# fiio e17 speculations?



## Xozz

[size=medium]Just ordered an e9 the other day and I decided to hold off on buying the e7 because of some posts I've seen stating that Fiio has an e17 in the works that handles 96/24. I even recall some tidbits being posted by the fiio rep on here...can't find them though. I know fiio is currently working on the e11 which is a dedicated portable amp, so that makes me wonder if the e17 is going to exclusively be a dac or just a higher quality combo than the e7. Just curious if anyone else is interested in this and if theres any info out there that I'm just not finding. Speculate away!​[/size]


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## Keyboarder

I'm very curious of the same, but will probably get another if it's not released soon.


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## juman231

Here's a direct comment from feiao:
   
  " We will also develop a E17 which can be docked into E9 too, the E17 should support 96k/24bit
   

   USB dac and optical, coaxial input and will have better amp section."

   

  So i'm guessing it's gonna be an upgrade from the e7.

   

  link: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/535707/thinking-of-buying-the-fiio-e7-and-e9-right-now/15

   

  post #26


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## Xozz

aha! yeah thats what I was looking for, thanks for digging it up.
   
  now to play the waiting game...


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## Xymordos

Oh damn, how long do we have to wait for...waiting sucks.


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## Xozz

that it certainly does. I have no idea, but if I had to guess I'd say since that since they announced the e11 earlier this month and its coming out in march, I would guess they'll officially announce the e17 somewhat soon and release it over the summer. Of course I'm spouting a completely uninformed opinion, but thats my theory.


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## estreeter

Am I the only one who can see a situation where iBasso and Fiio take it in turns, month about, to release a new amp or DAC/amp ? Choice is good, but we already have mass confusion on the forums, particularly when newbies arrive and want to know which is the 'best' amp on a budget. Cant argue with their pricing though.


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## Xozz

Ya know...I could actually see that happening. I really can't think of anything negative that could come of it though. Competition is always good and we can already see that its creating a great entry-level market of sorts. Sure, there will probably be around 98721346872356 threads comparing all the different models, but I think thats probably a good thing. It'll get people interested, and for once they don't have to take out a second mortgage in order to do it. I know I wouldn't be here if it weren't for the likes of fiio and others.


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## Keyboarder

FIIO,
  Please at least give us a ballpark release date for the E17.
   
  Thanks,
  Management


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## JamesMcProgger

Quote: 





keyboarder said:


> FIIO,
> Please at least give us a ballpark release date for the E17.
> 
> Thanks,
> Management


 
   






  whose management?


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## Xymordos

Hey you know how you go to Control Panel --> Sound and you check the playback thing. I realize my computer have the option of 24/192? Its default is like 16/44.1 Does it make a difference?


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## kingpage

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> Hey you know how you go to Control Panel --> Sound and you check the playback thing. I realize my computer have the option of 24/192? Its default is like 16/44.1 Does it make a difference?


 

  
  Not if you only CD quality (16/44) source.


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## Xymordos

But the E7 only supports like...16/44? Where do you get 24/192 sources? o.o
  Quote: 





kingpage said:


> Quote:
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## yifu

Direct rips from reel tapes or vinyl or SACDs or DVD audios. Some sites have got 24/96 as well like HDtracks and there are a few others.
  
  Quote: 





xymordos said:


> But the E7 only supports like...16/44? Where do you get 24/192 sources? o.o
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


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## kingpage

Quote: 





xymordos said:


> But the E7 only supports like...16/44? Where do you get 24/192 sources? o.o


 

 E7 doesn't support 24/192 formats. I was merely refering to formats of music when I said source, not hardware.


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## Xymordos

Yes, I know haha. Just thinking where you'd get the music. Can all music file formats come in 24/192?
  
  Quote: 





kingpage said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
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> ...


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## Jack C

Hey,
   
  What little info James has released on the E17 I've put together here:
   
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/537356/fiio-new-products-guide#post_7244899
   
  Looks like a great product. From the description it does sound like the higher end brother of the E7 - I would expect the E7 to stay around given it's attractive price. The E17 takes the performance up a few notches and offers additional digital connectivity.
   
  Like the rest of you, I can't wait for this to get here.
   
  Jack


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## JRG1990

And the E17 can still dock in the E9?.


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## Jack C

Yes, the E17 will dock in the E9 as well, and I think that gives us some idea of its size/thickness, should be similar to the E7 in that regard. 
   
  Jack


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## JRG1990

Good but won't docking it in the E9 loose the digital outputs?.


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## Jack C

You mean the digital inputs?
   
  That's a good question. I don't know the location of the digital input ports on the E17 or whether they still function once docked into the E9. I guess it would be ideal if they did, so that you can connect the E17/E9 up to the optical or coaxial output of a CD player. 
   
  Oh and if you guys want the E17 to provide bass boost or any such EQ functions *while docked in the E9*, now would be a good time to let FiiO know. 
   
  Jack


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## Very Legal

Hmmm... interesting i think i will be in for one if my wallet feel comfy about it. need a dac for my laptop.


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## tme110

I think moving up from the E7 will be a no brainer - but only if my only issue with the e7 is addressed  - the lack of lineout really limits what I can do with it.


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## tme110

oh and as for as sources.  I guess it's ok to say this...but if you search on computer audiophile they have unbelievable samples of 176khz and 8467kbps(!!!!) HRx files for free.  One is 260 megs for a single song.  These files are offered by reference recordings and I'm making the assumption that having access to these files completely negates the point of having actual audiophile level sources...???  The only (and huge) issue is that people are only spending the time and money to make recordings like this for Jazz and classical.


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## Xozz

Quote: 





tme110 said:


> oh and as for as sources.  I guess it's ok to say this...but if you search on computer audiophile they have unbelievable samples of 176khz and 8467kbps(!!!!) HRx files for free.  One is 260 megs for a single song.  These files are offered by reference recordings and I'm making the assumption that having access to these files completely negates the point of having actual audiophile level sources...???  The only (and huge) issue is that people are only spending the time and money to make recordings like this for Jazz and classical.


 

  
  lol...that seems a bit excessive. can you really tell a difference?


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## tme110

Well, my Grado's are out getting mod'ed right now and I don't have a backup pair to check.  They do sound fantastic on my speakers though.  Oh, and though I feel I have a pretty good DAC these files are way beyond what my (or most others?) DAC can really peform to.


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## ProtegeManiac

Quote: 





xozz said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  I had some SACDs before. Even with the entry-level Sony, the SACDs sound better than CD's; playing CD's through that vs most other CDPlayers within the price range and the Sony's not any warmer but the resolution, not in k-bits but in how each note is resolved, etc, is a lot clearer. I loved Mahler, Orff, Wagner and Mozart on that player, and it's a shame very few metal bands released on SACD. What's more, some of the bands that released on SACD compose music that won't make too much difference, not the complex power/symphonic metal compositions.
   
  On a related note, The Phantom Agony CD sounds more musical, while the 2 meter sessies DVD is more analytical. Except the vocal microphones used for the live recording session really bring the lead vocals up front, like speaker systems with the Vifa XT25 tweeters.


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## Jerff

Personally, I want the Optical/Coaxial in to be available when docked into the E9 as right now the E9 it only supports USB and Line in IIRC 
  I'd be much happier off with Optical in going into the DAC for a higher quality output rather than having to hog up another USB port for less quality.
   
  Oh and BTW first post on HF


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## Very Legal

I think the E9 use the E17`s dac because the E9 is amp only without E17 or E7. Welcome to HeadFi and sorry about that wallet of yours
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





jerff said:


> Personally, I want the Optical/Coaxial in to be available when docked into the E9 as right now the E9 it only supports USB and Line in IIRC
> I'd be much happier off with Optical in going into the DAC for a higher quality output rather than having to hog up another USB port for less quality.
> 
> Oh and BTW first post on HF


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## tlniec

Right - I think what he's saying is, he hopes the E17 will be configured such that you can physically plug in a coax/spdif cable when the unit is docked (i.e. those jacks are not placed on the same face as the dock connector) and that engaging the dock connector doesn't force (e.g. via software) digital input to be from the dock/ignore the coax/spdif inputs.  And I agree completely on both counts.


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## Mad Lust Envy

I think you'll probably have to hook up the E17 to the E9's line in to take advantage of the E17's digital inputs. If not, you'll have to deal with the USB connection of the E9.
   
  That's my assumption. I think it would just look weird as hell having the connections going to the E17 while it's docked to the E9. I highly doubt Fiio is going this route.
   
  As for the E7 and a line out, well we're still waiting on that L7(?) dock that is supposed to be released soon (probably around the time of the E11, that way the E7 can be used as a DAC for the E11).


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## Jerff

Quote: 





tlniec said:


> Right - I think what he's saying is, he hopes the E17 will be configured such that you can physically plug in a coax/spdif cable when the unit is docked (i.e. those jacks are not placed on the same face as the dock connector) and that engaging the dock connector doesn't force (e.g. via software) digital input to be from the dock/ignore the coax/spdif inputs.  And I agree completely on both counts.


 


  Yup, that's exactly what I meant.


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## lee730

I'm curious as to how much this e17 will cost. And will it be worth it upgrading from an e7? I really want a night and day difference if I am going to upgrade my portable amp. Please fill this void fiio .


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## tme110

They've already said it would cost about twice as much so I'd expect about $200.  It is supposed to be substantially more capable then the e7 - I'm surprised they are dealing with all the different optical inputs this time but it will make the product stand out (now you can use it with more sources than just your computer).  If you have source files that can use the DAC improvements then it will be good for you, if not...
   
  but you still have a good wait


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## jronan2

Quote: 





xozz said:


> Just ordered an e9 the other day and I decided to hold off on buying the e7 because of some posts I've seen stating that Fiio has an e17 in the works that handles 96/24. I even recall some tidbits being posted by the fiio rep on here...can't find them though. I know fiio is currently working on the e11 which is a dedicated portable amp, so that makes me wonder if the e17 is going to exclusively be a dac or just a higher quality combo than the e7. Just curious if anyone else is interested in this and if theres any info out there that I'm just not finding. Speculate away!​


 

 Sorry guys I know this is a very noobish question before I even ask, but what is 96/24? How important is whatever this figure is? And how much better do you think the e17 will be compared to the e7? I currently have the e7/e9 and happy with this set up just curious to see what else fiio is coming out with.


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## kingpage

96kHz/24bit means high definition audio, as opposed to 44kHz/16bit standard from a Red Book CD. It's only beneficial to have HD audio equipment if you have HD music for it to play. E17 has not been compared to the E7 yet, and won't be released until much later this year.


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## jronan2

i thought CD/Flac was the best quality. Where do you get HD music?


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## kingpage

The sound science subforum is a very good place to learn about the differences.
   
  Basically you can find labels such as 24bit or HD on the disk.


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## diodiel

fiio e17  should have an aux in at the same side as the head out ^_^ cause when i use the e7 with the ipod both sides has cables sticking out so i found it hard to put it in my pocket  with out being scared that ill break either cable


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## JamesFiiO

We had decided to develop E15 first, and them we can move the same DAC converter, 96k/24bit converter and some other technology  into E17, it can decrease the risk of R/D and 
   
  save some time. btw, E15 is more like a desktop E17 because some people ask us to develop such model.


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## juman231

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> We had decided to develop E15 first, and them we can move the same DAC converter, 96k/24bit converter and some other technology  into E17, it can decrease the risk of R/D and
> 
> save some time. btw, E15 is more like a desktop E17 because some people ask us to develop such model.


 

 So...E15 is a 24/96 DAC that is not portable? Does this mean it will not be directly compatible with the E9 as E7?


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## JamesFiiO

Yes, E15 will support below decoder.
   
  USB: 96K/24Bit
   
  Digital input ( coaxial and optical): 192K/24Bit
   
  Line in: RCA.


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## juman231

Sorry to bombard you with questions, but is there anything planned for e15 size-wise?


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## JamesFiiO

not available now.


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## Mad Lust Envy

Wait, so the E15 is a desktop DAC? I thought it was a succesor to the E9? Is the E15 fully DAC or DAC/AMP?


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## latenlazy

What price range is the e17 targetting. Can we expect it to be as powerful as some of ibasso's latest amps? How much power should we expect it to deliver?


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## JRG1990

So the E15 is a all in 1 desktop dac & amp? , so you don't have to dock the E7 or E17 in the top to get a dac ,will have it rca out?
  I have a request/suggestion regarding the sound quality, could you not make it so smooth / soft sounding the E9/E7 is too smooth/soft for my taste i assume the soft smooth sound is caused by the combo of the dac chip and opamps could you make the E15 have a fuller thicker cleaner sound please.


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## JamesFiiO

yes, the input output includes
   
  Input: USB x1, Optical x1, Coaxial X1, RCA X 1 or 2, 
   
  Output: RCA line out X 1, 6.5mm Headphone out X1.
   
  DAC: AD1955 or PCM1798
   
  Amp section: TPA6120 ( same as E9).
   
  Volume control: Alps potentionmeter or digital volume control (WM8816 or TA3110)
   
  The Sound will different with E9 when work as DAC, and a little different with E9 when work as amp only;
   
  Any suggest is welcome now. we just design the outlook now.


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## JamesFiiO

About the power of E15, It is the same as E9, and enough to 99% headphone. also E15 is desktop amp , 
   
  As usual, E15 will be an affordable desktop DAC+AMP.


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## Mad Lust Envy

Damn, this sounds like an extremely solid choice for those getting into this hobby. I'm looking into a higher level replacement to my E7/E9, but I'm not against selling my E7/E9 (or gifting it to a friend) and using the E15 as a secondary unit to my inevitable purchase of the Schiit Lyr + higher end DAC.
   
  I'm extremely loyal to the Fiio brand due to the quality products they put out at the price point they're placed in. I'm very much looking forward to the E15. 
   
  Suggestions:
   
  Low/High gain switch in FRONT, like a slider or button.
   
  RCA coaxial input (red/white) instead of 3.5mm. People are picky, and would prefer not needing an RCA to 3.5mm adapter. Dunno if you covered this already
   
  Less illuminating led for as a power indicator, and placement considerably farther  away from the volume pot.
   
  Better 3.5mm headphone input. The E9's 3.5mm is extremely rough, and can be a chore to plug stuff into it.
   
  Please make sure there is ZERO noise when adjusting the volume. Almost everyone I know has this issue with the E9. Not a dealbreaker, but a minor annoyance.
   
  More transparency than the E7/E9. A lot of us would like to have an amp that is mostly like a 'wire with gain', where it doesn't impart it's own sonic signature to their headphones. I'm sure this was more the E7 adding a little bit of warmth, moreso than the E9 adding anything.


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## diodiel

ohhhh the fiio15 will have a better DAC&AMP  as e17 or same DAC but less AMP? ill prolly get torned between e9+e17 or e15 by itself


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## ProtegeManiac

Crap...E15 and E17 have all that and we have a local Fiio dealer, which cuts back on shipping cost on IBasso. Guess I'll just have to learn to wait.


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## tlniec

Wow, that E15 news came out of nowhere and sort of deflated my interest in the E17!  Now I'll just have to figure out what to do with the ol' E7+E9 once the E15 comes around.


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## tme110

nope, still waiting for the e17.


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## juman231

I wonder if E15 would look like E9 without the E7 dock...almost like A1?


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## JamesFiiO

not, it will be slim shape, total different with E9!


