# Speakers on a Desk or on Stands



## ninjikiran

I have the Audioengine A5's which shoots bass down rather than rear port.  I just ordered the Auralex mopads since they were cheap, but what worries me is the fact that its still shooting its energy downward.
   
  Anyway long story short, the bass is VERY boomy, I mean killer boom here.  Which sounds more like resonance from the glass portion of the desk acting as a giant woofer. 
   
  Anyone know of any good stands(with or without a need for a mounting bracket) that would fit the A5 in case its still far too resonate?
   
  Not expecting extremely high caliber sound out of these but the beast must be tamed


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## muad

They can sound really good but are incredibly dependent on positioning. It definitely their biggest downfall, every complaint about them references the boomyness. Once you get them off the desk and perfectly positioned from the rear walls they sound amazing!
   
  I have mine toed in on some black painted cinder blocks with auralex pads about 10" from the wall and they are definitely not boomy.


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## Somnambulist

Not perfect given the cupboard walls, or the fact sound still bounces off the desk in front of them, but they're at ear height and it was the best I could do given this is what I'm stuck with.
   
  From top to bottom they're simply speaker, the rubber stand that came with them, a painted black steel plate + Mopad (to emulate the Recoil Stabilizer design), and a couple of the heaviest bricks I could find tied up with a bit of string, wrapped up tightly in cheap black fabric and stitched sloppily so they didn't fall apart. I wanted to use concrete bricks, but couldn't find any builder supply places selling them, so just found the densest bricks I could.
   
  The painted cinder block idea is also good, although the wrong size for my speakers and I lack the tools to hack them up. I've lined the speakers/stands up since the photo and toed them in a little more so it looks better!


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## muad

I never had to hack mine up... they sell half cinder blocks


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## ninjikiran

I have seen alot of those concrete blocks but they would probably raise the speakers far too high for my personal use.  I was thinking more of an actual adjustable stand.  I really like the tripod ones.  But they don't seem to be made for these kinds of speakers.  Granted with the mopads I can aim them down.
   
  Regardless I know the mopads will help regardless, just cant wait to hear these things in their true glory.  They actually sound rather good, its jus tthe resonance thats unbearable.  Its like the equivalent of sibilance to my ears.


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## Somnambulist

Just use concrete bricks instead. You can stack as many/few as you need to get the speakers to ear height. Disguise either by painting or draping with fabric.


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## ninjikiran

Is there any website I can buy these at then ?  Painting them or making them discrete is no problem.  Its obtaining them that might be.
   
  If I used the concrete blocks I would stick some foam in the center, wrap them in anti-vibration pads like what they sell at frozen-cpu, then cover it up in a cheap black fabric.  A bit overkill but, I can dig it.


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## Somnambulist

If you have concrete blocks they should be more than capable of isolating the monitors on their own. Many people with floorstanding speakers sit them on granite slabs.
   
  Look up local builders merchants/trade places, or DIY stores. Over here in the UK they are dime-a-dozen. Unfortunately in my case everyone here uses every type of brick except concrete, so I had to make do with something else. However that part of my stand was more about raising the height than anything else, the thick and extremely heavy steel plate, Mopads, and rubber mat will provide the isolation.


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## ninjikiran

Yea I jsut installed the mopads last night.  I would say most resonances have been eliminated with just that, difference in clarity is night and day(not audiophile night and day, literal night and day), the bass doesn't turn my desk into a woofer and drown out all other sounds as well as annoy my ears.
   
  Its still there once in a while but its very slight, the mopads alone bring the speakers to or around my ideal listening angle.  Still I am going to try to get a hole of those blocks, If that can mute it out to the point only a true speakerphile can hear it I will be happy.


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## Somnambulist

You can put blocks underneath, or an alternative is to source a couple of mild steel plates (there are people on ebay that will cut to size, for example) about 6-10mm, paint it with some Hammerite or some similar metal paint, and put that on the Mopads. You then essentially have 2/3rd of the much more expensive Primacoustic Recoil Stabilizer monitor stands (the remaining 1/3rd is a layer of dense rubber on the top).
   
  Then there's only desk reflections to sort out!


