# FiiO BTR3-The World' First Bluetooth Headphone Amplifier, SBC/AAC/aptX/aptX LL/aptX HD/LDAC/HWA (LHDC)



## FiiO (Aug 8, 2018)




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## FiiO (Aug 8, 2018)




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## FiiO (Aug 13, 2018)




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## caprimulgus

Nice one, can't wait! 

Any info on Australian availability (distributors, dates, pricing, etc)?


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## FiiO

caprimulgus said:


> Nice one, can't wait!
> 
> Any info on Australian availability (distributors, dates, pricing, etc)?



Thanks for your kind attention! The worldwide delivery probably start tomorrow, so you may check with local sales agent around Aug. 20th: https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/46664.html


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## Koolpep

Yep, definitively testing this one.


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## Arasthel

Gonna have to wait for it to get to the Argentina FiiO store


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## Palash

@FiiO very promising product.


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## bahamot

Looking good there, what's the price range?


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## Makahl

Looking forward to getting one! Btw, is the EQ on the app only presets or we can edit frequencies? Also, does the BTR3's battery drains when connected as DAC? I've had a problem using FiiO E17 first gen because after a while the battery was during only 30 minutes since it was recharging all the time through USB when using as dac/amp.


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## zolom (Aug 9, 2018)

Is it going to be sold on Amazon (or just the FiiO Aliexpress store)?

Is playback available while charging?

Thanks


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## JamesFiiO

zolom said:


> Is it going to be sold on Amazon (or just the FiiO Aliexpress store)?
> 
> Is playback available while charging?
> 
> Thanks



will be available around the world, of course, Amazon and AE included.


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## MentalDraco

Looking around my local reseller in Romanian to see how and when it arrives.


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## FiiO

bahamot said:


> Looking good there, what's the price range?


The MSRP in US is around $69.99, but it's subject to change slightly in other markets which would be decided by our local distributors.
Best regards


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## FiiO

Makahl said:


> Looking forward to getting one! Btw, is the EQ on the app only presets or we can edit frequencies? Also, does the BTR3's battery drains when connected as DAC? I've had a problem using FiiO E17 first gen because after a while the battery was during only 30 minutes since it was recharging all the time through USB when using as dac/amp.


The EQ on the FiiO Music APP is only preseted. 

Best regards


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## FiiO

zolom said:


> Is it going to be sold on Amazon (or just the FiiO Aliexpress store)?
> 
> Is playback available while charging?
> 
> Thanks


Yes, you could use the BTR3 while charging still. But it is recommended to use it after charging fully.

Best regards


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## novatax

Is it as smart as Q1 Mark II in differentiating usb sources (AC or PC or smartphone)?


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## thebrad

Would the selected EQ preset stick to the BTR3, even if I connect it to another device or uninstall the fiio music app?


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## 0x6170

I wonder what the noise floor with sensitive IEMS (e.g. Shure SE535) will be on the BTR3.
On the BTR1 it's almost silent, however at low volumes you can still hear the digital noise.


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## zhubajie (Aug 10, 2018)

@FiiO :
I see the BTR3 supports LDAC but I haven't read which of the 3 LDAC versions.
Does it support :

LDAC (Connection) = 330kbps (so aptX is better @352kbps)
LDAC (Normal) = 660kbps
LDAC (Quality) = 990kbps
And does the Fiio M7 support these 3 too? (Answered myself : Yes it does)

Thanks in advance for your answer.


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## jotaku

I didn't see this info in any of the promo info that was released. Which version of Bluetooth is it; 4.1, 4.2, or 5.0?


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## mikp

csr8675= 5.0


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## hotdog108

FiiO said:


> Thanks for your kind attention! The worldwide delivery probably start tomorrow, so you may check with local sales agent around Aug. 20th: https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/46664.html


Been waiting for this one ever since I heard about it from CanJam London, hopefully Amazon will have it when it first comes out. I'm definitely getting one, currently using the BTR1 and loving it.


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## mvadu

hotdog108 said:


> Been waiting for this one ever since I heard about it from CanJam London, hopefully Amazon will have it when it first comes out. I'm definitely getting one, currently using the BTR1 and loving it.


same here.. held off from buying BTR1, will order as soon as i see it on Amazon.com


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## Gee Simpson

The BTR1 didn't work well with sensitive earphones, apparently there was an audible buzz. Will the BTR3 have the same problem?


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## novatax

It is available at Ali. $80...


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## georgelai57

Just ordered one at AliExpress


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## zhubajie (Aug 10, 2018)

I first need to know which of the 3 LDAC versions it supports.
I already have the uBTR and it's only for the LDAC support that I could be tempted to buy another.
But if it, for example, only supports LDAC Connection it would be useless to me.

You won't be able to distinguish which of the 3 versions of LDAC is used since they all have the same LED color (if all 3 LDAC variants are supported that is).


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## mikp

ordered one on tmall.

Regarding ldac,- is it not source dependent if it uses 330, 660 or 990?


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## zhubajie

mikp said:


> ordered one on tmall.
> 
> Regarding ldac,- is it not source dependent if it uses 330, 660 or 990?



That too, ofcourse.
But, like many devices support aptX but not aptX HD, it's, afaik, very well possible that a device only supports LDAC Connection.
And if that's the case you are better off with aptX.

And, because the light on the BTX3 just shows that you have a LDAC connection, you never know if you have a 330, 660 or 990kbps connection.


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## mikp

well, to have ldac certification does it not have to support all 3. I have not seen a ldac product that only support one.


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## JamesFiiO

mikp said:


> well, to have ldac certification does it not have to support all 3. I have not seen a ldac product that only support one.



BTR3 supports 3 LDAC mode.


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## zhubajie

JamesFiiO said:


> BTR3 supports 3 LDAC mode.



NICE!
I'll order one at the end of the month.


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## FiiO

zhubajie said:


> NICE!
> I'll order one at the end of the month.


 I believe you won't be disappointed.
Best regards


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## CeroAbsoluto

Hello,

I have a question. If the BTR3 can be connected to the computer, could it also be connected via OTG to the mobile?

I love the sound quality of the DAC AKM along with the implementation that makes the FIIO in the BTR1. It would be spectacular using USB AUDIO PLAYER PRO in Bit-Prefect mode.


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## FiiO

CeroAbsoluto said:


> Hello,
> 
> I have a question. If the BTR3 can be connected to the computer, could it also be connected via OTG to the mobile?
> 
> I love the sound quality of the DAC AKM along with the implementation that makes the FIIO in the BTR1. It would be spectacular using USB AUDIO PLAYER PRO in Bit-Prefect mode.


Dear friend,

Some of the mobile phones may be supported. My colleague's Vivo Xplay6 works fine with the BTR3 via OTG.

Best regards


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## FiiO (Aug 10, 2018)

The worldwide delivery of BTR3 starts today! If you are in the mind of getting one, check with local agents (*>>Where to Buy*) for its availability or kindly buy it at our Aliexpress store (*>>Click here*) if it's not available in your local market.

To celebrate its release, we are giving out one BTR3 to one lucky fan on our Facebook page at: Click here">*>>Click here *


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## CeroAbsoluto

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Some of the mobile phones may be supported. My colleague's Vivo Xplay6 works fine with the BTR3 via OTG.
> 
> Best regards



Thank you,

I can not wait to try this BTR3. I have to say that I love the sound of my B & W P7 moved by the BTR1. With this BTR3 through APTX-HD it has to be spectacular, and if I can also use Bit-Perfect ...


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## mvadu

FiiO said:


> The worldwide delivery of BTR3 starts today! If you are in the mind of getting one, check with local agents (*>>Where to Buy*) for its availability or kindly buy it at our Aliexpress store (*>>Click here*) if it's not available in your local market.
> 
> To celebrate its release, we are giving out one BTR3 to one lucky fan on our Facebook page at: Click here">*>>Click here *


I don't see "USA" in your website wheretobuy !! does that mean I have to buy only from AliExpress if I want one delivered to USA?


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## Koolpep

mvadu said:


> I don't see "USA" in your website wheretobuy !! does that mean I have to buy only from AliExpress if I want one delivered to USA?



Go back to first page and read there. Will be on Amazon US.


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## mvadu (Aug 10, 2018)

Koolpep said:


> Go back to first page and read there. Will be on Amazon US.


hmm.. I am referring to their official website. Thought that is more reliable.


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## JamesFiiO (Aug 10, 2018)

mvadu said:


> hmm.. I am referring to their official website. Thought that is more reliable.



We already shipped some to Amazon but usually it will take about 2 week to appear on Amazon.


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## batarang

So their FB page and AliExpress store says this device only supports BT 4.2 while at the same time using Qualcomm CSR8675 . So which one is true, CSR8675 BT 5.0 or a different SOC?


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## JamesFiiO

batarang said:


> So their FB page and AliExpress store says this device only supports BT 4.2 while at the same time using Qualcomm CSR8675 . So which one is true, CSR8675 BT 5.0 or a different SOC?



BTR3 used CSR8675 which can supports Bluetooth 5.0 , but you can only use bluetooth 4.2 if you want to install the LDAC/aptX HD , anyway, the bluetooth audio does not benefit from 5.0 which is most for BLE device.


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## mikp

noticed I didnt buy from the official tmall store, hope it goes ok anyway. Been waiting for this one since announced.

Edit..

does your 40cm mmcx work on other earbuds with mmcx?


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## zhubajie

JamesFiiO said:


> BTR3 used CSR8675 which can supports Bluetooth 5.0 , but you can only use bluetooth 4.2 if you want to install the LDAC/aptX HD , anyway, the bluetooth audio does not benefit from 5.0 which is most for BLE device.


Ah, nice.
Now we know the M9 will also have Bluetooth 4.2 
Hope there will more info and prices on the M9 soon. And a nice bundle offer with the F9 Pro


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## batarang

@JamesFiiO Thanks for clearing that up.

Does it support balanced mode via adapter such as Fiio L26?


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## zhubajie

batarang said:


> @JamesFiiO Thanks for clearing that up.
> 
> Does it support balanced mode via adapter such as Fiio L26?



What exactly would you gain by first sending the signal via Bluetooth and then splitting it up again?


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## J The Killer

I wish there was a way to connect sennheiser 6 series headphones to the BTR3 with a more convenient short cable like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pr...622.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.1e24e728EF73Ae


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## batarang

zhubajie said:


> What exactly would you gain by first sending the signal via Bluetooth and then splitting it up again?



Lol yeah make sense . But EarStudio ES100 has dedicated 2.5mm. And I feel bad for my extra F5 balanced cable.


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## zhubajie

batarang said:


> Lol yeah make sense . But EarStudio ES100 has dedicated 2.5mm. And I feel bad for my extra F5 balanced cable.


Aren't there loads of 3.5mm to 2.5mm adapters on the market for close to nothing?
Or don't these work (I'm still in my pre-balanced period)?


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## Koolpep

zhubajie said:


> What exactly would you gain by first sending the signal via Bluetooth and then splitting it up again?


Even if you send it through BT it’s still a left and a right channel, so you can still do a balanced output. The ES100 has it, the Astell & Kern XB10 has it too... I have both of these and their sound quality is amazing. Since I use them for hours each day thanks to lots of conference calls, I am always on the lookout for the next good one haha. 

Will surely get the BTR3 as well to check it out.


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## Koolpep

zhubajie said:


> Aren't there loads of 3.5mm to 2.5mm adapters on the market for close to nothing?
> Or don't these work (I'm still in my pre-balanced period)?



Once it’s single ended, you can’t make it balanced. However true balanced makes only sense if you have balanced amp as well, which the BTR3 doesn’t have, so no point really. Balanced enhances channel separation, noise and usually has a higher power output. 

You can connect a balanced headphone with an adapter to a single ended output, but NOT the other way round otherwise you short circuit the balanced amp if you connect a single ended plug to it.

Cheers.


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## Vergil

batarang said:


> @JamesFiiO Thanks for clearing that up.
> 
> Does it support balanced mode via adapter such as Fiio L26?


 You can turn balanced analogue into single ended analogue. You can't turn single ended analogue into balanced analogue. You can turn red and green paint into yellow (by mixing them), but you cannot turn yellow into red and green.



zhubajie said:


> What exactly would you gain by first sending the signal via Bluetooth and then splitting it up again?


 Bluetooth is digital. Sound for the left and right speakers are carried by separate channels. There's no mixing.



zhubajie said:


> Aren't there loads of 3.5mm to 2.5mm adapters on the market for close to nothing?
> Or don't these work (I'm still in my pre-balanced period)?


 Plugs don't make any difference. Balanced is 2.5mm, so idiots won't plug their single ended headphones / IEMs into it.


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## zhubajie

Vergil said:


> Plugs don't make any difference. Balanced is 2.5mm, so idiots won't plug their single ended headphones / IEMs into it.



Ehm... But some people have IEMs with a balanced cable and want to use it with a player or a bluetooth receiver that has a -non balanced- 3.5mm jack.
For them it's good there are adapters.


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## Marco Angel

Koolpep said:


> Even if you send it through BT it’s still a left and a right channel, so you can still do a balanced output. The ES100 has it, the Astell & Kern XB10 has it too... I have both of these and their sound quality is amazing. Since I use them for hours each day thanks to lots of conference calls, I am always on the lookout for the next good one haha.
> 
> Will surely get the BTR3 as well to check it out.


When you will, please make a little comparison, the ES100 is quite great in ldac and the EQ apears to introduce no artifacts in the sound (and is very powerfull)


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## Koolpep

Marco Angel said:


> When you will, please make a little comparison, the ES100 is quite great in ldac and the EQ apears to introduce no artifacts in the sound (and is very powerfull)



My pleasure I will do for sure. 

Cheers!


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## crabdog

Am looking forward to hearing this soon.


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## Sonic-Debris

Hey folks.

I just picked up the BTR3 from a store here in China, as well at the new FH5 IEM's.
I tested the BTR3 in the store and thought the output power was very good matched with these earphones, I was wondering the exact specs of the output power? some places say 25mw, and others say it is higher? also,... I remember seeing a smartphone app that links to the the BTR3, but I have no idea where to download it, any ideas? I think it was just a EQ and a few other things. The box that I got looks like it may have been a early sample or something, as it says that "The final product may differ in apper


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## Sonic-Debris

Oh I just realised that its actually the Android Fiio smart phone app that apparently allows you to adjust the EQ and things on the BTR3, just installed the beta so will check it out.


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## georgelai57

Sonic-Debris said:


> Oh I just realised that its actually the Android Fiio smart phone app that apparently allows you to adjust the EQ and things on the BTR3, just installed the beta so will check it out.


Hi. 
Congrats on the purchase. What does the Android/iOS FiiO Music App do that the normal Android/iPhone cannot? I’m curious as the description on the App Store doesn’t tell me much. 
Thanks.


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## Sonic-Debris

georgelai57 said:


> Hi.
> Congrats on the purchase. What does the Android/iOS FiiO Music App do that the normal Android/iPhone cannot? I’m curious as the description on the App Store doesn’t tell me much.
> Thanks.


As far as I know, it is just another music player app. It is actually not in the Google Playstore, you have to side load it onto Android phones. I normally use the Hiby player app, or just PowerAmp. My main Device to listen to audio on is my AK70MKII which is very nice and paired with wither the new FH5 from FiiO, or the Campfire Audio Polaris, the 2.5mm output has plenty of power. But for those times I need my phone, I will use this BTR3.

I will test out the FiiO app later, Im interested to see if I can find the settings screen that they showed for the BTR3 in this thread.


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## georgelai57

Sonic-Debris said:


> But for those times I need my phone, I will use this BTR3.
> 
> I will test out the FiiO app later, Im interested to see if I can find the settings screen that they showed for the BTR3 in this thread.



Yes I ordered the BTR3 for use with my iPhone when I’m too lazy to use my DAPs as the iPhone is always with me. I downloaded the FiiO app first and don’t see an obvious setting for a BTR3.


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## mikp

well, my tmall btr3 and fiio 40cm mmcx has started moving within china, so something is happening.

Do the settings in the app stick to the btr3?


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## Sonic-Debris

Nope can't find anything that looked like the picture FiiO showed here. Perhaps it is an additional app, or it is only for iPhone? I'm using the FiiO Music app version 0.1.0beta


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## harpo1 (Aug 12, 2018)

Sonic-Debris said:


> Nope can't find anything that looked like the picture FiiO showed here. Perhaps it is an additional app, or it is only for iPhone? I'm using the FiiO Music app version 0.1.0beta


you probably need the BTR3 on and paired to see the options.


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## Sonic-Debris

harpo1 said:


> you probably need the BTR3 on and paired to see the options.


 Yep it was on, and I was playing music through it, and the FiiO app. Perhaps it is not implemented yet? or they need to do an update for it. Can anyone test?


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## Light Focus

Just got my copy of BTR3, very satisfied and I'm writing a review about it!


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## FiiO




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## Sonic-Debris

FiiO said:


>





Hey FiiO, how do we get to the screen shown here in the app? or is this only for iphone users? I'm using the Android app, but can not see this. Do you have an updated Android app?


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## Sonic-Debris

I did get a response from Fiio, they said:

"Hi, firstly thanks for your purchasding the FiiO BTR3. Yes, we will release a new firmware for the BTR3 later. And you could upgrade it by yourself at that time. Actually the Android app is FiiO Music app, and we will add BTR3 option to that app later"


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## mikp

so the firmware is upgradeable?

My shipping agent got both the btr3 and 40cm mmcx cable today, surprised how fast tmall packages ship domestically in china.


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## Sonic-Debris

mikp said:


> so the firmware is upgradeable?
> 
> My shipping agent got both the btr3 and 40cm mmcx cable today, surprised how fast tmall packages ship domestically in china.



Yeah it sounds like they will be releasing firmware updates, though i'm not sure how they will be installed on the device, maybe via a computer app or smart phone app?
Tmall does indeed ship very fast, Im living and working in China, and found the local markets in Shenzhen seem to get the products before they even start shipping via online retailers. 

I am now in need of a balanced cable for my FH5 earphones, I was using the cheap one from FiiO, but it is not great quality and the cable started to yellow after about 1 month of use. I will wait for the LC-2.5C or LC-2.5B to be available, they look far better quality... though I'm not sure what the difference is between them, or if they would make and sound difference? I discovered it is also very hard to find quality cables in China, most markets just sell "DIY" at high prices, but carry zero information about what they are, and the sellers have no idea either.


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## mikp

ordered the tin audio t2, hopefully the 40cm fiio cable will fit.

Was there any answer if the btr3 supported fiio l26? so not have to change from balanced cables on the earbuds.


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## Sonic-Debris

mikp said:


> ordered the tin audio t2, hopefully the 40cm fiio cable will fit.
> 
> Was there any answer if the btr3 supported fiio l26? so not have to change from balanced cables on the earbuds.



Im not sure but I assume so, as it is just a cable that changes your 2.5mm to 3.5mm to fit into the BTR3. Obviously this does not make the BTR3 balanced, but good if you don't want to swap the whole cable.


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## psikey (Aug 14, 2018)

I had the EarStudio ES100 which sounded awesome via my SE846's with LDAC & balanced but was underwhelmed with the build quality and usability of the controls. I paid £100 from Amazon with shipping before returning.

For half the price I'm certainly giving the BTR3 a go and got my preorder in with AMP3. Having balanced not worth double the price to me. Do you think this would also drive my HD660S headphones too? The ES100 did.

1x Fiio BTR3 Bluetooth Headphone Amp
Sub-Total: £54.99
Supersaver 2 - 4 working days (Postage to United Kingdom): £0.00
VAT@20% (included in price): £9.17
Discount Coupons:STAY10P: *-£5.50*

Total: *£49.49*


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## SubMash

psikey said:


> I had the EarStudio ES100 which sounded awesome via my SE846's with LDAC & balanced but was underwhelmed with the build quality and usability of the controls. I paid £100 from Amazon with shipping before returning.
> 
> For half the price I'm certainly giving the BTR3 a go and got my preorder in with AMP3. Having balanced not worth double the price to me. Do you think this would also drive my HD660S headphones too? The ES100 did.
> 
> ...


You going to have much worse experience since btr3 is single amp. 846 would have not enough current, so expect way more noise. 660 would have not enough voltage since no balanced output, so expect not enough volume.


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## SubMash

@FiiO - are you going to post device audio quality specs? Who cares what is the noise floor of amp when it has no headphones connected?


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## FiiO

SubMash said:


> @FiiO - are you going to post device audio quality specs? Who cares what is the noise floor of amp when it has no headphones connected?


Not sure what you want to need. Can the parameters in our website answer: http://www.fiio.com.cn/btr3_parameters

Best regards


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## psikey

SubMash said:


> You going to have much worse experience since btr3 is single amp. 846 would have not enough current, so expect way more noise. 660 would have not enough voltage since no balanced output, so expect not enough volume.



Its just to replace my really old Sony Ericsson MW600 which I use on my e-bike normally with just my old Klipsch X10i. No real reason to use my HD660S headphones with it as only use those at home anyway. My SE846's had no issue with the ES100/LDAC (to my ears) so not sure what your referring to with this either.


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## FiiO

Sonic-Debris said:


> I did get a response from Fiio, they said:
> 
> "Hi, firstly thanks for your purchasding the FiiO BTR3. Yes, we will release a new firmware for the BTR3 later. And you could upgrade it by yourself at that time. Actually the Android app is FiiO Music app, and we will add BTR3 option to that app later"


Yes, now the BTR3 option has not been added to the FiiO Music APP. The stable version FiiO Music APP may be released next month or so.

Best regards


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## FiiO

batarang said:


> @JamesFiiO Thanks for clearing that up.
> 
> Does it support balanced mode via adapter such as Fiio L26?


No, the BTR3 doesn't have balanced output. Using the L26, could not active the balanced mode as well. 

Best regards


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## SubMash (Aug 14, 2018)

FiiO said:


> Not sure what you want to need. Can the parameters in our website answer: http://www.fiio.com.cn/btr3_parameters
> 
> Best regards


I miss THD limit with power outputs declared and I doubt how it's possible to get <0.3Ohm OI with this single amplifier. Also, knowing maximum RMS or Vpp voltage on the output would help. Again, I'm not interested in amp specs - they all available online . I'm interested in your device final results. It's not the same.


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## FiiO

mikp said:


> noticed I didnt buy from the official tmall store, hope it goes ok anyway. Been waiting for this one since announced.
> 
> Edit..
> 
> does your 40cm mmcx work on other earbuds with mmcx?


Theoretically, the LC-3.5AS can work with other earbuds with standard mmcx port. You could have a try in the local store first if you can. 

Best regards


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## psikey

Anybody know how the output power compares to the EarStudio ES100 3.5mm connection ?


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## Vergil

psikey said:


> Anybody know how the output power compares to the EarStudio ES100 3.5mm connection ?


Well, the dude straight up declared the FiiO has worse quality *because *it's not balanced. Facepalm. Don't take him seriously. The SE846s are super easy to drive. Power won't be a problem. With high sensitivity IEMs I'd worry more about background noise.


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## psikey (Aug 14, 2018)

Vergil said:


> Well, the dude straight up declared the FiiO has worse quality *because *it's not balanced. Facepalm. Don't take him seriously. The SE846s are super easy to drive. Power won't be a problem. With high sensitivity IEMs I'd worry more about background noise.



With the SE846's its the background noise that can sometime be an issue. With the ES100 it was dead silent but lots of background hiss with the old MW600.

I'm hoping this will drive my SE846's over LDAC as good as the ES100 did but with a nicer design, easier controls. Would be nice if it also had enough output power to drive my HD660S 150Ohm.

Anybody know where to get a decent short mmcx cable to UK? Seen someone had a custom one made from a US seller at 48cm length.


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## SubMash (Aug 14, 2018)

Vergil said:


> Well, the dude straight up declared the FiiO has worse quality *because *it's not balanced. Facepalm. Don't take him seriously. The SE846s are super easy to drive. Power won't be a problem. With high sensitivity IEMs I'd worry more about background noise.


AK4376a lowest load impedance is 14.4Ohm.
Add something on a circuitry of btr3 and Fiio declares 16Ohm.
846 is going down to 5Ohm - that is anything but NOT "easy to drive".
Don't take that dude seriously - he doesn't know what he is talking about.

It's worse because it's single amp with same load specs as ES100, but ES100 is dual amp. Not because it's balanced.
One AK4376 can't drive 846 at a reasonable volume - it will be heavily saturated due to the current limiter in the amp.

ES100 is another league for any low or high impedance headphones. For medium impedance high sensitivity headphones, they MIGHT sound same, but I didn't see any device specs posted - only amp specs.

AK4376A Vrms is 0.61V rms, ES100 dual amp AK4375 is 2.26V.
Both those DACs are identical THD under 32Ohm load with 25mW, so ES100 is double current.

Aside of audio quality specs it will be a question of connection reliability, so let's see reviews. Other than that BTR3 certainly better from the price point of view.


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## Vergil

SubMash said:


> AK4376a lowest load impedance is 14.4Ohm.
> Add something on a circuitry of btr3 and Fiio declares 16Ohm.
> 846 is going down to 5Ohm - that is anything but NOT "easy to drive".
> Don't take that dude seriously - he doesn't know what he is talking about.
> ...


Balanced implies dual mono (dual amp as you call it) from start to finish. This can halve the resistance, which translates to a miserable 3dB gain. If the BTR3 cannot drive the Shure, then going balanced won't solve the problem.


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## SubMash (Aug 14, 2018)

Vergil said:


> Balanced implies dual mono (dual amp as you call it) from start to finish. This can halve the resistance, which translates to a miserable 3dB gain. If the BTR3 cannot drive the Shure, then going balanced won't solve the problem.


Again, you not even reading my answer. It has nothing to do with balanced or not. SE846 doesn't need more voltage. It needs current. And a lot of it. Even ES100 is below specs. BTR3 is twice lower maximum current ability. Because it has only ONE amp.

P.S. Just if you don't know - ES100 works in dual mono and in tandem mode. So balanced or unbalanced - it can use both amps at the same time.

P.P.S. And anything high impedance needs voltage which single amp also can't provide.


----------



## psikey

SubMash said:


> Again, you not even reading my answer. It has nothing to do with balanced or not. SE846 doesn't need more voltage. It needs current. And a lot of it. Even ES100 is below specs. BTR3 is twice lower maximum current ability. Because it has only ONE amp.
> 
> P.S. Just if you don't know - ES100 works in dual mono and in tandem mode. So balanced or unbalanced - it can use both amps at the same time.



I'm no expert on this stuff, so are you saying the BTR3 won't drive the SE846's to loud volume or that the audio quality will be poor with artefacts/noise etc ?


----------



## SubMash (Aug 14, 2018)

psikey said:


> I'm no expert on this stuff, so are you saying the BTR3 won't drive the SE846's to loud volume or that the audio quality will be poor with artefacts/noise etc ?


It will be bad quality with a medium volume of SE846, because it will be overdriving amp with the too high current.

And it will be not enough volume on anything >100Ohm (like your HD660S) where you win with ES100 higher voltage on a balanced connection.

P.S. It doesn't mean it will not sound as good as ES100 with medium impedance high sensitivity headphones. I just don't know that - no tests posted, no finished device specs available. So time will tell.


----------



## Vergil

SubMash said:


> Again, you not even reading my answer. It has nothing to do with balanced or not. SE846 doesn't need more voltage. It needs current. And a lot of it. Even ES100 is below specs. BTR3 is twice lower maximum current ability. Because it has only ONE amp.
> 
> P.S. Just if you don't know - ES100 works in dual mono and in tandem mode. So balanced or unbalanced - it can use both amps at the same time.


I do understand what you're saying now. It's just that your first post was poorly articulated and I jumped on you immediately. Originally you wrote:


SubMash said:


> You going to have much worse experience since btr3 is single amp.


 So he's not going to have a bad experience, because it's single amp, but because even in dual amp mode it's barely enough. In other words the amp is simply too weak and the problem is not inherited from the fact that the BTR3 is single amp. Very different meaning.


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## zhubajie (Aug 14, 2018)

And they all lived happily ever after and got many children.


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## SubMash (Aug 14, 2018)

Vergil said:


> I do understand what you're saying now. It's just that your first post was poorly articulated and I jumped on you immediately. Originally you wrote:
> So he's not going to have a bad experience, because it's single amp, but because even in dual amp mode it's barely enough. In other words the amp is simply too weak and the problem is not inherited from the fact that the BTR3 is single amp. Very different meaning.


Yes, ok. My bad. Those both products use an almost same amp. And this amp is not high voltage or high current.
So with both his headphones it will be out of specs (SE846 and HD660s), so 2 amps become significant audible quality (846) and volume (660) improvement.


----------



## mvadu

@FiiO USA still no sign of BTR3 on amazon.com.. it was one thing to be waiting for the product to be released, and whole another deal for not being able to purchase.. any ETA when you will be able to sell there?


----------



## brightxy

mvadu said:


> @FiiO USA still no sign of BTR3 on amazon.com.. it was one thing to be waiting for the product to be released, and whole another deal for not being able to purchase.. any ETA when you will be able to sell there?


Same here waiting. Based on their earlier reply (I think on page 2 or 3), Fiio has shipped a few internationally and it takes around 2 wks to be available on Amazon (US). And in another thread they mentioned to check around 20th, so I presume probably it would be available next week (I hope). I'm pretty much checking Amazon and Google shopping multiple times a day for it...


----------



## caprimulgus

BTR3 shouldn't have any problem powering any of these, right?

Headphones: V-Moda M-100 (32ohm), Philips Fidelio X1 (30ohm), Fostex TH-X00 (25ohm), Denon D2000/D5000 (25ohm), Beyerdynamic DT-770 PRO (80ohm)
IEMs: Sennheiser IE80 (16ohm), Sony XBA-3 (12ohm)


----------



## SubMash

caprimulgus said:


> BTR3 shouldn't have any problem powering any of these, right?
> 
> Headphones: V-Moda M-100 (32ohm), Philips Fidelio X1 (30ohm), Fostex TH-X00 (25ohm), Denon D2000/D5000 (25ohm), Beyerdynamic DT-770 PRO (80ohm)
> IEMs: Sennheiser IE80 (16ohm), Sony XBA-3 (12ohm)


XBA3 is out of specs. IE80 at the limit and since it's an impedance specs at 2kHz often, could be out of spec too - need to check impedance curve on innerfidelity (846 is 9 and goes down to 5). Also need to check sensitivity - low sensitivity and it will either will take too much current or will be not enough volume.


----------



## novatax

Just received it. I like how the edges feels compared to BTR1's sharp edges. I'm using 1+3T O2Beta30 and Adv Sound M4. Bluetooth pairing was normal, and it was automatically paired to LDAC. I could change it manually in Dev Options tho

Independent volume. When paired, BTR3's volume was already max yet I need more volume. So I had to adjust from my phone. Do I need to set the bluetooth volume on my phone to max first?
There was a second audio stop when unlocking or just turn on the screen only while on LDAC.


----------



## SubMash

Always set phone volume at max and regulate device volume only or you're just cutting bits of transmission for nothing and losing resolution.
I hope BTR3 uses op-amp volume adjustment instead of DAC to shift noise floor together with a signal, but they are not talking about it. @FiiO ?


----------



## mvadu

@SubMash since you seems to what you are talking about, small clarification. ES100 with dual drive will use both amps only when connected to balanced IEMs, right? for a non balanced (e.g. SE215 in my case) even ES100 will use only one of those amps, hence being equivalent to BTR3?


----------



## SubMash

mvadu said:


> @SubMash since you seems to what you are talking about, small clarification. ES100 with dual drive will use both amps only when connected to balanced IEMs, right? for a non balanced (e.g. SE215 in my case) even ES100 will use only one of those amps, hence being equivalent to BTR3?


No, it uses both in balanced and unbalanced mode. In unbalanced it works in tandem doubling current capacity (higher current always increases noise) and effectively decreasing Output impedance 50%.

Es100 has power saving mode in unbalanced mode to save a bit of power if second amp is not needed.


----------



## SubMash

Double post


----------



## RPGWiZaRD (Aug 15, 2018)

@FiiO Just making sure, this is a BT reciever only, correct? I'd LOVE to see the same but with transmitter capability as well with all the codec options (or better yet, both transmitter and reciever mode). I'd buy one in a heartbeat if it had TX capability!! Maybe a future product?

The use case I'm especially looking for, LDAC BT connectivity for TV and PC!


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## zerolight

How well is the BTR3 going to drive the K10au?


----------



## mvadu

SubMash said:


> No, it uses both in balanced and unbalanced mode. In unbalanced it works in tandem doubling current capacity (higher current always increases noise) and effectively decreasing Output impedance 50%.
> 
> Es100 has power saving mode in unbalanced mode to save a bit of power if second amp is not needed.



Thank you for the response. When you say "higher current always increases noise", does that mean SE215 will sound less nicer when fed with higher current? But current is a derivative of resistance which is not changing, right?


----------



## SubMash

mvadu said:


> Thank you for the response. When you say "higher current always increases noise", does that mean SE215 will sound less nicer when fed with higher current? But current is a derivative of resistance which is not changing, right?


Since we are not dealing with DC, but AC - we talk about impedance - resistance that changes with frequency. Higher current from same amplifier brings more noise. Setting higher volume by increasing voltage would yield more current at the same frequency unless load will start to heat and change impedance.

But what I said is that with 2 amps Vs 1 amp you need lower current from each to have same volume. And at above certain current level quality degrades massively since amplifier is saturated.


----------



## mvadu

SubMash said:


> Since we are not dealing with DC, but AC - we talk about impedance - resistance that changes with frequency. Higher current from same amplifier brings more noise. Setting higher volume by increasing voltage would yield more current at the same frequency unless load will start to heat and change impedance.
> 
> But what I said is that with 2 amps Vs 1 amp you need lower current from each to have same volume. And at above certain current level quality degrades massively since amplifier is saturated.



Makes sense.. as i already said, you seems to know what you are talking about


----------



## FiiO

RPGWiZaRD said:


> @FiiO Just making sure, this is a BT reciever only, correct? I'd LOVE to see the same but with transmitter capability as well with all the codec options (or better yet, both transmitter and reciever mode). I'd buy one in a heartbeat if it had TX capability!! Maybe a future product?
> 
> The use case I'm especially looking for, LDAC BT connectivity for TV and PC!


Yes, it could not transmit the signal out.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

mvadu said:


> @FiiO USA still no sign of BTR3 on amazon.com.. it was one thing to be waiting for the product to be released, and whole another deal for not being able to purchase.. any ETA when you will be able to sell there?



Before the end of this month. @FiiO USA have arranged the shipment as well.

Best regards


----------



## ezekiel77

Just got mine. It's tiny and looks well-built. Tested immediately with my phone and the connection and sound seems fine. 

Then tried connecting to my WM1A via BT and NFC. In both cases while they connected quickly (NFC was especially fast), the connection drops all too easily, even at 10cm (4 inches) distance between the WM1A and BTR3. They have to be within touching distance to get a decent connection (and the sound is awesome since all my hi-res files are there), but the close distance defeats the purpose of the BTR3 in the first place.

I'll try to get to the bottom of this, but if any BTR3 users have a WM1A/1Z please try this out as well. Will be looking for BT issues in the Sony Walkman thread too.


----------



## caprimulgus

SubMash said:


> XBA3 is out of specs. IE80 at the limit and since it's an impedance specs at 2kHz often, could be out of spec too - need to check impedance curve on innerfidelity (846 is 9 and goes down to 5). Also need to check sensitivity - low sensitivity and it will either will take too much current or will be not enough volume.



IE80: https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/hp/sennheiser-ie-80.php
-Impedance looks like it's pretty much 17ohm across the board.
-Sensitivity is rated at 125db (?mV). Looks to be measured at 131.8 (-12.95, +7.52). This is high?

So IE80 should be within the range (just), and should be ok on volume?

XBA-3: https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/hp/sony-xba-3.php
-Impedance is 21.4ohm average, but it looks like it goes as low as 9-10ohm 
-Sensitivity is rated at 108dB (150mV). But looks to be measured at 123.5 (-6.39, +5.59).

So I guess I should avoid using the XBA-3 with the BTR3, because of impedance mismatch?


----------



## batarang

ezekiel77 said:


> Just got mine. It's tiny and looks well-built. Tested immediately with my phone and the connection and sound seems fine.
> 
> Then tried connecting to my WM1A via BT and NFC. In both cases while they connected quickly (NFC was especially fast), the connection drops all too easily, even at 10cm (4 inches) distance between the WM1A and BTR3. They have to be within touching distance to get a decent connection (and the sound is awesome since all my hi-res files are there), but the close distance defeats the purpose of the BTR3 in the first place.
> 
> I'll try to get to the bottom of this, but if any BTR3 users have a WM1A/1Z please try this out as well. Will be looking for BT issues in the Sony Walkman thread too.



I didn't know nfc is used for audio transmission.


----------



## caprimulgus

batarang said:


> I didn't know nfc is used for audio transmission.



It's not. It's used for establishing a BT connection.


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## Vergil (Aug 17, 2018)

caprimulgus said:


> IE80: https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/hp/sennheiser-ie-80.php
> -Impedance looks like it's pretty much 17ohm across the board.
> -Sensitivity is rated at 125db (?mV). Looks to be measured at 131.8 (-12.95, +7.52). This is high?
> 
> ...


Please note that a high amp impedance / phone impedance ratio does not necessarily ruin sound quality, but distorts the frequency response*. When the manufacturer tuned your IEMs they took only the phone's own impedance curve into consideration. Adding a lot of resistance to the chain can distort this impedance curve, which will make the speaker sound different. Please note that different doesn't necessarily mean worse.

A very simple example:
A speaker has 16 ohm resistance at 200 hz, 8 ohm resistance at 8 khz. This means high frequencies get twice as much energy. The speaker was tuned to whatever sound signature with these specs in mind. If you add 0.1 ohm resistance to the chain you will get 16.1 ohm at 200 hz and 8.1 ohm at 8 khz. Pretty much the same, right? Now let's add 8 ohm. Now we are looking at 24 ohm at 200 hz and 16 ohm at 8 khz. It's no longer a ratio of 2:1, but 3:2. The high end of the frequency range no longer gets twice the energy meaning the bass will be more pronounced than before. If the XBA has low resistance at lower frequencies, high resistance at high frequencies, than it will sound thinner with less bass and more sparkle at the high end.

* There's also damping to take into account, but let's not go down the rabbit hole.


----------



## SubMash

Vergil said:


> Please note that a high amp impedance / phone impedance ratio does not necessarily ruin sound quality, but distorts the frequency response*. When the manufacturer tuned your IEMs they took only the phone's own impedance curve into consideration. Adding a lot of resistance to the chain can distort this impedance curve, which will make the speaker sound different. Please note that different doesn't necessarily mean worse.
> 
> A very simple example:
> A speaker has 16 ohm resistance at 200 hz, 8 ohm resistance at 8 khz. This means high frequencies get twice as much energy. The speaker was tuned to whatever sound signature with these specs in mind. If you add 0.1 ohm resistance to the chain you will get 16.1 ohm at 200 hz and 8.1 ohm at 8 khz. Pretty much the same, right? Now let's add 8 ohm. Now we are looking at 24 ohm at 200 hz and 16 ohm at 8 khz. It's no longer a ratio of 2:1, but 3:2. The high end of the frequency range no longer gets twice the energy meaning the bass will be more pronounced than before. If the XBA has low resistance at lower frequencies, high resistance at high frequencies, than it will sound thinner with less bass and more sparkle at the high end.
> ...


Let's go down the rabbit hole actually - underdamping increases THD, which would be way worse than even FR distortion. XBA3 would be suffering from amp impedance mismatch way more than IE80, but even if you're not reaching current saturation at the amp - more current generates more harmonics. So amp that barely fits specs would most probably have audible issues vs the one that is far from limits.

Returning back to btr3 - it has its place vs es100, because it's 30$ cheaper and slicker look, but they are not similar even in regard of theoretical audio quality and for practical difference - having instrumental test would be useful, because they are not different style amps at all, so can be directly compared.

What shouldn't fool people is 4375 vs 4376. 4376 only theoretically better if whole thing works as a preamp setup (means load is very high resistance), but not headphones amp. Unfortunately for balanced preamp single 4376 hands down worse than dual 4375 since it's just much lower voltage, but even on unbalanced es100 has higher Vrms in specs than btr3.

In the world where people easily blow 100$ on a cable, I would rather invest 30$ in the source. But since cables are for looks also, I might not be even speaking for majority.


----------



## Vergil

SubMash said:


> Let's go down the rabbit hole actually - underdamping increases THD, which would be way worse than even FR distortion. XBA3 would be suffering from amp impedance mismatch way more than IE80, but even if you're not reaching current saturation at the amp - more current generates more harmonics. So amp that barely fits specs would most probably have audible issues vs the one that is far from limits.
> 
> Returning back to btr3 - it has its place vs es100, because it's 30$ cheaper and slicker look, but they are not similar even in regard of theoretical audio quality and for practical difference - having instrumental test would be useful, because they are not different style amps at all, so can be directly compared.
> 
> ...


Fair point. It would be nice to see some measurements, so we could know how it behaves for certain with different IEMs. Personally I don't mind underdamping with my Beyer A20 (100Ω output impedance). Even FiiO's F9 Pros with their 28Ω sound good on it. It's a fuller, more relaxed sound. Maybe not for audiophiles, but way more fun than straight out of a smartphone. But then comparing a hifi desktop amp to a smartphone is almost as stupid as comparing it to the BTR3. 

As for spending an extra $30 for a better source, I don't think the BTR3 was meant to be taken seriously. It's just a small BT DAC for sports / commuting.


----------



## SubMash (Aug 17, 2018)

Vergil said:


> Fair point. It would be nice to see some measurements, so we could know how it behaves for certain with different IEMs. Personally I don't mind underdamping with my Beyer A20 (100Ω output impedance). Even FiiO's F9 Pros with their 28Ω sound good on it. It's a fuller, more relaxed sound. Maybe not for audiophiles, but way more fun than straight out of a smartphone. But then comparing a hifi desktop amp to a smartphone is almost as stupid as comparing it to the BTR3.
> 
> As for spending an extra $30 for a better source, I don't think the BTR3 was meant to be taken seriously. It's just a small BT DAC for sports / commuting.


If you don't need serious source, why not to get something 3x cheaper than btr3? ES100 sounds very serious disregarding price. Btr3 for non demanding headphones could be quite comparable.

Regarding underdamped lazy sound - there are plenty of plugins that can make same coloring. Like Samsung tube amp emulator in their phones. But I believe that job of hardware is to be able to reproduce sound correctly as intended. After that color it as you want in software. It's easy to add noise to the signal according to personal preference and much harder to remove one that comes from system deficiency.


----------



## zerolight

Does this support iOS volume sync. I get that it is useful to be able to control the volume of the BTR3 independently of the iPhone volume, but I like to adjust the volume of my music with the source, particularly nice to control iPhone volume with Apple Watch. Most BT devices default to volume sync, iPhone puts out full volume and then iPhone can control the BT analogue volume. I believe the ES100 can do this, but I'd prefer the BTR3, assuming it's a good match to my K10.


----------



## J The Killer

I was actually looking forward to BTR3 because of the newer 4376A DAC chip which has better THD and SNR than the older 4375A used in ES100. 

Granted ES100 has dual integrated chip that may increase Vrms but in my understanding it does not address the bottleneck of the THD/SNR of the DAC. @SubMash @Virgil @FiiO Please correct me if I am wrong then to assume that sound will be more refined/cleaner with BTR3 but the cans will have more driveability with ES100.


----------



## Koolpep

J The Killer said:


> I was actually looking forward to BTR3 because of the newer 4376A DAC chip which has better THD and SNR than the older 4375A used in ES100.
> 
> Granted ES100 has dual integrated chip that may increase Vrms but in my understanding it does not address the bottleneck of the THD/SNR of the DAC. @SubMash @Virgil @FiiO Please correct me if I am wrong then to assume that sound will be more refined/cleaner with BTR3 but the cans will have more driveability with ES100.



I am not sure the single AKM 4376 THD/SNR is better than using a 4375 per channel, usual using dual DACs changes these values usually for the better....

Cheers.


----------



## Koolpep

zerolight said:


> Does this support iOS volume sync. I get that it is useful to be able to control the volume of the BTR3 independently of the iPhone volume, but I like to adjust the volume of my music with the source, particularly nice to control iPhone volume with Apple Watch. Most BT devices default to volume sync, iPhone puts out full volume and then iPhone can control the BT analogue volume. I believe the ES100 can do this, but I'd prefer the BTR3, assuming it's a good match to my K10.



I understand the convenience but adjusting the volume digitally reduces the fidelity, so it's best to leave it on 100% and change the volume on the receiver end.

cheers.


----------



## zerolight

Koolpep said:


> I understand the convenience but adjusting the volume digitally reduces the fidelity, so it's best to leave it on 100% and change the volume on the receiver end.
> 
> cheers.



It doesn't adjust it digitally, iOS volume sync adjusts the BT devices analogue output remotely.


----------



## Koolpep

zerolight said:


> It doesn't adjust it digitally, iOS volume sync adjusts the BT devices analogue output remotely.



Wow. That’s smart. Excuse my ignorance. I didn’t know that.


----------



## zerolight

Koolpep said:


> Wow. That’s smart. Excuse my ignorance. I didn’t know that.


Looking at it more, I may be wrong.


----------



## zerolight

I really like the look of this one, nice and solid. decent DAC. Hard to believe there can be much difference between this and the ES100 with a good matched set of IEMs. I have no idea if my Nobles are a good match of either. Awaiting some reviews.


----------



## SubMash

J The Killer said:


> I was actually looking forward to BTR3 because of the newer 4376A DAC chip which has better THD and SNR than the older 4375A used in ES100.
> 
> Granted ES100 has dual integrated chip that may increase Vrms but in my understanding it does not address the bottleneck of the THD/SNR of the DAC. @SubMash @Virgil @FiiO Please correct me if I am wrong then to assume that sound will be more refined/cleaner with BTR3 but the cans will have more driveability with ES100.


I will repeat it again - 4376 has better THD and SNR only without load. With load it's identical -60dB THD at 25mW. Dual amp is not just increasing voltage (means volume), but also doubles current capacity (which might make 10 times difference in THD at load), doubles damping factor and does balanced connection which removes ground and interference noise.


----------



## J The Killer

SubMash said:


> I will repeat it again - 4376 has better THD and SNR only without load. With load it's identical -60dB THD at 25mW. Dual amp is not just increasing voltage (means volume), but also doubles current capacity (which might make 10 times difference in THD at load), doubles damping factor and does balanced connection which removes ground and interference noise.



First Q: Do the 4375/4376 have a DAC and Amp combo built in?
Second Q: If I use unbalanced output of ES100 then 4376A of BTR3 will be slightly better (THD/SNR wise) than 4375A of ES100?


----------



## SubMash

J The Killer said:


> First Q: Do the 4375/4376 have a DAC and Amp combo built in?
> Second Q: If I use unbalanced output of ES100 then 4376A of BTR3 will be slightly better (THD/SNR wise) than 4375A of ES100?


1. Yes.
2. No. Balanced or unbalanced es100 uses both amps either in dual mono or tandem mode. So it's always better than single 4376. Plus, as I've stated before - this SNR only available if no headphones connected to 4376.


----------



## SubMash

zerolight said:


> Does this support iOS volume sync. I get that it is useful to be able to control the volume of the BTR3 independently of the iPhone volume, but I like to adjust the volume of my music with the source, particularly nice to control iPhone volume with Apple Watch. Most BT devices default to volume sync, iPhone puts out full volume and then iPhone can control the BT analogue volume. I believe the ES100 can do this, but I'd prefer the BTR3, assuming it's a good match to my K10.


Es100 doesn't have this mode as well yet. Well, my LDAC Sony also don't have volume sync.


----------



## hotdog108

zerolight said:


> I really like the look of this one, nice and solid. decent DAC. Hard to believe there can be much difference between this and the ES100 with a good matched set of IEMs. I have no idea if my Nobles are a good match of either. Awaiting some reviews.


I'm wondering about my Nobles as well, the BTR1 I'm using with my Encores has some white noise at 50% volume and gets worse if I turn the volume down. The noise is less noticeable at higher volumes, drowned out by the music I suppose. I didn't notice the noise when I was using it with my UERRs, they're less sensitive than the Encore. I'm going to order this when it's available on Amazon, and try see how it fares with my Encores and Bells.


----------



## Koolpep

The ES100 has literally no noise with my K10, I assume this is because it has DCT - a noise elimination technology build in that was licensed from EarStudio to A&K and others. Seems to be quite advanced.

Cheers


----------



## hotdog108

Koolpep said:


> The ES100 has literally no noise with my K10, I assume this is because it has DCT - a noise elimination technology build in that was licensed from EarStudio to A&K and others. Seems to be quite advanced.
> 
> Cheers


The ES100 is literally the first item on the recommended list on my Amazon homepage, I think they're onto me I'll give it a twirl, thanks for the insights.


----------



## CeroAbsoluto

Hi, I have a question.

Now I am listening to the music with IEM and bluetooth APTX with the Fiio BTR1. Well, I'm testing different players to see which one gives me the best quality:

Player that brings the phone, Sony Xperia XA2
Onkyo HF Player
Neutron Music Player
USB Audio Player Pro, activating playback on Android

Well, honestly, they all sound the same to me.

My question is ... does the player use what is transmitted by bluetooth? I understand that yes, at least as regards the resampling that you perform to generate the signal, do not ...? If this is the case, then either APTX lowers the quality of all equally or my ears already by age are not able to distinguish one from the other ... With APTX HD (Fiio BTR3) will the difference be noticed from one player to another?

Someone can explain something to me about this, I'm a little lost.

Thank you.


----------



## novatax

Lots of comparison to ES100. I don't have and never listened to it. Interesting product though. I don't know anything about technical terms, just simply like or dislike the sound, but I hope this helps.
Fiio Q1 Mk2 has been out there for some time, so I assume some of you have listened to it.
From what I've listened for 3 days, I found it hard to differentiate the sound between BTR3 and Q1 Mk2 (no bass/gain boost) when being used as USB DAC via 3.5mm output and listening to Spotify. Maybe because both uses AK's DAC. I could not go for more when Q1 Mk2's vol pointed to 2 or 3, and I could reach that same loudness with BTR3.
As for those bluetooth codecs, same thing. I've tried guys. On paper, yes they are different. But I found nothing compared to AptX's BTR1. So, for me, portablitity speaking, I prefer BTR3 over Q1 Mk2 and BTR1's limited features as I found three of them kind of equal.
Please note that I was only using PC and 1+3T, Tin Audio T2, Adv Sound M4 & Model 3, Mee Audio M6 Pro 2nd Gen, Yersen FEN-2000, Radius NEF-HP31. Nothing fancy stuffs..


----------



## hotdog108

novatax said:


> Lots of comparison to ES100. I don't have and never listened to it. Interesting product though. I don't know anything about technical terms, just simply like or dislike the sound, but I hope this helps.
> Fiio Q1 Mk2 has been out there for some time, so I assume some of you have listened to it.
> From what I've listened for 3 days, I found it hard to differentiate the sound between BTR3 and Q1 Mk2 (no bass/gain boost) when being used as USB DAC via 3.5mm output and listening to Spotify. Maybe because both uses AK's DAC. I could not go for more when Q1 Mk2's vol pointed to 2 or 3, and I could reach that same loudness with BTR3.
> As for those bluetooth codecs, same thing. I've tried guys. On paper, yes they are different. But I found nothing compared to AptX's BTR1. So, for me, portablitity speaking, I prefer BTR3 over Q1 Mk2 and BTR1's limited features as I found three of them kind of equal.
> Please note that I was only using PC and 1+3T, Tin Audio T2, Adv Sound M4 & Model 3, Mee Audio M6 Pro 2nd Gen, Yersen FEN-2000, Radius NEF-HP31. Nothing fancy stuffs..


Very interesting, thank you for the insignts


----------



## mvadu

SubMash said:


> Es100 doesn't have this mode as well yet. Well, my LDAC Sony also don't have volume sync.


Yes, as per the white paper on Radsone 



> However, in order to manage fine analog volume adjustment, EarStudio does NOT
> support the volume synchronization even with the iOS device. We'd like to provide the full
> degree of freedom for analog volume control with finest step sizes: 0.5dB step with
> EarStudio mobile application and 2dB step with EarStudio HW buttons. Thus, please
> ...



I am assuming same limitation or guidance works for BTR3.  @FiiO do you have any such white papers or block diagrams on how your solution works?

Also Radsone seems to be very good with firmware supports, they have published 6 firmware updates since Jan. They even added features like "Microphone loopback during a voice calls(self-hearing)". Any commitments of adding new features after release via firmware upgrades?


----------



## Brooko

Vergil said:


> Fair point. It would be nice to see some measurements, so we could know how it behaves for certain with different IEMs. Personally I don't mind underdamping with my Beyer A20 (100Ω output impedance). Even FiiO's F9 Pros with their 28Ω sound good on it. It's a fuller, more relaxed sound. Maybe not for audiophiles, but way more fun than straight out of a smartphone. But then comparing a hifi desktop amp to a smartphone is almost as stupid as comparing it to the BTR3.
> 
> As for spending an extra $30 for a better source, I don't think the BTR3 was meant to be taken seriously. It's just a small BT DAC for sports / commuting.



Mine should be here next week.  I'll see what I can do about supplying measurements on my rig.  I haven't commented so far because the BTR3 hasn't arrived yet - but I've seen a lot of talk about what the device can drive and can't drive - but I'm wondering about real world results.

SubMash - you've been quite vocal so far.  Have you got the BTR3 and the ES100 (I see you have SE846)?  Have you performed any blind volume matched tests between both devices?

Also their specs are here : https://www.fiio.com/btr3_parameters

In most of the measurements they have - they were performed under load (its common practise for FiiO to do this with all their devices).  Usually they use a 32 ohm real world load.

As far as THD+N goes - the real question is at what point it is actually audible?  If both are inaudible to us during music playback - then the debate is meaningless.  Here's some good reading (admittedly its speakers) but follows the same debate - https://www.axiomaudio.com/blog/distortion.  Another is https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/ap...preting-thd-measurements-think-db-not-percent.

And regarding damping - the BTR3 has close to zero ohm impedance - so the discussion regarding the SE846 and damping doesn't correlate.  A source would have to have 1 ohm or more of OI to make a significantly audible frequency difference to the SE846 (usual 1:8 damping factor).  As far as current and voltage goes - FiiO has not published those specs so anything quoted is speculation.  I'm going to see if they have them (have already emailed their support staff).  What we do know is that:
Into a 16 ohm output - the BTR3 will put 33 mW
Into a 32 ohm output - the BTR3 will put 25 mW

This suggests that the BTR3 is more voltage restricted than current restricted, so backs up FiiO's guidance of 16-100 ohm devices.  I would suggest SubMash is probably right that the 9 ohm SE846 might be a difficult load for most low current amps - but note that FiiO already states it is not in their recommended guide.  So writing it off because it does not support the SE846 is something that will only apply to very low impedance IEMs.

I have a pair of 8 ohm DN2000J - so it will be interesting to see how they go when the BTR3 arrives.


----------



## georgelai57

https://www.facebook.com/FiiOAUDIO/videos/528237094299281/

A video on how to use the BTR3


----------



## georgelai57

And a comparison between this, the BTR1 and the uBTR

https://www.fiio.com/btr3_comparison


----------



## caprimulgus (Aug 18, 2018)

SubMash said:


> If you don't need serious source, why not to get something 3x cheaper than btr3? ES100 sounds very serious disregarding price. Btr3 for non demanding headphones could be quite comparable.



FWIW, my personal rationale for getting the BTR3 is that I want AptX-LL for gaming/TV use, while also future-proofing a bit, with the AptX-HD and LDAC support (neither of which I have a need for right now). Not many others can support AptX-LL AND higher quality codecs.

I guess the alternative is that I buy a cheaper AptX-LL receiver just for gaming/tv use, and then just grab a higher quality receiver later down the track for music listening (eg. ES100). But I would prefer to just have the one unit that can do everything, and BTR3 looks like the best option currently for using AptX-LL as well as supporting other codecs.

Just a pity that my XBA3 (which are my beater IEMs) are outside the 16-100ohm range provided by Fiio, and especially in the lower frequencies (I am a basshead). Hopefully they don’t sound TOO bad, but I guess I can just use other IEMs (I will mainly use the BTR3 with M-100, but the option to go IEM for more portability would be handy).

FWIW, I will mostly be using it with Genki AptX-LL Bluetooth transmitter for Nintendo Switch, as a portable gaming rig. Later down the track, I was planning to grab an Avantree Oasis Plus (or Mee Audio Connect) for TV watching over dual-link AptX-LL, or music listening over AptX-HD.


----------



## SubMash (Aug 18, 2018)

Brooko said:


> Mine should be here next week.  I'll see what I can do about supplying measurements on my rig.  I haven't commented so far because the BTR3 hasn't arrived yet - but I've seen a lot of talk about what the device can drive and can't drive - but I'm wondering about real world results.
> 
> SubMash - you've been quite vocal so far.  Have you got the BTR3 and the ES100 (I see you have SE846)?  Have you performed any blind volume matched tests between both devices?
> 
> ...


As I've stated before - I don't have btr3. So I'm only talking about physical difference of products specs. I do have es100. I don't see a point of single person blind test. It's also doesn't make sense for me to buy btr3, because all my headphones would work worse - 846 too low impedance, 650 - too high.

Most important measurements Fiio doesn't provide with any load - SNR and THD+N. FR also measured without load, btw. Power output at load provided from amp specs. And amp makes those 25mW with 60dB THD+N. 60dB you can hear if music is not too busy. But those 25mW are with ideal load. On 846 60db thd+n would happen way way sooner. On 650 you can't get any reasonable volume. Take a look how many tests Radsone published on website including comparisons to other similar products.

Btr3 doesn't have close to zero OI. Es100 paid a lot of attention to decrease OI, but ultimately it's amplifier impedance. Single 4375/76 amp is 1 Ohm OI. Dual makes it 0.5Ohm. ES100 is close to amp specs. BTR3 can't be below 1.0, but in reality could be worse.

I'm not writing off btr3. Apparently Fiio was looking at success of es100 designing product and price+looks offsets absence of second amp. So it has its place - high sensitivity 32Ohm headphones would work inaudibly same as es100 based on specs. But there are always a lot of work required to make sure ground noise, interference, crosstalk a are not coming out from PCB design. I have no idea if Fiio done it right in btr3.

Also, for instance, es100 changes volume with amp. A lot of products change volume with DAC to simplify design. How btr3 does it? I don't know. But if by DAC - you will have higher noise floor with low impedance headphones.

My point of being vocal here is to make sure people don't get distracted by marketing BS of 4376 noise floor without load.

P.S. I doubt that btr3 OI is 0.3Ohm. somebody who has it should verify it. Google how to measure it with a computer and splitter of audio signal.


----------



## SubMash

caprimulgus said:


> FWIW, my personal rationale for getting the BTR3 is that I want AptX-LL for gaming/TV use, while also future-proofing a bit, with the AptX-HD and LDAC support (neither of which I have a need for right now). Not many others can support AptX-LL AND higher quality codecs.
> 
> I guess the alternative is that I buy a cheaper AptX-LL receiver just for gaming/tv use, and then just grab a higher quality receiver later down the track for music listening (eg. ES100). But I would prefer to just have the one unit that can do everything, and BTR3 looks like the best option currently for using AptX-LL as well as supporting other codecs.
> 
> ...


Aptx-ll is useful addition for gaming if you have transmitter, but it's still significant lag. I'm using wired connection for games and do video delay correction in the HTPC player for movies over BT.


----------



## caprimulgus

SubMash said:


> Aptx-ll is useful addition for gaming if you have transmitter, but it's still significant lag. I'm using wired connection for games and do video delay correction in the HTPC player for movies over BT.



Yeah, it’s more for convenience, and to avoid fear of cable getting snagged on public transport (pulling either the headphones off head or Switch out of hands!). For this kind of use (non-competitive portable use, and for games that do not require pinpoint sound accuracy), I think AptX-LL would be an acceptable amount of lag.

For any games that required exact timing with sound, I would probably avoid Bluetooth altogether.


----------



## Brooko

SubMash said:


> As I've stated before - I don't have btr3. So I'm only talking about physical difference of products specs. I do have es100. I don't see a point of single person blind test. It's also doesn't make sense for me to buy btr3, because all my headphones would work worse - 846 too low impedance, 650 - too high.
> 
> Most important measurements Fiio doesn't provide with any load - SNR and THD+N. FR also measured without load, btw. Power output at load provided from amp specs. And amp makes those 25mW with 60dB THD+N. 60dB you can hear if music is not too busy. But those 25mW are with ideal load. On 846 60db thd+n would happen way way sooner. On 650 you can't get any reasonable volume. Take a look how many tests Radsone published on website including comparisons to other similar products.
> 
> ...



I'll translate for others on the thread.

The numbers you are quoting are what you've read on the specs without actually asking FiiO or without using the product.
WTH do you keep going on about the HD650 and SE846 for?  Both are outside the operating specifications FiiO recommends.
FiiO quite clearly states on their website that the output impedance is 0.3 ohms - under a 32 ohm load.
Also the chip used is not the only thing that dictates output impedance.  It also depends on the circuit being used.
You are making the assumption that FiiO just quotes chip specs.  They don't.  They have a full measurement suite at their research centre.  The numbers shown are real (actually measured) numbers.
I've asked about THD+N and SNR numbers - personally I'd rather ask the manufacturer than make assumptions.  I'll report back when I find out how they measured them


----------



## Brooko

SubMash said:


> P.S. I doubt that btr3 OI is 0.3Ohm. somebody who has it should verify it. Google how to measure it with a computer and splitter of audio signal.



I don't have a mutli-meter which has that sort of precision, and I don't have access to a decent analyser.  I do trust FiiO with the Audio Precision suite to be able to measure these things properly.


----------



## Niel_JM

has anybody tested this with a source with the likes of samsung phones from s8 and above?  considering these phones now support LDAC?


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> I don't have a mutli-meter which has that sort of precision, and I don't have access to a decent analyser.  I do trust FiiO with the Audio Precision suite to be able to measure these things properly.


I guess you don't have one. Because you can't measure OI with multimeter. Can't comment rest of the rant except that there is no way to use passive circuitry to decrease OI of chip. You can only make it higher. And I'm not aware of AP that can measure OI. Maybe there is one now. But if it was capable to do it - I'd rather see OI curve or at least mention frequency they used. Because load doesn't change OI, it's useless info. If it was 0.3 Ohm - they would not limit it to 16Ohm load...


----------



## Brooko

Actually you can (although normally you'd use a scope), and its not a rant.

Use a 1 kHz sine wave and measure peak to peak voltage with no load (can be done with an MM but scope would be preferred)
Add a known resistance (load) and remeasure
Then apply calc: RO = RL (Vopen/Vload -1)
Like I said - I have nothing which would give me the accuracy needed to measure the OI.

If you google Audio Precision and Output Impedance you'll find a series of articles on how they do it with their suites, and also note that there are software enhancements to allow you to have it as an automatic output from their hardware.  I'm not sure if this is the way FiiO is doing it - but it would make sense.

And finally - you keep going back to the chip specs, but we have no idea if FiiO are using anything post the chip to further boost or change the output power.  That circuitry can change impedance.


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> Actually you can (although normally you'd use a scope), and its not a rant.
> 
> Use a 1 kHz sine wave and measure peak to peak voltage with no load (can be done with an MM but scope would be preferred)
> Add a known resistance (load) and remeasure
> ...


Ok. Sorry, not a rant. And you are right, my last experience with AP was long time ago and I can Google before answering. Do you really believe that Fiio put second op-amp after first one and somehow magically didn't increase noise and said nothing about it? You can ask them about it, since you don't like to guess. I don't see a point in doing so.

And you can use sound card line input to record difference of sweep tone volume with and without simple 10Ohm resistance. It's precise enough and maybe there are even apps now that allow to convert 2 wave files into the table of OI points. Math is simple.


----------



## Flamwin

SubMash said:


> Can't comment rest of the rant except that there is no way to use passive circuitry to decrease OI of chip.


You can. See IFI iEMatch for an example. That's a passive device that reduces output impedance at the cost of reduced output voltage / power. See also here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-port_network.


----------



## Brooko

SubMash said:


> Ok. Sorry, not a rant. And you are right, my last experience with AP was long time ago and I can Google before answering. Do you really believe that Fiio put second op-amp after first one and somehow magically didn't increase noise and said nothing about it? You can ask them about it, since you don't like to guess. I don't see a point in doing so.
> 
> And you can use sound card line input to record difference of sweep tone volume with and without simple 10Ohm resistance. It's precise enough and maybe there are even apps now that allow to convert 2 wave files into the table of OI points. Math is simple.



As Flamwin quoted above - probably not even an OP amp - as there would be little point.  But clearly they did something, as the output is not the same as the chipset specs.  I asked Lily for some info on what they measured.  The thing with FiiO is that they've proven over time that they hide nothing, inflate nothing, and measure everything.  If they quote 0.3 ohm - they're not referring to a manual or calculations - they've measured it 

Anyway - lets wait and see what they say.  My unit supposed to arrive Tuesday - so I can also check performance with the 8ohm DN-2000J then as well.


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> As Flamwin quoted above - probably not even an OP amp - as there would be little point.  But clearly they did something, as the output is not the same as the chipset specs.  I asked Lily for some info on what they measured.  The thing with FiiO is that they've proven over time that they hide nothing, inflate nothing, and measure everything.  If they quote 0.3 ohm - they're not referring to a manual or calculations - they've measured it
> 
> Anyway - lets wait and see what they say.  My unit supposed to arrive Tuesday - so I can also check performance with the 8ohm DN-2000J then as well.


I doubt that they can improve OI without introducing either significant cost impact or noise. Can you convert the voltage to current? Yes. But once you have a 66$ retail price and high demand for low noise with AC signal - the second amp would be cheapest option to do it. I doubt it's 0.3 mostly because it should be a lower Ohm rating for a load. They only increased it from chip 14.4 to 16.0, so doesn't look like any black magic happening there. Also, you can measure OI on 1Hz signal and it would be great, but totally useless. So let's wait for responses, so far I only remind that this product is cheaper and better looking than the existing product on the market and price for that - single amp which is NOT only for those who need balanced connection. If we will have proof of opposite - it's ok, but there are no data supporting it yet. And I don't plan to buy btr3 just to test and prove my point. So limitations of my assumptions I'm clearly stating in every post.


----------



## SubMash

Flamwin said:


> You can. See IFI iEMatch for an example. That's a passive device that reduces output impedance at the cost of reduced output voltage / power. See also here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-port_network.


Is it just a resistor or its an inductor? From tech notes it sounds like - hey, if you use very high voltage amp and have to decrease volume - you're losing SNR, since decreasing volume doesn't bring down noise floor, so let's put resistor there which will bring down voltage and this way you can throw full-scale amp voltage on it (and convert some sound energy to heat)... ES100 changes volume by adjusting op-amp itself, so it doesn't have such a problem. I hope btr3 also does the same. You can decrease OI by converting a voltage to current on the inductor, but then tech notes don't make sense and it's certainly costly or plain bad quality due to the variable impedance of inductor itself. I don't understand relevance of link on two-port, sorry


----------



## Amber Rain

@FiiO  and anyone else...

Couldn't find it in this thread, perhaps it was in the BTR1 thread when it got hijacked:

Will the BTR3 decode 24 bit when being used as a UBS DAC with a computer (specifically a Mac), as I thought I had seen somewhere that it would be limited to 16Bit 48kHz?

Has anyone actually tested it with Shure SE846 yet? I had the BTR1 fairly briefly and can;t remember whether I had my SE846 or only SE535 at the time, but I don't remember volume  / power being an issue. Connectiovity wasn't an issue either (with an iPhone 6).

Thanks


----------



## SubMash

Amber Rain said:


> @FiiO  and anyone else...
> 
> Couldn't find it in this thread, perhaps it was in the BTR1 thread when it got hijacked:
> 
> ...


You won't have volume of power issue with it. But you might get hissing noise or just amp overload since its heavily out of specs.


----------



## Galeonero

Hello, a question about the DAC function, can it be used on an Android smartphone only as a DAC without the need for the Smartphone to load the BTR3?


----------



## novatax

Galeonero said:


> Hello, a question about the DAC function, can it be used on an Android smartphone only as a DAC without the need for the Smartphone to load the BTR3?



I'm using 1+3T, and yes it can. But, it drains the battery so fast, so I think there is no point to do so.


----------



## Galeonero

novatax said:


> I'm using 1+3T, and yes it can. But, it drains the battery so fast, so I think there is no point to do so.


Uh what a problem, I still can not find a 100% viable solution with high quality audio for my smartphone (pixel 2) that does not have a 3.5 mm input.


----------



## novatax

Galeonero said:


> Uh what a problem, I still can not find a 100% viable solution with high quality audio for my smartphone (pixel 2) that does not have a 3.5 mm input.



What? What's wrong with your bluetooth? BTR3 was made as bluetooth receiver at the beginning, so I believe Fiio has put a lot of effort into it. USB DAC is only a bonus. Beside, I couldn't tell sound differences while connected to USB DAC or bluetooth. Maybe my ears are not audiophile's grade, but I'm sure if there were differences, they were small.
If you still want to be tethered to your phone to have a high quality audio, you might want to look at somewhere else.


----------



## Galeonero (Aug 19, 2018)

novatax said:


> What? What's wrong with your bluetooth? BTR3 was made as bluetooth receiver at the beginning, so I believe Fiio has put a lot of effort into it. USB DAC is only a bonus. Beside, I couldn't tell sound differences while connected to USB DAC or bluetooth. Maybe my ears are not audiophile's grade, but I'm sure if there were differences, they were small.
> If you still want to be tethered to your phone to have a high quality audio, you might want to look at somewhere else.


My problem or doubt is that I had a SoundPeats In-ear headphones of the brand Q36 that have many sales for several pages including Amazon and had excellent review, and the bluetooth was really bad and that I used them using Aptx HD, they have a lot of interference, the music gets too stuck and forget when it was cold and I'm with the headphones and over a scarf all those problems are duplicated ...
My phone did not have any kind of problem with the Bluetooth I used it with Harman Kardon speakers and had no interference whatsoever.
So I think that because it's something so small, Bluetooth is not so reliable.
If I have thought about it, buy another Smartphone with 3.5 mm like the LG v30 that have a very good QuadDac but as a phone I do not like them, so I prefer to have the Pixel 2 that works very well and a device for sound that is of high quality .
Surely this wrong and the SoundPeats are a bad purchase I made. Does this BTR3 have a problem with your Bluetooth connection?


----------



## Brooko

@SubMash - as promised 

From FiiO:



> The peak voltage output is about 2.5Vp-p and the maximum output current is about 80mA; For the distortion, SNR and THD+N figures, they all measured under 32Ω loaded。



And the 0.3 ohm is measured - not estimated or calculated


----------



## Amber Rain

SubMash said:


> You won't have volume of power issue with it. But you might get hissing noise or just amp overload since its heavily out of specs.



Thanks. 

Do the specs provided by Brooko alter your opinion of the BTR3 and / or matching with the SE846?

Would the BTR1 be a better match for the SE846?

The other BT receiver I am considering is the ES100, which I note you have stated pairs nicely with the SE846, however it's significantly more expensive and I dive no real need for balanced or for a USB DAC (i still  a Fiio E17). how did you find the ES100 grin a usability point of view?


----------



## georgelai57

Bought and sold the ES100 within a week. Couldn’t get used to the weird placement of the volume buttons and the FW updates especially on a Mac were ridiculously complicated.


----------



## Koolpep (Aug 20, 2018)

ES100 is by far the best $99 I have spend in regards to any DAC/Amp ever. It still surprises me time and time again with my multi BA in ears as well as massive DD in ears, it even drives most of my over ears very well. It's the most used device of my BT transmitters, I have the BTR-1, AK XB10, mPow something and the ES100. It's also the absolutely most versatile. The options one can set in the app are amazing.

BUT: I will get the BTR-3 too as I use these things daily for calls and music, so always checking for good and latency free quality.
I am sure though that Fiio is working on a competitor with the BTR-5  so if you prefer to wait....

@Amber Rain you should visit the ES100 thread and check the opinions out there.

@georgelai57 Sorry but any halfway literate Mac person who has used the terminal before can update the firmware in 2 minutes. The manual is step by step and works a charm. It's not that complicated - again the documentation is pretty good. For Windows it's easier and takes 1 minute. But here is the thing: you don't need to update the firmware if you are happy with what the device does. It's hardly a downside, better than not having the option at all. Also - it has a dedicated app in which you can set the analog volume of the device. I usually use that. I agree though that the ergonomics could be better if you have to use the buttons. Anyhow I got used to it within a day or two.

However - if you have a budget and you don't want to spend more than 70 bucks - I doubt you can do better than the BTR-3. I am a fan of the Fiio brand from the first X3, first X5, to their cables and headphones, amps and DAC/amps I really never had a bad experience. And recently their industrial design is on a completely new level as well.

Cheers


----------



## Amber Rain (Aug 20, 2018)

Koolpep said:


> ES100 is by far the best $99 I have spend in regards to any DAC/Amp ever. It still surprises me time and time again with my multi BA in ears as well as massive DD in ears, it even drives most of my over ears very well. It's the most used device of my BT transmitters, I have the BTR-1, AK XB10, mPow something and the ES100. It's also the absolutely most versatile. The options one can set in the app are amazing.
> 
> BUT: I will get the BTR-3 too as I use these things daily for calls and music, so always checking for good and latency free quality.
> I am sure though that Fiio is working on a competitor with the BTR-5  so if you prefer to wait....
> ...


 Thanks for the reply and pointers, I've been most of the way through the ES100 thread


----------



## SubMash (Aug 20, 2018)

Brooko said:


> @SubMash - as promised
> 
> From FiiO: The peak voltage output is about 2.5Vp-p and the maximum output current is about 80mA; For the distortion, SNR and THD+N figures, they all measured under 32Ω loaded。
> And the 0.3 ohm is measured - not estimated or calculated


Since I don't plan to test it myself - I will just doubt about how SNR and OI were measured and escape from this talk.
Also, I don't see how it can make 71mW of undistorted output from specs above - it just doesn't match with other specs provided.


----------



## SubMash (Aug 20, 2018)

Amber Rain said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Do the specs provided by Brooko alter your opinion of the BTR3 and / or matching with the SE846?
> 
> ...


On 846 my position is the same - it is clearly out of the specs of any BTR. If the manufacturer asks you not to put such load on the amp - why would you do it?
BTR1 can only be worse than BTR3, since it's older design and same amp.

For me ES100 became ideal device after a bunch of app updates they did. Yes, buttons are not perfectly placed. But device just works more reliable than any BT device I ever had. And no issues with sound.


----------



## bowei006 (Aug 20, 2018)

Received it today.

*NOTE THESE ARE INFORMAL EARLY IMPRESSIONS.  FINAL REVIEW IS SUBJECT TO CHANGE. *

Phenomenal performance for the price.

Yes I'm an audiophile but in the end, convenience is huge in my life. So therefore being on the go with my Essential PH1 (no headphone jack, not that I'd use it anyway) is crucial.

I've bought consumer BT devices in the past for speakers and even have an _audiophile _BT receiver, the Bluewave GET ($110).

The value proposition of this device pretty much wins it for me. It beats the Bluewave GET in most areas and at ~60% the price.

*Consumer *'higher' end BT (so not including ES100) cost me about $35 and only supported SBC (most basic BT streaming standard) with semi frequent drops despite my phone being within 0.3m of the receiver constantly (this happened with multiple devices).

The Bluewave GET is more well rounded in the sound with the BTR3 a bit too bassy but I've had problems with un-reliable BT reception and an inability to keep AptX HD.

The BTR3 immediately was able to drop into LDAC mode (I'm using Android 8.1 Developer settings to force my phone output BT mode) immediately. I was able to go 6m without Line of Sight without noticeable quality drops or buffering stutters.

It was also DEAD quiet when used with my CIEMs (InEarz Euphoria) which are sensitive. I did not detect/believe this to be an automatic muting of the amplifier to give the impression of no noise. Nearly all consumer devices do this and FiiO has done it in the past with their DAPs in selectively cutting off the amp and re-engaging it when called for to prevent excess noise and to save power. I did quick stop and plays of quiet songs and even boosted the volume. NOTE: This was a quick 3min test just now. I could be wrong and they are actually muting the op amp section. More time is needed.


If the best consumer BT receiver units are $30-$40 and can barely keep SBC. Then the BTR just about kills them. And that's before the USB C connector and USB DAC option.

I've only spent about 3 hours with it so far. Final official reviews will be available on Headphone.Guru. Please look forward to it.


----------



## bowei006

ezekiel77 said:


> Just got mine. It's tiny and looks well-built. Tested immediately with my phone and the connection and sound seems fine.
> 
> Then tried connecting to my WM1A via BT and NFC. In both cases while they connected quickly (NFC was especially fast), the connection drops all too easily, even at 10cm (4 inches) distance between the WM1A and BTR3. They have to be within touching distance to get a decent connection (and the sound is awesome since all my hi-res files are there), but the close distance defeats the purpose of the BTR3 in the first place.
> 
> I'll try to get to the bottom of this, but if any BTR3 users have a WM1A/1Z please try this out as well. Will be looking for BT issues in the Sony Walkman thread too.



Weird, I was able to get quite far away without losing connection even while streaming LDAC at 32bit resolution. I'm ussing an Essential PH1



Niel_JM said:


> has anybody tested this with a source with the likes of samsung phones from s8 and above?  considering these phones now support LDAC?



Yep, excellent range and no immediate noticeable artifcats due to BT. It obv sounds different due to its amp and DAC compared to what I ran my CIEMs off of.

My PH1 has the same BT specs as the S8 and above to my knowledge. All the Qualcomm specs and LDAC.

Was streaming from my phone with the following settings


LDAC
AVRCP 1.6
96kHz
32bits
LDAC : Best Effort, Adaptive Bit Rate mode\

was able to do 35feet open hallway, no obstructions with direct line of sight with no noticeable quality decrease


----------



## Galeonero

Hello, I have a question about this device in terms of which Bluetooth transmission protocol you use if it is Aptx or Aptx HD or LDAC, in which I would modify the experience if I use one or the other if the final result is converted by the AK4376A dac?


----------



## bowei006

Galeonero said:


> Hello, I have a question about this device in terms of which Bluetooth transmission protocol you use if it is Aptx or Aptx HD or LDAC, in which I would modify the experience if I use one or the other if the final result is converted by the AK4376A dac?



I don't completely get your question but don't over think this.

The DAC on this device is a constant. The streaming standards are stand-ins for the physical cable and each are a digital method of utilizing the wireless highway to deliver the digital bits from your BT source (transmissting digital bits out of it) and then sending it to the BTR3's own DAC afterwards.

Sony's LDAC standard is commonly considered to be the 'best' with Qualcomm's AptX-HD as the second best alternative.

Not every BT source supports LDAC or Qualcomm AptX/HD


----------



## mvadu

mvadu said:


> Yes, as per the white paper on Radsone
> 
> 
> 
> ...



@FiiO Any commitment you can make about the firware updates and incorporating user feedback in your future updates?


----------



## ezekiel77

bowei006 said:


> Weird, I was able to get quite far away without losing connection even while streaming LDAC at 32bit resolution. I'm ussing an Essential PH1



No issues with the BTR3 if paired with my phone, so the Sony Walkman issue might be isolated in my case (mine was modded).


----------



## bowei006

ezekiel77 said:


> No issues with the BTR3 if paired with my phone, so the Sony Walkman issue might be isolated in my case (mine was modded).



I've found dedicated DAPs Bluetooth transmitters to usually be lacking compared to cell phones. 

This is pure conjecture but im guessing the BT in phones is using the pre-designed and HIGHLY engineered frequency arrays and antennas scattered across the phone's body. And with them being communication devices first, always have a lot of engineering in finding the right places to put the antennas and what patterns.

Whereas BT on dedicated DAPs might just be a chip on board solution with a rudimentary antenna located somewhere on it.

I tested earlier and got 35ft away with direct Line of Sight and had no issues when using with my smartphone.


----------



## Galeonero

bowei006 said:


> I don't completely get your question but don't over think this.
> 
> The DAC on this device is a constant. The streaming standards are stand-ins for the physical cable and each are a digital method of utilizing the wireless highway to deliver the digital bits from your BT source (transmissting digital bits out of it) and then sending it to the BTR3's own DAC afterwards.
> 
> ...


Of course, that just asked if there was any change in transmitting Aptx HD or LDAC, regardless of whether your device supports it or not.
But for what you are saying no, there are different protocols to have more compatibility with other devices.


----------



## Amber Rain

SubMash said:


> On 846 my position is the same - it is clearly out of the specs of any BTR. If the manufacturer asks you not to put such load on the amp - why would you do it?
> BTR1 can only be worse than BTR3, since it's older design and same amp.
> 
> For me ES100 became ideal device after a bunch of app updates they did. Yes, buttons are not perfectly placed. But device just works more reliable than any BT device I ever had. And no issues with sound.



Thanks for the reply.


----------



## Brooko

SubMash said:


> Since I don't plan to test it myself - I will just doubt about how SNR and OI were measured and escape from this talk.
> Also, I don't see how it can make 71mW of undistorted output from specs above - it just doesn't match with other specs provided.



Where did you get 71 mW from?

From spec sheet :


> About 25mW (32Ω loaded)
> About 33mW (16Ω loaded)



I have no reason to doubt their measurements - like I said, they have a full measurement suite, and they measure everything.  It would be nice if more manufacturers took the same approach.

Anyway - the BTR3 showed up today.  Really nice looking little unit. Easy connection.  Bluetooth range is very good - easily 10m ++.  Connection strong and only had a couple of micro drop-outs early on.  Seems to be more stable now.  Sounds pretty good - but need more testing before I comment.  Love the independent controls too


----------



## Brooko

Oh and I tried the BTR3 with the 8 ohm DN2000J.  I can't hear hiss because of my permanent tinnitus, so I threw the 2000J on the measurement rig, and then increased the volume to see if I could record some hiss.  All I got was steady noise floor (just below 40 dB).  Tomorrow I'll get my daughter to test them and see if she hears any hiss (she has fantastic hearing).  For me though - its a pretty clean signal.


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> Where did you get 71 mW from?
> 
> From spec sheet :
> 
> ...


I use their Vpp and current limits from your message. I have troubles debating argument - "just trust them, they do it right". Maybe yes, maybe no. It doesn't matter. I can compare to what data Radsone provides that is much more informative.


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> Oh and I tried the BTR3 with the 8 ohm DN2000J.  I can't hear hiss because of my permanent tinnitus, so I threw the 2000J on the measurement rig, and then increased the volume to see if I could record some hiss.  All I got was steady noise floor (just below 40 dB).  Tomorrow I'll get my daughter to test them and see if she hears any hiss (she has fantastic hearing).  For me though - its a pretty clean signal.


40db SNR is clean for you?


----------



## Vergil (Aug 21, 2018)

SubMash said:


> 40db SNR is clean for you?


Must be his measurement rig. I have a hard time believing that a modern amp has -40 dB noise floor. That's even worse than a Schiit multibit. That'd be quite a feat.


----------



## SubMash

Vergil said:


> Must be his measurement rig. I have a hard time believing that a modern amp has -40 dB noise floor. That's even worse than a Schiit multibit. That'd be quite a feat.


Normally maximum power specs are with 60db THD+N aka 0.1%. 40db is 1%. It all depends on how much volume he pushed and if there was any signal even at that time, because without signal amp is not working.


----------



## artpiggo

They should add 2.5 balanced since I don't mind this kit being a little bit more expensive. since all my gears are now balanced and it needs adapter plug to use with this stuff.


----------



## FiiO

zerolight said:


> Does this support iOS volume sync. I get that it is useful to be able to control the volume of the BTR3 independently of the iPhone volume, but I like to adjust the volume of my music with the source, particularly nice to control iPhone volume with Apple Watch. Most BT devices default to volume sync, iPhone puts out full volume and then iPhone can control the BT analogue volume. I believe the ES100 can do this, but I'd prefer the BTR3, assuming it's a good match to my K10.


Dear friend,

The volume control for BTR3 and the iPhone is independent.

Best regards


----------



## georgelai57

artpiggo said:


> They should add 2.5 balanced since I don't mind this kit being a little bit more expensive. since all my gears are now balanced and it needs adapter plug to use with this stuff.


BTR5 or BTR 7 at a higher cost


----------



## artpiggo

georgelai57 said:


> BTR5 or BTR 7 at a higher cost



need to wait one more year probably


----------



## FiiO

Amber Rain said:


> @FiiO  and anyone else...
> 
> Couldn't find it in this thread, perhaps it was in the BTR1 thread when it got hijacked:
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

Because of the hardware limitation, the BTR3 can support to 16bit 48kHz at most when working as USB DAC.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

mvadu said:


> @FiiO Any commitment you can make about the firware updates and incorporating user feedback in your future updates?


Dear friend,

The users can update the firmware for the BTR3 by themselves.

Best regards


----------



## Brooko (Aug 22, 2018)

SubMash said:


> 40db SNR is clean for you?



Sorry tired when I did it last night.  It was with an SPL meter and connector - and was at max volume (not the actual measurement rig as I incorrectly stated).  The SPL meter was measuring the room noise floor (quiet room).  And who said anything about SNR - I was trying to see if the hiss was apparent over the ambient noise floor (it wasn't).  Like I said - I can't hear it because of my tinnitus.

SNR on a proper rig is 120dB A-weighted (32 ohm loaded)

Real world test with the DN-2000J.  My 13 yo daughter (also a music lover) listens at around 60 dB (I don't know how she does it), and can hear our cat walk on carpet from 10-15m away.  X5iii at max volume, Bluetooth (apt-X) to BTR3 - also set at max volume.  Hiss is audible (no music playing), disappeared as I lowered the volume.  At the volume she said it disappeared altogether, I then played a track - and the ave music SPL was ~70-75 dB.

With music masking, there is no audible hiss even at her 60-65 dB level - except if there is no music playing.

This is with the 8ohm, 102 dB SPL DN-2000J.

For the recommended 16 ohm+ I don't think you'll get any real hiss.  For lower, it will depend on the sensitivity of the earphone in question.

So for someone like SubMash with low impedance high sensitivity earphones, and who may be sensitive to hiss - don't recommend it.  For anyone with normal 16-100 ohm earphones, I don't think you'll have a problem.

Anyway - I really like the little device.


----------



## iaTa

Fiio is there any chance you could add an ambient mode similar to the ES100?


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> Sorry tired when I did it last night.  It was with an SPL meter and connector - and was at max volume (not the actual measurement rig as I incorrectly stated).  The SPL meter was measuring the room noise floor (quiet room).  And who said anything about SNR - I was trying to see if the hiss was apparent over the ambient noise floor (it wasn't).  Like I said - I can't hear it because of my tinnitus.
> 
> SNR on a proper rig is 120dB A-weighted (32 ohm loaded)
> 
> ...


60dB SPL is not very loud music at all. But how are you measuring it, I'm lost...
Certainly, you can fix hiss by adding resistance in line - 846 even comes already with such wire already.
That comes with the cost of wasting battery and destruction of OI even further, so no damping - raise of IEM harmonics even further.

And so if we comparing to ES100 - even if I set the volume to 140dB SPL (calculated) and play very silent beeps it has a noise floor that I can't hear at all. And I'm good at hearing such thing. So, no miracle - 2 amps do their job to extend a range of headphones that are compatible and generally increasing SNR under load.

And speaking about specs of SNR of BTR3 - if the amp is set to lowest volume it would do good SNR and THD+N close to DAC level even with a 32Ohm load. But it's a manipulation - this amp makes -60dB of THD+N at declared maximum power. And it's not 1000mW crazy amp, so result going to be different. And hiss if it's audible with music - it's closer to 40-50dB.


----------



## hotdog108

Still waiting for Amazon, or any US based vendor for that matter. I checked a dozen of them this morning and nobody seems to have it in stock. Next week perhaps.


----------



## Brooko

SubMash said:


> 60dB SPL is not very loud music at all. But how are you measuring it, I'm lost...
> Certainly, you can fix hiss by adding resistance in line - 846 even comes already with such wire already.
> That comes with the cost of wasting battery and destruction of OI even further, so no damping - raise of IEM harmonics even further.
> 
> ...



You didn't read my post properly (or I didn't explain it well enough - mea culpa) - the hiss isn't audible with music playing.  My daughter - who probably has keener hearing than you - couldn't hear any hiss with the DN-2000J even at her 60 dB while music was playing.  With no music there is audible hiss - but its pretty faint.  I measured the listening levels we used with a calibrated SPL meter.  This only happens with very low impedance and high sensitivity earphones.

Look - I get it.  You haven't got much good to say about the BTR3, and you are obviously happy with your ES100.  By your own admission, the BTR3 isn't suitable for you and your headphones, and you have no intention of getting it.  I can't really understand why you're still on the thread?  Enjoy your ES100, and please allow the people who are going to buy the BTR3 the peace to enjoy it.  It sounds great to me with my chosen earphones (a variety from the HifiMan RE-2000 and 64Audio U10 down to the more budget FH1).  In real world terms, and from FiiO's actual measurements - it performs pretty well - especially considering it's price.

Its not important that you don't believe FiiOs real world measurements, or believe my real world experience.  What would be nice is if people who actually have experience with it now have the freedom to relate their experiences without someone constantly quoting specs and telling us "how we should be hearing it".

If the boot was on the other foot - how would it be if I (with no ES100 experience) went to that thread, and started making claims about how it performs - straight from the manufacturers chip spec sheet?

All I'm suggesting is that it may be time to leave those interested in the product the chance to actually discuss it - from real world experience.


----------



## hotdog108

Brooko said:


> You didn't read my post properly (or I didn't explain it well enough - mea culpa) - the hiss isn't audible with music playing.  My daughter - who probably has keener hearing than you - couldn't hear any hiss with the DN-2000J even at her 60 dB while music was playing.  With no music there is audible hiss - but its pretty faint.  I measured the listening levels we used with a calibrated SPL meter.  This only happens with very low impedance and high sensitivity earphones.
> 
> Look - I get it.  You haven't got much good to say about the BTR3, and you are obviously happy with your ES100.  By your own admission, the BTR3 isn't suitable for you and your headphones, and you have no intention of getting it.  I can't really understand why you're still on the thread?  Enjoy your ES100, and please allow the people who are going to buy the BTR3 the peace to enjoy it.  It sounds great to me with my chosen earphones (a variety from the HifiMan RE-2000 and 64Audio U10 down to the more budget FH1).  In real world terms, and from FiiO's actual measurements - it performs pretty well - especially considering it's price.
> 
> ...


Amen


----------



## zhubajie

iaTa said:


> Fiio is there any chance you could add an ambient mode similar to the ES100?



Weird, we call ourselves audiophiles but some then ask to add functions to be able to rape the sound.
Maybe they can add "Spatial Stereo" too


----------



## hotdog108

zhubajie said:


> Weird, we call ourselves audiophiles but some then ask to add functions to be able to rape the sound.
> Maybe they can add "Spatial Stereo" too


Or how about a "NY Times Square during rush hour commute mode", let us experience the horror without actually being there


----------



## iaTa (Aug 22, 2018)

Just be handy when I'm out and about wearing ER4s, crossing a road for example.

This a portable use product after all 

Plus it's not like you would have it enabled 24/7 and "rape the sound" at all times.

A quick way to enable/disable like the ES100 would be perfect.


----------



## hotdog108

iaTa said:


> Just be handy when I'm out and about wearing ER4s, crossing a road for example.
> 
> This a portable use product after all


If your IEMs are not providing adequate sound isolation, then you should be looking into different tips, or even custom tips. Active noise cancelling is not a good thing for audio quality. I wear my custom tip with my Noble Bell to the out door shooting range, without music playing thru them, and the isolation is completely acceptable. I wear my custom Noble Encores as ear protection to the indoor shooting range, and they work just fine without music, better than the universal IEM with custom tips. I can't imagine any city dwelling scenario that would be louder than a shooting range, and I work near Times Square, have to walk thru there every day during rush hour.


----------



## iaTa (Aug 22, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> If your IEMs are not providing adequate sound isolation, then you should be looking into different tips, or even custom tips. Active noise cancelling is not a good thing for audio quality. I wear my custom tip with my Noble Bell to the out door shooting range, without music playing thru them, and the isolation is completely acceptable. I wear my custom Noble Encores as ear protection to the indoor shooting range, and they work just fine without music, better than the universal IEM with custom tips. I can't imagine any city dwelling scenario that would be louder than a shooting range, and I work near Times Square, have to walk thru there every day during rush hour.



It seems you don't know what ambient mode in the ES100 actually achieves. It is not ANC, quite the opposite in fact. It enables you to temporarily hear the world around you without having to remove your IEMs/headphones.

Also FYI I have custom tips for my ER4s which give superb isolation, hence my request for ambient mode.


----------



## hotdog108

iaTa said:


> It seems you don't know what ambient mode in the ES100 actually achieves. It is not ANC, quite the opposite in fact. It's so that you can temporarily hear the world around you.
> 
> Also FYI I have custom tips for my ER4s which are superb, hence my request for ambient mode.


Why not use your eyes to pay attention to the surroundings? That's what I do when I'm walking to/from work, thru Times Square, arguably the busiest crossings in North America. Adding ambient mode seems counter intuitive, take them out of your ears if you want to hear what's around you.


----------



## zhubajie

hotdog108 said:


> Or how about a "NY Times Square during rush hour commute mode", let us experience the horror without actually being there


Or what about a "Hiss, Static and Other Distortions" mode to relive those good old days?


----------



## iaTa

hotdog108 said:


> Why not use your eyes to pay attention to the surroundings? That's what I do when I'm walking to/from work, thru Times Square, arguably the busiest crossings in North America. Adding ambient mode seems counter intuitive, take them out of your ears if you want to hear what's around you.



I live in central London which is arguably even worse than NYC for pedestrian/cyclist/motor traffic. You cannot purely rely on your eyes.

I also have very funny shaped ear canals (small at the start and then open up) so removing and reinserting IEMs isn't hugely pleasant.

Anyway what's it to you if a feature is added, you don't have to use it so how is it counter intuitive?


----------



## hotdog108

iaTa said:


> I live in central London which is arguably even worse than NYC for pedestrian/cyclist/motor traffic. You cannot purely rely on your eyes.
> 
> I also have very funny shaped ear canals (small at the start and then open up) so removing and reinserting IEMs isn't hugely pleasant.
> 
> Anyway what's it to you if a feature is added, you don't have to use it so how is it counter intuitive?


How is it not? Introducing ambient noise to the music we're listening to, when all of us here are essentially looking for better sound quality from our equipment. Actively introducing noise of any kind to our listening experience isn't something many of us here are looking to do, if any. If safety is your main concern, then wearing headphones with excellent sound isolation is also counter intuitive, is it not?


----------



## iaTa (Aug 22, 2018)

Sigh. That's one use case which would be incredibly useful to me and others.

There is a myriad of other situations where you could want/need to temporarily hear the world around you.

Someone talks to you? Double tap a button so you can hear them, double tap and you're back as you were.

Not sure why you are being so argumentative. ES100 users find the feature very useful.


----------



## hotdog108

iaTa said:


> Sigh. That's one use case which would be incredibly useful to me and others.
> 
> There are a myriad of other situations where you could want/need to temporarily hear the world around you.
> 
> ...


I understand that you find the feature very useful, I can certainly picture the use cases. I'm just struggling to understand why if you and others with ES100 are so happy with the product, that you're looking to switch to the BTR3, but you want the BTR3 to become more like the ES100. It's like asking Apple to add an Android feature to the iPhone, because you have and love an Android phone, but want to switch to an iPhone, but this one feature is important to you so you want it available on the iPhone. Why not stick with the ES100 if it's so fantastic?


----------



## iaTa (Aug 22, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> I understand that you find the feature very useful, I can certainly picture the use cases. I'm just struggling to understand why if you and others with ES100 are so happy with the product, that you're looking to switch to the BTR3, but you want the BTR3 to become more like the ES100. It's like asking Apple to add an Android feature to the iPhone, because you have and love an Android phone, but want to switch to an iPhone, but this one feature is important to you so you want it available on the iPhone. Why not stick with the ES100 if it's so fantastic?



Lol, how did I know that was coming. Price, build quality and USB-C charging mainly.

Plus adding a feature such as this is most likely a firmware/software update, not hardware.

A very reasonable request I would say.