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## JamesFiiO

in our roadmap, E7+E9 is different kind of product with E17, as you can have a low at below, the sequency is depend on price from low to high
   
  1, E7:         Portable USB DAC+AMP,  USB 16BIT/48K                                                       US$100 (reference) 
  2, E9:         Desktop AMP                                                                                                 US$120 (reference) 
  3, E17:       Portable USB DAC+AMP,   USB 24BIT/96K, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$190 (reference) 
  4, E7+E9： COMBO                                                                                                         US$190 (reference) 
  5, E15:        Desktop USB DAC+AMP,  USB 24BIT/96K, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$290  (reference)
  6, E17+E9:  COMBO                                                                                                        US$290  (reference)
   
  So you can choose the best solution for yourself. 
   
  We may use the different DAC in E17 and E15 because some DAC need more power so it is not suitable in portable device.  if compare with the combo of E17+E9 with E15, you will find that 
   
  Or you get the best DAC or you get two device that is more  flexible.


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## latenlazy

How much power will the E17 be able to provide?


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## diodiel

oh man i guess this will make life harder but less boring ^_^ thanks feiao


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## Mad Lust Envy

Hmm, so depending on which comes out first, sticking with the E9 and just upgrading to an E17 may be more logical and versatile than the E15. However, if you're like me who doesn't use portable amps...ever, the E15 is probably gonna be more aestethically pleasing solution.

I may just end up selling my E7/E9 for cheap to get an E15. I have a feeling my D7000 will pair up better with these Fiios than with an overpowered amp like the Lyr which may have an audible noise floor with them, since they're so easy to drive.


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## diodiel

oh yea @madlustenvy i notice you have cool avatars all the time! you watch anime? lol pm me recommendations if you dont mind ^_^ thanks


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## hotsport

@290~300 $
  There are lot of other great hi-end product at that price point
  FiiO going to have tough time dealing with those
  = fiio should drop their expected price. LOL


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## ProtegeManiac

Quote: 





hotsport said:


> @290~300 $
> There are lot of other great hi-end product at that price point
> FiiO going to have tough time dealing with those
> = fiio should drop their expected price. LOL


 

 Then again they might sound just as good or better. E17 vs D12 maybe a good match; but I'm not too positive on Fiio's chances on E15 vs NFB-11.
   
  BUT, for me, they have an advantage. There's a brick n' mortar dealer here that sells Fiio products at around the online price, and my gasoline driving there is still cheaper than having the competition ship theirs. Not to mention our Customs people are liable for making audiophiles bald (tearing their hair out) while other people have snuck in loads of cameras and iPods and PSPs, so I might stick with Fiio mostly for this. Assuming they keep local prices at the same rates.


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## JamesFiiO

Quote: 





hotsport said:


> @290~300 $
> There are lot of other great hi-end product at that price point
> FiiO going to have tough time dealing with those
> = fiio should drop their expected price. LOL


 

  
  1, The final retail price depend on our seller.
   
  2, it is not a promise price, so it may expensive or cheaper, but I can find any Hi-End products is at such price, maybe you are talking something like a LOD.
   
  Anyway, it is a little hard to me to find some referent products, because I just know there are lots of pure solid amp is selling in usd500+, and I don't think $300 is too cheap to 
   
  talk about a hi end amp.


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## JamesFiiO

BTW, I don't want to compare with other brand, but obviously, it is not the same feature and spec.
   
  1, USB can only support to 16bit / 48k.
   
  2, the DAC is tow 8740.
   
  If we just change our E7 to such feature, the price will be less than $150 . and it is not means to do that because we wants to provide better products.


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## hotsport

Sorry for not making it clear. I was talking about E15 not e17.
  The other hi-end product I am talking about is audio-gd NFB11 (or FUN which $50 more) is around that market already
  Beside NFB12 is even cheaper. But it is true that fiio never disappoint us so I had better wait and see (hear)


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## JamesFiiO

NFB12 is very good products. but I notice that it is sold by the factory themself. so it is the best way to control the price, not sale agent not distributor. it is a good idea but it will also limited their business.


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## juman231

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> yes, the input output includes
> 
> Input: USB x1, Optical x1, Coaxial X1, RCA X 1 or 2,
> 
> ...


 

 I guess only one headphone out. Does this mean it E15 will likely come with a gain switch function?


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## JamesFiiO

yes, will includes a gain switch. and we are consider if we should add bass/treble adjust function


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## juman231

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> yes, will includes a gain switch. and we are consider if we should add bass/treble adjust function


 

  
  Oooh tasty. Is it also possible to add some mid adjustment function as well or is it technically impossible/very difficult?


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## quesce

I know we all love the waiting game, but any idea what approximate release dates we're looking at here?


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## JamesFiiO

since we had decided to develop E15 first, the ETA of E17 hard to decide now. but will be this year.
   
  the reason why we release our plan in here is , we wants to adopt some suggestion from our user, but it does make you feel it is a long time to wait it hit the market. usually it will take us 6 months from idea to the final product.


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## diodiel

i really like the functions of the nuforce hdp and icon 2. so i hope E15 will be similar to them... im planning to use my PC as a primary source, then ps3 as secondary, so coax,spdif/optical and usb input would be perfect! not necessarily need a stereo amp, i think a good pre-amp+headphone out would work  a remote would be a major + for the market too "like switching inputs and stuff! so everyone can just relax.. most people will probably use an active speaker to match it just in case,  and i hope the sound quality can be on par with the HDP and so on..  what do you think? thanks!   
  for E15 just hope its a lot better than E7. i cant wait! ill use the RCA out for a powered speakers. a remote would be fun tho to change inputs, volume, sleep mode but not necessary. treble & bass controls. i hope by the time its out, i have money again. 
  Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> since we had decided to develop E15 first, the ETA of E17 hard to decide now. but will be this year.
> 
> the reason why we release our plan in here is , we wants to adopt some suggestion from our user, but it does make you feel it is a long time to wait it hit the market. usually it will take us 6 months from idea to the final product.


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## Kagelou

hmmm I was planning on getting a E7+E9 for my future K701, but I guess I should put a hold on this...?


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## juman231

Feiao, is there any other news on the future products? I'm curious as to how things are going with the E15 and E17.


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## Kagelou

Same. Will the E15 be out in the Summer, Fall, or Winter?


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## ProtegeManiac

Wonder what the amp section's like on the E15...will it be basically the E9 with a good DAC?


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## Mad Lust Envy

I believe it's been said to be an internal E7/E9 all in one. The DAC portion will sound better because it doesn't have to go through the USB stuff, or whatnot. So it will yield better SQ than the E7/E9 together.


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## juman231

in the past page feiao did say amp section will be very similar to E9, but the DAC would sound different.


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## ProtegeManiac

Cool. I'm holding off other stuff for this, since I spend more time listening on a CDPlayer than on the PC, I can hold this off for a while.


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## Kagelou

This is what I wanted to hear. I was wondering if it would be better to just buy the E7/E9 combo or the E15 to power my future K701. But then again, I guess we'll have to see how good the E15 synergizes with the K701..?
  
  Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> I believe it's been said to be an internal E7/E9 all in one. The DAC portion will sound better because it doesn't have to go through the USB stuff, or whatnot. *So it will yield better SQ than the E7/E9 together.*


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## juman231

Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> I believe it's been said to be an internal E7/E9 all in one. The DAC portion will sound better because it doesn't have to go through the USB stuff, or whatnot. *So it will yield better SQ than the E7/E9 together.*





  Quote: 





kagelou said:


> This is what I wanted to hear. I was wondering if it would be better to just buy the E7/E9 combo or the E15 to power my future K701. But then again, I guess we'll have to see how good the E15 synergizes with the K701..?


 
   
  Actually, E15 is not going to be an internal E7/E9 combo. Few pages back, Feiao gave a short overview of his future product lines:
  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   in our roadmap, E7+E9 is different kind of product with E17, as you can have a low at below, the sequency is depend on price from low to high
   

  1, E7:         Portable USB DAC+AMP,  USB 16BIT/48K                                                       US$100 (reference) 

  2, E9:         Desktop AMP                                                                                                 US$120 (reference) 

  3, E17:       Portable USB DAC+AMP,   USB 24BIT/96K, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$190 (reference) 

  4, E7+E9： COMBO                                                                                                         US$190 (reference) 

  5, E15:        Desktop USB DAC+AMP,  USB 24BIT/96K, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$290  (reference)

  6, E17+E9:  COMBO                                                                                                        US$290  (reference)

   

  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Unlike the E7, the DAC that will be on the E15 will be able to do 24/96, which makes it closer to the DAC capabilities of the future E17. We can also see this implied when Feiao says in the few posts further back, when he says Fiio plans to develop E15 before E17 to save R&D cost.


----------



## Kagelou

So basically, E15 > E7/E9 combo right? Although it does cost around $100 more
  
  Quote: 





juman231 said:


> Actually, E15 is not going to be an internal E7/E9 combo. Few pages back, Feiao gave a short overview of his future product lines:
> in our roadmap, E7+E9 is different kind of product with E17, as you can have a low at below, the sequency is depend on price from low to high
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## maverickronin

kagelou said:


> So basically, E15 > E7/E9 combo right? Although it does cost around $100 more




But it also has more inputs and takes higher bit depths and sample rates, which may or may not be important to you.


----------



## diodiel

if i remember correctly, from pages back, they also mentioned that E15>E17/E9 besides E17/E9s flexibility. E15 should have a more powered DAC.
   
  going to choose between getting e15 or NFB12 >.< i think nfb12 supports up to 25/194KHz while E17 might have 24/96KHz.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





juman231 said:


> Unlike the E7, the DAC that will be on the E15 will be able to do 24/96, which makes it closer to the DAC capabilities of the future E17. We can also see this implied when Feiao says in the few posts further back, when he says Fiio plans to develop E15 before E17 to save R&D cost.


 
  The DAC in the E7 is perfectly capable of 24/96, it's just limited by the USB receiver chip. So yes, the E15 could just be an E7 and E9 combined and still do 24/96 through coax and optical, though still not through USB. HD music is possible over USB, but it generally requires specific chips and drivers that I don't think FiiO want to get into developing.
  You know how the X3 ought to sound better than the E7 because it's bypassing the USB decoder? Same principle.
   
  Oh, and how did I miss this thread?


----------



## juman231

Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> The DAC in the E7 is perfectly capable of 24/96, it's just limited by the USB receiver chip. So yes, the E15 could just be an E7 and E9 combined and still do 24/96 through coax and optical, though still not through USB. HD music is possible over USB, but it generally requires specific chips and drivers that I don't think FiiO want to get into developing.
> You know how the X3 ought to sound better than the E7 because it's bypassing the USB decoder? Same principle.
> 
> Oh, and how did I miss this thread?


 
   
  Quote:
  
   
  1, E7:         Portable USB DAC+AMP,  *USB 16BIT/48K *                                                      US$100 (reference) 

  2, E9:         Desktop AMP                                                                                                 US$120 (reference) 

  3, E17:       Portable USB DAC+AMP,   USB 24BIT/96K, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$190 (reference) 

  4, E7+E9： COMBO                                                                                                         US$190 (reference) 

  5, E15:        Desktop USB DAC+AMP,  *USB 24BIT/96K*, Optical/Coaxial 24BIT/128K            US$290  (reference)

  6, E17+E9:  COMBO                                                                                                        US$290  (reference)

   

  I don't know why I have to quote the same thing twice for someone not so observant. but, You're wrong.  Read more carefully before you say someone's wrong..


----------



## JoetheArachnid

http://www.wolfsonmicro.com/products/dacs/WM8740/
   
  Most importantly:

  Sampling frequency : 8kHz - 192kHz
  Input data word : 16 to 24-bit
   
  See also: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/pcm2706.html

 Sampling Rate: 32, 44.1, 48 kHz
   
  The E7 alone can not do 24/96, because it is only interfaced with through the above USB DAC chip. The main Wolfson DAC chip inside it, however, can. Were it that the E7 and E9 were put together so that the PCM2706 was bypassed and the input was 24/96 (or 24/192, though then there may be stability issues) through S/PDIF or I2S, then the chip would be able to decode those signals into analogue audio. My point was that the E15 could utilise the exact same components as the E7/E9 combo, but could have optical and coax inputs that would bypass the USB chip and so reach higher sampling rates and word counts.
   
  tl;dr - the bits are all there for hi-res but the USB screws it over.


----------



## juman231

Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> http://www.wolfsonmicro.com/products/dacs/WM8740/
> 
> Most importantly:
> 
> ...


 

 The DAC chip in the E7 might be capable of 24/96, but this does not change the fact that E7 as a device CANNOT do 24/96 with usb. Three posts above, what I meant by "DAC," was the DAC as a device inside the E15 combo, not the DAC chip (which I suppose was what led you to talk about WM8740's capabilities). Also, the DAC chip that will be used will be either AD1955 or PCM1798. So even in the technical sense(assuming E7 and E9 were implemented differently than they already are so that the usb receiver or whatever can be bypassed), E7 and E9 combined will NOT be the same as E15, unless you assume that any DAC that can do same bitrate/sampling frequency are considered the same. 

  I don't want to go into the technicalities of how chips are implemented and thus limitations are created and et cetera. The point I'm trying to make, is that from the configurations Fiio used in their products, and in a consumer's point of view, E7 is NOT able to do 24/94 with USB, nor does it have coaxial or optical input available, while E15 CAN do 24/96 with USB, and 24/128 with optical/coaxial.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

I never said that the E7 unit could do anything higher than 16/48, if I implied anything otherwise I apologise. I also said that the E15 _could_ use the same components as the E7/E9 and still achieve 24/96 over coax, not that it will or should, or that FiiO would choose to do anything like that. Anyway...


----------



## Kagelou

hm, well I think most of my music is 44kHz....and I don't really need the portability of the E7 since I am quite happy with my M50 and J3~
  
  Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


   
  I am also between those two. They are both in a similar price range (once the promo is done), but then again, we don't really know anything about the E15
  
  Quote: 





diodiel said:


> if i remember correctly, from pages back, they also mentioned that E15>E17/E9 besides E17/E9s flexibility. E15 should have a more powered DAC.
> 
> going to choose between getting e15 or NFB12 >.< i think nfb12 supports up to 25/194KHz while E17 might have 24/96KHz.


----------



## diodiel

yeahh if its the same performance, id go for fiio 
  Quote: 





kagelou said:


> hm, well I think most of my music is 44kHz....and I don't really need the portability of the E7 since I am quite happy with my M50 and J3~
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Kagelou

Same. Even if the only reason why the NFB-12 takes a long time to ship is because everyone is going after the promo, the shipping cost is still like $30~40 =/
  Quote: 





diodiel said:


> yeahh if its the same performance, id go for fiio


----------



## diodiel

i cant wait! good luck fiio in your productions!


----------



## CantScareMe

Hope there's a big enough difference between their products.
   
  Like the E15 beats the e7/e9 in sound quality all round. Not just something that gives a different sound flavour.
   
  Or similarly, the E17 easily beats the e7.
   
   
*And I also hope that they keep up the good build quality. Very very important.*


----------



## diodiel

yeah they just need to match and/or beat other amp/dac within their price range. like NFB12 and such


----------



## MrMike

Has there been any allusion to the E17 amp portion being the same or similar to the E11?
   
  I looked through this thread and a lot of the E11 thread, but I did not find anything.


----------



## JamesFiiO

Quote: 





mrmike said:


> Has there been any allusion to the E17 amp portion being the same or similar to the E11?
> 
> I looked through this thread and a lot of the E11 thread, but I did not find anything.


 


  Yes, we will use the same amp as E11 in our E17.


