# Aliexpress Cables



## dougms3 (Sep 12, 2022)

So in the past I've ordered some knockoff aliexpress cables.  Surprisingly, these cables sound quite good, I mean well above their price point.  They outperform some cables I have tried that are 10-15x more expensive. 

It looks like this.







Recently I asked a seller to make me a sata cable with this wire.

I received it and unfortunately it didn't work, it seems they didn't wire it properly or theres a short somewhere.  I took it apart to see what it looks like.  Really hate that glue insulator they use.







So it looks like the wire is actually silver or at the very least sterling silver.  Its not plated and looks to be 28 awg conductors with a teflon or pet sleeve then spiraled aluminum shield then pet or teflon sleeve on top of that.  No wonder it sounds so good.  I tried to light it on fire and it wont burn or melt.   PVC should melt or burn if I tried that.

It is quite surprising the quality of these things.  Most likely the conductors are sterling silver because the pricing doesnt make sense for such a thing. 

I have purchased quite a few of these knockoffs and they perform unbelievably well, I'm sure they're not as good as the real thing but for the price they are quite good.  Quite a pleasant surprise.








*Few notes, there are some sellers reported by members that are not pleasant do business with.  Recommend not purchasing from these sellers due to shady business practices and/or problems returning.  Will update as we go along.*

Goltech - Sent cable with missing parts and gold odin cable with lesser valhalla conductors.
Queensway - Several members reported incorrect pinout for hdmi cable and had problems returning or getting a refund.




Crypt Keeper said:


> Just my 2 cents,
> 
> The Best Cables I purchased on Ali:
> 
> ...


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## msing539

I have one of these knock-off Nordost cables on order. I'm not expecting a ton but at this price, they definitely seem worth trying.


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## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I have one of these knock-off Nordost cables on order. I'm not expecting a ton but at this price, they definitely seem worth trying.


Which one did you get?

Now is a good time to buy with the sales and coupons going on.


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## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Which one did you get?
> 
> Now is a good time to buy with the sales and coupons going on.


It's called "Nordost Odin 2 decoder DAC data cable USB sound card cable A-B shield USB Cable High Quality Type A to Type B Hifi Data Cable" lol... I'm not even sure what I bought based on the name.


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## dougms3

msing539 said:


> It's called "Nordost Odin 2 decoder DAC data cable USB sound card cable A-B shield USB Cable High Quality Type A to Type B Hifi Data Cable" lol... I'm not even sure what I bought based on the name.


Lol i bought that one too.

And the ethernet cables.


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## dougms3

If anyone is interested, until july 1st there's a $3 off every $30 spent promotion.

Then there's a JUN5 $5 off $40, JUN15 $15 off $120 that you can stack.

Got this 1.5 m cable for $87 and some iems.

https://www.aliexpress.com/p/order/detail.html?orderId=8152211755298439


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## Gazza

My Odin 2 ethernet knock-offs just arrived. I must say the build quality is incredible considering what I paid. Looking forward to plugging them in.


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## Gazza (Jun 27, 2022)

Listening to them now (they JUST fit my Google Nest)... do they sound better? Maaaaaaaaaaaybe. Completely fresh with no run-in mind. Might be a bit more airy with space around the instruments. Need to give 'em time. Even if the upgrade is nil-to-mild they are at the very least very well made.

EDIT: Bass does seem better.


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## dougms3

Gazza said:


> Listening to them now (they JUST fit my Google Nest)... do they sound better? Maaaaaaaaaaaybe. Completely fresh with no run-in mind. Might be a bit more airy with space around the instruments. Need to give 'em time. Even if the upgrade is nil-to-mild they are at the very least very well made.
> 
> EDIT: Bass does seem better.


Should have done a jitter test before and after to see if there was a difference there.

https://speed.cloudflare.com/


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## Death_Block

I just received my first ever purchase from AliExpress 3 minutes ago. 2.5 to xlr and 2.5 to 4.4. both ~£35 Inc postage. They look really nice, and oh so soft. The stock HD700 cable is a nightmare. Can't wait to give a balanced listen and utilize the tube amp!


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## gimmeheadroom

Death_Block said:


> The stock HD700 cable is a nightmare. Can't wait to give a balanced listen and utilize the tube amp!



The greatest thing about Sennheiser stock cables is that they're detachable 

The HD 800 cable is a good cable, but it's not very handy. The other models cables are worth keeping only for emergencies.


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## Death_Block

gimmeheadroom said:


> The greatest thing about Sennheiser stock cables is that they're detachable
> 
> The HD 800 cable is a good cable, but it's not very handy. The other models cables are worth keeping only for emergencies.


After unknotting the stock cable, I go make a cup of tea, come back into the listing room and somehow it's caught on the ceiling fan, wrapped around the cats foot, under a desk leg with a salmon nibbling on the end of it


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## gimmeheadroom

Death_Block said:


> After unknotting the stock cable, I go make a cup of tea, come back into the listing room and somehow it's caught on the ceiling fan, wrapped around the cats foot, under a desk leg with a salmon nibbling on the end of it


It's good to set expectations properly for the next guy


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## Gazza (Jun 28, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Should have done a jitter test before and after to see if there was a difference there.
> 
> https://speed.cloudflare.com/



The difference isn't profound but the more I listen I notice a less artificial, more effortless presentation. Bigger soundstage. I'd liken it to the system loosening slightly, less uptight.

Due to the way the thick cables are manhandling my teeny-tiny D-Link switch I caved and ordered this beefy switch:

8 Bit Gigabit HIFI Audio Ethernet Switch Full Linear DC Power Supply SC Cut OCXO Constant Temperature Crystal Oscillator Upgrade

Reviews seem to be quite high. Cheaper than buying the Innuous or Melco equivalents. This means I can now tie a ribbon around my network upgrade and not have to worry about it.


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## dougms3 (Jun 28, 2022)

Gazza said:


> The difference isn't profound but the more I listen I notice a less artificial, more effortless presentation. Bigger soundstage. I'd liken it to the system loosening slightly, less uptight.
> 
> Due to the way the thick cables are manhandling my teeny-tiny TP Link switch I caved and ordered this beefy switch:
> 
> ...


That is quite interesting, I've seen those high end routers before but was not aware they had such a thing on aliexpress.

Definitely interested in your assessment of that device.


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## dougms3

The router may also benefit from a linear power supply as well.

I bought this LPS to test out on my jcat card for the pc.  If it offers significant improvement, I'll get one for my router as well.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802422189882.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.47821802VRknDi


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## Gazza

My Google Nest router has a hard-wired cord so no upgrades there I'm afraid.


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## dougms3

Gazza said:


> My Google Nest router has a hard-wired cord so no upgrades there I'm afraid.


Ah ok, forgot you mentioned you were using a google nest.


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## DenverW

I've ordered a few iem cables and a couple cables for zmf from aliexpress and have generally been pretty happy.  Some issues will pop up, like I got a balanced cable that wasn't assembled correctly so I had to take apart one of the connectors and make sure it was lined up.

The only TRULY negative experience I've had is with the "Queenway" store.  Ordered a specific i2s cable from them, of course it didn't work (wasn't wired correctly) and got put through the ringer trying to get them to accept a return.  I had to send videos of the cable not working.  Videos.  Stupid.  Eventually had to go through my CC to get a refund, they never accepted they wired it wrong and first blamed my dac, then my ddc.

Avoid Queenway.


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## msing539

DenverW said:


> I've ordered a few iem cables and a couple cables for zmf from aliexpress and have generally been pretty happy.  Some issues will pop up, like I got a balanced cable that wasn't assembled correctly so I had to take apart one of the connectors and make sure it was lined up.
> 
> The only TRULY negative experience I've had is with the "Queenway" store.  Ordered a specific i2s cable from them, of course it didn't work (wasn't wired correctly) and got put through the ringer trying to get them to accept a return.  I had to send videos of the cable not working.  Videos.  Stupid.  Eventually had to go through my CC to get a refund, they never accepted they wired it wrong and first blamed my dac, then my ddc.
> 
> Avoid Queenway.


Why don't you tell us how you really feel?


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## dougms3 (Jun 30, 2022)

DenverW said:


> I've ordered a few iem cables and a couple cables for zmf from aliexpress and have generally been pretty happy.  Some issues will pop up, like I got a balanced cable that wasn't assembled correctly so I had to take apart one of the connectors and make sure it was lined up.
> 
> The only TRULY negative experience I've had is with the "Queenway" store.  Ordered a specific i2s cable from them, of course it didn't work (wasn't wired correctly) and got put through the ringer trying to get them to accept a return.  I had to send videos of the cable not working.  Videos.  Stupid.  Eventually had to go through my CC to get a refund, they never accepted they wired it wrong and first blamed my dac, then my ddc.
> 
> Avoid Queenway.


I've been ordering stuff here and there from aliexpress now for some 7-8 years now I think, can't remember exactly when. 

I've also come across more than a few nasty sellers.  Its very different now though.  They realize how valuable the American consumer is now and aliexpress wants us to spend without worry.

So if anyone has any problems, I can try to advise to the best of my ability of what I've done to get a refund with my orders.

Providing pics and video is kind of standard now with disputes on aliexpress.  Just clearly explain and demonstrate whats wrong with it with a pic or video to the best of your ability and aliexpress will always give you the benefit of the doubt.  And do not wait, as soon as you receive the item make sure to inspect it and make sure everything is in good order.  There is a short window to dispute and get a full refund with free return shipping.  Some of the nasty sellers will try to delay and buy time with excuses or promises so that you lose this window.

Don't fall for crap like this,
If  you like the product ,you can  buy it again, I  will give  some special benefits  to you [Shake Hands]
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Politely insist on a refund and/or return, alot of these guys are standoffish and don't respond well to threats so I wouldn't advise that, catch more flies with honey as they say.


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## DenverW

msing539 said:


> Why don't you tell us how you really feel?


Lol .

Me: The cable was wired incorrectly, there is no sound.
Queenway: what does it do when it is plugged in.
Me: Nothing.  There is no sound.  No lock light on the dac.
Queenway:  Send a video.
Me: A video to show there is no sound.
Queenway:  Yes.
Me: Sent a video.
Queenway:  Is there sound now?
Me: ...


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## dougms3

DenverW said:


> Lol .
> 
> Me: The cable was wired incorrectly, there is no sound.
> Queenway: what does it do when it is plugged in.
> ...


Haha that brings back some memories.

There was one seller I ordered a set of rcas from and there was a channel imbalance with the cables, volume on one side was louder than the other for some reason, one might have been a coaxial cable now that I think about it.

Anyway I took a video with a microphone and tone generator to show the decibel level on my monitor and I told the seller, I'm gonna have to file a dispute.

I don't remember exactly what he said but it was something like this,

"Oh why don't you go ahead, I'm so scared"

I got a full refund plus free return shipping.


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## DenverW

I've got a hd800 cable that has a similar imbalance; the left side has much lower volume than the right.  I thought about sending it back to them but they didn't offer free shipping, and the cost was about the same as the cable.  I'm going to try and fix it.  My thought is something is soldered incorrectly, I just need to figure it out and fix it.


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## dougms3

DenverW said:


> I've got a hd800 cable that has a similar imbalance; the left side has much lower volume than the right.  I thought about sending it back to them but they didn't offer free shipping, and the cost was about the same as the cable.  I'm going to try and fix it.  My thought is something is soldered incorrectly, I just need to figure it out and fix it.


Ah that sucks.  

For the more expensive stuff, I try to buy from sellers that offer this in the listing.





It seems like they have warehouses setup for returns in the US, one seems to be Chicago.  I'm guessing they bundle them together and ship all at once to minimize costs.


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## Gazza

As I've connected by Innuos Zen Mini directly into my Naim NDX (and then sent to my Aqua DAC) I ordered an Odin coax knock-off. Was pretty darned cheap. Interested to see how it compares to my relatively affordable Van Den Hul.


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## msing539

Gazza said:


> As I've connected by Innuos Zen Mini directly into my Naim NDX (and then sent to my Aqua DAC) I ordered an Odin coax knock-off. Was pretty darned cheap. Interested to see how it compares to my relatively affordable Van Den Hul.


I ordered an Odin XLR, and I'm curious because I have an actual Red Dawn to compare it against.


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## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I ordered an Odin XLR, and I'm curious because I have an actual Red Dawn to compare it against.


That'll be interesting.  

I think it will sound better than the red dawn.  I have the odin 1 xlrs that I bought several years ago.  The odin 2 sounds a little better.  They both sounded better than my wireworld silver eclipse 8 and jps labs superconductorfx cables.


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## dougms3

Gazza said:


> As I've connected by Innuos Zen Mini directly into my Naim NDX (and then sent to my Aqua DAC) I ordered an Odin coax knock-off. Was pretty darned cheap. Interested to see how it compares to my relatively affordable Van Den Hul.


I bought the same odin coax too, I don't have any use for it yet but I wanted to have it on hand because I want to get a DDC later on.

I figured might as well get it since it was $13 during the sale.


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## Gazza

My Odin XLR knock-offs just arrived. I've hooked them up between my STAX amp and La Scala DAC and first impressions, baring in mind the cable is fresh and that I've never listened to this combo and the STAX have sat unused for about 6 months, it's...good? Great actually. Build quality is superb. Sound is crystal clear with gobs of detail. Have no idea how it compares to other cables as it's the only XLR I have on hand but so far I can't complain. Everything needs running in so let's see if it improves.


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## msing539

I have two XLRs on the way and one RCA. I think I need to at least complete a leg of the chain before I can see if they do anything. Even if they're just well made cables, I'll be happy with them for the price. 

The USB cable with jacket is so thick, I could chain a bike with it.


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## dougms3

Its pretty crazy how good they sound.  

Build quality is superb.  



msing539 said:


> The USB cable with jacket is so thick, I could chain a bike with it.



It is quite ridiculously thick for a usb cable, you should see the power cable.


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## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Its pretty crazy how good they sound.
> 
> Build quality is superb.
> 
> ...


Would you mind taking a non contact voltage tester to the jacket? I'm just curious if they're shielded as well as they look.


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## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Would you mind taking a non contact voltage tester to the jacket? I'm just curious if they're shielded as well as they look.


Don't have one of those unfortunately.


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## cdacosta

Ok first I want to say everything I purchased from Aliexpress is Dougms3's fault.  I have never previously ordered from Aliexpress or purchased audio anything from China (that I am aware of LOL).  Before getting any of the Aliexpress clone cables I was using really nice cables, most snagged from my reference home system that is in storage right now.

I started with a digital Nordost Odin SPDIF cable, then a Nordost Odin 2 power cable, then a Odin 2 Balanced XLR, then a Nordost Odin Ethernet cable.  After burn-in and hearing how damn good for the money the above cables were I then ordered a Nordost Odin Gold XLR balanced cable (which I got today) and a Nordost Odin Gold power cord.  All these cables that I put into my headphone rig are replacing really good cables.  Like the Odin Gold power cord that should arrive soon will be replacing a Electra Glide Signature which I purchased for around $1200 in the day.

I have also purchased during the above a Furutech power cable that was crap and some isolation footers that are working out nicely.  Oh yah also Elfidelity fan and SATA filters.  Again Doug to be blamed for all of this.  LOL

Aside the Furutech crap power cord and the Odin Gold cables (that will take time to know), the other cables are stellar for the money.  I need more cables like I need another hole in the head, but at these prices and performance I just want to try them.  NOTE: burn-in time for all of the above mentioned cables is 500+ hours for them to fully settle in.  The silver takes a lot of time to burn-in unless you have access to a cable burner/conditioner.  They sound acceptable and then get better and better as time and signal is passed through them.

Pics are of the Odin Gold XLR I got today and that I am listening to now.  Which by the way sound very different to the Odin 2 XLR balanced cable.  The Odin 2 power cord is installed on the PC and has about 600 hours on it.  I will admit in the last 25 years or so in this hobby I have not heard any cables that perform as well as these for even 10x the price.  I am impressed.


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## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Ok first I want to say everything I purchased from Aliexpress is Dougms3's fault.  I have never previously ordered from Aliexpress or purchased audio anything from China (that I am aware of LOL).  Before getting any of the Aliexpress clone cables I was using really nice cables, most snagged from my reference home system that is in storage right now.
> 
> I started with a digital Nordost Odin SPDIF cable, then a Nordost Odin 2 power cable, then a Odin 2 Balanced XLR, then a Nordost Odin Ethernet cable.  After burn-in and hearing how damn good for the money the above cables were I then ordered a Nordost Odin Gold XLR balanced cable (which I got today) and a Nordost Odin Gold power cord.  All these cables that I put into my headphone rig are replacing really good cables.  Like the Odin Gold power cord that should arrive soon will be replacing a Electra Glide Signature which I purchased for around $1200 in the day.
> 
> ...


Lol well then consider us even for introducing me to the power filtering stuff.


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## dougms3

Got the replacement power cable in today.

Switching out my furutech 314ag power cable on my Denafrips Ares II, this one sounds more spacious and open.  The treble is more accentuated and articulate, vocals are not as forward and theres improved separation and microdetail.  Its not as warm and theres slightly less bass but the improvement in the rest of the range is worth the trade off.  I just swapped it in so it may need a little bit of burn in time to settle in.


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## msing539

Is this just gold foil nicely wrapped over a silver plated copper cable?


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## dougms3

I didn't take it apart but I think all of the nordost knockoffs are using that solid core silver or sterling silver wire.  Just a bigger version of the other wire I took apart.

The last power cable I looked at seemed that way, it had heatshrink on the conductors and I had to return it so I didn't want to take it apart.


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## msing539

Why did you have to return it? Also, at first glance, it seems like all the knock-offs are the same... except there's one using Furutech connectors. There must be a giant spool of this wire in China somewhere.


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## msing539

These cables are made by a mfg called Audiocrast. I wonder if they have an unbranded cheaper cable using the same wire and connectors that's made just as well.


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## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Why did you have to return it? Also, at first glance, it seems like all the knock-offs are the same... except there's one using Furutech connectors. There must be a giant spool of this wire in China somewhere.


Returned it because the price.

I initially bought it for $155 then got it for $87.  Seller refused to match price.

A few companies make it i believe viborg also makes it.


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## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I just swapped it in so it may need a little bit of burn in time to settle in.


Ummm LOL good luck with that.  Because of the silver burn-in time is long.  I will be receiving one (Odin Gold 1.5m) within the week to try on the Jotunheim 2 amp.


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## Thenewguy007

cdacosta said:


> Ok first I want to say everything I purchased from Aliexpress is Dougms3's fault.  I have never previously ordered from Aliexpress or purchased audio anything from China (that I am aware of LOL).  Before getting any of the Aliexpress clone cables I was using really nice cables, most snagged from my reference home system that is in storage right now.
> 
> I started with a digital Nordost Odin SPDIF cable, then a Nordost Odin 2 power cable, then a Odin 2 Balanced XLR, then a Nordost Odin Ethernet cable.  After burn-in and hearing how damn good for the money the above cables were I then ordered a Nordost Odin Gold XLR balanced cable (which I got today) and a Nordost Odin Gold power cord.  All these cables that I put into my headphone rig are replacing really good cables.  Like the Odin Gold power cord that should arrive soon will be replacing a Electra Glide Signature which I purchased for around $1200 in the day.
> 
> ...



How's the silver version vs the gold version of those Nordost sound?


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## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Is this just gold foil nicely wrapped over a silver plated copper cable?


I am now listening to my system with the Odin Gold XLR balanced, now with about 48 hours of burn-in.  Before the silver Odin 2 XLR balanced were used, which have several hundred hours of burn-in.  I thought the Odin Gold would sound the same as the silver Odin 2.  Gold foil shield vs silver foil shield with same wire and different color connector shells.  But the system sounds vastly different with the Odin Gold version installed.  Connectors look identical, just different color.  Wire looks different.  Solder used is likely different.


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## msing539

cdacosta said:


> I am now listening to my system with the Odin Gold XLR balanced, now with about 48 hours of burn-in.  Before the silver Odin 2 XLR balanced were used, which have several hundred hours of burn-in.  I thought the Odin Gold would sound the same as the silver Odin 2.  Gold foil shield vs silver foil shield with same wire and different color connector shells.  But the system sounds vastly different with the Odin Gold version installed.  Connectors look identical, just different color.  Wire looks different.  Solder used is likely different.


Bah! Could you elaborate a little on the difference? I ordered all silver just because I assumed it was aesthetic only.


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## cdacosta

Thenewguy007 said:


> How's the silver version vs the gold version of those Nordost sound?


Vastly different which was not what I was expecting.  The Gold version has now about 48 hours on them, the silver had about 500 hours (so close to full burn-in).  When I mention burn-in time, I am referring to the amount of time signal has actually passed through the cable.

Odin Gold XLR balanced cable: 
- Is warmer, to me more musical.   
- Mid bass to Sub bass way more present.  Because of this and the warmth it brings to the presentation feels weightier compared to silver version.
- Not as resolving so far.  Has improved in micro detail the last 8 or so hours but since it is not fully burned-in it would be impossible to know how it ends up.

Silver Odin 2 XLR balanced cable:
- faster
- More resolving.  But was not like this the first 200 or so hours during burn-in.


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## msing539

By the time I'm done buying all these variants, I could have afforded one genuine Odin cable.


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## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> By the time I'm done buying all these variants, I could have afforded one genuine Odin cable.


LOL I doubt it.  The Odin Gold .5 meter XLR Balanced cable costed me $53.53 shipped.  Price of a decent dinner, that is why I had to try them.  The real Odin Gold .6 meter XLR Balanced costs $35,000!


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## msing539

Now I wish you had posted sooner. I would have bought your silver ones.


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## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Bah! Could you elaborate a little on the difference? I ordered all silver just because I assumed it was aesthetic only.


I also expected aesthetic only.  They sound way different.  I am glad I purchased both for two reasons, 1) they both sound unique and to me worth more than what I paid, 2) it is about synergy in a system.  Cables or one cable can change the overall presentation of a system.

Ultimately I need to hear the Odin Gold "after" they are burned in to know what they are capable of.



msing539 said:


> Now I wish you had posted sooner. I would have bought your silver ones.


Oh no, I am keeping them.  For the money (I paid $96.14 shipped) they sound stunning.  I will install them into my home reference system when I buy another home.


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## cdacosta

This will sound like a teaser but I am just sharing a true story.  The reason I even tried these cables.  Also, I believe Doug started this thread to make head-fi members aware of the value of some of these cables. 

I previously was adamant that Chinese audio gear and cables were junk and refused to even look at them.  And clones, ummm like a fake watch, no thanks.  Doug has been urging me to try Aliexpress cables for awhile now.  

Well, I have two clients that have Ultra high end home 2-channel systems.  They both own original Nordost Odin 2 power cables they use to power mono blocks that power their Wilson speakers.  They told me (with a straight face) that the Chinese Nordost Odin 2 clones were 95% of the performance and more musical for a tiny fraction of the price.  After I laughed at them, they dared me to try the Chinese cables.  So I purchased a 1.2m Odin 2 power cable.  Since then I purchased a different cable at a time to try and have been very impressed at the performance and the value.  Only cable I regret buying was the Furutech PS-950.  This Furutech cable looks identical to the original and sound like junk.


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## Gazza

Whelp, it happened, an improvement I thought couldn't, _shouldn't _occur: the Aliexpress audiophile network switch that arrived yesterday resulted in an audible improvement:

https://external-preview.redd.it/uap_4yjw6rO05lt97xCDpRaUMQOd0iJbdkhDrDTHZpQ.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=6a686ca385673a3bf5703155433aa0d9a8fe83ef






Combined with the knock-off Odin 2 ethernet cables I got a few weeks back (which only made a mild change but a change nonetheless) I heard a genuine increase in detail, in particular sub-bass that I never heard before. It also reduced some glare that was present when listening to very loud, very compressed tracks. I mean, this is an ethernet switch, it shouldn't make any difference to the sound, right? But compared to the $49 TP-Link that it replaced it very much made a welcome change.

I don't know if running in will improve things but that's my impressions fresh. if it gets better than great but it's already doing its job.

Oh, and @cdacosta and @dougms3 I have just ordered 3 x Gold Odin power cables you raved about. I was going to buy a Shunyata Delta power cable to put between the wall and my PS Audio regenerator but after hearing how good the gold Odin is I decided getting 3 cable for 1/3 the price of 1(!) cable is a far better use of my dollars.

This leaves my budget room to buy the new Western Electric 300B valves to replace my long-in-the-tooth Sophia Princess which are overdue a replacement.

Really hope these power cables are at least on the level of my entry-level Shunyata Venom power cables.


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## dougms3

Gazza said:


> Whelp, it happened, an improvement I thought couldn't, _shouldn't _occur: the Aliexpress audiophile network switch that arrived yesterday resulted in an audible improvement:
> 
> https://external-preview.redd.it/uap_4yjw6rO05lt97xCDpRaUMQOd0iJbdkhDrDTHZpQ.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=6a686ca385673a3bf5703155433aa0d9a8fe83ef
> 
> ...


That sounds like the typical effect when noise is reduced.  Background sounds that were just quiet will become more prominent as well.

It should improve with some burn in time, all electronics require some level of burn in.  

Definitely interested in how it compares to your Shunyata power cables.  Which Shunyata cables are you using now?

I only compared to my furutech 314ag power cable and its a very different sound.  I think the biggest improvement is how much more holographic it sounds with the gold odin cable.  

When I have more time, I'll compare it vs the Furutech s55n power cable with fi-46 connectors I built.


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## Gazza

Shunyata Venom NR-V12 for the DAC and Venom NR-V10 for the preamp. Aside from the Odin replacing the mains cable between the wall and my PS Audio PP3 (which is a power cord that has in-built filtering which is apparently not recommended for this purpose), the other two will be used on my Naim streamer and my power amp. Be interesting to hear what improvements they will bring. If the improvements a significant then I'll order a few more for other items including for the new network switch.


----------



## cdacosta

Gazza said:


> Whelp, it happened, an improvement I thought couldn't, _shouldn't _occur: the Aliexpress audiophile network switch that arrived yesterday resulted in an audible improvement:
> 
> https://external-preview.redd.it/uap_4yjw6rO05lt97xCDpRaUMQOd0iJbdkhDrDTHZpQ.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=6a686ca385673a3bf5703155433aa0d9a8fe83ef
> 
> ...


Burn-in is real.  You tell us if sonic performance improve with burn-in.  I have the Odin Gold power cable on order, Doug has the power cable.  I have the Odin 2 power cable now and the Odin Gold XLR balanced (received a couple days ago).   If your experience is like what I have been experiencing with the Odin 2 series and Odin Gold XLR you will be a happy camper.  Just remember those power cables need a lot of burn-in before you really hear what they are capable of.


----------



## cdacosta

Gazza said:


> Shunyata Venom NR-V12 for the DAC and Venom NR-V10 for the preamp. Aside from the Odin replacing the mains cable between the wall and my PS Audio PP3 (which is a power cord that has in-built filtering which is apparently not recommended for this purpose), the other two will be used on my Naim streamer and my power amp. Be interesting to hear what improvements they will bring. If the improvements a significant then I'll order a few more for other items including for the new network switch.


I can see you are series about improving the sonic reproduction of your system.  Have you tried Furutech Nano Liquid?  This is a contact enhancer that would surprise you what it does to improve sonic reproduction.   I purchased mine at VH Audio.  IMHO, very inexpensive for what it does.

Doug can elaborate what this does for his system.  For me this product makes a profound enough difference that "all" mechanical connections even inside gear (including source which is a PC) get treated with the Furutech Nano Liquid.  The Nano Liquid will sonically elevate every cable, connection or gear you use it on.  What this product does is minimize or eliminate the micro arcing of the electrical signal between mechanical connections.  Line level or AC electrical signal.  Non-conductive so you do not have to worry about shorts, which I know is counter productive.


----------



## cdacosta

I just thought of a way to explain what the benefits the Furutech Nano Liquid bring.  Way lower noise floor.  Timbre more realistic.  The presentation becomes less solid state and more like analog.  Increases resolution throughout the entire frequency spectrum.  Plainly put, more musical.


----------



## swiftdaddy

I bought some cheap cables off eBay and I have no complaints. I find it hilarious to the people who spend $1k+ on cables and convince themselves it sound “better”. The placebo effect is real!


----------



## dougms3

swiftdaddy said:


> I bought some cheap cables off eBay and I have no complaints. I find it hilarious to the people who spend $1k+ on cables and convince themselves it sound “better”. The placebo effect is real!


Oh thats interesting, which $1k cables are you referring to?  

So I take it, you've done listening tests and compared the cheap vs these non specific $1k cables?


----------



## Gazza

Thanks, yeah I'll check out that Furutech nano liquid.


----------



## cdacosta

Gazza said:


> Thanks, yeah I'll check out that Furutech nano liquid.


You won't regret it.  

To give you an idea of what I think of the Furutech Nano Liquid.  Yesterday I decided to replace/upgrade the PSU on my PC, which serves as the source component to my headphone sound system.  A simple start to finish PSU swap would be about 30 mins.  Instead the install took me 2.5 hours.  First cleaning all PSU and cable contacts with isopropyl alcohol and then applying a very thin coat of the Nano liquid.  Seriously good product.

Another quick personal story for anyone reading this.  The first time I tried the Nano Liquid just to see if it did anything was on a already burnt-in Cardas Clear Light balanced cable to my pair of Audeze LCD-XC (2021 model).  After listening for 30 mins I was so happy (and surprised) with the result I stopped listening and started applying the Nano Fluid on all contacts within the system.  Listening after each application within parts of the system.  I noticed that after each application system performance improved.  But there is a brake-in or settling-in of at least 75 hours.


----------



## cdacosta

Doug asked me about my thoughts on the Odin Gold 1.5m power cable I got.  I thought it made more sense to give anyone thinking of getting one to post my thoughts here.

My expectations were to have the Odin Gold perform very similar to the Odin 2.  The two cables appear to be the same but with one cable having gold plated connectors vs Rhodium.  Also one cable having gold foil shields and other having silver foil shielding.  After opening the cables up I still think this is the case.  Installed yesterday evening, so far the Odin Gold cable has been running 24/7 from the amp to a custom Line conditioner.  This means about 24 hours of current through the cable.  The Odin Gold power cable replaced a power cable I am very fond of, a 5' Electro Glide Reference Signature.  Note, the cable I received looks identical to the one Doug received.

*Before installation of the Odin Gold power cable:*
- Checked for proper wiring with a DMM.  They were wired correctly.  I never assume any new cable is properly wired before installing into a system.
- Polished male AC plug with 0000 Steel wool and Pro Gold as a lubricant.  I was not happy with the AC blade finish.  The Odin 2 cable blades with Rhodium contacts looked like any Furutech or Oyaide plug I have used, unlike the Odin Gold blade finishing.
- Removed connectors and cleaned all contacts with 91% isopropyl alcohol.  Then applied a very thin layer of Furutech Nano Liquid on all wires and connector contacts.  The Furutech Nano Liquid also gets applied to the AC male blades and inside the female blades on the IEC connector.  
- After assembly applied fo.Q. T-32 around the outside of the female plug that plugs into the Schitt Jotunheim 2 amp IEC socket.  This will ensure an extremely tight fit and minimizes micro vibration.

*After installation:*
My expectations were nil except I would hear sound.  I know the Furutech Nano Liquid would take at least 72 hours to settle-in and the power cable would take at least 300+ hours to really get an idea of what I have and how I would like it installed on this amp.  Silver power cords take a long time to burn-in and usually sound off until they are burned in.  
- First few hours were what I experienced many times before with silver cables.   A hazy HF brightness, most bass frequencies cut in half.  Loss of macro and micro detail.  Unlistenable at least for music.  There were wild swings from opening and closing of sound stage, bass coming back and hitting hard but the rest of the frequencies sounding weird.  And so on, and so on, was all over the place. 
- Eight hours later was better.  This morning I listened to the system before work and was markedly better, but still had some of that HF haze and brightness.
- After twenty four hours, everything sounds much much better.  Micro detail was awesome with bass detailed and authoritive.  There were a lot of changes but is still obvious much more burn-in is necessary.

Will update once I can get enough burn-in on this cable within the system.


----------



## Ficcion2 (Jul 14, 2022)

This thread has sparked my curiosity about replica cables.
I ordered these (Amazon) Monosaudio XLR cables and an Audiocrast power cable that looks like a copy of an AQ Monsoon PC just with different plugs.

Bought purely for aesthetics after selling off my JPS Labs cables and real AQ Tornado. I settled with Mogami but tbh theyre just so plain.

I went overboard and got outlet receptacle and matching cover on sale from Ali Express for $35 even if it makes no difference the receptacle cover looks pretty cool IMO. Again, just for looks.


----------



## dougms3

Ficcion2 said:


> This thread has sparked my curiosity about replica cables.
> I ordered these (Amazon) Monosaudio XLR cables and an Audiocrast power cable that looks like a copy of an AQ Monsoon PC just with different plugs.
> 
> Bought purely for aesthetics after selling off my JPS Labs cables and real AQ Tornado. I settled with Mogami but tbh theyre just so plain.
> ...


You never know what you find.

Audiocrast makes alot of stuff, I wouldn't be surprised if they make the bulk wiring for some of these knockoffs.

@cdacosta has that same outlet.  I should get one to test out how it compares to my real furutech duplexes.


----------



## cdacosta

Ficcion2 said:


> This thread has sparked my curiosity about replica cables.
> I ordered these (Amazon) Monosaudio XLR cables and an Audiocrast power cable that looks like a copy of an AQ Monsoon PC just with different plugs.
> 
> Bought purely for aesthetics after selling off my JPS Labs cables and real AQ Tornado. I settled with Mogami but tbh theyre just so plain.
> ...


Never tried a cable based on looks, but hey maybe you can get lucky.   As for outlet wall plate what I have tried and like is the Carbon Fiber wall plates.  They lower noise floor a bit and are cheap.  I paid about $20 each.  I have one on main Oyaide R1 outlet, one on a copper Monosaudio copper outlet (I do not use for my audio system anymore) and one on a Isolation PLC mated with a Maestro outlet.


----------



## Ficcion2

dougms3 said:


> You never know what you find.
> 
> Audiocrast makes alot of stuff, I wouldn't be surprised if they make the bulk wiring for some of these knockoffs.
> 
> @cdacosta has that same outlet.  I should get one to test out how it compares to my real furutech duplexes.


After browsing through Ali Express and seeing how Audiocrast and the like seem to pump out all sorts of cable "models" under different brands.. I figured AQ using them isn't probably too far from the truth. AQ just blows up the price X^10. I actually prefer these connectors vs the plastic ones on the official AQ PCs.

If you give a go lets us know what you think. Legit Furutech is very nice.


cdacosta said:


> Never tried a cable based on looks, but hey maybe you can get lucky.   As for outlet wall plate what I have tried and like is the Carbon Fiber wall plates.  They lower noise floor a bit and are cheap.  I paid about $20 each.  I have one on main Oyaide R1 outlet, one on a copper Monosaudio copper outlet (I do not use for my audio system anymore) and one on a Isolation PLC mated with a Maestro outlet.



Yeah, they're cheap enough that when I get bored of looking at them Ill just try out different ones like the ones you guys have swooped from Ali.

What about the Monosaudio outlet made you move it away from your audio system? I just bought it for looks and cause Ive given myself a limit on accessories for now.


----------



## cdacosta

Oops sorry I misspoke.  I have purchased a clone (from Aliexpress), a Furutech Alpha PS-950 power cord because of looks and curiosity. I have listened to the real thing in cable shootouts just before Covid first hit.  Looks exactly like the original Furutech and sounds like crap.  It is now plugged into my wife's computer.


----------



## cdacosta

Just found these Carbon Fiber outlet covers for $9.41 shipped on Aliexpress:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/225...103399116577801603226458ea836!67016267243!sea


----------



## Ficcion2

I might get some outlet covers just to spruce up my place...

I have another Monosaudio power cord that I put on my bass guitar amp which is also a boutique brand.
It made no difference to the sound but it sure looks cooler now not that anyone would actually care vs this forum lol.

 After owning expensive cables and noting no discernible differences (in my rig) I tried sticking to studio cables and stock power cords but they're dull looking.
Theres so many options on Ali Express that I don't want to end up spending as much as if I were to just get an official cable like someone else mentioned


----------



## FredA

DenverW said:


> I've ordered a few iem cables and a couple cables for zmf from aliexpress and have generally been pretty happy.  Some issues will pop up, like I got a balanced cable that wasn't assembled correctly so I had to take apart one of the connectors and make sure it was lined up.
> 
> The only TRULY negative experience I've had is with the "Queenway" store.  Ordered a specific i2s cable from them, of course it didn't work (wasn't wired correctly) and got put through the ringer trying to get them to accept a return.  I had to send videos of the cable not working.  Videos.  Stupid.  Eventually had to go through my CC to get a refund, they never accepted they wired it wrong and first blamed my dac, then my ddc.
> 
> Avoid Queenway.


Was it the AVPlay cable? So many bought it and are really happy with it.


----------



## FredA

Almost all my cables are now from Aliexpress, except some Nimaks (main pc, acss interconnects and usb cable). I am really happy with them.


----------



## DenverW

FredA said:


> Was it the AVPlay cable? So many bought it and are really happy with it.


I  believe so.  I’m sure the cable is great, but the seller wired it incorrectly so it wasn’t compatible.


----------



## FredA

DenverW said:


> I  believe so.  I’m sure the cable is great, but the seller wired it incorrectly so it wasn’t compatible.


Yeah, possible. Doing a short video showing the cable is plugged and that no music plays would have given them confidence. The issue is the cable costs much to return, so they would just send you a new one. What kind of dac and usb interface do you have?


----------



## DenverW

FredA said:


> Yeah, possible. Doing a short video showing the cable is plugged and that no music plays would have given them confidence. The issue is the cable costs much to return, so they would just send you a new one. What kind of dac and usb interface do you have?


They did request a video, but fought the return, saying they made the cable correctly.  The cable was for an denafrips iris to audiomirror tubadour, which uses ps audio standard.  They did not send a new cable, so the transaction was cancelled by my credit card co.


----------



## FredA

DenverW said:


> They did request a video, but fought the return, saying they made the cable correctly.  The cable was for an denafrips iris to audiomirror tubadour, which uses ps audio standard.  They did not send a new cable, so the transaction was cancelled by my credit card co.


You could have the cable checked by someone qualified nearby. No rocket science but tricky to solder. Could be that one solder broke


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> They did request a video, but fought the return, saying they made the cable correctly.  The cable was for an denafrips iris to audiomirror tubadour, which uses ps audio standard.  They did not send a new cable, so the transaction was cancelled by my credit card


They'll always fight the return.  Aliexpress has become alot better at handling these problems.  I just recently had two issues and got a full refund on both without involving the cc company.

But you also have to understand that you have to be extremely specific when getting cables custom made.  Don't pay anything until you are 100% clear they understand.  Give them diagrams.  Because if you pay and say i want the ps audio standard, they'll make it as fast as possible and use the first diagram in weibo search or whatever they use and ship it out.


----------



## DenverW

dougms3 said:


> They'll always fight the return.  Aliexpress has become alot better at handling these problems.  I just recently had two issues and got a full refund on both without involving the cc company.
> 
> But you also have to understand that you have to be extremely specific when getting cables custom made.  Don't pay anything until you are 100% clear they understand.  Give them diagrams.  Because if you pay and say i want the ps audio standard, they'll make it as fast as possible and use the first diagram in weibo search or whatever they use and ship it out.


Yep.  I did a direct chat with them prior to ordering with the specific info and they still screwed it’s up.  Queenway stinks .


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> Yep.  I did a direct chat with them prior to ordering with the specific info and they still screwed it’s up.  Queenway stinks .


Lol sometimes it helps to have a Chinese friend translate specific instructions for you.

The aliexpress chat uses auto translate and its really bad.


----------



## cdacosta

Odin Gold power cord after 72 hours of burn-in...

- I added the Oyaide MWA-010T EMI tape to the ends of the connectors, which can be seen in the included pic.  This is a tweak I really like for power cords.  Usually will lower noise floor.  If you try this tape it works well with power cables, not so much with signal cables.
- 97% of the HF haze is gone.   Definitely a warmer presentation then the Odin 2 cable, by a couple of notches I would say.  
- What I have experienced throughout the last 48 hours (listening on and off) is the volume/db level has gone up and down.  The volume change is about 2 db, using the same source material, listening to the same songs.  So yesterday volume was lower, today volume higher.  
-At about 200 hz and down (bass regions) now hit like a MAC truck.  I had to turn down the bass by 1db, was making my jaw and face shake when listening to fast 135-138 bpm techno.  If my past experiences are any indication this bass boost will fade some.
- Macro detail developing nicely.  
- Better PRAT than the first 48 hours.
- This is a fast cable, but feels a tad slower than the Odin 2.  Micro and macro dynamics is very cool to experience.

More to come after 150 - 200 hours.  At the 200 hour mark or so the Odin 2 started to really become resolving, lets see if this cable is similar. After about 300 or so hours IIRC the Odin 2 on the PC started to all snap into place and system started to sound really good.  This is all hard to explain unless one experiences it.  It is when timbre sounds and feels real or more real.  Like when you hear a cymbal struck or levels of detail with drum kits, skin over guitar strings, etc.


----------



## Gazza

cdacosta said:


> Odin Gold power cord after 72 hours of burn-in...
> 
> - I added the Oyaide MWA-010T EMI tape to the ends of the connectors, which can be seen in the included pic.  This is a tweak I really like for power cords.  Usually will lower noise floor.  If you try this tape it works well with power cables, not so much with signal cables.
> - 97% of the HF haze is gone.   Definitely a warmer presentation then the Odin 2 cable, by a couple of notches I would say.
> ...



Great write-up! Now I can't wait for my gold Odins to arrive. Might even buy 3 more if they're that good. Would you say they're on par with $1,000-$2,000 power cables from the likes of Shunyata, Isotek, et al?


----------



## cdacosta

Gazza said:


> Great write-up! Now I can't wait for my gold Odins to arrive. Might even buy 3 more if they're that good. Would you say they're on par with $1,000-$2,000 power cables from the likes of Shunyata, Isotek, et al?


*Short answer:* Yes, that is why I am so impressed by them (entire line up I have tried so far).  Especially once I tweaked them as I have shared recently.  The Odin Gold 1.5m costed me $87.86 shipped!  Yesterday a hamburger and fries (no drink) costed me $24.15, so the value to me is very high.

*Long Answer: *Your question is kind of loaded.  In the last 20 years or so I probably have experienced 100+ "audiophile grade" power cables ranging in systems priced from $5K to $250K.  I have learned the #1 factor to how well a cable(s) fit into a system is synergy.  I will say so far from what I have experienced with the clone Odin 2 and Odin Gold power cables, is they are the best at resolution, dynamics and presenting sonically like a live event, compared to anything I have experienced up to $1000.  Without any real drawbacks.   The higher end or higher priced power cords will "usually" excel in certain sonic attributes.  This is how they command the price they ask.  For example, the power cable that was attached to the Jotunheim 2 amp was a Electra Glide Reference Signature.  This Electra Glide cable added a sweet warmth, kind of tubey like tone to the sonic presentation that is hard to reproduce without actually using tubes.  Some audiophiles like me paid $1200 for this cable because of what the cable did to vocals and presentation, especially with source components.  But, is not as resolving (especially micro detail) as these two clone cables we are discussing.  The Odin Gold because of the slightly warmer presentation is closer, but not the same.  Then again you could plug a $3K power cord into your setup and really dislike what you hear.  

In two or three instances at cable shootouts or comparison meet ups I was able to A/B/C the real Nordost Odin (not Odin 2 or Odin Gold) original power cables.  I did not like them when compared to others in the $3K to $5K range.  They were fast, exacting, very resolving, but not musical.  The Odin Gold power cable I got sounds better to me because it is musical, but not quite as resolving or dynamic.  I could go on and on with comparisons but there likely is not much value, since a cable must be tried on system (which are all different) and hear the synergy and how it mates up to the listeners taste.  Usually buyers of high end cables are very discerning about their music and tastes.  What I can say is for the money, the two above mentioned clone Nordost cables represent a stunning value in my humble opinion.

Also to note, if you have other decent cables in your system, you should try swapping them around between components.  Like if I swapped the Odin 2 I have on my PC (source) with the Odin Gold on amp the sonic presentation will be different.  Just make sure all cables are burned-in so you can make an accurate assessment. 

As I am typing this, I am listening to below, and is believable, like first or second row.  Sounds really good, even with cables breaking in.


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> *Short answer:* Yes, that is why I am so impressed by them (entire line up I have tried so far).  Especially once I tweaked them as I have shared recently.  The Odin Gold 1.5m costed me $87.86 shipped!  Yesterday a hamburger and fries (no drink) costed me $24.15, so the value to me is very high.
> 
> *Long Answer: *Your question is kind of loaded.  In the last 20 years or so I probably have experienced 100+ "audiophile grade" power cables ranging in systems priced from $5K to $250K.  I have learned the #1 factor to how well a cable(s) fit into a system is synergy.  I will say so far from what I have experienced with the clone Odin 2 and Odin Gold power cables, is they are the best at resolution, dynamics and presenting sonically like a live event, compared to anything I have experienced up to $1000.  Without any real drawbacks.   The higher end or higher priced power cords will "usually" excel in certain sonic attributes.  This is how they command the price they ask.  For example, the power cable that was attached to the Jotunheim 2 amp was a Electra Glide Reference Signature.  This Electra Glide cable added a sweet warmth, kind of tubey like tone to the sonic presentation that is hard to reproduce without actually using tubes.  Some audiophiles like me paid $1200 for this cable because of what the cable did to vocals and presentation, especially with source components.  But, is not as resolving (especially micro detail) as these two clone cables we are discussing.  The Odin Gold because of the slightly warmer presentation is closer, but not the same.  Then again you could plug a $3K power cord into your setup and really dislike what you hear.
> 
> ...



Synergy with the overall system and the gear itself is mandatory. I have a favorite cable for each gear. It take time to do the comparisons but it is worth the investment.

I even bought grouding tubes on Ali (small wooden cylindersb filled with a mysterious semi-conductor mix). I have found they make a difference when used on the main power bar.. For the rest of the gears, not sure they work. The sound became a bit more relax and laid back. More focused too. Worth a try, it's only 25-30$ a piece.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Doug asked me about my thoughts on the Odin Gold 1.5m power cable I got.  I thought it made more sense to give anyone thinking of getting one to post my thoughts here.
> 
> My expectations were to have the Odin Gold perform very similar to the Odin 2.  The two cables appear to be the same but with one cable having gold plated connectors vs Rhodium.  Also one cable having gold foil shields and other having silver foil shielding.  After opening the cables up I still think this is the case.  Installed yesterday evening, so far the Odin Gold cable has been running 24/7 from the amp to a custom Line conditioner.  This means about 24 hours of current through the cable.  The Odin Gold power cable replaced a power cable I am very fond of, a 5' Electro Glide Reference Signature.  Note, the cable I received looks identical to the one Doug received.
> 
> ...


That's hardcore, bro, love it!


----------



## szore

Yah! So based on cdacosta advice I bought a Odin 2 cable and was very impressed! Ordered 2 more last night.


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> Yah! So based on cdacosta advice I bought a Odin 2 cable and was very impressed! Ordered 2 more last night.


Awesome, I await your impressions in 8 to 10 weeks.


----------



## musicinmymind

FredA said:


> Synergy with the overall system and the gear itself is mandatory. I have a favorite cable for each gear. It take time to do the comparisons but it is worth the investment.
> 
> I even bought *grouding tubes* on Ali (small wooden cylindersb filled with a mysterious semi-conductor mix). I have found they make a difference when used on the main power bar.. For the rest of the gears, not sure they work. The sound became a bit more relax and laid back. More focused too. Worth a try, it's only 25-30$ a piece.



Never heard of grouding tubes, what is that used for.
Can you pls give link.


----------



## msing539

I ordered the Odin 2 silver interconnects but went a different route on power cables:

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/3256802712395331.html

Just got one to try for now.


----------



## FredA

musicinmymind said:


> Never heard of grouding tubes, what is that used for.
> Can you pls give link.


This

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/1005003583405036.html

Same function as a grounding box, i.e. clean-up ground.


----------



## cdacosta

Ficcion2 said:


> What about the Monosaudio outlet made you move it away from your audio system? I just bought it for looks and cause Ive given myself a limit on accessories for now.


I got the Monosaudio copper outlet to be used on the modem/router, replacing the $1 outlet.  I since moved the modem/router and is now plugged into a isolation transformer PLC with DAC.  All my other AC outlets are Furutech, Oyaide or Maestro and did not see any reason to try the Monosaudio to replace any of them.


----------



## FredA (Jul 15, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> I got the Monosaudio copper outlet to be used on the modem/router, replacing the $1 outlet.  I since moved the modem/router and is now plugged into a isolation transformer PLC with DAC.  All my other AC outlets are Furutech, Oyaide or Maestro and did not see any reason to try the Monosaudio to replace any of them.


Interested in the outcome if anyone compares it to the Maestro.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Yah! So based on cdacosta advice I bought a Odin 2 cable and was very impressed! Ordered 2 more last night.


Do yourself a favor and do not judge the performance of the cable until at least 300 hours of current has passed through it.  Sucker goes through some wild swings.  Also Furutech Nano Liquid if you are not already using a very good contact enhancer.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> Interested in the outcome if anyone compares it to the Maestro.


How do you like the Maestro outlet in your setup?  For anyone serious about their system and sonic performance, I think AC outlet upgrades are often overlooked.  I found the Maestro build quality lacking compared to Furutech and Oyaide.  But the Maestro seems to be the most sonically natural and neutral sounding compared to the brands mentioned and that I tried.


----------



## FredA (Jul 15, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> How do you like the Maestro outlet in your setup?  For anyone serious about their system and sonic performance, I think AC outlet upgrades are often overlooked.  I found the Maestro build quality lacking compared to Furutech and Oyaide.  But the Maestro seems to be the most sonically natural and neutral sounding compared to the brands mentioned and that I tried.


Yes. It's been there for 15 years. I would call it natural.i never thought about changing it. I spent more time afterwards on power bars. I assembled one from affordable parts and am glad with the results. Clone furutech iec, good quality Chinese chassis and Chinese sockets, plus good silver-plated 12awg wire from Hificollective. Total cost of 120usd.


----------



## szore (Jul 15, 2022)

Wow! Spending quality time with the Odin 2 on my Jot 2 amp and I'm really gob smacked I mean, i can be funny about it, but the truth is I am seriously impressed... Everything is elevated, and yes I know it has to burn in, but what I am hearing is exactly what was described earlier in this thread by various members so that gives me great confidence in where this cable is going. But with about 24 hours on it , the bass and treble is indeed extended, the bass has more body and slam and is very 'planted'. The resolution has increased considerable. The treble is a little hot. The over all quality of the sound is elevated. What is not so great is the soundstage, and the mids are a bit muddles. The texture has increased, but I think that is really more 'body' across the spectrum. The timbre seems a bit warbly. So, yeah, I'm seriously impressed! I ordered 2 more and I'm really excited! Best $120 I ever spent for audio! in multiples..... Can't wait till I get everything burned, this system will be awesome. I am going to get that liquid too. I wonder can I use that liquid, i forget its name, on my DAP cable and connections? Why not, right?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Wow! Spending quality time with the Odin 2 on my Jot 2 amp and I'm really gob smacked I mean, i can be funny about it, but the truth is I am seriously impressed... Everything is elevated, and yes I know it has to burn in, but what I am hearing is exactly what was described earlier in this thread by various members so that gives me great confidence in where this cable is going. But with about 24 hours on it , the bass and treble is indeed extended, the bass has more body and slam and is very 'planted'. The resolution has increased considerable. The treble is a little hot. The over all quality of the sound is elevated. What is not so great is the soundstage, and the mids are a bit muddles. The texture has increased, but I think that is really more 'body' across the spectrum. The timbre seems a bit warbly. So, yeah, I'm seriously impressed! I ordered 2 more and I'm really excited! Best $120 I ever spent for audio! in multiples..... Can't wait till I get everything burned, this system will be awesome. I am going to get that liquid too. I wonder can I use that liquid, i forget its name, on my DAP cable and connections? Why not, right?


Glad to hear its improved your system.  It is pretty crazy how good these cables are.  I'm curious about the other knockoffs as well.  

I bought the argento xlr knockoffs and they're even better than the odin 2 interconnects I bought.  I really want to take it apart to see whats inside but they cost too much to risk damaging.

The contact enhancer is called the Furutech Nano Liquid, it works well on any connection but the effect will wear off on connectors that plugged in and out alot.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Glad to hear its improved your system.  It is pretty crazy how good these cables are.  I'm curious about the other knockoffs as well.
> 
> I bought the argento xlr knockoffs and they're even better than the odin 2 interconnects I bought.  I really want to take it apart to see whats inside but they cost too much to risk damaging.
> 
> The contact enhancer is called the Furutech Nano Liquid, it works well on any connection but the effect will wear off on connectors that plugged in and out alot.


Yeah, I just bought moon audio Black Dragon XLR's now I'm thinking of swapping them out for the Argento considering you like it...I wonder how the black dragon compares tho, because I'm pretty happy with it.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Yeah, I just bought moon audio Black Dragon XLR's now I'm thinking of swapping them out for the Argento considering you like it...I wonder how the black dragon compares tho, because I'm pretty happy with it.


Always chasing the dragon in this hobby.  Curiosity always gets the better of me.

I had the wireworld silver eclipse 8 xlrs before and compared it directly, one channel hooked up with the wireworld cable and one with the argento knockoffs and it was pretty easy to tell that the argento knockoffs sounded better.  I sold the wireworld cables.  

I have no idea how they're achieving these results but its unmistakably better.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804094581749.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.190d38dahk9Z7J&mp=1

The gold one is now at a new low $74.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Wow! Spending quality time with the Odin 2 on my Jot 2 amp and I'm really gob smacked I mean, i can be funny about it, but the truth is I am seriously impressed... Everything is elevated, and yes I know it has to burn in, but what I am hearing is exactly what was described earlier in this thread by various members so that gives me great confidence in where this cable is going. But with about 24 hours on it , the bass and treble is indeed extended, the bass has more body and slam and is very 'planted'. The resolution has increased considerable. The treble is a little hot. The over all quality of the sound is elevated. What is not so great is the soundstage, and the mids are a bit muddles. The texture has increased, but I think that is really more 'body' across the spectrum. The timbre seems a bit warbly. So, yeah, I'm seriously impressed! I ordered 2 more and I'm really excited! Best $120 I ever spent for audio! in multiples..... Can't wait till I get everything burned, this system will be awesome. I am going to get that liquid too. I wonder can I use that liquid, i forget its name, on my DAP cable and connections? Why not, right?


LOL As I said, during burn-in that sucker is going to be all over the place.  The treble stays hot and slowly dissipates away after 300 hours.  Mids/vocals, timbre, more micro and macro detail develop as time goes through burn-in.   Eventually everything sonically snaps into place.

The Furutech Nano Liquid "can and should be used" on all mechanical connections.  If you like the cable, the Nano Liquid is more impressive.  I recommend cleaning and coating the conductors and connectors of the power cable.  By treating the power cable, will relax the aggressive presentation a bit and improve timbre and micro dynamics.  Because you apply such an extremely light coat of the Nano Liquid there is enough to treat every mechanical connection and then some.  Even every connection inside my PC (source) is treated except the CPU.


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> LOL As I said, during burn-in that sucker is going to be all over the place.  The treble stays hot and slowly dissipates away after 300 hours.  Mids/vocals, timbre, more micro and macro detail develop as time goes through burn-in.   Eventually everything sonically snaps into place.
> 
> The Furutech Nano Liquid "can and should be used" on all mechanical connections.  If you like the cable, the Nano Liquid is more impressive.  I recommend cleaning and coating the conductors and connectors of the power cable.  By treating the power cable, will relax the aggressive presentation a bit and improve timbre and micro dynamics.  Because you apply such an extremely light coat of the Nano Liquid there is enough to treat every mechanical connection and then some.  Even every connection inside my PC (source) is treated except the CPU.


This darn liquid is expensive though...


----------



## FredA

Stabilant 22 seems fine and more affordable.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Stabilant 22 seems fine and more affordable.


It is quite expensive but it works well.  

Stabilant 22 looks interesting, maybe when I run low on the nano liquid I'll give that a try and compare it.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> It is quite expensive but it works well.
> 
> Stabilant 22 looks interesting, maybe when I run low on the nano liquid I'll give that a try and compare it.


It is used on aircrafts and can be wipped off with alcool.


----------



## Nago

Has anyone found a good cable for the HD800S by chance? 

I once ordered one but it felt super cheap and low quality so I gave up on it.


----------



## dougms3

Nago said:


> Has anyone found a good cable for the HD800S by chance?
> 
> I once ordered one but it felt super cheap and low quality so I gave up on it.


To be honest, I think you're better off getting one of the premium cables like cardas.  The HD800s is a premium headphone, doesn't make sense to skimp on the cable.

But if you want to try out something on a budget, you could try xinhs. They're pretty good quality and he's very reasonable with the prices. I really like that all silver 12 core wire.

Just pick a cable and ask them to make the cable with specific connectors and termination.


----------



## FredA (Jul 16, 2022)

Nago said:


> Has anyone found a good cable for the HD800S by chance?
> 
> I once ordered one but it felt super cheap and low quality so I gave up on it.


Got a couple of cables from Lunashop on ali for my Chinese Music Masters. Happy with them, both well under 100$.

This one is from another seller, no review, but it looks good:

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005002093852427.html


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> Stabilant 22 seems fine and more affordable.


Only sharing here, one can obviously do whatever they like.  I have used Stabilant 22 and the Furutech Nano Liquid regarding performance is in a totally different league.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> It is used on aircrafts and can be wipped off with alcool.


Furutech Nano Liquid can also be removed with isopropyl alcohol.


----------



## cdacosta

Nago said:


> Has anyone found a good cable for the HD800S by chance?
> 
> I once ordered one but it felt super cheap and low quality so I gave up on it.


I know a few audiophiles that own HD800 series headphones.  Because of the bright signature of these headphones all ended up with Cardas.  Cardas cables have a warmer sonic signature which helps balance the overall presentation.  For a budget cable recommendations you may want to look at HD800 threads within head-fi.  I am sure you will find reviews and suggestions from users.


----------



## Nago

dougms3 said:


> To be honest, I think you're better off getting one of the premium cables like cardas.  The HD800s is a premium headphone, doesn't make sense to skimp on the cable.
> 
> But if you want to try out something on a budget, you could try xinhs. They're pretty good quality and he's very reasonable with the prices. I really like that all silver 12 core wire.
> 
> Just pick a cable and ask them to make the cable with specific connectors and termination.


I see your point but honestly I don't hear cables (never paid much attention to it though). Hence this is more about haptics, build quality and convenience of length.

I'll definitvely check out the shop you recommanded, looks really solid. Much appreciated!


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> Furutech Nano Liquid can also be removed with isopropyl alcohol.


Do you put this stuff  on both the gear and the cable connectors, and both male and female? Cause with the stabilant 22, the excess has to be wipped off. Not easy with a female connector...


----------



## dougms3

Nago said:


> I see your point but honestly I don't hear cables (never paid much attention to it though). Hence this is more about haptics, build quality and convenience of length.
> 
> I'll definitvely check out the shop you recommanded, looks really solid. Much appreciated!


Or you could check out moon audio cables.  Theres usually some for sale in the classifieds for a reasonable price.

I'll put it this way.  At canjam, almost every single vendor had moon audio cables on their headphones for demo.  

Its like buying cheap tires for a Corvette.  Not getting the most out of the vette with cheap tires.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> Do you put this stuff  on both the gear and the cable connectors, and both male and female? Cause with the stabilant 22, the excess has to be wipped off. Not easy with a female connector...


Yes both connections.  Applying Nano Liquid is not messy. The amount used is a very light coat. Like I keep saying “all mechanical connections”.  After applying the Nano Liquid in a couple of places and hearing the change you will start looking for every application possible within your system. I am not exaggerating.


----------



## dougms3

Maybe @saldsald can weigh in on his impressions of the nano liquid also.


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> Yes both connections.  Applying Nano Liquid is not messy. The amount used is a very light coat. Like I keep saying “all mechanical connections”.  After applying the Nano Liquid in a couple of places and hearing the change you will start looking for every application possible within your system. I am not exaggerating.


I will possibly try the Stabilant 22a. Same directives. Seems to work very well. Half the money.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> I will possibly try the Stabilant 22a. Same directives. Seems to work very well. Half the money.


Cheaper is leave it and use nothing.  I have tried the Stabilant 22 and several others like Walker Audio (couple of variants/versions), Quick Silver, Quick Silver Gold and others throughout the years.  

I found the Stabilant 22 to be very useful and worked well for mechanical non-audio applications.  For improving audio performance, what I hear and feel when listening to music through mid to high resolution systems, the Furutech Nano Liquid gets my money.


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> Cheaper is leave it and use nothing.  I have tried the Stabilant 22 and several others like Walker Audio (couple of variants/versions), Quick Silver, Quick Silver Gold and others throughout the years.
> 
> I found the Stabilant 22 to be very useful and worked well for mechanical non-audio applications.  For improving audio performance, what I hear and feel when listening to music through mid to high resolution systems, the Furutech Nano Liquid gets my money.


Furutech has exaggerated pricing. I am not a fan of nanotech for biological reasons. Nanotech are everywhere,. It's a big concern to me. I recognize that Furutech has good products though.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Furutech has exaggerated pricing. I am not a fan of nanotech for biological reasons. Nanotech are everywhere,. It's a big concern to me. I recognize that Furutech has good products though.


Agree with the pricing but the nano liquid should be pretty safe even if you get it on your hands or in the environment.  The base is squalene oil which is an organic oil, all animals and plants produce squalene, and it has micro particles of gold and silver in it which are safe also.  They're pretty open about what its made of.

The stuff to worry about is PET, BPA, teflon, microplastics, pthalates, etc, they mimic estrogen and disrupt the endocrine system.  They get in the water supply and can't be removed, they eventually make their way into lakes, rivers and oceans where its consumed or absorbed by plants and microscopic animals then eventually make their way back up the food chain to us.

One of the biggest offenders of this is thermal paper like in receipt paper, try not to touch it.  They make BPA free receipt paper which has BPS in which is actually worse than BPA.


----------



## cdacosta

For those following the break-in of the Odin Gold power cord on my Jotunheim 2 amp...

120 or so hours in listening to Tidal, varies genres:

- The crazy bass boost calmed down some as I thought it would.  Now is tighter a bit quicker and punchier vs hard slam.
- Interesting is sound stage expanded.  So as a listener I do not feel there are walls or that the sound is compressed inwards at all.  Keeping in mind sound stage presentation is different on headphones vs 2+ channels in a room.   The Audeze LCD-XC headphones I am listening to are closed back headphones.  
- Slight improvement in micro dynamics and macro dynamics (which are already very good).
- Vocals are warming up and sounding more natural and inviting
- No negative sonic attributes I can detect developing.
- The whole presentation or PRAT is better.  PRAT is almost where I would want and expect a setup like mine to perform at.  Pretty good for 120 or so hours into burn-in period.


----------



## szore

So what XLR interconnect cable do people like?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> So what XLR interconnect cable do people like?


My favorite is Audioquest Sky, not inexpensive though, they cost about $2200 for a 1 meter.  Best budget balanced XLR cable I have experienced is the Nordost Odin Gold or Odin 2 clones.  

- Odin Gold clone .5 meter cost me $53.53 shipped.  Using them now and burning them in.  
- Odin 2 clone 1 meter cost me $96.14 shipped.  Edgier, faster and a bit more resolving than Odin Gold above.
- XLO Signature 3 clone.  Costed me around $70 shipped.  Looks identical to the real thing and sounds very similar.  I have used the originals for a couple of months that were about $1200 for 1 meter but not in my current headphone setup.   When I used these cables it was during cable swaps between audiophiles.  Warmer, musical but not as resolving as the Nordost clones above.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> My favorite is Audioquest Sky, not inexpensive though, they cost about $2200 for a 1 meter.  Best budget balanced XLR cable I have experienced is the Nordost Odin Gold or Odin 2 clones.
> 
> - Odin Gold clone .5 meter cost me $53.53 shipped.  Using them now and burning them in.
> - Odin 2 clone 1 meter cost me $96.14 shipped.  Edgier, faster and a bit more resolving than Odin Gold above.
> - XLO Signature 3 clone.  Costed me around $70 shipped.  Looks identical to the real thing and sounds very similar.  I have used the originals for a couple of months that were about $1200 for 1 meter but not in my current headphone setup.   When I used these cables it was during cable swaps between audiophiles.  Warmer, musical but not as resolving as the Nordost clones above.


Another great response, thanks! I was asking because another member said the Odin 2 clone was not good in XLR. They said the power cords were good but not the xlr...but you have a different opinion. The question is is it worth selling my brand new black dragon interconnects for the odin2.... I know it's cheaper but how much better will it sound?? (rhetorical question!)


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Another great response, thanks! I was asking because another member said the Odin 2 clone was not good in XLR. They said the power cords were good but not the xlr...but you have a different opinion. The question is is it worth selling my brand new black dragon interconnects for the odin2.... I know it's cheaper but how much better will it sound?? (rhetorical question!)


I have briefly listened to Moon Audio Black Dragon balanced interconnects, but not on my system.  Tonality was kind of like Cardas.  Without being able to compare directly would be hard to say and will depend on system synergy and your tastes.  The Black Dragon is a "safer" choice, Odin Gold feels more aggressive and open and is likely more resolving.  The Odin Gold are inexpensive and the pair I would suggest over Odin 2.  Odin 2 leans more toward a neutral presentation, Odin Gold a tad richer presentation.  Odin 2 for me would sound horrible on a non-Class A amp or lean sounding gear.  Easiest way to find out is get a pair and then decide.  The Black Dragon will be easy to sell if you prefer the Odin Gold.  The caveat is the Odin Gold and Odin 2 take time to break in, keep this in mind.  Synergy and taste (meaning what you are trying to accomplish) is key.

Below is a pic of where I purchased mine, which also shows what I paid...


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have briefly listened to Moon Audio Black Dragon balanced interconnects, but not on my system.  Tonality was kind of like Cardas.  Without being able to compare directly would be hard to say and will depend on system synergy and your tastes.  The Black Dragon is a "safer" choice, Odin Gold feels more aggressive and open and is likely more resolving.  The Odin Gold are inexpensive and the pair I would suggest over Odin 2.  Odin 2 leans more toward a neutral presentation, Odin Gold a tad richer presentation.  Odin 2 for me would sound horrible on a non-Class A amp or lean sounding gear.  Easiest way to find out is get a pair and then decide.  The Black Dragon will be easy to sell if you prefer the Odin Gold.  The caveat is the Odin Gold and Odin 2 take time to break in, keep this in mind.  Synergy and taste (meaning what you are trying to accomplish) is key.
> 
> Below is a pic of where I purchased mine, which also shows what I paid...


Yeah, I see that but it says xlr to rca...I need xlr to xlr....


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Yeah, I see that but it says xlr to rca...I need xlr to xlr....


LOL select XLR to XLR option. That is what I have. Look carefully at the pic I included in the last post, should say XLR to XLR.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> LOL select XLR to XLR option. That is what I have. Look carefully at the pic I included in the last post, should say XLR to XLR.


it only has xlr to rca or rca to xlr! lol, I do not see any one with xlr to xlr....


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> it only has xlr to rca or rca to xlr! lol, I do not see any one with xlr to xlr....


I can look later for you, I am currently at work.


----------



## dougms3 (Jul 18, 2022)

szore said:


> it only has xlr to rca or rca to xlr! lol, I do not see any one with xlr to xlr....


This seller is really nice and responsive.

gold odin

$55.5 - $3 off

This seller is a dick, he made a fake tracking number and kept delaying for 3 weeks and then stopped responding to my messages.  I got the argento xlrs from him though and they sound great.

Audioquest sky xlrs


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> This seller is really nice and responsive.
> 
> gold odin
> 
> ...


Doug, Audioquest Sky I like are the originals.  The clones I purchased to try I never hooked them up.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> it only has xlr to rca or rca to xlr! lol, I do not see any one with xlr to xlr....


Here is the link... 
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804207079632.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.4a0218024UYNpF

They have XLR to XLR, select the picture to the left will say XLR to XLR in the description.  I will take a pic so you can see.  LOL I think the price is even lower now.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Here is the link...
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804207079632.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.4a0218024UYNpF
> 
> They have XLR to XLR, select the picture to the left will say XLR to XLR in the description.  I will take a pic so you can see.  LOL I think the price is even lower now.


Yes, but I dont get that...All I get is RCA to xlr....


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> This seller is really nice and responsive.
> 
> gold odin
> 
> ...


These links just lead to aliexpress homepage,.....


----------



## cdacosta

cdacosta said:


> Here is the link...
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804207079632.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.4a0218024UYNpF
> 
> They have XLR to XLR, select the picture to the left will say XLR to XLR in the description.  I will take a pic so you can see.  LOL I think the price is even lower now.


By the way I ordered them 6/21 and received them in California 7/5.  I have about 300 hours on these Odin Gold.  These cables are not the best cables I have heard but for the money they sound fantastic.  Very balanced across the frequency spectrum, really good mid bass to sub bass response.  Warmish and inviting vocals, open presentation with good resolution and timbre.  For $54?  LOL

What I think helps is the lower mass conductors, look at the hollow male pins.  Also sounds like the solder used has silver in it.  Once a decent amount of burn-in time they sound very smooth and not typical silver wiring.  If you try them and have some burn-in time, let me know what you think?  The Odin 2 are one notch more resolving but quicker and not as warm.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Yes, but I dont get that...All I get is RCA to xlr....


Bro, click on the picture of the cables to the left of the "RCA to XLR female" box you have selected.  Then select the length you want and the price before discount is displayed.  You will see XLR to XLR.  In the picture I provided, you can see what I am talking about.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> These links just lead to aliexpress homepage,.....


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...d16581925706283129e8c53!12000029014973598!sea

The seller's name is getwire.


----------



## szore (Jul 18, 2022)

Ohhh duh!  I got it... Ordered!

Thanks!!!!


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804204973270.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.1f6911dcFPzufR&algo_pvid=1210c1d4-315c-48a7-b16d-698d32c2f9ec&algo_exp_id=1210c1d4-315c-48a7-b16d-698d32c2f9ec-5&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000029014973598"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!!55.5!!!!!@2103250d16581925706283129e8c53!12000029014973598!sea
> 
> The seller's name is getwire.


Price is lower (LOL).  I have built many interconnects.  The funny thing to me is when I look at the cost of materials and labor to build these cables.  I see the prices shipped.  Then compare it all to what my time is worth or a decent lunch just cracks me up.  Then when they perform well, my mind gets blown!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Ohhh duh!  I got it... Ordered!
> 
> Thanks!!!!


My pleasure.  Do let us know what you think of them once you get some time on them.  Just dawned on me, if someone buys a inexpensive amp and DAC stack what a great deal these cables are.  Waaaaay better than any sub $100 cable they would normally purchase or use.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> My pleasure.  Do let us know what you think of them once you get some time on them.  Just dawned on me, if someone buys a inexpensive amp and DAC stack what a great deal these cables are.  Waaaaay better than any sub $100 cable they would normally purchase or use.


The power cable is all over the place like you said...it went dark now and the dynamics are flat...treble isn't hot anymore tho...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The power cable is all over the place like you said...it went dark now and the dynamics are flat...treble isn't hot anymore tho...


LOL If you ever wondered, now you know burn-in is real.  Don’t worry, gets better than when you first installed the cable. There will be a point (approx 300 hours) when sonically the presentation all snaps into place. Then as time goes on, resolution starts to improve, PRAT improves, background gets blacker, timbre of all sounds improve, decay and dynamics improve, etc.  And at about 500 hours or so it will be a “yep that sounds sweet” moment.  You will know when the cable is almost burned in when you start to hear micro detail you never heard or noticed before.  Especially with silver cables, takes a lot of time to burn in.  Assuming you are burning in the cable 24/7, I would not be surprised if tomorrow it all sounds different. LOL. 

Now this is one cable doing all this.  Imagine how everything in your system effects the end overall sonic performance.  Poor Doug has learned this and has been going through this journey…


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> LOL If you ever wondered, now you know burn-in is real.  Don’t worry, gets better than when you first installed the cable. There will be a point (approx 300 hours) when sonically the presentation all snaps into place. Then as time goes on, resolution starts to improve, PRAT improves, background gets blacker, timbre of all sounds improve, decay and dynamics improve, etc.  And at about 500 hours or so it will be a “yep that sounds sweet” moment.  You will know when the cable is almost burned in when you start to hear micro detail you never heard or noticed before.  Especially with silver cables, takes a lot of time to burn in.  Assuming you are burning in the cable 24/7, I would not be surprised if tomorrow it all sounds different. LOL.
> 
> Now this is one cable doing all this.  Imagine how everything in your system effects the end overall sonic performance.  Poor Doug has learned this and has been going through this journey…


I ordered 2 more cables a week ago, plus I just ordered the xlr...Still going to get the power conditioner, but my system already sounds awesome... I appreciate your help with all of this!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I ordered 2 more cables a week ago, plus I just ordered the xlr...Still going to get the power conditioner, but my system already sounds awesome... I appreciate your help with all of this!


No worries, my pleasure.  I just looked at your listed setup.  No idea what power cord you have on your Ares II DAC, but if you have the Jot 2 mated with the Ares II, it could be an interesting experience to have the two Odin 2 power cords and Odin Gold XLR on those two pieces.  What headphones are you using?

Lastly, I am a serious believer of how power and conditioning is to overall fidelity of a sound system.  But before getting a power conditioner I would suggest trying Furutech Nano Liquid to minimize micro arcing in your mechanical connections.  Unless you already are using a very good contact enhancer.  If your system sounds good already, the Nano Liquid will improve the sonic reproduction and increase musicality in your system that is hard to believe until experienced.  Doug and I kind of went through experiementing with the Nano Liquid at the same time.  Possibly he can share his thoughts and experience of the Nano Liquid and what it did within his system.  He also has a Ares II DAC.


----------



## dougms3

Its my opinion that if you live in an apt or a densely populated area the plc will make a huge difference in your system.

We know each other, we met at at canjam lol.

Even though it seems expensive the Furutech nano liquid is really worth the price.  Theres enough liquid in there to apply to a dozen systems.  I was very liberal with my application, I used it on every single termination in my audio chain and applied it on every connection in my pc from fans, usb ports, pci slots, ram, ssd drives.  Sometimes had to apply multiple times for connections that are unplugged alot.

Its also a lubricant and antioxidant.  It will prevent the metal from rusting.  

The effect is just like getting an upgraded cable and the difference is immediately noticeable.  You can try it one side at a time and hear the results yourself.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Its my opinion that if you live in an apt or a densely populated area the plc will make a huge difference in your system.
> 
> We know each other, we met at at canjam lol.
> 
> ...


Doug, I know we both very much like the improvements the Furutech Nano Liquid provides.  But for you, in your system, what did applying the contact enhancer do?  

Also looks like you applied the Nano Liquid throughout your system.  Maybe sharing when applying to additional mechanical connections, what this did or did not do for your system sonically?  Was there improved sonic performance, was it minor?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> No worries, my pleasure.  I just looked at your listed setup.  No idea what power cord you have on your Ares II DAC, but if you have the Jot 2 mated with the Ares II, it could be an interesting experience to have the two Odin 2 power cords and Odin Gold XLR on those two pieces.  What headphones are you using?
> 
> Lastly, I am a serious believer of how power and conditioning is to overall fidelity of a sound system.  But before getting a power conditioner I would suggest trying Furutech Nano Liquid to minimize micro arcing in your mechanical connections.  Unless you already are using a very good contact enhancer.  If your system sounds good already, the Nano Liquid will improve the sonic reproduction and increase musicality in your system that is hard to believe until experienced.  Doug and I kind of went through experiementing with the Nano Liquid at the same time.  Possibly he can share his thoughts and experience of the Nano Liquid and what it did within his system.  He also has a Ares II DAC.


I just have the stock power cable on the Ares II right now, but when I get those 2 new Odin 2 cables one will go to the Ares....I plan on rotating the cables to burn them in. Funny thing about headphones, I recently got the Raptgo Hook IEM for $230...and it sounds a lot better than my LCD-X did...someone sold their $4,000 IEM's after they got the Hook, and another guy sold $2,500 IEM after getting the Hook...it's perfect, it's like the holy grail...next to these cables the best audiophile bargain I've ever seen. On my desktop with my PWAudio cable the Hook sounds amazing! 

So I will get the Furutech liquid, that's my next adventure...not looking forward to tearing my PC apart and cleaning all the contacts with alcohol, then painting this stuff on everything...sounds like a big project....


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I just have the stock power cable on the Ares II right now, but when I get those 2 new Odin 2 cables one will go to the Ares....I plan on rotating the cables to burn them in. Funny thing about headphones, I recently got the Raptgo Hook IEM for $230...and it sounds a lot better than my LCD-X did...someone sold their $4,000 IEM's after they got the Hook, and another guy sold $2,500 IEM after getting the Hook...it's perfect, it's like the holy grail...next to these cables the best audiophile bargain I've ever seen. On my desktop with my PWAudio cable the Hook sounds amazing!
> 
> So I will get the Furutech liquid, that's my next adventure...not looking forward to tearing my PC apart and cleaning all the contacts with alcohol, then painting this stuff on everything...sounds like a big project....


I recently got the TRN Kirin which is a planar iem and I was seriously impressed at what they can do for the price.  

Its hard to compare to my headphones, I can't say they're better but they are highly resolving and detailed.  The technicals, imaging, soundstage, positioning, separation are excellent.  

I cant remember specifically the improvements the nano liquid provides but as I said the effect is like basically upgrading to better cables.

As a future upgrade, I'd also recommend the Audio-gd DI-20.  I just got it about 4 days ago and man what a difference it makes.  At this level, I never expect anything to improve as much as it did when I first upgraded gear to where I hear new details in music but this DDC does just that.  Hearing new details that I've never heard before.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I just have the stock power cable on the Ares II right now, but when I get those 2 new Odin 2 cables one will go to the Ares....I plan on rotating the cables to burn them in. Funny thing about headphones, I recently got the Raptgo Hook IEM for $230...and it sounds a lot better than my LCD-X did...someone sold their $4,000 IEM's after they got the Hook, and another guy sold $2,500 IEM after getting the Hook...it's perfect, it's like the holy grail...next to these cables the best audiophile bargain I've ever seen. On my desktop with my PWAudio cable the Hook sounds amazing!
> 
> So I will get the Furutech liquid, that's my next adventure...not looking forward to tearing my PC apart and cleaning all the contacts with alcohol, then painting this stuff on everything...sounds like a big project....


If what I am sensing is correct, you enjoy listening to your system and are trying to get the most out of your gear.  If I am reading you correctly you are in for a fun and interesting journey.  Even with your new acquisition of cables and the Furutech Nano Liquid, believe it or not your eyes will be opened.  

Regarding the Nano Liquid, I have some recommendations for you or anyone that is planning to treat their system.  What will be going through your mind is 1) what does this stuff do?, 2) where to apply it?, 3) where to apply first? 4) how will it effect the sound or if at all, etc.

I recommend to keep it simple.  Re-read the directions I outlined as to how to prep and treat mechanical connections.  Once you “experience and hear” the treatment of a couple of mechanical connections you will want to treat all connections.  At this point yes, this will be an adventure.  You have read that I recommend “all mechanical connections”, you will understand why once you try the Nano Liquid.   So you will understand what the Nano Liquid will do for your system sonically first try the headphone jack, all headphone cable connections and connections of your headphones first.  Listen to see what changed.  Then your main SATA cable and SATA drive or SSD.  Then all power cables and socket connections.  Then interconnects and ports. Ethernet cable and connections.  Treat both mechanical mated connection points.  Results will vary depending on where you apply the treatment.  You will experience no negative effects.  When you have done all of this then let me know and I can assist where to go from there.  As you go through the above, you will start to see how your system is inter related and what does what where and the effects.


----------



## szore

Wow, the dynamics are back and the treble has really opened up and is smoother. The dynamics are nice and punchy and the soundstage is larger it seems...This power cable is very dynamic during the burn in process, very intense. The Jot 2 sounds clean and vivid...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Wow, the dynamics are back and the treble has really opened up and is smoother. The dynamics are nice and punchy and the soundstage is larger it seems...This power cable is very dynamic during the burn in process, very intense. The Jot 2 sounds clean and vivid...


LMAO. I had an idea this would happen, especially if you are running current through it.  Like I said though, will take time for break-in. Did you know this kind of break-in happens or is this a new experience for you?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> LMAO. I had an idea this would happen, especially if you are running current through it.  Like I said though, will take time for break-in. Did you know this kind of break-in happens or is this a new experience for you?


Na i burn in all my stuff....I am a big burn in advocate, even my cables. And I never use EQ.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Na i burn in all my stuff....I am a big burn in advocate, even my cables. And I never use EQ.


Cool, then you will not be surprised by the sonic swings.  Have you tried using EQ like Equalizer APO (assuming you are using PC as a source)?

As an aside since you are getting cables similar to what I am burning in right now.  The two cables in my system getting burned in now being used with a Jotunheim 2 are Odin Gold power cord and balanced XLR interconnects.  Power cord has about 210 hours and interconnects 360 hours.  Listened to system for a few hours last night.  

- HF edge gone
- Overall presentation is warmer, very pleasant but feels powerful
- A bit more micro detail and can start to feel the precision of the system, like before when using burned-in Odin 2 and Electra Glide cables.  
- PRAT a bit better (but I know is not 100% there).  I think this is because note attack is more precise and faster.  With improved decay hearing the additional micro detail.
- Spatial aspect of the sound stage is more apparent.  In the beginning placement of sounds and information was muddy with a kind of incoherency.  Now information is precise and there is no muddiness.
- Vocals improved a lot compared to first 24-48 hours.  Also in the beginning vocals were placed further from performance, now is more akin to you being sung to.

To give you a different perspective.  I listen to a lot of different genres.  Right now typing this, I am listening to goth and acid techno which is about 135bpm.  What I hear is a 360 degree presentation with oodles of macro and micro detail that feel precise with bass that can be felt in the bones in my face and upper body.  Bass is not boomy, but hits hard and fast with nuance.  From experience I would say burn-in is about 87%-90% there.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Cool, then you will not be surprised by the sonic swings.  Have you tried using EQ like Equalizer APO (assuming you are using PC as a source)?
> 
> As an aside since you are getting cables similar to what I am burning in right now.  The two cables in my system getting burned in now being used with a Jotunheim 2 are Odin Gold power cord and balanced XLR interconnects.  Power cord has about 210 hours and interconnects 360 hours.  Listened to system for a few hours last night.
> 
> ...


You should get the Raptgo Hook...you will be shocked!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> You should get the Raptgo Hook...you will be shocked!


Two issues with your idea. 1) I hate having anything in my ear for prolonged periods of time. 2) I love the Audeze LCD-XC 2021 EQ’ed.  I can make this headphone sound exactly the way I like audio reproduction.


----------



## szore

I ordered the Odin 2 decoder DAC data cable for my dac/Element H connection...i can easily sell my black dragon usb cable...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I ordered the Odin 2 decoder DAC data cable for my dac/Element H connection...i can easily sell my black dragon usb cable...


You received the Odin 2 USB and directly compared them?  If yes is the Odin 2 cable burned in?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> You received the Odin 2 USB and directly compared them?  If yes is the Odin 2 cable burned in?


No I just ordered the USb. What I'm saying is assuming it's better or at least equal, I can always sell the black dragons and recoup some money.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> No I just ordered the USb. What I'm saying is assuming it's better or at least equal, I can always sell the black dragons and recoup some money.


I have the odin 1 usb cable, it was better than the shunyata venom and xlo usb cable I had.  Haven't compared it to anything more expensive than the shunyata but it was definitely better.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> No I just ordered the USb. What I'm saying is assuming it's better or at least equal, I can always sell the black dragons and recoup some money.


I have been working from home the last 5 hours and listening to the system.  Burn-in is getting close, I would say 94%-95%.  If I disregard price these cables are really good.  For the price they are amazing.  

I hate to keep bring up the Nano Liquid, just makes such a difference. By the way Furutech does what I did and what I am about to recommend for you to do, for all their retail cables.  If you do acquire the Nano Liquid I highly recommend that you disassemble the two ends and treat both the conductors and connectors like I shared I did.  The Odin Gold power cable (which I treated with Nano Liquid) on the Jotunheim 2 amp elevates the system.  The treatment will lower noise floor.  Basically increasing resolution (across the frequency spectrum) and note/sound precision, quieter background and improve timbre.    Test it out yourself since you will have multiple of the same cable.

As an FYI the Odin Gold power cable is plugged into the Jotunheim 2 during burn-in.  I leave the Jotunheim 2 on 24/7.  But since I am burning in balanced interconnects and new power supply in PC they are all running 24/7 with volume turned all the way down.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have been working from home the last 5 hours and listening to the system.  Burn-in is getting close, I would say 94%-95%.  If I disregard price these cables are really good.  For the price they are amazing.
> 
> I hate to keep bring up the Nano Liquid, just makes such a difference. By the way Furutech does what I did and what I am about to recommend for you to do, for all their retail cables.  If you do acquire the Nano Liquid I highly recommend that you disassemble the two ends and treat both the conductors and connectors like I shared I did.  The Odin Gold power cable (which I treated with Nano Liquid) on the Jotunheim 2 amp elevates the system.  The treatment will lower noise floor.  Basically increasing resolution (across the frequency spectrum) and note/sound precision, quieter background and improve timbre.    Test it out yourself since you will have multiple of the same cable.
> 
> As an FYI the Odin Gold power cable is plugged into the Jotunheim 2 during burn-in.  I leave the Jotunheim 2 on 24/7.  But since I am burning in balanced interconnects and new power supply in PC they are all running 24/7 with volume turned all the way down.


I will get the Furutech in a few days...just made a bunch of purchases and I need to chill for a bit... Congratulations on completing burn in! My Odin 2 now has distorted mids! but the bass and treble are much better...maybe 'distorted; is too harsh a word, but lets say that the mids right now are just a little harsh.....
I just got a new iem today, the Raptgo Leaf, single dynamic driver...I know you said you dont like IEM's, but these sound really fantastic and they are only$129...they certainly sound better than my old Xelentos, those were single DD and cost $1K...of course listening to them on the desktop doesn't hurt!   I'll have to go back and read again how you treated the 2 ends of the Odin2, but when I get the liquid I will get into all that. BTW do you have a Odin cable on your PC too? How about your dac?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I will get the Furutech in a few days...just made a bunch of purchases and I need to chill for a bit... Congratulations on completing burn in! My Odin 2 now has distorted mids! but the bass and treble are much better...maybe 'distorted; is too harsh a word, but lets say that the mids right now are just a little harsh.....
> I just got a new iem today, the Raptgo Leaf, single dynamic driver...I know you said you dont like IEM's, but these sound really fantastic and they are only$129...they certainly sound better than my old Xelentos, those were single DD and cost $1K...of course listening to them on the desktop doesn't hurt!   I'll have to go back and read again how you treated the 2 ends of the Odin2, but when I get the liquid I will get into all that. BTW do you have a Odin cable on your PC too? How about your dac?


Odin 2 power cord on the PC (which works well here), iFi IPower X on the Modius DAC.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I will get the Furutech in a few days...just made a bunch of purchases and I need to chill for a bit... Congratulations on completing burn in! My Odin 2 now has distorted mids! but the bass and treble are much better...maybe 'distorted; is too harsh a word, but lets say that the mids right now are just a little harsh.....
> I just got a new iem today, the Raptgo Leaf, single dynamic driver...I know you said you dont like IEM's, but these sound really fantastic and they are only$129...they certainly sound better than my old Xelentos, those were single DD and cost $1K...of course listening to them on the desktop doesn't hurt!   I'll have to go back and read again how you treated the 2 ends of the Odin2, but when I get the liquid I will get into all that. BTW do you have a Odin cable on your PC too? How about your dac?


Ok one more recommendation.  This is so you can “hear” the differences during burn-in and understand how the cabling or Nano treatment does what and where.  I will assume when you get the Nano Liquid you will have only one of the 3 new power cords.  I recommend that you treat the internal and external of the power cord and the IEC socket connections of the PC.  Install the Odin 2 power cord you have now on the PC and leave it there to burn-in.  Do not plug and unplug from your PC to try the cable on your amp or other component.  Let the cable properly burn-in and settle in.  Do the same with your other power cords when you get them.  If you did get the Odin Gold XLR cables install them if you like, treating all contacts on cable and component sockets that mate with the cables mechanically.  Then stop.  Let it all burn-in 24/7, listen for the changes and be patient.  250 or so hours in, call it day 11 assuming cables are breaking in as expected and all is sounding coherent and becoming more resolving then you will in stages treat the rest of your system step by step.  The fun and amazement will be eye opening for you.  All part of the hobby, learning what effects sonic reproduction.  By the time you are done your system will be at a different level.  

Eventually you will end up treating your entire system with Nano Liquid, trust me you will want to.  It will nag you to do so once you start to hear the difference, fight the urge.  Being patient will reward you with a better understanding of your signal chain.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Ok one more recommendation.  This is so you can “hear” the differences during burn-in and understand how the cabling or Nano treatment does what and where.  I will assume when you get the Nano Liquid you will have only one of the 3 new power cords.  I recommend that you treat the internal and external of the power cord and the IEC socket connections of the PC.  Install the Odin 2 power cord you have now on the PC and leave it there to burn-in.  Do not plug and unplug from your PC to try the cable on your amp or other component.  Let the cable properly burn-in and settle in.  Do the same with your other power cords when you get them.  If you did get the Odin Gold XLR cables install them if you like, treating all contacts on cable and component sockets that mate with the cables mechanically.  Then stop.  Let it all burn-in 24/7, listen for the changes and be patient.  250 or so hours in, call it day 11 assuming cables are breaking in as expected and all is sounding coherent and becoming more resolving then you will in stages treat the rest of your system step by step.  The fun and amazement will be eye opening for you.  All part of the hobby, learning what effects sonic reproduction.  By the time you are done your system will be at a different level.
> 
> Eventually you will end up treating your entire system with Nano Liquid, trust me you will want to.  It will nag you to do so once you start to hear the difference, fight the urge.  Being patient will reward you with a better understanding of your signal chain.


Wow, awesome! I can't wait, I mean even now I'm blown away by my desktop! Plus the Ares II will hit the 30 day mark in a few days, so that is significant as well, the dac technically is still burning in. The Jot 2 also, potentially, but I dont think the jot 2 needs a month to burn in...but any improvement beyond this and I will be thrilled!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Wow, awesome! I can't wait, I mean even now I'm blown away by my desktop! Plus the Ares II will hit the 30 day mark in a few days, so that is significant as well, the dac technically is still burning in. The Jot 2 also, potentially, but I dont think the jot 2 needs a month to burn in...but any improvement beyond this and I will be thrilled!


My Jot took about 400 hours for the majority of the break-in.  If my experiences are any gauge at all, if you follow what I have outlined, you are in for a more interesting ride then you imagine.   This will sound bold… If you like your system now, your system will be at a much superior performance level after cables are installed, total system Nano treatment and all to break-in. 

When all is said and done in 1.5 months, you tell me if I exaggerated.


----------



## DecentLevi

@dougms3 you referred me specifically to page 5 of this thread when I inquired about a good power cable for the DI20 (DDC from Audio-GD). I didn't seem to see any consensus on that page. Do you or anyone here have a recommendation sub-$100 for good sounding AC power cables? 

I did find a few good looking custom ones on Etsy, and really like the Aurora 7 from Wireworld which I have, but looking to try more affordable options.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 you referred me specifically to page 5 of this thread when I inquired about a good power cable for the DI20 (DDC from Audio-GD). I didn't seem to see any consensus on that page. Do you or anyone here have a recommendation sub-$100 for good sounding AC power cables?
> 
> I did find a few good looking custom ones on Etsy, and really like the Aurora 7 from Wireworld which I have, but looking to try more affordable options.


You could try one of the knockoff cables.  

They are pretty cheap and work well.

A couple of us have the gold odin cable.  There are many sellers with the same product so you may want to shop around.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804113993563.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.630d38dahriWV8&mp=1


----------



## dougms3

@Gazza 

Any update on your order of the gold odin power cables?


----------



## Gazza

dougms3 said:


> @Gazza
> 
> Any update on your order of the gold odin power cables?



Still waiting for them to arrive. Hopefully in the next few days. 

On a different note, my audiophile ethernet switch has started to run in and I have noticed a change in the sound, most notably a relaxing of the overall presentation. Removed quite a bit of glassy harshness that would creep in on some compressed recordings, something I ascribed to what I thought were my ancient valves being one-foot in the grave. Guess not! A really listenable sound overall, which makes me appreciate my new DAC all the more. It still is ruthless in telling me if a recording isn't up to snuff but without making it an unpleasant. It has also made Tidal streams sound quite a bit more musical and enjoyable. Still behind my CD rips but not an artificial facsimile as they were prior.

Very curious how the power cords will improve things.

I'm also (satan help me) thinking of saving for the Aqua LinQ streamer to replace my Naim NDX. It's an eye-watering cost but seeing how my valves seem to still be holding up I can put off that upgrade and save for the LinQ. I wish a pure streamer made no difference to the sound but sadly I have found that is really not the case.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> You could try one of the knockoff cables.
> 
> They are pretty cheap and work well.
> 
> ...


Thanks. So is any seller with a gold Odin cable legit, or are certain sellers more likely to have the authentic version?

And is there any opinion on the sound? Hopefully it is neutral and not colored too much


----------



## dougms3

Gazza said:


> Still waiting for them to arrive. Hopefully in the next few days.
> 
> On a different note, my audiophile ethernet switch has started to run in and I have noticed a change in the sound, most notably a relaxing of the overall presentation. Removed quite a bit of glassy harshness that would creep in on some compressed recordings, something I ascribed to what I thought were my ancient valves being one-foot in the grave. Guess not! A really listenable sound overall, which makes me appreciate my new DAC all the more. It still is ruthless in telling me if a recording isn't up to snuff but without making it an unpleasant. It has also made Tidal streams sound quite a bit more musical and enjoyable. Still behind my CD rips but not an artificial facsimile as they were prior.
> 
> ...


Very interested to hear your comparison vs the cables you have.

I've come to realize how a streamer / music server can be highly beneficial in terms of sound quality improvement.  The PC adds so much noise into an audio signal its ridiculous.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Thanks. So is any seller with a gold Odin cable legit, or are certain sellers more likely to have the authentic version?
> 
> And is there any opinion on the sound? Hopefully it is neutral and not colored too much


It seems to me they're all the same because almost all are using a stock image.  Seems like they're ordering it from the manufacturer when you place the order.

I wouldn't know how it sounds compared to the original but I'm sure the original is better.  It also costs as much as a car so probably gonna assume the original is alot better.

I can only directly compare it to the cable I replaced it with, it sounds alot better than the Furutech 314ag power cable.  More resolving, alot more stage and depth, better imaging, better articulation in the treble and less warm than the 314ag.

cdacosta did a very thorough review earlier in the thread.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Thanks. So is any seller with a gold Odin cable legit, or are certain sellers more likely to have the authentic version?
> 
> And is there any opinion on the sound? Hopefully it is neutral and not colored too much


I have both the Odin 2 and Odin Gold power cable. Still burning in the Odin Gold.  Excellent performing power cables. Would recommend to anyone. The two cables do sound different.  Look through this thread for my thoughts, experiences and burn-in comments for these two cables.


----------



## dougms3

I forgot to mention I bought this linear power supply from aliexpress.

It replaced an ifi ipower x.  Swapped back and forth 4 times to know for sure, its not a huge difference but definitely noticeable.  Its funny how these things relate to audio impact.  The effect is a more 3D sound, more space all around, microdetails are more audible, clearer imaging and positioning of sounds, slower decay especially with reverb, echoing seems to linger a bit longer.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I forgot to mention I bought this linear power supply from aliexpress.
> 
> It replaced an ifi ipower x.  Swapped back and forth 4 times to know for sure, its not a huge difference but definitely noticeable.  Its funny how these things relate to audio impact.  The effect is a more 3D sound, more space all around, microdetails are more audible, clearer imaging and positioning of sounds, slower decay especially with reverb, echoing seems to linger a bit longer.


I am going to verify power input plug size and voltage and will order one to try on the modem/router.  Have you tried different power cords on that Linear PS to see if it made any difference?  I have 3 good power cords on hand to try on the unit. Did you notice a break-in period with the Linear PS?


----------



## msing539

I think I mentioned that I bought this cable to try:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802712395331.html

Made by Audiocrast, one of the companies that makes the Odin 2 cable. 

I wanted to see what the build quality was like and if there might be an audible difference over my current Pangea cables (which are well made for their price). And yes, there is a difference, but it's not to my taste. On the Pontus, this cable has an edge to it that makes for a less relaxed and more analytical presentation. The leading edge of everything just seemed harsher, even on the Pontus. Build quality is excellent though, especially for its price.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I am going to verify power input plug size and voltage and will order one to try on the modem/router.  Have you tried different power cords on that Linear PS to see if it made any difference?  I have 3 good power cords on hand to try on the unit. Did you notice a break-in period with the Linear PS?


Unfortunately, I don't have anything available right now to test on it.  

Once I get that gryphon knockoff power cable, I'll have some freedom to power cable roll.  I'll be honest I dont like doing this with the power cables because they're big and heavy and every cable has a wood block under it to support the weight so that it doesn't put stress on the socket.

Its hard to tell with the burn in, there probably is but I have the audio-gd DI20HE and new audioquest carbon coax cable burning in right now and since its going through some wild swings its impossible to tell.  Good news is only another 950 hours left recommended to go before its all settled in.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I think I mentioned that I bought this cable to try:
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802712395331.html
> 
> ...


The cable looks nice and I'm sure its well made but my issue with it is that it lacks shielding and a more effective dielectric.

If you look at the conductors of the odin knockoff, it has aluminum or silver spiraled shielding that covers 99% of each conductor and it uses teflon or PET as a dielectric which is much more effective than PVC.  I'm not 100% sure but I think it also has an air tube or something other dielectric going through the center of the cable, if its an air tube, air is one of the best dielectrics and would significantly enhance its capabilities.  

It explains why that odin cable in particular is very good even with the aforementioned lower quality materials.

I would have recommended this earlier to you but you already purchased it and didn't want to be a negative Nancy.


----------



## dougms3

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/2251832690032612.html?spm=a2g0n.order_list.0.0.21ef1802RQGXgs

I also bought this knockoff gryphon cable.  It'll be a couple weeks before it arrives but I wanted to test it out because it has an interesting design with what apears to be an additional ground wire going around the cable.  

If I don't get too lazy, I'll open it up and take up pics.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> The cable looks nice and I'm sure its well made but my issue with it is that it lacks shielding and a more effective dielectric.
> 
> If you look at the conductors of the odin knockoff, it has aluminum or silver spiraled shielding that covers 99% of each conductor and it uses teflon or PET as a dielectric which is much more effective than PVC.  I'm not 100% sure but I think it also has an air tube or something other dielectric going through the center of the cable, if its an air tube, air is one of the best dielectrics and would significantly enhance its capabilities.
> 
> ...


I knew... couldn't help but try it for the price. Plus it's so pretty.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I knew... couldn't help but try it for the price. Plus it's so pretty.


It does look nice, looks like a steroided version of those 16 core headphone cables


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> It does look nice, looks like a steroided version of those 16 core headphone cables


OK, offer accepted. I'll send it to you to adapt for my BLON.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> OK, offer accepted. I'll send it to you to adapt for my BLON.


Ok but if your ear gets ripped off its not my fault.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Unfortunately, I don't have anything available right now to test on it.
> 
> Once I get that gryphon knockoff power cable, I'll have some freedom to power cable roll.  I'll be honest I dont like doing this with the power cables because they're big and heavy and every cable has a wood block under it to support the weight so that it doesn't put stress on the socket.
> 
> Its hard to tell with the burn in, there probably is but I have the audio-gd DI20HE and new audioquest carbon coax cable burning in right now and since its going through some wild swings its impossible to tell.  Good news is only another 950 hours left recommended to go before its all settled in.


LOL burn-in is pain and real.  I learned to just be patient.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> I think I mentioned that I bought this cable to try:
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802712395331.html
> 
> ...


Has that cable been burned-in?  Meaning has that cable seen at least 300 hours through it?  The reason I ask this is if the cable has not seen at least 300+ hours of current through the cable, the PTFE dielectric will have the effect sonically you are describing.

From my experience building and prototyping audiophile power cables, what you describe based on the materials (assuming the info is correct) is exactly what I would expect.  You may want to allow the cable to settle in or hook it up to a PC or small or large fridge and give it 300 - 500 hours and then try it again.  I am fairly sure the results will be different.  The issue with the design of the cable you reference is the amount of dielectric.  If you do what I am suggesting and let the cable burn-in on a different device then re-install to your DAC or component, do not judge until the cable has been in place for a few days.

To many the above sounds ridiculous, my experience tells me this is what happens.  For fun try it, you have nothing to lose.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Has that cable been burned-in?  Meaning has that cable seen at least 300 hours through it?  The reason I ask this is if the cable has not seen at least 300+ hours of current through the cable, the PTFE dielectric will have the effect sonically you are describing.
> 
> From my experience building and prototyping audiophile power cables, what you describe based on the materials (assuming the info is correct) is exactly what I would expect.  You may want to allow the cable to settle in or hook it up to a PC or small or large fridge and give it 300 - 500 hours and then try it again.  I am fairly sure the results will be different.  The issue with the design of the cable you reference is the amount of dielectric.  If you do what I am suggesting and let the cable burn-in on a different device then re-install to your DAC or component, do not judge until the cable has been in place for a few days.
> 
> To many the above sounds ridiculous, my experience tells me this is what happens.  For fun try it, you have nothing to lose.


It has not been burned it but I'll give it a try--will report back in... weeks lol.


----------



## DecentLevi (Jul 25, 2022)

@dougms3 I'm so glad you referred me to this thread! Discovering things I didn't even know about and I'm all about those little audio hacks or tricks. Looking into the Odin 2 and Odin gold AC cables. So far, my take is they're both outstanding and the Gold is somewhat warmer with the other being faster / more detailed?

I'm also looking into the metal tape and liquid paste hack and now this has really caught my attention:


FredA said:


> This
> 
> https://m.aliexpress.com/item/1005003583405036.html
> 
> Same function as a grounding box, i.e. clean-up ground.


Have you or anyone here tried it? I think this may be the new link.
I'm interested to see how it may affect the sound on my tube amp, and see if it may reduce hum / buzz - would that be something it can do also? I was considering an Akiko Audio RCA tuning stick, though I'm not sure if the effect is similar(?). And these are a lot cheaper!


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 I'm so glad you referred me to this thread! Discovering things I didn't even know about and I'm all about those little audio hacks or tricks. Looking into the Odin 2 and Odin gold AC cables. So far, my take is they're both outstanding and the Gold is somewhat warmer with the other being faster / more detailed?
> 
> I'm also looking into the metal tape and liquid paste hack and now this has really caught my attention:
> 
> ...


I have done a/b (with/without) with a friend. On his power distributor. I doubt it will remove any tube hum. It has a more subtle effect than that.


----------



## DecentLevi

There are several types with different wire thicknesses and both paper and redwood ground loop noise isolators, do you have a type to recommend?

I'm actually looking for something to reduce hum that is in fact generated from within my tube amp itself (transformer or other components), and curious if it can improve the sound in other ways too.


----------



## Zaek

Couldn't resist the temptation. Ordered one odin gold powercord and one xlr interconnect to try


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> There are several types with different wire thicknesses and both paper and redwood ground loop noise isolators, do you have a type to recommend?
> 
> I'm actually looking for something to reduce hum that is in fact generated from within my tube amp itself (transformer or other components), and curious if it can improve the sound in other ways too.


The best is the one with 18awg silver wire. The wooden version is only a little more expensive, it is beautifully finished, worth the price difference.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 I'm so glad you referred me to this thread! Discovering things I didn't even know about and I'm all about those little audio hacks or tricks. Looking into the Odin 2 and Odin gold AC cables. So far, my take is they're both outstanding and the Gold is somewhat warmer with the other being faster / more detailed?
> 
> I'm also looking into the metal tape and liquid paste hack and now this has really caught my attention:
> 
> ...


I don't have the odin 2 power cable only the gold, cdacosta has both.

I found it to be a neutral cable with some accentuation at the top end, I found it added alot of space and depth to my system.  Its a real bargain at the price its available at now.

The furutech nano liquid is very worthwhile investment.  Its hard to explain but once you apply it one thing you will see the difference it makes and you'll coat every single connection in your system with it.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> It has not been burned it but I'll give it a try--will report back in... weeks lol.


LOL yes, it will be weeks.  You may like the cable somewhere else in your system once it is burned in.  Never know until you try it.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Couldn't resist the temptation. Ordered one odin gold powercord and one xlr interconnect to try


Did you order the Odin Gold XLR interconnects or Odin 2?


----------



## szore

The mids on the Odin2 have gotten a lot better, much more clear now... I have 200+ hours on it now...the bass is insane...


----------



## Zaek

cdacosta said:


> Did you order the Odin Gold XLR interconnects or Odin 2?


Odin Gold. Wanted something musical.. hope it will be good.


----------



## szore

Zaek said:


> Odin Gold. Wanted something musical.. hope it will be good.


I ordered the gold xlr too, also an Odin 2 USB cable...


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> The mids on the Odin2 have gotten a lot better, much more clear now... I have 200+ hours on it now...the bass is insane...


Try the usb cable, too--I replaced my Wireworld with an Odin 2.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803929178175.html

*Edit--simultaneous post.*


----------



## Zaek

szore said:


> I ordered the gold xlr too, also an Odin 2 USB cable...


Please share your impression on the usb cable after burn in. If good, I will get one too.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Odin Gold. Wanted something musical.. hope it will be good.


I have both Odin 2 and Odin Gold power cord and XLR interconnects.  Odin Gold has a sweetish touch to the presentation compared to Odin 2.  Just be prepared for the break-in period, it is a rough ride.  Takes 500+ hours to break these cables in.  First 200 hours they are all over the place and have a HF glare.  About 300 hours in the HF glare almost all disappears, sonic landscape starts to settle-in and micro detail starts to emerge.  Every aspect of sonic performance improves from here until about 500 hours or so.

These cables are very good once burned in.  The system will sound wonky and all over the place until the cables are burned in.  Amazing performance for the money.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The mids on the Odin2 have gotten a lot better, much more clear now... I have 200+ hours on it now...the bass is insane...


At 200 hours you are only in the middle of the break in.  For me, mid frequencies improved dramatically after 300 hours up to about 500 hours.  Odin 2 detail retrieval is quite remarkable once you get past 400 hours.  Until I got to 400 hours or so, the bass impact changed a lot.  The above experience is with the power cord plugged into the PC (source component).  Between 400 and 500+ hours is when everything sonically improves.


----------



## cdacosta

Here is another cable that I found to improve system performance.  Nordost Odin Ethernet cable.  I use this cable from Comcast modem/router to PC.  Not sure how much they are now.


----------



## Zaek

Does Aliexpress sell any device like the Blue Horizon Proburn for running in cable? Will speed up the process


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Try the usb cable, too--I replaced my Wireworld with an Odin 2.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803929178175.html
> 
> *Edit--simultaneous post.*


That USB cable is legit good.

Pretty crazy how it performs better than alot more expensive usb cables.

I ordered an odin coax also and I'm gonna directly compare it to the audioquest carbon.

Not sure which one will sound better but i have my doubts that the $13 odin cable will win this one, just had to come close.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> That USB cable is legit good.
> 
> Pretty crazy how it performs better than alot more expensive usb cables.
> 
> ...


So inexpensive, i'll give it a try.


----------



## msing539

FredA said:


> So inexpensive, i'll give it a try.


The audiophile guide to rationalizing purchases.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> The audiophile guide to rationalizing purchases.


yeah so far I bought 3 Odin 2 power cables, the gold xlr and the Odin2 USB cable....


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> So inexpensive, i'll give it a try.


Come join us in this rabbit hole, the dragon chasin room is on the left.


----------



## WilliamBlake

cdacosta said:


> At 200 hours you are only in the middle of the break in.  For me, mid frequencies improved dramatically after 300 hours up to about 500 hours.  Odin 2 detail retrieval is quite remarkable once you get past 400 hours.  Until I got to 400 hours or so, the bass impact changed a lot.  The above experience is with the power cord plugged into the PC (source component).  Between 400 and 500+ hours is when everything sonically improves.


mid frequencies improved dramatically? by an usb cable?


----------



## FredA (Jul 26, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Come join us in this rabbit hole, the dragon chasin room is on the left.


It is not my first cable, i got 9 already.


----------



## cdacosta

WilliamBlake said:


> mid frequencies improved dramatically? by an usb cable?


We were discussing break in characteristics of a Odin 2 power cable.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> It is not my first cable, i got 9 already.


Not 9 aliexpress knockoff cables


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> We were discussing break in characteristics of a Odin 2 power cable.


Incidentally, why wouldn't the mids improve with a proper USB cable? All frequencies would improve, no?


----------



## msing539 (Jul 26, 2022)

szore said:


> Incidentally, why wouldn't the mids improve with a proper USB cable? All frequencies would improve, no?


I think a common perception is that a USB cable either functions or it does not, as any error would be corrected. So a $5 generic cable if built to standards would function the same as a $500 cable made of 6N ofc... assuming it met the same standards.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> I think a common perception is that a USB cable either functions or it does not, as any error would be corrected. So a $5 generic cable if built to standards would function the same as a $500 cable made of 6N ofc... assuming it met the same standards.


Yeah, except they don't. lol.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> Not 9 aliexpress knockoff cables


Yep.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Incidentally, why wouldn't the mids improve with a proper USB cable?


From my humble experience, maybe or maybe not.  Your question is not simple to answer, here is what I mean... I like fuller and fleshed vocals, you may not.  Is it possibly you may try a $2500 Audioquest USB cable and it unbalances an area of your system and you do not like it?   I have experienced this.

I have read and was told the Nordost Odin USB cable can compete with $500 USA sold USB cables.  I do not have a use for USB, so I have not tried this cable yet.  



szore said:


> All frequencies would improve, no?


Again maybe, or maybe not.  This is a very complicated topic.  Every part of the cable makes a difference, including solder used or termination.  This all effects the overall sonic ability and presentation of the system when the cable is installed.  Any and all cables in a system will effect the overall performance of a system.  So another factor is synergy with the rest of the gear and cabling.  

Like if I have your system, knowing what I know and experienced with the Odin 2 and Odin Gold.  I would install a Odin 2 PC at computer and Ares II, Odin Gold at Jot 2 and Odin Gold XLR interconnects.  Understanding the system is near unlistenable until at least 400 hours of burn-in.  After that it should sound amazing.  

For a tad more tubey/analog feel I would even use a Odin Gold PC at the Ares II.  Odin 2 will make the DAC more resolving and quicker, but a notch or two less analog.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> I think a common perception is that a USB cable either functions or it does not, as any error would be corrected. So a $5 generic cable if built to standards would function the same as a $500 cable made of 6N ofc... assuming it met the same standards.


In the 25 years or so in this hobby I have learned that I cannot assume anything and conventional logic usually does not apply.  LOL   There are a lot of really good arguments by people in and out of this hobby that I found to be just not true.  I wish some of these were true, I would have saved tens of thousands by now!  And the arguments make sense, here are some off the top of my head regarding headphone rigs...

1) All digital cables sound the same.  They all transfer 1s and 0s.  It turns out the transference of the data is way more complicated than that.

2) You have hundreds of feet of cheap 14ga. Romex wire running through your walls and to the power provider.  There is no way a 5' power cord from your component is going to change anything.  Power cords can make a big difference, especially the more resolving your system.

3) Your headphone cable whether SE or XLR balanced makes no difference aside ergonomics and esthetics.  Copper is copper.  I watched a well regarded reviewer say this in a live stream.  He said he has never been able to hear a difference.  Hmmm to me the difference can be big and can be super obvious.

I will stop here, it just goes on and on.


----------



## dougms3

The difference it makes with a high quality solder like mundorf supreme is pretty wild.

It brought out the sparkle in my modded Sony z7m2 when I upgraded only the solder on only one end of the wire.  Would have just replaced the wire but its designed in a way so that you can't access the other end without possibly destroying the headphones.


----------



## WilliamBlake

It's just a cable bringing data, i don't understand how it's possible to hear such changes, unless it's something you want to hear


----------



## msing539

Digital playback over usb isn't perfect--there's variation across cables and setups.


----------



## WilliamBlake

msing539 said:


> Digital playback over usb isn't perfect--there's variation across cables and setups.


So should be a defective cable?


----------



## msing539 (Jul 27, 2022)

WilliamBlake said:


> So should be a defective cable?


What I'm saying is that two cables made to usb spec can still sound different. The data is digital, but it's still transmitted electrically. As such, it's influenced by inductance, capacitance, impedance, crosstalk. Many cables also carry power along with that signal, which can also cause issues with sound quality. There are also external factors, like emi, that can negatively impact sound depending on cable shielding, geometry, etc.

So not defective, there's just a difference in sound.


----------



## WilliamBlake

msing539 said:


> What I'm saying is that two cables made to usb spec can still sound different. The data is digital, but it's still transmitted electrically. As such, it's influenced by inductance, capacitance, impedance, crosstalk. Many cables also carry power along with that signal, which can also cause issues with sound quality. There are also external factors, like emi, that can negatively impact sound depending on cable shielding, geometry, etc.
> 
> So not defective, there's just a difference in sound.


Still  I don't understand how an usb cable could improve low, mids or highs, anyway I think I'm venturing into a swamp


----------



## dougms3

WilliamBlake said:


> It's just a cable bringing data, i don't understand how it's possible to hear such changes, unless it's something you want to hear


In theory, yes you are correct but in practice, it makes a difference.  A usb signal is an electrical signal that needs to cross a medium to send data back and forth to a destination.  Wouldn't it make sense that a higher quality conductor with shielding would be better than an unshielded, cheap copper conductor?

We can all theorize with conjecture whether or not it does or doesn't but those of us who have more than one can A/B compare to make sure.  I have 4 usb cables, they all sound different on my system.  

I can guess as to the reasons why but while I have some theories, in all honesty, I'm not 100% sure.  I just know they sound different.  That is 100%, no doubt about that part.

Some people will try to argue that it doesn't make it a difference while refusing to even test a higher end usb cable, like a child refusing to try broccoli and state they know for a fact that it doesn't make a difference with their pseudoscience.  

And to be clear, depending on the system, it may not make much, if any difference.  Its not like we all have the components and environmental factors (ie type of pc, apt vs house, power, wifi, radio, bluetooth signals).  If you account for how many possible variables there are that can affect the audio system, its ridiculous to say for sure that something doesn't make a difference when you can't even account for possible variables that influence the audio system.

The easiest and most definitive way is to check and test it on your system.


----------



## msing539

WilliamBlake said:


> Still  I don't understand how an usb cable could improve low, mids or highs, anyway I think I'm venturing into a swamp


The knock-off usb cable we're talking about in this thread is $25 USD for 0.5m, so not a deep swamp.


----------



## WilliamBlake

msing539 said:


> The knock-off usb cable we're talking about in this thread is $25 USD for 0.5m, so not a deep swamp.


No I'm just referring to the subject, if cables can alter the sound ecc...


----------



## szore

szore said:


> Yeah, except they don't. lol.





WilliamBlake said:


> It's just a cable bringing data, i don't understand how it's possible to hear such changes, unless it's something you want to hear


When you here it it is an obvious difference.


----------



## dougms3

WilliamBlake said:


> No I'm just referring to the subject, if cables can alter the sound ecc...


I created this thread to let people know my findings with these aliexpress cables that don't cost a fortune.  

Because lets be honest, no one likes or wants to spend big money on cables.  

As the ancient Romans used to say, "Fortis Fortuna Aduivat".  In this case being brave only costs $25 or so, not much of a gamble if it doesn't do anything vs the possible reward.  A small price to pay imo to know for sure.


----------



## FredA

WilliamBlake said:


> Still  I don't understand how an usb cable could improve low, mids or highs, anyway I think I'm venturing into a swamp


The cable has an impact on the noise level, which itself impacts jitter. Jitter impacts sound.


----------



## DecentLevi

I ordered some of your recommendations from the Getwire store (Gold Odin AC cable and 2 RCA-terminated Ground Loop Noise Isolators). For some reason I got an email with a status update, and on the tracking it says "Processing issue at sorting center", while still in China, and estimated delivery is 3 weeks. Hope this isn't a major concern.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I ordered some of your recommendations from the Getwire store (Gold Odin AC cable and 2 RCA-terminated Ground Loop Noise Isolators). For some reason I got an email with a status update, and on the tracking it says "Processing issue at sorting center", while still in China, and estimated delivery is 3 weeks. Hope this isn't a major concern.


Try contacting the seller to see whats going on.


----------



## szore

lol, omg, I'm sitting here laughing...I just got the second Odin 2 cable (one more is coming, maybe tomorrow), so I had a big decision; do i put the second cable on the PC, or on the AresII dac? One is already on the Jotunheim amp...so I put it on the PC, and i cant stop laughing, pushes it over the top. I was stunned when i put the first cable on the Jot amp, and I'm stunned again,,,,listening to Sabbath album 13 and the dynamics, are, yet again threw the roof. More texture, clarity and deep, more sophisticated bass... There is some seriously good audiophile karma in this thread, these cable have changed everything about my desktop... I actually feel sorry for audiophiles that do not take advantage of what cables can offer. Can't even imagine the 3rd Odin, the gold xlr and the Odin usb cable, all on the way, then the Furutech liquid, then the bic500 power conditioner...I get goose bumps when I think how this beast of mine is going to sound when its all together and burned in. Thanks to this thread and the people in it, they have given this gift to me!!!


----------



## msing539

Did you try it on the DAC too yet?


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> Did you try it on the DAC too yet?


I'm so giddy I dont want to stop listening to music to switch it...this stuffs like ear candy...


----------



## msing539

Makes me wish I had a desktop sometimes. Every crammed inside a laptop is no bueno for noise.


----------



## Zaek

Arghh... I still waiting for mine. Ordered on monday, been too long!! hahah


----------



## szore

I am also noticing I am setting the volume wheel higher and higher; that tells me distortion is reduced; playing now at a higher volume with a cleaner sound. Normally the volume pot sits at about 10:00 and now its at 11:00...


----------



## cdacosta

WilliamBlake said:


> It's just a cable bringing data, i don't understand how it's possible to hear such changes, unless it's something you want to hear


I think your question is a fair one to ask.  For the majority that have not noticed a difference between any cable (pick one) they have not heard a difference.  This is assuming they are open to the idea it is possible.  Not, there in nothing to hear because there cannot be a difference. 

For USB this is an easy enough experiment.  Try out different cables and see if they make a difference?  See if there are any changes, whether pro or con to the cable you have been using.   

As a general rule of thumb, if I am asked.  For low budget systems I would say spend the least you need to get the system operarational. Cables connect your gear together.  They can make a difference on moderately priced gear.  The more resolving your system is the more obvious cabling can make a difference.


----------



## Gazza (Jul 28, 2022)

Ok, my gold Odin power cords arrived (well, 2 of the 3 as the third one was shipped separately). After much swearing and gnashing of teeth (limited rack space and thick, inflexible cords is a patience-testing endevour) the cables are installed. One between the wall and my PS Audio regenerator and the other connected to my Naim streamer. I had initially intended to plug it into my Densen amp but I discovered that it wouldn't fit due to the fuse-holder sticking out and preventing anything other than a bog-standard kettle lead. This isn't a big issue as Densen (like Naim whom they model themselves on) offer external power supply upgrades and that unit allows for any type of power cord to be used.

Playing some music to run it in and not listening critically whatsoever for now.


----------



## cdacosta

WilliamBlake said:


> No I'm just referring to the subject, if cables can alter the sound ecc...


Honestly if you believe cables do not matter, just keep believing this!  Way cheaper!  

If out of curiosity you do end up finding out cables can improve your listening enjoyment, this could end up being a never ending chase..  Your eyes start getting opened, this journey becomes a never ending knowledge gathering, generally through trial and error, and research.

The blue pill above is cheaper.  The red pill takes one through a interesting journey.  Be forewarned the journey is not inexpensive.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> lol, omg, I'm sitting here laughing...I just got the second Odin 2 cable (one more is coming, maybe tomorrow), so I had a big decision; do i put the second cable on the PC, or on the AresII dac? One is already on the Jotunheim amp...so I put it on the PC, and i cant stop laughing, pushes it over the top. I was stunned when i put the first cable on the Jot amp, and I'm stunned again,,,,listening to Sabbath album 13 and the dynamics, are, yet again threw the roof. More texture, clarity and deep, more sophisticated bass... There is some seriously good audiophile karma in this thread, these cable have changed everything about my desktop... I actually feel sorry for audiophiles that do not take advantage of what cables can offer. Can't even imagine the 3rd Odin, the gold xlr and the Odin usb cable, all on the way, then the Furutech liquid, then the bic500 power conditioner...I get goose bumps when I think how this beast of mine is going to sound when its all together and burned in. Thanks to this thread and the people in it, they have given this gift to me!!!


Yep, yep you will be likely thinking that it all sounds amazing….. after getting through the burn-in.  Have fun, this is all part of the journey


----------



## WilliamBlake

cdacosta said:


> Honestly if you believe cables do not matter, just keep believing this!  Way cheaper!
> 
> If out of curiosity you do end up finding out cables can improve your listening enjoyment, this could end up being a never ending chase..  Your eyes start getting opened, this journey becomes a never ending knowledge gathering, generally through trial and error, and research.
> 
> The blue pill above is cheaper.  The red pill takes one through a interesting journey.  Be forewarned the journey is not inexpensive.


I do not believe that cables cannot have some influences, but I'm just a bit puzzled when I read some statements. Anyway I will not buy some fancy and expensive usb cable just to search for nuances, I feel that the signal I hear is clear enough, but I will try  a simple supra cable, I don't like these imitations from aliexpress


----------



## dougms3

WilliamBlake said:


> I do not believe that cables cannot have some influences, but I'm just a bit puzzled when I read some statements. Anyway I will not buy some fancy and expensive usb cable just to search for nuances, I feel that the signal I hear is clear enough, but I will try  a simple supra cable, I don't like these imitations from aliexpress


Perhaps you need to stop believing or not believing and find out for yourself.  This is not a religion.  

Do you really think all of these people posting in this thread are imagining these differences with some having more than $10k+ in gear?  

Lol a supra cable costs $50+, why not just get a $5 printer cable.


----------



## DecentLevi (Jul 28, 2022)

szore said:


> lol, omg, I'm sitting here laughing...I just got the second Odin 2 cable (one more is coming, maybe tomorrow), so I had a big decision; do i put the second cable on the PC, or on the AresII dac? One is already on the Jotunheim amp...so I put it on the PC, and i cant stop laughing, pushes it over the top. I was stunned when i put the first cable on the Jot amp, and I'm stunned again,,,,listening to Sabbath album 13 and the dynamics, are, yet again threw the roof. More texture, clarity and deep, more sophisticated bass... There is some seriously good audiophile karma in this thread, these cable have changed everything about my desktop... I actually feel sorry for audiophiles that do not take advantage of what cables can offer. Can't even imagine the 3rd Odin, the gold xlr and the Odin usb cable, all on the way, then the Furutech liquid, then the bic500 power conditioner...I get goose bumps when I think how this beast of mine is going to sound when its all together and burned in. Thanks to this thread and the people in it, they have given this gift to me!!!


It's always nice to see new revelations in the hobby, and congratulations! For me, a possible greatest dream in this hobby would be to completely get away from the digital realm - and combine it with electrostatic headphones! Top flight vinyl system and even reel-to-reel tape with authentic old analog recordings connected to electrostatic headphone system, via tube amp / buffer. I already have Stax L300 LE, though that system is under modification. Digital has definitely been definitely reaching new heights however, thanks to my Audio-GD DI20 (a DDC that goes between the PC and DAC), and all of the above will be coaxed along quite nicely with upgraded cables from here, along with my existing Neotech silver OCC single crystal RCA cables.

Enjoyment can be taken up quite a few levels however with a decent tube amp such as from Ultrasonic Studios or Woo Audio, to much greater heights than the mid-fi solid state amps most around here seem to like.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> It's always nice to see new revelations in the hobby, and congratulations! For me, a possible greatest dream in this hobby would be to completely get away from the digital realm - and combine it with electrostatic headphones! Top flight vinyl system and even reel-to-reel tape with authentic old analog recordings connected to electrostatic headphone system. I already have Stax L300 LE, though that system is under modification. Digital has definitely been definitely reaching new heights however, thanks to my Audio-GD DI20 (a DDC that goes between the PC and DAC), and all of the above will be coaxed along quite nicely with upgraded cables from here, along with my existing Neotech silver OCC single crystal RCA cables.
> 
> Enjoyment can be taken up quite a few levels however with a decent tube amp such as from Ultrasonic Studios or Woo Audio, to much greater heights than the mid-fi solid state amps most around here seem to like.


Vinyl and electrostats, that sounds nice!


----------



## WilliamBlake

dougms3 said:


> Perhaps you need to stop believing or not believing and find out for yourself.  This is not a religion.
> 
> Do you really think all of these people posting in this thread are imagining these differences with some having more than $10k+ in gear?
> 
> Lol a supra cable costs $50+, why not just get a $5 printer cable.


Where i was talking about religion? it's just an opinion, and it's not only this thread, it's the whole argument.

So how much someone have to spend for an usb cable in your opinion?


----------



## szore

So I took the Odin 2 power cable off the PC and put it on the AresII dac and I think it sounds better than on the PC...on the PC maybe the dynamics were better but on the dac it seems there is better detail and even microdetail... It sounds sweeter on the dac and the soundstage is MUCH better, so I think i will leave on there. The last cable will be here in a day or 2 ill put that on the PC...


----------



## msing539

WilliamBlake said:


> it's just an opinion, and it's not only this thread, it's the whole argument.


I respect and value both sides of the conversation regarding cables.

I think the folks in this thread are just saying that we've come across something that outvalues and outperforms lots of other cables at a fraction of the price... I pulled a Nordost Red Dawn XLR off my system for one of these knock-off cables and couldn't be happier. I also swapped a Wireworld Starlight USB for the same knock-off brand. Is there an audible difference? I'd say so... my setup is fairly resolving though not TOTL.

What we're getting at is, for the price of the knock-off cables, they're worth a try. And if you don't like them, you've lost a minimal amount of money.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> I respect and value both sides of the conversation regarding cables.
> 
> I think the folks in this thread are just saying that we've come across something that outvalues and outperforms lots of other cables at a fraction of the price... I pulled a Nordost Red Dawn XLR off my system for one of these knock-off cables and couldn't be happier. I also swapped a Wireworld Starlight USB for the same knock-off brand. Is there an audible difference? I'd say so... my setup is fairly resolving though not TOTL.
> 
> What we're getting at is, for the price of the knock-off cables, they're worth a try. And if you don't like them, you've lost a minimal amount of money.


I think you can even return it.


----------



## WilliamBlake

msing539 said:


> I respect and value both sides of the conversation regarding cables.
> 
> I think the folks in this thread are just saying that we've come across something that outvalues and outperforms lots of other cables at a fraction of the price... I pulled a Nordost Red Dawn XLR off my system for one of these knock-off cables and couldn't be happier. I also swapped a Wireworld Starlight USB for the same knock-off brand. Is there an audible difference? I'd say so... my setup is fairly resolving though not TOTL.
> 
> What we're getting at is, for the price of the knock-off cables, they're worth a try. And if you don't like them, you've lost a minimal amount of money.


Yep but i didn't understand the statement on the supra cable, but a fake nordost cable is praised like the holy grail.


----------



## dougms3

WilliamBlake said:


> Yep but i didn't understand the statement on the supra cable, but a fake nordost cable is praised like the holy grail.


Believe or don't believe, this is not the place for that, thats for church or mosque or whatever.  Lets keep our beliefs to ourselves.

We are just sharing our experience with these cables.   Whether they're fake, they're still well made and have high quality shielding and conductors.  They're praised because of the value vs performance.

If you don't like it, you don't have to buy it, done.

My point is that if you don't think the cables do anything why waste money on a $50 if they're all the same, just get a cheap $5 cable.


----------



## WilliamBlake

dougms3 said:


> Believe or don't believe, this is not the place for that, thats for church or mosque or whatever.  Lets keep our beliefs to ourselves.
> 
> We are just sharing our experience with these cables.   Whether they're fake, they're still well made and have high quality shielding and conductors.  They're praised because of the value vs performance.
> 
> ...


You keep talkin about religion and beliefs, it's not the point! I've expressed my opinion or is forbidden in this  thread?

your last sentence testifies that maybe you haven't even read what I wrote.


----------



## msing539

WilliamBlake said:


> I've expressed my opinion or is forbidden in this thread?



No of course not! Opinions based on experience are always welcome in any thread.



WilliamBlake said:


> I will try a simple supra cable, I don't like these imitations from aliexpress



It's sort of like if one of us posted in the HE1000 v2 impressions thread that we were going to buy the Meze Empyrean because we didn't trust the Hifiman build quality. Which is also totally fine... it's just that the HE1000 thread wouldn't be the best place to say that, when there are plenty of owners there telling everyone how great it is.


----------



## dougms3

WilliamBlake said:


> You keep talkin about religion and beliefs, it's not the point! I've expressed my opinion or is forbidden in this  thread?
> 
> your last sentence testifies that maybe you haven't even read what I wrote.





WilliamBlake said:


> I do not *believe *that cables cannot have some influences, but I'm just a bit puzzled when I read some statements. Anyway I will not buy some fancy and expensive usb cable just to search for nuances, I feel that the signal I hear is clear enough, but I will try  a simple supra cable, I don't like these imitations from aliexpress


Ok whats the point.

Buy or don't buy, its not necessary to inform us.


----------



## WilliamBlake

dougms3 said:


> Ok whats the point.
> 
> Buy or don't buy, its not necessary to inform us.


Never meant to do so, enjoy your incredibile cable


----------



## szore

my desktop sounds like crap right now...gotta loooove the burn in...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> my desktop sounds like crap right now...gotta loooove the burn in...


Yes, I am sure it sounds all discombobulated or out of whack.  No real clarity to anything.  What I would consider unlistenable.  This is why I keep mentioning be ready for the burn-in, it is real.  And you are burning in 3 power cords and interconnects at the same time?  

What I do whenever I am burning in any piece of new gear or cable(s) is let it all run 24/7 for 21 days or so.  When I am not listening say at work, will be running music with dynamic swings in it (I like using fast 135+bpm techno), with volume turned all the way down on the amp.    This is a slower way to burn-in but does work.  You will be able to "hear" the changes throughout this burn-in period.  And these changes as you already know will be massive.  At about 300 or so hours (or 13 days in) parts of the sonic landscape start to snap into place and just gets better and better from here.

Just be patient.


----------



## szore (Jul 30, 2022)

Well this morning it sounded much better, then I noticed over coffee that the 3rd Odin cable and the Gold XLR was delivered! Put them on, now all 3 components have the Odin power cable, dac amp and PC. First thing, bass kicks like a mule,..dynamics are tight (in a good way), supreme clarity and resolution across the spectrum...and the music is effortless and engaging, the AresII and Jot 2 have great synergy... the dynamics are unreal...mids are very open and transparent, treble has great texture and body...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Well this morning it sounded much better, then I noticed over coffee that the 3rd Odin cable and the Gold XLR was delivered! Put them on, now all 3 components have the Odin power cable, dac amp and PC. First thing, bass kicks like a mule,..dynamics are tight (in a good way), supreme clarity and resolution across the spectrum...and the music is effortless and engaging, the AresII and Jot 2 have great synergy... the dynamics are unreal...mids are very open and transparent, treble has great texture and body...


I read what you wrote.  I am thinking back to the stage of burn-in you are at.  IIRC you will soon start to hear glimpses of what certain aspects of the overall presentation will be.  Here are two simple examples of what I mean:

- Huge exaggeration of bass frequencies which will have ehh to ok detail.  Then a day or two later the bass that was boosted will subside by up to 3db.  Eventually extreme detail will emerge in lower bass regions you have not heard from your system before.  This was at about 300 hour mark.  

- Mid frequency swings are similar to bass above without the huge db boost.  Vocal positioning (front to back) for same track will shift with vague levels of macro or micro detail.  On my system once the vocals stopped shifting and it felt like I was being sung to vs watching a performance I noticed extreme levels of micro detail emerging.  Wait until you hear the mid frequency detail these cables help pull from your gear.  Guitar and other mid frequency instrument timbre is superb.

Will be entertaining to read your journey through the break-in process.  I am sure will be highly educational for anyone that reads it and have never experienced break-in of cables.


----------



## szore

Well i'm listening to Black Sabbath 13 album at near ear bleeding volume on my custom Valkyries, and every single instrument is effortless and transparent. Butler's bass, is fully defined in the mix, as well as all other instruments. The bass drum is kicking in my throat...zero distortion...


----------



## dougms3

Received the odin coax cable today.  Build quality is top notch, very suprising that the conductors look to be made of silver plated copper or sterling silver, I'm leaning towards the latter as its very light weight, highly doubtful its pure silver at this price point.  Not a fan of the locking connectors but can't complain for $13.  

Its probably gonna need a bit burn in time but upon swapping out the Audioquest Carbon spdif cable, the difference in sound is immediately apparent.  Initial impressions are, the sound is much more open and 3 dimensional, soundstage and depth improved significantly.  Its almost as if the AQ carbon sounds compressed by comparison.  Microdetail is slightly improved, imaging and layering presentation is more precise.  Vocals are less forward.  Bass is about the same, imo bass tends to fluctuate the most during burn in so I won't bother comparing that right now.

I'll be honest, I was not expecting this cable to be better than the carbon, I thought it might come close but was not expecting at all to be better.  It is stupid ridiculous that for $13, that this cable is outperforming the AQ carbon spdif, and not by a little bit.

This is the odin 1 coax cable, I ordered the odin 2 to compare as well and also because I need a little more length.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Well i'm listening to Black Sabbath 13 album at near ear bleeding volume on my custom Valkyries, and every single instrument is effortless and transparent. Butler's bass, is fully defined in the mix, as well as all other instruments. The bass drum is kicking in my throat...zero distortion...


If you are happy now, better times a coming!  It gets gets much better.


----------



## szore

I dont normally listen loud like that BTW it was just an experiment!


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I'll be honest, I was not expecting this cable to be better than the carbon, I thought it might come close but was not expecting at all to be better. It is stupid ridiculous that for $13, that this cable is outperforming the AQ carbon spdif, and not by a little bit.


I have a different ODIN SPDIF cable (see pic) that cost $47 for 1.5m.   This cable is heavy.  I am still using this cable because it performs better than the Blue Jeans and a all silver custom SPDIF cable I have that cost about $500 IIRC.  Also not that big of a fan of the locking WBT connectors, but it works.  The cable goes from PC --> ifi SPDIF iPurifer2 --> DAC.


----------



## musicinmymind

I am looking for 6.3 mm jack for soldering my headphone cable, please suggest good quality ones


----------



## cdacosta

Highest quality, lowest price my vote is Furutech FP-704 G - $17
Buy it here: 
https://www.soniccraft.com/product_info.php/furutech-fp-704-14-phono-plug-p-1443

Want Rhodium go to VH Audio, Furutech are about $73.
https://www.vhaudio.com/connectors-rcaxlr.html#phone


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> I am looking for 6.3 mm jack for soldering my headphone cable, please suggest good quality ones


Forgot to mention, I have used both of the Furutech plugs.  The $17 Furutech is the smoothest or warmer of the two plugs.  The Rhodium is a bit edgier sounding and a bit more resolving BUT mids are not as lush and break-in is extremely long, like 600 hours!


----------



## dougms3

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801342455842.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802EbNvgG

Recently got this cable to use for connecting my Hiby r6g2 to my audio-gd m19 amp.  

Build quality is excellent, works ine but the 3.5mm plug is not snug though.  

I'm really liking this cable and I'm gonna try asking the seller to make a headphone cable with this wire.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Yes, I am sure it sounds all discombobulated or out of whack.  No real clarity to anything.  What I would consider unlistenable.  This is why I keep mentioning be ready for the burn-in, it is real.  And you are burning in 3 power cords and interconnects at the same time?
> 
> What I do whenever I am burning in any piece of new gear or cable(s) is let it all run 24/7 for 21 days or so.  When I am not listening say at work, will be running music with dynamic swings in it (I like using fast 135+bpm techno), with volume turned all the way down on the amp.    This is a slower way to burn-in but does work.  You will be able to "hear" the changes throughout this burn-in period.  And these changes as you already know will be massive.  At about 300 or so hours (or 13 days in) parts of the sonic landscape start to snap into place and just gets better and better from here.
> 
> Just be patient.


My Odin Gold AC cable should be coming in a few days. I'm planning to burn it in as the main power cord to my huge power conditioner (Furman IT ref 15i). I probably won't hear any difference regardless of which cable is used or burn in process in that spot, being that it is before a huge power regeneration cycle, but will probably swap it to my amp every now and then to listen for changes. Would you think this is a good enough way to burn it in? I suppose I would have to have the power conditioner on, at least powering low-level components such as a DDC or wal-wart... but I'm definitely not going to be burning it in with my tube amp 24/7 which has tubes that can get extremely hot. I also probably wouldn't want to burn it in with my computer, because that would just be connecting to a a wall-wart for a laptop.

Also I'm curious - how much is the price of the original Gold Odin AC cable, and what does it look like? Someone here says it costs as much as a car, but not sure if they were exaggerating.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801342455842.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802EbNvgG
> 
> Recently got this cable to use for connecting my Hiby r6g2 to my audio-gd m19 amp.
> 
> ...


That looks interesting, but I'm not sure if I would get it - recent experience with audio cables points to the merits of being shielded thoroughly. The best headphone cable I can remember hearing was fully shielded on the outside, and every time I add ferrite clamps to my headphone and RCA cables, the sound really comes into focus and is more resolving, better dynamics, Etc. Or I may be mistaken and that cable actually does have a shielding? As far as I know, this helps for EMI / RF protection, and prevents  electrical leakage of sorts.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> My Odin Gold AC cable should be coming in a few days. I'm planning to burn it in as the main power cord to my huge power conditioner (Furman IT ref 15i). I probably won't hear any difference regardless of which cable is used or burn in process in that spot, being that it is before a huge power regeneration cycle, but will probably swap it to my amp every now and then to listen for changes. Would you think this is a good enough way to burn it in? I suppose I would have to have the power conditioner on, at least powering low-level components such as a DDC or wal-wart... but I'm definitely not going to be burning it in with my tube amp 24/7 which has tubes that can get extremely hot. I also probably wouldn't want to burn it in with my computer, because that would just be connecting to a a wall-wart for a laptop.
> 
> Also I'm curious - how much is the price of the original Gold Odin AC cable, and what does it look like? Someone here says it costs as much as a car, but not sure if they were exaggerating.


Yeah, it's like 14K the original...


----------



## msing539

If I owned an actual Odin cable, I'd disconnect it every night and take it to bed with me. Then we'd hit the gym in the morning and stop for power shakes on the way home.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> That looks interesting, but I'm not sure if I would get it - recent experience with audio cables points to the merits of being shielded thoroughly. The best headphone cable I can remember hearing was fully shielded on the outside, and every time I add ferrite clamps to my headphone and RCA cables, the sound really comes into focus and is more resolving, better dynamics, Etc. Or I may be mistaken and that cable actually does have a shielding? As far as I know, this helps for EMI / RF protection, and prevents  electrical leakage of sorts.


The cable is heavily shielded.  Just like all the other odin cables the conductors have a spiral wrap of aluminum or sterling silver around each conductor.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Also I'm curious - how much is the price of the original Gold Odin AC cable, and what does it look like? Someone here says it costs as much as a car, but not sure if they were exaggerating.


1.25M MSRP is $35K.  Link to a dealer, all sell for the same price I understand:
https://www.hifipig.com/nordost-odin-gold-cable-range/


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> My Odin Gold AC cable should be coming in a few days. I'm planning to burn it in as the main power cord to my huge power conditioner (Furman IT ref 15i). I probably won't hear any difference regardless of which cable is used or burn in process in that spot, being that it is before a huge power regeneration cycle, but will probably swap it to my amp every now and then to listen for changes. Would you think this is a good enough way to burn it in? I suppose I would have to have the power conditioner on, at least powering low-level components such as a DDC or wal-wart... but I'm definitely not going to be burning it in with my tube amp 24/7 which has tubes that can get extremely hot. I also probably wouldn't want to burn it in with my computer, because that would just be connecting to a a wall-wart for a laptop.


The power cord attached to your Furman IT ref 15i should effect what you hear or the gear attached to this power conditioner.  I suppose nothing in life is for certain but I am fairly sure this will be the case.  I have built several balanced power conditioners and have two isolation power conditioners in my headphone setup now.  The power cable used has always been audible to me.  But obviously YMMV.

For burn-in of any cable, I do not recommend moving the cable around.  Burn-in of the Odin Gold PC is 500+ hours.  Obviously will work immediately, but how the cable performs is completely different from new to after burn-in.  If you have a constant load on the Furman, leave the PC on the Furman.  Best way to burn-in is on a cable cooker, then fridge or large draw device, lastly is on device that will constantly draw current through cable.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> 1.25M MSRP is $35K.  Link to a dealer, all sell for the same price I understand:
> https://www.hifipig.com/nordost-odin-gold-cable-range/


sheesh even the .5M XLR is 35K...


----------



## DecentLevi

Can someone recommend which seller here to get an Odin 2 CRA coax cable? I found this one (from Getwire) but it says Odin Pure Silver, is that the same as Odin 2? 

Also is there an Odin 2 AC cable on sale? 
And 3.5mm to RCA cable?

I'm thinking to go all Odin 2 this time around since I like it fast and clear. My Odin Gold AC cable is on the way.


----------



## DecentLevi

PS - look at the insides of the Odin 2 AC cable, it's insane quality. If this isn't silver I wonder what it's made of.


----------



## szore




----------



## msing539

I "think" the ones marked pure silver are Odin 1 cables. They don't make it easy to figure out what's what.

I've purchased from this seller:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832234344491.html?mp=1

And Timeless Audio, and some others. My guess is they just drop ship from warehouses. I usually look for the cable manufacturer to be Audiocrast.

Doug, I think, found the 3.5 to dual RCA.


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 2, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> PS - look at the insides of the Odin 2 AC cable, it's insane quality. If this isn't silver I wonder what it's made of.


To be honest, I think its most likely a silver alloy like sterling silver.

The price doesn't make sense if it were high purity silver.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801405522978.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802MgeNlx

The coax cable is cheaper here, this is the version 1 though.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I "think" the ones marked pure silver are Odin 1 cables. They don't make it easy to figure out what's what.
> 
> I've purchased from this seller:
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832234344491.html?mp=1
> ...


That one looks a little different, it has wbt knockoff connectors.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801342455842.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.16841802flpweh

Are you referring to this one?


----------



## msing539

These wooden blocks tho...


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> These wooden blocks tho...


Lol when the hell did you get all those.  

You guys are getting way ahead of me. Haha.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> These wooden blocks tho...


I know. The're so gawdy and useless, I love them tho.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Lol when the hell did you get all those.
> 
> You guys are getting way ahead of me. Haha.


It's only like 3 pairs... 3 pairs of cables with like 24 wooden blocks.


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> I know. The're so gawdy and useless, I love them tho.


If I could cut the blocks off without damaging the cables, I 100% "wood."


----------



## szore

I love my blocks...


----------



## szore

So the Gold XLR has a few days on it, I am noticing the high end is rich, smooth and lush sounding...very lovley...


----------



## Lumithium

Are the XLR interconnects off AliExpress sold in singles or pairs?

I doubt I will be hearing much if any difference, but $45 for a pair will be a good deal for some gold XLR cables.

although I never bought anything off AliExpress before.


----------



## dougms3

Lumithium said:


> Are the XLR interconnects off AliExpress sold in singles or pairs?
> 
> I doubt I will be hearing much if any difference, but $45 for a pair will be a good deal for some gold XLR cables.
> 
> although I never bought anything off AliExpress before.


They're usually sold in pairs unless otherwise stated.

Lol you're in HK and never bought from aliexpress?  It'll probably be like 1 day delivery for you.


----------



## szore

Lumithium said:


> Are the XLR interconnects off AliExpress sold in singles or pairs?
> 
> I doubt I will be hearing much if any difference, but $45 for a pair will be a good deal for some gold XLR cables.
> 
> although I never bought anything off AliExpress before.


Price is for a pair....I think it was $45....


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> These wooden blocks tho...


That looks like burn-in hell...LOL


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> That looks like burn-in hell...LOL


Just looking at it makes me anxious... I'll neaten it up once I get the power cables. I try to cross signal and power perpendicularly when it can't be avoided.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> So the Gold XLR has a few days on it, I am noticing the high end is rich, smooth and lush sounding...very lovley...


As I mentioned:

Odin Gold has a sweeter presentation
Odin 2 a bit faster and a tad more resolving

I understand it will be very hard to know until full burn-in, but so far how do you feel about the value or performance?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> As I mentioned:
> 
> Odin Gold has a sweeter presentation
> Odin 2 a bit faster and a tad more resolving
> ...


Oh, I'm blown away! Even the first power cable, as soon as I put it on the PC I heard an immediete diffirence.


----------



## cdacosta

Seeing the pic(s) of others trying the cables is kind of cool.  After all of you have some time with the cables, it would be interesting to read your feelings about them?

For me, the performance vs price is what shocked me.  Hence the main reason I share my experiences with them.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Seeing the pic(s) of others trying the cables is kind of cool.  After all of you have some time with the cables, it would be interesting to read your feelings about them?
> 
> For me, the performance vs price is what shocked me.  Hence the main reason I share my experiences with them.


Agreed--had these cables been more expensive, I might never have tried them. The wait time is killer though... we should just get a spool and the connectors and make them here. Without the wood blocks.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Oh, I'm blown away! Even the first power cable, as soon as I put it on the PC I heard an immediete diffirence.


After you get time on your system, cables and gear all settled in.  Know what it sounds and feels like.  When I say "feels like", I am referring to the visceral feeling, how musical if feels to you as you are listening to it...  

If you want to take it to a whole other level relatively inexpensively, Furutech Nano Liquid.  The sonic benefits of minimizing the micro arcing between all your mechanical connections will shock you.  Benefits from my personal experience with Nano Liquid:

- The levels of noise floor lowered is easily evident, you will hear micro detail across entire frequency spectrum you never knew existed, from the same recordings you have been listening to.  
- Increased macro and micro dynamics
- PRAT (Pace, Rhythm And Timing) improved.  I went from this sounds really good, to parts of my body grooving to what I am listening to for hours until I realize what my foot, hand and head have been doing.  
- Timbre is improved dramatically.  Everything heard just sounds more real or lifelike.  More organic experience vs listening to a reproduction of a recording.
- Improved separation and sound stage placement of all sounds.

