# Cayin RU6: R-2R USB Dongle DAC with Head-Amp



## Andykong (Nov 25, 2021)

While we are busy working on our new flagship products, we have also devoted a lot of resource to pass down our new technologies to more affordable applications.  Our R-2R based R01 Audio Motherboards for N6ii was well-received by the Personal Audio community.  While a lot of users urged us to develop a high-end R-2R DAP with latest CPU and software technologies, our priority is to make the R-2R technologies we developed for N6ii more widely available before we move to another high-end R-2R DAP.






*Background Story*

The RU6 is the first portable USB DAC/Amp from Cayin. We have noticed the enormous demand in the Dongle DAC market, but we are not satisfied with the highly integrated off-the-shelf solutions, so we take our time to look for the right technologies.  By the time we completed R01 Audio Motherboard R&D for N6ii DAP, we noticed the R-2R resistor ladder network can be implemented as low power consumption DAC circuit that offers outstanding audio performance. The bigger difficulties are space and operation limitations but we are confident that R-2R Dongle DAC is technically feasible.

The RU6 Dongle DAC features an in-house developed 24bit Discrete R-2R resistor ladder circuit that can decode up to 384kHz. The hardware volume control buttons are backed by a sophisticated resistor ladder volume circuit, and user can select between Non-Oversampling or Oversampling mode through a simple menu setting. Two headphone outputs, 3.5mm and 4.4mm, are in place so you can connect RU6 to a wide selection of earphone in the market.

*24Bit Discrete R-2R Reistor Ladder DAC*

The basic idea of R-2R ladder is a matched pair of two resistors, the first is “R” and the other is “2R”which has twice the value of R.  To achieve 24bit decoding, we need 48 pieces of resistors (23 x R and 25 x 2R), and that’s good for one channel. So for a stereo 24Bit R-2R decoder, we need exactly 96 pieces of resistors. The digital audio section of R01 Audio Motherboard DAC circuitry can be divided into four subsystems:

USB Audio Bridge: receive different audio format from USB, go through high precision signal enhancement, output I2S bit-stream for subsequent processing.
Digital Audio Bridge: convert DSD to PCM; convert all audio signals to left and right channel of 24 Bit/384kHz serial audio data signal.
Serial to Parallel Shift Register: convert serial data signal to parallel data signal and transmit to DAC circuit
24-Bit Discrete R-2R Precision DAC: convert digital audio signal to analog audio signal through a high precision R-2R Resistive Ladder Network.
Basically (2) to (4) is incurred from R01 Audio Motherboard, we can't accommodate the hardware interpolation filter in RU6 in view of the space and power supply limitation, the oversampling feature will absorbed into the Audio Bridge and fulfilled by software based DSP.  We added an USB Audio Bridge to handle the USB Audio input since this is the only digital input to RU6.  The details R-2R design is also incurred from R01 Audio Motherboard include the R and 2R value (5.1kΩ and 10.2kΩ respectively).  Unfortunately we can’t afford to use the same high precision resistors, so we go down one step and adopted high precision low TCR Thin Film Resistors rated at ±0.1% (or ±0.001 or ±1/1,000). This is as close as we can get with Dongle DAC project. They will offer satisfactory matching accuracy required in R-2R ladder DAC circuit. The temperature coefficient of resistance (TCR) of these resistors is also respectable. Rate at TCR25 (±25 ppm/℃), the resistor value will only fluctuate within 25/1,000,000 per 1 degree change in temperature.

For more detail explanation of our R-2R implementation, please refer to our *R01 Audio Motherboard* announcement.





*Non-Oversampling/Oversampling DA mode*

Cayin offers both Oversampling and Non-oversampling DA modes in RU6. For Oversampling mode, the Digital Audio Bridge will upsample the digital audio data to 384kHz through digital filters. This will enhance the resolution, reduce noise and improve anti-aliasing of the digital signal.  The Oversampling DA mode will offer noticeable improvement on details and frequency extension.  The playback is clean and sharp with darker background.

On the other hand, NOS DA mode maintains the sampling rate of the original bit-stream. This will get rid of the digital filters in OS mode, and maintain the signal in perfect time sequence. The phase distortion and jitter will remain at very low level without ringing artifact. Playback will become very musical with a natural, organic and coherent presentation.

*High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control*

Most USB dongle DAC will rely on the volume control of your mobile phone to control the volume of the headphone output.  Unfortunately this is not a viable solution to Cayin RU6.  R-2R DAC circuit is very demanding on incoming data integrity, digital volume of mobile phone will damage sound quality badly, so the more effective solution with R-2R design is to keep the incoming bit-stream at full volume and then implement a high quality analog volume control after the R-2R DAC circuit. For these reasons, Music player app. supports bit perfect USB is recommended.   If we use HiBy Music App as example, you need to turn on Exclusive HQ USB Audio Access and USB Output setting > Lock USB Audio Vol in your App setting (as illustrated below), this will safeguard the quality of USB Audio output.  For applications that don't provide similar feature, you'll need to turn the volume to 100 manually.  This is inconvenient to users for sure, but fortunately most, if not all, current mobile phones will "remember" the volume setting of different plug-in device.  So as soon as  you unplug the RU6 from your mobile phone, the volume will fall back to the setting BEFORE you plug in RU6, and when you plug in RU6 again, you phone will raise the volume to 100 automatically.



Cayin tested numerous off-the-shelf volume options, unfortunately they cannot meet the high precision, low noise, and low power consumption requirements in dongle DAC application.  For instance, we have used PGA2311A in several DAPs and R01 Audio Motherboards, we tried to repeat the trick but the RU6 developed unacceptable background noise.  There are better volume chipset in the market, but they are either too big physically, or drain a lot of power, making it inappropriate for Dongle DAC application.  Eventually Cayin bite the bullet and developed a high precision resistor array volume control circuit that provides 99 steps volume control through 9 segments of resistors and switching relays.





Resistor Array volume control is not a new technologies, it have been around for a very long time.   They are very high quality volume control design, extremely transparent when implemented correctly and you can find them in a lot of high-end preamp and integrated amplifies.  Each segment of resistor array can only provide ~10 steps of volume control, this is obviously not enough in real life application, so you need to "hop" to another set of resistor array for another 10 steps, and so on, and so on.

We don't recall anyone used resistor array volume control in a Dongle DAC, probably not even in portable DAP.  There is no way we expected  this final outcome when we started the RU6 project back in early February 2021 (when we completed R01 R&D). We basically completed the RU6 circuit design in very fast track but we stuck at the volume control issue for 3 months trying different solutions and going nowhere.  Using Resistor Array Volume Control is our final trump card. It is basically an out of proportion implementation for Dongle DAC and that us another month to finalise the furrent 9 segment resistor array design.

Our main hesitation with resistor array volume control is not about technical difficulties or budget consideration. The Resistor Array volume control involves switching relays when you hop from one segment to another.  The relay will produce very mild pop sound with speakers and is inaudible when you are 2 or 3 meters away from the speaker.  Unfortunately the pop noise will become very annoying to sensitive IEM users.  For this reason, we need to mute the output for a short moment when a relay kicks in.  This will introduce a small delay (around 40ms) in volume adjustment, definitely a set  back from user experience point of view.  For dedicated audiophiles who put audio performance, this is a small price to pay in order to implement R-2R resistor ladder network in a dongle DAC. but we can understand some users might consider this as a deal breaker, that's why we explained this in detail up front.

*Amplification, Headphone Output and Other Issues*

First of all, another confession.  The RU6 is NOT a full balanced designed Dongle DAC.  The 4.4mm phone output is balanced driven, but the signal path is primarily a single-ended design. We added an extra op-amp (identical to the primary headphone amplification Op-Amp) in the final output stage as unity gain amplifier, all it does is to convert the original stereo signal to negative phase.  This will provide extra power and current from the regular 3.5mm phone out, but the channel separation is not as good as a full balanced design.

Design and implement full balanced amplification circuit for R-2R is not difficult, we have done that with R01.  The primary limitation is space, and power consumption is also something we need to consider.  If you are hesitated because the 4.4 phone out is not fully balanced design, please wait till you have the chance to audition the RU6 in person, or when there are reviews or user impression that provide all the information you need about RU6.

To be honest.  if you study the specification of RU6, they are not particularly impressive.  They are not bad for sure because we have done our engineering work properly.  Measurement is not the strong suit of R-2R technologies, especially with NOS design.  For those who put measurement as top priority, we can only advise you up-front that RU6 is not the best choice for you.




*Summary of RU6 Features*

24-Bit Discrete R-2R Resistor Ladder DAC
1/1000 ultra-high precision TCR25 low temperature coefficient thin film resistors
Support up to PCM 384kHz and DSD 64/128/256
Low power consumption

User selectable NOS/OS DA Mode
NOS mode: digital filter-less, low phase distortion, low jitter, no ringing artifact
OS mode: increased sampling rate, enhance resolution, reduce noise, improve anti-aliasing

99 steps Multi-segments High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control
Hardware Volume +/- button
TWO 6-layers PCB, digital and analog circuit on separate boards
3.5mm single-ended phone output delivers 138mW per channel at 32Ω loading
4.4mm balanced phone output delivers 213mW per channel at 32Ω loading
Compatible with Android, iOS, iPadOS, macOS, Windows 7/8/8,1/10 and DAP with USB Audio output
Type-C USB Audio, Shield USB-C to USB-C cable bundled.
High/Low gain control
Compact and seamless CNC aluminium chassis with 1” OLED screen at 28g.
Optional Leather cases: orange or blue
Optional USB-C to lightning cable
The suggested retail price of RU6 is *$249.99*
The USB-C to Lightning cable is an optional accessories at $19.99
Two protective cases (blue and orange) are also available at $19.99

We have commenced mass production of RU6 already, they should be available by 1 December 2021, please consult your Cayin dealer for local availability date. The global logistic is not at their best, so please be accommodative when it take a bit longer to arrive.


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## Mehran (Oct 11, 2021)

So why these USB dongles can't also work via BT to compete with BTR5 or other BT receivers too?
Would it considerably increase the build size or something ?


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## musicday

Can't wait 😀. Congratulations for another wonderful product.


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## immortalsoul

I have not used a dongle before but I am interested in this one


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## jwbrent

Mehran said:


> So why these USB dongles can't also work via BT to compete with BTR5 or other BT receivers too?
> Would it considerably increase the build size or something ?



Perhaps expense and more importantly, noise potential.


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## Mehran

jwbrent said:


> Perhaps expense and more importantly, noise potential.


Well, I'm no expert but I think BT can be turned off when not in use perhaps, like on phones?
Anyway it would have been much more appealing for my use case.


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## alota

nice news


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## justsomesonyfan

incredible, any speculation on power output?


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## Ichos

The question to be answered is about power consumption.

What is the power consumption of this dongle?


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## HiFiHawaii808

Andykong said:


> Since the cat is out of the bag, and there were discussion of our forthcoming USB DAC/Amp Dongle in multiple threads/forums/groups, we decides to start a new thread ahead of our regular schedule.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the update, Andy.   I'll buy one.    If it sounds better than the L&P W2, I don't really care as much about usability features.    Well, I do care.  But I care about great sound the most.  So I am probably in your target customer base.   Too bad it doesn't have a true line out.  Would have been nice to pair it with the C9.


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## feverfive




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## musicday

Nice to have more high end dongle USB amp options, W2, S2 and now this.👍


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## justsomesonyfan

musicday said:


> Nice to have more high end dongle USB amp options, W2, S2 and now this.👍


give it 2 - 3 years and dongles will run the portable game.


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## tawmizzzz

justsomesonyfan said:


> give it 2 - 3 years and dongles will run the portable game.


Quite possible-you can even argue the W2 already knocks out most $1-1.5k DAPs from a pure sound quality aspect. It's really just the use case of battery burn/not having a separate LO'd music player that can be an inconvenience to most.


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## blotmouse

justsomesonyfan said:


> give it 2 - 3 years and dongles will run the portable game.


Only if they get their power use under control. I am actualy here on Head-fi because I was destroying my phone batteries prematurely. Time for a dedicated device, I thought. Happy I did, but 2-3 charge cycles for a new phone in a day using a dongle vs. 1 charge every 3 days when not using is a huge difference.


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## justsomesonyfan

blotmouse said:


> Only if they get their power use under control. I am actualy here on Head-fi because I was destroying my phone batteries prematurely. Time for a dedicated device, I thought. Happy I did, but 2-3 charge cycles for a new phone in a day using a dongle vs. 1 charge every 3 days when not using is a huge difference.


that's a fair point, but maybe a self charging dong will come eventually, who knows. hell it could be a dongle with an extra battery feature for all we know, with a toggle to just charge the phone instead of being a dac/amp


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## blotmouse

justsomesonyfan said:


> that's a fair point, but maybe a self charging dong will come eventually, who knows. hell it could be a dongle with an extra battery feature for all we know, with a toggle to just charge the phone instead of being a dac/amp


Yeah, maybe a case w/battery like some phone's have.

Whatever happened to that battery material they could spray on the insides of electronics and then they work more like a car and alternator never requiring an actual charge unless they drop too low? Gotta check my MIT feeds, lol.


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## sp33ls

Super interested in this... I'm looking at the HIP DAC v2 as a nice option to for chilling on my outside balcony and listening, and was just yesterday thinking "is there an R2R portable DAC/amp out there..?"

Curious how it'll do with difficult-to-drive cans.


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## SHOOTINGTECHIE

Cant wait for this wohooo, hopefully it stays coolllllllll with that leather case !!!


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## ClieOS

Definitely interested.


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## rocketron

Interested in this.
Will have a line out as well?


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## musicday

What audio formats it can decode and the power output are important questions.


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## Wildcatsare1

Andykong said:


> Since the cat is out of the bag, and there were discussion of our forthcoming USB DAC/Amp Dongle in multiple threads/forums/groups, we decides to start a new thread ahead of our regular schedule.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



To get reasonably price R2R, is be happy to carry one twice the size of the Cayin Dongle, waiting with baited breath. Has Andrew opened pre-order yet?