----------



## MrMike

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> Yes, we will use the same amp as E11 in our E17.


 
   
  Great, and thanks for the fast reply!


----------



## gavinfabl

Awaiting delivery of the E11 which will be my portable amp. When the E15 arrives I will use this at home and sell my E9/E7 combo for a neater look.


----------



## cactus_farmer

So let me get this straight - the E15 dac + amp one box solution will reportedly offer better quality than connecting the E17 to the E9?


----------



## JRG1990

I was wondering the same thing, which will be the best E15 or E17 & E9 combo?.


----------



## tme110

Personaly, I vote for the combo because I don't like combined devices.  I have the e7/e9 but  I usually have my MS2+ connected to the e9 - granted I'm sure you'll be able to connect another DAC to the e15 but you can't trade its DAC for something else.


----------



## SigInTheHead

I hope the E17 has the same form factor as the X3, would look nice paired up.
   
  As a preference I think that the display on the E7 is overkill, when i first had my E7 I thought is was really good. Now i also have an ibasso D12, and find that the controls are faster to use as i set the E7 to lock the keys and turn off the screen and save power. 
   
  It would also be nice if you could control the E17 from the X3 via a dock port connector. probably just dreaming though.


----------



## sheep duck

Quote: 





cactus_farmer said:


> So let me get this straight - the E15 dac + amp one box solution will reportedly offer better quality than connecting the E17 to the E9?


 


  also wondering this. awaiting a response from James!


----------



## richbass

Is the e17 out ? Can we dock into e9 instead of e7 ? What is e15 ?


----------



## tme110

Did you read any of this thread?  You can search in this thread too - there answers are there several times over including the previous page.  But no the e17 wont be out for a while - first the e11, then the e15 then the e17.


----------



## estreeter

'Incredible India' indeed.


----------



## JamesFiiO

E17 have the same dock as E7, so it can be docked into E9, so the user of E9 can upgrade the combo to 96k/24bit USB decode.


----------



## richbass

Quote: 





tme110 said:


> Did you read any of this thread?  You can search in this thread too - there answers are there several times over including the previous page.  But no the e17 wont be out for a while - first the e11, then the e15 then the e17.


 

 Nope, I didn't. Browsing H-Fi after monthsssssssss.
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> 'Incredible India' indeed.


 

 What do you mean ? X(


----------



## cactus_farmer

when is the estimated release date of the Fiio E17?
   
  If you know it, please be helpful (won't take long to type it out) rather than making me delve into this massive thread!!


----------



## ClieOS

FiiO generally doesn't want to keep a firm date for any future release. They just keep a relative date for the nearest release, and for what I know, E17 is not the nearest release just yet.


----------



## diodiel

still waiting for e15 updates!  i hope the dacs and etc... aren't outdated


----------



## sepinho

So feiao, will we be able to utilize the E17's coax and optical inputs while it's plugged into the E9? Has that question been answered yet? I would love to - and probaby will - get the E17 as a portable DAC for my Iriver, being able to use my CDPs optical out with it would just be the icing on the cake.


----------



## khaos974

I hope that both the E15 and the E17 will get an less than1 ohm output impedance to accommodate for low impedance headphones.


----------



## Jack C

Quote: 





sepinho said:


> So feiao, will we be able to utilize the E17's coax and optical inputs while it's plugged into the E9? Has that question been answered yet? I would love to - and probaby will - get the E17 as a portable DAC for my Iriver, being able to use my CDPs optical out with it would just be the icing on the cake.


 


  I don't know for sure, but it would really surprise me if the E17 would allow coax/optical inputs while docked to the E9. For one, it would be kind of messy to have wires stringing up to the E17 while it is docked, and optical cables are not very flexible. Of course you can use a L7 to get line out from the E17 and feed that into the E9 that way. 
   
  If you are playing music from a source that only provides coax/optical output, then the E15 will make more sense if you want to keep it as clean as possible in terms of equipment clutter. The E17/E9 combo will be for those who want the versatility of a portable/desktop combo, and primarily use computer as desktop source. 
   
  Jack


----------



## sepinho

Seeing how I will be getting an E9 soon and am planning on getting an E17 to connect to my Iriver via optical, it would be nice to be able to use gear I already have instead of buying yet another amp. I guess I'll just have to wait and see.


----------



## Jack C

You will definitely be able to do that - I just doubt you will be able to do that while the E17 is docked in the E9. You can feed optical to the E17 and use an L7 with the E17 to get line out and feed that into the E9.
   
  Jack


----------



## 021311

[size=medium]

  Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> E17 have the same dock as E7, so it can be docked into E9, so the user of E9 can upgrade the combo to 96k/24bit USB decode.







   
  I think you should have E17 out on the market before E15 then,

  because there still is a large amount of E9 inventory, and people who already has E9 will be able to use it.

  Rather than going to the E15, because having E15 is like stabbing your sale on E9 and E7/E17.

  I think people would like my plan better.

   ​[/size]


----------



## Croozer

Waiting for the E17.


----------



## megabass

Just about to click buy on e9/e7 combo.
   
  THIS SUCKS


----------



## megabass

bought bought e7 + e9
   
  life is too short to wait
   
  now I hope everything comes out next year


----------



## Remonster

Quote: 





megabass said:


> bought bought e7 + e9
> 
> life is too short to wait
> 
> now I hope everything comes out next year


 
  You won't be disappointed, I love my E7/E9. I'm interested in the new desktop amp but mainly out of curiosity, I can see myself being satisfied with the E7/E9 combo for quite a while I just wish I didn't have to turn both the E7 and E9 on and off separately.


----------



## JamesFiiO

Initial render design picture of E17!


----------



## winkyeye

First. looks great!


----------



## Croozer

*Nice.*


----------



## lee730

wow this is sick looking. Fiio don't change a thing lol keep this design. I'm curious to know what amp will be in it? The same amp as the E11? How good is the DAC in it as well? Not sure if it would compare to my DACport but it still looks nice.


----------



## SkinnyPuppy

When is this coming out?!?!?! CANNOT WAIT.


----------



## lee730

Quote: 





skinnypuppy said:


> When is this coming out?!?!?! CANNOT WAIT.


 


  Expect delays lol. Fiio has a tendency to push things back (then again that's better than releasing a sub-par device to begin with).


----------



## tme110

very nice


----------



## diodiel

omg so tempting!


----------



## 021311

I want the E17 so bad! I will pre-order it once available


----------



## redwarrior191

if i'm not mistaken, the e15 should come out first, right? how come the initial render of the e17 is out before e15?? am i getting the wrong info here??


----------



## Angelbelow

Awesome! Looking forward to more updates.


----------



## julianbell92

Lovely looking device, although might be more ergonomic to have the volume controls on the side as per the E7 and possibly the hold switch as well - this would allow for easier 'blind' operation, at least I think so anyway... thoughts? I'd keep the other switches on the front though. Speaking of the hold switch, it's great to see, one of the few negatives about the E7 as a whole was the lack of an elegant screen timeout and hold feature - just make sure the firmware switches the screen off when the hold switch is applied fiio!


----------



## julianbell92

Quote: 





lee730 said:


> wow this is sick looking. Fiio don't change a thing lol keep this design. I'm curious to know what amp will be in it? The same amp as the E11? How good is the DAC in it as well? Not sure if it would compare to my DACport but it still looks nice.


 


  feiao said a couple of pages back that the amp in the E17 is the same as the E11


----------



## KevinWolf

WOW, Fiio can't change the design, looks pretty good, I also agree that the buttons could be at the side, but the design is already great. I wasn't expecting to see such beautiful design. Now I just hope that the DAC sounds as good as it will look.


----------



## puresilence

Nice design. I'd love to get it and use it as my on-the-go DAC/Amp, especially if it's as powerful as the E11.


----------



## SkinnyPuppy

I just bought the E7, but I will buy this the first day it comes out. Would probably become THE portable amp/dac.


----------



## 021311

I don't see the COX/OPT in, but it says it's there...?


----------



## tme110

it has a coax in and includes a mini-RCA adapter to use a standard coax cable.


----------



## lee730

Quote: 





julianbell92 said:


> feiao said a couple of pages back that the amp in the E17 is the same as the E11


 
  Thanks man.  I swear I heard that before but just needed it confirmed. Who knows I may end up picking one up. Not sure if its necessary though. Looks real nice non the less.


----------



## julianbell92

Quote: 





021311 said:


> I don't see the COX/OPT in, but it says it's there...?


 


  If you look really closely on the picture, the socket which forms the second headphone out on the E7 (on the top) is a combined coax/opt in


----------



## megabass

Just got my E7. Even my laptop- Acer Timeline Realtek soundcard is better. Bass on E7 is enhance but lack definition and kinda sucks
   
  I got a HTC Desire HD phone, the volume is low. with E7  everything is enhanced, especially the bass on a Sony MDR XB700, a vibrating good fun. But because the phone music configuration sucks in the first place, not much enjoyable even amp up with E7 or better headphones. I think aplpe products is slightly better but need to wait for iphone 5 in September so stuck for a while.
   
  E7 is only good if you want to get a 20-30% enhancement on phone/mp3 player/netbook on the go, it cannot change the original source configuration much. For listening experience it can't even compare to $80 external computer sound card.  But compare to other similiar products, it is the best pound for pound in quality & value. Very unique and one of a kind.
   
  Unless E17 DAC can sound better than my cheap Realtek soundcard, and if the amp is the same as E7, might as well stick with E7.


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





megabass said:


> Unless E17 DAC can sound better than my cheap Realtek soundcard, and if the amp is the same as E7, might as well stick with E7.


 
  Hardware wise, E17 and E7 will be quite different.


----------



## lee730

Wow I'm surprised you find the e7 inferior to your realtek card? I find it better than my X-fi titanium card and that is definitely more expensive than your realtek and I would assume more better as it is a dedicated card as opposed to on-board. Guess very different ears. But the E7 doesn't compare to my UHA4. I also have the E9 amp and it does sound better on that as well. But the DACport with the E9 is much better.
  Quote: 





megabass said:


> Just got my E7. Even my laptop- Acer Timeline Realtek soundcard is better. Bass on E7 is enhance but lack definition and kinda sucks
> 
> I got a HTC Desire HD phone, the volume is low. with E7  everything is enhanced, especially the bass on a Sony MDR XB700, a vibrating good fun. But because the phone music configuration sucks in the first place, not much enjoyable even amp up with E7 or better headphones. I think aplpe products is slightly better but need to wait for iphone 5 in September so stuck for a while.
> 
> ...


----------



## megabass

Well it seems that Realtec is a solid performer buck for buck, that is why Acer use it. I got creative sound card before, so so.
   
  Without E7, the high on my Realtec sounded better on my Sennheiser HD25-1ii. With E7, the high is very harsh, I can feel mid is more detailed and bass is very sweet. But seriously what is wrong with the high. I have to stop listening after 20 minutes because it is tiring and making my ears uncomfortable, does not happen with Realtec.
   
  The DAC of E7's listening experience is comparable to a $50 sound card. Without DAC, on a crappy music phone, the E7 amp only amplified the crap quality, not enjoyable. The only selling point is the bass boost, for £58 to get this bass boost, it is a pretty high price. I will get a L3 and try on an apple product soon. If it can improve on the 2011 Macbook Air, worth it.
   
  E7's verdict:
  DAC- like a mediocre soundcard
  Amp- acceptable
  Bass boost- Sweet, love it. Britney Spears said gimme gimme more.
  Price- overall reasonable, not cheap.
   
  E17 for that price, better got a heaven sent DAC that make drastic difference, especially on apple's upcoming portable product, or else what is the point? For an average listening quality portable amp, E11got the job done well.
   
  E9 does not have connect the E7's bass boost, WHY? It is then just an amp to power over 80ohm cans, market got many similar amp at the same price. Still not a bad choice but personally I rather get a sweet tube amp from HK ebayers for the price.
   
  Bass boost is the most awesome part. But the overall improvement is not drastic enough for the hassle to carry around. If you got a crap netbook, E7 is a no brainer, best on market for the price. If you want quality portable listening- better get cowon or hifiman, mobile phone+ E7 or any portable amp won't do much difference. Saw the X3 is on the way- we shall see  
   
  Fiio is very innovative, also products are solid quality with attention to detail. Keepit up! 
   
   
  Quote: 





lee730 said:


> Wow I'm surprised you find the e7 inferior to your realtek card? I find it better than my X-fi titanium card and that is definitely more expensive than your realtek and I would assume more better as it is a dedicated card as opposed to on-board. Guess very different ears. But the E7 doesn't compare to my UHA4. I also have the E9 amp and it does sound better on that as well. But the DACport with the E9 is much better.


----------



## lee730

If you're looking for a decent upgrade maybe you should consider the UHA 4 amp/dac. I'm very happy with my purchase and I got it before they raised the price. Was $169.00 now its $200.00. This amp is better than the Arrow 3g which costs over $300.00
  
  Quote: 





megabass said:


> Well it seems that Realtec is a solid performer buck for buck, that is why Acer use it. I got creative sound card before, so so.
> 
> Without E7, the high on my Realtec sounded better on my Sennheiser HD25-1ii. With E7, the high is very harsh, I can feel mid is more detailed and bass is very sweet. But seriously what is wrong with the high. I have to stop listening after 20 minutes because it is tiring and making my ears uncomfortable, does not happen with Realtec.
> 
> ...


----------



## Somnambulist

Probably a dumb question, but I take it that if I get the upcoming X3 and get this as a superior DAC/amp section, I can then get an L7 to use it as a pure DAC and connect to any portable amp?


----------



## Jack C

Hey,
   
  Not sure if the opt/coax digital input would still function with the L7 connected. But if it does, then yes, you could have X3, E17, and a L7, and whatever amp you wanted to use. It'd be a cube by the time you are done, but it would be rather impressive. 
   
  Jack


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





somnambulist said:


> Probably a dumb question, but I take it that if I get the upcoming X3 and get this as a superior DAC/amp section, I can then get an L7 to use it as a pure DAC and connect to any portable amp?


 
  That seems possible. Though you will have to consider how much improvement you are going to get by using E17 as DAC only to feed another amp as X3 already has a line-out that you can use.


----------



## Somnambulist

I'm just thinking about an upgrade path that's cheaper than iPod > CLAS/Fostex HP-P1 > amp 
   
  The X3+E17 will probably be fine as is.


----------



## kite7

If the E17 does sound like the E11 then that is great. Hoping a release will still make it this fall


----------



## kite7

E17 ETA has been pushed back to Feb 2012
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/566321/initial-render-design-picture-of-e17/15#post_7742070


----------



## glassmoon

damn. gonna have to look elsewhere then... :mad:


----------



## puresilence

Oh well. Looks I'll stick with my E7 for little longer.


----------



## firev1

Thats good for me, my funds are running tight this year :3 I just bought my E11 and im loving it. Can't wait to get my X3 though.


----------



## Assimilator702

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> We had decided to develop E15 first, and them we can move the same DAC converter, 96k/24bit converter and some other technology  into E17, it can decrease the risk of R/D and
> 
> save some time. btw, E15 is more like a desktop E17 because some people ask us to develop such model.


 


  Thats exactly what I'm looking for....something I can use on my computer setup or move over to my dedicated CD player and not have to have 2 different setups.


----------



## Somnambulist

That's fine, gives me some more time to see if someone comes out that I could use it with now the X3 is on hold.


