treble in a recording isn’t bad on the LS8, the V3 cable smooth’s the presentation without losing detail, improving the experience.  Many cables don’t improve the LS8, however the TWag V3 certainly does with changes that improve the immersive experience of the LS8 while improving the overall sound quality.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]SE 5-way[/size][size=10.0pt]: While the left channel fits fine, the right channel had some issues similar to the Hybrid cable, but not quite as bad.  I was able to do some limited comparisons.  While the 5-way treble is smooth and extended, the TWag V3 improved the treble quality while cleaning up the presentation a bit with a slightly brighter presentation.  Bass was slightly tighter.  If the shell connectors fit and the cable will stay put, the TWag V3 is a nice match.[/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]8.A[/size][size=10.0pt]: The TWag V3 cable fits as securely as the stock cable.  Sonically the TWag V3 adds a bit of spaciousness to the already spacious 8.A, especially in the soundstage depth.  The bass is brought a bit more forward and in doing so becomes more prominent, but still very controlled with better definition.  The midrange and treble are a bit more forward as well, with more prominent treble.  The upper midrange prominence is also increased which does lead to hints of sibilance.  Overall the presentation is cleaner with better instrument separation, but due to the upper midrange increase leading to hints of sibilance, the changes won’t be considered an improvement for everyone. [/size]
  
[size=10.0pt]SA-43[/size][size=10.0pt]: The Hybrid cable fits on the SA-43 as well as the stock cable; however, the polarity is switched*.  The impressive space of the SA-43 is improved with the TWag V3 cable with a slight bump forward in the presentation.  Bass is tighter and goes a bit deeper and the treble is more prominent.  The SA-43 sounds more coherent with the V3 cable and details are easier to hear while retaining the smoothness of the original sound.  The subtle changes result in a very nice cumulative overall improvement making the already musical SA-43 even more so while improving some of the weaknesses and building on the strengths.  This is a nice pairing.[/size]
  
 [size=10.0pt]* The bottom socket of the CIEM shell is the positive channel vs. the traditional top socket.  Normally, the memory wire would need to be bent the opposite way, but due to the stiffness and pre-formed shape, I wasn’t able to reverse the bend.  I wore the cable without it going over my ear, and since the CIEMs fit perfectly in my ears, they didn’t come loose.  If you want the Hybrid cable for a CIEM with a positive socket on the bottom (UE, Starkey, Earsonics), ask Craig to have the memory wire orientation reversed.[/size]
  
*[size=10.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=10.0pt]: The TWag V3 is a very nice cable in many ways with great looks, very good ergonomics, and solid sonic performance that improves most CIEMs.  Typical sonic changes include a bit of added brightness and slightly more forward midrange as a result of adding depth to the presentation, giving a more 3D presentation.  Clarity, focus, and instrument separation are all better increasing the articulation and ability to hear the little details.  Dynamics are also improved and bass is tightened up.  Overall, the TWag V3 is as ergonomic as the V2 even though the wires are a larger gauge, and the sonic improvements are a step up.  [/size]
  
 Ergonomics: 9.5
 Tangle Resistance: 9.5
 Memory Effect: 10
 Build Quality: 10
 Works with recessed sockets: Yes (EM4, LS8, etc.)
 [size=10.0pt]Options: see product page[/size]
  
  
  
---------------------
  
  
17) Effect Studio [Pearl Ver.2] Upgrade Cable for UE/Shure ($69.90) or TF10 ($59.90)
  
  
 
Pearl, free form; Pearl and UE900 stock cable
  
 [size=11pt]I reviewed two Effect Studio cables previously, and while they looked amazing in photos and great in person, they didn’t score high primarily due to ergonomics.  Effect Studio revamped their lineup and contacted me to see if I was interested in trying their new cables.  I received the Pearl V2 with Shure connectors that also fit Sensaphonics and Ultimate Ears UE900s.  The cable looks great, terminated in a Phalic 3.5mm connector that uses several staggered layers of heat shrink creating a nice strain relief, a sleeve covering the braided wire up to the Y-split with a robust Y-split made from hard plastic, and the shape prevents strain points.  Two pairs of twisted wires exit the Y-split with molded heat shrink that forms flexible ear hooks just before the over molded shell connectors.  The wire used is 24 AWG Silver plated OFC with 30+ strands per wire.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]The Pearl has a very solid feel to it with excellent fit and finish except where the 3.5mm plug meets the heat shrink as the cable is partially visible, but it doesn’t look like this will cause any issues and may just be an issue with this particular unit.  Considering the wires have 30+ strands, the Pearl is surprisingly stiff, which affects tangle resistance, memory effect, microphonics, and overall ergonomics.  After storing the Pearl in a case for a while, the cable didn’t want to straighten out and kept rolling back up.  Depending on usage, this can either be annoying or similar to a self-shortening cable.  A gentle pull will get rid of the loops, but they do come back easily.  Microphonics are another issue when walking or moving around, but it wasn’t too bad sitting at a desk with a desktop source.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]Paired with the UE900[/size][size=11.0pt]: The connector is a bit tighter than the stock UE900 connector, which holds the shell in place better than stock.  It is harder to install and remove.  I had two UE900s so I could easily perform A/Bing of the stock UE cable and the Pearl V2.  The Pearl V2 had a more spacious and laid-back presentation with better clarity, instrument separation, and dynamics, all leading to a more involving sound.  The sonic improvements are more than minimal.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: The Pearl isn’t the most ergonomic cable out there, nor is it silent, but if you plan to use it sitting relatively calmly, it will work well and offers a great price for performance ratio.  Sonically, the improvement to the UE900 was significant enough to recommend the Pearl as a replacement, depending on your tolerance for the ergonomic issues.  The Pearl is a step up from the Crystal cable I previously reviewed.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 3[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 4[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 1[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Microphonics: 2[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 9.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: N/A[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: _3.5mm jack options_ - Pailiccs, Sennheiser Silver, Sennheiser Black, Yarbo, Neutrik RA, Oyaide (+$10), Oyaide RA (+$10); _shell connectors_ – TF10 (UE5Pro/ TF10/ Universal two pin connector), custom IEMs (Westone ES4, ES3, JH Audio, UE Custom), Shure (Shure SE215/315/425/535, UE900, Sensaphonics); colors – black, white, blue[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]---------------------[/size]
  
18) Effect Studio [Apollo] Advanced upgrade Cable for UE/Shure ($88)
  
  
   
Effect Studio packaging; Y-split, plug, and shell connectors; free form; with old Effect Studio Crystal cable
  
 [size=11pt]I reviewed two Effect Studio cables previously, and while they looked amazing in photos and great in person, they didn’t score high primarily due to ergonomics.  Effect Studio revamped their lineup and contacted me to see if I was interested in trying their new cables.  The Apollo cable I received has connectors that fit Shure, Sensaphonics, and the Ultimate Ears UE900, among others.  The Apollo is the least flashy of the three cables I received from Effect Studio, but it still looks nice.  The wire used is Silver plated .99999 OFC with 8 braided wires that have a clear jacket.  The 3.5mm jack is made by Yarbo and give a sense of quality, especially when the strain relief consisting of several staggered layers of heat shrink is taken into account.  The Y-split is hard plastic with a design that doesn’t create any strain points, and the right and left cables consist of 4 wires braided and in a clear cable jacket.   Molded heat shrink forms flexible ear hooks just before the over molded, high quality shell connectors.  The size should be fine for just about any ear size, and it took me less time and stayed in place better than the stock UE900 cable which uses memory wire.  The cable is very thin, about half the thickness of the stock UE900 cable. [/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomically, the cable performance is excellent.  It doesn’t have memory, microphonics are minimal and lower than the stock UE900 cable, and the cable is super light-weight and thin, yet since it is very well made I didn’t get a sense that the cable would break or wear out faster than other cables.  There is a slight amount of memory as the cable retains some “waves,” although this doesn’t affect performance.  Once rolled up, the cable is springy and does not tangle very easily, and when it does it is usually because the over-the-ear molded area catches.  Overall, the Apollo is a joy to use.[/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]Paired with the UE900[/size][size=11.0pt]: The connector is a bit tighter than the stock UE900 connector, which holds the shell in place better than stock.  It is harder to install and remove.  I had two UE900s so I could easily perform A/Bing.  Comparing the two, vocals are slightly more forward with the stock cable in comparison with the slightly more spacious presentation with the Apollo.  Detail levels are also a hair higher with the Apollo due in part to better instrument separation; however the stock cable has a more coherent presentation.  The Apollo cable is a nice alternative if you want less microphonics and/or a bit more spacious and laid back sound.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: The Apollo is an ergonomic dream; thin, light, flexible, tangle resistant, all resulting in excellent performance.  Looks are good and fit and finish is top notch.   Changes to the sound with the UE900 were small but palpable.  I can recommend the Apollo cable as a nice choice for those looking for a very ergonomic, well-built cable that is very small, and considering the price, it is also a great value.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 9.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 9.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Microphonics: 8.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: N/A[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: _3.5mm jack options_ - Pailiccs, Sennheiser Silver, Sennheiser Black, Yarbo, Neutrik RA, Oyaide (+$10), Oyaide RA (+$10); _shell connectors_ – TF10 (UE5Pro/ TF10/ Universal two pin connector), custom IEMs (Westone ES4, ES3, JH Audio, UE Custom), Shure (Shure SE215/315/425/535, UE900, Sensaphonics)[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]---------------------[/size]
  
19) Effect Studio Odin AKA Top Upgrade Cable for UE/Shure/Westone/JH Audio/UE Custom/IE8 ($170)
  
  
  
 
Odin cable with TF10; free form; shell connectors and plug; plug and Y-split; shell connectors
  
 [size=11.0pt]I reviewed two Effect Studio cables previously, and while they looked amazing in photos and great in person, they didn’t score high primarily due to ergonomics.  Effect Studio revamped their lineup and contacted me to see if I was interested in trying their new cables.  I received the Odin with shell connectors for the TF10.  The cable uses 24 AWG Silver plated .9999999 OCC with FEP Mono-Filament and Spaced FEP Insulation single core wire.  A Odin uses a Oyaide 3.5mm plug, which looks very elegant, with a strain relief made from several staggered layers of heat shrink, which is robust, good looking, and functional.  The cable between the 3.5mm plug and Y-split is twisted and coated, keeping the twists tight and in place.  The Y-split is made from hard plastic and is well designed, without any stress points.  There is a cable cinch on the Odin made from heat shrink.  Above the Y-Split, a coated cable is used, and near the over molded shell connector heat shrink is formed to keep the cable in place during over-the-ear wear.  The cable reminds me of the Crystal Piccolino cable.[/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]In use, the cable has decent flexibility, no microphonics, and stays in place well.  The cable does retain some waves from being wound up, but nothing serious.  The Odin has an average amount of tangle resistance and a higher than average amount of memory, however the memory doesn’t affect the cable detrimentally.  Above the Y-split, the cable is a bit stiffer than the other two provided cables.  Fit and finish are excellent  [/size]
  
[size=11.0pt]Paired with the TF10[/size][size=11.0pt]: Compared with the stock cable, the Odin fits more securely.  Ergonomics are quite a bit better with the Odin and the curvature of the ear mold fit much better and was easier to put on in comparison with the stock cable.  Sonically, the Odin improves the sound by adding more space and depth to the presentation while offering more instrument placement.  Overall the sound is a bit brighter, but at the same time smoother while articulating detail better.  The combination of improvements results in a more realistic sound.  This is a worthwhile upgrade to the TF10.[/size]
  
*[size=11.0pt]Summary[/size]*[size=11.0pt]: The Odin has a lot of competition and offers good ergonomics and a great look.  Unfortunately, since the Odin came with a TF10 connector I couldn’t perform sonic comparisons with other custom IEM cables I own, although the performance with the TF10 indicates the Odin will be an upgrade sonically. [/size]
  
 [size=11.0pt]Ergonomics: 7.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Tangle Resistance: 5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Memory Effect: 3.5[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Microphonics: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Build Quality: 10[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Works with recessed sockets: No[/size]
 [size=11.0pt]Options: _3.5mm plug_ - Oyaide, Oyaide RA, Pailiccs, Sennheiser Silver, Sennheiser Black, Yarbo, Neutrik RA; _shell connector_ - UE Universal; Shure SE535; Westone ES4, ES3; JH Audio; UE Custom; Sennheiser IE8[/size]
  
 20) Effect Studio Thor Silver
 21) Whiplash Audio TWau Reference Gold
 22) Whiplash Audio TWag V2 GOLD


----------



## i2ehan

Awesome work my friend! You've peaked piqued my interest, and I'll give it a full read through as soon as my JH16's arrive. As always, looking forward to your continued efforts.


----------



## IPodPJ

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Awesome work my friend! You've *piqued* my interest, and I'll give it a full read through as soon as my JH16's arrive. As always, looking forward to your continued efforts.


 

 FTFY


----------



## Anaxilus




----------



## Stephen Guo

Thank you, Joe, for reviewing the Cronus and the Supreme cables!~


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> Thank you, Joe, for reviewing the Cronus and the Supreme cables!~


 

 It was my pleasure, they are very nice cables and will make most people pretty happy!  The Silver Sonic cable is on sale and I received a PM asking about how that compares with the other two Beat Audio cables; any insight?


----------



## caracara08

nice write up as usual joe.  i usually go with the TWag.  i hope the haters stay out of this thread... but you know they wont.


----------



## BattleBrat

I love that Beat Audio Supreme Rose cable, so beautiful! Do they make one that will work with the UM3X RC?


----------



## project86

Quote: 





battlebrat said:


> I love that Beat Audio Supreme Rose cable, so beautiful! Do they make one that will work with the UM3X RC?


 


  Isn't that just the standard Westone cable like they use with their customs? If so, the Beat Audio cables will work fine with them (I use the Supreme Rose cable with Westone AC2 and ES3X). It is the same termination as JH or UM uses.
   
  Also, in case it wasn't clear enough in my review or this post: The Supreme cables are all the same internally except for the more expensive Supreme Pro. They just have different colors.


----------



## Stephen Guo

The silver sonic will be a cable that's placed between the supreme and cronus. 
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> It was my pleasure, they are very nice cables and will make most people pretty happy!  The Silver Sonic cable is on sale and I received a PM asking about how that compares with the other two Beat Audio cables; any insight?


----------



## Stephen Guo

http://www.custom-iem.com/ibasso-to-sr71bprotector-interconnector-p-660.html
   
  The item above is our new iBasso to SR-71B/protector interconnector from Beat Audio.


----------



## average_joe

Good stuff!  Is a specific wire used, such as the wire in the Oslo or some other Beat Audio cable?


----------



## Stephen Guo

The interconnector uses the Hera MKII wire, same wire as the cable for HE500/HE6 cable.
   
http://www.custom-iem.com/hera-mkii-for-hifiman-he6he500-%E2%80%93-beat-audio-earphone-cable-p-659.html
   
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Good stuff!  Is a specific wire used, such as the wire in the Oslo or some other Beat Audio cable?


----------



## Darwin022

Thanks for this review, Joe.  Which of these yo you think will stand the test of time as far as durability against failure?  I'm not rough on my equipment, but I use it all day every day.  The stock cables seem to last a few months, 5-7 at BEST before developing faults/just going bad.  I've just sent my Whiplash TWag OM back because one channel died completely (so I may never see it again).  Looking for a replacement.
   
  I love(d) the TWag OM.  Matched the JH13's well.  Nice open sound stage, very clear.  The feel of the cable was amazing.  fairly flexible, easy enough to coil but the coil wants to spring quickly, so it needs to be held/wrapped/etc. when not in use.  The quad braid is cool.  The Oyide right angle is a great looking plug but the plating on the contacts does wear quickly and create tracks in the plug.  The plug, as Joe said, can get in the way with some equipment.  I find that it gets in the way with the RSA Predator (flips the input/USB switch reliably).  It's better on The Shadow, but still hangs over the edge.  The OM plugs on this cable are nicer than the stock plugs.  They feel and look more sturdy.  It was very easy to get used to lack of memory wire, I think I prefer that now.  Moving down the cable, the wood slider is a nice touch.  It does the job well and with the rest of the cable, looks great.  The holes could be a bit larger though, it's a bit stiff feeding the cable through to adjust it.  It looks like Craig has changed the slider on the newest ones, which might be better.  I like how the Y is simple braid -> twist and clear shrink wrap.  That seems a lot more simple and more durable than the blocks of rubber and plastic (stock) that fall apart.  Fair is fair: the right channel had been slightly faulty for a few months, then it just up and died one day.  Similar to the Whiplash LOD I have (cuts in and out) so it seems to be common for their cables.  
   
  Overall, I really liked the TWag OM cable for the 6 months before it died.


----------



## average_joe

I really don't know which will last longer, I guess it depends on the usage.  The Beat Audio cable does seem very well made, but then I thought the TWag cable was as well.  The Cronus does have a jacket over the cable which could lead to more durability, but you never know until you try.
   

  Beat audio offers a 3 month warranty where they will pay for shipping, but will still warrant the cable after that as long as it is reparable.  You must ship the cable back and pay for return shipping.  The TWag cable has a 1 year warranty so you should be able to get warranty service.  Both Stephen from Beat Audio and Craig from Whiplash Audio are great guys and very responsive and helpful.

  [size=10.0pt][/size]


----------



## Anaxilus

I have to say I'm a huge fan of the earguides on the Beat audio stuff.  Everyone should be using that design IMO.  Not sure how you glass wearers feel about it.


----------



## average_joe

Jaben ES8 cable added.


----------



## Premonition

Very good effort marn  should review the Moon Audio SilverDragon too!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





premonition said:


> Very good effort marn  should review the Moon Audio SilverDragon too!


 

 Thanks and I will!


----------



## Foress

looking forward to a Silver Dragon IEM cable review!


----------



## kiteki

Fantastic.
   
  I just bought the Effect Studio Crystal.


----------



## ChrisSC

really curious about your impressions of the uber expensive crystal piccolinos- I know its really hard to get ahold of them- but I wonder if, money were no object, if they would be considered the best cables.  Some people say they're like adding a whole other component to the rig in terms of SQ, while others say they don't make a significant improvement.  If you could review them, that'd be great!


----------



## average_joe

While I am awaiting the Silver Dragon and some others I have the pleasure of auditioning these:
 
Null Audio Lune series upgrade cable fully enclosed in Nylon sleeve. It is the latest version of the Lune series cable for UE.  Second is the Arete series upgrade cable for UE, freshly coming out of the R&D lab and yet to be officially released.

 

   
  Both look amazing and I have just started using them.  I am not a big fan of the larger viablue connectors, but the small viablue plugs are awesome!


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


average_joe said:


>


 


 I love seeing new pictures of your TS842.


----------



## dogears

Cool stuff chief


----------



## Hero Kid

What is that white thing that both cables are plugged into in the third photo?


----------



## average_joe

The white thing is this.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





dogears said:


> Cool stuff chief


 

 x2 way to go captain.


----------



## dogears

Just to share, not yet fully done but I'm using it already 
  The Microsoft Mouse cable is now the EM3pro cable


----------



## average_joe

Where do you get the pins/what do you use for the pins?


----------



## dogears

Salvaged it from SOIC to DIP pins(?) like these:

  image borrowed from ebay
  Sort of finished the cable today, check my new avatar. I like the color combo 
   
  real edit: my new avatar


----------



## dogears

Sorry, here's a bigger pic. Just used heatshrinks for the jack and pins for the time being - until they last.


----------



## Hero Kid

Colour me impressed.


----------



## dogears

Thanks. Color by Konica Minolta (7D)


----------



## average_joe

A Chris_Himself cable added to the review queue:
   
   
   
  Sorry for the poor pic quality...long night...
   
  Here is his blog


----------



## shotgunshane

Very cool. Do you foresee any problems fitting Chris's connectors into a UM recessed socket?


----------



## average_joe

I have a Miracle with recessed sockets on hand and Chris's connector unfortunately does not fit.


----------



## kiteki

Yep, this feels more like a christmas decoration than a cable... does it light up when I plug it in?
   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Fantastic.
> 
> I just bought the Effect Studio Crystal.


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





dogears said:


> Sorry, here's a bigger pic. Just used heatshrinks for the jack and pins for the time being - until they last.
> *snip*


 

 Nice job dogears.  You could probably sell those, they look very cool.


----------



## dogears

^Thanks bro.


----------



## kiteki

^ Good idea.
   
  Dogears, stop listening to music, start selling cables!
   
  WOOF
   
   
   
   
  p.s. anyone know where I can get a new or used UE18Pro cable?


----------



## bbindon

Great review, very helpful!


----------



## eclipes

how about a review on Twisted Cables?


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





eclipes said:


> how about a review on Twisted Cables?


 

 Aka: http://www.head-fi.org/user/qusp


----------



## average_joe

Will see about the Twisted Cables.  I still have a few other reviews I need to finish up...I just need to get some good pics of the Null Audio cables and then have 3 more cables to review plus the TWag with the JH16 and a few other custom IEMs.


----------



## average_joe

Null Audio Lune and Arete added.
   
  I also added pictures of the Beat Audio Supreme - Rhyme.


----------



## Athur126

Any idea whens the arête becoming available?


----------



## average_joe

The Arete should be available in 3-4 weeks.


----------



## Jupiterknight

Regarding the Lune cable/ universal TF10 combo, I believe your description pretty much nailed it spot on how I experienced this setup sounded. 
   
  Now, to me at least, I wish that I had been so smart to figure out, that I "just" could have used some pliers combined with a fragment of energy and the pins would have fit  my Kozee reshelled TF10.
    
  Due to this info, I of course also wish that I hadn't sold my Lune cable, but I guess that I learn something everyday and I will most certainly want to try out the Arete whenever they become available.


----------



## average_joe

Think of this as an opportunity to get the Arete 
   
  And I have a Silver Dragon in hand!


----------



## dannytang

Can't wait to hear your thoughts about the Silver Dragon!


----------



## eclipes

damn should have waited a bit to hear your review on the silver dragon.


----------



## average_joe

Updated the TWag cable review with my thoughts with the JH16, SA-43, and UERM.


----------



## aslives

Great review - many thanks.  I was hoping though to see something on the Silver Dragons - any thoughts on them for the JH16's?


----------



## average_joe

Thanks, I should have a review of the Silver Dragon and Chris_Himself cables up soon, including how they pair with the JH16.


----------



## aslives

Great!  Really looking forward to hearing your sage impressions!


----------



## Randius

Eagerly waiting for your review on the Silver Dragon cable. Still deciding between this and the TWag to match my 1964-Q


----------



## PhaedraCorruption

Anyone have any idea where I can get a TF10 plug like this so I can make my own cable?


----------



## rawrster

average joe, do you find the stock cables to be durable? For some reason after some time one channel starts cutting in and out and I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. I've switched left with right to make sure it's the cable and not the custom and have determined it is the cable.
   
  Also since I have a recessed cable what would you consider to be a good option? I'm thinking trying the black UE cable since its 38 shipped and might be better than the Westone but I'm also looking at the Silver Dragon from Moon Audio. It looks durable enough and looks like a good cable that is not too prone to memory where the cable goes everywhere like on many custom cables I've experienced. Also would a Silver Dragon fit a recessed socket? I have that and from pics the black plastic thing that holds the pins looks the same as Westone but can you confirm that?
   
  What do you think about this?​


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> average joe, do you find the stock cables to be durable? For some reason after some time one channel starts cutting in and out and I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. I've switched left with right to make sure it's the cable and not the custom and have determined it is the cable.
> 
> Also since I have a recessed cable what would you consider to be a good option? I'm thinking trying the black UE cable since its 38 shipped and might be better than the Westone but I'm also looking at the Silver Dragon from Moon Audio. It looks durable enough and looks like a good cable that is not too prone to memory where the cable goes everywhere like on many custom cables I've experienced. Also would a Silver Dragon fit a recessed socket? I have that and from pics the black plastic thing that holds the pins looks the same as Westone but can you confirm that?
> 
> What do you think about this?​


 

 I am probably not your typical user from the standpoint that I don't listen to the same custom IEM day in and day out for extended periods of time since I am always testing and A/Bing for reviews.  I have had one issue and that was the JH16 cable, but it was the shell connector plastic breaking.
   
  I don't think the UE cable will fit the Westone customs as the pins are smaller.  You can of course expand them, but you should buy the old model, not the new as the new is made for an outie!
   
 
  First picture: UERM; 2nd picture: EM3 Pro plug (recessed socket), TWag plug (fits recessed sockets), aftermarket TF10 plug, TF10 plug
   
  The Silver Dragon will fit and is a good sounding cable, I should have my review of the Silver Dragon and Chris_Himself cables posted next week.  A sneak peak is I am hearing a larger soundstage when using the Silver Dragon than stock cables with better attributed due to the larger space.  The cable is relatively thick and well made with low memory and tangling and won't "go everywhere!"


----------



## rawrster

I'll wait for that review then. I do have a cable that works but it's terminated into a straight plug since I preferred it then but that is no longer the case with my phone as source. 
   
  I was actually referring to the custom cable before they changed it to the new cable. On the UE website you can buy both new and old as it's pretty cheap but may just spend some money on a Moon Audio cable where it may last me longer. I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong since I'm not rough on them.


----------



## eclipes

awaiting your silver dragon review. Thanks average_joe
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I am probably not your typical user from the standpoint that I don't listen to the same custom IEM day in and day out for extended periods of time since I am always testing and A/Bing for reviews.  I have had one issue and that was the JH16 cable, but it was the shell connector plastic breaking.
> 
> I don't think the UE cable will fit the Westone customs as the pins are smaller.  You can of course expand them, but you should buy the old model, not the new as the new is made for an outie!
> 
> ...


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I'll wait for that review then. I do have a cable that works but it's terminated into a straight plug since I preferred it then but that is no longer the case with my phone as source.
> 
> I was actually referring to the custom cable before they changed it to the new cable. On the UE website you can buy both new and old as it's pretty cheap but may just spend some money on a Moon Audio cable where it may last me longer. I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong since I'm not rough on them.


 

 OK, got ya.
   
  Quote: 





eclipes said:


> awaiting your silver dragon review. Thanks average_joe


 
   
  I should be posting my Silver Dragon and Chris_Himself cable reviews by Thursday...


----------



## Sayajin

Impressive collection you got there average_joe. 
Enjoyed reading the first post. Looking up for your next reviews as well.


----------



## average_joe

Silver Dragon IEM cable and Chris_Himself IEM cables added in the first post.  Double Helix Symbiote cable on the way.  Let me know if there are any other cables you would like reviewed and I will see what I can do...


----------



## 0o0o0o

Great collection of reviews average_joe.
   
  Too bad about the Crystal, have to say those heat-shrink wrapped connectors look disgusting when connected to the TF10s.
   
  My quest for a cheaper than $50 braided cable continues.... Though I'm seriously considering giving up and just buying the Supreme Rose.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Heya thanks for the review man, shame about the build quality thing... I'll get it fixed and it'll go right back to you!
   
  I have a feeling that the intermittent channel might have a negative effect on your final sound as well... I'm glad you put 300+ hours on them, although my recommended burn in is usually like 20-40 hours haha...
   
  Man those pictures look great compared to the ones I have on 'em...


----------



## rawrster

Thanks for the review average joe. The Silver Dragon cable looks a lot like the CK10 cable


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Heya thanks for the review man, shame about the build quality thing... I'll get it fixed and it'll go right back to you!
> 
> I have a feeling that the intermittent channel might have a negative effect on your final sound as well... I'm glad you put 300+ hours on them, although my recommended burn in is usually like 20-40 hours haha...
> 
> Man those pictures look great compared to the ones I have on 'em...


 
   
  No problem, it was a joy to review.  And as you did state, you will fix them in addition to offering that lifetime warranty.  It is not if something breaks IMO (unless it breaks repeatedly), but how the issue is handled that is the most important.  I still highly recommended your cable given the price/performance.  Buy 2 at the price you sell them for!  Once I get the cable back I will use it for an extended time and see if there are any future issues.  And I have updated the text of the review.  
   
  I do burn in all my cables the same just to make sure and do know that some of them seem to continue to change over extended periods of time.  I am not sure about the issue causing any negative effect on the sound as once the memory wire was straightened I had a good connection.
   
  Thanks, I am trying to figure out how to take better pictures, lighting is critical and it is a learning process.
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Thanks for the review average joe. The Silver Dragon cable looks a lot like the CK10 cable


 

 Yea, but thicker and stiffer.


----------



## eclipes

great stuff, I am going to order the Silver Dragon and compare it with my DHC cable now. Awaiting your review for the DHC cable now haha. Thanks average_joe


----------



## Chris_Himself

Yeah dude you can't review my stuff and NOT review DHC! Best in the business IMO. Nice guy too, he helped me with a lot of questions when I was just starting out.


----------



## RockaRolla

Chris cables certainly looked tempting for the price, any idea how it would perform with ES5?
   
  I have the supreme rose, while I love the softness and silicon material used (esp. the ear guide areas), i kinda hate the springy effect on the cables coiled/uncoiled.
  After i had coiled it nicely and leave it, it would just spring and uncoil itself into a mess haha


----------



## average_joe

I don't have the ES5 so I can't compare, but since sonically the CH cable has similar strengths to the TWag, which I loaned to an ES5 owner who really liked it with the ES5, I would deduce it will perform well!  However, the springy effect will be somewhere between that of the Rose and something like the Silver Dragon; the stiffness helps it retain its shape better but you have to over-bend the cable to get it to stay a certain way.


----------



## rawrster

Is it that much thicker than the CK10 cable? It looking like that cable is what got me tempted since that cable is awesome. It would also be nice to not have a memory wire since I hate those esp since I wear glasses. The cable doesn't feel heavy when it is being used right?


----------



## Metalboy

Quote: 





rockarolla said:


> , any idea how it would perform with ES5?


 


  It works very well with my ES5  Much better than The Beat Audio Cronus. It made the cymbal sounds etc way to loud and it did nothing to the mids.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





metalboy said:


> It works very well with my ES5  Much better than The Beat Audio Cronus. It made the cymbal sounds etc way to loud and it did nothing to the mids.


 


  Haha hey there I think I have an idea of who you are! Man shipping to Sweden is not nearly as quick as I thought it'd be! 
   
  Enjoy the cables!


----------



## eclipes

Thanks for the great reviews, I've been keeping up with every cable you've tested and compared. Really interested in the Silver dragon cable.
  Was wondering how flexible is the cable? is it really hard to work with? how does it compare with the Westone Stock cable, I actually love the flexibility and weight of the stock cable but the sound is just congested and muddy. How is the cable around the ear, does it bend around the ear or is a memory wire required for it?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





eclipes said:


> Thanks for the great reviews, I've been keeping up with every cable you've tested and compared. Really interested in the Silver dragon cable.
> Was wondering how flexible is the cable? is it really hard to work with? how does it compare with the Westone Stock cable, I actually love the flexibility and weight of the stock cable but the sound is just congested and muddy. How is the cable around the ear, does it bend around the ear or is a memory wire required for it?


 

 Thank you!
   
  The flexibility is much lower than the stock cable, although I wouldn't say it is hard to work with.  The stock cable will just fall into a pile while the Silver Dragon is closer to the performance of a power cord, of course better, but similar.  I have no problem with the cable around my ear as the weight of the cable holds it in place and since the custom is snug in my ear and won't come out unless I rotate it out, there really isn't any concern.

 Here are some pictures of the Silver Dragon with a stock cable (they are pretty much all the same) so you can see the size differences:
   
   
  The SD cable is much thicker all around except the Y-split and where the memory wire area and inspires much more confidence.


----------



## Metalboy

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Haha hey there I think I have an idea of who you are! Man shipping to Sweden is not nearly as quick as I thought it'd be!
> 
> Enjoy the cables!


 


 Yeah you are not the first one saying that


----------



## eclipes

Thanks again average_joe, looks good.
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Thank you!
> 
> The flexibility is much lower than the stock cable, although I wouldn't say it is hard to work with.  The stock cable will just fall into a pile while the Silver Dragon is closer to the performance of a power cord, of course better, but similar.  I have no problem with the cable around my ear as the weight of the cable holds it in place and since the custom is snug in my ear and won't come out unless I rotate it out, there really isn't any concern.
> Here are some pictures of the Silver Dragon with a stock cable (they are pretty much all the same) so you can see the size differences:
> ...


----------



## scootermafia

Yeah, in my experience, somewhere between too big, and worryingly thin dental floss, is key.


----------



## Jupiterknight

@Average Joe
   
  Great review on the Chris_Himself's cable's. I have been using two of his IEM cable's for a month or so and I can only concur that I found a similar (large compared to stock) improvement in sound when using his custom cable with my reshelled TF10's, and that you even wanted to keep your TF10's in your ears for many more seconds than usual, kind of expresses this very explicitly  
   
  His cable's, when compared to the pricing of many other aftermarket cable's, then I most certainly find them worth their price (including a life time warranty!) as you said yourself Chris is a very nice guy to communicate with and in my experience he so far delivers his products very quickly.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Yeah, in my experience, somewhere between too big, and worryingly thin dental floss, is key.


 

 Yep, just the right size...for the headphone type.  I like thick cables for full sized cans, but for IEMs a little thinner, but not too thin is better!


  Quote: 





jupiterknight said:


> @Average Joe
> 
> Great review on the Chris_Himself's cable's. I have been using two of his IEM cable's for a month or so and I can only concur that I found a similar (large compared to stock) improvement in sound when using his custom cable with my reshelled TF10's, and that you even wanted to keep your TF10's in your ears for many more seconds than usual, kind of expresses this very explicitly
> 
> His cable's, when compared to the pricing of many other aftermarket cable's, then I most certainly find them worth their price (including a life time warranty!) as you said yourself Chris is a very nice guy to communicate with and in my experience he so far delivers his products very quickly.


