# The Little Dot Mk IV /  SE Impressions Thread



## Tiramisu515

Dear Mk IV / se lovers,
  
 Today, I thought I start The Little Dot Mk / Se Appreciation Thread for all Mk IV lovers to contribute and enjoy.
  
 This thread would be dedicated to you and shall be a place for us to share our joy as well as to learn from one another.
  
 You may share everything here as long as it is about the Mk IV/se such as the following:
  
 1. Pictures of your rig with the Mk IV/se of course
 2. Share your set up. What source and headphones you pair with your Mk IV
 3. Tube rolling
 4. Sound impression with your rig
 5. Ask fellow Mk IV owners questions pertaining to the MK IV/se
 6. Problems with your Mk IV
 7. Etc, etc, etc.
  
 Please be polite of course.
  
 Enjoy and I look forward for your wonderful contributions.
  
 Here's my combo.. with a beyer DT-990 (600)
  
 How I have decided to own a Mk IV/se is because of the following:
  
 1. Great value for the buck (always a high priority for me)
 2. Great quality parts that goes into the Mk IV/se
 3. Great customer services such as prompt email reply, trouble shooting and shipment (experienced by many users here)
 4. Reliability based on all the above.
 5. Great sounding and able to pair with the best sounding headphones out there such as the Senn, Beyer etc.


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## .Sup

My setup is as follows: iPod digital out>Audio GD reference 5 DSP> LD IV SE>HD600
   
  gain setting set at max
   
  Soon I will be getting HD800 so I'll post some impressions about how good it pairs with the LD here.
   
  Some photos here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/sups_photos/sets/72157624864191755/with/5004790292/


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## rosgr63

Nice thread!
   
  My LD MKIV SE is the first tube amp I bought.
  It was a nice way to get into tubes, best value for the money.
  It tied me over nicely while my main tube amp was getting built.
   
  I like the SQ and have done a lot of tube rolling.
  Currently i used it with my DT-880.
   
  And David's service is first class.


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## .Sup

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> Nice thread!
> 
> My LD MKIV SE is the first tube amp I bought.
> It was a nice way to get into tubes, best value for the money.
> ...


 
  hehe it was my 1st tube amp as well. One of the best purchases I have ever made. I later on bought the Starving Student just to see what all the fuss was about. I guess I was a bit spoiled by the time I got it as I thought it was absolute rubbish compared to the LD IV 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  I haven't done any tube rolling though. Is it worth it?
   
  and indeed David's service really is 1st. class, probably the best I have ever encountered


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## rosgr63

Tube rolling was a nice exercise, tried the DR super tubes some Mullards, Western Electric, RCA, Raytheon to name some.


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## .Sup

How were the stock tubes compared to other?


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## rosgr63

Not bad but can get different results from other tubes.


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## Tiramisu515

.Sup
   
  may I ask what interconnect you use for your MK IV se. seen the pic and it looked good. care to tell me more about it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





.sup said:


> My setup is as follows: iPod digital out>Audio GD reference 5 DSP> LD IV SE>HD600
> 
> gain setting set at max
> 
> ...


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## Tiramisu515

Hi rosgr63
   
  great of you to contribute in this thread. Can you kindly share your rig journey since the Mk IV se? Your latest rig or plan?
   
  This would be good to share, cos it enable us to see how Mk IV se users has upgraded their system. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 hope\ to learn more from you.
   
  Pics any?
  
  Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> Nice thread!
> 
> My LD MKIV SE is the first tube amp I bought.
> It was a nice way to get into tubes, best value for the money.
> ...


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## Tiramisu515

Hi rosgr63,
   
  I am keen to try the DR super tubes. Where did you get it. How's the price? I understand this is very expensive tube but sound super!
  Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> Tube rolling was a nice exercise, tried the DR super tubes some Mullards, Western Electric, RCA, Raytheon to name some.


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## rosgr63

I got them from ebay.
  They are expensive, but nice.
  I would recommend you try different Drivers first as they will give you more of a change than the Power Tubes.
  I would say you'll get 30% change from the Power Tubes and 70% from the Drivers.
  I got a few Drivers of a Singaporean Head-Fier, I'll pass you his details later on via PM, he might have some left.


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## rosgr63

Quote:


tiramisu515 said:


> Hi rosgr63
> 
> great of you to contribute in this thread. Can you kindly share your rig journey since the Mk IV se? Your latest rig or plan?
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  My Tube Amp journey started with a LD MK IV SE, then continued with a Single Power Extreme and a Current Eddie Balancing Act.
  I've always been a SS person so I bought my LD so I could get a feel for tube amps. I liked it a lot and so I decided to get a SP as well.
  Along the way I've learned a lot about tubes and tube amps and fell in love with my all time favourite tube the 6SN7.
  Despite the fact that one of my 6SN7 drivers costs more than the LD and the numerous Power and Driver tubes I have, I still enjoy my LD.


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## .Sup

Quote: 





tiramisu515 said:


> .Sup
> 
> may I ask what interconnect you use for your MK IV se. seen the pic and it looked good. care to tell me more about it?
> 
> ...


 

 its actually a generic pair of 2 coaxial cables from Vivanco


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## jr41

Hi all! I'm excited to be shortly joining the ranks; David e-mailed me with a shipping number earlier advising me my MK IV SE is en-route. Great idea to create an appreciation thread Tiramisu515! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  The MK IV will be my first true (I have a Little Dot MK I+ Hybrid) tube headphone amp too and will play the centrepiece in my first serious head-fi setup. I've gone with Little Dot's DAC_I as the source. Both will be pairing up to drive the HD 650, which I hope in turn will propel me to audio nirvana.
   
  Woo amps seem to get all the limelight and I was seriously considering the WooAudio 3 but it was pushing my budget a bit too far. The MK IV SE is a good deal cheaper than the 3 (when taking into account the pre-amp option) and the comments I've read indicate there's really not much in it. Likewise, rosgr63, I'm encouraged to read that you still enjoy the MK IV despite having some serious tube amps in your collection!
   
  Enjoy your MK IV's everyone and as soon as I get mine I'll be sure to post some impressions and pics.


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## rosgr63

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> Hi all! I'm excited to be shortly joining the ranks; David e-mailed me with a shipping number earlier advising me my MK IV SE is en-route. Great idea to create an appreciation thread Tiramisu515!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Please keep us updated, hope it arrives soon.


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## .Sup

jr don't forget the amp need lots of burn-in and tubes also.
   
  I thought I read somewhere that David stopped IV SE production and was only making regular IVs because the tubes in the SE were hard to get. Good to see they are available again.
   
  enjoy your new LD when it arrives jr


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## jr41

Thanks guys. I read through Penchum's useful review thread and all following posts, which mentioned the long burn-in time. The HD 650 also need plenty of burn-in time apparently so I'll resist judgement until both are fully settled down.
   
  If I recall correctly, again from reading Penchum's thread, the first batch of SEs were wired for a particular premium tube which Little Dot had aquired a stock of. When that stock ran out I believe LD initially planned to stop production, but then decided to adapt the SE so it could accept the same family of tubes as the non SE MK IV so they could continue selling it.


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## wudai_e

The only problem I have with LD IV SE are the power tubes made from EH. They seem to have quality control issues. 2 out of 4 tubes died early and create lots of hiss and pop in one channel. Made me stay out of future tube gear. I love tube rolling but hate to buy new tubes every now and then simply because of a bad tube.


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## furyagain

I also just got the MKIVse with a MKVII+
  and have them both conected to my LD DAC1
   
  David 's services is really good,
  he answer all my questions with in a day ( from tube rolling to trouble shoot)
   
  I really recommand getting what i have now,
  as the DAC have both output , RCA and XLR 3pin (2x)
  i have the RCA connect to MKIVse and the balanced XLR to MKVII+
  and i have both setting playing the same song
   
  good for comparing
   
  I do love using T1 and HD800 with the MKIVse and the D7000 with the MKVII+( but need ohm adapter , as just like the MKV MKVII+ give me hissing  when use with D7000( low ohm headphones)
   
  the only complaint is...
  I am using the lowest gain setting ( 3)
  when i tried to set to (4) the right channel sound abit louder
   
  but i really don't need the reason to go high gain with all my headphones.
   all around 9-10o clock the volume nub


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## Stevtt

I actually got rid of my home setup and went portable. Just a couple months ago I started looking at my vinyl collection, couldn't stand it anymore and had to start all over. I went with a Mk IV SE to play with the tubes and take time to decide what I was going with next but I like it. I'm using it off my Music Hall mmf 7.1 through a Jolida D9 into a set of Beyer 880's.  I'm running the pre-amp out through a Cambridge 640R on 2 channel to speakers. I also have the gain low.


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## lescanard

I'm pleased to say my MKIV arrived today and I am quite happy as a first impression. I'm using it with my DT990s (600ohm) - fed from my DacMagic. I swapped out the stock drivers immediately for some Western Electric 403Bs that I just recently bought on eBay. It sounds great out of the box but I'm burning it in for a while as well. I had an MKIII previously which I sold - I was surprised at how much bigger the MKIV is - solid as a tank.
   
  My 1 small issue is the jumpers. The old MKIII had switches which made changing the settings for tube families quite easy. I've only glanced at it but can't see how I'm going to easily move the jumpers to change to EF91/92 tubes. I have many of these types of tubes and I tend to favor them. Has anyone done this - and any advice. The holes are pretty small - I couldn't really get a hold of the jumpers with needle nose pliers very easily - any tips or advice on this?


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## jr41

Congratulations lescanard. How would you say the sound compaires to your old MK III?
   
  Mine hasn't arrived yet so I can't answer your question RE changing jumpers. Once it's arrived, and if I discover anything useful in this regard, I'll let you know.


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## Tiramisu515

wow, looks like we have a few new MK IV/se owners.... That is great to know. Hopefully, we will take the journey together and share as much as possible.
   
  As for the jumper thingy. I too find it alittle too much hassle. I mean, the design should have been more user friendly. Any guru who has been switching jumper, please advice if you may. I am sure it would be beneficial to all of us trying to tube roll with the Mk IV/se.
   
  cheers!


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## rosgr63

I think you'll be able to find quite a few tubes to roll without having to change the jumpers.
  But I agree a simpler way would have been better.


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## lescanard

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> Congratulations lescanard. How would you say the sound compaires to your old MK III?
> 
> Mine hasn't arrived yet so I can't answer your question RE changing jumpers. Once it's arrived, and if I discover anything useful in this regard, I'll let you know.


 

 Thanks - I'm really just starting with the MKIV. I didn't own my DT990s when I had the MKIII - basically I was using it primarily with my K701s and although it's a really nice amp - as an OTL design it's better suited I think with higher impedance phones which the K701s are not. My M-Stage does a stellar job with the AKGs - I guess I just didn't have a good headphone match for the MKIII when I had it. I was listening a bit last night with my DT990s and was really impressed with the detail and soundstage of this amp and expect it will only get better.

  
  Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> I think you'll be able to find quite a few tubes to roll without having to change the jumpers.
> But I agree a simpler way would have been better.


 

 I've experienced and accumulated quite a few tubes (with the MKIII previously and my LDI+ currently). I really think the EF91/EF92 tubes are my favorites and I have quite a few so I'm going to need to figure out how to change the jumpers easily.
   
  Some of the best tubes I've heard the past 2 years include CV4015/Mullard 8161 (EF92), and my absolute favorites which are Mullard EF91/Blue Glass (6AM6). I would highly suggest people try this family of tubes - incredibly rich, smooth and deep tight bass are characteristics I think they excel in. They will be really good mates with my DT990s which are strong on the low end.


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## .Sup

Why do the jumpers need to be changed? I though they were for impedance only


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## lescanard

Quote: 





.sup said:


> Why do the jumpers need to be changed? I though they were for impedance only


 

 The way my new MKIV is set up (slightly different than the way the MKIII was) is explained from the manual below:
   
_"The Little Dot MK IV / SE has three jumper pins per channel that allow two different types of driver tubes. You can access the pins through the amplifier’s bottom panel, and they are located to the sides of the pair of capacitors closest to the front of the amplifier. Please power off the amplifier, and unplug it for at least 10 minutes before attempting to change the jumper settings._
   
_If the jumper cap is covering pins 1 and 2 (M8100ff), the following driver tubes may be used:_
_ *WE403A * *5654*, CK5654, GL5654, 5591, *CV4010*, CV5216, CV8246, 6069, CV10442  *EF95*, *M8100*, 6AK5W, CV10100, CV8159, CV8225, CV850  *6J1*_
   
_If the jumper cap is placed to cover pins 2 and 3 (EF92 side), the following driver tubes may be used:_
_ *EF92*, *6CQ6*, CV2023, V884, VP6, *M8161 * *EF91*, 6AM6, CV10327, *CV138*, CV1955, CV2195, Z77  *CV131*, 9D6, W77_
_Any other equivalents or drop-in replacements for the above-mentioned tubes (both sets) may also be used. "_
   
  So basically you need to somehow wedge some tweezers down the 2 very small holes - remove the jumpers which are by default on pins 1/2 and replace each back on pins 2/3. My old MKIII simply had switches like you see on the bottom of the MKIV to adjust the gain. I believe Little Dot went away from the switches and back to jumpers because of some issues they were having. 
   
  The reason this is so important at least for me - is I have about 35-40 tubes I've collected - at least 2/3 are of the EF92/91 families and as I said - they tend to sound best to me. I should also note - the manual that came with my amp must be old - I received a more updated manual from David via email that correctly explains this. The physical manual I rec'd is actually wrong - it's important that new owners get the updated manual. 
   
  If you don't have it - here is the link:
   
  http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6037680/Little%20Dot%20MK%20IV%20SE%20Reference%20Guide.pdf


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## kwang411

I own the LD Mk IV SE too, my set up is: Asus Xonar STX --> LD Mk IV SE --> HD800
   
  I find that this set up is very bright with HD800, but i'm not quite sure what exactly is causing it.
  I've plugged my HD800 into my receiver downstairs, and I know for certain that HD800 is capable of delivering warm-neutral-ish sound.
  i think the LD is supposed to sound quite neutral, maybe slightly to the warm side (since it's tube amp), so I guess maybe it's the STX thats very cold and bright?
   
  What do you guys think? Thanks


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## jr41

Hi kwang411, I'm not sure what could be causing your problem. What gain setting do you have you amplifier on? From previous reading I believe it's recommended to have the HD 650 on gain 10. Since the HD 800 is also 300 ohm, it may be that 10 is also the best setting for the HD 800. I recall comments were made that adjusting the gain affected sound (particularly bass), but whether it will address an overly bright sound I'm not sure.
   
  Have you got another source you could use to determine whether the Xonar is the cause?


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## .Sup

Quote: 





kwang411 said:


> I own the LD Mk IV SE too, my set up is: Asus Xonar STX --> LD Mk IV SE --> HD800
> 
> I find that this set up is very bright with HD800, but i'm not quite sure what exactly is causing it.
> I've plugged my HD800 into my receiver downstairs, and I know for certain that HD800 is capable of delivering warm-neutral-ish sound.
> ...


 
  if your operational system is either Vista or Windows 7 then your music will sound bright, that's why I don't use PC as the transport any more. Windows Xp has a much more neutral sound, you should try it if you haven't already.
   
   
  Thanks for the PDF lescanard


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## jr41

Quote: 





.sup said:


> if your operational system is either Vista or Windows 7 then your music will sound bright, that's why I don't use PC as the transport any more. Windows Xp has a much more neutral sound, you should try it if you haven't already.


 
   
  Really? I don't recall noticing a difference in this regard when switching from XP to 7. Perhaps my system wasn't resolving enough at the time (and it was a long time ago!). As I understand it, if you use something like WASAPI with Foobar2000, you bypass any OS specific sound processing, so this may be something to try if the OS really has that much of a bearing on sound signature.


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## HeatFan12

Proud MKIVSE owner for 2+ years....
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  In reference to the jumpers, a while back they were selling some extended jumpers on ebay for the MKIV that were very easy to change.  I did a quick search, however atm nothing came up.  Maybe an email to David.


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## kwang411

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> Hi kwang411, I'm not sure what could be causing your problem. What gain setting do you have you amplifier on? From previous reading I believe it's recommended to have the HD 650 on gain 10. Since the HD 800 is also 300 ohm, it may be that 10 is also the best setting for the HD 800. I recall comments were made that adjusting the gain affected sound (particularly bass), but whether it will address an overly bright sound I'm not sure.
> 
> Have you got another source you could use to determine whether the Xonar is the cause?


 

 My gain setting is on 4, because 5 and 10 are just way too loud for me. Even at 4, i only need to turn my LD to 3 or at most 4 for normal listening sessions.
  I've tried different gains, but didn't really find much difference in sound, especially won't help the brightness at all.
  I don't have any other proper source other than my STX..
   
  Maybe the HD800 sounded warm when i tried it downstairs is because the DVD player has really cheap DAC chip, creating the rolled off treble and fat bass


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## kwang411

Quote: 





.sup said:


> if your operational system is either Vista or Windows 7 then your music will sound bright, that's why I don't use PC as the transport any more. Windows Xp has a much more neutral sound, you should try it if you haven't already.
> 
> 
> Thanks for the PDF lescanard


 
  Hmm, interesting, I've never heard this before. But I definitely won't be going back to XP though, I like Win7 much better


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## .Sup

fat bass lol. I was thinking that it could be a driver issue, you know the brightness in Win7 and Vista. I did try Asio4all and it didn't change anything, the brightness was still there. with 4 different PCs all using the same Microsoft usb audio driver. I also tried some driver (I forgot its name) that you have to purchase, I tried the trial, and while it did sound different, not necessarily better, it was still overly bright. Media players used were Winamp and Foobar.


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## lescanard

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Proud MKIVSE owner for 2+ years....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks HeatFan - I emailed David and basically he said tweezers were the recommended tool. The hole is so deep I'm afraid if I screw up I'll drop the jumper inside the unit. I'm going to look out for extended jumpers cause I'll be changing frequently - esp. to get my beloved Mullard EF91s on this beast.
   
  That being said - I've been running the WE 403Bs and they sound truly glorious with my DT990s. The gorgeous tones are so fine - the mids and especially the low end are so incredibly refined - I wasn't hearing this on my M-Stage with the Beyers. I tried the K701s last night for a short while and they sounded ok but a bit thin compared to when they are paired w/ my M-Stage - but I really bought the amp for the 990s. The K701s have beautiful detail IMO - I'm not sure that they really shine with tube amps vs a nice SS choice.
   
  What a great amp - I can't wait to spend more time with it.


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## rosgr63

les you might want to try the Mullard M8100, they are great.
  The K701 shine with the more powerful amps be it tube or SS.
  Grado and HD650 are very good with the LD MKIVSE.


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## lescanard

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> les you might want to try the Mullard M8100, they are great.
> The K701 shine with the more powerful amps be it tube or SS.
> Grado and HD650 are very good with the LD MKIVSE.


 

 Thanks rosgr63 - I have a couple of pairs of the 8100s and used to run them quite a bit in my MKIII. I thought they were great with my old Grado 325s - I'll certainly try them in my MKIVs - I'm really enjoying the Beyers with my NOS WE403Bs right now.
   
  For those who are interested in rolling tubes - it took me quite a while to figure out the numbers and equivalents of all of the various family of tubes. Another Head-Fier posted this (I think on the MKIII website) and it was incredibly helpful when I was scouring eBay for tubes - so here it is for anyone who wants it:
   
   
*EF91* = 6AM6 = Z77 = 6F12 = 8D3 = N79 = CV138 = 6064 = M8083 = CV4014
   
*EF92* = 6CQ6 = W77 = 6F21 = 9D6 = CV131 = 6065 = M8161 = CV4015
   
*EF95* = 6AK5 = 6j1p = 6069 = 6F32V = 6F32 = 5654 = 6ZH1P = M8100= 403A [=408a {heads up, higher heater voltages}]


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## lescanard

So I thought I would list some of my favorite tubes I've accumulated over the past couple of years in case anyone is inclined to pick some up and try them. Most of these were purchased via eBay when I owned my MKIII - I'm looking forward to trying them in my new MKIV when I get the time.
   
   
  VOSHOD - Russians (6ZHIP-EV) - EF95 - can be found really cheap online - huge favorites with MKIII owners - everyone should have a set or 2.

   
  Mullard 8083/CV4014 - EF91 - great tubes with my AKGs - both k701s and k271s - I found these to be natural and not too overly warm - stellar with acoustic music (guitars) - really detailed IMO

   
  Mullard 8161 - EF92 - I thought these were particularly good with my old Grado 325is - they seem SMOOOOTH and helped to tame the natural brightness in these phones.

   
  Mullard 8100/CV4010 - EF95 - rosgr63 mentioned these earlier.

   
  Mullard EF91/6AM6 - Blue Glass - simply my favorite - currently in my LDI+ - soon to be tried in my MKIV - awesome and they look sexy! Tons of detail - really smooth in the lows - just are stellar with my k701s

   
  GE-5-Stars (EF95) - many people rave about these tubes - you can find them pretty readily - but they can be over-priced so you have to shop around.


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## rosgr63

Nice work les.
  I also enjoy my SR325is a lot.
  The only cans I didn't like with the LD MKIVSE are the Maestro GMP400.


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## Tiramisu515

Acknowledging individual preferences in sound, is it possible for tube rollers here to work toward a reference for tube recommendation with the Mk IV/se using a couple of widely appreciated headphones such as HD 650, HD 600, DT-990, DT-880, AKG 701 etc or even HD 800 and T1. Of course, with an explanation for the recomendation.
   
  eg if it is a HD 650, what would be the best combination of driver and power tubes in MK IV/se.


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## rosgr63

Mullard M8100 + Stock Power Tubes + HD650 or Grado SR325is or DT880


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## .Sup

I have completed my balanced to unbalanced interconnect
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sups_photos/5030589945/lightbox/
   
  sounds amazing through my LD and its still burning in!


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## Stevtt

Oh, that's nice


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## Tiramisu515

Quote: 





.sup said:


> I have completed my balanced to unbalanced interconnect
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/sups_photos/5030589945/lightbox/
> 
> sounds amazing through my LD and its still burning in!
> ...


 


 Hi . Sup
   
  Neat work there! I am assuming you are using this to hook up a dac with a balance output to the mk IV? I have always been curious, how does it improve the sound? cheers mate.


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## jr41

My MK IV SE arrived Friday, but sadly it's been plagued with a problem I'm unable to pin-point. The first evening of firing it up I enjoyed a listening session of sonic bliss. Even straight-out-of-the box - with an also brand new HD 650 and source (the Little Dot DAC_I) - the sound was very impressive. It was more engaging, alive, detailed and realistic compared to anything I'd heard up until this point - this is the closest I've ever come to feeling like I'm listening to a live performance from audio equipment.
   
  However, the next morning - eager to repeat the experience - I fired the amp up and left it playing to warm-up and continue the burn-in while I went about the morning's duties. Upon putting the phones on my head to settle down to another listening session, I could hear a very clear rustling/crackling/squeaking sound coming from the left channel. I could hear this noise with the volume set to 0 and the source turned off. I wasn't too worried initially, I'd read many accounts of tube pins becoming oxidised during transit, and so got to work cleaning all tube pins with isopropyl alcohol. This didn't solve the problem, so I decided to try swapping the tubes around (driver first, power second) so see if I had a dodgy tube. I also checked the gain switches and moved them back and forth several times. None of this made a difference either.
   
  To cut a long story short, I repeated swapping tubes and moving the gain switches a good number of times to try to pin-point the issue. During this trouble-shooting, the issue moved to the right channel and then back to left, however I have never heard the noise from both channels during the same listening session. I have also been unable to identify a gain switch or tube as the cause, because while the issue did move back and forth channel, it does not move with the adjustment/re-positing of any of these components. I have followed literally every recommendation in the troubleshooting guide (swapped fuse, power plug, checked tube jumper position and turned off all electrical equipment in vicinity and moved the amp to a different location), I've also tried the HD 650 in a different amp and used a different source with the MK IV to be sure.
   
  Today I purchased some electrical contact cleaner to clean the tube pins, sockets and gain switches as I understand this can be more effective at cleaning electrical components than isopropyl alcohol. I've been in touch with David who directed me to follow the trouble-shooting guide but hasn't offered any other suggestions so far. If the contact cleaner doesn't do the trick (I'm doubtful it will as the tube pins look clean to me), then I see no alternative than to send the amp back, and I'll be insisting Little Dot pay postage.
   
  If anyone has any further ideas or tricks I'd be grateful to hear them. I'm loathed to send the amp back, as after hearing its potential, I'm really keen to start enjoying it.


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## rosgr63

jr, I suggest you clean the pins using wire wool.
  To me it sounds like a tube problem.
  You could have 2 bad tubes so when you swap them over the problem doesn't go.
  Another option would be to buy a couple of cheap but tested drivers (Mullard M8100 as you're in UK) and see if that solves the problem.
  Good Luck


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## jr41

The contact cleaner hasn't worked. I'll try wire wool, thanks for the suggestion.


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## jr41

I tried wire wool, but that didn't make a difference (although it did clean the pins up noticeably). I then swapped the driver tubes into my Little Dot MK I+ (I really should have thought of that sooner!) and could hear no interference at all. As such I e-mailed David and he's supplied me with return details and offered to pay the shipping fee.


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## lescanard

I'm sorry to hear about your situation - it's hard enough to wait for something like this in the first place. This is my third LD product and I've never had a problem (knock on wood) - but David seems to be a fair person who cares about his customers so I'm sure he'll make it right and I hope you are in business soon.
   
  On another note - I'm currently running some GE 5-Stars is my MKIV and they really have what I would describe as a detailed SS - not as warm/tubey as the EF91/92s - but really powerful and tight in the lows which match well with my DT990s. Great tube - you need to shop around and find a reasonable price on eBay because many LD MKIII owners seem to favor these and they tend to be over-priced.  
  
  Quote: 





jr41 said:


> I tried wire wool, but that didn't make a difference (although it did clean the pins up noticeably). I then swapped the driver tubes into my Little Dot MK I+ (I really should have thought of that sooner!) and could hear no interference at all. As such I e-mailed David and he's supplied me with return details and offered to pay the shipping fee.


----------



## Tiramisu515

My customised volume knob. Nice?
   
  Mirror(polished) finished. Incredibly reflective. This knob is heavy as it is made of solid brass and plated in Gold. Feels solid! The weight gives a really good feel when turning the knob.


----------



## rosgr63

Very nice!


----------



## .Sup

Nice indeed. I see you also changed the screws from black to silver on the Neutrik lock on plug


----------



## Tiramisu515

Quote: 





.sup said:


> Nice indeed. I see you also changed the screws from black to silver on the Neutrik lock on plug


 

 indeed, and also changed the screws of the MK IV face plate to silver.


----------



## jr41

Very classy!


----------



## Tiramisu515

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> I tried wire wool, but that didn't make a difference (although it did clean the pins up noticeably). I then swapped the driver tubes into my Little Dot MK I+ (I really should have thought of that sooner!) and could hear no interference at all. As such I e-mailed David and he's supplied me with return details and offered to pay the shipping fee.


 


 Hi Jr41,
  What is the status of your amp now. Have you send it back to David for a replacement?
   
  Keep us updated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Tiramisu515


----------



## jr41

I shipped the amp back to Little Dot on Friday last week. It probably won't get to them until some time next week. David advised testing/repair/replacement could take up to three weeks, and then it's got to be shipped back of course. So I'm probably going to be without my amp for some time yet. I'm glad Little Dot agreed to pay return shipping as the cost was £65! I can't believe how much UK international shipping charges are.

 I'm burning the HD 650 in on my Little Dot I+, but it's no way near the same (not to take anything away from the I+, it's a budget amp). Although my time with the MK IV SE was brief I'm missing it very much.

 I may research and buy a few different, well regarded, driver tubes for the MK IV in the interim to keep me occupied. The I+ and IV SE are able to share a lot of the same tube types, which is a bonus.
  Thanks for your interest and I'll keep you abreast of developments


----------



## rosgr63

Hope it gets back asap, meantime enjoy your LDI+.


----------



## lescanard

Well, I switched the internal jumpers today to the EF91/92 tube setting and rolled in my favorite Mullard EF91 Blue Glass tubes so I'm looking forward to enjoying these for a while. Not easy to get at the jumpers, a bit of a pain actually. I used tweezers, but I think a pair of hemostats may be the tool of choice. 

 I have been listening to my DT990s and they sound fantastic. I'm getting the itch maybe to get the DT880s, any comments on the Beyer DT880s paired with the MKIV from anyone?


----------



## rosgr63

I have used the DTE880/250Ohm and they are not that bad.
  My preferred cans at the moment for the LD MKIVSE are the HD650.


----------



## jr41

I just got an e-mail from David advising Little Dot have my amp (it sure took a long time to get there from the UK!) along with a PayPal refund for the postage costs.
   
  I've asked David to let me know what is wrong with the amp and for Little Dot to perform an extended testing/listening once they think they've fixed it as I really don't want it going wrong again!


----------



## .Sup

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> I have used the DTE880/250Ohm and they are not that bad.
> My preferred cans at the moment for the LD MKIVSE are the HD650.


 


  hehe and HD600 are my preferred for IV


----------



## rosgr63

Any of you on a Mac?


----------



## lescanard

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> Any of you on a Mac?


 

 I am on a Mac - Macbook->Airport Express->DacMagic_>Little Dot


----------



## rosgr63

les I recommend you download and try the AyreWave player http://sbooth.org/AyreWave/ and let us know what you think of it.


----------



## Katun

Nice thread!
   
  Nice picture in OP Tiramisu515! That alone makes me want that combo!
   
  (In fact, I think I may get that exact same thing...)


----------



## Tiramisu515

haha, I take that as a complement 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . The beyer DT-990 (600) is selling at an amazing price on amazon.com.  Do check it out.
  
  Quote: 





katun said:


> Nice thread!
> 
> Nice picture in OP Tiramisu515! That alone makes me want that combo!
> 
> (In fact, I think I may get that exact same thing...)


----------



## jr41

Good news, David e-mailed to say that my MK IV SE is on its way back to me - finally! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Can't wait to get it back and start enjoying it again.


----------



## rosgr63

Good news indeed.
  Did David mention what was wrong with your amp?


----------



## jr41

Thanks rosgr63 - I never managed to determine what was actually wrong, despite asking. I've received good service from Little Dot overall, but having said that, they were less communicative than I would have liked when the amp was back with them for the diagnosis period. I believe they're sending a replacement as opposed to repairing the unit I originally received.
   
  I was inclined to push the issue with them but after getting a little stroppy, and subsequently realising I had actually got the time period the amp had been with them wrong, I thought I had better reel it in a little. I just hope this one works correctly as otherwise I'll be asking for a refund.


----------



## psone

subscribed!
   
  this is my new favourite thread, I'll be purchasing my MK IV in the next week or two, I'm finding it incredibly difficult not to just hit my credit card
  up for it right now!! anyway this will be my first headphone amp and I'll be pairing it with my DT880's and using my Bravura's line out as a
  source until i can scrape some more pennies together to grab a LD DAC_I
   
  thanks for all the info folks, you've already answered a ton of my questions i didn't even know i had.


----------



## Tiramisu515

Dear psone,

 Welcome to this forum and particularly this thread. Hope you will enjoy your stay here!  . I am quite sure you will like the MK IV, paired with the DT-880. This combo has been tested and appreciated for quite a while now, so you won't go wrong.
   
  tiramisu515
  Quote: 





psone said:


> subscribed!
> 
> this is my new favourite thread, I'll be purchasing my MK IV in the next week or two, I'm finding it incredibly difficult not to just hit my credit card
> up for it right now!! anyway this will be my first headphone amp and I'll be pairing it with my DT880's and using my Bravura's line out as a
> ...


----------



## psone

Thanks Tiramisu515,
   
  i am officially addicted to the forums!
   
  As for MKIV i really can't wait to get a hold of it, I've read nothing but good things about it and in particular it in combination with the 880s, so I'm fairly confident i won't
  be disappointed. i think i may have to pull the trigger on it sooner rather than later!


----------



## Tiramisu515

Glowing tubes on the MK IV SE.. really nice and warm.


----------



## rosgr63

Nice photo!
  psone the DTE880 and LD MKIVSE are a nice combination, you will not be disappointed for sure.


----------



## jr41

Welcome to the club psone. Do you have the 600 ohm DT880? I too have read they're an excellent pairing with the MK IV so I'm sure you'll enjoy it. I brought the MK IV SE to pair with the HD 650 as my first serious setup, but I hope to invest in a few additional headphones in the future, and the 880 600 ohm is on my list.
   