I can go on and on.  Basically your system will take on a level of refinement and sonic reproduction you did not think was possible.  I will put it another way.  The Nano Liquid will feel like you upgraded every cable, connection and component in your system.  There is two downsides to the Nano Liquid: 1) "you" will have to treat every connection one at a time, and that takes time.  But once you "hear" what treating the connections do you will be looking for any and all mechanical connections you can imagine to treat.  2) Break-in is minimum of 72 hours. 

Simply one of the best bang for the $ tweak or upgrade to any mid-fi and up system I have come across in over two decades.  Easy to apply, can easily be removed, non-conductive, can and should be used on "all" mechanical connections.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Agreed--had these cables been more expensive, I might never have tried them. The wait time is killer though... we should just get a spool and the connectors and make them here. Without the wood blocks.


I am not a fan of the wood blocks.  But since I do not stare at the cables, they do not bother me.  Wait time of 2.5-3 weeks is long, but every high end new cable I have purchased has always taken 2-4 weeks to arrive after purchase.  So about the same.


----------



## DecentLevi

msing539 said:


> I "think" the ones marked pure silver are Odin 1 cables. They don't make it easy to figure out what's what.
> 
> I've purchased from this seller:
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832234344491.html?mp=1
> ...


Still looking for an RCA coax cable especially. Doesn't seem like there are any Odin 2 in this type, maybe the ones marked Odin Pure Silver really are the same as Odin 2, or are the only available Odin of this type?


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Still looking for an RCA coax cable especially. Doesn't seem like there are any Odin 2 in this type, maybe the ones marked Odin Pure Silver really are the same as Odin 2, or are the only available Odin of this type?


Why not just get the gold?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Still looking for an RCA coax cable especially. Doesn't seem like there are any Odin 2 in this type, maybe the ones marked Odin Pure Silver really are the same as Odin 2, or are the only available Odin of this type?


Cable application?  Are you looking for a SPDIF cable with RCA termination?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Still looking for an RCA coax cable especially. Doesn't seem like there are any Odin 2 in this type, maybe the ones marked Odin Pure Silver really are the same as Odin 2, or are the only available Odin of this type?


You have to understand that the descriptions are not really accurate.

Theres several different possible scenarios with these sellers on aliexpress.  Should make notes of a few things.


The smaller sellers are just middle men, placing the order with a bigger seller or manufacturer as they receive the order from the customers.
They may get the bulk wire and terminate the wire on their own.
The descriptions are not accurate and probably alot of false information like 99.9999% silver, if it really was that it would not be $13, or $50 or $70.  It'd be alot more as it costs alot of money to manufacturer that high a purity silver wire.
Some of the bigger sellers are viborg, audiocrast, amongst others.  
Competition is cutthroat amongst the sellers on aliexpress, you see that gold odin power cable, it was about $200 when I first found it and within 2 months it progressively dropped to $64.  This doesn't always happen but when alot of sellers are selling the same product, we get stuff deals, high five.
Sometimes theres more than one version of the same product.  Like the odin coax cable, some have the odin connectors while some have wbt gold, and some wbt silver, and some viborg.  

Don't put in too much thought on the description, like I said, even though the conductors look to be solid silver its most likely not.  If you go by the current market value of silver, it doesn't make sense when you factor in the cost of the manufacturing process, sheathing and middle men.  I've spoken to a seller before regarding this and he accidentally said sterling silver a few times, and I corrected him.  He then said, "oh yes, that is what I meant".


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 2, 2022)

Look what came in the mail today.

Looks legit fake 

I really hate that gel insulator they use.  Still not a fan of the locking connectors.

I literally ordered this one month after the odin 1 coax and got that 4 days ago.

Gonna need some burn in but immediately off the bat, its more resolving, more bass, and more open than the odin 1 coax.  The odin 1 coax sounded better than the audioquest carbon coax cable.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Look what came in the mail today.
> 
> Looks legit fake
> 
> ...


Yep, that is the one I have.  I like the cable's performance.  How much you pay for it?  

I paid $47.23 shipped at the end of April for a 1.5m.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Yep, that is the one I have.  I like the cable's performance.  How much you pay for it?
> 
> I paid $47.23 shipped at the end of April for a 1.5m.


It was $41.05 for 1m but I used a coupon with some other stuff I ordered so probably a couple bucks cheaper than that.

Price doesn't seem to have changed for that one.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> It was $41.05 for 1m but I used a coupon with some other stuff I ordered so probably a couple bucks cheaper than that.
> 
> Price doesn't seem to have changed for that one.


For those wondering what this cable is for, this is the 75ohm SPDIF cable.  RCA to RCA termination.  There is also a BNC to BNC connection version.


----------



## szore (Aug 2, 2022)

All I know is I'm totally digging these cables, man... I mean, I'm dealing with burn in from multiple fronts: The dac and amp are technically still burning in too...so all I'm getting is this steady increase in sound quality...it's really cool. Listening to Sabbath album 13 on my penon Serial tri DD iem, $1,000 PWAudio cable, and my desktop and its a total experience... crystal clear at near pain levels...stunning!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> All I know is I'm totally digging these cables, man... I mean, I'm dealing with burn in from multiple fronts: The dac and amp are technically still burning in too...so all I'm getting is this steady increase in sound quality...it's really cool. Listening to Sabbath album 13 on my penon Serial tri DD iem, $1,000 PWAudio cable, and my desktop and its a total experience... crystal clear at near pain levels...stunning!


What cables did the clone Nordost cables replace?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> What cables did the clone Nordost cables replace?


The power cables were stock...the xlr and usb were Black Dragons


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The power cables were stock...the xlr and usb were Black Dragons


I understand the cables are breaking in.  What do you hear different when comparing the Moon Audio Black Dragon cables and the Odins that replaced them?


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Look what came in the mail today.
> 
> Looks legit fake
> 
> ...


So cool, I'll order the same type. Guess you meant 'legit fake' as in legit clone, rather than like 'very fake'. Yeah I need a digital RCA coax cable, so I guess that means SPDIF 75 ohm, sounds like what I had before. Mind to tell me which seller you got it from?


----------



## DecentLevi

@dougms3  I was looking at this one from Getwire which looks the same as your photo above, except it doesn't say Odin 2.





Was this the kind you had for one year and didn't like as much?


----------



## Zaek

Free Burn-in track to speed up.
https://www.taralabs.com/cascade-noise-burn-in


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> So cool, I'll order the same type. Guess you meant 'legit fake' as in legit clone, rather than like 'very fake'. Yeah I need a digital RCA coax cable, so I guess that means SPDIF 75 ohm, sounds like what I had before. Mind to tell me which seller you got it from?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803967512562.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802lJ0rLf

I got it from this seller because he uses the silver wbt clones.  

I only had the odin 1 coax cable for about 4 days before I got the odin2.  The odin2 sounds alot better, don't bother with the odin1 coax.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I understand the cables are breaking in.  What do you hear different when comparing the Moon Audio Black Dragon cables and the Odins that replaced them?


First impression when I put the Odin on my PC reminded me of what you said...the bass and treble extension increased. Also resolution and clarity was significantly improved. Since then I have put Odins on the dac and amp. When i put it on the dac, the notes got sweeter sounding...and more, I just cannot describe it...more delicate? And the cable on the jot really brought supreme clarity to the sound. Also perception of dynamics are better...Don't know how else to put it...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> First impression when I put the Odin on my PC reminded me of what you said...the bass and treble extension increased. Also resolution and clarity was significantly improved. Since then I have put Odins on the dac and amp. When i put it on the dac, the notes got sweeter sounding...and more, I just cannot describe it...more delicate? And the cable on the jot really brought supreme clarity to the sound. Also perception of dynamics are better...Don't know how else to put it...


I am sure the Odin 2 power cords would be a big improvement over stock.  

Didn’t you replace the Moon Audio Black Dragon XLR balanced interconnects with the Odin Gold XLR balanced interconnects?  If you did, how did these interconnects differ in your setup?  Black Dragon balanced interconnects when new start at $300 (for 1m IIRC) and go up in price depending on XLR connectors and length.  Would be good for anyone reading this to get an idea of the difference.


----------



## musicinmymind

For RCA connectors, I found only this cable for Odin 2

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100...f816595372881995971e8e8d!12000028690530067!sh

any other sellers for less price?


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> For RCA connectors, I found only this cable for Odin 2
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004304110429.html?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_groupList.8148356.10.6c986ec2qzIR0o&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!US $71.42!US $64.28!!!!!@0b0a01f816595372881995971e8e8d!12000028690530067!sh
> 
> any other sellers for less price?


Get the version with the Holo Plugs, like the real Nordost Odin 2 cables.  Skip the WBT plugs, they are wonky to work with.  Looks like the prices have dropped.  Below are links to a couple I have found, but you will have to read reviews to decide who to buy from.  There are many sellers.  There are 2 or 3 main suppliers/manufacturers for these cables. I have not tried the RCA versions, only the XLR.  The Odin Gold below pricing is the lowest I have seen.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...616595394992026284ea44b!12000027405414910!sea

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...616595394992026284ea44b!12000029090429179!sea


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> For RCA connectors, I found only this cable for Odin 2
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004304110429.html?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_groupList.8148356.10.6c986ec2qzIR0o&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!US $71.42!US $64.28!!!!!@0b0a01f816595372881995971e8e8d!12000028690530067!sh
> 
> any other sellers for less price?


Here is another Odin Gold link.  Make sure you:

* Order RCA to RCA
* Order a pair, they are also offered as a single cable.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...f16595408782994275e9f74!12000029197193063!rec


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I am sure the Odin 2 power cords would be a big improvement over stock.
> 
> Didn’t you replace the Moon Audio Black Dragon XLR balanced interconnects with the Odin Gold XLR balanced interconnects?  If you did, how did these interconnects differ in your setup?  Black Dragon balanced interconnects when new start at $300 (for 1m IIRC) and go up in price depending on XLR connectors and length.  Would be good for anyone reading this to get an idea of the difference.


Yes, I want to wait until everything is burned in then I will do A/B compare to the Black dragon... The mids are still a little warbly...once the mids clarify and those microdynamics you talked about start coming through, I'll compare to stock cables and black Dragon, etc....  One surprising thing: With all this new found clarity and dynamics, I listened to some old albums last night that are tired and worn out to me, but with all the new cables, suddenly the music was revitalized, I felt like I was actually in the studio...I remember thinking, 'this never sounded like this to me"...i mean every instrument was just THERE...its like they were in the room...How do you describe sound like that in detail?  To say the band sounded like they were in your room is the highest compliment I can think of....


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Yes, I want to wait until everything is burned in then I will do A/B compare to the Black dragon... The mids are still a little warbly...once the mids clarify and those microdynamics you talked about start coming through, I'll compare to stock cables and black Dragon, etc....  One surprising thing: With all this new found clarity and dynamics, I listened to some old albums last night that are tired and worn out to me, but with all the new cables, suddenly the music was revitalized, I felt like I was actually in the studio...I remember thinking, 'this never sounded like this to me"...i mean every instrument was just THERE...its like they were in the room...How do you describe sound like that in detail?  To say the band sounded like they were in your room is the highest compliment I can think of....


Makes sense.  Give the entire system 2 weeks, 24/7 burn-in.  At this time you should start to not only hear, but feel the improved coherency and PRAT of the system.  Vocals and mid frequencies should really improve.  Micro detail will start to emerge, dynamics, separation, etc will also start to improve.


----------



## musicinmymind

cdacosta said:


> Get the version with the Holo Plugs, like the real Nordost Odin 2 cables.  Skip the WBT plugs, they are wonky to work with.  Looks like the prices have dropped.  Below are links to a couple I have found, but you will have to read reviews to decide who to buy from.  There are many sellers.  There are 2 or 3 main suppliers/manufacturers for these cables. I have not tried the RCA versions, only the XLR.  The Odin Gold below pricing is the lowest I have seen.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803702194867.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.317b10a1tPElsj&algo_pvid=1cb05385-9aae-4602-bce1-659f9fd2d008&algo_exp_id=1cb05385-9aae-4602-bce1-659f9fd2d008-6&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000027405414910"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!25.0!13.75!!!!!@2103143616595394992026284ea44b!12000027405414910!sea
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804225661235.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.317b10a1tPElsj&algo_pvid=1cb05385-9aae-4602-bce1-659f9fd2d008&aem_p4p_detail=202208030811393230080466078550007598340&algo_exp_id=1cb05385-9aae-4602-bce1-659f9fd2d008-4&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000029090429179"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!34.22!34.22!!!!!@2103143616595394992026284ea44b!12000029090429179!sea



If I want warm and rich tone, then should I get gold or odin 2 cable?


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> If I want warm and rich tone, then should I get gold or odin 2 cable?


Odin Gold has a sweeter presentation, this includes mid range
Odin 2 a bit faster and a tad more resolving, but tends more toward neutral presentation


----------



## Zaek

I noticed that there are different pricing for the same cable in Aliexpress. The power plug on the Cheaper version has white wording while the more expensive version has black wording.. Not sure if the slightly more expensive one has better quality plug. Any idea?


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> If I want warm and rich tone, then should I get gold or odin 2 cable?


By the way, the difference I mentioned regarding sonic presentation between the interconnects, also holds true with the power cables.

If you want even warmer than the Odin Gold and are willing to give up on some of the micro detail from mid bass frequencies and up and a tiny bit slower (pure copper cable), the XLO signature 3 interconnects will do this.  I have the balanced versions and this is a good cable.  Dirt cheap now, stupid value.  Actually all these cables are so inexpensive $23.80 for 1m including shipping (literally cheaper than a meal). I would recommend you get one of each and see which you prefer in your system.  Synergy is key with cabling.  Link to the XLO...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...00025306200295!sea&curPageLogUid=CjmvV4nW7IqK


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> I noticed that there are different pricing for the same cable in Aliexpress. The power plug on the Cheaper version has white wording while the more expensive version has black wording.. Not sure if the slightly more expensive one has better quality plug. Any idea?


Those plugs are different than the ones we use in US, so I am not sure.  Especially since I cannot inspect it personally.  But if the price difference is reasonable "I" would get the plugs with black writing and brass screws at the back of the plug.


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> I noticed that there are different pricing for the same cable in Aliexpress. The power plug on the Cheaper version has white wording while the more expensive version has black wording.. Not sure if the slightly more expensive one has better quality plug. Any idea?


I was curious about this too.

I wonder if its any different than the one with the white lettering, I have the one with the white lettering.


----------



## dougms3

@Gazza 

Isn't this the switch you have?

This is the new Denafrips LHY SW-8 audiophile switch.  If Denafrips is offering it, must be legit.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> @Gazza
> 
> Isn't this the switch you have?
> 
> This is the new Denafrips LHY SW-8 audiophile switch.  If Denafrips is offering it, must be legit.


LHY is a subsidiary of Jay's Audio.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> LHY is a subsidiary of Jay's Audio.


Please explain, I'm not familiar with Jay's Audio.

I've seen some of the products on aliexpress but don't know much about it.


----------



## Gazza (Aug 5, 2022)

@dougms3 Yup, that's the one I have. Really happy with it.

EDIT: Do you mind posting the link to the Denafrips version?


----------



## dougms3

Gazza said:


> @dougms3 Yup, that's the one I have. Really happy with it.
> 
> EDIT: Do you mind posting the link to the Denafrips version?


My mistake, its not being offered by Denafrips.  They are reviewing it.

https://www.vinshineaudio.com/post/...mail&cid=9fb8d3f8-2b55-4a56-afe3-c69ba3b48782


----------



## Gazza

dougms3 said:


> My mistake, its not being offered by Denafrips.  They are reviewing it.
> 
> https://www.vinshineaudio.com/post/...mail&cid=9fb8d3f8-2b55-4a56-afe3-c69ba3b48782



Cheers, good write up + video. I agree getting the audiophile switch was 99% about sorting out the last bits in my stereo not about making big improvements in the sound. Honestly iy was a genuine surprise that it made a noticeable and welcome improvement to the sound.


----------



## cdacosta

*Here is an update on the latest Odin Gold cables added to the system and burn-in after 600 hours. * 

- The .5m Odin Gold XLR balanced between DAC and amp have about 740 hours on them. 
- Odin Gold 1.5m power cord about 600 hours on them.

Let me set a bit of a stage.  The first power cord I got was a 1.2m Nordost Odin 2 that is on the PC.  After that burned in I told Doug I really liked the power cable but thought that too much silver would be too over the top pushing the system so far toward neutral I would not like it or recommend it.  I felt this would be the case because I have experienced a lot of silver cables (mostly high end) in the past and this was usually what happened.  Much of my system now (including Ethernet and SPDIF) is with the Odin 2 or Odin Gold. The push of the presentation toward neutral is not as much as I thought it would be.   I like a warmer, organic and more inviting presentation.  Everyone has different taste and gear.  But whatever someone's taste may be, synergy is always the key for optimal performance.  This hold true no matter the performance level of gear.  To illustrate, I have heard 2-Channel home systems that cost north of $100K that made my ears bleed, just horrible and painful.   Then I have heard $30K 2-channel system that sounded inviting and just yah.  Once gear is fairly well matched, power delivery done well, etc., this is where cabling can help make or break the overall presentation of the system.   

With the above said, before buying a bunch of cables mentioned in this thread randomly because of price, I have a recommendation.  First, know or decide what is the sonic presentation you want from your system, or improve from what you have now?  And you can always buy one cable, try it and go from there.  You may want to lean more toward Odin 2 or Odin Gold, or possibly a mix.  They sound different and will change the presentation of your system. Ask for recommendations before purchase, many in a short time from now, I am sure will have experienced a few of the cables mentioned in this thread.

What I hear now from my system compared to when I first installed the cables is drastically different.  What a new Odin 2 or Odin Gold XLR interconnect or power cord inserted to system sounds very different than after burn-in of 600 hours or so.  Here are the main differences I experienced with all of the Odin 2 or Odin Gold cabling:

- Starts with incoherence in some frequency ranges.  During break-in, this incoherence and fluctuation of db changes within frequencies ranges.  Bass impact and level is all over the place, this is for the entire bass frequency region.  Vocals are meh at best.

- At 300 hours or so there is a balancing of the frequency range.  Micro detail, note texture, decay, separation and timbre improvement starts.  Sound Stage starts to open up.

- Between the 300 hour and 500 hour mark PRAT is improved, sound stage becomes more holographic, can start to hear the environment of the recording like echo of notes off of walls, etc.  Note decay improvement, vocal placement and clarity improving.  Detail or resolution across the entire frequency spectrum just gets better and better.  

- Between the 500 hour mark and 600 hours+ is for a lack of a better explanation when whatever I am listening to starts to feel more like a live presentation.  On my setup because of the gear I have, feels like I am in the middle of it, like edge of the front center of the stage.  If listening to fast EDM like 135+ bpm techno, you are at the rave kind of feeling.  Complete 360 degrees happening around me, in the middle of it experience.  

- 600+ hours in, detail retrieval is quite impressive, for any price cables I have heard (without doing anything wrong).  Everything is extremely coherent, great PRAT.  Vocals are very good, male or female.  Any upper silver HF glare completely gone.  Really nice timbre, feels realistic, does not leave me wanting or needing  more or a change.

The above burn-in is super obvious, no having to wonder if it is placebo.  During the first 100 hours when your system goes from more bass than you thought your system capable and than 12 hours later there is almost no bass, you will know the burn-in is happening and it is real.  In summary, after burn-in these cables are a stellar value.   Highly recommended.  In my experience cables that perform this well usually cost over $1000 a cable.  At the prices we can buy these cables for blows my mind.


----------



## musicinmymind

cdacosta said:


> *Here is an update on the latest Odin Gold cables added to the system and burn-in after 600 hours. *
> 
> - The .5m Odin Gold XLR balanced between DAC and amp have about 740 hours on them.
> - Odin Gold 1.5m power cord about 600 hours on them.
> ...



So which one you liked more, Odin2 or Gold?


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Please explain, I'm not familiar with Jay's Audio.
> 
> I've seen some of the products on aliexpress but don't know much about it.


Jay's makes CD transports primarily and I believe they also had some linear PS units branded as Jay's Audio earlier on. They're also based out of China.


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> So which one you liked more, Odin2 or Gold?


For the XLR balanced interconnects and power cords I like the Odin 2 and Odin Gold equally.  As mentioned several times in the thread, the two models offer something different.  Which I would prefer, would depend on what I wanted to accomplish from changing or addition of a cable.  If I want ultimate resolution and speed, this would be the Odin 2 series.  If I want a sweeter (not darker) and slightly warmer presentation I would go with the Odin Gold.  

I have gone through, owned and experienced tens of thousands worth of cables throughout the years.  Assuming one has decent or better cables, synergy is key to the overall presentation. Here is another way to look at this.  If you have a piece of gear like an amp that is dry and or bright, and you want to add some warmth or sweeten the overall presentation, the Odin Gold is likely better suited for that application.  If the amp leaned more warm and you want to improve resolution and speed, likely Odin 2 will be the best choice.  I think the Odin Gold is more universal.  I use both in my system.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> *Here is an update on the latest Odin Gold cables added to the system and burn-in after 600 hours. *
> 
> - The .5m Odin Gold XLR balanced between DAC and amp have about 740 hours on them.
> - Odin Gold 1.5m power cord about 600 hours on them.
> ...


Epic post, thank you for that!


----------



## musicinmymind

cdacosta said:


> For the XLR balanced interconnects and power cords I like the Odin 2 and Odin Gold equally.  As mentioned several times in the thread, the two models offer something different.  Which I would prefer, would depend on what I wanted to accomplish from changing or addition of a cable.  If I want ultimate resolution and speed, this would be the Odin 2 series.  If I want a sweeter (not darker) and slightly warmer presentation I would go with the Odin Gold.
> 
> I have gone through, owned and experienced tens of thousands worth of cables throughout the years.  Assuming one has decent or better cables, synergy is key to the overall presentation. Here is another way to look at this.  If you have a piece of gear like an amp that is dry and or bright, and you want to add some warmth or sweeten the overall presentation, the Odin Gold is likely better suited for that application.  If the amp leaned more warm and you want to improve resolution and speed, likely Odin 2 will be the best choice.  I think the Odin Gold is more universal.  I use both in my system.



Thanks for valuable suggestion, just one more question what is PC from your post.

"The first power cord I got was a 1.2m Nordost Odin 2 that is on the *PC"*


----------



## szore

musicinmymind said:


> Thanks for valuable suggestion, just one more question what is PC from your post.
> 
> "The first power cord I got was a 1.2m Nordost Odin 2 that is on the *PC"*


Personal Computer


----------



## musicinmymind

szore said:


> Personal Computer



Got it, for burn-in of the cable.

I got it confused for Power cord


----------



## FredA

Just got my od2 0.5m usb cable. First impression : painfully bad compared to my Nimak Purple. As if i had downgraded the dac. I am stunt. I will let it cook a bit.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Epic post, thank you for that!


My pleasure, hope it is helpful.


----------



## cdacosta

Personal computer, which I use as the source component to the headphone system all of these cables are used.


----------



## szore

FredA said:


> Just got my od2 0.5m usb cable. First impression : painfully bad compared to my Nimak Purple. As if i had downgraded the dac. I am stunt. I will let it cook a bit.


Ouch mine will be delivered in a few days....let us know


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> Just got my od2 0.5m usb cable. First impression : painfully bad compared to my Nimak Purple. As if i had downgraded the dac. I am stunt. I will let it cook a bit.


I personally do not use USB, but am curious as to which USB cable you purchased?  I believe Doug has or have used a USB variant, possibly he can share his experience as to any burn-in with the cable?  Or possibly performance of the Nordost Odin USB cables?


----------



## dougms3

Well that nimak purple cable is listed as 6N pure silver so an odin usb probably won't outperform that one.


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> I personally do not use USB, but am curious as to which USB cable you purchased?  I believe Doug has or have used a USB variant, possibly he can share his experience as to any burn-in with the cable?  Or possibly performance of the Nordost Odin USB cables?


Speaking of the odin2. Also, it is very stiff. I should have gone for 0.75m.


----------



## msing539

I have the silver Odin 2 silver USB cable--initially, it's bright and almost a little harsh. It settles down after a week or so.


----------



## FredA (Aug 5, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Well that nimak purple cable is listed as 6N pure silver so an odin usb probably won't outperform that one.


Probably not.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> I have the silver Odin 2 silver USB cable--initially, it's bright and almost a little harsh. It settles down after a week or so.


Curious as to how many hours of signal has been through the USB cable? I do not own and have never tried this USB cable.  I am curious as to what the burn-in is like?


----------



## FredA

I put the Nimak back on, things are better but not so much. The streamer had been turned off prior, so that may be the reason.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Curious as to how many hours of signal has been through the USB cable? I do not own and have never tried this USB cable.  I am curious as to what the burn-in is like?


At this point, I conservatively have 200+ hours of signal sent through it. If it's changed over the past two weeks, I have not heard it.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> Speaking of the odin2. Also, it is very stiff. I should have gone for 0.75m.


Your sharing of comparing a $40ish USB cable vs a $600 USB cable you currently have will be interesting to many.  It is possible that the Nimak Purple is a cable better suited in your system.  Time will tell.

As an aside, all pure silver or silver coated (especially when heavily coated like these Nordost cables) sound unlistenable when new.  They have a crazy long break-in period.  That is why in this thread alone I have spent hours describing and mentioning break-in.  To help prepare whoever is going to try the XLR interconnects and power cables.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> At this point, I conservatively have 200+ hours of signal sent through it. If it's changed over the past two weeks, I have not heard it.





msing539 said:


> I have the silver Odin 2 silver USB cable--initially, it's bright and almost a little harsh. It settles down after a week or so.


So aside the slight brightness and harshness that settled down, within the first 200 hours that was the only changes you experienced?

The reason I ask is to understand for future reference.  The Odin 2 SPDIF cable I have had a burn-in but was mild compared to the interconnects.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> So aside the slight brightness and harshness that settled down, within the first 200 hours that was the only changes you experienced?
> 
> The reason I ask is to understand for future reference.  The Odin 2 SPDIF cable I have had a burn-in but was mild compared to the interconnects.


In my setup, that was the only change I noticed with the usb cable. I don't leave it running unattended though--I'm always listening, so it's possible there were more changes over time.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> In my setup, that was the only change I noticed with the usb cable. I don't leave it running unattended though--I'm always listening, so it's possible there were more changes over time.


Ok, allow me to understand what you wrote.  Is the 200 hours after 200 hours of signal through the cable or 200 hours of time?

For clarity, when I reference an amount of time say 300 hours of burn-in, I am referring to 300 hours of signal through the cable.  Not 300 hours of time of the cable being installed onto gear.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Ok, allow me to understand what you wrote.  Is the 200 hours after 200 hours of signal through the cable or 200 hours of time?
> 
> For clarity, when I reference an amount of time say 300 hours of burn-in, I am referring to 300 hours of signal through the cable.  Not 300 hours of time of the cable being installed onto gear.


200+ hours of signal from PC to DDC going through the USB. I've had this cable since June.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Your sharing of comparing a $40ish USB cable vs a $600 USB cable you currently have will be interesting to many.  It is possible that the Nimak Purple is a cable better suited in your system.  Time will tell.
> 
> As an aside, all pure silver or silver coated (especially when heavily coated like these Nordost cables) sound unlistenable when new.  They have a crazy long break-in period.  That is why in this thread alone I have spent hours describing and mentioning break-in.  To help prepare whoever is going to try the XLR interconnects and power cables.


Don't forget the teflon / ptfe, it seems to prolong the burn in time as well.  Maybe because its such a strong dielectric has something to do with it? 🤷‍♂️

I've also noticed that the higher end solder like that mundorf supreme silver/gold takes a really long time to burn in.  Whatever they're using as solder its probably not anywhere near as good as the mundorf, plus they use that gel insulator.  

Perhaps this is why the odin power cables have a stronger effect, because they don't use any solder on the terminations.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> Don't forget the teflon / ptfe, it seems to prolong the burn in time as well.  Maybe because its such a strong dielectric has something to do with it? 🤷‍♂️
> 
> I've also noticed that the higher end solder like that mundorf supreme silver/gold takes a really long time to burn in.  Whatever they're using as solder its probably not anywhere near as good as the mundorf, plus they use that gel insulator.
> 
> Perhaps this is why the odin power cables have a stronger effect, because they don't use any solder on the terminations.


I enjoy the Odin power cords with my digital gears. I don't use them with analog devices though.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> I enjoy the Odin power cords with my digital gears. I don't use them with analog devices though.


I only have one odin power cord.  I've been too lazy to swap around and test where it sounds the best.

I was going to do it once that gryphon knockoff came in but its probably still gonna be a week or two.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> I only have one odin power cord.  I've been too lazy to swap around and test where it sounds the best.
> 
> I was going to do it once that gryphon knockoff came in but its probably still gonna be a week or two.


Wait...there a Gryphon knockoff...?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Wait...there a Gryphon knockoff...?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832690032612.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.7b2b1802Z8Kn1C

Yeah, I wanted to test it out since the odin and argento knockoffs worked out well.

Reviews looked promising, not from this seller but from other listings.  If I don't get lazy, I'll open it up and take pics of the wiring.

The gold odin is nice but sometimes too many of the those in my system will probably make it more neutral with accentuated top end.  I wanted to tilt my system to warm and bassy with rich mids, I've found that heavy gauge, high quality copper or little bit of gold mixed in with silver adds body and richness to the the sound.

The power cable on my audio-gd m19 amp is this furutech fp-s55n with furutech fi-46 gold iec and fi-46 ac plug.










I was going for max warmth and bass, since my audio-gd m19 veers towards neutral, clinical.  It worked but it didn't add as much as I anticipated, but if I had more than one of those on my system, I think it'd be too much.  It works really well on my m19 but not so good on the Denafrips ares.  

Again, if I don't get lazy I'll do a comparison once I get the gryphon cable.  I really hate swapping these power cables around because they're usually crazy heavy, stiff and its in a tight space.  On more than one occasion, I've hit myself in the face with one of those connectors and well lets just say I'm lucky to have all my teeth.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832690032612.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.7b2b1802Z8Kn1C
> 
> Yeah, I wanted to test it out since the odin and argento knockoffs worked out well.
> 
> ...


Synergy is key.  Cables for many reasons sound different.  Once cables are burned in then experimenting with location/component will yield differing results.  I have enough experience with cables that I can make an educated guess. But I am still guessing, never know until you try it.  Power cable on one component will yield different results when used on a different component.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832690032612.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.7b2b1802Z8Kn1C
> 
> Yeah, I wanted to test it out since the odin and argento knockoffs worked out well.
> 
> ...


I like a particular knockoff (mythical creature) with my audio-gd pre /hp amp and power amp. Not cheap but worth the expense IMO. Stiff as a stick though.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832690032612.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.7b2b1802Z8Kn1C
> 
> Yeah, I wanted to test it out since the odin and argento knockoffs worked out well.
> 
> ...


Oh, great post but I thought you meant the Gryphon DAP, lol...


----------



## Zaek

The more expensive version of Nordost odin gold looks very much alike with the authentic version. The wires are thicker but the price is too expensive to try


----------



## szore

How much is it? How do I find it, what's it's name?


----------



## Zaek

szore said:


> How much is it? How do I find it, what's it's name?


check out RM Digital Store


----------



## Zaek

Based on what was shared here and the photo at RM digital store. The wires look different


----------



## szore

well, I'm not sure, but I think that is the very end that is attatched to the actual plug, so it's legit. I'm counting 7 wires; 3 pos 3 neg 1 ground...


----------



## Zaek

I am not complaining. For this price, the performance is outstanding. I am just curious if there is another knockoff version that is even better,.. hahha


----------



## szore

I just bought a 1.5M Odin Gold power cable... Not sure how I'm going to use it...i guess the best place would be between the power conditioner (when I get it) and the wall...and I can put the Odin 2 silver on the PC, amp, and dac...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I just bought a 1.5M Odin Gold power cable... Not sure how I'm going to use it...i guess the best place would be between the power conditioner (when I get it) and the wall...and I can put the Odin 2 silver on the PC, amp, and dac...


Will be interesting to know how you feel the whole system performs when it is all broken in?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Will be interesting to know how you feel the whole system performs when it is all broken in?


It's going to be epic, heck it already is epic. Maybe the gold should go on the DAC...not to mention the liquid, that will be the icing on the cake, i'll save that for last!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> It's going to be epic, heck it already is epic. Maybe the gold should go on the DAC...not to mention the liquid, that will be the icing on the cake, i'll save that for last!


LMAO, if you like it now...

* You will be thrilled after all cables break-in and your gear stabilize with the cables.  
* Then your mind gets blown after the Furutech Nano Liquid full treatment!  The smile on your face will get stuck in stupid mode.  You will then understand why I keep recommending the Nano Liquid.


----------



## szore

The last day the mids have now become a tad shouty, but it seems to be passing. Bass is excellent, great precision and slam...


----------



## szore (Aug 6, 2022)

Look what just came....Odin USB... I notice an immediet improvement over the black dragon...there is more air now and more clarity!  whao also the bass just went through the roof! mids are more layered and the soundstage has really expanded...the mids have been transformed...I never imagined a usb could make such a impact...shows how crappy black dragon is too, over priced...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The last day the mids have now become a tad shouty, but it seems to be passing. Bass is excellent, great precision and slam...


How far along time wise is the burn-in?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Look what just came....Odin USB... I notice an immediet improvement over the black dragon...there is more air now and more clarity!  whao also the bass just went through the roof! mids are more layered and the soundstage has really expanded...the mids have been transformed...I never imagined a usb could make such a impact...shows how crappy black dragon is too, over priced...


I have only experienced Moon Audio Black Dragon cables during A/B while experimenting with higher end cabling.  This is why I was curious as to how you felt they compared to the clone Nordost Odin series.  Never listened to a system with their USB cable though.  From memory, of my impression of Black Dragon cabling, is it reminded me a lot of lower end Cardas cables.  Does nothing wrong, nothing stands out, enhances nothing specifically, leaned a tad to warm signature.  A tad veiled compared to higher end cables.  For a budget really bright setup they can help, this is where I would assume they fit best.  Your setup, Ares II DAC and Jotunheim 2 amp, Black Dragon cabling I would assume would be a tad too mellow to be optimal to mate between components unless it was used to balance other aspects of the system.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have only experienced Moon Audio Black Dragon cables during A/B while experimenting with higher end cabling.  This is why I was curious as to how you felt they compared to the clone Nordost Odin series.  Never listened to a system with their USB cable though.  From memory, of my impression of Black Dragon cabling, is it reminded me a lot of lower end Cardas cables.  Does nothing wrong, nothing stands out, enhances nothing specifically, leaned a tad to warm signature.  A tad veiled compared to higher end cables.  For a budget really bright setup they can help, this is where I would assume they fit best.  Your setup, Ares II DAC and Jotunheim 2 amp, Black Dragon cabling I would assume would be a tad too mellow to be optimal to mate between components unless it was used to balance other aspects of the system.


Yes, the music electrified a little with the new USB Odin!


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> How far along time wise is the burn-in?


1st Odin 2 cable I got now has a solid 400 Hours on it, its on the AMP...the other 2 Odin 2 cables and the gold XLR have about 200 on them...


----------



## szore




----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> 1st Odin 2 cable I got now has a solid 400 Hours on it, its on the AMP...the other 2 Odin 2 cables and the gold XLR have about 200 on them...


Yah, if your experience is anywhere close to mine, will take 300 hours min before the vocals stabilize.  For me the vocal/mid region edginess and kind of flat sounding morphed to a fuller, more solid and detailed presentation around 300 or so hours.  As time went by started to relax and become more natural.  At 500+ hours it starts to get really good.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


>


You probably paid under $300 for those 4 cables.  Crazy performance to value proposition.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


>


I don't have the xlrs just the regular odin 2 rca.

Nice sparkly bits on the connectors


----------



## Zaek

szore said:


>


Interesting, the wording on my xlr is white. Yrs is black.. Seems like there are some variants out there


szore said:


> Look what just came....Odin USB... I notice an immediet improvement over the black dragon...there is more air now and more clarity!  whao also the bass just went through the roof! mids are more layered and the soundstage has really expanded...the mids have been transformed...I never imagined a usb could make such a impact...shows how crappy black dragon is too, over priced...


nice. How is the quality of the connector? Saw some negative comments that the plug won't lock in securely to equipment. Some cable movement will cause the connector to dislodge from the equipment.. is it true?


----------



## szore

Zaek said:


> Interesting, the wording on my xlr is white. Yrs is black.. Seems like there are some variants out there
> 
> nice. How is the quality of the connector? Saw some negative comments that the plug won't lock in securely to equipment. Some cable movement will cause the connector to dislodge from the equipment.. is it true?


The gold xlr does not lock in, that's true, but the connection seems snug enough...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The gold xlr does not lock in, that's true, but the connection seems snug enough...


For those wondering, of all the Nordost Odin 2, and Gold cables I have which are:

* Odin 2 Ethernet
* Odin 2 digital SPDIF
* Odin 2 Power Cord
* Odin Gold Power Cord
* Odin Gold XLR balanced interconnect
* Odin 2 XLR balanced interconnect

The only connector I find wonky and I think is inferior because of design is the WBT connectors on the Odin 2 digital SPDIF cable.  Works, does not disconnect signal but not a fan of it.


----------



## szore

This Odin2 USB cable is really astonishing...took the mids and soundstage to the next level...this is endgame...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> This Odin2 USB cable is really astonishing...took the mids and soundstage to the next level...this is endgame...


Just wait until it all breaks in.  

Then after the Furutech Nano Liquid the timbre, decay, PRAT and organic natural presentation will blow you away.


----------



## szore

Plus I haved the USB plugged into the Element H USB low noise card with seperate power supply, the cable can really shine. The DAC sounds amazing...all of it is just massive. I can hear through the burn in and see where it is going and its already sounding amazing...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Plus I haved the USB plugged into the Element H USB low noise card with seperate power supply, the cable can really shine. The DAC sounds amazing...all of it is just massive. I can hear through the burn in and see where it is going and its already sounding amazing...


During burn-in you will hear glimpses of what will be.  It won't be until burn-in is closer to completing that it will all snap in place.  The burn-in process actually sucks because sonically the system is all over the place.  But the process does offer an education.  Cables and component parts do require a break-in period.


----------



## dougms3

@FredA 

Any update on the odin 2 usb cable?

Have you had more time to compare vs the nimak cable?


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> @FredA
> 
> Any update on the odin 2 usb cable?
> 
> Have you had more time to compare vs the nimak cable?


I gave up on it for now, i really got too short a cable. I fear for the connectors.


----------



## Zaek

cdacosta said:


> During burn-in you will hear glimpses of what will be.  It won't be until burn-in is closer to completing that it will all snap in place.  The burn-in process actually sucks because sonically the system is all over the place.  But the process does offer an education.  Cables and component parts do require a break-in period.


It is really painful to wait for the burn in. Been one week since I got my cables (~50 hours burn in), there is a bass bump somewhere. 
Gonna take a long while to get it to 500 hours.


----------



## Gazza

Burn-in is indeed a major pain. I received my STAX SR-009 back from repair the other day after getting new drivers installed (and new leather pads), which makes them a brand new headphone pretty much. Not only do they need a thorough burn-in (they had a ghastly peaky glare in the mids that is slowly going away) but the Gold ODIN 2 plugged into my WOO energizer also needs burning in. Gonna be a while. Hopefully everything in my system is bedded in by the time my new Western Electric 300Bs arrive in a couple of weeks so they can be assessed on their own merits.


----------



## szore

Gazza said:


> Burn-in is indeed a major pain. I received my STAX SR-009 back from repair the other day after getting new drivers installed (and new leather pads), which makes them a brand new headphone pretty much. Not only do they need a thorough burn-in (they had a ghastly peaky glare in the mids that is slowly going away) but the Gold ODIN 2 plugged into my WOO energizer also needs burning in. Gonna be a while. Hopefully everything in my system is bedded in by the time my new Western Electric 300Bs arrive in a couple of weeks so they can be assessed on their own merits.


Everything in my system is burning in, the entire chain! I feel you!


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> I gave up on it for now, i really got too short a cable. I fear for the connectors.


Will be interested to hear how it compares to a higher end cable like the nimak if you ever get the chance.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> It is really painful to wait for the burn in. Been one week since I got my cables (~50 hours burn in), there is a bass bump somewhere.
> Gonna take a long while to get it to 500 hours.


You should of seen my surprise 20+ years ago when I first learned such a thing as burn-in being real.  Building a high end home theater/music system and prototyping high end cables.  One singular power cord made my system sound like crap and all over the place for 2 weeks. I was shocked such a thing was possible.  How about a A/C outlet doing the same thing to a system, mind blown.

What I learned is the more a cable will effect the system the more it usually will offer it sonically.  Generally the higher end cables it effects more, not a $3 free power cord that comes with your gear.  Here is the good news:

1) One learns to hear for these changes and learn how cables can and cannot effect a system and the role it plays.  
2) Once fully burned in, these Odin 2 and Odin Gold cables are quite impressive, shockingly so for the money.  The more revealing a system, the more these cables shine.  In my humble experience and opinion one can spend upwards of $1000+ and not get the performance of what these under $100 cables offer.  Been there and done that.
3) Learn patience, 25 or so days of 24/7 and the burn in is just about complete.  I have over 600 hours on all my cables now and they seem to still be improving.


----------



## cdacosta

Gazza said:


> Burn-in is indeed a major pain. I received my STAX SR-009 back from repair the other day after getting new drivers installed (and new leather pads), which makes them a brand new headphone pretty much. Not only do they need a thorough burn-in (they had a ghastly peaky glare in the mids that is slowly going away) but the Gold ODIN 2 plugged into my WOO energizer also needs burning in. Gonna be a while. Hopefully everything in my system is bedded in by the time my new Western Electric 300Bs arrive in a couple of weeks so they can be assessed on their own merits.


Oh yah, when burning in cables and gear at the same time it makes it worse  LOL.  I have learned to ignore/not judge the system until a specified amount of signal is through the system.  Keeps me sane instead of getting irritated or concerned.


----------



## Zaek

I wish Aliexpress sell a cable burner at an affordable price. 😄


----------



## cdacosta

Now you all know why from the first post on in this thread I keep mentioning "burn-in" with these cables.  Many have not experienced this phenomenon.  It is real and just be prepared for it.   I laugh when I read or see in a YouTube video stating as fact that "cable burn-in" is placebo.  Also that "cables make no difference or cannot make a difference", again a placebo effect.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> I wish Aliexpress sell a cable burner at an affordable price. 😄


No kidding.  I have two but both are in storage and cannot find either when I went to look for them.  Too many boxes to go through.  A nice cable burner like a Audioharma was about $1200 back in the day.  An absolute necessity when I used to build and prototype cables for designers.


----------



## dougms3

Anyone have the all gold odin 2 power cable?

I guess there are 2 versions of it.  

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804383313954.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.200338da0npt1W&mp=1

This is what I bought.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804094581749.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.257338daQDxtvf&mp=1

Man, these guys are cutthroat with the prices, get it while the gettins good.


----------



## Zaek (Aug 10, 2022)

Can't view those links u posted.

From what I see on Aliexpress, the more expensive version like having thicker core wires inside. Similar to the original Nordost.
But the price is too expensive to try.


----------



## dougms3

Not expensive anymore


----------



## Zaek

I already ordered 2 more Odin Gold powercord from Getwire (on its way), otherwise would have try this seller.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> No kidding.  I have two but both are in storage and cannot find either when I went to look for them.  Too many boxes to go through.  A nice cable burner like a Audioharma was about $1200 back in the day.  An absolute necessity when I used to build and prototype cables for designers.


lol, Are you an engineer? you talk like one!


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Not expensive anymore


I guess I was the last sucker to pay US $232.75 for one....


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Anyone have the all gold odin 2 power cable?
> 
> I guess there are 2 versions of it.
> 
> ...


How can this cable just be $50 now?


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 10, 2022)

szore said:


> How can this cable just be $50 now?


It's the cutthroat practice of undercutting each other on price till everyone loses money. 

Don't feel too bad i also paid alot more for mine since i bought it a while ago.

That's why i say get it while the gettins good.


----------



## musicinmymind

dougms3 said:


> It's the cutthroat practice of undercutting each other on price till everyone loses money.
> 
> Don't feel too bad i also paid alot more for mine since i bought it a while ago.
> 
> That's why i say get it while the gettins good.



whatever could be competition, no one can sell below manufacture + other cost. 
These cables could be worth only manufacture cost of 20$


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> whatever could be competition, no one can sell below manufacture + other cost.
> These cables could be worth only manufacture cost of 20$


Obviously they would not sell to lose money.

It seems like almost all of these sellers are middle men and place an order for the cable to one of the larger sellers/manufacturers.  

They are undercutting each other by the week on pricing, still enough to make money but their margins are shrinking.  

I used to sell online for a long time and the Chinese sellers are notorious for doing this.  At a certain point they don't care if they lose money, they just want to "win".


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> lol, Are you an engineer? you talk like one!


LOL no, I am in sales.  I do have a very analytical mind.  I got into hifi as a serious hobby in the late 90s.  Got hooked and the bug is still there.  I just enjoy music.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> How can this cable just be $50 now?


I paid $87.86 shipped for a 1.5m.  They were all $250+ and I just waited until I saw deal to get one to try.  On the Jotunheim 2 now.  I think I posted pics in this thread of the conductors and connectors disassembled before I cleaned it all and applied the Nano Liquid.


----------



## szore

I asked the guy who sold me the gold cable why is it now $50? He said it is not the same cable. Intresting...so I asked what the difference was but I have yet to hear from him. He may not want to reveal his secret or he may just be lying, lol...


----------



## Zaek

Many years back, my friends bought the Odin2 knock-off powercord and some NFC connectors to try. He commented that SQ is really bad and not worth the money. 
In the end, he bought some loose wires (for valhalla) and made some powercords himself.. The result was quite alright. I even bought one from my friend.

Really didn't expect the quality to improve after seeing this thread. Decided to give it a shot and was very surprised.


----------



## szore

So this was his answer....

_First of all, the gold shielding is made of gold foil paper. It is not a metal material, and the shielding effect is poor. Second, the conductor is not single crystal copper silver plated, and the conductor is thinner



_


----------



## Zaek

szore said:


> So this was his answer....
> 
> _First of all, the gold shielding is made of gold foil paper. It is not a metal material, and the shielding effect is poor. Second, the conductor is not single crystal copper silver plated, and the conductor is thinner
> 
> _


This is the version most of us bought right? I do agree that the shield is not so great. My original nordost has a blacker background


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> So this was his answer....
> 
> _First of all, the gold shielding is made of gold foil paper. It is not a metal material, and the shielding effect is poor. Second, the conductor is not single crystal copper silver plated, and the conductor is thinner
> 
> _


He better be willing to take the pepsi challenge with that claim, because I'll tear mine apart to prove him wrong.  If he's wrong he owes me a new cable.  See if he'll take that bet.

What conductor size does he claim his to be?


----------



## szore

Well, Its the RM Digital Store, you can ask him yourself, he's friendly.


----------



## szore

Zaek said:


> This is the version most of us bought right? I do agree that the shield is not so great. My original nordost has a blacker background


He's saying the $50 version thats up on aliexpress is inferior. I paid like $230 for mine from him.


----------



## DenverW

szore said:


> He's saying the $50 version thats up on aliexpress is inferior. I paid like $230 for mine from him.


It stands to reason that the more expensive cable would have a better build quality.  However, it ALSO stands to reason that if I were selling a $230 cable that had a $50 competitor, I would absolutely say it was inferior, too.  I'd love to get more on this!


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Many years back, my friends bought the Odin2 knock-off powercord and some NFC connectors to try. He commented that SQ is really bad and not worth the money.
> In the end, he bought some loose wires (for valhalla) and made some powercords himself.. The result was quite alright. I even bought one from my friend.
> 
> Really didn't expect the quality to improve after seeing this thread. Decided to give it a shot and was very surprised.


I here you.  I never would have considered trying Chinese made cables until a couple of clients of mine goated me into it.  They own original Nordost Odin 2 power cables and told me they 95%+ of the originals.  They said not as resolving but a bit more musical at a tiny fraction of the price.  They use them on their Classe monoblocks powering Wilson speakers.  This is how it started for me.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> He's saying the $50 version thats up on aliexpress is inferior. I paid like $230 for mine from him.


I agree with DenverW.  I would have to inspect them side by side.


----------



## DenverW

So the word on the street is that my dac would benefit from a good silver rca cable.  I've gone through the thread and looked at the odin 2 but a lot of the links are dead (looks like aliexpress sellers change their pages often).  Would anyone be able to link me a standard RCA cable they might recommend?  I'm currently using a DIY duelund cable which has been treating me fine, but you don't know what you're missing until you try, right?


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 11, 2022)

DenverW said:


> So the word on the street is that my dac would benefit from a good silver rca cable.  I've gone through the thread and looked at the odin 2 but a lot of the links are dead (looks like aliexpress sellers change their pages often).  Would anyone be able to link me a standard RCA cable they might recommend?  I'm currently using a DIY duelund cable which has been treating me fine, but you don't know what you're missing until you try, right?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804204638255.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.43d238daj8xyo2&mp=1






This seller seems to be the cheapest I could find right now.

This is the silver one I got, price seems to have gone up since I bought it though.  May want to shop around on that one.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...st.0.0.21ef18021zwczQ&gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt


----------



## cdacosta

DenverW said:


> So the word on the street is that my dac would benefit from a good silver rca cable.  I've gone through the thread and looked at the odin 2 but a lot of the links are dead (looks like aliexpress sellers change their pages often).  Would anyone be able to link me a standard RCA cable they might recommend?  I'm currently using a DIY duelund cable which has been treating me fine, but you don't know what you're missing until you try, right?


Are you wanting a cable for your Audio Mirror Tubadour III SE DAC?  If yes, I can understand why a silver cable was recommended for you to try.  Could bring out resolution depth.  Around late 2018, I briefly heard a system with that DAC in the chain.  Was awhile ago and we played with a lot of gear and cables that day.  What are you hoping to achieve by replacing your current DIY Duelund SE interconnects?  

Duelund interconnect wire from my limited experience experimenting with them is warmish, mid level detail retrieval, good midrange, not exciting and a tad on slow side.  Connectors and solder will change the end sonic signature of the cable.  Does this description sound like the cable you have?


----------



## Zaek

These came in today. Full loom of Knock-dost Gold. Burning in!


----------



## szore (Aug 11, 2022)

Has anyone tried, or have knowledge of these and how to use them?

HiFi Audio Cable Ground Loop Noise Isolator Filter GND Black Hole Eliminate Static Electricity Saver Power Purifier Electronic​


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> These came in today. Full loom of Knock-dost Gold. Burning in!


Oh boy, the burn-in fun begins!


----------



## endless402

Zaek said:


> These came in today. Full loom of Knock-dost Gold. Burning in!


ansuz power distributor! hardcore


----------



## Ficcion2

Screw it. The prices were too good to pass up on the gold Nords.
I got 2 PCs; one for my conditioner and the other for my DAC.
Also the matching XLRs even though I just bought new cables about a month ago.

The only thing I’m not feeling are the blocks. Has anyone taken them off?


----------



## szore

Something just clicked in my desktop...suddenly it went next level...my cables are all at different stages of burn in so its interesting to see the final output...but yes, suddenly its as if a veil was lifted...3d holographic now, superior imaging...still distorted, but its on its way...


----------



## cdacosta

Ficcion2 said:


> Screw it. The prices were too good to pass up on the gold Nords.
> I got 2 PCs; one for my conditioner and the other for my DAC.
> Also the matching XLRs even though I just bought new cables about a month ago.
> 
> The only thing I’m not feeling are the blocks. Has anyone taken them off?


Same here, but since I do not look at the cables the wood does not bother me.  You can remove the wood on a power cable.  By sliding them off one end if you remove one of the connectors from the cable.  I could have done this with the Odin Gold when I took the ends off to treat with Furutech Nano Liquid.  I did not think of it at the time.


----------



## dougms3

Ficcion2 said:


> Screw it. The prices were too good to pass up on the gold Nords.
> I got 2 PCs; one for my conditioner and the other for my DAC.
> Also the matching XLRs even though I just bought new cables about a month ago.
> 
> The only thing I’m not feeling are the blocks. Has anyone taken them off?


Even if you don't like the way they look, they may still be functional.

I believe the wood is there to counter some of the noise from the oscillation at the 60hz frequency, even if its not the highest quality wood, it may help somewhat to reduce noise.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Something just clicked in my desktop...suddenly it went next level...my cables are all at different stages of burn in so its interesting to see the final output...but yes, suddenly its as if a veil was lifted...3d holographic now, superior imaging...still distorted, but its on its way...


As time goes by, the cables will develop more and more.  Every one of these 6 cables I have went through the same thing.  And the cables are all different types.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Even if you don't like the way they look, they may still be functional.
> 
> I believe the wood is there to counter some of the noise from the oscillation at the 60hz frequency, even if its not the highest quality wood, it may help somewhat to reduce noise.


Interesting you mention that.  As you know I have experimented with exotic woods.  Usually sliding the wood up and down the length of the cable will result in slightly different sonic changes, depending on the wood.  On these cables sliding the wood along the length of the cable does nothing sonically.


----------



## Guipnox

I'm about to pull the trigger on my first Odin 2 cable.
Going for a coaxial first.
Which do you guys recommend?
Is this one good?
https://a.aliexpress.com/_mtnpwJI
Thanks!


----------



## dougms3

Guipnox said:


> I'm about to pull the trigger on my first Odin 2 cable.
> Going for a coaxial first.
> Which do you guys recommend?
> Is this one good?
> ...


I bought this one.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803967512562.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802BV1quv

It sounds great.  I bought the odin 1 first, don't waste your money with that, the odin 2 sounds much better.  I haven't tried that particular version that you posted.  The one I have has knockoff wbt silver connectors.

Which coax are you currently using ?


----------



## Guipnox

dougms3 said:


> I bought this one.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803967512562.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802BV1quv
> 
> ...


Thanks, dougms3.
I'm using a cheap generic coaxial cable from AliExpress lol
And my setup is already sounding awesome (to my ears).
But I know there's more to it.
Gonna improve slowly though because I spent too much already.


----------



## dougms3

Guipnox said:


> Thanks, dougms3.
> I'm using a cheap generic coaxial cable from AliExpress lol
> And my setup is already sounding awesome (to my ears).
> But I know there's more to it.
> Gonna improve slowly though because I spent too much already.


I'm sure either one is going to be a huge improvement over that generic cable.  You'll see.


----------



## cdacosta

Guipnox said:


> I'm about to pull the trigger on my first Odin 2 cable.
> Going for a coaxial first.
> Which do you guys recommend?
> Is this one good?
> ...


That cable looks different than the one I got so cannot comment.  Below is the one I got and it is a very good cable.  Only caveat is the WBT locking connectors are wonky to work with.  I prefer the Nordost Odin 2 connectors in your link.  Study the wire, if it looks the same I would get the one in the link you provided.  If you want a cable that someone is using and likes the performance, get the one I got.

Here is the one I have:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...st.0.0.1bd61802b9OIp1&gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> That cable looks different than the one I got so cannot comment.  Below is the one I got and it is a very good cable.  Only caveat is the WBT locking connectors are wonky to work with.  I prefer the Nordost Odin 2 connectors in your link.  Study the wire, if it looks the same I would get the one in the link you provided.  If you want a cable that someone is using and likes the performance, get the one I got.
> 
> Here is the one I have:
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...st.0.0.1bd61802b9OIp1&gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt


That one looks different from mine, it has the copper wbt knockoffs, mine has the silver wbt knockoffs.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I bought this one.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803967512562.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802BV1quv
> 
> ...


LOL the one you have is the same as mine but with a different piece of wood.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> That one looks different from mine, it has the copper wbt knockoffs, mine has the silver wbt knockoffs.


Actually the one I have came with the silver WBT connectors.  That pic is off their site.


----------



## Guipnox

dougms3 said:


> I bought this one.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803967512562.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802BV1quv
> 
> ...


I bought this one.
I think I'm safe. 
1.5m because why not.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 11, 2022)

Well guys, you can count me in on the Furutech Nano Liquid club - an exclusive or lucky club, or even experimental? I for one believe it can make a difference in sound, based off what I've read here. I will even try it on the contacts of my tube pins, maybe I will be a first. But maybe I will just have to keep it on this thread, because my hunch is telling me that anywhere else on Head-fi people will just laugh it off  as "snake oil"... and actually that's not too bad of an analogy, considering it's also a liquid - so maybe I will call it Nano Snake Oil, just for kicks, haha. 

I am quite a believer in hacks / tweaks and it's amazing how they can all go together to improve the overall system  performance. I've got numerous things on my system, some of which basically nobody else has such as high quality ferrite clamps inside my amp and on all type of cables, several of your recommended silver / gold cables incoming, the newest iFi iPurifier and iDefender on the way, and now this nano liquid gold on the way too. Good times ahead.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Well guys, you can count me in on the Furutech Nano Liquid club - an exclusive or lucky club, or even experimental? I for one believe it can make a difference in sound, based off what I've read here. I will even try it on the contacts of my tube pins, maybe I will be a first. But maybe I will just have to keep it on this thread, because my hunch is telling me that anywhere else on Head-fi people will just laugh it off  as "snake oil"... and actually that's not too bad of an analogy, considering it's also a liquid - so maybe I will call it Nano Snake Oil, just for kicks, haha.
> 
> I am quite a believer in hacks / tweaks and it's amazing how they can all go together to improve the overall system  performance. I've got numerous things on my system, some of which basically nobody else has such as high quality ferrite clamps inside my amp and on all type of cables, several of your recommended silver / gold cables incoming, the newest iFi iPurifier and iDefender on the way, and now this nano liquid gold on the way too. Good times ahead.


The nano liquid on the tube pins makes a huge difference.  I tried it on my loxjie p20 amp and the effect was very significant.


----------



## DenverW

cdacosta said:


> Are you wanting a cable for your Audio Mirror Tubadour III SE DAC?  If yes, I can understand why a silver cable was recommended for you to try.  Could bring out resolution depth.  Around late 2018, I briefly heard a system with that DAC in the chain.  Was awhile ago and we played with a lot of gear and cables that day.  What are you hoping to achieve by replacing your current DIY Duelund SE interconnects?
> 
> Duelund interconnect wire from my limited experience experimenting with them is warmish, mid level detail retrieval, good midrange, not exciting and a tad on slow side.  Connectors and solder will change the end sonic signature of the cable.  Does this description sound like the cable you have?


I honestly haven't done enough rolling of the rca cable to answer that properly.  I would describe my current system as warm, which I enjoy, but I'll need to do some comparison to really be able to tell.  If there is a bit of slowness and average detail retrieval I was hoping a silver cable would help reveal it.  Then at least I'd have a reference for comparison.  Thanks for answering, i quite enjoy the dac .


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Well guys, you can count me in on the Furutech Nano Liquid club - an exclusive or lucky club, or even experimental? I for one believe it can make a difference in sound, based off what I've read here. I will even try it on the contacts of my tube pins, maybe I will be a first. But maybe I will just have to keep it on this thread, because my hunch is telling me that anywhere else on Head-fi people will just laugh it off  as "snake oil"... and actually that's not too bad of an analogy, considering it's also a liquid - so maybe I will call it Nano Snake Oil, just for kicks, haha.
> 
> I am quite a believer in hacks / tweaks and it's amazing how they can all go together to improve the overall system  performance. I've got numerous things on my system, some of which basically nobody else has such as high quality ferrite clamps inside my amp and on all type of cables, several of your recommended silver / gold cables incoming, the newest iFi iPurifier and iDefender on the way, and now this nano liquid gold on the way too. Good times ahead.


If you have read my posts in this thread there is 3 common themes:
1) The clone Nordost Odin 2 and Odin Gold cables offer a crazy performance to price proposition.
2) The burn-in is long and crazy for the above mentioned cables.   Be ready for that, your system is not broken LOL
3) As a serious hobbyist modding and tweaking audio gear, I have yet to come across a better $ to performance increase to a system than Furutech Nano Liquid.  You can literally upgrade every cable and component in your system with a tiny bottle of this stuff.  The more resolute a system is the better the results, just like cables.

All I ask is that after you try the Nano Liquid and give it 72 hours or so to settle in, if what this stuff does is as good as I mention it is, tell people.   Read and re-read what I wrote about how to clean and apply the Nano Liquid.  Very little of the liquid is needed.  Apply at "all" mechanical connections within your audio system, you will want to and you will be rewarded.

I have used contact enhancers (totally different than cleaners or preservative products like Pro Gold) since at least 2007.  After discussing the topic of contact enhancers with countless industry cable and gear designers in the past I have a theory of why Nano Liquid does what it does.  There are many contact enhancers, most are conductive, kind of pasty in texture (messy) and degrade over time.  How effective they are varies.  Nano Liquid does not exhibit any of those negative traits and is the most effective I have come across.  

So what does Nano Liquid do?  With a single electrical mechanical connection, there are two metal parts coming in contact with each other.  In the context of an audio or video system, this mechanical connection is passing a constant electrical signal/current along the outside of the surface, from one connection to the other.  By the way this is why differing plating sounds different and why audiophiles pay stupid money for highly polished contact products from brands like Furutech and Oyaide.  When we humans look at the surface finish of a conductor we may not be able to see the flaws.  Under a microscope the flaws and inconstancies are obvious.  One can see peaks and valleys across the surface.  When a signal is passed across the first surface to the second of the mechanical connection micro arcing occurs between the mechanical connection.  The signal is bouncing or ricocheting off these irregular surfaces.  I have seen videos of under microscope and lab tests at Livermore Labs of this phenomenon many years ago, when one of the designers of a well regarded contact enhancer manufacturer was doing R&D.  It looks like electrical signals just bouncing back and forth between the connections instead of a smooth hand over of the signal.  What I could see looked crazy like a really distorted signal, instead of a smooth signal.  The human eye cannot see at the speeds of the signal but the lab gear was measuring distortions, loss of signal and so forth.   So back to what does the Nano Liquid do?  The Nano Liquid minimizes the micro arcing by filling the uneven cavities or smooths the surface.  Which in turn passes a purer signal.  So what does this mean within the context of audio? Lowered noise floor, everything sounds and feels more organic, purer timbre, improved dynamics, improved spatial awareness of the presentation and more resolution.  Basically by lowering the noise floor one hears more, everything heard feels more natural, feels more real and experiences deeper into the recording.  But the whole system needs to be treated to really hear what the system is capable of.

Here is the catch and pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.  There is an umpteen number of connections within a complex audio system. This means just treating your headphone cable connection and tube pins will yield an audible performance increase but there is still 140 (guessing here) more to go!  There is more mechanical connections within your system than I would bet you could think of in 30 mins if you did nothing but count them all.  So the catch is it will take a lot of time to treat a whole system.  But with every connection within a system treated/improved the sonic performance of ones system is taken up a notch.  Lastly, some connections treated will have a more profound performance gain, with some connections not as obvious.


----------



## DecentLevi

Also, forgot to mention I was sold on the Furutech Nano Liquid not just from here, but another thread and a few reviews here and there had positive things to say as well...

And PS - so far it's been a little over two weeks, and my orders from AliExpress are still just barely making it to US customs. I guess I wouldn't expect airmail from these affordable deals-but dang, I guess they picked the slowest boat, unless you live closer to the eastern hemisphere.


----------



## cdacosta

DenverW said:


> I honestly haven't done enough rolling of the rca cable to answer that properly.  I would describe my current system as warm, which I enjoy, but I'll need to do some comparison to really be able to tell.  If there is a bit of slowness and average detail retrieval I was hoping a silver cable would help reveal it.  Then at least I'd have a reference for comparison.  Thanks for answering, i quite enjoy the dac .


If your Duelund cables effect your system as I think it may, replacing them with an Odin Gold interconnect will likely slightly quicken your system and improve resolution.  That means PRAT will change slightly also, which you may like.  The Odin Gold may extend top end and add a touch of excitement to the presentation.  Not HF glare or thin the presentation.  More like if you here a cymbal struck it will be more impactful and decay sound more realistic.  But without hearing your system I am guestimating.  Let us know how it works out for you.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Also, forgot to mention I was sold on the Furutech Nano Liquid not just from here, but another thread and a few reviews here and there had positive things to say as well...
> 
> And PS - so far it's been a little over two weeks, and my orders from AliExpress are still just barely making it to US customs. I guess I wouldn't expect airmail from these affordable deals-but dang, I guess they picked the slowest boat, unless you live closer to the eastern hemisphere.


Comes by airmail from China, not boat.  lol  That would take months.

Well good for you, I think you are going to be more than pleasantly surprised.  First by initial impressions.  After you run out of ideas of where else to treat you will ask where else to treat?  When you read the answer you get surprised again.  lol


----------



## Zaek (Aug 12, 2022)

I currently have the Dita Oslo contact enhancer. Not sure if it is as good as the Furutech nano liquid.
This also appear to have the nano functionality - nanoparticles oil

"This extra oil solution is intended to enhance the conductivity between metal connectors, similar to DeoxIT contact enhancing solution. DITA own nanoparticle formula is enhanced with gold and silver particles"


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> I currently have the Dita Oslo contact enhancer. Not sure if it is as good as the Furutech nano liquid.
> This also appear to have the nano functionality - nanoparticles oil
> 
> "This extra oil solution is intended to enhance the conductivity between metal connectors, similar to DeoxIT contact enhancing solution. DITA own nanoparticle formula is enhanced with gold and silver particles"


Not familiar with OSLO. Please never use Caig Deoxit for anything but cleaning and make sure you remove all of it. Sounds really bad.  What has the OSLO done for you?


----------



## Zaek

I got it (liquid) when I bought the Dita Oslo cable for my IEM. Been sitting there for 2 years. Never try.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> So this was his answer....
> 
> _First of all, the gold shielding is made of gold foil paper. It is not a metal material, and the shielding effect is poor. Second, the conductor is not single crystal copper silver plated, and the conductor is thinner
> 
> _


Been talking to a seller that sells the all gold cable, Goltech.

Says his cable is all gold metal foil.  I bought it from him yesterday.


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 12, 2022)

SOAB

As soon as I buy it he lowers the price $9. 






Also this is new, I don't remember them adding taxes like this to the order before.

They used tack on customs fees which equated to less than 1%, even before that around prepandemic there were no fees whatsoever.


----------



## Zaek

u bought the odin gold with black wording, hopefully the quality is better than those we got.


----------



## DecentLevi

@cdacosta a few questions / brainstorming for my incoming Furutech Nano Liquid. If I should apply it to both sides connections, what should I use to apply it into the female contacts? Maybe a cotton q-tip would leave flakes behind. That would probably be the same thing I was thinking to use for cleaning the contacts beforehand though. Not sure what else is soft, small and firm enough to clean the likes of radio tube pins, per say. 

And did you say I'm likely to hear a difference straight away or does it take a burn-in period? If so, I assume higher voltage connections luke AC would burn in faster. I think you posted more recommendations earlier, but I can't seem to find that post.


----------



## szore

Just ordered 3 of these and I have no idea what they are supposed to do other than in the description....LOL but at 10 bucks a pop how could you not? I like it too because it reminds me of some kind of firework!


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @cdacosta a few questions / brainstorming for my incoming Furutech Nano Liquid. If I should apply it to both sides connections, what should I use to apply it into the female contacts? Maybe a cotton q-tip would leave flakes behind. That would probably be the same thing I was thinking to use for cleaning the contacts beforehand though. Not sure what else is soft, small and firm enough to clean the likes of radio tube pins, per say.
> 
> And did you say I'm likely to hear a difference straight away or does it take a burn-in period? If so, I assume higher voltage connections luke AC would burn in faster. I think you posted more recommendations earlier, but I can't seem to find that post.


Apply it to all connections.  Don't need to apply to both male and female on the same connection, just one.

Dont put it on a qtip, you will lose some of the nano particles on it.  

On tube pins the effect is immediately noticeable, if its a tube per channel, you can check to see how much of a difference it makes by doing one side at a time.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> @cdacosta a few questions / brainstorming for my incoming Furutech Nano Liquid. If I should apply it to both sides connections, what should I use to apply it into the female contacts? Maybe a cotton q-tip would leave flakes behind. That would probably be the same thing I was thinking to use for cleaning the contacts beforehand though. Not sure what else is soft, small and firm enough to clean the likes of radio tube pins, per say.
> 
> And did you say I'm likely to hear a difference straight away or does it take a burn-in period? If so, I assume higher voltage connections luke AC would burn in faster. I think you posted more recommendations earlier, but I can't seem to find that post.


I disagree with Doug, apply to both connections.  Only applicator you will use is the included brush, do not use anything else as a applicator.  I will see if I can find the post in this thread where I detailed exactly how to clean/prep connection and then treat with Nano Liquid.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Just ordered 3 of these and I have no idea what they are supposed to do other than in the description....LOL but at 10 bucks a pop how could you not? I like it too because it reminds me of some kind of firework!


I'm calling in skeptical hippo on that one but interested to see if it makes any difference.

Then again, I bought these carbon fiber discs and vibration absorption thingies to see if they make any difference.  It would probably help if I did one at a time but I put them all on all at once.

There was a small bit of a noticeable increase in the stage and depth, and it sounds more airy.  Was thinking about getting the spikes for the ares ii but can't figure out how to get the feet off.


----------



## cdacosta

Look at the below video on Furutech's website showing how to apply the Nano Liquid.  Clearly shows you apply to "both" contact surfaces.  After using the product I would recommend an even lighter coat than they show in the the video.  Be sure to clean both contact surfaces with isopropyl alcohol before applying the Nano Liquid.  You can use a cotton swab (Q-tip) or paper towel for cleaning but not applying the Nano Liquid.

https://www.furutech.com/2013/01/18/1647/


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> @cdacosta a few questions / brainstorming for my incoming Furutech Nano Liquid. If I should apply it to both sides connections, what should I use to apply it into the female contacts? Maybe a cotton q-tip would leave flakes behind. That would probably be the same thing I was thinking to use for cleaning the contacts beforehand though. Not sure what else is soft, small and firm enough to clean the likes of radio tube pins, per say.
> 
> And did you say I'm likely to hear a difference straight away or does it take a burn-in period? If so, I assume higher voltage connections luke AC would burn in faster. I think you posted more recommendations earlier, but I can't seem to find that post.


Sorry forgot to answer your burn-in question.  You will hear a difference immediately but will roll off the top end a bit and mask some resolution until at least 72 hours of signal through the connection.  Then it will open up.


----------



## cdacosta

A few more tips regarding the application of Nano Liquid...

1) Shake the bottle side to side for about 20 seconds before starting any treatment or application.   

2) The liquid is very thin.  One way to tell if you applied too much is if the liquid starts running.  To remedy this just brush over surface and the brush will pick up some of the liquid.  You want to apply a very thin coat.

3) In the video of Furutech's website shows them using inside top of the bottle to remove excess liquid from brush.  You want to use this technique to remove enough of the liquid off the brush until there is almost nothing left on the brush.  Once you do this a few times you will understand what I am suggesting here.

4) If you were like me and wanted to know what the audible effect of treating a mechanical contact is... treat one or two contacts first.  Then listen.  Maybe even let the Nano Liquid break-in or newly formed connection settle in.  The first connection I tried it on was the headphone cable.  Applied to the amp's balanced contacts, headphone, headphone cable's three contact points (balanced connector, and connectors to the headphone).  When I listened after application I was shocked.  The rest is history.  

5) Make a list of where you applied the Nano Liquid.  This way you can see where you have not applied it.  Possibly make notes of what you hear.  Trust me when I say you will "want to treat all connections" after you "hear" what the Nano Liquid does.   By documenting where you have applied the Nano Liquid, it is possible for you to take a picture and post it.  I can help with ideas of where else to treat.


----------



## musicinmymind

cdacosta said:


> A few more tips regarding the application of Nano Liquid...
> 
> 1) Shake the bottle side to side for about 20 seconds before starting any treatment or application.
> 
> ...



If I apply on Headphone jack, which I keep plugging and unplugging every day, does liquid still remain on jack or I have reapply again?


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> If I apply on Headphone jack, which I keep plugging and unplugging every day, does liquid still remain on jack or I have reapply again?


Only downside is if you unplug and plug after several times you will need to reapply.  I confirmed this with Furutech.  I emailed them and asked them a lot of questions while I was waiting for the Nano Liquid to arrive from VH Audio.  Only thing they told me that was BS was they said no break-in was required.


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> If I apply on Headphone jack, which I keep plugging and unplugging every day, does liquid still remain on jack or I have reapply again?


It wears off if you are constantly plugging and unplugging, you'll be able to tell because if you reapply it, the sound changes.


----------



## szore

So I think I've had another breakthrough with my burn in...The mids were sounding way too forward. I know it was the cables because suddenly all my IEM's sounded that way, but after a few days of that, the mids are becoming more and more transparent with no more 'forwardness'...sound over all is definitly settling down.  I have 770 hours on my first Odin2 cable, thats on the AresII dac, the other 2 power cables have 360 and 300 hours on them, they are on the Jot2 and PC, the XLR Gold has 150 hours of signal and the Odin USB cable has about 75 hours of signal...


----------



## FellMTK

i need recommendations for a thin , non-microphonic , lightweight cable for the HD800

The included cable is so thick that it can be used to discipline people


----------



## musicinmymind

https://www.aloaudio.com/shop/cloth-litz-headphone-cable/


----------



## cdacosta

Here is a quick update of my system with many of these clone Nordost Odin 2 and Odin Gold cables.  It is safe to say that all the cables are burned in by now.  

Approx. time of signal through the individual cables:
- Odin Gold power cable - 770 hours
- Odin 2 power cable - 1900 hours
- Odin Ethernet cable - 1600 hours
- Odin 2 SPDIF coax w/RCA - 2000 hours
- Odin 2 XLR balanced interconnects - 1400 hours

Take in consideration I do EQ my headphone setup.  But I have not adjusted any settings since before starting with all of the above cables.   Here is a general list of what the characteristics of the mix of cables in the system bring or do not.  Judged mainly off of Tidal, genres being Jazz, rock and fast EDM...

- Any HF glare during break in is gone.  But if the recording is poor or hot it is obvious.  Put another way, will not hide a poor recording.
- PRAT is fairly quick but not weird or off feeling.  With this much silver in the chain this is a bit smoother than I would have expected.
- Does offer a very exciting and dynamic presentation.
- Presentation is balanced.  Although bottom end to upper frequencies have been extended, no real tilt toward any frequency range. 
- Timbre is a bit better than good, not exceptional.  But then again I would never expect exceptional timbre at this price point or without more high end copper in the chain.
- Excellent detail retrieval across frequency spectrum.
- Sound stage and separation is very good.  I have heard better, but not anywhere near this price point.
- Male and female vocals and midrange in general are very good.
- To get the above attributes the system does move a bit toward neutral. 

Overall pretty good, exceptional for the money.  Really good for movies from HBO Max, Netflix or Disney +.


----------



## cdacosta

Regarding the cables...

Listening to fast EDM on Tidal while doing some research.  Not at a high volume, I would say medium volume.  Two things I am noticing.  One is the bass is very authoritative, I can feel the vibration in my ankles and feet which is kind of trippy.  Every been to a club or rave?  You can hear sound from 360 degrees with notes floating in the air, meaning all around you, on a vertical and horizontal axis.  So the stage is very deep (cannot feel there is a barrier or ending of the stage), 360 degrees and also tall.  Sounds like this.  Now I think it is my DAC that is producing this effect but the cabling is allowing it to all come through with really cool decay and floating of many sounds across the sound stage 360 degrees around me.  Kind of trippy and cool.


----------



## szore (Aug 15, 2022)

The mids are clearing up now. I moved the cables around; I put the oldest cable on my amp, that seems to be the most sensitive component. The Odin Gold power cable should be here in about a week, I will swap out the PC cable when that one comes.


----------



## DecentLevi

Incoming today was my first knockoff package. Gold Odin AC cable and THIS THING LOOKS LEGIT!!! Built like a tank, b-e-a-u-t-i-f-u-l and a show stopper. Looks and feels like $10,000.00 (but was only $79)!! Maybe they accidentally gave me the a real Nordost Odin Audiophile cable 





From the feel of it, I speculate what they said is true about its taking advantage of hollow interior, maybe for some sonic benefit or isolation of some sort. Mine says Odin Gold on the wood blocks and Odin 2 on the connectors in white lettering... wonder how that makes mine stack up with others around here?

I plugged it in from the wall outlet to my Furman power conditioner that's central for my entire rig, just for burn-in and as recommended from someone here would make a difference. And I am astonished to say it LOOKS LIKE THEY WERE RIGHT! (I think @cdacosta .) Just an informal listen on budget room speakers so far, but it seems the sound I'm getting straight from the off is more realistic and plush with drums sound more like drums including some sort of nice wooden texture type quality to them.

Also in the center is my High Quality HiFi Audio Cable Ground Loop Noise Isolator's. Surprised at how small they are, and will try them soon.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Incoming today was my first knockoff package. Gold Odin AC cable and THIS THING LOOKS LEGIT!!! Built like a tank, b-e-a-u-t-i-f-u-l and a show stopper. Looks and feels like $10,000.00 (but was only $79)!! Maybe they accidentally gave me the a real Nordost Odin Audiophile cable
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Be careful...I asked my seller why he charged me $239 for the gold when it was going for $79, and he said they were different cables, he said the $79 one had paper faux foil shielding....just saying...


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Incoming today was my first knockoff package. Gold Odin AC cable and THIS THING LOOKS LEGIT!!! Built like a tank, b-e-a-u-t-i-f-u-l and a show stopper. Looks and feels like $10,000.00 (but was only $79)!! Maybe they accidentally gave me the a real Nordost Odin Audiophile cable
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, these cables are the real deal...feel so lucky I stumbled upon these folks and this great thread! Still don't remember how I got here...lol!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Be careful...I asked my seller why he charged me $239 for the gold when it was going for $79, and he said they were different cables, he said the $79 one had paper faux foil shielding....just saying...


FYI, mine have the gold foil shields around conductors.  I paid $87.86 shipped for a 1.5m. 

I have pics in this thread I think of when I took the connectors off to apply Nano Liquid to conductors and connectors.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Incoming today was my first knockoff package. Gold Odin AC cable and THIS THING LOOKS LEGIT!!! Built like a tank, b-e-a-u-t-i-f-u-l and a show stopper. Looks and feels like $10,000.00 (but was only $79)!! Maybe they accidentally gave me the a real Nordost Odin Audiophile cable
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That was me.  The cable once burned in and settles on whatever it is connected to, performs at a different level.  You will experience it.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> FYI, mine have the gold foil shields around conductors.  I paid $87.86 shipped for a 1.5m.
> 
> I have pics in this thread I think of when I took the connectors off to apply Nano Liquid to conductors and connectors.


OK, That's good to know...I'm sure the paper ones are out there, I would just hate for someone to not get the foil... My Gold is taking forever...been hung up in China sorting center over a week now...


----------



## dougms3

Got this in the mail today.

Another outstanding replica, surprisingly flexible and huge connectors.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Got this in the mail today.
> 
> Another outstanding replica, surprisingly flexible and huge connectors.


How does it perform?  I have a outstanding “looking replica” Furutech that sounds like doo doo.


----------



## DecentLevi

@cdacosta or anybody - according to my AC cable photo do you think I have the paper faux or gold foil shielding? It looks gold, but just checking. I got mine from Getwire shop.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> How does it perform?  I have a outstanding “looking replica” Furutech that sounds like doo doo.


Well, I moved the odin cable to my di20he and have the gryphon on the ares II.  It definitely sounds better, not huge but the mids are thicker/more weight behind the notes, stage depth and width is bigger, sounds more open, the decay seems to be a little slower, lingers a tad bit longer, presentation is sounding more analog.  

Probably need a little more time with it, should have just swapped the one cable to make sure what the difference is.  I'm highly impatient.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @cdacosta or anybody - according to my AC cable photo do you think I have the paper faux or gold foil shielding? It looks gold, but just checking. I got mine from Getwire shop.


Chinese sellers on aliexpress lie alot, I doubt theres any paper foil cables otherwise he would have shown a picture or pointed one out.

I returned the original gold odin cable I bought from getwire because I bought it for like $160 and the price dropped to $90 from the other sellers.  I asked him to match the price or I'll return it, he made up some crap about his cable being better and that I already got a great price, I returned it and bought it from another seller.  The cables were identical.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Chinese sellers on aliexpress lie alot, I doubt theres any paper foil cables otherwise he would have shown a picture or pointed one out.
> 
> I returned the original gold odin cable I bought from getwire because I bought it for like $160 and the price dropped to $90 from the other sellers.  I asked him to match the price or I'll return it, he made up some crap about his cable being better and that I already got a great price, I returned it and bought it from another seller.  The cables were identical.


Ah, yes, the dark underbelly of audiophile...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Ah, yes, the dark underbelly of audiophile...


Been buying stuff from aliexpress for about 9 years and usually they come up with all kinds of stories when you ask if theres any difference between their stuff and a competitor who's cheaper.  

I grew up in the Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn, I can sniff out a liar even through the interwebs.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Well, I moved the odin cable to my di20he and have the gryphon on the ares II.  It definitely sounds better, not huge but the mids are thicker/more weight behind the notes, stage depth and width is bigger, sounds more open, the decay seems to be a little slower, lingers a tad bit longer, presentation is sounding more analog.
> 
> Probably need a little more time with it, should have just swapped the one cable to make sure what the difference is.  I'm highly impatient.


Hard to tell what the difference is without a direct swap.  Could be the Odin is better on the di20he.  And you have to wait until a cable is broken in to really know.  But it is good that the cable out of the box exhibits good sonic characteristics.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Been buying stuff from aliexpress for about 9 years and usually they come up with all kinds of stories when you ask if theres any difference between their stuff and a competitor who's cheaper.
> 
> I grew up in the Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn, I can sniff out a liar even through the interwebs.


Ha! I live in Brooklyn... Yeah, I know what you mean...


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> @cdacosta or anybody - according to my AC cable photo do you think I have the paper faux or gold foil shielding? It looks gold, but just checking. I got mine from Getwire shop.


The wire from the pic looks the same, weird it has connectors labeled a different model.  Likely just the writing or labeling on the connectors.  The only way to really know is to slide the connector housing down the cable.  Really easy to do this, two screws on the side of the end of the cables or connection part of the connector.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> The wire from the pic looks the same, weird it has connectors labeled a different model.  Likely just the writing or labeling on the connectors.  The only way to really know is to slide the connector housing down the cable.  Really easy to do this, two screws on the side of the end of the cables or connection part of the connector.


I bought the gold odin cable with the black lettering for my pc, I'll compare it vs the white lettering gold odin cable when I get it.

I  think it'll be the same to be honest but we'll see.


----------



## cdacosta (Aug 16, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Well, I moved the odin cable to my di20he and have the gryphon on the ares II.  It definitely sounds better, not huge but the mids are thicker/more weight behind the notes, stage depth and width is bigger, sounds more open, the decay seems to be a little slower, lingers a tad bit longer, presentation is sounding more analog.
> 
> Probably need a little more time with it, should have just swapped the one cable to make sure what the difference is.  I'm highly impatient.


From past experience I have found the following to be true about power cords which is interesting food for thought.  One (and there are many) of the reasons power cords effect a component differently sonically, or have specific sonic characteristics on a component in an audio system is the electrical characteristics of the cable.  And this does effect the component, especially the power supply.  For an example what I did recently is use a sweetish and warmish copper power cord (Electra Glide Signal Glide Signature) on a NOS R2R DAC that is not particularly warm to start with.  I did this understanding that likely this will help balance the overall presentation of the system.  If I went with another power cord I have which is a pure silver power cord like the Electra Glide Mini Khan Plus, the DAC will become hyper detailed but some of the beauty of the presentation would not be there.

So I mention this as a reminder that synergy and balance in a system is important for the ultimate performance based on the listener's taste.  Once cables are burned-in, so you know how it all sounds as a whole, it may be worth experimenting and switch around power cables.  Assuming you have different cables on hand.  If one does not wait until all cables are burned-in and system is electrically all settled in, you will have no idea what your system sounds like.  You will be just guessing.


----------



## Thenewguy007

dougms3 said:


> Chinese sellers on aliexpress lie alot, I doubt theres any paper foil cables otherwise he would have shown a picture or pointed one out.
> 
> I returned the original gold odin cable I bought from getwire because I bought it for like $160 and the price dropped to $90 from the other sellers.  I asked him to match the price or I'll return it, he made up some crap about his cable being better and that I already got a great price, I returned it and bought it from another seller.  The cables were identical.



There is a difference. The newer cheaper Odin cables are flexible, while the older more expensive ones were very stiff & had from what I can tell thicker individual wires strands.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 16, 2022)

My take on the HiFi Audio Cable *Ground Loop Noise Isolator*'s (photo shown here) are that it can increase the depth of the entire experience a bit, in terms of depth of scene / lifelike quality / and even touches the instrument separation or depth of bass by a slight nuance. What it does NOT do is to change the frequencies, tone or reduce any hum. It has the effect of a power conditioner giving a blacker background.

The reason I say that's what it "can" do is because for me I have two "dummy" RCA outputs connected to the amps ground signal and I'm using both in parallel. These things are tiny, and with one you really struggle to hear a difference and finally with two there is a difference but it takes a highly trained ear and incredibly resolving system to notice it, IMO. I'm not necessarily recommending these unless you have a way to use _at least_ 2 at the same time, but I would also like compare these to professional "RCA tuning sticks" before making any conclusion.

*Gold Odin cable* - all I can say is I've been getting world class sound while burning into my central power conditioner. I don't even want to remove it for comparison to the stock cable, seeing how installation was a challenge with the stiffness and tight fit. Maybe sometime. And the darn thing looks so BEAUTIFUL that my problem now is that I can only let select trusted people see it, in case they may steal it for looks alone.

*Furutech Nano Liquid* - I actually got mine today but I'm savin' the best for last. Because I'm already in audio heaven and want to get used to each upgrade first.

... not to mention I've also upgraded from a standard USB cable to a Fibbr Alpha USB-optical cable and today also connected both the newest iFi iDefender (laptop side) and the iFi iPurifier 3 (DDC side) which also made a GIANT LEAP in performance!!!
@rsbrsvp and @801evan check out this thread.


----------



## dougms3

Thenewguy007 said:


> There is a difference. The newer cheaper Odin cables are flexible, while the older more expensive ones were very stiff & had from what I can tell thicker individual wires strands.


There was no difference between the $160 odin cable and the $90 odin cable.  It was exactly the same, both were stiff.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> both were stiff.


Giggity...

My silver Odin 2 power cables came in yesterday--I swapped all simultaneously (DDC, DAC, AMPS).


----------



## dougms3

This is what it looks like behind my desk now, about 30lbs of pretty looking cables that no one will ever see.


----------



## msing539

Yeah, they're stiff and weigh a ton--like many heavy gauge power cables. I don't like the way it connects to the Iris... I might need to add a heavy standoff/cable riser or something.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Yeah, they're stiff and weigh a ton--like many heavy gauge power cables. I don't like the way it connects to the Iris... I might need to add a heavy standoff/cable riser or something.


I use wooden blocks as support under the cable so it doesnt put strain on the jack.


----------



## DenverW

msing539 said:


> Giggity...
> 
> My silver Odin 2 power cables came in yesterday--I swapped all simultaneously (DDC, DAC, AMPS).


Quagmire, make sure to post your impressions once you feel they’ve settled!  I’m considering the Odin 2 myself based on synergy with my warmer dac and tube amp, but I’m on the fence with the golds as well.


----------



## msing539

DenverW said:


> Quagmire, make sure to post your impressions once you feel they’ve settled!  I’m considering the Odin 2 myself based on synergy with my warmer dac and tube amp, but I’m on the fence with the golds as well.


Allll riiiiight... 

I will say out of the box, I'm hearing more microdetail but there's also a slight harshness in the top end with the silver ones. Low end is also more impactful. I'm hoping this calms down in the coming weeks.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Allll riiiiight...
> 
> I will say out of the box, I'm hearing more microdetail but there's also a slight harshness in the top end with the silver ones. Low end is also more impactful. I'm hoping this calms down in the coming weeks.


Yep, read my burn-in experiences with these cables in this thread.  Will give you a very good idea of what to expect during burn-in.


----------



## Thenewguy007

dougms3 said:


> There was no difference between the $160 odin cable and the $90 odin cable.  It was exactly the same, both were stiff.



I should have said the older Odin2 models, they  are very stiff, the new ones in comparison are flexible. Don't know if it has anything to do with quality, but they definitely changed the way they make them.


----------



## Zaek

dougms3 said:


> I use wooden blocks as support under the cable so it doesnt put strain on the jack.


I use the Furutech NCF booster to lift the cable too. It is really heavy


----------



## msing539

Zaek said:


> I use the Furutech NCF booster to lift the cable too. It is really heavy


You have a power conditioner there, right? Have you tried bypassing it to see if the sound improves?


----------



## Zaek

msing539 said:


> You have a power conditioner there, right? Have you tried bypassing it to see if the sound improves?


What do you mean bypass? To not use the power distributor? and connect all my gears directly to wall socket?


----------



## msing539

Zaek said:


> What do you mean bypass? To not use the power distributor? and connect all my gears directly to wall socket?


Yes, if it's a power conditioner and not just a power tap--just curious, because I've heard different viewpoints on them. Some say they negatively impact SQ, some say they help. I think it's one of those synergy things and dependent on your setup. Mine helps but my amp hits harder if I plug it in directly into the wall.


----------



## Zaek (Aug 16, 2022)

msing539 said:


> Yes, if it's a power conditioner and not just a power tap--just curious, because I've heard different viewpoints on them. Some say they negatively impact SQ, some say they help. I think it's one of those synergy things and dependent on your setup. Mine helps but my amp hits harder if I plug it in directly into the wall.


I did test out many years back. Conclusion is that it is better to plug power amp directly to wall socket. The rest (e.g. source, pre-amp) perform better on the power distributor/conditioner. In general, I don't like power conditioner. Like u say, it may negatively impact SQ. My personal preference is to use a power distributor instead.

I am using the Ansuz Mainz 8D (Gen 1), love their tesla coils technology, really clean up the dirty AC by alot.
As for headphones setup, I am too lazy. I just plug everything to the power distributor.


----------



## dougms3

When I have time I need to check the sound difference with this new gryphon power cable and the odin.  

I know I only had a day but it sounds quite good.  The gold odin2 is a little more resolving and maybe a little more thump in the bass as of the moment, it may be different once the gryphon burns in but it has a really euphonic quality to it with a little more warmth.  The lingering decay is quite addictive.  Almost as if it was going through a hybrid tube preamp.

I really hate cable swapping because I have to move around the wooden blocks.


----------



## msing539

The blocks... they do nothing!


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> The blocks... they do nothing!


Look at the massive size of the connector on my ares ii.  

Without the blocks, the connector sags worse than my sack on a busy friday night, giggity.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Look at the massive size of the connector on my ares ii.
> 
> Without the blocks, the connector sags worse than my sack on a busy friday night, giggity.


No no I meant the Odin cable blocks.


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 16, 2022)

msing539 said:


> No no I meant the Odin cable blocks.


Ah ok, my mistake, I thought you meant the support wood blocks.  I will disagree with you on the blocks on the cable, even if they are cheap pine blocks, I think they will dampen the 60hz frequency oscillation somewhat.

For those that might misunderstand, I have a part time job hauling sacks of potatoes on friday nights, giggity.


----------



## DenverW

dougms3 said:


> Look at the massive size of the connector on my ares ii.
> 
> Without the blocks, the connector sags worse than my sack on a busy friday night, giggity.


I hit the like button and felt immediately ashamed.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 17, 2022)

I just tried the Furutech Nano Liquid.
First was on my IEM - both on the main plug and connections to the IEM. An A/B is difficult with the way audio memory goes, but it seemed to sound like an upgraded cable! More vivid and lifelike, and resolving!

Next was on my headphone (currently ATH R70x) which had 4 connections. Now it seems deeper into the scene and better detail, and maybe even improved transients. More time on it needed to be sure.

I noticed my bottle was only about 1/3rd full even before use - and it's already a very tiny bottle. Is this normal or should I write to customer service, or is this normal with your bottles also? Also should I let the oil dry a little first?


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 17, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I just tried the Furutech Nano Liquid.
> First was on my IEM - both on the main plug and connections to the IEM. An A/B is difficult with the way audio memory goes, but it seemed to sound like an upgraded cable! More vivid and lifelike, and resolving!
> 
> Next was on my headphone (currently ATH R70x) which had 4 connections. Now it seems deeper into the scene and better detail, and maybe even improved transients. More time on it needed to be sure.
> ...


My bottle came about 2/3 full.  Even though its a small bottle since you only use a tiny bit at a time, its enough for many uses.

Its going to be like waiting for olive oil to dry.

I literally applied to every connection in my system more than once and thats how much I have left.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I just tried the Furutech Nano Liquid.
> First was on my IEM - both on the main plug and connections to the IEM. An A/B is difficult with the way audio memory goes, but it seemed to sound like an upgraded cable! More vivid and lifelike, and resolving!
> 
> Next was on my headphone (currently ATH R70x) which had 4 connections. Now it seems deeper into the scene and better detail, and maybe even improved transients. More time on it needed to be sure.
> ...


The bottle is small and does not come full.  You should be using so little at each mated mechanical connection that you will easily be able to treat an entire system and then some.

Yes you can hear a difference right away but it takes 72+ hours to really hear what it can do.  If treating just the headphone cable there is an improvement, just imagine if you treat the entire system?  To be sure treating an entire system is a project, there are more mechanical connections in your system then one would initially realize.  Read the post where I suggested how to approach this. 

With every mechanical connection treated your system is sonically improved.  That is why I suggested “all” mechanical connections.  Meaning:
- All signal cable connections, jack and cable side
- all AC connections, even at the wall or power conditioner.  If you know how to disconnect your breaker, even at the Romex wire to AC outlets.  Power cables.  I also treat the inside of the power cables
- Inside gear (including computer if that is your source), like at internal mechanical connections and fuse/fuse holders
- All Ethernet connections, at wall, at router and or modem, power
- If applicable video connections
- If your source is a computer, this is a 1.5 hour project in itself.  But the sonic upgrade for me was amazing.

When all said and done you will have sonically upgraded gear, cabling and sonic performance of the entire system.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi, here is another way to understand the effects of the Furutech Nano Liquid.  With every mechanical connection treated within a audio system the noise floor is lowered to some degree.  Some connections have more of an audible effect than others.  When all connections are treat the end results are compounded vs just the first few connections treated.


----------



## musicinmymind

I am looking for USB cable Type A to micro, for my Hugo 2. 
Could not find Odin cable with micro, please suggest.


----------



## msing539

musicinmymind said:


> I am looking for USB cable Type A to micro, for my Hugo 2.
> Could not find Odin cable with micro, please suggest.


The stuff from Wireworld is well made. I've owned two.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 17, 2022)

Thanks for the tips guys, yeah of course I was just starting out small, then would move on to more Connections in time. So here I was taking apart my gold Odin AC cable, to oil the connections. Also where would I go from this point, to check what type of gold foil or paper it uses?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Thanks for the tips guys, yeah of course I was just starting out small, then would move on to more Connections in time. So here I was taking apart my gold Odin AC cable, to oil the connections. Also where would I go from this point, to check what type of gold foil or paper it uses?


To see the foil you would have to remove the heat shrink, which I do not recommend.  When you say “oil”, did you mean treat with Nano Liquid?   If yes, treat both the conductors and the inside of the connectors.  This is how I and Furutech apply to power cords.  Does improve the performance.


----------



## szore

Mids are settling down some now that they have a few hours on them, bit off topic, but I just got these earphones off ali express...amazing! $17....(I mean like, as good as anything I own...)...

KZ ZS6 2DD+2BA Hybrid In Ear Earphone​


----------



## DecentLevi

This is a warning for anyone wanting to take apart their AC cables.

I took the advice here to open my Gold Odin 2 cable to treat it with Nano Liquid - overall I would probably recommend it - but with some huge caveats.

The negative: It took about 3 hours of my time. First I had a major issue with the 3 small curved square bolts falling out once all screws were removed from inside the assembly, after already sliding down the main housing. Turns out I should've just loosened those screws up (the ones that apply pressure on the wire to the bolt and side contact) enough to remove the wire, without actually removing the screw to prevent an incredibly difficult balancing act of realigning each of the three scew/bolt sets - lesson learned! 

Next lesson learned was that if the screw is incredibly tight, don't force it. I broke the head off one of the screws that tightens the red mains signal wire into the housing, but was lucky enough to have it apply enough of its own pressure against the side contact when putting the others back in and closing everything back up, to make it so that it works without issue... for now at least.

The good: The sound I'm getting is nothing g short of M-I-R-A-C-U-L-O-U-S!!! After applying the Fututech Nano Liquid to the Gold Odin, along with two other AC cables in my system and the headphone cable (all both sides), my system sounds so much better that it may be closer to the mighty Stax electrostatic sound! Still trying to wrap my head around the supreme fidelity I'm receiving a little slowly though cuz of my work schedule.

One of my recent changes however have been causing a fair bit of extra brightness for the last several days straight, could have been from the iFi iPurifier 3, if not the Nano Liquid.


----------



## msing539

DecentLevi said:


> This is a warning for anyone wanting to take apart their AC cables.
> 
> I took the advice here to open my Gold Odin 2 cable to treat it with Nano Liquid - overall I would probably recommend it - but with some huge caveats.
> 
> ...


Sorry man, that does suck. Is this nano liquid really $150? Do you only need to apply it once and it's done with? If so, someone please sell me the remainder of their bottle...


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> This is a warning for anyone wanting to take apart their AC cables.
> 
> I took the advice here to open my Gold Odin 2 cable to treat it with Nano Liquid - overall I would probably recommend it - but with some huge caveats.
> 
> ...


I am at work so will keep this short.  Only loosen bolts on the power cord connectors, no need to remove them.  Nano Liquid will not cause HF brightness or glare. 

By the way, I have to do this… told ya the Nano Liquid is good stuff!  The more connections you treat the better it gets.  Remember minimum 72 hour burn-in for best results.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Sorry man, that does suck. Is this nano liquid really $150? Do you only need to apply it once and it's done with? If so, someone please sell me the remainder of their bottle...


Yes apply once. I am never selling the Nano Liquid I have.  Sorry


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Sorry man, that does suck. Is this nano liquid really $150? Do you only need to apply it once and it's done with? If so, someone please sell me the remainder of their bottle...


Lol I doubt anyone well sell their used bottle, you keep finding more and more uses for it.


----------



## msing539

No worries guys, I looked it up on AliExpress and it's only $13.68. 

Labeled as LAIKOU Goat Milk Shower Gel Shampoo. Should make my sound silky smooooth.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> No worries guys, I looked it up on AliExpress and it's only $13.68.
> 
> Labeled as LAIKOU Goat Milk Shower Gel Shampoo. Should make my sound silky smooooth.


Milked from only the most verile male goats, has that extra goaty flavor.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Milked from only the most verile male goats, has that extra goaty flavor.


I assumed they meant this nano stuff was the greatest of all time


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I assumed they meant this nano stuff was the greatest of all time


I know it seems like an exaggeration but the nano liquid is really an amazing product. 

I put it on ethernet, usb, interconnects, power cables, power adapters, the contact pins on all the pci cards in my pc, ram, pins on tubes.

It brings the system up to a new level.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> I know it seems like an exaggeration but the nano liquid is really an amazing product.
> 
> I put it on ethernet, usb, interconnects, power cables, power adapters, the contact pins on all the pci cards in my pc, ram, pins on tubes.
> 
> It brings the system up to a new level.


I don't doubt it as a contact enhancer. Did you treat your outlet, too?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I don't doubt it as a contact enhancer. Did you treat your outlet, too?


I didn't put it in the outlet, its conductive, probably don't want apply that on a live outlet.  I don't think its necessary to apply to both male and female on the same connection point.

I put too much of it on one of the ac plugs and it was sparking.  The furutech duplex i plugged into is transparent and I could see it.  Just be careful not to overdo it.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> I don't doubt it as a contact enhancer. Did you treat your outlet, too?


Yes I did. All outlets, at the wall, all three PLC.  The conductors and outlet contacts. Then obviously power cord and contacts in socket.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 18, 2022)

I detected a bit of sarcasm here (or maybe just humor) but I for one am a believer. It's a very special contact enhancer made out of actual silver and gold nanoparticles. Here is their illustration, and an application video.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Yes I did. All outlets, at the wall, all three PLC.  The conductors and outlet contacts. Then obviously power cord and contacts in socket.


That's what I was wondering, because Furutech demonstrates it being used at all contact points. 

I've also heard that it can add detail to a dark system but can make a revealing system sound unnaturally harsh if overdone.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> That's what I was wondering, because Furutech demonstrates it being used at all contact points.
> 
> I've also heard that it can add detail to a dark system but can make a revealing system sound unnaturally harsh if overdone.


Never experienced any harshness.  I have used the Nano Liquid on every kind of mechanical connection within an audio system that one can imagine including inside gear and all mechanical connection inside a computer.  Always a audible sonic improvement, degree of improvement will vary depending on where the application is. 

I will bet if someone experienced harshness something else they did is causing it.  The result of applying Nano Liquid is the opposite effect of harshness.  Want more resolution, hear more/deeper into the recording, purer more natural timbre and more engaging experience?... Nano Liquid is the ticket.  This is seriously one of the best bang for the $ upgrade to an audio system I have experienced.  Otherwise I would not spend so much time and effort recommending it.


----------



## Thenewguy007

DecentLevi said:


> I detected a bit of sarcasm here (or maybe just humor) but I for one am a believer. It's a very special contact enhancer made out of actual silver and gold nanoparticles. Here is their illustration, and an application video.




So it's just like thermal paste used in computers. Except it's a thinner liquid that leaves a film than a thicker paste that will connect all the connects points.


----------



## Zaek

New arrival. Initial impression was amazed by the quality of sound


----------



## msing539

Thenewguy007 said:


> So it's just like thermal paste used in computers. Except it's a thinner liquid that leaves a film than a thicker paste that will connect all the connects points.


It's a gold and silver solution that fills in surface imperfections on connectors and allows for more contact.


----------



## musicinmymind

Zaek said:


> New arrival. Initial impression was amazed by the quality of sound


can you pls share the link


----------



## Zaek

musicinmymind said:


> can you pls share the link


The link keep changing, so try searching for ATAudio. Tried this because the cable is very flexible.


----------



## szore

Just got the last cable!!!! the Gold!


----------



## Zaek (Aug 19, 2022)

szore said:


> Just got the last cable!!!! the Gold!


It looks different from the one we got. Do share yr impression


----------



## szore

It's hard to say because I took the silver off the PC that had 600 hours on it and I put it on my DAC which had the 'least' burned in cable. The silver that was on the DAC I threw in the closet, then I put the new gold on my PC. My initial impressions is that it takes some of the 'coldness' or 'sterility' out of the silver and it warms it up and polishes it a little, but there is no loss of clarity or resoulution, so its sounding pretty sweet. It's a little rough around the edges but that is to be expected with a new cable... The main thing I need to burn in is the USB cable...the mids came alive when I switched cables, but they only have 100 hours on them, so its going to take months to burn them in...the gold xlr's too...maybe by Christmas!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> It's hard to say because I took the silver off the PC that had 600 hours on it and I put it on my DAC which had the 'least' burned in cable. The silver that was on the DAC I threw in the closet, then I put the new gold on my PC. My initial impressions is that it takes some of the 'coldness' or 'sterility' out of the silver and it warms it up and polishes it a little, but there is no loss of clarity or resoulution, so its sounding pretty sweet. It's a little rough around the edges but that is to be expected with a new cable... The main thing I need to burn in is the USB cable...the mids came alive when I switched cables, but they only have 100 hours on them, so its going to take months to burn them in...the gold xlr's too...maybe by Christmas!


Yes the Odin Gold is a little sweeter from mids to upper frequencies.  When both are burned in the Odin 2 is a tad quicker and a tad more resolving.  They definitely provide a different sonic experience.


----------



## szore (Aug 19, 2022)

Definitley getting more HF information...like, delicate, 12 string guitar, barley audible and off to the side, and never heard before, just hanging in its own space with perfect air and body... that's very high quality information there...not bad considering the gold is still raw...


----------



## dougms3

Sale coming up on 8/22 boys.  Also the $3 off $30 is back.

Is it illegal to wear a helmet while driving a car?  Because I think I really need this.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Sale coming up on 8/22 boys.  Also the $3 off $30 is back.
> 
> Is it illegal to wear a helmet while driving a car?  Because I think I really need this.


One ugly mother...


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> One ugly mother...


Lmao


----------



## cdacosta

I am listening to my headphone rig with all the Nordost cables while sharpening knives. I can swear even after all those hundreds of hours burning in, I think it is all still becoming more refined.  Especially in the mids and top end.  Mid bass is really solid which is not usually the case with pure silver cables.


----------



## cdacosta

By the way, with enough burn-in any hint of HF peakiness or HF harshness is gone. At least with the cables I have.  Also much more delicate top end.  Very nice, especially for money.  The power cord on my DAC cost 4 times what all the other 5 clone Nordost cables cost in total!  Amazing


----------



## dougms3

Just an update with some cable swapping with the gryphon, nordost and a cheap power cable.  All testing was done with my audio-gd master 19 and modded focal clears at the same volume.

On my ares ii dac, the gold odin 2 seems to be more resolving and has more thump in the bass, the gryphon cable was not as resolving as the gold odin but made my system warmer with more body, less thump in the bass but more volume, its very midcentric, perhaps with it might work better with a more resolving dac than my ares ii.  

I also tested a cheap power cable that I got from aliexpress a few years ago on my audio-gd di20he.  It has a regenerative power supply so I was curious to see how much of a difference the cable would make. With the cheap cable, theres more bass coming through but its not clean and theres alot of background noise coming along with it, almost sounds like a haze over the sound and not as resolving.  Its alot better with either the nordost cable or the gryphon cable on the ddc.  Again the nordost offers cleaner treble and harder hitting bass, kinda v shaped and more resolving.  The gryphon cable does the same, more bass volume but doesn't hit as hard, warmer, thicker mids, has kind of a euphonic analog effect, not as resolving as the odin.

I think with the current lineup of cables I have, the gold odin on the ares ii and the gryphon on the ddc offers the best synergy for now.

Once I get the all gold odin cable, I'll compare that directly to the gold silver mix odin cable then do some cable rolling with the other devices.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 20, 2022)

'Unfortunately' this came in yesterday... Odin 2 75ohm digital RCA coax cable. LOL well of course I'm being facetious because this sounds and looks FANTASTIC!!!

Not really expecting much because I'm coming from a _20 AWG solid .032" (.81mm) silver-plated copper conductor(s), gas-injected FHDPE insulation, Beldfoil® + tinned copper braid shield (85% coverage), overall PVC jacket_ (Belden 734D1 from BlueJeans cable co.), which I fitted with 6 special quality ferrite clamps for improved sound.

Right off the bat I was impressed with a sound that is fuller, improved PRaT and lifelike quality, and seems to have completely remedied my HF (high freq.) glare I've been noticing! I got mine from Aliexpress seller Furukawa Flagship Store and they were able to shorten the white tube sleeving a little upon request by messaging right after purchase. Having not yet owned the Odin 2 RCA audio cable I'm not sure if there's any difference, but for one thing this is not is bright - it's so transparent!!


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> 'Unfortunately' this came in yesterday... Odin 2 75ohm digital RCA coax cable. LOL well of course I'm being facetious because this sounds and looks FANTASTIC!!!
> 
> Not really expecting much because I'm coming from a _20 AWG solid .032" (.81mm) silver-plated copper conductor(s), gas-injected FHDPE insulation, Beldfoil® + tinned copper braid shield (85% coverage), overall PVC jacket_ (Belden 734D1 from BlueJeans cable co.), which I fitted with 6 special quality ferrite clamps for improved sound.
> 
> Right off the bat I was impressed with a sound that is fuller, improved PRaT and lifelike quality, and seems to have completely remedied my HF (high freq.) glare I've been noticing! I got mine from Aliexpress seller Furukawa Flagship Store and they were able to shorten the white tube sleeving a little upon request by messaging right after purchase. Having not yet owned the Odin 2 RCA audio cable I'm not sure if there's any difference, but for one thing this is not is bright - it's so transparent!!


I have/am using the same cable. No brightness or glare.  Cannot remember what it sounds like before break-in.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> 'Unfortunately' this came in yesterday... Odin 2 75ohm digital RCA coax cable. LOL well of course I'm being facetious because this sounds and looks FANTASTIC!!!
> 
> Not really expecting much because I'm coming from a _20 AWG solid .032" (.81mm) silver-plated copper conductor(s), gas-injected FHDPE insulation, Beldfoil® + tinned copper braid shield (85% coverage), overall PVC jacket_ (Belden 734D1 from BlueJeans cable co.), which I fitted with 6 special quality ferrite clamps for improved sound.
> 
> Right off the bat I was impressed with a sound that is fuller, improved PRaT and lifelike quality, and seems to have completely remedied my HF (high freq.) glare I've been noticing! I got mine from Aliexpress seller Furukawa Flagship Store and they were able to shorten the white tube sleeving a little upon request by messaging right after purchase. Having not yet owned the Odin 2 RCA audio cable I'm not sure if there's any difference, but for one thing this is not is bright - it's so transparent!!


Did you apply Nano Liquid to the jacks and WBT cable connectors?


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Did you apply Nano Liquid to the jacks and WBT cable connectors?


First I tried it without nano liquid, then did apply some, but I'm still comparing it on different headphones / speakers and with different type of RCA to 3.5 mm connectors which are necessary for my setup, so couldn't really tell any  difference yet. For digital cables like this, shorter is better so I got 0.5 meters. It's transparent definitely not bright. But previous posts seem to mention something about Odin 2 cables in general leaning towards brightness.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> First I tried it without nano liquid, then did apply some, but I'm still comparing it on different headphones / speakers and with different type of RCA to 3.5 mm connectors which are necessary for my setup, so couldn't really tell any  difference yet. For digital cables like this, shorter is better so I got 0.5 meters. It's transparent definitely not bright. But previous posts seem to mention something about Odin 2 cables in general leaning towards brightness.


Not brightness so much as clarity or transparancy, I think...


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> First I tried it without nano liquid, then did apply some, but I'm still comparing it on different headphones / speakers and with different type of RCA to 3.5 mm connectors which are necessary for my setup, so couldn't really tell any  difference yet. For digital cables like this, shorter is better so I got 0.5 meters. It's transparent definitely not bright. But previous posts seem to mention something about Odin 2 cables in general leaning towards brightness.


The only brightness or high frequency glare is “before” break-in.  After break-in I detect none.


----------



## DecentLevi

@OctavianH and @UntilThen I invite you to follow this thread. This is THE actualization of my existing hi-fi sound system and I'm very lucky to have chanced upon it. The cumulative improvements from upgrades mentioned here are yielding what I would call 6-star sound and it's something that has to be experienced to believe. Do check out at least a few pages.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Did you apply Nano Liquid to the jacks and WBT cable connectors?


Now I also applied the Furutech Nano Liquid to all the contacts of the RCA coax cable, and I kid you not - just from putting it on the adapter and receiving side connections, I heard an instant improvement in clarity and dynamics! And I don't think the Odin 2 cable is bright, even without burning in, IME (in my experience).


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Now I also applied the Furutech Nano Liquid to all the contacts of the RCA coax cable, and I kid you not - just from putting it on the adapter and receiving side connections, I heard an instant improvement in clarity and dynamics! And I don't think the Odin 2 cable is bright, even without burning in, IME (in my experience).


After break-in (approx. 72+ hours of signal through cable), will get better.  What is your component chain, from source on?  For example my setup starts at a Windows 10 computer.


----------



## DecentLevi (Aug 22, 2022)

My source
Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20 --> DAC via RCA coax (Odin 2) -->Ultrasonic Studios tube amp

Early this month it consisted of just normal USB cable to Wyrd, then iPurifier 2 before the DDC then DAC. Excellent sound was then taken up a solid notch to fantastic with the Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable; though it did sound fairly colorless and clinical on it's own. Adding the iDefender before it and the iPurifier 3 after it before the DDC whic precedes the DAC took it up a few more notches to spectacular with added body, improved PRaT and sense of realism. Then today I thought I'd stack my old iPurifier 2 with it, and now I'm getting even more of everything, for a wholly transcendental sound! Do note I have already tried every combination of less components and in every possible order, and I have found THE best. And I just finished treating all mechanical connections with Furutech Nano Liquid, which has been giving me these thrills. This is 6*+* star fidelity and so surreal you have to try it and you will feel it! It's visceral boundless performance! Much thanks also go to my custom Ultrasonic Studios tube amp, and also the Odin 2 digital RCA coax cable which also made its own HUGE increase in performance!!!  

I can say with absolute confidence that right now I am getting a sound that is on par with some of the best rigs I have ever heard! And that's coming from me as someone who has attended about 12 meets including local that I attended and organized, and about 6 CanJams, with top systems including the likes of DAVE, WA33, Orpheus 2, LCD-5, HEDDphone and thousands more pieces of gear. I may in fact have an even BETTER system on my hands here, but I just need to upgrade my DAC and headphones (currently using Chord Mojo 2 and ATH-R70x) in order to hear the full potential of what is being unleashed right now.

@RONJA MESCO and @801evan  this is for you also.

Also my Furman IT-ref 15i central AC power conditioner fed by Odin Gold AC cable, and a very good supercapacitor DC LPS as isolated clean DC power into my Fibbr USB optical cable are doing some good heavy lifting too.


----------



## 801evan

DecentLevi said:


> My source
> Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20 --> DAC via RCA coax (Odin 2) -->Ultrasonic Studios tube amp
> 
> Early this month it consisted of just normal USB cable to Wyrd, then iPurifier 2 before the DDC then DAC. Excellent sound was then taken up a solid notch to fantastic with the Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable; though it did sound fairly colorless and clinical on it's own. Adding the iDefender before it and the iPurifier 3 after it before the DDC whic precedes the DAC took it up a few more notches to spectacular with added body, improved PRaT and sense of realism. Then today I thought I'd stack my old iPurifier 2 with it, and now I'm getting even more of everything, for a wholly transcendental sound! Do note I have already tried every combination of less components and in every possible order, and I have found THE best. And I just finished treating all mechanical connections with Furutech Nano Liquid, which has been giving me these thrills. This is 6*+* star fidelity and so surreal you have to try it and you will feel it! It's visceral boundless performance! Much thanks also go to my custom Ultrasonic Studios tube amp, and also the Odin 2 digital RCA coax cable which also made its own HUGE increase in performance!!!
> ...


I'm happy to hear you got to experiment with my chain in your own way and hear what I'm hearing. 💪💪


----------



## DecentLevi

801evan said:


> I'm happy to hear you got to experiment with my chain in your own way and hear what I'm hearing. 💪💪


Yup, my USB optical setup it loosely based on concepts thanks to your input. And I believe your chain can evolve even better with the use of Odin 2 digital RCA coax or USB cable, and Odin Gold AC or RCA cables. It's based on a $30,000.00 cable going only for about $70, and sounding better than cables costing thousands. Zero joke.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> My source
> Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20 --> DAC via RCA coax (Odin 2) -->Ultrasonic Studios tube amp
> 
> Early this month it consisted of just normal USB cable to Wyrd, then iPurifier 2 before the DDC then DAC. Excellent sound was then taken up a solid notch to fantastic with the Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable; though it did sound fairly colorless and clinical on it's own. Adding the iDefender before it and the iPurifier 3 after it before the DDC whic precedes the DAC took it up a few more notches to spectacular with added body, improved PRaT and sense of realism. Then today I thought I'd stack my old iPurifier 2 with it, and now I'm getting even more of everything, for a wholly transcendental sound! Do note I have already tried every combination of less components and in every possible order, and I have found THE best. And I just finished treating all mechanical connections with Furutech Nano Liquid, which has been giving me these thrills. This is 6*+* star fidelity and so surreal you have to try it and you will feel it! It's visceral boundless performance! Much thanks also go to my custom Ultrasonic Studios tube amp, and also the Odin 2 digital RCA coax cable which also made its own HUGE increase in performance!!!
> ...


All that counts is that you are happy!


----------



## 801evan (Aug 22, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20


I think you don't have the right connector type in the purifier for my suggestion but I never got a better sound back to back with ipurifiers. But I got a better sound with , in ur case, having the purifier 2 in-between the idefender and fibbr.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Yup, my USB optical setup it loosely based on concepts thanks to your input. And I believe your chain can evolve even better with the use of Odin 2 digital RCA coax or USB cable, and Odin Gold AC or RCA cables. It's based on a $30,000.00 cable going only for about $70, and sounding better than cables costing thousands. Zero joke.


I think the Odin 1 cable is the one to get for USB, tho....


----------



## DecentLevi

I need a USB cable, do you recommend Odin 2 or Odin Gold? Odin 1 looks a bit lesser to me.


----------



## msing539 (Aug 22, 2022)

This is the Odin 2 USB cable I have:

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/3256803929178175.html


----------



## szore

Oh, my bad, I have the Odin 2 USB cable....


----------



## msing539

Side note, I briefly had a knock off Audioquest Vodka HDMI cable for I2S between the Iris and Pontus:

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/3256802862576043.html

This outperformed generic HDMI cables I had laying around...mostly stuff from Monoprice. In comparison, the Monoprice cables all sounded recessed or veiled, especially in the midrange. And for $20+, I think the "Vodka" cable is a solid option.

But I have since picked up a Transparent Audio HDMI and there's no contest for I2S. The clarity is well above the Vodka cable.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Side note, I briefly had a knock off Audioquest Vodka HDMI cable for I2S between the Iris and Pontus:
> 
> https://m.aliexpress.com/item/3256802862576043.html
> 
> ...


I have used and owned several Transparent Audio cables in the past. How much was their HDMI cable?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Side note, I briefly had a knock off Audioquest Vodka HDMI cable for I2S between the Iris and Pontus:
> 
> https://m.aliexpress.com/item/3256802862576043.html
> 
> ...


Forgot to mention that the knockoff vodka outperformed the real audioquest carbon hdmi.

I guess there is a ceiling to all of these knockoff cables.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> I have used and owned several Transparent Audio cables in the past. How much was their HDMI cable?


I got it for $90 after shipping and fees new off eBay, Transparent Gen 5 20" long.


----------



## msing539

Are there any decent power conditioners on AliExpress? I have a Panamax M8-AV-PRO, which is really made for home theater setups. My lines are noisy... power just isn't great where I am. Before ConEd swapped the transformer on the pole, I was getting 60-70 events a month, including brown outs, surges, and an occasional blackout.


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 22, 2022)

szore said:


> Just ordered 3 of these and I have no idea what they are supposed to do other than in the description....LOL but at 10 bucks a pop how could you not? I like it too because it reminds me of some kind of firework!


@DecentLevi 

Did you also get this?

Any update on this?

Does it do anything?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> @DecentLevi
> 
> Did you also get this?
> 
> ...


I haven't gotten them yet but my sources tell me they just left the Fengang province....


----------



## RONJA MESCO

DecentLevi said:


> My source
> Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20 --> DAC via RCA coax (Odin 2) -->Ultrasonic Studios tube amp
> 
> Early this month it consisted of just normal USB cable to Wyrd, then iPurifier 2 before the DDC then DAC. Excellent sound was then taken up a solid notch to fantastic with the Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable; though it did sound fairly colorless and clinical on it's own. Adding the iDefender before it and the iPurifier 3 after it before the DDC whic precedes the DAC took it up a few more notches to spectacular with added body, improved PRaT and sense of realism. Then today I thought I'd stack my old iPurifier 2 with it, and now I'm getting even more of everything, for a wholly transcendental sound! Do note I have already tried every combination of less components and in every possible order, and I have found THE best. And I just finished treating all mechanical connections with Furutech Nano Liquid, which has been giving me these thrills. This is 6*+* star fidelity and so surreal you have to try it and you will feel it! It's visceral boundless performance! Much thanks also go to my custom Ultrasonic Studios tube amp, and also the Odin 2 digital RCA coax cable which also made its own HUGE increase in performance!!!
> ...


Bro, you are awesome. Thanks for the info and how you implemented it into your chain!


----------



## szore

Has anyone tried any IEM cables? The 'Hiclass Hifi Connector store' has some very interetsing cables.....Don't have the cash now but i will definitly be checking some of these out soon....this one particular caught my eye...

Hiclass 8 Core Pure Silver Gold Plated + Pure Silver Palladium Plated + OCC Silver Plated Cable​


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> @DecentLevi
> 
> Did you also get this?
> 
> ...


Yup, I reported on it in this post.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> My source
> Windows laptop --> iFi iDefender --> Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable --> Schiit Wyrd --> iFi iPurifier 3 -- iFi iPurifier 2 --> Audio GD DI20 --> DAC via RCA coax (Odin 2) -->Ultrasonic Studios tube amp
> 
> Early this month it consisted of just normal USB cable to Wyrd, then iPurifier 2 before the DDC then DAC. Excellent sound was then taken up a solid notch to fantastic with the Fibbr Alpha USB optical cable; though it did sound fairly colorless and clinical on it's own. Adding the iDefender before it and the iPurifier 3 after it before the DDC whic precedes the DAC took it up a few more notches to spectacular with added body, improved PRaT and sense of realism. Then today I thought I'd stack my old iPurifier 2 with it, and now I'm getting even more of everything, for a wholly transcendental sound! Do note I have already tried every combination of less components and in every possible order, and I have found THE best. And I just finished treating all mechanical connections with Furutech Nano Liquid, which has been giving me these thrills. This is 6*+* star fidelity and so surreal you have to try it and you will feel it! It's visceral boundless performance! Much thanks also go to my custom Ultrasonic Studios tube amp, and also the Odin 2 digital RCA coax cable which also made its own HUGE increase in performance!!!
> ...


At this point if you want to push or increase sonic performance without spending a penny...

Inside your gear, power conditioners, DDC, DAC and power outlets (all including at the wall, the ones in your Furman and any other power line conditioners).  All mechanical connection including switches, fuse and fuse holders, treat with Furutech Nano Liquid.  Even molex connections for power or signal between PC boards inside the gear.

Remember the performance upgrade you got by applying to the one power cord contacts and connectors?  Imagine that effect multiplied, system becomes even more refined.  If you are up to this project the sonic performance in your system will be further improved. 

Another surprising upgrade is Nano Liquid treat the power connector and SATA cable connection and hard drive connections in your laptop.  LOL the sonic improvement will surprise you and stick a smile on your face for quite some time.

Here is another... have you treated the ethernet cable ends and contacts at your laptop and router/modem?


----------



## Zaek

Saw this new Odin Gold usb. Anyone wants to try?


----------



## szore

Bit off topic, but I just ordered my Denefrips BIC500 power conditioner! It's why I bought all these cables in the first place, to prepare for the BIC 500! It's on its way! Cannot wait to here it when its all together.....


----------



## szore

Just ordered 2 new cables off Ali Express for IEMs...   

Hiclass 8 Core Pure Silver Gold Plated + Pure Silver Palladium Plated Cable  $204​Hi Class 8 Core 5N Pure Silver Gilded Cable Earphone Cable   $244​


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Just ordered 2 new cables off Ali Express for IEMs...
> 
> Hiclass 8 Core Pure Silver Gold Plated + Pure Silver Palladium Plated Cable  $204​Hi Class 8 Core 5N Pure Silver Gilded Cable Earphone Cable   $244​


Very interested in your impressions of these cables also.


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> Bit off topic, but I just ordered my Denefrips BIC500 power conditioner! It's why I bought all these cables in the first place, to prepare for the BIC 500! It's on its way! Cannot wait to here it when its all together.....


It looks like the PCB is scared of the transformer.


----------



## DenverW

dougms3 said:


> Very interested in your impressions of these cables also.


I've picked up a few different iem cables and headphone cables from aliexpress.  They've all been soft and good quality for the price.  A couple of the cables have minor issues when they arrive, such as the XLR input not being aligned property on the headphone cable, but no biggie.  I've had no issue with any of the iem cables out of the box.  
I will say that I haven't noticed any real difference in sound.  This may be because I've never spent a good amount of time A/Bing the cables, or perhaps my stone ears just don't notice.


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> I've picked up a few different iem cables and headphone cables from aliexpress.  They've all been soft and good quality for the price.  A couple of the cables have minor issues when they arrive, such as the XLR input not being aligned property on the headphone cable, but no biggie.  I've had no issue with any of the iem cables out of the box.
> I will say that I haven't noticed any real difference in sound.  This may be because I've never spent a good amount of time A/Bing the cables, or perhaps my stone ears just don't notice.


I have a whole bunch of headphone and iem cables from aliexpress also but mostly from xinhs.  Mostly the cheaper stuff nothing over $80.  I have not tried any of the higher end cables from aliexpress which is why I'm interested in his impressions.  

I've noticed they all sound different, subtle differences but perceivably different.  Theres a huge difference with the moon audio silver dragon and wywires platinum headphone cables I have compared to the cheap cables I bought from aliexpress.  

But I'm sensitive to alot of things in general.


----------



## DenverW

Faux Odin rca cables arrive tomorrow; the burn in begins soon!


----------



## cdacosta

DenverW said:


> Faux Odin rca cables arrive tomorrow; the burn in begins soon!


Which ones did you purchase?


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> Faux Odin rca cables arrive tomorrow; the burn in begins soon!


Welcome to the club!


----------



## DenverW

cdacosta said:


> Which ones did you purchase?


If the link works...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801517945652.html?spm=a2g0o.order_detail.0.0.275ff19cN7Y4gj

Nordost ODIN 2 fever audio RCA signal cable double lotus sterling silver audio cable CD amplifier tube cable​
Hopefully it doesn't stink .  I just noticed the price dropped since I ordered it; wonder if they'll honor the lower price.  It has free returns so I suggest they do...


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> If the link works...
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801517945652.html?spm=a2g0o.order_detail.0.0.275ff19cN7Y4gj
> 
> ...


Interesting variation, has the silver wbt knockoff connectors.  I think these might be better than the knockoff nordost connectors.


----------



## dougms3

I just came across this.

Gold odin ethernet cable.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...00030044134933!sea&curPageLogUid=baC082wE4JPf


----------



## Lumithium

Probably not a good idea to buy Ethernet cables without actual specs. Like CAT5 / CAT6, twisted pair or not etc.

And most CAT5 cables aren't shielded so it could be a major step down in quality.


----------



## dougms3

Lumithium said:


> Probably not a good idea to buy Ethernet cables without actual specs. Like CAT5 / CAT6, twisted pair or not etc.
> 
> And most CAT5 cables aren't shielded so it could be a major step down in quality.


I guarantee it won't be a step down in quality vs a standard included in the box ethernet cable.  Those cables the the cheapeast cables available, can't get any cheaper than that, it can only improve from there.

They don't really make cat5 cables anymore its either cat5e or up.  Most cables are UTP cat5e.





Considering that most devices use gigabit ethernet ports (only higher end devices use multi gig), using cat6 or higher won't make any difference since its limited by the port.  Not that it matters because these speeds are only capable intranetwork.  It won't reach those speeds outside of your router unless you have an internet connection capable of gigabit speed, which most people don't.  Simply put the category doesn't really matter for most people, if I were to guess a number 98% of home users.

Almost all consumer ethernet cables are UTP as STP costs more and they won't spend a penny more on STP, they're also very annoying and messy to make out in the field.  

That gold odin ethernet cable has shielding on each conductor and each conductor is about 24awg sterling silver sleeved in teflon (probably).  It also has shielded connectors vs cheap unshielded plastic on the standard cables.

This will be a huge improvement over the standard ethernet cable.


----------



## Rolox (Aug 26, 2022)

Hi everyone, this is my first post on Head-fi. 
I've been reading this thread with much interest as I've been for the last two years a big proponent of the fake Odin cables from Ali.
My system is fully cabled with Odin cable, as interconnects I have the old version with rhodium plated Furutech style (grey carbon fiber) plugs.
Odin speaker cables as well, Odin digital coaxial, and Odin power cables.

I have recently ordered, to try, a pair of the Odin Gold RCA interconnects and received it a few days ago. I installed it between DAC and preamp. There is still the older Odin between preamp and active crossover, and between crossover and amps.
I was shocked to discover the Gold cable made my system sound VERY different from the first second of insertion. That being said, I cannot tell yet if the vast difference is due to the new cable not being burned in yet, but I doubt it. I believe this is a very different sounding cable: less emphasis on the high mids / lower treble range, blacker backgrounds, sweeter and more front to depth perspective. Everything sounded more "focused" at least the first couple of hours. Listening now and it sounds a bit "vague" and fuzzy with slightly bloated and slow lower mids and bass. I suppose I'm hearing the infamous burn-in rollercoaster, even tho with the older Odin the burn-in was different. I've been working a lot and the cables haven't seen a lot of current yet.

There's a promotion at the moment and I'm hesitating on purchasing Gold interconnects to replace all the Odin "1.5" cables remaining, but I'm not sure if it would be the right move... has anyone compared a fully broken in Odin 1 or 1.5 with a fully broken in Odin 2 Gold? Does the Gold become more resolving / with less bloated bass as hours go by? It does have some nice qualities but I'm afraid my system would become overly tubes if I put the gold version everywhere. Yet, I'm using a fully horn loaded, high sensitivity system (105dB/W/m) and some sweetness / warmth wouldn't be a bad thing but not at the expense of precision / definition / PRAT... I'm on the edge here...


----------



## cdacosta

Lumithium said:


> Probably not a good idea to buy Ethernet cables without actual specs. Like CAT5 / CAT6, twisted pair or not etc.
> 
> And most CAT5 cables aren't shielded so it could be a major step down in quality.


I got the Odin Ethernet cable and even though the speed difference from the Gigabyte CAT 5se was about 8%, the audible sonic difference was very obvious.  Paid $63.52 for a 1m shipped.  Very happy with cable.


----------



## cdacosta

Rolox said:


> Hi everyone, this is my first post on Head-fi.
> I've been reading this thread with much interest as I've been for the last two years a big proponent of the fake Odin cables from Ali.
> My system is fully cabled with Odin cable, as interconnects I have the old version with rhodium plated Furutech style (grey carbon fiber) plugs.
> Odin speaker cables as well, Odin digital coaxial, and Odin power cables.
> ...


Your situation is hard to judge.  No idea what your system sounds like now.  What the cables you have sounds like in your system and what you are hoping to achieve by changing the cabling?  What I can tell you is the newer cables (Odin Gold or Odin 2) burned-in (which takes 600+ hours) sound different from out of the box or with just a few hours on them.  I have noted many times in this thread what I found the differences between Odin Gold and Odin 2 to be.  These cables sound horrible during burn-in but are fantastic after burn-in.  If you have a nice system, these cables are dirt cheap to experiment with.  

As an aside, before I even tried my first Odin 2 power cable I needed more cabling like I need another hole in my head.  After getting the cable and breaking it in, the performance surprised me to the point that one by one ended up trying the entire line up.  Have not so far been disappointed with the newer Nordost clone cables.  Value to performance I have not seen in any high end cabling in my 25+ years in the hobby.  But I must note that for interconnects I have only tried the balanced cables.


----------



## msing539

Two questions. 

On the interconnects, there's a directional chevron on the wooden blocks. Are these cables intended to be directional from source or is this just arbitrary, meaning they put the blocks on any which way.

And second, which is really why I'm asking this... the jacket on one of my RCAs doesn't fully go under the connector. So it's essentially exposed where the connector and wire meet. Normally, not a huge deal, but if they are actually directional, that side would end up vertically on the Kenzie and the connector would cut into the wire over time because of the angle.

Any ideas? Is there an aftermarket support I can add for these top inserted cables including the power cord that would act as a strain relief?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Two questions.
> 
> On the interconnects, there's a directional chevron on the wooden blocks. Are these cables intended to be directional from source or is this just arbitrary, meaning they put the blocks on any which way.
> 
> ...


Can you take a pic?

All of my cables were pretty rock solid builds but if you need to adjust it shouldnt be hard.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Can you take a pic?
> 
> All of my cables were pretty rock solid builds but if you need to adjust it shouldnt be hard.


Yeah I'll post tomorrow. The outer sleeve is what I mean--it should end a little under the actual connector. Mine ends just before the connector, only on one RCA cable. Didn't notice it until tonight when I had to redo part of my setup. The other end has plenty but it's impossible to shift the entire jacket over the wire... maybe lube would help.


----------



## cdacosta

cdacosta said:


> Your situation is hard to judge.  No idea what your system sounds like now.  What the cables you have sounds like in your system and what you are hoping to achieve by changing the cabling?  What I can tell you is the newer cables (Odin Gold or Odin 2) burned-in (which takes 600+ hours) sound different from out of the box or with just a few hours on them.  I have noted many times in this thread what I found the differences between Odin Gold and Odin 2 to be.  These cables sound horrible during burn-in but are fantastic after burn-in.  If you have a nice system, these cables are dirt cheap to experiment with.
> 
> As an aside, before I even tried my first Odin 2 power cable I needed more cabling like I need another hole in my head.  After getting the cable and breaking it in, the performance surprised me to the point that one by one ended up trying the entire line up.  Have not so far been disappointed with the newer Nordost clone cables.  Value to performance I have not seen in any high end cabling in my 25+ years in the hobby.  But I must note that for interconnects I have only tried the balanced cables.


Use the directional indicator.  This is so in the future you know which way the cable was burned-in.  Aside cable construction/geometry the cable will burn in a direction over time. 

A cable burned in a certain direction will usually sound different if you flip the signal direction.  From my experience I found this to be true.


----------



## msing539

So I need a strain relief idea in order to run them in that direction. I don't mind taking the ends off the RCA but I don't want to disassemble the power cord to get one on there. Also, I'm guessing plastic or nylon would be safer than metal.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> So I need a strain relief idea in order to run them in that direction. I don't mind taking the ends off the RCA but I don't want to disassemble the power cord to get one on there. Also, I'm guessing plastic or nylon would be safer than metal.


Without pictures I do not understand what you are trying to do or achieve.


----------



## msing539

Sorry, I'm not at my listening spot. 

But this is a stock pic of my amp, the ampsandsound Kenzie. Power and RCAs are inserted in the top, which is a problem for heavy gauge cables. 

The weight of the cables puts a lot of strain where they actually connect on the amp side. I'm trying to alleviate that in some way that doesn't involve right angle adapters, unless that's the only solution.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Sorry, I'm not at my listening spot.
> 
> But this is a stock pic of my amp, the ampsandsound Kenzie. Power and RCAs are inserted in the top, which is a problem for heavy gauge cables.
> 
> The weight of the cables puts a lot of strain where they actually connect on the amp side. I'm trying to alleviate that in some way that doesn't involve right angle adapters, unless that's the only solution.


Hmmm with enough slack the RCA cable should be fine.  But you could sure up the connections on the rca end by adding 3-1 adhesive lined heat shrink over the existing heat shrink and rca connector.  Adhesive lined heatshrink will not bend, very stiff after installation.


----------



## msing539

Thanks! Anything less permanent? Was literally thinking of those plastic tube wraps, but I don't know if they'd hold up under this weight. Or I could do right angle adapters I guess.


----------



## DenverW

Got my Odin silver rca cables today.  Compared to my existing rca cables of different sorts these are significantly thicker and more solid feeling.  There is a lot of cable on this cable!  Sonically I’m going to have difficulty judging improvement, as I’m not able to a/b the cables (and I wont,  as locking rca are a pain!) but I can say there is no downgrade sonically.  good feeling cable.


----------



## Rolox

cdacosta said:


> Your situation is hard to judge.  No idea what your system sounds like now.  What the cables you have sounds like in your system and what you are hoping to achieve by changing the cabling?  What I can tell you is the newer cables (Odin Gold or Odin 2) burned-in (which takes 600+ hours) sound different from out of the box or with just a few hours on them.  I have noted many times in this thread what I found the differences between Odin Gold and Odin 2 to be.  These cables sound horrible during burn-in but are fantastic after burn-in.  If you have a nice system, these cables are dirt cheap to experiment with.
> 
> As an aside, before I even tried my first Odin 2 power cable I needed more cabling like I need another hole in my head.  After getting the cable and breaking it in, the performance surprised me to the point that one by one ended up trying the entire line up.  Have not so far been disappointed with the newer Nordost clone cables.  Value to performance I have not seen in any high end cabling in my 25+ years in the hobby.  But I must note that for interconnects I have only tried the balanced cables.


Well, my system had a slight upper midrange emphasis - brazen, upfront and fast but not so realistic with timbres. Inserting an Odin Gold between DAC and preamp seems to have bettered things; maybe because my "old" odin cables have Rhodium plated plugs? maybe the slight unnatural color comes from the rhodium? I know a lot of people try to avoid it and prefer silver or gold. Or maybe the Gold cable is just less transparent (I doubt it, to my ears it seems to let MORE details and background stuff come through). Basically I just need to know if once burned in, the lows / low mids keep this slightly slow / bloated character or if it's just the lack of burn in that I hear  I guess I'll just take the plunge and purchase the rest of the Gold cables.


----------



## cdacosta

Rolox said:


> Well, my system had a slight upper midrange emphasis - brazen, upfront and fast but not so realistic with timbres. Inserting an Odin Gold between DAC and preamp seems to have bettered things; maybe because my "old" odin cables have Rhodium plated plugs? maybe the slight unnatural color comes from the rhodium? I know a lot of people try to avoid it and prefer silver or gold. Or maybe the Gold cable is just less transparent (I doubt it, to my ears it seems to let MORE details and background stuff come through). Basically I just need to know if once burned in, the lows / low mids keep this slightly slow / bloated character or if it's just the lack of burn in that I hear  I guess I'll just take the plunge and purchase the rest of the Gold cables.


Based on my experience of the Odin Gold XLR balanced interconnects and power cables, after burn-in there is no bloat and the cable is not slow.  A tad slower than the Odin 2 cables but definitely not slow.  I have mentioned more times than I can count in this thread that the burn-in period is a beast for these cables.  After 600+ hours of signal through the cables they sound very different.  Once burned in, timbre is very good from Odin Gold, interconnect or power cable.  There is also a bit of sweetness in the upper  mid and up frequencies.

I have a decent amount of experience with Rhodium connectors, mainly from Furutech.  Before burn-in, timbre is bad and it all sounds off.  Generalizing here, but once burned-in timbre improves but is no where as good as copper or silver.  The off sounding improves quite a lot after full burn-in.  Problem with Rhodium is it also usually has an under plating of silver, How Rhodium connectors sound within a system is very system dependent.  Rhodium is generally good in a system that needs a bit of a push and clarity in the upper registers, say in a very warm and rolled off system.  Break-in for Rhodium is not crazy like these clone Nordost cables, but they sound "off or just not right" until broken-in.

If more transparency, purer timbre, increased resolution and or lower noise floor is what you are after look into Furutech Nano Liquid.  Pause on the cabling for now, and look at the part of your system that most overlook which is the actual mechanical connections within an audio system.  Improving one connection will improve the audible sonic performance of your system.  Improving 20+ would surprise you, possibly shock you.  PRAT improved, everything sounds more real and organic also.


----------



## dougms3

Damn aliexpress sellers, if theres one defining attribute, its that they're dirty liars.

What I ordered and what I received.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Damn aliexpress sellers, if theres one defining attribute, its that they're dirty liars.
> 
> What I ordered and what I received.


I dont get it...is the picture of the cable what you got? its not all gold? how can you tell?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I dont get it...is the picture of the cable what you got? its not all gold? how can you tell?


Its not all gold, its the same as the one I already have except the black print on the connectors.


----------



## dougms3

Also got this fuse for my Ares II, wanted to test it out.

I just installed it and it seems to be more resolving but slightly less bass off the bat vs the telum audio fuse I have.  I'll run it for a while then go back to the telum fuse once this aucharm fuse is burned in and see if theres any significant difference.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Also got this fuse for my Ares II, wanted to test it out.
> 
> I just installed it and it seems to be more resolving but slightly less bass off the bat vs the telum audio fuse I have.  I'll run it for a while then go back to the telum fuse once this aucharm fuse is burned in and see if theres any significant difference.


Fuses can make a difference, but LOL they also have a break-in.  Depending on construction break-in can be long.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Also got this fuse for my Ares II, wanted to test it out.
> 
> I just installed it and it seems to be more resolving but slightly less bass off the bat vs the telum audio fuse I have.  I'll run it for a while then go back to the telum fuse once this aucharm fuse is burned in and see if theres any significant difference.


How much was the fuse?  Link?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Also got this fuse for my Ares II, wanted to test it out.
> 
> I just installed it and it seems to be more resolving but slightly less bass off the bat vs the telum audio fuse I have.  I'll run it for a while then go back to the telum fuse once this aucharm fuse is burned in and see if theres any significant difference.


You guys are getting nuts now!


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> How much was the fuse?  Link?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802pie9ql

About $20 with tax and customs fees.



szore said:


> You guys are getting nuts now!


Lol says the man who bought the wooden cylinders with an rca plug on it.  But I have high hopes that they work!  Waiting on your impressions before I decide to buy it.  

Great rewards come to those with an open mind, although every now and then you get dirty liar sellers that send you silver/gold instead of gold odin power cables, but nevertheless OPEN MIND.


----------



## dougms3

So the new gold odin power cable I received, its a bit different in construction vs the one I had.

The connectors on the new one are lighter and a little smaller, both are metal and non-magnetic.

Wood blocks are slightly different and the new cable is a tiny bit slimmer.

It also sounds a little different too.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Wood blocks are slightly different and the new cable is a tiny bit slimmer.
> 
> ​


At least they're still proudly Made in the USA.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> At least they're still proudly Made in the USA.


Yep good ole Fengang district USA.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Yep good ole Fengang district USA.


I don't get out to Massachusetts too often.


----------



## Zaek (Aug 27, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> So the new gold odin power cable I received, its a bit different in construction vs the one I had.
> 
> The connectors on the new one are lighter and a little smaller, both are metal and non-magnetic.
> 
> ...


Looks like both are made up of the same wires. Does the alternate version sound better? It does look "closer" to the authentic Nordost


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> You guys are getting nuts now!


LOL have been modding and tweaking Hifi for about 25 years. You would be surprised at everything I and many I know have experimented with.  It’s a hobby.


msing539 said:


> At least they're still proudly Made in the USA.


LMAO


----------



## szore

I just consulted a Feng shui expert and she aligned my desktop rig to my chakras...subbass is killer now!


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> I just consulted a Feng shui expert and she aligned my desktop rig to my chakras...subbass is killer now!


I also reached out to Feng Shui to cancel a chakra order but they told me it already shipped.


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Looks like both are made up of the same wires. Does the alternate version sound better? It does look "closer" to the authentic Nordost


I have to switch back and forth to find out the exact differences but it definitely sounds a little different.  Probably not much of a difference considering that I couldn't say specifically what off the bat.  There is a little less bass with the new one though.


----------



## Zaek

dougms3 said:


> I have to switch back and forth to find out the exact differences but it definitely sounds a little different.  Probably not much of a difference considering that I couldn't say specifically what off the bat.  There is a little less bass with the new one though.


Internal wires look the same, so the difference is probably the effect of the plug


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Internal wires look the same, so the difference is probably the effect of the plug


Don't forget the wood.  

Could be the same but the wire is a tiny bit slimmer than the one I have.  Not sure where that difference is but its definitely slimmer.


----------



## msing539

I'm going to pick up an SKW RCA just for comparison. They claim it's single crystal OCC and they're available on both Amazon and AliExpress.


----------



## dougms3

dougms3 said:


> Also got this fuse for my Ares II, wanted to test it out.
> 
> I just installed it and it seems to be more resolving but slightly less bass off the bat vs the telum audio fuse I have.  I'll run it for a while then go back to the telum fuse once this aucharm fuse is burned in and see if theres any significant difference.


@szore you need this fuse for your ares.

It needs some burn in but it started to open up today.  And wow what a difference.  For $20 you need this now.


----------



## dougms3

After A/B testing the old and new odin cable.  

I've come to the conclusion that new odin cable is definitively inferior.  It has less body in the sound, alot less bass volume and impact and the higher frequencies sound recessed and less airy vs the one I had.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> After A/B testing the old and new odin cable.
> 
> I've come to the conclusion that new odin cable is definitively inferior.  It has less body in the sound, alot less bass volume and impact and the higher frequencies sound recessed and less airy vs the one I had.


Maybe that "paper foil" my cable guy was talking about? 

Which fuse should I get for the Ares? I am on the Aliexpress page but there are several options....

On a related note: My BIC500 power conditioner is in Newark, delivery Tuesday!!!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Maybe that "paper foil" my cable guy was talking about?
> 
> Which fuse should I get for the Ares? I am on the Aliexpress page but there are several options....
> 
> On a related note: My BIC500 power conditioner is in Newark, delivery Tuesday!!!


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802vUspdg

Its the 5x20 2A slow blow.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> ...slow blow.



Giggity


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802vUspdg
> 
> Its the 5x20 2A slow blow.


Ordered.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802vUspdg
> 
> Its the 5x20 2A slow blow.


$20 for a good quality audio grade fuse is inexpensive.  I will look at what size fuses my DAC uses and order one to try.  FYI, silver filament fuses take quite a long time to burn-in.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> $20 for a good quality audio grade fuse is inexpensive.  I will look at what size fuses my DAC uses and order one to try.  FYI, silver filament fuses take quite a long time to burn-in.


Its pretty crazy how much its improved over night.

Theres an added sense of naturalness? realism? to the sound with that fuse.  It seems like theres alot more depth, separation, and the imaging is razor sharp, sounds panning across from one side other almost sound real as if something flew past my face.  It doesn't seem possible with a fuse upgrade, I don't know maybe it could be the weed gummies making me hear things.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Its pretty crazy how much its improved over night.
> 
> Theres an added sense of naturalness? realism? to the sound with that fuse.  It seems like theres alot more depth, separation, and the imaging is razor sharp, sounds panning across from one side other almost sound real as if something flew past my face.  It doesn't seem possible with a fuse upgrade, I don't know maybe it could be the weed gummies making me hear things.


But the question is: did you use "The Liquid" on it?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> But the question is: did you use "The Liquid" on it?


Lol yes I did, just like I used it on the telum audio fuse I already had in there.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Its pretty crazy how much its improved over night.
> 
> Theres an added sense of naturalness? realism? to the sound with that fuse.  It seems like theres alot more depth, separation, and the imaging is razor sharp, sounds panning across from one side other almost sound real as if something flew past my face.  It doesn't seem possible with a fuse upgrade, I don't know maybe it could be the weed gummies making me hear things.


Like I mentioned before, the more resolving a system everything matters.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Like I mentioned before, the more resolving a system everything matters.


Plus the gummies probably help.


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Plus the gummies probably help.


They enhance your senses, some say make audio better.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Plus the gummies probably help.


LOL


----------



## szore

Man, listening to the *Szalayi *on my desktop...classical beethoven quartets...strings sound MAGICAL! This thread has had the biggest impact in my audiophile life, seriously... I am thoroughly happy with my rig! Can't wait till everything is burned in 600+ and the liquid is in, plus the bic500...oh, man, such great golden age of audiophile!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Man, listening to the *Szalayi *on my desktop...classical beethoven quartets...strings sound MAGICAL! This thread has had the biggest impact in my audiophile life, seriously... I am thoroughly happy with my rig! Can't wait till everything is burned in 600+ and the liquid is in, plus the bic500...oh, man, such great golden age of audiophile!