FYI I don't own an ES100 but I do have a BTR3 on pre-order.


----------



## mikp

I looked at the es100, but since it is only sold on amazon it would cost me 143$ with prepaid import tax.

The btr3 arrived today and also a fiio 40cm mmcx cable for combined 80$ including shipping from the Chinese agent


----------



## iaTa

mikp said:


> The btr3 arrived today and also a fiio 40cm mmcx cable for combined 80$ including shipping from the Chinese agent



Awesome. What are your first impressions?


----------



## mikp

iaTa said:


> Awesome. What are your first impressions?



Well I'm away so it will be some days till I can try it. Most surprised that it is cheaper and almost faster ordering from Chinese shopping agent with ems than shops in my own country.


----------



## SubMash

Brooko said:


> You didn't read my post properly (or I didn't explain it well enough - mea culpa) - the hiss isn't audible with music playing.  My daughter - who probably has keener hearing than you - couldn't hear any hiss with the DN-2000J even at her 60 dB while music was playing.  With no music there is audible hiss - but its pretty faint.  I measured the listening levels we used with a calibrated SPL meter.  This only happens with very low impedance and high sensitivity earphones.
> 
> Look - I get it.  You haven't got much good to say about the BTR3, and you are obviously happy with your ES100.  By your own admission, the BTR3 isn't suitable for you and your headphones, and you have no intention of getting it.  I can't really understand why you're still on the thread?  Enjoy your ES100, and please allow the people who are going to buy the BTR3 the peace to enjoy it.  It sounds great to me with my chosen earphones (a variety from the HifiMan RE-2000 and 64Audio U10 down to the more budget FH1).  In real world terms, and from FiiO's actual measurements - it performs pretty well - especially considering it's price.
> 
> ...


Good old - "if you dont like it - leave this thread". Those interested in the product don't have it. Should they leave also? We already agreed long time ago - those headphones are out of specs for it. But you're still testing something and answering to me. Stop confusing people that using it out of specs is ok. All I said - low sensitivity or low impedance or high impedance - choose es100, because they are similar devices. Looking for savings and outlook - btr3.

P.S. I had exactly same talks on es100 thread where people don't want me to talk about problems and asking why am I there. We survived 3 thread clean-ups there. Just relax.


----------



## bowei006

We can at least all agree on one thing with the BTR3.

The god awful LQ bootup sound has got to go - All Head-Fiers


----------



## avnv007

I was planning to buy q1 mark II  but now this got launch what will be the sound difference between these 2 .. i  could go  for btr3 because of portability 
Should i buy this. how is the sound quality compared to q1 mark 2 and i need a dac for my laptop also should this would be sufficient?

I have these iem
1.Rha ma750
2.1 more triple drive
3.momentum 2


----------



## Vergil (Aug 23, 2018)

mikp said:


> Well I'm away so it will be some days till I can try it. Most surprised that it is cheaper and almost faster ordering from Chinese shopping agent with ems than shops in my own country.


I wouldn't buy from china. My local distributor says some European shipments are going back to China, because of some kind of a hardware issue. Maybe the Chinese batch is fine, but I doubt it. Chinese manufacturers always beta test with their own people, that's why worldwide releases are often later.

Edit: it's also a general rule to never buy from first shipment.


----------



## zhubajie

Vergil said:


> I wouldn't buy from china. My local distributor says some European shipments are going back to China, because of some kind of a hardware issue. Maybe the Chinese batch is fine, but I doubt it. Chinese manufacturers always beta test with their own people, that's why worldwide releases are often later.
> 
> Edit: it's also a general rule to never buy from first shipment.



But local distributors want you to buy from them so you can expect them to say such things.

But it's indeed always best to wait a little and skip the first batch.
But, children of our time as we are; WE WANT IT NOW!


----------



## Vergil

zhubajie said:


> But local distributors want you to buy from them so you can expect them to say such things.
> 
> But it's indeed always best to wait a little and skip the first batch.
> But, children of our time as we are; WE WANT IT NOW!


_I want it all...
I want it all...
I want it all...
and I want it now. _


----------



## Brooko

avnv007 said:


> I was planning to buy q1 mark II  but now this got launch what will be the sound difference between these 2 .. i  could go  for btr3 because of portability
> Should i buy this. how is the sound quality compared to q1 mark 2 and i need a dac for my laptop also should this would be sufficient?
> 
> I have these iem
> ...



Both can handle your earphones with no problems - although the Q1ii has almost 3 x the power, and also has balanced out (if that is a factor).  The BTR3 has the extra portability and also the Bluetooth option (so you can work wirelessly from your laptop).  It also has a mic if thats important to you.

I just tried both with my laptop (HP Core i7 Elitebook).  Both install Windows generic HQ audio drivers and are recognised automatically.  And both sound comparable (tested with a pair of HD630VB).  Ultimately depends on your intended use.  If you value portability and like the idea of wireless connection to both phone and laptop (as well as mic) - then the BTR3 is a great option.  If you don't care as much for ultra-portability, want to future proof power options a little more, and like the idea of a balanced output and also things like bass boost - then Q1ii is better choice.

Sonically they both sound pretty good.


----------



## zerolight

I'm tempted to order the BTR3 when it hits the UK since it's about 60% of the price of the ES100. Given my K10s should fall into the Fiio spec I find it hard to believe that the double dacs in the ES100 will have any real impact on the sound. If this was likely to be the only BT DAC I purchase over the next year then I'd go with the ES100 for more versatility (the increased power working with more headphones). However, I feel like this is really just the beginning and I expect within a year I'll be selling whatever I buy to replace it with something has a higher end Burr Brown or Sabre DAC included. 

Feels like this is where the market is going. More and more of us are listening to Apple Music & Spotify. BT is pretty much lossless in transmitting AAC from Apple Music to one of these things, so it's making more sense to me to have an iPhone and a BT device rather than a CCK + USB dac or a dedicated player. Even if I do miss the sound of my old and sold Mojo. A BTR5 with an ESS9018M or similar makes sense.


----------



## CodyZzZ

Brooko said:


> Sorry tired when I did it last night.  It was with an SPL meter and connector - and was at max volume (not the actual measurement rig as I incorrectly stated).  The SPL meter was measuring the room noise floor (quiet room).  And who said anything about SNR - I was trying to see if the hiss was apparent over the ambient noise floor (it wasn't).  Like I said - I can't hear it because of my tinnitus.
> 
> SNR on a proper rig is 120dB A-weighted (32 ohm loaded)
> 
> ...



Thanks, what are your thoughts on CA Andromeda with these? They have a slightly higher impedance (12.8) but higher sensitivity as well (113). I hear quite a bit of hiss on the BTR1s and wondering whether this will be any different.


----------



## Brooko

CodyZzZ said:


> Thanks, what are your thoughts on CA Andromeda with these? They have a slightly higher impedance (12.8) but higher sensitivity as well (113). I hear quite a bit of hiss on the BTR1s and wondering whether this will be any different.



Given the higher sensitivity of the Andros and the fact that you could hear the noise floor (hiss) with the DN-2000J, then I'd expect you'll also get hiss with the BTR3.


----------



## iaTa

Vergil said:


> I wouldn't buy from china. My local distributor says some European shipments are going back to China, because of some kind of a hardware issue. Maybe the Chinese batch is fine, but I doubt it. Chinese manufacturers always beta test with their own people, that's why worldwide releases are often later.
> 
> Edit: it's also a general rule to never buy from first shipment.



That would explain why everyone is out of stock including FiiO themselves.


----------



## bowei006 (Aug 23, 2018)

Small design quirks I've noticed. More minor quality of life and User Interface and design.

But the beeps that signal the powering off should be tonally decreasing. Instead it does a quick decrease but then a quick uptick in tone with a flashing blue LED (3x i think).

 The Bluewave GET has Ux that makes it so you didn't need instructions to intuitively know how to use it. Powering on gave short tones that raised in frequency. Powering off gave those exact tones in reverse as it gets lower. Pairing mode would have a longer beeeeep followed by intermitent ones.

Simple, but gets the job done.

Or maybe I'm just an old senile panda yelling at the wind to get off my lawn

-------------------
On another note. Very impressed with the BTR3's connection and disconnection speed.

The majority of BT I've used in my life are obviously ones that have BT as an afterthought or side feature. These take 10s to connect and are un-reliable in being able to do it everytime without me toggling my source/Phone's BT enabler and or the BT device itself.

BTR3 power on, and its near instantly connected. And I can do it with quick succession on and off and both it and my phone keep up.


----------



## zhubajie

bowei006 said:


> Small design quirks I've noticed. More minor quality of life and User Interface and design.
> 
> But the beeps that signal the powering off should be tonally decreasing. Instead it does a quick decrease but then a quick uptick in tone with a flashing blue LED (3x i think).
> 
> The Bluewave GET has Ux that makes it so you didn't need instructions to intuitively know how to use it. Powering on gave short tones that raised in frequency. Powering off gave those exact tones in reverse as it gets lower. Pairing mode would have a longer beeeeep followed by intermitent ones.



That's the biggest challenge for most Chinese companies.
They are VERY skilled in making complex and high tech hardware but the software is usually a quickie and usability gets hardly any attention.
Fiio stands above the crowd in this and that's why they are getting ever more popular. The fact they listen to their customers and keep supporting their products helps a lot too.
But even Fiio still has some things to learn.
The Fiio app is quite nice but not always intuitive and what you mention about these power on / power off tones should be taken more seriously too.

I have bought several cheap bluetooth speakers and many have voice messages in a horrible Chinglish and with a high volume.
A volume so high I am ashamed to turn on these devices in public.
You should think that anyone with half a working brain would understand that that alone totally spoils a further excellent product....


----------



## bowei006

zhubajie said:


> That's the biggest challenge for most Chinese companies.
> They are VERY skilled in making complex and high tech hardware but the software is usually a quickie and usability gets hardly any attention.
> Fiio stands above the crowd in this and that's why they are getting ever more popular. The fact they listen to their customers and keep supporting their products helps a lot too.
> But even Fiio still has some things to learn.
> ...



I see this all the time too. The small quality of life usability quirks in Chinese products where it's almost almost there but with some rough edges.


----------



## bowei006

zerolight said:


> I'm tempted to order the BTR3 when it hits the UK since it's about 60% of the price of the ES100. Given my K10s should fall into the Fiio spec I find it hard to believe that the double dacs in the ES100 will have any real impact on the sound. If this was likely to be the only BT DAC I purchase over the next year then I'd go with the ES100 for more versatility (the increased power working with more headphones). However, I feel like this is really just the beginning and I expect within a year I'll be selling whatever I buy to replace it with something has a higher end Burr Brown or Sabre DAC included.
> 
> Feels like this is where the market is going. More and more of us are listening to Apple Music & Spotify.* BT is pretty much lossless in transmitting AAC from Apple Music to one of these things*, so it's making more sense to me to have an iPhone and a BT device rather than a CCK + USB dac or a dedicated player. Even if I do miss the sound of my old and sold Mojo. A BTR5 with an ESS9018M or similar makes sense.



Good points you make but the bolded part is incorrect. AAC (Advanced Audio Coding) is not remotely close to lossless. I'm going off lossless here by the technicial definition. AAC transmits at a best available lossy 250kbps.


----------



## zerolight (Aug 25, 2018)

bowei006 said:


> Good points you make but the bolded part is incorrect. AAC (Advanced Audio Coding) is not remotely close to lossless. I'm going off lossless here by the technicial definition. AAC transmits at a best available lossy 250kbps.



It transmits Apple Music untouched, bit for bit. I'm saying it's *pretty* *much* (more or less) lossless transmitting *Apple* *Music*, see what you bolded. Of course a flac file transmitted over AAC would lose something in the process, but an already AAC file in Apple Music, no it loses nothing Vs wired.


----------



## SubMash

zerolight said:


> It transmits Apple Music untouched, bit for bit. I'm saying it's *pretty* *much* (more or less) lossless transmitting *Apple* *Music*, see what you bolded. Of course a flac file transmitted over AAC would lose something in the process, but an already AAC file in Apple Music, no it loses nothing Vs wired.


It is not true. Doesn't matter which file you play - it is decoded first and then encoded back again. There are no physical way in the phone system to send original encoded stream over Bluetooth.

With that being said - AAC is much more sophisticated codec, so it has much higher quality than any other BT codec with same or double bitrate. It's just power hungry codec and drains battery faster.


----------



## zerolight (Aug 25, 2018)

For what it's worth, my old ears struggle to here a difference between DSD, FLAC, Tidal HD, 320k Spotify, and AAC Apple Music.

Both Spotify and Apple Music had an edge over Google Play and Deezer last time I tested. But the rest, varied by track which service sounded best, but in a blind test I'm not be able to identify it was so subtle. It was more tone than detail. Apple Music is just more convenient for me in a house full of Mac, iOS, and watchos, though I did spend a good 6 months on each of Spotify, AM, Tidal.


----------



## zerolight

@SubMash fair enough, sure I read otherwise in one of these threads, possibly by you. May have misinterpreted. Still it's close enough to losing nothing over wireless for me I reckon with AM as source.


----------



## Sonic-Debris

I think Hiby are doing interesting things, and bypassing the limitations of androids audio and their direct transport architecture.


----------



## zerolight

Sonic-Debris said:


> I think Hiby are doing interesting things, and bypassing the limitations of androids audio and their direct transport architecture.



The R3 is a cute little dap. If I were in the market for a dap, that would be on my list.


----------



## rkw (Aug 25, 2018)

SubMash said:


> It is not true. Doesn't matter which file you play - it is decoded first and then encoded back again. There are no physical way in the phone system to send original encoded stream over Bluetooth.


In the case of an AAC file played through AAC codec, the file can be transmitted directly in the A2DP audio payload without transcoding.


----------



## jeffri

Received my BTR3 last week.

For $79, this is no brainer. Of course, coming for a guy who collected this little thingy (my new obsession, lol).


----------



## avnv007

From where did you buy and how is the sound quality

Is it true that via usb dac it supports only 16bit


----------



## jeffri

avnv007 said:


> From where did you buy and how is the sound quality
> 
> Is it true that via usb dac it supports only 16bit



AliExpress. The shipping is quick, they are using DHL Express, quite surprising considering it is free shipping, it only took 4 days from the shipment to my door.

I'm not really sure about the USB DAC, but could be. It seems to be some limitation for the chipset on these tiny thing. Bluewave Get also only does 16 bit, and I believe ES100 is also the same case. Personally, I haven't really tried the USB DAC feature other than connecting it to my Nintendo Switch (it works!). The Switch seems to only support UAC1 (many DACs don't work as the result), however both BTR3 and Bluewave Get worked with Switch. So it's likely BTR3 is also only supporting UAC1, and in that case it will be limited to just 16 bit/44.1 khz.


----------



## Amber Rain

Yes. Fiio confirm you my question that it is 16 bit for a DAC.


----------



## SubMash

rkw said:


> In the case of an AAC file played through AAC codec, the file can be transmitted directly in the A2DP audio payload without transcoding.


Yes, sure, you can do it if you deal with BT directly. Unfortunately, in phones BT is just one of the output device options that stands after mixer system app. And there are no ways of dealing with encoded streams directly. If you have any evidence showing opposite - let me know.


----------



## jeffri

As for the sound, I liked it. It is quite warm sounding and everything rendered pretty well, it's hard to find fault on this thing. I don't think it does anything exceptionally well though, i.e detail-wise, both XB10 and Bluewave Get is still ahead (all connected to aptX HD source). But those two have annoying faults, BTR3 have none.

However, I can say for sure, this BTR3 have lower noise floor than both AK XB10 and Bluewave Get. My IEM of choice is U12, while it's not the most sensitive IEM in the universe, it still is quite sensitive. XB10 hiss is audible, Bluewave Get is bordering annoying, BTR3 on the other hand is clean, while AT-PHA55BT is slightly better.

My favorite is still AT-PHA55BT though. It's very unique that it renders soundstage and image very 3D-like, but when doing so, still sounding pretty natural, warm and detailed. None of my other Bluetooth receiver did that (heck, not even any of my portable DAC did that), so I really love that thing. 

Anyway, I don't have ES100 for head to head comparison, but I have spent a bit of time with it. It's a good contender, with features that a bit more complete. I didn't notice hiss when I tested it, so I'm pretty sure both sound clean. Hopefully I'll find some time with my friend to compare both. 

Another stand out is the build quality, it is excellent. It definitely is better build than XB10 and from what I have seen, even the ES100. It's on par with the Bluewave Get and AT-PHA55BT.

With such build, complete feature and codec set (aptX LL, HD and LDAC especially), low noise floor and nice sound, I can't really find any fault with it. I'll definitely pick this over XB10 and Bluewave Get.


----------



## bowei006

jeffri said:


> As for the sound, I liked it. It is *quite warm sounding *and everything rendered pretty well, it's hard to find fault on this thing. I don't think it does anything exceptionally well though, i.e *detail-wise, both XB10 and Bluewave Get is still ahead (all connected to aptX HD source). But those two have annoying faults, *BTR3 have none.
> 
> However, I can say for sure, this* BTR3 have lower noise floor than both AK XB10 and Bluewave Get. *My IEM of choice is U12, while it's not the most sensitive IEM in the universe, it still is quite sensitive. XB10 hiss is audible,* Bluewave Get is bordering annoying*, BTR3 on the other hand is clean, while AT-PHA55BT is slightly better.
> 
> ...



Agree on these points. I have the Bluewave GET as well

The general sound sig of the GET is cleaner and more refined but that's about its only point of superiority here. It's connection is not nearly as stable and with much more frequent drops. It's also noisy with my CIEMs unless I use a low impedance adapter.


I'd rather lose some of the refine of the GET for the signal reliability of the BTR3. The drops and stutters happen frequently enough with the GET that even if it's gen sound is better, the audible cracks and sputters pretty much degrade the audiophile listening experience.

The GET's wheel has gotten loose for me over the last two months and plastic is kinda spongy. It's also not able to keep AptX HD and often downgrades.

The normal MSRP will be $69.99 which is fantastic. USB C is a massive plus as well. Great to see FiiO moving to this standard.

Is it my most favorite sound sig? Not really. A bit too warm and heavy at times but at its multi function, price, and the fact that its a wireless device first. Can't really be too harsh compared to if it was a dedicated $70 wired amp.


----------



## jeffri

The MSRP is supposed to be $69.99? Even a better deal. I paid $79.99 and already pretty happy with it. 

And yeah, the USB-C is great, forgot to mention it. That reminds me of one annoying thing with it though, the USB-C and the headphone jack sit too close together. As the result, using it as USB DAC can be a challenge if the headphone jack is somewhat thick.

I didn't know the Bluewave Get wheel can get loose, that will be annoying as the volume control is really only like from 3/4 onward. It's something I actually like as I can precisely control the volume, but if it get loose, accidental turn could make this deadly...


----------



## bowei006

jeffri said:


> The MSRP is supposed to be $69.99? Even a better deal. I paid $79.99 and already pretty happy with it.
> 
> And yeah, the USB-C is great, forgot to mention it. That reminds me of one annoying thing with it though, the USB-C and the headphone jack sit too close together. As the result, using it as USB DAC can be a challenge if the headphone jack is somewhat thick.
> 
> I didn't know the Bluewave Get wheel can get loose, that will be annoying as the volume control is really only like from 3/4 onward. It's something I actually like as I can precisely control the volume, but if it get loose, accidental turn could make this deadly...



Yep, the full release MSRP is that yeah. You're paying a bit of a premium to be an early adopter. Not a huge deal haha.

I can see that issue too but at 24mW (at whatever Ohms) I don't expect to see any headphones with bulky jacks to be used with the BTR3 besides for review testing and ...for the 'lulz'

Yeah, my review of the GET (coming soon) mentions that. Uncontrolled volume is something i always fear when using the GET. My wheel has close to no friction nowadays whereas it had a lot when I first got it.

I've gotten used to the digital vol control of the BTR3.

For me, signal robustness and reliability with a BT audiophile device is paramount. The BTR3 passes that with flying colors.

The startup sound though.... I hate it


----------



## jeffri

bowei006 said:


> Yep, the full release MSRP is that yeah. You're paying a bit of a premium to be an early adopter. Not a huge deal haha.
> 
> I can see that issue too but at 24mW (at whatever Ohms) I don't expect to see any headphones with bulky jacks to be used with the BTR3 besides for review testing and ...for the 'lulz'
> 
> ...



I actually tried it with Fostex TH-X00. That is quite easy to drive and BTR3 can still drive it pretty loud.  The problem is I need adapter, I used Grado 6.3 to 3.5 adapter and with the USB-C cable connected, both the jack and the cable is already pushing each other. I can see this being a problem for those that use aftermarket cable for their IEM, i.e jack like Eidolic that have huge barrel.

I actually don't experience much issue with Bluewave Get connectivity though, it's pretty solid for me. But I can see BTR3 to be better though, almost zero issue with it so far.

Startup sound, yeah... they probably trying to fit it in something like 128kB storage...  Personally, I rarely heard it as I usually didn't wear my IEM when I turn on the BTR3.


----------



## bowei006

jeffri said:


> I actually tried it with Fostex TH-X00. That is quite easy to drive and BTR3 can still drive it pretty loud.  The problem is I need adapter, I used Grado 6.3 to 3.5 adapter and with the USB-C cable connected, both the jack and the cable is already pushing each other. I can see this being a problem for those that use aftermarket cable for their IEM, i.e jack like Eidolic that have huge barrel.
> 
> I actually don't experience much issue with Bluewave Get connectivity though, it's pretty solid for me. But I can see BTR3 to be better though, almost zero issue with it so far.
> 
> Startup sound, yeah... they probably trying to fit it in something li*ke 128kB storage.*..  Personally, I rarely heard it as I usually didn't wear my IEM when I turn on the BTR3.



Try much less. The startup clip sounds like a stereo 64kbps (32kbps per ear) with a 2second duration.

Meaning you have a total file size of like sub 200kilo bits which is 25kB of storage.

Haha....

Now I'm curious and want FiiO to check


----------



## bowei006

Initial test of using BTR3 as USB DAC has failed with a Dell XPS 15 9550 with stock included cable.

Weird, driver installed and recognized as BTR3 but no audio is able to play. Verified sound settings, unchecked exclusive mode to test. Tried multiple ports including another USB-C to USB-C cable I have. Un-able to get audio output.

Might need a computer restart but can't do that right now as I have stuff I'm working on with this laptop.


Will try with my desktop tomorrow.

Please note this is not definite stuff. Just posting moment by moment / play by of my experience with the BTR3. Not the end of the world.


----------



## jeffri

Have you click the power button in quick succession 3 times? It took several try, but keep trying until the LED is constantly white.


----------



## Sonic-Debris

Loving the BTR3 so far, and I just got the new LC-2.5c balanced cable (not for the BTR3) from Fiio, gotta give it to them they are starting to put out some very good products these days, and working in China I seem to be able to get my hands on them fairly quick which I love. I do have a slightly off topic question though, hoping you guys may be able to answer? I currently use a AK70-MKII , and for IEM'S I have the new Fiio FH5, and some CampfireAudio Polaris. I was looking at new DAP's and was thinking of the Hiby R6, but Im very confused with the balanced power output. The AK70-MKII states 4.0vrms, and the Hiby R6 states 300mW (RMS) at 32ohm. I have no clue now these compare, does one have a much higher output? I mainly use the balances 2.5mm jack, but never really go to to 100% volume on the AK70-MKII. Just wondering if the Hiby will be a good match for my IEM's, as their DAP looks very appealing, great OS, very good EQ, large battery, USB C quick charging. Sorry for the noob question, just not sure how to compare Vrms to rms


----------



## bowei006

jeffri said:


> Have you click the power button in quick succession 3 times? It took several try, but keep trying until the LED is constantly white.



Found out how to get it working. This is very annoying.

It's very misleading as with the device powered off and plugging it into my computer, the device gets noticed as being there. Therefore I immediately think this device can be used without it being turned on pre-emptive to plugging it in.


And you can't simply just turn it on as it would just auto quick connect to your phone causing it not to enter USB mode. I had to disable BT on my phone and other paired BT device (desktop) and then do the quick triple tap for the DAC to start working.


----------



## jeffri

bowei006 said:


> Found out how to get it working. This is very annoying.
> 
> It's very misleading as with the device powered off and plugging it into my computer, the device gets noticed as being there. Therefore I immediately think this device can be used without it being turned on pre-emptive to plugging it in.
> 
> ...



Hmm... There is no need to disable Bluetooth on paired device, the triple tap works even if it is connected to Bluetooth. The Bluetooth device will stay connected, the triple tap will then switch between USB DAC input and Bluetooth input. It could be convenient, that you can easily switch between inputs and both stay connected, but the triple tap is unreliable enough that it requires multiple try to get it right.


----------



## bowei006

jeffri said:


> Hmm... There is no need to disable Bluetooth on paired device, the triple tap works even if it is connected to Bluetooth. The Bluetooth device will stay connected, the triple tap will then switch between USB DAC input and Bluetooth input. It could be convenient, that you can easily switch between inputs and both stay connected, but the triple tap is unreliable enough that it requires multiple try to get it right.



I had a feeling FiiO made that the case. I didn't test that option tonight. Last time it didn't work as it auto connected to my phone's BT and started playing my playlist off that.


----------



## jeffri

bowei006 said:


> I had a feeling FiiO made that the case. I didn't test that option tonight. Last time it didn't work as it auto connected to my phone's BT and started playing my playlist off that.



Yeah, I just tested it and it worked that way. Hopefully they could increase the tolerance a bit, the triple tap had to be really quick right now.


----------



## mikp

finally got to try my btr3 a little, smaller than expected. Also it works better than my other apt-x ll receivers ive used.

Now waiting for the tin t2 to pair with it.


----------



## FiiO

jeffri said:


> Yeah, I just tested it and it worked that way. Hopefully they could increase the tolerance a bit, the triple tap had to be really quick right now.


Dear friend,

Yes, we will report to the engineers about that and check whether they could change the operation of entering DAC mode.

Best regards


----------



## jeffri

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Yes, we will report to the engineers about that and check whether they could change the operation of entering DAC mode.
> 
> Best regards



Awesome, thanks


----------



## Amber Rain

Sonic-Debris said:


> Loving the BTR3 so far, and I just got the new LC-2.5c balanced cable (not for the BTR3) from Fiio, gotta give it to them they are starting to put out some very good products these days, and working in China I seem to be able to get my hands on them fairly quick which I love. I do have a slightly off topic question though, hoping you guys may be able to answer? I currently use a AK70-MKII , and for IEM'S I have the new Fiio FH5, and some CampfireAudio Polaris. I was looking at new DAP's and was thinking of the Hiby R6, but Im very confused with the balanced power output. The AK70-MKII states 4.0vrms, and the Hiby R6 states 300mW (RMS) at 32ohm. I have no clue now these compare, does one have a much higher output? I mainly use the balances 2.5mm jack, but never really go to to 100% volume on the AK70-MKII. Just wondering if the Hiby will be a good match for my IEM's, as their DAP looks very appealing, great OS, very good EQ, large battery, USB C quick charging. Sorry for the noob question, just not sure how to compare Vrms to rms




Hi

Could you confirm how long that Fiio LC balanced cable is? Is it the standard 125cm?

I've not actually seen these for sale anywhere in the UK yet. 

Thanks


----------



## hotdog108

Just checked on Amazon, September 10th availability, placing order and crossing fingers.


----------



## Sonic-Debris

Amber Rain said:


> Hi
> 
> Could you confirm how long that Fiio LC balanced cable is? Is it the standard 125cm?
> 
> ...


Yep it's either 120 or 125, no issue with length with a DAP in my pocket.


----------



## Amber Rain

Sonic-Debris said:


> Yep it's either 120 or 125, no issue with length with a DAP in my pocket.



Thanks for confirming. 

Yes, that's a very useful length for putting in your pocket, quite standard.

I usually have my DAP in my top shirt pocket and I was looking for a short balanced cable to try with my earstudio es100.


----------



## lawonga

Hey guys, BTR3 or M0?


----------



## Sonic-Debris

lawonga said:


> Hey guys, BTR3 or M0?


Hmmm, two very different devices. One is a DAP, the other is just a small portable DAC/amp. What are you waiting the device for mainly


----------



## lawonga

Sonic-Debris said:


> Hmmm, two very different devices. One is a DAP, the other is just a small portable DAC/amp. What are you waiting the device for mainly


Won't be needing the DAP function. Which one would sound better?


----------



## DeLaw

hotdog108 said:


> Just checked on Amazon, September 10th availability, placing order and crossing fingers.



Ordered from Ebay, will be getting it Friday.


----------



## chortya

lawonga said:


> Hey guys, BTR3 or M0?


I have preoredered BTR3 and already own M0. M0 is actually a nice device but I miss microphone for calls. Also I expect longer battery time from BTR3.
Additionally I have ordered EarStudio device to compare and also backed Hizdis AP80 which offers comparable functionality. So much vatiety on the market right now.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Just checked on Amazon, September 10th availability, placing order and crossing fingers.


Is it on Amazon US? I cannot find it there, only see btr1 and ubtr. Mind sharing the link?


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> Is it on Amazon US? I cannot find it there, only see btr1 and ubtr. Mind sharing the link?


It's currently sold out and listed as unavailable, that's why you can't find it on Amazon US. My delivery date has now slipped to 9/13.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> It's currently sold out and listed as unavailable, that's why you can't find it on Amazon US. My delivery date has now slipped to 9/13.


I cannot believe I missed it... Darn... Been searching it every day


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> It's currently sold out and listed as unavailable, that's why you can't find it on Amazon US. My delivery date has now slipped to 9/13.


May I ask who's the seller? Fiio Tech themselves or third party retailer?


----------



## DeLaw

brightxy said:


> May I ask who's the seller? Fiio Tech themselves or third party retailer?



Tinbel Store


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> I cannot believe I missed it... Darn... Been searching it every day


I've been checking daily as well, which is why I pulled the trigger immediately when I saw it on Amazon.


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> May I ask who's the seller? Fiio Tech themselves or third party retailer?


When I placed the order it said sold by Fiio fulfilled by Amazon.


----------



## DeLaw

ebay tinbel store has 8 in stock


----------



## DeLaw

https://www.ebay.com/itm/FiiO-BTR3-...926465&hash=item3b19e4554e:g:tMUAAOSwPfhbfL~r


----------



## DeLaw

hotdog108 said:


> When I placed the order it said sold by Fiio fulfilled by Amazon.



https://www.ebay.com/itm/FiiO-BTR3-...926465&hash=item3b19e4554e:g:tMUAAOSwPfhbfL~r


----------



## hotdog108

DeLaw said:


> https://www.ebay.com/itm/FiiO-BTR3-...926465&hash=item3b19e4554e:g:tMUAAOSwPfhbfL~r


Thanks, I might just cancel my order and buy them on eBay.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> When I placed the order it said sold by Fiio fulfilled by Amazon.


Sigh... Guess I'll just have to wait longer then. There's one retailer selling on ebay but I still prefer Amazon.
Congrats on getting it though!


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> Sigh... Guess I'll just have to wait longer then. There's one retailer selling on ebay but I still prefer Amazon.
> Congrats on getting it though!


Thanks, I'm a prime member that's why I prefer Amazon as well, but I may cancel and order from eBay instead, shipping times look much better.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Thanks, I'm a prime member that's why I prefer Amazon as well, but I may cancel and order from eBay instead, shipping times look much better.


I'm on the west coast so it takes a week for the ebay seller to ship. But more importantly I have more confidence in Amazon's client service. Been seeing some comments about BTR3's microphone, worrying that I might need to ask for replacement if there's hardware issue


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> I'm on the west coast so it takes a week for the ebay seller to ship. But more importantly I have more confidence in Amazon's client service. Been seeing some comments about BTR3's microphone, worrying that I might need to ask for replacement if there's hardware issue


Good points, I'm still on the fence, not sure exactly what I want to do at this point. Might just wait it out.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Good points, I'm still on the fence, not sure exactly what I want to do at this point. Might just wait it out.


Oh no! I was waiting on you cancelling your order so I may have a chance to cut into the list! (Joking)
I do see on the Chinese version of Twitter (Weibo) that a few ppl were complaining about using it for audio call and the other side cannot hear them clearly. Adding earlier in the thread there's one mentioning of hardware issue for the first batch, I'm kinda worried, since one of my big incentive for buying it is I can get rid of those 3rd party in-line mic cords for my W4R and use mic on it.


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> Oh no! I was waiting on you cancelling your order so I may have a chance to cut into the list! (Joking)
> I do see on the Chinese version of Twitter (Weibo) that a few ppl were complaining about using it for audio call and the other side cannot hear them clearly. Adding earlier in the thread there's one mentioning of hardware issue for the first batch, I'm kinda worried, since one of my big incentive for buying it is I can get rid of those 3rd party in-line mic cords for my W4R and use mic on it.


Think about it this way, even iPhones come with defects, no new product in history has had zero issues on day one. Good customer service plays a big role here, and my experience with Fiio customer service has been all positive so far.


----------



## hotdog108

Just cancelled my Amazon order and placed the order on eBay, estimated arrival date 9/4


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Think about it this way, even iPhones come with defects, no new product in history has had zero issues on day one. Good customer service plays a big role here, and my experience with Fiio customer service has been all positive so far.


That's a big relief, I've only tried their M7 and it indeed has been working very well so far. Just trying to minimize the chance of avoiding any possible hassle. Guess you will get it before I do, so I'll wait for your first hand experience.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Just cancelled my Amazon order and placed the order on eBay, estimated arrival date 9/4


Ha, it did show up again on Amazon, though not from Fiio. It is actually from the same seller as ebay:
"Sold by Tinbel Store and Fulfilled by Amazon. Gift-wrap available."


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> That's a big relief, I've only tried their M7 and it indeed has been working very well so far. Just trying to minimize the chance of avoiding any possible hassle. Guess you will get it before I do, so I'll wait for your first hand experience.


I wouldn't worry about it, Fiio is known for making great bang for the buck products, their customer service is also top notch.


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> Ha, it did show up again on Amazon, though not from Fiio. It is actually from the same seller as ebay:
> "Sold by Tinbel Store and Fulfilled by Amazon. Gift-wrap available."


If you order on eBay it'll still show up before the Amazon option, even factoring in the week long shipping.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> If you order on eBay it'll still show up before the Amazon option, even factoring in the week long shipping.


That is very true... Struggling...


----------



## hotdog108

brightxy said:


> That is very true... Struggling...


Just do it, if you were going to order it anyway, what difference does it make where you buy it from? Besides, eBay customer service is no slouch either. I recently had to file a claim with them over an order I placed in February and for a reason I won't mention here, the product will never make it to me, and eBay refunded me the full $3,000 5 months after the order was placed.


----------



## brightxy

hotdog108 said:


> Just do it, if you were going to order it anyway, what difference does it make where you buy it from? Besides, eBay customer service is no slouch either. I recently had to file a claim with them over an order I placed in February and for a reason I won't mention here, the product will never make it to me, and eBay refunded me the full $3,000 5 months after the order was placed.


Oh really? Cool, advice taken, thank you!


----------



## crabdog

It's a beautiful little device and the glass front looks really classy. Sounds brilliant with LDAC too.


----------



## Galeonero

Hello, then which bluetooth receiver is better? The ES100 or BTR3?
I read in other post that apparently the ES100 is better for having balanced output even if a DAC has an older model.
Is this exactly the sound that ES100 produces?


----------



## chortya

Galeonero said:


> Hello, then which bluetooth receiver is better? The ES100 or BTR3?
> I read in other post that apparently the ES100 is better for having balanced output even if a DAC has an older model.
> Is this exactly the sound that ES100 produces?


I have ordered both to compare side by side. Will definitely report here. Additionally I have LG G7 and Shanling M0. Shanling actually offers very similar functionality with bi-directional Bluetooth connectivity and LDAC.


----------



## SubMash

chortya said:


> I have ordered both to compare side by side. Will definitely report here. Additionally I have LG G7 and Shanling M0. Shanling actually offers very similar functionality with bi-directional Bluetooth connectivity and LDAC.


Next 19 hours ES100 on Amazon with Prime free shipping is just 4$ more than BTR3, LOL.
I'm reminding that those are 2 seriously different class of devices that coexist only for price difference purpose.


----------



## mikp

SubMash said:


> Next 19 hours ES100 on Amazon with Prime free shipping is just 4$ more than BTR3, LOL.
> I'm reminding that those are 2 seriously different class of devices that coexist only for price difference purpose.



not everyone is in the u.s

*Shipping & Fee Details*
Price $74.25
AmazonGlobal Shipping + $14.34
Estimated Import Fees Deposit + $22.15
Total $110.74

I paid 67usd for the btr3

Anyone compared the two?

The btr3 works fine with my lg g7


----------



## crabdog

mikp said:


> not everyone is in the u.s
> 
> *Shipping & Fee Details*
> Price $74.25
> ...


The BTR3 compares very well to the ES100 in terms of sound, plus it has a much nicer build and feel. The only other major difference for me is the balanced out since I don't really use any of the extra features of the Earstudio app.


----------



## SubMash

crabdog said:


> The BTR3 compares very well to the ES100 in terms of sound, plus it has a much nicer build and feel. The only other major difference for me is the balanced out since I don't really use any of the extra features of the Earstudio app.


If you have both - comment on the buttons usability, please.


----------



## chortya

I would be also interested how well are both performing for calls.
ES100 is being praised fir very good sound quality, good to hear that BTR3 is comparable.


----------



## crabdog

SubMash said:


> If you have both - comment on the buttons usability, please.


The size of the buttons is almost identical. The BTR3 power and multifunction buttons have a straighter edge, so they're a bit easier to feel. The volume button on the BTR3 is concave - almost flat in the middle and raised slightly at either end so it can be just as tricky to find as the ES100 volume. Since the BTR3 uses the same button for volume and forward/back it might be simpler to use without having to look at it, although I don't really have any difficulty with the ES100 buttons so long as I keep in mind whether I have SE or balanced cable plugged in.

Another key difference is that the BTR3's headphone jack is located on the bottom edge of the device and the ES100 jacks are on the top of each side. I'm not sure which location I prefer at this point.


----------



## Elzizo

Just received my BTR3 in the mail. Some pictures in comparison to the ES100 (which has been to date my favorite Bluetooth device ever). If you click on the last image it's a gif of both devices while on:


----------



## zhubajie

crabdog said:


> It's a beautiful little device and the glass front looks really classy. Sounds brilliant with LDAC too.


For a moment I thought; Where the hell did he get that Fiio M9?!


----------



## crabdog

zhubajie said:


> For a moment I thought; Where the hell did he get that Fiio M9?!


Maybe you are seeing the future. I hope so


----------



## zerolight

@crabdog the issue I have with the es100 buttons is that they are on both sides. When I grip it and attempt to press a button it's very easy to press the opposite side at the same time. Fiio appears to have buttons along one side?


----------



## Elzizo

zerolight said:


> @crabdog the issue I have with the es100 buttons is that they are on both sides. When I grip it and attempt to press a button it's very easy to press the opposite side at the same time. Fiio appears to have buttons along one side?


The buttons are all located on the right side of the device.


----------



## crabdog

zerolight said:


> @crabdog the issue I have with the es100 buttons is that they are on both sides. When I grip it and attempt to press a button it's very easy to press the opposite side at the same time. Fiio appears to have buttons along one side?


Yes,as @Elzizo said, they're all on one side. The volume up /down and forward /back uses shared buttons


----------



## smorgar

How is the clip on BTR3 compared to ES100?


----------



## Elzizo

smorgar said:


> How is the clip on BTR3 compared to ES100?


It's metal on the BTR3, longer, and has larger stays with more clamping force compared to the shorter plastic clip on the ES100.


----------



## freebil

Hello. I have a television which does not support audio bluetooth streaming. Is it possible to connect btr3 to my tv and hear the tv channels audio to my bluetooth headset? Thanks.


----------



## mikp

finally got the tin "hype" buds.


----------



## chortya

mikp said:


> finally got the tin "hype" buds.


Why would you use a bluetooth dongle with a dedicated DAP? I don't think BTR3 DAC is better then Hiby R3.


----------



## mikp

chortya said:


> Why would you use a bluetooth dongle with a dedicated DAP? I don't think BTR3 DAC is better then Hiby R3.




Controls,calls and keep the r3 waterproof among other things.

I mainly use bt now with ldac, - or true wireless buds.


----------



## chortya

mikp said:


> Controls,calls and keep the r3 waterproof among other things.
> 
> I mainly use bt now with ldac, - or true wireless buds.


Ok, thanks. But wouldn't a smartphone + BTR3 also cover your needs? 
I am still undecided myself if I want a dedicated DAP (again) or wait for LG V40 which could potentially become an universal device (which I still don't believe looking at competition like Huawei Mate 20 Pro).


----------



## mikp

chortya said:


> Ok, thanks. But wouldn't a smartphone + BTR3 also cover your needs?
> I am still undecided myself if I want a dedicated DAP (again) or wait for LG V40 which could potentially become an universal device (which I still don't believe looking at competition like Huawei Mate 20 Pro).



i got the lg g7..very nice phone. But for hiking etc i want something small that fits in shirt pockets with waterproof bag. Have been using small chinese android phones, currently waiting for the unihertz atom.

The btr3 can be connected to both, same as the jabra 65t.

..and also I hate cables connected to something,- and the btr3 is small enough so it gets a pass.


----------



## jeffri

Just received my ES100. I'll be working on some comparison with all my Bluetooth receiver soon, which includes AT-PHA55BT, AK XB10, Bluewave Get and maybe throw in CEntrace BlueDAC as well.


----------



## chortya

jeffri said:


> Just received my ES100. I'll be working on some comparison with all my Bluetooth receiver soon, which includes AT-PHA55BT, AK XB10, Bluewave Get and maybe throw in CEntrace BlueDAC as well.


Looking forward to your comparison!


----------



## FiiO

freebil said:


> Hello. I have a television which does not support audio bluetooth streaming. Is it possible to connect btr3 to my tv and hear the tv channels audio to my bluetooth headset? Thanks.


Dear friend,

No, the BTR3 doesn't support Bluetooth output function.

Best regards


----------



## Sonic-Debris

freebil said:


> Hello. I have a television which does not support audio bluetooth streaming. Is it possible to connect btr3 to my tv and hear the tv channels audio to my bluetooth headset? Thanks.



If you have an android box connected to your TV you can use that to send the audio to your BTR3, works well.


----------



## freebil

Sonic-Debris said:


> If you have an android box connected to your TV you can use that to send the audio to your BTR3, works well.



Thanks for the answer. My TV is android and it has 3.5 jack audio output. In which btr3's input I have to connect the TV?


----------



## Sonic-Debris

freebil said:


> Thanks for the answer. My TV is android and it has 3.5 jack audio output. In which btr3's input I have to connect the TV?


hmmm, so what exactly are you wanting to do? if you just want your TV to play music to your BTR3 so you can use headphones or whatever, just go into your android TV's settings turn on bluetooth and connect to the BTR3.


----------



## freebil

Sonic-Debris said:


> hmmm, so what exactly are you wanting to do? if you just want your TV to play music to your BTR3 so you can use headphones or whatever, just go into your android TV's settings turn on bluetooth and connect to the BTR3.



My tv does not support a2dp over bluetooth. So I cant use my bluetooth headphones directly.


----------



## Sonic-Debris

freebil said:


> My tv does not support a2dp over bluetooth. So I cant use my bluetooth headphones directly.


Ahh then you won't be able to do it then. Just get yourself a little android TV box, they are usually far better than the android built into your TV, and very cheap.


----------



## iaTa

For people that have a unit already what is the microphone quality like?


----------



## hotdog108

iaTa said:


> For people that have a unit already what is the microphone quality like?


I took a few calls with it, seems fine, no real difference between it and my BTR1 from the other side. People can hear me perfectly clearly, I wear it right above the third button down from the collar on my dress shirt, so mid-sternum.


----------



## Brooko

iaTa said:


> For people that have a unit already what is the microphone quality like?


Very clean and clear. Had no issues taking business calls with it


----------



## frifox

Wow. Got mine few days ago and been putting it through tests, and so far BTR3 is checking all the right boxes.

Pitch black noise floor
Mac volume & mute controls actually work
Onboard volume control, to avoid ear-shattering accidents
No drivers necessary
AptX and LDAC
Tiny

Now, the only issue I have with BTR3 is when using it as a USB DAC. When my macbook goes to sleep / screensaver BTR3 auto shuts off. Waking up the PC does not wake up BTR3. I have to manually turn power on, hear the annoying "startup" sound, and tripple-tap to switch back to the USB mode, every single time. Quite annoying tbh.


----------



## Ggroch

My BTR3 from AliExpress/Fiio Store just arrived this afternoon. I also got an ES100 during Amazon's Dotd last week...so will be comparing them over the next couple of weeks.  I am initially quite pleased with both.

The BTR3 is more nicely made...glass and metal rather than mostly plastic...but I have no reason to think the ES100 is not plenty sturdy.

It is too early for me to make sound comparisons.  But there are a couple of advantages I see already in the ES100.

1st.  The ES100 app allows for a lot more customization at this point.  I can choose the codec as well as EQ/Ambiance curves and save them.  I see that the Fiio Music app on my Android phone should allow me to do this at some point..but I have downloaded the current release version (1.0?) from the Google store, and it does not yet have that option. So far as I can tell there are not yet either adjustments for or feedback on the BTR3...so I cannot view its firmware etc. 

In addition, my Android Phone (Moto G5s Plus on Android 7.1.1) does not provide me with any Bluetooth Codec selection options...even in developer mode.  Perhaps I just have missed that...but it is not listed in the Developer Options page or in the Fiio App. Any ideas how to do it?

On the plus side...the Fiio Music App seems to enable LHDC in my Moto Phone.  The LED pulses Green when playing from FMapp....and the phones Bluetooth Volume control has no effect within the app...so perhaps there is software coding going on.  I did not know that was possible...is it a bug or a feature?

The BTR gets plenty loud for me and controls the phones I have tried quite well.


----------



## rkw

Ggroch said:


> my Android Phone (Moto G5s Plus on Android 7.1.1) does not provide me with any Bluetooth Codec selection options...even in developer mode.  Perhaps I just have missed that...but it is not listed in the Developer Options page or in the Fiio App. Any ideas how to do it?


You won't be able to, without Android 8 (Oreo). There are reports on the web that Motorola is just starting to roll out Android 8 to the G5S. You'll have more Bluetooth options after your phone is updated.


----------



## beneficius

Hi folks, 

Anyone knows if is it possible to connect the Fiio BTR3 to Chord Mojo?

My idea is to use BTR3 as a Chord Poly, sending music from streaming services directly to Mojo. In that way, I'd need to connect Fiio and Mojo using the 3.5mm.

Thanks in advance.

Kind regards, 
B


----------



## hotdog108

I don't see why not, it's analog to analog.


----------



## hotdog108

Just tried this with my BTR3 connected to my Fiio E12DIY using a 3.5mm interconnect, can confirm, it works.


----------



## beneficius

Thank you guys! It seems that will work fine with Mojo.

All the best, 
B


----------



## jeffri

Pretty sure Mojo doesn't have an analog input, so no, it won't work.


----------



## hotdog108

From their website: 1x 3.5mm Jack Coaxial 768kHz/32-bit Capable Input, I think that means analog, unless that's a digital input format that I just don't know about.


----------



## rkw (Sep 8, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> From their website: 1x 3.5mm Jack Coaxial 768kHz/32-bit Capable Input, I think that means analog, unless that's a digital input format that I just don't know about.


Mojo is a DAC and only has digital input. 768kHz/32-bit makes no sense to describe an analog signal.


----------



## beneficius

In that way, is there any bluetooth receiver on the market that has digital output in order to connect to Chord Mojo?

Maybe EarStudio ES100?

Thanks,
B


----------



## rkw

beneficius said:


> In that way, is there any bluetooth receiver on the market that has digital output in order to connect to Chord Mojo?
> 
> Maybe EarStudio ES100?


Shanling M0 should work. EarStudio ES100 does not have digital output.


----------



## crabdog

rkw said:


> Shanling M0 should work. EarStudio ES100 does not have digital output.


+1 for the M0 and the Acoustic Research AR-M200. For a budget option, the Benjie T6/Rocker has bi-directional Bluetooth as well.


----------



## hotdog108

beneficius said:


> In that way, is there any bluetooth receiver on the market that has digital output in order to connect to Chord Mojo?
> 
> Maybe EarStudio ES100?
> 
> ...


3.5mm is always analog, I don't know where the idea of Mojo being all digital comes from, but it makes no sense.


----------



## harpo1

hotdog108 said:


> 3.5mm is always analog, I don't know where the idea of Mojo being all digital comes from, but it makes no sense.


Mojo is all digital input.  USB, Optical and digital 3.5mm coax.


----------



## hotdog108

harpo1 said:


> Mojo is all digital input.  USB, Optical and digital 3.5mm coax.


Did a bit of reading on digital coax, interesting, I stand corrected. Thanks for the info.


----------



## harpo1

hotdog108 said:


> Did a bit of reading on digital coax, interesting, I stand corrected. Thanks for the info.


Several DAP's use a combined 3.5mm as well.  There switchable between line out and digital coax.  The mojo doesn't have an amp in it so that is why it doesn't have an analog input.


----------



## hotdog108

harpo1 said:


> Several DAP's use a combined 3.5mm as well.  There switchable between line out and digital coax.  The mojo doesn't have an amp in it so that is why it doesn't have an analog input.


I guess I was thinking about it in terms of output instead of input, it certainly makes sense for an all digital in device, but all digital out is where I was getting hung up. Thanks for clarifying, my head was stuck in the wrong end of the alley.


----------



## Ggroch

rkw said:


> You won't be able to, without Android 8 (Oreo). There are reports on the web that Motorola is just starting to roll out Android 8 to the G5S. You'll have more Bluetooth options after your phone is updated.



Thanks for the input.

In my apartment the BTR3 seems to have slightly stronger Bluetooth reception than the ES100.  When I am down the hall and a room away I get some cutouts with the ES100...not with the BTR3...but that could be a synergy issue with my transmitter (a Chinese Bluetooth 5.0 model with Aptx HD & LL).

So with my Android 7.1.1 phone and current Fiio Music Android Software there is no way to select which of the many codecs you want to use.   In my case the pairing of the bluetooth transmitter and the BTR3 results in an Aptx HD connection.  It sounds great, but one of my reasons for choosing the BTR3 is its inclusion of Aptx LL.    There is I think no way to select that with my transmitter.  However.... with my transmitter/TV setup I am noticing very little lag with Aptx HD.... it is totally acceptable, and sounds great.

One key feature will be that when BTR3 support is added to Fiio Music you are able to save/memorize your setting choices so that they work outside of the app, and that particular phone.  I think that is how the ES100 works. 

It is undoubtedly unfair to  compare the software/control sophistication of the BTR3 which is just now being released to the ES100 which has been around a lot longer with several Firmware/Software updates, but in its current state customizing choices on the BTR3 is very limited depending on your setup.

But it sounds great.


----------



## grkn

If you don't use EQ and don't have very hard to drive IEMs (KZ ES4, maybe Ibasso IT01 in the future), for active use think the BTR3 is the better choice due to the metal/glass build and metal clip? I'm not using balanced on the ES100 and it already sounds quite black to me, not sure there's much to gain by going balanced. Wondering if I should get the BTR3 instead.


----------



## Alphasoixante

I very much want to see how robust the clip is on the btr3. I currently have the es100 and the clip fell off after 32 days of ownership. Radsone was kind enough to replace the unit, but the es100 clip is just not strong enough to stay attached to my clothing (it very frequently detaches).

I just spoke with someone at Audio46 (I am local to their store) and whomever is in charge of ordering the btr3 won't be in until tomorrow, so I'm not sure when they will have it in stock. I'm hoping very soon so I can get a hands-on impression. 

Cheers.



grkn said:


> If you don't use EQ and don't have very hard to drive IEMs (KZ ES4, maybe Ibasso IT01 in the future), for active use think the BTR3 is the better choice due to the metal/glass build and metal clip? I'm not using balanced on the ES100 and it already sounds quite black to me, not sure there's much to gain by going balanced. Wondering if I should get the BTR3 instead.


----------



## grkn

Alphasoixante said:


> but the es100 clip is just not strong enough to stay attached to my clothing (it very frequently detaches).



Same for me, I've decided to return the ES100 for this reason, also the build quality and buttons are not great. Plus getting a Fiio F5 as I prefer the build quality and form factor over the ES4 (and IT01). My only gripe is that they seem a bit sub bass shy.


----------



## jeffri

The clip is certainly more solid in BTR3 and clip to my shirt better than ES100, but I can't speak of how long it will last.


----------



## crabdog

I can also attest that the clip on the BTR3 has much more clamping force and feels much more secure when attached to clothing.


----------



## inertianinja

I received the BTR3 for review, and i'm in the process of testing it out.

One interesting thing, though - *the BTR3 works with the Nintendo Switch* in USB mode!

It works perfectly. Triple-click to toggle USB mode and back to Bluetooth. I don't know if it's charging off the switch, which would not be good for battery life, but it's nice to see that it works.


----------



## KKFA

Hi, I am looking to get the BTR3 soon, will it be able to drive the Fiio FH5?

Thanks in advance for your kind advice.


----------



## inertianinja

KKFA said:


> Hi, I am looking to get the BTR3 soon, will it be able to drive the Fiio FH5?
> 
> Thanks in advance for your kind advice.



Yup. That’s one of the headphones I’m using for my review.


----------



## KKFA

Thanks.
Looking forward to your review.


inertianinja said:


> Yup. That’s one of the headphones I’m using for my review.[/QUOTE


----------



## Luhar

inertianinja said:


> Yup. That’s one of the headphones I’m using for my review.


Which IEMs+daps are you using for your review? Also looking forward to it


----------



## jeffri

inertianinja said:


> I received the BTR3 for review, and i'm in the process of testing it out.
> 
> One interesting thing, though - *the BTR3 works with the Nintendo Switch* in USB mode!
> 
> It works perfectly. Triple-click to toggle USB mode and back to Bluetooth. I don't know if it's charging off the switch, which would not be good for battery life, but it's nice to see that it works.



The Switch will support UAC1 USB DAC. Interestingly, all Bluetooth receiver with USB DAC function all does support this. So BTR3, ES100 and Bluewave Get were all working with Switch.


----------



## Luhar

Would CA Lyra 2's or IMR R1's be driven by this or the ES100?


----------



## Brooko

Luhar said:


> Would CA Lyra 2's or IMR R1's be driven by this or the ES100?



Both IEMs are easy loads to drive.  ES100 and BTR3 would have no issues with either.


----------



## Luhar

Brooko said:


> Both IEMs are easy loads to drive.  ES100 and BTR3 would have no issues with either.


Thanks for info. Kind of leaning on the btr3, the build and USB type C is rather important to me.. hmm!


----------



## FSTOP

Already ordered, should have by Wednesday. Anyone paired with P1, enough power to drive well?


----------



## Alphasoixante

crabdog said:


> I can also attest that the clip on the BTR3 has much more clamping force and feels much more secure when attached to clothing.





jeffri said:


> The clip is certainly more solid in BTR3 and clip to my shirt better than ES100



Thank you both for replying. 

As soon as Audio46 has stock of the btr3, I'm going to head over.

Cheers.


----------



## hotdog108

Alphasoixante said:


> Thank you both for replying.
> 
> As soon as Audio46 has stock of the btr3, I'm going to head over.
> 
> Cheers.


My coworker just came back from Audio46, he went there to buy the Noble EDC Bell, but also asked about the BTR3. He decided to order from Amazon instead.


----------



## tripside

A couple of questions 

Do these output more power compared  to the Apple lightning dongle ? 

Is it neutral sounding or does it colour the sound in any manner ?


----------



## crabdog




----------



## hotdog108

crabdog said:


>


Those look fantastic! What are they?


----------



## crabdog

hotdog108 said:


> Those look fantastic! What are they?


Empire Ears Bravado.


----------



## hotdog108

I had a chance to demo them at CanJam, fantastic sounding IEMs. Great design graphic on your customs, love the different color shells. Ultimately though, the Noble Encore resonated with me on a whole different level, so I went with those.


----------



## avnv007

hey guys i got new btr3 but there is a problem i cant get into usb dac mode even  after pressing power butoon thrice fastly it is detected by my laptop but no sound is coming


----------



## hotdog108

avnv007 said:


> hey guys i got new btr3 but there is a problem i cant get into usb dac mode even  after pressing power butoon thrice fastly it is detected by my laptop but no sound is coming


Does your laptop OS allow sound output selection? On my windows 10 machine I had to select the BTR3 as the sound out before any audio came from the unit.


----------



## inertianinja

avnv007 said:


> hey guys i got new btr3 but there is a problem i cant get into usb dac mode even  after pressing power butoon thrice fastly it is detected by my laptop but no sound is coming



Keep trying, at different speeds. Sometimes it takes a few tries. 
Also the new firmware switches automatically


----------



## crabdog

hotdog108 said:


> Does your laptop OS allow sound output selection? On my windows 10 machine I had to select the BTR3 as the sound out before any audio came from the unit.


+1 this. You need to go to your sound settings and select the BTR3.


----------



## smagus

has anyone tried to pair it with LG TV(OLED)? wondering in  which mode connection is made and if there will be any lag...


----------



## SilverEars (Sep 11, 2018)

Dayam, how come I didn't see this earlier? All I need is a solution from my arm yanking the cable during running strides, but at the same time I want to use wired iems since there are wide varieties of them with better quality transducers.

Just a question for yall, how is the latency for videos from the smartphone?  Is this LL (low-latency aptX)?  It's actually a toss-up between this and Shanling M0 right now.  M0 of course is also tiny and and can function as a standalone DAP with micro SD slot as well.  But, M0 is not LL.


----------



## hotdog108

SilverEars said:


> Dayam, how come I didn't see this earlier? All I need is a solution to arm yanking the cable during running strides, but I don't want to do compete wireless as I like my wired iems.
> 
> Just a question for yall, how is the latency for videos from the smartphone?  Is this LL (low-latency aptX)?


I haven't noticed any latency compared to a wired connection to my iPhone X, SE, iPad 4th Gen, 6th Gen, Google Pixel 2, Blackberry KeyOne, Key2, Priv, DTEK60, Samsung tab S2, MacBook Air. So you shouldn't either, and yes, I do use all of those devices on a daily basis, I'm a mobility engineer.


----------



## eespinosa (Sep 15, 2018)

zolom said:


> Is it going to be sold on Amazon (or just the FiiO Aliexpress store)?
> 
> Is playback available while charging?
> 
> Thanks


It's available in Amazon starting on 9/21


----------



## mikesider

@FiiO Will it be available in Canada, other than on the Aliexpress site?


----------



## FiiO

mikesider said:


> @FiiO Will it be available in Canada, other than on the Aliexpress site?


Dear friend,

It is available in our Aliexpress: https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pr...298.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.5cdce728sFq6U2

You may contact our distributor in Canada to see when they would have the new batch.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

avnv007 said:


> hey guys i got new btr3 but there is a problem i cant get into usb dac mode even  after pressing power butoon thrice fastly it is detected by my laptop but no sound is coming


Dear friend,

Please try to turn on the BTR3 first and then connect it to the computer and click the power button for third time fastly. If it still fails to help, please send email to support@fiio.com about that.

Best regards


----------



## SilverEars (Sep 12, 2018)

I think this device hit the right market.

For what wireless is most useful for me is for fitness.  I want to be able to use wired  earphone of my choice and want the module in smallest formfactor possible(for fitness application), flexible options in codecs (for high beandwidth aptX HD or LDAC), quick charge (for times when battery is drained forgot to charge and need it's usage right away), and low latency for video, would hit all the tick marks to be more preferred than wireless earphones if you have a fav wired earphone you want wireless.

If we can get shorter cables for different earphones with detachable connectors would hit another sweetspot.


----------



## novatax

SilverEars said:


> I think this device hit the right market.
> 
> For what wireless is most useful for me is for fitness.  I want to be able to use wired  earphone of my choice and want the module in smallest formfactor possible(for fitness application), flexible options in codecs (for high beandwidth aptX HD or LDAC), quick charge (for times when battery is drained forgot to charge and need it's usage right away), and low latency for video, would hit all the tick marks to be more preferred than wireless earphones if you have a fav wired earphone you want wireless.
> 
> If we can get shorter cables for different earphones with detachable connectors would hit another sweetspot.



Fiio has 60cm mmcx cable, intended for BTR1 at first..


----------



## mikp

SilverEars said:


> I think this device hit the right market.
> 
> For what wireless is most useful for me is for fitness.  I want to be able to use wired  earphone of my choice and want the module in smallest formfactor possible(for fitness application), flexible options in codecs (for high beandwidth aptX HD or LDAC), quick charge (for times when battery is drained forgot to charge and need it's usage right away), and low latency for video, would hit all the tick marks to be more preferred than wireless earphones if you have a fav wired earphone you want wireless.
> 
> If we can get shorter cables for different earphones with detachable connectors would hit another sweetspot.



something like this?  fiio LC-3.5AS


----------



## SilverEars (Sep 12, 2018)

mikp said:


> something like this?  fiio LC-3.5AS


I was thinking ideally just enough to clip on my shirt, but on the other hand, you may need to use the earphone with another device as well so you probably need to keep the long cable.  If I have a earphone that I know will be used just for wireless, it's for certain a short cable would be the most convenient option, no excess when clipped on the shirt (I see on the images that they have a cable tie to keep the bundle, which is a good way to keep it short if you want to keep the long cable attached).


----------



## SilverEars

I didn't think much about this, but this wireless way is another way to be able to use a different DAC (that the streaming device's), but without really wiring it up to the devices.  It's an interesting solution that probably can find solutions to problems (like illustrated on the first page).


----------



## tripside

tripside said:


> A couple of questions
> 
> Do these output more power compared  to the Apple lightning dongle ?
> 
> Is it neutral sounding or does it colour the sound in any manner ?



So I wasn’t able to get hold of numbers for the Apple 3.5mm dongle but it should be comparable to iPhone 6 for which I was able to info on output power (courtesy Anandtech). 



 

BT3 Output Power is About 25mW (32Ω loaded) or About 33mW (16Ω loaded). So it’s not an improvement.


----------



## beneficius

Hi folks,

What is the overall sound quality of the BTR3 built-in DAC? Does it compare with Dragonfly Red or Meridian Explorer 2? If no, what other DAC in the market is similar to it?

I want to connect a pair of Yamaha HS5 directly on the BTR3, using Y cable. But I would like to know if its DAC has a reasonable quality or I need another one.

Thanks!


----------



## dbkwall

I would also like to know how the BTR3's sound compares to that from the audioquest dragonfly red and the Shanling M0.


----------



## hotdog108

dbkwall said:


> I would also like to know how the BTR3's sound compares to that from the audioquest dragonfly red and the Shanling M0.


My coworker has the red, it's much warmer than the BTR3. There's a bass boost on the red that just isn't there on any Fiio DAC, it may or may not appeal to you.


----------



## hotdog108

Two of my coworkers have now bought the BTR3, and they love them so far!


----------



## Coconut Wireles

I just got the BTR3 the other day and I do like it.  The build is excellent, I like the codec support list, I like the USB C, and I like the price point.  I'm surprised that the ES100 is using single and balanced outputs while the Fiio is only using single.  If this were Creative or something an unbalanced output would be about right but I'd expect more from Fiio by now.  Also, this device needs a dedicated app with adjustable EQ and other settings as well as a widget to control the EQ and volume.  I think this is going to impress wired snobs but there is a bit more that can be done to make this much better.

Also, like my ES100, I added a piece of adhesive velcro(loop side) underneath the pocket clip toward the fulcrum or pivot that helps to hold the device horizontally to my work shirts without sliding as much.  This probably isn't for everyone but I like to clip it between my buttons on my dress shirts and this helps to hold it more firmly without pinching too tight or damaging the shirt material.


----------



## Semiramide

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> It is available in our Aliexpress: https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pr...298.html?spm=2114.12010608.0.0.5cdce728sFq6U2
> 
> ...


Oh no, sold out. Will you renew the stock?


----------



## eespinosa

Semiramide said:


> Oh no, sold out. Will you renew the stock?


It's available on Amazon.


----------



## Hal Rockwell (Sep 15, 2018)

I ordered the BTR3 and one of the uses I have for it is to pair it with my PC for music and movies. I currently use the Avantree Leaf DG50 for that. Will it be sufficient for delivering the quality the BTR3 is capable of, or should I upgrade for a better transmitter, and what transmitter should I upgrade to?

*It has to connect to the PC via USB.


----------



## Ggroch

Hal Rockwell said:


> I ordered the BTR3 and one of the uses I have for it is to pair it with my PC for music and movies. I currently use the Avantree Leaf DG50 for that. Will it be sufficient for delivering the quality the BTR3 is capable of........?.



Your DG50 has APTx Low Latency...which is probably the best codec for Movies in terms of  sound/video sync.  So I would try it out first before upgrading.  

It is possible that if you purchased a USB adapter with Aptx HD (they are not easy to find) the sound would improve slightly...but the latency would be worst.  At the moment, there is no way I know of to force the BTR3 to use a particular codec...and on my Optical Bluetooth Transmitter that has both APTx HD and LL...it defaults to the higher latency APTx HD.


----------



## grogg

Anyone in Canada order a BTR3 from aliexpress? 

If so how long did it take to receive yours after placing the order?


----------



## mikesider

grogg said:


> Anyone in Canada order a BTR3 from aliexpress?
> 
> If so how long did it take to receive yours after placing the order?



FYI, I'm waiting for the device to be available on Amazon Canada, I got a response from a Fiio seller saying that they will begin selling the BTR3 on Amazon Canada within a few days.


----------



## mikesider

grogg said:


> Anyone in Canada order a BTR3 from aliexpress?
> 
> If so how long did it take to receive yours after placing the order?



And just after my previous post, I checked on Amazon Canada and it's now available! Can't wait to try this!


----------



## Adityaseven7

Well I just want to thank Fiio for making this device and more importantly, making it available in India.
I'm a new entrant into good audio and the btr3 has been quite an upgrade over my previous sony sbh20 ...i know this is gonna serve me well till I can save up for a dac+amp/dap. 
And btw, here in India the es100 costs 16k while this cost me 5k...cheers!


----------



## zeppu08

Is this the answer if i want to stream music like spotify and tidal tru my iphone? I dont want to use the ligthning dongle adaptor and i wanted to use my 3.5mm iems.. will this be a good buy for me? 

Sorry for being noob. Was in hiatus from HF for about 3 yrs..


----------



## Ggroch

zeppu08 said:


> Is this the answer if i want to stream music like spotify and tidal tru my iphone? I dont want to use the ligthning dongle adaptor and i wanted to use my 3.5mm iems.....



It should be a great choice for your purposes using an iPhone/IOS.

You might check out the IOS centric review of the BTR3 that was just posted on ilounge. 

They rate it A- and suggest some pluses in using it with an iPhone:

1 - Independent 30 step Bluetooth Volume control.  The review says IOS Bluetooth volume control is limited to 16 steps.  This can be a problem with sensitive IEMs as each step will boost or cut the sound quite a bit so it can be difficult to dial in what you want.  With the BTR3 you should get both the finer 30 step volume control built in to it,  plus the 16 step in the iPhone (use one or the other or both).  This could be an important advantage for IEM users.

2- Support for the less lossey AAC codec.

Some of negatives would include, iPhone does not support any aptx flavors...so you will not get Aptx HD or LLC Benefits.  I do not have an iPhone so I have not personally tried this combo or know how well the Fiio Music Player app for IOS works. Perhaps others can chime in on that.


----------



## thebrad

inertianinja said:


> Also the new firmware switches automatically



Maybe I'm blind, but are there any firmware updates already released?
I just noticed, there is a new tutorial for updating the firmware by fiio.


----------



## chortya

thebrad said:


> Maybe I'm blind, but are there any firmware updates already released?
> I just noticed, there is a new tutorial for updating the firmware by fiio.


On Chinese version there are 2 firmware updates but I don't know if the device outside China already had them installed. I updated but could not hear/see any difference.

Right now my feelings are still mixed about BTR3... I have to add I also have ES100. Combination of both would be perfect but both of them have some flaws.
Especially the USB DAC functionality of BTR3 is really strange. For me it's hit an miss to enable/use it. And only 16Bit is supported.
I am able to use HWA codec natively with Huawei but for the rest of the phones you can use it if your phone supports LDAC and then enable HWA option in the official FiiO player. Can't say if there is any improvement over LDAC.
Also combined volume/track change buttons are not my thing... On the other side it's built very well and sound is good. Also connection stability seems to be better then with ES100.


----------



## thebrad

Thanks, the hint for the chinese website helped:

For the others: firmware btr3

I'm gonna try it, when I'm home, later.


----------



## zeppu08

Ggroch said:


> It should be a great choice for your purposes using an iPhone/IOS.
> 
> You might check out the IOS centric review of the BTR3 that was just posted on ilounge.
> 
> ...



Wow! Thanks for the reply! Will check on it..


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Ggroch said:


> Your DG50 has APTx Low Latency...which is probably the best codec for Movies in terms of  sound/video sync.  So I would try it out first before upgrading.
> 
> It is possible that if you purchased a USB adapter with Aptx HD (they are not easy to find) the sound would improve slightly...but the latency would be worst.  At the moment, there is no way I know of to force the BTR3 to use a particular codec...and on my Optical Bluetooth Transmitter that has both APTx HD and LL...it defaults to the higher latency APTx HD.



What brand and model of optical transmitter do you own?


----------



## FiiO

*Get Your FiiO BTR3 Upgraded to the Latest Firmware--v0912
https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/85272.html*


----------



## crabdog

FiiO said:


> *Get Your FiiO BTR3 Upgraded to the Latest Firmware--v0912
> https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/85272.html*


Nice. Updated without any issues and everything is working fine.


----------



## mikesider

Coconut Wireles said:


> Also, this device needs a dedicated app with adjustable EQ



+ 1 for this. It would be very useful.


----------



## aozukina

Nice update. May I ask if there is an easy way for Mac users to update the firmware as well?


----------



## KKFA

inertianinja said:


> Yup. That’s one of the headphones I’m using for my review.


Hi @inertianinja may I enquire whether you have posted your review? If yes may we have the link?
Thanks.


----------



## miztahsparklez

hmm I just got mine today and have noticed that the bass output is quite a bit lacking when compared to the USBC connection on my xiaomi mi mix 2s...

I'm using UE 900s iems for initial testing.

Anyone else notice the same?  Is there an EQ app/setting?  I couldn't find it in the FiiO music app.


----------



## miztahsparklez

Hmm so more notes...

Stage and detail is really good.  I think the lack of bass is just lack of overall power.

However, I'm tempted to buy the es100 instead.


----------



## crabdog

miztahsparklez said:


> Hmm so more notes...
> 
> Stage and detail is really good.  I think the lack of bass is just lack of overall power.
> 
> However, I'm tempted to buy the es100 instead.


I find it hard to believe that it would have any trouble driving a 30Ω IEM. I was using the BTR3 last night and thinking how full the bass sounded. That said, I have never heard the UE 900 s.


----------



## miztahsparklez (Sep 20, 2018)

crabdog said:


> I find it hard to believe that it would have any trouble driving a 30Ω IEM. I was using the BTR3 last night and thinking how full the bass sounded. That said, I have never heard the UE 900 s.



I also tried it with my dt770 pro 80ohm..  definitely not enough juice there, but better on the bass.  But the amount of bass is pretty neutral for a normally bass heavy phone.  It's close to what the ue900s sounded like when it was plugged into the phone.

The ue900s sounds pretty clean like a good studio monitor.  Very very neutral.

Loudness wasn't an issue with the 900s though.  Your ears would bleed before you get close to maxing out.  It just lost all the oomph of full rounded sound.  I could turn on the Android EQ and bass boost it to a tolerable level, but I feel like I shouldn't have to do it for a device that's supposed to be hi-fi...

I was kind of wondering if it was some weird EQ that was applied, so I was hoping the app would have the settings.  Guess it's not ready yet.


----------



## crabdog

miztahsparklez said:


> I also tried it with my dt770 pro 80ohm..  definitely not enough juice there, but better on the bass.  But the amount of bass is pretty neutral for a normally bass heavy phone.  It's close to what the ue900s sounded like when it was plugged into the phone.
> 
> The ue900s sounds pretty clean like a good studio monitor.  Very very neutral.
> 
> ...


What is your regular source for 900s?


----------



## miztahsparklez

crabdog said:


> What is your regular source for 900s?



Usually mobile phone or laptop directly.  No eq turned on when connected through these ways either.

I'd almost say it's like a high pass filter applied when using the bt3.  Something like 60-80hz and above.


----------



## LondonBenji

I want to connect the BTR3 to a PC as a USB DAC, will I then be able to pair my Sony WH-1000XM3 to it using AptX HD? The BTR3 essentially has to be a USB DAC to AptX transmitter, support for the ES100 told me it can't act as a transmitter so I'm hoping the BTR3 will fit the bill.

the USB DAC portion of it will also need to support sending the microphone from the headphones as an input to the PC.


----------



## crabdog

miztahsparklez said:


> Usually mobile phone or laptop directly.  No eq turned on when connected through these ways either.
> 
> I'd almost say it's like a high pass filter applied when using the bt3.  Something like 60-80hz and above.


Is it possible that the BTR3 is just more transparent but you're used to the more "coloured" sound of your phone and laptop?


----------



## miztahsparklez

crabdog said:


> Is it possible that the BTR3 is just more transparent but you're used to the more "coloured" sound of your phone and laptop?



I have Bluetooth setup in my car and it has plenty of bass there (stereo tuned for SQ, flat response since I compete)

Will do some more testing today.  The es100 just came in the mail.  Nothing like Amazon same day delivery!

If I bump up all frequencies below 100 in the eq, the sound appears to be better.  Maybe will also test Bluetooth audio from an apple device.


----------



## miztahsparklez

I'm torn... 

The FiiO BTR3 has so much detail....  definitely a great piece of hardware.  Would LOVE to see how much more I can get out of it with the eventual eq settings/presets.  I can hear every instrument so clearly.  It's just not meant for large power hungry cans.  IEMs, no problem.

The features of the ES100 are crazy!  It can also drive my dt770 pro cans at a reasonable volume without issue... Very impressed overall, but the hardware package itself isn't as premium feeling as the BTR3.  The sound is a little less transparent as the BTR3, but it's still quite good.

Features vs sound quality....


----------



## miztahsparklez (Sep 21, 2018)

Doing more a/b testing.  I definitely like the sound profile of the BTR3 IF and ONLY IF, I crank the bass boost on max for the factory android snapdragon processing (EQ is flat otherwise).  For fun, I also used DAC mode on my PC to test.  It's no better in bass response.

If I didn't hear the BTR3 first, I probably would be 100% happy with the ES100.  It just sounds so muddy in comparison... I'm also using best case scenario with a balanced cable.

Vocals are just phenomenal on the BTR3.  Presence is fantastic. 

Anyone find the track advance/back buttons to be a little odd being reversed?  The - makes the track go forward and + makes it go backwards.


----------



## miztahsparklez

LondonBenji said:


> I want to connect the BTR3 to a PC as a USB DAC, will I then be able to pair my Sony WH-1000XM3 to it using AptX HD? The BTR3 essentially has to be a USB DAC to AptX transmitter, support for the ES100 told me it can't act as a transmitter so I'm hoping the BTR3 will fit the bill.
> 
> the USB DAC portion of it will also need to support sending the microphone from the headphones as an input to the PC.



No, it's not a transmitter.  It's a DAC and Bluetooth receiver


----------



## hotdog108

It's sold out on Amazon and eBay again. I have at least half a dozen friends wanting to buy and they're all waiting for stock.


----------



## miztahsparklez

hotdog108 said:


> It's sold out on Amazon and eBay again. I have at least half a dozen friends wanting to buy and they're all waiting for stock.



Lol pretty sure I bought the last one on Amazon...


----------



## hotdog108

miztahsparklez said:


> Lol pretty sure I bought the last one on Amazon...


Enjoy, everyone around me who's bought one love it.


----------



## LondonBenji

miztahsparklez said:


> No, it's not a transmitter.  It's a DAC and Bluetooth receiver



Dang it! Doesn't _anyone_ do a USB AptX *HD* _transmitter_! I just want to enjoy the Sony's at full quality on a PC...... I can find a few USB AptX sticks but so far nothing that supports AptX HD.


----------



## hotdog108

LondonBenji said:


> Dang it! Doesn't _anyone_ do a USB AptX *HD* _transmitter_! I just want to enjoy the Sony's at full quality on a PC...... I can find a few USB AptX sticks but so far nothing that supports AptX HD.


Casual Google search turned up this as one of the top results: https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Handsfree-Headphones-Synchroniz/dp/B076DCVD13


----------



## LondonBenji

hotdog108 said:


> Casual Google search turned up this as one of the top results: https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Handsfree-Headphones-Synchroniz/dp/B076DCVD13



Yeah, I should have clarified, I am hoping for one from a reputable manufacturer, that seems to be a generic multi branded product of unknown quality:

http://www.skywing-hk.com/cp/10-en.html

If the audio cable on the Sony's included a mic return audio as well it wouldn't be so much of an issue. Might have to rethink this, thank you for you link!


----------



## Ggroch (Sep 21, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> Casual Google search turned up this as one of the top results: https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Handsfree-Headphones-Synchroniz/dp/B076DCVD13



I am pretty sure this one is not a USB DAC/transmitter...in fact, It appears to be Line In/Aux Only as a source.  The USB connection is for power only.   There are others like this Anker one that add Optical/Coaxial inputs.....but still not USB input.
I have not yet found a true Aptx-HD USB transmitter DAC...but if you wanted to simultaneously hear the headphones AND use the mic/calling feature you would need a combined Transmitter Receiver that did both at the same time.  Adapters like theses linked ones either transmit or receive....not both at the same time.

Transmitters with Optical inputs like the Anker above ARE useful with the BTR-3, but not for PC.  I use one for connecting my TV's Optical Output and another for the Optical Out on my Chromecast Audio.  Both make a great audio connection to the BTR3. Sadly, the Optical In/Outs are one direction only...either transmit or receive.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

This looks like a better choice for a Bluetooth transmitter/receiver, if you're willing to pay the extra 50USD for the option to prioritize what codac is used to stream the content. But it's still an optical device.

Maybe FiiO will pick up the gauntlet and be the first to come up with a Bluetooth transmitter that has aptx HD and connects to a PC via USB and not optical.


----------



## Ggroch (Sep 22, 2018)

Hal Rockwell said:


> This looks like a better choice for a Bluetooth transmitter/receiver, if you're willing to pay the extra 50USD for the option to prioritize what codac is used to stream the content.....



I like it.
3 advantages I see over the Anker (above) or the no name I own.
 -  Selectable Aptx LL /HD switch...so you can choose low latency when appropriate (my no name defaults to aptx HD with no choice).
 -  Long Range Bluetooth Transmitter
 -  Optical Pass Through...allows you to send your optical TV output to both the transmitter and another device like a sound bar.

And 2 Disadvantages
- Bluetooth 4.2 not 5.0 ......this is probably NO disadvantage with the BTR3 as it is also Bluetooth 4.2...but when the BTR4 comes out sporting Bluetooth 5.0 you'd be ready 
- Price

I am not tempted to switch because as yet I have not noticed a sync delay on my TV when using the defaulted to aptx HD mode.  My hope is that when the  BTR3 Fiio Music App interface goes live you will be able to select/program the receive codec into the BTR3, like you can the ES100.  We will not know until we see it I guess.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Ggroch said:


> I like it.
> 3 advantages I see over the Anker (above) or the no name I own.
> -  Selectable Aptx LL /HD switch...so you can choose low latency when appropriate (my no name defaults to aptx HD with no choice).
> -  Long Range Bluetooth Transmitter
> ...



I hope that that the FiiO app will present the ability to configure the BTR3 globally, and won't enforce me to use their app exclusively for playing music.


----------



## Ggroch

Hal Rockwell said:


> I hope that that the FiiO app will present the ability to configure the BTR3 globally, and won't enforce me to use their app exclusively for playing music.


Yes that is how the ES100 works...all settings are memorized and work in other apps & Bluetooth sources.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Ggroch said:


> Yes that is how the ES100 works...all settings are memorized and work in other apps & Bluetooth sources.



Wish FiiO would pack the app with all of the options that ES100 has.


----------



## Travors

FiiO said:


> *Get Your FiiO BTR3 Upgraded to the Latest Firmware--v0912
> https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/85272.html*




Hi FiiO, I recently purchased through my official store on AliExpress my BTR3 and I can not wait to receive it because I know it will take from 7 to 14 days because in Italy still no dealer had available.

I have read that a new Firmware - v0912 update is available for the BTR3, but going to download the firmware there are other updates before this! My question is you need to install the old firmware first of the one just released by you recommended ?? Sorry for my english but I'm not native speaker help me with a translator


----------



## Travors

Hello everyone, thank you very much for inspiring me and convinced me to buy the new BTR3, I still have to get there because in Italy no dealer could tell me when it was available, for this reason I decided to buy it on AliExpress from the FiiO store.

Do I have the M2IEG Momentum Sennheiser according to you as they play with the BTR3? Wanting to update what would you recommend? I listen to different kinds of music from extreme metal to modern classical. Thanks to anyone who will help me 

Franz


----------



## mikp

well, im happy with the btr3. Battery just lasts a week of hikes with tin t2. buttons are easy to use and feel. power button could have been on the bottom


----------



## rkw (Sep 22, 2018)

Ggroch said:


> Bluetooth 4.2 not 5.0 ......this is probably NO disadvantage with the BTR3 as it is also Bluetooth 4.2...but when the BTR4 comes out sporting Bluetooth 5.0 you'd be ready


The Bluetooth 5 standard didn't update the audio profile (A2DP). Bluetooth audio works the same way whether 4.2 or 5.0 — no change in range or bandwidth. The updates in Bluetooth 5 were to provide better performance for IOT (Internet of Things) devices which transmit small quantities of data.

tl;dr: Bluetooth 5.0 is 4.2 with some updates. Those updates do not affect Bluetooth audio.

Most wireless headphone makers use off-the-shelf Bluetooth chipsets (such as from Qualcomm). Some of those chipsets now support BT 5. They happily advertise BT 5 without saying anything about audio performance, and let the consumer infer that it has a higher number and surely must be better. But actually this is pure marketing and it makes no difference.


----------



## Ynot1

This is interesting for me because I tried to read the bluetooth standard and I got bored. But just before that happened I did manage to pickup something about power control which could lengthen battery life and sustain good audio quality.


----------



## crabdog

Travors said:


> Hello everyone, thank you very much for inspiring me and convinced me to buy the new BTR3, I still have to get there because in Italy no dealer could tell me when it was available, for this reason I decided to buy it on AliExpress from the FiiO store.
> 
> Do I have the M2IEG Momentum Sennheiser according to you as they play with the BTR3? Wanting to update what would you recommend? I listen to different kinds of music from extreme metal to modern classical. Thanks to anyone who will help me
> 
> Franz


If you can tell us your budget we can give you a better recommendation.


----------



## Travors (Sep 23, 2018)

.


----------



## Travors

crabdog said:


> If you can tell us your budget we can give you a better recommendation.



Hello Crabdog, thanks for the help, let's say maximum € 150.00 
The use I will make and listen to music while I go to work or while traveling, I have a trained and sensitive ear and all my music is in Flac format some albums also Flac Hd 24bit ... as a smartphone I have a Note 9 where I mount a 128gb microsd I put all my music


----------



## crabdog

Travors said:


> .


I would suggest the Hifi Boy OS V3.


----------



## Travors

crabdog said:


> I would suggest the Hifi Boy OS V3.



Thank you very much, I read some reviews about these headphones, I am very attracted and curious about how they play with my music and how they match with the BTR3.
But I have doubts about the attacks of headphones, I'm afraid that with the constant use of every day you can ruin, I've never had headphones with detachable cable just for this fear.
Another doubt is that in Italy I have no retailer to buy them, the only way is AliExpress with delivery in about 30 days, if I had problems I do not have a warranty or spare parts, given the economic investment I would like to be quiet.

I bought the Sennheiser M2IEG Momentum on Amazon years ago, they convinced me the excellent reviews they had, I must say that they did not disappoint me.
According to your expert opinion are bad headphones? Do they match badly with the BTR3 they fail to yield its characteristics?

Thank you so much for the precious help


----------



## Ggroch (Sep 23, 2018)

Travors said:


> I bought the Sennheiser M2IEG Momentum on Amazon years ago, they convinced me the excellent reviews they had, I must say that they did not disappoint me.
> According to your expert opinion are bad headphones? Do they match badly with the BTR3 they fail to yield its characteristics?



Electronically they should be a fine match with your Sennheiser in ears.The remote may or may not work but otherwise a good match that should sound really fine.   One key benefit of the BTR3 over other receivers is its 30 step independent volume control, which enables you far more precise volume control in concert with your source than most other BT receivers and that is important on IEMs.

The BTR3 should work very well with the vast majority of in ear headphones...and work poorly mostly with inefficient on and over ears like the Fostex T50rp and Sennheiser 650.   

My advice would be if you like the Senns to try them first.  You know how they sound on your current source, so you will be the best judge of what they lose...VERY little I would bet. 

   Your IEMs will determine 90% of the sound and 100% of the fit / comfort quality.  The amp/Bluetooth adapter which will impact maybe 10% (barring any gross mismatch).... so I would not choose your earphones on the basis of matching your Bluetooth adapter....just be sure when you buy new ones that you choose from the vast majority of IEMs that will work great and that are not weird/unusual in their amp requirements.


----------



## crabdog

Travors said:


> Thank you very much, I read some reviews about these headphones, I am very attracted and curious about how they play with my music and how they match with the BTR3.
> But I have doubts about the attacks of headphones, I'm afraid that with the constant use of every day you can ruin, I've never had headphones with detachable cable just for this fear.
> Another doubt is that in Italy I have no retailer to buy them, the only way is AliExpress with delivery in about 30 days, if I had problems I do not have a warranty or spare parts, given the economic investment I would like to be quiet.
> 
> ...


I have not heard the Momentum but it has a good reputation and very positive reviews. If you want to buy something locally maybe you can see if there's a shop in your area that sells the iBasso IT01.


----------



## cleg

my take on FiiO's BTR3


----------



## PeterMac

Does this FiiO BTR3 will handle good Sennheiser HD 599 headphones with 50omhs ?
How long can run on battery with this headphones ?, I quess 11h is for earbuds with lower impedance.

FiiO please make that kind of Bluetooth receiver with much bigger battery, for example >500mAh.

I had Sennheiser HD 4.40 BT which work on Bluetooth 25 hours, but I return them to shop, no comfortable for me using at home, so now I want open-back headphones with BT.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

PeterMac said:


> Does this FiiO BTR3 will handle good Sennheiser HD 599 headphones with 50omhs ?
> How long can run on battery with this headphones ?, I quess 11h is for earbuds with lower impedance.
> 
> FiiO please make that kind of Bluetooth receiver with much bigger battery, for example >500mAh.
> ...



FiiO already has it. It's called the Q5.


----------



## PeterMac (Sep 24, 2018)

Too big, too expensive, I want stick this bluetooth receiver on headphones, and for 50ohms does this BTR3 not enough ?

Sennheiser HD 4.40 BT have built in that kind of Bluetooth DAC/receiver in one earcup and 25hours of battery life of one charge, and they sound perfect .


----------



## miztahsparklez

PeterMac said:


> Too big, too expensive, I want stick this bluetooth receiver on headphones, and for 50ohms does this BTR3 not enough ?
> 
> Sennheiser HD 4.40 BT have built in that kind of Bluetooth DAC/receiver in one earcup and 25hours of battery life of one charge, and they sound perfect .



I had it on my 80ohm dt770 pro... It wasn't very loud and seemed to sound unstable at Max volume


----------



## Ggroch (Sep 24, 2018)

miztahsparklez said:


> I had it on my 80 ohm dt770 pro... It wasn't very loud and seemed to sound unstable at Max volume



The 80 Ohm  DT770 Pro have a sensitivity of 96dB...  PeterMac's  50 Ohm HD599 have a much higher sensitivity of 106dB.    So the HD599 should get a lot louder....be a better match.   The BTR3 is so new that I think it is unlikely  anyone with the HD599 has tried the combo but the reviews say the Senns can be driven well with most smart phones.   

So...if Peter wants to play at very high volumes and expects 25 hours of battery life...that will not happen.   I see no reason why it would not be a good combination with good fidelity if  expectations are realistic.   The HD599 are very easy to drive and 50 Ohms is not that high...but like you said with the DT770s....it may not get VERY loud.


----------



## FiiO

Travors said:


> Hi FiiO, I recently purchased through my official store on AliExpress my BTR3 and I can not wait to receive it because I know it will take from 7 to 14 days because in Italy still no dealer had available.
> 
> I have read that a new Firmware - v0912 update is available for the BTR3, but going to download the firmware there are other updates before this! My question is you need to install the old firmware first of the one just released by you recommended ?? Sorry for my english but I'm not native speaker help me with a translator


Dear friend,

You could update the latest firmware version directly. Don't need to update the older one first. 

Best regards


----------



## alphak

Will I be able to drive my Audio Technica ATH EQ500's with the uBTR, or will I need the BTR3? I know uBTR doesn't have AptX HD but was wondering if it'll have a lot of the hiss etc, they are really light weight headphones that I love, even though lots of sound leakage etc, its super comfortable..

Got the following specs off the AT japanese site and used google translate

Driver = φ 28 mm
Output sound pressure level = 103 dB / mW
Playback frequency band = 16 to 24,000 Hz
Maximum input = 40 mW
Impedance = 20 Ω


----------



## mhoopes

alphak said:


> Will I be able to drive my Audio Technica ATH EQ500's with the uBTR, or will I need the BTR3? I know uBTR doesn't have AptX HD but was wondering if it'll have a lot of the hiss etc, they are really light weight headphones that I love, even though lots of sound leakage etc, its super comfortable..
> 
> Got the following specs off the AT japanese site and used google translate
> 
> ...



It seems to me that the µBTR would be a good match for that earphone, both in impedance and cost. If you have extra money for the BTR3, I'd upgrade my earphones, first. 

At 103 dB/mW, I don't think hiss should be much of an issue. I have 112 dB/mW earphones that don't exhibit hiss with the µBTR, though my hearing may be less sensitive to it than yours. Also, I use an iPhone, so my experience is with AAC, which isn't too different in quality from aptX HD.


----------



## SpiderNhan

Ggroch said:


> Electronically they should be a fine match with your Sennheiser in ears.The remote may or may not work but otherwise a good match that should sound really fine.   One key benefit of the BTR3 over other receivers is its 30 step independent volume control, which enables you far more precise volume control in concert with your source than most other BT receivers and that is important on IEMs.
> 
> The BTR3 should work very well with the vast majority of in ear headphones...and work poorly mostly with inefficient on and over ears like the Fostex T50rp and Sennheiser 650.
> 
> ...


Actually, I just unboxed my BTR3 and the first headphone I fed it was the Fostex T50rp mk3. I must say... Not bad at all. Full volume on both my phone (OnePlus 5T>LDAC) and the BTR3, but this is definitely listenable.


----------



## eckndu

hi, can it be recharged while maintaining a bt connection?


----------



## miztahsparklez

Ggroch said:


> The 80 Ohm  DT770 Pro have a sensitivity of 96dB...  PeterMac's  50 Ohm HD599 have a much higher sensitivity of 106dB.    So the HD599 should get a lot louder....be a better match.   The BTR3 is so new that I think it is unlikely  anyone with the HD599 has tried the combo but the reviews say the Senns can be driven well with most smart phones.
> 
> So...if Peter wants to play at very high volumes and expects 25 hours of battery life...that will not happen.   I see no reason why it would not be a good combination with good fidelity if  expectations are realistic.   The HD599 are very easy to drive and 50 Ohms is not that high...but like you said with the DT770s....it may not get VERY loud.



Oh I know.. the dt770 is not friendly .  It puts most amps to the test even.  They consume gobs and gobs of power, the more you throw, the more they take.

I'm assuming "normal" listeners who don't turn up their music will get optimal sound out of most headphones and decent battery life.  What will wow most people is the level of detail that the BTR3 can provide.  I've gone back and listened to old cans that have sounded "muddy" to me in the past, but now can hear all the fine details.  I'm amazed how much I have been missing out on using my phone's DAC.


----------



## hotdog108

eckndu said:


> hi, can it be recharged while maintaining a bt connection?


Yep, although it's not recommended. As is the case with all battery based devices.


----------



## rkw

hotdog108 said:


> Yep, although it's not recommended. As is the case with all battery based devices.


Why? Lots of people charge their phone or laptop while using it. Does FiiO discourage it? Doesn't it charge while using it as a USB DAC?


----------



## hotdog108

rkw said:


> Why? Lots of people charge their phone or laptop while using it. Does FiiO discourage it? Doesn't it charge while using it as a USB DAC?


it's not a good idea to drain a battery while adding more juice, it reduces the life of said battery, because physics and chemistry


----------



## miztahsparklez

hotdog108 said:


> it's not a good idea to drain a battery while adding more juice, it reduces the life of said battery, because physics and chemistry



Honestly, for something thats $70 and no removable battery is designed to wear out so you buy another one.  Maybe in 3 years you will buy the next one anyway.  

I would just say use and charge how you want!


----------



## SubMash

This is just not true. When you charge and use battery it is effectively same as if you charge it slower. And charging slower is good for battery.


hotdog108 said:


> it's not a good idea to drain a battery while adding more juice, it reduces the life of said battery, because physics and chemistry


----------



## hotdog108

SubMash said:


> This is just not true. When you charge and use battery it is effectively same as if you charge it slower. And charging slower is good for battery.


You can believe whatever you want, or rationalize whatever way you like, but science is science. Personal belief has never altered how physics works, and nor will it this time.


----------



## hotdog108

miztahsparklez said:


> Honestly, for something thats $70 and no removable battery is designed to wear out so you buy another one.  Maybe in 3 years you will buy the next one anyway.
> 
> I would just say use and charge how you want!


I agree, things like this are considered consumables, use it for a few years and get a new one. I'm just speaking in terms of pure battery physics, consuming while charging reduces the capacity.


----------



## rkw (Sep 27, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> it's not a good idea to drain a battery while adding more juice, it reduces the life of said battery, because physics and chemistry





SubMash said:


> This is just not true. When you charge and use battery it is effectively same as if you charge it slower. And charging slower is good for battery.


The information I see is that it is not possible to charge and use a battery at the same time. The external power will drive the device and excess power will charge the battery. If the external source can't provide enough power for the device, the battery provides supplemental power and isn't charged at that same time. So @SubMash is partially correct depending on the amount of power.
https://www.google.com/search?q=charge+discharge+battery+simultaneously


----------



## mhoopes (Sep 27, 2018)

rkw said:


> The information I see is that it is not possible to charge and use a battery at the same time. The external power will drive the device and excess power will charge the battery. If the external source can't provide enough power for the device, the battery provides supplemental power and isn't charged at that same time. So @SubMash is partially correct depending on the amount of power.
> https://www.google.com/search?q=charge+discharge+battery+simultaneously


In order for a battery to charge, the charging voltage applied to it must be higher than the battery potential. An extra load could draw power from both, but current division would favor the source with the higher potential by some %.
[edit] Unless the current-limiting of the source->battery is sufficiently higher than the battery output impedance.


----------



## alphak

mhoopes said:


> It seems to me that the µBTR would be a good match for that earphone, both in impedance and cost. If you have extra money for the BTR3, I'd upgrade my earphones, first.
> 
> At 103 dB/mW, I don't think hiss should be much of an issue. I have 112 dB/mW earphones that don't exhibit hiss with the µBTR, though my hearing may be less sensitive to it than yours. Also, I use an iPhone, so my experience is with AAC, which isn't too different in quality from aptX HD.



Thank you for this, however the problem is the kind of headphones I want, which are light weight clip-on on ear type and not in-ear, are few and far in between. The only popular one I keep seeing is the Koss KSC75 but it seems a bit too heavy, the ATH EQ500 is too perfect at 20 grams, and the audio quality is not horrendous at the spec. I should probably post a separate thread for clip-on headphone recommendations but I've looked through some of the existing ones and couldn't find anything much superior.

I have an Avantree Cara II bluetooth transmitter and i get an ever so slight hiss when using it with the ATH EQ500, mainly because I listen 90% to audiobooks and podcasts at low volumes. 