  The DAC_I (or any DAC) is a very worthwhile investment to get the best out of your headphone and amp, plus is looks great with the MK IV stacked on top of it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. My MK IV SE is currently on its way back from being repaired, but as soon as it's back in my possession I'll be posting some pictures (though I'm not sure I can match tiramisu515's excellent shots) and more comprehensive impressions - and enjoying its great sound of course.


----------



## psone

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> Nice photo!
> psone the DTE880 and LD MKIVSE are a nice combination, you will not be disappointed for sure.


 
   
  I'm sure i won't be!, it will however be the standard version of the MK IV I'll be getting, my thinking being that i should probably not go too crazy on the spending front with this being my first HP amp and well given that I'm in Ireland if i did want to upgrade to the SE i can't imagine I'd have too much trouble when it came to selling on the standard edition.
   
  These sort of items are almost impossible to find here and tend to get snapped up pretty quick!


      Quote:


jr41 said:


> Welcome to the club psone. Do you have the 600 ohm DT880? I too have read they're an excellent pairing with the MK IV so I'm sure you'll enjoy it. I brought the MK IV SE to pair with the HD 650 as my first serious setup, but I hope to invest in a few additional headphones in the future, and the 880 600 ohm is on my list.
> 
> The DAC_I (or any DAC) is a very worthwhile investment to get the best out of your headphone and amp, plus is looks great with the MK IV stacked on top of it
> 
> ...


 
   
  thanks for the welcome jr41, I have the 250ohm version of the DT880, my thinking being that I'd have to drive them from my Bravura, i had no intention of buying a headamp at the time as well as being under the impression that the higher the ohm the harder to drive( which I've since learned isn't always the case). Either way they are a monumental step up from the XDR-400 I'd been using. oh and i picked them up on Amazon for $175 so...
   
  As for the DAC_I again its a case of hardly anyone having a bad word to say about it, it just seems like the obvious choice...I'd considered grabbing a Hot Audio WOW mainly because from a vfm standpoint they seem hard to beat, but this was before i came across the DAC_I, and now I've got this LD stack in my mind nothing else will do! 
   
  And congratulations on almost having your MK IV back!, hope its all smooth sailing this time around, what i was wondering though, was what were your initial shipping times like? It should be
  fairly similar to here.


----------



## jr41

*@psone*
  That is indeed a good price on the Beyers!
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm trying to remember how long it took for the Little Dot items I've ordered in the past to arrive - I believe it's around 5 days.


----------



## psone

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> *@psone*
> That is indeed a good price on the Beyers!


 
   
  yea i was pretty pleased with myself on that score 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  just placed my order with David so hopefully I'll be a proud MK IV owner in the next couple of weeks.


----------



## rosgr63

Congratulations, let us know what you think of it!


----------



## jr41

Quote: 





psone said:


> [...] just placed my order with David [...]


 
   
  Good work, be sure to let us know how it sounds with your Beyers


----------



## jr41

Finally received my replacement MK IV SE yesterday evening. Naturally I headed straight home and hooked it up for a few hours listening.
   
  Sonic bliss has returned! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'll let the unit burn in and then I'll post some further impressions.
   
  I'll try to take some photos this weekend also - weather (light) permitting.


----------



## rosgr63

Good news,  are you running stock tubes?


----------



## psone

Quote:


jr41 said:


> Finally received my replacement MK IV SE yesterday evening. Naturally I headed straight home and hooked it up for a few hours listening.
> 
> Sonic bliss has returned!


 
   
  Grats! still waiting on mine, did any of you have a problem with your DHL tracking number? David emailed mine a week ago but so far i haven't been able to track the parcel.
   
  I tried using both methods of tracking but no joy so far


----------



## jr41

*@rosgr63*
   
  Thanks. I'm running the stock tubes for the SE, which are the M8100/CV4010 driver tubes and the 6H30PI (Gold-Pin) power tubes at the moment. Once it's burnt in I might try some tube rolling, but one of the reasons I went for the SE was that it comes with the premium tubes out-of-the-box, as I'm not sure how much I want to get into tube rolling (I guess I'll know once I try a couple of different types).
   
*@psone*
   
  Cheers. Yeah, I think there was a problem, as the number David provides might not be a standard tracking number. David did provide a link to use when I sent the item back to China:
   
http://intmail.183.com.cn/item/trace/itemTraceAction.do
   
  Perhaps it'll also work for your parcel. It might be that you have to wait for the package to hit UK shores before the number you have works. Did you try specifying a date range on the 'track by shipper's reference' page on DHL's website? I seem to recall that had something to do with it. You could try phoning DHL with the number you have and see if they can determine the normal tracking number from it?
   
  Regardless, I hope it arrives soon


----------



## rosgr63

jr41 what brand are your M8100/CV4010?


----------



## psone

thanks for the link jr41, sadly that was a no go, i did try playing around with the dates for the shipper's reference but that didn't make any difference.
   
  I dropped David an email yesterday so no doubt I'll here back from him soon enough, i guess I'm just being overly eager 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 There is so much snow here at the moment that even if it was in the country i couldn't see it being delivered til next week anyway


----------



## jr41

*@rosgr63*
   
  I don't know to be honest. The markings on the driver tubes are:
   
  000-4010
  CV4010
  KQDD/K
  83-44


----------



## rosgr63

Most likely Mullard, excellent tubes I use them too.


----------



## nisspug

Hi all,
   
  new to the forums and headphones in general. I'm considering buying an amp for my Grado Sr325is cans and I'm interested in the LD Mk III or Mk IV. Can someone tell me the difference in sound between these two models with the SR325 (low impedance)? 
   
  Rosgr63  - you have these cans don't you? Could you give a mini review of the way they sound with the Mk IV? I play mainly rock, jazz and alt country/folk styles of music and value a strong, deep bass and general transparency. I'm wondering if they would suit me.


----------



## rosgr63

Hello nisspug, welcome to Head-Fi.
  I don't know about the LD III, I can only comment about the LD MKIV SE.
  I like the SR325is with it they sound very nice with rock.
  Great mids but the bass may not be as strong as you woulkd like.
  Any chance you can audition before you buy them?


----------



## lescanard

nisspug said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> 
> ...







Hi nisspug, welcome. I have owned both the 325is' and MKIII (sold both), and currently own the MKIV. I only used the Grados with the MKIII but IMO it was the wrong amp for them. I ended up purchasing the hybrid Little Dot I+ as it is the preferred LD amp with low impedance phones. It was a great match and significantly less expensive. Both the MKIII and MKIV are OTL amps which are ideal for phones at 120+ ohms according to an email I received from David at LD. Not to say that neither would sound good with the 325s, just that the LDI+ is made for phones like the Grados. I would suggest that route, save some money and maybe buy a good DAC as well.


----------



## nisspug

Thanks for the welcomes.
   
  I can't really audition the amps before I buy rosgr63 as I live in Australia. Could you please descibe the bass a bit more with the MkIV and Grados? Does it go deep and does it have weight and impact? I like realistic bass not over-pumped.
   
  Lescanard - interesting that you prefered the LD 1+ with the Grados. Was it mainly the bass that was improved with the smaller amp, due to a better impedance match? Is the MkIV possibly a better match for low impedance cans than the MKIII? I'm also considering building the A47 amp which is a supercharged version of a CMoy. Do you think the LD 1+ would be superior to the A47?


----------



## Hifisound

I have recently ordered MKIV from little dot and am eagerly waiting for the same ( it has been shipped) . Have also ordered Senns HD600. Currently just have Sr60 so this will be my first proper headphone system.
   
  I must say David really has lot of patience and answers all your emails .... Appreciated.
   
  One small dejection for me was I couldn't upgrade my order to SE. I initially placed order for mkiii and then soon upgraded it to mkiv 
  Later I realized the SE would be best (given the very good stock tubes as well as 2 yr warranty) , but by the time I sent the upgrade email, David informed me that it has shipped .... Unfortunate...
   
  Hope to really enjoy standard MKIV + HD600 !!!
   
  Btw any idea if can connect MKIV to power in connections of my NAD372 ? How to ensure its safe for a given amp ?
   
  Thanks and Regards,
  Hifisound


----------



## jr41

*@Hifisound*
   
  Congratulations on going for the MK IV - I'm sure it'll pair very nicely with the HD 600.
   
  As for the MK IV vs. the MK IV SE, I don't think there's a huge difference between the two - I think it's mainly in the tubes and you can buy the tubes used in the SE separately.


----------



## psone

Hey HifiSound, grats on the amp and cans! and welcome to the club 
   
  as far as the nad372 is concerned i'm not familiar with that particular amp but you should be able to run the preamp out from the mkIV into the tape/tuner/aux inputs on it.
   
  There are a couple of threads knocking around regarding using the MKIII/IV as a preamp if your looking for more on information on the subject...


----------



## Hifisound

@jr41
   
  Thanks!!! i am planning to buy ehx 6h30pi and mullard m8161 later, i hope i dont miss the SE then 
  Only thing is the 2 yrs warranty, though if this machine is reliable enough, that should not be a problem..
  Typically what's the best place to buy tubes , ebay ? And what would be resonable prices for above tubes ?
   
  @psone
   
  Thanks!!! Yes I can surely connect it to aux in. But I was thinking of bypassing 372 pre and connecting directly to 372 main in.
  Anyways, as you suggested I will search through various threads...


----------



## lescanard

Quote: 





nisspug said:


> Thanks for the welcomes.
> 
> I can't really audition the amps before I buy rosgr63 as I live in Australia. Could you please descibe the bass a bit more with the MkIV and Grados? Does it go deep and does it have weight and impact? I like realistic bass not over-pumped.
> 
> Lescanard - interesting that you prefered the LD 1+ with the Grados. Was it mainly the bass that was improved with the smaller amp, due to a better impedance match? Is the MkIV possibly a better match for low impedance cans than the MKIII? I'm also considering building the A47 amp which is a supercharged version of a CMoy. Do you think the LD 1+ would be superior to the A47?


 
   
  As I recall nisspug - the bass was definitely much improved on the LDI+ I think. I felt it was a much better presentation - very smooth and took any harshness out of the phones for me anyway. Really had the juice to drive the low impedance phones (I also enjoyed my AKGs with it). I didn't dislike them with the MKIII, just felt that the hybrid LDI+ was a better match and was a really nice budget unit - so much so I sold the MKIII. I was able to swap out op-amps and enjoyed that as well as tube rolling. I never listened to the Grados with the MKIV (they were sold by the time I got it) - and I really love this amp with my Beyers but can't comment on how the Grados would be with it. My impression was that the MKIII/IV are more suited to phones over 120ohms. My Beyers are hi-impedance and it shines with them. I am unfamiliar with the A47 - so no opinions there either, sorry.


----------



## dadong

I'm now a proud owner of a MKIV amp... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  it's a sweet little thing and dealing with David at little dot was smooth as silk.
   
  currently running off an sondigo inferno/ipod touch G1 into a hd555 (waiting for my hd650's to arrive)
   
  Sound is SPECTACULAR. The mids just opened up compaired to when i was running straight off the ipod. bass has more impact now. and i've only used it for 4 hours. can't wait to hear how it sounds with my hd650's and when it's burned in for 100+ hours and with flacs... if it puts a smile on my face at 4 hours and fwir it only get's better i have high expectations.
   
   
  now to fix this freaken ground loop issue. so i can run it off the computer... i heard it can be fixed by constructing a set of interconnects with the shield cut at source end. can anyone help me out with this?


----------



## nisspug

Lescanard-thanks for posting those impressions. Sounds like I should look deeper into the LD+1. Much appreciated.


----------



## .Sup

I received some nice power block with quality plugs and they don't fit into LDs IEC sockets. I looked at its IEC and one pin is thicker than the other. So I can't use it with it. Really too bad.


----------



## jr41

*@dadong*
  Congratulations on getting your MK IV 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Sorry to hear about the ground loop issue though. I've never suffered from the problem myself so I can't offer much assistance, I understand it's got something to do with resistance in a components signal path ground, or a varying in potential between two components connectors ground paths. If you describe your particular setup and the problems you're experiencing someone might be able to help you.
   
  I know you can get various devices which sit in the signal path to eliminate the problem, you can also get cheater plugs - but these really aren't a good idea for obvious reasons.
   
  It might be worth posting your issue in the DIY forum, as people with a strong knowledge of electronics hang out there.


----------



## dadong

K thanks. I've just purchased a used cheap line conditioner and from what i've read that might just fix the issue, though i can' t be sure until it arrives. funny though the hum completely disappear when i listen to any music that has good mids, it's just when the music starts getting quite that it becomes an issue.
   
  other than that these things are hot 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





jr41 said:


> *@dadong*
> Congratulations on getting your MK IV
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## jr41

*@dadong*
  Re-reading your original post, I see you're using an ipod as one of your sources. I wouldn't have thought you'd get mains hum (ground loop) from an ipod as your source, not even if it's plugged in as I believe ipod power adapters aren't grounded.
   
  You might get it from your sound card, I'm not sure (I'm not an expert on this subject).
   
  Sound quality from a sound card can be variable and some are prone to a lot of background noise (as is the case with the on-board sound card in my computer). Also, are you using CD quality lossles audio files or low bit rate MP3s? It could just be the MK IV is more revealing than your previous amplification.


----------



## dadong

@ Jr41
   
  I'm using high bitrate audio tracks + Flac files on foobar 2000. absolutely no problems there.
   
  and yes when i'm using my ipod running off the battery there is absolutely no background noise. once it's plugged into to the computer it's a different story since i thing all usb devices are grounded.
   
  Interesting thing is the more i look into this the more it hints at the EMI from my videocard  hum starts to fluctuate when i move the mouse, though strangely enough is if i use the cheater plug all noise goes a way, so i'm a stump to what the issue actually is. ground loop or EMI at the soundcard.
   
  I could use the cheater plug until the issue is fixed (i've heard that on tube amps the concerquences are terrible), but no way in hell am i gonna risk getting killed before i get a taste of my incoming hd650's XD


----------



## psone

so i finally received my MKIV today and its broken looks like the faceplate has been forcefully removed the volume pot has been broken off
  from the PCB the led is broken, theres a screw missing, the threads that the faceplate screws insert into are all mangled and the rear
  plate is a little loose but seemingly undamaged...
   
  I'm just so disappointed its not even close funny! i just sent a mail to David so i guess i'll have to wait and see what he says. anyway
  here are some pics for your viewing pleasure 
   
  This is how it looked when i unpacked it

   
  sigh...

   
  sigh continued


----------



## jr41

Oh no, that's terrible psone. How gutting it must have been to discover that upon opening 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I imagine that could only have been caused by very poor shipping handling.
   
  I'm sure David will sort everything out for you, but I know that doesn't help ease the shock or the fact you're going to have a longer wait before you get to enjoy your amp.
   
  Incidentally, I did notice the back panels of my replacement amp where a little scuffed. I think Little Dot's packaging is pretty good, but they only use a 'skeleton foam frame'; a solid foam casing may protect better against severe shocks.
   
  I hope you get the issue sorted out quickly - let us know how you get on.


----------



## .Sup

Sorry to hear the bad news psone. Looking at the second photo and I'm thinking-mine got scratches too when I got it, I guess that's how they make em, a bit nonperfect.


----------



## psone

gutted is not the word!
   
  at first i thought it had been searched by customs and that they'd just hacked at it to open it up
  but after inspecting the packaging more closely it doesn't appear to have been tampered with at all.
   
  Poor shipping handling may indeed have been the cause. Initially i was told that DHL were the carrier
  but this then changed to EMS. anyway i'll let you know how i get on.


----------



## psone

quick question jr41, just wondering what method you used when you were returning your amp? did you ship it registered mail or via a carrier like ups/dhl?


----------



## jr41

I shipped mine back via Royal Mail (Parcel Force). It was pretty expensive (around £60-80 if I recall correctly), but luckily Little Dot paid - as they should do in your case too.


----------



## psone

fingers crossed! thanks for the info.


----------



## Ctwombly

Hi all - I'm considering purchasing a Little Dot Mk IV, in large measure based on the great things said here.  I'm a tad confused about where to purchase though -- there's a seller called "audiophilechina.com" on ebay, and also david zhezhe.  Sounds like the latter is the preferred source from folks here, but I'm a tad concerned because the info @ ebay, and on the audiophilechina site is pretty limited.
   
  Also wondering how the LD MkIV compares to the DarkVoice336SE - also available through audiophilechina.com
   
  Thanks for your input.


----------



## psone

hi Ctwombly, i know david sells through ebay under the seller name davidzhezhe its probably the most straight forward way to order, not too sure about
  audiophilechina though, its the first i've heard of it. Alternatively you can organise a sale through david directly just drop him an email at little.tube@gmail.com
  he's incredibly helpful, quick to reply and more than happy to answer any questions you may have 
   
  if you do decide to purchase the MKIV in the end be sure to keep us posted!


----------



## Ctwombly

Thanks for the quick response and helpful info -- will let you know what I do


----------



## dadong

@ ctwombly
   
  it's also cheaper if you order directly from David via his gmail.
   
  @psone
   
  ouch!! thats a terrible scene. can't imagine what i must have felt like when you opened the box. and are you sure customs didn't just rip it apart cause i don't think shipping can cause that kinda damage with LD's packaging.


----------



## Ctwombly

Thanks for the tip dadong -- much appreciated.


----------



## Hifisound

Hi all,
   
  I finally received my MKIV. Looks much much better than its pics on little dot website.
   
  Though , on preliminary inspection, I found there is an issue with volume control. It gets stuck at around 50. If lot of pressure is applied, it goes past 50 and then its smooth till 100.
  I have not yet switched the unit. Do I need to open it once, to see that there are no shipping related damages, before I switch it on ?
   
  Have sent an email to David too for the volume control.
   
  Thanks,
  Hifisound


----------



## saber8689

Received my MKIV a few weeks ago along with a Musiland Monitor 02...I'm very pleased =).
   
  My hd650s have never sounded better! Quick question though, If I want to get into tube rolling, does the mkIV use the same tubes as the mkIII, and if not is there a thread for MKIV tube rolling?


----------



## jr41

*@Hifisound*
  I'm sorry to hear about the issue with the volume pot. I would wait for David's advice rather than opening up the amp - I suspect the problem is likely to be internal to the pot so opening up the amp probably won't reveal anything.
   
*@psone*
  Any luck RE getting a replacement unit for your damaged one?
   
  It's terrible I know, but I still don't have 200hrs on my amp - I've been distracted by my new studio monitors 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I need to get it burnt in so I can post some proper impressions. Now the light's better I should be able to take some good photos soon also.


----------



## jr41

*@saber8689*
  I'm with you on the improvement they bring to the HD 650 - a very spacious and clean sound.
   
  The MK IV can be used with the EF92, CV131, WE403A/B, GE5654, M8100, CV4010, EF95 and 6JI families of tubes, which gives a lot of options RE tube rolling (although I haven't rolled any tubes in my KM IV yet). The MK III is compatible with exactly the same families of tubes as the MK IV, so you should be able to glean plenty of relevant information from MK III tube rolling thread.
   
  I don't know if a MK IV tube rolling thread exists, perhaps you should start one . I'm sure everyone with a MK IV would like to hear your impressions.


----------



## .Sup

Quote: 





hifisound said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I finally received my MKIV. Looks much much better than its pics on little dot website.
> 
> ...


 

 you could increase gain with internal jumpers so you don't have to go past 50 volume


----------



## jr41

If you're driving any headphones around or over 300 ohms I believe you should be using full gain anyway.


----------



## .Sup

Quote: 





jr41 said:


> If you're driving any headphones around or over 300 ohms I believe you should be using full gain anyway.


 


  Yes but if he had it maxed he wouldn't go over 30. I have the gain maxed and never go over 15. So I believe he doesn't have it maxed.


----------



## Hifisound

I did switch on the amp and the initial impression quite nice. Everything sounds very very clear. Only problem is the drums (Sheffield disc) lack the attack or power as compared to my 372 headphone out. But I started with gain 4. Will be changing it to 10.
  Maybe the burn in will solve it or it could be the very nature of the tube sound.
   
  Though as .Sup said , I will not have to go above 30 at gain 10.
   
  But its still a problem with volume control for which I will await David's reply.... Hope I don't have to send it back for just this problem...
   
  Thanks,
  Hifisound


----------



## rosgr63

Hifisound, congratulations, hope you'll sort out your volume control problem soon.
  Lots of gain may not be the best solution.
  After you sort out the VC you might want to try some other tubes like the Mullard M8100.
  Tubes take time to burn in so give them time.


----------



## .Sup

David personally set the gain at "10" for my (ex) HD600 but like Rosgr said it might not be best for the SR60s


----------



## Hifisound

@rosgr63
   
  Thanks!. Yes tube rolling is the next project  Though I will spend sufficient time (min 6 months)  with the stock tubes before changing.
  I would be looking at mullards (m8100/8161) and then maybe the power tubes.
   
  @.Sup
  I will finally keep the setting most suitable for HD600. since I be using Sr60s only rarely.


----------



## jr41

Quote: 





.sup said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Totally agree, mine was just a general observation


----------



## Hifisound

David suggested removing the volume knob and adjusting it.
  I removed the volume knob, the front plate and refitted all back and now its fine.
   
  It was basically a problem with metal knob grinding with the external circular surface. Now its fine...
   
  Back to burn in and listening now


----------



## Hifisound

Btw is it safe to use mk iv as pre for audioengine A2s ?
   
  Will there be any DC related issues ?


----------



## Hifisound

I confirmed with AudioEngine and they confirmed that it will be safe...


----------



## jr41

Glad it turned out to be a simple issue easily sorted, Hifisound.


----------



## jr41

A couple of pics of my MK IV SE and DAC_I:
   
 ​ ​   
​   
  I will get around to posting some impressions of this pairing with my HD 650, just holding off until everything is burned in.


----------



## kwang411

I'm just wondering if the driver tubes that came with the SE version are made by Mullard?
  On my tube it just says:
  CV4010
  KQDD/K
  83-22
   
  Also, would the same tubes sound different if they are made by two different brands? For example the Tung-sol 6AK5 vs GE 6AK5?
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## codeninja

Between hd600 and ad900, which headphone has a better synergy with LD Mk IV?


----------



## .Sup

HD600 has an amazing synergy with LD 4


----------



## jr41

The Audio-Technica ATH-AD900 has an impedance of 35 ohm. Little Dot don't specify the output impedance of the MK IV, but typically it's quite high for amps of this design. I understand it's bad if the output impedance is higher than the impedance of the load (headphone) as the amp will struggle to supply the current the load is drawing.
   
  Amps such as the MK IV tend to be paired best with headphones like the HD 6XX, as they have a higher impedance of around 300 ohm.
   
  Having said that, Little Dot's website states the amp will easily drive 32 - 600 ohm headphones.
   
  I hope what I've said here is correct. I'm still getting my head around concepts such as impedance.


----------



## Ehr33

I just finished completing my home rig. The highlight is my custom solid rosewood knobs!


----------



## jr41

Very nice setup!


----------



## roadcykler

ehr33 said:


> I just finished completing my home rig. The highlight is my custom solid rosewood knobs!




Did you make those knobs or purchase them somewhere? If you bought them, where? Thanks.


----------



## Snips

I'm curious, what's the difference betweem the MKIV and MKIV SE? Do you guys think that it will synergize with the Beyerdynamic T1 well?


----------



## .Sup

snips said:


> I'm curious, what's the difference betweem the MKIV and MKIV SE? Do you guys think that it will synergize with the Beyerdynamic T1 well?




higher quality jack and RCA sockets + different tubes with golden pins


----------



## Snips

So do you guys think that it would pair well with a T1?


----------



## jr41

On paper the two should pair well. The MK IV SE is an OTL tube and the T1 is a high impedance headphone, so specs. wise the two should be a good match. I've also read many comments that the T1 goes well with tubes from a sound signature perspective.
   
  I heard the T1 for the first time recently at the UK head-fi meet driven by a Darkvoice tube amp, the audition was only brief and meets aren't the best place for critical listening, but I was very impressed with the sound. Further details of my impressions can be found in the link in my signature.


----------



## .Sup

just wanted to say HE-4 and LD4 SE is a combo made in heaven.


----------



## jyc327

@kwang411
   
  the cv4010 are likely from mullard england. since thats the standard naming for European tubes. and yes same tubes from different companies will sound slightly different. even the same tubes from mullard made from vastly different year will be slightly off as well.
   
  and as for the Bass lacking from prior reads. i have found the RCA EF95 series tend to help with that. at the least when i had it with my shure 840's the RCA drivers compared to tung-sol and my Ge amongst other seems to give a little more power to the bass.


----------



## tcp56

O.K.   MK IV se owners,  I picked up a pair of EF 91 driver tubes, I now realize I need to switch the "jumpers" from the factory setting to the "short circuit" setting in order for the amp to use this type of tube.  I assumed that these Jumpers were accessed through the same holes in the bottom of the amp that the gain switches are accessed through. In looking through the holes with a flash light, I'm not seeing anything that looks like a removable jumper. Is that because the factory setting is with the "jumpers removed" and there aren't any jumpers included? Or are the jumpers accessed by opening the amp up and moving the included jumpers from one place to the other on the circuit board?  
   
  If anyone could shed some light on this subject I'd appreciate it.    thanks


----------



## Publicenemy

Just have my LD mk4 se in da house!! Own a beyer dt990 600 ohm last few months, my avr n I cute beyond can't drive it very well. But now I really enjoying the power of the beyer. This is a excellent combo to me!! Few weeks back before my LD arrive, I listen to another combo at headphone shop. It's also a very good combo akg k701 with rudistor rp5.3. I like jazz n dance music. Beyer sounds very good in vocal n rock but the akg n rudistor combo sounds wider n refine. I feeling like get a k701. But can't afford the rudistor. Any 1 here listen to LD with 701 before? Any Idea for this combo?


----------



## benuyu

Hi,
   
  has anyone compared the MKIV SE against the Schiit Valhalla ?
   
  i recently just bought a used DT990 600ohm and was deciding between both amps to pair with it.
   
  thanks !


----------



## tcp56

This thread is pretty quiet,
  sorry haven't herd the Valhalla


----------



## Vicca Tito

Hello, MK IV SE owners
   
  Does anybody know whether the jumpers are attached to 2 and 3 pins (beside driving tube plates) 
  by the default or should they be removed, if installed, in newly purchased LD mk IV-SE?
   
   
  Many thanks for the answers

 Vicca


----------



## john57

The default setting for new MK IV SE  is jumper set  covering pins 1 and 2      (same as unjumpered)  for stock M8100/CV4010  tubes. Look at this site and at the bottom the link to the latest reference guide for your amp.
   
http://www.littledot.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=820&sid=117b9309ab6149843433e5e9f04cdae4


----------



## Vicca Tito

Yeah, thanks.
  I know that now. But I was suspicious because those pictures are with no jumpers on pins.
  Sorry.
  In my unit pin 1 and 2 are covered with jumpers (not 2 and 3 as I thought).
  What makes it a default whatsoever.


----------



## stuympy

How has shipping worked? any difference ebay vs. direct order? Any issues with customs or duty?
   
  Thanks


----------



## Trist

Does the MK IV have ground loop problems like the MKIII and MKII?


----------



## .Sup

Quote: 





trist said:


> Does the MK IV have ground loop problems like the MKIII and MKII?


 


  I haven't had any issues with the IV SE whatsoever.


----------



## MohawkUS

Would this amp be any good with a 40ohm headphone like the Ultrasone PRO2900? I've been looking but I havn't been able to find any reviews.


----------



## .Sup

Tough to say, I haven't used a can with such low impedance, its a very good amp for high impedance cans, that's for sure.


----------



## mab1376

I'm thinking of getting an MK IV SE with an Audio-GD NFB-5 DAC, anyone had any experience with it? I See most of you have the LD DAC, does anyone have any objections to using another DAC?
   
  I'm planning on getting a pair of Beyerdynamic T70's to go with it as well (250 ohm).


----------



## gavinfabl

Well I just bought the MKIV from David via his eBay store. Really excited now and can't wait for it to arrive. 

I currently have a Fiio E7/E9 setup using Fischer Audio FA-003 headphones. As my budget is limited I also got a Fiio L7 so that I could use my E7 with the USB out from my laptop. Hoping everything sounds ok. I really don't have a clue about tubes. 

What is the typical life of a tube?


----------



## BARNSTORMER

So i have just taken the plunge into Audiofileism! My first real set up is on its way which consists of Little Dot mk iv se, Little Dot DAC-1, Sennheiser Hd650's and a full compliment of Audioquest cables. Got my PC set up with 320k music through Foobar2000 using asio4all and will be using my SPDIF port when the new system turns up. Only downer is my new lappy that i have all this set up on is playing up and getting sent back first thing Monday for an unknown time period. All my great gear is going to turn up and ill have no source to use it from. But dam im excited!!!


----------



## dadong

Yo guys I've had my LD amp for about half a year now and for a while I have felt that it was a little bit muddy with my HD650, but now it's all changed. 
   
  I just got my 6ZH1P-EV and replaced the stock jan 5654's and all I can say is freaken WOW. The changes are amazing even when not burned in at all. The clarity is amazing, gone are the muddies from the mids. The bass is more tamed now and not as loose as it was before. the highs are crisp and less sibliant as before. soundstage is wider but still shallow given the nature of the HD650's. The vocals are less forward then before and sounds quite good.  overall a massive improvement from the stock tubes and this is the impression i get from listening to it for 10 mins. i can't wait when i get about 30+ hours of use on them.
   
  Just wanted to share this. I recommend people to give these a try. I think it might be the most worthwhile 24bucks i've ever spent on audio equiment. ​


----------



## BARNSTORMER

Excellent! I will give those tubes a try. I'm still waiting for my HD650's ATM but have the L.D. system set up. Am currently using my Audio-technica ATH-AD700's. I'm crawling out of my skin to listen to this system with the HD650's. Ive also started compiling a FLAC library. Not the biggest FLAC collection ATM but getting there. Audio = <3


----------



## BARNSTORMER

Just got the 6zh1p-ev driver tubes and they have been in for about 1.5 songs and sound great! Massive improvement! now to leave them burn in for a bit!


----------



## ramarge3653

This is my first post on this board and the reason that I joined is becuase of the LD MK IV SE. 
  I'm curious on how much better my setup will sound if I purchase this amp. 
  Here is my current setup.
   
  VPI Scoutmaster TT
  Dynavector 17D3 Cartridge
  Dynavector P-75 Preamp
  Outlaw Audio 2150 Reciever
  Grado RS2i
   
  Can anyone comment on how much better my RS2's will sound if I connect from my preamp directly to the LD MK IV SE driving my Grados?  In a perfect world someone will respond that has used the Outlaw Audio 2150 and the MK IV.  I really have nowhere to test this thing, but I've read a lot of reviews stating that the MK IV and the RS2s are a perfect match.  My only concern is how much of an improvement over my existing reciever will this amp make?
   
  Any thoughts, comments, or info is highly appreciated.
   
  Regards,
  Matt


----------



## mab1376

I just ordered my MK IV SE, anyone got any got tubes to recommend?


----------



## BARNSTORMER

Can also recommend the tubes from the previous page. They are a vast improvement!


----------



## mab1376

I just got conformation from David that my MK IV SE shipped today!
   
  I should have it in >2weeks.


----------



## bruce108

After trying most of the recommended driver tubes for Little Dot Mk4 SE, I ended up preferring the [size=12.0pt]Hytron JHY-6AK5[/size] (mine are from 1953). I raved about them here but I see today they're out of stock. That said, the Russians are good, no doubt about it.


----------



## mr_maharot

Hi! I recently bought a Little Dot MK IV SE  and paired it with my HD650. Although out of the box it sounded nice  (atleast for me) while i was browsing through the manual, i noticed there is a gain switch at the bottom of the amp. in what gain should i switch them into? Thanks!


----------



## mab1376

I set 1 on and 2 off for a gain of 5 for my 250 ohm Beyer T70s.
   
  There's 2 sets of switches, 1 for each channel.
   
  by default they're all on for a gain of 3.
   
  The next highest setting for me is a gain of 10 which would be entirely too much, I'd only set that for something like the HE-6


----------



## mr_maharot

I'm still on its 10th hour of burn in. Ill play with the gain when i reach atleast 50hours or so


----------



## mab1376

i'm only about 20 hours in myself.
   
  the bass extension is already getting much better, can't wait till i reach 100 hours or so.