Wait till you try the weed gummies.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef1802vUspdg
> 
> Its the 5x20 2A slow blow.


Just ordered a 5x20mm 1 amp fuse for the Proceed DAC.  $22.60 with shipping and tax.  My setup already sounds really sick, especially after all the upgrades.  Trying one of my NOS R2R DACs really took it to new heights, which was your idea!  I am now really considering when I have time to go and get the ML 360 DAC from storage and try it.  Just for kicks and grins.  Just need to find time and desire to sell the Schiit Asgard 3 and Modius stack.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Man, listening to the *Szalayi *on my desktop...classical beethoven quartets...strings sound MAGICAL! This thread has had the biggest impact in my audiophile life, seriously... I am thoroughly happy with my rig! Can't wait till everything is burned in 600+ and the liquid is in, plus the bic500...oh, man, such great golden age of audiophile!


I get it.  I use to spend tens of thousands on gear and cabling (still have main rig in storage).  A really tweaked headphone setup for say $10K or so is mind blowing!

Have you tried the Furutech Nano Liquid in your setup yet?


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Just ordered a 5x20mm 1 amp fuse for the Proceed DAC.  $22.60 with shipping and tax.  My setup already sounds really sick, especially after all the upgrades.  Trying one of my NOS R2R DACs really took it to new heights, which was your idea!  I am now really considering when I have time to go and get the ML 360 DAC from storage and try it.  Just for kicks and grins.  Just need to find time and desire to sell the Schiit Asgard 3 and Modius stack.


I knew those old school r2r dacs are on another level.  While the modius is ok, its not on the same level.  

I going to predict that the fuse will increase the depth, separation and imaging significantly.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I knew those old school r2r dacs are on another level.  While the modius is ok, its not on the same level.
> 
> I going to predict that the fuse will increase the depth, separation and imaging significantly.


That would be cool.  Likely will be better assuming the new fuse is a better conductor than the stock fuse in it now.  When I treated the fuse with Nano Liquid I saw it was the stock fuse.  I thought I replaced the fuse with a better one long ago but obviously not, that is why I ordered this one.

A better conductor= Lower noise floor= More is audible from the original recording  ---> this holds true throughout the signal chain, whether it is power or line level signal.  In my humble journey in this hobby has taught me anything that improves the connection and delivery of electrical signal throughout the chain will lower noise floor.  Lowering noise floor always mean you hear more.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I get it.  I use to spend tens of thousands on gear and cabling (still have main rig in storage).  A really tweaked headphone setup for say $10K or so is mind blowing!
> 
> Have you tried the Furutech Nano Liquid in your setup yet?


I'm going to save that for after burn in is done. Right now I got 3 cables, and after tuesday, 4 cables that are all at different stages of burn in, its confusing to know what's doing what. Maybe around Halloween I'll be ready!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I'm going to save that for after burn in is done. Right now I got 3 cables, and after tuesday, 4 cables that are all at different stages of burn in, its confusing to know what's doing what. Maybe around Halloween I'll be ready!


Your system sonically will be all over the place until you get at least 300+ hours into all cables.  Then the system will start to settle.  Then will come the refinement in different areas until the 600+ hour mark.   Assuming you will be pretty happy at this point.

As you start to apply the Nano Liquid... get ready to hear your system take on levels of refinement that you likely thought not possible.  Will be fun!


----------



## Zaek

did anyone notice any changes on the physical appearance of the Knock-dost gold powercord after burn-in? I though the gold wires looks thicker and more prominent compared when it is still new..


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> That would be cool.  Likely will be better assuming the new fuse is a better conductor than the stock fuse in it now.  When I treated the fuse with Nano Liquid I saw it was the stock fuse.  I thought I replaced the fuse with a better one long ago but obviously not, that is why I ordered this one.
> 
> A better conductor= Lower noise floor= More is audible from the original recording  ---> this holds true throughout the signal chain, whether it is power or line level signal.  In my humble journey in this hobby has taught me anything that improves the connection and delivery of electrical signal throughout the chain will lower noise floor.  Lowering noise floor always mean you hear more.


I took the monster 3 fan video card out of my PC as well as my $200 sound card, switched to mobo video and audio just to get those extra mechanical connections out of the source... lol


----------



## szore

BIC500 is out for delivery, 1 day early, and I'm off today! Ohhhh fun fun fun...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> BIC500 is out for delivery, 1 day early, and I'm off today! Ohhhh fun fun fun...


Do you have the Nano Liquid on hand?  And is your source your PC?


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> BIC500 is out for delivery, 1 day early, and I'm off today! Ohhhh fun fun fun...


Congrats! What will you be hooking up to the BIC?


----------



## szore

I dont have liquid yet gonna wait for after burn in...yes PC is my source.

Well 1 odin 2 cable, thats going on the amp Jotunheim2 and the bic, my next 2 Odin 2 cables will go between my ares2 dac and the bic, and the PC and bic, and my Odin Gold cable will go between the bic and the wall socket.


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> Jotunheim2 ... aes2 ... and the PC


I wonder if this is too much for the BIC with the PC. I'm no good at power calculation, so just wondering.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> I wonder if this is too much for the BIC with the PC. I'm no good at power calculation, so just wondering.


Interesting you said that. I was worried too, so I emailed Alvin at Denefrips and asked him, and he said "Sure! No prfoblem! 500VA power PC." So I just got the BIC installed, plugged everything in, and the fuse blew...thankfully it came with a spare. Plugged everything in WITHOUT PC, and its fine...waiting for Roon to boot up now for a first listen....


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> Interesting you said that. I was worried too, so I emailed Alvin at Denefrips and asked him, and he said "Sure! No prfoblem! 500VA power PC." So I just got the BIC installed, plugged everything in, and the fuse blew...thankfully it came with a spare. Plugged everything in WITHOUT PC, and its fine...waiting for Roon to boot up now for a first listen....


Yeah, I asked because Alvin suggested not running high current amps through it, and their site reads 

"...the BIC500 is suitable for Streamer/DDC/DAC/Preamp or a moderate powered Class A/B amplifier (up to 500VA)." And I would think a PC would be too much.

He also said not to plug switched mode power supplies into it because they could contaminate the signal.


----------



## szore

I just realized my Matrix H USB card is dead...oh boy, havent even listened yet.....


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> I just realized my Matrix H USB card is dead...oh boy, havent even listened yet.....


Well that sucks--have you tried changing slots?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Yeah, I asked because Alvin suggested not running high current amps through it, and their site reads
> 
> "...the BIC500 is suitable for Streamer/DDC/DAC/Preamp or a moderate powered Class A/B amplifier (up to 500VA)." And I would think a PC would be too much.
> 
> He also said not to plug switched mode power supplies into it because they could contaminate the signal.


That's interesting.

Regarding the smps contaminating the power supply.  Good to know.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> That's interesting.
> 
> Regarding the smps contaminating the power supply.  Good to know.


SMPS will bleed or contaminate into the power line or circuit. Ifi products are suppose to be better at controlling the contamination.


----------



## dougms3 (Aug 30, 2022)

After taking a closer look at the cable, it appears to all gold.  What appears to silver in the cable are actually air gaps and the reflection of the foil and pvc.  All of the gold and silver odin cables are all gold, its the reflections that make it appear silver.






On another note, this seller that I purchase from Goltech, got really lazy and didnt bother to put screws in on one of the connectors and its also missing the silicon wire tensioner around the wire.


----------



## msing539

Was this from a seller you bought the other cables from?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Was this from a seller you bought the other cables from?


No the other cable I bought was from timeless.


----------



## dougms3

@szore any update in those magic wooden blocks?

Still processing at fengang usa or has it passed thru customs yet?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> @szore any update in those magic wooden blocks?
> 
> Still processing at fengang usa or has it passed thru customs yet?


I think they just went through customes. Those 2 iem cables were delivered today...ill check them out tonight


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I think they just went through customes. Those 2 iem cables were delivered today...ill check them out tonight


Nice.

That was fast for the cables.

Interested in hearing your thoughts on those cables, especially the palladium.


----------



## szore (Sep 2, 2022)

Wow. Got the cables, very happy, very impressed. Best part was the best unboxing I ever had in my life, totally charmed. The palladium cable brings utter clarity, warmth and detail to the Szalayi, the gold plated silver has clarity, warmth...built like tanks....The soundstage has really become huge....Those embroided pouches are lined with felt! Imagine my surprise when I opened these boxes and found these beautiful cables inside!

Got the little electrostatic dodads too, put one on my dac, 1 on amp, and one on my computer. I cant say I "hear a difference" especially since I haver this new cable, all I can say is my desktop sounds amazing!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Wow. Got the cables, very happy, very impressed. Best part was the best unboxing I ever had in my life, totally charmed. The palladium cable brings utter clarity, warmth and detail to the Szaoyolis, the gold plated silver has clarity, warmth...built like tanks....The soundstage has really become huge....Those embroided pouches are lined with felt! Imagine my surprise when I opened these boxes and found these beautiful cables inside!
> 
> Got the little electrostatic dodads too, put one on my dac, 1 on amp, and one on my computer. I cant say I "hear a difference" especially since I haver this new cable, all I can say is my desktop sounds amazing!


Pretty cool you are happy with your purchase.  I am personally very hesitant with headphone cables made far away, in case they muck it up.


----------



## szore (Sep 2, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Pretty cool you are happy with your purchase.  I am personally very hesitant with headphone cables made far away, in case they muck it up.


If I paid over a grand for these I would have been happy, these are the real deal. Only $220. And the gold plated silver cable is gourgeous...huge soundstage, warm clarity...quantum leap...i mean, its as good as the power cables in terms of instant improvement. It was a quantum leap...same with these...thinking of getting the 8 wire pure silver now....


----------



## szore

Can't say I really hear a difference, but I'm still breaking in power cables... but here they are in action...Ground Loop Noise Isolator Filter....


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> If I paid over a grand for these I would have been happy, these are the real deal. Only $220. And the gold plated silver cable is gourgeous...huge soundstage, warm clarity...quantum leap...i mean, its as good as the power cables in terms of instant improvement. It was a quantum leap...same with these...thinking of getting the 8 wire pure silver now....


Nice!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Can't say I really hear a difference, but I'm still breaking in power cables... but here they are in action...Ground Loop Noise Isolator Filter....


From the picture looks like the filter is alligator clipped to a coated bolt to a component chassis. Not sure how that would do anything?


----------



## szore

I


cdacosta said:


> From the picture looks like the filter is alligator clipped to a coated bolt to a component chassis. Not sure how that would do anything?


Yeah, I thought of that. I'll clip it better.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I
> 
> Yeah, I thought of that. I'll clip it better.


Assuming chassis is grounded, would need to tap on to bare metal on chassis to have a chance for it to do anything.  I am no electrical engineer or specialist but I am assuming here.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> From the picture looks like the filter is alligator clipped to a coated bolt to a component chassis. Not sure how that would do anything?


How's this ground loop isolator supposed to work?


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> How's this ground loop isolator supposed to work?


Your guess is better than mine.   LOL.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Your guess is better than mine.   LOL.


No idea... But I agree, a ground contact would ideally meet with bare unpainted metal on the chassis. Might be better to try to attach it on the bottom where any cleaned metal wouldn't greatly affect the appearance or resale value.


----------



## DecentLevi (Sep 4, 2022)

Got this Odin 2 (0.3m) USB cable today to upgrade my USB cable. Super SUPER pleased with the result. I was coming from a decent hi-fi quality brand name that's lost on me (below), which I fitted with premium ferrite chokes that work on attenuating specific frequencies and actually did improve the sound. THIS however is a different beast! Instant audibly noticeable upgrade. Sound is much more vivid, with both soundstage and freq. response more full / wider, even more lush, velvety and just true to life in general. And that's even with no burn-in! This was used after my USB optical cable and series of USB regenerators / purifiers then this into the DDC that's before the DAC.





previous:




I got it from seller Getwire. I requested the "Odin 2" USB cable since I didn't see it, but whether or not it's labeled as Odin 2, if it looks the same as the above, it will be the same one.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Got this Odin 2 (0.3m) USB cable today to upgrade my USB cable. Super SUPER pleased with the result. I was coming from a decent hi-fi quality brand name that's lost on me (below), which I fitted with premium ferrite chokes that work on attenuating specific frequencies and actually did improve the sound. THIS however is a different beast! Instant audibly noticeable upgrade. Sound is much more vivid, with both soundstage and freq. response more full / wider, even more lush, velvety and just true to life in general. And that's even with no burn-in! This was used after my USB optical cable and series of USB regenerators / purifiers then this into the DDC that's before the DAC.
> 
> 
> previous:
> ...


The interesting thing is likely it costed you the price of lunch or a dinner.  LOL that cracks me up!


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> The interesting thing is likely it costed you the price of lunch or a dinner.  LOL that cracks me up!


Only costed $40 (since it was 0.3 meters) and sounds like $1,000's.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Only costed $40 (since it was 0.3 meters) and sounds like $1,000's.


Glad this thread has assisted in your musical enjoyment.  👍


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Got this Odin 2 (0.3m) USB cable today to upgrade my USB cable. Super SUPER pleased with the result. I was coming from a decent hi-fi quality brand name that's lost on me (below), which I fitted with premium ferrite chokes that work on attenuating specific frequencies and actually did improve the sound. THIS however is a different beast! Instant audibly noticeable upgrade. Sound is much more vivid, with both soundstage and freq. response more full / wider, even more lush, velvety and just true to life in general. And that's even with no burn-in! This was used after my USB optical cable and series of USB regenerators / purifiers then this into the DDC that's before the DAC.
> 
> 
> previous:
> ...


Yeah I remember that usb cable made a pretty big difference.  

Surprising how much the silver makes and the conductor shielding with teflon sleeve probably helps alot to reduce the EMI bleed from the power in the cable.


----------



## szore

I had the same cable but I blew it out during my bic500 mishap. Instantly ordered another one, awesome cable!


----------



## szore

This is from the sellers page concerning the "things" clipped to my chasis...lol

Principle of action:

1. It can reduce the static electricity generated by the accumulation of free electrons, so that the equipment casing maintains a stable potential and reduces interference with signals. The sound is more stable and the sound field is more clear.

2. It can reduce the static potential energy of electrons.

Instructions:

1. Connect to the case, preferably on the screw. It can change the spatial separation well and the sound is simulated. It is best to use every device in the system. Note: Different screws on the device have different sounds and you can try more.

2. Connect the negative terminal of the speaker terminal of the amplifier output to improve the softness of the sound.

3. One device can use multiple electronic black holes, and the effects can be superimposed.

4. If the case has no conductive place, try to clamp it on the interface.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> This is from the sellers page concerning the "things" clipped to my chasis...lol
> 
> Principle of action:
> 
> ...


So the design of the device is to help reduce static electricity within a component.  Although I have never heard of this phenomenon being a thing before, I suppose anything is possible.  Since you have one of these magical devices on hand, try it at different places and “if” there is an appreciable audible difference I would open it up and see how it is designed and then research how to make a better one.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> I would open it up and see how it is designed and then research how to make a better one.


Would personally like to see what's inside it, too. 

Let's start placing bets...

A. Ferrite core
B. Magnet
C. Metal block with wire wrapped around it
D. Polyfill
E. Petroleum jelly
F. Hopes and dreams
G. Hello Kitty and/or a Polly Pocket
H. Nothing
I. The answer to life, the universe, and everything


----------



## szore (Sep 4, 2022)

I read there is a "silicone wafer" inside. Ohhh.... 

It's heavy and dense and filled with black epoxy...I would need a hacksaw at least to cut this open....


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Would personally like to see what's inside it, too.
> 
> Let's start placing bets...
> 
> ...


I'm going to add.

J. Rhino Horn
K. Civet musk glands
L. Bear Bile


----------



## szore

Coming back to the IEM cables, I cannot recommend enough. The palladium plated gold plated silver one sheds a light on the mids, really highlights the Szalayi's planar driver. The foundatation is what you get on the gold plated silver without palladium cable. Both cables have HUGE soundstages that really open up, and also great clarity and detail. And everything has that sweet, gold plated shimmer, absolutley stunning! I'm using the GPS with Szalayi and it is holographic, sweet, egaging with stunning clarity and detail, the SZA really lights up! All my IEM's I tried with these cables were super charged, It's like getting a whole new IEM collection with 1 upgrade, its THAT dramatic. Easily on par with $1K+ cables. And they are both 8 wire. The 8 wire Horus sells for $3,400, this is $220....


----------



## msing539

Well is says right on it what's in it.​


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Coming back to the IEM cables, I cannot recommend enough. The palladium plated gold plated silver one sheds a light on the mids, really highlights the Szalayi's planar driver. The foundatation is what you get on the gold plated silver without palladium cable. Both cables have HUGE soundstages that really open up, and also great clarity and detail. And everything has that sweet, gold plated shimmer, absolutley stunning! I'm using the GPS with Szalayi and it is holographic, sweet, egaging with stunning clarity and detail, the SZA really lights up! All my IEM's I tried with these cables were super charged, It's like getting a whole new IEM collection with 1 upgrade, its THAT dramatic. Easily on par with $1K+ cables. And they are both 8 wire. The 8 wire Horus sells for $3,400, this is $220....


Do you have the link for this cable?


----------



## Ficcion2

I finally had my cables delivered Friday evening.
They sure feel and look nice.
Not really pliable but I managed to have them angled well enough.

Pertaining to sound I have no opinion at the moment especially since my DAC is also brand new.

I’m considering the USB cable as well once I decide which transport I should get for my DAC.



The blocks are growing on me….


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Do you have the link for this cable?


Hiclass HIFI Connector Store

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/1101929486?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.1b7e18023R5Zhs


----------



## dougms3

Ficcion2 said:


> I finally had my cables delivered Friday evening.
> They sure feel and look nice.
> Not really pliable but I managed to have them angled well enough.
> 
> ...


Just double check that the cables have all the screws and the wire tensioner.  

Can't believe this seller is giving me problems with this cable he sent me that were missing those.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I read there is a "silicone wafer" inside. Ohhh....
> 
> It's heavy and dense and filled with black epoxy...I would need a hacksaw at least to cut this open....


First thing is first, does it do anything that is audible?


----------



## msing539

These gorram blocks...


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Well is says right on it what's in it.​


What “audio yeast”? LMAO


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> First thing is first, does it do anything that is audible?


With all these cables burning in and a brand new dac I'm also burning in, who can tell? When I touch it to the chasis I do not hear an 'improvemnt', no. But like I said i'm burning in 4 power cables and a DAC....


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> What “audio yeast”? LMAO


It helps grow the sound... also makes it moist.


----------



## cdacosta

Ficcion2 said:


> I finally had my cables delivered Friday evening.
> They sure feel and look nice.
> Not really pliable but I managed to have them angled well enough.
> 
> ...


When the cables are installed I do not notice the wood. Personally do not look at the cables while listening to the headphone system.  

The burn-in is long and the sonic ride is very strange.  Cannot imagine an entire system burning in these cables all at once. Would recommend refraining judging until at least 300 hours of signal through these cables. This puts it about 1/2 way through burn-in process.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> It helps grow the sound... also makes it moist.


LOL


----------



## cdacosta

I think there are several that visit this thread now that have these clone Nordost cables (Odin Gold and Odin 2).  Would be interesting to know from those that have enough burn-in through them what your opinions are of these cables?  And any comparison to what you had installed previously might be helpful to others.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> I think there are several that visit this thread now that have these clone Nordost cables (Odin Gold and Odin 2).  Would be interesting to know from those that have enough burn-in through them what your opinions are of these cables?  And any comparison to what you had installed previously might be helpful to others.


Previously, I had Pangea power cables, Kimber Kable and Nordost Red Dawn interconnects, and a Wireworld Starlight USB. 

Upgrading from the Starlight and Kimber to the Odin 2, details and microdynamics are noticeably improved. There's a greater sense of air and more impactful bass, at least initially. Bass has been calming down but it's now articulate and well defined, with great texture. The change was also there swapping out the Pangea power cords, but to a smaller extent. The interconnects were more noticeable and the power cords were more of a tweak in my setup.

The Nordost Red Dawn XLR is a great cable and I've kept it to A/B down the line. Everything else is sold, except for one Pangea cable which... @cdacosta I'm guessing will buy from me.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Previously, I had Pangea power cables, Kimber Kable and Nordost Red Dawn interconnects, and a Wireworld Starlight USB.
> 
> Upgrading from the Starlight and Kimber to the Odin 2, details and microdynamics are noticeably improved. There's a greater sense of air and more impactful bass, at least initially. Bass has been calming down but it's now articulate and well defined, with great texture. The change was also there swapping out the Pangea power cords, but to a smaller extent. The interconnects were more noticeable and the power cords were more of a tweak in my setup.
> 
> The Nordost Red Dawn XLR is a great cable and I've kept it to A/B down the line. Everything else is sold, except for one Pangea cable which... @cdacosta I'm guessing will buy from me.


How long have the cables been burning-in would you say?


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> How long have the cables been burning-in would you say?


The interconnects have roughly 275-300 hours. The USB I've had longer so maybe 375-400 hours now.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> The interconnects have roughly 275-300 hours. The USB I've had longer so maybe 375-400 hours now.


That is cool. If you like the way your system sounds now you will hear refinement during the next 300 or so hours. At about 600 hours or so the system (or cables) settle in and you have what you hear.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> Well is says right on it what's in it.​


hey I saw what you did! It should have been called 'Audio Donothing'


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Yeah I remember that usb cable made a pretty big difference.
> 
> Surprising how much the silver makes and the conductor shielding with teflon sleeve probably helps alot to reduce the EMI bleed from the power in the cable.


Although the Odin "2" USB cable looks and performs SPLENDIDLY, I'm still questioning whether or not it actually contains silver. I mean the look and performance gives me no reason to doubt it, but the cheap price leaves me wondering what it's actually made of? Even if so, they chose a good material whatever it is. 

Same goes for the Odin Gold AC cable, now that can't be made of real gold but I'm still not faulting it. One observation however when taking that apart to do cdacosta's nano liquid suggestion was that the connection assembly and external connectors are made out of cheap standard brass and/or copper. Again I'll say however it works superbly though.


----------



## DecentLevi

szore said:


> Coming back to the IEM cables, I cannot recommend enough. The palladium plated gold plated silver one sheds a light on the mids, really highlights the Szalayi's planar driver. The foundatation is what you get on the gold plated silver without palladium cable. Both cables have HUGE soundstages that really open up, and also great clarity and detail. And everything has that sweet, gold plated shimmer, absolutley stunning! I'm using the GPS with Szalayi and it is holographic, sweet, egaging with stunning clarity and detail, the SZA really lights up! All my IEM's I tried with these cables were super charged, It's like getting a whole new IEM collection with 1 upgrade, its THAT dramatic. Easily on par with $1K+ cables. And they are both 8 wire. The 8 wire Horus sells for $3,400, this is $220....


Those cables do look nice. Any word on microphonics? For me that is the biggest issue I've had with a silver modestly stiff upgrade I got at a good hi-fi earphone store in Tokyo. Top pure quality, but even breathing results in a big amplified sound into your ears.

Also which are your favorite IEMs to pair with it so far?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Although the Odin "2" USB cable looks and performs SPLENDIDLY, I'm still questioning whether or not it actually contains silver. I mean the look and performance gives me no reason to doubt it, but the cheap price leaves me wondering what it's actually made of? Even if so, they chose a good material whatever it is.
> 
> Same goes for the Odin Gold AC cable, now that can't be made of real gold but I'm still not faulting it. One observation however when taking that apart to do cdacosta's nano liquid suggestion was that the connection assembly and external connectors are made out of cheap standard brass and/or copper. Again I'll say however it works superbly though.


Its most likely sterling silver conductors. 

I opened up one of the cables to verify.

It's on the first page of this thread.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> Its most likely sterling silver conductors.



Sterling Archer would have been more impressive.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Its most likely sterling silver conductors.
> 
> I opened up one of the cables to verify.
> 
> It's on the first page of this thread.


You know in my case, I tried these cables because of a recommendation.   Never heard of using Sterling Silver for conductors or plating with conductors.  Except of course the Chinglish on Aliexpress listings.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Those cables do look nice. Any word on microphonics? For me that is the biggest issue I've had with a silver modestly stiff upgrade I got at a good hi-fi earphone store in Tokyo. Top pure quality, but even breathing results in a big amplified sound into your ears.
> 
> Also which are your favorite IEMs to pair with it so far?


No microphonics that I can detect, build is excellent. I've been listening mostly to the Szalayi on the gold plated silver cable. But also the Penon Vortex, after bass mod, turns into a BEAST on these cables...even off the DAP the Vortex just transforms into a monster IEM.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> You know in my case, I tried these cables because of a recommendation.   Never heard of using Sterling Silver for conductors or plating with conductors.  Except of course the Chinglish on Aliexpress listings.


I figure its the aliexpress seller way, they market it as pure silver knowing its sterling silver or some kind of alloy.  I cut the wire to make sure it was all solid core silver. 99.99 % of people will have no way to check it, unless its melted down or lab tested.

But its my opinion that sterling silver, which is typically 92.5%/7.5% silver/copper mix but even if its less silver than that, I think its still better than silver plated copper.  I believe there are some arguments related to SPC on how it contributes to time smear.  I'm in the camp that tends to believe it does so typically I would prefer an alloy rather than plating.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I figure its the aliexpress seller way, they market it as pure silver knowing its sterling silver or some kind of alloy.  I cut the wire to make sure it was all solid core silver. 99.99 % of people will have no way to check it, unless its melted down or lab tested.
> 
> But its my opinion that sterling silver, which is typically 92.5%/7.5% silver/copper mix but even if its less silver than that, I think its still better than silver plated copper.  I believe there are some arguments related to SPC on how it contributes to time smear.  I'm in the camp that tends to believe it does so typically I would prefer an alloy rather than plating.


Agreed. I also prefer an alloy vs silver plating.  Whatever the metal composition, it works well.  For me, performance to price I find to be stellar.  Zero reason to build cables when these can be had so inexpensively.


----------



## dougms3

Was looking at this for a while and noticed that this seller reduced it to $32 so I can't not try it for that price.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832580085862.html


----------



## Flavioccastro

Hi guys. I read the entire thread and didn’t find what I’m looking for.

To avoid the OTG adapter, I’m looking for a good USB C to USB B cable to connect my fire HD 8 to ayima D03.

Or it’s better to use the fake cable from AliExpress (the recommended here) with the otg adapter (usb A to C).

Thanks for the help.

Edit. I need to buy from AliExpress.


----------



## dougms3

Flavioccastro said:


> Hi guys. I read the entire thread and didn’t find what I’m looking for.
> 
> To avoid the OTG adapter, I’m looking for a good USB C to USB B cable to connect my fire HD 8 to ayima D03.
> 
> ...


Its always best to avoid adapters if you can.

It probably will be difficult to find an odin with usb c.  The conductors are way to large to fit into the usb C connector.

I think I have seen some other sellers on aliexpress sell usb c to usb b that will probably be better quality than some cheap off the shelf cable.  If I come across it again I'll post it here but you'll have better luck searching directly.


----------



## cdacosta

Flavioccastro said:


> Hi guys. I read the entire thread and didn’t find what I’m looking for.
> 
> To avoid the OTG adapter, I’m looking for a good USB C to USB B cable to connect my fire HD 8 to ayima D03.
> 
> ...


If you can find a decent adapter the USB cable you have seen recommended will work fine for your setup.  Be aware the USB cable will be heavy for your use or tablet and little amp/DAC.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Coming back to the IEM cables, I cannot recommend enough. The palladium plated gold plated silver one sheds a light on the mids, really highlights the Szalayi's planar driver. The foundatation is what you get on the gold plated silver without palladium cable. Both cables have HUGE soundstages that really open up, and also great clarity and detail. And everything has that sweet, gold plated shimmer, absolutley stunning! I'm using the GPS with Szalayi and it is holographic, sweet, egaging with stunning clarity and detail, the SZA really lights up! All my IEM's I tried with these cables were super charged, It's like getting a whole new IEM collection with 1 upgrade, its THAT dramatic. Easily on par with $1K+ cables. And they are both 8 wire. The 8 wire Horus sells for $3,400, this is $220....



Does this scale well with the lower end iems?  iems I have are under $120.


----------



## Flavioccastro (Sep 6, 2022)

Thank you guys.

I have some cable in my list and later I’ll share the links here.

I think my otg adapter is good quality.

And I have one usb c / b cable from ugreen but isn’t specific for audio.


----------



## Zaek

This came in today.. (First impression) was insanely good even without burn-in. Let's wait for 500hrs n see how it performs


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> This came in today.. (First impression) was insanely good even without burn-in. Let's wait for 500hrs n see how it performs


USB Odin Gold, have not seen one of these yet.


----------



## Flavioccastro

Hi guys!

This is my cable from ugreen:

https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005..._list.0.0.21efcaa4jEVf9P&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

And those on my list:

1- https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005...37460.0.0.1be52e0edb9gSr&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

2- https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005...37460.0.0.1be52e0edb9gSr&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

3- https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005...37460.0.0.1be52e0edb9gSr&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

4- https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005...37460.0.0.1be52e0edb9gSr&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

I don't know the difference between the 2 and 3......but both is probably my choice....

I know my system is simple (before the class d amp, I had one HK 235 to drive a 5.1 system (floorstanding speakers) and today just a stereo setup with the same L and R speakers -- and they sound much better now)


----------



## Flavioccastro

This store on Aliexpress have some USB C cables:

AliExpress

Purovoz Store​


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Does this scale well with the lower end iems?  iems I have are under $120.


Absolutley! Every IEM in my collection from the Vortex to my custom Valkyries sound like super energized! I cannot recommend enough....The only thing is the one with palladium does push the mids forward...its perefect for my customs but some of the other iems...the mids can be a bit forward with that cable. However the gilded silver (gold plated) is lush and magnificant! Both cables have huge soundstage...I ordered the pure silver 8 wire yesterday!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Absolutley! Every IEM in my collection from the Vortex to my custom Valkyries sound like super energized! I cannot recommend enough....The only thing is the one with palladium does push the mids forward...its perefect for my customs but some of the other iems...the mids can be a bit forward with that cable. However the gilded silver (gold plated) is lush and magnificant! Both cables have huge soundstage...I ordered the pure silver 8 wire yesterday!


I actually like forward mids.  Thanks that helps alot.

Been wanting to try one of those palladium cables for a while.  I see that the cable is listed as a palladium, silver, copper alloy which is exactly what I wanted.  I'll keep on my wishlist, will wait for a sale.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> I actually like forward mids.  Thanks that helps alot.
> 
> Been wanting to try one of those palladium cables for a while.  I see that the cable is listed as a palladium, silver, copper alloy which is exactly what I wanted.  I'll keep on my wishlist, will wait for a sale.


If you want I can send you mine to play with for a week, then just send it back....up to you...


----------



## dougms3

Appreciate it thanks, but unfortunately I only have iems that use the qdc connectors.  

I trust your judgement, I will keep an eye on it on the next big sale, should be one coming up soon.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Appreciate it thanks, but unfortunately I only have iems that use the qdc connectors.
> 
> I trust your judgement, I will keep an eye on it on the next big sale, should be one coming up soon.


In my mind they are 'as good' as the power cords, if you know what I mean...sorry, i'm just really enthusiastic about these cables...the power cables too, everything sounds great, tho literally everything is burning in! Even the IEMs...my new usb cable shipped, and i havent heard back from Element yet about repairing my usb card....in the meantime using the RME stock usb cable in regular usb port...


----------



## dougms3

Flavioccastro said:


> Hi guys!
> 
> This is my cable from ugreen:
> 
> ...


I would recommend something else that is made of sterling silver, maybe something like this.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...a16625089936567848e4e6f!12000029920015938!rec

The knockoff odin cable is really nice because each conductor is individually shielded with a teflon sleeve.  I think thats the main reason why it sounds so good, it helps to  isolate the conductor that carries power so it minimizes contamination of the audio signal.

Or you could message one of the sellers that sell the odin usb cable and ask if they can make one with the usb c connector.  Try asking a few of them and see what they say.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> In my mind they are 'as good' as the power cords, if you know what I mean...sorry, i'm just really enthusiastic about these cables...the power cables too, everything sounds great, tho literally everything is burning in! Even the IEMs...my new usb cable shipped, and i havent heard back from Element yet about repairing my usb card....in the meantime using the RME stock usb cable in regular usb port...


Wait till that fuse comes in.  If you're using the stock fuse on the ares, you're in for a real treat.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Wait till that fuse comes in.  If you're using the stock fuse on the ares, you're in for a real treat.


The fuse is with my local carrier. I already ordered another Odin2 USB cable, I was very happy with it...  Plus my low noise usb card only takes regular usb, not C


----------



## DecentLevi

Zaek said:


> This came in today.. (First impression) was insanely good even without burn-in. Let's wait for 500hrs n see how it performs


Wow they have Odin Gold USB cables? I could have sworn I only saw Odin 2 silver for USB cables. And how long is that? Looks like a beast. AFAIK however shorter runs are generally better for digital cables such as USB and RCA coax.


----------



## DenverW

Odin Gold power cable came in today, and I'm "burning it in" right now.  (translation, listening to music)  Bright, colorful cable, almost a bit too busy for my set up; it draws the eye!   Also, the plug connection feels a bit lose on the Bigger Ben, but I'm getting a good connection and power is flowing.

Musically I'll just have a wait a long, long, time until I feel like it's fully burned in (at my listening rate this will be about 3 months to get 500 hours) and then i'll swap in the previous cable to see what difference I hear.  Sounds great at the moment, though .


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Wow they have Odin Gold USB cables? I could have sworn I only saw Odin 2 silver for USB cables. And how long is that? Looks like a beast. AFAIK however shorter runs are generally better for digital cables such as USB and RCA coax.


Yeah its fairly new, they also have gold ethernet cables too.


----------



## cdacosta

DenverW said:


> Odin Gold power cable came in today, and I'm "burning it in" right now.  (translation, listening to music)  Bright, colorful cable, almost a bit too busy for my set up; it draws the eye!   Also, the plug connection feels a bit lose on the Bigger Ben, but I'm getting a good connection and power is flowing.
> 
> Musically I'll just have a wait a long, long, time until I feel like it's fully burned in (at my listening rate this will be about 3 months to get 500 hours) and then i'll swap in the previous cable to see what difference I hear.  Sounds great at the moment, though .


When you say the plug feels a bit loose are you referring to IEC to component IEC input?  If yes you can use plumbers Teflon tape and wrap around the male portion of the IEC connector. Use the amount you need to get a snug fit.  This will also help dampen micro vibration a bit.


----------



## Zaek

DecentLevi said:


> Wow they have Odin Gold USB cables? I could have sworn I only saw Odin 2 silver for USB cables. And how long is that? Looks like a beast. AFAIK however shorter runs are generally better for digital cables such as USB and RCA coax.


Mine is a 3m.


----------



## Guipnox

For a reference sound, is it better to just buy silver cables?
I plan to make YouTube reviews about headphones using Questyle CMA 400i (still waiting for its arrival) as DAC/AMP and preamp for my monoblocks (to test hungry planars like HE6seV2).
I received this coaxial cable yesterday but I can't use it yet as my DDC is with a friend.
On Friday, I'll be able to compare it to a "generic" coaxial from AliExpress.

Thanks in advance,

Gui


----------



## DecentLevi

Your RCA coax cable looks the same as mine, but mine is twisted more times. Silver can be good for a reference sound, especially if it's thicker to avoid brightness, such as these. Odin Gold are superb also.


----------



## dougms3

Guipnox said:


> For a reference sound, is it better to just buy silver cables?
> I plan to make YouTube reviews about headphones using Questyle CMA 400i (still waiting for its arrival) as DAC/AMP and preamp for my monoblocks (to test hungry planars like HE6seV2).
> I received this coaxial cable yesterday but I can't use it yet as my DDC is with a friend.
> On Friday, I'll be able to compare it to a "generic" coaxial from AliExpress.
> ...


Looks the same as mine but mine has the darker brown wood block that says odin 2, its probably the same though.


----------



## dougms3

Just a heads up regarding that gold odin power cable i bought from a seller named goltech on aliexpress.

He shipped me a cable with missing parts.  Missing screws in the connector and no wire tensioner, so basically the connector is held on by the strength of the clamped wires which is pretty dangerous.

I asked to return the item, he said I'll send screws.  I said I'd be more comfortable returning the item.  So he said to return the item on my dime which is like $50, i filed a dispute with aliexpress, they rejected my claim for some reason.  So i filed a dispute with my cc company.

Just a heads up, may want to avoid this seller.


----------



## Flavioccastro

Hi guys!

The seller from HIFI store - https://www.aliexpress.com/store/405877 - will make the Nordost cable with USB-C.

https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/1005..._list.0.0.fb5dcaa4J3rb5z&gatewayAdapt=glo2bra

That one with USB C -- USB B.


----------



## drspeter

Flavioccastro said:


> Hi guys!
> 
> The seller from HIFI store - https://www.aliexpress.com/store/405877 - will make the Nordost cable with USB-C.
> 
> ...


Glad to hear but I am afraid that usb c connection is not firm enough compared to usb a to withstand that thick and stiff cable... but still very tempting so I may end up buying one. I was initially eyeing on the silver plated ofc from xangsane cable, which comes in B C connection option as well.


----------



## dougms3

drspeter said:


> Glad to hear but I am afraid that usb c connection is not firm enough compared to usb a to withstand that thick and stiff cable... but still very tempting so I may end up buying one. I was initially eyeing on the silver plated ofc from xangsane cable, which comes in B C connection option as well.


Forgot about that.  That cable is crazy thick and heavy, it might snap off at the connector with even a light touch.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 9, 2022)

Hello All. Very nice thread indeed...

From reading thru the thread: I see you guys really went all-in on Odins ) Yes, I remember that fake Odin2 12 core silver plated XLR was another eye-opener  back in the day… IMHO, Odin2 12 core USB AND 12 core XLRs are the best, but the AC Odin2 was nothing special. From my experience with AC cables on Ali, I should say: Odin2 < AQ Wel < AQ Dragon (I own both versions the source & high current) < Siltech triple crown solid silver… Maybe Odin2 was nothing special due to the “Synergy” aspect of my system, but replacing it with the AQ Dragon on my Amp made huge jump in SQ...

The best cables I came across were: Siltech triple crown XLR, Speaker Cables and AC power cord… They are just awesome.
Speaking of shopping Asian markets, due to the lows on Japanese Yen, shopping in Japan is exciting as well as in China again ) I ordered that FURUTECH Contact Rejuvenator Nano Liquid for 90 USD Plan to replace my old Monosaudio AC receptacle soon) Thanks for the heads up on that …


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Hello All. Very nice thread indeed...
> 
> From reading thru the thread: I see you guys really went all-in on Odins ) Yes, I remember that fake Odin2 12 core silver plated XLR was another eye-opener  back in the day… IMHO, Odin2 12 core USB AND 12 core XLRs are the best, but the AC Odin2 was nothing special. From my experience with AC cables on Ali, I should say: Odin2 < AQ Wel < AQ Dragon (I own both versions the source & high current) < Siltech triple crown solid silver… Maybe Odin2 was nothing special due to the “Synergy” aspect of my system, but replacing it with the AQ Dragon on my Amp made huge jump in SQ...
> 
> ...


I was wondering about those AQ and siltech cables.

I think even the fake market scales in performance lol.


----------



## DenverW

Crypt Keeper said:


> Hello All. Very nice thread indeed...
> 
> From reading thru the thread: I see you guys really went all-in on Odins ) Yes, I remember that fake Odin2 12 core silver plated XLR was another eye-opener  back in the day… IMHO, Odin2 12 core USB AND 12 core XLRs are the best, but the AC Odin2 was nothing special. From my experience with AC cables on Ali, I should say: Odin2 < AQ Wel < AQ Dragon (I own both versions the source & high current) < Siltech triple crown solid silver… Maybe Odin2 was nothing special due to the “Synergy” aspect of my system, but replacing it with the AQ Dragon on my Amp made huge jump in SQ...
> 
> ...


Any link to look at the siltech?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I was wondering about those AQ and siltech cables.
> 
> I think even the fake market scales in performance lol.


Speaking of Siltech triple crown, I think they are like 70-80 % of the original . And the Original speaker cable has 77 K price tag … If one would purchase original Furutech FI-50 NCFs in Japan and replace the fake ones on Siltech trpl crown solid silver power cord that would bring fake Siltech so close to the original … It definitely would be over that 70% mark … And the original got crazy price tag of 15-20 K USD .


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DenverW said:


> Any link to look at the siltech?


XLR, AC power cord or Speaker cables ?


----------



## DenverW

Crypt Keeper said:


> XLR, AC power cord or Speaker cables ?


Power cable.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DenverW said:


> Power cable.


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801143969853.html

Seller store : Cheap Shop Store


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801143969853.html
> 
> Seller store : Cheap Shop Store


I bought my argento xlrs from him which sound great but for cheaper stuff he drags his feet.

For 3 weeks he didn't ship my order, then sent it on the last day express international which I got in 3 days.

When I ordered the knockoff gryphon cable from him, he made a shipping label so I couldnt cancel it then for 3.5 weeks kept telling me, I'll ship it tomorrow, in 2 days, in 2 days, then I had to file a claim because he stopped answering my messages.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I bought my argento xlrs from him which sound great but for cheaper stuff he drags his feet.
> 
> For 3 weeks he didn't ship my order, then sent it on the last day express international which I got in 3 days.
> 
> When I ordered the knockoff gryphon cable from him, he made a shipping label so I couldnt cancel it then for 3.5 weeks kept telling me, I'll ship it tomorrow, in 2 days, in 2 days, then I had to file a claim because he stopped answering my messages.


Yes they all do that… They still have some heavy “Plandemic” restrictions in China so some really slow on the shipping. But… but this guy loves to bargain and sends pay-pal invoices on purchases over 100 USD (No sales Tax)… I think, I spent over 3 K at the store. Yes they slow but I have received all goods. All were good quality…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes they all do that… They still have some heavy “Plandemic” restrictions in China so some really slow on the shipping. But… but this guy loves to bargain and sends pay-pal invoices on purchases over 100 USD (No sales Tax)… I think, I spent over 3 K at the store. Yes they slow but I have received all goods. All were good quality…


Interesting, have not tried the Siltech and AQ clones.  But a couple of others that I know personally have tried the AQ Wel said the Odin 2 Gold was better to them.  I do think synergy to the rest of the system makes a big difference.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Interesting, have not tried the Siltech and AQ clones.  But a couple of others that I know personally have tried the AQ Wel said the Odin 2 Gold was better to them.  I do think synergy to the rest of the system makes a big difference.


IMHO, The Gold Odin2 is a spinoff of that Silver Odin2. I would guess, they just changed the color of foil and plug… While going thru the thread I saw some pics of Gold Odin2 were the core seems to be just plain Valhalla wire ( green and red strains inside clear insulator) . Valhalla wire is one level down from Odin 1. I think they have a few different versions of Gold Odin2 and it’s almost impossible to tell which version they are selling…

Regarding AQ Dragons: yep they have crappy plugs, but the wire is awesome and impossible to bend. I might change all plugs one day on my 3 Dragons…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> IMHO, The Gold Odin2 is a spinoff of that Silver Odin2. I would guess, they just changed the color of foil and plug… While going thru the thread I saw some pics of Gold Odin2 were the core seems to be just plain Valhalla wire ( green and red strains inside clear insulator) . Valhalla wire is one level down from Odin 1. I think they have a few different versions of Gold Odin2 and it’s almost impossible to tell which version they are selling…
> 
> Regarding AQ Dragons: yep they have crappy plugs, but the wire is awesome and impossible to bend. I might change all plugs one day on my 3 Dragons…


I have Odin 2 and Odin Gold XLR and power cables. They are the same aside foils and connectors. The sound difference I am fairly sure are the plug platings.  They definitely sound different. Interestingly enough an entire or almost entire system of the cabling sound better than just having one or two in the system. I have a good mix of these cables and other high end cables to play with.  And in the headphone rig I really like these cables.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I have Odin 2 and Odin Gold XLR and power cables. They are the same aside foils and connectors. The sound difference I am fairly sure are the plug platings.  They definitely sound different. Interestingly enough an entire or almost entire system of the cabling sound better than just having one or two in the system. I have a good mix of these cables and other high end cables to play with.  And in the headphone rig I really like these cables.


I have Odin2 AC cable and Odin2 XLRs. Sold Odin 1 (Less cores than Odin2) with my old amp. Yep, it's all about Synergy and so much depends on the gears... Since I personally confirmed $150 AQ Wel XLR beats the original $750 AQ Water (And some say it beats AQ Fire with 3.5 K tag) no way I will be buying any more "originals" from AQ ... The 70% mark Good quality fake VS original is real . I bet most of the Brand names get the metals from the same source - China ))


----------



## DenverW

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801143969853.html
> 
> Seller store : Cheap Shop Store


Price wise, I think I'll stick with the odin gold power cable i'm trying.  $626-4,550?  The humor of their store name "Cheap" being put in all the pictures is unintended, most likely .  $4550 for a knock off cable on aliexpress?  I'm sure it may be a bargain comparatively somewhere, but it's not for me.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DenverW said:


> Price wise, I think I'll stick with the odin gold power cable i'm trying.  $626-4,550?  The humor of their store name "Cheap" being put in all the pictures is unintended, most likely .  $4550 for a knock off cable on aliexpress?  I'm sure it may be a bargain comparatively somewhere, but it's not for me.


This cable is Tha King of all knockoffs. Hence the price )


----------



## szore

Well, just chiming in...my Odin cables are continuing to burn in nicely and the mids are greatly clarifying and becoming a lot more transparent, thankfully! The mids had me worried but that congestion seems to be just evaporating.... The Odin gold and the silver have about 500 hours on them... the gold xlr about 375.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 10, 2022)

Purchased “Pure Silver CAT8 Ethernet Network Cable 40Gbps 2000MH RJ45 Patch Cord for HiFi Audio” here…Awaiting delivery / will post the results after burn-in …
This time it will be: The Original AQ Vodka CAT8 ($475) VS $70 Pure Silver core CAT8...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Well, just chiming in...my Odin cables are continuing to burn in nicely and the mids are greatly clarifying and becoming a lot more transparent, thankfully! The mids had me worried but that congestion seems to be just evaporating.... The Odin gold and the silver have about 500 hours on them... the gold xlr about 375.


As I mentioned, these cables change drastically after enough burn-in. Which is at least at 600 hour mark. One cable not burned in will throw the whole system off.  After all cables have 600 hours on them, it is time to judge what you have.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Purchased “Pure Silver CAT8 Ethernet Network Cable 40Gbps 2000MH RJ45 Patch Cord for HiFi Audio” here…Awaiting delivery / will post the results after burn-in …
> This time it will be: The Original AQ Vodka CAT8 ($475) VS $70 Pure Silver core CAT8...


Lol should be an interesting comparison.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Lol should be an interesting comparison.


The Vodka only 5% silver and average terminals . But the cost is insane for 0.75 M....


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Purchased “Pure Silver CAT8 Ethernet Network Cable 40Gbps 2000MH RJ45 Patch Cord for HiFi Audio” here…Awaiting delivery / will post the results after burn-in …
> This time it will be: The Original AQ Vodka CAT8 ($475) VS $70 Pure Silver core CAT8...


Do you have a link to this cable?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Do you have a link to this cable?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804392417275.html


----------



## Rolox

10 days ago I purchased one Odin Gold RCA IC and put it between DAC and preamp. I was still using odin 1 (1.5?) between preamp and active crossover, and between crossover and amps, and the combination sounded fantastic.
I then ordered a complete set of 3 other Gold RCA iCs to replace the "old" Odin 1s and received them a couple days ago. They came from a different vendor and, even tho they share the exact same photos, they are slightly different: the first set has plastic body plugs, these have metal body plugs that seem to be impossible to unscrew.
I'm not enamored with the sound at all. They system now sounds dark with a recessed midrange, vague imaging, bloated bass, splashy treble. I have 15 days to return them and I'm hesitating. It's probably just a lack of burn in - where they are located in the system they don't see much current. I hope things will get really better. It's impossible to see if they built the cable the same way as the first one... the wire is the same, but how is it connected to the plug? I dunno...


----------



## Flavioccastro

drspeter said:


> Glad to hear but I am afraid that usb c connection is not firm enough compared to usb a to withstand that thick and stiff cable... but still very tempting so I may end up buying one. I was initially eyeing on the silver plated ofc from xangsane cable, which comes in B C connection option as well.



Let’s see. My set is just a tablet in portrait mode docked on wireless charger. Don’t know if I will have problems.


----------



## dougms3

Rolox said:


> 10 days ago I purchased one Odin Gold RCA IC and put it between DAC and preamp. I was still using odin 1 (1.5?) between preamp and active crossover, and between crossover and amps, and the combination sounded fantastic.
> I then ordered a complete set of 3 other Gold RCA iCs to replace the "old" Odin 1s and received them a couple days ago. They came from a different vendor and, even tho they share the exact same photos, they are slightly different: the first set has plastic body plugs, these have metal body plugs that seem to be impossible to unscrew.
> I'm not enamored with the sound at all. They system now sounds dark with a recessed midrange, vague imaging, bloated bass, splashy treble. I have 15 days to return them and I'm hesitating. It's probably just a lack of burn in - where they are located in the system they don't see much current. I hope things will get really better. It's impossible to see if they built the cable the same way as the first one... the wire is the same, but how is it connected to the plug? I dunno...


I had the odin1 xlrs from several years ago and the odin 2 rcas I bought were much better.  

There seems to be different variations of the same item all over the place.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 10, 2022)

Just a quick update on these Golden Odins : If your Odin looks like this inside






 – you are getting Valhalla cable wrapped up in gold foil...

Valhalla<Odin1<Odin2
Also it should be 7 cores (or more) 14 AWG  wire ...

Quality 15 Core Vallhala  AC Cable (Same as  the above  with  X2  cores  but no golden foil) But it might be a good idea to upgrade the plugs...


----------



## Ficcion2

Those bastards!


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just a quick update on these Golden Odins : If your Odin looks like this inside
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thats about what I'd expect from these aliexpress sellers.

Perhaps thats why the new gold odin cable I got sounds different than the old one I had and it was slightly thinner.

Also explains the sudden price drop from about $180 to $50.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just a quick update on these Golden Odins : If your Odin looks like this inside
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What I got has 7 conductors, gold foil and the wire sleeving does not have the colored stripes.  I opened it up to inspect and apply Furutech Nano Liquid to conductors and connector contacts when I first got it.  Looked like 14ga all silver, no trace of copper which surprised me.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

If you like quality copper – Audiomeca AC Cable

This one should be around $50 for 1.5 M during the biggest 11.11 sale in November…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> What I got has 7 conductors, gold foil and the wire sleeving does not have the colored stripes.  I opened it up to inspect and apply Furutech Nano Liquid to conductors and connector contacts when I first got it.  Looked like 14ga all silver, no trace of copper which surprised me.


Can't wait to try this Furutech Nano Liquid on my plugs and brand new outlet.


----------



## DecentLevi

Hey guys, giving an update on burn-in with my (knockoff of course) Odin Gold AC cable 

_shown with the RCA damping plugs which make a barely discernable difference even using 2_


Been burning it in powering my power conditioner that's central to my system for 24 days. I've left the power conditioner on 24/7 with a medium/low AC load (powering a wall wart and a DDC (DI-20 audio bridge). Today my system was sounding a bit darker with softer dynamics the way it was, and I'm using a WireWorld Aurora 7 blue AC power cable from the power conditioner to the tube amp. Here's what I tried:

- standard black IEC AC cable (extra thick gauge) into the power conditioner (instead of the Odin Gold), with same Wireworld Aurora 7 into the amp
Improved dynamics / slam and clarity with upper extension

- standard black IEC AC cable (extra thick gauge) into the power conditioner with Odin Gold into the amp
Sense of realism / organic quality are improved, but at expense of dynamics. FR was hella wide, with neutral recordings borderlining on dark and bright recordings becoming fatiguingly bright

- Wireworld Aurora 7 into the power conditioner with Odin Gold into the amp
Now THIS is the master of performance!! Super sense of realism / analogue-ness and weight / slam to the drums, with extension great in both directions. Here however the highs are tad too unforgiving, which I likely attribute to the Wireworld Aurora 7 as it's known to be a somewhat bright cable.

I reversed the above combination back to how it was, so I can burn-in the Odin Gold a little more, being that I can leave it on 24/7 going into the power conditioner. It's surprising how much the sound has changed back to how it was, now somewhat darker with softer dynamics, but still good. So I'm thinking to get an Odin 2 for the power conditioner since it's said to be a bit brighter than the Odin Gold, yet probably not as bright as the Aurora 7. (opinions?) I'm actually surprised at how much a difference AC cables feeding a conditioner actually make, especially since it regenerates the power.
@cdacosta how many weeks would you say I should give it?  It's already got 576 hours at 24 days.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Hey guys, giving an update on burn-in with my (knockoff of course) Odin Gold AC cable
> 
> _shown with the RCA damping plugs which make a barely discernable difference even using 2_
> 
> ...


AT 576 hours that is pretty close as it will get.  From my experience at this point another 100 hours it will be close to where it settles in and stays.  Did you use the Nano Liquid with the cable?  If you did, just at contacts or also internally on conductors and connector contacts?  Just curious.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Can't wait to try this Furutech Nano Liquid on my plugs and brand new outlet.


You are in for a treat.  Of all the tweaks I have tried in the last 25 years (and I have tried a lot) the Nano Liquid is the most universal performance booster I have encountered.  The more mechanical electrical connections within or attached to the audio system the better it gets.  I recommend treating a few connections first and listen so you can "hear" the change first.  Then you will eventually want to treat "all" connections, will (or should be) obvious to you why.

Is the system you are treating a headphone setup, home 2-channel or home theater system?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 11, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> You are in for a treat.  Of all the tweaks I have tried in the last 25 years (and I have tried a lot) the Nano Liquid is the most universal performance booster I have encountered.  The more mechanical electrical connections within or attached to the audio system the better it gets.  I recommend treating a few connections first and listen so you can "hear" the change first.  Then you will eventually want to treat "all" connections, will (or should be) obvious to you why.
> 
> Is the system you are treating a headphone setup, home 2-channel or home theater system?


Sounds good ! I plan to do the receptacle first … Rejuvenating those really old wires in the wall should definitely make it audible … Then the Isolation transformers and up the chain… Thanks again !

I have 2 Chanel setup that I really like to “upgrade” all the time 😊

At the moment: Isolators-> Etherregen -> SOtm streamer -> Gustard U18 -> Musician Aquarius DAC -> Yammy AS3000 -> B&W CM9


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Sounds good ! I plan to do the receptacle first … Rejuvenating those really old wires in the wall should definitely make it audible … Then the Isolation transformers and up the chain… Thanks again !
> 
> I have 2 Chanel setup that I really like to “upgrade” all the time 😊
> 
> At the moment: Isolators-> Etherregen -> SOtm streamer -> Gustard U18 -> Musician Aquarius DAC -> Yammy AS3000 -> B&W CM9


Then here is a tip regarding the Romex coming from the wall…

1) prep outlet by cleaning all contacts with isopropyl alcohol and then apply Nano Liquid to contacts. This includes contacts inside the outlet where the AC plugs will be inserted. 

2) Turn off breaker/kill power to outlet, then polish the wire conductors and clean off with isopropyl alcohol.  This step makes an audible difference, don’t skip it. 

3) Then apply the Nano Liquid to conductors. 

4) install conductors from wall to outlet. 

I have installed more AC outlets then I can remember and this process has produced best audible results. I use to use a different contact enhancer before, now only Nano Liquid.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Then here is a tip regarding the Romex coming from the wall…
> 
> 1) prep outlet by cleaning all contacts with isopropyl alcohol and then apply Nano Liquid to contacts. This includes contacts inside the outlet where the AC plugs will be inserted.
> 
> ...


Much appreciated !


----------



## Rolox

Crypt Keeper said:


> IMHO, The Gold Odin2 is a spinoff of that Silver Odin2. I would guess, they just changed the color of foil and plug… While going thru the thread I saw some pics of Gold Odin2 were the core seems to be just plain Valhalla wire ( green and red strains inside clear insulator) . Valhalla wire is one level down from Odin 1. I think they have a few different versions of Gold Odin2 and it’s almost impossible to tell which version they are selling…
> 
> Regarding AQ Dragons: yep they have crappy plugs, but the wire is awesome and impossible to bend. I might change all plugs one day on my 3 Dragons…


Well, there are two versions of the Odin Gold wire: one that has the cores wrapped in a very shiny gold foil, each core being visibly separated from the others by a silver stripe (see photo of my Gold RCA cable next to my old Odin 1.5(?) cables) and the other one, usually more expensive, looks exactly like the Odin 2 wire but with gold wrapping instead of silver. On the first version, the cores also seem to be thinner. Those two versions probably sound very different hence we should always mention it when we talk about the Odin Gold sound.


----------



## Rolox

Rolox said:


> Well, there are two versions of the Odin Gold wire: one that has the cores wrapped in a very shiny gold foil, each core being visibly separated from the others by a silver stripe (see photo of my Gold RCA cable next to my old Odin 1.5(?) cables) and the other one, usually more expensive, looks exactly like the Odin 2 wire but with gold wrapping instead of silver. On the first version, the cores also seem to be thinner. Those two versions probably sound very different hence we should always mention it when we talk about the Odin Gold sound.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 11, 2022)

Odin1 was 15 AWG / Odin 2 Should be 14 AWG (For pwr cable)


----------



## msing539

I'm amazed that we have 54 pages and almost 800 posts on these Odin cables.


----------



## szore

Switched the gold odin2 from the power conditioner and the wall, to power cond and my Jot2 amp;, then took silver odin off amp and put it on the wall...Much richer presentation, sounds much more musical and engaging....


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> I'm amazed that we have 54 pages and almost 800 posts on these Odin cables.


Not just odin cables but alot of other stuff as well.

If we all share our experiences testing out different things and reporting bad sellers, we can influence better behavior out of some of these sellers as well as find good products where our small community of audio enthusiasts can benefit while not breaking the bank. 

Granted I don't think they compare to the real thing but if they can reach 60-80% of a $10k cable for $60, I'd say thats a win.


----------



## dougms3

Looks like @Crypt Keeper was right.

This is the gold odin I got from *Goltech*, he's using the old, thinner awg conductors from the valhalla clones and selling them as odin 2.  What a dirtbag.

Not only did he send me a cable with missing parts but doing shady stuff like this, I bet he regrets not refunding my order.  Putting that fool on blast.

I said it was slightly thinner than the gold odin I already had.  I know I wasn't imagining things.  Its hard to see but I think you can make out that the old one is slightly thicker.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Looks like @Crypt Keeper was right.
> 
> This is the gold odin I got from *Goltech*, he's using the old, thinner awg conductors from the valhalla clones and selling them as odin 2.  What a dirtbag.
> 
> ...


Yep, I’m pretty sure that 15 core Valhalla with replaced Holo plugs will be much much better than this 7 core Valhalla clone sold as Odin 2 gold…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yep, I’m pretty sure that 15 core Valhalla with replaced Holo plugs will be much much better than this 7 core Valhalla clone sold as Odin 2 gold…


Its not a huge difference from the real fake gold odin lol.  

But it is noticeable, everything else being the same, I tested out both cables on my denafrips ares II dac and the real one has more bass, body, and better treble accentuation.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 11, 2022)

Just my 2 cents,

The Best Cables I purchased on Ali:

12 Core Odin2 USB cable (Around $20) – This one is a real gem… IMHO, It beats almost all cables under $500 range… The only cable that bettered this one was Original NEW SEMPERFI THE OUTSIDER PURE SILVER USB CABLE from UK ($150)… But the Outsider is on par with Wireworld Starlight Platinum 8 USB ($600)

Odin 2 12 Core XLR – This $108 fake bettered the original Walhalla XLR.

Wel Signature XLR ($150) - Bettered AQ Water@ $750 with almost no burn-in…

Xangsang Audiophile 6N Pure Silver XLR (Around $120) If you like analog silver cables, try this solid silver core XLR. Very nice/similar to 1K Branded pure silver cables.

WEL Signature AC Cable – Pretty good for $150 / I use it with Farads (LPS)

Audiomeca copper core / metal plugs 10 AWG power cable (Around $50) – Awesome for the price.

AQ Dragon Source and High Current (Around $350) – This fake bettered the original AQ Thunder and Firebird ! I will be replacing the plug thou…

Siltech triple crown XLR ($800) – The best XLR I ever auditioned.

Siltech triple crown speaker cables ($1400) – The best.

Siltech Triple Crown solid silver AC Cable ($700) The best Power cable I found . Need / want mo’ of them …

Siltech signature jumper cables ($50) Very good quality / The original retails around 1K

MOSHOU 8K HDMI 2.1 Optical Fiber Cable eARC HDR 8K@60Hz 4K@120Hz ($80)

AMPCOM Cat8 Ethernet Patch Cable S/FTP 22AWG Screened Solid Cable | 2000Mhz Up to 40Gbps ( $48 for 10 M) Very good quality twisted  CAT.8

Audiocrast Grounding Box solid silver cable ($38)
..................


----------



## DecentLevi

Does it look like mine is the better Odin Gold clone, or the Valhalla with replaced Holo plugs and thinner cables?
I wasn't able to inspect the wire shielding when taking it apart to add Furutech nano Liquid due to the solid thick rubber sleeving at the ends. Definitely seems thick and solid to me. It was from seller Getwire.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Much appreciated !


My pleasure


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> My pleasure


Quick question: What is the best way to Polish these old Romex wall wires ? 
Thanks


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> Quick question: What is the best way to Polish these old Romex wall wires ?
> Thanks


Do you have enough slack to cut and strip? 

*Phrasing


----------



## Crypt Keeper

msing539 said:


> Do you have enough slack to cut and strip?
> 
> *Phrasing


Not sure if  I have enough...


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> Not sure if  I have enough...


Assuming breaker is off. Sandpaper or a wire brush would clean it.


----------



## msing539

msing539 said:


> Assuming breaker is off. Sandpaper or a wire brush would clean it.


Oh, and if you're using a standard contractor grade outlet, use the screws, not the push in on the back. I'm sure you know.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Quick question: What is the best way to Polish these old Romex wall wires ?
> Thanks


I use 0000 Steel wool and ProGold.  If the Romex is long enough you can cut off the old exposed wire and strip back sleeving to expose fresh conductors.  I personally would still polish the conductors with fresh wire "if" it looked like it needed it, otherwise just clean fresh conductors with the isopropyl alcohol before treating with Nano Liquid.  

Also when applying Nano Liquid, be sure to shake bottle well before use and apply a "very thin" layer to conductors and contacts.  You will hear a difference right away after application but does take at least 72 hours for optimum sonic improvement.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Oh, and if you're using a standard contractor grade outlet, use the screws, not the push in on the back. I'm sure you know.


Agreed


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Quick question: What is the best way to Polish these old Romex wall wires ?
> Thanks


Here is two more tweaks for AC outlets.

1) Dampen between outlet (brass Mickey Mouse looking ear holes/part of outlet back strap) and wall box that the outlet screws into.  I use fo.Q T32 or T102 (which you likely do not have).  You can use any dampening material you have on hand, make sure the material is not too thick.  AC lines cause micro vibrations that resonate into the outlet and contacts.  This will help with that.

2) Carbon Fiber outlet plate.  Just like used on high end Oyaide and Furutech outlets.  Can be had for about $20 on eBay, see link below.  This tweak is audible, not dramatic though.  If you are like me and believe everything matters, and the sum of the whole equals what your system is capable of, this tweak is for you.  Oh, and it looks cool.  LOL

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1334250754...4c9RtvzBSjUMNF+tX3rWYa+4+N|tkp:Bk9SR8zZmfnlYA


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Here is two more tweaks for AC outlets.
> 
> 1) Dampen between outlet (brass Mickey Mouse looking ear holes/part of outlet back strap) and wall box that the outlet screws into.  I use fo.Q T32 or T102 (which you likely do not have).  You can use any dampening material you have on hand, make sure the material is not too thick.  AC lines cause micro vibrations that resonate into the outlet and contacts.  This will help with that.
> 
> ...


What's the thinking behind the carbon fiber plates? Though I agree they are cool looking.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Here is two more tweaks for AC outlets.
> 
> 1) Dampen between outlet (brass Mickey Mouse looking ear holes/part of outlet back strap) and wall box that the outlet screws into.  I use fo.Q T32 or T102 (which you likely do not have).  You can use any dampening material you have on hand, make sure the material is not too thick.  AC lines cause micro vibrations that resonate into the outlet and contacts.  This will help with that.
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot ! Yes, I believe every small tweak matters … No “placebo effect” here... I’m sure it works… That’s why it was exciting to learn about that Nano silver/gold liquid… I will be installing The Furutech Trio…
I gave it a lot of thought and just decided to shell out $316 for the trio…


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> Thanks a lot ! Yes, I believe every small tweak matters … No “placebo effect” here... I’m sure it works… That’s why it was exciting to learn about that Nano silver/gold liquid… I will be installing The Furutech Trio…
> I gave it a lot of thought and just decided to shell out $316 for the trio…



If Batman has outlets in the batcave, I bet this is what they look like.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

msing539 said:


> If Batman has outlets in the batcave, I bet this is what they look like.




😂


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Will be replacing these:  Monosaudio DP-2 Rhodium Duplex + Crosbon pure aluminum 86 panel home improvement wall socket


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> What's the thinking behind the carbon fiber plates? Though I agree they are cool looking.


I got one of those.  It has a pretty noticeable affect.

And it is legit carbon fiber, as I tried to grind out the place where the screw head slots in and it took forever to grind 1/10 of a mm and broke my tool.


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> What's the thinking behind the carbon fiber plates? Though I agree they are cool looking.


Reduces/absorbs EMI and reduces/absorbs vibration.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I got one of those.  It has a pretty noticeable affect.
> 
> And it is legit carbon fiber, as I tried to grind out the place where the screw head slots in and it took forever to grind 1/10 of a mm and broke my tool.


Yep we got it the same time I think.  I installed two, one at another outlet that I am no longer using for audio system and the main outlet at wall.  I also installed fo.Q T-32 between the plate and the wall for added vibration control.  The CF plate is being used with the Oyaide R1 for main outlet to first PLC.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Will be replacing these:  Monosaudio DP-2 Rhodium Duplex + Crosbon pure aluminum 86 panel home improvement wall socket


Nice.  LOL just be ready for a pain of a break-in with the Furutech outlets.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Nice.  LOL just be ready for a pain of a break-in with the Furutech outlets.


After my R2R DAC burn-in, that lasted 8 weeks I’m ready for anything


----------



## creuzabar

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just my 2 cents,
> 
> The Best Cables I purchased on Ali:
> 
> ...



Hello Crypt Keeper. I got an odin 2 usb cable with only 8 cores (what a disappointment). Although the description stated that the cable was 12 cores. I bought it from the TimeLess Audio Store.
The same happened with the xlr odin gold cable, which also has only 8 cores instead of the 10 described in the ad. The latter was purchased from the Preffair Store.
Stay away from these stores.
I would appreciate if you could let me know the stores from which you purchased your usb and xlr Odin 2 with 12 cores.


----------



## creuzabar

creuzabar said:


> Hello Crypt Keeper. I got an odin 2 usb cable with only 8 cores (what a disappointment). Although the description stated that the cable was 12 cores. I bought it from the TimeLess Audio Store.
> The same happened with the xlr odin gold cable, which also has only 8 cores instead of the 10 described in the ad. The latter was purchased from the Preffair Store.
> Stay away from these stores.
> I would appreciate if you could let me know the stores from which you purchased your usb and xlr Odin 2 with 12 cores.


Although these cables mentioned are considerably superior to the copper cables they replaced, in terms of soundstage, image, resolution and transparency, I still feel that I was cheated. I would like to know in which stores to purchase the most complete versions of this line of odin 2 fake cables, and I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone who shared their experiences in this topic.


----------



## szore

creuzabar said:


> Hello Crypt Keeper. I got an odin 2 usb cable with only 8 cores (what a disappointment). Although the description stated that the cable was 12 cores. I bought it from the TimeLess Audio Store.
> The same happened with the xlr odin gold cable, which also has only 8 cores instead of the 10 described in the ad. The latter was purchased from the Preffair Store.
> Stay away from these stores.
> I would appreciate if you could let me know the stores from which you purchased your usb and xlr Odin 2 with 12 cores.


Looks like my gold xlr is 8 core too...but they didnt say how many cores it would have,


----------



## creuzabar

szore said:


> Parece que meu gold xlr é de 8 núcleos também... mas eles não disseram quantos núcleos ele teria,


Usually this information is omitted from most ads I've seen, but in the store where I bought it, Preffair Store, it was stated that the cable contained 10 cores, as was also described on the real Odin gold xlr cable page.


----------



## cdacosta

creuzabar said:


> Usually this information is omitted from most ads I've seen, but in the store where I bought it, Preffair Store, it was stated that the cable contained 10 cores, as was also described on the real Odin gold xlr cable page.


A lot of the Aliexpress seller advertising on the listing is a “copy and paste” from the original Nordost website/advertising.


----------



## dougms3

creuzabar said:


> Although these cables mentioned are considerably superior to the copper cables they replaced, in terms of soundstage, image, resolution and transparency, I still feel that I was cheated. I would like to know in which stores to purchase the most complete versions of this line of odin 2 fake cables, and I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone who shared their experiences in this topic.


Perhaps i should make a sticky in the first post of this thread.

I bought a majority of the cables before from timeless and getwire.  Would recommend timeless.

They were really good about processing a refund for that sata cable i asked them to make from odin wire that didn't work.


----------



## creuzabar

cdacosta said:


> A lot of the Aliexpress seller advertising on the listing is a “copy and paste” from the original Nordost website/advertising.


Yes I understand. I would just like to know, obviously if possible, if there really are usb, xlr and rca cables out there from this Odin 2 and Gold line from Aliexpress with more cores than the 8 cores I received, and if this difference of 4 cores would make a real  difference in the cable's ultimate performance.
It seems that it has been proven that, at least as far as AC Odin Gold is concerned, there is a worse version than the best known.
But anyway, even these cables that I received, with a few hours of burn in is already being a big improvement compared to the cables that were replaced.


----------



## dougms3

Things starting to make more sense as to why the gold is so much cheaper than the silver odin 2.


----------



## creuzabar

dougms3 said:


> Perhaps i should make a sticky in the first post of this thread.
> 
> I bought a majority of the cables before from timeless and getwire.  Would recommend timeless.
> 
> They were really good about processing a refund for that sata cable i asked them to make from odin wire that didn't work.


Thanks for the info where you got your cables from. I'm just trying to understand if the quality of the components in these cables has been dropping lately, compared to a few months ago when this thread started.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Things starting to make more sense as to why the gold is so much cheaper than the silver odin 2.


My gold was $230.....really happy with the sound tho so I don't sweat it....


----------



## Crypt Keeper

creuzabar said:


> Hello Crypt Keeper. I got an odin 2 usb cable with only 8 cores (what a disappointment). Although the description stated that the cable was 12 cores. I bought it from the TimeLess Audio Store.
> The same happened with the xlr odin gold cable, which also has only 8 cores instead of the 10 described in the ad. The latter was purchased from the Preffair Store.
> Stay away from these stores.
> I would appreciate if you could let me know the stores from which you purchased your usb and xlr Odin 2 with 12 cores.


Hello, 
I purchased that Odin2 USB from this store, but it was purchased in 2021 … I’m not sure what they selling right now, in the description still says 12 core USB thou…

Yes, it’s a mess with these Odins… I think they are just so mass market, so popular - they have a few different factories manufacturing different Odins and some are really low quality … Stores on Ali mostly distributors/retailers they are not factory direct (Usually). Most of them would have mass market items always in stock b/c they are buying on consignment I think, but with more expensive items they have to pre-order and  never have it in stock…

I would say, unless you getting your Odin from the same batch, there is no way to see what exactly will be delivered… IMHO It’s been like that with all Odins for a while now...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Perhaps i should make a sticky in the first post of this thread.
> 
> I bought a majority of the cables before from timeless and getwire.  Would recommend timeless.
> 
> They were really good about processing a refund for that sata cable i asked them to make from odin wire that didn't work.


Yes , I bought a few Audiocrast grounding box silver cables and other items from Timeless  as well ..  Good  quality, fast shipping ...


----------



## creuzabar

Crypt Keeper said:


> Hello,
> I purchased that Odin2 USB from this store, but it was purchased in 2021 … I’m not sure what they selling right now, in the description still says 12 core USB thou…
> 
> Yes, it’s a mess with these Odins… I think they are just so mass market, so popular - they have a few different factories manufacturing different Odins and some are really low quality … Stores on Ali mostly distributors/retailers they are not factory direct (Usually). Most of them would have mass market items always in stock b/c they are buying on consignment I think, but with more expensive items they have to pre-order and  never have it in stock…
> ...


Thanks for the info where you got your cable from. The ad from the store I bought it said the same thing, but when I visually inspected the cable I only found eight cores. If I buy a second odin 2 usb cable, I will try to buy from AliExpress
FINDAUDIO Store, to see if I'll have more luck.


----------



## szore

How do you find a specific store on ali express?


----------



## creuzabar

szore said:


> My gold was $230.....really happy with the sound tho so I don't sweat it....





szore said:


> My gold was $230.....really happy with the sound tho so I don't sweat it....


I think you bought your cable from the RM Digital Store. Their Odin Gold looks more like the Odin Gold that was worse (which seems to be using cores from the Valhalla cable) than the other usual Odin Gold (with white lettering), however the Odin Gold from RM Digital Store looks thicker than the other Odin Gold, the only problem with it is the much higher price.
I also got the impression that the Odin 2 that this store sells also seems to be thicker than the ones sold by other stores. I believe cdacosta acquired his Odin 2 from this store, and maybe that could be the reason he has more resolution than Odin Gold: because the Odin 2 he acquired has thicker cores than the cores of his Odin Gold? This is just an assumption. Probably the reason for the difference in resolution must be more complex than that.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

creuzabar said:


> Thanks for the info where you got your cable from. The ad from the store I bought it said the same thing, but when I visually inspected the cable I only found eight cores. If I buy a second odin 2 usb cable, I will try to buy from AliExpress
> FINDAUDIO Store, to see if I'll have more luck.


I think, If we really want to make sure we are getting “12 core Odin”. We have to buy the wire in bulk + plugs … Usually when buying bulk wire , if they say it’s 15 core - 15 core wire will be delivered…


----------



## creuzabar

szore said:


> How do you find a specific store on ali express?


I look for any product, then I enter this store's page and search for the product I want only within this store. Then I do the same, but in other stores. I don't know if that's what you asked, or if I can answer it properly.


----------



## creuzabar

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, If we really want to make sure we are getting “12 core Odin”. We have to buy the wire in bulk + plugs … Usually when buying bulk wire , if they say it’s 15 core - 15 core wire will be delivered…


You are completely right. Possibly I will try this after I have purchased a good amount of high quality solder like Mundorf Supreme.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 12, 2022)

Received FE Norway Ball Foot Nail today… Very good quality. Highly recommended if you need perfect isolation for your Master Clock or a sensitive CD transport perhaps…






If I’m not mistaken, the original was @ 1K / piece…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

creuzabar said:


> You are completely right. Possibly I will try this after I have purchased a good amount of high quality solder like Mundorf Supreme.


 Mundorf Supreme ....yes...  They say it's the best...


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Mundorf Supreme ....yes...  They say it's the best...


I should probably stay out of this. But as a PSA, there are several very good “audiophile” grade solder available. Mundorf is one, WBT and Cardas are also very good.  I have used all three, sonically they sound different.  I won’t say one is better than the other.  So yes a single solder joint can make an audible difference.


----------



## dougms3 (Sep 12, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> Mundorf Supreme ....yes...  They say it's the best...


Mundorf supreme is awesome stuff.

You should see the improvements it made when i resoldered my headphone drivers with it.

I have tried the cardas as well, it's good but doesn't have anywhere near the same effect as the mundorf.  

I saw that oyaide makes a 6% solder but i haven't tried it myself.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I should probably stay out of this. But as a PSA, there are several very good “audiophile” grade solder available. Mundorf is one, WBT and Cardas are also very good.  I have used all three, sonically they sound different.  I won’t say one is better than the other.  So yes a single solder joint can make an audible difference.


I have a lil'  bit of  Cardas silver left but wanted to try this Mundorf ...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Mundorf supreme is awesome stuff.
> 
> You should see the improvements it made when i resoldered my headphone drivers with it.
> 
> ...


I think  I should just  shell out $50 for this... But I spent  so much  already this month


----------



## szore

Wow...something is burning in because my desktop sound is really coming together. Stunned....Listening with my Szalayi...massive 3D holographic sound with gripping mids, excellent imaging, and massive bass....really nice. Haven't even gotten the new USB cable or the repair done on the Matrix H usb card, not to mention the Furotech liquid....

Listening to City: Works of Fiction by Jon Hassell


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Wow...something is burning in because my desktop sound is really coming together. Stunned....Listening with my Szalayi...massive 3D holographic sound with gripping mids, excellent imaging, and massive bass....really nice. Haven't even gotten the new USB cable or the repair done on the Matrix H usb card, not to mention the Furotech liquid....
> 
> Listening to City: Works of Fiction by Jon Hassell



Do you have the Furutech Nano Liquid on hand?  If you do you should treat your main SATA drive cable, SATA HDD signal and power cable and connection on motherboard and SATA drive.  I bet this takes your system to another level.

I am listening to this while examining another Aliexpress toy I got today (pocket knife) before modding and tuning it...


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Do you have the Furutech Nano Liquid on hand?  If you do you should treat your main SATA drive cable, SATA HDD signal and power cable and connection on motherboard and SATA drive.  I bet this takes your system to another level.
> 
> I am listening to this while examining another Aliexpress toy I got today (pocket knife) before modding and tuning it...



Nice blade! Link?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Nice blade! Link?


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804463057652.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.4d5c1802jfDDtA

Good seller, excellent communication.  He messaged me a video of him showing me the actual knife before I purchased.  The pic is of it stock, as it came.  I am going to mod it and tune it.  I have built several other custom Bugout 535.


----------



## drspeter

While this is not knockoff variants of fancy expensive cable, the concept isolating data and power wires is interesting.
https://www.aliexpress.com/i/3256804307335930.html?gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt
Also, data transfer wires are pure silver, so I am curious if this is worth trying...
There aren't many user impressions so far, it seems to be a recent release.


----------



## Stax 7

Crypt Keeper said:


> Received FE Norway Ball Foot Nail today… Very good quality. Highly recommended if you need perfect isolation for your Master Clock or a sensitive CD transport perhaps…
> 
> 
> 
> If I’m not mistaken, the original was @ 1K / piece…



Crypt Keeper the footnail they dont screw in you just place the dive on top?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804463057652.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.4d5c1802jfDDtA
> 
> Good seller, excellent communication.  He messaged me a video of him showing me the actual knife before I purchased.  The pic is of it stock, as it came.  I am going to mod it and tune it.  I have built several other custom Bugout 535.


IDK, Everytime I try a link it just takes me to the ali express homepage not the item...anyone else experience thjis?

Meanwhile I have ordered a silver fuse for the power conditioner...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Stax 7 said:


> Crypt Keeper the footnail they dont screw in you just place the dive on top?


It's 100% clone of the original. Yes the base has a  screw . The cheaper option they sell has no base.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 13, 2022)

szore said:


> IDK, Everytime I try a link it just takes me to the ali express homepage not the item...anyone else experience thjis?
> 
> Meanwhile I have ordered a silver fuse for the power conditioner...


Aliexpress search engine is a mess. I have figured out the best way to provide a link is to save it first to your watchlist then open it from the watchlist (Not from your purchase/search results) So it will be in this format: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803140632693.html
 ...
Nope...  didn't  work   again...


----------



## OCC7N

@Crypt Keeper Do you have a link for a really good xlr on aliexpress?

Siltech tripple crown one?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> @Crypt Keeper Do you have a link for a really good xlr on aliexpress?
> 
> Siltech tripple crown one


Cheap shop store
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802010722290.html


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Cheap shop store
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802010722290.html


Thanks 🙏 Wow they look great!

But they are too expensive. I was thinking about these also LINK

They are not shielded right?

Also can we trust them saying pure silver?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 13, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> Thanks 🙏 Wow they look great!
> 
> But they are too expensive. I was thinking about these also LINK
> 
> ...


I can't open the link...  Ali search engine is messed up again...
I did not get a chance to see what's inside the triple crown... They say - similar to the original (Silver& Gold alloy) .For me it was the best XLR I've ever auditioned .


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> I can't open the link...  Ali search engine is messed up again...
> I did not get a chance to see what's inside the triple crown... They say - similar to the original (Silver& Gold alloy) .For me it was the best XLR I've ever auditioned .


----------



## dougms3

OCC7N said:


>


The empress, i would have bought those instead of the argentos but they were alot more expensive at the time.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


>


BTW, They are not expensive at all performance-wise … I think, similar branded high end XLR would cost you 8-10 K. $800 Branded XLR = AudioQuest Water ? Good old Odin2 and WEL Signature bettered The water with almost no burn-in…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


>


That's  Siltech double crown...  Should be very good XLR as well .


----------



## OCC7N

Good to hear. thanks! Right now I am using Supra:
http://www.jenving.com/products/view/eff-ixlr-audio-1001906419

It says it is shielded, I have heard unshielded should be more open/better in the sound. I don´t have anything to compare with, I like them, but I think i should give unshielded cables a try.

Those Siltechs are shielded right?


----------



## Ysound

Crypt Keeper said:


> I can't open the link...  Ali search engine is messed up again...
> I did not get a chance to see what's inside the triple crown... They say - similar to the original (Silver& Gold alloy) .For me it was the best XLR I've ever auditioned.


So it's not possible at all to partially disassemble to the Triple Crown to see what's really inside?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Ysound said:


> So it's not possible at all to partially disassemble to the Triple Crown to see what's really inside?


It is possible, but I would rather not touch it. Again, for me it was the best XLR...


----------



## Ysound

Have you taken a look inside of the Dragon cables?


----------



## dougms3

Ysound said:


> So it's not possible at all to partially disassemble to the Triple Crown to see what's really inside?


What can be assembled can be disassembled but its risky since these are quite expensive even though they are knockoffs.

I'd take mine apart but don't want to risk anything happening to my beautiful sounding cables


----------



## DecentLevi

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just my 2 cents,
> 
> The Best Cables I purchased on Ali:
> 
> ...


I'm interested to try the WEL Signature AC Cable, couldn't find it yet. Do you have a link? Also please include the recommended shop name in case the link doesn't work.
How would you describe the sound signature? Brighter / darker than Odin 2 or Gold? Neutral, etc.? 
Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 14, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I'm interested to try the WEL Signature AC Cable, couldn't find it yet. Do you have a link? Also please include the recommended shop name in case the link doesn't work.
> How would you describe the sound signature? Brighter / darker than Odin 2 or Gold? Neutral, etc.?
> Thanks


The first Wel I purchased back in 2021, so that item is no longer available. Most recently purchased another one from Vipeos-HiFi Store . 1.8 M for $160, it’s on it’s way, but there is no mess with Wels as far as I know they all come from the same manufacturer and mostly out of stock now…

The signature is similar to AQ dragon. It’s silver plated (alloy) copper, not as bright as the Odin, but some prefer it over the Dragon… I use it with my Farad Super 3 LPS -> 10 Mhz Master Clock  mostly, so can’t really comment on the Signature now  … All I know it’s a darn good cable for the price similar ( at least ) to quality 1.5 K branded cables…


----------



## szore

I just switched the Odin gold power cable off the amp and back to the power conditioner...The gold amp bass was a tad too thick, it was moving towards boxy sounding even, But in any event I think the gold on the conditioner adds just enough warth without over doing it...the Jot2 is 'punchy' sounding as it is... the silver is better for it I think...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The first Wel I purchased back in 2021, so that item is no longer available. Most recently purchased another one from Vipeos-HiFi Store . 1.8 M for $160, it’s on it’s way, but there is no mess with Wels as far as I know they all come from the same manufacturer and mostly out of stock now…
> 
> The signature is similar to AQ dragon. It’s silver plated (alloy) copper, not as bright as the Odin, but some prefer it over the Dragon… I use it with my Farad Super 3 LPS -> 10 Mhz Master Clock  mostly, so can’t really comment on the Signature now  … All I know it’s a darn good cable for the price similar ( at least ) to quality 1.5 K branded cables…


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832811530567.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1

This guy sells it for $149.25 for 1.8m if anyone is interested.

Have you tried the argento flow power cable?

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800382848862.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I just switched the Odin gold power cable off the amp and back to the power conditioner...The gold amp bass was a tad too thick, it was moving towards boxy sounding even, But in any event I think the gold on the conditioner adds just enough warth without over doing it...the Jot2 is 'punchy' sounding as it is... the silver is better for it I think...


Interesting how moving just power cords changes the presentation…


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Interesting how moving just power cords changes the presentation…


That is one of the aspects I hate the most.  The power cable rolling with horse p3nisii.  Thats the correct plural right?


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832811530567.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1
> 
> This guy sells it for $149.25 for 1.8m if anyone is interested.
> 
> ...


@Crypt Keeper do you concur if this one is legit also? Looks like it's from a store called Audioson. Planning to pull the trigger soon. Maybe anyone else has dealt with this seller before?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 15, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> @Crypt Keeper do you concur if this one is legit also? Looks like it's from a store called Audioson. Planning to pull the trigger soon. Maybe anyone else has dealt with this seller before?


I can't  open the link  again    I will   try  later...
But I think I have purchased my Wel XLRs  from this vendor...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

BTW, some of these “Deep-End” Dragons and Siltechs are so rigid … It’s impossible to bend … I think I messed up one of the XLRs now… Now back to the good old Odin2 from Siltech triple crown… The difference is HUGE… It seems will be checking what is inside that mono-crystal Siltech cable after all


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832811530567.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1
> 
> This guy sells it for $149.25 for 1.8m if anyone is interested.
> 
> ...


No, I did not get a chance to audition the Argento , but they look awesome. I remember the power cable . It was so tempting...  I will  try the link in a bit  again.


----------



## dougms3 (Sep 15, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> No, I did not get a chance to audition the Argento , but they look awesome. I remember the power cable . It was so tempting...  I will  try the link in a bit  again.


Maybe the siltech is better but this one hits the sweet spot in price and if its anything like the argento xlrs, it should be really good.

The argentos xlrs were a real eye opener for me and everything else was validated my purchases on these knockoffs after that.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 15, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Maybe the siltech is better but this one hits the sweet spot in price and if its anything like the argento xlrs, it should be really good.
> 
> The argentos xlrs were a real eye opener for me and everything else was validated my purchases on these knockoffs after that.


I found the cable by checking his store. While I was doing this I saw the same vendor selling it for $135. Just need to confirm the length …

Also found some feedback from different vendors on this cable :

“very low price for a replica of a very high end power cable perfect! 11 Jul 2022 09:33 “

“very good quality build. fast shipping. thank you very much 19 Jul 2022 19:45”

That cable is really tempting indeed…


If you buying from Finaudio:

Store Coupon/Codes
US $5.00
Orders over US $65.00
Sep 10, 12:00 AM PT-Sep 16, 11:59 PM PT
CRS123456


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I found the cable by checking his store. While I was doing this I saw the same vendor selling it for $135. Just need to confirm the length …
> 
> Also found some feedback from different vendors on this cable :
> 
> ...


Lol its the same seller, I asked already, they don't know the length because they don't know who listed it at their company.


----------



## DecentLevi (Sep 24, 2022)

I ordered the Wel Signature AC cable from the mentioned Audioson store. Only the EU plug was listed, but I was able to send them a message and request the US plug, and they gave it to me for the same price. Hoping this is the legit one. It's the link that was posted above.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832811530567.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1

PS, a hack I discovered is to copy and paste the text of the link instead of clicking it on Head-Fi


----------



## szore

Just got my 8 wire silver and it is stunning...absolutley perfect with my Szalayi....if I paid well over $1,000 for this sound I would have been happy...This blows the Cleopatra away!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Just got my 8 wire silver and it is stunning...absolutley perfect with my Szalayi....if I paid well over $1,000 for this sound I would have been happy...This blows the Cleopatra away!


Wait a minute are you comparing to the $1k effect audio cleopatra cable?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I ordered the Wel Signature AC cable from the mentioned Audioson store. Only the EU plug was listed, but I was able to send them a message and request the US plug, and they gave it to me for the same price. Hoping this is the legit one. It's the link that was supposed above.
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832811530567.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.a83538dapqzlUB&mp=1
> 
> PS, a hack I discovered is to copy and paste the text of the link instead of clicking it on Head-Fi


Let us know how it sonically compares to the Nordost variants.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Let us know how it sonically compares to the Nordost variants.


Well, Ali shipping to the US takes around 3 weeks, and tracking doesn't work. So maybe just do what I do. Don't expect much and then you'll be surprised one day.


----------



## OCC7N (Sep 16, 2022)

I have noticed under information of product, it says Origin.

like origin: NL Netherland. Does this mean it ships from Europe or something?

I have never seen gold neutrik connectors. Are they specially gold palted or?
LINK


----------



## OCC7N (Sep 16, 2022)

If the taxws wasnt that damn expenisive I would order the tripple crown right now. Beautiful cable 

Will 5N Pure silver not beat any copper for interconnect?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Wait a minute are you comparing to the $1k effect audio cleopatra cable?


Yes.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 16, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> If the taxws wasnt that damn expenisive I would order the tripple crown right now. Beautiful cable
> 
> Will 5N Pure silver not beat any copper for interconnect?


It depends... Have you tried any pure silver for analog ? I like it a lot for my digital interconnects…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Talk to the seller and ask for ”the 11.11 price”…You can ask the seller for a pay-pal invoice instead of  paying  direct via Aliexpress... This way,  when shipping they can “declare” it exactly as you want for Customs... Your purchase will not be protected by Aliexpress but you can start a claim with pay-pal (always make sure you have it as “paying for goods or services” never Friends&family and put a note in pay-pal (when submitting your payment)… Something might go wrong with the above method, but Fortuna audaces iuvat “Fortune favors the brave”


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> Well, Ali shipping to the US takes around 3 weeks, and tracking doesn't work. So maybe just do what I do. Don't expect much and then you'll be surprised one day.


Usually once shipped it takes about 2 weeks for me... But sometimes they have to pre-order. So it takes a  week or so before they ship.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 16, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> I have noticed under information of product, it says Origin.
> 
> like origin: NL Netherland. Does this mean it ships from Europe or something?
> 
> ...


No. always  China.  The original would  cost you X 10(used) -20 (new)...


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 16, 2022)

BTW, audiolund.com Good for any custom cables. Ordered a few cables from this guy befo.... The best pure silver I2S cable I was able to find..


----------



## PLGA

Hi guys,
I recently changed the power cord of my Audio-GD HE-7 Mk2 DAC.

I went from a DIY DH Labs AC Power Plus: https://silversonic.com/products/bulk-cable/bulk-power-cable/power-ac-power-cable/

To this chinese power cord at about half the price or less depending on the length: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100...1d82e2d44e0b962d8fef3ff1a48&afSmartRedirect=y

I have a dedicated AC line, a Holton DC Blocker and an Audioquest Niagara 1200 feeding the HE-7 and this cable made the difference at about half the cost of the DH Labs. I also have the DH Labs DIY Red Wave, wich I like very much, and, eventhough I haven't compared them side by side, I estimate they shoud be in the same ligue or close.

A couple of thoughts:

1. Cables and AC conditioning matter in every piece of audio, even in ones with AC regeneration like the HE-7. The chinese cable also changed for the better my valve amp when it replaced the DH Labs AC Power Plus.

2. There are many chinese cables worth to try at a fraction of the cost of more western popular ones. Just be careful as not all chinese cables are good. I've tried a couple that I did not like.

Also these made a good difference when they replaced my Vibrapods (now I have them all over the place  ) https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100...1d82e2d44e0b962d8fef3ff1a48&afSmartRedirect=y


----------



## PLGA

szore said:


> Just got my 8 wire silver and it is stunning...absolutley perfect with my Szalayi....if I paid well over $1,000 for this sound I would have been happy...This blows the Cleopatra away!



Hi, I just joined the thread. What kind of cables are those pure silver? Can you provide me the link? Thanks


----------



## cdacosta

OCC7N said:


> If the taxws wasnt that damn expenisive I would order the tripple crown right now. Beautiful cable
> 
> Will 5N Pure silver not beat any copper for interconnect?


Silver and copper audible sonic presentation are very different.  Assuming identical construction and materials (including solder) of the cable, they will sound very different.  Which is better will depend on your taste and how the cable blends with your system.  Put another way, how does the cable synergies with the rest of your system?  Think of it this way, use the cable as a tone control to nudge your system in the different areas you would like improvement.   So the simple answer to "is 5N silver better than copper", is no.


----------



## dougms3

A few toys came in today.  Fastest I've ever received something from aliexpress.

9 days from the date of order.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> A few toys came in today.  Fastest I've ever received something from aliexpress.
> 
> 9 days from the date of order.


What does the filter sound like?


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> What does the filter sound like?


You'll have to excuse the messy desk.





Theres more bass and it hits so much harder with this thing on my plc.

The soundstage got bigger, I can hear more microdetail and resolution seems to have increased a little bit.  

I wonder what the hell is in this thing?  Dammit I regret not buying 3 more at the price I got it for.  I think it might have been a pricing error because he raised it immediately after I bought it.


----------



## PLGA

dougms3 said:


> You'll have to excuse the messy desk.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hi 
I'm sorry, I got lost. What filter have you bought?

Can you share the link?


----------



## dougms3

PLGA said:


> Hi
> I'm sorry, I got lost. What filter have you bought?
> 
> Can you share the link?


Bought it from this seller but it was $32 when I bought it, there may be other sellers that are selling it at a cheaper price than this just fyi.  

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832580085862.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.25621802bf0zDC


----------



## dougms3 (Sep 17, 2022)

Disassembled my furutech 314ag II power cable and installed the new knockoff plug and iec.  Really nice quality on these things.  I ran a magnet over every part of the connector and there doesn't seem to be any ferrous content in it.

The original FI20 plug literally disintegrated as I was uninstalling it, it must have been about 15 years old lol.







Whoever terminated this cable did a messy job, and yes @cdacosta I made sure to coat the wires with nano liquid


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Disassembled my furutech 314ag II power cable and installed the new knockoff plug and iec.  Really nice quality on these things.
> 
> The original FI20 plug literally disintegrated as I was uninstalling it, it must have been about 15 years old lol.


Nice !


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 17, 2022)

I have placed 3 orders for the Furutech FI-50M NCF(R). 1 order with MATIHUR audiophile Store @ Ali and 2 orders with Amazon ( It’s Prime orders/ shipped from Amazon but from 2 different sellers) … The fake plug from Ali was $32 and 2 “Authentic” plugs from Amazon were $240 each… Well 2 “Authentic” plugs arrived this week, but they look fake to me… Awaiting the fake FI-50M NCF from Aliexpress to arrive, so I can find the weight (Fake VS "authentic"), but after checking these 2 plugs from Amazon prime I really suspect they are fakes sold as Authentic Furutech… There is no way to get the real thing, unless buying direct from Japan @ trusted vendor/store, I guess ... I will post my update on this once the fake from Ali delivered…


----------



## endless402

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have placed 3 orders for the Furutech FI-50M NCF(R). 1 order with MATIHUR audiophile Store @ Ali and 2 orders with Amazon ( It’s Prime orders/ shipped from Amazon but from 2 different sellers) … The fake plug from Ali was $32 and 2 “Authentic” plugs from Amazon were $240 each… Well 2 “Authentic” plugs arrived this week, but they look fake to me… Awaiting the fake FI-50M NCF from Aliexpress to arrive, so I can find the weight (Fake VS "authentic"), but after checking these 2 plugs from Amazon prime I really suspect they are fakes sold as Authentic Furutech… There is no way to get the real thing, unless buying direct from Japan @ trusted vendor/store, I guess ... I will post my update on this once the fake from Ali delivered…


Or you buy from a dealer? Lol


----------



## dougms3

Yeah, its probably best to get it from an authorized dealer to make sure you get a legit Furutech part.

Amazon sells alot of fake stuff.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

endless402 said:


> Or you buy from a dealer? Lol


It's $240 Japan or $400-500 from a dealer for this plug...


----------



## endless402

Crypt Keeper said:


> It's $240 Japan or $400-500 from a dealer for this plug...


then get from japan dealer? Always buy furutech from a dealer. Generally no free lunch. Fake NCF doesn’t sound the same from experience. None of their parts are made from china


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have placed 3 orders for the Furutech FI-50M NCF(R). 1 order with MATIHUR audiophile Store @ Ali and 2 orders with Amazon ( It’s Prime orders/ shipped from Amazon but from 2 different sellers) … The fake plug from Ali was $32 and 2 “Authentic” plugs from Amazon were $240 each… Well 2 “Authentic” plugs arrived this week, but they look fake to me… Awaiting the fake FI-50M NCF from Aliexpress to arrive, so I can find the weight (Fake VS "authentic"), but after checking these 2 plugs from Amazon prime I really suspect they are fakes sold as Authentic Furutech… There is no way to get the real thing, unless buying direct from Japan @ trusted vendor/store, I guess ... I will post my update on this once the fake from Ali delivered…


I have used fake and real when building cables. Over half the time fake sounded better. Not kidding.  The real were purchased from VH Audio


----------



## cdacosta

endless402 said:


> then get from japan dealer? Always buy furutech from a dealer. Generally no free lunch. Fake NCF doesn’t sound the same from experience. None of their parts are made from china


Agreed


----------



## Crypt Keeper

I have received my Furutech Nano liquid today … They could not ship it out of Japan, so had to pay $160 for this lil’ beautiful bottle of goodness … Can’t wait to use it on my braker, outlet, fuse holders and other connectors…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have received my Furutech Nano liquid today … They could not ship it out of Japan, so had to pay $160 for this lil’ beautiful bottle of goodness … Can’t wait to use it on my braker, outlet, fuse holders and other connectors…


You're in for a wild ride. 

Once you see what happens when you put it on one thing, you will put it on everything.  

I put it on fuses, power cables, interconnects, headphone cables, pc components, literally anything that has an electrical connection.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have received my Furutech Nano liquid today … They could not ship it out of Japan, so had to pay $160 for this lil’ beautiful bottle of goodness … Can’t wait to use it on my braker, outlet, fuse holders and other connectors…


Suggestion, read my notes and tips on use and application in this thread.  You are in for a treat.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> You're in for a wild ride.
> 
> Once you see what happens when you put it on one thing, you will put it on everything.
> 
> I put it on fuses, power cables, interconnects, headphone cables, pc components, literally anything that has an electrical connection.


Ah yep, that is likely how it will go for Crypt Keeper.


----------



## OCC7N (Sep 18, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have received my Furutech Nano liquid today … They could not ship it out of Japan, so had to pay $160 for this lil’ beautiful bottle of goodness … Can’t wait to use it on my braker, outlet, fuse holders and other connectors…


Power cable?

Or the flux-50? Mine is authentic btw 😊


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Power cable?
> 
> Or the flux-50? Mine is authentic btw 😊


Furutech Nano liquid https://www.furutech.com/2013/01/18/1647/



How much was the original Flux in USD ?    
The best price-wise so far  $76  https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832594385310.html  so $32  was a great deal...


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Furutech Nano liquid https://www.furutech.com/2013/01/18/1647/
> 
> 
> 
> ...



800dollars


----------



## dougms3 (Sep 18, 2022)

So I just wanted to show you guys something.

I used a non contact voltage detector (NCVD) which basically picks up EMF.  This is only an indication of the insulation and shielding of the cable.  It has nothing to do with the sound quality.

https://imgur.com/9DQjYAw

The far left cable is a real furutech fp-s55n with real furutech connectors, the one directly to the right of that is real furutech 314ag wire with knockoff furutech fi50 connectors, behind that is the gryphon knockoff, then the odin gold and ifi ipower x.

This is why furutech is legit, as you can see, the NCVD did not pick up any EMF outside the wire or connectors.  The worst offender is the gryphon knockoff, about an inch radius of detectable EMF around the wire.  The NCVD picked up an EMF about 1/4" radius on the gold odin and about the same on the ifi ipower x.

Its also interesting that there was no EMF picked up from the knockoff FI50 connectors.  As I mentioned previously, they are of excellent build quality.  I have several real furutech connectors and I cannot tell the difference by looking at it.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 19, 2022)

Awesome ! Bad shielding I would assume ? I have one of these NCVDs somewhere… Should check my wires and plugs as well. I guess I would stick with that fake $32 Furutech from Matihur store for now…

Recently I decided to order EM100 Dirty Electricity Meter by Trifield (EMI Power Line Noise Analyzer) for the outlet and Isolation transformers…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Awesome ! Bad shielding I would assume ? I have one of these NCVDs somewhere… Should check my wires and plugs as well. I guess I would stick with that fake $32 Furutech from Matihur store for now…
> 
> Recently I decided to order EM100 Dirty Electricity Meter by Trifield (EMI Power Line Noise Analyzer) for the outlet and Isolation transformers…


Yeah, pretty much means insufficient shielding and dielectric material for the amount of power its carrying.  

Shouldn't really indicate any issues with sound but just have to be more careful that the cables don't come in close proximity with other cables.  

But it works both ways so it could be prone to absorbing EMI as well.

Haven't tried one of those, I did look at it at one time but I wouldn't have much of a purpose for it because knowing the exact number won't help me much.


----------



## dougms3

Btw I bought the FI-50 connectors from this seller.  He sells the set for $36.  Not bad at all 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/325...00028280719049!sea&curPageLogUid=fgBIFrdcjGcM


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Before doing the Nano, I was looking to replace me messy old speaker jumper plates (they are cheap stock and like 10 years old now)…

I have 3 on my list  so far... What do you guys think?... 

1) https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803430099969.html
2) https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256801637632333.html
3) https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256804250150163.html


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Before doing the Nano, I was looking to replace me messy old speaker jumper plates (they are cheap stock and like 10 years old now)…
> 
> I have 3 on my list  so far... What do you guys think?...
> 
> ...


Do you stick those in your ears?

I'm afraid I'm not too familiar with speakers unless its in a car.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Do you stick those in your ears?
> 
> I'm afraid I'm not too familiar with speakers unless its in a car.


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Awesome ! Bad shielding I would assume ? I have one of these NCVDs somewhere… Should check my wires and plugs as well. I guess I would stick with that fake $32 Furutech from Matihur store for now…
> 
> Recently I decided to order EM100 Dirty Electricity Meter by Trifield (EMI Power Line Noise Analyzer) for the outlet and Isolation transformers…


I have always wanted one of these. How much do they cost?



dougms3 said:


> So I just wanted to show you guys something.
> 
> I used a non contact voltage detector (NCVD) which basically picks up EMF.  This is only an indication of the insulation and shielding of the cable.  It has nothing to do with the sound quality.
> 
> ...


Wow! thats awesome the Furutech knockoffs does it well!!!!

Im gonna buy that and connectors and cable for my flux-50


What about the Flux-50 knockoff how does it respond to the EMF pen?


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> Bought it from this seller but it was $32 when I bought it, there may be other sellers that are selling it at a cheaper price than this just fyi.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832580085862.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.25621802bf0zDC


30cm length $130aud so your doing well


----------



## OCC7N (Sep 19, 2022)

Stax 7 said:


> 30cm length $130aud so your doing well


have you seen price of authentic version 

I have the authentic(800 dollars) and I can confirm deeper bass responds as @dougms3 also has experience with the knock off. I don´t know if it is the same responds...

So if the knock off can do the same for less, I feel casually robbed.


----------



## dougms3

OCC7N said:


> have you seen price of authentic version
> 
> I have the authentic(800 dollars) and I can confirm deeper bass responds as @dougms3 also has experience with the knock off. I don´t know if it is the same responds...
> 
> So if the knock off can do the same for less, I feel casually robbed.


Don't feel bad, I'm sure the authentic version is better just as the odin knockoffs won't be as good as the original.




OCC7N said:


> I have always wanted one of these. How much do they cost?
> 
> 
> Wow! thats awesome the Furutech knockoffs does it well!!!!
> ...


When I run the NCVD over the knockoff flux, the iec connector doesn't emit any EMF but theres something going on in the thick connector.  It sets off the NCVD very easily.


----------



## OCC7N

dougms3 said:


> Don't feel bad, I'm sure the authentic version is better just as the odin knockoffs won't be as good as the original.
> 
> 
> 
> When I run the NCVD over the knockoff flux, the iec connector doesn't emit any EMF but theres something going on in the thick connector.  It sets off the NCVD very easily.


inside the connector of the thick side(flux50)?


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Before doing the Nano, I was looking to replace me messy old speaker jumper plates (they are cheap stock and like 10 years old now)…
> 
> I have 3 on my list  so far... What do you guys think?...
> 
> ...


Do your speakers have 5 way binding posts?  What is the termination of your speaker cables?


----------



## dougms3

OCC7N said:


> inside the connector of the thick side(flux50)?


Yeah the thicker side.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> I have always wanted one of these. How much do they cost?
> 
> 
> Wow! thats awesome the Furutech knockoffs does it well!!!!
> ...


$ 143 off  E-bay or $152 on Amazon for  EM100 Dirty Electricity Meter by Trifield


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Do your speakers have 5 way binding posts?  What is the termination of your speaker cables?


Yes.  It's  5 way.  I have huge spades , so was  thinking Banana to Spades .. Thanks


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes.  It's  5 way.  I have huge spades , so was  thinking Banana to Spades .. Thanks


If you have spades on the cables, go banana for jumpers. Better overall connection in my experience.  Cannot recommend the jumpers on Aliexpress, no experience with them.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 19, 2022)

The triple crown XLR inside:







The plugs are high quality aluminum shells filled with silicone filler so they feel heavy just like the real thing. The wire itself looks like what they say “silver alloy mono-crystal”, but needs a lab test.. Positive and negative wires are individually shielded and seem to be 12 AWG .The ground wire is 14 AWG. Overall quality of the wire 10/10. Build quality 8/10. When put back together looks and feels almost as good as the real thing 10/10 … After switching back from the good old Odin2 for a few days the difference in SQ was huge… Better soundstage and a 3d like effect, more micro details, much better overall and most definitely cold be even better cable if I would replace all plugs…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The triple crown XLR inside:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Before you put that back together, you may way to consider resoldering with mundorf supreme solder.  

That solder enhances everything to a new level.


----------



## dougms3

I don't know what the hell is in that knockoff Flux-50 but as I mentioned before its connected to my furutech etp80 plc and it increased the bass and hits harder, theres more soundstage and depth, treble seems smoother and less peaky, mids have more body and seem richer as well but there is a slight haziness to the mids. 

Hopefully, it just need some burn in time.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 20, 2022)

Just wanted to add another source of very good cables to the thread:

Expensive but excellent solid silver cables https://audiosensibility.com

The best DC cable I have tried - Signature Silver DC cable (7N OCC – 16 AWG)

Would like to audition - The Signature USB ...


----------



## OCC7N

dougms3 said:


> Yeah the thicker side.


Im gonna order the same pen as yours and try my cable. Do you have link?


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just wanted to add another source of very good cables to the thread:
> 
> Expensive but excellent solid silver cables https://audiosensibility.com
> 
> ...


https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...re-Power-Cable-V2/p/32732719/category=2595837

that one? it does not look like 7N


----------



## dougms3

OCC7N said:


> Im gonna order the same pen as yours and try my cable. Do you have link?


I bought mine from this guy but he raised the price since I bought it.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/225...00030208856684!sea&curPageLogUid=wSf8Z3z6jj5R

This guy is selling it cheaper.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/225...101f6ba16636572226781010e1a79!63693947166!rec


OCC7N said:


> https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...re-Power-Cable-V2/p/32732719/category=2595837
> 
> that one? it does not look like 7N


Audiosensibility is one of a handful of companies that have an official license to produce OCC cables, along with furutech, neotech, xlo.  The owner of the company is the son of a college friend of Dr. Ohno who invented and owns the patent for OCC.


----------



## OCC7N

dougms3 said:


> I bought mine from this guy but he raised the price since I bought it.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832580085862.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.2cae776cR3KFUU&algo_pvid=38ec8a95-5405-49a1-b23a-9dab9771c358&algo_exp_id=38ec8a95-5405-49a1-b23a-9dab9771c358-2&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000030208856684"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!100.0!85.0!!!!!@2101d64d16636572040561671e847f!12000030208856684!sea&curPageLogUid=wSf8Z3z6jj5R
> 
> ...


Thanks for links  You really did get it for veeery good price right?

I am talking about the voltage/emf sensore pen. Im gonna try it on my flux-50 to see if it is the same as yours


----------



## dougms3

OCC7N said:


> Thanks for links  You really did get it for veeery good price right?
> 
> I am talking about the voltage/emf sensore pen. Im gonna try it on my flux-50 to see if it is the same as yours


Yeah I got it for $32, I should have bought more but I didn't think it was gonna do anything to be honest lol.

I will predict that the real flux-50 won't emit any emf anywhere on the cable. 

Will be interesting to see how it compares to the real thing though.

Are you noticing any change in the sound with the flux-50?  The sound has been changing over the past couple days for me, really opening up after a few days on the plc.


----------



## OCC7N

dougms3 said:


> Yeah I got it for $32, I should have bought more but I didn't think it was gonna do anything to be honest lol.
> 
> I will predict that the real flux-50 won't emit any emf anywhere on the cable.
> 
> ...


Its connected to my ifi powerstation. the lows and midlows has improved when I try my Aryas. I really don´t know how it was on my Susvara to start with, but the imaging/seperation from mid lows to the mid highs are just wider on Susvara.

But yeah the whole setup has changed according to my ears. More bass. Arya was just mid and highs before, now it sounds like more.


----------



## iFi audio

OCC7N said:


> Its connected to my ifi powerstation. the lows and midlows has improved when I try my Aryas. I really don´t know how it was on my Susvara to start with, but the imaging/seperation from mid lows to the mid highs are just wider on Susvara.
> 
> But yeah the whole setup has changed according to my ears. More bass. Arya was just mid and highs before, now it sounds like more.



It's rather interesting to experience how much all power accessories stack, isn't it  ?


----------



## szore

I got my AresII back from repair and put that "audiophile" fuse in and it sounds great! @dougms3 

In other news, I plugged the Ares 2 into the power conditioner, and it blew the fuse on the bic500-again-...


----------



## OCC7N

iFi audio said:


> It's rather interesting to experience how much all power accessories stack, isn't it  ?


yes it really does make a difference, and I like it, it makes Susvara more delicate than it already is, but on the same time it does something opposite on my Aryas, more raw, full spectred kinda way.


szore said:


> I got my AresII back from repair and put that "audiophile" fuse in and it sounds great! @dougms3
> 
> In other news, I plugged the Ares 2 into the power conditioner, and it blew the fuse on the bic500-again-...


What fuse did you buy? Im just new to this


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I got my AresII back from repair and put that "audiophile" fuse in and it sounds great! @dougms3
> 
> In other news, I plugged the Ares 2 into the power conditioner, and it blew the fuse on the bic500-again-...


Takes a few days for the fuse to open up.

Thats weird that it blows the fuse so easily.  

And I think that palladium iem cable is coming in this week.


----------



## szore

So, concerning these IEM cables I bought... I had an issue with the new 8 wire silver cable I bought. At the junction of the 4.4mm plug and the wire, if you move the wire sometimes you get drop outs...very bummed, so I message Highclass hifi Connector store and asked about a repair. He told me it may be better to repair local, and I told him it would cost $65. Now...I bought another cable off him, a 4 wire pure 7NN copper 3.5 which sounds brilliant! ($35)...I asked last week if he could make me a custom 8 wire version 4.4mm and he agreed. I figure the 8 wire is double the price of the 4 wire ($65)...so I asked him if he could send the 8 wire free to compensate for the repair and he agreed! I thought that was very decent of him!


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 20, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...re-Power-Cable-V2/p/32732719/category=2595837
> 
> that one? it does not look like 7N


His AS Signature Silver line is really good (The wire and connectors have been cryogenically treated. Mundorf Silver-Gold Supreme Solder is used for all solder connections) Now that I’ve seen what’s inside the Triple crown, I want to compare it to AS Signature XLR.. Damn addiction…


----------



## szore

Is it my imagination, or does that silver fuse brighten AresII up? It has great extension up top but it seems 'brighter' to me...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Is it my imagination, or does that silver fuse brighten AresII up? It has great extension up top but it seems 'brighter' to me...


Lol it takes some time to settle in so it might go through some swings.  It started to open up alot 3-4 days in for me.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 20, 2022)

szore said:


> Is it my imagination, or does that silver fuse brighten AresII up? It has great extension up top but it seems 'brighter' to me...


It takes up to 300 hrs for the synergistic research purple fuse .. I’ve tried Aucharm Reds n my DAC  as well …I would say, it needs a week. But the fuse is very good for the price.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Takes a few days for the fuse to open up.
> 
> Thats weird that it blows the fuse so easily.
> 
> And I think that palladium iem cable is coming in this week.


That Palladium cable needs some hours on it before it breaks in....at first I thought the mids were too forward...now its perfect.


----------



## szore (Sep 21, 2022)

Man, what a day...my power conditioner is dead in the water because I dont have a fuse for it...I orderd them next day on Amazon, then Alvin tells me it has to be a slow blow, which it wasnt so I cancelled and reorderd a slow blow 5A...will get it tomorrow but I can't wait, and I got time at work to kill, so I go from Lexington and 55 to Lex and 62 to a hardware store but they dont have one. Then I walk from there to 47th and 2nd, to an Ace hardware store, great, but Biden is in town to talk at The U.N. ...cops on every single corner, literally, from at least 65th to midtown (35,etc). all centered on the United Nations, diplomats everywhere...protests every where, I got caught literally in ground zero of an Iranian freedom protest...like, packed body to body for 2 city blocks, and the guy with the bullhorn was right in my ear...oh, man...finally get to the HW store, he only has fast blow, so I take them... Hit another HW store on the way back, zilch...ok, anyway get home after work, and I want to see how these fast blows work, I got 2 of them. I put 1 in, and only plug in the AresII...turn on the switch on the DAC and the fuse blows...great, put in the last one, unplug the dac and plug in the Jot2 amp and it works! So it's cool for tonight because the Ares already has its own toroidal power supply...its nice tho to have it on the AMP...anyway, these power cables are breaking in nicely! now with the power conditioner, the mids are like butter, yet musical, transparent and detailed with great PrAT (on my Szalayi and the 8 wire silver...). The background is much blacker, everything is crisp... The bass is always perfect...cymbal crashes just contrast against a deep, black soundstage...vocals hang in their own space... So tomorrow I am getting back my Matrix USB card, i'll plug my iFi power supply into that, then in a day or 2 the new Odin2 USB cable will get here! finally, spent 8 days in customes...then after that the audiophile fuse for the BIC500...fingers crossed!...(then, The Liquid).


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Man, what a day...my power conditioner is dead in the water because I dont have a fuse for it...I orderd them next day on Amazon, then Alvin tells me it has to be a slow blow, which it wasnt so I cancelled and reorderd a slow blow 5A...will get it tomorrow but I can't wait, and I got time at work to kill, so I go from Lexington and 55 to Lex and 62 to a hardware store but they dont have one. Then I walk from there to 47th and 2nd, to an Ace hardware store, great, but Biden is in town to talk at The U.N. ...cops on every single corner, literally, from at least 65th to midtown (35,etc). all centered on the United Nations, diplomats everywhere...protests every where, I got caught literally in ground zero of an Iranian freedom protest...like, packed body to body for 2 city blocks, and the guy with the bullhorn was right in my ear...oh, man...finally get to the HW store, he only has fast blow, so I take them... Hit another HW store on the way back, zilch...ok, anyway get home after work, and I want to see how these fast blows work, I got 2 of them. I put 1 in, and only plug in the AresII...turn on the switch on the DAC and the fuse blows...great, put in the last one, unplug the dac and plug in the Jot2 amp and it works! So it's cool for tonight because the Ares already has its own toroidal power supply...its nice tho to have it on the AMP...anyway, these power cables are breaking in nicely! now with the power conditioner, the mids are like butter, yet musical, transparent and detailed with great PrAT (on my Szalayi and the 8 wire silver...). The background is much blacker, everything is crisp... The bass is always perfect...cymbal crashes just contrast against a deep, black soundstage...vocals hang in their own space... So tomorrow I am getting back my Matrix USB card, i'll plug my iFi power supply into that, then in a day or 2 the new Odin2 USB cable will get here! finally, spent 8 days in customes...then after that the audiophile fuse for the BIC500...fingers crossed!...(then, The Liquid).


Lol like the movie Everything Everywhere All at once.

Why is the fusing blowing so easily?  A dac and couple headphone amps shouldn't be enough to overload a plc.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Lol like the movie Everything Everywhere All at once.
> 
> Why is the fusing blowing so easily?  A dac and couple headphone amps shouldn't be enough to overload a plc.


All I know is he said use 5 amp slow blow. Its ok cause tomorrow I get 5 of them to experiment with until the audiophile one comes in a week or so. It's supposed to have 500VA (whatever that is..)


----------



## dougms3 (Sep 21, 2022)

Btw after some further listening with the knockoff flux 50 on my plc, I've discovered something is off.

While I was getting more bass and stage, there was some unusual haziness in the mids.  I took it off my plc and put it on my pc.  I'll let it burn in for a while on my pc and then test it again later on.  But since I took it off the haziness is gone.

@OCC7N

May be hold off on the purchase until I can make sure its not negatively affecting the sound.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> All I know is he said use 5 amp slow blow. Its ok cause tomorrow I get 5 of them to experiment with until the audiophile one comes in a week or so. It's supposed to have 500VA (whatever that is..)


Now that I think of it, 5amps seems really kind of low for a plc.  The ares itself maxes out at 2amps, leaves you room with less than 3amps to use for another device.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Btw after some further listening with the knockoff flux 50 on my plc, I've discovered something is off.
> 
> While I was getting more bass and stage, there was some unusual haziness in the mids.  I took it off my plc and put it on my pc.  I'll let it burn in for a while on my pc and then test it again later on.  But since I took it off the haziness is gone.
> 
> ...


I know this is going to be more expensive, but this small unit will provide much much better results …


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I know this is going to be more expensive, but this small unit will provide much much better results …



I got something similar, a used Powervar 6.0 ABC600-11MED Power Conditioner off ebay for about $80.

I bought the knockoff duplexes to put into this unit, then I'm going to replace all of the internal wiring with neotech 12awg awg solid core occ copper.  Then replaced the power wire later on.

I've been meaning to do this for a while.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I got something similar, a used Powervar 6.0 ABC600-11MED Power Conditioner off ebay for about $80.
> 
> I bought the knockoff duplexes to put into this unit, then I'm going to replace all of the internal wiring with neotech 12awg awg solid core occ copper.  Then replaced the power wire later on.
> 
> I've been meaning to do this for a while.


I found this great review on these...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I found this great review on these...


Dual stacked toroidal power supply, well can't beat that.


----------



## Rick_B

dougms3 said:


> Lol like the movie Everything Everywhere All at once.
> 
> Why is the fusing blowing so easily?  A dac and couple headphone amps shouldn't be enough to overload a plc.


Inrush current starting something up...initial current spikes can momentarily exceed the 5 Amp rating and blow the fuse...slow blows absorb this momentary spike without blowing...in an emergency I have used a fast blow of 1 Amp greater capacity until I get the right thing.


----------



## szore

Rick_B said:


> Inrush current starting something up...initial current spikes can momentarily exceed the 5 Amp rating and blow the fuse...slow blows absorb this momentary spike without blowing...in an emergency I have used a fast blow of 1 Amp greater capacity until I get the right thing.


Everything delivered today: New usb card, new USB Odin 2 cable, audiophile fuse, and slow blow fuses from Amazon...!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Everything delivered today: New usb card, new USB Odin 2 cable, audiophile fuse, and slow blow fuses from Amazon...!


I know the feeling, new toys.  I am waiting for a knife sharpening system that arrives today that I am going to mod, so I get the excitement!


----------



## dougms3

Got the palladium cable.  Xinhs 4 core copper cable for comparison which is what I was using on my TRN Kirin.  Both are terminated to 2.5mm.

Immediately, the bass impact and volume increase is noticeable, theres cleaner separation and more audible microdetail.  I'll wait till it burns in to give a better impression.


----------



## szore

I went through 5 fuses, no doubt The ARes 2 blows the slow blow fuse on the BIC500 everytime...Ittle teed off...I spent 750 clams on that, and I cant even plug a DAC into it? So for now, with the audiophile fuse I just have the AMP and the USB card ext power supply plugged into it. Got to write Alvin an Email now... Having said that, with the new usb card and usb cable, and the amp on the powerconditioner, the sound is seriously impresive.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Received this “100W Hi end Version Linear Power Supply” today …


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Received this “100W Hi end Version Linear Power Supply” today …


Damn, thats alot of caps and looks like all nichicon.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Damn, thats alot of caps and looks like all nichicon.


Yes, Nichicons !   It’s huge and heavy. About X2 size of my Farad Super 3…

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256803216470537.html


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Received this “100W Hi end Version Linear Power Supply” today …


How does it perform and what is this LPS replacing?  What is it powering?


----------



## Rolox

dougms3 said:


> Bought it from this seller but it was $32 when I bought it, there may be other sellers that are selling it at a cheaper price than this just fyi.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2251832580085862.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.25621802bf0zDC


Now the cheapest I've seen (which is the one on ur link) costs around 110USD. Most other vendors sell those between 200 and 300USD. 32USD was a complete steal!
 The cheapest one seems to be made by Preffair, the other ones by CGQAE (or something I don't remember exactly). I wonder how different they are. I wonder what's inside... that filter makes me really curious!
You've been using it for a few days now... still happy? no side effects? no screwing of the dynamic range?


----------



## Rolox

cdacosta said:


> How does it perform and what is this LPS replacing?  What is it powering?


I have the same PSU, 12V version, powering the small class D amplifier that feeds the 500 to 20000Hz range in my trip-amped horn system. It's a fantastic power supply. Mine has been ON 24/7 for the last 3 years and seems very reliable and sounds great.


----------



## dougms3

Rolox said:


> Now the cheapest I've seen (which is the one on ur link) costs around 110USD. Most other vendors sell those between 200 and 300USD. 32USD was a complete steal!
> The cheapest one seems to be made by Preffair, the other ones by CGQAE (or something I don't remember exactly). I wonder how different they are. I wonder what's inside... that filter makes me really curious!
> You've been using it for a few days now... still happy? no side effects? no screwing of the dynamic range?


I opened up the connector end and it looks like just stranded copper wire.  

The thick part, I couldn't figure out how to remove it so I was unable to look inside.  

It increases bass and stage but there was some unusual fuzziness to the mids.  I'm burning it in on my pc at the moment. 

I'll test it out again later on once its fully burned in.


----------



## Rolox

I bought this little Odin cable out of curiosity: it is the same as the other ones I own, but with silver plated XSSH RCA plugs instead of the fake Furutech Rhodium plugs my previous Odin cables use.
It is also the cheapest Odin I ever bought, probably one of the cheapest available, 35euro for one meter, 55euro for 3 meters! Fast delivery, one week to Brussels... it is very well built (better than the Odin Gold I recently bought), great soldering job, RCA plugs are basic but the silver plating is a nice touch and they are tight, for such a low price that cable is a no-brainer.
Hasn't been broken-in yet but it sounds great, neutral and detailed, seems to be a bit more extended in the highs and slightly more neutral than the rhodium plugs version.
For anyone having a system with a lot of cables, or needing some long lengths on a small budget, this could be a great option.

https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005..._list.0.0.730179d2c1X7U0&gatewayAdapt=glo2nld


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 23, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> How does it perform and what is this LPS replacing?  What is it powering?


I just got it and I think it needs at least a week or 2 of  burn-in ... But I plan to power my Nighthawk XR1000 (one of the best for streaming audio)  router with it..


----------



## szore

_I posted this in the Szalayi thread, where someone asked me about these 3 Hiclass cables, so I'm just pasting..._

Well, I have had some time with them, and I love them all! BUT! They do different things, and they do those things very well indeed! The palladium plated silver, gold plated silver cable is very revealing. It opens up the mids, it expands the soundstage, adds extension on both ends. (all 3 do that, actually. Due in no small part to the 8 wire design). The 8 wire cables really open up and add complexity to the soud stage. In the begining the palladiums cables mids were too forward for me, especialy with the SZA. But I found out they suited my other IEMs well, especialy my custom Valkyries. BUT, I also found out that once the palladium cable was broken in with about 100 hours (and counting) the mids really smoothed out, and now it sounds spectacular, even with the Szalayi!

The gold plated silver 8 wire has just as much clarity and extension, but it leans slightly to a more euphonic sound, with lovely sweetness on the top end, and a rich layerd base. Mids are expansive, clear and detailed, and the sound is very relaxed and open.

The 8 wire silver is like plugging in the lights on a Christmas tree on the Szalayi! Its like shining a clear, musical, textured, engaging silver light on all the notes, just frosting them with clarity and resolution. Rich, deep bass. Treble on all 3 cables have great air and extension. I have to believe these cables are doing at least 80% of their boutique counterparts are doing like , well, I won't name names, that aint cool, but lets just look at the 8 wire gold plated silver. Comparable cables sell for $3,600.... Of course they don't have comparable connectors, but I think the actual cables are all close in sound. I mean, if I paid $3,600 for a Horus, and it sounded like the $240 Hiclass, I would have been happy.


----------



## msing539

The Odin 2 usb cable won't recognize the Pontus off a Raspberry Pi. I tried for hours, swapping the board, different Pi OS including Moode, Volumio, Raspbian, Ropieee, etc. In the end, a generic usb cable worked though I'm not sure why. Same length on both cables.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 24, 2022)

msing539 said:


> The Odin 2 usb cable won't recognize the Pontus off a Raspberry Pi. I tried for hours, swapping the board, different Pi OS including Moode, Volumio, Raspbian, Ropieee, etc. In the end, a generic usb cable worked though I'm not sure why. Same length on both cables.


I purchased 2 (0.75m and 2m)  back in 2021 and tried them on different devices (for data transfer as well) … All good. Maybe you got defective cable ?


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> I purchased 2 (0.75m and 2m)  back in 2021 and tried them on different devices (for data transfer as well) … All good. Maybe you got defective cable ?


I'm not sure--it works perfectly fine from PC to Iris or direct to Pontus. The Pi just doesn't like it.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

msing539 said:


> I'm not sure--it works perfectly fine from PC to Iris or direct to Pontus. The Pi just doesn't like it.


You can check the pinout with a voltmeter , but it will destroy that nice Nordost shrink tubing…

Item# 3256803768948311


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> You can check the pinout with a voltmeter , but it will destroy that nice Nordost shrink tubing…
> 
> Item# 3256803768948311


If it has to come to that, I'll just sell the Pi!


----------



## Crypt Keeper

msing539 said:


> If it has to come to that, I'll just sell the Pi!


BTW,  Before I purchased my SOtm Linux streamer, I’ve been using mini PC with IFI elite Power Supply + Linux Daphile realtime kernel with great results…


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> BTW,  Before I purchased my SOtm Linux streamer, I’ve been using mini PC with IFI elite Power Supply + Linux Daphile realtime kernel with great results…


Thanks, I've listed the Pi in classifieds. I might look into something like a Nuc.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 24, 2022)

msing539 said:


> Thanks, I've listed the Pi in classifieds. I might look into something like a Nuc.


I’ve been using  this. Cheap, fanless and it's 12 Volt.


----------



## msing539

Crypt Keeper said:


> I’ve been using  this. Cheap, fanless and it's 12 Volt.


That IS cheap. I'll look into it, thanks!


----------



## DecentLevi (Sep 24, 2022)

@dougms3 looks like we're both on a similar journey with the Flux-50 inline power filter, mine's still on the way. Did you say yours is the real thing or a copy? You mentioned one of your cables being real. And did you say it passed the electrical leakage test?

Also I've been wondering, does the power cable or your custom sockets still make a difference matter if you place it before the Flux-50? My use case for it will be at the end of some of these nice power cables, because it is not nearly long enough to use on its own. I could get a longer one but that would become quite expensive.

And silly question, what is "plc"? I've seen this acronym in lowercase, the closest guess I have is the postal abbreviation for place.


----------



## Thenewguy007

Crypt Keeper said:


> The triple crown XLR inside:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Did you open up the shells with switch? does it really float or ground the shield?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Thenewguy007 said:


> Did you open up the shells with switch? does it really float or ground the shield?


Nope. I only did the XLR connectors. But the switch works. there is a slight difference when you flip it on both ends…


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 looks like we're both on a similar journey with the Flux-50 inline power filter, mine's still on the way. Did you say yours is the real thing or a copy? You mentioned one of your cables being real. And did you say it passed the electrical leakage test?
> 
> Also I've been wondering, does the power cable or your custom sockets still make a difference matter if you place it before the Flux-50? My use case for it will be at the end of some of these nice power cables, because it is not nearly long enough to use on its own. I could get a longer one but that would become quite expensive.
> 
> And silly question, what is "plc"? I've seen this acronym in lowercase, the closest guess I have is the postal abbreviation for place.


Mine is a copy, @OCC7N has the real thing.  

I have a real furutech fp-s55n power cable with fi-46 connectors and real furutech 314ag cable with the knockoff fi-50 connectors.  Both of these cables don't emit any EMI anywhere on the cable or connectors.

I opened up the ac plug connector to coat it with nano liquid, wire is stranded copper maybe 10awg but it just looks like a regular power cable.  I don't know whats in the thick connector as I couldn't figure out how to open it up.  It definitely increased the bass and stage but it was causing some grain in the mids so I took it off so I could burn it in on my PC.  I will test again later on once it has a good amount of hours on it.  

PLC = Power Line Conditioner


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> Mine is a copy, @OCC7N has the real thing.
> 
> I have a real furutech fp-s55n power cable with fi-46 connectors and real furutech 314ag cable with the knockoff fi-50 connectors.  Both of these cables don't emit any EMI anywhere on the cable or connectors.
> 
> ...


Anyone recommend a AES/EBU cable from Ali express seller?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 25, 2022)

Stax 7 said:


> Anyone recommend a AES/EBU cable from Ali express seller?


No experience with this wire. But not expensive at all to try…
( Item# 3256802429608832 , 3256801644507067 )


----------



## Stax 7

Crypt Keeper said:


> No experience with this wire. But not expensive at all to try…
> ( Item# 3256802429608832 , 3256801644507067 )


Yes that is a good one. to try


----------



## Crypt Keeper

The Vipeos silver Ethernet cable ($70 no tax) Bettered Original AQ Vodka ($475+tax) instantly, thou it had only 3 days of burn-in and from my experience it usually takes at least 2 weeks with pure silver… The Vodka had well over 3 weeks of burn-in   This overpriced piece of crap is going back to Amazon tomorrow…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Just Awesome CAT 8 !


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just Awesome CAT 8 !


The Vipeos silver Ethernet?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 26, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> The Vipeos silver Ethernet?


Yes, Item #    3256804392417275


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes, Item #    3256804392417275


Now thats how you link from aliexpress. Only thing that works! Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Now thats how you link from aliexpress. Only thing that works! Thanks


I’m blown away by the performance of this CAT 8 with only 3 days of burn-in done…  Pls Don’t get me wrong, there are plenty of even better Lan cables around, but for the price ??? It’s just like: Odin2 USB 12 core, The outsider USB or Siltech trpl crown XLR… Awesome!


----------



## OCC7N (Sep 26, 2022)

how do you connect and length of the cable?

its pretty expensive though 🤣


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 26, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> how do you connect and length of the cable?
> 
> its pretty expensive though 🤣


I'm ok  with 0.5-0.75 m  (Etherregen --> Streamer) , but I have 10 m item#   2255800651386902   (The router----> Etherregen) .  BTW also  very  nice twisted CAT 8


----------



## szore

I'm pretty upset...Everytime I tried to plug my AresII DAC into the bic500 power conditioner with an Odin2 cable, the fuse would blow on the DAC. I just tried the normal included power cable that came with the DAC, and it does not blow the fuse...so my suspician is confirmed: the Odin2 must have very low resistance and there must be a current spike that is blowing the fuse... So I have to use the Odin2, plugged into my normal power outlet.... Even this way it sounds better than the normal power cord plugged into the bic500.


----------



## OCC7N

Have anybody bought good knock off ACSS cables from aliexpress?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I'm pretty upset...Everytime I tried to plug my AresII DAC into the bic500 power conditioner with an Odin2 cable, the fuse would blow on the DAC. I just tried the normal included power cable that came with the DAC, and it does not blow the fuse...so my suspician is confirmed: the Odin2 must have very low resistance and there must be a current spike that is blowing the fuse... So I have to use the Odin2, plugged into my normal power outlet.... Even this way it sounds better than the normal power cord plugged into the bic500.


Man sorry to hear that.

What's weird is i have tested the gold odin, gryphon, and other cables on my ares ii and haven't blown the fuse once.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Man sorry to hear that.
> 
> What's weird is i have tested the gold odin, gryphon, and other cables on my ares ii and haven't blown the fuse once.


"Weird" is exactly the word Alvin used... But its not the fuse in the AresII, its the fuse on the power conditioner that keeps blowing.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Off topic: Received my 3rd Isolation transformer today. Got it as “New- damaged box” off e-bay… Look what’s Inside… I think I should get a good partial refund for this type of “crap”…


----------



## DenverW

Crypt Keeper said:


> Off topic: Received my 3rd Isolation transformer today. Got it as “New- damaged box” off e-bay… Look what’s Inside… I think I should get a good partial refund for this type of “crap”…


Wow - that's the dirtiest open box I've ever seen.


----------



## hahachah27

Crypt Keeper said:


> Off topic: Received my 3rd Isolation transformer today. Got it as “New- damaged box” off e-bay… Look what’s Inside… I think I should get a good partial refund for this type of “crap”…


return it man hahahah


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> "Weird" is exactly the word Alvin used... But its not the fuse in the AresII, its the fuse on the power conditioner that keeps blowing.


On the product page, it says it has surge protection.  Thats unusual, I think that should not be happening.


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


> I'm pretty upset...Everytime I tried to plug my AresII DAC into the bic500 power conditioner with an Odin2 cable, the fuse would blow on the DAC. I just tried the normal included power cable that came with the DAC, and it does not blow the fuse...so my suspician is confirmed: the Odin2 must have very low resistance and there must be a current spike that is blowing the fuse... So I have to use the Odin2, plugged into my normal power outlet.... Even this way it sounds better than the normal power cord plugged into the bic500.


The fuse on the BIC500 blows everytime you use the Odin2 cable?

Are you connecting the odin2 to the DAC or the BIC500? .... I understood it as DAC in the first place

And when you say normal poweroutlet this way it connects directly to the BIC500?

Do you have a multimeter where you can measure the cables stock and Odin?

Also measure the wall outlet so you have that checked.

(Imagine you had the SR Purple fuse )


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 27, 2022)

szore said:


> I'm pretty upset...Everytime I tried to plug my AresII DAC into the bic500 power conditioner with an Odin2 cable, the fuse would blow on the DAC. I just tried the normal included power cable that came with the DAC, and it does not blow the fuse...so my suspician is confirmed: the Odin2 must have very low resistance and there must be a current spike that is blowing the fuse... So I have to use the Odin2, plugged into my normal power outlet.... Even this way it sounds better than the normal power cord plugged into the bic500.


Could you check the polarity (Hot, Neutral, Ground) of The Odin ? Sometimes they mess it up .. I should remind myself to do so every time I receive any new pwr cable from Ali… It (reversed polarity) happened befo…


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> Could you check the polarity (Hot, Neutral, Ground) of The Odin ? Sometimes they mess it up .. I should remind myself to do so every time I receive a new pwr cable from Ali… It (reversed polarity) happened befo…


I tried 2 different odin cables but I will look into it


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Could you check the polarity (Hot, Neutral, Ground) of The Odin ? Sometimes they mess it up .. I should remind myself to do so every time I receive a new pwr cable from Ali… It (reversed polarity) happened befo…


Hot and Neutral was reversed?


----------



## PLGA

OCC7N said:


> Have anybody bought good knock off ACSS cables from aliexpress?


I bought a hand made 2m ACSS cable from an Aliexpress seller. I like it very much, in fact it's the one I'm using now, but it's not a knock off. 

I would love to find a fake Nordost ACSS cable on Aliexpress.


----------



## szore

I just bought a digital voltmeter off Amazon to test the cables...TBC...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> OCC7N said:
> 
> 
> > Hot and Neutral was reversed?
> ...


----------



## ZivkoF

dougms3 said:


> Welcome to the club!


Great thread - I have found the same findings for those cables as you guys and I'm very excited. So I have bunch of them. 

4 x 1.5m Odin 2 Gold power cord
4 x 1.5m Odin 2 power cord
6 x 0.5m Odin 2 Gold XLR cable
1 x 1.0m Odin 2 Gold XLR cable
1 x 1.0m Odin 2 coax cable
1 x 0.75m Odin 2 USB cable


----------



## cdacosta

As a habit, any new cable I get aside Ethernet, I test for proper wiring and continuity before installing.  Just to make sure gear does not get damaged from faulty wiring.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Hot and Neutral was reversed?


Yep


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 28, 2022)

Found this beautiful 10 AWG cable today... Might give it a try...











Item#  2255800150682782


Mo' cables





3256803208092240  on sale now

But,  finally decided to purchase YARBO SP-2200PW ...  This one should be pretty close to "pure silver"...


----------



## DecentLevi (Sep 28, 2022)

Just plugged this sugar daddy in between my Gold Odin and tube amp - INSTANT SATISFACTION!!! It's just the sound I hoped it could be and more. My system is so resolving now that in fact I didn't even suppose things could have sounded so damn aplomb, like I've just stepped into a very top system at Can Jam! Especially since I already have a Furman IT REF-15i power conditioner (worth $3K) powering my system. I dunno how clean power can make such a huge difference, but this thing is just flawless on my system at least. There's a few other places it could serve in my system, but I'm thrilled with the placement after the Gold Odin cable, like it's a natural extension. Whipped those dynamics into shape, polished the treble and fleshed out the mids somewhat.

Seller was Moonsaudio Store, $85 for 30cm length.



_Furman Flux-50 knockoff_
I was lazy to take a photo but the item photo is precisely what I received.


----------



## OCC7N

DecentLevi said:


> Just plugged this sugar daddy in between my Gold Odin and tube amp - INSTANT SATISFACTION!!! It's just the sound I hoped it could be and more. My system is so resolving now that in fact I didn't even suppose things could have sounded so damn aplomb, like I've just stepped into a very top system at Can Jam! Especially since I already have a Furman IT REF-15i power conditioner (worth $3K) powering my system. I dunno how clean power can make such a huge difference, but this thing is just flawless on my system at least. There's a few other places it could serve in my system, but I'm thrilled with the placement after the Gold Odin cable, like it's a natural extension. Whipped those dynamics into shape, polished the treble and fleshed out the mids somewhat.
> 
> Seller was Moonsaudio Store, $85 for 30cm length.
> 
> ...


When you also confirm this and I have the authentic version. Yes it insane how it sounds!!!

I have never heard my AryaV2 like that. It goes deeper than the SE/TT2.

(I cant wait to test matrix spdif 2 with a good optical cable.)


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Found this beautiful 10 AWG cable today... Might give it a try...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wow thats a thick as cable! Price?
SP-1100PW-OCC
https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/cabl...lded-power-cable-occ-553mm-o165mm-p-6456.html
This one


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Wow thats a thick as cable! Price?
> SP-1100PW-OCC
> https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/cabl...lded-power-cable-occ-553mm-o165mm-p-6456.html
> This one


Yes that's SP-1100 PW (They  say it's  rigid as the AQ Dragon fake) but I ordered  SP-2200PW (Flat  silver plated)  item# 3256804146454296


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes that's SP-1100 PW (They  say it's  rigid as the AQ Dragon fake) but I ordered  SP-2200PW (Flat  silver plated)  item# 3256804146454296


I have these cables maybe you can help me find something that is a level better. Only priority really good copper rather than silverplated. I wanna try something different. UP-OCC 7N possible?

my cable:
http://www.jenving.com/products/view/eff-ixlr-audio-1001906419

I am not disspointed but I like having other cables to A/B test for my own learning/training.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Sep 28, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> I have these cables maybe you can help me find something that is a level better. Only priority really good copper rather than silverplated. I wanna try something different. UP-OCC 7N possible?
> 
> my cable:
> http://www.jenving.com/products/view/eff-ixlr-audio-1001906419
> ...


The best XLR  I've tried would be that Triple crown XLR then comes fake WEL Signature item # 2251801654779006 . IDK  any good pure copper XLRs... IMHO  pure silver beats them all.... If you are ok  with $700+  price  tag check this one  https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...XLR-Interconnects/p/18299861/category=2595836


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> The best XLR  I've tried would be that Triple crown XLR then comes fake WEL Signature item # 2251801654779006 . IDK  any good pure copper XLRs... IMHO  pure silver beats them all.... If you are ok  with $700+  price  tag check this one  https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...XLR-Interconnects/p/18299861/category=2595836


https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...XLR-Interconnects/p/22232352/category=2595836

This cable is mixed?

Really really nice cables, I hope to buy them from a european store


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...XLR-Interconnects/p/22232352/category=2595836
> 
> This cable is mixed?
> 
> Really really nice cables, I hope to buy them from a european store


The statement IDK...  I would go for the signature, but again I prefer silver...


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> The statement IDK...  I would go for the signature, but again I prefer silver...


Well I totally forgot about Gotham cables. I think I might start soldering my own.

I have about 8meters. I should try it....

but meanwhile this cable looks great:
https://zavfinousa.com/products/arcadia-pc-occ-interconnect-cable?variant=40076574359604

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/cabl...-cable-xlr-xlr-pc-occ-copper-15m-p-15195.html


----------



## szore

I'm really at a loss with this power conditioner (bic500) and my AresII dac...when I plug the dac in with standard power cable it works, when I use one of the Odin2 cables it blows the fuse on the bic500...I ordered a voltmeter off Amazon, it should be delivered today, but I'm not exactly sure what I am checking for... When I listen to the DAC with normal cord plugged into the bic500 it does not sound as good as the Odin2 plugged into the wall/ So right now I'm using a $750 power conditioner for my $400 amp.... I've emailed Alvin a few times and latley he is not responding....getting pissed. I have not tried the odin gold, tho, I guess I'll try that tonight. I have 4 fuses left....


----------



## Rolox

szore said:


> I'm really at a loss with this power conditioner (bic500) and my AresII dac...when I plug the dac in with standard power cable it works, when I use one of the Odin2 cables it blows the fuse on the bic500...I ordered a voltmeter off Amazon, it should be delivered today, but I'm not exactly sure what I am checking for... When I listen to the DAC with normal cord plugged into the bic500 it does not sound as good as the Odin2 plugged into the wall/ So right now I'm using a $750 power conditioner for my $400 amp.... I've emailed Alvin a few times and latley he is not responding....getting pissed. I have not tried the odin gold, tho, I guess I'll try that tonight. I have 4 fuses left....


I don’t know… it’s weird. Could it be that the Odin cables have so little resistance that the inrush current blows the fuse? Seems doubtful but, if the cables were faulty, they would blow ALL fuses!


----------



## szore

Rolox said:


> I don’t know… it’s weird. Could it be that the Odin cables have so little resistance that the inrush current blows the fuse? Seems doubtful but, if the cables were faulty, they would blow ALL fuses!


Yes thats what I thought...current spike.


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


> Yes thats what I thought...current spike.


Now Im getting nervous of how low the resistant should be for a interconnect XLR. My cable spec is:

Resistance: 38 Ohms/km (yes, per km!)
Capacitance: 77 pF/meter
Nominal impedance: 75 Ohms @ 1 Mhz
Propagation velocity: 0.66c (the 66% of the speed of light
How should the ohms be in XLR interconnects?


----------



## szore

Well, I just got home and as a lark, tried the Odin2 GOLD power cable I have (the one I spent $230 on!) into the AresII and it worked! The fuse on the power conditioner didn't blow... great so I put back in the audiophile fuse and its fine. But now with the Gold on the DAC, and the DAC plugged into the PC, the whole upper end seems transformed. Got that slightly euphonic glow, and the microdetails and contrast in the cymbal crashes are really great. Sounds different I'm still processing it. Much greater impact and dynamics and a tighter low end...

Allso I noticed the Odin2 USB cable is on sale for $25, its a good buy normaly its like $50 And thats for a 1.5M.

3256801728006550


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


> Well, I just got home and as a lark, tried the Odin2 GOLD power cable I have (the one I spent $230 on!) into the AresII and it worked! The fuse on the power conditioner didn't blow... great so I put back in the audiophile fuse and its fine. But now with the Gold on the DAC, and the DAC plugged into the PC, the whole upper end seems transformed. Got that slightly euphonic glow, and the microdetails and contrast in the cymbal crashes are really great. Sounds different I'm still processing it. Much greater impact and dynamics and a tighter low end...
> 
> Allso I noticed the Odin2 USB cable is on sale for $25, its a good buy normaly its like $50 And thats for a 1.5M.
> 
> 3256801728006550


Ok I am a little confused are you talking about two Odin2 cable. Gold and no Gold cable?


----------



## szore

OCC7N said:


> Ok I am a little confused are you talking about two Odin2 cable. Gold and no Gold cable?


I have 3 Silver and 1 Gold. 1 silver on PC (source) 1 on amp, 1 on power conditioner and the gold on the dac


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


> I have 3 Silver and 1 Gold. 1 silver on PC (source) 1 on amp, 1 on power conditioner and the gold on the dac


But did you do any troubleshoot on the cable you think that is defect?


----------



## szore

OCC7N said:


> But did you do any troubleshoot on the cable you think that is defect?


I got a digital volt meter today, but I havent yet I'm drinking beer ATM and listening to music...tomorrow I get a polarity checker for the outlets too...but I have not looked at it yet. The silver works on the PC and the amp, so I dont know why it would blow the fuse, unless the gold has more resistance and less of a current spike? That was my initial hunch when I tried it, any way...


----------



## Rolox

DecentLevi said:


> Just plugged this sugar daddy in between my Gold Odin and tube amp - INSTANT SATISFACTION!!! It's just the sound I hoped it could be and more. My system is so resolving now that in fact I didn't even suppose things could have sounded so damn aplomb, like I've just stepped into a very top system at Can Jam! Especially since I already have a Furman IT REF-15i power conditioner (worth $3K) powering my system. I dunno how clean power can make such a huge difference, but this thing is just flawless on my system at least. There's a few other places it could serve in my system, but I'm thrilled with the placement after the Gold Odin cable, like it's a natural extension. Whipped those dynamics into shape, polished the treble and fleshed out the mids somewhat.
> 
> Seller was Moonsaudio Store, $85 for 30cm length.
> 
> ...


Wow. I'm gonna have to try this. Does that store offer free return facilities?
And, has anyone here tried it into a conventional loudspeaker based system?
I was soooo sure this Chinese copy was just a cosmetic accessory that does absolutely nothing, reading from already two people here that it actually WORKS is mind blowing.