I've decided to go for the FiiO BTR3 even though it is overkill for these headphones, got it delivered yesterday.







First surprising thing about this little gadget is the weight, it is super tiny but also substantially heavy, I'd wager with the metal clip it's easly 30 grams or more, about the weight of a 9v battery maybe slightly less (the site says 25g but they might be saying that without the clip). On a thin t-shirt it can definitely be felt when clipping onto a shoulder. The clip is made of really solid metal, and feels VERY premium. in fact, the whole build is absolutely top notch, feels like it's an expensive product and has a lot of tech packed into its tiny dense frame.

NFC; this feature is slightly different from how I expected it to work, basically you need to hold the power button to power on the device first, and then use NFC to tap your phone and connect. On another NFC bluetooth headset I had, NFC would also power on/power off the bluetooth device itself, but that's not the case here. Would have loved to seen the NFC being the same but its not a horrendous issue.

Audio quality; now my headphones are by no means super power hungry at 103 dB/mW and i'm no audio expert either, but I have not heard even the slightest bit of noise or disturbance when listening at low volumes, mainly podcasts and audio books. It is excellent, definitely indistinguishable from a 3.5mm analog connection to my pc. The convenience of wireless at the quality of wired is what this device aims to deliver and at least in my case, delivers perfectly. Definitely recommended!


----------



## SubMash (Sep 28, 2018)

hotdog108 said:


> I agree, things like this are considered consumables, use it for a few years and get a new one. I'm just speaking in terms of pure battery physics, consuming while charging reduces the capacity.


Well, explain how? Battery charged in cc-cv mode. Means limit of current and voltage whatever comes first. Charge is application of higher voltage than existing on the battery. If you use battery during charge (which would be almost all of the battery powered devices in existence) you make a load on electrical source - charger. If your load is too high to maintain same voltage - charger will drop voltage (or when internal resistance of charger will decrease it under load).

Such event effectively identical to decrease of charging speed. Which is known to prolong life of battery.

If load will push charger voltage below battery voltage - battery won't be charging and will be releasing energy. There are no physical event of charging and discharging at the same time. Battery is either driven to get charge or to release it.

And it doesn't care if you going to have tiny currents changing directions very often, because almost all circuitry would effectively push tiny currents back to battery at high frequency on voltage regulators.

There are few things known to decrease capacity:
1. High (or extremely low) Temperature
2. High Input or Output Current
3. High or Low Charge
4. Oxidation of electrolyte and electrodes over time

None of those increasing during charge and use at the same time.

So there are no evidence of what you say (or give a link on a study that shows it) and no physical effects describing potential for such result. Moreover - almost all devices using battery while charging, because charging logic is powered by battery itself. So, you can't even avoid it and therefore whole comment is useless.

P.S. When we talk about devices like this one regular USB charger is 2.5W, while whole device consumption at most 0.2W, so if charger is connected - it never uses a battery at all. USB-C of btr3 is not increasing charging speed at all, batteries are too tiny to be charged even at regular USB currents.


----------



## hotdog108

SubMash said:


> Well, explain how? Battery charged in cc-cv mode. Means limit of current and voltage whatever comes first. Charge is application of higher voltage than existing on the battery. If you use battery during charge (which would be almost all of the battery powered devices in existence) you make a load on electrical source - charger. If your load is too high to maintain same voltage - charger will drop voltage (or when internal resistance of charger will decrease it under load).
> 
> Such event effectively identical to decrease of charging speed. Which is known to prolong life of battery.
> 
> ...


Every battery has an upper limit of charge cycles, this is an irrefutable fact. Every time you charge it, you're reducing the battery life and charge cycles. This is common sense at this point. Having it charging during use puts a constant bidirectional load on the battery, reducing the life of the battery faster than normal use and charging cycles. It's physics and common sense, this whole idea of a device not using the battery while plugged in because of a difference in output and input isn't scientifically sound. I'm not saying charging while using isn't possible, it certainly is, but so is driving with one hand out the window, it's just not recommended.


----------



## mhoopes (Sep 28, 2018)

alphak said:


> Thank you for this, however the problem is the kind of headphones I want, which are light weight clip-on on ear type and not in-ear, are few and far in between. The only popular one I keep seeing is the Koss KSC75 but it seems a bit too heavy, the ATH EQ500 is too perfect at 20 grams, and the audio quality is not horrendous at the spec. I should probably post a separate thread for clip-on headphone recommendations but I've looked through some of the existing ones and couldn't find anything much superior.
> 
> I have an Avantree Cara II bluetooth transmitter and i get an ever so slight hiss when using it with the ATH EQ500, mainly because I listen 90% to audiobooks and podcasts at low volumes.
> 
> ...


Gotcha - there are limited headphone choices for audio enthusiasts in truly lightweight on-ear form. Glad you like the ones you have.
I see by the blue FiiO logo that it's using the SBC codec, though Avantree says their unit supports AAC (cyan logo in the BTR3) and aptX (purple). Have you seen it connect to AAC or aptX? That could make a noticeable difference. 
[edit] Ahh, the Avantree Cara II is a receiver, so that's obviously not in play in your picture. What is transmitting there?


----------



## SubMash

hotdog108 said:


> Every battery has an upper limit of charge cycles, this is an irrefutable fact. Every time you charge it, you're reducing the battery life and charge cycles. This is common sense at this point. Having it charging during use puts a constant bidirectional load on the battery, reducing the life of the battery faster than normal use and charging cycles. It's physics and common sense, this whole idea of a device not using the battery while plugged in because of a difference in output and input isn't scientifically sound. I'm not saying charging while using isn't possible, it certainly is, but so is driving with one hand out the window, it's just not recommended.


I'm managing company that actively using and testing millions of battery cells. A number of cycles - consumer characteristic that is defined by Charging Current limit and with the full cycle of complete charge-discharge because this is the most common battery use scenario - full charge, almost full discharge. There is no physical dependency from a number of any cycles. Reality is that there is an extended wear of electrolyte and electrodes due to the presence of current. And smaller current per energy - smaller wear until the point that it doesn't matter anymore, because self-oxidization becomes stronger than usage wear.

Now once you keep the battery on the charger and using it, especially in this particular device - you are NOT charging it more often and NOT discharging it at all except self-discharge which instantly compensated by the presence of charging voltage. So your logic is not applicable here at all - there is no bidirectional load on a battery.

If you're using ES100 it even has a battery saving mode where it won't charge battery above 80%. That saves a lot of battery cell life because keeping the battery at high voltage wears it very fast.

If anyone will decide that it's better to use without the charger connected and only connect charger once it's empty - makes an enormous mistake. That would wear battery and decrease capacity much much faster.


----------



## alphak

mhoopes said:


> Gotcha - there are limited headphone choices for audio enthusiasts in truly lightweight on-ear form. Glad you like the ones you have.
> I see by the blue FiiO logo that it's using the SBC codec, though Avantree says their unit supports AAC (cyan logo in the BTR3) and aptX (purple). Have you seen it connect to AAC or aptX? That could make a noticeable difference.
> [edit] Ahh, the Avantree Cara II is a receiver, so that's obviously not in play in your picture. What is transmitting there?


I meant receiver sorry! Cara II does have AptX (non HD and non LL) so i tried using it, was still able to hear some audio noise on my EQ 500 headphones, maybe it can't supply enough power or something. Definitely no such issues on the BTR3 anymore!

And the FiiO BTR3 blue light, honestly, I've got it on SBC because maybe my headphones aren't powerful enough but I notice very little difference switching between LDAC and AptX HD and SBC. So I thought I'll keep it at SBC and save a decent bit of battery especially on the phone. So far I've gotten into hour 12 (8 yesterday and 4 today) and BTR3's battery still says 30% in settings, and audio quality is still just as good, no noise or screeches etc. Absolutely loving it, our wireless future is here boys and gals!


----------



## mhoopes

SubMash said:


> I'm managing company that actively using and testing millions of battery cells. A number of cycles - consumer characteristic that is defined by Charging Current limit and with the full cycle of complete charge-discharge because this is the most common battery use scenario - full charge, almost full discharge. There is no physical dependency from a number of any cycles. Reality is that there is an extended wear of electrolyte and electrodes due to the presence of current. And smaller current per energy - smaller wear until the point that it doesn't matter anymore, because self-oxidization becomes stronger than usage wear.
> 
> Now once you keep the battery on the charger and using it, especially in this particular device - you are NOT charging it more often and NOT discharging it at all except self-discharge which instantly compensated by the presence of charging voltage. So your logic is not applicable here at all - there is no bidirectional load on a battery.
> 
> ...


I had a buddy who never unplugged his Toshiba laptop because the didn't know how to make his screen brighter when it was unplugged. His LIB was dead in less than a year. Constant top-off is likely the cause. So there's a balance that is helpful to attempt: charging current vs. storage voltage. I'd say use its "partial-charging" mode if you're worried about battery life. CVCC charging might produce more heat when charging from very low battery potentials (when in CC mode), but the ES100 doesn't seem to get very warm when charging, in my experience.

Here's a discussion comment I ran into recently that talks about some of the issues of the typical wireless charging use case, in response to a ZDNet article entitled "iPhone X/8: Wireless charging will wear out the battery faster than cable charging":



> altema1 • 6 months ago
> 
> Hey everyone, just thought I'd chime as an engineer and former mobile device repair tech.
> First off, the 500 cycle is an estimate. Lithium ion and lithium polymer batteries do not care about the actual number of charge cycles, as their lifespan is determined by the total voltage flowing through the battery. This total usually averages out to about 500 cycles, so that's why they still use the reference. Older battery technologies did care about the actual number, even if they were minor charges, due to battery memory. Those were mostly nickel cadmium and nickel metal hydride batteries, and I'm glad we don't use those in smartphones! Their power/density ratio was not the best anyway, lol.
> ...


----------



## hotdog108

So physics and chemistry doesn't apply?


----------



## eckndu

Let’s move on.


----------



## harpo1

Just upgraded the firmware to the latest and plugged it in as a USB DAC and it shows up as an EarStudio USB DAC.  I own the ES100 as well.  Not sure why this is happening since the BTR3 is suppose to be plug and play.  Anyone have any ideas?


----------



## Darkestred (Oct 1, 2018)

How


harpo1 said:


> Just upgraded the firmware to the latest and plugged it in as a USB DAC and it shows up as an EarStudio USB DAC.  I own the ES100 as well.  Not sure why this is happening since the BTR3 is suppose to be plug and play.  Anyone have any ideas?



Where did you upgrade from?  The link from here: http://fiio-file.fiio.net/BTR3/BTR3_firmware-0912.zip when i open the file shows just a .dfu.  I am currently stuck in DFU mode because Windows 7 drivers failed upon connecting the device.  So, i guess i have a brick or hopefully when the battery dies.  I will be able to power this device on.  Currently, I have no way of getting out of DFU mode . I've tried all various button presses and holds.  Waiting for Fiio to respond in Firmware thread/email.

A few minutes after posting this i was able to get out of DFU mode.  Not sure what button presses did what.


----------



## Ggroch

Darkestred said:


> .....A few minutes after posting this i was able to get out of DFU mode.  Not sure what button presses did what.



Glad to hear you got it reset.  If I remember right it happened to me...and disconnecting from USB and then doing the reset (holding the power button down for 10 seconds) solved it.  But I am not sure exactly. 

The best firmware link to use for people just joining this discussion is this one:  https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg  because it includes not only the download link...but also the upgrade tool link and instructions on how to do it.

It still took me 2 tries.


----------



## Darkestred

Ggroch said:


> Glad to hear you got it reset.  If I remember right it happened to me...and disconnecting from USB and then doing the reset (holding the power button down for 10 seconds) solved it.  But I am not sure exactly.
> 
> The best firmware link to use for people just joining this discussion is this one:  https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg  because it includes not only the download link...but also the upgrade tool link and instructions on how to do it.
> 
> It still took me 2 tries.



Yeah.  I did power down and a few other buttons for awhile.  Thank you for the link. Ahh.  Same link.  I just now noticed the upgrade tool link.


----------



## alphak

Ggroch said:


> Glad to hear you got it reset.  If I remember right it happened to me...and disconnecting from USB and then doing the reset (holding the power button down for 10 seconds) solved it.  But I am not sure exactly.
> 
> The best firmware link to use for people just joining this discussion is this one:  https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg  because it includes not only the download link...but also the upgrade tool link and instructions on how to do it.
> 
> It still took me 2 tries.


yep can confirm this works, very seamless in win 10, took about 5 min all told. 

Battery life seems to be roughly around the 10-11 hr mark whether I use SBC or HD - LDAC, I assumed using a lower codec will save battery but I guess not! Still pretty solid for a wireless device that's as tiny as it is!

Thinking of getting a plastic "screen" protector for the glass, don't want it ruined by accidental bumps etc, the whole build really feels extremely premium, glass front, matte finished body and metal back clip, solid combination of materials!


----------



## MarkF786

This product seems half-baked; they're releasing firmware updates, but the process for updating it is flawed in many ways, for example:

- The support information and downloads seems amateurish; more like a discussion forum that support pages.
- Apparently there's no support for doing firmware updates from Macs.
- Apparently VMWare Fusion doesn't work either.
- There's no guidance offered for when the firmware update doesn't work.
- The device gets stuck in DFU mode for some unknown interval of time.  Who knows when it will reset, if there's any way to force it to reset, etc.  In my attempts to flash it, sometimes it would exit DFU mode while I was still attempting to flash it, other times I'd have to way 15-30 minutes for it to exit.

On the other hand, the ES100 is easy to update, both on Windows and Mac, with the firmware easy to find on their website, and the instructions well written.  What a world of difference in quality of support.

Sure, the BTR3 feels more solid - but so far nothing about the support seems solid.


----------



## KKFA

Ggroch said:


> Glad to hear you got it reset.  If I remember right it happened to me...and disconnecting from USB and then doing the reset (holding the power button down for 10 seconds) solved it.  But I am not sure exactly.
> 
> The best firmware link to use for people just joining this discussion is this one:  https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg  because it includes not only the download link...but also the upgrade tool link and instructions on how to do it.
> 
> It still took me 2 tries.


Hi, I just got by BTR3.  Will this latest batch already have the new firmware? If it does will flashing it again damage it? Btw how do we check what firmware version as there seems to have no indication.

Also pairing it with my Samsung S8 is flawless but does not seem to play well with my Hiby R6. Anyone here has the similar issues? I will ask in the Hiby R6 thread as well

Thanks.


----------



## Ggroch

KKFA said:


> Hi, I just got by BTR3.  Will this latest batch already have the new firmware? If it does will flashing it again damage it? Btw how do we check what firmware version as there seems to have no indication.
> 
> Also pairing it with my Samsung S8 is flawless but does not seem to play well with my Hiby R6. Anyone here has the similar issues? I will ask in the Hiby R6 thread as well
> Thanks.



The latest firmware is dated 09/12...so my guess is yours probably does not have it, but reflashing will not damage it.   I expect that when the Fiio Music App is updated to support the BTR3 that it will report the firmware (and hopefully provide an easier way to update it).  I know of no way to find out the current firmware until they update the app.

I see the Hiby R6 uses Bluetooth 4.0 with aptx (not HD or LL).  So, it should work fine.  Perhaps updating the BTR3 firmware  or making sure the Hiby R6 is also up do date. will help.  No other ideas.


----------



## KKFA

Ggroch said:


> The latest firmware is dated 09/12...so my guess is yours probably does not have it, but reflashing will not damage it.   I expect that when the Fiio Music App is updated to support the BTR3 that it will report the firmware (and hopefully provide an easier way to update it).  I know of no way to find out the current firmware until they update the app.
> 
> I see the Hiby R6 uses Bluetooth 4.0 with aptx (not HD or LL).  So, it should work fine.  Perhaps updating the BTR3 firmware  or making sure the Hiby R6 is also up do date. will help.  No other ideas.


Thanks I just updated the BTR3 to the new firmware. My R6 is up to date but still no dice. It will show connected, plays around 20 seconds than no sound though the song is still playing on the player.

I got the BTR3 primarily to use with my S8 so that connects and plays without issue but still cannot force it to optimize to LDAC it always goes to adaptive connection. At least I can live with it.

The R6 I use mainly wired or as a transport to my home system but still it irks that there is such an issue with the Bluetooth.

I hope there are more suggestions or methods to cure this issue

Thanks.


----------



## MayorSimpleton

Just want to say that I got mine today and I am delighted with it.  I’ve tried a number of others including the BTR1 and the Bluewave Get - and for me this one nails it.

Decoupled volume - check
Gain spot on so no hiss with my sensitive SE535, even at very low levels - check
Buttons have correct amount of resistance and ‘clickability’ - check
Buttons rather than wheel for volume so no acidental volume changes - check
Nice form factor and good build quality - check
Sounds great - check

Haven’t been so roundly pleased with a product for ages - so kudos Fiio


----------



## PopZeus

Hopefully someone can answer this question for me... Does the BTR3 output digital audio from USB-C? I would like to use it as a BT receiver but I want to use a better DAC. And I might occasionally use it for other purposes...


----------



## surja

PopZeus said:


> Hopefully someone can answer this question for me... Does the BTR3 output digital audio from USB-C? I would like to use it as a BT receiver but I want to use a better DAC. And I might occasionally use it for other purposes...


I'd like to know too.... want to use it as BT receiver to connect to my Mojo....


----------



## rkw (Oct 5, 2018)

PopZeus said:


> Does the BTR3 output digital audio from USB-C?


The answer is no.

Take a look at the Shanling M0. It has bi-directional USB but you have to verify which sources it can use for USB output.


----------



## Saltjo

@FiiO 
Do you also plan to sell the btr3 via Amazon Germany?


----------



## PopZeus

rkw said:


> The answer is no.
> 
> Take a look at the Shanling M0. It has bi-directional USB but you have to verify which sources it can use for USB output.



Thanks, I had a feeling it wasn't gonna work out. Usually they promote these features on product pages and I didn't immediately read anything about it so... I'm looking at the M5s as a proper DAP upgrade. The M0 is undoubtedly cool for the price, but it's not the best fit for a stationary set-up. Then again, neither is the BTR3. Still, it's an impressive bit of engineering.

Side note: There are so many no name BT receivers out there on the market, and all of them do the same basic thing. How hard would it be to add LDAC, and an optical out (and maybe NFC pairing) to one and not have it suck?


----------



## rkw

PopZeus said:


> Side note: There are so many no name BT receivers out there on the market, and all of them do the same basic thing. How hard would it be to add LDAC, and an optical out (and maybe NFC pairing) to one and not have it suck?


I don't see any with LDAC, but there are many with aptX HD. This one even has NFC: https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Receiver-Adapter-Headphone/dp/B07D1JJBJR/. For a stationary setup you can also consider WiFi instead of Bluetooth. I've been happy with Chromecast Audio, which has some advantages over Bluetooth.


----------



## crabdog

Here are my thoughts on the BTR3. Enjoy 
https://primeaudio.org/fiio-btr3-review/


----------



## FiiO

Saltjo said:


> @FiiO
> Do you also plan to sell the btr3 via Amazon Germany?


Dear friend,

You could find it from the shop of our Germany distributor: https://fiio-shop.de/kopfhoererverstaerker/490/fiio-btr3

Best regards


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 10, 2018)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You could find it from the shop of our Germany distributor: https://fiio-shop.de/kopfhoererverstaerker/490/fiio-btr3
> 
> Best regards


Can I ask for when will some stocks come to Indonesian market? I've asked local Jaben Dealer and he said there's still no legal stock coming here..  Even tho I'm so interested with the device too...


----------



## munbeo

I just got my BTR3 but I fail to found the app to manually tuned it can anyone help me?


----------



## harpo1

munbeo said:


> I just got my BTR3 but I fail to found the app to manually tuned it can anyone help me?


It's FiiO Music app but the feature isn't implemented yet.


----------



## munbeo

harpo1 said:


> It's FiiO Music app but the feature isn't implemented yet.


Any idea when it's gonna be?


----------



## harpo1

munbeo said:


> Any idea when it's gonna be?


With FiiO who knows.


----------



## Trapok

Saltjo said:


> @FiiO
> Do you also plan to sell the btr3 via Amazon Germany?


https://www.amazon.de/FiiO-BTR3-réc...1?ie=UTF8&qid=1539183738&sr=8-1&keywords=btr3


----------



## mab1376

Does this support line-out or is it explicitly amped?


----------



## Indiemaker

LDAC means I can connect this to Sony A25 Walkman wirelessly for better sound instead of using Bluetooth wireless option?


----------



## Indiemaker

FiiO said:


> Thanks for your kind attention! The worldwide delivery probably start tomorrow, so you may check with local sales agent around Aug. 20th: https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/46664.html




Hi James,

You wonderful people make such wonderful accessories but why always ignore adding a little FM radio chip? There are millions of users who tune into local FMs still. Only your M7 offers this option. *Could've been great, if you had added FM fuctionality to BTR3 the way some early Sonly BT stereo receivers did.*

Great work, though. A big fan.

-Indiemaker


----------



## Taleru

mab1376 said:


> Does this support line-out or is it explicitly amped?


Same question, looks really really enticing & I never had any issues with fiio products.


----------



## Ggroch

Indiemaker said:


> LDAC means I can connect this to Sony A25 Walkman wirelessly for better sound instead of using Bluetooth wireless option?


The Fiio BTR3 is a Bluetooth 4.2 LDAC compatible receiver.  Your A25 built in transmitter is Bluetooth 3.0 with LDAC output.   So yes....you will get superior LDAC Bluetooth sound when using Bluetooth.  In the A25 Bluetooth Quality Settings choose "Prioritize Sound Quality"....your BTR 3 should show a Green readout to confirm LDAC hookup.

RE: Does this work as a Line Out or is it Explicitly Amplified:...... It works perfectly as a line out...but there is no explicit separate jack or separate menu settings for that.  Note that ALL LIne outs are amplified (normally to between 1 and 2 volts).  

 The BTR3 has fully compatible amplification both in output level and ohm rating (usually 16 ohms for line level) ...but the actual voltage output will depend on both the volume level set by the transmitter and the volume level set on the BTR3 (which are separate/independent).   The BTR3 remembers its last volume setting when you turn it on...SO...if you max your Bluetooth sources volume..and then set the BTR3 for the correct compatible setting by ear...it should remain right whenever you use it.


----------



## Rackhour (Oct 11, 2018)

Does the BTR3 support multi-pairing with a phone? It’d be cool if I’m listening to music on one device and if I get a call, the phone takes priority.

Edit to add: if there is multi-pairing support in that scenario (DAP for music, phone for calls), and I accept or reject the incoming call, does the BTR3 automatically revert to the DAP?


----------



## alphak

Rackhour said:


> Does the BTR3 support multi-pairing with a phone? It’d be cool if I’m listening to music on one device and if I get a call, the phone takes priority.
> 
> Edit to add: if there is multi-pairing support in that scenario (DAP for music, phone for calls), and I accept or reject the incoming call, does the BTR3 automatically revert to the DAP?



I haven't tried with calls, but had both my android devices connect to the BTR3 at the same time, podcast listening from one and notifications playing from the other phone, both at the same time, so i'd wager calls would work as well.


----------



## doowap

Will the BTR3 perform well used as a source for my car? Would I just turn the volume all the way up to get best performance in that scenario? Also, anyone know if it outputs at least 1vrms cleanly? Trying to decide if it would work for me. Thx


----------



## 422561

When used as a USB DAC on a Windows PC, can the microphone also be used for the PC?


----------



## xnordic (Oct 14, 2018)

After updating to newest firmware (0912) my btr3 sometimes skips and stops playing for 5 sec around once every minute. This is with the phone (OG Pixel XL) on top of each other. With the phone connected with USB it skips maybe every 10 seconds. Seems fine connected with PC. Had no problems with original firmware.

edit. This was yesterday right after updating. Listening now I do not experience any problems, might have been an isolated issue..


Anyway this device is just awesome. Just found out you can connect two devices at once, so now I have my pc and phone connected. If I play sound from my pc it will automatically switch to that device, and if I stop playing from the pc and start from my phone it will switch back. 

For those that do not know, LDAC for Linux: https://github.com/EHfive/pulseaudio-modules-bt


----------



## FiiO

ReddFour said:


> When used as a USB DAC on a Windows PC, can the microphone also be used for the PC?


Dear friend,

Currently, when the BTR3 is used as a USB DAC on the Windows PC, the microphone of the BTR3 can not be used.

Best regards


----------



## Sp12er3

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Currently, when the BTR3 is used as a USB DAC on the Windows PC, the microphone of the BTR3 can not be used.
> 
> Best regards


"currently"? Does that mean it might be possible to be implemented in the future? Or will the device need to have a driver installation (so it won't be plug and play like it is now) for that to be available?


----------



## redrich2000

Anyone using one of these clipped to full size headphones? Would it work like that?


----------



## Brooko

redrich2000 said:


> Anyone using one of these clipped to full size headphones? Would it work like that?


Yes it would - but you’d want to make sure they were easy to drive.


----------



## redrich2000

Brooko said:


> Yes it would - but you’d want to make sure they were easy to drive.



Susvaras be okay?

Seriously though, I can’t imagine being in a situation where I wanted to listen to big full size cans and wasn’t able to at least use a portable amp. This would be for B&O H6s.


----------



## Brooko

redrich2000 said:


> Susvaras be okay?
> 
> Seriously though, I can’t imagine being in a situation where I wanted to listen to big full size cans and wasn’t able to at least use a portable amp. This would be for B&O H6s.



Unfortunately I can't find specs anywhere (including manufacturers website) for impedance or sensitivity.  But you'd have to assume that they will be low impedance (323 ohm?) high-ish sensitivity because they are targeted for portable use - so the BTR3 should be fine with them.


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 18, 2018)

redrich2000 said:


> Susvaras be okay?
> 
> Seriously though, I can’t imagine being in a situation where I wanted to listen to big full size cans and wasn’t able to at least use a portable amp. This would be for B&O H6s.


I used it for my Denon and Sony and it drive them ok... but both of those are very easily driven fullsize, (and I love them for that). I'd try using it with my K702 later tonight and report back.

So far (it came just yesterday), it fulfills my need mighty well, it connects to my phone, and chime in the ringtone when something on that comes up, while still connected and functioning as a DAC for my laptop, I didn't know the dual pairing would work in tandem with the USB, nice.

edit: id recommend a short and slim audio jack extension tho as the HO is sitting quite close to the USB port, might be too tight for some chunky jacks. I recommend Fiio to make them come out of different sides of the device (like other tiny DAC/AMP ie Dragonfly) so it wont be a problem in next iteration. Also, if you give the device glass front, give us free, perfectly sized screen protector please...

also I'd love it if they give us, or at least sell rubber/ leather case for this little gem. as a clip on, itd get banged against things quite a lot.


----------



## Sp12er3

BTW, I've been using this with my Android  One Xiaomi A1 (on 8.1 Oreo) , but I haven't been able to make LDAC connection going. Pressing the cogs on the Bluetooth setting screen only show HD audio:AAC going.. Do I need to use different app? (using Foobar2k android) or set a lossless music to play and not MP3 crap?


----------



## SpiderNhan

Sp12er3 said:


> BTW, I've been using this with my Android  One Xiaomi A1 (on 8.1 Oreo) , but I haven't been able to make LDAC connection going. Pressing the cogs on the Bluetooth setting screen only show HD audio:AAC going.. Do I need to use different app? (using Foobar2k android) or set a lossless music to play and not MP3 crap?


Have you looked in developers settings to see if you can change it? I have a OnePlus 5T and I can toggle between all the different codecs. It even works while audio is playing.


----------



## jeffri

My friend have Xiaomi A2 and LDAC support is not working yet I believe. I guess you have to wait for updates as I read that Xiaomi planned to support LDAC in the future.


----------



## Ggroch (Oct 18, 2018)

Sp12er3 said:


> BTW, I've been using this with my Android  One Xiaomi A1 (on 8.1 Oreo) , but I haven't been able to make LDAC connection going....



Google search for Android One Xiaomi A1 shows owners have lost LDAC with the 8.1 update.  So...sounds like a phone issue not an app issue.  The threads say LDAC worked in 8.0 and was lost in 8.1.

You sure got a lot of help fast


----------



## Sp12er3

Thanks for the heads up, damn that's annoying. We'll for now I guess AAC it is for me. I do plan to change out of the Xiaomi because of a couple small niggles it have, not something I can do in near future, so I'd manage for now. 

Still damn annoying tho. It's weird intentionally deleting features..


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 18, 2018)

I have a problem with FiiO BTR3, because it not power off after few minutes when I power off my Bluetooth device.
Only power off fine when I disconnect Bluetooth connection manually.

For example my other Bluetooth device headphones power off no matter if they was disconnected manually or not, always power off when it's no sound after 5 minutes.

In FAQ they say
https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/92195.html


> When it's connected to other devices, it will enter standby mode if no music playing. When it's not connected, it will power off automatically after 2 minutes.


What it mean standby mode ? after what time, and for how long it will be stay in that mode ? forever ? never will power off itself ?

Total bad idea, it only drain battery for nothing, should always power off after few minutes if no sound.

Do you have any solution ?


----------



## aozukina

I personally don't see this as an issue. Say if I walk away from the headphone+btr3 which is current connected for a few mins or just stopped playing music for a few mins then it automatically turned off and I need to push the power button to start it again. That actually sounds like extra work for me. But if it is in standby mode (my guess is very low power consumption just to keep the channel open) I can always just pick up where I left off without the need to turn it on again every time. Said that I think it all matter how long BTR3 could really last in the stand by mode. I have find any data point regarding it especially Fiio claimed to fix the power consumption issue in standby mode right after the latest firmware update. Would love get an answer from the official if possible. @FiiO


----------



## jeffri

PeterMac said:


> I have a problem with FiiO BTR3, because it not power off after few minutes when I power off my Bluetooth device.
> Only power off fine when I disconnect Bluetooth connection manually.
> 
> For example my other Bluetooth device headphones power off no matter if they was disconnected manually or not, always power off when it's no sound after 5 minutes.
> ...



Most Bluetooth receiver will go into standby mode, instead of turning off. This is intentional, so you can receive call with it. Out of my collection, only Bluewave GET will auto turn-off after a while and that is, to be honest, annoying. It means I can't receive call with it, and the hassle to turning it back on each time I want to listen to something. 

Standby mode should be very efficient, which I don't think will affect playtime at all. BTR3 have no rating for standby mode when I look for it, but take the competitor, the AK XB10. It is rated for 5 hours playtime, but a whooping 300 hours standby time. So it's not like it will consume 10% of the battery even if you left it on standby for a whole 24 hours.


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 18, 2018)

I prefer auto power off after few minutes if there is nothing playing, best option to save maximum battery life. I have for example Bluetooth headphones Sennheiser HD 4.40 BT and Panasonic RP-HF400 and both nice power off after 5 minutes.
So for me it's weird now with this FiiO, I have to manually power off it everytime by button, or disconnect Bluetooth connection, for me it's not comfortable at all.

Would be great if FiiO release two sepearte firmwares one with auto power off without this stand-by mode, and second firmware as it is now. Please FiiO consider this. Thank you.




Brooko said:


> Yes it would - but you’d want to make sure they were easy to drive.


I tried it with HD600 which are 300ohms and there is no any problem to drive them at very loud volume level.

But the question is, does this high 300 ohms headphones will consume faster battery ? or it's not good for FiiO hardware ?


----------



## redrich2000 (Oct 18, 2018)

I'm not worried at all about the power, my concern is size, will it be too big to clip to headphones? The specs say its 104 x 58mm, but it looks smaller than that?


----------



## ezekiel77

redrich2000 said:


> I'm not worried at all about the power, my concern is size, will it be too big to clip to headphones? The specs say its 104 x 58mm, but it looks smaller than that?


It's the size of a thumb. I don't have it with me now, but here's a visual aid.


----------



## rkw

redrich2000 said:


> The specs say its 104 x 58mm, but it looks smaller than that?


That's called wishful thinking.


----------



## Sp12er3

^hahahah
Well what u wish is Fiio giving us option to detach the clip so it can be smaller when I don't plan on clipping it anywhere


----------



## redrich2000

rkw said:


> That's called wishful thinking.



Aha, no wonder. I misread the specs as 10.4cm long and 5.8cm wide. It's 5.8 long 1.04 thick and 2.5 wide.
Fit's perfectly on the H6 headband.


----------



## Ggroch

I have not complaints about the clip and think Fiio made the right decisions on this.  I own other small BT adapters and some (like the ES100) lack the spring tension to make them secure, and others with removable clips are by necessity a bit bulkier and less ridged.  Plus I am not organized enough to want one more detachable piece to lose.   Its a great design and plenty small enough.


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 20, 2018)

Someone know how to easy open this BTR3 if battery will died in future  and what battery exactly it use ?

I tested Bluetooth range of this BTR3, and I have to say it's not great.
In my kitchen, bathroom not even play, compare to my Panasonic RP-HF400 which play fine there, also even in next room it's start to cut music.
Little dissapointed with range of this device, I heard that BTR1 is even worse.
I wanted use it with Sennheiser HD599 at home and listen music wirelessly in my home and replace my Panasonic RP-HF400 headphones.

@FiiO - please release alternative firmware with auto power off if nothing playing for let's say 5 minutes, without this stand-by mode. PLEASE

Also where I can buy additional battery replacment for it ?


----------



## ezekiel77

Hi guys, here's my review of the BTR3. 

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/fiio-btr3.23354/reviews#review-21052


----------



## Sp12er3

BTW is updating the firmware worth it? What's to be gained from it, and is there a risk while doing it?


----------



## ezekiel77 (Oct 22, 2018)

Sp12er3 said:


> BTW is updating the firmware worth it? What's to be gained from it, and is there a risk while doing it?


The added features are mentioned here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/get-your-fiio-btr3-upgraded-to-the-latest-firmware-v0912.889251/, although all units from October 12 onwards won't need to perform this update since they'll be preloaded.

As for the risk, I took 3 attempts before success. If it didn't work as the instructions said I unplugged the BTR3 and started over again.


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 22, 2018)

Mine do automatically change to DAC function without me pressing the power button, does that mean it already got the new firmware? I have no idea how to check which version I'm having, I did buy them after 12 Oct, but it may be from an older stock.

Also, how do I change the source mode to not automatic? Sometimes they changed mode way too often, (by app notification, the keyboard sound effect of my iPhone, override and change the source) way too fussy.

I wish they make both the automatic and manual active at the same time.


----------



## amrbadrawy

I wonder how the F9 pro will sound when combined with the BTR3, I know that the F9 is a bit harsh in the high range (Some complained about fatigue too), does the BTR3 tam this harshness down and add more emphasis on the bass?


----------



## Ggroch

amrbadrawy said:


> I wonder how the F9 pro will sound when combined with the BTR3,..... does the BTR3 tam this harshness down and add more emphasis on the bass?



I certainly hope not. 

The BTR3 is designed to pass through flat accurate sound and not to add or subtract any emphasis.  I have not noticed any significant tonal change on mine.    The ability to modify the sound would be a nice optional addition.  The ES100 lets you control equalization as well as choose between different digital filters in their app.    It would be nice if when implemented the Fiio Music App would have that capability...but it would not be nice if it imposes inaccurate tonal adjustments without your input.


----------



## Saltjo

Hi.
I need some help: Since I used the BTR3 with my Sony Xperia x compact over bluetooth I cannot use the mobile with a headphone cord any more - regardless of bluetooth activated or not. There is no output. BTR3 and loudspeaker work fine. I already tried a restart of btr3 and xperia without success. Is there a setting where I can activate it again? Can anyone help me, please?
Thanks in advance!


----------



## redrich2000 (Oct 22, 2018)

I've just updated the firmware. Others should note, the device did not appear under the USB list in Device Manager as suggested in the instructions, it appeared as a connected device in DFU mode in Control Panel though and the update tool worked.


----------



## hotdog108

I've noticed my BTR3 getting progressively louder recently after the firmware upgrade. Not in a bad way, just wasn't expecting this behavior. Prior to the upgrade, I keep the BTR3 at max volume and lower my iPhone volume to 2 clicks, the volume was low enough that I can wear my CIEM in one ear in the office and still be able to carry a normal conversation. Now the same volume setting almost matches the iPhone volume at 4 clicks prior to the upgrade, so I have to lower it to 1 click on the iPhone. Not sure if anyone else is experiencing the same thing. Again, not a bad thing per-se, just curious behavior that I've noticed.


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 23, 2018)

How to open this BTR3 if battery will died in future to not break a glass  and what battery exactly it use ?


----------



## Darkestred

hotdog108 said:


> I've noticed my BTR3 getting progressively louder recently after the firmware upgrade. Not in a bad way, just wasn't expecting this behavior. Prior to the upgrade, I keep the BTR3 at max volume and lower my iPhone volume to 2 clicks, the volume was low enough that I can wear my CIEM in one ear in the office and still be able to carry a normal conversation. Now the same volume setting almost matches the iPhone volume at 4 clicks prior to the upgrade, so I have to lower it to 1 click on the iPhone. Not sure if anyone else is experiencing the same thing. Again, not a bad thing per-se, just curious behavior that I've noticed.



I havent experienced the loudness issue perse.  What i have experienced is once or twice i have paused and unpaused or received a phone call and when going back to the music it was noticeably lower.  Either the master volume got lowered on the phone or...because when i pressed volume up once on my phone it was LOUD.


----------



## Sp12er3

How to check which firmware version my BTR3 is currently in?


----------



## Ggroch

Sp12er3 said:


> How to check which firmware version my BTR3 is currently in?[/QUOT+



No way I know of.  Hopefully when BTR3 control is added to the Fiio Music app it will show current firmware and provide an easier way to upgrade.


----------



## FiiO

Sp12er3 said:


> "currently"? Does that mean it might be possible to be implemented in the future? Or will the device need to have a driver installation (so it won't be plug and play like it is now) for that to be available?


Dear friend,

We will try to check whether this function can work via firmware update in the future.

Best regards


----------



## Sp12er3

P


FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We will try to check whether this function can work via firmware update in the future.
> 
> Best regards


Please, we're waiting for an easier, much more stress free than the current steps too.
Fiio music integration would be very nice.


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 24, 2018)

Tried using the Fiio Music app the first time, it surprised me when the led changed to green when playing music using the app, I checked and it seems to be LHDC, activated because I opted the HWA option on it seems.

My question is:

1) what's the difference between it and LDAC? Which is better? I saw some pages explaining things, it says LHDC has 900kbit throughput, how come is that activable only by using an app?

2) how come I can no longer control the music playback using the BTR3 anymore? Only volume is controllable when LHDC is on.

3) different one, but still from the app, how to change the source option from automatic to manual? I downloaded the PDF ver of BTR3 Quick start guide and it said I can change it via "the app" ... Where?

4) using USB DAC function from phone->type c to a adapter->BTR3 is so quiet.. Way quieter than Bluetooth pathway. Why's that? Can I somehow mend this? It's barely driving my K702 Right now. Tried on both Spotify and Fiio music app, so quiet.


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 24, 2018)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We will try to check whether this function can work via firmware update in the future.
> 
> Best regards


Would be great if you add battery level also if possible.

------
Nobody think about possiblility with replace battery in future ?


----------



## Willo13B

sup peeps nice to see the BTR3 out and about. Question:

My mobile rig rn is my iPhone SE as source, BTR1 + dt770i. Mostly Spotify on max quality. Sounds pretty legit.

Would it be worthwhile to upgrade to the BTR3 for that AAC support? Not really needing more power.

Could it also replace my E17K as my desktop dac-amp?


----------



## hotdog108

Willo13B said:


> sup peeps nice to see the BTR3 out and about. Question:
> 
> My mobile rig rn is my iPhone SE as source, BTR1 + dt770i. Mostly Spotify on max quality. Sounds pretty legit.
> 
> ...


You'll get better range, better battery life, more stable connections at the very least. Those alone are reasons enough to upgrade. I come from the BTR1 as well, so this is first hand experience.


----------



## Ultrainferno

Nathan aka @shigzeo takes a close look at the BTR3 on today's article. He says it nails the basics: signal quality, noise floor, loaded and unloaded signal quality, and now APTx/LDAC support. He finds it to have great battery life and build quality but the Bluetooth signal catching quality... he's not a big fan of that.
https://www.headfonia.com/review-fiio-btr3/


----------



## FiiO

Sp12er3 said:


> Tried using the Fiio Music app the first time, it surprised me when the led changed to green when playing music using the app, I checked and it seems to be LHDC, activated because I opted the HWA option on it seems.
> 
> My question is:
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

The volume of the BTR3 and your mobile phone is only controlable when LHDC is on?
The manual and automatic switch will be added in later update for the BTR3 firmware and FiiO Music APP.

Best regards


----------



## shigzeo

SubMash said:


> Again, you not even reading my answer. It has nothing to do with balanced or not. SE846 doesn't need more voltage. It needs current. And a lot of it. Even ES100 is below specs. BTR3 is twice lower maximum current ability. Because it has only ONE amp.
> 
> P.S. Just if you don't know - ES100 works in dual mono and in tandem mode. So balanced or unbalanced - it can use both amps at the same time.
> 
> P.P.S. And anything high impedance needs voltage which single amp also can't provide.



The BTR3 is perfect for the SE846, current being the main issue or not. It also hisses next to not at all, less in fact than any high-end portable DAP unit I've tested in the last year.


----------



## psikey (Oct 25, 2018)

Having read concern raised by *SubMash*  when using with low sensitivity IEM's I still decided to give it a go after having tried an ES100 at about £89 but not being happy with controls/materials or design (but did sound great with my SE846's & HD660S  over LDAC).

The BTR3 came today for ~ £49.50 (£55 on Amazon) and basically the build quality is everything the ES100 isn't, super easy to operate with phone or as a DAC to PC, and initial impression is it sounds as good as the ES100 via 3.5mm jack. Only tried with my SE846's but will try with my HD660S tonight. No background noise I can detect with the SE846's either. The V30+ wired using QUAD DAC does still sound a bit better but can't say there is a lot in it when listening to Spotify or Tidal MQA tracks. Looks like it will be great as an alternative to using my V30 wired or better than most other phones audio.

Nice upgrade to my old HS3000 AptX BT adapter (which still actually works with around 4hrs of battery after around 5 or 6 years.

Unless you need balanced, app tweaking and longer battery life I'd go for the ~£55 BTR3 over the ~£90 ES100, especially if design/materials/looks are important to you. Oh, or need to drive more demanding headphones.

I tried the other lower BT modes including SBC, AAC, aptX but AptxHD and especially LDAC set to Optimised 990kbps sound noticeably better.


----------



## jeffri

To be honest, the BTR3 does sound better than ES100 to me. I feel the ES100 sounds a bit too unnatural, timbre feels off, like the sound is over-processed to make it appear clean. BTR3 is better in this regard, with noise level as good as the ES100 while sounding more natural.


----------



## Sp12er3

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The volume of the BTR3 and your mobile phone is only controlable when LHDC is on?
> The manual and automatic switch will be added in later update for the BTR3 firmware and FiiO Music APP.
> ...


Yeah using HWA LHDC on, volume is only controllable from the BTR3, and the app did warn about that happening, 

I'm just wondering whether it'd be permanently that way or will Fiio add the volume control + track playback control function when LHDC is on, later in the future.


----------



## psikey

psikey said:


> Having read concern raised by *SubMash*  when using with low sensitivity IEM's I still decided to give it a go after having tried an ES100 at about £89 but not being happy with controls/materials or design (but did sound great with my SE846's & HD660S  over LDAC).
> 
> The BTR3 came today for ~ £49.50 (£55 on Amazon) and basically the build quality is everything the ES100 isn't, super easy to operate with phone or as a DAC to PC, and initial impression is it sounds as good as the ES100 via 3.5mm jack. Only tried with my SE846's but will try with my HD660S tonight. No background noise I can detect with the SE846's either. The V30+ wired using QUAD DAC does still sound a bit better but can't say there is a lot in it when listening to Spotify or Tidal MQA tracks. Looks like it will be great as an alternative to using my V30 wired or better than most other phones audio.
> 
> ...



Adding to above, now just tried it with my 150 Ohm HD660S and it fed them nicely too, but have to have volume at nearly max if I want to listen loud. Normal listening for me with the HD660S would be 2-3 steps under max. I'd think it would struggle with anything much more demanding. Saying that, I have no need to listen to my headphones over Bluetooth from my phone and would always use them wired at home. The BTR3 is for use with my SE846 (used 90% of the time) if I need to be wire free from the phone or my old Klipsch X10i (exercise/bike commute earphones).


----------



## Sp12er3

Ultrainferno said:


> Nathan aka @shigzeo takes a close look at the BTR3 on today's article. He says it nails the basics: signal quality, noise floor, loaded and unloaded signal quality, and now APTx/LDAC support. He finds it to have great battery life and build quality but the Bluetooth signal catching quality... he's not a big fan of that.
> https://www.headfonia.com/review-fiio-btr3/


Read that, I think he has a case of faulty device, I have no experience of such bad connections like what he's describing in the article at all. Also at least 2 other commenter there also stated the same as me.

I think he should ask for a different device or buy one off the self somewhere just to check whether the connection issues persist.


----------



## psikey

He must have a faulty one. Mines not dropped signal once to my LG V30.


----------



## hotdog108

Sp12er3 said:


> Read that, I think he has a case of faulty device, I have no experience of such bad connections like what he's describing in the article at all. Also at least 2 other commenter there also stated the same as me.
> 
> I think he should ask for a different device or buy one off the self somewhere just to check whether the connection issues persist.


I'm the commenter above your comment, I agree he must have a faulty unit. Mine didn't have those issues even before the firmware upgrade.


----------



## Darkestred

jeffri said:


> To be honest, the BTR3 does sound better than ES100 to me. I feel the ES100 sounds a bit too unnatural, timbre feels off, like the sound is over-processed to make it appear clean. BTR3 is better in this regard, with noise level as good as the ES100 while sounding more natural.



I have to agree.  I thought the ES100 did a better job with bass but now i am not too sure.  I will go back to testing both units but the BTR3 has been my daily driver and trying out the ES100 last night felt like the ES100 was missing something.

I don't think i have a faulty unit but i have seen some issues with bluetooth.  Sometimes i can cup the device and it cuts out, others not.  More times than not this happens.  Which may not seem like a big deal but a hand on the waiste or however my body brushes against another body part etc will cause a slight hiccup from time-to-time.


----------



## shigzeo

I've read all your comments and have tested and re-tested the BTR3. Again: 60 metres of line-of-sight, and it connects up to 10 metres. But when I use a power tool or chisels or grip tools for work and hobby (furniture making), it cuts out. I'm also comparing it directly to the uBTR and AirPods, which are now my benchmarks, and next to those two, BTR3 is a good step down.


----------



## jeffri

Did you test the range of different codecs? I.e aptx vs ldac? The less bandwidth of aptx might help with the range.


----------



## MayorSimpleton

I have to say, I have 4 of these things now - including the BTR1 and the bluetooth on the BTR3 is the most stable yet. It definately handles the rush hour commuter train better than the BTR1 did.


----------



## psikey

shigzeo said:


> I've read all your comments and have tested and re-tested the BTR3. Again: 60 metres of line-of-sight, and it connects up to 10 metres. But when I use a power tool or chisels or grip tools for work and hobby (furniture making), it cuts out. I'm also comparing it directly to the uBTR and AirPods, which are now my benchmarks, and next to those two, BTR3 is a good step down.



Your not taking into account the BTR3 you tested is likely faulty considering no one else seems to be having this problem. Internal BT antenna may have come loose (assuming there is a wire with micro mmcx type connector onto the circuit board).


----------



## redrich2000

I feel like the volume dropped off with the firmware update, is that possible?
I need it maxed with the phone also maxed to get good volume. If it is possible to tweak the gain that would be good.


----------



## Sad Panda

Hi Folks,

Is there a option to remove the battery so I can leave this in the car? Any specs on operating temperatures?


----------



## shigzeo

jeffri said:


> Did you test the range of different codecs? I.e aptx vs ldac? The less bandwidth of aptx might help with the range.


I didn't find any meaningful differences in range, SBC, APTX, or LDAC. All extremely good line of site and mediocre to normal otherwise, but when touching skin or squatting whilst working or holding hand and power tools in the hand constant cuts.


----------



## jeffri

shigzeo said:


> I didn't find any meaningful differences in range, SBC, APTX, or LDAC. All extremely good line of site and mediocre to normal otherwise, but when touching skin or squatting whilst working or holding hand and power tools in the hand constant cuts.



Oh, cool, thanks


----------



## 24thchromosome

Anyone here using the Xiaomi Mi Max 3 phone running the latest MIUI 10 global ROM and able to get LDAC working when paired with BTR3?


----------



## Sp12er3

^have you tried configuring the Bluetooth and pressing the cogs?
If still no option to check LDAC on even there, we may be just out of luck. (also Xiaomi user)


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 27, 2018)

Zeos of ZReview just did a Bluetooth receiver shootout of which the BTR3 (and uBTR) are in. Scroll to 26:45 for it, but watch the whole video (long, I know) if you're considering cutting the cord. It's a practical usage review, (not sound) so Z is good for that.
TLDW (Conclusion): 38:13




FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We will try to check whether this function can work via firmware update in the future.
> 
> Best regards


Also Fiio, please change the volume up/down long press to next/prev track please. The way it is now is damn annoying. Who the heck think reversing that is a good choice? The Q5 doesn't do that, right?


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 29, 2018)

Exactly minus button skip to next song  total wrong.
---

Anyone open yet BTR3 to see their components, battery etc. ?




psikey said:


> Adding to above, now just tried it with my 150 Ohm HD660S and it fed them nicely too, but have to have volume at nearly max if I want to listen loud. Normal listening for me with the HD660S would be 2-3 steps under max. I'd think it would struggle with anything much more demanding. Saying that, I have no need to listen to my headphones over Bluetooth from my phone and would always use them wired at home. The BTR3 is for use with my SE846 (used 90% of the time) if I need to be wire free from the phone or my old Klipsch X10i (exercise/bike commute earphones).


It drive my HD600 which are 300ohm easly, volume are very very high, I even not max out because It's too loud.
With HD 660S should be piece of cake.
You have to set volume up also on source player to have higher volumes.


----------



## Brooko

PeterMac said:


> It drive my HD600 which are 300ohm easly, volume are very very high, I even not max out because It's too loud.



Just want to comment on this one.  I have the HD600.  It may drive it loud - but it doesn't drive it well.  It wasn't designed to.  The BTR3 cannot produce enough voltage, and the HD600 needs voltage.  The BTR3 is designed for portable earphones / headphones - and IMO does extremely well.


----------



## FiiO

Sp12er3 said:


> Yeah using HWA LHDC on, volume is only controllable from the BTR3, and the app did warn about that happening,
> 
> I'm just wondering whether it'd be permanently that way or will Fiio add the volume control + track playback control function when LHDC is on, later in the future.


Dear friend,

We will report to the engineer for checking about that.
You could try to uninstall the FiiO Music APP and reset the BTR3 to check if it helps?

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Sp12er3 said:


> Also Fiio, please change the volume up/down long press to next/prev track please. The way it is now is damn annoying. Who the heck think reversing that is a good choice? The Q5 doesn't do that, right?


Dear friend,

We may not consider about that. It is also designed according to the feedback from most users.

Best regards


----------



## Sp12er3 (Oct 30, 2018)

Really? Can any other Fiio BTR owner here do a hands up on thinking that reversing the playback control is a good idea?


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 29, 2018)

Brooko said:


> Just want to comment on this one.  I have the HD600.  It may drive it loud - but it doesn't drive it well.  It wasn't designed to.  The BTR3 cannot produce enough voltage, and the HD600 needs voltage.  The BTR3 is designed for portable earphones / headphones - and IMO does extremely well.


You have right, but I tested it for few minutes with HD600 and they sounded very good to me and how loud they can be, I was impress how this tiny box can drive them, but I do not compare them side by side with my Xonar STX II.
I bought BTR3 to finally drive HD 599.


----------



## Sad Panda

Fire8Fly said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> Is there a option to remove the battery so I can leave this in the car? Any specs on operating temperatures?


Anyone know the answer? D:


----------



## MarkF786

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We may not consider about that. It is also designed according to the feedback from most users.
> 
> Best regards



The Headfonia review (https://www.headfonia.com/review-fiio-btr3/) pointed out the same flaw:

"Another problem – and one I neglected to mention in my BTR1/uBTR reviews – is the backward physical UI. The plus sign raises volume; contrariwise, a long press tracks to the previous song. The same is the case in reverse for the minus. Plus should never move backward and minus should never move forward. This also applies to the BTR1 and uBTR and will be appended to their reviews."

I don't understand the logic in reversing the controls.  Most people would logically associate Plus, Up, Forward and Minus, Down, Back.


----------



## Amber Rain

I believe it has something to do with the Chinese market; the top button (+) signifies moving up in a list of songs  etc (i.e. backwards) and  the minus button going "down" in a list.

As Fiio said, it ain't gonna change.. Unless user configurable button short can be added...


----------



## psikey

Sp12er3 said:


> Really? Can any other Fiio BTR owner here do a hands up on thinking that reversing the playback control is a good idea?



Don't Asian markets do things other way to Western countries ? I have no problem pressing down for next track, like skip down to next list item (easy to get used to).


----------



## PeterMac (Oct 31, 2018)

Minus button for next track  FiiO stop listen this "most" users, this is nonsense.
This is like reverse gear to be design to ride to forward, fix this please.
If you think this is correct so why volume is correct .



Fire8Fly said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> Is there a option to remove the battery so I can leave this in the car? Any specs on operating temperatures?


From manual:
"Please don't place the device in circumstance of
excessive high/low temperature (above 45℃ or
below 0℃)"

I also wish to know how to open it easly, but here nobody cares about change battery in future and where to buy it to have a replacment


----------



## Sad Panda

PeterMac said:


> Minus button for next track  FiiO stop listen this "most" users, this is nonsense.
> This is like reverse gear to be design to ride to forward, fix this please.
> If you think this is correct so why volume is correct .
> 
> ...


Thanks! Guess this isn't for me. 113F is pretty much a car left outside around mid 70s on a sunny day I think.


----------



## Dasm

hi! what is working time with aac?


----------



## waynes world

PeterMac said:


> This is like reverse gear to be design to ride to forward, fix this please.



That's like my wife's Prius which has the gear shifting on the console: Up=reverse, Down=drive forward. What? Hurts my brain every time.


----------



## redrich2000 (Nov 1, 2018)

Introducing the B&O H6 wireless. I’ve been using the Bowers and Wilkins PX as my commute headphones. I’ve never really been satisfied with the sound or comfort. When I got them, I did think about trying to convert the H6. I love the H6, it’s the best of many many closebacks I have tried. But the BT receivers didn’t entirely convince me back then.

A few weeks ago I saw the BTR3 introduced in the headfi video and thought it was time to have another go at this. It’s already a huge improvement on the PX. Currently just using an iPhone. Next delivery will be a Sony XZ1 compact, a mid-range android phone capable of both LDAC and APTX HD, which I will use as DAP. Looking forward to maxing our the potential of this rig.


----------



## FrankieZappa

redrich2000 said:


> Next delivery will be a Sony XZ1 compact, a cheap android phone capable of both LDAC and APTX HD, which I will use as DAP. Looking forward to maxing our the potential of this rig.



Maybe it’s cheap now but when it came out last year it was billed around 500 bucks,if not more..
I have the “normal” XZ1 and I’m frankly pleased with it,it’s a nice phone and used as a DAP can give some satisfactions..


----------



## redrich2000

FrankieZappa said:


> Maybe it’s cheap now but when it came out last year it was billed around 500 bucks,if not more..
> I have the “normal” XZ1 and I’m frankly pleased with it,it’s a nice phone and used as a DAP can give some satisfactions..



 That’s a fair point. Even now it’s mid-range cost wise. It does seem like a very good phone if you’re happy with the size and design. It’s perfect for what I want. I was looking at the FiiO M9 but I use BT when commuting so it’s a waste paying for a DAC and amp. This will give me a MUCH slicker OS.


----------



## FrankieZappa

Apart from the simple720p HD screen I think the XZ1c is a fantastic phone..aptxHd, LDAC,a long battery life and Sony audio tweaks integrated (ClearAudio and DSEE HX) makes it a very good and portable DAP in my opinion... and the possibility of using 3,5 mm jack nowadays is a bonus...


----------



## FiiO

Dasm said:


> hi! what is working time with aac?


Dear friend,

For reference: 





Best regards


----------



## Dasm

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> For reference:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the answer. It is a little sad that he has a battery, much more than ubTR but plays almost as much


----------



## Ggroch (Nov 2, 2018)

I see the Fiio Music app has just been updated to v 1.0.4 supporting the BTR3.   It apparently also requires a BTR3 firmware update to function.  Looking for that.  Just a heads up.

Update: not finding new firmware yet.  The music app crashes when I access the BTR3 section using the 0912 firmware.   App description says it requires firmware 1.00

It appears the necessary firmware is not yet posted.  Probably happen quite soon.


----------



## harpo1

Ggroch said:


> I see the Fiio Music app has just been updated to v 1.0.4 supporting the BTR3.   It apparently also requires a BTR3 firmware update to function.  Looking for that.  Just a heads up.
> 
> Update: not finding new firmware yet.  The music app crashes when I access the BTR3 section using the 0912 firmware.   App description says it requires firmware 1.00
> 
> It appears the necessary firmware is not yet posted.  Probably happen quite soon.


I'm not seeing the BTR3 section in the settings on v1.0.4.  Is this on android or ios?


----------



## Ggroch

harpo1 said:


> I'm not seeing the BTR3 section in the settings on v1.0.4.  Is this on android or ios?



Android.  The BTR3 has to be connected via Bluetooth for it to appear.  In the settings menu, scroll to the bottom.  When I click it the app crashes.


----------



## harpo1

Ggroch said:


> Android.  The BTR3 has to be connected via Bluetooth for it to appear.  In the settings menu, scroll to the bottom.  When I click it the app crashes.


LGV20 and it's paired to it but still not showing up in settings.  Typical FiiO when it comes to software.


----------



## harpo1

Oh and by the way here's a link for the new firmware.
https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg


----------



## Ggroch

harpo1 said:


> Oh and by the way here's a link for the new firmware.
> https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg


 Thanks,

I am still on the old firmware.  I have to start the app after the BTR3 is connected...so you might try a reboot.

I might wait a few days and let some of the braver of us try first.


----------



## Darkestred

harpo1 said:


> Oh and by the way here's a link for the new firmware.
> https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg



It's a shame their music app still blows.  Crashes left and right and forget even being able to access the BTR through the app - force closed.


----------



## harpo1

I updated the firmware and cleared the app data now I can see it.  Doesn't crash but the eq isn't available yet.


----------



## Ggroch

harpo1 said:


> I updated the firmware and cleared the app data now I can see it.  Doesn't crash but the eq isn't available yet.


What can you see/do in the app with the BTR3 now?


----------



## harpo1

Ggroch said:


> What can you see/do in the app with the BTR3 now?


You can turn the RGB lights off, select which codec you want available, you can see the status, adjust left/right balance, select four different lowpass filters and there's a guide for the BTR3.


----------



## harpo1

Oh and there's a Charge toggle Open/Close which I'm assuming is for when you use it as a USB DAC so it's not draining your phone.


----------



## SpiderNhan

But... you cannot long press volume keys to skip tracks


----------



## harpo1

SpiderNhan said:


> But... you cannot long press volume keys to skip tracks


I can.


----------



## SpiderNhan

harpo1 said:


> I can.


I cleared the app cache and data and now long pressing works.


----------



## cardeli22

Can anyone on here answer this question I have: Can the BTR3 receive the signal via Bluetooth and then push it out via usb (to another dac/portable dac)? Thanks in advance.


----------



## dazzerfong

Got this unit around a month ago. Also had a BTR1 before this which I wasn't 100% happy with.

Compared to the BTR1, the BTR3 has:

A much better noise floor. With the BTR1, there was a bit of a 'sizzle' with quieter volumes which I only got rid of with a IEMatch (which I very conveniently broke). With the BTR3, it's virtually black - the only time I can hear it is if I'm in the dead of night in my room with music barely playing. This is with a CA Polaris, which is rather sensitive to noise and hiss.
Better range. Even with LDAC, I never got dropouts on my body at all. With the BTR1, dropouts would occur occasionally.
(Subjectively) better controls. Even with the skip tracks reversed (please allow me to reverse it!), the buttons are now all on a single side, which I prefer.
Longer battery life. 3 hours isn't anything to scoff at.
Use as a DAC via USB. Cool neat feature, especially when I'm working on my laptop and I want it to be charged.
USB type C. Thank you! Now all my electronics are USB type C.

One minor thing about my unit: I never got NFC to work on both my and a demo unit. Tried it on 2 different phones which definitely have working NFCs. Anyone experiencing these problems?


----------



## PeterMac (Nov 3, 2018)

@FiiO - Does it secure to upgrade firmware on Windows 10 x64 build 1809  ?

Other question
On your website you say:


> _Note: please download and install the latest version FiiO Music app *v1.0.4 *firstly, if you want to know the version on your BTR3._



I paired with phone, open FiiO Music app 1.0.4 and where is information what version currently is on my BTR3 before upgrade ?, I do not see antyhing about BTR3 there.


----------



## rkw

cardeli22 said:


> Can the BTR3 receive the signal via Bluetooth and then push it out via usb (to another dac/portable dac)?


No.


----------



## Brooko

My review and thoughts on the BTR3

https://www.headphone-earphone.revi...luetooth-mobility-takes-another-leap-forward/


----------



## FiiO

*FiiO releases the new firmware v1.0 for BTR3 >>>*Click for more information

*BTR3 firmware v1.0:* click here
*
How to upgrade the BTR3: *click here

*Notes: *

1. The latest Android version *1.0.4 of FiiO Music app* is already available, and you could download it from Google Play Store directly or by this link: click here ; The iOS version FiiO Music app has been submitted to Apple company for review. You could download the new version FiiO Music app from App store once it has been approved. 

2. It will be displayed as version 1.0 on new FiiO Music app after upgrading the BTR3 to firmware v1.0(v1030).

3. It is highly suggested to upgrade BTR3 to firmware v1.0 first, if you want to make the BTR3 works with the lastest version FiiO Music app.


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> @FiiO - Does it secure to upgrade firmware on Windows 10 x64 build 1809  ?
> 
> Other question
> On your website you say:
> ...


Dear friend,

Have you update the firmware of the BTR3 to latest version as well? It will be displayed as *version 1.0* on new FiiO Music app((settings-FiiO BTR3) after upgrading the BTR3 to firmware v1.0(v1030) and connect to the mobile phone via Bluetooth.






Best regards


----------



## alphak

FiiO said:


> *FiiO releases the new firmware v1.0 for BTR3 >>>*Click for more information
> 
> *BTR3 firmware v1.0:* click here
> *
> How to upgrade the BTR3: *click here



Upgraded and works as advertised. Only request is if the Startup/shutdown sounds can also be turned off? Especially the startup sound its soooo loud, really wish i could use it without!

The light being turned off is awesome especially using it in the dark and seeing the light constantly blink is unnecessary, works great! Looking forward to the EQ features when it comes in a future update and also please consider startup sound toggle, thanks guys!


----------



## KKFA

Just updated BTR3 firmware and the music app. Works flawlessly so far. Good job Fiio. Looking forward to future upgrades.


----------



## Alberto01 (Nov 4, 2018)

¿How does the sound quality of the BTR3 on IEMs compare to the sound quality of IEMs plugged into the 3.5mm jack of the LG V30?


----------



## crabdog

KKFA said:


> Just updated BTR3 firmware and the music app. Works flawlessly so far. Good job Fiio. Looking forward to future upgrades.


Same here. Everything is working great. Looking forward to the next update too!


----------



## alphak

alphak said:


> Upgraded and works as advertised. Only request is if the Startup/shutdown sounds can also be turned off? Especially the startup sound its soooo loud, really wish i could use it without!
> 
> The light being turned off is awesome especially using it in the dark and seeing the light constantly blink is unnecessary, works great! Looking forward to the EQ features when it comes in a future update and also please consider startup sound toggle, thanks guys!


I Spoke a bit too soon. The settings that are changed within the FiiO app, they don't stick. So every time I connect to the device again, I have to go back into the BTR3 settings and change stuff again. @FiiO  Is it not possible to save the settings within the device and have them stay when connecting to different devices etc?


----------



## pinkuyt

Anyone having a problem with the new update? Right after updating the app and firmware i can access the menu Setting-> Fiio BTR3, but after a while (i switch back and forth between Spotify & fiio music app) the menu Setting -> Fiio BTR3 is disappeared from Fiio Music app.


----------



## emirikol

BTR3 looks amazing but is there any spec or release date for BTR5? I want to buy one but I don’t know if I should wait or not.
Thanks!


----------



## Huxley

Make the BTR5 with a bigger battery, more power and perhaps dual dac balanced output and I'm sold.


----------



## PeterMac

In new version please add battery level status also.


----------



## emirikol

Huxley said:


> Make the BTR5 with a bigger battery, more power and perhaps dual dac balanced output and I'm sold.


There are still no word about release or specs isn't it?


----------



## Huxley

emirikol said:


> There are still no word about release or specs isn't it?



Yeah, would be nice if they did bring out such a device.


----------



## Saltjo (Nov 5, 2018)

With the new App I can access BTR3 settings. But while the whole app runs in german, the BTR3 settings are only displayed in chinese letters. Is there a way to change this?

EDIT: Curiously the FIIO App showed up for update in the Play Store a second time (same version). Afterwards everything worked fine.


----------



## emirikol

Huxley said:


> Yeah, would be nice if they did bring out such a device.


Yes, I don't know if I should wait for btr5 or just buy btr3 because I see too word on specs, release date or price


----------



## jeffri

The BTR3 just released not too long ago... I doubt BTR5 will release anytime soon. I don't think it's a bad idea to get BTR3 when a refresh or successor is still a long way to go.

That said, Shanling have a new receiver coming up. It might be a good idea to hold off buying BTR3 to see what Shanling have to offer. As of now, the BTR3 remains one, if not the best, bluetooth receiver.


----------



## emirikol

jeffri said:


> The BTR3 just released not too long ago... I doubt BTR5 will release anytime soon. I don't think it's a bad idea to get BTR3 when a refresh or successor is still a long way to go.
> 
> That said, Shanling have a new receiver coming up. It might be a good idea to hold off buying BTR3 to see what Shanling have to offer. As of now, the BTR3 remains one, if not the best, bluetooth receiver.


I have supposed BTR5 would hit another target not the same that BTR3, but maybe just a next gen :/


----------



## jeffri

FiiO Bluetooth receiver lineup is already confusing as it is. Of course, I would be interested if they decided to make a higher-end version. But it's not something I see it happening anytime soon, especially as BTR3 just hit the market.


----------



## emirikol

jeffri said:


> FiiO Bluetooth receiver lineup is already confusing as it is. Of course, I would be interested if they decided to make a higher-end version. But it's not something I see it happening anytime soon, especially as BTR3 just hit the market.


Then I'll wait a bit for the Shanling device to make a decision.

PS: To be honest I know nothing about Shanling product line, I was just looking to buy a good portable bluetooth device in order for everyday and a pc amp(I almost bought the E10K or even Q1MKII but now Im waiting for the new k3 but I would take in consideration any other you would recommend me  )


----------



## Huxley

emirikol said:


> Yes, I don't know if I should wait for btr5 or just buy btr3 because I see too word on specs, release date or price



I went ahead and bought the btr3 as I've just bought the huawei mate 20 pro, so want to see what lhdc is like.

Besides as said it might be a while.


----------



## jeffri

emirikol said:


> Then I'll wait a bit for the Shanling device to make a decision.
> 
> PS: To be honest I know nothing about Shanling product line, I was just looking to buy a good portable bluetooth device in order for everyday and a pc amp(I almost bought the E10K or even Q1MKII but now Im waiting for the new k3 but I would take in consideration any other you would recommend me  )



I think BTR3 definitely suit your use. ES100 is also comparable functionality-wise, but I like the sound of BTR3 better. Bluewave Get is great if you are driving headphone, but less so with IEM due to the hiss it produces. Sound-wise, I think the Get is better than ES100, but you have to use the aptX HD codec.

I can recommend AT-PHA55BT, but the functionality is limited (no USB DAC support) and can only connect to 1 device at a time. AK XB10 sounds good too, but battery life is too short and also no USB DAC support.


----------



## emirikol

Huxley said:


> I went ahead and bought the btr3 as I've just bought the huawei mate 20 pro, so want to see what lhdc is like.
> 
> Besides as said it might be a while.


I'm not in a hurry but I want it asap  and as I stated I know nothing about Shanling stuff but I'll wait a bit


----------



## emirikol (Nov 5, 2018)

jeffri said:


> I think BTR3 definitely suit your use. ES100 is also comparable functionality-wise, but I like the sound of BTR3 better. Bluewave Get is great if you are driving headphone, but less so with IEM due to the hiss it produces. Sound-wise, I think the Get is better than ES100, but you have to use the aptX HD codec.
> 
> I can recommend AT-PHA55BT, but the functionality is limited (no USB DAC support) and can only connect to 1 device at a time. AK XB10 sounds good too, but battery life is too short and also no USB DAC support.



I'm out my home almost all day this is why dac function is important too. And as I said I’m looking for a pc desktop amp too for my weekends at home


----------



## FrankW86

pinkuyt said:


> Anyone having a problem with the new update? Right after updating the app and firmware i can access the menu Setting-> Fiio BTR3, but after a while (i switch back and forth between Spotify & fiio music app) the menu Setting -> Fiio BTR3 is disappeared from Fiio Music app.



I have the same problem after the update. At first the menu didn't appear at all. After reinstalling Fiio Music the menu appeared on the first run. The second time I opened the app it was gone again. 

The other issues are worse though. Using Fiio Music the BTR3 stutters. It seems the unit constantly switch the codec it uses: the logo changes color. On any other apps the volume is whisper quiet. 
This is using the 1.0 firmware and Fiio Music 1.0.4 on a phone running Android 7.1.1


----------



## Darkestred

FrankW86 said:


> I have the same problem after the update. At first the menu didn't appear at all. After reinstalling Fiio Music the menu appeared on the first run. The second time I opened the app it was gone again.
> 
> The other issues are worse though. Using Fiio Music the BTR3 stutters. It seems the unit constantly switch the codec it uses: the logo changes color. On any other apps the volume is whisper quiet.
> This is using the 1.0 firmware and Fiio Music 1.0.4 on a phone running Android 7.1.1



The app isn't useable on Samsung S8+ I just want to see what i can view on the BTR.  Id never use their music app...


----------



## polarbipolar (Nov 5, 2018)

Just bought BTR3 and updated to FW v. 1.0. Really amazing improvement compared to my Galaxy S9 stock DAC.Everything works as it should (aside from reversed track skip on volume control).

I've got only one problem: LHDC (HWA) does not seem to work for me. Everytime I try to force turn LHDC on the playback stops, then stutters for a couple of seconds and stops completely with blue light blinking (as in standby mode). The same happens in Fiio Music app and in Hiby Music app. Anybody encountered this? Really want to compare LHDC to LDAC.


----------



## Ggroch

polarbipolar said:


> Just bought BTR3 and updated to FW v. 1.0. Really amazing improvement compared to my Galaxy S9 stock.......I've got only one problem: LHDC (HWA) does not seem to work for me.



I did not know the Galaxy S9 supports LHDC.   Do you see LHDC as an option when you look at the Bluetooth Codecs on your phone (in Developer Options and probably elsewhere).


----------



## polarbipolar (Nov 5, 2018)

Ggroch said:


> I did not know the Galaxy S9 supports LHDC.   Do you see LHDC as an option when you look at the Bluetooth Codecs on your phone (in Developer Options and probably elsewhere).


Lol, no, S9 does not support LHDC. You're right. I guess I was mislead by the fact that it can be force turned on in the app (unlike any other codec). Thanks anyway 
Upd. I was also misled by the fact that it actually works for a couple of seconds.


----------



## deniska80 (Nov 6, 2018)

I bought this dac 2 days ago.
On pair with Iphone X the sound quality is quite good, but the quality of BT-receiver is awfull.
Periodically the music stutters (while btr3 is attached to the front side of my shorts and the phone is in my back pocket)
And of course I cant listen to it when my phone is in another room of my flat. It should be near with me or on me(in my front side pocket)
And The volume is not enough for me on heavy flacs(My iems are Rhapsodio Solar)
I wish I bought radsone es100


----------



## Brooko

deniska80 said:


> I bought this dac 2 days ago.
> On pair with Iphone X the sound quality is quite good, but the quality of BT-receiver is awfull.
> Periodically the music stutters (while btr3 is attached to the front side of my shorts and the phone is in my back pocket)
> And of course I cant listen to it when my phone is in another room of my flat. It should be near with me or on me(in my front side pocket)
> ...



Complete opposite for me - iPhone SE.  10m and two walls and still get clear audio.  Absolutely no cut-outs, and same when used portably (phone in pocket on left, receiver clipped to shirt.

What fw are you using?


----------



## deniska80

Brooko said:


> Complete opposite for me - iPhone SE.  10m and two walls and still get clear audio.  Absolutely no cut-outs, and same when used portably (phone in pocket on left, receiver clipped to shirt.
> 
> What fw are you using?


Updated to the latest(1.0).


----------



## Brooko

Seems weird doesn't it - the BTR3 to me is my constant companion - simply because the BT connection is so good ......


----------



## emirikol

deniska80 said:


> I bought this dac 2 days ago.
> On pair with Iphone X the sound quality is quite good, but the quality of BT-receiver is awfull.
> Periodically the music stutters (while btr3 is attached to the front side of my shorts and the phone is in my back pocket)
> And of course I cant listen to it when my phone is in another room of my flat. It should be near with me or on me(in my front side pocket)
> ...





Brooko said:


> Complete opposite for me - iPhone SE.  10m and two walls and still get clear audio.  Absolutely no cut-outs, and same when used portably (phone in pocket on left, receiver clipped to shirt.
> 
> What fw are you using?



It’s supposed iPhone doesn’t works with Bluetooth HD codecs and uses aac instead isn’t it?


----------



## Brooko

emirikol said:


> It’s supposed iPhone doesn’t works with Bluetooth HD codecs and uses aac instead isn’t it?



Yep - he said he was using an iPhone X - so he'd be using AAC as well.

I've tested all the codecs using both FiiO M9 and iPhone & I can't tell a difference.  AAC was designed to be audibly transparent - so I don't see an issue.


----------



## emirikol

Brooko said:


> Yep - he said he was using an iPhone X - so he'd be using AAC as well.
> 
> I've tested all the codecs using both FiiO M9 and iPhone & I can't tell a difference.  AAC was designed to be audibly transparent - so I don't see an issue.


Just asking, because i didn’t know if I was too dumb I didn’t know how enable aptx hd


----------



## voon (Nov 6, 2018)

polarbipolar said:


> Lol, no, S9 does not support LHDC. You're right. I guess I was mislead by the fact that it can be force turned on in the app (unlike any other codec). Thanks anyway
> Upd. I was also misled by the fact that it actually works for a couple of seconds.



Are you sure? On my S9+, I can put it into developer mode and then select LDAC as the BT codec.

(https://android.gadgethacks.com/how-to/activate-developer-options-your-galaxy-s9-0183344/)


----------



## polarbipolar (Nov 6, 2018)

voon said:


> Are you sure? On my S9+, I can put it into developer mode and then select LDAC as the BT codec.
> 
> (https://android.gadgethacks.com/how-to/activate-developer-options-your-galaxy-s9-0183344/)


Thanks, LDAC works perfectly fine on mine too, I was having problems with LHDC (HWA). These are different competing codecs. LDAC is by Sony, LHDC is by Huawei. Both support playback at ~900kbps.


----------



## voon

Argh sorry ... my brain autocorrected whatever into LDAC... silly me :/


----------



## rkw (Nov 6, 2018)

polarbipolar said:


> Thanks, LDAC works perfectly fine on mine too, I was having problems with LHDC (HWA). These are different competing codecs. LDAC is by Sony, LHDC is by Huawei. Both support playback at ~900kbps.


You can only use HWA with the Fiio Music app (except for Huawei phones which have HWA built-in). You can find HWA in the Fiio Music app settings.


----------



## polarbipolar

rkw said:


> You can only use HWA with the Fiio Music app (except for Huawei phones which have HWA built-in). You can find HWA in the Fiio Music app settings.


Well, I can't use it at all with Galaxy S9. When I turn it on in Fiio Music app, BTR3 stutters, stops and goes into standby mode. But S9 does not really have to support LHDC so go figure...


----------



## highlightshadow

I recently bought the BTR3 for use with my S9 but didn't end up keeping it long... i found the bluetooth was struggling more than i wanted it to (breakup).
The LDAC at least made for the best bluetooth audio experience i've had..... S9 doesn't support LHDC tho 
Ended up switching to an ES100


----------



## PeterMac

polarbipolar said:


> Thanks, LDAC works perfectly fine on mine too, I was having problems with LHDC (HWA). These are different competing codecs. LDAC is by Sony, LHDC is by Huawei. Both support playback at ~900kbps.



If you not listen Hi-Res files you don't need this super high bitrate codecs, even SBC is enough, only drain more battery for antything.
What else SBC and AptX have identical sound quality, even mesaurements agree this, I also do not hear any differences, only better is lower latency in AptX.
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/learn/sbc-aptx-which-bluetooth-codec-is-the-best


----------



## highlightshadow

I find SBC crunchy in quiet sections of music.... listening to classical gets unpleasant in SBC codec i personally find.
AAC is better, similar to AptX probably fine for 95% of use cases... AptXHD / LDAC etc do pretty much eliminate the costs of wireless for all but the best quality lossless sources


----------



## polarbipolar

PeterMac said:


> If you not listen Hi-Res files you don't need this super high bitrate codecs, even SBC is enough, only drain more battery for antything.
> What else SBC and AptX have identical sound quality, even mesaurements agree this, I also do not hear any differences, only better is lower latency in AptX.
> https://www.rtings.com/headphones/learn/sbc-aptx-which-bluetooth-codec-is-the-best


I do listen to DSD & FLAC on my phone, and I'm not sure whether it's psychoacoustics or not, but I do hear differences between AptX & LDAC. Also listenning to music I do not mind the latency, and really it's not that bad with LDAC.


----------



## FiiO

pinkuyt said:


> Anyone having a problem with the new update? Right after updating the app and firmware i can access the menu Setting-> Fiio BTR3, but after a while (i switch back and forth between Spotify & fiio music app) the menu Setting -> Fiio BTR3 is disappeared from Fiio Music app.


Dear friend,

Please try to exit the FiiO music from settings of the FiiO music then enter again for check? Or please try to reset the BTR3 and reconnect?

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

alphak said:


> I Spoke a bit too soon. The settings that are changed within the FiiO app, they don't stick. So every time I connect to the device again, I have to go back into the BTR3 settings and change stuff again. @FiiO  Is it not possible to save the settings within the device and have them stay when connecting to different devices etc?


Dear friend,

Some of the settings for the BTR3 can be remembered. You don't need to set again when connecting to device again.
But some of the settings could only work one time after setting.

For reference:
*RGB indicator option* (ON/OFF)

_Note: This setting will be out of work if the BTR3 is rebooted, and that is to say, the RGB indicator will light again after reboot._

*Charge option* (ON/OFF)

_Note: After the setting is changed,  it will take affect after re-plugging the USB cable.  The Charge option will be set to ON automatically if BTR3 is in low battery condition._

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

FrankW86 said:


> I have the same problem after the update. At first the menu didn't appear at all. After reinstalling Fiio Music the menu appeared on the first run. The second time I opened the app it was gone again.
> 
> The other issues are worse though. Using Fiio Music the BTR3 stutters. It seems the unit constantly switch the codec it uses: the logo changes color. On any other apps the volume is whisper quiet.
> This is using the 1.0 firmware and Fiio Music 1.0.4 on a phone running Android 7.1.1


Dear friend,

Did you turn on the HWA option in the FiiO Music?
Please try to turn it off and reset the BTR3 to see if it helps?

Best regards


----------



## FrankW86

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Did you turn on the HWA option in the FiiO Music?
> Please try to turn it off and reset the BTR3 to see if it helps?
> ...



Yes, the stuttering only happens in Fiiio Music when HWA is active. 
After deleting pairing history and re-pairing with my phone, the volume issues are fixed. Even Fiiio Music works as long as HWA is not engaged.


----------



## pinkuyt

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Please try to exit the FiiO music from settings of the FiiO music then enter again for check? Or please try to reset the BTR3 and reconnect?
> 
> Best regards



I tried each of them and it didn't work, but then i tried *both *resetting BTR3 and turning off the HWA, the menu appears again. 
And if i turn on HWA, the menu will disappear when i comeback to the Fiio App.


----------



## Andreeww

I am trying to get a usb c dac for my phone. I have found Fiio btr1k, Fiio btr3, shanling up, shanling m0. Does any one know which is the best? And are there any other options?​


----------



## dpsbz

Hi just got my BTR3 and I like it but thought it would go a lot louder tbh . Also when I press the volume up button the music fades out then back in again . Is this normal ?


----------



## jeffri

dpsbz said:


> Hi just got my BTR3 and I like it but thought it would go a lot louder tbh . Also when I press the volume up button the music fades out then back in again . Is this normal ?



That just means you have hit the volume limit. Make sure you also maxed the volume on your phone.


----------



## dpsbz

Ok cool , thanks


----------



## omega505 (Nov 9, 2018)

Brooko said:


> Yep - he said he was using an iPhone X - so he'd be using AAC as well.
> 
> I've tested all the codecs using both FiiO M9 and iPhone & I can't tell a difference.  AAC was designed to be audibly transparent - so I don't see an issue.



I just got the BTR3, updated to latest firmware, but on iOS it always gives me the blue logo light (so SBC, not AAC).

Is there a setting somewhere I need to set up to get this to work with AAC?

Also, for some reason the Fiio Music app doesn’t detec the device when its in use


----------



## Brooko (Nov 9, 2018)

It’ll flash blue until you hit play, then the blue turns to cyan.  At least it does that for me.

And the iOS FiiO app doesn’t detect the BTR3 for me either. Just shows a blank screen.


----------



## omega505

Brooko said:


> It’ll flash blue until you hit play, then the blue turns to cyan.  At least it does that for me.
> 
> And the iOS FiiO app doesn’t detect the BTR3 for me either. Just shows a blank screen.



huh, you’re right. cyan looks really similar to the blue.


----------



## bencherian

Did anyone compare this one against Hidizs Sonata HD2 ? Need to know in Sound quality terms only


----------



## minimalist82

Hi guys, This is actually my first post on Head-fi, but I am a long time lurker! I have been especially interested in this and the ES100 thread. I own both devices and they have made me realise that Bluetooth is absolutely a viable option at last!

As my name suggests I am about simplicity. I want to find a great portable audio solution that is as compact as possible but that still provides great sound and versatility. I'm an Apple music user and have an Samsung S8 and an iPhone 6s at present. I love the idea of this this tiny device, my IEMs and a smartphone as my setup. Also the idea of my smartphone being free of cables is fantastic.

Just to share some of my thoughts on this product. I think the build is fantastic and a step up from the ES100. I hate the idea of choosing one product over the other based on aesthetics, but durability is so important when talking about a portable product.  Initially I thought the lack of balanced out would be a huge negative, but so far it is not presenting any real issues. I think the sound is great, lots of detail and very chunky in the low end and no noticeable noise. IMO It feels like it has a lot more weight in the sound delivered compared to ES100, but of course that is probably just the way the product has been tuned and could probably be replicated by the ES100 with the EQ. Which brings me on to EQ, does anyone know when the EQ functionality will be launched in the FIIO app? I feel that this will really start to unlock the true potential of the device. @FiiO Can you share a timeline for EQ functionality please?

My biggest issue with the product so far is the Bluetooth signal and this is becoming a major issue for me. Sitting in my kitchen, with the phone on the table, just walking around the small room I find it stutters and drops audio regularly. Even just obstructing with my body, but still being at close range. I also experience these issue when out and about, just having my phone in one pocket and the BTR3 in the other. Do people think this could be helped by future firmware upgrades, or is it linked to the design, due to the metal housing (that would be such a shame)? These kinds of issues seem much less with the ES100.

Just my input so far!


----------



## Hanesu (Nov 12, 2018)

minimalist82 said:


> Hi guys, This is actually my first post on Head-fi, but I am a long time lurker! I have been especially interested in this and the ES100 thread. I own both devices and they have made me realise that Bluetooth is absolutely a viable option at last!
> 
> As my name suggests I am about simplicity. I want to find a great portable audio solution that is as compact as possible but that still provides great sound and versatility. I'm an Apple music user and have an Samsung S8 and an iPhone 6s at present. I love the idea of this this tiny device, my IEMs and a smartphone as my setup. Also the idea of my smartphone being free of cables is fantastic.
> 
> ...



Great (first) post! 
I have almost exactly the same thoughts on this little device (no balanced but built quality way better and more attack compared to ES100 and XB10) and bluetooth in general (minimalistic approach works great with streaming on the go and BT-SQ is way better than its reputation ) and I am asking myself the same questions: FIIO, please let us know when the EQ is coming!


----------



## RobbS

Wishing I would have picked this up instead of the uBTR!


----------



## highlightshadow

I had the btr3 and the build quality was great. Ended up wth the es purely on functionality.

Bluetooth is prone to interference as it's congested 2.4ghz. Even microwave oven week affect it.

The little chip antenna on the PCB aren't particularly good.
Be better if the put a larger one as part of the case.


----------



## SpiderNhan (Nov 13, 2018)

The right side of the clip housing just broke on me. I wasn't aware when it happened but it was clipped to the inner breast pocket of a blazer when I unclipped it and noticed it felt a little off.

It's pretty much spent the past 3 weeks clipped to the headband of my V-Moda XS headphones, so I wasn't constantly clipping and unclipping it. I took it off the XS today to use with a pair of VE Monks with my blazer when I noticed the break.


----------



## highlightshadow

That's surprising - the one thing the BTR looked like it had was build quality... felt so strong


----------



## Alberto01

Do music apps such as foobar2000 and VLC media player work through the BTR3? If so, will their equalizers also work in the BTR3? VLC has a 10 band equalizer and foobar2000 has an 18 band equalizer.


----------



## iL15hts

I just purchased the btr3 coming from btr1 (Ver. 2) I'm surprised with the sound quality, Definitely worth an upgrade from btr1. I just checked the comparison chart from their website and stated its the same amp/dac.  I wonder why the sound is different? Anyone please enlighten me.


----------



## waynes world

SpiderNhan said:


> The right side of the clip housing just broke on me. I wasn't aware when it happened but it was clipped to the inner breast pocket of a blazer when I unclipped it and noticed it felt a little off.
> 
> It's pretty much spent the past 3 weeks clipped to the headband of my V-Moda XS headphones, so I wasn't constantly clipping and unclipping it. I took it off the XS today to use with a pair of VE Monks with my blazer when I noticed the break.



I break plenty of clips. I clip stuff to my belt (phones, daps, bt receivers, whatever), and car bucket seats usually result in clip carnage. I recently broke the clip on my ES100, but it was my bad (and I've since made it clip-able again). I'm sure if I had the BTR3, I'd break it's clip too. But it does seem kind of odd that it broke on you, with your relatively gentle handling of it.


----------



## jeffri

I have a friend with BTR3 with clip broken by a drop too, seems to be the weak point.


----------



## Alberto01

Alberto01 said:


> Do music apps such as foobar2000 and VLC media player work through the BTR3? If so, will their equalizers also work in the BTR3? VLC has a 10 band equalizer and foobar2000 has an 18 band equalizer.


Mr. FiiO, please answer these questions.


----------



## rkw

Alberto01 said:


> Do music apps such as foobar2000 and VLC media player work through the BTR3? If so, will their equalizers also work in the BTR3? VLC has a 10 band equalizer and foobar2000 has an 18 band equalizer.


Yes. The BTR3 is a receiver and plays whatever is sent by any media player.


----------



## Alberto01

rkw said:


> Yes. The BTR3 is a receiver and plays whatever is sent by any media player.


Thank you!

That is what I thought about how it works. But, it was better to ask before getting the MTR3. I always use an equalizer to raise the frequencies below 100 Hz, around 1000 Hz and above 5000 Hz. The sound is so much better with those adjustments. Mr. FiiO, that is the reason why people here are requesting that you give them an equalizer in the BTR3 app.


----------



## Alberto01

rkw, do you have a BTR3?


----------



## PeterMac (Nov 14, 2018)

minimalist82 said:


> Hi guys, This is actually my first post on Head-fi, but I am a long time lurker! I have been especially interested in this and the ES100 thread. I own both devices and they have made me realise that Bluetooth is absolutely a viable option at last!
> 
> As my name suggests I am about simplicity. I want to find a great portable audio solution that is as compact as possible but that still provides great sound and versatility. I'm an Apple music user and have an Samsung S8 and an iPhone 6s at present. I love the idea of this this tiny device, my IEMs and a smartphone as my setup. Also the idea of my smartphone being free of cables is fantastic.
> 
> ...


Someone here said that ES100 have worse BT range to BTR3. You say ES100 have much better ?


----------



## minimalist82

PeterMac said:


> Someone here said that ES100 have worse BT range to BTR3. You say ES100 have much better ?



I haven't carried out any scientific tests, but for my use case described above or out and about with the device in one pocket and my handset in the other I have certainly found the ES100 to have a more solid connection. I want to be clear though, the BTR3 is far from unusable in this regard!

My intention was to test both the ES100 and BTR3 and settle on one or the other as my portable solution. I want simplicity and not two products doing the same thing, but I'm finding it so difficult to decide. On paper, the ES100 should be the safer bet, but there is something about the sound of the BTR3 that I am finding more enjoyable. It has a certain 'thickness' I just can't seem to replicate with the ES100. This is of course very subjective and purely my personal taste. 

Just to give more context to my findings, I have been using AKG N5005, AKG K550MKIII & VE Monk Plus. I'm a little AKG-centric as you can probably see due to being a Harman employee! 

@FiiO  please give us EQ control soon, so we can really unlock the potential of this device!


----------



## waynes world

minimalist82 said:


> I haven't carried out any scientific tests, but for my use case described above or out and about with the device in one pocket and my handset in the other I have certainly found the ES100 to have a more solid connection. I want to be clear though, the BTR3 is far from unusable in this regard!



I don't have the BTR3, but the ES100's BT connection seems pretty darned good to me.



> My intention was to test both the ES100 and BTR3 and settle on one or the other as my portable solution. I want simplicity and not two products doing the same thing, but I'm finding it so difficult to decide. On paper, the ES100 should be the safer bet, but there is something about the sound of the BTR3 that I am finding more enjoyable. It has a certain 'thickness' I just can't seem to replicate with the ES100. This is of course very subjective and purely my personal taste.



Interesting. Fwiw, I like some bass, and on my more neutral gear, I often use the ES100's "bass boost" EQ setting to warm up the sound a bit. But you say that you can't replicate, so you probably have already tried EQ'ing.


----------



## kiruenauk

Hi, a quick question on using the BTR3 as a USB DAC through an Android phone. I'm currently using a Xiaomi Mi A1 playing FLAC files on USB Audio Player Pro going through the BTR3 connected through a USB OTG cable. Most of my FLAC files are 96kHz/24bit. The USB Audio Player Pro shows that the BTR3 USB DAC sample rate is only at 48kHz. 

Is the BTR3 internal DAC sample rate is locked at 48kHz only when using it as a USB DAC?


----------



## highlightshadow

I think it's limited to 44.1KHz/16Bit on USB


----------



## Darkestred

PeterMac said:


> Someone here said that ES100 have worse BT range to BTR3. You say ES100 have much better ?



Unless it was a faulty unit.  I find the ES100 has better and stronger range.  I own both.  If i use the ninja to blend protein my BTR cuts out.  The ES100 does not.  I can go through multiple walls in my house and the ES100 will not cutout, the BTR struggles.  Cupping both units the ES100 does not cutout but the BTR does.  I love both units, though.

And as someone else mentioned the BTR has that FIIO airy "Thickness."


----------



## MarkF786

PeterMac said:


> Someone here said that ES100 have worse BT range to BTR3. You say ES100 have much better ?



I was doing some testing comparing Bluetooth signal strength of both devices using an app LightBlue on my iPhone.  Under the conditions I tested, signal strength was very similar between the two, and in practical terms, they've performed similarly well for me in my day-to-day use.


----------



## highlightshadow

Think it's partly, at least, down the the fact that the ES100 has a totally plastic shell and the BTR has an aluminium shell except glass front.
Both use a chip antenna which aren't the best for range.

But i would agree that the ES100 has the edge albeit slight on range or connection stability. But i find most BT devices have a sweetspot in terms of their position/orientation when you'll get the best connection, similarly there's a position that'll kill it within a metre.

Not sure why they couldn't have run an antenna around the glass edge to create a much larger one rather than the chip


----------



## rkw

Alberto01 said:


> rkw, do you have a BTR3?


Yes


----------



## kiruenauk (Nov 15, 2018)

kiruenauk said:


> Hi, a quick question on using the BTR3 as a USB DAC through an Android phone. I'm currently using a Xiaomi Mi A1 playing FLAC files on USB Audio Player Pro going through the BTR3 connected through a USB OTG cable. Most of my FLAC files are 96kHz/24bit. The USB Audio Player Pro shows that the BTR3 USB DAC sample rate is only at 48kHz.
> 
> Is the BTR3 internal DAC sample rate is locked at 48kHz only when using it as a USB DAC?



I did some searching online and found that the DAC used in the BTR3, AK4376A actually supports multi sample rates up to 384kHz, so I'm confused why it's stuck to one sample rate.

Anyone from @FiiO or @JamesFiiO can shed some light? I'm planning to use it extensively as a USB DAC


----------



## Alberto01

rkw said:


> Yes


How is the sound quality of your BTR3 compared to other stuff that you have?


----------



## highlightshadow

kiruenauk said:


> I did some searching online and found that the DAC used in the BTR3, AK4376A actually supports multi sample rates up to 384kHz, so I'm confused why it's stuck to one sample rate.
> 
> Anyone from @FiiO or @JamesFiiO can shed some light? I'm planning to use it extensively as a USB DAC


When i plug my BTR3 into a USB port on my PC i only get the options listed here - cannot select higher - they're just not there - might be an issue with their embedded driver not advertising capabilities to the OS properly


----------



## jeffri

I think that is because BTR3 only support USB Audio Class 1, which is limited to 16bit/44.1khz. The same limitation was also in ES100 and Bluewave Get.


----------



## highlightshadow

jeffri said:


> I think that is because BTR3 only support USB Audio Class 1, which is limited to 16bit/44.1khz. The same limitation was also in ES100 and Bluewave Get.



Always thought USB class 1 had a limitation of 24/96 PCM.

Definitely fiio could make a Windows driver, not sure about Android though


----------



## archy121 (Nov 15, 2018)

@FiiO Does the new BT chip in BTR1K offer superior connectivity to the BTR3 ?

Edit. 

I just realised I have an even more important question to ask. 
As I plan to use the FIIO BT device with iPhone XS, will I be able to take advantage of LDAC using the FIIO Audio player as output or am I still limited to Apple’s AAC ? 

In which case there is no sonic advantage for me to look at either or the BT3/BTR1K. uBTR with AAC might be the best for me.


----------



## ctaxxxx

Just bought these and have got to say, they're not bad. Listening to them with the Focal Elegia and the iPhone (so AAC only atm). I went with the BTR3 over the ES100, since I heard they were more energetic sounding. I have to agree so far. They give the Elegia more upper vocal presence and such. Really like it. 

Can't wait to upgrade my DX200 to Oreo OS and try LDAC.


----------



## FiiO

SpiderNhan said:


> The right side of the clip housing just broke on me. I wasn't aware when it happened but it was clipped to the inner breast pocket of a blazer when I unclipped it and noticed it felt a little off.
> 
> It's pretty much spent the past 3 weeks clipped to the headband of my V-Moda XS headphones, so I wasn't constantly clipping and unclipping it. I took it off the XS today to use with a pair of VE Monks with my blazer when I noticed the break.


Dear friend,

We have reported to the engineer about that. Will try to improve the clip in later batch.
Sorry if bringing inconvenience to you.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

archy121 said:


> @FiiO Does the new BT chip in BTR1K offer superior connectivity to the BTR3 ?
> 
> Edit.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

The price, the Bluetooth chip, the out looking, the function are all different between BTR3 and BTR1K.
The μBTR doesn't have independent DAC chip so the decoding performance may not be so good comparing to BTR3 or BTR1K. 
For some mobile phones(like iPhone), the supported Bluetooth codecs are limited which could not support APTX or LDAC. To those users, BTR1K is not the best but the most suitable.


