# best solder



## audiomortis

so, I tried to do a search, but you type in "solder" or "best solder" and see how many results come up that don't help.

 Ok, I'm almost out of solder. I want to buy some good stuff, but not spend a ton of money. As far as normal solder, is there much of a difference? I've heard bad things about ratshack solder, and I've had it ruin a tip of mine.

 I'm also going to be playing with some silver/silver plate wire soon. Do I NEED silver solder?


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## n_maher

Tangent's DIY guide has a good section on solder and then his "kits" have various choices for different levels. 

 Personally I use the mid level 63/37 solder and it's worked great.

 For my M3 and Dynalo I may use silver bearing solder, but from what I've read it's harder to work (generally speaking) so I'm not 100% convinced yet.

 HTH,

 Nate


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## stackofhay

FWIW, I've tried several types of solder recently. I was running out myself and grabbed a few feet of various types from friends and gave them a go.

 IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR SONIC IMPACT OF THESE, DO NOT READ ON...

 Kester Sn96.5/Ag3/Cu.5 #58 flux -- Stinky and the final joint are not shiny. VERY sensitive to temp and motion of the joint when cooling. Joints get downright dull if ANY movement occurs during cooling. Kester said this is normal for this lead-free alloy and the no-clean flux. Ventilation a must and they claim that "folks are going to have to get used to dull-looking joints as they make the move to lead-free solder". 

 Kester Sn62/Pb36/Ag02 #66 flux -- nice to work with, shinier joints. More familiar working characteristics and smell. Has a little silver so will be friendly when soldering silver plated wire.

 Ersin Multicore Sn60/Pb40 -- a surplus roll with rosin flux. This is "the old standby" IMHO. Easy to work, low melting point and fairly forgiving.

 WBT 4% silver, unknown alloy -- nice to work with, familiar smell, nice shiny joints, frighteningly expensive.

 CARDAS "Eutectic" audio solder -- very nice to work with, shiny joints tolerant of some movement when cooling (like when free handing temporary wire connections to something), nice smell. I bought a roll and am using it for everything. It is about 2x the price of the silver-bearing Kester solder, but at the rate I use solder, this will keep me happy for at least a year...

 FWIW, YMMV

 Conclusion: Cardas was the best bang for the reputation/price/emotion/silver/buck. WBT was the emotional favorite only because it is so damned expensive and makes such nice shiny joints... Lead free will work well but I'm old-school when it comes to dull-looking joints, so I'll pass for now.


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## Todd R

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stackofhay* 
_CARDAS "Eutectic" audio solder -- very nice to work with, shiny joints tolerant of some movement when cooling (like when free handing temporary wire connections to something), nice smell. I bought a roll and am using it for everything. It is about 2x the price of the silver-bearing Kester solder, but at the rate I use solder, this will keep me happy for at least a year...

 FWIW, YMMV

 Conclusion: Cardas was the best bang for the reputation/price/emotion/silver/buck. WBT was the emotional favorite only because it is so damned expensive and makes such nice shiny joints... Lead free will work well but I'm old-school when it comes to dull-looking joints, so I'll pass for now._

 

Second on the Cardas, that's all I use anymore. 
 It melts at a decent temp, flows very well and I almost never get a cold, dull joint.


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## audiomortis

well, I'm not surprised that the $70/lb solder is great... it had better be. and as much as I would love to use that, I plain can't afford it.

 I'm looking at the Keller #44 due to it's ability to solder nickel well (a lot of the connectors I use are nickel plated).


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## Garbz

personally i don't care for silver bearing soldier. The joints in the end are so small in the greater sceme of things. I.e. 1mm compared to 80cm of cable.

 I use standard cheapo soldier and unless your dynahi is carved out of pure silver i doubt it would make that much difference.


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## mono

Kester 63/37 is what i usually use, since I buy a pound reel at a time then refill those tiny tubes I used to get.

 Solder WILL wear out a tip, that is a sign of effective flux in it... though silver bearing may be worse in that regard.


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## dsavitsk

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stackofhay* 
_Kester Sn96.5/Ag3/Cu.5 #58 flux -- Stinky 

 CARDAS "Eutectic" audio solder -- nice smell._

 

I can't imagine what the Kester smells like as I thought the Cardas smelled terrible


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## dr_digits

I would like to try the WBT some time, but for now, I am more than happy with the Cardas.


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## stackofhay

Quote:


 I can't imagine what the Kester smells like as I thought the Cardas smelled terrible 
 

It is pretty noxious... I would not use it in a closed space...