----------



## FSonicSmith

I bought my Mark IV more than three years ago, when it was a relatively new "phenomenon" on this Board. At the time, my headphones were AT AHD700s, Denon ADH2000s, and AKG 701s. Sound was OK, but I was not particularly thrilled, even after I had splurged for a pair of Russian 6H30P-DR "super tubes". A week ago I received a new set of phones, the much ballyhooed Audeze LCD-2s with Moon Silver Dragon V3 cables. From everything I had read on this Board and elsewhere, I was prepared to buy a new headphone amp, and expected the Little Dot to mate poorly with the Audeze LCD-2s. From what is out there on this topic, I was expecting to hear audible distortion. So far, I am pleasantly surprised at the sound quality. I am hearing rock solid bass and palpable midrange. The highs are extended and plenty "bright", not dark as others have reported about the headphones. Whenever I have heard audible distortion, I have confirmed that the distortion is with the source material and not due to the amp and phones combo-a prime example is the new Bon Iver release on vinyl. The distortion is more audible when listening with my Audezes than through my loudspeakers, but I can tell it's recorded and not a by product of the amp-phone combo. Immediately after listening to Bon Iver I put on a different cleanly recorded record and heard crystaline sound. I have plenty of gain. I will likely audition the Violectric V200 and the Bryston BHA-1 (once it comes out) to determine if I simply don't realize what I am missing (quite possible), but there is certainly nothing glaringly wrong with this duo, irrespective of those who report that an OTL single ended tubed head amp like the LD Mark IV SE will sound distorted and lack sufficient gain for the Audeze LCD-2s.


----------



## mab1376

That's good that it works well with solid Orthos, I was looking into getting a pair soon.
   
  definitely intrigued with the Super Tubes, I just ordered a pair of M8161's and I read the Super Tube is a perfect companion.


----------



## gavinfabl

Great 12 pages. 

I use my iPod Classic , line out dock into LD MKIV into Beyer DT880 600 ohm headphones. 

Sound is incredible. 

My question if I got some mullard 8100 tubes would the fit without any adjustments and are they that much better than stock. Also what tubes do I swap the others for? Again I just want an easy swap. No pin adjustments.


----------



## jigsawPB

Hi! Nevertheless anyone compare this amp and Darkvoice 336SE? Especially with HD650...


----------



## gavinfabl

gavinfabl said:


> Great 12 pages.
> 
> I use my iPod Classic , line out dock into LD MKIV into Beyer DT880 600 ohm headphones.
> 
> ...




I found a good UK company that supplies tubes. £16.50 inclusive of shipping for a pair for Mullard M8100. 

Already swapped over from default tubes on the MKIV. Result. A lot better. More dynamics, more precision and more bass. Very pleased with my little investment. 

Just waiting for my Caig DeOxit to arrive so I can give all the pins a good clean for optimal performance, although sound wise everything is lovely.


----------



## mab1376

I've been using mine with WE 403b tubes and they sound very nice, very good bass extension.
   
  Definitely worth a shot if you can find a pair, I bought mine from another head-fier.
   
  I also bought a pair of M8161(EF92) and accidentally destroyed one of them by not changing the jumper.
   
  now the broken one has no bass from it at all.


----------



## gavinfabl

That's a shame re the jumper. 

My Caig DeOxit arrived and I used it on my new tubes and existing power tubes. Really didn't think it would make much of a difference but it sure did. Highly recommend if you can get some. 

Order some Sovtek 6H30 PI power tubes which I'm waiting to arrive to complete my tube rolling which is a lot easier than I realised. Would never go back to solid state now.


----------



## mab1376

Quote: 





gavinfabl said:


> That's a shame re the jumper.
> 
> My Caig DeOxit arrived and I used it on my new tubes and existing power tubes. Really didn't think it would make much of a difference but it sure did. Highly recommend if you can get some.
> 
> Order some Sovtek 6H30 PI power tubes which I'm waiting to arrive to complete my tube rolling which is a lot easier than I realised. Would never go back to solid state now.


 


   
  Where did you order the DeOxit from?


----------



## gavinfabl

mab1376 said:


> Where did you order the DeOxit from?




I had seen a few places, but I got mine from this company. Quick delivery too. 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180287934422&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:GB:1123#ht_1622wt_689


----------



## pelltj03

Mine just arrived!!, an MKIV SE  I was shocked it only took 4 days to ship from China to my doorstep!  Happily plugged it in and I'm already rocking out with it. 
   
  I am completely shocked at how much bigger than the MKIII it is.  I can't wait to start tube-rolling again as well!


----------



## rosgr63

Congratulations, enjoy it!


----------



## nottipiglet

Does anyone know where David and team from Little Dot are? I ordered my Mk IV SE late last week. However, David has not been replying to emails since Feb 6. I sure hope he is all right.


----------



## Bobsama

nottipiglet said:


> Does anyone know where David and team from Little Dot are? I ordered my Mk IV SE late last week. However, David has not been replying to emails since Feb 6. I sure hope he is all right.




They were closed for the Chinese New Year. It seemed their shipping company was also out for that--it took a while until I got DHL's tracking information. Once it hit the system, it was on an express route to my front step. Yes, I ordered a MK IV. And no, you may NOT borrow it!


----------



## Ratafak

Hello, I want to buy Little Dot Mk IV or Mk IV SE (not sure yet). I want to pair it with my bayer DT 770 80ohm + HD595 and Nuforce uDac2. Is it a good idea ? Is low impedance 80ohm a problem ? Later I want upgrade my cans, so I hope Mk IV will be good even with something like HD800, T1, T5, T70.


----------



## mab1376

Quote: 





ratafak said:


> Hello, I want to buy Little Dot Mk IV or Mk IV SE (not sure yet). I want to pair it with my bayer DT 770 80ohm + HD595 and Nuforce uDac2. Is it a good idea ? Is low impedance 80ohm a problem ? Later I want upgrade my cans, so I hope Mk IV will be good even with something like HD800, T1, T5, T70.


 


  I use mine with 32ohm Ultrasone HFI-780 and 250ohm Beyerdynamic T70 with my MK IV SE, and both sound amazing. I use my iBasso D6 as my DAC for he time being until I save up for a Schiit Bifrost.
   
  I swapped my driver tubes with LM Ericsson 403b tubes which I'd highly recommend if you can find a pair.


----------



## nottipiglet

My Mk IV SE arrived yesterday! It's beautiful... and it's really quite big. It sounds amazing out of the box, and I'm looking forward to improvements after burn-in. I also ordered a couple of 6J1P-EV (6ZH1P-EV) from Russia to tube roll... just for some fun. I have the gain set at 4 at the moment, for my AKG Q701.


----------



## Bobsama

And that's my Little Dot setup! Works great, sounds good.  I've got 19 hours of music burn-in on it and quite a bit more non-music use (gaming, youtube, etc).


----------



## mab1376

When I use M8161 tubes with the jumpers changed, the right channel always sounds like there’s much less volume and less bass. Also when I turn the amp off the right channels drops to no volume in a few seconds whereas the left channel stays on for 30-40 seconds while draining power.
   
  Is there something wrong with one of my power tubes? Or maybe a capacitor inside the unit?
   
  I tried swapping the L/R driver tubes to see if it was one of them, but its always the right channel.
   
  -edit-
   
  I fixed it, there was a chewed up jumper from me using crappy pliers trying to change it. Must have caused a crappy connection and wasn't changing the voltage correctly.
   
  I swapped it and now it's working fine.


----------



## Louie from SF

Hi all,
   
  I'm new to Head-Fi.
   
  Here's my story. I bought a Cyberpower PC last year in which I installed an ASUS ESSENCE ST card to drive my Audio-Technica ATH-M50S. It did the trick for a few months and I was pretty happy with my gear. But eventually, after reading this and other headphones dedicated web sites, I decided to get a pair of Sennheiser HD650. I loved them right away (they became even better after a couple hundred hours of burn time). But I quickly realized that my ASUS card was not giving me enough. I wanted more, better. I then decided to get a Nuforce Icon HDP that I now use throug the SPDIF output of my Asus card. I'm very happy with my gear and I think that I could stop here. But, I'm curious, I want to try tubes. And this thread convinced me to order a Little Dot MK IV SE that I intend to use with the Nuforce ICON HDP. I ordered from David and he seems very professional, I'm glad I ordered from him already. I'll keep you posted on how things go with my new set up.
   
  Louie from San Francisco.


----------



## Subrata

Hi All,
  I'm just new to head-fi like Louie
  I interested too with tube, especially with little dot MK IV
  but I'm not yet order for that
  I have a question, Can I use MK IV without DAC?for example ipod -> MK IV -> DT770
  How can I connect my ipod to MK IV, could I use interconnect mini to RCA from ipod to MK IV?


----------



## rosgr63

Subrata you need a DAC and iPod Dock, or an iPod Dock with RCA output.
  Otherwise you are taking the amplified signal from your iPod and try to feed it to your amp, double amplification loss of quality.
  The Dock will tap on the digital signal and pass it on the DAC which then will convert it to an analogue signal and feed your amp.
  Some Docks have the DAC built in and provide an analogue signal for your amp.
  The LD MKIV SE is a wonderful amp, you'll be very happy.


----------



## Subrata

Thanks rosgr63
Do you have any DAC suggestion for MK IV?
I saw little dot DAC, but its over budget for me
How about the difference quality between little dot DAC and standard ipod dock?
Is little dot DAC more better than standard ipod dock?

Is it worth MK IV SE than MK IV for $100?


----------



## rosgr63

It would depend on your budget.
  I would look into iPod Docks which include a DAC and have an RCA output as a first choice.


----------



## Namkung

louie from sf said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm new to Head-Fi.
> 
> ...




Hi there.
I used to use HDP as my dac/amp setup for a bit before upgrading the amp section to the mk iv se and had intended on using the hdp as a DAC.
Upon receiving my mk iv se though I noticed there was static noise in the background to which I could not get rid of after trying just about everything. The sound disappeared however when I plugged the input rca cables out. This pretty much assured me that the static was coming from the dac . 
I contacted David immediately and he has told me that the mk iv se is a very revealing amp and is probably picking up noises from the hdp. I ended up getting a new dac which is on its way atm but I would love to find out if you run into the same problem..
Please do keep me updated. And I wish you all the luck!


----------



## Subrata

Hi Namkung,
  I want to know, why are you choose MK IV SE not MK IV?
  is it MK IV SE much better than MK IV for $100?
   
  Thank you


----------



## Namkung

Quote: 





subrata said:


> Hi Namkung,
> I want to know, why are you choose MK IV SE not MK IV?
> is it MK IV SE much better than MK IV for $100?
> 
> Thank you


 


  If you look at their website it tells you what the differences are.
  The biggest difference is the upgrade in tubes but there are a few other small things.
  I suggest you read them yourself !


----------



## Louie from SF

Hi Namkung, at this point the Nuforce Icon HDP sounds just perfect with the SPDIF signal coming from the Asus Essence ST sound card but I will let you know for sure. After looking at the (lack of) available space on my computer desk though I think that I will also use the LD MK IV SE directly through my Onkyo CD/DVD-Audio player in the living room.
   
  David did send the LD on Wednesday. It's on its way and I should get it next week.


----------



## Louie from SF

Quote: 





subrata said:


> Hi Namkung,
> I want to know, why are you choose MK IV SE not MK IV?
> is it MK IV SE much better than MK IV for $100?
> 
> Thank you


 


 I chose the SE because I'm not planning on doing tube rolling and I want the upgraded version with better components. For me, at least for now, the Little Dot MK IV SE will be a plug and play thing.


----------



## Namkung

Quote: 





louie from sf said:


> Hi Namkung, at this point the Nuforce Icon HDP sounds just perfect with the SPDIF signal coming from the Asus Essence ST sound card but I will let you know for sure. After looking at the (lack of) available space on my computer desk though I think that I will also use the LD MK IV SE directly through my Onkyo CD/DVD-Audio player in the living room.
> 
> David did send the LD on Wednesday. It's on its way and I should get it next week.


 

 Ah I see.
  Never mind what I said haha. I found out the noise was coming from my computer =/
  I was able to get rid of it using a toslink connection .
  I hope you enjoy!
  DHL's shipping was amazingly fast haha.


----------



## Louie from SF

Quote: 





namkung said:


> Ah I see.
> Never mind what I said haha. I found out the noise was coming from my computer =/
> I was able to get rid of it using a toslink connection .
> I hope you enjoy!
> DHL's shipping was amazingly fast haha.


 
   
  I received the Little Dot MK IV SE yesterday. It's in perfect shape, it's bigger than I expected, it's heavy and built like a tank to quote many here. I'm feeding it with the DAC portion of my Nuforce Icon HDP and it already sounds great. No static whatsoever BTW. I'll do the burn in by the book, about 8 hours at a time, with cooling periods in between. I already like the "roudness" of what comes out of my HD650. The Nuforce Icon HDP sounds great but the Little Dot sounds so real.
   
  I've spent a few hours so far listening to music through the LD. Bass drums are straight in your face, snare drums are tight and punchy, bass guitars are powerful, guitar tube amps sound like they should and acoustic guitars sound more real than ever. And I'm expecting things to get much better in a few hundred hours of slow burn in.
   
  This little guy might be the best $409 I've spent in quite a while.


----------



## Louie from SF

I haven't been home much lately but was able to clock in about 200 hours of burn time on my new LD MV IV SE. What I've read on this thread is true, the LD is now very different. Rounder, smoother, buttery and the amp has much more "dynamic". I tried it with the DAC portion of my Nuforce ICON HDP and directly connected on my Onkyo CD/DVD-Audio/SACD player. I did set the bit switches to get a gain of 4 which is enough for my HD650s but not too gainy for my ATH-M50s.
   
  Now my problem is that I think my Onkyo player might not be up to snuff. I never noticed before but through the LD I now think it sounds a bit harsh compared to when I use the DAC portion of the Nuforce ICON HDP. I started fantasizing on a Oppo BDP-93 SE/Xtreme or a BDP-95.
   
  These puppies are expensive, are they worth it? Which one is best?


----------



## Louie from SF

I installed a pair of VOSKHOD 6J1P-EV tubes in my LD MK IV SE a couple days ago and they already have about 20 hours of burn in time. In my HD650 and compared to the M8100 Mullards they make the LD sound more present, more dynamic with more detailed and more pronounced high frequencies. BUT, they make the LD run much hotter. I'm not sure if I'll keep them in since I already liked the Mullards even if they were a bit less pronounced on the highs. TBD.
   
  I'm going through my CD collection and realize how the LD makes bad recordings sound even worst compared to better recording. I absolutely love female vocals on the LD, stuff like Stacey Kent "Raconte-moi...".  The "Last Temptation of Christ" of Peter Gabriel also sounds awesome, anything with well recorded wind or traditional chinese strings instruments sounds fantastic. Yoyo Ma, Coltrane, remastered Mike Oldfield...I could go on and on.
   
  I can't compare (yet) but for $409+shipping, I'm very happy with my new LD.
   
  Anybody knows how many hours a set of tubes can last for?
   
  Thank you.


----------



## derbigpr

Quote: 





namkung said:


> Hi there.
> I used to use HDP as my dac/amp setup for a bit before upgrading the amp section to the mk iv se and had intended on using the hdp as a DAC.
> Upon receiving my mk iv se though I noticed there was static noise in the background to which I could not get rid of after trying just about everything. The sound disappeared however when I plugged the input rca cables out. This pretty much assured me that the static was coming from the dac .
> I contacted David immediately and he has told me that the mk iv se is a very revealing amp and is probably picking up noises from the hdp. I ended up getting a new dac which is on its way atm but I would love to find out if you run into the same problem..
> Please do keep me updated. And I wish you all the luck!


 
   
   
   
  Buzzing problems with Little Dot amps have absolutely nothing to do with DAC's.  Its the poor implementation of power supply in all of Little Dot amps, which causes ground loop problems in many cases. It happens to almost everyone, especially with MkV's. And frankly, if he said that his amps are so revealing that they reveal the buzzing in other gear you have, while in fact thats not the case, then thats a very poor and pathetic excuse, and one would have to be very naive to believe it.


----------



## NOMBEDES

Wow 3 days 6hrs and no one has responded to Namkung!   Now I am thinking I do not want to buy a Little Dot (LD).  Any comments from the community on the LD power supply?


----------



## john57

Good loops can happen with any equipment with any manufacture. I used to to has good loops in solid state equipment. You do not want to float the grounds on equipment especially tube equipment which uses high voltages.


----------



## NOMBEDES

FLOAT GROUNDS?  Sorry, please explain.


----------



## john57

[size=medium]Floating the grounds means that the equipment ground is no longer tied to the outlet receptacle ground like using cheater plugs. Ground loop happens when the ground that one equipment is using is at a different potential from another piece of equipment. A small current loop is created when the resistances of the two grounds are slightly different. It has nothing to do with the quality of the equipment or the power supply. The last time I had a ground loop issue was with the cable TV coming into the house that had a different grounding source from the house ground. I solve the problem by isolate the cable ground from the house ground. This does not always work with all cable systems. Some RCA cables avoid the issue by connected the ground only on one side of the cable. It is best to have a good single-point grounding system than to lift or “float” the ground from a safety standpoint and to reduce interference from other sources like RF.[/size]


----------



## NOMBEDES

thanks.


----------



## gavinfabl

Been busy lately but fired up my LD MK4 with upgraded tubes and listened away. Totally forgot how bloody amazing the LD sounds.


----------



## Brooko

Welcome back Gavin 
   
  Which tubes did you end up with?  I also ended up with an LD MKIV and couldn't be happier.  Still have the HD600s - but repurchased the DT880 (600) - and couldn't be happier.
   
  Currently using 6H30Pi Golds for power, and alternating between Mullard M8100 and GE JAN5654W (Early Square Getter).  So far I think the best combo for me are the JAN 5654W.


----------



## BARNSTORMER

Just playing with the new SLR. Love this amp.


----------



## gavinfabl

I can't recall which ones. But they were the best ones recommended by LD. Made a big difference and they glow more


----------



## amandarae

Hi,
   
  New member of the group here and just started last September acquiring HP gears..  I bought the LD MKIV SE and very happy with it.
   
  Do you think this will void warranty?
   

   
   
   
   

   
   
  Just injecting the thread some humor guys, no offense intended 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I really enjoy my LD MKIV SE with my HD-650.  After trying some input tubes, I settled with CBS Hytron 6AK5 and just the stock  power tubes or the EH 6H30.
   
  I also have excellent results using  Schiit Bifrost as DAC to drive the LD.  From this combo, small ensemble acoustic jazz is like touching heaven(at least for me).  Regards!


----------



## Nirvana Woman




----------



## Nirvana Woman

I just got back an email from David, supplying me with the tracking number.
   
  It appears the amp was already shipped on monday and it's now about 2 hours away from my house.
   
  No comment... that really is insanely fast.
   
  Thanks David and Sword


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





amandarae said:


> Hi,
> 
> New member of the group here and just started last September acquiring HP gears..  I bought the LD MKIV SE and very happy with it.
> 
> ...


 

 I dunno if it will void warranty.. But I have to say... That apple logo on the little dot I think is not good. I think it is tasteless, in fact maybe the most tasteless thing I've seen this year.
  The reason I feel that way is because if you enjoy that Little Dot amp, you should show that and place credit and attention on the Little Dot and the brand. Now if you plaster something like that apple logo on it, It take away attention from little dot and also even makes it appear that it is an apple product.
   
  That is the reason why I am so anal about this... I have a principal problem with this...
   
  But ofcourse it is your item. I hope you can forgive me my anger. I am truly sorry if I offended you  but I am now little dot fan and will make a fight for these guys...


----------



## Brooko

nirvana woman said:


> I dunno if it will void warranty.. But I have to say... That apple logo on the little dot I think is not good. I think it is tasteless, in fact maybe the most tasteless thing I've seen this year.
> The reason I feel that way is because if you enjoy that Little Dot amp, you should show that and place credit and attention on the Little Dot and the brand. Now if you plaster something like that apple logo on it, It take away attention from little dot and also even makes it appear that it is an apple product.
> 
> That is the reason why I am so anal about this... I have a principal problem with this...
> ...


 
   
  Perhaps lighten up a little and notice this line which you may have missed ........
   
   


amandarae said:


> *Just injecting the thread some humor guys, no offense intended*


----------



## amandarae

Quote: 





nirvana woman said:


> I dunno if it will void warranty.. But I have to say... That apple logo on the little dot I think is not good. I think it is tasteless, in fact maybe the most tasteless thing I've seen this year.
> The reason I feel that way is because if you enjoy that Little Dot amp, you should show that and place credit and attention on the Little Dot and the brand. Now if you plaster something like that apple logo on it, It take away attention from little dot and also even makes it appear that it is an apple product.
> 
> That is the reason why I am so anal about this... I have a principal problem with this...
> ...


 
  No worries!  As I said, just injecting some humor and no intention to be offensive at all (Thanks Brooko!)


----------



## gavinfabl

I love my LD MKIV with rolled tubes along with my Beyer DT880 Premium 600 ohm headphones. The problem is I just don't get to use it enough, especially now I have 2 puppies as well as my 2 10 year old cats. 

I am in a dilemma as I am thinking of selling, but don't know if I should or even if there would be a buyer. What should I do?


----------



## atistatic

oh hoho i did must that sign up here long time ago xD


----------



## Doms

Hi there,
   
  i'm an happy user of LD MK IV products, now i want to change my driver tubes CV4010 by a couple of Mullard 6AM6S  while keeping power tubes 6H30EB.
   
  it is possible?
   
  Sorry for my bad english!
   
  Regards Dom


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





doms said:


> Hi there,
> 
> i'm an happy user of LD MK IV products, now i want to change my driver tubes CV4010 by a couple of Mullard 6AM6S  while keeping power tubes 6H30EB.
> 
> ...


 

  
  I don't see why not, since Little Dot IV supports EF91, 92 and 95. M6am6s is EF91 tube. So you'd just need to switch jumper on the little dot (dunno how that's done).


----------



## Doms

Thx for u fast answer.
   
  But if i switch the jumper no problem with the 6H30 Tubes?
   
  Regards Dom


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





doms said:


> Thx for u fast answer.
> 
> But if i switch the jumper no problem with the 6H30 Tubes?
> 
> Regards Dom


 
   
  No. The jumper setting only affects the driver tubes.


----------



## Doms

Works fine!  Thx


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





doms said:


> Works fine!  Thx


 
   
  Cool  Enjoy


----------



## mab1376

For the 6AM6 tubes (EF91 equivalent) you need to change the jumper or else you will get horrible sounds out of your tubes.
   
  see page 10: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6037680/Little%20Dot%20MK%20IV%20SE%20Reference%20Guide.pdf


----------



## bruce108

Just a heads-up to subscribers: my MK IVSE is advertised in the amps section (220v version).
   
  Cheers
   
  Bruce


----------



## Cakensaur

Can anyone comment on the Synergy between the LD MK IV and Grado's?
  if they work at all together.
  I'm soon to enter your ranks.


----------



## rosgr63

I have used my Grado SR325is with my LD MKIV SE and was very pleased with the results.


----------



## Cakensaur

Thanks  that was one of the main make/break points. i wanted a "All in one" Amp. 
  I think ive found it..


----------



## Brooko

Another who uses the LD MKIV with woodied SR325i.  It's a nice combo.


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





rosgr63 said:


> I have used my Grado SR325is with my LD MKIV SE and was very pleased with the results.


 

 Just curious - would you remember what gain setting you used it with?


----------



## Cakensaur

Thanks Brooko and rosgr
   
  between the two of you, this amp is now in my sights.
   
  Quick question... since my main headphone for these will be the HD650 and will be listening to a fair bit of EDM
   
  I'm thinking of these as aftermarket tubes: voshkod 6zh1p-ev
   
  nice, cheap, and supposedly very good.
   
  as a balance between dominant EDM and a still large proportion of rock/metal i cant help but feel these would be best. but i might be wrong.
   
  does anyone have any ideas that could be better?


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





cakensaur said:


> Thanks Brooko and rosgr
> 
> between the two of you, this amp is now in my sights.
> 
> ...


 

 Even with stock tubes, I find the Little Dot IV + HD650 is fantastic for EDM. I regularly listen to house music for hours on end and absolutely love the sub and midbass response... It's just awesome, in a word. Even as I speak I am listening to Add2Basket's Intimate & Underground session from 2009 and find myself engulfed in ear-massaging bass . I am not a basshead at all (well, maybe a little - i like my house music groovy and a little punchy and bassy), but it's just beautiful. Trance is equally good as well.
  I listen to all kinds of stuff like Tiesto's ISOS and Magik series, the Renaissance series, Balance series, Hernan Cattaneo's work, Joris Voorn, Way Out West, Robert Babicz, just to name a few. Maybe you are familiar with any of those artists? Anyway, it sounds very good. The HD650's bass response and general sound signature to me is a very good fit with any EDM I know.


----------



## Cakensaur

wow thanks 
  my main styles are trance (all variants) and i have a very large softspot for hardstyle (listening to Defqon.1 2009 atm)
  I tend to be a supreme basshead on the go (DT770 + zo2) but less so at home, i still like a healthy amount with my EDM though


----------



## Cakensaur

by the way
  when you say "stock tubes" do you have the LD MKIV or LD MKIV SE, the latter already comes with very decent tubes anyway.
   
  thanks again


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





cakensaur said:


> by the way
> when you say "stock tubes" do you have the LD MKIV or LD MKIV SE, the latter already comes with very decent tubes anyway.
> 
> thanks again


 
   
  Oh yeah sorry. I meant the stock GE5654's on the MKIV (as opposed to the superior Mullard8100's on the MKIVse). I'm actually going to be upgrading to the 8100's soon.


----------



## Cakensaur

For me its between the 8100's and the 6zh1p-ev, I may go for the latter since they are just so much easier to get hold of.
  Plus I'm only buying from yenaudiostore on EBAY, since that's the re-seller i trust the most. who doesn't have the 8100 in stock at the moment.
  So I'm kind of in a corner.


----------



## mab1376

Personally these are my favorite with my LD MK IV SE: http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-TELEFUNKEN-6AK5-5654-6AK5W-Tubes-for-Little-Dot-headphone-amp-MK-IV-3-4-/290678560214
   
  I also have:
   
  Mullard M8100
  Mullard M8161
  Raytheon 6AK5
  LM Ericsson 403b
  WestermElec 403b
  Voshkod 6zh1p-ev
  Russian Military 6X1Π-EB
   
  The Raytheon's have a very airy sound stage but lack a bit of detail, they're perfect for music like the black keys or anything that sounds "muddy".
   
  i.e. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Based on what I've read I would assume the M8083 is a very similar sound.
   
  The Voshkod's are a close second to the Telefunken's for me, I can see how people could go either way on these, and the Voshkod's are usually cheaper so they usually win. I just prefer the flavor of the Telefunken's


----------



## BobJS

Not sure if this thread is officially dead yet .... just wanted to post I just ordered this puppy and looking forward to its arrival!


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> Not sure if this thread is officially dead yet .... just wanted to post I just ordered this puppy and looking forward to its arrival!


 

 Nice 
   
  You've made a good choice. Did you order the SE or the regular version?


----------



## BobJS

I sprang for SE .... maybe I can avoid some tube rolling (probably not!)


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> I sprang for SE .... maybe I can avoid some tube rolling (probably not!)


 
   
  Hehe probably not 
   
  The m8100 are great tubes, most other good tubes aren't really better than those. They're mostly different I think, but the m8100 has great characteristics.


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





nirvana woman said:


> Hehe probably not
> 
> The m8100 are great tubes, most other good tubes aren't really better than those. They're mostly different I think, but the m8100 has great characteristics.


 

 Correct me if I'm wrong, NW, but I was browsing a LD tube rolling thread..... wasn't that you who didn't like the Mullards at first and then, voila, they sounded pretty good ......


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, NW, but I was browsing a LD tube rolling thread..... wasn't that you who didn't like the Mullards at first and then, voila, they sounded pretty good ......


 

 Yes. The truth is the tubes were never the problem, though. If anything, my approach to the whole thing shouldn't have indicated it had anything to do with the tubes themselves, which I know now but didn't at the time .


----------



## HeatFan12

[size=10pt]4+ years and still kicking @ss.  Some DuMont 5654s atm I got on the cheap and sounding good...[/size]
   
  [size=10pt]



[/size]


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> Not sure if this thread is officially dead yet .... just wanted to post I just ordered this puppy and looking forward to its arrival!


 

 A week and 2 days later, it's (SE) unpacked and glowing.  In the past half hour, I've tried it with my HE-500, HD600, and Mad Dogs.  It sounds very similar to the Schiit Lyr..... in fact doing a quick A/B comparison, the Lyr sounds a bit more fluid and velvety.   But the LD is not too shabby out of the box.  This is all at default gain, which puts me at about 40-50 %.  I'm picking up a hint of sibilance on the highs --- not great since I'm also awaiting the arrival of a Beyer T1.   Can I expect this baby to smooth out with some burn in?


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> A week and 2 days later, it's (SE) unpacked and glowing.  In the past half hour, I've tried it with my HE-500, HD600, and Mad Dogs.  It sounds very similar to the Schiit Lyr..... in fact doing a quick A/B comparison, the Lyr sounds a bit more fluid and velvety.   But the LD is not too shabby out of the box.  This is all at default gain, which puts me at about 40-50 %.  I'm picking up a hint of sibilance on the highs --- not great since I'm also awaiting the arrival of a Beyer T1.   Can I expect this baby to smooth out with some burn in?


 

 Would you be able to say what you mean by "more fluid and velvety"?


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





nirvana woman said:


> Would you be able to say what you mean by "more fluid and velvety"?


 

 The LD, relative to the Lyr : Bass not quite as extended, slightly underemphasized, mids not as present as the Lyr, highs are crisper, almost to the point of sibilance.  Could just be different sound signature of the tubes, or the amps themselves.
   
  Not suprisingly, my higher impedance headphone (HD600) performs relatively better with LD than the lower impedance phones (Mad Dogs, HE-500) vs the Lyr.  Still just initial impressions.


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> The LD, relative to the Lyr : Bass not quite as extended, slightly overemphasized, mids not as present as the Lyr, highs are crisper, almost to the point of sibilance.  Could just be different sound signature of the tubes, or the amps themselves.
> 
> Not suprisingly, my higher impedance headphone (HD600) performs relatively better with LD than the lower impedance phones (Mad Dogs, HE-500) vs the Lyr.  Still just initial impressions.


 

 Interesting. Thanks for sharing.
   
  I remember when I first got the Little Dot feeling that the sound did really change dramatically, especially the first week. But I am absolutely not confident about that.


----------



## cswann1

Quote: 





mab1376 said:


> Personally these are my favorite with my LD MK IV SE: http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-TELEFUNKEN-6AK5-5654-6AK5W-Tubes-for-Little-Dot-headphone-amp-MK-IV-3-4-/290678560214


 
  Holy SHYTE!   $40 for a single driver tube?  Do they come with a Sports Illustrated Swimsuite Edition cover model?
   
   
   
   
  On the topic of appreciating my MKIVse...
   
  ...a year or so ago I decided to take the plunge into electrostats.  I bought some Stax and a Woo Wee and using a small power amp that I got for only the cost of shipping from a generous Head-Fier I was on my way.
   
  I hooked everything up and started a favorite track.  It sounded like garbage.  There was some horrible noise coming from the amp.  I remembered that the Little Dot could also pull double duty as a pre-amp.  I scrounged up a second pair of interconnects and have not looked back since. 
   
  My current rig (for over a year) Denon DVD-2900 -> Little Dot MKIVse ->Sonic Impact Super T-amp -> Woo Wee -> Stax SR404
   
  I still keep my dynamics but compared the the stats they just sound dull and boring.  Kinda sucks really lol cause I loved my HD580's.


----------



## mab1376

Quote: 





cswann1 said:


> Holy SHYTE!   $40 for a single driver tube?  Do they come with a Sports Illustrated Swimsuite Edition cover model?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  That's not what I paid, they've jacked up the price since I bought them a few months ago.


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> A week and 2 days later, it's (SE) unpacked and glowing.  In the past half hour, I've tried it with my HE-500, HD600, and Mad Dogs.  It sounds very similar to the Schiit Lyr..... in fact doing a quick A/B comparison, the Lyr sounds a bit more fluid and velvety.   But the LD is not too shabby out of the box.  This is all at default gain, which puts me at about 40-50 %.  I'm picking up a hint of sibilance on the highs --- not great since I'm also awaiting the arrival of a Beyer T1.   Can I expect this baby to smooth out with some burn in?


 
   
  So my Beyer T1 came in.  Sounded crappy on the Asgard.  Sounded good on the Lyr.  Sounded REALLY great on the LD.  HD600 sounds better on the LD as well.  Those lower impedance phones sound better though on the Lyr.  I was going to sell one tube amp or the other, but it appears I need both .....


----------



## BobJS

On the other hand, I really committed to myself to keep just one tube amp --- so I decided to sell the Little Dot.  See sig.