Best regards


----------



## FiiO

kiruenauk said:


> I did some searching online and found that the DAC used in the BTR3, AK4376A actually supports multi sample rates up to 384kHz, so I'm confused why it's stuck to one sample rate.
> 
> Anyone from @FiiO or @JamesFiiO can shed some light? I'm planning to use it extensively as a USB DAC


Dear friend,

Because of the hardware limitation, the USB DAC function of the BTR3 supports up to 48KHz/16bit.

Best regards


----------



## kiruenauk

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Because of the hardware limitation, the USB DAC function of the BTR3 supports up to 48KHz/16bit.
> 
> Best regards



@FiiO  Any chance there will be firmware updates to improve this to at least support up to 96kHz sample rate and 24 bits?


----------



## FiiO

kiruenauk said:


> @FiiO  Any chance there will be firmware updates to improve this to at least support up to 96kHz sample rate and 24 bits?


Dear friend,

No, because it is not a software problem but the hardware limitation. 

Best regards


----------



## psikey (Nov 17, 2018)

Just trying the BTR3 in USB DAC mode with Roon. Does it only support a max of 16/48 as a USB DAC?

Wondered if it would sound better than the supposedly good built-in audio on my MSI motherboard which supports 24/192

…..

Guess so  

Just enable Fiio WASAPI Exclusive Mode and with a Tidal Master it shows Bit Depth Conversion 24bit to 16bit. PC motherboard sounds cleaner.

If I enable the onboard Realtek WASAPI and Exclusive mode I get a full lossless signal path.


----------



## Janjohnnn (Nov 29, 2018)

@FiiO Is there a way to fix the inaccurate battery indicator? Just got them and it goes from 90%-70-50-30. It skips 20%. Sometimes it goes 30 to 50 back to back and i kept hearing the low battery notification sound. Maybe future firmware update? Or did I get a faulty btr3? I just got them nov 16


----------



## Litlgi74 (Nov 18, 2018)

Not really sure if I'll be phrasing my question correctly... But I'll give it a shot.

I am currently using a HA-2SE... Love it... But I'd like to make it more portable. I was considering the BTR3 for it's AptX and LDAC receiver capabilities.

Now for the question(s)

Is it possible to use the BTR3 just as a stand alone receiver... bypassing it's internal DAC? If so, how?

I've installed the Fiio app to give it a test drive... I see the BTR3 has the option for usb out... What are the three options, (DoP, D2P, and native) for. Can I use this USB option to export digital audio to my HA-2SE via an OTG cable?



Thanks for your help.
John


----------



## Janjohnnn (Nov 19, 2018)

.


----------



## iL15hts

I just upgraded my BTR1(aac) to BTR3 because of the USB DAC feature. The sound is improved in this version. Soundstage seems a bit wider.

But I missed my BTR1 for these little thing
1. A big play/pause button (Handy when running and you need to pause a song)
2. The volume is sync with my iPhone
3. If you watching videos or listening to music, If you remove the headphone from BTR! the video/music will PAUSE
4. When you're watching/listening a video through your phone's speaker (While the BTR1 connected to your phone)...
clicking the play/pause button will automatically route the sound to the BTR1. (No need to go to your phone and choose output)

For me this seems a new product.


----------



## archy121 (Nov 21, 2018)

So I just came across a very interesting video where the reviewer is comparing transmission distances of popular BT receivers inc ESS100, BTR1K and BTR3. 

The BTR1K outperforms all of them including the BTR3 by almost 3 times distance indicating that the new BT chip in it is far superior.
I previously heard complaints about the BTR3 having   weak BT signal and this video has addded more fuel to my concern.

BTR3 with its LDAC advantage or better BT connectivity with BTR1K is not a choice I want to have to make. I hope we see an updated BTR3K with the same new BT chip and until than I think I’m going to sit back.


----------



## Brooko

archy121 said:


> So I just came across a very interesting video where the reviewer is comparing transmission distances of popular BT receivers inc ESS100, BTR1K and BTR3.
> 
> The BTR1K outperforms all of them including the BTR3 by almost 3 times distance indicating that the new BT chip in it is far superior.
> I previously heard complaints about the BTR3 having   weak BT signal and this video has addded more fuel to my concern.
> ...



How are you going to use your device though?  Are you really going to range that far away from your source?  Most people I know will have their source (Phone) in their pocket, or within an easy 10m.  At that range the BTR3 has been perfect, and thats even through walls.  It simply doesn't glitch out.  I can get line of sight to about 20m with a pretty solid connection.  So personally I think it's dependent on the the actual source you're using (mine is an iPhone SE), and the environment.  I use mine all the time, and thoroughly recommend it as a portable device.


----------



## archy121

Brooko said:


> How are you going to use your device though?  Are you really going to range that far away from your source?  Most people I know will have their source (Phone) in their pocket, or within an easy 10m.  At that range the BTR3 has been perfect, and thats even through walls.  It simply doesn't glitch out.  I can get line of sight to about 20m with a pretty solid connection.  So personally I think it's dependent on the the actual source you're using (mine is an iPhone SE), and the environment.  I use mine all the time, and thoroughly recommend it as a portable device.


 

Thanks for sharing your experience which seems to be a positive one. 

The guy in the video is testing in open air and the situation in a house can be much more different with doors, solid walls and insulated ceilings etc. Ideally I wanted to be able connect to my media PC and go downstairs to kitchen etc without interference. Not just for when I have phone in pocket with me. 
I read another owners comparison with ES100 and his main complaint against BTR3 was the BT reception when going room distance away from the BT transmitter. 

Your experience has made me feel a bit more confident in it too. The BTR3 is available at almost same RRP price as BTR1K in UK so i best have a good think.


----------



## Brooko

archy121 said:


> Thanks for sharing your experience which seems to be a positive one.
> 
> The guy in the video is testing in open air and the situation in a house can be much more different with doors, solid walls and insulated ceilings etc. Ideally I wanted to be able connect to my media PC and go downstairs to kitchen etc without interference. Not just for when I have phone in pocket with me.
> I read another owners comparison with ES100 and his main complaint against BTR3 was the BT reception when going room distance away from the BT transmitter.
> ...


The hard part in trying to evaluate is the different environments, competing signals, different density in obstacles, different source connections and strengths. I guess that is the problem - what works for me may not work for you.


----------



## waynes world

Brooko said:


> The hard part in trying to evaluate is the different environments, competing signals, different density in obstacles, different source connections and strengths. I guess that is the problem - what works for me may not work for you.



+1. When I got my BT receiver, I wasn't really concerned with the BT connectivity as long as it worked well in the same room as my phone (ie within 10m). After having used it now for a while, I actually wouldn't complain if it had a crazy long range which would allow me to wander around the house without cutouts. For example, sometimes I hook up my BT receiver to my stereo and it's great to be able to control it with my phone... until I wander out of the room and I get yelled at lol. Anyway, first world problem!


----------



## FiiO

Janjohnnn said:


> @FiiO Is there a way to fix the inaccurate battery indicator? Just got them and it goes from 90-70-50-30. Sometimes it goes 30 to 50 back to back and i kept hearing the low battery notification sound. Maybe future firmware update? Or did I get a faulty btr3? I just got them nov 16


Dear friend,

Because of the low precision of the Bluetooth power meter, the battery indicator would show the approximate battery value, which is just for reference. Most Bluetooth products in the market also have similar phenomenon. We will report to the engineers about that and try to improve this.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Litlgi74 said:


> Not really sure if I'll be phrasing my question correctly... But I'll give it a shot.
> 
> I am currently using a HA-2SE... Love it... But I'd like to make it more portable. I was considering the BTR3 for it's AptX and LDAC receiver capabilities.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

The option for usb out is not used for the BTR3. The USB DAC function for the BTR3 is used for the computer originally, we could not promise whether it could work in your mobile phone. When you are using the Bluetooth output, the internal DAC of your player is bypassed, and the Bluetooth headphones or amplifier work as the DAC instead. 

Best regards


----------



## noaid (Nov 22, 2018)

Hi, the guy in the video wears BT receivers sometimes behind his body, sometimes left of the body, differently for each receiver. Human body is one of the biggest obstacles for receiving BT signal, so I dont take video as very relevant. But yes, BRT1K distance is amazing but not worth loosing LDAC at least for me.

As for the BTR3 sound quality - I use it with Samsung J5 for spoken word with APTX and with Samsung S7 with LDAC for music both with USB Audio Player. I can compare with Fiio Q1 mk2 + S7. Headphones KZ ZS6 or AKG K-701.
BTR3 LDAC is relatively good if you have nothing to compare what is better.  Problem is probably analog part not the bluetooth or DAC. Comparing to Q1 mk2 - it is much better - but bigger, needs usb cable.
I connected both to my advanced home system and with Q1 sound was more clear and space separation much better. Source was S7, when playing from Windows with Foobar Q1 was even better than from S7.

So for me BTR3 is very good for BT, but if I want to listen to music in best quality outside my home, I stack Q1 to my S7 and connect all cables, load some SACDs and hires music and enjoy.

In the future I plan to buy some successor of Fiio Q5 which will have also LDAC.


----------



## minimalist82

Hi guys, 

I just wanted to share my updated thoughts. Initially I was disappointed with the connectivity issues compared to the ES100 as I mentioned. But after using it daily for a couple of weeks. I have found it to be absolutely fine. Walking around with the product in my pocket i'm experiencing very few issues and i have definitely grown very fond of it! It makes my AKG N5005s sing and it is just so compact ! To be honest this is what I bought it for. Sure it would be nice to think you could walk around the house with the phone in one room and not have any issue, but I think perhaps it is unfair to expect the product to perform this way. 

Ultimately anyone who is considering using the product in the way that I am, I would say go ahead and buy it. I don't believe you will be disappointed!

@FiiO I have a question regarding the EQ functionality that will hopefully be launched soon. Will the EQ be applied system wide or just for music being played from the FIIO music app please? Thanks.


----------



## amrbadrawy

Hi,
I was wondering what is the DAC decoding capabilities when connected over USB to PC? is it capable of Decoding DSD or 192 HI-Res natively?


----------



## Ggroch

amrbadrawy said:


> Hi,
> I was wondering what is the DAC decoding capabilities when connected over USB to PC? is it capable of Decoding DSD or 192 HI-Res natively?



No and No. *This was all covered previously*


----------



## amrbadrawy

Ggroch said:


> No and No. *This was all covered previously*


Thank you so much, May be I should give the Q5 a try! I wonder how much different it will sound with the FH5 compared to the BTR3, i am sure there will be so much difference, the question is how will my aging ears be able to pick up the difference!


----------



## Ggroch

My old ears cannot hear the difference. On the other hand, if I had taken the time and trouble to build a library of high bit / DSD files, I would probably want that feature just to be consistent.  I didn't, so I don't.


----------



## archy121

minimalist82 said:


> ..Ultimately anyone who is considering using the product in the way that I am, I would say go ahead and buy it. I don't believe you will be disappointed!...



Thanks for confirming my concerns. 
I’m in no rush so will wait for BTR3K/BTR4 to arrive.


----------



## minimalist82

archy121 said:


> Thanks for confirming my concerns.
> I’m in no rush so will wait for BTR3K/BTR4 to arrive.



Haha I was trying to alleviate your concerns not confirm them!


----------



## lordaine

Recently bought this one and upgraded to v1 at once but when using kz zs10 with full volume on both phone and btr3 is like 10%. Already using HWA on Huawei honor 8x. BT connection is not good as well.

It's only good when using fiio music app with HWA but connection always drop even at close range.


----------



## lordaine (Nov 25, 2018)

lordaine said:


> Recently bought this one and upgraded to v1 at once but when using kz zs10 with full volume on both phone and btr3 is like 10%. Already using HWA on Huawei honor 8x. BT connection is not good as well.
> 
> It's only good when using fiio music app with HWA but connection always drop even at close range.



Quick fix, remove fiio music app then BT unpair, reboot phone, after that, BT pair again. Never installed music app.

HWA(LHDC) is kinda far from LDAC in terms of software maturity, IMHO. Setting for optimized audio quality results to stuttering from time to time even at side by side. Suggest to keep at adaptive bit rate. See attached screenshot.


----------



## waynes world

lordaine said:


> Quick fix, remove fiio music app then BT unpair, reboot phone, after that, BT pair again. Never installed music app.
> 
> HWA is kinda far from LDAC. Setting for optimized audio quality results to stuttering from time to time even at side by side. Suggest to keep at adaptive bit rate. See attached screenshot.



Sorry, but what do you mean by "HWA is kinda far from LDAC"?


----------



## lordaine

waynes world said:


> Sorry, but what do you mean by "HWA is kinda far from LDAC"?



Updated my post above.


----------



## borrego (Nov 26, 2018)

Fiio BTR3 is turning my GMP 8.35D Mobile to a pair very capable BT headphones. Sound quality (using aptx HD) is similar to my LG V20's built-in Sabre DAC.


----------



## lordaine

borrego said:


> Fiio BTR3 is turning my GMP 8.35D Mobile to a pair very capable BT headphones. Sound quality (using aptx HD) is similar to my LG V20's built-in Sabre DAC.



How's the instrument separation and soundstage? I got to experience v20 last time and it was superb.


----------



## borrego (Nov 26, 2018)

lordaine said:


> How's the instrument separation and soundstage? I got to experience v20 last time and it was superb.



The V20's built in Sabre DAC is a touch more dynamic than the BTR3 aptx HD when playing 320K MP3 from Google Play Music. The V20 has more advantage on seperation and resolution if playing 16bit FLAC. The comparison was done in quiet indoor environment. I bet one would not be able to tell difference in less quiet outdoor environment


----------



## lordaine

borrego said:


> The V20's built in Sabre DAC is a touch more dynamic than the BTR3 aptx HD when playing 320K MP3 from Google Play Music. The V20 has more advantage on seperation and resolution if playing 16bit FLAC. The comparison was done in quiet indoor environment. I bet one would not be able to tell difference in less quiet outdoor environment



True enough. As for me, this dac sounds more "fun" rather than analytical.


----------



## FiiO

minimalist82 said:


> @FiiO I have a question regarding the EQ functionality that will hopefully be launched soon. Will the EQ be applied system wide or just for music being played from the FIIO music app please? Thanks.



Dear friend,

The EQ for BTR3 will be applied system wide.

Best regards


----------



## Alberto01 (Nov 28, 2018)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The EQ for BTR3 will be applied system wide.
> 
> Best regards


Mr. FiiO, there is something that you should know about designing an equalizer: A good equalizer must include sliders at 100 Hz, 1000 Hz and 10,000 Hz.

100 Hz is the frequency of punchy bass. For example, to increase the slam of electronic music or any bass notes without affecting the middle frequencies at the same time, that is the best frequency to raise with an equalizer. That is the tightest and punchiest bass frequency.

1000 Hz (1 kHz) is the frequency of voices. If you want to bring vocals forward while keeping the bass and treble sweet (without much middle frequency glare), that is the best frequency to raise with an equalizer.

10,000 Hz (10 kHz) is the frequency of sweet treble. If you want to increase the sweetest treble without increasing treble harshness and high frequency glare, that is the right frequency to raise with an equalizer.

It took me several years doing live sound to get this knowledge about equalization. Many people that design equalization software, don't know this. And when the number of bands is limited, they don't include all 3 of these frequencies.


----------



## BenKatz

waynes world said:


> Sorry, but what do you mean by "HWA is kinda far from LDAC"?



I dont know about huawei phones, but google included LDAC in Android ever since 8, so you should have LDAC support, and if so, use it.

I read about HWA, and its really inferior to LDAC in all ways. Technically, its has a narrower bandwidth than LDAc (ldac is wider by 90khz) and the software and coding that Sony has developed into LDAc over the years, being an expert company in anything Audio, makes it far superior to whatever Huawei rushed (and most probably copied from LDAC coding) to the market. I've read a lot of people complaining about HWA constant cutouts, while LDAC is very stable even though it gives you a wider bandwidth.


----------



## waynes world

BenKatz said:


> I dont know about huawei phones, but google included LDAC in Android ever since 8, so you should have LDAC support, and if so, use it.
> 
> I read about HWA, and its really inferior to LDAC in all ways. Technically, its has a narrower bandwidth than LDAc (ldac is wider by 90khz) and the software and coding that Sony has developed into LDAc over the years, being an expert company in anything Audio, makes it far superior to whatever Huawei rushed (and most probably copied from LDAC coding) to the market. I've read a lot of people complaining about HWA constant cutouts, while LDAC is very stable even though it gives you a wider bandwidth.



I think you meant to direct this to @lordaine. Fwiw, I use LDAC on the BT receiver that I have (not the BTR3).


----------



## lordaine

BenKatz said:


> I dont know about huawei phones, but google included LDAC in Android ever since 8, so you should have LDAC support, and if so, use it.
> 
> I read about HWA, and its really inferior to LDAC in all ways. Technically, its has a narrower bandwidth than LDAc (ldac is wider by 90khz) and the software and coding that Sony has developed into LDAc over the years, being an expert company in anything Audio, makes it far superior to whatever Huawei rushed (and most probably copied from LDAC coding) to the market. I've read a lot of people complaining about HWA constant cutouts, while LDAC is very stable even though it gives you a wider bandwidth.



Problem is am using a Huawei phone ang they remove LDAC support, totally replace it with LHDC


----------



## PeterMac

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The EQ for BTR3 will be applied system wide.
> 
> Best regards


EQ preset will be In memory in BTR3 ? or only on device where FiiO Music app was installed ?


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> EQ preset will be In memory in BTR3 ? or only on device where FiiO Music app was installed ?


will be In memory in BTR3

Best regards


----------



## PeterMac

That's great. Thank you.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> Mr. FiiO, there is something that you should know about designing an equalizer: A good equalizer must include sliders at 100 Hz, 1000 Hz and 10,000 Hz.
> 
> 100 Hz is the frequency of punchy bass. For example, to increase the slam of electronic music or any bass notes without affecting the middle frequencies at the same time, that is the best frequency to raise with an equalizer. That is the tightest and punchiest bass frequency.
> 
> ...



That is a terrible frequency choice. Punchy bass?? I think not.
~40-65hz is where the deep bass(subwoofer like) is and is what I would hope that FiiO gives options for.

I just bought the BTR3 for use on my Pixel 3 and my VMODA Crossfade Wireless headphones as the BT in them only does SBC.
Not at all happy to discover that the EQ that it is advertised to have is not implemented yet.
I use Poweamp V3 for my music and that has a very very good EQ, however, I wanted the "system wide" EQ that this DAC was supposed to have so that other apps, like a  video player, that have no EQ, would sound better. ( I need bass boost fro my music vids)
Poweramp EQ has 34,62,125,250,500.1K,2K,4K,8K,16K frequency adjustments. I can only hope that FiiO implements a EQ with that many adjustments. Mainly have the lower frequency available to give a good subwoofer like bass, or perhaps a dedicated "Bass Boost" option.


----------



## FSTOP

Agreed. The more bands the better for any EQ adjustments. PowerAmp has a very decent EQ at 10 bands (nothing like my 31 bands/channel graphic and parametric EQ studio racks though). Only 3 bands at those frequencies would not be that useful.


----------



## Alberto01

speedingcheetah said:


> That is a terrible frequency choice. Punchy bass?? I think not.
> ~40-65hz is where the deep bass(subwoofer like) is and is what I would hope that FiiO gives options for.
> 
> I just bought the BTR3 for use on my Pixel 3 and my VMODA Crossfade Wireless headphones as the BT in them only does SBC.
> ...


There is a difference between punchy bass and deep bass. 100 kHz is the punchy bass frequency. The deep bass frequencies are also important. I didn't mention them because the equalizer software designers usually don't miss them. But, you are right; in some equalizers the lowest frequency is not low enough for my liking.

Regarding the 100, 1000 and 10,000 Hz frequencies, Dr. Chung added a bass and treble boost button to his INDEED G3 amplifiers. He chose 100 Hz for the bass and 10,000 Hz for the treble. Clean, tight bass punch and clean sweet treble is what that pressed button produced. It is a shame that the dB boost at 100 Hz was just too big.


----------



## Alberto01

FSTOP said:


> Agreed. The more bands the better for any EQ adjustments. PowerAmp has a very decent EQ at 10 bands (nothing like my 31 bands/channel graphic and parametric EQ studio racks though). Only 3 bands at those frequencies would not be that useful.


I never intended to suggest Mr. FiiO to give us an equalizer with just 3 bands at the frequencies that I mentioned. I just meant to say that those 3 frequencies must be included in whatever many bands equalizer Mr. FiiO designs for our BTR3s.


----------



## lordaine

FYI: btr3 can easily drive tin audio t2 iem.

Flac+neutron+btr3+t2=


----------



## lordaine

IMHO, what I'm really experiencing right now even for HWA:

https://www.soundguys.com/ldac-ultimate-bluetooth-guide-20026/amp/


----------



## PeterMac (Dec 5, 2018)

HD579 + BTR3 , perfect neutral sound for me.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Is there any ETA on this EQ option being added.
This product has been out long enough now.


----------



## lordaine

YEAHHHHH!!!!!


----------



## MoonbeamTURBO

Joining in. Just got mine last Thursday. So far, I am very happy with the performance. LDAC is very nice. I am also using it as my DAC for my laptop. 

Quick feedback on it is that it sounds a lot cleaner than the headphone out of the laptop, with zero hiss in the background and better detail retrieval. I also find it more open, and it is generally brighter than the laptop's headphone out. 

Also using this a lot for calls. The microphone is excellent. It actually sounds better for me than the in-line mic of my Focal Spirit One. 

I initially bought the BTR3 because of the mic since apparently it has noise cancelling. My laptop's onboars mic is just so bad, it gets all of the noise around the area and it has too much feedback. 

Use cases:

Samsung Galaxy A7 (2017) → Bluetooth LDAC → FiiO BTR3 (Bluetooth mode) → Headphones
ASUS ZenBook UX360UA → USB-C → FiiO BTR3 → Headphones
Headphones:

FlipEars Aiden Dual-Driver BA Custom IEMs
Shure SE215
Focal Spirit One
Feels Pro900 with Custom Cable
On a typical work day, I combine both USB-C mode (to connect to the laptop) and Bluetooth LDAC (to connect to my phone). Music is playing from my laptop, but when I get calls on my phone, it mutes the music from the laptop and audio goes to my phone. This is a super convenient feature and it helps me have a synchronized experience between my laptop and my phone.


----------



## TooPoorForHiFi

Can you connect the BTR3 to your phone via wired and use it like an External Mini DAC/AMP?


----------



## jeffri

MidNighTempest said:


> Can you connect the BTR3 to your phone via wired and use it like an External Mini DAC/AMP?



Yes


----------



## lordaine (Dec 5, 2018)

It defeats the purpose of being a bluetooth wireless dac/amp but hey, it's really a good idea to begin with, cause nothing beats a wired one. It needs to be tested to actually make it work. You probably need a Phone=usb-c to otg adapter(female)(will act like a computer source) BTR3=usb-c to otg adapter(male). Connect them together and see.


----------



## jeffri

Just use an USB-C to USB-C cable. It'll work.


----------



## lordaine

jeffri said:


> Just use an USB-C to USB-C cable. It'll work.



Have you actually tested it? You have any specific brand for this?


----------



## jeffri

Yeah. I have C to C cable from Anker and Mophie, both works fine. I also have short C to C from SXFI amp and works fine as well. The beauty of USB-C. 

Just make sure you get cable that can transfer data, if I remember correctly, Macbook C to C charger cable only transmit power and that won't work.


----------



## highlightshadow

lordaine said:


> It defeats the purpose of being a bluetooth wireless dac/amp but hey, it's really a good idea to begin with, cause nothing beats a wired one. It needs to be tested to actually make it work. You probably need a Phone=usb-c to otg adapter(female)(will act like a computer source) BTR3=usb-c to otg adapter(male). Connect them together and see.


It does to a point with this particular model since the USB mode DAC is limited to 16 bit 44khz - so you're limited to what quality you can get but yes - that's still likely better even that LDAC


----------



## PeterMac (Dec 5, 2018)

@FiiO - any ETA when EQ will be available ?


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> @FiiO - any ETA when EQ will be available ?


No, currently. I will report to the engineer again. 

Best regards


----------



## lurk

Any particular bt dongle I should buy to pair with btr3 for my pc? 

Bt5 or bt4.2 will suffice?


----------



## jmwreck (Dec 7, 2018)

FiiO said:


> No, currently. I will report to the engineer again.
> 
> Best regards



Hi, I just wanna ask since I'm a bit OC with my stuff, does the 3.5mm jack and type-C socket have through hole component or smd?

To everyone, are you concern about plugging in and out on the headphone jack? (not specifically in your BTR3, but on the rest of your devices). I'm using a right angle jack extension.


----------



## ninetylol

Hey got a question regarding the BTR3 as a PC DAC.

Can i connect the BTR3 on Windows 10 as a USB DAC and use it as a bluetooth dongle streaming in LDAC to my Sony WH-1000XM3?

Since there is no LDAC (or even aptX-HD) bluetooth dongle yet this would solve all my problems!

Thanks in advance!


----------



## Tihstea

I recently received a pair of KZ AS10 s. I didn't know this before ordering them, but apparently they are very sensitive IEMs. When connecting them to my phone or pc via a normal cable, they do have some static/hissing noise which is very annoying. I'll be honest, I don't want a separate device just to listen to music, or a bunch of cables between devices, so I've reached the conclusion that I need something like the BTR3. My question is to those of you that own it and have sensitive headphones/earphones - is there any static ? 
Before reaching this forum thread, my other choice would have been shanling m0, but it's a lot more expensive, and I probably wouldn't be using its player options. Also I assume the BTR3 has a much better batterly life.


----------



## rkw

ninetylol said:


> Can i connect the BTR3 on Windows 10 as a USB DAC and use it as a bluetooth dongle streaming in LDAC to my Sony WH-1000XM3?
> 
> Since there is no LDAC (or even aptX-HD) bluetooth dongle yet this would solve all my problems!


No. BTR3 is not a transmitter.

There are aptX HD transmitters, but with optical Toslink input (not USB). If your computer doesn't have Toslink output, you can use a USB to Toslink converter.
https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Receiver-Adapter-Headphone/dp/B07D1JJBJR
https://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Receiver-HiGoing-Digital/dp/B07FSFF3M9
https://www.amazon.com/Signstek-Coaxial-Converter-Convert-Analogue/dp/B00FEDHHKE


----------



## bowei006

Little BTR3 shattered today after I launched it 10 feet away onto solid concrete.






But the little warrior still chugs along 

So yeah PSA... don't launch your BTR3 onto hard ground.


----------



## FiiO

bowei006 said:


> Little BTR3 shattered today after I launched it 10 feet away onto solid concrete.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear about that.

The front panel is made of 2.5D tempered glass. The rigidity is 6H (same as iphone's touch screen). It's not easy to be scratched but please avoid to put it together with keys or other sharp metal objects.

Best regards


----------



## zObiToz

MoonbeamTURBO said:


> Joining in. Just got mine last Thursday. So far, I am very happy with the performance. LDAC is very nice. I am also using it as my DAC for my laptop.
> 
> Quick feedback on it is that it sounds a lot cleaner than the headphone out of the laptop, with zero hiss in the background and better detail retrieval. I also find it more open, and it is generally brighter than the laptop's headphone out.
> 
> ...


Can we use BTR3's mic instead of Laptop's build in mic when using USB DAC mode?


----------



## rkw

zObiToz said:


> Can we use BTR3's mic instead of Laptop's build in mic when using USB DAC mode?


Do the sound settings on your computer show the BTR3 as a USB mic or USB audio input device? If not, then the answer is no.


----------



## MadMusicJunkie

Hello!
 I've downloaded the latest firmware, however, I still find that the microphone quality on phone calls is awful.  I finally had to go back to the BTR1, because it does a pretty good job with calls.
 Is there any way or are there any plans to improve the Mic quality on the BTR3 or should I go ahead and return it?


----------



## highlightshadow

MadMusicJunkie said:


> Hello!
> I've downloaded the latest firmware, however, I still find that the microphone quality on phone calls is awful.  I finally had to go back to the BTR1, because it does a pretty good job with calls.
> Is there any way or are there any plans to improve the Mic quality on the BTR3 or should I go ahead and return it?



I use my btr3 on conference calls all the time and it sounds great. Maybe you got a defective one?


----------



## bowei006

MadMusicJunkie said:


> Hello!
> I've downloaded the latest firmware, however, I still find that the microphone quality on phone calls is awful.  I finally had to go back to the BTR1, because it does a pretty good job with calls.
> Is there any way or are there any plans to improve the Mic quality on the BTR3 or should I go ahead and return it?



Weird. I have good call quality on mine.

Maybe its the connection protocol or cell quality?


----------



## FiiO

zObiToz said:


> Can we use BTR3's mic instead of Laptop's build in mic when using USB DAC mode?


Dear friend,

No, currently.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

MadMusicJunkie said:


> Hello!
> I've downloaded the latest firmware, however, I still find that the microphone quality on phone calls is awful.  I finally had to go back to the BTR1, because it does a pretty good job with calls.
> Is there any way or are there any plans to improve the Mic quality on the BTR3 or should I go ahead and return it?


Dear friend,

The BTR3 is equipped with Qualcomm's cVc noise cancellation technology and automatic gain control. If you are in a louder noise environment(or the BTR3 is too far away, the mic is blocked) , the gain will be increased which may lead to distortion.
You could try to hold the BTR3 and keep close to the microphone for try again.
Our engineers are also trying to improve the microphone quality for the BTR3.

Best regards


----------



## civciv (Dec 17, 2018)

In car use scenario, can BTR3 power up when the car starts and power off when the car stops? Is it possible? (Connected to the USB port of the car for charging)


----------



## cleg

Which BTR is right for you? I've created small comparison video with 3 recent models


----------



## Adityaseven7

Guys I'm observing something I wanna clarify. Any help is appreciated.
I'm using the BTR3 as a USB DAC on my laptop and when I try my HD 660s, the sound is understandably not that great/dynamic and I hear pops and clicks in the music (16 bit wav files). 
It drives my M50x quite well and the sound is much improved in every sense than my laptop's output.It gets quite loud too.

The weird thing is that I hear the same pops/clicks in the M50x as well but to a much lesser degree than the 660s. And its NOT the files. 
I understand that the power output on this is best suited for IEM's and also that the M50x's are not the most efficient headphones around as may be suggested by the rated ohms.

I guess I want to know if this behaviour is due to the amp clipping (it seems like it is) and if I'll damage anything (BTR3 or headphones) if I use it like this for some time?
I am planning on getting an amp in the near future (most probably Fiio A5).


----------



## speedingcheetah

How about just give us the damn EQ......as it was advertised to have!


----------



## FiiO

civciv said:


> In car use scenario, can BTR3 power up when the car starts and power off when the car stops? Is it possible? (Connected to the USB port of the car for charging)


Dear friend,

No, it is not supported by the BTR3.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

speedingcheetah said:


> How about just give us the damn EQ......as it was advertised to have!


Dear friend,

Our engineers will try their best to add EQ for BTR3 in the FiiO Music as soon as possible.

Best regards


----------



## sebox

Dear Fiio, can you also ask your engineers to make one important improvement?

Now with single device connection mode a double short-click of a "Power" button works like Play/Pause, it mapped as consistency:
code 127 (KEYCODE_MEDIA_PAUSE)
code 126 (KEYCODE_MEDIA_PLAY)

And it is completely useless for this button assignment in single device connection mode.

It will be very good and correctly to assign this "Power" button to the following:

single short-click of a "Power" button   - code 87 (KEYCODE_MEDIA_NEXT)
double short-click of a "Power" button - code 88 (KEYCODE_MEDIA_PREVIOUS)

Then it would be very convenient to control the switching of tracks, holding BTR3 in hand with a cable hanging down from the fist.

If the doubleclick cannot be changed due to compatibility with multiconnection mode, then at least one single short-click assignment for KEYCODE_MEDIA_NEXT can greatly improve usability.

Who agree, join the request!


----------



## FiiO

sebox said:


> Dear Fiio, can you also ask your engineers to make one important improvement?
> 
> Now with single device connection mode a double short-click of a "Power" button works like Play/Pause, it mapped as consistency:
> code 127 (KEYCODE_MEDIA_PAUSE)
> ...


Dear friend,

For Switching the music files, you could hold the volume button for about 2s instead.
We could try to report your feedback to our engineer. But we may not add your design in the BTR3 currently.

Best regards


----------



## sebox

FiiO said:


> For Switching the music files, you could hold the volume button for about 2s instead.



Thank you for your prompt reply. I know about hold the volume button for about 2s, and I use it all the time. But it is not convenient to do this when the receiver is in the hand and in the pocket of the jacket. I asked not to change the existing key layout, but simply add one additional command for the Power button short-click. I hope you understood this correctly 
This mapping could also be activated by the checkbox in FiiO Music app.


----------



## civciv

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> No, it is not supported by the BTR3.
> 
> Best regards



I guess an app update can do the job. It can't be that hard to implement this feature. 5V OK, then turn on the device. No 5V, then turn off the device.


----------



## tiptop8125 (Dec 19, 2018)

Hi,

Does it work with headset remote (volume, start stop + microphone)?

I updated the firmware, but the music app can still not find the unit, any ideas? Should I restart the phone? I’ve restarted the BTR3 many times.

I’m very happy with the unit, but the microphone is not performing very well. I tried using it in my car today and I had to resort to speaker phone. From what I read this is not expected?

This question might’ve been asked, sorry!


----------



## rkw (Dec 19, 2018)

tiptop8125 said:


> Does it work with headset remote (volume, start stop + microphone)?


No, it has a TRS jack, only audio output. Only the microphone on the BTR3 itself will work.


----------



## FiiO

civciv said:


> I guess an app update can do the job. It can't be that hard to implement this feature. 5V OK, then turn on the device. No 5V, then turn off the device.


Dear friend,

Thanks for your kind feedback. 
However, adding this function may lead to other problem in other function. And we don't consider adding it for the BTR3 currently. We will report to our product manage and check the feasibility in our new products.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

tiptop8125 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Does it work with headset remote (volume, start stop + microphone)?
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

Only the microphone and control on the BTR3 itself will work when using with the in-line remote control headphone.

You are using iPhone or Android one? Please try to reconnect and reset the BTR3 to see if it helps? Are you using the latest music APP version?

Best regards


----------



## speedingcheetah

Is there a Bluetooth 4.2 or even better a 5.0 USB adapter dongle I can get for my PC so that the BRT3  will connect and also do LDAC?

The built in Bluetooth on my laptop via the Intel wifi card is BT 4.2 and with Win 10, the BRT3 shows AptX in use.


----------



## Ggroch

speedingcheetah said:


> Is there a Bluetooth 4.2 or even better a 5.0 USB adapter dongle I can get for my PC so that the BRT3  will connect and also do LDAC?



I do not think so.  I have looked, and found nothing.


----------



## Yukicore (Dec 21, 2018)

Hello, Head-Fi 'ers

I come disappointed after purchasing Fiio BTR1K, it's a good product, for the most part, it does it's job, I guess. Signal is great, no hiccups at all on steady streaming. Sadly, that's not it..
At first I thought that was just being paranoid, because it sounded great, I did expect sound degradation, from my research, and I thought it was minimal. I was excited for the new product.
Days went by, and then I realized that it's not right, I don't get the same feel for the music, it sounds harsh and distorted. Comparing and going back and forth between my desktop Dac/amp, usb-c dac/amp and this bluetooth receiver, going through longer sessions just listening to music, not overly analyzing, I confirmed my worries.

A quick hearing test proves more difficult to reveal, but when you finally relax your earholes and start to enjoy the music, it's just not there (yet, for bluetooth)
Even in MP3 320kbps (which I found difficult but possible to distinguish from FLAC 16/44.1) I heard noticeable degradation and artifacting.
Between MP3 320 and FLAC, distinguishing for me is definitely not consistent, maybe cause of my hearing, maybe cause of my equipment, maybe because of the music that I listen, which isn't emphasized for sounding Hi-Fi, but Hi-Fi enough to tell Analog from Bluetooth audio.

So my question is, do the more advanced codecs on BTR3 work better than APTX and SBC(even worse) on my BTR1K?


----------



## jeffri

In my experience, yes, LDAC sounds considerably better than aptX. Even the aptX HD is quite an improvement.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Yukicore said:


> Hello, Head-Fi 'ers
> 
> I come disappointed after purchasing Fiio BTR1K, it's a good product, for the most part, it does it's job, I guess. Signal is great, no hiccups at all on steady streaming. Sadly, that's not it..
> At first I thought that was just being paranoid, because it sounded great, I did expect sound degradation, from my research, and I thought it was minimal. I was excited for the new product.
> ...



I, for one, hear a HUGE difference in sound quality from AptX to LDAC.  So much so, I won't use BT audio unless its LDAC, which means it has to be a Sony headphone, or a adapter, like the BTR3 that supports it. 
I first discovered the amazing difference in BT codecs when Google updated the OS on my 1st gen Pixel a couple years ago and included LDAC support. 
SBC and AAC is trash. Even with my vehicles Kenwood head unit, when it defaults to SBC, switching to AptX makes a very noticeable difference in sound quality.
But LDAC is still the top codec for Bluetooth.

If you are using the BTR3 in USB DAC mode, that is wired mode, note that it only works in 16/48 mode, not 24/96.   IMO, as a USB DAC, the BTR3 is lacking. I find the Fiio Alpen 2 E17K to sound far superior.


----------



## KKFA

speedingcheetah said:


> I, for one, hear a HUGE difference in sound quality from AptX to LDAC.  So much so, I won't use BT audio unless its LDAC, which means it has to be a Sony headphone, or a adapter, like the BTR3 that supports it.
> I first discovered the amazing difference in BT codecs when Google updated the OS on my 1st gen Pixel a couple years ago and included LDAC support.
> SBC and AAC is trash. Even with my vehicles Kenwood head unit, when it defaults to SBC, switching to AptX makes a very noticeable difference in sound quality.
> But LDAC is still the top codec for Bluetooth.
> ...



Totally agree on LDAC being the superior codec for now. 

That's why I am straining my neck for the 8.1 update to my Hiby R6 so that I can use LDAC Bluetooth.


----------



## Yukicore (Dec 22, 2018)

speedingcheetah said:


> I, for one, hear a HUGE difference in sound quality from AptX to LDAC.  So much so, I won't use BT audio unless its LDAC, which means it has to be a Sony headphone, or a adapter, like the BTR3 that supports it.
> I first discovered the amazing difference in BT codecs when Google updated the OS on my 1st gen Pixel a couple years ago and included LDAC support.
> SBC and AAC is trash. Even with my vehicles Kenwood head unit, when it defaults to SBC, switching to AptX makes a very noticeable difference in sound quality.
> But LDAC is still the top codec for Bluetooth.
> ...



I guess I ought to wait for a *not confirmed* BTR3K aka updated BTR3.
Micro USB just doesn't work for me, I need USB-C so I can use the same cable for everything, and Bluetooth 5.0 for more stable connection, as I've heard 4.2 is struggling.

It's sad that the BTR1K didn't work out for me, I heard great things about it. And I thought I wouldn't have been able to hear a difference, or hear enough of a difference, if most of my music is 320MP3 or M4A.

Would You say that LDAC is indistinguishable from wired connection? Say at similar level the 320MP3 is to FLAC, obviously there are losses, just that APTX sound more like something of a 128kbps MP3 in some frequency ranges.


----------



## KKFA

Yukicore said:


> I guess I ought to wait for a *not confirmed* BTR3K aka updated BTR3.
> Micro USB just doesn't work for me, I need USB-C so I can use the same cable for everything, and Bluetooth 5.0 for more stable connection, as I've heard 4.2 is struggling.
> 
> It's sad that the BTR1K didn't work out for me, I heard great things about it. And I thought I wouldn't have been able to hear a difference, or hear enough of a difference, if most of my music is 320MP3 or M4A.
> ...



BTR3 uses USB C.


----------



## digititus

I find the BTR3 has very stable connection with LDAC. Sound quality is excellent. Very happy with this purchase and I use it daily.


----------



## minimalist82

Yukicore said:


> I guess I ought to wait for a *not confirmed* BTR3K aka updated BTR3.
> Micro USB just doesn't work for me, I need USB-C so I can use the same cable for everything, and Bluetooth 5.0 for more stable connection, as I've heard 4.2 is struggling.
> 
> It's sad that the BTR1K didn't work out for me, I heard great things about it. And I thought I wouldn't have been able to hear a difference, or hear enough of a difference, if most of my music is 320MP3 or M4A.
> ...



Hi there,

I haven’t used the BTR1K, but have been using the BTR3 for a few months now and I love it. This product has really changed my perception of what is possible with Bluetooth audio. My personal view is that you shouldn’t get too hung up on the codecs either. I have been using AAC to my iPhone and LDAC to my Samsung S8 and both sound fantastic. On both devices I’m mainly streaming Apple Music.

You mention that you need USB-C, well the BTR3 has it! 

I also think you shouldn’t worry too much about Bluetooth 4.2 vs Bluetooth 5. Most of the benefits of the new version are not audio related and I find the BTR3 pretty stable in normal use.

From what I read, the BTR3 should tick all of the boxes in terms of your needs. As long as you are being sensible about the headphones you use with it, then you should be really happy with it! I would say if you are not, then perhaps your expectations of what is possible for a product at this price point may be unrealistic.

Just my thoughts!


----------



## tom1l21

in addition to using the BTR3 via Bluetooth, I am  looking to use it wired with my Pixel 2. If I use this device via USB-C as a wired DAC, will the BTR3 stay charged via my Pixel 2's battery? Also, how is sound quality when using as wired DAC vs Bluetooth?


----------



## Yukicore

minimalist82 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I haven’t used the BTR1K, but have been using the BTR3 for a few months now and I love it. This product has really changed my perception of what is possible with Bluetooth audio. My personal view is that you shouldn’t get too hung up on the codecs either. I have been using AAC to my iPhone and LDAC to my Samsung S8 and both sound fantastic. On both devices I’m mainly streaming Apple Music.
> 
> ...


But what about the statements that Bluetooth 5 has presumably 2X the performance/throughput, 4X the distance, and more stable signal. I mean, it's probably not that much of a difference in real life, but still.
I've read some controversial posts about LDAC, and if it also has bluetooth stuttering, and can't handle the maximum 990kbps bandwidth, it's probably not worth it to me. There are people saying that at the lowest setting 330kbps, LDAC sounds worse than SBC. And unfortunately Pixel 3 defaults to that setting, for some reason, I have a Pixel 2 XL. That doesn't exactly boost up my confidence, and yes, I know that you can change it.


----------



## MarkF786

Has anyone compared the BTR3 to the Q5?  I’m curious if stepping up to one of the larger Bluetooth amps brings much improvement in sound quality. Maybe for high impedance headphones it would, but my primary use case is IEMs.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Yukicore said:


> But what about the statements that Bluetooth 5 has presumably 2X the performance/throughput, 4X the distance, and more stable signal. I mean, it's probably not that much of a difference in real life, but still.
> I've read some controversial posts about LDAC, and if it also has bluetooth stuttering, and can't handle the maximum 990kbps bandwidth, it's probably not worth it to me. There are people saying that at the lowest setting 330kbps, LDAC sounds worse than SBC. And unfortunately Pixel 3 defaults to that setting, for some reason, I have a Pixel 2 XL. That doesn't exactly boost up my confidence, and yes, I know that you can change it.



The lowest 330Kbps in NOT the default setting on Pixel phones. Best Effort mode is.

I have had no issues with my 1st Gen Pixel XL and now my Pixel 3 phone with LDAC set to the best quality setting(annoying that setting does not stick, and reverts to default when you disconnect)
Keep in mind, and this should be common sense/obvious point, but in order to successfully push that much bandwidth, you must stay at close range...so you will get studding/skipping if you move to far away.
That is the point of the default mode, "Best Effort" setting, where it dynamically adjusts.

The BTR3 and my Pixel 3 set to Highest Quality in Dev settings is amazing. I have 2 different sets of Sony built in LDAC headphones, and they will cut out when i walk out of the room, but the BTR3 connected to the same headphones via wired, works with no issues around my entire medium sized 4 room apartment unit.


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> The BTR3 and my Pixel 3 set to Highest Quality in Dev settings is amazing.


Agreed.


----------



## rkw

Yukicore said:


> But what about the statements that Bluetooth 5 has presumably 2X the performance/throughput, 4X the distance, and more stable signal.


Bluetooth 5 didn't update audio streaming, which continues to operate with the same performance as before. The improvements were for devices such as wearables and IOT devices that do short bursts of data, not continuous streaming. Improvements for Bluetooth audio won't happen until they update the audio protocol. Meanwhile, manufacturers are using chipsets that happen to support Bluetooth 5, and they are happy to advertise that their product supports BT5 even though there is no improvement in audio streaming.


----------



## Darkestred

Anyone run any tests for battery usage difference between LDAC and APTxHD?  I mean for my use LDAC sounded a little better but nothing to go hog-wild about.  But, i do like a litle more sound in the mix.


----------



## Yukicore

rkw said:


> Bluetooth 5 didn't update audio streaming, which continues to operate with the same performance as before. The improvements were for devices such as wearables and IOT devices that do short bursts of data, not continuous streaming. Improvements for Bluetooth audio won't happen until they update the audio protocol. Meanwhile, manufacturers are using chipsets that happen to support Bluetooth 5, and they are happy to advertise that their product supports BT5 even though there is no improvement in audio streaming.


Yeah, I was thinking about this too, when I wrote the comment. I wonder if it's the same case with Fiio too. But to be fair, as much as it could be codec related more than range, I saw a video of a guy testing this, both of the Fiios were there, and BTR1K really had ~30m signal, while BTR3 had the advertised ~10m, I think he was using LDAC and probably the default best effort mode.


----------



## FiiO

tom1l21 said:


> in addition to using the BTR3 via Bluetooth, I am  looking to use it wired with my Pixel 2. If I use this device via USB-C as a wired DAC, will the BTR3 stay charged via my Pixel 2's battery? Also, how is sound quality when using as wired DAC vs Bluetooth?


Dear friend,

We could not confirm whether the DAC function of the BTR3 could be compatible with your mobile phone.

But there is a Charge option (ON/OFF) for BTR3 in FiiO Music.

_Note: After the setting is changed,  it will take affect after re-plugging the USB cable.  The Charge option will be set to ON automatically if BTR3 is in low battery condition._

You could turn on this function for not charging the BTR3 when connecting to usb apply.

Best regards


----------



## Huxley

Couple questions, what's the battery life like for each codec?
Also did anyone have trouble with apps, works fine with most codecs but on hwa or ldac if i change players or apps it didn't always carry the audio, i find myself having to disconnect to wake it up.


----------



## FiiO

Huxley said:


> Couple questions, what's the battery life like for each codec?
> Also did anyone have trouble with apps, works fine with most codecs but on hwa or ldac if i change players or apps it didn't always carry the audio, i find myself having to disconnect to wake it up.


Dear friend,

For LDAC or APTX, the battery life is 1-2 hours shorter than AAC generally.
What's the firmware version of your BTR3? You may try to update the firmware to see if it helps.

Best regards


----------



## Huxley

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> For LDAC or APTX, the battery life is 1-2 hours shorter than AAC generally.
> What's the firmware version of your BTR3? You may try to update the firmware to see if it helps.
> ...




How do i go about updating the firmware?


----------



## BenKatz

I'm wondering, did anyone compare it, with sound coming from direct USB or LDAC BT, to the Dragonfly Red?

I know the Dragonfly should be superior, but i'm wondering how it compares, how far back is it in terms of sq (especially soundstage).


----------



## highlightshadow

Anyone in UK after one of these...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FiiO-BTR...h=item4b5995bcfe:g:Ts4AAOSwCtNbzxH8:rk:3:pf:0

AdvancedMP3Players have it for £54 and eBay have POWPOW15 site-wide discount ... so a BTR3 for £46!


----------



## archy121

highlightshadow said:


> Anyone in UK after one of these...
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FiiO-BTR...h=item4b5995bcfe:g:Ts4AAOSwCtNbzxH8:rk:3:pf:0
> 
> AdvancedMP3Players have it for £54 and eBay have POWPOW15 site-wide discount ... so a BTR3 for £46!




It expired at 8PM and I jumped in at 7:59PM lol

Cheers


----------



## highlightshadow

archy121 said:


> It expired at 8PM and I jumped in at 7:59PM lol
> 
> Cheers


AWesome - winner!!!
Was a total bargain at that price


----------



## archy121

highlightshadow said:


> AWesome - winner!!!
> Was a total bargain at that price


 
I had planned to stop buying anything else for a good while after my recent audio spree that went out of control... but at this price was too good to ignore. At least no more confusion to buy this or es100.


----------



## highlightshadow

archy121 said:


> I had planned to stop buying anything else for a good while after my recent audio spree that went out of control... but at this price was too good to ignore. At least no more confusion to buy this or es100.



It's an addiction 
But deffo a good quality bargain - you'll be happy with it


----------



## LibiSC

I read the first pages and got confused. I know the 1/8 rule for amps and headphones. Btr3 has 0.333 output impedancd according to fiio. Why it shouldnt be usef with a 5 ohm iem?


----------



## Paulnguy3

Purchased my btr3 a few months for wireless exercise with my final e4000. However I’m falling out of love with it as it can annoy me more times than none(used to neckbuds). Besides the slight clunkiness, the amp is powers the iems very well. 

Let me know if anyone wants. Will include Fiio short cable as well.


----------



## PeterMac

FiiO start selling replacement battery for BTR3, you start selling silicone cover, but battery replacment would be better idea.

When we will get Equalizer ?


----------



## BenKatz

PeterMac said:


> FiiO start selling replacement battery for BTR3, you start selling silicone cover, but battery replacment would be better idea.
> 
> When we will get Equalizer ?



Wondering the same thing. This is exactly what's missing. An EQ to -slightly- bump up the low freq and recess the 4 to 6k ranges to give the sound a tad more soundstage.


----------



## speedingcheetah

PeterMac said:


> FiiO start selling replacement battery for BTR3, you start selling silicone cover, but battery replacment would be better idea.
> 
> When we will get Equalizer ?



Do you have a link to a English (USA) page where one can buy this case for the BTR3?
The only page I can find direct for Fiio is all in Chineese when you change language to English. and I do not find the case (SK-BTR3) on Ebay or Amazon.

Yes, and still very much waiting for an EQ to be activated on this product.
I find it quite unacceptable and ridiculous that they even released the product with such a feature "Still under development" where as most other BT adapters and good BT headphones themselves have such a feature already at launch.


----------



## BenKatz

speedingcheetah said:


> Do you have a link to a English (USA) page where one can buy this case for the BTR3?
> The only page I can find direct for Fiio is all in Chineese when you change language to English. and I do not find the case (SK-BTR3) on Ebay or Amazon.
> 
> Yes, and still very much waiting for an EQ to be activated on this product.
> I find it quite unacceptable and ridiculous that they even released the product with such a feature "Still under development" where as most other BT adapters and good BT headphones themselves have such a feature already at launch.



https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20181230061612&SearchText=btr3+case


----------



## speedingcheetah

BenKatz said:


> https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20181230061612&SearchText=btr3+case



Thanks...but how about from a reputable site?
Ali Express is a SCAM!  You never get what you order, and no one at their customer service cares or can help. Myself and my boss and several others i know have had the same experience.
Don't believe me, there are many complaints on ripoff report and BBB regarding them.


----------



## Ggroch

Wow, suddenly a lot of very angry new users on this thread. I have purchased dozens of items from Ali...not likely I will change my opinion based on a new poster with 8 posts, even if his boss agrees. 

Sure an equalizer would be nice...but do you think the same tech who works on the firmware took time off to create a silicone case?  Its just a Bluetooth adapter guys.  Chill.


----------



## crabdog

speedingcheetah said:


> Thanks...but how about from a reputable site?
> Ali Express is a SCAM!  You never get what you order, and no one at their customer service cares or can help. Myself and my boss and several others i know have had the same experience.
> Don't believe me, there are many complaints on ripoff report and BBB regarding them.


Both of the storefronts listed there have been open for 4-5 years and have excellent feedback ratings. I have made over 30 purchases on AliExpress and have received every single item I paid for without exception.


----------



## BenKatz

speedingcheetah said:


> Thanks...but how about from a reputable site?
> Ali Express is a SCAM!  You never get what you order, and no one at their customer service cares or can help. Myself and my boss and several others i know have had the same experience.
> Don't believe me, there are many complaints on ripoff report and BBB regarding them.



I literally never got scammed off aliexpress and whenever there was an issue i got quick refunds.

Do as you please. I got scammed on ebay though.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Ggroch said:


> Wow, suddenly a lot of very angry new users on this thread. I have purchased dozens of items from Ali...not likely I will change my opinion based on a new poster with 8 posts, even if his boss agrees.
> 
> Sure an equalizer would be nice...but do you think the same tech who works on the firmware took time off to create a silicone case?  Its just a Bluetooth adapter guys.  Chill.





crabdog said:


> Both of the storefronts listed there have been open for 4-5 years and have excellent feedback ratings. I have made over 30 purchases on AliExpress and have received every single item I paid for without exception.





BenKatz said:


> I literally never got scammed off aliexpress and whenever there was an issue i got quick refunds.
> 
> Do as you please. I got scammed on ebay though.



I may be a new user to this forum....but that is irrelevant. And I am not imposing any anger, merely stating a fact and asking for another option.
I and many others, Internet reviews as well, state that particular site is terrible for multiple reasons. But that is an off topic discussion not relevant to this thread.

Even if I was so inclined to order from that site, the only option it seems to get this case, I do not find it acceptable to wait 9 days for the order to process then the 25-35 days shipping to get to me.
I have ordered things on Ebay from China or Hong Kong and the longest they have ever taken to get to me here in USA is 14 days with the free or cheapest shipping option.
I ordered my Fiio BTR3 off Amazon, and it was delivered the next day, for free.

Anyway, I am miffed that the EQ is not enabled, as it was advertised to have it and that was specifically what I was looking for. I could have bought/tried some other brand, but I really like my other Fiio USB only  DAC E17K (and that has Bass and Treble adjust) and I had assumed that this Fiio product would be just as good in build quality and sound quality. To which it is, but I can not use it fully for its intended purpose, without the system wide EQ ability. And who knows if Fiio will ever finished "developing" the feature..


----------



## caprimulgus

speedingcheetah said:


> Even if I was so inclined to order from that site, the only option it seems to get this case, I do not find it acceptable to wait 9 days for the order to process then the 25-35 days shipping to get to me.
> I have ordered things on Ebay from China or Hong Kong and the longest they have ever taken to get to me here in USA is 14 days with the free or cheapest shipping option.
> I ordered my Fiio BTR3 off Amazon, and it was delivered the next day, for free.



Then don't buy it.

FWIW, I've had more items from Amazon not turn up than I have from AliExpress. So Amazon is a SCAM!


----------



## Paulnguy3

speedingcheetah said:


> Thanks...but how about from a reputable site?
> Ali Express is a SCAM!  You never get what you order, and no one at their customer service cares or can help. Myself and my boss and several others i know have had the same experience.
> Don't believe me, there are many complaints on ripoff report and BBB regarding them.



Negative. It may take a month or two to come, but always seems to make it IME.


----------



## Adityaseven7

I too would like to know if any kind of cases will ever be available in India on Fiio's own site?
Been waiting for it since I bought the BTR3 right at launch. It's sturdy but has glass for god's sake.
 I hope fiio provides them or at least distributes the 3rd party ones through their own channel and make them available on their website.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Isn't it a bit steep to pay 15USD for a case for a device that costs 80 bucks?


----------



## KKFA

I thought it was for a set of 6 colours? So that would be 2.5 a pop. Not that extravagant I guess.


----------



## speedingcheetah

KKFA said:


> I thought it was for a set of 6 colours? So that would be 2.5 a pop. Not that extravagant I guess.



If that is the case, then I am a bit surprised that some folks havn't sold off on ebay the individual cases they do not want.
I just want the black one.


----------



## FiiO

Huxley said:


> How do i go about updating the firmware?


Dear friend,

You could read this for help: 
Instruction of Upgrading the firmware for the BTR3

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

BenKatz said:


> Wondering the same thing. This is exactly what's missing. An EQ to -slightly- bump up the low freq and recess the 4 to 6k ranges to give the sound a tad more soundstage.


Dear friend,

If everything goes well, the EQ function will be added in early March.

Best regards


----------



## KKFA

speedingcheetah said:


> If that is the case, then I am a bit surprised that some folks havn't sold off on ebay the individual cases they do not want.
> I just want the black one.


Hahaha, maybe black is only one no body wants to sell.


----------



## shockdude

Got a BTR3 over Christmas. The prospect of having an all-in-one BT adapter/USB DAC/IEM amp was too good to ignore, and overall it works great.

There's one severe fault that I've found: the USB DAC has noticeable latency. It's ~50ms laggier than my laptop's headphone out. This surprised me, since the AptX-LL latency is also ~50ms and I expected the USB DAC latency to at least beat that.
Is it possible for a future FW update to decrease the USB DAC latency?


----------



## speedingcheetah

shockdude said:


> There's one severe fault that I've found: the USB DAC has noticeable latency. It's ~50ms laggier than my laptop's headphone out.



Must just be your laptop???

I have not any latency issues with my Win 10 laptop, desktop, or when using in USB DAC mode on any of my mobile devices. And i watch lots of videos, many with people talking where I would easy notice latency.


----------



## shockdude (Jan 4, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> Must just be your laptop???
> 
> I have not any latency issues with my Win 10 laptop, desktop, or when using in USB DAC mode on any of my mobile devices. And i watch lots of videos, many with people talking where I would easy notice latency.


I'm finding audio to be slightly late in videos, but I'm used to the laptop's headphone out and 50ms is pretty subtle, so I'm not surprised that you don't notice it.
I play rhythm games (Stepmania, Clone Hero), where even 20ms audio latency is immediately noticeable. I measured the BTR3's latency using Stepmania's in-game calibration.
I could capture a more precise latency measurement using Audacity, but that takes time.


----------



## Manwue

Hi to all,

Does anyone have tried to connect it via bluetooth with an AVR. I cannot connect it with my marantz SR6009. I am trying to pair it with my AVR but my AVR cannot find it.


----------



## FiiO

Manwue said:


> Hi to all,
> 
> Does anyone have tried to connect it via bluetooth with an AVR. I cannot connect it with my marantz SR6009. I am trying to pair it with my AVR but my AVR cannot find it.


Dear friend,

The BTR3 doesn't have Bluetooth output. The marantz SR6009 you mentioned need a Bluetooth input, right? The BTR3 is not suitable in this situation. 

Best regards


----------



## Manwue

Ok thanks


----------



## Manwue

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The BTR3 doesn't have Bluetooth output. The marantz SR6009 you mentioned need a Bluetooth input, right? The BTR3 is not suitable in this situation.
> 
> Best regards



Ok thanks.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Is there any technical difference in the raw DAC chips that this used in this BTR3 vs the USB only DAC the Alpen 2 E17K?
Does one have a "better" DAC than the other?

The E17K does sound better to me, but that is probably because it has built in Bass and Treble adjust.


----------



## shockdude (Jan 5, 2019)

I properly measured and compared the BTR3 DAC latency against the headphone outs on 2 laptops: my primary Windows 10 laptop and a much older Windows 7 laptop. Both produced near- identical latency numbers.
For both the BTR3 and the headphone out, I used Audacity to play a click track through a speaker and recorded the playback through the laptop mic. The time difference between the clicks in each recording = latency difference.
Interestingly, the latency depended on the Windows audio API.

WASAPI: ~32ms over laptop out.
MME: ~32ms over laptop out.
DirectSound: ~55ms over laptop out <-- this is pretty bad, many video games use DirectSound and 55ms is over 3 frames of delay @ 60FPS.

Really wish the BTR3 had lower latency, like <20ms.
At the same time, there's a good chance this is just Windows latency. Wish I had another USB DAC to compare.


----------



## Brooko (Jan 5, 2019)

The BTR3 uses an AK4376A - details of performance here : https://www.fiio.com/btr3_parameters

The E17K uses the older TI PCM5102 chipset - details of performance here : http://www.fiio.net/en/products/38/parameters

Both deliver performance beyond our ability to hear.  My advice - buy the device with the features you need for usability.  Don't worry about the specs on the DAC.  I have both - they both sound great.



speedingcheetah said:


> Is there any technical difference in the raw DAC chips that this used in this BTR3 vs the USB only DAC the Alpen 2 E17K?
> Does one have a "better" DAC than the other?
> 
> The E17K does sound better to me, but that is probably because it has built in Bass and Treble adjust.


----------



## rkw

speedingcheetah said:


> Is there any technical difference in the raw DAC chips that this used in this BTR3 vs the USB only DAC the Alpen 2 E17K?
> Does one have a "better" DAC than the other?
> 
> The E17K does sound better to me, but that is probably because it has built in Bass and Treble adjust.


They have different amps, which probably make more of a difference than their DACs. There are a lot of factors that affect the sound quality of a device.


----------



## speedingcheetah

rkw said:


> They have different amps, which probably make more of a difference than their DACs. There are a lot of factors that affect the sound quality of a device.



Yea that what i meant, DACs and the AMPs that are in them...how are they different. what one is "better"


----------



## Brooko

Define better?

What is it you are trying to use the device for?  What headphones do you need to drive?  What features do you need?


----------



## speedingcheetah (Jan 5, 2019)

Brooko said:


> Define better?
> 
> What is it you are trying to use the device for?  What headphones do you need to drive?  What features do you need?



I mentioned all that in a previous post while back...guess it got buried.
Pixel 3 via USB (but I do also occasionally use on PC)
I use Poweramp V3 music player app.
Most of my media files are FLAC, or Wav. some are 24bit.
Headphones are Vmoda Crossfade Wireless (1st gen) in wired mode.
I own both the E17K and the BTR3

Features? Well, the E17K has built in LCD that allows user to adjust things like Bass, Treble, Gain...etc. Which i prefer as this an EQ adjust on the DAC level, so that other sources like video players apps that do not have its own EQ will greatly benefit from the DACs EQ. The BTR3 is supposed to have an EQ, but I did not know until after I purchased it that Fiio has not developed and enabled it yet..and wont until at least March.

The BTR3 i got for times when i want to use BT wireless LDAC, as the BT chip in the headphones themselves are terrible(no AptX), but since the BTR3 has a wired mode, was hoping to use that too. But with out an EQ ability on the DAC, I find myslef using the E17K when i want the best sound and wired. But I was just wondering on raw technical level, what hardware is better specs wise and audio quality wise. I do not know enough about all the meanings of the raw technical specs and circuit board diagrams to determine my self.  Wanting to hear from more advanced audio guys or audiophiles as to the differences.

I had heard also that a usb dac called Dragonfly Red was very highly rated for audio quality..but the ones I looked at were much more expensive...$200 or so.


----------



## Brooko

For power output, the E17K has approx 8 times the power of the tiny BTR3.  Crosstalk is about the same.  BTR3 is limited to 16/48 via USB.  E17K supports up to 32/96 over USB and up to 24/192 via coax.

BTR3 has Bluetooth - E17K does not.

E17K has better gain management and of course the treble controls.

As far as which "sounds better" - that is completely subjective, and only you can tell that.

My advice - use the BTR3 for ultra-portability and for wireless.  Use the E17K for everything else.  But it depends on your usage scenario.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Jan 5, 2019)

Brooko said:


> E17K supports up to 32/96 over USB


That is an issue for me with my Pixel 3 however. It only works in 16/48 says the LCD display.
Where as, on my 1st Gen Pixel XL, the LCD reports 24/96, and Poweramp says it is outputting 32/96 (and it does sound a bit better)


----------



## archy121 (Jan 7, 2019)

I received the BT3 today and successfully tested connectivity with my LG TV (APTX/APTXLL) and than LG V30 (LDAC).

I was relieved to find no lipsync issues when connected to TV & viewing YouTube and Netflix HD tracks. With the phone the sound was fuller and more detailed - very good CD quality like with FLAC files. Further listening needed to evalutae quality.

I than went to try and test it with my iPhone XS and ran into trouble.
Although the BT3 unit is showing as connected to iPhone no music can be streamed to it.
I have tried FIIO Player, Apple Music, Spotify and Tidal and None of them show the BT3 as audio output device. Only iPhone shows up. See screen shot.

I have reconnected and connected the BT3 in settings and it connects fine. In fact I can press and hold the special BT3 Button and it invokes Siri so it’s definitlly connected but just not as a BT audio device.

Anybody know what’s going on ?

Is it because the TV and LG phone are already paired and I need to reset the BT3 ?

——** EDIT **——

Mysteriously started working with iPhone. Not sure if
I accidentally reset something or just plain old Gremlins playing up ?


----------



## McLambo (Jan 8, 2019)

hopefully someone can help me out, or clear things up for me.

Long story short: I ended up with the BTR3 through amazon, very satisfied with the increase in sound quality over my mobile phone's 3,5mm out jack
I decided to invest in somewhat higher quality AKG in-ear plugs. (N20) 
Especially trebble tones are really sparkling in my ears, almost iches :0
So, sounds good so far, right? Well here is the issue I'm having:
Recently my phone received an upgrade to Android Pie, and all of a sudden the BTR3 connects using APT-X HD. (you can see the toast message when connecting)
there is a very small, but clear difference in quality noticeable between using the LDAC and APT-X HD codec.

Especially in the frequency range where singers sound there ' ssstt, ttt ' tones at the end of words
Using the APT-X HD (and also non HD coded) I can clearly hear compression gibbering in the before-mentioned higher frequency ranges.
And this frustrates me a lot, even to the point that I rather not listen at all, then be irritated by this flaw.

You know how this works: once you've heard it, you cannot un-hear it, and notice it everytime.
So I'm either stuck using LDAC and accept the stuttering, and disconnects or use APT-X HD and accept the compression noises...
Or is there maybe another way to enjoy problem-less LDAC playback?? I want to be able to stay mobile, so a desktop DAC is not really an option


----------



## archy121

speedingcheetah said:


> The lowest 330Kbps in NOT the default setting on Pixel phones. Best Effort mode is.
> 
> I have had no issues with my 1st Gen Pixel XL and now my Pixel 3 phone with LDAC set to the best quality setting(annoying that setting does not stick, and reverts to default when you disconnect)
> Keep in mind, and this should be common sense/obvious point, but in order to successfully push that much bandwidth, you must stay at close range...so you will get studding/skipping if you move to far away.
> ...




Glad I came across your post. 
I been experiencing same issues with LDAC settings not sticking in Dev Options on the LG V30. I guess it’s an Android issue and I shouldn’t be hating on the LG. Thanks


----------



## borrego

I did Android 8.0 upgrade with my LG V20 phone during Christmas holidays and can use LDAC with the BTR3 now. Apart from the slight sound improvement, I also found the Android 8.0/LDAC connection more stable comparing to the Android 7.0/aptx-HD connection (both usng Google Play Music playing lossless FLAC). So I think the phone OS also play a major part for connection stability.


----------



## tom1l21

I recently got the BTR3 and it sounds great on my Pixel 2. However, I have a lingering question:

Is there a difference in sound quality between using bluetooth (LDAC or APTx HD) or USB DAC through my pixel 2? Moreover, is there any limitations in available codec, Sample rate, and Bits/sample between either bluetooth or USB-DAC?​In my experience, it appears the latter settings found in the developer settings of android are different if either in bluetooth or USB DAC.


----------



## McLambo

McLambo said:


> hopefully someone can help me out, or clear things up for me.
> 
> Long story short: I ended up with the BTR3 through amazon, very satisfied with the increase in sound quality over my mobile phone's 3,5mm out jack
> I decided to invest in somewhat higher quality AKG in-ear plugs. (N20)
> ...




Shortened my previous post, so that it is hopefully better to understand. Anyone who can help me out?


----------



## speedingcheetah

McLambo said:


> Shortened my previous post, so that it is hopefully better to understand. Anyone who can help me out?


If you are having studdering or issues...its more than likely the phone you have...which u never stated what model it is.
If it is an older ish model phone, that just got Pie...then the hardware may not be well suited for the new Bluetooth codecs.

Also, try using a different media player app. I use PowerAmp v3 pro and have it set so that USB and BT devices output with OpenSL ES Hi-Res, instead of the stock AudioTrack Java, or non HD output.


----------



## McLambo

speedingcheetah said:


> If you are having studdering or issues...its more than likely the phone you have...which u never stated what model it is.
> If it is an older ish model phone, that just got Pie...then the hardware may not be well suited for the new Bluetooth codecs.
> 
> Also, try using a different media player app. I use PowerAmp v3 pro and have it set so that USB and BT devices output with OpenSL ES Hi-Res, instead of the stock AudioTrack Java, or non HD output.


It's a Nokia 8

Thanks for the tip on the media player app, I will check that out.


----------



## forsakencowboy (Jan 8, 2019)

I usually stream music from Spotify or Tidal, is there an EQ app for android that works with BTR3? Neutralizer which I normally use doesn't work, and all of the other apps I've tried does not work either. 

I hope @FiiO manges to push out an update with 10 band EQ sooner than march.


----------



## McLambo

McLambo said:


> It's a Nokia 8
> 
> Thanks for the tip on the media player app, I will check that out.



Decided to return the BTR3 to Amazon, and go for the M6 instead. Seems that this meets my wishes more than the BTR3.
The experiences so far have increased my appetite for more FIIO


----------



## FiiO

forsakencowboy said:


> I usually stream music from Spotify or Tidal, is there an EQ app for android that works with BTR3? Neutralizer which I normally use doesn't work, and all of the other apps I've tried does not work either.
> 
> I hope @FiiO manges to push out an update with 10 band EQ sooner than march.


Dear friend,

If everything goes well, the EQ function for BTR3 will be added in February.

Best regards


----------



## BenKatz

Has anyone compared it to the Dragonfly RED? I know the RED is an expensive product, but I'm curious how it compares.


----------



## archy121 (Jan 11, 2019)

BenKatz said:


> Has anyone compared it to the Dragonfly RED? I know the RED is an expensive product, but I'm curious how it compares.



You do realise they are two different non competing products ?

One offers top quality lossless sound over BT (LDAC) and the other offers great sound through a wired solution.

BTR3 is not particularly good as a USB DAC and the Dragonfly can’t do any Wireless audio at all.


----------



## BenKatz (Jan 11, 2019)

archy121 said:


> You do realise they are two different non competing products ?
> 
> One offers top quality lossless sound over BT (LDAC) and the other offers great sound through a wired solution.
> 
> BTR3 is not particularly good as a USB DAC and the Dragonfly can’t do any Wireless audio at all.



I did mention in know the price difference is almost double. In that regard they dont compete. I know the dragonfly has 1.5x more output power (more powerful amp) but is only wired, while the BTR3 has lower power but also works on BT (ldac especially). I know the BTR3 has a AK dac while the Dragonfly i believe is Sabre.

So back to my question (and i'd appreciate an answer from someone that tried them), considering these are both portable, flash drive sized dac/amps, how does the sound quality compare (dragonfly wired vs btr wired/ldac) besides the fact that the dragonfly can make the headphones sound louder?

I'm asking about resolution/sound stage/separation.


----------



## Alberto01 (Jan 11, 2019)

BenKatz said:


> Has anyone compared it to the Dragonfly RED? I know the RED is an expensive product, but I'm curious how it compares.


There is some insight for your inquiry in this post:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-26#post-14480567

I have used my BTR3 in wired mode with a micro B port cell phone through IEMs. The sound was excellent with 16 bit/44.1 kHz tracks and on par with the sound when using the best Bluetooth codecs. That speaks very well about using the BTR3 in either wireless or wired mode for CD quality tracks. For the wired connection, I used a plug adapter in order to turn the BTR3 USB male A to USB Type-C (male, of course) stock cable into a USB micro B to USB Type-C cable. Soundwise that was a perfect connection. However, I noticed that the BTR3 got warm, which is an indication that the connection was passing current from the cell phone battery to the BTR3. I switched then to an OTG cable (micro B to female A) connected to the BTR3 stock cable and the sound was the same and the BTR3 didn't get warm anymore.

Beware that in wired mode, the BTR3 is limited to a 16 bit/44.1 (or 48) kHz resolution.


----------



## shockdude (Jan 12, 2019)

Some more thoughts on the BTR3.

It sounds great, whether as a USB DAC or wirelessly with LDAC. Looking forward to the equalizer so that I can increase the subbass a little.

Going wireless is much more convenient than I ever imagined, and works well with my regular usage (only a couple hours wirelessly a day, plugged in as a USB DAC the rest of the time).

I wish that the Charge & LED indicator functions could be changed using button combinations, instead of having to use the Fiio app.

When used as a USB DAC for my Android phone, there's _less_ latency than the phone's headphone out (if the Cytus II ingame calibration isn't lying to me). This is pretty funky compared to the latency when connected to a Windows laptop as a USB DAC.
The microphone isn't great, but it works well enough.
Also, does the microphone work on Windows PCs? I couldn't get the "Headset" speaker & mic to do anything.


----------



## subtec

@FiiO I don't suppose we'll see a slightly larger device with longer battery life at some point? All of these BT receivers settle around 8-12 hours runtime, which I find isn't always enough. I'd gladly trade a little size increase if I could reliably get 20 hours out of it.


----------



## borrego

I personally do not want to see any BT receiver/headamp device larger than the BTR3. I bought the BTR3 for its small size and be able to clip to the headbands of my GMP 8.35d Mobile and Beyer Custom Street, converting them to BT headphones with a short 3.5-3.5 plug cable.


----------



## subtec

borrego said:


> I personally do not want to see any BT receiver/headamp device larger than the BTR3.


Well, you're in luck, because there aren't any (or they're a lot larger). Most of the available models are about the size of the BTR3.


----------



## SeeD

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If everything goes well, the EQ function for BTR3 will be added in February.
> 
> Best regards



Excellent!  

 How many bands will be apart of your EQ software?


----------



## forsakencowboy (Jan 13, 2019)

@FiiO I am using the btr3 at 30% volume and only get around six hours of battery. And the battery indicator on my android phone shows battery as half full when it's empty. What can cause this?


----------



## FiiO

shockdude said:


> Also, does the microphone work on Windows PCs? I couldn't get the "Headset" speaker & mic to do anything.



Dear friend,

The microphone in BTR3 is disabled when using as USB DAC. The computer will set the original microphone in itself for default input still. 

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

subtec said:


> @FiiO I don't suppose we'll see a slightly larger device with longer battery life at some point? All of these BT receivers settle around 8-12 hours runtime, which I find isn't always enough. I'd gladly trade a little size increase if I could reliably get 20 hours out of it.



Dear friend,

We don't have the Bluetooth AMP with 20 hours battery life currently.  But we will still report your suggestion to the product manager. Thank you for the kind interest on our products.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

forsakencowboy said:


> @FiiO I am using the btr3 at 30% volume and only get around six hours of battery. And the battery indicator on my android phone shows battery as half full when it's empty. What can cause this?


Dear friend,
You could test the battery life refer to our website first:
https://www.fiio.com/btr3_parameters

Because of the low precision of Bluetooth electricity meter, it can only indicate the approximate quantity of the battery which can still meet the daily using. Most Bluetooth devices in the market are also with low precision.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO (Jan 17, 2019)

SeeD said:


> Excellent!
> 
> How many bands will be apart of your EQ software?


Dear friend,

There will be 10 frequency bands in the EQ. 

Best regards


----------



## forsakencowboy

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> You could test the battery life refer to our website first:
> https://www.fiio.com/btr3_parameters
> 
> ...



Thanks for replying! 

I understand that bluetooth electricity meters are inaccurate, but this is too much. Battery meter shows over 50% when it´s empty. I´ve never seen a device with a battery meter that inaccurate.

And what about the short battery life? 6 hours running at 30% volume is not acceptable for a new device rated at 11 hours.

Could this be fixed by a factory reset?


----------



## speedingcheetah

forsakencowboy said:


> Thanks for replying!
> 
> I understand that bluetooth electricity meters are inaccurate, but this is too much. Battery meter shows over 50% when it´s empty. I´ve never seen a device with a battery meter that inaccurate.
> 
> ...



I have found my Pixel 3 to be fairly accurate with BT battery % for devices. But it does not update that quickly, I believe it is more the fault of how the devices reports them sevles to the phone, not the phone it self. BT devices are not well programed to transmist such info it seems.

Battery life for the BRT3 has been ammazing for me. I use it about 2hrs each day. and it goes a week easy. It is using LDAC for me.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Jan 15, 2019)

For the record, I did order one of those cases for the BTR3 from Ali EXpress.....and....same thing that happened to my previous ordered from Ali.....tracking shows the item is at "Dispatched, HEBRON,KY 41048" as its last scan, 10 days ago. Nothing ever happens after that scan, never receive it. USPS says they are still waiting for item.  Meanwhile, I have ordered things form China and Hong off ebay after I ordered the case from AliExpress, and they come in no more than 9 days from order date. Go those orders fine. but nothing from ALi. Their CS, who barley can type English says I must wait 25 more days before they are willing to consider it "Not received status".


----------



## shockdude

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The microphone in BTR3 is disabled when using as USB DAC. The computer will set the original microphone in itself for default input still.
> 
> Best regards


Thanks, however I'm referring to when connecting over Bluetooth, not as a USB DAC.
When connected to my computer with Bluetooth, I can't get the BTR3's microphone to work. I'd like to use the BTR3 as a wireless PC headset, if possible, could you please help with that?

Also, do you know anything about the 55ms audio latency when using the BTR3 as a USB DAC on Windows? Do you know if this is a Windows limitation?


----------



## Phascinate (Jan 16, 2019)

shockdude said:


> Thanks, however I'm referring to when connecting over Bluetooth, not as a USB DAC.
> When connected to my computer with Bluetooth, I can't get the BTR3's microphone to work. I'd like to use the BTR3 as a wireless PC headset, if possible, could you please help with that?
> 
> Also, do you know anything about the 55ms audio latency when using the BTR3 as a USB DAC on Windows? Do you know if this is a Windows limitation?


I had to buy this adapter to get the microphone to work. It also supports APTX HD and APTX Low Latency which is really nice. As far as I know most motherboard's built in Bluetooth modules and third party adapters don't even support APTX at all, forcing you to use the much lower quality SBC codec. So I highly recommend getting this adapter if just to get better sound quality. I think SBC is limited to *up to* 328kbps (with most devices playing at way lower than that).

This is the adapter:

Avantree Leaf: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01G3J1I5M/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_QQSpCbWKGWKJX

Only problem that I'm having is that even WITH Aptx Low Latency I'm still getting like 100ms of latency. Not sure why. It's definitely connecting in Low Latency mode. I have a very high end computer.

Without Low Latency it feels like it's literally an entire half a second of delay. Very jarring in games. At least Low Latency is usable.

This is literally the only adapter I could find that supports APTX-LL, unfortunately. I don't know if it's the BTR3 that's the problem or the adapter. The adapter is rated at 40ms delay or lower. It's definitely not reaching that. I wanted to get this setup for VR but with such a delay it's not as awesome as I expected.

Again, I still highly recommend the adapter if you're looking to use it for decently high fidelity means such as listening to music or watching videos. It's great for that. It's just games that are the problem, really.


----------



## shockdude (Jan 16, 2019)

Phascinate said:


> I had to buy this adapter to get the microphone to work. It also supports APTX HD and APTX Low Latency which is really nice. As far as I know most motherboard's built in Bluetooth modules and third party adapters don't even support APTX at all, forcing you to use the much lower quality SBC codec. So I highly recommend getting this adapter if just to get better sound quality. I think SBC is limited to *up to* 328kbps (with most devices playing at way lower than that).
> 
> This is the adapter:
> 
> ...


My laptop includes an Intel Bluetooth card that happens to supports the Dell AptX driver, so I have both regular AptX and AptX-LL available (no AptX-HD but w/e).
I haven't precisely measured AptX-LL's latency, but I ballparked it around 50ms in Stepmania's calibration.
But yeah, no working BTR3 bluetooth mic on PC with this particular setup.

edit: with the Avantree Leaf, when you need to use the microphone, how do you enable it?


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Phascinate said:


> I had to buy this adapter to get the microphone to work. It also supports APTX HD and APTX Low Latency which is really nice. As far as I know most motherboard's built in Bluetooth modules and third party adapters don't even support APTX at all, forcing you to use the much lower quality SBC codec. So I highly recommend getting this adapter if just to get better sound quality. I think SBC is limited to *up to* 328kbps (with most devices playing at way lower than that).
> 
> This is the adapter:
> 
> ...



Avantree Leaf does not support APTX-HD.


----------



## FiiO

forsakencowboy said:


> Thanks for replying!
> 
> I understand that bluetooth electricity meters are inaccurate, but this is too much. Battery meter shows over 50% when it´s empty. I´ve never seen a device with a battery meter that inaccurate.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,
Here is the condition of the battery life testing. You may have a test by yourself.

If you are using LDAC or APTX Bluetooth code and higher volume, the battery life would be shorter. 





Best regards


----------



## caprimulgus (Jan 17, 2019)

Phascinate said:


> Only problem that I'm having is that even WITH Aptx Low Latency I'm still getting like 100ms of latency. Not sure why. It's definitely connecting in Low Latency mode. I have a very high end computer.





shockdude said:


> I haven't precisely measured AptX-LL's latency, but I ballparked it around 50ms in Stepmania's calibration.



Hmmm, interesting. I was planning on getting a BTR3 for gaming over AptX-LL. Anyone else tested the latency of the BTR3 over AptX-LL?


----------



## monocats

Hi all, 

Just got my Btr3 yesterday.

Really satisfied with the sound, but, I am concerned about connectivity.

The do experience skipping and crackling of audio when walking and my phone (S9 plus) is in my back pocket...

Is my BTR faulty, or is this normal? 
My firmware is updated.

Thanks for the advice!


----------



## xoa.nine

Hi @FiiO 

Recently purchased the BTR3, overall very impressed, only issue is that none of the controls work with iTunes on macOS Mojave (Play/Pause, Vol +, Vol -, Next Track, Prev Track), have tested this on 3 different macs, will this ever be fixed? Everything seems to be working fine with other apple applications (Safari etc.)

Thanks for your help


----------



## gto88

monocats said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just got my Btr3 yesterday.
> 
> ...


It is btr3 reception limitation, it is mentioned in early post.


----------



## Dobrescu George

My review of BTR3 is live now! 

I actually made a 4-Way review on BTR3, BTR1K, uBTR and FiiO FB1. 

The Audiophile-Heaven link has all of them together, while on Head-Fi, I posted each of them individually. 

https://www.audiophile-heaven.com/2019/01/fiio-bluetooth-freedom-review.html

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/fiio-btr3.23354/reviews#review-21471


----------



## FiiO

xoa.nine said:


> Hi @FiiO
> 
> Recently purchased the BTR3, overall very impressed, only issue is that none of the controls work with iTunes on macOS Mojave (Play/Pause, Vol +, Vol -, Next Track, Prev Track), have tested this on 3 different macs, will this ever be fixed? Everything seems to be working fine with other apple applications (Safari etc.)
> 
> Thanks for your help


Dear friend,

You are using the USB DAC or Bluetooth connection? The volume control would not change the volume of the player but the BTR3 itself. 

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

monocats said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just got my Btr3 yesterday.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

Which Bluetooth code you are using?

Some explanations about Bluetooth Connection — From James

Best regards


----------



## xoa.nine

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You are using the USB DAC or Bluetooth connection? The volume control would not change the volume of the player but the BTR3 itself.
> 
> Best regards


Hi,

Thanks for the quick reply, I've tested using the BTR3 with Bluetooth and USB DAC.

Yes i understand the volume control is separate, but play/pause, next track/prev track, does not do anything on iTunes on macOS Mojave


----------



## Douglas McGee

Just received my BTR3 today and absolutely love it. Using it with an iphone X and my Shure se856 iems. This pair sound really good. Much better than the stock lightning adaptor out. Sound is closer to my Q1 mkII, but without the bulk. Unlike some reviews I've read, I get really good bluetooth range here. I can walk all around my large rooms without any interruption. AAC bluetooth also works well here with the iphone. 

One request. I would love it if there were an ASIO driver for windows. I'm a professional musician, and I'd like to be able to travel with just the BTR3 and my laptop, and to be able to edit with this pair on the go. Would save me from having to take my Q1 mkII in my travel case. I find the BTR3 sound to be more than adequate for mobile use as a headphone DAC. Really wish it had an ASIO driver.


----------



## alexkonkov (Jan 19, 2019)

Dear Fiio, could you please make possible changing the volume right form Bluetooth host (e.g. phone)? I need to make sure my phone sends the best audio quality to BTR3 (best at 100% volume). Needing to change a separate volume on BTR3 is a critical usability flaw I believe everyone would like you to address.


----------



## monocats

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Which Bluetooth code you are using?
> 
> ...



Hi. Thanks for the response! 
Based on the info I did some further testing.

LDAC, Aptx, AAC, SBC - with my Galaxy S9 plus Exynos - no difference, stuttering when in my back pocket. So the issue seems not to be tied to the bandwidth the codec uses. 

I did not experience this kind of issue with my other (AptX) Bluetooth adapter - Samsung Level Link.. 

Not sure what can be done about this. Is the lower sensitivity of the antenna a part of the design of the device?

If so, I would gladly sacrifice some battery for more power to the antenna.


----------



## Brooko

alexkonkov said:


> Dear Fiio, could you please make possible changing the volume right form Bluetooth host (e.g. phone)? I need to make sure my phone sends the best audio quality to BTR3 (best at 100% volume). Needing to change a separate volume on BTR3 is a critical usability flaw I believe everyone would like you to address.



Um - the whole idea of the better volume configuration is that you can adjust both from BTR3 and your source - but they are independent of each other.  So you have much better control.  On my iPhone - if I want it at 100% I can choose to do this - and then control listening volume with the BTR3.  But if I have more sensitive IEMs, likewise I can come to a compromise between the two devices.  Everyone I've talked to so far prefers this method.

Assuming this is a "flaw" and that everyone wants to "address it" - is the mistake in your argument I think.

I for one want to see it left as it is now.  And what makes you think this would give better "quality"?


----------



## alexkonkov

Brooko said:


> I for one want to see it left as it is now.  And what makes you think this would give better "quality"?



After (more) quiet audio is sent over Bluetooth (in 44/16 format) it needs to be amplified in order to reach expected output volume level. Aren't dynamic range, resolution and other quality aspects suffering in this case?


----------



## Brooko

Why would they be?  If your perception of them is - turn the volume up slightly.


----------



## rkw

alexkonkov said:


> After (more) quiet audio is sent over Bluetooth (in 44/16 format) it needs to be amplified in order to reach expected output volume level. Aren't dynamic range, resolution and other quality aspects suffering in this case?


Yes. For best sound quality, the source device should be set to maximum volume, then set listening volume on the BTR3.


----------



## archy121 (Jan 21, 2019)

Just like to provide some feedback and say this is an excellent device and works better than I expected. Also very flexible. 

I mainly use it with super comfortable Fidelio X2’s. I can connect to my tv without any lip sync issues and connect to LG V30 mobile using LDAC for all my music needs.

I find the sound quality using LDAC is so good that there is hardly any point in using a wired headphone anymore for audio up to 24/96. Battery being the only thing holding it back from being a full time solution. @FiiO take note for future model. 
The quality of audio from the BT3 compared to the LG V30’s Quad DAC - not much in it when you add in the convenience or wireless.

Before buying I had been concerned by the BT range of this unit and now I can confirm it is not an issue for me. I have been able to leave the phone on charge in the living room and walk next door to my kitchen without any audio issues using LDAC. That’s the kind of wireless distance I had hoped for.

Today as an experiment I connected the BT3 using interconnects to my HiFi amp rather than the headphones and again i was surprised by how good the sound was. Very full and rich.
The LG V30 with LDAC enabled maintained a firm connection as I sat with it in my hand and played through my FLAC files and Tidal without any trouble. GENIUS !

This is no doubt the best value and quality wireless audio solution not just for headphone listening but also to turn a wired HiFi rig into a wireless one. I might have to buy another one !


----------



## Alberto01

Some people have a very good reception with their BTR3s while others a have very poor reception. That brings the thought that the transmitter device can make a big difference in the signal reception. My BTR3 is bad using AptX with my LG G4 cell phone. It hardly takes much to make it stutter or completely stop. I haven't tried it with other transmitters, yet.


----------



## alexkonkov

Alberto01 said:


> Some people have a very good reception with their BTR3s while others a have very poor reception.



Mine has noticeably worse reception than several Bluetooth headphones I own. BTR3 struggles to play well being ~ 8 meters away through two walls. I wish it could be on a par with other devices in this area, but unfortunately it isn't.


----------



## Alberto01

alexkonkov said:


> Mine has noticeably worse reception than several Bluetooth headphones I own. BTR3 struggles to play well being ~ 8 meters away through two walls. I wish it could be on a par with other devices in this area, but unfortunately it isn't.


Mine is a lot worse than that.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Jan 21, 2019)

alexkonkov said:


> Mine has noticeably worse reception than several Bluetooth headphones I own. BTR3 struggles to play well being ~ 8 meters away through two walls. I wish it could be on a par with other devices in this area, but unfortunately it isn't.



It really depends also on the device that is transmitting. Some of the older chips are not good at handling interference.

I have tested, if I pair my BTR3 to and old phone, like my Nexus 5X, it has issue at further distances and in my kitchen. But paired to my Pixel 3, it works everywhere, no issues. Hell, the BTR3 still worked fine when i stuck it in my fridge or oven and closed the door.

BT uses the 2.4ghz band, so if you are in a crowded environment where there is lots of 2.4g wifi around, or other devices/appliances around that distort that band....you are going to have Bluetooth issues in general.

For those having issues, disable 2.4ghz band in your router, see if that helps. Make sure all your wifi clients are connected to the 5ghz band though first.


----------



## jeffri

Also Bluetooth works better within line of sight as it isn't as good at penetrating human body. So putting the BTR3 for example, to back pocket, might reduce the reception. Bluetooth headphones have less of this issue since it is always exposed on your head.


----------



## archy121 (Jan 21, 2019)

Anyone know if the BT3 can be charging and have 3.5mm audio out at the same time ?  

This would be useful connected to the HiFi


----------



## Alberto01 (Jan 21, 2019)

archy121 said:


> Anyone know if the BT3 can be charged and have 3.5mm audio out at the same time ?


Mine works well that way. It seems that once the battery is fully charged, my BTR3 stops taking its current from the charger and starts running on battery power. Then, I have to disconnect and reconnect the BTR3 to the charger in order to get it to draw current from the charger again.

You wrote "3.5mm audio out". ¿Is there any other way besides the 3.5mm jack for the BTR3 to send audio out?


----------



## rkw

Alberto01 said:


> It seems that once the battery is fully charged, my BTR3 stops taking its current from the charger and starts running on battery power.


How do you know that? It isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work.


----------



## Alberto01 (Jan 21, 2019)

rkw said:


> How do you know that? It isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work.


I said "it seems" because when I connect the BTR3 to the charger, the codec light stays permanently on (that means is drawing current from the charger) for longer if the battery is not close to being fully charged. The emptier the battery is when I connect the BTR3 to the charger the longer the codec light stays on. The fuller the battery is the shorter it stays on. At least in my case, the BTR3 battery charge level indicator that is shown in my mobile device (i.e. cell phone) is not very precise as to the charge level. It displays a full charge whether the battery is full or it is close to being full. So, with that charging behavior and the imprecise battery level indicator, it seems like it is working the way I posted it, even though "it isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work".

Does the BTR3 keep running on the charger's power after the codec's light changes from permanent to intermittent?


----------



## monocats

jeffri said:


> Also Bluetooth works better within line of sight as it isn't as good at penetrating human body. So putting the BTR3 for example, to back pocket, might reduce the reception. Bluetooth headphones have less of this issue since it is always exposed on your head.



Well, my old Samsung Level Link adapter was able to work with my phone in my back pocket without any issues.

I really like Btr3 aside from the weak reception so far, but am still contemplating returning it. Not sure if the need to baby sit it in terms of being aware as where to place it to get reception, is worth the increased audio quality.


----------



## rkw (Jan 21, 2019)

Alberto01 said:


> I said "it seems" because when I connect the BTR3 to the charger, the codec light stays permanently on (that means is drawing current from the charger) for longer if the battery is not close to being fully charged. The emptier the battery is when I connect the BTR3 to the charger the longer the codec light stays on. The fuller the battery is the shorter it stays on. At least in my case, the BTR3 battery charge level indicator that is shown in my mobile device (i.e. cell phone) is not very precise as to the charge level. It displays a full charge whether the battery is full or it is close to being full. So, with that charging behavior and the imprecise battery level indicator, it seems like it is working the way I posted it, even though "it isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work".
> 
> Does the BTR3 keep running on the charger's power after the codec's light changes from permanent to intermittent?


Here's a way to test what's happening.

Plug the BTR3 into a charger and let it charge to full.
Leave the BTR3 on the charger, and play music for a few hours
Turn it off and see how long it takes to fully recharge (stop charging).
If it stops charging after a short time, then you know that it was using the charger instead of the battery to play music at step #2.


----------



## archy121 (Jan 21, 2019)

rkw said:


> Here's a way to test what's happening.
> 
> Plug the BTR3 into a charger and let it charge to full.
> Leave the BTR3 on the charger, and play music for a few hours
> ...



Why not simply use the battery status indicator that displays on the android phones when BT3 is connected to it ?


----------



## rkw (Jan 21, 2019)

archy121 said:


> Isn’t the battery status indicator on the android Accurate enough to tell you  ?


Yes, that will work as long as you played music long enough for a clear result (e.g. if expecting 80% for playing from the battery, but the app shows 98% I would consider it confirmed that it was using charger power).


----------



## archy121 (Jan 21, 2019)

Thanks for input guys.
Just need to test out whether the BT3 will auto start charging again when it’s battery level falls low. This could be a great solution for creating wireless speaker setups.

*EDIT Found the missing parts in iOS app. 
Works same as Android L


----------



## Alberto01

With Android 6.0 my battery indicator doesn't display percentage numbers. It is just an icon that shows 4 different levels: full, half full, about a quarter full and empty. Is it different from that in newer Android or iOS versions?


----------



## Alberto01

archy121 said:


> Thanks for input guys.
> Just need to test out whether the BT3 will auto start charging again when it’s battery level falls low. This could be a great solution for creating wireless speaker setups.
> 
> @FiiO any plans to improve the iPhone FIIO app so that like the android app you can check the BT3 status, adjust equ  etc. ?



Whether it works like I thought or just like a typical Li-Ion powered device, leaving the BTR3 connected to the charger should keep it running and will either keep the battery fully charged or will keep it between almost fully charged and fully charged. Any of those are good options. A bad option would be that the battery-charger connection keeps the battery getting charged after being already full. That is not happening with my BTR3. My BTR3 would get warm/hot if that were happening, and my BTR3 always stays cold/cool no matter how long I leave it connected to the charger.


----------



## gto88

Just ordered one from amazon, with its Bluetooth codec support this will go a long time.


----------



## Dobrescu George

gto88 said:


> Just ordered one from amazon, with its Bluetooth codec support this will go a long time.



It really should, there's no other new BT codec in sight for a while


----------



## Bombyx

Dobrescu George said:


> It really should, there's no other new BT codec in sight for a while


Except, of course, aptX Adaptive.


----------



## mhoopes

I understand that the BTR3 lags in RF performance as compared to the µBTR (due to a metallic frame, perhaps?), though its FCC test documents indicate a similar or identical RF section. 

I've found RF environment, with respect to the 2.4 GHz band, is the key factor affecting my BT performance. I've experienced sporadic poor signal quality with 990 Kb/s LDAC between my EarStudio ES100 and Sony UBP-X800, and fixed it by switching off the BT radios on my iPhone and iPad, which were sitting on a table right next to my armchair. I suppose moving them further away would have helped, alternatively. I still have a couple of routers in the room that are broadcasting at 2.4 GHz. I'll be changing that soon.


----------



## Dobrescu George

Bombyx said:


> Except, of course, aptX Adaptive.



I wouldn't expect it to sound better than APT-X HD  

"low-bit rate audio transmission" was the headline of their description


----------



## archy121

Bombyx said:


> Except, of course, aptX Adaptive.



After using LDAC it’s that or nothing for me.