 

 Yes, another great option depending on what you want to spend and what is important to you.  I hope they figure out how to make them for recessed sockets as I want to try with the EM3 Pro and LS8 (and have a friend that wants to try with his Miracle).


----------



## Foress

how would you compare the Silver Dragon with Chris' Silver cable?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





foress said:


> how would you compare the Silver Dragon with Chris' Silver cable?


 

 Well, both are very different in design and also differ in audio performance.  The Silver Dragon is much thicker, probably the thickest custom IEM cable I have, while the Chris_Himself cable is average thickness.  Ergonomics and ease of use go to the SD, but that is not saying the CH cable is bad.  To generalize the sound quality, but improve many custom IEMs, but the CH seemed to improve more and more consistently.  The SD didn't do all that much other than expand the space, with minor improvements in other qualities more than likely due to the larger space.  The CH cable did seem to add to the clarity, dynamics, and refinement more, and while the CH cable does improve the soundstage size, I am not sure it improves it as much as the SD.  I was planning on comparing cable vs. cable when I get a chance, but I am not sure when that will be as I have amps, sources, and many other custom IEMs to review.


----------



## Foress

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Well, both are very different in design and also differ in audio performance.  The Silver Dragon is much thicker, probably the thickest custom IEM cable I have, while the Chris_Himself cable is average thickness.  Ergonomics and ease of use go to the SD, but that is not saying the CH cable is bad.  To generalize the sound quality, but improve many custom IEMs, but the CH seemed to improve more and more consistently.  The SD didn't do all that much other than expand the space, with minor improvements in other qualities more than likely due to the larger space.  The CH cable did seem to add to the clarity, dynamics, and refinement more, and while the CH cable does improve the soundstage size, I am not sure it improves it as much as the SD.  I was planning on comparing cable vs. cable when I get a chance, but I am not sure when that will be as I have amps, sources, and many other custom IEMs to review.


 


  thank you for the comparison. personally i own both and i feel somehow the CH cable is strong in making vocals clearer while the SD makes bass much clearer. do you hear the same thing?


----------



## eclipes

which one would you recommend as an all around IEM cable? The CH or the SD?
  
  Quote: 





foress said:


> thank you for the comparison. personally i own both and i feel somehow the CH cable is strong in making vocals clearer while the SD makes bass much clearer. do you hear the same thing?


----------



## Foress

Quote: 





eclipes said:


> which one would you recommend as an all around IEM cable? The CH or the SD?


 


  if you don't mind the stiffness, the CH cable is excellent - really excellent.
  i find myself changing between the 2 cables all the time. it depends on what setup i'm using.


----------



## eclipes

great thanks... Im pretty interested in the CH cables but too bad they don't fit recessed sockets. I'll give the Silver Dragon a try and see how it goes.

  
  Quote: 





foress said:


> if you don't mind the stiffness, the CH cable is excellent - really excellent.
> i find myself changing between the 2 cables all the time. it depends on what setup i'm using.


----------



## average_joe

Double Helix arrived

   
  Comparison between the CK10 cable and Silver Dragon: The SD is a little thicker but is much stiffer and the outer jacket is made from a much harder material.  The CK10 cable will flop around a lot while the SD won't too much.

   
  Comparison between the TWag, Silver Dragon, and Double Helix


----------



## eclipes

Great, looks like the DHC is the thickest one. Now I'll await your review on the DHC cable. Best IEM cable thread, keep it up average_joe
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Double Helix arrived
> 
> 
> Comparison between the CK10 cable and Silver Dragon: The SD is a little thicker but is much stiffer and the outer jacket is made from a much harder material.  The CK10 cable will flop around a lot while the SD won't too much.
> ...


----------



## scootermafia

I feel so ALO right now with my big bad 24 gauge cable.


----------



## average_joe

Thanks and yea, I need 2 hands to handle it


----------



## scootermafia

Use my cables and pretty soon people will ask you if you've been working out...


----------



## eclipes

My Silver Dragon IEM cable just came in today, so I got a chance to do a initial impression of the cable with my Um3x. I've used the stock westone cable, Twag, and currently using the DHC symbiote cable. There is definitely a significant difference on my um3x with the Silver Dragon. First thing I've noticed was the HUGE soundstage and space. The spacious presentation kinda blew me away because i've never listened to something with such large soundstage ever (grado fan). The bass is definitely a lot deeper than my DHC, clarity is around the same. Overall feeling of the silver dragon was the sound is a bit laid back compared to the DHC. Aesthetics... my DHC looks better but silver dragon functions a lot better, especially for my daily 4 hour commutes. Its much more low profile, lighter, thinner, and fits a lot better around the ear since I wear glasses. DHC is a bit difficult sometimes since it can never wrap around my ear properly without a memory wire which i dont want. Silver Dragon definitely helps people with glasses, its functionality is a lot similar to the Westone Stock Cable. Quality is expected from Moon Audio, definitely built to last and its pretty strong.
   
  Overall impression of the Silver Dragon IEM cable for me are quite positive and definitely a keeper. One more thing, 0 Hour burn in was on the silver dragon while comparing to DHC,  it has around 200 hours. Drew from Moon Audio recommended a Minimum of 60Hour burn in for the silver dragon so i will definitely burn this baby in and see how it performs later. Will keep you guys updated. Oh yeah, the review from average_joe was the exact same impression that I got, thanks again for this wonderful thread!!!


----------



## scootermafia

You guys will actually be comparing 2 different cables.  Eclipes, you have one of the non cryo, 26 gauge prototypes.  Also, if you want it to stay put behind your ears, shape the last 3" of the cable into a loop and heat it with a hairdryer, then let it cool and it will stay in a shape that will not pop up, I do this to all the cables now.


----------



## eclipes

I believe you said there weren't any difference in sound between the 2 cables correct? And also, I did try to use the hairdryer method but only worked for a while before it lost its memory. One thing I do want to note is that I curl it up to fit in my pelican1010 case every thing i put my rig away, that might also be a reason on why the memory won't last for me.
  
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> You guys will actually be comparing 2 different cables.  Eclipes, you have one of the non cryo, 26 gauge prototypes.  Also, if you want it to stay put behind your ears, shape the last 3" of the cable into a loop and heat it with a hairdryer, then let it cool and it will stay in a shape that will not pop up, I do this to all the cables now.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





eclipes said:


> My Silver Dragon IEM cable just came in today, so I got a chance to do a initial impression of the cable with my Um3x. I've used the stock westone cable, Twag, and currently using the DHC symbiote cable. There is definitely a significant difference on my um3x with the Silver Dragon. First thing I've noticed was the HUGE soundstage and space. The spacious presentation kinda blew me away because i've never listened to something with such large soundstage ever (grado fan). The bass is definitely a lot deeper than my DHC, clarity is around the same. Overall feeling of the silver dragon was the sound is a bit laid back compared to the DHC. Aesthetics... my DHC looks better but silver dragon functions a lot better, especially for my daily 4 hour commutes. Its much more low profile, lighter, thinner, and fits a lot better around the ear since I wear glasses. DHC is a bit difficult sometimes since it can never wrap around my ear properly without a memory wire which i dont want. Silver Dragon definitely helps people with glasses, its functionality is a lot similar to the Westone Stock Cable. Quality is expected from Moon Audio, definitely built to last and its pretty strong.
> 
> Overall impression of the Silver Dragon IEM cable for me are quite positive and definitely a keeper. One more thing, 0 Hour burn in was on the silver dragon while comparing to DHC,  it has around 200 hours. Drew from Moon Audio recommended a Minimum of 60Hour burn in for the silver dragon so i will definitely burn this baby in and see how it performs later. Will keep you guys updated. Oh yeah, the review from average_joe was the exact same impression that I got, thanks again for this wonderful thread!!!


 

 Glad to hear it about the improved space.  For some reason I really don't have issues with most cables staying in place even without memory wire.  My DHC is getting run in like all my other cables locked in my closet, but I am looking forward to hearing it.  
   
  Also, different IEMs will react differently with the various aftermarket cables which is why I test all my customs with each cable.


----------



## eclipes

yeah i do like both cables a lot, both has its own advantages. 
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Glad to hear it about the improved space.  For some reason I really don't have issues with most cables staying in place even without memory wire.  My DHC is getting run in like all my other cables locked in my closet, but I am looking forward to hearing it.
> 
> Also, different IEMs will react differently with the various aftermarket cables which is why I test all my customs with each cable.


----------



## scootermafia

I only mean that there might be a difference (especially in usability since you really need a heat gun to apply a permanent shape to the cable) in the prototype vs. final.  The copper itself is the same metal, but the final cable is 24awg vs. 26awg in the prototypes, and cryoed.


----------



## aslives

Thanks for the excellent review.  So at this point I am thinking of replacing my stock JH16 cables for the silver dragons.  Seems like the best bet in that price range.  Worth the switch?  Love to hear your thoughts.


----------



## eclipes

really depends on your preference and your music collection.. the silver dragon is definitely a great cable for its sound and build quality.. if you enjoy a spacious and large soundstage without losing the clarity, the silver dragon definitely fulfills it. the sound is actually really comfortable, not too aggressive and forward which actually gives me headaches after a certain period of time. it was a bit harsh in the beginning compared to my dhc but after around 80hrs of use, the sound is a lot smoother...



aslives said:


> Thanks for the excellent review.  So at this point I am thinking of replacing my stock JH16 cables for the silver dragons.  Seems like the best bet in that price range.  Worth the switch?  Love to hear your thoughts.


----------



## average_joe

For under $200 the SD cable is very good, and depending on what you are looking for in ergonomics, the Chris_Himself cable is worth a look also.  Another good match with the JH16, although at a higher price point is the Whiplash TWag cable.


----------



## Sayajin

I just placed an order on the Silver Dragon. Again thank you for this amazing thread joe. Will be checking up for more stuff.


----------



## average_joe

Thanks!  Let us know how what you think when your SD is burned in.


----------



## average_joe

Added the Symbiote and Crystalino cables as well as the UERM stock cable near the top.


----------



## Cryok95

Great review! I suppose the crystalino is based on crystal piccolino cables?


----------



## average_joe

Thanks.  Yes, I believe this cable was made by Null Audio (please correct me if I am wrong). When I wrote the review, which was several weeks ago, the link at the top had full product information, but Null Audio has discontinued the cable and has taken the information down.


----------



## Cryok95

Hmm, i dont think so. i am not aware of any link between jaben and null audio. Though, the cable material is the same. Jaben sells many other cables for tf10, i suspect the maker of those cables also made the ones shown in your link. In general, crystal cables are rare now, thus the price. Though, Matt(who is currently banned) seems to have an abundance of crystal piccolino wire.


----------



## zainprox

Hi average_joe, may i know which version of the Lune cable did you review? Is it the older one or the later 'Lune cable mkII'?
   
  Also, If I am not mistaken, Crystalino and Crystal Piccolino are 2 different companies. Crystal Piccolino sells the wires, but do not make them into cables. Jaben buys the Crystal Piccolino wires and makes them into iem and headphone cables and sells them


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





cryok95 said:


> Hmm, i dont think so. i am not aware of any link between jaben and null audio. Though, the cable material is the same. Jaben sells many other cables for tf10, i suspect the maker of those cables also made the ones shown in your link. In general, crystal cables are rare now, thus the price. Though, Matt(who is currently banned) seems to have an abundance of crystal piccolino wire.


 

  
  Quote: 





zainprox said:


> Hi average_joe, may i know which version of the Lune cable did you review? Is it the older one or the later 'Lune cable mkII'?
> 
> Also, If I am not mistaken, Crystalino and Crystal Piccolino are 2 different companies. Crystal Piccolino sells the wires, but do not make them into cables. Jaben buys the Crystal Piccolino wires and makes them into iem and headphone cables and sells them


 

 So, the cable I reviewed was actually the Crystal Piccolino made by Parrots (Matt), and the rest of your info is correct.
   
  Correction: The cable I tested was the MKII.


----------



## cooperpwc

Just a fine review, Joe. I am very interested in trying the Silver Dragon and also a future copper version that Moon Audio will make.
   
  It would be cool if you could review the Twisted Cable TWcu (24awg) cable from qusp. (That would add another copper entry to your line up.) It's thick but very flexible. Sounds great. I like mine muchly.


----------



## scootermafia

Piccolino isn't rare, you just have to buy a large amount of it at a time to get a halfway decent price (think spending five figures).  I can tell you now that it doesn't cost as much as some people says it does, not by a long shot, but it is still very very expensive compared to wholesale prices of any other cable out there that DIYers work with.  Working with it once was enough to say never again, to build a business around it you either need all the free time of Hannibal Lecter or the $10,000 automatic stripping machine that Crystal uses.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





cooperpwc said:


> Just a fine review, Joe. I am very interested in trying the Silver Dragon and also a future copper version that Moon Audio will make.
> 
> It would be cool if you could review the Twisted Cable TWcu (24awg) cable from qusp. (That would add another copper entry to your line up.) It's thick but very flexible. Sounds great. I like mine muchly.


 

 Thanks!  I am working on reviewing several other things at the moment and when I get those out I will probably review the cables from qusp.  So many great products!  

  
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Piccolino isn't rare, you just have to buy a large amount of it at a time to get a halfway decent price (think spending five figures).  I can tell you now that it doesn't cost as much as some people says it does, not by a long shot, but it is still very very expensive compared to wholesale prices of any other cable out there that DIYers work with.  Working with it once was enough to say never again, to build a business around it you either need all the free time of Hannibal Lecter or the $10,000 automatic stripping machine that Crystal uses.


 

 Thanks for the info.  If the UERM was my only custom IEM, I would have to consider the cable, but since it isn't, I am OK without


----------



## caracara08

Hey Joe, which cable would be a great match for the Aud5x?


----------



## average_joe

Depends on what you are looking for in the sound...changes or no changes.  Also, what is your price range and what do you want from a looks and usability perspective.  The TWag and Chris_Himself cables are very nice and fit my personal preference.


----------



## caracara08

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Depends on what you are looking for in the sound...changes or no changes.  Also, what is your price range and what do you want from a looks and usability perspective.  The TWag and Chris_Himself cables are very nice and fit my personal preference.


 


  thanks those fill both price ranges.  i was always curious about the moon audio though. dont think it would be a good pairing?


----------



## average_joe

The CH cable is brighter than the SD cable, but both improve space and the overall technical presentation.  The TWag is closer to the CH cable, but technically a little better in the improvements in clarity, imaging, and instrument separation.


----------



## gabieteo91

just wanted to say thanks for the review.
  using a NULL Audio Lune cable now, thinking whether shld upgrade to TWag


----------



## gabieteo91

also, can I ask whether plugs matter?
  Heard the Oyaide Rhodium plug is really good.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





gabieteo91 said:


> just wanted to say thanks for the review.
> using a NULL Audio Lune cable now, thinking whether shld upgrade to TWag


 

 You are welcome!  And what are you using with the Lune?
   
  Quote: 





gabieteo91 said:


> also, can I ask whether plugs matter?
> Heard the Oyaide Rhodium plug is really good.


 

 At this point I can't really say since I haven't had the same cable with 2 different plugs.  I would venture to say there will be some differences between some, but not sure if they would be good or not, and how significant or not.  Theoretically there should only be changes if the resistance, capacitance, and/or inductance changes.


----------



## SladeNoctis

So is the Arete a better purchase money wise over the Lune?


----------



## average_joe

It depends on what you are looking for in a cable and what you are matching it up with.  Personally I do think the Arete is the better deal, but they do sound different to me.


----------



## rac4hf

Thanks for the detailed reviews and info!  I have JH13 IEMs and the stock cable, using with my iphone mainly.  I find it a pain to remove the IEMs when I run into someone on the street.  Is there a cable available from any of these companies that provides a mic for street conversations without removing the IEM?  Taking calls and controlling the ipod would also be nice.  If not, any recommended adapters?  Thanks!


----------



## chapel

Can these be made to fit a TF10?
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Ultimate Ears In-Ear Reference Cable $40
> Why does the UERM cable (and all new UE monitors after September 1, 2010) have their own entry?  Because they are different and IMO better than other stock cables in many ways.  First, the shell connectors fit over a protruding socket for a secure fit with a great angle that works well in my ears.  Next the actual cable uses a very tight braid for the area between the nice looking 3.5mm plug and the Y-split and then after the Y-split the cable uses a very tight twist.  The cable uses 4 wires to avoid issues that can be caused by splitting one wire to two at the Y-split.
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ChrisSC

@ Rac4hf:
   
  beat audio iPhone specialists
  http://www.custom-iem.com/iphone-specialist-mic-remote-–-beat-audio-earphone-cable-p-656.html
   
  If you get them, let me know how you like them because I'm thinking about buying them too!


----------



## goodvibes

Really good stuff. Thanks. I like everything about the review except the explanation why Silver's brighter. I agree that it often is and enjoyed your descriptions but material resistance isn't frequency selective. The raw wire used here will pass 1 mhz at these length without loss relative to lows. Skin effect, stranding, reflections, impedance and construction can have an exponentially greater infuence on bandwidth. I'm not arguing that silver doesn't sound different or that these cables don't. I know they do. I just don't think it's resistance. A 1.7m vs 1.6m silver cable will sound virtually the same while a copper of 1.6 with same constuction will likely not and the resistance at connections and solder is more significant. Sorry for the input if it's not welcome. I have no objections if you'd like the mods to delete this post as I really like the piece and am not trying to get this into another cable being different debate. I'm with you here and just wanted to comment on your thought regarding the mechanism.


----------



## Chris_Himself

To date, I have no idea why things sound the way they do and I'm on cable #70 ahahah...
   
  I just know that my particular version of silver sounds one way, and the copper I use sounds another way, and that Grado copper sounds completely different so it's very hard to nail down why things should sound the way they do for the time being.
   
  Then again I have friends who pick up an SR-80 and then my SR-225 and they can't hear a difference... so theres always that...


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





chapel said:


> Can these be made to fit a TF10?


 

 Sure, anything can be done.  I doubt UE would do it though, so you would need to either DIY it or get someone else to do it.

  
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Really good stuff. Thanks. I like everything about the review except the explanation why Silver's brighter. I agree that it often is and enjoyed your descriptions but material resistance isn't frequency selective. The raw wire used here will pass 1 mhz at these length without loss relative to lows. Skin effect, stranding, reflections, impedance and construction can have an exponentially greater infuence on bandwidth. I'm not arguing that silver doesn't sound different or that these cables don't. I know they do. I just don't think it's resistance. A 1.7m vs 1.6m silver cable will sound virtually the same while a copper of 1.6 with same constuction will likely not and the resistance at connections and solder is more significant. Sorry for the input if it's not welcome. I have no objections if you'd like the mods to delete this post as I really like the piece and am not trying to get this into another cable being different debate. I'm with you here and just wanted to comment on your thought regarding the mechanism.


 
   
  I welcome the question.  I am not an expert and until someone pays me to work in a lab and truly figure these things out, I will have to go off my work experience with wiring and various signals, engineering background, research, and what my ears are telling me.
   
  Audio signals are much different than RF and HF signals, especially when you consider they will typically be carrying some PSK, FSK, etc signal that doesn't have the intricacies of music .  With audio frequencies there is no skin effect (hence silver plated copper has no benefit of silver) and reflections are pretty much not an issue.  There was an excellent post I read somewhere that described the differences in op amp performance into loads with different capacitance.  The differences weren't large, but the leading edge of a square wave was noticeably different on a scope which would affect attack of a note.  And if you think about all the different electrons moving at different speeds and at different amplitudes, some large, some small, some very small, it would seem logical to me that the small difference in resistance along with the capacitive and inductive changes that may be present can not only affect the very small amplitude signals that make up the micro-detail, but also affect the amp performance.  We are talking about tiny differences in resistance, but also tiny amplitude analog signals.
   
  As far as the significance of solder, I do believe it is significant, but if there is metal to metal contact of the wire to the pin, the effect of solder for an audio signal should minimized.  I actually think the material and construction of the connectors can also make a slight but audible difference (when combined with high resolution equipment and music), but I have not had the opportunity to test connectors.


----------



## Anaxilus

I can tell you emphatically UE will not do it.
   
  I can also tell you the perception of altered FR is actually not a change in FR.  You'll need to look elsewhere to investigate perceived differences.  All I'm gonna say.


----------



## rac4hf

Thanks for the suggestion.  They don't have the Push-to-hear ability, though.  Reviews of Shure's Push-To-Hear (the only one I could find with the feature) seem to indicate it's a bit of a novelty and clumsily implemented.  I'd like to have the option, but doesnt seem like there's a good custom IEM option.  There is an app that can add some of the funtionality (SoundOut) using the phone mic, but that has its own limitations.
   
  Quote: 





chrissc said:


> @ Rac4hf:
> 
> beat audio iPhone specialists
> http://www.custom-iem.com/iphone-specialist-mic-remote-–-beat-audio-earphone-cable-p-656.html
> ...


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I can tell you emphatically UE will not do it.
> 
> I can also tell you the perception of altered FR is actually not a change in FR.  You'll need to look elsewhere to investigate perceived differences.  All I'm gonna say.


 


 This.


----------



## shureThing

Woot! This stopped me getting Double Helix cables...


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Hey guys,
   
  I was wondering how bad the memory/ergonomics are on the Chris_Himself cables, especially compared to Triple.Fi stock cables? I was thinking about replacing those cables simply because of how difficult they are to manage, but if the ergonomics of the Chris_Himself cables are pretty poor, then it seems like the Null Audio Arete is the way to go. The Arete also seems the be pretty bulky as well (maybe due to the nylon sleeve), but you made references to it's light weight, so it seems to be the best for what I'm looking for.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Foress

Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I was wondering how bad the memory/ergonomics are on the Chris_Himself cables, especially compared to Triple.Fi stock cables? I was thinking about replacing those cables simply because of how difficult they are to manage, but if the ergonomics of the Chris_Himself cables are pretty poor, then it seems like the Null Audio Arete is the way to go. The Arete also seems the be pretty bulky as well (maybe due to the nylon sleeve), but you made references to it's light weight, so it seems to be the best for what I'm looking for.
> 
> Thanks!


 


  I don't think it's really much of an issue - especially with the lifetime warranty. It's a world of differences compared with the TF10 stock cable. Possibly the best cable in the price range. I would definitely recommend Chris' cable any day.


----------



## scootermafia

Quote: 





shurething said:


> Woot! This stopped me getting Double Helix cables...


 


  Is it because the TF10 is a tight fit?  I use the same plugs as the majority of IEM cable makers (Plastics One does the overmolded "type 92" connector that a lot of IEM cables have) but you do have to wiggle them in with a bit of force with the TF10s so it's not a good idea to do nonstop cable rolling with these or certain other IEM cables.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I was wondering how bad the memory/ergonomics are on the Chris_Himself cables, especially compared to Triple.Fi stock cables? I was thinking about replacing those cables simply because of how difficult they are to manage, but if the ergonomics of the Chris_Himself cables are pretty poor, then it seems like the Null Audio Arete is the way to go. The Arete also seems the be pretty bulky as well (maybe due to the nylon sleeve), but you made references to it's light weight, so it seems to be the best for what I'm looking for.
> 
> Thanks!


 

 The CH cable is better than the stock cable, ergonomically they are just different, with the stock cable being unwieldy while the CH cable is just a little stiff in comparison.  You can get the CH cable with heat shrink which changes the characteristics in a positive way IMO.  I will post some pictures comparing the two.
   
  The Arete is one of the thinner cables I have tested and isn't bulky at all and for me is the easiest to use and has the best combo of flexibility and tangle resistance.  Well, the Lune actually, but if you can get the Arete with the overbraid after the Y-split that would be a great cable ergonomically.  
   
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Is it because the TF10 is a tight fit?  I use the same plugs as the majority of IEM cable makers (Plastics One does the overmolded "type 92" connector that a lot of IEM cables have) but you do have to wiggle them in with a bit of force with the TF10s so it's not a good idea to do nonstop cable rolling with these or certain other IEM cables.


 

 I do have to say I would take the DH cable 10 out or 10 times over the stock TF10 cable and for the size, it is very user friendly.


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> The CH cable is better than the stock cable, ergonomically they are just different, with the stock cable being unwieldy while the CH cable is just a little stiff in comparison.  You can get the CH cable with heat shrink which changes the characteristics in a positive way IMO.  I will post some pictures comparing the two.
> 
> The Arete is one of the thinner cables I have tested and isn't bulky at all and for me is the easiest to use and has the best combo of flexibility and tangle resistance.  Well, the Lune actually, but if you can get the Arete with the overbraid after the Y-split that would be a great cable ergonomically.


 

 Thanks, that was great advice. The pricing of the two is about the same and I don't really have the money to spend on cables at the time, but I'll keep this in mind (and stalk the cables for sale to see if there's a bargain).


----------



## Poak

Hey, what's the most *durable *cable for the tf10? I don't want to pay a lot for a cable and I'm not looking for sound improvement, I simply want something which will last.


----------



## Jalo

Average Joe, your review of the Crystal Piccolino is as opposite to my experience as night and day in almost every way.  I have three Crystal Piccolino cables (JH13, LCD2/3, and HD800) and I have used my JH13/Piccolino for almost a year so I am intimately familiar with its sound character.  It is the most natural and smooth cable that I have heard for my JH13.  By the way, the metallurgy of the Piccolino is made up of mostly silver and some gold that are melted together under precise control and temperature before the wire is made otherwise the crystal will be destroyed at different temperature level and its smoothness will be gone.  However, it is not gold plated on the outside as you indicated.  I met with the inventor, Gabby at this year RMAF and had a very good discussion with her on the sound.
   
  Besides the Piccolino, I also owned the following cables for my JH13:  JH stock, UE stock, ALO 22 awg Chain Mail 8 wire UPOCC copper, Whiplash TWag v1, and Stefan Audio Equinnox.  Out of the group, the Piccolino is by far the most natural, musical cable with absolutely no listener fatigue.  I do not understand where the roughness come from in your audition.  But the Piccolino is anything but rough.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





poak said:


> Hey, what's the most *durable *cable for the tf10? I don't want to pay a lot for a cable and I'm not looking for sound improvement, I simply want something which will last.


 

 There are many factors that go into how long a cable will last IMO, and the primary factor is the users.  How do you remove the plug, where to you keep the player, how much tugging is there on the cable (is it used primarily while walking or sitting down for example), and how is it stored?
   
  I also think there is a factor of random bad luck with cables as I have experienced cable failures in IEMs without much use and no abuse to being able to abuse the cables.
   
  As far as durability, the Symbiote cable seems very robust and is the first cable I think of from a durability standpoint with the Silver Dragon coming in second.  If you do get the full sleeve over the Arete, with the flexible construction I would imaging that cable should last if treated well.
  
  Quote: 





jalo said:


> Average Joe, your review of the Crystal Piccolino is as opposite to my experience as night and day in almost every way.  I have three Crystal Piccolino cables (JH13, LCD2/3, and HD800) and I have used my JH13/Piccolino for almost a year so I am intimately familiar with its sound character.  It is the most natural and smooth cable that I have heard for my JH13.  By the way, the metallurgy of the Piccolino is made up of mostly silver and some gold that are melted together under precise control and temperature before the wire is made otherwise the crystal will be destroyed at different temperature level and its smoothness will be gone.  However, it is not gold plated on the outside as you indicated.  I met with the inventor, Gabby at this year RMAF and had a very good discussion with her on the sound.
> 
> Besides the Piccolino, I also owned the following cables for my JH13:  JH stock, UE stock, ALO 22 awg Chain Mail 8 wire UPOCC copper, Whiplash TWag v1, and Stefan Audio Equinnox.  Out of the group, the Piccolino is by far the most natural, musical cable with absolutely no listener fatigue.  I do not understand where the roughness come from in your audition.  But the Piccolino is anything but rough.


 

 The cable I borrowed was not burned in the standard way the other Crystal Piccolino cables were, and the owner agrees with my review.  From talking with someone in the know that shall remain nameless, when burned in a certain way the Crystal Piccolino cable does sound very different and I will have the opportunity to review one once I have the time.  Unfortunately my time is all booked for the near future with custom IEM reviews and amp reviews, plus I do have another cable and some balanced vs. unbalanced tests to do.  Not the greatest picture quality, but here are some cable pics:
   
  Audio Hub VF5 Cable:

   
  Chris_Himself cables: Extension (only jack end), and original cable (repaired) & balanced cable with heat shrink over it.
  
   
  Whiplash TWag balanced cable:


----------



## loghead

So, if I place sound quality improvements over the stock cable above all other considerations, which cable would you recommend for TF10 overall (without consideration to price)? And which would you consider the best value?
   
  Based on your reviews, I'm guessing the answers would be Lune and CH.


----------



## caracara08

best cable probably twag, best value id say ch


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





loghead said:


> So, if I place sound quality improvements over the stock cable above all other considerations, which cable would you recommend for TF10 overall (without consideration to price)? And which would you consider the best value?
> 
> Based on your reviews, I'm guessing the answers would be Lune and CH.


 
   
  Quote: 





caracara08 said:


> best cable probably twag, best value id say ch


 

 The cables are like flavors making it difficult to truly compare, but caracara08 answer is in agreement with mine for the TF10.  And I would take the Lune over the Arete personally for the TF10.


----------



## loghead

Is that due to a better overall value? Other considerations? Or do the Arete cables actually sound better than the Lune?
   
  If the price difference between the following 3 is not an issue, which would you recommend for the TF10s? The Lune, the Arete, or the CH cables?
   
  What I'm looking for in order of importance: 1. Sound quality improvements (especially the midrange); 2. lightweight (I use my IEMs for running and working on my jump shot); 3. Microphonics (don't want to be hearing my footsteps while I run); 4. Durability; 5. Ergonomics (this isn't hugely important, as long as they don't get in the way).


----------



## average_joe

I meant to say I would take the Lune of the Arete for the TF10 above.  
   
  Because of all but #1 I would recommend the Lune over the CH cable, and I do think the Lune is a good deal easier to use.  Now, if you were to run the cable under your shirt that will change things as a heat shrunk CH cable may be better, but it is still stiffer.  One thing to consider is if you do use the Lune under your shirt sweat will be absorbed into the overbraid while sweat may harden the CH cable outer heat shrink.  And of course either cable will need to be worn over-the-ear.


----------



## loghead

Edited (sent OP a PM)
   
  BTW- awesome thread man! Extremely helpful!


----------



## Chris_Himself

I really appreciate you reviewing my cables and putting my name on the map man. I'm just a kid and his buddy trying to build cool stuff, and if other people enjoy it, that just makes my day a little bit better.
   
  I hope you enjoy your cables Joe... that extension cable was kinda hard to put in tubing but I hope it's to your satisfaction.


----------



## 177261

Which ones of these are the most affortable for my SE535? I don't feel like shelving out too much money on cables but yet i want to have a cable that's quite an improvement from the stock cable.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





loghead said:


> Edited (sent OP a PM)
> 
> BTW- awesome thread man! Extremely helpful!


 

 Replied!  And thanks!
  
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> I really appreciate you reviewing my cables and putting my name on the map man. I'm just a kid and his buddy trying to build cool stuff, and if other people enjoy it, that just makes my day a little bit better.
> 
> I hope you enjoy your cables Joe... that extension cable was kinda hard to put in tubing but I hope it's to your satisfaction.


 
   
  No problem, that is what the reviews are all about, seeing how things perform. Sometimes you find a great value!
   
  And yes, the extension cable is great!  I haven't found the time for the balanced cable yet but like the form factor. 
   
  Quote: 





christianh said:


> Which ones of these are the most affortable for my SE535? I don't feel like shelving out too much money on cables but yet i want to have a cable that's quite an improvement from the stock cable.


 
   
  Check out the bottom of each review to check to see if a 535 connector is available and go from there. Since I don't have a 535 I can't test the sound and am not sure the changes will necessarily be the same for the 535.


----------



## cn11

I would like to suggest reviewing cables made by qusp as well. I have a pair on my FutureSonics MG6pro, and the sonic improvement is not subtle. Great stuff.
   
  Also, Kunlun speaks highly of the Fortis pure silver cables by Amp City. Maybe a good one to consider.


----------



## speedingredline

average_joe do you have any plans of reviewing the Stefan AudioArt cable for the JH16? I have seen it quoted as the best cable for the JH16s.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





cn11 said:


> I would like to suggest reviewing cables made by qusp as well. I have a pair on my FutureSonics MG6pro, and the sonic improvement is not subtle. Great stuff.
> 
> Also, Kunlun speaks highly of the Fortis pure silver cables by Amp City. Maybe a good one to consider.


 
   
  Quote: 





speedingredline said:


> average_joe do you have any plans of reviewing the Stefan AudioArt cable for the JH16? I have seen it quoted as the best cable for the JH16s.


 

 Thank you both for the suggestions, I have been in contact with qusp and will probably have reviews of his cables next year.  Once I clear my review backlog I will look more into the Fortis cable and Stefan AudioArt cables.


----------



## jonaliew

Hi Joe,
   
  Could you care to explain more how the CH cable with the heat shrink improves the characteristics?
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> The CH cable is better than the stock cable, ergonomically they are just different, with the stock cable being unwieldy while the CH cable is just a little stiff in comparison.  You can get the CH cable with heat shrink which changes the characteristics in a positive way IMO.  I will post some pictures comparing the two.


 
   
   
  Hahaha. I go running with my JH16. Care to explain how it will harden?
   