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## ninjikiran

By the way you can check out http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12539/pad-215/Corepad_XXXL_Professional_Cloth_Gaming_Mouse_Pad_EP24550.html or something similar.  Might help a little bit with reflections, not sure 100% as I don't know what they sounds like.  Looked for the steel plate on ebay but there wasn't much selection.  Are these things greased by any chance?


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## Somnambulist

Mine came with a reddish layer of anti-corrosive stuff. I just painted straight onto it with Hammerite. The guy on eBay I used... you had to message him with what you wanted and he created a listing for you.


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## ninjikiran

Yea the hammerite looks to be priced quite right as well.  Considering costs and the fact that no matter which route I take I can still use both parts i'll definitely order two small slabs.
   
  I should take a picture of my desk though, considering the size of my screen its a bit hard to work with. (32in, desk width is ~50in... have the perfect amount of clearance without it touching the screen.  Until I angle them.


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## ninjikiran

http://www.homedepot.com/Building-Materials-Concrete-Cement-Masonry-Concrete-Blocks-Bricks-Lintels/h_d1/N-5yc1vZboge/R-202361322/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
   
  Does that look ok?


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## muad

I'm using this http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202522480/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053
   
  and This may work work if that last one is too high and you just want to add a few inches... it need to be cut in half and will get you 4 inches off the desk
http://www.homedepot.com/Building-Materials-Concrete-Cement-Masonry-Concrete-Blocks-Bricks-Lintels/h_d1/N-5yc1vZboge/R-202524813/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053


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## ninjikiran

That concrete solid block actually looks perfect if you can get it cut in half.  The first one seems a tad high though.
   
  What kind of paint would you guys use to do the concrete/cinder blocks?


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## Lavcat

I too would like to know about the paint for sealing concrete blocks.  I've been thinking of placing my rather large monitors on concrete blocks, on top of Auralex platforms.  High density rubber on top of the concrete blocks might be a nice addition.
   
  Perhaps stone could be used in place of concrete?


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## Somnambulist

You just want something that's high-density. People make speaker stands out of tubes filled with sand or lead shot etc. Seen floorstanders on sheets of granite. Concrete is good because it's very cheap and heavy/dense.


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## tmars78

I used plain spray paint to paint my bricks. Nothing fancy, just black spray paint. 
   
   
  Before paint

   
  After paint


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## Marleybob217

So these are my speaker stands on rotanional disks custom made.


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## eclipes

anything else other than brick or concrete? Im using a cheap Ikea table and with the dual monitors and my entire audio setup on it, I don't think the table can withstand any more weight like concrete blocks. Anything that is lighter but can replace concrete blocks?


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## adamlau

Sound Anchors...http://www.head-fi.org/t/397869/pictures-of-your-computer-rigs-post-them-here/6000#post_8048488


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## eclipes

Yeah i've seen those, just haven't looked into it because it didn't state the price on their website but im gonna email them. So will this work, my monitors on aurlex mopads and then placed on top of the stands?

  
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adamlau said:


> Sound Anchors...http://www.head-fi.org/t/397869/pictures-of-your-computer-rigs-post-them-here/6000#post_8048488


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## Somnambulist

If you do something similar to what I did in terms of the Mopads and steel/rubber, it doesn't really matter too what's underneath as long as it can take the weight and gets the speaker the correct height. The bricks I used earlier in the thread... if I slouch they're the correct height, but really they need to be double the height they are now, so at some point I'm just going to glue some MDF into two 20x20x10cm blocks, sand the edges down a bit and paint it. I could just stick a couple of books underneath what I have now, but I'm a perfectionist.
   
  Just find something that works and looks pleasing to you.
   
  When I finish my DIY speakers, I'm going to just get a couple of granite chopping boards to stand them on. Cheap and cheerful, but does the trick.


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## eclipes

thanks, i might be able to get my hands on some steel plate. Is the steel plate placed on top of the mopad or beneath the mopad, not sure how the recoil stabilizer works. Also if i can't get the steel plates, what if using thick MDF boards beneath the mopads as base, will that work? I think the height should be fine, not sure, because i have the mopads tilted or the monitors are angled to my ears. if i don't angle it and stack like how you guys did it, it will be pretty high (im 6'1) in order to reach the optimum height.
   