----------



## monocats (Jan 23, 2019)

monocats said:


> Hi. Thanks for the response!
> Based on the info I did some further testing.
> 
> LDAC, Aptx, AAC, SBC - with my Galaxy S9 plus Exynos - no difference, stuttering when in my back pocket. So the issue seems not to be tied to the bandwidth the codec uses.
> ...



My last mesaage in the regards to this, please bear with me.

After 5 days of testing, I concluded that BTR3 is not suitable for my use case - using it on the go.
The thing is, that I experience stuttering even if BTR3 is on my collar and my phone in the FRONT pocket of my jeans (!)

An honest question for the FiiO representative - is this normal? Shall I return the unit, or ask for a replacement?


----------



## sidecross

rkw said:


> How do you know that? It isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work.


The battery is just a power source it is controlled by a chip or controller in conjunction with a separate power source that can read the voltage and recharge when the voltage drops below a programed voltage level and terminate when above a programed voltage.


----------



## rkw

sidecross said:


> The battery is just a power source it is controlled by a chip or controller in conjunction with a separate power source that can read the voltage and recharge when the voltage drops below a programed voltage level and terminate when above a programed voltage.


That's a separate topic. I was questioning @Alberto01's claim that after charging has completed, the player will run only from the battery and not use charger power.


----------



## gto88

Received my BTR3 tonight.
Listening FH5 with from iPhone HiBy music player, pretty good actually.
I have not figured out how to player music with fiio music player, it connects btr3
with bluetooth, however the indicator continue flushing, but I can do setup of btr3.


----------



## Darkestred

monocats said:


> My last mesaage in the regards to this, please bear with me.
> 
> After 5 days of testing, I concluded that BTR3 is not suitable for my use case - using it on the go.
> The thing is, that I experience stuttering even if BTR3 is on my collar and my phone in the FRONT pocket of my jeans (!)
> ...



I've experienced this but i may have been sweaty from a workout.  Sometimes i'll clip the device to my collar while working out.  With the phone in my pocket and leaving the gym, THE BTR was cutting out but im certain the few phone calls ive made (not related to being at the gym), there were no issues.


----------



## gto88

Btr3 to iphone by bluetooth, when phone call come in, is it supposed to go to btr3?
Somehow I cannot hear anything.  Is it volume issue?
What is the best setting to be able to switch between music and phone call
Smoothly without changing volume?


----------



## digititus

monocats said:


> My last mesaage in the regards to this, please bear with me.
> 
> After 5 days of testing, I concluded that BTR3 is not suitable for my use case - using it on the go.
> The thing is, that I experience stuttering even if BTR3 is on my collar and my phone in the FRONT pocket of my jeans (!)
> ...


Which phone are you using? More likely to be an issue with your phone than the BTR3. I've had a number of portable amplifiers with bluetooth and some experienced the symptoms you describe with certain phones and not at all with others.


----------



## FiiO

monocats said:


> My last mesaage in the regards to this, please bear with me.
> 
> After 5 days of testing, I concluded that BTR3 is not suitable for my use case - using it on the go.
> The thing is, that I experience stuttering even if BTR3 is on my collar and my phone in the FRONT pocket of my jeans (!)
> ...


Dear friend,

You may read Some explanations about Bluetooth Connection — From James: http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=43331&highlight=Bluetooth

Best regards


----------



## angpsi

Anyone else having problems having his/her BTR3 show up on the iOS app BT settings screen? I can't seem to make it work no matter how hard I try (did the firmware upgrade process, reinstalled the app, and everything but it didn't work). My BTR3 is brand new from the official distributor and my iPhone is an iPhone 6.


----------



## monocats

digititus said:


> Which phone are you using? More likely to be an issue with your phone than the BTR3. I've had a number of portable amplifiers with bluetooth and some experienced the symptoms you describe with certain phones and not at all with others.



I am using an Samsung Galaxy s9 plus. I also tried btr with galaxy s8 today, with the same result.

Still on a fence in regards to whether to return it or ask for an replacement.


----------



## gto88

monocats said:


> I am using an Samsung Galaxy s9 plus. I also tried btr with galaxy s8 today, with the same result.
> 
> Still on a fence in regards to whether to return it or ask for an replacement.


This is how I did it.
I pair BTR3 to iphone first.
And when I bring up fiio music app, go to BT control page, it show BTR3 as "unconnected",
so I have to reconnect it right there, it was not smooth, but I eventually got there.


----------



## gto88

My question, any one use BTR3 for phone call when on blutetooth connection?
My iphone bluetooth works for my car stereo phone control, but I cannot have it working
for BTR3.
Anyone can shed some light?


----------



## shockdude

I got the BTR3 headset & microphone to work on Windows, and it works pretty smoothly.
I had to uninstall the Dell AptX driver, which was fine because Windows 10 has working native AptX out-of-the-box. I don't have AptX-LL without the Dell driver, but w/e.


----------



## angpsi

gto88 said:


> My question, any one use BTR3 for phone call when on blutetooth connection?
> My iphone bluetooth works for my car stereo phone control, but I cannot have it working
> for BTR3.
> Anyone can shed some light?


The BTR3 works fine for phone calls as long as it is paired to your iPhone. Maybe if you disconnect your iPhone from the car stereo, it will send the call to your BTR3?


----------



## BenF

I followed the instructions to enter DFU mode, and red/blue light stops flashing as expected, but it shows up in the device manager as "Generic Bluetooth Adapter" under "Bluetooth"





instead of "CSR BlueCore in DFU mode" displayed under the "Universal Serial Bus controller".
How to solve this?


----------



## monocats

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You may read Some explanations about Bluetooth Connection — From James: http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=43331&highlight=Bluetooth
> 
> Best regards



FYI - I ended up returning Btr3, the wireless performance was not acceptable for my needs.

I tried different phones & laptops, even using a dedicated Bluetooth transmitter for my laptop (creative bt-w2), the performance was pretty bad no matter what I tried.

I will be definitely revisiting a next gen product from FiiO, as I really liked the concept.


----------



## alexkonkov

monocats said:


> FYI - I ended up returning Btr3, the wireless performance was not acceptable for my needs.



Sold mine too. Hardware was the only thing I could appreciate on paper until I faced with so many product flaws in reality. They'd better hire good firmware developers and refrain from advertising buggy and even unimplemented features (like settings in app).


----------



## archy121

@alexkonkov @monocats 

Sorry to hear things didn’t work out for guy guys. 

Strange how it’s works so well for some and not so for others. It’s working flawlessly with LG V30 over LDAC. I can even walk a room away on the same floor without any BT problems. Phone calls over iPhone no problem. 

The trend in shipping out new half baked goods and patching them after is one that is not limited to FIIO. It’s across the tech industry and really should be halted.


----------



## sidecross

alexkonkov said:


> Sold mine too. Hardware was the only thing I could appreciate on paper until I faced with so many product flaws in reality. They'd better hire good firmware developers and refrain from advertising buggy and even unimplemented features (like settings in app).


Fiio's popularity can easily lead to failure if they cannot match excellent production to their design concepts. Growth in the market can be a curse to a company if they cannot expand good production values.


----------



## mhoopes (Jan 27, 2019)

archy121 said:


> @alexkonkov @monocats
> 
> Sorry to hear things didn’t work out for guy guys.
> 
> ...


RF background emissions in the 2.4 GHz band can be a factor. They were for me. Connection quality of BT devices improved when I shut off unnecessary BT radios and 2.4 GHz channels on my routers.

Also, consumer demand for “premium” enclosure materials (metallic materials, in particular) end up compromising signal quality when devices lack external antennae.

Try the FiiO μBTR, which FCC test documents claim has equivalent RF circuitry to the BTR3. I have no connection issues with that model. What’s the difference?


----------



## sidecross (Jan 27, 2019)

I use two btr1k's all night with no problem. The btr1k is a big improvement over the btr1.

I have an anker 10,050 mah battery near my bed and charge 1 btr1k while I use the other.

https://www.fiio.com/btr1k_comparison


----------



## angpsi

Yesterday, the BTR3 suddenly started showing up on the FiiO app. Didn’t do anything special, besides what I had done in the previous days trying to fix this. When I finally managed to get a successful connection to the FiiO app the BTR3 was hooked to my MacBook with the USB cable while it was also connected to my iPhone via bluetooth. I don’t know, perhaps there’s a mix-up with Apple’s continuity protocols.

Just to make things clear, the BTR3 was connecting properly to all of my devices via BT; I just couldn't make it show up on the FiiO Music app (and therefore I couldn't tamper with the settings). I am using the latest version firmware and the latest version of FiiO music.

For now I'm quite happy with it's performance on my FLC8s IEMs. I wish Apple would jump on to the hi-res BT protocols bandwagon, the BTR3 itself is certainly doing a better job rendering music compared to any other basic DAC implementation available on my devices.


----------



## FiiO (Jan 29, 2019)

angpsi said:


> Yesterday, the BTR3 suddenly started showing up on the FiiO app. Didn’t do anything special, besides what I had done in the previous days trying to fix this. When I finally managed to get a successful connection to the FiiO app the BTR3 was hooked to my MacBook with the USB cable while it was also connected to my iPhone via bluetooth. I don’t know, perhaps there’s a mix-up with Apple’s continuity protocols.
> 
> Just to make things clear, the BTR3 was connecting properly to all of my devices via BT; I just couldn't make it show up on the FiiO Music app (and therefore I couldn't tamper with the settings). I am using the latest version firmware and the latest version of FiiO music.
> 
> For now I'm quite happy with it's performance on my FLC8s IEMs. I wish Apple would jump on to the hi-res BT protocols bandwagon, the BTR3 itself is certainly doing a better job rendering music compared to any other basic DAC implementation available on my devices.


Dear friend,

Sometimes it may take 10s or above for the BTR3 showing in the FiiO Bluetooth control. So maybe it was a delay issue of the FiiO Music APP. We will still report to the engineer for checking about that.

Best regards


----------



## BenF

BenF said:


> I followed the instructions to enter DFU mode, and red/blue light stops flashing as expected, but it shows up in the device manager as "Generic Bluetooth Adapter" under "Bluetooth"
> 
> 
> instead of "CSR BlueCore in DFU mode" displayed under the "Universal Serial Bus controller".
> How to solve this?


Anyone?


----------



## shockdude

I haven't had any bad experiences with the BTR3's bluetooth thus far. I've had no signal drops with LDAC while keeping my phone in my pocket. I've also walked like 30 feet from my laptop while using AptX and was surprised that the signal didn't break up until after I stepped through a doorway.

Some nitpicky feature/firmware suggestions:

Reduce the microphone sensitivity. The mic picks up other people talking 10 feet away.
Disable the fade-in when changing the USB DAC sample rate. I have music in both 44.1khz and 48khz and I use foobar2000 with WASAPI, so every time I play a song with a different sample rate, the BTR3 fades in the first second of the song.
Enable a way to use 44.1khz 16-bit LDAC by default. I don't have hi-res music, so the current default 96khz 32-bit is kind of a waste, and I'd prefer to not resample unnecessarily.
Toggle the LED without needing the app, and/or a mode that only turns the LED on for the first few seconds and turns it off afterward.
I'm very happy with the BTR3, and I hope to see more firmware improvements in the future.


----------



## archy121 (Jan 31, 2019)

Also very happy with how the BT3 is performing and now needs tweaking like Shockdude mentioned.

I have just ordered a pair of Sony MH755 earphones specifically to go with the BT3.
These earphones were made specifically to be used with an armband Sony BT receiver so they are short in length. Also one of the earphone cables is longer than the other from the splitter so that it can be worn by running it back of the neck.

This is really neat style of earphones for using with BT3 for walks, gym etc. Just clip the BT3 to upper part of clothing close to pocket/collar and the earphones will be just the right tidy length.

 They have got some really positive feedback on the forums and are said to follow the harmonic curve nicely.

Hope to give feedback on how it sounds with the BT3 next week.


I say this is a cheap £5 must have addon for the BT3.


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> Anyone?


Dear friend,

Have you checked the firmware version in the FiiO Music app first? And your BTR3 is not using the latest version? 
Please try to reset the BTR3 by holding the power button for at least 10s or holding the volume +&- for 5s then update again?

Best regards


----------



## sidecross

archy121 said:


> Also very happy with how the BT3 is performing and now needs tweaking like Shockdude mentioned.
> 
> I have just ordered a pair of Sony MH755 earphones specifically to go with the BT3.
> These earphones were made specifically to be used with an armband Sony BT receiver so they are short in length. Also one of the earphone cables is longer than the other from the splitter so that it can be worn by running it back of the neck.
> ...


Fiio now makes a 45 cm cable.  

https://www.fiio.com/productinfo/102911.html


----------



## archy121

sidecross said:


> Fiio now makes a 45 cm cable.
> 
> https://www.fiio.com/productinfo/102911.html



You kind of missed the point. 
I pointed out a ready to go complete short headphones solution. And they have very good reviews for sound quality.


----------



## sidecross

archy121 said:


> You kind of missed the point.
> I pointed out a ready to go complete short headphones solution. And they have very good reviews for sound quality.


I appreciated your comment about a shorter cable and was pointing out to others who might like myself were looking for a similar solution to using a mmcx iem with fiio's btr1k or btr3.

I often miss the point; it is how I explore new adventurers.


----------



## mhoopes

sidecross said:


> I appreciated your comment about a shorter cable and was pointing out to others who might like myself were looking for a similar solution to using a mmcx iem with fiio's btr1k or btr3.
> 
> I often miss the point; it is how I explore new adventurers.


Short cables are part and parcel to the portable experience. JAYS understood this...my first single-BA IEM (d-JAYS) had an inline 3.5 mm connector pair in their cable for exactly this purpose. I think Sony and some others used to do the same back in the 80s&90s.

I'm using the LC-3.5BS with my ES100 and FA7. It's definitely an upgrade from FiiO's other short cable, in terms of durability and ergonomics. Finally, a short MMCX cable with a chin slider, and a measure of strain relief at the far ends.


----------



## sidecross

mhoopes said:


> Short cables are part and parcel to the portable experience. JAYS understood this...my first single-BA IEM (d-JAYS) had an inline 3.5 mm connector pair in their cable for exactly this purpose. I think Sony and some others used to do the same back in the 80s&90s.
> 
> I'm using the LC-3.5BS with my ES100 and FA7. It's definitely an upgrade from FiiO's other short cable, in terms of durability and ergonomics. Finally, a short MMCX cable with a chin slider, and a measure of strain relief at the far ends.


My lc-3.5bs  is ordered and due to arrive Sunday.


----------



## sidecross

The fiio lc-3.5ds cable arrived today and it is just what I needed to use with my two fiio BT  btr1k's; no more having to wire-up my longer cable for all night listening.


----------



## Dmitry87

Is it know when the EQ for BTR3 will be released?


----------



## mykeldg

@FiiO 

I plan to use the BTR3 to connect to my Marantz Stereo Amplifier. Would it be OK to have it powered permanently via USB?


----------



## Dmitry87

mykeldg said:


> @FiiO
> I plan to use the BTR3 to connect to my Marantz Stereo Amplifier. Would it be OK to have it powered permanently via USB?


frolsa on 4pda says, that BTR3 stops charging when 100% is reached and it doesn't start charging again until it's physically reconnected or the connection is restarted.


----------



## archy121 (Feb 4, 2019)

mykeldg said:


> @FiiO
> 
> I plan to use the BTR3 to connect to my Marantz Stereo Amplifier. Would it be OK to have it powered permanently via USB?



I have used it with my Music Fidelity amp. Sounded amazing with BT LDAC and I intend to buy another one so I can leave it connected to the amp.

@FiiO

Is the Low Pass DAC filter fully implemented as I’m Not noticing any differences between the options ? 
Please clarify how each is supposed to affect the sound.

Secondly is the Low Pass Filter setting saved to the BTR3 like you intend to do with the Equaliser settings ?


----------



## LSD25

I'm trying to connect BTR3 to iPad pro 11, which has Type-C connector. 

Using a Type-C to Type-C cable doesn't work. Tested three different C to C cables on Note 8, and iPad, still nothing. 
If I connect a Type-C external SSD, it does show up, so the cables do data transfer.

Only way I can get BTR3 to work in DAC mode is if i use a Type-C OTG adapter -> USB-A to Type-C cable.
Is there any particular brand of Type-C to Type-C cable that will get BTR3 working in DAC mode on iPad?


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 6, 2019)

BenKatz said:


> I'm wondering, did anyone compare it, with sound coming from direct USB or LDAC BT, to the Dragonfly Red?
> 
> I know the Dragonfly should be superior, but i'm wondering how it compares, how far back is it in terms of sq (especially soundstage).


I have the dragonfly Black and the the sound quality is a still a bit better on the DFB. The dragonfly is 2-3x louder, more balanced, more micro details and subtle nuances can be heard, soundstage is wide open, sound is more natural and less fatiguing. more forward midrange and smoother than the BTR3.

The BTR3 sounds a bit more dynamic but narrower. Seems to have a slight emphasis on highs and lows. Midrange is a bit recessed compared to the dragonfly. BTR3 sounds like it has more depth instead of width. less natural sounding than the DFB. Blacker background.

I have done my comparison when the BTR3 is connected as a DAC instead of Bluetooth to make sure there is no compression affecting the SQ comparison.

That said, they are the best Bluetooth receiver Ive heard to date. No lags when watching videos. black background, no noise. The SQ when connected via bluetooth and wired is not so big to be bothered about.

Disclaimer : I primarily listen to the BTR3 via my Stereo / Hifi and MSR7 Full sized Headphones. It might be different with IEMs which I do not own.


----------



## mykeldg

Dmitry87 said:


> frolsa on 4pda says, that BTR3 stops charging when 100% is reached and it doesn't start charging again until it's physically reconnected or the connection is restarted.



Great thanks a lot and good to know.


----------



## mykeldg

LSD25 said:


> I'm trying to connect BTR3 to iPad pro 11, which has Type-C connector.
> 
> Using a Type-C to Type-C cable doesn't work. Tested three different C to C cables on Note 8, and iPad, still nothing.
> If I connect a Type-C external SSD, it does show up, so the cables do data transfer.
> ...


Sorry I have no suggestion for your case but I have heard wired vs wireless of the BTR3 and the increase in SQ is not significant enough to bother with all the hassle of tethering it to the device. I tested both AAC and APTX. If you have Apple Music, it is essentially lossless transmission (of the 256k AAC file) between the ipad and the BTR3.


----------



## mykeldg

@FiiO & @ everyone Does anyone know if the Digital Filter settings gets saved to the device? What if I will play music via another device other than my phone where the app is installed into?


----------



## Dmitry87 (Feb 5, 2019)

*mykeldg, *it should work like the promised EQ:


FiiO said:


> PeterMac said:
> 
> 
> > EQ preset will be In memory in BTR3 ? or only on device where FiiO Music app was installed ?
> ...


But You will have to test it to be sure, as we know that not everything work the way they promised (if at all).


----------



## Jayden16

Every time I connect my phone (OnePlus 6) to my HiBy R3 via Bluetooth using LDAC, it upsamples to 32bit/96kHz. This means I have to dig into the developer settings and change it back to 16bit/44kHz every single time I want to use my R3 as a receiver, and it's a giant PITA. It also sets the playback quality to 'Best Effort (Adaptive Bit Rate)' every time I connect it, and doesn't remember my preferred setting of 'Balanced Audio and Connection Quality'. 

I'm looking at getting the BTR3 as a relatively cheap alternative to use with my phone. For anyone with experience with Android and the FiiO BTR3, have you had any issues with upsampling like I've described?


----------



## speedingcheetah

Jayden16 said:


> Every time I connect my phone (OnePlus 6) to my HiBy R3 via Bluetooth using LDAC, it upsamples to 32bit/96kHz. This means I have to dig into the developer settings and change it back to 16bit/44kHz every single time I want to use my R3 as a receiver, and it's a giant PITA. It also sets the playback quality to 'Best Effort (Adaptive Bit Rate)' every time I connect it, and doesn't remember my preferred setting of 'Balanced Audio and Connection Quality'.
> 
> I'm looking at getting the BTR3 as a relatively cheap alternative to use with my phone. For anyone with experience with Android and the FiiO BTR3, have you had any issues with upsampling like I've described?



Normal and default Android behavior for any BT audio device. Doesn't matter the the phone make or model.  Those settings always revert upon disconnect then connect again.
There may be a way to change the behavior on your rom, but you would probably need root and  some other mod.
Maybe a macro or tasker automation app can be programmed to change those settings for you.


----------



## Jayden16

speedingcheetah said:


> Normal and default Android behavior for any BT audio device. Doesn't matter the the phone make or model.  Those settings always revert upon disconnect then connect again.
> There may be a way to change the behavior on your rom, but you would probably need root and  some other mod.
> Maybe a macro or tasker automation app can be programmed to change those settings for you.


Damn, that's a shame. Appreciate the response though - I wasn't sure if it was the fault of the R3 or Android. Looks like the BTR3 won't solve my problem then, but it looks like a neat little device that I might pick up eventually anyway. I'll look into Tasker or even root solutions, thanks!


----------



## salla45

Ok , so i got my shiny new BTR3 today  - sounding fine... Ldac paired to my Note 8, brill.

Silly question... but how do I know when it's fully charged?


----------



## mykeldg

salla45 said:


> Ok , so i got my shiny new BTR3 today  - sounding fine... Ldac paired to my Note 8, brill.
> 
> Silly question... but how do I know when it's fully charged?


The fiio logo will go from steady (charging) to blinking (not charging).


----------



## salla45

mykeldg said:


> The fiio logo will go from steady (charging) to blinking (not charging).


thanks!


----------



## mykeldg

salla45 said:


> thanks!


I see you also have a Chord Mojo. I know its a bit unfair, but can you compare  DAC / sound quality of the BTR3 to the Mojo? Is it night and Day or does the BTR3 hold its own? I've read that the AKM chip in the BTR3 has excellent SNR & THD.


----------



## baradona

Apologies if the answer is elsewhere in the thread and I haven't found it.

I'm trying to get the BTR3 to connect to my MacBook using AptX HD.  I use Bluetooth Explorer to force AptX (over AAC) and the laptop connects to the BTR3 using AptX.  Other headphones (B&W PX ) connect using AptX HD.  Any ideas?


----------



## Alberto01 (Feb 6, 2019)

archy121 said:


> Anyone know if the BT3 can be charging and have 3.5mm audio out at the same time ?
> 
> This would be useful connected to the HiFi





Alberto01 said:


> Mine works well that way. It seems that once the battery is fully charged, my BTR3 stops taking its current from the charger and starts running on battery power. Then, I have to disconnect and reconnect the BTR3 to the charger in order to get it to draw current from the charger again.
> 
> You wrote "3.5mm audio out". ¿Is there any other way besides the 3.5mm jack for the BTR3 to send audio out?





rkw said:


> How do you know that? It isn't how power in Li-Ion devices typically work.





mykeldg said:


> @FiiO
> 
> I plan to use the BTR3 to connect to my Marantz Stereo Amplifier. Would it be OK to have it powered permanently via USB?





Dmitry87 said:


> frolsa on 4pda says, that BTR3 stops charging when 100% is reached and it doesn't start charging again until it's physically reconnected or the connection is restarted.



I ran several tests to determine my BTR3's charging behavior. It is exactly how I said that it "seemed to be".

I tested my BTR3 with 2 chargers, 2 power banks, 2 current (Volts and Amps) meters, and 3 charging cables.  The charging behavior with the chargers is that the BTR3 gets fully charged after it is connected to the chargers.  Once the battery is full, the BTR3 starts drawing its charge from the battery for about 3 hours. Then, it draws current from the chargers for about 25 minutes until the battery is fully charged. Then, the BTR3 starts running on its battery power, again.  After about 3 hours of operation, the same thing happens again.  That way, the BTR3 will or would operate non-stop when left connected to a charger and the battery will remain between full and about 75% charged.

Using power banks as a charging source, the BTR3 gets fully charged after it gets connected to the power banks. Once the battery is full, the BTR3 starts drawing its current from the battery and never draws current from the power banks while the BTR3 remains connected to the power banks. This way, the BTR3 runs on battery power until it shuts itself off because the battery is empty of charge, unless the BTR3 is disconnected and reconnected to the power banks before the BTR3's battery runs out of charge.  If that is done, just like it happens with the chargers, the BTR3's battery gets fully charged by the charging source until it is full and then the BTR3 switches to run on its own battery power, again.

Has anyone noticed a different charging behavior with the BTR3?


----------



## sidecross

Alberto01 said:


> I ran several tests to determine my BTR3's charging behavior. It is exactly how I said that it "seemed to be".
> 
> I tested my BTR3 with 2 chargers, 2 power banks, 2 current (Volts and Amps) meters, and 3 charging cables.  The charging behavior with the chargers is that the BTR3 gets fully charged after it is connected to the chargers.  Once the battery is full, the BTR3 starts drawing its charge from the battery for about 3 hours. Then, it draws current from the chargers for about 25 minutes until the battery is fully charged.  Then, after about 3 hours the same thing happens again.  That way, the BTR3 will or would operate non-stop when left connected to a charger and the battery will remain between full and about 75% charged.
> 
> ...


Thank you for documenting the data you provided; it seems like a logical step to program the charging without the use of a trickle charging circuit.


----------



## salla45

mykeldg said:


> I see you also have a Chord Mojo. I know its a bit unfair, but can you compare  DAC / sound quality of the BTR3 to the Mojo? Is it night and Day or does the BTR3 hold its own? I've read that the AKM chip in the BTR3 has excellent SNR & THD.


Hi, I made some quick comparison earlier today to the Mojo, and nothing jumped out as lacking with the BTR3 in a/b listening. The Mojo has the edge in instrumental timbre, but the BTR3 signature didn't make me feel I wanted to jump back to the Mojo; ie nothing was lacking specifically.


----------



## sidecross (Feb 6, 2019)

salla45 said:


> Hi, I made some quick comparison earlier today to the Mojo, and nothing jumped out as lacking with the BTR3 in a/b listening. The Mojo has the edge in instrumental timbre, but the BTR3 signature didn't make me feel I wanted to jump back to the Mojo; ie nothing was lacking specifically.


I am using fh5, fa7, fa1, and sony mdr-1am2 with a source of an iphone se and apple music going through btr1k or fiio  q5 and running flat eq.

The fa1 really has no advantage while running on the q5, but sounds fine at moderate volume with either the iphone or btr1k.

The the others, fh5, fa7, and mdr-1am2 sound much better on the q5. Their full sound signature can be played at a higher volume while maintaining the 'sweet spot' in an iem's tuning. This is the set up I use for music.


----------



## Sylmar

Is there a big sound difference in BTR3 and BTR1K? Worth upgrading for sound?


----------



## sidecross

Sylmar said:


> Is there a big sound difference in BTR3 and BTR1K? Worth upgrading for sound?


Not really,  https://www.fiio.com/btr1k_comparison


----------



## sidecross

An edit to my post above concerning the q5 and btr1k:

The btr1k at 16 ohms has 45 mW while the fiio q5 with am3-a at 16 ohms has an output of 200 mW.

To my ears this is horsepower needed to produce the 'sweetspot' at a higher volume. In my view the fa1 was designed for lower milliwatt power


----------



## Sylmar

sidecross said:


> Not really,  https://www.fiio.com/btr1k_comparison



Thanks for the info!


----------



## salla45

sidecross said:


> I am using fh5, fa7, fa1, and sony mdr-1am2 with a source of an iphone se and apple music going through btr1k or fiio  q5 and running flat eq.
> 
> The fa1 really has no advantage while running on the q5, but sounds fine at moderate volume with either the iphone or btr1k.
> 
> The the others, fh5, fa7, and mdr-1am2 sound much better on the q5. Their full sound signature can be played at a higher volume while maintaining the 'sweet spot' in an iem's tuning. This is the set up I use for music.


I have the FH5, great iem's. I can often prefer to them to my Beyerdynamic T1's for convenience. I mean, the difference ain't _*that *_great to push me to bother with the T1 rig.


----------



## archy121

Sylmar said:


> Is there a big sound difference in BTR3 and BTR1K? Worth upgrading for sound?



It’s more about the additional BT support for LDAC, APTX-LL etc so potentially you could say it has better sound.


----------



## Alberto01 (Feb 7, 2019)

sidecross said:


> Thank you for documenting the data you provided; it seems like a logical step to program the charging without the use of a trickle charging circuit.


You are welcome.

I would have liked to have the trickle charge circuit to save battery charge/discharge cycles whenever is practical to run the BTR3 connected to a charger. But, knowing that the BTR3 requires just about 0.02 Amperes (at about 5.10 Volts) to run with IEMs, it might not be easy to get just a trickle charge at all times when the BTR3's battery is full. And you don't want more than a trickle charge on a full battery, running the risk of overcharging and getting a non-removable bulged battery. No way!

The BTR3's battery gets recharged at 0.15-0.16 Amperes at about 5.10 Volts, and runs on not much more than 1/10 of that amount of current with IEMs.


----------



## Alberto01

sidecross, I meant to say 0.15-0.16 instead of 0.015-0.016 in my last post. I already edited it with the correct numbers.


----------



## sidecross

Alberto01 said:


> sidecross, I meant to say 0.15-0.16 instead of 0.015-0.016 in my last post. I already edited it with the correct numbers.


It is remarkable the resolution that these meters provide.


----------



## sidecross

salla45 said:


> I have the FH5, great iem's. I can often prefer to them to my Beyerdynamic T1's for convenience. I mean, the difference ain't _*that *_great to push me to bother with the T1 rig.


Most of my listening is to audio books, audm audio magazines, and other spoken word media, but when I listen to music the fiio q5 is not that big of a rig for me to use.  The difference to my ears is substantial when I compare the diffrence.


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 8, 2019)

Has anyone tried the Colorfly BT-C1? It has ESS DAC instead of AKM. I find the AKM in general to be a bit unnatural in the mids and bass and narrow sounding compared to my Dragonfly Black.

How about compared to ES100?

I love my BTR3 but I am curious if there are any better solutions out there.


----------



## 5twnr (Feb 8, 2019)

baradona said:


> Apologies if the answer is elsewhere in the thread and I haven't found it.
> 
> I'm trying to get the BTR3 to connect to my MacBook using AptX HD.  I use Bluetooth Explorer to force AptX (over AAC) and the laptop connects to the BTR3 using AptX.  Other headphones (B&W PX ) connect using AptX HD.  Any ideas?


Would like the answer to this as well!

I'm finding that in usb DAC mode, the onboard Macbook DAC seems to sound better - the soundstage is wider and there is less compression of percussion instruments. Not sure if this is just me? Testing on my DT770 pro.


----------



## mykeldg

5twnr said:


> Would like the answer to this as well!
> 
> I'm finding that in usb DAC mode, the onboard Macbook DAC seems to sound better - the soundstage is wider and there is less compression of percussion instruments. Not sure if this is just me? Testing on my DT770 pro.



Same here, even iphone out seems to sound fuller.

BTR3 sounds like it has more depth but it is less forward in the mids which makes everything sound narrow and less full. But I do notice more details in the BTR3 if your mind has adjusted to its sound signature.


----------



## MarkF786

I tried connecting the BTR3 to my iPhone with a CCK adapter and USB cable and got the message “attached accessory uses too much power”.  It’s kinda surprising, considering the device is battery powered.

I guess this only works via Bluetooth with an iPhone?


----------



## Janjohnnn (Feb 9, 2019)

mykeldg said:


> Same here, even iphone out seems to sound fuller.
> 
> BTR3 sounds like it has more depth but it is less forward in the mids which makes everything sound narrow and less full. But I do notice more details in the BTR3 if your mind has adjusted to its sound signature.



That's exactly what I'm feeling with my btr3 rn. It's been a month I've been using the btr3 paired with FH5 and yesterday I just tried using dongle, and do noticed the difference. I actually falling out of love with the btr3 now

The first time i got the btr3 my impression was that it has a bit better details. But now, I also noticed the vocals isn't as forward with the fh5 (that's actually fine) but some of the instruments imaging sometimes gets lost.
Btr3 does make the sound deeper and less full.

Any bluetooth dac that portrays a better soundstage? Not just making it deeper, but also maybe make the imaging better? Do imaging also gets better with some source? Im just a reg consumer and dont know much about audio, sorry xD


----------



## 5twnr

After some experimenting, it seems like the audio quality is markedly better when I pair the BTR3 to my android phone, a Oneplus 6. Here it's using the LDAC codec vs what I assume is just Aptx (not even HD!) from my Macbook Pro. What I don't understand is why this sounds even better than wired mode from my Macbook! Is the USB Dac mode not the same as LDAC? Couldn't find any specifics on this.

I would love to hear if it's possible to make my Macbook output Aptx HD to it


----------



## jeffri

Janjohnnn said:


> That's exactly what I'm feeling with my btr3 rn. It's been a month I've been using the btr3 paired with FH5 and yesterday I just tried using dongle, and do noticed the difference. I actually falling out of love with the btr3 now
> 
> The first time i got the btr3 my impression was that it has a bit better details. But now, I also noticed the vocals isn't as forward with the fh5 (that's actually fine) but some of the instruments imaging sometimes gets lost.
> Btr3 does make the sound deeper and less full.
> ...



The AT-PHA55BT remains my favorite due to the soundstage and imaging, even though technically the BTR3 is better.


----------



## Alberto01

jeffri said:


> The AT-PHA55BT remains my favorite due to the soundstage and imaging, even though technically the BTR3 is better.



What is better about the BTR3 compared to the AT-PHA55BT?


----------



## jeffri

Technicality like the noise floor, resolution and even extension on the low end, the BTR3 wins. But it can't create a soundstage and imaging like the AT-PHA55BT could, which is more holographic.


----------



## rkw (Feb 10, 2019)

5twnr said:


> it seems like the audio quality is markedly better when I pair the BTR3 to my android phone, a Oneplus 6. Here it's using the LDAC codec vs what I assume is just Aptx (not even HD!) from my Macbook Pro.


Your Macbook Pro should connect with AAC, which sounds pretty good (better than regular aptX). While music is playing, view which codec it's using by pressing the option key and clicking on the Bluetooth icon and select the device. Maybe it's connecting on SBC and you may need to enable AAC and aptX on your Mac.
https://www.macrumors.com/how-to/enable-aptx-aac-bluetooth-audio-codecs-macos/



5twnr said:


> Is the USB Dac mode not the same as LDAC?


No. LDAC (and aptX) are codecs for Bluetooth only. On USB, the BTR3 supports up to 16 bit 48kHz resolution. If your source is CD quality, it will stream lossless.


----------



## 5twnr

rkw said:


> Your Macbook Pro should connect with AAC, which sounds pretty good (better than regular aptX). While music is playing, view which codec it's using by pressing the option key and clicking on the Bluetooth icon and select the device. Maybe it's connecting on SBC and you may need to enable AAC and aptX on your Mac.
> https://www.macrumors.com/how-to/enable-aptx-aac-bluetooth-audio-codecs-macos/
> 
> No. LDAC (and aptX) are codecs for Bluetooth only. On USB, the BTR3 supports up to 16 bit 48kHz resolution. If your source is CD quality, it will stream lossless.



It seems like the Macbook Pro is connecting via Aptx (not HD). I can try forcing AAC.

For USB, it definitely seems worse quality than straight off the headphone jack or LDAC with my Android.


----------



## rkw

5twnr said:


> For USB, it definitely seems worse quality than straight off the headphone jack


That's really odd. The Mac should stream the audio straight through USB to the BTR3 (downsample to 48k if you're playing hi-res files). I don't think there's any setting for the BTR3 that would affect it. What music player on the Mac are you using?


----------



## 5twnr (Feb 10, 2019)

rkw said:


> That's really odd. The Mac should stream the audio straight through USB to the BTR3 (downsample to 48k if you're playing hi-res files). I don't think there's any setting for the BTR3 that would affect it. What music player on the Mac are you using?



Using iTunes with no equalizer

I also have a usb-c only Mac, so I need to use a USB-c -> USB -> USB-c to get to the BTR3. Could it be the conversion?


----------



## rkw (Feb 10, 2019)

5twnr said:


> I also have a usb-c only Mac, so I need to use a USB-c -> USB -> USB-c to get to the BTR3. Could it be the conversion?


You should be able to use USB-C to USB-C cable. From post #752:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-51#post-14639700


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 10, 2019)

5twnr said:


> Using iTunes with no equalizer
> 
> I also have a usb-c only Mac, so I need to use a USB-c -> USB -> USB-c to get to the BTR3. Could it be the conversion?



Try changing the Samplerate from 48khz to 44.1khz. That's what I did and it sound better; especially since 90% of audio and streaming are encoded in 44.1khz anyway. Forcing 48KHz sounded less detailed to me.

I doubt any added USB interface / adapter would affect a digital signal. That said, LDAC I believe runs at 24-bit. So yes, it is possible that LDAC have better dynamic range than via USB which is capped at 16-bit.


----------



## Mujaji

How does the Btr3 handle connecting to an android Phone and a Windows PC at the same time?

I have a Btr1 and if it connects to two devices at the same time and I walk away from the PC it will beep every 5 seconds forever until I power cycle the unit. Does the btr3 handle this anymore gracefully? I used to use a Sony SBH20 and it was much more flexible and I could stay connected to both devices and walk away and come back to either device with no problems. With the Btr1 I feel like my head has an invisible tether attached to my computer.


----------



## mykeldg

Mujaji said:


> How does the Btr3 handle connecting to an android Phone and a Windows PC at the same time?
> 
> I have a Btr1 and if it connects to two devices at the same time and I walk away from the PC it will beep every 5 seconds forever until I power cycle the unit. Does the btr3 handle this anymore gracefully? I used to use a Sony SBH20 and it was much more flexible and I could stay connected to both devices and walk away and come back to either device with no problems. With the Btr1 I feel like my head has an invisible tether attached to my computer.


You can set in the App to switch off auto select source. So that way it doesn't switch back and forth automatically between the 2 devices every time you get a notification sound from the PC.


----------



## Mujaji

mykeldg said:


> You can set in the App to switch off auto select source. So that way it doesn't switch back and forth automatically between the 2 devices every time you get a notification sound from the PC.


Thanks for the info, does It constantly beep at you when you are out of range of one of the devices? That is my biggest problem, Windows 10 is VERY aggressive at reconnecting to bluetooth devices, so I walk past my computer it connects then I go to the other side of the house or leave the house and it beeps constantly over whatever I'm listening forever to until I power the unit off and on again. All other bluetooth devices I have used up until now will give you one disconnection sound and then stop, and I've gotten used to being able to move between my phone and PC effortlessly.

My only solution is for forget the device on the windows PC and repair it from scratch whenever I need to use it which is a lot of steps and annoying. I like everything else about the BTR1 but I can't buy a BTR3 without knowing if its going to have this same annoyance. But it is so specific it's never going to be in a review or a spec sheet.


----------



## gwertheim

How does it compare to the BTR1K, I have that and it works very well not just for music but for YouTube and movies without any sync issues


----------



## mykeldg

Mujaji said:


> Thanks for the info, does It constantly beep at you when you are out of range of one of the devices? That is my biggest problem, Windows 10 is VERY aggressive at reconnecting to bluetooth devices, so I walk past my computer it connects then I go to the other side of the house or leave the house and it beeps constantly over whatever I'm listening forever to until I power the unit off and on again. All other bluetooth devices I have used up until now will give you one disconnection sound and then stop, and I've gotten used to being able to move between my phone and PC effortlessly.
> 
> My only solution is for forget the device on the windows PC and repair it from scratch whenever I need to use it which is a lot of steps and annoying. I like everything else about the BTR1 but I can't buy a BTR3 without knowing if its going to have this same annoyance. But it is so specific it's never going to be in a review or a spec sheet.



I do not get the beeping sound. But I am not sure why exactly you get beeping sound in your setup -- it may also be a specific case to your config. But as far as the BTR3 in my setup, when connected to 2 devices, I do not get any beeping. But It gets annoying when it switches between sources when I get notification sounds from either devices and the music gets cut out for a few seconds (to play the notf sound) until it goes back to the device that is playing the music.


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 10, 2019)

gwertheim said:


> How does it compare to the BTR1K, I have that and it works very well not just for music but for YouTube and movies without any sync issues


I've heard BTR1k has the best bluetooth range / reception. BTR3 has a slightly improved sound quality, and more codecs like LDAC, LHDC and aptx LL. See this youtube vid for sound quality comparison :

   (listen via headphones)


----------



## y2jdmbfan

Does anyone know if this will drive the Kaiser Encore well?


----------



## Dobrescu George

y2jdmbfan said:


> Does anyone know if this will drive the Kaiser Encore well?



Fair would be the best way to describe it I think 

I mean, you would be getting better overall quality by using better DAC/AMP units , especially wired units instead of Bluetooth, but for the price, it is hard to find anything that beats BTR3.


----------



## y2jdmbfan

Dobrescu George said:


> Fair would be the best way to describe it I think
> 
> I mean, you would be getting better overall quality by using better DAC/AMP units , especially wired units instead of Bluetooth, but for the price, it is hard to find anything that beats BTR3.



Thanks. I'm looking for something small and portable that I can use with my Pixel 3XL and / or my iPhone XS Max and the Kaiser Encore customs I have.


----------



## archy121 (Feb 11, 2019)

mykeldg said:


> I've heard BTR1k has the best bluetooth range / reception. BTR3 has a slightly improved sound quality, and more codecs like LDAC, LHDC and aptx LL. See this youtube vid for sound quality comparison :
> 
> (listen via headphones)




Add APTX-HD to BTR3 video list.

APTX-HD & LDAC are not slight or minor improvements - it’s the best audio that you can get over BT.

LDAC is LOSSLESS 24/96 levels using wireless.
In many situations it’s good enough solution to replace wired solution.

The HD codecs are huge point of buying BTR3 over BTK1. I have had no issues with range when using the BT3 with LG V30 or Iphone MAX.


----------



## Samadroid

At this point I'd be curious to know whether a BTR3-K revision with bluetooth 5 (and possibly slightly more output power) can be expected in the near future. It would be the ultimate portable solution.


----------



## Dobrescu George

y2jdmbfan said:


> Thanks. I'm looking for something small and portable that I can use with my Pixel 3XL and / or my iPhone XS Max and the Kaiser Encore customs I have.



Ths should be it, from the stuff I tested  



Samadroid said:


> At this point I'd be curious to know whether a BTR3-K revision with bluetooth 5 (and possibly slightly more output power) can be expected in the near future. It would be the ultimate portable solution.



More power surely would be welcome


----------



## darrylchew

salla45 said:


> Ok , so i got my shiny new BTR3 today  - sounding fine... Ldac paired to my Note 8, brill.
> 
> Silly question... but how do I know when it's fully charged?



greetings, does the BTR3 drop connection easily wehn the line of sight is blocked, say by cloth or bag? i have the BTR1 and it works great. am thinking of getting the BTR3 for a better sound. but read from some reviews that connection is its weakness.


----------



## archy121 (Feb 12, 2019)

darrylchew said:


> greetings, does the BTR3 drop connection easily wehn the line of sight is blocked, say by cloth or bag? i have the BTR1 and it works great. am thinking of getting the BTR3 for a better sound. but read from some reviews that connection is its weakness.



I’m able to leave it in the dining room and go into
Kitchen without dropping signal even using LDAC.
APTX-LL Works great sitting 4m away from my TV without lipsync issues. No problems with phone in pocket. Line of sight has not been an issue for me.

You also need to consider how good the BT transmitter is implemented on the DAP/phone and if you have potential WiFi interference with BT channel.

I use LG V30 and my WiFi Router is on N and AC.

@Dobrescu George more Power would be great but before that you would need to address the battery.
Longer battery life would be number one request in next model even it was made few mm bigger.
So tiny at the moment it wouldn’t harm it being slightly bigger to accommodate a better battery.

Better battery would be my only reason to upgrade.

@y2jdmbfan i confirm that it works fine with my iPhone MAX. Just a shame it’s limited to AAC. 
Once you start using HiRes files with LDAC nothing else seems worth using.


----------



## darrylchew

archy121 said:


> I’m able to leave it in the dining room and go into
> Kitchen without dropping signal even using LDAC.
> APTX-LL Works great sitting 4m away from my TV without lipsync issues. No problems with phone in pocket. Line of sight has not been an issue for me.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I am using btr1 and listening to tidal n Spotify only. Wondering if it would help increase SQ


----------



## archy121

darrylchew said:


> Thanks. I am using btr1 and listening to tidal n Spotify only. Wondering if it would help increase SQ



Tidal HiFi lossless tracks may improve your listening experience if you use at least APTX-HD or much better LDAC. Only they have the bandwidth to deliver lossless 16/44 over BT. Spotify no gain as BTR1 good enough for lossy quality.


----------



## salla45

darrylchew said:


> greetings, does the BTR3 drop connection easily wehn the line of sight is blocked, say by cloth or bag? i have the BTR1 and it works great. am thinking of getting the BTR3 for a better sound. but read from some reviews that connection is its weakness.


yes i was worried too about the connection, we probably read the same review, lol.

I think that review must've had some oddness specifically.

 Ive had it under several layers of clothing, coat, jacket, 2 scarves, and the phone in pocket  of trousers, and had no issues.

Running a test now..LDAC connected to my Note 8... Ive just tried it out right now leaving phone in my office room, walking out into living room, through into kitchen, and there's minimal cutout, only when I get to the kitchen and move around (ok if i stay still in there), and that's through 2 (thickish wooden) walls and furniture, etc. And that's a full 5-6m away from the phone, lol.

That's good enough for me!!!


----------



## mhoopes (Feb 13, 2019)

I've found it difficult to distinguish between LDAC and AAC in practice, except for the following:

AAC: More latency when watching video. This is likely due to higher computation overhead in decoding, with its more advanced perceptual encoding. The CSR8675 SOC has its limitations in this regard.
LDAC: Relatively low latency. 990 Kb/s mode is finicky with regards to 2.4 GHz background RF levels (Wi-Fi routers, other BT radios in close proximity). It's quite apparent when the signal quality is low; the audio stream will exhibit severe stuttering/warbling. When I turn off my iPad and iPhone BT radios, which are on an end table next to my chair, the problem goes away.


----------



## samuelnsh

@FiiO 

Any plans for USB DAC support on Linux? As of BTR3 firmware v 1.0, both my Arch Linux desktop and Ubuntu 18.04 LTS laptop are able to show the BTR 3 audio device but no sound comes out when I select it. The same issue occurs with my friend's BTR 3 when I connect it to my Linux machines.

Bluetooth does work, but when I'm in front of the computer I'd rather use the USB DAC functionality. There's also the fact that I can't use Bluetooth on a flight.

Thanks!


----------



## Giovanni58

Hi guys. 
An information, please. I begin by saying that I am very ignorant about the DAC amps. I just bought a Fiio M6, I like the sound but I would like to have a warmer sound. Is the Fiio BTR3 good for that or does not change anything? Some other DAC that is very portable is not too expensive?
Thanks


----------



## archy121

Giovanni58 said:


> Hi guys.
> An information, please. I begin by saying that I am very ignorant about the DAC amps. I just bought a Fiio M6, I like the sound but I would like to have a warmer sound. Is the Fiio BTR3 good for that or does not change anything? Some other DAC that is very portable is not too expensive?
> Thanks



 Know that the selling point of this item is BT Transmission using APTXHD and LDAC. And as that it offers great sound quality. 

It can’t compete with desktop DACs and nor is it meant to.  Best you will get is 16/44 or 24/44 I believe.


----------



## mhoopes

archy121 said:


> Know that the selling point of this item is BT Transmission using APTXHD and LDAC. And as that it offers great sound quality.
> 
> It can’t compete with desktop DACs and nor is it meant to.  Best you will get is 16/44 or 24/44 I believe.


Yes, the AK4376A DAC/amp section is plenty capable for a wide range of portable applications, but the CSR8675 SOC can only do USB Audio 1.0. (16/44.1, or maybe 16/48).


----------



## Giovanni58

archy121 said:


> Know that the selling point of this item is BT Transmission using APTXHD and LDAC. And as that it offers great sound quality.
> 
> It can’t compete with desktop DACs and nor is it meant to. Best you will get is 16/44 or 24/44 I believe.




I would use it only on the move, no desckop. What interests me and that can make the sound a little warmer. Using it with the cable (no Bluetooh) how is the sound?


----------



## darrylchew

Anyone used the fiio q5 vs btr3? Am thinking or either. I can ge t the fiio q5 for a double the price of btr3 used in good condition. Dunno if it's a better deal (with SQ in mind)


----------



## Dobrescu George

darrylchew said:


> Anyone used the fiio q5 vs btr3? Am thinking or either. I can ge t the fiio q5 for a double the price of btr3 used in good condition. Dunno if it's a better deal (with SQ in mind)



The difference is huge, not even a contest  

Go for Q5 in this situation, if you don't need the portability of BTR3


----------



## sidecross

Dobrescu George said:


> The difference is huge, not even a contest
> 
> Go for Q5 in this situation, if you don't need the portability of BTR3


I totally agree!

The q5 is what I use for music.

The btr1k ( I use two) is what I use for all night listening. I listen to spoken word and low volume music during horizontal hours.


----------



## y2jdmbfan

I’m torn between this, the Chord Mojo, or the Cozoy Rei or Takt Pro. Not looking for Bluetooth audio. I’d like it to be portable, want to use it between Pixel 3XL or iPhone XS Max and my Noble Kaiser Encore customs.


----------



## darrylchew

for playing songs from spotify, will a q5 have better SQ than a x5iii?


----------



## Dobrescu George

darrylchew said:


> for playing songs from spotify, will a q5 have better SQ than a x5iii?



Yes, much much better  

I reviewed both already, please don't hesitate if you have any questions 

https://www.audiophile-heaven.com/2018/05/fiio-q5-rule-them-all.html


----------



## darrylchew

Thanks.. So basically I connect q5 to hop via Bluetooth n listen w iem on the q5? Works w android right..? I was thinking w x5iii the decoding within the Dap and won't be limited by Bluetooth...thereforw should be better sounding....plus I could play my collection of songs on it too.


----------



## darrylchew

Dobrescu George said:


> Yes, much much better
> 
> I reviewed both already, please don't hesitate if you have any questions
> 
> https://www.audiophile-heaven.com/2018/05/fiio-q5-rule-them-all.html




thanks for the info.
basically my intend of use:
X5iii: connect x5iii via wifi thru my phone(huawei p20pro) hotspot. listen to spotify via app in x5iii. iem( jh Lola) plugged in to balanced 2.5mm port.
Q5:connect to my phone via bluetooth as source. (not going to use OTg to wire out). listen to spotify with iem plugged into balanced port at Q5.

thanks from the comprehensive reivew. now i only have the lola and find the lows sont sit low and tight enough though the amount could be increased via the bass port.was abit concern with the x5 beginning adding too much warmth and bloatedness in the low end. as for the Q5, i read the bass is deeper and tighter. more of what i wanted.
added bonus for x5 is i could listen to my whole collection of music at loseless. then again most of them are avaible on spotify and the difference greatly audible..thus i dont mind going 100% spotify.]
would like to here your advice. thanks!


----------



## Brooko

Dobrescu George said:


> Yes, much much better
> 
> I reviewed both already, please don't hesitate if you have any questions
> 
> https://www.audiophile-heaven.com/2018/05/fiio-q5-rule-them-all.html



Please quantify this.  I also have both - and the answer is ..... it depends on.


Which module the Q5 has, and what headphone you're using
Your personal taste in tonality
How you want to listen to your music
What you value in portability
For example - and these are the first ones I thought of.

if I prefer to have a more minimal and more portable experience, I might find the X5iii or the M9 better than a Q5 - as then I don't have to carry a source device as well.
if I prefer to have my phone decoupled from my music - then the choice is obvious and its not the Q5
If I'm listening to IEMs and don't need the extra power, then it becomes a real choice (preference of tonality)
In terms of sound quality

Both have distortion levels below our audibility thresholds
Both have low impedance outputs
Both have good SNR ratios and cross-talk measurements beyond our audibility
Saying one is better than the other is (IMO) quite silly.  The answer is - it depends on what your preferences are.  SQ is about the same.

The better answer is:

If you're driving a harder to drive headphone the Q5 has better power options - depending on the module
If you prefer a warmer, richer tonality, both can be viable options - but with the Q5, you will need a different amp module to achieve this
If you prefer a more neutral sound, the Q5 has better module options to achieve this
If you prefer a device to uncouple yourself from your phone - then the X5iii or M9 are better options
If you prefer your phone's UI and just want better SQ than your phone, the Q5 is probably the better option
I could go on - but you get the gist.  Saying the Q5 is "much better" than the X5iii for Spotify listening - without quantifying context is at best misleading, and at worst totally incorrect.  At least find out what the person values (attributes), then you can give them a more informed reply.

FWIW, I use Spotify, and have both the Q5 and the X5iii.  They are both fantastic sounding devices.  Unless I'm using the HD800S, Alara or HD300, 9/10 I'll either be using the X5iii or direct from my iPhone SE.  If I'm using my full sized, and moving around the house - then I'd take the Q5.


----------



## darrylchew

Brooko said:


> Please quantify this.  I also have both - and the answer is ..... it depends on.
> 
> 
> Which module the Q5 has, and what headphone you're using
> ...


Just for a used 6 month old q5 for usd220. And u are right that it's impossible to quantify which is better. That's why I decided to get one to try it out.
Initially was quite shocked how much warmth it added compare to btr1. Then I realized one can adjust the low pass filter. Switch it too slow its much better.
My final reason for getting the q5..  
1. U don't try u will never know...rraaly impossible to correctly to quantify the type of sound but a generalisation. 
2. Figured that I am likely to change hp more frequently than amp or Dap. So depending on hp as source and q5 as dac/amp only.


----------



## Brooko

If you are intending to use your phone as source - then Q5 over X5iii.  And use the Bluetooth.  Everyone I know who tests properly (volume matched) can't tell a difference between wired and wireless.

Pointless getting a  DAP if you need a dac/amp and don't intend using the DAPs main feature (ie that its a music player)


----------



## mykeldg

Brooko said:


> Please quantify this.  I also have both - and the answer is ..... it depends on.
> 
> 
> Which module the Q5 has, and what headphone you're using
> ...



Do you also have the BTR3? Would be interested to know how SQ alone compares to the Q5 and X5. TIA


----------



## darrylchew

Brooko said:


> If you are intending to use your phone as source - then Q5 over X5iii.  And use the Bluetooth.  Everyone I know who tests properly (volume matched) can't tell a difference between wired and wireless.
> 
> Pointless getting a  DAP if you need a dac/amp and don't intend using the DAPs main feature (ie that its a music player)


Got the q5... Irritating thing is the low pass filter had to be set everytime. Set to low keep changing back to sharp each time the q5 is off.


----------



## darrylchew (Feb 15, 2019)

Had the q5 barely 6 hrs. So far side by side listening vs btr1... Btr1 sounds more fun q5 sounds wider and shot of boring.

Anyway I kinda of like the setup. Iem connected to q5 in pocket. Control via phone. Can watch Netflix w it too... 
Comparing the difference between q5 n btr1... I think the difference between btr3 vs q5 is going to be huge. But just different


----------



## Dobrescu George

Brooko said:


> Please quantify this.  I also have both - and the answer is ..... it depends on.
> 
> 
> Which module the Q5 has, and what headphone you're using
> ...



Good points all of them actually.  

X5-3 is less revealing than Q5 due to its lack in treble energy and smooth nature, so Q5 is more detailed. Of course someone might want that smooth / warm signature of X5, but I'm assuming that someone asking this question is asking about detail levels, where Q5 outperforms X5-3, regardless of which AMP module is strapped to Q5. 

BTR3 is simply for portability, it doesn't have the detail, clarity, power, and refinement of Q5. BTR3 is a ~70 USD device and performs well for that price range, maybe using below 300 USD IEMs would make them more similar, but Q5 is considerably more detailed and revealing, has a deeper soundstage. I have reviewed BTR3 an the other BTR receivers for their price range, they aren't alternatives to Q5 or iFi xDSD, the BTR modules series are good for what they do, being ultra-small and portable.  

My smartphone, Xiaomi Mi Max 3, is so far from either Q5 or X5-3, that I could never in my entire life use it for music, it literally struggles with IEMs to get me the volume I need without distortions. 



darrylchew said:


> Had the q5 barely 6 hrs. So far side by side listening vs btr1... Btr1 sounds more fun q5 sounds wider and shot of boring.



Do you have the same feeling if you are using bass boost on Q5? 

Also, please try using Q5 wired instead of bluetooth.


----------



## digititus

Dobrescu George said:


> BTR3 is simply for portability, it doesn't have the detail, clarity, power, and refinement of Q5. BTR3 is a ~70 USD device and performs well for that price range, maybe using below 300 USD IEMs would make them more similar, but Q5 is considerably more detailed and revealing, has a deeper soundstage. I have reviewed BTR3 an the other BTR receivers for their price range, they aren't alternatives to Q5 or iFi xDSD, the BTR modules series are good for what they do, being ultra-small and portable.
> .



I have found that price is a poor indicator of performance and using it as a comparative tool for subjective quality rather pointless.
The BTR3 is perhaps the finest audio purchase I have made in 25 years! Paired with my phone using LDAC and IEM's I can immerse myself in sound all day. Everything is present in the music and the sound signature is easily changed by changing headphones. I use with DUNU 2000-J and Falcon C. Switching to desktop setup, there is 'maybe' a little more detail and space, but for portable use, external sounds will be far more of a detriment to sound to worry about this extra 2%.


----------



## Dobrescu George

digititus said:


> I have found that price is a poor indicator of performance and using it as a comparative tool for subjective quality rather pointless.
> The BTR3 is perhaps the finest audio purchase I have made in 25 years! Paired with my phone using LDAC and IEM's I can immerse myself in sound all day. Everything is present in the music and the sound signature is easily changed by changing headphones. I use with DUNU 2000-J and Falcon C. Switching to desktop setup, there is 'maybe' a little more detail and space, but for portable use, external sounds will be far more of a detriment to sound to worry about this extra 2%.



Welp 

Price is a bad indicator of quality and performance sometimes, but Falcon-C and DN2000-J are exactly the type of IEMs where BTR3 would do a really good job. I think that BTR3 and Q5 would also be rather similar with F9Pro and FH5, to keep the setup entirely FiiO.

Something more expensive / revealing, like say, Accoustune HS1650CU reveals the differences between BTR3 and Q5 quite fast.


----------



## digititus

Dobrescu George said:


> Welp
> 
> Price is a bad indicator of quality and performance sometimes, but Falcon-C and DN2000-J are exactly the type of IEMs where BTR3 would do a really good job. I think that BTR3 and Q5 would also be rather similar with F9Pro and FH5, to keep the setup entirely FiiO.
> 
> Something more expensive / revealing, like say, Accoustune HS1650CU reveals the differences between BTR3 and Q5 quite fast.


As my hearing is no longer functioning in the ultrasonic frequencies, I'm not sure I would notice these differences in a portable situation unless lack of power was an issue.  As you have rightly noted, changing the IEM is going to have the greatest impact on the presentation.


----------



## darrylchew (Feb 15, 2019)

Dobrescu George said:


> Good points all of them actually.
> 
> X5-3 is less revealing than Q5 due to its lack in treble energy and smooth nature, so Q5 is more detailed. Of course someone might want that smooth / warm signature of X5, but I'm assuming that someone asking this question is asking about detail levels, where Q5 outperforms X5-3, regardless of which AMP module is strapped to Q5.
> 
> ...


I am using it with Bluetooth and not tampering with wired cos I wont use it anyway even if it's good... Too cumbersome 
I actually have the bass boost on without knowing. N I thought I just wasted my money on the q5. Also the bass sounded bloated n highs lack shimmer.
But after I turned off the bass boost. Set the low pass filter to slow(no echo) and the reduce the bass knob on my lola from 3 to abt slightly less than 2. Then sound very good now. Wider stage... But not depth. Less warmth than btr1. Very good separation n mids. Lows are there when it's supposed to be there but no overwhelming.
As I have mentioned in previous replies...
1. The low pass filter kept switching back to sharp.
2. Everytime I turn q5 on must press the paring button... Btr is better here. Just on it and it will pair.
Still adjusting to the sound.


----------



## hotdog108

y2jdmbfan said:


> I’m torn between this, the Chord Mojo, or the Cozoy Rei or Takt Pro. Not looking for Bluetooth audio. I’d like it to be portable, want to use it between Pixel 3XL or iPhone XS Max and my Noble Kaiser Encore customs.


It's fine, I use it with my Encore customs and iPhone Xs as the daily driver. Have been using this setup since August, it does have a bit of compression artifacts, but then again we're not talking about a $500 DAC/AMP. I considered the other products you mentioned, but decided on the BTR3 because of portability, battery life, and value.


----------



## darrylchew

hotdog108 said:


> It's fine, I use it with my Encore customs and iPhone Xs as the daily driver. Have been using this setup since August, it does have a bit of compression artifacts, but then again we're not talking about a $500 DAC/AMP. I considered the other products you mentioned, but decided on the BTR3 because of portability, battery life, and value.


Q5 sound isn't very much better than btr1... Just different. I would believe btr3 would be the same... Sound different but can really say it's better or worst...but definitely way better value than q5


----------



## hotdog108

darrylchew said:


> Q5 sound isn't very much better than btr1... Just different. I would believe btr3 would be the same... Sound different but can really say it's better or worst...but definitely way better value than q5


I wasn't even considering the Q5, I wanted something I can clip to the collar of my shirt. I have the E12DIY from Fiio that I'm using for my LCD2.2, which I think sounds better than the Q5, but that's based on comparisons done at CanJam, so the noisy environment could've thrown me off.


----------



## darrylchew

hotdog108 said:


> I wasn't even considering the Q5, I wanted something I can clip to the collar of my shirt. I have the E12DIY from Fiio that I'm using for my LCD2.2, which I think sounds better than the Q5, but that's based on comparisons done at CanJam, so the noisy environment could've thrown me off.


Ya. btr 1/3 is is way to go for convenience..
For me is all hype around the q5... I need to hear it... Sound is truly subjective. I recently audited the aaw w9000 cos of all the rav review... To me they sounded terrible for its price... I ended up with the lola.. Sounded way better than w9000


----------



## hotdog108

darrylchew said:


> Ya. btr 1/3 is is way to go for convenience..
> For me is all hype around the q5... I need to hear it... Sound is truly subjective. I recently audited the aaw w9000 cos of all the rav review... To me they sounded terrible for its price... I ended up with the lola.. Sounded way better than w9000


I listened to Lola and all other JH offerings at CanJam, along with a few dozen others, but resonated the most with the Noble Kaiser Encore, which is what I have now. As you said, it's subjective.


----------



## sidecross

The q5 when compared my btr1k is of no question to me; the q5 is superior.


----------



## sidecross

I can easily use the q5 when being mobile; iphone se in one jacket pocket and q5 in the other side pocket. 

I use the smaller btr1k for when in bed at night with short 45 cm cable.


----------



## Dobrescu George

darrylchew said:


> I am using it with Bluetooth and not tampering with wired cos I wont use it anyway even if it's good... Too cumbersome
> I actually have the bass boost on without knowing. N I thought I just wasted my money on the q5. Also the bass sounded bloated n highs lack shimmer.
> But after I turned off the bass boost. Set the low pass filter to slow(no echo) and the reduce the bass knob on my lola from 3 to abt slightly less than 2. Then sound very good now. Wider stage... But not depth. Less warmth than btr1. Very good separation n mids. Lows are there when it's supposed to be there but no overwhelming.
> As I have mentioned in previous replies...
> ...



Oh, I see! 

Happy you now found happy with it! 

I haven't noticed the filter issues as I have been using it only with the filter on the default state  

The bass boost on Q5 is not exactly what most people are looking for, it is a known thing about it. It should be less warm than BTR1K, which was a bit warm, q5, especially with AM03A should be extremely neutral  .


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 15, 2019)

seems im the only one here NOT using these DACs on IEM or headphones, atleast primarily. I use them on my Stereo System (Marantz Integrated Amp / Speakers) and I find differentiating between DACs easier without all the hoopla about impedance matching, under powering etc.

One thing's for sure, compared to my $200 Dragonfly, the BTR3 has more resolving detail and depth (more 3-dimensional). The dragonfly on the other hand sounds alot louder, wider and fuller in the mids -- FR seems flatter too. (BTR3 seem to have a bit of coloration in the bass, with a small dip in the mids.) BTR3 are more layered, Dragonflys are more textured.

And that is judging from AAC only. haven't heard LDAC & aptX-HD yet due to device limitation (apple). I tried APTX (non HD) on my laptop and was sorely disappointed.

For 70$ and judging on the SQ alone without the weak amplification, the BTR3 is a steal.


----------



## darrylchew (Feb 15, 2019)

hotdog108 said:


> I listened to Lola and all other JH offerings at CanJam, along with a few dozen others, but resonated the most with the Noble Kaiser Encore, which is what I have now. As you said, it's subjective.


I liked the encore too... Just that I ad the opportunity to get a minty lola of less than 1yr old for usd730. Thought it's better value.


----------



## hotdog108

darrylchew said:


> I liked the encode too... Just that I ad the opportunity to get a minty lola of less than 1yr old for usd730. Thought it's better value.


That's an awesome deal, very lucky!


----------



## darrylchew (Feb 15, 2019)

sidecross said:


> The q5 when compared my btr1k is of no question to me; the q5 is superior.


W q5, I can get very close to btr sound by changing filter to sharp. And turning iem bass port up. But I can't get q5 sound w btr 3. During the day I sometimes prefer btr warm sound. At night I kinda like q5 clean sound better. Though I actually cant hear whatever happening around me


----------



## sidecross (Feb 15, 2019)

darrylchew said:


> W q5, I can get very close to btr sound by changing filter to sharp. And turning iem bass port up. But I can't get q5 sound w btr 3. During the day I sometimes prefer btr warm sound. At night I kinda like q5 clean sound better. Though I actually can hear whatever happening around me


The main reason the q5 is my optimum choice is greater mW power and the the q5's 256 volume steps as compared to the 32 steps on the btr3 or btr1k.

When I listen at higher volume music I find the volume step control more important than eq.

I find for me the ideal 'sweet spot' for volume's best dynamic range does not pass the 1/3 mark of volume possibility. It is because of this concept that q5 running am3a modules has 200 mW @ 16 ohms compared to my btr1k which is ratted at 45 mW @ 16 ohms is my reasoning.

Each of us decide for ourselves what we find pleasing to our ears and mind. It may not be universal to every ones liking.


----------



## darrylchew

sidecross said:


> I can easily use the q5 when being mobile; iphone se in one jacket pocket and q5 in the other side pocket.
> 
> I use the smaller btr1k for when in bed at night with short 45 cm cable.


Ya. I keep q5 in pocket n handphone on hand. Control from hp and watch Netflix or YouTube too with great sound. Was also thinking for the money of q5 can look at x5iii too. But find havin q5 or btr more convenient for a do all solution


----------



## mykeldg

@FiiO any news when to get the next firmware update?


----------



## darrylchew

darrylchew said:


> Ya. I keep q5 in pocket n handphone on hand. Control from hp and watch Netflix or YouTube too with great sound. Was also thinking for the money of q5 can look at x5iii too. But find havin q5 or btr more convenient for a do all solution


Been using the q5 over btr1 for 1 week.
Yesterday I did a/b comparison n realise at initial listening there weren't much diffrerence except a little more warmth on the btr1. As I listen to btr1 I just felt they sounded different from the q5. Yet very similar. Highs r there. Mids more forward n fun actually..lows are there. Then I switch to q5 and realised that btr1 kinda like stays in a safe zone.. Doesn't really give the crystal highs and doesn't slam and stays right at the center. With the q5, when the highs kick in, there is more clarity and height in the sound stage. Same with e lows.... Slams hard and low. Have anyone compares the btr3 to btr1? I am in for q5 over btr1 cos when needed, the difference is there. Not always there but the sound calls for it it will go high n slam hard.


----------



## Extrasensory

I am in this thread because of new FiiO Bluetooth dac/amp news.

Hope it will feature 4.4 balanced output.


----------



## darrylchew

Extrasensory said:


> I am in this thread because of new FiiO Bluetooth dac/amp news.
> 
> Hope it will feature 4.4 balanced output.


Isn't the q5 a dac/amp already? Anyway what's the advantage of 4.4 over 2.5mm balanced


----------



## Extrasensory (Feb 20, 2019)

darrylchew said:


> Isn't the q5 a dac/amp already? Anyway what's the advantage of 4.4 over 2.5mm balanced



FiiO's official fan page just announced that new Bluetooth dac/amp will be coming soon.

The reason why I am heading to 4.4 is because I am currently using Sony IER-M9 which has 4.4 balanced cable included in the package.


----------



## mykeldg

darrylchew said:


> Been using the q5 over btr1 for 1 week.
> Yesterday I did a/b comparison n realise at initial listening there weren't much diffrerence except a little more warmth on the btr1. As I listen to btr1 I just felt they sounded different from the q5. Yet very similar. Highs r there. Mids more forward n fun actually..lows are there. Then I switch to q5 and realised that btr1 kinda like stays in a safe zone.. Doesn't really give the crystal highs and doesn't slam and stays right at the center. With the q5, when the highs kick in, there is more clarity and height in the sound stage. Same with e lows.... Slams hard and low. Have anyone compares the btr3 to btr1? I am in for q5 over btr1 cos when needed, the difference is there. Not always there but the sound calls for it it will go high n slam hard.



BTR3 has more detail than the btr1. see the below video comparison. listen using headphones:


----------



## mykeldg

Extrasensory said:


> FiiO's official fan page just announced that new Bluetooth dac/amp will be coming soon.
> 
> The reason why I am heading to 4.4 is because I am currently using Sony IER-M9 which has 4.4 balanced cable included in the package.


Try the ES100. It has similar SQ as BTR3 but has more power, better app, and Balanced out


----------



## Extrasensory

mykeldg said:


> Try the ES100. It has similar SQ as BTR3 but has more power, better app, and Balanced out



Yeah ES100 was one of my choices. But the ES100 is 2X more expensive than BTR3 in my country. It is not like 70$ and 100$. 

I used to own BTR3 for 3 months. I sold it because at that time I was using BGVP DM6 which is very source-sensitive. Now I am using Shanling M0 for portable use.


----------



## FiiO

mykeldg said:


> @FiiO any news when to get the next firmware update?


Dear friend,

The engineer are still working on the new firmware. We will release it when the firmware is more stable. 

Best regards


----------



## darrylchew

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The engineer are still working on the new firmware. We will release it when the firmware is more stable.
> 
> Best regards





Extrasensory said:


> Yeah ES100 was one of my choices. But the ES100 is 2X more expensive than BTR3 in my country. It is not like 70$ and 100$.
> 
> I used to own BTR3 for 3 months. I sold it because at that time I was using BGVP DM6 which is very source-sensitive. Now I am using Shanling M0 for portable use.





Extrasensory said:


> Yeah ES100 was one of my choices. But the ES100 is 2X more expensive than BTR3 in my country. It is not like 70$ and 100$.
> 
> I used to own BTR3 for 3 months. I sold it because at that time I was using BGVP DM6 which is very source-sensitive. Now I am using Shanling M0 for portable use.



Got a balanced cable for lola n with balanced, btr1 is nowhere near q5. Sticking to q5.. The little more to carry is Mort than worth it.


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 23, 2019)

Interesting. i just discovered that the BTR3 sounds so much better via AAC on the macbook than the default aptX.

When I checked, it is running on 32-bit instead of 16bit and the bitrate is 320kbps AAC (can be set using the tool when you slide it to maximum)

Sounds virtually lossless to me.


----------



## darrylchew

I compared bluetooth vs my old x3. Really hard pressed to say that there is a difference. Just a little wider soundstage n more space around the voice. Other than that really hardly any audible difference.


----------



## sidecross

darrylchew said:


> I compared bluetooth vs my old x3. Really hard pressed to say that there is a difference. Just a little wider soundstage n more space around the voice. Other than that really hardly any audible difference.


I remember hearing that after BT 4.1 and 4.2 any improvement is beyond audio; is there any other further information?


----------



## sidecross

For those like myself who are not as fluent in technology, Bluetooth 5 will be mainly an advantage in range. Below is a preliminary article I found.

https://www.macworld.com/article/3262664/hardware/bluetooth-5-faq-everything-you-need-to-know.html


----------



## subtec

sidecross said:


> For those like myself who are not as fluent in technology, Bluetooth 5 will be mainly an advantage in range. Below is a preliminary article I found.
> 
> https://www.macworld.com/article/3262664/hardware/bluetooth-5-faq-everything-you-need-to-know.html


Pay attention to this passage near the bottom:


> *Nearly all of the big improvements in Bluetooth 5 are exclusively for its Low Energy mode (BLE)*. First introduced in Bluetooth 4.0 and then improved in the v4.1 and v4.2 releases, BLE is a whole separate protocol from “classic” Bluetooth. As of Bluetooth 4.2, the BLE mode transmits a lot less data than classic Bluetooth, but it has similar range, much lower latency, and uses just a fraction of the power. That’s why it is used so often in Internet of Things devices, beacons, tiles, fitness trackers, and anywhere where really long battery or low-power operation is key.



BT5 only improves BLE, which doesn't have the bandwidth to support audio streaming (which is still using BT Classic - unchanged since BT 4.2). So in short, the improvements in BT5 do absolutely nothing for a device like the BTR3, because it doesn't use BLE at all.


----------



## sidecross (Feb 24, 2019)

subtec said:


> Pay attention to this passage near the bottom:
> 
> 
> BT5 only improves BLE, which doesn't have the bandwidth to support audio streaming (which is still using BT Classic - unchanged since BT 4.2). So in short, the improvements in BT5 do absolutely nothing for a device like the BTR3, because it doesn't use BLE at all.


This was my initial understanding as well. Its only benefit may be increased battery life for future usage when devices are using bt 5 for audio streaming.


----------



## Ab10

Is it possible to know the battery level of the BTR3 at the Fiio Music App? I know Some device display the battery level under BT settings but not all device - If Fiio Music App can able to display current Codec and Firmware etc why not provide the Battery Level Indicator (percentage) inside the same app....how hard it will be to display battery level?

Anyhow got the device last week since then can't put it down. It can handle even Senn HD598 SE too very well and AKG K712 in just OK volume if the source device has BT volume control. The only place it sucks with Amazon Fire TV Stick 4K which don't have any inbuilt volume for BT.


----------



## FiiO

Ab10 said:


> Is it possible to know the battery level of the BTR3 at the Fiio Music App? I know Some device display the battery level under BT settings but not all device - If Fiio Music App can able to display current Codec and Firmware etc why not provide the Battery Level Indicator (percentage) inside the same app....how hard it will be to display battery level?
> 
> Anyhow got the device last week since then can't put it down. It can handle even Senn HD598 SE too very well and AKG K712 in just OK volume if the source device has BT volume control. The only place it sucks with Amazon Fire TV Stick 4K which don't have any inbuilt volume for BT.



Dear friend,

 The way to check the battery of BTR on the smart phone running the different OS is not the same.
iOS: When it's connected to BTR, the battery bar on the notification bar is the  remaining capacity of BTR. Or you could go to Widget and add the Battery, then you could see the battery of BTR.
Android phone: Some cellphones could show remaining battery on the notification bar.
Most mobile phone could support the battery display for BTR actually. So we do not add this in the FiiO Music APP again.

Best regards


----------



## mykeldg (Feb 26, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The way to check the battery of BTR on the smart phone running the different OS is not the same.
> iOS: When it's connected to BTR, the battery bar on the notification bar is the  remaining capacity of BTR. Or you could go to Widget and add the Battery, then you could see the battery of BTR.
> ...


Great, didn't know there was a widget for the battery in iOS --- works well here.


----------



## darrylchew

mykeldg said:


> Great, didn't know there was a widget for the battery in iOS --- works well here.


Am using huawei 20pro n nova3  Both have the battery icon next to Bluetooth logo at the top when it's connected.


----------



## Dmitry87 (Feb 28, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If everything goes well, the EQ function for BTR3 will be added in February.
> 
> Best regards


Can we expect the EQ this month?


----------



## CybDev

samuelnsh said:


> @FiiO
> 
> Any plans for USB DAC support on Linux? As of BTR3 firmware v 1.0, both my Arch Linux desktop and Ubuntu 18.04 LTS laptop are able to show the BTR 3 audio device but no sound comes out when I select it. The same issue occurs with my friend's BTR 3 when I connect it to my Linux machines.
> 
> ...



First off:

You can use bluetooth and wifi on most flights, just not during takeoff and landing.
Your phone/laptop usually lets you turn on bt or wifi even when in flight-mode.

As for BTR3 on linux:

Using the FiiO BTR3 as a DAC on linux actually worked just as expected the first time I tried it on Fedora 29 back in the end of November 2018...

Just connected it to my laptop (Lenovo T480s, via USB-C), tapped the power button on the BTR3 three times and selected the output in pulseaudio. Both "Analog Stereo Output" and "Digital Stereo (IEC958) Output" worked fine.

However, fast forward til today, and it no longer works...

I'm not sure when it broke or what caused it, as I usually use my Benchmark DAC2 at home and only use the BTR3 when I'm on the move, - I find FiiO BTR3 combined with Shure SE535 so much better than other noise cancelling cans like Bose QC35 II or Sony WH-1000xm3, but I digress...

Everything seems fine when I connect the BTR3 to my computer, - it shows up as a DAC and can be selected, the monitor channels register fine, but the output of the BTR3 is just completely silent just like @samuelnsh describes it.

So not wanting to roll back my machine to the November snapshot, I decided to look for a new firmware for the BTR3 first.

Long story short, upgrading the firmware to the version mentioned under the thread named "FiiO releases the new firmware v1.0 for BTR3" at http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=43768 does nothing, everything behaves the same (except now the "FiiO Music" android app can show details about the BTR3 provided the HWA option is turned off)

I've included the steps I took to upgrade the firmware under linux as well, for those interested.


Spoiler: FiiO BTR3 linux firmware upgrade



*Disclaimer: This procedure is not supported by the vendor and you are knowingly risking bricking your device if you attempt this.*

So, not having a windows machine and feeling pretty reckless, I noticed the upgrade instructions seem to refer to a generic dfu upgrade, and went looking for a firmware upgrade tool on linux.

My first hit was "dfu-util" from http://dfu-util.sourceforge.net/, which is actually available in fedora as "dfu-util-0.9-6.fc29.x86_64" at the time of writing.

Following the instructions from the upgrade guide, I first set the device into program/dfu mode, so it shows up like this:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ dmesg
<snip>
usb 3-1: new full-speed USB device number 7 using xhci_hcd
usb 3-1: New USB device found, idVendor=0a12, idProduct=ffff, bcdDevice=25.20
usb 3-1: New USB device strings: Mfr=0, Product=2, SerialNumber=3
usb 3-1: Product: FiiO BTR3
usb 3-1: SerialNumber: ABCDEF0123456789
<snip>
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

So having installed the dfu-util package and previously downloaded the firmware from FiiO, check that the device is known by dfu-util:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ sudo dfu-util -l
dfu-util 0.9

Copyright 2005-2009 Weston Schmidt, Harald Welte and OpenMoko Inc.
Copyright 2010-2016 Tormod Volden and Stefan Schmidt
This program is Free Software and has ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY
Please report bugs to http://sourceforge.net/p/dfu-util/tickets/

Found Runtime: [1781:0e4f] ver=0330, devnum=16, cfg=1, intf=2, path="1-1", alt=0, name="Benchmark DAC2 DFU", serial="0000"
Found Runtime: [1781:0e4f] ver=0330, devnum=16, cfg=1, intf=2, path="1-1", alt=0, name="Benchmark DAC2 DFU", serial="0000"
Found Runtime: [0a12:ffff] ver=2520, devnum=7, cfg=1, intf=2, path="3-1", alt=0, name="UNKNOWN", serial="ABCDEF0123456789"
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

Looks good, so copy the device string and point it to the firmware file you downloaded:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ sudo dfu-util -d 0a12:ffff -v -D /tmp/BTR3_1.0.dfu
dfu-util 0.9

Copyright 2005-2009 Weston Schmidt, Harald Welte and OpenMoko Inc.
Copyright 2010-2016 Tormod Volden and Stefan Schmidt
This program is Free Software and has ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY
Please report bugs to http://sourceforge.net/p/dfu-util/tickets/

DFU suffix version 100
Opening DFU capable USB device...
ID 0a12:ffff
Run-time device DFU version 0101
Claiming USB DFU Runtime Interface...
Determining device status: state = appIDLE, status = 0
Device really in Runtime Mode, send DFU detach request...
Resetting USB...
Opening DFU USB Device...
Claiming USB DFU Interface...
Setting Alternate Setting #0 ...
Determining device status: state = dfuIDLE, status = 0
dfuIDLE, continuing
DFU mode device DFU version 0101
Device returned transfer size 1023
Copying data from PC to DFU device
Download   [=========================] 100%      1084988 bytes
Download done.
Sent a total of 1084988 bytes
dfu-util: unable to read DFU status after completion
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

I've got to admit I was a little nervous when it first told me the device wasn't in DFU mode, and especially after it lost contact with it when the firmware was flashed.

However, when unplugging it, turning it back on manually, and re-plugging it, everything looked OK:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ dmesg
<snip>
usb 3-1: new full-speed USB device number 7 using xhci_hcd
usb 3-1: New USB device found, idVendor=0a12, idProduct=ffff, bcdDevice=25.20
usb 3-1: New USB device strings: Mfr=0, Product=2, SerialNumber=3
usb 3-1: Product: FiiO BTR3
usb 3-1: SerialNumber: ABCDEF0123456789
usb 3-1: reset full-speed USB device number 7 using xhci_hcd
usb 3-1: device firmware changed
usb 3-1: USB disconnect, device number 7
usb 3-1: new full-speed USB device number 8 using xhci_hcd
usb 3-1: New USB device found, idVendor=0a12, idProduct=ffff, bcdDevice=25.20
usb 3-1: New USB device strings: Mfr=0, Product=2, SerialNumber=3
usb 3-1: Product: FiiO BTR3
usb 3-1: SerialNumber: ABCDEF0123456789
usb 3-1: USB disconnect, device number 8
<snip>
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

Unfortunately, it currently does not work as a DAC with "kernel-5.0.0-0.rc8.git0.1.vanilla.knurd.1.fc29.x86_64" and "pulseaudio-12.2-1.fc29.x86_64".
It does show up as any other soundcard, but no actual sound from the device.

On the bright side, the FiiO Music app on android now lets me configure some of the features of the BTR3 and it seems the firmware upgrade was successful.


----------



## crabdog

CybDev said:


> First off:
> 
> You can use bluetooth and wifi on most flights, just not during takeoff and landing.
> Your phone/laptop usually lets you turn on bt or wifi even when in flight-mode.
> ...


FWIW folks (including myself) have had the same experience with the ES100 on Linux lately. Maybe an older kernel would work but I cbf messing around with it. I also have the BTR3 but have not connected it to my (work) Linux laptop for a couple of months.


----------



## Brooko

BTR3 still works on my Linux box.  Using Mint Tara (19), kernel 4.15.0-45


----------



## digititus

Current Kernel on Fedora 29 (which works with BTR3) is* 4.20.11-200.fc29.x86_64*


----------



## CybDev

digititus said:


> Current Kernel on Fedora 29 (which works with BTR3) is* 4.20.11-200.fc29.x86_64*



Interesting, would you mind comparing some notes?

Pretty much everything looks the same when I use my Benchmark DAC2, except that works fine and I get no sound at all from the BTR3...



Spoiler



Pulseaudio sink:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ pactl list sinks
<snip>
Sink #14
   State: RUNNING
   Name: alsa_output.usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00.iec958-stereo
   Description: FiiO BTR3 Digital Stereo (IEC958)
   Driver: module-alsa-card.c
   Sample Specification: s16le 2ch 44100Hz
   Channel Map: front-left,front-right
   Owner Module: 55
   Mute: no
   Volume: front-left: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB,   front-right: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB
           balance 0.00
   Base Volume: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB
   Monitor Source: alsa_output.usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00.iec958-stereo.monitor
   Latency: 662488 usec, configured 980000 usec
   Flags: HARDWARE DECIBEL_VOLUME LATENCY SET_FORMATS
   Properties:
       alsa.resolution_bits = "16"
       device.api = "alsa"
       device.class = "sound"
       alsa.class = "generic"
       alsa.subclass = "generic-mix"
       alsa.name = "USB Audio"
       alsa.id = "USB Audio"
       alsa.subdevice = "0"
       alsa.subdevice_name = "subdevice #0"
       alsa.device = "0"
       alsa.card = "2"
       alsa.card_name = "FiiO BTR3"
       alsa.long_card_name = "FiiO BTR3 at usb-0000:00:14.0-2, full speed"
       alsa.driver_name = "snd_usb_audio"
       device.bus_path = "pci-0000:00:14.0-usb-0:2:1.0"
       sysfs.path = "/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-2/1-2:1.0/sound/card2"
       udev.id = "usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00"
       device.bus = "usb"
       device.vendor.id = "0a12"
       device.vendor.name = "Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd"
       device.product.id = "1243"
       device.product.name = "FiiO BTR3"
       device.serial = "0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789"
       device.string = "iec958:2"
       device.buffering.buffer_size = "352800"
       device.buffering.fragment_size = "176400"
       device.access_mode = "mmap+timer"
       device.profile.name = "iec958-stereo"
       device.profile.description = "Digital Stereo (IEC958)"
       device.description = "FiiO BTR3 Digital Stereo (IEC958)"
       alsa.mixer_name = "USB Mixer"
       alsa.components = "USB0a12:1243"
       module-udev-detect.discovered = "1"
       device.icon_name = "audio-card-usb"
   Ports:
       iec958-stereo-output: Digital Output (S/PDIF) (priority: 0)
   Active Port: iec958-stereo-output
   Formats:
       pcm
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

Pulseaudio module:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ pactl list modules
<snip>
Module #55
   Name: module-alsa-card
   Argument: device_id="2" name="usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00" card_name="alsa_card.usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00" namereg_fail=false tsched=yes fixed_latency_range=no ignore_dB=no deferred_volume=yes use_ucm=yes card_properties="module-udev-detect.discovered=1"
   Usage counter: 2
   Properties:
       module.author = "Lennart Poettering"
       module.description = "ALSA Card"
       module.version = "12.2-rebootstrapped"
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

Pulseaudio source:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ pactl list sources
<snip>
Source #15
   State: IDLE
   Name: alsa_output.usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00.iec958-stereo.monitor
   Description: Monitor of FiiO BTR3 Digital Stereo (IEC958)
   Driver: module-alsa-card.c
   Sample Specification: s16le 2ch 44100Hz
   Channel Map: front-left,front-right
   Owner Module: 55
   Mute: no
   Volume: front-left: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB,   front-right: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB
           balance 0.00
   Base Volume: 65536 / 100% / 0.00 dB
   Monitor of Sink: alsa_output.usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00.iec958-stereo
   Latency: 0 usec, configured 2000000 usec
   Flags: DECIBEL_VOLUME LATENCY
   Properties:
       device.description = "Monitor of FiiO BTR3 Digital Stereo (IEC958)"
       device.class = "monitor"
       alsa.card = "2"
       alsa.card_name = "FiiO BTR3"
       alsa.long_card_name = "FiiO BTR3 at usb-0000:00:14.0-2, full speed"
       alsa.driver_name = "snd_usb_audio"
       device.bus_path = "pci-0000:00:14.0-usb-0:2:1.0"
       sysfs.path = "/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-2/1-2:1.0/sound/card2"
       udev.id = "usb-0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789-00"
       device.bus = "usb"
       device.vendor.id = "0a12"
       device.vendor.name = "Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd"
       device.product.id = "1243"
       device.product.name = "FiiO BTR3"
       device.serial = "0a12_FiiO_BTR3_ABCDEF0123456789"
       device.string = "2"
       module-udev-detect.discovered = "1"
       device.icon_name = "audio-card-usb"
   Formats:
       pcm
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

Installed kernel, pulseaudio and alsa (yes I know it's not the standard kernel, but one from https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Kernel_Vanilla_Repositories-FAQ, should still be good enough for this)

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ rpm -q pulseaudio pulseaudio-libs kernel alsa-plugins-pulseaudio alsa-lib
pulseaudio-12.2-1.fc29.x86_64
pulseaudio-libs-12.2-1.fc29.x86_64
pulseaudio-libs-12.2-1.fc29.i686
kernel-5.0.0-0.rc8.git0.1.vanilla.knurd.1.fc29.x86_64
alsa-plugins-pulseaudio-1.1.8-1.fc29.x86_64
alsa-plugins-pulseaudio-1.1.8-1.fc29.i686
alsa-lib-1.1.8-1.fc29.x86_64
alsa-lib-1.1.8-1.fc29.i686
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

USB device properties:

```
[cybdev@localhost ~]$ sudo lsusb -vvv -d 0a12:1243

Bus 001 Device 017: ID 0a12:1243 Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd
Device Descriptor:
  bLength                18
  bDescriptorType         1
  bcdUSB               2.00
  bDeviceClass            0
  bDeviceSubClass         0
  bDeviceProtocol         0
  bMaxPacketSize0        64
  idVendor           0x0a12 Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd
  idProduct          0x1243
  bcdDevice           25.20
  iManufacturer           0
  iProduct                2 FiiO BTR3
  iSerial                 3 ABCDEF0123456789
  bNumConfigurations      1
  Configuration Descriptor:
    bLength                 9
    bDescriptorType         2
    wTotalLength       0x008d
    bNumInterfaces          3
    bConfigurationValue     1
    iConfiguration          0
    bmAttributes         0x80
      (Bus Powered)
    MaxPower              500mA
    Interface Descriptor:
      bLength                 9
      bDescriptorType         4
      bInterfaceNumber        0
      bAlternateSetting       0
      bNumEndpoints           0
      bInterfaceClass         1 Audio
      bInterfaceSubClass      1 Control Device
      bInterfaceProtocol      0
      iInterface              0
      AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                 9
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      1 (HEADER)
        bcdADC               1.00
        wTotalLength       0x002b
        bInCollection           1
        baInterfaceNr(0)        1
      AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                12
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      2 (INPUT_TERMINAL)
        bTerminalID             1
        wTerminalType      0x0101 USB Streaming
        bAssocTerminal          0
        bNrChannels             2
        wChannelConfig     0x0003
          Left Front (L)
          Right Front (R)
        iChannelNames           0
        iTerminal               0
      AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                13
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      6 (FEATURE_UNIT)
        bUnitID                 2
        bSourceID               1
        bControlSize            2
        bmaControls(0)     0x0001
          Mute Control
        bmaControls(1)     0x0002
          Volume Control
        bmaControls(2)     0x0002
          Volume Control
        iFeature                0
      AudioControl Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                 9
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      3 (OUTPUT_TERMINAL)
        bTerminalID             3
        wTerminalType      0x0301 Speaker
        bAssocTerminal          0
        bSourceID               2
        iTerminal               0
    Interface Descriptor:
      bLength                 9
      bDescriptorType         4
      bInterfaceNumber        1
      bAlternateSetting       0
      bNumEndpoints           0
      bInterfaceClass         1 Audio
      bInterfaceSubClass      2 Streaming
      bInterfaceProtocol      0
      iInterface              0
    Interface Descriptor:
      bLength                 9
      bDescriptorType         4
      bInterfaceNumber        1
      bAlternateSetting       1
      bNumEndpoints           1
      bInterfaceClass         1 Audio
      bInterfaceSubClass      2 Streaming
      bInterfaceProtocol      0
      iInterface              0
      AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                 7
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      1 (AS_GENERAL)
        bTerminalLink           1
        bDelay                  0 frames
        wFormatTag         0x0001 PCM
      AudioStreaming Interface Descriptor:
        bLength                14
        bDescriptorType        36
        bDescriptorSubtype      2 (FORMAT_TYPE)
        bFormatType             1 (FORMAT_TYPE_I)
        bNrChannels             2
        bSubframeSize           2
        bBitResolution         16
        bSamFreqType            2 Discrete
        tSamFreq[ 0]        48000
        tSamFreq[ 1]        44100
        AudioStreaming Endpoint Descriptor:
          bLength                 7
          bDescriptorType        37
          bDescriptorSubtype      1 (EP_GENERAL)
          bmAttributes         0x81
            Sampling Frequency
            MaxPacketsOnly
          bLockDelayUnits         2 Decoded PCM samples
          wLockDelay         0x0000
      Endpoint Descriptor:
        bLength                 9
        bDescriptorType         5
        bEndpointAddress     0x03  EP 3 OUT
        bmAttributes            1
          Transfer Type            Isochronous
          Synch Type               None
          Usage Type               Data
        wMaxPacketSize     0x00c0  1x 192 bytes
        bInterval               1
        bRefresh                0
        bSynchAddress           0
    Interface Descriptor:
      bLength                 9
      bDescriptorType         4
      bInterfaceNumber        2
      bAlternateSetting       0
      bNumEndpoints           1
      bInterfaceClass         3 Human Interface Device
      bInterfaceSubClass      0
      bInterfaceProtocol      0
      iInterface              0
        HID Device Descriptor:
          bLength                 9
          bDescriptorType        33
          bcdHID               1.11
          bCountryCode            0 Not supported
          bNumDescriptors         1
          bDescriptorType        34 Report
          wDescriptorLength      69
         Report Descriptors:
           ** UNAVAILABLE **
      Endpoint Descriptor:
        bLength                 7
        bDescriptorType         5
        bEndpointAddress     0x81  EP 1 IN
        bmAttributes            3
          Transfer Type            Interrupt
          Synch Type               None
          Usage Type               Data
        wMaxPacketSize     0x0010  1x 16 bytes
        bInterval               1
can't get device qualifier: Resource temporarily unavailable
can't get debug descriptor: Resource temporarily unavailable
Device Status:     0x0000
  (Bus Powered)
[cybdev@localhost ~]$
```

All the output above was captured while the card was active and supposedly playing music, the LED on the device was a solid white, and the hardware volume buttons used to turn the volume up to max.

If I stop spotify (current input at the time of testing), the LED changes to the standard blue "blink twice, pause" sequence.


----------



## mykeldg

Can someone with ES100 confirm that BTR3 is superior SQ-wise if you disregard the double power capacity? (i.e. if I want to use BTR3 vs ES100 on Speakers)


----------



## ExpatinJapan

My review is up:


 

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/fiio-btr3.23354/reviews#review-21708


----------



## speedingcheetah

ExpatinJapan said:


> My review is up:
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/fiio-btr3.23354/reviews#review-21708



How can you even call that a "review"???

It is 90% screen-shots of FiiOs product page, a copy and paste of the items specs and then only a few lines of your own actual text describing your experience with the product.


----------



## marcusd

speedingcheetah said:


> How can you even call that a "review"???
> 
> It is 90% screen-shots of FiiOs product page, a copy and paste of the items specs and then only a few lines of your own actual text describing your experience with the product.



Nothing better than pointless words salads on head-fi. #Head-pie sucks!!


----------



## martadinata (Mar 7, 2019)

can someone confirm that fiio btr3 only work in 32bit sample format in Linux box? I got fiio btr3 but with 16bit sample rate btr3 no sound output, only with 32bit.


----------



## speedingcheetah

martadinata said:


> can someone confirm that fiio btr3 only work in 32bit sample format in Linux box? I got fiio btr3 but with 16bit sample rate btr3 no sound output, only with 32bit.


In wired mode, the max the BTR3 supports is 16bit/48khz.
32bit is only on the LDAC Bluetooth Codec.


----------



## martadinata (Mar 7, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> In wired mode, the max the BTR3 supports is 16bit/48khz.
> 32bit is only on the LDAC Bluetooth Codec.



the problem is when I set 16bit 'Linux default' sample format the btr3 no sound output.

idk is the same chip or not.
https://www.akm.com/akm/en/file/datasheet/AK4376AECB.pdf

edit1 : manually edit to 16bit sample format still working, s16le 48000, I must specified to pulseaudio daemon if I leave to auto it got no audio.

thanks.


----------



## mykeldg

I also get 32bit on my macbook but 16bit on the Windows laptop. So I guess 32bit on unix type OSes


----------



## mykeldg

@FiiO do you think the new updates will be due this March?

Any ES100 users here -- can you compare the SQ of the BTR3 -- which between ES100 vs  BTR3 sound better?


----------



## CybDev

CybDev said:


> Interesting, would you mind comparing some notes?
> 
> Pretty much everything looks the same when I use my Benchmark DAC2, except that works fine and I get no sound at all from the BTR3...