----------



## Steelsix

This thread is amazing, 2+ years old and still going!
   
  I set out first week in December to buy my first set of high end phones, and grabbed a pair of Beyer DT990 600 ohm for Christmas. I also  ordered a Bravo Ocean tube amp from China. After realizing I bought too little amp, I came back to school and decided on a MK IV SE. It's more than I wanted to spend; but the more I read, the less I think about the cost. What an amazingly well built piece of hardware. I'm stoked!
   
  I see myself passing it on to my daughter some day. So few things these days are built well enough to pass down. Am I on target when I say this thing looks like it will endure?
   
  One thing I haven't seen is detail on how they're packed. Can a recent buyer comment? Are they packed well enough to come out of international shipping looking perfect? Yea there's always a chance for damage, but in general, how well are they packaged?


----------



## mab1376

I got mine in Nov 2011 and from what I remember it was very sturdy foam. The tubes are in their own boxes with packing peanuts.
   
  I'm playing some Primus through mine now with my HD650s and Bifrost and I couldn't be happier with my purchase.
   





   
  Also have some fun tube rolling, you can pickup some different 6AK5 tubes off ebay for >$10 a pair.


----------



## Steelsix

Plenty of sound to listen out for in that Primus tune, nice. Good to know about the tubes being boxed uninstalled. Yep I plan to grab a couple tube sets. Thanks


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





steelsix said:


> This thread is amazing, 2+ years old and still going!
> 
> I set out first week in December to buy my first set of high end phones, and grabbed a pair of Beyer DT990 600 ohm for Christmas. I also  ordered a Bravo Ocean tube amp from China. After realizing I bought too little amp, I came back to school and decided on a MK IV SE. It's more than I wanted to spend; but the more I read, the less I think about the cost. What an amazingly well built piece of hardware. I'm stoked!
> 
> ...


 

 Just got one, it's packed very well; arrived in perfect shape.  I previously decided I was only going to keep one tube amp, though, so it's for sale (see link below).


----------



## Nirvana Woman

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> Just got one, it's packed very well; arrived in perfect shape.  I previously decided I was only going to keep one tube amp, though, so it's for sale (see link below).


 

 Out of interest, what made you decide to sell your little dot and keep the other?


----------



## mab1376

Based on the avatar, its probably because the HE-500 is much better suited for the Lyr which can output 4W into 32 Ohms


----------



## BobJS

See above ..... the 600 ohm T1 sounds really nice on the LD though


----------



## mab1376

I gotta say these Tung Sol 6AK5W/5654 tubes really bring new life to my T70s, it is a much wider sound stage and a little more mid bass with some extra kick in the sub bass, still very tight though. I hope the 6N6P-IR tubes improve on this further.


----------



## voxx

Hi guys, I'm really interested in trying one of these amps as I've always hankered for a tube amp.Does anyone know if this ebay seller is trustworthy for purchasing from:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Little-Dot-MK-IV-Tube-Headphone-Amplifier-Preamp-tube-amplifier-2x-JAN-5654-NEW-/180728739758?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers&hash=item2a1445b7ae
   
  Many thanks if you can help out.


----------



## bruce108

Check with David at Little Dot to see if this guy is an authorised re-seller. What's at stake is your warranty: bought direct, it's two years. You could also ask the seller - and compare the two replies. The price offered by szclever is below LDs which says grey product to me, but maybe I'm too sceptical.


----------



## voxx

Quote: 





bruce108 said:


> Check with David at Little Dot to see if this guy is an authorised re-seller. What's at stake is your warranty: bought direct, it's two years. You could also ask the seller - and compare the two replies. The price offered by szclever is below LDs which says grey product to me, but maybe I'm too sceptical.


 
  Thanks for that. I'll email David and will report back with what he says.


----------



## BobJS

A short while back I was displeased with my MKIV SE and was looking to sell it.   Fortunately for me, I had no takers, and closed the classified and decided to burn it in for 200 hours.  I'm not sure if it was the burn-in, or the act of actually playing with the various gain settings, but the sibilance I was originally unhappy with (with my 600 ohm T1) is gone.  I've also discovered (duhhhh) that ALL my phones sound great at one or another gain setting (Mad Dogs, HD-600, HE-500).  At the original default gain of 3 the lower impedance phones were lacking in bass.   No longer.
   
  Now that I've decided to keep her, I'm going to try rolling some driver tubes.  They are a b*tch to remove ---- I assume the solution for you tube rollers is the same as the one I'm using for my Lyr ---- socket savers to elevate the tubes for easier removal?


----------



## Brooko

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> Now that I've decided to keep her, I'm going to try rolling some driver tubes.  They are a b*tch to remove ---- I assume the solution for you tube rollers is the same as the one I'm using for my Lyr ---- socket savers to elevate the tubes for easier removal?


 
   
  Unscrew the external tub enclosure - then they're easy to remove.  I just left mine off when I was actively tube-rolling (to decide which tube combination I preferred).  Once I'd settled on the right tubes, I then put the enclosure/guard back on.
   
  When you are rolling - remember to give the tubes enough time to burn-in.  I don't believe in burn-in for most things - but the tubes definitely need a certain amount of time.  Even a week's regular use makes a difference IMO.


----------



## BobJS

^^^ Thanks!


----------



## Wildings

After reading much excellent commentary, I yesterday ordered MK IV SE....which I will be using with vintage Grado RS 1's. I hope this is a good match, and am wondering if forum members recommend different tubes for this pairing? I listen to a lot of CD's, next purchase may be a Yaqin SD 32A tube HDCD player, but that's another matter. Thanks for your thoughts!


----------



## bruce108

Anyone opening the case? I'm a very happy Mk IVSE owner. But I decided to experiment with the EF91-2 range of tubes. See where I'm going with this? - sure you do. Managed to get one jumper off but couldn't get it back on in the right place. I'm not very dexterous, and that damn hole is too small. I've ordered a long curved pair of tweezers (as per a post here) so we'll see, but I'm not confident.
   
  So is opening the case possible for a non-techie mug?


----------



## Wildings

While waiting for LD arrival, I read many of the prior postings, and have some uncertainty about the pairing with my RS 1's....further confusion after reading online manual. LD should arrive next week....I would appreciate advice on the gain settings to use. If I matters, I have a pair of the Radio Shack premium Gold audio cable series.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





bruce108 said:


> Anyone opening the case? I'm a very happy Mk IVSE owner. But I decided to experiment with the EF91-2 range of tubes. See where I'm going with this? - sure you do. Managed to get one jumper off but couldn't get it back on in the right place. I'm not very dexterous, and that damn hole is too small. I've ordered a long curved pair of tweezers (as per a post here) so we'll see, but I'm not confident.
> 
> So is opening the case possible for a non-techie mug?


 
   
  How did the tweezers work out bruce?  I have never opened mine up, but be careful once inside.  Unplug it and let it drain due to the caps storing high voltages.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





wildings said:


> After reading much excellent commentary, I yesterday ordered MK IV SE....which I will be using with vintage Grado RS 1's. I hope this is a good match, and am wondering if forum members recommend different tubes for this pairing? I listen to a lot of CD's, next purchase may be a Yaqin SD 32A tube HDCD player, but that's another matter. Thanks for your thoughts!


 
   
  Quote: 





wildings said:


> While waiting for LD arrival, I read many of the prior postings, and have some uncertainty about the pairing with my RS 1's....further confusion after reading online manual. LD should arrive next week....I would appreciate advice on the gain settings to use. If I matters, I have a pair of the Radio Shack premium Gold audio cable series.


 
   
  I would try lo, med and hi gain settings and see which one gives you the more full/robust sound.
   
  Cheers!!!


----------



## bruce108

Quote: 





> How did the tweezers work out bruce?


 
   
  Haven't arrived yet - I'll let you know.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





wildings said:


> While waiting for LD arrival, I read many of the prior postings, and have some uncertainty about the pairing with my RS 1's....further confusion after reading online manual. LD should arrive next week....I would appreciate advice on the gain settings to use. If I matters, I have a pair of the Radio Shack premium Gold audio cable series.


 
   
  Don't know if this will help you as a guide (although plugging them in and listening would be best, of course).  I have 2 user manuals (2008 & 2009) and I believe I purchased my amp in 2008.  Been testing various gains with several phones.
   
   
  2008
   

   
   
   
  2009


----------



## Wildings

Recieved it a couple of days ago....I am absolutly astounded by the difference and improvement compared to line out from my CD  player...right out of the box with no break in!  As I mentioned in another post, I dont have the knowledge to be participating in the forum, at least I dont have anything to bring to the table, so to speak....but reviews I read here prompted me to buy the Little Dot, and I thank you all for that!  So, what do I do next?  My main sources are CD's from vintage Yamaha CDC-755, or streaming Slacker from Droid (no downloaded files).  A member suggested V-DAC II & V-PSU II....I looked at a Little Dot DAC I, not sure I understand the difference...and there is a new Little Dot DAC evidently, and I also looked at a Yaquin SD 32A VAcume tube CD HDCD.
  I doubt anything I could do now would give me as much improvement and enjoyment as adding the headphone amp.  Thanks all, and best from NH, Tony B.


----------



## fbxfbx

Hi,
   
   and here's my own experience that I'd like to share. I bought my LD mk IV in a trip to Hong Kong, in a shop called Mingo. Beautiful shop, where I had the possibility of listening at the mk IV and the mk III side-by-side. I decided to go for the mk IV because I liked its precise sound signature and the generous headroom.
   Once unboxed at home it was sounding a bit harsh, becoming instead very smooth, yet precise, after a few days (I let it playing for many hours unattended), and all I can say now is that it's just a very lovely amp, very well built. The comparison at home with my other headamp (a homemade single ended OTL whose sound I know very well and represents my reference) also is very good, with the LD being just a bit more aggressive sounding. I normally use a pair of HD800s, I cannot be happier. This thing is smooth, powerful and precise, a real pleasure. In the next days the LD will find its place in my office desk, where by now I use a pair of HD280Pro.
   I also did a few measurements, with a software called Baudline, playing the test sounds through a Matrix Mini-i (another excellent piece) and sampling with an Edirol UA-25 at 96KHz. I attach the graph that I consider as the most meaningful, i.e. the harmonic spectrum on a 250 ohm load at 50mW of output power. Under these conditions the LD has a THD of 0.1%, very good I would say, and, even more important, the slope of the harmonics, which contributes to the sound signature is very good as well, decaying by about 20dB per octave.
   This beautiful little toy will give me for sure a very long time of earphone satisfaction. Recommended to all the serious listeners who don't want to exaggerate with the budget!
   
  fbx


----------



## BobJS

I just got these inexpensive tubes in from Russia and they sound fantastic --- great on all counts, bass, mids, highs, soundstage :
   
4 x 6J1P-EV EF95 6F32 Voskhod Pentodes for Little Dot Amp MKII III 1980s NEW NOS
   
  I don't recall if I found them myself or found a link from this thread.  The price went up a few dollars since I purchased and they're still dirt cheap.  Only down side is it took a month to get here.
   
   
http://www.ebay.com/itm/200898030188?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


----------



## bruce108

@HeatFan12
   
  Tweezers arrived. Took the amp out into the sunlight and managed to change the jumpers first go: these tweezers are exactly the right tool for the job.


----------



## bruce108

Follow-up. So I installed a pair of GE 6CB6A [6CF6] Sharp-Cutoff Pentode Tubes (GE of Canada, "Japan" stamped on packet). Bought from dbtubes. All good, tubes working nicely & my early impressions are of a rich, but relatively clean sound - somewhere between the Mullard honey and the Western Digital's clear outlines.
   
  But then I got to wondering where I heard about these, which are not commonly listed as an EF92 possibility for Little Dot. And a search of headfi doesn't yield results. Anyone running them?


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





bruce108 said:


> @HeatFan12
> 
> Tweezers arrived. Took the amp out into the sunlight and managed to change the jumpers first go: these tweezers are exactly the right tool for the job.


 
   
  Quote: 





bruce108 said:


> Follow-up. So I installed a pair of GE 6CB6A [6CF6] Sharp-Cutoff Pentode Tubes (GE of Canada, "Japan" stamped on packet). Bought from dbtubes. All good, tubes working nicely & my early impressions are of a rich, but relatively clean sound - somewhere between the Mullard honey and the Western Digital's clear outlines.
> 
> But then I got to wondering where I heard about these, which are not commonly listed as an EF92 possibility for Little Dot. And a search of headfi doesn't yield results. Anyone running them?


 
   
   
  Great to hear those tweezers worked out great Bruce.  Seems like a great tool to have in the tool box.
   
  In reference to the tubes check these:
   
  Lots of info on different uncommon LD tubes and probably where you saw it
   
  In post #1418 in this one gibosi breaks it down with a list
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/364043/little-dot-i-tube-rolling/1410#post_9323456
   
   
  Last 12 pages or so of this one has lots of info as well on uncommon variety tubes
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/975#post_9330447
   
   
  Cheers!!!


----------



## bruce108

Many thanks HeatFan - you nailed my source. Indicates that the search function on HeadFi can fail to pick things up, pretty sure I checked it thoroughly. Also that the subject of 'best' tubes results in considerable headspin.


----------



## Powello

Quote: 





bobjs said:


> A short while back I was displeased with my MKIV SE and was looking to sell it.   Fortunately for me, I had no takers, and closed the classified and decided to burn it in for 200 hours.  I'm not sure if it was the burn-in, or the act of actually playing with the various gain settings, but the sibilance I was originally unhappy with (with my 600 ohm T1) is gone.  I've also discovered (duhhhh) that ALL my phones sound great at one or another gain setting (Mad Dogs, HD-600, HE-500).  At the original default gain of 3 the lower impedance phones were lacking in bass.   No longer.


 
   
  Oh my god, i laughed out loud when i read this!!!  not because you didn't realise, but because I totally FORGOT about gain when i was so eager to get this thing going!!!!  i was googling "little dot mk IV se not loud" and lo and behold this post made me realise "holy *#&$ there's gain in there you idiot!", cranked it up and WOW massive difference.  you saved me my friend!!!  this is my first experience with tubes and i was starting to also think maybe i sould sell and go to a SS amp... so happy now you have no idea


----------



## BobJS

Quote: 





powello said:


> Oh my god, i laughed out loud when i read this!!!  not because you didn't realise, but because I totally FORGOT about gain when i was so eager to get this thing going!!!!  i was googling "little dot mk IV se not loud" and lo and behold this post made me realise "holy *#&$ there's gain in there you idiot!", cranked it up and WOW massive difference.  you saved me my friend!!!  this is my first experience with tubes and i was starting to also think maybe i sould sell and go to a SS amp... so happy now you have no idea


 
   
  Quote: 





bobjs said:


> A short while back I was displeased with my MKIV SE and was looking to sell it.   Fortunately for me, I had no takers, and closed the classified and decided to burn it in for 200 hours.  I'm not sure if it was the burn-in, or the act of actually playing with the various gain settings, but the sibilance I was originally unhappy with (with my 600 ohm T1) is gone.  I've also discovered (duhhhh) that ALL my phones sound great at one or another gain setting (Mad Dogs, HD-600, HE-500).  At the original default gain of 3 the lower impedance phones were lacking in bass.   No longer.


 
   
  Glad my dimness could help you out.  I've since got a nice pair of long tweezers for changing the gain DIP switches.


----------



## davecollinson

set the dip switches for 5 it is more than enugh


----------



## evilscientist

Hello Head-Fi! Long time listener, first time caller and all that. Just got my Little Dot Mk IV SE. Upgraded from a Mk II and the 1st thing to note is the size difference between the two. I was not prepared for that!
   
  Anyways, I may yet get into tube rolling for the IV SE—done a bunch for my Mk II already—but for now I will enjoy the burn in period. Just picked up the Beyerdynamic DT1350s, too, so I'm in music heaven for the foreseeable future. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  (Can't seem to get a pic to upload... Oh, well)


----------



## mab1376

check out post # 1154: http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/1140


----------



## bruce108

Anyone help with a tube question? I have a MKIV SE which came with some tubes marked as follows:
   
  000-4010
   
  CV-4010
   
  KQDD/K
   
  81/27
   
  I understand that these are Mullard tubes, and I want to sell them as such - but they don't carry the Mullard stamp. Is that a problem?


----------



## Oskari

Quote: 





bruce108 said:


> I understand that these are Mullard tubes, and I want to sell them as such - but they don't carry the Mullard stamp. Is that a problem?


 
   
  Only if the buyer is adamant about it. The British Services were not interested in commercial labels on their valves.


----------



## redrum42

Hi,
   
  I want to try using my mk iv as a pre-amp. I would be using it with this integrated amp doing power amp functions: http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/shearne_phase2.htm
   
  Unfortunately there is not much info available about this amp, so I can't find out if it is DC coupled. Any ideas how I could tell? And am I right in thinking that if it is dc coupled I cannot use my little dot with it?
   
  Thanks


----------



## richmazz

Quote: 





redrum42 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I want to try using my mk iv as a pre-amp. I would be using it with this integrated amp doing power amp functions: http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/shearne_phase2.htm
> 
> ...


 
   
  I have heard that you are not supposed to use the MK IV as a preamp with integrated amps or amps that are direct coupled. I may very well be wrong, but I think that a majority of integrated amps will be DC.
   
  From what I understand, the reason that you are not supposed to use DC amps with preamps such as the LD MK IV is that the LD can leak some DC current. Then this DC current would be amplified and sent to the speakers and it can blow the speakers.
   
  DC leakage from the LD is not supposed to happen and will most likely not happen, but it can.
   
  I will say that I have broken this rule with my MK IV, just because I absolutely had to see how it sounded (it was fantastic by the way) but that was a risk that I took because my speakers are relatively cheap to replace. My system is still fine, but your mileage may vary. 
   
  Hope this helps,
  -Rich


----------



## derbigpr

I'd really appreciate if someone who used this amp with Beyer T1's or HD800's could write a few things about it. What I'm mainly interested in is the bass extension, soundstage, imaging and I also want a complete silent and dark background. Is the sound resolution of this amp good enough, or to better put it, is it transparent enough to be used with a great DAC and high end headphones?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Acapella11

In this thread, at least two head-fiers (incl. myself) post who have an HD800: http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/1710#post_9569514
   
  As you can expect, there is no simple answer to your question  but in brief you can use it with the HD800 and it will sound good. It would require a thorough review including multiple amps and the LD in order to properly answer your question though. "Best tube" recommendations are currently evaluated in the above thread and there is loads going on.


----------



## TrollDragon

The MK IV has arrived, now let the fun begin!


----------



## derbigpr

Quote: 





trolldragon said:


> The MK IV has arrived, now let the fun begin!


 
   
   
  Furst impreshuns plz


----------



## TrollDragon

I just unboxed it and have to make a splitter cable up for it. I'm going to check it out this weekend and post some impressions for you. It will be driven from the line out on my E17/E09K combo using foobar off the PC.


----------



## foreign

I'm thinking about buying the little dot mkiv to pair it with my hd650s seems like its a good amp by looking at this thread. I haven't had a chance to audition the tube amp. Probably going to take a gamble and buy it.


----------



## TrollDragon

Go for it, I did for my DT880's. Thoroughly enjoying the amp, but play with the gain settings and never mind the manuals recommendations. Mine came at 3 default and it had serious harshness to the sound. I moved the gain to 5 and all is good again, this weekend going to see what 10 sounds like. But from what I read I'll probably go back to 5.

Sent from my HTC Desire HD A9191 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Ehr33

Mi





foreign said:


> I'm thinking about buying the little dot mkiv to pair it with my hd650s seems like its a good amp by looking at this thread. I haven't had a chance to audition the tube amp. Probably going to take a gamble and buy it.




You can't go wrong with those pair. Feed it with a good DAC and it will make your HD650 sing!


----------



## foreign

Cheers already have a dac and amp but I'm not happy with the amp that I currently have. Heard a different tube amp at a friends house and what can I say was blown away. The tube amp was a few $k but as it will be my first tube amp I'm sure it will sound fantastic.


----------



## Joel71

I have had the Little Dot MKIV SE for 2 months now. I have noticed while listening to soft music that I can hear some noise at volume level 70 or above. I am a new listener and this is my first tube amp. I asked Little Dot about the issue and they told me that this is a normal issue with tube amps. He stated that the tubes have a floor. Is this true? Do you all have this same issue? I tried different headphones and different wires. No change. 

Does anyone pair their MKIV SE with Denon AH-D7000 and Sennheiser HD800? 

-Joel


----------



## bruce108

70 is very high. Try a higher gain setting, unless you're already maxed out. That should reduce the need for volume - and thr problem. Mine (on about 50, gain setting 5) is dead silent into 600ohm Beyers.


----------



## Acapella11

Quote: 





joel71 said:


> I have had the Little Dot MKIV SE for 2 months now. I have noticed while listening to soft music that I can hear some noise at volume level 70 or above. I am a new listener and this is my first tube amp. I asked Little Dot about the issue and they told me that this is a normal issue with tube amps. He stated that the tubes have a floor. Is this true? Do you all have this same issue? I tried different headphones and different wires. No change.
> 
> Does anyone pair their MKIV SE with Denon AH-D7000 and Sennheiser HD800?
> 
> -Joel


 
   
  Try a gain of 10. I use this, generally, even with HD800. Then, yes 70 is very high. I hardly ever exceed 50 with the HD800, at a gian of 10. As David Zhezhe pointed out, some tubes also have a noise floor, that's right. If you would be using military spec tubes or heptodes as driver tubes, it would be lesser likely.


----------



## foreign

Hmmm think there's something wrong with the little dot I just recieved. The tubes just barely glow and a 32ohm headset seems barely audible. Have to have the dial maxed out on the little dot. I did just unpack it maybe I should send it back??


----------



## TrollDragon

Quote: 





foreign said:


> Hmmm think there's something wrong with the little dot I just recieved. The tubes just barely glow and a 32ohm headset seems barely audible. Have to have the dial maxed out on the little dot. I did just unpack it maybe I should send it back??


 
  My first thought it that it is a 220V version running from 110V mains. What does the voltage sticker say on the back?


----------



## foreign

I'm in Australia def 220volts, the tube amp never seems to get warm sorry its mkiii not iv and the tubes barely glow. Is this normal???


----------



## Joel71

bruce108 said:


> 70 is very high. Try a higher gain setting, unless you're already maxed out. That should reduce the need for volume - and thr problem. Mine (on about 50, gain setting 5) is dead silent into 600ohm Beyers.



 
 Thank you for the post. I did some troubleshooting and discovered that the issue is my DAC. It does not syn well with the tubes. I would not have imagined. I will be buying a new DAC soon. I have been looking at the Rein Audio X3. I have read great reviews about it. But seeing how it is only at 70 and above it isn't too big of an issue. 70 is quite high i suppose. Thank you for the input.


----------



## Joel71

acapella11 said:


> Try a gain of 10. I use this, generally, even with HD800. Then, yes 70 is very high. I hardly ever exceed 50 with the HD800, at a gian of 10. As David Zhezhe pointed out, some tubes also have a noise floor, that's right. If you would be using military spec tubes or heptodes as driver tubes, it would be lesser likely.



 
 Thank you for the post. I did some troubleshooting and discovered that the issue is my DAC. It does not syn well with the tubes. I would not have imagined. I will be buying a new DAC soon. I have been looking at the Rein Audio X3. I have read great reviews about it. But seeing how it is only at 70 and above it isn't too big of an issue. 70 is quite high i suppose. Thank you for the input. It actually wasn't the MKIV at all. I plugged in my iPod to test it out and the noise was gone all together. Even at 100 there wasn't a hint of noise. I wonder if the Rein Audio X3 would be a good pair with the MKIV SE.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





trolldragon said:


> Go for it, I did for my DT880's. Thoroughly enjoying the amp, but play with the gain settings and never mind the manuals recommendations. Mine came at 3 default and it had serious harshness to the sound. I moved the gain to 5 and all is good again, this weekend going to see what 10 sounds like. But from what I read I'll probably go back to 5.
> 
> Sent from my HTC Desire HD A9191 using Tapatalk 2


 
   
   
  How's the MK IV treating you TD?
   
   
   
  Quote: 





joel71 said:


> Thank you for the post. I did some troubleshooting and discovered that the issue is my DAC. It does not syn well with the tubes. I would not have imagined. I will be buying a new DAC soon. I have been looking at the Rein Audio X3. I have read great reviews about it. But seeing how it is only at 70 and above it isn't too big of an issue. 70 is quite high i suppose. Thank you for the input.It actually wasn't the MKIV at all. *I plugged in my iPod to test it out and the noise was gone all together*. Even at 100 there wasn't a hint of noise. I wonder if the Rein Audio X3 would be a good pair with the MKIV SE.


 
   
   
  Great troubleshooting Joel.  The best way to find out if your amp is at fault is plug a DAP into it.  On desktop setups (especially computer audio) there are many things in the chain that could be the culprit.


----------



## TrollDragon

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> How's the MK IV treating you TD?


 
  The honeymoon is still on, I fire it up go out for a smoke and when I come back in plug the cans in and enjoy. I still haven't tried a 10 gain yet but the 5 is sounding very nice.
  Picture up in the Sone Love Zone!


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





trolldragon said:


> The honeymoon is still on, I fire it up go out for a smoke and when I come back in plug the cans in and enjoy. I still haven't tried a 10 gain yet but the 5 is sounding very nice.
> Picture up in the Sone Love Zone!


 
   
   
  That's great TD...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Yes, the 5 gain is good for various phones.  Give the 10 a shot with the Beyers and then see if the 'Sones cooperate.
   
  I saw that you checked out the LD tube rolling thread...Those guys over there are real players...lol...I remember when the EF91, 92 and 95 family as well as all their variants was going strong.  Now with all the other tubes they have found and cutting pins and strapping, they have taken it to a whole 'nother level.
   
  Amazing!
   
  Cheers!


----------



## TrollDragon

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> That's great TD...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I'll give the 10 a try this weekend, yeah the guys in the tube rolling thread are some serious hard core rollers. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Gonna be fun playing with some heptodes down the road.


----------



## mab1376

Quote: 





trolldragon said:


> I'll give the 10 a try this weekend, yeah the guys in the tube rolling thread are some serious hard core rollers.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I use 5 on my HD650 and T70 and its more than sufficient. I would up it to 10 for low impedance for low ohm rated phones since OTL is designed for high impedance.
   
  get a pair of 6BE6 and 6BY6 tubes and you won't be disappointed.


----------



## TrollDragon

Quote: 





mab1376 said:


> I use 5 on my HD650 and T70 and its more than sufficient. I would up it to 10 for low impedance for low ohm rated phones since OTL is designed for high impedance.
> 
> get a pair of 6BE6 and 6BY6 tubes and you won't be disappointed.


 
   
  Thanks mab1376!
   
  I'll try those settings out with the 'Sones and look for a set of those tubes. This is going to rock!
   
  More fun than chasing OpAmps, I should sell my collection of them to create a tube fund.


----------



## sennsay

HI to all you Mk IVSE owners. Although I've posted plenty on HeadFi over a few years - less recently - I have a pair of Senn HD650s which could really do with a fine amp, other than the KHA (highly modified Jacar amps) and the Corda 2Move. So, now that I have settled back in OZ, I am seriously considering a nice valve amp to power them and I've loved the look of the Little Dot models for years now, especially from the IVSE model on up. Be great if I could afford the Mk VII or Mk VIII, but at the moment I'm loving the idea of the Mk IVSE. This thread looks like a good place to start  
 Ok, a little advice from some of you long term afficionados would be greatly appreciated. I take it that there are some fabulous new amps out there that will drive the HD650s just fine, however I'm quite taken with the IVSE, as mentioned, and I'm wondering if this amp is still up there in the SQ stakes? I remember Penchum's ripper review of the combo some years back, but I would like to hear some of your more current thoughts and feelings on your experiences. True, I know there are 22 pages here, but if I can avoid sifting through it all - amongst many other pages on the site in general - I'd prefer to. The above question is probably number one for me at the moment. Are there any particular issues that require consideration as well, such as reliability etc?

P.S. I use a Triode Corporation TRV-88SE valve amp in my main system which has a headphone jack, though it doesn't really suit the HD650s. It sounds ok, but strangely suits my 23 year old Senn HD540 Reference cans at 600ohms much better. 

 Cheers guys


----------



## amham

I've owned the MKIVSE now for about 3+ years and, this may be against common wisdom, but I keep going back to it as my preferred amp.  Now, I own an Woo WA6SE, Benchmark HDC2, Schiit Asgard 2 and several other highly regarded amps and use both Senn HD650 and HiFiman He-500's.  With the HE-500 the LD sounds absolutely terrific!  The whole spectrum is smooth, quiet and alive.  The bass is particularly solid and deep (this is the part that is not suppose to be).  I sense no noise or other artifacts.  The soundstage is open, wide and  natural.  I can't explain it but this is my "go to" amp time and again...go figure!  I suggest you buy one and play with several differing tubes, you will not regret it!


----------



## steppenout

Quote: 





amham said:


> I've owned the MKIVSE now for about 3+ years and, this may be against common wisdom, but I keep going back to it as my preferred amp.  Now, I own an Woo WA6SE, Benchmark HDC2, Schiit Asgard 2 and several other highly regarded amps and use both Senn HD650 and HiFiman He-500's.  With the HE-500 the LD sounds absolutely terrific!  The whole spectrum is smooth, quiet and alive.  The bass is particularly solid and deep (this is the part that is not suppose to be).  I sense no noise or other artifacts.  The soundstage is open, wide and  natural.  I can't explain it but this is my "go to" amp time and again...go figure!  I suggest you buy one and play with several differing tubes, you will not regret it!


 
   
  Which tubes have you found that suit you the best?


----------



## mab1376

Quote: 





steppenout said:


> Which tubes have you found that suit you the best?


 
   
  6BE6 (EK90) - Telefunken, or Siemens if you can find them, also IBM from the 1950's are awesome and super cheap, use them with standard M8100 (EF95) settings.


----------



## Makiah S

Quick question could I run a High Impedance can like the Dt 880 600 ohm and a Low Impedance can like teh w1000x out of the LD MK IV? Does it have some kinda of Gain or power adjustment setting 
   
  also $459 for the LD MK IV Se, shipped doesn't sound bad at all . I wonder what the differance between the SE and non SE where, and well high quality interconnectors sold me! I've had a few amps have Interconnectors go bad on me q.q


----------



## TrollDragon

Quote: 





mshenay said:


> Quick question could I run a High Impedance can like the Dt 880 600 ohm and a Low Impedance can like teh w1000x out of the LD MK IV? Does it have some kinda of Gain or power adjustment setting
> 
> also $459 for the LD MK IV Se, shipped doesn't sound bad at all . I wonder what the differance between the SE and non SE where, and well high quality interconnectors sold me! I've had a few amps have Interconnectors go bad on me q.q


 

 Gain settings are 3, 4, 5 and 10, I have mine set to 5 at the moment for the DT880 Pro's, a friend was over last night and wanted to hear the Koss TBSE1's @ 38Ω so I plugged them in and they sounded good as well with the 5 gain setting.
   
  I have the MK IV but mine came with the SE's Power tubes, and as for the better quality jacks and RCA's... I can change those down the road if there ever is a problem. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Let us know if you decide to pick one up!


----------



## Makiah S

It will be quite a while before I do. I'm mega broke atm. So maybe during the spring when I get my taxes back... but that's still good to know!


----------



## rnadell

How does this amp work with the hd600's?
  thanks


----------



## Brooko

Really nice with the HD600s when I had them.  Very clean background, powerful bass (to my tastes anyway), and beautifully euphonic mid-range.  Mind you - I liked the HD600 with most amps .... a really special headphone!


----------



## rnadell

Who is the vendor of choice to buy this amp from?


----------



## Brooko

Direct from Little Dot - or via their E-Bay account
   
*This page* has more details.  David and his team are really good to deal with


----------



## sennsay

Thanks amham, I'm going to buy one. I think I'm right in saying that one can be ordered with better tubes supplied? Where do you buy your favourite tubes from,  an eBay dealer?  Maybe they will also be a treat with my new Sony MD-1Rs as well, though they are far more efficient and lower impedance than the Senn HD650s.


----------



## HPiper

Quote: 





mshenay said:


> Quick question could I run a High Impedance can like the Dt 880 600 ohm and a Low Impedance can like teh w1000x out of the LD MK IV? Does it have some kinda of Gain or power adjustment setting
> 
> also $459 for the LD MK IV Se, shipped doesn't sound bad at all . I wonder what the differance between the SE and non SE where, and well high quality interconnectors sold me! I've had a few amps have Interconnectors go bad on me q.q


 

  I have the MkIII not the IV, but I have some Grados and some HD650's and at gain 5, they both sound really super good out of this amp. The more I listen to it the more I like it and that is with the stock tubes even.