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## musicday

Wildcatsare1 said:


> To get reasonably price R2R, is be happy to carry one twice the size of the Cayin Dongle, waiting with baited breath. Has Andrew opened pre-order yet?


It is in development as I type I believe.


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## Billyak

Also interested in this.


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## Deferenz

As soon as I heard Cayin + R2R I was sold.


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## Cyn0

A portable, sub-$500, r2r dac/amp with 4.4? You definitely have my interest


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## Wildcatsare1

Sign me up; it’ll complement my incoming N6ii!


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## musicday

The screen also seems slightly bigger then the one used on the S1/S2/W2.
Looking forward to read more about it.


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## ForSure

How hard is it to add play / stop / forward function?


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## PopZeus

Are R-2R DACs becoming more attractive to hifi makers because DAC chips have become more scarce or is this strictly because it provides the best sound quality? It just seems like a trend that all of a sudden started appearing in places where R-2R had not been before.


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## Victory112

PopZeus said:


> Are R-2R DACs becoming more attractive to hifi makers because DAC chips have become more scarce or is this strictly because it provides the best sound quality? It just seems like a trend that all of a sudden started appearing in places where R-2R had not been before.


That's an interesting question. The R2R BlueMini is the only other cheap example that comes to mind. What else have you noticed?


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## Stuff Jones

Awesome. @Andykong - Any plans for Cayin combine R2R + tubes in a DAP or portable DAC+amp and at a reasonably affordable price range (<1k)?


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## ClieOS (Oct 12, 2021)

PopZeus said:


> Are R-2R DACs becoming more attractive to hifi makers because DAC chips have become more scarce or is this strictly because it provides the best sound quality? It just seems like a trend that all of a sudden started appearing in places where R-2R had not been before.



Nah, R2R has always being 'special' in the HiFi market with a few dedicated manufacturers trying to achieve a certain sound signature that is opposite to that of Delta-Sigma. This has became more and more obvious as PCM1702/1704 (which many considered to be the pinnacle of integrated R2R audio chip) becomes harder and harder to come by. The usual problem is really the size, matching precision and cost of making a (non-integrated ) R2R that can be used in a portable setting - that's until recently years where we finally started to see viable miniatured R2R design.


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## PopZeus

Victory112 said:


> That's an interesting question. The R2R BlueMini is the only other cheap example that comes to mind. What else have you noticed?


Oh Just the BlueMini and the Cayin devices. It wasn't a very scientific theory haha. 


ClieOS said:


> Nah, R2R has always being 'special' in the HiFi market with a few dedicated manufacturers trying to achieve a certain sound signature that is opposite to that of Delta-Sigma. This has became more and more obvious as PCM1702/1704 (which many considered to be the pinnacle of integrated R2R audio chip) becomes harder and harder to come by. The usual problem is really the size, matching precision and cost of making a (non-integrated ) R2R that can be used in a portable setting - that's until recently years where we finally started to see viable miniatured R2R design.


Yeah, I guess the real innovation is manufacturing tolerances have gotten precise enough to produce these types of DACs at scale.


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## Wildcatsare1

PopZeus said:


> Are R-2R DACs becoming more attractive to hifi makers because DAC chips have become more scarce or is this strictly because it provides the best sound quality? It just seems like a trend that all of a sudden started appearing in places where R-2R had not been before.



There are plenty of Sabre chips, it's the sound quality.


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## Stuff Jones

Wildcatsare1 said:


> There are plenty of Sabre chips, it's the sound quality.



The SQ was always a factor -- why now? I bet AKMs issues are rising the prices for other chips including Sabre, which makes R2R R&D more competitive.


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## ClieOS

Stuff Jones said:


> The SQ was always a factor -- why now? I bet AKMs issues are rising the prices for other chips including Sabre, which makes R2R R&D more competitive.



Almost all the recently appeared R2R implementation on portable devices started R&D a few years ago, well before AKM's fire or the global chip shortage happened. While no doubt those are factors pushing a quicker release, I think the true reason is manufacturers are simply trying to differentiate themselves out with something that is hard to copy. The fact is, regardless how many or how high end the ESS or AKM chips you use, other can just copy the basic circuit and out-design you. An R2R on the other hand is definitely not something that can be easily copied. Like the old saying - if it is easy, everyone will be doing it. The opposite is just as true.


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## magicguy

blotmouse said:


> Yeah, maybe a case w/battery like some phone's have.


Great idea !
But the size has to be contained, so that you don't walk around with a wheelbarrow...


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## deafdoorknob

@Andykong please make it play nice with ios devices and their limited power 🙏


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## DanielListening

blotmouse said:


> Only if they get their power use under control. I am actualy here on Head-fi because I was destroying my phone batteries prematurely. Time for a dedicated device, I thought. Happy I did, but 2-3 charge cycles for a new phone in a day using a dongle vs. 1 charge every 3 days when not using is a huge difference.



Just get AppleCare. 

I am really excited for this device.


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## blotmouse

Daniel Lodewyk said:


> Just get AppleCare.
> 
> I am really excited for this device.


 They have excessiveness clauses.
I am excited too, but this is the time to make up a list of unattainable options and complain the new product does not include them, c’mon.


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## Andykong (Nov 5, 2021)

sp33ls said:


> Super interested in this... I'm looking at the HIP DAC v2 as a nice option to for chilling on my outside balcony and listening, and was just yesterday thinking "is there an R2R portable DAC/amp out there..?"
> 
> Curious how it'll do with difficult-to-drive cans.





Ichos said:


> The question to be answered is about power consumption.
> 
> What is the power consumption of this dongle?





blotmouse said:


> Only if they get their power use under control. I am actualy here on Head-fi because I was destroying my phone batteries prematurely. Time for a dedicated device, I thought. Happy I did, but 2-3 charge cycles for a new phone in a day using a dongle vs. 1 charge every 3 days when not using is a huge difference.





deafdoorknob said:


> @Andykong please make it play nice with ios devices and their limited power 🙏



@Ichos has pointed out the most important issue.

Don't expect the USB dongle will be powerful enough to handle difficult-to-drive cans.  Not that we can't do that, our C9 is one of the most powerful "portable" headphone amplifier in the market, and even our earliest C5 was consider the power house in the market.  if there is only a handful of companies can deliver compact portable amplifier, Cayin has proven to be one of them.   The point is, the mobile phone industry has placed an unbreakable limitation to limited the power we can drain from the USB-C port.  Some latest observation suggested that the limitation is as low as 100mA, and the mobile phone company can even lower the limit further with a simple firmware update.







For your information, the Type A USB port in your notebook computer can support 500mA for USB 2.0 and 900mA for USB 3.0 respectively.  When Cayin facilitate OTG storage from the DAP's USB-C port, we set the limit to 300mA, so we can support most card readers or a low-powered SSD (M.2 become feasible), but you cannot mount a standard SSD to the DAP as it will draw more then 300mA current from the USB port.  The DAP probably will recognise the SSD, but as soon as the device start to transfer data, the connection failed.    So 100mA power supply ceiling probably will limit the accessories or storage device that you can use with your mobile phone.

By the way, if I can attached storage to my mobile phone freely, i probably won't need a mobile phone with 512GB or 1TB internal storage, right?

I don't think the mobile industry are trying to stop HiFi USB dongle from connecting to the mobile phone, we are too small to become a concern, we probably are just collateral damage.

@deafdoorknob let me describe a scenario and you can probably figure out the situation.  R-2R DAC is also about precision and it is very sensitive to the accuracy of input bitstream.  If we turn down the "volume" of the mobile phone to certain level, the date integrity will be affected, and will in turn affect the precision of the conversion in R-2R algorithm.

This is most unfortunate.


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## Andykong

justsomesonyfan said:


> that's a fair point, but maybe a self charging dong will come eventually, who knows. hell it could be a dongle with an extra battery feature for all we know, with a toggle to just charge the phone instead of being a dac/amp





blotmouse said:


> Yeah, maybe a case w/battery like some phone's have.
> 
> Whatever happened to that battery material they could spray on the insides of electronics and then they work more like a car and alternator never requiring an actual charge unless they drop too low? Gotta check my MIT feeds, lol.



Wait, are we talking about Chord Mojo? or how to miniature the Mojo?


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## Andykong

Stuff Jones said:


> Awesome. @Andykong - Any plans for Cayin combine R2R + tubes in a DAP or portable DAC+amp and at a reasonably affordable price range (<1k)?



Sorry, can't discuss future product.  

But there is something you should be aware of.  The electronics supply chain is being hammered on all sides – from materials to logistics.  There has been an increase in component prices (including transistors and capacitors) of up to 40% as compared to last quarter (*HERE*), and selected components price even raised 100% since the outbreak.  Logistic side is even worse, freights cancelled, shipping delays,  and logistic cost increased exponentially.  The *container freight index *has increased from $2112 (11 Sept 2020) to $11,109 (12 Sept 2021) , more then 500% increased. We are struggling to continue production without increase the product retail price. 

So unless someone somehow can bring the components and logistic market back to the pre-COVID benchmark, consumer electronics price will increase instead of decrease (or enhanced performance at the same price).


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## Ichos

This is very unfortunate and harmful to the market but in the other hand it maybe beneficial since the manufacturers are going to a few and well designed products instead of releasing new ones and updates before we haven't even finished reviewing the previous!!!


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## blotmouse

Andykong said:


> Wait, are we talking about Chord Mojo? or how to miniature the Mojo?


lol, not exactly. 
https://www.technologyreview.com/2012/07/02/85611/spray-on-batteries-could-reshape-energy-storage/


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## ruffandruff (Oct 16, 2021)

Hopefully comes with a true line out.

EDIT: Earbuds like ve zen require some extra power.


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## flipper203

Will it be also Bluetooth receiver ?


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## ClieOS

flipper203 said:


> Will it be also Bluetooth receiver ?


No?


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## Currawong

Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


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## alota

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


Indeed


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## ActuallySparky

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


See, I'm on the other side of the fence. I find batteries inconvenient and the more different devices I need to manage charge cycles on the more hassle I have to deal with. If a dongle (on a high powered port) can sound as good as the Mojo, I'd rather use it than the Mojo!


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## ClieOS

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.



Why not just goes a little further with a battery pack that the dongle can fit inside to be used as a self-powered device or take out to be used as USB powered dongle. Win win.


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## rocketron

Think the battery is a great idea.
I have been using the Ifi Go Blu that has a battery and it’s a really good device.
Especially since a firmware update and can be used as a usb dac.
The battery drain on a W2 is quite high same goes for the Astell &Kern PEE51.
Desktop top doesn’t mater but on the go a battery to make it more powerful makes sense to me.
All these dongles must be eating into the lower, mid price dap market?

Have the Lotoo S2 inbound so looking forward too trying that.


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## alota

ActuallySparky said:


> See, I'm on the other side of the fence. I find batteries inconvenient and the more different devices I need to manage charge cycles on the more hassle I have to deal with. If a dongle (on a high powered port) can sound as good as the Mojo, I'd rather use it than the Mojo!


Good point too. In every case if this dongle works well it is a revolution in the market. I had three daps and in my opinion for iem dap is too much. A good smartphone with an audiophile dongle is best solution


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## povidlo

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


It would be then probably closer in price to HM1000 which is a larger portable R2R DAC with a battery.


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## musicday

I prefer it without battery. I like a small footprint. Hopefully will do at least 125 mW/200 mW 
Hopefully more specifications will be revealed soon.


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## gr8soundz

ActuallySparky said:


> See, I'm on the other side of the fence. I find batteries inconvenient and the more different devices I need to manage charge cycles on the more hassle I have to deal with.



Same here. Been waiting for another R2R solution w/o batteries. Sometimes use dac1101 with my PS5 and great not having to worry about a battery. Fitting 96 resistors will already make the RU6 bigger and battery would make it even larger.

One detail Andy stated was their decision to compromise for best possible sound. Bluetooth won't help there. Plus there's no shortage of existing options even among growing R2R segment (incl Hifiman's announced Bluemini R2R with battery and bluetooth for $149).

I say keep the RU6 more streamlined. I too hope it has a line-out (mode) and pray the volume control won't get in the way. A bit hard-core but if we already have daily drivers and want a track day car, why weigh it down with performance decreasing parts just because some expect EVERY vehicle (and now EVERY new piece of audio gear) to have the exact same features.


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## justsomesonyfan

@Andykong wondering if the ru6 will be close to the r01 in performance? considering it's a device purely for r2r while the n6ii only had r01 motherboard specifically made for r2r (for example the hiby rs6 is an entire dap that's built around r2r)


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## blotmouse

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


That already exists under the Luxury & Precision brand. LP6 and P6/P6 Pro, I think they are named.


----------



## magicguy

Any idea of the release date ?


----------



## musicday

magicguy said:


> Any idea of the release date ?


Q4. I suppose sometimes in December.


----------



## magicguy

I’m really excited by this R2R dongle, it’s rare.
Wait’n see for the first reviews


----------



## gto88

Hope its driving power >= ifi hip dac, it would be a trade off not to draw too much power from source.


----------



## NewEve

Andykong said:


> Since the cat is out of the bag, and there were discussion of our forthcoming USB DAC/Amp Dongle in multiple threads/forums/groups, we decides to start a new thread ahead of our regular schedule.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This is the most interesting product I’ve seen since I started this hobby…


----------



## Currawong

blotmouse said:


> That already exists under the Luxury & Precision brand. LP6 and P6/P6 Pro, I think they are named.


ROFL, an LP6 is not a battery powered dongle!


----------



## ActuallySparky

Currawong said:


> ROFL, an LP6 is not a battery powered dongle!


Sure it is, so is a Hugo2


----------



## musicday

Can we get any more specifications this month please?


----------



## Andykong

Finally, we have received all the parts and perform a trail production later this week. 

Hopefully we'll identify as many problems as possible during this trail production and smoothen them out before the mass production.  If the amendments are minor, we can measure the trail production units for preliminary specification.