  Quote:


> Now, if you were to run the cable under your shirt that will change things as a heat shrunk CH cable may be better, but it is still stiffer.  One thing to consider is if you do use the Lune under your shirt sweat will be absorbed into the overbraid while sweat may harden the CH cable outer heat shrink.


 
   
   
  So with that factored in, I am deciding between a heat shrink CH cable, Null audio's lune and arteta. For the JH16, which would you recommend?
   
  Oh, like to say I agree with the fact JH16 is weak in terms of 3D space. I still want that bit more. :/


----------



## average_joe

The CH cable without the heat shrink is springy and the heat shrink reduces the springiness of the cable, adding to the ergonomics.  Stiffness is slightly higher but in use it is better for me because it will stay more where you put it.
   
  As far as a cable hardening, sweat and body fluids will, over time, alter the composition of many cables.  There have been many reported cases of companies such as Shure and Klipsch having issues with their cables hardening, and these cables may do so depending on the material.  Teflon, for example, should be immune, but PVC and other materials will not be.  I am not sure the material of the CH cable so I can't say for sure.  My SM3 cable is starting to harden...
   
  The nylon or cloth over braid that the Lune and Arete use will absorb whatever comes in contact with them.  Sweat, lotions on your hands, spilled beverages, etc. and all these things will, in my experience with this type of cable, add to the stiffness.  Getting sweat on any cable day ofter day can be detrimental.  The cable that has held up for me is the stock silver type of cable, which discolors, but there are no other issues I know of.
   
  As far as the sound, the CH cable performs sonically better with the JH16 than either Null Audio cable and will add more to the 3D space as well as improve the other sonics characteristics.


----------



## jonaliew

Thank you for replying 
   
  Does heat shrinking affect the tonal characteristics? And does CH do the heat shrinking at the ends where you connect to IEM or is it the whole cable?


----------



## average_joe

No problem.  The whole cable is hear shrunk and as far as tonal changes, there are none that I can hear.


----------



## miow

I'm sold to the Chris Himself's Cable for the JH16 Pro.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





miow said:


> I'm sold to the Chris Himself's Cable for the JH16 Pro.


 
   
  Check out the cables made by qusp, they could be right up your alley.


----------



## ucrime

I saw someone ask if the UE custom cable 48inch (newer version) will fit with the TF 10 but no one answered, so I thought I would bring up the question again.
   
  Will http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories fit with the TF 10 (the ones bought last month).
   
  Thanks in advance....


----------



## ucrime

I am so torn to buying these, just would like to know from experienced people if they fit


----------



## dannytang

average_joe has the pins sizes for both the TF10 and the UE customs listed on the first page. The TF10's pins are smaller in diameter than the UE customs, while you would be able to jam the UE customs cable into the TF10, you'll probably never be able to use the stock TF10 cable again.
  
  Quote: 





ucrime said:


> I saw someone ask if the UE custom cable 48inch (newer version) will fit with the TF 10 but no one answered, so I thought I would bring up the question again.
> 
> Will http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories fit with the TF 10 (the ones bought last month).
> 
> Thanks in advance....


----------



## ucrime

thanks.  When I read everything, it showed the TF10 as the smallest in pin size, then just below it showed UE reference cables, but I thought the ones I linked are the reference, so it really is confusing (unless I am not in on the joke).  It seems only Null Audio sells cables UNDER 150$ for the TF10, and I right?
   
  I do not want to damage the earbuds.


----------



## average_joe

If you check the options section at the bottom of each review it will list the compatibility options.  Many cables offer TF10 connectors.


----------



## unl3a5h3d

Fantastic reviews!


----------



## average_joe

Added the Uber Muzik V5f
  
  Quote: 





unl3a5h3d said:


> Fantastic reviews!


 

 Thank you!


----------



## kryten123

Firstly, thanks for the great review average_joe
   
  I may have missed it in all these posts, but I cant remember seeing a comparison of the microphonics of the cables vs the stock JH16 cable?
   
  I have a JH13 and JH16 on order and I am guessing that they both use the same cable. I am finding the JH13 cable to be very microphonic, especially when I have been spoilt with ACS's T1 kevlar cable.
  When I move around, I am very aware of the rubbing sound of the cable on my shirt collars or sides of my face (maybe my head is too big...lol).
   
  Can you recommend a replacement that is much less microphonic than the stock JH cable?


----------



## rianchaos

Joe, is the uerm cable compatible with the tf10?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kryten123 said:


> Firstly, thanks for the great review average_joe
> 
> I may have missed it in all these posts, but I cant remember seeing a comparison of the microphonics of the cables vs the stock JH16 cable?
> 
> ...


 

 That seems odd because I really haven't read about JH cables, or any stock cables to be microphonic, and mine aren't.  But, people all have different anatomical makeups, so that may be the cause.  Are the cables wrapping around your ears snugly?  Have you tried using the cable slider and a shirt clip?  
   
  I am not sure what to recommend because I don't have the microphonics issue and I have used the JH16 at the gym.  I might be able to help if we can figure out if anything helps.
   
  Quote: 





rianchaos said:


> Joe, is the uerm cable compatible with the tf10?


 

 Yes, but it is not a perfect fit.  The protruding sockets fit in the recessed pin area helping with the fit.  And TF10 cable can be made to fit a Westone/JHA custom by flattening the pins slightly with pliers.


----------



## rianchaos

Is it because of the pin or due to the socket of the connector?


----------



## average_joe

Primarily due to the socket, but you can make the pins fit better by flattening them ever so slightly with pliers.


----------



## kryten123

Hi average_joe,
   
  following your comment about not having any issues with your cable, I've done a bit more testing and its a little wierd.
   
  The cables are securely wrapped around the back of my ears.
  I can hear the rubbing against my cheeks and when the Y cables touch my shirt collars. Tightening the cable slider helps as it stops the cable moving around quite so much. The strange thing is that if I hold the cable between two fingers and run my fingers down the cable I get the microphonic rubbing for about 12 inches after the Y section andf then it abruptly stops and is dead quiet!
   
  I am now wondering if there is a problem with the cable as the microphonics dont just fade out but go instantly quiet after a certain point down the cable.
   
  I assume this doesnt happen with yours?
   
  I''ll let you know if this also happens with my JH16 when they arrive.
   
  Cheers


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kryten123 said:


> Hi average_joe,
> 
> following your comment about not having any issues with your cable, I've done a bit more testing and its a little wierd.
> 
> ...


 

 That seems odd, let us know what happens.


----------



## Watagump

I think I already read the UE custom cable can be used on the TF10, just wanted to make sure. So if anyone has it, let me know.


----------



## Watagump

I went ahead and ordered the Fiio cable.


----------



## KimChee

How long do you burn in your cable joe?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> How long do you burn in your cable joe?


 

 300 hours.  The TWag cable needed that as do some others, it seems, so I use the same number for all to be fair.


----------



## KimChee

Holy crap, I do 100, and I didn't know if that was overkill or not lol.
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> 300 hours.  The TWag cable needed that as do some others, it seems, so I use the same number for all to be fair.


----------



## average_joe

I don't understand exactly why, but it sounds like the case to my ears.  But you can put on the hours by using the cable!


----------



## KimChee

Thanks for this review, I bought my Null Audio Arete based on this review thread (previously have owned the Lune).  It's like a veil was lifted and the details, bass, and SS are much better.


----------



## MhzMonster

I ordered the Null Audio Lune (shipped, waiting for its arrival). Since you had the Lune cable, why did you switch to the Arete? Does the Arete sound better than the Lune? Now you've got me second guessing my decision.
  
  Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Thanks for this review, I bought my Null Audio Arete based on this review thread (previously have owned the Lune).  It's like a veil was lifted and the details, bass, and SS are much better.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Thanks for this review, I bought my Null Audio Arete based on this review thread (previously have owned the Lune).  It's like a veil was lifted and the details, bass, and SS are much better.


 

 Glad to be of help!
    
  Quote:


mhzmonster said:


> I ordered the Null Audio Lune (shipped, waiting for its arrival). Since you had the Lune cable, why did you switch to the Arete? Does the Arete sound better than the Lune? Now you've got me second guessing my decision.


 

 Did you read my reviews in the first post


----------



## Theolliellama

Great job, you helped me make a decision on which cable I'll buy.


----------



## MhzMonster

Yep, I sure did. I just wanted to hear from him, if thats the only reason he made the switch or if there were other factors involed. It's always nice to have more than one opinion. I'm sure I will like the Lune cable over the unbearable OEM cable that came with it... if it ever arrives!
   
  Thanks for all the time and effort you put into the reviews.
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Glad to be of help!
> 
> Did you read my reviews in the first post


----------



## Matter

Does anyone know if the TWag or the TWcu matches better with the Westone 4r? Can't really seem to find an answer anywhere.
   
  Thank you.


----------



## average_joe

It depends on what you want from the sound signature.  I haven't tested many copper cables, but silver tends to be brighter and open up the soundstage and add clarity/resolution.  Copper will retain the original sound signature with a possible improvement in the soundstage/clarity/resolution.


----------



## vaulter1

@average_joe  Thanks for the comprehensive cable review.  I decided to pull the trigger on the Null Audio Arete and am eagerly awaiting their arrival in the post.


----------



## v0nn

Average_joe, thank you for your reviews. They helped pull the trigger on a set of chris himsel cables for my tf10 remolds. Albeit used from caracara08, they have yet to see 300 hours . They shoukd make a good a set of cables for any future customs. I hope so at least!  Anyhoo thanks


----------



## KimChee

I was more than happy with the Lune cable, however after reading about the Arete (ie better sq overall, improvement in clarity, little more bass centered than mid centered), it sounded like qualities I'd like better than the Lune.  I'd take the Lune and I'm sure I'd be equally happy.
  
  Quote: 





mhzmonster said:


> Yep, I sure did. I just wanted to hear from him, if thats the only reason he made the switch or if there were other factors involed. It's always nice to have more than one opinion. I'm sure I will like the Lune cable over the unbearable OEM cable that came with it... if it ever arrives!
> 
> Thanks for all the time and effort you put into the reviews.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





vaulter1 said:


> @average_joe  Thanks for the comprehensive cable review.  I decided to pull the trigger on the Null Audio Arete and am eagerly awaiting their arrival in the post.


 
   
   Quote:


v0nn said:


> Average_joe, thank you for your reviews. They helped pull the trigger on a set of chris himsel cables for my tf10 remolds. Albeit used from caracara08, they have yet to see 300 hours . They shoukd make a good a set of cables for any future customs. I hope so at least!  Anyhoo thanks


 

 No problem, let us know how the Arete and CH cables perform for you.
   
  Quote: 





kimchee said:


> I was more than happy with the Lune cable, however after reading about the Arete (ie better sq overall, improvement in clarity, little more bass centered than mid centered), it sounded like qualities I'd like better than the Lune.  I'd take the Lune and I'm sure I'd be equally happy.


 

 The Lune cable is good and if that is what you bought, see what you think.


----------



## mikaveli06

any thoughts on whiplash's newer hybrid cables, and what they might bring to earsonics sm3v2??


----------



## Matter

Quick question, if you had a $500 budget, will you spend it on a new cable and LOD or purchase an amp/dac (amp-less and dac-less at the moment)?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





matter said:


> Quick question, if you had a $500 budget, will you spend it on a new cable and LOD or purchase an amp/dac?
> 
> Thanks.


 


  Unless your amp/dac we're already figured out to your liking and/or you really detest shopping for DAC and amp pairings, it'd be the second choice every time IMO


----------



## julianlaz

Has anyone tried Lune Cables on Unique Melody Recessed sockets? I've read in OP that your can flatten the connectors with pliers to make it fit snugly on bigger sockets.

 If not, are these Lune Cables compatible with "flat" sockets instead?


----------



## NewAKGGuy

Quote: 





matter said:


> Quick question, if you had a $500 budget, will you spend it on a new cable and LOD or purchase an amp/dac (amp-less and dac-less at the moment)?
> 
> Thanks.


 


  A bit of smart shopping could net you high quality examples of all three for $500.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





matter said:


> Quick question, if you had a $500 budget, will you spend it on a new cable and LOD or purchase an amp/dac (amp-less and dac-less at the moment)?
> 
> Thanks.


 

 It really depends on your current equipment.  What headphones/IEMs do you have and what is your current source?  Are there any particular things you are looking for/looking to avoid?
   
  Quote: 





julianlaz said:


> Has anyone tried Lune Cables on Unique Melody Recessed sockets? I've read in OP that your can flatten the connectors with pliers to make it fit snugly on bigger sockets.
> 
> If not, are these Lune Cables compatible with "flat" sockets instead?


 

 The Lune cables don't fit recessed sockets, which should include UM stuff.  You may be able to trim the shell plug to fit, but that could ruin the integrity of the plug.  What do you mean by flat sockets?


----------



## julianlaz

^ Thank you for the response

 Unique Melody,as I understand, offers two kinds of socket configurations. Recessed and Flat. I've asked Null-audio about the Lune cable with TF10 pins' compatibility with "flat" sockets. They confirmed that they do indeed fit.

 I'm hoping for a confirmation from someone who knows and is sure that this works.

 Also, what kind of sockets do the JH16's use?


----------



## average_joe

I think when I say flush, that is what you refer to as flat, and any TF10 cable will fit into larger sockets with a bit of flattening of the pins.  However, if the plug is made for the protruding socket of the TF10, the pins may not fit all that deep and therefore not be as secure as a cable made specifically for a flush socket.  However, I am sure Null can make it the way you need it.


----------



## Majin

does the jaben cable fit snug on the TF10? and did you check out these cables?
   
http://www.ebay.com/itm/upgrade-cable-STRAIGHT-LINE-AIR-Ultimate-Ears-/120848191805?_trksid=p5197.m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D5%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D5959102726855514577#ht_2362wt_1396
   
  /
   
http://www.ebay.com/itm/upgrade-cable-KAKITSUBATA-for-Ultimate-Ears/120848178281?ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1&ih=002&category=112529&cmd=ViewItem#ht_1985wt_1396


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





majin said:


> does the jaben cable fit snug on the TF10? and did you check out these cables?
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/upgrade-cable-STRAIGHT-LINE-AIR-Ultimate-Ears-/120848191805?_trksid=p5197.m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D5%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D5959102726855514577#ht_2362wt_1396
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, it fits snug.
   
  First time I have seen those cables.  The second one talks about heat resistance, but I am sure I don't want to put my TF10s or any CIEMs in an over at 300 F to test the cable jacket.  I wonder what the actual wire was made for.


----------



## KimChee

I just wanted to mention for my reshelled TF10, I had to cut the memory wire on my Arete cable, bc the curve was really not working with my ear, it was pulling of the pins, and the memory wire isn't bendable..


----------



## kryten123

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> That seems odd, let us know what happens.


 


  Hi all,
   
  Well I got my JH16 and the cable is the Silver one (my JH13 are black and weirdly shorter in the Y section) and unfortunately it is just as noisy as the JH13 cable. When I am sat still its all fine, but once I am on the train, its a real pain. All the swaying and rocking in my seat on the train obviously moves the cable around a lot and unless my music is quite loud, I am very aware of the rubbing and knocking against my cheeks and shirt collars.
   
  As my JH16 (and JH13 to be used as the template) are on their way back to JH Audio for a fit issue, I have been using my T1s again and its now really obvious how spoilt I have been. The T1s are completely quiet without any noise from banging and rubbing on my train journeys.
   
  I have to say that I am very disappointed with the JH cables in comparison and expected better considering the price of them. The rubbing effectively makes them useless for my commute as I am very aware of it, which spoils my musical enjoyment.
   
  Does anyone have any recommendations for a replacement cable?
   
  Thanks


----------



## Krisman

Maybe it is worth adding a rating for Microphonics to all the cables reviewed?
   
  This ia major factor for a lot of people including myself.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> I just wanted to mention for my reshelled TF10, I had to cut the memory wire on my Arete cable, bc the curve was really not working with my ear, it was pulling of the pins, and the memory wire isn't bendable..


 

 I think you could have heated it with a hair dryer and reshaped it!
   
  Quote: 





kryten123 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Well I got my JH16 and the cable is the Silver one (my JH13 are black and weirdly shorter in the Y section) and unfortunately it is just as noisy as the JH13 cable. When I am sat still its all fine, but once I am on the train, its a real pain. All the swaying and rocking in my seat on the train obviously moves the cable around a lot and unless my music is quite loud, I am very aware of the rubbing and knocking against my cheeks and shirt collars.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I am not sure what is going on since I haven't experienced the same thing with my JH16 or any of my other CIEMs that use the same cable.  The TWag and Simbiote cables are non-microphonic.

  Quote: 





krisman said:


> Maybe it is worth adding a rating for Microphonics to all the cables reviewed?
> 
> This ia major factor for a lot of people including myself.


 

 Some day...


----------



## Krisman

Forgot to thank you Average_Joe on a great set of reviews! 
   
  Does the Chris_Himself cable have much microphonics? I bought a nice little cable on ebay:
   
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/320829191886?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
   
  Very cheap and very well made I have to say. Is nice and soft but carrys microphonics so badly that I have to be very still otherwise I can hear the cable scraping my clothes etc.
   
  Anyone got any suggestions for cheapish (<$100) cable that would give a good lift to Triple Fi 10s as well as have little memory effect and low/no microphonics?
   
  Cheers


----------



## Staal

From what I've heard the Chris_Himself cable is great value for the price, but as it's a stiff cable, you'll probably be experiencing some of that "scratching against jacket" sound.


----------



## kryten123

average_joe
   
  I'm sure I cant be the only person that finds the stock JH cables noisy? Did you not have ANY rubbing\knocking from the stock JH cables?
   
  I'll investigate the TWag and Simbiote cables further. By the way, do you think they are less microphonic than the standard JH cables?

 Thanks


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





krisman said:


> Forgot to thank you Average_Joe on a great set of reviews!
> 
> Does the Chris_Himself cable have much microphonics? I bought a nice little cable on ebay:
> 
> ...


 

 From my review in the first post "With much less flexibility than all the other cables I have tried to date the cable can be unwieldy at times and has more microphonics than other cables during movement."
   
  Interesting cable, but is that truly a Furutech cable, or just someone using the name?  
   
  The Null Audio Arete is a great cable for the TF10 IMO at a great price.
  
  Quote: 





staal said:


> From what I've heard the Chris_Himself cable is great value for the price, but as it's a stiff cable, you'll probably be experiencing some of that "scratching against jacket" sound.


 

 You want the heat shrink which reduces microphonics, and while it is still stiff, it is easier to use.

      Quote:


kryten123 said:


> average_joe
> 
> I'm sure I cant be the only person that finds the stock JH cables noisy? Did you not have ANY rubbing\knocking from the stock JH cables?
> 
> ...


 

 Honestly, the only person I have heard of.  If there are others, I hope they speak up, but I have read about people from time to time having severe microphonics issues with various IEMs that others didn't have issues with, and I think it has as much to do with the person's individual anatomy as anything else.
   
  For your case it is purely a guess, but they are microphonic free for me, but so are the stock cables.
   
  Have you tried wearing the cable down your back or used a shirt clip?


----------



## westusa

Hi I just jump on the IEM bandwagon. I have been using cx300 for years and been using Sennheisers also like HD 212 pro and HD202.
  I bought my Ultimate ears at the Blackfirday Amazon. was wondering if you could add a review for the Fiio and Oyaide ones for Ultimate ears?
  Because I was thinking which is good for my UE Triplefi 10 Chris cables or the Oyaide ones. Thanks have a nice day


----------



## v0nn

I have been using Chris' silveray iem cable and Id like to share my thoughts. I have paired them with tf10s and compared them to the stock cables.

 I am not an audiophile linguist, as such I will just speak my ear. 

 The most prominent affect were on vocals. Previously I felt vocals were behind the instruments. Its as if the singer moved from behind the band to in front of the band, if you will.

  I felt the higher frequency notes on violins improved. I felt they became sharper and crisper.  I now hear the bow move across the strings more clearly. Being a violinist I felt reproduction was artificial. Accuracy just seemed lacking, something didn't sound right. It is definitely the drivers and not the cable. After consulting a friend during half time, I realized that one will rarely hear the same sound while playing and listening. Having said that I don't think tf10 is good match for classical music but I digress.

 Live recordings also improved slightly. It was the accuracy of the drums and increased acoustic resonance that I felt was worthy of mentioning.
   
  Lastly there are definitely micro-phonics.

 I am not very good at describing these kind of things and hope I didn't confuse anyone.
   
  Congrats Giant fans good game


----------



## Chris_Himself

Thanks for the review Vonn.. It's so crazy reading these reviews and especially Joe's review considering I build these things out of higher quality materials just because if I can make something really well I just will, and it was just a structural and ornamental upgrade to stock cables. I'm very flattered and I hope you enjoy them for a long time.
   
  Happy listening my friend.
   
  Also the Patriots had it up til the incomplete pass and eventual turnover


----------



## Staal

Reading about the Chris_himself cables, I'm really excited to receive mine.
  
  Quote: 





westusa said:


> Hi I just jump on the IEM bandwagon. I have been using cx300 for years and been using Sennheisers also like HD 212 pro and HD202.
> I bought my Ultimate ears at the Blackfirday Amazon. was wondering if you could add a review for the Fiio and Oyaide ones for Ultimate ears?
> Because I was thinking which is good for my UE Triplefi 10 Chris cables or the Oyaide ones. Thanks have a nice day


 


  Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't oyaide just a make for plugs?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





westusa said:


> Hi I just jump on the IEM bandwagon. I have been using cx300 for years and been using Sennheisers also like HD 212 pro and HD202.
> I bought my Ultimate ears at the Blackfirday Amazon. was wondering if you could add a review for the Fiio and Oyaide ones for Ultimate ears?
> Because I was thinking which is good for my UE Triplefi 10 Chris cables or the Oyaide ones. Thanks have a nice day


 

 I am not planning on adding any cables until I reduce my backlog of CIEMs and finish my amp reviews, but I will be adding cables.  I also have to do a balanced vs. SE output from the 801 review...
   
  Can you please provide a link to the Oyaide cable?
   
  Quote: 





v0nn said:


> I have been using Chris' silveray iem cable and Id like to share my thoughts. I have paired them with tf10s and compared them to the stock cables.
> 
> I am not an audiophile linguist, as such I will just speak my ear.
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for sharing.
   
  Quote: 





staal said:


> Reading about the Chris_himself cables, I'm really excited to receive mine.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't oyaide just a make for plugs?


 

 Let us know what you think when you get them.  And yes, Oyaide is a plug manufacturer.


----------



## westusa

Here is a link from Ebay I saw a discussion about this in headfi but I cant seem to find it. Still new in the forums sorry.
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Oyaide-HPC-UE-1-3-Ultimate-Ears-Triple-Fi10-Replacing-Cable-1-3m-/300660093174?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4600bcf0f6
   
  on the Fiio I found this one in the forums
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/581648/fiio-rc-ue1-support-more-models-of-earphone


----------



## average_joe

Both of those look interesting, thanks for bringing them to my attention.  Sorry I can't help at the moment, but once I clear up my review backlog (4 CIEMs to review, 1 amp, and balanced vs. single ended comparison from the 801) I will look into those.


----------



## ChrisSC

Thanks for all the great cable reviews!  This site really is a worldwide asset to audiophiles everywhere of all different levels. Average Joe really has a special place in this community.
   
  So a couple questions...
   
  It seems that the majority of the cables reviewed here are silver, specifically high purity 6n stranded silver.  Considering that they have the same basic composition, when comparing one such silver cable to another (ex: twag v2 and the arete), is the difference in sound that apparent?
   
  What do you think accounts for the differences? The method that they are made? (OCC, cryogenic, etc.), the way they are braided?, the end plug used?
   
  Thanks for all the help Joe, can't wait to read about the next CIEMs you pick up!


----------



## average_joe

Your welcome and I am glad this thread is useful.  
   
  Is the difference that apparent?  It will depend on each person.  This software makes my point, the higher a level you can get to with this, the more apparent the differences will most likely be.  I know that over the past several years I have developed my ability to hear differences, so for me there can be a significant difference between cables.  A test is, if you can't A/B is to listen with an aftermarket cable for a few days and get used to it (after burn in, which I do believe in) and then switch to the stock cable and see if, over a short period of time, you notice any degredation in sound.  It is often easier to hear a step down than a step up.
   
  I can't say why one silver cable sounds better than the other that it most likely has to do with the capacitive and inductive properties of which part is the insulation, thickness (gauge), stranding, and braiding all play a role.
   
  I would like to review more cables including some additional copper ones, but I do have a large backlog at the moment.


----------



## dosley01

That's awesome!  Thanks for sharing that.  I guess I won't be getting much work done today, going to try it out with my new ESW9.


----------



## average_joe

Quote:


dosley01 said:


> That's awesome!  Thanks for sharing that.  I guess I won't be getting much work done today, going to try it out with my new ESW9.


 

 Are you on level 8 yet


----------



## dosley01

Wow, that was eye (or ear) opening.  So far I've only done the first Band ID session and I did get to 8 but could not believe how quickly by success rate plummeted from 5 to 8, at 101 trails I saved and exited and now back to 7.  I can say one thing, I will NOT review another headphone until I complete the training sessions.  This really should be required training for any headphone reviewer.  This is an EXCELLENT tool, especially to find ones strengths and weaknesses in the way an individual hears and will certainly help in describing the traits of a particular headphone. 
  
  Thanks Again!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





dosley01 said:


> Wow, that was eye (or ear) opening.  So far I've only done the first Band ID session and I did get to 8 but could not believe how quickly by success rate plummeted from 5 to 8, at 101 trails I saved and exited and now back to 7.  I can say one thing, I will NOT review another headphone until I complete the training sessions.  This really should be required training for any headphone reviewer.  This is an EXCELLENT tool, especially to find ones strengths and weaknesses in the way an individual hears and will certainly help in describing the traits of a particular headphone.
> 
> Thanks Again!


 

 Yes, this is a great tool.  Most reviewers out there (not necessarily the ones on head-fi, but mainstream) would probably not do so well with this test, that is if they would even take the time to try this.


----------



## Byakushiki

Well, sadly, my stock TF10 cables are only 4 days old and already coming apart at the Y splitter. A bit of gaffer taping the chin slider to the splitter is going to have to do for now but I'm looking to replace it, maybe with the ES8 cable. Question is, would it help if I coated it with plasti-dip to stop it from unbraiding itself and help durability?


----------



## average_joe

Wow, that didn't take long!  I am not familiar with plasti-dip, so I am not sure how that will affect things and if it will give the desired effect without causing other issues.


----------



## KimChee

Yeah, I saw that in your review, but I didn't like it anyways lol.
  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I think you could have heated it with a hair dryer and reshaped it!
> 
> 
> I am not sure what is going on since I haven't experienced the same thing with my JH16 or any of my other CIEMs that use the same cable.  The TWag and Simbiote cables are non-microphonic.
> ...


----------



## KimChee

Wouldn't that make the cable stiffer?
  
  Quote: 





byakushiki said:


> Well, sadly, my stock TF10 cables are only 4 days old and already coming apart at the Y splitter. A bit of gaffer taping the chin slider to the splitter is going to have to do for now but I'm looking to replace it, maybe with the ES8 cable. Question is, would it help if I coated it with plasti-dip to stop it from unbraiding itself and help durability?


----------



## Sayajin

Would some of you think the Silver Dragon isn't suitable for TF10?


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





sayajin said:


> Would some of you think the Silver Dragon isn't suitable for TF10?


 


  I've owned them, they're absolutely appropriate to use and they're good value for money for what you get!


----------



## average_joe

I think the SD cable is a great upgrade for the TF10.


----------



## AFRO insomniac

Would the custom UE Reference cables work with stock TF10s or are they specifically designed for custom molds?
   
http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_ultimateears
   
  I'm really looking for a basic cable upgrade to the stock cable that is durable and less rigid. Doesn't really have to be fancy, trying to find something around $30.


----------



## average_joe

The UERM cable fits (I could have pushed it on completely), but the bend is not in the correct spot and will not go over the ear.
   
  Fiio makes a cable, but I have no idea how it is as it could be as bad as the stock cable as it looks like it could possibly be not all that flexible from the pictures.  
   
This cable looks soft and flexible.


----------



## westusa

I am still over the fence about that too. Chris cable review are stiff coz of the silver core. I was thinking of silver but not too hard like the oyaide I showed you.
  The IEM logitech cables can fit right even though there is a little gap? If I push it in like the one in your picture will it make the holes bigger? Also will the ones on the far lower right fit? The one in the UERM http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_ultimateears
   
  Thanks for all the info


----------



## Staal

Hey average_joe,
   
  Do you know if the pre-2010 ones from UE at http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_ultimateears would work with JH etc?


----------



## Byakushiki

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Wouldn't that make the cable stiffer?


 


  Probably, but anything to help the overall durability would help. My earphones and cables go through...A lot. While the microphonics would be worse, it probably wouldn't matter as long as I ran the cable behind the neck.
   
  Either way, I just phoned in today and got them to send a replacement cable for free. Customer support isn't half bad. I'll probably grab a better cable this summer or reshell at this rate though.


----------



## Sayajin

chris_himself said:


> I've owned them, they're absolutely appropriate to use and they're good value for money for what you get!






average_joe said:


> I think the SD cable is a great upgrade for the TF10.




Have to say, I also thought same to begin with. I used this combo already and quite happy with it. 
Today I'm bit confused. What happened to me twice now, exact 1 month from receiving, I've got bad signal from one channel, found that to be a problem at the bottom end of the cable. What the hell, the Silver Dragon supposed to be tank. 
Already shipped back one time, last week same just happened again to me. 
The company now saying TF10 does not fit the SD and is the problem, I can't believe this.

Just to say I tried several phones with it and players, it's not my TF10s.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





westusa said:


> I am still over the fence about that too. Chris cable review are stiff coz of the silver core. I was thinking of silver but not too hard like the oyaide I showed you.
> The IEM logitech cables can fit right even though there is a little gap? If I push it in like the one in your picture will it make the holes bigger? Also will the ones on the far lower right fit? The one in the UERM http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_ultimateears
> 
> Thanks for all the info


 

 Yes, if I push it in more it will stretch the sockets.

  
  Quote: 





staal said:


> Hey average_joe,
> 
> Do you know if the pre-2010 ones from UE at http://www.logitech.com/en-us/ue/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_ultimateears would work with JH etc?


 

 I don't have experience with those, but the current UE pins fit Westone/JHA pins.  I would say yes, but I can't verify, so hopefully someone with experience with the specific connectors will chime in. 
   
   
  Quote: 





sayajin said:


> Have to say, I also thought same to begin with. I used this combo already and quite happy with it.
> Today I'm bit confused. What happened to me twice now, exact 1 month from receiving, I've got bad signal from one channel, found that to be a problem at the bottom end of the cable. What the hell, the Silver Dragon supposed to be tank.
> Already shipped back one time, last week same just happened again to me.
> 
> ...


 

 Sorry to hear about your issues.  What do you mean by the bottom end of the cable, the 3.5mm plug or the shell connector?  And the site doe specify only JHA, Ultimate Ears, and Westone compatibility (or Livewires), but a TF10 really shouldn't be much different except for the angle.


----------



## Sayajin

average_joe said:


> Sorry to hear about your issues.  What do you mean by the bottom end of the cable, the 3.5mm plug or the shell connector?  And the site doe specify only JHA, Ultimate Ears, and Westone compatibility (or Livewires), but a TF10 really shouldn't be much different except for the angle.




I meant the end next to the 3.5mm plug.


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I don't have experience with those, but the current UE pins fit Westone/JHA pins.  I would say yes, but I can't verify, so hopefully someone with experience with the specific connectors will chime in.


 

 You mean the ones with the "shield" around the pins? I kinda assumed that surely wouldn't fit.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





sayajin said:


> I meant the end next to the 3.5mm plug.


 

 If you can verify it is that end, it really shouldn't matter what is connected to the shell connectors.  I would recommend re-explaining the situation.  However, if you do have 2 failures at the same place, you should look at how you are using the cable.  I know that some people can be extremely rough on cables, such as continuously bending them since they are in a tight pocket while walking, or pulled out by the cable, or bent at severe angles, etc.  I am not saying you are doing that, but check your usage patterns.
   
  Quote: 





staal said:


> You mean the ones with the "shield" around the pins? I kinda assumed that surely wouldn't fit.


 

 I don't have experience with the ones without the shield.  The one with the shield has pins that fit, but you would need to cut the shield off to use it with something other than the UE products.


----------



## Matter

Anyone tried the hybrid TWag and TWcu from Whiplash? Curious as to how it sounds and if it is worth getting.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





matter said:


> Anyone tried the hybrid TWag and TWcu from Whiplash? Curious as to how it sounds and if it is worth getting.
> 
> Thanks.


 


  I'm fairly certain I will be reviewing it soon.


----------



## Matter

Quote: 





staal said:


> I'm fairly certain I will be reviewing it soon.


 


   
  Nice! Looking forward to it.
  Also, is it significantly thicker than the TWag v2? Looks alot thicker from the pictures I've seen and not sure if its going to be a nuisance and result in microphonics when walking etc.
  And as for the bands at the area close to the pins, does it have any memory effect? Any reason why it is there?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Staal

From the looks of it, the bands seem to have a memory wire effect. 
   
  I wouldn't know about thickness as I haven't seen it yet, but I assume you're right. Probably not the kind of cable that's ideal for on-the-go use.


----------



## Sayajin

average_joe said:


> If you can verify it is that end, it really shouldn't matter what is connected to the shell connectors.  I would recommend re-explaining the situation.  However, if you do have 2 failures at the same place, you should look at how you are using the cable.  I know that some people can be extremely rough on cables, such as continuously bending them since they are in a tight pocket while walking, or pulled out by the cable, or bent at severe angles, etc.  I am not saying you are doing that, but check your usage patterns.