----------



## dougms3

Rolox said:


> Wow. I'm gonna have to try this. Does that store offer free return facilities?
> And, has anyone here tried it into a conventional loudspeaker based system?
> I was soooo sure this Chinese copy was just a cosmetic accessory that does absolutely nothing, reading from already two people here that it actually WORKS is mind blowing.


Thats what I assumed as well but its definitely doing something.  I don't know whats in that thick connector, I'm gonna guess rainbows and unicorn droppings.  

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2rSnokN&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

They have a free return for any reason option.


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> Thats what I assumed as well but its definitely doing something.  I don't know whats in that thick connector, I'm gonna guess rainbows and unicorn droppings.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2rSnokN&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> They have a free return for any reason option.


Anyone in Australia using the Aliexpress Flux 50 ? any wiring differences required for AUD?


----------



## DecentLevi (Sep 29, 2022)

Stax 7 said:


> Anyone in Australia using the Aliexpress Flux 50 ? any wiring differences required for AUD?


These are definitely universal. Mine is actually rated at max 250 volts with 120v here. So as long as your voltage is below that threshold, it's just fine. If you are on earth, the answer is yes. 

I plan on getting one for almost all of my cables, when I can. Also I would advise if you don't like it where you have it the first time, try it elsewhere on your system. My concept is that even though I have a main power conditioner, it is still helping out in the way of multistage filtering AKA individually for each item thereby reducing crosstalk between components.


----------



## DecentLevi

My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today. 
From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.

Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


----------



## OCC7N

DecentLevi said:


> My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today.
> From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.
> 
> Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


I think the battery is “absorbing” noise. Its connected to earth/ground if I remember correctly. Might be more complex, but battery is usually because of less noise/distortion.

Like a DAC with builtin battery


----------



## Stax 7

OCC7N said:


> I think the battery is “absorbing” noise. Its connected to earth/ground if I remember correctly. Might be more complex, but battery is usually because of less noise/distortion.
> 
> Like a DAC with builtin battery


The cable plugs in the unit which should have a battery installed ,it then should can be attached using Velcro to the power cable.When switched on the led lights up and should improve the FR.


----------



## szore

So I ordered a nice 4 wire 7N cable 3.5mm from Hiclass Hifi connector store for $35 and its awesome, I have to believe its as good as PWAudio's $350 cable which looks the same. But when I got the 8 wire silver, there was some static on the left side (problem has since gone away). I wanted an 8 wire 4.4mm version of the 7N cable, so He custom built it for me, and because of the static problem he is only charging me $10 for the 8 wire 7N. I told him the static problem went away, and he is still sending me the cable, he said he was mailing it today (China time).  He showed me a picture of the custom 8 wire, how awesome is this? Just $10 he is charging me because he figures a cable repair would cost around $65. I think that is really great of him, look at this nice 8 wire he made for me!


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today.
> From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.
> 
> Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


I believe it acts as an active noise cancellation and/or grounding device.  You should test it with and without to see if theres any difference.  

Let us know how it goes.


----------



## DecentLevi

Thanks for your input guys. I just bought the Wels cable off of recommendations here, and it didn't come with any instructions. Will get to try it after a delay, around my busy work schedule.


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


> So I ordered a nice 4 wire 7N cable 3.5mm from Hiclass Hifi connector store for $35 and its awesome, I have to believe its as good as PWAudio's $350 cable which looks the same. But when I got the 8 wire silver, there was some static on the left side (problem has since gone away). I wanted an 8 wire 4.4mm version of the 7N cable, so He custom built it for me, and because of the static problem he is only charging me $10 for the 8 wire 7N. I told him the static problem went away, and he is still sending me the cable, he said he was mailing it today (China time).  He showed me a picture of the custom 8 wire, how awesome is this? Just $10 he is charging me because he figures a cable repair would cost around $65. I think that is really great of him, look at this nice 8 wire he made for me!


I wish I could find same in dual 3.5mm to XLR 4 pin. Its really challanging on Ali


----------



## szore

OCC7N said:


> I wish I could find same in dual 3.5mm to XLR 4 pin. Its really challanging on Ali


Message him he will most likley build it for you


----------



## szore

Also these Odin 2s are burning in, the power cords and the gold XLR, and the mids are really becoming so transparent with great clarity and depth. And now that the AresII and the Jotunheim2 is plugged into the bic500, everything is tighter and much more engaging, plus I have the audiophile silver fuses in the bic500 and the dac.... Right now I'm listening to Mozart's 23rd Piano Concerto with Claudio Abbado and Rudolf Serkin, DG. I've been listening to this since the 80's and I always come back to it, the performance is for me, along with Kathleen Battle's Mozart arias, and the Requiem by Karajan, the epitome of Mozart's accesibility. Anyway, the clarity and the tightness and the layered presentation, all hanging with utmost clarity in 3D space. The soundstage is truly vast. I'm using my Szalayi and the 8 wire silver. Desktop sounds amazing, and yet I can still hear there is more clarity to be squeezed out of this...Listening to the piano against the strings is utterly coherent and natural, there is no 'layering' effect between the highs mids and lows, its all coherent and just suspended in the soundstage...The bass too  is just transparent, natural, layered and effortlessly rendered, with tons of layering and space. Nice black background which really enhances the the micro and macro dynamics, really nice... So thankfull to have found this thread!


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today.
> From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.
> 
> Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


The 72v (dc) is an Audioquest design.  I have been experimenting with it for a decade. Concept is the 72v coming from battery pack keeps the cable’s dielectric constant.  It works. Break-in is faster, about 1-2 weeks. The 2.5mm connector coming from cable plugs into the battery pack.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Also these Odin 2s are burning in, the power cords and the gold XLR, and the mids are really becoming so transparent with great clarity and depth. And now that the AresII and the Jotunheim2 is plugged into the bic500, everything is tighter and much more engaging, plus I have the audiophile silver fuses in the bic500 and the dac.... Right now I'm listening to Mozart's 23rd Piano Concerto with Claudio Abbado and Rudolf Serkin, DG. I've been listening to this since the 80's and I always come back to it, the performance is for me, along with Kathleen Battle's Mozart arias, and the Requiem by Karajan, the epitome of Mozart's accesibility. Anyway, the clarity and the tightness and the layered presentation, all hanging with utmost clarity in 3D space. The soundstage is truly vast. I'm using my Szalayi and the 8 wire silver. Desktop sounds amazing, and yet I can still hear there is more clarity to be squeezed out of this...Listening to the piano against the strings is utterly coherent and natural, there is no 'layering' effect between the highs mids and lows, its all coherent and just suspended in the soundstage...The bass too  is just transparent, natural, layered and effortlessly rendered, with tons of layering and space. Nice black background which really enhances the the micro and macro dynamics, really nice... So thankfull to have found this thread!


Glad to hear you've finally sorted out that issue with the fuse.  

Is it just me or the silver cable on the right look thicker than the other two?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Glad to hear you've finally sorted out that issue with the fuse.
> 
> Is it just me or the silver cable on the right look thicker than the other two?


I think that is just camera perspective


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> The 72v (dc) is an Audioquest design.  I have been experimenting with it for a decade. Concept is the 72v coming from battery pack keeps the cable’s dielectric constant.  It works. Break-in is faster, about 1-2 weeks. The 2.5mm connector coming from cable plugs into the battery pack.


Thanks for the input. I tried the Wel cable last night, still too early stages to give any sonic impressions. But after around a half hour, I went and felt the battery pack which is known as DBS, and it was becoming moderately warm. If I had to guess, maybe 130° f so I disconnected the battery pack. My ears are telling me it was better without it, but it could have been identical either way. It may not have made any difference being the placement was before my power conditioner which is also before my gold Odin and the Furman inline power filter. I asked the seller on AliExpress for any instructions, he didn't have any, but seems to tell me to just plug it in, but he also wasn't aware whether or not it should get warm at all. Is heat from it usual or anything to worry about?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Thanks for the input. I tried the Wel cable last night, still too early stages to give any sonic impressions. But after around a half hour, I went and felt the battery pack which is known as DBS, and it was becoming moderately warm. If I had to guess, maybe 130° f so I disconnected the battery pack. My ears are telling me it was better without it, but it could have been identical either way. It may not have made any difference being the placement was before my power conditioner which is also before my gold Odin and the Furman inline power filter. I asked the seller on AliExpress for any instructions, he didn't have any, but seems to tell me to just plug it in, but he also wasn't aware whether or not it should get warm at all. Is heat from it usual or anything to worry about?


The DBS battery pack should not get warm, should be room temp.  There is no power drawn from the batteries.  The positive and negative from the battery pack only stabilize the dielectric.  And the break-in is about 2 weeks.  After two weeks unplug the battery pack and you "should" hear a sonic degradation, if not the implementation is wrong.  

If you feel the battery pack go up in temp to 130 degrees something is wrong.


----------



## Stax 7

cdacosta said:


> The DBS battery pack should not get warm, should be room temp.  There is no power drawn from the batteries.  The positive and negative from the battery pack only stabilize the dielectric.  And the break-in is about 2 weeks.  After two weeks unplug the battery pack and you "should" hear a sonic degradation, if not the implementation is wrong.
> 
> If you feel the battery pack go up in temp to 130 degrees something is wrong.


From memory AudioScience did a review on the original cable found that the battery pack caused more distortion to the cable,which reflects your experience at the moment.


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> I'm ok  with 0.5-0.75 m  (Etherregen --> Streamer) , but I have 10 m item#   2255800651386902   (The router----> Etherregen) .  BTW also  very  nice twisted CAT 8


I have decided this instead:

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/ethe...net-optical-fiber-converter-pair-p-13759.html

+ 3m fibercable(SC)

And short ethernet cables at the end.

So the chain is:
Router(ethernet) -> Baaske MI1005 -> switch -> Ethernet\Fiber -> fiber cable -> Fibe\Ethernet -> PC


----------



## dougms3

Since I have a few power cables to play with I thought I'd cable roll starting with my Denafrips ares II dac.

Gold Odin Knockoff - This cable offers the best resolution, top end accentuation and neutral throughout rest of the frequency range.  

Knockoff Gryphon - This cable is the warmest and bassiest cable.  It adds alot of thick richness and body to the sound.  Not as resolving as the gold odin.

Furutech 314ag II with knockoff fi-50 connectors - This cable sounds fairly neutral - warm, kind of in between the odin and gryphon.  Resolution is on par with the gryphon.  Not as bassy and doesn't have the richness or body of the gryphon.

I settled on the Gryphon cable for the ares ii for now.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 1, 2022)

I had a highly adventurous night experimenting with combinations of the Wel Signature AC cable and Furman Flux-50 inline power filter (knockoffs) from Aliexpress. Adventurous as in educational moreso than amazing. This is all IMO / IME, so YMMV.

To my surprise, it seems the Flux-50 inline power filter is fairly picky on synergy. I got lucky on my first pairing with it at the end of the Odin Gold AC cable going into my tube amp, but for some reason the same cable pairing into my DDC (Audio-GD DI20) didn't bode well seeming too bright. Combined with any cable (both generic and aftermarket alike) into my central power conditioning unit was painfully bright and harsh. Paired with my Wireworld Aurora 7 AC cable into the DDC was a sweet spot, which oddly enough sounded darker paired with this brighter cable than when paired with the Odin Gold, which OTOH did gel well going into my tube amp. I still plan to get at least one more for the DDC.

Wel Signature AC  cable. To me, this thing is built like a tank and solid as they come, but I've yet to be blown away by the sound. Firstly RE my previously mentioned episode with the battery pack overheating, turns out the jack connector wasn't fully inserted, likely causing a temporary short out. Luckily I noticed it within enough time to disconnect it and there's still good life remaining of the battery which I might add seems non-removable. It just needed an extra firm exhertion to properly secure, and now it's not  getting warm, even overnight.

Initially I had the Wels cable connected directly to the power conditioner, which for me seems maybe ideal. Brief comparisons were it may be a bit brighter than both the Wireworld Aurora 7 blue color cable and a generic black IEC cable which I fitted with a logical mixture of industrial quality external ferrite clamps; the Wels cable sounding maybe a touch brighter with possibly(?) smoother treble and (maybe?) a touch more sense of depth than both cables. The Wels cable into my tube amp was good, but the combination of Odin Gold + Flux-50 beat it hands down, injecting more body and 'color' overall, the Wels sounding a bit too transparent or colorless, and not boding well in any case with the Flux-50.

I'm not sure if it's making any improvement; will burn-in full time for 1-2 weeks and do some more comparisons.


----------



## OCC7N

DecentLevi said:


> I had a highly adventurous night experimenting with combinations of the Wel Signature AC cable and Furman Flux-50 inline power filter (knockoffs) from Aliexpress. Adventurous as in educational moreso than amazing. This is all IMO / IME, so YMMV.
> 
> To my surprise, it seems the Flux-50 inline power filter is fairly picky on synergy. I got lucky on my first pairing with it at the end of the Odin Gold AC cable going into my tube amp, but for some reason the same cable pairing into my DDC (Audio-GD DI20) didn't bode well seeming too bright. Combined with any cable (both generic and aftermarket alike) into my central power conditioning unit was painfully bright and harsh. Paired with my Wireworld Aurora 7 AC cable into the DDC was a sweet spot, which oddly enough sounded darker paired with this brighter cable than when paired with the Odin Gold, which OTOH did gel well going into my tube amp. I still plan to get at least one more for the DDC.
> 
> ...


Nice! I actually would never choose to place the Flux50 in the start of the chain(before digital) but rather on the analog part.

Did you try connect the Fux50 directly to your headamp?
-Mine is connected to my H9LE paired with a blue wireworld cable, cant remember the name. connects to iFi Powerstation.

Remember to use supporters to all those heavy cables/connectors


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I had a highly adventurous night experimenting with combinations of the Wel Signature AC cable and Furman Flux-50 inline power filter (knockoffs) from Aliexpress. Adventurous as in educational moreso than amazing. This is all IMO / IME, so YMMV.
> 
> To my surprise, it seems the Flux-50 inline power filter is fairly picky on synergy. I got lucky on my first pairing with it at the end of the Odin Gold AC cable going into my tube amp, but for some reason the same cable pairing into my DDC (Audio-GD DI20) didn't bode well seeming too bright. Combined with any cable (both generic and aftermarket alike) into my central power conditioning unit was painfully bright and harsh. Paired with my Wireworld Aurora 7 AC cable into the DDC was a sweet spot, which oddly enough sounded darker paired with this brighter cable than when paired with the Odin Gold, which OTOH did gel well going into my tube amp. I still plan to get at least one more for the DDC.
> 
> ...


I hate cable rolling but its necessary to find the best synergy between your components.  Then when you get anything new, its creates a mess of trying to find the right synergy again.

The flux 50 is currently on my pc which I may keep there permanently because it seems to have a pretty strong effect there.  Dammit, I regret not buying a couple of them when they were $32.  

I'm sure the battery in the wels cable can be replaced, it probably uses a disc battery.  Did you notice any difference with it plugged in?


----------



## DecentLevi

OCC7N said:


> Nice! I actually would never choose to place the Flux50 in the start of the chain(before digital) but rather on the analog part.
> 
> Did you try connect the Fux50 directly to your headamp?
> -Mine is connected to my H9LE paired with a blue wireworld cable, cant remember the name. connects to iFi Powerstation.
> ...


Yup, that is what I said in my post. It didn't do well in the start of my chain but on the analogue part, after the end of my Gold Odin cable into my tube amp. My plastic staple refill box had come in handy as a cable support, they definitely have some weight when combined.

I just tried the Wels cable again with/without the battery pack in realtime, and noticed absolutely 0 difference. I could revisit later after more burn-in with the cable connected directly to an amp, as it's currently at the beginning of the chain before the power conditioner.


----------



## OCC7N

DecentLevi said:


> Yup, that is what I said in my post. It didn't do well in the start of my chain but on the analogue part, after the end of my Gold Odin cable into my tube amp. My plastic staple refill box had come in handy as a cable support, they definitely have some weight when combined.
> 
> I just tried the Wels cable again with/without the battery pack in realtime, and noticed absolutely 0 difference. I could revisit later after more burn-in with the cable connected directly to an amp, as it's currently at the beginning of the chain before the power conditioner.


Ah sorry, what amp is that?
-Lately I have been interested in tube amp since my chain is cleaning up.

I am a little curious of what will happen if you let the Flux50 sit for 24-48hours on the DI20HE.

When all my setup has burnin for 500hours I will test them all individually like this. Using another computer and record directly into my SSL2+(from Chord TT2)
- I will make a thread and let users decide A/B.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 1, 2022)

@OCC7N  I have a tube headphone+speaker amp from Ultrasonic Studios (link, join thread). It's a one-man show boutique amp builder in Sweden, with a bit of a waiting list. Reputable people in the hobby have reported their amps comparable to Woo Audio WA33, but with a more affordable price. Mine is a unique amp I had him custom design for me that is a hybrid between their Infinity and Odyssey models I call Finyssey, but I actually don't recommend this model, due to potential design flaws relating to the input tube circuit and a background hum. If your headphones are not very sensitive, I would recommend their model Odyssey, otherwise probably go with either Oblivion or Citadel. He's also perfecting a newly designed 300b tube amp, that are garnering rave reviews and wowing even the most seasoned veterans.


----------



## DecentLevi

Refresh the page for a few updates above


----------



## Rick_B (Oct 1, 2022)

The Chinese, and AQ, DBS systems use 6 each, 12 volt batteries like are used in garage door remote controls to get the 72 Volts. They look like sawed off AAAs.
My experience with real AQ Water 1m interconnects and Chinese WEL interconnects is that people say they break in immediately...
Not for me, it took weeks on the Waters, so when I got the WEL's I just let them play in a noncritical position for a couple of months...


----------



## DecentLevi

Rick_B said:


> The Chinese, and AQ, DBS systems use 6 each, 12 volt batteries like are used in garage door remote controls to get the 72 Volts. They look like sawed off AAAs.
> My experience with real AQ Water 1m interconnects and Chinese WEL interconnects is that people say they break in immediately...
> Not for me, it took weeks on the Waters, so when I got the WEL's I just let them play in a noncritical position for a couple of months...


Cool, did you also get knockoff Wel's like mine in this link? Did you also find it a bit bright at first, and not noticed any difference from the DBS? And how did it change after burn in? Thanks


----------



## Rick_B

DecentLevi said:


> Cool, did you also get knockoff Wel's like mine in this link? Did you also find it a bit bright at first, and not noticed any difference from the DBS? And how did it change after burn in? Thanks


I don't have the Chinese WEL power cord, just the single ended RCA interconnects...plus a lot of other Chinese interconnects including an Odin 2 silver...and several different flavors of power cords...I've been buying these different things from AliExpress for over 3 years now, I've just not publicized the fact...

I do have one of the 15 core "Valhalla" power cords, but right now it's plugged into a Hagerman FryCorder burn in box where I will leave it for a couple of weeks, maybe, before replacing the 12TC type power cord now on my Audible Illusions preamp.

I also have a bunch of the Finite Element clone/style footers with the optional ceramic balls


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Yup, that is what I said in my post. It didn't do well in the start of my chain but on the analogue part, after the end of my Gold Odin cable into my tube amp. My plastic staple refill box had come in handy as a cable support, they definitely have some weight when combined.
> 
> I just tried the Wels cable again with/without the battery pack in realtime, and noticed absolutely 0 difference. I could revisit later after more burn-in with the cable connected directly to an amp, as it's currently at the beginning of the chain before the power conditioner.


IME with real Audioquest or with DBS system properly implemented, it works well.  Does take about 2 weeks of the DBS system in place.  The batteries are replaceable and are inexpensive 12v N cells.


----------



## DecentLevi

Hi again folks - now I want to try fuse rolling for my amp! 

Is this the most recommended type, or any other suggestions (affordably)?
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832677112249.html 
(can try copy and paste URL or search item number if not opening)

I need 3 types:
- Mains: 5x20mm 3.15A, slow blow
- 5x20mm 100mA, slow blow
- 6.35mm 500V 350mA, slow blow _(these 2 are for transformer power supplies)_

It looks like he has 3 types. Not sure if this is the best type or which he has for the above sizes





Silver Alloy fuse





Black & Red Nano Fuses made of single crystal copper alloy + single crystal silver wire and are directional


----------



## kr0gg

Has anyone tried Odin ethernet RJ45 cables?


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Hi again folks - now I want to try fuse rolling for my amp!
> 
> Is this the most recommended type, or any other suggestions (affordably)?
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832677112249.html
> ...


I read somewhere they were not directional, should I check my fuses?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I read somewhere they were not directional, should I check my fuses?


Its best to try listening both ways just in case.


----------



## dougms3

kr0gg said:


> Has anyone tried Odin ethernet RJ45 cables?


I have it and it works well.  I also tested this cable for comparison and its not as good as the odin.

AMPCOM S/FTP CAT8 Ethernet Cable, High Speed 24AWG Patch Cable ​
If you're swapping out from a cheap included in the box ethernet cable, it should make a significant improvement.  For me it improved streaming audio quality.  Streaming video also, youtube and netflix look slightly better after I swapped in the odin ethernet.


----------



## OCC7N

DecentLevi said:


> Hi again folks - now I want to try fuse rolling for my amp!
> 
> Is this the most recommended type, or any other suggestions (affordably)?
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832677112249.html
> ...


I was planning on these:
https://www.synergisticresearch.com/fuses/purple-fuse/

Expensive stuff


----------



## DecentLevi

szore said:


> I read somewhere they were not directional, should I check my fuses?


Nope fuses are not directional, but it seems to be a special design from that mentioned seller.


OCC7N said:


> I was planning on these:
> https://www.synergisticresearch.com/fuses/purple-fuse/
> 
> Expensive stuff


Ironically that's the same stuff recommended to me! But I'd much rather see what can be had for like $5 before I spend hundreds, just in case they can do anything good.

Thus being said, anyone else here have recommendations on affordable hi-fi fuses?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Nope fuses are not directional, but it seems to be a special design from that mentioned seller.
> 
> Ironically that's the same stuff recommended to me! But I'd much rather see what can be had for like $5 before I spend hundreds, just in case they can do anything good.
> 
> Thus being said, anyone else here have recommendations on affordable hi-fi fuses?


This is the fuse I bought to compare to the Telos audio fuse that I put in my ares ii.

This aliexpress fuse sounds better.  

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2s0JQ8f&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## cdacosta

kr0gg said:


> Has anyone tried Odin ethernet RJ45 cables?


Yes. I have a 1m from router/modem to PC. I like it, was an obvious improvement over the Cat 5e Gigabyte that was being used.


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> This is the fuse I bought to compare to the Telos audio fuse that I put in my ares ii.
> 
> This aliexpress fuse sounds better.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255800301936159.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.3d4f1802s0JQ8f&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_





cdacosta said:


> Yes. I have a 1m from router/modem to PC. I like it, was an obvious improvement over the Cat 5e Gigabyte that was being used.


I use the Telos fuse can you advise where the Aliexpress fuse is better?


----------



## dougms3

Stax 7 said:


> I use the Telos fuse can you advise where the Aliexpress fuse is better?


I only remember that it was more resolving and better clarity in the top end.  Might be other stuff that was affected but I didn't pay attention since the resolution was enough for me.


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> I only remember that it was more resolving and better clarity in the top end.  Might be other stuff that was affected but I didn't pay attention since the resolution was enough for me.


Sounds like good bang for buck.


----------



## FredA (Oct 3, 2022)

I decided to get one of those flux-50 knock-offs to use on my usbridge sig streamer. The reasoning is simple. I have both my master clock and streamer plugged to the same outlet of a fancy zerozone isolation transformer. This unit has partly independent filters before each of the two outlets, but nothing prevents the streamer from contaminating the clock, being on the same one, beside the cords and respective psus... So i hope the flux 50 will help... Who knows...


----------



## DecentLevi

FredA said:


> I decided to get one of those flux-50 knock-offs to use one my usbridge sig streamer. The reasoning is simple. I have both my master clock and streamer plugged to the same outlet of a fancy zerozone isolation transformer. This unit has partly independent filters before each of the two outlets, but nothing prevents the streamer from contaminating the clock, being on the same one, beside the cords and respective psus... So i hope the flux 50 will help... Who knows...


It's cool to see you here Fred! Well, the Flux-50 can sometimes work where you least expect it so try it in a few spots. I like mine before my tube amp and also before the DI-20 (both only when combined with specific AC cables).


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> Hi again folks - now I want to try fuse rolling for my amp!
> 
> Is this the most recommended type, or any other suggestions (affordably)?
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832677112249.html
> ...


I have tried Aucharm, not this red one though. They make good fuses. I can also recommend the Gustard fuse.


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> It's cool to see you here Fred! Well, the Flux-50 can sometimes work where you least expect it so try it in a few spots. I like mine before my tube amp and also before the DI-20 (both only when combined with specific AC cables).


I figure i can't go wrong with the streamer. When power draw is small and steady, filtering normally works well. I will either use it on the clock or the streamer. Most likely the streamer.

As for other knock-offs, one expensive one is the Dragon cord. But it works so very well on my Audio-gd Master-3.


----------



## FredA (Oct 3, 2022)

Most fuse makers state the fuse will sound better applied from live to neutral according to the arrow. Does not make much sense but they do mention this....


----------



## Geared4me

Hey all, I have been using the knock off Nordost Odin Gold power cables and xlr cables for a couple months now and have been more than satisfied. However, after adding the knock off Furutech Flux-50 in front of my genuine Furutech TP80 and enjoying the difference I am wondering if anybody has tried the knock off Furutech nano flux power cables or speaker cables.


----------



## musicinmymind

I need Odin gold power cable which 4 mtr lenght, I did not find any options. Is there any available for 4 mts?


----------



## OCC7N (Oct 4, 2022)

Any body on this thread, using Furutech e-TP80S NCF?

I was thinking of buying it with a SR Purple fuse and then use my Furutech Flux-50 NCF after it.

I am wondering if it does something close the FLUX-50 cable


----------



## DecentLevi

Geared4me said:


> Hey all, I have been using the knock off Nordost Odin Gold power cables and xlr cables for a couple months now and have been more than satisfied. However, after adding the knock off Furutech Flux-50 in front of my genuine Furutech TP80 and enjoying the difference I am wondering if anybody has tried the knock off Furutech nano flux power cables or speaker cables.


Find an item you like and send a message to the seller on AliExpress for any requests. I got mine from seller Getwire and seems legit.


----------



## Rolox

FredA said:


> Most fuse makers state the fuse will sound better applied from live to neutral according to the arrow. Does not make much sense but they do mention this....


I own a SR Orange fuse - amongst others - and I can definitely attest that fuses are directional and sound VERY different depending on orientation. It sounds crazy but it’s true. The wrong direction with the Orange fuse sounds flat and lifeless.


----------



## szore

Interesting note on the fuse page:

Suggestion:
*●Fuse replacement Note 1: The audio fuse is not selected according to the original current rating of the equipment, but is one level larger than the original (original use 1A, should choose 1.6A).*

Am I use the wrong fuse for the DAC and power conditioner?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Interesting note on the fuse page:
> 
> Suggestion:
> *●Fuse replacement Note 1: The audio fuse is not selected according to the original current rating of the equipment, but is one level larger than the original (original use 1A, should choose 1.6A).*
> ...


Not sure about the power conditioner but the ares ii uses T2A which is 2amp slow blow.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 4, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today.
> From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.
> 
> Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


Yes, like @cdacosta mentioned this battery pack keeps the cable’s dielectric constant... The bettery is  cheap  and could be replaced.  Also, you can get brand new DBS unit on Ali  for like $ 17 (It should never get hot/ that green led is to test the bettery only) ... I own a few Wels now and  really like  it (Not the DBS or appearance, but I've  seen what's  inside) Really good wire for the price ...  I  would say give it about 2 weeks for the burn-in...

I think it's:  Odin2<Wel<AQ Dragon (source/ current)< Siltech  trpl crown


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> I have decided this instead:
> 
> https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/ethe...net-optical-fiber-converter-pair-p-13759.html
> 
> ...


Nice ! I'm not into the fiber yet, but there is a set-up (not cheap at all) available  for my Etherregen as well ...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Rick_B said:


> I don't have the Chinese WEL power cord, just the single ended RCA interconnects...plus a lot of other Chinese interconnects including an Odin 2 silver...and several different flavors of power cords...I've been buying these different things from AliExpress for over 3 years now, I've just not publicized the fact...
> 
> I do have one of the 15 core "Valhalla" power cords, but right now it's plugged into a Hagerman FryCorder burn in box where I will leave it for a couple of weeks, maybe, before replacing the 12TC type power cord now on my Audible Illusions preamp.
> 
> I also have a bunch of the Finite Element clone/style footers with the optional ceramic balls


Is this Hagerman FryCorder burn in box really worth it ? Is it good ? /  your experience using this box compared to the "traditional burn-in" process ? 
Thanks


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> Nice ! I'm not into the fiber yet, but there is a set-up (not cheap at all) available  for my Etherregen as well ...


Yeah I always confuse that(Uptone) with Sonore. Are they same company?

They were actually what triggered my cheap attempt


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> Hi again folks - now I want to try fuse rolling for my amp!
> 
> Is this the most recommended type, or any other suggestions (affordably)?
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832677112249.html
> ...


I like  the red ( for the price) Also  they have this  Blue/ mineral oil fuse (around $80) , but The Synergistic research purple fuse ($200) beats  them all...  
BTW,  SR  purples should be on sale (Buy 2 get 1 free)  in December again...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> I figure i can't go wrong with the streamer. When power draw is small and steady, filtering normally works well. I will either use it on the clock or the streamer. Most likely the streamer.
> 
> As for other knock-offs, one expensive one is the Dragon cord. But it works so very well on my Audio-gd Master-3.


Agree... The Dragon (source/current) is the best AC cable (price wise) I was able to find on Ali...


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> I like  the red ( for the price) Also  they have this  Blue/ mineral oil fuse (around $80) , but The Synergistic research purple fuse ($200) beats  them all...
> BTW,  SR  purples should be on sale (Buy 2 get 1 free)  in December again...


Actually whole month of October.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Yeah I always confuse that(Uptone) with Sonore. Are they same company?
> 
> They were actually what triggered my cheap attempt


I have not tried the Sonore, but IMHO Etherregen with a clock is  the best...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

szore said:


> Actually whole month of October.


VH  Audio is so late on the promo ...  Thanks !


----------



## Crypt Keeper

This  Dragon XLR looks  tempting ... But I already have the triple crown   





Item #   3256804341511177


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have not tried the Sonore, but IMHO Etherregen with a clock is  the best...


I saw the clock crystal. How low is the ppb?

I ordered the spdif2 which should have a better clock.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> I saw the clock crystal. How low is the ppb?
> 
> I ordered the spdif2 which should have a better clock.


I'm  using Cybershaft clock  that gets to:  below 3.0E-13 (0.00030ppb/s) /  -119.6 dBc @ 1Hz  in just 72 Hrs ...


----------



## FredA

Crypt Keeper said:


> Agree... The Dragon (source/current) is the best AC cable (price wise) I was able to find on Ali...


You have a Triple Crown power cord? It is over 700 usd. What do you use it on?


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> I'm  using Cybershaft clock  that gets to:  below 3.0E-13 (0.00030ppb/s) /  -119.6 dBc @ 1Hz  in just 72 Hrs ...


Wow thats impressive. Is that a master clock?


----------



## OCC7N

Crypt Keeper said:


> I'm  using Cybershaft clock  that gets to:  below 3.0E-13 (0.00030ppb/s) /  -119.6 dBc @ 1Hz  in just 72 Hrs ...


master clock means like. You can bypass the clock on that Etherregen and use the Cybershaft instead?

I am very new to clock.


----------



## FredA (Oct 5, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> master clock means like. You can bypass the clock on that Etherregen and use the Cybershaft instead?
> 
> I am very new to clock.


Yes. Different clock signal with different frequency may be required inside the device. The device is able to derive them from the connected master clock signal. If all chained devices are fed by the same clock, you can say they are synched. Phase noise of low frequency gets also drastically reduced. All to the benefit of sound quality.


----------



## OCC7N

FredA said:


> Yes. Different clock signal with different frequency may by required inside the device. The device is able to derive them from the connected master clock signal. If all chained devices are fed by the same clock, you can say they are synched. Phase noise of low frequency gets also drastically reduced. All to the benefit of sound quality.


Ok thanks🙌🙌🙌

Those cybershaft looks serious. I want it😍

…If my Chord TT2 could do this I would buy a master clock.


----------



## szore

Ordered a Schiit Lokius EQ. Then ordered a second set of Odin gold XLR for....20 bucks!


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> You have a Triple Crown power cord? It is over 700 usd. What do you use it on?


Yes, this cord is expensive, but I was able to make a deal with the vendor (Cheap shop store) and get 15% off /no tax … I also purchased my triple crown speaker cables & XLRs from this guy. This power cable would be an upgrade for any device: Amp, Preamp, DAC or DDC. That’s why I want / need more of these Siltech triple crown pwr cables. I own both Dragons, but for me this one beats them all …

I really like silver and both Siltechs (Speaker cables & XLRs) have this very nice 12 AWG silver alloy wire inside. They say - it’s silver/GOLD alloy but I think, we need a lab test to confirm that...

I haven’t opened the power cord yet, but I think it has the same wire they used for XLR/speaker cable clones.



Siltech triple Crown clone XLR Inside:


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Wow thats impressive. Is that a master clock?


Yes !


----------



## Crypt Keeper

OCC7N said:


> Ok thanks🙌🙌🙌
> 
> Those cybershaft looks serious. I want it😍
> 
> …If my Chord TT2 could do this I would buy a master clock.


Yes, good master clock + heavy grounding box +Isolation transformer = Magic…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Is this Hagerman FryCorder burn in box really worth it ? Is it good ? /  your experience using this box compared to the "traditional burn-in" process ?
> Thanks


I have a Hagerman Frycleaner. Have used one and a Audioharma for years.  Hagerman works well but has limitations on the cables that can be hooked up to it. The one I have can only burn in line level cables.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I have a Hagerman Frycleaner. Have used one and a Audioharma for years.  Hagerman works well but has limitations on the cables that can be hooked up to it. The one I have can only burn in line level cables.


Thanks !
Yes, I have looked into the  Audioharma,  awesome device but not  cheap at all


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Thanks !
> Yes, I have looked into the  Audioharma,  awesome device but not  cheap at all


Not cheap but works.  So does Hagerman but again only useful for line level cables.  Hagerman will allow the cable to perform better than just burning in on a system.  I have burned in at least 50 cables on my Hagerman.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 5, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Not cheap but works.  So does Hagerman but again only useful for line level cables.  Hagerman will allow the cable to perform better than just burning in on a system.  I have burned in at least 50 cables on my Hagerman.


Just placed my order for FryCorder2 - Power Cord Burn-In Generator ... Damn addiction    
"Empirical testing has led to the conclusion that most wiring achieves break-in after two or three days of continuous burn. Silver conductors seem to take twice as long as copper."​Nice !


----------



## musicinmymind

Zaek said:


> This came in today.. (First impression) was insanely good even without burn-in. Let's wait for 500hrs n see how it performs



Which seller, looks beautiful. Can you pls give me link


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Very nice indeed…
I think I can burn-in my master clock cables with this device !


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Very nice indeed…
> I think I can burn-in my master clock cables with this device !


Yep, I put together a lot of adapters.  I use to burn in several pairs of cables and devices at a time.  Works well for this.


----------



## Zaek

musicinmymind said:


> Which seller, looks beautiful. Can you pls give me link


I got it from the seller - Getwire

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100...5b16650181874912235e9efe!12000030048912851!sh


----------



## DenverW

If anyone knows of an aliexpress headphone cable that would come close to matching (for audeze connectors):


112 Strands Pure Silver 7N Litz
133 Strands 7N 2K copper

Let me know!  I'm finding a lot of occ copper with "silver shielding" but I doubt that's what I'm looking for...


----------



## FredA

Too bad no fancy knock-off 50-ohm clock cables are offered on ali... I asked a seller and no luck...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> Too bad no fancy knock-off 50-ohm clock cables are offered on ali... I asked a seller and no luck...


They have some pure silver, Nordost and Siltech clones but all 75 Ohm… I was not able to find any 50 Ohm clock cables besides that Gustard C2 on Ali...


----------



## musicinmymind

Zaek said:


> I got it from the seller - Getwire
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004670855512.html?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_allProduct.8148356.9.20935543MDE2zj&pdp_npi=2@dis!SGD!SG$ 67.59!SG$ 54.07!!!!!@2103255b16650181874912235e9efe!12000030048912851!sh



Any comparison with sliver color, they sound same or different. I like gold color better


----------



## Zaek

musicinmymind said:


> Any comparison with sliver color, they sound same or different. I like gold color better


no clue. I only have the gold version


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 6, 2022)

I have replaced the receptacles on my Isolation transformer with Monos audio rhodium plated… I have not replaced the wiring inside or AC cable yet… That would be my next project once all Ali cables delivered....

Used the Nano liquid for the first time on all connectors (except GND) I replaced today 





Monosaudio Pure Copper Power Wall Mount,20A 125V Audio Outlet Hi End Duplex Receptacle (Rhodium Plated Without Fixing Bracket)


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have replaced the receptacles on my Isolation transformer with Monos audio rhodium plated… I have not replaced the wiring inside or AC cable yet… That would be my next project once all Ali cables delivered....
> 
> Used the Nano liquid for the first time on all connectors (except GND) I replaced today
> 
> ...


The duplex will take some time to break-in. The Nano Liquid about 72-100 hours to break-in.  Have you tried the Nano Liquid any where else in your system?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 7, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> The duplex will take some time to break-in. The Nano Liquid about 72-100 hours to break-in.  Have you tried the Nano Liquid any where else in your system?


Not yet.. Can’t wait to do this ! but just don’t want to waste this precious liquid. (I plan to redo my main outlet and move some of my gears ) been waiting for 3+ weeks for all components to arrive .. Now it seems that the shipper didn’t provide a "commercial invoice"  with the shipment and my package got delayed by Customs… Yes, sometimes they do that …

Thank you for clear guidelines on the Nano !


----------



## LocalMotion (Oct 7, 2022)

Decided to try the Odin2 XLR’s, so far so good. Letting them play in for 100 or so hours before I compare. But plan on getting another pair and some power cords if all goes well.




I had been using these 8N OCC Silver plated RCA’s from eBay with great success but since I’ve upgraded some thing I can use XLR now. The RCA connectors on this look exactly like the *Shunyata* Venom RCA connectors.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> Decided to try the Odin2 XLR’s, so far so good. Letting them play in for 100 or so hours before I compare. But plan on getting another pair and some power cords if all goes well.
> 
> 
> I had been using these 8N OCC Silver plated RCA’s from eBay with great success but since I’ve upgraded some thing I can use XLR now.


Once this Odin 2 bettered my Original Audioquest $750+ Water XLRS , I Realized AQ = PS Audio


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Not yet.. Can’t wait to do this ! but just don’t want to waste this precious liquid. (I plan to redo my main outlet and move some of my gears ) been waiting for 3+ weeks for all components to arrive .. Now it seems that the shipper didn’t provide a "commercial invoice"  with the shipment and my package got delayed by Customs… Yes, sometimes they do that …
> 
> Thank you for clear guidelines on the Nano !


My pleasure!


----------



## George Hincapie

Gazza said:


> My Odin XLR knock-offs just arrived. I've hooked them up between my STAX amp and La Scala DAC and first impressions, baring in mind the cable is fresh and that I've never listened to this combo and the STAX have sat unused for about 6 months, it's...good? Great actually. Build quality is superb. Sound is crystal clear with gobs of detail. Have no idea how it compares to other cables as it's the only XLR I have on hand but so far I can't complain. Everything needs running in so let's see if it improves.


Do you have a link please?


----------



## szore

George Hincapie said:


> Do you have a link please?


is that the Odin gold xlr?


----------



## George Hincapie

szore said:


> is that the Odin gold xlr?


Yes please. I need RCA too though. And AES.


----------



## szore

George Hincapie said:


> Yes please. I need RCA too though. And AES.


3256804207079632


----------



## LocalMotion (Oct 11, 2022)

Decided to try a full loom of the Odin2 cables 😄

Gotta give props to Sound Labs store. I ordered 5 days before their “holiday” and they never shipped. Messaged them, they said on holiday. I said I ordered week before holiday. They ended up shipped via FedEx for free. Got the cables 3 days after shipped.


----------



## szore

LocalMotion said:


> Decided to try a full loom of the Odin2 cables 😄
> 
> Gotta give props to Sound Labs store. I ordered 5 days before their “holiday” and they never shipped. Messaged them, they said on holiday. I said I ordered week before holiday. They ended up shipped via FedEx for free. Got the cables 3 days after shipped.


You're gonna fit right in around here!


----------



## Stax 7

Dont think I have ever seen that much HI-FI cable in one bundle lol


----------



## George Hincapie

LocalMotion said:


> Decided to try a full loom of the Odin2 cables 😄
> 
> Gotta give props to Sound Labs store. I ordered 5 days before their “holiday” and they never shipped. Messaged them, they said on holiday. I said I ordered week before holiday. They ended up shipped via FedEx for free. Got the cables 3 days after shipped.


Looking forward to your impressions.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Received mo’ cables.
My new Wel 1.8 M has Reversed polarity


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Received mo’ cables.
> My new Wel 1.8 M has Reversed polarity


Yah, I check all cables for proper wiring before insertion into system. No matter the brand or cost of cable.  I never assume anything.


----------



## DecentLevi

Crypt Keeper said:


> Received mo’ cables.
> My new Wel 1.8 M has Reversed polarity


What difference (supposedly) does reversed polarity make in AC cables? 
And mind to mention which seller you got your Wels from?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> What difference (supposedly) does reversed polarity make in AC cables?
> And mind to mention which seller you got your Wels from?


Reversed polarity may damage your gears... and IMHO simply not good at all … I got this Wel from Vipeos Hi-fi store. Now he owes me a partial refund, I bought a lot of cables from him… Have no idea why no QC this time , the other Wel I have was fine…


----------



## ejk1

DecentLevi said:


> What difference (supposedly) does reversed polarity make in AC cables?
> And mind to mention which seller you got your Wels from?





Crypt Keeper said:


> Reversed polarity may damage your gears... and IMHO simply not good at all … I got this Wel from Vipeos Hi-fi store. Now he owes me a partial refund, I bought a lot of cables from him… Have no idea why no QC this time , the other Wel I have was fine…




No danger

Reversing "polarity" * (swapping the hot and grounded/neutral wires) presents* no danger* to the equipment on an AC circuit. In terms of electrical properties, the conductors are the same. The current switches direction 50 or 60 times each second, and the equipment simply cannot tell the difference between the two conductors.

WEB SEARCH


----------



## DecentLevi

Well that's interesting to see both sides of the story. It was a valid question, seeing how some of my stereos have no polarity on the power which is reversible. But to be sure I did test the polarity with my Wels cable initially, and it was correct. Just as long as they don't connect the hot signal to the ground pin, LOL


----------



## dougms3

@Crypt Keeper 

Any update on that Yarbo cable?

Did you get around to building it yet?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> @Crypt Keeper
> 
> Any update on that Yarbo cable?
> 
> Did you get around to building it yet?


Unfortunately no updates so far on the YARBO SP-2200PW … I guess I should receive it next week… I’m moving some of my gears upgrading outlets, cables, plugs and “cooking” a few with Frycorder2 ATM … No serious listening for me for 2-3 weeks now…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

BTW, Amazon is cheaper than Ali ATM on these excellent quality plugs….






https://a.co/d/5H1QfN6


----------



## FredA (Oct 12, 2022)

Fixing a reverse polarity is easy on a WEL.

Decided to try this power cable  on my dac, so yet one more will end up in my cable closet. There must be 50 cables in there.... 

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005002682915056.html


----------



## FredA (Oct 12, 2022)

Deleted.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Fixing a reverse polarity is easy on a WEL.
> 
> Decided to try this power cable  on my dac, so yet one more will end up in my cable closet. There must be 50 cables in there....
> 
> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005002682915056.html


I'm sure theres a printer or monitor that could use some clean power also


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> BTW, Amazon is cheaper than Ali ATM on these excellent quality plugs….
> 
> 
> 
> https://a.co/d/5H1QfN6


Dammit, I bought one.

And these too.

https://www.amazon.com/Monosaudio-R...ctor/dp/B09KTWYK3B?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Stopper-Shie...ated/dp/B083NKQBJ8?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/Speaker-Conn...tor-Degree/dp/B082M45MN5?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 12, 2022)

Easy to fix yeees (unlike the dragon) but again, unless the plug is falling apart …
Explaining reversed polarity to a seller on Ali – serious dilemma


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 12, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Dammit, I bought one.
> 
> And these too.
> 
> ...



Purchased XLR plugs (caps) as  well, Thanks !


----------



## cdacosta

Within last two months or so I have placed approx. 18 separate orders through Aliexpress.  With about 10 in transit currently.  In all cases within the last 2 months, shipping tracking is either useless or non-existent.  Previously tracking worked. Are you guys experiencing the same?


----------



## Rolox

cdacosta said:


> Within last two months or so I have placed approx. 18 separate orders through Aliexpress.  With about 10 in transit currently.  In all cases within the last 2 months, shipping tracking is either useless or non-existent.  Previously tracking worked. Are you guys experiencing the same?


Not having any issue here. Tracking, and very fast delivery!


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Within last two months or so I have placed approx. 18 separate orders through Aliexpress.  With about 10 in transit currently.  In all cases within the last 2 months, shipping tracking is either useless or non-existent.  Previously tracking worked. Are you guys experiencing the same?


Haven't experienced any issues with tracking info.

Tracking info is usually on point.  Once it departs China, sometimes there is no update, until it arrives in the US.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Within last two months or so I have placed approx. 18 separate orders through Aliexpress.  With about 10 in transit currently.  In all cases within the last 2 months, shipping tracking is either useless or non-existent.  Previously tracking worked. Are you guys experiencing the same?


I would say  they are in slow-mo now... Maybe due to the holiday (Oct 1-9) but no  issues with tracking ...  Some of my orders are 1-2 weeks late now...


----------



## LocalMotion

I usually copy the tracking number they provide and manage it outside of the Ali website. Seems more accurate.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 13, 2022)

DHL - 1 week or less (as soon as they ship)

Fedex & UPS  – about 7 days (as soon as they ship)

Aliexpress premium shipping 8-20 days

Aliexpress standard shipping 2-4 weeks

China post  1-2 months …


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I would say  they are in slow-mo now... Maybe due to the holiday (Oct 1-9) but no  issues with tracking ...  Some of my orders are 1-2 weeks late now...


Oh yea, forgot about the holiday.  

Shipping is usually fastest this time of year otherwise.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> DHL - 1 week or less (as soon as they ship)
> 
> Fedex & UPS  – about 7 days (as soon as they ship)
> 
> ...


Hmm, before tracking was good for me. Wonder if where I am/state matters?  Thanks for the info.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Hmm, before tracking was good for me. Wonder if where I am/state matters?  Thanks for the info.


You're welcome.

I think, it should be even less time in transit for West Coast … Were they shipped China Post by any chance ?

Last year I had some items delayed for 3 mo or so… I initiated claims, received refunds (after 60 days of shipping) and then received some of the “lost” items in a month or so…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> You're welcome.
> 
> I think, it should be even less time in transit for West Coast … Were they shipped China Post by any chance ?
> 
> Last year I had some items delayed for 3 mo or so… I initiated claims, received refunds (after 60 days of shipping) and then received some of the “lost” items in a month or so…


I am looking at the orders and frankly I can not tell which carrier was used to ship orders.  Some have a tracking number through Cainiao.  I have no clue who or what is Cainiao aside a tracking service that sucks.  Some provide a USPS tracking number.  Prior to a month ago orders took 2 - 2.5 weeks with a USPS tracking number and was a coin toss if the delivery per USPS was accurate.

I originally posted the question to see if I was just the unlucky one or if there were shipping issues from China.  Because the prices including shipping and tax are so low I always took the stance that it is what it is.


----------



## LocalMotion (Oct 13, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> I am looking at the orders and frankly I can not tell which carrier was used to ship orders.  Some have a tracking number through Cainiao.  I have no clue who or what is Cainiao aside a tracking service that sucks.  Some provide a USPS tracking number.  Prior to a month ago orders took 2 - 2.5 weeks with a USPS tracking number and was a coin toss if the delivery per USPS was accurate.
> 
> I originally posted the question to see if I was just the unlucky one or if there were shipping issues from China.  Because the prices including shipping and tax are so low I always took the stance that it is what it is.


cainiao seems like just a tracking website... I plugged my 'cainiao' tracking number into USPS and it worked. and it should be USPS if it's not Fedex or DHL
i.e. 4203424192612903017222000114374853 linked to cainiao on the Ali website, but works on USPS

But there is a week or so delay since the china holiday... that added to the long "free shipping" times, probably looking at 4-6 weeks


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> cainiao seems like just a tracking website... I plugged my 'cainiao' tracking number into USPS and it worked. and it should be USPS if it's not Fedex or DHL
> i.e. 4203424192612903017222000114374853 linked to cainiao on the Ali website, but works on USPS
> 
> But there is a week or so delay since the china holiday... that added to the long "free shipping" times, probably looking at 4-6 weeks


Ok that is helpful. So basically the usual 2 - 2.5 weeks assume 4 - 6 weeks.  Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 13, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> I am looking at the orders and frankly I can not tell which carrier was used to ship orders.  Some have a tracking number through Cainiao.  I have no clue who or what is Cainiao aside a tracking service that sucks.  Some provide a USPS tracking number.  Prior to a month ago orders took 2 - 2.5 weeks with a USPS tracking number and was a coin toss if the delivery per USPS was accurate.
> 
> I originally posted the question to see if I was just the unlucky one or if there were shipping issues from China.  Because the prices including shipping and tax are so low I always took the stance that it is what it is.


Cainiao = China post…

Cainio's estimated delivery time time is about 20 – 40 days for standard and 30 – 50 days for economy…

https://global.cainiao.com     or  https://parcelsapp.com/en/carriers/china-post

Maybe  they have more tracking updates now ?


----------



## szore

I haven't had any problems with Aliexpress shipping. Everything comes within 14 days.


----------



## dougms3

From my experience, Q4 of the year is when things get delivered the fastest.  Last couple orders I received in 7-8 days.  Rest of the year 3-4 weeks typical.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> From my experience, Q4 of the year is when things get delivered the fastest.  Last couple orders I received in 7-8 days.  Rest of the year 3-4 weeks typical.


The last few doodads I ordered got stuck in us customs for 7 or 8 days...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> The last few doodads I ordered got stuck in us customs for 7 or 8 days...


I hate when that happens.


----------



## szore

So, yeah, incidently, concerning the burn in of the Odin 2, et. al. and my desktop...I am thinking the power conditioner has also broken in some, but the sound is really unbelievable....especially with the Szalayi and 8 wire cables....its like the gear is utterly transparent and the music just hangs inside your head in this transparent soundstage...


----------



## dougms3

So after burning this this Flux-50 knockoff on my pc for a couple weeks, I removed it to see what it does like without it for a few days.

Removing it made it sound like my system had less stage, less bass, less microdetail, less resolving, bass became less impactful.  The difference is very noticeable and brings my system down a few notches after removing it.  The biggest difference is the depth.  It sounds flat without it.  

After a few days I decided to plug it back into my system again before the plc and after my ifi supanova.  The difference is stunning, just massive improvements.  I think I was hearing some grain before because either the cable wasn't burned in or the tracks I tested were not as well recorded as I thought they were.  Its become very revealing of tracks that are not recorded perfectly.  Highlights any errors or inconsistencies in the tracks.

The levels in the bass seems to be biggest increase.  

Dammit, I really regret not getting a couple of these at the discount price.  I'm gonna have to get another one for my pc.


----------



## DecentLevi

I was pretty satisfied with my Flux 50, and I got mine from the Moonsaudio store, item 2251832580085862 and have a second one on the way.


----------



## DecentLevi

Can anyone recommend a good seller for a Odin Gold USB cable that's legit? I have the Odin 2 USB cable. It's substantially better than my previous already good quality one, but it's been coming off it's a little bright. To be fair though it's probably neutral, and the brightness may be attributed to my Wels AC cable, so just trying to counterbalance it a bit.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Cainiao = China post…
> 
> Cainio's estimated delivery time time is about 20 – 40 days for standard and 30 – 50 days for economy…
> 
> ...


No but just received one order in the mail today. No tracking data, not even USPS. Although like the other orders USPS tracking number is provided.  It is cool, I am in no hurry so long as I get what I paid for.  Would be nice if the tracking worked.


----------



## dougms3

New toys.


----------



## dougms3

Dammit I really don't want to buy another flux-50 cable but on my pc it increased the dynamics and added so much punch to the bass.  It looks like I'm going to have to buy it on sheer principle, bah.


----------



## LocalMotion

FYI I just had an excellent experience with the store “Audio Accessary”





I was looking at their “16 core Pure 100% Silver” speaker cables with Viborg bananas. The default listing was with gold bananas but in their store they have rhodium bananas VB401R. I asked if they can build with these instead. They said sure. Then I said I was waiting on the 11/11 sale to buy them. She said no wait I give you discount. She gave me a $60 discount code. Built them in 1 day and is shipping via FedEx as “free shipping” option. Even sent me a pic of the final assembly


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> FYI I just had an excellent experience with the store “Audio Accessary”
> 
> 
> I was looking at their “16 core Pure 100% Silver” speaker cables with Viborg bananas. The default listing was with gold bananas but in their store they have rhodium bananas VB401R. I asked if they can build with these instead. They said sure. Then I said I was waiting on the 11/11 sale to buy them. She said no wait I give you discount. She gave me a $60 discount code. Built them in 1 day and is shipping via FedEx as “free shipping” option. Even sent me a pic of the final assembly


Wait, what 11/11 sale?  What is that, an annual thing on Aliexpress?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Wait, what 11/11 sale?  What is that, an annual thing on Aliexpress?


Yes. the biggest sale of the year…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes. the biggest sale of the year…


So it is a one day sale?  On our (or their) date of 11/11?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> So it is a one day sale?  On our (or their) date of 11/11?


 Yeah, it starts  on or a few days before November 11th... But You can request 11.11  prices from any seller  today ... With the US dollar is the strongest it has been in 20 years, they will be more  than happy to give you the discount !


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 15, 2022)

I mean, check out the price on the R1 ! It was like 100 USD last year …





Or The Alpha 3


----------



## dougms3

So I took off the gold odin connectors and installed the monosaudio connectors and coated with nano liquid.  Was hoping it didn't emit any EMI but the voltage detector is detecting some leak, not as bad as the gold odin connector though.  The knockoff furutech connectors are better, they don't leak any EMI.

Also this is the cheaper version of the odin cable.  I can't remember exactly but I'm pretty sure the other gold odin cable I have had more than one conductor for ground.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> So I took off the gold odin connectors and installed the monosaudio connectors and coated with nano liquid.  Was hoping it didn't emit any EMI but the voltage detector is detecting some leak, not as bad as the gold odin connector though.  The knockoff furutech connectors are better, they don't leak any EMI.
> 
> Also this is the cheaper version of the odin cable.  I can't remember exactly but I'm pretty sure the other gold odin cable I have had more than one conductor for ground.


Probably towards the beginning of the thread I posted a pic of mine. Did have more than one connector for ground. Total AWG per leg looked like to me somewhere between 10ga and 12ga.  Yours look thinner when looking at the provided picture.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Probably towards the beginning of the thread I posted a pic of mine. Did have more than one connector for ground. Total AWG per leg looked like to me somewhere between 10ga and 12ga.  Yours look thinner when looking at the provided picture.


Its hard to tell but the cable itself is definitely slightly thinner than my other gold odin cable.


----------



## musicinmymind

So there are different versions of gold cable, which seller did you buy from.

I have one gold power cable on it's way, I got it from FINDAUDIO Store


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> So there are different versions of gold cable, which seller did you buy from.
> 
> I have one gold power cable on it's way, I got it from FINDAUDIO Store


The thinner one is from Goltech, which I do not recommend buying from, that seller is a douche.  Only reason I swapped out the connectors is because that idiot didn't even bother to finish screwing in the connector, just left the connector with missing screws and left out the wire tensioner.

The thicker odin cables I bought from getwire and timeless.  But its best to confirm with the seller and confirm for yourself.  These cables are not difficult to take apart.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 16, 2022)

*YARBO SP-2200PW Power Cord Cable 10AWG*

The cable arrived … The wire inside seems to be good quality, but this cable needs better shielding (Just 1 layer of thin foil is not enough / Same EMI problem) … I’m going to put 1 extra layer of foil and add some braid sleeving … $50 per 1 M for this cable ? IDK … I think, I should have gotten OYAIDE TUNAMI V2 for this price…



 

 



IMHO, there aren’t any really good cheap power cables available on Ali ATM… If you looking for the best, better pay some extra and get The Dragon or Siltech triple crown…


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> So there are different versions of gold cable, which seller did you buy from.
> 
> I have one gold power cable on it's way, I got it from FINDAUDIO Store


I got mine from audio Accessary in June 2022.


----------



## musicinmymind

Thanks, mine is already on it way, when I get it will remove the connector and check.
Even if I find one connector for ground, I cannot return as I did not question the seller about the thickness, before pressing the button.


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> Thanks, mine is already on it way, when I get it will remove the connector and check.
> Even if I find one connector for ground, I cannot return as I did not question the seller about the thickness, before pressing the button.


I'm not sure but I think it might be 1 conductor for ground on the thicker cable too.  

As crypt keeper mentioned, the way to tell is if it has red, green and black lines in the conductors, that indicates that its the cheaper valhalla knockoff conductors.  They are slightly slimmer than the odin conductors.

Either way, the cables sound good and we're talking marginal differences in performance.  Maybe 5% if I had to quantify it.


----------



## musicinmymind

dougms3 said:


> I'm not sure but I think it might be 1 conductor for ground on the thicker cable too.
> 
> As crypt keeper mentioned, the way to tell is if it has red, green and black lines in the conductors, that indicates that its the cheaper valhalla knockoff conductors.  They are slightly slimmer than the odin conductors.
> 
> Either way, the cables sound good and we're talking marginal differences in performance.  Maybe 5% if I had to quantify it.



Thanks for let me know, I have JPS labs kaptovator lite and Shunyata Research Anaconda to compare with. More than WA33 which i have, Dave is more responsive to power cable change IMO. 

After burning for 400 hrs approx will check with Dave.


----------



## LocalMotion

Crypt Keeper said:


> *YARBO SP-2200PW Power Cord Cable 10AWG*
> 
> The cable arrived … The wire inside seems to be good quality, but this cable needs better shielding (Just 1 layer of thin foil is not enough / Same EMI problem) … I’m going to put 1 extra layer of foil and add some braid sleeving … $50 per 1 M for this cable ? IDK … I think, I should have gotten OYAIDE TUNAMI V2 for this price…
> 
> ...



That does seem excessive cost for 1m for that quality of cable.


----------



## Crypt Keeper




----------



## msing539

I need to change my setup so I'll have an 1M Odin silver USB cable up for sale, if anyone is interested.


----------



## LocalMotion

Thanks to @Crypt Keeper for the suggestion on testing the cables. I had an outlet tester but added a simple adapter from Amazon. 👍🏼


----------



## LocalMotion

Small update on the NearDost loom 

It's been almost 2 weeks and I've been breaking them in almost 24/7. I thought this would be an experiment, and worst case I'm out $100 or so after trying to resell them somewhere. 

My current cables altogether MSRP for over $5000. I honestly can't believe how well these Odins are working out. quite shocked actually. Currently in my system
2x - Odin2 XLR's (DAC to Pre / Pre to solid state amp)
1x - Odin2 RCA (Pre to tube amp)
3x - Odin2 silver power cords. (1 in DAC, 1 in DDC, 1 in solid state amp)

I'll be buying 2 more PC's to replace the one in my Innuos Zen, and then my Preamp

The USB didn't work out. I couldn't get it to sync from Innuos to Hermes DDC (well weird part is it saw my DDC in Innuos, but couldn't get anything to play). No biggie I had a nice Audio Sensibility Statement USB cable, which I'll keep. 

Once I found the 16 core solid silver speaker cables on AE, I just decided to return the Odin2 SC's. So been approved to return/refund the USB & SC's.

Suppose to get the new silver SC's end of week. Until then I have two very nice pairs of cables, Audio Art Statement, and Zenwave SL17.

At the current rate of progress, I'll be selling off some expensive cables and buy more hardware


----------



## szore

LocalMotion said:


> Small update on the NearDost loom
> 
> It's been almost 2 weeks and I've been breaking them in almost 24/7. I thought this would be an experiment, and worst case I'm out $100 or so after trying to resell them somewhere.
> 
> ...


The first Odin2 power cable I bought i put on my PC and I was shocked at the improvement to my system. And that is just source for the dac. When i put Odin 2 on dac and amp each time was a quantum improvement in sound and that was before burn in


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> Small update on the NearDost loom
> 
> It's been almost 2 weeks and I've been breaking them in almost 24/7. I thought this would be an experiment, and worst case I'm out $100 or so after trying to resell them somewhere.
> 
> ...


Funny how that works out isnt it?

That was exactly my experience when comparing even the old odin1 knockoffs froma couple years ago to my wireworld silver eclipse 8 xlrs.  They had been sitting in my closet for years because I never thought they would be comparable to higher end stuff but imagine my surprise when I a-b compared them.  Then found out the odin 2 were even better.

It would have been nice if you could get the odin usb cable to work on your setup, I would have been very interested in how it compares to the silver statement usb.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

I have not tried The statement from AS, but I own AS Signature Silver … It’s well beyond Odin 2 USB.

I would say: Odin2 USB (12 core) < The Outsider (Pure silver) < AS Signature Silver USB

I would suggest: The Outsider = AS statement… and AS Signature Silver = Tubulus Concentus USB


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The first Odin2 power cable I bought i put on my PC and I was shocked at the improvement to my system. And that is just source for the dac. When i put Odin 2 on dac and amp each time was a quantum improvement in sound and that was before burn in


Oh yah, what change did you experience after burn-in?  Was it a big difference or slight or?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Oh yah, what change did you experience after burn-in?  Was it a big difference or slight or?


In a word I would say massive clarification. Yes there were swings, but overall what burn in is bringing is clarification and everything that goes with it (micro/macrodynamics, soundstage, clarity, body and impact)...and most of all, in the end it seems, is clarity to the upper mids, which stayed congested to the end. And when I listen now, as great as it sounds, what more burn in will bring is greater clarity to the upper mids....thats the last frontier. Unless there is other stuff beyond that! (Better microdynamics, perhaps)?  What improvement the raw cables brought BEFORE burn in, when I first put them on was greater impact and extension in the bass, and the treble had greater extension and clarity. NOW after burn in there is excellent transparancy as well.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have not tried The statement from AS, but I own AS Signature Silver … It’s well beyond Odin 2 USB.
> 
> I would say: Odin2 USB (12 core) < The Outsider (Pure silver) < AS Signature Silver USB
> 
> I would suggest: The Outsider = AS statement… and AS Signature Silver = Tubulus Concentus USB


How much better is the AS statement vs the odin usb?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> In a word I would say massive clarification. Yes there were swings, but overall what burn in is bringing is clarification and everything that goes with it (micro/macrodynamics, soundstage, clarity, body and impact)...and most of all, in the end it seems, is clarity to the upper mids, which stayed congested to the end. And when I listen now, as great as it sounds, what more burn in will bring is greater clarity to the upper mids....thats the last frontier. Unless there is other stuff beyond that! (Better microdynamics, perhaps)?  What improvement the raw cables brought BEFORE burn in, when I first put them on was greater impact and extension in the bass, and the treble had greater extension and clarity. NOW after burn in there is excellent transparancy as well.


Cool. I tried to share what my experience was and people are likely to expect but was not easy to do.  And since everyone’s gear is different their experience will likely be different.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> How much better is the AS statement vs the odin usb?


I have not auditioned The statement, but I own Gothic audio the outsider (similar to the statement USB) … The outsider is on par with WIreworld Platinum Starlight 8 USB … Conductors are solid silver and its power line is separated from the signal .. So the outsider is much better than only silver plated Odin2 . For me this cable bettered some much more expensive cables .. Maybe even that $ 600 Wireworld … I have not auditioned the Tubulus Concentus , but I had to purchase expensive AS Signature to beat the outsider… IMHO,  can’t find anything better  at his price point…


----------



## LocalMotion

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have not auditioned The statement, but I own Gothic audio the outsider (similar to the statement USB) … The outsider is on par with WIreworld Platinum Starlight 8 USB … Conductors are solid silver and its power line is separated from the signal .. So the outsider is much better than only silver plated Odin2 . For me this cable bettered some much more expensive cables .. Maybe even that $ 600 Wireworld … I have not auditioned the Tubulus Concentus , but I had to purchase expensive AS Signature to beat the outsider… IMHO,  can’t find anything better  at his price point…



I'm happy with the AS Statement and thought about upgrading to the Signature,  but since I'm going from Innuos to DDC, I thought a decent to good USB cable would be sufficient since the DDC should be cleaning everything up. I emailed Alvin at Vinshine, and he stated the same, said a good quality USB should be sufficient going into DDC and didn't feel the need for a high end USB cable in that application.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 18, 2022)

LocalMotion said:


> I'm happy with the AS Statement and thought about upgrading to the Signature,  but since I'm going from Innuos to DDC, I thought a decent to good USB cable would be sufficient since the DDC should be cleaning everything up. I emailed Alvin at Vinshine, and he stated the same, said a good quality USB should be sufficient going into DDC and didn't feel the need for a high end USB cable in that application.


IMHO: I have 10 Mhz Master clock on both SOtm streamer ---> Gustard U18 DDC, still changing USB cable would make an audible difference …


----------



## dougms3

Ya i have to agree that the cables will always make a difference.  Even on my audio gd di20he which has regenerative power it makes a difference with the cable i use.


----------



## LocalMotion

@Crypt Keeper @dougms3 thanks for the feedback. Maybe I’ll look into grabbing the AS Signature next. I have a Gaia on the way to replace my Hermes.


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> @Crypt Keeper @dougms3 thanks for the feedback. Maybe I’ll look into grabbing the AS Signature next. I have a Gaia on the way to replace my Hermes.


I think you're ok with the AS statement silver.  The signature may not offer much, if any improvement since I think the gaia has galvanic isolation.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

There is a review posted on the Concentus: “Dave July 1, 2022
I took some time to compare the Concentus USB cable with my trustworthy Shunyata Sigma USB. I am happy to tell you the Concentus was the clear winner in all aspects. That with the Concentus just ran for couple hours!
I also went to an audio friend’s home with 2 other guys. So total 4 of us. I brought the Concentus, Shunyata, & the JCAT. We had a lot of fun rolling usb cables. There was also a new Sablon which the owner raved about and the host uses (now used) an Intona Ultimate which is the dearest priced of the 5. The Concentus is regardless of price, the most balanced and musical. The CP ratio just blew everything away.”

Would very much like  to compare it to the AS Signature …


----------



## musicinmymind

Odin gold Power and USB cable arrived.
Briefly did try USB cable and could not immediately find any difference between cheap USB cable I have, but there are no flip side as well.

May be it needs burning, will check again after 400+ hrs.

The wood blocks on USB is nice weight balance as well, making me wonder if that was the purpose of it?


----------



## musicinmymind

I did a check inside the power cord, I see the red and black tape. Is this cheap quality cable?


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> I did a check inside the power cord, I see the red and black tape. Is this cheap quality cable?


Try comparing to cdacostas post 63 on page 5.

Its hard to tell but usually the thicker odin conductors don't have that red and green line in the wire.


----------



## musicinmymind

dougms3 said:


> Try comparing to cdacostas post 63 on page 5.
> 
> Its hard to tell but usually the thicker odin conductors don't have that red and green line in the wire.



Did check post 63 on page 5, the picture of gold cable from @cdacosta is also having red and green wire. Cable I have is thick, will check how it performs after burn-in.


----------



## LocalMotion

So I'm assuming these Odin2 reference cable is 7 strands of silver plated solid core copper? Pretty impressive for the PC's and actually buying the PC is cheaper than the raw cable from the same seller (although there's random discounts on everything so hard to judge)

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803580930600.html


----------



## szore (Oct 19, 2022)

LocalMotion said:


> So I'm assuming these Odin2 reference cable is 7 strands of silver plated solid core copper? Pretty impressive for the PC's and actually buying the PC is cheaper than the raw cable from the same seller (although there's random discounts on everything so hard to judge)
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803580930600.html


That link is for Odin, not Odin 2. Someone an Odin2 open and it was solid silver, they assumed sterling silver. I forget who it was...


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 19, 2022)

LocalMotion said:


> So I'm assuming these Odin2 reference cable is 7 strands of silver plated solid core copper? Pretty impressive for the PC's and actually buying the PC is cheaper than the raw cable from the same seller (although there's random discounts on everything so hard to judge)
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803580930600.html



15 core available as well ... Item # 2251832806941272   3256802936896122


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 19, 2022)

Unless it looks like this inside, it’s the Valhalla…









Item: 3256802214685388


----------



## szore

Incidentally, now that a few months have gone by and things have burned in a little, when I attatch these little gadgets onto my amp and DAC and computer, I DO hear a slight improvement; it sounds just a little smoother, and there seems to be slightly greater depth and layering...interesting. I've been doingA/B test with them clipped on or not for a few weeks now, and I always hear a tad improvement when they are on. At $10 a po you cant go wrong, but I suggest the clip at the end where you screw it on. Its more firm, I got the aligator clips and they are always popping off...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Incidentally, now that a few months have gone by and things have burned in a little, when I attatch these little gadgets onto my amp and DAC and computer, I DO hear a slight improvement; it sounds just a little smoother, and there seems to be slightly greater depth and layering...interesting. I've been doingA/B test with them clipped on or not for a few weeks now, and I always hear a tad improvement when they are on. At $10 a po you cant go wrong, but I suggest the clip at the end where you screw it on. Its more firm, I got the aligator clips and they are always popping off...


Dammit szore, now I have to try it.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Incidentally, now that a few months have gone by and things have burned in a little, when I attatch these little gadgets onto my amp and DAC and computer, I DO hear a slight improvement; it sounds just a little smoother, and there seems to be slightly greater depth and layering...interesting. I've been doingA/B test with them clipped on or not for a few weeks now, and I always hear a tad improvement when they are on. At $10 a po you cant go wrong, but I suggest the clip at the end where you screw it on. Its more firm, I got the aligator clips and they are always popping off...


What are they?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> What are they?


3256803397090284

Supposed to lower the noise floor caused by free electrons...it supposedly neutralizes these free electrons.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> 3256803397090284
> 
> Supposed to lower the noise floor caused by free electrons...it supposedly neutralizes these free electrons.


I like how you keep mentioning “supposedly”. LOL


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Agree.. These grounding boxes (similar to Nordost Qkore and Entreq) work. But I would say get at least 1.5 kg one + proper connectors for your gears … I’ve been using 16 kg box + Audiocrast grounding cables with great results…


----------



## cdacosta

By the way, after hearing about the 11.11 sale I started asking sellers “what will be your 11.11 sale price?”.  The three sellers I asked this question all said that their current price will be the 11.11 price.  I am curious to see if this is true.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I like how you keep mentioning “supposedly”. LOL


I'm gonna wait till the 11.11 sale to get a couple.  

Don't question the magic, if it works it works.  I also hear it also gives you stronger boners if you attach the alligator clip to your nipple.


cdacosta said:


> By the way, after hearing about the 11.11 sale I started asking sellers “what will be your 11.11 sale price?”.  The three sellers I asked this question all said that their current price will be the 11.11 price.  I am curious to see if this is true.


Not all of them have better prices, some sellers like to jack up the price a week before 11.11 then reduce it to the regular price for 11.11.  These guys have no honor, if they get into any physical altercation, they're the type that will throw salt in your eyes then kick you in the balls.  Communist style.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I'm gonna wait till the 11.11 sale to get a couple.
> 
> Don't question the magic, if it works it works.  I also hear it also gives you stronger boners if you attach the alligator clip to your nipple.
> 
> Not all of them have better prices, some sellers like to jack up the price a week before 11.11 then reduce it to the regular price for 11.11.  These guys have no honor, if they get into any physical altercation, they're the type that will throw salt in your eyes then kick you in the balls.  Communist style.


Ummm does that mean just wait and see if prices change?  Lol

If it is a couple or few dollars I do not care. You have been buying from Aliexpress for years, what kind of discount does the 11.11 sale usually offer?


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Ummm does that mean just wait and see if prices change?  Lol
> 
> If it is a couple or few dollars I do not care. You have been buying from Aliexpress for years, what kind of discount does the 11.11 sale usually offer?


Yeah, just keep an eye on the price before the sale.  

I haven't seen many spectacular deals on 11.11, they're difficult to find.  Sometimes the coupons are worthwhile but alot of them just do that price increase then drop on 11.11.


----------



## LocalMotion

cdacosta said:


> By the way, after hearing about the 11.11 sale I started asking sellers “what will be your 11.11 sale price?”.  The three sellers I asked this question all said that their current price will be the 11.11 price.  I am curious to see if this is true.



FYI - remember AE uses a language translator.. I tried to write out English that could make more sense. example today



> >hi. i was going to wait until 11/11 sale to buy these. will there be better price for 11/11 sale?
> Read
> 
> >>>Yes, friend. [Smile] It will have the best price. Best Regards Churry
> ...


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> FYI - remember AE uses a language translator.. I tried to write out English that could make more sense. example today


Interesting, thanks for that.


----------



## LocalMotion

cdacosta said:


> Interesting, thanks for that.



So that exchange happened over last 30 min... he gave me a $10 off code ($95 total for two 1m Odin2 power cords) store was "sound labs"


----------



## musicinmymind

Crypt Keeper said:


> Unless it looks like this inside, it’s the Valhalla…
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Valhalla is preferred and better cable?


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> Valhalla is preferred and better cable?


Its the older version of the odin cable, preferrably you want the odin2 cable.

But they're pretty close in performance so I wouldn't worry too much about it.


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> So that exchange happened over last 30 min... he gave me a $10 off code ($95 total for two 1m Odin2 power cords) store was "sound labs"


I tried what you said with a seller of an item that is $30.  He said would be $1 off...LOL

I wish I would or could be more serious, money is money.  But the cost is so low for these items and the shipping is so cheap or free that I am having a hard time taking a few dollars seriously.  I do appreciate the info though.  I am sure others can benefit from your recent experience.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 20, 2022)

musicinmymind said:


> Valhalla is preferred and better cable?


As you can see it’s cheaper … It’s 1 mm VS 1.4 mm . Not sure about quality of the conductors b/c we will need a lab test on both to see which one is better…

I think I found the real odin2 gold - Item # 3256803923817224

It seems the “real” Odin2 (gold or silver) has different plug… And it’s around $200-400 VS $30-100 …


----------



## musicinmymind

Checking my cable again, I found a difference between my gold cable and one @cdacostas have.
He has 7 conductors cable and mine has only 5 conductors, not sure how this will affect the sound, as mine still burning-in. 
(picture from @cdacostas can be found in page 5)

Should I just return this and get 7 conductors one?


----------



## dougms3

musicinmymind said:


> Checking my cable again, I found a difference between my gold cable and one @cdacostas have.
> He has 7 conductors cable and mine has only 5 conductors, not sure how this will affect the sound, as mine still burning-in.
> (picture from @cdacostas can be found in page 5)
> 
> Should I just return this and get 7 conductors one?


Yeah thats going to make a difference 

This is one I have.  It has 7 conductors as well.


----------



## szore

musicinmymind said:


> Checking my cable again, I found a difference between my gold cable and one @cdacostas have.
> He has 7 conductors cable and mine has only 5 conductors, not sure how this will affect the sound, as mine still burning-in.
> (picture from @cdacostas can be found in page 5)
> 
> Should I just return this and get 7 conductors one?


My Odin2 gold has 7 connectors, I paid $230 for it from RM Digital store.


----------



## musicinmymind

dougms3 said:


> Yeah thats going to make a difference
> 
> This is one I have.  It has 7 conductors as well.



I was ask for return then, purchased from Futureshop on Ali,
please suggest audio store for 7 connectors, RM Digital store seems to be expensive.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

musicinmymind said:


> I was ask for return then, purchased from Futureshop on Ali,
> please suggest audio store for 7 connectors, RM Digital store seems to be expensive.


Item # 2251832444596357    Seems  to be the 1.4 mm  and screws on the plug, but needs  to be confirmed...


----------



## LocalMotion

These I've ordered have 7 legs and screws in the plug ( I just ordered 2 more):

_Insulation: High purity class 1.003 extruded Fluorinated Ethylene Propylene (FEP)
Construction: Mechanically tuned spacing, length and Dual Mono-Filament, TSC design
Conductors: 7 x 14 AWG
Material: Silver-plated 99.999999% solid core OFC_

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803393578109.html

*edit they are the silver, but they are exactly the same, but sure how just the gold color foil would make a difference?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 20, 2022)

LocalMotion said:


> These I've ordered have 7 legs and screws in the plug ( I just ordered 2 more):
> 
> _Insulation: High purity class 1.003 extruded Fluorinated Ethylene Propylene (FEP)
> Construction: Mechanically tuned spacing, length and Dual Mono-Filament, TSC design
> ...


Unless they are using different conductors, both should be identical …

If it has this white insulation , it should be 1.4 mm and not Valhalla disguised as Odin2 …


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> These I've ordered have 7 legs and screws in the plug ( I just ordered 2 more):
> 
> _Insulation: High purity class 1.003 extruded Fluorinated Ethylene Propylene (FEP)
> Construction: Mechanically tuned spacing, length and Dual Mono-Filament, TSC design
> ...


It says that cable is 20 amps.


----------



## LocalMotion

dougms3 said:


> It says that cable is 20 amps.


What would that matter if the connector is 15a? Just the cable is “rated” to use with a 20a connection right?


----------



## LocalMotion

So the 16 core solid silver speaker cables I ordered on Oct 17th were delivered today. That was fast! And they included that in the “free shipping” after I chatted with them. 

They are beautiful and in the listing they use the term “soft” and flexible which they are. Very cool feel to them. But fit and finish seem top notch. Plugged them in and letting them break in. They sent them in a sealed anti-static bag


----------



## FredA

Got my Flux50 two hours ago. I put it on the streamer, which is plugged to the same isolation transfo outlet as the Afterdark master clock (feeding a di20he and a r7he mkii). The idea is to avoid contamination from the streamer.  It seems to work at the moment. I get exceptionally good sound. 

About the flux50, there is something loose inside the iec (filter) part. Does not seem detrimental...


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> What would that matter if the connector is 15a? Just the cable is “rated” to use with a 20a connection right?


Should be ok for headphones gear but just remember that is capable of drawing 20 amps, if you ever move it to something else like a plc or high power gear.

Might trip the circuit breaker if your House is wired for 15 amps.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Got my Flux50 two hours ago. I put it on the streamer, which is plugged to the same isolation transfo outlet as the Afterdark master clock (feeding a di20he and a r7he mkii). The idea is to avoid contamination from the streamer.  It seems to work at the moment. I get exceptionally good sound.
> 
> About the flux50, there is something loose inside the iec (filter) part. Does not seem detrimental...


You should open it up and double check.  

Male iec is easy to open up.  Its most likely the wire tensioner that's rattling in there but best to make sure.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> You should open it up and double check.
> 
> Male iec is easy to open up.  Its most likely the wire tensioner that's rattling in there but best to make sure.


Thanks.


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 20, 2022)

Good day everyone. Thank you for this open topic and your discussions , this is very valuable information , thank you all .
I do not think that clone wires, copies is bad , it's bad when hucksters sell a piece of wire for the price of a car.
I bought two ODIN 2 power cables for amplifiers and have been enjoying the sound for a couple of weeks now.
My system began to sound many times better after changing only the power cables and the process of improvements continues.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2U5kGGq&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


I'm a little handy with a soldering iron. I've always wondered why wires affect sound. I'm not interested in other scientific nonsense about electrons because the true nature of electricity is unknown even to science.

I think that the Power cable  Odin 2 works as a filter, the harmonics at a frequency of 160Hz on my system have decreased, the sound has become more voluminous, balanced, natural , depth, space have appeared, the middle has also calmed down.A lot of thing change .  This is a comparison with mine a standard wire.
I am also waiting for my DAC Power cable ODIN Gold and USB Odin 2 .

I carefully studied the difference between wires ODIN 2 and ODIN Gold. Wire gauge difference
ODIN 2 has 7 wires of 14AWG each,
ODIN Gold has 7 wires with a cross section of 17AWG.
A screen made of gold or silver is just a different color of foil I thing . And with all this, I can say that the whole point is in the wire screen and philosophy to make harmonize and clean up same dust energy of electricity .
Different thickness of the core of the wire and gives the difference in sound between gold and Odin 2.
With all this, these are super copies of the ODIN @ and Odin GOLD cable, the whole point is in the screen and the philosophy of the cable itself what was make .

*My bad experience with aliexpress is related to the purchase of an interconnect RCA 3 meters of cable  *
Argento the Flow​https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2U5kGGq&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
The fact is that the DAC turns off the signal to the amplifier if there is no information coming from my PC and it turns out that the wire, if a bad screen on wire starts to noise on it. What happened with FLOW. I dismantled the plug and decided to see which cable was inside and was surprised that there was an ordinary  cable without a screen
look like 14-17AWG . Yes, of course, when the DAC is turned on and the music is paused, then there is no noise and interference, the cable sounds dark as if under a blanket. Any compression compresses the sound, smoothing out all the errors details and sound not natural
If this is actually ARGENTO's idea how build interconnect cable , then I consider it beyond fraud and a scam to sell wire like this for $7K .




 photo of what inside Argento cable RCA


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 20, 2022)

FredA said:


> Got my Flux50 two hours ago. I put it on the streamer, which is plugged to the same isolation transfo outlet as the Afterdark master clock (feeding a di20he and a r7he mkii). The idea is to avoid contamination from the streamer.  It seems to work at the moment. I get exceptionally good sound.
> 
> About the flux50, there is something loose inside the iec (filter) part. Does not seem detrimental...


Mine has a rattling sound but poses no problem. It may be akin to many radio tubes. You hear a rattling sound when shaking it, but I confirmed that's an expected part of the design (filament) and nothing is actually loose. Especially considering that both ours have a rattling sound and work.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 20, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> Good day everyone. Thank you for this open topic and your discussions , this is very valuable information , thank you all .
> I do not think that clone wires, copies is bad , it's bad when hucksters sell a piece of wire for the price of a car.
> I bought two ODIN 2 power cables for amplifiers and have been enjoying the sound for a couple of weeks now.
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2U5kGGq&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> ...


Yep, I think, the worst offenders are: Audioquest, PS Audio & Nordost…

Was your Odin2 from Findaudio store white insulation around each core version ? Or transparent insulation with (red, green, black) version ?

I’m trying to find the white insulation 1.42 mm core version. I believe it should be the best wire among all fake Odins…


----------



## DecentLevi

From recent posts I was starting to doubt for a moment whether or not my Gold Odin cable is the real (knockoff). Luckily after checking my photos, looks like mine is legit, I have 7 wires and the nice looking plug!










I have a 2nd one that's almost here - both times from the same seller Getwire, thanks to a recommendation from here.
Though even these are not perfect. IMO they seem to lack proper shielding, hence the boomy dynamics even after around 6 weeks F/T burn-in. But I'm not complaining once I connect it to a Flux-50, then everything is upped a few notches into an abyss of sonic perfection!
Maybe I'll upgrade to the even nicer plugs too, since these use pure copper terminations.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> From recent posts I was starting to doubt for a moment whether or not my Gold Odin cable is the real (knockoff). Luckily after checking my photos, looks like mine is legit, I have 7 wires and the nice looking plug!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh boy, looks like I'll be taking my Gold apart later to see for myself....


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 20, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yep, I think, the worst offenders are: Audioquest, PS Audio & Nordost…
> 
> Was your Odin2 from Findaudio store white insulation around each core version ? Or transparent insulation with (red, green, black) version ?
> 
> I’m trying to find the white insulation 1.42 mm core version. I believe it should be the best wire among all Odins…


Yes my Odin 2 power cable from the store Findaudio
I dismantled the plug, it has wires 3+3+1 wrapped in silver foil that I could not see inside the wire, I did not disassemble it further. There are probably two wire options as shown in the photo. The one that is twisted inside with red and blue fishing line, I think it is preferable for sound because it has the least contact with insulation.


----------



## pashkaam

Now I got ODIN GOLD power cable  for my DAC and USB cable  ODIN 2. So far, I can’t say anything, because today, after Argento cables on my old RCA ones, the sound is excellent, I have to listen more . Yes, USB cable ONE 2, with a little foggy sound and  fell a little while pulling it out , putting back my old USB simple.


----------



## pashkaam

I have a question, has anyone tried to disconnect  interconnect wire ODIN 2 or ODIN GOLD from a source like a DAC or preamp without disconnecting from the amplifier, or simply turn off the power at the source, thereby checking the screen protection for noise pickup on the wire, how good this foil is ?


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> I have a question, has anyone tried to disconnect  interconnect wire ODIN 2 or ODIN GOLD from a source like a DAC or preamp without disconnecting from the amplifier, or simply turn off the power at the source, thereby checking the screen protection for noise pickup on the wire, how good this foil is ?


wait, what?


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I have a question, has anyone tried to disconnect  interconnect wire ODIN 2 or ODIN GOLD from a source like a DAC or preamp without disconnecting from the amplifier, or simply turn off the power at the source, thereby checking the screen protection for noise pickup on the wire, how good this foil is ?


The foil is not that good a shield.

When running a voltage detector anywhere near the wire it goes off.  A good 2-3 inch radius around it.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

2251832827361159 should be cheaper version of Oyaide Electromagnetic Absorber MWA-010T ...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> 2251832827361159 should be cheaper version of Oyaide Electromagnetic Absorber MWA-010T ...


I have the oyaide mwa-010t.  

It it extremely powerful stuff, I would not use it anywhere near audio gear.  

I used it in my breaker box, power switches and outlets before they reach the audio chain.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I have the oyaide mwa-010t.
> 
> It it extremely powerful stuff, I would not use it anywhere near audio gear.
> 
> I used it in my breaker box, power switches and outlets before they reach the audio chain.


For me keep the stuff away from line level signals. Works like a champ around power cables connectors. I use it around all my power cable connectors, awesome tweak. With each application sonic improvement is had, in my system. Also a small piece on AC panel breaker switch. Do not like the effects when overused or anywhere else within audio system. Actually I would have to look but small piece at digital cable ends like USB can have a positive sonic effect also.


----------



## szore

I never heard of tape like that, why wouldnt you use it around audio signals? Is it like duct tape? How would you use it?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I never heard of tape like that, why wouldnt you use it around audio signals? Is it like duct tape? How would you use it?


I am headed to work.  When I get back later I can take pics of my actual application of the Oyaide tape.  This tape absorbs and dissipates EMI.  Very strong effect.  When used around line level signals can suck the life out of the music.  Now a tiny, tiny piece say 1/8” square can be used on line level signals but really any much more than that changes what I hear too much.  

Doug made a tweak and sent it to me using nylon baby AC protector plugs with this Oyaide EMI tape and fo.Q T-102 tape (high end made for audio micro vibration tape).  This works and I liked it in several places, in and outside of the system on the same AC circuit.  We use to make the same with only the fo.Q T-102 back in the day.  His idea works better.  WIll take a pic of it later when I get home.

To see where the EMI tape works best, while listening to the system just place the tape on and around different parts of the system and where it makes a “positive” sonic gain you try different amounts.  It is a very thin 3/4” (going by memory) wide tape.  Comes in a 5’ roll for like $60.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I never heard of tape like that, why wouldnt you use it around audio signals? Is it like duct tape? How would you use it?


Its sendust tape, a mixture of silicon, aluminum and iron. 

It can manipulate electromagnetic fields.

Its a really good deal for that price if you want to experiment with it.


----------



## cdacosta

I am headed out but here are some pics…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Doug made a tweak and sent it to me using nylon baby AC protector plugs with this Oyaide EMI tape and fo.Q T-102 tape (high end made for audio micro vibration tape).  This works and I liked it in several places, in and outside of the system on the same AC circuit.  We use to make the same with only the fo.Q T-102 back in the day.  His idea works better.  WIll take a pic of it later when I get home.


Brilliant idea ! I should try this tweak as well …


----------



## cdacosta

Some more. The black you see is the fo.Q dampening tape


----------



## cdacosta

By the way, that AC outlet plug tweak in my system is more effective on the same circuit as the audio system.


----------



## pashkaam

Yesterday I received a wire ODIN 2 USB.
I did not hear the difference with a simple USB cable, maybe. It's hard to say or hear something if the other day I got a huge step up in sound and just enjoy it.

I bought USB ONE 2 as 12 wire. In fact, there were only 8. Dismantled the plug, the inside is done well.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 21, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> Yesterday I received a wire ODIN 2 USB.
> I did not hear the difference with a simple USB cable, maybe. It's hard to say or hear something if the other day I got a huge step up in sound and just enjoy it.
> 
> I bought USB ONE 2 as 12 wire. In fact, there were only 8. Dismantled the plug, the inside is done well.


It’s silver plated , so 1-2 weeks of burn- in required …


----------



## Rick_B

I just noticed that Aliexpress has some "Heimdall" style cables now...


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> It’s silver plated , so 1-2 weeks od burn- in required …


I wanted to make a 18v DC cable  for my DAC  from the USB ODIN 2 , but the wire looked too thin. I have a USB mini socket in the DAC instead of USB B, I will solder it and replays  original to USB mini. I turned on ODIN 2 USB through a cheap adapter, maybe this is the same as it affected the sound.
Another interesting thing, I want to check if the shield is connected in this wire on each wire, it seems that the central signal wire can be shorted to the shield.
Everything is fine in ODIN 2 power cable, I checked it.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> By the way, that AC outlet plug tweak in my system is more effective on the same circuit as the audio system.


Quick question: Have you tried The nano on a USB cable ? I mean it’s doable with a fine brush … what do you think ? Thanks


----------



## szore

I want to put the nano on the cpu pins on my computer....


----------



## pashkaam

Ha ha. I checked the foil screen on USB ODIN 2, I have bad news. 
There is no ground on each wire on the foil shield. 

Due to the fact that the wire itself is very thin and there is insulation on top of the foil, connecting the ground to the protection is a very delicate job, which was not done.

*The question is who has an Interconnect cable and USB ODIN 2, tell me they are the same in thickness and number of wires? 
*


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> Ha ha. I checked the foil screen on USB ODIN 2, I have bad news.
> There is no ground on each wire on the foil shield.
> 
> Due to the fact that the wire itself is very thin and there is insulation on top of the foil, connecting the ground to the protection is a very delicate job, which was not done.
> ...


Well, I have the cable, I didn't really look at it I just plugged it in...


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Ha ha. I checked the foil screen on USB ODIN 2, I have bad news.
> There is no ground on each wire on the foil shield.
> 
> Due to the fact that the wire itself is very thin and there is insulation on top of the foil, connecting the ground to the protection is a very delicate job, which was not done.
> ...


I have the odin2 rcas and usb.  They look like they're the same diameter but I haven't opened up either of them.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Another reversed polarity cable from Ali  DC cable this time.. I bought 2 cables from him before , yet again.. wrong plug and reversed polarity … Always dbl check and then tripl check all your cables...


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I have the odin2 rcas and usb.  They look like they're the same diameter but I haven't opened up either of them.


Are they similar in appearance? Overall thickness, inner wire thickness, if put side by side the same?
Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Are they similar in appearance? Overall thickness, inner wire thickness, if put side by side the same?
> Thanks



Yes  they look like the same wire ... but I can't confirm that  ... I have XLRs and USBs ....


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Quick question: Have you tried The nano on a USB cable ? I mean it’s doable with a fine brush … what do you think ? Thanks


Yes, all mechanical connections.  Never had a short.  Actually what confuses me is the Nano liquid is not conductive across connections.  Not sure how this is possible, but I cannot get continuity when testing for it across just the Nano.  I use the same brush that comes with the Nano Liquid on all mechanical connections.  To be clear, when I say all mechanical connections I mean all!  Every application has improved system performance to some degree.  For example, here are some applications most likely will not think of:

* R45 connections on ethernet cable
* All mechanical connections inside PC (personal computer/source) except CPU.
* Video connections including power 
* Powerline Conditioners connections.  AC Outlet contacts, Bybee Quantum contacts, IEC contacts, etc.  (Easy upgrade to a PLC)
* AC outlet contacts
* All cable (power and line level) mechanical connections including the cable contact points. 
* fuse holder connections and fuse contact points


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I want to put the nano on the cpu pins on my computer....


That is the only thing I have not tried!  My system runs so flawlessly, I was happy with all of the other connections inside the PC.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Another reversed polarity cable from Ali  DC cable this time.. I bought 2 cables from him before , yet again.. wrong plug and reversed polarity … Always dbl check and then tripl check all your cables...


Absolutely, no matter who built it!


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Yes, all mechanical connections.  Never had a short.  Actually what confuses me is the Nano liquid is not conductive across connections.  Not sure how this is possible, but I cannot get continuity when testing for it across just the Nano.  I use the same brush that comes with the Nano Liquid on all mechanical connections.  To be clear, when I say all mechanical connections I mean all!  Every application has improved system performance to some degree.  For example, here are some applications most likely will not think of:
> 
> * R45 connections on ethernet cable
> * All mechanical connections inside PC (personal computer/source) except CPU.
> ...


Niceeeey nice ! Thanks a lot !


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Absolutely, no matter who built it!


I was in a rush (for some stupid reason) … Should have followed tha rule, but I didn’t … Now that new LPS – fried… Hope it’s just a fuse inside…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Niceeeey nice ! Thanks a lot !


my pleasure


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I was in a rush (for some stupid reason) … Should have followed tha rule, but I didn’t … Now that new LPS – fried… Hope it’s just a fuse inside…


When first seriously starting out in this hobby and modding gear and experimenting with cables and designs I learned the following:

RULE #1: CYA
RULE #2: See rule #1
RULE #3: If not 100% sure I knew what I was doing, ask people that do.
So far which is about 25 years in, have not had an accident or anything fail following the above rules.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

They say The nano liquid is Squalene (organic matter) - Shark liver oil (an oil obtained from the livers of sharks) with gold and silver nano particles…. Now I understand why it will not short …


----------



## FredA (Oct 22, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> Another reversed polarity cable from Ali  DC cable this time.. I bought 2 cables from him before , yet again.. wrong plug and reversed polarity … Always dbl check and then tripl check all your cables...


Same thing happened to me last week. As a bonus, there was a short. Luckily, my psu has overcurrent protection so the Gustard fuse i had installed recently did not blow. Would have been a shame.  I repaired the cable, now all is fine.


----------



## szore

Finally got my last gold xlr cable for my Lokius...all that upper mids/lower treble congestion I was hearing is greatly improved. To be fair, the old cable was $30 for the pair Amazon temp cable, but the new xlr the sound is finally totally amazing. So much clarity throughout the spectrum now. Plus I got my new 8 wire 7N copper cable and that adds great texture and clarity as well. This is a good Saturday!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Finally got my last gold xlr cable for my Lokius...all that upper mids/lower treble congestion I was hearing is greatly improved. To be fair, the old cable was $30 for the pair Amazon temp cable, but the new xlr the sound is finally totally amazing. So much clarity throughout the spectrum now. Plus I got my new 8 wire 7N copper cable and that adds great texture and clarity as well. This is a good Saturday!


I noticed something the last two days. It feels like and sounds like the system has refined a tad over the last month or so, compared to after the first 700+ hours of burn in of all the cables I have. It is slight but still noticeable.  The simplest way to describe the change is that it is a tad more coherent as a whole and a bit more musical. Gets and keeps me in that involuntary body movement when I am really into music I am listening to. 

During burn in this also happened, but there was a lot of swings sonically. Now no sonic swings. Just sharing for anyone wondering if system could continue to improve after initial burn in.


----------



## FredA

The flux50 i got on Thursday sounded well at first, then perhaps not so well for a couple of days. Now it seems to have come around. It took just 2 days. I ordered another one for my master clock.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> The flux50 i got on Thursday sounded well at first, then perhaps not so well for a couple of days. Now it seems to have come around. It took just 2 days. I ordered another one for my master clock.


I'm having a love hate relationship with that thing.

I don't know if its something else thats burning in thats causing some swings but it sounds good for a while then it seems like it making things seem off.  I have it on the LPS feeding my jcat usb card for now.


----------



## FredA (Oct 22, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> I'm having a love hate relationship with that thing.
> 
> I don't know if its something else thats burning in thats causing some swings but it sounds good for a while then it seems like it making things seem off.  I have it on the LPS feeding my jcat usb card for now.


A swing is possible during burn-in, it will eventually stabilize. My rule of thumb is to use that sort of filtering device only on purely digital gears, as you are doing. Can take a week or two i figure to stop varying. Right now, things are perfect here.

The Afterdark Trifecta master clock i use has no emi or rfi filter inside so using an external one is a good idea. You really need an inductor to block very high-freq noise, because caps can only go so high. I believe there is one inside the flux 50. Using chokes for digital gears is common. You do not want them on any analog stage psu, on the other hand. I don't filter my analog gears. My dac is on a 500w isolation transformer with filtering, however.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 22, 2022)

Wrestling huge snakes all afternoon - all with their own character for sure. Some put up a fight against me flexing them or against gravity keeping all stringed together, but in the end each kept their own sound in one way or another.

The battle between these AC cables ensued:
- 2x Odin Gold (authentic knockoff) (from Getwire store)
- 1x Wel Signature (WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M from Audioson store)
- 2x standard generic black extra thick IEC cables (one fitted with special combination of external ferrite chokes to reduce HF)
- 1x Wireworld Aurora 7 (authentic from Wireworld)
- 2x Flux-50 NFC in-line power filters (from Moonsaudio store)

TLDR: just do this and go for the 'gold'





Exploring all mathematically possible iterations of these cables between 3 components: central huge Furman power conditioner, hefty tube amp and DDC (audio bridge), I was essentially trying to quell a fair bit of brightness I've been experiencing. Save for listing every combination, here was the general takeaway:

This damn Wel Signature is a treble freak. It loves speed giving off dynamics that are clinical, with bass that is recessed and is sped off into the void. Highs are smooth but overdone, and I'm just not getting that true to life analogue experience, nor a very good soundstage. This is my final judgement. I have let it burn-in 24/7 for 24 days into my power conditioner, and tried it about 12 different ways into all 3 components, with/without the Flux-50 (both 1 and 2 stacked), and with/without the DBS, which made ZERO difference IMO. I can only praise its build quality like a tank. Maybe it'll save my life one day from a jedi warlord, LOL.

My initial reason for getting 2 Flux-50's was because my former testing shown fantastic performance with one into the DDC. Although the sound was resolving I experienced treble fatigue, later becoming clear that using multiple Flux-50's on different devices simultaneously changes the sound a lot, not always for the better. Even without the Wel Signature in the mix I still encountered a consistently bright sound when using two on two devices.

Enter _dual _Flux-50's.  Finally I had the wits to stack both Flux-50's in serial before my tube (headphone / speaker) amp. NOW you're talkin'! I seem to have broken some kind of sound barrier of performance. Sounds come in every color from every direction, and instruments hang in their own time & space, and the FR is wide, wide, wide!!! And yes sir, this sounds far better than one on each component separately and better to me than with just one - in my system / IMO. Stacking two together seems to have even reduced the noisefloor a bit more on my amp.

For my DDC, I've settled on just an Odin Gold AC cable, as well as with my Furman power conditioner, using the other Odin Gold cable. The Wels cable into everything made it sound bright like described above. The blue Wireworld cable was great but usually a bit bright, and the thick black IEC cables were both somewhat fatiguing and didn't carry a good sense of lifelike quality. The Odin Gold OTOH did everything just right on all but my tube amp. For my tube amp, I've settled on the blue Wireworld Aurora 7 + 2 Flux-50's stacked together. Finally the bass and dynamics have come into the limelight and the organic quality is just surreal, has to be heard to believe.

Though improved I'm getting a slightly forward treble, but that's something I believe will be fixed with my incoming Odin Gold USB cable (to compare with my Odin 2 USB cable) and/or special fuses that are incoming.


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> Wrestling huge snakes all afternoon - all with their own character for sure. Some put up a fight against me flexing them or against gravity keeping all stringed together, but in the end each kept their own sound in one way or another.
> 
> The battle between these AC cables ensued:
> - 2x Odin Gold (authentic knockoff) (from Getwire store)
> ...


This is strange but what the heck. Two flux50 in series... 

Right now, i use a WEL on my streamer. Toghether with a flux50. Last night was epic with this setup. One thing i had to tweak was the rubber feet on the Zerozone psu feeding the streamer. Initially, the feet were fine. But with time, they compress and offer less vibration control. The streamer is a usbridge sig and its chassis is quite flimsy. It sits on top of the Zerozone on a 2-layer foam suspension. So i don't think it is much affected by what feet are underneath the psu it sits on. The psu must be though. 

Depending on the weight of the cord you use, the feet can become more or less effective with vibration damping. I replaced them with these

https://www.audioserenity.co.uk//iso-9h/audioserenity-set-of-8-iso-9h-gel-isolation-pads/


----------



## Leonarfd

I bought it for Hifiman HE-R9 and that doesn't work since its has a different cabling than what's normal for dual 3.5mm TRS. It worked great on my T1, but cant beat my more expensive Arctic Cable.

Cheap and can be recommended if someone wants a light and very soft cable.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003405770618.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.42801802LvTOFW


----------



## pashkaam

Another funny product news, this time *ODIN GOLD Power Cable *
The gold foil on the wire is not foil, it's just a Christmas dielectric  !!!
That's why ODIN 2 sounds different, this cable has a real shield, and ODIN GOLD is not shielded.
The best audio cables should be shielded, anything that is not shielded works as an antenna for noise.


----------



## pashkaam

The funniest thing is when people pay thousands of dollars for wires that are worthless and bad for the sound.
For example, Argento Flow interconnect cable , my wire from China has a serial number, it’s more likely not a fake, they wrote about it on other forums who compared the original and a copy, BUT
The wire is made of plain stranded wire with thick insulation and no shield. The cost for this miracle is $7K. 

The whole trick is that the ordinary wire was spaced apart, the usual wire for $1 meter, well, maybe $2


----------



## Rick_B

pashkaam said:


> The funniest thing is when people pay thousands of dollars for wires that are worthless and bad for the sound.
> For example, Argento Flow interconnect cable , my wire from China has a serial number, it’s more likely not a fake, they wrote about it on other forums who compared the original and a copy, BUT
> The wire is made of plain stranded wire with thick insulation and no shield. The cost for this miracle is $7K.
> 
> The whole trick is that the ordinary wire was spaced apart, the usual wire for $1 meter, well, maybe $2


Where were the other reviews?
Inquiring minds want to know...


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> For my DDC, I've settled on just an Odin Gold AC cable, as well as with my Furman power conditioner, using the other Odin Gold cable. The Wels cable into everything made it sound bright like described above. The blue Wireworld cable was great but usually a bit bright, and the thick black IEC cables were both somewhat fatiguing and didn't carry a good sense of lifelike quality. The Odin Gold OTOH did everything just right on all but my tube amp. For my tube amp, I've settled on the blue Wireworld Aurora 7 + 2 Flux-50's stacked together. Finally the bass and dynamics have come into the limelight and the organic quality is just surreal, has to be heard to believe.
> 
> Though improved I'm getting a slightly forward treble, but that's something I believe will be fixed with my incoming Odin Gold USB cable (to compare with my Odin 2 USB cable) and/or special fuses that are incoming.


I would have thought several times to buy ODIN GOLD. You will have an unshielded USB wire, which will give complete horror.
Perhaps in the GOLD version there is no screen, like in a Power cable, there is not foil there, but just a golden film, a dielectric


----------



## pashkaam

Rick_B said:


> Where were the other reviews?
> Inquiring minds want to know...


other reviews


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Another funny product news, this time *ODIN GOLD Power Cable *
> The gold foil on the wire is not foil, it's just a Christmas dielectric  !!!
> That's why ODIN 2 sounds different, this cable has a real shield, and ODIN GOLD is not shielded.
> The best audio cables should be shielded, anything that is not shielded works as an antenna for noise.


The only version of “Odin” AC cable I would consider buying  # 3256802214685388    …


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I would have thought several times to buy ODIN GOLD. You will have an unshielded USB wire, which will give complete horror.
> Perhaps in the GOLD version there is no screen, like in a Power cable, there is not foil there, but just a golden film, a dielectric


I believe the gold foil is an aluminum shield but it is quite thin and definitely not enough to properly shield this cable.  

As I have tested with a NC voltage detector, it does emit an emf with about a 2" radius outside the boundaries of the cable.  Although it is not ideal, the cable is quite good for the price.  It has provides better resolution than my real furutech 314ag cable.  My theory is that because it comprised of sterling silver conductors rather than pure copper, it may not attract as much interference.  I may be wrong but I believe silver is not as good an antenna as copper.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> I believe the gold foil is an aluminum shield but it is quite thin and definitely not enough to properly shield this cable.
> 
> As I have tested with a NC voltage detector, it does emit an emf with about a 2" radius outside the boundaries of the cable.  Although it is not ideal, the cable is quite good for the price.  It has provides better resolution than my real furutech 314ag cable.  My theory is that because it comprised of sterling silver conductors rather than pure copper, it may not attract as much interference.  I may be wrong but I believe silver is not as good an antenna as copper.


I doubt it is pure silver. Probably only plated. 

Anyone tried the Argento flow cord?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Pure silver AC  cord - #   3256801792402434


----------



## dougms3

I will tell you guys something, maybe most of you know already this or have an idea at least.  Long winded post warning.

Working in various fields in my lifetime, I've see how little the Chinese manufacturers care about patents, its basically free designs for them to copy as they see fit.

A friend who owns a company that manufactures rivets, screws, bolts told me that at trade shows, the chinese manufacturers would send people to take pictures of designs or even bribe security guards so they could steal things at these shows.  They would also pay for him to goto china to help improve manufacturing techniques, quality control and just help improve things for them in general.  

I can't stress this enough because people forget, China is a communist country and they could care less about patent laws and such.  The government or companies like aliexpress will address complaints to comply with international laws but its half hearted and they only do it to appease plaintiffs and avoid lawsuits.  They are quite good at playing this game.  

I won't go into detail about it but if you know the story of what happened to qualcomm in china, this has happened to many companies in china and ruined them.  Basically, companies saw china as either a place to reduce manufacturing costs for their products and / or a place to open up shop to an enormous consumer market.  Countless companies fell for this trap.  

You can probably see where this going.  They basically copy the stuff that they are manufacturing for that company or steal their designs and sell it to others.  And if you try to take them to court in a communist country, take a guess who's going to win.  If you didn't know, any business in china cannot be owned by a foreign entity or person, they have to get a chinese national to put the company under their name.  Many a company hired a chinese national to open up shop in china only to have that person take control of the company then sue that company for copyright infringement and the like.  Quite a sleazy tactic but if these companies weren't so greedy they wouldn't find themselves in this kind of predicament.

They have been doing this thing for the past 30-40 years very quietly and successfully.  In about 7-8 years, chinese smart phone manufacturers have gone from nothing to one of the most advanced smartphones, quite an accomplishment.  We, the audiophile community have benefitted greatly from this.  Audio gear that most could not afford became very affordable.  In particular iems have flourished.  

As consumers, we benefit alot from this, as prices became very affordable due to the cutthroat pricing nature of the middlemen.  While I don't condone these things, I don't really care if these companies lose money because of their greed.  Granted some of these copies may be almost identical to the original but most of the time they are made of lesser quality.  But for example, if something like the odin cable can perform to even a fraction the original for a fraction of the price, I'd say thats a win.  Because to be honest, I'm never going to buy a $10k cable, they're not losing any business from me.

So while alot of these things are not quite up to par to the originals they copy, some of them are excellent for what they bring to the table and compared to equally priced products, they perform much better.  Grain of salt though, some things are not as good as others.  The whole point of creating this thread is to find the good stuff, perhaps I should have titled it better.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> I doubt it is pure silver. Probably only plated.
> 
> Anyone tried the Argento flow cord?


The conductors are silver, I cut the wire to verify that its is silver all around.  But as I mentioned before, it doesn't make sense price wise to be silver so its most likely sterling silver which is a silver/copper alloy and even then its probably a lower mix % of silver than the standard sterling silver.

The good news is that sterling silver is actually quite good, its superior to copper in conductivity.  

I have the argento flow xlrs but haven't tried the power cord.  Its really good


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The only version of “Odin” AC cable I would consider buying  # 3256802214685388    …


While the odin is good, its not the only delicious option on the table. 

This gryphon knockoff power cable I got is excellent.  It outperforms my furutech 314ag cable by a huge margin.  Depends on the characteristic you are looking to achieve in the chain.  It is very warm and adds alot of body and richness to the mids, the gold odin is better at treble accentuation and ultimate resolution.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2bWkiyD&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> I will tell you guys something, maybe most of you know already this or have an idea at least.  Long winded post warning.
> 
> Working in various fields in my lifetime, I've see how little the Chinese manufacturers care about patents, its basically free designs for them to copy as they see fit.
> 
> ...


The odin 2  pc is very good. The Dragon is excellent. The Siltech DC speaker cables as well. Great values. The regular Odins are also great on my digital gears. All in all, i am very satisfied with the results. Of course, i know it's not the real thing but it is not so far off IMO. I would never consider buying a 40K speaker cable set. Of course...


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> The only version of “Odin” AC cable I would consider buying  # 3256802214685388    …


I can't search by number, how do you do it?


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I can't search by number, how do you do it?


Just put the # in the search bar but make sure theres no spaces before or after the numbers.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> The conductors are silver, I cut the wire to verify that its is silver all around.  But as I mentioned before, it doesn't make sense price wise to be silver so its most likely sterling silver which is a silver/copper alloy and even then its probably a lower mix % of silver than the standard sterling silver.
> 
> The good news is that sterling silver is actually quite good, its superior to copper in conductivity.
> 
> I have the argento flow xlrs but haven't tried the power cord.  Its really good


I don't know what the mix is but an once of silver is 18usd and you need over 3 onces for a 1.5m 14 awg cable...


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> The odin 2  pc is very good. The Dragon is excellent. The Siltech DC speaker cables as well. Great values. The regular Odins are also great on my digital gears. All in all, i am very satisfied with the results. Of course, i know it's not the real thing but it is not so far off IMO. I would never consider buying a 40K speaker cable set. Of course...


ODIN Gold Power cable is also cen be super in terms of conductors and ideas if  put a stocking on it, a screen and ground it.
It will not be so beautiful looking, but maybe even better Odin 2 and so on .


----------



## dougms3

Dammit I ran into a problem when trying to upgrade my powervar PLC.  

The duplexes I bought won't fit because of the extended straps.  Anyone know of any other good options for a cheap duplex with the short backstraps?  Also if you guys find any ring or y spade terminals for the duplex, would be greatly appreciated.

Something like this but if anyone sees a better price lmk, thanks.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...00025126819359!sea&curPageLogUid=gNi9z7LpVJEF


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I believe the gold foil is an aluminum shield but it is quite thin and definitely not enough to properly shield this cable.
> 
> As I have tested with a NC voltage detector, it does emit an emf with about a 2" radius outside the boundaries of the cable.  Although it is not ideal, the cable is quite good for the price.  It has provides better resolution than my real furutech 314ag cable.  My theory is that because it comprised of sterling silver conductors rather than pure copper, it may not attract as much interference.  I may be wrong but I believe silver is not as good an antenna as copper.


I tested . This is NOT foil . This is Holiday decor film gold color . Did you try tested with a NC voltage detector ODIN 2. Thanks


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> I tested . This is NOT foil . This is Holiday decor film gold color . Did you try tested with a NC voltage detector ODIN 2. Thanks


I dont think all Odin gold is the same.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I tested . This is NOT foil . This is Holiday decor film gold color . Did you try tested with a NC voltage detector ODIN 2. Thanks


I only have the gold odin, don't have the odin2, it leaks some emi.

https://imgur.com/9DQjYAw


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I only have the gold odin, don't have the odin2, it leaks some emi.
> 
> https://imgur.com/9DQjYAw


Thank you . Yes, I've seen this before. Yesterday I did the cleaning and threw away what I need today. I will try to put the screen on ODIN gold Power , grounding the side of the source. I liked the cable itself because it has minimal contact with the insulation. This is real pis of art not like Argento Flow simple wire .


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Thank you . Yes, I've seen this before. Yesterday I did the cleaning and threw away what I need today. I will try to put the screen on ODIN gold Power , grounding the side of the source. I liked the cable itself because it has minimal contact with the insulation. This is real pis of art not like Argento Flow simple wire .


For additional shielding, you could trying spiral wrapping 3M copper tape around the outside then wrap with teflon tape.  It wont be pretty anymore but it might offer some additional shielding.


----------



## pashkaam

szore said:


> I dont think all Odin gold is the same.


Everything is simple in China. There are kilometers of wire from which different wires are made. For example, an interconnect cable, when replacing a plug, can turn into a USB wire. They mold and resell. The golden ODIN Power is definitely without foil, but it has an interesting, cool wire, as I wrote, with the least contact with the insulation, silver-plated.
For example, ODIN 2 Interconnect is USB, it's just a super idea, each wire has a screen foil and a dielectric inside the wire, it turns out a pipe for magnetic waves inside the wire.
The foil inside ODIN 2 can not be grounded, we get a wire with interference.


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 23, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> For additional shielding, you could trying spiral wrapping 3M copper tape around the outside then wrap with teflon tape.  It wont be pretty anymore but it might offer some additional shielding.


Yes, can build like this. I was thinking of taking the easier route. Cut aluminum food foil, and pull the screen off from the television antenna wire, the screen can be easily removed. Then, on top of everything,  can stretch a decorative mesh that is wrapped around expensive wires, like wire sleeve The screen must be grounded on one side.
​


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Dammit I ran into a problem when trying to upgrade my powervar PLC.
> 
> The duplexes I bought won't fit because of the extended straps.  Anyone know of any other good options for a cheap duplex with the short backstraps?  Also if you guys find any ring or y spade terminals for the duplex, would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> ...



Monosaudio Pure Copper Power Wall Mount,20A 125V Audio Outlet Hi End Duplex Receptacle (Rhodium Plated Without Fixing Bracket) – Amazon has it (I’ve purchased 5) on sale with 20% discount ATM…  At this price point I can only recommend Oyaide R1 from Japan (around 56 USD+ shipping) but I’m not sure if the bracket can be removed…

I have purchased Genuine Furutech FP209-10 R for power cables , but they are not delivered yet…Around $17 via Zenmarket proxy-shopping service…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> While the odin is good, its not the only delicious option on the table.
> 
> This gryphon knockoff power cable I got is excellent.  It outperforms my furutech 314ag cable by a huge margin.  Depends on the characteristic you are looking to achieve in the chain.  It is very warm and adds alot of body and richness to the mids, the gold odin is better at treble accentuation and ultimate resolution.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2bWkiyD&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


Agree… even if this “clone” brings 70-80% of the original I’m happy at this price point…

I own 4 “Dragons” . I think it’s the best price-wise option for the system I’m building ATM…

IMHO what is the best / worth trying on ALI ATM : WEL <The REAL Odin2 <The Dragon <Siltech triple crown….


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> I can't search by number, how do you do it?


 Just copy and paste the number into "I'm shopping for"  Search  field...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I will tell you guys something, maybe most of you know already this or have an idea at least.  Long winded post warning.
> 
> Working in various fields in my lifetime, I've see how little the Chinese manufacturers care about patents, its basically free designs for them to copy as they see fit.
> 
> ...


This is off topic , but I feel I should reply…
We can purchase copies of these 20-80K products b/c it’s allowed by the real “Owners” Just like music or movies… You can purchase or download for free.. Both options are allowed …
In pursuit of “Happiness” some will purchase these 20 K interconnects and will not notice the bill , some will have to give an arm and a leg for the cable … Some will not be able to purchase it at all ….As long as we playing “the game” it’s allowed…
It’s not about the money at all… Mind control this is what matters the most for the “Owners”…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Monosaudio Pure Copper Power Wall Mount,20A 125V Audio Outlet Hi End Duplex Receptacle (Rhodium Plated Without Fixing Bracket) – Amazon has it (I’ve purchased 5) on sale with 20% discount ATM…  At this price point I can only recommend Oyaide R1 from Japan (around 56 USD+ shipping) but I’m not sure if the bracket can be removed…
> 
> I have purchased Genuine Furutech FP209-10 R for power cables , but they are not delivered yet…Around $17 via Zenmarket proxy-shopping service…


Thanks I got 3 of them off Amazon.  20% off each one, cheaper than aliexpress.

I also found this while looking around.

$16 for monosaudio silver carbon fiber rhodium iec and ac plug.

https://www.amazon.com/Hi-End-Trans...5A-Rhodium/dp/B08QS4FR24?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> ODIN Gold Power cable is also cen be super in terms of conductors and ideas if  put a stocking on it, a screen and ground it.
> It will not be so beautiful looking, but maybe even better Odin 2 and so on .


Unfortunately now we have too many versions of  the “Odin” available on Ali… From like $20 to 400 USD (Don't matter if gold or silver foil used)… As far as I understand they are using 2 wires (Valhalla and The real Odin 2 wire). If you like The Valhalla get the 15 core version ( around $35 for 1 M) If you want to try the real Odin 2 get the Odin 2 wire ( Around $80 for 1M) … Better replace these plugs as well … My Idea is The real Odin 2 wire with Furutech FP209-10 R spades + Monosaudio M106/F106 plugs …. Around $140 for 1M + labor…


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Thanks I got 3 of them off Amazon.  20% off each one, cheaper than aliexpress.
> 
> I also found this while looking around.
> 
> ...


Wow $17.18 that's awesome. Bought 1 pair.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Wow $17.18 that's awesome. Bought 1 pair.


Bought this also for $55, gonna compare it to the odin usb cable I have.  Its listed for $108 on aliexpress.  If its not up to par, at least I can return it.  

https://www.amazon.com/Monosaudio-F...nter/dp/B09KRL5KTW?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1&psc=1


----------



## pashkaam

Today I got from ebay 4 for $45 each flux 50 .


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Today I got from ebay 4 for $45 each flux 50 .


Good find.


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Today I got from ebay 4 for $45 each flux 50 .


This is cheap. If paid like 80 on ali.


----------



## FredA

Speaking of bargains

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004220227551.html


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> Good find.


Last night was $48.40
Today he raised a little to $61.58 after I bought 4.

The main thing is that they work and change the sound. I'm more interested in the three-dimensional image in sound.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Last night was $48.40
> Today he raised a little to $61.58 after I bought 4.
> 
> The main thing is that they work and change the sound. I'm more interested in the three-dimensional image in sound.


Lol a similar thing happened to me with the seller from AliExpress.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Speaking of bargains
> 
> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004220227551.html


Dammit Fred, I don't even need this but I bought one in anticipation of the LHY audio ock-1 that I plan on buying at sometime in the future.


----------



## FredA (Oct 24, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Dammit Fred, I don't even need this but I bought one in anticipation of the LHY audio ock-1 that I plan on buying at sometime in the future.


Good idea. I can't say for sure how good the cable is until i try it on my own dac, but it certainly is as good as anything under 100$. And that it has got two solid recommendarions, including one by PLGA. My impression is it is is close to the Gustard c2. I will know for sure when i try it on the dac. The cable is stiff but bendable. It has to be pre-bent prior to installation, otherwise it will put stress on the connectors.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> Good idea. I can't say for sure how good the cable is until i try it on my own dac, but it certainly is as good as anything under 100$. And that it has got two solid recommendarions, including one by PLGA. My impression is it is is close to the Gustard c2. I will know for sure when i try it on the dac. The cable is stiff but bendable. It has to be pre-bent prior to installation, otherwise it will put stress on the connectors.


Purchased that cable off e-bay as well, Thanks… Will see how it’s going to perform against the C2 and Cybershaft Blue 50 Ohm…


----------



## LocalMotion

Some Odin spaghetti


----------



## szore

LocalMotion said:


> Some Odin spaghetti


How does it sound?


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> Some Odin spaghetti


Lol i thought my mess of wires was bad.  always have someone watch you when adjusting those cables. 

Otherwise one day they may find a severely decomposed corpse with a smile entangled in that jungle of cables.


----------



## LocalMotion

szore said:


> How does it sound?



All but two new power cords (as of yesterday) have about 200hrs on them... and I'm pleasantly surprised how good they are. I have about $3k MSRP in name brand cables I'm going to start selling off, as I'm convinced these are as good or better.


----------



## Rick_B

dougms3 said:


> Dammit Fred, I don't even need this but I bought one in anticipation of the LHY audio ock-1 that I plan on buying at sometime in the future.


The linked cables are 50 Ohm impedance, is the LHY setup for 50 or 75 Ohm cabling?  
The BNCs on the pictures of the unit suggest 75 Ohm connections.
50 Ohm cables will attach, but 75 Ohm ones will match the impedance of the circuit.


----------



## dougms3

Rick_B said:


> The linked cables are 50 Ohm impedance, is the LHY setup for 50 or 75 Ohm cabling?
> The BNCs on the pictures of the unit suggest 75 Ohm connections.
> 50 Ohm cables will attach, but 75 Ohm ones will match the impedance of the circuit.


The di20 is 50 ohms and the ock1 can be customized to have one or all outputs to be 50or 75 ohms.


----------



## runningwitit

Crypt Keeper said:


> Unfortunately now we have too many versions of  the “Odin” available on Ali… From like $20 to 400 USD (Don't matter if gold or silver foil used)… As far as I understand they are using 2 wires (Valhalla and The real Odin 2 wire). If you like The Valhalla get the 15 core version ( around $35 for 1 M) If you want to try the real Odin 2 get the Odin 2 wire ( Around $80 for 1M) … Better replace these plugs as well … My Idea is The real Odin 2 wire with Furutech FP209-10 R spades + Monosaudio M106/F106 plugs …. Around $140 for 1M + labor…


What seller are you using with link please??
Thanx!!


----------



## pashkaam

People who have experience with a return to AliExpress?
Help.
I bought an Argento FLOW RCA interconnect , cable without shield   . It is not possible to do this because the cable is without a screen, work like antenna it seems that this is the original idea.
I applied for a return, paid $ 270, the seller first gave me an offer of $ 250, then $ 260, I asked his return address, he said what would happen when you confirm the agreement ,  return US address on the box . I foolishly confirmed the agreement of $260 and a Chinese address popped up for me. I looked at how much shipping would cost me and was stunned.


What to do ? How to get my money and for the shipment?
Is it possible now to reject and start all over again because now I have to send cable and I see no other option. Can i  call AliExpress?
Thank you .
This is Cable on AliExpress :
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...6lRG1Kr&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> People who have experience with a return to AliExpress?
> Help.
> I bought an Argento FLOW RCA interconnect , cable without shield   . It is not possible to do this because the cable is without a screen, work like antenna it seems that this is the original idea.
> I applied for a return, paid $ 270, the seller first gave me an offer of $ 250, then $ 260, I asked his return address, he said what would happen when you confirm the agreement ,  return US address on the box . I foolishly confirmed the agreement of $260 and a Chinese address popped up for me. I looked at how much shipping would cost me and was stunned.
> ...


I'm sorry to say, the option is to either pay the return shipping or keep it.

Once you lose the dispute with aliexpress for seller covered return, if you don't ship it back, you won't get a refund.  They won't refund the shipping fee either, no matter what promises they make.

Once they have you in this position, they get real dickish.  Both aliexpress cs and the seller.


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> People who have experience with a return to AliExpress?
> Help.
> I bought an Argento FLOW RCA interconnect , cable without shield   . It is not possible to do this because the cable is without a screen, work like antenna it seems that this is the original idea.
> I applied for a return, paid $ 270, the seller first gave me an offer of $ 250, then $ 260, I asked his return address, he said what would happen when you confirm the agreement ,  return US address on the box . I foolishly confirmed the agreement of $260 and a Chinese address popped up for me. I looked at how much shipping would cost me and was stunned.
> ...


How much was the return shipping?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

runningwitit said:


> What seller are you using with link please??
> Thanx!!


 The Real Odin 2  Or Valhalla 15 core ?


----------



## pashkaam

szore said:


> How much was the return shipping?


Fedex $199.09


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> People who have experience with a return to AliExpress?
> Help.
> I bought an Argento FLOW RCA interconnect , cable without shield   . It is not possible to do this because the cable is without a screen, work like antenna it seems that this is the original idea.
> I applied for a return, paid $ 270, the seller first gave me an offer of $ 250, then $ 260, I asked his return address, he said what would happen when you confirm the agreement ,  return US address on the box . I foolishly confirmed the agreement of $260 and a Chinese address popped up for me. I looked at how much shipping would cost me and was stunned.
> ...


I see no Free return option or Local return option on the item. You will have to ship it back to China. But it’s not that expensive if you ship it USPS First-Class Package International Service ( 4lbs limit) 
You  can try  to dispute  the return shipping cost with "not as described claim", but probably you will have to send it back at your own cost or keep the item and receive a partial refund (equal to the return shipping cost or above) ...


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Real Odin 2  Or Valhalla 15 core ?


The wire for what, as an interconnect or for power?
 I found a good Russian forum on it with a lot of useful information on making DIY wires, a lot of information will need to be read.
Of course, it is better when the wire has minimal contact with the insulation. 

Valhalla needs to be screened, it's not a problem, you can take the screen from any TV cable.
The best cables with a screen, even power, otherwise what's the point in cleaning electricity if the wire works like an antenna.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> The wire for what, as an interconnect or for power?
> I found a good Russian forum on it with a lot of useful information on making DIY wires, a lot of information will need to be read.
> Of course, it is better when the wire has minimal contact with the insulation.
> 
> ...


Power  cables.


----------



## runningwitit (Oct 25, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Real Odin 2  Or Valhalla 15 core ?


The real odin 2 and gold power cables....i think i won't an xlr also.... Thank you my friend!!!!

Which do you like the best between the odin and valhalla??


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> The wire for what, as an interconnect or for power?
> I found a good Russian forum on it with a lot of useful information on making DIY wires, a lot of information will need to be read.
> Of course, it is better when the wire has minimal contact with the insulation.
> 
> ...


None of the analog interconnects i use have shields. I dont think it matters that much. I don't like the sound of shielded analog interconnects, generally speaking. I made many cables myself, all without shields.


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> Power  cables.




In this case, I would take for myself ODIN 2 in it 7x14AWG  and shielded.
ODIN  gold is not screened, this is a fake gold film and it has 7x17AWG. 

valhalla is good as an interconnect cable  if shielded DIY , but not for power. Again, this is my opinion.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

runningwitit said:


> The real odin 2 and gold power cables....i think i won't an xlr also.... Thank you my friend!!!!
> 
> Which do you like the best between the odin and valhalla??


IMHO, The real Odin 2 power cord is better than Valhalla… Is it better than 15 core Valhalla ? – IDK… Need to purchase the 15 core version and compare…

The real Odin2 Bulk - 3256802214685388, 2251832787347789

Valhalla 15 core Bulk – 3256803919901651

Valhalla 15 core cable - 3256802936896122


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> The wire for what, as an interconnect or for power?
> I found a good Russian forum on it with a lot of useful information on making DIY wires, a lot of information will need to be read.
> Of course, it is better when the wire has minimal contact with the insulation.
> 
> ...


Not sure what you mean by screened.

If the shielding is the only thing you're worried about, I think the dielectric works as a shield from emi as well, albeit not as effect as something like a copper or silver braided shield.  The cable may also have cotton or some other filler in it which also helps to shield the cable.

It will act as an antenna if its bare or very little shielding but theres alot of material in that argento cable, its very thick.  

I have the argento xlrs and they sound great, not getting any interference whatsoever.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> In this case, I would take for myself ODIN 2 in it 7x14AWG  and shielded.
> ODIN  gold is not screened, this is a fake gold film and it has 7x17AWG.
> 
> valhalla is good as an interconnect cable  if shielded DIY , but not for power. Again, this is my opinion.


Granted the shielding could be better on the odin cables but it still functions very well.  The gold film is a chemical treatment, just like the gold plated connectors on most rca or headphone connectors.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> In this case, I would take for myself ODIN 2 in it 7x14AWG  and shielded.
> ODIN  gold is not screened, this is a fake gold film and it has 7x17AWG.
> 
> valhalla is good as an interconnect cable  if shielded DIY , but not for power. Again, this is my opinion.


The real odin 2 seems to be fine…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The real odin 2 seems to be fine…


Man its gonna be a pain to solder 3 of those to an rca postive terminal.


----------



## runningwitit

Crypt Keeper said:


> IMHO, The real Odin 2 power cord is better than Valhalla… Is it better than 15 core Valhalla ? – IDK… Need to purchase the 15 core version and compare…
> 
> The real Odin2 Bulk - 3256802214685388, 2251832787347789
> 
> ...


Could you recommend a reliable seller please??


----------



## Crypt Keeper

runningwitit said:


> Could you recommend a reliable seller please??


I have no experience with these sellers, This is what’s the best price-wise ATM… Just copy and paste item number into the “I’m shopping for” field.


----------



## szore

runningwitit said:


> Could you recommend a reliable seller please??


I bought my cables from RM Digital Store


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> None of the analog interconnects i use have shields. I dont think it matters that much. I don't like the sound of shielded analog interconnects, generally speaking. I made many cables myself, all without shields.


I also used to think that unshielded wire is better. I made a shielded cable and it sounds realistic.
We fight parasitic interference by installing filters and at the same time we are sold unshielded wires.
Why are expensive Power cables shielded?


We know little about what electricity is or rather nothing.


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> I also used to think that unshielded wire is better. I made a shielded cable and it sounds realistic.
> We fight parasitic interference by installing filters and at the same time we are sold unshielded wires.
> Why are expensive Power cables shielded?
> 
> ...


Not to mention different metals in IEM cables and why they change the sound....


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> I also used to think that unshielded wire is better. I made a shielded cable and it sounds realistic.
> We fight parasitic interference by installing filters and at the same time we are sold unshielded wires.
> Why are expensive Power cables shielded?
> 
> ...


 I would say: "We MUST know little about what electricity is or rather nothing "


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> Not sure what you mean by screened.
> 
> If the shielding is the only thing you're worried about, I think the dielectric works as a shield from emi as well, albeit not as effect as something like a copper or silver braided shield.  The cable may also have cotton or some other filler in it which also helps to shield the cable.
> 
> ...


You will unplug the cable from the source and hear .
The Argento cable does not make noise as it is always under load, but actively catches everything around. My Antelope Zodiac DAC turns off if there is no signal, and noise starts. A dielectric can never be a noise shield for a wire.
The dielectric also creates problems for the sound, without the sound is open, voluminous,.....


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 25, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> I have the argento xlrs and they sound great, not getting any interference whatsoever.


I forgot to ask, in comparison FLOW with ODIN 2, what's the difference?
What burning time for Argento flow ?
Thanks


----------



## FredA (Oct 25, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> I also used to think that unshielded wire is better. I made a shielded cable and it sounds realistic.
> We fight parasitic interference by installing filters and at the same time we are sold unshielded wires.
> Why are expensive Power cables shielded?
> 
> ...


With power cables, when used on a power amp, much noise is generated by the amp (a current swing causes radiations) itself inside the cable. So shielding the cable makes things worse because it traps that EM noise, unless there is some system inside the cable to dissipate it. So applying a shield has its drawbacks in this case. As for balanced connection, or  rca connections towards a differential input, unless the source of noise is really close to the cable, the noise will mostly be eliminated by the input because equivalent on the two conductors, except the very high frequencies. 

A signal is first and foremost transmitted as an EM wave. The shield will act as a waveguide and influence the sound. So indeed these are not simple things to fully comprehend and this is why cables have evolved so much during the last 20y. I am happy to report that cables really improved. at least this is my own experience.

I am not against shielding analog signal cables but all of the best i have tried were not.

Signal transmission is not easy to model, analyze or comprehend. I don't pretend i do.


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> With power cables, when used on a power amp, much noise is generated by the amp itself inside the cable. So shielding the cable makes things worse because it traps that EM noise, unless there is some system inside the cable to dissipate it. So applying a shield has its drawbacks in this case. As for balanced connection, or  rca connections towards a differential input, unless the source of noise is really close to the cable, the noise will mostly be eliminated by the input because equivalent on the two conductors, except the very high frequencies.
> 
> A signal is first and foremost transmitted as an EM wave. The shield will act as a waveguide and influence the sound. So indeed these are not simple things to fully comprehend and this is why cables have evolved so much during the last 20y. I am happy to report that cables really improved. at least this is my own experience.
> 
> I am not against shielding analog signal cables but all of the best i have tried were not.


I have good experience with shielding when the shield is connected from the power amp side and not from the DAC side. . My next idea DIY was all the same as Argento Flow's but with a screen connected from the amplifier side.


----------



## runningwitit

szore said:


> I bought my cables from RM Digital Store


Nice store!!
Ty!


----------



## LocalMotion

runningwitit said:


> Nice store!!
> Ty!


I’ve also had excellent results with these two stores:
 “Sound Labs” 
“Audio Aceesary”


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Re: Odin2
The Valhalla inside . Confirmed by the Seller…


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> Re: Odin2
> The Valhalla inside . Confirmed by the Seller…


Can I have a link to see the cross section and the number of conductors if indicated? Thanks .


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Can I have a link to see the cross section and the number of conductors if indicated? Thanks .


Item # 2251832444596357


----------



## LocalMotion

Crypt Keeper said:


> Re: Odin2
> The Valhalla inside . Confirmed by the Seller…



I'd be hard pressed to trust anything they say  
The listing states 
Conductors: 7 x 14 AWG

How is that Valhalla? thought that was 15


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> I'd be hard pressed to trust anything they say
> The listing states
> Conductors: 7 x 14 AWG
> 
> How is that Valhalla? thought that was 15


Have no Idea how thy measure it up to 14 AWG, but if it’s 7 core Valhalla, better get the 15 core version for $50 …


----------



## pashkaam

LocalMotion said:


> I'd be hard pressed to trust anything they say
> The listing states
> Conductors: 7 x 14 AWG
> 
> How is that Valhalla? thought that was 15


Odin 2 has 7x14 . Perhaps the wire itself is 14AWG with  technology as in the Valhalla wire. This is actually better than a wire filled with a dielectric.
The less the wire touches the insulation, the better.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Odin 2 has 7x14 . Perhaps the wire itself is 14AWG with  technology as in the Valhalla wire. This is actually better than a wire filled with a dielectric.
> The less the wire touches the insulation, the better.


I think you're giving them too much credit, theres probably not any high level tech in these cables.  They typically don't measure things in AWG, usually they go by mm.  The wire is solid core sterling silver.  I disagree about the dielectric.  Theres a reason why the higher end cables tend to be thick.  Air is the best dielectric and if it were practical, I would go air gapped teflon sleeve pure silver.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I think you're giving them too much credit, theres probably not any high level tech in these cables.  They typically don't measure things in AWG, usually they go by mm.  The wire is solid core sterling silver.  I disagree about the dielectric.  Theres a reason why the higher end cables tend to be thick.  Air is the best dielectric and if it were practical, I would go air gapped teflon sleeve pure silver.


Yep, Tubulus uses this concept for their cables “air insulation - because (next to a vacuum) air is the best dielectric”  But I seriously doubt any Odin is Sterling silver b/c sterling silver  wire  would be much more expensive … I would guess, 7 cores around 500-1000 USD per 1 M… I think it’s silver plated and Valhalla is inferior to the real Odin 2 wire ( They call it – “Supreme Reference wire”)


----------



## dougms3

Got the monosaudio formula usb cable in today.

Build quality is excellent and comes with a fancy velvet bag that I suppose one could use for covering someone's head during a kidnapping, autoerotic asphyxiation or other fun activities.




Initial impressions are that its sounds like it has a little more body in the mids but not much difference from the odin usb cable I have.  I'll let it burn in for a while then A/B them to see if theres any difference.


----------



## cdacosta

I am still in the market and looking for an excellent SATA cable that is not in the hundreds.   Any ideas or thoughts?


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yep, Tubulus uses this concept for their cables “air insulation - because (next to a vacuum) air is the best dielectric”  But I seriously doubt any Odin is Sterling silver b/c sterling silver  wire  would be much more expensive … I would guess, 7 cores around 500-1000 USD per 1 M… I think it’s silver plated and Valhalla is inferior to the real Odin 2 wire ( They call it – “Supreme Reference wire”)


Well I say sterling silver but the exact mixture is 92.5% silver and the rest copper.  I don't think they're using 92.5% but any silver/copper alloy is going to be a better conductor than pure copper or spc.

Also got the monosaudio plug and iec, looks even better than the furutech knockoff.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Well I say sterling silver but the exact mixture is 92.5% silver and the rest copper.  I don't think they're using 92.5% but any silver/copper alloy is going to be a better conductor than pure copper or spc.
> 
> Also got the monosaudio plug and iec, looks even better than the furutech knockoff.


Received mine last night. Nice and heavy plug Indeed ! I hope this one from Monosaudio will be on sale in November as well …


----------



## szore

lol, you guys are crazy. I look at you and I see me in 6 months! 

Man, I may just be a rube, but I'm pretty blown away just with the Odin PCable, xlr and usb! Granted I have the power conditioner too, but I am just floored at how good my system sounds right now. I don't even have the nano liquid yet, not even thinking about that, I'm just giddy at how awesome this is!!! lol, just had to share that!


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I am still in the market and looking for an excellent SATA cable that is not in the hundreds.   Any ideas or thoughts?


I think thats going to be a difficult one to find.



Crypt Keeper said:


> Received mine last night. Nice and heavy plug Indeed ! I hope this one from Monosaudio will be on sale in November as well …


Is that one better than the one with carbon fiber?

The reason I like carbon fiber on the plug is that it mitigates some of the noise generated by the 60hz oscillation.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

I really like the carbon fiber one, It’s heavy and top quality , but they didn’t put this in the description *“Conductor- Brass”*





So I think, Monosaudio M106/F106 will be better. It looks like a high quality clone of Furutech FI-46 …


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I have the argento xlrs and they sound great, not getting any interference whatsoever.


I forgot to ask, in comparison FLOW with ODIN 2, what's the difference ?
What burning time for Argento flow ?
Thanks


----------



## DenverW

pashkaam said:


> Today I got from ebay 4 for $45 each flux 50 .


they crabked the price up to $75 or so; I offered $50 for one and they rejected me.  I wrote them back and told them I’d just wait for 11.11 and they wrote back saying they’d accept $50 if I give them positive feedback.  Order placed, interested if this will make any difference at all!


----------



## pashkaam

DenverW said:


> they crabked the price up to $75 or so; I offered $50 for one and they rejected me.  I wrote them back and told them I’d just wait for 11.11 and they wrote back saying they’d accept $50 if I give them positive feedback.  Order placed, interested if this will make any difference at all!


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I forgot to ask, in comparison FLOW with ODIN 2, what's the difference ?
> What burning time for Argento flow ?
> Thanks


Its been a while since I compared them but I remember the argento being better overall at everything.

In particular it sounded richer in the mids, more bass and sounded more open.  I don't remember specific details though.

Probably gonna need a good 200 hours at least, I'm not sure how big the conductors are but I assume they're pretty big since the wire looks thick.  Thicker the wire the longer the burn in time required.


----------



## dougms3

Perhaps these will show up on AliExpress also.  Hoping for an 11.11 sale on this one.

Chinese military robot dog with a light machine gun mounted on the back.  It doesn't look like an exact copy of the Boston dynamics robot so they probably didnt absolutely steal that tech


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> Its been a while since I compared them but I remember the argento being better overall at everything.
> 
> In particular it sounded richer in the mids, more bass and sounded more open.  I don't remember specific details though.
> 
> Probably gonna need a good 200 hours at least, I'm not sure how big the conductors are but I assume they're pretty big since the wire looks thick.  Thicker the wire the longer the burn in time required.


Excellent thank you . If Argento Flow is good and better than Odin 2 then what is currently in your music system? Why didn't you stay with Orgento?
thanks


----------



## pashkaam

Does anyone have any ideas on how to mute pickups on an unshielded interconnect cable ? The fact is that the Argento flow Interconnect cable does not have any protection shielding at all. The wire makes terrible noise if the DAC turns off when there is no signal. If I pause the music, the DAC sees the signal and is in working mode and everything is quiet.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Excellent thank you . If Argento Flow is good and better than Odin 2 then what is currently in your music system? Why didn't you stay with Orgento?
> thanks


The odin 2 i use the preamp out put from my amp to my hybrid tube amp.  Dac to amp is argento.


pashkaam said:


> Does anyone have any ideas on how to mute pickups on an unshielded interconnect cable ? The fact is that the Argento flow Interconnect cable does not have any protection shielding at all. The wire makes terrible noise if the DAC turns off when there is no signal. If I pause the music, the DAC sees the signal and is in working mode and everything is quiet.


Is it making noise when it's plugged in?

Because to be honest i feel like any cable will make noise when doing that because it's electrically charged with an open end.  Its probably picking up EMI for a moment.

If you're not hearing any noise while plugged in, i don't see what the problem is.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> The odin 2 i use the preamp out put from my amp to my hybrid tube amp.  Dac to amp is argento.
> 
> Is it making noise when it's plugged in?
> 
> ...


Тhe Signal from PC -- going to DAC if no signal ( I stop playing music ) DAC is turns off the output . DAC connected with amplifier does not have a closed circuit, from which there is a large noise like cable disconnect from DAC  .


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Тhe Signal from PC -- going to DAC if no signal ( I stop playing music ) DAC is turns off the output . DAC connected with amplifier does not have a closed circuit, from which there is a large noise like cable disconnect from DAC  .


Sounds like a ground loop issue ... Have you tried differen XLRs ? Same issue with RCAs ?


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> Sounds like a ground loop issue ... Have you tried differen XLRs ? Same issue with RCAs ?


My amplifier  can take only RCA plugs . On DAC Antelope Zodiac have two different output RCA and XLR Balance . 
All time if cable not shielded I got noise because DAC without signal going like standby and cut signal and ground line  output . If cable shielded no problem / My DIY cable is grounded from amplifier side all OK


----------



## dougms3 (Oct 27, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> My amplifier  can take only RCA plugs . On DAC Antelope Zodiac have two different output RCA and XLR Balance .
> All time if cable not shielded I got noise because DAC without signal going like standby and cut signal and ground line  output . If cable shielded no problem / My DIY cable is grounded from amplifier side all OK


Ok, I unplugged one of the xlrs while everything was on, no unusual sound or anything, just dead silence.

It could be your particular setup. Or maybe because its rca, when you unplug the rca the negative disconnects before the positive.

What is your chain?  Are you using a PLC?


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Does anyone have any ideas on how to mute pickups on an unshielded interconnect cable ? The fact is that the Argento flow Interconnect cable does not have any protection shielding at all. The wire makes terrible noise if the DAC turns off when there is no signal. If I pause the music, the DAC sees the signal and is in working mode and everything is quiet.


In the past I have found on SE interconnects the only time I would get/pickup noise is when some thing was causing that noise.  On balanced interconnects I have never experienced noise.  So the first question is are you using SE or balanced interconnects?  Second question is have you isolated the piece of gear or source of the noise?  Third question is have you tried shielded interconnects and did that solve your noise issue?


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> My amplifier  can take only RCA plugs . On DAC Antelope Zodiac have two different output RCA and XLR Balance .
> All time if cable not shielded I got noise because DAC without signal going like standby and cut signal and ground line  output . If cable shielded no problem / My DIY cable is grounded from amplifier side all OK


I just asked you a few questions and I can see you are using SE interconnects.  Well the first obvious band aid or fix is use a shielded interconnect.  But if it were me I would want to find out "what" is actually generating the noise?  This part is tough.  Could be coming from AC, a specific piece of gear or something else that is effecting a piece of gear.  For example certain pieces of electronics like video monitors will generate EMI and RFI that can be picked up and amplified.  It is possible the noise is coming from upstream to your DAC or the source is outside the electrical connections of the audio system.  

With my headphone setup the amp and DAC are right next to three 24" monitors but because I am running all balanced I do not have a problem.  If I use SE cabling noise can be heard.  I personally have always preferred non-shielded interconnects sonically.  But sometimes a shielded cable is required unless the noise source can be determined and dealt with.


----------



## DecentLevi

pashkaam said:


> ODIN Gold Power cable is also cen be super in terms of conductors and ideas if  put a stocking on it, a screen and ground it.
> It will not be so beautiful looking, but maybe even better Odin 2 and so on .


Can you explain what do you mean by putting a stocking on it, a screen and ground it? Do you mean to specifically ground this cable in addition to the rest of your system somehow? I actually ordered some copper foil tape that I will play around with later.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 28, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> For additional shielding, you could trying spiral wrapping 3M copper tape around the outside then wrap with teflon tape.  It wont be pretty anymore but it might offer some additional shielding.


I resent this because I'm the one that came up with the copper shielding idea for Odin Gold first, and I want to patent it, LOL.. seriously though I may have been the first one to think of it around here, and I could show you the order date was before your comment, haha  ... though I won't have time to try it until the weekend.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Dammit Fred, I don't even need this but I bought one in anticipation of the LHY audio ock-1 that I plan on buying at sometime in the future.


Doung or @FredA do you know which connection type I would need for the DI-20 and LHY Ock-1? I'm guessing BNC Male to BNC Male? And is there anything that makes this cable better than generic ones?


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> Doung or @FredA do you know which connection type I would need for the DI-20 and LHY Ock-1? I'm guessing BNC Male to BNC Male? And is there anything that makes this cable better than generic ones?


It is sort of a generic one but it is bigger than normal, the conductor's gauge is bigger. Attenuation at 1Ghz is 10dB lower than with a rg400. So a square wave should come out squarer, which should make jitter lower. 

Yes, you need bnc male to bnc male. And consider ordering longer than you need. As i said many times, the cable is bendable and stiff. It has to be pre-bent prior to installation. This uses up some length.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> Ok, I unplugged one of the xlrs while everything was on, no unusual sound or anything, just dead silence.
> 
> It could be your particular setup. Or maybe because its rca, when you unplug the rca the negative disconnects before the positive.
> 
> What is your chain?  Are you using a PLC?


Have you disconnected the interconnect from the source?
Most likely, the XLR has a less sensitive input on the amplifier. For example the microphone input is very sensitive and will respond to any unshielded wires. Yes, the RCA is quite a sensitive input somewhere around 50kohm.
My chain is simple: Mac Mini through USB to DAC, And from DAC through RCA goes to amplifiers . 
What is PLC?


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Have you disconnected the interconnect from the source?
> Most likely, the XLR has a less sensitive input on the amplifier. For example the microphone input is very sensitive and will respond to any unshielded wires. Yes, the RCA is quite a sensitive input somewhere around 50kohm.
> My chain is simple: Mac Mini through USB to DAC, And from DAC through RCA goes to amplifiers .
> What is PLC?


I don't get this test. If the cable does not pick noise up when both ends are connected, there is no problem. Having the source unplugged gives a different situation, which is not representative.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> In the past I have found on SE interconnects the only time I would get/pickup noise is when some thing was causing that noise. On balanced interconnects I have never experienced noise. So the first question is are you using SE or balanced interconnects? Second question is have you isolated the piece of gear or source of the noise? Third question is have you tried shielded interconnects and did that solve your noise issue?