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## KarlDL

A year ago, I acquired a quarter pound of TRT "Wonder Solder", allegedly "easy to work". I've never been able to get this to perform as well w/iron or gun as the remnants of a 35(!) year old reel of Kester 44. Perhaps I don't have the temp correct, but I'm wondering which drugs its proponents are on! OTOH, one wonders whether the ancient Kester 44 achieves acceptable sonics.

 Frustrated w/TRT, I obtained a small reel of WBT silver-bearing solder several months ago. It's now my "default" solder for all audio projects. It "feels" just like the old-reliable Kester 44 (or Ersin Multi-Core) and has the "audiophile" credentials (whatever they're worth).

 One must keep in mind that the purpose of the solder is not to effect the conductive joint, but rather to stabilize and solidify the conduction between conductors and/or pcb trace. The soldering techniques taught by Heathkit eons ago are every bit as valid today. If close attention is paid to that, maybe the make/mix of solder doesn't matter so much.

 Karl


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## PinkFloyd

Good old 60/40 here.


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## psilosome

Here's another vote for Kester 63/37. It's cheap and tolerant of some movement when cooling. My girlfriend says the smell reminds her of incense from church.


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## Pars

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *KarlDL* 
_A year ago, I acquired a quarter pound of TRT "Wonder Solder", allegedly "easy to work". I've never been able to get this to perform as well w/iron or gun as the remnants of a 35(!) year old reel of Kester 44. Perhaps I don't have the temp correct, but I'm wondering which drugs its proponents are on! OTOH, one wonders whether the ancient Kester 44 achieves acceptable sonics._

 

I've got some Wonder Solder, and never had any problems with it... it melts well and flows good, makes good joints.

 I use Kester "44" 63/37 and buy it in pound or half-pound rolls. Next time I may try the 62/36/2. I also occasionally use the RatShack 62/36/2 or 63/37... not as good as the Kester, but it works ok.


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## aerius

The 5lb spool of Alpha Metals no-clean 63/37 solder which I uh...borrowed from a place I used to work at. Wets nicely and makes consistent shiny joints without leaving residue on my soldering iron tip or otherwise crapping it up. And being a no-clean solder I don't have to clean flux residue off the board if I feel lazy.


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## Edwood

Cardas Quadeutectic is my favorite.

 Very high flux content, but it is very clean and easy to wipe up.

 Supposedly is no clean solder, but never confirmed it with Cardas. Usually clean it off anyways.

 -Ed


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## MisterX

http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=55516






 Does the Cardas always win these threads?


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## JWFokker

I can't understand why. It costs 4-5x more than 62/36/2 solder. To me, that's excessively overpriced.


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## HiGHFLYiN9

I usually use Kester 63/37, Kester 62/36/2 or Cardas. I find the Kester a little easier to work with so that's generally what I use.


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## RnB180

I use ol rat shack 62/36/2 silver bearing solder

 its nice to work with cools quick, but corrodes my solder tips, I think I need a new one already (3rd tip in the past month or two) but I should note Ive solder many many many joints already 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 time to look up Kester, I dont know if Cardas is worth the price.


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## Edwood

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MisterX* 
_http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=55516





 Does the Cardas always win these threads? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

LOL, I should've added Kester 44 or "Wonder solder" to that poll.

 Seems that most like Cardas because it's so easy and clean to work with.

 Haha, and the fumes smell better, according to one person.

 Actually, it does smell a little "sweeter". 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 OK, smoking too much solder.......

 -Ed


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## Todd R

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *RnB180* 
_I use ol rat shack 62/36/2 silver bearing solder

 its nice to work with cools quick, but corrodes my solder tips, I think I need a new one already (3rd tip in the past month or two) but I should note Ive solder many many many joints already 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 time to look up Kester, I dont know if Cardas is worth the price._

 

Send me a self addressed stamped envelope and I'll send you 6" of Cardas solder to try out. 
 That goes for any of you guys who want to try it. 
E-Mail


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## audiomortis

I think I'm going to take you up on that. I would really like to try it. The one thing that makes it stand out to me is that it has copper in it. I like copper. It's what almost all the wires I solder are made out of, and if I could find/afford all the ends I use in copper, I would use that for almost everything. It just makes sence to me to have the solder contain the same materials as the joints.


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## Edwood

The actual amounts of copper and silver in the Cardas solder are pretty small, relatively speaking.

 But if anything it helps to achieve the proper eutectic blend. And would, if anything help to prevent galvanic corrosion, by having some similar metal in the solder.

 -Ed


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## PinkFloyd

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Todd R* 
_Send me a self addressed stamped envelope and I'll send you 6" of Cardas solder to try out. 
 That goes for any of you guys who want to try it. 
E-Mail_

 

Is that 6 inches or 6 metres Todd?


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## Edwood

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PinkFloyd* 
_Is that 6 inches or 6 metres Todd? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

" = Inches.