----------



## donunus

I can't wait to get my hands on the E15


----------



## ThaJM

Found out something interesting about the e17, Fiio said in another thread that they were investigating the possibility of MHL support.
  AFAIK this would mean compatibility with MHL supported android phones (e.g Samsung Galaxy S2) to be used as a dac! Pretty excited myself for possibly the first android-compatible dac. I could be wildly mistaken here though.


----------



## hotsport

Quote: 





thajm said:


> Found out something interesting about the e17, Fiio said in another thread that they were investigating the possibility of MHL support.
> AFAIK this would mean compatibility with MHL supported android phones (e.g Samsung Galaxy S2) to be used as a dac! Pretty excited myself for possibly the first android-compatible dac. I could be wildly mistaken here though.


 

  
  And he also said in other thread that fiio have already gave up that idea
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/572078/first-photo-of-e17/45


----------



## ThaJM

Thats disappointing... On the plus side, the e17 won't be delayed and since the only forseeable inhibition of developing a MHL compatible dac is power, maybe a desktop dac for android devices? Google has also hinted at opening up the mini-usb in android devices to accept other devices in the ice cream sandwich OS so im still allowed to dream


----------



## milosolo

The E17 looks very nice and the specs sound great. I just about pulled the trigger on an E11, then the E7/E9 combo. I'll wait for the E17. Main use will be connected standalone to ipod and occasionally for office workstation to bypass on board sound card. The E7/E17 form factor is a big plus for me because DAC and amp are in the same compact box. I don't really appreciate the benefits of separate DAC/amp with ipod as source because this combo seems to push the boundaries of "portable" too far imo.


----------



## turbolog

Hello Feiao. Why didn't you use a volume pot in e17, like e11?


----------



## JamesFiiO

Quote: 





turbolog said:


> Hello Feiao. Why didn't you use a volume pot in e17, like e11?


 


  Some reason:
   
  1, The size limited, a potentionmeter need a lots of space to install. we need to control the size of E17, and still can dock into E9. 
   
  2, The reliability, it is hard to prevent the unbalance and the adjusting noise of traditional potentionmeter.
   
  3, The feature,  E17 will have balance function, also Bass and Treble adjustable.


----------



## Anathallo

Love the digital volume - much better for sensitive portable iems/cans to avoid deafening yourself/channel imbalance!
   
  Still on track for February 2012?
  
  Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> Some reason:
> 
> 1, The size limited, a potentionmeter need a lots of space to install. we need to control the size of E17, and still can dock into E9.
> 
> ...


----------



## JamesFiiO

Quote: 





anathallo said:


> Love the digital volume - much better for sensitive portable iems/cans to avoid deafening yourself/channel imbalance!
> 
> Still on track for February 2012?


 

 Yes.


----------



## holden4th

So when is the E15 coming out? If I understand it correctly this will be a one box desktop DAC and I can partner that with my E9. The DAC in the E15 will be going into the E17.
   
  As it stands, I already have the E7 so If I get the E15 I will have a desktop setup (DAC/AMP) for home and also have the luxury of using the E7 as a portable? Or should I wait for the E17?


----------



## FuzzyD

I thought the E15 was going to be a desktop DAC and Amp in one unit. Not just a DAC?


----------



## concentrate

Yes E15 is an AIO unit. Holden4th has just not read anything in this thread.


----------



## holden4th

Quote: 





concentrate said:


> Yes E15 is an AIO unit. Holden4th has just not read anything in this thread.


 

 Yes, I've read the thread but wasn't sure. So what you are saying is that the E15 will be a desktop DAC/amp?
   
  If I get the E15 then I make my E9/E7 combo obsolete? At this stage I don't use the E7 as a portable.


----------



## tme110

you would.  But since you already have an e9 it would make more sense to wait and get the e17 to pair with it. but either way...


----------



## boymasskara

@sir Feiao
   
  I hope you'll have a DAP by that time so that we can use the portable DAC )


----------



## JamesFiiO

everything is possible, but we must do what we should do first, E17 will released soon, and we will send some review samples to headfonia, ClieOS after 2 weeks


----------



## FuzzyD

Any news on the E15?


----------



## milosolo

I am anxiously awaiting this!
  
  Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> everything is possible, but we must do what we should do first, E17 will released soon, and we will send some review samples to headfonia, ClieOS after 2 weeks


----------



## chinesedevil

Quote: 





fuzzyd said:


> Any news on the E15?


 


  I'm also interested in news of E15, thought it was supposed to be released first?


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

My E9 has a problem with the 1/4" input where it adds a little distortion/noise/slight hiss to the right channel. I don't like the way the 3.5mm input sounds in comparison, so I either get another E9 or something else. I'd like to know the timeframe for the E15, because I'd go for that right now.


----------



## hotsport

I think the latest news is fiio decided to go with the e17 first. So I suppose we won't be seeing e15 soon.


----------



## TigreNegrito

I've read this thread and some others front to back a couple times now and I don't see any mention of a crossover in the E7/E9/E17.  Is that not something Fiio is looking at or even offers on any of their other products? I enjoy the crossover effect on my Headroom amps and have seen some others, though not portable, that share this feature. Looking to adequately drive some Q701's which I just acquired, and the only thing I've plugged into so far that can do it was a $1200 HK home stereo amp.  While I'm not necessarily looking for something portable, I do appreciate a smaller footprint like the E9 and the idea of tweaking the EQ settings via E7 or future E17 is nice.  If it also had crossover, that'd be cherry on top!


----------



## ClieOS

tigrenegrito said:


> ...If it also had crossover, that'd be cherry on top!




It is called crossfeed. Crossover is another thing all together.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Ah, thanks for the clarification, ClieOS.  And is THAT available in Fiio products?


----------



## tme110

I think expecting crossfeed in budget, portable combined amp/DAC is asking waaaayyyyyyy too much.  Fiio makes nice products and I have several myself but they can't have everything. I have a few amps in the $1000-2000+ range and none of them have it either.


----------



## FuzzyD

Headroom manages it in their Bithead and Airhead. You're right though that crossfeed is rare, unfortunately. Practical Devices also uses it and they aren't terribly expensive.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Precisely, FuzzyD!  All those relatively inexpensive portable amps/DAC's have it on-board, which is why I was curious if Fiio was going to attempt the same kind of thing, or if the feature was so ubiquitous that they didn't even bother to mention it.  I assumed it was a relatively easy feature to incorporate, but after reading a few of the crossfeed threads, I see that it is more of a proprietary thing.
   
  I'm guessing that it would be something incorporated into the DAC portion and not the amp side of things, because my Bithead has a switch to turn the crossfeed on or off, but not the amp.  If I ended up getting just a better amp, I couldn't use the Bithead to add the crossfeed to the signal without a lot of distortion (via the doubly-amped signal).  I'm guessing at this last statement, but it seems reasonable based on what I've read here so far.
   
  So that kinda takes the Bithead out of the equation and leaves me with a void to fill via some other DAC.  I was hoping there was something out there like the Fiio that offered a two part solution to my situation: the necessity for an amp to drive the 701's at home (regardless of source) and the portability of a decent DAC/Amp for my IEM's while on the road.  Maybe that's too much to ask and I just need to stick with the Bithead for my IEM's and get a separate unit altogether for the 701's.
   
  What I didn't know until I started looking over this site a couple months ago was that the sampling rate for the Bithead maxes out at CD quality.  I have 1000's and 1000's of discs I now have to rip to a hard drive again, because the vast majority of them were ripped at a lower mp3 setting years ago. But I don't want to limit myself to not being able to appreciate the details of higher-end sources that I'm just starting to learn about here.  All of that in a nutshell basically puts me in the market for a newer/updated Amp/DAC unit.  Initially, I thought the E9 + E7/17 combo would achieve both needs, but it sounds like I have to do some more market research to find the best deal.
   
  To that end, thanks for all the help and guidance available here!


----------



## kingpage

Crossfeed is never implemented in the DAC portion, unless you want to wreck accuracy. It's always somewhere in the amp section.


----------



## ClieOS

tigrenegrito said:


> Ah, thanks for the clarification, ClieOS.  And is THAT available in Fiio products?




No that I know of. 




fuzzyd said:


> Headroom manages it in their Bithead and Airhead. You're right though that crossfeed is rare, unfortunately. Practical Devices also uses it and they aren't terribly expensive.




I have the BitHead as well as a Practical Devices XM3, plus a Meier Audio 3MOVE which also has crossfeed. It really isn't about who can put a crossfeed in but how well the crossfeed is implemented (there are quite a few different designs) The crossfeed in BitHead is great, but those in XM3 and 3MOVE don't really do much (despite the fact that 3MOVE sound a lot better than BitHead). So the answer isn't really as simple as just adding a crossfeed citcuit into an amp.

The easy way out is just to use a crossfeed filter / software in the PC to get the same effect. If the software is good, the result should be comparable to a hardware crossfeed since it is done in the digital domain and shouldn't affect the SQ much.


----------



## TigreNegrito

I stumbled across that concept just recently as well, ClieOS.  Since I'm basically starting from scratch here, what PC-based software program allows that kind of tweaking?  I see lots of folks referencing Foobar, but haven't really heard mention of anything else.  I'd kinda like that in place before I start re-ripping everything to a big external drive so that it can download the album cover/track lists, etc (I think that's called meta-data?) as I'm converting to lossless.
   
  FYI, I've been shutting off the crossfeed about 50% of the time lately.  I don't know if it has something to do with the 'burn-in' on these AKG's or not.  I couldn't stand not having it on during the first 100 hrs or so - felt like my the top of my head was being pushed off by high treble notes and the crossfeed effectively nulled that.  Now, however, the lower ends are becoming more pronounced and the overall sound more balanced.  It also depends on what I'm listening to at the time, and that changes frequently.  I never shut it off with my IEM's, though.
   
  Thanks for clearing up my misconception re: location of crossfeed, Kingpage!


----------



## ClieOS

I don't really use any EQ software so I am not sure which to recommend you. There are a few software EQ discussion in the computer-as-source forum but I don't remember the name of those thread anymore.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Thanks for the directions... I'll go look it up!


----------



## JamesFiiO




----------



## JamesFiiO




----------



## Anathallo

*Sits at computer, credit card in hand, waiting for release*


----------



## kicker

i have question when E15 will come out ? 
   
  and who is more powerful the E15 VS E9\E17 ?


----------



## TigreNegrito

So anyone who already has E7, can you please tell me if the shape is the same as an iPhone?  Looks like it is, but can't judge size on pics since there is nothing to compare it to.
   
  I'm in the market for a new phone as well, trying to choose between 4s or the new Galaxy Nexus, and it looks like the E17 (same shape/size as E7) will pair nicely with the 4s.
   
  Also, farther back in the thread, someone was talking about compatibility issues with Android... what's that all about?
   
  P.S. the pics look great!


----------



## julianbell92

Quote:


tigrenegrito said:


> So anyone who already has E7, can you please tell me if the shape is the same as an iPhone?  Looks like it is, but can't judge size on pics since there is nothing to compare it to.


 
   
   
  It's roughly the same shape as an iPhone 4/4S yes, but smaller and thicker. The E7 is roughly 95mm x 55mm x 14mm


----------



## Cino

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


>


 

 What a tease? If the price is right, I will go this route with Ultrasone Pro 900.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Thanks, Julian!  Gotta go look at that nexus still, but sounds like it will pair up better w/the 4s


----------



## tme110

If I remember correctly from a few months ago the issue you talk about had nothing to do with android at all. The commenter was talking about hooking a usb device up to a phone (which happened to be android) but you obviously aren't going to be able to do that.  The e17 will connect to an android phone just like any other phone or device - through an analog connection.  But like the e7 and almost all other portable DACs you will only be connecting it to a phone or ipod as an amp.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Quote: 





thajm said:


> Found out something interesting about the e17, Fiio said in another thread that they were investigating the possibility of MHL support.
> AFAIK this would mean compatibility with MHL supported android phones (e.g Samsung Galaxy S2) to be used as a dac! Pretty excited myself for possibly the first android-compatible dac. I could be wildly mistaken here though.


 


   


  Quote: 





hotsport said:


> And he also said in other thread that fiio have already gave up that idea
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/572078/first-photo-of-e17/45


 


   


  Quote: 





thajm said:


> Thats disappointing... On the plus side, the e17 won't be delayed and since the only forseeable inhibition of developing a MHL compatible dac is power, maybe a desktop dac for android devices? Google has also hinted at opening up the mini-usb in android devices to accept other devices in the ice cream sandwich OS so im still allowed to dream


 

 Gosh, it looks like this has everything to do with android devices.  I know you can connect any phone with a headphone jack into a unit with a compatible input, yet there are all these accessories available for iphones that utilize the connector on the bottom of the phone rather than the headphone-out jack.  I assumed that this had to do with wanting to bypass the iphone's DAC in the same way the USB connection supposedly bypasses the CPU's built-in DAC.  Is that the case?  Or maybe it's 180 degrees the other way and allows you to use apps on the phone as DACs?  It looks as if they've dropped the concept for the E17, but I'd still be curious to know.


----------



## lalavideos

im thinking of getting ultrasone pro 900's too...wt kinda amp u think will b good with this ??
  peace!!
  Quote: 





cino said:


> What a tease? If the price is right, I will go this route with Ultrasone Pro 900.


----------



## Huxley

From what i have read, they go very well with ibasso, i have a p4 on the way so can let you know what i think in a few days.


----------



## lalavideos

Quote: 





huxley said:


> From what i have read, they go very well with ibasso, i have a p4 on the way so can let you know what i think in a few days.


 

 thanks!!, keep us updated..., how about a portable amp??


----------



## ClieOS

An early sample of E17 is coming my way, probably be here by early next week. Should receive my T5 by tomorrow as well.


----------



## TigreNegrito

Jealous!


----------



## lalavideos

what sort of headphones r u gona use with the T5, are ultrasone 900's a good match up?
  im thinking of gettin T5 but jus cant afford it atm, im broke after buyin the headphones :S
   
  peace!


----------



## AykDaddy

Cool....keep us updated. Thinking about canceling my Digizoid v2 order for an E17...


----------



## ClieOS

lalavideos said:


> what sort of headphones r u gona use with the T5, are ultrasone 900's a good match up?
> im thinking of gettin T5 but jus cant afford it atm, im broke after buyin the headphones :S
> 
> peace!




Don't have any Ultrasone. You will have better chance of an answer if you ask me about IEM 



aykdaddy said:


> Cool....keep us updated. Thinking about canceling my Digizoid v2 order for an E17...




They are sort of two different product though. ZO2's main selling point is really the bass boost while E17 is more of a one-size-fits-all as it is DAC+amp.


----------



## AykDaddy

Absolutely, but in the end of the day i prefer the all-in-one solution somehow. And in the long run its cheaper too to stick with one device until you are ready to upgrade as opposed to having multiple devices


----------



## Huxley

Ibasso p4 warbler is a portable amp.
  Quote: 





lalavideos said:


> thanks!!, keep us updated..., how about a portable amp??


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





aykdaddy said:


> Cool....keep us updated. Thinking about canceling my Digizoid v2 order for an E17...


 


  i was going to get a ZO2 also...but then this came out. and the impressions from Mike at headfonia have been absolutley amazing. 
  E17>E10>E11>E7(amp wise)>ibasso sub zero
  from his tastes
   
  The E17 seems to have the best qualities of the E10,E7,and E11 all added together 
   
  my main desktop's audio chip is not that good, so i needed a DAC and also an amp  it also just happened to be christmas(i have a lot of money in reserve for my audiophile tastes, but i get a little more trigger happy in this time of the year  )


----------



## Sennhe1ser0fan

Does anyone think that the $150 price point suggested by Chung James on facebook will be accurate? If so, then this will be a very worthy investment, considering that The e7 plus the d3 for optical will cost you around $120 or more.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





sennhe1ser0fan said:


> Does anyone think that the $150 price point suggested by Chung James on facebook will be accurate? If so, then this will be a very worthy investment, considering that The e7 plus the d3 for optical will cost you around $120 or more.