I have RCA wires from DAC to amplifier, CE signal , this is my DIY RCA interconnect ,  wire has two wires "+" and "-" plus  the independent shielding is connected to ground from the amplifier side. In this version, complete silence.





cdacosta said:


> I just asked you a few questions and I can see you are using SE interconnects. Well the first obvious band aid or fix is use a shielded interconnect. But if it were me I would want to find out "what" is actually generating the noise? This part is tough. Could be coming from AC, a specific piece of gear or something else that is effecting a piece of gear. For example certain pieces of electronics like video monitors will generate EMI and RFI that can be picked up and amplified. It is possible the noise is coming from upstream to your DAC or the source is outside the electrical connections of the audio system.
> 
> With my headphone setup the amp and DAC are right next to three 24" monitors but because I am running all balanced I do not have a problem. If I use SE cabling noise can be heard. I personally have always preferred non-shielded interconnects sonically. But sometimes a shielded cable is required unless the noise source can be determined and dealt with.


On amplifiers, the XLR input has a lower input impedance, so the input receives a more powerful signal, so interference is not audible.
Yes, my wire and in this case Argento FLOW has no shielding at all and the wire is separated from each other, it's a great idea that the wires do not interact with magnetic fields, good for sound. If I put a screen on the signal wire on Argento Flow, then the whole point of the wire to wake up is lost.
That's why I asked if it is possible to create an artificial ground if I put a shielding stocking on the signal wire by connecting it to an artificial ground ?

And yes noise can be activated if I touching  cable , light Dimmer make a lot of noise at night ,  noise is look like 60hz electricity .


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Have you disconnected the interconnect from the source?
> Most likely, the XLR has a less sensitive input on the amplifier. For example the microphone input is very sensitive and will respond to any unshielded wires. Yes, the RCA is quite a sensitive input somewhere around 50kohm.
> My chain is simple: Mac Mini through USB to DAC, And from DAC through RCA goes to amplifiers .
> What is PLC?


As cdacosta mentioned, the shielded interconnects are only a bandaid, the real issue is that you have probably have a ground loop or some other noise issue.

Pc/ laptop inject alot of noise into the audio chain.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> Can you explain what do you mean by putting a stocking on it, a screen and ground it? Do you mean to specifically ground this cable in addition to the rest of your system somehow? I actually ordered some copper foil tape that I will play around with later.


Yes ODIN Gold has no shielding. Gold is a common plastic film, NOT foil , but while the ODIN 2 has a good quality silver foil.
Yes,  need to put a shielding mesh on Odin Gold and connect it to the ground on one side wire. Aluminum shielding works better than copper shielding, less inductance

It is necessary to wind the adhesive foil tape from copper or aluminum foil correctly, otherwise you will get a mini transformer from the wire.

Yes, I made one   from Odin Gold so the wire is playing now, everything is fine, but another problem, the fear of God, how this wire began to look.


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> I don't get this test. If the cable does not pick noise up when both ends are connected, there is no problem. Having the source unplugged gives a different situation, which is not representative.


It's simple, My DAC turns off the output if there is no signal from the computer If the cable is shielded and grounded on the amplifier side, then there is no noise.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> As cdacosta mentioned, the shielded interconnects are only a bandaid, the real issue is that you have probably have a ground loop or some other noise issue.
> 
> Pc/ laptop inject alot of noise into the audio chain.


There are no problems with ground loop, the same story was when there was an optical cable from the computer to the DAC.

the problem : My DAC turns off the output if there is no incoming signal and noise is produced, the like as if the wire is not connected on the source side.

So I asked if it was possible to connect some kind of artificial earth, grounding


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 28, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I resent this because I'm the one came up with the copper shielding idea for Odin Gold first, and I want to patent it, LOL.. seriously though I may have been the first one to think of it around here, and I could show you the order date was before your comment, haha  ... though I won't have time to try it until the weekend.




Buy ODIN 2 silver with Valhalla inside you will get a shielded ODIN Gold.

If there is a two-polar power supply, then you can pull out the central 7 wire from ODIN Gold and put on the shielding screen over the golden beauty, connect it only to the source, you will get a very good power wire and even better the power wire for the DC as for the DAC with external power, changing the plug of course


----------



## dougms3

New toys.
Going to replace this.






With these.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> It's simple, My DAC turns off the output if there is no signal from the computer If the cable is shielded and grounded on the amplifier side, then there is no noise.


Your noise issue is not easily troubleshooted without seeing and trying different things with setup.   I would try the following:

- Have you tried moving your setup to a different area in your home that is utilizing a different AC circuit?
- Have your tried using battery power instead of AC to your MAC (source)?
- Have you tried using a different DAC than the one currently in the audio chain?

Above troubleshooting steps are to try and ascertain if it is the AC power, source, DAC, amp or something else possibly emitting the noise.  Almost a year ago I moved from a home with dedicated lines to an apartment.  The apartment AC power is very dirty and is easily detectable as soon as I remove the isolation PLCs (PLC= power line conditioner) and other AC conditioning gear from the system.   But with all the power conditioning gear I have on the system it does not matter the time of day, if air conditioning, any appliance, any type of lighting, etc. is running, my system sounds the same.  In short, to figure out the best solution to your noise problem is to find out why and what is causing the noise.  The noise even with the band-aid shielded interconnects is still raising the noise floor, which means sonic information is being masked.  My 2 cents


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> New toys.
> Going to replace this.
> 
> 
> ...


Are you changing the wire also?  Going from hospital grade $3 outlets to gold plated copper outlets should provide a more organic/natural presentation.  Will be interesting to see your perspective after break-in.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Are you changing the wire also?  Going from hospital grade $3 outlets to gold plated copper outlets should provide a more organic/natural presentation.  Will be interesting to see your perspective after break-in.


Yea, i have 14 awg neotech solid core occ copper with ptfe sleeving ready to go.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> New toys.
> Going to replace this.
> 
> 
> ...


I will also assume you are going to use the Nano Liquid on connections.  Do you have any fo.Q T-102 (preferred) or T-52?  If you do, place across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall.  Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts.  This will lower noise floor by minimizing ringing that will be caused by the AC power vibration.   I think we have discussed this in the past but just in case we have not.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Just


dougms3 said:


> New toys.
> Going to replace this.
> 
> 
> ...


Very nice Indeed ... I got same rhodium receptacles+ OYAIDE TUNAMI V2 cord for my  1000W Isolator  as well


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> There are no problems with ground loop, the same story was when there was an optical cable from the computer to the DAC.
> 
> the problem : My DAC turns off the output if there is no incoming signal and noise is produced, the like as if the wire is not connected on the source side.
> 
> So I asked if it was possible to connect some kind of artificial earth, grounding


Try heavy 1.5 kg grounding box ?  It may resolve your issue ...


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I will also assume you are going to use the Nano Liquid on connections.  Do you have any fo.Q T-102 (preferred) or T-52?  If you do, place across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall.  Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts.  This will lower noise floor by minimizing ringing that will be caused by the AC power vibration.   I think we have discussed this in the past but just in case we have not.


Of course i will be using nano liquid on all connections.

And ta102 tape.  Dont have any more ta32 tape left.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Of course i will be using nano liquid on all connections.
> 
> And ta102 tape.  Dont have any more ta32 tape left.


After you finish upgrading the PLC unit, try different digital gear on it.  To isolate from the analog (amplifier).  Fun project.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I will also assume you are going to use the Nano Liquid on connections.  Do you have any fo.Q T-102 (preferred) or T-52?  If you do, place across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall.  Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts.  This will lower noise floor by minimizing ringing that will be caused by the AC power vibration.   I think we have discussed this in the past but just in case we have not.


I have Q T-102 and Oyanide Denki tape on order. So just place QT-102  “across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall. Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts” ? Should I put some on the cover of the unit as well ? Thanks


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have Q T-102 and Oyanide Denki tape on order. So just place QT-102  “across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall. Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts” ? Should I put some on the cover of the unit as well ? Thanks


Dont over do it with the tape, I've found that overdamping causes problems.  It kills bass and dynamics when over used.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Dont over do it with the tape, I've found that overdamping causes problems.  It kills bass and dynamics when over used.


So just use a few on the ears ? Would be much appreciated If you cold share a few pics of your completed project … Thanks


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have Q T-102 and Oyanide Denki tape on order. So just place QT-102  “across the back strap and mounting ears between ears and wall. Can also be placed on each side of the outlet by the contacts” ? Should I put some on the cover of the unit as well ? Thanks


* Placing on the inside of PLC cover plate would not hurt, but I have not found that tweak to audibly change anything.   Only change which is slight would be on a wall outlet cover plate.

*I would also be very careful with the Oyaide EMI tape inside the PLC or on the outlets themselves.  Every time I have tried this I did not like the results.  This EMI tape is strong, in the wrong place will hurt sonics, just like ERS paper.  Where I have found "near 100%" success is around the connectors of power cords, both ends of the power cord.  What I do is cut a 6" length of the tape with backing still on.  Use a small piece of masking tape to hold the Oyaide EMI tape in place then listen.  If I like the change which will be immediate I permanently install the tape by removing the backing.   Only one power cord did not react sonically positive, this is why I say "near 100% success". 

If you have a package of fo.Q T-102 coming there are a lot of uses for it that will positively impact your sound system.  After you get it, share with me what you have tried and I can share with you where and how much within the system to try it.  I have been using fo.Q T-102 since 2010 or maybe before, love the product.  Like the Furutech Nano Liquid, one of the best inexpensive high performance audio system tweaks I have experienced.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> * Placing on the inside of PLC cover plate would not hurt, but I have not found that tweak to audibly change anything.   Only change which is slight would be on a wall outlet cover plate.
> 
> *I would also be very careful with the Oyaide EMI tape inside the PLC or on the outlets themselves.  Every time I have tried this I did not like the results.  This EMI tape is strong, in the wrong place will hurt sonics, just like ERS paper.  Where I have found "near 100%" success is around the connectors of power cords, both ends of the power cord.  What I do is cut a 6" length of the tape with backing still on.  Use a small piece of masking tape to hold the Oyaide EMI tape in place then listen.  If I like the change which will be immediate I permanently install the tape by removing the backing.   Only one power cord did not react sonically positive, this is why I say "near 100% success".
> 
> If you have a package of fo.Q T-102 coming there are a lot of uses for it that will positively impact your sound system.  After you get it, share with me what you have tried and I can share with you where and how much within the system to try it.  I have been using fo.Q T-102 since 2010 or maybe before, love the product.  Like the Furutech Nano Liquid, one of the best inexpensive high performance audio system tweaks I have experienced.


Thank you !


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> * Placing on the inside of PLC cover plate would not hurt, but I have not found that tweak to audibly change anything.   Only change which is slight would be on a wall outlet cover plate.
> 
> *I would also be very careful with the Oyaide EMI tape inside the PLC or on the outlets themselves.  Every time I have tried this I did not like the results.  This EMI tape is strong, in the wrong place will hurt sonics, just like ERS paper.  Where I have found "near 100%" success is around the connectors of power cords, both ends of the power cord.  What I do is cut a 6" length of the tape with backing still on.  Use a small piece of masking tape to hold the Oyaide EMI tape in place then listen.  If I like the change which will be immediate I permanently install the tape by removing the backing.   Only one power cord did not react sonically positive, this is why I say "near 100% success".
> 
> If you have a package of fo.Q T-102 coming there are a lot of uses for it that will positively impact your sound system.  After you get it, share with me what you have tried and I can share with you where and how much within the system to try it.  I have been using fo.Q T-102 since 2010 or maybe before, love the product.  Like the Furutech Nano Liquid, one of the best inexpensive high performance audio system tweaks I have experienced.


Sure , I will !  I said  QT -102   but  it's  the  TA 32  (I was able to find it cheap)


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Sure , I will !  I said  QT -102   but  it's  the  TA 32  (I was able to find it cheap)


What site is that?


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Sure , I will !  I said  QT -102   but  it's  the  TA 32  (I was able to find it cheap)


Wow, that is a steal of a deal!  Unless the shipping is $30 USD  LOL.

TA32 is not quite as strong as TA-102 but is more flexible in use because the material will bend.  When you get it and look at the product you will scratch your head and wonder "what the heck can this do?".  But once you try the material like I suggest it will pleasantly surprise you.  To the extent that you may consider this tweak as "the best bang for the buck tweak for audio".


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> Try heavy 1.5 kg grounding box ?  It may resolve your issue ...


It's interesting .  Where I can get this sweet stuff ?


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Your noise issue is not easily troubleshooted without seeing and trying different things with setup.   I would try the following:
> 
> - Have you tried moving your setup to a different area in your home that is utilizing a different AC circuit?
> - Have your tried using battery power instead of AC to your MAC (source)?
> ...


Thanks for the help . The electricity is certainly not ideal and clicks are heard when electrical dryer or something   is turned on.
 In my case, the DAC creates an open circuit in the signal, it just turns off the output and an open circuit is the same as pulling the connectors out of the DAC. Perhaps I need to buy adapters from XLR to RCA and at the input of the amplifier, extinguish the signal with a 10 kΩ resistance . I w'll try


----------



## Temple (Oct 28, 2022)

Looking at a couple speaker cable options for Ali and wanted to get some input on either.

They both look very similar but banana quality between the two is probably the biggest difference from what I can see.

https://m.aliexpress.com/i/2255800337031169.html?gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt

https://m.aliexpress.us/item/325680...apt=gloPc2usaMsite4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 28, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> What site is that?


ZenMarket.Jp - Proxy Buying Service for Japanese goods. You can consolidate a few items and then ship them all in 1 box via DHL 3-5 days once shipped … Usually works great for multiple items… Yahoo! Auctions.jp , Amazon.jp and Y! shopping.jp … The best pricing on all Furutech !


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Got the monosaudio formula usb cable in today.
> 
> Build quality is excellent and comes with a fancy velvet bag that I suppose one could use for covering someone's head during a kidnapping, autoerotic asphyxiation or other fun activities.
> 
> ...


Cool. I'm looking for a short USB cable that's slightly darker than Odin 2. Please report back after it's got some burn in time to let us know if that holds true, and about the dynamics perhaps. And what is the item number? I think you mean the seller Moonsaudio not Monosaudio, right?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> It's interesting .  Where I can get this sweet stuff ?


I have no ground loop issues so far but been using this heavy 16 Kg Grounding box for my front end with great success . Item # 2255800390848273 with solid silver Audiocrast grounding cables. This box is awesome … I’m considering getting another one… But my first grounding box was just the standard Aucharm item # 3256804506795238 1.5 Kg box and it works very good as well… Just toss away that crocodile clip and get proper grounding cables for each of your gears …


----------



## runningwitit

pashkaam said:


> Thanks for the help . The electricity is certainly not ideal and clicks are heard when electrical dryer or something   is turned on.
> In my case, the DAC creates an open circuit in the signal, it just turns off the output and an open circuit is the same as pulling the connectors out of the DAC. Perhaps I need to buy adapters from XLR to RCA and at the input of the amplifier, extinguish the signal with a 10 kΩ resistance . I w'll try


I would suggest adding audio labs dc blocker on computer to power conditioner... I had the same problem on my system and now it's dead quiet!


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 28, 2022)

I deleted my post, I wrote it wrong


----------



## pashkaam

runningwitit said:


> I would suggest adding audio labs dc blocker on computer to power conditioner... I had the same problem on my system and now it's dead quiet!


Here, thank you very much. DC blocker is a good thing and the circuit is not complicated, build DIY
_And how does the DC blocker affect the sound if connected to an amplifier?_
 I applied 2 phases to the amplifiers, naturally switched the voltage of 240v from 120v to 240v. The sound became instantly richer.
If possible, try it.
I wonder if you connect Mac Mini to 240v what will happen with the sound.


----------



## dougms3

That was more difficult than I was expecting.

Had to reuse the stock ground wiring because I didn't have enough wire to do the grounds.


----------



## runningwitit

The Audio Lab made the 60 hertz hiss louder and did not stop the popping/fuzz from playing through the speakers from amplifier. PLUS, it did nothing for the distorted haze around the vocal. Which was SUPER HIGHLY PRESENT at high valume and it made me crazy with disappointment.

I hooked it up to my computer and the haze was gone, no popping/fuzz or hiss.

The sound is now crystal clear with more space. The bass hits harder and is more pronounced. The vocals are more life like than I've heard from my get up! At times, it's very 3d!!


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> That was more difficult than I was expecting.
> 
> Had to reuse the stock ground wiring because I didn't have enough wire to do the grounds.


Apply the fo.Q across the backstrap of the outlet, not a small piece like you have it.  To be more specific, on each side of the backstrap bolt.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Apply the fo.Q across the backstrap of the outlet, not a small piece like you have it.  To be more specific, on each side of the backstrap bolt.


Ok, I'll let it burn in for a bit before adjusting.   

The level of noise reduction is pretty amazing.  I only have my pc, monitor and tv connected to it but its making a huge impact on the sound.

Hearing new details in music.  The background details are much more audible and clear.  Theres more bass and its tighter, more stage and depth.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 29, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> Yes ODIN Gold has no shielding. Gold is a common plastic film, NOT foil , but while the ODIN 2 has a good quality silver foil.
> Yes,  need to put a shielding mesh on Odin Gold and connect it to the ground on one side wire. Aluminum shielding works better than copper shielding, less inductance
> 
> It is necessary to wind the adhesive foil tape from copper or aluminum foil correctly, otherwise you will get a mini transformer from the wire.
> ...


Okay please post a few photos of your shielded cable. We don't discriminate... not me anyway


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> Okay please text me a few photos of your shielded cable. We don't discriminate... not me anyway


I don't think my scary-looking DIY ODIN Gold cable in the photo will explain anything.
It is necessary to stretch the shielding mesh and connect it to the ground on one side. And listen with and without it.
Do not change several upgrades at the same time.
Other :
As an example : I have been listening to Argento Flow all morning now .
That's interesting if you buy such a cable for $ 7K, the sound will be the same pressed or the brain will give a different image?
I put back my self-made DIY shielded interconnect cable  , the sound became airy, more three-dimensional, more freedom, details....
My wire does not have what Argento has a little density.
There are two options left either to hammer out alternative science or stupidly buy different wires.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 29, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Ok, I'll let it burn in for a bit before adjusting.
> 
> The level of noise reduction is pretty amazing.  I only have my pc, monitor and tv connected to it but its making a huge impact on the sound.
> 
> Hearing new details in music.  The background details are much more audible and clear.  Theres more bass and its tighter, more stage and depth.


I’m using EMI (Dirty Electricity) Meter/ noise sniffer to check my isolators . And my unmodified isolator VS direct to the wall shows: 600 Mv to 11 Mv drop ! I mean: the wall – 600 Mv Noise levels VS the isolator - 11 Mv . Amazing….


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> That was more difficult than I was expecting.
> 
> Had to reuse the stock ground wiring because I didn't have enough wire to do the grounds.


Do we need to replace grounding wires as well ?  I didn't put any nano liquid on the grounds . I thought it's not that important ?


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Ok, I'll let it burn in for a bit before adjusting.
> 
> The level of noise reduction is pretty amazing.  I only have my pc, monitor and tv connected to it but its making a huge impact on the sound.
> 
> Hearing new details in music.  The background details are much more audible and clear.  Theres more bass and its tighter, more stage and depth.


Try removing monitors and tv from it. Only PC, basically isolating the digital source from rest of system. If there is a change let me know.  I will share what else to try after you try the above.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Do we need to replace grounding wires as well ?  I didn't put any nano liquid on the grounds . I thought it's not that important ?


Yes, use Nano Liquid on “all” mechanical connections for best results.


----------



## cdacosta

cdacosta said:


> Try removing monitors and tv from it. Only PC, basically isolating the digital source from rest of system. If there is a change let me know.  I will share what else to try after you try the above.


Just to be clearer on the purpose of isolating your source or other digital gear away from analog (amp). By now I think you understand the importance AC power plays to the performance of a specific piece of gear. All digital gear bleed nasties back into the AC line, which contaminates the AC in the system.  The power supply in all but the highest grade or highest quality built power supplies in gear are very susceptible to AC coming into it.  By isolating the individual piece of gear minimizes the AC contamination, into system component (in your case PC) and back into the AC line that feeds the rest of the system. 

You will receive the purist or cleanest and voltage stable AC into PC/source by removing the monitors from the transformer based PLC.  Adding any contamination to the PC from the monitors or TV will be amplified to the rest of the audio system via the line level or digital output from PC.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Yes, use Nano Liquid on “all” mechanical connections for best results.


Gotcha ... I will   try it on my Grounding box /  cables   as well .... Thanks


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Try removing monitors and tv from it. Only PC, basically isolating the digital source from rest of system. If there is a change let me know.  I will share what else to try after you try the above.


Unfortunately, I can't remove the tv and monitor lol.  No where else to plug them in. 

The improvement is pretty crazy, its making everything sound so realistic.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Unfortunately, I can't remove the tv and monitor lol.  No where else to plug them in.
> 
> The improvement is pretty crazy, its making everything sound so realistic.


LOL I know there is a difference. Took awhile for me to talk you into trying a isolation device like a transformer based PLC remember?  

Well when you can I would try it, system performance will be improved. 

You are hearing more information  because the noise that is on the AC line is being blocked from your PC power supply. And also the noise generated by your PC is not bleeding into the AC line feeding the rest of your system.  Noise from dirty AC going into a component’s power supply will generate noise (think adding “noise floor”) to your component’s internal circuitry, which will reflect output performance (what you hear) of the component.  

I have learned some simple truths in my search for improving audio.  Aside the gear or components there are three main areas that when addressed always improve performance at an audible level.  Mechanical connections, AC and micro vibrations.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> LOL I know there is a difference. Took awhile for me to talk you into trying a isolation device like a transformer based PLC remember?
> 
> Well when you can I would try it, system performance will be improved.
> 
> ...


Lol its not that I didn't believe you, I just kept running into issues along the way of completing the project.

The yield is quite alot more than I was expecting.  Considering how much improvement it offers with only the PC connected to it.  Once its fully burned in, I'm gonna need to test out my other gear on it.  Its possible it may be even better than my furutech etp80.  Those audiocrast outlets are legit.

Right now its going through some fluctuations, the bass is massive, dare I say too much?

I spent about $230 in parts building that PLC.  For those that may be interested in building your own PLC on a budget this is an option.

$70 - Used Powervar medical grade power conditioner
$50 - Neotech 14 awg solid core OCC copper wire sleeved in teflon
$100 - 3x Audiocrast earless backstrap duplexes - 2 gold + 1 rhodium plated
$10 - Pure copper y spades

Optional (totally worth it)

$160 - Furutech Nano Liquid applied on all mechanical connections including in between ring terminals, nuts, bolts, and screws.

Side note, the wire used in the powervar plc is interesting.  Its difficult to see in the image but it has very thin copper strands maybe 12 or so if I had to guess, in the center of the wire with solid aluminum encasing the copper then sleeved in pvc.  It is 14awg, I've never seen this type of wire before.

I'm also going to get some pure copper washers and replace the cheap steel washers.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Lol its not that I didn't believe you, I just kept running into issues along the way of completing the project.
> 
> The yield is quite alot more than I was expecting.  Considering how much improvement it offers with only the PC connected to it.  Once its fully burned in, I'm gonna need to test out my other gear on it.  Its possible it may be even better than my furutech etp80.  Those audiocrast outlets are legit.
> 
> ...


Think of the unit as close to a separate line as possible.  But to get the most out of it you have to only have one component on it. Digital works best like source, DAC, router, etc. Headphone amp can work well but any amplifier that needs a large draw of instantaneous current nope.  

Once the outlets burn-in there are some further tweaks that can be applied.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Oct 29, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Think of the unit as close to a separate line as possible.  But to get the most out of it you have to only have one component on it. Digital works best like source, DAC, router, etc. Headphone amp can work well but any amplifier that needs a large draw of instantaneous current nope.
> 
> Once the outlets burn-in there are some further tweaks that can be applied.


What kind  of tweeks ?  If you  don't mind me asking ?  

I have similar project completed a  few weeks ago,  but  made  a mistake   with that crappy Ali wire... So now  awaiting Furutech FP-α3 from Japan so I can complete the project and finally apply the Nano all over… ( I have 3 Oyaide R1s cooking with the Frycorder ATM)
​


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Lol its not that I didn't believe you, I just kept running into issues along the way of completing the project.
> 
> The yield is quite alot more than I was expecting.  Considering how much improvement it offers with only the PC connected to it.  Once its fully burned in, I'm gonna need to test out my other gear on it.  Its possible it may be even better than my furutech etp80.  Those audiocrast outlets are legit.
> 
> ...


Did you  replace the AC cord as well ?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

🤣


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> What kind  of tweeks ?  If you  don't mind me asking ?
> 
> I have similar project completed a  few weeks ago,  but  made  a mistake   with that crappy Ali wire... So now  awaiting Furutech FP-α3 from Japan so I can complete the project and finally apply the Nano all over… ( I have 3 Oyaide R1s cooking with the Frycorder ATM)
> ​


1) replace power cord
2) fo.Q to power switch
3) One or two Hammond 193L or H choke to smooth current further. Easiest way is to plug into spare outlet. 
4 spare unused outlets to experiment with the nylon baby protector plugs with fo.Q and Oyaide EMI tape on the protector plug. This helps minimize the ringing on spare outlet hardware. Also helps draw stray EMI away from circuit.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Did you  replace the AC cord as well ?


I didn't.  The reason why is because I would need to dremel out the chassis to fit an iec connector.  Its also a budget build and that would increase the cost quite a bit.

Perhaps in the future I may consider it if it turns out to sound better than my furutech plc.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I didn't.  The reason why is because I would need to dremel out the chassis to fit an iec connector.  Its also a budget build and that would increase the cost quite a bit.
> 
> Perhaps in the future I may consider it if it turns out to sound better than my furutech plc.


On one balanced version I did not install a IEC inlet.  I ran the cable through the same chassis hole, I think with an aluminum strain relief. When I go home I will try and take a pic of it.


----------



## cdacosta

Pic of aluminum strain relief for direct connection of a XLO Signature 3-10 power cord into the PLC. I remember wanting to do a direct connection vs using a IEC inlet.  I did 2 PLC like this. All internal wiring is also the same including grounds.  

All ground connections are star wired. Meaning all ground wiring terminate at one point inside chassis.


----------



## DecentLevi (Oct 30, 2022)

OK boys, you ready for some audio contraband? The ultimate juxtaposition - the ugliest duckling, but sounding like a purple unicorn. It's one of those things you couldn't get into a club with, but at home it's your ultimate portal to untold netherworlds. Astonishing wall of sound with everything done right, it's even alluring, albeit when I'm not looking LOL.





Above is my initial result with copper foil around a Gold Odin, and I've also tried it with my Odon 2 RCA coax, and Odin 2 USB cables. On those the result was somewhat unexpected. In fact with just the copper foil alone I didn't really notice any difference or like it, maybe even sounding a tad brighter. But after applying my trusty professional quality ferrite clamps that I previously had over the foil, I noticed incremental improvements for every cable. Now with 3 cables treated this way, the difference is heightened / smoothed everything! More vivid surreal organic true to life experience with probably larger soundstage, with treble that's probably just as present, yet smoother and more likeable.

On the Odin 2 USB and Odin Gold AC cables I preferred with it actually touching one side of the ground, but not touching on the Odin 2 RCA coax cable. Luckily no shock when touching it, and luckily it is all removable. What I really like is that it doesn't seem to alter the original sound character, but just let the best aspects of it shine through better.

I got 2" thick copper foil and cut it lengthwise in 1/4ths for the other cables, and in 1/2 for the Odin Gold cable, in order to wrap it without overlapping because I was going for a "partial coverage" design. If I'd like to I can just do another pass and it will be "fully clothed".

But what is that other aluminum cover above - just on the cable ends for strain relief, not for sound? And what might I want to do differently? Any further benefits of "fully clothing" it, or trying aluminum? But I'm sure Reynold's wrap would look even worse.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> OK boys, you ready for some audio contraband? The ultimate juxtaposition - the ugliest duckling, but sounding like a purple unicorn. It's one of those things you couldn't get into a club with, but at home it's your ultimate portal to untold netherworlds. Astonishing wall of sound with everything done right, it's even alluring, albeit when I'm not looking LOL.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dude are you sure thats safe with the copper tape on the ground terminal?


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 30, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Dude are you sure thats safe with the copper tape on the ground terminal?


And what can happen is just grounding ?
It was better to disassemble the plug and solder the wires without insulation to ground and scroll around the foil. The adhesive on the foil is a dielectric. Correctly made grounding on one side of the source.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> Above is my initial result with copper foil around a Gold Odin, and I've also tried it with my Odon 2 RCA coax, and Odin 2 USB cables. On those the result was somewhat unexpected. In fact with just the copper foil alone I didn't really notice any difference or like it, maybe even sounding a tad brighter. But after applying my trusty professional quality ferrite clamps that I previously had over the foil, I noticed incremental improvements for every cable. Now with 3 cables treated this way, the difference is heightened / smoothed everything! More vivid surreal organic true to life experience with probably larger soundstage, with treble that's probably just as present, yet smoother and more likeable.
> 
> On the Odin 2 USB and Odin Gold AC cables I preferred with it actually touching one side of the ground, but not touching on the Odin 2 RCA coax cable. Luckily no shock when touching it, and luckily it is all removable. What I really like is that it doesn't seem to alter the original sound character, but just let the best aspects of it shine through better.
> 
> ...


Maybe it was the ferrite clamps that did a good service to the sound?
I have read that ferrite clamps work well at the beginning and at the end.
In Odin 2 RCA, each wire is shielded, the wire does not need an additional shield. I do not have ONE 2 RCA, but it was correct to test whether there is grounding on the foil, they could not be connected.
I have Odin 2 USB in it, the ground is not connected to the screen, which is bad, cable not shielded ,  but by connecting the ground, the wave impedance of the cable is violated and cable may not play at all. On Odin 2 USB it is necessary to put on top braided protection shielding and connect from the source side


----------



## pashkaam

A little more and we will overcome the new barrier 100 pages of interesting information that we share with each other .


----------



## pashkaam (Oct 30, 2022)

From Odin Gold  I made two wires. Having cut off a short piece and I made a DC cord to power my DAC from an external power source. I also shielded this wire.
Much to my regret, my old regular thin plain cord DC plays better, much better .

There is a fact that cannot be caught by any test equipment,
The cable sounds different in different directions. There will be time to solder in the reverse position . wll see


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Dude are you sure thats safe with the copper tape on the ground terminal?


Yes just like Pashkaam said, it's just grounding and carries no hot signal, and I was able to touch it - first with my sleeve over my hands. As mentioned it's just an initial experimental design, and I'm liking the sound, both on my Odin Gold AC, and it was making a subtle but good difference with my Odin 2 cables, though reaching its' plateau of performance only after adding about 3 equally spaced ferrite clamps over the foil (specific combinations of ferrites which work on different frequencies that I determined to sound best specific to each cable).


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Yes just like Pashkaam said, it's just grounding and carries no hot signal, and I was able to touch it - first with my sleeve over my hands. As mentioned it's just an initial experimental design, and I'm liking the sound, both on my Odin Gold AC, and it was making a subtle but good difference with my Odin 2 cables, though reaching its' plateau of performance only after adding about 3 equally spaced ferrite clamps over the foil (specific combinations of ferrites which work on different frequencies that I determined to sound best specific to each cable).


I don't know dude, that looks very dangerous to me.  

It doesn't carry an electrical load all the time, its meant to be an overload relief line.  Meaning that sometimes a surge of electricity will go through it.  Thats a potential fire or electrocution waiting to happen.

I highly advise removing the tape from the ground terminal.  These are not things that you should guess with, that could cause serious injury or death.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I don't know dude, that looks very dangerous to me.
> 
> It doesn't carry an electrical load all the time, its meant to be an overload relief line.  Meaning that sometimes a surge of electricity will go through it.  Thats a potential fire or electrocution waiting to happen.
> 
> I highly advise removing the tape from the ground terminal.  These are not things that you should guess with, that could cause serious injury or death.


Or place a cover over all of the cable.


----------



## cdacosta

First and most important rule when dealing with electricity is CYA.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I don't know dude, that looks very dangerous to me.
> 
> It doesn't carry an electrical load all the time, its meant to be an overload relief line.  *Meaning that sometimes a surge of electricity will go through it.*  Thats a potential fire or electrocution waiting to happen.
> 
> I highly advise removing the tape from the ground terminal.  These are not things that you should guess with, that could cause serious injury or death.


I kind of understand that the foil on the plug is badly fixed and can come off and create a short circuit, but bursts of electricity on the ground are already too much !!!
If you touch the grounding and at that moment make a short circuit by applying the phase to grounding, then nothing will happen except to knock out the fuse or burn the wire at the place of the short circuit, you won’t even feel it.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I kind of understand that the foil on the plug is badly fixed and can come off and create a short circuit, but bursts of electricity on the ground are already too much !!!
> If you touch the grounding and at that moment make a short circuit by applying the phase to grounding, then nothing will happen except to knock out the fuse or burn the wire at the place of the short circuit, you won’t even feel it.


It depends on how much electricity is surging through that ground terminal.  If theres a unusual surge from a lightning storm or something else, it can cause a life threatening situation.

When wires burn or melt, sometimes it happens in a split second.  Assuming that because nothing happens when you touch it that time doesn't mean its safe all the time.


----------



## pashkaam

I have Odin Gold power AC for the power supply for the DAC. Since gold foil is not foil but decorative plastic, I shielded  this wire.
The stage deepened and moved forward, it's great.
A flat scene is an indicator of signal compression and something wrong with signal 
A good wire always shows a good stage, sound release, three-dimensional , music is starts open , less compression .
While the wiring is warming up.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> It depends on how much electricity is surging through that ground terminal.  If theres a unusual surge from a lightning storm or something else, it can cause a life threatening situation.
> 
> When wires burn or melt, sometimes it happens in a split second.  Assuming that because nothing happens when you touch it that time doesn't mean its safe all the time.


This grounding does not flow through it at all. Grounding exists and saves a person from electric shock, which is planted on the equipment case, be it a short circuit or lightning. 
By the way, there are nets for mattresses that are connected to a power outlet. Very good for health. Too much static and synthetics around us . Man must ground himself


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> I kind of understand that the foil on the plug is badly fixed and can come off and create a short circuit, but bursts of electricity on the ground are already too much !!!
> If you touch the grounding and at that moment make a short circuit by applying the phase to grounding, then nothing will happen except to knock out the fuse or burn the wire at the place of the short circuit, you won’t even feel it.


What if I have expnesive SR Purple fuse Installed ?


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> What if I have expnesive SR Purple fuse Installed ?


Well, well, what is the connection between grounding and fuse. The fuse can be in the DC power supply and at the AC input. This is a precautionary measure against fire, and so that everything inside does not burn out at once ..


----------



## pashkaam

I’ll also throw in some information for reflection, although everyone probably knows this fact.
Different  sound in different direction.
just don't ask what he's talking about


----------



## DecentLevi

pashkaam said:


> I have Odin Gold power AC for the power supply for the DAC. Since gold foil is not foil but decorative plastic, I shielded  this wire.
> The stage deepened and moved forward, it's great.
> A flat scene is an indicator of signal compression and something wrong with signal
> A good wire always shows a good stage, sound release, three-dimensional , music is starts open , less compression .
> While the wiring is warming up.


OK guys I took your recommendation and disconnected the copper foil shield of the Odin Gold AC cable from the ground connection. To my surprise it sounds AT LEAST as good now, if not even BETTER. Smooth / non fatiguing and just like above, more 3D with perhaps a deeper soundstage, but especially a more vivid, true to life, organic sound overall. This includes with both my Odin 2 USB & RCA coax cables and the Odin Gold all having been treated. It's not pretty but at least it's not gonna burn up the carpet it rests on, and it sounds more than good for now.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> OK guys I took your recommendation and disconnected the copper foil shield of the Odin Gold AC cable from the ground connection. To my surprise it sounds AT LEAST as good now, if not even BETTER. Smooth / non fatiguing and just like above, more 3D with perhaps a deeper soundstage, but especially a more vivid, true to life, organic sound overall. This includes with both my Odin 2 USB & RCA coax cables and the Odin Gold all having been treated. It's not pretty but at least it's not gonna burn up the carpet it rests on, and it sounds more than good for now.


What are your perceived changes between partially wrapping your Power cord and XLR balanced interconnects vs without the copper wrap?  Thanks


----------



## msing539

Hey guys, anyone have a 1M AES cable they'd like to sell? Please pm if so.


----------



## LocalMotion

msing539 said:


> Hey guys, anyone have a 1M AES cable they'd like to sell? Please pm if so.


Pm incoming


----------



## DecentLevi

DecentLevi said:


> OK guys I took your recommendation and disconnected the copper foil shield of the Odin Gold AC cable from the ground connection. To my surprise it sounds AT LEAST as good now, if not even BETTER. Smooth / non fatiguing and just like above, more 3D with perhaps a deeper soundstage, but especially a more vivid, true to life, organic sound overall. This includes with both my Odin 2 USB & RCA coax cables and the Odin Gold all having been treated. It's not pretty but at least it's not gonna burn up the carpet it rests on, and it sounds more than good for now.





cdacosta said:


> What are your perceived changes between partially wrapping your Power cord and XLR balanced interconnects vs without the copper wrap?  Thanks


The above quote was my general impressions which are also on par with Pashkaam's result. That and that it doesn't change the sound sig. - just further highlights the best attributes. I'm just having to go by audio memory from beforehand, since unwrapping it for an A/B is less than practical. My other Odin cables are RCA coax and USB. 

My system uses standard RCA not XLR interconnects, and what I have can never be matched from any knockoff cable - being a genuine Neotech NEI 2001 pure silver solid core UPOCC single crystal cable with premium genuine Furutech connectors, worth around $1K. I had a friend in the hobby put it together for me using raw parts for less than that.


----------



## pashkaam

To tell the truth, I listen to music not in headphones, but on vintage  active tri-amp speakers. The three-dimensionality of the holographic sound from the subtracted from different forums in different headphones does not manifest itself as much as listening to music through speakers.
Too long running-in and wire-burning process. its kill me waiting .
I'm still experimenting with a lot of different ideas
Wire, any wire is good if the manufacturer has understood how his creation will affect the signal by creating unknown changes in signal cleaning and harmonization.
In the future, I will share the information I have collected about the cable.


Yesterday I connected back the ODIN Gold short cut DIY for the DC power supply for DAC, but before returning it, *I created a magnetic field of the conductor by smoothly sliding the magnet along the wire, but now in the direction against the signal movement. (*
(Who knows, maybe they do this by selling ordinary wires, they held it with a magnet and began to sound differently.
You are the first to know about it.)


I have ODIN 2 power cables for each amplifier so far , and Odin Gold for  AC power for a DAC
 and  DIY DC cable ( cut from Odin Gold shielded ) is Only this cable  has pulled the stage forward significantly which means a huge advance.
When the sound is separated from the speakers, when you do not hear the speakers, but only the music and the stage are getting closer and closer in front of you, this is good sign right way to improving .  
now you can hear the room and the responses and can determine the location.
In this case, be fair, everything that was in your system will come out because you will hear everything that was hidden by the previous wires like sound compression, in some places  the recording itself . 

I listened to equipment for $500k with three-dimensional sound, it very cool , different experience . My friend then said that the wires do it 3d.


----------



## pashkaam

There is an interesting sound correction option for those who listen to music from a computer, for example, I have Jriver26 > I installed the FabFilter Pro-Q3 plugin. I sometimes use it to reduce the effect of a room or other artifacts when something doesn't sound right.
 This is an equalizer BUT you do not reduce same frequencies or increase the frequency that you need not with an equalizer, but use a dynamic compressor at a certain frequency that is built into this equalizer, increase dynamics or reduce a certain frequency by say 3 dB. and you all hear a more natural sound than if you lowered or boosted a certain range with an equalizer.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> The above quote was my general impressions which are also on par with Pashkaam's result. That and that it doesn't change the sound sig. - just further highlights the best attributes. I'm just having to go by audio memory from beforehand, since unwrapping it for an A/B is less than practical.* My other Odin cables are RCA coax and USB.*


ODIN 2 Usb is not shielded. its silver foil is not connected to ground. When an external screen is connected to the ground, the wave resistance is violated and the DAC will not see cable .
Any USB cable likes extra shielding, you can put the shield on the entire cable on top and connect it on one side to the USB case plug that there is a ground signal . 
Odin 2 RCA i dont have it and I can't tell you what happen with shielding ( silver foil) can be not connected to ground is very complicated job , need check with tester . 

Now i listening (The Netherlands Symphony Orchestra, Jan Willem de Vriend , Beethoven: Symphonies Nos. 4 & 6 (Complete Symphonies Vol. 1)

I'm sitting in the hall somewhere in the 20th row, just fooling around, poked at the first disk I came across and couldn't turn it off. Closer seat is better.

Vivat Chinese!!!
 No more robbing banks to buy a good cable.


----------



## msing539

pashkaam said:


> ODIN 2 Usb is not shielded. its silver foil is not connected to ground. When an external screen is connected to the ground, the wave resistance is violated and the DAC will not see cable .
> Any USB cable likes extra shielding, you can put the shield on the entire cable on top and connect it on one side to the USB case plug that there is a ground signal .
> Odin 2 RCA i dont have it and I can't tell you what happen with shielding ( silver foil) can be not connected to ground is very complicated job , need check with tester .
> 
> ...



So you like the cable.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Well I say sterling silver but the exact mixture is 92.5% silver and the rest copper.  I don't think they're using 92.5% but any silver/copper alloy is going to be a better conductor than pure copper or spc.
> 
> Also got the monosaudio plug and iec, looks even better than the furutech knockoff.


Hello dougms3,

I joined last night just so that I’d ask a question of you

As someone whom has purchased one of the Odin Gold power cords, primarily to be used on my Denafrips Pontus ll DAC, and realized it’s slightly on the warmer side….., I’m looking to replace its stock gold plated brass power connectors, and was sort of wondering if there’s a particular reason for you selected rhodium plated copper as opposed to say unplated copper or silver plated copper versions?. Am I to assume this is a means of adding more top end detail and sparkle?.

Just curious more so than anything els.

TIA!.
O_o scar Johnson


----------



## pashkaam

msing539 said:


> So you like the cable.


I got :
2x Odin 2 on the amplifiers gave good dynamics, detailing, a lot of things.
Odin Gold also worked well connected to the AC/DC liner PS for the DAC.
But when I made a cable for the DC power supply from Odin Gold, changes began with the three-dimensionality of the scene.
It would be shorter to write Yes I like these cables, except for the Argento flow, it really takes the air out of the sound a little, although it plays nice tight.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hello dougms3,
> 
> I joined last night just so that I’d ask a question of you
> 
> ...


Yes, I chose rhodium instead of gold, hoping it would do just that since my entire system is on the warm side.  Although to be honest, its probably not a significant difference.  The duplex in the wall is a real furutech gtx-d (gold) and it made my chain so warm and bassy, if given the option I tend to always get rhodium plated stuff for everything else.

This is still on sale btw if you're looking to replace the plug and iec.  Highly recommend it.  

https://www.amazon.com/Hi-End-Carbo...TgifQ==&sprefix=monosaud,aps,469&sr=8-34&th=1


----------



## msing539

KT77 said:


> Hello dougms3,
> 
> I joined last night just so that I’d ask a question of you
> 
> ...



I have the Pontus II and opted for the silver Odin for this very reason. Haven't heard the gold for comparison, but I don't find my setup too warm.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Yes, I chose rhodium instead of gold, hoping it would do just that since my entire system is on the warm side.  Although to be honest, its probably not a significant difference.  The duplex in the wall is a real furutech gtx-d (gold) and it made my chain so warm and bassy, if given the option I tend to always get rhodium plated stuff for everything else.
> 
> This is still on sale btw if you're looking to replace the plug and iec.  Highly recommend it.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Hi-End-Carbon-Transparent-Connector-250V-15A/dp/B08QS4FR24/ref=sr_1_34?crid=1S02ZPL9711W0&keywords=monosaudio&qid=1667262508&qu=eyJxc2MiOiI1LjQ4IiwicXNhIjoiNC41MiIsInFzcCI6IjMuNTgifQ==&sprefix=monosaud,aps,469&sr=8-34&th=1


Hello dougms3,

Thanks for taking the time to respond, as I had assumed as much, but wanted to ask none the leas, as I’ve to date collected various platings of plugs from the likes of Oyaide | Furutech | Viborg | Monosaudio where I’ve at least 6 sets sitting here currently, yet have been reluctant to change any of them on the Odin Gold power cord, as I was somewhat uncertain while ones to use as a meres of altering its overall presentation, as I was told silver plated copper was the way to go with digital sources, yet noticed that Monosaudio doesn’t offer one in said plating, yet due to delays in shipping….., I ended up canceling a set of IeGO silver plated copper ones, and in fact because of your words about, with in fact be looking forward to using a set of Monosaudio M109R | F109Rs which I’ve setting around in my storage unit, as shown here:






US $52.50 | Monosaudio M09R/M109R 99.998％ Pure Copper Rhodium Plated US AC Power Plug Rhodium Plated Carbon Fiber US Male AC Power Plug

https://a.aliexpress.com/_mLQnyLa

As well as my posting on life’s contentment having discovered your post on said cables, where I go by the username of el34eh@yahoo.com:

https://db.audioasylum.com/mhtml/m....3D1307%20ORDER%20BY%201%2D%2D%20%2D&forum=ALL

Thanks once again for the encouragement to move onwards.


----------



## KT77

msing539 said:


> I have the Pontus II and opted for the silver Odin for this very reason. Haven't heard the gold for comparison, but I don't find my setup too warm.



Hello msing539,

Weird thing is….., I just canceled an order for said Odin 2 Silver just two days ago, as a few over on cable asylum spoke on this version, yet they also mentioned replacing the plugs with Viborg unplated copper ones, of which I’ve quite a few laying around, yet have in all honesty grown so accustomed to the sound of my DAC with the Gold version in place, it’s sort of like stepping outside of one’s self and realizing how best to change this cords characteristics just enough to add that extra sense of top end sparkle that’s apparently lacking…., as my current system information is shown here:

https://cgi.audioasylum.com/systems/10562.html





Where my Aurender Sever | Naim Audio SuperNait 3 | Rosso Florentino Pienza 2s all are more on the forgiving side of the audio spectrum, yet in truth, I’m still content system wise, yet remain somewhat of a cabling | isolation footers type of hoarder.

Thanks for chiming in, my one regret……, well sort of, is that I didn’t pursue the Denafrips Venus ll, when I had funds in hand.


----------



## msing539

KT77 said:


> Thanks for chiming in, my one regret……, well sort of, is that I didn’t pursue the Denafrips Venus ll, when I had funds in hand.



You're very welcome. And don't feel too bad--I've heard the Venus II and it didn't make me as happy as the Pontus does. In any case, I'm changing out the Pontus for the Sonnet Morpheus if all goes as planned.


----------



## KT77

msing539 said:


> You're very welcome. And don't feel too bad--I've heard the Venus II and it didn't make me as happy as the Pontus does. In any case, I'm changing out the Pontus for the Sonnet Morpheus if all goes as planned.


In light of what you’ve stated……., I’m thinking I’m better off riding out the Pontus ll, as I’ve experienced bad luck with several DACs with their digital displays becoming burnt out over the course of say 6-7 months, I’m much happier with the tinier led lighting on said DAC, and know that several guys that own the Pontus ll, over on A’Gon | Audio Circle | Audio Karma, have mentioned having great synergy between it and cords like the Supra LoRad | Gotham Audio 85005 used with unplated copper connector.

Enjoy your quest with the incoming DAC, it’s a looker.

Again where I’m at in replacing the connectors on the Odin Gold.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hello dougms3,
> 
> Thanks for taking the time to respond, as I had assumed as much, but wanted to ask none the leas, as I’ve to date collected various platings of plugs from the likes of Oyaide | Furutech | Viborg | Monosaudio where I’ve at least 6 sets sitting here currently, yet have been reluctant to change any of them on the Odin Gold power cord, as I was somewhat uncertain while ones to use as a meres of altering its overall presentation, as I was told silver plated copper was the way to go with digital sources, yet noticed that Monosaudio doesn’t offer one in said plating, yet due to delays in shipping….., I ended up canceling a set of IeGO silver plated copper ones, and in fact because of your words about, with in fact be looking forward to using a set of Monosaudio M109R | F109Rs which I’ve setting around in my storage unit, as shown here:
> 
> ...


In this hobby it's hard to predict what something will sound like when changing a part or gear.

Usually the only way to know for sure is to test it and listen.  Because sometimes a part or piece of equipment may work for one system and may not synergize well with another.

With connectors like plugs and iec, i prefer to go with things that have carbon fiber inserts because they mitigate vibration extremely well.  I have used carbon fiber for other applications in the past and have observed its finer properties.  So i have a bias for it.

I wasn't sure of the quality of the gold odin connectors so i tested the monosaudio connectors and found them to be vastly superior as well as the furutech fi 50 knockoffs i got off ali.  In terms of emi leakage, the furutech knockoffs from ali perform the best, followed by the carbon fiber monosaudio connectors, then the other monosaudio connectors i got from amazon, they're just black painted aluminum.  Not only do they sound better by comparison, they spill out less emi.  
All were superior to the gold odin connectors imo.  The gold odin connectors use thin aluminum and dont shield all that well.  

I have not tried those particular monosaudio connectors you posted from ali but having installed the duplexes and connectors from monosaudio, i can safely say they are legit and make legit products.

https://www.aliexpress.com/p/order/detail.html?orderId=8155060149258439 

These are the knockoff fi50 connectors i got that does not set of my nc voltage detector even when touching the plug.  The monosaudio connectors set it off if i get within about 3-4mm distance.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 1, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> In this hobby it's hard to predict what something will sound like when changing a part or gear.
> 
> Usually the only way to know for sure is to test it and listen.  Because sometimes a part or piece of equipment may work for one system and may not synergize well with another.
> 
> ...


Hello,

I‘m somewhat confused as to which plugs you said perform the best?, is it the knockoff Furutech or Monosaudio carbon fiber versions?, or said black aluminum shelled one?, as an avid tweaker, I don’t mind purchasing a few more, yet have taken your point on said carbon fiber designs……, thanks again for re-educating me on said options, which in reality makes a great deal of sense.

As is my usual saying since the pandemic……, be well | stay safe.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

3256802936896122


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I‘m somewhat confused as to which plugs you said perform the best?, is it the knockoff Furutech or Monosaudio carbon fiber versions?, or said black aluminum shelled one?, as an avid tweaker, I don’t mind purchasing a few more, yet have taken your point on said carbon fiber designs……, thanks again for re-educating me on said options, which in reality makes a great deal of sense.
> 
> As is my usual saying since the pandemic……, be well | stay safe.


I'm not sure which sounds better to be honest.  They're too similar in performance for me to be able to tell by ear.  I only know that they all sound better than the gold odin connectors.  

Just pointing out knockoff furutechs don't set off the NC voltage detector at all.  The monosaudio set it off but only at a very close distance.  The gold odin connectors will set it off about 2-3 inches away.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I'm not sure which sounds better to be honest.  They're too similar in performance for me to be able to tell by ear.  I only know that they all sound better than the gold odin connectors.
> 
> Just pointing out knockoff furutechs don't set off the NC voltage detector at all.  The monosaudio set it off but only at a very close distance.  The gold odin connectors will set it off about 2-3 inches away.


What may be an interesting experiment is try with the Oyaide EMI tape wrapped around the connectors (placed up closest to the connection point).  Then test for EMI.  For no question in my setup this tweak is very good.


----------



## dougms3

If anyone is going to buy anything on ali thats over $150, theres a $15 off coupon for 11.11.  Coupon code is US15 case sensitive.


----------



## KT77

KT77 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I‘m somewhat confused as to which plugs you said perform the best?, is it the knockoff Furutech or Monosaudio carbon fiber versions?, or said black aluminum shelled one?, as an avid tweaker, I don’t mind purchasing a few more, yet have taken your point on said carbon fiber designs……, thanks again for re-educating me on said options, which in reality makes a great deal of sense.
> 
> As is my usual saying since the pandemic……, be well | stay safe.





dougms3 said:


> I'm not sure which sounds better to be honest.  They're too similar in performance for me to be able to tell by ear.  I only know that they all sound better than the gold odin connectors.
> 
> Just pointing out knockoff furutechs don't set off the NC voltage detector at all.  The monosaudio set it off but only at a very close distance.  The gold odin connectors will set it off about 2-3 inches away.


Thanks once again for adding said insight, as it’s much appreciated.


----------



## kr0gg

Is the Preffair store OK to buy Odin 2 Gold RCA and Power cords? They have the biggest discount i think. I want to jump into your team


----------



## msing539

kr0gg said:


> Is the Preffair store OK to buy Odin 2 Gold RCA and Power cords? They have the biggest discount i think. I want to jump into your team


These other guys can chime in as I don't have the gold versions.

However, every cable I've bought and kept shows Audiocrast as the manufacturer under specs. This is also true for non Odin cables... when Audiocrast is the mfg, they have been better made in my experience.


----------



## gimmeheadroom

msing539 said:


> These other guys can chime in as I don't have the gold versions.
> 
> However, every cable I've bought and kept shows Audiocrast as the manufacturer under specs. This is also true for non Odin cables... when Audiocrast is the mfg, they have been better made in my experience.


They're all made in the same garage. Only the label changes


----------



## msing539

gimmeheadroom said:


> They're all made in the same garage. Only the label changes



I spoke with Mr. Audiocrast. He assured me his are fever grade.


----------



## kr0gg

Ok. Then I'm buying 4  Preffair Odin cables in 4 minutes.


----------



## gimmeheadroom

msing539 said:


> I spoke with Mr. Audiocrast. He assured me his are fever grade.



I was just gonna make an audiocrast salad. Now that there's a health risk I'm gonna have to reconsider!


----------



## dougms3

Preffair, audiocrast, monosaudio, viborg are the bigger names and are usually more reliable quality.


----------



## dougms3

kr0gg said:


> Ok. Then I'm buying 4  Preffair Odin cables in 4 minutes.


May want to try that 15 core valhalla cable that crypt keeper posted.  Can't go wrong for $36 and it comes with carbon fiber connectors.


----------



## kr0gg

too late


----------



## KT77

Hi kr0gg,

in truth is was willing to spend a little bit more for the versions sold by RPM Digital, as they merely seemed better made | as many here have written about the quality of the newer thinner versions, as maybe using suspect Christmas wrappings as the gold foil, of which I can’t speak on, yet mine cost $200 and about for said Odin Gold IC’s | XLR IC’s | Power cord, and as I ended up with four diff versions of their usb cable, I see the first one which is sold via Audio Connection, which is a rather thin one with white shrink wrap as the most nimble, the second of which was from Gutwire….., is thicker and uses black shrink wrap, which happens to be the one in my system now | offers more weigh, the third is shown with the very very nice Viborg connectors | while the fourth is the Gold version, of which hasn’t made it into the system quite yet……, but in truth, each easily replaced my former $350 | $565 | $585 | $770 and $945 usb cables, by offering what I now heard as very very expressive in the way of hearing more accurate detailing of instruments like cymbal decay, rimshots, whacks and so on.

As an avid jazz head, said presentation simply capture my innermost creativity and imagination as if all of my files were heard anew.


----------



## KT77

And know that it’s never to late to cancel and order | especially if it hasn’t been shipped….., I’ve done it more times than not.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hi kr0gg,
> 
> in truth is was willing to spend a little bit more for the versions sold by RPM Digital, as they merely seemed better made | as many here have written about the quality of the newer thinner versions, as maybe using suspect Christmas wrappings as the gold foil, of which I can’t speak on, yet mine cost $200 and about for said Odin Gold IC’s | XLR IC’s | Power cord, and as I ended up with four diff versions of their usb cable, I see the first one which is sold via Audio Connection, which is a rather thin one with white shrink wrap as the most nimble, the second of which was from Gutwire….., is thicker and uses black shrink wrap, which happens to be the one in my system now | offers more weigh, the third is shown with the very very nice Viborg connectors | while the fourth is the Gold version, of which hasn’t made it into the system quite yet……, but in truth, each easily replaced my former $350 | $565 | $585 | $770 and $945 usb cables, by offering what I now heard as very very expressive in the way of hearing more accurate detailing of instruments like cymbal decay, rimshots, whacks and so on.
> 
> As an avid jazz head, said presentation simply capture my innermost creativity and imagination as if all of my files were heard anew.


Good lord them some fancy speakers.


----------



## kr0gg (Nov 2, 2022)

the Odin power cables is bought were $40 for 2 meters. how much more are those? (and where I live we mostly don't have grounding, so anything related to ground issues or shielding issues is unsolvable anyway :)


----------



## cdacosta

This may be helpful to some so I will share my thoughts and experience with material and plating for connectors.  This holds generally true for line level signal connections and AC applications.  I have built approx. 150 or so cables in the past, most during proto typing for designers or during my quest for the ultimate cables for a home system and home theater I was designing for my home.   The sensitivity of the system, how well tuned it is, will amplify the the quality of material and metal used on the connector.  Plating material used on the base metal will also effect sonic performance.  Also the plating descriptions I mention for connectors will generally hold true for conductors used.  When the connectors and conductor materials are combined, will amplify or mix characteristics for the connector plating and conductors material to come up with the end results.  Obviously cable geometry, dielectric material and so forth play a role in what one hears.  I experimented for years with almost every connector money can buy from well known manufacturers until about 2 years ago.  In the end I just listen to the system, decide what I want to change or improve on, then select a combination of materials to use to "try" to accomplish the tuning I am looking for.

As a general rule:
* Copper, no plating will offer the most organic and lush presentation.  Also one of the best for true timbre.  A kind of happy medium for speed, dynamics and usually provides the richest and natural vocal presentation.

* Beryllium Copper like Furutech uses sounds a lot like pure copper to me.  Maybe 90% or so like pure copper. 

* Brass performs harsher, not as lush, not as organic and have a slightly tinnier sound to my ear than copper.  Brass does sound slightly quicker than copper.  

* Pure silver come in different variations during manufacturing, just like copper.  But mostly they sound very similar to me.  Silver in general sounds and feels faster than copper.  When I mention slower or faster this will effect PRAT (Pace, Rhythm and Timing) of the system.  Usually more detailed, a bit less full in midrange frequencies.  Properly burned in silver does not sound harsh, tinny or thin.  Not properly burned, silver sounds kind of thin across the frequency range compared to copper.

* Rhodium once properly burned in will provide the most detail retrieval.  Speed is similar or close to silver.  The drawback to me is Rhodium does not feel or sound as organic/natural as copper or silver.  Think more vivid or lively of a presentation.  I personally am not a fan of Rhodium for audio, takes forever to burn-in and does not feel as musical as the other metals.  When I listen to music I want it to move me, and with "my tastes" the other metals as conductors just do it better.  But if one wants analytical and detail, Rhodium fits that well.

* Gold as a conductor sounds beautiful and lush, but is slow compared to the above mentioned.  In an alloy mix gold "usually" sounds very natural and I like most of the combinations I have experienced.  Neotech makes a conductor that has gold, silver and I think copper that sounds amazing for line level use.  Never tried the Neotech alloy wire for power.  Gold plating works well for corrosion prevention but does slightly mute some of the characteristics of the base metal.

Plating is tough.  There are many plating schemes and combinations in the marketplace.  Generally the above I found also true for plating.  Since electrical signals flow on the outside plating material, I assumed in the past the outside plating material would play the biggest role ultimately in what we hear.  Generally this is true but I have noticed when comparing exactly designed cables having different connectors using different plating schemes this is not 100% accurate.  Direct gold plated copper sounds slightly different than copper metal plated with another material then gold for instance.

Even though one cable within a system may be the focus for say connector or conductor plating, it will effect overall presentation of the system.  Copper is warmer and the extreme opposite would be Rhodium.  A system can be tuned using cables (or AC outlet), allowing presentation change to be warmer or livelier or more analytical by changing the materials used within a single cable (or AC outlet) design.  Each change will nudge to a varying degree the overall system presentation.

Peace


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Good lord them some fancy speakers.


Meant to be audio prone | eye candy. My own speakers are these:

https://www.atelier13-usa.com/rosso-fiorentino-pienza-loudspeaker


----------



## KT77

kr0gg said:


> the Odin power cables is bought were $40 for 2 meters. how much more are those? (and where I live we mostly don't have grounding, so anything related to ground issues or shielding issues is unsolvable anyway :)


As some has written earlier, said Odin Gold power cords aren’t shielded, in which case the standard Odin 2 Silver might actually be a better option.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> This may be helpful to some so I will share my thoughts and experience with material and plating for connectors.  This holds generally true for line level signal connections and AC applications.  I have built approx. 150 or so cables in the past, most during proto typing for designers or during my quest for the ultimate cables for a home system and home theater I was designing for my home.   The sensitivity of the system, how well tuned it is, will amplify the the quality of material and metal used on the connector.  Plating material used on the base metal will also effect sonic performance.  Also the plating descriptions I mention for connectors will generally hold true for conductors used.  When the connectors and conductor materials are combined, will amplify or mix characteristics for the connector plating and conductors material to come up with the end results.  Obviously cable geometry, dielectric material and so forth play a role in what one hears.  I experimented for years with almost every connector money can buy from well known manufacturers until about 2 years ago.  In the end I just listen to the system, decide what I want to change or improve on, then select a combination of materials to use to "try" to accomplish the tuning I am looking for.
> 
> As a general rule:
> * Copper, no plating will offer the most organic and lush presentation.  Also one of the best for true timbre.  A kind of happy medium for speed, dynamics and usually provides the richest and natural vocal presentation.
> ...


----------



## dougms3

kr0gg said:


> the Odin power cables is bought were $40 for 2 meters. how much more are those? (and where I live we mostly don't have grounding, so anything related to ground issues or shielding issues is unsolvable anyway :)


Eh it still benefits to have good grounding.

I live in a really old apt building built in the 1940s so they are not up to code with the outlets.  I think starting from the 1970s, in the US  the nec requires all outlets to be grounded through the ground plug for new buildings.

I checked my outlets and they are only grounded to the cage holding the duplex.

While not ideal, it should still benefits from additional grounding.  That's I'm excited about those wooden grounding cylinders.


----------



## KT77

Thanks cdacosta,

I for one have always been torn as to if I should buy into the whole rhodium plated thingy, as someone whom has mostly dealt with un-plated copper connectors, be they rca input jacks, binding post, or power cord connectors going back as far as 1993, at which point I’d replace each where I’d?, being as how my soldering skills are less than perfect | I‘d attach the wiring harness onto an O lug type of device, and just place it between the chassis and post of said input jacks or binding post…., thank God for the likes of companies like Viborg | Monosaudio which offer screw down type connectors.

It seems when it comes to banana plugs, I’ve to date ( just found more in storage by the way ) always gravitated towards silver plated copper ones, with the rare exception of using the pure silver Furez plugs, of which I’d merely use a hex crimped to attach them onto speaker cables. As mentioned earlier, of late I find myself always looking into cables and isolation footers or devices, yet weird thing is……., I’m seriously loving these pure silver banana plugs big time.

So as you’ve stated……, I’ve over the course of the last 7 years more or less spent time in voicing ( finalizing ) my system at each stage, component wise by ear, but as we all know, attention to the smallest details matter, like much preferring Oyaide R1 | R0 AC Receptacles to most, as well as their P-400 | C-400 power connectors.

Thanks again for shedding more insight into said options, as I’ve been asking the guys over on Audio Asylum, within the Tweaker Asylum section to share their thoughts on this very matter for years, so in hindsight selecting pure copper and silver plated copper were bad choices at all.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Eh it still benefits to have good grounding.
> 
> I live in a really old apt building built in the 1940s so they are not up to code with the outlets.  I think starting from the 1970s, in the US  the nec requires all outlets to be grounded through the ground plug for new buildings.
> 
> ...


I can respect that, as my family and I used to live in a converted loft build around this same period in downtown Detroit, and no matter which upscaled ac receptacles I tried to install, especially for the system, there was always a constant hum. I’ve of late had extremely good luck in using several iFi AC iPurifiers placed around the listening room, and even when one further by making my own grounding cables from pure silver Duelund 28AWG wiring for them……, which have proving most effective I’d add.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thanks cdacosta,
> 
> I for one have always been torn as to if I should buy into the whole rhodium plated thingy, as someone whom has mostly dealt with un-plated copper connectors, be they rca input jacks, binding post, or power cord connectors going back as far as 1993, at which point I’d replace each where I’d?, being as how my soldering skills are less than perfect | I‘d attach the wiring harness onto an O lug type of device, and just place it between the chassis and post of said input jacks or binding post…., thank God for the likes of companies like Viborg | Monosaudio which offer screw down type connectors.
> 
> ...


Ah Audio Asylum and Tweaker Asylum, I started my audio journey there around 1995 or so.  Met in person many awesome and crazy audiophiles like me.   I go by or went by cdc in those forums.  If you were in those forums and based on what I read, I have two suggestions for you.  Assuming you like what you are hearing now from your system and am just searching for what else… 1) keep what you have and do not worry about upgrading, changes will likely be minute from this point compared to the cost.  2) Look into Furutech Nano Liquid if you are not using a good contact enhancer.   If you are not already using a good contact enhancer, what the Nano Liquid will do for your system will pleasantly shock you.  It will allow you to improve every mechanical connection in your system.  The performance improvement is stunning.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77, I forgot to mention regarding the Furutech Nano Liquid.  Although the amount to be used is very minor on both sides of a mechanical connection, will help prevent corrosion over time with bare connectors like pure copper.


----------



## dougms3

I know this sounds a bit out there but I think these rca and xlr covers are actually reducing the noise a bit.  

Its not that big a difference but I can hear a small change when I remove them.  

What a pleasant surprise.

Got it here if anyone is interested. 

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2lkxNQu&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## DecentLevi

KT77 said:


> I can respect that, as my family and I used to live in a converted loft build around this same period in downtown Detroit, and no matter which upscaled ac receptacles I tried to install, especially for the system, there was always a constant hum. I’ve of late had extremely good luck in using several iFi AC iPurifiers placed around the listening room, and even when one further by making my own grounding cables from pure silver Duelund 28AWG wiring for them……, which have proving most effective I’d add.


Ironically, I also have an iFi AC iPurifier on the way. Would you advise what is that connecting port for on the back of it, and any recommended usage for that? Aside from that, I've read how to place it nearby the components which can benefit from hum reduction. 

Along with that, I've also just gotten an iFi DC Blocker (this is said to reduce any DC that's mixed in the AC path), and I'm trying to find a good price on a iFi GND Defender, to see if the buzz / hum I've been experiencing from my tube amp could have anything to do with the mains power - although my home power is ready grounded and going through a top power conditioner. It may also have the effect of absorbing from the amp when I try all of these three. The Flux-50 has reduced it a subtle amount, when I stacked two together. Along with improving the fidelity.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Ah Audio Asylum and Tweaker Asylum, I started my audio journey there around 1995 or so.  Met in person many awesome and crazy audiophiles like me.   I go by or went by cdc in those forums.  If you were in those forums and based on what I read, I have two suggestions for you.  Assuming you like what you are hearing now from your system and am just searching for what else… 1) keep what you have and do not worry about upgrading, changes will likely be minute from this point compared to the cost.  2) Look into Furutech Nano Liquid if you are not using a good contact enhancer.   If you are not already using a good contact enhancer, what the Nano Liquid will do for your system will pleasantly shock you.  It will allow you to improve every mechanical connection in your system.  The performance improvement is stunning.


You joined them much earlier than I, as I spent my earlier days on Echo Loft | Glass Tube Audio forums from the Far East, learning about tubes which many Americans obviously knew nothing about….., and only came to both A’Gon | Audio Asylum around 2003, whereas these days I tend to only ask questions on things I don’t know, going directly to the source, in my case means the country of origin to items like tubes | cables | speakers and so on, as it seems I’ve always enjoyed the sonic signature of items like turntables and speakers from England | CD Players from France | cabling from Germany and Japan and so on.

As for contact enhancers I use the two shown in these added photos. And believe me I’ve spent and wasted enough money on gear, and definitely understand these days, it’s more and more about what I’ve termed since 2016 as “ Mi-Fi “, and plan to ride said wares out.

 Thanks again.


----------



## KT77

DecentLevi said:


> Ironically, I also have an iFi AC iPurifier on the way. Would you advise what is that connecting port for on the back of it, and any recommended usage for that? Aside from that, I've read how to place it nearby the components which can benefit from hum reduction.
> 
> Along with that, I've also just gotten an iFi DC Blocker (this is said to reduce any DC that's mixed in the AC path), and I'm trying to find a good price on a iFi GND Defender, to see if the buzz / hum I've been experiencing from my tube amp could have anything to do with the mains power - although my home power is ready grounded and going through a top power conditioner. It may also have the effect of absorbing from the amp when I try all of these three. The Flux-50 has reduced it a subtle amount, when I stacked two together. Along with improving the fidelity.


Said opening is intended to be used with their Ground Hog cabling loom, where it allows it to be wired directly with a banana plug into said opening, yet on the opposite end one has the choice of using say an RCA | Spade | USB type of connectors placed onto to either a spare RCA Input | Chassis Screw | Spade or Grounding Post on their amplification or DAC or LPS.

DC noises can in fact be due to said grounding issues, there are times when dressing one’s cables on a 90 degree angle where they cross one another helps, as does investing in a properly designed power line conditioner as well as ac receptacles, the latter of which plenty of folks I know don’t believe makes a difference, because they’ve invested in circuit breakers for their system, yet seemingly fail to realize their $89.000 or more system is still linked ( or powered ) by a standard 50 cent ac outlet from either Lowes’s or Home Depot, logic is wouldn’t one except better performance from the likes of using either an Oyaide or Furutech version?.

Once again……, for me at least, paying attention to the smallest of details in voicing one’s system matters.


----------



## KT77

DecentLevi said:


> Ironically, I also have an iFi AC iPurifier on the way. Would you advise what is that connecting port for on the back of it, and any recommended usage for that? Aside from that, I've read how to place it nearby the components which can benefit from hum reduction.
> 
> Along with that, I've also just gotten an iFi DC Blocker (this is said to reduce any DC that's mixed in the AC path), and I'm trying to find a good price on a iFi GND Defender, to see if the buzz / hum I've been experiencing from my tube amp could have anything to do with the mains power - although my home power is ready grounded and going through a top power conditioner. It may also have the effect of absorbing from the amp when I try all of these three. The Flux-50 has reduced it a subtle amount, when I stacked two together. Along with improving the fidelity.



Speaking of which I picked up the concept of building my own grounding cable for the iFi AC iPurifier from having found this site a few years ago:

https://www.adark.co/products/after...element-cfs-ground-cable-for-ifi-ac-ipurifier


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> This may be helpful to some so I will share my thoughts and experience with material and plating for connectors.  This holds generally true for line level signal connections and AC applications.  I have built approx. 150 or so cables in the past, most during proto typing for designers or during my quest for the ultimate cables for a home system and home theater I was designing for my home.   The sensitivity of the system, how well tuned it is, will amplify the the quality of material and metal used on the connector.  Plating material used on the base metal will also effect sonic performance.  Also the plating descriptions I mention for connectors will generally hold true for conductors used.  When the connectors and conductor materials are combined, will amplify or mix characteristics for the connector plating and conductors material to come up with the end results.  Obviously cable geometry, dielectric material and so forth play a role in what one hears.  I experimented for years with almost every connector money can buy from well known manufacturers until about 2 years ago.  In the end I just listen to the system, decide what I want to change or improve on, then select a combination of materials to use to "try" to accomplish the tuning I am looking for.
> 
> As a general rule:
> * Copper, no plating will offer the most organic and lush presentation.  Also one of the best for true timbre.  A kind of happy medium for speed, dynamics and usually provides the richest and natural vocal presentation.
> ...


 Hello cdacosta,

I forgot to ask you about the use of silver plated copper, as it relates to said power cord connector?, as the only said connectors I’ve which are used on my Aurender server Jena Labs Crimson Red RX silver plated copper cords, are a set of IeGO 8095 pure silver rhodium plated ones, where ideally they suit said purpos.

But as I’ve yet used said silver plated copper options, I’d love to hear your take on them as well.

TIA!.
O_o scar


----------



## KT77

Hi all,

I forgot to put this out there | but I’ve noticed several users over on Cable | Tweaker Asylum have used several different type of plating on the power cord connector, whereas they’ve used say either a silver plated copper AC Male ( stating it offered them better resolution and top end detail ) in tandem with an unplated or red copper IEC Female ( as to add a slightly warmer flavor to the mix ) I’m wondering if any of you here have tired said method of voicing the overall tonality of your cords?, or system’s balance?.

Just curious more so than not, I guess in the end since I’ve said different plated plugs here, I’d always just sample them as such, I just hate the concept of possibly stripping the screws from multiple usage.

Be well guys, stay safe.


----------



## KT77

I merely wanted to share a concept in which I just posted over on Tweaker Asylum | do read between the lines to see if said remarks ring true?:

Hi all,

As I posted earlier on as it relates to isolation footers and such to be used underneath my Aurender server | I've ended up with three options, as well as disc couplers to be used under my Denafrips Pontus ll DAC, all told I've remained truer to the cause as someone whom is always looking at means of isolation or decoupling each component from its surroundings | as every item in our system resonates even if we aren't aware of it..., it seems cables are another weakness of mine | yet admittedly I've been very fortunate to have discovered very very very musically balanced IC's | SCs | Power Cords costing well under $400, which have replaced in my case ones I've owned ranging from $500-$2.750 | with stops in between.

All this to say, other than continuing to research said cabling options, it appears my quest has reached its zenith | personally I couldn't be happier, as all to often in our shared hobby while buying into the concept of the flavor of the month mindset, we often move onto items which in hindsight sometimes are merely lateral or backwards moves from the items we wrote off, instead of trying to build our systems based upon synergy, you know, like when each component plays well with those around them, in my mind once one has selected their electronics carefully based upon actual hearing them, as opposed to some fake ass rating system, regardless of what some reviewers would've use believe..., I based said written words upon reality, if they claimed said this or that component was the best thing since sliced bread, yet looking closely at the content of their own systems, if said piece isn't in it, then it reads to me like something smells like BS, guys like Art Dudley and Herb were the only ones I saw as if they loved a piece of gear | they purchased it, end of story..., sidetracked as usual, but a reality none the less.

Happy listening to you all, I'm glad to say I'm off the wagon once and for all.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Hello cdacosta,
> 
> I forgot to ask you about the use of silver plated copper, as it relates to said power cord connector?, as the only said connectors I’ve which are used on my Aurender server Jena Labs Crimson Red RX silver plated copper cords, are a set of IeGO 8095 pure silver rhodium plated ones, where ideally they suit said purpos.
> 
> ...


By the way when it comes to this topic or audio in general I use the term "generally" a lot.  Reason is there are a lot of factors that effect audio fidelity which I am sure you are aware of.  That is why there is no "always" in our hobby.   

IMHO depending on the voicing during design of the cable, determines how suitable silver plated copper connectors will effect sound vs pure copper or pure silver.  I prefer pure metals but a pure silver AC or line level connector is expensive to make.  If the plating is done well, meaning high quality copper and silver used, and the final plating is polished (allowing better/more surface contact) usually will fall between pure copper and pure silver regarding audible sonic presentation and performance.  Said another way, not as detail focused as pure 5N+ silver and not as organic as 5N+ pure copper.  A middle ground if you will.

I actually prefer pure copper or pure silver or simple plating like silver plated copper for audio connectors.  Preferred over complicated multi-layered plating like Oyaide connectors.  I have found multi-layered plating emphasizes specific frequencies and do not sound as natural or real to me.  Within specific systems after a lot of experimenting (which is a PITA) multi layered plating can work well.  Just easier to tune or fine tune with what is known.  If I want to warm up or nudge vocals and mid frequencies I will look at pure copper in the chain.  Ultimate speed go silver in the chain, understanding the trade off and look for a strategic part swap.  Usually silver plated copper connectors come pre-installed on a cable purchased.  I usually will not change these connectors because the cables are very expensive so I will look elsewhere in system to tune.  Like changing fuses (to pure copper or silver), AC outlet, passive tweaks (like footers, wood, etc.) or using a different cable.  Building a cable from scratch will obviously be different.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I forgot to put this out there | but I’ve noticed several users over on Cable | Tweaker Asylum have used several different type of plating on the power cord connector, whereas they’ve used say either a silver plated copper AC Male ( stating it offered them better resolution and top end detail ) in tandem with an unplated or red copper IEC Female ( as to add a slightly warmer flavor to the mix ) I’m wondering if any of you here have tired said method of voicing the overall tonality of your cords?, or system’s balance?.
> 
> ...


Yes, I and several I know in the past (from Audio Asylum actually) have experimented with the differing IEC plating and material connections.  Very hard to determine end results of the experiment.  By the time it takes for the change to break-in, it is near impossible to figure out the exact change.  The general thoughts I gave previously which includes the post from a few mins ago "should" hold true for silver plated copper IEC female connection.  I got to the point to when I am building a new PLC I try to voice for as natural sonic presentation as possible.  And then tune...


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> By the way when it comes to this topic or audio in general I use the term "generally" a lot.  Reason is there are a lot of factors that effect audio fidelity which I am sure you are aware of.  That is why there is no "always" in our hobby.
> 
> IMHO depending on the voicing during design of the cable, determines how suitable silver plated copper connectors will effect sound vs pure copper or pure silver.  I prefer pure metals but a pure silver AC or line level connector is expensive to make.  If the plating is done well, meaning high quality copper and silver used, and the final plating is polished (allowing better/more surface contact) usually will fall between pure copper and pure silver regarding audible sonic presentation and performance.  Said another way, not as detail focused as pure 5N+ silver and not as organic as 5N+ pure copper.  A middle ground if you will.
> 
> I actually prefer pure copper or pure silver or simple plating like silver plated copper for audio connectors.  Preferred over complicated multi-layered plating like Oyaide connectors.  I have found multi-layered plating emphasizes specific frequencies and do not sound as natural or real to me.  Within specific systems after a lot of experimenting (which is a PITA) multi layered plating can work well.  Just easier to tune or fine tune with what is known.  If I want to warm up or nudge vocals and mid frequencies I will look at pure copper in the chain.  Ultimate speed go silver in the chain, understanding the trade off and look for a strategic part swap.  Usually silver plated copper connectors come pre-installed on a cable purchased.  I usually will not change these connectors because the cables are very expensive so I will look elsewhere in system to tune.  Like changing fuses (to pure copper or silver), AC outlet, passive tweaks (like footers, wood, etc.) or using a different cable.  Building a cable from scratch will obviously be different.






Thank……., as you’ve clearly once again pointed out how each of these platings or pure copper or pure silver, as well as simple plating techniques should be used.

Once again, I’m forever grateful for said insight | and while my photos might be seen by some as off topic?, I’ve always preferred to leave them in my post, which in essence adds a little bit of flavor to them.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Yes, I and several I know in the past (from Audio Asylum actually) have experimented with the differing IEC plating and material connections.  Very hard to determine end results of the experiment.  By the time it takes for the change to break-in, it is near impossible to figure out the exact change.  The general thoughts I gave previously which includes the post from a few mins ago "should" hold true for silver plated copper IEC female connection.  I got to the point to when I am building a new PLC I try to voice for as natural sonic presentation as possible.  And then tune...



Once again, much thanks is in order, as I’ve never thought to just try out a silver plated copper IEC Female connectors | I’m all over this, and am once again very very grateful for your words of wisdom | logic. Onwards | Outward thinking it is.


----------



## KT77

Do excuse me as my somewhat tiring 68 year old mind tends to forget a few things from time to time, but since you’ve mentioned pure silver power plugs, I’ve been watching these for awhile now:

http://www.viborgaudio.com/en/Product/a/chanpin/jianzhusheji/2021/0923/377.html

The seems to vary price wise | yet can be found at $168 each or $280 the set over on eBay.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thank……., as you’ve clearly once again pointed out how each of these platings or pure copper or pure silver, as well as simple plating techniques should be used.
> 
> Once again, I’m forever grateful for said insight | and while my photos might be seen by some as off topic?, I’ve always preferred to leave them in my post, which in essence adds a little bit of flavor to them.


My pleasure.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Do excuse me as my somewhat tiring 68 year old mind tends to forget a few things from time to time, but since you’ve mentioned pure silver power plugs, I’ve been watching these for awhile now:
> 
> http://www.viborgaudio.com/en/Product/a/chanpin/jianzhusheji/2021/0923/377.html
> 
> The seems to vary price wise | yet can be found at $168 each or $280 the set over on eBay.


Not inexpensive, but cost is relative to one's value system and affordability.   Pure silver AC connectors take a long time to fully burn-in unless you have access to a good burn-in device.  Pure silver AC connectors will increase mid to upper detail retrieval and add a bit of speed to the system.   The trade off is will likely nudge the system toward neutral a bit and may rob some of the warmth from vocals.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> My pleasure.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Not inexpensive, but cost is relative to one's value system and affordability.   Pure silver AC connectors take a long time to fully burn-in unless you have access to a good burn-in device.  Pure silver AC connectors will increase mid to upper detail retrieval and add a bit of speed to the system.   The trade off is will likely nudge the system toward neutral a bit and may rob some of the warmth from vocals.


Totally understood | especially taking into account the cheaper Chinese NordOst clones we‘re talking about, yet in all honesty the Odin Gold in my system, easily bettered my $300 | $800 power cords within 2-3 tracks, much like their matching usb cables, I no longer question or second guess what I hear, if said item brings about a certain sense of realism | tonal shadings | timbre accuracy, then consider me smitten.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Totally understood | especially taking into account the cheaper Chinese NordOst clones we‘re talking about, yet in all honesty the Odin Gold in my system, easily bettered my $300 | $800 power cords within 2-3 tracks, much like their matching usb cables, I no longer question or second guess what I hear, if said item brings about a certain sense of realism | tonal shadings | timbre accuracy, then consider me smitten.


Yep for the cost of those Nordost clone cables, aside tweaking them it is not worth spending more on them.  They already perform extremely well for the cost of the cables.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Yep for the cost of those Nordost clone cables, aside tweaking them it is not worth spending more on them.  They already perform extremely well for the cost of the cables.


As my only current concern was actually replacing the power connectors on the Odin Gold, are you saying I shouldn’t do it?, or limit my budget for said connectors to the lesser expensive ones ( brands ) like Vanguard | SonarQuest | Monosaudio | Vibor, which all seeming have single plugs between $16-$25 each, versus spending extra on the likes of them from Furutech | Oyaide ( which it reads as if you don’t like ) | Cardas Audio | Neotech types, correct?.

In said case, I’m only lookino to purchase a single silver plated copper IEC Female connecto, to place on the Odin Gold with an un-plated copper AC Male on the other side.

 Thanks again for the clarification of said matters, once again it makes a great deal of sense.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

IMHO,  Viborg is overpriced ...  Monosaudio -  very good for the price...


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> IMHO,  Viborg is overpriced ...  Monosaudio -  very good for the price...


Thank……, I’ve used both in the past | but have noticed Monosaudio doesn’t offer silver plated copper connector, as I’d exc emails with them, they only can be done on special order, where they stated they’d be done plated in 30 microns. I’m looking to get the version based upon their latest design referred to as M109R, they mentioned $70-$90 per set with silver plated copper or red copper, as it’s my last go round with power cords | connectors I figure why not.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> As my only current concern was actually replacing the power connectors on the Odin Gold, are you saying I shouldn’t do it?, or limit my budget for said connectors to the lesser expensive ones ( brands ) like Vanguard | SonarQuest | Monosaudio | Vibor, which all seeming have single plugs between $16-$25 each, versus spending extra on the likes of them from Furutech | Oyaide ( which it reads as if you don’t like ) | Cardas Audio | Neotech types, correct?.
> 
> In said case, I’m only lookino to purchase a single silver plated copper IEC Female connecto, to place on the Odin Gold with an un-plated copper AC Male on the other side.
> 
> Thanks again for the clarification of said matters, once again it makes a great deal of sense.


I am not saying or recommending anything, only sharing my experiences.  If you want to replace the connectors on a Odin Gold clone you can but I would not expect much of a sonic difference vs the one that came with the cable.  If you want to experiment or find out for yourself, go for it.  To me I think it is tuned well.  Changing connectors will change that tuning, which you may or may not prefer compared to stock.  

For clarity I do not dislike Oyaide AC connectors.  I am just not a fan because of the multi layered plating, IME result in a less natural presentation.  I just prefer other connectors.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> I am not saying or recommending anything, only sharing my experiences.  If you want to replace the connectors on a Odin Gold clone you can but I would not expect much of a sonic difference vs the one that came with the cable.  If you want to experiment or find out for yourself, go for it.  To me I think it is tuned well.  Changing connectors will change that tuning, which you may or may not prefer compared to stock.
> 
> For clarity I do not dislike Oyaide AC connectors.  I am just not a fan because of the multi layered plating, IME result in a less natural presentation.  I just prefer other connectors.


Once again, understood | notes taken and appreciated. As stated I’m only looking to sample, as there’s no way of kneeing what’s what otherwise. As it’s simple enough to merely go back to the original stock plugs should it not work out?, as the Viborg silver plated copper plug only cost $21 or thereabouts on Amazon, there’s no need for me to sell an arm or leg to sample it, and put it aside if it doesn’t sound as pleasant?.





Thanks again.


----------



## DenverW (Nov 3, 2022)

The flux-50 that I picked up from the seller that was linked on the bay arrived today.  Haven't had a chance to listen but I can confirm that at least it's wired correctly .

I have power!

Edit: Hmmmm...very positive first impressions.  It makes me want to crack the cable open and see if I'm just hearing placebo or if there is really something special to it.  Running into my amp at the end of the Odin Gold.


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> IMHO,  Viborg is overpriced ...  Monosaudio -  very good for the price...


As my ad here shows, I sold off all of my remaining Viborg type AC | IEC plugs in favor of the ones from Monosaudio, as started I’m looking to try out a silver plated copper IEC Female plug merely out of curiosity, would you happen to know of any brands that offer silver plated ones, where the base metal isn’t brass?.

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649887845-viborg-ac-iec-connectors/


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 3, 2022)

KT77 said:


> As my ad here shows, I sold off all of my remaining Viborg type AC | IEC plugs in favor of the ones from Monosaudio, as started I’m looking to try out a silver plated copper IEC Female plug merely out of curiosity, would you happen to know of any brands that offer silver plated ones, where the base metal isn’t brass?.
> 
> https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649887845-viborg-ac-iec-connectors/


I think,  Oyaide P-037 Silver / Rhodium and Furutech FI-48m NCF Ag  (• α Alpha Pure-Copper Silver-plated Conductor) should be good… but personally have not tried these …

Edit: Furutech FI-48(Ag) NCF - female plug (Around  $150 +  shipping from Japan)


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think,  Oyaide P-037 Silver / Rhodium and Furutech FI-48m NCF Ag  (• α Alpha Pure-Copper Silver-plated Conductor) should be good… but personally have not tried these …
> 
> Edit: Furutech FI-48(Ag) NCF - female plug (Around  $150 +  shipping from Japan)


Thanks Crypt Keeper, 

I’ll research said options, yet was told several months ago the Fi-48(AG) might prove to be a better options | as I’m looking to add ( try ) a silver plated version, I’m more than willing to see where this goes?, as I view playing around with these different types of plating favors on my last power cord, as a means of finalizing the voicing process of my system once and for all….., at which point I merely intend to live out what’s left of life as the Creator sees fit just enjoying life | my wife | family | Mi-Fi as is, provided nothing breaks that is?, I’m not looking to change one single item due to fashion or peer pressure, it simply isn’t how I roll.


----------



## pashkaam

DenverW said:


> The flux-50 that I picked up from the seller that was linked on the bay arrived today.  Haven't had a chance to listen but I can confirm that at least it's wired correctly .
> 
> I have power!
> 
> Edit: Hmmmm...very positive first impressions.  It makes me want to crack the cable open and see if I'm just hearing placebo or if there is really something special to it.  Running into my amp at the end of the Odin Gold.


Congratulations . I also received 4 flux-50 today.
While I can’t say something, I’m listening to the sound at low volume. It seems like he smeared the detail and the attack decreased, this is the first sign that the stage is changing. It seems that a low register has been added or the upper middle has decreased. There is a slight compression of the sound (???) maybe due to a change in the presentation of the overall picture of the music when the sound becomes more, but I can’t say that it still exists. Need a little time.
I want to disassemble one flux-50, see what's inside. Has anyone already opened it?


----------



## DenverW

pashkaam said:


> Congratulations . I also received 4 flux-50 today.
> While I can’t say something, I’m listening to the sound at low volume. It seems like he smeared the detail and the attack decreased, this is the first sign that the stage is changing. It seems that a low register has been added or the upper middle has decreased. There is a slight compression of the sound (???) maybe due to a change in the presentation of the overall picture of the music when the sound becomes more, but I can’t say that it still exists. Need a little time.
> I want to disassemble one flux-50, see what's inside. Has anyone already opened it?


Do it!  I’m super curious!


----------



## pashkaam

I dismantled the well-known miracle FLUX-50 cable. I honestly thought that there were diodes for cleaning DC electricity, in fact it is a simple thick piece of stranded, shielded wire. I think that the original FLUX-50 cable is the same inside. That is, a wire for $3 is sold 50 times more expensive.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> I dismantled the well-known miracle FLUX-50 cable. I honestly thought that there were diodes for cleaning DC electricity, in fact it is a simple thick piece of stranded, shielded wire. I think that the original FLUX-50 cable is the same inside. That is, a wire for $3 is sold 50 times more expensive.


So nothing inside on both ends ? Just wire ?


----------



## pashkaam

* Here is the wire inside*


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 4, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> So nothing inside on both ends ? Just wire ?


YES .

I think the original FLUX-50 cable  has the same thing, only a wire with a signature from the company. Everything is made in China, signatures change.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> So nothing inside on both ends ? Just wire ?


I took the connector apart on the ac plug end only.  I couldn't get the iec part off.  

Can verify it's just stranded shielded copper wire. i think part of the reason for it having such an effect on the sound is the carbon fiber.  Maybe they sprinkled some nano liquid on that iec lol.


----------



## pashkaam

OCC7N said:


> Any body on this thread, using Furutech e-TP80S NCF?
> 
> I was thinking of buying it with a SR Purple fuse and then use my Furutech Flux-50 NCF after it.
> 
> I am wondering if it does something close the FLUX-50 cable


Look at what is inside the already vintage Monster power filter and compare it with the Furutech e-TP80S NCF and you will understand that you have been deceived once again. Much cheaper and much better electronically.
FLUX-50 piece of cheap wire.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> Look at what is inside the already vintage Monster power filter and compare it with the Furutech e-TP80S NCF and you will understand that you have been deceived once again. Much cheaper and much better electronically.
> FLUX-50 piece of cheap wire.



Having more components doesn't necessarily indicate that it's better.

For all you know it could be adding more artifacts into the power stream or over filtering it, possibly flattening the sound.

I think simplicity is best when it comes to power.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> YES .
> 
> I think the original FLUX-50 cable  has the same thing, only a wire with a signature from the company. Everything is made in China, signatures change.


I never bothered to purchase one of these because I was thinking “likely three conductors with Carbon Fiber bodied connectors”.   For the price I am not surprised.  Thanks for opening one up and sharing what you found.


----------



## OCC7N

pashkaam said:


> Look at what is inside the already vintage Monster power filter and compare it with the Furutech e-TP80S NCF and you will understand that you have been deceived once again. Much cheaper and much better electronically.
> FLUX-50 piece of cheap wire.


Do you mean my authentic flux50 is cheap wire?


----------



## cdacosta

What might be an interesting experiment is swapping the connectors on a Odin 2 clone with the Furutech Carbon Fiber bodied clone connectors.  I have listened to several cables in the past where we swapped out the connectors with the clone Furutech and real Furutech and I liked the clone better than the real.  The real sounded too warm and not lively compared to the clone connectors.  I may try this.


----------



## OCC7N

pashkaam said:


> I dismantled the well-known miracle FLUX-50 cable. I honestly thought that there were diodes for cleaning DC electricity, in fact it is a simple thick piece of stranded, shielded wire. I think that the original FLUX-50 cable is the same inside. That is, a wire for $3 is sold 50 times more expensive.


Where are the pictures?

Dont spread misinformation please just because you dissasswmbled a fake one


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I took the connector apart on the ac plug end only.  I couldn't get the iec part off.
> 
> Can verify it's just stranded shielded copper wire. i think part of the reason for it having such an effect on the sound is the carbon fiber.  Maybe they sprinkled some nano liquid on that iec lol.


After the silver-plated wire, a copper, non-grounded shield of the wire is inserted, creating either induction or capacitance of the wire, which anyone can do for $10 of Home Depot. So far, I liked the wires ODIN 2 power cable. A lot of things affect the sound because in the 1900s the ideology about electrons was adopted, which covered the knowledge of electricity with darkness. Today, many manufacturers are simply fooling people into making tweaks for a penny, selling them for 100 and 1000 times more.

Just a thank you to the Chinese that because of the low price, you can disassemble the copy and see what's inside. I think that buying such crap for thousands of dollars, the hand will not rise to open it and see what's inside.


----------



## pashkaam

OCC7N said:


> Where are the pictures?
> 
> Dont spread misinformation please just because you dissasswmbled a fake one


Take the original apart and see what's inside. Prove otherwise that the originals inside are different.
Here are the pics:
Everything is made in China, in most cases.


----------



## OCC7N (Nov 4, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> Take the original apart and see what's inside. Prove otherwise that the originals inside are different.
> Here are the pics:
> Everything is made in China, in most cases.


That one is fake dude!

Not only fake but worse than a fake😂😂😂

Already evident of missing parts


----------



## OCC7N

Aahh you probably one of those ASR guys thats polluting headfi


----------



## pashkaam

OCC7N said:


> That one is fake dude!



Prove otherwise, everything is made in China, ordered exactly. Maximum wire is different from Furutech in the original.


----------



## OCC7N

pashkaam said:


> Prove otherwise, everything is made in China, ordered exactly. Maximum wire is different from Furutech in the original.


Like you would buy a real one and dissassemble it😂😂😂

Dont worry I will prove everything 2023 Q1. 

I understand the anger towards snake oil, but atleast have facts


----------



## cdacosta

Here is an idea that I may endulge.  Ever try those magic plug in the wall or outlet AC line filters?  These are AC rated R-C networks wired in parallel to the hot and neutral.  They work, I have experimented with many designs for two manufacturers of these type of line filters.  Two are installed into my headphone rig now.

Here is the idea… Filter the cable directly.  What if from outlet side (AC connector plug) two conductors are tapped from the connector and wired into said R-C filter array?  What the R-C array is a collection of AC rated caps that step up in frequency that are soldered together across each leg with solid core copper or silver 14ga. wire.  Each leg is then soldered or connected to one HOT and the other to Neutral blades that insert into the outlet.  That is it, super simple.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Take the original apart and see what's inside. Prove otherwise that the originals inside are different.
> Here are the pics:
> Everything is made in China, in most cases.


JC the fake one IS just that $5 per 0.5 meter wire wrapped up in carbon …

I would guess the original is similar design, but instead of $5 wire they using Alpha Nano  + much better quality carbon fiber wrap+ NCF… Again just my wild  guess ...


----------



## pashkaam

OCC7N said:


> Aahh you probably one of those ASR guys thats polluting headfi


Do they interfere with pushing the goods and selling? What is ASR ??? . I didn't understand a word of what you said here.
I don't like when they cheat and I try to find a theory, knowledge of what exactly affects the sound signal and if I can share it with everyone.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Here is an idea that I may endulge.  Ever try those magic plug in the wall or outlet AC line filters?  These are AC rated R-C networks wired in parallel to the hot and neutral.  They work, I have experimented with many designs for two manufacturers of these type of line filters.  Two are installed into my headphone rig now.
> 
> Here is the idea… Filter the cable directly.  What if from outlet side (AC connector plug) two conductors are tapped from the connector and wired into said R-C filter array?  What the R-C array is a collection of AC rated caps that step up in frequency that are soldered together across each leg with solid core copper or silver 14ga. wire.  Each leg is then soldered or connected to one HOT and the other to Neutral blades that insert into the outlet.  That is it, super simple.


Need a schematic to see what's inside the filter. Are there any pictures?


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 4, 2022)

Interesting interview. Here owner company are honest about how wires are made, where , and everything else .


----------



## DenverW

My main curiosity is how the eBay and aliexpress knock off flux-50 compare to the original.  Is it the same structure but different quality components?  Are there missing components in the aliexpress version?  

I was pretty happy with the sound I was getting last night listening with the flux going into my amp, but I’m well aware of potential placebo effect so I make no claims on it doing anything.  

What is the source of the pictures of the flux 50 earlier?  Where was it purchased?


----------



## pashkaam

DenverW said:


> My main curiosity is how the eBay and aliexpress knock off flux-50 compare to the original.  Is it the same structure but different quality components?  Are there missing components in the aliexpress version?
> 
> I was pretty happy with the sound I was getting last night listening with the flux going into my amp, but I’m well aware of potential placebo effect so I make no claims on it doing anything.
> 
> What is the source of the pictures of the flux 50 earlier?  Where was it purchased?


The copper in the screen is not grounded stranded wire 12AWG did its job, it is especially audible after silver. I think so .


----------



## OCC7N

DenverW said:


> My main curiosity is how the eBay and aliexpress knock off flux-50 compare to the original.  Is it the same structure but different quality components?  Are there missing components in the aliexpress version?
> 
> I was pretty happy with the sound I was getting last night listening with the flux going into my amp, but I’m well aware of potential placebo effect so I make no claims on it doing anything.
> 
> What is the source of the pictures of the flux 50 earlier?  Where was it purchased?


Im gonna do a recording A/B with and without the authentic version. But thats will be when my system has finished burnin 2023Q1.

I think Furutech knows what they are doing. They would have been exposed if there were no sound difference.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Trying to purchase the Nano again …It’s so cheap in Japan


----------



## pashkaam

OCC7N said:


> Im gonna do a recording A/B with and without the authentic version. But thats will be when my system has finished burnin 2023Q1.
> 
> I think Furutech knows what they are doing. They would have been exposed if there were no sound difference.


Of course they know. Fools all around. The main thing is to make it beautiful, well, and some simple tricks for $ 1 and the sound will change, and then it’s the advertisers’ business, the main thing is to present it beautifully.


----------



## DenverW

pashkaam said:


> The copper in the screen is not grounded stranded wire 12AWG did its job, it is especially audible after silver. I think so .


It may be me, I’m sorry, but I’m not following this.  It might be a translation thing.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

I think, I’m going to try that cable as well…so cheap + very good reviews …


----------



## cdacosta

Excellent 


Crypt Keeper said:


> Trying to purchase the Nano again …It’s so cheap in Japan


Excellent price!  You could not have already used up your original bottle. Did you?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Excellent
> 
> Excellent price!  You could not have already used up your original bottle. Did you?


Nah, not yet … But I wasted some already … Very sad indeed


----------



## Crypt Keeper

*Fresh  Ali Coupons :*


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, I’m going to try that cable as well…so cheap + very good reviews …





Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, I’m going to try that cable as well…so cheap + very good reviews …


Just disconnected Flux 50 and connected ODIN 2 to amplifiers without Flux 50. Air appeared,
Gone is some booming , better intelligibility of bass and lower register , there is more clarity , the music has become more musically natural . Stage more deeply.
I don't think that this wire as you showed does anything good for music, this is the s same cable is in Flux 50.
It can be recommended for entry level . Too much loss and color in the sound. The same cable can be bought in Home depot.

The same power cable on Flux 50


----------



## DenverW

I’m enjoying playing around with the cables I’ve gotten from Ali.  I think the sub title to this thread should be, “you need to make your own subjective opinions.”  

There is a lot of variation on what’s sounding good/better/best.


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, I’m going to try that cable as well…so cheap + very good reviews …


Crypt Keeper,

I‘ve to add depending upon where you’re looking to use a power cord?, there are plenty of us over on cable asylum ( including myself ) which have found e of the Viborg cords worthy of investigation | said model are ready built, and are the models MBU 1606 | MBU 1501 and respectfully can be found for $98 | $156 depending once again on length?, they’re both 10AWG types and in my case are used on either of my Naim Audio Integrated Amps, where both replaced $600-$800 cords….., just a thought.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 5, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> I dismantled the well-known miracle FLUX-50 cable. I honestly thought that there were diodes for cleaning DC electricity, in fact it is a simple thick piece of stranded, shielded wire. I think that the original FLUX-50 cable is the same inside. That is, a wire for $3 is sold 50 times more expensive.


Well folks, this is one of those things in the audio hobby that ventures into the unexplained and subjective. IMO it sounds good to me... make that "great" to me, especially with two in series, even if it's just made of something very simple. After all, dirt grounding boxes for instance also improved the sound through dampening. It does make me curious to try the entire AC wire made out of that material though. And maybe the flux-50 does have something additional in the ends.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Crypt Keeper,
> 
> I‘ve to add depending upon where you’re looking to use a power cord?, there are plenty of us over on cable asylum ( including myself ) which have found e of the Viborg cords worthy of investigation | said model are ready built, and are the models MBU 1606 | MBU 1501 and respectfully can be found for $98 | $156 depending once again on length?, they’re both 10AWG types and in my case are used on either of my Naim Audio Integrated Amps, where both replaced $600-$800 cords….., just a thought.


I will check out these cables ,  Thanks


----------



## KT77 (Nov 4, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> I will check out these cables ,  Thanks


You’re more than welcome | know that said cords are used on two different integrated amps $3.700 one‘s a hybrid called the Pathos Acoustics Classic Model One MK lll, while the other is a Naim Nait XS3, as well a $5.600  Naim Audio SuperNait 3, and being that both are 10AWG gave me the best bass reproduction and silence between | around notes I’ve had to date.

My latest isolation footers discovery | loving them as placed underneath said SN3, these are the Oyaide INS-BS ( bases ) | INS-CFX ( hybrid carbon fiber isolators ).

Have a good one | be well | stay safe.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 4, 2022)

KT77 said:


> You’re more than welcome | know that said cords are used on two different integrated amps $3.700 one‘s a hybrid called the Pathos Acoustics Classic Model One MK lll, while the other is a Naim Nait XS3, as well a $5.600  Naim Audio SuperNait 3, and being that both are 10AWG gave me the best bass reproduction and silence between | around notes I’ve had to date.
> 
> My latest isolation footers discovery | loving them as placed underneath said SN3, these are the Oyaide INS-BS ( bases ) | INS-CFX ( hybrid carbon fiber isolators ).
> 
> Have a good one | be well | stay safe.


I found these to be excellent quality and very good for the price…







Item# 3256803029524750


----------



## KT77 (Nov 4, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> I found these to be excellent quality and very good for the price…
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I had a set of those…….., I didn’t know they were so huge, as most of my gear is viewed upon as sleeker built, I sold them to a buddy of mine that owns vintage tube amplification.

Said quest ends he….., as I’ve finally found different ones which ideally bring the best out of each component. The only ones not in the photo are a set if Ingress Engineering ball bearing based designs using stainless steel balls | which I replaced with 1 tungsten carbide ball bearing | 2 silicone nitrate bearings these are placed under my Aurender server.


----------



## pashkaam

I went to the workshop where they make stone countertops and from the dumpster I took stone slabs of the correct form what I need it , they are there in any color and size. Stone very heavy and very useful under the legs my DAC and put on top .


----------



## pashkaam

Now I'm stuffing a shopping cart on Aliexpress. 
Does anyone have experience or information on which cable is super for replacing the internal wiring of 3 way speakers?
 Preferably silver plated Lo Mein cables ali

Thanks for help


----------



## szore

pashkaam said:


> Now I'm stuffing a shopping cart on Aliexpress.
> Does anyone have experience or information on which cable is super for replacing the internal wiring of 3 way speakers?
> Preferably silver plated Lo Mein cables ali
> 
> Thanks for help


Paging @cdacosta ...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Paging @cdacosta ...


For internal wiring I would stick with what I know.  Depending on budget there are several excellent choices. I would need to know a lot more about budget, the speaker design and voicing.  

What one can do is call Sonic Craft, these guys know a lot about this topic. They also do or did a lot of work for Wilson and other speaker manufacturers.  They did a great job helping me design exterior cross overs for me in the past.


----------



## dougms3

Since I had to buy earless backstrap duplexes for the powervar plc, I have these extra duplexes that I bought off ali and thought to replace the duplex in my living room that my router plugs into.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2gqqZGs&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

This is a steal for this price btw, I bought it for $20 a few months ago.

It is pretty crazy that this offers an improvement in the sound.  Youtube and netflix picture and color quality looks improved, streaming audio is also improved.  The increase in bass is the most significant change but it seems to have improved in alot of areas.  Even on my pc that is connected wirelessly in another room where all my gear is connected is sounding better.  

Not sure why that has such a huge effect.  Must be alot of noise being injected into the wireless signal or power stream?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 5, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Since I had to buy earless backstrap duplexes for the powervar plc, I have these extra duplexes that I bought off ali and thought to replace the duplex in my living room that my router plugs into.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2gqqZGs&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> ...


Oh yeah, huge improvement since I replaced switching adapters with LPS and iFi iPower X on my router/modem… I only stream oversampled DI.FM, but it is so good now … Also for my router/modem : Purchased small 250 W isolator off e-bay for $108, replaced that cheap outlet with high quality earless monosaudio receptacle , applied the nano...

Also much much better picture quality when TV/ player  connected via the Isolator ...


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> For internal wiring I would stick with what I know.  Depending on budget there are several excellent choices. I would need to know a lot more about budget, the speaker design and voicing.
> 
> What one can do is call Sonic Craft, these guys know a lot about this topic. They also do or did a lot of work for Wilson and other speaker manufacturers.  They did a great job helping me design exterior cross overs for me in the past.


My system.
Active Speakers BRAUN LV1020 with built-in active crossovers and 3 power amplifiers for each speaker .
The sound is open, realistic, full of presence and naturalness. excellent instrument separation, excellent dynamics and stereo presentation. The three-dimensional and photographic nature of the scene is not fully developed, but the sound is not tied to the speakers.
There is absolutely no compression, conciseness that I heard on super expensive KEF equipment start from $20k 

The speakers are not super detailed or fast sounding but have a natural musicality and presentation of the instruments.
I would call these far-field speakers. There is a small hump around 150 hertz, perhaps this is the room.
Woofer: 17Hz resonant frequency. 12" diameter . EQ cutoff frequency 220Hz 12db .
MF speaker with a huge magnet 6" , 





cut off frequency 320 6000 Hz. 12db



All this plays with Mac Mini Jriver via USB on Antipope Zodiac DAC, and via RCA on active speakers BRAUN

I have made some modifications to the amplifier such as selection of transistors, replacement of electrolytic capacitors and others.

The power supply of the amplifier is a simple diode bridge and a 10KuF capacitor. The class AB power amplifier circuit is also vintage, so there are no difficulties in it, everything that came as a signal and power came out, there are not many schematic piles that are chasing the quality of the sinusoidal on the oscilloscope
as in more modern AMPS

This active speaker can reproduce any sound and very accurately shows any changes that are made to the system, whether it's wires or replacing a single transistor.

Odin 2 power cable proved to be excellent in my system today, openness, detail, dynamics thanks to a smart and wise structure with minimal contact with the dielectric wire, so I'm thinking of picking up silver-plated wires of different sections and structure for internal speaker wiring for each speaker. I would appreciate your help if you have any ideas in this direction


----------



## DecentLevi

pashkaam said:


> * Here is the wire inside*


I ordered one of these AC cables, curious how the regular AC cable sounds since it's (purportedly) the same material as with the Flux-50 inline power filter. I'm not sure if all Flux-50 knockoffs are equal though, mine both being from Moonsaudio store and for me I heard improvements in all areas including soundstage, layering, separation and bass texture/definition to name a few. Do notice though they have an option for "bulk wire" which would be without a connection.  

I'm puzzled though is this cable shielded? It seems there is a 4th wire on the outside and some sort of nylon or carbon, not sure.


----------



## LocalMotion

Just wanted to post a follow up... I bought these speakers cables from store Audio Accessary... they were originally listed with gold plated Viborg bananas, but I talked to the store chat and they happily built them with the rhodium plated bananas at my request. The cable itself is 'solid silver' , not plated.

After break in these cables have been everything I was hoping they would. I'm now selling my $1200 pair of reference speaker cables.

They are very detailed, open, fast, and yet smooth. I really like the Viborg products as a whole, I've been replacing some of my tube amps with the RCA connectors and speaker binding posts.... I previously used KLE connectors, but these Viborgs are now my new fav....


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> I ordered one of these AC cables, curious how the regular AC cable sounds since it's (purportedly) the same material as with the Flux-50 inline power filter. I'm not sure if all Flux-50 knockoffs are equal though, mine both being from Moonsaudio store and for me I heard improvements in all areas including soundstage, layering, separation and bass texture/definition to name a few. Do notice though they have an option for "bulk wire" which would be without a connection.
> 
> I'm puzzled though is this cable shielded? It seems there is a 4th wire on the outside and some sort of nylon or carbon, not sure.


I would assume they are not all the same. Got both of mine from AudioConnectorStore. The loose parts inside could very well be a filter.


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> Just wanted to post a follow up... I bought these speakers cables from store Audio Accessary... they were originally listed with gold plated Viborg bananas, but I talked to the store chat and they happily built them with the rhodium plated bananas at my request. The cable itself is 'solid silver' , not plated.
> 
> After break in these cables have been everything I was hoping they would. I'm now selling my $1200 pair of reference speaker cables.
> 
> They are very detailed, open, fast, and yet smooth. I really like the Viborg products as a whole, I've been replacing some of my tube amps with the RCA connectors and speaker binding posts.... I previously used KLE connectors, but these Viborgs are now my new fav....


Do you have a link to that item on ali?

I'm wondering if they can make a headphone cable like that, I'm interested in stuffing as many cores as a 3.5mm plug will fit.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> My system.
> Active Speakers BRAUN LV1020 with built-in active crossovers and 3 power amplifiers for each speaker .
> The sound is open, realistic, full of presence and naturalness. excellent instrument separation, excellent dynamics and stereo presentation. The three-dimensional and photographic nature of the scene is not fully developed, but the sound is not tied to the speakers.
> There is absolutely no compression, conciseness that I heard on super expensive KEF equipment start from $20k
> ...


You seem to love what you hear now. Impossible to feel good to recommend wiring when I would have no clue as to what you are trying to accomplish by changing the wire.


----------



## LocalMotion

dougms3 said:


> Do you have a link to that item on ali?
> 
> I'm wondering if they can make a headphone cable like that, I'm interested in stuffing as many cores as a 3.5mm plug will fit.


Here’s the original listing.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804102330185.html


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> Here’s the original listing.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804102330185.html


Very nice  and not  expensive at all !


----------



## FredA (Nov 6, 2022)

Got my my second flux-50. I tried to open it but stripped one of the two screws. So this will wait.

Since it extends my cable's length by one 30cm, it allowed swapping in an odin2 (odin1 out) on the master clock.

I don't know if it is the odin2 or the flux50 or both but clarity and smoothness improved slightly.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 6, 2022)

LocalMotion said:


> Just wanted to post a follow up... I bought these speakers cables from store Audio Accessary... they were originally listed with gold plated Viborg bananas, but I talked to the store chat and they happily built them with the rhodium plated bananas at my request. The cable itself is 'solid silver' , not plated.
> 
> After break in these cables have been everything I was hoping they would. I'm now selling my $1200 pair of reference speaker cables.
> 
> They are very detailed, open, fast, and yet smooth. I really like the Viborg products as a whole, I've been replacing some of my tube amps with the RCA connectors and speaker binding posts.... I previously used KLE connectors, but these Viborgs are now my new fav....


Great find……, and while I’m aware most here are headphone users | I to use a traditional 2 channel setup | and have a pair of the Chinese NordOst Valhalla SCs, as well as 2 pairs of pure silver ones | in which I’ve installed say gold plated copper banana plugs on the amp ends on all 3 pairs | and both silver plated copper | red copper on the speaker side of these,…., which in a sense is ex the type of signature I was going after. As I’m well aware no one shoe size fits all | playing around with different plating types has proven to be very effective to say the least.


----------



## dougms3 (Nov 6, 2022)

FredA said:


> Got my my second flux-50. I tried to open it but stripped one of the two screws. So this will wait.
> 
> Since it extends my cable's length by one 30cm, it allowed swapping in an odin2 (odin1 out) on the master clock.
> 
> I don't know if it is the odin2 or the flux50 or both but clarity and smoothness improved slightly.


Might save you some time on the iec end.  I opened it up and its just regular stranded copper wire with some pet or ptfe dielectric and pvc with a copper braided shield.

The thick end has the curiosities inside or perhaps its also the same on that end.

No idea what makes this thing tick but it has a strong effect.  Take pics if you take it apart.  I'd like to coat that end with nano liquid as well but I couldn't figure out how to take it apart.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> Might save you some time on the iec end.  I opened it up and its just regular stranded copper wire with some pet or ptfe dielectric and pvc with a copper braided shield.
> 
> The thick end has the curiosities inside or perhaps its also the same on that end.
> 
> No idea what makes this thing tick but it has a strong effect.  Take pics if you take it apart.  I'd like to coat that end with nano liquid as well but I couldn't figure out how to take it apart.


How much did you pay? They is quite a big price variation. I would think they are not all the same. The thick end could indeed have a filtering effect. Anyway, something made the sound here better, that's all that matters.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> How much did you pay? They is quite a big price variation. I would think they are not all the same. The thick end could indeed have a filtering effect. Anyway, something made the sound here better, that's all that matters.


I got it for $34.  I think they made a pricing mistake because they raised it immediately after I bought it.


----------



## runningwitit

After soldering speaker wires with cardas, is there a settle time??


----------



## FredA

runningwitit said:


> After soldering speaker wires with cardas, is there a settle time??


Soldering takes about 20h in my experience.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 6, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I ordered one of these AC cables, curious how the regular AC cable sounds since it's (purportedly) the same material as with the Flux-50 inline power filter. I'm not sure if all Flux-50 knockoffs are equal though, mine both being from Moonsaudio store and for me I heard improvements in all areas including soundstage, layering, separation and bass texture/definition to name a few. Do notice though they have an option for "bulk wire" which would be without a connection.
> 
> I'm puzzled though is this cable shielded? It seems there is a 4th wire on the outside and some sort of nylon or carbon, not sure.


The main thing is to enjoy and not feel fooled. This wire has a screen but it is not connected on both sides.
Wires running close together in parallel always affect the depth of the scene volume in a negative direction. This applies to power, and acoustic wires


----------



## pashkaam

LocalMotion said:


> Just wanted to post a follow up... I bought these speakers cables from store Audio Accessary... they were originally listed with gold plated Viborg bananas, but I talked to the store chat and they happily built them with the rhodium plated bananas at my request. The cable itself is 'solid silver' , not plated.
> 
> After break in these cables have been everything I was hoping they would. I'm now selling my $1200 pair of reference speaker cables.
> 
> They are very detailed, open, fast, and yet smooth. I really like the Viborg products as a whole, I've been replacing some of my tube amps with the RCA connectors and speaker binding posts.... I previously used KLE connectors, but these Viborgs are now my new fav....



Thanks for the wire recommendation. I need wires of different sections for each speaker woofer, midrange, tweeter. separately for internal wiring in the speakers


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 6, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> Thanks for the wire recommendation. I need wires of different sections for each speaker woofer, midrange, tweeter. separately for internal wiring in the speakers


If you  like solid silver : 3256804215843387 3256802079133365 3256801840926381

Silver plated: 3256801282806402  3256803825179278


----------



## runningwitit

FredA said:


> Soldering takes about 20h in my experience.


Lol! I was hoping I wasn't stuck with this sound....lol.lol.lol

Thanks!!


----------



## dougms3

runningwitit said:


> Lol! I was hoping I wasn't stuck with this sound....lol.lol.lol
> 
> Thanks!!


It depends on the solder.  If it has lead in it, it doesn't take long but something like mundorf supreme takes a long time to burn in.


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> It depends on the solder.  If it has lead in it, it doesn't take long but something like mundorf supreme takes a long time to burn in.


Can anyone recommend a 2IS cable they have purchased?


----------



## dougms3

Stax 7 said:


> Can anyone recommend a 2IS cable they have purchased?


I haven't tried it myself but I hear the audioquest vodka knockoff is pretty good, someone mentioned it sounded better than the real AQ carbon hdmi.


----------



## LocalMotion

@Crypt Keeper did the order for Furutech Nano Liquid go thru?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Stax 7 said:


> Can anyone recommend a 2IS cable they have purchased?


2255800069559032


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> @Crypt Keeper did the order for Furutech Nano Liquid go thru?


Unfortunately they would not ship any liquid …


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> I haven't tried it myself but I hear the audioquest vodka knockoff is pretty good, someone mentioned it sounded better than the real AQ carbon hdmi.


Thanks 
dougms3​


----------



## OCC7N

These cables seems to be really cheap and they are OCC:
https://www.adamhall.com/shop/is-en...icrophone-cables/3302/4-star-mmf-1000-krystal

Any idea if they could be good for interconnect.

They are cheaper than there 5 star/OFC cables, hmmmm


----------



## iFi audio

Crypt Keeper said:


> Oh yeah, huge improvement since I replaced switching adapters with LPS and iFi iPower X on my router/modem



Power supplies make a difference, don't they  ?


----------



## FredA

Stax 7 said:


> Can anyone recommend a 2IS cable they have purchased?


https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/4000255873784.html

I like the Gustard hdmi cable even better. Not available anymore, though.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Nice  DC / USB tester ...







Item# 3256801308930397
​


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Mo'  cables !


----------



## Crypt Keeper




----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


>





Crypt Keeper said:


> Mo'  cables !


Thats called audio pornography.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 8, 2022)

2255799858668459 Only $80  VS $150 Amazon...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Thats called audio pornography.


 After almst 4 weeks of NO music,  I finally put everything back together ...


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 9, 2022)

Don't try this at home



... or anywhere. This was my Monday night project, fully 'clothing' one of my Odin Gold AC cables with copper foil. Turns out the sound just became brighter (more treble and reduced bass amount), although perhaps the fidelity and sense of realism _may_ have been a touch better. I spent at least 2 hours on Tuesday removing it. Painstaking process of removing bit by bit, with finger cuts a scrapes, and a lot of copper bit residue all over to clean up, and with fragments and stickyness permanently left on the cable.

My partial covering of about 75% as formerly shown on another Odin Gold cable still may be good - with that one going to my power conditioner I did hear an improvement, but this with full coverage going into my DDC, it just wasn't happening. Overall I don't recommend this procedure because although it technically is reversible, the copper foil tape seems to solidify within a couple hours making it very difficult to properly remove if needed, leaving residue behind on the wire. I may still recommend this concept IF you find a way to apply it solidly with some sort of film between it and cable, as to allow for easier removal. On the other mostly covered cable I'm just leaving it on because it sounds top notch, and I will have to accept the ruined appearance.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 9, 2022)

Also I got 2 different AC fuses from Ali recently. So far, the one I've tried sounds too bright for my tastes. Do fuses change with burn-in? And if so about how much time is generally recommended?

I'm still mostly a skeptic for burn-in of any cables, because I've never heard any difference along the process, at least with any cables I've gotten from AliExpress, IIRC, though maybe a small change with a pure silver solid core interconnects from a genuine source before. Cables seem mostly 'plug & play'.


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> Don't try this at home
> ​
> ... or anywhere. This was my Monday night project, fully 'clothing' one of my Odin Gold AC cables with copper foil. Turns out the sound just became brighter (more treble and reduced bass amount), although perhaps the fidelity and sense of realism _may_ have been a touch better. I spent at least 2 hours on Tuesday removing it. Painstaking process of removing bit by bit, with finger cuts a scrapes, and a lot of copper bit residue all over to clean up, and with fragments and stickyness permanently left on the cable.
> 
> My partial covering of about 75% as formerly shown on another Odin Gold cable still may be good - with that one going to my power conditioner I did hear an improvement, but this with full coverage going into my DDC, it just wasn't happening. Overall I don't recommend this procedure because although it technically is reversible, the copper foil tape seems to solidify within a couple hours making it very difficult to properly remove if needed, leaving residue behind on the wire. I may still recommend this concept IF you find a way to apply it solidly with some sort of film between it and cable, as to allow for easier removal. On the other mostly covered cable I'm just leaving it on because it sounds top notch, and I will have to accept the ruined appearance.


Take lighter gas to clean off the glue.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 9, 2022)

I got from this seller ODIN 2 with Valhalla cable inside 
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...6YOyW6N&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

2255800536141291


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> Don't try this at home
> ​
> ... or anywhere. This was my Monday night project, fully 'clothing' one of my Odin Gold AC cables with copper foil. Turns out the sound just became brighter (more treble and reduced bass amount), although perhaps the fidelity and sense of realism _may_ have been a touch better. I spent at least 2 hours on Tuesday removing it. Painstaking process of removing bit by bit, with finger cuts a scrapes, and a lot of copper bit residue all over to clean up, and with fragments and stickyness permanently left on the cable.
> 
> My partial covering of about 75% as formerly shown on another Odin Gold cable still may be good - with that one going to my power conditioner I did hear an improvement, but this with full coverage going into my DDC, it just wasn't happening. Overall I don't recommend this procedure because although it technically is reversible, the copper foil tape seems to solidify within a couple hours making it very difficult to properly remove if needed, leaving residue behind on the wire. I may still recommend this concept IF you find a way to apply it solidly with some sort of film between it and cable, as to allow for easier removal. On the other mostly covered cable I'm just leaving it on because it sounds top notch, and I will have to accept the ruined appearance.


Pardon for my hands, I'm doing a small project at home. Usually they say for such cases you need paint.
Why paint?
To paint and throw in the trash. Joke .
Clean cable easily with Paint Thinner


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Don't try this at home
> ​
> ... or anywhere. This was my Monday night project, fully 'clothing' one of my Odin Gold AC cables with copper foil. Turns out the sound just became brighter (more treble and reduced bass amount), although perhaps the fidelity and sense of realism _may_ have been a touch better. I spent at least 2 hours on Tuesday removing it. Painstaking process of removing bit by bit, with finger cuts a scrapes, and a lot of copper bit residue all over to clean up, and with fragments and stickyness permanently left on the cable.
> 
> My partial covering of about 75% as formerly shown on another Odin Gold cable still may be good - with that one going to my power conditioner I did hear an improvement, but this with full coverage going into my DDC, it just wasn't happening. Overall I don't recommend this procedure because although it technically is reversible, the copper foil tape seems to solidify within a couple hours making it very difficult to properly remove if needed, leaving residue behind on the wire. I may still recommend this concept IF you find a way to apply it solidly with some sort of film between it and cable, as to allow for easier removal. On the other mostly covered cable I'm just leaving it on because it sounds top notch, and I will have to accept the ruined appearance.


The reason why it won't have the same type of effect as a copper braid inside the the cable is that there are alot of factors that come into play.

Theres intimacy and point of contact, % coverage and configuration of the shield, electrification of the shield, distance from the conductors, etc.

I have played with the sendust tape and 3m copper tape extensively on the wall outlets, circuit breakers, cables, inside amps and dacs, and found that overuse or too close to circuitry causes unusual things to happen.  It kills bass and soundstage for some reason while at the same time making it sound more resolving.  Or sometimes it makes the sound grainy or causes distortion at certain frequencies.  Especially that sendust tape.  It is very powerful stuff.

I placed a strip of it on my this thin aluminum divider on my audio-gd master 19 to see if it would help prevent any emi from the transformers get into the audio signal.  It did reduce noise levels but also basically neutralized all the dynamics, bass and soundstage.  Music just sounded flat but became more resolving and reduced noise.





This is one of the reasons why I dont like active noise cancellation products.  I think its best to try and address noise before the audio chain, once the noise is already injected into the signal, it inherently becomes part of the signal and trying to reduce it or cancel it out at that point causes degradation in the music.  Just a theory on my part but it comes from experience.


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> I got from this seller ODIN 2 with Valhalla cable inside
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...6YOyW6N&gatewayAdapt=


Isn't it upposed to be Odin2?


----------



## ld100

szore said:


> So, yeah, incidently, concerning the burn in of the Odin 2, et. al. and my desktop...I am thinking the power conditioner has also broken in some, but the sound is really unbelievable....especially with the Szalayi and 8 wire cables....its like the gear is utterly transparent and the music just hangs inside your head in this transparent soundstage...



Who makes those headphone cables?


----------



## szore

ld100 said:


> Who makes those headphone cables?


A store on Ali Express:

Hiclass HIFI Connector Store

Amazing cables.


----------



## ld100

szore said:


> A store on Ali Express:
> 
> Hiclass HIFI Connector Store
> 
> Amazing cables.


So you have a link to that seller? Doesn't come up in a search for me.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> The reason why it won't have the same type of effect as a copper braid inside the the cable is that there are alot of factors that come into play.
> 
> Theres intimacy and point of contact, % coverage and configuration of the shield, electrification of the shield, distance from the conductors, etc.
> 
> ...


That probably explains why partial copper foil shielding sounds better to me than full, depending on which device it synergizes with. 

Any opinions on if fuses need burn in?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> That probably explains why partial copper foil shielding sounds better to me than full, depending on which device it synergizes with.
> 
> Any opinions on if fuses need burn in?


The aucharm fuse that I got from ali took quite a long time to burn in.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 9, 2022)

FredA said:


> Isn't it upposed to be Odin2?


This is just the more real ODIN 2; his wire has an air gap. I saw a similar silver wire without an air gap.
Difference of Valhalla and ODIN , Add silver shielding

Any insulation contact with the wire creates sound problems.


----------



## FredA

ld100 said:


> So you have a link to that seller? Doesn't come up in a search for me.


Google it. 
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004220130624.html


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> This is just the more real ODIN 2; his wire has an air gap. I saw a similar silver wire without an air gap.
> Difference of Valhalla and ODIN , Add silver shielding


Very cheap if so. Huge bargain.


----------



## szore

ld100 said:


> So you have a link to that seller? Doesn't come up in a search for me.


He made a 8 wire 7N copper cable custom for me, sounds amazing, cost $70... Not just inexpensive, but great sound. I had the EA ARes 8 wire and did not like it, it sounded strange. But this one really just sounds great. I have 5 of his cables and they are built like tanks and all sound great.


----------



## ld100

szore said:


> He made a 8 wire 7N copper cable custom for me, sounds amazing, cost $70... Not just inexpensive, but great sound. I had the EA ARes 8 wire and did not like it, it sounded strange. But this one really just sounds great. I have 5 of his cables and they are built like tanks and all sound great.


Do you have a better picture by any chance?


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> The reason why it won't have the same type of effect as a copper braid inside the the cable is that there are alot of factors that come into play.
> 
> Theres intimacy and point of contact, % coverage and configuration of the shield, electrification of the shield, distance from the conductors, etc.
> 
> ...


I'll copy your text, I'm collecting interesting experience. What you wrote about is a big step towards achieving good sound.
The fact is that listening to music in headphones and through speakers, the result of the image and stage of music is different, and therefore the approach to setting the sound is different.
Flat stereo without 3D always gives accents and good separation of instruments with large accents and sounds realistic as if the musicians have connected instruments at home and play, but listening to this on speakers does not have the most delicious 3D sound in sound. Listening to headphones music in my head, listening to speakers flat stereo picture .

With headphones, this presentation will sound more interesting.

Therefore, listening to music with speakers may have a slightly different setting to the taste of a person with the same wires and their manufacturing technology. .
For example, by moving the wires to each other, the bass becomes larger and the instruments sound more specific and denser, by pushing the wires apart, detail appears, the endings and all sorts of subtleties are well audible, more air but the bass becomes smaller, but it becomes more vibratory and legible.
Surround sound appears, sometimes it is smeared, some echoes stick out, and if everything is correctly selected, then three-dimensionality will be the reward. This is when you can no longer hear the speakers but only the 3D music around


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Also I got 2 different AC fuses from Ali recently. So far, the one I've tried sounds too bright for my tastes. Do fuses change with burn-in? And if so about how much time is generally recommended?
> 
> I'm still mostly a skeptic for burn-in of any cables, because I've never heard any difference along the process, at least with any cables I've gotten from AliExpress, IIRC, though maybe a small change with a pure silver solid core interconnects from a genuine source before. Cables seem mostly 'plug & play'.


Yes fuses have a burn-in. Depending on the fuse full burn in can take 150 up to 500 hours or more.


----------



## szore

ld100 said:


> Do you have a better picture by any chance?


----------



## pashkaam

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...9423!sh&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
I was advised on Aliexpress a what best USB cable and this is not ONE 2, although I asked them about it  Recommend me different one 
3256803111356881


----------



## pashkaam

I have read many forums. I'm looking for a power outlets. Lots of good reviews for Hubbell Hbl5362. Found for cheap. The photo shows one like this, but I'm confused by the case with a metallic color. Who knows this is a good power outlets for an audio system?


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I have read many forums. I'm looking for a power outlets. Lots of good reviews for Hubbell Hbl5362. Found for cheap. The photo shows one like this, but I'm confused by the case with a metallic color. Who knows this is a good power outlets for an audio system?


I've read reviews stating they're decent for the price but why not just get these.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2MEF0VB&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

Its $12.50 and it sounds amazing for the price.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


>


Man that is thick.  

I like how he spirals the cable at the end instead of leaving it in a braid.


----------



## OCC7N

szore said:


>


Very beautiful! Have your measured the capacitance vs standard headphone cable?

I had the idea of getting the thickest cable for Susvara, but read it will increase the capacitance. On interconnects I see it differs from 30 to 130pF.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> I've read reviews stating they're decent for the price but why not just get these.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2MEF0VB&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> Its $12.50 and it sounds amazing for the price.


It would be great to hear from you or others about comparisons with other power outlets.
Medical Hubbll HBL5363 or HBL5263 are a proven option, there are many descriptions of how the sound becomes, the Chinese ones look very good, but I have not seen the experience of comparing the description of what sound with them.
Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> It would be great to hear from you or others about comparisons with other power outlets.
> Medical Hubbll HBL5363 or HBL5263 are a proven option, there are many descriptions of how the sound becomes, the Chinese ones look very good, but I have not seen the experience of comparing the description of what sound with them.
> Thanks


This one is  really good for the price ATM  2255800795369439
Oyaide R1 Receptacle Outlet


----------



## KT77

As mentioned above…., I use both the Oyaide R1 | R0 and much prefer them over anything else, there’s a certainty on how they both sound, as well as actually reassure me of right amount of pressure needed to secure their hold on the AC Male Plugs on any connector | in my case an Oyide P-004 plug, placed onto the cord for my Puritan Audio Labs PSM-136 or Chang Lightspeed PLC’s.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> It would be great to hear from you or others about comparisons with other power outlets.
> Medical Hubbll HBL5363 or HBL5263 are a proven option, there are many descriptions of how the sound becomes, the Chinese ones look very good, but I have not seen the experience of comparing the description of what sound with them.
> Thanks


I have listened to several Hubbell outlets, including cry’od versions.  They are decent, not high end.  Do you have a budget per duplex outlet?  I am also assuming you are looking for US standard.


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> This one is  really good for the price ATM  2255800795369439
> Oyaide R1 Receptacle Outlet


Thank you . Gave the seller an offer. Sounds better than medical power outlets


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> I have listened to several Hubbell outlets, including cry’od versions.  They are decent, not high end.  Do you have a budget per duplex outlet?  I am also assuming you are looking for US standard.


Hello cdacosta. Yes, I have a US standard power outlet. With a power outlet, I became interested the other day. I don’t even know the budget, if there are real improvements, I’ll willingly empty my pocket but at reasonable prices. thanks for the help


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Thank you . Gave the seller an offer. Sounds better than medical power outlets


NP,  Also chek out the Audiocrast outlets dougms3 mentioned ...


----------



## FredA (Nov 10, 2022)

Got a grouding box, a small one, that i hooked up to my balanced isolation transformer via a 4x20awg shielded silver-plated copper ( 14awg total)  cable that i wrapped with copper tape, to improve shielding. And then put banana plugs and a jacket. Seems to improve the sound, it is so smooth and detailed. But i made many other changes since i listened to this album (Joao Gilberto, Chega De Saudade), i am not sure.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> Got a grouding box, a small one, that i hooked up to my balanced isolation transformer via a 4x20awg shielded silver-plated copper ( 14awg total)  cable i wrapped it with copper tape, to improve shielding. And then put banana plugs and a jacket. Seems to improve the sound, it is so smooth and detailed. But i made many other change since i listened to this album (Joao Gilberto, Chega De Saudade), i am not sure.


Nice!  That  grounding box  needs  a few  days to "stabilize" as well...


----------



## FredA (Nov 10, 2022)

Now that think about it, i listened to this album last night, just some tracks. My impression is the background is clearly blacker with the box. Depth and layering are great. But the volume is higher than normal so again it's not apples to apples.


----------



## FredA

Crypt Keeper said:


> Nice!  That  grounding box  needs  a few  days to "stabilize" as well...


Yes. I read this. And also about the piezoelectric effect.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Hello cdacosta. Yes, I have a US standard power outlet. With a power outlet, I became interested the other day. I don’t even know the budget, if there are real improvements, I’ll willingly empty my pocket but at reasonable prices. thanks for the help


Like anything audio whether it be gear, cabling many tweaks, etc. usually there is a sonic signature or colorization.  Once you start to get into more sensitive and sonically superior components and setups, AC outlets can have a big sonic impact.  Over the years I have listened to or experimented with I think just about every Furutech, Oyaide and some other mainstream alternatives like the Hubbell (and they do have a few variants that are tweaked by different audio companies).  AC outlets to varying degrees also impart a sonic signature.  To my ears, all that I have heard are colored except one outlet.  The least colored and transparent outlet is the Maestro.  Now the Maestro feels and looks like a inexpensive hospital grade outlet, but sonically sounds very good.  The popular Oyaide R1 has a sweetish colorization, especially in the mids.  I also like Furutech pure copper, un-plated outlets which are not expensive.  To the above adding a carbon fiber face plate also works well. 

Higher priced outlets are extremely well built, non-magnetic and look impressive.  But does not mean sonically will match well with a well tuned system.  The ones I mentioned above I feel are the safest in my humble opinion.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Hello cdacosta. Yes, I have a US standard power outlet. With a power outlet, I became interested the other day. I don’t even know the budget, if there are real improvements, I’ll willingly empty my pocket but at reasonable prices. thanks for the help


By the way, I have found the more complex the plating is the more coloration is heard.  In some systems the owner may be looking for such a coloration like the Oyaide R1, but some of the multi level plated outlets "to me" sound off and not natural.  YMMV


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Like anything audio whether it be gear, cabling many tweaks, etc. usually there is a sonic signature or colorization.  Once you start to get into more sensitive and sonically superior components and setups, AC outlets can have a big sonic impact.  Over the years I have listened to or experimented with I think just about every Furutech, Oyaide and some other mainstream alternatives like the Hubbell (and they do have a few variants that are tweaked by different audio companies).  AC outlets to varying degrees also impart a sonic signature.  To my ears, all that I have heard are colored except one outlet.  The least colored and transparent outlet is the Maestro.  Now the Maestro feels and looks like a inexpensive hospital grade outlet, but sonically sounds very good.  The popular Oyaide R1 has a sweetish colorization, especially in the mids.  I also like Furutech pure copper, un-plated outlets which are not expensive.  To the above adding a carbon fiber face plate also works well.
> 
> Higher priced outlets are extremely well built, non-magnetic and look impressive.  But does not mean sonically will match well with a well tuned system.  The ones I mentioned above I feel are the safest in my humble opinion.



Thanks *cdscosta* I'll post tomorrow. I took a quick look, Maestro outlets product store Loves? Tomorrow I will look for information. Power outlets took longer to find than other components.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Thanks *cdscosta* I'll post tomorrow. I took a quick look, Maestro outlets product store Loves? Tomorrow I will look for information. Power outlets took longer to find than other components.


Maestro outlets not made in China.  Produced in USA.

https://www.cruzefirstaudio.com/maestro


----------



## FredA (Nov 11, 2022)

I second the Maestro recommendation. They are neutral, as mentioned.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Maestro outlets not made in China.  Produced in USA.
> 
> https://www.cruzefirstaudio.com/maestro


Thanks for the advice. Neutrality is the most important thing in a system like mine where there is an elementary simple circuit , without a lot of signal and power improvers wound in the circuit.


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> This one is  really good for the price ATM  2255800795369439
> Oyaide R1 Receptacle Outlet


I don't feel so comfortable. Yesterday I made an offer for this two power outlets, Oyaide R1 on ebay  and today the seller agreed 2x $100, and I have already read many forums where the sound rating of these duplexes was divided into two groups for and against.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> I don't feel so comfortable. Yesterday I made an offer for this two power outlets, Oyaide R1 on ebay  and today the seller agreed 2x $100, and I have already read many forums where the sound rating of these duplexes was divided into two groups for and against.


2 R1s for $100 is a real bargain...


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I don't feel so comfortable. Yesterday I made an offer for this two power outlets, Oyaide R1 on ebay  and today the seller agreed 2x $100, and I have already read many forums where the sound rating of these duplexes was divided into two groups for and against.


As I own once again both the Oyaide R1 | R0 outlets and love them both, I’d add as mentioned above the R1 offers a more warmer sense of tonality within the mids, whereas the R1 offers greater low end impact | and view the CruzFirst Maestro as a third alternative favor wise, it merely comes down to how you wish to voice the overall balance of your system long term?, much like the story of Goldilocks and the three bears, one’s to hard | ones to soft, and one being just right holds true with audio accessories as well. In truth….., even more so.



My ad on said Oyaide R0, as it seems I had two of these items laying around, as I tend to buy things more than once, and forget I already have them:

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details...eceptacle-carbon-fiber-aluminum-outlet-cover/


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> As I own once again both the Oyaide R1 | R0 outlets and love them both, I’d add as mentioned above the R1 offers a more warmer sense of tonality within the mids, whereas the R1 offers greater low end impact | and view the CruzFirst Maestro as a third alternative favor wise, it merely comes down to how you wish to voice the overall balance of your system long term?, much like the story of Goldilocks and the three bears, one’s to hard | ones to soft, and one being just right holds true with audio accessories as well. In truth….., even more so.
> 
> My ad on said Oyaide R0, as it seems I had two of these items laying around, as I tend to buy things more than once, and forget I already have them:
> 
> https://www.usaudiomart.com/details...eceptacle-carbon-fiber-aluminum-outlet-cover/


Yes, I look like  the girl Masha from the tale of the three bears.   Now I'm stuffing the basket on aliexpress. The fact is that I now have an Argento Flow RCA interconnect cable, but I want to buy ODIN 2 instead, I hope that what is now cutting my ear will go away. Naturally, the presentation of the music will change, so now I don't like the low-frequency register, and the middle in three-dimensionality is a bit naughty with a microphone echo a little  This did not happen with my DIY cable, but there were other bad distortions in the sound.

Thanks everyone for the help with the power outlets , I'll have a coffee now and post another interesting question about buying cables.


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Yes, I look like  the girl Masha from the tale of the three bears.   Now I'm stuffing the basket on aliexpress. The fact is that I now have an Argento Flow RCA interconnect cable, but I want to buy ODIN 2 instead, I hope that what is now cutting my ear will go away. Naturally, the presentation of the music will change, so now I don't like the low-frequency register, and the middle in three-dimensionality is a bit naughty with a microphone echo a little  This did not happen with my DIY cable, but there were other bad distortions in the sound.
> 
> Thanks everyone for the help with the power outlets , I'll have a coffee now and post another interesting question about buying cables.


I would maybe try the Siltech knockoff if i were you.


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> I would maybe try the Siltech knockoff if i were you.


I filled the basket with some of the outlets what recommended here. Can you provide a link please.

When there are several different duplexes nearby, I can choose what I need, their price is small, if something goes wrong, the refrigerator will freeze better with an audiophile outlet.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> Yes, I look like  the girl Masha from the tale of the three bears.   Now I'm stuffing the basket on aliexpress. The fact is that I now have an Argento Flow RCA interconnect cable, but I want to buy ODIN 2 instead, I hope that what is now cutting my ear will go away. Naturally, the presentation of the music will change, so now I don't like the low-frequency register, and the middle in three-dimensionality is a bit naughty with a microphone echo a little  This did not happen with my DIY cable, but there were other bad distortions in the sound.
> 
> Thanks everyone for the help with the power outlets , I'll have a coffee now and post another interesting question about buying cables.


You’re more than welcome young man. And while I can’t speak on the clone Argento Flow IC’s, I’ve owned the real Organic pure copper IC’s from this company back in 2016, yet over the years have disc in my system copper simply rolls off to much detail, especially at the very top end, and while I’ve ended up with both the Odin 2 Silver standard IC’s | XLR IC’s | Odin Gold IC’s, none of them have made it into the system quite yet, as I’m reluctant to remove my pure silver Yannis Tome 222Connect Litz IC’s, once again……, they’ve just fitted perfectly as how I wanted “ Mi-Fi “ final voicing.

Now onto changing out a few power plug connectors | add a couple of grounding cables | I’m set.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I filled the basket with some of the outlets what recommended here. Can you provide a link please.
> 
> When there are several different duplexes nearby, I can choose what I need, their price is small, if something goes wrong, the refrigerator will freeze better with an audiophile outlet.


Once again, I’ve more or less been a cable | isolation footer hoarder since 2000, and while in my system, based upon what’s hears with my ears | felt with my heart ( as I tend to use both to gauge just how any given component sounds | feels from both a sonic or emotional standpoint, before settling on any of them ) and admittedly much prefer the sound of pure silver, followed by silver plated copper IC’s, I came across via friend, one pair of pure copper IC’s, which stood out, and I’m talking what I consider as my 3rd best sounding cables at the time, as shown here:

https://zavfinousa.com/collections/audio-interconnects/products/arcadia-pc-occ-interconnect-cable

And as I’ve owned real Siltech Explorer Series I90 IC’s, let’s just say they were sold years ago, it’s hard to imagine the cloned versions being any better, but it’s not in me to knock someone else‘s recommendations, I only can speak truthfully on what I’ve heard | owned.


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> Once again, I’ve more or less been a cable | isolation footer hoarder since 2000, and while in my system, based upon what’s hears with my ears | felt with my heart ( as I tend to use both to gauge just how any given component sounds | feels from both a sonic or emotional standpoint, before settling on any of them ) and admittedly much prefer the sound of pure silver, followed by silver plated copper IC’s, I came across via friend, one pair of pure copper IC’s, which stood out, and I’m talking what I consider as my 3rd best sounding cables at the time, as shown here:
> 
> https://zavfinousa.com/collections/audio-interconnects/products/arcadia-pc-occ-interconnect-cable
> 
> And as I’ve owned real Siltech Explorer Series I90 IC’s, let’s just say they were sold years ago, it’s hard to imagine the cloned versions being any better, but it’s not in me to knock someone else‘s recommendations, I only can speak truthfully on what I’ve heard | owned.


Thanks for the young man. I think that Argento Flow clones have original cables, there were comparisons on other forums, I gave a link, the Chinese will not copy what was not in production.
I heard Argento original on tube monoblocks and then I noticed that the sound was a bit choked, like in a muffled room, everything else was just music, three-dimensionality, i can see, touch the musicians with your hands. Argento smooths out the sound well making it musical, clearly creates a three-dimensional stage. It is created with a good dark background. A lot  good things , but for me the bass is not too detailed, but for tuba amps it will be imperceptible.
I listen to some compression in the sound, there is less air. on the tube amp it will not be noticeable.


----------



## FredA (Nov 11, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> I filled the basket with some of the outlets what recommended here. Can you provide a link please.
> 
> When there are several different duplexes nearby, I can choose what I need, their price is small, if something goes wrong, the refrigerator will freeze better with an audiophile outlet.


https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004504586462.html

But I haven't tried them. I have the speaker cables and one power cable. They are awesome.

This should also be considered in this price range. It is a good bet, i own two of their ACSS cables:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/123701363134


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> Thanks for the young man. I think that Argento Flow clones have original cables, there were comparisons on other forums, I gave a link, the Chinese will not copy what was not in production.
> I heard Argento original on tube monoblocks and then I noticed that the sound was a bit choked, like in a muffled room, everything else was just music, three-dimensionality, i can see, touch the musicians with your hands. Argento smooths out the sound well making it musical, clearly creates a three-dimensional stage. It is created with a good dark background. A lot  good things , but for me the bass is not too detailed, but for tuba amps it will be imperceptible.
> I listen to some compression in the sound, there is less air. on the tube amp it will not be noticeable.


Your welcome……, yet I’d wager if something is heard nicely through tube amplification, it should offer a slightly different, but not worth sound on solid state gear, other than the legit NordOst cabling which I’ve come to believe was designed primarily at the time to bring about strengths in pure SET based systems, where they tend to lack nimbleness | top end sparkle, much like in the old days of classic sounding tube gear, relied upon brands like Telefunken | GE | Raytheon to compliment their weaknesses, and restore a sense of balance to the presentation.

The brand Argento, for the most part has remained very very popular amongst East Asian based music lovers, primarily because most love tube gear, and secondly if one was to look closer at the music they listen to….., it isn’t very challenging to say the least, as they tend to like acoustic based instruments, like woodwinds | an occasional drum here or there, and are absolutely smitten with piano trio type recordings, so in that sense none challenging to a cable that’s voiced to spotlight instruments above all else, vocalist need not apply.


----------



## KT77

FredA said:


> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004504586462.html
> 
> But I haven't tried them. I have the speaker cables and one power cable. They are awesome.
> 
> ...


Nice recommendation….., these happen to be some very nice sounding pure silver IC’s. As for the random photos, I view them as audio prone, or eye candy if you’ll, as most people over the years on other forums I’ve been active since 1998, know it’s my way of just trying to add a bit of favor to my responses.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> 2 R1s for $100 is a real bargain...


Likely not original Oyaide R1 at that price. They are clones


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I don't feel so comfortable. Yesterday I made an offer for this two power outlets, Oyaide R1 on ebay  and today the seller agreed 2x $100, and I have already read many forums where the sound rating of these duplexes was divided into two groups for and against.


Looks legit on my end……, the rainbow looking seal is a tell tale sign on their packing ( boxes ) is hard to copy. And seeming they’re being sold stateside versus somewhere in China, is a bonus.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 11, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> I don't feel so comfortable. Yesterday I made an offer for this two power outlets, Oyaide R1 on ebay  and today the seller agreed 2x $100, and I have already read many forums where the sound rating of these duplexes was divided into two groups for and against.