----------



## HPiper

Quote: 





sennsay said:


> Thanks amham, I'm going to buy one. I think I'm right in saying that one can be ordered with better tubes supplied? Where do you buy your favourite tubes from,  an eBay dealer?  Maybe they will also be a treat with my new Sony MD-1Rs as well, though they are far more efficient and lower impedance than the Senn HD650s.


 

 Yes you can order it with the good tubes already installed from David. I looked at buying some from Tube-Depot but the money you save isn't really all that much. So when I go to upgrade my MkIII to the IVse I am just going to get them directly from him and avoid the hassle.


----------



## siles1991

I'm getting the littledot mkiv soon and I have a fostex t50rp ortho 50ohms I should set it to x5 or x10 gain iirc? I was also wondering why higher gain for lower impedance phones? I thought gain was to make low volumes higher, but low impedance phones can have decent volumes at lower gain could someone explain this part I dont understand haha sorry.


----------



## sennsay

Brilliant, thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  PS, which address do you buy the amp from directly from David?


----------



## Makiah S

Quote: 





hpiper said:


> Yes you can order it with the good tubes already installed from David. I looked at buying some from Tube-Depot but the money you save isn't really all that much. So when I go to upgrade my MkIII to the IVse I am just going to get them directly from him and avoid the hassle.


 
  That's good to know... I wonder though any reomendation on Extra Lean Tubes for this amp... I like the sound of my Hybrid Tube with Clear Top RCAs and I'm hoping [and pretty certain] that this would be a GREAT upgrade in sound quality to my crummy little Millet Hybrid, my concern though is how Warm are those mids going to be... I wouldn't want them too much warmer than the Hybrid Tube, but I assume they will be seeing as the MKIV is a full Tube. That being said I'm sure the extra mid warmth would still be cleaner and tighter due to the superior contrustion quality of the MKIV over my little millet.
   
  Still any good extra LEAN tubes for this amp!


----------



## HeaderForPeace

Hi all. I joined head fi just to share my appreciation of my little dot mark ivSE and sennheiser HD 600 combo. I genuinely listen to a broad range of music - mostly hi def through my iPhone. Both the amp and the headphone represent awesome value on their own, but they fit together beautifully - hitting the sweet spot between detail and musicality. It's a setup I would recommend to anyone who's looking for the best value at around $800.


----------



## BobJS

I've been having periodic episodes of wanting to sell my mkiv/se and tube collection .......  could be my acquisition of the Burson Conductor has something to do with it ......
   
  And now, switching gears completely......
   
  Has anyone had an opportunity to compare the MkIV with the often-mentioned Bottlehead Crack with Speedball?  Do these OTL amps go head to head?


----------



## Wildings

Also off topic here....considering selling my LD IV SE and getting the Burson Soloist....I am listening with new Audeze 3's and not sure if I need more power. Would appreciate advice on the best LD settings for these cans....seem to be more switch settings than in the manual. Thank you.


----------



## mab1376

you can try Gain 10 which is set using the dip switches, but an OTL amp is not ideal for orthos.
   
  I think you would be much happier with the soloist for those cans IMO. Some people like the LD with the HE-500 which has a similar power requirement so maybe upping the gain would help you out.
   
  Personally I would look for a hybrid amp such as the Schiit Lyr which outputs 4w into 32 ohms and has a Solid state amp stage and tube gain stage.
   
  I plan on purchasing the Little Dot MK VI+ with the HE-500 in the future which has a much higher power output then the MK IV/III.


----------



## Wildings

Thank you for the LD advice, the setting of 10 did give noticeable improvement. The whole issue with the switches has been confusing to me: I have two separate red switch 'blocks' - each has two switches, numbered 1 and 2, so the reference in the manual to switch 1or 2 is ambiguous (to me!). Anyway, all on "off" and sounds better. Could you give me a simple explanation to something - are my Audeze 3' s " high impedance with low sensitivity loads". Thank you so much...my hearing ain't too bad, but my comprehension....well, not so great!


----------



## Wildings

Just listed my 5 month old LDMKIV SE on e bay for $340 plus shipping (fair price?)....if it sells will try the Burson Soloist or the LD VIII to pair with recent Audeze 3's - I think they will do well with the additional power.


----------



## lothloriel

Hi all,
  
 Quick question; does anyone have any experience pairing the mk4 with headphones such as the Audio Technica W1000x? I read a lot about user experiences with higher impedence cans but not many with lower.


----------



## Wildings

After setting the red switches on my little dot 4 on gain setting 10 and listening for a few sessions (audeze 3's), it seemed that yes there was more volume with a lower dial setting....but the sound seemed 'thinner', the soundstage not so full and three dimensional, as when on factory default setting
Of 3 with both switches on. Sound definatly seemed better on this setting, with the dial turned up to a higher position. I will leave it to technically savvy to explain.....or tell me is my imagination!


----------



## Wildings

My LD Mark 4 SE is on e bay.. if any forum members interested, contact me and I will lower price. Currently at $330 plus shipping. Will do what I can to hook you u up - let me know what would work for you, within reason.


----------



## Wildings

Thank you to any who had interest.  It was just sold.


----------



## mink42

Hi guys, after a very lengthy search I think im finally settling on a little dot MK III or MKIV.
  
 Just wondering what the difference was between these two?
  
 Also was looking at getting a DAC for it as well but funds are relatively low  would a schiit modi suffice?
  
 I currently have an Asus STX which I guess I could use as a DAC then connect the little dot
  
 STX>Little Dot MKXXX> HD600


----------



## apeschi

I asked the same question directly to David Zhezhe.
  
 He answered:
 "The MK III and MK IV are both based on the same SEPP OTL in Class A design, however the MK IV has a slightly different circuit implementation as well as tubes for better overall performance. The SE version of the MK IV further improves with custom RCA jacks, upgraded circuit components, connectors, and even better tubes. Generally we recommend the MK III as the best price/performance value and the MK IV or SE for those who want those last few percentages of performance. "
  
 I'm thinking to order MK IV SE


----------



## HPiper

mink42 said:


> Hi guys, after a very lengthy search I think im finally settling on a little dot MK III or MKIV.
> 
> Just wondering what the difference was between these two?
> 
> ...


 
 I am currently using a Modi with my MkIII and it is a very fine dac, I was going to say 'for the money' but in fact it is a very fine dac period. I got it for the same reason as you, after buying a MkIII and some HD650's funds were low and that was the cheapest dac I saw that seemed to be anything even close to 'Hi-Fi' I am not the least bit disappointed, far exceeded my expectations.


----------



## mink42

I purchased the MKIV and it sounds great, however I get a buzzing in the right hand channel. It seems to be the right hand power tube not being seated properly. I changed power tubes around just to check if the tube was the issue, still get the same issue on the right hand channel. Once I seat it properly, the channel disturbance is gone, however, it seems persistent in returning usually within 24 hours. Any ideas?


----------



## Brooko

mink42 said:


> I purchased the MKIV and it sounds great, however I get a buzzing in the right hand channel. It seems to be the right hand power tube not being seated properly. I changed power tubes around just to check if the tube was the issue, still get the same issue on the right hand channel. Once I seat it properly, the channel disturbance is gone, however, it seems persistent in returning usually within 24 hours. Any ideas?


 
  
 Yep - contact David.  He's really good with replying - and he'll be the best person to talk to regarding possible causes / or if there is any easy fix.


----------



## mink42

Sent him an email yesterday, I think he's enjoying his weekend though


----------



## mab1376

Try checking the tube jumper on the right channel for EF95 and EF92.
  
 May have come loose in the shipping.


----------



## TrollDragon

Sounds to me like a possible bad solder joint near or on the power tube socket.

When I had mine apart I noticed the soldering of these boards leaves a lot to be desired, so I went through and resoldered the whole board.


----------



## mink42

Email back from david... fairly blunt, said to check the troubleshooting guide and clean the pins. As the problem doesn't seem to be isolated to one tube ie the channel distortion occurs regardless of which tube is placed it's gotta be something else. Waiting for a reply from little dot. 
  
 I'm not very tech savvy, ie i don't own a soldering iron, and I don't really feel terribly comfortable taking apart the little dot... but I will if i have to, is this really my only option?


----------



## TrollDragon

Wow really sorry to hear that, One gets really pumped up and then there is an issue with the product and that really takes all the enjoyment out of it for sure.

That's the problem with these things out of China shoddy workmanship from the little companies and cost way too much to ship it back.

But they say David is supposed to be a great guy to deal with, and has in the past paid for shipping both ways on defective gear, or so I've read.

If you bought it from eBay then Negative Feedback can be your friend as well as a claim filed with PayPal etc... But those are last resorts.

So stay on him about it and if you do not end up getting any satisfactory results... I can assist you in getting the board out as it is a real pig to get apart.

You could then take the board to a buddy who solders and not a dude with a soldering gun. 

It just sounds like bad solder to me, when you say you reseat the tube and the hum goes away.

The ground for the board is the front right screw on top in the black area by the right driver tube, it's a shot in the dark but make sure that is tight. Try not to mark up the head of it when tightening just incase you have to send the amp back. They use cheap screws too... 

Good Luck and if you need any help with disassembly just ask.


----------



## mab1376

trolldragon said:


> Wow really sorry to hear that, One gets really pumped up and then there is an issue with the product and that really takes all the enjoyment out of it for sure.
> 
> That's the problem with these things out of China shoddy workmanship from the little companies and cost way too much to ship it back.


 
  
 Luckily I haven't had any issue with build quality, but I've seen some HeadAmp and Woo Audio soldering work and its top notch compared to the LittleDot.
  
 ...But you will pay out the ass for the kind of quality.
  
 ...one day


----------



## TrollDragon

Yes indeed, I would expect the Woo tier of product to be excellent in build quality. I imagine most of it is hand soldered, where as the LD board probably went through a wave solderer and then was touched up for bridges and cold solders by hand.

I have already had to change the headphone jack on mine for a Neutrik one, the clone one would cut out one channel if you moved the plug a little...

And yes you will pay for quality product, the more man hours involved the higher the price.

One day there will be a McIntosh 275 50th Anniversary system in the living room. 

Don't get me wrong, I really like the LD MK IV, its just the little things like jumpers and gain switches that could have been made more accessible for a few bucks more. I also didn't see spending $100+ more on the SE version for a $7 headphone jack and $5 RCA plugs... Mine already had the 6H30Pi-EH's installed and LD states that there are better components in the audio chain as well, but boutique capacitors are a very subjective thing. 

Hopefully mink42 gets his issue resolved and moves on to Rollin' some fine Heptodes and enjoying the music!


----------



## mink42

Thanks so much for your input Troll! Really helpful! 
  
 I by no means am bagging on little dot as everything so far in terms of customer service has been excellent bar that last email. I'll give him a few days to reply to my latest and I'll update you as to the outcome. Everything I've read about LD and David leaves me quite confident that I won't be left high and dry. 
  
 And yes when I reseat the tube and press it firmly down the hum goes away, however after a variable amount of time..... the hum of minor annoyance returns..


----------



## TrollDragon

Hey mink42 any updates?


----------



## mink42

I got an email from David saying to try the trouble shooting guide and email back the results. I bought some de oxidizer to clean the pins of the tubes and that hasn't helped either. Definitely something with the amp and not isolated to a tube, otherwise I would have just bought some new tubes! Will email him back tonight and take it from there, considering just returning it at this stage and buying an amp locally :-/


----------



## TrollDragon

Wow that is really too bad, are you still going to look at tubes, possibly a Valhalla or a hybrid Lyr from Schiit?

The Garage1217.com Project Ember gets some very high praise from its owner's. 
 http://garage1217.com/graphic_design_004.htm
The looks of it is just not to my liking.

Thanks for the update and please keep us posted!


----------



## atistatic

mink42 said:


> Hi guys, after a very lengthy search I think im finally settling on a little dot MK III or MKIV.
> 
> Just wondering what the difference was between these two?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi, well the sound card has a serious problem, i had the xonar essence ST as DAC with LD MK VI+, i still have dat amp and i replace the sound card ST to Anedio D2, the sound cards problem that there's a spark sound specially is notoriously with Piano solo musics.


----------



## eyal1983

Did someone here had a chance to compare the LD to the Bottlehead Crack ?


----------



## pragu

It looks like the SE edition is on sale for the next few days... anyone know how these would do to drive HE-500's? The power output seems a little low...
  


> Did someone here had a chance to compare the LD to the Bottlehead Crack ?


 
 I'd love to see this as well.


----------



## amham

The amp has more than enough power to drive the HE-500.  I own both and very pleased with the synergies.


----------



## pragu

Is there an appreciable difference between the two? I'm trying to find the right path to move up from my little Aune T1, and I'm a little uncertain! The Schiit Lyr seems to be a popular choice, but it is on the expensive side (as is the Bottlehead Crack).


----------



## TrollDragon

You might want to remove the Massdrop link as that is not allowed here on HF.


----------



## pragu

Good catch, thank you!


----------



## TrollDragon

Anytime!


----------



## Ebonyzer

amham, can you elaborate on your experience with the SE and the HE-500's? I have an SE on the way and have been intrigued by the HE-500 lately. I thought I'd heard someone talk about them being mismatched, but I reckon it's a personal taste matter and would appreciate hearing about yours if you didn't mind.


----------



## Audiofanboy

ebonyzer said:


> amham, can you elaborate on your experience with the SE and the HE-500's? I have an SE on the way and have been intrigued by the HE-500 lately. I thought I'd heard someone talk about them being mismatched, but I reckon it's a personal taste matter and would appreciate hearing about yours if you didn't mind.


 
  
 That's the difference between theory and practice, basically. People have been raving about how the HE-500 is supposed to be really hard to drive, need 2000W to sound good, and blah blah blah... But, it's still a sensitive enough pair of headphones, that despite its low impedance (and therefore inherent mismatch with OTL tube amps, especially less powerful ones), has no damping factor issues because it's an ortho (flat impedance throughout all frequencies, behaves like a resistor across the whole spectrum in a way, unlike typical high impedance dynamic phones like the HD650) and doesn't really care about the high output impedance an OTL tube amp like the MK IV would have (which would be the "problem" here: impedance mismatch).
  
 So, unlike dynamic phones, the worst the HE-500 can suffer is being a little bit starved for current, but for the HE-500 to sound "bad", it would take more than just a less powerful amp, you'd need to severely underpower it (think ipod or iphone). High impedance dynamic headphones like the HD650, on the other hand, sound like Schiit when paired with the wrong type of amp and/or when underpowered (think cheap SS amp with some current but very little voltage amplification).
  
 The HE-500 isn't actually very picky with amps, so long as they get some degree of current amplification. And even the MK IV SE will deliver more than enough current to low impedance cans (despite being made for the exact opposite application) to drive the HE-500 to ear-shattering levels. The worst you _could_ and probably _won't _be missing out on is a tiny bit of bass, that only a full-size speaker could give you, and the OTL detail and 3D sound more than covers for that (and upgraded tubes cover that too).
  
 I've been using the HE-500 with my MK IV SE for almost a year now, and I can at least vouch for the fact that there is tremendous synergy between the two. Balanced-sounding orthos like the HE-500 (Audeze's less so from what I hear) just pair marvelously well with OTL amps in terms of sound, it's like hearing ultra-detail in a velour glove or something. And with the right tubes, I dare you to find anything missing with that pairing!
  
 Hope that helps
  
 A happy MK IV SE user


----------



## Wicked world

Quick question!
  
 I own a pair of *Beyerdynamic DT-990 250 Ohm*, and I just received a *Little Dot MK IV SE*.
  
 How do I set the gain switches for my 250 Ohm Beyers?
  
 Gain of 10 - High impedance or low sensitivity loads.
  
 Gain of 5 - Medium impedance or medium sensitivity.
  
 Gain of 4 - Medium impedance or medium sensitivity.
  
 Gain of 3 - Low impedance or high sensitivity.
  
 A few quick pointers would be highly appreciated!


----------



## Audiofanboy

Typical answer would be to test what setting sounds best, but Little Dot would probably recommend gain x10 as a best match for this type of headphone.
  
 Hope you like the amp!


----------



## Wicked world

I hope I will like it too of course! For starters, it's definitely nice to look at! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 If my Beyers would be 600 Ohms I would surely put the gain on x10 straight away. But does the 250 Ohm version also count as high?


----------



## TrollDragon

Yes, as AFB says test what setting sounds best.

My personal experience with the DT880 Pro's 250 Ohm, the amp came default at 3 which I didn't like the sound of at all. I bypassed 4 and went to 5 which I found sounded much better and gave me a nice listening volume at 10-11 o'clock on the dial. I tried 10 and found too much volume to soon at 8 - 9 o'clock fo my linking. I like my volume controls near the midway point for operation but that is just me... 

Check the setting out to see what you like best and Welcome to the Club!


----------



## TrollDragon

The tube rolling thread will probably be your next stop...


----------



## Audiofanboy

Yup, TD speaks the truth. I definitely wouldn't use x3 and x4, as it both sounds bad and and requires a little too much volume on the dial to get to comfortable levels.
  
 I do recall Little Dot recommending the highest gain for high impedance cans (300 ohms +) like the HD650, so I think you could safely lump a 250 ohms headphone in the same category.
  
 Way back when I got the MK IV SE paired with the Senn HD650, I had spent time with both x5 - when I was using the unit as an occasional preamp - and x10, and eventually settled for x10 since it gave me the best sound; imho of course, since some find the highest gain - lowest feedback - setting to be too thin, but I find it more realistic and natural.
  
 So, yeah, try it out and report your findings!


----------



## Wicked world

Thanks for the input! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 I'm gonna spend this evening trying out x5 and x10 and see which I like best!


----------



## HFoletto

Hello, how are you?

 I bought a Little Dot IV SE 1 year ago used from a forum member.
 When I receive it was working quite fine and how I wish.

 However several months later the left channel started sound louder than the right one. I tried switch the power tubes of place and nothing. The same happened with the driver tubes.

 What could be the problem and how to fix it?
 I use other amp with the same source and this problem does not happen.

 Thank you for reading, have a great day.


----------



## rosgr63

Hello.
  
 Check if the gain switches are set the same on both channels.


----------



## HFoletto

Hello there!

 Thank you for the reply, I really appreciate it.
 Well, I'm not sure how to check it, so I took a photo of how it is now: http://i.imgur.com/zoO2bO0.jpg
 Sorry for the low quality picture.
  
 So, are the switches right?

 Thank you again.


----------



## rosgr63

Sorry I can't be of more help, I need to check my amp first to be sure.


----------



## MIKELAP

hfoletto said:


> Hello there!
> 
> Thank you for the reply, I really appreciate it.
> Well, I'm not sure how to check it, so I took a photo of how it is now: http://i.imgur.com/zoO2bO0.jpg
> ...


 
 your gain switches look to be  the same on each channel . you said you changed around your power tube and you have same problem and also driver tube and problem is still there in left channel did you try other tubes then the ones originally on the amp to see if same problem.


----------



## HFoletto

mikelap said:


> your gain switches look to be  the same on each channel . you said you changed around your power tube and you have same problem and also driver tube and problem is still there in left channel did you try other tubes then the ones originally on the amp to see if same problem.


 
  
 Well, I haven't tried any other tube, just the ones that came with it.
 I'm afraid to buy those tube new and the problem persist. They aren't cheap though.

 It's really weird because the problem started suddenly..

 Thank you for the reply!


----------



## MIKELAP

hfoletto said:


> Well, I haven't tried any other tube, just the ones that came with it.
> I'm afraid to buy those tube new and the problem persist. They aren't cheap though.
> 
> It's really weird because the problem started suddenly..
> ...


 
 but you did change around the power tubes and driver tubes .what driver tubes are you using in your amp .Also the jumpers on your amp are they positionned ok if you have a EF95 type tube both jumpers should be on EF95 setting thats about all i can think off let me know


----------



## HFoletto

mikelap said:


> but you did change around the power tubes and driver tubes .what driver tubes are you using in your amp .Also the jumpers on your amp are they positionned ok if you have a EF95 type tube both jumpers should be on EF95 setting thats about all i can think off let me know


 
 Yes, I changed the power tubes and the driver tubes around.
 Those are the tubes I'm using:
Driver Tubes: 2x JAN 5654
Power Tubes: 2x Soviet 6H30EH

 Thank you again.


----------



## MIKELAP

hfoletto said:


> Yes, I changed the power tubes and the driver tubes around.
> Those are the tubes I'm using:
> Driver Tubes: 2x JAN 5654
> Power Tubes: 2x Soviet 6H30EH
> ...


 
 Last thing i can think of is check the jumper settings under the amp below the gain setting in other holes if mk4 is similar to mk3  the jumpers should be on EF95 SETTINGs since you are using 5654 tubes


----------



## HFoletto

mikelap said:


> Last thing i can think of is check the jumper settings under the amp below the gain setting in other holes if mk4 is similar to mk3  the jumpers should be on EF95 SETTINGs since you are using 5654 tubes


 
 Hmmm, I tried to take pictures of the other 2 holes but it's so hard to see and even more to take a picture. I tried my best, here they are:
 http://i.imgur.com/fv2YKmb.jpg
 http://i.imgur.com/ChmXe6c.jpg

 What do you think?

 Thank you again.


----------



## MIKELAP

hfoletto said:


> Hmmm, I tried to take pictures of the other 2 holes but it's so hard to see and even more to take a picture. I tried my best, here they are:
> http://i.imgur.com/fv2YKmb.jpg
> http://i.imgur.com/ChmXe6c.jpg
> 
> ...


 
 Heres a picture if im not mistaken this should be on  EF95 setting   is your jumper placed like that .just checked your pictures again looks like they are well placed


----------



## MIKELAP

So maybe its a solder joint  thats not wright i dont know .sorry but cant help you more


----------



## HFoletto

mikelap said:


> So maybe its a solder joint  thats not wright i dont know .sorry but cant help you more


 
 Thank you, I really appreciate your help.

 It's so weird that it was suddenly. I will ask if someone can lend me their tubes and then I can give it a try.

 Thank you again.


----------



## TrollDragon

hfoletto said:


> Hello, how are you?
> 
> 
> I bought a Little Dot IV SE 1 year ago used from a forum member.
> ...


Hi HFoletto,
Following along here since you have checked your source with another amp that eliminates the source. Tubes switched sides and still the same problem would eliminate the tubes.

Try moving your headphone plug around in the jack while it's plugged in and see if it is the headphone socket. Grab the plug and apply a little sideways force to it, up down left and right to see if the sound comes back.

I have the MK IV not SE and had to change my headphone jack since the non SE versions are really cheap clone Neutrik Jacks.

Other than that I would guess there is a component bad on your board, or the volume pot going bad.

Those little gain switches might have some dirt / corrosion on the contacts as well, so take a little screwdriver and move the switches back and forth a half a dozen times to clear the debris if any.

Also could possibly be a dirty socket hole on the driver / power tube sockets you might want to try a piece of wire just a hair bigger than the tube pins and go in and out of each socket hole a few times to clean them.

Do all of the above with the power cord UNPLUGGED and the amp left for a few minutes to discharge the capacitors inside.

These are the things I would try, and hopefully it is just the headphone jack which is very easy to clean (Q-Tip with contact Cleaner) or if you have to change it only requires some basic soldering skills or a friend who solders.

Good Luck and let us know how things turn out.


----------



## HFoletto

trolldragon said:


> Hi HFoletto,
> Following along here since you have checked your source with another amp that eliminates the source. Tubes switched sides and still the same problem would eliminate the tubes.
> 
> Try moving your headphone plug around in the jack while it's plugged in and see if it is the headphone socket. Grab the plug and apply a little sideways force to it, up down left and right to see if the sound comes back.
> ...


 
 Hey TrollDragon,
 Thank you so much! I really appreciate all your help!

 Yeah, seems like the problem isn't on the source nor tubes. However it's really odd that it sounds louder, I think that if the problem were in somewhere else it would mute the problematic channel, but I guess I'm wrong...

 I tried to clean the headphone jack and move the switches a couple of time however nothing change. I even tried to let all the switches on the opposite side, however the problem persists.

 Unfortunately I know nothing about DIY. My skills in this area are simply zero. I think I'll have to ship it to someone who knows a lot of DIY.

 Thank you again!


----------



## CITIZENLIN

Ordered LD IV from David via Ebay 3 days ago and I haven't heard from Ebay or tracking yet. I hope it worth the wait.


----------



## MIKELAP

citizenlin said:


> Ordered LD IV from David via Ebay 3 days ago and I haven't heard from Ebay or tracking yet. I hope it worth the wait.


 
 It takes several days it seems not the first time i hear that .but you wont regret it especially if you start rolling tubes you will want to check out page 1 and especially page 77 for all the tubes we tried that are compatible with your amp and that are very inexpensive because theres no need to pay a fortune for your tubes got questions feel free to ask before you buy tubes will see you on THE LITTLEDOT AMPS:TUBE ROLLING GUIDE THREAD                                                                                                                                                                   http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/4635#post_10159570


----------



## bbmiller

Hello all
 I an very new to the I dear of owning audiophile level headphone equipment, but I got the idea to do so when after equalizing my Plantronics 780 headset I began to hear music over that headset like I have never heard before except in person. Consequently I thought I should push this hearing things with headphones thing as far as I could so I started to shop for audiophile level equipment.
  
 Well my present only headphones are a very old pier of Sony MIDR CD350s which are meant for pedestrian use. But even though that was the case I thought I should purchase a DAC and headphone amplifier first as to have a means of previewing a headset bought from Amazon which in my past experiences with Amazon they have a no hassle return policy which I thought I should take advantage of when purchasing headphones.
  
 So as of now I only have that headset for my best music listening and no appropriate headphones.
  
 I have purchased both the Little Dot MK IV mk 4 SE Headphone Tube Amplifier Pre-Amp and the Little Dot DAC_I DAC 1 Digital to Analog Converter both being shipped from China with the estimated delivery date of March 20. So I still have a little time to figure out the headphone thing.
  
 I would appreciate some guidance I require is a newbie. I have been looking at some tube rolling threads as well as other threads and I never see things like this set up was really good and when I equalized my headphones for it it was really great. Am I one of a very small minority of people on these forms that are sold on equalization? I mean I thought perhaps mistakenly I should shop for headphones with equalization in mind. And the same would go for tube rolling if I ever get into that. So any perspectives on those two questions shopping for headphones to be equalized and possible future shopping for tubes to be equalized? I never see that sort of stuff on these forums but perhaps I'm looking in the wrong places.


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> Hello all
> I an very new to the I dear of owning audiophile level headphone equipment, but I got the idea to do so when after equalizing my Plantronics 780 headset I began to hear music over that headset like I have never heard before except in person. Consequently I thought I should push this hearing things with headphones thing as far as I could so I started to shop for audiophile level equipment.
> 
> Well my present only headphones are a very old pier of Sony MIDR CD350s which are meant for pedestrian use. But even though that was the case I thought I should purchase a DAC and headphone amplifier first as to have a means of previewing a headset bought from Amazon which in my past experiences with Amazon they have a no hassle return policy which I thought I should take advantage of when purchasing headphones.
> ...


 
 I guess it all depends on what kind of sound signature you are looking for do you like something neutral sounding bassy an open headphone a closed headphone because everybody ears differently your best bet is to sample in your area the headphones available because earing is believing anything else you would be taking a chance on imo                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             And if you want to try tube rolling this thread is great you need help the guys will help you out .I suggest asking for the best plug and play tubes to start with they are better than the tubes mentionned at the beginnig of the thread . See you there.
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/4965#post_10254417


----------



## bbmiller

OK two more things.
  
 I think I found what I wanted try in headphones at Amazon which are 250 ohm headphones. From reading the spec sheet they should be even easier to drive than lower impedance headphones with my new purchase. Can you confirm that's the case.
  
 Also if I want to take advantage of free shipping and coordinate with estimated March 20 arrival of my new headphone amp and DAC, what is your best guess on when I should order my headphones to coordinate the two arrivals? I live in Colorado USA near Denver. And will be ordering from Amazon.com?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> Also if I want to take advantage of free shipping and coordinate with estimated March 20 arrival of my new headphone amp and DAC, what is your best guess on when I should order my headphones to coordinate the two arrivals? I live in Colorado USA near Denver. And will be ordering from Amazon.com?


 
  
 That is probably something you should ask the seller or Amazon directly...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_left_v4_sib?ie=UTF8&nodeId=3043211


----------



## mab1376

bbmiller said:


> I think I found what I wanted try in headphones at Amazon which are 250 ohm headphones. From reading the spec sheet they should be even easier to drive than lower impedance headphones with my new purchase. Can you confirm that's the case.


 
  
 Yes high impedance works well electrically with the topology that the MK III and IV use (OTL topology (Output Transformer-less)).
  
 I use 300ohm Sennheiser HD650 and 250ohm Beyerdynamic T70 with my MK IV SE.


----------



## bbmiller

Thanks - mab1376

 Is the effects of tube rolling different from tube sound coloration and/or distortion?


----------



## mab1376

bbmiller said:


> Thanks - mab1376
> 
> Is the effects of tube rolling different from tube sound coloration and/or distortion?


 
  
 The effects are subtle in both cases but yes, below is a link to the dictionary of terms people use when reviewing audio gear, it may give you some insight while reading through the tube rolling thread for ideas on what you might want to try.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/a/describing-sound-a-glossary
  
 Personally I very much like 6AV6 tubes which require cutting some pins off, but to start you may want to try IBM 6080 (6BE6) tubes or 6HM5 tubes as they don't require any mods or deviation from the stock configuration.


----------



## bbmiller

Well I may ask a lot of questions here waiting my long wait to March 20 to get my The Little Dot Mk IV / SE headphone amplifier. So please don't get sick of me 
  
  
 I will be biding my time waiting for my amp by researching headphones. I have the low-end of the impedance range question now. Having oral ready asked about 250 ohms what about only 25 ohms.
  
  
 I am now considering getting Denon AH-D600 which has these  audio specs as follows.
  
 The impedance is 25 ohms with power on high.
  
  
 The sensitivity is 108 dB/mW.
  
  
 The Maximum power input 1800mW.
  
  
 Please confirm Dot Mk IV / SE headphone amplifier is appropriate for such a headphone.
  
  
 I'm considering this headphone because I always intend to equalize any headphone I buy and I don't know if this is wrongheaded thinking, but I am thinking this very said neutral headphone might be capable of being whatever I want through the right equalization. Maybe that is very wrong headed thinking, but I am a very newbie newbie waiting the long wait for his equipment.


----------



## Brooko

bbmiller said:


> Well I may ask a lot of questions here waiting my long wait to March 20 to get my The Little Dot Mk IV / SE headphone amplifier. So please don't get sick of me
> 
> I will be biding my time waiting for my amp by researching headphones. I have the low-end of the impedance range question now. Having oral ready asked about 250 ohms what about only 25 ohms.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi - welcome to the LD MKIV club - it's a great amp.
  
 The Denon's are not going to be ideal with the LD - mainly because of damping.  Here are two articles from Innerfidelity (Tyll really knows what he's talking about) that will help your understanding:
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/comparison-beyerdynamic-dt-880-32-ohm-dt-880-250-ohm-and-dt-880-600-ohm-headphones-page-2
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/meridian-explorer-case-study-effects-output-impedance-page-2?page=1
  
 Basically you want an approx damping ratio of 1:8.  Higher is OK.  Lower could create issues.
  
 Output impedance (headphone out) on the Little Dot MKIV is supposed to be around 30-50 ohms.  This means that this amp is ideally suited to drive headphones of around 300ohms.  it does great with Beyers at 250 ohms as well.  The issue with the Denons is that they have an impedance of 25 ohms - so ideally you want a headphone-out impedance of  0-4 ohms.
  
 The problem with pairing these cans with the LD is that you may get a very altered frequency if the damping isn't ideal.
  
 You'll also not that the Denons are really sensitive (108 dB/mW) so they don't need much power at all to get them plenty loud.  They're actually designed to be used with a low powered source (like your typical smart phone or MP3 player).  You may even struggle with the Little Dot - because they may be too loud (not enough usable range on the volume pot).
  
 If you do have a low power source to pair the Denons with though (an iPhone?) - no reason why you can't just use the LD for higher impedance cans only.  That's pretty much what I do.


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> Well I may ask a lot of questions here waiting my long wait to March 20 to get my The Little Dot Mk IV / SE headphone amplifier. So please don't get sick of me
> 
> 
> I will be biding my time waiting for my amp by researching headphones. I have the low-end of the impedance range question now. Having oral ready asked about 250 ohms what about only 25 ohms.
> ...