----------



## ClieOS




----------



## feverfive

:rubshandstogether:  Looks like this will be well- vetted by the community in advance of me being ready to purchase (probably not until I buy a new M2 Macbook Pro next year).

I have been off-and-on racking my brain over my anticipated near future use case(s), as welll as attempting to find an avenue away from DAPs specifically, and (non-simpleton-user-replaceable) battery powered audio devices in general.  I think USB bus/host-powered dongle will be my path as much as I continue to struggle a little with the thought.


----------



## TheHighlander (Oct 28, 2021)

Very interesting this little guy


----------



## TomKorn

Andykong said:


> Since the cat is out of the bag, and there were discussion of our forthcoming USB DAC/Amp Dongle in multiple threads/forums/groups, we decides to start a new thread ahead of our regular schedule.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I want 10 now. 😳😉😅


----------



## Xinlisupreme

TomKorn said:


> I want 10 now. 😳😉😅


Only 10?🤣


----------



## TomKorn

Xinlisupreme said:


> Only 10?🤣


Well, I don't wanna look greedy now. 🤣


----------



## inscythe

Damn, that looks so pretty! Would there be more colours on the leather sleeve? That green looks nice too though.


----------



## abitdeef

Actually doesn't look that huge at all. Looks to be close to btr5 size. Not bad for discreet R-2R dac tech. I had a listen to hifi man's R2R2000 red and it blew me away. But the interface and battery and $$ were no no's 

But if I can experience that sound again for a fraction of that price and use my phone as a transport then that's very exciting! Besides I'm using dongle now- W2. I will buy one for sure.


----------



## musicday

abitdeef said:


> Actually doesn't look that huge at all. Looks to be close to btr5 size. Not bad for discreet R-2R dac tech. I had a listen to hifi man's R2R2000 red and it blew me away. But the interface and battery and $$ were no no's
> 
> But if I can experience that sound again for a fraction of that price and use my phone as a transport then that's very exciting! Besides I'm using dongle now- W2. I will buy one for sure.


We all buy one for sure 😉.


----------



## abitdeef (Oct 29, 2021)

musicday said:


> We all buy one for sure 😉.



Hell yes! 😀 I like how cayin thinks. N6ii was a very smart move at the time. N3 pro was also brilliant with the tube+ digital output, and now this 👏 they're always doing something really different than the competition.


----------



## Stuff Jones

Will this have a line out feature? That would be awesome. Pair it with say a Schiit Vali 2+ and you have R2R  portable + tubes desktop for <500.


----------



## Skev (Nov 5, 2021)

This looks very interesting.

I'd like to see Play/Pause/Next Track functionality.

Also, the high precision volume control, is this a digitally controlled stepped attenuator?

Any idea on output impedance and noise floor?


----------



## justsomesonyfan

Stuff Jones said:


> Will this have a line out feature? That would be awesome. Pair it with say a Schiit Vali 2+ and you have R2R  portable + tubes desktop for <500.


that would be far too good..


----------



## DaYooper

Andykong said:


> By the way, if I can attached storage to my mobile phone freely, i probably won't need a mobile phone with 512GB or 1TB internal storage, right?


Unless, and this applies to DAP as well, one only wants to carry ONE device in a t-shirt pocket, hmmm??


----------



## DaYooper

Currawong said:


> Just thinking out loud, but I can't help wondering if it wouldn't be better if it came out as a battery-powered device, even if it was quite a bit larger.


Then it would be a DAP, wouldn't it?


----------



## Currawong

DaYooper said:


> Then it would be a DAP, wouldn't it?


No. It would still need to be connected to another device with music on it.


----------



## fattycheesebeef

Very interested on this and comparing with RS6 (of course the level would be different, but how far..)


----------



## Kristy Song

Great news, looking forward to having them here.


----------



## Hellhammer

fattycheesebeef said:


> Very interested on this and comparing with RS6 (of course the level would be different, but how far..)


This is the comparison I'm looking forward to as well. I currently use a HiBy R3 Pro with a L&P W2 and have compared it to things like Cayin N6II (A02), PAW 6K, A&K KANN Alpha and the difference is very close to splitting hairs in terms of SQ

I owned a Hifiman HM1000 Red and while it did sound better, I had some  QC issues (USB was recognized only half of the time and the battery suddenly died one day after I left it charging overnight)

Therefore, I'm currently only interested in HiBy RS6 and Cayin RU6


----------



## abitdeef

Hellhammer said:


> This is the comparison I'm looking forward to as well. I currently use a HiBy R3 Pro with a L&P W2 and have compared it to things like Cayin N6II (A02), PAW 6K, A&K KANN Alpha and the difference is very close to splitting hairs in terms of SQ
> 
> I owned a Hifiman HM1000 Red and while it did sound better, I had some  QC issues (USB was recognized only half of the time and the battery suddenly died one day after I left it charging overnight)
> 
> Therefore, I'm currently only interested in HiBy RS6 and Cayin RU6



Same here can't wait, I agree about the w2 too. I was unimpressed with the paw 6000 after a while- nice dap but maybe too neutral for me and not worth the price tag imo.  And the kann is awesome but heavy and bulky and wifi is worse than sr25? 

Still like all in one solution but it's nice to use a powerful android phone as your transport for something like W2 and hopefully shortly RU6.


----------



## deafdoorknob

@Andykong, so no ios support confirmed? (asking as I could move on and not wait lol) thanks!


----------



## Andykong

deafdoorknob said:


> @Andykong, so no ios support confirmed? (asking as I could move on and not wait lol) thanks!


Our R&D has tested RU6 with Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter, it works fine with several iPhone, however we cannot guarantee that Apple won't change their systems down the road, I doubt if any vendor can guarantee that unless we go through the Apple MFI certification.


----------



## TomKorn

Andykong said:


> Our R&D has tested RU6 with Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter, it works fine with several iPhone, however we cannot guarantee that Apple won't change their systems down the road, I doubt if any vendor can guarantee that unless we go through the Apple MFI certification.


Maybe Apple should do the only things that makes sense and use USB-C finally. I mean they do have only USB-C on their laptops...


----------



## fattycheesebeef

I hope this comes out by end Nov, early Dec!


----------



## Billyak

I think I seen from Cayin on Twitter that this has been delayed until December at least.


----------



## hemtmaker (Nov 9, 2021)

Andykong said:


> Our R&D has tested RU6 with Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter, it works fine with several iPhone, however we cannot guarantee that Apple won't change their systems down the road, I doubt if any vendor can guarantee that unless we go through the Apple MFI certification.


Would it work on iPad with usb c port directly without the camera kit?


----------



## armstrj2

hemtmaker said:


> Would it work on iPad with usb c port directly without the camera kit?


My experience is that USB dongle DACs work perfectly with iPads via USB C. 

On the other hand, using the camera connection kit with iPhone introduces a lot of noise and interference for me. Not something I like using at all.


----------



## hemtmaker

armstrj2 said:


> My experience is that USB dongle DACs work perfectly with iPads via USB C.
> 
> On the other hand, using the camera connection kit with iPhone introduces a lot of noise and interference for me. Not something I like using at all.


I see. Thanks for sharing your experience


----------



## Andykong

hemtmaker said:


> Would it work on iPad with usb c port directly without the camera kit?



I thought the iPad Pro has USB-C but the iPad is still lightning?  I am an Android man so I am very ignorant about Apple products, but I have used iPad Pro as digital transport in audio shows and their USB Audio output is among the best in tablet products, so I am quite sure RU6 won't have any problem with that.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

tawmizzzz said:


> Quite possible-you can even argue the W2 already knocks out most $1-1.5k DAPs from a pure sound quality aspect. It's really just the use case of battery burn/not having a separate LO'd music player that can be an inconvenience to most.


I don't think it knocks out $1-1.5k DAPs.  More like less than $1k.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

justsomesonyfan said:


> give it 2 - 3 years and dongles will run the portable game.


I used to think that, but now I don't.   I much prefer the DAP user experience vs. dongle.    I own S1, S2 and W2.   My favorite at the moment is S2 and I use it for very long walks (> 2 hours) when weight really matters.    Otherwise, I prefer my DX300 for sound quality, battery life and usability.


----------



## abitdeef (Nov 9, 2021)

Yes it's all subjective in the end. I mean what I consider great sound could undoubtedly be considered mediocre by some. 

Honestly other than power output and impedance matching I don't notice much difference between daps or dongles. Especially when using easy to drive stuff. 

Now something like cayin n8 or n3 pro with tubes or calyx m or Sony z1 or R2R2000 I do notice because of the more organic warm tuned signatures. 

I now buy alot more toward user experience and aesthetics then pure sound because even r3p or m3x sounds really good to my ears. Of course I do notice extra power and headroom of other bigger more $$$ daps but not that much with my iems. 

This though should have a very nice and rich sound sig from the ladder architecture. 

I like smaller and more compact daps myself, so that limits quite a lot of units to me. I also like daps more than dongles but I think RU6 will have a unique sig and I will think of it as a r2r mini dac/amp. All that really matters in the end is that you personally like the gear you have.

No other opinions really matter.

I do think dongles will eventually take over or audio grade smartphones just because everyone has a smartphone. And just because I think it's cool to have a stand alone dap I realize I'm in the minority.


----------



## Stuff Jones

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> I don't think it knocks out $1-1.5k DAPs.  More like less than $1k.



It doesn't knock off the $699 Dethonray Honey. I find the W2 gives a false sense of detail by elevating the upper mids and treble but the quality of the timbre is quite digital. It kind of has that sabre glare thing going on, like the Geek Out series.

Hopefully the R2R of the RU6 will avoid this issue and give us a more natural timbre.


----------



## justsomesonyfan

Stuff Jones said:


> It doesn't knock off the $699 Dethonray Honey. I find the W2 gives a false sense of detail by elevating the upper mids and treble but the quality of the timbre is quite digital. It kind of has that sabre glare thing going on, like the Geek Out series.
> 
> Hopefully the R2R of the RU6 will avoid this issue and give us a more natural timbre.


have you tried uapp?


----------



## Stuff Jones

justsomesonyfan said:


> have you tried uapp?



No I was using foobar and WASAPI w/ my laptop.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

Stuff Jones said:


> It doesn't knock off the $699 Dethonray Honey. I find the W2 gives a false sense of detail by elevating the upper mids and treble but the quality of the timbre is quite digital. It kind of has that sabre glare thing going on, like the Geek Out series.
> 
> Hopefully the R2R of the RU6 will avoid this issue and give us a more natural timbre.


The S2 is better than the W2 in this regard.   I haven't heard the Dethonray Honey, but that's not a DAP either.


----------



## armstrj2

Andykong said:


> I thought the iPad Pro has USB-C but the iPad is still lightning?  I am an Android man so I am very ignorant about Apple products, but I have used iPad Pro as digital transport in audio shows and their USB Audio output is among the best in tablet products, so I am quite sure RU6 won't have any problem with that.


iPad Pro models and the new Mini are USB C.


----------



## hemtmaker

Andykong said:


> I thought the iPad Pro has USB-C but the iPad is still lightning?  I am an Android man so I am very ignorant about Apple products, but I have used iPad Pro as digital transport in audio shows and their USB Audio output is among the best in tablet products, so I am quite sure RU6 won't have any problem with that.


Thanks, I am using the new iPad mini which does have a usb c port now


----------



## docked seaman

Stuff Jones said:


> It doesn't knock off the $699 Dethonray Honey. I find the W2 gives a false sense of detail by elevating the upper mids and treble but the quality of the timbre is quite digital. It kind of has that sabre glare thing going on, like the Geek Out series.
> 
> Hopefully the R2R of the RU6 will avoid this issue and give us a more natural timbre.


What version firmware are you using on the w2?   The sound changed pretty drastically on a recent update. Lost the upper mids boost. Sound much better to me now.


----------



## Stuff Jones

docked seaman said:


> What version firmware are you using on the w2?   The sound changed pretty drastically on a recent update. Lost the upper mids boost. Sound much better to me now.



I sold it months ago. Glad they may  have fixed it.


----------



## abitdeef

I've got no problems with W2 treble at all. It's well defined with the proper harmonics and timbre. I haven't noticed a treble glare since dx90 or the old fiio x7. Been using new firmware. 

My only small complaint would be it doesn't quite have the depth or holographic sound of a nice dap. Sorry to veer off topic but we can't really talk about RU6 yet because none of us has it 😀 😞 But with cayin's latest releases like n3 pro and all around great daps like n6ii and n8 I can't imagine anything other than a killer dongle. 

My dream dap would be a smaller and lighter n6ii with tube capabilities- besides being able to use modules. Probably impossible to make and I know the n6ii isn't really big but just a bit more svelte and light would be killer. Android 10 or up, 6 gb of ram and BT 5.1 and oled screen if we're going to dream 😀


----------



## monsieurfromag3

abitdeef said:


> I've got no problems with W2 treble at all. It's well defined with the proper harmonics and timbre. I haven't noticed a treble glare since dx90 or the old fiio x7. Been using new firmware.
> 
> My only small complaint would be it doesn't quite have the depth or holographic sound of a nice dap. Sorry to veer off topic but we can't really talk about RU6 yet because none of us has it 😀 😞 But with cayin's latest releases like n3 pro and all around great daps like n6ii and n8 I can't imagine anything other than a killer dongle.
> 
> My dream dap would be a smaller and lighter n6ii with tube capabilities- besides being able to use modules. Probably impossible to make and I know the n6ii isn't really big but just a bit more svelte and light would be killer. Android 10 or up, 6 gb of ram and BT 5.1 and oled screen if we're going to dream 😀


My dream DAP too!