When in doubt?, ask the seller to cancel your order, if he hasn’t shipped them that is?, as you’re the one whom decides what you want, not the other way around…., and while it might take longer to arrive, go with this one first:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/354254554144?epid=1741120245&hash=item527b378420:g:xXYAAOSw5V5i-hRI&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAAoDeRisnNkc0tCr4aop2Egki9siSui+k+bqHqQK4b4BbfO9RmrNBAhkj8nkMOhga5F4y3SlVXvLc5IHApTNRq5mfPzYah87mWbUSQy14fjrbj3MCYtLA/ihujtxWbEptq7UAYXHvXbJ9FDmjxJVmGgOG28gKXJdhc9x4WY66c+nSQ9YxvzB3Vpzxc6F0LgCQwdgVaeAMbRp/epxm3dJ5HVGc=|tkp:Bk9SR7i284ONYQ

Having spent 9 years of my youth stationed in Japan, I can say they aren’t into deception, and are very very honorable people, it’s some of the other culture, which I find are the biggest liars.

After having tried the R0, and only if you feel you want a slightly warmer | creamier presentation?, then pursue an R1 with a vengeance.


----------



## KT77

Once again….., here’s my own personal take on the subject of Oyaide AC Receptacles, which was written awhile back:

https://db.audioasylum.com/mhtml/m....arch.mpl?forum=tubediy&session=20220912104700

YMMV……, but I think not.


----------



## pashkaam

Now the topic and questions will be about *speaker cables*.
And so, I already wrote but I will repeat.
My active speakers have a short wire length inside the speaker itself and wires are suitable for each speaker from the individual amplifiers. Three way system. I want to change the wires from the amplifier to the speakers.

Chose the following options.:


Odin 2, cable for speakers, it is the same cable that goes as an interconnect and as a USB cable .
The wire itself for DIY is sale more expensive than ready-made with connectors at the ends. I think to take the interconnect ODIN 2 and put it for the speakers. What are its advantages:

1 Shielded, the shield can be passive, not connected, it is unique in that it has minimal contact with the dielectric like Valhalla.
In principle, this is the same Valhalla but with a silver screen.
2. 
Another question is whether to put 15AWG on one wire in the screen from Odin 2 power cable to the LF woofer or will it create a greater reverse flow of electricity from the speaker to the transistors?

I am also considering a cable for speakers like Valhalla without a screen.

What do you think and advise.?
What size wire is needed for different speakers?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Now the topic and questions will be about *speaker cables*.
> And so, I already wrote but I will repeat.
> My active speakers have a short wire length inside the speaker itself and wires are suitable for each speaker from the individual amplifiers. Three way system. I want to change the wires from the amplifier to the speakers.
> 
> ...


A few reviews said that Odin wire is excellent for interconnects but didn’t perform well as a speaker cable...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Likely not original Oyaide R1 at that price. They are clones


I think, those were legit R1’s .. The  price really went down due to the lows on Japanese Yen...


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, those were legit R1’s .. The  price really went down due to the lows on Japanese Yen...


As stated, I’ve used these over and over during the years since 2009, the ones he picked up on eBay looked legit to me as well.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I think, those were legit R1’s .. The  price really went down due to the lows on Japanese Yen...


Not for long Japanese yen just hit the 139 to $1 mark, coming back strong.


----------



## dougms3 (Nov 11, 2022)

Just an update with this.

I recently received some copper washers from ali and replaced the stainless steel washers where the y spades and ring terminals connect to the pcb.  And of course nano liquid in between all contact points.  The retail price on the nano liquid has gone up to $190 btw. 

After some burn in time the sound has changed a bit, pretty much only improved.  Dynamics all around are extremely punchy.  Separation, soundstage, depth in particular has improved quite a bit.  Listening with my focal clears, its indistinguishable from speakers at this point.  Bass has also increased from before burn in, which is surprising, I thought it would calm down a bit.  It hits absurdly hard with the denon d7200s. 

I must reiterate that the only thing in my audio chain that is connected to this plc is my pc.

I regret being a cheap bastage with the 14awg and not getting the 12awg neotech occ copper wire.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 11, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Just an update with this.
> 
> I recently received some copper washers from ali and replaced the stainless steel washers where the y spades and ring terminals connect to the pcb.  And of course nano liquid in between all contact points.  The retail price on the nano liquid has gone up to $190 btw.
> 
> ...


Viborg red copper spades……., way to go, and don’t feel bad about buying the smaller gauge neotech wires, as they seem to fit said spades | application nicely.

Yet I’d have added several 1/2” layers of shrink wrap from the midpoint of the lower hex screw to the central location beneath the opening of the spade itself, it would look tidier, as well as prevent the wires themselves from being exposed to oxygen.


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> Your welcome……, yet I’d wager if something is heard nicely through tube amplification, it should offer a slightly different, but not worth sound on solid state gear, other than the legit NordOst cabling which I’ve come to believe was designed primarily at the time to bring about strengths in pure SET based systems, where they tend to lack nimbleness | top end sparkle, much like in the old days of classic sounding tube gear, relied upon brands like Telefunken | GE | Raytheon to compliment their weaknesses, and restore a sense of balance to the presentation.
> 
> The brand Argento, for the most part has remained very very popular amongst East Asian based music lovers, primarily because most love tube gear, and secondly if one was to look closer at the music they listen to….., it isn’t very challenging to say the least, as they tend to like acoustic based instruments, like woodwinds | an occasional drum here or there, and are absolutely smitten with piano trio type recordings, so in that sense none challenging to a cable that’s voiced to spotlight instruments above all else, vocalist need not apply.


Ops, I'm talking about the Argento Flow IC cable. Now soldered make from USB ONE 2 (the same as for the speakers, the same as the IC cable odin 2 ) and so I soldered the DC cable going from the power Linear sp  to my DAC. A completely different "opera" coming  out of the speakers. The bass became legible, vibrating, the no compression , more air, more clear no plastic echos on mids,  it plays like my DIY cable, but better, much better . The piano began to sound harmonious, ..... 


I have unhappy neighbors, since I often test short fragments on different records, I can poke for a long time song by song testing my sound system 
Sorry ARGENTO . 
Best if I clean up my all negative posts about Argento .


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> Ops, I'm talking about the Argento Flow IC cable. Now soldered make from USB ONE 2 (the same as for the speakers, the same as the IC cable odin 2 ) and so I soldered the DC cable going from the power Linear sp  to my DAC. A completely different "opera" coming  out of the speakers. The bass became legible, vibrating, the no compression , more air, more clear no plastic echos on mids,  it plays like my DIY cable, but better, much better . The piano began to sound harmonious, .....
> 
> 
> I have unhappy neighbors, since I often test short fragments on different records, I can poke for a long time song by song testing my sound system
> ...


Adjust said remarks accordingly | just enough it. Neighbors and all.


----------



## pashkaam

Wow. A small DC wire made from ODIN 2 IC, miracles. I don't know where to go next. I'm listening to a Deep Perple concert ("The Now What! Live Tapes (CD1, VICP-70192), just fly away, I'm at a concert, Argento separates the instruments very clearly, the tonal, balance is excellent. I need a time  to listen, after a while ideas for improvement will begin again.


----------



## Zaek

Guys, need some help. I opened Odin Gold plug to apply the Nano Liquid but had some issue putting this plastic piece back (see arrow).
Any advice how to put it back properly?


----------



## pashkaam

Zaek said:


> Guys, need some help. I opened Odin Gold plug to apply the Nano Liquid but had some issue putting this plastic piece back (see arrow).
> Any advice how to put it back properly?


very simple, throw it away, you don't need it, I didn't have it on mine . Apparently it was put in order to secure the wire when the internal bolts are crimped and going to wire


----------



## ld100

KT77 said:


> You’re more than welcome young man. And while I can’t speak on the clone Argento Flow IC’s, I’ve owned the real Organic pure copper IC’s from this company back in 2016, yet over the years have disc in my system copper simply rolls off to much detail, especially at the very top end, and while I’ve ended up with both the Odin 2 Silver standard IC’s | XLR IC’s | Odin Gold IC’s, none of them have made it into the system quite yet, as I’m reluctant to remove my pure silver Yannis Tome 222Connect Litz IC’s, once again……, they’ve just fitted perfectly as how I wanted “ Mi-Fi “ final voicing.
> 
> Now onto changing out a few power plug connectors | add a couple of grounding cables | I’m set.



What cable is it?


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Guys, need some help. I opened Odin Gold plug to apply the Nano Liquid but had some issue putting this plastic piece back (see arrow).
> Any advice how to put it back properly?


I experienced the same thing.  What I eventually figured out is where to place the clear sleeve before sliding the shell back in place.  Its a b*tch but can be done.  Must be patient while doing it.

I see the Oyaide EMI tape and know you applied the Nano Liquid.  How does it sound to you after these two tweaks?


----------



## Zaek

cdacosta said:


> I experienced the same thing.  What I eventually figured out is where to place the clear sleeve before sliding the shell back in place.  Its a b*tch but can be done.  Must be patient while doing it.
> 
> I see the Oyaide EMI tape and know you applied the Nano Liquid.  How does it sound to you after these two tweaks?


Noise was reduced. Background becomes darker. 
And Nano does make the music sounds more LIVE and natural. Loving it so far


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Noise was reduced. Background becomes darker.
> And Nano does make the music sounds more LIVE and natural. Loving it so far


Nice.  Now curious, where else within your system did you apply the Nano Liquid?


----------



## Zaek

cdacosta said:


> Nice.  Now curious, where else within your system did you apply the Nano Liquid?


Powercord and interconnect


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Noise was reduced. Background becomes darker.
> And Nano does make the music sounds more LIVE and natural. Loving it so far


If they only knew how dramatic an improvement it can make...


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Powercord and interconnect


First I am glad that if I had anything to do with you or others trying the Nano Liquid, I absolutely love the stuff.   If after trying the Nano Liquid on your power cord and interconnect you like the results, I think you will be amazed what the sonic benefits are after applying to "all" mechanical connections.  Even inside gear, All internal PC parts, inside gear, fuses/fuse holders, ethernet, coax,  AC outlet connections, etc., etc.  To do an entire system it is a project, but after it is all done and burned in... so worth it!  The benefits you heard is magnified.  With every mechanical connection improved, noise floor is lowered, which means purer signal transmission and more information heard.  Food for thought...


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> If they only knew how dramatic an improvement it can make...


agreed bro!


----------



## szore

I plan on getting the Nano in January. I want all my cables to be reasonably burned in before I apply the liquid goodness.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I plan on getting the Nano in January. I want all my cables to be reasonably burned in before I apply the liquid goodness.


Well sir, I think you will be pleasantly surprised what improving the mechanical connections and minimizing the micro arcing of the electrical signals at the connections will do for your system.  Not only will you "hear more", your system will "sound and feel" more refined.  Hard to verbalize the difference, must be heard and experienced to understand. 

The way I wrap my head around what is happening is when micro arcing occurs, the electrical signal is distorted or causes a level of distortion or noise floor.  The now distorted signal (however minor the distortion) is then amplified throughout the system.  It is obvious to me that with "just about" every application or treated mechanical connection, there is an audible positive change that can be heard.  After treating enough mechanical connections within a system it is so obvious the benefit of improving mechanical connections that conduct an electrical signal.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 11, 2022)

I'm sure this Nano fluid works great. If  search for words like _Graphene oxide_,  can be find what kind of chemical it is that not only heals contacts, but also much more.
  There will be time I will study this issue more with  magic contact fluid


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Most recently I have tried the Nano an all fuses I have installed/replaced and all DC cables (LPS side only so far) and Yes ! I can hear the difference ... I have not applied the nano to my other components so far (besides some AC connectors) b/c I will be making more changes soon … Don’t want to waste this precious liquid.


----------



## FredA (Nov 12, 2022)

I got the Stabilant 22 contact enhancement liquid this summer. I tried it on a fuse. I hated the effect and l clean it off within a week. I should have gone for the Furutech.


----------



## KT77

ld100 said:


> What cable is it?


Said primarily used IC’s over the course of the last 4 years | very very difficult to better are shown here:

https://gaia.cabledesigns.co.uk/html/gaia_connect_-rca-rca.html


----------



## ld100

KT77 said:


> Said primarily used IC’s over the course of the last 4 years | very very difficult to better are shown here:
> 
> https://gaia.cabledesigns.co.uk/html/gaia_connect_-rca-rca.html


On Ali Express thread?? 😂


----------



## ld100

So which RCA out of sea of fakes on AliExpress worth getting?


----------



## KT77

ld100 said:


> On Ali Express thread?? 😂


I’ve purchased 11 of said AliExpress cables to date, which are awaiting an opportunity to be placed into my system as it stands for more than 2-3 tracks, the only two in use are the thicker Odin 2 USB Cable | Odin Gold AC Cord.

Once again, I’m reluctant to replace said pair of IC’s, yet obviously have bought into the entire concept behind said AliExpress cables, I can assure you, otherwise I wouldn’t have bothered joining just to find out more, now would I?. Let’s not get beside yourself young fella, wrong type of brother I can assure you.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 12, 2022)

thanks….


----------



## KT77

One more for ld100.

items I’ve owned | sold:

SOLD​


Roksan Xerxes 20 Plus Piano Black w|. Tonearm | PSU | Cartridge




Price: $2,900.00Original Price:$10,270.00Days/Views: 2323 / 3333 (Posted 2016-07-03)Condition:9/10 Excellent/Like NewAccessories:Original box, manual

Seller: el34eh@yahoo.com   (Contact Seller)
(Other Seller Items For Sale)Feedback: 5.0/5.0
Hi Vinyl Lovers,
Here's my last ad for the season, and one that should make someone with a large record collection quite happy for years to come, as I've always seen|heard this particular turntable as one of my top 5 every since hearing the original version back in 1989, yet it has evolved to the point where what one gets today, is well above the sonic merits of what was capable at the time.
While more often then not, I've seen these tables listed minus a tonearm or PSU for around $4.500, here we've for offer a Mint|NM ( small light scratch underneath the platter at say 1" long and barely visible ) where here once again, this one includes the Tabriz Zi tonearm ( $1.600 ) along with the RPM " Reference Power Supply " ( $2.600 ) as well as a Dynavector DV-10x5 ( $550 ) all one has to do is the math, to see that this is actually one very nice offer, as these have set idle over the course of the last two years, and only ever played for all of one track to measure the speed accuracy and cartridge alignment, so all are in Mint|NM condition as one would ever hope to find.
As this is one of those cases, where the rarity of said table and combined accessories forbid me from excepting anything less, so my offer remains firm on this one, yet as always........, who knows, you might catch me in one of those even rarer moods, where I mind consider a lower price?, as the moon might be in a certain location where I just feeling at peace with the universe, and will except a sane offer, as I'm not totally gone all cosmic as of yet.
So, once again I'd say this would make someone an ideal Christmas gift, and prove what vinyl is truly capable of without breaking a sweat, and offer a pride of ownership where your family members and friends|associates will look at you in amazement for having invested so wisely in such a well crafted, and very very very music piece which plays tunes with such a sense of " correctness " very little else around you would seem to matter.
So dig deep, and invest in yourself or a loved one, as these don't come around with all these goodies included all that often, and trust me........., I've been watching them for years. And an even greater reassurance is knowing these still have a company around to fix things should something go wrong, how many turntable manufactures are even still around to service many of the other brands one sees listed?, hence this would in fact make a much wiser investment then some.
Once again........., I'm opened to sane offers, so don't let my stated price scare you away, let's negotiate a fair price that would please us both. As I know that this ad was placed during the Christmas season, and some have already blown their funds, but do keep in mind, this is one of those tables that deserves to be heard, if not outright owned, yet my ad is about to be pulled, as I'd much rather not have to keep lowering its price, so it's up until next month, and if nothing else, it stays in house.
Happy Holidays, and here's hoping to hear from you soon, and what would be a better way to bring in Christmas or New Years then with the warmth and organic nature of vinyl served up right?........., well I can think of a few things, but will keep my thoughts clean, at least publicly.
Let's make this one happen, shall we?.
Thanks for viewing my ads, once again, and by all means know that I'm a mere click away.
Regards, O_o scar

Payment and ShippingPay By:*Paypal*Ship Weight:60 lbs.Ships From:48225 (Harper Woods, MI)Ships To:USA and CanadaShippers/Payer:UPS, FedEx, Postal / Paid by: BuyerShipping Notes:(none)


More Seller InfoSeller: el34eh@yahoo.com   (Contact Seller)
(Other Seller Items For Sale)Membership: AudiophileAsylum Feedback: 5.0/5.0AudigoN Feedback:El34eheBay Feedback:Msthang56Location: Michigan, United StatesRegistered on: 2003-09-06Posts: 1360 



Laughter is good, no?.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> My system details are once again shown here:
> 
> 
> Matters ' H/ear ' SystemIP Address: Last Update: October 13, 2022 at 11:03:40​Amplifier:[ 1 ] Audiomat Arpege 10 Reference
> ...


You may want to omit your email and ip address for safety consideration.


----------



## dougms3

ld100 said:


> So which RCA out of sea of fakes on AliExpress worth getting?


Depends on what you're looking for.

Interconnects, power, master clock, lps, sendust tape, sex toys, whatever you want they have it for really cheap lol.

I bought some shoes, a sweater, and for some reason a karambit knife (thanks cdacosta), in addition to alot of other things I don't need.


----------



## ld100

dougms3 said:


> Depends on what you're looking for.
> 
> Interconnects, power, master clock, lps, sendust tape, sex toys, whatever you want they have it for really cheap lol.
> 
> I bought some shoes, a sweater, and for some reason a karambit knife (thanks cdacosta), in addition to alot of other things I don't need.



Looking for a few interconnects. 2 and 3 feet. To run between dacs, amps, active speakers. I see a lot of McIntosh and other cables that clearly are fakes but look great. Wondering what is good and worth getting.


----------



## dougms3

ld100 said:


> Looking for a few interconnects. 2 and 3 feet. To run between dacs, amps, active speakers. I see a lot of McIntosh and other cables that clearly are fakes but look great. Wondering what is good and worth getting.


I haven't tried the mcintosh or cardas knockoffs but based on the price, I'd imagine they are just cheap knockoffs.

I would recommend starting off with the nordost odin 2 knockoffs, many people have tried them here and while there are many versions of them, even the lesser quality versions are excellent.  Comparable to stuff that costs 10-20x more.  For interconnects around 2-3 ft, I've seen them go for about $40 give or take a few bucks.  The stores are saturated with these cables so you would need to contact the seller to try and see if the cable he's offering is the "better" version.  The problem is, its very difficult to verify as you would have to take the connectors off and compare them to each other.  I forget the exact differences.  

The difference is very small, either way, it will probably be much better than what you are replacing.

What I and certain others are attempting to do with changing connectors and such, is to try and improve the cable, as it does leak quite a bit of emi.  This is not necessary, we are audiophiles and are always chasing dragons so if you want to, you can but its not required.


----------



## ld100

dougms3 said:


> I haven't tried the mcintosh or cardas knockoffs but based on the price, I'd imagine they are just cheap knockoffs.
> 
> I would recommend starting off with the nordost odin 2 knockoffs, many people have tried them here and while there are many versions of them, even the lesser quality versions are excellent.  Comparable to stuff that costs 10-20x more.  For interconnects around 2-3 ft, I've seen them go for about $40 give or take a few bucks.  The stores are saturated with these cables so you would need to contact the seller to try and see if the cable he's offering is the "better" version.  The problem is, its very difficult to verify as you would have to take the connectors off and compare them to each other.  I forget the exact differences.
> 
> ...



Can you point me to one of the Odin versions that you think ok to buy? Thanks


----------



## Crypt Keeper

ld100 said:


> So which RCA out of sea of fakes on AliExpress worth getting?


IMHO, 3256802010602042   or  3256802010599389


----------



## dougms3

ld100 said:


> Can you point me to one of the Odin versions that you think ok to buy? Thanks


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...00029672275017!sea&curPageLogUid=7LJdmMzXZbd9

Just going by the picture this one looks like the better version but its hard to tell as they all copy each other's pictures.

You'd have to ask seller how many cores and the diameter of the conductor.  @Crypt Keeper is more familiar with that info.

Like I said though, I think the performance difference is marginal.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> You may want to omit your email and ip address for safety consideration.


Thanks.., but I’m good as I don’t response to anyone I don’t know, and it’s only my username that’s listed.


----------



## ld100

For 25 I might just give it a try... Just for the looks of it.


----------



## KT77

KT77 said:


> My system details are once again shown here:
> 
> 
> *el34eh@yahoo.com*'s Music Matters ' H/ear ' SystemLast Update: October 13, 2022 at 11:03:40​Amplifier:[ 1 ] Audiomat Arpege 10 Reference
> ...


----------



## Shiraz (Nov 12, 2022)

I'll jump in here with my observations as a longtime follower of this thread. @dougms3 is on the money in his post - the Odin Golds are an excellent place to start and offer incredible value.  They do vary, but my (successful) approach has been to stick to well reviewed items from popular sellers. I am a fan of the audioConnector store and bought my Odin ICs from them here: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US

For what it's worth, in my system the Odin Gold ICs were beaten (only just) by a pair of Tara Labs RSC Vector ICs bought here:  https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US.  They offered a smidgeon better insight, clarity and a wider soundstage, at the expense of a touch of the warmth of the Odins.  Fantastic cables overall.

On power cables, the "gold star" as far as many are concerned goes to the Odin Gold, of which there are also a number of variants. I bought mine from Getwire on the back of good experiences in this thread: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US.  I haven't received mine yet, but have had incredible success with an Accuphase clone that has had a lot of coverage in the Australian forums:  https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US.  Can't wait to compare the two, but the Accuphase will be tough to beat.

It makes me wonder just how many undiscovered but incredible cables are available on AE but have yet to have their limelight. Count me addicted.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 12, 2022)

Thanks….., links have been rather difficult for me to cut and paste, I got all three pairs of said Odin 2 Silver standard RCA and XLR IC’s as well as the Odin Gold RCA IC’s from the sellers, Getwire or RPM Digital, as well as the Odin Gold power cord, all of which appeared thicker than the cheaper ones, I paid all of $125 for the IC’s and $223 or so for the power cord.

Not trying to knock anyones budget……, I merely wanted the versions which appeared better made.



Shiraz said:


> I'll jump in here with my observations as a longtime follower of this thread. @dougms3 is on the money in his post - the Odin Golds are an excellent place to start and offer incredible value.  They do vary, but my (successful) approach has been to stick to well reviewed items from popular sellers. I am a fan of the audioConnector store and bought my Odin ICs from them here: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> For what it's worth, in my system the Odin Gold ICs were beaten (only just) by a pair of Tara Labs RSC Vector ICs bought here:  https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US.  They offered a smidgeon better insight, clarity and a wider soundstage, at the expense of a touch of the warmth of the Odins.  Fantastic cables overall.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the endorsement on both the Tara Labs RSC Vector IC’s | Accuphase clone power cord, both have made it into my cart | beautifully priced as well, and being a proponent of pure silver, it can’t hurt to have options available when needed?.


----------



## DenverW

So i've managed to keep control fairly well for the 11.11 sale, only purchasing a 16.99 modular cable from xinhs that was marked up to $169 so they could put it on sale for $16.99 .  I've had good luck with them in the past, and I need a simple cable that can run 2.5 and 4.4.

Who knows, maybe i'll grab another power cable or something, or another odin silver rca.


----------



## pashkaam

Judging by the reviews of various forums, a good cable for Valhalla 2 speakers. They say it's even better than the original. Does anyone have one like this? ?        ?           ?
3256804182786789


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> Judging by the reviews of various forums, a good cable for Valhalla 2 speakers. They say it's even better than the original. Does anyone have one like this? ?        ?           ?
> 3256804182786789


Most of the buyers on various forums, including myself as stated in my post here:

https://www.audioasylum.com/audio/cables/messages/18/183259.html

Actually prefer the ones which appear to be red and white, they can be found cheaper on eBay to boot.

And……., as mentioned on eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/225029571020


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> And……., as mentioned on eBay:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/225029571020


This is a different wire from Ebay , this one sells for $14 per 1 meter. Strangely, I looked and compared them both , the difference is that the expensive one has 28x22AWG and the cheap one has 18x0.7mm(21AWG) 

The one that was expensive , people compared with the original is similar and plays well. Cheap no reviews.


----------



## Shiraz

KT77 said:


> Thanks for the endorsement on both the Tara Labs RSC Vector IC’s | Accuphase clone power cord, both have made it into my cart | beautifully priced as well, and being a proponent of pure silver, it can’t hurt to have options available when needed?.


My pleasure! Thanks for your input and reflections on this excellent thread- it's been a blast to read.


----------



## Geared4me

pashkaam said:


> Judging by the reviews of various forums, a good cable for Valhalla 2 speakers. They say it's even better than the original. Does anyone have one like this? ?        ?           ?
> 3256804182786789


I have these cables on order from RM Digital along with the matching jumpers. I am currently using Clarity Cable Organic speaker cables so they will be up against some stiff competition.


----------



## KT77

Shiraz said:


> My pleasure! Thanks for your input and reflections on this excellent thread- it's been a blast to read.


You’re more than welcome | I’m deeply honored I’d share insight where I could……, as I’m the type that can only speak truth on what I’ve hear or owned, as the old tv show X-Files used to state “ The Truth Is Out There “, I believe we just need to know where to look.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> This is a different wire from Ebay , this one sells for $14 per 1 meter. Strangely, I looked and compared them both , the difference is that the expensive one has 28x22AWG and the cheap one has 18x0.7mm(21AWG)
> 
> The one that was expensive , people compared with the original is similar and plays well. Cheap no reviews.


Once again, when in doubt?, spend more and go with the better option.


----------



## KT77

Apologies I intended to drop this for those of you looking for ac outlet covers, as awhile back many of us over on Tweaker Asylum discovered options to both the more expensive offerings from Furutech | Oyaide cover……, he also offers a nice sounding titanium screw to hold said covers in place, which sound wonderful as well:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/133425075429


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Apologies I intended to drop this for those of you looking for ac outlet covers, as awhile back many of us over on Tweaker Asylum discovered options to both the more expensive offerings from Furutech | Oyaide cover……, he also offers a nice sounding titanium screw to hold said covers in place, which sound wonderful as well:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/133425075429


Do you have the link to the titanium screws?  I can't seem to find it in his store.

Btw @DecentLevi this might be a better option for you to try and shield the odin cable.  Then you can sleeve with techflex over it if you want.  Makes for a neater presentation and full coverage.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/133335088956?hash=item1f0b63ff3c:g:olMAAOSw75xa061c


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Do you have the link to the titanium screws?  I can't seem to find it in his store.
> 
> Btw @DecentLevi this might be a better option for you to try and shield the odin cable.  Then you can sleeve with techflex over it if you want.  Makes for a neater presentation and full coverage.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/133335088956?hash=item1f0b63ff3c:g:olMAAOSw75xa061c


The article is here:

https://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=tweaks&m=211007

It seems he’s selling the screws, as well as said carbon fiber ac outlet cover via his own site these days, shown here:

https://kamaudio.com/Titanium-Screws-for-US-AC-Receptacles


----------



## pashkaam

Just a recommendation.
Install new cables and other new things only one at a time, and not all at once, so that later you do not have to return to the original one that was.

Sometimes one cable can do a lot and not in the best direction.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> Just a recommendation.
> Install new cables and other new things only one at a time, and not all at once, so that later you do not have to return to the original one that was.
> 
> Sometimes one cable can do a lot and not in the best direction.


Good advice | I’ve found over the course of the last 6-8 years in my case……, that my system came together once I stumbled upon the right voicing of IC’s | USB | Cord used on the source component itself, once again in my case this was on the DAC, as logically one music begins here, get this wrong, and nothing further downstream is going to restore the signal itself. And with all things digital in my mind requires speed | attack of notes | P.R.A.T. to be spot on, silver plated copper or pure silver cabling and cords do this to my ears | senses in a manner copper never could, YMMV.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 13, 2022)

KT77 said:


> Good advice | I’ve found over the course of the last 6-8 years in my case……, that my system came together once I stumbled upon the right voicing of IC’s | USB | Cord used on the source component itself, once again in my case this was on the DAC, as logically one music begins here, get this wrong, and nothing further downstream is going to restore the signal itself. And with all things digital in my mind requires speed | attack of notes | P.R.A.T. to be spot on, silver plated copper or pure silver cabling and cords do this to my ears | senses in a manner copper never could, YMMV.


I completely agree . I'm just now at this point of the DAC, and specifically the DC power cable. . My DAC is powered by an external power supply, changing the DC power cable sounds completely  different, just a huge impact depending on the cable. 
I read on the forum one interesting engineer, before making a cable, he listened to it in different directions in the break of one positive cable to the speakers. I want to try experimenting in the same direction
but with different thickness, configuration and other options , but on a DC DAC cable. If I manage to find and make the right cable, then I will change all the DC wiring in the amplifier in addition, but until the DC power cable for the DAC is made, there is nowhere to go for improvement.
Although I bought a bunch of cables yesterday.

I'm wondering why it changes so much and why the tonal balance, detail, three-dimensionality changes, the attack that even the deaf will hear by changing only one DC cable to the DAC.
By the way, with a bad DC Power cord to the DAC the interconnect cables are simply bare, easy can immediately hear where and how they lie in the music .


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I completely agree . I'm just now at this point of the DAC, and specifically the DC power cable. . My DAC is powered by an external power supply, changing the DC power cable sounds completely  different, just a huge impact depending on the cable.
> I read on the forum one interesting engineer, before making a cable, he listened to it in different directions in the break of one positive cable to the speakers. I want to try experimenting in the same direction
> but with different thickness, configuration and other options , but on a DC DAC cable. If I manage to find and make the right cable, then I will change all the DC wiring in the amplifier in addition, but until the DC power cable for the DAC is made, there is nowhere to go for improvement.
> Although I bought a bunch of cables yesterday.
> ...


Thanks for agreeing with my assessment | yet as it has been awhile since I’ve purchased any LPSs, but I do use a Teddy Pardo one on our Auralic Aries Mini located in our bedroom system, and can highly recommended said LPSs | as well as his DC Cable both of which are shown here:

https://teddypardo.com/product/tedd...ply/?Ref=search&attribute_pa_cable-type=55-25

https://teddypardo.com/product/power-supply-cable/

Simply select the brand | model of your device needing power and it offers a list of options.


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> Thanks for agreeing with my assessment | yet as it has been awhile since I’ve purchased any LPSs, but I do use a Teddy Pardo one on our Auralic Aries Mini located in our bedroom system, and can highly recommended said LPSs | as well as his DC Cable both of which are shown here:
> 
> https://teddypardo.com/product/tedd...ply/?Ref=search&attribute_pa_cable-type=55-25
> 
> ...


Why are you posting pictures? I understand if you posted a picture of power supply on the topic of conversation.
Interestingly, their power cable Teddy Pardo is not expensive that you posted .. But, I will make the DC cable myself. Yesterday I made another one, though copper. 
DC cable Odin 2 from AliExpress sells costs more than $ 100 +, I don’t remember , but the wire is the same as Odin 2 USB, IC this cable Reduced the size of the instruments, make small  but plays in great detail. .( I dont like it )
I tried it for a couple of days and made another out of copper. There wasn't much time to burn it, but I know if the cable didn't play right away on fist moment , there's nothing to look forward to


----------



## pashkaam

I accidentally found silver conductive glue on Aliexpress for repairs. An interesting thing is to cover the tracks of the board, contacts, connections and more. It will be necessary to look for how good he is in our affairs for music.
Has anyone tried or knows something about this silver contact glue?
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...c4!60488218599!sea&curPageLogUid=FistxjiVK9Vz


----------



## KT77 (Nov 14, 2022)

Iv


pashkaam said:


> Why are you posting pictures? I understand if you posted a picture of power supply on the topic of conversation.
> Interestingly, their power cable Teddy Pardo is not expensive that you posted .. But, I will make the DC cable myself. Yesterday I made another one, though copper.
> DC cable Odin 2 from AliExpress sells costs more than $ 100 +, I don’t remember , but the wire is the same as Odin 2 USB, IC this cable Reduced the size of the instruments, make small  but plays in great detail. .( I dont like it )
> I tried it for a couple of days and made another out of copper. There wasn't much time to burn it, but I know if the cable didn't play right away on fist moment , there's nothing to look forward to


I’ve been posting pictures regardless of which forum since 2015, as I enjoy adding a bit of flavor to what I often see as a boring bland ass type of response to post, it seems over the years since, it has caused plenty of viewers to send me PM, regarding said photos wanting to know the brand and model of said pictured items….., so in a sense they’ve captured other’s imagination as they’ve mine.

There are some items one can DIY, and there are times one needs to buy into what’s already assembled | leave it at that, hence my recommendation for this DC cord.

Case in point……, while I’m very capable of building a grounding cable for my iFi AC iPurifier, I went ahead and purchased the one shown ( free world, yah know ):


----------



## KT77

Lastly……., here’s another place to purchase DC cables from a reputable dealer, for those of you like myself whom can’t build their own:

https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/list-dc.html

Look Ma, not photos.


----------



## KT77

And here’s the type of LPS I actually purchased from this seller, other than the ones from Teddy Pardo or Paul Hynes Designs:

https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/det...ual-ultra-low-noise-linear-power-supply-8v5v/

Other brands were either said ZeroZone or Studer900 Chinese made products.


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> And here’s the type of LPS I actually purchased from this seller, other than the ones from Teddy Pardo or Paul Hynes Designs:
> 
> https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/det...ual-ultra-low-noise-linear-power-supply-8v5v/
> 
> Other brands were either said ZeroZone or Studer900 Chinese made products.


I wonder what's inside PS. I see the Chinese DC cable as I had it, I took it apart, the usual two wires.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I wonder what's inside PS. I see the Chinese DC cable as I had it, I took it apart, the usual two wires.


As someone whom has admitted to not having soldering skills, nor like some of my Asian buddies here in Michigan | where they tend to open up every single component to study them, as if they’re looking to reverse engineer said designs, or improve upon internal parts?. I’m someone that spends hours, if not days researching an item, and have the willingness to just pursue it, and while I’m here to primarily learn about how some go about using different type of platings or pure copper on either RCA | Binding Post | Banana Plugs | Power Cord Connectors and so on….., and have replaced cables in my system like $1.600 IC’s | $2.750 SCs with these exact Chinese Odin makes, and am in a much much better place…., I’m still one that’s willing to invest logically where said items have made improvements in my way of listening | to me each move bought about a certain sense of enlightenment, and being someone whom never second guesses what I hear | feel while attempting to weave through the BS!, once again, “ I find myself in a much better place these days “, so much thanks | appreciation to those whom made many of aware of said cables.

And no doubt about it……., here’s another random photo, I tend to save them as visual reminders of items I’m looking to buy, if for no other reason than to make others aware of what’s out there. I’m to assume some might actually prefer using pure silver rca connector?, but I’d be wrong, eh?.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

The Ultimate Monosaudio Plug


----------



## KT77 (Nov 14, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Ultimate Monosaudio Plug


Are you saying you took the blades from one of their cheaper rhodium plated copper versions, versus the ones which have rhodium plated base metal, and replaced it’s carbon fiber body, on the ones that go for $18 the set?, smart move….., as I’m about to do a combination of red copper and rhodium plated ones with the shell of their more expensive models called the M109R | F109R, which offers a different look on carbon fiber shells.

My bad……., said version with the white carbon fiber shells were going for $18 the set last week, which it seems someone caught that price, which has gone up to $46, which is still a great option | provided one buys a set of the cheaper ones which are actually rhodium plated copper, versus rhodium plated brass.

Once again, smart move.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Yes,  the  carbon fiber one is plated Brass,  so I did this  combo ... Total cost :  around $40 ...


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes,  the  carbon fiber one is plated Brass,  so I did this  combo ... Total cost :  around $40 ...


Way to go…….., now that’s what I call being creative.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> And here’s the type of LPS I actually purchased from this seller, other than the ones from Teddy Pardo or Paul Hynes Designs:
> 
> https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/det...ual-ultra-low-noise-linear-power-supply-8v5v/
> 
> Other brands were either said ZeroZone or Studer900 Chinese made products.


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2FEkPeZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I have this sengterbelle LPS, works great.  I can't really compare to anything else since its the only LPS I have but its solidly built and it outperformed the ifi ipower x ps in sound quality.  

I like it the LPS so much I just bought this GX16 2 pin to DC 2.5mm pure silver cable to replace the stock cable.  I think it was a price mistake again because they raised it by double the price after I bought it.  Either way free return if its not up to par.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...277NoGA&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Ultimate Monosaudio Plug


This set was a steal for $18.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2FEkPeZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> I have this sengterbelle LPS, works great.  I can't really compare to anything else since its the only LPS I have but its solidly built and it outperformed the ifi ipower x ps in sound quality.
> 
> ...


Nicely built DC cable from my end……, pure silver to boot, go ahead with your bad self young man.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 14, 2022)

KT77 said:


> Are you saying you took the blades from one of their cheaper rhodium plated copper versions, versus the ones which have rhodium plated base metal, and replaced it’s carbon fiber body, on the ones that go for $18 the set?, smart move….., as I’m about to do a combination of red copper and rhodium plated ones with the shell of their more expensive models called the M109R | F109R, which offers a different look on carbon fiber shells.
> 
> My bad……., said version with the white carbon fiber shells were going for $18 the set last week, which it seems someone caught that price, which has gone up to $46, which is still a great option | provided one buys a set of the cheaper ones which are actually rhodium plated copper, versus rhodium plated brass.
> 
> Once again, smart move.


M/F  109 looks  awesome,  but not  cheap at  all ...  I also have M/F 109 - Very  good  quality at this  price point...
Edit : I also have M/F 106*​


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> This set was a steal for $18.


Indeed... but  not anymore


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Indeed... but  not anymore


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2FEkPeZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I have this set also, I think this one is better because it doesn't set off the NC voltage detector at all.  The monosaudio version sets it off but only if it comes in contact with the plug.


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> M/F  109 looks  awesome,  but not  cheap at  all ...  I also have M/F 109 - Very  good  quality at this  price point...
> ​


As I’ve always preferred to see the innards of these plugs | earlier on I became very fond of the transparent versions of IeGO Power makes, sold via Acoustic-Fun.com, which are currently being used on a lot of brands of late, yet I settled upon a pair of the pure silver rhodium plated ones called the 8095s, which retail for $145 each, but have proved long term to be a very wise investment in self, these were soldered by Jennifer, onto one of her Jena Labs Crimson Red RX ( silver plated copper ) power cord @ $250 | 1.5m, as dedicated to my Aurender server.

My way of thinking is……., one doesn’t spend upwards of $1.500-$3.990 on a dedicated music server ( even slightly used ) and settles on say a $50-$123 power cord, not when one that taps out just under $600, offers better overall performance.

And now onto another one of my random photos, of which I hope many of you don’t mind?, it has become more or less my signature. Great investment on the 109s on your part as well.


----------



## DecentLevi

Zaek said:


> Guys, need some help. I opened Odin Gold plug to apply the Nano Liquid but had some issue putting this plastic piece back (see arrow).
> Any advice how to put it back properly?


With steady hands I was able to hold it snugly enough to exert the base back over it after taking mine apart. I would think it helps to prevent dislodging the connections.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2FEkPeZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> I have this set also, I think this one is better because it doesn't set off the NC voltage detector at all.  The monosaudio version sets it off but only if it comes in contact with the plug.


Thanks dougms3,

Saved onto my wishlist on AliExpress.


----------



## DecentLevi

@dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


2255800390848273 - 16 Kg, Great  quality for the price...


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


Unfortunately, I'm not too familiar with grounding boxes.  I'm curious about them myself.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


Unfortunately I have not tried any of the "grounding boxes for hifi" that  AliExpress is selling.  I looked at a few pics of the internals of one of the boxes and they may or more likely do nothing.  The one I saw which I will include a link have a mixture of parts that could effect EMI but from my experience only used on top of gear, internal chips/parts or on top of power supplies and such.  Kind of like using Shatki Stones or onlines.  Those crystals and materials can in fact effect what is heard when placed near or on top of said gear.  But at a distance plugged into AC outlet or line level input or output of gear, I would need to hear it myself to believe it.

As crazy as it may seem, crystals can in fact effect electrical signals in a audio signal.  Spent a year or so experimenting with the concept and use Shatki products currently.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...216684935269545178e357c!12000025884501911!rec


----------



## cdacosta

This is not the thread for this topic but I will throw it out there for anyone that wants to look into it.  If you look at my signature you will see within my current headphone setup I am using three Hammond 193L chokes within my system.  My home system used 8+ of these chokes. These chokes are used to smoothen the AC power similar to how it is used with tube gear.  Relatively inexpensive $50 - $60 each and works like a champ.  Ever heard of Richard Gray Power Company?  What put him on the map was back in the day he would bring what he called RGPC 400 Pro to the big audio shows.  These varying sized PLC (RGPC 400, 600 and 1200) were 5H and 10H (H= Henry) chokes in parallel to the AC duplex.   These chokes will also absorb some AC spiking coming from the grid or within your AC circuit.

Can be wired just HOT and Neutral in parallel to any where within your system's AC.  Meaning at the wall, plugged into PLC, power strip or wired directly into power cord.  For added warmth to a system attach a ground lead to the chassis and to AC ground.  The choke itself is just a heavy metal enclosure with two leads coming out of it for HOT and NEUTRAL.   I buy them from Parts Express, probably sold elsewhere also.  These chokes are silent and run cool (no heat come from these chokes) when plugged into AC and do not degrade or have to be replaced.

How I use these 193L chokes in my headphone setup.  Two are wired parallel into a single AC plug (Oyaide male plug but does not really matter, any decent plug will do), and plugged into main PLC from wall.  I have one wired to AC plug that is plugged into the Balanced power isolation station that powers my PC which is source.  The cool thing about these chokes is they are easy to install.  There is a choke, 4 little rubber feet (to install under choke), an AC male plug and extra wire (use 14ga copper) up to 2' if needed to extend length if needed.  No soldering required.  Just wire up a male AC plug and plug it into your system.  Takes about 3 days or so to hear full effect.  Can experiment with multiple chokes within different areas in your system and AC circuit.  I love these chokes for audio.

I like these chokes enough I even placed a few of them inside enclosures for esthetics. I will take a couple pics and upload.


----------



## cdacosta

Hammond 193L by itself which is on top of a piece of wood and 193L inside DIY enclosures.


----------



## DecentLevi

Crypt Keeper said:


> 2255800390848273 - 16 Kg, Great  quality for the price...


Cool, it will consider it soon. Please let me know your user experience. In your view, how did it change the sound? And which component(s) was it connected to? Did you use an aftermarket cable or the stock one?


----------



## szore

You guys are over my head...have to admit I am a little lost...what exactly is a 'grounding box' and how do you use it?


----------



## KT77

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


While my recommendation might seem a tad overpriced at $250, I view said purchases as a means to an end as opposed to buying cheaply, and then in the long run end up buying several times over….., in said case I’d think it’s more logical to invest in the best type of grounding device one can for their system and be done with it….., and since I use one of this companies power line conditioners, the only other ones that come to mind are Synergistic Research | Entreq, which both cost more.

Anyways, here yah go:

https://theaudiophileman.com/ground-master-puritan-review/

https://www.thecableco.com/accessories/grounding-devices/micro kit groundbox kit.html

I hope this helps?.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> This is not the thread for this topic but I will throw it out there for anyone that wants to look into it.  If you look at my signature you will see within my current headphone setup I am using three Hammond 193L chokes within my system.  My home system used 8+ of these chokes. These chokes are used to smoothen the AC power similar to how it is used with tube gear.  Relatively inexpensive $50 - $60 each and works like a champ.  Ever heard of Richard Gray Power Company?  What put him on the map was back in the day he would bring what he called RGPC 400 Pro to the big audio shows.  These varying sized PLC (RGPC 400, 600 and 1200) were 5H and 10H (H= Henry) chokes in parallel to the AC duplex.   These chokes will also absorb some AC spiking coming from the grid or within your AC circuit.
> 
> Can be wired just HOT and Neutral in parallel to any where within your system's AC.  Meaning at the wall, plugged into PLC, power strip or wired directly into power cord.  For added warmth to a system attach a ground lead to the chassis and to AC ground.  The choke itself is just a heavy metal enclosure with two leads coming out of it for HOT and NEUTRAL.   I buy them from Parts Express, probably sold elsewhere also.  These chokes are silent and run cool (no heat come from these chokes) when plugged into AC and do not degrade or have to be replaced.
> 
> ...


Not off topic in the least, as I too have used a RGP 400 in the past, yet found my way over to all things Clang Lightspeed, as well as currently using a Puritan Audio Labs PSM-136, and couldn’t be happier with the results. Once again….., not being the technician type, I’ll leave said chokes and wiring harnesses to those with greater knowledge on how said items function, I only wish I had paid more attention in electronics training courses in my youth.


----------



## szore

KT77 said:


> Not off topic in the least, as I too have used a RGP 400 in the past, yet found my way over to all things Clang Lightspeed, as well as currently using a Puritan Audio Labs PSM-136, and couldn’t be happier with the results. Once again….., not being the technician type, I’ll leave said chokes and wiring harnesses to those with greater knowledge on how said items function, I only wish I had paid more attention in electronics training courses in my youth.


Don't feel bad, I was an Electronics Technician in the US Navy (35 years ago) and I hardly ever know what the hell is going on around here!


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Not off topic in the least, as I too have used a RGP 400 in the past, yet found my way over to all things Clang Lightspeed, as well as currently using a Puritan Audio Labs PSM-136, and couldn’t be happier with the results. Once again….., not being the technician type, I’ll leave said chokes and wiring harnesses to those with greater knowledge on how said items function, I only wish I had paid more attention in electronics training courses in my youth.


I also have tried Chang Lightspeed line conditioning products in my systems in the past.  

Chokes are a simple, passive parallel device plugged into the AC circuit.  I use them as part of a wholistic approach to AC line conditioning for audio.  The cool thing about this tweak is one can plug it in a open AC socket within the circuit and "hear" or "not hear" a positive change.  They work better closer to or at AC source feeding one or multiple components.  The tweak is inexpensive, easy to implement, easy to remove or move around.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> @dougms3 @KT77 @cdacosta  or anyone - can you recommend a good grounding box, and from which seller? I'm looking for something under about 20 kg, and I would experiment with connecting it to either my power conditioner and/or RCA 'dummy jacks' of my amp. Maybe there's still a sale on one. As far as I know, the bigger the better with these, right? 😁


You can do it yourself. there is information on the internet. All components are simple, the secret filling is Tourmaline can be searched on google.com.
Other options are also possible. If you find something please share.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> Cool, it will consider it soon. Please let me know your user experience. In your view, how did it change the sound? And which component(s) was it connected to? Did you use an aftermarket cable or the stock one?


This box is similar to Nordost Qkore ($6K) and the Enteraq ($2.5 K and above) … The box will not “color” the sound, but lower the noise floor, thus: blacker background, better tonality and timbre of the music, better clarity across all frequencies.. In high resolving system it brings more details….

I’m using 3256801606656922 grounding cables, though the newer version banana connector might not feet in the terminal and has to be replaced, but the wire quality is excellent…

I found this great review:

https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/


----------



## DecentLevi

Hi guys thanks on the grounding box advice. I need an in-room solution since I don't own a house and have access to the actual ground, and wanted a premade system so I don't have to DIY. 

@Crypt Keeper the one you recommended says it doesn't ship to my address. And it says $575. I guess I'm looking to start with something cheaper. I've already gotten the two small cone size dampening devices but I'm looking to go with something bigger...

@cdacosta the one you recommended
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...216684935269545178e357c!12000025884501911!rec
looks somewhat small. Is it the one that made a big difference for you?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Hi guys thanks on the grounding box advice. I need an in-room solution since I don't own a house and have access to the actual ground, and wanted a premade system so I don't have to DIY.
> 
> @Crypt Keeper the one you recommended says it doesn't ship to my address. And it says $575. I guess I'm looking to start with something cheaper. I've already gotten the two small cone size dampening devices but I'm looking to go with something bigger...
> 
> ...


I am not recommending that product, the link is so you can see the internals of the box.  I have not so far experienced such a product, used like it is advertised that did anything.   Maybe, I am misunderstanding the application.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 15, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> Hi guys thanks on the grounding box advice. I need an in-room solution since I don't own a house and have access to the actual ground, and wanted a premade system so I don't have to DIY.
> 
> @Crypt Keeper the one you recommended says it doesn't ship to my address. And it says $575. I guess I'm looking to start with something cheaper. I've already gotten the two small cone size dampening devices but I'm looking to go with something bigger...
> 
> ...


3256802761190275  $535/  shipped / via pay-pal.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> I am not recommending that product, the link is so you can see the internals of the box.  I have not so far experienced such a product, used like it is advertised that did anything.   Maybe, I am misunderstanding the application.


I went to the DIYaudio site, to see what they write and how they do it, it turned out that the people there laughed at this device with a grounding box.


----------



## DecentLevi

pashkaam said:


> I went to the DIYaudio site, to see what they write and how they do it, it turned out that the people there laughed at this device with a grounding box.


To say that they laughed at a device, if anything casts a shadow on their character. Unless they have actually tried it, they have no valid point. Grounding works by absorbing free electrons and the like, dampening. I have already heard a difference with the two very tiny cylinder shaped grounding devices I got a couple dozen pages back from AliExpress but barely barely so, as such I want to get something a lot bigger and see what can be had. But I'm not going to step up to the plate for like $500, hopefully I'll find some budget wooden box from China as a starter.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> To say that they laughed at a device, if anything casts a shadow on their character. Unless they have actually tried it, they have no valid point. Grounding works by absorbing free electrons and the like, dampening. I have already heard a difference with the two very tiny cylinder shaped grounding devices I got a couple dozen pages back from AliExpress but barely barely so, as such I want to get something a lot bigger and see what can be had. But I'm not going to step up to the plate for like $500, hopefully I'll find some budget wooden box from China as a starter.


Yes, I agree, there are many techies who rely on fundamental knowledge of physics no more. When the theory about electrons was pushed through, the scientific world thought that someone really fried in the scientific council. With the history of the world the same crap and so on. Therefore, we do not have an ideal cable and all developments are based on non-fundamental knowledge.


----------



## dougms3

Interesting stuffs with the grounding boxes.  

Was wondering why they're so expensive.  It seems that each manufacturer uses a different mixture of rare earth minerals and crystals.  

For example tourmaline has some interesting properties, this is one of many abstracts from the National Library of Medicine.

Abstract​ 
_Tourmaline (electric stone, a type of granite stone), common granite stone, ceramic disks, hot spring water and human palmar energy (called "Kikoh" in Japan and China), all which emit electromagnetic radiation in the far infrared region (wavelength 4-14 microns). These materials were thus examined for effects on human leukocyte activity and on lipid peroxidation of unsaturated fatty acids. It was revealed that these materials significantly increased intracellular calcium ion concentration, phagocytosis, and generation of reactive oxygen species in neutrophils, and the blastogenetic response of lymphocytes to mitogens. Chemotactic activity by neutrophils was also enhanced by exposure to tourmaline and the palm of "Kikohshi" i.e., a person who heals professionally by the laying on of hands. Despite the increase in reactive oxygen species generated by neutrophils, lipid peroxidation from unsaturated fatty acid was markedly inhibited by these four materials. The results suggest that materials emitting electromagnetic radiation in the far infrared range, which are widely used in Japan for cosmetic, therapeutic, and preservative purposes, appear capable of potentiating leukocyte functions without promoting oxidative injury._

So it definitely has some interesting properties, it emits radiation in the form of an emf in the far infrared spectrum.  It looks like has it significant effect in the role of negative ions but its unclear to me how it works exactly.  I'm guessing other minerals and rare earth minerals may also possess similar types of properties and combining them together may produce some kind of "magic" effect but it is beyond my understanding.  I don't have an opinion whether it works or not since I haven't tried it but it seems to stem from some logic as the radiation from tourmaline does affect the EMF in infrared spectrum.

With all of the stuff that I've tested out on my system that does crazy things that I can't explain, I tend to use it if works and try to figure out the science later if I can.


----------



## DecentLevi

Oh yes this makes perfect sense.

Black hole hifi ground box with hair and antenna and copper shield.
Only $260 shipped 





https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804013942504.html


----------



## DecentLevi

Oh I spoke with the seller. The above is just the beginning, and it's filled with these minerals and such like this




https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832861104282.html


----------



## KT77

szore said:


> Don't feel bad, I was an Electronics Technician in the US Navy (35 years ago) and I hardly ever know what the hell is going on around here!


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> I also have tried Chang Lightspeed line conditioning products in my systems in the past.
> 
> Chokes are a simple, passive parallel device plugged into the AC circuit.  I use them as part of a wholistic approach to AC line conditioning for audio.  The cool thing about this tweak is one can plug it in a open AC socket within the circuit and "hear" or "not hear" a positive change.  They work better closer to or at AC source feeding one or multiple components.  The tweak is inexpensive, easy to implement, easy to remove or move around.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 16, 2022)

*I have a question for the owners of IC ODIN Gold. Is the gold shielding a foil or a Christmas dielectric?*
////////////
I have noticed clearly that when using the ODIN 2  silver my DIY DC cable for my DAC there is very much loss of instrument size and voice in the music and significantly.
Perhaps the same cable can affects the sound of the system in the same way when it is in different places like an IC.
 I don't have ODIN 2 silver yet and I want to ask those who have Odin 2 silver:
*Do you have a decrease in the physicality (mid-bass) of the music, the size of the instruments when using ONE 2 silver?*

What I like about my system is that the sound of the instruments, the voices are close to real size with the full presence of the musicians in my room, especially when I go outside to smoke a cigarette, and here it plays like from small speakers.


----------



## KT77

pashkaam said:


> I have a question for the owners of IC ODIN Gold. Is the gold shielding a foil or a Christmas dielectric?


As I was willing to pay the price for the version that cost over $200, as it seemed better built, I’m not one to butcher said items for the sake of reverse engineering it, nor any of my cables, yet as I’ve re-terminated a few SCs as a means of shortening them, or place better quality banana plugs onto them, I couldn’t help but notice the true origin of said cables……, which lead me to buy several bulk versions of this same cable | which was much cheaper by the way, and thus build my own, but in truth……, I’m quite content with the build | sound of said Gold power cord, and am only looking to change the power connectors | live with it as is.

Oh……, you’ll notice my random photo is in fact a power cord, so it’s relevant to your post, so no need for sly remarks, of which aren’t humorous to me in the least.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> *I have a question for the owners of IC ODIN Gold. Is the gold shielding a foil or a Christmas dielectric?*
> ////////////
> I have noticed clearly that when using the ODIN 2  silver my DIY DC cable for my DAC there is very much loss of instrument size and voice in the music and significantly.
> Perhaps the same cable can affects the sound of the system in the same way when it is in different places like an IC.
> ...


I have both Odin 2 and Odin Gold balanced interconnects and power cables. The foil shielding on both types of cables are not grounded and look and feel of the same aluminum foil material except the color. 

I am using them on a headphone setup and cannot comment on sizes of instruments but can say that my system feels like there are no real borders when it comes to sound staging.  I am referring to width and depth.


----------



## pashkaam

KT77 said:


> As I was willing to pay the price for the version that cost over $200, as it seemed better built, I’m not one to butcher said items for the sake of reverse engineering it, nor any of my cables, yet as I’ve re-terminated a few SCs as a means of shortening them, or place better quality banana plugs onto them, I couldn’t help but notice the true origin of said cables……, which lead me to buy several bulk versions of this same cable | which was much cheaper by the way, and thus build my own, but in truth……, I’m quite content with the build | sound of said Gold power cord, and am only looking to change the power connectors | live with it as is.
> 
> Oh……, you’ll notice my random photo is in fact a power cord, so it’s relevant to your post, so no need for sly remarks, of which aren’t humorous to me in the least.


I didn't understand . Does ODIN Gold IC SC have foil shielding or is it plastic gold?

At the expense of photography, again, not the topic, this is not the cable we are talking about here. Why do we need these stupid photos that are not related to the topic of conversation?


----------



## KT77 (Nov 16, 2022)

pashkaam said:


> I didn't understand . Does ODIN Gold IC SC have foil shielding or is it plastic gold?
> 
> At the expense of photography, again, not the topic, this is not the cable we are talking about here. Why do we need these stupid photos that are not related to the topic of conversation?


Understood in some ways, but as I’m stated “ I’m not one to butcher cables or cords “ as I appreciate them for what they’re, if you’re personally able to build better ones and market them?, then talk crap.

I‘ll continue to post whatever I like, I’d highly advise your silly ass don’t look at my post, ****ed up cap you‘re wearing by the way. It’s weird……, you’re trying your best to look like the comedian “ Fluffy “,  but the truth be told, in my world….., you’re a ****ing clown.🤡


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> I have both Odin 2 and Odin Gold balanced interconnects and power cables. The foil shielding on both types of cables are not grounded and look and feel of the same aluminum foil material except the color.
> 
> I am using them on a headphone setup and cannot comment on sizes of instruments but can say that my system feels like there are no real borders when it comes to sound staging.  I am referring to width and depth.


Thank you, I heard what I wanted. 
Sound stage, that's different. I meant only a reduction in the body of the instruments, as if mid-bass is missing.
It's strange, but in ODIN Gold power cable  a wire wrapped with a gold dielectric like from a Christmas tree no foil . 
 The strange thing is that the same wires Odin 2 and Odin Gold sound differently based on the information in this forum.
In Odin 2 (silver) the foil is dense and thick and is not connected to ground.


----------



## KT77

Guys, I’m signing off now, as I just don’t have it in me these days to have disputes with clowns, if anyone could ever wish to write me?, hit me up over on Audio Asylum, I go by the username of El34eh@yahoo.com, no it isn’t my email address | just a title I chose over 19 years ago, and didn’t want to lose my previous post, so decided to let it stick.

Thanks to those of you whom were willing to share your vision with me, on several of the topics which on my end needed to be clarified | now that I’ve learned all that I believe I didn’t know, it’s time to step back and live out whatever’s left of life, not regretting said lessons, but no longer having to deal with rude ass people.

Over | Out.

Take care of yourselves | loved ones.
Salaam.


----------



## pashkaam

Back to FLUX 50.
I just unplugged the only Flux 50 that was wired to my DAC power supply and immediately heard a more detailed and clearer sound.
Inside Flux 50 there is an EMI filter, which can be put at the input of an amplifier or other equipment,
 2. If you replace the Flux 50 copper cable  with ODIN 2 cable, then there will be a better result, since a small piece of wire adds color to the sound (copper sound).
In the original Flux 50 :  inside AC-1501R EMI filter features a parallel circuit with in-line coil and condenser, reducing noise at 1MHz by 10dB and at 10MHz by more than 30dB.
But rather, in the Chinese Flux 50, there can be an ordinary cheap filter for $ 1 bucket like on pic .


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Thank you, I heard what I wanted.
> Sound stage, that's different. I meant only a reduction in the body of the instruments, as if mid-bass is missing.
> It's strange, but in ODIN Gold power cable  a wire wrapped with a gold dielectric like from a Christmas tree no foil .
> The strange thing is that the same wires Odin 2 and Odin Gold sound differently based on the information in this forum.
> In Odin 2 (silver) the foil is dense and thick and is not connected to ground.


With the cables I have, Odin 2 and Odin Gold both have what seems like the same aluminum foil shielding around each conductor, just different color.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Back to FLUX 50.
> I just unplugged the only Flux 50 that was wired to my DAC power supply and immediately heard a more detailed and clearer sound.
> Inside Flux 50 there is an EMI filter, which can be put at the input of an amplifier or other equipment,
> 2. If you replace the Flux 50 copper cable  with ODIN 2 cable, then there will be a better result, since a small piece of wire adds color to the sound (copper sound).
> ...


LOL now I am glad I did not buy a real or clone.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 16, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> To say that they laughed at a device, if anything casts a shadow on their character. Unless they have actually tried it, they have no valid point. Grounding works by absorbing free electrons and the like, dampening. I have already heard a difference with the two very tiny cylinder shaped grounding devices I got a couple dozen pages back from AliExpress but barely barely so, as such I want to get something a lot bigger and see what can be had. But I'm not going to step up to the plate for like $500, hopefully I'll find some budget wooden box from China as a starter.


3256804506795238 This is big one 2kg  from option .
Accidentally jumped out not expensive. How it works I don't know.


----------



## pashkaam

How tedious it is to sit and wait for the wires to burn out and hope that something will change.

If you want full sound, put a short copper power cable, for example, after the silver one.

In the evening, the sound is different, as factories and factories stop working and a more correct AC sine wave is supplied. In the afternoon, the sine wave is cut, I read an article about how distributors themselves steal electricity.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> 3256804506795238 This is big one 2kg  from option .
> Accidentally jumped out not expensive. How it works I don't know.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/2034840406...ZETLZoqeRqqpP75U2mi978rIfkjz|tkp:BFBM6OPJtJBh

They sell it on ebay too for $100.

If anyone gets it, please share your experience.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> https://www.ebay.com/itm/203484040640?hash=item2f60980dc0:g:rAYAAOSwErlguvMI&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAA4DUS7pVwjzh/orTpfrshx0yy9lL4QhPwftfj9RikF2WCES6EcIGdDnk/2BWl283O+x3fPCUK8Xg9Efl1AZ9/AVVNJuJ2hgmDwxbpOLIZiJvQ+ju2sDGwQM1QeElGYZJWuHgmkBM+fui2a1F2m1NobfY69C3WJpPzY7y50yd6OwHa5UbE9OKwBhdG207EvMAW/oAfBLRgJU6J2+Z0xUIDHDk3sILCn1SLiM3OP3AE79kXmah7gZqpy05g23OM6R59WeGv2QOTX+Ekf/dEZETLZoqeRqqpP75U2mi978rIfkjz|tkp:BFBM6OPJtJBh
> 
> They sell it on ebay too for $100.
> 
> If anyone gets it, please share your experience.


Well, I just plugged my little grounding box to the ground pin on the bic500, and lo and behold, I hear a rather significant improvement in overall sound; more authoritative due to a blacker background; more musicality because there is more of the actual mix coming through...wow, I'm really surprised. Crisper...I think that is just really greater contrast related to improved dynamic range. Not bad for ten buck$.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Well, I just plugged my little grounding box to the ground pin on the bic500, and lo and behold, I hear a rather significant improvement in overall sound; more authoritative due to a blacker background; more musicality because there is more of the actual mix coming through...wow, I'm really surprised. Crisper...I think that is just really greater contrast related to improved dynamic range. Not bad for ten buck$.


My order of the rosewood cylinders should be arriving hopefully by next week.  One of them is going on the plc like you have it.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Well, I just plugged my little grounding box to the ground pin on the bic500, and lo and behold, I hear a rather significant improvement in overall sound; more authoritative due to a blacker background; more musicality because there is more of the actual mix coming through...wow, I'm really surprised. Crisper...I think that is just really greater contrast related to improved dynamic range. Not bad for ten buck$.


Anyone open one of these up and see what is inside?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Anyone open one of these up and see what is inside?


There was mention of a 'silicone wafer' on the website. Its filled with hard epoxy you would need a hacksaw to cut through this...


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 16, 2022)

szore said:


> Well, I just plugged my little grounding box to the ground pin on the bic500, and lo and behold, I hear a rather significant improvement in overall sound; more authoritative due to a blacker background; more musicality because there is more of the actual mix coming through...wow, I'm really surprised. Crisper...I think that is just really greater contrast related to improved dynamic range. Not bad for ten buck$.


It never ends, LOL.. let's just hope it's not actually one of these inside





Actually I'm rather surprised you heard a difference with just one of those small dampening cylinders. I have two of them on my large amp and I almost had to imagine any difference in sound. Maybe it makes a bigger difference for a smaller amp. The seller I spoke with last night on the below mentioned product confirmed my suspicion that bigger is better. So I ordered this one at about 3.5 kg, on the way.

Item 2251832861104282


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> It never ends, LOL.. let's just hope it's not actually one of these inside
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cool, let us know what difference if any effect it has on your system.  I am skeptical.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> It never ends, LOL.. let's just hope it's not actually one of these inside
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It could be the placement.  

Since its placed on the plc thats designed specifically with a spot for a grounding device.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Guys, I’m signing off now, as I just don’t have it in me these days to have disputes with clowns, if anyone could ever wish to write me?, hit me up over on Audio Asylum, I go by the username of El34eh@yahoo.com, no it isn’t my email address | just a title I chose over 19 years ago, and didn’t want to lose my previous post, so decided to let it stick.
> 
> Thanks to those of you whom were willing to share your vision with me, on several of the topics which on my end needed to be clarified | now that I’ve learned all that I believe I didn’t know, it’s time to step back and live out whatever’s left of life, not regretting said lessons, but no longer having to deal with rude ass people.
> 
> ...


Hey, here is Pure silver plug  set I think I will be getting  soon....
https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/co...r-plug-hifi-pure-silver-iec-connectors-p-1586


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> https://www.ebay.com/itm/203484040640?hash=item2f60980dc0:g:rAYAAOSwErlguvMI&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAA4DUS7pVwjzh/orTpfrshx0yy9lL4QhPwftfj9RikF2WCES6EcIGdDnk/2BWl283O+x3fPCUK8Xg9Efl1AZ9/AVVNJuJ2hgmDwxbpOLIZiJvQ+ju2sDGwQM1QeElGYZJWuHgmkBM+fui2a1F2m1NobfY69C3WJpPzY7y50yd6OwHa5UbE9OKwBhdG207EvMAW/oAfBLRgJU6J2+Z0xUIDHDk3sILCn1SLiM3OP3AE79kXmah7gZqpy05g23OM6R59WeGv2QOTX+Ekf/dEZETLZoqeRqqpP75U2mi978rIfkjz|tkp:BFBM6OPJtJBh
> 
> They sell it on ebay too for $100.
> 
> If anyone gets it, please share your experience.


I have both, the Aucharms 2 kg and the 16 kg ( 4 *separate 4 Kg boxes inside) version. The 16 Kg was a clear improvement over the Aucharm… I didn’t open that “sealed” box. But I think the quality of the material used is much better, thus the result…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have both, the Aucharms 2 kg and the 16 kg ( 4 *separate 4 Kg boxes inside) version. The 16 Kg was a clear improvement over the Aucharm… I didn’t open that “sealed” box. But I think the quality of the material used is much better, thus the result…


How exactly are you using these boxes?  And what sonically changes in your system by using the box?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> How exactly are you using these boxes?  And what sonically changes in your system by using the box?


ATM These boxes are connected to all “Front end” equipment, using custom made solid silver grounding cables . I have 5 available terminals ATM and It is connected to : Master Clock (Clock has grounding terminal), EtherRegen, Streamer (Custom USB grounding cable), DDC (RCA grounding cable) , DAC (Custom XLR grounding cable) ….

The box will not “color” the sound, but lower the noise floor, thus: blacker background, better tonality and timbre of the music… better clarity across all frequencies and more details….


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> ATM These boxes are connected to all “Front end” equipment, using custom made solid silver grounding cables . I have 5 available terminals ATM and It is connected to : Master Clock (Clock has grounding terminal), EtherRegen, Streamer (Custom USB grounding cable), DDC (RCA grounding cable) , DAC (Custom XLR grounding cable) ….
> 
> The box will not “color” the sound, but lower the noise floor, thus: blacker background, better tonality and timbre of the music… better clarity across all frequencies and more details….


But the box itself does not 'plug' into the wall, right?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 17, 2022)

szore said:


> But the box itself does not 'plug' into the wall, right?


Not into the wall, but could be plugged in the power distributor using this cable






I mean, unlike The Synergistic Research Active grounding boxes, these are different (Passive) design …


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> Not into the wall, but could be plugged in the power distributor using this cable
> 
> 
> 
> I mean, unlike The Synergistic Research Active grounding boxes, these are different (Passive) design …


So then I can just hook the box up to the ground post on my BIC500 and I'm good to go? System wide improvement?


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> Hey, here is Pure silver plug  set I think I will be getting  soon....
> https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/co...r-plug-hifi-pure-silver-iec-connectors-p-1586


That’s one I spotted years ago | yet never pursued it as I was uncertain of the purity of the base metal actually being copper?, nicely designed much like the ETI Research plugs…., but I’d recommend your sticking with brands known to use pure copper underneath as in Vanguard | SonarQuest | Viborg | IeGO, they may cost more, but as they only need to be purchased once…., I’d say go for it.


----------



## KT77

Here’s where I first discovered said grounding blocks or boxes, along with the more costlier versions from NordOst, I hope this helps?:

https://www.synergisticresearch.com/accessories/hd-sx-metaground/

I look forward to seeing all of you around, it just feels nice visiting here, eggheads shall be ignored.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

szore said:


> So then I can just hook the box up to the ground post on my BIC500 and I'm good to go? System wide improvement?


Yes, It  should lower the noise floor if  your  balanced isolation transformer has a  grounding post...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> That’s one I spotted years ago | yet never pursued it as I was uncertain of the purity of the base metal actually being copper?, nicely designed much like the ETI Research plugs…., but I’d recommend your sticking with brands known to use pure copper underneath as in Vanguard | SonarQuest | Viborg | IeGO, they may cost more, but as they only need to be purchased once…., I’d say go for it.


It  says - pure copper, but  you never know  yes...  Though the Viborg solid  silver set is over $300...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> How exactly are you using these boxes?  And what sonically changes in your system by using the box?


I also  found this great review on how  to use them ...
https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> I also  found this great review on how  to use them ...
> https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/


Excellent article. Think a nice ground box is my next purchase....


----------



## szore

KT77 said:


> Guys, I’m signing off now, as I just don’t have it in me these days to have disputes with clowns, if anyone could ever wish to write me?, hit me up over on Audio Asylum, I go by the username of El34eh@yahoo.com, no it isn’t my email address | just a title I chose over 19 years ago, and didn’t want to lose my previous post, so decided to let it stick.
> 
> Thanks to those of you whom were willing to share your vision with me, on several of the topics which on my end needed to be clarified | now that I’ve learned all that I believe I didn’t know, it’s time to step back and live out whatever’s left of life, not regretting said lessons, but no longer having to deal with rude ass people.
> 
> ...


cya


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> It never ends, LOL.. let's just hope it's not actually one of these inside
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ya the improvement was subtle, but there. I am deifinitley getting a large box tho


----------



## dougms3

Received my hakugei healer, this cable is damn good for the price.

Cable is thick with very tight braids.  Probably gonna need a good amount of burn in time with this thick a cable but initial impressions on my TRN ST5, sound is very rich in the mids, bass sounds cleaner and more textured, bigger soundstage.

I am seriously impressed with this cable.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Received my hakugei healer, this cable is damn good for the price.
> 
> Cable is thick with very tight braids.  Probably gonna need a good amount of burn in time with this thick a cable but initial impressions on my TRN ST5, sound is very rich in the mids, bass sounds cleaner and more textured, bigger soundstage.
> 
> I am seriously impressed with this cable.


How much?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> How much?


I got it from this store but it looks like he raised the price.  I'm sure you can find it in other stores cheaper.

I bought it during the 11.11 sale and used a coupon so it came out cheaper, original price was about $85.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2BWX1P1&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> It  says - pure copper, but  you never know  yes...  Though the Viborg solid  silver set is over $300...


Understood | as I’ve spent $290 on the IeGO pure silver rhodium plated plugs, and would hate to do it again, my point is there are in fact only a handful of companies that actually use pure copper as the base metal for plugs like RCA | Binding Post | Banana Plugs | Spades | Power Plugs, as the majority of them are either brass or nickel based.

If you intend to use said plugs or plating in one key area within your system?, then it’s worth considering.


----------



## KT77

szore said:


> cya


Yes you’ll. As I was personally contacted by 6 members asking me to stay, I’ve decided to do just that.

Old Happy Day, as the song goes…..


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Super  low  price  and  ending  soon...

TRIPP LITE IS1800HG


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Understood | as I’ve spent $290 on the IeGO pure silver rhodium plated plugs, and would hate to do it again, my point is there are in fact only a handful of companies that actually use pure copper as the base metal for plugs like RCA | Binding Post | Banana Plugs | Spades | Power Plugs, as the majority of them are either brass or nickel based.
> 
> If you intend to use said plugs or plating in one key area within your system?, then it’s worth considering.


https://audiolund.com/product/viborg-vm504ag-vf504ag-pure-solid-silver-us-power-plugs-set-of-2/ 

Viborg VM504Ag/VF504Ag Pure Solid Silver US Power Plugs (Set of 2) Around $250 Shipped


https://audiolund.com/product/monosaudio-m109g-f109g-rhodium-plated-us-power-plugs-set-of-2/

Monosaudio M109R/F109R Rhodium Plated US Power Plugs (Set of 2) Around $80 Shipped



 Welcome back


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://audiolund.com/product/viborg-vm504ag-vf504ag-pure-solid-silver-us-power-plugs-set-of-2/
> 
> Viborg VM504Ag/VF504Ag Pure Solid Silver US Power Plugs (Set of 2) Around $250 Shipped
> 
> ...


Thanks Crypt Keeper,

As stated, why I haven’t used headphones since 1987, back then it was a pair of Grado RS1 into a Nakamichi RX-303 cassette deck placed underneath our bed for late night | early morning listening sessions, I initially came here to learn about which versions of these cable to pursue, either the standard Odin 2 Silver or Odin Gold IC’s and power cord?. As well as plating of power cord connectors.

And now having collected 11 pieces, I’m currently looking for my last purchase, and wonder if any of you can tell me which version of the Odin Gold XLR IC’s, I should be looking to buy?, as I’ve read some have plastic type of connectors and should be avoided at the expense of the slightly costlier version, so in this sense am I looking for the ones with white or black text on the actual connectors themselves?. I’ve noticed some of them look darker with what I see as a slightly greenish hue….., while others ( supposedly the cheaper ones ) are more lighter color wise, as if a pale yellow more so.

Please advise | TIA!. Said photo of one option shown here.


----------



## KT77

And as I do have said Monosaudio M109R | F109R connectors, sitting right in front of me as I type this……, all I can say is it’s one of the very best built set power plugs I’ve ever laid eyes on, the other being IeGO, I’d even asked the seller on AliExpress, which is linked to Monosaudio, about the possibility of having a set done in silver plated copper, their response was it could be done for $90, as well as layered with 30 microns of said silver plating….., as I noticed a few weeks ago, silver plated plugs were the only ones I never saw as listed on Amazon or anywhere else for that matter.

My current thinking is, to either use a rhodium or red copper ac male plug into these shells?, or the other way around in using one or the other on the iec female side?, as I’m not looking to use them other then mixed versus straight versions of either…., in hopes of creating a signature that combines the best of both worlds.


----------



## KT77

Guys,

While I’m well aware this is a thread on said AliExpress cables, yet I’ve to ask if any of you’ve taken the time to address issues like isolation footers | platforms | usb isolators and ac noise filtration devices?.

As I’m currently using the last items mentioned from a company called “ Add-Powr “ yet prior to them the designs from NordOst shown here:

The actual one I currently have three of laying around our listening room:

https://add-powr.com/shop/ols/products/eau4

https://positive-feedback.com/reviews/hardware-reviews/nordost-qvibe-qkoil/

Where I’m also researching their ground wires, but cost wise have come across pure silver ones on AliExpress for $40 shipped.

Lastly……., have you ever questioned the quality or purity of the RCA input connectors on your prized Headphone Amps?, as I believe the Viborg ones are more than worthy of any one’s attention. I’ve posted here on the matter of whats the difference between quartz or black diamond insulators from the likes of Oyaide, which are used with its INS-BS bases, if you’ve anything to add on said options?, please consider responding.

The relevancy of the picture added, it’s an amp I once owned | cherished.




Have a good one fellas.


----------



## KT77

Lest I forget…….., of all the improvements bought to any DAC they’ve set under, the IsoAcoustic Orea series of footers were by far much much better at bringing about an unrivaled impact second to none. No other brand of footers, regardless of brand or cost came close, and here know that my most expensive set of footers are in fact Shun Mook Super Diamond Resonators.

https://isoacoustics.com/home-audio-isolation-products/orea-series/

 Thank me later.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Lest I forget…….., of all the improvements bought to any DAC they’ve set under, the IsoAcoustic Orea series of footers were by far much much better at bringing about an unrivaled impact second to none. No other brand of footers, regardless of brand or cost came close, and here know that my most expensive set of footers are in fact Shun Mook Super Diamond Resonators.
> 
> https://isoacoustics.com/home-audio-isolation-products/orea-series/
> 
> Thank me later.


I'm  using these for my master  clock.
3256803029524750
Thanks , I will look into the Oreas ...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Lest I forget…….., of all the improvements bought to any DAC they’ve set under, the IsoAcoustic Orea series of footers were by far much much better at bringing about an unrivaled impact second to none. No other brand of footers, regardless of brand or cost came close, and here know that my most expensive set of footers are in fact Shun Mook Super Diamond Resonators.
> 
> https://isoacoustics.com/home-audio-isolation-products/orea-series/
> 
> Thank me later.


3256802412327238


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> 3256802412327238


Crypt Keeper,

Unfortunately for me, when I click onto either of the numbers you’ve listed on my iPad, they only come up as if to place a phone call, if you’d provide the links to both?, that would be easier on my end.

TIA!.
O_o scar


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Crypt Keeper,
> 
> Unfortunately for me, when I click onto either of the numbers you’ve listed on my iPad, they only come up as if to place a phone call, if you’d provide the links to both?, that would be easier on my end.
> 
> ...


They don't  work with Ali ... The best way is to copy  the number into the "I'm searching for" field ...

Here you go:

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2I6Xdin&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802412327238.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> They don't  work with Ali ... The best way is to copy  the number into the "I'm searching for" field ...
> 
> Here you go:
> 
> ...


Thanks young man.


----------



## KT77

KT77 said:


> Thanks young man.


Nice items, I’ve had the first ones which are based upon Stillpoints Ultra ll’s, they were way to huge for any of my gear | yet the second ones listed, look very very very nicely built, and have been added to my list, as I’m one of those types that simply believes in isolation footers | platforms | devices.

 Thanks again.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thanks Crypt Keeper,
> 
> As stated, why I haven’t used headphones since 1987, back then it was a pair of Grado RS1 into a Nakamichi RX-303 cassette deck placed underneath our bed for late night | early morning listening sessions, I initially came here to learn about which versions of these cable to pursue, either the standard Odin 2 Silver or Odin Gold IC’s and power cord?. As well as plating of power cord connectors.
> 
> ...


Mine are metal connectors.  Prices dropped a bit from when I purchased them.  Once burned in (about 600+ hours) I like them.  I purchased mine here:

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2ZjeBBw&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Mine are metal connectors.  Prices dropped a bit from when I purchased them.  Once burned in (about 600+ hours) I like them.  I purchased mine here:
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2ZjeBBw&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


Thanks cdacosta,

That‘s the exact version I’ve saved.

And once again….., I can’t emphasize enough the improvements made by simply adding a set of those IsoAcoustic Orea Footers underneath my DAC, here’s my take on them at said time as posted awhile back:

https://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=tweaks&m=206898

Once again, those of you whom haven’t tried them?, thank me later, because as far as I’m concerned you haven’t heard what your DAC is remotely capable of….


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> I’ve to ask if any of you’ve taken the time to address issues like isolation footers | platforms | usb isolators and ac noise filtration devices?.


Throughout the years, yes to all you mentioned except USB isolators.  Spent thousands experimenting with these tweaks.  The more sensitive the gear/system the more effective these tweaks are.  But one can spend days just sharing or talking about these tweaks and the effects or possible effects on a system.  If one has the time to read, over the years "Tweakers Asylum" has a some good sharing on these topics.  For about 10 years or so I also contributed to these discussions and experiments.  

With inline filters, the filter plugs inline to the electrical connection which I am not a fan of.  When additional connections inline are introduced usually will degrade sonics.  Usually (or every one I have seen opened up) has a parallel filter scheme which is just hidden from view.    I mentioned such a parallel filter scheme that is connected in parallel instead of inline earlier in this thread.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thanks cdacosta,
> 
> That‘s the exact version I’ve saved.
> 
> ...


I do use IsoAcoustic pucks, they work to help decouple.   Works on more than DACs


----------



## dougms3

Got this in today.

Definitely a noticeable difference.  Not huge but its noticeable.  Slightly lower noise floor, bass hits harder, microdetails seem more audible as well.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Got this in today.
> 
> Definitely a noticeable difference.  Not huge but its noticeable.  Slightly lower noise floor, bass hits harder, microdetails seem more audible as well.


Yah, man!


----------



## szore

I think I couldn't hear an improvement with aligator clips because the screws are coated. Once I hooked it to my bic500's grounding post, the improvement was significant to me... I am going to get one of those mineral grounding boxes soon....


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> I think I couldn't hear an improvement with aligator clips because the screws are coated. Once I hooked it to my bic500's grounding post, the improvement was significant to me... I am going to get one of those mineral grounding boxes soon....


The most noticeable thing is the bass hits significantly harder on my Denon d7200s.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Throughout the years, yes to all you mentioned except USB isolators.  Spent thousands experimenting with these tweaks.  The more sensitive the gear/system the more effective these tweaks are.  But one can spend days just sharing or talking about these tweaks and the effects or possible effects on a system.  If one has the time to read, over the years "Tweakers Asylum" has a some good sharing on these topics.  For about 10 years or so I also contributed to these discussions and experiments.
> 
> With inline filters, the filter plugs inline to the electrical connection which I am not a fan of.  When additional connections inline are introduced usually will degrade sonics.  Usually (or every one I have seen opened up) has a parallel filter scheme which is just hidden from view.    I mentioned such a parallel filter scheme that is connected in parallel instead of inline earlier in this thread.


Great news on your end……, and as always I appreciate your willingness | honesty on said matters more than you’ll ever know.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> I do use IsoAcoustic pucks, they work to help decouple.   Works on more than DACs


In my case as placed underneath my Naim SN3, while they added a more sense of fleshy tonality to stringed instruments, it came at the expense of softening leading edges or attack of notes | where I happen to be more about speed | snap | extended upper end detailing not being rolled off. Yet I do understand your point.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> The most noticeable thing is the bass hits significantly harder on my Denon d7200s.


Ya Mon indeed……., it’s all about one’s willingness to try said designs, as one never knows what type of improvement said devices brings, and seemingly at said lower cost, I’d say “ why not try, versus not? “.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 20, 2022)

Wonderful job in discovering the grounding boxes, Guys.

Enjoy.


----------



## dougms3

Its pretty crazy that these little wooden blocks work this well.  Dammit now I'm wondering how well those ground boxes work.

Has anyone tried this?  I like that it has a screw so you can swap out the wire.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...616688368540535857ea587!12000030155147457!rec


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 19, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Its pretty crazy that these little wooden blocks work this well.  Dammit now I'm wondering how well those ground boxes work.
> 
> Has anyone tried this?  I like that it has a screw so you can swap out the wire.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804515608271.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000014.13.2bc92879GohVab&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreOtherSeller&scm=1007.40050.281175.0&scm_id=1007.40050.281175.0&scm-url=1007.40050.281175.0&pvid=dbf92bea-410f-4ecb-be50-a1ab16a91efe&_t=gps-idcDetailBottomMoreOtherSeller,scm-url:1007.40050.281175.0,pvid:dbf92bea-410f-4ecb-be50-a1ab16a91efe,tpp_buckets:668#2846#8116#2002&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000030155147457","sceneId":"30050"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!19.41!17.47!!!!!@2101d1b616688368540535857ea587!12000030155147457!rec


I  would say this one 3256804440153353 ( 3.7 Kg)  or  the 16 kg/ 4 post @ $ 535 +  solid  silver  Audiocrast grounding cables ...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> I  would say this one 3256804440153353 ( 3.7 Kg)  or  the 16 kg/ 4 post @ $ 535 +  solid  silver  Audiocrast grounding cables ...


Lol too rich for me.  

I'm satisfied with the rosewood tubes and may try that aucharm tube for now.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Great news on your end……, and as always I appreciate your willingness | honesty on said matters more than you’ll ever know.


👍


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> I  would say this one 3256804440153353 ( 3.7 Kg)  or  the 16 kg/ 4 post @ $ 535 +  solid  silver  Audiocrast grounding cables ...


My mouse cursor is hovering over the "buy now"...we wants it....


----------



## Crypt Keeper

szore said:


> My mouse cursor is hovering over the "buy now"...we wants it....


Much better get the  3.7  kg with the  silver cable than that Aucharm 2 Kg (no cable) ... Still on sale


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> Much better get the  3.7  kg with the  silver cable than that Aucharm 2 Kg (no cable) ... Still on sale


Yes, I think that is the one I was looking at...  

I just got my RCA caps (with no pin) installed on both my DAC and amp, and I also just cut off the aligator clips off my grounding tube wire, stripped the end and wrap it around the screw and tightened it for amp and DAC. Just a bandaid until I get a few spade clips for it...but with this now, I do yet still hear yet another improvement... it seems the bass is richer and has more depth and slam. also a tad greater clarity threw out the spectrum, and a noticably blacker backround...


----------



## szore

also more vivid, 3D presentation to the soundstage and better imaging...also better engagement and PRaT....vocals are richer and more emotive....seriously impressed! I had to order another set of caps, I just realized the Lokius has RCA that needs them... so even better sound to come!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> also more vivid, 3D presentation to the soundstage and better imaging...also better engagement and PRaT....vocals are richer and more emotive....seriously impressed! I had to order another set of caps, I just realized the Lokius has RCA that needs them... so even better sound to come!


Might also be worthwhile to get the xlr caps for the empty slots on the Jot 2.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2UvaKgZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I think since you and I live in an apt, we are exposed to more stray EMI, RFI, wifi, bluetooth signals than others.  The caps helps to prevent those empty interconnect slots from picking up artifacts.  I initially just bought them to protect the rca and xlr slots from dust but noticed the reduction in noise, nice little bonus.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Might also be worthwhile to get the xlr caps for the empty slots on the Jot 2.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2UvaKgZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> I think since you and I live in an apt, we are exposed to more stray EMI, RFI, wifi, bluetooth signals than others.  The caps helps to prevent those empty interconnect slots from picking up artifacts.  I initially just bought them to protect the rca and xlr slots from dust but noticed the reduction in noise, nice little bonus.


Yeah, you get 8 in a package, I have Jot 2 and DAC covered...just need 4 more for the Lokius


----------



## dougms3

Btw this seller is offering 15% off if you buy two items.

So if you plan on getting that ground box you can get two for $170.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Btw this seller is offering 15% off if you buy two items.
> 
> So if you plan on getting that ground box you can get two for $170.


I have not tried or experienced one of these grounding boxes, but am slowly getting curious.  Let’s fast forward and assume for a moment these boxes work as intended.  Meaning the crystals and materials inside these boxes that have bare wire that is exposed to the material will in fact drain to some extent whatever is negatively attached to the other end of the wire.  Hence improving what is audible from a component.  Assuming this is how passive grounding boxes work.  Anyone try and just run more leads from such a box to multiple components at a time?  Or to multiple parts of a component?  It would seem logical that this would work and be simple to try assuming that one can get into the box without damaging it.

Anywhere to go to research and try to understand how such a product works or science behind it?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have not tried or experienced one of these grounding boxes, but am slowly getting curious.  Let’s fast forward and assume for a moment these boxes work as intended.  Meaning the crystals and materials inside these boxes that have bare wire that is exposed to the material will in fact drain to some extent whatever is negatively attached to the other end of the wire.  Hence improving what is audible from a component.  Assuming this is how passive grounding boxes work.  Anyone try and just run more leads from such a box to multiple components at a time?  Or to multiple parts of a component?  It would seem logical that this would work and be simple to try assuming that one can get into the box without damaging it.
> 
> Anywhere to go to research and try to understand how such a product works or science behind it?


Taken from this great article...

*But very importantly, do take note that it is crucial to only connect ONE equipment to ONE ground box! A single ground box CANNOT BE SHARED between two or more equipment!*_ Because this can result in the possibility of shorting out the ground paths at the wrong locations! So please do not try that with the aim of saving money as it may turn out you will spend a lot more!_

https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Taken from this great article...
> 
> *But very importantly, do take note that it is crucial to only connect ONE equipment to ONE ground box! A single ground box CANNOT BE SHARED between two or more equipment!*_ Because this can result in the possibility of shorting out the ground paths at the wrong locations! So please do not try that with the aim of saving money as it may turn out you will spend a lot more!_
> 
> https://quartzacoustic.com/audio-ground-box-the-whys-and-the-hows/


I did some research last night on these grounding boxes saw what you linked.  Thanks


----------



## FredA

I recently acquired one of these grounding boxes. I have it plugged on the ground terminal of my balanced isolation transfo. 

At the same time, i received a Triple Crown power cable i put on my dac (r7he mkii). It took over a week to mature. Bass, staging res all improved. Can say the contribution of each. Some bad recording became enjoyable. 

Never plug many devices to a box with single out. A short-circuit can occur. 

You need a well shielded grounding cable ideally. The shield must not touch the connectors, of course. 

If a positive effect occurs, It would be due to the piezoelectric effect. The ground cable connecting the device to the box will put the latter at the same electrical potential as the former. If the potential is noisy, the material inside the box is supposed to reduce the fluctations. You can either connect a ground or a neutral (taken from a input or ouput signal connector). 

Another variation are the small grounding tubes found on ali. I a/bed with and without on the body of my power dist. I and a friend would hear a more relaxed sound with. 

On the chassis of a device, i could hear no effect. But there seems to be a positive effect on neutral. 

Just me 2 cents. 

I would have to unplug the transo from the box to see if i hear a difference. The drawback is if i do that, the positive effect  could take days to come back, according the a reviewer. Not sure about this though, it makes no sense to me.


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> I recently acquired one of these grounding boxes. I have it plugged on the ground terminal of my balanced isolation transfo.
> 
> At the same time, i received a Triple Crown power cable i put on my dac (r7he mkii). It took over a week to mature. Bass, staging res all improved. Can say the contribution of each. Some bad recording became enjoyable.
> 
> ...


I'd like to know how the infrared radiation from the rare earth minerals and crystals like tourmaline and the other stuff thats in there, affect the sound.  What other materials are used in that box?  Why is it so expensive?

I'm not doubting that it works but this is very interesting as to why it works.

Does it return anything from that box back into the ground connection?

Does the ground box dissipate the static charge from the ground connection more effectively?  How does it work?

Does it work better if you give the ground box a name, dress it in a onesie and pet it lovingly?

So many questions...


----------



## Stax 7

I ordered one of those small ground Rosewood cylinders from D-U-N-C-A-N 21 L-O-V-E PC HIFI Store and checked yesterday and it did not leave China as it was a restricted electrical item and being returned.I have sent a message to the seller but as usual they are very slow to reply.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> Its pretty crazy that these little wooden blocks work this well.  Dammit now I'm wondering how well those ground boxes work.
> 
> Has anyone tried this?  I like that it has a screw so you can swap out the wire.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...616688368540535857ea587!12000030155147457!rec


Nice!


----------



## FredA

Stax 7 said:


> I ordered one of those small ground Rosewood cylinders from D-U-N-C-A-N 21 L-O-V-E PC HIFI Store and checked yesterday and it did not leave China as it was a restricted electrical item and being returned.I have sent a message to the seller but as usual they are very slow to reply.


Sorry. No issue to Canada.


----------



## dougms3

Stax 7 said:


> I ordered one of those small ground Rosewood cylinders from D-U-N-C-A-N 21 L-O-V-E PC HIFI Store and checked yesterday and it did not leave China as it was a restricted electrical item and being returned.I have sent a message to the seller but as usual they are very slow to reply.


Tell the seller to not to mark it as an electrical device.  

Tell them to write livestock fertility enhancer on the customs form, and show them that pic to show its filled with pebbles and silvery goat pubes packaged in a wooden tube.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I have not tried or experienced one of these grounding boxes, but am slowly getting curious.  Let’s fast forward and assume for a moment these boxes work as intended.  Meaning the crystals and materials inside these boxes that have bare wire that is exposed to the material will in fact drain to some extent whatever is negatively attached to the other end of the wire.  Hence improving what is audible from a component.  Assuming this is how passive grounding boxes work.  Anyone try and just run more leads from such a box to multiple components at a time?  Or to multiple parts of a component?  It would seem logical that this would work and be simple to try assuming that one can get into the box without damaging it.
> 
> Anywhere to go to research and try to understand how such a product works or science behind it?


Some vendors recommend no more than 2 devices per grounding box, but I have tried that with 2 Kg Aucharm and the 16 Kg boxes , I didn’t like the result… So would recommend 1 box per device…


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Some vendors recommend no more than 2 devices per grounding box, but I have tried that with 2 Kg Aucharm and the 16 Kg boxes , I didn’t like the result… So would recommend 1 box per device…


I imagine its not advised to connect more than one device to the grounding box because you are basically creating a bridge between those electrical devices which is probably why it would cause a short.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I imagine its not advised to connect more than one device to the grounding box because you are basically creating a bridge between those electrical devices which is probably why it would cause a short.


Agree... But, " What is the maxmium device to connect on single BLACKICE Ground Box? - We suggested the maxmium two devices for optimal results." per Adrian @ Afterdark
https://www.adark.co/products/after...ackice-ground-box?_pos=1&_sid=b181cad83&_ss=r


----------



## FredA (Nov 20, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> Agree... But, " What is the maxmium device to connect on single BLACKICE Ground Box? - We suggested the maxmium two devices for optimal results." per Adrian @ Afterdark
> https://www.adark.co/products/after...ackice-ground-box?_pos=1&_sid=b181cad83&_ss=r


You just have be sure not to connect a live with a neutral or two live together...

For instance, on a balanced power amp, both speaker terminals are live.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Agree... But, " What is the maxmium device to connect on single BLACKICE Ground Box? - We suggested the maxmium two devices for optimal results." per Adrian @ Afterdark
> https://www.adark.co/products/after...ackice-ground-box?_pos=1&_sid=b181cad83&_ss=r


It would depend on a few things.  I personally would not connect more than 1 device.

For instance, sometimes duplexes from the neutral to the ground are daisychained.  As in my powervar plc, it was wired like that from the factory.  Most likely to dissipate any stray static charge or surges.  

If you have 2 devices connected to that type of plc, you have a direct bridge between the 2 devices and that could cause some serious damage.


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> I recently acquired one of these grounding boxes. I have it plugged on the ground terminal of my balanced isolation transfo.
> 
> At the same time, i received a Triple Crown power cable i put on my dac (r7he mkii). It took over a week to mature. Bass, staging res all improved. Can say the contribution of each. Some bad recording became enjoyable.
> 
> ...


Which grounding box do you have or are describing?  

I am not sure I understand the differences you heard when A/B comparing one of those little grounding tubes to the box?  Please elaborate.  Thanks!


----------



## FredA

cdacosta said:


> Which grounding box do you have or are describing?
> 
> I am not sure I understand the differences you heard when A/B comparing one of those little grounding tubes to the box?  Please elaborate.  Thanks!


It was a/b beween with and without a grounding tube on the power distributor. I have done no a/b of with/without the grounding box. Yet. Not sure if it works, in fact.

I got this one

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/33047419034.html


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> It was a/b beween with and without a grounding tube on the power distributor. I have done no a/b of with/without the grounding box. Yet. Not sure if it works, in fact.
> 
> I got this one
> 
> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/33047419034.html


Understand now, thanks.  After doing some research I think I understand what a "grounding box or device" is suppose to do.  Curious as to the effect and how much the amount of the internal ingredients matter with how it effects the effectiveness of such a device.  Like the tube vs a 2kg box?


----------



## pashkaam

I think there are more questions than answers with these groundings.
As far as I understand, this grounding removes static voltage.
It is good to cling such dynamite in the amplifier itself inside directly to the ground star. There is always a point in each circuit where all grounding from different places is reduced. I bought two pieces, it is not known when they will be delivered.
wires


----------



## pashkaam

Another idea .
I would solder a USB plug to ground to this explosive dynamite connect to and plug into a free USB outlet.

What can you say about ODIN 2 power cable and its ability to create a three-dimensional stage > have you noticed this? How long was there no 3D during the burn or was the stage immediately unchanged?
Thank you.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> What can you say about ODIN 2 power cable and its ability to create a three-dimensional stage > have you noticed this? How long was there no 3D during the burn or was the stage immediately unchanged?


IIRC between 400 and 500 hours.


----------



## FredA

Are you asking me? I used to have the Odin 2 on the dac (r7he mkii). It was marginally better than my other cords but not perfect.

The Triple Crown was litterally awful for 8h or so, took 2 days to beat the Odin2 and 10 days to clearly beat it. The staging improvement took a week to start manisfesting. And the full 10 days to be spectacular.


----------



## FredA

5 times more expensive so...


----------



## dougms3

Got the other one connected to my jcat usb card.

Good thing no one can see this but I'm lying on the floor with headphones on, plugging it in and pulling out to A/B it.  Seems like its making a small difference.  Slightly more punchiness to the music.


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> Got the other one connected to my jcat usb card.
> 
> Good thing no one can see this but I'm lying on the floor with headphones on, plugging it in and pulling out to A/B it.  Seems like its making a small difference.  Slightly more punchiness to the music.


I liked the pipe. What's with the big puck? I missed something in this life.


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> Are you asking me? I used to have the Odin 2 on the dac (r7he mkii). It was marginally better than my other cords but not perfect.
> 
> The Triple Crown was litterally awful for 8h or so, took 2 days to beat the Odin2 and 10 days to clearly beat it. The staging improvement took a week to start manisfesting. And the full 10 days to be spectacular.



Triple Crown is an Egg Roll cable? I didn't find it on Ali .
If it's expensive, then it's better not to show it to me. I haven't received IC ODIN 2 yet . Its very interesting how sounding and what 
Very interested in how it affects the sound. Now I have a three-dimensional sound, but I would like the stage to be even closer, so that the sound was like in headphones on my head, I heard such a system.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> IIRC between 400 and 500 hours.


It certainly kills waiting for the cable to burn out.


----------



## sicnesse

Tripowin GranVia. Really nice feeling, has some weight to it, vibrant colors
I wish however that there was more connectors and colors options tho


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> I liked the pipe. What's with the big puck? I missed something in this life.


Its supposed to be a noise dampener made of myrtle wood.

If its doing anything I can't tell.  Also it doesn't fit properly on any of my connectors.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Its supposed to be a noise dampener made of myrtle wood.
> 
> If its doing anything I can't tell.  Also it doesn't fit properly on any of my connectors.


Ah, every time I have tried using myrtle wood for tuning I did not like what it did to the presentation.  Dry and thins the presentation, to my ears at least.  Almost the opposite of Purple Heart wood.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Got the other one connected to my jcat usb card.
> 
> Good thing no one can see this but I'm lying on the floor with headphones on, plugging it in and pulling out to A/B it.  Seems like its making a small difference.  Slightly more punchiness to the music.


I am assuming the small cylinders are small versions of the grounding box.  How obvious is the difference before and after adding the grounding cylinder?  Even worth trying?


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Triple Crown is an Egg Roll cable? I didn't find it on Ali .
> If it's expensive, then it's better not to show it to me. I haven't received IC ODIN 2 yet . Its very interesting how sounding and what
> Very interested in how it affects the sound. Now I have a three-dimensional sound, but I would like the stage to be even closer, so that the sound was like in headphones on my head, I heard such a system.


Good enough for any burger guy. From this store

https://fr.aliexpress.com/store/4703137


----------



## KT77 (Nov 21, 2022)

An interesting guide on various ways to use grounding boxes | cables | as well as a review of said brands item:

https://www.russandrews.com/images/pdf/GroundingV6.pdf

https://theaudiophileman.com/rf-router-mkii-review-russ-andrews/


----------



## msing539

I changed my setup a few weeks ago and my Odin usb cable was too short. Gave that one away to a known headfier and he was impressed, and I'm being conservative with his reaction.

Tried an SKW and an XLO from @dougms3 in my setup and they were fine, but I ordered another Odin silver usb from AE. 

Just received and even out of the box, it's no contest... the Odin silver has greater separation, dynamics, detail, more bass. Thing is a killer.


----------



## ZivkoF




----------



## ZivkoF

My comment i have so many of these cables and they are really great on my full horn speakers system with sensitivity of 110 dB@1w/1m or just stereo or 7.4.4 home cinema listening with 4 big TH 18 inch TH subwoofers.


----------



## KT77

msing539 said:


> I changed my setup a few weeks ago and my Odin usb cable was too short. Gave that one away to a known headfier and he was impressed, and I'm being conservative with his reaction.
> 
> Tried an SKW and an XLO from @dougms3 in my setup and they were fine, but I ordered another Odin silver usb from AE.
> 
> Just received and even out of the box, it's no contest... the Odin silver has greater separation, dynamics, detail, more bass. Thing is a killer.


That’s great news….., as I eventually ended up with 4 different versions of said Odin usb cables, 3 were the Odin 2 Silver variants | the 4th was the Odin Gold….., as mentioned earlier on it was because of my introduction to the very first one, I began collecting these cables, and once again while the first one was only $50, it easier replaced both my $585 In-Akustik Referenz and $918 SoTM Filtered Pure Copper usb cables, so in my system apparently silver or silver plated copper cables sound best, so I’ll be riding them out, especially as said usb cables | IC’s.

And am now thinking a 4th and last pure silver pair of SCs, will tie me over until the Creator calls me home.


----------



## KT77

ZivkoF said:


>


Might I ask what’s the little carbon fiber circular device you’ve placed to the bottom left hand side, that seems to be attached to one of your runs of Odin IC’s?.

 Thanks in advance for your incoming response.
O_o scar


----------



## ZivkoF

Hi, it is like Akkiko Audio - Tuning Stick, it is DIY by myself and I will explain it omorrow, because it is now quite late here in EUROPE.


----------



## szore

msing539 said:


> I changed my setup a few weeks ago and my Odin usb cable was too short. Gave that one away to a known headfier and he was impressed, and I'm being conservative with his reaction.
> 
> Tried an SKW and an XLO from @dougms3 in my setup and they were fine, but I ordered another Odin silver usb from AE.
> 
> Just received and even out of the box, it's no contest... the Odin silver has greater separation, dynamics, detail, more bass. Thing is a killer.


How many cores does it have? Mine has 12, i've seen 4 and 8 as well...


----------



## KT77

ZivkoF said:


> Hi, it is like Akkiko Audio - Tuning Stick, it is DIY by myself and I will explain it omorrow, because it is now quite late here in EUROPE.


Thank……., until then.

Have a wonderful sleep | be well | stay safe.


----------



## msing539

szore said:


> How many cores does it have? Mine has 12, i've seen 4 and 8 as well...


This one has 12


----------



## OCC7N

I ordered this very cheap. 

https://www.adamhall.com/shop/cy-en...icrophone-cables/3298/4-star-mmf-0150-krystal

OCC cable for a bargain!

Im also gonna order the neotech 3004III and furutech fp701/702 with some good soldering wire and compare them.


----------



## cdacosta

For use with grounding box anyone find a specific gauge, type of wire (stranded vs solid core and copper vs silver, etc) to work best?  Thanks!


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> For use with grounding box anyone find a specific gauge, type of wire (stranded vs solid core and copper vs silver, etc) to work best?  Thanks!


I'm  using  Audiocrast S.Silver grounding cables  3256801606656922


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> For use with grounding box anyone find a specific gauge, type of wire (stranded vs solid core and copper vs silver, etc) to work best?  Thanks!


Once again, I’m very fond of pure silver cables, period, but while I’m having difficulty in cutting and pasting the things I see on AliExpress, I’ll just post my incoming cable information here:




Order detailsPlaced on Nov 14,2022, 07:48


 Audio & Video Cables Store 
	



HIFI Sterling Silver Audi...
Banana To RCA, 1m
US $48.00x1


----------



## dougms3

ZivkoF said:


>


If thats not proof that its good, I don't know what is.


----------



## dougms3

Received the $36 15 core valhalla power cable today.

This thing is massive and feels like it weighs close to 10lbs.  Its as thick as my thumb.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> This thing is massive and feels like it weighs close to 10lbs.  Its as thick as my thumb.


Giggity


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 21, 2022)

Actual daylight robbery 🤣
An interesting experiment. I have a lot of questions for the FURUNTECH company, too much nonsense to empty the pocket of an audiophile .


----------



## dougms3

Viborg via amazon is having some great deals, cheaper than aliexpress for some items.

https://www.amazon.com/Viborg-VM502G-VF502G-Connector-Audiophile/dp/B088QVWRC9?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1

https://www.amazon.com/Audiocrast-I...tion/dp/B08MPBXG6M?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/Protectors-A...able/dp/B08R8FDHHF?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1&psc=1


----------



## cdacosta

After enough reading and trying to understand the concept and use of a passive grounding box I am intrigued.  But still skeptical... LOL.  So before spending hundreds on something that looks kinda like snake oil to me I am going to first do what the person did at Audiogon, see first post:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/preliminary-diy-grounding-box-result 

Grounding box experiment I am going to try:

* Ordered 7.5 lbs (3.4kg) of High Purity Arizona Magnetite, Fine Sand, -12 Mesh, 62-63% Fe.
* Will use a 16ga or 14ga. wire (wire still to be determined) like Nordost does.
* Do a pair --> Install negative post of Furutech CF-102 Rhodium, Carbon Fiber bodied RCA plug onto a wire lead.  Other end strip a long length and place into the bag of Magnetite.

To recap: Bag of 3.4kg of Magnetite with bare wire inside for a left and right (2 wires attached to two connectors) ---> plug into left and right RCA outputs of DAC.  
- Will try just one lead only first like to right RCA DAC input.  Then see what two leads out to both left and right of RCA DAC inputs do.
If this experiment bares fruit I will expand it.  Like wooden box with binding post and internal configuration like Entreq does.

More tweaking possible with crystals and other minerals and wire purity etc., after I know this does something worth the trouble.  I have the Furutech RCA on hand but all my cables, binding posts and other parts in storage.  So I have to decide on wiring to use for this experiment.  I have a lot of Cardas solid core silver (5N), XLO Reference 3 power wire (silver plated copper) and others in storage.  Will know if the above yields any kind of results within a week.  Will update with results from experiment for anyone also curious about this.

If this works out would be pretty cool.  Easy and cheap to do.  If this works can be implemented to the whole system inexpensively.  The Magnetite was $21.85 shipped.
​


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> Are you asking me? I used to have the Odin 2 on the dac (r7he mkii). It was marginally better than my other cords but not perfect.
> 
> The Triple Crown was litterally awful for 8h or so, took 2 days to beat the Odin2 and 10 days to clearly beat it. The staging improvement took a week to start manisfesting. And the full 10 days to be spectacular.



I seem to have fallen in love. A small fire lit up in me and I look at these cables more and more. I have Argento Flow and ordered IC ODIN 2 .


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> After enough reading and trying to understand the concept and use of a passive grounding box I am intrigued.  But still skeptical... LOL.  So before spending hundreds on something that looks kinda like snake oil to me I am going to first do what the person did at Audiogon, see first post:
> 
> https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/preliminary-diy-grounding-box-result
> 
> ...


Very interesting and useful information. Thank you.
I'm waiting for a regular compass from ebay to check the polarization version of the wire. The more we know, the less they will fool us


----------



## DecentLevi

My _Preffair Hi-End 400 Signature Hifi Audio US/EU Power Cord Pure Copper Power Cable_ came in today. Looks identical to the photo below (with US plug). This was recommended as being the same cable inside the Flux-50 knockoffs. It's built like a tank and probably even a hair thicker than the Odin Gold!






Sound: incredibly vibrant, organic and dynamic and with far reaching FR that go from deep lows and high highs. Made my Odin Gold sound a bit dull in comparison...
unfortunately further testing shows the cable is too bright for me. All that detail was from an extra extended treble. Switched back to Odin Gold and definitely all the good aformentioned attributes are still in full force, just with more neutral / less fatiguing treble. So looks like Odin Gold stays for now. Maybe I will try copper foil shielding on this later.


----------



## FredA

DecentLevi said:


> My _Preffair Hi-End 400 Signature Hifi Audio US/EU Power Cord Pure Copper Power Cable_ came in today. Looks identical to the photo below (with US plug). This was recommended as being the same cable inside the Flux-50 knockoffs. It's built like a tank and probably even a hair thicker than the Odin Gold!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Let it burn for 1-2 weeks. I don't know of any cable that does not benefit.


----------



## szore

I lost track, has anyone actually bought a grounding box off AliExpress?


----------



## KT77 (Nov 22, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> Received the $36 15 core valhalla power cable today.
> 
> This thing is massive and feels like it weighs close to 10lbs.  Its as thick as my thumb.


Once again, nice find.

And while I’m aware like the Odin 2 power cord, you usually give them hours to burn in…., yet are you able to give a generalization upon the sound it offers out the box?, I ask as I’m looking to buy a few things from AliExpress this weekend, and view this as one said option.

I should add having settled on the Odin Gold power cord on my DAC | I never had the chance to compare it to an Odin 2, am I too assume the Valhalla version is sonically different to your ears in said case, which warranted as your reason for going back to order one?, just curious as to how they compare to one another?.



As always….., TIA!.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 22, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> My _Preffair Hi-End 400 Signature Hifi Audio US/EU Power Cord Pure Copper Power Cable_ came in today. Looks identical to the photo below (with US plug). This was recommended as being the same cable inside the Flux-50 knockoffs. It's built like a tank and probably even a hair thicker than the Odin Gold!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My experiment with ODIN Gold Power Cable ( which *with gold foil* , it-s film )  for line power to the DAC (DIY Kitchen foil on top shielding with ground connection and other option test  passive shielding without ground connection to the foil) showed a strong effect on the DC  to DAC downstream cable.
When try different DC wires, the sound changed very much.
Copper DC was without a detailed bass like a whistle on a ship. DIY ODIN 2 , USB converted to DC cable reduced the size of the instruments (small speaker effect). Original DC silver-plated cable simple  two wires played very well, Stage, speaker size and more, ...
When I removed the grounding, the difference between all DC cables became less different audible.

You can muffle the brightness of the sound with a short piece of copper power cable, but the problem is more likely in the headphones or speakers.
Why is the new wire like FLux 50 thick, it should be thinner ODIN Gold ?


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Once again, nice find.
> 
> And while I’m aware like the Odin 2 power cord, you usually give them hours to burn in…., yet are you able to give a generalization upon the sound it offers out the box?, I ask as I’m looking to buy a few things from AliExpress this weekend, and view this as one said option.
> 
> ...


I just bought the cable because it was on sale for 11.11 for$36.  Damn good deal imo. 

I'm just burning it in for now on my lps.  If it made any difference in sound i didn't notice because i got a new dac.

Funny you posted that pic, i actually bought that during the 11.11 sale as well for$70.

Says solid silver connectors and ebony sandalwood connectors, we'll see how that sounds.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Once again, nice find.
> 
> And while I’m aware like the Odin 2 power cord, you usually give them hours to burn in…., yet are you able to give a generalization upon the sound it offers out the box?, I ask as I’m looking to buy a few things from AliExpress this weekend, and view this as one said option.
> 
> ...


My experience, my ears is that the clone Nordost Odin 2 and Odin Gold out of the box is near unlistenable.  This is for power cables and balanced interconnects.  All over the place, frequency peakiness that moves across the frequency spectrum during early stages of break-in.  Lack of cohesiveness and focus. Funky PRAT.  

If you read my impressions and warnings in the early part of this thread about break-in of these cables. Out of the box vs 600+ hours break-in is night and day.  The Ethernet and SPDIF cables are not nearly as bad out of the box, although break-in does very much improve cable performance.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> My experience, my ears is that the clone Nordost Odin 2 and Odin Gold out of the box is near unlistenable.  This is for power cables and balanced interconnects.  All over the place, frequency peakiness that moves across the frequency spectrum during early stages of break-in.  Lack of cohesiveness and focus. Funky PRAT.
> 
> If you read my impressions and warnings in the early part of this thread about break-in of these cables. Out of the box vs 600+ hours break-in is night and day.  The Ethernet and SPDIF cables are not nearly as bad out of the box, although break-in does very much improve cable performance.


Of course I read and even saved the texts . Thank you. 
With Odin Gold, a slightly different story, since in it the conductors are not shielded with gold foil, so this is a golden film , Odin 2 ( silver ) has real good silver plated foil . So Odin Gold without shielding this is Valhalla


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> I just bought the cable because it was on sale for 11.11 for$36.  Damn good deal imo.
> 
> I'm just burning it in for now on my lps.  If it made any difference in sound i didn't notice because i got a new dac.
> 
> ...


Thanks dougms3,

Yet just re-reading a few things on both power cords over on A’Gon, I’m going to buy one of these as well, once again, in my system I’ve since discovering the sound of silver plated copper IC’s, followed by pure silver IC’s | USB cables, especially from the DAC to integrated amp has found it extremely hard to go back to copper, other then the sole power cords on several integrated amps.

And since I’ve never been able to find any cost effective pure silver IC’s made in the USA, when that pair in said photo showed up, I was like it looks well built, and told myself, let’s give it a try, the nice RCA connectors on them, only added to the appeal.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> My experience, my ears is that the clone Nordost Odin 2 and Odin Gold out of the box is near unlistenable.  This is for power cables and balanced interconnects.  All over the place, frequency peakiness that moves across the frequency spectrum during early stages of break-in.  Lack of cohesiveness and focus. Funky PRAT.
> 
> If you read my impressions and warnings in the early part of this thread about break-in of these cables. Out of the box vs 600+ hours break-in is night and day.  The Ethernet and SPDIF cables are not nearly as bad out of the box, although break-in does very much improve cable performance.


Thanks cdacosta,

Yet in my case I was fortunate to been able to get what the Odin Gold had on offer from day one, in that sense I’ve to guess I taught myself years ago to only focus upon the reproduction value of the music playback itself, not allowing my subconscious to be caught up in swings here and there within the foreground, as said HiFi effects have never fooled me into what was, versus what both my ears | senses told me otherwise was something of worth.

Once again, thanks again for re-educating me to the fact, versus fantasies of uncertainty. This for me, is a journey worth taking.


----------



## szore

Bought a proper grounding box.   Let's see what we see...

2255799978657859


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Of course I read and even saved the texts . Thank you.
> With Odin Gold, a slightly different story, since in it the conductors are not shielded with gold foil, so this is a golden film , Odin 2 ( silver ) has real good silver plated foil . So Odin Gold without shielding this is Valhalla


On my cables the Odin 2 and Odin Gold have what looks like and feels like the same foil just different color.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> On my cables the Odin 2 and Odin Gold have what looks like and feels like the same foil just different color.


I disassembled the both cables and checked with a tester. On ODIN 2, a good thick, dense foil look like silver plated , GOLD has just a golden film.
ODIN GOLD from YTERAUDIO Store


----------



## musicinmymind

pashkaam said:


> I disassembled the both cables and checked with a tester. On ODIN 2, a good thick, dense foil look like silver plated , GOLD has just a golden film.
> ODIN GOLD from YTERAUDIO Store



Does this makes much difference sonically?
Anyway the ODIN 2 dense foil is not grounded as I understand on wall side.


----------



## DecentLevi

szore said:


> Yes, I think that is the one I was looking at...
> 
> I just got my RCA caps (with no pin) installed on both my DAC and amp, and I also just cut off the aligator clips off my grounding tube wire, stripped the end and wrap it around the screw and tightened it for amp and DAC. Just a bandaid until I get a few spade clips for it...but with this now, I do yet still hear yet another improvement... it seems the bass is richer and has more depth and slam. also a tad greater clarity threw out the spectrum, and a noticably blacker backround...


RCA caps - just realized what you're talking about. Any general idea on the concept of how these work, and if there's any specific conductor material that's most recommended? Where did you get yours? Was it this link?
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2UvaKgZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> I disassembled the both cables and checked with a tester. On ODIN 2, a good thick, dense foil look like silver plated , GOLD has just a golden film.
> ODIN GOLD from YTERAUDIO Store


Mine is apparently different from yours.  Here is where I purchased mine...


----------



## cdacosta

musicinmymind said:


> Does this makes much difference sonically?
> Anyway the ODIN 2 dense foil is not grounded as I understand on wall side.


I have disassembled the Odin 2 and Odin Gold.  The foil shielding on both power cords are not attached to ground on either end, essentially a floating ground.


----------



## musicinmymind

cdacosta said:


> I have disassembled the Odin 2 and Odin Gold.  The foil shielding on both power cords are not attached to ground on either end, essentially a floating ground.



Shield is best when the signal lines are completely surrounded by a conductive tunnel that is completely at ground potential. That means it should be grounded at BOTH ends, otherwise it is still an antenna at some frequencies.

I do no thave Odin 2 but only Gold, shield Gold ot not it should not matter as shield is left along in Odin 2.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 23, 2022)

FredA said:


> Let it burn for 1-2 weeks. I don't know of any cable that does not benefit.


The only cable I've ever heard make a difference from burn-in happened to be a genuine neotech Nei 2001 solid core silver RCA cables. After at least 3 weeks each full-time burning in Odin gold and Wel Signature "real knockoff" cables, I never heard an iota of difference. And don't even ask me how resolving my system is, now with the esteemed HEDDphone. Not sure if I'll try burn in anyway to tame the highs with this cable, or maybe another hack.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> RCA caps - just realized what you're talking about. Any general idea on the concept of how these work, and if there's any specific conductor material that's most recommended? Where did you get yours? Was it this link?
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2UvaKgZ&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


I think the idea is RCA connections tat are 'live' with signal act like little noise transmitters. The caps with center pin removed just grounds it all out and shields it. I bought mine on Amazon...

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083NKQBJ8?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details


----------



## KT77

DecentLevi said:


> The only cable I've ever heard make a difference from burn-in happened to be a genuine neotech Nei 2001 solid core silver RCA cables. After at least 3 weeks each full-time burning in Odin gold and Wel Signature "real knockoff" cables, I never heard an iota of difference. And don't even ask me how resolving my system is, now with the esteemed HEDDphone. Not sure if I'll try burn in anyway to tame the highs with this cable, or maybe another hack.


As stated above, much like you I guess I’ve been lucky enough to never experienced said cabling burn in period. I’ve been borrowing cables via the Cable Company since 2004, where they usually give a person 10 days to audition said cables, on average if I had borrowed upwards of 5 pairs, I’d ask them to send the courier back the next day to return 4 of them….., as I had already gathered what they had to offer, it would come down to a single pair I’d enjoy most | wished to hold onto for said ten day period. I can’t speak on my system resolving potential either, in so much as having the ability to simply hear what’s there within 2-3 tracks at best. So I sort of always wondered why others have often mentioned said burn in periods?, and thought just maybe some cables require said 300-600 hours on them, because in hindsight the majority of said cables sent were in fact demo models, which means they already had hours of use on them | in a lot of ways I consider myself blessed to enjoy most right out of the box.


----------



## KT77

szore said:


> I think the idea is RCA connections tat are 'live' with signal act like little noise transmitters. The caps with center pin removed just grounds it all out and shields it. I bought mine on Amazon...
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083NKQBJ8?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details


Nice find……., as I’ve noted a few of you use them, which I’ve always felt were essential | however I went with the versions here years ago, and never looked back:

https://www.thecableco.com/telos-audio-design-quantum-xlr-caps-pair.html

https://telos-audio.com.tw/caps/

I went with these because they were produced with pure copper as the base metal, whereas many others are created from nickel, like the ones from Cardas Audio, of which I began collecting as well.


----------



## pashkaam

musicinmymind said:


> Does this makes much difference sonically?
> Anyway the ODIN 2 dense foil is not grounded as I understand on wall side.


ODIN gold with  gold film not foil  works like Valhalla, the difference is that gold or silver have passive shielding, which at least somehow protects against external interference and has no grounding on both side.

What better science can not answer.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Mine is apparently different from yours.  Here is where I purchased mine...


Lucky. 
I do not regret that I bought it without foil because I did experiments with shielding and grounding and with a passive shield and I want to understand simple things about magnetic fields that carry information, how best for them to travel with maximum information and what needs to be done for this.



I found a Russian website where there is a description of most High End cables, some manufacturers indicate and describe what and how their cables are made of. Just started studying.
Nordost  is original SC silver plated, others company are molded from copper.
Interesting options, invested $1 received $500.
Some write about the same contact lubrication and cable burning through 1,000,000 volts, which is the usual cable polarization, that's all the secrets.


----------



## FredA (Nov 23, 2022)

KT77 said:


> As stated above, much like you I guess I’ve been lucky enough to never experienced said cabling burn in period. I’ve been borrowing cables via the Cable Company since 2004, where they usually give a person 10 days to audition said cables, on average if I had borrowed upwards of 5 pairs, I’d ask them to send the courier back the next day to return 4 of them….., as I had already gathered what they had to offer, it would come down to a single pair I’d enjoy most | wished to hold onto for said ten day period. I can’t speak on my system resolving potential either, in so much as having the ability to simply hear what’s there within 2-3 tracks at best. So I sort of always wondered why others have often mentioned said burn in periods?, and thought just maybe some cables require said 300-600 hours on them, because in hindsight the majority of said cables sent were in fact demo models, which means they already had hours of use on them | in a lot of ways I consider myself blessed to enjoy most right out of the box.


It's likely that they send them pre-burned. Otherwise, they would have a hard time selling some of them.


----------



## FredA

I won't argue that with certain pairs of ears and certain set-ups, it can't be heard. Auditive accuity is a gift that not everybody has. Also, i won't argue that certain cables require minimal burn-in, if any.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 23, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> The only cable I've ever heard make a difference from burn-in happened to be a genuine neotech Nei 2001 solid core silver RCA cables. After at least 3 weeks each full-time burning in Odin gold and Wel Signature "real knockoff" cables, I never heard an iota of difference. And don't even ask me how resolving my system is, now with the esteemed HEDDphone. Not sure if I'll try burn in anyway to tame the highs with this cable, or maybe another hack.


Levi , Most likely this is how it should be when everything is fine, the cable should not make changes to the signal, if scientifically. Another, if changes in the signal are not heard, it means that there are too many bad things that you can’t spoil. Remove all the new things and start from the beginning.


There are facts of influence on the signal and on the sound, there is a place to be when different materials, copper, silver, etc., transmit the signal in different ways, as well as many options for how the cable is made.

 The best cable is its absence, but this is again according to science, Ohm's laws and so on. The cable can and should work like a turbine to carry information into the system according to the laws of its nature and not according to science.


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Levi , Most likely this is how it should be when everything is fine, the cable should not make changes to the signal, if scientifically. Another, if changes in the signal are not heard, it means that there are too many bad things that you can’t spoil. Remove all the new things and start from the beginning.
> 
> 
> There are facts when different materials, copper, silver, etc., transmit the signal in different ways, as well as many options for how the cable is made.
> ...


You need advanced physics to know exactly what is going on. It is not a simple subject at all. Neotec indeed needs 80h-120h with their occ copper. Done a few projects with it. Excellent wire.

There is no such thing as fixed and definitive science. Scientism is just that, it is a religion. Science is alway open to new and better models. And requires open-mindedness. Experimentation, setting cognitive bias aside.

Nowadays, politicians speak in the name of science. They don't even know what it is. We live in a dark period.


----------



## szore

FredA said:


> You need advanced physics to know exactly what is going on. It is not a simple subject at all. Neotec indeed needs 80h-120h with their occ copper. Done a few projects with it. Excellent wire.
> 
> There is no such thing as fixed and definitive science. Scientism is just that, it is a religion. Science is alway open to new and better models. And requires open-mindedness. Experimentation, setting cognitive bias aside.
> 
> Nowadays, politicians speak in the name of science. They don't even know what it is. We live in a dark period.


Agreed.


----------



## KT77

FredA said:


> It's likely that they send them pre-burned. Otherwise, they would have a hard time selling some of them.


Good point, weird thing is they got so used to knowing what I’d eventually like, they’d send a new pair of IC’s along | in so many ways it helps having dealers that knows one’s taste.


----------



## FredA

Some guy who seems to be knowledgeable explains here what he thinks is going on during burn-in.

In French, but Google Translate should do a good job.

https://onlybass.com/topic/74020-le-rodage-des-câbles/


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 23, 2022)

FredA said:


> Some guy who seems to be knowledgeable explains here what he thinks is going on during burn-in.
> 
> In French, but Google Translate should do a good job.
> 
> https://onlybass.com/topic/74020-le-rodage-des-câbles/


Usually a kind-hearted crowd of such people is sent to the fire or to the media to be torn to pieces.

It seems that on this site the dude merged himself, dumping everything on April 1 as a joke.

It is difficult to swim against the current of religion and science.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

FredA said:


> You need advanced physics to know exactly what is going on. It is not a simple subject at all. Neotec indeed needs 80h-120h with their occ copper. Done a few projects with it. Excellent wire.
> 
> There is no such thing as fixed and definitive science. Scientism is just that, it is a religion. Science is alway open to new and better models. And requires open-mindedness. Experimentation, setting cognitive bias aside.
> 
> Nowadays, politicians speak in the name of science. They don't even know what it is. We live in a dark period.


well said


----------



## Crypt Keeper

I was skeptical on buying a “Cable Cooker” device, but after I’ve tried the Hagerman Labs cookers I believe it well worth the price …


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> Usually a kind-hearted crowd of such people is sent to the fire or to the media to be torn to pieces.
> 
> It seems that on this site the dude merged himself, dumping everything on April 1 as a joke.
> 
> It is difficult to swim against the current of religion and science.


Not sure i get you. Science evolution is wanted and a good thing. For science to evolve, you have to go against people with big money. This is how things work in our so called "evolved" world.


----------



## pashkaam

FredA said:


> Not sure i get you. Science evolution is wanted and a good thing. For science to evolve, you have to go against people with big money. This is how things work in our so called "evolved" world.


I wrote about the French guy  who from the beginning described the effect of the cable on the sound, and then, under the indignation of the crowd, he retracted his words referring to April 1


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> I just bought the cable because it was on sale for 11.11 for$36.  Damn good deal imo.
> 
> I'm just burning it in for now on my lps.  If it made any difference in sound i didn't notice because i got a new dac.
> 
> ...


After a week or two of more burn-in to your LPS, mind to do a comparison of it with other Odin cables on your amp or the like? That 15 core AC cable seems interesting, and is it shielded?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> After a week or two of more burn-in to your LPS, mind to do a comparison of it with other Odin cables on your amp or the like? That 15 core AC cable seems interesting, and is it shielded?


Its not shielded.

Just has a sleeve of what looks like pe or pvc on each conductor.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 23, 2022)

FredA said:


> I won't argue that with certain pairs of ears and certain set-ups, it can't be heard. Auditive accuity is a gift that not everybody has. Also, i won't argue that certain cables require minimal burn-in, if any.





pashkaam said:


> Levi , Most likely this is how it should be when everything is fine, the cable should not make changes to the signal, if scientifically. Another, if changes in the signal are not heard, it means that there are too many bad things that you can’t spoil. Remove all the new things and start from the beginning.
> 
> 
> There are facts of influence on the signal and on the sound, there is a place to be when different materials, copper, silver, etc., transmit the signal in different ways, as well as many options for how the cable is made.
> ...


This isn't about auditory acuity or how resolving my system is, rather that IMO/IME, most cables do not change with burn in. The fact that I was able to hear a distinct differences in every cable I tried, on every component from power conditioner to amp, to DDC, and could even hear the difference of foil shielding experiments, and the additions of Flux-50 filters, Etc show that both my hearing and my system are incredibly resolving and accurate. I could even hear some things nobody else could, such as with the addition of socket savers on my tube amp. To me it's just that cable burn in doesn't really exist for the most part, and it could be placebo. Plus no one's listening full-time during an entire burn in process, and when you come back at different times of the day or even different days, your perception of hearing itself can change. I definitely heard my system sound darker some days than others, but it could be either due to that and other changes in my system, and that was already after the cables had more than like 300 hours. I can't really pinpoint if it was a cable's sound changing. @pashkaam that's not right to assume there are a whole bunch of bad things in my system. You don't know exactly what I have, and it's much better than some of the others. And yes I had tried it in all different areas of my system, beginning, and end.

Cables are plug and play. And myself along with at least another on here agree that you can basically judge a book by its cover in this hobby... including headphones. Sounds signatures may change when connected to different components, but it will never be a radical difference, especially not from burn-in.


----------



## dougms3 (Nov 23, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> This isn't about auditory acuity or how resolving my system is, rather that IMO/IME, most cables do not change with burn in. The fact that I was able to hear a distinct differences in every cable I tried, on every component from power conditioner to amp, to DDC, and could even hear the difference of foil shielding experiments, and the additions of Flux-50 filters, Etc show that both my hearing and my system are incredibly resolving and accurate. I could even hear some things nobody else could, such as with the addition of socket savers on my tube amp. To me it's just that cable burn in doesn't really exist for the most part, and it could be placebo. Plus no one's listening full-time during an entire burn in process, and when you come back at different times of the day or even different days, your perception of hearing itself can change. I definitely heard my system sound darker some days than others, but it could be either due to that and other changes in my system, and that was already after the cables had more than like 300 hours. I can't really pinpoint if it was a cable's sound changing. @pashkaam that's not right to assume there are a whole bunch of bad things in my system. You don't know exactly what I have, and it's much better than some of the others. And yes I had tried it in all different areas of my system, beginning, and end.
> 
> Cables are plug and play. And myself along with at least another on here agree that you can basically judge a book by its cover in this hobby... including headphones. Sounds signatures may change when connected to different components, but it will never be a radical difference, especially not from burn-in.


To be honest, alot of people can't tell a difference because its usually very gradual.  Some people are more sensitive to the changes than others, doesn't mean its not happening.  Kind of like how you don't notice the earth is rotating very slowly over the course of 24 hours, or like a bullet train slowly creeping up to 200mph. 

Power cables in particular might be difficult to notice the difference if you're changing a good power cable for something slightly better or worse.  Our hearing adapts to the environment and sensitivity changes all through out the day.  In the course of a day, I'll listen to the sound system in my car, then headphones at home, then iems at the gym.  I've had the same sound system in my car for years, everything sounds different every day...

Also the car audio system fluctuates wildly depending on the environment like temperature, humidity, air pressure.


----------



## FredA

pashkaam said:


> I wrote about the French guy  who from the beginning described the effect of the cable on the sound, and then, under the indignation of the crowd, he retracted his words referring to April 1


Ok. Too bad he did!


----------



## dougms3

So I ordered this carbon fiber board as a base for my powervar plc.






The board is beautiful and so well made and inexpensive that since I now need a shelf / rack to hold this ridiculously large 17x17 audio-gd r8mk2 dac, I was thinking to get some carbon fiber boards and legs and just glue it together.  What do you guys think?

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2308!sh&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/225...2100bdd816692509486151295e05da!65675437886!sh


----------



## cdacosta

FredA said:


> I won't argue that with certain pairs of ears and certain set-ups, it can't be heard. Auditive accuity is a gift that not everybody has. Also, i won't argue that certain cables require minimal burn-in, if any.


Agreed, I won't argue either, and I do not disbelieve some people cannot hear burn-in.  Although I can, and to me it is dramatic with certain cables like the Nordost clone power cables and balanced interconnects.  To the extent that I had to walk away, it sounded that bad to me.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> So I ordered this carbon fiber board as a base for my powervar plc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Maybe a maple shelf with carbon fiber glued on top?


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> Maybe a maple shelf with carbon fiber glued on top?


I've been looking for around and its difficult to find something in the size that I'm looking for.  

That seller will cut pieces to exact sizes for me.  I wish I could drill a hole in carbon fiber but I dont have tools capable of doing that to carbon fiber, tool will probably break before it even scratches the carbon fiber.

Also its alot cheaper to build the shelf with these pieces.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> So I ordered this carbon fiber board as a base for my powervar plc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Carbon fiber is rigid but have never seen it used for load bearing.  If placed under component on top of a solid surface like a desk would be ok.  You would have to try to see is there is any negative (or positive) audible effects.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> I've been looking for around and its difficult to find something in the size that I'm looking for.
> 
> That seller will cut pieces to exact sizes for me.  I wish I could drill a hole in carbon fiber but I dont have tools capable of doing that to carbon fiber, tool will probably break before it even scratches the carbon fiber.
> 
> Also its alot cheaper to build the shelf with these pieces.


The depth can be below 17 inches. 15 would do, maybe less.


----------



## FredA

dougms3 said:


> I've been looking for around and its difficult to find something in the size that I'm looking for.
> 
> That seller will cut pieces to exact sizes for me.  I wish I could drill a hole in carbon fiber but I dont have tools capable of doing that to carbon fiber, tool will probably break before it even scratches the carbon fiber.
> 
> Also its alot cheaper to build the shelf with these pieces.


Just buy a rack.

https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/e-t-hifi-audio-racks-stand-table-c-25


----------



## dougms3

FredA said:


> The depth can be below 17 inches. 15 would do, maybe less.


Has to be around 23-24 inches depth to accomodate these ridiculous cables.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I was skeptical on buying a “Cable Cooker” device, but after I’ve tried the Hagerman Labs cookers I believe it well worth the price …


Yep Hagerman and Audioharma cookers work as advertised.


----------



## cdacosta

After reading/researching for hours on end about the grounding box written by users and reviewers, it seems there are a lot of audiophiles that really like Entreq products and the concept of a passive grounding box.   Although until I actually "hear" what if anything the concept does I will still be skeptical.  Some of the things I am reading do not make sense, but I am open minded and will experiment with the concept.  If in fact these devices work as advertised, or from the hundreds of user comments I have read, this would be a cool system project.  I have a few questions for users of such devices:

1) Minimum size (say in kg weight) of material to get good results per grounding box?

2) How much of a difference have you found in performance change using different quality and type of metals in the cable used going to component?  Meaning copper vs silver plated copper vs pure silver wire and connector materials?

3)  If you have tried to add multiple ground boxes within your system that have improved performance?  Whether it is daisy chaining units to add mass/volume or using additional grounding boxes for other parts of your system?

Happy Thanksgiving and thanks in advance!


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> So I ordered this carbon fiber board as a base for my powervar plc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Doug,

I’m digging the various sizes of carbon fiber boards myself, yet would like to add if it’s within your budget?, like many are currently doing, including me, by buying either a nice looking ( closed or open ) 2-3 shelf TV Stand or use a cocktail table that’s like about 42-57” wide, it looks tidier in the long run than having multiple racks all over the place, I’d then buy a few carbon fiber pucks ( isolation footers ) to place between the underside of the boards and atop said unit used as a rack.

Said examples:

https://www.overstock.com/Home-Gard...yle:Modern+&amp;+Contemporary&option=51427845

https://www.overstock.com/Home-Gard...5-97fd-2558c71fbfe6&recidx=0&st=pdp_cmpr_ctrl

Not knowing your taste in decor?, mades it difficult to select something for you, I can only show what I’d see as a gift to someone from me, to serve said purpose | as the main 2-3 components could then proudly be displayed atop the stand itself. I got the ideal after watching this video here ( scroll over to the 41:15 mark :

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...=iF2Qr8OpNxs&usg=AOvVaw00DtNiYYfHfzdTrGAXE6rl

I‘ve always been one of those semi-anal retentive types, to the point upon us moving into this apartment building just east of Detroit, I took it upon myself to measure where my rack and speakers stands would ideally fit, but installed two Oyaide AC Outlets, before bringing furniture into the room. My apologies if I got off track?.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Doug,
> 
> I’m digging the various sizes of carbon fiber boards myself, yet would like to add if it’s within your budget?, like many are currently doing, including me, by buying either a nice looking ( closed or open ) 2-3 shelf TV Stand or use a cocktail table that’s like about 42-57” wide, it looks tidier in the long run than having multiple racks all over the place, I’d then buy a few carbon fiber pucks ( isolation footers ) to place between the underside of the boards and atop said unit used as a rack.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the suggestions.

The problem is space constraints so I'm trying not to go too big.  I'm not really concerned with aesthetics, only function, it could be pink for all I care as long as its cheap.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> After reading/researching for hours on end about the grounding box written by users and reviewers, it seems there are a lot of audiophiles that really like Entreq products and the concept of a passive grounding box.   Although until I actually "hear" what if anything the concept does I will still be skeptical.  Some of the things I am reading do not make sense, but I am open minded and will experiment with the concept.  If in fact these devices work as advertised, or from the hundreds of user comments I have read, this would be a cool system project.  I have a few questions for users of such devices:
> 
> 1) Minimum size (say in kg weight) of material to get good results per grounding box?
> 
> ...


As always……, merely speaking for what I actually own, I’ve never gotten around to using any of these types made within a box, nor know said materials needed, I own 2 iFi AC iPurifiers | a Russ Andrews RF Router ( USA outlet ac plugs ) | Puritan Audio Labs Ground Master, the last two which are shown here, and seemingly only ever pursue pure silver grounding cables, of which I’m currently expecting 4 next week which were purchased on AliExpress to keep things in line with the thread.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> As always……, merely speaking for what I actually own, I’ve never gotten around to using any of these types made within a box, nor know said materials needed, I own 2 iFi AC iPurifiers | a Russ Andrews RF Router ( USA outlet ac plugs ) | Puritan Audio Labs Ground Master, the last two which are shown here, and seemingly only ever pursue pure silver grounding cables, of which I’m currently expecting 4 next week which were purchased on AliExpress to keep things in line with the thread.


The Puritan products are designed to work with a grounding rod IIRC.  I sold my home a year ago and am temporarily or currently in an apartment.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> The Puritan products are designed to work with a grounding rod IIRC.  I sold my home a year ago and am temporarily or currently in an apartment.


Once again, apologies, but I think I mentioned earlier?, maybe not?, there’s an additional part called the Ground Master - City, which takes the grounding cable from the main unit and is placed into this secondary device, which is then plugged directly into a ac outlet:

https://www.mackenziehifi.com/puritan-audio-labs---the-ground-mastercity-master-4267-p.asp


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Once again, apologies, but I think I mentioned earlier?, maybe not?, there’s an additional part called the Ground Master - City, which takes the grounding cable from the main unit and is placed into this secondary device, which is then plugged directly into a ac outlet:
> 
> https://www.mackenziehifi.com/puritan-audio-labs---the-ground-mastercity-master-4267-p.asp


Thanks, I forgot they sold such a thing. Will consider this. First the passive grounding units.  I plan to be buying a new home hopefully sooner than later.  Use to have dedicated lines, miss those.


----------



## DecentLevi

szore said:


> I think the idea is RCA connections tat are 'live' with signal act like little noise transmitters. The caps with center pin removed just grounds it all out and shields it. I bought mine on Amazon...
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083NKQBJ8?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details


I'm going to treat myself to RCA plugs as a little Thanksgiving gift, LOL... seeing how I have to work tomorrow.

Any consensus on which material sounds better, between the ones that are available on Amazon? Either rhodium or gold-plated. The AliExpress link says it's gold-plated brass, not sure if that's actually the same thing.

And if it has a center pin, hopefully that doesn't also connect to the ground pin and cause a short circuit?

And I don't understand this sentence, would you mind to reword it?
_ The caps with center pin removed just grounds it all out and shields it. _


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> And I don't understand this sentence, would you mind to reword it?
> _ The caps with center pin removed just grounds it all out and shields it._


Have been using these types of caps for 20 years.  Usually gold plated brass, teflon insulation.  No center pin, only ground contact.  Idea behind these RCA caps is to minimize RFI through the RCA jacks.  I use them with fo.Q T-102 on the outside of the cap.  Can hear a slight lowering of noise floor when enough of the RCA jacks are covered.  The effect is very slight but to my ears still there.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> So I ordered this carbon fiber board as a base for my powervar plc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very nice Indeed !


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 24, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> After reading/researching for hours on end about the grounding box written by users and reviewers, it seems there are a lot of audiophiles that really like Entreq products and the concept of a passive grounding box.   Although until I actually "hear" what if anything the concept does I will still be skeptical.  Some of the things I am reading do not make sense, but I am open minded and will experiment with the concept.  If in fact these devices work as advertised, or from the hundreds of user comments I have read, this would be a cool system project.  I have a few questions for users of such devices:
> 
> 1) Minimum size (say in kg weight) of material to get good results per grounding box?
> 
> ...


1) 2KG Aucharm was good but after that I got 16 KG / 4 in 1 (I think, Better quality material used) and it was an upgrade…
2) I have used cheap silver plated and the pure Silver Audiocrast, I mentioned befo - It’s impossible to tell the difference, but I believe the Audiocrast is better than $5 cable with crappy shielding n' 
crappy connectors   on both sides…
3) Yes I have it on my : Etherregen, Streamer, DDC, DAC and the clock…

Happy Turkey day !


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> 1) 2KG Aucharm was good but after that I got 16 KG / 4 in 1 (I think, Better quality material used) and it was an upgrade…
> 2) I have used cheap silver plated and the pure Silver Audiocrast, I mentioned befo - It’s impossible to tell the difference, but I believe the Audiocrast is better than $5 cable with crappy shielding n'
> crappy connectors   on both sides…
> 3) Yes I have it on my : Etherregen, Streamer, DDC, DAC and the clock…
> ...


Thanks, helpful info.  What I have read fairly consistently is bigger the more profound the performance.  So in your case you went from 2kg to 4 kg per device.  I also read fairly consistently is the better or different connection materials and cabling metal (copper vs silver plated vs pure silver) yielded different results.

Did adding connection to each subsequent device after the first yield incremental improvements?  What I am asking is you likely liked the results from the first device connected.  What type of improvement did you hear with subsequent connections?  Thanks for sharing your experience!


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> 1) 2KG Aucharm was good but after that I got 16 KG / 4 in 1 (I think, Better quality material used) and it was an upgrade…
> 2) I have used cheap silver plated and the pure Silver Audiocrast, I mentioned befo - It’s impossible to tell the difference, but I believe the Audiocrast is better than $5 cable with crappy shielding n'
> crappy connectors   on both sides…
> 3) Yes I have it on my : Etherregen, Streamer, DDC, DAC and the clock…
> ...


Have you found a cable that has a RJ45 connector on it?  So far I can only find Entreq selling the cable.  How the end is terminated I do not care.  I would just make one but I am not 100% sure which of the 8 RJ45 terminations I should be connecting to the grounding box.  I want it for the Router/modem.  Thanks!


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 24, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Thanks, helpful info.  What I have read fairly consistently is bigger the more profound the performance.  So in your case you went from 2kg to 4 kg per device.  I also read fairly consistently is the better or different connection materials and cabling metal (copper vs silver plated vs pure silver) yielded different results.
> 
> Did adding connection to each subsequent device after the first yield incremental improvements?  What I am asking is you likely liked the results from the first device connected.  What type of improvement did you hear with subsequent connections?  Thanks for sharing your experience!




What I can tell for sure: DDC was connected to the 2 KG (Aucharm), after that DDC went on -> 4Kg + adding DAC to 4KG = Huge improvement over only DDC on the Aucharm… For my SOtm (Isolated USB output) streamer I’m using my custom made 4 core USB grounding cable (used crappy solid silver Ali USB I had for ages) … After I switched to the Audiocrast solid silver cables I think I got better results … Again it’s very subjective and based on my perception only …


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Have you found a cable that has a RJ45 connector on it?  So far I can only find Entreq selling the cable.  How the end is terminated I do not care.  I would just make one but I am not 100% sure which of the 8 RJ45 terminations I should be connecting to the grounding box.  I want it for the Router/modem.  Thanks!


Yes, Entreq and Afterdark has it … But I just bought a box of https://a.co/d/0CFqdns  (use the  jacket) Works great !


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yes, Entreq and Afterdark has it … But I just bought a box of https://a.co/d/0CFqdns  (use the  jacket) Works great !


Looked at the link and I am not sure what I am looking at?  What exactly would I be getting in that link?  And you have tried it and it works/improves sonics?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Nov 24, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Looked at the link and I am not sure what I am looking at?  What exactly would I be getting in that link?  And you have tried it and it works/improves sonics?


You will be getting a box of Ubiquiti i RJ45 Grounding cables … You might want to upgrade the wire to S. Silver though…






It's  only $11  for  a box of  20 ....


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Has to be around 23-24 inches depth to accomodate these ridiculous cables.


I'm using  2 of  these ...Very well made ... https://a.co/d/fMX8Dm3


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> You will be getting a box of Ubiquiti i RJ45 Grounding cables … You might want to upgrade the wire to S. Silver though…
> 
> 
> 
> It's  only $11  for  a box of  20 ....


Ok, lets make sure I understand this.  So I get 20 of those connectors for $11.  I also supply the wire and ring connector to the RJ45 connector chassis?  Unless the wire and connector is already in place (like it is shown in the picture) I cannot tell how it is installed.

The connector by itself plugs into my device and the lead goes to grounding box, right?  And this has shown a positive sonic improvement for you?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Ok, lets make sure I understand this.  So I get 20 of those connectors for $11.  I also supply the wire and ring connector to the RJ45 connector chassis?  Unless the wire and connector is already in place (like it is shown in the picture) I cannot tell how it is installed.
> 
> The connector by itself plugs into my device and the lead goes to grounding box, right?  And this has shown a positive sonic improvement for you?


I have not tried this grounding cable with my router yet (b/c I’m grounding my Etherregen) … Yes , (The connector by itself plugs into my device and the lead goes to grounding box) The Jacket on RJ45 is the grounding … I can not confirm the improvement using JUST this cable… b/c I have 5 of my devices ( Including the Etherregen ) connected…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I have not tried this grounding cable with my router yet (b/c I’m grounding my Etherregen) … Yes , (The connector by itself plugs into my device and the lead goes to grounding box) The Jacket on RJ45 is the grounding … I can not confirm the improvement using JUST this cable… b/c I have 5 of my devices ( Including the Etherregen ) connected…


I appreciate the pic, patience and sharing.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Ok, lets make sure I understand this.  So I get 20 of those connectors for $11.  I also supply the wire and ring connector to the RJ45 connector chassis?  Unless the wire and connector is already in place (like it is shown in the picture) I cannot tell how it is installed.
> 
> The connector by itself plugs into my device and the lead goes to grounding box, right?  And this has shown a positive sonic improvement for you?


Basically the  same grounding RJ45 cable  from Afterdark...
https://www.adark.co/products/after...ackice-ground-box?_pos=1&_sid=e43cfb181&_ss=r


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I appreciate the pic, patience and sharing.


My pleasure


----------



## cdacosta

I have a pic of the Entreq cable showing which of the 8 connections is connected.  Can I see a pic of the bottom of the connector?  The pic you took is of the top.  Thanks for your assistance with this.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Have been using these types of caps for 20 years.  Usually gold plated brass, teflon insulation.  No center pin, only ground contact.  Idea behind these RCA caps is to minimize RFI through the RCA jacks.  I use them with fo.Q T-102 on the outside of the cap.  Can hear a slight lowering of noise floor when enough of the RCA jacks are covered.  The effect is very slight but to my ears still there.


Thanks. What is the fo.Q T-102 on the outside of the cap for? And can you show a photo of how that's used?


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> Thanks for the suggestions.
> 
> The problem is space constraints so I'm trying not to go too big.  I'm not really concerned with aesthetics, only function, it could be pink for all I care as long as its cheap.


Totally understood…, except the pink part, I’d see it you said salmon.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Thanks, I forgot they sold such a thing. Will consider this. First the passive grounding units.  I plan to be buying a new home hopefully sooner than later.  Use to have dedicated lines, miss those.


You’re more than welcome.

Happy search on the new home as well.


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Basically the  same grounding RJ45 cable  from Afterdark...
> https://www.adark.co/products/after...ackice-ground-box?_pos=1&_sid=e43cfb181&_ss=r


This is extremely easy to make.

That is a toolless shielded rj45 connector and you could connect it to something like this or a grounding box should offer some improvements.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Thanks. What is the fo.Q T-102 on the outside of the cap for? And can you show a photo of how that's used?