Thanks for the explanation, never store or place my cables in a pocket though, when comes to expensive stuff most stays home on my table. I certainly avoid winding cables up and things like that during, neither like to store them in a small box for same reason. Well if that's not enough keeping it away from breaking, then I don't know. 
Keep up the great cable reviews, really like this thread!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





matter said:


> Anyone tried the hybrid TWag and TWcu from Whiplash? Curious as to how it sounds and if it is worth getting.
> 
> Thanks.


 

 I wish I had more...time...
   
  Quote: 





staal said:


> I'm fairly certain I will be reviewing it soon.


 

 Very cool!
   
  Quote: 





sayajin said:


> Thanks for the explanation, never store or place my cables in a pocket though, when comes to expensive stuff most stays home on my table. I certainly avoid winding cables up and things like that during, neither like to store them in a small box for same reason. Well if that's not enough keeping it away from breaking, then I don't know.
> Keep up the great cable reviews, really like this thread!


 

 Thanks!  It sounds like you are easy on your gear, I hope you get your issues resolved.


----------



## ichiveritas

@average_joe
  I'm looking at the arete on null audio's site.  Is the cable they are selling the same as the one you reviewed?  You listed the arete and the lune as both having silver wire.  When I look on the site it lists the lune as having silver wire but arete as having multi stranded ofc. Pardon my ignorance but I dont know what multi strand ofc is.  The one you reviewed had the nylon sleeve on it and you suggested that was the way to go.  I did not see that as an option on null's site.  If it is I wonder what the cost is to add it.  I know you made the review before the arete was out and now Im curious with the current prices and what the cables are made of currently etc if you still feel the same way. Also thanks for all the time and effort put into this thread.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





ichiveritas said:


> @average_joe
> I'm looking at the arete on null audio's site.  Is the cable they are selling the same as the one you reviewed?  You listed the arete and the lune as both having silver wire.  When I look on the site it lists the lune as having silver wire but arete as having multi stranded ofc. Pardon my ignorance but I dont know what multi strand ofc is.  The one you reviewed had the nylon sleeve on it and you suggested that was the way to go.  I did not see that as an option on null's site.  If it is I wonder what the cost is to add it.  I know you made the review before the arete was out and now Im curious with the current prices and what the cables are made of currently etc if you still feel the same way. Also thanks for all the time and effort put into this thread.


 

 I will send them an email to ask if they made any changes to the cable they sent to me as they sent it before it was officially released.  I ran the review by them asking if everything was correct, and they responded that it was, which is why I listed the wire as silver.  I guess it is OFC, which is oxygen free copper.  I am sure you can ask for the braid, but I am not sure about the possible cost.  Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## ichiveritas

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I will send them an email to ask if they made any changes to the cable they sent to me as they sent it before it was officially released.  I ran the review by them asking if everything was correct, and they responded that it was, which is why I listed the wire as silver.  I guess it is OFC, which is oxygen free copper.  I am sure you can ask for the braid, but I am not sure about the possible cost.  Sorry for the confusion.


 

 No need to apologize.  Thanks again for all your effort.  And now I know what OFC is.


----------



## lxl88

Would like to c reviews on the whiplash hybrid iem cables. Have been wanting to buy but seems there's too little user review on this little gem.


----------



## ichiveritas

I messaged Null and asked if they could put the Nylon sleeve on the Arete and what it would cost.  I got a message back today
   
   
 [size=10.5pt]"We can do that for additional S$15.[/size]
 [size=10.5pt] [/size]
 [size=10.5pt]However, it can only be done in B/W combination as you found on the Lune series due to some sleeve diameter restrictions.[/size]
 [size=10.5pt] [/size]
 [size=10.5pt]Please do let me know, thank you!"[/size]


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





lxl88 said:


> Would like to c reviews on the whiplash hybrid iem cables. Have been wanting to buy but seems there's too little user review on this little gem.


 

 In due time...
   
  Quote: 





ichiveritas said:


> I messaged Null and asked if they could put the Nylon sleeve on the Arete and what it would cost.  I got a message back today
> 
> 
> [size=10.5pt]"We can do that for additional S$15.[/size]
> ...


 

 I received the same answer about the sleeve.  And there was just a mis-communication about the material, they confirmed I reviewed the same cable they are selling now.  The material really doesn't matter as the end result is the important thing.


----------



## ichiveritas

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> In due time...
> 
> 
> I received the same answer about the sleeve.  And there was just a mis-communication about the material, they confirmed I reviewed the same cable they are selling now.  The material really doesn't matter as the end result is the important thing.


 


  Fantastic thanks for finding out.  Time to put an order in.
   
  Placed my order for the Arete with the nylon sleeve on it.  One last thanks for all your work on reviewing.  It was crucial for my decision making process!


----------



## Masmo

Quote: 





ichiveritas said:


> Fantastic thanks for finding out.  Time to put an order in.
> 
> Placed my order for the Arete with the nylon sleeve on it.  One last thanks for all your work on reviewing.  It was crucial for my decision making process!


 

 I'd just like to point out that it is possible to have the black Arete cable with a sleeve on it, I have one. I got mine from treoo.com which had the option to put it on for both the black and b/w for the same cost of SGD$15.
   
  I've had my Arete for a week or so and I love them, infinitely better than the stock cables.


----------



## JamesMcProgger

anyone knows if the Unique Melody UM 50" IEM fits the TF10? thanks


----------



## Staal

It should fit as well as any other CIEM cable.


----------



## Narii

Hello everybody, I read all the reviews and they were awesome, so I decided to buy a new cable for my little JH16 baby and due to my doubts on how a cable could improve the sound of my IEM I decided I wouldn't spend $ 300 on a cable. So I read the Chris_himself review and decided to give it a shot. 

As a side note : I have been training for the past month with the help of the Harman How To Listen App to be able to see the differences between stock and CH cable.

I got it yesterday and let me tell you that the sound really made me feel as if I bought a new Pair of IEMs. THe JH16 just sounded better. Better instrument placement, better highs, and really REALLY better bass. 

The JH16 just feel perfect with the Chris_himself cable.

THanks again everybody for the reviews and thank you to Chris for making affordable cables that are better than what you paid for.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





jamesmcprogger said:


> anyone knows if the Unique Melody UM 50" IEM fits the TF10? thanks


 

 I believe Rooth uses the same cables as UM, and the pins are slightly larger than Westone/JHA cables, which have larger pins than the TF10, so no, I don't think they will fit.
   
  Quote: 





narii said:


> Hello everybody, I read all the reviews and they were awesome, so I decided to buy a new cable for my little JH16 baby and due to my doubts on how a cable could improve the sound of my IEM I decided I wouldn't spend $ 300 on a cable. So I read the Chris_himself review and decided to give it a shot.
> As a side note : I have been training for the past month with the help of the Harman How To Listen App to be able to see the differences between stock and CH cable.
> I got it yesterday and let me tell you that the sound really made me feel as if I bought a new Pair of IEMs. THe JH16 just sounded better. Better instrument placement, better highs, and really REALLY better bass.
> The JH16 just feel perfect with the Chris_himself cable.
> THanks again everybody for the reviews and thank you to Chris for making affordable cables that are better than what you paid for.


 

 Thanks for sharing.


----------



## ch1n4

Quote: 





staal said:


> I'm fairly certain I will be reviewing it soon.


 


  Anything new about the twag hybrid cable Staal?
 I am also looking forward to your review. I haven't found reviews of it yet.


----------



## Staal

No, I haven't heard back from Craig from Whiplash in several weeks. Very odd indeed.


----------



## evolutionx

Quote: 





narii said:


> Hello everybody, I read all the reviews and they were awesome, so I decided to buy a new cable for my little JH16 baby and due to my doubts on how a cable could improve the sound of my IEM I decided I wouldn't spend $ 300 on a cable. So I read the Chris_himself review and decided to give it a shot.
> As a side note : I have been training for the past month with the help of the Harman How To Listen App to be able to see the differences between stock and CH cable.
> I got it yesterday and let me tell you that the sound really made me feel as if I bought a new Pair of IEMs. THe JH16 just sounded better. Better instrument placement, better highs, and really REALLY better bass.
> The JH16 just feel perfect with the Chris_himself cable.
> THanks again everybody for the reviews and thank you to Chris for making affordable cables that are better than what you paid for.


 

 +1.  Just got my Chris_himself cable for my JH-16pro and really exceeded my expectation.    Half the costs of my previous cable but sounded like a match make in heaven.    Thanks to this thread and the reviews.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





staal said:


> No, I haven't heard back from Craig from Whiplash in several weeks. Very odd indeed.


 

 Any word from Craig?


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Any word from Craig?


 

 Nope, sadly nothing as of yet. I really cannot be bothered to write more e-mails. From what I gathered from the (now an "archive") Whiplash sponsor forum he was hospitalized for some time. While I certainly appreciate that something like that would be totally out of his hands and that he probably has had a lot of catching up to do, I really would have appreciated if anyone from Whiplash would get back to me. I mean, c'mon, it's been a month. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  However, I did receive a "Thor" cable from Stephen over at Custom-IEM.com yesterday and i'll be posting about that later. So far all I've had time to do was snap some photos and have a quick listen


----------



## average_joe

Oh, man, that isn't good news.  Craig is more of a one man shop and a great guy.  I wish him a fast recovery.


----------



## Staal

Yes, indeed. I do hope he gets better soon. While many have been complaining about products not being delivered and such I'm sure it was out of his hands and that he'll do his best to catch up as soon as he can find the time and energy. Head-Fi'ers can be very demanding.
   
  I was actually under the impression that he had some customer service help around. If that isn't the case, I do feel bad that I've been so whiny about the lack of response from Whiplash.


----------



## TimHKG

These are my recently DIY IEM cables, not a difficult task providing you've got all the materials needed. Less expensive and more choices than that of the aftermarket, but could be really time-consuming...huh!


----------



## xxhaxx

Quote: 





timhkg said:


> These are my DIY IEM cables, not a difficult task providing you've got all the materials. Less expensive and more choices than that of the aftermarket, but could be really time-consuming...huh!


 

  Updated with working link :]


----------



## Staal

Looking great.


----------



## TimHKG

Another not-yet-completed 8-wire braiding OCC Copper IEM Cable.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





timhkg said:


> These are my recently DIY IEM cables, not a difficult task providing you've got all the materials needed. Less expensive and more choices than that of the aftermarket, but could be really time-consuming...huh!
> 
> ​


 

 Looking really good! This one is quite the beauty!


----------



## Chris_Himself

Tim, those cables look amazing, are you using Toxic or Double Helix for your builds?


----------



## hifiguyhk

pretty, but the material seem not cheaper, expecially OCC material.


----------



## TimHKG

8-wire-braided OCC copper IEM cable.


----------



## TimHKG

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Tim, those cables look amazing, are you using Toxic or Double Helix for your builds?


 
  These cables were obtained almost directly from manufacturers, they were brandless. I guess they could be nothing or perhaps may once be any famous brands for sale on the market when they're being made and shipped in accordance with any contracts signed.
   


  Quote: 





hifiguyhk said:


> pretty, but the material seem not cheaper, expecially OCC material.


 
  Yes, to me, prices of the OCC Silver ones could be to some extent, relatively high!


----------



## kyoshiro

TimHKG you in Hong Kong? 
  where ya getting them cables?


----------



## Cryok95

Quote: 





timhkg said:


> These cables were obtained almost directly from manufacturers, they were brandless. I guess they could be nothing or perhaps may once be any famous brands for sale on the market when they're being made and shipped in accordance with any contracts signed.
> 
> Yes, to me, prices of the OCC Silver ones could be to some extent, relatively high!


 


  Share your source


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





ch1n4 said:


> Anything new about the twag hybrid cable Staal?
> I am also looking forward to your review. I haven't found reviews of it yet.


 


  Finally got in touch with Craig from Whiplash who has been hospitalized and he appears to be back in business. He will be sending a cable over my way after all.


----------



## christcos

Finally got my Null Audio Lune!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





staal said:


> Finally got in touch with Craig from Whiplash who has been hospitalized and he appears to be back in business. He will be sending a cable over my way after all.


 

 Good to hear Craig is back out and in business.  
   
  Quote: 





christcos said:


> Finally got my Null Audio Lune!


 

 Nice, what do you think?


----------



## Matter

Hi,
   
  So I'm about to get a TWag v1 cable with memory wire from someone but will like to check, is it better for me to get the v2 instead and is there a huge difference between the 2?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## kenman345

I am not 100% sure, but I thought I saw when compiling my list of aftermarket IEM cables that Whiplash is doing a trade in service or upgrade service for free or relatively low cost. Check into it. If they are offering a service like this, it would be reasonable to think they believe the v2 is better than the v1
  
  EDIT: cant seem to find it, maybe it never existed, sorry about the misinformation
  Quote: 





matter said:


> Hi,
> 
> So I'm about to get a TWag v1 cable with memory wire from someone but will like to check, is it better for me to get the v2 instead and is there a huge difference between the 2?
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## Akin

İs the picolino really worth it? I think someone would be happier buying something else like another iem, or a used lcd2


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





akin said:


> İs the picolino really worth it? I think someone would be happier buying something else like another iem, or a used lcd2


 

  
  From what people tell me, it is. I wouldn't buy it, but all the dudes who have money AND common sense who bought it seem to not mind keeping theirs.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





akin said:


> İs the picolino really worth it? I think someone would be happier buying something else like another iem, or a used lcd2


 

 That is a question that combines both economic status and interest level in the hobby.  If it takes your CIEM to the next level, making it more realistic than the LCD2 (especially if you don't have the amp for the LCD2), then it could be worth it.  Synergy is tough to predict, so finding a match is important, however there really isn't a large database ATM.


----------



## ichiveritas

Quote: 





christcos said:


> Finally got my Null Audio Lune!


 


  How long did it take?  I'm going on 2 months for my arete.  It's been an interesting process.


----------



## KimChee

Weird I got mine within a week or so..


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





ichiveritas said:


> How long did it take?  I'm going on 2 months for my arete.  It's been an interesting process.


 

 That sure seems like a long time...care to share the story?


----------



## ichiveritas

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> That sure seems like a long time...care to share the story?


 

 Sure thing.  I would have to say the first thing that struck me as odd was when I was told that the sleeving could only be done on the black and white cable as opposed to the black cable.  I all ready had noted on the site that they were sold out of the black cable.  But I was told due to dimensions it would have to be the black white cable.  I posted that earlier in this thread and another member stated they had gotten the black cable with sleeve previously.  That was not a big deal though just slightly suspect.  Placed my order on February 28th.  Was told to allow three to five days for custom build.  On March 28th I sent out an email to inquire about the one month delay.  I was told there was a delay on them receiving there viablu connectors and that was the hold up.  So now I'm waiting.


----------



## average_joe

Have you been talking with Kevin at Null Audio? Something sounds strange.


----------



## Staal

Ah, the mailman brought the Hybrid cable from Whiplash today. Very excited to get to spend some time with it. It looks beautiful.


----------



## myared

Quote: 





evolutionx said:


> +1.  Just got my Chris_himself cable for my JH-16pro and really exceeded my expectation.    Half the costs of my previous cable but sounded like a match make in heaven.    Thanks to this thread and the reviews.


 


 I'll be receiving both my JH-16 and Chris_Himself cable by the end of the month.  How much difference did you find between the CH cable and the stock ones?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





staal said:


> Ah, the mailman brought the Hybrid cable from Whiplash today. Very excited to get to spend some time with it. It looks beautiful.


 

 Very nice, looking forward to your impressions of the cable.
   
  Quote: 





myared said:


> I'll be receiving both my JH-16 and Chris_Himself cable by the end of the month.  How much difference did you find between the CH cable and the stock ones?


----------



## myared

average_joe,
   
  The question I asked evolutionx is by no means meant to diminish the value of your excellent review of IEM cables.  By the way, my decision to go ahead with Chris_Himself cables for my JH16 is totally based on the recommendation you make in that review.  Thanks man.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





myared said:


> average_joe,
> 
> The question I asked evolutionx is by no means meant to diminish the value of your excellent review of IEM cables.  By the way, my decision to go ahead with Chris_Himself cables for my JH16 is totally based on the recommendation you make in that review.  Thanks man.


 

 No problem, I too am interested in what evolutionx has to say about the pairing.  The more reviews/evaluations of gear we have, the more informed decisions others can make!  The popcorn was just a nice snack until evolutionx posts his thoughts 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.  And thank you for the compliment, please don't hesitate to ask me questions.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





myared said:


> average_joe,
> 
> The question I asked evolutionx is by no means meant to diminish the value of your excellent review of IEM cables.  By the way, my decision to go ahead with Chris_Himself cables for my JH16 is totally based on the recommendation you make in that review.  Thanks man.


 


  I see the thousands of dollars I wired into Joe's offshore bank account to write reviews for me is paying off MUAHAHAHA *twiddles fingers*
   
  Seriously though, thank you for the support guys. You guys are seriously putting me through school.


----------



## cooperpwc

As someone who cannot access Chris_himself on Blogspot (which is banned in China), I am confused. It seems that Headphone Lounge Cables by Chris_Himself is different than Headphonelounge.com which also makes silver IEM cables?


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





cooperpwc said:


> As someone who cannot access Chris_himself on Blogspot (which is banned in China), I am confused. It seems that Headphone Lounge Cables by Chris_Himself is different than Headphonelounge.com which also makes silver IEM cables?


 


  Same website, just PM me if all else fails.
   
  My e-mail is my user name @tranceaddict.net,
   
  I'm available to chat about audio equipment as well, as thats how I like to spend my time on head-fi these days instead of posting.


----------



## cooperpwc

Quote:


chris_himself said:


> Same website, just PM me if all else fails.
> 
> My e-mail is my user name @tranceaddict.net,
> 
> I'm available to chat about audio equipment as well, as thats how I like to spend my time on head-fi these days instead of posting.


 

 Thanks!


----------



## myared

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Same website, just PM me if all else fails.
> 
> My e-mail is my user name @tranceaddict.net,
> 
> I'm available to chat about audio equipment as well, as thats how I like to spend my time on head-fi these days instead of posting.


 


 No, no, no!  You should be spending your time finishing my cable before my JH16s arrive!!!....  Just kidding Chris, please take your time.  Just make sure it's the best cable you've ever made.


----------



## ichiveritas

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Have you been talking with Kevin at Null Audio? Something sounds strange.


 



 Yup Kevin K Wang.  I'm still waiting I will update in this post if anything changes.


----------



## myared

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> No problem, I too am interested in what evolutionx has to say about the pairing.  The more reviews/evaluations of gear we have, the more informed decisions others can make!  The popcorn was just a nice snack until evolutionx posts his thoughts
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I will probably ask you and others a lot of questions once I get my IEMs and cable.  I'm new at this hi def music business.  Thanks man.


----------



## Xymordos

I'm using a Silver Dragon MKII Pure silver cable from Jaben at the moment, and its soundstage is massive, but the trade off is the slight bass reduction, but increased depth. I ordered the toxic cable OCC silver and asked my friend to build one for me. Its going to arrive in probably another week...
   
  Does anyone have any impression on the Toxic Cable OCC Silver?


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> I'm using a Silver Dragon MKII Pure silver cable from Jaben at the moment, and its soundstage is massive, but the trade off is the slight bass reduction, but increased depth. I ordered the toxic cable OCC silver and asked my friend to build one for me. Its going to arrive in probably another week...
> 
> Does anyone have any impression on the Toxic Cable OCC Silver?


 
   
  Yes, it's very good, go check out the LCD-2 cable thread and you'll grasp the following that the guy has. He builds beautiful cables and I hope he enjoys a lot of success in the future.


----------



## Xymordos

Ooh thats good, can't wait till it arrives! Takes 10-20 days for it to ship to Hong Kong


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> I'm using a Silver Dragon MKII Pure silver cable from Jaben at the moment, and its soundstage is massive, but the trade off is the slight bass reduction, but increased depth. I ordered the toxic cable OCC silver and asked my friend to build one for me. Its going to arrive in probably another week...
> 
> Does anyone have any impression on the Toxic Cable OCC Silver?


 
   
  I made an ipod LOD out of the Toxic Cables silver, and am currently making an IEM cable from it too ( longest cable build ever! But good things come to those who wait. All I need to do is solder the pins on then its done... Check my photo albumn - towards the end - for pics) Its really nice stuff. Very flexible and beautiful.
   
  I was so impressed with the SQ from the LOD that I decided to sink some cash into 16ft of the silver wire to make the IEM cable. For me - refering to the LOD - the bass responce is great. Tighter than before. The music sounds more dynamic and engaging than before.
   
  I must finish this cable up!


----------



## Xymordos

I wonder how it compares to other silver cables due to the gold content..but hey it just arrived! I'll post some impressions when its done making


----------



## cogsand gears

Soldered the pins onto the Toxic Cables DIY silver IEM cable this evening.
   
  Cable is not quite finished yet but I had a quick listen to a couple of tracks with my TF10. Very initial impressions are: Bass sounds huge! Mids seem much more forward. Highs are still wonderfully sparkly. Sounds much more epic than previously.
   
  I will post further impressions once I have finished it off and gotten a few hours on it.


----------



## cogsand gears




----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


>


 
   
  Is that an amber Y-split? Wow... gorgeous!


----------



## Toxic Cables

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Soldered the pins onto the Toxic Cables DIY silver IEM cable this evening.
> 
> Cable is not quite finished yet but I had a quick listen to a couple of tracks with my TF10. Very initial impressions are: Bass sounds huge! Mids seem much more forward. Highs are still wonderfully sparkly. Sounds much more epic than previously.
> 
> I will post further impressions once I have finished it off and gotten a few hours on it.


 
   
  Just wait till you burn it in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Your work looks amazing.


----------



## cute

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> I wonder how it compares to other silver cables due to the gold content..but hey it just arrived! I'll post some impressions when its done making


 
   
   I just heard from a reliable source that this wire is the same wire that Whiplash uses for it's cables.....how ironic!
   
   
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pure-Stranded-UP-OCC-Cyro-Treated-7N-Silver-Wire-per-ft-/120887397448?pt=UK_Computing_CablesConnectors_RL&hash=item1c25734c48


----------



## Toxic Cables

Quote: 





cute said:


> I just heard from a reliable source that this wire is the same wire that Whiplash uses for it's cables.....how ironic!
> 
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pure-Stranded-UP-OCC-Cyro-Treated-7N-Silver-Wire-per-ft-/120887397448?pt=UK_Computing_CablesConnectors_RL&hash=item1c25734c48


 
   
  My wire is made especially for me to my specifications, every wire i use for my cables is my own and only available from me.
   
  Your source is far from reliable, if that's the information they gave you.


----------



## Matter

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


>


 
   
  Beautiful!
  How much did this cost you in total?


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Is that an amber Y-split? Wow... gorgeous!


 
   
  Yes it is. Thank you! I did make an amber chin cinch / slider as well, but in the end I thought it was a little too much so wennt with a clear silicone O ring instead.
   
   
  Quote: 





toxic cables said:


> Just wait till you burn it in.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks Frank. What burn in time would you recomend on the silver?  
   
   
  Quote: 





matter said:


> Beautiful!
> How much did this cost you in total?


 
   
   Thank you. Total cost for materials was about £120 ish I think. It was over my budget, but after making an ipod LOD with the TC Silver, I had to do an IEM cable with it too.


----------



## Xymordos

Wow that looks amazing!
  Do update us on the sound after burn in


----------



## ChrisSC

Can you burn in cables by attaching them to the source and playing music thru them, but without having iems attached to them?


----------



## Toxic Cables

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Thanks Frank. What burn in time would you recomend on the silver?


 
   
  150-200hrs.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





chrissc said:


> Can you burn in cables by attaching them to the source and playing music thru them, but without having iems attached to them?


 
   
  Nope, they must be connected to something to complete the circuit and have electrons flow.


----------



## myared

What's the best way to burn in new cables; is it to simply listen to regular music for about 150-200 hours or are there special audio clips to use (and where would one find them if they exist)?   Thanks.


----------



## PLUSSOUND

Quote: 





myared said:


> What's the best way to burn in new cables; is it to simply listen to regular music for about 150-200 hours or are there special audio clips to use (and where would one find them if they exist)?   Thanks.


 
   
  Most do it by simply playing music for hundreds of hours.


----------



## ChrisSC

Quote: 





myared said:


> What's the best way to burn in new cables; is it to simply listen to regular music for about 150-200 hours or are there special audio clips to use (and where would one find them if they exist)?   Thanks.


 
   
  This is a good burn-in loop:  http://jlabaudio.com/burn.php (bottom right corner)
   
  I like it because it plays a minute of silence between sets so you can run it continuously without worrying about over-stressing your monitors


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





chrissc said:


> Can you burn in cables by attaching them to the source and playing music thru them, but without having iems attached to them?


 
   
  The negative leads won't get used in that scenario, only the positive ones


----------



## Xymordos

I got my Toxic Silver today! The first listen wasn't as good...bassless and a soundstage completely out of proportions. However, after a few hours of music, they already sound MUCH better.
  I would say this cable is extremely energetic and full of power. I can tell that details increased by quite a bit. The treble is more pronounced and detailed. Vocals moved closer, and the background instruments seem to surround me better too. However, this is at a cost of a smaller soundstage, which looks like this:
    
          /  \  
         | x |
  
  x is you, and the sound near your ears are squashed closer in. There is a lot of depth in the soundstage, but then it gets narrower as it gets further away from you, as if it is focusing on a point very far away. Its a weird soundstage, and I hope it'll improve as I burn in the cable.
   
  The bass is very unique indeed. There is not a lot of quantity, and each note is very very solid. The punch is extremely powerful, but the bass extension is only average. What's unique is that even though the bass quantity is quite little, after the impact from the punch of the bass note, the echos of that note will rush back to you like a wave. Very nice.
   
  This cable probably changed the sound of my customs the most compared to any other cable, including ALO.


----------



## Staal

So, where does one purchase a cable from Toxic Cables for IEMs?


----------



## Toxic Cables

^^ Send me an email, can be found on my profile.
   
  Thanks for the impressions, i highly recommend burning them in a little more, then


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> I got my Toxic Silver today! The first listen wasn't as good...bassless and a soundstage completely out of proportions. However, after a few hours of music, they already sound MUCH better.
> I would say this cable is extremely energetic and full of power. I can tell that details increased by quite a bit. The treble is more pronounced and detailed. Vocals moved closer, and the background instruments seem to surround me better too. However, this is at a cost of a smaller soundstage, which looks like this:
> 
> /  \
> ...


 
   
  I agree with your final statement totaly - most change I have ever heard from a cable, not tried ALO though ( too expensive for my taste / budget ) . I also agree that it is very energetic - it makes everthing sound effortless if that makes sense. Like there is limitless power behind it which is barely being taped.
   
  I have not found the bass to be lacking at all, but that may be down to the fones. The notes are very solid indeed, a lot of power and punch. By far the best cable I have tried.
   
  I have only used it for around 10 - 12 hours so far, but have noticed a change in that time.
   
  Great product Frank! Nice work.


----------



## Toxic Cables

Thanks Luke, i try me best.


----------



## Xymordos

ALO cables sounds very different compared to this one. Their bass is thicker and richer, with a more relaxed sound. the Toxic silver is clearer and more spacious (blacker background?), though with a smaller soundstage (so far which is around 10-12 hours burn in).


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> ALO cables sounds very different compared to this one. Their bass is thicker and richer, with a more relaxed sound. the Toxic silver is clearer and more spacious (blacker background?), though with a smaller soundstage (so far which is around 10-12 hours burn in).


 
   
   I thought the background was blacker too. I thought it must be in my head though, didnt know a cable could do that.


----------



## myared

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> The negative leads won't get used in that scenario, only the positive ones


 
   
  Chris, are you familiar with the JLab audio loop ChrisSC provided the URL for ( http://jlabaudio.com/burn.php) and would it be good to burn in the cable you're making me?  Also, how long should the burn in period be in your opinion?  Thanks.


----------



## Xymordos

Instead of burning in like that...you should just listen to it normally...
   
  And yes I do think the background is blacker! I can hear more details as a result!


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





myared said:


> Chris, are you familiar with the JLab audio loop ChrisSC provided the URL for ( http://jlabaudio.com/burn.php) and would it be good to burn in the cable you're making me?  Also, how long should the burn in period be in your opinion?  Thanks.


 
   
  Listen to it normally so you can monitor how much better it sounds every time you pick it up. If you just kinda fire and forget (burn-in) it'll be hard to fully appreciate burn-in.
   
  Then after a few weeks just pop the stock cables back in (depends what IEM or headphone we're talking about) and boom, thats your quantifiable difference between stock, silver or upgraded OCC copper.
   
  That being said, certain brands I've used (I've been a cable-fier long before Headphone Lounge) will show a difference right away. Others, are worse for a bit, then after whatever magic happens in 30 hours, then you get your improved sound.
   
  Burn-in period has been stated to be as long as 200 hours for some people, probably on new headphones which need driver burn-in anyway, but I've observed in my personal experience that any differences with usage can be noticed as early as 20 hours to 50 hours. I can pick apart the most subtle of things since I've been into headphones since 2006 and I play musical chairs with equipment a lot so theres also that.
   
  Some people don't even notice when I plug my LCD-2's into a DAC/amp or a headphone jack of my computer speakers... so then theres that demographic too haha.


----------



## Xymordos

My dad said theres no difference between W5000 and HD598, then he heard my speakers and said they sounded the same too...


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> My dad said theres no difference between W5000 and HD598, then he heard my speakers and said they sounded the same too...


 
   
  How old is your father? I'm sorry to say, he may be beginning to lose his hearing. Presbycusis starts with the high frequencies.
   
​


----------



## Xymordos

He'll be between the yellow and orange lines 
  But no, not really, because he just doesn't pay as much attention as we do in listening. He listens to music usually when doing other things.


----------



## myared

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Listen to it normally so you can monitor how much better it sounds every time you pick it up. If you just kinda fire and forget (burn-in) it'll be hard to fully appreciate burn-in.
> 
> Then after a few weeks just pop the stock cables back in (depends what IEM or headphone we're talking about)....


 
   
  JH16s...  I think I'll go with this advice and just normally listen to them with your cable and hopefully hear them sound better every time I put them on once I've logged in enough hours...  Thanks for the advice guys.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





myared said:


> JH16s...  I think I'll go with this advice and just normally listen to them with your cable and hopefully hear them sound better every time I put them on once I've logged in enough hours...  Thanks for the advice guys.


 
   
  Enjoy them and if you ever have a problem, you always know where to find me mate


----------



## myared

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Enjoy them and if you ever have a problem, you always know where to find me mate


 
   
   
  I sent you a PM.  Thanks Chris.


----------



## myared

Anyone (other than Average-Joe) has compared the Chris_Himself cables to the stock JH16 cable?  Thanks.


----------



## Staal

Mine has yet to arrive. I'll be sure to let you know when it does. (I own the JH16).


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





staal said:


> Mine has yet to arrive. I'll be sure to let you know when it does. (I own the JH16).


 
   
  Thors, I feel so bad for your situation, I'm gonna do a special video of me in the nude building your cables 
   
  I'm going to send them via direct helicopter mail this time so they won't get lost. Thats the second package I lost this year dangit.


----------



## Staal

No worries Chris, hardly your fault the postal workers are so fond of your cables that they end up in their pockets rather than my mailbox. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Looking forward to that video. Should be able to make a pretty penny from it if I can just find the right forum for that kinda thing!


----------



## ichiveritas

Just to update my cables arrived from null on the 9th.  havent tried them out yet.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





staal said:


> No worries Chris, hardly your fault the postal workers are so fond of your cables that they end up in their pockets rather than my mailbox.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Shipped.


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Shipped.


 
   
  Sounds great!


----------



## n3utra1

Awesome thread!
   
  I wish someone will review the Beat Silver sonic MKIII


----------



## kenman345

When I made my IEM cable thread, I never found a review of the Silver Sonic MKIII as of yet. Sorry. Keep your eyes open though, you never know what will pop up on these forums.


----------



## n3utra1

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> When I made my IEM cable thread, I never found a review of the Silver Sonic MKIII as of yet. Sorry. Keep your eyes open though, you never know what will pop up on these forums.


 
   
  No worries bro 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I'd really like to purchase a Chris_himself cable but it is not compatible with my customs with recessed sockets. I PMed Chris already if he can make one but didn't get a reply. I dont want to spend more than $150 as much as possible for custom cables


----------



## kenman345

I'll tal to him for you. I got one spare set of plugs for recessed ports I can send him. Just need a kickback for the price. Or Lunashops has them, but he still has to do work to them to work with his cables and make them nice, i'll ask if he wants to do another pair besides my two pair for you. Let me know by PM if you're serious about it. Otherwise, I might likely decide to sell one of my pairs in the end, don't know yet, but it's always a possibility
  Quote: 





n3utra1 said:


> No worries bro
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## hyogen

which did you prefer sonically...Arete or Chris_himself?  It was hard to tell from the review--at least at 5AM -_-


----------



## ChrisSC

Any plans to review the new silver cables by Toxic Cables?  When they start making IEM cables, one of their designs has iPhone mic/controls, and that's something I'm particularly interested in.


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





chrissc said:


> Any plans to review the new silver cables by Toxic Cables?  When they start making IEM cables, one of their designs has iPhone mic/controls, and that's something I'm particularly interested in.


 

  
  Project86 will be getting a review sample of a Toxic IEM cable.
   
  Westone has already launched their phone-control cable and JH has one coming as well.