----------



## Ufanco

abitdeef said:


> I've got no problems with W2 treble at all. It's well defined with the proper harmonics and timbre. I haven't noticed a treble glare since dx90 or the old fiio x7. Been using new firmware.
> 
> My only small complaint would be it doesn't quite have the depth or holographic sound of a nice dap. Sorry to veer off topic but we can't really talk about RU6 yet because none of us has it 😀 😞 But with cayin's latest releases like n3 pro and all around great daps like n6ii and n8 I can't imagine anything other than a killer dongle.
> 
> My dream dap would be a smaller and lighter n6ii with tube capabilities- besides being able to use modules. Probably impossible to make and I know the n6ii isn't really big but just a bit more svelte and light would be killer. Android 10 or up, 6 gb of ram and BT 5.1 and oled screen if we're going to dream 😀


That be a killer dap maybe cross a woo audio with a ? then shrink it.


----------



## abitdeef

Yep and maybe use Korg newtube to save some space. Would be cool to use new battery tech also because a beefy conventional battery like a lion poly takes up quite a bit of space.


----------



## felix3650

Having had Holo Audio's Cyan R2R I'm quite interested in this. Should be fun comparing it to the W2.

@Andykong
Will it have the same LDO, 24.576MHz local clock and resistor array as the N01? From the PCB pic you posted I can spot the DAB chip. The ladder network along with the other components like S2P register and OS filter will be in a different PCB 
Line Out might be a challenge in such restricted space and due to the noise characteristics of a R2R topology.


----------



## Pcppps

I dont understand why all these dongles do not allow customized eq


----------



## Andykong

Glad to know there is a choice.


----------



## ClieOS (Nov 16, 2021)

Pcppps said:


> I dont understand why all these dongles do not allow customized eq



You can do EQ two ways, digital or analog. A customizable analog EQ required a lot of circuit, so that's impossible to do. That means it must be processed in the digital domain, just before the D-to-A stage. To do it digitally on a USB dongle will need some kind of processing power, either in the form of a custom processor (i.e. XMOS or FPGA) or some kind of DSP chip. Either ways will take up a lot of space and power, not to mention incurring significant cost.  So it is not a matter of 'we can't do it', but more like 'we don't think it is worth it' - especially since you can do digital EQ on the smartphone much easier since smartphone has plenty of processing power and a lot of EQ app to do the exact same thing much cheaper than to implement processor or DSP on the dongle itself.


----------



## abitdeef

Most high end dongles (w2, s1, ru6) are capable of it but you almost need a companion app to be able to set the custom eq values easily. Like Quedilix has.


----------



## Andykong (Nov 16, 2021)

Pcppps said:


> I dont understand why all these dongles do not allow customized eq



How do you want to control your EQ setting on the tiny screen? touch screen? limited buttons? 

I won't say all, but most DAC/Amp only support basic control and operation. If they provide digital EQ feature, they'll need to upgrade the MCU to a more powerful one, that will increase cost, circuit complexity and power drain.  Given all USB DAC dongle are struggling with limited power supply (around 100mA as mentioned by other users), your mobile phone is probably a better place to control EQ, full screen control and more processing power at your finger tip.


----------



## ClieOS

abitdeef said:


> Most high end dongles (w2, s1, ru6) are capable of it but you almost need a companion app to be able to set the custom eq values easily. Like Quedilix has.


Qudelix probably uses the DSP built inside the Qualcomm SoC itself. Besides, The QCC51xx chip on its own has decent processing power.


----------



## Andykong

felix3650 said:


> Having had Holo Audio's Cyan R2R I'm quite interested in this. Should be fun comparing it to the W2.
> 
> @Andykong
> Will it have the same LDO, 24.576MHz local clock and resistor array as the N01? From the PCB pic you posted I can spot the DAB chip. The ladder network along with the other components like S2P register and OS filter will be in a different PCB
> Line Out might be a challenge in such restricted space and due to the noise characteristics of a R2R topology.


 N01?  I assume you means R01?

You have good eyes, the RU6 has two fully-packed 6-layers PCB.  It incurs the R2R circuitry design from R01, but we can't afford to use the same 1/10,000 high precision low TCR thin film resistors, the 96 pieces resistors alone will blow our complete BOM budget already.  

I just received my RU6 and start to prepare the documentation and translating engineering notes to English, I need about a week to get everything ready.


----------



## abitdeef

ClieOS said:


> Qudelix probably uses the DSP built inside the Qualcomm SoC itself. Besides, The QCC51xx chip on its own has decent processing power.



Yes, and w2 has fpga and s1 has black fin dsp processor. But no way to really interact comfortably with tiny screen. Then you need separate software and as you said with limited power it would be more of a drain. 

Better to use eq on apps like neutron and such. Even hiby music has decent custom eq. In my experience most of these dongles sound better with 'normal' (no eq) selected anyways.


----------



## alota

@Andykong when is available in the market? thank you


----------



## Andykong

alota said:


> @Andykong when is available in the market? thank you


If I can finish my translation efficietly, we should be able to have everything for a formal announcement within a week.


----------



## Stuff Jones

@Andykong - Will there be any line out function?


----------



## Andykong (Nov 16, 2021)

Stuff Jones said:


> @Andykong - Will there be any line out function?



Nope, there won't be, unfortunately.


----------



## felix3650

Andykong said:


> N01?  I assume you means R01?
> 
> You have good eyes, the RU6 has two fully-packed 6-layers PCB.  It incurs the R2R circuitry design from R01, but we can't afford to use the same 1/10,000 high precision low TCR thin film resistors, the 96 pieces resistors alone will blow our complete BOM budget already.
> 
> I just received my RU6 and start to prepare the documentation and translating engineering notes to English, I need about a week to get everything ready.


Yes, typo. I meant the R01.
Hopefully the new resistors have a low tcr too and the unit doesn't get hot enough to be a challenge 



Stuff Jones said:


> @Andykong - Will there be any line out function?


Read my comment above.


----------



## blotmouse

OK, no more questions. Let Andy finish his documentation and let's get this puppy to market.


----------



## abitdeef

blotmouse said:


> OK, no more questions. Let Andy finish his documentation and let's get this puppy to market.



Lol hear hear!


----------



## musicday

Beautiful cases.


----------



## abitdeef

I don't normally like orange, but I like it better than the blue.


----------



## emilsoft

After using a quidelix and rme adi I find it difficult to go to a non eq ability DAC. The subtle corrections I apply to almost all my headphone is a blessing - removing a peak here and there, increase sub bass on hd650 etc. I can't easily achieve this in software - on Mac I use Apple music, on phone I use YouTube music and Apple music and no accurate eq for both.. then at work I connect to my other machine which also doesn't have eq.

It's such a massive benefit - and makes my RME sound much better than my Qutest as I can get a proper frequency response on all my headphones...

The reason I believe many manufacturers don't do proper eq on their devices is because it's too much effort sadly. one reason why quidelix is popular.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> After using a quidelix and rme adi I find it difficult to go to a non eq ability DAC. The subtle corrections I apply to almost all my headphone is a blessing - removing a peak here and there, increase sub bass on hd650 etc. I can't easily achieve this in software - on Mac I use Apple music, on phone I use YouTube music and Apple music and no accurate eq for both.. then at work I connect to my other machine which also doesn't have eq.
> 
> It's such a massive benefit - and makes my RME sound much better than my Qutest as I can get a proper frequency response on all my headphones...
> 
> The reason I believe many manufacturers don't do proper eq on their devices is because it's too much effort sadly. one reason why quidelix is popular.



We didn't discredit EQ, we simply explained that USB dongle is NOT the right place to implement EQ in your music chain.  Try to think of this from a system approach rather then equipment base.  

Is quidelix very popular? Must be my fault to leave it out of my radar?


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> We didn't discredit EQ, we simply explained that USB dongle is NOT the right place to implement EQ in your music chain.  Try to think of this from a system approach rather then equipment base.
> 
> Is quidelix very popular? Must be my fault to leave it out of my radar?



I have to politely disagree on this one. A dac-headphone unit is the right place to put a dsp eq. As I explained, depending on software eq is a major hassle, and isn't always an option especially when using any of the popular streaming services.

I see there is a screen and buttons on the device - the RME ADI only utilises 2 buttons to edit the eq settings - a simple ui is all that's needed: to edit gain, frequency and Q value - even just a 3 band parametric EQ will bring massive value.

Ya Qudelix is massive - just see their 500+ reviews on Amazon, and after using it for some time I can see why - their app is great and stable with 10 para EQ and tonne of other features, sound quality is very good too and price is great. Not saying it sounds better than an r2r, but for the price it's giveth a lot


----------



## Zachik

@Andykong - any chance line-out functionality can be added via FW update in the future?
Also, any update on the price?


----------



## LoryWiv

This is exciting! Wondering if it will be DSD capable as most R2R DAC's are not, at least not natively. Also hopeful it will have better power output balanced than most dongles. I'd love to try it with full-sized headphones (EG - Focal Clear MG, not too hard to drive) in addition to IEM's.


----------



## ClieOS

LoryWiv said:


> This is exciting!* Wondering if it will be DSD capable as most R2R DAC's are not, at least not natively*. Also hopeful it will have better power output balanced than most dongles. I'd love to try it with full-sized headphones (EG - Focal Clear MG, not too hard to drive) in addition to IEM's.


That's because R2R is for PCM (Pulse-Code Modulation) only while DSD is for SDM (Sigma-Delta Modulation) only. Therefore there is no such a thing as a 'native R2R DSD capable' DAC.


----------



## deafdoorknob

if it doesnt fly, power my city, incorporate a 20 band eq, double as a phono preamp, and costs 39.99 i’m not… 

good on you for sticking to your guns, cayin aint fiio 😏


----------



## Zachik

deafdoorknob said:


> if it doesnt fly, power my city, incorporate a 20 band eq, double as a phono preamp, and costs 39.99 i’m not…


It CAN fly (across the room until it hits the wall), CAN power a VERY small city, incorporate ANY eq you want and double as anything you wish, but unfortunately $39.99 not gonna tick you box. Sorry...


----------



## abitdeef

Ha ha 😂  who here hasn't chucked electronics across the room in frustration. Especially controllers and gamesticks.


----------



## felix3650

abitdeef said:


> Ha ha 😂  who here hasn't chucked electronics across the room in frustration. Especially controllers and gamesticks.


50-70$ vs 200$+ 😅
I'm not sure of something like this happening.. at least not voluntarily lol. And hopefully the leather case is on the unit 😝


----------



## abitdeef

felix3650 said:


> 50-70$ vs 200$+ 😅
> I'm not sure of something like this happening.. at least not voluntarily lol. And hopefully the leather case is on the unit 😝



Yes chucking daps can be $$$ and dangerous. But I did throw an old iaudo (cowon) player across the room one time. It was tiny and suffered only minor cosmetic damage 💔


----------



## Andykong

LoryWiv said:


> This is exciting! Wondering if it will be DSD capable as most R2R DAC's are not, at least not natively. Also hopeful it will have better power output balanced than most dongles. I'd love to try it with full-sized headphones (EG - Focal Clear MG, not too hard to drive) in addition to IEM's.



The  R-2R technologies of RU6 is based on the *R01 Audio Motherboard* of N6ii DAP.  The decoding circuit of R01  is strictly PCM only, DSD bitstream will convert to PCM in the Audio Bridge, and the oversampled to 24Bit/768kHz before feeding to R2R resistor network.  (For more detail, please refer to R01 functional diagram).   In short, DSD is supported through transcoding.


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> Ha ha 😂  who here hasn't chucked electronics across the room in frustration. Especially controllers and gamesticks.


Well, anyone tried 14" CRT monitor?   For the record, when I studied computer science in university, I learned FORTAN and COBAL.


----------



## Zachik

Andykong said:


> Well, anyone tried 14" CRT monitor?   For the record, when I studied computer science in university, I learned FORTAN and COBAL.


You mean FORT*R*AN and COB*O*L...  
(another CS major here...)


----------



## MarkParity

There are 10 types of people, those that like dongle DAC's and those that don't.


----------



## alota

dongle is one of the best news in this tired and pumped market


----------



## Stuff Jones (Nov 17, 2021)

Zachik said:


> @Andykong - any chance line-out functionality can be added via FW update in the future?
> Also, any update on the price?



Not to annoy Andy, but I really think the LO feature would be a huge differentiator with the R2R. I think modularity is the future for portable audio. Having a tiny good quality DAC with an IEM acceptable amp that you can add a desktop amp to to scale up would be huge.


----------



## MusicTeck

We're now taking pre-orders for the RU6! 
https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...r-usb-c-dac-amp-dongle?variant=39638791618622

Grab a leather case here:
https://shop.musicteck.com/collections/cayin/products/cayin-ru6-case?variant=39638770843710

And why not a compatible lightning cable as well:
https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...ightning-cable-for-ru6?variant=39638772056126


----------



## discord

MusicTeck said:


> We're now taking pre-orders for the RU6!
> https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...r-usb-c-dac-amp-dongle?variant=39638791618622
> 
> Grab a leather case here:
> ...



What are the specs such as output power for both single ended, balanced, etc? @Andykong


----------



## blotmouse

Pre-ordered. fin


----------



## rocketron

Specs please?


----------



## hemtmaker

MusicTeck said:


> We're now taking pre-orders for the RU6!
> https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...r-usb-c-dac-amp-dongle?variant=39638791618622
> 
> Grab a leather case here:
> ...


Lightning cable? I thought RU6 is not MFI certified and MacBooks don’t have lightning ports???


----------



## jwbrent

hemtmaker said:


> Thanks, I am using the new iPad mini which does have a usb c port now



How do you find the “jelly roll” when the mini 6 screen is vertical? I have a mini 5 and was going to buy a 6, but this screen distortion I’ve read about is bothersome. 😒


----------



## jwbrent

Pcppps said:


> I dont understand why all these dongles do not allow customized eq



power draw, I would surmise. I agree, even a 5-band eq would be more helpful than the presets.


----------



## hemtmaker

jwbrent said:


> How do you find the “jelly roll” when the mini 6 screen is vertical? I have a mini 5 and was going to buy a 6, but this screen distortion I’ve read about is bothersome. 😒


Doesn’t bother me at all, especially when I realised my iPhone 12 Pro does the same thing. The biggest win for me is the form factor and weight, I find myself using it a lot to take notes


----------



## jwbrent

hemtmaker said:


> Doesn’t bother me at all, especially when I realised my iPhone 12 Pro does the same thing. The biggest win for me is the form factor and weight, I find myself using it a lot to take notes



Yes, the mini size is perfect for me for multiple tasks. My mini 5 is going to need a battery soon, so I’ll probably trade it in towards a 6.