 


  $150 has been the speculated price for months. not to mention Chung works at FiiO and provided me with information
   
  the FiiO E17 for anyone wondering
*200mW per channel @ 32 Ohms*
*Supports Mac*
   
   
  [size=medium]*Should be on Amazon the first day it is released*[/size]
   
  [size=xx-small]This is just what Chung told me in Facebook Messages[/size]


----------



## JamesFiiO

Sorry, maybe it is my mistake, but need to make it clear, 
   
1, I am not sure whether the E17 will be available on Amazon the first day when it is released because it depend on our agent, 
   
2, The retail price us$150 is just our suggested price to our sales agent, the real price  will be a little high at the beginning  because it is decided by our agents too.  but 
   
   as our experience that finally the retail price will close to our suggested price
   
3, feiao is  my user ID in head-fi which given by Jude ( it is a strange ID, lol ), and my name is James Chung, and welcome to be my friend on  facebook and follow me on
   
    twitter as below
   
    Facebook:  http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002942361670
   
    [size=medium]Twitter: [/size][size=medium]https://twitter.com/#!/James_fiio[/size]
      
   
   
   
Chung James


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> Sorry, maybe it is my mistake, but need to make it clear,
> 
> 1, I am not sure whether the E17 will be available on Amazon the first day when it is released because it depend on our agent,
> 
> ...


 

 the fact that it mght not be avaible first day and a little higher is a bit of a letdown. but is good for me also  I can't wait to get this thinng, and since it won't be avaible the first day and will be priced higher, i will have to wait for reviews 
   
  But still, the thing i thought was important none the less about the message was how much power this thing had and if it also supported the Mac 
  Thank you Chung for the information
   
Any word on what DAC and opamp is in this thing Chung?


----------



## ClieOS

DAC chip is the same as E10. WM8740 for decoding and TE7022 for 24/96 support over USB. While another Wolfson chip will handle the Coax / Optical-in and adds support for 24/192. The amp section is a new design featuring AD8692 and AD8397 in a pre- + power-amp setup. Volume is controlled by another chip which also handle the EQ and such.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> DAC chip is the same as E10. WM8740 for decoding and TE7022 for 24/96 support over USB. While another Wolfson chip will handle the Coax / Optical-in and adds support for 24/192. The amp section is a new design featuring AD8692 and AD8397 in a pre- + power-amp setup. Volume is controlled by another chip which also handle the EQ and such.


 


  wow..this is some fancy stuff right here. 
  How will i be able to use the fancier 24/192 Woflson chip with coaxil? Through my computer?  and it now also has a pre amp inside. wow 
   
  Ok Quick question. my desktop only has optical out and i plan to use that with this.
  http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10229&cs_id=1022904&p_id=2763&seq=1&format=2
  this cable will work, i know that, but is it worth it from between 12 to 6ft to go the fiber route and pay an extra $15 for a Toslink Fiber optical cable?( or are all Toslink optical cables Fiber already, the facts aren't straight >_< )
   
  I heard there is jitter and something about signal degration the longer the cable. is this true? and to what extent?
   
  Would Getting an dedicated coaxial output on my desktop be better? I also have a macbook pro. IT doesn't' have optical out but i heard from the monoprice video that you can just use the min toslink adpater(that comes with the E17) and plug it into the headphone out. Will this be able to output 24bit 192 KHz to the E17? or can i only do that with a full optical out on my computer like my desktop has


----------



## ClieOS

All Toslink cable are fiber optic so you don't need any fancy cable for it. Signal degradation is mainly issue when you run it for long distance and jitter is mainly issue for the SPDIF chip, neither is something you can fix with fancy cable.

Unless Macbook's optical is really bad, I really don't think you will hear much difference between its optical and an extra COAX adapter. It shouldn't have any problem outputting 24/192 but I can't confirm it (as I am not a Mac user). Most Mackbook already has the optical out built into the headphone-out, so check your spec.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> All Toslink cable are fiber optic so you don't need any fancy cable for it. Signal degradation is mainly issue when you run it for long distance and jitter is mainly issue for the SPDIF chip, neither is something you can fix with fancy cable.
> Unless Macbook's optical is really bad, I really don't think you will hear much difference between its optical and an extra COAX adapter. It shouldn't have any problem outputting 24/192 but I can't confirm it (as I am not a Mac user). Most Mackbook already has the optical out built into the headphone-out, so check your spec.


 

 Ok thank you. Yes the MAcbook's do, i was just making sure about signal degration and all that. I can't wait for the E17 now that I now what to use and do  and monoprice has the fancy cables just so cheap >_<


----------



## wacomme

Instead of an e7/e9 combo, would the e17 not only fulfill the want for a portable amp, but provide an amp/dac to run my Audioengine a2's connected to my imac?


----------



## Systematic

Sorry for jumping into this thread, but I have a few questions about the Fiio E17. I'm currently debating on getting the E9 and holding off on the E7 to wait for the E17.
   
  Would the E9 and the E17 be the best combo for dac/amp?
   
  I have a AKG K702 and I'm waiting patiently and debating whether to make  the purchase for the E9 right now.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





systematic said:


> Sorry for jumping into this thread, but I have a few questions about the Fiio E17. I'm currently debating on getting the E9 and holding off on the E7 to wait for the E17.
> 
> Would the E9 and the E17 be the best combo for dac/amp?
> 
> I have a AKG K702 and I'm waiting patiently and debating whether to make  the purchase for the E9 right now.


 


  I don't know if it would be the "best" per see. But if you need all it's functions then yes. As in, you will get a good desktop station for $250. It will have a nice 192KHz @ 24bit Wolfson DAC if you use the optical out on it, or coaxil and then the E9 will basically amp all you want. And then... it's also portable. you can then just grab the E17 up and use it with your ipod or PMP device. So yeah if you are looking for both portability AND desktop use and has a lot of features. This is for you. if you are mainly at home, then looking at desktop ones like the Maverick Tube Magic D1 ($200) might be a bit better. But overal. Yes the FiiO E9 and E17 will basically give you the best "combo" if you need it for desktop use, gaming use, portable use and what not.


----------



## Systematic

Thank you very much for your input!


----------



## AxelCloris

One thing I'm curious about with the E17 is battery life. We're seeing an overall upgrade to the E7 which has great battery life. I haven't read anything about the size of the battery going into the new E17 and I'm wondering if we should expect a shorter time between trips to the plug.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





axelcloris said:


> One thing I'm curious about with the E17 is battery life. We're seeing an overall upgrade to the E7 which has great battery life. I haven't read anything about the size of the battery going into the new E17 and I'm wondering if we should expect a shorter time between trips to the plug.


 


  ..that's a good question. with 2 DAC's and 2 amps . that's sure to take up much more power. The DAC's wion't be used both at once..but weather it is in an off or power saving state or anything is still a mystery.  and then add in the fact that the amp is more powerful than the E7's (115mW @32Ohms for the E7 and 200mW @ 32Ohms for the E17) ...in the same sized body. i'm gonna guess a hit. 75% of the E7's? what if they introduced a new battery? Smaller and better? >_<


----------



## AxelCloris

Well from what I understand the E7 is sporting a 1050mAh which is actually pretty impressive for its size and price. There are a few smartphones out there today with smaller batteries than that. And I know Chung mentioned that they were doing their best to keep the form small for portability by using buttons instead of a pot and such. So I'm really interested to know if we can expect the same 1050mAh in the new E17 or if they're going to sacrifice a little bit of the compact goal in order to negotiate a battery life that can match the less power hungry E7.
   
  And if they've managed to get all the internals in the E17 running at the same power consumption of the E7 then they're not engineers, they're wizards.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





axelcloris said:


> Well from what I understand the E7 is sporting a 1050mAh which is actually pretty impressive for its size and price. There are a few smartphones out there today with smaller batteries than that. And I know Chung mentioned that they were doing their best to keep the form small for portability by using buttons instead of a pot and such. So I'm really interested to know if we can expect the same 1050mAh in the new E17 or if they're going to sacrifice a little bit of the compact goal in order to negotiate a battery life that can match the less power hungry E7.
> 
> And if they've managed to get all the internals in the E17 running at the same power consumption of the E7 then they're not engineers, they're wizards.


 

 if they can get it to use the same battery. i will bow my head. and like you said. same battery and power consumption. We got some wizards there.
   
  2 DAC's and not knowing if the not used one will be in a sleep state or off state. and then with two amps(pre and power) outputting 200mW...almost double what the E7 could pull..wow.. We would indeed have some wizards in here...heck they are almost wizards already. I can already feel the E17 in my hands. im not that well versed in sound science yet
http://www.analog.com/en/all-operational-amplifiers-op-amps/operational-amplifiers-op-amps/ad8397/products/product.html
http://www.analog.com/en/all-operational-amplifiers-op-amps/operational-amplifiers-op-amps/ad8692/products/product.html
  but wow..look at this. the AD8397 has two op amps and then the AD8692 seems to be an main amp. probably what clieos meant by
 "AD8692 and AD8397 in a pre- + power-amp setup."
and then the WM8740 and then an unknown woflfson being able to output 24/192..
Edit:hmm..it seems the WM8740 supports a max sample of 192KHz....why another one..don't get. whatever has two wolfsons


----------



## AxelCloris

The good news is that we won't have to wait (hopefully) too long before we get to hear ClieOS's first impressions. I'm really looking forward to the writeup.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





axelcloris said:


> The good news is that we won't have to wait (hopefully) too long before we get to hear ClieOS's first impressions. I'm really looking forward to the writeup.


 


  haha yeah me too. the amping and DAC's really baffle me. both the two amps seem to have 2 operational amplifiers or units in them each :/ ???? and then the WM8740 already supports up to 192KHz....?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> ..that's a good question. with 2 DAC's and 2 amps . that's sure to take up much more power. The DAC's wion't be used both at once..but weather it is in an off or power saving state or anything is still a mystery.  and then add in the fact that the amp is more powerful than the E7's (115mW @32Ohms for the E7 and 200mW @ 32Ohms for the E17) ...in the same sized body. i'm gonna guess a hit. 75% of the E7's? what if they introduced a new battery? Smaller and better? >_<


 

 There is only one DAC (WM8740) inside, the other Wolfson chip is a SPDIF transcoder as WM8740 doesn't handle SPDIF by itself.
  
  Quote: 





axelcloris said:


> The good news is that we won't have to wait (hopefully) too long before we get to hear ClieOS's first impressions. I'm really looking forward to the writeup.


 

 Due to holidays, the E17 shipment has been delayed. Should be here tomorrow though and I'll post an impression once I have a listen.

  
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> haha yeah me too. the amping and DAC's really baffle me. both the two amps seem to have 2 operational amplifiers or units in them each :/ ???? and then the WM8740 already supports up to 192KHz....?


 
  Most opamp has two internal opamps on one chip (a stereo / dual opamp) as one handles right channel while the other handles left channel. Some opamp only has one circuit as they are for mono channels. You can use two mono opamp to create a stereo circuit and usually you will have better stereo separation (*less crosstalk) than using a dual opamp. The downside is that it will take more space.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> There is only one DAC (WM8740) inside, the other Wolfson chip is a SPDIF transcoder as WM8740 doesn't handle SPDIF by itself.
> 
> 
> Due to holidays, the E17 shipment has been delayed. Should be here tomorrow though and I'll post an impression once I have a listen.
> ...


 

 ok thanks for the information. so can you explain it if possible in almost layman's terms the use of the two amps in the pre+- power amp setup? is it that one of the amps is used as a pre amp while the other is the actual full blown amp?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> ok thanks for the information. so can you explain it if possible in almost layman's terms the use of the two amps in the pre+- power amp setup? is it that one of the amps is used as a pre amp while the other is the actual full blown amp?


 
  The way FiiO has the pre / power opamp setup is a little similar to speaker amp. So one opamp is the preamp while the other is the power amp. Preamp is to amplify the signal to a higher level (voltage wise) while the power amp provide the current needed to drive headphone. This is how FiiO tends to like to design their amp circuit and similar concept (though different opamps) is also used on E5, E6 and E7.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> The way FiiO has the pre / power opamp setup is a little similar to speaker amp. So one opamp is the preamp while the other is the power amp. Preamp is to amplify the signal to a higher level (voltage wise) while the power amp provide the current needed to drive headphone. This is how FiiO tends to like to design their amp circuit and similar concept (though different opamps) is also used on E5, E6 and E7.


 


  ok that's kinda what i thought it did. Thank  you ClieOS!  I am looking forward to your review. im sure thousands that have seen this page are also waiting


----------



## JamesFiiO

When we release E9, some users complained that they can not use the bass boost of E7 when E7 dock into E9, because E9 use the line out signal from E7.
   
So we add a switch this time, so everyone will be happy because they can select what kinds of signal from E7 when they dock into the E9.


----------



## bowei006

*new pics *
http://www.hifitogo.com/nl/blog/fiio-e17-komt-er-aan/

   

   

   
   
  The website roughly says:
FiiO is revealed and the E17 is coming! Early next year, you have it. The E17 is an improved version of the E7, with a stronger and better amplifier and the icing on the cake are able to receive a digital signal to an optical or coaxial connection. Both the E7 and theE11 have now built a large fan base, the E17 will certainly be no different.

Unlike the E7 to E17 also received 96/24 via USB, the EQ is further expanded, while the more powerful amplifier. Very promising!

Besides all the technical updates FiiO has also invented a new name. From the Alps E17 (officially known as the E17), all new ampsby the name of a famous mountain range. I wonder what else they go out of their hat-making in 2012!


----------



## TigreNegrito

For those that were curious, it looks like a big hit on the battery life... from 80 hours on E7 down to 15 on Alpen.  A fair price to pay for all they crammed into a device 3mm thinner than the E7, I should think!  Just ordered and overnighted the E9 to myself so I'll have a nice place to set it when Alpen finally hits the shelves!


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





tigrenegrito said:


> For those that were curious, it looks like a big hit on the battery life... from 80 hours on E7 down to 15 on Alpen.  *A fair price to pay for all they crammed into a device 3mm thinner than the E7, I should think!*  Just ordered and overnighted the E9 to myself so I'll have a nice place to set it when Alpen finally hits the shelves!


 

 I will think so. There isn't another portable headphone amp in the same price range right now that can do half the stuff built into E17 / Alpen. In fact, I don't think you can find one even if you double the price range. It would have been even better if X3 was able to make it to market and we will have some killer combo there.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> I will think so. There isn't another portable headphone amp in the same price range right now that can do half the stuff built into E17 / Alpen. In fact, I don't think you can find one even if you double the price range. It would have been even better if X3 was able to make it to market and we will have some killer combo there.


 
   
  That's why I buy FiiO  X3 is the Portable media player with the good dac and amp inside right?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> That's why I buy FiiO  X3 *is* the Portable media player with the good dac and amp inside right?


 

 Was. It is no longer in development.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> Was. It is no longer in development.


 


  FiiO is no longer in the game to develop a portable media player!!??? Are they postponing it for after the E15...or is it just ...dead?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> FiiO is no longer in the game to develop a portable media player!!??? Are they postponing it for after the E15...or is it just ...dead?