----------



## ChrisSC

Awesome!  I just read P86's review of the 6.a and he writes good stuff.  Looking forward to his cable review.
   
  I saw that westone is now making a cable with mic/controls, but then there's the huge asterisk that it *does not work with iPhone 4/s, so that one's out for me.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





hyogen said:


> which did you prefer sonically...Arete or Chris_himself?  It was hard to tell from the review--at least at 5AM -_-


 
   
  First, one is a TF10 cable and the other fits my CIEMs.  But I prefer the CH cable sonically, but the Arete is my absolute favorite from an ergonomics standpoint.
   
  Quote: 





chrissc said:


> Any plans to review the new silver cables by Toxic Cables?  When they start making IEM cables, one of their designs has iPhone mic/controls, and that's something I'm particularly interested in.


 
   
  Not at this time as I am trying to catch up on my reviews and don't want to take on anything else that will sit for a while.
   
  Quote: 





staal said:


> Project86 will be getting a review sample of a Toxic IEM cable.
> 
> Westone has already launched their phone-control cable and JH has one coming as well.


 
   
  Very cool, I am looking forward to his review.


----------



## cogsand gears

For those of you who are looking to order from the new Toxic Cables IEM cable range, Frank will be taking pre orders as of the end of next week, and should have the cables ready to ship in a month, so shoot him an email via the Toxic Cables website.
   
  Also, he sent me some pictures of the soon to be released (next week) Shure compatiable CIEM cable: Click on the pics for a much larger and better detailed view.

   
  Stunning!


----------



## Cryok95

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> For those of you who are looking to order from the new Toxic Cables IEM cable range, Frank will be taking pre orders as of the end of next week, and should have the cables ready to ship in a month, so shoot him an email via the Toxic Cables website.
> 
> Also, he sent me some pictures of the soon to be released (next week) Shure compatiable CIEM cable: Click on the pics for a much larger and better detailed view.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I am actually speechless..


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





cryok95 said:


> I am actually speechless..


 
   Yes, quality indeed.


----------



## Cryok95

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Yes, quality indeed.


 
   
  I think there will be an overmoulded version with Westone pins. Those will look even better!
   
  Hopefully Average Joe will give a review sometime soon


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





cryok95 said:


> I think there will be an overmoulded version with Westone pins. Those will look even better!
> 
> Hopefully Average Joe will give a review sometime soon


 
  There will be indeed. Im looking forward to seeing those soon.


----------



## Toxic Cables

Quote: 





cryok95 said:


> I think there will be an overmoulded version with Westone pins. Those will look even better!
> 
> Hopefully Average Joe will give a review sometime soon


 
  Yes, all the IEM cables do have an over mold.


----------



## Ohhirio

Hi people on this thread. Im rather new here, in need of some help. Im interested in getting a Null Audio Lune from Treoo.com at the moment. But i would like to ask if the Viablue straight or the Neutrik right-angled plug is more durable? Im fine with both straight or right-angled jacks. Thanks!


----------



## kenman345

Usually, the preference for durability is towards the right-angle plug, as their is less stress on the output jack when the tension on the cord is tight. The real most durable option is whichever is going to suit you better without much stress. I have a few different cables with right angles and straight plugs and they are all for different applications. I notice more that a straight plug on my Macbook Pro will always come out and lose connection because of stress, yet the right-angle plugs are much more consistent. Good luck with your choice, it's all about how you're going to use it. 
  Quote: 





ohhirio said:


> Hi people on this thread. Im rather new here, in need of some help. Im interested in getting a Null Audio Lune from Treoo.com at the moment. But i would like to ask if the Viablue straight or the Neutrik right-angled plug is more durable? Im fine with both straight or right-angled jacks. Thanks!


----------



## dragonball

Arete costs 90$ + 50$ shipping !!??
  Any idea how to obtain arete cheaply? How to avoid 50$ shipping? Any other site except Treeoo to buy this?


----------



## average_joe

Null Audio.  Currently (with the exchange rate) $82.52 + $9 shipping worldwide.


----------



## ChrisSC

Hey Joe, I was rereading your review on the crystal piccolinos, and it seemed that the only way to justify its cost is if you paired it with the UERM- that made a noticeable improvement.  Is that because the UERM has a flat sound sig or is it because of something else in the UERM?  I'm not sure if you have the cable anymore, but how do you think it would sound with the nt-6 or another flatly tuned (no bump in highs, mids, lows) monitor?  Same results?


----------



## average_joe

I don't have the cable, so I can't say for sure or even speculate about the NT-6 paring.  I haven't had the chance to try different cable options as of late since I have been busy with amps and CIEMs, but I did start a project that I haven't had a chance to finish that may shed some additional light on custom IEM cable matching.
   
  For now, the premium cable that used to come with the NT-6 did improve the sound compared with the stock cable.


----------



## apollinaris

Hello!
   
  Is there a way to check and confirm that a given headphone cable is actually a silver one? I've recently purchased on ebay a used upgrade cable for my Sennheiser HD580 and the seller stated it's "Jaben/Hippo Silver Dragon Mk.II cable" worth of $140 as initial retailer price (1.2m). However, the build quality and general exterior of this cable looks almost identical to some cheaper cables like Effect Studio Crystal in your review post. The cable sounds very well, but due to limited alternatives I can't objectively compare the sound quality of this particular cable. Hence, I don't know if any noticable upgrade is still possible and is worth of. Will appreciate any tips in this respect!


----------



## drubrew

Quote: 





apollinaris said:


> Hello!
> 
> Is there a way to check and confirm that a given headphone cable is actually a silver one? I've recently purchased on eBay a used upgrade cable for my Sennheiser HD580 and the seller stated it's "Jaben/Hippo Silver Dragon Mk.II cable" worth of $140 as initial retailer price (1.2m). However, the build quality and general exterior of this cable looks almost identical to some cheaper cables like Effect Studio Crystal in your review post. The cable sounds very well, but due to limited alternatives I can't objectively compare the sound quality of this particular cable. Hence, I don't know if any noticeable upgrade is still possible and is worth of. Will appreciate any tips in this respect!


 
   
  Because someone just asked me about this, I thought I would post something in this Post on IEM cable.
  Be very careful of buying any cable called the Silver Dragon from Zephone. As it is a Moon Audio Silver Dragon V1 IEM knockoff. They have even copied our description word for word as seen here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/220816779304?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_1081wt_1139
  Jaben's cable is not a knock off, but for whatever reason they named their cable the same as ours. I emailed them long ago and asked if they would not mind changing the name so it did not cause customer confusion. As we have been using the Silver Dragon Product name since 2003. 
  We have found a bunch of Asian forum posts stating that the Zephone it is our cable. These are not Moon Audio cables and we will not warranty them. If you ever have a concern about buying a counterfeit Moon Audio Silver Dragon V1 IEM please contact us first and show us what you plan to buy. We have authorized dealers in Asia and can confirm with you real from fake.


----------



## Toxic Cables

It seems a real shame, how some of these manufacturers try to pass of their cables as another brand.


----------



## Spike99

I have to give a lot of props to AJ for his detailed reviews....

Bit of a noob here.... Basically, for commuting purposes (train/bus) will be getting IEM, most likely Jh16's but will be Checking other JH models at the audiologist. 

Since my source will be IPhone/IPad (not sure about portable amp due to portability - but maybe in the future), I've been searching for a cable that has inline mic and skip/pause functions... But I have no luck in finding any. Am I looking in the wrong places ?


----------



## average_joe

Added the AudioSonus UE TF10 cable review in the first post of this thread, and also added two evaluations to the TWag cable, one of which is the Heir Audio 8.A with the Magnus 1 cable, which I will be reviewing at some point.
   
  Quote: 





spike99 said:


> I have to give a lot of props to AJ for his detailed reviews....
> Bit of a noob here.... Basically, for commuting purposes (train/bus) will be getting IEM, most likely Jh16's but will be Checking other JH models at the audiologist.
> Since my source will be IPhone/IPad (not sure about portable amp due to portability - but maybe in the future), I've been searching for a cable that has inline mic and skip/pause functions... But I have no luck in finding any. Am I looking in the wrong places ?


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  I have not seen any aftermarket cables that have inline controls; just a few CIEMs (from Europe) that don't have detachable cables.  If anyone knows of any, please let us all know!


----------



## dannytang

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I have not seen any aftermarket cables that have inline controls; just a few CIEMs (from Europe) that don't have detachable cables.  If anyone knows of any, please let us all know!


 
   
  Beat Audio used to make "iPhone Specialist" custom IEM cable. Chris_Himself has mentioned that if someone could find him a source/supplier for the mic/remote, he'd be willing to give it a try. At the moment the only place I know that offers a IEM cable with iPhone compatible mic/remote is a little shop in Hong Kong, mentioned by mrAdrian in this thread. I've tried contracting him via email and forums in English and Chinese, but I never head back from him. If anyone else has had better luck, please let us know.


----------



## Staal

Quote: 





dannytang said:


> Beat Audio used to make "iPhone Specialist" custom IEM cable. Chris_Himself has mentioned that if someone could find him a source/supplier for the mic/remote, he'd be willing to give it a try. At the moment the only place I know that offers a IEM cable with iPhone compatible mic/remote is a little shop in Hong Kong, mentioned by mrAdrian in this thread. I've tried contracting him via email and forums in English and Chinese, but I never head back from him. If anyone else has had better luck, please let us know.


 
   
  Did you consider the one from Westone? JH Audio has also mentioned that they're working on a cable with a mic.


----------



## dannytang

Westone says that their Epic Mics Cable is not recommended for the iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S.
   
   
   


> Not recommended for iPhone 4 or 4s. Some users report an echo effect while using this product with the iPhone 4 and 4s.


----------



## cogsand gears

Frank at Toxic Cables does a CIEM cable with controlls and mic. Send him an email or PM Kabelmeister.


----------



## Spike99

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Frank at Toxic Cables does a CIEM cable with controlls and mic. Send him an email or PM Kabelmeister.


 
  OK... will do.
   
  It's very surprising that most if not all universal IEM have a inline control for apple products but when it comes to customs... none have it...  Since customs are much more expensive... I would expect them to have this... especially when apple products are so popular...  Why is this ?  Is there a degradation of sound quality due to this inline control ?


----------



## scootermafia

The inline control requires another wire to be braided into the mix, it doesn't degrade sound quality though. It does require the use of a 4 pole (TRRS) mini plug instead of a regular mini plug so stuff like Oyaide mini plugs are out. There's also the issue of figuring out where to stick it and how to integrate it since typically an in line remote is molded onto your typical mass produced cable. Adding one isn't trivial, for sure.


----------



## Spike99

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> The inline control requires another wire to be braided into the mix, it doesn't degrade sound quality though. It does require the use of a 4 pole (TRRS) mini plug instead of a regular mini plug so stuff like Oyaide mini plugs are out. There's also the issue of figuring out where to stick it and how to integrate it since typically an in line remote is molded onto your typical mass produced cable. Adding one isn't trivial, for sure.


 
  Like I mentioned... most (if not all) universal IEM have an inline control OR at least have an option to get this cable... I just don't understand why it is not available for custom IEM's.... very hard to understand.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> The inline control requires another wire to be braided into the mix, it doesn't degrade sound quality though. It does require the use of a 4 pole (TRRS) mini plug instead of a regular mini plug so stuff like Oyaide mini plugs are out. There's also the issue of figuring out where to stick it and how to integrate it since typically an in line remote is molded onto your typical mass produced cable. Adding one isn't trivial, for sure.


 
   
  Lets not forget that it's a fifth wire, thickness is not always fun to deal with.
   
  I get asked almost weekly if I can do one of these cables. Basically I wouldn't want to add an in-line mic unless I knew it was good quality and it wouldn't be a problem area later. The TRRS plugs are not fun to work with either.
   
  Can't you guys just use bluetooth headsets haha


----------



## PLUSSOUND

Quote: 





spike99 said:


> Like I mentioned... most (if not all) universal IEM have an inline control OR at least have an option to get this cable... I just don't understand why it is not available for custom IEM's.... very hard to understand.


 
  It is easier said than done. I've been able to do this but it is complicated for anyone to do with the addition of a fifth wire for the mic, as well as finding the right mic that would do justice to the cable.


----------



## AudioSonus

Thanks for the review, Joe.
  We will endeavour to keep on improving our cables.


----------



## kenman345

If you can contact me whenever those cables come out I'll be sure to add it to the list linked to in my signature. Great addition to the already great reviews on the thread.
  Quote: 





audiosonus said:


> Thanks for the review, Joe.
> We will endeavour to keep on improving our cables.


----------



## illwafer

Do the UE custom replacement cables work with the TF10?
http://www.logitech.com/en-us/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories
   
  The second row are for customs before September 2010. The connector looks the same, and it seems like a good bargain.


----------



## drubrew

Quote: 





illwafer said:


> Do the UE custom replacement cables work with the TF10?
> http://www.logitech.com/en-us/custom-in-ear-monitors/accessories
> 
> The second row are for customs before September 2010. The connector looks the same, and it seems like a good bargain.


 
  Triple fi uses a shorter pin. So if you use any of these cables our other cables made for the custom IEMs, the plug will not seat in all the way. You can end up bending the pins since they dont sit firmly all the way in. Not a good idea. We will have a Triple Fi version of our custom IEM cables in a few months. If your cable is bad I would just order a TF10 cable. It is no better or worse than the stock cables for the customs.


----------



## liquidsword

I'm looking to buy a replacement cable for my tf10, I was wondering if you know anything about these cables: 
  http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OCC-Ultimate-Ears-upgrade-cable-UE-triple-fi-10-SF-3-5-AWG26-/150849572340?pt=UK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Headphones&hash=item231f55cdf4#ht_2459wt_780
   
  thanks!


----------



## kenman345

I would rather spend the money on a different tf10 cable. Check my list of IEM cables in my signature, it's got a few UE TF10 cables. The problem is that some of these non overmoulded cables are not proper for the pin sizes. I've heard lots of reports from people about their cables not working and not to include them in the list. This one was never mentioned to me, but it is a risk you are taking (some cables had pin sizes smaller than the tf10 size, not the usually larger pin sizes used on other IEM's. Weird why they would even produce the non-standard size, but they do and it's something to try and find out about. 
   
  Good luck in your search, let me know if the cable works and i'll include it in the list
  Quote: 





liquidsword said:


> I'm looking to buy a replacement cable for my tf10, I was wondering if you know anything about these cables:
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OCC-Ultimate-Ears-upgrade-cable-UE-triple-fi-10-SF-3-5-AWG26-/150849572340?pt=UK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Headphones&hash=item231f55cdf4#ht_2459wt_780
> 
> thanks!


----------



## Toxic Cables

I recently ordered several different TF10 connectors, and on half of them the pins were too large, good thing i actually purchased a TF10 so that i could check.


----------



## PLUSSOUND

I find it strange that all TF10 pins don't maintain the same size. It is always best to own the IEM to make sure you find the right connector.


----------



## scootermafia

TF10s sound sexy, but they're a cruel and unusual ear punishment, at least for me, the way they're shaped.  T minus 12 hours and counting until I finally get fitted for customs.


----------



## kenman345

You've never had customs? Or never custom TF10's? Customs are lots of fun. The fitting will be much more to your liking if you get it done right. Who you getting to do the remold or customs?
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> TF10s sound sexy, but they're a cruel and unusual ear punishment, at least for me, the way they're shaped.  T minus 12 hours and counting until I finally get fitted for customs.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> TF10s sound sexy, but they're a cruel and unusual ear punishment, at least for me, the way they're shaped.  T minus 12 hours and counting until I finally get fitted for customs.


 
   
  JH13's or bust brohan.


----------



## liquidsword

Hey 
   
  Thanks a lot for getting back to me! So I'll take your advice and won't risk it! I'm kind of stuck between  *Chris_Himself's Cable* and *Null Audio Arete. *which one do you find sonically superior?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





toxic cables said:


> I recently ordered several different TF10 connectors, and on half of them the pins were too large, good thing i actually purchased a TF10 so that i could check.


 
   
  I think the TF10 iv and regular use different pins, at least pin lengths.  And I have a cable that says UE on it and came with a $99 TF10 that doesn't have recessed pins so it doesn't fit flush.  Nothing like consistency!
   
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> TF10s sound sexy, but they're a cruel and unusual ear punishment, at least for me, the way they're shaped.  T minus 12 hours and counting until I finally get fitted for customs.


 
   
  I have large ears and they are still brutal from a fit perspective.
   
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> JH13's or bust brohan.


 
   
  Or one of the many other great custom IEMs out there 
   
  Quote: 





liquidsword said:


> Hey
> 
> Thanks a lot for getting back to me! So I'll take your advice and won't risk it! I'm kind of stuck between  *Chris_Himself's Cable* and *Null Audio Arete. *which one do you find sonically superior?


 
   
  Sonically superior (for the TF10)...the CH cable.


----------



## Chris_Himself

UE used to focus on custom IEM's first. How do you go from a custom tailored fit, to ramming awkwardly shaped cheetoes into your ear canal? I couldn't sleep with them in for fear of lodging one of them into my brain if I rolled over. Then again, I would have acheived the ULTIMATE FIT if that happened.


----------



## kenman345

The TF10's are designed similarly to other BA based IEM's. They have a bend in them so you theoretically can get a better and deeper fit. I honestly think the opposite happens, as I've never been able to get a half decent seal with any universal IEM's that have a bend. 
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> UE used to focus on custom IEM's first. How do you go from a custom tailored fit, to ramming awkwardly shaped cheetoes into your ear canal? I couldn't sleep with them in for fear of lodging one of them into my brain if I rolled over. Then again, I would have acheived the ULTIMATE FIT if that happened.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> The TF10's are designed similarly to other BA based IEM's. They have a bend in them so you theoretically can get a better and deeper fit. I honestly think the opposite happens, as I've never been able to get a half decent seal with any universal IEM's that have a bend.


 
   
  They are designed like other BA IEMs, but triple the size, lol!  There are plenty of universal IEMs that give me a good fit, but of course, customs have spoiled me


----------



## kenman345

Customs have spoiled me as well. I love the instant and perfect fit of my customs when I put them on. It's the only BA based type of IEM I can get a seal with. I've tried a few others and I never get a good seal at all and I'm more of a dynamic driver lover myself anyways.
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> They are designed like other BA IEMs, but triple the size, lol!  There are plenty of universal IEMs that give me a good fit, but of course, customs have spoiled me


----------



## dragonball

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Sonically superior (for the TF10)...the CH cable.


 
   
  Hi,
   
  1) I have stock TF10. Please tell me why is CH cable sonically superior to Null Audio Arete?
  2) What about microphonics & entanglement? Which is better in these 2 parameters?
  3) What about pic size? Are both same sized and do they both fit perfectly in Tf10 of filing is necessary?
   
  Thank you.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





dragonball said:


> Hi,
> 
> 1) I have stock TF10. Please tell me why is CH cable sonically superior to Null Audio Arete?
> 2) What about microphonics & entanglement? Which is better in these 2 parameters?
> ...


 
   
  1) The CH cable gives more depth to the presentation (a big weakness of the TF10) than the Arete and in doing so the increases instrument separation and improves inner resolution.  The Arete does the same thing, but not to the extent.  While the difference isn't large, it is noticeable to me.   Both cables improve the TF10.
  2) Arete
  3) The Arete is smaller than the CH cable, but both fit well.


----------



## dragonball

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> 1) The CH cable gives more depth to the presentation (a big weakness of the TF10) than the Arete and in doing so the increases instrument separation and improves inner resolution.  The Arete does the same thing, but not to the extent.  While the difference isn't large, it is noticeable to me.   Both cables improve the TF10.
> 2) Arete
> 3) The Arete is smaller than the CH cable, but both fit well.


 
   
  Thanks for the quick reply. Few more things:
  1) Is microphonics of CH much more than Arete? Because I use TF10 while running (right now with default cable and there isnt much microphonics with default cable). So if CH has similar or lesser micrphonics than default cable, I can go this route.
   
  2) WHen you say both fit TF10 well, the pins wont hang out/naked, right? I dont want metal part exposed (which may lead to it coming in contact with water, etc)
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## kenman345

Can't fully trust the review or the microphonics reported by others for the CH cable. They just got in new wire that's meant to fix the microphonics and flexibility. Don't know if it's the same manufacturer or anything yet. but I know Chris, and he's always moved to better cables in the past, not worse.
  Quote: 





dragonball said:


> Thanks for the quick reply. Few more things:
> 1) Is microphonics of CH much more than Arete? Because I use TF10 while running (right now with default cable and there isnt much microphonics with default cable). So if CH has similar or lesser micrphonics than default cable, I can go this route.
> 
> 2) WHen you say both fit TF10 well, the pins wont hang out/naked, right? I dont want metal part exposed (which may lead to it coming in contact with water, etc)
> ...


----------



## NocKM

just got DHC symbiote for ES5, and to my surprise it is the biggest improvement in sound in the setup over the CLAS and portaphile and alo continental. It doesn't taint the sound character of the ES5 but instead it noticeably,
   
  1) lifts the veil/improves clarity without messing with the ES5 mids
  2) Bass has slightly more impact and definitely hits lower
  3) Improve soundstage


----------



## scootermafia

Glad you like it!  My ES5 should be coming in tomorrow, so hopefully it will work out for me too.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





dragonball said:


> Thanks for the quick reply. Few more things:
> 1) Is microphonics of CH much more than Arete? Because I use TF10 while running (right now with default cable and there isnt much microphonics with default cable). So if CH has similar or lesser micrphonics than default cable, I can go this route.
> 
> 2) WHen you say both fit TF10 well, the pins wont hang out/naked, right? I dont want metal part exposed (which may lead to it coming in contact with water, etc)
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Can't fully trust the review or the microphonics reported by others for the CH cable. They just got in new wire that's meant to fix the microphonics and flexibility. Don't know if it's the same manufacturer or anything yet. but I know Chris, and he's always moved to better cables in the past, not worse.


 
   
  I guess this means I can't answer the question!
   
  Quote: 





nockm said:


> just got DHC symbiote for ES5, and to my surprise it is the biggest improvement in sound in the setup over the CLAS and portaphile and alo continental. It doesn't taint the sound character of the ES5 but instead it noticeably,
> 
> 1) lifts the veil/improves clarity without messing with the ES5 mids
> 2) Bass has slightly more impact and definitely hits lower
> 3) Improve soundstage


 
   
  Does the cable make these improvements with say a Clip+, or is it overall system synergy?  The cable could have been holding the rest of your system back...


----------



## Chris_Himself

I am using Double Helix Cables myself, they're up there with the best for copper cables. I have a prototype Peptide hexabraid cable. I can relate to his findings at the LCD-2 level of gear. For IEM's it's a much more audible difference.. which is saying a lot since a lot of people have been re-educated due to this thread. Thank you for reviewing my cables again Joe, it was the best thing I have to show people when they ask questions about my stuff


----------



## Girls Generation

x2
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> I am using Double Helix Cables myself, they're up there with the best for copper cables. I have a prototype Peptide hexabraid cable. I can relate to his findings at the LCD-2 level of gear. For IEM's it's a much more audible difference.. which is saying a lot since a lot of people have been re-educated due to this thread. Thank you for reviewing my cables again Joe, it was the best thing I have to show people when they ask questions about my stuff


----------



## scootermafia

Oh, hello.
   
   

   
  Edit: It's an ES5, bros.


----------



## kenman345

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Oh, hello.


 
  This makes me wish I had a cool element of a logo to integrate into a CIEM. Very nice. I bet you got a whole room filled of cables you've tried with those things.


----------



## scootermafia

Actually I'm starting from scratch figuring out how to cable these, they are my first CIEM but not my first IEM, they are very unique in their sound though.  Lots of options for sure.  And the cable has to fit inside the case...
   
  Westone charged me a gruesome amount for the double logo and the rush express service.  These are now my most expensive headphone, beating my wholesale-obtained LCD3s and original price HD800s.
   
  About microphonics, this whole phenomenon is overrated.  Teflon based wires are the most compact but have the most microphonics as people call them, since the insulation is firmer and thinner.  The trade off is that polyethylene insulated cables are larger.  When your music is off and you run your fingers up and down certain cables, there's that fun rattling noise.  But when your music is going, it's really not a huge concern...you hear the music.  And most times when you're listening, you're chilling out and not bonking the cable around.


----------



## kenman345

Congrats on the CIEM's. I love my CIEM's as well. I notice that just the stock IEM cable on mine and using my CH Silver Ray LOD causes an extreme amount of microphonics when I walk around campus. I plug my CIEM's into my iPod and continue walking and no microphonics effect (or very very minimal if at all). 
   
  Back to cables, I think your cables interest me the most since you always are seeming to work on interesting cables more so than any other company I follow. Mine cost a boat load too....let me know when you come up with the most epic of cable solutions. I'm definitely interested to hear what you come up with, and would totally be willing to beta test some cables if you want :-D
  Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Actually I'm starting from scratch figuring out how to cable these, they are my first CIEM but not my first IEM, they are very unique in their sound though.  Lots of options for sure.  And the cable has to fit inside the case...
> 
> Westone charged me a gruesome amount for the double logo and the rush express service.  These are now my most expensive headphone, beating my wholesale-obtained LCD3s and original price HD800s.
> 
> About microphonics, this whole phenomenon is overrated.  Teflon based wires are the most compact but have the most microphonics as people call them, since the insulation is firmer and thinner.  The trade off is that polyethylene insulated cables are larger.  When your music is off and you run your fingers up and down certain cables, there's that fun rattling noise.  But when your music is going, it's really not a huge concern...you hear the music.  And most times when you're listening, you're chilling out and not bonking the cable around.


----------



## scootermafia

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Congrats on the CIEM's. I love my CIEM's as well. I notice that just the stock IEM cable on mine and using my CH Silver Ray LOD causes an extreme amount of microphonics when I walk around campus. I plug my CIEM's into my iPod and continue walking and no microphonics effect (or very very minimal if at all).
> 
> Back to cables, I think your cables interest me the most since you always are seeming to work on interesting cables more so than any other company I follow. Mine cost a boat load too....let me know when you come up with the most epic of cable solutions. I'm definitely interested to hear what you come up with, and would totally be willing to beta test some cables if you want :-D


 
   
  Microphonics as they apply to this sort of audio is just the mechanical vibrations that translate to your ear when you bump your IEM cable with the music off.  You can't get them with interconnects though, that's basically impossible.  The stock cables still have plenty of microphonics, in that if you twiddle the wire that's attached to your ears, you'll feel vibrations.  Firmer wires have more microphonics though.  But I don't get how an LOD could cause that when it's not mechanically coupled to your ears.


----------



## Girls Generation

Microphonics from a LOD eh...   .......


----------



## kenman345

I am not quite sure, but I have strong winds around my college campus and I can repeated try what I said in my previous post and without fail it's the CH LOD. I've even tried other LOD's using other wire and I was fine as well. It's a weird phenomenon, maybe the signal is getting weird from wind as it enters my amp section and that gets amplified. 
  Quote:  





> But I don't get how an LOD could cause that when it's not mechanically coupled to your ears.


 
   
  Quote: 





girls generation said:


> Microphonics from a LOD eh...   .......


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> I am not quite sure, but I have strong winds around my college campus and I can repeated try what I said in my previous post and without fail it's the CH LOD. I've even tried other LOD's using other wire and I was fine as well. It's a weird phenomenon, maybe the signal is getting weird from wind as it enters my amp section and that gets amplified.


 
   
  Sound more likely to be an intermittent short than mirco phonics.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





scootermafia said:


> Oh, hello.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Very nice!
   
  Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Sound more likely to be an intermittent short than mirco phonics.


 
   
  I agree.


----------



## kenman345

I don't quite agree as it experiences no signs of shorting when I move the cable around, it's only when It's very windy around and using that LOD. I literally hear the wind like the LOD is picking it up like a microphone would. any ideas on how to test and know for sure?
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I agree.


----------



## tupac0306

Posted this on the other thread Since no one mentioned toxic cable here, thought I should add it here. Have tried twag and Chris himself before, this silver toxic cable certainly level up (if not top) their build qualities. Very flexible, great finish. It pairs JH16 pretty well by adding a bit more smoothness and depth to the sound. The OM connector pins fits perfectly. More importantly, this cable provides a slightly brighter presentation to the 5 way (more aggressive in a good way), so that the details is easier to be heard. The bass seems to be a bit tightened too. Great match with 801+Game. Also the cable fits in the recessed socket really very tightly (twag cable can be easily pulled out when inserted in). Frank from Toxic cable is absolutely helpful and responsive. He replies emails within 2 hours normally. They have plenty IEMs cable options. I have another sliver plated copper cable coming for my 5 way exclusively!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> I don't quite agree as it experiences no signs of shorting when I move the cable around, it's only when It's very windy around and using that LOD. I literally hear the wind like the LOD is picking it up like a microphone would. any ideas on how to test and know for sure?


 
   
  Quite odd.  I suppose you could test by grabbing the LOD when it the noise occurs and see if that stops it as it sounds like it is somehow transferring mechanical energy (of course, you can't have wind turn into an electrical signal ).
   
  Quote: 





tupac0306 said:


> Posted this on the other thread Since no one mentioned toxic cable here, thought I should add it here. Have tried twag and Chris himself before, this silver toxic cable certainly level up (if not top) their build qualities. Very flexible, great finish. It pairs JH16 pretty well by adding a bit more smoothness and depth to the sound. The OM connector pins fits perfectly. More importantly, this cable provides a slightly brighter presentation to the 5 way (more aggressive in a good way), so that the details is easier to be heard. The bass seems to be a bit tightened too. Great match with 801+Game. Also the cable fits in the recessed socket really very tightly (twag cable can be easily pulled out when inserted in). Frank from Toxic cable is absolutely helpful and responsive. He replies emails within 2 hours normally. They have plenty IEMs cable options. I have another sliver plated copper cable coming for my 5 way exclusively!


 
   
  Nice, the Toxic cable does look very nice, but unfortunately I don't have the time in my schedule for a review...I hope in the upcoming months...


----------



## anoxy

I'm torn between the Null Audio Lune, DHC Symbiote, and the Moon Audio Silver Dragon. I'll be using it with my Etymotic ER4B. Any suggestions to sway me one way?
   
  My biggest concern with the Etys is having no microphonic feedback on the cord, and good over the ear fit.


----------



## yjt93

Quote: 





tupac0306 said:


> Posted this on the other thread Since no one mentioned toxic cable here, thought I should add it here. Have tried twag and Chris himself before, this silver toxic cable certainly level up (if not top) their build qualities. Very flexible, great finish. It pairs JH16 pretty well by adding a bit more smoothness and depth to the sound. The OM connector pins fits perfectly. More importantly, this cable provides a slightly brighter presentation to the 5 way (more aggressive in a good way), so that the details is easier to be heard. The bass seems to be a bit tightened too. Great match with 801+Game. Also the cable fits in the recessed socket really very tightly (twag cable can be easily pulled out when inserted in). Frank from Toxic cable is absolutely helpful and responsive. He replies emails within 2 hours normally. They have plenty IEMs cable options. I have another sliver plated copper cable coming for my 5 way exclusively!


 
   
  When you say very flexible, is it like the standard iem cable that most custom cable comes with? Cause I just purchased Chris_Himself cable, while everything looks nice, the cable is quite stiff and I dislike that.


----------



## kenman345

The Toxic Cables cable is much more flexible than the old stock of Chris_Himself cables. He's getting in a new order of a stranded variety, so it will increase flexibility. Not sure how flexible the IEM cable is, but I have an LOD of Toxic Cables that gives you a pretty good idea of flexibility. I also have a Chris_Himself LOD, so it's comparing apples to apples in this case
   
  Quote: 





yjt93 said:


> When you say very flexible, is it like the standard iem cable that most custom cable comes with? Cause I just purchased Chris_Himself cable, while everything looks nice, the cable is quite stiff and I dislike that.


----------



## tupac0306

Quote: 





yjt93 said:


> When you say very flexible, is it like the standard iem cable that most custom cable comes with? Cause I just purchased Chris_Himself cable, while everything looks nice, the cable is quite stiff and I dislike that.


 
  I have Chris himself cable too. They are no where as flexible as toxic cable.


----------



## kenman345

Agreed, but We have yet to see or hear how Chris_Himself's new wire is. I'm excited to find out. 
  Quote: 





tupac0306 said:


> I have Chris himself cable too. They are no where as flexible as toxic cable.


----------



## anoxy

Does anyone from Null Audio post here? The Arete cable pictured on their website is different than the one reviewed here. I just want to make sure which one I'm actually ordering.
   
  This is what's on the website:

   
  EDIT: Also, do you know if the old UERM cable will fit westone 2-pin connections?


----------



## Sonify

Too bad that's silver plated copper instead of pure silver.
   
  Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> The Toxic Cables cable is much more flexible than the old stock of Chris_Himself cables. He's getting in a new order of a stranded variety, so it will increase flexibility. Not sure how flexible the IEM cable is, but I have an LOD of Toxic Cables that gives you a pretty good idea of flexibility. I also have a Chris_Himself LOD, so it's comparing apples to apples in this case


----------



## kenman345

Yes, and just copper variety too. Sound travels on the outside, shouldn't have much of an effect that its not a silver core anyways
  Quote: 





sonify said:


> Too bad that's silver plated copper instead of pure silver.


----------



## Sonify

Well I'll keep looking for stranded pure silver cables under $100


----------



## kenman345

Completely understandable. Cables are a weird thing where some may hear a difference others may not so if you want pure you want pure, just because to you it sounds different. I gotta test out his new cables before i make my decision, but I don't know when that'll be.
  Quote: 





sonify said:


> Well I'll keep looking for stranded pure silver cables under $100


----------



## ChrisSC

I could me mistaken, but I thought that solid-core wire has fewer crystal boundaries, anyone know if this is right?