It turns out I had tampered with my pulseaudio daemon.conf file, so it contained:

```
resample-method = speex-float-10
avoid-resampling = true
default-sample-format = s24le
default-sample-rate = 44100
alternate-sample-rate = 48000
```
Commenting out the line with default-sample-format, or replacing it with:
	
	



```
default-sample-format = s16le
```
and then restarting pulseaudio fixes the issue...
... but only on an older kernel (4.19.10-300.fc29.x86_64 from December 2018)

(but the selected format in pulseaudio seems to be the correct s16le according to the previously pasted output, perhaps a bug?)

Running "alsa-capabilities -s" also lists "S16_LE:48000,44100" for the BTR3, typical for a USB1 interface.


Spoiler





```
7) USB Audio Class Digital alsa audio output interface `hw:1,0'
 - device name       = B20                                                         
 - interface name    = USB Audio                                                   
 - usb audio class   = 2 - isochronous asynchronous                               
 - character device  = /dev/snd/pcmC1D0p                                           
 - samplerates (Hz)  = S32_LE:44100,48000,88200,96000,176400,192000               
 - monitor file      = /proc/asound/card1/pcm0p/sub0/hw_params                     
 - stream file       = /proc/asound/card1/stream0                                 

 8) USB Audio Class Digital alsa audio output interface `hw:2,0'
 - device name       = BTR3                                                       
 - interface name    = USB Audio                                                   
 - usb audio class   = 0 - none                                                   
 - character device  = /dev/snd/pcmC2D0p                                           
 - samplerates (Hz)  = S16_LE:48000,44100                                         
 - monitor file      = /proc/asound/card2/pcm0p/sub0/hw_params                     
 - stream file       = /proc/asound/card2/stream0
```







speedingcheetah said:


> In wired mode, the max the BTR3 supports is 16bit/48khz.
> 32bit is only on the LDAC Bluetooth Codec.



According to Sony's documentation LDAC it does not support 32bit audio. See https://www.sony.net/Products/LDAC/: 





> Possible to maintain maximum bit depth and frequency of 96kHz/24bit


(and LDAC is still a lossy codec, https://www.soundguys.com/ldac-ultimate-bluetooth-guide-20026/ has a pretty decent technical writeup)




martadinata said:


> can someone confirm that fiio btr3 only work in 32bit sample format in Linux box? I got fiio btr3 but with 16bit sample rate btr3 no sound output, only with 32bit.



Like @speedingcheetah said, it doesn't seem to support 24 or 32, and only 16bit wired input. I am curious how the mac users seem to be getting 32bit samples for the BTR3 though...


----------



## speedingcheetah

CybDev said:


> According to Sony's documentation LDAC it does not support 32bit audio. See https://www.sony.net/Products/LDAC/:
> (and LDAC is still a lossy codec, https://www.soundguys.com/ldac-ultimate-bluetooth-guide-20026/ has a pretty decent technical writeup)



 
So Says PowerAmp V3 using OpenSL ES High-Res output.


----------



## martadinata

as per post BTR1K here it confirmed that pulseaudio need to manually set format sample manually by edit /etc/pulse/daemon.conf to make btr3 / btr1k working as digital audio. Maybe need to pin this at front page


```
default-sample-format = s16le
default-sample-rate = 48000
alternate-sample-rate = 44100
default-sample-channels = 2
default-channel-map = front-left,front-right
```


----------



## CybDev

martadinata said:


> as per post BTR1K here it confirmed that pulseaudio need to manually set format sample manually by edit /etc/pulse/daemon.conf to make btr3 / btr1k working as digital audio. Maybe need to pin this at front page
> 
> 
> ```
> ...



Thanks, that's what I arrived on as well.
But since ALSA does detect the capabilities to just s16le and 48k/44.1k, and the pactl output from my previous post indicates the samples sent to the sink/card are indeed 16bit/44.1kHz, I would have assumed that was not needed.
I have multiple other USB adapters that only support 16/44.1 as well, where the default setting of s24 works just fine as it will switch to 16bit for the USB output when selected.

And of course, - it still does not work on a more recent kernel for me, everything looks the same, except no sound from the actual physical output.

(and while @freemnix can't get audio using the analog option, that works fine for me on the older kernel, and also the IEC digital out)


----------



## CybDev

speedingcheetah said:


> So Says PowerAmp V3 using OpenSL ES High-Res output.



Interesting... What system is that from?


----------



## Galeonero

Hi, is it advisable to use this M3K for a Fiio F9 PRO or is it better to buy an M7 or M6? I ask more than anything about the system, it does not convince me much and I saw that it has some pulls and is somewhat slow.


----------



## borrego (Mar 12, 2019)

Silicone protective cases for the BTR-3 are now available in China. CNY25 for a pack of 6 cases in different colors.


----------



## smagus

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If everything goes well, the EQ function for BTR3 will be added in February.
> 
> Best regards



we have March already, any chance for EQ?


----------



## mykeldg

smagus said:


> we have March already, any chance for EQ?



Ditto.  Any updates @FiiO?


----------



## FiiO

mykeldg said:


> @FiiO do you think the new updates will be due this March?
> 
> Any ES100 users here -- can you compare the SQ of the BTR3 -- which between ES100 vs  BTR3 sound better?


Dear friend,

I hope the new firmware could be released soon as well. The engineer are trying their best to improve the stability still.

Best regards


----------



## mykeldg

thanks for the update. so will it be this march?


----------



## Crixus00 (Mar 19, 2019)

Hi All,

Recently bought this unit to pair with my Samsung S8 mobile phone and AKG N5005 iem's. To my surprise, the volume is quite lacking with this setup.. in actual fact, the S8 appears to go louder on its own by roughly 10 - 20% i.e. when i plug my iem's into the S8 headphone jack.

I have played around with quite a few settings with no joy. Anyone else have a similar experience? Or any tips to improve volume from the BTR3?

I will say the sound quality and functionality is very nice for the price. But no good if I can't get to desired volume.

Edit: should have noted that I have tested with streaming music from Tidal and also using VLC to play local files. Same result.

Thanks!


----------



## minimalist82

Crixus00 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Recently bought this unit to pair with my Samsung S8 mobile phone and AKG N5005 iem's. To my surprise, the volume is quite lacking with this setup.. in actual fact, the S8 appears to go louder on its own by roughly 10 - 20% i.e. when i plug my iem's into the S8 headphone jack.
> 
> ...


Hi there, 

I’m actually using the same setup as you 90% of the time and I have to admit I have never felt the volume to be lacking.

I just did a quick check and cranked the BTR3 right up. To my ears this is very uncomfortable and not something I would want to sustain. I also tried plugging into the S8 directly and cranked up the volume. To me this is similar if not a little quieter. My tests here are subjective and not scientific of course! I’m assuming you have checked on the S8 that any kind of volume limiting is deactivated? Also are you using LDAC codec? I’m not sure if this makes a difference.

I hope this helps.


----------



## Crixus00

minimalist82 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I’m actually using the same setup as you 90% of the time and I have to admit I have never felt the volume to be lacking.
> 
> ...



Thank you for your reply.

At 100% my current setup is just about ok to listen to most of the time (not too loud at all). But the fact i have hit a ceiling and would like more head room leaves me wanting more (prob up to 20% more).

My S8 definitely goes louder on its own (albeit sounds like trash at max). I have checked lots of setting but will check and double check some more. The fact you are reporting that your BTR3 goes louder is interesting and gives me some hope. I have tried LDAC and other codecs so don't think it makes a difference.

Thanks again.


----------



## dannyking

Hi everyone,

I have some questions regarding the BTR3, thanks in advance.   I own a campfire audio atlas and would be pairing it with an iphone SE for reference.

1.)  How is the sound quality like paired with an iphone SE (I read iPhones convert all audio to AAC)  compared to it being plugged directly to the 3.5mm jack?

2.) How loud does it actually get?  For example, is the loudest volume going to be comparable to me plugging my Atlas directly to the jack?  I have the Flares pro and my main problem with the bluetooth module is that it doesn't get loud enough.



Thank you.


----------



## nort ycagel

my s9 headphone jack died. I hope this will be good enough to replace it


----------



## Dobrescu George

nort ycagel said:


> my s9 headphone jack died. I hope this will be good enough to replace it



It should be for sure!


----------



## highlightshadow

nort ycagel said:


> my s9 headphone jack died. I hope this will be good enough to replace it



Definitely - when you pair you'll have the option to pick LDAC on your S9 and it's a pretty decent codec for most people most of the time (especially on the move)


----------



## highlightshadow

dannyking said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I have some questions regarding the BTR3, thanks in advance.   I own a campfire audio atlas and would be pairing it with an iphone SE for reference.
> 
> ...



With iPhone the codec is limited to AAC - so not the best the unit's capable of.

I just did a quick back to back with my Sennheiser HD58X plugged into my Galaxy S10+ direct and through the BTR3 
To be honest i couldn't determine a difference in sound levels.... it was loud enough to enjoy but i couldn't push them to the point where i would have to turn it down


----------



## nort ycagel

do the earbuds buttons work with the bt3?


----------



## Dmitry87

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> I hope the new firmware could be released soon as well. The engineer are trying their best to improve the stability still.
> Best regards


Another month is nearly over. Any news? Can we have the unstable version?


----------



## FiiO

nort ycagel said:


> do the earbuds buttons work with the bt3?


Dear friend,

No, the in-line remote button in headphone is disabled when working with the BTR3.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Dmitry87 said:


> Another month is nearly over. Any news? Can we have the unstable version?


Dear friend,

We haven't add the EQ function in the beta firmware still. 
But the beta firmware has some improvement in microphone. If you would like to try, I could send the firmware file to you. 

Best regards


----------



## carloshacecosas

I was 99% decided on the uBTR, but with the AliExpress sale + a promo code finally got this one for 49€. Can't wait for it to arrive... in a month


----------



## nort ycagel

alright, I like the sound quality of this thing. 
is it possible to control the BTR3 volume from the phone volume buttons?


----------



## Crixus00

nort ycagel said:


> alright, I like the sound quality of this thing.
> is it possible to control the BTR3 volume from the phone volume buttons?



I believe they are two separate volumes. On my Samsung S8 I have phone media phone volume, and the BTR3 unit has it's own volume as well. Both on max is just about loud enough for me for 75% of the listening i like to do.


----------



## Jay Ros

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We haven't add the EQ function in the beta firmware still.
> But the beta firmware has some improvement in microphone. If you would like to try, I could send the firmware file to you.
> ...



I have no problems to wait, but please, do an installer for macOS. I have a FiiO BTR3 that I share with my iPhone 8 Plus and my MacBook Pro, and for the last update I had to find a Windows PC to update it. I'd like to be able to update from my own computer (without having to install Windows on Bootcamp just for an exe file). Thanks!


----------



## Senior.god

Dear all,

I lost my ES100 some days ago.......
After Reading these Thread, i think i Unterstand, that 
Btr3 is Almost on par with audio quality, with fewer power Output
Btr3 has much more better button layout (this is really terrible on ES100)
Fiio do a really bad job on maintaining firmware and app

One point i didn‘t find is if it is possible to use a lightning to usb-c cable to connect btr3 to an iPhone and use btr3 as external (wired) dac.
Anybody here who can answer that question?


----------



## Brooko

Senior.god said:


> Dear all,
> 
> I lost my ES100 some days ago.......
> After Reading these Thread, i think i Unterstand, that
> ...



You'd have to have a cable that didn't pass power through.  I just tried with a standard cable and the iPhone won't connect because the device uses too much power.

Why wouldn't you just use the Bluetooth connection though?  AAC256 is transparent - and I'm pretty sure in a blind volume match test you couldn't tell a wired and wireless connection apart.


----------



## Senior.god

Brooko said:


> You'd have to have a cable that didn't pass power through.  I just tried with a standard cable and the iPhone won't connect because the device uses too much power.
> 
> Why wouldn't you just use the Bluetooth connection though?  AAC256 is transparent - and I'm pretty sure in a blind volume match test you couldn't tell a wired and wireless connection apart.



In addition to streaming Services (i use spotify instead of Apple music, because it is much more better to Stream to my Hifi) i have several Flac files on my phone. Some of them in 44.1/24, 48/24 96/24. In order to hear these „in full quality“ it would be nice if btr3 also works as external DAC.


----------



## Brooko

I'd suggest at some stage seeing if you can tell the difference between different containers.  AAC256 might be lossy - but I've yet to find someone who can differentiate between it and lossless (using the same master, and volume matching properly).  Once you work out what is actually audible - then you can simply worry about the most stable connection and easiest to use.

But to answer your original question - you'll need a lightning to USB-C which doesn't pass through power.


----------



## FiiO

Jay Ros said:


> I have no problems to wait, but please, do an installer for macOS. I have a FiiO BTR3 that I share with my iPhone 8 Plus and my MacBook Pro, and for the last update I had to find a Windows PC to update it. I'd like to be able to update from my own computer (without having to install Windows on Bootcamp just for an exe file). Thanks!


Dear friend,

We are sorry that the chip supplier does not provide a update tool for MAC.  So you would need to find a Windows PC still for updating.

Best regards


----------



## CybDev

Jay Ros said:


> I have no problems to wait, but please, do an installer for macOS. I have a FiiO BTR3 that I share with my iPhone 8 Plus and my MacBook Pro, and for the last update I had to find a Windows PC to update it. I'd like to be able to update from my own computer (without having to install Windows on Bootcamp just for an exe file). Thanks!



From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Device_Firmware_Upgrade


> Device Firmware Upgrade (DFU) is a vendor- and device-independent mechanism for upgrading the firmware of USB devices with improved versions provided by their manufacturers, offering (for example) a way to deploy firmware bug fixes.



Might not be officially supported, but you might want to try your luck with something like http://macappstore.org/dfu-util/ or https://www.thesycon.de/eng/dfu_utility_macos.shtml 

(I successfully upgraded the firmware of my BTR3 on linux)


----------



## pholcus1975

Just ordered one. Use will be mainly in my car, that has 3.5 aux in. Now I have a Blitzwolf bw br4 dongle that supports aptx and aptxhd. It sounds pretty decent to my ears. But my phone supports aptx non hd and ldac, so I think Fiio will be way better. More impressions tomorrow.


----------



## nort ycagel

I'm really liking this dongle. Sound quality seems fine.

The only issue I have so far is that everytime I turn it on it blasts my eardrums.


----------



## FiiO

nort ycagel said:


> I'm really liking this dongle. Sound quality seems fine.
> 
> The only issue I have so far is that everytime I turn it on it blasts my eardrums.


Dear friend,

Did you do any other settings in your mobile phone or the BTR3?  The volume of BTR3 would not change if you did not do any settings for it.

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

So today I received, so far impressed by sound quality. No hiss even with re600, it drives no problem my Panasonic hd10 full size cans. I use it with a Samsung a3 2017 with Oreo, that supports ldac, app is Poweramp. Sound Starts to drop after 6 meters with 2 walls.
One question, If I leave to default without entering developer options, bit depth is 32 and sample rate is 96. So there is upsample, if source is 16 44.1. Who does upsample? Phone or btr3? Is there a way to auto follow file quality? Is it better to enter each time dev options, and manually change? It's a pita...


----------



## Senior.god

Dear all,

today i received my btr3 
It is connected to iphone XS MAX and i can play music via bluettooth to btr3
The quality is really bad. I guess it is only SBC. the color of the led don't change when i answer phone calls. The earstudio es 100 is much more better
I downloaded the FiiO Music app.Unfortunatly the btr is not to seen in the music app.
I update the firmware. No change.

Any idea what is wrong?


----------



## highlightshadow

Senior.god said:


> Dear all,
> 
> today i received my btr3
> It is connected to iphone XS MAX and i can play music via bluettooth to btr3
> ...



In theory both the ES100 and BTR3 on an iPhone should be using AAC ... it's the best iOS can do - so really there shouldn't be much difference in SQ


----------



## minimalist82

Senior.god said:


> Dear all,
> 
> today i received my btr3
> It is connected to iphone XS MAX and i can play music via bluettooth to btr3
> ...



Hi there, 

I use the BTR 3 with an Iphone XR and it always uses the AAC codec by default. The LED on the BTR3 flashes Cyan colour (like turquoise) which confirms this. What colour do you see when connecting? SBC would be a standard Blue colour. 

Regarding the quality, in what way to do you find it bad? I also use the device with my Samsung S8 and LDAC codec as well as my iPhone XR with AAC . If i'm really honest i would probably find it hard to tell a difference in a blind test. Both sound great to me. Of course this is all very subjective. 

I also used an ES100 previously with same devices/codecs above. I felt there was a slight difference in the sound signature for both, but I would not have said that one sounded better than the other. Just a little different. 

Which headphones are you using? If they are hard to drive perhaps that is the issue you are experiencing? Because the ES100 does have more power, especially when using balanced connection?


----------



## Senior.god

minimalist82 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I use the BTR 3 with an Iphone XR and it always uses the AAC codec by default. The LED on the BTR3 flashes Cyan colour (like turquoise) which confirms this. What colour do you see when connecting? SBC would be a standard Blue colour.
> 
> ...



Hi,

after some hours of using btr3 the sound is more refined now. 
I can compare ES100 and btr3 now. ES is more leaner and, the biggest difference, the upper mids and the highs are "smother". The music sounds more grained on btr3. I think that is the result of the more advanced functions for handling the music data in ES100. The btr3 sounds more "fat" with more lower mids and upper bass. That hides some details in the music. By the way i use SD2 from inear-monitoring.

After some trials i get Fiio Music to recognise BTR3. But than i see two BTR3 devices in my bluetooth settings. Don't know why. 
The Fiio Music app lost the connection the BTR3 sometimes and i have to reconnect. The EQ function is still not there. 
The setting of "hiding" the LED will lost every turn off/turn on of BTR3. 
What not worked - the whole day - and i have no idea why is the connection for phone calls. 
I can hear music without any problem. If i answer a phone call, i can't hear anything and on the other side of line, nobody can hear me. 
I have no idea why. I use iPhone XS.
Any ideas?


----------



## C_Lindbergh (Apr 3, 2019)

Still no EQ for this? I really wanna try this as well, but coming from the ES 100's fantastic EQ I'm not too sure.

Also any recomendations for a short 2 Pin 3.5 mm cable?


----------



## FiiO

Senior.god said:


> Dear all,
> 
> today i received my btr3
> It is connected to iphone XS MAX and i can play music via bluettooth to btr3
> ...


Dear friend,

Due to individual preferences, sound quality may be different for different people. When connecting to iPhone device and playing music,  the LED indicator would light cyan: 




If the BTR3 could not show up in the FiiO Music APP ios version, please try to click the reflash button in the top right button, and press the power button of the BTR3 for several time. Wait for 10s or so then you will see the BTR3 in the FiiO Bluetooth control interface. 

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

Hints for next update: settings of Fiio music app are reset to default every time device is turned off. Please let them save.


----------



## pholcus1975

Sound quality using Ldac top quality is simply outsatanding. My car stereo system, a simple basic Volvo setup, is brought to new life. Well done Fiio, this is my first Fiio device, but surely you earned a customer!


----------



## civciv

I have a problem with my Samsung S10 Plus and BTR3.

When I choose the "Optimized for Audio Quality" in Developer Options, audio is stuttering. No problem with the other options.

I never had this issue with my Note9. Any opinions?


----------



## TheoS53




----------



## Urnamaster13

Does BTR3 work as USB DAC automatically even if i am using it with WIndows 7 ?


----------



## Dmitry87 (Apr 7, 2019)

Urnamaster13 said:


> Does BTR3 work as USB DAC automatically even if i am using it with WIndows 7 ?


Yes, it should. However there are some complains that it doesn't work as USB DAC with the latest firmware. For me it worked at least with the previous firmware version.


----------



## Senior.god

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Due to individual preferences, sound quality may be different for different people. When connecting to iPhone device and playing music,  the LED indicator would light cyan:
> 
> ...



Dear all,

my BTR3 was defect. It was changed by the shop.
Now the mic is working and the sound is better (but not as good as the radsone es 100)


----------



## FiiO

pholcus1975 said:


> Hints for next update: settings of Fiio music app are reset to default every time device is turned off. Please let them save.


Dear friend,

Which settings are reset to default in your FiiO music APP? You could try to reset the BTR3 and reconnect for check? 

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

Digital filter always reverts to sharp, and  Fiio logo light reverts to on.


----------



## Dmitry87

The logo can't be switch off permanently for me as well. Also I've just checked the USB DAC mode and it doesn't work for me with the latest firmware. Both win7 and win10 can see the unit and the logo flashes blue, but there is no sound. Will see if the upcoming firmware update will fix these issues.


----------



## Ab10

Dmitry87 said:


> The logo can't be switch off permanently for me as well. Also I've just checked the USB DAC mode and it doesn't work for me with the latest firmware. Both win7 and win10 can see the unit and the logo flashes blue, but there is no sound. Will see if the upcoming firmware update will fix these issues.



Did you press the button combination to enter DAC mode of the BTR3 ?


----------



## Dmitry87

Ab10 said:


> Did you press the button combination to enter DAC mode of the BTR3 ?


I believe it should enter the mode automatically, correct me if I'm wrong. However I tried pressing/holding the buttons with no luck. For me it's not a big problem, I'm not going to use it as USB DAC. Reflashing can probably fix the issue, as it's definitely not a hardware malfunction.


----------



## Ab10 (Apr 8, 2019)

Dmitry87 said:


> I believe it should enter the mode automatically, correct me if I'm wrong. However I tried pressing/holding the buttons with no luck. For me it's not a big problem, I'm not going to use it as USB DAC. Reflashing can probably fix the issue, as it's definitely not a hardware malfunction.



1. Power on the device.
2. connect BTR3 with your pc via USB cable,
3. Press on/off buttons 3 times to enter into DAC mode,
4. Stable white light indicates DAC mode.

Detail manual available at Fiio music > Settings > Fiio BTR3 Status > Guide.

Or User manual in the product box.


----------



## Urnamaster13

Ab10 said:


> 1. Power on the device.
> 2. connect BTR3 with your pc via USB cable,
> 3. Press on/off buttons 3 times to enter into DAC mode,
> 4. Stable white light indicates DAC mode.
> ...


i tried it, is not working for me. I just got the BTR3.   I am on windows 7


----------



## Dmitry87 (Apr 8, 2019)

Ab10 said:


> 1. Power on the device.
> 2. connect BTR3 with your pc via USB cable,
> 3. Press on/off buttons 3 times to enter into DAC mode,
> 4. Stable white light indicates DAC mode.
> ...


Yes, that's what I did. It's a common issue, for some it works, for others doesn't.

For the unlucky I would recommend reflashing to the first or previous version of  the firmware if this functionality is vital.


----------



## shockdude

I'm on the v1030 firmware and the DAC works for me. But the "Auto" mode was annoying because the BTR3 would fade in every single new sound from the PC.
In the Fiio Music app, I set "Select input device" to "Manual". I then restarted the BTR3, plugged it into my computer, and did the triple power button click to change the LED to white and enable the DAC. No weird fade-ins, sounds great, the only issue is some added latency compared to the on-board headphone out.


----------



## FiiO

Dear friend,

The BTR3 can work as a DAC for the computer.  

*Auto mode*: Power on the BTR3, and connect it to the computer, then select it as the audio output device to* play music*; the white light will stay steadily on;

*Manual mode*: Power on the BTR3, and connect it to the computer,  then *quickly press the Power button for 3 times*; then white light will stay steadily on.

Best regards


----------



## pokipoki08

lordaine said:


> Quick fix, remove fiio music app then BT unpair, reboot phone, after that, BT pair again. Never installed music app.
> 
> HWA(LHDC) is kinda far from LDAC in terms of software maturity, IMHO. Setting for optimized audio quality results to stuttering from time to time even at side by side. Suggest to keep at adaptive bit rate. See attached screenshot.



Honor 8x EMUI need to be updated
Example
Huawei Mate 20 & Huawei Freebud/Flybud already on EMUI 9 but need more updates to pair & work properly
Link1 Link2

Honor 8x EMUI9 rolling out last month


----------



## pokipoki08

lordaine said:


> Problem is am using a Huawei phone ang they remove LDAC support, totally replace it with LHDC



Try updating EMUI first

Or root the phone and install magisk aptx-hd/ldac module, rooting is available for a small fee, check xda or taobao for details

Honor Play, View 10 have all the codes including HWA


----------



## pokipoki08

From the makers of LHDC (Huawei's HWA) , SAVITECH Corp. Hi-res Bluetooth  player app. 

Note playing some files may crash the app, coz it allows playing hi-res music without downsampling. Bluetooth LHDC device (speaker/headphones) required.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.savitech_ic.hdplayer


----------



## beholdclarity

I would like to share my impressions of the BTR3

TLDR:
It is just shy of being perfect! Get it, if you want something for your IEMS

Getting the BTR3 updated and the accompanying app to run/recognize it was a hassle. But once I was past that, getting it connected to my iOS device was a breeze.
I was surprised just how small and portable this tiny little wonder-thing is.

The good:

Dead silent background to my ears, even with CA Andromeda
Volume control buttons have just enough levels for decent control of volume (I think double the levels of iOS)

Sound quality is amazing, slightly more neutral than the Mojo, but still a bit warm, I suppose
Portability is outstanding. This thing fits in the leather pouch of my Andromedas WITH the Andromedas attached. 

Connectivity was never an issue with iOS, no problems here

Fit and finish is cool, I like the glass front and the clip actually is useful
Decent battery, could be better... but for its size it's great
The bad:

Why??? Oh Why do you have to insult my ears with this abrasive low-quality, high-volume sound every time i start it up or shut it down. Is there any way to remove that or replace it with a more subtle tone?


----------



## pholcus1975

I'll second that! That low fi sound is so wrong! Also when you reach max volume and press again to raise volume, sound briefly drops to play a tone, but it's not smooth.
Other than that this device is simply incredible, right now I'm listening with my fav iems no hassle of cables !


----------



## beholdclarity

pholcus1975 said:


> [...] Also when you reach max volume and press again to raise volume, sound briefly drops to play a tone, but it's not smooth.!



Haven't encountered that one yet. I wonder why they implemented this in the first place. The Q5 has no audible feedback whatsoever, which I find irritating as well... but oh well, small price to pay


----------



## Moonstar (Apr 12, 2019)

My short impressions about the FiiO BTR3 are as follows;

The FiiO BTR3 is a wireless Bluetooth Receiver that shows a clean and neutral sound presentation, which is packed in a small sized device with lots of features and that supports various Bluetooth audio codec.

*
Pros and Cons *

+ Clean and Neutral Sound
+ USB DAC functionality
+ Supports lots of Bluetooth Audio Codes

- There is no Screen Protector and Case in the Box
- Soundstage depth
*
 Full Review:*
https://moonstarreviews.net/fiio_btr3_review/


*Some Pictures *


----------



## FiiO

beholdclarity said:


> I would like to share my impressions of the BTR3
> 
> TLDR:
> It is just shy of being perfect! Get it, if you want something for your IEMS
> ...


Dear friend,

The notice volume is not changeable so maybe you will feel it too loud comparing to low volume settings. We will report to the engineer to assess about that in later products and firmware update for BTR3.

Best regards


----------



## Unknown757890 (Apr 14, 2019)

I might sound a bit stupid, but nevertheless; can you connect this via cable(?) to the FiiO M3K,
So it can act like a bluetooth reciever?

The FiiO M3K does not have bluetooth (Duh...)


----------



## speedingcheetah

So...is there still no EQ for the BTR3?
It is well into April and last I had read here, it was due out with a firmware update in March...
I see no new firmware updates...still only V1.0 is current.

Can we at least get a basic Bass and Treble adjustment ability? Like my E17K?


----------



## Bombyx

speedingcheetah said:


> So...is there still no EQ for the BTR3?


It is certainly a long-awaited feature, and I can relate how you feel. Personally I have been interested in buying the BTR3 since day one, but I have decided that I needed the EQ feature, so I have postponed my purchase, and I routinely check here about any progress.

I was very excited when FiiO announced here that a 10-band EQ was in the works, and I look forward to the release of the new firmware. That said, I am not sure about pressuring FiiO about it. A software project being behind schedule is not something unusual, and I prefer FiiO taking the time to polish the firmware rather than rushing it out. At worse, too much pressure could lead to the decision of dropping features (like the 10-band EQ) which is not something we want.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Bombyx said:


> I was very excited when FiiO announced here that a 10-band EQ was in the works



Where did they announce this?
I have had a BTR3 for several months,...and followed the thread since then, have not seen any official detailed announcement of a 10-band EQ. 
I have only seen posts of "EQ is feature is in development...its not ready yet "etc.


----------



## Dmitry87 (Apr 16, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> Where did they announce this?
> I have had a BTR3 for several months,...and followed the thread since then, have not seen any official detailed announcement of a 10-band EQ.
> I have only seen posts of "EQ is feature is in development...its not ready yet "etc.





FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> There will be 10 frequency bands in the EQ.
> Best regards



The EQ was announced in August-September. Implementation of an equalizer is a question of weeks for a mid programmer. They have probably had bigger problems to deal with so far.
@FiiO, is it possible to get source codes of the latest firmware?


----------



## 41treys

Recently purchased the BTr3. I have pretty limited experience with amps. Paired with my DT 770 32 ohms the sound is great.


----------



## beholdclarity

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The notice volume is not changeable so maybe you will feel it too loud comparing to low volume settings. We will report to the engineer to assess about that in later products and firmware update for BTR3.
> 
> Best regards



Thanks for the clarification! I appreciate your response


----------



## beholdclarity

A few more impressions:

I have spent a bit more time with the BTR3 and while I do have the feeling more technologically advanced dedicated DAC/AMP combinations like the Q5 offer more resolution, I find the BTR3 does a remarkable job. Actually, it is quite a bit more than just satisfactory: It is brilliant.

The best part -besides design, connectivity, sound, decent volume control, black background etc.- is portability. This thing fits in the Campfire Audio leather pouch along with the Andromeda!


----------



## 41treys

beholdclarity said:


> A few more impressions:
> 
> I have spent a bit more time with the BTR3 and while I do have the feeling more technologically advanced dedicated DAC/AMP combinations like the Q5 offer more resolution, I find the BTR3 does a remarkable job. Actually, it is quite a bit more than just satisfactory: It is brilliant.
> 
> The best part -besides design, connectivity, sound, decent volume control, black background etc.- is portability. This thing fits in the Campfire Audio leather pouch along with the Andromeda!



Hey, I'm running the DT 770 32 ohms with these. Just recently purchased the BTR3 myself. I found the darker tone of the BTR3 actually tunes the treble down a bit on the 770s, letting the mids come out more. I rather like it quite a bit. Also, the portability is fantastic. I'm interested to hear what your cans and IEMs sound like with the BTR3.


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 19, 2019)

I like my FiiO BTR3, but it has serious limits in physical connectivity. The software part of it is flawless, if you have more than two sources and you already know, which button is needed to be pushed and when, it's still acceptable. Bluetooth connections won't break easy, timeouts are long, etc. This behavior may come from its small size and the applied metal case that otherwise I like, too, because the (very small) RF field is directed away from my body when I wear it. Hopefully. 

So, if I compare it e.g. to a Parrot Zik, it has about half the range even on SBC (A2DP). If I'm sitting in a less lucky position, FiiO may skip seconds periodically even if the dongle is in the same room and in eyesight, but 2..2.5 meters away, even without turning my side or back to it... (My wifi router works on 5 GHz, but I live in a big condo, nothing is guaranteed). I began to attach the BTR3 to the edge of the sleeve of my shirts on the upper arm. I don't think that it is only the fault of my device or BT dongle, it has same sympthoms when it is used with an SGS7 phone.

The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones... the limit of its electronics is somewhere there. Nice to have them, anyway. My test equipment was $1000 range headphone (with less than 32 Ohm, by the way).  But this is a decent sounding, good device, and e.g. having so many steps in the volume control is exemplary.


----------



## 41treys

Hey, nice to hear your thoughts.  I have 770 32 ohms because I use them for work and commuting as well. The BTR3s portability and durability become very convinient for them. The formats are also very useful. I enjoy the audio quality as well. GLad to see you like yours as well. I know it's not a powerhouse amp by any means, but beyer designed the 770 32 ohms for on the go unamped use so its nice for me to have a small, portable source that's not clunky and can still add extra power to the phones.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 19, 2019)

ha3flt said:


> The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones... the limit of its electronics is somewhere there.



That is your opinion and your personal decision. Your hearing must not be that great then or the equipment you use is not that good, or you have not truly tested the difference in the codecs...or clearly just don't care.
There are plenty here that will say you are dead wrong.
There is a HUGE difference in SBC/AAC vs LDAC.  Even non "audiophiles" routinely report here and on other product forums that LDAC sounds way better and is a huge improvement.
Having personally toggled all the codecs with my Pixel 3, both with the BTR3 and using other BT headphones, LDAC is by far the best sounding BT audio codec, with APTX HD the second best. (though I find the HD AptX to be only just slightly better than the normal Aptx) LDAC is worlds ahead of Aptx. The raw specs LDAC are well higher than the other as well. https://www.sony.net/Products/LDAC/


----------



## beholdclarity

speedingcheetah said:


> That is your opinion and your personal decision. Your hearing must not be that great then or the equipment you use is not that good, or you have not truly tested the difference in the codecs...or clearly just don't care.
> There are plenty here that will say you are dead wrong.
> There is a HUGE difference in SBC/AAC vs LDAC.  Even non "audiophiles" routinely report here and on other product forums that LDAC sounds way better and is a huge improvement.
> Having personally toggled all the codecs with my Pixel 3, both with the BTR3 and using other BT headphones, LDAC is by far the best sounding BT audio codec, with APTX HD the second best. (though I find the HD AptX to be only just slightly better than the normal Aptx) LDAC is worlds ahead of Aptx. The raw specs LDAC are well higher than the other as well. https://www.sony.net/Products/LDAC/




Pardon my ignorance, but improved _how_?
Better resolution? More clarity? Warmer? More analytical?
Which attribute is improved with ldac? Is it like with any (decent) amp, that there are more differences than real preferences, or is it just _better. period._? Can you elaborate with a few bulletpoints or your experience?


----------



## speedingcheetah

beholdclarity said:


> Which attribute is improved with ldac


Litterlay everything is improved.
read the article i linked to for the tech specs.
For me, it sounds far closer to wired performance using the same headphones.
Bigger sound stage, very little to no compression artifacts. Far great dynamic range.
I can crank the volume up and not have it distort.
ANd you can do your own research if you want to know all the technical differences...but it is something you realy have to listen and compare for yourself with your own setup and equipment. as everyone's setup, hearing, and audio preferacnes are different.


----------



## beholdclarity

41treys said:


> Hey, I'm running the DT 770 32 ohms with these. Just recently purchased the BTR3 myself. I found the darker tone of the BTR3 actually tunes the treble down a bit on the 770s, letting the mids come out more. I rather like it quite a bit. Also, the portability is fantastic. I'm interested to hear what your cans and IEMs sound like with the BTR3.



Your experience coincides with mine. The BTR3 is dark to me, which I can appreciate. 
It provides a substantial oomph to those headphones that lean toward it, like my B&W P9, and dark and dry bass with my Andromeda while smoothing the highs in a very likeable way without producing any muddines at all. It’s quite perfect.

Only sometimes, when the mood calls for more resolution and a tad bit more clarity and power in the lows do I grab my Q5


----------



## beholdclarity

speedingcheetah said:


> Litterlay everything is improved.
> read the article i linked to for the tech specs.
> For me, it sounds far closer to wired performance using the same headphones.
> Bigger sound stage, very little to no compression artifacts. Far great dynamic range.
> ...




Hm, thanks for clearing that up. I’m a bit sceptical though. There is no component in my gear that I can single out and say „this improves everything“, since it all is so preferential. Even my Andromeda didn’t improve everything  compared to my 1more triple driver 80usd buds, even though all the specs suggest that. 
What they did, though, was improve in those aspects I deemed important/ worthy. 
Others might disagree and prefer the other thing greatly when asked without telling them the specs.

 I don’t know, but I accept the fact that I am unable to tell high spec from low spec with certainty.
I respect your opinion, though and will take it as a stepping stone to further investigate and broaden my horizon


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 19, 2019)

beholdclarity said:


> 1more triple driver 80usd buds



I have tried those both the dual and tripple earbuds. With my BTR3 and the better USB DAC the E17K I use with my main headphones, VMODA Crossfade wireless gen 1 (basically they are the M100 V2).
Those buds are gimicky to me. they mess with the sound stage. They just sounded, weird to me, even after they broke in a bit.  I was not expecting much at that price point honesty.
The pair of $30 Sony earbuds I got sound better to me. More natural and more details heard. 
Now, look at earbuds that are $800 or so, even ones that custom molded to your ear canal, even the real "audiophile" ones, are single driver. So I don't hold much to any stock in mutil driver headphones.
But again, audio is a VERY subjective thing and taste. If you like one thing over the other, then use what you prefer.


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 19, 2019)

beholdclarity said:


> I respect your opinion, though and will take it as a stepping stone to further investigate and broaden my horizon



Same here, anything might have happened, especially on the software side (unwanted conversion or so), but it is not fair to mix in experiences with other hardwares, as well as there is too much references given to the codec's specs - as if we didn't know. 

I agree, A2DP is definitely below a limit that one can hear relatively easily if something goes beyond using Apt-X or anything else above it e.g. in dynamics and sound stage, but I did not hear this on the BTR3 with a higher class headphone - that's my statement for now. Btw. that setup was really far from a more or less inexpensive but well worked out desktop DAC+amp by all means, but it implies at least a three times higher overall price over the BTR3.


----------



## 41treys

Hey fellow audio enthusiasts. Here is a review I have put together on the Fiio BTR3.

Preface: I have been using the Fiio BTR3 for about a week now with my Beyer DT 770 32 ohm versions. I've been pretty happy with this amp, so I decided I'd do a review here for anyone who's interested in them. I know most people run these with IEMs, so I wanted to provide some insight on how they power low impedance OEMs.

Equipment: Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro 32 Ohm, iPhone 6, Lenovo 40HU08E Laptop, Fiio BTr3, music ripped at rates of 320 kbps to FLAC quality

_Everything category will be reviewed on a scale of 1-10. Overall, I will score the BTR3 based on my final thoughts about their quality with regards to their pricepoint of $60._

Design: The BTR3 is extremely compact, coming in at about a third of the size of an iphone 6. Needless to say, with the clip and lanyard attachments, it's very easy to take around with little to no hassle. The build feels exceptionally sturdy and durable with metal and glass components. The UI is simple: a power button, a connect button, and a +/- volume switch. It also has a sleek, futuristic look with the Fiio logo lighting up in different colors depending on the audio codec used. The only issue I have with the design is that there is no part that shows me a battery percentage, and this is more of a personal preference anyway.
9/10

Connectivity: For me, I always keep the BTR3 on person, clipped somewhere, so connectivity has not been an issue whatsoever. I have found that I can get up to ~10ish feet away with no drops or lag. This means that a normal sized room will have full connectivity.
8.5/10

Sound: The BTR3 has a warm sound with a compact soundstage. In particularly, I think it syncs exceptionally well with the Beyers. It tunes down the treble a tad which allows the mids to sound more forward. Overall, the cans take on a much more balanced sound with little to no loss in detail. The soundstage does feel a bit smaller though. If you're looking for a portable amp that can produce a good bit of power though, then these might not be for you. Given that I have the portable friendly Beyers, they work excellently for me. The only qualm is the soundstage, but at their pricepoint, the sound is an absolute steal.
8.5/10

Overall Impressions: This is a stellar bang for your buck product. It's sleek, portable, easy to use and maintain, and overs a nicely resolved, rich sound. It adds an element of fun to whatever set you're using, and if you're looking for something that's convenient while also offering audiophile friendly quality in terms of portable amps, then I'd highly recommend this product. Feel free to ask me any questions!

9/10


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 24, 2019)

Neither makes any difference in the original discussion as to comparing audio quality of LDAC vs AAC or SBC.....u can hear the difference no matter what what type or physical forum factor headphone you use.


----------



## Brooko

And disengaging for good this time.

You make claims with no proof - haven't ever performed a controlled test (bluetooth quality, lossless vs lossy).  Make outlandish statements about products (most high quality "ear-buds" / IEMs are single driver - please!).

I wouldn't have even spoken up except for you saying atpX is superior to aac.  It isn't.  Never has been.

And confusing bit-rate with quality and audibility ........ ?  Enough said.  Lets agree to ignore each other.  I will make no further comment.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 19, 2019)

Brooko said:


> And disengaging for good this time.
> 
> You make claims with no proof - haven't ever performed a controlled test (bluetooth quality, lossless vs lossy).  Make outlandish statements about products (most high quality "ear-buds" / IEMs are single driver - please!).
> 
> ...



There are literally thousands+ of articles and videos if you Google search the topic comparing what is the so called "Best" Bluetooth Audio codec...with "proofs" and "facts" that counter each other over and over again. People with College degrees in Audio Engineering or related, can not agree and in raw lab tests, each nonindependent firm come to different and opposing conclusions often.  It is an endless debate, same as iOS vs Android, Mac vs PC...I can post a dozen articles "proving" to u that LDAC is better, then u can find and post a dozen more "proving" other wise. A useless and rather cynical request. 
You will never find any proof that you would accept anyway...other than your own experience and opinion based on your audio preference.

And to that end, the BTR3 is almost there.....It supports all the codecs that are in major use currently, but is STILL lacking in the EQ that it was advertised to have when i bought it a year ago. I have tried a few other competing products alike to this, but even with them having an device level EQ ability, I still find myself going back to the BTR3. Its sound and range is just more, premium, feeling and it has been out doing pretty much every other BT audio device I have for range and ability to not cut out as I walk around my home.
I also freaking love my Fiio Alpen 2 E17K which gives a larger sound stage and much better sound, imo,  than the BRT3 does even in wired DAC mode, and has much more power in it to drive nearly any headphone out there. The BTR3, i do have issues with not having enough volume on many things, mainly if i use it paired to my PC. However, the E17K has built in Bass, Treble, and Gain control, things lacking with the BTR3. Ether way, I am still waiting for the EQ to be implemented.....whenever that happens. Then I will be using the BTR3 far more often.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 19, 2019)

Brooko said:


> ou make claims with no proof - haven't ever performed a controlled test (bluetooth quality, lossless vs lossy)


What makes you think that any user who posts here, a public fourm where users post their opinions and experiences of a certain range of products, that disagrees with you, that user then has to  prove to you by providing a university level Critical Analysis/Research and Compare Study to back up thier statements???   I provided a link to a page that gave some technical specs and compares to AptX and LDAC. If that is not sufficient to you, then you are free to do your own in-depth research. I already stated, that I did do my own compassion between the codecs using the equipment I have and use with FLAC,WAV and MP3. LDAC is far superior sounding in my compare....period. I have no obligation to type a research paper to explain to you as to why or how or to "prove" my own findings or preferences to you or anyone else.

The main thing that I took a issue to was the post that was made some ways back now where they blatantly disregarded even trying the other codecs because they knew they were inferior and not worth their time to even see if that were true or how the BTR3 sounded while using those other codecs. You would not really know unless you try them.


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 21, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> The main thing that I took a issue to was the post that was made some ways back now where they blatantly disregarded even trying the other codecs because they knew they were inferior and not worth their time to even see if that were true or how the BTR3 sounded while using those other codecs. You would not really know unless you try them.



It is painful to elongate such a thread, but I don't see who wrote such a sentence that "blatantly disregarded even trying the other codecs". If you answered to my post(s), it is rude, or you still don't understand what's in it (and the next one about BTR3). Please, do not send us more spec's... nobody tried to defy them, as well as nobody were speaking of other hardware than the BTR3.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Apr 21, 2019)

ha3flt said:


> It is painful to elongate such a thread, but I don't see who wrote such a sentence that "blatantly disregarded event trying the other codecs". If you answered to my post(s), it is rude, or you still don't understand what's in it (and the next one about BTR3). Please, do not send us more spec's... nobody tried to defy them, as well as nobody were speaking of other hardware than the BTR3.





ha3flt said:


> The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely *no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones.*..



Utter rubbish.


----------



## speedingcheetah

ha3flt said:


> It is painful to elongate such a thread, but I don't see who wrote such a sentence that "blatantly disregarded even trying the other codecs". If you answered to my post(s), it is rude, or you still don't understand what's in it (and the next one about BTR3). Please, do not send us more spec's... nobody tried to defy them, as well as nobody were speaking of other hardware than the BTR3.




You clearly are confused and misdirected.

I never sent anything more than ONE link to explain the tech difference in Aptx and LDAC, in response to one post, which is related to the BTR3 directly in the codecs it can make use of.
One user then demanded I provided them "proof" or "documentations" and my results of my own tests to prove to them what I say is correct, other wise, my statement (or claims) is invalid and incorrect.
I only mentioned summarized or general things further about that, told them to do their own research and it was off topic, but they persisted, then...futhermore....
Then some other users took over the thread and posted, duplicate specs and definitions of earbuds vs IEM headphones (which i never wanted or asked for....) to forcefully correct my term used when they clearly knew what i was generally referring to. Yall have no issue going off on off topic rants and nitpicking at what everyone says...there seems to be no moderation or thread cleaning here.


----------



## ha3flt

Yes, I thought of exactly this one. Look at the whole post, it is not that long.

"_*I like my FiiO BTR3*, but it has serious limits in physical connectivity.
...
So, *if I compare it e.g. to* a Parrot Zik, it has about half the range even on SBC (A2DP).
...
The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones... *the limit of **its** electronics is somewhere there*._"

There is no such statment above that I did not try out what I was speaking of. There is a statement that BTR3's electronics is on a level that you cannot hear difference between the SBC and higher quality codecs. And this could have been done by trying and hearing, what else.

Then I tried to make it clear once more:

"_I agree, A2DP is definitely below a limit that one can hear relatively easily if something goes beyond using Apt-X or anything else above it e.g. in dynamics and sound stage,* but I did not hear this on the BTR3 with a higher class headphone - that's my statement for now.*_"


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 21, 2019)

Also, I did not want to write it down here earlier, because it is something that BTR3 is not designed to be and might be displeasing to mention here (someone may misunderstand it), but BTR3 is simply not on that level that _anybody_ can hear differences between those high spec's codecs with tons of bitrates and everything (if they are implemented well, but they seem to be implemented well). If BTR3 is compared to something more audiophile (as I did), it would become clear very fast, how ridiculous is to claim to hear such subtle differencies on that (Brooko tried to give you some hint on this, too).


----------



## speedingcheetah

ha3flt said:


> but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones..



Heavily implies you did not try the other codecs and you are saying it doest matter as there is no difference....



ha3flt said:


> There is a statement that BTR3's electronics is on a level that you cannot hear difference between the SBC and higher quality codecs


Then there is clearly something wrong with your hardware or device you are using if you are not hearing any difference. 
The difference _should be _night and day between SBC and LDAC.
Are you certain that the device and app you are using is actually using and outputting in the correct format each time you test, via looking at the HCI log? 

What is the player device that u are using to play your music with? If is an Apple device, I believe those only do SBC/AAC. (I do not use Apple) .
My Pixel 3 (and my old 1st gen Pixel XL) u can toggele the BT codec used in the Dev settings and when u do so, the change is instant, but I do have to restart my player app, PowerAmpv3 and confirm that it is outputting in the correct format.
Also, what app are you using if you are using a smartphone....many apps do not support Hi-Res Output hardware output or the better BT codecs. I have noticed that some app, or stock player apps, they seem to force output to the lower codecs, even though the system and the BTR3 indicate the use of AptX or LDAC. However, when i read the BT HCI log output, it shows the use of SBC when that app plays music, and LDAC when I use PowerAmp (configured correctly)


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 21, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> Heavily implies you did not try the other codecs and you are saying it doest matter as there is no difference....



So this is the end of our conversation. Have a nice day.

"_The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones... the limit of its electronics is somewhere there._"


----------



## speedingcheetah

ha3flt said:


> So this is the end of our conversation. Have a nice day.
> 
> "_The sound quality is adequate, but there is absolutely no need to worry about formats, like Apt-X and LDAC variations, because you are not going to hear any difference between SBC (A2DP) and the higher ones... the limit of its electronics is somewhere there._"



Lets try to rein this in a bit and focus more one the main topic then.

U are saying that the BTR3 is designed and has a "electronics limitation" somehow as such that you can not tell any difference in using the other codecs.....and I am saying that _should not_ be the case and I am pretty sure that Fiio them selves would agree with me on that point.

 If that is in fact what you are hearing, no difference in the use of the better codecs, then something is possibly up with your source hardware/software electronics (not the BTR3)support limiting use of the other codecs properly.   
You are claiming that the BTR3 is the limiting factor, but without further expansion on that point, like what other hardware BT DAC adapter you have used that you CAN hear a difference in codecs on, or raw spectrum analysis output compares of the audio signals from each codec while in use.....it just boils down to a the fact that you say u can't hear any difference, and I (and others) _can_ hear a difference and that difference, many folks have widely different options on if it sounds "better" or not.. 
Your  experience is not typical, hence why it confuses me so and wanted to try and learn as to why you are saying as you say.

But if you do not care...and your sound quality is acceptable for you...then so be it.


----------



## ha3flt (Apr 21, 2019)

"_If that is in fact what you are hearing, no difference in the use of the better codecs, then something is possibly up with your source hardware/software electronics (not the BTR3)support limiting use of the other codecs properly._"

I can here differences with my desktop setup and a Denon headphone (using the same computer), but they are on a different level, and that is a different story.

You are so inexperienced, you don't know how to understand that one electronics is different from other. If there were no "limitations", there were no difference between sounds of a worse and a better DAC and amplifier... It simply means a certain level of quality and price of the circuit and its parts (plus/minus some spirit and knowledge).

I have other devices for sound quality. This one is for commuting and working, and it is really good in its category.

Sorry for the post beyond the finish line.


----------



## speedingcheetah

ha3flt said:


> I can here differences with my desktop setup


How is this so? 
I have only ever been able to get Win 10 to connect to BT devices with  SBC or AptX. I have yet to find anyway to get AptxHD or LDAC support on Win 10 and my research shows many folks asking the same thing with no real solutions?
(Using a program called "Bluetooth Tweaker" that tells me what codecs the OS and the device is using and also what it fully supports.)
Or are you using a different OS? 
What BT adapter and drivers are you using?


----------



## Hal Rockwell

speedingcheetah said:


> How is this so?
> I have only ever been able to get Win 10 to connect to BT devices with  SBC or AptX. I have yet to find anyway to get AptxHD or LDAC support on Win 10 and my research shows many folks asking the same thing with no real solutions?
> (Using a program called "Bluetooth Tweaker" that tells me what codecs the OS and the device is using and also what it fully supports.)
> Or are you using a different OS?
> What BT adapter and drivers are you using?



You can use Avantree Oasis Plus to transmit aptx HD to BTR3 from your PC.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Hal Rockwell said:


> You can use Avantree Oasis Plus to transmit aptx HD to BTR3 from your PC.


Interesting...though....I still have yet to find an adapter that does LDAC.


----------



## Dmitry87

Fiio said:
			
		

> Dear friend
> 
> The engineer will try their best to release a new firmware for BTR3 in May.
> 
> Best regards


----------



## cosmin01 (Apr 24, 2019)

Hello and thank you for accept on this forum.
I received my BTR3 yesterday.
Paired my Samsung S9... the sound level is very low. Paired with iPhone, all ok. Pairing again with S9was solving the problem.
Today i connected again the BTR3 and S9... low sound level. Disconnected S9, connected iphone, disconnected iphone and connected back the S9... solved the problem.
Went through all the codecs and BT settings in Developer mode, but no changes.
It is too much for me. I will send it back.
Does anyone know about Audioengine B1? Is it better or at least equal on sound quality with this BTR3?
I don't need the internal battery as i will use it in my car.


----------



## IdleHeroe

cosmin01 said:


> Hello and thank you for accept on this forum.
> I received my BTR3 yesterday.
> Paired my Samsung S9... the sound level is very low. Paired with iPhone, all ok. Pairing again with S9was solving the problem.
> Today i connected again the BTR3 and S9... low sound level. Disconnected S9, connected iphone, disconnected iphone and connected back the S9... solved the problem.
> ...



I've the Audioengine B1, its good with connectivity. SQ wise its a littler more dynamic and punchy but with BT, the SQ wouldn't be as good as wired in. I was keen on the BTR3 until i saw your post..


----------



## 41treys

Max the volume on your device then use the BTR3 to adjust the volume to your desired level. It drives my 32 ohm dt 770s that way. No reason it shouldn't work for your IEMs either.


----------



## cosmin01

You don't understand. Volume it's at maximum on both phone and BTR3. But it's not working at high volume until i pair it again 2-3 times. After that, if i'm not using it for a few hours, when i use it again, it's low volume. I unpair and pair it again and voila: high volume without making any other settings on volume or something else.


----------



## 41treys

Ahhhhh I see. My bad. Honestly, maybe you got a faulty unit? I haven't had this problem once.


----------



## cosmin01

Everything's possible. I will send it back. I ordered a Audioengine B1. Let's see what is capable of.


----------



## AxelCloris

We've removed some off-topic discussion from the thread. Let's please keep posts focused around the FiiO BTR3. Thanks everyone.


----------



## FiiO

cosmin01 said:


> You don't understand. Volume it's at maximum on both phone and BTR3. But it's not working at high volume until i pair it again 2-3 times. After that, if i'm not using it for a few hours, when i use it again, it's low volume. I unpair and pair it again and voila: high volume without making any other settings on volume or something else.


Dear friend,
Which Bluetooth codec are you using in your mobile phone?
Please try to reset the BTR3 by holding the power button for at least 10s or holding the volume +&- for 5s to see if it helps? 

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

Just updated Fiio music app, eq is there


----------



## Janjohnnn

That only works for fiio app. Doesn't work on spotify/anything else but the fiio app


----------



## cosmin01

I am using LDAC codec. I already tried that procedure, but no result.
Whenever the BTR3 wants, he works at low volume with the Samsung S9. If i unpair and pair again the phone, it works properly.
I already purchased the Audioengine B1 and will send back the BTR3.


----------



## SBranson (May 1, 2019)

I've had the BTR3 since Dec. and I've finally given up on it.  The connectivity is absolutely terrible.  If I'm outside I can have the phone literally 4' away from me with no obstruction and it struggles.  Inside is better but even with my phone in my back pocket it cuts out.  I've managed to live with it until today when I can't get it to function reliably at all.  This is on an LGv30 and set to best connectivity in the settings.

Looking for suggestions for a replacement.  This should never have been sold.


----------



## digititus

SBranson said:


> Looking for suggestions for a replacement.  This should never have been sold.


I've had mine for approximately the same time. Works perfect for me. Maybe you got a defective unit? Have you tried connecting different devices?


----------



## highlightshadow

SBranson said:


> I've had the BTR3 since Dec. and I've finally given up on it.  The connectivity is absolutely terrible.  If I'm outside I can have the phone literally 4' away from me with no obstruction and it struggles.  Inside is better but even with my phone in my back pocket it cuts out.  I've managed to live with it until today when I can't get it to function reliably at all.  This is on an LGv30 and set to best connectivity in the settings.
> 
> Looking for suggestions for a replacement.  This should never have been sold.


I find if i'm out and about in a city and have anything using LDAC the connectivity is super glitchy

I bought some Sony 1000XM3's and in London yesterday they were frankly unusable with the phone in a pocket on the front of my jacket and the headphones using LDAC
Had to bring the phone super close to stabilise 
SBC codec worked flawlessly .... seems to be a the codec has much less margin for interruption than other codecs


----------



## SBranson (May 1, 2019)

highlightshadow said:


> I find if i'm out and about in a city and have anything using LDAC the connectivity is super glitchy
> 
> I bought some Sony 1000XM3's and in London yesterday they were frankly unusable with the phone in a pocket on the front of my jacket and the headphones using LDAC
> Had to bring the phone super close to stabilise
> SBC codec worked flawlessly .... seems to be a the codec has much less margin for interruption than other codecs



I'm not really in a city but that sounds like my troubles.  I'm going to figure out how to change the codecs then.
Thanks.



digititus said:


> I've had mine for approximately the same time. Works perfect for me. Maybe you got a defective unit? Have you tried connecting different devices?



I havent tried as I only use this at work.  As above, I'm going to try to get it off LDAC but I'm having trouble figuring out how to do that.

When I bought this, the retailer said that if I wanted sound quality, choose this model but if i wanted stable connection then I should choose the btr1.


----------



## digititus

SBranson said:


> I havent tried as I only use this at work.  As above, I'm going to try to get it off LDAC.


I only use LDAC with my phone. Definitely try different codecs to see if you can get a stable connection.


----------



## highlightshadow

In general i find bluetooth to be *highly* sensitive to environment. The noisier (in terms of other BT devices, EM background, wifi, mobiles, walls, tech) the worse my devices perform.
Walking around my home area which is a typical suburb i have significantly less issues and generally solid connection using LDAC even.
Yesterday i was on the London Underground and around Canary Wharf and it was completely un-listenable. with LDAC


----------



## SBranson

Well I don't know what it is but it was completely unusable today.  But in hindsight, there's never been a day where I haven't had to move my phone from my back pocket to a table or have it cut out if I get more than 15' away.  This is on the "most stable" setting so I've been really unimpressed with the performance.  Compared to the Shure 215BT set up I had, I could leave my phone in another room and it would still work.  
Considering all this, I probably can't sell it in good conscience so I'll probably just give it away..


----------



## SBranson (May 2, 2019)

I downloaded the Fiio app to try to work with the codecs but the app drops connection after 10-15 secs everytime.  This btr3 was bought in Nov and I think I recall the retailer telling me it was up to date.  I tried to update it and it did not work.


----------



## boodado

SBranson said:


> Well I don't know what it is but it was completely unusable today.  But in hindsight, there's never been a day where I haven't had to move my phone from my back pocket to a table or have it cut out if I get more than 15' away.  This is on the "most stable" setting so I've been really unimpressed with the performance.  Compared to the Shure 215BT set up I had, I could leave my phone in another room and it would still work.
> Considering all this, I probably can't sell it in good conscience so I'll probably just give it away..



if you are looking to give it away - I'd be happy to help you out... haha


----------



## archy121

@FiiO any updates on new firmware with Equ implementation?


----------



## BenF

I am trying to update BTR3 to the latest(?) firmware.
https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/114977.html

The instructions are here:
https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html
Here is part C of the instructions:




Looking back at part A:




It starts with "after downloading..." 
Where is the upgrade tool???
Really bad documentation - no way to know which firmware is the latest, and no upgrade tool is provided.


----------



## Dmitry87 (May 3, 2019)

Trues about NCT and the microphone quality problem:


			
				sebox @ 12/17/18 13:37 said:
			
		

> VAVENTUS @ 12/17/18 said:
> 
> 
> > In it, I met the parameters associated with the microphone, try to play with them, like there you can even cut down the noise reduction.
> ...


Source: https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=&sl=ru&tl=en&u=https://4pda.ru/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=927662&view=findpost&p=80261002&sandbox=1

It can probably be fixed by connectiong of a mic to B input, however such a hardware fix should be supported by the firmware. No software fix alone is enough to solve the issue.
It's clear now that headset microphone has no physical connection to neither A nor B inputs and it can't be used to fix the problem. Maximum, that can be done without fixing the hardware side of the problem is software filtering of high frequency noises. It will probably make the voice recognition level slightly higher while on transport.
I'm using busses and subway in Saint-Petersburg, the trains are old and the noise level is extremely high so I have to unpair my dongle and call back every time, then pair it back. I had no possibility to return it and had to put up with the problem. My advice is to check if the microphone quality is good enough before buying.


----------



## SBranson

Thankfully I have a great retailer.  I told then my troubles with the BTR3 asking only if the Btr1 would work better and if they had other suggestions and they offered to replace it for free, are sending out today and I'll send mine back.  What great service!!!


----------



## speedingcheetah (May 2, 2019)

BenF said:


> I am trying to update BTR3 to the latest(?) firmware.
> https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/114977.html
> 
> The instructions are here:
> ...



I was wondering the same thing...there is no link...

Anyway, as far as I know the V1.0 (1030) is the current version of the Firmware and there are and have been no new updates.
This is the version that came on my BTR3, and I bought it about a year ago on Amazon.
So, unless you have one of the first batch ones, you may not need to update.

Edit: Also, as the page say, the Fiio app will only show just V1.0 as the firmware regardless.
Unless they have changed that in the last few months....i no longer use my BTR3 with my Android phone, but instead re-purposed it to use with my Win 10 Laptop....since the BTR3 has not system EQ option enabled yet.


----------



## BenF

speedingcheetah said:


> I was wondering the same thing...there is no link...
> 
> Anyway, as far as I know the V1.0 (1030) is the current version of the Firmware and there are and have been no new updates.
> This is the version that came on my BTR3, and I bought it about a year ago on Amazon.
> ...


My firmware is older, so I need to update
It's ridiculous how bad FIIO's site is. Didn't anyone ever try to upgrade? How can they be missing the upgrade tool?


----------



## Ab10

Anybody here with iOS 12 and iPad can confirm this: 
 FiiO Music App cannot see the BTR3 - Right ?


----------



## cosmin01

On my iPhone with IOS12 worked the app. Don't know if it's the same situation.


----------



## Brooko

iPad mini.  iOS12.  The app can't access the BTR3 settings - although it still plays OK.


----------



## Ab10

Brooko said:


> iPad mini.  iOS12.  The app can't access the BTR3 settings - although it still plays OK.



Thank You Sir for the confirmation, Yes the BTR3 working fine - Just want to turn off the breathing light so it can extend some battery life. Due to this, I need to first connect to POCO F1 then back to the iPad. 
Just got the iPad Air 3 Today.


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> My firmware is older, so I need to update
> It's ridiculous how bad FIIO's site is. Didn't anyone ever try to upgrade? How can they be missing the upgrade tool?


Dear friend,

As we mentioned in the instruction of updating page: 
The latest firmware for the BTR3 is *v1.0 (v1030)* at present.There is no need to upgrade your BTR3 again, if it is already latest firmware. 
Some user tried to update the firmware even they were using latest firmware and got the BTR3 stuck. 
You could send email to support@fiio.com if you are not using the latest firmware instead.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Ab10 said:


> Anybody here with iOS 12 and iPad can confirm this:
> FiiO Music App cannot see the BTR3 - Right ?


Dear friend,

Can the BTR3 be see in other iPhone device instead? Please try to click the reflash button in the top right button, and press the power button of the BTR3 for several time. Wait for 10s or so then will you see the BTR3 in the FiiO Bluetooth control interface?

Best regards


----------



## C_Lindbergh (May 5, 2019)

Ab10 said:


> Thank You Sir for the confirmation, Yes the BTR3 working fine - Just want to turn off the breathing light so it can extend some battery life. Due to this, I need to first connect to POCO F1 then back to the iPad.
> Just got the iPad Air 3 Today.



I doubt the tiny LED would noticeably improve the battery




FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> As we mentioned in the instruction of updating page:
> The latest firmware for the BTR3 is *v1.0 (v1030)* at present.There is no need to upgrade your BTR3 again, if it is already latest firmware.
> ...



Any plans on Bluetooth 5.0 for better connection like the Radsone Earstudios? And when is EQ coming?

Also, are you still working on the BTR 4 (5?), considering you just launched the M5 which is also an BT receiver.


----------



## Ab10

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Can the BTR3 be see in other iPhone device instead? Please try to click the reflash button in the top right button, and press the power button of the BTR3 for several time. Wait for 10s or so then will you see the BTR3 in the FiiO Bluetooth control interface?
> 
> Best regards



Thank You Fiio - Described method worked, Now I'm happy to report Fiio Music can see the BTR3 and able to gain access Setting Section at iOS 12.


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> As we mentioned in the instruction of updating page:
> The latest firmware for the BTR3 is *v1.0 (v1030)* at present.There is no need to upgrade your BTR3 again, if it is already latest firmware.
> ...







1) The latest Android app (1.1.0) doesn't show any version for my BTR3 - doesn't it mean it has an older firmware?
2) If a firmware update bricks your devices, isn't this good enough reason to release a firmware version that wouldn't brick?
3) What's the point of having incomplete upgrade instructions in the User Gude? If the only way to upgrade is to contact your support, that's what should be in the User Guide.


----------



## mia123 (May 6, 2019)

Hi all, just wanted to share my thoughts and vent my frustration:

Positives:
-Straightforward and reliable connection with phone.
-Good audio quality
-Superb build quality
-Value for money

Negatives:
-NO EQ - It's been months. It's not good to promise and not deliver.
-Microphone is NOT working at all (Getting unit replaced) - seems a common issue.
-Unintuitive button layout. The buttons are not immediately easy to identify in the pocket. It's also not apparent how to pair without manual.
-Annoying flashing logo ruins sleek aesthetics. It's a nuisance especially at nighttime, or when clipped to outer garments. FiiO app doesn't remember settings and must be manually toggled each startup.
-Odd positioning of 3.5mm jack relative to clip. Feels like it should be opposite.
-Sometimes connects on APTx-HD and sometimes AAC (could be just my phone).
-FiiO music app is very cluttered.

However I still think it's a great product. However if I knew of these cons I'd probably have waited until the next firmware.


----------



## scook94

mia123 said:


> Hi all, just wanted to share my thoughts and vent my frustration:
> 
> Positives:
> -Straightforward and reliable connection with phone.
> ...



Did you try loading the f/w as posted in post #4 to address the microphone not working?
http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=44208&extra=page=2


----------



## mia123

scook94 said:


> Did you try loading the f/w as posted in post #4 to address the microphone not working?
> http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=44208&extra=page=2



Thanks! It worked. Now my mic finally has sound.


----------



## scook94

mia123 said:


> Thanks! It worked. Now my mic finally has sound.



Happy days!


----------



## Hinomotocho (May 6, 2019)

Can anyone please tell me if battery usage would be more for my tablet if I was to use bluetooth out to the BTR3 or using the 3.5mm output?
Is anyone able to confirm that I could use the skip track function with USB Audio Player Pro? Do the volume and track functions work with Foobar (PC)?


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> My firmware is older, so I need to update
> It's ridiculous how bad FIIO's site is. Didn't anyone ever try to upgrade? How can they be missing the upgrade tool?


Dear friend,

The latest firmware for the BTR3 is *v1.0 (v1030)* at present.There is *no need* to upgrade your BTR3 again, if it is already latest firmware.
Some users tried to update their firmware even when they are using latest firmware version and get the BTR3 stuck. So we do not provide the firmware link in our website currently.
Here is the firmware file you need: http://fiio-file.fiio.net/BTR3_1.0.dfu, Upgrade tool package is always in our website instead: http://fiio-file.fiio.net/BTR3_firmware_upgrade_tool.zip 

Best regards


----------



## C_Lindbergh (May 7, 2019)

Just got mine, I've owned an ES 100 before as well. Initial thoughts are that they sound like the ES100, I can't spot any major difference at least. But the ES 1000 do have an excellent EQ, the BTR3 lacks it atm.  The ES100 also got a much better app/tweak settings and a 2,5 mm jack, the battery life is also a bit better. ES100 can power more demanding headphones as well.

But the BTR3 got some advantages over the ES100

+ Build, the glass/aluminium combo feels really nice, even tho i'd preferred an all glass build for better connectivity/feel.
+  USB C! Huge for me, then I dont have to think about an adapter/cable whenever I'm on the road, just need one USB C for both my phone and amp.
+ Buttons, far easier to find the right buttons for volume/pause/next... Even tho I'd rather change place on forward/back, so forward is on volume up and back is on volume down.
+ The clip feels really solid, much better than the clip on the ES100
+ Cheaper, for me its 30 euros cheaper

I haven't had the time to test the mic yet tho.

All in all, my dream device would be the software from the ES100 with the hardware from the BTR3, along with wireless charging and a bit bigger battery. But as off right now I'd go with the BTR3 if you want something simple to power your IEMS, and the ES100 if you drive headphones with a lot more settings tied into the app.

There's just something that's really weird with the BTR3, the app settings are tied into their music player app, why not release a separate app like the ES100?


----------



## Dmitry87

C_Lindbergh said:


> There's just something that's really weird with the BTR3, the app settings are tied into their music player app, why not release a separate app like the ES100?


Totally agree, all we need is EQ and some other settings, but we have to use the app overloaded with a lot of junk functionality,
@*FiiO*, could you ask the programmers to cut out everything from the app except this frame:
*




*


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The latest firmware for the BTR3 is *v1.0 (v1030)* at present.There is *no need* to upgrade your BTR3 again, if it is already latest firmware.


I don't see a "1.0" version displayed in the app - this means I don't have the latest firmware, right?


----------



## smagus

FiiO, will there will be finally EQ added as you promised to be delivered in March? what's the ETA? or should we all start looking at ES100 or other options?


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> I don't see a "1.0" version displayed in the app - this means I don't have the latest firmware, right?


Dear friend,

So you could try to update the APP and the firmware of BTR3 for checking again.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

smagus said:


> FiiO, will there will be finally EQ added as you promised to be delivered in March? what's the ETA? or should we all start looking at ES100 or other options?


Dear friend,

We did not promise the EQ must be added in March. If everything goes well, the new firmware for BTR3 will be released this month.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Dmitry87 said:


> Totally agree, all we need is EQ and some other settings, but we have to use the app overloaded with a lot of junk functionality,
> @*FiiO*, could you ask the programmers to cut out everything from the app except this frame:


Dear friend,

Thanks for your kind feedback. 

The guide and lowpass filter are useful for some users however. You could just ignore those if you don't need to use that.

Best regards


----------



## Alberto01 (May 8, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If everything goes well, the EQ function for BTR3 will be added in February.
> 
> Best regards



Mr. FiiO, you said February/March referring to the equalizer addition. Since you didn't tell us the year, everyone here thought that you meant February or March of 2019. Nobody thought that you meant February/March of 2020 or perhaps later into the next decade.


----------



## Dmitry87 (May 8, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Thanks for your kind feedback.
> 
> ...


That's not exactly what I meant, filters of course should be preserved. By junk stuff I meant: music player/library, timers, track scanning, wi-fi transfer stuff and other not BTR3 related settings. All we need is to start the app and see the frame with BTR3 settings immediately. Just like its made for ES100, only settings, nothing more. Besides, all that excessive stuff doesn't work well, the programmers spend a lot of time trying to fix it instead of adding useful things like EQ. Check the last few updates of the app, nothing useful is made. Just admit, nobody needs it and cut it out and the time will be safe for important things to implement. Nobody will ever use fiio app as a music player when there is always a built-in music player and way better alternatives on google play.


----------



## apirat

This looks amazing! I’m a BTR1 fan, this would be a great next purchase.


----------



## scook94

Attempted a F/W upgrade, but it didn't go so well. Advice please?


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> So you could try to update the APP and the firmware of BTR3 for checking again.
> 
> Best regards


Finally upgraded, now it does show "1.0" in the app.
The old firmware was dated 2016-09-23 - over 2.5 years ago!
Now I could disable HWA and use LDAC instead.


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> Finally upgraded, now it does show "1.0" in the app.
> The old firmware was dated 2016-09-23 - over 2.5 years ago!
> Now I could disable HWA and use LDAC instead.


Dear friend,

The BTR3 was released at August, 2018. So the old firmware could not be that old. But anyway, glad to hear that you have updated successfully.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

scook94 said:


> Attempted a F/W upgrade, but it didn't go so well. Advice please?



Dear friend,

Can you still turn on the BTR3 by holding the power button for about 10s? If yes, you could follow the instruction and try again.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Dmitry87 said:


> That's not exactly what I meant, filters of course should be preserved. By junk stuff I meant: music player/library, timers, track scanning, wi-fi transfer stuff and other not BTR3 related settings. All we need is to start the app and see the frame with BTR3 settings immediately. Just like its made for ES100, only settings, nothing more. Besides, all that excessive stuff doesn't work well, the programmers spend a lot of time trying to fix it instead of adding useful things like EQ. Check the last few updates of the app, nothing useful is made. Just admit, nobody needs it and cut it out and the time will be safe for important things to implement. Nobody will ever use fiio app as a music player when there is always a built-in music player and way better alternatives on google play.


Dear friend,

Thanks for you feedback.
But we may not consider about your suggestion now. 

Best regards


----------



## scook94

No I couldn't. I ended up sending it back to Amazon and ordered a replacement. I won't attempt an upgrade until there's is a method that is fit for purpose. 



FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Can you still turn on the BTR3 by holding the power button for about 10s? If yes, you could follow the instruction and try again.
> 
> Best regards


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> ...The BTR3 was released at August, 2018. So the old firmware could not be that old.


 Unless it was a pre-release firmware


----------



## caprimulgus

There's discussion on the Shanling Up2 thread of BTR5 - is there any info on this?

Link to announcement (in chinese) here:
http://share.erji.net/wap/thread/view-thread/tid/2148499


----------



## Hinomotocho

I've just ordered one and will receive it today, can anyone please tell me when using USB Audio Player Pro app (android Samsung S7) how to select the output codec.
Is there a setting I use from the app or do I use the developer settings to set the bluethooth output to LLDAC?


----------



## Hal Rockwell

caprimulgus said:


> There's discussion on the Shanling Up2 thread of BTR5 - is there any info on this?
> 
> Link to announcement (in chinese) here:
> http://share.erji.net/wap/thread/view-thread/tid/2148499



Searching BTR5 on Google gets you to a couple of pages announcing the release of FiiO M5, which is an alternative to Shanling M0 DAP. I wish FiiO would release a BTR5, which would be like the Xduoo XP-2, but with a broad range of Bluetooth CODEC support, like the BTR3 has.


----------



## caprimulgus (May 16, 2019)

Hal Rockwell said:


> Searching BTR5 on Google gets you to a couple of pages announcing the release of FiiO M5, which is an alternative to Shanling M0 DAP. I wish FiiO would release a BTR5, which would be like the Xduoo XP-2, but with a broad range of Bluetooth CODEC support, like the BTR3 has.



Click on the link I posted. This IS the BTR5, not the M5.

There is a teaser video. This is a different product to the previously announced M5.


----------



## 4Real

Decided to pull the trigger on one of these, arrived today, got to say I'm pretty impressed paired with ibasso's IT01, wouldn't want to EQ them even if I could.

Was looking at getting a G7 or v40 but now I have more options, think a Oneplus 7 Pro has my name on it


----------



## Hinomotocho

Just got mine yesterday, also enjoying it with phone and IT01.
I got it working with PC/Foobar but it sounded like there were alot of frequencies lacking - how do you change the settings for the bluetooth output? Is there a component that I need to download for Foobar?


----------



## 4Real (May 17, 2019)

Hinomotocho said:


> Just got mine yesterday, also enjoying it with phone and IT01.
> I got it working with PC/Foobar but it sounded like there were alot of frequencies lacking - how do you change the settings for the bluetooth output? Is there a component that I need to download for Foobar?



Maybe your PC is using SBC (Blue Light), the app will tell you what codec is being used, if that's all it has then your out of luck as far as bluetooth, unless you try using an EQ.

I use "VoiceMeeter Banana" when I want to EQ, it has a very nice Parametric EQ, very easy to setup.

If you want to give it a go

1 - Select VoiceMeeter Input in Windows playback devices. (Set 2 channels)
(Alternative to the above (1), select VoiceMeeter Input in Foobar as output device)
2 - Set VoiceMeeter Banana to use A1 channel then output to BTR3.

Check the screenshot it should help, I removed all the faders on the channels not being used just to make it clearer. I was using wired for the screenshot but Bluetooth shouldn't be any different.

https://imgur.com/KXQaPM4

Use the EQ (right mouse click on EQ) on the output ( Master Section) not the input.

VoiceMeeter Banana

https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/banana.htm

What: Amazon dropped the price from £61.99 to £54.99


----------



## nort ycagel

I was loving the BTR3 from my android phone using LDAC but now that I have an iPhone it just seems like a waste because of the AAC limitations. 
is there really no solution to play at higher bitrates from iOS?


----------



## digititus

nort ycagel said:


> I was loving the BTR3 from my android phone using LDAC but now that I have an iPhone it just seems like a waste because of the AAC limitations.
> is there really no solution to play at higher bitrates from iOS?


No. The solution is to go back to your Android .


----------



## Hinomotocho

4Real said:


> Maybe your PC is using SBC (Blue Light), the app will tell you what codec is being used, if that's all it has then your out of luck as far as bluetooth, unless you try using an EQ.
> 
> I use "VoiceMeeter Banana" when I want to EQ, it has a very nice Parametric EQ, very easy to setup.
> 
> ...


Thank you - I'll have a go.
I use bluetooth for certain situations but for audio I've always stuck with wired to squeeze every last bit of SQ I can get before my aging ears let me down. I'm new to bluetooth streaming so I'm just trying to get my head around what is possible and if so, how to achieve it.


----------



## 4Real

Hinomotocho said:


> Thank you - I'll have a go.
> I use bluetooth for certain situations but for audio I've always stuck with wired to squeeze every last bit of SQ I can get before my aging ears let me down. I'm new to bluetooth streaming so I'm just trying to get my head around what is possible and if so, how to achieve it.



You can get Bluetooth transmitters, some support aptx HD.


----------



## Hinomotocho

4Real said:


> You can get Bluetooth transmitters, some support aptx HD.


Time to upgrade from the old one I have


----------



## Soundizer (May 19, 2019)

I am looking to purchase the best Bluetooth receiver to connect to my Focal Clear headphones.

In terms of comparisons what about the
*iFi Audio xDSD.*

Yes it is more expensive, but does it sound better than BTR3 and others?


----------



## Soundizer

Actually IFI XCAN is even better: cleans up Bluetooth signal and is £100 less than xDSD


----------



## 4Real

Can someone tell me if when using the BTR3 with Android you have the same problem with audio being resampled from 44.1kHz to 48kHz?


----------



## Dmitry87

4Real said:


> Can someone tell me if when using the BTR3 with Android you have the same problem with audio being resampled from 44.1kHz to 48kHz?


Yes, it works that way and it's unlikely to be fixed in future. Fiio has abandoned BTR3. It will soon be a year since last reasonable firmware update.


----------



## 4Real

Dmitry87 said:


> Yes, it works that way and it's unlikely to be fixed in future. Fiio has abandoned BTR3. It will soon be a year since last reasonable firmware update.


Just to be clear I'm talking over bluetooth not wired, not sure you can blame fiio when it's coded this way in Android.

What about "USB Audio Player Pro" over Bluetooth?

Thanks


----------



## Hinomotocho (May 21, 2019)

4Real said:


> Just to be clear I'm talking over bluetooth not wired, not sure you can blame fiio when it's coded this way in Android.
> 
> What about "USB Audio Player Pro" over Bluetooth?
> 
> Thanks


I use USB Audio Player Pro and was wondering if anyone could please enlighten me to how to get the best quality settings for the app, and also for android - using the developer settings. Does one override the other?


----------



## caprimulgus

caprimulgus said:


> There's discussion on the Shanling Up2 thread of BTR5 - is there any info on this?
> 
> Link to announcement (in chinese) here:
> http://share.erji.net/wap/thread/view-thread/tid/2148499



Ok, since no response, here is what I have pieced together from google translate:

BTR5

2.5mm balanced & 3.5mm single-ended
2x ESS Sabre ES9218P DAC
160mW+160mW balanced output power


----------



## PochoLaPantera

Hi is there any information about the Fiio BTR5?


----------



## Ab10

caprimulgus said:


> Ok, since no response, here is what I have pieced together from google translate:
> 
> BTR5
> 
> ...



Ohh....Is this true ? Two individual Dac for each channel, Brilliant !  

Size and the battery capacity please...As well as price.


----------



## Sp12er3

its 2/3 of may now, is there still no Firmware update in sight?


----------



## FiiO

Sp12er3 said:


> its 2/3 of may now, is there still no Firmware update in sight?


Coming soon!!!We are now testing the new firmware and will try to release it in next week.

Best regards


----------



## PeterMac

New firmware with EQ built in ?


----------



## cardeli22

SBranson said:


> I've had the BTR3 since Dec. and I've finally given up on it.  The connectivity is absolutely terrible.  If I'm outside I can have the phone literally 4' away from me with no obstruction and it struggles.  Inside is better but even with my phone in my back pocket it cuts out.  I've managed to live with it until today when I can't get it to function reliably at all.  This is on an LGv30 and set to best connectivity in the settings.
> 
> Looking for suggestions for a replacement.  This should never have been sold.


I have read that the bluetooth performance on the LGv30 is subpar. I had the LGv30 and had some issues myself with bluetooth earbuds disconnecting (while the Lgv30 was on my arm via sportsband) while I never had that issue with the iPhone XS. Hope this helps


----------



## SBranson (May 25, 2019)

cardeli22 said:


> I have read that the bluetooth performance on the LGv30 is subpar. I had the LGv30 and had some issues myself with bluetooth earbuds disconnecting (while the Lgv30 was on my arm via sportsband) while I never had that issue with the iPhone XS. Hope this helps



Thanks.  I discovered it was a combination of not the best BT performance on the LGv30..(the car always picks up my wife's iPhone over my LG even if she is 20' from the car and I am in the car)... And the other was LDAC.  My retailer graciously exchanged my btr3 for the btr1k and the performance was much better than the btr3 even on most stable setting.

It's too bad that the BTR3 just couldn't work for me because of the three, the btr3, the BTR1K and the ES100, the BTR3 has the best sound imo..


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> New firmware with EQ built in ?


Yes, EQ!


----------



## PeterMac (May 24, 2019)

Finally, that's great.

I need to increase I think ~+3dB on bass with my HD559 and will be perfect setup for me , can't wait yay


----------



## ClieOS (May 25, 2019)

Even BT adapter can use some love from a leather case.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

ClieOS said:


> Even BT adapter can use some froma leather case.



Looks cool! Where did you get it?


----------



## ClieOS

Hal Rockwell said:


> Looks cool! Where did you get it?



Taobao, though you can find it over Aliexpress as well.


----------



## Bombyx (May 25, 2019)

For those into DIY, someone designed a 3D printable case : https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3359376/
Edit : It is meant to be printed in TPU, a flexible material.


----------



## quimbo

Thank you.  Link for case - 
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DD-...luetooth-Adapter-Cover-Black/32994158721.html


----------



## PeterMac

FiiO - and how progress  do we get new firmware with EQ in this week ?


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> FiiO - and how progress  do we get new firmware with EQ in this week ?



Yes. 

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

*FiiO releases the new firmware 1.2 for BTR3, new added EQ function: Click here*


----------



## highlightshadow

PeterMac said:


> New firmware with EQ built in ?


New firmware is out
Includes eq. 1.2


----------



## 4Real

Is there any reason to upgrade if you don't need an EQ?



highlightshadow said:


> New firmware is out
> Includes eq. 1.2


Did you not see the post above yours


----------



## Bombyx

At last, THE new firmware? Hurray!  Thank you FiiO.  So, I have just taken the plunge and ordered a BTR3...


4Real said:


> Is there any reason to upgrade if you don't need an EQ?


According to the changelog (link posted above by FiiO) there a several bug fixes and small improvements.


----------



## 4Real

Bombyx said:


> At last, THE new firmware? Hurray!  Thank you FiiO.  So, I have just taken the plunge and ordered a BTR3...
> According to the changelog (link posted above by FiiO) there a several bug fixes and small improvements.


Yeah I saw that, but I'm not experiencing any issues.


----------



## grininja

Guys, after updating to the new firmware, please share a thought about EQ. My ES100 is dying and the lack of EQ kept me away from tryning BTR3.


----------



## speedingcheetah

So, the EQ only works for media played via the Fiio app? and not a device wide embedded EQ? 
I use Poweramp as my music player app, its EQ is amazing, but I use MX Player Pro for videos and that has no EQ.
I was hoping, and what I had understood from previous posts that was said the EQ would be a devices saved thing and would stick no matter what u paired it to, like if i set the EQ for higher bass, it would stick if i paired the BTR3 to my Windows laptop...etc.

Also, EQ does not function with LDAC!!?  The main reason I bough this product in the first place is because it supported LDAC......

Quite the disappointment.


----------



## C_Lindbergh

Yeah, I can't even tell if the EQ is on or off... Completely unlike the ES100


----------



## grininja

Bummer. So I have to get a second ES100.


----------



## Bombyx

speedingcheetah said:


> So, the EQ only works for media played via the Fiio app? and not a device wide embedded EQ?


It is a device-stored EQ (as you previously understood) otherwise a firmware update would not have been needed.



C_Lindbergh said:


> Yeah, I can't even tell if the EQ is on or off... Completely unlike the ES100


Have you tried resetting the BTR3 after updating (as mentioned in the update instructions)?


----------



## C_Lindbergh (May 30, 2019)

Bombyx said:


> It is a device-stored EQ (as you previously understood) otherwise a firmware update would not have been needed.
> 
> Have you tried resetting the BTR3 after updating (as mentioned in the update instructions)?



Yes, I also noticed that it doesn't work with LDAC... So if you're content without using LDAC it works. But it does work in other apps and not just in the Fiio music player.

It wouldn't be a huge deal if my device supported Aptx HD, but for some reason the S10 doesn't do that.

I do love the hardware of the BTR3, in that regard its way superior compared to the ES100, but ES100's software just blows the BTR3 away.


----------



## C_Lindbergh

Even says on their official release page that it doesn't support LDAC... *** -.-

"*.* The Equalizer only works when streaming in the SBC, AAC, aptX, aptX-HD and HWA(48kHz or lower) codec. It does not work for the LDAC codec. "

https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/244621.html

Such a disappointment, why can Radsone make it work with LDAC, their company is tiny compared to Fiio.


----------



## 4Real

C_Lindbergh said:


> Yes, I also noticed that it doesn't work with LDAC...





C_Lindbergh said:


> Even says on their official release page that it doesn't support LDAC... *** -.-
> 
> "*.* The Equalizer only works when streaming in the SBC, AAC, aptX, aptX-HD and HWA(48kHz or lower) codec. It does not work for the LDAC codec. "
> 
> ...


Did you not check the link fiio posted, all that info is listed there.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-86#post-14981274


----------



## C_Lindbergh

4Real said:


> Did you not check the link fiio posted, all that info is listed there.
> 
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-86#post-14981274



I didn't read every single post in the patch notes at first... But they never stated before today that it wouldn't work with LDAC, unless I missed it. If they did I wouldn't have gotten my hopes up in the first place...


----------



## shockdude (May 30, 2019)

Oh nice, the EQ works over USB DAC mode.
Haven't tested Bluetooth yet, but USB DAC Is my primary use case so I'm pretty happy.

Edit: Did the default EQ get adjusted in this update? Could be placebo, but the subbass might be better than it was before...


----------



## Hal Rockwell (May 30, 2019)

I had to disable the LDAC in the "Bluetooth CODAC" menu, though my phone doesn't even supports it, to get the EQ to work globally. It might solve the issue of "EQ is on, but makes no audible difference" for some.


----------



## PeterMac (May 30, 2019)

I do not hear any differences in sound with EQ on. I set +12dB on bass and nothing, use aptX lol.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

PeterMac said:


> I do not hear any differences in sound with EQ on. I set +12dB on bass and nothing, use aptX lol.



Did you uncheck LDAC, like I wrote?


----------



## PeterMac (May 30, 2019)

It starts work


----------



## Hal Rockwell

PeterMac said:


> yes


Weird. Worked for me.
Do you hear a click in the headphones when you go through the EQ presets?


----------



## PeterMac (May 30, 2019)

Work!, I dont know what I done to start work. I disconnect few times Bluetooth, run start FiiO Music and something fix itself.


----------



## PeterMac (May 30, 2019)

Thank you FiiO for EQ, now I listen my CD's again 

btw. Does it not possible to add EQ for LDAC in future ? hardware limitations ?
I'm using Nvidia Shield TV very often and this device work only with SBC or LDAC, aptX not 

__
sorry for double post, I was so exited and forgot to edit


----------



## speedingcheetah

Bombyx said:


> It is a device-stored EQ (as you previously understood) otherwise a firmware update would not have been needed.



Says it in the announce post.
"*d.* *New feature EQ only works with the latest version FiiO Music app"*


----------



## Kean FiiO

speedingcheetah said:


> Says it in the announce post.
> "*d.* *New feature EQ only works with the latest version FiiO Music app"*


Thank you for your encouragement and sharing. The added EQ function is the EQ adjustment of BTR3, which is independent of FiiO Music APP.
However, only the latest version of FiiO Music APP can call the EQ function of BTR3.
We will continue to work on the EQ function under LDAC coding.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Kean FiiO said:


> Thank you for your encouragement and sharing. The added EQ function is the EQ adjustment of BTR3, which is independent of FiiO Music APP.
> However, only the latest version of FiiO Music APP can call the EQ function of BTR3.
> We will continue to work on the EQ function under LDAC coding.



I was able to get the EQ to save and use out side of the app and on other devices the BTR3 is paired to.
The wording of that statement just implies to me that EQ only works in your app.


----------



## Hinomotocho (May 30, 2019)

I've only had my BTR3 for about a week. This update is a bonus - I am really happy that the on/off sound has been reduced and that the display doesn't reset and turn on when powered on for next use. I use mine most mornings for a quick listen before I get up, now I can do it without the shock of the display light and the power-on sound giving me a double shock wake up, I just power on and press play without having to open my tablet cover and start the player app, very convenient.


----------



## Brooko

EQ is working perfectly - thanks FiiO.

Thankfully I'm not worried particularly about codecs - as aac to me is completely transparent, and the differences in latency aren't an issue if I'm listening to music.


----------



## 4Real

Anyone using iOS? the app still shows 1.3.8 on the app store, not much point upgrading if we can't get the new app on ios.


----------



## Ab10

Firmware Upgrade went smoothly by following the Step by Step Instruction, Finally, have the feature to permanently disable the Led Light.....But at iOS device connectivity option sucks.


----------



## MarkF786

FiiO states the minimum IOS version is 1.3.9 but I only see 1.3.8 available.  I've deleted the app, downloaded it again, and still its 1.3.8.  And in the app, under "Check for update" it states it's "The latest version".

Is the IOS app not yet released?


----------



## 4Real

MarkF786 said:


> FiiO states the minimum IOS version is 1.3.9 but I only see 1.3.8 available.  I've deleted the app, downloaded it again, and still its 1.3.8.  And in the app, under "Check for update" it states it's "The latest version".
> 
> Is the IOS app not yet released?


No hence my post above.

Check the post below.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fio...added-eq-function.892468/page-3#post-14982781


----------



## highlightshadow

Am i correct in assuming that you can only listen to audio over the HWA standard if played via the Fiio app and not any other source?


----------



## 4Real

FiiO Music app 1.3.9 for iOS in now available on the app store


----------



## Hal Rockwell

highlightshadow said:


> Am i correct in assuming that you can only listen to audio over the HWA standard if played via the Fiio app and not any other source?



No. You can use whichever CODAC you'd like, from the ones available in the app and supported by the paired devices.


----------



## nort ycagel (Jun 2, 2019)

I updated the ios app to the latest version. My BTR3 tough was still at 1.0 so I coudlnt use the EQ.
I tried updating the BTR3. Put it in DFU mode and connected it to the computer.

The computer didnt recognize it correclty and now the BTR3 is simply dead, the leds won't give any sign of life no matters what button I press.

edit: nevermind i managed to do it


----------



## 4Real

Anyone here using the new iOS app, is the layout of the app all out of alignment for you, I'm using it on an ipad air, I had trouble at first selecting the Bluetooth codec because of this, filters are pretty messed up also.

Sceenshot

https://i.imgur.com/aQR0iAl.jpg


----------



## highlightshadow

Hal Rockwell said:


> No. You can use whichever CODAC you'd like, from the ones available in the app and supported by the paired devices.


Must be missing something - i get the green pulsing light when i play music from Fiio app to my Samsung GS10
But as soon as i leave the fiio app it reverts to Blue (sbc) or ldac if i select that in BT settings
Odd


----------



## quimbo

nort ycagel said:


> I updated the ios app to the latest version. My BTR3 tough was still at 1.0 so I coudlnt use the EQ.
> I tried updating the BTR3. Put it in DFU mode and connected it to the computer.
> 
> The computer didnt recognize it correclty and now the BTR3 is simply dead, the leds won't give any sign of life no matters what button I press.
> ...



I have the same issue, how did you manage to do it?


----------



## nort ycagel

quimbo said:


> I have the same issue, how did you manage to do it?


My pc saw the BTR3 as an "unrecognized Bluetooth Device". I right clicked it and unistalled the drivers. I unplugged the BTR3. 

I took a shower and when I returned the BTR3 was ON again. Before trying again to update it I first installed the driver given by FIIO and then plugged the device in DFU mode. then everything worked.


----------



## quimbo (Jun 2, 2019)

nort ycagel said:


> My pc saw the BTR3 as an "unrecognized Bluetooth Device". I right clicked it and unistalled the drivers. I unplugged the BTR3.
> 
> I took a shower and when I returned the BTR3 was ON again. Before trying again to update it I first installed the driver given by FIIO and then plugged the device in DFU mode. then everything worked.



Thank you, my pc does not see it as unrecognized bluetooth or in usb.  will continue to plug away

UPDATE: Holding the power button for about 15 seconds got me out of dfu mode.  Looks like I may not be able to upgrade?  tried on a win 7 computer and a win 10.  As much as I enjoy Fiio products (this is probably my 8th device) it may be time to seek an alternative.

UPDATE 2: Using a true usb-c cable matters.  I am all set


----------



## Hal Rockwell

highlightshadow said:


> Must be missing something - i get the green pulsing light when i play music from Fiio app to my Samsung GS10
> But as soon as i leave the fiio app it reverts to Blue (sbc) or ldac if i select that in BT settings
> Odd



What version of Android are you running?


----------



## 4Real

For those of you who have updated, which guide did you follow, video or written? because at the upgrade action screen in the video he selects the middle option, in the written guide it shows the top one selected?


----------



## quimbo

4Real said:


> For those of you who have updated, which guide did you follow, video or written? because at the upgrade action screen in the video he selects the middle option, in the written guide it shows the top one selected?



I just ran DfuWizard.exe and pointed to the folder where I downloaded the dfu file


----------



## highlightshadow

Hal Rockwell said:


> What version of Android are you running?


9.0


----------



## 4Real (Jun 2, 2019)

quimbo said:


> I just ran DfuWizard.exe and pointed to the folder where I downloaded the dfu file


I'm referring to the option below, in the video he selects the middle option, from the guide (picture below) its the top selected.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

highlightshadow said:


> 9.0



Do you have the developer options activated?


----------



## mico1964

Selected the top one as in the written guide.
Never watched the video


----------



## digititus

highlightshadow said:


> Must be missing something - i get the green pulsing light when i play music from Fiio app to my Samsung GS10
> But as soon as i leave the fiio app it reverts to Blue (sbc) or ldac if i select that in BT settings
> Odd


The green light is the HWA codec which is only supported via Fiio music app. It is not a system wide codec (unless your phone supports it natively). With other apps, you need to select the codec to use with the BTR3 (LDAC being the best).
I have found the HWA codec to be very unstable. As soon as you pause Fiio music or do something on your phone, the connection is dropped (even with latest firmware). In terms of sound quality, I hear no noticeable difference to LDAC, so I turn off the HWA setting.


----------



## 4Real

mico1964 said:


> Selected the top one as in the written guide.
> Never watched the video


Ok thanks for the reply, having just read you can't downgrade the firmware if you upgrade to 1.2 the top option seems kind of pointless anyway, lol.


----------



## PeterMac (Jun 2, 2019)

> We will continue to work on the EQ function under LDAC coding.



Now I can't wait to this , with LDAC EQ support will be perfect device for me. Keep great work FiiO team.


----------



## FiiO

digititus said:


> The green light is the HWA codec which is only supported via Fiio music app. It is not a system wide codec (unless your phone supports it natively). With other apps, you need to select the codec to use with the BTR3 (LDAC being the best).
> I have found the HWA codec to be very unstable. As soon as you pause Fiio music or do something on your phone, the connection is dropped (even with latest firmware). In terms of sound quality, I hear no noticeable difference to LDAC, so I turn off the HWA setting.


Dear friend,

If you are using the HWA in FiiO Music APP, please try to exit the FiiO Music APP after switching on the HWA option. Then enter it again and switch to next song for check.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

highlightshadow said:


> Must be missing something - i get the green pulsing light when i play music from Fiio app to my Samsung GS10
> But as soon as i leave the fiio app it reverts to Blue (sbc) or ldac if i select that in BT settings
> Odd


Dear friend,

Does your mobile phone supports HWA codec itself? If not, the HWA codec in FiiO Music APP could only work in FiiO Music APP.
But in the case your mobile phone supports HWA codec, other music APP could also use this Bluetooth codec.