----------



## musicday

I wonder if it can be connected to game consoles etc like the S1/S2.


----------



## discord (Nov 17, 2021)

Andykong said:


> Our R&D has tested RU6 with Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter, it works fine with several iPhone, however we cannot guarantee that Apple won't change their systems down the road, I doubt if any vendor can guarantee that unless we go through the Apple MFI certification.



Do I need use the lighting to USB camera adapter? I thought I could just use the usb c to lightning cable to hook up with my iPhone?

https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...ightning-cable-for-ru6?variant=39638772056126


----------



## LoryWiv

Andykong said:


> The  R-2R technologies of RU6 is based on the *R01 Audio Motherboard* of N6ii DAP.  The decoding circuit of R01  is strictly PCM only, DSD bitstream will convert to PCM in the Audio Bridge, and the oversampled to 24Bit/768kHz before feeding to R2R resistor network.  (For more detail, please refer to R01 functional diagram).   In short, DSD is supported through transcoding.


Thank you, @Andykong! Does the RU6 balanced also output 430mW @ 32Ω like R01?


----------



## ssriram2791

LoryWiv said:


> Thank you, @Andykong! Does the RU6 balanced also output 430mW @ 32Ω like R01?


If RU6 outputs 430 mW in balanced mode, then the price of the dongle would end up around $619 (equal to price of N6ii R01).. No company would create a product to sabotage sales of their high end product.. In addition to this, I think Andy has mentioned about power consumption factors in designing dongles (specifically with iOS devices).. therefore we would be lucky if we see more than 200 mW @ 32 ohms balanced.. this is just a guess..


----------



## LudoLVG

I Wonder when the ru6 will be available in EU or french shop.
Or  musiteck will have them first so i should ordre it now ?

Does the ru6 have physical buttons ?


----------



## abitdeef

LudoLVG said:


> I Wonder when the ru6 will be available in EU or french shop.
> Or  musiteck will have them first so i should ordre it now ?
> 
> Does the ru6 have physical buttons ?



Yep it has buttons, don't know if musicteck ships overseas.


----------



## LoryWiv

ssriram2791 said:


> If RU6 outputs 430 mW in balanced mode, then the price of the dongle would end up around $619 (equal to price of N6ii R01).. No company would create a product to sabotage sales of their high end product.. In addition to this, I think Andy has mentioned about power consumption factors in designing dongles (specifically with iOS devices).. therefore we would be lucky if we see more than 200 mW @ 32 ohms balanced.. this is just a guess..


Strong probability you are correct, but a man can dream,


----------



## musicday

LudoLVG said:


> I Wonder when the ru6 will be available in EU or french shop.
> Or  musiteck will have them first so i should ordre it now ?
> 
> Does the ru6 have physical buttons ?


Yes they do and actually very fast, just 1 day to UK.👍


----------



## abitdeef

musicday said:


> Yes they do and actually very fast, just 1 day to UK.👍



What? One day from NJ? They must have a warehouse there then, unless the shipping is crazy $$$. I can't send anything to the UK for less than 25 dollars and that's first class pkg which could take 2 weeks.


----------



## musicday

abitdeef said:


> What? One day from NJ? They must have a warehouse there then, unless the shipping is crazy $$$. I can't send anything to the UK for less than 25 dollars and that's first class pkg which could take 2 weeks.


Yes, it was actually that fast to reach UK, but you will get it next day, with the customs clearance getting a bit longer, still amazing fast .


----------



## abitdeef

musicday said:


> Yes, it was actually that fast to reach UK, but you will get it next day, with the customs clearance getting a bit longer, still amazing fast .



From NJ? What shipping service was it? Just curious. I think DHL is about 40 dollars to UK if I remember correctly.


----------



## musicday

abitdeef said:


> From NJ? What shipping service was it? Just curious. I think DHL is about 40 dollars to UK if I remember correctly.


FedEx express 50 USD.


----------



## abitdeef

musicday said:


> FedEx express 50 USD.


Lol oh ok well that's pretty standard. I thought it was free shipping. Lots of times you'll get free DHL which isn't too bad.


----------



## gto88

Pre-order is on without specs?


----------



## ssriram2791

gto88 said:


> Pre-order is on without specs?


I think the specs are going to be out next week (Andy is working on getting the product user manual/documentation finished, from what I read earlier in this thread).

Andy has been very open in this thread about the challenges in terms of getting high output power using dongle (set expectations accordingly) and potential power consumption issues based on smartphone USB architecture.

This is first of kind for R-2R architecture based dongle and hence it is automatically inviting lot of pre-orders given the recent surge of interest in the forum around portable R2R systems. My 2 cents.


----------



## richoval

https://audioessence.ch/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle

fyi for the swiss 😎


----------



## twister6

I just shared more info about RU6 in Musicteck pre-order thread: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/pre-order-the-new-cayin-ru6-today.960684/page-2#post-16666085 , I borrowed a unit from them for a few days.  Sounds damn good, that's why I'm calling it mini R01 

Not gonna repeat everything, but will post pictures in this thread as well.  Just one thing to note, in Settings you have Gain H/L and Sampling (NOS and OS), along with Backlight time out or option to keep the screen on.


----------



## fattycheesebeef

Am interested in W2 but since this has appeared, I'm interested to know the comparisons between them!


----------



## CrocodileDundee

twister6 said:


> I just shared more info about RU6 in Musicteck pre-order thread: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/pre-order-the-new-cayin-ru6-today.960684/page-2#post-16666085 , I borrowed a unit from them for a few days.  Sounds damn good, that's why I'm calling it mini R01
> 
> Not gonna repeat everything, but will post pictures in this thread as well.  Just one thing to note, in Settings you have Gain H/L and Sampling (NOS and OS), along with Backlight time out or option to keep the screen on.


that size comparison picture is gold. thanks mate.


----------



## LudoLVG

Already out of stock on musiteck....


----------



## emilsoft

I'd love to know more about initial sound impressions.

I didn't have great experience with a Cayin N3 Pro dap - I though the sound quality was sub par for a mid tier dap (kinda etched and dirty sounding with an underwhelming dac implementation, even with the tube stage) - both the Fiio M11 Pro and Sony ZX507 sounded more mature and higher fidelity overall.

I'm going to give it another chance with this R2R dongle as I'm just too curious - I'm hopeful there's been good care and attention put in the clocking, power filtering and other indirectly related dac elements that elevate the sound quality.


----------



## ClieOS

@Andykong Any chance you would know when the pre-order will begin in China / Taobao?


----------



## soundblast75

As link is down and I can't see, how much is it?
Asking as i ordered Colorfly CDA M1 Instead for around £70


----------



## emilsoft

about 250 usd


----------



## soundblast75

emilsoft said:


> about 250 usd


Thanks, its a lot..


----------



## NYanakiev

Will this work with USB-C MacBooks? My new L&P W2 won't play ball with the laptop no matter if directly connected or through Apple's USB-C Digital AV Multiport adapter
​


----------



## NewEve

richoval said:


> https://audioessence.ch/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle
> 
> fyi for the swiss 😎



Nice, thank you so much! Ordered


----------



## richoval

NewEve said:


> Nice, thank you so much! Ordered


😎


----------



## NewEve

richoval said:


> 😎





NewEve said:


> Nice, thank you so much! Ordered



'Will compare it to L&P's W1.


----------



## twister6

NYanakiev said:


> Will this work with USB-C MacBooks? My new L&P W2 won't play ball with the laptop no matter if directly connected or through Apple's USB-C Digital AV Multiport adapter
> ​



Don't have MacBook, but does it have a regular usb-A port? I assume that should work with your W2, usb-c to usb-c, and usb-A adapter. There are no issues with usb-c ports of smartphones, but I'm not familiar with usb-c port of MacBook. In general, RU6 should have the same connection compatibility as S1/S2 and W1/W2.


----------



## abitdeef

soundblast75 said:


> As link is down and I can't see, how much is it?
> Asking as i ordered Colorfly CDA M1 Instead for around £70



Wow dongles everywhere. Colorfly U8 sounded amazing. Had a beautiful analog type sound. Only got rid of it because of bugs. Might have to check this one out too 😀


----------



## NewEve

NYanakiev said:


> Will this work with USB-C MacBooks? My new L&P W2 won't play ball with the laptop no matter if directly connected or through Apple's USB-C Digital AV Multiport adapter
> ​


You might want to find a PC and upgrade the firmware.


----------



## NYanakiev

NewEve said:


> You might want to find a PC and upgrade the firmware.


Up to date already.


----------



## alota

@Andykong  please exists european online seller? I tried to find one without success


----------



## bnupy

So the musicteck link is having a 404 right now


----------



## musicday

Looks like this dongle will be very popular without other reviews. Happy to have so many choices.


----------



## feverfive

NYanakiev said:


> Will this work with USB-C MacBooks? My new L&P W2 won't play ball with the laptop no matter if directly connected or through Apple's USB-C Digital AV Multiport adapter
> ​


Well this is disappointing to read.  I have a W2, and am awaiting (impatiently, LOL) for my new 16" 2021 Macbook Pro to ship.  It never occurred to me it wouldn't work with the new Apple Silicon machines.  Now I'll be watching this thread for compatibility reports even  more.


----------



## NewEve

feverfive said:


> Well this is disappointing to read.  I have a W2, and am awaiting (impatiently, LOL) for my new 16" 2021 Macbook Pro to ship.  It never occurred to me it wouldn't work with the new Apple Silicon machines.  Now I'll be watching this thread for compatibility reports even  more.


My W1 works well with my M1 MacBook Air 🤷🏼‍♂️


----------



## richoval

my w2 works well with my macbook pro 2018…


----------



## NYanakiev

feverfive said:


> Well this is disappointing to read.  I have a W2, and am awaiting (impatiently, LOL) for my new 16" 2021 Macbook Pro to ship.  It never occurred to me it wouldn't work with the new Apple Silicon machines.  Now I'll be watching this thread for compatibility reports even  more.


I might be doing something wrong, even though I cannot even think of what that might be.


----------



## richoval

NYanakiev said:


> I might be doing something wrong, even though I cannot even think of what that might be.



i just need to switch my audio output to the w2 in the audio settings… so does your laptop mot recognize the w2 when you plug it in?


----------



## NYanakiev

It does work but only in Windows- be it via the USB-c to USB-a adapter or directly into USB-c. 
Not on the M1 Pro Macbook, however.


----------



## blotmouse

You guys are all likely talking different things. M1 chip or Intel vs. different macOS versions vs. USB-C Thunderbolt vs. USB-A vs. ad nauseam.
I have no issues with USB-C dongles on an Intel Mac running 10.14.6. I do have power draw issue with lightning to USB-c adapters on certain iPhones running certain iOS versions, but not all.
What versions of things are you all even running? It matters. Apple changes things.


----------



## rocketron

Is this the Cayin ru6 thread????


----------



## jmwant

justsomesonyfan said:


> give it 2 - 3 years and dongles will run the portable game.


I think dongles are already replacing daps.


----------



## Mr Trev

If only it was self powered and confirmed to be compatible with Sony A series walkmans, I'd be all over this.

@Andykong 
Any chance your R2R tech will find its way into devices that'd compete with the ZenDAC and HipDAC?


----------



## justsomesonyfan

Mr Trev said:


> If only it was self powered and confirmed to be compatible with Sony A series walkmans, I'd be all over this.
> 
> @Andykong
> Any chance your R2R tech will find its way into devices that'd compete with the ZenDAC and HipDAC?


why would you pair a dongle with a walkman tho


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

jmwant said:


> I think dongles are already replacing daps.


I think dongles expand the market rather than simply steal market share from the DAP market.   I own both and use them for different purposes.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Any reason why this was withdrawn from the MusicTeck site?


----------



## Mr Trev

justsomesonyfan said:


> why would you pair a dongle with a walkman tho


Sony (esp. the A17 I have) are pretty weak on the amp side. I would like to get something to use as a dac/amp (like the hipdac), but yah, a dongle as they stand would be useless


----------



## QwertyType

Mr Trev said:


> If only it was self powered and confirmed to be compatible with Sony A series walkmans, I'd be all over this.
> 
> @Andykong
> Any chance your R2R tech will find its way into devices that'd compete with the ZenDAC and HipDAC?


Cant we use fiio l27-tc (wmport to usbc) 
For a17 to these dongles (S2, w2, ru6)?


----------



## someyoungguy

jmwant said:


> I think dongles are already replacing daps.


Yeah, dongles are ruining me I tell ya, ruining me! I love DAPs, and in many ways prefer to use a separate device other than my phone. Hell I even love their little quirks.

But I've recently got a Violectric Chronos, A&K PEE51 and Questyle M12. Yeah I don't know how I ended up with 3 but when they're all so cheap (compared to DAPs) and each offers their own sound signature, you kind of end up shopping around to find one that suits. They're all pretty great in their own right, but the Chronos especially has ruined me, I struggle to feel the same about my DAPs anymore   . There's so much value for money in these little things.

I previously had the N6ii/R01 so am interested to hear the RU6. The R01 was one of the most interesting finds I've laid ears on for a few years. In many ways one of the best sounding DAPs I've heard; but, it was like it was so effortless in it's presentation it felt kind of relaxed or unhurried in its signature, and that just didn't jibe well with trying to crank out some Rivers of Nihil or Orders ov Riven Cathedrals  I wonder how much the RU6 will differ, since it uses different resistors.


----------



## Mr Trev (Nov 18, 2021)

QwertyType said:


> Cant we use fiio l27-tc (wmport to usbc)
> For a17 to these dongles (S2, w2, ru6)?


The Sonys won't be able to supply power to the dongle. We'd need something battery powered - like the Fiio Q3


----------



## cristian4

Hi all!)
Maybe anyone know will RU6 support mqa?