----------



## kenman345

Yea, pretty sure you're correct, but it's about the type of wire too. Chris_Himself's new wire will be OCC stranded wire. 
  Quote: 





chrissc said:


> I could me mistaken, but I thought that solid-core wire has fewer crystal boundaries, anyone know if this is right?


----------



## Sonify

I have been researching in cables and wires for the past 8 months, and have been told from a reputable wire manufacturer that:
   

 If the strands that make up the wire are too thin, then the properties of the single crystalline structure are adversely affected
 
 During the manufacturing of electroplated wires, e.g. silver plated copper wires, the silver will NOT have the single crystalline structure due to the electroplating process, but the copper would still have the single crystal structure


----------



## kenman345

Interesting. It all makes sense. It all still comes down to how it sounds in the end though. And how it is in build quality and flexibility and micro phonics. So, I still will be waiting or talkign to Chris_Himself about getting some of the new wire to try it out for myself or to find out who's reviews are of the new stuff.
  Quote: 





sonify said:


> I have been researching in cables and wires for the past 8 months, and have been told from a reputable wire manufacturer that:
> 
> 
> If the strands that make up the wire are too thin, then the properties of the single crystalline structure are adversely affected
> ...


----------



## Sonify

One last interesting note before we veer off topic too much:
   
  Taken from the Cardas Audio website: http://www.cardas.com/content.php?area=faqs&content_id=6&pagestring=Cable+Materials
   
  "Silver Plated, Copper Conductors
   
  Q.) First off, I like your cables very much, and use them in my system. After reading about various manufacturers using silver-plated copper in their interconnect and speaker cable designs, I was just curious what it is about copper that you like so much that you prefer using it over silverplate.
   
  A.) Well basically it sounds better. Cables are a dynamic system, prone to ring. Like any other system without a little loss they will resonate, like a speaker box with no stuffing inside or phono cartridge with no damper. Ultra pure copper is ideal for audio purposes in most designs.
   
  Plated conductors are inherently impure mediums with bi-metal junctions and are not suitable for audio use in my estimation. - George"


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





sonify said:


> Well I'll keep looking for stranded pure silver cables under $100


 
  Good luck with that.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> I'm torn between the Null Audio Lune, DHC Symbiote, and the Moon Audio Silver Dragon. I'll be using it with my Etymotic ER4B. Any suggestions to sway me one way?
> 
> My biggest concern with the Etys is having no microphonic feedback on the cord, and good over the ear fit.


 
   
  The Symbiote cable is quite thick and I think with an ER4B, the Lune or Arete would be the best pairing from an ergonomic standpoint, although the SD is also good.  Are there components in the cable of the ER4B?
   
  Quote: 





anoxy said:


> Does anyone from Null Audio post here? The Arete cable pictured on their website is different than the one reviewed here. I just want to make sure which one I'm actually ordering.
> 
> This is what's on the website:
> 
> ...


 
   
  It is the same thing, mine just has a jacket on it.  The before Sept 1, 2010 cables from will fit a Westone socket.
   
  Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Yes, and just copper variety too. Sound travels on the outside, shouldn't have much of an effect that its not a silver core anyways


 
   
  The audio frequencies actually travel on the interior of the wire.  You have to go up to UHF (or is it VHF) to get the signal to travel on the skin.
  Quote: 





sonify said:


> One last interesting note before we veer off topic too much:
> 
> Taken from the Cardas Audio website: http://www.cardas.com/content.php?area=faqs&content_id=6&pagestring=Cable+Materials
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sometimes yes, sometimes no.  The Heir Audio cable, for example, is silver plated copper but sounds better than a stock cable while some silver plated copper Belden wire I tried at one point sounded worse than pure copper.


----------



## anoxy

Thanks for the responses average_joe. The Arete seems like a good deal, but I ordered the UERM cable first because it's 60 bucks less so I'll see how that works out.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> Thanks for the responses average_joe. The Arete seems like a good deal, but I ordered the UERM cable first because it's 60 bucks less so I'll see how that works out.


 
   
  OK, cool.  Let us know how you like the UERM cable.


----------



## anoxy

Just got the white UERM cable and my love for my ER4B has been restored! Perfect length, no microphonics, looks cool, fits around my ears, sounds great, and costs next to nothing. Glad I saw this thread before impulse buying a $200+ cable...


----------



## discretesound

Joe, can you compare between silver dragon and magnus mainly on the flexibility and the general ergonomics. Thanks!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> Just got the white UERM cable and my love for my ER4B has been restored! Perfect length, no microphonics, looks cool, fits around my ears, sounds great, and costs next to nothing. Glad I saw this thread before impulse buying a $200+ cable...


 
   
  Good to hear you got a good solution!  
   
  Quote: 





discretesound said:


> Joe, can you compare between silver dragon and magnus mainly on the flexibility and the general ergonomics. Thanks!


 
   
  The Silver Dragon has pretty good ergonomics and the flexibility is fine, but it is stiffer than the braided Magnus cable gets the same score as the UE cable, a 10.


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Hey Joe (or anyone else that can provide an opinion),
   
  I'm back on the cable road again for my TF10s. Just sold my Chris_Himself cable because I couldn't deal with the microphonics. It's a pity too, because that was a great sounding cable.
   
  Now I'm choosing between the Null Audio Arete, Lune, and this BTG cable if anyone has heard it: http://btg-audio.webs.com/webstore.htm#ecwid:category=2706350&mode=product&product=12596470
   
  I really loved how the CH cable brought out the mids very forward (I'm guessing that was the silver; too bad the silver was also what caused the microphonics). It seems that the Lune might be closer to that sound signature than the Arete? Seems like the Arete brings out the mids a bit too, but I'm guessing not as much? I have the UM3X too and I love the vocals on that, so if they can get to that point, I guess that's what I'm looking for.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Holymoly

I ordered the Lune and TWag Eclipse, I am yet to receive them.

I also considered the BTG cable but after doing some reading i found that he uses the same wires that are used within the Mogami 2893 microphone cable, I could not bring myself to buy an upgrade cable made with wires from a microphone cable.
The black sleeving also looks bulky for a IEM cable.


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





holymoly said:


> I ordered the Lune and TWag Eclipse, I am yet to receive them.
> I also considered the BTG cable but after doing some reading i found that he uses the same wires that are used within the Mogami 2893 microphone cable, I could not bring myself to buy an upgrade cable made with wires from a microphone cable.
> The black sleeving also looks bulky for a IEM cable.


 
   
  Hm yeah. I got back from Brian at BTG and he said that his cable doesn't fit the Triple.Fi. Too bad.
   
  The Lune cable looks quite thick too. Seems like it might have my preferred sound signature though.


----------



## KimChee

I've had the Arete cable, sonically it wasn't as detailed as the CH cable...I think the Arete is copper also..


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> I've had the Arete cable, sonically it wasn't as detailed as the CH cable...I think the Arete is copper also..


 
   
  Yeah, I think the Arete is copper too. But, I was thinking that the Lune cable might have the same microphonics problems as the CH cable if it's silver.


----------



## kenman345

Most of the microphonics came from the stiff solid core. Now CH cables uses a stranded variety, which should decrease the microphonics. Waiting a little before I order a new cable, but I should hopefully have some of the new wire soon.
  Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Yeah, I think the Arete is copper too. But, I was thinking that the Lune cable might have the same microphonics problems as the CH cable if it's silver.


----------



## InfiniteGene

Can anyone comments on the sound difference of a tf10 with TWag v2 om silver dragon... looking forward for reviews of Chrishimself stranded silver cable as well...


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Most of the microphonics came from the stiff solid core. Now CH cables uses a stranded variety, which should decrease the microphonics. Waiting a little before I order a new cable, but I should hopefully have some of the new wire soon.


 
   
  Yeah, I'm not sure if Chris has switched over yet.
   
  Might go for the Lune cable though; should have the dynamic sound I want.


----------



## kenman345

I believe he just recently got his order of cables in, or will be receiving them soon. I know they shipped from manufacturer like two weeks ago. Can't remember if he said they arrived. He did mention all orders that he receives now though will be getting the new cable. 
  Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Yeah, I'm not sure if Chris has switched over yet.
> 
> Might go for the Lune cable though; should have the dynamic sound I want.


----------



## Holymoly

kenman345 said:


> Most of the microphonics came from the stiff solid core. Now CH cables uses a stranded variety, which should decrease the microphonics. Waiting a little before I order a new cable, but I should hopefully have some of the new wire soon.




Looking at the site Chris himself says he has copper and silver plated wire coming which he will also sell by the foot and not silver like the solid silver wire they had.


----------



## kenman345

Yea, they changed up the type of wire. No more Solid core or Pure silver wire anymore. 
  Quote: 





holymoly said:


> Looking at the site Chris himself says he has copper and silver plated wire coming which he will also sell by the foot and not silver like the solid silver wire they had.


 
  EDIT: Just got an email. Chris_Himself's wire shipment has arrived.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Yeah, I'm not sure if Chris has switched over yet.
> 
> Might go for the Lune cable though; should have the dynamic sound I want.


 
   
  Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> I believe he just recently got his order of cables in, or will be receiving them soon. I know they shipped from manufacturer like two weeks ago. Can't remember if he said they arrived. He did mention all orders that he receives now though will be getting the new cable.


 
   
  Quote: 





holymoly said:


> Looking at the site Chris himself says he has copper and silver plated wire coming which he will also sell by the foot and not silver like the solid silver wire they had.


 
   
   
  Yeah it's here. You guys are free to contact me for pics of completed stuff with the new wire. I'm not sure I can reply with a picture even though you guys are talking about it. I've accidently broken the rules a couple times this month already and I want to stay on Head-Fi's good side 

 But yes it's very much here and the pre-tubed wire means it's quicker to build cables than ever. (seriously like 60% faster now)


----------



## kenman345

Glad to see you're moving away from that Jewelry wire (I kid of course). Can't wait to get a cable made with some of the shipment and compare between the old and the new
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Yeah it's here. You guys are free to contact me for pics of completed stuff with the new wire. I'm not sure I can reply with a picture even though you guys are talking about it. I've accidently broken the rules a couple times this month already and I want to stay on Head-Fi's good side
> 
> But yes it's very much here and the pre-tubed wire means it's quicker to build cables than ever. (seriously like 60% faster now)


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Yeah it's here. You guys are free to contact me for pics of completed stuff with the new wire. I'm not sure I can reply with a picture even though you guys are talking about it. I've accidently broken the rules a couple times this month already and I want to stay on Head-Fi's good side
> 
> But yes it's very much here and the pre-tubed wire means it's quicker to build cables than ever. (seriously like 60% faster now)


 
   
  Cool. Sent you a PM so not to break forum rules.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Glad to see you're moving away from that Jewelry wire (I kid of course). Can't wait to get a cable made with some of the shipment and compare between the old and the new


 
   
  It was never jewelry wire, it was actually some random yarn I found in my attic..
  Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Cool. Sent you a PM so not to break forum rules.


 
   
  Cool, cool, look forward to doing business wit cha


----------



## Holymoly

What thickness is this new wire. I read the last solid silver was 28.


----------



## kenman345

last solid silver was 26 AWG i believe. Pretty sure this new stuff is the same thickness
  Quote: 





holymoly said:


> What thickness is this new wire. I read the last solid silver was 28.


----------



## Holymoly

I read it was 28 in this review and other places http://www.head-fi.org/t/565912/review-triple-fi10-custom-silver-upgrade-cable-by-user-chris-himself


----------



## Spartanman2112

I'm really considering getting the Arete in black/white. I really love the look of it. Anyone recently purchase one or have some input for me?


----------



## Spartanman2112

Also, does anyone know what brand the double flange tips he is using are? I've been looking for some new tips to use while im at the gym


----------



## InfiniteGene

I'm looking for an alternative to CH cables as I liked how it sounded on my tf10 reshell but not the stiffness... 

Is there any alternative to it? Closest sounding to CH cables but with flexibility and good built??


----------



## kenman345

CH just got in new wire. More flexible and stranded. That may be an option. 
  Quote: 





infinitegene said:


> I'm looking for an alternative to CH cables as I liked how it sounded on my tf10 reshell but not the stiffness...
> Is there any alternative to it? Closest sounding to CH cables but with flexibility and good built??


 
  Check my sig for al IEM cables and reviews. Should be quite helpful to you.


----------



## InfiniteGene

I'm getting my tf10 back in mid Sep.. not sure how will the new CH cables will sound like as no demo set in Singapore yet...

Any idea if TWag comes close or excel further???


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





infinitegene said:


> I'm looking for an alternative to CH cables as I liked how it sounded on my tf10 reshell but not the stiffness...
> Is there any alternative to it? Closest sounding to CH cables but with flexibility and good built??


 

 It's 26AWG stranded OCC silver plated copper and OCC copper that I have.
   
  It all arrived on Monday. It's on our facebook page if you wanna have a look.


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





infinitegene said:


> I'm looking for an alternative to CH cables as I liked how it sounded on my tf10 reshell but not the stiffness...
> Is there any alternative to it? Closest sounding to CH cables but with flexibility and good built??


 
  Hows about these:
   
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultimate-Ears-UE-TF10-SF3-SF5-5EB-OCC-Pure-7N-Stranded-Silver-Upgrade-Cable-/120963846721?pt=UK_MP3_Player_Accessories_Cables_Adapters&hash=item1c2a01d241


----------



## Sonify

You seem to link to Toxic Cables every opportunity you get.
  Something seems a bit fishy.
   
  Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Hows about these:
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ultimate-Ears-UE-TF10-SF3-SF5-5EB-OCC-Pure-7N-Stranded-Silver-Upgrade-Cable-/120963846721?pt=UK_MP3_Player_Accessories_Cables_Adapters&hash=item1c2a01d241


----------



## Canadian411

Help me here, what you guy call the stiffer end of the cable section where it meet the socket ?
   
  I just bought the Fiio UETfi10 replacement cable and it's not stiff enough to bend around my ear, the cable is so flexible it doesn't shape.


----------



## kenman345

memory wire or the cable is molded is what i think you're talking about. Otherwise, it's just got nothing
  Quote: 





canadian411 said:


> Help me here, what you guy call the stiffer end of the cable section where it meet the socket ?
> 
> I just bought the Fiio UETfi10 replacement cable and it's not stiff enough to bend around my ear, the cable is so flexible it doesn't shape.


----------



## Canadian411

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> memory wire or the cable is molded is what i think you're talking about. Otherwise, it's just got nothing


 
   
  Thanks, probably the molded rubber/cable ? 
  Do you guys know anywhere I can buy this ? my Fiio cable doesn't come with this mold.


----------



## kenman345

It's not something usually added on afterwards. Lunashops should have some that comes with its pins, might even have it separate. Main thing is you can take heat shrink (available at stores like radioshack) and heat it in a mold to form it to the shape around your ear.
  Quote: 





canadian411 said:


> Thanks, probably the molded rubber/cable ?
> Do you guys know anywhere I can buy this ? my Fiio cable doesn't come with this mold.


----------



## Canadian411

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> It's not something usually added on afterwards. Lunashops should have some that comes with its pins, might even have it separate. Main thing is you can take heat shrink (available at stores like radioshack) and heat it in a mold to form it to the shape around your ear.


 
   
  Ok, that's probably the weekend project   Thank you very much !!!.


----------



## Toxic Cables

You can also purchase ear guides, i had some come with my IE80.


----------



## Canadian411

Quote: 





toxic cables said:


> You can also purchase ear guides, i had some come with my IE80.


 
   
  Oh that will work too !, thanks ! and thanks guys for giving me pms and replies.


----------



## Rp4k

very nice review , thank you for doing this.


----------



## Rp4k

Quote: 





canadian411 said:


> Thanks, probably the molded rubber/cable ?
> Do you guys know anywhere I can buy this ? my Fiio cable doesn't come with this mold.


 
  you could probably make that yourself if you had the time, buy some transparent heatshrink then use a 1200w hairdryer  to shrink the tubing onto the selected area.  they say that for durability you can also heat shrink more then one time. so maybe do two coats.


----------



## MLW75

Average Joe...I have been lurking around these forums for a while and made a few recent purchases based on reviews done by you (thank you by the way) but have a question. I just bought the JH16 and also purchased the Chris Himself cable but now am looking for a player suitable for this combination. At the moment I am using my Shure 535 and a galaxy s3, as you can see I stepped up my game a little. I am currently looking at the iBasso DX100 for a player cause it looks like a good all in one but your comment of its "brighter with a less organic/more digital feel to the sound" is keeping me from pulling the trigger. Not sure if this would be a good combo...your thoughts?


----------



## average_joe

I updated to the DX100 firmware to 1.1.7 (I think) and it is now a good deal better than the 801 and is more natural sounding.


----------



## kryten123

Quote: 





mlw75 said:


> Average Joe...I have been lurking around these forums for a while and made a few recent purchases based on reviews done by you (thank you by the way) but have a question. I just bought the JH16 and also purchased the Chris Himself cable but now am looking for a player suitable for this combination. At the moment I am using my Shure 535 and a galaxy s3, as you can see I stepped up my game a little. I am currently looking at the iBasso DX100 for a player cause it looks like a good all in one but your comment of its "brighter with a less organic/more digital feel to the sound" is keeping me from pulling the trigger. Not sure if this would be a good combo...your thoughts?


 
   


 @MLW75, I have the JH16 and the DX100 but just the stock cable (although I am considering upgrading the cable to a Chris Himself) and I can vouch for it being a good combination. The sound can at times be bright but not harshly so and I found my Cowon J3 to be brighter. I've tended to notice the over brightness with the odd song\album, which leads me to think that its more likely the song mastering and the revealing nature of the JH16, rather than the JH16\DX100 combo.
   
  The thing I would say with the DX100 is that even though it is an Android player and can technically run apps, I would stick to using it just as a DAP. Make sure it boots fully before you try to play any music ie give it a minute or two to settle down as the firmware and Andriod OS version can be a bit flakey.
  Install a Task Killer and kill everything but the music player before you start playing. Also I would stay on firmware 1.1.7 for now as 1.2.3 seems to mess with the sound. I play my music(FLAC) with all EQ turned off and it sounds amazing.


----------



## KimChee

Soooo I got my Chris Himself/HPL OCC Copper cable today that I'm using with my Triple Fi 10 custom.  The cable looks great, I think visually it is better looking wire than the older wire.  Ergonomically, it is flexible, much better than the old solid core wire.  The sound is great, it is detailed, but not bright like silver can sometimes be.  Definately added clarity and bass weight, without being too energetic sounding, which is what I was going for very natural.  There are times I don't want all the energy, but still want the detail, and this is where I feel like going with a high quality copper wire was a good choice..There are no microphonics, and no interference.  One thing that was really annoying me about my Twag Eclipse cable was I got a lot of interference, and I'm not getting that with the CH cable.  
   
  I will be getting a Hybrid cable soon to use with my JH16, I'm excited..love the wood accents it really adds a touch of class.


----------



## Toxic Cables

Piccolino IEM cables, and my new 7N OCC stranded Silver cable "Anthrax", now available at promotional pricing, starting at only £120.
   
  We are an authorised dealer for, Piccolino by Crystal Cable.
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/609155/toxic-cables-the-appreciation-thread/585#post_8756008


----------



## PhoenixClaw

average_joe (or anyone with a Silver Dragon cable), since the Silver Dragons don't have earguides, how well do they hold over-ear? Or do they keep falling out? I'd appreciate it if anyone can answer this as I am looking to get one for my ASG-1s


----------



## KimChee

Hey joe are you planning to review the new headphone lounge cables?  Interested to hear your take on them?  Also some of the 8 conductor cables from Toxic and Whiplash.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Hey joe are you planning to review the new headphone lounge cables?  Interested to hear your take on them?  Also some of the 8 conductor cables from Toxic and Whiplash.


 
   
  I think were gonna send him a set but he's a pretty busy guy so it might be a while...


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





phoenixclaw said:


> average_joe (or anyone with a Silver Dragon cable), since the Silver Dragons don't have earguides, how well do they hold over-ear? Or do they keep falling out? I'd appreciate it if anyone can answer this as I am looking to get one for my ASG-1s


 
   
  For me, it stays fine, but then I don't usually have issue with most cables without memory wire including many universal IEMs (and their stock cables).  They aren't as secure as something with memory wire, but then the weight of the cable keeps them in place for me.
   
  Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Hey joe are you planning to review the new headphone lounge cables?  Interested to hear your take on them?  Also some of the 8 conductor cables from Toxic and Whiplash.


 
   
  See below...
    
  Quote:


chris_himself said:


> I think were gonna send him a set but he's a pretty busy guy so it might be a while...


 
   
  Yes, busy, but trying to work on reviews of various gear I have had for a while.  I can't promise review times however, but things are slowly churning.  And a big thank you!


----------



## average_joe

I have added the new Whiplash Hybrid V3 and TWag V3 to the first post (bottom of the post).  Check them out!


----------



## KimChee

Thanks for the update joe..that Twag hybrid v3 cable looks amazing!  Must...not..buy..ugh.


----------



## kenman345

New Aftermarket cable list is up. Still have a few tweaks I wanna do to it. http://www.head-fi.org/t/633501/aftermarket-iem-cable-list-work-in-progress
   
  Thanks for the new reviews. Almost didn't even realize those cables were out. Was just on Whiplash Audio's website a few days ago looking at cables.
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I have added the new Whiplash Hybrid V3 and TWag V3 to the first post (bottom of the post).  Check them out!


----------



## nc8000

I have been using TWag cables from Whiplash since I got my JH13 nearly 3 years ago and have gone through all the versions and generations and both my HE500 and my now sold Ed8 were done with TWag V2. About a month ago Craig wrote me to tell me about the upcomming V3 cable and asked if I would like to try it and naturally I said yes. I have received 2 cables (single ended and balanced) for my JH13 plus a caps lod for my Whipmod. I have been using the single ended version for about 2 weeks (the balanced only arrived today so no impreesion on that yet). So my first comparison was my balanced V2 versus the single ended V3 out of the balanced and single ended outputs of the SR71-B. To sum up my impression what I get with V3 single ended is nearly all the effects I got with V2 balanced plus some. I get the grater control over the bass region and that in turn gives more room for the midrange and the treble, actually I think that the midrange is a little more prominent with the V3 than it is with V2 and the treble has slightly more sparkle. What the single ended version does not give is the darker background and lower noisefloor of the balanced version but I fully expect to get that on top of all the rest once I get to try the balanced V3. As I understand it the price is going to be comparable to the old V2 procing while the prices for V2 are going to drop. It is still expensive cable but I'm sure that I'm going to order the OM version once it is avaiable as I don't like the memory wire on the non OM version (never have like memory wire in the least bit)


----------



## tomscy2000

So, Whiplash is getting into the much-ballyhooed, 1% gold rukus as well, now?


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> So, Whiplash is getting into the much-ballyhooed, 1% gold rukus as well, now?


 
   It would seem so.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> New Aftermarket cable list is up. Still have a few tweaks I wanna do to it. http://www.head-fi.org/t/633501/aftermarket-iem-cable-list-work-in-progress
> 
> Thanks for the new reviews. Almost didn't even realize those cables were out. Was just on Whiplash Audio's website a few days ago looking at cables.


 
   
  Yes, and they are extremely nice (as I am sure you can tell from my review).  I also added a link to your thread in the first post, thanks for the work!
   
  Quote: 





nc8000 said:


> I have been using TWag cables from Whiplash since I got my JH13 nearly 3 years ago and have gone through all the versions and generations and both my HE500 and my now sold Ed8 were done with TWag V2. About a month ago Craig wrote me to tell me about the upcomming V3 cable and asked if I would like to try it and naturally I said yes. I have received 2 cables (single ended and balanced) for my JH13 plus a caps lod for my Whipmod. I have been using the single ended version for about 2 weeks (the balanced only arrived today so no impreesion on that yet). So my first comparison was my balanced V2 versus the single ended V3 out of the balanced and single ended outputs of the SR71-B. To sum up my impression what I get with V3 single ended is nearly all the effects I got with V2 balanced plus some. I get the grater control over the bass region and that in turn gives more room for the midrange and the treble, actually I think that the midrange is a little more prominent with the V3 than it is with V2 and the treble has slightly more sparkle. What the single ended version does not give is the darker background and lower noisefloor of the balanced version but I fully expect to get that on top of all the rest once I get to try the balanced V3. As I understand it the price is going to be comparable to the old V2 procing while the prices for V2 are going to drop. It is still expensive cable but I'm sure that I'm going to order the OM version once it is avaiable as I don't like the memory wire on the non OM version (never have like memory wire in the least bit)


 
   
  Thanks for sharing.  The V3 does improve upon the V2 in tangible ways, and I agree with your assessment of the cable except I think the V2 TWag is a bit brighter than the V3 with most of my CIEMs.  The price of the V2 will drop but there were some issues with Craig's site that he is working on resolving.
   
   


tomscy2000 said:


> So, Whiplash is getting into the much-ballyhooed, 1% gold rukus as well, now?


 
   
  I haven't heard that cable so I can't comment, but I was actually skeptical about the Hybrid V3, and upon first listen with the PRM I wasn't impressed.  Turns out I forgot the positive pin of the PRM is on the bottom, so I had the PRM hooked up with an opposite polarity and once I got that right the improvement of the cable was apparent.  But, cables are also about synergy as the Hybrid V3 makes the NT-6 sound so much better I was stunned.  It went from reference design that had some musicality to a musical sound that was reference quality all the while improving the already great clarity, detail, and presentation within the soundstage.  When something as good as the NT-6 is improved, and the amount of improvement I heard, I am genuinely impressed.

 Some CIEMs don't react well to certain cables such as the Rooth LS8 as many cables actually make the soundstage less 3D than the stock cable, but the TWag V3 improved the sound overall while I don't think the V2 is a match due to the changes in the soundstage proportions.  I really don't have any reason to be skeptical about changes cables make and let my ears be the judge.  Craig said the TWag Gold sounds different than the regular TWag, so I would tend to believe him and want to hear it, time permitting.  Changes in resistance, capacitance, and inductance do affect the nuances in the music to my ears, which is what high-end audio is all about!


----------



## kenman345

It's the people like you that make the list I do possible. If it were not for the inspiration by the involved members of this community, I never would have made my list public, after it originally formed from me doing research for the upcoming purchase of an aftermarket IEM cable. I'm glad so many people enjoy it. I am currently in the aftermath's of a hurricane to hit my area, and this it the first time I have been able to be online in 24 hours. When everything is settled down, I will begin again on revising the list to include memory wire or not information for each cable. I started a few days ago contacting some manufacturers and am awaiting some more responses and to figure out things in the regular world before I go ahead and make a massive update. 
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Yes, and they are extremely nice (as I am sure you can tell from my review).  I also added a link to your thread in the first post, thanks for the work!


----------



## Xymordos

Joe, if I want to change a cable for my UERM, for example, a Westone cable, do I have to flip the connector upside down?


----------



## CharliePolk

Thanks for your reviews, it's great to consider some cable for my ear phone.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> It's the people like you that make the list I do possible. If it were not for the inspiration by the involved members of this community, I never would have made my list public, after it originally formed from me doing research for the upcoming purchase of an aftermarket IEM cable. I'm glad so many people enjoy it. I am currently in the aftermath's of a hurricane to hit my area, and this it the first time I have been able to be online in 24 hours. When everything is settled down, I will begin again on revising the list to include memory wire or not information for each cable. I started a few days ago contacting some manufacturers and am awaiting some more responses and to figure out things in the regular world before I go ahead and make a massive update.


 
   
  Well wishes to all those affected by the hurricane.  
   
  Glad I have that effect and can help people to enjoy their gear at a higher level and glad I helped you with your list!
   
  Quote: 





xymordos said:


> Joe, if I want to change a cable for my UERM, for example, a Westone cable, do I have to flip the connector upside down?


 
   
  The positive pin, which is the one with the dot on the Westone cables, should be facing the ground when the CIEM is worn.
   
  Quote: 





charliepolk said:


> Thanks for your reviews, it's great to consider some cable for my ear phone.


 
   
  You are welcome.  Let me (us) know if you have any questions.


----------



## nc8000

I have now had som time with the balanced TWag V3 and yes going balanced gives another step up in performance as I expected it would. However the diference between single ende and balanced V3 is much smaller than the difference between single ended and balanced V2. In fact single ended V3 is probably 2/3 of the way to balanced V2 and even surpasses it in some areas and balanced V3 is probably only 1/3 again over balanced V2. So it seems that Craig has really done something right with this new cable


----------



## average_joe

Thanks for sharing nc8000.  I started a review comparing SE, balanced, and my Anedio D1 with various CIEMs I own and found that balanced didn't always improve the sound.  However, that might be the implementation of the 801 balanced card, so I am still awaiting time to explore balanced vs. SE further.
   
  However, from your post it does seem like cables can make great overall improvements.


----------



## average_joe

Coming in 4-5 weeks time, the OM versions of the TWag and TWcu V3...


----------



## kenman345

Wonderful.....another cable to add to the list....No worries. Looking forward to your review
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Coming in 4-5 weeks time, the OM versions of the TWag and TWcu V3...


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Wonderful.....another cable to add to the list....No worries. Looking forward to your review


 
   
  These are just the OM versions...the shell connector has a plastic mold vs the epoxy one.


----------



## PhoenixClaw

I just got the Silver Dragons last monday and I find that they pair quite well with the ASG-1s. I wasn't expecting a very noticeable difference but it was very clear that the SD improved clarity throughout and brought the treble forward. I won't exaggerate and say that they transform the ASG-1s, but I would say that they give that much needed push to truly make them shine. I've since stopped using EQ when using them.
   
  It's really interesting for me because I was halfway through a song when I replaced the cables and when I let the music continue playing that's when I noticed the differences. Honestly I didn't expect a change at all.


----------



## nc8000

average_joe said:


> Thanks for sharing nc8000.  I started a review comparing SE, balanced, and my Anedio D1 with various CIEMs I own and found that balanced didn't always improve the sound.  However, that might be the implementation of the 801 balanced card, so I am still awaiting time to explore balanced vs. SE further.
> 
> However, from your post it does seem like cables can make great overall improvements.




The difference balancing makes varies greatly from phone to phone, for some the difference is very small and for others it is quite noticeable. 

Another interesting point is burn-in of cables. I have been fairly sceptical about this but last year I had an aha experience. I had ordered a number of cables from Whiplash when the black version of V2 came out but by mistake he send me a clear one for HE-500. He promissed me to send a black one and did so a month later. I replaced it on the phones and heard a distinct difference which I absolutely did not expect, after all the only difference was supposed to be the insulation colour. I wrote Craig and asked and his answer was interesting "I was wondering if you would notice. I have invested heavily in burn-in equipment so all my cables now come with about 500 hours of burn-in". So what I was hearing was the difference between the 50 or so hours of use on the clear cable versus the 500+ hours on the black. 

And I'm so waiting for the OM V3 as I hate the memory wire on the version I have now, have never gotten on with memory wire


----------



## tupac0306

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Coming in 4-5 weeks time, the OM versions of the TWag and TWcu V3...


 
  They look great. But is TWcu V3 supposed to be thicker than that or this is just 4 conductors? They do OM version of TWcu V3? that's cool.


----------



## kenman345

That's extremely interesting in the case for burn-in of cables. Kinda wish more companies for cables did that, so you have a well burnt in product that also has little to no wear to it when it sounds its best. I think a major case against cable burn in is people mishandling their cables throughout the time it takes to burn them in so the actual cable is deteriorating in quality physically while it is getting burned in
  Quote: 





nc8000 said:


> The difference balancing makes varies greatly from phone to phone, for some the difference is very small and for others it is quite noticeable.
> Another interesting point is burn-in of cables. I have been fairly sceptical about this but last year I had an aha experience. I had ordered a number of cables from Whiplash when the black version of V2 came out but by mistake he send me a clear one for HE-500. He promissed me to send a black one and did so a month later. I replaced it on the phones and heard a distinct difference which I absolutely did not expect, after all the only difference was supposed to be the insulation colour. I wrote Craig and asked and his answer was interesting "I was wondering if you would notice. I have invested heavily in burn-in equipment so all my cables now come with about 500 hours of burn-in". So what I was hearing was the difference between the 50 or so hours of use on the clear cable versus the 500+ hours on the black.
> And I'm so waiting for the OM V3 as I hate the memory wire on the version I have now, have never gotten on with memory wire


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





nc8000 said:


> The difference balancing makes varies greatly from phone to phone, for some the difference is very small and for others it is quite noticeable.
> Another interesting point is burn-in of cables. I have been fairly sceptical about this but last year I had an aha experience. I had ordered a number of cables from Whiplash when the black version of V2 came out but by mistake he send me a clear one for HE-500. He promissed me to send a black one and did so a month later. I replaced it on the phones and heard a distinct difference which I absolutely did not expect, after all the only difference was supposed to be the insulation colour. I wrote Craig and asked and his answer was interesting "I was wondering if you would notice. I have invested heavily in burn-in equipment so all my cables now come with about 500 hours of burn-in". So what I was hearing was the difference between the 50 or so hours of use on the clear cable versus the 500+ hours on the black.
> And I'm so waiting for the OM V3 as I hate the memory wire on the version I have now, have never gotten on with memory wire


 
   
  Burn in does have a profound effect in my experience, and silver changes more than copper.  I have found 200 to 300 hours is quite good for many silver cables.  I remember getting my first TWag cable and it sounded bad until about 100 hours and then it started to sound much better but kept improving.
   