Best  regards


----------



## sensenonno

hi FIIO,

BTR5 - when??


----------



## digititus

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If you are using the HWA in FiiO Music APP, please try to exit the FiiO Music APP after switching on the HWA option. Then enter it again and switch to next song for check.


This does actually work. Thanks. However, if I get any notification alerts on the phone then the connection is dropped again. Skipping forward or backward 1 track gets things connected again. Not really user friendly, but it does work.


----------



## vonBurg

Hi! has anybody tested if the BTR3 can be used as a DAC connected to an iphone or ipad?


----------



## 4Real (Jun 4, 2019)

vonBurg said:


> Hi! has anybody tested if the BTR3 can be used as a DAC connected to an iphone or ipad?


Same question below if you continue reading from that post forward, wonder if it would draw less power with charging off?

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-75#post-14868815


----------



## holsen

Ab10 said:


> Firmware Upgrade went smoothly by following the Step by Step Instruction, Finally, have the feature to permanently disable the Led Light.....But at iOS device connectivity option sucks.


Just got my BTR3  and cannot update the firmware.   The unit not go into DFU mode.  I've got to say, I'm pretty technically literate and I know what I;m doing in the device manager of a PC and pressing 2 buttons is pretty simple so I'm convinced this is not user error.
Steps to reproduce:
1st try:  Full Charge > Power On > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU
2nd try.  Power Off > Power On > Press and Hold Power 10 seconds to reset > Wait > Power Off > Power On > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU

Grateful if anyone knows a workaround or do I need to exchange?


----------



## Ab10 (Jun 4, 2019)

holsen said:


> Just got my BTR3  and cannot update the firmware.   The unit not go into DFU mode.  I've got to say, I'm pretty technically literate and I know what I;m doing in the device manager of a PC and pressing 2 buttons is pretty simple so I'm convinced this is not user error.
> Steps to reproduce:
> *1st try:  Full Charge > Power On > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU*
> 2nd try.  Power Off > Power On > Press and Hold Power 10 seconds to reset > Wait > Power Off > *Power On > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously* = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU
> ...



Just writing down the missing part

1st try:  Full Charge > Power On >* Hold the Multi Function (which is middle button) Button for 5 Seconds, Then Red & Blue Light will flash Alternatively* > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU

Bold underline step is missing from your statement...same goes to your 2nd try.

https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/84403.html?tdsourcetag=s_pctim_aiomsg


----------



## holsen

Ab10 said:


> Just writing down the missing part
> 
> 1st try:  Full Charge > Power On >* Hold the Multi Function (which is middle button) Button for 5 Seconds, Then Red & Blue Light will flash Alternatively* > Press and Hold Multi Button & + Button Simultaneously = Flashing Blue Light - No DFU
> 
> ...


Thank you.   I completely missed it.  Got and updated!


----------



## harpo1

@FiiO Why doesn't the EQ function work with your own devices (M11)?


----------



## PeterMac

What I hate after frimware update v.1.2 is notification sounds. They are same for connect/disconnect, power on/off etc. Please FiiO make something with this to be easy recognize. Should be different sound for every task.


----------



## Bombyx

I _hated_ the notification sounds of v1.0, they were much too loud (made me jump up each time). So for me, the sounds of v1.2 are a great relief, a much needed improvement. But I agree that they are not perfect, they sound noisy and they are not distinctive enough. Just a random guess, but maybe FiiO had to reduce their memory footprint to make room for the new features.

It must be a matter of taste, but my preferred notification sounds are those from the cheap Bluetooth earphones I run with. A soft voice that gently says in English : "power on", "power off", phone 1 connected", "phone 2 connected", "out of range", "battery low", etc. This is lovely, but probably much too memory consuming...


----------



## Brooko

harpo1 said:


> @FiiO Why doesn't the EQ function work with your own devices (M11)?



Does on mine.


----------



## quimbo

ClieOS said:


> Even BT adapter can use some love from a leather case.



Mine arrived yesterday, nice looking case, thank you for posting


----------



## holsen

Nice.  My BTR3 arrived 2 days ago.  Why anyone would buy a BT Cable when they could get a short cable and and full dac / amp is beyond me/   This thing rocks


----------



## holsen

FiiO said:


> Yes, you could use the BTR3 while charging still. But it is recommended to use it after charging fully.
> 
> Best regards


Just got my BTR3 and must say the audio is great, as close to a cable as you're going to get.  I love the form, the convenience when out and about but man, the amount of signal drop is terrible.  It doesn't matter what device I'm paired with... Phone, tablet, or DAP / DAC unless the two devices are beside each other with direct line of sight the audio just drops.   As I write this, the BTR3 is clipped to my shirt, my audio player is in my pocket I'm sitting in my living room and every time I turn my head, audio drops. When it works it's lovely or about 50% of the time.   Have I got a dud? @FiiO any chance of a FW pdate to BT 5.0?  The chip is capable.


----------



## nort ycagel

Anyone able to tell me the difference beetwen the various digital filters?


----------



## holsen

I've tried all of them but the differences are so subtle that I'm not sure I heard any difference really


----------



## holsen

nort ycagel said:


> Anyone able to tell me the difference beetwen the various digital filters?


----------



## joamlt22

My BTR3 can't turn on by button press or even when plugging in directly to a charger or pc.
Is another one else having the same issue? 
It seems to turn on if I leave it in the charger long enough. But when it does, it dies again quickly. 
Its only 6 months old


----------



## Caguioa (Jun 10, 2019)

is there any reason I need to get this if I have an m11

the only time I use Bluetooth is when I'm working out or when I don't want to mess with my wiress and my hands are busy


----------



## FiiO

harpo1 said:


> @FiiO Why doesn't the EQ function work with your own devices (M11)?


Dear friend,

Are you using the LDAC Bluetooth codec?

Best regards


----------



## 4Real

holsen said:


> Just got my BTR3 and must say the audio is great, as close to a cable as you're going to get.  I love the form, the convenience when out and about but man, the amount of signal drop is terrible.  It doesn't matter what device I'm paired with... Phone, tablet, or DAP / DAC unless the two devices are beside each other with direct line of sight the audio just drops.   As I write this, the BTR3 is clipped to my shirt, my audio player is in my pocket I'm sitting in my living room and every time I turn my head, audio drops. When it works it's lovely or about 50% of the time.   Have I got a dud? @FiiO any chance of a FW pdate to BT 5.0?  The chip is capable.


Maybe it's your other devices not the BTR3?

I can go 30ft from my ipad air with the BTR3 in my pocket without any issues.


----------



## holsen

Exactly the reasons I got one.  What this thing does is


4Real said:


> Maybe it's your other devices not the BTR3?
> 
> I can go 30ft from my ipad air with the BTR3 in my pocket without any issues.


I think the issue may be when I'm connected to 2 Devices.   Turned Bluetooth off everything except the phone I'm using right now and it's improved.  I'll try a couple of different scenarios over the next couple of days to be sure.
Would still love to see the FW update to BT5.0 though.  Radstone did it with the ES100, @FiiO should be able to do it with this.   I know it doesnt change the sound, but it does improve ranges and battery consumption.


----------



## Ocelitgol

LHDC stutters like crazy for me. Anyone experience the same?


----------



## holsen

Yep.  Disabled it and just stick to LDAC which sounds about as close to a cabe as. I think we're going to get


----------



## Ocelitgol

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Are you using the LDAC Bluetooth codec?
> 
> Best regards



Is it normal for LHDC to stutter when the screen is off? I'm using the Fiio App



holsen said:


> Yep.  Disabled it and just stick to LDAC which sounds about as close to a cabe as. I think we're going to get



Hmm....I really want to experience LHDC, see if it's much different with LDAC. Do you hear any difference between LDAC vs AptX?


----------



## holsen

H U G E difference between LDAC and Aptx.  and a  smaller but still noticeable difference from Aptx HD.  LDAC is the bomb for wireless BT


----------



## digititus

stormers said:


> LHDC stutters like crazy for me. Anyone experience the same?


LHDC performs very poorly with the BTR3 IME. Stick with LDAC.


----------



## Ocelitgol

holsen said:


> H U G E difference between LDAC and Aptx.  and a  smaller but still noticeable difference from Aptx HD.  LDAC is the bomb for wireless BT





digititus said:


> LHDC performs very poorly with the BTR3 IME. Stick with LDAC.



I just notice that if i leave my phone screen on, there will be no stuttering. as soon as the screen turn off, it stutters

I assume LHDC uses a lot of CPU and CPU is throttled down when screen is off? idk


----------



## holsen

WiFi also affects it.  Turn off WiFi and its better.  For me it just wasnt worth the hassle and LDAC sounds so good anyway.  I just consider LHDC as non existent.


----------



## nort ycagel

holsen said:


> H U G E difference between LDAC and Aptx.  and a  smaller but still noticeable difference from Aptx HD.  LDAC is the bomb for wireless BT


I'm not sure I can hear any difference beetwen AAC 256kbs and LDAC


----------



## holsen

I'm not sure either as I dont use AAC but go into your Bluetooth settings and click optimize for audio quality see what you fined / hear what you hear. On one of my devices I can set it to 900 mbitsr sure there is a difference btwn AptX and LDAC


----------



## Bombyx

holsen said:


> Would still love to see the FW update to BT5.0 though. (...) I know it doesnt change the sound, but it does improve ranges and battery consumption.


Hardly so. Actually, as far as Hi-Fi audio is concerned, the _only_ improvement of BT 5 is the _Slot Availability Mask, _which improves the coexistence with other wireless devices (especially LTE). This _can_ affect the signal quality in _some_ circumstances, but nothing dramatic.



holsen said:


> On one of my devices I can set it to 900 mbitsr sure there is a difference btwn AptX and LDAC


The bitrate is critical. Both 990kbps and 660kbps versions of LDAC are better than aptX HD, but the 330kbps version of LDAC is _worse_ than aptX Classic (and arguably worse than SBC according to this article).


----------



## digititus (Jun 11, 2019)

One solution to getting LHDC to be more stable in Fiio Music is to put your phone into aeroplane mode. Then turn bluetooth back on. Same for optimized for music LDAC connection. Not ideal, but it works for me.

Edit: Actually, disabling LTE / data is enough. Wifi seems to be ok.


----------



## FiiO

stormers said:


> LHDC stutters like crazy for me. Anyone experience the same?


Dear friend,

You are using the HWA from the mobile phone or the FiiO Music APP?
If you are using the HWA from the Huawei mobile phone, please try to switch frequency from 96kHz to 48kHz  in your mobile phone.
If you are using the HWA in FiiO Music APP, please try to turn off and on the FiiO Music app after turning on the HWA option. Then switch to next file after turning on the FiiO Music app at the second time.  

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

PeterMac said:


> What I hate after frimware update v.1.2 is notification sounds. They are same for connect/disconnect, power on/off etc. Please FiiO make something with this to be easy recognize. Should be different sound for every task.


Dear friend,

Thanks for your kind feedback. But considering different notification sound may lead to misunderstanding easily, and in order to meet most users' need, we chose that notification sound in FW1.2. We will still consider about changing the notification sound in later firmware update according to the feedback from our users. 

Best regards


----------



## PeterMac (Jun 12, 2019)

Best notifications sound would be human voice like "Power On", Power Off", "Connected", "Disconected" etc. like in many Bluetooth devices. Same sound for everything is misunderstanding


----------



## Ocelitgol

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You are using the HWA from the mobile phone or the FiiO Music APP?
> If you are using the HWA from the Huawei mobile phone, please try to switch frequency from 96kHz to 48kHz  in your mobile phone.
> ...



Thank you. Yeah, I did that and it still stutters. The only time it doesn't is when I leave the screen on. When the phone's screen is off, it starts stuttering 
(I use the app with Samsung S8+)


----------



## Hal Rockwell

stormers said:


> Thank you. Yeah, I did that and it still stutters. The only time it doesn't is when I leave the screen on. When the phone's screen is off, it starts stuttering
> (I use the app with Samsung S8+)



If your phone is rooted you can use an app to set the cpu to a fixed clock.


----------



## Sp12er3

quimbo said:


> Thank you.  Link for case -
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DD-...luetooth-Adapter-Cover-Black/32994158721.html


That's nice... Sadly my btr is already too beat up for it... The clip on isn't as reliable as I'd liked. 
Now on to updating hhe FW... I do like that it's device bound, as the default tuning is pretty flat, I'd love being Abel to change it based on mood. On that week.


----------



## caprimulgus

sensenonno said:


> hi FIIO,
> 
> BTR5 - when??



Still no response from FIIO on BTR5...but on twitter:

https://twitter.com/FiiO_official/status/1131817814006882305



> BTR5 is under the development now, and we wish we can release it in the coming months.


----------



## FiiO

caprimulgus said:


> Still no response from FIIO on BTR5...but on twitter:
> 
> https://twitter.com/FiiO_official/status/1131817814006882305


Dear friend,

Yes, stay tuned!

Best regards


----------



## holsen

Anyone else getting sub par battery life from the BTR3 3.   I love this little BT DAC but I've had it it 2 weeks and I'm consistently only getting 6 hours out of it at low volume.  I pump the volume on source a d dial in on the BTR3.


----------



## FiiO

holsen said:


> Anyone else getting sub par battery life from the BTR3 3.   I love this little BT DAC but I've had it it 2 weeks and I'm consistently only getting 6 hours out of it at low volume.  I pump the volume on source a d dial in on the BTR3.


Dear friend，
You could try to check the battery life according to the information in our website again:https://www.fiio.com/btr3_parameters
If you are using LDAC Bluetooth codec, the battery life would be a bit shorter.

Best regards


----------



## holsen

OK thanks.  But the quoted battery life is 11hrs.  I understand that that running LDAC could drop the battery "a little" but I'm only getting about 6 hours which is just over half that.    A 45% drop is more than a little.


----------



## FiiO

holsen said:


> OK thanks.  But the quoted battery life is 11hrs.  I understand that that running LDAC could drop the battery "a little" but I'm only getting about 6 hours which is just over half that.    A 45% drop is more than a little.


Dear friend,

So please try to test the battery life again first. If the issue remains, please contact your seller about that.

If the seller fails to help, please contact us（support@fiio.com） again with the receipt attached. 

Sorry for bringing inconvenience to you.

Best regards


----------



## denony (Jun 22, 2019)

Hello,

I have just received my BTR3 (firmware 1.2). I am trying to *charge it*.
According to the quick start guide, when BTR3 is OFF and connected to a 5V charger (with USB type C cable) , the blue light should flash while charging (if I understand well).
Mine is *steady red.*
Is my BTR3 charging ?

And how to read the charge level of the BTR3 (in %) ?

Thank you


----------



## Razp

Cancelled my order after finding out that there was no firmware update enabling Bluetooth 5, even though the chip supports it ( https://www.qualcomm.com/products/csr8675 ). 

Slot Availability Mask is relevant in the EU.

Any ETA for BTR5 or I should just get an es100 ? I have the FiiO Q1 and really enjoy it, but BT 5 is a must for me.


----------



## digititus

Razp said:


> BT 5 is a must for me.


Why? What does BT5 bring to audio?


----------



## Razp (Jun 23, 2019)

digititus said:


> Why? What does BT5 bring to audio?




The only thing BT5 adds to Audio is Slot Availability Mask that prevents interference with LTE and WiFi networks. And that's a big deal in the EU


----------



## digititus

Razp said:


> The only thing BT5 adds to Audio is Slot Availability Mask that prevents interference with LTE and WiFi networks. And that's a big deal in the EU


I see. Does it work? I mean there is a noticeable difference?


----------



## Razp

digititus said:


> I see. Does it work? I mean there is a noticeable difference?



Honestly, I don't think there's such a noticeable difference. Probably a more stable connection in crowded spaces and offices, but that's enough for me.


----------



## holsen

Yes, it really improves the connection and is also more power efficient = better battery life


----------



## Bombyx

@holsen BT5 _can_ be more power efficient (than BT4.2) for _some_ use cases, but Hi-Fi audio is not one of them. On last November, when the ES100 became BT5 compliant (via firmware update) its users did not notice any battery life improvement.

An interesting read about BT5 : https://translate.google.com/transl....fr/bluetooth-5-arretons-de-dire-de-la-merde/


----------



## holsen

I'll give it a read.  Thanks.


----------



## FiiO

denony said:


> Hello,
> 
> I have just received my BTR3 (firmware 1.2). I am trying to *charge it*.
> According to the quick start guide, when BTR3 is OFF and connected to a 5V charger (with USB type C cable) , the blue light should flash while charging (if I understand well).
> ...


Dear friend,

1. If your BTR3 is powered off when charging, the red light will light up constantly and turn off after fully charged.

2. If the BTR3 is connected to device, the light indicating current Bluetooth codec would will light up constantly and return pulsating status after fully charged.

3. If the BTR3 is turned on but does not connect to any device, the blue light  flash once every 3s when charging as well.   

It is not recommended to use smart chargers with fast charging function. But theoretically, it could charge the BTR3 as well. 

Best regards


----------



## holsen

Is there a way to get the BTR3 to auto connect to last device?  Mine never does....   I litereally have to to go to the device and force connect it through settings.   I also understand that it can connect to 2 devices and switch between them   I can see you using this at conferences and seminars and connect it to a music source for breaks, but then connect to my PC to for presentation AV through the PA System...


----------



## FiiO

holsen said:


> Is there a way to get the BTR3 to auto connect to last device?  Mine never does....   I litereally have to to go to the device and force connect it through settings.   I also understand that it can connect to 2 devices and switch between them   I can see you using this at conferences and seminars and connect it to a music source for breaks, but then connect to my PC to for presentation AV through the PA System...


Dear friend,

Are you turning on several devices which connected to the BTR3 before? You may try to turn the Bluetooth of other device off first before turning on the Bluetooth of the BTR3. So it will reconnect the correct device you want.

Best regards


----------



## scook94

@FiiO Are you actively working on why HWA (LHDC) broke with 1.2 firmware? (At least it has for me on my Huawei P20 Pro.)


----------



## PochoLaPantera

Waiting for the btr5!! i wiilo buy it


----------



## zufmi

Please add firmware update support for OSX! I don't have access to windows computers.


----------



## CybDev

zufmi said:


> Please add firmware update support for OSX! I don't have access to windows computers.



Agreed, it would be great if @FiiO would officially support firmware upgrades on linux and osx as well as windows, especially as they seem to be using an open standard for flashing firmware anyway...


In the meantime, you might want to check out some of my earlier posts on the subject:


CybDev said:


> From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Device_Firmware_Upgrade
> 
> Might not be officially supported, but you might want to try your luck with something like http://macappstore.org/dfu-util/ or https://www.thesycon.de/eng/dfu_utility_macos.shtml
> 
> (I successfully upgraded the firmware of my BTR3 on linux)




And the long and boring version:


CybDev said:


> <snip>
> "FiiO BTR3 linux firmware upgrade"
> 
> Disclaimer: This procedure is not supported by the vendor and you are knowingly risking bricking your device if you attempt this.
> ...


----------



## FiiO

scook94 said:


> @FiiO Are you actively working on why HWA (LHDC) broke with 1.2 firmware? (At least it has for me on my Huawei P20 Pro.)


Dear friend,

You are using the HWA from the mobile phone or the FiiO Music APP?

If you are using the HWA from the Huawei mobile phone, please try to switch frequency from 96kHz to 48kHz in your mobile phone.
And please try to turn off and on the FiiO Music app after turning on the HWA option. Then switch to next file after turning on the FiiO Music app at the second time. 

Best regards


----------



## zufmi (Jul 1, 2019)

CybDev said:


> Agreed, it would be great if @FiiO would officially support firmware upgrades on linux and osx as well as windows, especially as they seem to be using an open standard for flashing firmware anyway...
> 
> 
> In the meantime, you might want to check out some of my earlier posts on the subject:
> ...



Thanks for this!

So I (successfully) installed the one for Macos: https://www.thesycon.de/eng/dfu_utility_macos.shtml.. But now I don't know what to do. I put my device in DFU mode, connect it to my Mac, run sudo dfu-util -l in terminal and it does not find my device, it just states the dfu-util version (0.9)


----------



## scook94

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You are using the HWA from the mobile phone or the FiiO Music APP?
> 
> ...



Yeah that does NOT work.


----------



## zufmi

zufmi said:


> Thanks for this!
> 
> So I (successfully) installed the one for Macos: https://www.thesycon.de/eng/dfu_utility_macos.shtml.. But now I don't know what to do. I put my device in DFU mode, connect it to my Mac, run sudo dfu-util -l in terminal and it does not find my device, it just states the dfu-util version (0.9)



So I got it to recognise my device, but the update won't work. It says something like "disconnected before reset?" and then it stops. Scary, because the device wouldn't restart for a while..


----------



## CybDev

zufmi said:


> So I got it to recognise my device, but the update won't work. It says something like "disconnected before reset?" and then it stops. Scary, because the device wouldn't restart for a while..



Sorry to hear that... Perhaps you could share some details about your platform?

And just to make sure, - you did follow the instructions to put it into DFU mode first?
And running the commands or gui app with superuser privileges (note the sudo part from my linux terminal output)?
(I should mention I booted from a usb stick without selinux/apparmor and such enabled, just in case)

As for the part where it wouldn't restart for a while, I encountered that as well, it took some effort to power cycle it after, but in the end it did come up with a new firmware version in the app, and the new functionality was there...


----------



## denony (Jul 2, 2019)

scook94 said:


> @FiiO Are you actively working on why HWA (LHDC) broke with 1.2 firmware? (At least it has for me on my Huawei P20 Pro.)


HWA does not work on my Samsung Note 9 + BTR3 1.2 + FiiO application 1.1.2, too. But I have not tried with firmware 1.1. There are a lot of drops (1 drop every 2 or 3 seconds). I tried all FiiO recommendations _(turn off and on the FiiO Music, ...)_. I hope FiiO team will fix HWA issues soon.


----------



## Philip Christian

I have ordered a BTR3 last night. Was looking at high end DACs such as mojo and ifi xdsd, q5, oppo etc. I am buying primarily for preamp dac as interface between phone and alpine h800 processor in car audio system. I tested max output voltage on my Galaxy s10 5G is around 0.28v without atmos or 0.4 with. I need to set amp gains too high as this output is not ideal at all. Looks like the btr3 should put out just under a volt from my calculations which should help snr. Anyway, I went with btr3 due to really wanting the convenience of ldac bluetooth vs usb cable and special media player with usb dacs such as mojo. I am waiting for the Fiio Q5s! I really hope Fiio use usb c connections on it though as it looks like they are using micro usb in press photos .


----------



## Razp (Jul 2, 2019)

@FiiO A few questions:
- Is there a BT5 FW update for BTR3 planned? The BT chip you are using supports BT5 and ES has updated their device. The feature I want from bt5 is slot availability mask, pretty much the only audio-related improvement. 
- Is there an ETA for BTR5 ? In may, your twitter said that you wanted to release "in the coming months".


----------



## zufmi (Jul 3, 2019)

CybDev said:


> Sorry to hear that... Perhaps you could share some details about your platform?
> 
> And just to make sure, - you did follow the instructions to put it into DFU mode first?
> And running the commands or gui app with superuser privileges (note the sudo part from my linux terminal output)?
> ...


I’m on a Mac, high Sierra so maybe that’s why it doesn’t work. I was able to put the brtr3 in dfu mode I guess. I know because when I mistakenly did not, dfutil would not recognize it. So I assume when it comes up with the device Id and all, it means it’s in dfu mode. I’m a bit scary to run the update again, then I could copy the exact messages. My terminal messages looked a little different and most of all shorter than the one you posted.Its not updated that’s for sure.


----------



## FiiO

denony said:


> HWA does not work on my Samsung Note 9 + BTR3 1.2 + FiiO application 1.1.2, too. But I have not tried with firmware 1.1. There are a lot of drops (1 drop every 2 or 3 seconds). I tried all FiiO recommendations _(turn off and on the FiiO Music, ...)_. I hope FiiO team will fix HWA issues soon.


Dear friend,

Did you try turn off and on the HWA option in FiiO Music APP and check again?

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Razp said:


> @FiiO A few questions:
> - Is there a BT5 FW update for BTR3 planned? The BT chip you are using supports BT5 and ES has updated their device. The feature I want from bt5 is slot availability mask, pretty much the only audio-related improvement.
> - Is there an ETA for BTR5 ? In may, your twitter said that you wanted to release "in the coming months".


Dear friend,

BTR3 uses the bluetooth 4.2. Actually the Bluetooth 5.0 may not help with the sound quality too much compared with the bluetooth 4.2. Moreover, some bluetooth codecs like LDHC still hasn't adapted to the bluetooth 5.0, we decided to use the mature bluetooth 4.2 version for BTR3.
We do not have an ETA for BTR5 currently.

Best regards


----------



## Razp

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> BTR3 uses the bluetooth 4.2. Actually the Bluetooth 5.0 may not help with the sound quality too much compared with the bluetooth 4.2. Moreover, some bluetooth codecs like LDHC still hasn't adapted to the bluetooth 5.0, we decided to use the mature bluetooth 4.2 version for BTR3.
> We do not have an ETA for BTR5 currently.
> ...



BT5 SAM is used for BT Audio.
That's sad that you don't have an update planned. I guess I'll go with @Shanling UP2 in this case.


----------



## se7en7

Can the Fiio btr3 be used like a normal portable headphone DAC where you use a otg usb c cable from phone into btr3 then out of 3.5mm into headphones? Thinking of two birds one stone etc


----------



## denony

Hello,



FiiO said:


> Did you try turn off and on the HWA option in FiiO Music APP and check again?


Yes, I tried. I does not work.

Regards


----------



## thebrieze

How well does the BTR3 work with sensitive IEM's? Does it have independent volume control with finer steps, or is it tied to the phones control - in which the increments are generally too large for my IEM's


----------



## 4Real (Jul 5, 2019)

thebrieze said:


> How well does the BTR3 work with sensitive IEM's? Does it have independent volume control with finer steps, or is it tied to the phones control - in which the increments are generally too large for my IEM's



Device volume and BTR3 volume work independently from each other, I'm using IT01's with mine which are pretty sensitive without any issues.


----------



## thebrieze

Great, thanks.


----------



## CybDev

thebrieze said:


> How well does the BTR3 work with sensitive IEM's? Does it have independent volume control with finer steps, or is it tied to the phones control - in which the increments are generally too large for my IEM's



I'm using my BTR3 with Shure SE535 IEMs, no problems at all 

And yes, the volume control is independent, and the steps are fine for me (not that it should matter, but using LDAC, both from a Oneplus 7 Pro and an older Samsung Galaxy 7 Edge).


----------



## 4Real

CybDev said:


> I'm using my BTR3 with Shure SE535 IEMs, no problems at all
> 
> And yes, the volume control is independent, and the steps are fine for me (not that it should matter, but using LDAC, both from a Oneplus 7 Pro and an older Samsung Galaxy 7 Edge).



I'm looking at getting the Oneplus 7 Pro, any problems with LDAC at 990kbps?


----------



## CybDev

4Real said:


> I'm looking at getting the Oneplus 7 Pro, any problems with LDAC at 990kbps?



Apart from the standard Android stuff where you have to go to developer settings every time you connect the BT device in order to get 990, - no issues.

Can't really speak for the range, I typically wear both phone and btr3 when I use them (got the BTR3 due to no headphone jack on the phone)


----------



## 4Real

CybDev said:


> Apart from the standard Android stuff where you have to go to developer settings every time you connect the BT device in order to get 990, - no issues.
> 
> Can't really speak for the range, I typically wear both phone and btr3 when I use them (got the BTR3 due to no headphone jack on the phone)


Ok, well at least 990 works.

As for LDAC not remaining selected, have you tried disabling all the other codecs on the BTR3 accept for LDAC? Maybe Android is defaulting to one of those for some reason.


----------



## CybDev

4Real said:


> Ok, well at least 990 works.
> 
> As for LDAC not remaining selected, have you tried disabling all the other codecs on the BTR3 accept for LDAC? Maybe Android is defaulting to one of those for some reason.



It defaults to LDAC selected when you enabled high-fi/ldac on the bluetooth device page, however, it falls back to "Best Effort (Adaptive bit rate)" setting when the device reconnects (along with 96kHz, 32bit, Stereo).

This was the same on Pixel2, Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge as well as the Oneplus 7 Pro. And same applies for using with my Sony WH-1000XM3 on all 3 phones, - it remembers LDAC but falls back to those defaults, and every time I connect the BT device I have to hit the developer menu and change back to my preferred settings (16bit/44.1Khz/Stereo/Optimized for Audio Quality (990/909), I'm mostly using Spotify so anything over that would be pointless to encode), at which point I have no problem with dropouts or anything. To be clear, no dropouts occur with default settings, and most of the time I can't tell the difference between the adaptive and audio-quality settings.

I'm not sure how I would see the "real" bitrate when it uses the default adaptive bitrate setting?


----------



## highlightshadow (Jul 8, 2019)

se7en7 said:


> Can the Fiio btr3 be used like a normal portable headphone DAC where you use a otg usb c cable from phone into btr3 then out of 3.5mm into headphones? Thinking of two birds one stone etc



Actually it does ... figured it out.
Basically turned on my BTR3 - it connected to my phone via BT
I plugged in the usb-c cable to both btr3 and my phone and then pressed power button 3 times ... FIIO logo went on solid white and in USB Audio Player it shows up as 'USB DAC'

If your phone has a USB-C port then you just need a standard double-ended USB-C cable ... i got a cheap Amazon Basics one at 15cm


----------



## highlightshadow

USB Audio Player in 'Bit perfect' mode


----------



## 4Real

highlightshadow said:


> USB Audio Player in 'Bit perfect' mode



Maybe I'm missing something, but how can it be bit perfect when your screenshot shows,USB DAC 48kHz File 44.1kHz?


----------



## highlightshadow

No - you're right ... for some reason even though the BTR3 supports 44Khz via USB on my Windows PC via the phone on this app it seems locked at 48Khz ... can't seem to change it


----------



## 4Real

highlightshadow said:


> No - you're right ... for some reason even though the BTR3 supports 44Khz via USB on my Windows PC via the phone on this app it seems locked at 48Khz ... can't seem to change it


Sounds like it's using Androids driver which will always output 48kHz.


----------



## Daiyama

I am little bit late to the update party but I have finally updated to 1.2 and I can say LDAC connection to the M9 is now way more stable, no random short disruption of the music stream anymore. Thanks FiiO!


----------



## ccrys

BTR3 can be used as receiver and trasmiter in the same time ? For example I want to use smartphone - bluetooth - btr3 - bluetooth- earbuds true wireless without any cable ? If not, there is a solution for something like this in the market?


----------



## Dmitry87 (Jul 22, 2019)

ccrys said:


> BTR3 can be used as receiver and transmitter in the same time ? For example I want to use smartphone - Bluetooth - BTR3 - Bluetooth- earbuds true wireless without any cable ? If not, there is a solution for something like this in the market?


BTR3 can't be used as a transmitter. If you want to use it as an external equalizer, you can set up Equalizer Pie application on your smartphone. However, it only works with Android 9+. There are some system-wide equalizers for Android 8 (like Equalizer FX), but the system interface is not sufficient and the output quality is very pure. Only bands 60, 230 and 910 can be adjusted on Android 8, so it's impossible to isolate main tone of voice (~180-320).
If you find the signal level of your smartphone is not sufficient, you can try USB Bluetooth transmitters, it should be cheaper, though it's not a wireless solution.
I would recommend an Android 9+ device in not-metal shell. Plastic or glass smartphones usually have  higher levels of Bluetooth signal. Years 4-5 ago the best Bluetooth range had HTC and Samsung smartphones. Probable Samsungs are still the best... the specifications have to be checked.


----------



## scook94

ccrys said:


> BTR3 can be used as receiver and trasmiter in the same time ? For example I want to use smartphone - bluetooth - btr3 - bluetooth- earbuds true wireless without any cable ? If not, there is a solution for something like this in the market?



Why oh, why? a) BTR3 is a receiver not a transmitter. b) if your earbuds are not capable of receiving and processing LDAC/LHDC/aptxHD already what makes you think putting another Bluetooth device in-between is going to rectify this?


----------



## ccrys

b)The smartphone output is weak and I want to use a dac as btr3.


----------



## scook94

ccrys said:


> b)The smartphone output is weak and I want to use a dac as btr3.



see a).


----------



## Dmitry87 (Jul 22, 2019)

ccrys said:


> b)The smartphone output is weak and I want to use a dac as btr3.


Check Audikast (TC418). It's said to be Class 1 range (100FT / 30M). It's powered and gets input signal from USB.  aptX LL, aptX,  SBC compatible.
Another option is Avantree c51, it's not so powerful, but can be easily fixed at the neck, if the cable is long enough. I've never used these devices, so you have to check the specification to be sure that's what you need.
I'm pretty sore there are no pure portable wireless solutions on the market, such devices don't make sense. I would still recommend to buy a smartphone with good antenna (not in metal shell).


----------



## thebrieze

ccrys said:


> b)The smartphone output is weak and I want to use a dac as btr3.


If you use BT earbuds, you will ALWAYS use the Dac in your earbuds. Think about it - BT is digital signal. So your earbuds will receive a digital signal and emit analog sound == Dac.

Adding BT transmitters/receivers in between is only going to add more hops (latency and other issues) and potentially may even degrade the signal if there any unnecessary codec conversions or DAC/ADC conversations depending on the components used


----------



## holsen (Jul 22, 2019)

thebrieze said:


> If you use BT earbuds, you will ALWAYS use the Dac in your earbuds. Think about it - BT is digital signal. So your earbuds will receive a digital signal and emit analog sound == Dac.
> 
> Adding BT transmitters/receivers in between is only going to add more hops (latency and other issues) and potentially may even degrade the signal if there any unnecessary codec conversions or DAC/ADC conversations depending on the components used


Exactly  And this is why I sold my BT earbuds and bought at BTR3.  A small 40 CM FiiO Cable (about the same size as a BT earphone cable) connects my Xelentos, or Tin P1 of Tin P3 to the BTR3 and I can walk around all day with 1. Strong Signal and 2. LDAC or aptX HD.
As you said the you will always be using the decoder in the receiving unit. So let the BTR3 or UP2 or ES100 be the receiver and you're golden.   I haven't found one BT earphone to have a decent dac or even the LDAC / aptX HD codec.... I asked several manufacturers why and it because of battery life..   Bite the bullet, get a BT DAC and you can use any 3.5 earphone for better range and better sound.


----------



## ccrys (Jul 22, 2019)

Every day I'm travelling 4h to work with bus.
The problem is when I asleep, my earbuds get out from the ear.I already damaged headphones cable.
Instead using btr3 prefer what I have now...


----------



## holsen

Hello @FiiO   I've got a question about the App.   Is there anyway to reset the library.   The app took a scan of "All Folders" and now all my old voice mails and system sounds are part of the library.  I need to reset and allocate just the "Music" folder.  How can this be done?  Thanks


----------



## holsen

holsen said:


> Hello @FiiO   I've got a question about the App.   Is there anyway to reset the library.   The app took a scan of "All Folders" and now all my old voice mails and system sounds are part of the library.  I need to reset and allocate just the "Music" folder.  How can this be done?  Thanks


Ok, I figured it out.  I went to Settings>Apps>FiiO> and 1. Force Stop  2. Clear Cache 3. Delete Data   Then just restart the app and start fresh


----------



## thebrieze

Fiio team, 

Are there any plans for an updated BTR3 with Bluetooth 5?

Thanks


----------



## FiiO

thebrieze said:


> Fiio team,
> 
> Are there any plans for an updated BTR3 with Bluetooth 5?
> 
> Thanks


Dear freind,

Our BTR5 will support Bluetooth 5.0. But the BTR3 may not be updated about that.

Best regards


----------



## 4Real (Jul 23, 2019)

ccrys said:


> BTR3 can be used as receiver and trasmiter in the same time ? For example I want to use smartphone - bluetooth - btr3 - bluetooth- earbuds true wireless without any cable ? If not, there is a solution for something like this in the market?



Hidizs AP80 has Bi-Direction Bluetooth and USB, but you might as well use it as the source if you got one of those.


----------



## 4Real (Jul 23, 2019)

Ignore, double post


----------



## thebrieze

FiiO said:


> Dear freind,
> 
> Our BTR5 will support Bluetooth 5.0. But the BTR3 may not be updated about that.
> 
> Best regards



Cool.. Any details, or a target release time frame that you can share for the BTR5?


----------



## Cadop

Hi all, I am experiencing echo on calls. I am using it in a Volvo XC90 with car mode on. 

Does anyone have the same problem? The problem is not for us but for the person on the other side of the call (so the issue is that the microphone picks up the other person's voice)


----------



## FiiO

thebrieze said:


> Cool.. Any details, or a target release time frame that you can share for the BTR5?


Dear friend,

If you will attend CanJam London, you can have a try of the BTR5 there. 

Best regards


----------



## domino584

Are there alternatives?  I like this design and its USB function but with a better DAC + amp (that is also affordable and portable like this package).  What is the competition?


----------



## acygni

domino584 said:


> Are there alternatives?  I like this design and its USB function but with a better DAC + amp (that is also affordable and portable like this package).  What is the competition?


If you are talking about the btr3, try shanling up2. If you are talking about the btr5, if there's a better, cheaper alternative, it wouldn't be releasing as a new product soon would it?


----------



## Hal Rockwell

Behold! The first ever Bluetooth transmitter with USB input and APTX-HD support.


----------



## dfung

holsen said:


> Exactly  And this is why I sold my BT earbuds and bought at BTR3.  A small 40 CM FiiO Cable (about the same size as a BT earphone cable) connects my Xelentos, or Tin P1 of Tin P3 to the BTR3 and I can walk around all day with 1. Strong Signal and 2. LDAC or aptX HD.
> As you said the you will always be using the decoder in the receiving unit. So let the BTR3 or UP2 or ES100 be the receiver and you're golden.   I haven't found one BT earphone to have a decent dac or even the LDAC / aptX HD codec.... I asked several manufacturers why and it because of battery life..   Bite the bullet, get a BT DAC and you can use any 3.5 earphone for better range and better sound.


You just saved me a lot of time and $$$.  What cable do you use?
I want something similar to the girl from the promo pics featuring the BTR3 from FiiO. LOL

I'm always on the go. Keeping everything ultra portable and light is very important to me.
Don't want my ear buds and the BT receiver get accidentally thrown off and stomped on the treadmill because the cable is too long and heavy like most copper cables out there...


----------



## holsen

Either of these will do it:  
https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32950...d=1943amp-ep_RnpW7f8Ir15K5wOeS-g1564034547474
Or
https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32959...d=1943amp-ep_RnpW7f8Ir15K5wOeS-g1564034547474


----------



## Sp12er3

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> If you will attend CanJam London, you can have a try of the BTR5 there.
> 
> Best regards


Is it any different from hhe M5?


----------



## tracyca

The btr3 usb dac is a nice choice to have. I like the build of this little amp.


----------



## Mlaihk

Can't wait!!!!!  Any chance to have an early batch!


----------



## kgs51

I use the sennheiser hd650 along with fiio M11 and fiio BTR3. If the sound from my M11 is producing LDAC, aptHD etc, then my headphones should transmit these codecs too because of the BTR3. Is this correct.


----------



## FiiO

kgs51 said:


> I use the sennheiser hd650 along with fiio M11 and fiio BTR3. If the sound from my M11 is producing LDAC, aptHD etc, then my headphones should transmit these codecs too because of the BTR3. Is this correct.


Dear friend,

The BTR3 will receive the Bluetooth signal transmition in LDAC ,aptxHD Bluetooth codec from M11. And you could insert the headphne to the BTR3 for enjoying the music.

Best regard


----------



## DavidS11

*FiiO Launched New Flagship Wireless Portable DAC/Amp BTR5*

Features :
1. Detachable back clip
2. 3.5mm (Single-Ended) + 2.5mm (Balanced)
3. Dual ES9218P DAC chip
4. Built-in XMOS chip
5. Supports native DSD decoding

Scheduled to be release in September/October (subjected to change)

Estimated SRP at USD 99.99 (subjected to final confirmation)

Update from Bluetooth 4.2 to Bluetooth 5.0 
Update battery capacity from 300mAh to 500mAh
Update DAC chip from AK4376A to Dual ES9218
Bigger and heavier

Source from: HiFiGO news


----------



## thebrieze

I’m looking at the BTR1K, BTR3 and the upcoming BTR5. In terms of size and weight (portability) which model would be a good balance that is lightweight and yet provide good enough sound? This will mostly be used during my commute, and will not be my main setup (Chord Mojo, Q5s). So I do not need the ultimate SQ


----------



## FiiO

thebrieze said:


> I’m looking at the BTR1K, BTR3 and the upcoming BTR5. In terms of size and weight (portability) which model would be a good balance that is lightweight and yet provide good enough sound? This will mostly be used during my commute, and will not be my main setup (Chord Mojo, Q5s). So I do not need the ultimate SQ


Dear friend,

Which headphone and mobile phone you are using? If your mobile phone doesn't support Bluetooth codec like aptxHD, LDAC, the BTR1K may be suitable enough for you.

Best regards


----------



## thebrieze

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Which headphone and mobile phone you are using? If your mobile phone doesn't support Bluetooth codec like aptxHD, LDAC, the BTR1K may be suitable enough for you.
> 
> Best regards



I will be using an iPhone and IEM’s (Fiio FH5, Massdrop Plus, Shure SE215 etc)


----------



## FiiO

thebrieze said:


> I will be using an iPhone and IEM’s (Fiio FH5, Massdrop Plus, Shure SE215 etc)


Dear friend,

The headphones could connect to 2.5mm headphone cable as well. So if your budget is enough, and you do not mind waiting a few time more, the BTR5 may be better choice.

Best regards


----------



## amgupt01

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The headphones could connect to 2.5mm headphone cable as well. So if your budget is enough, and you do not mind waiting a few time more, the BTR5 may be better choice.
> 
> Best regards



I'm going to go against the grain here. The highest quality codec that iPhones currently support is AAC. BTR1K, BTR3, and BTR5 all support this.

If you're already using 2.5mm balanced cables with your IEMs in your main setup, it _might _be nice to have the BTR5's 2.5mm balanced jack so you don't have to swap cables around. On the flip side, if you have more 3.5mm unbalanced IEMs, that might be too annoying to be worth the hassle.

Factors to consider include:

2.5mm balanced cable support
weight
size
overall build quality (materials, ease of use)
battery life
price, and
codec support for non-iPhone devices (if that matters)

For me, the sweet spot for commuting purposes is the BTR3, but it might be worth waiting for the BTR5 if you feel strongly about 2.5mm support


----------



## thebrieze

My main setup is unbalanced 3.5mm. So balanced is not a factor at this point. My main concerns is size/weight vs sound quality


----------



## amgupt01

thebrieze said:


> My main setup is unbalanced 3.5mm. So balanced is not a factor at this point. My main concerns is size/weight vs sound quality


For an iPhone over bluetooth (AAC) and with unbalanced 2.5mm, I don't think there would be a significant difference between the BTR1K, BTR3, and BTR5 in sound quality. 

Personally, I prefer the build quality (despite the corresponding increase in weight/size) of the BTR3 over the BTR1K. I don't think the jump in size/weight for the BTR5 brings a corresponding increase in quality unless you're using balanced cables.


----------



## nort ycagel (Aug 3, 2019)

Any hope for a proper parametric EQ? Would make all the difference in the world.

Edit: or if it was possible to manually modify the eq values, maybe even through some txt


----------



## TooPoorForHiFi

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The headphones could connect to 2.5mm headphone cable as well. So if your budget is enough, and you do not mind waiting a few time more, the BTR5 may be better choice.
> 
> Best regards



Do you have any ETA of BTR5 being available on Amazon US?


----------



## FiiO

TooPoorForHiFi said:


> Do you have any ETA of BTR5 being available on Amazon US?


Dear friend,

Thank you for the kind interest on our products.
No, stay tuned together~

Best regards


----------



## nort ycagel

am I the only one that finds the BTR3 sound lacking in definition?
Compared to the apple 3.5mm dongle it has a much bigger soundstage but sounds congested at the same time. on the apple dac the sound is sharp, almost "cutting" while the BTR3 is way softer and with less instrument separation.


----------



## Hinomotocho

nort ycagel said:


> am I the only one that finds the BTR3 sound lacking in definition?
> Compared to the apple 3.5mm dongle it has a much bigger soundstage but sounds congested at the same time. on the apple dac the sound is sharp, almost "cutting" while the BTR3 is way softer and with less instrument separation.


Could it be the codecs being used? I use with different devices and sometimes feel it sounds impressive, other times very average - I still haven't got my head around finding which codec is being used, I don't know if it is a developer setting or app setting.


----------



## nort ycagel

Hinomotocho said:


> Could it be the codecs being used? I use with different devices and sometimes feel it sounds impressive, other times very average - I still haven't got my head around finding which codec is being used, I don't know if it is a developer setting or app setting.



Im making my comparison using Spotify / Apple music. The codec used is always AAC 256kbps


----------



## 4Real (Aug 8, 2019)

nort ycagel said:


> am I the only one that finds the BTR3 sound lacking in definition?
> Compared to the apple 3.5mm dongle it has a much bigger soundstage but sounds congested at the same time. on the apple dac the sound is sharp, almost "cutting" while the BTR3 is way softer and with less instrument separation.


Its the other way round for me with my ipad air.


Hinomotocho said:


> I still haven't got my head around finding which codec is being used, I don't know if it is a developer setting or app setting.


What? it flashes a different colour for each codec, AAC is very similar to SBC in colour, but if you hit pause when your using AAC your see it gets darker, or you can look in the app, you can also limit the codec used by your hardware in the app.


----------



## Dmitry87

I have a few questions regarding upcoming BTR5:
1) I see only one microphone on the BTR5 renders -> no NCT is possible? or there is invisible second microphone?
2) Can we expect that headset controls/microphone will work properly with BTR5 ? If Yes, there would be 2 microphones, will in that case the unit microphone be used for NCT?
3) From the renders it's not clear how the unit can be fixed/attached. There is no clip.
4) Will there be a parametric 20 band equalizer?


----------



## 4Real

Dmitry87 said:


> I have a few questions regarding upcoming BTR5:
> 1) I see only one microphone on the BTR5 renders -> no NCT is possible? or there is invisible second microphone?
> 2) Can we expect that headset controls/microphone will work properly with BTR5 ? If Yes, there would be 2 microphones, will in that case the unit microphone be used for NCT?
> 3) From the renders it's not clear how the unit can be fixed/attached. There is no clip.
> 4) Will there be a parametric 20 band equalizer?


I guess you didn't read the text above the images?

Features :
1. Detachable back clip


----------



## Dmitry87

*4Real, *Sure I did. Just wanted to know how it looks.


----------



## acygni

Dmitry87 said:


> *4Real, *Sure I did. Just wanted to know how it looks.


Here is a glimpse
https://video.h5.weibo.cn/1034:4398717831203275/4398718591530597


----------



## Cadop

I have an issue with the BTR3 in the car, when I call someone, the other person hears himself every time he speaks. Is that a problem specific with my build no. Or is it a common issue? And will it be fixed in the btr 5?

Thanks in advance


----------



## acygni

Bad news for anyone anticipating the btr5 James from Fiio just announced it is delayed to end of Sep for their home market. So I don't expect it to available on Amazon until Nov.


----------



## FiiO

Cadop said:


> I have an issue with the BTR3 in the car, when I call someone, the other person hears himself every time he speaks. Is that a problem specific with my build no. Or is it a common issue? And will it be fixed in the btr 5?
> 
> Thanks in advance



Dear friend,

You may connecting the BTR3 to a speaker? So the mic of BTR3 may receive the loud sound from speaker as well. Maybe you could try to decrease the volume of your speaker to see if it helps?

Best regards


----------



## Cadop

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You may connecting the BTR3 to a speaker? So the mic of BTR3 may receive the loud sound from speaker as well. Maybe you could try to decrease the volume of your speaker to see if it helps?
> 
> Best regards


Yes that's exactly my problem. Unfortunately lowering the volume cannot be lowered because also at relatively low volume you can hear it. 
Is noise cancelling for car mode going to be implemented? Another possibility would be to automatically mute the mic when the other party is speaking

Thanks a lot

Pier Carlo


----------



## caprimulgus

acygni said:


> Bad news for anyone anticipating the btr5 James from Fiio just announced it is delayed to end of Sep for their home market. So I don't expect it to available on Amazon until Nov.



Do you have a link?

Wasn’t the original target release date always September / October?


----------



## acygni (Aug 17, 2019)

caprimulgus said:


> Do you have a link?
> 
> Wasn’t the original target release date always September / October?


https://m.weibo.cn/detail/4405537234228342
you can try use google translate. The original release period for their home market was actually arround May but had been delayed again and again. The facebook release date was posted before this last delay was announced and it's for the west so you can assume its pushed bk a month also.


----------



## flamesofarctica

Just returned my BTR3 to Amazon. I was getting approx 1.5 hours playback on a full charge with it getting hot to the touch, even on SBC using iems on low volume, just playing mp3 files. Doubtful I'll replace after this experience. It's a shame as it sounded great.


----------



## nishan99 (Aug 17, 2019)

My Bluetooth combo


----------



## nort ycagel

flamesofarctica said:


> Just returned my BTR3 to Amazon. I was getting approx 1.5 hours playback on a full charge with it getting hot to the touch, even on SBC using iems on low volume, just playing mp3 files. Doubtful I'll replace after this experience. It's a shame as it sounded great.


Perhaps SBC was the issue? No real benefits from using that codec.
I can get atleast double that amount of battery time


----------



## 4Real

flamesofarctica said:


> Just returned my BTR3 to Amazon. I was getting approx 1.5 hours playback on a full charge with it getting hot to the touch, even on SBC using iems on low volume, just playing mp3 files. Doubtful I'll replace after this experience. It's a shame as it sounded great.


Replace it there was something obviously wrong.


----------



## flamesofarctica

nort ycagel said:


> Perhaps SBC was the issue? No real benefits from using that codec.
> I can get atleast double that amount of battery time



Went back to SBC as I think that was the default. I tried every codec my phone will support and no improvement, and various earphones. Considered it may be the firmware, but didn't want to mess too much as really it should work out of the box. Think it was just a faulty one to be honest,  but I don't want to chance a replacement. Going to try the shanling up2 and see if I have more joy.


----------



## flamesofarctica

4Real said:


> Replace it there was something obviously wrong.



Just seen this after I replied to the other post so apols for double post. I think you're probably right, but a bit nervous as if I get one the same, Amazon will think I'm trying it on or something! If I have no problems with the UP2, I may try again in future as it was impressive minus that (fairly major) aspect.


----------



## noaid

What is the sense of having balanced output on small bluetooth device BTR5? 
Even the best LDAC codec does not have the quality when advantages of balanced would benefit. On the other hand device has to be much bigger and needs bigger battery without longer play time.
Without balance there would be or much longer playtime or smaller size or both. Sound quality the same.
The only reason may be current balanced headphone connector. But you can buy short 3.5-2.5 conversion cable and no problem.


----------



## Alberto01

nishan99 said:


> My Bluetooth combo


Nice!

Where can I get a 3.5mm coupler just like that one?


----------



## nishan99

Alberto01 said:


> Nice!
> 
> Where can I get a 3.5mm coupler just like that one?



this one came with the fiio a5

just search "3.5mm jumper" on Amazon


----------



## zufmi

Ok a while back in this thread I tried to update the btr3 with a Mac unsuccessfully. I tried again so I could copy my terminal screen. Here is what I've done, maybe anyone can shed some light:

I'm on high Sierra
Installed dfu util following this link http://macappstore.org/dfu-util/

*Put BTR3 in dfu mode successfully:*

_Computer:~ ****$ sudo dfu-util -l

Password:

dfu-util 0.9
(...)

Found Runtime: [0a12:ffff] ver=2520, devnum=5, cfg=1, intf=2, path="20-2.1", alt=0, name="UNKNOWN", serial="ABCDEF0123456789"
_
*Then ran the update:*
_
Computer:~ ****$ sudo dfu-util -d 0a12:ffff -v -D /BTR3-1.2-0531.dfu 

dfu-util 0.9

(...)

DFU suffix version 100

Opening DFU capable USB device...

ID 0a12:ffff

Run-time device DFU version 0101

Claiming USB DFU Runtime Interface...

Determining device status: state = appIDLE, status = 0

Device really in Runtime Mode, send DFU detach request...

Resetting USB...

dfu-util: Lost device after RESET?

Computer:~ ****$ _

*That's it. *
Something goes wrong here, but I have no clue what..


----------



## CybDev (Aug 22, 2019)

zufmi said:


> Ok a while back in this thread I tried to update the btr3 with a Mac unsuccessfully. I tried again so I could copy my terminal screen. Here is what I've done, maybe anyone can shed some light:
> 
> I'm on high Sierra
> Installed dfu util following this link http://macappstore.org/dfu-util/
> ...



Could be your usb ports, - perhaps you can try another one? Or if you are using a usb-hub, try directly without the hub?
(I have a Lenovo Thinkpad W541 where this occurs frequently on the usb3 ports, but never on the usb2 ports...)

Edit: You should also capture the last few lines of the command `dmesg` to get more information, or even just `grep USB /var/log/system.log` or `ioreg -b | grep USB` (all of those might require sudo). I'm not sure macos has anything similar to linux debugfs, but that could also shed some light on what happens with the usb device.


----------



## zufmi (Aug 22, 2019)

Thanks for a quick reply. I tried different USB ports and also usb c directly ( I have a Macbook with only TB3/USB-c ports). These are the last (of many ) lines after the dmesg command:

_IOBluetoothHostControllerUARTTransport::SendUART mProvider->enqueueData() failed error=0xe00002d7
**** [IOBluetoothHostController][EnqueueRequestForController] -- SendHCIRequestToTransport failed, error (0xE00002D7) -- kIOReturnOffline
[IOBluetoothHostController][SendRawHCICommand] ### ERROR: EnqueueRequestForController failed (err=e00002d7) _(repeatedly)

_012851.829824 dfu-util@: IOUSBUserClientLegacy::start: missing entitlement com.apple.ibridge.control_ (repeatedly)

_012851.835508 FiiO BTR3@14200000: AppleUSBDevice::ResetDevice: <software attempt to RESET>
_
I'm not sure what this means other than I see a lot of 'failed'..

[EDIT]
I tried a second time, now the last lines are different:

_Starting poll type 4
Restarting poll type 4
Command 0x2 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x4Command 0x1 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x1101Command 0x16 completed. inCount: 2 data:0xc0Command 0xa completed. inCount: 2 data:0xf7fdCommand 0xb completed. inCount: 2 data:0xf933Command 0x12 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x18Command 0x13 completed. inCount: 2 data:0xffffCommand 0xf completed. inCount: 2 data:0x2beCommand 0x10 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x1ac7SmartBattery: finished polling type 4_

[EDIT2]
and a third time, but now right after I ran the update attempt. I guessed the dmesg command could be something that looks back in recent history of the ports ?

_014372.179928 FiiO BTR3@14320000: AppleUSBDevice::ResetDevice: <software attempt to RESET>

Starting poll type 4
Restarting poll type 4
Command 0x2 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x5Command 0x1 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x1011Command 0x16 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x80Command 0xa completed. inCount: 2 data:0x1230Command 0xb completed. inCount: 2 data:0x10b5Command 0x12 completed. inCount: 2 data:0xffffCommand 0x13 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x9dCommand 0xf completed. inCount: 2 data:0x22bCommand 0x10 completed. inCount: 2 data:0x1acaSmartBattery: finished polling type 4
AGC:: WindowServer started pid 157 WS count 3
AGC:: [WindowServer pid:157 mux-aware] starting, non-mux-aware app count 0 WS-ready 1 switch-state 0 IG FBs 0 EG FBs 1:1f power-state 0 4D idle HDA idle system-state 1 power-level 20:20 connect-change 0
AGC:: [WindowServer pid 157 mux-aware] exiting, non-mux-aware app count 0, runtime: 0:00:00.000
AGC:: WindowServer died pid 157 WS count 2_

This last one looks a bit more informative although I have no clue what to do next

PS I tried on another macbook with native USB ports and El Capitan, but same issues. So it does not seem port / os version related.


----------



## zufmi

Ok I also tried to run windows XP in a virtual box, but even that one does not work. I was able to see the btr3 as an usb device, and install the driver. But when I run the wizard it cannot find the blue core model (/ in use by another software). I know a windows pc would fix this, but no friend, colleague or family member has a windows pc, and on the ones that do I cannot install the driver or connect any unknown usb devices for security reasons.. This update thing has taken too much of my time ;-(. Imo Fiio should clearly state on it's website that it cannot be updated with a Mac.


----------



## CybDev

zufmi said:


> Thanks for a quick reply. I tried different USB ports and also usb c directly ( I have a Macbook with only TB3/USB-c ports). These are the last (of many ) lines after the dmesg command:
> 
> _IOBluetoothHostControllerUARTTransport::SendUART mProvider->enqueueData() failed error=0xe00002d7
> **** [IOBluetoothHostController][EnqueueRequestForController] -- SendHCIRequestToTransport failed, error (0xE00002D7) -- kIOReturnOffline
> ...



Ah, the computer I use most often for firmware upgrades is a Lenovo T480s, and it has 2 usb-c ports, one with thunderbolt support.
- The thunderbolt port never works properly, - I have to plug it into the other port to get things to work (also applies to some external usb storage, it just keeps resetting the connection...)

As far as I know the FiiO BTR3 has a usb-c physical connector, but only supports USB2 over that port, so that might be the issue (mind you, the usb3.0 port I connected it to for my fw upgrade worked fine, but the driver detected a usb2 compatible device, not usb3).
Do you have access to something with good old fashioned usb2 ports you can try it on? (sorry, last time I had a macbook was 2012 so I'm a bit in the dark about OS versions and what actual ports the various versions ship with)


----------



## CybDev

zufmi said:


> Ok I also tried to run windows XP in a virtual box, but even that one does not work. I was able to see the btr3 as an usb device, and install the driver. But when I run the wizard it cannot find the blue core model (/ in use by another software). I know a windows pc would fix this, but no friend, colleague or family member has a windows pc, and on the ones that do I cannot install the driver or connect any unknown usb devices for security reasons.. This update thing has taken too much of my time ;-(. Imo Fiio should clearly state on it's website that it cannot be updated with a Mac.



To be fair they only state they support windows, right? So if we can get it working unofficially with other platforms that's just a bonus for us, but not something we can expect...


----------



## iL15hts (Aug 24, 2019)

Don’t put this in your pockets with a coin.


----------



## CybDev

iL15hts said:


> Don’t put this in your pockets with a coin.



Yeah, mine is pretty scratched/worn from very gentle storage(no coins) in my pocket when it's not in use... :/
Then again, I only need the blinking colour codes to see it turns off properly, or to identify the codec, so it's not that big of a deal in practical terms, but ofc sucks from an aesthetic point of view...


----------



## FiiO

iL15hts said:


> Don’t put this in your pockets with a coin.


Dear friend,

Sorry to hear about that. Maybe you could consider getting the SK-BTR3 for protection: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32966328471.html

Best regards


----------



## Huxley (Aug 27, 2019)

Anyone having issues with hwa not working with Huawei mate 20 pro.
Updated mine to the latest a few weeks back, and only now noticed i can only select LDAC from developer options.

Edit - Just seen the btr5 ok now I'm in love.


----------



## scook94

Huxley said:


> Anyone having issues with hwa not working with Huawei mate 20 pro.
> Updated mine to the latest a few weeks back, and only now noticed i can only select LDAC from developer options.
> 
> Edit - Just seen the btr5 ok now I'm in love.



Yes, same issue with P20 Pro, was working fine until the new f/w then it broke. Switched to a Shanling UP2 and have no issues.


----------



## Huxley (Aug 28, 2019)

scook94 said:


> Yes, same issue with P20 Pro, was working fine until the new f/w then it broke. Switched to a Shanling UP2 and have no issues.



Looking at the Btr5 specs no Hwa neither. I'd be inclined to say either fiio or huawei stopped support which is a shame.
I found the connection more stable using Hwa.

Edit - I'll try updating to the latest firmware.

Ok that brought it back, but now it's running rough on 96khz.


----------



## ha3flt

It might be useful for somebody that_ the BTR3 can easily drive the Tin Hifi P1 earphone_.  I did not even make the volume control to reach its upper end it is so loud, while my Samsung S7 is not able to serve it in every situation.

Also, the P1 is a niiice little gem, _it gave a completely new life to my BTR3_, they are so good together, I was just smirking for almost a whole evening, and the next morning. I will write a review sooner or later, but it is surprising how this relatively cheap setup can approach a flagship headphone with an average audiophile DAC+amp. (Certainly, I use an EQ set to that horizontal S shape.) Yes, in an A/B test the difference is obvious (less bandwidth, less dynamics, worse bass resolution, etc.), but the difference is less than I could ever imagine (except on SBC, of course). Previously I have put down the BTR3 as boring and limited as an amplifier, and it is not worth to get a better headphone connected to it, but now... can't stop listening them when I'm not at home. 

By the way, I stated earlier that the BTR3 has extremely bad physical connectivity (range). Despite of my all experience, it was mostly my fault, however, I could call not the second, only the third Bluetooth dongle what I tried as "normal". As a matter of fact, it is the smallest one - the previous (not the cheapest) two sticks _both_ were just junk, or eventually faulty. So the connection is fairly good now, and it works on longer distances.


----------



## ha3flt

I've read myself back in this topic - I shouldn't have to... After some month _it is very embarassing how much I denied the difference between SBC and the higher spec. codecs on BTR3_ in the terms of sound quality, and saying today that the SBC is "of course" not on the same level.  After this fiasco I will never write nothing of anything anymore I heard at least in a year (or ten)...

I was fairly rational, though: I thought, since I have a flagship but non-high impedance headphone what can be driven relatively easy, I posess a gear good enough to detect even subtle differences well. Also, I used the very same sound files and setup then and now, also I write software, I know electronics and DSP fairly well, I'm always in building equipments, etc. The P1 (what is not even a widely acknowledged, reassuring reference product) taught a lesson to me: somehow it sounds better on the BTR3 comparing to its capabilities what I can take out of the otherwise great Denon headphone on the BTR3. How this small, battery based device took out such dynamics and clarity out of the hat, I don't know, but keep trying to investigate...

The rest is in my previous post.


----------



## truefalse

I for the life of me can't get my BTR3 to show up in the iOS FiiO app. The first thing I did when I got the BTR3 was updated it to 1.2 and it's working great but doesn't show up in the app - tested on 3 different devices with different iOS versions (11-12) but always with the latest FiiO app (1.4.0). Did anyone have this problem? Is my unit faulty?


----------



## Cadop

truefalse said:


> I for the life of me can't get my BTR3 to show up in the iOS FiiO app. The first thing I did when I got the BTR3 was updated it to 1.2 and it's working great but doesn't show up in the app - tested on 3 different devices with different iOS versions (11-12) but always with the latest FiiO app (1.4.0). Did anyone have this problem? Is my unit faulty?


Hi, have you disabled HWA in the app? that's what caused it for me!


----------



## truefalse (Sep 2, 2019)

Cadop said:


> Hi, have you disabled HWA in the app? that's what caused it for me!


Thanks for the suggestion, but there is no HWA in the iOS app. The BTR3 is connected to the phone and even shows up as such on the Now Playing interface in the FiiO app, but getting it in the Bluetooth Control seems impossible =[


----------



## rdsu

About BTR5, do you know if can be used as USB DAC, connected to PC, and then transmit Bluetooth to some Wireless Headphone? Thanks


----------



## paul.tonnenberg

Does anyone happen to use a lg v30 with the fiio btr3? Which bluetooth codec will be displayed as a standard within the developer options? Is this SBC, AAC, aptX, aptX LL, aptX HD, LDAC, HWA, LHDC?


----------



## tiamor988

rdsu said:


> About BTR5, do you know if can be used as USB DAC, connected to PC, and then transmit Bluetooth to some Wireless Headphone? Thanks


I don't think so. BTR5 act as a bluetooth receiver, not bluetooth transmitter. For that you need the Fiio M5. I'm probably wrong. We have to wait for the official release to be sure.


----------



## paul.tonnenberg

Concerning the steps of volume: How many steps are there in total? Is that actually 1db increase per step?


----------



## ha3flt

32 steps. Really good, never felt it coarse.


----------



## FiiO

truefalse said:


> I for the life of me can't get my BTR3 to show up in the iOS FiiO app. The first thing I did when I got the BTR3 was updated it to 1.2 and it's working great but doesn't show up in the app - tested on 3 different devices with different iOS versions (11-12) but always with the latest FiiO app (1.4.0). Did anyone have this problem? Is my unit faulty?


Dear friend,

I took a small video and you may read if it helps:


 Please try to click the reflash button in the top right corner first. In my video, you could see i was too hurry so i failed for serveral time.

When the BTR3 appear,  press the power button of the BTR3 for several time.

Exit that page and wait for 10s or so then you will see the BTR3 in the FiiO Bluetooth control interface.

Best regards


----------



## truefalse

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> I took a small video and you may read if it helps:
> 
> ...



Thank you! I've actually managed to fix it myself. In my case, I needed to reset the BTR3 pairings by holding '+' and '-' at the same time. After doing that and re-pairing with the phone, it worked right away.


----------



## fsi22 (Sep 5, 2019)

Can equalizer be used when using usb mode instead of Bluetooth. Plan on using this with my Switch and have eq'd my iem to my preference.


----------



## truefalse

fsi22 said:


> Can equalizer be used when using usb mode instead of Bluetooth. Plan on using this with my Switch and have eq'd my iem to my preference.


EQ works for me in USB mode on Win10. You don't even have to replug anything, all changes are live.


----------



## fsi22

truefalse said:


> EQ works for me in USB mode on Win10. You don't even have to replug anything, all changes are live.



Thank you, That's perfect.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Sep 10, 2019)

When using in USB DAC mode in Win 10...it shows as Speakers, 16 bit, 48000Hz DVD Quailty

When in  BT mode (Aptx) on the same computer,  it is Headphones, *2 channel*, 16 bit, 44100Hz  CD Quality.

Does this mean that in USB DAC, this is outputting in Mono,,,,not 2 channel Stereo???

The sound quality should be noticeably better in USB DAC connection, but for some reason, the BT connection sounds better or fuller somehow.


----------



## FiiO

speedingcheetah said:


> When using in USB DAC mode in Win 10...it shows as Speakers, 16 bit, 48000Hz DVD Quailty
> 
> When in  BT mode (Aptx) on the same computer,  it is Headphones, *2 channel*, 16 bit, 44100Hz  CD Quality.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

When working as USB DAC, the output of BTR3 is stereo so please don't worry.

Best regards


----------



## speedingcheetah

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> When working as USB DAC, the output of BTR3 is stereo so please don't worry.
> 
> Best regards



Does the USB mode in the Fiio Music app affect how the device works or is detected when used as a USB DAC on a different device like a computer?
I think there are settings like HWA or Direct and one or two others i cant recall.
Those are not defined what they mean or do anywhere.


----------



## Chamelleon

Hi, I just updated my BTR3 to 1.2 and already regret this. Sounds of power On/Off and connection are way worse than old ones and there is no battery low sound or it's so quiet that I couldn't notice that. Could you upload older version and is it safe to downgrade?


----------



## 4Real (Sep 20, 2019)

Chamelleon said:


> Hi, I just updated my BTR3 to 1.2 and already regret this. Sounds of power On/Off and connection are way worse than old ones and there is no battery low sound or it's so quiet that I couldn't notice that. Could you upload older version and is it safe to downgrade?


You can't downgrade if you read the release notes.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fio...re-1-2-for-btr3-new-added-eq-function.892468/


----------



## Alberto01

Chamelleon said:


> Hi, I just updated my BTR3 to 1.2 and already regret this. Sounds of power On/Off and connection are way worse than old ones and there is no battery low sound or it's so quiet that I couldn't notice that. Could you upload older version and is it safe to downgrade?


Both times that I have upgraded the firmware in my BTR3, it didn't work right for a few hours after the update. The volume became extremely low at all volume levels. But, it went back to normal later.

FiiO hasn't programed the firmware update procedure for downgrades. But, you can safely update again with the latest firmware version and see if that helps with the abnormal behaviour.


----------



## FiiO

Chamelleon said:


> Hi, I just updated my BTR3 to 1.2 and already regret this. Sounds of power On/Off and connection are way worse than old ones and there is no battery low sound or it's so quiet that I couldn't notice that. Could you upload older version and is it safe to downgrade?


Dear friend,

Thanks for the feedback. We will report to the engineer about that. It is not recommended to downgrade. But if you would still like to try, the FW1.0 firmware download link is: http://fiio-file.fiio.net/BTR3_1.0.dfu 

Best regards


----------



## Chamelleon

I'd rather not to brick my BTR3 so probably i'll wait for another update. Thank You for answers.


----------



## fsi22

Chamelleon said:


> I'd rather not to brick my BTR3 so probably i'll wait for another update. Thank You for answers.



In the firmware release notes, change in notification sounds is noted. So I think, that's a design choice, rather than  a bug.


----------



## Chamelleon

fsi22 said:


> In the firmware release notes, change in notification sounds is noted. So I think, that's a design choice, rather than  a bug.


Yea, I know, it sounds now like 5$ bluetooth headset from AE so we have to get used to this. I'm not sure about battery low sound indicator, was it so quiet or just missing. I have to recharge my device and check it.


----------



## fsi22

Chamelleon said:


> Yea, I know, it sounds now like 5$ bluetooth headset from AE so we have to get used to this. I'm not sure about battery low sound indicator, was it so quiet or just missing. I have to recharge my device and check it.



It doesn't make a sound now, audio just dips. Previously there was a warning tone.


----------



## Chamelleon

fsi22 said:


> It doesn't make a sound now, audio just dips. Previously there was a warning tone.


That's weird. Previous warning tone wasn't perfect because it could appears at 20% and last for over an hour but still I knew that I should charge battery. I have no idea why they removed it completely instead of placing trigger on 10 or 15% instead of 20.


----------



## 3diddy

Hi, I just received my BTR3 and very happy with the sound.  However I have two questions; 1) How do I tell when the device is charging?  No charging indicator is present when connected via USB C and 2) How do I tell what FW version is running, the device doesn't appear in FiiO Music?


----------



## ha3flt

Just trust in your battery status instinct - since the charging time is short, after some weeks you will know it better than any gauge...


----------



## fsi22

3diddy said:


> Hi, I just received my BTR3 and very happy with the sound.  However I have two questions; 1) How do I tell when the device is charging?  No charging indicator is present when connected via USB C and 2) How do I tell what FW version is running, the device doesn't appear in FiiO Music?




Fiio is solid red when switched off and charging.


----------



## Alberto01

3diddy said:


> Hi, I just received my BTR3 and very happy with the sound.  However I have two questions; 1) How do I tell when the device is charging?  No charging indicator is present when connected via USB C and 2) How do I tell what FW version is running, the device doesn't appear in FiiO Music?


1) The FiiO light is ON all the time when the device is charging. It is intermittent/blinking when the device is not charging.

2) In the FiiO app you will see the firmware version once your BTR3 is shown as connected.


----------



## fsi22

3diddy said:


> Hi, I just received my BTR3 and very happy with the sound.  However I have two questions; 1) How do I tell when the device is charging?  No charging indicator is present when connected via USB C and 2) How do I tell what FW version is running, the device doesn't appear in FiiO Music?




Firmware version is in Fiio Music, click on Bluetooth device control and then device. Will be be below Fiio BTR3 and codec.


----------



## FiiO

3diddy said:


> Hi, I just received my BTR3 and very happy with the sound.  However I have two questions; 1) How do I tell when the device is charging?  No charging indicator is present when connected via USB C and 2) How do I tell what FW version is running, the device doesn't appear in FiiO Music?


Dear friend,

1. If your BTR3 is powered off when charging, the red light will light up constantly and turn off after fully charged.

If the BTR3 is connected to device, the light indicating current Bluetooth codec would will light up constantly and return pulsating status after fully charged.

 If the BTR3 is turned on but does not connect to any device, the blue light  flash once every 3s when charging as well.   

It is not recommended to use smart chargers with fast charging function. But theoretically, it could charge the BTR3 as well. 
2. Which mobile phone are you using? Android or Ios device?

Best regards


----------



## 3diddy

Hi, thanks - I generally use chargers capable of fast charging but found that this was having issues as was charging direct from my MacBook. Plugged into an old iPhone charger and this worked.


----------



## FiiO




----------



## 3diddy

Another question, sorry, and this one has probably already been asked... Why does volume down skip forward and volume up skip backwards - this is the same on my RC-BT but unlike any other bluetooth device I've ever used.  Is this the norm for Chinese products?


----------



## fsi22

3diddy said:


> Another question, sorry, and this one has probably already been asked... Why does volume down skip forward and volume up skip backwards - this is the same on my RC-BT but unlike any other bluetooth device I've ever used.  Is this the norm for Chinese products?




been asked by everyone. Fiio should change that and positioning of headphone jack relative to clip. 2 less than logical design choices.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Sep 28, 2019)

3diddy said:


> Another question, sorry, and this one has probably already been asked... Why does volume down skip forward and volume up skip backwards - this is the same on my RC-BT but unlike any other bluetooth device I've ever used.  Is this the norm for Chinese products?



It is standard on the other BT devices i have, such as 3 sets of different model Sony BT headphones, and 3 other random brand BT headsets with media controls.
It is kinda funky u think, but.....think it through.

When u position the device horizontal, so the control buttons are on the top, the usb and aux jack to the right....the buttons are Vol +/Back (Left) , Play/Pause (Middle), Vol -/ Next (Right) , . (This design also is industry standard layout for media control buttons such as devices like tape recorders, receivers, boom boxes, tape decks, cd players...etc. )

You also read from left to right, you also turn pages in a book in the same fashion, so when looking at it in this fashion, the Vol - (Right) button, makes sense to set as Next page/track, and the left button to be Back\Previous track
And since, in a vertical orientation, it is natural for up to be Increase, down to be decrease, that is why that has to be set that way for that orientation.
So u see they chose the most logical and set standard for button functions.

If you want the buttons to be mapped to other functions, or in reverse, you will need to use a media player app that supports local button remap feature, that will only work in that app of course.
For a system wide button re-map, there may be third party apps that can do this with out root, or jailbrake...whatever ur devices supports.


----------



## 3diddy

Alright mate


----------



## FiiO

Thanks for understanding and sharing.

Best regards


----------



## fsi22

Any news on the BTR5?


----------



## TooPoorForHiFi

fsi22 said:


> Any news on the BTR5?




Mid October Is the release date.


----------



## G_T_J

I just got my BTR3 and am ery happy with it.
Can someone please let me know what's the latest firmware available? Mine came with version 1.2. Many thanks!


----------



## DGNZ

G_T_J said:


> Can someone please let me know what's the latest firmware available? Mine came with version 1.2.


It seems to me this is the latest one (so far).


----------



## G_T_J

DGNZ said:


> It seems to me this is the latest one (so far).


Thanks for the helpful response!


----------



## Alberto01 (Oct 2, 2019)

G_T_J said:


> I just got my BTR3 and am ery happy with it.
> Can someone please let me know what's the latest firmware available? Mine came with version 1.2. Many thanks!


That is the latest firmware version for the FiiO BTR3.


----------



## G_T_J

Alberto01 said:


> That is the latest firmware version for the FiiO BTR3.


Thank you!


----------



## Zam1419

In Bluetooth mode, the volume output is much lower than USB DAC mode. It is still better than Bluetooth volume without the btr3 on the OnePlus 7 Pro.

I just wanted to know if it's normal to have such a difference in sound output between Bluetooth and DAC mode.


----------



## CybDev

Zam1419 said:


> In Bluetooth mode, the volume output is much lower than USB DAC mode. It is still better than Bluetooth volume without the btr3 on the OnePlus 7 Pro.
> 
> I just wanted to know if it's normal to have such a difference in sound output between Bluetooth and DAC mode.



I happen to have a oneplus 7 pro as well, and have no such issues with the volume... The volume controls are independent, so make sure to set the phone-bluetooth-volume to max and then adjust the actual volume on the BTR3 itself.

(sidenote: if you are using a linux system and pulseaudio, pay attention to the volume slider, it does not stop at 100% but allows you to artificially boost the output at the expense of dynamic range/quality)


----------



## Zam1419

CybDev said:


> I happen to have a oneplus 7 pro as well, and have no such issues with the volume... The volume controls are independent, so make sure to set the phone-bluetooth-volume to max and then adjust the actual volume on the BTR3 itself.
> 
> (sidenote: if you are using a linux system and pulseaudio, pay attention to the volume slider, it does not stop at 100% but allows you to artificially boost the output at the expense of dynamic range/quality)


Thanks for the reply. 

I've maxed out the volume on the phone and on the btr3. But like I said, the unit simply doesn't have high volume on Bluetooth. In DAC mode, the volume is crazy high which is how it's supposed to be I'm guessing.

I've also updated the firmware to 1.2 from 1.0. I even reinstalled 1.2 again to make sure the firmware install isn't causing any issue. But the problem still persists.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Zam1419 said:


> Thanks for the reply.
> 
> I've maxed out the volume on the phone and on the btr3. But like I said, the unit simply doesn't have high volume on Bluetooth. In DAC mode, the volume is crazy high which is how it's supposed to be I'm guessing.
> 
> I've also updated the firmware to 1.2 from 1.0. I even reinstalled 1.2 again to make sure the firmware install isn't causing any issue. But the problem still persists.



Volume will vary depending on the audio source file AND mainly, the headphones you are powering.
Some headphones are higher impedance and require much more power to push them at higher volumes.
In bluetooth mode, possible that there is a power restraint. the DAC would have direct wire line power in USB mode and thus can push more power.
The BTR3, i have noticed, is not as powerful as my Ek17 usb dac to drive my Vmoda Crosfade wireless (1st gen -in wired mode)
But yes, i have noticed that volume is different between modes, even on my win10 computer between modes, but nothing that has been an issue.
Pretty much, my BTR3 is set to max volume all the time, as it is kinda weak.


----------



## Alberto01

Zam1419 said:


> Thanks for the reply.
> 
> I've maxed out the volume on the phone and on the btr3. But like I said, the unit simply doesn't have high volume on Bluetooth. In DAC mode, the volume is crazy high which is how it's supposed to be I'm guessing.
> 
> I've also updated the firmware to 1.2 from 1.0. I even reinstalled 1.2 again to make sure the firmware install isn't causing any issue. But the problem still persists.


After every firmware update, my BTR3 shows the very low volume issue. After using it and turning it off and on a few times, the issue goes away and my BTR3 goes back to normal.


----------



## Zam1419 (Oct 4, 2019)

The equaliser in the fiio music app, under Bluetooth devices menu also doesn't work when connected via Bluetooth. I noticed that this is the case with the LDAC or LHDC codec.

Aptx and Aptx HD as well as all other codecs allow for the use of the equaliser. 

I should also clarify that the volume difference I noticed was due to the amped up EQ which did not apply on LDAC. Hence, I stated that there's a massive difference in volume. 

Running it on Aptx HD, everything is running well. But shouldn't I be able to use the firmware EQ on LDAC too?


----------



## speedingcheetah

Zam1419 said:


> The equaliser in the fiio music app, under Bluetooth devices menu also doesn't work when connected via Bluetooth. I noticed that this is the case with the LDAC or LHDC codec.


So? EQ has nothing to due with volume output.
I have been able to set my preferred EQ settings via the app when it was first paired to my Pixel 3 via BT, the EQ settings are stored on the BTR3 and work on the device itself, independent of other apps.
I really only use my BTR3 on my Win 10 laptop, in both modes, wired when i an at desk and want best quality sound, or BT when i need to move around.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> After every firmware update, my BTR3 shows the very low volume issue. After using it and turning it off and on a few times, the issue goes away and my BTR3 goes back to normal.


there has only ever been 2 firmware updates for the BTR3 since it came out.
i haven't had any change in volume after an update.
I does at time, revert to a lower volume level if i put it into pairing mode to par to something else.


----------



## Alberto01

speedingcheetah said:


> there has only ever been 2 firmware updates for the BTR3 since it came out.
> i haven't had any change in volume after an update.
> I does at time, revert to a lower volume level if i put it into pairing mode to par to something else.


With those 2 firmware updates, I have run the update procedure about 4 times. The very low volume issue has happened after every one of those update procedures.


----------



## Zam1419

speedingcheetah said:


> So? EQ has nothing to due with volume output.
> I have been able to set my preferred EQ settings via the app when it was first paired to my Pixel 3 via BT, the EQ settings are stored on the BTR3 and work on the device itself, independent of other apps.
> I really only use my BTR3 on my Win 10 laptop, in both modes, wired when i an at desk and want best quality sound, or BT when i need to move around.



Well, when I was testing out the EQ, I amped up all the bands to +12db. I did that simply because the EQ wasn't working and I wanted to test it. Then I switched over to DAC mode and suddenly there was increased sound output. 

It was obviously because of the EQ but I realised this after making my first post here. Remember that I'm using LDAC and for whatever reason the EQ isn't working on that. So switching back and forth between DAC mode and Bluetooth meant that in DAC mode the EQ was on but in Bluetooth mode it was off. 

All that said, the only 'issue' now is that LDAC codec isn't supporting the EQ functionality of the firmware. Moving the sliders around does nothing. Come down to apxt HD or switching to DAC mode makes the EQ work again.

Appreciate everyone's replies BTW


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> With those 2 firmware updates, I have run the update procedure about 4 times. The very low volume issue has happened after every one of those update procedures.





Zam1419 said:


> Well, when I was testing out the EQ, I amped up all the bands to +12db. I did that simply because the EQ wasn't working and I wanted to test it. Then I switched over to DAC mode and suddenly there was increased sound output.
> 
> It was obviously because of the EQ but I realised this after making my first post here. Remember that I'm using LDAC and for whatever reason the EQ isn't working on that. So switching back and forth between DAC mode and Bluetooth meant that in DAC mode the EQ was on but in Bluetooth mode it was off.
> 
> ...



Mine came with 1.0 and sat pretty much unused for a year until from 1.2 with the EQ feature that the BTR3 was advertised to have when i bought it.
SO I have only ever updated mine once.
And i did use it for a while over BT, LDAC with my Pixel 3.
Throughly tested the EQ so as it came out. It sticks for me with any device or codec, and in USB dac mode.
There are others ways back, when firm was new, that confirmed this as well.
I have also used LDAC when i boot into Linux on same laptop.

Dont know really what to tell u


----------



## Zam1419

speedingcheetah said:


> Mine came with 1.0 and sat pretty much unused for a year until from 1.2 with the EQ feature that the BTR3 was advertised to have when i bought it.
> SO I have only ever updated mine once.
> And i did use it for a while over BT, LDAC with my Pixel 3.
> Throughly tested the EQ so as it came out. It sticks for me with any device or codec, and in USB dac mode.
> ...


Thanks. Just wanted someone to confirm that it actually does work on LDAC. So I suppose I have a defective unit. I did try on multiple devices but the EQ simply never worked on LDAC.

Time to contact amazon..


----------



## speedingcheetah

Maybe it your playback device?
Have u tried using LDAC on some thing else?


----------



## digititus

Zam1419 said:


> The equaliser in the fiio music app, under Bluetooth devices menu also doesn't work when connected via Bluetooth. I noticed that this is the case with the LDAC or LHDC codec.
> 
> Aptx and Aptx HD as well as all other codecs allow for the use of the equaliser.
> 
> ...


No. Fiio says it doesn't work on LDAC. This is normal.


----------



## Zam1419 (Oct 4, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> Maybe it your playback device?
> Have u tried using LDAC on some thing else?



Tried it on OnePlus 6t, OnePlus 7 Pro and Pixel XL. All support LDAC. The light was white. The EQ didn't work. Switched to aptX HD, EQ started working. Tested this on all devices.



digititus said:


> No. Fiio says it doesn't work on LDAC. This is normal.


Source please?

Edit: I got it. https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/244621.html


----------



## digititus

Zam1419 said:


> Tried it on OnePlus 6t, OnePlus 7 Pro and Pixel XL. All support LDAC. The light was white. The EQ didn't work. Switched to aptX HD, EQ started working. Tested this on all devices.
> 
> 
> Source please?


Source
_*c.* The Equalizer only works when streaming in the SBC, AAC, aptX, aptX-HD and HWA(48kHz or lower) codec. It does not work for the LDAC codec. And for HWA 96kHz, it's suggested to turn off EQ, otherwise there might be noise_


----------



## Zam1419

digititus said:


> Source
> _*c.* The Equalizer only works when streaming in the SBC, AAC, aptX, aptX-HD and HWA(48kHz or lower) codec. It does not work for the LDAC codec. And for HWA 96kHz, it's suggested to turn off EQ, otherwise there might be noise_


Yeah that settles it. It's a bummer but thanks for letting me know.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Personally, I would not waste your time on the Fiio EQ, Poweramp v3 EQ is FAR better.
That sounds freaking amazing when using High Res output mode and LDAC. 
I jsut use the Fio hardware DAC for a small low end bass and trebble boost, which, i do notice outside of poweramp, like  in MPV when i play videos, or on my PC vua usb....so, EQ is working for me.


----------



## FSTOP

Totally agree. Ive no problems whatsoever with any of my decices with the BTR3. Still haven't upgraded any firmware, and wouldn't bother with the fiio app. LDAC sounds great along with PowerAmp's EQ and custom tone controls. (I have specific EQ profiles for different IEMs/cans, car, home studio/BT settings.


----------



## Alberto01 (Oct 4, 2019)

speedingcheetah said:


> Personally, I would not waste your time on the Fiio EQ, Poweramp v3 EQ is FAR better.
> That sounds freaking amazing when using High Res output mode and LDAC.
> I jsut use the Fio hardware DAC for a small low end bass and trebble boost, which, i do notice outside of poweramp, like  in MPV when i play videos, or on my PC vua usb....so, EQ is working for me.





FSTOP said:


> Totally agree. Ive no problems whatsoever with any of my decices with the BTR3. Still haven't upgraded any firmware, and wouldn't bother with the fiio app. LDAC sounds great along with PowerAmp's EQ and custom tone controls. (I have specific EQ profiles for different IEMs/cans, car, home studio/BT settings.



I second (or third) what you are saying. Some equalizers ruin the tone of the tune as you raise the equalizer frequencies. The one in the FiiO app is one of them. You can't raise any frequency by much with that EQ, without getting dirt in the tone as you raise them. I rely on foobar2000's 18 band equalizer for those duties.


----------



## speedingcheetah

I have tested several times today....i have set the volume to max on the BTR3 for each source input mode. While connected to a powered speaker via AUX cable, its own volume set to 50%.
I can hot switch from wired usb to BT, and back again....no change in volume. Even powering off the BTR3 before switching modes, still no change in volume.
If you are experiencing a change in volume, i submit is most likely the connecting device that is overriding volume that was set. 
Bluetooth support DVC Direct Volume Control. I have had phones in the past, LG and Samsung, that will auto change the volume lower if it thinks it is too loud, and display a message saying so. 
If in usb mode, may be your software that is affecting the output volume, such as OS settings, software/app settings, such as VLC innter volume.


----------



## G_T_J

@FiiO are you aware that hifigo sells the BTR5 already for 140$ (shipping not included)?
I think that's not fair play for a device with estimated SRP at 99.99$


----------



## TooPoorForHiFi

$140!!? I'll pass.


----------



## G_T_J

TooPoorForHiFi said:


> $140!!? I'll pass.


I don't think it's intended to cost so much.
It's just some people with the help of any given circumstances are looking to gain profit by taking advantage of some buyers' impatience.
FiiO should take control and eliminate such injustice IMO.


----------



## vaguely

Size looks perfect for me..helpful enough for low ohm iem's enough to use in lieu of lg v20?


----------



## Hinomotocho

I haven't used my BTR3 much lately as my circumstances changed and it crossed my mind to sell it. Recently I've gone to use my xDSD with my Nvidia Shield and it gives me all kinds of grief with disconnecting and failing to reconnect etc but the trusty little BTR3 connects and reconnects everytime.


----------



## fsi22

vaguely said:


> Size looks perfect for me..helpful enough for low ohm iem's enough to use in lieu of lg v20?



I've replaced my V30, with a btr3, does the job and is good for driving low impedance iems and headphones. Volume is more than enough, No issues with audio quality, battery life is good. Very convenient device


----------



## FiiO

G_T_J said:


> @FiiO are you aware that hifigo sells the BTR5 already for 140$ (shipping not included)?
> I think that's not fair play for a device with estimated SRP at 99.99$



Dear friend,

The BTR5 is not available currently. Where did you find a 140USD one? Could you please share the link to us?

Best regards


----------



## G_T_J

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> The BTR5 is not available currently. Where did you find a 140USD one? Could you please share the link to us?
> 
> Best regards


Please look at the bottom of the page
https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/fiio-launched-new-flagship-wireless-portable-dac-amp-btr5-hifigo


----------



## Ab10

I wish Fiio must do one minor change in the "LED" Behaviour which is;

User Can Turn OFF the LED light but can't turn off the Charging Light, meaning when the device is plugged into the charger the "RED LED" will glow no matter the user opt-out 'LED OFF' option at the Control Panel.

I'm the one who prefers to turn off LED breathing light all the time but absolutely likes to know when BTR3 fully toped up.


----------



## FiiO

Ab10 said:


> I wish Fiio must do one minor change in the "LED" Behaviour which is;
> 
> User Can Turn OFF the LED light but can't turn off the Charging Light, meaning when the device is plugged into the charger the "RED LED" will glow no matter the user opt-out 'LED OFF' option at the Control Panel.
> 
> I'm the one who prefers to turn off LED breathing light all the time but absolutely likes to know when BTR3 fully toped up.


Dear friend,

We could report to the engineer for assess about that. But if you turn off the 'RED' indicator in charging status, there will be no indicator even when the BTR3 is fully charged. 

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

G_T_J said:


> Please look at the bottom of the page
> https://hifigo.com/blogs/news/fiio-launched-new-flagship-wireless-portable-dac-amp-btr5-hifigo


Dear friend,

Please do not purchase the BTR5 from them in order to receive better after-sale service because they are not our seller in oversea market。

Best regards


----------



## Mlaihk

Fiio, this is mid Oct.  When will the BTR5 be available?


----------



## Ab10

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> We could report to the engineer for assess about that. But if you turn off the 'RED' indicator in charging status, there will be no indicator even when the BTR3 is fully charged.
> 
> Best regards



Thank you for the reply,

Yes,

Please, implement the rule that user can turn off the breathing light, but that will not effect the charging light, as long the unit is "turned off" and connected to the charger / receive power from the USB the 'Red' Led will glow and once it reaches to 100% it turned off, so that user know charging is done.


----------



## hmscott (Oct 14, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Please do not purchase the BTR5 from them in order to receive better after-sale service because they are not our seller in oversea market。
> 
> Best regards


@FiiO, I'm a bit new to this and I can't find any outlet to purchase the BTR5 other than hifigo.com and Chinese direct outlets.  hifigo.com support was very nice and helpful, but I do want full US support / warranty for my FiiO purchases

Do I need to wait for an Amazon listing with fulfillment through FiiO?  Or are there other "approved" US outlets where I can get full support / warranty coverage for the US?

I came this ->||<- close to buying a BTR5 today  - I've been waiting a while already but I can wait a bit longer for full US support / warranty.

Thanks for your great help in these forums, I've enjoyed reading your helpful responses.


----------



## Hal Rockwell

hmscott said:


> @FiiO, I'm a bit new to this and I can't find any outlet to purchase the BTR5 other than hifigo.com and Chinese direct outlets.  hifigo.com support was very nice and helpful, but I do want full US support / warranty for my FiiO purchases
> 
> Do I need to wait for an Amazon listing with fulfillment through FiiO?  Or are there other "approved" US outlets where I can get full support / warranty coverage for the US?
> 
> ...



The BTR5 is not yet available overseas. I guess you'll have to wait a bit longer.


----------



## FiiO

hmscott said:


> @FiiO, I'm a bit new to this and I can't find any outlet to purchase the BTR5 other than hifigo.com and Chinese direct outlets.  hifigo.com support was very nice and helpful, but I do want full US support / warranty for my FiiO purchases
> 
> Do I need to wait for an Amazon listing with fulfillment through FiiO?  Or are there other "approved" US outlets where I can get full support / warranty coverage for the US?
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

The BTR5 will be available in USA at about next month.

Best regards


----------



## Peertje

For the people who do this:
How do you mount a BTR3 to a fullsize headphone to make it wireless?


----------



## speedingcheetah

I am trying to connect the BTR3 to the Fiio app after adjusting some settings, suddenly, it , the app, no longer is detecting the BTR3, app giving some short error, but i cant read it.

https://imgur.com/EKZDr8V


----------



## fsi22

speedingcheetah said:


> I am trying to connect the BTR3 to the Fiio app after adjusting some settings, suddenly, it , the app, no longer is detecting the BTR3, app giving some short error, but i cant read it.
> 
> https://imgur.com/EKZDr8V



If on Android, try clearing cache and  storage. That fixed it for me.


----------



## speedingcheetah

fsi22 said:


> If on Android, try clearing cache and  storage. That fixed it for me.



i had removed and reinstalled the app which does the same thing. same issue.
What does the little white box and text state? I cant read chinese.
Also, this happened directly after i toggled HWA on...no idea what that is, there is no instructions on what that is or what settings affect what.
The thing still is paired to the phone, and other devices fine, have tried repairing, its only the Fiio app that wont allow me to manage the BTR3 now.


----------



## fsi22

speedingcheetah said:


> i had removed and reinstalled the app which does the same thing. same issue.
> What does the little white box and text state? I cant read chinese.
> Also, this happened directly after i toggled HWA on...no idea what that is, there is no instructions on what that is or what settings affect what.
> The thing still is paired to the phone, and other devices fine, have tried repairing, its only the Fiio app that wont allow me to manage the BTR3 now.



Yeah same thing happened to me after I toggled HWA, mine was fine after I cleared cache. No idea what it means,sorry. try resetting the BTR3. hold down power button for 10 seconds.


----------



## speedingcheetah

fsi22 said:


> Yeah same thing happened to me after I toggled HWA, mine was fine after I cleared cache. No idea what it means,sorry. try resetting the BTR3. hold down power button for 10 seconds.



HWA....what even is it? it does not do anything, far as I can tell. toggled it on and off before....no change in anything. Maybe it only a thing that work in Fiio app only? I dont use thier app to play music, I use Poweramp, and mainly, the dac is used via USB or BT from my win 10/linux laptop.


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> HWA....what even is it? it does not do anything, far as I can tell. toggled it on and off before....no change in anything. Maybe it only a thing that work in Fiio app only? I dont use thier app to play music, I use Poweramp, and mainly, the dac is used via USB or BT from my win 10/linux laptop.


HWA is a bluetooth HiRes codec like LDAC. Only really works with Huawei phones (who developed it) and is not very stable on other android devices. You can safely keep it turned off.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Oct 16, 2019)

digititus said:


> HWA is a bluetooth HiRes codec like LDAC. Only really works with Huawei phones (who developed it) and is not very stable on other android devices. You can safely keep it turned off.



then make no difference then....since the DAC will fall back to the connecting device codec it requests...but did something, as BTR3 will not connect back to thier own app, connects to phone phone via LDAC, if disable LDAC via the BT menu in phone, then it uses SBC instead of AptX, for some reason.

and, no, do not have any Huawei phones, they are kinda useless in USA now, with the "ban" thing going on, and they no longer can have Google Services on them....


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> and they no longer can have Google Services on them....


That can also be a blessing! Some people have no need for Google services.


----------



## hmscott (Oct 16, 2019)

digititus said:


> That can also be a blessing! Some people have no need for Google services.


Unfortunately you are out of luck if the device OS is Android and you want to use the Google Play Store to download apps otherwise unavailable on Android.

An Android phone without Google Services ends up being a useless paperweight at best - worst case you spend untold hours trying to get Google Play side-loaded to no-avail - Google is actively defeating work-arounds - so no joy can be had.

I've stopped looking at new Huawei hardware until this blockade ends.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Oct 16, 2019)

digititus said:


> That can also be a blessing! Some people have no need for Google services.