----------



## gto88

Guess no MQA support, it didn’t say in the 1st post.


----------



## cristian4

gto88 said:


> Guess no MQA support, it didn’t say in the 1st post.


yes, but I hope maybe they don't provide all information. I'm asking because other Cayin products support mqa(n6,n8, n3pro)


----------



## utdeep (Nov 19, 2021)

feverfive said:


> Well this is disappointing to read.  I have a W2, and am awaiting (impatiently, LOL) for my new 16" 2021 Macbook Pro to ship.  It never occurred to me it wouldn't work with the new Apple Silicon machines.  Now I'll be watching this thread for compatibility reports even  more.


I have a MacBook Pro M1 and had no problems with the W2 (except I needed a Windows machine for updates).  Not sure what happened to the other person


----------



## felix3650

cristian4 said:


> yes, but I hope maybe they don't provide all information. I'm asking because other Cayin products support mqa(n6,n8, n3pro)


Those are daps. This is a dongle with only a "simple" processing chip neccessary for the R2R network. Fortunately the focus has been the sound quality rather than the "optional" features 😁


----------



## cristian4

felix3650 said:


> Those are daps. This is a dongle with only a "simple" processing chip neccessary for the R2R network. Fortunately the focus has been the sound quality rather than the "optional" features 😁


you're totally right ) But we have an example of Lotoo paw s1/s2(with this feature) ..So I hoped that maybe Cayin also provide this "optional" feature)


----------



## LudoLVG

I am not sure that r2r dac could support mqa


----------



## Zachik

Would I start a riot if I say "MQA is a gimmick"?   
TBH, gimmick is the wrong word, but IMHO nobody should base their decision on product A or B based on that "feature"...
Again, just my own personal opinion.


----------



## blotmouse

LudoLVG said:


> I am not sure that r2r dac could support mqa


Correct, It can't. Or at least no one has made it possible yet. 

No current r-2r player supports MQA (afaik) as its licensed tech with a cost associated, easily implemented in off the shelf chips like AKM and ESS (sometimes even embedded), but not so in custom creations like this discrete ladder network.

If you are planning on using MQA as a format for your music, you will only be able to listen to r-2r via SW rendered 1st unfolds (up to 96kHz) Mostly that is just fine, and if you follow any info on the MQA conspiracy and artifacting, it's even the preferred way to listen with less measured file alteration.


----------



## cristian4

Zachik said:


> Would I start a riot if I say "MQA is a gimmick"?
> TBH, gimmick is the wrong word, but IMHO nobody should base their decision on product A or B based on that "feature"...
> Again, just my own personal opinion.


I think it's quite arguable question )



blotmouse said:


> Correct, It can't. Or at least no one has made it possible yet.
> 
> No current r-2r player supports MQA (afaik) as its licensed tech with a cost associated, easily implemented in off the shelf chips like AKM and ESS (sometimes even embedded), but not so in custom creations like this discrete ladder network.
> 
> If you are planning on using MQA as a format for your music, you will only be able to listen to r-2r via SW rendered 1st unfolds (up to 96kHz) Mostly that is just fine, and if you follow any info on the MQA conspiracy and artifacting, it's even the preferred way to listen with less measured file alteration.


Thanks for the asnwer) It's very helpful)


----------



## Zachik

cristian4 said:


> I think it's quite arguable question


I agree. That is the reason that first - I asked if I would start a riot by asking that... And second - I emphasized that was my personal opinion.
I am aware there are 2 camps. Actually 3 camps:
* MQA believers
* MQA haters
* People that think it is just a different "flavor" but not necessarily better or worse

I guess I am personally on the 3 camp, thinking it sounds a little different but not necessarily better or worse. Just a little different.


----------



## Billyak

Zachik said:


> I agree. That is the reason that first - I asked if I would start a riot by asking that... And second - I emphasized that was my personal opinion.
> I am aware there are 2 camps. Actually 3 camps:
> * MQA believers
> * MQA haters
> ...


The thing I don't like about MQA (apart from the recent debunking) is that I find it practically impossible to tell the difference between 320 MP3, CD Quality and Hi Res.  They sound pretty much identical to me but when I listen to MQA, it sounds different.  Like others have said it doesn't necessarily sound worse but I find it hard to believe that MP3 CD and Hi Res are not true to the recording but MQA is.


----------



## InvisibleInk

Billyak said:


> The thing I don't like about MQA (apart from the recent debunking) is that I find it practically impossible to tell the difference between 320 MP3, CD Quality and Hi Res.  They sound pretty much identical to me but when I listen to MQA, it sounds different.  Like others have said it doesn't necessarily sound worse but I find it hard to believe that MP3 CD and Hi Res are not true to the recording but MQA is.


MQA is DRM masquerading as a value-added feature.


----------



## blotmouse

InvisibleInk said:


> MQA is DRM masquerading as a value-added feature.


Kinda, yeah


----------



## cristian4 (Nov 20, 2021)

Zachik said:


> I agree. That is the reason that first - I asked if I would start a riot by asking that... And second - I emphasized that was my personal opinion.
> I am aware there are 2 camps. Actually 3 camps:
> * MQA believers
> * MQA haters
> ...


of course, you're right, everyone has his own opinion

Actually, I didn't want bring up this arguing to this thread.
I just wanted to know, if it has or not(mqa support), that's all)

thank you all, guys, for your replies)


----------



## alota

i heard good mqa files and bad mqa files. I heard good 16/ 44.1 files and bad. So the anti mqa war is stupid war and wasted time
@Andykong  please i ask again. I need a name of online european retailer. Thank you


----------



## hardpike

https://audioessence.ch/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle


----------



## alota

hardpike said:


> https://audioessence.ch/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle


Thank you but sorry my bad. I mean european union
Now it is too bad with custom


----------



## Andykong (Nov 21, 2021)

alota said:


> i heard good mqa files and bad mqa files. I heard good 16/ 44.1 files and bad. So the anti mqa war is stupid war and wasted time
> @Andykong  please i ask again. I need a name of online european retailer. Thank you



Can you please wait? MusicTeck started a pre-order, that's PRE-ORDER, not something every dealer will opt for.  We can't ask dealers from other countries to follow suit simply because MusicTeck in US has done that.

I had enough trouble because of the pre-order already, my PM and Facebook were flooded with review requests.  Let's wait till we provide the necessary information before we follow up with Sales arrangement.


----------



## alota

Andykong said:


> Can you please wait? MusicTeck started a pre-order, that's PRE-ORDER, not something every dealer will opt for.  We can't ask dealers from other countries to follow suit simply because MusicTeck in US has done that.
> 
> I had enough trouble because of the pre-order already, my PM and Facebook were flooded with review requests.  Let's wait till we provide the necessary information before we follow up with Sales arrangement.


Sure. Thank you


----------



## Andykong (Nov 22, 2021)

Cayin will host a product announcement live streaming on 24 November evening 8pm (GMT +8), I should be able to post English announcement with product detail around 2 hours after the live streaming (and I have put the date on the title of the thread).


----------



## ClieOS




----------



## musicday

Is coming....👍😀


----------



## emilsoft

I hope we get parametric EQ... in the announcement, or one day...


----------



## dumpsterfire

I’d gladly skip EQ in favor of proper line out functionality.


----------



## Zachik

dumpsterfire said:


> I’d gladly skip EQ in favor of proper line out functionality.


+1


----------



## emilsoft

I hope we get parametric EQ... one day... I'll sell my


dumpsterfire said:


> I’d gladly skip EQ in favor of proper line out functionality.


 the headphone outs are usually quite transparent on these devices so line out in my experience doesnt make huge differences if any when used with pre amps


----------



## InvisibleInk

dumpsterfire said:


> I’d gladly skip EQ in favor of proper line out functionality.


Maybe a little switch on the side which toggles the 3.5mm output from PO to LO.

I still want PEQ in an app, though.


----------



## twister6

InvisibleInk said:


> Maybe a little switch on the side which toggles the 3.5mm output from PO to LO.
> 
> I still want PEQ in an app, though.



If R01 didn't have room for a proper LO, it's quite unrealistic for RU6 dongle either

Also, if you want PEQ in an app, wouldn't it be just a matter of picking the right app that support PEQ?  Neutron is a good one.


----------



## felix3650

I'd rather have better resistors in a *resistor* ladder network than PMEQ or line out. The later requires filtering and noise reduction which needs an output section of its own..
Given the size of the RU6..well.. 😝


----------



## alota

i don´t understand question about equalizer. usually when i use a dongle, the equalizer is embedded in apps like UAPP or similar


----------



## emilsoft

twister6 said:


> If R01 didn't have room for a proper LO, it's quite unrealistic for RU6 dongle either
> 
> Also, if you want PEQ in an app, wouldn't it be just a matter of picking the right app that support PEQ?  Neutron is a good one.



The problem with software PEQ is that it's non global... youtube, apple music, youtube music, Logic Pro, video games, etc etc - this is why eq DSP is great. I didn't think much of it but once I got it with RME ADI 2 it's difficult to live without it.

I really like Neutron, but no support for Apple music


----------



## InvisibleInk

twister6 said:


> If R01 didn't have room for a proper LO, it's quite unrealistic for RU6 dongle either
> 
> Also, if you want PEQ in an app, wouldn't it be just a matter of picking the right app that support PEQ?  Neutron is a good one.



Have iPhone, so no Neutron…


----------



## emilsoft

InvisibleInk said:


> Have iPhone, so no Neutron…


There is neutron on IOS too


----------



## Andykong (Nov 22, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> I hope we get parametric EQ... in the announcement, or one day...





emilsoft said:


> The problem with software PEQ is that it's non global... youtube, apple music, youtube music, Logic Pro, video games, etc etc - this is why eq DSP is great. I didn't think much of it but once I got it with RME ADI 2 it's difficult to live without it.
> 
> I really like Neutron, but no support for Apple music


I don't want to hold you up.  There won't be any EQ feature in RU6.  No multi-band EQ, No PMEQ.

Several users and myself have explained the limitation of USB DAC dongle already,  and suggest to implement EQ in the source equipment (mobile phone or computer) instead of the USB dongle.  This is especially true to RU6 when R-2R DAC circuit has taken up most of the space available in the dongle already.  We understand that you have strong preference on EQ in DAC, I am sure there are other DAC products that provide such feature, I wish you all the best in finding the best product that fit your need.

We have discussed several EQ App in Android platform that can serve as a global EQ control for third party applications.  Check *HERE *if you are interested.  I am not familiar with iOS mobile device but there is no reason why these app can't be implemented in iOS platform.  On the other hand, if anyone want to use their mobile phone as audio source to  your personal or home audio system, iOS mobile devices are not ideal choice to start with IMHO.


----------



## InvisibleInk

emilsoft said:


> There is neutron on IOS too


Didn’t know that; thought it was Android-only. Good solution for local file library. Not so much for streaming apps.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> I don't want to hold you up.  There won't be any EQ feature in RU6.  No multi-band EQ, No PMEQ.
> 
> Several users and myself have explained the limitation of USB DAC dongle already,  and suggest to implement EQ in the source equipment (mobile phone or computer) instead of the USB dongle.  This is especially true to RU6 when R-2R DAC circuit has taken up most of the space available in the dongle already.  We understand that you have strong preference on EQ in DAC, I am sure there are other DAC products that provide such feature, I wish you all the best in finding the best product that fit your need.



That's ok. I'm just hopeful if eq is mentioned enough by customers and competition is getting more heated  with hardware DSP, it might become a more common occurrence. Perhaps a firmware update for the RU6 one day even if it doesn't look like reality now


----------



## Andykong

cristian4 said:


> Hi all!)
> Maybe anyone know will RU6 support mqa?





cristian4 said:


> yes, but I hope maybe they don't provide all information. I'm asking because other Cayin products support mqa(n6,n8, n3pro)





cristian4 said:


> you're totally right ) But we have an example of Lotoo paw s1/s2(with this feature) ..So I hoped that maybe Cayin also provide this "optional" feature)





blotmouse said:


> Correct, It can't. Or at least no one has made it possible yet.
> 
> No current r-2r player supports MQA (afaik) as its licensed tech with a cost associated, easily implemented in off the shelf chips like AKM and ESS (sometimes even embedded), but not so in custom creations like this discrete ladder network.
> 
> If you are planning on using MQA as a format for your music, you will only be able to listen to r-2r via SW rendered 1st unfolds (up to 96kHz) Mostly that is just fine, and if you follow any info on the MQA conspiracy and artifacting, it's even the preferred way to listen with less measured file alteration.



Thank you @blotmouse for explaining the limitation of R-2R and MQA implementation. I share the same observation with you as I didn't know of any R-2R DAC are MQA certified.  I can't go into detail of MQA implementation because I am bounded by NDA with Cayin and MQA, but even when someone are brilliant enough to incorporate MQA technologies in R-2R DAC, it won't be a DAC dongle because we just don't have the space, power and budget to provide the necessary DSP power.

@cristian4 
Cayin has incorporated MQA technologies in N3Pro, N8 and A01/A02/T01/E01/E02 Audio Motherboard of N6ii.  Unfortunately we can't incorporate MQA to our R-2R product, namely R01 Audio Motherboard.  The RU6 incurred the R-2R technologies from R01, and therefore it is technically infeasible to incorporate MQA in RU6.   I am not saying MQA is not feasible in USB DAC dongle.  If Cayin were to design a DAC dongle with off-the-shelf DAC chipset that can support MQA (for examle, ES9068AS), we can certainly include MQA support effectively.



emilsoft said:


> That's ok. I'm just hopeful if eq is mentioned enough by customers and competition is getting more heated  with hardware DSP, it might become a more common occurrence. Perhaps a firmware update for the RU6 one day even if it doesn't look like reality now


There will never be any  EQ feature in RU6, not now, not by firmware update.  We just don't have the extra DSP processing power in RU6 to facilitate that.  We have devoted all the DSP processing power to support the R-2R design.  If you take some time to look at our R01 Audio Motherboard, you'll aware that there are a lot of pre-processing need to be done BEFORE R-2R decoding can take place.