 


 Presumably dead for now, possibly another DAP project in a year or two when they feel more ready.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> Presumably dead for now, possibly another DAP project in a year or two when they feel more ready.


 








 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 hmmm that may be smart. FiiO is a relatively unknown brand in the world. Their revenue comes off us. the audiophiles. but not all audiophiles will need a DAP. and then there's the competition with HiFi man who has more money to go into R&D and marketing as they have expensive headphones to boot. :/ maybe one day when the FiiO name has spread they could go back and do this again


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> hmmm that may be smart. FiiO is a relatively unknown brand in the world. Their revenue comes off us. the audiophiles. but not all audiophiles will need a DAP. and then there's the competition with HiFi man who has more money to go into R&D and marketing as they have expensive headphones to boot. :/ maybe one day when the FiiO name has spread they could go back and do this again


 
  It is not about the risk at this point. X3 fails because of supplier issue, so FiiO want to bring the production in house. They will need a new team of engineers (which are actually rare in China now) that can do both R&D and manufacturing, especially on firmware development That will take a lot of time and effort so they don't want to rush it.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> It is not about the risk at this point. X3 fails because of supplier issue, so FiiO want to bring the production in house. They will need a new team of engineers (which are actually rare in China now) that can do both R&D and manufacturing, especially on firmware development That will take a lot of time and effort so they don't want to rush it.


 
  wow. you have a lot of insider knowledge  great to know this too


----------



## skiam

Can't wait for e17 to come out and try it out with my Pro 900s
   
  My only concern is, hope amazon.com can ship internationally or at least amazon.ca can carry it so I can purchase it. Living in Canada sucks sometimes in terms of getting products. 
   
  Thanks bowei006 and ClieOS for your clarifications


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Can't wait for e17 to come out and try it out with my Pro 900s
> 
> My only concern is, hope amazon.com can ship internationally or at least amazon.ca can carry it so I can purchase it. Living in Canada sucks sometimes in terms of getting products.
> 
> Thanks bowei006 and ClieOS for your clarifications


 


  haha yeah. i knew you either lived in the U.S or Canada due to your English and all those other little things. When you asked about availbility i knew 99% that you lived in Canada. ha. but yeah. if you know a place that currently ships fiio products. they should have them. not at the beginning probably but soon.
   
  if you have Optical out or Coaxil that will be your best option  USB would be second best for your computer. and then using an LOD with your ipod would be tremendous. Make sure the FiiO LOD uses HPC22W wire. the L9 does and a nother straight cabled one does too. the rest don't use it and have been noted to not be as good as teh ones with the thicker and higher quality cable


----------



## Arundor

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Can't wait for e17 to come out and try it out with my Pro 900s
> 
> My only concern is, hope amazon.com can ship internationally or at least amazon.ca can carry it so I can purchase it. Living in Canada sucks sometimes in terms of getting products.
> 
> Thanks bowei006 and ClieOS for your clarifications


 
   
  I also live in Canada and am worried about the same thing. I'd keep an eye on Headphone Bar as they're a Canadian company that stocks Fiio's current products (the only one I know of), so we can hope that they will carry the e17 and e15 in the future.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





arundor said:


> I also live in Canada and am worried about the same thing. I'd keep an eye on Headphone Bar as they're a Canadian company that stocks Fiio's current products (the only one I know of), so we can hope that they will carry the e17 and e15 in the future.


 


  see that works  headphone bar is your savior  After the ZO2 more or less began bombing. the E17 came to us as our savior!!
   
  if FiiO did/was able to make an X3...i would call them the new Budget Hifiman that hifiman would need to seriously..really seriously watch out for. Pushing out an E17, E15, and X3....wow. that would make FiiO top my list


----------



## gcameron

so when is the FiiO e17 due out anyway?
   
  the output on my e5 is acting a bit wierd and i need a replacement


----------



## ClieOS

It will likely start shipping out to distributor before the last week of this month. You will most likely see it hits the store by early next.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





gcameron said:


> so when is the FiiO e17 due out anyway?
> 
> the output on my e5 is acting a bit wierd and i need a replacement


 


  that's what happened to mine. it seems teh initial bath of E5's had a faulty problem with the output jack side of the E5 where it became loose. For me and others with this faulty bath, the left channel would cut out. I have yet to receive word from Dealerextreme where i bought it from. My last option would be to call FiiO up again and ask for help in dealing with this issue. Or i'll just send my E5 over to the PRC and get it fixed. (no fault in having 2 amps right?) Yes, I speak Chinese and yes.....you have to call at like 10PM EST to get a hold of them.


----------



## eyrepm

The e17 and e7 are very interesting products. I am thinking of trying a DAC, an Argon DAC1, which sells for a pretty ok price in Norway. Desktop. It has these specs:
   

 Stereo PCM D/A-konverter
 Maksimal bitrate: 24-bit/96kHz
 Digitale innganger: USB, optisk, coaxial
 Analog audio-ut: L/R (RCA)
 Chipset: 24-bit Wolfson WM-8740 (DAC), TI-DIR9001 (digital receiver), TENOR-TE7022 (USB-dekoder), NS-LM4562 (OPAmp)
   
 Is it possible to tell from this if it is a better choice to go with e17? It has no EQ possibilities, this Argon.
  
 Also, I am mainly using 44.1/16-files, so will I notice any difference between e7 and e17? Because I have a mac, and thus I can run an optic cable to the e17, and am I right to think this will decrease things like jitter? even though I have personally not heard such things yet, as I have never tried a standalone DAC. Is the optic-in a good reason even for 44.1/16-files?
  
 Thank you


----------



## shamankl

Quote: 





eyrepm said:


> The e17 and e7 are very interesting products. I am thinking of trying a DAC, an Argon DAC1, which sells for a pretty ok price in Norway. Desktop. It has these specs:
> 
> 
> Stereo PCM D/A-konverter
> ...


 

 it seems you are saying you dont have a dac yet and that will definitely help make produce more music, it helps if u told us your headphone or speaker
   
  i dont have either the argon or e17(not out yet), but if its usb it will both be 24/96. so unless one company built a better system it will be very similar dac wise(e17 is also an amp if mobilly used)
   
  simply put, better(often more expensive) equipment usually sounds better; the only situations this is not true is if ur amp doesnt match your hp or u find your music satisfactory already
   
  SRY guys ... wat i just said is definitely offf topic


----------



## eyrepm

My headphones are Grado SR60i and my amp is an Argon HA1, a simple amp. Although I can see that the e17 has an amp, and I am also considering the e9 to go with. My question is this, is it best to go with e17, or maybe just e7, or the other argon? I'm awfully sorry if this is completely off topic, but I am quite interested in the e17, so I appreciate any help.


----------



## shamankl

ur headphone is 32ohm so amp benefit is minimal, but probably noticable if u have flac or lossless(if u want a e9). if u dont have that type of file then e7 is enough, but if u do then consider the e17. it has eq functions as well as a 24/96 dac. if u want to buy a whole dac and amp i think the audist mx1 and nfb12 should also be some of your options. I heard grado tend to do well with nfb12(do a little reaseach on this forum... ). Hope that helped a little


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





eyrepm said:


> My headphones are Grado SR60i and my amp is an Argon HA1, a simple amp. Although I can see that the e17 has an amp, and I am also considering the e9 to go with. My question is this, is it best to go with e17, or maybe just e7, or the other argon? I'm awfully sorry if this is completely off topic, but I am quite interested in the e17, so I appreciate any help.


 


  The E17 while using optical or coaxil supports up to 24/192. That is a plus. The E17 has two amps in it. one to amplify the voltage to a higher level(pre amp) and one to drive the headphones(Thx to ClieOS for this info) . otherwise they have same DAC. how they utilize the DAC and other parts internally can change the sound drastically though.
   
  i looked up the argon
http://www.head-fi.org/t/377031/argon-ha1
   
  quote from partysnatcher



Spoiler: Partysnatcher%20quote



 
"Conclusion:
I want my beef back 

 But I will be giving the Argon a week to grow on me.


Edit: Found a quote here http://www.minhembio.com/forum/index...wtopic=212787:

  Quote:


 Argon HA1 testas i senaste HiFi&Musik tillsammans med en rad andra hörlursförstärkare, där HA1 är billigast. Den får sämst ljudbetyg (6/10) av de testade men anses ändå vara en bra uppgradering jämfört med ett vanligt luruttag.



Since this is a Scandinavia only product, I assume most interested partys can read this, but here's a translation anyway:

*Argon HA1 was tested in the latest HiFi&Musik (a magazine) with several other headphone amps, where HA1 was the cheapest. It got the worst sound score (6/10) of the tested amps, but is still considered a nice upgrade compared to a "normal" headphone out."*
   


   
  The review for the Argon does not look good :/ with FiiO's (now) legendary quality
  . And how many ppl buy them and how well known they are. I would say/guess the E17 is a better buy


----------



## AtlantasRealtor

Hi All,
  
 Here's some great news from the Android development team on adapting android devices to supply high end audio applications:
  
http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2011/11/updated-ndk-for-android-40.html

   
http://www.khronos.org/opensles/
   
http://www.khronos.org/files/opensl-es-1-1-quick-reference.pdf
   
  I'm betting Android 4+ equipment will soon be directly supplying DACS with high resolution content.  The mini USB port is already well established as a physical link.
   
I have an E7/E9 and am looking forward to the new gear.
   
Do you think this new technology will supply the E17 directly with high end source streams for conversion?
   
   
  Mike


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





atlantasrealtor said:


> Do you think this new technology will supply the E17 directly with high end source streams for conversion?


 

 No. Any hardware that want to support that new standard will likely need new hardware as well.


----------



## shamankl

sry if im a noob but about when is the e17 going to be avaliable?


----------



## tme110

next month but that was just asked and answered a few hours ago.


----------



## jdenn

Do we have any idea about pricing for the e17?


----------



## Evarin

Quote: 





jdenn said:


> Do we have any idea about pricing for the e17?


 


  This is from the review thread via ClieOS" MSRP is about $150, which is not bad consider a iBasso D-zero (which has much less features) goes about $125 or so. However, FiiO usually let the dealer has the final say on what price they want to put on so you can probably expect it to be around $150~$175."
   
  Here is the link to the thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/587912/fiio-e17-alpen-frist-impression


----------



## tme110

Thanks for the link, I think I missed that one.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





yifu said:


> Direct rips from reel tapes or vinyl or SACDs or DVD audios. Some sites have got 24/96 as well like HDtracks and there are a few others.


 


  What other sites can I get High quality music from? Most all my music is itunes and some CD rips... had I known, would have used other sites. Sadly I already built up my music library, using up lots of cash... to re-purchase would be insane. Maybe just specific songs I really like... (purchase again).


----------



## RealSlimSeto

I take it that the E10 is better for (exclusively)home usage?


----------



## ebmp19

Isn't it released...? It's on the fiio website and says buy now. I made a thread but I guess everyone only talks here. Should I get an e7/e9 combo or wait a month and get an e7/e17 combo? I mostly listen to lossless music. I have beyerdynamic dt770 pro 250ohm headphones.


----------



## ebmp19

Or maybe just get an e17 as it should be able to handle 250ohm headphones  shouldn't it?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> I take it that the E10 is better for (exclusively)home usage?


 

 If you have no use for SPDIF and purely want something for PC, it makes more sense to get the E10 instead as it is nearly half the price.
   


  Quote: 





ebmp19 said:


> Isn't it released...? It's on the fiio website and says buy now. I made a thread but I guess everyone only talks here. Should I get an e7/e9 combo or wait a month and get an e7/e17 combo? I mostly listen to lossless music. I have beyerdynamic dt770 pro 250ohm headphones.


 

 It is not released yet - late this month or early next.


----------



## ebmp19

They really give the appearance of it being released with the product on their website and their facebook posts go - e17 coming soon and then a bit higher- New DAC and amp e17. IDK if you've seen these pictures but I will post them again


----------



## shotgunshane

Preorder is up on Mp4nation.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





unityispower said:


> What other sites can I get High quality music from? Most all my music is itunes and some CD rips... had I known, would have used other sites. Sadly I already built up my music library, using up lots of cash... to re-purchase would be insane. Maybe just specific songs I really like... (purchase again).


 


  head fi doesn't encourage music places. or how to atain these lossless music on public and searchable forums. PM me for more info


  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> I take it that the E10 is better for (exclusively)home usage?


 

 If u just use it at home. Then yes
   


  Quote: 





ebmp19 said:


> Or maybe just get an e17 as it should be able to handle 250ohm headphones  shouldn't it?


 

 After posting and spamming all these FiiO pages i have learned. You get whatever depending on use and if you need it or not. Do you need the better sounding amp? Do you need the more powerful amp? Do you need optical and coaxil capabilites or am thinking about using them? Are you going to be using the DAC? IF you answer is yes to most of these questions. The E17 is for you. 
   


  Quote: 





ebmp19 said:


> They really give the appearance of it being released with the product on their website and their facebook posts go - e17 coming soon and then a bit higher- New DAC and amp e17. IDK if you've seen these pictures but I will post them again


 

 There is no new DAC in the E17. Same WM8740 in others. New DAC would require too much power, and they've already cut almost 80% off the life of E17 as compared to the E7 even with the 50% larger battery :O


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> head fi doesn't encourage music places. or how to atain these lossless music on public and searchable forums. PM me for more info
> 
> If u just use it at home. Then yes
> 
> ...


 

 ? Their is a forum on HDtracks.... what are you talking about.. why is this... elaborate please.
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/476089/head-fi-and-hdtracks-david-chesky-collaborate-to-assemble-a-headphone-system-test-album/255#post_8030468


----------



## Sennhe1ser0fan

Can't wait to use the e17 with my PS3 through optical, while playing Skyrim and outputting to my modded HD 558s!


----------



## DKaz

What happened to the e15?  Is it still in the works?  Any potential release timeframe?


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





dkaz said:


> What happened to the e15?  Is it still in the works?  Any potential release timeframe?


 


  if you look in the early pages of this thread. the E15 was supposed to come out first and lay down the pavement for the E17, but they decided differently. they are now doing the E17 first. Cancelled/postponed the X3 PMP and is working on the E15 next. The E15 will probably take a while :/ they have not yet even finished everything with the E17, then they have to support and ship and do all the arrangements with the E17 after it's shipped and other stressfull stuff. and then they need to add a splash screen to the second batch of E17's(first batch won't have the "Alpen" sign pop up when u boot up... i don't care for this, i'll buy first batch.)


----------



## tme110

There's already way many e17 threads, I wonder how many there will be once people start getting them


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





tme110 said:


> There's already way many e17 threads, I wonder how many there will be once people start getting them


 

 There's only about 3 that are used or have traffic. but yeah. imagine all the "review" threads being created and impression threads  and the "official" discussion threads lol


----------



## skiam

Why is it only $135 as PREORDER on mp4nation? Is this the real deal?


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Why is it only $135 as PREORDER on mp4nation? Is this the real deal?


 


  don't know. don't care. I had bad experiences ordering from non major retailers in my country. I'll stick with Amazon when it arrices on there. First Batches could have problems...and buying from amazon...gets those problems/bugs fixed


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Why is it only $135 as PREORDER on mp4nation? Is this the real deal?


 

 Because it is a promotion?


----------



## skiam

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> don't know. don't care. I had bad experiences ordering from non major retailers in my country. I'll stick with Amazon when it arrices on there. First Batches could have problems...and buying from amazon...gets those problems/bugs fixed


 


  Sigh...Can't decide if I should pre-order or wait for http://www.headphonebar.com/ to get it since I probably cannot get it from amazon regardless.
   