  But definitely, i think the mopads itself might not be enough so i need something beneath it or above it. 
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somnambulist said:


> If you do something similar to what I did in terms of the Mopads and steel/rubber, it doesn't really matter too what's underneath as long as it can take the weight and gets the speaker the correct height. The bricks I used earlier in the thread... if I slouch they're the correct height, but really they need to be double the height they are now, so at some point I'm just going to glue some MDF into two 20x20x10cm blocks, sand the edges down a bit and paint it. I could just stick a couple of books underneath what I have now, but I'm a perfectionist.
> 
> Just find something that works and looks pleasing to you.
> 
> When I finish my DIY speakers, I'm going to just get a couple of granite chopping boards to stand them on. Cheap and cheerful, but does the trick.


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## Somnambulist

The RC is basically just a Mopad with a steal plate with a rubber top layer glued to the top, and one costs about 3-4 times as much as a pair of Mopads. As I probably said before, I found a guy on eBay selling steel plates in a variety of sizes (no idea what for to be honest!), and asked him if he could make a pair of 200x200x10mm ones and list them. He did and I bought them, then painted them with some black Hammerite. I then just used the rubber mat that came with each Focal monitor and stuck the Focals on top of that.
   
  The gist of it is that the foam layer does the same job as the Mopads, then the steel layer basically acts as a way of anchoring the speaker down so that it's not moving, however minutely, when music is blaring out of it. The final rubber layer is basically to make it harder still for the speaker to move due to friction, I think. The density of steel also helps, I'd imagine with absorbing some of the energy directed downwards into the desk as well, since mass and distance are the only things that really deal with bass. If I was a little more DIY oriented I'd probably do proper stands filled with sand or something, but I think what I have now is doing the job okay, and the cupboard my desk is in more problematic! When I have my own place, I plan on making proper sand-filled DIY stands, but then I also plan on upgrading to Event Opals and they are certainly too big for most desks anyway!


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## eclipes

Great Thanks Somnambulist, I'm gonna head over to home depot or something to get myself some steel plates. Will post up pics when everything is settled.
  
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somnambulist said:


> The RC is basically just a Mopad with a steal plate with a rubber top layer glued to the top, and one costs about 3-4 times as much as a pair of Mopads. As I probably said before, I found a guy on eBay selling steel plates in a variety of sizes (no idea what for to be honest!), and asked him if he could make a pair of 200x200x10mm ones and list them. He did and I bought them, then painted them with some black Hammerite. I then just used the rubber mat that came with each Focal monitor and stuck the Focals on top of that.
> 
> The gist of it is that the foam layer does the same job as the Mopads, then the steel layer basically acts as a way of anchoring the speaker down so that it's not moving, however minutely, when music is blaring out of it. The final rubber layer is basically to make it harder still for the speaker to move due to friction, I think. The density of steel also helps, I'd imagine with absorbing some of the energy directed downwards into the desk as well, since mass and distance are the only things that really deal with bass. If I was a little more DIY oriented I'd probably do proper stands filled with sand or something, but I think what I have now is doing the job okay, and the cupboard my desk is in more problematic! When I have my own place, I plan on making proper sand-filled DIY stands, but then I also plan on upgrading to Event Opals and they are certainly too big for most desks anyway!


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## Somnambulist

Cool. A pair of RC's are about £140-150 here, I think, maybe more.
   
  If I recall correctly, my own stands cost something like
  Bricks - £2
  Fabric - £5
  Pair of Mopads - £30
  Steel plates - £15
  Hammerite - already had in garage
  Rubber mat - came with speaker
   
  So just over £50 for both, less than the price of one RC! I could have made them for less by using acoustic foam and cutting it, rather than buying the Mopads, but I was worried the cuts would look jagged and horrible, and buying a hot wire cutter would have made it cost just as much as buying the Mopads anyway.
   
  It'll be similar when I do these acoustic panels for my room, I can probably make all the panels for the cost of 1 one from a big company, but it obviously involves a bit of time and effort.


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## eclipes

wow too bad you're located in the UK, if not I would have commissioned you to help me build stuff. Im planning on adding acoustic panels for my room too.
  