  Quote: 





tupac0306 said:


> They look great. But is TWcu V3 supposed to be thicker than that or this is just 4 conductors? They do OM version of TWcu V3? that's cool.


 
   
  There is an 8 conductor TWcu V3, but this is the OM version.  Making the thicker cables such as an 8 conductor an OM cable is difficult due to the thicker cable.
   
  http://www.whiplashaudio.com/cables/headphone-cables/new-twcu-v3-om-pre-order.html


----------



## tomscy2000

I'm guessing 24 AWG is about as thick as it gets for being able to do overmolded connectors...


----------



## tupac0306

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> There is an 8 conductor TWcu V3, but this is the OM version.  Making the thicker cables such as an 8 conductor an OM cable is difficult due to the thicker cable.
> 
> http://www.whiplashaudio.com/cables/headphone-cables/new-twcu-v3-om-pre-order.html


 
  But the copper cable picture you showed is 4 conductor right? (8 conductor one should be twice as thick) Is it even possible to do a 8 conductor with an OM connectors?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





tupac0306 said:


> But the copper cable picture you showed is 4 conductor right? (8 conductor one should be twice as thick) Is it even possible to do a 8 conductor with an OM connectors?


 
   
  Yes, the OM is on a 4 conductor cable.  Craig is trying to perfect the OM for the 8 wire cables.


----------



## CharliePolk

Hi Joe and everybody ,

 I found a problem on my Twag v2 eclipes, it's not about the sound but my cable have something wrong. the head plug is bend so when I insert my westone on socket the joint of the cable were loose.  Does anyone have a good suggestion to resolve this problem , I'm worried to damage on my cable.

 Thanks you.


----------



## average_joe

Hi CharliePolk, I am not sure I understand the issue properly.  Would you be able to upload a picture?  Once that is done, I (or another knowledgeable head-fier) should be able to help.


----------



## Juvenall

Ergonomics aside, I seem torn between the Chris_himself cable and the Whiplash TWag v3. Do you have any thoughts on the sound quality comparison between these two for someone upgrading from a stock cable for the JH16s?


----------



## kenman345

No reviews that I am aware of yet have the latest wire type from Chris_Himself. You may wish to wait if you were hoping for more flexibility with Chris_Himself cables. I know it's supposed to be more flexible but havent read any reviews about it yet.
  Quote: 





juvenall said:


> Ergonomics aside, I seem torn between the Chris_himself cable and the Whiplash TWag v3. Do you have any thoughts on the sound quality comparison between these two for someone upgrading from a stock cable for the JH16s?


----------



## ostewart

In you opinion, what's the best cable for the Alclair reference monitor, preferably under $150


----------



## Juvenall

kenman345 said:


> No reviews that I am aware of yet have the latest wire type from Chris_Himself. You may wish to wait if you were hoping for more flexibility with Chris_Himself cables. I know it's supposed to be more flexible but havent read any reviews about it yet.




Yeah, which is totally fair. I went ahead and pulled the trigger on some from Chris (balanced for my sexy new RSA Intruder), so hopefully it's the new wires and they're at least as good as the old ones with improved ergonomics. If I'm lucky, they'll show up soon (my stock cable is full of fail at the moment) and I'll gladly toss up my thoughts when they show up. I'm also tempted to buy the TWag v3 on top of it, then try to sell off the one I like the least.


----------



## Chris_Himself

juvenall said:


> Yeah, which is totally fair. I went ahead and pulled the trigger on some from Chris (balanced for my sexy new RSA Intruder), so hopefully it's the new wires and they're at least as good as the old ones with improved ergonomics. If I'm lucky, they'll show up soon (my stock cable is full of fail at the moment) and I'll gladly toss up my thoughts when they show up. I'm also tempted to buy the TWag v3 on top of it, then try to sell off the one I like the least.




If your name is Brian, yeah we gotcha taken care of bro.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





ostewart said:


> In you opinion, what's the best cable for the Alclair reference monitor, preferably under $150


 
   
  I tried the TWag V2 with the Alclair Reference and the improvement to the soundstage and presentation was quite large, but it will depend on the tracks and source.  The space becomes much more 3D and the overall quality of the presentation takes a good step up with more smoothness and air.  
   
  As far as the Chris_Himself cables, I don't have the new ones, but the old one with solid wire performed close to the TWag.  I would have tried the Arete, but the shell connectors don't work with the recessed sockets on my Reference.


----------



## ostewart

Sounds like I'll get a chris himself cable, or make my own with toxic cables SPC


----------



## hyogen

I have a new Chris himself (headphone lounge) cable for sale in my sig, not sure what its worth but make me an offer .


----------



## Chris_Himself

average_joe said:


> As far as the Chris_Himself cables, I don't have the new ones, but the old one with solid wire performed close to the TWag.




Thats quite a complement, thank you Joe.


----------



## Juvenall

My new Chris_Himself cable came in today, but sadly, my JH16s are off at JH Audio's lab for repair (slight channel imbalance and a well needed cleaning), so I don't have much to contribute in regards to sound quality just yet.

For the build, however, the cable feels very thoughtfully constructed; no half-assed work here. Against the stock cable, it is ever so slightly thicker, but not out of place or bulky. I don't have enough knowledge to know if this is the result of my choice of a balanced connection or not, but I can say this extra thickness won't bother me one bit. In fact, the difference so small, I wasn't even sure it was worth mentioning here. It does feel a good bit more rigid than the stock cable in that when dropping the connection end against my shirt, it's not as fluid, but still falling generally where I'd expect it to. The ear guide/memory wire portion is quite a bit longer than the standard stock cable from JH Audio. I'm betting that'll be a nice bonus, too, but I can't say for sure until my 16s come back and I can fully try it out.

For aesthetics, the "Silverray" is far brighter in color tone than I was expecting, which for me, is a positive thing. I feel it really gives the cable a great look, even though it won't really match the darker tones of my 16s. I suppose more cable coloring options would be nice, but given the price point, I'm not going to complain one bit here. Speaking of expectations, the wood y-splitter and cinch (an oblong cylinder and skull, by request, respectively) were far smaller than any of the pictures implied. This was one of my big fears around this cable as I was expecting these items to be a bulky pain to deal with. instead, they share a footprint on par with a US dime and give an otherwise great looking cable a little splash of awesomesauce. 

The cable aside, from order to delivery it took less than a week for it to show up. Considering the nature of this type of work, that's damn impressive in my book. Chris was pleasant to deal with, but considering expectations with email, was very slow to respond (a day or more). To be perfectly honest, part of the reason I was asking about another cable in this thread was Chris's slow-ish reply to my initial email (to be fair, it was a weekend and where I work, emails are returned in hours, so my bar may be too high). Thankfully, Ted, the cable maker, noticed my post, and once I sent him the info, got right to work and was extremely responsive, knowledgeable, and friendly. He had my cable ready for me fast and shipped it off just as quickly. If Chris could step up his game a little here, I see no reason why anyone wouldn't pick up one of these cables. 

For now, I'm stuck with a well built, great looking cable that I can't use until JH Audio sees fit to send my IEMs back, but my experience with Chris/Ted/HeadphoneLounge thus far has been great and if the quality reviews on the old cable hold with the new material, this will be an awesome addition to my growing high end collection.


----------



## KimChee

I just got Toxic Cables Scorpion cable, the 24 AWG version, and I am very impressed. This is definately my favorite cable for my JH16, and Ive tried the Whiplash Twag V2, Headphone Lounge solid core cable, Headphone Lounge Copper cable, and the Headphone Lounge Hybrid.  I also have experience with DHC Nucleotide cable, and the Null audio Arete and Lune cables. The increase in clarity, SS depth, and details in the all frequencies is impressive. I'm definately a fan of Toxic Cables now! I really like the thicker guage of the cable, and it very much eyecandy, very well braided and quite flexible for such a large guage.
   
  The flexibility is great I've read some reviews that said it was stiffer than the Twag V2 Eclipse but I find it to be the same in flexibility. It's a lot more flexible than I thought it would be given its a thicker cable.
   
  Ive done some more critical listening with my Scorpion, it by far has the most bass impact and quantity of any cable I have tried. It still retains the texture, headroom, and detail in the bass that I love about my JH16. The soundstage depth definately adds to the note thickness and there is a liquidity that is added to the midrange that I didn't notice before. I generally prefer a very neutral midrange, but the midrange is definately sweetened up in a good way. Treble has a little better extension and sparkle. All this with gains is SS width, depth, and clarity increase. I'm thinking about getting an over the head set of headphones just so I can fit it with a Scorpion lol.


----------



## kenyee

so my triple.fi 5 cables finally gave out on me and I'm looking for replacements, but I haven't seen much mention of durability.

Anyone use 3rd party cables for commuting and have to coil/uncoil them twice a day? My UE cables maybe lasted 9 months from doing this and stuffing them into a Shure case 

If anyone gets Chris/Headphonelounges new cables w/ the stranded wire, please post a report as well...from the solid wire version's review, they sounded like a good candidate though reliability might be worrisome if the review copy had issues...missed hyogen's cable sale posting by a week


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kenyee said:


> so my triple.fi 5 cables finally gave out on me and I'm looking for replacements, but I haven't seen much mention of durability.
> Anyone use 3rd party cables for commuting and have to coil/uncoil them twice a day? My UE cables maybe lasted 9 months from doing this and stuffing them into a Shure case
> If anyone gets Chris/Headphonelounges new cables w/ the stranded wire, please post a report as well...from the solid wire version's review, they sounded like a good candidate though reliability might be worrisome if the review copy had issues...missed hyogen's cable sale posting by a week


 
   
  Durability depends greatly on usage including pulling, twisting, etc.  While the Arete cable may be thin, the over braid should provide some good protection.  I haven't seen the new CH cables which might be great, but my experience with solid core wire (I used to make solid core silver LODs) doesn't make me feel as strongly about the durability as stranded wire.


----------



## kenman345

CH wires should be nice and more durable than ever considering the stranded wires inside it over the solid thick core they used to have. Still yet to see any reviews of them yet. 
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Durability depends greatly on usage including pulling, twisting, etc.  While the Arete cable may be thin, the over braid should provide some good protection.  I haven't seen the new CH cables which might be great, but my experience with solid core wire (I used to make solid core silver LODs) doesn't make me feel as strongly about the durability as stranded wire.


 
  kenyee, if you didn't already know, check out the link in my signature for a list of all aftermarket IEM cables, any cables are out there and I have links to reviews for each cable, where reviews exist that is.


----------



## SursumCorda

I have an old Chris_Himself wire and for the price, it was a great deal. It was pretty hassle-free experience putting in the order and getting them too. I agree with Average_Joe, it's a great wire to grab if you want to step out see if this whole "wire" business does anything for your ears. The old solid wire was a hassle, but it made my JH16 sound noticeably better from the stock cables. It got to the point where I didn't want to hook my stock cables back onto the JH16 despite the care that had to be taken of the solid wire! (Granted, the length I ordered was too long to be reasonable on the move, it was more for desk work.)
   
  The '_problem_' is that I started looking for a bigger fix. That is why I recently received a V3 Hybrid 8 connector from Whiplash Audio... Craig was very helpful and friendly through the whole order process, and his replies were prompt even as he was snowed under with V3/Au wire orders. I want to say, this Hybrid wire really opened up my JH16 in a whole new way. It was expensive, but an expense that was worth it to me. I was questioning whether it would be, but that was before I hooked it up to my JH16. Unfortunately it makes me want to get an NT6... This wire must be a great conductor as I have to use a lower volume with the same CIEM for the same amount of sound... I'd go on, but Average_Joes review on page one is better than mine could be. If you want one "super wire," the V3 Hybrid is definitely worth considering...
   
  I'm not associated in any way with Whiplash or Headphone Lounge, but both of these wires have improved my audio experience so I wanted to give a shout out to both of them.
 Thanks again for this thread Joe.
  Cheers guys~! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Now back to the listening~


----------



## hiyobeats

Quote: 





kenyee said:


> so my triple.fi 5 cables finally gave out on me and I'm looking for replacements, but I haven't seen much mention of durability.
> Anyone use 3rd party cables for commuting and have to coil/uncoil them twice a day? My UE cables maybe lasted 9 months from doing this and stuffing them into a Shure case
> If anyone gets Chris/Headphonelounges new cables w/ the stranded wire, please post a report as well...from the solid wire version's review, they sounded like a good candidate though reliability might be worrisome if the review copy had issues...missed hyogen's cable sale posting by a week


 
  I'm on the same boat. I actually decided to buy a pair of Monster iSports instead of a new replacement cable (or the Klipsch X10), because I primarily use my IEMs for working out. Finally got around to testing the iSports and it is plain junk. Feels cheap and plasticky and the sound, although decent (better than stock Apple buds), is nowhere near compared the the TripleFi. However, I will say that I love the stock cable from it. It's super light, super thin, and no-bs tangle free. With that going away and the X10 returning to normal price, it looks like I'll be considering buying a replacement cable again.
   
  I've been doing alot of reading/researching and probably order from Chris. I just have a bunch of questions about specifics that I haven't gotten around to asking yet. (taking the LSAT in two days...)


----------



## kenyee

average_joe said:


> Durability depends greatly on usage including pulling, twisting, etc.  While the Arete cable may be thin, the over braid should provide some good protection.




Think the Arete w/o the black overbraid shield would coil up into something 2.5" diameter and .75" high? I have an old Shure PA235 travel case I stuff the TF10 into. CH doesn't think the new cables would be able to be coiled up that small


----------



## kenyee

FYI, Ted sent me a photo of the new CH cables...looks as flexible as the Arete ones.  The Arete folks also confirmed it'll coil down to 2.5" diameter and .75" high...decisions, decisions...


----------



## kenyee

BTW, for yucks, this is what the stock UE TF10 cables looked like at the break...there was enough to solder together so I can research cables a bit more...


----------



## hiyobeats

Doing some more reading on CH cables. Can anyone explain what the difference between copper/silver/hyrbid wires are? Not really sure what the differences are.


----------



## SursumCorda

Quote: 





hiyobeats said:


> Doing some more reading on CH cables. Can anyone explain what the difference between copper/silver/hyrbid wires are? Not really sure what the differences are.


 
   
*The Silver Ray cable* is stranded occ copper wire coated with high purity silver with teflon insulation.
*The Hybrid Ray* cable uses both stranded silver plated occ copper wire with teflon insulation and stranded occ copper wire with teflon insulation.
*The Copper Ray* uses stranded occ copper wire with teflon insulation.

 A lot of people like silver wire because it makes the sound stage/imaging better and helps tighten up the sound. Basically, it gives greater definition, but it's not "warm" sounding like copper is, and the bass can have less punch/oomph. One way people try to overcome this is by having one(or more) wires be silver, and one (or more) be copper. That way you get the nice top end and tightness, and a bit more oomph.

I am assuming that Chris actually mean to write that the Silver ray is a SILVER wire... not silver coated copper. Since his link about IEM cables talks about silver wire here.
_EDIT: Since making this post I've been notified that Headphone lounge has since moved away from solid silver to a silver-coated copper for their main wire for increased flexibility/better sound. They have silver and 1% gold wire, but you have to ask for it. Talk to them for the specifics on strengths/weaknesses of each. _
   
_If you are a "believer" in cables affecting sound (after getting the Whiplash Hybrid V3, I am a big believer in cables affecting sound!) In essence;_
*- Silver Ray (highs) -* Better sound stage/imaging. Better highs/top end. The low end may feel less punchy/more tight but less warm and impactful.
 (_EDIT: This remains the same... but pure silver does this more than silver-coated copper.)_
  
*- Hybrid Ray (both) -* In a perfect world, this should be the best of silver and copper. Good highs and warm lows. It's probably just going to be "better" but if you want clearer sound or more emphasis on top or bottom then chose the silver or copper wire.
  
*- Copper Ray (lows) - *Usually this is the cable type that comes with IEMs, though the quality of copper is not always that high. It's warm, friendly, can be fuzzy and less clear, smaller soundstage but very warm and musical. Good copper makes improves the soundstage/imaging, but not as much as silver...
   

 What do you want to emphasize? Go for that...
_NOTE: I have not listened to the new CH cables. This is surmise on His old Silver Ray and other wires/posts around this place._


----------



## hiyobeats

Quote: 





sursumcorda said:


> *The Silver Ray cable* is stranded occ copper wire coated with high purity silver with teflon insulation.
> *The Hybrid Ray* cable uses both stranded silver plated occ copper wire with teflon insulation and stranded occ copper wire with teflon insulation.
> *The Copper Ray* uses stranded occ copper wire with teflon insulation.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks so much for this detailed explanation! Hm... might consider going silver seeing how I'm going through an EDM phase right now.


----------



## IGarrettS

I am guessing that most, if not all, of these cables could be made with four, two pronged IEM connectors instead of the standard two with two prongs. Id love to be able to use these with the JH3a system.


----------



## fuzzyash

igarretts said:


> I am guessing that most, if not all, of these cables could be made with four, two pronged IEM connectors instead of the standard two with two prongs. Id love to be able to use these with the JH3a system.




whiplash has something for the jh3a system


----------



## cogsand gears

Quote: 





igarretts said:


> I am guessing that most, if not all, of these cables could be made with four, two pronged IEM connectors instead of the standard two with two prongs. Id love to be able to use these with the JH3a system.


 
  Love the design on those CIEM's! Yours?
  Quote: 





fuzzyash said:


> whiplash has something for the jh3a system


 
  Toxic Cables make for the JH3a also - upon request.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Thanks for the kind words yall. I can do cables for JH3a upon request. It's just not that popular of a termination so it's not up on my page.


----------



## SACD-Man

Yes I agree that the 3a cable can limited in request. Let me know if I can assist you in any way!!
   
  Craig~


----------



## IGarrettS

Thanks guys, your the best. I'm probably going to order my JH3a around Christmas then look at my cabling options once I can afford to (I am a student at the moment so a ~$2000 JH3a is already pushing it). I have heard great things about your cables and might end up going for the TWag V3. Thanks for the comments, saved me a lot of worry about my cabling possibilities.



cogsand gears said:


> Love the design on those CIEM's! Yours?



Hahaha they will be soon, ordering them in a few weeks. I'm thinking that spiral design in my photo or a totally clear shell with the flying lady outline (silver for the left and gold for the right) in the brushed steel looking finish .


----------



## Toxic Cables

Quote: 





cogsand gears said:


> Toxic Cables make for the JH3a also - upon request.


 
  Thanks Luke, funnily enough, i made one for a customer over the weekend. As i have never posted a picture of a JH-3A cable before, here it is.


----------



## SACD-Man

In all honesty, I really can't believe it's the end of the year already. I remember last holiday like it was yesterday. 

However I must admit, when I look at the calendar it reminds me that CES in Las Vegas is coming up!! 

Dangerous stuff. Very very dangerous!
Hahahaha. 

Craig


----------



## KimChee

Hey guys does a JH/Westone socket fit into a Miracle?


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote: 





fuzzyash said:


> whiplash has something for the jh3a system


 
  Yes thet do.  I've had mine from Whiplash for some six months now and it sounds and wears a charm.


----------



## kenyee

Wrote up my review of the CH cables w/ the new less stiff cables for the curious: http://www.head-fi.org/t/644046/ch-ta-custom-iem-ue-tf10-cable-review


----------



## Toxic Cables

*Toxic Cables, new Silver Widow IEM cable.*
   
*The first ever Litz Type 2 Silver IEM cables, with a larger % of gold then found in my Silver Poison, at 25.5AWG it is also a little thicker then the Silver Poison and comes as standard with my new custom made aluminium Y splitter.*
   
*Also available now, is the White Widow, looks exactly the same, but instead is a Silver plated Copper Type 2 Litz cable.*
   
   
 
   

   
  The first Silver Widow review of a headphone cables can be found here, where it is also compared to the Silver Poison.


----------



## kenman345

Give me a few days and it'll be added to the IEM Cable list with the pictures. Hella busy these days. Looks interesting. Need to get my hands on someones to test for myself one day.
  Quote: 





toxic cables said:


> *Toxic Cables, new Silver Widow IEM cable.*
> 
> *The first ever Litz Type 2 Silver IEM cables, with a larger % of gold then found in my Silver Poison, at 25.5AWG it is also a little thicker then the Silver Poison and comes as standard with my new custom made aluminium Y splitter.*
> 
> ...


----------



## ScreenKiller

Beat Audio Cronus (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
 4) Beat Audio Ruby Supreme (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
 do they fit the 1964 v3?


----------



## mavericknm

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> 1a) Ultimate Ears In-Ear Reference Cable $40
> Why does the UERM cable (and all new UE monitors after September 1, 2010) have their own entry?  Because they are different and IMO better than other stock cables in many ways.  First, the shell connectors fit over a protruding socket for a secure fit with a great angle that works well in my ears.  Next the actual cable uses a very tight braid for the area between the nice looking 3.5mm plug and the Y-split and then after the Y-split the cable uses a very tight twist.  The cable uses 4 wires to avoid issues that can be caused by splitting one wire to two at the Y-split.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I am on my second of these and after 10 months of usage, they are showing the same failure mode. Wire color makes no difference. The memory wire tube begins breaking off. I'm not sure you can warrant a build quality of 10 if the life expectancy is less than a year. Is anyone else getting this? Also the price is only $30 and recently a built in mic has been offered for $50.


----------



## dezispop

would like to see the comment for Stefan AudioArt E series on JH 16pro~


----------



## psion84

Hi guys, any cables recommendation for the westone 4r?in terms of removing the veil? any reply is appreciated. thanks.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





screenkiller said:


> Beat Audio Cronus (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
> 4) Beat Audio Ruby Supreme (tested pin compatibility: JHA)
> do they fit the 1964 v3?


 
   
  I believe they do fit 1964 products.
   
  Quote: 





mavericknm said:


> I am on my second of these and after 10 months of usage, they are showing the same failure mode. Wire color makes no difference. The memory wire tube begins breaking off. I'm not sure you can warrant a build quality of 10 if the life expectancy is less than a year. Is anyone else getting this? Also the price is only $30 and recently a built in mic has been offered for $50.


 
   
  Thanks for the heads-up.  Anyone else with a similar issue?
   
  Quote: 





dezispop said:


> would like to see the comment for Stefan AudioArt E series on JH 16pro~


 
   
  They look interesting...
   
  Quote: 





psion84 said:


> Hi guys, any cables recommendation for the westone 4r?in terms of removing the veil? any reply is appreciated. thanks.


 
   
  While I haven' used aftermarket cables with the 4r, from my experience stranded silver cable should help with the veil, making the 4r a bit brighter and cleaner/clearer.


----------



## Xymordos

My cable is still fine for UERM. Though if you change cable often the protruding plug may crack and break off.


----------



## Eqzcer

I luv twag & twcu v3 hybrid ^O^
   
  but i just order twag v2 gold om from Craig >O<"


----------



## aLm0sT

Has anyone tried the TWag v3 with the um merlins and can comment on that? 
  I also saw someone with the hybrid v3 paired with the merlins in another thread but i can't remember where it was...


----------



## ChrisSC

Are there any sonic differences between the different connectors- specifically oyaide and neutrik?
   
  When you buy oyaide, are you mostly just paying for the aesthetic and the precious metals used (gold/rhodium) or is their some functional difference as well?  I understand this might be hard to compare because one would need to have two of the same cable with different terminations, and cable differences are subtle anyway, but still, I think this would be useful information for cable buyers, if anyone can share.  Thanks!


----------



## xaddictionx

chrissc said:


> Are there any sonic differences between the different connectors- specifically oyaide and neutrik?
> 
> When you buy oyaide, are you mostly just paying for the aesthetic and the precious metals used (gold/rhodium) or is their some functional difference as well?  I understand this might be hard to compare because one would need to have two of the same cable with different terminations, and cable differences are subtle anyway, but still, I think this would be useful information for cable buyers, if anyone can share.  Thanks!



Personally, I've tried different terminations with the silver dragon cable. I've tried before Right angled oyaide termination, Gold plated right angled oyaide termination and Viablue termination. In my opinion, it does not have any differences sonically. Basically it's more to the build quality that you're paying for. However do note that right angled oyaide tends to be larger and heavier.


----------



## Swiftay

Hi,
   
  Anyone have any opinions on Chris_Himself's SilverRay for Shure IEMs?


----------



## AnakChan

swiftay said:


> Hi,
> 
> Anyone have any opinions on Chris_Himself's SilverRay for Shure IEMs?



Not the SilverRay but I'm receiving the pure silver & silver/gold for my Rhapsodio in a week. I can't speak for the cables yet but I've just had one of the most pleasant, fun, & even funny experience in communicating with Ted & Chris. From a business communication & pricing perspective these guys are extremely pleasant to deal with.


----------



## teds headfood

too bad my nickname isn't fit to print


----------



## AnakChan

teds headfood said:


> too bad my nickname isn't fit to print


If you're who I'm thinking, I didn't even know you're on Head-Fi!!


----------



## Swiftay

Quote: 





anakchan said:


> Not the SilverRay but I'm receiving the pure silver & silver/gold for my Rhapsodio in a week. I can't speak for the cables yet but I've just had one of the most pleasant, fun, & even funny experience in communicating with Ted & Chris. From a business communication & pricing perspective these guys are extremely pleasant to deal with.


 
   
  I kind of worded my post wrong, but thanks for the response. I actually ordered the day before I posted. I'm very keen to receive them. I'm also very pleased with the price of these cables in comparison to competitors. Chances are, I'll be buying from them again, and recommending them to anyone who asks.
   
  I must agree though. Chris and Ted seem like lovely people. On the off chance that I'm ever in Cali, beers on me. (Extremely unlikely though, unfortunately, so don't get your hopes up )


----------



## teds headfood

if ever go walk-a-bout expect me for one beer


----------



## Chris_Himself

anakchan said:


> Not the SilverRay but I'm receiving the pure silver & silver/gold for my Rhapsodio in a week. I can't speak for the cables yet but I've just had one of the most pleasant, fun, & even funny experience in communicating with Ted & Chris. From a business communication & pricing perspective these guys are extremely pleasant to deal with.




LOL come for the cables, stay for the two dudes


----------



## kenman345

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> LOL come for the cables, stay for the two dudes


 
  "I can get behind that".....oh wait, what did I just say?
   
  Keep up the good work guys. I can't wait to see more reviews of the new wires you got


----------



## SursumCorda

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> "I can get behind that".....oh wait, what did I just say?
> 
> Keep up the good work guys. I can't wait to see more reviews of the new wires you got


 
   
  They have a really nice silver stranded wire that works well with IEMs that need a bit more extension. It sounds best with my JH16, not so much with my NT6. The build quality is quite good and it arrived quickly with no fuss. (I have one custom wire that is finally on it's way after 5/6 months from another vendor.)


----------



## kenman345

I've been eyeing it but I have Black CIEM's, so I want a black insulated wire. It's a pass for now. unfortunately.
  Quote: 





sursumcorda said:


> They have a really nice silver stranded wire that works well with IEMs that need a bit more extension. It sounds best with my JH16, not so much with my NT6. The build quality is quite good and it arrived quickly with no fuss. (I have one custom wire that is finally on it's way after 5/6 months from another vendor.)


----------



## SursumCorda

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> I've been eyeing it but I have Black CIEM's, so I want a black insulated wire. It's a pass for now. unfortunately.


 


 Hmmm. I know Chris has different color options on his cables, is the stranded silver clear only?


----------



## kenman345

Not anymore they don't, not with the new stuff. 
  Quote: 





sursumcorda said:


> Hmmm. I know Chris has different color options on his cables, is the stranded silver clear only?


----------



## SursumCorda

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> Not anymore they don't, not with the new stuff.


 
   
  Doh. My mistake.


----------



## average_joe

Effect Studio cables added in the first post.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





sursumcorda said:


> Hmmm. I know Chris has different color options on his cables, is the stranded silver clear only?


 
   
  Yeah it's clear, the stuff is fairly expensive, so we only got it in one color. Perhaps in the future we could work out different colors for them. Thank you for your interest.


----------



## kenman345

I would be very interested in some black insulated silver......I love the handiwork on your cables but for a CIEM cable I prefer black due to the how they look with my CIEM's
  Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> Yeah it's clear, the stuff is fairly expensive, so we only got it in one color. Perhaps in the future we could work out different colors for them. Thank you for your interest.


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





kenman345 said:


> I would be very interested in some black insulated silver......I love the handiwork on your cables but for a CIEM cable I prefer black due to the how they look with my CIEM's


 
   
  We're still a bit young to have the wire inventory of some of our competitors but perhaps we shall catch up some day.


----------



## Swiftay

Very happy with my set of cables.

Thanks, Chris & Ted!
Expect more business from me later on


----------



## ChrisSC

Oooh, that's pretty! By any chance, do you know if they offer any type 2 litz cables?


----------



## Swiftay

chrissc said:


> Oooh, that's pretty! By any chance, do you know if they offer any type 2 litz cables?




I'm not sure. You gotta ask Ted/Chris about that.


----------



## dragonball

I have been off this thread for almost 6 months. I am using TF10 with default cable. I am in the market for less than 100$ cable. The last time I was here, I was considering CH. Are there any new options in last 6 months?
  What are the best options (and their reviews) for th10 cables under 100$ ?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Swiftay

Chris_Himself cables are good choices.

You can try the White Angel or Dark Lord on ebay (It's around $30)


----------



## kenman345

Quote: 





chrissc said:


> Oooh, that's pretty! By any chance, do you know if they offer any type 2 litz cables?


 
  Right now, no. Ted does not have any Litz cable but if you email him about it he always tries to please customers.
  Quote: 





dragonball said:


> I have been off this thread for almost 6 months. I am using TF10 with default cable. I am in the market for less than 100$ cable. The last time I was here, I was considering CH. Are there any new options in last 6 months?
> What are the best options (and their reviews) for th10 cables under 100$ ?
> 
> Thanks.


 
  You should be able to find a lot of options. If you are into DIY, their are some offerings from Toxic Cables for loose wire and pins from their eBay store. (Doing something like that myself, but I already had pins for the CIEM's I have)(I figured I should mention this as it is a legitimate option and it's a great way to get the bang for your buck if you are confident enough to do things yourself.)
   
  In terms of cables being made for the TF10's you should find that a bunch of the cables in your price range come in the TF10 variety. Chris_Himself cables, as well as others will do you well. They are generally all quite good. I have a list of aftermarket cables and links to their reviews in my signature. I unfortunately have been swamped with school and haven't updated it in the last month but the majority of the reviews on this site are there, just about 3-5 are missing and 3 of them are from this thread


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





dragonball said:


> I have been off this thread for almost 6 months. I am using TF10 with default cable. I am in the market for less than 100$ cable. The last time I was here, I was considering CH. Are there any new options in last 6 months?
> What are the best options (and their reviews) for th10 cables under 100$ ?
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  I am not sure how the current CH cable perform since I haven't had a chance to try them, but the Effect Studio Apollo is very nice for the price as is the Null Audio Arete (make sure you change the pricing to USD).  Both offer exceptional ergonomics and the Apollo is very solidly built and the Arete is almost like no cable


----------



## Mimouille

Hello Joe, still no thoughts on a good cable for my SE5 ?


----------



## dragonball

Any reviews on the difference between 3 CH varieties - silver, hybrid (silver and copper interlaced) and copper ?


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





dragonball said:


> Any reviews on the difference between 3 CH varieties - silver, hybrid (silver and copper interlaced) and copper ?


 
   
  Ehh I'll save you the trouble and tell you not really. Even Joe hasn't received our new stranded stuff yet.. we've been pretty busy. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.


----------



## Swiftay

chris_himself said:


> Ehh I'll save you the trouble and tell you not really. Even Joe hasn't received our new stranded stuff yet.. we've been pretty busy. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.




Is the new stranded silver? Or just the new coating?


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





swiftay said:


> Is the new stranded silver? Or just the new coating?


 
   
  Both, there is a 24awg copper sheathed in more supply PE tubing and a 26AWG pure OCC silver wire!


----------



## AnakChan

chris_himself said:


> Both, there is a 24awg copper sheathed in more supply PE tubing and a 26AWG pure OCC silver wire!


Wow, so the one I have sitting in my mailbox in Japan (yeah, sorry Ted/Tim...didn't make it in time for my Australia trip), is that the new OCC 26AWG silver cable? Also is the Silver/Gold sibling OCC too?


----------



## Toxic Cables

Toxic Cables new "VIRUS" cable, the first true hybrid cable to be released. No further need of an 8 wire cable, to get a hybrid. Our cables use Litz OCC pure silver and OCC pure copper within the same wire.
   
Please check my appreciation thread for pricing.


----------



## flaming_june

Certainlly looks fan ******* tastik.


----------



## agoston.berko

*Are there any IEM cables for increasing the BASS impact without microfonics + light design ? *
*Thanks for the suggestions.*
   
*(sub100$ catergory preferred)*


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





agoston.berko said:


> *Are there any IEM cables for increasing the BASS impact without microfonics + light design ? *
> *Thanks for the suggestions.*
> 
> *(sub100$ catergory preferred)*


 
   
  It depends on the headphone, but in general, good copper can increase the bass.  A good amp can increase the bass to a larger extent, if you aren't already using one (see my multi-amp review thread).


----------



## chengsta

Hey joe, I've read your cable reviews about 10 times over in the last week.  I will soon be an owner of a jh16.  With that being said, my take-away from your review hints that the 'chris himself' cables were the best improvement for the jh16 (for the price), is that correct?
   