 LOL, nice try, Mike. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 -Ed


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## MisterX

Nice gesture Todd. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I agree with the notion that once you try it you won't go back to regular solder.... how about you Ed?


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## Todd R

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PinkFloyd* 
_Is that 6 inches or 6 metres Todd? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Some people's kids.......


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## AndrewFischer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *audiomortis* 
_ Do I NEED silver solder?_

 

Depends on what you are soldering. Most of the time, no you don't need silver. You do need it to repair really old Textronix Oscilliscopes, the ones with the ceramic strips. Silver solder is also a good idea for some(all?) SMD rework. 

 I use MultiCore 60/40 in a small .61mm diameter for 95% of what I do. I'm used to working with the stuff, it works well and it is inexpensive. Eutectic isn't for me. I'm too set in my ways.

 Exotic solder --- I'd rather use my limited funds elsewhere.


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## dcrane

I don't have much experience with other solder. But...I am using cardas solder and it seems pretty good to me. If you look around the web, you can find it for a reasonable price - still a bit pricey. I doubt that I will even try anything else.


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## skyskraper

what i dont like about my generic 60.40 solder:
 it chews through tips
 it can be hard to get to reflow without flux
 can be a pain to work with unless i get the heat/tip combo right for a particular part/board

 what i do like:
 i get it for free
 its generally pretty good to work with 
 constantly teaching me about soldering.

 to conclude: generic solder can be a ok 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i would like to try out some multicore solder, will see if i can get some of that soon


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## Emon

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dcrane* 
_I doubt that I will even try anything else._

 

*Please* tell me you wouldn't use stuff that expensive for anything but high quality audio applications...


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## PinkFloyd

I use this stuff It's cheap, flows like water, doesn't smell, isn't messy and makes a beautiful shiny joint.... what more could you ask for?


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## individual6891

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PinkFloyd* 
_I use this stuff It's cheap, flows like water, doesn't smell, isn't messy and makes a beautiful shiny joint.... what more could you ask for?_

 

Me too! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I use Antec lead free solder (from maplin) for silver plated parts though.


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## RickP

Any eutectic Pb/Sn 37/63 solder with rosin core is all you need.

 Ersin and Kester come to mind although I don't know if Ersin is mfgd any more.

 IMO, anything else more exotic/expensive is audio snakeoil wrt sonic or electrical performance.


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## Edwood

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MisterX* 
_Nice gesture Todd. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I agree with the notion that once you try it you won't go back to regular solder.... how about you Ed?_

 


 Cardas Quadeutectic all the way. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I use Kester Electronic Silver Solder (62% Tin, 36% Lead, 2% Silver, 44 Flux) for SOIC chips like OP Amps, it's much much thinner than Cardas, which just oozes all over the place.

 I wish there was a thin version of Cardas with less flux.

 -Ed


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## Edwood

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *RickP* 
_Any eutectic Pb/Sn 37/63 solder with rosin core is all you need.

 Ersin and Kester come to mind although I don't know if Ersin is mfgd any more.

 IMO, anything else more exotic/expensive is audio snakeoil wrt sonic or electrical performance._

 

Even though I'll bet there won't be a single person here who could hear the difference between solders, there is a big difference in workability of the different solders. You have to actually try the Cardas solder to know what I'm talking about.

 -Ed


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## cetoole

I use mainly Kester 62/36/2 Silver Solder, I love it, and it is pretty cheap. I will have to try the Cardas sometime, anyone know where it is cheapest?


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## KZEE

I've heard that in addition to adhering the parts together, solder's main purpose is to prevent oxidation of the joint. Whether it be interconnect wires being soldered to RCA plugs, or capacitors being attached to circuit boards, or what have you, first and foremost there should be a good physical contact between the surfaces being joined together. Then the solder is flowed into place around that physical contact in order to A) maintain that physical contact, and B) prevent oxidation from taking place in the contact area. 
 I'm not saying that there can't be audible differences in sound between the various solders that are available, but if there is good solid contact between the parts that were joined together in a soldered joint, then I would think the majority of the electrical signal that passes through that joint would be passing through the physical contact of the parts that were connected to each other, and thus the solder's influence on the electrical signal would be small, leading me to believe that the solder's influence on the sound would also be small.


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## kilkil

Parts Connexion has the cardas for $38 a pound.

http://www.partsconnexion.com/catalo...lscleaner.html


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## mono

In a perfect world all joints would be mechanical connections. Anyone who's ever worked with protoboard or seen the chinese et al PCBs that don't have thru-hole plating, knows better... not to mention surface-mounted parts. Solder is a mechanical connection and is sufficient in this role unless the part will be load-bearing.