----------



## Skev

The whole ethos behind R2R & Stepped Antenuator dongle is completely in the opposite direction to DSP & EQ. Two different worlds in my opinion. You have to know what you want.

It's like wanting a pure analogue driver's track car then expecting traction control and ABS!


----------



## Andykong (Nov 22, 2021)

Skev said:


> The whole ethos behind R2R & Stepped Antenuator dongle is completely in the opposite direction to DSP & EQ. Two different worlds in my opinion. You have to know what you want.
> 
> It's like wanting a pure analogue driver's track car then expecting traction control and ABS!


or PMEQ  with turntable as source.

Thank you for your insight, we know we can't please everyone when we decide to go this route.


----------



## Skev

Exactly my point 👍

I'll definitely keep my eye on people's impressions and reviews on this one. I'm intrigued.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Andykong said:


> Thank you @blotmouse for explaining the limitation of R-2R and MQA implementation. I share the same observation with you as I didn't know of any R-2R DAC are MQA certified.  I can't go into detail of MQA implementation because I am bounded by NDA with Cayin and MQA, but even when someone are brilliant enough to incorporate MQA technologies in R-2R DAC, it won't be a DAC dongle because we just don't have the space, power and budget to provide the necessary DSP power.
> 
> @cristian4
> Cayin has incorporated MQA technologies in N3Pro, N8 and A01/A02/T01/E01/E02 Audio Motherboard of N6ii.  Unfortunately we can't incorporate MQA to our R-2R product, namely R01 Audio Motherboard.  The RU6 incurred the R-2R technologies from R01, and therefore it is technically infeasible to incorporate MQA in RU6.   I am not saying MQA is not feasible in USB DAC dongle.  If Cayin were to design a DAC dongle with off-the-shelf DAC chipset that can support MQA (for examle, ES9068AS), we can certainly include MQA support effectively.


The lack of MQA support is one of the reasons I'm interested in the RU6!


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 23, 2021)

Skev said:


> The whole ethos behind R2R & Stepped Antenuator dongle is completely in the opposite direction to DSP & EQ. Two different worlds in my opinion. You have to know what you want.
> 
> It's like wanting a pure analogue driver's track car then expecting traction control and ABS!



I understand there is no DSP capacity in the ru6 to deal with this, it just wasn't designed with dsp eq in mind. That's ok, just a little disappointing for me as I was hopeful in this day and age we would see more dsp solutions for digital


----------



## AxelCloris

As a heads up, we've removed some posts that were starting to veer away from the topic of the RU6 and into more general discussion. We invite everyone who would like to share their thoughts on the more broad topics of EQ and DSP in mobile DACs to join us in the Members' Lounge, and ask that this thread please remain focused towards the RU6. Thanks everyone, we appreciate your understanding. Now back to the RU6.


----------



## ssriram2791

@Andykong 

Given we are 24 hours away from product release announcement, would it be streamed live on any online platform tomorrow at 8pm (GMT+8) ?


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> @Andykong
> 
> Given we are 24 hours away from product release announcement, would it be streamed live on any online platform tomorrow at 8pm (GMT+8) ?



It online streaming will take place at Bilibili room no. 22110062.  This streaming will be conducted in CHINESE only.  That's why I didn't post the detail to English speaking community.


----------



## LoryWiv

Understood, thank you @Andykong. Would you be kind enough to provide the full RU6 specifications here when available? Sincere appreciation!


----------



## senorx12562

MusicTeck said:


> We're now taking pre-orders for the RU6!
> https://shop.musicteck.com/collecti...r-usb-c-dac-amp-dongle?variant=39638791618622
> 
> Grab a leather case here:
> ...


Link still produces a 404 error.


----------



## emilsoft

senorx12562 said:


> Link still produces a 404 error.



I think they said Cayin didn't want them to advertise the price until the 24th which is why they had to take it down


----------



## Andykong

LoryWiv said:


> Understood, thank you @Andykong. Would you be kind enough to provide the full RU6 specifications here when available? Sincere appreciation!



I have mentioned previously that I'll post English announcement with product detail around 2 hours after the live streaming.


----------



## deafenears

Andykong said:


> This streaming will be conducted in CHINESE only. That's why I didn't post the detail to English speaking community.





ssriram2791 said:


> Given we are 24 hours away from product release announcement, would it be streamed live on any online platform tomorrow at 8pm (GMT+8) ?


24 hours to learn Chinese! Go go go.


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 23, 2021)

I have to say I'm genuinely excited about this R2R dongle - it might just save me from buying the Hiby RS6 or Sony WM1A - I have high hopes it's going to kick some serious dongle backside (i.e. all existing dongles now) and give us some sweet analogue organic honey sound, bringing me closer to my vinyl rig.


----------



## twister6

emilsoft said:


> I have to say I'm genuinely excited about this R2R dongle - it might just save me from buying the Hiby RS6 or Sony WM1A - I have high hopes it's going to kick some serious dongle backside (i.e. all existing dongles now) and give us some sweet analogue organic honey sound, bringing me closer to my vinyl rig.



It's no longer just a hope, it's a reality.


----------



## emilsoft

twister6 said:


> It's no longer just a hope, it's a reality.



You've got to give us some more impressions - we're clutching at straws here haha throw us some more bread crumbs... how does it sound in comparison to others?


----------



## ssriram2791

Folks, 

I just checked my account and found that MUSICTECK has already charged my credit card (it was pending for a while) for the pre-order placed last week. So, expecting December 1st shipping on track.


----------



## hardpike

Not many products nowadays can be called truly a revolution or a first ever... I think this is one of those rare occasions...
Excited for it...


----------



## blacksesame

very excited for it. I hope there will be some comparison between this and R01 module soon. I'm debating on which to buy


----------



## PopZeus

Have we been told how much power this draws from an iPhone? Is it significantly more than the Apple lightning to 3.5mm adapter?


----------



## gto88

I guess that we will find out the detailed tomorrow.


----------



## twister6

PopZeus said:


> Have we been told how much power this draws from an iPhone? Is it significantly more than the Apple lightning to 3.5mm adapter?


The same as W2, I measured about 110-120mA (using 4.4mm out)


----------



## gto88

Andykong said:


> It online streaming will take place at Bilibili room no. 22110062.  This streaming will be conducted in CHINESE only.  That's why I didn't post the detail to English speaking community.


No idea about Bilibili room stuff, is there a direct link for the video?


----------



## twister6

blacksesame said:


> very excited for it. I hope there will be some comparison between this and R01 module soon. I'm debating on which to buy


The same tech (discrete R-2R), but 2 different functionalities, with RU6 being standalone and at less then half the price. Apples and oranges, right?


----------



## blotmouse (Nov 23, 2021)

twister6 said:


> The same tech (discrete R-2R), but 2 different functionalities, with RU6 being standalone and at less then half the price. Apples and oranges, right?


Also different resistors than R01.


----------



## pinkpiglet

Does the RU6 have an HID function? Would be really nice if we can toggle it on/off in the menu.


----------



## Andykong

gto88 said:


> No idea about Bilibili room stuff, is there a direct link for the video?


https://live.bilibili.com/22110062

Please be reminded this is a 100% Chinese based platform without any translation feature.

The live stream will last for 1 to 1.5  hours, I'll post specification on 9pm (GMT +8), approaching the end of the live stream


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 24, 2021)

Andykong said:


> https://live.bilibili.com/22110062
> 
> Please be reminded this is a 100% Chinese based platform without any translation feature.
> 
> The live stream will last for 1 to 1.5  hours, I'll post specification on 9pm (GMT +8), approaching the end of the live stream



Excellent, let me puff up my sofa pillows, take my shoes and trousers off and butter up the popcorn...


----------



## Andykong (Nov 24, 2021)

The suggested retail price of RU6 is $249.99
The USB-C to Lightning cable is an optional accessories at $19.99
Two protective cases (blue and orange) are also available at $19.99

I have updated the *FIRST POST* of RU6 thread with detail explanation on key features.  Please check it out.


----------



## fattycheesebeef

Right on time! Thanks for the live broadcast! Waiting for the C9 giveaway


----------



## ssriram2791

@Andykong 

Congratulations ! Nearly half the power of R01 for about 40% of the price. This should be excellent for IEMs and headphones (especially > 100 dB/mW and < 50 ohms)


----------



## Lu88

Pre-orders for RU6 have been resumed on MusicTeck.


----------



## emilsoft

213mw in 32ohm is quite generous for a dongle. Any info on the amplification topology?


----------



## ClieOS

Just placed a pre-order on Cayin Taobao store.


----------



## Andykong

*Summary of RU6 Features*

24-Bit Discrete R-2R Resistor Ladder DAC
1/1000 ultra-high precision TCR25 low temperature coefficient thin film resistors
Support up to PCM 384kHz and DSD 64/128/256
Low power consumption

User selectable NOS/OS DA Mode
NOS mode: digital filter-less, low phase distortion, low jitter, no ringing artifact
OS mode: increased sampling rate, enhance resolution, reduce noise, improve anti-aliasing

Multi-segments High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control
Hardware Volume +/- button
TWO 6-layers PCB, digital and analog circuit on separate boards
3.5mm single-ended phone output delivers 138mW per channel at 32Ω loading
4.4mm balanced phone output delivers 213mW per channel at 32Ω loading
Compatible with Android, iOS, iPadOS, macOS, Windows 7/8/8,1/10 and DAP with USB Audio output
Type-C USB Audio, Shield USB-C to USB-C cable bundled.
High/Low gain control
Compact and seamless CNC aluminium chassis with 1” OLED screen at 28g.
Optional Leather cases: orange or blue
Optional USB-C to lightning cable
I have updated the *FIRST POST* of RU6 thread with detail explanation on key features.  Check it out if you want to learn more about Cayin's first Dongle DAC.


----------



## vilhelm44

I was on the verge of getting the W2 but have just placed a pre-order for RU6 on Musicteck, looking forward to hearing this!


----------



## hardpike

Pre-ordered too

My first pre-order ever (I usually wait for used stuff)

I hope is wothy.


----------



## sahmen

Any speculation as to how this might  stack up against the Astell & Kern USB-Dongle and/or the Violectric Chronos?  I am considering adding one of these RU6s too to my collection.  Or would it be simpler to wait for the first impressions of early adopters if there are no reviews  out comparing this  R2R dongle with other already released dongles?


----------



## Andykong (Nov 24, 2021)

sahmen said:


> Any speculation as to how this might  stack up against the Astell & Kern USB-Dongle and/or the Violectric Chronos?  I am considering adding one of these RU6s too to my collection.  Or would it be simpler to wait for the first impressions of early adopters if there are no reviews  out comparing this  R2R dongle with other already released dongles?



You should wait if you are haven't use Cayin product before and is not familiar with Cayin house sound.  We'll send out sample to reviewers within this week, and I am sure user impression will pop up very soon.


----------



## WDitters

Any place in the EU where I can preorder @Andykong? After all, since I am waiting for my N6ii to return from Cayin, I am now suffering from serious R-2R withdrawal symptoms.... 😇😎


----------



## musicday

emilsoft said:


> 213mw in 32ohm is quite generous for a dongle. Any info on the amplification topology?


W2 can do 230 mw in 32 ohm, but what's impresive here the 138 mW single ended, where all the dongles can do only 125 mW.


----------



## ssriram2791

musicday said:


> W2 can do 230 mw in 32 ohm, but what's impresive here the 138 mW single ended, where all the dongles can do only 125 mW.


The only thing I hope not to see is folks trying to power (a.k.a driving them to full potential) high impedance or low sensitivity headphones with these dongles. For the first case, we are needing lot of voltage and for the second case, we require voltage as well quite significant amount of current (planar magnetics - I am looking at you). 

Dongles are built purposefully for powering IEMs and anything more they can drive is "PLUS" in my books.


----------



## NewEve

Andykong said:


> The RU6 is NOT a full balanced designed Dongle DAC. The 4.4mm phone output is balanced driven, but the signal path is primarily a single-ended design. We added an extra op-amp (identical to the primary headphone amplification Op-Amp) in the final output stage as unity gain amplifier, all it does is to convert the original stereo signal to negative phase. This will provide extra power and current from the regular 3.5mm phone out, but the channel separation is not as good as a full balanced design.


As someone who prefers single-ended to balanced but sometimes uses the latter for extra power, I am actually extremely happy about this.

I should soon get my RU6 and can’t wait to audition/review it!!!


----------



## Matpar

Andykong said:


> You should wait if you are haven't use Cayin product before and is not familiar with Cayin house sound.  We'll send out sample to reviewers within this week, and I am sure user impression will pop up very soon.


Hi Andy, glad to read about this new dongle.

Coming from an experience with the Hifiman R2R2000, I am more than interested. 

Any plan in a "tour" or chances to test/review/demo and enjoy this little thing here in EU?

Cheers.


----------



## alota

Matpar said:


> Any plan in a "tour" or chances to test/review/demo and enjoy this little thing here in EU?
> 
> Cheers.


I support your request lol


----------



## WDitters

alota said:


> I support your request lol


Same here 🙏😊


----------



## NewEve

WDitters said:


> Any place in the EU where I can preorder @Andykong? After all, since I am waiting for my N6ii to return from Cayin, I am now suffering from serious R-2R withdrawal symptoms.... 😇😎


https://audioessence.ch/collections/digital-audio-player/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle


----------



## Currawong

ssriram2791 said:


> The only thing I hope not to see is folks trying to power (a.k.a driving them to full potential) high impedance or low sensitivity headphones with these dongles. For the first case, we are needing lot of voltage and for the second case, we require voltage as well quite significant amount of current (planar magnetics - I am looking at you).


I still have a couple of very good, but now discontinued portable amps that will hopefully be a good match with the RU6. They've been sitting in a drawer for years waiting for a good excuse to be used.


----------



## ssriram2791

Currawong said:


> I still have a couple of very good, but now discontinued portable amps that will hopefully be a good match with the RU6. They've been sitting in a drawer for years waiting for a good excuse to be used.