  Anyway I went to his website and it seems there are some major changes, like him expanding the business, which confuses me about exactly which cable you used in your review.  Perhaps he raised the prices from 75 to $200, perhaps not.  Anyway for the review, did you use the $200 pure silver iem cables, or the $85 HPL hybrid iem cables?
   
  Sure I bought the jh16's for the bass potential, but I do like to listen to the occassional classical tracks as well.  I like just enough bass in classical tracks to make me feel like I'm in a movie theatre watching pirates of the caribbean or something. so I'm not sure if the 16s will provide enough/too much.  I'm currently leaning towards the chris cables, but would you have a different recommendation?  I know it's been a good while since you've done your cable reviews, so maybe you have found better cables for the jh16's.
   
  my budget is around $250


----------



## Chris_Himself

Quote: 





chengsta said:


> Hey joe, I've read your cable reviews about 10 times over in the last week.  I will soon be an owner of a jh16.  With that being said, my take-away from your review hints that the 'chris himself' cables were the best improvement for the jh16 (for the price), is that correct?
> 
> Anyway I went to his website and it seems there are some major changes, like him expanding the business, which confuses me about exactly which cable you used in your review.  Perhaps he raised the prices from 75 to $200, perhaps not.  Anyway for the review, did you use the $200 pure silver iem cables, or the $85 HPL hybrid iem cables?
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  The cables Joe reviewed are not the new stranded wire I use actually. Stranded silver is a good deal more expensive than solid core but it is factually more malleable and supple as well as being easier on the microphonics despite being a thicker gauge. We made the move despite the price increases because of a ton of breakages we were dealing with.


----------



## chengsta

Quote: 





chris_himself said:


> The cables Joe reviewed are not the new stranded wire I use actually. Stranded silver is a good deal more expensive than solid core but it is factually more malleable and supple as well as being easier on the microphonics despite being a thicker gauge. We made the move despite the price increases because of a ton of breakages we were dealing with.


 

 Oh I see, thanks.  Which of your new cables are considered to be the upgraded version of the silver core?  Also, whats the difference between SPC and silver?  I was looking at your website and its kind of confusing.  When I click description button, all it does is take me to the order page.  Sorry for all these questions, I just don't want to make any mistakes.


----------



## MorAase

About to shop a 100 dollar string 
   
  What do you think about a YELLOW cable??
   
  My thougths are now at an silver-plated  Apollo with angled oyaide plugs. 
   
  The decision is - just a boring black string - or a fancy yellow one ?The pic above is from seller, I really should like a photo of an actual earpod witth this 
  æ


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





chengsta said:


> Hey joe, I've read your cable reviews about 10 times over in the last week.  I will soon be an owner of a jh16.  With that being said, my take-away from your review hints that the 'chris himself' cables were the best improvement for the jh16 (for the price), is that correct?
> 
> Anyway I went to his website and it seems there are some major changes, like him expanding the business, which confuses me about exactly which cable you used in your review.  Perhaps he raised the prices from 75 to $200, perhaps not.  Anyway for the review, did you use the $200 pure silver iem cables, or the $85 HPL hybrid iem cables?
> 
> ...


 
   
  As CH said, the cable I reviews is no longer available and very different from the current cables, which I haven't seen or heard.  Solid core, which was used by the old cables, sounds excellent but is problematic from a breakage and flexibility standpoint.  I used to make LODs and used solid core cable, so I know from that experience, as does CH I am sure.  Stranded takes more work to get sounding as good, and for the price, the Whiplash products seem to offer some of the best performance.  The Stage 93 silver cable was also quite good for the price.
   
  Also, it isn't just about material as the way it is made (braiding and other factors that affect capacitance and impedance) will change how it pairs with different multi-BA IEMs/CIEMs due to the crossover networks.  The best cable for my JH16 was the Whiplash TWag V2, but then there is also a sound signature change to take into account while the V3 kept the sound signature change to a minimum.
   
  Quote: 





moraase said:


> About to shop a 100 dollar string
> 
> What do you think about a YELLOW cable??
> 
> ...


 
   
  Unfortunately I can't find any IEM/CIEM pics with yellow cable, maybe Effect Studio can provide one.


----------



## Swiftay

Quote: 





moraase said:


> About to shop a 100 dollar string
> 
> What do you think about a YELLOW cable??
> 
> ...


 
  imo, from an appearance standpoint, I don't find yellow to go well with IEM/CIEM or otherwise. Black/Clear/White seems to work the best.


----------



## KimChee

Hey Joe,
   
  Any plans to review any of the Toxic Cables line?


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





swiftay said:


> imo, from an appearance standpoint, I don't find yellow to go well with IEM/CIEM or otherwise. Black/Clear/White seems to work the best.


 
   
  Yellow isn't so bad, especially with some CIEMs such as these:





 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Hey Joe,
> 
> Any plans to review any of the Toxic Cables line?


 
   
  I wouldn't say plans at this time, but I would like to down the road when time permits.


----------



## MorAase

Mine is Shure 535. The transparent version. And transparent sleeves, custom made, with gold dust 
   
  Plugs - shiny silver Oyaide rhodium ones 
   
   
  thus - yellow cable !


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





moraase said:


> Mine is Shure 535. The transparent version. And transparent sleeves, custom made, with gold dust
> 
> Plugs - shiny silver Oyaide rhodium ones
> 
> ...


 
   
  Pictures please!


----------



## Currawong

Given all the reviews of cables for the JH-16, I wonder if they would apply equally to the JH-13. TWAG v3 alone is VERY expensive.


----------



## fiascogarcia

Hi all. I'm getting interested in trying the iem market for the first time, but I have a very basic question.  When discussion of custom cables for over ear headphones come up, invariably there are huge arguments about whether or not custom cables make any sonic difference, to the point that the horse gets beaten to death.  Yet I notice (and kind of appreciate) that this is not the case with iem cable discussions.  Is it more a quality and aesthetics thing with iem users, or does cable have greater sonic effect with iems than with over ear headphones?  Thanks for your input!


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





currawong said:


> Given all the reviews of cables for the JH-16, I wonder if they would apply equally to the JH-13. TWAG v3 alone is VERY expensive.


 
   
  Honestly, I can't say as every CIEM/IEM will perform differently, but it seems certain properties are generally changed by cables.  For example, the NT-6 and NT-6 pro don't perform the same with various cables even though they are both made by the same manufacturer and share similarities.  The differences aren't just in how the sound changes, but also the magnitude of the changes that are similar.  Another way to say that is, if a cable improves imaging on two difference CIEMs, one could have a quite noticeable change while the other has a small change.
   
  Quote: 





fiascogarcia said:


> Hi all. I'm getting interested in trying the iem market for the first time, but I have a very basic question.  When discussion of custom cables for over ear headphones come up, invariably there are huge arguments about whether or not custom cables make any sonic difference, to the point that the horse gets beaten to death.  Yet I notice (and kind of appreciate) that this is not the case with iem cable discussions.  Is it more a quality and aesthetics thing with iem users, or does cable have greater sonic effect with iems than with over ear headphones?  Thanks for your input!


 
   
  It depends on where you post, what response you will get.  I also believe it is dependent upon the ear of the beholder.  The changes are typically subtle and it generally helps to know what you are listening for to really pinpoint the differences, at least for me.  The easiest way for me to tell is not to go from stock to an aftermarket cable to hear the improvement (if there is any improvement), but the switch back lets me hear what I am missing when going back to stock.
   
  Essentially, I don't think there are more differences for IEMs/CIEMs than headphones,  but maybe a less outspoken crowd?  Although I can't say I have really tried to make a correlation.


----------



## kenyee

Quote: 





fiascogarcia said:


> Is it more a quality and aesthetics thing with iem users, or does cable have greater sonic effect with iems than with over ear headphones?  Thanks for your input!


 
   
  For IEM users, a big thing is microphonics (when you rub something, it conducts the noise to your ear).  That trumps aesthetics for the most part.
  Also, with an IEM, you'll hear less external environmental stuff, so you can hear differences if any better.  But as always, it depends on the listener and external components.  Some people can hear differences that are less obvious to others.  Some users use external components w/ better drivers (e.g., Apple's original iPod raised the bar in portable music players way back when it was released) that aren't as affected by different cable impedances.


----------



## MorAase

The yellow cable
   
  and a silver Mundorf connecting my fiio e11 and iphone 4S
   
   
  All the sudden, music is fun and lovely to listen to, even with 320 kbps MOG stream 
  And yet to come - custom earsleeves for my se535 - I guess it will be even nicer


----------



## audionewbi

It might be a silly question but I will still ask, is Nordost Valhalla an OEM of the Cronus(or other way around)?)


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





audionewbi said:


> It might be a silly question but I will still ask, is Nordost Valhalla an OEM of the Cronus(or other way around)?)


 

 I believe the Beat Cronus is said to use OEM sources of Nordost Valhalla cables (Nordost doesn't have cable production capability, I don't think, they need an OEM), but there have been rumors that they're merely using cables that _qualitatively_ sound like the Valhalla if it were to be made into an IEM cable. Apparently, there have been rumors that all Beat cables are that way, just like Zephone and a few of the older Chinese cable companies. I don't know what the real deal is, though.


----------



## Lenni

the deal is a total sham bordering on scam, using the name of an expensive cable manufacture to allure people into buying their own products.
   
  it's funny how it works - it's like someone is selling a Skoda - the car has still its badge on it, but he says it's a Bently.


----------



## Xymordos

In China, the Beat Audio cables are believed to be a scam. Since no Nordost cables can ever be sold at such a low price. Also, the Beat Audio CIEMs are not looked upon favorably either.


----------



## audionewbi

Thanks.


----------



## Emospence

Do cables affect dynamic drivers the same way they do BAs?


----------



## chengsta

In my experience, probably a bit more. 
   
  I switched to a silver cable interconnect and suddenly I thought I lost my seal, but I didn't.


----------



## KimChee

I just got the Silver Dragon IEM cable and I am very happy with it.  It added much needed soundstage depth and actually widened the JH16 soundstage which was already wide.  Clarity across the boards is very evident, and there is more bass punch, and it brings out the high frequency a little more without adding too much up top which was what I was looking for.  I can actually fit the cable in my Westone travel case which was important to me since I carry my JH16s around in my pocket.  The braiding on other cables look nice, but they wouldn't fit in my Westone case, and I also wanted a black or gray silver iem cable most of them are silver colored or white.


----------



## psychokite

Hi everybody
  first message there I guess, I ll make my presentation in the nearest time...
  I do have a simple question to ask as honestly, and as I use to say, too many information kill the information, so I am a little lost. I have a little idea of what I could do, but may need a little of push to pass the step...
  I have a duo, iBasso DX100 and Earsonics EM6, using the stock cable supplied by earsonics. I am however wondering if I can improve the experience by changing the cable I have... why not a TWag V3 ?
  But then again, would it be the wisest choice ?
  And then what would it bring exactly except lowering the wallet's weight ?
   
  I do like the Earsonics signature (mid levels a little in front, etc...), but may be there's even a way to get it better ?
   
  Thanks to all for your comments


----------



## chengsta

in my experience, and the experience of the general population (the population that believes the cables make a difference), is that the differences between cables are noticeable, but not really a big deal to the casual listener. 
   
  in my experience: 
   
  pure copper = warmer, bass has more impact and rumble.  Vocals are more forward.  Very good timbre, you can just see what instrument/key is being strummed/plucked/pressed, and what it's made of.
   
   
  silver plated copper = Vocals are smoother sounding, bass has less impact, but rumble sounds the same.  Same timbre as pure copper.   
   
  Pure silver = Vocals are farther back(maybe more neutral?) than pure copper, bass has slightly less impact/rumble.  Highest detail and brightness.  The timbre is less convincing probably because the instruments sound a bit thinner?  Not really noticeable unless you're A/Bing, which I did because I noticed that I did less head-bobbing and toe-tapping with pure silver for some reason.  I spent all 5 days of the last holiday just switching stuff out.  (However, I've yet to figure out whether or not the timbre/bass is attenuated by the silver, or just enhanced by the copper cables).
   
  Once again, this is just my subjective experience.  Also, I've been listening to the same 40 tracks for the last 4 months, 8-15 hours per day so I am very familliar with the tracks.


----------



## psychokite

thanks Chengsta
   
  indeed I beleive that cables are an important part in the sound chain. But my only knowledge today in cables is regarding speakers for my Home Theater.
  But what I learned from it is that too much is the enemy of the good (used to have too good cables which were breathtaking my Elipson speakers... they got reborn with a smaller cable with less resistance...)
   
  I'd say, according to my taste (which is at the end the most important) that I do not wish to soften the EM6 sound. so according to your analysis, pure copper shall be the best compromise.
  Anyway I'll research it more !


----------



## Grimtuth

Sorry for reviving an old thread. 
 I was just wondering if any of you have ever owned a 'twag/cu v3 hybrid' that has gone "green"?
 I'll be receiving one soon and was (still is) hoping it to use it for a couple of years.


----------



## Swiftay

grimtuth said:


> Sorry for reviving an old thread.
> I was just wondering if any of you have ever owned a 'twag/cu v3 hybrid' that has gone "green"?
> I'll be receiving one soon and was (still is) hoping it to use it for a couple of years.


 
  
 I have a cable from HPL/Chris_Himself silver plated copper that has gone green on the right earpiece connector. Although it has gone green, it hasn't affected audio quality (as far as i can tell). I'm just hoping it spreads evenly, and not just one side, so I don't look like a monster with one side green, one side clean.


----------



## Grimtuth

swiftay said:


> I have a cable from HPL/Chris_Himself silver plated copper that has gone green on the right earpiece connector. Although it has gone green, it hasn't affected audio quality (as far as i can tell). I'm just hoping it spreads evenly, and not just one side, so I don't look like a monster with one side green, one side clean.


 
  
 Your reply is appreciated.
 I was just HOPING that due to amount that whiplash asks for their 8-wire v3 hybrids, that they would have at least fixed the discoloration of their wires.


----------



## average_joe

grimtuth said:


> Sorry for reviving an old thread.
> I was just wondering if any of you have ever owned a 'twag/cu v3 hybrid' that has gone "green"?
> I'll be receiving one soon and was (still is) hoping it to use it for a couple of years.


 
  
 My Hybrid cable hasn't gone green.  I do have an old TWag V2 that has a small black area, but you really can't see it unless you really look.


----------



## xaddictionx

average_joe said:


> My Hybrid cable hasn't gone green.  I do have an old TWag V2 that has a small black area, but you really can't see it unless you really look.



Do you prefer the sound of a hybrid cable to a pure copper or pure silver cable?


----------



## teds headfood

grimtuth said:


> Your reply is appreciated.
> I was just HOPING that due to amount that whiplash asks for their 8-wire v3 hybrids, that they would have at least fixed the discoloration of their wires.


 
  
 its not something thats fixable or any cable makers fault as copper/spc can eventually turn green thru oxidation and silver can turn black. some cables oxidize faster than others its just the way of oxidation.  oxidation starts even before insulation is being applied at manufacturer, so basically as soon as oxygen makes contact with any wire/metal the oxidation process has started.


----------



## average_joe

Stock silver cables (the twisted kind) have a porous jacket that allow quick oxidization of the copper.  Aftermarket cables that I have seen do not have this issue.


----------



## Nukeshock

review this cable Swan Audio SA-05 , it sounds pretty good and i bought it for $199SGD which is about 159 usd


----------



## KimChee

Any plans to review the Toxic Cables lines, joe?


----------



## average_joe

nukeshock said:


> review this cable Swan Audio SA-05 , it sounds pretty good and i bought it for $199SGD which is about 159 usd


 
  
 Thanks for the request.  When I get more time (see below).
  


kimchee said:


> Any plans to review the Toxic Cables lines, joe?


 
  
 Thanks for asking.  Yes, I really do need to review the Toxic cables.  I just finished a cable review and have 2 more, but am trying to finish several other reviews before I take on any new product.  I have been extremely busy lately.


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Just a quick question... will the TF10 cables fit into earphones with the Westone-style pins? I have a pair of Aurisonics with the Westone pins and I was wondering if the TF10's cable fits, since I want to buy a TF10 cable with the microphone for them. Thanks


----------



## KimChee

No it will be loose, it will fit, but you won't keep a good connection.
  
 Quote:


epicfailxd said:


> Just a quick question... will the TF10 cables fit into earphones with the Westone-style pins? I have a pair of Aurisonics with the Westone pins and I was wondering if the TF10's cable fits, since I want to buy a TF10 cable with the microphone for them. Thanks


----------



## ScreenKiller

are you going to test the fiio rc cables?
 they are only 30 bucks and look great.
 you have to try them for that price


----------



## wonjun

Does anyone know if the Effect Audio Odin uses a solid-core conductor?  That was my initial impression (that's why I bought it for my Tralucent 1+2), but now I'm not sure...
  
 Thank you,
 David.


----------



## average_joe

epicfailxd said:


> Just a quick question... will the TF10 cables fit into earphones with the Westone-style pins? I have a pair of Aurisonics with the Westone pins and I was wondering if the TF10's cable fits, since I want to buy a TF10 cable with the microphone for them. Thanks


 
  
 KimChee is correct, but you can flatten the pins and it will work.  To do so, get some pliers and gently apply pressure on the pins and insert.  Repeat until they stay securely.  I have applied too much pressure and ruined the pins, so it is best to be careful and go slow.
  


screenkiller said:


> are you going to test the fiio rc cables?
> they are only 30 bucks and look great.
> you have to try them for that price


 
  
 Oh, if I had the time   I still have 3 cables I need to review now.
  


wonjun said:


> Does anyone know if the Effect Audio Odin uses a solid-core conductor?  That was my initial impression (that's why I bought it for my Tralucent 1+2), but now I'm not sure...
> 
> Thank you,
> David.


 
  
 Hi David, sorry for the delayed response.  From the review in the first post: "The cable uses 24 AWG Silver plated .9999999 OCC with FEP Mono-Filament and Spaced FEP Insulation *single core wire*."
  
 So, yes.


----------



## wonjun

average_joe said:


> KimChee is correct, but you can flatten the pins and it will work.  To do so, get some pliers and gently apply pressure on the pins and insert.  Repeat until they stay securely.  I have applied too much pressure and ruined the pins, so it is best to be careful and go slow.
> 
> 
> Oh, if I had the time   I still have 3 cables I need to review now.
> ...


 
  
 Thank you very much for the clarification!
  
 I'm loving the Odin on my Tralucent!


----------



## average_joe

wonjun said:


> Thank you very much for the clarification!
> 
> I'm loving the Odin on my Tralucent!


 
  
 NP.  Looks like a great combo!


----------



## vermilions

I have a question regarding the wires in braid... Is there audible difference between 6 wire braids and 8 wire braids? Is it worth it to get a higher braid count?


----------



## Chris_Himself

vermilions said:


> I have a question regarding the wires in braid... Is there audible difference between 6 wire braids and 8 wire braids? Is it worth it to get a higher braid count?


 
  
 Superficial in my opinion. A typical 26awg conductor has plenty of room in it for the signal it's transmitting per channel, per polarity.


----------



## vermilions

Thanks Chris!


----------



## lbbef

Hi guys! I recently got myself a CIEM from a new local company. Was wondering what's the difference between the various connectors (MMCX, 2 Pin, Reversed 2 Pin) and which one would be better.

 Currently only the MMCX connector is offered. For the other 2 connectors, there's an extra lead time of a few weeks.

 I noticed that most other CIEMs use the 2 pin connectors. So I was thinking that the 2 pin connector would be better since if I upgrade my cable, I'd be able to re-use the cable for future CIEMs.

 Please advice a lost soul here.


----------



## Lindskog

I would like to have a cable with microphone for use with my Iphone. Does any one know of a 2 pin connector cable (JHA standard) that has remote control and microphone?


----------



## Hassles

Does anyone have leanings towards either the 2 pin or single swivel type pin connector for IEMs / pros and cons etc?
  
 thanks


----------



## Lorias

hassles said:


> Does anyone have leanings towards either the 2 pin or single swivel type pin connector for IEMs / pros and cons etc?
> 
> thanks


 
 The swivel type is better IMO because it's more ergonomic and it also can help to prevent the cables from getting damaged too quickly. I quite like the EPIC cable that came with my new Westone ES60s. It doesn't get in the way during insertion and removal of the IEM, nor while listening to the music. Also, putting everything safely back in the box is really very easy with this cable, mainly due to the swivel.


----------



## Hassles

The main reason I posted my initial inquiry was that the twin connector cables are deemed to be _*industry standard*_ while I myself prefer the single spigot / swivel varient. Hmm, I wonder if I can specify cable type with my impending CIEMs!!! Perhaps I'll have to wrangle that into the deal.


----------



## average_joe

hassles said:


> The main reason I posted my initial inquiry was that the twin connector cables are deemed to be _*industry standard*_ while I myself prefer the single spigot / swivel varient. Hmm, I wonder if I can specify cable type with my impending CIEMs!!! Perhaps I'll have to wrangle that into the deal.


 
  
 You can ask manufacturers if they can make a CIEM with the MMCX connector (the round swivel one), but if the manufacturer has never done it, they may say it isn't available.


----------



## FangJoker

I'm considering replacing the cable for my JVC FX850.  I love it, but I want a little bit more out of it.  Sadly the ones that I'm considering (the ones made by whiplash) cost more than what I paid for the IEM itself.  Or I could just do what I always wanted to do and buy a custom IEM like the Noble K10.


----------



## average_joe

Two new cable reviews have been posted here.


----------



## thedips

average_joe said:


> Two new cable reviews have been posted here.




Thanks for the comparison my stock tf10 cable finally crapped out on me


----------



## zachchen1996

thedips said:


> Thanks for the comparison my stock tf10 cable finally crapped out on me


 
  
 Now you have an excuse to upgrade your IEMs


----------



## Insatiable One

average_joe said:


> *3) Beat Audio Cronus*_ - $289.00_
> 
> 
> [size=11.0pt]*9) Null Audio Arete* $82 USD[/size]


 
 Viablue 3.5mm T6 Plug es no bueno
 from what I've heard, people who have been listening with equipment that was terminated with a Viablue T6 then tried a different plug suddenly all SQ was improved from clarity to soundstage. I have not tried this but when more than one person says this, I don't even want to try this. 
  
 just what I've heard
 if you're a Viablue advocate
 pls don't murder me 
  
 I do, however, love the way the Viablue T6 plug looks


----------



## teds headfood

was probably a dirty surface on plug. all contacts build up a grey-ish grease and should be cleaned regularly.


----------



## Mimouille

Hey Joe, so all in all what are the best matches for SE5 and NT6. I am using TWAu and Oslo II respectively.


----------



## zachchen1996

mimouille said:


> Hey Joe, so all in all what are the best matches for SE5 and NT6. I am using TWAu and Oslo II respectively.


 
  
 Well I can tell you the TWau is not very good...


----------



## Mimouille

zachchen1996 said:


> Well I can tell you the TWau is not very good...


Oh I find the Twau quite good, just wondering if there is better. Your sentence is quite weird, since I already have the TWAu, so you "telling" me it is bad does while I obviously do not think so is not going to get us anywhere. We obviously have different tastes as you did not like the 901 as source for the Hidition and I consider it the perfect source for the NT6.


----------



## average_joe

insatiable one said:


> Viablue 3.5mm T6 Plug es no bueno
> from what I've heard, people who have been listening with equipment that was terminated with a Viablue T6 then tried a different plug suddenly all SQ was improved from clarity to soundstage. I have not tried this but when more than one person says this, I don't even want to try this.
> 
> just what I've heard
> ...


 
  
 I haven't noticed an issue with the Viablue plugs.
  


mimouille said:


> Hey Joe, so all in all what are the best matches for SE5 and NT6. I am using TWAu and Oslo II respectively.


 
  
 My SE5 needs longer pins, so most aftermarket cables don't work well with it, but here are the ones that have fit.  My bias for the NT-6 can be found here, and in general I like the TWau, which was reviewed here.  The Oslo cable I had didn't really impress; what are your thoughts?


----------



## zachchen1996

mimouille said:


> Oh I find the Twau quite good, just wondering if there is better. Your sentence is quite weird, since I already have the TWAu, so you "telling" me it is bad does while I obviously do not think so is not going to get us anywhere. We obviously have different tastes as you did not like the 901 as source for the Hidition and I consider it the perfect source for the NT6.


 

 Well you did say you are looking for better hahaha, it's only my humble opinion that it's not that good of a cable (sq wise) for the price.
 But you're right, we both have very different tastes. You prefer a warmer / smoother sound than me right?


----------



## Mimouille

average_joe said:


> My SE5 needs longer pins, so most aftermarket cables don't work well with it, but here are the ones that have fit.  My bias for the NT-6 can be found here, and in general I like the TWau, which was reviewed here.  The Oslo cable I had didn't really impress; what are your thoughts?


 
 My opinion is that I do not really hear differences in cables, but I keep trying! To me source makes a world of a lot more difference. My SE5 and NT6 sound at least as good as with stock with the Oslo II, and I feel the build of Beat Audio cables is among the best. However, the Oslo II, like the Cronus, are a bit too stiff.
  
 Have you tried their new TOTL, the Prima Donna?


zachchen1996 said:


> Well you did say you are looking for better hahaha, it's only my humble opinion that it's not that good of a cable (sq wise) for the price.
> But you're right, we both have very different tastes. You prefer a warmer / smoother sound than me right?


 
 No pb mate. I guess I do not really believe in cables, so I like them pretty and ergonomic  But I do prefer slightly warm than bright. However the NT6 (at least mine) is really bright but liquid and musical so I love it.


----------



## Mimouille

Hello guys, anyone heard of / the new Alo flagship cables?

http://www.aloaudio.com/quad-ribbon


----------



## Barra

mimouille said:


> Hello guys, anyone heard of / the new Alo flagship cables?
> http://www.aloaudio.com/quad-ribbon




Tried them at canjam. They were elegant and ergonomic and sounded nice but on unfamiliar rigs so I cannot describe the SQ. Unfortunately, they didn't have any 2 pin jh style ciem cables to try with my nt6pros.


----------



## Mimouille

barra said:


> Tried them at canjam. They were elegant and ergonomic and sounded nice but on unfamiliar rigs so I cannot describe the SQ. Unfortunately, they didn't have any 2 pin jh style ciem cables to try with my nt6pros.


 
 Great thanks, I might give them a try


----------



## kamoteFX

very informative thread


----------



## MikePortnoy

My SilverFi IEM2 cable review has been posted
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/silverfi-iem2-cable/reviews/13139


----------



## MikePortnoy

My plusSound Apollonian+ review has been posted:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/plussound-apollonian-iem-cable/reviews/13433


----------



## stone-eye

Thanks for the amazingly detailed review!! Exactly what i was after as i'm looking into cable upgrades for both TF10 and JH13. For my own purposes I will have to assume a rough correlation between sq improvements for the jh16 and jh13.
  
 I know ranking can be subjective depending on each individuals hearing, sound preferences and source equipment but on reading the reviews am i right in inferring the best upgrade cables for the TF10 and JH16 to be:
  
 TF10 - 
 Chris_Himself's cable
 Moon Audio Silver Dragon V1
 Null Audio Arete
  
 JH16 -
 Whiplash Audio TWag v3
 Whiplash Audio TWag Hybrid v3
 Moon Audio Silver Dragon V1/Chris_Himself's cable
  
 Is this about right?
  
 I have used two versions of the Lune MkIII silver cable on my TF10s (with custom molded ear sleeves) and found the step up in quality to be immense across the board but due to both dying with weeks of purchase i'm keen to try something different. For info i play apple lossless files from an ipod classic 6th gen through a pico slim amp (connected via a Whiplash TWag LOD) and listen almost exclusively to a wide range of metal.
  
 Also, has anyone heard the new Null Audio Vitesse Cryo 7N CGOCC-A Pure Silver Earphone Cable? I can't seem to find any reviews anywhere.
  
  
One final question. I want to recable my Ultrasone Edition 8s and was mainly looking at choosing between the Moon Audio Silver/Black/Blue Dragon V3 (V2 only for Black i think) cables and the Whiplash Audio TWag V2/3/Hybrid V3 (although the recabling service suggests only the V2 is available for the Ed.8s). Does anyone here have experience of any of these cables with the Ed.8s? (or even better two or more of them?)
  
Thanks in advance!
Stuart


----------



## SACD-Man

Hey!
  
 I can recable almost any headphone with any wire. My site needs major updating. In fact we are building a new site...
 Sorry for the lack of information. PM me if you have any questions!!
  
 Craig
  
 PS - I like TWau


----------



## MikePortnoy

My PW Audio Legend IEM cable review has been posted: 
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/pw-audio-legend-ii-v2-copper-iem-cable/reviews/13860


----------



## MikePortnoy

Forza IEM cables review has been posted:
  
http://www.head-fi.org/products/forza-audioworks-iem-cables/reviews/14216


----------



## flinkenick

Will read this tonight! I've owned the Hybrid, curious to hear your impressions. Although mine looked different, but I think that's just the sleeving option..


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> curious to hear your impressions. Although mine looked different, but I think that's just the sleeving option..


 
  
 That's cool mate. 
  
 I think it may be about sleeving as you said..


----------



## flinkenick

I also have the Null Audio Vitesse Copper (and Silver) now, so will read your review about the Copper again. I will try to attempt to write a review on the Silver, but i find it quite difficult


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> I will try to attempt to write a review on the Silver, but i find it quite difficult


 
  
 Keep writing mate, a few words can give a lot of description   Adding a comparison between Silver and Copper would be nice.


----------



## proedros

can someone who owned both, compare *Moon Audio Silver Dragon* and *Whiplash Audio Twag V3 OM/Litz *?

 for use with a UM Miracle, compare with the UM stock cable also welcome
  
  
 thank you.


----------



## MikePortnoy

Premium packaging with a wooden case.. Labkable Takumi is in town..


----------



## flinkenick

Oh dude you got it? Which one is that, the silver/gold/copper hybrid as well? Probably V2


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> Oh dude you got it? Which one is that, the silver/gold/copper hybrid as well? Probably V2


 
  
 Yes bud, it is. Latest version.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I must say that it has an impressive package, premium look.


----------



## flinkenick

Ah awesome man I'm very glad to hear so I can share your impressions! I haven't really given it any time because 1) I need to listen to the Solar with standard cable for future reviews and the Velvet/RTi2 require silver, and 2) I want to sell it because I reeeeally need money.
  
 But since nobody is interested in it I will give it a second chance later on 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 My first, brief impressions is that is has a very clear sound, instruments can be defined well in space. Bass seemed a bit attenuated, but I think this gives the instruments more room to breathe. 
  
 ps. But on looks alone, it wins from all other cables. I have never seen anything like it, with its two colors and flat 8-braid. Post another pic later on when it's rolled out so we can see the braid, I think the color is different from mine.


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> Ah awesome man I'm very glad to hear so I can share your impressions! I haven't really given it any time because 1) I need to listen to the Solar with standard cable for future reviews and the Velvet/RTi2 require silver, and 2) I want to sell it because I reeeeally need money.
> 
> But since nobody is interested in it I will give it a second chance later on
> 
> ...


 
  
 The craftsmanship is impressive indeed. Knitting/braid is done very well. I haven't taken a listen to it yet, buddy. Edmond from Labkable recommends a total 100 hours of burn-in for the best performance. Btw, Edmond is very friendly and super responsive.Master series Takumi is a mid-priced cable from their range. They also have Ultimate series Pandora and Master Series Samurai in higher price range.  
  
 Need money, budget thing for flagships


----------



## flinkenick

That's right my friend 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Awaiting your impressions!


----------



## MikePortnoy

I will post a preview after enough burn-in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 Btw, SilverFi IEM3-IEM4 review has been posted: 
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/silverfi-iem-cables/reviews/14549


----------



## flinkenick

Read it, great work mate.


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> Read it, great work mate.


 
  
 Thank you buddy, as for your post on other thread, IEM-R1 is a huge step up. Definitely amazing..


----------



## flinkenick

Sounds good man, I think it's probably one of the best out there..
 There is also a $1000 gold-plated silver cable from Effect Audio. Maybe you should contact them as well for a flagship comparison


----------



## MikePortnoy

flinkenick said:


> Sounds good man, I think it's probably one of the best out there..
> There is also a $1000 gold-plated silver cable from Effect Audio. Maybe you should contact them as well for a flagship comparison


 
  
 Perhaps in the future


----------



## MikePortnoy

My plusSound Exo silver/gold cable review has been posted:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/plussound-exo-series-cable/reviews/14640


----------



## viper2377

Any impressions on this yet?





mikeportnoy said:


> Premium packaging with a wooden case.. Labkable Takumi is in town..


----------



## MikePortnoy

viper2377 said:


> Any impressions on this yet?


 
  
 I will post a preview very soon.


----------



## MikePortnoy

Labkable Takumi cable review has been posted:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/labkable-master-series-takumi-iem-cable/reviews/15113


----------



## Arsalan

Thanks
Did yoy test the Bravity 5N SPC cable from Null Audio ?


----------



## edyeded

Hi guys, 

Hope someone can help - tried reading through thread but a little overwhelmed. 

Looking for a cable in the 100 usd budget (as of now) that improves sound quality/soundstage/texture on my jh16 paired with my HTC 10.

Any recommendations would be massively appreciated. 

Thanks fellas


----------



## willowbrook

Any impressions on Brevity made by Null Audio?


----------



## liyzag1

Hi,
  
 am using the se535 with the cowon d,
  
 i wanted a cable with a 3.5 mm right angle and a mic , i dont care for volume controls !!!
  
  
 is a mic possible with 3.5mm right angle ???
  
 can any1 please help !!
  
 thanks !


----------



## dockie7

Super extensive review


----------



## Edric Li

-


----------