 No matter how well you mechanically connect something, a VERY large portion of the electrical conduction could still be through the solder, because no two parts are going to be mirror smooth at the micron level, solder will be a very large contact point that inevitably improves the connection even when there is "sufficient" mechanical connection alone. 

 Having written that, so long as your solder, iron, surface, etc, are good mates for each other, so long as the solder joint is sound, you should not have any significant differences in electrical conduction based on which solder you choose, including audio quality. BUT, a marginal solder joint can certainly effect this, even if it looks shiney on top.


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## KZEE

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mono* 
_In a perfect world all joints would be mechanical connections. Anyone who's ever worked with protoboard or seen the chinese et al PCBs that don't have thru-hole plating, knows better... not to mention surface-mounted parts._

 

I would suspect that the vast majority of DIY Head-Fiers participating in this thread work with electrical parts that for the most part permit good physical contact between the parts being joined together, and that is what I was addressing in my post. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mono* 
_No matter how well you mechanically connect something, a VERY large portion of the electrical conduction could still be through the solder, because no two parts are going to be mirror smooth at the micron level..._

 

Solder itself is also not mirror smooth at the micron level, and in electrical joints where one is able to achieve a relatively LARGE area of good physical contact between the parts being soldered together, and providing you don't blob your solder on 2" thick, I don't think it unreasonable to conclude that the majority of the electrical signal passing through the joint will be passing through the physical contact points of the parts being joined together. I think it self evident that when one is not able to achieve a large area of physical contact between parts being joined together then of course the solder will be carrying a larger portion of the electrical signal.


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## audiomortis

if you "tin" the ends of your wires, aren't you then reducing the mechanical connection and putting more solder in the path?


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## mono

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *KZEE* 
_I believe the vast majority of Head-Fiers participating in this thread work with electrical parts that for the most part permit good physical contact between the parts being joined together, and that is what I was addressing in my post._

 

... To which I partly disagree. Which parts are these that have good physical contact? Even a resistor lead slipped into a plated hole has relatively poor contact quality until soldered.

  Quote:


 Solder itself is also not mirror smooth at the micron level, and in electrical joints where one is able to achieve a relatively LARGE area of good physical contact between the parts being soldered together, and providing you don't blob your solder on 2" thick, I don't think it unreasonable to believe that the majority of the electrical signal passing through the joint will be passing through the physical contact points of the parts being joined together. 
 

Well I'd have to disagree here too, we can't really have it both ways, either there is a mechanical connection already with majority of electrical signal (and thus NO NEED for the solder at all), or there is more benefit to the solder than just this. Even though solder may not be "perfect", it is still a vastly better mechanical and electrical bond than the rough mating of two non-planar parts. It can't be assumed the electrical connection was already sound as this is the whole reason behind parts designed to be soldered rather than crimped... and if you have mating crimp connectors then solder would indeed, often be overkill.

  Quote:


 I think it self evident that when one is not able to achieve a large area of physical contact between parts being joined together then of course the solder will be carrying a larger portion of the electrical signal. 
 

 True, though that's almost always. Unless one is using high-quality crimps and mating connectors, there generally isn't a large area of physical contact between any two parts. If there were, the solder would be obviously unnecessary. I don't mean to be anal about these points but to be fair when considering the benefit of solder, most often it is an important mechanical AND electrical connection in addition to preventing air (oxidation or environmental contaminants) to accumulate.


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## Todd R

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Todd R* 
_Send me a self addressed stamped envelope and I'll send you 6" of Cardas solder to try out. 
 That goes for any of you guys who want to try it. 
E-Mail_

 

Ya know what? 
 6" just isn't enough, I'll make it 1 foot. 

 Funny, I'm offering free stuff and only 1 person has asked for a sample so far.


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## donovansmith

For interconnects I really enjoy working with the Cardas Quadeutectic stuff. It really is incredibly easy to use. But for smaller stuff I stick with RadioShack's 62/36/2 stuff. It is thin enough for surface-mount stuff and easy enough to work with overall and readily available, too. I definitely prefer eutectic solder over standard 60/40 stuff. Once I tried it I didn't go back.

 And how do you guys go through tips so fast? My 2+ year old cheapie 15W iron is still on its original tip and works beautifully and my 1 1/2 year old 40W iron is also on its original tip. Every time I plug in my irons to use them I tin them, scrape them off, and then tin them again and keep them tinned throughout using them. I don't use special tip tinner and cleaner, I just use a pair of scissors to scrape them and solder to tin them. They are showing some wear but work fine still, making quite solid joints, despite the numerous times I have left them on for an hour without even using them. I likely don't solder nearly as often as some here likely do, but I still get plenty of use out of my irons.


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