See attached pic.  Pic is of Lexicon preamp while I was packing it up.  Look at the caps, the black round material on the gold plated caps is the fo.Q T-102.  I used a leather hole punch to get the fo.Q T-102 round.  The fo.Q T-102 is micro vibration control material.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> This is extremely easy to make.
> 
> That is a toolless shielded rj45 connector and you could connect it to something like this or a grounding box should offer some improvements.


Kind of what I am planning to try.  The router does not have a earth ground.  What I am actually going to try is take a CAT 7 cable (OFC copper lead), strip and cut off all the leads except the ground pin lead Entreq uses.  Teflon wrap and heat shrink to guarantee no shorts.  Other end of lead to grounding box or similar.   

I read from a couple of users of Entreq boxes that upon doing what I want to try was astonished at the performance increase.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Kind of what I am planning to try.  The router does not have a earth ground.  What I am actually going to try is take a CAT 7 cable (OFC copper lead), strip and cut off all the leads except the ground pin lead Entreq uses.  Teflon wrap and heat shrink to guarantee no shorts.  Other end of lead to grounding box or similar.
> 
> I read from a couple of users of Entreq boxes that upon doing what I want to try was astonished at the performance increase.


You can use whatever wire you want.  Doesn't have to be a cat anything.

Not sure which pinout you would connect that to though?  Theres 8 wires in the ethernet cable and it would probably go on the negative but which one ?


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> You can use whatever wire you want.  Doesn't have to be a cat anything.
> 
> Not sure which pinout you would connect that to though?  Theres 8 wires in the ethernet cable and it would probably go on the negative but which one ?


I just picked a RJ45 cable because it had 23ga. OFC copper.  Pin 4.  Can just search the net for "Entreq eartha rj45 cables" and see a few pics of the actual cables.


----------



## cdacosta (Nov 24, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> You can use whatever wire you want.  Doesn't have to be a cat anything.
> 
> Not sure which pinout you would connect that to though?  Theres 8 wires in the ethernet cable and it would probably go on the negative but which one ?


Actually go by these pics... Pin 5


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 24, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> See attached pic.  Pic is of Lexicon preamp while I was packing it up.  Look at the caps, the black round material on the gold plated caps is the fo.Q T-102.  I used a leather hole punch to get the fo.Q T-102 round.  The fo.Q T-102 is micro vibration control material.


That's quite interesting, maybe even unique. I already have sorbothane sheets, which is a special vibration absorption material similar to rubber but better. Maybe I could try some of that instead, is it the same material? One of them is a fairly thin sheet. But what size of leather hole punch should I get?


----------



## DecentLevi

Looks like I'm not the only one who needs a big gob of these. I needed at least 28 RCA caps for my integrated amp. I ordered six 8-packs. Rhodium and gold-plated so I can compare.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> That's quite interesting, maybe even unique. I already have sorbothane sheets, which is a special vibration absorption material similar to rubber but better. Maybe I could try some of that instead, is it the same material? One of them is a fairly thin sheet. But what size of leather hole punch should I get?


IIRC Sorbathane is used as dampening material "between" material.  fo.Q dampening tape goes on top of what you want to minimize micro vibrations.  I have not experienced micro dampening material better then fo.Q T-102 and T-32 (thinner and more pliable) yet.  There are many applications within an audio system that produce positive and audible sonic benefits.  Cannot remember the size of the hole punch, they come in a kit of about 10+ sizes.  You can just get a size smaller then the diameter of the cap.   

Pics are just two examples of how fo.Q T-102 can be used.  Also work excellent on subwoofer drivers.


----------



## dougms3

Btw this set of speaker isolators came out to $10.45 for me before tax.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08R8FDHHF/ref=ox_sc_act_title_11?smid=ARWHO5528CW1O&th=1


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Btw this set of speaker isolators came out to $10.45 for me before tax.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08R8FDHHF/ref=ox_sc_act_title_11?smid=ARWHO5528CW1O&th=1


They are coupling footers.  inexpensive


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> IIRC Sorbathane is used as dampening material "between" material.  fo.Q dampening tape goes on top of what you want to minimize micro vibrations.  I have not experienced micro dampening material better then fo.Q T-102 and T-32 (thinner and more pliable) yet.  There are many applications within an audio system that produce positive and audible sonic benefits.  Cannot remember the size of the hole punch, they come in a kit of about 10+ sizes.  You can just get a size smaller then the diameter of the cap.
> 
> Pics are just two examples of how fo.Q T-102 can be used.  Also work excellent on subwoofer drivers.


I'm not sure I can see that yet. Is it those tiny two dots on the outside of each driver?

And would *this* be the right type and a reasonable deal?

Also I just compared what I got to your attached photo and it looks like mine are different, with your RCA plugs being more flat. Did I get the wrong kind or will these work good too?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I'm not sure I can see that yet. Is it those tiny two dots on the outside of each driver?
> 
> And would *this* be the right type and a reasonable deal?
> 
> Also I just compared what I got to your attached photo and it looks like mine are different, with your RCA plugs being more flat. Did I get the wrong kind or will these work good too?


If you detach the center pin otherwise it is a shorting plug.  Cannot attach any vibration control material though.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I'm not sure I can see that yet. Is it those tiny two dots on the outside of each driver?


Two 1/8" dot on the edge of each driver.  On small drivers (8" and smaller) I use two 1/8" dots.  On larger than 8" driver, one 3/16" dot at the bottom center edge of the driver.  When I say edge of driver, like in the pics just before the surround material.  What this will do is make the driver more precise.  Which will sound a tad quicker, bass tighter, more precise and more musical.  Improves accuracy of notes and everything you hear.  If you apply to outside of driver basket will also improve control of driver.  

I shared this tweak with Doug awhile back.  I know he has tried this tweak and IIRC has an opinion of it.  Maybe he can share his thoughts on it or you can ask him.

There are many uses of the fo.Q T-102 within an audio system.


----------



## KT77

Hi guys,

I seem to recall at least 2 of you having purchased the 15 core Valhalla power cord, and am wondering if it’s to early to tell me sonically once again, how it sounds compared to either the Odin 2, or Odin Gold cords?.

And while it might seem irrelevant, are there sonic differences to be heard between say the black carbon fiber hounding versus the lighter grey version as it relates to the power plugs themselves?, or is this purely cosmetic at best?.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> They are coupling footers.  inexpensive


Whatever you do?, please don’t place any isolation footers directly beneath the original stick rubber footers, one gets much better results placing them directly underneath the chassis of their gear, a much more responsive nature I’d add.  

The method shown in the video is totally a bunch of BS!.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I seem to recall at least 2 of you having purchased the 15 core Valhalla power cord, and am wondering if it’s to early to tell me sonically once again, how it sounds compared to either the Odin 2, or Odin Gold cords?.
> 
> And while it might seem irrelevant, are there sonic differences to be heard between say the black carbon fiber hounding versus the lighter grey version as it relates to the power plugs themselves?, or is this purely cosmetic at best?.


I haven't A/B'd it vs the odin cables.  Its quite annoying for me since I have to turn off my pc and the gear that I"m swapping with.  I'll do it once I get a stand to hold my dac.

I don't think the color of the carbon fiber will make any difference.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> I haven't A/B'd it vs the odin cables.  Its quite annoying for me since I have to turn off my pc and the gear that I"m swapping with.  I'll do it once I get a stand to hold my dac.
> 
> I don't think the color of the carbon fiber will make any difference.


Thanks Doug,

I was trying to get a general idea of what to expect compared to the other Odin types before buying, of which I’ve decided to stick with the Odin Gold version on my DAC, yet due to this one being thicker gauged and since I’m still somewhat curious about silver plated copper power cords in general, in hopes of having a slightly more dynamically balanced top end, whereas the Odin Gold while very very nice sounding, does roll of the very top end just a tad, a little bit more extension here wouldn’t hurt.

Thanks for the insight on said coloring options of the carbon fiber shelling.

Earlier today, I came across this device, of which looks very interesting on my end, and am looking to purchase one next week just out of curiosity:

https://a.aliexpress.com/_mOPb5EM

Have a great weekend young man.
Peace beyond to you | yours.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Thanks Doug,
> 
> I was trying to get a general idea of what to expect compared to the other Odin types before buying, of which I’ve decided to stick with the Odin Gold version on my DAC, yet due to this one being thicker gauged and since I’m still somewhat curious about silver plated copper power cords in general, in hopes of having a slightly more dynamically balanced top end, whereas the Odin Gold while very very nice sounding, does roll of the very top end just a tad, a little bit more extension here wouldn’t hurt.
> 
> ...


I will have to do some cable rolling once I find a final position for my new dac.  

It has alot more bass than my previous dac and I was using the gryphon knockoff power cable over the odin because it had a warmer, bassier signature but since the new dac is quite bassy, it makes the bass from my Denon d7200 a bit overwhelming.  My eardrums are sore from the violence of the bass hits.  The odin might have better synergy with the new dac.

I saw that on ali and was curious about it also but its pricey.  If theres a time to get it, its now, $3 off every $30 and coupon codes.


----------



## KT77 (Nov 25, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> I will have to do some cable rolling once I find a final position for my new dac.
> 
> It has alot more bass than my previous dac and I was using the gryphon knockoff power cable over the odin because it had a warmer, bassier signature but since the new dac is quite bassy, it makes the bass from my Denon d7200 a bit overwhelming.  My eardrums are sore from the violence of the bass hits.  The odin might have better synergy with the new dac.
> 
> I saw that on ali and was curious about it also but its pricey.  If theres a time to get it, its now, $3 off every $30 and coupon codes.


Once again, Thanks Doug,

Depending upon where you reside?, you’d always borrow a few items from me, more often than not most of it sits here for months, if not an entire year before it’s placed into my main system.

I’ve always seen sharing and caring as one of the same, BS types need no apply, yet your vibe wears well from where I sit.

Said items:


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> IIRC Sorbathane is used as dampening material "between" material.  fo.Q dampening tape goes on top of what you want to minimize micro vibrations.  I have not experienced micro dampening material better then fo.Q T-102 and T-32 (thinner and more pliable) yet.  There are many applications within an audio system that produce positive and audible sonic benefits.  Cannot remember the size of the hole punch, they come in a kit of about 10+ sizes.  You can just get a size smaller then the diameter of the cap.
> 
> Pics are just two examples of how fo.Q T-102 can be used.  Also work excellent on subwoofer drivers.


And what is this glued on the board, is it an anti-vibration sticker? 
This is interesting because if this is the case, then you can stick it on many electrical parts inside. Where can you buy? Do our friends in the ALI store sell such tapes?


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thanks Doug,
> 
> I was trying to get a general idea of what to expect compared to the other Odin types before buying, of which I’ve decided to stick with the Odin Gold version on my DAC, yet due to this one being thicker gauged and since I’m still somewhat curious about silver plated copper power cords in general, in hopes of having a slightly more dynamically balanced top end, whereas the Odin Gold while very very nice sounding, does roll of the very top end just a tad, a little bit more extension here wouldn’t hurt.
> 
> ...


Odin 2 will give you a bit more extension in the top end and is a bit quicker vs Odin Gold.  Gold has a tad warmer presentation.  This is my experience, YMMV.


----------



## pashkaam

The well-known snake oil  FLUX 50 with a Cheap filter inside.
There are better ideas,  put a good board that will really filter the power, clean up the block DC and keep it out of the Power. Here's what I found.
There are no discussions and information about Chinese power filters on the Internet, but judging by the reviews of the circuits of the DIY filters, the good effect of the power filters on the sound on the stage is convincing. .. Has anyone tried such a filter? There are a lot of them, but this one is average, there are better capacitors, but more expensive.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...00029190077177!sea&curPageLogUid=rrxTIudIqFg2


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Odin 2 will give you a bit more extension in the top end and is a bit quicker vs Odin Gold.  Gold has a tad warmer presentation.  This is my experience, YMMV.


Thanks as well, cdacosta.

As it stands I’m trying my best to decide between said Valhalla | Odin 2, as the latter was the only one I had purchased and ended up selling to a buddy of mine because of its weight | it had my previous Denafrips Ares ll laying on its side, yet I’m to assume since the Valhalla version is thicker, it’d have more weight?, but in truth as cheap as both of them are, I just might buy them both.

Logically it shouldn’t hurt. As always notes taken | appreciated.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Thanks as well, cdacosta.
> 
> As it stands I’m trying my best to decide between said Valhalla | Odin 2, as the latter was the only one I had purchased and ended up selling to a buddy of mine because of its weight | it had my previous Denafrips Ares ll laying on its side, yet I’m to assume since the Valhalla version is thicker, it’d have more weight?, but in truth as cheap as both of them are, I just might buy them both.
> 
> Logically it shouldn’t hurt. As always notes taken | appreciated.


My pleasure


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> And what is this glued on the board, is it an anti-vibration sticker?
> This is interesting because if this is the case, then you can stick it on many electrical parts inside. Where can you buy? Do our friends in the ALI store sell such tapes?


That “sticker” as you call it is the same material as those dots on the caps.  It is fo.Q T-102, made and sold only from Japan.  Can be purchased from eBay or Amazon, or high end audio stores for more money. Comes as two sheets in a package and priced around $60.  In my humble opinion one of the best bang for the $ audio tweak money can buy.


----------



## dougms3

pashkaam said:


> And what is this glued on the board, is it an anti-vibration sticker?
> This is interesting because if this is the case, then you can stick it on many electrical parts inside. Where can you buy? Do our friends in the ALI store sell such tapes?


Its a very powerful dampener.  Its also slightly conductive.

It has the ability to convert mechanical vibration to electricity then heat.  Its similar to sorbothane which also converts mechanical vibration, but directly to heat.  But it works better than sorbothane and a small piece of fo.q tape is much more effective than the same size piece of sorbothane.  If I had to guess, I'd say its at least 10x more effective by volume.

So far I have not seen any sellers on aliexpress be able to copy this, it'd be nice if there were something as its quite expensive.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Its a very powerful dampener.  Its also slightly conductive.
> 
> It has the ability to convert mechanical vibration to electricity then heat.  Its similar to sorbothane which also converts mechanical vibration, but directly to heat.  But it works better than sorbothane and a small piece of fo.q tape is much more effective than the same size piece of sorbothane.  If I had to guess, I'd say its at least 10x more effective by volume.
> 
> So far I have not seen any sellers on aliexpress be able to copy this, it'd be nice if there were something as its quite expensive.


I agree with Doug except for $60 the value to midfi and up systems is extremely high. So to me not expensive.


----------



## Zaek

dougms3 said:


> Received the $36 15 core valhalla power cable today.
> 
> This thing is massive and feels like it weighs close to 10lbs.  Its as thick as my thumb.


Any impression? comparison with other Odin 2 or Odin Gold?


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Any impression? comparison with other Odin 2 or Odin Gold?


I'm burning it in on my lps right now.  

Maybe in a week or two I'll test it out on my new audio-gd dac, that thing is so resolving and detailed, I should be able to pinpoint any strengths or weaknesses with an A/B comparison.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> If you detach the center pin otherwise it is a shorting plug.  Cannot attach any vibration control material though.


It seems I somehow got the rounded RCA caps vs. yours which are flat, even though I used the Amazon link recommended here. I'm thinking I can still apply a small bit putty on the end of these anyway, maybe still for some benefit.






For the fo.Q T-102 (putty), is this a good deal?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/313817350010


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> It seems I somehow got the rounded RCA caps vs. yours which are flat, even though I used the Amazon link recommended here. I'm thinking I can still apply a small bit putty on the end of these anyway, maybe still for some benefit.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


T-102 is not pliable so cannot be used on those caps.  There is a listing advertised in the link you provided for $55 shipped.  

When you get the T-102 or T-32 let me know and I will share with you where and how I use it.


----------



## dougms3

New toys in today.  Audiocrast isolation footers.

And got this neat little 3 tier bamboo shoe rack for $33 off Amazon to hold some devices, fits like a glove right under my desk.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> New toys in today.  Audiocrast isolation footers.
> 
> And got this neat little 3 tier bamboo shoe rack for $33 off Amazon to hold some devices, fits like a glove right under my desk.


Nice. I am waiting for toys/parts to try out this grounding box theory.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> New toys in today.  Audiocrast isolation footers.
> 
> And got this neat little 3 tier bamboo shoe rack for $33 off Amazon to hold some devices, fits like a glove right under my desk.


Very very tidy indeed, and thank God you’ve placed the isolation footers properly, I’ve never understood why some users place them directly underneath the stock footers of any component, where they’re the least effective.

Way to go once again young man.


----------



## Stax 7

dougms3 said:


> New toys in today.  Audiocrast isolation footers.
> 
> And got this neat little 3 tier bamboo shoe rack for $33 off Amazon to hold some devices, fits like a glove right under my desk.


Any sound differences with the isolation footers?


----------



## dougms3

Stax 7 said:


> Any sound differences with the isolation footers?



Maybe a minor difference, I can't really tell because my dac is burning right now.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Nice. I am waiting for toys/parts to try out this grounding box theory.


My pre built box should be here in a few days...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> My pre built box should be here in a few days...


Cool, which one did you get?  I will be able to do some tests today.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Cool, which one did you get?  I will be able to do some tests today.


2255799978657859

I got it with banana plug for the ground post on the power conditioner. He wouldn't tell me what was in it tho, only the weight... 3.7 KG...I guess I'm taking a chance but that's what this forum is all about, right?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> 2255799978657859
> 
> I got it with banana plug for the ground post on the power conditioner. He wouldn't tell me what was in it tho, only the weight... 3.7 KG...I guess I'm taking a chance but that's what this forum is all about, right?


I cannot see or access a link via those numbers to see what you purchased.


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> I cannot see or access a link via those numbers to see what you purchased.


*cdacosta *
The link is working. When copying, do not make spaces, not at the beginning, not at the end.

Try one more time without  spaces , only digits .


----------



## cdacosta

cdacosta said:


> I cannot see or access a link via those numbers to see what you purchased.


Tried again.  For whatever reason whether from app or web browser I cannot see Aliexpress links from numbers, only URL.  No biggie, just show us after you get it.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I cannot see or access a link via those numbers to see what you purchased.


I'm sorry, just copy and paste the numbers into the search box on Ali express and it should pop up!

or maybe this works...

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2UnDMgl&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I'm sorry, just copy and paste the numbers into the search box on Ali express and it should pop up!
> 
> or maybe this works...
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2UnDMgl&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


Numbers do not work but link does.  I have spent a lot of time researching and reading about these passive grounding units.  Interesting on the unit you purchased does not have a binding post.  And what they mention is "the pure silver wire directly into the box is connected to the copper plate (not connected by the speaker terminal), the test is compared, if the terminal is connected, the effect is only about 30%.".  I find this interesting and will test it.  Binding post is handy to test different wire, but it is possible they are right.


----------



## szore

Also have this tape coming..

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...207Onov&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

Does this work best on both ends of the power cables only? And a piece on the relays in the fuse box?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Also have this tape coming..
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...207Onov&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> Does this work best on both ends of the power cables only? And a piece on the relays in the fuse box?


Oyaide EMI tape MWA-010T is not the same as what you purchased from Aliexpress.  I highly doubt will work the same.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Oyaide EMI tape MWA-010T is not the same as what you purchased from Aliexpress.  I highly doubt will work the same.


ah, I should have checked first... ill try it out it was inexpensive.


----------



## pashkaam

Today received ODIN 2 RCA -RCA and  XLR to RCA IC .
The first was for the RCA test (DAC to AMPS). Honestly, one disorder, physicality disappeared, the piano became thin and not of natural size, something happened to the bass, it also decreased. Turned Argento Flow back on the physicality of the instruments, medium low range, returned.
 The DAC has XLR outputs, I tried the same ODIN 2 rca- rca thing through an adapter XLR to RCA , all the same .(???)
 For second testing I try ODIN 2 but XLR to RCA from my dac to Amps
Installed and voila, it sounds much better out of the box this cable than Argento Flow. More air, clarity, stage
became a little better because of the clarity than Argento and so on .
I'm very happy, I got what I wanted. Sounding perfect .  It's strange why the same ODIN 2 RCA played differently, even with an XLR adapter? RCA kit ODIN2 will go to spare parts in the amplifier as wiring.


----------



## cdacosta

Initial thoughts on usage or application of signal ground filtering.  It is real and does effect what is heard.  Most of what I read from Entreq users and DIY grounding box users (most also own Entreq products) is what I am also experiencing to an extent.  So far what I have tried is super simple and will experiment because I am liking what this is doing.

*What I did:* Using one meter of 12ga OCC (multi gauge totaling 12ga) copper wire. Wire terminated with Furutech solderless RCA CF-201 (R) RCA connector that is plugged into open RCA output jack of DAC.  Other end of wire stripped 6" and stuck into a 7.5lb. (3.4kg) bag of magnetite.  I also stuck a piece of stainless steel into the bag but that is barely audible, so assume it does nothing.  Furutech Nano Liquid when terminating the wire to RCA connector. 

*What I heard:*  When I first plugged it in there was a change in what I heard and I did not like it.  Sounded off, I cannot remember how, just did not like it.  After 10 mins I disconnected the cable and back to the way it was.  So this tells me messing with signal ground does in fact audibly effect what is heard.  I re-connected the RCA and same thing, did not like it.  

There is suppose to be a minimum settling time of 3 hours or so.  Before re-connecting for the third time I applied Nano Liquid to the connector and DAC output jack, now this made a big difference which I did not expect.  This tells me it is very likely not only the connection matters, likely the wire used and how it is terminated at the box matters.  As unexpected this is since there is no signal being transmitted via the cable or device, but *hands in the air*.

Now after 2-3 hours what I heard started changing, I am now about 5 hours in.  Another crazy and unexpected surprise happened.  Close to me while I was listening there was a singular Shatki Online.  Using two small blobs of blu-tac, placed the Online on the cable after the connector and now more improvement.  The Shatki Online has crystals in it as the active ingredient.

So what am I hearing now?  
* Did not effect the the sonic signature or PRAT of the system.
* Everything heard is harmonically richer.  Not a massive change, but is obvious.
* Vocals and instruments/sounds are more separated, focused and with a bit more precision.
* More engaging and emotional when listening.


----------



## LocalMotion

FYI for links to Ali just remove all the parameter junk from the url. Everything after html stating with the ?

I.e.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255799978657859.html


----------



## cdacosta

Absolutely hilarious.  Placed 3 IsoAcoustics mini pucks under the plastic tupperware container the Magnetite is sitting in and bass got tighter and hits harder. LOL  

Best part is it all sounds even better now compared to an hour ago.  Now is more 3D to soundstage and is obvious noise floor has been lowered even more.  Also a bit more separation with everything heard.  Was watching an episode of Punisher on Disney+ and is very obvious, including the 140 BPM Acid Trance I am listening to now.   LOL very cool.  The difference with and without this jimmy rigged signal ground is not subtle.

I just ordered two more 7.5lb bags of this Magnetite.  Also ordered Tourmaline, Tungsten and other to try with the Magnetite.  For anyone wanting to try what I did this is the Magnetite I got:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2243004913...rentrq:c231e6ea1840ab95198bc6bbfff6bea4|iid:1

Listing says only 8 bags left so...


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> Absolutely hilarious.  Placed 3 IsoAcoustics mini pucks under the plastic tupperware container the Magnetite is sitting in and bass got tighter and hits harder. LOL
> 
> Best part is it all sounds even better now compared to an hour ago.  Now is more 3D to soundstage and is obvious noise floor has been lowered even more.  Also a bit more separation with everything heard.  Was watching an episode of Punisher on Disney+ and is very obvious, including the 140 BPM Acid Trance I am listening to now.   LOL very cool.  The difference with and without this jimmy rigged signal ground is not subtle.
> 
> ...


Great report | as I discovered about 5 years ago the effective of said IsoAcoustics placed underneath every DAC I’ve owned….., and wrote everybody I knew and told them they were must haves, yet it’s nice tk see you’ve found away to take them one step further.


----------



## cdacosta

KT77 said:


> Great report | as I discovered about 5 years ago the effective of said IsoAcoustics placed underneath every DAC I’ve owned….., and wrote everybody I knew and told them they were must haves, yet it’s nice tk see you’ve found away to take them one step further.


I ordered silicon footers for the boxes I am going to make but will definitely try using the same IsoAcoustic mini pucks under boxes.  Currently have them also under Jotunheim 2 headphone amp and DAC.


----------



## KT77

cdacosta said:


> I ordered silicon footers for the boxes I am going to make but will definitely try using the same IsoAcoustic mini pucks under boxes.  Currently have them also under Jotunheim 2 headphone amp and DAC.


Once again, great report | creative thinking on your part.


----------



## kenincalgary

szore said:


> 2255799978657859
> 
> I got it with banana plug for the ground post on the power conditioner. He wouldn't tell me what was in it tho, only the weight... 3.7 KG...I guess I'm taking a chance but that's what this forum is all about, right?


I got one of these out of curiosity and connected it immediately to the DAC/streamer/preamp. My brain couldn't parse what I was hearing so I went away to have dinner and give it the recommended 30 minutes minimum settling time. After dinner and after a 5 minute listen I went online and ordered 2 more. Don't know what's in them but they definitely work.


----------



## szore

kenincalgary said:


> I got one of these out of curiosity and connected it immediately to the DAC/streamer/preamp. My brain couldn't parse what I was hearing so I went away to have dinner and give it the recommended 30 minutes minimum settling time. After dinner and after a 5 minute listen I went online and ordered 2 more. Don't know what's in them but they definitely work.


Awesome! Mine comes on Friday...


----------



## pashkaam

There are many options for how to dampen micro vibrations for audio, mainly for DACs where there is a clock, for example, telescope anti-vibration pads , there are many options for little money without snake oil and feng shui appearance,
 but for any anti-vibration stands , pads  to work fine  need a stone base and heavy put weight on the equipment from above. Stone slabs from kitchen countertops can be obtained free of charge at any workshop where countertops are made. For little money they will cut the right size, and fans of DIY can order a turntable made of stone. In other words, I wrote about it


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> Initial thoughts on usage or application of signal ground filtering.  It is real and does effect what is heard.  Most of what I read from Entreq users and DIY grounding box users (most also own Entreq products) is what I am also experiencing to an extent.  So far what I have tried is super simple and will experiment because I am liking what this is doing.
> 
> *What I did:* Using one meter of 12ga OCC (multi gauge totaling 12ga) copper wire. Wire terminated with Furutech solderless RCA CF-201 (R) RCA connector that is plugged into open RCA output jack of DAC.  Other end of wire stripped 6" and stuck into a 7.5lb. (3.4kg) bag of magnetite.  I also stuck a piece of stainless steel into the bag but that is barely audible, so assume it does nothing.  Furutech Nano Liquid when terminating the wire to RCA connector.
> 
> ...


Thanks . it fast DIY project . 
In my opinion, it is better to make a grounding box of copper inside , it will work as a screen and have more contact with the backfill and make the maximum amount of ground wire inside the Magnetite.
Other :
I would connect artificial grounding not from the source side, but from the consumer side, this will give a greater effect and benefit, since connecting from the source side, the connections between the DAC and the consumer work like an antenna and it is always recommended to dampen the external influence as close as possible to the amplifier board, preferably in it .


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Awesome! Mine comes on Friday...


The one you are getting has Tourmaline in it, says it in the listing.  I have done some experimenting since yesterday and ordered a lot of parts and materials to experiment with.  After many hours of reading it seems from user comments that this type of passive grounding works best with signal grounds.   I also tried duplicating Entreq's Mini Infinity cable wraps, and it works also.  Was another pleasant revelation.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Thanks . it fast DIY project .
> In my opinion, it is better to make a grounding box of copper inside , it will work as a screen and have more contact with the backfill and make the maximum amount of ground wire inside the Magnetite.
> Other :
> I would connect artificial grounding not from the source side, but from the consumer side, this will give a greater effect and benefit, since connecting from the source side, the connections between the DAC and the consumer work like an antenna and it is always recommended to dampen the external influence as close as possible to the amplifier board, preferably in it .


I have ordered a lot of parts including wooden boxes, copper plates, copper lining, copper binding posts, 14 ga. silver wire, more Magnetite, many other wildly used filler material like tungsten, tourmaline, Shungite, Rochelle salt, etc.  All to experiment with.  What I am hearing is not subtle, actually almost shocking improvement.  Just the addition of the jimmy rigged version to DAC and a small wrap around headphone cable super charged the DAC's performance.   For now this will be my new hobby experiment because it works so good.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 29, 2022)

My grounding box came in yesterday, with extra extended cable that has banana plugs on both sides and detachable alligator clamp.

I'm experiencing a totally holographic sound, natural timbre / acoustics, earth-deep freq. response with organic richness oozing all over the place!
Though to be fair I am NOT yet sure how much of this sonic goodness is actually coming from the grounding box, because my current system was already sounding downright glorious with the advent of multiple upgrades recently, including but not limited to getthe the HEDD Audio HEDDphone, thin sorbothane sheets as damping-feet under my amp, upsampling on the DDC / DAC, multiple iFi DC blockers and iFi GND Defender AC iPurifier placed in various areas.

So far I didn't hear any difference with the grounding box on my (current SS integrated) amp, but I think I heard a difference when connecting it to the grounding input of my iFi AC iPurifier which is connected to my central power conditioner. There may have been an increase in soundstage depth and sense of realism, but further testing will be required to be sure.

Would anyone know if it's safe / recommended to connect a grounding box to either the red or black speaker output of a speaker amp?
And what about shaking? My box doesn't seem to be open-able, so maybe it could benefit from shaking and mixing around a little, The mixture likely shifted in transit. Just trying to make the best out of it, but certainly no complaints.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> My grounding box came in yesterday, with extra extended cable that has banana plugs on both sides and detachable alligator clamp.
> 
> I'm experiencing a totally holographic sound, natural timbre / acoustics, earth-deep freq. response with organic richness oozing all over the place!
> Though to be fair I am NOT yet sure how much of this sonic goodness is actually coming from the grounding box, because my current system was already sounding downright glorious with the advent of multiple upgrades recently, including but not limited to thin sorbothane sheets as damping-feet under my amp, upsampling on the DDC / DAC, multiple iFi DC blockers and iFi GND Defender AC iPurifier placed in various areas.
> ...


I've seen some posts of the box attatched to the ground of speaker, but I'm no expert!


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> My grounding box came in yesterday, with extra extended cable that has banana plugs on both sides and detachable alligator clamp.
> 
> I'm experiencing a totally holographic sound, natural timbre / acoustics, earth-deep freq. response with organic richness oozing all over the place!
> Though to be fair I am NOT yet sure how much of this sonic goodness is actually coming from the grounding box, because my current system was already sounding downright glorious with the advent of multiple upgrades recently, including but not limited to getthe the HEDD Audio HEDDphone, thin sorbothane sheets as damping-feet under my amp, upsampling on the DDC / DAC, multiple iFi DC blockers and iFi GND Defender AC iPurifier placed in various areas.
> ...


Based on everything I have read the negative speaker terminal at the amp.  Issue is you would need one per channel.

You should be able to "hear" a difference with the box installed vs not installed to your system.  Was really obvious in my system.  From what I read installing at source, DAC then amp should yield best results.  Can be used on a negative or ground of a power strip or power source.  Supposedly (have not tried yet) best performance from using at signal vs power ground.


----------



## DecentLevi

Yup, I think I may have heard a difference with the grounding box at the source, versus perhaps nothing directly to my amp. I speculate that my existing power regeneration / grounding hacks are already doing so much heavy lifting (EG huge Furman power conditioner, iFi AC iPurifier, iFi GND Defender and iFi DC Blockers) that it may be a stretch to expect any further improvements from external grounding at this point. But definitely, when I get back home I'm looking forward to furthering this experiment. And everything definitely does seem to sound better, however it may just be variations in my hearing or the environment, so will have to do more testing. Will also try connecting the banana plug directly to the ground of several AC sockets in my system; maybe that's the same though as my current setup of connecting it to the iFi AC iPurifier's ground port.


----------



## pashkaam

Making a power cable like this guy, but filling in what goes into the ground box will make a cable for $ 1 million


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> Making a power cable like this guy, but filling in what goes into the ground box will make a cable for $ 1 million



There is a guy online that makes such a cable using crystals and sells them online starting at $1K.  He uses the Nordost clone Aliexpress bulk wire (Valhalla and Odin) and clone Furutech connectors.  I have seen his videos in the past explaining what he is doing.  What he does not tell you is his crystal mix.  The cable also will be super heavy.


----------



## DecentLevi (Nov 30, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> My grounding box came in yesterday, with extra extended cable that has banana plugs on both sides and detachable alligator clamp.
> 
> I'm experiencing a totally holographic sound, natural timbre / acoustics, earth-deep freq. response with organic richness oozing all over the place!
> Though to be fair I am NOT yet sure how much of this sonic goodness is actually coming from the grounding box, because my current system was already sounding downright glorious with the advent of multiple upgrades recently, including but not limited to getthe the HEDD Audio HEDDphone, thin sorbothane sheets as damping-feet under my amp, upsampling on the DDC / DAC, multiple iFi DC blockers and iFi GND Defender AC iPurifier placed in various areas.
> ...


ABSOLUTELY NO QUESTION THIS IS A MAGIC BOX!!!!!!! What just happened between moving this from my amp and power conditioner to the DDC (Audio-GD DI20)? The heavens are shining on me, that's what! Jawdropping experience. Treble is even more extended but in a natural way. Soundstage further envelops your auditory senses into the universe. It's too late to speak straight. Somebody let me sleep tonight because I can't get over what this thing is doing... take my above post at how I've already essentially reached a plateau of excellence - that's when this was not really doing anything but now my system further improves. Hard to fathom.

YMMV but try these on all your components, some need grounding more than others.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> ABSOLUTELY NO QUESTION THIS IS A MAGIC BOX!!!!!!! What just happened between moving this from my amp and power conditioner to the DDC (Audio-GD DI20)? The heavens are shining on me, that's what! Jawdropping experience. Treble is even more extended but in a natural way. Soundstage further envelops your auditory senses into the universe. It's too late to speak straight. Somebody let me sleep tonight because I can't get over what this thing is doing... take my above post at how I've already essentially reached a plateau of excellence - that's when this was not really doing anything but now my system further improves. Hard to fathom.
> 
> YMMV but try these on all your components, some need grounding more than others.


Awesome!


----------



## pashkaam

cdacosta said:


> There is a guy online that makes such a cable using crystals and sells them online starting at $1K.  He uses the Nordost clone Aliexpress bulk wire (Valhalla and Odin) and clone Furutech connectors.  I have seen his videos in the past explaining what he is doing.  What he does not tell you is his crystal mix.  The cable also will be super heavy.


It would be great if there was a link to the video. My tribute.
 I'm a little behind on the purchases and upgrades of you all, but I can tell you how my system sounds today is hard to fault.
But I have already begun to notice some touches in the music as well as in the stage that can be done better.
I believe I will be in accurate realistic 3D instrument placement in full presence and feel with natural presentation  sounding instruments.


It's not a secret but all of our music is electricity from our outlets, and the simpler the system, the more impact the upgrades have and you can achieve a super cosmic sound.


----------



## pashkaam (Nov 30, 2022)

Who has external power supply for DAC. From my experience, the best is any silver stranded cable.
It turned out that the purchased Chinese power supply had a DC silver cable.
I have tried many options but DC cable has a huge impact on sound and stage.
This one the best . It can be the same cover on top but inside regular silver wire , I tested on many genres of music .
Odin gold DC DIY is good but many mid bass on classic same moments , Odin 2 IC cable made DC cable sounding  less body . DC copper loss a lot of details , not clear bass like horn without vibration .


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> ABSOLUTELY NO QUESTION THIS IS A MAGIC BOX!!!!!!! What just happened between moving this from my amp and power conditioner to the DDC (Audio-GD DI20)? The heavens are shining on me, that's what! Jawdropping experience. Treble is even more extended but in a natural way. Soundstage further envelops your auditory senses into the universe. It's too late to speak straight. Somebody let me sleep tonight because I can't get over what this thing is doing... take my above post at how I've already essentially reached a plateau of excellence - that's when this was not really doing anything but now my system further improves. Hard to fathom.
> 
> YMMV but try these on all your components, some need grounding more than others.


Give it a few days to settle in.  2 days in and it improved even more vs the first 10 hours or so.  Since this is a Aliexpress thread I have not posted what I have found so far with this signal grounding scheme.  I plan to do a lot of experimenting in the next few weeks to attempt to improve or maximize performance with these grounding boxes.  I plan and have ordered parts/materials to build 4 units.  I can post my findings if members would like that?

Here is two things I found that may help you:
1) Sensitive to micro vibrations, will effect performance.  Try different decoupling schemes like footers and do not place on any surface that vibrates.
2) Sensitive to the mechanical connection.  If you have Furutech Nano Liquid, use it at both ends, component, cable and box.
In both cases above you should be able to hear an immediate difference.


----------



## cdacosta

pashkaam said:


> It would be great if there was a link to the video. My tribute.
> I'm a little behind on the purchases and upgrades of you all, but I can tell you how my system sounds today is hard to fault.
> But I have already begun to notice some touches in the music as well as in the stage that can be done better.
> I believe I will be in accurate realistic 3D instrument placement in full presence and feel with natural presentation  sounding instruments.
> ...


I found the guy by accident on YouTube about a year ago, he has a several videos.  Try searching “Furutech clone review” or similar.  I did not save the link.


----------



## Exocer

DecentLevi said:


> ABSOLUTELY NO QUESTION THIS IS A MAGIC BOX!!!!!!! What just happened between moving this from my amp and power conditioner to the DDC (Audio-GD DI20)? The heavens are shining on me, that's what! Jawdropping experience. Treble is even more extended but in a natural way. Soundstage further envelops your auditory senses into the universe. It's too late to speak straight. Somebody let me sleep tonight because I can't get over what this thing is doing... take my above post at how I've already essentially reached a plateau of excellence - that's when this was not really doing anything but now my system further improves. Hard to fathom.
> 
> YMMV but try these on all your components, some need grounding more than others.


Very exciting report. Can you confirm how you have this connected to your ddc?


----------



## DecentLevi

just with an alligator clamp on the outside of one of the unused SPDIF sockets. A makeshift way for now, there are better connections. And the clamping force is so extremely tight I'm hoping it doesn't bend the socket. Actually after further testing showed me it's also adding a bit of extra brightness. Probably more true to the recording though, and my setup is still in flux.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> just with an alligator clamp on the outside of one of the unused SPDIF sockets. A makeshift way for now, there are better connections. And the clamping force is so extremely tight I'm hoping it doesn't bend the socket. Actually after further testing showed me it's also adding a bit of extra brightness. Probably more true to the recording though, and my setup is still in flux.


As illogical as it may seem, the mechanical contacts of the wire and wire make a big difference as to how well your signal grounding device will perform.  I have read this and my testing have proven this to be true.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Absolutely hilarious.  Placed 3 IsoAcoustics mini pucks under the plastic tupperware container the Magnetite is sitting in and bass got tighter and hits harder. LOL
> 
> Best part is it all sounds even better now compared to an hour ago.  Now is more 3D to soundstage and is obvious noise floor has been lowered even more.  Also a bit more separation with everything heard.  Was watching an episode of Punisher on Disney+ and is very obvious, including the 140 BPM Acid Trance I am listening to now.   LOL very cool.  The difference with and without this jimmy rigged signal ground is not subtle.
> 
> ...


Very innovative and cool! Looking forward to reading about your results. Have you considered using a wooden instead of plastic box? I've got a hunch it's used by the professional boxes for a specific reason or another. 

Ideally I would assume you would have multiple boxes, one for each device that you want it for. And for the results, I would especially be interested in hearing if certain materials affect the sound signature in certain ways; so if my system is too bright, said material will make it darker. I will also try vibration absorption feet under my grounding box later.


----------



## szore

My grounding box is coming Friday and I feel like I'm expecting a baby...can't wait for this freeking thing!


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Found this a while ago . but check in Subtitles / CC …


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Very innovative and cool! Looking forward to reading about your results. Have you considered using a wooden instead of plastic box? I've got a hunch it's used by the professional boxes for a specific reason or another.
> 
> Ideally I would assume you would have multiple boxes, one for each device that you want it for. And for the results, I would especially be interested in hearing if certain materials affect the sound signature in certain ways; so if my system is too bright, said material will make it darker. I will also try vibration absorption feet under my grounding box later.


Yes, ordered 4 wooden boxes, plan to dye them black. Moved from the Tupperware to cigar box.  Yes this helps a little.  Internal material will be arriving as time goes by. Got 1lb of Tourmaline pebbles today.  Will try them in a bit, just got home.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Found this a while ago . but check in Subtitles / CC …



I saw the video but skipped it because was in Spanish.  I forgot about subtitles!  Will check it out.


----------



## cdacosta

Adding 1/4lb of black Tourmaline pebbles immediately warmed the system up a notch. Will have to let it settle to see if it changes. Will try adding and removing and see what happens.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> My grounding box is coming Friday and I feel like I'm expecting a baby...can't wait for this freeking thing!


LMAO.  Seriously though, the jimmy rigged test I am doing so far absolutely unleashed my older Proceed DAP R2R NOS DAC I am using.  System sounds mind blowing.  That is why I decided to devote time and money into this project.   As good as my system sounded before, it leaped frogged forward just by what I did.


----------



## cdacosta

Ok the Tourmaline... 1/4lb. or so is too much mixed with 7.5lbs of Magnetite.  Presentation becomes warmer but instead of what feels like a wide open sound stage it becomes smaller and system feels too thick instead of quick and agile.  There is some loss of resolution also.  I am adding and removing the Tourmaline as I listen and I can hear the changes real time.  Amazing.

Lets see if I can find a happy medium.  On purpose when purchasing the Tourmaline I wanted a different size so I can differentiate the material for tuning.   

By the way during researching ground boxes and Entreq.  I read Entreq used Magnetite as the main ingredient in their Telles line boxes.  I can see why now.


----------



## Geoduck

I've Entreq boxes in my system and will say they make a major improvement. The cables used are critical to better sound but expensive. I wish there were Chinese cables that could match Entreq cables. 
The small Chinese boxes are interesting. I'm Impressed with the home made mixtures. You guys are awesome.


----------



## cdacosta

One more update regarding Tourmaline mixed in with Magnetite.  As mentioned I am listening while adding and removing the Tourmaline and can hear real time any changes.  As I removed the Tourmaline until about 1/10th of a pound the magic came back, I have now only 7-8 of those small chips of Tourmaline in the mix and it adds a tad of warmth but does not take away what the Magnetite offered.  I am still really surprised that just connecting to a output signal ground with a 12ga. copper wire 1 meter in length I can hear such minor changes.


----------



## cdacosta

LOL I am listening to fast EDM while experimenting with Tourmaline mixed with Magnetite.  With only the 7-8 small chips/stones warms the presentation a bit but the bass and sub bass hit harder and is fuller.  Remove two small stones (now there is about 5 or 6 left in the mix) and the bass is less full and does not hit as hard or deep.  As soon as I dropped the two stones I removed back in I feel and hear the bass increase.  This is cool because the end mix can be tuned but feels freaky.  Included pic showing the size of the Tourmaline I am using.


----------



## Geoduck

You hear changes real time. When you adjust the mixture is the box still connected? How much time between tests? Please don't misunderstand my asking I believe your experiences. 
Entreq boxes take time to affect sound quality 24 hours or more when first applied. If a cable is changed quickly the effect may take a few hours to return 100%.


----------



## cdacosta

Geoduck said:


> You hear changes real time. When you adjust the mixture is the box still connected? How much time between tests? Please don't misunderstand my asking I believe your experiences.
> Entreq boxes take time to affect sound quality 24 hours or more when first applied. If a cable is changed quickly the effect may take a few hours to return 100%.


Test with the Tourmaline mixing is done live with the box connected to the negative signal SE output of DAC, while I am listening to headphones.  The box has been connected continuously for 3 days now to the DAC.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Found this a while ago . but check in Subtitles / CC …



I watched the video.   I observed and realized a few things:

1) When during the comparisons I heard differences when the box(s) were hooked up and not.  I noticed they were mainly attaching to chassis and AC ground.  The differences I heard is about 1/10th of the performance gain I get.  Meaning the performance gain I get is 10 times (just off the DAC) what I heard during the demonstration.  This tells me "likely" either their overall grounding is way better than my setup and or by them attaching to AC ground vs signal ground the way they are connecting the box is not optimal.  As I understand it, this type of passive grounding is designed for and best suited to be used with signal ground.  Also possible the plethora of minerals and stones they were using is not as optimal as what Entreq found, which is the Magnetite.  I can test the AC theory soon enough.

2) Resistance from connection to the interior of grounding material plays a large role with performance and can be easily heard.  Two things in that video would or should lower performance, 1) the connector they used had a lot of metal, it was huge.  If a contact enhancer like the Nano Liquid made the difference it did for me... I will test this theory when I build the boxes.   I have read multiple times that bypassing a binding post gave them improved performance. The listing on the box szore is getting also stated that by connecting binding post vs directly to copper shielding (which connects to the internal grounding material) decreases performance to 30%.  2) I read from many users of passive grounding boxes they feel to keep resistance down, use a 2 meter max length cable.  IIRC Entreq also recommends this.  It makes sense but I likely will not test this theory.

When I build the boxes I will set them up to offer both, a direct connection and a copper binding post that have minimal metal to minimize resistance.  This will allow me to test the theory.  At this early juncture I am guessing since the Magnetite is so magnetic that it offers the least resistance to the stray current or static electricity it is drawing from the signal ground.  But this is a guess based on how connectivity and wire make a difference to performance.  So we will see.  Thanks for the video.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I watched the video.   I observed and realized a few things:
> 
> 1) When during the comparisons I heard differences when the box(s) were hooked up and not.  I noticed they were mainly attaching to chassis and AC ground.  The differences I heard is about 1/10th of the performance gain I get.  Meaning the performance gain I get is 10 times (just off the DAC) what I heard during the demonstration.  This tells me "likely" either their overall grounding is way better than my setup and or by them attaching to AC ground vs signal ground the way they are connecting the box is not optimal.  As I understand it, this type of passive grounding is designed for and best suited to be used with signal ground.  Also possible the plethora of minerals and stones they were using is not as optimal as what Entreq found, which is the Magnetite.  I can test the AC theory soon enough.
> 
> ...


My pleasure

Yes, I think “signal ground” is the best way to use these boxes, though using the box on a balanced transformer grounding post should be not subtle as well (As far as I learned / what been reported )
Also as far as I know , solid silver/ silver plated wire would be an improvement over Cu...

Awesome! I Thanks a lot for the update on this !


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Pure silver powder ...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Pure silver powder ...


Any guesses on the secret ingredient?

I'm gonna say rhino horn powder.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

The Entreq Tellus passive ground system stripped naked

https://www.monoandstereo.com/2015/12/entreq-tellus-passive-ground-system.html


----------



## Geoduck

CDAcosta, I think you may be correct about importance of the binding post box connector. The Entreq wood clamp makes a huge difference in my system and I have no clue why that could be. 
Connecting to signal grounds works best in my gear. Also separating digital and analog grounds each to their own box or boxes. Having an individual box connected to each equipment may be best but is not absolutely necessary.
I'm intrigued now with all your guys information am thinking of attempting a DIY build of my own.

I'm particularly curious what cables work best for you all. Silver seems to be the best in my situation and DIY not nearly as good as Entreq branded ones. The cables are important and I don't have any suggestions why or how. I have mostly high end Entreq cables and one non Entreq 16 gage pure silver cable that is clearly not as good sounding as the high end Entreq ones. 

For those who may be reading about the boxes with skepticism I don't blame you. A close friend told me about Entreq. I tried very hard not to roll my eyes. Once he got them in his system I was shocked how good they sounded. The boxes are darn expensive and cables are ridiculous even on the used market how I got mine. Hard to find used. I am not suggesting everyone should buy Entreq. They are so expensive. If we could even get 50% from a DIY box it would be very worthwhile.


----------



## Geoduck

Thank you CripKeeper. 
I am a member of that forum but never noticed those pictures.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Geoduck said:


> CDAcosta, I think you may be correct about importance of the binding post box connector. The Entreq wood clamp makes a huge difference in my system and I have no clue why that could be.
> Connecting to signal grounds works best in my gear. Also separating digital and analog grounds each to their own box or boxes. Having an individual box connected to each equipment may be best but is not absolutely necessary.
> I'm intrigued now with all your guys information am thinking of attempting a DIY build of my own.
> 
> ...


Have  you tried Audio Sensibility  grounding cables with  your  box ?

https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...-Grounding-Cable/p/56176325/category=14422116


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Entreq Tellus passive ground system stripped naked
> 
> https://www.monoandstereo.com/2015/12/entreq-tellus-passive-ground-system.html


That looks like magnetite or tourmaline to my internet geologist eyes.  

Will be interesting which mixture works best from cdacosta's mad scientist lab.  

And where to source the rhino horn?


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> That looks like magnetite or tourmaline to my internet geologist eyes.
> 
> Will be interesting which mixture works best from cdacosta's mad scientist lab.
> 
> And where to source the rhino horn?


I  would like to buy one of his boxes! @cdacosta would you makes boxes and sell them?


----------



## dougms3

Some new toys came in today.  

Listening to the rcas now, without burn in, its already sounding more 3 dimensional, more resolving with less noise than the silver odin 2 rcas it replaced.  Its sounding absolutely crystal clear, like mountain water before it touches dirt.  

It has silver plated shielded braid vs the unshielded odin2, I think this is making a big difference in my system because I have many wires in close proximity to each other.  The rca connectors are said to be made of ebony sandalwood, I cannot verify if it is that but its definitely some kind of hardwood by the way it sounds when I clink a piece of gabon ebony wood against it.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2rsSpl4&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2rsSpl4&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Some new toys came in today.
> 
> Listening to the rcas now, without burn in, its already sounding more 3 dimensional, more resolving with less noise than the silver odin 2 rcas it replaced.  Its sounding absolutely crystal clear, like mountain water before it touches dirt.
> 
> ...


Nice...  Yep,  solid  silver will better  silver plated Odin ...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Nice...  Yep,  solid  silver will better  silver plated Odin ...


Jeez, I just noticed they jacked up the prices on both those items.

I bought it during the 11.11 sale, it was $30 for 1M dc cable and $70 for 1.5M RCAs.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Pure silver powder ...


I have seen this listing concoction.


dougms3 said:


> That looks like magnetite or tourmaline to my internet geologist eyes.
> 
> Will be interesting which mixture works best from cdacosta's mad scientist lab.
> 
> And where to source the rhino horn?


I think it is Magnetite.  A box or 7lb. or more of Tourmaline I have a feeling I will not like the result.  I am getting 15lb. more of the Magnetite and Rochelle Salt tomorrow.  Will have a lot more of everything Monday.


----------



## pashkaam

Crypt Keeper said:


> Have  you tried Audio Sensibility  grounding cables with  your  box ?
> 
> https://audiosensibility.com/blog/p...-Grounding-Cable/p/56176325/category=14422116


Have you looked at the price of a grounding cable? This is beyond impudence, as in other things for many other audio products.
Buy Chinese silver wire and you will be happy.


----------



## DecentLevi

Bingo - perfect size grounding box!


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 2, 2022)

Would there be any merit of shielding the wire leading to my grounding box? I have a thick cable that's silver plated that came with my grounding box from Aliexpress. I wonder which material would sound darker or best?

I don't want to order all the way from China but on Amazon I saw they have tinned copper, stainless steel and copper.





I'm gonna have to make it very loosely fitting though to get around the banana plug ends, and for easy removal. Not sure if being very loose would hurt performance.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I  would like to buy one of his boxes! @cdacosta would you makes boxes and sell them?


If this was 15 years ago probably... LOL

A lot of experimenting to do to try and optimize and see how the different "most popular" minerals and metals effect performance.  I say with just high grade Magnetite, no binding post, no shielding of any kind, using good wire treated with Nano Liquid at signal ground works stunning. A little bit of Tourmaline added increases body and lower register slam.  More Tourmaline than that and the magic starts to fade.  The more Tourmaline after a certain amount makes it sound worse.

I have so many questions that only first hand experimenting will answer.   So we will see where this goes.  What will blow my mind is if by adding more say 3.5kg+ boxes to the system keeps magnifying what I have experienced so far.  That definitely will blow my mind and get me seriously looking for ways to improve further.

What I am 100% sure of so far is the lower the resistance from the signal ground of a component to box material, the better this type of ground filtering works.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

pashkaam said:


> Have you looked at the price of a grounding cable? This is beyond impudence, as in other things for many other audio products.
> Buy Chinese silver wire and you will be happy.


The top grounding Entreq cable is around $1,600   You can get  almost 5  top AS cables instead


----------



## cdacosta

I just got a PM regarding grounding boxes.  Since there seems to be enough interest what I will do is post what I am doing and make public if I find something that I test to create specific repeatable results.  I will also post pics and material list and where to get them.  To keep the Aliexpress theme, will also buy/use parts from Aliexpress to keep costs down.  In the past I just try to buy the best performance, with money being a consideration but not the priority.  For this project my goal is to try to build the best iteration with trying to keep cost as low as possible.  Will also experiment with name brand high end wire and such also to see if any gains can be had and value vs cost.  I have this feeling that to "really get the most" out of this kind of ground filtering scheme almost an entire system should be treated.  So keeping cost down to a reasonable level so that just about anyone can participate would be pretty cool.  A full blown Entreq system is about $10K or so, which I find really steep.  What if an audiophile could build an array of units that give 50% or better performance for say $500 or $600 all in?  That would cool I think.

Just realize that although this type of filtering is more in the realm of creativity than science, I am not an electrical engineer.  I just have a very keen ear, have been modding and tweaking mid to high end audio for about 25 years, and will pursue this until I am truly happy with the end result.  So try what I show you with all the above in mind...


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Would there be any merit of shielding the wire leading to my grounding box? I have a thick cable that's silver plated that came with my grounding box from Aliexpress. I wonder which material would sound darker or best?
> 
> I don't want to order all the way from China but on Amazon I saw they have tinned copper, stainless steel and copper.
> 
> ...


If you are trying to tone control your system using the ground box device, try a copper wire.  Copper wire from your grounding box post to the ground of an RCA jack of your DDC.  Use the best wire on hand.  Use a rubber type grommet or rca cap/cover to secure wire to the jack and just listen and see what the pure copper vs silver plated copper does.   Not a long term solution but just to see if this tonally effects your system?  Also try running the cable you have to different unused input and output jacks on your DDC, this may give you differing results.  A floating shield will likely act as an antenna which is not optimal.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

The Entreq Box Inside:

What I don’t get is that how it’s possible to connect 3 different devices to this Entreq ? I thought we can’t do that…. I would guess it’s ok as long as you using different grounding posts…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Entreq Box Inside:
> 
> What I don’t get is that how it’s possible to connect 3 different devices to this Entreq ? I thought we can’t do that…. I would guess it’s ok as long as you using different grounding posts…


You can attach as many as you want to one box.  But can muddy or reduce performance.  I right now have the DAC and a make shift Entrec mini wrap around the headphone cable and it is also grounded to the same media/box.  The danger is mixing different ground potentials, as explained to me from an actual electrical engineer.   So "I think but am not sure" that by having seperate grounding planes inside a box would not interfere with one another.  BUT in the picture they all terminate or touch the copper plate.  By the way the cable wrap works!  But not as potent, bonus is it can be slid up and down the length of the cable to tune.


----------



## cdacosta

Ok for kicks the make shift Entreq mini wrap with ground wire on headphone cable.  Only material right now used is the Magnetite.  The wire is cheap 14ga from an old $1 Computer IEC power cable.  I just wanted to know if this concept worked. It does work.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 2, 2022)

So I tried the recommended Furutech nano liquid on both connections of my grounding box, and it actually made a difference. At first it sounded a bit bright and too technically perfect.

Next, enter the world of rubber feet on grounding boxes - a world shrouded in mystery that likely even rocket scientists could never explain, and one that frankly _shouldn't?_ exit... but it DOES! Because, you know, those unpowered boxes vibrate a lot, LOL.

Not expecting anything, I went ahead and placed extra cut-outs of a sorbothane sheet I had under my grounding box. I definitely heard a difference! Blacker background and even brighter. This was with my thinner sheet, so switched it to the thicker softer sorbothane sheet and it was different, I liked it even less somehow.

Still having more damping material laying around, I went ahead and tried the smaller Bright Star IsoNode Feet Set of 4 under it. WOW! This really seemed to hit the sweet spot! Bass is more vibrant and deeper now, everything is deeper into the scene, and that fatiguing treble is gone!!! Thinking this was as good as it gets, I went ahead with an experimental combo I had laying around from a previous amp that consists of the EXTRA LARGE Bright Star IsoNode Feet Set of 4 stacked together with 70 duro 0.125" (inch) thin damping material. This is a very large, soft dampening which did well. Now to my astonishment, things are even better now!!! Gone is the fatiguing treble I was hearing, and drums kick with the depth that has to be heard, making my current SS amp sound more analogue then ever before.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> If you are trying to tone control your system using the ground box device, try a copper wire.  Copper wire from your grounding box post to the ground of an RCA jack of your DDC.  Use the best wire on hand.  Use a rubber type grommet or rca cap/cover to secure wire to the jack and just listen and see what the pure copper vs silver plated copper does.   Not a long term solution but just to see if this tonally effects your system?  Also try running the cable you have to different unused input and output jacks on your DDC, this may give you differing results.  A floating shield will likely act as an antenna which is not optimal.


I got my cable along with my grounding box, the silver cable shown
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832861104282.html 
It's fairly thick and good, and I like the way I got it to sound now. Though I may still try shielding just for kicks. If I were to add external braided shielding like the photo above, would copper, tinned copper or stainless steel be more recommended?

I tried it briefly on all the unused connections of my DDC and settled on the one I liked the best (may have all been the same). Though I am just using an alligator clamp that's totally a totally exposed and unshielded connection, so not sure if / how to redo that. 

Along the way I noticed that my SS amp DOES benefit from a grounding box. After discovering it does have an actual grounding socket, it sounded fantastic as opposed to just clamping it on the outside of one of the RCA connections. Looks like I'll be getting a 2nd box sometime, for this and my DDC.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> So I tried the recommended Furutech nano liquid on both connections of my grounding box, and it actually made a difference. At first it sounded a bit bright and too technically perfect.
> 
> Next, enter the world of rubber feet on grounding boxes - a world shrouded in mystery that likely even rocket scientists could never explain, and one that frankly _shouldn't?_ exit... but it DOES! Because, you know, those unpowered boxes vibrate a lot, LOL.
> 
> ...


Yep, I think I mentioned these grounding boxes are sensitive to micro vibrations.  Footers will effect performance and surface they are placed on top of not to vibrate.  That gives me a thought.  To try fo.Q T-32 (should be most effective) or even T-102 at each end of the cables.


----------



## szore

Well, it's here!  Very well built, heavy as hell, packaged expertly!  I know this needs to sit for a while but out of the box I am very happy with sound; cleaner, punchier, greater dynamics, and overall more polished and smooth sound, lusher, richer. There is more 'there' there, as it were....


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Yep, I think I mentioned these grounding boxes are sensitive to micro vibrations.  Footers will effect performance and surface they are placed on top of not to vibrate.  That gives me a thought.  To try fo.Q T-32 (should be most effective) or even T-102 at each end of the cables.


Yes I think I read that. But it's sure some pseudo stuff borderlining on paranormal how an _un_powered grounding box can produce micro-vibrations. I don't doubt it though because I heard quite noticeable differences after changing the isolation feet, each time it was done.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Yes I think I read that. But it's sure some pseudo stuff borderlining on paranormal how an _un_powered grounding box can produce micro-vibrations. I don't doubt it though because I heard quite noticeable differences after changing the isolation feet, each time it was done.


I have it sitting on a carpet, does that "isolate", lol?


----------



## szore

I'm noticing too that I need more volume...I am at 11:30 on the volume pot, thats a little high....


----------



## DecentLevi

szore said:


> I have it sitting on a carpet, does that "isolate", lol?


Actually I was in the same boat! My grounding box was on the carpet the  few first days too. Immediately when moving it to a sturdy flat wooden desk (nice lower section on the floor), things started to sound different. After I settled on my preferred (70 duro sorbothane + ISO node dampening feet stacked), I heard quite an improvement over the carpet. If going this route, I'd recommend several different options to mix / match until you settle on your favorite sound.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Well, it's here! Very well built, heavy as hell, packaged expertly! I know this needs to sit for a while but out of the box I am very happy with sound; cleaner, punchier, greater dynamics, and overall more polished and smooth sound, lusher, richer. There is more 'there' there, as it were....





szore said:


> Well, it's here!  Very well built, heavy as hell, packaged expertly!  I know this needs to sit for a while but out of the box I am very happy with sound; cleaner, punchier, greater dynamics, and overall more polished and smooth sound, lusher, richer. There is more 'there' there, as it were....


How do you have the box hooked up to your system?  What component and how?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I have it sitting on a carpet, does that "isolate", lol?


I personally would keep it and cables off the carpet… static electricity


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Actually I was in the same boat! My grounding box was on the carpet the  few first days too. Immediately when moving it to a sturdy flat wooden desk (nice lower section on the floor), things started to sound different. After I settled on my preferred (70 duro sorbothane + ISO node dampening feet stacked), I heard quite an improvement over the carpet. If going this route, I'd recommend several different options to mix / match until you settle on your favorite sound.


OK, we will talk later about that!  I need time to absorb all this, this system is going through the stratosphere! It's unreal, even since I plugged in the box, the transparancy is UNREAL, and also the black background is 'pitch black'! Cymbal crashes, against this blackness are sublime... voices just emerge out of thin air in this transparent sound stage...really kinda speechless, this is beyond my wildest expectations for what this box was gonna do! Wow! Maybe it's this pure silver cable he is using going straight into the box with no plug? And the wieght...3.7KG is apparently rather heavy, I was happily surprised.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> How do you have the box hooked up to your system?  What component and how?


Just like the pic shows, into the ground on the bic500


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> OK, we will talk later about that!  I need time to absorb all this, this system is going through the stratosphere! It's unreal, even since I plugged in the box, the transparancy is UNREAL, and also the black background is 'pitch black'! Cymbal crashes, against this blackness are sublime... voices just emerge out of thin air in this transparent sound stage...really kinda speechless, this is beyond my wildest expectations for what this box was gonna do! Wow! Maybe it's this pure silver cable he is using going straight into the box with no plug? And the wieght...3.7KG is apparently rather heavy, I was happily surprised.


So as with my DAC the difference is huge. So what happens when I filter more of the system?  That is what I am going to find out!  The 4 boxes I purchased and that will arrive tomorrow are about the same overall dimensions as the one you purchased.  Like I mentioned, not subtle the difference.


----------



## Exocer

szore said:


> OK, we will talk later about that!  I need time to absorb all this, this system is going through the stratosphere! It's unreal, even since I plugged in the box, the transparancy is UNREAL, and also the black background is 'pitch black'! Cymbal crashes, against this blackness are sublime... voices just emerge out of thin air in this transparent sound stage...really kinda speechless, this is beyond my wildest expectations for what this box was gonna do! Wow! Maybe it's this pure silver cable he is using going straight into the box with no plug? And the wieght...3.7KG is apparently rather heavy, I was happily surprised.


Fantastic and very exciting. Can you confirm which box you purchased from Ali?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> So as with my DAC the difference is huge. So what happens when I filter more of the system?  That is what I am going to find out!  The 4 boxes I purchased and that will arrive tomorrow are about the same overall dimensions as the one you purchased.  Like I mentioned, not subtle the difference.


I'm thinking of getting three small boxes and hooking 1 each to the dac, amp, and EQ on my desktop and just stacking them...(i have very limited space).


----------



## szore

Exocer said:


> Fantastic and very exciting. Can you confirm which box you purchased from Ali?


2255799978657859

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2vUsSJU&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## cdacosta

Cannot remember who asked about this but here is a pic of gold plated brass RCA caps with fo.Q T-102 on the outside of the caps. Also in the pic is the solderless Furutech RCA plugs I am using for the ground box leads.


----------



## dougms3

You guys are killing me. 

I'm sure the effect of these grounding boxes is the same as the tube x 10.

Must resist the urge to give china more of my monies.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> You guys are killing me.
> 
> I'm sure the effect of these grounding boxes is the same as the tube x 10.
> 
> Must resist the urge to give china more of my monies.


Run to it! You want this..


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Just like the pic shows, into the ground on the bic500


Oh yah, LOL on my phone I did not notice the full pic.


----------



## cdacosta

Just added a 3.4kg or 7.5lb of the same Magnetite to amp.  Same one meter total length cable.  Hmmm I may have to let it settle in.  Initial impressions:
* quieter background 
* smoother and richer feeling presentation, meaning not as aggressive. 
* on DAC only there was a approx 10% volume gain vs before. On amp also that gain is now about the same as before adding to DAC. 
*. Bass slam, the power felt from bass is stronger or more authoritative.  With Sub bass more akin to a sub woofer, non-centralized. 
* 20 mins in, while I am typing this on my phone it is slightly changing and volume is creeping back up. 

I think I need to let it settle in for a day. No wood enclosure or footers until tomorrow or Monday. 

I have Aliexpress 14ga. silver plated OFC copper coming soon which I will make a cable using same connectors.


----------



## cdacosta

Ok, apparently what works like absolute magic for the DAC sounds wrong on the amp.  The bass hits so hard and tight but is not musical and closes in the sound stage.  Removed from amp and installed it to the other DAC SE output.  Volume came back and performance got another maybe 10% - 15% boost in performance.  Mainly in resolution and dynamics (micro and macro).  Still likely needs to settle in and Nano Liquid needs some time also.  Will have new materials to mess with tomorrow.  Once I get a mix I like I will try different mineral mixes for the amp before installing into a fully copper shielded wood enclosure.   I will then compare performance of a fully built unit vs the jimmy rigged versions I am using now.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Ok, apparently what works like absolute magic for the DAC sounds wrong on the amp.  The bass hits so hard and tight but is not musical and closes in the sound stage.  Removed from amp and installed it to the other DAC SE output.  Volume came back and performance got another maybe 10% - 15% boost in performance.  Mainly in resolution and dynamics (micro and macro).  Still likely needs to settle in and Nano Liquid needs some time also.  Will have new materials to mess with tomorrow.  Once I get a mix I like I will try different mineral mixes for the amp before installing into a fully copper shielded wood enclosure.   I will then compare performance of a fully built unit vs the jimmy rigged versions I am using now.


Where do you get the energy for this, LOL!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Where do you get the energy for this, LOL!


Passion for the hobby and desire to know and understand.  I do not like half *ssing anything.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 3, 2022)

I've been experimenting with these RCA caps from Amazon the last few days, from a link that was recommended earlier. I got both tin plated brass and plain brass varieties so I could experiment. This is the result after about 100 combinations of one or both or single colors on any / all sockets, on my Kenwood integrated amp I'm using at the moment. At first I tried full coverage then 50/50 mix, and I've definitely been hearing a difference. Namely the sound was brighter, tighter and deeper into the scene - hence why I had to spend hours trying dozens of combinations to even out the FR. I could hear a difference in colors and a difference on which sockets they were connected to, and combinations of caps. Some colors worked better on specific sockets than others. Also an epiphany I had was that the shown RCA dampening tubes also made a difference depending on sockets, so the key was to remove everything and start from where those sounded best.





And I've revised my favorite dampening feet for the mineral grounding box. To me the (large) Bright Star IsoNode dampening feet sound better solo without stacked to the aforementioned sorbothane sheet. The sound I'm getting is a true masterpiece. Stunningly vivid, vibrant, smooth, detailed, linear, cohesive, deep into the scene, organic, punchy and very linear.


----------



## DecentLevi

Also I wasn't able to get the banana plug to fit firmly when facing outward from the box, instead only on the angled connection like shown above. Any advice on this? I also tried screwing it both directions with it pushed in fully.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I've been experimenting with these RCA caps from Amazon the last few days, from a link that was recommended earlier. I got both tin plated brass and plain brass varieties so I could experiment. This is the result after about 100 combinations of one or both or single colors on any / all sockets, on my Kenwood integrated amp I'm using at the moment. At first I tried full coverage then 50/50 mix, and I've definitely been hearing a difference. Namely the sound was brighter, tighter and deeper into the scene - hence why I had to spend hours trying dozens of combinations to even out the FR. I could hear a difference in colors and a difference on which sockets they were connected to, and combinations of caps. Some colors worked better on specific sockets than others. Also an epiphany I had was that the shown RCA dampening tubes also made a difference depending on sockets, so the key was to remove everything and start from where those sounded best.
> 
> 
> 
> And I've revised my favorite dampening feet for the mineral grounding box. To me the (large) Bright Star IsoNode dampening feet sound better solo without stacked to the aforementioned sorbothane sheet. The sound I'm getting is a true masterpiece. Stunningly vivid, vibrant, smooth, detailed, linear, cohesive, deep into the scene, organic, punchy and very linear.


Will likely be even better if you used a RCA connector instead of the banana clip.  More surface connection to the RCA socket on your DDC.


----------



## cdacosta

Some more experimenting...

By adding to digital (BNC connection) and SE line output (RCA jack) is better than doubling up at the SE line output RCA jacks.  I need a better connection at the digital BNC out so an adapter from RCA to BNC was ordered so I can really test combo out.

Tourmaline does not mix well with the Magnetite.  Tourmaline by itself at the amp, even only 1/2lb. adds increased resolution and a tad of speed to system.

A small amount of Rochelle Salt (three large heaping table spoons) added to 7.5lb of Magnetite adds a bit of warmth and richness to the system when mixed with Magnetite.  This is at the DAC.  So Rochelle salt does not negatively interact with Magnetite.

Four empty, unfinished wood boxes about the size and design of the box szore purchased arrived.  They are $8 each shipped through Amazon.  They hold about 3.5kg of material.  I noticed wood contributes to a slightly more body or weight vs plastic or aluminum as an enclosure.

The main reason I did not just buy a pre-made box is I wanted to be able to 1) test if this type of filtering does anything, 2) test what materials effect performance and 3) be able to tune the ground boxes.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Also I wasn't able to get the banana plug to fit firmly when facing outward from the box, instead only on the angled connection like shown above. Any advice on this? I also tried screwing it both directions with it pushed in fully.


The slot/hole on the banana plug body is for bare wire, not a banana plug.  Which means at both ends you are getting minimal contact at the contact points.  If you like the way it sounds, hooked up the way it is, my suggestion and what I would do... 

*At the box: *Cut off the banana plug and carefully strip back the wire just long enough to expose the bare wire.  Treat the binding post and bare wire "lightly, meaning a very thin layer" with Nano Liquid.

*At the DDC end:* Get the Furutech solderless CF-102 (R) RCA plugs I am using.  Strip the wire back just enough to expose enough wire to ground contact of plug.  Light coat of Nano Liquid on RCA plug ground contact and exposed wire.   Furutech real plugs like this are about $200 a pair.  Aliexpress clones are $20 for the pair.  I have used the real and now the clones.  The clones look and work exactly like the real and sound good.  And the clones are $10 each and come with the allen wrenches to tighten contacts.  No tools or soldering needed.   Below is where I purchased mine.

https://www.thecableco.com/diy-cables-and-connectors/rca/cf-102-r-rca-connector-set-of-2.html

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US 

Before installing clean off the outside of the RCA jack of DDC and inside of contact area of Furutech RCA jack, basically ground connections with isopropyl rubbing alcohol.  Then apply thin layer of Nano Liquid.  After install give a day for it all to settle in.


----------



## szore

Found this interesting pic...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Found this interesting pic...


I am planning something similar.  Full copper internal shielding and copper plate.  Binding post and a direct cable connection to the copper plate.  But without the solid copper wire in the pic.  Have all the copper, waiting on the binding posts and silver plated OFC 14gs. wire.


----------



## kingoftown1

Consider this recipe as well (not mine):
https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/10031

In addition, silica gel beads (often sold for flower drying) are another material worth experimenting with.  I forget the exact reasoning, but there's an old Shunyata patent where they would surround their cables in a tube of silica beads. https://patents.google.com/patent/US6545213

Finally, the comments on the type of ground wire having a big impact are very true.  Entreq hints that one of their cables is multi-awg that totals 15awg.  Smaller gauges (physically, like 28-30) are theoretically better at filtering out RF, but I've found that you need larger gauges to help balance the sound.  Agreed that nano liquid makes a nice difference on terminations here as well.


----------



## szore

So my conductive tape came in, wrapped a few pieces around the power cable plugs on all 4 of my Odin 2s....hearing a rather significant improvement all around...greaty sizzle and clarity in the highs, more transparent mids and a tighter more impactful bass... everything sounds cleaner too...better dynamics and blacker background.

I got a 20M role of this stuff....lol 

not recommended for XLR plugs, tho? And I will try putting pieces on the fuse box? How do I do that, if anyone can advise me I'd appreciate it!


----------



## kingoftown1

@szore try wrapping it around the cable itself without taking off any adhesive backing.  Wrap it 2-3x around the cable, then try sliding it up and down the cable to change its position.  You should be able to change tonality based on where it is on the cable, similar to Stealth's tuning rings.  A lot of people on the PS Audio forum are using 3M AB7050HF for this with great results (myself included) on all different types of power cables.  I think most of mine are 1-2" away from the IEC end of the cable.


----------



## szore

kingoftown1 said:


> @szore try wrapping it around the cable itself without taking off any adhesive backing.  Wrap it 2-3x around the cable, then try sliding it up and down the cable to change its position.  You should be able to change tonality based on where it is on the cable, similar to Stealth's tuning rings.  A lot of people on the PS Audio forum are using 3M AB7050HF for this with great results (myself included) on all different types of power cables.  I think most of mine are 1-2" away from the IEC end of the cable.


Sweet! I'll check that out, thanks!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> So my conductive tape came in, wrapped a few pieces around the power cable plugs on all 4 of my Odin 2s....hearing a rather significant improvement all around...greaty sizzle and clarity in the highs, more transparent mids and a tighter more impactful bass... everything sounds cleaner too...better dynamics and blacker background.
> 
> I got a 20M role of this stuff....lol
> 
> not recommended for XLR plugs, tho? And I will try putting pieces on the fuse box? How do I do that, if anyone can advise me I'd appreciate it!





kingoftown1 said:


> @szore try wrapping it around the cable itself without taking off any adhesive backing.  Wrap it 2-3x around the cable, then try sliding it up and down the cable to change its position.  You should be able to change tonality based on where it is on the cable, similar to Stealth's tuning rings.  A lot of people on the PS Audio forum are using 3M AB7050HF for this with great results (myself included) on all different types of power cables.  I think most of mine are 1-2" away from the IEC end of the cable.


When I was experimenting with the Oyaide EMI tape, works best on and by power.  When close to signal cables or on top of gear it hurt performance.  Kingoftown1's recommendation of placing on or near cable with backing still on is good.  That is what I did, I used masking tape or blue painters tape to temporarily affix in place while listening.  Here is a few suggestions:

* On or around wall outlet plate and power conditioners.
* On or around lighting or other appliances on the same power circuit.
* Try some of the material on or around entire system, one area at a time and listen for any changes.
* Can be effective on or around digital gear and cables.
* One can over use or use too much material.  The Oyaide material is really strong, you will have to experiment.
* On breaker that powers the system.  Try on the body of the breaker.  Also breaker door panel, cut strips and temporarily affix with painters/masking tape to see if you like what you hear.  I did not like it here, only on the breaker switch body.  Was too strong here for me, overdamped the system.  Try on the body or face of other breaker switches also.
* Video monitor power and signal cables.  Remember, easy to overdamp.

Simply put, trial and error, just have to experiment to see what and where your tape can "audibly" improve sonic performance.  If the tape takes away from system performance or does nothing audibly just remove it.  Then permanently affix in place.


----------



## cdacosta

kingoftown1 said:


> Consider this recipe as well (not mine):
> https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/10031
> 
> In addition, silica gel beads (often sold for flower drying) are another material worth experimenting with.  I forget the exact reasoning, but there's an old Shunyata patent where they would surround their cables in a tube of silica beads. https://patents.google.com/patent/US6545213
> ...


Thanks.  While researching for this project I read "I think" all the threads on Audiogon on grounding boxes and did see his recipe.   I have been looking for a smaller bag/amount of Rock salt to try.  Home depot and most outlets sell 25lb and 50lb bags.  Currently staying in an apartment, storage is a thing.   Have you tried the mix in the link you provided or rock salt in a mix?


----------



## kingoftown1 (Dec 4, 2022)

Not aliexpress, so maybe off topic in that sense, but on the emi front I have to put in a recommendation for Techflex Flexo Anti-Stat.  Experimenting with using it as power cable sleeving, with a drain wire to ground with good results.

@cdacosta I did something similar to that recipe, but not exact.  I ended up grabbing a couple bags of this, which was enough for two boxes at 11.5" x 5" x 7" and two more at 5x5x7
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00C92HYWO?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details


----------



## cdacosta

kingoftown1 said:


> Not aliexpress, so maybe off topic in that sense, but on the emi front I have to put in a recommendation for Techflex Flexo Anti-Stat.  Experimenting with using it as power cable sleeving, with a drain wire to ground with good results.
> 
> @cdacosta I did something similar to that recipe, but not exact.  I ended up grabbing a couple bags of this, which was enough for two boxes at 11.5" x 5" x 7" and two more at 5x5x7
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00C92HYWO?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details


I need to go to home depot to buy some brass hardware for the boxes so will pick up this 40lb. bag of Sodium Chloride crystals, which is rock salt.  Did you notice any other minerals that did not mix well with the rock salt?

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Morton-...r-Water-Softener-Salt-Crystals-3983/100351742


----------



## cdacosta

For days I have been doing critical listening while playing around with mix of material.  I have to admit I went from total sceptic to 100% hooked to the concept of passive signal ground filtering.  I have not tried with power yet.

For serious audiophiles that already have a nice setup, especially if it is well tweaked already, this type of tweak "will" take a system to whole other level.   Catapulted my system, even jimmy rigged as it currently is.  My system sounds so good my mind really is blown.  What I am hearing is so addictive.  I love this hobby!


----------



## Exocer

cdacosta said:


> For days I have been doing critical listening while playing around with mix of material.  I have to admit I went from total sceptic to 100% hooked to the concept of passive signal ground filtering.  I have not tried with power yet.
> 
> For serious audiophiles that already have a nice setup, especially if it is well tweaked already, this type of tweak "will" take a system to whole other level.   Catapulted my system, even jimmy rigged as it currently is.  My system sounds so good my mind really is blown.  What I am hearing is so addictive.  I love this hobby!


If you had to choose one mineral as a starting point, would it be Magnetite powder or Tourmaline chips? The diy recipe you posted appears to be tourmaline based.


----------



## DecentLevi

I thought my grounding box silver cable seemed a bit naked, so luckily my shielding came in today. I ordered tinned copper and boy was this a good choice! The sound is now MUCH BETTER! Even more linear with very agreeable smooth highs that are never fatuiging. Somehow my changes mentioned yesterday (RCA caps and RCA damping cylinder) seemed to change upon power-on today, making my system unlistenably bright. But just in the nick of time, this was the PERFECT solution. Maybe even a tad too dark, but will let things settle a while. I got the 11/16th inch (0.44inch) size in case it doesn't stretch over the connectors, but for anyone going this route - rest assured these things are stretchy so only get the min. size that you need.




Before the shielding:


----------



## cdacosta

Exocer said:


> If you had to choose one mineral as a starting point, would it be Magnetite powder or Tourmaline chips? The diy recipe you posted appears to be tourmaline based.


I have not posted a recipe, I am still experimenting.  Magnetite works like a champ on my DAC.  Only on the amp am I currently using small Tourmaline stones.


----------



## Exocer

cdacosta said:


> I have not posted a recipe, I am still experimenting.  Magnetite works like a champ on my DAC.  Only on the amp am I currently using small Tourmaline stones.


Thank you.

You have encouraged me to build a grounding box. I have a spare modushop Galaxy 2u chassis from a diy linear power supply I stopped using. It is aluminum and already has Herbies Tenderfeet installed. I am thinking to go with that. In staying on-topic with the Ali Express aspect of this I am likely going to source the binding post, spade and rca connectors from there for the ground cable. I have a bit of spare Mundorf Angelique copper/silver/gold wire from other projects I am debating using but I am also eyeing solid core silver Ali conductors as well.

I have also ordered the bag of Magnetite that was suggested earlier on in the thread. Very excited for where this will go. Thanks for your and everyone else’s enthusiasm.


----------



## cdacosta

Exocer said:


> Thank you.
> 
> You have encouraged me to build a grounding box. I have a spare modushop Galaxy 2u chassis from a diy linear power supply I stopped using. It is aluminum and already has Herbies Tenderfeet installed. I am thinking to go with that. In staying on-topic with the Ali Express aspect of this I am likely going to source the binding post, spade and rca connectors from there for the ground cable. I have a bit of spare Mundorf Angelique copper/silver/gold wire from other projects I am debating using but I am also eyeing solid core silver Ali conductors as well.
> 
> I have also ordered the bag of Magnetite that was suggested earlier on in the thread. Very excited for where this will go. Thanks for your and everyone else’s enthusiasm.


So what I am going to do is run both a Copper binding post and a direct connection to the copper plate.  The results I have so far is just having 6" of the copper wire stripped stuck into the Magnetite.  I believe the binding post "will degrade" performance vs having a direct connection to the material.  The binding post obviously gives more options of swapping cables.  The Furutech solderless CF-102 RCA plugs I am using work well.  If you are planning to solder, I would recommend using a low mass (less resistance) contact connector.

I just purchased 30lbs of rock salt, so time to see what that does to the mix...


----------



## cdacosta

Note, whenever I add or subtract minerals I immediately hear a change, but it takes about 12 hours to fully know the change.  The first few hours gives you a taste of what is likely going to sound like.  The crazy thing is the changes are almost as obvious as an interconnect change. 

Adding rock salt (sodium chloride) to Magnetite adds air and upped frequency sparkle.  A little to Tourmaline is the same, too much and it shrinks soundstage and sounds odd.


----------



## cdacosta

For anyone thinking about building one of these Grounding boxes... I just mentioned the ones I am building will have a copper binding post and a direct cable connection, here is why:

* Direct cable connection for the intended component.  This will be the connection with the lowest resistance.
* Binding post for cable wraps or if I want to try the box at a different component, power conditioner, isolation transformer, etc.

Just an FYI


----------



## Shiraz

dougms3 said:


> Some new toys came in today.
> 
> Listening to the rcas now, without burn in, its already sounding more 3 dimensional, more resolving with less noise than the silver odin 2 rcas it replaced.  Its sounding absolutely crystal clear, like mountain water before it touches dirt.
> 
> ...


@dougms3 I am sorted for RCAs but considering a DC cable upgrade. Do you attribute the improvement you mention here to one over the other? I'm currently using the stock cable that came with my AE LPS. Thanks in advance.


----------



## szore (Dec 5, 2022)

So I wrapped up my cords with the tape, put it on the fuse box, and over the wall outlet...even the wall wart for the Lokius and the usb cable...and it is sublime improvement...inky black background, utter smoothness and clarity. Bass has increased slam and more subtle layering...soundstage is infinite...Not hearing that congestion in the mids anymore...need to digest this...


----------



## dougms3

Shiraz said:


> @dougms3 I am sorted for RCAs but considering a DC cable upgrade. Do you attribute the improvement you mention here to one over the other? I'm currently using the stock cable that came with my AE LPS. Thanks in advance.


Both cables made noticeable improvements but I think that the DC cable made a bigger impact because its so far at the beginning of the chain.

The rca I have connected as a preamp from my audio-gd master19 to the loxjie p20 amp.  

So if listening directly from my master19, its only the sound of the dc cable upgrade and it made a noticeable difference over the stock dc cable.

Definitely worth it.


----------



## msing539

Regarding AE tracking... 

I ordered a 110 ohm Odin AES cable on November 3 with scheduled delivery December 3. 
By November 14, it showed in US Customs so I waited for 2 weeks and nothing.

Contacted USPS and they said it was still in China and when I asked how they knew, they said they ran it through 17track.net
Contacted the AE Store with that info and the next day, it showed it was loaded on a plane from China to the US. 
Now it's Out for Delivery on USPS.

So is the AE Tracking just to appease us?


----------



## dougms3

msing539 said:


> Regarding AE tracking...
> 
> I ordered a 110 ohm Odin AES cable on November 3 with scheduled delivery December 3.
> By November 14, it showed in US Customs so I waited for 2 weeks and nothing.
> ...


The AE tracking is just accurate in china up until it says left from departed country.

Sometimes it will say out for delivery once it leaves china, which is sometimes a couple days to weeks out from arriving in the US.


----------



## msing539

dougms3 said:


> The AE tracking is just accurate in china up until it says left from departed country.
> 
> Sometimes it will say out for delivery once it leaves china, which is sometimes a couple days to weeks out from arriving in the US.


Yes, but this one said left from Departure and arrived in US Customs when it hadn't left China. LIES!


----------



## kr0gg




----------



## kr0gg

I'm the richest guy in the trolleybus right now, for sure


----------



## kr0gg

dougms3 said:


> The AE tracking is just accurate in china up until it says left from departed country.
> 
> Sometimes it will say out for delivery once it leaves china, which is sometimes a couple days to weeks out from arriving in the US.


finally, I've jumped into your hype train. two 2m power cords, interconnects incoming later this week.


----------



## msing539

kr0gg said:


> hype train



From the writers of Bullet Train and Producers of Soul Train comes a gripping new drama starring Woody Harrelson (Money Train) and Gong Yoo (Train to Busan)... this winter, get aboard the Hype Train.


----------



## kr0gg

wow, that's some space tech. directional power cords. if it weren't drawn, I could've used them completely wrong


----------



## kr0gg

Can't say the sound amazes me or has something superlative (for example, I have a Black Sand Violet cable which gives vocals amazing magic). But this is good stuff and I'd say that is great purchase if you don't plan to spend a lot on a  on a power cord.  This 2m one costs $40. Some cords give and take away a lot, but this one doesn't make me want to throw it away (like my VH Flavor 4 does, for example, so I use it on my Roon Rock PC because everywhere else it shrunk my soundstage like crazy). Compared to a basic cord this Odin Gold has some good instrumental separation, has some nice air, gives more depth between instruments. Emphasizes natural instruments and sounds like claps. I'm not sure if it clears junk or removes valuable information from sounds, but I hear something like that. Also, there's a feeling of sounds being reflected from the walls (which now feel further away than before, though). Takes away a liiiiitle of dynamics, but shows more sources of rhytm in the music. Will see how it goes with burn-in.


----------



## Shiraz

dougms3 said:


> Both cables made noticeable improvements but I think that the DC cable made a bigger impact because its so far at the beginning of the chain.
> 
> The rca I have connected as a preamp from my audio-gd master19 to the loxjie p20 amp.
> 
> ...


Brilliant. Order incoming! Thank you


----------



## msing539

Shiraz said:


> Brilliant. Order incoming! Thank you


@dougms3 is taking orders for these cables now?


----------



## Shiraz

msing539 said:


> @dougms3 is taking orders for these cables now?


Not @dougms3, intended for the AE marketing team who are no doubt actively tracking the health of this thread 😂.


----------



## szore

szore said:


> So I wrapped up my cords with the tape, put it on the fuse box, and over the wall outlet...even the wall wart for the Lokius and the usb cable...and it is sublime improvement...inky black background, utter smoothness and clarity. Bass has increased slam and more subtle layering...soundstage is infinite...Not hearing that congestion in the mids anymore...need to digest this...


Ended up wrapping my XLR cables too at the plugs! Sounds unreal!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Ended up wrapping my XLR cables too at the plugs! Sounds unreal!


So the tape is a pure shielding tape, with Oyaide one cannot do what you did, would suck the life out of the music.  Very cool for a few bucks it improved your system.


----------



## cdacosta

kr0gg said:


> Can't say the sound amazes me or has something superlative (for example, I have a Black Sand Violet cable which gives vocals amazing magic). But this is good stuff and I'd say that is great purchase if you don't plan to spend a lot on a  on a power cord.  This 2m one costs $40. Some cords give and take away a lot, but this one doesn't make me want to throw it away (like my VH Flavor 4 does, for example, so I use it on my Roon Rock PC because everywhere else it shrunk my soundstage like crazy). Compared to a basic cord this Odin Gold has some good instrumental separation, has some nice air, gives more depth between instruments. Emphasizes natural instruments and sounds like claps. I'm not sure if it clears junk or removes valuable information from sounds, but I hear something like that. Also, there's a feeling of sounds being reflected from the walls (which now feel further away than before, though). Takes away a liiiiitle of dynamics, but shows more sources of rhytm in the music. Will see how it goes with burn-in.


I found for the money they are great cables... after burn-in.  After burn-in your system will sound different, at least mine did.


----------



## DecentLevi

Is this a recomm


szore said:


> So I wrapped up my cords with the tape, put it on the fuse box, and over the wall outlet...even the wall wart for the Lokius and the usb cable...and it is sublime improvement...inky black background, utter smoothness and clarity. Bass has increased slam and more subtle layering...soundstage is infinite...Not hearing that congestion in the mids anymore...need to digest this...


Is *this* tape 'on the reel'? They're havin' a deal.


----------



## cdacosta

Grounding boxes, what I know so far... and still waiting on a lot of parts from Aliexpress to arrive to experiment with...

* They work, and work really well if implemented properly.  The concept works as advertised, signal is so much purer.  I hear way more information than before.  Resolution, improved decay, amount of harmonic information is stunning, vocal clarity,  can go on and on, literally transformed my already great sounding system.
* Sensitive to vibration, wood enclosures work better than aluminum or plastic or rubberish type of enclosure.  Have not tried a copper enclosure.
* The connection at both ends matter a lot.  Will be testing wire differences soon.
* Mixing different Para, Dia and Ferro magnetic metals and minerals do effect what can be heard.  Problem is I am finding that there is no "one" best mix so far.  Magnetite by itself so far seems the safest for performance while not changing tone of system.  But if performance is to be pushed additional trial and error mixing is required.  And my amp prefers Tourmaline instead of Magnetite.  DAC and PC shine with Magnetite as the base material.  The neat part is I can listen while tuning, so each component can be optimized.
* Even though adding or subtracting minerals can be heard real time, takes 2-3 hours to get a realistic idea what I did is going to more likely sound like.  12+ hours for system to really show what I did.  Even 24 hours later there are still slight changes.  This is real time, not signal through system time like cable break-in.  Tonal system tuning is possible, meaning tilting system warmer or closer to neutrality.
* Entreq's sizing or material weight vs size of component being filtered seems correct.  They say a guide is the component be no more than 5x the filtering material weight.  I am paraphrasing here, but this is what they are trying to convey.


----------



## szore

I even wrapped the grounding post on the power conditioner....


----------



## szore (Dec 6, 2022)

Listening to Bach organ concertos...the clarity and resolution on my system is unreal...it reminds me of the electrostatic sets I heard at Canjam, that unreal level of transparency... this forum has been the best audiophile experience of my life! Thanks guys for all the great suggestions! I honestly feel sorry for people that don't know about this forum....especially all those suckers spending all their money on cables, SMH...

also I got like 18 meters of this tape left if anyone wants to try it, I only paid $10 for it...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Listening to Bach organ concertos...the clarity and resolution on my system is unreal...it reminds me of the electrostatic sets I heard at Canjam, that unreal level of transparency... this forum has been the best audiophile experience of my life! Thanks guys for all the great suggestions! I honestly feel sorry for people that don't know about this forum....especially all those suckers spending all their money on cables, SMH...
> 
> also I got like 18 meters of this tape left if anyone wants to try it, I only paid $10 for it...


Maybe I need to revisit the tape and compare vs the oyaide tape that I have.

I remember the oyaide tape was too powerful when I used it on cables directly connected to gear.  It killed alot of noise and was very clear but it just flattened and compressed the sound.  

If you dont mind sending me some to test out, I'd like to try it out.


----------



## Stax 7

szore said:


> I even wrapped the grounding post on the power conditioner....


 
Faraday Fabric Tape​is the one being used just to be clear?


----------



## szore

Stax 7 said:


> Faraday Fabric Tape​is the one being used just to be clear?


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...26P5pNV&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

20M Conductive Tape Double-sided Conductive Anti-interference Shielding Electromagnetic Wave Radiation-Proof Silver Gray Tape​


----------



## szore (Dec 6, 2022)

I ordered the 40mm wished i ordered the 60...


----------



## Stax 7

szore said:


> I ordered the 40mm wished i ordered the 60...


Thank you


----------



## DecentLevi

I'm going with this Faraday Fabric Tape because I can get it faster locally. It sure looks the same on both sides as the Chinese one, and is 2" x 50ft which is roughly the same as 50mm x 20 meters (well, 15m). The composition seems the same too - described as "metal copper, metallic nickel" composition vs. the Aliexpress wording "Copper Nickel Plated". Looks the same as the OYAIDE MWA-010T tape but apparently quite different because that's made of Sendust Alloy Flat Metal Powder.

https://www.amazon.com/ANGKEEL-Conductive-Grounding-Interference-Electrical/dp/B097HC9HR7


----------



## szore (Dec 6, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I'm going with this Faraday Fabric Tape because I can get it faster locally. It sure looks the same on both sides as the Chinese one, and is 2" x 50ft which is roughly the same as 50mm x 20 meters (well, 15m). The composition seems the same too - described as "metal copper, metallic nickel" composition vs. the Aliexpress wording "Copper Nickel Plated". Looks the same as the OYAIDE MWA-010T tape but apparently quite different because that's made of Sendust Alloy Flat Metal Powder.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/ANGKEEL-Conductive-Grounding-Interference-Electrical/dp/B097HC9HR7


That's identical to what I have, but it doesn't give you the width options ali express version does...but watching the video, especially the part where he peals off the back, I can see it's the same stuff...


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I'm going with this Faraday Fabric Tape because I can get it faster locally. It sure looks the same on both sides as the Chinese one, and is 2" x 50ft which is roughly the same as 50mm x 20 meters (well, 15m). The composition seems the same too - described as "metal copper, metallic nickel" composition vs. the Aliexpress wording "Copper Nickel Plated". Looks the same as the OYAIDE MWA-010T tape but apparently quite different because that's made of Sendust Alloy Flat Metal Powder.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/ANGKEEL-Conductive-Grounding-Interference-Electrical/dp/B097HC9HR7


I'm gonna take a wild guess and say thats sendust tape.  

Maybe they added or changed the concentration of the base ingredients?

All I know is that if I did what szore did with the oyaide tape, it'd kill all of the bass and flatten the sound like a pancake.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> I'm gonna take a wild guess and say thats sendust tape.
> 
> Maybe they added or changed the concentration of the base ingredients?
> 
> All I know is that if I did what szore did with the oyaide tape, it'd kill all of the bass and flatten the sound like a pancake.


The bass is so rich, tho. I'm listening to a techno track and the bass is rich and abundant, and very clean and transparent, but not thin at all, the opposite. I don't even have the EQ engaged....


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> The bass is so rich, tho. I'm listening to a techno track and the bass is rich and abundant, and very clean and transparent, but not thin at all, the opposite. I don't even have the EQ engaged....


Maybe the composition is different.  Or maybe permalloy?

I tested a couple strips of the oyaide tape on the outlet wall plate and it was enough to flatten the sound.  Although it did drop the noise floor.  

I'll revisit the tape and test it out again, maybe only a tiny piece is enough to get the desired effect.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I'm gonna take a wild guess and say thats sendust tape.
> 
> Maybe they added or changed the concentration of the base ingredients?
> 
> All I know is that if I did what szore did with the oyaide tape, it'd kill all of the bass and flatten the sound like a pancake.


LOL Anywhere near signal transmission and will suck the life out of my system.


----------



## Dandoudou

I bought from Queenway a customized HDMI cable that does not perform as expected. 
I want to send it back, and get a refund, but the seller does not send me a Return label and return instructions. 
What should I do?


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> I bought from Queenway a customized HDMI cable that does not perform as expected.
> I want to send it back, and get a refund, but the seller does not send me a Return label and return instructions.
> What should I do?


When you say does not perform as expected, do you mean that you were expecting more or that it doesnt work?


----------



## Dandoudou (Dec 7, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> When you say does not perform as expected, do you mean that you were expecting more or that it doesnt work?


I asked them if they can make a customized HDMI cable to connect the DI-20HE to the Gustard R26, and that will play both PCM and DSD.
They said that they can, but the cable that I received plays only PCM, like the HDMI cables that I have already.

EDIT
They said "Please send to us", but do not reply to my requests to receive a return label and return instructions.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> I asked them if they can make a customized HDMI cable to connect the DI-20HE to the Gustard R26, and that will play both PCM and DSD.
> They said that they can, but the cable that I received plays only PCM, like the HDMI cables that I have already.
> 
> EDIT
> They said "Please send to us", but do not reply to my requests to receive a return label and return instructions.


I don't think that has anything to do with the cable.

If it plays pcm, the cable works and its a software setting.  What player are you using?


----------



## Dandoudou (Dec 7, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> I don't think that has anything to do with the cable.
> 
> If it plays pcm, the cable works and its a software setting.  What player are you using?


I use Roon, Audirvana Origin, and JRiver.
But it's not a software issue. The configurations of the pins between the DI-20HE and the R26 are not the same. That was the reason for which I ordered from them a customized cable.

By playing PCM, their cable does what my standard HDMI cables do. But it does not play DSD as it was supposed to do.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> I use Roon, Audirvana Origin, and JRiver.
> But it's not a software issue. The configurations of the pins between the DI-20HE and the R26 are not the same. That was the reason for which I ordered from them a customized cable.


The di20he has options to change the pinout in the menu but if the cable is working properly with PCM, that means that there is a configuration issue with the software.  

DSD is tricky to get working on audirvana, dont know about roon.  I'm more familiar with Jriver.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> The di20he has options to change the pinout in the menu but if the cable is working properly with PCM, that means that there is a configuration issue with the software.
> 
> DSD is tricky to get working on audirvana, dont know about roon.  I'm more familiar with Jriver.


I tried all the options of the DI-20HE. 
The problem has nothing to do with the software, because I have other DACs and they play DSD and PCM when I connect them to the DI-20HE.


----------



## jimmychan

Normally a standard HDMI cable would support both PCM and DSD. Try setting the Roon / Device Setup / DSD Playback Strategy to DSD Over PCM.


----------



## Dandoudou

jimmychan said:


> Normally a standard HDMI cable would support both PCM and DSD. Try setting the Roon / Device Setup / DSD Playback Strategy to DSD Over PCM.


I'm using a Mac, so all my players handle DSD as DoP. 
The problem is in a different I2S implementation between the two devices. The problem with the R26 is well known among DI-20HE users.


----------



## jimmychan

That's interesting, the DoP implementation only requires the PCM signal pins. That suppose if PCM works, the DSD signal will ride on PCM formats.
Try go through all the setting including in Roon and R26 to see what's missing.


----------



## Dandoudou (Dec 7, 2022)

If I understood properly the issue, the R26 needs to receive a signal by pin 15 (?) to understand that it receives a DSD sound. And the DI-20HE does not deliver such signal by pin 15.


----------



## runningwitit (Dec 7, 2022)

OFF TOPIC

Can i make a grounding cable for my ifi ac purifier with speaker wire?

I am going from ifi purifier (bare wire inserted in ifi) to rca connector amp side....

Also...does type of solder matter???

I want to mimic the cable on the left side...


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> If I understood properly the issue, the R26 needs to receive a signal by pin 15 (?) to understand that it receives a DSD sound. And the DI-20HE does not deliver such signal by pin 15.


As far as i know the pinouts on the cable have nothing to do with the ability to differentiate between pcm and dsd.  If the hdmi cable plays pcm, it will play dsd.

You may want to verify the max level dsd format the gustard dac can support.  If you try to play a higher level than it can support it won't work.

For example, if your dac is limited to dsd256 and you configure the software to play dsd512, it won't work.  And you also have to verify that it can play dsd natively, otherwise you have to use dop.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> As far as i know the pinouts on the cable have nothing to do with the ability to differentiate between pcm and dsd.  If the hdmi cable plays pcm, it will play dsd.
> 
> You may want to verify the max level dsd format the gustard dac can support.  If you try to play a higher level than it can support it won't work.
> 
> For example, if your dac is limited to dsd256 and you configure the software to play dsd512, it won't work.  And you also have to verify that it can play dsd natively, otherwise you have to use dop.


This is not at all the problem. 
The Gustard plays DSD fine, either when the sound is streamed directly to its LAN input or if the streamer is connected to its USB input. 
It does not play DSD only when the DI-20 is connected to its I2S input.


----------



## Stax 7

Dandoudou said:


> This is not at all the problem.
> The Gustard plays DSD fine, either when the sound is streamed directly to its LAN input or if the streamer is connected to its USB input.
> It does not play DSD only when the DI-20 is connected to its I2S input.


KEEP AWAY FROM QUEENWAY STORE..They stuffed up a custom HDMI cable for me ,I sent it back using my own funds and was returned three months later as they didn't want to accept it.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Stax 7 said:


> KEEP AWAY FROM QUEENWAY STORE..They stuffed up a custom HDMI cable for me ,I sent it back using my own funds and was returned three months later as they didn't want to accept it.


Ordered some really expensive gears from this store and the AV play cable  as well ... Queenaway seller/manufacturer is on my fav list. Never had a problem... I might be getting an Amp from them as well...

For the AV Play Cable, It’s the I2S definition mess… As far as I know audio-gd and Gustard pinouts will not match. Need custom pinouts.

HDMI I2S B Definition: Sonore, PS Audio, Mola Mola, M2 Tech, Aune, Holo Audio, Empirical Audio, K&K Audio, Channel Islands Audio, Musica Pristina, Stahl~Tek, Matrix, DiDiT, HiFime, X-Sabre, Soundaware, Audio-gd, Denafrips

HDMI I2S A Definition: Pink Faun, Wyred4Sound, Audiobyte, Wadia, Rockna, SMSL, LKS, Gustard, JAVS, Singxer


----------



## cdacosta

Had some parts drop from Aliexpress, still more to come.  And here is an update on grounding box...

I have read from many users that they feel the "cable" is about 50% of the performance.  As crazy as it may seem the connection, connectors used and wire does play a critical role to overall performance.  I have been playing around with many configurations and silver plated copper sounds horrible just at the DAC, have not tried it anywhere else yet.  Have tried different gauges and quality of wire.   What so far is offering the best performance is 12ga - 11ga. overall gauge size with multiple gauge diameter OFC copper.  The silver thins the body or weight of the presentation and extends HF but sounds tizzy on the top end.  Does not sound musical.  

Thinking of trying JPS Labs Alumiloy wire sheathed with cotton or Neotech, but this will easily start to push budget up.  If anyone knows of good multiple gauge wire with diameter of 12ga. or so please let me know.  If available on Aliexpress even better, I have not been able to find any.


----------



## szore (Dec 7, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Had some parts drop from Aliexpress, still more to come.  And here is an update on grounding box...
> 
> I have read from many users that they feel the "cable" is about 50% of the performance.  As crazy as it may seem the connection, connectors used and wire does play a critical role to overall performance.  I have been playing around with many configurations and silver plated copper sounds horrible just at the DAC, have not tried it anywhere else yet.  Have tried different gauges and quality of wire.   What so far is offering the best performance is 12ga - 11ga. overall gauge size with multiple gauge diameter OFC copper.  The silver thins the body or weight of the presentation and extends HF but sounds tizzy on the top end.  Does not sound musical.
> 
> Thinking of trying JPS Labs Alumiloy wire sheathed with cotton or Neotech, but this will easily start to push budget up.  If anyone knows of good multiple gauge wire with diameter of 12ga. or so please let me know.  If available on Aliexpress even better, I have not been able to find any.


My box has a silver wire and I hear clarity and transparancy...I wonder if you would hear it as thin or lacking weight?  plus I have silver fuses in DAC and power conditioner, 3 odin2silve power cables a Odin silver usb cable....lot of clarity....I'm gonna try putting the Odin gold which is between the powerconditioner and wall put it on the amp try and warm up the system a little...


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Dec 7, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Had some parts drop from Aliexpress, still more to come.  And here is an update on grounding box...
> 
> I have read from many users that they feel the "cable" is about 50% of the performance.  As crazy as it may seem the connection, connectors used and wire does play a critical role to overall performance.  I have been playing around with many configurations and silver plated copper sounds horrible just at the DAC, have not tried it anywhere else yet.  Have tried different gauges and quality of wire.   What so far is offering the best performance is 12ga - 11ga. overall gauge size with multiple gauge diameter OFC copper.  The silver thins the body or weight of the presentation and extends HF but sounds tizzy on the top end.  Does not sound musical.
> 
> Thinking of trying JPS Labs Alumiloy wire sheathed with cotton or Neotech, but this will easily start to push budget up.  If anyone knows of good multiple gauge wire with diameter of 12ga. or so please let me know.  If available on Aliexpress even better, I have not been able to find any.


Entreq wants $1,600 for their top grounding cable 




"The Statement 'Entreq-Style' Grounding Cable has an overall 6.8AWG gauge. It consists of a star-quad Teflon insulated mil-spec silver-plated copper wire foundation with one 16AWG OCC silver core. It provides _better performance_ than the second-from-the-top _Entreq Apollo _grounding cable at a fraction of the price.."


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Had some parts drop from Aliexpress, still more to come.  And here is an update on grounding box...
> 
> I have read from many users that they feel the "cable" is about 50% of the performance.  As crazy as it may seem the connection, connectors used and wire does play a critical role to overall performance.  I have been playing around with many configurations and silver plated copper sounds horrible just at the DAC, have not tried it anywhere else yet.  Have tried different gauges and quality of wire.   What so far is offering the best performance is 12ga - 11ga. overall gauge size with multiple gauge diameter OFC copper.  The silver thins the body or weight of the presentation and extends HF but sounds tizzy on the top end.  Does not sound musical.
> 
> Thinking of trying JPS Labs Alumiloy wire sheathed with cotton or Neotech, but this will easily start to push budget up.  If anyone knows of good multiple gauge wire with diameter of 12ga. or so please let me know.  If available on Aliexpress even better, I have not been able to find any.


I was looking into 7 and 9 AWG ... Item# 3256803109569888


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Entreq wants $1,600 for their top grounding cable


I know... LOL  They are smoking some really good weed!
That is why I am experimenting with different cables.  Cable (wire and connections) does make a big difference in overall performance of the unit as a whole.  I have also come up with a really good footer upgrade or option that is giving me about 95% or so the performance of IcoAcoustic Mini Pucks.  Mini Pucks are about $110 (shipped and tax) for 8 pucks.  On Amazon they sell these .75" silicon feet for $16 + tax for 16 footers and work almost as good.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I was looking into 7 and 9 AWG ... Item# 3256803109569888


Need finer strands, and PVC as a dielectric will likely cause smearing.  Unless you strip the PVC off and use loose cotton, that will help.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> My box has a silver wire and I hear clarity and transparancy...I wonder if you would hear it as thin or lacking weight?  plus I have silver fuses in DAC and power conditioner, 3 odin2silve power cables a Odin silver usb cable....lot of clarity....I'm gonna try putting the Odin gold which is between the powerconditioner and wall put it on the amp try and warm up the system a little...


Yes less weight and sounds not natural and way less musical.  This is only changing or adding the silver plated at the DAC.  Maybe will sound different on another component, we will see.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> This is not at all the problem.
> The Gustard plays DSD fine, either when the sound is streamed directly to its LAN input or if the streamer is connected to its USB input.
> It does not play DSD only when the DI-20 is connected to its I2S input.


Hmmm, may it is the cable then.

I was looking at the pinouts and it looks like theres 4 different options, it should work if its one of the 4.  

I bought this cable but now I'm thinking its queensway's second store.  It works to play pcm but dsd doesn't work.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2yHyFD0&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> I know... LOL  They are smoking some really good weed!
> That is why I am experimenting with different cables.  Cable (wire and connections) does make a big difference in overall performance of the unit as a whole.  I have also come up with a really good footer upgrade or option that is giving me about 95% or so the performance of IcoAcoustic Mini Pucks.  Mini Pucks are about $110 (shipped and tax) for 8 pucks.  On Amazon they sell these .75" silicon feet for $16 + tax for 16 footers and work almost as good.


Yes,  some really good Swedish weed  (grown with that magic Swedish magnitite)


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Need finer strands, and PVC as a dielectric will likely cause smearing.  Unless you strip the PVC off and use loose cotton, that will help.


I was about  to strip it  and use it  for the "Internal wiring"  but I would  still use these 3256801606656922 for  grounding cables.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Yes less weight and sounds not natural and way less musical.  This is only changing or adding the silver plated at the DAC.  Maybe will sound different on another component, we will see.


I put the gold power cable on my amp and silver odin on wall and there is better body and slightly more warmth to the sound....I think it balances the silver well... note sounds a tad thick but lets see what brain burn brings


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 8, 2022)

Yesterday my amp mysteriously became extremely dark (hardcore basshead) for the entire several hour listening session, then the next day restored back to the same very musical, detailed robust sound that I tuned my system for. I know it was the amp because when moving my same headphones with same source chain / same song back to the DAC's built-in amp, I got a linear sound once again. This precludes any change of my hearing, DAC, DDC, source or power chain to it. I thought it could be one of my Odin Gold AC cables towards the end of burn-in, but it seems less likely being that the only shared circuit between these and my current amp are with the one running to the central power conditioner which is already burned-in for around 500 hours, and the other going to the DDC. It may have been related to its' copper tape shielding but that doesn't explain anything how it's back to normal today and very indirectly connected.

My current amp is a Kenwood VR-406 integrated speaker/headphone amp which has a fixed 2-prong power chord (while my tube amp is out for repairs). I think either the Aliexpress RCA damping cylinders, or more likely: the 10 assorted RCA caps are responsible for such fluctuations, below. Again no issue for now being everything returned back to normal - just wondering about any opinions.





I'm actually thinking to try even more RCA caps being that the recent tinned copper braided metal wire shielding of the wire between my grounding box and DDC actually made my system somewhat darker, and the caps tend to add treble.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I was about  to strip it  and use it  for the "Internal wiring"  but I would  still use these 3256801606656922 for  grounding cables.


Could use it for internal wiring


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> I put the gold power cable on my amp and silver odin on wall and there is better body and slightly more warmth to the sound....I think it balances the silver well... note sounds a tad thick but lets see what brain burn brings


I am going a different direction than you.  My system is already well tuned.  Sound sick right now.  As shocked as I am how easily I can use the materials within this signal grounding to tune the system further I am sticking with that.  The silver plated OCC and OFC wire just sound absolutely inferior to the copper when applied to this project.  So far that is.  Obviously this is system, taste and component dependent.  But I am always open to any suggestions and ideas!  At one point I am going to try some high end wiring with the boxes once built.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> Hmmm, may it is the cable then.
> 
> I was looking at the pinouts and it looks like theres 4 different options, it should work if its one of the 4.
> 
> ...


This HDMI incompatibility was discussed on the Audio-GD DI-20 thread, and on the Gustard R26 thread, by many forum members. 
Hopefully, someone will find a reliable supplier who will fix correctly this issue. 

I have the impression that I bought the same cable as you: 
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/4000255873784.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=FR


----------



## iFi audio

runningwitit said:


> OFF TOPIC
> 
> Can i make a grounding cable for my ifi ac purifier with speaker wire?
> 
> ...



Thanks for asking. Any cable with matching plugs (banana on one end, RCA on the other) will work fine


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> This HDMI incompatibility was discussed on the Audio-GD DI-20 thread, and on the Gustard R26 thread, by many forum members.
> Hopefully, someone will find a reliable supplier who will fix correctly this issue.
> 
> I have the impression that I bought the same cable as you:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/4000255873784.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=FR


I'm using it for audio-gd di20he to audio-gd r8mk2 and its not working properly lol.


----------



## roberto2

Dandoudou said:


> This HDMI incompatibility was discussed on the Audio-GD DI-20 thread, and on the Gustard R26 thread, by many forum members.
> Hopefully, someone will find a reliable supplier who will fix correctly this issue.
> 
> I have the impression that I bought the same cable as you:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/4000255873784.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=FR


I have one between my DI20HE and Denafrips Terminator and it works very well. And I tried the same cable with an Holo Spring 3 and an Holo May with the DI20HE and it worked flawlessly…


----------



## dougms3

roberto2 said:


> I have one between my DI20HE and Denafrips Terminator and it works very well. And I tried the same cable with an Holo Spring 3 and an Holo May with the DI20HE and it worked flawlessly…


Mine works fine for pcm.  It's the dsd that's not working with the cable.

Did you try playing music with dsd upsampling?


----------



## roberto2

dougms3 said:


> Mine works fine for pcm.  It's the dsd that's not working with the cable.
> 
> Did you try playing music with dsd upsampling?


Yes with my Terminator


----------



## Oswolrf

Hi guys my AKG 712 pro cable died today. Could you recommend me some good and cheap aliexpress cables? Thank you.

There are a lot but i am not sure about if they are ok or not so that why i am asking.

EDIT: I need it 2 metters long.


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 8, 2022)

roberto2 said:


> Yes with my Terminator


It may have something to do with the complexity of the r8mk2. 

In any case, after reading through the audio-gd dac thread, it seems to be a known issue.  Unfortunately for me and dandoudou we didnt know before purchasing.

I'm not 100% sure its the cable, I have an hdmi cable incoming so I'll post an update once I'm able to verify.


----------



## kingoftown1

fwiw re: ground cables -- I started with 1 run of 17awg stranded Neotech OCC copper in PVC (pulled from no longer used NES-3004, some of the strands are silver-plated) + 1 run of 30awg no-name tin-plated copper stripped out of a sata cable.  It was pretty good.

Next I tried 2 runs of the same 17awg stranded PVC Neotech.  Intense bass, but overall bloated and severely lacking transparency.

3rd attempt is 1 run of 28awg Neotech OCC silver (solid), 1 run of 24 awg solid Neotech OCC copper, 1 run of 18awg solid Neotech OCC copper.  All 3 with PTFE insulation instead of PVC.  The soundstage exploded with this combination, but sounded a bit bass-light and thin for about 2 weeks.  Now it's really well-rounded with nice tonal density and no bass deficiency.  no complaints.


Another attempt was mixing 1 run of the 18awg Neotech PTFE copper with braided multi-strand occ headphone wire:
https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/unba...adphone-occ-copper-ptfe-isolated-p-10545.html
https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/unba...headphone-occ-silver-ptfe-o186mm-p-10546.html
On these, I haven't compared to any other recipes but I like what I'm hearing from the system as a whole, so I probably won't make any changes in the near future.


----------



## szore (Dec 9, 2022)

I'm thinking of getting this grounding mat for under the transformer and Gr. box that's sitting on the carpet. I can clip it to the ground post on the transformer.   

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832553678649.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.740d1244DD48IV&algo_pvid=03130de5-7c36-437c-b44d-35f0f56e79d5&algo_exp_id=03130de5-7c36-437c-b44d-35f0f56e79d5-4&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000028697209419"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!USD!29.37!24.38!!!!!@2103399116705660391847883e68ff!12000028697209419!sea&curPageLogUid=GQbfJ0ayB11L


----------



## cdacosta

kingoftown1 said:


> fwiw re: ground cables -- I started with 1 run of 17awg stranded Neotech OCC copper in PVC (pulled from no longer used NES-3004, some of the strands are silver-plated) + 1 run of 30awg no-name tin-plated copper stripped out of a sata cable.  It was pretty good.
> 
> Next I tried 2 runs of the same 17awg stranded PVC Neotech.  Intense bass, but overall bloated and severely lacking transparency.
> 
> ...


I am assuming you are referring ground cables for a passive ground box, or are you referring to another use?  Took two weeks for it all to settle in after installing the cable?


----------



## kingoftown1

Yeah, the same ground boxes we were talking about a few pages back.  In my experience, Neotech's copper in PTFE takes a few days to settle.  This was my first time using their silver, so I didn't really know what to expect there.  I also had bananas & binding posts, so more mass there too.


----------



## dougms3

Oswolrf said:


> Hi guys my AKG 712 pro cable died today. Could you recommend me some good and cheap aliexpress cables? Thank you.
> 
> There are a lot but i am not sure about if they are ok or not so that why i am asking.
> 
> EDIT: I need it 2 metters long.


https://www.head-fi.org/posts/17286764/

This thread is more for what you're looking for.


----------



## cdacosta

kingoftown1 said:


> Yeah, the same ground boxes we were talking about a few pages back.  In my experience, Neotech's copper in PTFE takes a few days to settle.  This was my first time using their silver, so I didn't really know what to expect there.  I also had bananas & binding posts, so more mass there too.


I have just ordered Neotech 12ga., UP-OCC, stranded copper chassis wire from Sonic Craft.  This is 7N copper with a Teflon jacket.  Currently with what I have on hand (and not in storage) that is working well is VH Audio OFC 12ga. stranded with Teflon jacket and Aliexpress OCC 12ga. stranded (with Cardas markings, but is not real Cardas).  The Aliexpress wire is the best so far.  Using the same RCA connectors at the same connection point on component, the differences of wire are not only audible it is night and day.

What is tricky, is upon adding or changing mineral/material mix or with a wire change is instantly audible.  12 hours later more obvious the changes, 24 hours more changing.  I am not sure how long it takes for it all to finally settle in because I am consistently experimenting.  24 hours in gives a very good idea of what the previous changes were though.  

I can clearly hear the cause and effect of everything I have tried.  What I am still having trouble wrapping my mind around is how passively draining from a signal ground on a single component has such a huge audible effect?


----------



## szore (Dec 9, 2022)

So, cdacosta got me thinking about that tape on the XLR's, so I took tape off 2 xlr connections (4 plugs), and left it on the other 2 xlr, and there is a bit more warmth and body and it's not so transparent. so at least for the moment there is a nice balance and body to the sound. Pretty cool how you can fine tune it.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> This HDMI incompatibility was discussed on the Audio-GD DI-20 thread, and on the Gustard R26 thread, by many forum members.
> Hopefully, someone will find a reliable supplier who will fix correctly this issue.
> 
> I have the impression that I bought the same cable as you:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/4000255873784.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=FR


I got it working.  Its a configuration issue, cable is fine.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/new...cs-and-dac-amps.853902/page-633#post-17286110


----------



## Dantheman

Hello Everyone, Has anyone tried Ali Dragon power cord? recently I received this cord, burned it in for about 200 hours, yesterday I plug into my amp, it sounded bad, worse than any cord that I have heard, when battery was plugged in, treble was so poor, soundstage is narrow, unplugged battery, treble sounded a bit better, a bit more transparent, I think any stock PC will sound better than this cord.  Bought it from Audioson store, their service is great, since they does not offer free return, sending the cable back will be expensive.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> I have just ordered Neotech 12ga., UP-OCC, stranded copper chassis wire from Sonic Craft.  This is 7N copper with a Teflon jacket.  Currently with what I have on hand (and not in storage) that is working well is VH Audio OFC 12ga. stranded with Teflon jacket and Aliexpress OCC 12ga. stranded (with Cardas markings, but is not real Cardas).  The Aliexpress wire is the best so far.  Using the same RCA connectors at the same connection point on component, the differences of wire are not only audible it is night and day.
> 
> What is tricky, is upon adding or changing mineral/material mix or with a wire change is instantly audible.  12 hours later more obvious the changes, 24 hours more changing.  I am not sure how long it takes for it all to finally settle in because I am consistently experimenting.  24 hours in gives a very good idea of what the previous changes were though.
> 
> I can clearly hear the cause and effect of everything I have tried.  What I am still having trouble wrapping my mind around is how passively draining from a signal ground on a single component has such a huge audible effect?


Cool. Please share a photo of the cable you like best for your grounding box. And a link or the item number. Just curious how it compares.

And what does it mean when you have a better cable for a grounding box- is it a FR difference like brighter / darker, or is it more of everything that was good from the former cable?


----------



## DecentLevi

I got my Faraday fabric tape mentioned a few pages back, earlier in the week already from Amazon. Will finally have time to try it soon. Someone on here has theirs from a preferred AliExpress store. I inspected it though, and it is surprisingly thin like maybe in between that of a cassette tape and camera film, yet at the same time it definitely looks legit and is actually sturdy.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Cool. Please share a photo of the cable you like best for your grounding box. And a link or the item number. Just curious how it compares.
> 
> And what does it mean when you have a better cable for a grounding box- is it a FR difference like brighter / darker, or is it more of everything that was good from the former cable?


So far I like the mixed gauge fake Cardas OCC copper from Aliexpress the best.  Tuesday I will get the 12ga. Neotech, this wire is really pure so I do have high hopes for it.  But the Neotech is not inexpensive, 4' shipped and tax is $45.49.  If I like this cable I will direct wire it to the copper plate inside box, skipping binding post.  I am waiting to build and shield the box until I try the wire.  Then I will experiment more with mix.  Still more minerals like Graphite powder, Tungsten, Tourmaline powder and Tourmaline smaller stones to come.  

The following is a link for the fake Cardas wire, I have the 1m length.  Note, the link is to interconnects.  I cut the connectors off and used the conductors and shielding for the ground wire.  Total gauge is between 12ga and 11ga.  Furutech Nano Liquid then is terminated with a Furutech CF-102(R) RCA plug.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US 

Now the sonic difference or what I "hear" between different wire?  There seems a lot of things contribute to the effectiveness and performance of these devices.  The wire, connection and where it is connected make a big difference with overall performance.  I currently have jimmy rigged (still working on enclosures) at 4 different locations in the system.  DAC, amp, PC and modem/router.  In all cases connected to signal ground.  If I change the wire in one location the sonic presentation changes, and the change can be big.  The change can be brighter, warmer, kill or enhance certain aspects of the system performance, take away or add detail retrieval, PRAT, how much harmonic info increases, decay, add or take away body or weight of presentation, effect sound stage,  etc., etc.  The further up the chain like the DAC the difference is huge, further down the chain I need to experiment more.  And these changes can be dramatic, not subtle.    On the PC (source) I also need to experiment more and will when the box is built for it.


----------



## Stax 7

DecentLevi said:


> I got my Faraday fabric tape mentioned a few pages back, earlier in the week already from Amazon. Will finally have time to try it soon. Someone on here has theirs from a preferred AliExpress store. I inspected it though, and it is surprisingly thin like maybe in between that of a cassette tape and camera film, yet at the same time it definitely looks legit and is actually sturdy.


Be interesting to read your take on the sound differences between the two tapes if any.


----------



## KaiserTK

Dantheman said:


> Hello Everyone, Has anyone tried Ali Dragon power cord? recently I received this cord, burned it in for about 200 hours, yesterday I plug into my amp, it sounded bad, worse than any cord that I have heard, when battery was plugged in, treble was so poor, soundstage is narrow, unplugged battery, treble sounded a bit better, a bit more transparent, I think any stock PC will sound better than this cord.  Bought it from Audioson store, their service is great, since they does not offer free return, sending the cable back will be expensive.


I tried a few aq power cable knockoffs, and while the build quality was impressive, they were not even remotely close to the real things. Tried blizzard and thunder, and at 150+hr burn-in they completely lost to a real aq z3 cable. Worse resolution, staging, depth, timbre, etc. Can’t understand why there are good reviews on ali for these.


----------



## DecentLevi

Ok guys this may be THE big one. Not only does this stuff work, it propels my system far above I ever expected it to. Starting with covering just one side of one of my Odin Gold AC power cable connectors, I was INSTANTLY impressed with the first note I heard, as if things are more 3D! This made a BIG difference!!! Now after so far covering 3 sides of my 2 Odin Gold AC cables I had myself questioning whether or not I am still in the same celestial plane. Because I would not, could not have expected my upper-midfi headphone system to ever be transformed so close to summit-fi, with such a simple unassuming hack.




https://www.amazon.com/dp/B097HC9HR7
@Stax 7 I have only one Faraday Fabric tape so nothing to compare it to, but I would sure recon the ONLY way to get anything better than this would be if it was spiritually blessed by The Creator himself. I'm satisfied that this is at least as good as the one another user got from China off AliExpress. And this was from Amazon, and interestingly is the perfect size for the Odin Gold connectors (2"). Mainly I am noticing bigger soundstage and excitement with a pretty damn visceral lifelike quality, detail, and more natural flow of instruments in space and time. 



And like I said, so far only 3 of around 20 connectors are covered so far. I think I may remove one because one of them could have added a wee bit of extra shimmer in the highs. Folks this is sublime and makes AT LEAST as big of a difference as the premade grounding box, which do seem to compliment eachother!


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> I got my Faraday fabric tape mentioned a few pages back, earlier in the week already from Amazon. Will finally have time to try it soon. Someone on here has theirs from a preferred AliExpress store. I inspected it though, and it is surprisingly thin like maybe in between that of a cassette tape and camera film, yet at the same time it definitely looks legit and is actually sturdy.


That was me. I ended up taking it off 2 of my xlr connections, and on 2 other xlr I took a piece of tape and cut it in half to just brighten it up a little, and the sound balanced out nicely... This tape is very good apparently for fine tuning the sound....


----------



## Stax 7

DecentLevi said:


> Ok guys this may be THE big one. Not only does this stuff work, it propels my system far above I ever expected it to. Starting with covering just one side of one of my Odin Gold AC power cable connectors, I was INSTANTLY impressed with the first note I heard, as if things are more 3D! This made a BIG difference!!! Now after so far covering 3 sides of my 2 Odin Gold AC cables I had myself questioning whether or not I am still in the same celestial plane. Because I would not, could not have expected my upper-midfi headphone system to ever be transformed so close to summit-fi, with such a simple unassuming hack.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


DecentLevi...​thought you had the Aliexpress tape as well....I cant wait to get mine as well now...


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Ok guys this may be THE big one. Not only does this stuff work, it propels my system far above I ever expected it to. Starting with covering just one side of one of my Odin Gold AC power cable connectors, I was INSTANTLY impressed with the first note I heard, as if things are more 3D! This made a BIG difference!!! Now after so far covering 3 sides of my 2 Odin Gold AC cables I had myself questioning whether or not I am still in the same celestial plane. Because I would not, could not have expected my upper-midfi headphone system to ever be transformed so close to summit-fi, with such a simple unassuming hack.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Told ya...


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

Original impression was of electrostatic setup.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Original impression was of electrostatic setup.


Thanks @szore for sending me some to experiment with.  

I wrapped it on the xlrs and one of the power cable going to the dac.  I put on one side at a time while listening to music, its very subtle but the noise reduction is audible especially at the higher frequencies, noticeable improvement in separation as well.  Effect is not immediate, it takes quite some time to take full effect.  It has a more noticable effect on the power cable.

This is not the same material as the oyaide tape.  If I try to use the oyaide tape on the power or interconnects, it flattens the sound just holding it in place without adhering it.

The base material is cloth and it looks different from the oyaide tape.  Perhaps this is what permalloy looks like?  I'm not sure but it doesn't seem to be sendust or at least the same recipe as the oyaide tape.

I'm not noticing any negatives with this tape so far.  I'll only know for sure if I remove it but thus far, music seems livelier, better separation, less noise, treble seems to be more articulated?  I'll have to do some more experiementing with it.

I think electrostat is an accurate description of what it makes it sound like.


----------



## szore

I put the tape on my grounding box and transparency has gone through the roof!!!!!!

I also wrapped the grounding post on my transformer where I have the grounding box plugged in, big improvement in clarity!


----------



## szore

szore said:


> I put the tape on my grounding box and transparency has gone through the roof!!!!!!
> 
> I also wrapped the grounding post on my transformer where I have the grounding box plugged in, big improvement in clarity!


Bass extension and sub bass rumble has significantly improved!


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

Taped the transformer...my system sounds amazing...mids are crystal clear...bass extension and rumble has palpably improved, airiness, yet great body and rich layering and transparency. Just a hint of warmth...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Bass extension and sub bass rumble has significantly improved!


I'll be honest, I was real skeptical about this one and probably @cdacosta too.

But it works well and no negatives thus far.  I put it on my dc power cable, usb cable and the grounding tube as well.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Taped the transformer...my system sounds amazing...mids are crystal clear...bass extension and rumble has palpably improved, airiness, yet great body and rich layering and transparency. Just a hint of warmth...


Link to this tape?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Link to this tape?


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2cXhAiK&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## cdacosta

I have and am learning anything is possible.  Once I see your link I will order some and give it a whirl.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have and am learning anything is possible.  Once I see your link I will order some and give it a whirl.


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2cXhAiK&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## szore

This is how i put it on  my fuse box...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> This is how i put it on  my fuse box...


Ordered 50mm version.  So in each location you applied this shielding tape, what did you hear?  Any negatives?


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Ordered 50mm version.  So in each location you applied this shielding tape, what did you hear?  Any negatives?


No negatives at all. One observation: when I put it on cables it improved more clarity and resolution. When I put it on the grounding box and transformer, it gave it a little bit of lovely warmth, and the bass extension and sub bass rumble is greatly (significantly?) improved. My system souneds perfect right now... Next will be the liquid...
I was listening to classical and it was sublime; Bach organ concertoes and Bocherini strings...the tone was engageing and natural in the midst of electrostatic-like clarity...i'm in awe right now! I'm listening to techno now, and the bass and sub bass is rattling my lungs...and thats flat with no eq...the mids are clear, no congestion at all.... on my Szalayi the mids are rich and layered and the bass is bountiful...(its in the mix). Great balance between technical precision, and warmth and engaging sound... immersive experience... 

crap...the DAP and amp next?  Dare I...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> No negatives at all. One observation: when I put it on cables it improved more clarity and resolution. When I put it on the grounding box and transformer, it gave it a little bit of lovely warmth, and the bass extension and sub bass rumble is greatly (significantly?) improved. My system souneds perfect right now... Next will be the liquid...
> I was listening to classical and it was sublime; Bach organ concertoes and Bocherini strings...the tone was engageing and natural in the midst of electrostatic-like clarity...i'm in awe right now! I'm listening to techno now, and the bass and sub bass is rattling my lungs...and thats flat with no eq...the mids are clear, no congestion at all.... on my Szalayi the mids are rich and layered and the bass is bountiful...(its in the mix). Great balance between technical precision, and warmth and engaging sound... immersive experience...
> 
> crap...the DAP and amp next?  Dare I...


I have to agree thus far I'm not hearing anything negative with the application.  

I'm tempted to test it out on the internals of my headphones to see what it does.


----------



## dougms3

Guess I'm gonna be rolling around on the floor with my headphones on trying to listen for a difference again, ugh I'm too old for this.


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

Guys, get this tape on you DAC and amp as fast as you can!!! You will be rewarded with sonic riches!!!!!


----------



## kingoftown1

If it's anything like the 3M equivalent materials like AB7050HF or 5100, it works well applied directly to IC chips, fpgas, etc.  That way it absorbs HF noise at the source. Fair warning, the 3m versions are non-conductive on the adhesive side, not sure about what you're using, so be careful.


----------



## kingoftown1

double post


----------



## szore

kingoftown1 said:


> If it's anything like the 3M equivalent materials like AB7050HF or 5100, it works well applied directly to IC chips, fpgas, etc.  That way it absorbs HF noise at the source. Fair warning, the 3m versions are non-conductive on the adhesive side, not sure about what you're using, so be careful.


20M Conductive Tape Double-sided Conductive Anti-interference Shielding​


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

Back of my DAP...tighter, more impactful sound, blacker backround...much smoother......


----------



## cdacosta

I do 


szore said:


> Guys, get this tape on you DAC and amp as fast as you can!!! You will be rewarded with sonic riches!!!!!


Do not know if I can stand looking at that every day. How about inside the component’s chassis?  What did applying on the gear do?


----------



## szore (Dec 11, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> I do
> 
> Do not know if I can stand looking at that every day. How about inside the component’s chassis?  What did applying on the gear do?


I like looking at it when I hear what it's doing... I would say blacker background, smoother, richer presentation...bass is full and layered and very high quality and volume...the mids have a great engagement and musicality, yet they have a soundstage that just falls into an abyss... perfect clarity and great resolution...listening on my custom Valkyries, very rich and full.

I'm actually listening off my DAP now, the tape works wonders there too! Black background with better, layered bass with excellent extension and rumble...rich smooth detail...


----------



## Dandoudou (Dec 11, 2022)

@szore , I saw that you put the tape on your Denafrips, a DAC that has a thick case. Can this tape bring any benefit to it?


----------



## szore

Dandoudou said:


> @szore , I saw that you put the tape on your Denafrips, a DAC that has a thick case. Can this tape bring any benefit to it?


I'm hearing blacker background, smooth clarity with excellent detail. Better dynamics...also a deeper richer bass with greater layering and resolution...


----------



## dougms3

Ok I'm gonna have to buy more.


----------



## szore

I actually ran out. 

For the record, I also put 2 strips on the _bottom_ of the transformer.


----------



## Dandoudou

Once it is stuck on the gear, is it possible to remove it easily?


----------



## dougms3

Very interesting product.  For a bit there, I thought you guys with this tape might have gone off your rocker lol.

It works on well on my hiby r5g2 also.  Its not a huge difference very subtle and audibly noticeable.  

I was listening while pressing it against the dap then taking it off, there is less noise, better separation, microdetails are more audible.  It takes about 10-15 seconds for it to take effect.  Sound has more depth, imaging and positioning is improved noticeably.  Makes eveyrthing sound much more musical.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> Once it is stuck on the gear, is it possible to remove it easily?


Yeah comes right off, its a thin cloth tape.


----------



## szore

Dandoudou said:


> Once it is stuck on the gear, is it possible to remove it easily?


Yes, it peels right off and stays sticky so if i wanted to put it on the inside of the case like cdacosta suggests its easy to do


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Yeah comes right off, its a thin cloth tape.


Is the adhesive good enough to be installed on sides and top of inside gear?  Ever take a continuity tester to the surface to see if the material is actually conductive?  This sounds like a thin shielding material.  Have you tried the material on top of fo.Q or the Oyaide EMI tape?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Yes, it peels right off and stays sticky so if i wanted to put it on the inside of the case like cdacosta suggests its easy to do


If this material is thin adhesive shielding material, should work well around actual transformers inside gear to shield the electronic parts from the EMI the transformer emits.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Is the adhesive good enough to be installed on sides and top of inside gear?  Ever take a continuity tester to the surface to see if the material is actually conductive?  This sounds like a thin shielding material.  Have you tried the material on top of fo.Q or the Oyaide EMI tape?


Yeah, its similar to the oyaide tape but it works differently, its not as powerful.  Effects are subtle but easily noticeable.  

I didn't check but its probably conductive.  I checked with my NC voltage detector and everything is the same, it doesn't seem to shield at all.

Haven't tried it on top of other stuff.

I think szore was spot on, it makes my dap sound like an electrostat now.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Yeah, its similar to the oyaide tape but it works differently, its not as powerful.  Effects are subtle but easily noticeable.
> 
> I didn't check but its probably conductive.  I checked with my NC voltage detector and everything is the same, it doesn't seem to shield at all.
> 
> ...


Has to be a shielding material, otherwise what is the tape doing?  May not shield certain frequencies.  If it is a shield, how about using it to cover PC power supply case/chassis?  Could have a lot of unique uses.  Another would be shield AC wall plate and or the housing enclosure.  The list would be quite long but will depend on how effective the tape is.


----------



## msing539

cdacosta said:


> Has to be a shielding material, otherwise what is the tape doing?  May not shield certain frequencies.  If it is a shield, how about using it to cover PC power supply case/chassis?  Could have a lot of unique uses.  Another would be shield AC wall plate and or the housing enclosure.  The list would be quite long but will depend on how effective the tape is.


Someone on Amazon didn't have success shielding RFI from a PC case with it. So I guess mmv.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> Has to be a shielding material, otherwise what is the tape doing?  May not shield certain frequencies.  If it is a shield, how about using it to cover PC power supply case/chassis?  Could have a lot of unique uses.  Another would be shield AC wall plate and or the housing enclosure.  The list would be quite long but will depend on how effective the tape is.


I put it on my AC wall plate too...


----------



## cdacosta

msing539 said:


> Someone on Amazon didn't have success shielding RFI from a PC case with it. So I guess mmv.


We will see when I get it. May not be the same material szore is using/sold on AliExpress.  For $16 it worth a try


----------



## DenverW

I'm thinking of trying this out in some areas, I just want to make sure to say, "be careful out there!"

It's conductive, so please don't short anything out, give yourself a shock, or burn anything down!


----------



## msing539

I too, shall try the sticky.


----------



## cdacosta

DenverW said:


> I'm thinking of trying this out in some areas, I just want to make sure to say, "be careful out there!"
> 
> It's conductive, so please don't short anything out, give yourself a shock, or burn anything down!


Agreed, this is why I asked about the quality of the adhesive and continuity across the material.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 11, 2022)

I've got my system all set up with Faraday Fabric Tape.

Some observations: sometimes less is more. Don't cover an entire device, because for me it often became too bright when covering all sides or using too many strips. Usually 1-2 strips of the 2" tape for me, usually only on top would make a very nice improvement; covering about 80% of the units' length (but not that much surface area).

-DAP: covered the entire back. Looks sleek and bass seems deeper. Still working out any difference
- Odin Gold cables: IME it sounded better on the wall outlet without any on the power conditioner side.
   Sounded great on both sides of the Odin Gold cable to the DDC.
   To me sounded better with just the one strip like *this* photo, but not completely enclosed and wrapped down along the cable
- (huge Furman) power conditioner: settled on 2 long strips on the outermost top black surface and a small strip on the top silver part
- grounding box: IME this always added brightness and flattened the presentation in some way, but 1 medium strip in the very center top was the sweet spot
- SS amp: 2 strips on top and 2 more (1 on each side)
- DDC: 1 small piece on top center
- DC supercapacitor 5v LPS: best with only 1 long one on the top. Both sides made it too bright
- USB cleanser (Schiit Wyrd): fully wrapped the wall wart, and put 1 on top of the unit
- Odin 2 RCA digital coax cable: wrapped the last 5" of the cable going into the DAC on top of my existing copper foil tape

On everything, it would take me deeper into the scene with blacker background and improved soundstage / separation and details. On some components treble response was affected more than others, especially when I would overdo the amount of tape. With my stereo amp, it was the opposite. It gave some nice warmth and smoothed out the treble - now being covered about 25% surface area with 4 big strips. My sound system has just gotten a nice do-over that I didn't know it needed!


----------



## msing539

DecentLevi said:


> I've got my system all set up with Faraday Fabric Tape.
> 
> Some observations: sometimes less is more. Don't cover an entire device, because for me it often became too bright when covering all sides or using too many strips. Usually 1-2 strips of the 2" tape for me, usually only on top would make a very nice improvement; covering about 80% of the units' length (but not that much surface area).
> 
> ...


Thanks man. Now what I'd like to know is what corresponding internal parts are under or next to the areas you covered.


----------



## szore (Dec 12, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> I've got my system all set up with Faraday Fabric Tape.
> 
> Some observations: sometimes less is more. Don't cover an entire device, because for me it often became too bright when covering all sides or using too many strips. Usually 1-2 strips of the 2" tape for me, usually only on top would make a very nice improvement; covering about 80% of the units' length (but not that much surface area).
> 
> ...


I guess I was a bit more generous in my application. I'm sounding a little bright, so I took a few strips off my DAC and amp, and the sound warmed up a little...


----------



## szore

The best part about this rig is it makes every IEM in my collection sound like it's TOTL! The Serial never sounded so amazing!!! I left all the tape on my Gr. Box and transformer... I felt the improvement was to extend the bass and add amazing amounts of layering and depth and transparency and rumble to the bass... I see no need to change the tape there, but I did take tape off off the 4 xlr connections going in and out of my Lokius, and also the tape I put on the sides of the dac and amp and Lokius, took that off too.....and that warmed up the sound a little. Right now it sounds perfect! Blown away!


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The best part about this rig is it makes every IEM in my collection sound like it's TOTL! The Serial never sounded so amazing!!! I left all the tape on my Gr. Box and transformer... I felt the improvement was to extend the bass and add amazing amounts of layering and depth and transparency and rumble to the bass... I see no need to change the tape there, but I did take tape off off the 4 xlr connections going in and out of my Lokius, and also the tape I put on the sides of the dac and amp and Lokius, took that off too.....and that warmed up the sound a little. Right now it sounds perfect! Blown away!


It will seem illogical that over shielding will negatively affect sonics until one experiences it.  I found the best way is to try in one area of system, if I like what the shielding does then permanently affix. Then try another area of system and so forth.  This is a time consuming process but I found yielded best results.  There are usual places within a system that “usually” benefit most like power related which helps from Protecting other more sensitive electronics from the EMI.


----------



## DecentLevi

Has anyone tried this shielding tape underneath your devices? I have a hunch that maybe it will affect the sound differently than on the sides or top, being that with most components such as amps DACs, etc. the majority of internals are towards the bottom. Test this on your grounding box too. I will certainly try mine also, but will be delayed at work some days, so maybe someone else can get to it first.


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Has anyone tried this shielding tape underneath your devices? I have a hunch that maybe it will affect the sound differently than on the sides or top, being that with most components such as amps DACs, etc. the majority of internals are towards the bottom. Test this on your grounding box too. I will certainly try mine also, but will be delayed at work some days, so maybe someone else can get to it first.


I taped the bottom of my transformer with 2 strips...


----------



## cdacosta

First ground box made for PC (source).  Mix I still need to move over and is still in progress.  Wanted to finish one.  Has a light wood stain and one coat of Polyurethane protective coat (wanted to make box a bit more dense)  Using two 12ga. (9 awg total) VH Audio OFC copper), 12" in length each lead.  Thick copper lined interior with a fairly thick copper plate.  For DAC and amp I will hard wire directly to copper plate bypassing copper binding post.  Nano liquid used throughout all wire.  I am leaving the underside of cover and bottom of box unfinished just in case the shielding tape coming enhances it.  Feet used are the ones I referenced previously that comes really close to performance of the IsoAcoustic Mini footers.  The material would be equivalent to about a 4 kg. unit.  Will experiment with different wire with USB interface to PC.   This unit will be replacing the jimmy rigged attached to PC I have now.  Will install tomorrow when I have more time.  Also did receive the Neotech 12ga. copper wire which I am testing now on DAC.


----------



## Stax 7

cdacosta said:


> First ground box made for PC (source).  Mix I still need to move over and is still in progress.  Wanted to finish one.  Has a light wood stain and one coat of Polyurethane protective coat (wanted to make box a bit more dense)  Using two 12ga. (9 awg total) VH Audio OFC copper), 12" in length each lead.  Thick copper lined interior with a fairly thick copper plate.  For DAC and amp I will hard wire directly to copper plate bypassing copper binding post.  Nano liquid used throughout all wire.  I am leaving the underside of cover and bottom of box unfinished just in case the shielding tape coming enhances it.  Feet used are the ones I referenced previously that comes really close to performance of the IsoAcoustic Mini footers.  The material would be equivalent to about a 4 kg. unit.  Will experiment with different wire with USB interface to PC.   This unit will be replacing the jimmy rigged attached to PC I have now.  Will install tomorrow when I have more time.  Also did receive the Neotech 12ga. copper wire which I am testing now on DAC.


Looking good!


----------



## szore

So I am discovering with this tape that it is easy to 'over apply' it as I am learning, but the great thing about this stuff is it is easily removed, and the tape itself holds its 'stickyness' and is virtually indestructable, so it can be cut, saved, and reapplied. I also noticed that the 'strips' I put on the DAC and AMP 'sound better' if they are connected. Also on the Gr. box and transformer.  I just cut a thin strip and apply it like a circuit to connect it to the next strip, etc. This way when all connected it acts like "1 piece of tape' due to its conductivity. 

I also ended up removing some of the tape from my DAP because it had too much of an electrostatic sound to it. I want the 'electrostatic' sound, but just 1 piece of tape was sufficient along the back of the dap to achieve this. All-in-all pretty remarkable stuff.


----------



## cdacosta

Stax 7 said:


> Looking good!


Will be interesting to know how this setup sounds different to just placing the wire into material mix like it is now?


----------



## Stax 7

szore said:


> So I am discovering with this tape that it is easy to 'over apply' it as I am learning, but the great thing about this stuff is it is easily removed, and the tape itself holds its 'stickyness' and is virtually indestructable, so it can be cut, saved, and reapplied. I also noticed that the 'strips' I put on the DAC and AMP 'sound better' if they are connected. Also on the Gr. box and transformer.  I just cut a thin strip and apply it like a circuit to connect it to the next strip, etc. This way when all connected it acts like "1 piece of tape' due to its conductivity.
> 
> I also ended up removing some of the tape from my DAP because it had too much of an electrostatic sound to it. I want the 'electrostatic' sound, but just 1 piece of tape was sufficient along the back of the dap to achieve this. All-in-all pretty remarkable stuff.


Wonder if there is a difference in tape between the Aliexpress and Farday.


----------



## dougms3

Stax 7 said:


> Wonder if there is a difference in tape between the Aliexpress and Farday.


Its the same, szore sent me some and I bought the one that decentlevi bought on amazon.


----------



## dougms3

After some further experimenting with the tape and removing it.

While it does make things more resolving and reduce noise, it also closes in the sound and flattens the bass a bit.

Its not as powerful as the oyaide tape or foq tape.  It seems to do something slightly different in the higher frequencies but its definitely compressing the sound.  

I would not use it on any signal cables, only power.


----------



## Katsukare

Anyone got a suggestion which XLR to XLR balanced cable I should get for Pre-amp to DAC?


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> After some further experimenting with the tape and removing it.
> 
> While it does make things more resolving and reduce noise, it also closes in the sound and flattens the bass a bit.
> 
> ...


Have you tried it on or to shield PC power supply or component chassis?


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Its the same, szore sent me some and I bought the one that decentlevi bought on amazon.


Oh, awesome! So you received the Faraday tape from Amazon and had a sample of the Chinese one? And did you compare them side by side?


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Have you tried it on or to shield PC power supply or component chassis?


Not yet, I'll give it a go when I get my new power supply for my pc.

Its a super flower titanium PS.



DecentLevi said:


> Oh, awesome! So you received the Faraday tape from Amazon and had a sample of the Chinese one? And did you compare them side by side?


Yeah they're the same.


----------



## dougms3

Katsukare said:


> Anyone got a suggestion which XLR to XLR balanced cable I should get for Pre-amp to DAC?


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2tt0CuP&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I replaced the odin2 rca with this cable from my audio-gd master19 to loxjie p20 amp.  

This cable is superior to the odin2.  Maybe you can ask the seller to make an xlr version of this cable if you want it.

I use the argento xlrs which are very good also but about double the price of the cable above.

How much are you looking to spend?


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Not yet, I'll give it a go when I get my new power supply for my pc.
> 
> Its a super flower titanium PS.
> 
> ...


Cool, let me know how it works out?  You will get the PS before I get the tape from China.  Another possible good use would be at the back of video monitors, to shield electronics from the EMI and RFI the monitors produce.  Around or on SMPS units could also yield positive results.  These are just off the top of my head.