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somnambulist said:


> Cool. A pair of RC's are about £140-150 here, I think, maybe more.
> 
> If I recall correctly, my own stands cost something like
> Bricks - £2
> ...


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## Somnambulist

Luckily it's all pretty simple stuff to do - and I'm terrible at DIY so it must be easy haha. Sourcing materials and getting everything prepared is probably the hardest part.


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## blazer78

If i recall correctly, the Audioengines's are rear ported so you may want to move them away from a wall to prevent bass buildup. Inherently, the audioengines may just be designed to have a  bass hump and there may be nothing you can do about that, although i've not heard of the audioengines myself. Alternatively, you may choose to move yourself off-axis such that the tweeter is facing below your ear.
   
  If you are not certain that the woofer is bouncing lower frequencies off your desk and into your ear you can check this by putting some carpet/dampening material on your desk and see if the reflections still occur.
   
  If you are simply wanted to decouple your speakers from your desk, I recommend Primacoustic Recoil Stabiliser (be sure to get the right size).
   
  Lastly, your room and speaker placement may just be bad. Consider using bass traps to treat your room, if serious.


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## eclipes

okay before i move on to modding my stands, i have a question about the positioning of your monitors. I have always wanted a larger soundstage in my setup, so at first i thought it was because of my DAC/amp (NFB-12 sounds narrow). So after a long conversation with Kingwa from Audiogd, he recommended me to position my speakers in different way before doing any upgrades.
   
The boxes in BLACK is my current setup, the typical triangular setup at ear level. Green Box is what Kingwa recommended me to do for a larger soundstage. Tested it, works, I could hear a larger soundstage but at a cost of dynamics and clarity.
   
  So wondering how you guys position it, is there a certain ratio to maintain such as the distance between monitors should equal to the distance from the monitor to the person.
   My current setup right now. My monitors are WAY TO CLOSE to the wall but  the width of the desk is just too small. I stuffed my rear ports with socks already so it helps a bit.


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## blazer78

The speakers should form an equilateral triangle with your head being the third point (60 degrees at each vertex). Do note that distance is also important, distance being dependent on your room accoustics. Your perceived soundstage may be too low, because your speakers are on your desk and thus you are off axis. Draw an imaginary line from the middle of your tweeter and woofer and make sure that points straight into your ear.
   
  With the speakers raised, you should be getting a more accurate image.
   
  Just out of curiosity, how do you define soundstage?


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## Somnambulist

Yep, equilateral triangle, ears about tweeter height (or between woofer and tweeter) - and when you swivel in your chair to face each speaker, you should be looking down the barrel of the woofer.


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## eclipes

okay thanks guys, looks like my positioning is somewhat correct, might just need to raise the monitors a bit more.


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## Somnambulist

Raising also helps lessen desk reflections, although your speakers are pointed upward slightly so that helps too. The next step is putting bass traps in the corners of your room, and panels at first reflection points etc etc. Fun little game that. Here's a vid to demonstrate,
   





   
  From what I've read acoustic foam is pretty rubbish for anything but treble though (and he didn't put anything under the speakers, tut!,  and you should use the proper fibreglass/rockwool panels:


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## ninjikiran

To be honest I dumped the A5's, they sound horrible for their price and have these high volume bass humps that drown EVERYTHING out.
   
  No matter what stand, padding, black socks vs white socks stuffed in places they should not be.  Doesnt help it much if at all. Doesnt seem to matter how far or close to the wall.  Overall was completely and totally disappointed with my purchase.


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## eclipes

it doesn't matter if the monitors are tilted or straight right as long its pointed at my ears then its all good? Because i'm thinking of getting individual stands for each monitor. Using wooden boards and sticking Ikea mini legs on it.


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## eclipes

Thanks Somnambulist, wow I didn't even know bass will creep and store its energy in the corners but yeah i need those bass traps. I have to get going with my DIY recoil stabiliser.
  
  Quote: 





somnambulist said:


> Raising also helps lessen desk reflections, although your speakers are pointed upward slightly so that helps too. The next step is putting bass traps in the corners of your room, and panels at first reflection points etc etc. Fun little game that. Here's a vid to demonstrate,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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