  EDIT: headphone bar does have it for pre-order as well for 139. I will most likely get it from here then.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Sigh...Can't decide if I should pre-order or wait for http://www.headphonebar.com/ to get it since I probably cannot get it from amazon regardless.
> 
> EDIT: headphone bar does have it for pre-order as well for 139. I will most likely get it from here then.


 


  my heart skpped a beat when i thought i saw it for $250.....it was the E17 and E9 combo 
   
  I would rather pay $10 for peace of heart knowing that i bought from an American supplier and form Amazon that can guarantee me an return/warranty in case problems do arise.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





skiam said:


> Sigh...Can't decide if I should pre-order or wait for http://www.headphonebar.com/ to get it since I probably cannot get it from amazon regardless.
> 
> EDIT: headphone bar does have it for pre-order as well for 139. I will most likely get it from here then.


 


  I was hoping it would be on amazon... mp4nation sells on amazon but no go. They have fair reviews so I decided what the heck. But yes, amazons known customer service would have given me greater peace of mind... have purchased many items from them, always happy.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> my heart skpped a beat when i thought i saw it for $250.....it was the E17 and E9 combo
> 
> I would rather pay $10 for peace of heart knowing that i bought from an American supplier and form Amazon that can guarantee me an return/warranty in case problems do arise.


 


  Yeah, they would lose money with the fees but I wouldn't mind paying more to get it from amazon.


----------



## jdenn

I just ordered a brainwavz HM5 from mp4nation.net because they went out of stock  on amazon. I had no trouble with it, payed with paypal... my only gripe was I opted for fedex which cost about 17 dollars so it would not take for ever... It came in 3 days. and my other complaint is they just ran a special and dropped the price, but I think they are fine and considering ordering the e17 from them.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





unityispower said:


> Yeah, they would lose money with the fees but I wouldn't mind paying more to get it from amazon.


 


  Same, FiiO products have been someitmes known to have problem with first batches (E5, E10) from all i know so im buying from Amazon just in case so that in case a jack needs to be replaced or comes loose i can do it easily


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> Same, FiiO products have been someitmes known to have problem with first batches (E5, E10) from all i know so im buying from Amazon just in case so that in case a jack needs to be replaced or comes loose i can do it easily


 

 I am pretty sure E10 is the only product FiiO ever has a design problem with. The majority of problems faced by other models are mainly due to wear and tear.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> I am pretty sure E10 is the only product FiiO ever has a design problem with. The majority of problems faced by other models are mainly due to wear and tear.


 


  for my E5, i bought off dealer extreme. they sold me the earliest earliest batch if i seem to remember. the left channel would keep cutting out on my headphnones and i would need to keep wiggiling the jack. happened to a lot of people after i googled it.


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> for my E5, i bought off dealer extreme. they sold me the earliest earliest batch if i seem to remember. the left channel would keep cutting out on my headphnones and i would need to keep wiggiling the jack. happened to a lot of people after i googled it.


 

 That's because you didn't push it in far enough. E5 uses the same plug and never change it through out the product life cycle (I have opened both first and later version of E5). The mini plugs are quite tight, especially on first use. Many do not push it in enough and though it was defected, which it is not. The evidence is in the left channel cut off, as left channel is on the tip of the mini plug - the cutting off is a sign of it not making good contact with the pin inside because the mini plug is not inserted fully.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





clieos said:


> That's because you didn't push it in far enough. E5 uses the same plug and never change it through out the product life cycle (I have opened both first and later version of E5). The mini plugs are quite tight, especially on first use. Many do not push it in enough and though it was defected, which it is not. The evidence is in the left channel cut off, as left channel is on the tip of the mini plug - the cutting off is a sign of it not making good contact with the pin inside because the mini plug is not inserted fully.


 


  I hope Clie0s is on to something here... (nothing being wrong with most FiiO products aside form normal bad batches every now and then), he responds logically. I hope.. for my time/wallets sake.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





clieos said:


> That's because you didn't push it in far enough. E5 uses the same plug and never change it through out the product life cycle (I have opened both first and later version of E5). The mini plugs are quite tight, especially on first use. Many do not push it in enough and though it was defected, which it is not. The evidence is in the left channel cut off, as left channel is on the tip of the mini plug - the cutting off is a sign of it not making good contact with the pin inside because the mini plug is not inserted fully.


 

 it's gotten loose! way loose  i have it in all the way the plug goes. i have to wiggle it around to make contact with the plug. anyway i can fix this? insturctions? website?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> it's gotten loose! way loose  i have it in all the way the plug goes. i have to wiggle it around to make contact with the plug. anyway i can fix this? insturctions? website?


 

 It is another matter if it is getting loose after a few months of usage. The easy fix is to open it up and push/bend the pins a little back to its original position and it will work just fine. All headphone jack become loose over time, and they are quite easy to push back to position as long as you can open the device up. Sansa Clip for example is known to have loose headphone jack after a few month of use because it uses the same type of headphone jack like that in E5 and this kind of headphone is known to get loosen over time. But it is not an easy fix for the Clip because the housing is quite tight.


----------



## ebmp19

mp4nation is a trusted seller, I've bought things from them before. In my experience amazon often doesn't even have a warranty at all, or it's just with the manufacturer. There are also some quite dodgy products on amazon which are purposely mislabeled to make people buy them. For example they sell a certain phone which is labeled with the incorrect frequency so international buyers will get it. It is deliberately misleading and I emailed them about it and they said someone would fix it, as far as I know they didn't. People wrote the same thing in the reviews. They also have sellers that ship things used and broken when labeled as new. I wouldn't trust amazon solely because they are a popular website.


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> my heart skpped a beat when i thought i saw it for $250.....it was the E17 and E9 combo
> 
> I would rather pay $10 for peace of heart knowing that i bought from an American supplier and form Amazon that can guarantee me an return/warranty in case problems do arise.


 


  This isn't an issue with mp4nation.  They are an authorized dealer.  I've RMA'd through them before without issue (just takes a while from the States).  But sure Amazon is the easiest of all to deal with.


----------



## tme110

Amazon will get the e17.  It took them a few weeks to get the e11 but it got there.  I think a lot of Fiio products get sold on Amazon.
   
  Amazon will return a product for you no questions asked ALWAYs - unless you wait months. And if something was wrong with the order or product you don't even have to pay shipping.
   
  Amazon does not purposely sell misleading mechandize.  2nd party resellers may and you fix that by commenting on the sellers profile, not the product profile.  Though it is good into in the product profile to know about sellers to avoid.  But even if this does happen, Amazon will make them take it back.
   
  I had a buyer steel a set of headphones off of me on Amazon and Amazon automatically sided with the buyer.  The point being that I would have no issues buying something off of Amazon.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> This isn't an issue with mp4nation.  They are an authorized dealer.  I've RMA'd through them before without issue (just takes a while from the States).  But sure Amazon is the easiest of all to deal with.


 


  yeah that's the point. i've enver had a problem with a seller. it's the RMA time that makes me all  i want it to be in the states so it's faster


  Quote: 





tme110 said:


> Amazon will get the e17.  It took them a few weeks to get the e11 but it got there.  I think a lot of Fiio products get sold on Amazon.
> 
> Amazon will return a product for you no questions asked ALWAYs - unless you wait months. And if something was wrong with the order or product you don't even have to pay shipping.
> 
> ...


 

 haha yeah. they do not ask u... NAYTHING at all. u could buy a headphone. don't like it and just return it(even thogyuh it's not in the official rules)


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> yeah that's the point. i've enver had a problem with a seller. it's the RMA time that makes me all  i want it to be in the states so it's faster
> 
> haha yeah. they do not ask u... NAYTHING at all. u could buy a headphone. don't like it and just return it(even thogyuh it's not in the official rules)


 
  Quote: 





tme110 said:


> Amazon will get the e17.  It took them a few weeks to get the e11 but it got there.  I think a lot of Fiio products get sold on Amazon.
> 
> Amazon will return a product for you no questions asked ALWAYs - unless you wait months. And if something was wrong with the order or product you don't even have to pay shipping.
> 
> ...


 

 ^
  Exactly...


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





unityispower said:


> ^
> Exactly...


 


  that's why i use amazon  they always side with u. it's cheap and fast. and secure and near me
   
*Edit:how could u do this to me!*
http://mp4nation.net/catalog/fiio-e17-alpen-dac-headphone-amplifier-preorder-p-664.html
 you get a free set of IEM's if you buy this preordered !!!!!!!!!! what!! how could u do this to my judgement Mp4nation! how could u :'(


----------



## ebmp19

No, I emailed amazon support about it, surely their 'support' should be the people to fix it. I suppose at least they would take it back, but it's still a waste of time for people. I don't want to go too off topic but you can look here. See it's the 'international version' with 900/2100 3g, except it's not, it's the tmobile one which is 1700/2100 . Some people won't notice much because most carriers have 2100 3g so they will get single band 3g, but if your carrier also has 900 you will get worse signal. Definatly on purpose because it's 6 months later and still there....


----------



## JamesFiiO

Amazon will be a best and fast way to buy our products in US, and I'd say, we will take the quality control as the most important thing for FiiO, We now realize that 
   
  we will meet a big challenge because the sales volume is so big now, and internet will spread the bad news as fast as good news, although we already sold out 10k
   
  E10, Anyway, we will try our best to improve our quality in 2012, and for people who have problem with our products, we will provide better service to you. 
   
  James in Los Angeles, US


----------



## TheChosen0ne

So when will they be on amazon?


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> Amazon will be a best and fast way to buy our products in US, and I'd say, we will take the quality control as the most important thing for FiiO, We now realize that
> 
> we will meet a big challenge because the sales volume is so big now, and internet will spread the bad news as fast as good news, although we already sold out 10k
> 
> ...


 

 Good to know feiao.... good to know.


----------



## wacomme

I asked this question before, but I never received an answer.
   
  Would the e17 work as a portable amp for my Ety ER4's and as a dac/amp for AudioEngine A2's connected to my iMac?


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> I asked this question before, but I never received an answer.
> 
> Would the e17 work as a portable amp for my Ety ER4's and as a dac/amp for AudioEngine A2's connected to my iMac?


 


  yes. For use as a portable amp you need a portable music player with either a 3.5mm male connector on both sides or an LOD if you have an ipod
   
  Mac's feature an optical out (most of the time) in their volume out and can be used in conjunction with the optical plug that the E17 comes with so that u get 24/192. it can also be used through USB but will then only provide 24/96


----------



## wacomme

And the e17 will adequately run my AudioEngine A2 speakers (computer - e17 - A2 speakers)?
   
  Also, is the Sik Ram Din a LOD? I have the Sik cable connected to a very old Nano. Anything better?
  
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> yes. For use as a portable amp you need a portable music player with either a 3.5mm male connector on both sides or an LOD if you have an ipod
> 
> Mac's feature an optical out (most of the time) in their volume out and can be used in conjunction with the optical plug that the E17 comes with so that u get 24/192. it can also be used through USB but will then only provide 24/96


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> And the e17 will adequately run my AudioEngine A2 speakers (computer - e17 - A2 speakers)?
> 
> Also, is the Sik Ram Din a LOD? I have the Sik cable connected to a very old Nano. Anything better?


 
  1: I don't know if it will run your speakers. your speakers should already have it's own amplifier in it and thus make the amp in the E17..negligable, but you would need someone that does home bookshelf speakers to tell you. 
   
  2:The silk Ram din IS a LOD.. it's not famous or popular and has little reports on head fi. I can not tell you how the FiiO L9 is compared to it. The fiio L3 and L9 are both famous and popular LOD's on Head-fi and in the world. they use hpc22w wires which is pretty good and is only $9 for the L3 and $13 for the L9. is it better? can't tell you anythint defeinite


----------



## wacomme

Thank you for the LOD information. I'll investigate.
   
  For the computer system, I'm mostly wanting a dac that's better than the one in my iMac to run my A2 speakers. I figured if the system runs through the e17 first that it would bypass the the A2 amp too.
   
  I currently have an old (3 -AAA battery) TotalAirHead amp. With the LOD, my old nano, and Ety ER4s IEMs, would the sound be better with the A17?
  
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> 1: I don't know if it will run your speakers. your speakers should already have it's own amplifier in it and thus make the amp in the E17..negligable, but you would need someone that does home bookshelf speakers to tell you.
> 
> 2:The silk Ram din IS a LOD.. it's not famous or popular and has little reports on head fi. I can not tell you how the FiiO L9 is compared to it. The fiio L3 and L9 are both famous and popular LOD's on Head-fi and in the world. they use hpc22w wires which is pretty good and is only $9 for the L3 and $13 for the L9. is it better? can't tell you anythint defeinite


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> Thank you for the LOD information. I'll investigate.
> 
> For the computer system, I'm mostly wanting a dac that's better than the one in my iMac to run my A2 speakers. I figured if the system runs through the e17 first that it would bypass the the A2 amp too.
> 
> I currently have an old (3 -AAA battery) TotalAirHead amp. With the LOD, my old nano, and Ety ER4s IEMs, would the sound be better with the A17?


 
  Investigation may be hard :/
   
  The E17 will not bypass any amp. Unless you  use the L7 from FiiO to bypass it's own amp. It will "add" it's amping capabilites to whatever u are using it with. If your iMac is producing enough wattage than the E17 should be no problem. Most desktops use it's own power.
 So what will happen
  iMac-->E17(optical or USB)-->Wolfson WM8740DAC-->Pre amp and power amp-->A2 amp--A2
   
  The E17 "should" sound better as it is newer. Newer doesn't always mean better, but in this case it "should". Plz note. When used in conjunction with ur nano and LOD. all u are using is the amping capabilites of the E17 and nothing else.


----------



## wacomme

Ultimately, I'm trying to justify the cost and function of the E17. I need two things:
   

 It needs to be a better portable amp than my old TAH.
 It needs to create nicer sound than my direct Imac to A2 setup.
   
   
  It appears that #2 is likely. Though, will the improvement be noticeable? And for #1, ????
   
  Michael
   
   
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> Investigation may be hard :/
> 
> The E17 will not bypass any amp. Unless you  use the L7 from FiiO to bypass it's own amp. It will "add" it's amping capabilites to whatever u are using it with. If your iMac is producing enough wattage than the E17 should be no problem. Most desktops use it's own power.
> So what will happen
> ...


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> Ultimately, I'm trying to justify the cost and function of the E17. I need two things:
> 
> 
> It needs to be a better portable amp than my old TAH.
> ...


 
  1:the E17 has some tone and sound advances that you will see in the Mike @ headfonia's review. wider soundstage than the E10, more clear bass puch than the E11 and what not. I don't know if you with your IEM's can tell a difference.
  2: the iMac's internal DAC is already nice. IT's already a High end Cirrus Logic. Depending on how good yoursetup is. if your room absorbs a lot of sound frequencies. Your equipment. The DAC may not make a difference noticabley in sound.
   
  The E17's wodners is being able to not only have these advancements to people that are new to the Mid-fi world but also is very portable so you can take it anywhere. Unless you drastically need it's portability and 24/192 functions. i don't know/can't tell u the E17 is justifiable.
   
  I doubt IEM's will show u that much of a real difference since you already have a popular amp
  I doubt you can "hear" the Wolfson WM8740's differences on some A2's


----------



## makingoneup

Is there any way to use Digital In on the E17 in conjunction with the E9, or are you limited to USB? If that is true, then would I be better off using the E17 by itself instead of with the E9? Source is my computer (supports 24/192, but has minor static without music), Headphones are ATH-m50s. Thanks.