----------



## LocalMotion

All these Neardost PC’s look cool lined up. Would be worth a nice mansion if they were real 🤣


----------



## cdacosta

Here is an update with experimenting on ground boxes:

* The audible effect of changing the wire only is very similar to changing the interconnect used for that component.  This seems illogical but is what I am consistently experiencing. 
* The effect of using ground box on router or in my case router/modem combo filtering the ground lead only on an open port dramatically effects performance.  
* With a component such as a DAC with open digital and analog input or output ports, both digital and analog can be filtered.  But must be with two separate grounding boxes for optimal performance.  Filtering digital and analog with the same device sounds wrong or off.
* With changes such as mix of minerals or ground lead (wire and connection) takes a few days to fully develop.  Initial understanding of how it sounds will be known within 10 mins to 3 hours.  
* Box built like the one I recently showed, does produce a more profound effect vs jimmy rigged ( just taking a 5" or so lead and placing in a bag of the same minerals).


----------



## cdacosta

Here more interesting finds...

* Neotech Stranded UPOCC Copper in Teflon 12 AWG, which is 7N copper.  I tried this wire on DAC and amp with the Furutech solderless RCA plugs I have mentioned before.  Tried input and outputs.  In all cases whether it is the DAC or amp, somewhere in the mid bass frequencies and up very articulate, a bit on sweeter side, good resolution, refined sounding.  But the bass and sub bass is subdued a bit.  The bass region's resolution is very good but not what I would hope for.  Very airy top end and smooth, excellent in the vocal region.   The fake Cardas Ali copper wire has bass slam, the Neotech does not.  So out of wild curiosity I tried adding the 12ga. OFC VH-Audio wire to the other amp input.  This means now the amp has Neotech on the right RCA input and VH-Audio on the left input, all into the same Tourmaline mix.  BAM... just wow is all I can say.  Listened on and off all afternoon and experimenting with shielding schemes for the this box.  

No joke, this Schiit Jotunheim 2 sounds way different then stock now.  The noise floor just dropped hard.  I do not think I would expect a $2K amp to sound like this, definitely not a $500 amp.  Timbre is amazing, but everything I cherish as an audiophile was improved.  I have high quality graphite and different sizes of Tourmaline coming and is suppose to really enhance Tourmaline mixes so we will see.

* Next interesting thing is while experimenting with copper shielding for this box and mix I noticed the minerals do not like a shield, will roll off HF and dramatically shrink soundstage.  So easy to hear the effects of placing the shield over, under or around the mix inside the bag.  If the material/minerals or conductors are touching a copper bar or plate sounds way off, remove the plate and all good again.  I am listening to this happen in real time while music is playing.  So for this box there will be no shielding or copper plate inside the box.  I will just work on enhancing the mix of minerals.


----------



## lmfboy01

Some Ali cables in signature for sale


----------



## cdacosta

Built the amp box.  No shielding or copper plate for reasons I mentioned before.  I listened to the system after unplugging the jimmy rigged setup and what a drastic difference compared to attached to the grounding mix.  I now have the ground box so it is accessible for me to further play with the mix.  I still have Tungsten, graphite (which is suppose to really kick it in high gear with Tourmaline mixes), Tourmaline powder, Tourmaline polished smaller stones coming from Aliexpress.  Currently the material weight is about 1.3 KG.  The red wire is the Neotech 12 gauge. and white is 12 gauge VH Audio OFC.  Both leads are stripped back 7", wire separated apart, Nano liquid treated and going directly into the mix.  Copper binding post has two 12ga. VH Audio copper 7" leads attached to it.  Copper binding post is just in case I want to experiment with it later or add leads for cable wraps. 

Current mix in this box (which was what was in the bag before) is:
* Black polished Tourmaline
* Rock salt 
* Rochelle salt
* Shungite chips  

Side notes:
- I considered techflex for the wire leads.  Problem is Techflex will add to the dielectric mix of the Teflon jackets already on the leads.  In my experience prototyping for manufacturers, Techflex on interconnects are detrimental to performance.  So I did not want to take the time to experiment here.  But would look cool. 
- There is a difference in what I hear after having the box hooked up for about an hour (performance will improve over the next two days or so) vs just having the mix in a bag on top of foam.  I bit more body or weight to the presentation.  I will wait until it has all settled and may try tuning the wood enclosure by using exotic wood.  Possibly changing the resonate frequency of the enclosure makes a difference, concept is the same as with musical instruments.


----------



## Exocer (Dec 15, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> Built the amp box.  No shielding or copper plate for reasons I mentioned before.  I listened to the system after unplugging the jimmy rigged setup and what a drastic difference compared to attached to the grounding mix.  I now have the ground box so it is accessible for me to further play with the mix.  I still have Tungsten, graphite (which is suppose to really kick it in high gear with Tourmaline mixes), Tourmaline powder, Tourmaline polished smaller stones coming from Aliexpress.  Currently the material weight is about 1.3 KG.  The red wire is the Neotech 12 gauge. and white is 12 gauge VH Audio OFC.  Both leads are stripped back 7", wire separated apart, Nano liquid treated and going directly into the mix.  Copper binding post has two 12ga. VH Audio copper 7" leads attached to it.  Copper binding post is just in case I want to experiment with it later or add leads for cable wraps.
> 
> Current mix in this box (which was what was in the bag before) is:
> * Black polished Tourmaline
> ...


Excellent work - I missed the part about no shielding. Here is what I’m working with now and it sounds very nice, better than the Ali canister ground solution kn the Etherregen.

Conductors are Mundorf Angelique, with gold plated copper lug from Ali. 3 wires to the lug (reusing this from a prior project). Oversized teflon tube from Ali:


----------



## cdacosta

Exocer said:


> Excellent work - I missed the part about no shielding. Here is what I’m working with now and it sounds very nice, better than the Ali canister ground solution kn the Etherregen.
> 
> Conductors are Mundorf Angelique, with gold plated copper lug from Ali. 3 wires to the lug (reusing this from a prior project). Oversized teflon tube from Ali:


Mundorf Angelique is nice wire.  Would be interesting to know what that wire sounds like with these devices.  What gauge and where did you purchase it?  Mundorf Angelique in the past was not easy to acquire.  I tried shielding and copper plates with this box.  Any shielding degraded the performance.

Curious, what is the mix you are using?


----------



## Exocer

cdacosta said:


> Mundorf Angelique is nice wire.  Would be interesting to know what that wire sounds like with these devices.  What gauge and where did you purchase it?  Mundorf Angelique in the past was not easy to acquire.  I tried shielding and copper plates with this box.  Any shielding degraded the performance.
> 
> Curious, what is the mix you are using?


Audiophonics and hificollective sell Angelique wire, along with PartsConexxion. I use it throughout the Unregulated lps I built for my server and have about 5M left over. It is 15.5awg. But I also have 18awg to play with. Will probably use the rest to rewire my mids/tweeters (18awg on the tweeter).

I will try without shielding next. Thanks for the tip!

The mix is just Tourmaline at this point. I have a bag of crushed Magnetite as well, but I cant tell if you still use it at all. I also have some quartz on-hand.


----------



## cdacosta

Exocer said:


> Audiophonics and hificollective sell Angelique wire, along with PartsConexxion. I use it throughout the Unregulated lps I built for my server and have about 5M left over. It is 15.5awg. But I also have 18awg to play with. Will probably use the rest to rewire my mids/tweeters (18awg on the tweeter).
> 
> I will try without shielding next. Thanks for the tip!
> 
> The mix is just Tourmaline at this point. I have a bag of crushed Magnetite as well, but I cant tell if you still use it at all. I also have some quartz on-hand.


Regarding the shielding, I found this out by just taking thick copper foil (what is used to line box interior) and placing it around and different part of the mix.  I was doing this while I was listening and can hear the sound stage collapse and hf roll off whenever the copper enclosed the mix.  Then tried placing the copper plate into mix with contact to the ground wire and same thing happened.  I have so far tried this with three different mixes on two components as I am building boxes for, same thing.

In my rig Tourmaline and Magnetite do "not" sound well together.  Oddly enough other minerals will mix well with either though.  Amp likes the Tourmaline mix, DAC likes Magnetite, go figure.  

I just found this out experimenting a few mins ago.  Out of curiosity I took a small sealable baggy and filled it with Magnetite.  Wondered if it would work like a Shakti Online (which have crystals in them)?  Look at pic, I placed it on top of the amp power cord connector.  Immediately Bass slam and articulation improved.  A bit more body to presentation also.  I did this while I am listening to music and the effect is immediate.  Is slightly changing over time and if works like Shakti products will take a few days to fully settle in.  Another way to further tune system.  What I have not tried is varying the amount of Magnetite and at other areas of the system.  One project at a time.


----------



## cdacosta

Ok for kicks and giggles I filled another little bag with Magnetite and placed it at the other end of the power cord.  I tried placing and removing many times to see if what I am hearing was my imagination because the effect was immediate and not subtle.  Not my imagination.  What I heard was presentation body weight did not change but the bass and sub bass slam went away.  That was the most obvious, did not listen for any period of time to try and discern any other differences because I preferred what I was hearing with just at the amp. side.  So the lesson for me here is trial and error while listening for the changes.


----------



## szore

So, my humble opinion of the tape is, I think I am happy where I am at with this...I could tinker here and there; add a strip, remove a strip...but I think I'm set...these pictures show where I put the stuff...not scientific, not pretty, and certainly ad-hoc and jury-rigged, but I'm cool with it...


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> So, my humble opinion of the tape is, I think I am happy where I am at with this...I could tinker here and there; add a strip, remove a strip...but I think I'm set...these pictures show where I put the stuff...not scientific, not pretty, and certainly ad-hoc and jury-rigged, but I'm cool with it...


LOL that is a lot of that tape being used.  Studying your picture I noticed two things.  The first is your ground box is on its side, not sure if you have it installed this way and not sure it matters, have not seen its design.  But try and de-couple the box from the surface it sits on, mine perform better when de-coupled.  The other thing is your Jot 2 can get really warm, doesn't your EQ sitting on top of it effect the heat build up of the amp?


----------



## szore (Dec 15, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> LOL that is a lot of that tape being used.  Studying your picture I noticed two things.  The first is your ground box is on its side, not sure if you have it installed this way and not sure it matters, have not seen its design.  But try and de-couple the box from the surface it sits on, mine perform better when de-coupled.  The other thing is your Jot 2 can get really warm, doesn't your EQ sitting on top of it effect the heat build up of the amp?


Yes, I ordered a grounding mat, it's on it's way...

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2O5pJDA&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


And the Jot2 is nice and toasty warm, very mild heat-wise actually, nothing at all to be worried about! Plus the Shiit crap is supposed to be stacked! Schiit stack!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> So, my humble opinion of the tape is, I think I am happy where I am at with this...I could tinker here and there; add a strip, remove a strip...but I think I'm set...these pictures show where I put the stuff...not scientific, not pretty, and certainly ad-hoc and jury-rigged, but I'm cool with it...


That is quite alot of tape.  To make sure its not having a significant negative effect is to remove the tape and see how much of a difference it makes then reapply accordingly.

This is one of the reasons why I don't use the fo.q tape and oyaide tape on any of my audio gear or cables.  Its almost impossible to find a balance between losing stage and dynamics vs noise reduction.   Its just too difficult to fine tune.  I removed it from all my cables and gear and only use it on wall outlets, plc and the fuse box.


----------



## szore (Dec 15, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> That is quite alot of tape.  To make sure its not having a significant negative effect is to remove the tape and see how much of a difference it makes then reapply accordingly.
> 
> This is one of the reasons why I don't use the fo.q tape and oyaide tape on any of my audio gear or cables.  Its almost impossible to find a balance between losing stage and dynamics vs noise reduction.   Its just too difficult to fine tune.  I removed it from all my cables and gear and only use it on wall outlets, plc and the fuse box.


Well, on the gr box and trnx I found that amount to improve bass. keeping the strips seperate increased layering. I took the tape off 4 xlr plugs, so that balances it. If I take off anymore tape it sounds dead. But to your point it is definitley an ongoing process...


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Well, on the gr box and trnx I found that amount to improve bass. keeping the strips seperate increased layering. I took the tape off 4 xlr plugs, so that balances it. If I take off anymore tape it sounds dead. But to your point it is definitley an ongoing process...


I think the ground box is ok, but the ares is super sensitive to the tape.   The ares is the most sensitive audio device I have ever had.  If you place anything on top of it, it compresses the sound, if you put fo.q or oyaide tape anywhere on it or on cables, it kills bass and dynamics.

Perhaps a good balance can be found with the tape but its easy to go overboard as it reduces noise and increases resolution while killing bass, dynamics and compressing the sound.  And the noise reduction and resolution is easy to notice the increase while the degradation to the dynamics and stage are not as noticeable while the other thing is happening.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> I think the ground box is ok, but the ares is super sensitive to the tape.   The ares is the most sensitive audio device I have ever had.  If you place anything on top of it, it compresses the sound, if you put fo.q or oyaide tape anywhere on it or on cables, it kills bass and dynamics.
> 
> Perhaps a good balance can be found with the tape but its easy to go overboard as it reduces noise and increases resolution while killing bass, dynamics and compressing the sound.  And the noise reduction and resolution is easy to notice the increase while the degradation to the dynamics and stage are not as noticeable while the other thing is happening.


Originally I had 4 strips on the ares. I took off 1, but if I take off 2 it sounds flatter...I find the 3 strips on the ares makes the sound richer...IDK...maybe I'm crazy...


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 15, 2022)

szore said:


> Originally I had 4 strips on the ares. I took off 1, but if I take off 2 it sounds flatter...I find the 3 strips on the ares makes the sound richer...IDK...maybe I'm crazy...


If what you have it set to now sounds good to your ears then thats all that matters.

I will go insane constantly adding and removing tape attempting to find that perfect balance.  Thats how I ended up going through like 5 packages of fo.q tape, so I decided not to mess with it anymore and try to reduce noise other ways.

I have a theory that once noise in injected into the audio signal, its not possible to remove or reduce it without causing degradation in the audio signal somewhere else.  So I think the best way to minimize noise in the system is before it reaches the audio signal with clean power.

The benefit of going through all those packages of tape is that I've learned to identify what resonance sounds like when reflecting off of plastic and metal which helped me immensely in modding my headphones with the tape.


----------



## DecentLevi

After another day of tinkering with the Faraday Fabric Tape, I finally got my system just where I want it. My system has reached epic new heights, and sounding absolutely magnificent. Liquid mids & treble that strikes a perfect balance of detail and resolve, and now is not fatiguing even on bright songs. Bass is palpable and as natural and deep as one could imagine.

This time I started by adding more to the bottom of 3 components on the right (Wyrd, DC LPS and DDC), which all improved things in some way. I tried a few patterns of less/more on the DDC, as well as the amp and settled on my favorite sound because every time I changed shape it changed the performance. Here I went with a square shape on top, and a "+" shape on bottom. Also per @szore 's recommendation I tried connecting tape strips for more of a true Faraday effect. On the amp I found the thin strip sounded more balanced, with a normal thickness adding brightness.





I also tried the recommendation for tape shielding around my AC outlet. After 4 different patterns from this one to only 2, then the other 2, then just 1 strip, every time this made the system sound bright and compressed, so I went with none. On other areas of my system the overall organic character and depth of everything is improved - no negative effect on dynamics or soundstage.





This is the pattern I settled on for my power conditioner. The effect was much better on these sides as opposed to on the steel, and sounded better when connecting the sides separately instead of all together. I'm assuming this one may not make any difference on the underside of it.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> After another day of tinkering with the Faraday Fabric Tape, I finally got my system just where I want it. My system has reached epic new heights, and sounding absolutely magnificent. Liquid mids & treble that strikes a perfect balance of detail and resolve, and now is not fatiguing even on bright songs. Bass is palpable and as natural and deep as one could imagine.
> 
> This time I started by adding more to the bottom of 3 components on the right (Wyrd, DC LPS and DDC), which all improved things in some way. I tried a few patterns of less/more on the DDC, as well as the amp and settled on my favorite sound because every time I changed shape it changed the performance. Here I went with a square shape on top, and a "+" shape on bottom. Also per @szore 's recommendation I tried connecting tape strips for more of a true Faraday effect. On the amp I found the thin strip sounded more balanced, with a normal thickness adding brightness.
> 
> ...


You are happy, that is what counts.  Do you leave that power conditioner on the carpet like in the pic?


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> You are happy, that is what counts.  Do you leave that power conditioner on the carpet like in the pic?


Yes, it's been there under the desk for over 3 years. Any benefits otherwise? It weighs 60lbs.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Yes, it's been there under the desk for over 3 years. Any benefits otherwise? It weighs 60lbs.


Well aside fire hazard likely performance will take a hit, mainly because of static.


----------



## parfaitelumiere

I bought one litz silver cable, I feel more result in higher frequencies, more because of the silver material than the litz structure.
However the plugs are poor quality, especially on headphone side, this is quite a problem as no high end 2.5 mono plug seem to exist (PM-1 or hifiman type)


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Yes, it's been there under the desk for over 3 years. Any benefits otherwise? It weighs 60lbs.


I ordered this grounding mat, I will clip it to the ground post on my transformer and put it under trx and gr.box...

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2KP0bLL&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## LocalMotion

My tape arrives today... 

@DecentLevi I see you took the tape off the wall plate. did you leave it on the power cable connector?

Do others still use it covering the outlet?

Any recommendation for a RFI/EMI meter from amazon? was considering trying one out since I can return it. would be interesting to take some readings before/after


----------



## dougms3

LocalMotion said:


> My tape arrives today...
> 
> @DecentLevi I see you took the tape off the wall plate. did you leave it on the power cable connector?
> 
> ...


Just a word of warning to save yourself some trouble.

Use a little bit at a time and one connection at a time.  I used some on the underside of the outlet cover but i think a few thin strips is more than enough.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> My tape arrives today...
> 
> @DecentLevi I see you took the tape off the wall plate. did you leave it on the power cable connector?
> 
> ...


https://a.co/d/glxpgsI

Cheaper options  (around  $80 ) available on Ali


----------



## LocalMotion

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://a.co/d/glxpgsI
> 
> Cheaper options  (around  $80 ) available on Ali


Since this plugs into the outlet. I take it it's reading directly from the power. How would one measure the effects of using the tape? Wouldn't you need one that reads stray/airborne?


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> My tape arrives today...
> 
> @DecentLevi I see you took the tape off the wall plate. did you leave it on the power cable connector?
> 
> ...


What Dougms3 said.  Try Power related first and then digital.  So as to not mess up the performance will take time to apply, listen, adjust amount used.  Sometimes after application of any shielding attempt it is obvious, sometime subtle, sometimes does nothing.  One area at a time, critically listen, adjust by adding or removing material, then listen again and so forth.  Otherwise you will find the next day your system sounds off and you will have no idea how to fix or tune.


----------



## LocalMotion

great advice @cdacosta thank you


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> Since this plugs into the outlet. I take it it's reading directly from the power. How would one measure the effects of using the tape? Wouldn't you need one that reads stray/airborne?


The non contact voltage tester ? 
This one should be fine for that  https://a.co/d/5hJ2Wa0


----------



## LocalMotion

Crypt Keeper said:


> The non contact voltage tester ?
> This one should be fine for that  https://a.co/d/5hJ2Wa0



No, sorry maybe not clear... the RF/EMI shielding tape that we are talking about... was curious to find a way to measure the RF/EMI around the area before and after the tape is applied.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Dec 16, 2022)

Got the Monosaudio "Eclipse" (top of the line) speaker jumpers today… Very good quality indeed …


----------



## Crypt Keeper

LocalMotion said:


> No, sorry maybe not clear... the RF/EMI shielding tape that we are talking about... was curious to find a way to measure the RF/EMI around the area before and after the tape is applied.


You can try the pen and that EMI meter... IDK any other device that can measure   "the tape effect" ...


----------



## szore

Crypt Keeper said:


> Got the Monosaudio "Eclipse" (top of the line) speaker jumpers today… Very good quality indeed …


They look awesome!


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Well aside fire hazard likely performance will take a hit, mainly because of static.


As mentioned my heavy power conditioner has been live on the carpet under the desk for over 3 years, so if any fire hazard existed, something would have already happened. Maybe I can prop it up on wood blocks if I find any to hear if any difference in sound.


LocalMotion said:


> My tape arrives today...
> 
> @DecentLevi I see you took the tape off the wall plate. did you leave it on the power cable connector?
> 
> ...


Yes I left the tape on the power connector. That is where it made the biggest difference. And this was the first place I tried with the Faraday Fabric tape, - with that and the AC power path before digital. Now everything is already set up the way I like it, and there are zero problems or qualms whatsoever. So when trying it on the wall receptacle, it didn't bring any benefit, in fact the opposite.


dougms3 said:


> Just a word of warning to save yourself some trouble.
> 
> Use a little bit at a time and one connection at a time.  I used some on the underside of the outlet cover but i think a few thin strips is more than enough.


Not sure why folks are assuming that's NOT the way I had done it. All that tape I used was carefully done over several days, and I did critical listening after each and every small change, with test tracks of multiple genres I am very familiar with, and I revised a lot of the tape patterns / amounts along the way. In all it turned into an exciting journey that brought aplomb resolution and very analog sound beyond what I could have ever hoped or expected.


cdacosta said:


> What Dougms3 said.  Try Power related first and then digital.  So as to not mess up the performance will take time to apply, listen, adjust amount used.  Sometimes after application of any shielding attempt it is obvious, sometime subtle, sometimes does nothing.  One area at a time, critically listen, adjust by adding or removing material, then listen again and so forth.  Otherwise you will find the next day your system sounds off and you will have no idea how to fix or tune.


No problems there, and sound is now consistent from day to day.


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 16, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> As mentioned my heavy power conditioner has been live on the carpet under the desk for over 3 years, so if any fire hazard existed, something would have already happened. Maybe I can prop it up on wood blocks if I find any to hear if any difference in sound.
> 
> Yes I left the tape on the power connector. That is where it made the biggest difference. And this was the first place I tried with the Faraday Fabric tape, - with that and the AC power path before digital. Now everything is already set up the way I like it, and there are zero problems or qualms whatsoever. So when trying it on the wall receptacle, it didn't bring any benefit, in fact the opposite.
> 
> ...


I think we have a different opinion on the definition of small.  I used 1/8 inch strips about 3 inches long on each side of hte inside of the wall outlet cover.

These tapes have varying effects depending on circumstances, ie intimacy of contact, proximity to electrical devices.  I'm not sure exactly how they work but I can at least assume as much that they are affecting the magnetic field of electrical devices.

As I said its difficult to gauge how much its compressing the sound because its reducing noise and making things more resolving at the same time, only when you remove it all then can you assess how much of a difference there is.  Just giving a heads up thats all because I've played with various types of these tapes and went overboard then removed all of it then reapplied more than once.  But if you are happy with it, thats all that matters.


----------



## Zaek

Guys, is it recommended to tape USB cable with the Oyaide tape or Aliexpress tape?


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Guys, is it recommended to tape USB cable with the Oyaide tape or Aliexpress tape?


I would not recommend the oyaide tape on any cables, especially signal.  Its more powerful than the aliexpress tape. 

I did not like the way it compressed the sound but it depends on the person, the noise reduction and resolution is definitely nice but I dont like compromising, thats just me.

I think its very similar to what the THX chips do, which I am not a fan of.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Guys, is it recommended to tape USB cable with the Oyaide tape or Aliexpress tape?


My recommendation is to try both separately.  But do not affix the tape, use a piece of masking tape or painters tape to temporarily keep the Oyaide or shielding tape in place.  I would try one end at the connector first.  Just know you can use too much, especially the Oyaide.


----------



## Zaek (Dec 17, 2022)

Thanks for the suggestions.
So far, I only taped (Oyaide tape) the powercords (both end) for sources (cd transport, dac, headphone amp). Love dark background without any sacrifice/loss.


----------



## cdacosta

Zaek said:


> Thanks for the suggestions.
> So far, I only taped (Oyaide tape) the powercords (both end) for sources (cd transport n dac). Love dark background without any sacrifice/loss.


For me at power cord ends like you did, was the best use for the Oyaide EMI tape.  I have the Oyaide on every power cord but one.  Only on one cable did the Oyaide hurt sonic performance.  Try one cable at a time, wrapping a 6" length around each end temporarily keeping the tape in place with masking tape and listen.  If you like what you hear permanently affix tape.


----------



## dougms3

Found another use for the tape


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Found another use for the tape


OK, I'll bite. And this does....what exactly?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> OK, I'll bite. And this does....what exactly?


Its the power wire going to the audio system in my car.

The zip lock bag has strips of copper and the faraday tape and its shielding the ECU.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Its the power wire going to the audio system in my car.
> 
> The zip lock bag has strips of copper and the faraday tape and its shielding the ECU.


Ah! I thought it was better gas mileage!


----------



## DenverW

DecentLevi said:


> After another day of tinkering with the Faraday Fabric Tape, I finally got my system just where I want it. My system has reached epic new heights, and sounding absolutely magnificent. Liquid mids & treble that strikes a perfect balance of detail and resolve, and now is not fatiguing even on bright songs. Bass is palpable and as natural and deep as one could imagine.
> 
> This time I started by adding more to the bottom of 3 components on the right (Wyrd, DC LPS and DDC), which all improved things in some way. I tried a few patterns of less/more on the DDC, as well as the amp and settled on my favorite sound because every time I changed shape it changed the performance. Here I went with a square shape on top, and a "+" shape on bottom. Also per @szore 's recommendation I tried connecting tape strips for more of a true Faraday effect. On the amp I found the thin strip sounded more balanced, with a normal thickness adding brightness.
> 
> ...


Ahhhh, your picture of the outlet plug and power cord covered with conductive tape makes my safety hackles rise!  I'm glad you didn't like it!


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 17, 2022)

szore said:


> Ah! I thought it was better gas mileage!


I'm getting a smoother idle and when the boost comes in from the turbo, its very linear and smooth.

The tape on the power line and fuse cleaned up the audio quite a bit also.

I also have extensive grounding cables in the engine bay, for anyone that questions whether this does anything.  The stock battery lasted for 8 years on this car with the ground wires.  It was still holding good voltage but started leaking so I had to replace it.

Keep in mind the car has a 1000w rms audio system.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 17, 2022)

DenverW said:


> Ahhhh, your picture of the outlet plug and power cord covered with conductive tape makes my safety hackles rise!  I'm glad you didn't like it!


The Odin Gold power cable spiral wrapped with copper foil shielding was a sure shot winner sounding the best for me (with Faraday tape only on the wall connector plug), and it actually sounded just as good if not better without being connected to the grounds, so it poses no hazard being only external. About 80% of the surface area is covered, but I liked it better into my power conditioner, not my DDC.

More experiments to come.


----------



## pashkaam

DecentLevi said:


> The Odin Gold power cable spiral wrapped with copper foil shielding was a sure shot winner sounding the best for me (with Faraday tape only on the wall connector plug), and it actually sounded just as good if not better without being connected to the grounds, so it poses no hazard being only external. About 80% of the surface area is coverad covered, but I liked it better into my power conditioner, not my DDC.
> 
> More experiments to come.


I can't keep up with all of you. All this is super interesting what you write.
If the effect of the Faraday tape is more on power cables, what will happen if the all cable is  covered with this tape?


----------



## cdacosta

Ground box update...

I now have the following components negative signal ground filtered:
* Modem/router via RJ45 negative return pin 6 (approx 3.7kg Magnetite main mineral ingredient) - Box built
* PC via USB ((approx. 3.7kg Magnetite main mineral ingredient)
* DAC via RCA analog output (approx. 3.9kg Magnetite main mineral ingredient) - working on box
* DAC via RCA digital output (approx. 3.9kg Magnetite main mineral ingredient) - working on box
* Amp RCA left and right output (approx. 2kg Tourmaline main mineral ingredient) - Box built

Yesterday added a little (probably 20g) Tungsten to amp and DAC mixes. Tungsten is very expensive so I am going to add this slowly.  Added powdered Tourmaline and more Rochelle salt to amp mix.  I am starting to understand what mineral does what.  Tricky thing is it takes 24 hours or so to really get an idea and 72 hours to fully hear the change.  I will be experimenting for awhile still, I have a decent amount of material to try.

I have done many projects throughout the years for and with industry designers.  Every one of these projects were fun and very educational.  But this ground box project is the most interesting and fun to experiment with.  Whenever the system is not changing because I am messing with ground box mixes, listening to the system is almost unbelievable.  My system has gone from sounding very good to WHAT?   

Aside some of the things I mentioned in previous posts that effect performance, the weight of the material or amount of material does also.  I think Entreq is right, the weight of the component be no more than 5x the weight of the material.  For best performance this seems about right and is a good guideline.  So a 3.4kg (7.5lbs) of material to filter a component with max weight of 37.5 lbs.  I have tested this a few times and the effect or performance is severely hindered when less material (same mix) is used.


----------



## LocalMotion (Dec 18, 2022)

Anyone have any favorite RCA cables that are not Odin? Anyone try the Cardas Clear? Or the ribbon cable?


----------



## Zaek

Saw some interesting ways of taping the Oyaide tape. 
https://oyaideshop.blogspot.com/search?q=MWA


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 18, 2022)

Now folks, after a 3rd round of Faraday Fabric Tape to my system, things are sounding downright glorious. It's liquid, robust, hard hitting, and finally drums darn close to real drums and I'm getting treble that is detailed and not fatiguing. These are the results of trial & error with less / more and different patterns - NOT just some random guess I went with. Here's my results, which for your could be different (YMMV)

Grounding box:
For the silver cable that I already fitted with with tinned copper braided shielding, I preferred copper foil shielding on the grounding box side covering the entire connector & end of cable, vs. with the silver tape which ruined the sound in several ways. On the receiving side with alligator clamp it sounded better with neither.
For silver tape on the grounding box I always heard a negative in one way or another such as added brightness, but settled with just 1 piece in the center. And the Bright Star Isonode dampening feet were a very positive move.








  Other upgrades in the back
- DC LPS cable (powering the receiving side of my Fibbr Alpha USB-optical-USB cable on the right): 1 piece of silver tape on both sides made a nice improvement! Increased depth into the scene, blacker background and even more linear FR without sacrificing dynamics!
- Odin 2 USB cable which was already fitted with partial copper foil shielding and 3 special quality ferrite clamps: a nice thick piece of silver tape on both sides yielded great results, over the copper foil.
- iFi USB iPurifier 3: wrapped with i piece of the silver tape made an instant and desirable welcome!
- iFi USB iPurifier 2: The copper tape only added brightness, so I preferred the copper foil tape. + 1 thin piece of silver tape around the center (touching the foil shield on the wire wasn't preferrable)
- underneath SS power amp: 2 large pieces of silver tape one on each side added brightness, but just 1 large one in the center gave a nice sound




I was about to call it good, but I still got further improvement with the wall jack! As recommended scaling back this time. The first one shown just made it sound thin & bright, but the final version with it closer gave a very good sound, and interestingly effects the dynamics a lot.
 * ignore the cable above, that's a foreign power strip with a country socket adapter used for my non-audio equipment







I've heard some headphone designers say before that it seems impossible to ever get a transducer to sound like real drums. While I largely agree, I would say more focus on the entire system could take one closer to that goal. A good hi-fi system is a connected organism, and too many focus only on small parts like the headphone driver or tube rolling.


----------



## DecentLevi

Also I tried the silver tape on audio (headphone and RCA) cables, and it hurt the sound like adding brightness. Seem to be better for AC/DC cables.


----------



## cdacosta

Built a pair of these ground boxes for the DAC to house the jimmy rigged versions there now.  One goes to digital out, the other to analog out.  These are Magnetite mixes and I still have to play with.  Still working on the amp mix now.  Total material weight will be about 3.7 - 4kg each.


----------



## Rolox

I'm curious if anyone here has already tried this Xsangsane pure silver bulk cable? I have a friend telling me it's much better than the fake Odin - but it's unclear what fake Odin it's been compared to. I love my Odin Gold RCA interconnects as they add dimensionality and sweetness to the sound while staying transparent, but I've heard great things about this silver cable. Anyone?

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003717690021.html?gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt


----------



## szore

All I know is my Odin cables are burned in, that lingering congestion in the mids is gone, my system sounds killer, so happy!


----------



## dougms3

Rolox said:


> I'm curious if anyone here has already tried this Xsangsane pure silver bulk cable? I have a friend telling me it's much better than the fake Odin - but it's unclear what fake Odin it's been compared to. I love my Odin Gold RCA interconnects as they add dimensionality and sweetness to the sound while staying transparent, but I've heard great things about this silver cable. Anyone?
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003717690021.html?gatewayAdapt=4itemAdapt


It looks like it has heavy shielding.  The odin cables have a thin shield.

I think this cable is better than the odin cable.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2wpMEnm&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I think results may vary depending on your environment.  For some people the shielding may not make much of a difference while it may be huge for others.


----------



## dougms3

Titanium power
supply


----------



## pashkaam

dougms3 said:


> It looks like it has heavy shielding.  The odin cables have a thin shield.
> 
> I think this cable is better than the odin cable.
> 
> ...


The ODIN cables have good thick silver shield over each wire, but it is passive, not grounded. It is interesting how the original ONE was wired, probably there were no fans to open the cable for tens of thousands of dollars.



Something happened to the sound a long time ago on ODIN 2. Not as detailed and bright as it was at the first moment


----------



## szore

Ended up taking all tape off XLR and USB cables, much improved, fuller, richer sound with better dynamics, no doubt.


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Ended up taking all tape off XLR and USB cables, much improved, fuller, richer sound with better dynamics, no doubt.


You see what i mean now?

It's difficult to gauge how much to use and where to get the precise effect you want.


----------



## dougms3

Man, that sure sucked.

Next purchase will be a new case with room to work and route cables.

I was able to shoehorn that enormous power supply into my phanteks eclipse case but it wasn't easy.

Reminds me of this lovely picture with Shaq and his wife.


----------



## dougms3

Look at the difference in the size of the cables.

The superflower modular cables are a thicker gauge wire, absolutely massive.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Look at the difference in the size of the cables.
> 
> The superflower modular cables are a thicker gauge wire, absolutely massive.


Yep the EVGA Titanium 650 P6 I purchased is made by manufacture as yours.  Same cables, but I got the 650 watt so the case is not so big.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> Ended up taking all tape off XLR and USB cables, much improved, fuller, richer sound with better dynamics, no doubt.


With those kind of tweaks it is very time consuming to get right.  Temporarily apply in one location, listen.  Adjust amount applied, listen.  Learn what the material does in "that kind" of application.  Apply in another location, listen, and so on.  Shielding aside power related is tricky.


----------



## cdacosta

Just tried adding a second ground lead from 3.4kg Magnetite just in a bag and cigar box to open PC USB port.  Have not made an enclosure/box for the PC yet.  First try was with a ALCharm 11ga. silver plated copper.  Purchased here:  https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2sfvKWC&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

ALCharm cable was absolutely horrible, inexpensive like $7.  Then tried a Amazon cable, just cut the cable and used the ground lead.  This one is silver or silver looking plating.  Sounds ehhh.  The first one I installed was also an Amazon cable but was copper.  The Amazon copper cable sounded the best by itself.  Will end up making a cable eventually but need to get my soldering station, solder and good wire from storage first.  I have JPS Labs Alumiloy and XLO Signature Reference power wire I can try.  

Anyone know of a place to buy high quality USB A male connector to make the cable?


----------



## dougms3

dougms3 said:


> Look at the difference in the size of the cables.
> 
> The superflower modular cables are a thicker gauge wire, absolutely massive.


Just a quick update on the difference with the upgraded power supply.

The music seems to have more punch and better dynamics.  A little less noise as well.  Bass hits are pummeling my ear drums with the denon d7200s.

Probably gonna need some time to burn in the power supply but a nice boost in performance thus far.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Just a quick update on the difference with the upgraded power supply.
> 
> The music seems to have more punch and better dynamics.  A little less noise as well.  Bass hits are pummeling my ear drums with the denon d7200s.
> 
> Probably gonna need some time to burn in the power supply but a nice boost in performance thus far.


So i looked it up, but what is so special about that power supply?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> So i looked it up, but what is so special about that power supply?


Much higher end components, higher quality caps and better filtration, excellent ripple suppression, high quality cabling, stable load regulation, low inrush current.

Since the PC tends to generate the most noise out of any device in the audio chain, every little thing that you do to reduce it yields significant results because its at the beginning of the chain.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Just tried adding a second ground lead from 3.4kg Magnetite just in a bag and cigar box to open PC USB port.  Have not made an enclosure/box for the PC yet.  First try was with a ALCharm 11ga. silver plated copper.  Purchased here:  https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2sfvKWC&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> ALCharm cable was absolutely horrible, inexpensive like $7.  Then tried a Amazon cable, just cut the cable and used the ground lead.  This one is silver or silver looking plating.  Sounds ehhh.  The first one I installed was also an Amazon cable but was copper.  The Amazon copper cable sounded the best by itself.  Will end up making a cable eventually but need to get my soldering station, solder and good wire from storage first.  I have JPS Labs Alumiloy and XLO Signature Reference power wire I can try.
> 
> Anyone know of a place to buy high quality USB A male connector to make the cable?


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803262313507

The "best"  connectors  I  bought on Ali...


----------



## LocalMotion (Dec 21, 2022)

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803262313507
> 
> The "best"  connectors  I  bought on Ali...


Those look like the Viborg connectors which are very good.
left off the .html on end of link

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803262313507.html


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> Those look like to Viborg connectors which are very good.
> left off the .html on end of link
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803262313507.html


Appreciate the suggestions.  The reviews on this one is not favorable.  Viborg sells one that says the contacts are Phosphor Bronze with gold plating also.  Double the price though.  Looks very similar with a design on the metal body.  Being that it is Aliexpress, no idea if it is the same with a different body or what?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Appreciate the suggestions.  The reviews on this one is not favorable.  Viborg sells one that says the contacts are Phosphor Bronze with gold plating also.  Double the price though.  Looks very similar with a design on the metal body.  Being that it is Aliexpress, no idea if it is the same with a different body or what?


I also purchased this one https://a.co/d/0HR31pk and could not tell the difference ... I think Viborg and Monosaudio are two Brands under one company…


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I also purchased this one https://a.co/d/0HR31pk and could not tell the difference ... I think Viborg and Monosaudio are two Brands under one company…


You are saying you have purchased the $8 Monosaudio and Viborg version and you think they are the same connector?  Aside the obvious design on shell?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Dec 21, 2022)

cdacosta said:


> You are saying you have purchased the $8 Monosaudio and Viborg version and you think they are the same connector?  Aside the obvious design on shell?


Yes , they were Identical  (USB A) ...


----------



## LocalMotion

Zaek said:


> Saw some interesting ways of taping the Oyaide tape.
> https://oyaideshop.blogspot.com/search?q=MWA



Going back to this. has anyone tried using the tape applied like these examples? over end of cable, but not the connector?


----------



## cdacosta

LocalMotion said:


> Going back to this. has anyone tried using the tape applied like these examples? over end of cable, but not the connector?


Yes. For power cables I liked it better over the connector.  Anywhere near signal cables, even a small 1/4” wide by 1/2” piece next to the cable shrinks the sound stage and rolls off the HF frequencies.  On digital cables “can” be effective.  YMMV


----------



## dougms3

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2PUOANC&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

Its been a while and I totally forgot about it while leaving it to burn in.  

I think this 15 core cable is better than the gold odin cable, I moved it my DI20he and theres more impactful bass, body and air in the treble.


----------



## Zaek

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2PUOANC&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> Its been a while and I totally forgot about it while leaving it to burn in.
> 
> I think this 15 core cable is better than the gold odin cable, I moved it my DI20he and theres more impactful bass, body and air in the treble.


Been eagerly waiting for this.. How does it compare to Odin Gold? 
I am a big fan of Gold because it was a tad warmer and very musical (as shared in yr initial post).


----------



## dougms3

Zaek said:


> Been eagerly waiting for this.. How does it compare to Odin Gold?
> I am a big fan of Gold because it was a tad warmer and very musical (as shared in yr initial post).


It has more body and bass than the odin gold.  Better dynamics, air, stage and depth  also.  

Perhaps I just prefer it over the gold odin in my setup.  The odin gold may be a little more resolving and allows a little less noise to come through.

The 15 core valhalla2 knockoff is definitely warmer.


----------



## szore

I use the gold between wall and transformer, then silver Odin everywhere else. I put the gold on the amp as a goof and the notes got too thick. Reminded me of the difference between a copper DAP or a SS one. Didnt like it at all and put the gold back on the wall.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> It has more body and bass than the odin gold.  Better dynamics, air, stage and depth  also.
> 
> Perhaps I just prefer it over the gold odin in my setup.  The odin gold may be a little more resolving and allows a little less noise to come through.
> 
> The 15 core valhalla2 knockoff is definitely warmer.


Inexpensive enough to try.  Different gear will react differently to this cable vs Odin Gold. Mainly because the electrical properties will be different between the two cables.   I personally like the sweeter tonality and how the Odin Gold fits within my setup.


----------



## szore

LocalMotion said:


> Going back to this. has anyone tried using the tape applied like these examples? over end of cable, but not the connector?


I did on the usb and some of the xlr but i didnt hear a difference....i thinknthe ali express tape is weaker than the Japanese stuff tho


----------



## cdacosta

Today received the Aliexpress shielding tape, 50mm x 20 yards.  This is not the same material as the Oyaide EMI tape.  The Oyaide is a lot stronger and it seems has a different use.  The Oyaide tape absorbs EMI, the Aliexpress tape is a shield.  

Cut a 6" long piece and started to place it on and under different components, including the ground boxes.  Effect is slight, but seems to dry the presentation and slightly roll off HF.  Now where it seems effective is around power cord connectors.  Right now I have it only around power cord connectors at amp and DAC and with each application (two total so far) the focus is a bit improved.  The tape is held in place with masking tape so I can remove and put back in place to hear for differences if any.  Applied like this, does not negatively effect all other aspects of performance.  What I "think" is happening is by shielding the connector, is leaking less EMI to interconnects that are close by.   In my setup there are 6 power cords.  With 6 power cords there are 12 connection points so will have to test one by one and see how that goes.

What I am curious about is if shielding video monitors near by will improve audio performance?  For anyone that is going to try this type of tweak, take it slow and apply at one connection or location at a time.  Like Doug mentioned previously, there can be a trade off where it may seem background is blacker.  But if you do not critically listen you may miss that in that application information is being masked or causing a negative effect somewhere else.  If one just starts applying on all power cord ends because in one or two locations seems to improve the system, the next day you may realize the system is off and have no idea how to fix it.  

If I find a really cool use for the tape I will mention it.  I hope and trust everyone has an amazing Christmas day and Holiday season!


----------



## cdacosta

Ok check this out... With the three power cords I have tried the Ali shielding tape on, and that will be mentioned below, all have Oyaide EMI tape wrapped around the connectors at both ends flush to the edge of the connector where the connection is.  

* At the amp is a Odin Gold power cord.  Wrapped around the whole connector at amp end is a winner, adds a little precision and resolution.  See pic.  At the PLC wrapped around the whole connector collapses the sound stage, rolls HF and masks information.  BUT if the tape is moved toward the back of the connector (toward the cable or away from component) sound stage is a tad more holographic, resolution is slightly increased and bass frequencies around 100hz and down, hits a tad tighter and harder.  Bass feels a bit quicker here.  See pic.

* At the DAC is a Electroglide Signature Reference power cord.  Covering the whole connector has the same effect as the Odin Gold at the amp side.  Have not tried Isolation PLC side yet.

* At PC (source) is a Odin 2 power cable.  Exact same as what happened with Odin Gold at PLC, except this is at the PC PS.  When fully covering connector collapses the sound stage, rolls HF and masks information.  BUT if the tape is moved toward the back of the connector (toward the cable or away from PC) resolution is slightly increased and bass frequencies around 100hz and down hits a tad tighter and harder.  Bass feels a bit quicker again.  Have not tried at isolation PLC side yet.  See pic.

Here is the point, a lot of experimentation is needed to be able to dial in a tweak like this.  Takes a lot of time.  I am going to leave this alone and see how it sounds tomorrow to make sure system settles like this before experimenting further.  So far I like this shielding tape.


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 25, 2022)

After installing the titanium power supply, I had to remove this elfidelity sata filter until today where I had a chance to rearrange things in my pc and reinstall it.

I use this to connect a samsung 870 SSD which holds all of my music files.

This thing cleans up a good amount of noise from the PC.  The sound is a little warmer without it but it is more resolving, more detail, just better clarity overall with it. 

Another thing to note is that I use DSD512 upsampling for music and occasionally, there is a pop if I skip to the next track, after reinstalling this, it doesn't happen anymore.  
If anyone is using an SSD to store their music, I highly recommend this filter.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> After installing the titanium power supply, I had to remove this elfidelity sata filter until today where I had a chance to rearrange things in my pc and reinstall it.
> 
> I use this to connect a samsung 870 SSD which holds all of my music files.
> 
> ...


I like this filter also.  Got two based on your recommendation.  Inexpensive tweak/upgrade for SSD.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I like this filter also.  Got two based on your recommendation.  Inexpensive tweak/upgrade for SSD.


I installed the fan filters, pci card power filter and this sata filter at the same time so it was impossible to tell which one offered the most improvement but after removing for about a week and reinstalling, I was able to tell the difference it was making.

I'm curious about this thing.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...00010361966705!sea&curPageLogUid=eGyzc6FCpkTJ

It looks like it does the same thing as the JCAT usb card, probably not the same level of quality as the JCAT but considering every elfidelity item I've installed in my system gave me a nice improvement, I'd bet its more than worth it for the price.  If I didn't already have a JCAT usb, I'd get this.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I installed the fan filters, pci card power filter and this sata filter at the same time so it was impossible to tell which one offered the most improvement but after removing for about a week and reinstalling, I was able to tell the difference it was making.
> 
> I'm curious about this thing.
> 
> ...


Have seen these filters.  Have considered JCAT and there is one other well known one that slips my mind.  But since I do not use USB I dropped the idea.  My headphone system sounds so good it literally blows my mind almost every time I listen to it.   Not sure how much I want to mess with it.  But if someone is interested in state of the art probably worth paying the money for a JCAT and external LPS for it.


----------



## kingoftown1

Also happily using Elfidelity filters -- the sata filter is a nice improvement even when powering my library SSD from a quality external LPS.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

The Real Odin 2 DIY .. Finally


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Real Odin 2 DIY .. Finally


Hard to tell if its the light or the actual color but it looks like its copper in the center.  

Is it copper ?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Hard to tell if its the light or the actual color but it looks like its copper in the center.
> 
> Is it copper ?


Yep, looks like copper in the center / thick layer of  silver plating around it ...


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yep, looks like copper in the center / thick layer of  silver plating around it ...


Wait a second, did you say that was the real odin 2 cable?  Not an aliexpress knockoff?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> Wait a second, did you say that was the real odin 2 cable?  Not an aliexpress knockoff?


No, I mean not the Valhalla , but the real Odin2 clone


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> Wait a second, did you say that was the real odin 2 cable?  Not an aliexpress knockoff?


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> No, I mean not the Valhalla , but the real Odin2 clone


Lol I was gonna say, if you can afford a real odin2, why are messing with aliexpress stuff.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 26, 2022)

I was curious what benefits does the Oyaide tape bring to the plate that the silver faraday tape doesn't? I mean, can one have the best sound with only the silver tape (among other things)?

I just finished another round of redoing my silver tape yesterday, and I definitely concur that on DC (and AC) cables, often just a thinner piece towards the end (at the cable connection away from the component) can make the best difference. Curtails HF glare and lets that organic character and bass heft through. I've also made another interesting upgrade that I will post about.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I was curious what benefits does the Oyaide tape bring to the plate that the silver faraday tape doesn't? I mean, can one have the best sound with only the silver tape (among other things)?
> 
> I just finished another round of redoing my silver tape yesterday, and I definitely concur that on DC (and AC) cables, often just a thinner piece towards the end (at the cable connection away from the component) can make the best difference. Curtails HF glare and lets that organic character and bass heft through. I've also made another interesting upgrade that I will post about.


Its similar to the faraday tape but its much more powerful.  It feels like it works slightly differently but I can't describe it.

You're not missing anything.  The faraday tape is easier to work with since its not as powerful and cheaper, you can experiment and use larger strips.

The only place where the oyaide tape might benefit more is in the breaker box.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 26, 2022)

One place where the faraday tape actually wasn't strong enough for me was on the outside of my iFi AC iPurifier. Interestingly this device barely did anything until I wrapped it fully with the silver faraday tape. Just one layer improved the depth of scene/realism/soundstage/details but was too bright. Covering the backside as well was way too bright. Finally after hours of trials with combinations of that and copper foil tape, I settled on 2.75 layers of silver faraday tape around mine. Two layers fully around the cylinder, and the 3rd layer covering 3/4ths of the cylinder stopping early before the back with the input hole.






I got even better sound when I tried connecting my grounding box cable to its' included grounding port - and sounded even much much better than just connecting the grounding box cable to an the grounding port of an unused AC socket. That was interesting, because both the AC iPurifier and the grounding box cable were connected to unused ports on my power conditioner. I still need another grounding box for this though because for me the best difference for the grounding box is still on my DI20 DDC.

Note: iFi products are genuine and affordable, even though not on Aliexpress


----------



## DecentLevi

This is my actual iFi AC iPurifier wrapped with 2 3/4ths layers of the silver faraday tape, took the device out for the photo. You may not see the grounding port since the cap is is covering it.

Gave my system a listen again after removing it, and suddenly the highs were more grainy and piercing, and the overall everything had a somewhat 'fake' sound compared to what I was used to, although dynamics were still good. Put it back in my power conditioner right next to pertinent source AC connections, and gave another listen. At this point I am very seriously questioning whether or not I'm still listening to the same song. The difference was that great. Now I'm getting a very lifelike acoustic experience with drums that are taut, snappy and treble is still as detailed but smoother, and overall more true to life.




And This is not the only big improvement in my system recently - more to come.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I was curious what benefits does the Oyaide tape bring to the plate that the silver faraday tape doesn't? I mean, can one have the best sound with only the silver tape (among other things)?
> 
> I just finished another round of redoing my silver tape yesterday, and I definitely concur that on DC (and AC) cables, often just a thinner piece towards the end (at the cable connection away from the component) can make the best difference. Curtails HF glare and lets that organic character and bass heft through. I've also made another interesting upgrade that I will post about.


Oyaide tape absorbs EMI, the Aliexpress tape shields against EMI and "maybe" RFI.  Oyaide tape is way more powerful and trickier to work with like Doug mentioned.  I am currently using them together.  But have not spent enough time with the shielding tape to fully form an opinion aside it is inexpensive for what it can be used for.


----------



## cdacosta

Aliexpress tape... Yesterday I placed about a 30mm wide x 6" length tape around the connector of the main power cord that feeds the system.  This connector is plugged into a Oyaide R1 at the wall.  This connector already had the Oyaide tape applied.

Because of the ground boxes in my system now the amount of information or detail that is heard, is extremely high.  At first after adding the shielding tape at this location the background was really quiet, this is the first thing I noticed.  All sounded pretty good.  Today when I got home I was listening to songs I know really well and something sounded off, but could not tell what it was.  Remembering I placed the shielding tape around the power cord connector, I took it off and there it was.  The magic is back...

What the shielding tape did was mask information, especially in the higher octaves, without rolling system off.  With the Oyaide tape it is more obvious after installation.  So care to apply this shielding tape slowly and not more than one location at a time.  Then listen to music you know well to be able to understand what the application does or does not do.   Just sharing here.  It is easy to overdue or over use this kind of tweak.


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 27, 2022)

My next major upgrade is something that just may overtake even the grounding box discovery. It's the combination of iFi Audio DC iPurifier 2 connected to a DC LPS with silver faraday tape at the end, powering the iFi SPDIF iPurifier 2, which goes out to my DAC using its' optical output. More info on the tweaks thread here.


----------



## Zaek

I did the same thing to my Ansuz Sparkz. Background seems to be blacker n can hear more details.


----------



## iFi audio

DecentLevi said:


> My next major upgrade is something that just may overtake even the grounding box discovery. It's the combination of iFi Audio DC iPurifier 2 connected to a DC LPS with silver faraday tape at the end, connected to iFi SPDIF iPurifier 2, using its' optical output. More info on the tweaks thread here.



That trick with tape is easy to do, so everyone can follow your steps. Thanks a lot for sharing!


----------



## szore

I ended up taking the tape off the grounding box and transformer, sounds a bit richer without it. Left the tape on my DAc Amp and Lokius tho. When I remove any tape off those devices the sounds gets thinner. So at this point I think I have found a nice balance.

And curiously enough, I put some way back around the XLR adapter cable coming out of the amp, and it sounds much richer and way better dynamics. I put this on and off like 5 times and it is NOT subtle, Go figure! BUT when i put it around the plug of the IEM cable its self (the silver part) the sound collapses. Just goes to prove you have to experiment!


----------



## iFi audio

Crypt Keeper said:


> Got the Monosaudio "Eclipse" (top of the line) speaker jumpers today… Very good quality indeed …



I also have to ask, that Siltech Triple Crown speaker cable, it's real, isn't it  ?


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 27, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> After installing the titanium power supply, I had to remove this elfidelity sata filter until today where I had a chance to rearrange things in my pc and reinstall it.
> 
> I use this to connect a samsung 870 SSD which holds all of my music files.
> 
> ...


I use an external HDD for a lot of my audio files, not sure if it's SSD or optical (the rest from my laptops internal hard drive), but that is via USB (which also powers it, via a powered splitter bus) so this device would probably not be compatible. Most of my darn laptops USB 3 connectors are defective, so I have to put everything including mouse, keyboard, external HDD, Etc mostly off of the same USB port on a shared bus splitter. At least I have my audio output on a separate USB connection. Any advice?


dougms3 said:


> I installed the fan filters, pci card power filter and this sata filter at the same time so it was impossible to tell which one offered the most improvement but after removing for about a week and reinstalling, I was able to tell the difference it was making.
> 
> I'm curious about this thing.
> 
> ...


Would such a device be compatible with my source system which consists of a Windows laptop and USB for external hard drive and audio output?


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I use an external HDD for a lot of my audio files, not sure if it's SSD or optical (the rest from my laptops internal hard drive), but that is via USB (which also powers it, via a piwered splitter bus) so this device would probably not be compatible. Most of my darn laptops USB 3 connectors are defective, so I have to put everything including mouse, keyboard, external HDD, Etc mostly off of the same USB port on a shared bus splitter. At least I have my audio output on a separate USB connection. Any advice?
> 
> Would such a device be compatible with my source system which consists of a Windows laptop and USB for external hard drive and audio output?


First thing is probably dont connect the hdd to the usb hub.  Its sharing power and ground with everything else thats connected to it, spreading cooties like @msing539 on a busy friday night.

Possibly could use it to work with an external usb drive but you'd have to come up with a custom enclosure to accommodate that pcb and adapters, might not be worth the trouble.  

Another option is to use it on a NAS device, its easier to make something custom or just use double sided tape to stick it to the wall or something.

Just throwing out some options.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> First thing is probably dont connect the hdd to the usb hub.  Its sharing power and ground with everything else thats connected to it, spreading cooties like @msing539 on a busy friday night.
> 
> Possibly could use it to work with an external usb drive but you'd have to come up with a custom enclosure to accommodate that pcb and adapters, might not be worth the trouble.
> 
> ...


I had the cooties once, not fun.


----------



## dougms3

In one of the other threads, someone mentioned these lan isolators.  

Has anyone tried them?  Thoughts?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/334340331704

https://www.ebay.com/itm/334340331693


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 27, 2022)

Zaek said:


> I did the same thing to my Ansuz Sparkz. Background seems to be blacker n can hear more details.


That is so awesome that we both had basically the same results with silver Faraday shielding over our removable power filter cylinders. But from what I saw, those Ansuz Sparkz cost about 12X More than the iFi AC iPurifier, is that right?!


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 28, 2022)

Folks I've just tried shielding my _VIDEO _(HDMI monitor) cable with this magic sauce silver faraday tape and I'm getting better sound. Just trying to believe what's going on around here. Maybe my place is haunted with the ghost of sound phenomenons, LOL. It must have something to do with the cable's proximity right next to the USB cable for external hard drive, which I just also shielded underneath it with probable good results too... but then again even music from the laptop sounds better with the video cable shielded. My theory is that since it's not audio cabling, it needs more... MOAR MOARRR shielding.

Thanks to recent inspiration from here.
Next is under my laptop.


----------



## simon740

Hello.

I purchased this power cable:  https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100....order_list.order_list_main.17.1ec41802Li55DQ  . One for the Exposure 3010S2D amplifier and the other for the Ares II dac. Hmm...I think it's too "dark" sounding? Maybe that's too much for Ares II...
Do you have similar experiences?

regards,
Simon


----------



## DecentLevi

I put Furutech Nano Liquid on all the connections for my new iFi DC iPurifier 2 and its' cables - now my system is sounding too bright! Bass may have gotten leaner and treble got tilted upwards too much. Should I try to remove it, or wait for burn-in or brain adjustments?

Also, still experimenting with the above non-audio cable shielding.


----------



## kingoftown1

@DecentLevi give it time...


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 28, 2022)

simon740 said:


> Hello.
> 
> I purchased this power cable:  https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100....order_list.order_list_main.17.1ec41802Li55DQ  . One for the Exposure 3010S2D amplifier and the other for the Ares II dac. Hmm...I think it's too "dark" sounding? Maybe that's too much for Ares II...
> Do you have similar experiences?
> ...


I dont think anyone has tested that cable. 

It could be that it just needs some burn in time but you're the first person to confirm purchase of that cable in this thread.

The odin2 or gold odin have been extensively tested by many people in here as a good value, whichever version it is. 

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2f6pKjA&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I also recommend this 15core valhalla knockoff, its very good as well, not as resolving as the gold odin but more body and bass.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...25yClJ2&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I think for the ares ii, the odin cables pair well with it because they tend to accentuate the treble and make things more resolving.  While the ares ii is pretty good in the lows and mids, where the ares ii is not the strongest is the higher frequencies.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> I put Furutech Nano Liquid on all the connections for my new iFi DC iPurifier 2 and its' cables - now my system is sounding too bright! Bass may have gotten leaner and treble got tilted upwards too much. Should I try to remove it, or wait for burn-in or brain adjustments?
> 
> Also, still experimenting with the above non-audio cable shielding.


I think its the tape thats making things bright.  

The furutech nano liquid should be applied before the tape.  Its maximizing the capabilities of your system by increasing surface contact with the terminations.  You may need to make adjustments with the tape.  

This is why I don't like relying on the tape too much.


----------



## simon740

dougms3 said:


> I dont think anyone has tested that cable.
> 
> It could be that it just needs some burn in time but you're the first person to confirm purchase of that cable in this thread.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this info.

regards,
Simon


----------



## LykkeligLyd

Could you please recommend me a good 4,4mm to 2 x 4 pin minixlr. It’s for a Audece 2C


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> In one of the other threads, someone mentioned these lan isolators.
> 
> Has anyone tried them?  Thoughts?
> 
> ...


I've tried  EverStar MI-300 Compact Ethernet Galvanic Isolator for Hi-Res Audio Systems | LAN Signal Noise Filter | Gigabit Data Isolator , No good ... chokes  it ...


----------



## Zaek

DecentLevi said:


> That is so awesome that we both had basically the same results with silver Faraday shielding over our removable power filter cylinders. But from what I saw, those Ansuz Sparkz cost about 12X More than the iFi AC iPurifier, is that right?!


I got it used. Around usd$130 per piece.


----------



## KT77

Crypt Keeper said:


> The Real Odin 2 DIY .. Finally


Wonderful job, Crypt Keeper,

This along with dougms3 having mentioned how the Valhalla PC compares to the Odin Gold has inspired me to buy both | here I was thinking I was finished with the whole cabling thing | yet at their prices I’ve to say why not?, it doesn’t hurt to explore | so onwards and outwards.
Thanks for keeping me interested in said items.

Happier New Year to you | your loved ones | as well as everyone here. Enjoy the 
seasons to come.
O_o scar


----------



## DenverW

Christmas has arrived, and some faraday tape was under the tree.  Time to play around with it.  I think first will be around the component end of the power cables.


----------



## KT77

dougms3 said:


> It has more body and bass than the odin gold.  Better dynamics, air, stage and depth  also.
> 
> Perhaps I just prefer it over the gold odin in my setup.  The odin gold may be a little more resolving and allows a little less noise to come through.
> 
> The 15 core valhalla2 knockoff is definitely warmer.


Hello dougms3,

I was just about to purchase a Valhalla 15 core power cord | yet missed the part about where you stated it’s warmer than the Odin Gold | where I'm looking to add more detail | sparkle | transparency | snap to the cord as used primary on the Denafrips Pontus ll, which to my ears is already on the warm side | needs a tad more openness at the very top end.

As I’ve finally broken down and bought another Odin 2 Silver, which hopefully should be here within 6-13 more days, as it shipping seems to be dragging of late, yet I’d once again like to thanks those of you whom were willing to share your insight | heartfelt opinions on these cables enough where I became more than a little bit interested to pursue some for myself.

Here’s wishing you | your loved ones all the best in the New Year | Seasons to come.
Be well | Stay safe.
🧐_o scar


----------



## DenverW

The Flux-50 seems to be at a reasonable price again on aliexpress; I just found one that was under $50 with a coupon applied.  Of all of the things this thread has lead me to try, this had the most impact on my system.  Grabbing a second for my dac (the first is on the amp end power cable).


----------



## dougms3

Got some more of these xlr caps for the aes in and out.  The aes in is just a grounding plug but the out on the DDC appears to be a shorting plug.  It should be ok since its not active unless I select it.  Build quality on these things is just excellent.  

Plugged it in and took it out a few times and the effect is immediate.  It makes the sound a little more focused with a tiny bit more body and richness, maybe also tighter?  Cleans up the sound a bit around the edges.  The noise reduction is apparent, kick drums have a little bit more kick to it.


----------



## dougms3

DenverW said:


> The Flux-50 seems to be at a reasonable price again on aliexpress; I just found one that was under $50 with a coupon applied.  Of all of the things this thread has lead me to try, this had the most impact on my system.  Grabbing a second for my dac (the first is on the amp end power cable).


Just a word of warning, sometimes more isn't necessarily better.  

The flux 50 knockoff is very dependent on where its connected.  I did not like the way it changed the sound on my audio gear, tried it on my pc, PLC and didnt like it there either.  Its currently residing on my LPS thats feeding my jcat card.


----------



## dougms3

KT77 said:


> Hello dougms3,
> 
> I was just about to purchase a Valhalla 15 core power cord | yet missed the part about where you stated it’s warmer than the Odin Gold | where I'm looking to add more detail | sparkle | transparency | snap to the cord as used primary on the Denafrips Pontus ll, which to my ears is already on the warm side | needs a tad more openness at the very top end.
> 
> ...


It is quite surprising but yeah that 15 core valhalla cable is not as resolving as the gold odin.  It does have more bass, warmth, body to it though.  

I thought it would be more resolving but it just wasnt the case for me.  I only tested it on my LPS and the audio-gd di20he though.  

Perhaps I need to experiment with it more on other devices, I really would like to try it on my dac but the limited space won't allow me to plug the monstrously inflexible 15 core cable on it.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> Got some more of these xlr caps for the aes in and out.  The aes in is just a grounding plug but the out on the DDC appears to be a shorting plug.  It should be ok since its not active unless I select it.  Build quality on these things is just excellent.
> 
> Plugged it in and took it out a few times and the effect is immediate.  It makes the sound a little more focused with a tiny bit more body and richness, maybe also tighter?  Cleans up the sound a bit around the edges.  The noise reduction is apparent, kick drums have a little bit more kick to it.


Assuming these are like the RCA caps I got which they likely are, I would speculate the way these work is by actually using poor conductors, which for mine is rhodium or brass (I have both and prefer brass on most). Probably works by absorbing stray electrons or the like.


----------



## dougms3

DecentLevi said:


> Assuming these are like the RCA caps I got which they likely are, I would speculate the way these work is by actually using poor conductors, which for mine is rhodium or brass (I have both and prefer brass on most). Probably works by absorbing stray electrons or the like.


I think its more than the connector is not exposed.  They can act like an antenna for EMI/RFI, especially if they're active all the time.

The digital connectors on my ddc and dac must have been picking up quite alot of EMI because the difference is greater than when I put the RCA and XLR caps on.


----------



## DecentLevi

dougms3 said:


> I think its the tape thats making things bright.
> 
> The furutech nano liquid should be applied before the tape.  Its maximizing the capabilities of your system by increasing surface contact with the terminations.  You may need to make adjustments with the tape.
> 
> This is why I don't like relying on the tape too much.


While I already have fair experience with the Furutech nano liquid, is it others experiences also that it tends to make things bright or even overtly clinical? I could redo the silvet tape on my system then more of this liquid and strike a balance, but most of my system already has it and it also seems as if this liquid needs frequent reapplication. Especially if it is a connection that you disconnect on a semi-frequent basis, it doesn't last more than a couple times. Even with connections that don't move, it seems to dissipate within a matter of 2 months tops maybe? This little bottle does get costly also.

One area I haven't done is all my USB connections on my non audio chain and USB bus Bridge. But the connections are so small that it may cause arcing if I'm not careful.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> I think its more than the connector is not exposed.  They can act like an antenna for EMI/RFI, especially if they're active all the time.
> 
> The digital connectors on my ddc and dac must have been picking up quite alot of EMI because the difference is greater than when I put the RCA and XLR caps on.


I have been using these caps and ones like it for more than 20 years.  In my systems and components the effect they made were barely audible.  With the fo.Q. T-102 on it like the ones in the pic there is a slight improvement if enough of the caps are used.  More then anything I used them to keep the RCA or XLR jacks from gathering dust and dirt.


----------



## dougms3 (Dec 28, 2022)

DecentLevi said:


> While I already have fair experience with the Furutech nano liquid, is it others experiences also that it tends to make things bright or even overtly clinical? I could redo the silvet tape on my system then more of this liquid and strike a balance, but most of my system already has it and it also seems as if this liquid needs frequent reapplication. Especially if it is a connection that you disconnect on a semi-frequent basis, it doesn't last more than a couple times. Even with connections that don't move, it seems to dissipate within a matter of 2 months tops maybe? This little bottle does get costly also.
> 
> One area I haven't done is all my USB connections on my non audio chain and USB bus Bridge. But the connections are so small that it may cause arcing if I'm not careful.


I dont know about clinical but its just maximizing surface contact and conductivity at the connectors.  One of the aspects I've noticed is that it does give more energy and detail to the treble but I wouldn't say bright. 

Shouldn't need to reapply unless you are constantly plugging and unplugging.  Best to use it on connections that won't be removed.

Works well on all terminations, I would say really well on usb.  (dont forget to coat the inside of the usb connector, not just the outside).

As I said, I think its best to apply the nano liquid first on all connections then fine tune with the tape.  Otherwise its going to be a nightmare to get it exactly where you want it.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> I have been using these caps and ones like it for more than 20 years.  In my systems and components the effect they made were barely audible.  With the fo.Q. T-102 on it like the ones in the pic there is a slight improvement if enough of the caps are used.  More then anything I used them to keep the RCA or XLR jacks from gathering dust and dirt.


I would agree with the rca and xlr caps but on the aes connector, it made a bigger difference.  I don't know why, I'm assuming they were picking up alot of stray EMI as I live in an apt complex.  My phone picks up at least 30 wifi broadcasts.  Maybe the digital connectors are more prone to picking up EMI?

Its definitely showing the aspects of reduced noise.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> While I already have fair experience with the Furutech nano liquid, is it others experiences also that it tends to make things bright or even overtly clinical?


Never encountered with use of Furutech Nano Liquid causing brightness or nudging system toward neutral or clinical.  There is a 72 hour or so break-in, but I suspect that is not what you are encountering.  The Nano Liquid is improving the mechanical connection by minimizing the electrical micro arcing of that connection..  This will not cause your system to be bright.  What Nano Liquid does do is allow you to hear more accurately how that component and or cable combination performs in your system.   Nano Liquid does not lose effectiveness in a few months unless you disconnect the connection a few times.

If I would to guestimate, I believe Doug is correct.  It is the over use, or where you are using the shielding tape.  Shielding whether using this tape, copper or any other material in certain areas of an audio system can cause unwanted side effects.  This is why I on more than one occasion warn of going slow and testing one location at a time and let it sit overnight, then re-evaluate.  For some odd reason it takes an audio system time to all stabilize to such tweaks in a system.  Could never explain it but it happens whenever I use such tweaks.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

KT77 said:


> Wonderful job, Crypt Keeper,
> 
> This along with dougms3 having mentioned how the Valhalla PC compares to the Odin Gold has inspired me to buy both | here I was thinking I was finished with the whole cabling thing | yet at their prices I’ve to say why not?, it doesn’t hurt to explore | so onwards and outwards.
> Thanks for keeping me interested in said items.
> ...


But you have not  tried the Dragon & Siltech triple crown yet ...  These are the best


----------



## dougms3

Crypt Keeper said:


> But you have not  tried the Dragon & Siltech triple crown yet ...  These are the best


How do they compare to the gold odin?


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Dec 29, 2022)

dougms3 said:


> How do they compare to the gold odin?


I would say , like $8 Ali cord compares to the cheap version of the Odinz … The real Odin2 , or expensive version of Odin2/ Odin2 Gold is close to the Dragon… That Siltech TC is better than Dragon … I would say with better plugs it’s 80 % of the real thing…. That’s how good the TC Cable is… Again just IMHO… Batteries not included and Ur milage may vary…

Cheap Odin2 <-- Wel<--- Expensive Odin2 <--- Dragon <---  Siltech TC


----------



## cdacosta

Here is an interesting use for the shielding tape.  After reading previously DecentLevi trying the tape around the video plugs I believe, I thought that may do something.  I have three 24" monitors that use HDMI cables.  First try was at PC.  Tried wrapping the cable connector with different width tape.  Even at one connection the sound or presentation compressed, no good.  Did not look at the video to see if anything changed.  

Tried wrapping the IEC power cable connectors at the monitors, that improved video color and separation a bit.  Ok this is good, left it.  Did nothing to audio.  Then tried wrapping the video connectors at monitors, did a bit of the same like the power cord application, again good.  Still nothing for audio.

Last I tried and this was interesting.  So how about a small 3/4" x 1" piece on top of the HDMI video connector at the PC?  The Cardas Clear Light headphone cable I am using is 8' long so I can sit on the floor and apply, remove and move the tape, while listening to see if it does anything.  I used a piece of rolled up masking tape to hold the shielding tape in place.  Listening for the last 45 mins, this is what I get... on top of one HDMI video cable presentation is a bit more snappy and tiny bit more overall precision.  But will edge the presentation a bit more toward neutral. Presentation is not bright, just a bit more top extension and toward neutral.  ---> Now with two connectors the effect was doubled the effect of just applying to one connector.  Now the presentation is getting bright.

Last attempt is 1/2" x 1/2" to replace the first 3/4" x 1".  This toned down the brightness.  Then on the other 2 HDMI connectors did the same and used masking tape to place 1/2" x 1/2" square pieces on top of the connectors.  This was the best outcome.  No brightness and system performance is a bit better than before the tape on the video connectors.  And I think the video colors are improved, go figure.  If it stays sounding like this tomorrow I will permanently affix the tape.    

So lesson for me is if the tape does something at a specific location, try different sizes and placement positions to see if an effect to the system can be adjusted or tuned?


----------



## DecentLevi (Dec 29, 2022)

Hey guys! I owe SO MUCH to you! After leaving my stereo system on for 12 hours with music running, seems the aforementioned clinical brightness is gone. Now all that's left is the same exemplary sound I had tuned it for, with the added (probable?) benefit of the Furutech Nano liquid. Seems I had done right and I don't need to take down / redo my whole system (not for the time being ). I spent a lot of hours last weekend removing and relocating the silver tape to tune my system for a sound that in un-constrained yet smooth and linear.

I also discovered that my external optical HDD sounds better than the music off my laptop's hard drive - even though it goes through a long cable and a 8-way USB hub, then its' own cable. It's been right there all along but I never bothered to compare the same song from one device to another.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> Here is an interesting use for the shielding tape.  After reading previously DecentLevi trying the tape around the video plugs I believe, I thought that may do something.  I have three 24" monitors that use HDMI cables.  First try was at PC.  Tried wrapping the cable connector with different width tape.  Even at one connection the sound or presentation compressed, no good.  Did not look at the video to see if anything changed.
> 
> Tried wrapping the IEC power cable connectors at the monitors, that improved video color and separation a bit.  Ok this is good, left it.  Did nothing to audio.  Then tried wrapping the video connectors at monitors, did a bit of the same like the power cord application, again good.  Still nothing for audio.
> 
> ...


Wow we're onto something! But for me I always think you need full circle wrap of anything, regardless of size because this is about the faraday effect. I would rather try a 1/8" circular ring than a 2X2" square on top for example, for a round power plug. Otherwise on components I try all sides top and bottom because some sides sound better than others.


----------



## kingoftown1

So what I'm sensing is that this is a safe space to say I applied 3m ab5100hf on all the ICs inside my tv a while back (and it worked)?


----------



## szore

Whoa...just wrapped a tape around the HDMI plug going into the computer...bass is deeper and punchier and there are better dynamics! Nice!


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Whoa...just wrapped a tape around the HDMI plug going into the computer...bass is deeper and punchier and there are better dynamics! Nice!


Dammit, now I'm gonna have to try that too.

Btw the tape made a huge difference in my car audio system.  I also put on the power distribution block in the trunk.


----------



## iFi audio

simon740 said:


> Hello.
> 
> I purchased this power cable:  https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100....order_list.order_list_main.17.1ec41802Li55DQ  . One for the Exposure 3010S2D amplifier and the other for the Ares II dac. Hmm...I think it's too "dark" sounding? Maybe that's too much for Ares II...
> Do you have similar experiences?
> ...



Maybe that's just me, but from what I can tell Cardas doesn't have a 5C cable or wire in their offer?


----------



## LocalMotion

I'm simplifying my setup and have several Odin2 cables I'm selling if anyone is interested. that's about half my Odin cables. I bought a lot of them  

https://www.head-fi.org/classifieds/several-aliexpress-nordost-odin2-cables.38704/


----------



## runningwitit

Does anyone use this type of switch for audio ?

This particular model (pdf) was/is 1650$$ and I bought 1 for 450 that has not arrived yet..

Thanx


----------



## runningwitit

runningwitit said:


> Does anyone use this type of switch for audio ?
> 
> This particular model (pdf) was/is 1650$$ and I bought 1 for 450 that has not arrived yet..
> 
> Thanx


Nevermind....i read each switch has its own signature. so i willjust wait to see what this unit offers soundwise.....Also ordered a cisco meraki ms220 at a superb price..CHEERS!!


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Dec 30, 2022)

These 3256803136867172  bettered the original "Oreas" https://a.co/d/dOsAVVA ...  $ 4  per  foot  "Chi-Fi"  bettered  $60 per  foot pad  ... I'm not  surprised ...


----------



## szore

The electrostatic grounding mat I ordered to put under the ground box and transformer is lost in shipping black hole... 21 days... Aliexpress...ironic name...


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> These 3256803136867172  bettered the original "Oreas" https://a.co/d/dOsAVVA ...  $ 4  per  foot  "Chi-Fi"  bettered  $60 per  foot pad  ... I'm not  surprised ...


Do you have  URL link to the footers instead of "3256803136867172"?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The electrostatic grounding mat I ordered to put under the ground box and transformer is lost in shipping black hole... 21 days... Aliexpress...ironic name...


I feel ya, I have two orders outstanding or in shipping status.  One is 25 days and the other is 28 days so far.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Do you have  URL link to the footers instead of "3256803136867172"?


I've purchased these a  while ago
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html

Similar  pads on Amazon https://a.co/d/hAzl48T


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> I've purchased these a  while ago
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html
> 
> Similar  pads on Amazon https://a.co/d/hAzl48T


These are or look like rollerball based coupling footers.  They will produce a different effect than de-coupling footers like the isoAcoustic footers.  From my past experiences with these type footers, 3 generally work better than 4 under gear.  Price is super cheap for what they are.  In my main HT system I used both coupling and de-coupling footers depending on the component.


----------



## cdacosta

Found another good or effective use of the shielding tape.  On the external case of a SMPS (switch mode power supply).  My router/modem has a large SMPS and a single 1 1/4" x 2" piece on the side of this SMPS improves timbre and sub bass extension (which is interesting) without changing tonality.  I tried larger pieces but can immediately hear tonality change and compresses sound.  

I usually use a variety of music that I know well to test for changes while testing and trying to dial in tweaks.  For this I used the following mainly.  Decent recording and a lot of different instruments...


----------



## dougms3

Can't say if it did anything to the audio but the picture quality on my monitors has noticeably improved.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Can't say if it did anything to the audio but the picture quality on my monitors has noticeably improved.


Every system so different, that is why we have to just experiment and try.  Try the shielding at the monitor connectors and power cables, works there also to improve color depth, clarity and separation.


----------



## dougms3

I recently received these Robertson audio acss interconnect cables for my audio-gd r8 > master19.

Thanks to @Stax 7 for recommending them.  They are on a new level of performance.  I was a bit skeptical about how much better they'd be than my argento xlrs but man all skepticism went out the window once I listened to it.  

Its a bit bright and harsh and is fluctuating quite a bit at the moment, no doubt it will need a good amount burn in time due to the pure silver conductors.


----------



## cdacosta

Another use for Shielding tape... DAC has two 3.7kg - 4kg ground boxes.  Previously attempts with shielding tape or copper only yielded audibly negative results.  Whether on, inside or around the boxes or cables.  With playing around with this shielding tape I realized once there is an area in the system that reacts to using this tape that changing the amount used makes a very noticeable difference audibly.  Previously when trying to see how different areas in the system reacts to the tape, I must of used too much.  In my system at the box only did the results work well.  3/16" wide x 1 1/4" length tape at the end of the ground cables.  At the DAC end or on the balanced interconnects the results are not good.  If I loop around the cable and slide the tape up and down the cable it changes a tiny bit.  But best results in this application is at the end like in the pic.  This is a tad time consuming.  Good news is since I am listening to system while applying, it is easy to hear the difference, if there is any.  

With all the electronics, cables, tweaks and AC treatments, it kind of defies belief that something this simple makes any difference.  But low and behold the tape changes the characteristics of the cable to enough of an extent I can hear it.   My suggestion would be to place the tape on cabling to figure out if there is an audible effect.  Whether it be positive or negative.  Once you know the cable is sensitive to the shielding tape, then try differing amounts of the tape, at different locations on the cable.  Key is patience and go slow.


----------



## Pingo

Crypt Keeper said:


> Cheap shop store
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3256802010722290.html


This shop seems to be closed.
And the Siltech Triple Crown no more on aliexpress


----------



## Pingo

DecentLevi said:


> My WEL Signature Solid PSS CARBON-BASED 72V DBS HIFI EU AC Audiophile Power cable 1.8M arrived today.
> From seller AUDIOSON store search for item 2251832811530567. You can request different power plug types by messaging there.
> 
> Could @Crypt Keeper or someone explain the function of the external component and the 2.5mm connector? It looks like an external battery pack and / or tester. Thanks!


@DecentLevi How do you compare this power cord to other ones you have ?

Does anyone else here have experience with the other products in the AUDIOSON store on aliexpress ? They get great reviews from buyers.


----------



## DecentLevi

DecentLevi said:


> Wrestling huge snakes all afternoon - all with their own character for sure. Some put up a fight against me flexing them or against gravity keeping all stringed together, but in the end each kept their own sound in one way or another.
> 
> The battle between these AC cables ensued:
> - 2x Odin Gold (authentic knockoff) (from Getwire store)
> ...


@Pingo Here was my quote from a few months ago, after 24 days of nonstop burn-in with the Wel Signature cable. IT SUCKS. Don't let looks deceive you. It's probably the most DURABLE and beautiful cable I've owned, but doesn't even play in the same league as Odin Gold ('genuine knockoff') with silver faraday fabric tape on either or both sides... get it if you only like looks, or like the bright / fake Ultrasone type sound signature.


----------



## DecentLevi

FOLKS I PUT SOME SILVER FARADAY FABRIC TAPE UNDER MY LAPTOP AND IT'S AN A-B-S-O-L-U-T-E GEM!!!!!!​
My system was already sounding mighty damn swanky, silky, smooth and refined from myriad dozens of recent upgrades - but NOW, it's just downright holographic. That little bit of extra clarity and dynamics are coming through that I did not know I was missing, and NOT in a fatiguing way at all (I know because I have tinnitus). Listening to some analogue-era electro, I feel like I'm inside a top class nightclub. All I did was put one big 2 X 15" piece of this amazing (and cheap!) tape width-wize straight across in the center without cutting the width, and I'm blown away, have ZERO desire to mess with this one.


----------



## DecentLevi

The above mentioned sound also has a lot of thanks to these tweaks as well, which I just completed yesterday. I shielded all of these USB cables with the silver tape as shown, and the surface of my external HDD which I liked better than underneath. Then I coated ALL USB connections with Furutech Nano Liquid. The silver tape really increased the resolution and overall experience, especially on the receiving side of the USB cable to the splitter. The nano liquid at first sounded a bit bright / clinical, but after a few hours of burn-in, sure enough it settled down as well.

On my HDMI video cable I've got one piece on both ends, with an extra 2nd piece as shown to shield it from the USB cable it touches, and another 2" piece in the middle of the cable. It may be helping the sound a bit, and it's adding some nice depth of color on my monitor too.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> The above mentioned sound also has a lot of thanks to these tweaks as well, which I just completed yesterday. I shielded all of these USB cables with the silver tape as shown, and the surface of my external HDD which I liked better than underneath. Then I coated ALL USB connections with Furutech Nano Liquid. The silver tape really increased the resolution and overall experience, especially on the receiving side of the USB cable to the splitter. The nano liquid at first sounded a bit bright / clinical, but after a few hours of burn-in, sure enough it settled down as well.
> 
> On my HDMI video cable I've got one piece on both ends, with an extra 2nd piece as shown to shield it from the USB cable it touches, and another 2" piece in the middle of the cable. It may be helping the sound a bit, and it's adding some nice depth of color on my monitor too.


I think it is cool that the tape is helping so much, it is very inexpensive.  I find I have to be very specific and use very little otherwise degrades performance.  I just tried the tape on top of and around a sealed toroidal transformer inside DAC and nope, no good.


----------



## cdacosta

For those that have tried or are using the Aucharm crystal sterling silver Nano fuse, what was the burn-in time for you?  I just popped one in the DAC.  On the website or listing says 3 days.  And what was the change you experienced after burn-in?  Thanks!

Link to fuse:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2B7KvBD&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## DecentLevi

I got a few Aucharm silver alloy fuses a few months ago, and IME I actually didn't hear any improvement after installing it (used for the AC power IEC), the one shown below. Actually things got a bit brighter and I was waiting for burn-in, it may have evened out a bit in the following three weeks but I can't be sure yet. Right now the tube amp's out for repairs and I don't have anything that uses a fuse.


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> I got a few Aucharm silver alloy fuses a few months ago, and IME I actually didn't hear any improvement after installing it (used for the AC power IEC), the one shown below. Actually things got a bit brighter and I was waiting for burn-in, it may have evened out a bit in the following three weeks but I can't be sure yet. Right now the tube amp's out for repairs and I don't have anything that uses a fuse.


The one I got looks a bit different.  There is a difference vs the glass fuse that was in the DAC.  A bit more energy and resolution in the mid to Higher frequencies.  I have used many "audiophile" fuses in the past and that are in my main system packed away.  They all have a break-in period.


----------



## kingoftown1

@cdacosta I have one of those in an HDPlex.  Don't remember any crazy swings like the SR Purples had, or a time frame but I bet a week would do it.


----------



## dougms3

I'm just glad I don't have to think about the fuses anymore because audio-gd has built in fuses which are not user replaceable.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> For those that have tried or are using the Aucharm crystal sterling silver Nano fuse, what was the burn-in time for you?  I just popped one in the DAC.  On the website or listing says 3 days.  And what was the change you experienced after burn-in?  Thanks!
> 
> Link to fuse:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2B7KvBD&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


Usually takes  7- 10 days  with this  fuse for  the burn-in...


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Usually takes  7- 10 days  with this  fuse for  the burn-in...


Cool, good to know.  Are you aware of any good 1.25" (6x32mm) 1A fuse from Aliexpress?  The ones I use to buy are $200 each now LOL.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Cool, good to know.  Are you aware of any good 1.25" (6x32mm) 1A fuse from Aliexpress?  The ones I use to buy are $200 each now LOL.


Besides the Red fuse (I own 3) I would recommend the Blue -  Gold Silver Nano Oil Immersion Fuse… I have no experience with this fuse and it’s much more expensive than the red , but it should be very good and some confirmed; it bettered the SR Orange …

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803140632693.html


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Besides the Red fuse (I own 3) I would recommend the Blue -  Gold Silver Nano Oil Immersion Fuse… I have no experience with this fuse and it’s much more expensive than the red , but it should be very good and some confirmed; it bettered the SR Orange …
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803140632693.html


I have used the SR Purple, never the orange.  They are good, worth the price is debatable.  I have not seen the blue or red Aucharm available in 6x32mm or 1.25".  Have you found them in this size?  If you have, a link would be highly appreciated.  I want to buy and try one.  So far (not burned-in yet) I like the red 5x20mm.


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> I have used the SR Purple, never the orange.  They are good, worth the price is debatable.  I have not seen the blue or red Aucharm available in 6x32mm or 1.25".  Have you found them in this size?  If you have, a link would be highly appreciated.  I want to buy and try one.  So far (not burned-in yet) I like the red 5x20mm.


yeah I'm using the reds in dac and transformer i'm happy with them...


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Jan 2, 2023)

cdacosta said:


> I have used the SR Purple, never the orange.  They are good, worth the price is debatable.  I have not seen the blue or red Aucharm available in 6x32mm or 1.25".  Have you found them in this size?  If you have, a link would be highly appreciated.  I want to buy and try one.  So far (not burned-in yet) I like the red 5x20mm.


Yeah , I like SR Purples , noticeable improvement over the Aucharm Red, but it’s $133 VS $17 …
That Blue  Gold Silver Nano Oil is available in 6mm by 32mm but not the red …


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Yeah , I like SR Purples , noticeable improvement over the Aucharm Red, but it’s $133 VS $17 …
> That Blue  Gold Silver Nano Oil is available in 6mm by 32mm but not the red …


Where I use to buy the Purple is VH Audio and they have them for $199 now.  I ordered a Aucharm white color - silver fuse silver alloy 6x32mm for like $4 with shipping.  Lets see if they are worth anything before I try the blue ones.  So far I am liking the red 5x20mm, improvement over a typical glass fuse.

Here is something interesting.  I took out the main 6x32mm fuse to look at the rating.  When I replaced the fuse, system sounded off, kind of flat.  Reversed the glass fuse and back to the way it was previously.  This means once a fuse is burned in, it becomes directional, very interesting.

One I just ordered:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2Sp67Je&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


----------



## DecentLevi

Checking on my purchase history, I actually got both the red and white mains Aucharm fuses (5x20mm) and neither benefitted the sound, just maybe adding extra treble - and I did allow for burn-in. I guess I still haven't tried the blue ones...


----------



## dougms3 (Jan 2, 2023)

DecentLevi said:


> Checking on my purchase history, I actually got both the red and white mains Aucharm fuses (5x20mm) and neither benefitted the sound, just maybe adding extra treble - and I did allow for burn-in. I guess I still haven't tried the blue ones...


Did you coat the ends with nano liquid?

Also it might benefit from flipping it, it usually sounds better one way.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Did you coat the ends with nano liquid?


Interesting you mention that.  I did, like with all connections treat the contacts and fuse with Nano Liquid.  I definitely can hear a difference with the red fuse.   Will be interesting to see if the white ones are an improvement over a glass fuse.  The white ones are so inexpensive.


----------



## dougms3

cdacosta said:


> Interesting you mention that.  I did, like with all connections treat the contacts and fuse with Nano Liquid.  I definitely can hear a difference with the red fuse.   Will be interesting to see if the white ones are an improvement over a glass fuse.  The white ones are so inexpensive.


Might as well, worth a try for $3 lol.


----------



## cdacosta

dougms3 said:


> Might as well, worth a try for $3 lol.


That is exactly what I thought.  Actually there was no thinking, just bought it.  Was $3.83 shipped.  I will let you all know if the fuse is any different then a burned in glass fuse.

My experience with “audiophile grade” fuses is that they can definitely make an appreciable difference. Or add something to the presentation you may not want.  No way to know until you try it.


----------



## DecentLevi (Jan 2, 2023)

dougms3 said:


> Did you coat the ends with nano liquid?
> 
> Also it might benefit from flipping it, it usually sounds better one way.


Yes I tried both. It could be that these fuses really are good, but some amps don't benefit from fuse rolling.


----------



## Flamex

I also heard good things about this Gustard fuse, but never tried one. This is a new product on the market:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002559074708.html

I use QSA fuses, which are awesome, but extremely expensive. I would really like to find a much cheaper alternative.

Guys, you mentioned the Furutech NCF Plug clones. I read mixed reviews about them. What is the final verdict? Worth to try?

I consider the AQ Dragon power cable clone, but read the plugs are weak. Would be clever to order it with the clone NCF plugs?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Where I use to buy the Purple is VH Audio and they have them for $199 now.  I ordered a Aucharm white color - silver fuse silver alloy 6x32mm for like $4 with shipping.  Lets see if they are worth anything before I try the blue ones.  So far I am liking the red 5x20mm, improvement over a typical glass fuse.
> 
> Here is something interesting.  I took out the main 6x32mm fuse to look at the rating.  When I replaced the fuse, system sounded off, kind of flat.  Reversed the glass fuse and back to the way it was previously.  This means once a fuse is burned in, it becomes directional, very interesting.
> 
> ...


Nice !... Yep the red one is directional as well . For me the red one gave me more air and stage (I've been using them in my DAC before the purples) It's a great fuse for the money, I have 2 in my LPS ATM...


----------



## Flamex

Dantheman said:


> Hello Everyone, Has anyone tried Ali Dragon power cord? recently I received this cord, burned it in for about 200 hours, yesterday I plug into my amp, it sounded bad, worse than any cord that I have heard, when battery was plugged in, treble was so poor, soundstage is narrow, unplugged battery, treble sounded a bit better, a bit more transparent, I think any stock PC will sound better than this cord.  Bought it from Audioson store, their service is great, since they does not offer free return, sending the cable back will be expensive.


I was told the Audioson's Dragon is different from Vipeos's.

I really would like to try the Dragon, but not sure if it is any close to a genuine Wireworld Platinum power cord.


----------



## szore

Flamex said:


> I also heard good things about this Gustard fuse, but never tried one. This is a new product on the market:
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002559074708.html
> 
> ...


Pricing​
Black $28
Blue $72
Yellow $213
Violet $711
Red $1422
Red/Black $2844
Silver $4995


----------



## Flamex

szore said:


> Pricing​
> Black $28
> Blue $72
> Yellow $213
> ...


You forgot to list the Gold one. 

Even the Black is a big upgrade compared to the stock glass fuses. Yellow is the sweet spot.


----------



## szore

Flamex said:


> You forgot to list the Gold one.
> 
> Even the Black is a big upgrade compared to the stock glass fuses. Yellow is the sweet spot.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Jan 2, 2023)

Flamex said:


> I also heard good things about this Gustard fuse, but never tried one. This is a new product on the market:
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002559074708.html
> 
> ...


The oldest Dragon I own is over 12 mo old , I did a lot of cable rolling and the plug still holds… Yes they could be better plugs , but for the price you getting very good cord…

It’s going to be difficult to find a replacement plug for the dragon cords.

Furutech NCF clone is OK for the price  but much better alternatives are available …

Have you tried comparing the Yellow / Purple QSA VS Synergistic Research Purple ?


----------



## Flamex

szore said:


>


----------



## Flamex (Jan 2, 2023)

Crypt Keeper said:


> The oldest Dragon I own is over 12 mo old , I did a lot of cable rolling and the plug still holds… Yes they could be better plugs , but for the price you getting very good cord…
> 
> It’s going to be difficult to find a replacement plug for the dragon cords.
> 
> ...


No, I didn't. I talked to many user and based on their opinions I chose QSA. QSA Yellow is on the level of SR Orange. QSA Red beats SR Purple, but much more expensive.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


>


LOL that is serious pricing for fuses.  wow


----------



## cdacosta

Flamex said:


> No, I didn't. I talked to many user and based on their opinions I chose QSA. QSA Yellow is on the level of SR Orange. QSA Red beats SR Orange, but much more expensive.


$1400 for a fuse, LOL wow, I do not think I could get or talk myself to do that.  A SR Orange can be had for about $112 at VH Audio.


----------



## Exocer

Flamex said:


> No, I didn't. I talked to many user and based on their opinions I chose QSA. QSA Yellow is on the level of SR Orange. QSA Red beats SR Purple, but much more expensive.


I have several QSA Yellow, SR Orange, SR Purple and QSA Light Violet. QSA light blue was equivalent or better to SR Orange in my system, qsa yellow and sr purple were at a similar level in my system. Yellow was a better fit in my server lps, where purple was a bit too soft. Purple was better in the DC4 that powers my usb card. Light violet transformed my DAC.


----------



## szore (Jan 2, 2023)

Flamex said:


>


Ten Grand for the gold! get outta here! ( I wish I was rich so I could try it).

"Hello. How may I help you?"
"I was wondering if you had any 5 amp, 20mm fuses?"
"Yes, we ran out but we just got some more in stock. How many do you need?"
"2 please."
"That will be $23,600 with tax. Will that be cash or credit? Do you need a bag?"
"Cash. No, I'll just put them in my pocket."


----------



## Crypt Keeper

For  the price of "blk-red" fuse, I could get Farad Super 10 with SR purple fuse... Perefect DC power for  any device...


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Exocer said:


> I have several QSA Yellow, SR Orange, SR Purple and QSA Light Violet. QSA light blue was equivalent or better to SR Orange in my system, qsa yellow and sr purple were at a similar level in my system. Yellow was a better fit in my server lps, where purple was a bit too soft. Purple was better in the DC4 that powers my usb card. Light violet transformed my DAC.


Now that makes perfect sense… Since farad guys not offering any QSA as optional upgrade below the Violet level for their PSUs… It’s SR Orange then SR Purple and QSA Violet…


----------



## dougms3

Really glad I dont have to think about fuses anymore.


----------



## cdacosta

I have spent some time evaluating or listening to the system with the Aucharm red 5x20mm fuse in DAC.  No other tweaks added since installing the fuse.  I do not think the Nano Liquid or fuse is fully settle in yet, but for the $22.60 shipped I like the fuse.  Definitely is worth the money spent.  Compared to an already burned-in glass fuse, adds a bit of coherency, a bit more sound separation, a tad more resolution and lastly timbre is improved a bit.  Overall culminating in a more "like a live experience" when listening to music or more there when watching a movie.  

There are two fuses in the Proceed DAP (NOS R2R DAC) I am using, I only replaced the internal one by power supply.  The other is a larger fuse at the IEC, a 6x32mm.  I will try the inexpensive white Aucharm when it arrives.  I may also try a SR Purple or that blue one on Aliexpress, not sure yet.  Especially after the five ground boxes added to system, the system sounds absolutely insane.  Not really sure what value to put on upgrading the last fuse.


----------



## DecentLevi (Jan 4, 2023)

Cool, any photos of your 5 grounding boxes?

Also I've taken the advice a while ago about getting my hefty power conditioner off the rug. I put a whole bunch of 2X4" wood blocks under it and the sound really improved - more 3D, lifelike and better bass texture IIRC. That was a few weeks ago already, and now out of curiosity I went ahead and placed thin/firm sorbothane sheets between the power conditioner feet and wood blocks - and I LOVE what I hear! Sound is even more 3D and coherent now!

It's only a matter of time though, until these sorbothane sheets will need a replacement as they are being squished as flat as a dime (so to speak) under a very heavy 60lbs. Would any of you have any recommendations for shock absorption feet that are rated for very heavy equipment as such and may sound good under a power conditioner? Thanks


----------



## Dandoudou

DecentLevi said:


> Would any of you have any recommendations for shock absorption feet that are rated for very heavy equipment as such and may sound good under a power conditioner?


These are for 27-30 Kg: 

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/abso...-vibration-isolation-pads-set-x4-p-12416.html

These are for 30 Kg: 

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/absorbeurs/monacor-sps50go-absorbeurs-resonance-set-x4-p-2159.html


----------



## Crypt Keeper

DecentLevi said:


> Cool, any photos of your 5 grounding boxes?
> 
> Also I've taken the advice a while ago about getting my hefty power conditioner off the rug. I put a whole bunch of wood 2X4" wood blocks under it and the sound really improved - more 3D, lifelike and better bass texture IIRC. That was a few weeks ago already, and now out of curiosity I went ahead and placed thin/firm sorbothane sheets between the power conditioner feet and wood blocks - and I LOVE what I hear! Sound is even more 3D and coherent now!
> 
> It's only a matter of time though, until these sorbothane sheets will need a replacement as they are being squished as flat as a dime (so to speak) under a very heavy 60lbs. Would any of you have any recommendations for shock absorption feet that are rated for very heavy equipment as such and may sound good under a power conditioner? Thanks


So far these https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html (steel Beads, aluminum ) bettered the “Oreas” under my DAC and Isolation transformer … I have more on it's way...


----------



## ku1185 (Jan 4, 2023)

Wish I found this thread sooner. I was in isolation with COVID for much of December and dealing with similar things concurrently in this thread: putting ferrite clamps on basically everything on my computer but the audio chain itself (especially video cables; What why video cables so noisy?), ordering power cables from AliExpress, etc. I was going to return the Furutech power cable clone I got for the r2r-11mk2, but saw a post here about using it for the computer and I gotta say that I am unexpectedly pleased with the results (position of the ferrite ring thingy seems to matter, even though I had clamps on my older cable). Now I'm thinking about upgrading my PSU to something more efficient, though it was upgraded only 2 years ago (got whatever sufficiently powerful cheapo PSU I could find during the COVID craze).

Anyway, some of the things I discovered in my isolation madness:

unplugging my headset into the 3.5mm ports reduces noise,
ferrites on video cables and my keyboard cable reduces noise,
using the front panel USB ports w/ a powered USB 2.0 hub sounds cleaner than using any of the rear USB ports,
got one of those Faraday fabrics and draped it over my computer which seemed to help (though distance from amp/dac makes more of a difference).
All of this because I noticed some harshness and glare with the r2r-11mk2 while I was in between amps: initially, hardly any glare noticed when connected to Soloist 3xp, then issues after selling the 3xp, then stopped noticing glare when I had the Piety, and then glare after selling Piety. With this suspicion, I connected my El Amp II and voila, less glare. This led me to think I had some EMI/RFI and started messing with ferrite clamps and whatnot. I got those RCA plugs to cover the RCA ports on the r2r-11mk2 but they don't seem to help as much as connecting it to an amp via RCA, even if that amp is not powered or plugged into anything else.

Anyway, I just ordered me some faraday tape to play with (and will use it to better fashion the faraday fabric to fend off fraying).

I'd like to solicit some advice though: I'm still looking for a new power cable. Currently using the Pangea AC14 which leans warm but tends to emphasize any glare that might be present. I didn't like the Furutech clone because it sounds a little bit colder and thinner, though it seems to improve clarity, definition, separation, and transients. I'm actually fan of the generic power cable the r2r-11mk2 came with, but would prefer slightly cleaner and smoother sound (generic cable is slightly grainy). Any recommendations?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Cool, any photos of your 5 grounding boxes?
> 
> Also I've taken the advice a while ago about getting my hefty power conditioner off the rug. I put a whole bunch of 2X4" wood blocks under it and the sound really improved - more 3D, lifelike and better bass texture IIRC. That was a few weeks ago already, and now out of curiosity I went ahead and placed thin/firm sorbothane sheets between the power conditioner feet and wood blocks - and I LOVE what I hear! Sound is even more 3D and coherent now!
> 
> It's only a matter of time though, until these sorbothane sheets will need a replacement as they are being squished as flat as a dime (so to speak) under a very heavy 60lbs. Would any of you have any recommendations for shock absorption feet that are rated for very heavy equipment as such and may sound good under a power conditioner? Thanks


I posted pics after I built some of the ground boxes.  I can take pics of some later installed. I am still building two more to experiment daisy chaining with.  

Footers require experimenting.  If you like what the sorbathane material does try sorbathane based footers.  If you are looking for budget route I really liked the footers I mentioned previously from Amazon. They were probably 95% of what the IsoAcoustic footers offered.  They sell bigger versions that support 20lbs+ a footer IIRC.  I am at work, can check later if you like.


----------



## DecentLevi

cdacosta said:


> I posted pics after I built some of the ground boxes.  I can take pics of some later installed. I am still building two more to experiment daisy chaining with.
> 
> Footers require experimenting.  If you like what the sorbathane material does try sorbathane based footers.  If you are looking for budget route I really liked the footers I mentioned previously from Amazon. They were probably 95% of what the IsoAcoustic footers offered.  They sell bigger versions that support 20lbs+ a footer IIRC.  I am at work, can check later if you like.


Please let me know the model number and name, and I can search for the bigger ones.



Crypt Keeper said:


> So far these https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html (steel Beads, aluminum ) bettered the “Oreas” under my DAC and Isolation transformer … I have more on it's way...


Nice looking. It seems they have options for either aluminum or steel for the body, and steal ball or ceramic bead for inside (the former cheaper). Which type did you get?


----------



## cdacosta

DecentLevi said:


> Please let me know the model number and name, and I can search for the bigger ones.


In the pic are the two ground boxes used with the DAC.  Both have the footers, but the ones you need will be the bigger ones.  There are different sizes, in the pic are .75" diameter footers.  For 50lb to 100lb components you need the 2.5" diameter footers.  See link.

I was going to IsoAcoustic mini pucks with the boxes because they made a appreciable sonic performance difference under the boxes.  Knowing I was likely going to make many ground boxes I experimented with a few different footers.  The footers in the link are about 95% of the performance of the IsoAcoustic footers when I compared them.  The Amazon silicon footers do tighten and deepen bass a bit more than the IsoAcoustic footers. 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B079SV39KW?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1


----------



## cdacosta

@ DecentLevi read the description after selecting the different sizes.  I just noticed the 2" diameter ones that are $19.95 for 4 also support 50lb - 100lb components.


----------



## cdacosta

@ DecentLevi I have tried these also from AliExpress:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2vjdAZv&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

They come in two sizes. I have the smaller ones under the Balanced Power Isolation transformers.  The smaller ones perform almost identical to the IsoAcoustics Mini Pucks but are 1/2 the price.  I have not tried the larger ones.  

Keep this in mind, the Sorbothane, Silicon Amazon footers, IsoAcoustic footers and the ones above are decoupling footers.  There is also coupling footers like the ones Crypt Keeper mentioned.  With your application and component one type will work better than the other.  If I venture a guess, decoupling probably will work best, but you have to try to know.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Jan 5, 2023)

DecentLevi said:


> Please let me know the model number and name, and I can search for the bigger ones.
> 
> 
> Nice looking. It seems they have options for either aluminum or steel for the body, and steal ball or ceramic bead for inside (the former cheaper). Which type did you get?


I got : steel beads, aluminum body a while ago, but going to re-order steel body steel beads again soon.... There are similar products available on Amazon, but unfortunately it's cheaper version (they have smaller beads ) I’m using the Amazon version as well, but would prefer this “Hi C Version” ...


----------



## ejk1

I ordered these yesterday

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2PQ8B37&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

. And I also use these

https://www.amazon.com/VIBRAPODS-Mo...qid=1672932533&sprefix=vibrapod,aps,75&sr=8-1


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Jan 5, 2023)

cdacosta said:


> @ DecentLevi I have tried these also from AliExpress:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2vjdAZv&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> They come in two sizes. I have the smaller ones under the Balanced Power Isolation transformers.  The smaller ones perform almost identical to the IsoAcoustics Mini Pucks but are 1/2 the price.  I have not tried the larger ones.
> ...



https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802855239096.html

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804184918465.html

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804142583137.htm

What do you think  ?
Thanks


----------



## Rick_B

The round footers with the three balls and the similar ones that use a single ball are riffs on Finite Elemente designs:
https://www.finite-elemente.eu/en/cera/

I have a set of the single ball ones with ceramic balls under my Audible Illusions Mod3A preamp:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256801657950241.html
I've also used the stud mounts on them to put on Aurender music servers and a Pathos Classic integrated amp for a friend.

I also have a set of the stainless steel w/ceramic ball ones under my McIntosh MC240:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html

These:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804184918465.html 
are ripoffs of Stillpoints footers:
https://www.stillpoints.us/product/ultra-6-v2/
Even at Ali prices these are too rich for my blood...


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802855239096.html
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804184918465.html
> 
> ...


Well, first link is to a decoupling footer, the other two are coupling footers.  Throughout the years I have used many different kind of footers including ones from Symposium Audio, Stillpoints, Vibrapods, and many more I cannot think of right now.  Many DIY variants also.  Like I mentioned previously, the component you are using footers on are going to perform better or differently with a coupling or decoupling scheme.  For components I generally favor decoupling and minimizing vibration.  As an alternative, exotic wood can also be used as footers or for tuning resonant frequency or frequencies of the chassis of a component.  With exotic wood tuning, you would be doing the same thing that instrument makers/designers are doing for instruments.  This works, but a lot of experimentation is required to dial in or to tune a system with exotic wood.  The third footer link is attempting to do this.  But in my systems I have never liked rosewood for coupling, sounds off to me.  If you are looking to add a bit more warmth in the midrange and overall presentation look at Purple Heart wood and Gaboon Ebony wood (older and darker the better) for HF or upper frequency attenuation and precision. 

As Rick_B mentioned or alluded to, most of the Aliexpress footers are knock off designs.  Which is fine, but there is no way to know what "you" would prefer until you try them in your system and gear.  As a matter of fact, one footer can sound meh on one component and very good on a different component.  If one can afford it, it is always handy to have an assortment of different kind of footers to try when dialing in a system.  AliExpress does make it easier since pricing is generally so low.  This is a long winded way of saying it is impossible to know how any "one" footer will perform for a specific application until the footer is used in that application.  Then there is personal taste in music/sound reproduction...

If you do try any of the Aliexpress knock off footers, let us know what you think of them or what they did or did not do in a specific application.


----------



## cdacosta

ejk1 said:


> I ordered these yesterday
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2PQ8B37&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> ...


Try them both under the same component and that will tell you on that component if coupling or decoupling footers work best.  Then with the one that you prefer, try 3 and 4 footers under the component.  Also try placing the footers in different locations under the component.  All should yield different results.


----------



## Rick_B

Here's another Stillpoints riff:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804184890191.html


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Jan 5, 2023)

cdacosta said:


> Well, first link is to a decoupling footer, the other two are coupling footers.  Throughout the years I have used many different kind of footers including ones from Symposium Audio, Stillpoints, Vibrapods, and many more I cannot think of right now.  Many DIY variants also.  Like I mentioned previously, the component you are using footers on are going to perform better or differently with a coupling or decoupling scheme.  For components I generally favor decoupling and minimizing vibration.  As an alternative, exotic wood can also be used as footers or for tuning resonant frequency or frequencies of the chassis of a component.  With exotic wood tuning, you would be doing the same thing that instrument makers/designers are doing for instruments.  This works, but a lot of experimentation is required to dial in or to tune a system with exotic wood.  The third footer link is attempting to do this.  But in my systems I have never liked rosewood for coupling, sounds off to me.  If you are looking to add a bit more warmth in the midrange and overall presentation look at Purple Heart wood and Gaboon Ebony wood (older and darker the better) for HF or upper frequency attenuation and precision.
> 
> As Rick_B mentioned or alluded to, most of the Aliexpress footers are knock off designs.  Which is fine, but there is no way to know what "you" would prefer until you try them in your system and gear.  As a matter of fact, one footer can sound meh on one component and very good on a different component.  If one can afford it, it is always handy to have an assortment of different kind of footers to try when dialing in a system.  AliExpress does make it easier since pricing is generally so low.  This is a long winded way of saying it is impossible to know how any "one" footer will perform for a specific application until the footer is used in that application.  Then there is personal taste in music/sound reproduction...
> 
> If you do try any of the Aliexpress knock off footers, let us know what you think of them or what they did or did not do in a specific application.


So far,  these https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803029524750.html been under my Master clock for  a few month now  and I think they work really well ...

edt: and these https://a.co/d/d2hyy4I under my heavy speakers are great for  the money...


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> So far,  these https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803029524750.html been under my Master clock for  a few month now  and I think they work really well ...


Stillpoint copies.  If they work well, they are inexpensive compared to the ones Stillpoint sells.


----------



## szore

Wow, this thread really took off! I came in on page 8 and we are at page 170 now!


----------



## szore

@cdacosta  I read several times you described how to take off the power cables and add the nano liquid, but I cannot find those posts!


----------



## DecentLevi

Crypt Keeper said:


> So far these https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832725412366.html (steel Beads, aluminum ) bettered the “Oreas” under my DAC and Isolation transformer … I have more on it's way...





cdacosta said:


> In the pic are the two ground boxes used with the DAC.  Both have the footers, but the ones you need will be the bigger ones.  There are different sizes, in the pic are .75" diameter footers.  For 50lb to 100lb components you need the 2.5" diameter footers.  See link.
> 
> I was going to IsoAcoustic mini pucks with the boxes because they made a appreciable sonic performance difference under the boxes.  Knowing I was likely going to make many ground boxes I experimented with a few different footers.  The footers in the link are about 95% of the performance of the IsoAcoustic footers when I compared them.  The Amazon silicon footers do tighten and deepen bass a bit more than the IsoAcoustic footers.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B079SV39KW?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1





cdacosta said:


> @ DecentLevi I have tried these also from AliExpress:
> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...2vjdAZv&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> They come in two sizes. I have the smaller ones under the Balanced Power Isolation transformers.  The smaller ones perform almost identical to the IsoAcoustics Mini Pucks but are 1/2 the price.  I have not tried the larger ones.
> ...


I've ordered all 3 of these. The HiFi Audio Speaker Stand Foot Pad Anti-shock Absorber Spike Isolation Feet with balls, stepped cone shape Audio Speaker Preamp DAC Laptop Anti-shock HiFi Absorber Silica Gel Foot, and Amazon Platinum Silicone Speaker Isolation Pads. If you get the Spike isolation feet with marble ball bearing, the seller said the steel balls are included free of charge.

Just realized I could've just used a larger piece of my 70 duro sorbothane sheets that already sound good, directly under my power conditioner without its' included hard feet so they won't get squished - but thought I'd get a few of these to experiment with current and future components. Currently my DAC and my USB cleaner and reclockers are benefitting from cut-out pieces of sorbothane sheets.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> @cdacosta  I read several times you described how to take off the power cables and add the nano liquid, but I cannot find those posts!


Taking off the connectors is easy.  

1) Disconnect the cable from power source and component.  
2) There are two screws on the front of the connector (where the connections are).  Loosen the screws and the connector housing slides off.  Might be a tight fit, if so jiggle it slowly until it slides off.  Loosen   
3) Clean connections and wire conductors with isopropyl alcohol.  
4) Then apply "a very light coat" to the contacts and conductors.  
5) Reassemble that plug.
6) Do the same to the other end of the cable.

TIP: Use the inside of the bottle to squeeze the liquid off the brush so there is not a lot of excess Nano Liquid on the brush.  This way you will be able to apply a light coat.


----------



## cdacosta

@szore

If you have Furutech Nano Liquid you can and should apply the Nano Liquid to "all" electrical mechanical connections.  The more connections you apply the Nano Liquid the more profound the difference the Nano Liquid makes.  I have even treated every connection in the PC, aside the CPU.  Just treating the SATA HDD connection and power connector would surprise you the difference it makes.


----------



## dougms3 (Jan 5, 2023)

cdacosta said:


> @szore
> 
> If you have Furutech Nano Liquid you can and should apply the Nano Liquid to "all" electrical mechanical connections.  The more connections you apply the Nano Liquid the more profound the difference the Nano Liquid makes.  I have even treated every connection in the PC, aside the CPU.  Just treating the SATA HDD connection and power connector would surprise you the difference it makes.


I second the sata cable treatment.  If you store your music files on a non nvme SSD, it makes a very noticeable difference when coating the sata cable with nano liquid.

I put in on the pins of the microSD card in my phone too.  Edit : also on the microsd card on my DAP.


----------



## cdacosta

I have had enough time with the DIY ground boxes now to form a reasonable opinion on "passive signal ground filtering".  I have been waiting over a month for graphite and other minerals from AliExpress.  So full formulation mixes are still in the works.  I currently have 5 ground boxes ranging from 3kg - 4kg:
- Jotunheim 2 amp has a 3kg box and still waiting for more material
- Proceed DAP DAC has two 3.7kg+ boxes and still waiting for graphite to experiment more
- Motorola Router/Modem and PC each have one 3.7+kg box each and still waiting for graphite to experiment more 

The performance upgrade these 5 boxes has added to my headphone based system is nothing short of stunning.  That is why I just started building 2 more ground boxes that I want to try on AC power, and daisy chaining existing boxes to see what that does.  The most profound performance change was to the DAC, then amp, then Router/Modem, and least performance upgrade was to the PC.  Eventually will address the Router/Modem and PC ground cable, this is where I think needs addressing to see the full potential.  Seems illogical but the cable and connection make a huge difference with how these ground boxes perform.

I have read many explanations of how these ground boxes work or what they are doing.  I can not come up with any way to test any theories, just what I do or do not hear.  What I am about to describe is based on good to very good recordings.  The better the recording, the more profound the descriptions below.  What I am hearing is:

* Much more information on all sounds.  The resolution increase is *massive*, it did and still does surprise me.
* Separation of all sounds is much improved within the sound stage
* If using high grade stranded copper, tonality of system does not change.  Exception is tonality of system can be changed by the mix of material.
* Vocals are so detailed and liquid, more natural and "feel" realistic.  If I was watching a performance, I can feel the passion from the performers, super cool.
* Instruments sound live, the decay of notes are impressive. 
* A feel of more precision and being able to feel the passion from the performers like I did not always feel before. 
* I have never heard this much definition or resolution and decay in bass and sub bass notes.  This is in any serious system I have listened to in the last 25+ years.

Hearing multiple instruments with increased resolution, separation and the extra air with a more pinpoint sound stage just draws me in the performance.  Now throw in 3 separate singers, hear it all clearly delineated with improved micro and macro dynamics just keeps this stupid smile on my face.   What I am trying to convey is the difference "passive signal ground filtering" can make is *HUGE*.  I am glad that DIY is the route I went, taught me a lot about this.  Buying a pre-made unit would have been cheaper for me because of the time I have spent experimenting.  But being able to tune for specific component would not be possible and would not have learned what effects performance.  By the way, when I mention that the change can be huge, I am referring to performance gains many multiples of say a cable "upgrade".  For the amp the performance gain is so far (because I am still working on this) 3-4x a good cable upgrade.  For the DAC is like 15x a good cable upgrade!  For the Router/Modem and PC so far is approx. 1.5-2x.  I still have a lot of work and experimentation to do with ground cabling and mixes for Router/Modem and PC.  I am waiting for the Aliexpress order.

So what do I think these devices are actually doing?  Well there is no AC power, it is a passive device.  Does not transfer any signals within the system.  Within my system, only input analog, output analog or digital input/output ground signals are attached to these devices.  It seems obvious from what I hear that the analog or digital data signal is purer.  The devices are removing electrical noise that was masking the original signal from source.  How is the device doing this exactly is the mystery.  Is the magnetic material in the ground boxes allowing for a path of least resistance for the electric noise to travel to?  Hence leaving a purer signal within the signal chain?  I can, and would not be surprised if retail manufacturers of such devices are guessing at how these devices work.  What I do know is they work for me.

The disclosure... YMMV if you try one or several ground boxes.  This long winded sharing of my experience so far with these devices are a PSA.  There are several variables that effect the performance.  Looking at the cables, connections and just how they are being used, tells me that it is very easy to not get the full potential from these type of devices.


----------



## kenincalgary

Thanks for sharing your results cdacosta. You may already do this but I got a "next level" upgrade by putting the boxes on good footers like the 3-ball knockoffs that are mentioned in this forum. I don't understand why, but won't argue with the results.


----------



## cdacosta

kenincalgary said:


> Thanks for sharing your results cdacosta. You may already do this but I got a "next level" upgrade by putting the boxes on good footers like the 3-ball knockoffs that are mentioned in this forum. I don't understand why, but won't argue with the results.


I have found the ground boxes are sensitive to vibration and does effect performance.  I have tried coupling and decoupling the enclosures to the surface it is on.  With the enclosures I built, decoupling yields best performance.  IsoAcoustics Mini pucks work well.  Found a very inexpensive alternative that yields about a 95% performance of the IsoAcoustics Mini pucks for about $1 piece on Amazon.  Although for the bass frequencies I slightly prefer the Amazon footers to the IsoAcoustic Mini pucks.  The footers can be seen on the boxes in the pic that are attached to DAC.  Here is the link to the footers on Amazon, they are the .75" diameter ones:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075KK8WXM?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Do appreciate the sharing though!  I am open to any suggestions, I feel this project is worth the effort.


----------



## szore

dougms3 said:


> I second the sata cable treatment.  If you store your music files on a non nvme SSD, it makes a very noticeable difference when coating the sata cable with nano liquid.
> 
> I put in on the pins of the microSD card in my phone too.  Edit : also on the microsd card on my DAP.


Do you let it dry first after applying it, or do you just plug it in when still wet?


----------



## dougms3

szore said:


> Do you let it dry first after applying it, or do you just plug it in when still wet?


Still wet, it doesn't dry lol.  Or it will take a very long time since its oil.


----------



## kingoftown1

@szore my practice is to try to apply it as lightly as possible, and if i see any of the liquid pooling anywhere on the connector I'll go over very lightly with a q-tip to remove excess.


----------



## Flamex

Is there any good budget cable cooker / burner out there?

I am aware of the Frycorder and Frybaby, Audiodharma is much better, but very expensive.

There are so many Schumann Wave Generators on Ali, but haven't found any cable burner.


----------



## kingoftown1

Flamex said:


> Is there any good budget cable cooker / burner out there?
> 
> I am aware of the Frycorder and Frybaby, Audiodharma is much better, but very expensive.
> 
> There are so many Schumann Wave Generators on Ali, but haven't found any cable burner.


If you're up for diy, this could be a good starting point
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/cable-cooker.292978/


----------



## szore

General question: I put my grounding box on the ground pin on the transformer, so that essentially puts the box on the ground of all my desktop components plugged into the transformer...Is that the same as putting individual boxes on each ground in the system? Isn't sepreate boxes on each component over kill in my situation?


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> General question: I put my grounding box on the ground pin on the transformer, so that essentially puts the box on the ground of all my desktop components plugged into the transformer...Is that the same as putting individual boxes on each ground in the system? Isn't sepreate boxes on each component over kill in my situation?


From my experience so far, no to both questions. I am at work and busy so can give you a bit more insight as to why later. Have you tried attaching your box to signal ground on source or DAC yet vs AC power?  Also what is the termination of the lead coming from ground box?


----------



## szore

cdacosta said:


> From my experience so far, no to both questions. I am at work and busy so can give you a bit more insight as to why later. Have you tried attaching your box to signal ground on source or DAC yet vs AC power?  Also what is the termination of the lead coming from ground box?


The lead is a bannana plug. All i did was plug into transformer.


----------



## Crypt Keeper (Saturday at 4:40 PM)

szore said:


> General question: I put my grounding box on the ground pin on the transformer, so that essentially puts the box on the ground of all my desktop components plugged into the transformer...Is that the same as putting individual boxes on each ground in the system? Isn't sepreate boxes on each component over kill in my situation?


As far as I know for  best possible result it's better to ground it both ways: at power distribution / source and then each individual component to it's own box ... ATM I'm grounding my DAC at RCA output on both channels (L/R) to 2 individual boxes, this is DAC specific , but I think it bettered grounding my DAC at digital input (AES or Coax) though it takes 2 boxes now  for 1 component  ...


----------



## cdacosta

Since I have not tried it yet on power ground I am not sure the effect vs signal ground filtering.  I do know the ground box was designed originally by Entreq as a signal ground filtering device. And in my system it works fantastic on signal ground.  

On my DAC, I do use two separate ground boxes, one box for digital output and one box for analog output. Both connections at DAC are RCA.  Filtering the digital and analog works better than either by itself. Second best is analog by itself.


----------



## DecentLevi (Saturday at 8:28 PM)

Incoming today were my 2.5" Platinum Silicone Speaker Isolation Pads from Amazon, that were recommended here





These things are big enough for anything, about as big as dinosaur eggs (I should know, I was there, LOL). Gave it a critical listen after putting them under my large central power conditioner. For me, this was a no-go as it's just brighter (obscured bass and boosted treble) and not as lifelike perhaps. I put back my former cut-out pieces of 70 duro (very hard) and thin sorbothane sheets: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B019GBMG14 and presto! The good sound was back and more neutral.

Luckily these did improve the sound under the large solid state integrated amp I'm currently using! This bested the previous combination of a much smaller size of basically the same rubber feet+ thicker & softer sorbothane sheet under it. Now I'm getting a slightly more well rounded sound with even better sense of air.


----------



## cdacosta

szore said:


> The lead is a bannana plug. All i did was plug into transformer.


IIRC the box you have has a fixed lead.  Do you have Teflon plumbers tape on hand?   This is no way optimal but will work just to see the outcome.


DecentLevi said:


> Incoming today were my 2.5" Platinum Silicone Speaker Isolation Pads from Amazon, that were recommended here
> 
> 
> These things are big enough for anything, about as big as dinosaur eggs (I should know, I was there, LOL). Gave it a critical listen after putting them under my large central power conditioner. For me, this was a no-go as it's just brighter (obscured bass and boosted treble) and not as lifelike perhaps. I put back my former cut-out pieces of 70 duro (very hard) and thin sorbothane sheets: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B019GBMG14 and presto! The good sound was back and more neutral.
> ...


yep, like I mentioned, one has to try any footer in that application to know.  Also try moving the footers to see if there is an effect. Sometimes an improvement can be had by supporting different locations under your component.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Since I have not tried it yet on power ground I am not sure the effect vs signal ground filtering.  I do know the ground box was designed originally by Entreq as a signal ground filtering device. And in my system it works fantastic on signal ground.
> 
> On my DAC, I do use two separate ground boxes, one box for digital output and one box for analog output. Both connections at DAC are RCA.  Filtering the digital and analog works better than either by itself. Second best is analog by itself.


Just did 3 boxes on my DAC.... WOW it works even better ! Thanks man !


----------



## cdacosta

@szore LOL I typed that earlier and never finished. Busy at work.   What I was trying to say is try the banana Teflon taped to the outside or to negative of a RCA on your DDC or DAC and see if the ground box works better in your system filtering signal ground.  Not optimal or even decent connection but this will tell you if you should put filtering there.


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Just did 3 boxes on my DAC.... WOW it works even better ! Thanks man !


My pleasure bro!  I have been spending so much time with this project the last month. Really enjoying the fruits of the labor and the journey.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> My pleasure bro!  I have been spending so much time with this project the last month. Really enjoying the fruits of the labor and the journey.


That's  it ..I just ordered empty boxes on Amazon.... Was about to wait , but no mo' need more boxes ASAP


----------



## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> That's  it ..I just ordered empty boxes on Amazon.... Was about to wait , but no mo' need more boxes ASAP


LOL I will have seven soon.  By the way, if you read the Entreq owners manual, they recommend that the enclosures be at least 10mm to 20mm apart from each other.  They are right, sounds better 20mm+ apart. 

Since the distance apart makes a difference, how does Entreq place multiple units in one enclosure so close together?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> LOL I will have seven soon.  By the way, if you read the Entreq owners manual, they recommend that the enclosures be at least 10mm to 20mm apart from each other.  They are right, sounds better 20mm+ apart.
> 
> Since the distance apart makes a difference, how does Entreq place multiple units in one enclosure so close together?


I guess that's why they strongly recommend 1 unit per box only , though their boxes have multiple terminals ...
Or maybe they use these:





 🤣


----------



## Ufanco

Just started reading about the grounding box and was wonder what’s the difference is between using a grounding device vs the AC line that’s already grounded in the earth?


----------



## szore

Ufanco said:


> Just started reading about the grounding box and was wonder what’s the difference is between using a grounding device vs the AC line that’s already grounded in the earth?


The prevailing theory is that it grounds out free electrons, hence lowering the noise floor. I think.


----------



## dougms3

I got these in today.

What is the purpose of the screw in pieces on the top?


----------



## kenincalgary

They should screw into your speaker base.


----------



## dougms3

kenincalgary said:


> They should screw into your speaker base.


Ok i was just gonna use these as a base for my dac or ddc.


----------



## Dandoudou (Monday at 4:49 PM)

I saw that many of you are happy with power cables from Ali.
I'm willing to try good power cables from Ali.
Which models will you advise me to order?


----------



## kenincalgary

dougms3 said:


> Ok i was just gonna use these as a base for my dac or ddc.


That works too! The specs they list indicate these things take a lot of weight, but I'm guessing it's the max load before they actually break, the effective max weight to perform properly is probably way less.


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> I saw that many of you are happy with power cables from Ali.
> I'm willing to try good power cables from Ali.
> Which models will you advise me to order?


Theres alot of options.

I really like the 15 core valhalla power cable.

About $50 for 1.5 m.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> Theres alot of options.
> 
> I really like the 15 core valhalla power cable.
> 
> About $50 for 1.5 m.


With which devices are you using them?


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> With which devices are you using them?


Only have one of those but I'm using it on my ddc.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> Only have one of those but I'm using it on my ddc.


We are both using the DI-20HE. 

I see this cable on different shops on Ali. 
Is there a trustworthy seller from which you buy?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

dougms3 said:


> I got these in today.
> 
> What is the purpose of the screw in pieces on the top?


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Dandoudou said:


> I saw that many of you are happy with power cables from Ali.
> I'm willing to try good power cables from Ali.
> Which models will you advise me to order?


How much you looking to spend per AC cable ?


----------



## Dandoudou

Crypt Keeper said:


> How much you looking to spend per AC cable ?


I would like to try good value for price cables that won't exceed €100 per cable.


----------



## Crypt Keeper

Dandoudou said:


> I would like to try good value for price cables that won't exceed €100 per cable.


Then better DIY this one ... https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/cabl...c-copper-power-cable-526mm-o16mm-p-13493.html
Really good cables start  @ arount 250 USD on Ali, IMHO...


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> We are both using the DI-20HE.
> 
> I see this cable on different shops on Ali.
> Is there a trustworthy seller from which you buy?


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2NejJCv&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I bought mine from this seller.  

I've tried the gold odin with several different connectors and also this gryphon knockoff.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...2RuMYct&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

To be honest, theres alot of good options.  If you're wanting to test something out, the gold odin is a good one to start with.  Many of us have purchased it so its a pretty safe choice.  

One of these days, I'll do a shootout review and document the differences between the cables.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2NejJCv&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US
> 
> I bought mine from this seller.
> 
> ...


Is this cable the Gold Ordin? 

https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005...21!12000029708696968!rec&gatewayAdapt=glo2fra


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> Is this cable the Gold Ordin?
> 
> https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004581715522.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.2.747a59e0vtwvZg&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.291025.0&scm_id=1007.13339.291025.0&scm-url=1007.13339.291025.0&pvid=dc029100-dbf6-4e16-b66f-8983f0fd3504&_t=gps-idcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller,scm-url:1007.13339.291025.0,pvid:dc029100-dbf6-4e16-b66f-8983f0fd3504,tpp_buckets:668#2846#8108#1977&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000029708696968","sceneId":"3339"}&pdp_npi=2@dis!EUR!60.69!57.66!!!!!@0b0a23a716733129912543187e5321!12000029708696968!rec&gatewayAdapt=glo2fra


Yep, I bought one of my other cables from that seller.


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> Yep, I bought one of my other cables from that seller.


With which devices are you using them?


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> With which devices are you using them?



Using the 15 core valhalla on the di20he, gryphon on the r8mk2, gold odin with fi50 knockoff connectors on an lps feeding the jcat usb card, a furutech 314ag with fi50 knockoff connectors on the pc and a real furutech fp-s55n with fi-46 gold connectors on the master19.

I tested the s55n cable on all of my devices and it works best on the amp.  I tested the gold odin, gryphon knockoff and 15 core valhalla on the di20 and the valhalla sounds best there for my tastes.  Its warmer, richer, with more body than the gold odin but a tad less resolving at that spot.  The gryphon knockoff was a little too warm and bassy, and offered less at the top end than the other two.

I found it unusual that the power cable had such an effect on the di20he since it has regenerative power but it is what it is  🤷‍♂️


----------



## Dandoudou

dougms3 said:


> I tested the s55n cable on all of my devices and it works best on the amp.


Thank you for the pictures. 
I must miss something. What is the s55n cable?


----------



## dougms3

Dandoudou said:


> Thank you for the pictures.
> I must miss something. What is the s55n cable?


https://www.furutech.com/2017/05/10/14786/

This bad boy.


----------



## cdacosta

Ufanco said:


> Just started reading about the grounding box and was wonder what’s the difference is between using a grounding device vs the AC line that’s already grounded in the earth?


Earth ground, which is usually a copper or aluminum rod buried in the earth is a protection ground.  Earth ground is where your AC wall outlets are ultimately terminated to.

Grounding box is minerals and metals designed or used for filtering signal ground from your audio components.  Grounding box is wired to the negative terminal of the signal ground on your component.  This can be a digital or analog, output or input signal path of an audio component.  Grounding box used in this fashion is passive, meaning there is no AC power running through it.  Grounding box "does not" replace a safety earth ground.

When I first heard or read of a "grounding box" filled with minerals or rare metals used to filter the negative signal ground of an audio system, I thought it sounded like nonsense.  I finally tried it about a month or so ago and LOL it works.  Not only works, can make an extreme difference to the performance of an audio system.  At least for me it did.  I do not believe there is, and have not seen any scientific proof of why this works.  I just know what I hear.


----------



## Shiraz

Dandoudou said:


> I saw that many of you are happy with power cables from Ali.
> I'm willing to try good power cables from Ali.
> Which models will you advise me to order?


I have tried around 10 types on AE so far, and have had the best results from the "Monosaudio P902" cable which I DIY'd (finished versions are also available), followed closely by the "Accuphase 40th Anniversary" power cables. The imitation Odin Gold cable (I bought from Getwire, recommended here) didn't match the above two for dynamics and resolution, but is still a safe bet and popular here.


----------



## Ieonasj (Tuesday at 8:32 AM)

hello,why one headphones is with xlr cables and other with standar aux 3.5mm?


----------



## Ieonasj (Tuesday at 8:31 AM)

hello,im niewby in audio. have audeze lcd-2c cb headpohes with xlr cable. does xlr is balanced cable vs 4.4mm balanced i have with meze iem? both cables are same sound quality? what difference xlr 3 pin vs 4pin? does all portable dac/amp with 6.35mm output is balanced? as im saw all uotputs with 2.5mm or 4.4mm is marked 'balanced' and not marked 'balanced' at 6.35mm output?


----------



## DecentLevi

[initial] impressions on my 15-core Valhalla power cord from Ali seller Timeless Audio Store
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802936896122.html

Fresh off the heels of my 'real' Odin Gold knockoff (with silver Faraday Tape over both ends and mostly wrapped in copper foil which was the most optimized way for me), the sound could be described as either bright / clinical or dark yet detailed yet fairly analogue sounding depending on the recording. NOW with the Valhalla, the gap between ultra bright and dark has narrowed making everything more palatable, and everything is more open and analogue, with drums that are more coherent! MAJOR WIN for me, and it is slightly darker as mentioned by others, but in a VERY GOOD way! This was with it powering my power conditioner.


----------



## DecentLevi (Tuesday at 6:06 PM)

Now I put some silver Faraday Fabric tape over the connectors. All I can say is... WOW, heaven is smiling at me. Same sound sig. as before but now with more upper detail that's in no way harsh. Though two full pieces on both sides was a bit much... after trying a few variations of smaller / multiple thin strips / different placements / one or the other side, I settled on a 2/3rds width of the tape in the middle of the power plug wall side, and another of the same on the receiving plug closer to the cable connection.


----------



## dougms3

Shiraz said:


> I have tried around 10 types on AE so far, and have had the best results from the "Monosaudio P902" cable which I DIY'd (finished versions are also available), followed closely by the "Accuphase 40th Anniversary" power cables. The imitation Odin Gold cable (I bought from Getwire, recommended here) didn't match the above two for dynamics and resolution, but is still a safe bet and popular here.


I can't speak for the cables since I haven't tried them but the monosaudio and viborg connectors and accessories are legit good.


----------



## Exocer

DecentLevi said:


> Now I put some silver Faraday Fabric tape over the connectors. All I can say is... WOW, heaven is smiling at me. Same sound sig. as before but now with more upper detail that's in no way harsh. Though two full pieces on both sides was a bit much... after trying a few variations of smaller / multiple thin strips / different placements / one or the other side, I settled on a 2/3rds width of the tape in the middle of the power plug wall side, and another of the same on the receiving plug closer to the cable connection.


Hey man, posts like this are terrific!! Thats what this is all about 😎. Finding the magic recipe


----------



## szore

DecentLevi said:


> Now I put some silver Faraday Fabric tape over the connectors. All I can say is... WOW, heaven is smiling at me. Same sound sig. as before but now with more upper detail that's in no way harsh. Though two full pieces on both sides was a bit much... after trying a few variations of smaller / multiple thin strips / different placements / one or the other side, I settled on a 2/3rds width of the tape in the middle of the power plug wall side, and another of the same on the receiving plug closer to the cable connection.


Yeah reading your post motivated me to remove some of the faraday tape I wrapped around my power cable connectors. I had it wrapped around 2 or 3 times. Now on all my power cables I just have 1 layer wrapped around and the sound is wayyy more liquid, transparent and the soundstage is uber 3D.... Lesson learned; Don't over do the Faraday tape!


----------



## Exocer

Shiraz said:


> I have tried around 10 types on AE so far, and have had the best results from the "Monosaudio P902" cable which I DIY'd (finished versions are also available), followed closely by the "Accuphase 40th Anniversary" power cables. The imitation Odin Gold cable (I bought from Getwire, recommended here) didn't match the above two for dynamics and resolution, but is still a safe bet and popular here.


The P902 is really good! I use these with the Viborg Aluminum shell copper plugs (VM and VF512) in a critical part of my setup. It has no right to be this good at this price. I also have Furutech DPS 4.1 with authentic fi-50 ncf connectors in my setup and STILL consider the monosaudio P902 to be really good.


----------



## Ufanco

cdacosta said:


> Earth ground, which is usually a copper or aluminum rod buried in the earth is a protection ground.  Earth ground is where your AC wall outlets are ultimately terminated to.
> 
> Grounding box is minerals and metals designed or used for filtering signal ground from your audio components.  Grounding box is wired to the negative terminal of the signal ground on your component.  This can be a digital or analog, output or input signal path of an audio component.  Grounding box used in this fashion is passive, meaning there is no AC power running through it.  Grounding box "does not" replace a safety earth ground.
> 
> When I first heard or read of a "grounding box" filled with minerals or rare metals used to filter the negative signal ground of an audio system, I thought it sounded like nonsense.  I finally tried it about a month or so ago and LOL it works.  Not only works, can make an extreme difference to the performance of an audio system.  At least for me it did.  I do not believe there is, and have not seen any scientific proof of why this works.  I just know what I hear.


Thank you for the response..haven’t heard of grounding unless it was earth grounding so was curious. Sounds like building one might be a fun winter project. Is there somewhere that sells kits or plans? Is it possible to buy an inexpensive prebuilt one to see if I hear any difference?


----------



## dougms3

Ufanco said:


> Thank you for the response..haven’t heard of grounding unless it was earth grounding so was curious. Sounds like building one might be a fun winter project. Is there somewhere that sells kits or plans? Is it possible to buy an inexpensive prebuilt one to see if I hear any difference?


A few people have this one and stated it made a very noticeable difference but they they are not cheap.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251...ed!67376014457!sea&curPageLogUid=FESuP2mh0rUm

You'll have to ask @cdacosta for the magic formula if you're going to build your own.


----------



## cdacosta

Ufanco said:


> Thank you for the response..haven’t heard of grounding unless it was earth grounding so was curious. Sounds like building one might be a fun winter project. Is there somewhere that sells kits or plans? Is it possible to buy an inexpensive prebuilt one to see if I hear any difference?


What I would suggest is first see for yourself if such a device makes a difference in your system.  This way you can evaluate for yourself the time and cost value.  Until I tried it myself, I truly thought the concept sounded like **BS**.  I now have 5 of these ground boxes and will soon be 7.  All in one headphone system.  

You can go the route like Doug suggested, a pre-built unit, but will run you like $200.  Kind of steep for many to try and see if the idea makes a difference.  Then there is the ground lead which many users have stated and I concur is a big part of how well this device will perform.

You can dip your toe into it like I did at first.  What I did (which I have posted here in this thread) was:
* Get a 7.5lb (or about 3.4kg) of high grade Magnetite from ebay.  I just purchased another 7.5lb bag recently and think seller still has a couple more left. Cost including shipping is $22.  Will post links below.  

* Then buy knock off Furutech CF-102(R) solderless RCA plugs from Aliexpress.  The real ones will cost too much for experimentation.  Two will cost you about $24 shipped, 4 for $35 shipped.  Originals are priced around $410 for 4.  Based on my comparing them, the clones are almost as good as the originals.  The originals are a tad warmer and richer in the mids.

* Lastly you will need good 14ga to 12ga stranded wire.  I recommend as pure as possible stranded copper wire.  1 meter to 1.6 meters long wire is what you will need.

* Isopropyl Alcohol, higher the purity the better.  I use 91%, 70% if you have nothing else handy can be used.

The wire and connector matters a lot when it comes to overall performance of this device.  If you have the wire already to experiment with, your cost to try this will be $46.  For now do not worry about enclosure or anything else.  The Magnetite comes tightly packed in a zip lock bag.  Place the bag with Magnetite into a wood box, card board box or even a Tupperware container.  This is so the Magnetite stays put.   Install the wire to the Furutech RCA ground terminal.  For the other end that goes into the Magnetite, strip 4" off the end of wire.  The 4" stripped end is just buried into the Magnetite.  When making/assembling this simple cable, make sure you first use the Isopropyl Alcohol to clean the bare wire ends and contact of the Furutech RCA negative contact.

Using the Isopropyl Alcohol clean off the outside (negative contact) of all the unused RCA jacks on your DAC and amp.  I do not know what gear you are using so first try on a open analog, then digital unused RCA jack on your DAC. You can try on input or output RCA jacks.  Performance may differ filtering the input or output negative line signal, depending on your gear.  I recommend trying this first, as high up the signal chain as possible first.  That is it, easy.  You should "within" 10-15 mins hear a difference and then the changes further improve in the following approx. increments: 3hrs, 12hrs, 24hrs, 3 days.  After trying on DAC, then DDC, then amp.  Yes this can be improved on in many ways, but this is for later when you "know" that it is worth pursuing further.  You can and will reuse all the material you have purchased if you decide to build a proper ground box.

Feel free to ask any questions.


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## cdacosta

Oh shoot, the links...

7.5lb. Magnetite from eBay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224300491368

Furutech CF-102(R) RCA plugs from Aliexpress:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2X1jKvI&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

If you want good sounding wire without experimentation I like this wire.  It is about $27 for a 1.5m pair on Aliexpress.  Just cut off the XLR connector ends, you will be using the conductors and shield wire.  OCC copper, the braid and conductors give a total AWG of about 12ga - 11ga.  This is the wire I am using for the two boxes going to the DAC.  
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255...tewayAdapt=glo2usa4itemAdapt&_randl_shipto=US


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## Ieonasj

hi,what is better lamp amp vs rezitor?


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## Curiousityflufff

Thanks for the recommendation, Monosaudio P902 cable will be on my wishlist. 



Been lurking all the discussions for quite some time, can anyone suggest some good value RCA interconnects beside fake Odins? (pure silver is a plus bcos I also want to try new things) Budget around $100-350.


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## DecentLevi (Yesterday at 2:56 PM)

@Curiousityflufff This is my recommendation for RCA cables. IME with years of experience, I honestly don't expect Aliexpress cables to match this real thing. Him & I worked out out this custom design and it's totally transparent and scales with quality audio signal, for both headphone cables, interconnects, and soon to be used internally in my multithousand $ tube amp. He's also working on a v2 using a special cable material called Litz copper & silver. It's even on the lower end of $100-200.

Model: RUBI (Prototype) Shielded headphone cable. Mega 18AWG conductors.
Construction: 18AWG Varistrand OCC (-Ve), 18AWG stranded Pure Silver (+Ve)
For inquiries: https://www.etsy.com/shop/Arctand (message Darren in Singapore and ask for Levi's y-cable or r70x design)
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/aud...depth-review-impressions.765004/post-17154720


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## cdacosta

Received this earlier today and starting to mix into Tourmaline ground box mix.  So far I like it.  Adds a bit more depth and separation within sound stage, even quieter background so entire presentation stands out more.  Upper frequencies are even more defined.  From what I read from Asian sites graphite will make a huge difference with Tourmaline mixes.  I have not read of anyone trying graphite with Magnetite.  No idea if Entreq uses it either with their Magnetite mix.  I will post what graphite does with Magnetite for anyone interested.  Did take over a month to get this from Aliexpress though.  You do get quite a lot for the money.  Did not take much so far to make an audible performance improvement on the amp grounding box with Tourmaline as the main ingredient.  Will have to let it all settle which can take 3 days for full effect.  

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2sqkP9K&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US


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## dougms3

Curiousityflufff said:


> Thanks for the recommendation, Monosaudio P902 cable will be on my wishlist.
> 
> 
> 
> Been lurking all the discussions for quite some time, can anyone suggest some good value RCA interconnects beside fake Odins? (pure silver is a plus bcos I also want to try new things) Budget around $100-350.


https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...2ky7S5H&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa&_randl_shipto=US

I bought this one just out of curiosity and it replaced the odin2 rcas I had going to my loxjie p20.  Its definitely better than the odin2 in all aspects.  The odin2 rcas replaced the cheap rcas I had going from my sub amp to the line out converter.


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## cdacosta

Update on the Aliexpress graphite powder and mixing with Tourmaline mixes and Magnetite by itself or mixes.  Also the mix I am using for these ground boxes.

The graphite does what I mentioned before, and is definitely for the money worth it.  Works mixed with either Tourmaline and Magnetite mixes.    Basically adds a bit more micro resolution, quieter background, even more improvement to timbre, and a bit more air and refinement to top end.  Gives a "feel" of beauty and delicacy to instrumental notes, mid frequencies and up, extremely hard to put into words.  This is for the entire frequency spectrum.

Very little is needed for a 3kg - 4kg mix.  In one of the pics with the graphite bottle is also a white plastic spoon.  With amp Tourmaline mix, 4 small heaping spoon full of graphite.  I am adding while I am listening.  With the DAC Magnetite mixes, 2 spoon full.  Any more than just mentioned and the system tonality changes.  Adding more than noted the system starts to get brighter and leaner starting at the mids on up.   This is why I started experimenting by adding addition Magnetite mass by chaining to another approx. 1.5kg of Magnetite and that balances and as crazy as it sounds improved tonality balance.

Here are the ingredients I have in the two types of ground boxes I made, specifically for the amp and DAC.  Have not experimented with the Magnetite mixes on the PC and Router/Modem yet.  All of these ground boxes are for "signal ground filtering", have not tried AC ground yet.  I mention "about" because I added and adjusted amounts while tuning across time:

All boxes are the same purchased from Amazon.  Internal wood mated seams reinforced with E6000.  No copper shielding except on the ground box attached to the Router/Modem.  The amp and DAC ground box do not like any shielding or large copper plates inside the box, degrades performance. 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08P2N1922/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

All binding posts are pure copper from Aliexpress
Footers used are the .75" Platinum domes from Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075KK8WXM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

*Jotunheim 2 amp ground box: * Main ingredient is Tourmaline
- Tourmaline chips - AA+ grade (eBay), about 3 lbs
- Tourmaline - Brazilian black Tourmaline powder (eBay), about 0.6 lbs  
- Natural Shungite rough chips sized 5mm - 15mm (eBay), about 0.25 lbs
- Sodium Tartrate (Rochelle Salt) eBay - 0.3 lbs
- Silver plated 12ga. copper 5", just placed inside mix. (Aliexpress)  I wanted to hear what silver does to the mix.  May still add more later.
- Pure Rock Salt (Morton Pure and Natural purchased at Home Depot) - about 2 lbs
- Military Grade Graphite Powder (Aliexpress) - 4 plastic spoon full 
- Pure Tungsten, sand sized (Aliexpress) - about 30 grams

*Proceed DAP *(older NOS R2R DAC)* ground box x2, *one is for digital output and one for analog output*: * Main ingredient is Magnetite
- Magnetite, High purity sand (eBay), about 7.25 lbs  
- Natural Shungite rough chips sized 5mm - 15mm (eBay), about 0.25 lbs
- Sodium Tartrate (Rochelle Salt) eBay - 0.3 lbs
- Silver plated 12ga. copper fine cut up pieces from 24" length or so wire. (Aliexpress)  
- Pure Rock Salt (Morton Pure and Natural purchased at Home Depot) - about 1 lb
- Military Grade Graphite Powder (Aliexpress) - 2 plastic spoon full 
- Pure Tungsten, sand sized (Aliexpress) - about 35 grams

Before the ground boxes were added, this system was already highly tweaked, and sounded fantastic.  With these ground boxes, system sounds absolutely stunning.  Literally an entirely different performance level.   Anyhoos, just wanted to share the mix I am using as I mentioned previously I would.  Hopefully someone will benefit or save them time if they want to go this path.


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## Crypt Keeper

cdacosta said:


> Update on the Aliexpress graphite powder and mixing with Tourmaline mixes and Magnetite by itself or mixes.  Also the mix I am using for these ground boxes.
> 
> The graphite does what I mentioned before, and is definitely for the money worth it.  Works mixed with either Tourmaline and Magnetite mixes.    Basically adds a bit more micro resolution, quieter background, even more improvement to timbre, and a bit more air and refinement to top end.  Gives a "feel" of beauty and delicacy to instrumental notes, mid frequencies and up, extremely hard to put into words.  This is for the entire frequency spectrum.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the update on this !  Awesome ...


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## cdacosta

Crypt Keeper said:


> Thank you for the update on this !  Awesome ...


My pleasure bro


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## kenincalgary

cdacosta said:


> My pleasure bro


Yes, thanks for the data, much appreciated. I have 3 from AE and your experience has inspired me to home grow a couple for the speakers.


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## cdacosta

kenincalgary said:


> Yes, thanks for the data, much appreciated. I have 3 from AE and your experience has inspired me to home grow a couple for the speakers.


The ones I built and am still playing with will stay with this headphone setup.  I just wish I could properly share in writing the difference they have made, I never would have believed it until I experienced the difference.  When I eventually buy another home and set back up my home theater I definitely will build ground boxes for the whole setup.  This will include all three amps.  I have read many times that ground boxes work extremely well at the negative speaker terminal on amps.  Will need one for each channel though.

The reason I DIY'ed these ground boxes once I realized the potential of them, is they can be tuned real time for that application and system.  I have really enjoyed this project, I hope it will be as rewarding for you!


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