 
 With my Littledot mk3 i use SENNS HD800 and Denons d-5000 i to wread about the output impedance being to high for  my 25 ohms Denons  but personnally i dont see wheres the problem and using Senns my gain switches are at 10 when im using the Denons volume i use is around 9-10oclock but if you use less gain volume ajustment should be a bit higher i also use the Denons with a Burson Conductor which has a very low output impedance thats why i can tell you i cant ear why this is not a good match but thats me .Again best thing is to ear it for yourself .


----------



## Brooko

Mike

Here's why I posted the advice above

http://www.head-fi.org/t/619181/list-opinion-amp-recommendations-for-fostex-denon-headphones

These two posts from Songmic also help explain the technical side brilliantly. 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/619181/list-opinion-amp-recommendations-for-denon-headphones/180#post_8852275
http://www.head-fi.org/t/619181/list-opinion-amp-recommendations-for-denon-headphones/210#post_8896782


----------



## MIKELAP

brooko said:


> Mike
> 
> Here's why I posted the advice above
> 
> ...


 
  Buy the way i am not disputing your advice my friend  its all true i guess, i wouldnt know .im just saying i dont ear it .


----------



## Brooko

mikelap said:


> Buy the way i am not disputing your advice my friend  its all true i guess, i wouldnt know .im just saying i dont ear it .


 
  
 No problems there my friend 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Theoretically Grados aren't the best match either - but I had no problems when i owned the RS1s either.  Admittedly though - most of the time I'd use them more with my DAPs or out of the NFB-12 (both low output impedance).
  
 It's more for bbmiller.  In theory the Denons aren't ideal matched to the MKIV - but really he won't need to amp them anyway.


----------



## bbmiller

*Using pink noise and resistors to burn in my DAC and headphone amplifier with a Ruth Goldberg menagerie?*
  
 I am finally scheduled to get my new Little Dot DAC_I Digital to Analog Converter and my Little Dot MK IV Tube Headphone Amplifier / Pre-amplifier probably Monday. But my Sennheiser HD 600s will probably be delivered a week and a half later. Consequently I have no appropriate headphones to burn in my new audiophile quality, partial set up, which will be arriving Monday. I am thinking I will go to RadioShack, electronics store, the only store who sells resistors close to me and by the closest thing they have to a 300 ohm resistors which are 330 ohm resistors in quarter watt and putting them both in series of two and parallel create a 330 ohm one watt equivalent resistor suitable to simulate my Sennheiser HD 600s without being there. So it will take four resistors per channel, but RadioShack has that many. I using then plan on using a MP3 player (not my normal source of music for this set up) and a pink noise recording cycling into the RCA inputs to USB soundcard which will give me an optical audio out to the DAC with that pink noise will recording then repeatedly run for as long as the battery lasts and then charge and put the pink noise again and again until I reach 100 hours. So the plan is an eight resistor menagerie connected to my headphone amplifier and a recording of pink noise as the source to burn in at least my DAC and headphone amplifier before my headphones arrive.
  
 So what do you think of that plan? Can you think of any alternative plans that would be better? My normal source of music will be my one computer, but I will not be willing to give it up for 100 hours unless I could do something like have it generate pink noise out of one USB while still watching videos and listening to sound from another USB and video output.
  
PS what volume on the volume knob of by headphone amplifier do you think I should use?


----------



## TrollDragon

Wow that's quite the plan... :eek:

Solid state electronics do not Change or Benefit from any "Burn-In" because if they did all the specs on units would be different... Except in the case of quality control where it is used to find bad components or improperly soldered boards from the reflow ovens.

But whatever floats you boat...

The LD manual states that the amplifier should not be run for anymore than 8 hours without a cool down period since there is no ventilation in the case. Heat is a major contributor to failed electronics so I would follow the LD guidelines.

Your 300 ohm resistor network should be fine for the purpose but the stock driver tubes that come with the LD are not the best sounding tubes, check into the Little Dot Tube Rolling thread to find much better sounding choices like the 6DT6 in EF92 mode and 6HM5 in EF95 mode. Right now everyone is running octal tubes 6SN7 with adapters and external heater supplies in that thread. I run a 6DJ8 variant in my MKIV with an adapter, but you might not want to experiment with such mods from the start to get a feel for the stock sound.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> Wow that's quite the plan...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 What about tube burn in how necessary is it? Does it take a 100 hours, at least burn in, if it is pretty necessary?


trolldragon said:


> The LD manual states that the amplifier should not be run for anymore than 8 hours without a cool down period since there is no ventilation in the case. Heat is a major contributor to failed electronics so I would follow the LD guidelines.


 How much cooldown time between tube burn in sessions do you think necessary?



trolldragon said:


> Your 300 ohm resistor network should be fine for the purpose but the stock driver tubes that come with the LD are not the best sounding tubes


  What about the SE tube variant which is what I bought?


----------



## TrollDragon

Everyone in the rolling thread runs their tubes while listening to them and some do notice changes over a period of time. You can have the same model number of tube from different manufacturers and they will sound different between the brands. It is something that you have to experience for yourself with different tubes, the ones I listed earlier get a high praise from the majority of LD users so there is some merit to those tubes.

Yes the SE version does benefit from different driver tubes as well. Page 77 of the LD Tube Rolling thread lists all the 7 pin tubes that have been used as driver tubes and their results, sorry I can't link to the page from the mobile browser if you search or check a few pages back I think MIKELAP posted the link to that thread.


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> What about tube burn in? Is that necessary? Does it take a 100 hours if it is?


 
 Heres the link to page 77.                  http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/1140


----------



## TrollDragon

mikelap said:


> Heres the link to page 77.                  http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/1140


Thanks MIKELAP!

The table is about halfway down that page, I think post #1159.


----------



## MIKELAP

trolldragon said:


> Thanks MIKELAP!
> 
> The table is about halfway down that page, I think post #1159.


 
 Close  #1154  you got a good memory .


----------



## superpronker

I'm using my LD MK IV SE with a pair of Denon D7000 and it's giving out a high-pitched whining sound. The whine doesn't get higher when I change the volume, it appears to just be constant. 
  
 Does anyone experience this? Any ideas to what the solution might be?
  
 There is no ground by the way.


----------



## TrollDragon

superpronker said:


> I'm using my LD MK IV SE with a pair of Denon D7000 and it's giving out a high-pitched whining sound. The whine doesn't get higher when I change the volume, it appears to just be constant.
> 
> Does anyone experience this? Any ideas to what the solution might be?
> 
> There is no ground by the way.


 
 Have you tried connecting a ground?


----------



## boombobby289

I'm new to Tube Amp.
May I know if Cans like AKG K550 and BeyerDT880(32ohm) work well with MKIV or IVSE?

I worry about the annoying noise from this Amp?

Have you experienced with hum noise from its transformer?


----------



## TrollDragon

My Ultrasone HFI-780's @ 35 ohm do hum with the MK IV, I use a 100 ohm inline attenuator with them. The attenuator reduces the hum to a very low level but it is still there.

The DT880 Pro's @ 250 ohm and the GMP 8.300 D Pro's @ 300 ohm do not hum at all and sound incredible with non stock tubes.

OTL amps like the MK II and up are not really designed for low impedance headphones. You should look into a LD I+ hybrid or something similar.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> sound incredible with non stock tubes


 
 As I have stated earlier I am using the tubes of the SE option and am finding they are making my Sennheiser HD 600s sound incredible even though their stock. If the original files are incredible the sound is incredible.
  
  
 I am wondering what are the nature of files said to be improved by tube rolling? I have read elsewhere that given the right free 1980s recordings that the right tube can improve the sound greatly, but is it possible to describe what you hear when you find the file of this nature before and after the right tube?
  
  
 I am also wondering do I need a tube tester? Will the degradation of the sound once my tubes eventually wear out be so gradual that I can have degraded sound creep up on me without realizing it?


----------



## liupublic

Just picked an used mk IV SE. Very good pairing w hd650. Selected gain setting of 5db. Vol control is now at 10-11 o'clock for my lessening vol. is this about what I should expect? The menu suggested 10db setting but I think that is a bit too much gain.

Recv 3 sets of driver tubes plus original power tubes. Gonna spend the next few weeks on testing.

Ipod 160gb 7th gen -> pure I-20 -> cambridge dacmagic 100 -> LD IV SE -> senn hd650


----------



## TrollDragon

Congrats and welcome to the Club!

I use a gain of 5 with my MK IV and the DT880 Pro's, volume around 10-11 as well.

A gain of 10 just got too loud too fast and if you plug in some some headphones with higher efficiency, I found 9 o'clock too loud.

Good to see you have some spare tubes as well, check out the Little Dot Tube Rolling Thread, Page 77 has a table with all the B7G tubes you can use as drivers.

One of the best driver tubes we have found for an unmodifed LD is the 6HM5, they are really worth checking out.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/6HM5-6HA5-EC900-export-quality-audio-triode-tube-NOS-FREE-SHIPPING-/300879467071


----------



## liupublic

LD IV SE definitely have much more drive than my other tube headphone amp.  
  
 I still have an older Mapletree.  My last headphone AKG Q701 was a good paring with Mapletree.  I think Sennhesier HD650 matches better with LD IV SE.  
  
 Probably tube roll with what I have now for 4-6 weeks and then move on from there.


----------



## bbmiller

I have two questions.
  
 Do any of you know another name or description for the jumper circled above in the picture? I seem to have misplaced the ones that came with my amplifier and although I probably could contact little dot and get more I would like to do a search on eBay and Amazon first so do any of you have a search terms for those little black things that you think would work? Unfortunately just a words PCI jumpers do not work.
  
 Secondly I thought the little dot IV amplifier was a hybrid, but in a recent review it seemed to be reviewed as a tube amplifier was the suggestion you could buy a little dot hybrid if you needed an amplifier for low impedance headphones which might work just as good. Consequently I looked at all the pictures of the circuit boards closely and only seen to see one bridge as a solid-state component.
  
  
 So is this really a tube amplifier and if so do any of you who rolled tubes experience any noise with any of them? With my 300 ohm Sennheiser HD 600s I am experiencing absolutely no noise at any volume levels with the stock se tubes.


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> I have two questions.
> 
> Do any of you know another name or description for the jumper circled above in the picture? I seem to have misplaced the ones that came with my amplifier and although I probably could contact little dot and get more I would like to do a search on eBay and Amazon first so do any of you have a search terms for those little black things that you think would work? Unfortunately just a words PCI jumpers do not work.
> 
> ...


 
 i run a pair of hd 800 and no noise also but  i had a few noisy tubes tough and its a tube amp suppose to work better with high impedance but i used a pair of 25 ohms Denon and it sounded good but i use them mostly with a low output impedance amp with better results .


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> I have two questions.
> 
> Do any of you know another name or description for the jumper circled above in the picture? I seem to have misplaced the ones that came with my amplifier and although I probably could contact little dot and get more I would like to do a search on eBay and Amazon first so do any of you have a search terms for those little black things that you think would work? Unfortunately just a words PCI jumpers do not work.
> 
> ...


 
 The circled item is a standard PC board jumper that you could pic up from any computer repair shop.
 Here are quite a few on eBay with handles -> LINK <- that make them easier to grab with tweezers or a pair of hemostats.
  
 The MK II III IV are all OTL Tube Amplifier's with the only major solid state component being the bridge rectifier. The Little Dot I+ is a hybrid (Tube & Opamp).
  
 Some tubes can be noisy, some microphonic and some don't make any noise at all, it is a roll of the dice when you buy tubes.
  
 My 35Ω Ultrasones have a moderate hum when I plug them into the MK IV, I use an DIY Impedance adapter to bring them up to 150Ω's which reduces the hum to a very minimal level.


----------



## bbmiller

mikelap said:


> > i run a pair of hd 800 and no noise also but  i had a few noisy tubes tough and its a tube amp suppose to work better with high impedance but i used a pair of 25 ohms Denon and it sounded good but i use them mostly with a low output impedance amp with better results .


 
 If you really think the little dot IV se is adequate for those expensive HD 800s and have heard them with other amplifiers that's impressive? I heard the HD 800s are notoriously hard to drive. I myself am waiting for CanJam @ RMAF to hear my first other audiophile grade equipment. I am very impressed with the sound of my little dot IV se which just the stock tubes right now, but will be very interested in seeing if I could hear better sound through my HD 600s with other amps, and what ever, with the same music and singing I am impressed with at home.


----------



## bbmiller

> Originally Posted by *TrollDragon* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Some tubes can be noisy, some microphonic and some don't make any noise at all, it is a roll of the dice when you buy tubes.


 
 Does that mean I can buy the same stock tubes again and get noisy ones? Is noise more related to tube type or the individual tube you get?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> Does that mean I can buy the same stock tubes again and get noisy ones? Is noise more related to tube type or the individual tube you get?


Depending on what kind of noise you mean. Hum, Microphonics etc are all related to the individual tube, usually something loose in the tube itself.

You can also get a hum with a low impedance headphone plugged in since OTL amplifiers are made to work most effective with high impedance.

You could purchase 10 tubes and any of them might hum, be microphonic or just work properly. Certain tube types are more prone to noise than other tubes. A lot of the bigger octals are microphonic for example.

When tubes go bad, they can just cut out on one side or both, they can start to make really nasty noises or distort quite bad, you will know if you have a tube packing in, it happens very quickly.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> You could purchase 10 tubes and any of them might hum, be microphonic or just work properly. Certain tube types are more prone to noise than other tubes. A lot of the bigger octals are microphonic for example.


 
 So what do you think of tube vendors that claim they give you tested tubes? And/or balance tubes? Is it worth it to deal with such vendors if the price differential is small? Will such testing eliminate the noisy tubes? Will the tubes become noisy during shipping?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> So what do you think of tube vendors that claim they give you tested tubes? And/or balance tubes? Is it worth it to deal with such vendors if the price differential is small? Will such testing eliminate the noisy tubes? Will the tubes become noisy during shipping?


 

 They test tube's for leaks and shorts, they can only test for Microphonics by plugging the tube into an amp and listening to it.
  
 Tested tubes are guaranteed to be properly functioning, this all depends on the honesty of the vendor. Balanced / Matched tubes are not required in the LD I+, II, III or IV amplifiers and you are paying for something you don't need.
  
 Yes if the tubes are not packed properly and a courier or handler drops the box you can end up with broken tubes, microphonic tubes etc.
  
 I haven't had a broken or bad tube from eBay so far but others have, it is the chance you take when purchasing little glass bottles that were manufactured 40+ years ago.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> Balanced / Matched tubes are not required in the LD I+, II, III or IV amplifiers and you are paying for something you don't need.


 
 This begs the question why? What would be example of a tube amplifier which requires balance tubes and why do the little dot amplifiers you mention don't?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> This begs the question why? What would be example of a tube amplifier which requires balance tubes and why do the little dot amplifiers you mention don't?


 

 The Little Dot amplifier's I mentioned do not have phase inverters or a parallel push-pull output, since we don't have to adjust the bias on the tubes, matched pairs are not required.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> bbmiller said:
> 
> 
> > This begs the question why? What would be example of a tube amplifier which requires balance tubes and why do the little dot amplifiers you mention don't?
> ...


 
 So that infers they are strictly class A. Is that correct? And if that is correct are there any channel balancing inch issues and if so are there any ways to balance the channels?
  
 PS I let my own questioning be food for thought to myself. Consequently I have come upon this page "How To Adjust Audio Balance In Windows 7" which will give you a software way of adjusting the balance of an amplifier even if the amplifier is in imbalance because of hardware problems not software interface hardware problems.
  
 Perhaps I should amend my above question to do you think by using unmatched tubes and saving money it could be necessary to go through a software balance procedure like the one outlined in the link above due to level in balance caused by using unmatched tubes?
  
I have another question is well. My stock tubes keep improving and improving with increased burning-in. They have now reached the point where on certain files I consider particularly good like the ones of my videos of "John Williams at the BBC proms" which are so good sonically that I have been increasing the volume when listening to them not to give them too much volume overall but to increase the dynamic range. It seems the way my little dot IV amplifier has become with increased burning is that with some very good music video files increasing the volume increases the dynamic range more than what used to happen before my tubes burned in an I would not get increased in dynamic range with increasing volume, but just increase in volume. Have any of you all have experienced the increase in dynamic range with very sonically good files that I am experiencing. If so I will have additional questions.


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> If you really think the little dot IV se is adequate for those expensive HD 800s and have heard them with other amplifiers that's impressive? I heard the HD 800s are notoriously hard to drive. I myself am waiting for CanJam @ RMAF to hear my first other audiophile grade equipment. I am very impressed with the sound of my little dot IV se which just the stock tubes right now, but will be very interested in seeing if I could hear better sound through my HD 600s with other amps, and what ever, with the same music and singing I am impressed with at home.


 
 While i use the HD 800 with the Littledot i mostly use them on a Woo Audio 2 and a Burson Conductor .Audio shows were a real eye opener for me because for me i found out that at one point its only subtle differences


----------



## TrollDragon

The MKIV is an OTL (Output Transformerless) SEPP (Single Ended Push Pull) amplifier with the power tubes configured in a white cathode follower configuration.

Tube CAD's SEPP article:
http://www.tubecad.com/articles_2002/SRPP_Deconstructed/index.html

Valve Electronics cathode follower article:
http://www.valveradio.net/en/home/audio/low-distortion-cathode-follower.html

Lots of good reading there about the theory / pros and cons of the design used in the Little Dot. The bottom line is price, the Little Dot amps were designed the way they were because it is the cheapest way to make these amplifiers and get them to consumers.

Do you have a channel imbalance in your MKIV? There is no way to adjust the tube biasing without changing components on the board. If you are going to go through that trouble it would be better to obtain an amplifier where adjustments can be tuned to your liking, Decware or similar amplifiers would provide this option.

Possibly purchasing matched tubes might solve any perceived imbalance issue in the Little Dot, but that is a solution you would have to try by actually testing out a balanced pair of tubes.


----------



## Chris J

bbmiller said:


> So that infers they are strictly class A. Is that correct? And if that is correct are there any channel balancing inch issues and if so are there any ways to balance the channels?
> 
> PS I let my own questioning be food for thought to myself. Consequently I have come upon this page "How To Adjust Audio Balance In Windows 7" which will give you a software way of adjusting the balance of an amplifier even if the amplifier is in imbalance because of hardware problems not software interface hardware problems.
> 
> ...



 


Sounds like you really are a tube lover.
Don't sweat it too much, every now and then you get a bad tube: too noisy, too microphonic, etc. It happens. Just don't sweat it too much.
I suspect your Little Dot would sound even better with a good set of NOS tubes.
My tube amp does (it's not a Little Dot, BTW).


----------



## gyzimaki

I know it probably isn't relevant to the topic, but back in 2010, when I got my first HD800s, I did order and try out a Little Dot MKII, it was back then, I think. Even with the Gain switch turned up, there was this weird channel imbalance between left and right, it wasn't anything shocking, but it was noticeable, and to me, very annoying. I bet I could have gotten used to and adapted to it, but back then I used to be a real perfectionist, so I ditched it and gave it to a friend of mine instead to play around with.
  
 Have any of the subsequent models ( MK3/4 etc ) exhibited such an issue with certain sets of headphones for you, guys?


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> The MKIV is an OTL (Output Transformerless) SEPP (Single Ended Push Pull) amplifier with the power tubes configured in a white cathode follower configuration.
> 
> Tube CAD's SEPP article:
> http://www.tubecad.com/articles_2002/SRPP_Deconstructed/index.html
> ...


 
 Thanks for those cathode follower links I did find the reading interesting. I looked up the tubes in my little dot amplifier and it appears that the driving stage is a pentode and the power stage is a double triode. So I could see how if you were using to halves of a double triode the two halves would be in very good balance to each other and balance tubes would not  apply.
  
 Can I assume that the pent code driver is actually hooked up as a pentode and is utilizing all the grids?
  
 Also without going through the bother of using test equipment I am not hearing any imbalance in my channels, but was just speculating that tube rolling could possibly cause that. And if it did I could use the fact that I am utilizing USB Windows 7 drivers to drive my amplifier and since these drivers have the possibility of rebalancing channels that would be the solution I would use should that occur.
  
 I have a question my stock tubes must've taken at least 150 hours to reach their very high level of performance. Do you think if I were to try to do even better by tube rolling at least 150 hours would be what a good try of another combination of tubes would take?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> Can I assume that the pent code driver is actually hooked up as a pentode and is utilizing all the grids?
> I have a question my stock tubes must've taken at least 150 hours to reach their very high level of performance. Do you think if I were to try to do even better by tube rolling at least 150 hours would be what a good try of another combination of tubes would take?


 
 The driver tubes are run as triodes, on page 77 of the Little Dot Tube Rolling Thread the table shows all the tubes you can use and the mode required to run them.
  
 Heptodes like the 6CS6 for example can be run in the default EF95 mode, or pins 1 and 7 strapped together or 2 and 7 strapped together or even in EF92 mode. The 6CS6, 6DT6A, 6HM5 (tall version) are all very popular tubes that have been run in the LD as driver tubes.
  
 A lot of the tube rollers swear by Burn In, so if you find your current tubes much more enjoyable after 150 hours of Burn In, then that should apply to any other tubes that you try as well.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> run in EF95 mode, EF92 mode.


 
 Any especially good places to find out about this mode stuff?


----------



## TrollDragon

On the little dot driver board there are jumpers to switch between EF92 and EF95 relating to the pin configuration of the two tube types.
  
 In EF92 mode pins 5, 6 and 7 are shorted together. In EF95 mode just pins 5 and 6 are shorted with pin 7 left floating.
  
 EF95 tubes have pin 2 and 7 shorted together internally so if you plugged an EF95 tube in with the jumper set to EF92 you would end up shorting the anode to the cathode.  
  
EF92 Tube Info, EF95 Tube Info.


----------



## bbmiller

trolldragon said:


> On the little dot driver board there are jumpers to switch between EF92 and EF95 relating to the pin configuration of the two tube types.
> 
> In EF92 mode pins 5, 6 and 7 are shorted together. In EF95 mode just pins 5 and 6 are shorted with pin 7 left floating.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks
 so I suppose we are talking about the driving tube now.
 Does the power to have strapping options too? And do you have any similar information on its modes or whatever?
  
 Which tube has more impact on the sound?


----------



## TrollDragon

bbmiller said:


> Thanks
> so I suppose we are talking about the driving tube now.
> Does the power to have strapping options too? And do you have any similar information on its modes or whatever?
> 
> Which tube has more impact on the sound?


 

 Yes that is the information for the driver tubes.
  
 There are no strapping options or different modes for the power tubes. The stock 6H30Pi's are very good, you can try to seek out the Soviet "Super Tube" 6Н30П ДР, this is supposed to be the best tube you can put in an unmodified LD. On eBay they were demanding at one point upwards of $200 for real ones, beware though as there are plenty of fakes for sale as well. I have never head these tubes so I can't comment on the sound.
  
 I could not tell you which would have more impact as I have never changed the power tubes on my amplifier, that is a question you should ask in the Rolling Thread.


----------



## Chris J

trolldragon said:


> Yes that is the information for the driver tubes.
> 
> There are no strapping options or different modes for the power tubes. The stock 6H30Pi's are very good, you can try to seek out the Soviet "Super Tube" 6Н30П ДР, this is supposed to be the best tube you can put in an unmodified LD. On eBay they were demanding at one point upwards of $200 for real ones, beware though as there are plenty of fakes for sale as well. I have never head these tubes so I can't comment on the sound.
> 
> I could not tell you which would have more impact as I have never changed the power tubes on my amplifier, that is a question you should ask in the Rolling Thread.




In any amp I've rolled tubes in the driver or input tubes have more effect than the power tubes.


----------



## HeatFan12

Waz up TD!!!!!  Long time.........I took like a year off of head-fi...Great to see you are still enjoying your MKIV...
  
 Mine is still kickin' after 5+ years.
  
 Went old skool today with the drivers and threw in some RCA Command 5654s.  iPod 5.5G--> Apple Lossless--> LDMKIV SE--> Ultrasone PRO650s--> Good times!!!!!


----------



## TrollDragon

heatfan12 said:


> Waz up TD!!!!!  Long time.........I took like a year off of head-fi...Great to see you are still enjoying your MKIV...
> 
> Mine is still kickin' after 5+ years.
> 
> Went old skool today with the drivers and threw in some RCA Command 5654s.  iPod 5.5G--> Apple Lossless--> LDMKIV SE--> Ultrasone PRO650s--> Good times!!!!!


Hey HF!
Wow bro I was wondering where you snuck off to... Hasn't been much love in the Ultrasone thread in a while... Yes the MKIV is a great amp with the 6SL7 as a driver these days, the bigger plates seem to give it a fuller, richer sound. LOL

Braided me a nice portable cable for the 780's and picked up a sweet pair of German Maestro 8.300 D Pro's. There are two of us on Head-Fi that own those GMP's. 



Good to have you back bro and time to kick up the Ultrasone Love, unless you went all Stax Mafia on us....


----------



## HeatFan12

trolldragon said:


> Hey HF!
> Wow bro I was wondering where you snuck off to... Hasn't been much love in the Ultrasone thread in a while... Yes the MKIV is a great amp with the 6SL7 as a driver these days, the bigger plates seem to give it a fuller, richer sound. LOL
> 
> Braided me a nice portable cable for the 780's and picked up a sweet pair of German Maestro 8.300 D Pro's. There are two of us on Head-Fi that own those GMP's.
> ...


 
  
 Thanks bro!!!!!
  
 Looks awesome TD.  Great job!!!!
  
 Stax?!?!?  Stax can't fulfill the bass craving we need.!!!!!  lol


----------



## koc

Hi guys, i want to buy Little Dot MK IV for my D7100, but i need a dac to connect it to my computer, 
Can you please reccomend a good dac that match the Little Dot MK IV SE ?
What about Little Dot DAC_II ? or maybe Little Dot DAC3 ?

Thank you.


----------



## Brooko

koc said:


> Hi guys, i want to buy Little Dot MK IV for my D7100, but i need a dac to connect it to my computer,
> Can you please reccomend a good dac that match the Little Dot MK IV SE ?
> What about Little Dot DAC_II ? or maybe Little Dot DAC3 ?
> 
> Thank you.


 
  
 I haven't heard the D7100 - but I'm actually wondering if the LD MKIV is actually a good match for them.  The D7100 has an impedance of 25 ohms, whilst I think the LD output impedance is more in the 40-50 ohm bracket (from memory).  it's an OTL anyway - so the high output impedance is going to better suit headphones with a higher impedance.  What I'm suggesting is that due to an incorrect damping factor, you may find that the LD MKIV (or any OTL tube amp) could end up playing havoc with the D7100's frequency response due to poor damping.
  
 You may be far better trying a hybrid tube amp with a lower output impedance.
  
 If you wanted to go Little Dot - you could get the DAC_II (which would give you DAC + solid state amp), and then add a hybrid like the LD MK1+.
  
 Just a thought ......


----------



## MIKELAP

brooko said:


> I haven't heard the D7100 - but I'm actually wondering if the LD MKIV is actually a good match for them.  The D7100 has an impedance of 25 ohms, whilst I think the LD output impedance is more in the 40-50 ohm bracket (from memory).  it's an OTL anyway - so the high output impedance is going to better suit headphones with a higher impedance.  What I'm suggesting is that due to an incorrect damping factor, you may find that the LD MKIV (or any OTL tube amp) could end up playing havoc with the D7100's frequency response due to poor damping.
> 
> You may be far better trying a hybrid tube amp with a lower output impedance.
> 
> ...


 
 +1


----------



## HeatFan12

brooko said:


> I haven't heard the D7100 - but I'm actually wondering if the LD MKIV is actually a good match for them.  The D7100 has an impedance of 25 ohms, whilst I think the LD output impedance is more in the 40-50 ohm bracket (from memory).  it's an OTL anyway - so the high output impedance is going to better suit headphones with a higher impedance.  What I'm suggesting is that due to an incorrect damping factor, you may find that the LD MKIV (or any OTL tube amp) could end up playing havoc with the D7100's frequency response due to poor damping.
> 
> You may be far better trying a hybrid tube amp with a lower output impedance.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 Solid advice!!!
  
 Currently rockin' the LD I+ with some 'Sones
  
  

  
  

  
  
  
  
  
  
 *****Off-Topic... but why do my pics look so horrible and fuzzy lately?...lol.......Whether I upload directly from PC or hosted from url.....Look nothing like the original...I've tried different upload sizes etc. with no luck......What am I doing wrong?????*****.......*FIXED  FIXED FIXED*
  
*Thanks to TD....*





  
 I've seen pics on here from phones that look like HD.....
  
 ***Where ya at TD?.....All your uploaded pics look kick-@ss!!!!!!**
  
  
 Even with a PrtScn shot with Foobar looks fuzzy: *FIXED FIXED FIXED*


----------



## koc

brooko said:


> I haven't heard the D7100 - but I'm actually wondering if the LD MKIV is actually a good match for them.  The D7100 has an impedance of 25 ohms, whilst I think the LD output impedance is more in the 40-50 ohm bracket (from memory).  it's an OTL anyway - so the high output impedance is going to better suit headphones with a higher impedance.  What I'm suggesting is that due to an incorrect damping factor, you may find that the LD MKIV (or any OTL tube amp) could end up playing havoc with the D7100's frequency response due to poor damping.
> 
> You may be far better trying a hybrid tube amp with a lower output impedance.
> 
> ...


 

 Right now i have _Yulong D100_ MKII + D7100, but it cant bring all the D7100 to my ear, I said that because my ex-Dac HeadRoom ultra sound better with D7100.
 I also choice the LD amp based on some reviews and because the D7100 sound better with hybrid amp IMHO.
  
 In fact im n00b about amps and dacs and and i just need best DAC + AMP for D7100 ?
  
 Thank you


----------



## Brooko

koc said:


> Right now i have _Yulong D100_ MKII + D7100, but it cant bring all the D7100 to my ear, I said that because my ex-Dac HeadRoom ultra sound better with D7100.
> I also choice the LD amp based on some reviews and because the D7100 sound better with hybrid amp IMHO.
> 
> In fact im n00b about amps and dacs and and i just need best DAC + AMP for D7100 ?
> ...


 
  
 Well I just checked the Yulong D100 II specs - and it definitely has more than enough power for the D7100, as well as having a very good dac section (comparable to the Benchmark DAC1 if reviews can be taken as granted).  They don't list output impedance - but I'd be surprised if it was much more than 2ohms via the headphone out (they advertise ideal for 16-600 ohm), so it should be a good match for your Denons.
  
 All I'm suggesting is that an OTL amp is likely not going to be a good match.  If you want to use a tube amp - aim for a hybrid.
  
 Maybe best to checkout some existing D7100 threads - you might get better advice?  Like I said - I don't own these headphones, so I can't give you direct advice on what works.
 http://www.head-fi.org/newsearch?search=denon+d7100+amp


----------



## koc

Thank you Brooko for your help.


----------



## hypnos1

bbmiller said:


> Thanks
> so I suppose we are talking about the driving tube now.
> Does the power to have strapping options too? And do you have any similar information on its modes or whatever?
> 
> Which tube has more impact on the sound?


 
  
 Hi bbmiller and all you guys in this thread.
  
 I just thought I'd hop over from the Little Dot Amps: Vacuum Tube Rolling Guide and see what's cookin' here... and would like to pass on a summary of what we have been up to in our quest to see how far the LDs can be pushed, without blowing them up, lol! Hopefully there might be something of interest/use to some of you who want to get the most out of your MKIV SE.
  
 I personally am a fairly late-comer (1yr ago) to a bunch of really great, friendly, helpful enthusiasts who have spent a great deal of time, effort (and money!) experimenting with a range of LDs and who have made some pretty amazing discoveries over time regarding which tubes can be substituted - with or without modification - for stock. And my first bold statement is that ALL, and especially my IV SE, can give results _way_ above stock.
  
 I will give more details below, but perhaps I can first whet your appetite with a few  pics :
  
  

  

  
 The drivers are Siemens C3gS's - which are plug 'n play with a C3g to 6AK5 adapter available on ebay ( mine are my own, made with pure silver wire, 'cos I _love_ silver!) and on EF95 setting.
 These gave the first MASSIVE improvement - even over the Voskhods, and our later use of the 6DJ8 family (with mods). We found (one of) the best straight replacements was the tall-bottle 6HM5, which beat the Voskhods easily.
 Other guys have also found great improvements using 6SN7s as drivers, but require more adaptation still.
  
 The next almost equally huge improvement came from different POWER tubes...YES! - contrary to established belief. Further info below...
  