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> And the e17 will adequately run my AudioEngine A2 speakers (computer - e17 - A2 speakers)?


 
  A2 is self-powered (meaning it has an internal power amp section to drive the speaker unit), so E17 should be used as DAC only for maximum SQ or pre-amp mode (if you want the EQ on E17). For that, you'll need the FiiO L7.
  
   
  Quote: 





wacomme said:


> I currently have an old (3 -AAA battery) TotalAirHead amp. With the LOD, my old nano, and Ety ER4s IEMs, would the sound be better with the A17?


 

 E17 is much better than Total AirHead.
   


  Quote: 





makingoneup said:


> Is there any way to use Digital In on the E17 in conjunction with the E9, or are you limited to USB? If that is true, then would I be better off using the E17 by itself instead of with the E9? Source is my computer (supports 24/192, but has minor static without music), Headphones are ATH-m50s. Thanks.


 
  Yes, you can use the digital-in on E17 when docked on E9. All you need is to set E17 in the right mode and plug the digital cable on the top of E17.


----------



## makingoneup

Quote: 





clieos said:


> Yes, you can use the digital-in on E17 when docked on E9. All you need is to set E17 in the right mode and plug the digital cable on the top of E17.


 

  
  Good to know, wish the Digital-In was on the E9 though, as it sort of takes a lot away from the convenience of the combo


----------



## raptorconsult

Quote: 





jamesfiio said:


> Amazon will be a best and fast way to buy our products in US, and I'd say, we will take the quality control as the most important thing for FiiO, We now realize that
> 
> we will meet a big challenge because the sales volume is so big now, and internet will spread the bad news as fast as good news, although we already sold out 10k
> 
> ...


 

 good luck


----------



## wacomme

While there would be some sound improvement using the e17 compared to what I currently use, especially as a portable amp, overall the difference is small. I think I'll spend my money elsewhere; for music, that's probably custom ear molds for my Ety ER4.
   
  Thanks for your help!
  
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> 1:the E17 has some tone and sound advances that you will see in the Mike @ headfonia's review. wider soundstage than the E10, more clear bass puch than the E11 and what not. I don't know if you with your IEM's can tell a difference.
> 2: the iMac's internal DAC is already nice. IT's already a High end Cirrus Logic. Depending on how good yoursetup is. if your room absorbs a lot of sound frequencies. Your equipment. The DAC may not make a difference noticabley in sound.
> 
> The E17's wodners is being able to not only have these advancements to people that are new to the Mid-fi world but also is very portable so you can take it anywhere. Unless you drastically need it's portability and 24/192 functions. i don't know/can't tell u the E17 is justifiable.
> ...


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> While there would be some sound improvement using the e17 compared to what I currently use, especially as a portable amp, overall the difference is small. I think I'll spend my money elsewhere; for music, that's probably custom ear molds for my Ety ER4.
> 
> Thanks for your help!


 


 glad to help. Ifyou aren't using it for portability and other stuff. it's not for you  
   
  For people really wanting to get into the audiophile realm and have a good product that will last cheaply that does...or is an all in one. This is it


----------



## wacomme

Well, from that point of view, the e17 fits my needs perfectly; I want the e17 for both my desktop computer (dac running A2 speakers) and as a portable amp (replacing my old TAH). However, it sounds like the improvement to my A2s will be minimal at best, and while the e17 is a better portable amp than my TAH, the improvement in sound to my Ety ER4's probably won't justify the cost of the E17.
  
  Quote: 





bowei006 said:


> glad to help. Ifyou aren't using it for portability and other stuff. it's not for you
> 
> For people really wanting to get into the audiophile realm and have a good product that will last cheaply that does...or is an all in one. This is it


----------



## tme110

well, the e9 does have usb which is a digital input.  you'll just be limited to 24/96
  Quote: 





makingoneup said:


> Good to know, wish the Digital-In was on the E9 though, as it sort of takes a lot away from the convenience of the combo


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> Well, from that point of view, the e17 fits my needs perfectly; I want the e17 for both my desktop computer (dac running A2 speakers) and as a portable amp (replacing my old TAH). However, it sounds like the improvement to my A2s will be minimal at best, and while the e17 is a better portable amp than my TAH, the improvement in sound to my Ety ER4's probably won't justify the cost of the E17.


 


  yeah, i added teh last part for any noobies looking to see if this is for them


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





wacomme said:


> Well, from that point of view, the e17 fits my needs perfectly; I want the e17 for both my desktop computer (dac running A2 speakers) and as a portable amp (replacing my old TAH). *However, it sounds like the improvement to my A2s will be minimal at best*, and while the e17 is a better portable amp than my TAH, the improvement in sound to my Ety ER4's probably won't justify the cost of the E17.


 

  
  No it is not. TAH is a very outdated amp in SQ. I have the Total BiHead (same amp section as TAH) and it is not anywhere near as good sounding or resolving as E17. Even the lesser iBasso D-zero is a better amp then TAH. In many way, even cmoyBB and E11 is better than TAH. The DAC section on E17 is also far better sounding than that on the Total BitHead (which is the same price range as E17 btw).
   
  Quote: 





tme110 said:


> well, the e9 does have usb which is a digital input.  you'll just be limited to 24/96


 

 E17 can also provide SPDIF-in (both optical and coax) to E9 as well.


----------



## Sennhe1ser0fan

ClieOS,
  How well do you think the e17 will pair with the HD700?


----------



## makingoneup

MP4Nation sold out of their first shipment, says second one won't ship out until mid-February. I hope this is only because of the combo they offered and that amazon has them in stock sooner than that.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





makingoneup said:


> MP4Nation sold out of their first shipment, says second one won't ship out until mid-February. I hope this is only because of the combo they offered and that amazon has them in stock sooner than that.


 


  Does that mean the second shipment will be mid-February or all pre-orders will be pushed to mid-February?... just clarification.


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





sennhe1ser0fan said:


> ClieOS,
> How well do you think the e17 will pair with the HD700?


 


  Send me a HD700 and I'll tell you all about it


----------



## makingoneup

Quote: 





unityispower said:


> Does that mean the second shipment will be mid-February or all pre-orders will be pushed to mid-February?... just clarification.


 


  I'm pretty sure it just means that if you pre-order now it won't get sent out until mid-February, shouldn't have any affect on orders already placed (unless they send you an email).


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





clieos said:


> Send me a HD700 and I'll tell you all about it


 


  If I send you headphones, you would put up a review on them? How much would it cost to send headphones to you?


----------



## ClieOS

Quote: 





unityispower said:


> If I send you headphones, you would put up a review on them? How much would it cost to send headphones to you?


 

 Haha, sure, why not? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But on a second thought, you might not want to send me anything as shipping is not cheap.


----------



## UnityIsPower

Quote: 





clieos said:


> Haha, sure, why not?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  Well I put Malaysia in the destenation on USPS and it gave me a rate of 43.23 for Priority Mail® International Medium Flat Rate Box(6-10 days).
  Not a huge expense but yes.. It cost money. Then would I have to do something with customs?


----------



## ClieOS

You will need to fill in international shipping form and custom declaration on USPS. If there is a custom fee, the recipient will pay it, not the sender.


----------



## Monsieur

Agh, more money to spend.


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





monsieur said:


> Agh, more money to spend.


 


  correct  and all that hype....ill join the bandwagon


----------



## Etrips

I know this will be a dumb question, but is there any way to use this with having my iPhone as a source? I'd love to use my DT770s as a portable while studying at school.


----------



## Timodeus

etrips said:


> I know this will be a dumb question, but is there any way to use this with having my iPhone as a source? I'd love to use my DT770s as a portable while studying at school.




JDSlabs Cmoy with bassboost much better with DT770. You don't need a DAC and fiio sound is to refined for this bassmonster headphone.


----------



## seslwr

Anyone else have an e9 with an empty dock waiting for the e17 to show up on Amazon?  I sure as hell do *tick-tock*


----------



## TigreNegrito

Yeah, I bought the E9 after talking with Feaio extensively last month.  Mine's still in the shipping box, though.


----------



## sheep duck

sorry to resurrect an old thread, but is there any news whatsoever about the e15?


----------



## bowei006

Quote: 





sheep duck said:


> sorry to resurrect an old thread, but is there any news whatsoever about the e15?


 
  Another person just asked that yesterday:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/617432/new-product-e09k-on-sale-now/15#post_8702277
   
  Here is the post.


----------



## Ishrogh

Question: Need to hook up my HDTV from optical out to DAC to self powered speakers,  Would the FiiO E17 do the job?  Would I notice a difference between it and a much cheaper DAC in terms of sound quality?


----------



## silverharbinger

Quote: 





ishrogh said:


> Question: Need to hook up my HDTV from optical out to DAC to self powered speakers,  Would the FiiO E17 do the job?  Would I notice a difference between it and a much cheaper DAC in terms of sound quality?


 
   
  I would have to test that sometime when I'm at my E17 and get back with you. Based on what I recall about it that should work without any accessories. The sound from the E17 is very good for the price. To my knowledge there isn't anything in it's general SQ range for that price.


----------



## MrScratch

Quote: 





ishrogh said:


> Question: Need to hook up my HDTV from optical out to DAC to self powered speakers,  Would the FiiO E17 do the job?  Would I notice a difference between it and a much cheaper DAC in terms of sound quality?


 
   
  I would consider the D3 (if you want a Wolfson chip), the D03k Taishan and the D07 (if you'll ever need a Dolby/DTS-compatible DAC) as well. You can power it with one of your TV's USB ports (if it has any) so it would basically power on with your TV.


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## MUSICCURE

mrscratch said:


> I would consider the D3 (if you want a Wolfson chip), the D03k Taishan and the D07 (if you'll ever need a Dolby/DTS-compatible DAC) as well. You can power it with one of your TV's USB ports (if it has any) so it would basically power on with your TV.




I have the DO3 Taishan hooked up to my tv and in addition, use the e17 as an amp. It gives plenty of volume to my dt 770/80's for netflix and gaming.


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## MrScratch

Well, Ishrogh said he owns a pair of "self-powered" speakers (I think he meant active speakers) so he would just need a DAC. For ~30 (D03k/D3) or ~50 bucks (D07) I think they are worth mentioning.


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## silverharbinger

Quote: 





ishrogh said:


> Question: Need to hook up my HDTV from optical out to DAC to self powered speakers,  Would the FiiO E17 do the job?  Would I notice a difference between it and a much cheaper DAC in terms of sound quality?


 
   
  I did the tests. I'm not sure if my E17 has an issue, but the toslink input using the supplied adapter didn't work with signals from my blu ray player. It worked fine on my receiver, so I'm not sure what the issue is. It might not have been able to use the mix supplied from the disc I used, or the spdif in on the e17 just doesn't work. I primarily use it as a pc dac through usb which works fine, so I don't really care enough to look into it further.
   
  Others brought up the point that a standalone dac may be all you need if you don't need an amp as well. I can definitely say that the sound from the E17 - when it works - is well worth the money. It's a very versatile unit as well.


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## ClieOS

Make sure you ain't playing any music / sound on the Blu-ray player that is not stereo. E17 only decodes stereo. It won't do Dolby or 5.1 surround sound stuff.


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## MrScratch

Quote: 





silverharbinger said:


> I did the tests. I'm not sure if my E17 has an issue, but the toslink input using the supplied adapter didn't work with signals from my blu ray player. It worked fine on my receiver, so I'm not sure what the issue is. It might not have been able to use the mix supplied from the disc I used, or the spdif in on the e17 just doesn't work. I primarily use it as a pc dac through usb which works fine, so I don't really care enough to look into it further.


 
   
  Blu-ray discs commonly employ multi-channel audio formats such as Dolby Digital (AC-3 5.1), DTS and Linear PCM. The FiiO E17 can't decode those multi-channel audio streams. In the end you either end up with no sound or a very distorted noise.


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## silverharbinger

Clieos and Scratch - that was the thought I had as well. The disc I used was a dvd. Most of the time those default to a 2-channel track, but it was a concert dvd (nin - with you in time to be exact). There's a good chance that it was using a 5.1 mix by default. I have at least one disc that has a standard stereo mix I could test, but honestly I never use my e17 with toslink input. I really didn't have much free time to mess around with it, so I just stopped there.
   
  I can definitely say that the FiiO adapter makes a tight connection with toslink connectors. So much so that I thought I was going to break it trying to disconnect it.


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## MrScratch

Is it a DVD-A or a video DVD? If it is a DVD-Audio it's probably encoded with a 96KHz/24bit Full Surround (5.1) LPCM data stream.
  Dolby Digital is pretty common in DVDs as well.


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## silverharbinger

It's DVD video. I literally bought it at the release in 2007 and I haven't played it in years, so I forgot pretty much everything about it. Per the wiki article, the dvd has dolby stereo, dolby 5.1, and dts 5.1 versions on it. I would think based on that it would have defaulted to the stereo track, but again, I didn't check for that.
   
  Don't make me have to run these tests again!


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## Westbeach984

Greetings!
  
 I'm new to the audiophile world. I've spent time trying to grasp as much of the charts and concepts as I could, Impedance, Ohms, and so forth. I come to this community now with a scenario of what should I do. I will tell you what I have on the way as far as shipping, and ask your guidance in the matter. My main interest is computer gaming. I am moving towards the direction of 3d gaming (currently MechWarrior, and soon star citizen *rear admiral package and super hornet, still haven't played). I'm on an almost 2 yr old alienware x51. The audio gear that is coming is:
  
 *FiiO e17
 *FiiO 09k
 *FiiO W1R1
 *Sennheiser 363d's *virtual surround sound (according to you (*you- I mean the brilliant audiophile community)) doesn't work with the e17's. I have also ordered the best priced highest quality for dollar 3D monitor (hours to find it) - ASUS VG248QE Black 24" 144Hz 1ms (GTG) With that said, my dilemma is what cell phone to get with it.
  
 I have a homeless man's version of a Verizon phone. I'm staying with that carrier. I wanted to set up camera's for IP viewing on my phone. That narrows it down to IPhone 5s or an Android. <--- ~**Big Question**~ #1. I heard my MWO clan say Android rocks now, and you guys confirmed it.
  
 ~**Medium Question**~ #2. --> Also, if I go Android, which, note 3? S5? I have an upgrade. 3 Gig's a month and unlimited everything else. Will the e17 work with the Android? I saw something about the 16/48 thing. I added the W1's because they support 3d surround sound, and had video/optical cable's, the E09K didn't, yet had a docking station for the IPhone I thought would be sitting there. What do I keep, what do I send back? None of it has arrived yet.
  
 I really appreciate anyone that can answer my questions shorter and simpler than I asked them. Thank you to whoever made it through this message /w eye's still open!
  
 Westbeach984


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## ProtegeManiac

The E18 was designed specifically to work with Android devices (note that some more obscure devices might not work), so you might want to look into that one instead.


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## Westbeach984

I have an update. Somehow I messed up a digit or something and amazon cancelled my order! I am relieved because now I can do things the right way.
  
 I'm leaning towards an Android Phone of some sort. Its not so much for the music... Its for the remote access to home security and I heard they are making a comeback.
  
 So the E09K won't be coming and the E17.
  
 With that said, what is a good setup. I have Sennheiser 363d's still on the way, and I can still buy different headphones. At this point I'm hoping for suggestions on reasonably priced DAC / Amp gear mainly for stationary PC use.
  
 Thanks Every1!


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