Sure...those that can just use a flip phone...
U can't do anything with a smartphone without the Smart part, which is Google services.
Google = Android
Apple = iOS

Average user/customer....dont care...they just use it to get thier Uber, grubhub, facebook text etc...
Less than 1% of all smartphone users globally care about such things as, I dont want to use Google or Apple on my phone/computers....

Edit: ok, fine, there was a higher % of non google users, but they are now DEAD platforms, Palm, Win Phone, Blackberry, FireFoxPhone......etc


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> Sure...those that can just use a flip phone...
> U can't do anything with a smartphone without the Smart part, which is Google services.
> Google = Android
> Apple = iOS
> ...


I have an Android phone (LineageOS) without Google Services. I have no need for them. I don't use the Playstore or any of Google offerings on this device. Plenty of ways to install software without them.


----------



## speedingcheetah

digititus said:


> I have an Android phone (LineageOS) without Google Services. I have no need for them. I don't use the Playstore or any of Google offerings on this device. Plenty of ways to install software without them.



U miss the point..... U are part of the less than 1%...good for u....
The 99% of average users,  have no idea what custom rom is...and never heard of "LineageOS"

However, the 99% majority of devices and apps do require Google services and backend things that are in the stock Android rom. 
If ## app or device wont work with your stripped down AOSP or whatver custom rom u have, u get zero support from the manufacture and they tend to ignore you even if u have a legit bug report or issue that affect normal users.

None of this has anything to due with HWA and my original issue....but still....i find it annoying when folks just pop in and be so big headed and preachy about such things that is not relevant to troubleshooting a users issues with said device..


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> None of this has anything to due with HWA and my original issue....but still....i find it annoying when folks just pop in and be so big headed and preachy about such things that is not relevant to troubleshooting a users issues with said device..


I thought I was helping you to understand the HWA function in the BTR3? I guess that was lost on you.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Sure...please explain how HWA and having Google Services/apps or not affects the sound performance aspect and issue of the app not seeing the device anymore?


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> Sure...please explain how HWA and having Google Services/apps or not affects the sound performance aspect and issue of the app not seeing the device anymore?


HWA only works well with Huawei phones (sorry, I have no idea what phone you have). If you don't have a Huawei phone, then simply turn off the HWA function. If you haven't figured out how to enable or disable the other codecs on the BTR3 then may I kindly suggest that you RTFM. The Google Services is your tangent about USA/China handbag throwing and tariffs, so you're not interested in Huawei. Good for you, but for others reading this in "the rest of the world" it may be useful information.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Pixel 3. but I am also using it on ohter devices, as I stated. 
(I don't care or have any interest in Huawei products....i only mentioned the "ban" thing as reference to that brand(and others) is known for where I am.)
There is no manual with smartphones...lolz. 
And i can easy toggle the codecs my Pixel phone uses via the system dev options.
WIn 10, however, u cant toggle codecs, it does aptx only.
In Linux, i can toggle codecs easy too.
But i mainly use it as USB dac...so BT codec is not that important to me.
I just wanted to know how HWA affects USB mode and the issue of app nothing seeing device suddenly. cant toggle it off if device not detected i assume.

Speaking of USB DAC, i have yet to find any info on the USB modes in the Fiio app, Direct, DoP...something. I have asked here and other places, several times, over the last year, no responces....no idea what they don, just liek HWA, dont seem to do anything.....perhaps that needs a Huawei phone.


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> Pixel 3. but I am also using it on ohter devices, as I stated.
> (I don't care or have any interest in Huawei products....i only mentioned the "ban" thing as reference to that brand(and others) is known for where I am.)
> There is no manual with smartphones...lolz.
> And i can easy toggle the codecs my Pixel phone uses via the system dev options.
> ...


The Fiio Music app is where you toggle the codecs on/off. Settings > Bluetooth Device Control. Select your BTR3. "Select Bluetooth Codec."


----------



## speedingcheetah

digititus said:


> The Fiio Music app is where you toggle the codecs on/off. Settings > Bluetooth Device Control. Select your BTR3. "Select Bluetooth Codec."



nope.. no need...don't have it installed as it runs in the background and gets in they way. terrible music player too. only use it when i want to adjust the EQ ...which is very rare..native OS codec switch is built into the os now on android 9 and 10. Poweramp music player is lightyears ahead.

also, again....my main use is on PC there is no Fiio app for pc, that I now of.

Can us switch USB modes via PC somehow? do those modes in the Fiio android app even affect the USB DAC? or is it for something else?


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> nope.. no need...don't have it installed as it runs in the background and gets in they way. only use it when i want to adjust the EQ ...which is very rare..native OS codec switch is built into the os now on android 9 and 10.


The Fiio Music app controls the codecs which the BTR3 offers to your phone, not the Android developer options. That is my experience anyway. If you want to change the codecs (even just temporarily), I would suggest that you install the Fiio music app and try it. Then uninstall if you don't need it as a player. This works for me.


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> Can us switch USB modes via PC somehow? do those modes in the Fiio android app even affect the USB DAC? or is it for something else?


BTR3 is limited to 16/48 via USB. There is no changing this


----------



## speedingcheetah

digititus said:


> The Fiio Music app is where you toggle the codecs on/off. Settings > Bluetooth Device Control. Select your BTR3. "Select Bluetooth Codec."


Issue with that I noticed is that it disables thsoe codecs on the BTR3 itself, not the local device the thing is connecting to. I disable Aptx in the app, and use LDAC, the then the BTR3 connects only with SBC on my PC. etc



digititus said:


> BTR3 is limited to 16/48 via USB. There is no changing this



THis i know...but what is the USB modes in the app for then?


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> THis i know...but what is the USB modes in the app for then?


My guess is for connections to other DSD capable DAC's within Fiio Music, but not the BTR3.


----------



## digititus

speedingcheetah said:


> Issue with that I noticed is that it disables thsoe codecs on the BTR3 itself, not the local device the thing is connecting to. I disable Aptx in the app, and use LDAC, the then the BTR3 connects only with SBC on my PC. etc


Your PC is capable of connecting with LDAC? I needed to add this function to pulseaudio in linux.


----------



## speedingcheetah

digititus said:


> Your PC is capable of connecting with LDAC? I needed to add this function to pulseaudio in linux.


yes... easy to install as well. 
really wish there is a way to get LDAC to work in windows...as Win just does media playback in general better on my hardware....


----------



## fsi22

Mlaihk said:


> Fiio, this is mid Oct.  When will the BTR5 be available?



First batch has just been shipped, second batch which also includes worldwide, will ship mid November, hopefully.


----------



## FiiO

fsi22 said:


> First batch has just been shipped, second batch which also includes worldwide, will ship mid November, hopefully.


Dear friend,

First batch? The BTR5 is not available in oversea market currently.

Best regards


----------



## fsi22 (Oct 21, 2019)

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> First batch? The BTR5 is not available in oversea market currently.
> 
> Best regards




First batch, Pre sale on Tmall ( Shipped around the 17 October ). 
Second batch, Expected around Mid November ( includes worldwide )

That's what I understand. is that correct?


----------



## CybDev

Well, my BTR3 just started intermittently powering off all the time the last 2 days, even when laying undisturbed on a table while playing music... Trying to turn it back on works barely on long enough to do the power-on beep a few times, before it suddenly starts working again. But now it's completely dead, won't even take charge when plugged into the usb connector 
So I guess mine had about ~10 months lifetime averaging 5 hours a day.


----------



## FiiO

CybDev said:


> Well, my BTR3 just started intermittently powering off all the time the last 2 days, even when laying undisturbed on a table while playing music... Trying to turn it back on works barely on long enough to do the power-on beep a few times, before it suddenly starts working again. But now it's completely dead, won't even take charge when plugged into the usb connector
> So I guess mine had about ~10 months lifetime averaging 5 hours a day.


Dear friend,

Sorry to hear about that. Please try to reset the BTR3 by holding the power button for at least 10s or holding the volume +&- for 5s to see if it helps first?
If not,  please contact your seller about that first.

If the seller fails to help, please contact us again with the receipt attached. 

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

fsi22 said:


> First batch, Pre sale on Tmall ( Shipped around the 17 October ).
> Second batch, Expected around Mid November ( includes worldwide )
> 
> That's what I understand. is that correct?


Dear friend，

You are right. But the first batch for oversea is not available still. So we still have to wait some time more.

Best regards


----------



## noobandroid

I am one click away from buying the BTR3, so is there anything major that i need to know that will make me lift that finger instead of pressing "buy now"?


----------



## C_Lindbergh

noobandroid said:


> I am one click away from buying the BTR3, so is there anything major that i need to know that will make me lift that finger instead of pressing "buy now"?



EQ still doesn't work with LDAC (unless I've totally missed a firmware update)

Also the creators of the ES100 will release a new version soon under a new name

https://www.qudelix.com/

Also Fiio will release a BTR5 worldwide even sooner.


----------



## noobandroid (Oct 30, 2019)

C_Lindbergh said:


> EQ still doesn't work with LDAC (unless I've totally missed a firmware update)
> 
> Also the creators of the ES100 will release a new version soon under a new name
> 
> ...


1. i am a non believer of EQ, i believe IEM "as is"
2. in my area here, even ES100 dont exist, let alone the next gen
3. BTR5 has a long way to go since nobody has it yet, and can prove it's special sauce is indeed as stated, who knows, maybe BTR5 had major issue setbacks..


----------



## episiarch

noobandroid said:


> 1. i am a non believer of EQ, i believe IEM "as is"
> 2. in my area here, even ES100 dont exist, let alone the next gen
> 3. BTR5 has a long way to go since nobody has it yet, and can prove it's special sauce is indeed as stated, who knows, maybe BTR5 had major issue setbacks..


I heard a prerelease BTR5 this summer at CanJam London. Granted, things change between prerelease and release. But for me the improvement over BTR3 was compelling.


----------



## archy121

episiarch said:


> I heard a prerelease BTR5 this summer at CanJam London. Granted, things change between prerelease and release. But for me the improvement over BTR3 was compelling.



I have been so happy with the BTR3 that I know BTR5 is going to be a sure buy. Specs sound great. 

I’m already going to order an upgrade balanced 2.5mm cable for my earphones just so that I will be able to plug it into the BTR5. 

Surprised still no reviews.


----------



## noobandroid

just got my 3s, and initial 2 tracks played and I'm quite happy with it, metal song vocals gets screamed into my skull and its fun


----------



## MrBackup

Hi, I am using Fiio BTR3 with USB Audio Player Pro (UAPP) and I see that it uses the Android driver. 

I want to know if it is possible to use the HiRes driver with the Fiio BTR3, and if so, how can I select it.

Thank you.


----------



## noobandroid

MrBackup said:


> Hi, I am using Fiio BTR3 with USB Audio Player Pro (UAPP) and I see that it uses the Android driver.
> 
> I want to know if it is possible to use the HiRes driver with the Fiio BTR3, and if so, how can I select it.
> 
> Thank you.


maybe hires driver is for usb out only, i dont know


----------



## Chamelleon

Hi,
my battery seems to be worse and worse everyday so I asked FiiO for replacement and they told to me that they can't send me new battery but if I send them my device they can replace the battery. I'm afraid that costs of sending this from UK to China and back will be more expensive than new device.
I'm an electronics technician so I disassembled my device to check what's inside. Inside I found AEC471738, 300mAh battery. This number is a size of a cell so it's 38x17x4.7mm. The problem is there's no battery sized like this with that capacity. It seems that AEC which is manufacturer of FiiO batteries is only one company which can make 300mAh battery that size. The smallest battery I found with 300mAh capacity is 40x17x5mm and all smaller batteries are 250 or max 280mAh. So my question is the AES batteries are so good that they packed 300mAh in 250mAh sized battery or it's 250mAh battery with bad value printed on cell?


----------



## Alberto01

Chamelleon said:


> Hi,
> my battery seems to be worse and worse everyday so I asked FiiO for replacement and they told to me that they can't send me new battery but if I send them my device they can replace the battery. I'm afraid that costs of sending this from UK to China and back will be more expensive than new device.
> I'm an electronics technician so I disassembled my device to check what's inside. Inside I found AEC471738, 300mAh battery. This number is a size of a cell so it's 38x17x4.7mm. The problem is there's no battery sized like this with that capacity. It seems that AEC which is manufacturer of FiiO batteries is only one company which can make 300mAh battery that size. The smallest battery I found with 300mAh capacity is 40x17x5mm and all smaller batteries are 250 or max 280mAh. So my question is the AES batteries are so good that they packed 300mAh in 250mAh sized battery or it's 250mAh battery with bad value printed on cell?


If you do a browser search with the word "AEC471738" you will find a PDF file with a list of AEC branded batteries. The AEC471738 is included in the list, with a minimum listed capacity of 300 mAh.


----------



## Chamelleon

I found it too but isn't that weird that only AEC can make batteries like this?


----------



## Alberto01 (Nov 14, 2019)

Chamelleon said:


> I found it too but isn't that weird that only AEC can make batteries like this?


You can find similar batteries online by other manufacturers. It is possible that you can fit a 402030 (4.0 mm x 20 mm x 30 mm) battery in the BTR3, by getting rid of some of the outer plastic cover material. The 402030 comes in 200 mAh and 300 mAh capacities.

If you search hard (ha ha), you will succeed at getting a suitable replacement battery.


----------



## Chamelleon

There is enough space to fit 40x17x5 and already found and ordered matching battery. Anyway it's still weird for me that there is no way to buy same battery as original and now I'm gonna have to cut out plastic clip from the inside to fit bigger battery at same capacity.


----------



## archy121 (Nov 14, 2019)

Chamelleon said:


> There is enough space to fit 40x17x5 and already found and ordered matching battery. Anyway it's still weird for me that there is no way to buy same battery as original and now I'm gonna have to cut out plastic clip from the inside to fit bigger battery at same capacity.



Can you please upload some pics and instructions on how to open up the BTR3 and carry out the battery replacement.

It would be very useful to the rest of the community. Cheers


----------



## Chamelleon

It's easy like replacing battery in Chinese toys. You just need to pry plastic cover with some flat but not too sharp tool and swipe it around. There is plastic clip on the top so don't pry from that side. It's glued so you gonna have to use some force to take it off but don't try too hard to avoid puncture the battery. After you take off plastic cover peel off battery gently and desolder wires. Next solder new battery and use some tape to stick it to motherboard. Place plastic cover and use some glue (B7000 preferable, avoid Super Glue) to stick it. My clip felt off many months ago, so my plastic cover looks different but it's just a piece of plastic.


----------



## archy121

Chamelleon said:


> It's easy like replacing battery in Chinese toys.. .



Fantastic work. Thanks


----------



## Manwue

Hi to all,

I have just bought the Samsung S4 (model T830) tablet with Bluetooth 5.0 but I cannot connect it with my btr3. Does this happen because of the lower version of btr's 3 bluetooth???


----------



## FiiO

Manwue said:


> Hi to all,
> 
> I have just bought the Samsung S4 (model T830) tablet with Bluetooth 5.0 but I cannot connect it with my btr3. Does this happen because of the lower version of btr's 3 bluetooth???


Dear friend, 

Please check whether your BTR3 is in pairing mode first? After turning on the BTR3, you could hold the multifunctional for about 5s to force enter pairing mode. The blue and red light will flash alternately at that time. Can't your S4 search the BTR3 still?

Best regards


----------



## Manwue

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Please check whether your BTR3 is in pairing mode first? After turning on the BTR3, you could hold the multifunctional for about 5s to force enter pairing mode. The blue and red light will flash alternately at that time. Can't your S4 search the BTR3 still?
> 
> Best regards



It works!!!! Many thanks!!!!


----------



## FiiO




----------



## speedingcheetah

The BTR3 is a bit of a bugger with my 2019 Nvidia Shield Pro.
Doesn't seem to like it.
It pairs fine, uses LDAC.
But it cuts out for second, ever couple minutes, as if there is interference.
Range is also very poor, cuts out entirely if i leave the room.

I have 2 different sets of Sony BT in ear headphones, that work with no issues with the Shield.
Very rarely do they have any drops or glitches.
They also stay connected around my entire apartment unit.

I have tried to force the used of AptX or AAC etc, via the Android Dev settings, however, that does not seem do anything, even after re-connect, the system will always default to LDAC.

The BTR3 has no such cut out or range issues when it is paired to my Win 10 Laptop(AptX) or my Pixel 3 (LDAC).


----------



## noobandroid

speedingcheetah said:


> The BTR3 is a bit of a bugger with my 2019 Nvidia Shield Pro.
> Doesn't seem to like it.
> It pairs fine, uses LDAC.
> But it cuts out for second, ever couple minutes, as if there is interference.
> ...


use the fiio player app, connect the btr3 and choose the bt codec to be turned off, in your case the ldac and maybe hwa


----------



## speedingcheetah

noobandroid said:


> use the fiio player app, connect the btr3 and choose the bt codec to be turned off, in your case the ldac and maybe hwa


No. because I want LDAC,,, that is the bloody point of this DAC is that is does LDAC for the better quality.
Also, it has already been told here that HWA is a codec for only Huawei brand devices and is never in use anywhere else.
Second, the Fioo app stopped seeing the BTR3 last time i tired to adjust the EQ.


----------



## noobandroid

speedingcheetah said:


> No. because I want LDAC,,, that is the bloody point of this DAC is that is does LDAC for the better quality.
> Also, it has already been told here that HWA is a codec for only Huawei brand devices and is never in use anywhere else.
> Second, the Fioo app stopped seeing the BTR3 last time i tired to adjust the EQ.


if your shield cant do with the dropouts, compromise, give and take, try not to be overly obsessed with LDAC, they are good but not THAT good


----------



## speedingcheetah

noobandroid said:


> use the fiio player app, connect the btr3 and choose the bt codec to be turned off, in your case the ldac and maybe hwa





noobandroid said:


> if your shield cant do with the dropouts, compromise, give and take, try not to be overly obsessed with LDAC, they are good but not THAT good



Fioo app doe snot show up in the app store on the Shield.

It works fine with all other BT devices, the SONY audio products that do use LDAC as well, so it is clearly not a Shield or environmental issue.

It is not a big deal as i just use use the sony headphone when I need to use headphones late at night.

I was just posting here my experience with the BTR3 and the Shield.
There is nothing that can be done further.
Some BT chips just don't get along with others.
And the BTR3 works fine on the phones i have tried.


----------



## noobandroid

speedingcheetah said:


> Fioo app doe snot show up in the app store on the Shield.
> 
> It works fine with all other BT devices, the SONY audio products that do use LDAC as well, so it is clearly not a Shield or environmental issue.
> 
> ...



android variety is indeed a pain to uniformity


----------



## speedingcheetah

noobandroid said:


> android variety is indeed a pain to uniformity


Uniformity as whole, is inherently insecure. U hack one, u hack them all....looking at u Apple.
I would be using a pure linux device or Win phone...no none used win phone, no malware, viruses, no one cared about the platform...so no one wasted their time to attack the few users there were....
LOLZ


----------



## tyota

Love my BTR3, but with the new BTR5, what to do?


----------



## tmb821

Does the eq only work through the fiio app? I stream amazon music from my iPhone XR. Will the btr3 apply the eq settings to that, or only what’s streamed through the fiio app.


----------



## FiiO

tmb821 said:


> Does the eq only work through the fiio app? I stream amazon music from my iPhone XR. Will the btr3 apply the eq settings to that, or only what’s streamed through the fiio app.


Dear friend,

Did you set the EQ for BTR3 from FiiO Music app-Bluetooth device control -BTR3-EQ instead of the EQ option in FiiO Music app?

Best regards


----------



## tmb821

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Did you set the EQ for BTR3 from FiiO Music app-Bluetooth device control -BTR3-EQ instead of the EQ option in FiiO Music app?
> 
> Best regards




I don’t have one of these yet. I’m trying to decide if it will help with my issue. I have a hearing impairment, about 35% overall, with most of it falling in the midrange and vocal frequencies. I’m hoping with a eq I will be able to boost the midrange so I don’t have to use such a high volume level. As of now I have to use a volume level that causes distortion in the bass and sibilance in the highs, or I can’t clearly hear the vocals and midrange. I just want to have a fuller experience. I guess I’m asking if the device will apply the eq settings to any music played through it, or only music played through the fiio music player. iOS will only apply its eq to iTunes music. thanks.


----------



## Crixus00

I have recently upgraded my mobile phone from Samsung S8 to the Samsung Note 10+. With Samsung S8 I found the max volume to be barely just enough. For whatever reason my new Note 10 appears to have about 30% more volume on tap. Sound wise, with the AKG N5005, both phones pair really well with the BTR3.

That said, I will be upgrading to the BTR5 when it becomes more widely available


----------



## noobandroid

Crixus00 said:


> I have recently upgraded my mobile phone from Samsung S8 to the Samsung Note 10+. With Samsung S8 I found the max volume to be barely just enough. For whatever reason my new Note 10 appears to have about 30% more volume on tap. Sound wise, with the AKG N5005, both phones pair really well with the BTR3.
> 
> That said, I will be upgrading to the BTR5 when it becomes more widely available


S8 that generation i think is only up to AAC or maybe APTX? Note 10+ has every BT codec except APTX HD, that could be why maybe? android generation difference


----------



## Kundi

I tried to search this forum so apologies if this has been answered. The output for the BTR3 is so low that I have to turn it up all the way to hear anything. I don’t have this issue with the ES100. Is this an issue? Can it be fixed?


----------



## minimalist82

Kundi said:


> I tried to search this forum so apologies if this has been answered. The output for the BTR3 is so low that I have to turn it up all the way to hear anything. I don’t have this issue with the ES100. Is this an issue? Can it be fixed?


Hi there,

It certainly sounds like this is an issue. Which headphones are you using? The es100 does have a bit more power but The btr3 should be able to drive most iems to a really high level. What is the source device? Have you been able to test with any other device? 

It might be a silly question, but do you have the volume set to 100% on the source device?


----------



## minimalist82

noobandroid said:


> S8 that generation i think is only up to AAC or maybe APTX? Note 10+ has every BT codec except APTX HD, that could be why maybe? android generation difference



I use an S8 and it is also capable of using LDAC etc so that shouldn’t be the issue.


----------



## Kundi

minimalist82 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> It certainly sounds like this is an issue. Which headphones are you using? The es100 does have a bit more power but The btr3 should be able to drive most iems to a really high level. What is the source device? Have you been able to test with any other device?
> 
> It might be a silly question, but do you have the volume set to 100% on the source device?



i'm using Periodic Audio Be with a one plus 6. ES100 is okay with medium volume on the One Plus 6, but i have to crank it up to the max on the OP6 on the BTR3.


----------



## tmb821

Anybody know if they make a lightning to type c cable so I can use this as a dac from my iPhone XR? Will I gain anything by doing this? Any noticeable difference from Bluetooth?


----------



## minimalist82

Kundi said:


> i'm using Periodic Audio Be with a one plus 6. ES100 is okay with medium volume on the One Plus 6, but i have to crank it up to the max on the OP6 on the BTR3.


Hmm it should drive those with no issue based on their impedance / sensitivity. Are you able to connect the btr to a PC/Mac via usb and use it in usb mode? It would be a good test to see if it is a Bluetooth related issue or not.

You could also try to reset the device. Try google search btr3 hard reset.


----------



## minimalist82

tmb821 said:


> Anybody know if they make a lightning to type c cable so I can use this as a dac from my iPhone XR? Will I gain anything by doing this? Any noticeable difference from Bluetooth?


I have tried this using the Apple camera adapter cable. I get an error saying device draws too much power. To be honest though it kind of defeats the object of this device. I think usb mode limits the bitrate to 16 also, so ends up being a complicated setup for not much improvement in sound. Just my opinion though.


----------



## tmb821

minimalist82 said:


> I have tried this using the Apple camera adapter cable. I get an error saying device draws too much power. To be honest though it kind of defeats the object of this device. I think usb mode limits the bitrate to 16 also, so ends up being a complicated setup for not much improvement in sound. Just my opinion though.



thanks. Kinda what I was thinking, but just curious. I know I can use it with my Samsung tab a.


----------



## Alberto01

tmb821 said:


> Anybody know if they make a lightning to type c cable so I can use this as a dac from my iPhone XR? Will I gain anything by doing this? Any noticeable difference from Bluetooth?


I tried that, and the sound wasn't better than with the best Bluetooth codecs and the BTR3 got warm/hot. I posted about that in this thread. Check the post for details.


----------



## fsi22

Kundi said:


> I tried to search this forum so apologies if this has been answered. The output for the BTR3 is so low that I have to turn it up all the way to hear anything. I don’t have this issue with the ES100. Is this an issue? Can it be fixed?



Have you maxed volume on both BTR3 and device?


----------



## FiiO

minimalist82 said:


> I have tried this using the Apple camera adapter cable. I get an error saying device draws too much power. To be honest though it kind of defeats the object of this device. I think usb mode limits the bitrate to 16 also, so ends up being a complicated setup for not much improvement in sound. Just my opinion though.


Dear friend,

I think that you could try to turn off the charge option of the BTR3 from FiiO Music app-BT device control and check again.

Best regards


----------



## FiiO

Kundi said:


> I tried to search this forum so apologies if this has been answered. The output for the BTR3 is so low that I have to turn it up all the way to hear anything. I don’t have this issue with the ES100. Is this an issue? Can it be fixed?


Dear friend,

 Please try to reset the BTR3 by holding the power button for at least 10s or holding the volume +&- for 5s to see if it helps first?

Best regards


----------



## shimigg

What USB c to USB c cable should I use to connect the BTR3 to Android as a DAC ? I have multiple USB c cables and the only one that works is the one bundled with Note10 , other high quality cables (nekteck for ex.) The BTR3 is not recognized.


----------



## noobandroid (Dec 11, 2019)

try instead usb A to C, C to C is way too many usb protocol that it's confusing, maybe to btr3

now my question: lowpass filter only works in AptX or does it work with LDAC too? and what does each filter brings? im trying hard to dissect them but cant figure them out

@FiiO


----------



## AviP (Dec 9, 2019)

I tried to search the forum so I apologize if it's been discussed.
I connected the BTR3 to my phone and Macbook Pro, but it only plays media from my macbook when it's connected to both. I set "Select Input Device" to manual, it still won't switch when I double click the power button. Automatic mode behaves the same way, even if no media is playing on the mac and media is playing on my phone. Any advice would be appreciated.

Edit: I just tried resetting the device by holding down the power button for 10 seconds, I tried both when the unit was on and when the unit was off and both times it just changed the power state, but didn't reset the device. I'm starting to think that I have a defective device.


----------



## holty2503

Hi all,
I've just received my new BTR3 and I've paired it up ok with my iPhone X but I'm only outputting SBC, I've signed up for Amazon music HD but its only pulsating in blue, can anyone help?

Many thanks.


----------



## Chamelleon

I'm afraid that SBC or AAC are only codes you can use on iPhone.


----------



## holty2503

How do I output AAC sorry I'm new to this.


----------



## Chamelleon

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...hd-ldac-hwa-lhdc.886101/page-45#post-14588803

I don't have iPhone so I can't test it.


----------



## holty2503

@FiiO 
Is there anyone out there that can advise me, even when I hit play it just pulsates blue not Cyanic.


----------



## nort ycagel

holty2503 said:


> @FiiO
> Is there anyone out there that can advise me, even when I hit play it just pulsates blue not Cyanic.


Are you sure it isnt aac? My btr3 only uses that with iOs


----------



## holty2503 (Dec 12, 2019)

nort ycagel said:


> Are you sure it isnt aac? My btr3 only uses that with iOs



It's defiantly flashing blue, can't get my head round it, When its connected to my laptop its purple.

Update it was me all along, its not blue but cyanic its only just noticeable change in colour to my old eyes lol.


----------



## FiiO

holty2503 said:


> Hi all,
> I've just received my new BTR3 and I've paired it up ok with my iPhone X but I'm only outputting SBC, I've signed up for Amazon music HD but its only pulsating in blue, can anyone help?
> 
> Many thanks.



Dear friend,

You could try the Bluetooth codec from FiiO Music APP-BT control after playing the music: 






Can the AAC be shown correctly instead?

Best regards


----------



## 4Real (Dec 13, 2019)

holty2503 said:


> Hi all,
> I've just received my new BTR3 and I've paired it up ok with my iPhone X but I'm only outputting SBC, I've signed up for Amazon music HD but its only pulsating in blue, can anyone help?
> 
> Many thanks.



That's very unlikely with an iPhone, AAC and SBC are *very* *very *similar in colour, if you hit pause your probably find it goes a slightly darker blue which is the SBC colour, I initially thought the same along with many others on here, I can almost guarantee it will be AAC 

If you install the app it will tell you what codec it's using, you can also switch off all other codecs accept AAC.

Edit: Man I was too slow with my reply he figured it out lol


----------



## holty2503

4Real said:


> That's very unlikely with an iPhone, AAC and SBC are *very* *very *similar in colour, if you hit pause your probably find it goes a slightly darker blue which is the SBC colour, I initially thought the same along with many others on here, I can almost guarantee it will be AAC
> 
> If you install the app it will tell you what codec it's using, you can also switch off all other codecs accept AAC.
> 
> Edit: Man I was too slow with my reply he figured it out lol



Thanks for your advise, I figured it out it was my eyes lol, turns out it's running AAC.


----------



## nitinvaid20

i also bought this BTR 3 but i have issue it shows device connected in my android but no sound in connected earphones on BTR3
have to open the FIIO App and in bluetooth section it shows there disconnected
have to connect it then only i get sound in all other apps.

and When using LDAC viper4android does not work so have to disable it to get it work with viper4 android

and its my 1st time using this bluetooth DAC let me know if there are any suggestions


----------



## FiiO

nitinvaid20 said:


> i also bought this BTR 3 but i have issue it shows device connected in my android but no sound in connected earphones on BTR3
> have to open the FIIO App and in bluetooth section it shows there disconnected
> have to connect it then only i get sound in all other apps.
> 
> ...


Dear user,

If you are convenient, please show your problem via video to support@fiio.com.

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

Hi all, I use Btr3 in my car that has aux in. 
It's perfect because it powers on and off according to usb current.
Now, any advice on how should I set volume with physical rocker on Btr3? Max out, or just 1.or 2 steps down?


----------



## tmb821

I have one of these on the way. I’m wondering, will I notice a difference coming from a ubtr? And I’m curious about the eq, does it only apply to music played with the FiiOMusic app, or will it apply to whatever I’m streaming to the btr3? I use amazon music almost exclusively.


----------



## noobandroid

tmb821 said:


> I have one of these on the way. I’m wondering, will I notice a difference coming from a ubtr? And I’m curious about the eq, does it only apply to music played with the FiiOMusic app, or will it apply to whatever I’m streaming to the btr3? I use amazon music almost exclusively.


on aptx variant, there is an option for eq inside btr3 so its device wide, for ldac no eq effects at all


----------



## FinBenton

I realised I'w been using only base aptx codec with my computer the whole time, seems like my PC doesnt support other codecs, just ordered this BT transmitter that connects with optical and supports LL and HD codecs, posting here if someone else is having issues with their computer. 

https://avantree.com/ne/oasis-plus-bluetooth-transmitter-receiver

Will post how it sounds like later.


----------



## speedingcheetah

FinBenton said:


> I realised I'w been using only base aptx codec with my computer the whole time, seems like my PC doesnt support other codecs, just ordered this BT transmitter that connects with optical and supports LL and HD codecs, posting here if someone else is having issues with their computer.
> 
> https://avantree.com/ne/oasis-plus-bluetooth-transmitter-receiver
> 
> Will post how it sounds like later.




Windows 10 only supports up to AptX.  There is no way, that i have ever been able to find, to get Windows to support the never versions AptX HD etc, or LDAC.

It is easy to get full codec support even LDAC, in Linux however. Ubuntu based distro especially. There is just extra Pusle Audio modules you have to manually install.

On Apple, idk, I don't own any Apple. But far as I know, they only support AAC.


----------



## FinBenton

speedingcheetah said:


> Windows 10 only supports up to AptX.  There is no way, that i have ever been able to find, to get Windows to support the never versions AptX HD etc, or LDAC.
> 
> It is easy to get full codec support even LDAC, in Linux however. Ubuntu based distro especially. There is just extra Pusle Audio modules you have to manually install.
> 
> On Apple, idk, I don't own any Apple. But far as I know, they only support AAC.


I tried that on linux but it doesnt support LL and tbh to me it didnt sound that good on any codec compared to windows but I didnt give it too much time. With that transmitter I linked you dont need to hassle with any drivers, just plug and play with linux or win.


----------



## speedingcheetah

FinBenton said:


> I tried that on linux but it doesnt support LL and tbh to me it didnt sound that good on any codec compared to windows but I didnt give it too much time. With that transmitter I linked you dont need to hassle with any drivers, just plug and play with linux or win.



Low latency version of aptx....i have never had any issues with latency of the other codecs, lip sync vocals are on time, even in games, i can detect no delay. 
When interference happens, then things get out of sync and break up. usually if i stand near my microwave when on.
Such things are very such affected or happen based on your hardware setup and environment i guess.
If you are having latency issues, then it most likely is not the codec that is the issue, but something else.

I have tried the LL versions and compared, no discernible or measurable difference, for me anyways.

Curious to know why you think you need LL....also curious about such BT transmitters.
How do u even pair those to devices without the ability to have a screen or ui to select the device that is in pairing mode to connect, like u do on phone?
I bought some cheapo one off amazon one time, no instructions.
But i could not pair my headphones to it as i had no way to go into the things and select the headphones to pair to or to enter in pin.


----------



## FinBenton

speedingcheetah said:


> Low latency version of aptx....i have never had any issues with latency of the other codecs, lip sync vocals are on time, even in games, i can detect no delay.
> When interference happens, then things get out of sync and break up. usually if i stand near my microwave when on.
> Such things are very such affected or happen based on your hardware setup and environment i guess.
> If you are having latency issues, then it most likely is not the codec that is the issue, but something else.
> I have tried the LL versions and compared, no discernible or measurable difference, for me anyways.



I definitely get around 200-300ms latency on aptx with my fiio btr-3s, not a huge deal but lip sync is slightly off for me.



speedingcheetah said:


> Curious to know why you think you need LL....also curious about such BT transmitters.
> How do u even pair those to devices without the ability to have a screen or ui to select the device that is in pairing mode to connect, like u do on phone?
> I bought some cheapo one off amazon one time, no instructions.
> But i could not pair my headphones to it as i had no way to go into the things and select the headphones to pair to or to enter in pin.


I havent tried this device yet but manual says just put both devices to pairing mode and put them close together and it should pair.


----------



## noobandroid

speedingcheetah said:


> But i could not pair my headphones to it as i had no way to go into the things and select the headphones to pair to or to enter in pin.


btr3 is only a Rx and doesnt have Tx ability, that's why you cant pair a bt hp with it, unless you 3.5mm out to a Tx and pair with a bt iem, but that beats the purpose of btr3, maybe btr5 might be able, or the es100

correct me if i got the idea wrong


----------



## noobandroid

FinBenton said:


> I havent tried this device yet but manual says just put both devices to pairing mode and put them close together and it should pair.


thats by the nfc pairing, so device needs to have nfc too


----------



## speedingcheetah

noobandroid said:


> btr3 is only a Rx and doesnt have Tx ability, that's why you cant pair a bt hp with it, unless you 3.5mm out to a Tx and pair with a bt iem, but that beats the purpose of btr3, maybe btr5 might be able, or the es100
> 
> correct me if i got the idea wrong



i was referring to the generic BT transmitter adapter the previous poster had said they are buying
not the BTR3. i know that is a receiver only.
BTR3 works fine on many things, but some things, it do not get along with, like my Nvidia Shied TV, it it breaks up badly, no matter what codec it is set to., while my ldac headphones work fine standalone paried to Shield.


----------



## Urnamaster13

My BTR3 suddenly stopped working. No LED flashing, no change when i try to charge it.  I am thinking to contact service centre.
But it was bought in USA for me by my sister and i currently live in India, will it be a problem to get warranty ?


----------



## tmb821 (Dec 24, 2019)

So, just got my btr3. When I go into bt control, nothing shows up? What gives? Can’t adjust anything. iPhone XR. Uninstalled and reinstalled app, reset btr3. What gives?


----------



## tmb821 (Dec 25, 2019)

Nvm... showed up. Seemingly out of no where. All I can say is awesome! I am super impressed. From my iems to my k240s. Makes everything sound better. And the cool thing is I can run the k240s on low gain now from the topping nx3s. Makes me wonder how much better the btr5 is...


----------



## FiiO

Urnamaster13 said:


> My BTR3 suddenly stopped working. No LED flashing, no change when i try to charge it.  I am thinking to contact service centre.
> But it was bought in USA for me by my sister and i currently live in India, will it be a problem to get warranty ?


Dear friend,

You could send email to support@fiio.com about that. If you are located in India now, you may need to send it back to us in China for repair instead. 

Best regards


----------



## Urnamaster13

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> You could send email to support@fiio.com about that. If you are located in India now, you may need to send it back to us in China for repair instead.
> 
> Best regards


On Fiio India website, there is a service centre called Origin marketing, will they perform any repair service ?


----------



## FiiO

Urnamaster13 said:


> On Fiio India website, there is a service centre called Origin marketing, will they perform any repair service ?


Sorry may not because you did not buy the product from this seller.

Best regards


----------



## MechaHerc

Hi guys, i want to ask, can this Fiio BTR3 or BTR5 connect to PC and i'm using my TWS earbud to listen music?


----------



## noobandroid

MechaHerc said:


> Hi guys, i want to ask, can this Fiio BTR3 or BTR5 connect to PC and i'm using my TWS earbud to listen music?


they are only wireless receiver, output is still by the jack


----------



## FinBenton (Dec 30, 2019)

FinBenton said:


> I realised I'w been using only base aptx codec with my computer the whole time, seems like my PC doesnt support other codecs, just ordered this BT transmitter that connects with optical and supports LL and HD codecs, posting here if someone else is having issues with their computer.
> 
> https://avantree.com/ne/oasis-plus-bluetooth-transmitter-receiver
> 
> Will post how it sounds like later.


Got Oasis Plus, connected optical to my pc and wow what a difference it makes. Automatically connects to both my headphones depending on whats powered up without having to do anything on PC as it just blindly outputs through optical. Played some CSGO, putting the switch on LL mode it made the game audio from unplayable to actually completely playable, very low latency, bullets nicely sync with shooting oh boy. Also aptx-HD sounds absolutely fantastic and has good enough latency for general purpose music and videos.

So, if anyone is using these adapters with a computer then I *highly *recommend this device as you get additional codec support regardless of your operating system, not bad. Also got additional signal range compared to my motherboard BT even though it has pretty decent antenna, zero cutouts through 2 congrete walls.


----------



## tmb821

Any idea if fiio will ever make the eq work with ldac? I bought a es100 and the eq works with ldac in that.


----------



## vtecv12 (Jan 8, 2020)

Chamelleon said:


> It's easy like replacing battery in Chinese toys. You just need to pry plastic cover with some flat but not too sharp tool and swipe it around. There is plastic clip on the top so don't pry from that side. It's glued so you gonna have to use some force to take it off but don't try too hard to avoid puncture the battery. After you take off plastic cover peel off battery gently and desolder wires. Next solder new battery and use some tape to stick it to motherboard. Place plastic cover and use some glue (B7000 preferable, avoid Super Glue) to stick it. My clip felt off many months ago, so my plastic cover looks different but it's just a piece of plastic.



Thank you for information. I still don't understand why Fiio can't send new battery for their customer. The cost of sending Fiio BTR3 to China and returned it back to customer will be high. Also in my country (Indonesia) there are some rules that can make cost even higher.

I think fiio should provide new battery in their  local distributors.  So we can replace it without sending their product to China.


----------



## FiiO

vtecv12 said:


> Thank you for information. I still don't understand why Fiio can't send new battery for their customer. The cost of sending Fiio BTR3 to China and returned it back to customer will be high. Also in my country (Indonesia) there are some rules that can make cost even higher.
> 
> I think fiio should provide new battery in their  local distributors.  So we can replace it without sending their product to China.


Dear user,

We are willing to send the battery to users which not only be convenient to you but also us. But unfortunately, the shipping company fails to send the battery oversea because of the strict customs here. We did try to send the battery to some users before but all were returned or confiscated. We will still try to communicate with the shipping company about that.

Best regards


----------



## Alberto01 (Jan 11, 2020)

Mr. FiiO:

Please, make the FiiO music app equalizer work with LDAC. It works against sales of the BTR3 and BTR5 not having the equalizer working on LDAC. A lot of buyers have chosen your main competitor's equivalent product, the Radsone EarStudio ES100, just because of the FiiO app issues. You must get smarter about that.


----------



## FiiO

Alberto01 said:


> Mr. FiiO:
> 
> Please, make the FiiO music app equalizer work with LDAC. It works against sales of the BTR3 and BTR5 not having the equalizer working on LDAC. A lot of buyers have chosen your main competitor's equivalent product, the Radsone EarStudio ES100, just because of the FiiO app issues. You must get smarter about that.


Dear user, 

Thanks for your kind feedback. We will report this to the engineer as well. Since the audio processing process of LDAC is more special than other Bluetooth formats, we are still doing related debugging, and strive to achieve the same effect as other Bluetooth formats, but it will take a certain amount of time.

Best regards


----------



## max1236

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Thanks for your kind feedback. We will report this to the engineer as well. Since the audio processing process of LDAC is more special than other Bluetooth formats, we are still doing related debugging, and strive to achieve the same effect as other Bluetooth formats, but it will take a certain amount of time.
> 
> Best regards



Any plans to add some of the features from the btr5 app to btr3? Like the one where you can input sensitivity and impedance to calculate output?


----------



## harpo1

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Thanks for your kind feedback. We will report this to the engineer as well. Since the audio processing process of LDAC is more special than other Bluetooth formats, we are still doing related debugging, and strive to achieve the same effect as other Bluetooth formats, but it will take a certain amount of time.
> 
> Best regards


Come on FiiO the damn BTR3 has been out for over two years.  Hell those of us who purchased it when it came out will have to replace it by the time you implement this because the batteries won't be any good.  Typical FiiO with promised features that never happen.


----------



## tmb821

The only thing I wish they would add to the btr3 is multiple user settings for the eq. I use multiple headphones, would be nice to have eq’s preset for them. Much like I can do on the es100.


----------



## Alberto01

tmb821 said:


> The only thing I wish they would add to the btr3 is multiple user settings for the eq. I use multiple headphones, would be nice to have eq’s preset for them. Much like I can do on the es100.


This a must for a good product, Mr. FiiO.


----------



## sidecross

Fiio and consumers might be better served with less fiio new products and instead an increase in their current product consumer services.


----------



## snoopyfb

sidecross said:


> Fiio and consumers might be better served with less fiio new products and instead an increase in their current product consumer services.



If the products are really good, the more the better!


----------



## FiiO

max1236 said:


> Any plans to add some of the features from the btr5 app to btr3? Like the one where you can input sensitivity and impedance to calculate output?


Dear user,

We will try to report to  the engineer about your feedback and access about that.

Best regards


----------



## tmb821 (Feb 6, 2020)

No matter what I do, I can’t get my btr3 to connect to computer as a dac. The light just stays blue. Computer doesn’t even show the device as connected.  Done the power button 3 times thing, reset btr3, changed to manual mode. This is a brand new hp stream with windows 10. My es100 hooks up instantly with no problems. Maybe I grabbed the cord for my ūbtr? Could that be the problem? I thought usb c was all the same? Anybody have any ideas? Could it be because I am using windows 10 s mode? I wasn’t on my other laptop and it didn’t see the btr3 either.


----------



## ColdsnapBry

How strong is the connection of bluetooth audio? I've got a FiiO btr3 and a Sony NW-A55 DAP. The DAP has 4.1 bluetooth and the FiiO has a bunch of audio codecs. I've tried many different types of connection; LDAC, APTX HD. Yet I still get some audio skip once in awhile. Most cases my DAP is in my backpack and the FiiO btr is either like 1 feet away or 6. Anything that gets in the way of the connection or even just moving my arm over the device cuts off audio. I didnt think it was this sensitive...


----------



## sidecross

ColdsnapBry said:


> How strong is the connection of bluetooth audio? I've got a FiiO btr3 and a Sony NW-A55 DAP. The DAP has 4.1 bluetooth and the FiiO has a bunch of audio codecs. I've tried many different types of connection; LDAC, APTX HD. Yet I still get some audio skip once in awhile. Most cases my DAP is in my backpack and the FiiO btr is either like 1 feet away or 6. Anything that gets in the way of the connection or even just moving my arm over the device cuts off audio. I didnt think it was this sensitive...


I have the btr3 and the btr1k; the btr1k gives noticeably better reception. The btr3 only redemption is better battery availability  then the btr1k.


----------



## ColdsnapBry

sidecross said:


> I have the btr3 and the btr1k; the btr1k gives noticeably better reception. The btr3 only redemption is better battery availability  then the btr1k.



Ah, ok. I might try the btr1k then. Sometimes even in the gym if a dumbell passes over the btr3 I even get a skip.


----------



## Lolito

I´ve read 23 pages now, can someone please confirm this device will not be powerful enough to be used with the HD6XX? thanks a lot in advance!!!


----------



## FiiO

tmb821 said:


> No matter what I do, I can’t get my btr3 to connect to computer as a dac. The light just stays blue. Computer doesn’t even show the device as connected.  Done the power button 3 times thing, reset btr3, changed to manual mode. This is a brand new hp stream with windows 10. My es100 hooks up instantly with no problems. Maybe I grabbed the cord for my ūbtr? Could that be the problem? I thought usb c was all the same? Anybody have any ideas? Could it be because I am using windows 10 s mode? I wasn’t on my other laptop and it didn’t see the btr3 either.


Dear user,

Do you have another type c cable for check first? Can't the BTR3 show up in the play device list of your computer?

Best regards


----------



## tmb821

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Do you have another type c cable for check first? Can't the BTR3 show up in the play device list of your computer?
> 
> Best regards



I don’t have another cable at this moment. I will try that before anything else. As it stands right now, the btr3 will charge when connected to laptop, but laptop does not see the unit. It doesn’t show up in play device list.


----------



## FiiO

tmb821 said:


> I don’t have another cable at this moment. I will try that before anything else. As it stands right now, the btr3 will charge when connected to laptop, but laptop does not see the unit. It doesn’t show up in play device list.


Dear user,

Did you turn off the charge option for the BTR3 in the FiiO Music APP? And if your type C cable does not have data transmitting function, the BTR3 could not show up in the play device list when connecting to the computer.

Best regards


----------



## tmb821

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Did you turn off the charge option for the BTR3 in the FiiO Music APP? And if your type C cable does not have data transmitting function, the BTR3 could not show up in the play device list when connecting to the computer.
> 
> Best regards



I did turn of charging in the app. No change. I will try a different cable this weekend. Although, I am using the cable that came with the device, unless I grabbed the cable that came with my ūbtr.


----------



## FiiO

tmb821 said:


> I did turn of charging in the app. No change. I will try a different cable this weekend. Although, I am using the cable that came with the device, unless I grabbed the cable that came with my ūbtr.


Dear user,

Please try another cable which have data transmitting function and check again. You could also check another port.

Best regards


----------



## tmb821

turns out it was the cable.  none of the cables that came with my Fiio devices work. i used a aftermarket cable and it worked fine. although it says the device is my es100... but it works.


----------



## FiiO

tmb821 said:


> turns out it was the cable.  none of the cables that came with my Fiio devices work. i used a aftermarket cable and it worked fine. although it says the device is my es100... but it works.


Dear user,

Ok, anyway glad to hear about that. Thanks for the feedback.

Best regards


----------



## shimigg

I'm trying to use the btr3 as USB dac , with Samsung phones or with iPad pro , the only time it works is with USB c to USB c cable from Samsung only , no there cable works and I have quality cables ! , Any thing to do so I can use other cables ?


----------



## tmb821

shimigg said:


> I'm trying to use the btr3 as USB dac , with Samsung phones or with iPad pro , the only time it works is with USB c to USB c cable from Samsung only , no there cable works and I have quality cables ! , Any thing to do so I can use other cables ?



I use my btr3 with Samsung tablet, but I have to use a otg cable with it. In all honesty, the difference between bt and usb dac is nill. I can’t tell a difference, so I just use bt, it’s easier.


----------



## shimigg

tmb821 said:


> I use my btr3 with Samsung tablet, but I have to use a otg cable with it. In all honesty, the difference between bt and usb dac is nill. I can’t tell a difference, so I just use bt, it’s easier.



That’s also my problem but I’m trying to find a cable for times that I can’t charge it , not because of audio quality


----------



## tmb821

shimigg said:


> That’s also my problem but I’m trying to find a cable for times that I can’t charge it , not because of audio quality



I just use the cable it came with, and a otg adapter. It will run with my tablet, but not charge. If it doesn’t have a charge, it won’t run with my iPhone.


----------



## FiiO




----------



## 4Real

What chargers a safe to use with the BTR3, I'm assuming 5V only but what about amps?

5 V / 1 A
5 V / 2.1 A
5 V / 2.4 A


----------



## ClieOS

4Real said:


> What chargers a safe to use with the BTR3, I'm assuming 5V only but what about amps?
> 
> 5 V / 1 A
> 5 V / 2.1 A
> 5 V / 2.4 A


They are all safe to use with BTR3.


----------



## 4Real

ClieOS said:


> They are all safe to use with BTR3.


Ok, thanks.


----------



## dazzerfong

4Real said:


> What chargers a safe to use with the BTR3, I'm assuming 5V only but what about amps?
> 
> 5 V / 1 A
> 5 V / 2.1 A
> 5 V / 2.4 A



Just a small tip: voltage is the one that determines if it's safe or not. If the voltage is too high for your device, it'll destroy it. If the amps is too small, it'll either not charge or just charge slower. If the amps is higher than what your device needs, it simply draws as many amps as you need.


----------



## 4Real

dazzerfong said:


> Just a small tip: voltage is the one that determines if it's safe or not. If the voltage is too high for your device, it'll destroy it. If the amps is too small, it'll either not charge or just charge slower. If the amps is higher than what your device needs, it simply draws as many amps as you need.


Thanks, I was 99% sure on this already, just checking.


----------



## ClieOS

dazzerfong said:


> Just a small tip: voltage is the one that determines if it's safe or not. If the voltage is too high for your device, it'll destroy it. If the amps is too small, it'll either not charge or just charge slower. If the amps is higher than what your device needs, it simply draws as many amps as you need.



Actually, in the case of cheap charger that has no protection circuit (which often is the case on many low-amp-rating chargers), plugging in a device that required high current can cause the charger to overload, heating up and possibly burn-out. In worst case scenario, the charger can catch fire or explode.


----------



## sidecross

4Real said:


> What chargers a safe to use with the BTR3, I'm assuming 5V only but what about amps?
> 
> 5 V / 1 A
> 5 V / 2.1 A
> 5 V / 2.4 A


Products like btr3 regulate their incoming voltage and amperage power by themselves from powerbanks or wall chargers.


----------



## dazzerfong

ClieOS said:


> Actually, in the case of cheap charger that has no protection circuit (which often is the case on many low-amp-rating chargers), plugging in a device that required high current can cause the charger to overload, heating up and possibly burn-out. In worst case scenario, the charger can catch fire or explode.



Much rarer with USB-C chargers which include a resistor pull-up in the cable as part of the standard.

Of course, in that case, the onus is on the cable to have the proper resistor fitted. There's loads of crap cables out there which will fritz your devices if your charger is too high-powered, no matter how good it is.


----------



## sidecross

dazzerfong said:


> Much rarer with USB-C chargers which include a resistor pull-up in the cable as part of the standard.
> 
> Of course, in that case, the onus is on the cable to have the proper resistor fitted. There's loads of crap cables out there which will fritz your devices if your charger is too high-powered, no matter how good it is.


I would agree, I would have thought on this forum a certain basic understading of the market and how electricity works would include an understanding of cables, chargers and how they work. My error for an assumption misplaced.


----------



## dazzerfong

sidecross said:


> I would agree, I would have thought on this forum a certain basic understading of the market and how electricity works would include an understanding of cables, chargers and how they work. My error for an assumption misplaced.



Don't sweat it - in my days at uni, til around my 3rd year as an elec engineer student, electricity didn't make sense to me. 

That being said, USB-C is a smorgasbord of implementations, all in the goal to achieve a single standard til kingdom come. Complicated enough as it is, and with these changes came a lot of early adoption grief. Hell, even USB-C audio in Android phones is a minefield to navigate!


----------



## minimalist82 (Apr 22, 2020)

Hi guys and @FiiO

I'm not sure if anyone can help please. When using my BTR3 connected to my Samsung S8 and using the LDAC codec I've started to notice some distortion. I've had this combo for well over a year now and it has always been perfect until recently. I don't have another Android device to test so i'm not sure if this is something related to the phone or the BTR3. To be fair the performance of the S8 is pretty poor now, so could it be a processing power issue?

I have an iPhone and connecting the BTR3 to this using AAC I don't have the issue.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated, it has been a great little device!


----------



## FiiO

minimalist82 said:


> Hi guys and @FiiO
> 
> I'm not sure if anyone can help please. When using my BTR3 connected to my Samsung S8 and using the LDAC codec I've started to notice some distortion. I've had this combo for well over a year now and it has always been perfect until recently. I don't have another Android device to test so i'm not sure if this is something related to the phone or the BTR3. To be fair the performance of the S8 is pretty poor now, so could it be a processing power issue?
> 
> ...



Hi,

Please try to clear the pairing record by holding the volume+&- button at the same time for about 5s then reconnect? Can you borrow another player/mobilephone support LDAC for check as well?

Best regards


----------



## minimalist82

FiiO said:


> Hi,
> 
> Please try to clear the pairing record by holding the volume+&- button at the same time for about 5s then reconnect? Can you borrow another player/mobilephone support LDAC for check as well?
> 
> Best regards


Thank you Fiio, i'll give this a try. I'll also see if I can get hold of another Android device to test further. Kind regards!


----------



## minimalist82

minimalist82 said:


> Thank you Fiio, i'll give this a try. I'll also see if I can get hold of another Android device to test further. Kind regards!



@FiiO. I tried your suggestion and and unfortunately it didn't help. However I was able to test the device with a Samsung S3 tab and the issue is not present. I guess this means it is something to do with the S8 handset rather than the BTR3. I'll continue to try and find a solution. Thanks!


----------



## BenF

minimalist82 said:


> Hi guys and @FiiO
> 
> I'm not sure if anyone can help please. When using my BTR3 connected to my Samsung S8 and using the LDAC codec I've started to notice some distortion. I've had this combo for well over a year now and it has always been perfect until recently. I don't have another Android device to test so i'm not sure if this is something related to the phone or the BTR3. To be fair the performance of the S8 is pretty poor now, so could it be a processing power issue?
> 
> ...


Go into Developer Options and lower the LDAC bitrate to 660 or even 330. I have a similar problem when using 990kbps when my smartwatch is connected to the smartphone too, but not at lower bitrates.


----------



## deviltrombone

Has anyone tried the BTR3 with devices such as the Fire TV Stick 4K and Apple TV 4, which lack volume controls? I find my BTR3 cannot reach anywhere near adequate volumes with these devices, while my other BT receivers and headphones can, and I think this may be due to the BTR3's unusual independent volume control. Is there any workaround for this, or is the BTR3 just not suitable for those devices? My BTR3 does work fine with my phone and other devices which have volume controls, so I don't think it's broken.


----------



## MrBackup

Since yesterday I am having serious problems with Fiio BTR3 and Spotify transmitting on LDAC. It is impossible to use it with the LDAC codec.

I have to go to the Fiio Control App and disable the LDAC and HWA codec in order to use the APTX-HD codec with Spotify. Even with this, it is a ****ing mess, since sometimes there are serious interruptions and bad sound in the transmission (Very high quality - OGG 320 kbps).

I have a Xiaomi Mi8 (MIUI 11 and Android 10), and until yesterday everything was fine with btr3.

What's happening?


----------



## FiiO

MrBackup said:


> Since yesterday I am having serious problems with Fiio BTR3 and Spotify transmitting on LDAC. It is impossible to use it with the LDAC codec.
> 
> I have to go to the Fiio Control App and disable the LDAC and HWA codec in order to use the APTX-HD codec with Spotify. Even with this, it is a ****ing mess, since sometimes there are serious interruptions and bad sound in the transmission (Very high quality - OGG 320 kbps).
> 
> ...


Hi, 

Please try to clear the pairing record by holding the volume+&- at the same time for 5s and reconnect again?

Best regards


----------



## MrBackup

FiiO said:


> Hi,
> 
> Please try to clear the pairing record by holding the volume+&- at the same time for 5s and reconnect again?
> 
> Best regards



Thank you, I have done what you told me and it has worked well.

But I had to disable the HWA codec (LHDC) which is causing the problem. It sounds bad if they are all activated.

Now with LDAC it works correctly, but it is highly dependent on how close the smartphone is to the Fiio BTR3.


----------



## FiiO

MrBackup said:


> Thank you, I have done what you told me and it has worked well.
> 
> But I had to disable the HWA codec (LHDC) which is causing the problem. It sounds bad if they are all activated.
> 
> Now with LDAC it works correctly, but it is highly dependent on how close the smartphone is to the Fiio BTR3.


Hi,

Thanks for the feedback. As a high-definition and high-bit-rate Bluetooth audio codec technology, HWA has the shortest transmission distance and weak anti-interference ability under the same conditions due to its high bandwidth. So there are still many improvement spaces in user experience.
And you could also try LDAC(optimized for connection quality) instead?

Best regards


----------



## Radio81

Anyone know what the battery life of the BTR3 is with AptX-LL?  I'm looking at using this for a gaming setup and need something that can last 8 hours.  Yes, I know what advertised battery life is running the basic codec.  I haven't seen any real world usage with AptX-LL in regard to battery life.


----------



## PeterMac

FiiO - when you plan to release EQ for LDAC ?


----------



## jamington2004

Looks lovely


----------



## dh0licious (May 22, 2020)

PeterMac said:


> FiiO - when you plan to release EQ for LDAC ?



@FiiO

When will EQ for LDAC become available? Any timelines?

BTW are most people using the Fiio Music app or Fiio Control app to control their Bluetooth devices (most of my music is on Spotify)?


----------



## ClieOS

dh0licious said:


> ...
> BTW are most people using the Fiio Music app or Fiio Control app to control their Bluetooth devices (most of my music is on Spotify)?



FiiO Control.


----------



## PeterMac

@FIiiO - please add battery level indicator under codec in FiiO BTR3 in FiiO apps, same like in BTR5.

Please add finally this EQ for LDAC, how long this will take ?


----------



## FiiO

Thanks for your feedback.

We will try to report your feedback to the product manager for checking first.

Best regards


----------



## MrBackup

There is a curious thing that happens to me with the Fiio Btr3. I have read that the Btr3 has a null hiss with very sensitive IEMs.

This is not my case and I experience prominent background noise with IEMs like Shure SE846 or JH Angie. This happens to me both by bluetooth and using the DAC function for my laptop.

I don't know if this happens to someone else, since I have read reviews where the null hiss stands out with sensitive IEMs.

The parasitic noise is noticeable and annoying.


----------



## FiiO

Hi,

You may try to set the volume of your mobilephone/PC to max, and adjust the volume using the BTR3 for help.

Best regards


----------



## MrBackup

FiiO said:


> Hi,
> 
> You may try to set the volume of your mobilephone/PC to max, and adjust the volume using the BTR3 for help.
> 
> Best regards



That works. Such an easy question which I had not tried.

Thank you.


----------



## FiiO




----------



## BenF (Jul 8, 2020)

The microphone on my BTR3K is totally unusable - more noise than voice.
Tried over APTX and LDAC - same issue.
Using the latest v1.2 firmware

My BTR3 and BTR5 have great microphones, does anyone else have this issue with BTR3K?


----------



## dh0licious

BenF said:


> The microphone on my BTR3K is totally unusable - more noise than voice.
> Tried over APTX and LDAC - same issue.
> Using the latest v1.2 firmware
> 
> My BTR3 and BTR5 have great microphones, does anyone else have this issue with BTR3K?



I do. Totally unusable on my BTR3K. I get complaints constantly. Mic is good on my es100 mk2.


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> The microphone on my BTR3K is totally unusable - more noise than voice.
> Tried over APTX and LDAC - same issue.
> Using the latest v1.2 firmware
> 
> My BTR3 and BTR5 have great microphones, does anyone else have this issue with BTR3K?





dh0licious said:


> I do. Totally unusable on my BTR3K. I get complaints constantly. Mic is good on my es100 mk2.


Dear users,

Sorry to hear about that. Do you mean that while calling, the other could not hear you clearly when using the microphone in the BTR3K?

Best regards


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear users,
> 
> Sorry to hear about that. Do you mean that while calling, the other could not hear you clearly when using the microphone in the BTR3K?
> 
> Best regards


Not only during calls, but also when recording myself.


----------



## dsoares

BenF said:


> The microphone on my BTR3K is totally unusable - more noise than voice.
> Tried over APTX and LDAC - same issue.
> Using the latest v1.2 firmware
> 
> My BTR3 and BTR5 have great microphones, does anyone else have this issue with BTR3K?


I don't have this problem, everyone can hear me loud and clear. The device was purchased a few days ago, so it may be a recent improvement in the manufacturing process or materials.


----------



## BenF

dsoares said:


> I don't have this problem, everyone can hear me loud and clear. The device was purchased a few days ago, so it may be a recent improvement in the manufacturing process or materials.


I bought mine 3 months ago...
Did you upgrade the firmware to v1.2?


----------



## dsoares

BenF said:


> I bought mine 3 months ago...
> Did you upgrade the firmware to v1.2?


Yes, I updated immediately after receiving it. The microphone works well for normal calls and also through whatsapp.


----------



## BenF

dh0licious said:


> I do. Totally unusable on my BTR3K. I get complaints constantly. Mic is good on my es100 mk2.


When did you buy yours?


----------



## dsoares

BenF said:


> When did you buy yours?


Bought on 04/27 and was delivered on 05/27


----------



## BenF

dsoares said:


> Bought on 04/27 and was delivered on 05/27


I thought you wrote earlier that " The device was purchased a few days ago "?
The question above was for @dh0licious


----------



## dsoares

BenF said:


> I thought you wrote earlier that " The device was purchased a few days ago "?
> The question above was for @dh0licious


I miscalculated, sorry about that. I am not good with the English language, I use google translator.


----------



## BenF

dsoares said:


> I miscalculated, sorry about that. I am not good with the English language, I use google translator.


Understandable, most people here aren't native English speakers


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> I bought mine 3 months ago...
> Did you upgrade the firmware to v1.2?


Dear user, 

It seems to be a hardware issue with the microphone. Please try to contact your seller about that first. If the seller fails to help, please contact us(support@fiio.com) again with the receipt attached.

Best regards


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> It seems to be a hardware issue with the microphone. Please try to contact your seller about that first. If the seller fails to help, please contact us(support@fiio.com) again with the receipt attached.
> 
> Best regards


I bought it on Aliexpress 3 months ago - the seller isn't going to do anything...
What can FIIO's support do about this?


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> I bought it on Aliexpress 3 months ago - the seller isn't going to do anything...
> What can FIIO's support do about this?


Dear user,

You could send the Aliexpress receipt to us first. And which country are you located in now?

Best regards


----------



## Alberto01

My BTR3 doesn't show up in my LG G3 Bluetooth device search. The Bluetooth version for the LG G3 is 4.0. Is it right for this to happen being the FiiO BTR3 a Bluetooth 4.2 device?


----------



## FiiO

Alberto01 said:


> My BTR3 doesn't show up in my LG G3 Bluetooth device search. The Bluetooth version for the LG G3 is 4.0. Is it right for this to happen being the FiiO BTR3 a Bluetooth 4.2 device?


Dear user,

Is your BTR3 in pairing mode at that time? 

How to enter pairing mode: 
Hold the button Multifunctional button for about 5 seconds when the device is on,and the red and blue lights will flash alternately.

Best regards


----------



## Alberto01 (Jul 23, 2020)

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Is your BTR3 in pairing mode at that time?
> 
> ...


Thank you, Mr. FiiO! Your instructions solved the problem. I had only paired my BTR3 with one source before this one. That happened a long time ago and when I powered on the BTR3 for the first time. And since the BTR3 was already in pairing mode, it was easy to forget that I had to purposely get the BTR3 into pairing mode to get it connected to other sources.


----------



## Alberto01

How does the sound quality of the BTR3K through the unbalanced jack compare to the sound quality of the BTR3?


----------



## ClieOS

Alberto01 said:


> How does the sound quality of the BTR3K through the unbalanced jack compare to the sound quality of the BTR3?



BTR3K sounds almost as good as BTR5, just not as powerful on the output. It is a complete level above the old BTR3.


----------



## BenF

Alberto01 said:


> How does the sound quality of the BTR3K through the unbalanced jack compare to the sound quality of the BTR3?


It sounds a bit better than BTR3 (which can sound too thin sometimes), and a lot better than BTR5 (which sounds too veiled).


----------



## Alberto01

BenF said:


> It sounds a bit better than BTR3 (which can sound too thin sometimes), and a lot better than BTR5 (which sounds too veiled).


Thank you BenF! 

Does that mean that the BTR3 sounds better than the BTR5 through the 3.5 mm unbalanced jack?

My BTR3 sounds impressive connected to a very clean portable amplifier that go into my JVC HA-FX1100 earphones. Being those earphones of the bass heavy kind, there is no thinness in the sound of my BTR3 with that sound setup.


----------



## BenF

Alberto01 said:


> Thank you BenF!
> 
> Does that mean that the BTR3 sounds better than the BTR5 through the 3.5 mm unbalanced jack?
> 
> My BTR3 sounds impressive connected to a very clean portable amplifier that go into my JVC HA-FX1100 earphones. Being those earphones of the bass heavy kind, there is no thinness in the sound of my BTR3 with that sound setup.


Yes, BTR3 sounds a lot cleaner than BTR5.


----------



## Alberto01 (Jul 31, 2020)

How is the soundstage of the BTR3K and the BTR5 through the unbalanced (3.5mm) jack? The soundstage of the BTR3 is like being on a small stage with all the musicians. It is nice in that all sounds have a bold expression. It isn't nice in that there is no sense of distance and depth in the individual or overall presentation.


----------



## BenF (Jul 30, 2020)

Alberto01 said:


> How is the soundstage of the BTR3K and the BTR5 through the unbalanced (3.5mm) jack? The soundstage of the BTR3 is like being right on a small stage with all the musicians. It is nice in that all sounds have a bold expression. It isn't nice in that there is no sense of distance and depth in the individual or overall presentation.


If you are using BTR3 as a DAC, the soundstage is mostly defined by your amplifier (and headphones, of course).


----------



## Sp12er3

do people hook up amp to these? by double amping it or does it have a Line out mode?


----------



## Alberto01

Sp12er3 said:


> do people hook up amp to these? by double amping it or does it have a Line out mode?


I just connect the headphones jack of my BTR3 to the input jack of my amplifier with a 3.5 mm to 3.5 mm male to male coupler.


----------



## Sp12er3

just double amping it then?


----------



## Alberto01

Sp12er3 said:


> just double amping it then?


Yes


----------



## speedingcheetah (Aug 7, 2020)

Is the USB C port on the BTR3 USB 3.0 or 2.0 spec for use as USB DAC?


----------



## Alberto01 (Aug 8, 2020)

"just double amping it then?" 



Alberto01 said:


> Yes


To my ears the amplification power of the BTR3 is a joke for headphones and it isn't much for IEMs. This and the BTR3's small size make it an ideal receiver to be connected to an amplifier. Obviously, with an amplifier the BTR3's portability goes down the drain when compared to other BT receivers that have more amplification power than the BTR3.


----------



## speedingcheetah (Aug 8, 2020)

Alberto01 said:


> To my ears the amplification power of the BTR3 is a joke for headphones and it isn't much for IEMs. This and the BTR3's small size make it an ideal receiver to be connected to an amplifier. Obviously, with an amplifier the BTR3's portability goes down the drain when compared to other BT receivers that have more amplification power than the BTR3.


I have to say, that the BTR3s amp power is not great.
But it powers my Sony in ears  MDRXB50AP  just fine, get plenty loud and sound awesome, like far far more expensive headphones, after i tweak the EQ in the Fiio app. also powers my MDREX750BT/B in wired mode fine.
My wired Vmoda Crossfade Wireless (gen 1) full sized headphones, it can barely power, and does not get loud enough, but i use my E17K for those.


----------



## johny5

These are my go-to @ work headphone amp! Clean sound and the Bluetooth is cleaned and strong. Using with QC 35s


----------



## speedingcheetah

speedingcheetah said:


> Is the USB C port on the BTR3 USB 3.0 or 2.0 spec for use as USB DAC?



Can Fiio or someone answer this?


----------



## FiiO

speedingcheetah said:


> Is the USB C port on the BTR3 USB 3.0 or 2.0 spec for use as USB DAC?


Dear user,

Unlike the BTR5, when using as USB DAC, the BTR3 use USB Audio 1.0 mode instead.

Best regards


----------



## speedingcheetah

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Unlike the BTR5, when using as USB DAC, the BTR3 use USB Audio 1.0 mode instead.
> 
> Best regards


ook then. so the USB 2.0 hub i have been using on my Shield is fine. was thinking of upgrading to 3.0 hub if it had any impact on the BTR3, but....nope. thanks


----------



## Alberto01 (Aug 14, 2020)

speedingcheetah said:


> Is the USB C port on the BTR3 USB 3.0 or 2.0 spec for use as USB DAC?





FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> Unlike the BTR5, when using as USB DAC, the BTR3 use USB Audio 1.0 mode instead.
> 
> Best regards





speedingcheetah said:


> ook then. so the USB 2.0 hub i have been using on my Shield is fine. was thinking of upgrading to 3.0 hub if it had any impact on the BTR3, but....nope. thanks



Don't rest assured that there will be no difference in sound with different types of USB ports. There have been differences in sound quality when switching a part of my sound chain where technically the sound was supposed to be exactly the same. For example, with the same BT codec my BTR3 has a cleaner sound with my previous cell phone than it does with my current cell phone. The same thing has happened with USB cables of a different design despite the claim that it is impossible for the sound to be different because of the "just 1s and 0s being transmitted" explanation.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> Don't rest assured that there will be no difference in sound with different types of USB ports. There have been differences in sound quality when switching a part of my sound chain where technically the sound was supposed to be exactly the same. For example, with the same BT codec my BTR3 has a cleaner sound with my previous cell phone than it does with my current cell phone. The same thing has happened with USB cables of a different design despite the claim that it is impossible for the sound to be different because of the "just 1s and 0s being transmitted" explanation.



My nvidia shield and the USB DAC's i use, BTR3 and especially the E17K are quite picky.
I have to use a usb extension cable to reach other side of room so i can sit on couch and plug in DAC for headphone use.
It is odd, I have nice thick, known good, high quality shorter usb extender cables(and long ones), but when those are in use with the hub, I get no sound out of the DACs or, mainly the E17K will be very glitchy, static and not sound right at all. (hub is powered)
I moved to a quite thin, and much longer usb extender cable, and that is just fine.
Was just pondering the idea of changing to a USB 3.0 hub, that would also require new 3.0 spec extender cable of about 10-12ftft at least.
Thought maybe the step up to USB 3.0 may benefit the DAC, since its a C port on the BTR3, assumed it was 3.0 port and was being limited by using a 2.0 connection.
But Fiio says they work in USB 1.0 mode, so...i see no reason to spend money to upgrade something that won't change anything.


----------



## Alberto01

The needed speed for data transmission (the 1s and 0s stuff) between your source and the BTR3 will be covered by USB 2.0. So, the higher speed of USB 3.0 doesn't make a difference in this application. That is the theory (and obviously all or most of the reality) in this case.

You can use USB 2.0 cables and extensions, with USB 3.0 ports. They are all designed to be compatible.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> You can use USB 2.0 cables and extensions, with USB 3.0 ports. They are all designed to be compatible.



"Compatible" only means that it will function at 2.0 buss and power speeds. 
There is no way to get USB 3.0 buss and power speeds from USB 2.0 cables connected to a 3.0 hub.


----------



## Alberto01

Alberto01 said:


> The needed speed for data transmission (the 1s and 0s stuff) between your source and the BTR3 will be covered by USB 2.0. So, the higher speed of USB 3.0 doesn't make a difference in this application. That is the theory (and obviously all or most of the reality) in this case.
> 
> You can use USB 2.0 cables and extensions, with USB 3.0 ports. They are all designed to be compatible.





speedingcheetah said:


> "Compatible" only means that it will function at 2.0 buss and power speeds.
> There is no way to get USB 3.0 buss and power speeds from USB 2.0 cables connected to a 3.0 hub.


Your next step toward upgrading your setup should be getting a USB Bluetooth transmitter. The sound quality of aptx HD that you are gonna get, will be at the same level of your BTR3 wired connection.


----------



## HipHopScribe

Alberto01 said:


> For example, with the same BT codec my BTR3 has a cleaner sound with my previous cell phone than it does with my current cell phone.



This is probably because yourself new phone is falling back to a lower bitrate for transmission more often than your old phone, either because it has a weaker signal or the software is more aggressive about preserving connection strength over quality


----------



## speedingcheetah

Alberto01 said:


> Your next step toward upgrading your setup should be getting a USB Bluetooth transmitter. The sound quality of aptx HD that you are gonna get, will be at the same level of your BTR3 wired connection.


I didn't ask for you suggestions in how to upgrade things...I only asked about the usb port spec on the Fioo btr3.
USB wired kills Bluetooth anyday as far as quality goes.
I switched to wired when Nvidia broke LDAC codec on the Shield. ANd they don't seem to care to fix it, since its been over a year with no fix.
And i use a different non BT wired DAC for my phone for my serious music time.


----------



## BenF

FiiO said:


> Dear user,
> 
> It seems to be a hardware issue with the microphone. Please try to contact your seller about that first. If the seller fails to help, please contact us(support@fiio.com) again with the receipt attached.
> 
> Best regards


I have identified the root cause - BTR3K's microphone is OK, the problem was caused by the 3.5 input.
I didn't know this, but both BTR5 and BTR3K support in-line microphones using CTIA standard.

I was testing using a cable with in-line microphone, and BTR5 was producing a nice enough recording.
However, my BTR3K was producing more noise than voice with the same cable - totally unusable.
When using BTR3K with a regular cable without a microphone, recordings are just as good as on BTR3 (which is always using the built-in mic) and BTR5.

So I just won't use cables with an inline microphone - a nuisance, but a much smaller problem.
Hope FIIO will fix this in new batches.


----------



## speedingcheetah

Is it true the BTR5 has no EQ for USB DAC mode? and for LDAC too?
I read some reviews on Amazon that say that, but they are a bit old now, and I woudl think Fiio put out a firmware update to add that by now.
My BTR3 powers fine my budget Sony in ears fine, and I use the EQ to add the low end bass i like. (i use it and the earbuds connected to my Nvidia Shield for TV and movies)
But the 3 can not power my large Vmoda full size headphones.
But if the BTR5 has no EQ fo usb mode, then that is a deal breaker for me.


(I tried to find the official BTR5 thread on here, via search, but the couple i found were locked.0


----------



## Alberto01

speedingcheetah said:


> Is it true the BTR5 has no EQ for USB DAC mode? and for LDAC too?
> I read some reviews on Amazon that say that, but they are a bit old now, and I woudl think Fiio put out a firmware update to add that by now.
> My BTR3 powers fine my budget Sony in ears fine, and I use the EQ to add the low end bass i like. (i use it and the earbuds connected to my Nvidia Shield for TV and movies)
> But the 3 can not power my large Vmoda full size headphones.
> ...


Here is the official FiiO BTR5 thread:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...5mm-aac-sbc-aptx-aptx-ll-aptx-hd-ldac.918298/


----------



## ClieOS (Sep 4, 2020)

speedingcheetah said:


> Is it true the BTR5 has no EQ for USB DAC mode? and for LDAC too?
> I read some reviews on Amazon that say that, but they are a bit old now, and I woudl think Fiio put out a firmware update to add that by now.
> My BTR3 powers fine my budget Sony in ears fine, and I use the EQ to add the low end bass i like. (i use it and the earbuds connected to my Nvidia Shield for TV and movies)
> But the 3 can not power my large Vmoda full size headphones.
> ...



I think there is some misunderstanding here: saying BTR5 doesn't have EQ on USB DAC mode or over LDAC is the same as saying your BTR3 doesn't in itself have EQ on USB DAC mode or over LDAC - it does NOT mean you can't use an app that has EQ, or the built-in EQ inside your Nvidia Shield to add bass boost to the final sound. EQ is digitally applied onto the digital music files and thus it doesn't have that much difference whether it was applied by the Nvidia Shield or by BTR3/5 itself (*unless Nvidia Shield has exceptionally lousy EQ system).


----------



## speedingcheetah

ClieOS said:


> I think there is some misunderstanding here: saying BTR5 doesn't have EQ on USB DAC mode or over LDAC is the same as saying your BTR3 doesn't in itself have EQ on USB DAC mode or over LDAC - it does NOT mean you can't use an app that has EQ, or the built-in EQ inside your Nvidia Shield to add bass boost to the final sound. EQ is digitally applied onto the digital music files and thus it doesn't have that much difference whether it was applied by the Nvidia Shield or by BTR3/5 itself (*unless Nvidia Shield has exceptionally lousy EQ system).



you sound confused.
or have never used the btr3.

the btr3 has a built in system EQ u adjust via the Fiio Control app.
it persists on the device level as u use it via it various inputs devices.
Only when using LDAC, does the BTR3 EQ do no function.

According to the reviews, this same device level EQ does not function when in USB DAC mode with the BTR5.
I ask is this true.

I do not ask if any other software app EQ can be used...and if you ever use a Nvida Shield, you would know there is no system EQ in it or anyway to install a system EQ app that would affect the common apps used on it. (I dont know of a way to root and modify the ROM on Shield, and would not want to)


----------



## speedingcheetah

I have a issue. I used the Fiio Control app to turn off all BT codecs other than AptX HD...to do some testing.
now, i can not get the Fiio app to connect back to the BTR3.
It just says connection failed.
How does one fix this?


----------



## ClieOS

speedingcheetah said:


> I have a issue. I used the Fiio Control app to turn off all BT codecs other than AptX HD...to do some testing.
> now, i can not get the Fiio app to connect back to the BTR3.
> It just says connection failed.
> How does one fix this?



Try: Forget it on your smartphone first, then clear all pairing info on BTR3 itself (after turn on, press V+ and V- at the same time, which will force it to go to fresh pairing mode). Reconnect.


----------



## speedingcheetah

ClieOS said:


> Try: Forget it on your smartphone first, then clear all pairing info on BTR3 itself (after turn on, press V+ and V- at the same time, which will force it to go to fresh pairing mode). Reconnect.



yea i tried that even pairing it with a different phone it never was paired with. the fiio control app would not connect to it there.
i trued the fiio music app, oddly it does connect, but thinks its in SBC and shows odd options, like the balance is 2 marks to the L, and the EQ is all zeros....other options are greyed out.
was about to try and find out how to full factory rest the btr3 (hold down power button for more than 10 secs?)...
But, seems un-installing the Fiio Control app, then re-installing it, it connected and showed aptX HD in use and now works fine.
I re-enabled the other codecs..
 seems to be some bugs in the app and/or firmware for when users disable codecs, the app wont reconnect.


----------



## FiiO

Notices:

①If the app quit working, it is suggested to clear the pairing record of the Bluetooth device in your phone. Then reconnect it to your phone and try again.

②For the iOS version: the first time to enter “Bluetooth device control”, short press the power button of the Bluetooth device to finish connection, and then click “Cancel” and return to “Bluetooth device control” menu. It will be connected successfully. At this time, click Bluetooth device to execute relating operations.

③For the iOS version: if the BTR3K did not show up in the “Bluetooth device control” list, click the “Refresh” icon in the upper right corner, or quit the app for a while and then reenter it.


----------



## BenF

Posted a BTR3K review here: https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/fi...bluetooth-amp.24317/reviews#item-review-24719
Best Bluetooth adapter I have, despite the heavy competition:





Sounds especially amazing with Takstar Pro 82...


----------



## FiiO

The Android version FiiO Control app has been updated to V2.2.

If your FiiO Control app could not recognize the Bluetooth Amplifier, please try to update it.

Android version 2.2 download link: Click to download

You could also search “FiiO Control” in any application market to download it.


----------



## BenF

One annoying problem with BTR3K - it shuts down while the FIIO Control app still reports 20%:




No warning is given too - it just shuts down.
If I power it back up - it shuts down within a minute again (nothing was playing).


----------



## fsi22

BenF said:


> One annoying problem with BTR3K - it shuts down while the FIIO Control app still reports 20%:
> 
> 
> No warning is given too - it just shuts down.
> If I power it back up - it shuts down within a minute again (nothing was playing).



When it's close to empty, the btr series will beep a few times. it's not very noticeable or loud, there's also a momentary dip in volume on the 3k.


----------



## BenF

fsi22 said:


> When it's close to empty, the btr series will beep a few times. it's not very noticeable or loud, there's also a momentary dip in volume on the 3k.


Maybe I have missed the beeps, but why shut down at 20%?


----------



## FiiO

BenF said:


> One annoying problem with BTR3K - it shuts down while the FIIO Control app still reports 20%:
> 
> 
> No warning is given too - it just shuts down.
> If I power it back up - it shuts down within a minute again (nothing was playing).


Dear friend,

20% is showing the BTR3K in low battery level because there are only 5 level in the FiiO Control app: 20%,40%,60%,80%,100%.

The indicator of the BTR3K will also turn red when it is in low battery level.

Best regards


----------



## spyrusthegreat

Hello, about btr3k when using as usb dac and have not CTIA headphones does dongle mic work?
If I am on bluetooth and run out of battery will I stay on BT when plugg to usb port or it will go as usb dac?
If instead plug on powerbank?


----------



## FiiO

spyrusthegreat said:


> Hello, about btr3k when using as usb dac and have not CTIA headphones does dongle mic work?
> If I am on bluetooth and run out of battery will I stay on BT when plugg to usb port or it will go as usb dac?
> If instead plug on powerbank?


Dear friend,

1. When using the BTR3K as USB DAC, the microphone in the BTR3K is disabled.
2. You could switch the priority of Bluetooth or USB DAC output via the APP. If the input proiortiy is selected to Bluetooth first, you will stay on BT proiortiy even when connecting to the usb port in power on status.

Best regards


----------



## sidecross

BenF said:


> Maybe I have missed the beeps, but why shut down at 20%?


I hardly ever let my battery go lower than 40% for my own use and use auxiliary power when needed.


----------



## baloo87

anyone using the Avantree DG60 with the BTR3K?

i cant get the APTX-LL to work, i have contacted Avantree support, but their first response wasn't helpful.


----------



## FiiO

baloo87 said:


> anyone using the Avantree DG60 with the BTR3K?
> 
> i cant get the APTX-LL to work, i have contacted Avantree support, but their first response wasn't helpful.


Dear friend,

You could check whether you have turned off the APTX-LL Bluetooth codec for the BTR3K in the FiiO Control APP?






If your transmitter still fails to connect to the BTR3K via APTX-LL, you would need to check the settings in your transmitter. 

Best regards


----------



## pholcus1975

Hi, I have a BTR3 in my car, car mode is on, but it doesn't always switch on when I start car. Tried a reset, but it doesn't help. Any ideas?


----------



## FiiO

pholcus1975 said:


> Hi, I have a BTR3 in my car, car mode is on, but it doesn't always switch on when I start car. Tried a reset, but it doesn't help. Any ideas?


Dear user,

Can't the BTR3 turn on at the same time when the car is started sometimes? You could try to clear the pairing record by holding the volume +&- button at the same time for about 5s.

And update the firmware for the BTR3 to check whether the issue remains: http://www.fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=44447&extra=page=1

Best regards


----------



## Jay Ros

Anybody using the original BTR3 as USB DAC for your laptop or PC?

I have a problem when BTR3 is connected through USB. Everything goes through left channel. The right channel slider, as you can see in the screenshot, doesn't affect the sound volume. I can put it at 0 or 100 and doesn't affect the volume, but the left slider does work. I can hear both sides of my headphones or both of my speakers, but if for some reason I want to reduce the volume of any channel I can't, because everything is going through the left channel.

If I connect the BTR3 to my laptop through the Bluetooth connection, then it works perfectly, both channels are independent. So, I imagine is some kind of bug or issue, but I haven't found anyway to fix it.

I have updated firmware to 1.2, I have reinstalled firmware 1.2, I have formatted my laptop and reinstalled Windows 10. Nothing. Any idea?



Also, is there anyway to use this DAC with ASIO? I'd like to use it with ASIO in Ableton Live (and I'm not installing ASIO4ALL, i rather use the ASIO drivers of Realtek for my laptop. It's just that the BTR3 has better sound.

Thanks!


----------



## FiiO

Jay Ros said:


> Anybody using the original BTR3 as USB DAC for your laptop or PC?
> 
> I have a problem when BTR3 is connected through USB. Everything goes through left channel. The right channel slider, as you can see in the screenshot, doesn't affect the sound volume. I can put it at 0 or 100 and doesn't affect the volume, but the left slider does work. I can hear both sides of my headphones or both of my speakers, but if for some reason I want to reduce the volume of any channel I can't, because everything is going through the left channel.
> 
> ...


Dear friend,

We have replied and communicated with you via email.

Best regards


----------



## PeterMacPL

FiiO - do you add EQ for LDAC finally or this never happen ?


----------



## PeterMacPL (Jan 31, 2021)

FiiO - any news progress about adding EQ for LDAC codec ?

Also, I have a few question about using EQ in FiiO Music app with BTR3.
Which EQ is betteer to use built in device in Device Control, or Equalizer in FiiO Music ?
I noticed that EQ in app when increase for example bass lower volume, EQ in BTR3 do not do this ?


----------



## Knightsfan11

Received my BTR3k yesterday & have used for a couple of hours today, so far on AAC & through the USB DAC function. Happy with it's performance, paired with my LZ A7 IEM.

Question regarding using this unit in the car. I quickly plugged it into the AUX cable to play music over my sound system (speaker, sub & amp installed), found the volume very low. Is there a way of the BTR3's amp not taking effect while being plugged in, instead my sound systems taking full control?


----------



## BenF

Knightsfan11 said:


> Received my BTR3k yesterday & have used for a couple of hours today, so far on AAC & through the USB DAC function. Happy with it's performance, paired with my LZ A7 IEM.
> 
> Question regarding using this unit in the car. I quickly plugged it into the AUX cable to play music over my sound system (speaker, sub & amp installed), found the volume very low. Is there a way of the BTR3's amp not taking effect while being plugged in, instead my sound systems taking full control?


You need to adjust 3 volume controls:
1) Your smartphone's
2) BTR3K's
3) Car stereo's

I use BTR3K in my car, and it gets very loud even without maxing out car's volume control.

Also could be you didn't plug the cable all the way in


----------



## Knightsfan11

BenF said:


> You need to adjust 3 volume controls:
> 1) Your smartphone's
> 2) BTR3K's
> 3) Car stereo's
> ...


Thanks for the response. I'll have another go tonight. I also need to check the settings on my amp, as the aux setting may be low.


----------



## maserluv

Can the fiio app be customize to lock the physical button I.e. volume up/down and multifunction.

is there any plan to incorporate crossfeed into the software too?

Regards Wayne


----------



## MaxSong (Apr 13, 2021)

I have this problem with BTR3K that I wanted to share. Looks like it's related to this post.
By default on Linux OS (I have Manjaro, but that doesn't matter) BTR3K via USB works only for 48000 Hz audio. The device reports the following in `cat /proc/asound/BTR3K/stream0`:

```
Interface 1
    Altset 1
    Format: S16_LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 0x03 (3 OUT) (NONE)
    Rates: 48000, 44100
    Bits: 16
    Channel map: FL FR
```
But any 44100 Hz audio never works. For example, you can have audio on youtube, but when you'll try to play something in the player, there will be no sound. As a workaround you should specify 48000 Hz as your sample rate in pulseaudio config. I just added the following to `~/.config/pulse/daemon.conf`:

```
default-sample-rate = 48000
```
Unfortunately that means that every 44100 Hz source will be resampled to 48000 Hz. Would be great if 44100 was working too.

Looks like the workaround initially was posted here: https://github.com/ReimuNotMoe/FiiO-BTR3-USB-Linux-Workaround


----------



## MaxSong

MaxSong said:


> By default on Linux OS (I have Manjaro, but that doesn't matter) BTR3K via USB works only for 48000 Hz audio.



Apparently some people have discovered the reason, but FiiO still didn't fix it. https://bbs.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=201811201627356272545


----------



## FiiO

MaxSong said:


> Apparently some people have discovered the reason, but FiiO still didn't fix it. https://bbs.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=201811201627356272545



_
If you are using Linux 18.04, you may try the methods mentioned by this user to check if it helps: 
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...pe-c-and-usb-dac.850675/page-49#post-14823330


Thanks for the information, on that link I found the solution ... indirectly.

I found the solution by changing the output of the player that I use on Ubuntu (DeaDBeaf ver. 0.7.2).
Setting the 96Khz output and the algorithm on "SYNC_BEST_QUALITY"
now the BTR3 in DAC mode plays all audio formats.

Best regards_


----------



## MaxSong

FiiO said:


> _If you are using Linux 18.04, you may try the methods mentioned by this user to check if it helps:
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fiio’s-upgraded-bluetooth-amplifier-btr1k-qualcomm-qcc-3005-bt-chip-bt-5-0-and-aptx-aptx-ll-aac-supported-rgb-light-nfc-pairing-type-c-and-usb-dac.850675/page-49#post-14823330
> 
> 
> ...


These methods all involve resampling. I can resample audio to 48000 Hz perfectly fine myself.
But I want BTR3K to play 44100 Hz audio from my PC, like it is supposed to - because right now it doesn't.


----------



## borrego

I haven't used my BTR3 for a few months. Now it won't turn on and respond to charging. Is there any way to revive it? Thanks!


----------



## FiiO

borrego said:


> I haven't used my BTR3 for a few months. Now it won't turn on and respond to charging. Is there any way to revive it? Thanks!


Dear friend,

Sorry to hear about that. You could follow the help in this FAQ to check again:https://forum.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=202105211820457543051&tid=99

Best regards


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## borrego

FiiO said:


> Dear friend,
> 
> Sorry to hear about that. You could follow the help in this FAQ to check again:https://forum.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=202105211820457543051&tid=99
> 
> Best regards



I tried all the tricks stated in the FAQ and forum, i.e. holding power button for 10 secs, 30 secs, holding both +/- volume buttons, charging with different chargers, wait another day to charge, and none could revive the BTR3. Will it likely be a dead battery needing replacement? Sent email to Fiio support and not receiving reply yet.

Thanks!


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## FiiO

borrego said:


> I tried all the tricks stated in the FAQ and forum, i.e. holding power button for 10 secs, 30 secs, holding both +/- volume buttons, charging with different chargers, wait another day to charge, and none could revive the BTR3. Will it likely be a dead battery needing replacement? Sent email to Fiio support and not receiving reply yet.
> 
> Thanks!


Dear friend,

Have you tried to contact the seller about that? And if you failed to receive feedback from support@fiio.com, you could contact support@fiio.net instead.

Best regards


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## ronfifer

I have the BTR3k. How can i know at which sample rate and bit rate am i receiving audio over Bluetooth connection? The app doesnt say. I am streaming netflix from TV.


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## ClieOS

ronfifer said:


> I have the BTR3k. How can i know at which sample rate and bit rate am i receiving audio over Bluetooth connection? The app doesnt say. I am streaming netflix from TV.


Bluetooth codec is determined by the source (in this case, your TV). You should check what codec your TV has, though very likely it is just the basic SBC.


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## ronfifer

Uhm i already said i know what codec is running. Asking about bit rate n sample rate.


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## ronfifer

anyone has instructions in English on how to apply the firmware after downloading v1.3.zip from fiio support page? It is all in chinese. My device is the BTR3K.


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## ClieOS

ronfifer said:


> anyone has instructions in English on how to apply the firmware after downloading v1.3.zip from fiio support page? It is all in chinese. My device is the BTR3K.


https://fiio.com/newsinfo/380479.html


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## ronfifer

thanks


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## ronfifer (Dec 27, 2021)

my btr3k just died after 1 week. not turning on anymore, not recognized by the PC...I didnt even attempt firmware upgrade. Was just using it normally for TV watching via Bluetooth and it suddenly stopped turning on or respond to charging attempts.


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## FiiO

ronfifer said:


> my btr3k just died after 1 week. not turning on anymore, not recognized by the PC...I didnt even attempt firmware upgrade. Was just using it normally for TV watching via Bluetooth and it suddenly stopped turning on or respond to charging attempts.


Dear friend,

Sorry about that.
Please follow this instruction to check whether the issue remains:https://www.fiio.com/newsinfo/477737.html

Best regards


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## TooPoorForHiFi

@FiiO Does BTR3K Support Car Mode?


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## FiiO

TooPoorForHiFi said:


> @FiiO Does BTR3K Support Car Mode?


Yes, the BTR3K can support. 

Best regards


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## SlimCharles

The cover of my BTR3K fell of suddenly. Seems like the glue crystalized and stopped doing its job. What would be the appropiate product to glue it again?


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## BenF

SlimCharles said:


> The cover of my BTR3K fell of suddenly. Seems like the glue crystalized and stopped doing its job. What would be the appropiate product to glue it again?


Happened to my Shanling UP2 couple years ago:



Had to buy a new one...


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## FiiO

SlimCharles said:


> The cover of my BTR3K fell of suddenly. Seems like the glue crystalized and stopped doing its job. What would be the appropiate product to glue it again?


Sorry about that.
You may try to use the B-7000 glue for sticking the back panel again.   
Best regards


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## SlimCharles

Thanks!

Fiio responded to me here quicker than by email lmao.


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## ikjadoon

My FiiO BTR3K has been acting up recently. It's only ~9 months old, but seems like it's ready to die.


It will not power on ~80% of the time. I can press and hold the power button for 1 second, 3 second, 10 second, or 30 second intervals as recommended. The lights never turn on. It doesn't reset. 
It will stay on the red light forever, even when unplugged. 
It does not show up in the Fiio app, it can't be connected to via its only paired device (an iPhone 12 Pro), nor on the 20% times it does turn on + connected to a PC, Device Manager states "This device cannot start. (Code 10)". It is recognized as a FiiO BTR3K, however! Pressing and holding the multi-function button for 5 seconds to turn on DFU Mode (blinking red & blue lights), however, does nothing.
It was last working ~30 minutes ago, when it showed 60% charge (charging was on, car mode was on).
I updated the firmware to 1.3 almost 9 months ago and there does not seem to be a newer firmware. 
I'm a little concerned it's died so early, but thankfully within the warranty. I've also emailed FiiO support: let's see. 🙏


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## ballog

SlimCharles said:


> The cover of my BTR3K fell of suddenly. Seems like the glue crystalized and stopped doing its job. What would be the appropiate product to glue it again?


@SlimCharles hello there. Same happened to mine. In my case it was the battery which swelled and popped off the back cover. I would advise you to check battery too. If the back cover doesn't sit flush it certainly the battery turning bad. Has the battery life of your BTR3K significantly shortened? Mine did. This seems to be a common issue with the BTR3K.


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## JAnonymous5150

SlimCharles said:


> The cover of my BTR3K fell of suddenly. Seems like the glue crystalized and stopped doing its job. What would be the appropiate product to glue it again?



I'd recommend applying Locktite with a toothpick so you use the smallest amout possible. Once it dries it will hold fast and you don't need to apply a lot for it to do so. I have repaired IEM shells, headphone headband joints, strain relief to housing joints, and much more. When solid hold and no flexing in tight seems that will only allow for small amounts of adhesive Locktite is my go to. Good luck!


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## borkenarrou

Can the BTR3 work as a BT transmitter in USB DAC mode, or it only output via 3.5mm.


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## JAnonymous5150

borkenarrou said:


> Can the BTR3 work as a BT transmitter in USB DAC mode, or it only output via 3.5mm.



The BTR3 doesn't work as a transmitter.


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## FiiO

borkenarrou said:


> Can the BTR3 work as a BT transmitter in USB DAC mode, or it only output via 3.5mm.


Dear friend,

The BTR3 is only a Bluetooth receiver so it could not support the function you mentioned. 
You could consider our BTA30Pro if you would prefer BT transmisson in USB DAC mode. 


Best regards


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