  
  


trolldragon said:


> Yes that is the information for the driver tubes.
> 
> There are no strapping options or different modes for the power tubes. The stock 6H30Pi's are very good, you can try to seek out the Soviet "Super Tube" 6Н30П ДР, this is supposed to be the best tube you can put in an unmodified LD. On eBay they were demanding at one point upwards of $200 for real ones, beware though as there are plenty of fakes for sale as well. I have never head these tubes so I can't comment on the sound.
> 
> I could not tell you which would have more impact as I have never changed the power tubes on my amplifier, that is a question you should ask in the Rolling Thread.


 
  
 Please, please, please DO NOT waste your money on the 6N30P-DR (TD's characters are strictly more correct!). I spent £200 - yes pounds 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - on a pair, and while they gave a _little_ more than the stock 6H30P, no way were they worth that sort of money. For MUCH less, you can achieve good results from (once again) the 6SN7 family. These too are plug 'n play, using a 6SN7 to 6CG7 adapter from ebay. For these, and the other drivers, you will need to remove all the brass bits to accommodate the adapters. And again, on EF95 setting.
  
 In the above photos, first I had a Psvane CV181-TII (basically a 6SN7) in the left channel and a 7N7 (which needs a different adapter to the 6SN7) in the right. Yet again, going against previous findings, the mix gave amazing results - each filled the missing parts of the other, without any clash or imbalance.
  
  
 But finally came a leap to equal that of the C3gS drivers... *6AS7G's AS POWERS!*...unfortunately, this is not so easy to achieve - they require a 2.5A heater power supply, as opposed to the LD's native .9A. So, therefore, if you have never held a screwdriver, pliers, or soldering iron - or can't get a savvy friend to do the job for you - I'm afraid you probably will not be able to experience the humble MKIV/SE to a level that is totally beyond belief...and I'm not foolishly/ignorantly overstating the facts. I never dreamt my Senn HD 650s could sound as they are now doing.
  
 If you are interested, and would like to know more, just have a look on the rolling thread mentioned previously. I can only hope this change would/could be possible for at least some of you. Or at the very least, give the easier-to-adapt 6SN7 (or 7N7) a try - I don't think you would be disappointed. Thankfully they are ALL good, and not too expensive... and if you  are fairly flush, they will definitely sing MUCH better driven by the C3g (preferably the 'S' version, if possible).
  
 ps. The 6AS7G/6080 tube draws a _lot_ of current, and an earlier concern was the strain on the cathode resistors. With help from TrollDragon, pointing out the ones to look for (after artsi's warning), I monitored the outside temp of same and although much higher than stock 29C, after 1 hour they slowly reached 56/57C and then just 59C after 4 hours' continuous play - which I believe is way below max operating value - so it looks like all should be OK. And I have put a good few more hours on my baby...she gets somewhat warmer than before but hey, those tubes get *HOT*! And no nasty surprises as of yet. The only ones being more mind-blowing ones with each different test track I have been using for a long time now. I cannot overstate the level to which these power tubes have taken my LD.
  
  
  


chris j said:


> In any amp I've rolled tubes in the driver or input tubes have more effect than the power tubes.


 
  
 Hi Chris J.
  
 As mentioned above, until the 6AS7G especially, that _was_ the case...but no longer. The versatility of these LDs - especially the MKIV SE - is quite amazing. This has been demonstrated time and again by the guys on the rolling thread.
  
 And all I can say is that if I had taken TD's advice to "stay away" from said thread, I would have missed this opportunity to achieve a level of sound reproduction I NEVER thought possible, without spending thousands of pounds, lol!
  
  
 Well folks, I hope I haven't put you all in 'overload' mode, but at least given you "food for thought"...
  
 Cheers, and happy rolling?!


----------



## bbmiller

post #456  directly above the in my browsing of this thread appears with the words "This post is hidden because the user is in your block list. (Click to show)"
  
 OK I was finding that post very very interesting and was thinking of giving a questioning in depth reply after perhaps others of you replied, but what does this mean now? Can I address this uses thread by simply clicking to show and start replying? Would that get me blocked myself? Is it OK to quote this blocked user from the blocked reply itself without being blocked myself? Is what this blocked user is saying discredited? Can I find out the reason he is blocked? Is it OK to address this user in a private message? Should I feel whatever he tells me in a private message reply to be discredited?


----------



## hypnos1

Hi bbmiller, and for anyone else - I hope!
  
 I didn't quote you, because it looks like something really weird - and VERY discomforting - has happened here.
  
 As far as I know, I have done nothing to cause such a 'block'...please take a look on the rolling guide to put your mind at rest concerning myself.
  
 This certainly does need sorting...


----------



## Brooko

@bbmiller 
  
 Nothing sinister.  Only you can block a member.  Click the link to show the post, then if you hover your mouse over hypnos1 name in the post, you should get a menu.
  
 Here's how mine looks:

  
  
 Here's how yours probably looks (I just temporarily blocked hypnos1)
  

  
  
 Simply click "unblock member" and everything will be right with the world again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 You'll need to refresh the page to see the post after you've unbl;ocked.  My guess  is that you clicked to block him by accident.


----------



## bbmiller

brooko said:


> @bbmiller
> 
> Nothing sinister.  Only you can block a member.  Click the link to show the post, then if you hover your mouse over hypnos1 name in the post, you should get a menu.
> 
> ...


 
 Yes Right. thanks!


----------



## Chris J

brooko said:


> @bbmiller
> 
> 
> Nothing sinister.  Only you can block a member.  Click the link to show the post, then if you hover your mouse over hypnos1 name in the post, you should get a menu.
> ...




Useful for members of the Science Forum!


----------



## Chris J

hypnos1 said:


> Hi bbmiller and all you guys in this thread.
> 
> I just thought I'd hop over from the Little Dot Amps: Vacuum Tube Rolling Guide and see what's cookin' here... and would like to pass on a summary of what we have been up to in our quest to see how far the LDs can be pushed, without blowing them up, lol! Hopefully there might be something of interest/use to some of you who want to get the most out of your MKIV SE.
> 
> ...




Well.......honestly, I am in "overload mode".
Give me a few millennia to digest this.....:confused_face_2:

Edit:
You don't have to worry about the envelope temperature of the 6AS7, but you may want to check the case temperature of your Little Dot.


----------



## Brooko

chris j said:


> Useful for members of the Science Forum!


 
  
 I believe I'm a semi-regular member there, and enjoy it.  Feel free to put me on your block list Chris


----------



## Chris J

brooko said:


> I believe I'm a semi-regular member there, and enjoy it.  Feel free to put me on your block list Chris




OK,
Point taken.
Reserved for the obnoxious members, only! Your too civil and polite.


Back on topic :
OMG, using the 6AS7 is very major surgery!
Maybe Little Dot should create a Super Ultra Limited Edition version that can take an 6AS7 without modification!


----------



## hypnos1

brooko said:


> @bbmiller
> 
> Nothing sinister.  Only you can block a member.  Click the link to show the post, then if you hover your mouse over hypnos1 name in the post, you should get a menu.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks Brooko...thought I'd upset someone BIG time! I do try not to be _too_ controversial, lol 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Can now rest easy...cheers...
  


chris j said:


> Well.......honestly, I am in "overload mode".
> Give me a few millennia to digest this.....
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry CJ...I knew I should have fed in two episodes but I just got carried away - that's the effect these 6AS7Gs are having on me (combined with the C3gSs, that is..)
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 Sure the case gets warmer than before, but nothing at all to cause concern...thankfully!
  
 Although it _sounds_ like very major surgery, in actual fact it isn't _that_ difficult a job for someone with just basic screwdriver & soldering skills...they don't come much more basic than me!
  
 So here goes more 'overload' - sorry!...As far as the adapter is concerned, it needs pins 4 and 5 of the 6CG7 cut, leaving just enough to solder on the wires from an external DC power supply.
 Naturally this has to be done with a minimal amount protruding, and covered with insulating tape. I found the adapter pins long enough to seat in the socket OK...
  
 The power supply needs (of course) to be 6.3V and 2.5A per tube. At present I am using an old laptop power supply/charger, routed through a cheap AC/DC voltage converter/regulator (input ac/dc 12-45V to output ac/dc 0.7-21V 8A, $8.99 incl shipping from amazon). But now I know all is well I have invested in a DC bench power supply, just to be on the safe side - these tubes are MORE than worth it!
  
 And there we have it...I _did_ warn you, mon ami!
  
 Cheers.
  
 ps. Did anyone notice my headphone cable going straight into the machine?...Aah, now that's another story 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 Edit ...pps. The 6AS7G uses the same adapter as the 6SN7 - ie 6SN7 to 6CG7


----------



## bbmiller

hypnos1 said:


> And not only that, but at the risk of repeating myself, I can say that without doubt these 6AS7Gs are giving me a _taste_ of hi-end at a lo-to-mid-end price. NOTHING could have prepared me for the difference they are making. Now my new adapter is well run-in, along with all the other goodies I have described (many times!) the _depth_ of bass (as blew me away on revisiting Dire Straits' track 'Love over Gold') is now as never before...together with its wonderful detail...sheer bliss!
> Can't wait to see what happens when silver wire adapter #2 gets finished, lol!


 
 "I can say that without doubt these 6AS7Gs are giving me a _taste_ of hi-end at a lo-to-mid-end price."
  
 Well I probably won't be making mods for quite a while after I get to hear other systems and I'm convinced it would be worth it. But what you are saying about high-end at nearly low-end prices is sounding good should I think it worth it. I probably won't hear the other systems I would like to hear until a headphone show in early October. So I am certainly considering modifying my IV SE amp on what must be considered a very long-term basis.
  
 Consequently since I find that rolling thread hard to follow since the information there is very spread out among many pages I would appreciate it if when you are all through you could post say on this thread a consolidated guide for dummies that might be easier to follow.
  
 So far I am gathering the big power tubes you are using need a beefier heater current supply there are no pictures on that rolling thread showing how you wire in the beefier power supply. It also seemed like you were suggesting some resistors have to be changed to higher wattage, but then may have changed your mind.
  
 So it won't be for quite a while when I may wish to embark on doing mods, but will certainly very much appreciate it if when you feel you have come close to finishing your little dot IV SE mods you would post some sort of guide for dummies.
  
 PS I used to be electronic technician so I probably have adequate screwdriver and soldering ability.


----------



## superdux

the C3G Mod is easy, but costly in the end.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/6000#post_10512665


----------



## MIKELAP

bbmiller said:


> "I can say that without doubt these 6AS7Gs are giving me a _taste_ of hi-end at a lo-to-mid-end price."
> 
> Well I probably won't be making mods for quite a while after I get to hear other systems and I'm convinced it would be worth it. But what you are saying about high-end at nearly low-end prices is sounding good should I think it worth it. I probably won't hear the other systems I would like to hear until a headphone show in early October. So I am certainly considering modifying my IV SE amp on what must be considered a very long-term basis.
> 
> ...


 
 Look on page 300 post #4493 to #4495, 301, and 326 of the tube rolling guide thread it gives you a good idea of what to do and what you need .Here are a few of the adapters i made.   Got questions let me know. Since you have the LD 4 if you use these adapters like these you will have to remove the brass tube protectors Got questions let me know.                                                                                                                                                                               Heres a list of tubes compatible with the adapters       http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/3990#post_9983735


----------



## hypnos1

bbmiller said:


> "I can say that without doubt these 6AS7Gs are giving me a _taste_ of hi-end at a lo-to-mid-end price."
> 
> Well I probably won't be making mods for quite a while after I get to hear other systems and I'm convinced it would be worth it. But what you are saying about high-end at nearly low-end prices is sounding good should I think it worth it. I probably won't hear the other systems I would like to hear until a headphone show in early October. So I am certainly considering modifying my IV SE amp on what must be considered a very long-term basis.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi bbmiller...and to whomsoever else it may concern...
  
 Glad you found my 'massive missive' interesting, even if I may have put you also into overload mode! -  no wonder, as this is the culmination of a year's worth of loooong slog (but worth every mind-scrambling second, lol!)...which brings me to a rather down-to-earth (not with a bang, I trust) statement...
 Being brutally honest, much as I would gladly (try to) cobble together a consolidated guide, I'm afraid there is no quick, easy way to go the "full" DIY route to nirvana...one would need to be _really really_ keen; be prepared to wade through many, many pages of the rolling thread; be fully confident with things like pin layouts/routing etc., and have a good deal of time (and patience!)...buckets of it, in fact!.
  
 So in all honesty, I do not actually recommend this course of action. Better by far would be to save up your pennies/dollars and go the route I mentioned previously - using bought adapters...a bit costly yes, but MUCH MUCH easier - and safer.
  
 As for the mods needed re power supply to the 6AS7G tubes, I shall post later some photos of how I did it...this will not need anywhere near the in-depth slog I just mentioned - especially with your tech abilities.
  
 And re the tubes themselves, a wonderful source (thanks gibosi - one of the 'avatars' on our rolling thread) is vacuumtubes.net (not.com). They have a good selection at very good prices - RCAs at $15 (which I have, and are excellent), and Chathams at $20 ea (which I shall be trying - supposed to be a bit better, but time will tell)...the RCAs, though, are very well respected, it appears.
  
 Ah well, dinner time, so I shall have to say cheerio for now...but I'll be back!


----------



## hypnos1

chris j said:


> Well.......honestly, I am in "overload mode".
> Give me a few millennia to digest this.....
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi Chris J.
  
 Checked the case temp. and read 36C after 1 hour and just 39C after 4.5 hrs. Nothing _too_ drastic, eh? Hopefully the MKIV SE has displayed its amazing, forgiving versatility once again...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


bbmiller said:


> "I can say that without doubt these 6AS7Gs are giving me a _taste_ of hi-end at a lo-to-mid-end price."
> 
> Well I probably won't be making mods for quite a while after I get to hear other systems and I'm convinced it would be worth it. But what you are saying about high-end at nearly low-end prices is sounding good should I think it worth it. I probably won't hear the other systems I would like to hear until a headphone show in early October. So I am certainly considering modifying my IV SE amp on what must be considered a very long-term basis.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi bb.
  
 As promised, here's a couple of photos of the set-up - the laptop supply and the voltage regulator are usually tucked away underneath, on a lower shelf of my equipment stand...:
  

  

  
 The laptop power supply connector is crudely patched to the regulator...didn't want to cut the cable - still need it for the laptop! Am getting a similar supply (but aimed at powering led string lights - 12V/6A) from Amazon for just £11...the tubes need a total of 5A for the heaters.
 This particular voltage regulator - $8.99 from Amazon, and rated for 8A - is not very solidly made (I managed to dislodge the solder connections on the output block just by tightening the screws!... but easily resoldered). It also does not have a readout, so a meter is needed to get to the required 6.3V - rough measurement first at the regulator before connecting tubes, then final check at the pins ...some have found a slight difference. This regulator is adjusted by a small screw atop a blue block (can just be seen on the far side of the pic). I was going to splash out on a bench DC power supply, but that was "damaged in transit" - supposedly! - so I am saving myself some money and have gone for another  DC 'buck' regulator, but this time a beefier one (12A) with more protection circuits, and even with the new power supply still a lot cheaper than the 'bench'.
  
 Re the heater pins (#s 4&5) of the 6SN7 to 6CG7 adapter (available on ebay, but there are more going the other way ie 6CG7 to 6SN7, so beware!)  as can be seen, they have been cut leaving just enough to solder the wires from the regulator. Here I have covered them with white 'blu-tak', a form of plasticine, but good insulating tape would actually be better methinks...it would also be a good idea to insulate at the socket, just to be sure...you do NOT want those pins connecting to the LDs supply,lol!! With as little protrusion as possible, the adapter should seat OK in the socket.
  
 Hopefully this is clear enough, but please ask any questions if unsure about anything...
  
 ps. Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but when numbering the pins, look from below (as shown in the photo) and with these '9-pins' the larger gap denotes the 1-9 position - #1 is to the left as you look, and they run clockwise.
  


superdux said:


> the C3G Mod is easy, but costly in the end.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/6000#post_10512665


 
  
 At least with our MKIVs we don't (thankfully!) have to worry about the extra extender/tester adapter...we just have to remove ALL of the 'brass' bits (plate included) and the adapters fit OK 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 I'm actually going to see what happens with the straight-replacement 6HM5 in place of the C3g...should be very interesting to see what they can deliver, with the 6AS7G in the hot seat. Will keep you all posted.


----------



## bbmiller

hypnos1 said:


>


 
 Well I may have more questions later, but one occurs to me right now. The way you seem to be doing it the heat a power supply is just feeding the heater through the adapter. I'm assuming the plate voltage is still coming from the internals of the little dot IV amp if that is the case with their be any need to create a common ground between your power supply and the one in the amp?


----------



## hypnos1

bbmiller said:


> Well I may have more questions later, but one occurs to me right now. The way you seem to be doing it the heat a power supply is just feeding the heater through the adapter. I'm assuming the plate voltage is still coming from the internals of the little dot IV amp if that is the case with their be any need to create a common ground between your power supply and the one in the amp?


 

 Hi bb.
  
 Yes indeed, the external power supply is feeding just the heaters. And mine is totally separate from the LD's supply...no common ground...and no hum!
  
 Cheers.
  
 Edit...ps. Did not change the resistors - the transformer would probably blow instead!!


----------



## hypnos1

Hi guys.
  
 As promised, here's the preliminary result of replacing the C3GS with the (MUCH) cheaper, straight replacement tall-bottle 6HM5....all I can say is I'm gobsmacked!
  
 I _never_ expected such a result...not all that far off the C3Gs, in fact...and am still in shock, lol! They never sounded anything like this, even with the mightily expensive 6N30P-DRs.
  
 This is final proof that the old-established "wisdom" re the power tubes only having a slight influence on the final results is now totally *WRONG* ! These 6AS7Gs have rewritten the book...they are absolutely amazing. Will next try the Tesla E88CC (with gold grids & pins but need to be adapted)...these were far better in the old set-up, so it should be interesting to see how they perform driving the 6AS7Gs...this rolling game just keeps throwing up surprise after surprise - certainly with our humble LDs, anyway!
  

  
 A touch of David and Goliath?!


----------



## hypnos1

As an update (belated!) to my previous thread, although the Tesla E88CCs performed better than the 6HM5s, they were no match for the C3GSs - these truly are in another league...
  
 I also put in some Chatham 6AS7Gs in place of the RCAs, and the sound went up yet _another_ notch...absolutely fabulous! I am finally (?!) 100% sure I have pushed the MKIV SE to its absolute limits (without spending _silly_ money, that is) - WAY beyond the stock offering, lol. I can only hope other MKIV owners can experience this rather amazing result...borne of a year's worth of joining in the rolling thread, and sharing the wonderful work that has been going on there...and still IS!
  
 Whatever, ENJOY your marvellous value-for-money machine...


----------



## Kozic

Hi all
Quick inquiry how is the little dot mkiv se and HE-400 and or HE-500?
Thanks


----------



## lojay

Setting up a headphone rig at home. I have a high-end rig at work (see sig). 
  
 Just wondering, what is the best headphone to pair with the Little Dot MK IV? I didn't find the HD650 that great with the Little Dot, but that's more because I don't think much of the HD650.
  
 Has anyone tried pairing it with a closed headphone like the TH900? 
  
 I enjoy the Little Dot with the K701 much more than the HD800 but both sound bright driven by the Little Dot.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## TrollDragon

kozic said:


> Hi all
> Quick inquiry how is the little dot mkiv se and HE-400 and or HE-500?
> Thanks


 
  


lojay said:


> Setting up a headphone rig at home. I have a high-end rig at work (see sig).
> 
> Just wondering, what is the best headphone to pair with the Little Dot MK IV? I didn't find the HD650 that great with the Little Dot, but that's more because I don't think much of the HD650.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I run the LD MK IV with beyerdynamics DT880 Pro's @ 250Ω which pairs very nicely depending on the tubes you use.
 The OTL line of Little Dot amplifiers MK II, III, IV(SE) don't mesh well with lower impedance headphones in my experience, since they are all designed to optimally run higher impedance headphones. I get a hum with my Ultrasones on the MK IV.
  
 One possible solution might be to look into a transformer coupled amplifier for the low Z headphones such as the Woo WA6 which comes highly recommended around here.


----------



## lojay

Th





trolldragon said:


> I run the LD MK IV with beyerdynamics DT880 Pro's @ 250Ω which pairs very nicely depending on the tubes you use.
> The OTL line of Little Dot amplifiers MK II, III, IV(SE) don't mesh well with lower impedance headphones in my experience, since they are all designed to optimally run higher impedance headphones. I get a hum with my Ultrasones on the MK IV.
> 
> One possible solution might be to look into a transformer coupled amplifier for the low Z headphones such as the Woo WA6 which comes highly recommended around here.




Thanks. Anyone had any luck driving planars with the LD mkIV? I'm thinking of the Alpha Dog.


----------



## HPiper

lojay said:


> Th
> Thanks. Anyone had any luck driving planars with the LD mkIV? I'm thinking of the Alpha Dog.


 

 Well they drive my LCD2 but saying that I have to say they sound a lot better on my Lyr.


----------



## lojay

What are the best tube combos for the LD Mk IV and Beyer DT880 (250 Ohms)? I presume a warmer / bassier combo would be best?


----------



## TrollDragon

lojay said:


> What are the best tube combos for the LD Mk IV and Beyer DT880 (250 Ohms)? I presume a warmer / bassier combo would be best?


I have enjoyed the DT880's with 6DT6A's and 6HM5's but I have since modified the MKIV to run a 6SL7GT, between the Octal and 9 Pin 6N23P / 6DJ8 / 6922's before it, the Octals provide some of the warmest sound.

If modification is not your idea of fun then the 6HM5's are one of the best sounding tubes in an unmodified MKIV.

This is all with stock 6H30Pi-EH power tubes.

For all tube possibilities, have a look at the Little Dot Tube Rolling Thread. Page 77 for a table of tubes that are usable unmodified or the later posts for the full blown 6AS7 power tubes and C3g/s drivers which it top shelf sound per the users that run them.


----------



## MIKELAP

lojay said:


> What are the best tube combos for the LD Mk IV and Beyer DT880 (250 Ohms)? I presume a warmer / bassier combo would be best?


 
 For power tubes i noticed that the 6n6p-ir Russian power tubes seem to be warmer sounding  than the Electro Harmonix 6H30PI gold pins and cheaper also and thats with 300 ohms Senns hd 800.


----------



## lojay

trolldragon said:


> I have enjoyed the DT880's with 6DT6A's and 6HM5's but I have since modified the MKIV to run a 6SL7GT, between the Octal and 9 Pin 6N23P / 6DJ8 / 6922's before it, the Octals provide some of the warmest sound.
> 
> If modification is not your idea of fun then the 6HM5's are one of the best sounding tubes in an unmodified MKIV.
> 
> This is all with stock 6H30Pi-EH power tubes.Quote:


 


mikelap said:


> For power tubes i noticed that the 6n6p-ir Russian power tubes seem to be warmer sounding  than the Electro Harmonix 6H30PI gold pins and cheaper also and thats with 300 ohms Senns hd 800.


 
 Thanks guys! 
  
 I was too lazy to do my research on that massive tube-rolling threat so I just went with the recommendations on the first post and bought a pair of Voshkod 6ZH1P-EV. It has a treble emphasis and I didn't find the mid-range seductive at all. So far I prefer stock 5654s. 
  
 My power tubes are the Sovtek 6H30EBs.
  
 Funny that you mention the 6SL7. I am using the Tungsol BGRP 6SN7s on my Woo WA5, boy are they seductive. The Sylvania 6SN7s are not bad either.
  
 Where can I get more impressions on the tubes that you've mentioned?


----------



## TrollDragon

lojay said:


> Thanks guys!
> 
> I was too lazy to do my research on that massive tube-rolling threat so I just went with the recommendations on the first post and bought a pair of Voshkod 6ZH1P-EV. It has a treble emphasis and I didn't find the mid-range seductive at all. So far I prefer stock 5654s.
> 
> ...


All the mentioned tubes have been discussed in that massive rolling thread...  The member gibosi has probably rolled over 400 tubes through his Little Dot and would be the goto person in that thread for make / model / year and sonic impressions.

If you are just looking to pop in a pair of nice warm driver tubes the Yugoslavian 6HM5's for $7 on eBay are one of the best you will find, without having to make an adapter to start using dual triodes. The last 3/4 of the rolling threads posts deals with all the best sounding gear but it requires mods, after the 6DJ8 dual triodes were tried the members never went back to 7 pin driver tubes.

Good luck with the quest and try a pair of those tall 6HM5's, I think you will find them very enjoyable.

Also my MKIV came default with the gain set at 3 which sounded horrible on the DT880's, I moved it to 5 and the sound really opened up with the volume control between 10 & 11 o'clock.


----------



## lojay

TrollDragon, you saved my amp. My gain was set to low impedance (I was using it with the K701) and I never bothered to fix it since I couldn't locate the manual. When I swapped in the Voshkod the sound just wasn't "right". Then I changed gain to 5, now, everything is back where it should be. I think impedance mismatch was really the culprit. 
  
 The harshness is now mitigated and I have a clear window to the music. 
  
 I'll order the 6HM5 straight away


----------



## TrollDragon

Glad to hear that.

She's a great little amplifier with the right tubes, one of these days I'd like to hear some of the top tier amps like your WA5.

Enjoy!


----------



## gunnerwholelife

Guys does the mk iv se amp sound like a "non-tube" or neutral amp ? 
 I want to experience a pure tube sound.
 Ld mk iv se can be a good first tube amp right ?


----------



## annar

lojay said:


> Setting up a headphone rig at home. I have a high-end rig at work (see sig).
> 
> Just wondering, what is the best headphone to pair with the Little Dot MK IV? I didn't find the HD650 that great with the Little Dot, but that's more because I don't think much of the HD650.
> 
> ...


 
 I know I have asked this elsewhere, but no response so am trying here.
 How well do LCD's 2.2f @ 70 ohm,93 dB/1 mW go with LD ot mk4's?
 Thanks.


----------



## Acapella11

annar said:


> I know I have asked this elsewhere, but no response so am trying here.
> How well do LCD's 2.2f @ 70 ohm,93 dB/1 mW go with LD ot mk4's?
> Thanks.


 

 I have tried the LCD 3 with the LD MKIII just because I had it on loan, and just for curiosity. It doesn't drive it properly, which means it lacks dynamics and stage. Generally speaking, the power requirement for the LCD 2 is suggested to be 1 - 4 W (@ 70 ohm) but the LD does only 0.1 W at 30 ohm and 0.3 W at 120 ohm.


----------



## TrollDragon

acapella11 said:


> I have tried the LCD 3 with the LD MKIII just because I had it on loan, and just for curiosity. It doesn't drive it properly, which means it lacks dynamics and stage. Generally speaking, the power requirement for the LCD 2 is suggested to be 1 - 4 W (@ 70 ohm) but the LD does only 0.1 W at 30 ohm and 0.3 W at 120 ohm.


 

 When the measurements are applied... (Refers to an O2 but power would be the same)
   
 Quote: linustechtips.com


> *Latest LCD2 based on Audeze's spec sheet (93 dB/mw, 104 dB/Vrms):*
> 
> 105dB:
> 15.8mw
> ...


 
  
 The LD MK IV should give around 200mW at 70Ω which would bring the LCD's to 115dB, plenty loud but not a lot of headroom leftover. I had no issue running the LCD-3's from the MK IV, lot's of volume but they did perform much better on the Burson Conductor SL.


----------



## MIKELAP

trolldragon said:


> When the measurements are applied... (Refers to an O2 but power would be the same)
> 
> The LD MK IV should give around 200mW at 70Ω which would bring the LCD's to 115dB, plenty loud but not a lot of headroom leftover. I had no issue running the LCD-3's from the MK IV, lot's of volume but they did perform much better on the Burson Conductor SL.


 
 I used a 27 ohms Denon-5000 with LD MK3 plenty loud but not as good sounding as the Senns


----------



## Acapella11

trolldragon said:


> When the measurements are applied... (Refers to an O2 but power would be the same)
> 
> The LD MK IV should give around 200mW at 70Ω which would bring the LCD's to 115dB, plenty loud but not a lot of headroom leftover. I had no issue running the LCD-3's from the MK IV, lot's of volume but they did perform much better on the Burson Conductor SL.


 
  
 Yes, agree, loud enough. In other words, for me, they just sounded a bit boring on the LD.


----------



## narrow bights

Anyone thinking about parting with their MK III or IV?


----------



## Acapella11

gunnerwholelife said:


> Guys does the mk iv se amp sound like a "non-tube" or neutral amp ?
> I want to experience a pure tube sound.
> Ld mk iv se can be a good first tube amp right ?


 
  
 Hi g., it is a quite neutrally sounding amp, more neutral than the MKIII and certainly a good starting point to experience tube amps for the modest price, the multiple and cheap tube rolling options.


----------



## KodayN

Looking forward to getting my very first tube amp. A Little Dot MK IV SE with a collection of tubes arriving soon! I hope it pairs well with my DT 990's (600Ω) Also looking forward to getting a set of Beyer T90's later on.


----------



## amham

I'm continually amazed how good the MKIVSE sounds everytime I return to it.  I compare it with my Woo WA6SE, WA22, GraceM903, Benchmark DAC2 HGC and it holds it own.  In fact, it more than holds it own, it is a immensely underrated bargain.  Those who question it's SQ vs. XYZ brand/model should not worry.  This little wonder is worth your investment no matter what you trade up to in the future.


----------



## Audiofire5228

Ok im another newbie here. Looking to swap out my tubes on my LD MK IV. Can you give me a short list of easy to find tubes that will fit please? Already swapped my driver? tubes for some Russian tubes but now im questioning the quality. Id like 3-4 examples of driver and power tubes. Im just beginning to learn the difference between the 2. I listen to a lot of rock and electronic if that makes any difference. Thank you in advance for your time and wisdom. Justin.


----------



## MIKELAP

audiofire5228 said:


> Ok im another newbie here. Looking to swap out my tubes on my LD MK IV. Can you give me a short list of easy to find tubes that will fit please? Already swapped my driver? tubes for some Russian tubes but now im questioning the quality. Id like 3-4 examples of driver and power tubes. Im just beginning to learn the difference between the 2. I listen to a lot of rock and electronic if that makes any difference. Thank you in advance for your time and wisdom. Justin.


 
 Want to learn more on tube rolling go to the tube rollin guide thread                                                                                                                        http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/8850#post_11198188                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Very good plug& play power tube  are the 6N6P-IR    and  6GU7                                                                                                   good driver tubes are the  6HM5 Yugo tall bottles              
                                                                                                                                                                                                  http://www.ebay.com/itm/261418431621?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT 
  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/251611916081?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               Have fun .


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello, I'm considering buying my first tube amp. Does anybody know:
  

 * How do the Little Dot Mk IV compare to the Little Dot MK3? (difference in output level, any noticeable differences in sound quality, etc.?)
  
 * Would you recommend that these would pair well with the Beyer. DT 880 (32 ohm) or the Senn. HD 600 headphones?
  
 + any DAC recommendation would be nice, if you would be so kind. Thanks sincerely!


----------



## MIKELAP

decentlevi said:


> Hello, I'm considering buying my first tube amp. Does anybody know:
> 
> 
> * How do the Little Dot Mk IV compare to the Little Dot MK3? (difference in output level, any noticeable differences in sound quality, etc.?)
> ...


 
 Theres not much action here your best bet is to go to the LITTEDOT TUBE ROLLING GUIDE thread  link below youll get your answer there 
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/563884/little-dot-tube-amps-vacuum-tube-rolling-guide/9450#post_11475949
  
 the Littledot is better paired with high impedance HP i own a  mk3 and if i remember it is warmer sounding than a MK4 from what ive heard .Also a very useful feature atop the page is THE SEARCH THIS THREAD function makes it alot easier to find answers to your questions                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   For Dacs i wouldnt know personnally i am using the DAC from my Burson Conductor and considering a WYRED4SOUND dac 2 that  pairs well with my HD 800 it seems And by the way with either LD's you have lots of tube rolling capabilitys.See you there.


----------



## fbxfbx

Hi,
  
  I remember having tried the mkIII and the mkIV together, and then decided to buy the mkIV. The mkIV was just more punchy, precise and powerful, so I went for it. To me the sound of the mkIII was a bit more muddy (or soft/tubey, as you prefer), and I thought that it could be more fatigued with a lower impedance headphone.
 I can't be happier, it's a wonderful versatile amp once you find the correct dip switch feedback setting for your headphones. I use it most of the times with a pair of hd280pro (64 ohms), sometimes with my hd800 (300 ohms). It really shines.
  
 fbx


----------



## gulakpi

Just got my Mk4 a week ago!  
 I owned a few tube pre-amps and power amps, but this device is my very first Tube Headphone amp!
 I have 2 other "portable" headphone amps, and I read about the good reports on this forum, and decide to try it.
 After I received the little guy, I switched it on and cannot get rid of my headphones.  My AKG's never sound so good before!
 I've been listening and enjoying my music every evening since I received the Mk4. It's amazing!
  
 My amp came with a pair of GE 5 star 5654 and a pair of 6H30PiEH.
 I think it already sounds pretty good, but I have just ordered a pair of JAN 6AK5 and start my journey in tube rolling!
 I have been studying the tube rolling thread and hope to get the most out of this fantastic device!


----------



## superdux

you best start reading the tube rolling thread from the back forwards.The best tubes we have discovered are the C3G with adapters and the 6N23P also with an adapter.


----------



## gulakpi

Thanks Superdux,
  
 I'm trying hard to catch up with all the threads about LD tube rolling.  It will take me a while to digest them!
 Thanks for your hints on the C3g.  It seems it is a plug-n-play job with the necessary tube converter socket and the C3g tubes themselves, and nothing else!
 Did someone mention all C3g were made by Siemens and they are identical?


----------



## SonicTrance

gulakpi said:


> Thanks Superdux,
> 
> I'm trying hard to catch up with all the threads about LD tube rolling.  It will take me a while to digest them!
> Thanks for your hints on the C3g.  It seems it is a plug-n-play job with the necessary tube converter socket and the C3g tubes themselves, and nothing else!
> *Did someone mention all C3g were made by Siemens and they are identical?*


 
 No, Lorenz C3G is different. There's also Siemens C3G & C3GS. The "S" is supposedly better than the non-S.
  
 Here's a photo I took of the Lorenz C3G (left tube) and Siemens C3GS (right tube)


----------



## superdux

gulakpi said:


> Thanks Superdux,
> 
> I'm trying hard to catch up with all the threads about LD tube rolling.  It will take me a while to digest them!
> Thanks for your hints on the C3g.  It seems it is a plug-n-play job with the necessary tube converter socket and the C3g tubes themselves, and nothing else!
> Did someone mention all C3g were made by Siemens and they are identical?


 

 There are some C3G that won't work. See this page, which states there is an "old" and "new" C3G with different pin settings and voltage.
 http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_c3g.html


----------



## gulakpi

Many thanks for the tip.
I'll look for these


----------



## gulakpi

Thanks for the help!
  
 Do I understand correctly that I should look for the "new" type C3g?  
 Is it true that most C3g tubes in the market today are the "new" type, and the "old" type is rather rare and not usable here?
  
 I found some Siemens C3m/C3g,  are these what I needed?  The box is marked C3m, but the seller claims C3m = C3g !


----------



## gulakpi

Just found the C3m uses 20V for the filaments, so these cannot be used on the LD4 without modifications!  Correct?


----------



## d4rkch1ld

Correct. You would need external socket and power supply. I actually thought about it cause these tubes are alot cheaper then c3g, and that tube sounds amazing.


----------



## gr34td3str0y3r

Just ordered my Mark IV SE off mass drop (can we talk about them now or are still not allowed to mention them?)
I have read through most of this forum string. Just a few questions. 

Seems pairing with AkG 70X is very 50/50. Some people say yah, some no. 
Thoughts?

Correct me if I am wrong but the mark IV and HD650 seems to be the single most popular pairing anywhere on the web.
I just sold my hd598. I liked my q701 much better, no bass roll off. Much tighter and precise bass. But the graphs from inner fidelity show the 650 and 598 as very differnt cans, so maybe I will try the 650 out. They graphs indicate at least no where near as bad bass roll off. 

But will I hear a big difference between 650 and q701? Some on here, around page 23 I think said they are "opposite" sounding cans. That's good i want some differnt signatures.

How about the Beyer T1? Seems people merely tolerate them with the little dot OTL amps.
I won't go higher than 500 for headphones. So the only contender I am thinking is the HE400i.


----------



## Brooko

T1 and LD MKIV are a great pairing IMO. I've always loved mine with the Little Dot.  And I have the HD600 as well (very similar to HD650), so you'll enjoy that one as well I think (the HD650).
  
 Also had HD600 same time as DT880, K701/2, Q701 etc.  the Senns make a nice contrast to the AKGs.  Nice to own both.
  
 Congrats on the MKIV - great value for money IMO.


----------



## dftruett

New member here with my first post. Have lurked for awhile, however.
  
 Very much looking forward to the arrival of my LD Mk IV SE. Currently using DT880s with a FiiO E10K. Have a pair of he-400i  cans on the way as well. Can't wait to start adventures in tube rolling, although I intend to stick with the stock tubes through burn in.


----------



## gr34td3str0y3r

dftruett said:


> New member here with my first post. Have lurked for awhile, however.
> 
> Very much looking forward to the arrival of my LD Mk IV SE. Currently using DT880s with a FiiO E10K. Have a pair of he-400i  cans on the way as well. Can't wait to start adventures in tube rolling, although I intend to stick with the stock tubes through burn in.




Damn. I'm sitting here staring at the 400i and hd 650. Both sitting at 299. Really good prices.
The 650 will pair better with the mark IV. I might just stick with them for now. 1000$ in one month, that more than I spent all last year on headphones and equipment.

Edit: well... I am out of my effing mind. I just bought he 650's I will put the 400i on my wish list for next year.


----------



## brooksl

Hello. Would any of you Little Dot owners have experience using Philips Fidelio X2s? If so, what did you think? Thank you.


----------



## dftruett

gr34td3str0y3r said:


> Damn. I'm sitting here staring at the 400i and hd 650. Both sitting at 299. Really good prices.
> The 650 will pair better with the mark IV. I might just stick with them for now. 1000$ in one month, that more than I spent all last year on headphones and equipment.
> 
> Edit: well... I am out of my effing mind. I just bought he 650's I will put the 400i on my wish list for next year.


 

 I'm sure you'll love them. I'll report back later when I get my 400i's and LD Mk IV SE with impressions.


----------



## d4rkch1ld

brooksl said:


> Hello. Would any of you Little Dot owners have experience using Philips Fidelio X2s? If so, what did you think? Thank you.


 

 I have both and IMO it's not the best combination. Bass gets looser and a bit uncontrolled. It's not super bad but its better on my solid state amps.


----------



## yangian

I'm struggling on Mk IVSE (which is on massdrop now) and Valhalla 2 and Dark Voice 336SE now.
 I'm mainly listening to symphony/calssical. So I care soundstage/imaging and dynamic most. My headphone is HD600. Anyone can give me some hints?
 Thanks vey much!


----------



## amham

I've owned the MKIVSE for a number of years and have been very pleased.  It competes with my Woo WA22 favorably (although completely different architecture).  Phones used include Senn 650. Audeze LCD-X Hifiman 500, 400s. etc.  It performs way above it's modest price.  I cannot speak for the others you mention however the LD is rare bargain.  You will not be disappointed.  BTW, great build quality and I have not had any issues with the operation/performance.  Buy it!


----------



## yangian

amham said:


> I've owned the MKIVSE for a number of years and have been very pleased.  It competes with my Woo WA22 favorably (although completely different architecture).  Phones used include Senn 650. Audeze LCD-X Hifiman 500, 400s. etc.  It performs way above it's modest price.  I cannot speak for the others you mention however the LD is rare bargain.  You will not be disappointed.  BTW, great build quality and I have not had any issues with the operation/performance.  Buy it!


 

 Compete with WA22, really?! Charming! Will consider it.


----------



## loonacy

Has anyone used the little dot mk IV with the HD 700's ?  How do they match up?


----------



## wwmhf

loonacy said:


> Has anyone used the little dot mk IV with the HD 700's ?  How do they match up?


 
  
 The little dot MK IV has a better chance to match well with headphones of higher impedance, such as HD600, 650, and 800.


----------



## bharat2580

gr34td3str0y3r said:


> Damn. I'm sitting here staring at the 400i and hd 650. Both sitting at 299. Really good prices.
> The 650 will pair better with the mark IV. I might just stick with them for now. 1000$ in one month, that more than I spent all last year on headphones and equipment.
> 
> Edit: well... I am out of my effing mind. I just bought he 650's I will put the 400i on my wish list for next year.


 

 I have both of them, the 400i performs similar with most of the SS amps, sucks with the LD, with the best SS 400i is lets say 6/10, and with the same amp HD650 is 5/10, well you put in a amp that the 650 likes and its 9/10.
  
 the scalling performance of the 650 is amazing, for the ld its great.


----------



## bharat2580

the 650 setup just sounds so natural and musical


----------



## cggkevin1976

I've had my LD MKIV SE for several years now and use it primarily with 600ohm DT-880's. It is very versatile and I have also used my PS-500e and HE400 on it as well. I do find that mine is rather sensitive to RF so I have to careful of placement around computer and WiFi stuff. I've been using my Vallhalla more with the DT880 for classical.


----------



## bharat2580




----------



## kdub

cggkevin1976 said:


> I've had my LD MKIV SE for several years now and use it primarily with 600ohm DT-880's. It is very versatile and I have also used my PS-500e and HE400 on it as well. I do find that mine is rather sensitive to RF so I have to careful of placement around computer and WiFi stuff. I've been using my Vallhalla more with the DT880 for classical.


 

 How's the tube decay? Don't own any tube amp at moment but heard they die out like light bulbs over time and need replacement. Curious how long the bulbs would last in the LD MKIV SE of yours. I'm considering adding this amp to warm up the harsh brightness in my Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms but don't like the idea of having to swap out tubes over time and having the sound consistency degrade.  Maybe I be better off sticking to solid state amps and getting another headphone with a signature less bright?


----------



## wwmhf

kdub said:


> How's the tube decay? Don't own any tube amp at moment but heard they die out like light bulbs over time and need replacement. Curious how long the bulbs would last in the LD MKIV SE of yours. I'm considering adding this amp to warm up the harsh brightness in my Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms but don't like the idea of having to swap out tubes over time and having the sound consistency degrade.  Maybe I be better off sticking to solid state amps and getting another headphone with a signature less bright?


 
  
 My experiences tell me that, in general, Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms works better with an OTL tub amp like LD MKIV SE. For Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms, it is hard, if not impossible, to find a solid state amp to match or beat the performance of an OTL tub amp.


----------



## kdub

wwmhf said:


> My experiences tell me that, in general, Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms works better with an OTL tub amp like LD MKIV SE. For Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms, it is hard, if not impossible, to find a solid state amp to match or beat the performance of an OTL tub amp.




Would you be able to suggest any OTL tube amp with a more affordable price tag than MK IV? I'm looking at less than 250 if possible. My DT880/600 are my only headphones that are too bright for me and adding a dedicated tube amp for this makes the affordable price of the DT880 not so affordable anymore.


----------



## TrollDragon

kdub said:


> Would you be able to suggest any OTL tube amp with a more affordable price tag than MK IV? I'm looking at less than 250 if possible. My DT880/600 are my only headphones that are too bright for me and adding a dedicated tube amp for this makes the affordable price of the DT880 not so affordable anymore.


 

 A Little Dot MK II or MK III then might be cheaper. Massdrop had the Darkvoice on sale a while back for a good price but that has expired.
  
 If you are looking for tubes to take the brightness out of the DT880's then you might be disappointed, I'd try some EQ software first to take the treble two bumps out.


----------



## cggkevin1976

New tubes are generally rated at 3000 to 5000 hours which when you think about your actual 'on' time is a long time. YMMV with NOS tubes. I've had mine for over 3 years and still on the original tubes. 

The LD MKIII would be a lower cost option and the darkvoice I hear would also be a good option. Bear in mind the MKIV SE has upgraded tubes over the other options..


----------



## cggkevin1976

kdub said:


> How's the tube decay? Don't own any tube amp at moment but heard they die out like light bulbs over time and need replacement. Curious how long the bulbs would last in the LD MKIV SE of yours. I'm considering adding this amp to warm up the harsh brightness in my Beyerdynamic DT 880 / 600 ohms but don't like the idea of having to swap out tubes over time and having the sound consistency degrade.  Maybe I be better off sticking to solid state amps and getting another headphone with a signature less bright?




Can't argue with changing headphones either. I have 5 amps and 6 headphones and for me the headphones make a more profound change in sound signature than the amps do.


----------



## gulakpi

I won't worry about the life of the tubes.  Most of them are rated 3000 hrs and above, with some (e.g. C3g) rated at 10,000 hrs.
 Changing tubes are much easier than changing FET's.  Just lift the tubes and replace them with suitable ones.  You do not need to open the cabinet.
 In fact this is where all the fun in tube rolling, and all this thread is about!
 You will soon notice there are many friendly helps from this thread to help you get started,  This thread is one of the most helpful and friendly threads I've seen.
 Enjoy!


----------



## kdub

gulakpi said:


> I won't worry about the life of the tubes.  Most of them are rated 3000 hrs and above, with some (e.g. C3g) rated at 10,000 hrs.
> Changing tubes are much easier than changing FET's.  Just lift the tubes and replace them with suitable ones.  You do not need to open the cabinet.
> In fact this is where all the fun in tube rolling, and all this thread is about!
> You will soon notice there are many friendly helps from this thread to help you get started,  This thread is one of the most helpful and friendly threads I've seen.
> Enjoy!




Do tubes degrade over time (eg. Shelf life) even if you don't put in he usage hours?


----------



## Brooko

kdub said:


> Do tubes degrade over time (eg. Shelf life) even if you don't put in he usage hours?


 
  
 Not as far as I know.  Remember a lot of the NOS (new old stock) tubes are from the 50's-70's and they are still going strong.


----------



## kdub

brooko said:


> Not as far as I know.  Remember a lot of the NOS (new old stock) tubes are from the 50's-70's and they are still going strong.


 

 That's positive to hear. Maybe I will look into a tube amp after all.


----------



## wwmhf

trolldragon said:


> A Little Dot MK II or MK III then might be cheaper. Massdrop had the Darkvoice on sale a while back for a good price but that has expired.
> 
> If you are looking for tubes to take the brightness out of the DT880's then you might be disappointed, I'd try some EQ software first to take the treble two bumps out.


 
  
 Software EQ is effective for DT800/600ohm, I tried it through foobar2000.


----------



## superdux

those mullard 6ak5 should tame some of those highs. I think the 8100 are very warm, but i'm not sure if they are the ones.


----------



## bugeyed

Thought I would post my experience with the LD MK IV SE FYI & for the record (FTR??) 
  
 MassDrop Little Dot Mk IV SE
  
Just received my replacement LD MkIV se. The input & output jacks are wired correctly, but I notice that it too has the warped PCB. Guess that's the way most are made. It's not right & I will strip mine down & get the right length stand offs & clean the solder flux off the board. I resent having to do this, but at least I will have peace of mind when done. This gave me the opportunity to remove the lock on the phones jack too, before it causes an accident. I've included a picture.
 Regarding the bent PCB, the tube sockets are 7/16" tall & the PCB stand-offs are 11/32". The tube sockets don't extend through the holes in the top, so the PCB bends when the screws are tightened. It may last a long time like that, but mine is getting longer stand-offs. Cleaned off the solder flux too, so that was a big relief. It is likely corrosive, so it had to go! I'd be curious if all of these units were made with the short stand-offs. I'd like to see inside of an older one that was not made to fill the MD order. These may be using a different tube sockets. Ones that don't fit through the hole in the case or are just taller. Longer stand-offs should take care of it. 
 kev

  






In the process, I removed the lock mechanism in the HP jack. Didn’t see any reason for it & worried about causing damage if, somehow, I jerked on the cable. 
  

kev





  
Update; I added washers under the stand-offs to make their height match the tube sockets. It went back together OK until I tried to install the front panel. It seems that the PCB/standoff dimension is correct & the tube sockets are either too high or too big around to fit the holes in the top of the case. I got the front panel on, but I don't like that the PCB is now stressed in the front. 
 Solution 1. Replace tube sockets with shorter or narrower sockets.
 Solution 2. Enlarge the holes in the top of the case to allow the tube sockets to stick through. 
 I am probably going with the second solution. 
 P.S. I hope anyone reading this doesn't think I am overly obsessing about the bent PCB, but my background in engineering & R&D sees this as a serious breaking of the rules of quality assembly. PCBs are not generally made to be bent to this degree, or at all! It will likely fail at some point. I hope for everyone else's sake that it doesn't, but mine is going to be made right one way or another. This thing does sound nice though. I have to give the electrical engineer credit here. It's the mechanical engineer that is to blame. BTW I think you should be able to disable the locking phone jack without opening the unit up. Not sure if the wires are long enough. I can elaborate if anyone wants to do it. It's easy.
Update: If anyone cares??? I finally enlarged the tube holes in the chassis to accommodate the tube sockets. (Solution 2) Used a Dremel, but ended up finishing with files. The large holes need to be a bit over 1" & the smaller ones about 3/4". I thought that I could use the brass plate as a guide, but the large holes need to be a bit larger than the holes in the brass cover & the small holes a bit smaller. Anyway, it's all back together & working, with a flat, unbent, PCB. One of the hardest parts is learning how to maneuver the wires to get the board out & then to get it back in. When you get the wires arranged properly, the PCB assy. comes out & goes in smoothly. Glad that's over, as it was bugging me that the unit just wasn't right. The amp is much happier now. I would like to tell you that it sounds much better with an unstressed PCB, but I really can't tell a difference.  Also enjoying the non-locking jack. 
 Regards, kev


----------



## White Lotus

Hey all, 
  
 My LDMKIV should be here in a few days.
  
 Of all the amps I've purchased and owned over the years, I don't think I've been as excited as I am for this one.
  
 I'll be using it for reviews, but also for my 600ohm DT880.
  
 Also plan to use the pre-amps to speakers, and to other SS amps that drive my other cans well.
  
 Exciting times.


----------



## kingaljr

Hello all. First post on these awesome forums and just thought i'd through my 2 cents in. I started out with a Little Dot 2++ to run my Senn555 and Grado 80's and thanks to a tax refund a couple years back I sprang for the MKIVSE looking to upgrade to for my needs the best. Well of course once I got the SE I started getting upgrade fever and after much research got the Beyerdynamic  T90 .I modded the cushions  and was more than happy with them until I started looking at Grado again .Thanks to lots of devils cut and paypal pay later I got a pair of Grado SR325E's .
 After a lot of searching I was wondering if I made a mistake getting low impedance cans with the MK4SE. There are a  ton of posts about how the Grado's etc and Little Dot don't pair well and after my first listen I concur. Bass was a muddle and highs were painful. I noticed one power tube was dimmer than the other so I replaced them with a Pair of electro-harmonix 6h30pi and while I was at it replaced the drivers with a pair of mullard5654's .MY system still sounded like crap until I realized I had the whole gain thing backwards. Setting the gain to +5 was pure audio karma . With the new tubes and gain settings the first thing I listen to was  Pet Sounds and holly cow. 
 My Grado's sound like what I thought the T-90's would. I am writing this while listening to the Cranberries and am in total bliss. Not to put anyone down but have those saying Grado and LD4se don't pair actually heard the combo.
 Total bliss for me.


----------



## White Lotus




----------



## srvvzr

kingaljrI think if you go back to the beginning of this thread, people were saying that grados theoretically shouldn't pair well (low impedance cans with high impedance OTL), but listeners were happy with the mk iii/iv with their cans. so make of that what you will i suppose.


----------



## White Lotus

Not sure if anyone has picked up on this or not, but it looks like the MK IV and MK IV SE use the same front plate.
  
 Here is a closeup of the logo on the LD MK IV (non-SE) model I purchased from Brooko. 
  
 You can see where it once said "MK IV SE". 
  
 Interesting!


----------



## TrollDragon

Mine says Majestic...


----------



## MIKELAP

trolldragon said:


> Mine says Majestic...


 
 Mr Dragon is this MK4 Majestic a Limited Edition What special features does it have besides being fit for a King ? Thank you .


----------



## White Lotus




----------



## TrollDragon

mikelap said:


> Mr Dragon is this MK4 Majestic a Limited Edition What special features does it have besides being fit for a King ? Thank you .


 

 That excellent nameplate, an upgraded Neutrik 1/4" HP jack and a very fine ВОСХОД 6Н2п-EB in the 6DJ8 adapter.


----------



## White Lotus

I promise I'll stop posting photos of it soon. It's so sexy, I can't get over the aesthetic.


----------



## TrollDragon

white lotus said:


> I promise I'll stop posting photos of it soon. It's so sexy, I can't get over the aesthetic.


 
  
 Please post as many as you like, it's a great amplifier!


----------



## Ehr33

Here's mine, serving my HD650 well.


----------



## wendyKL

Is this significantly better than the LD MKII?


----------



## SoundCheck88 (May 7, 2017)

Hello Wendy, I never heard the LD MkII. But I would think its not that much better ,but definity better due to the more power. And all depends on the tubes you have or roll. Hope that helped a little any way. Thank you


----------



## timorinolee

Hi everyone, 

Just wondering if anyone has compared this with the Valhalla 2. Looking for a tube amp for my HD600's.


----------



## robboffard

_(Mods, if this is in the wrong place, please let me know)_

LDMKIV tube rolling question from a newbie.

Bought my first tube to roll with: a pair of Mesa Boogie EL84/6BQ5s, recommended by a local dealer. They aren't working right: there's hardly any sound, just horrible static.

They are seated correctly, and I have de-oxidised the pins. They do not appear to be damaged or dead (silver top, no purple glow etc), and I bought them from a reputable dealer. Stock tubes working fine, with good sound, so it's not the amp itself. Before I send them back: it occurs to me that I may need to change the jumper switches. But I don't know what these look like, and Google is no help. Neither unfortunately is the LD manual/reference guide.

Do I need to change the jumper switches? If so, where are they? And please don't say 'next to the capacitors' - assume I'm an idiot please! Muchas gracias


----------



## cswann1

robboffard said:


> _(Mods, if this is in the wrong place, please let me know)_
> 
> LDMKIV tube rolling question from a newbie.
> 
> ...



As far as I have been able to determine the EL84 valve is not a drop in replacement for the LD MKIV.

Here is a link to the owners manual that gives some info on tube rolling, however the power tubes don't include jumper settings for alternate tube types. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/biytahabdg1xs1c/Little Dot MK IV SE Reference Guide.pdf?dl=0

I would stick with the power tubes that shipped with your amp.  If you want to experiment with different flavors of sound, its the driver tubes you want to roll. They have far more effect on the sound.


----------



## Acapella11

robboffard said:


> _(Mods, if this is in the wrong place, please let me know)_
> 
> LDMKIV tube rolling question from a newbie.
> 
> ...





Hi, check this post for tube alternatives. I suggest to post your question in this forum as well:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lit...e-rolling-guide.563884/page-585#post-11155053


----------



## robboffard

Acapella11 said:


> Hi, check this post for tube alternatives. I suggest to post your question in this forum as well:
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lit...e-rolling-guide.563884/page-585#post-11155053





cswann1 said:


> As far as I have been able to determine the EL84 valve is not a drop in replacement for the LD MKIV.
> 
> Here is a link to the owners manual that gives some info on tube rolling, however the power tubes don't include jumper settings for alternate tube types.
> 
> ...



Cool, thank you!


----------



## robboffard

Acapella11 said:


> Hi, check this post for tube alternatives. I suggest to post your question in this forum as well:
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lit...e-rolling-guide.563884/page-585#post-11155053



Will do, thanks!


----------



## MIKELAP

YOU CANNOT USE THIS TUBE IN YOUR AMP heater current is .760 ma MAX/per channel is .500ma  look on page 77 for the tubes you can try


----------



## White Lotus

Some photos:


----------



## cswann1

Very nice pics!


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## bugeyed

Just tried to listen to my LD MKIV SE with the HE-400i & it was a fail. Tracks was Holly Cole Train song. Some serious upright bass & that's where the LD failed. Even a moderate levels the bass was not tight at all. It had a flabby sound on the verge of break up. Un-listenable. Tried the HD650 & they worked fine. Guess it's an impedance thing, I think the 400i is 35 Ohm? May just be too low for the LD to control the bass. I understand about damping factor & impedance mismatch, but have never actually experienced it. I will experimant more in the next few days. I have another pair of HP with Z of 250 Ohms. Otherwise I love this amp.
Kev


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## sennsay

bugeyed said:


> Just tried to listen to my LD MKIV SE with the HE-400i & it was a fail. Tracks was Holly Cole Train song. Some serious upright bass & that's where the LD failed. Even a moderate levels the bass was not tight at all. It had a flabby sound on the verge of break up. Un-listenable. Tried the HD650 & they worked fine. Guess it's an impedance thing, I think the 400i is 35 Ohm? May just be too low for the LD to control the bass. I understand about damping factor & impedance mismatch, but have never actually experienced it. I will experimant more in the next few days. I have another pair of HP with Z of 250 Ohms. Otherwise I love this amp.
> Kev


Yes, interesting, isn't it. I certainly didn't enjoy the HE400S with my upgraded Valhalla 2 (since sold), they are much improved with the Mimby/Magni 3 combo, if not as brilliant as my 600 ohm HD540 Ref1s! After over 18 months with the HE400S, I still prefer them straight out of the Questyle QP1R - with either stock or hand-made cable - where they are very good indeed. Even with only 40mW of pure Class A on hand! The only thing I really don't like about them is that lower treble peak which tends to blend vocals with the harmonics of other instruments, leading to voices not separating forward from them as happens with my other headphones. It's better with the newer cable, but still a feature of these cans. Now, if they could just flatten out that peak .......


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## TrollDragon

OTL amplifiers like the Little Dot MK IV require high Z headphones to shine, the amplifier was not designed for 35Ω cans.


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## wwmhf

TrollDragon said:


> OTL amplifiers like the Little Dot MK IV require high Z headphones to shine, the amplifier was not designed for 35Ω cans.



Totally agree. This is one of the thing you do not need to "even try"


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## HollowNoise

Hey peeps, any ideas on how the LD MK IV/SE perform compared to the Bottlehead Crack? Anyone heard the two? Also MK IV with C3g tubes vs stock Bottlehead with Speedball?


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## evolutiontheory

Sorry for the tangent.. 
Is there a similar thread for LD MK2? I had some doubts, but unable to find the forum


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## adbar86 (Dec 22, 2019)

Hi all, I'm new here  Just have a quick question... I own LDIVse the very first version and wondering if you can advise me any best value/money power tubes with adapters or without. And what about 6N6P it will work with the earlier version of IVse?
My LD came with the power valves visible on the picture any idea what they are? The name rubbed off


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## sennsay

adbar86 said:


> Hi all, I'm new here  Just have a quick question... I own LDIVse the very first version and wondering if you can advise me any best value/money power tubes with adapters or without. And what about 6N6P it will work with the earlier version of IVse?
> My LD came with the power valves visible on the picture any idea what they are? The name rubbed off


Hi adbar86, I don't own a LDIV - although I think I'd like to some time - however, something that might be of interest to you is that on the LampizatOr site, he quotes the 6H6P (notice I didn't say 6N6P!) as THE valve/tube to use and that they were used on the LD models - or at least some of them - I think from LDII to LDIV. They perform much better, are supremely linear, take less power to drive them, can run at lower voltages and sound magnificent. I'm paraphrasing his words, but he is the dude for using these tubes, I mention this because it is THE tube to use for converting my Zero DAC to tube output, rated very highly as such and that I _would_ like to do! As a newbie here, you probably won't want to just pop the lid and see how the output tubes are wired for the heaters, but here is the link to the 6H6P Club site, it's worth reading. All the best with it. 
http://www.lampizator.eu/UPGRADE/upgrade noval tubes to 6H6P.html


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## antenorhs

cswann1 said:


> As far as I have been able to determine the EL84 valve is not a drop in replacement for the LD MKIV.
> 
> Here is a link to the owners manual that gives some info on tube rolling, however the power tubes don't include jumper settings for alternate tube types.
> 
> ...




Thank you so much for posting this link!


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## ishmaelk (Aug 27, 2020)

I have a Little Dot MK-IV SE that I had given little use. With the holidays and some time to use it, I have to admit I'm quite impressed by its sound.
The pairing with my HD650 at the lowest gain setting is awesome. There's plenty of headroom, mids are heaven, bass is tight and highs are just right, not lowered or obscured by the mids.
I have a Valhalla 2 home and going back to the LD is making me think I may have made a mistake.
Of course, any comparison has to take into consideration that the V2 and the LD 4 use different tubes. I have the stock tubes in the V2, which I think are quite good, and some Mullard CV4010 in the LD.
Anyway, I'm pretty inexperienced in the tube world. But the LD 4 SE delivers.


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## ishmaelk (Aug 26, 2020)

I'm looking for tracks that I could use to make a better comparison between the Valhalla 2 and the Little Dot MKIV SE for clarity, soundstage, detail and range.
For example, Swegbe & Pako by Fela Kuti is one of my go to tracks to compare soundstage. I love the spaciousness of the recording.
Another fantastic track is Chan Chan, from the first Buena Vista Social Club release. Terrific acoustic recording.


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## antenorhs

ishmaelk said:


> I'm looking for tracks that I could use to make a better comparison between the Valhalla 2 and the Little Dot MKIV SE for clarity, soundstage, detail and range.
> For example, Swegbe & Pako by Fela Kuti is one of my go to tracks to compare soundstage. I love the spaciousness of the recording.
> Another fantastic track is Chan Chan, from the first Buena Vista Social Club release. Terrific acoustic recording.



Hi!
have you tryed the album from Amber Rubarth, "sessions from the 17th ward"? In particular the 4th track "A kiss to build a dream on", is great to compare soundstage.
To compare Details and dynamics I like the trak "Guillaume Tell: Overture", from Rossini, conducted by Antonio Pappano.
Also the track "The expert", from Tello is good.


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## antenorhs

ishmaelk said:


> I have a Little Dot MK-IV SE that I had given little use. With the holidays and some time to use it, I have to admit I'm quite impressed by its sound.
> The pairing with my HD650 at the lowest gain setting is awesome. There's plenty of headroom, mids are heaven, bass is tight and highs are just right, not lowered or obscured by the mids.
> I purchased a Valhalla 2 recently and going back to the LD is making me think I may have made a mistake.
> Of course, any comparison has to take into consideration that the V2 and the LD 4 use different tubes. I have the stock tubes in the V2, which I think are quite good, and some Mullard CV4010 in the LD.
> Anyway, I'm pretty inexperienced in the tube world. But the LD 4 SE delivers.



I'm using now a pair of RCA's for preamp and another from Electro Harmonix for power on My LD MKIV, and its a perfect match. The sound is rich and very very clear.


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## ishmaelk

antenorhs said:


> Hi!
> have you tryed the album from Amber Rubarth, "sessions from the 17th ward"? In particular the 4th track "A kiss to build a dream on", is great to compare soundstage.
> To compare Details and dynamics I like the trak "Guillaume Tell: Overture", from Rossini, conducted by Antonio Pappano.
> Also the track "The expert", from Tello is good.


Thanks for the recommendations. I'll check them out. 
Another favourite of mine to test headphones (and speakers) is Bill Evans' The Complete Village Vanguard Recordings. Some tracks offer a great sense of the room, with several layers of sounds from the venue.


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## jpearson

ishmaelk said:


> I'm looking for tracks that I could use to make a better comparison between the Valhalla 2 and the Little Dot MKIV SE for clarity, soundstage, detail and range.
> For example, Swegbe & Pako by Fela Kuti is one of my go to tracks to compare soundstage. I love the spaciousness of the recording.
> Another fantastic track is Chan Chan, from the first Buena Vista Social Club release. Terrific acoustic recording.


Hi @ishmaelk, does the LD have a more tubey sound than the V2 to your ears? Do you have any thoughts about comparison of the top end? I have the V2 and I find the upper mids a bit rough at times and some sharpness in the treble that is unpleasant to my sensitive ears... On a quest for a more relaxed sound from a tube amp, but perhaps the LD is not that!


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## ishmaelk

jpearson said:


> Hi @ishmaelk, does the LD have a more tubey sound than the V2 to your ears? Do you have any thoughts about comparison of the top end? I have the V2 and I find the upper mids a bit rough at times and some sharpness in the treble that is unpleasant to my sensitive ears... On a quest for a more relaxed sound from a tube amp, but perhaps the LD is not that!


I don't have neither of them anymore. I remember the sound of the LD seemed a bit smoother, more tubey if you please, but they didn't use the same tubes, so it's not a fair comparison, really. 
If I had to go back to any of them, I'd go for the V2. I used it with great results as a preamp too.
I'd check the V2 tube rolling thread and see if there's anyone that can recommend you a nice pair of affordable tubes to soften up that treble. The stock tubes were quite good but harsher than some gold lions I had too.
I'm a bit sensitive to treble harshness too and I know it's hell when something is bothering you. 
Good luck!


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