To understand this better, are you considering using the phone out of RU6 (use it as a DAC) and connect to another amp which has more power ? I would be interested to know if that is the case (if yes, then I would be contemplating Phone/DAP -> RU6 -> C9)


----------



## fattycheesebeef

I'm still in the old school camp with a 2.5mm. I need a 4.4mm adapter onto RU6... it's gonna be a long train


----------



## InvisibleInk

Currawong said:


> I still have a couple of very good, but now discontinued portable amps that will hopefully be a good match with the RU6. They've been sitting in a drawer for years waiting for a good excuse to be used.


This is where my po-lo switch idea would come in handy.


----------



## Currawong

InvisibleInk said:


> This is where my po-lo switch idea would come in handy.


I haven't checked if it's the case with the RU6, but with the R01 module for the N6ii, a line out option was not possible due to the higher noise floor of the design. I imagine it would be similar for the RU6.  All the same, using the built-in volume rather than the volume control on the amp might be perfectly viable. We'll see how it turns out after one arrives.


----------



## InvisibleInk

Currawong said:


> I haven't checked if it's the case with the RU6, but with the R01 module for the N6ii, a line out option was not possible due to the higher noise floor of the design. I imagine it would be similar for the RU6.  All the same, using the built-in volume rather than the volume control on the amp might be perfectly viable. We'll see how it turns out after one arrives.



I guess so. Just don't forget to turn the volume down after disconnecting the amp. But I'm sure you know what you're doing. I sometimes forget and end up blasting my ears when I do.


----------



## ClieOS

To be frank, the published spec, at least on face value, isn't great. It is passable. But given it is a discreted R-2R implementation, it is understandable.


----------



## Andykong (Nov 24, 2021)

WDitters said:


> Any place in the EU where I can preorder @Andykong? After all, since I am waiting for my N6ii to return from Cayin, I am now suffering from serious R-2R withdrawal symptoms.... 😇😎


So far only our Germany dealer has pre-ordered RU6 before our product announcement, but they don't do pre-order to the best of my knowledge, you can contact them for expected availability date. 

Let's hope more EU dealer will place order after we announced the product detail and specification.


----------



## Andykong

musicday said:


> W2 can do 230 mw in 32 ohm, but what's impresive here the 138 mW single ended, where all the dongles can do only 125 mW.



To be  honest, the 10mW advantage didn't mean anything significant, 10% different refer to a small advantage if the figures were obtained under the same measurement system.  When the power output were obtained from two different systems, maybe under different THD requirements, you should take the 10% power output advantage of RU6 with a grain of salt.


----------



## Andykong (Nov 24, 2021)

ssriram2791 said:


> The only thing I hope not to see is folks trying to power (a.k.a driving them to full potential) high impedance or low sensitivity headphones with these dongles. For the first case, we are needing lot of voltage and for the second case, we require voltage as well quite significant amount of current (planar magnetics - I am looking at you).
> 
> Dongles are built purposefully for powering IEMs and anything more they can drive is "PLUS" in my books.



Exactly.  When the power supply to Dongle DAC are limited at around 100mA from mobile phones, this kind of  "hope" is unrealistic.

Maybe they can convince Apple to give up their protection practise and allow a dongle to drain 500mA from the iPhone, then we can see something muscular down the road.


----------



## Andykong (Nov 24, 2021)

Matpar said:


> Hi Andy, glad to read about this new dongle.
> 
> Coming from an experience with the Hifiman R2R2000, I am more than interested.
> 
> ...



Yes, there will a tour in near future.  When we ramped up our production capability and when RU6 is widely available to all our dealers, I'll start a RU6 tour.

But let me put this upfront.  The cost and reliability of logistic is causing a lot of unhappy experience in product tour.  Several carrier has suspended International Economy due to COVID, making it very costly to send the tour package to a different country.  There are a lot of disputes and discontent during the tour because of that, so I probably will limited my product tour to Norther America and EU until the logistic system resumed to pre-COVID condition.


----------



## ssriram2791

Andykong said:


> When the power supply to Dongle DAC are limited at around 100mA from mobile phones, your "hope" is unrealistic.
> 
> Maybe you can convince Apple to give up their protection practise and allow a dongle to drain 500mA from the iPhone, then we can see something muscular down the road.


I think you have got my comment wrong. 

I was mentioning that people expecting the dongle to power difficult to drive headphones is unrealistic.


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> I think you have got my comment wrong.
> 
> I was mentioning that people expecting the dongle to power difficult to drive headphones is unrealistic.



Sorry, I misunderstand your statement. My fault indeed, and I have corrected my respond immediately.


----------



## Andykong

fattycheesebeef said:


> I'm still in the old school camp with a 2.5mm. I need a 4.4mm adapter onto RU6... it's gonna be a long train



Something like *this*?  Yes, it is kind of inconvenient to move around when you add the 4.4 to 2.5 adapter.


----------



## ssriram2791

Andykong said:


> Sorry, I misunderstand your statement. My fault indeed, and I have corrected my respond immediately.


Not to muddy this thread with the following question. 

I am just curious - given Cayin's foray (entry) into R-2R systems with N6ii-R01 and RU6 , would there be considerations for desktop R-2R DACs in the future if there is significant consumer interest in this area ? I know Cayin iDAC-6 used ESS DACs, so just wondering. I do understand the chip supply chain crisis has hurt the industry overall.


----------



## HansBarbarossa

I absolutely must listen to this device!


----------



## WDitters

NewEve said:


> https://audioessence.ch/collections/digital-audio-player/products/cayin-ru6-r2r-usb-c-dongle


Thanks... Switzerland might be Europe but is not EU.. And typically is more expensive even without the import duties


----------



## Andykong (Nov 25, 2021)

ClieOS said:


> To be frank, the published spec, at least on face value, isn't great. It is passable. But given it is a discreted R-2R implementation, it is understandable.



To be honest, there is a good reason why I mentioned as my concluding statement in RU6 announcement.

If you look at what Cayin did in past few years, we put vacuum tubes into DAP, spend more effort on Single-end phone out than balanced phone out,  "small power" discrete Class A in compact Audio Motherboard, and develop  discrete R-2R technologies for portable applications, .... none of this options put specification as our priority consideration.


----------



## Andykong

Currawong said:


> I haven't checked if it's the case with the RU6, but with the R01 module for the N6ii, a line out option was not possible due to the higher noise floor of the design. I imagine it would be similar for the RU6.  All the same, using the built-in volume rather than the volume control on the amp might be perfectly viable. We'll see how it turns out after one arrives.





Currawong said:


> I haven't checked if it's the case with the RU6, but with the R01 module for the N6ii, a line out option was not possible due to the higher noise floor of the design. I imagine it would be similar for the RU6.  All the same, using the built-in volume rather than the volume control on the amp might be perfectly viable. We'll see how it turns out after one arrives.



Definitely worthy trying out.   

If you tried connecting R01 to C9, you get the picture already. In my experience, use pre-amp input mode of C9 and control the volume through R01 works better then setting the R01 volume to a fixed position and use it as line out to C9.  RU6 is inferior to R01 on this regard, the SNR and THD+D explained part of the story, and mobile phone is inferior to N6ii main unit as digital audio source.


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> Not to muddy this thread with the following question.
> 
> I am just curious - given Cayin's foray (entry) into R-2R systems with N6ii-R01 and RU6 , would there be considerations for desktop R-2R DACs in the future if there is significant consumer interest in this area ? I know Cayin iDAC-6 used ESS DACs, so just wondering. I do understand the chip supply chain crisis has hurt the industry overall.



Feasible but unknown to me at this point.  There are several new products in the pipeline, the next 6 months are fully booked, let's see what happen after that.


----------



## Deleeh

Hello,
Stupid question, can I use the RU6 in such a way that I take a cable that has 3.5 mm and connect it to the dongle and at the other end it has Rca connections and so I can connect it to the amplifier?


----------



## emilsoft

Deleeh said:


> Hello,
> Stupid question, can I use the RU6 in such a way that I take a cable that has 3.5 mm and connect it to the dongle and at the other end it has Rca connections and so I can connect it to the amplifier?


yes you can, get a 3.5mm to rca cable, plenty sold on Amazon


----------



## Deleeh

emilsoft said:


> yes you can, get a 3.5mm to rca cable, plenty sold on Amazon


Okay, great, good to know. Thank you.
It's definitely on the wish list for next year.
I hope there will be great reports by then.
I think it's a really brave move by Cayin to build an R2R that can also be inexpensive to get an impression of what R2R is.
I am very excited.


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 25, 2021)

Deleeh said:


> Okay, great, good to know. Thank you.
> It's definitely on the wish list for next year.
> I hope there will be great reports by then.
> I think it's a really brave move by Cayin to build an R2R that can also be inexpensive to get an impression of what R2R is.
> I am very excited.


I think the pricing is OKish, it's not inexpensive and it's not super expensive - it is ultimately a dongle and the competition is very high here with some excellent sounding devices like Earmen Sparrow, Lotoo etc.  The Sparrow is already performing close to desktop class level in balanced out (for IEMs only) for 200usd coming close to RME ADI 2/Fiio M11 Plus, it's scary what is achievable in a dongle nowadays for around 200 dollars. I have very high expectations for the RU6 as it's priced on the highish side for a dongle and it has r2r.. I've been quite disappointed with their N3 Pro DAP sound and QC wise but I'm giving the brand another chance as my curiosity is too strong for an R2R dongle


----------



## Andykong

Deleeh said:


> Hello,
> Stupid question, can I use the RU6 in such a way that I take a cable that has 3.5 mm and connect it to the dongle and at the other end it has Rca connections and so I can connect it to the amplifier?



Yes,  it works, but please read on.  You'll be using the 3.5mm headphone output from RU6 as a DAC line out,  I assume you are connecting to an integrated amplifier? 



Stuff Jones said:


> Will this have a line out feature? That would be awesome. Pair it with say a Schiit Vali 2+ and you have R2R  portable + tubes desktop for <500.





Zachik said:


> @Andykong - any chance line-out functionality can be added via FW update in the future?
> Also, any update on the price?





dumpsterfire said:


> I’d gladly skip EQ in favor of proper line out functionality.



The RU6 does not  have line out function, and it can't be added through firmware update.  The line out of R2R design is slightly different delta-sigma chipset, we can't just take the LPF output and use it as a line out direclty.  

We didn't include a "shared" line out feature with RU6 because it is almost equivalent to set the RU6 at a designated volume and left it as-is and use it as a "fake" line out.   The "optimum" volume setting varied according to different amplifier and earphone/speaker with RU6.  The trick is to balanced between (distortion, noise, ...) against (dynamic, soundstage, headroom, ...).  

For instance, when you set the volume of RU6 to 50, you have low distortion and low noise, but lack of dynamic, narrow soundstage and insufficient headroom (because you need to turn your amplifier up to compensate the low output level).  On the other hand, when you set the volume of RU6 to 90, you'll increase the THD+N and noise, but you'll get better dynamic, wider soundstage and more headroom in your system.  So this is a matter of compromise. Given the unique pattern of the RU6 and R01 R-2R circuit, noise will increase as you turn up the volume.  there isn't one setting that is always right in different system, you just have to practice trail and error.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> I think the pricing is OKish, it's not inexpensive and it's not super expensive - it is ultimately a dongle and the competition is very high here with some excellent sounding devices like Earmen Sparrow, Lotoo etc.  The Sparrow is already performing close to desktop class level in balanced out (for IEMs only) for 200usd coming close to RME ADI 2/Fiio M11 Plus, it's scary what is achievable in a dongle nowadays for around 200 dollars. I have very high expectations for the RU6 as it's priced on the highish side for a dongle and it has r2r.. I've been quite disappointed with their N3 Pro DAP sound and QC wise but I'm giving the brand another chance as my curiosity is too strong for an R2R dongle



After I tried several IEM and headphone, I personally rated N3Pro above RU6 in many combinations.   The vacuum tube output from 3.5mm phone out of N3Pro rated at similar value against the 3.5mm phone out of RU6, but the dynamic and handling capability of N3Pro is noticeable better than NU6.  Tonality is personal choice, choice of triode and ultralinear modes in N3Pro are comparable to RU6's R2R IMHO.  When I moved to  headphone or more demanding earphones, the much higher output from 4.4mm of N3Pro win hands down.

The RU6 enables new application, target to another group of users.  NU6 never means to be an N3Pro replacement.  It probably can work for some users, but it won't work for everyone.


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 25, 2021)

Andykong said:


> After I tried several IEM and headphone, I personally rated N3Pro above RU6 in many combinations.   The vacuum tube output from 3.5mm phone out of N3Pro rated at similar value against the 3.5mm phone out of RU6, but the dynamic and handling capability of N3Pro is noticeable better than NU6.  Tonality is personal choice, choice of triode and ultralinear modes in N3Pro are comparable to RU6's R2R IMHO.  When I moved to  headphone or more demanding earphones, the much higher output from 4.4mm of N3Pro win hands down.
> 
> The RU6 enables new application, target to another group of users.  NU6 never means to be an N3Pro replacement.  It probably can work for some users, but it won't work for everyone.



That's interesting - the issue I had with N3Pro was i found it's dac section inferior to many others sources including other DAPs in similar price range (using IEMs and HD650). It sounded a little harsh, somewhat congested and dirty/agressive too.. the tube coloring was ok I guess, but the issue with the rather basic dac implementation put me off it - it was no way close to what I'd expect a 500$ source quality to be in terms of technicalities (tube or not)

The RU6 being an R2R, and some say comparable to R01 I am hopeful it will give a slightly more delicate and superior touch to the signal conversion.. in any case your impressions will be appreciated on how they differ - perhaps you put more value in certain tube characteristics vs converter etc


----------



## Johnfg465vd

After a disappointing experience with the Sparrow (EMI Issues), I was going to either get the W2 or S2 but now this seems like a better option. pricing is reasonable too.

I'm hoping this device will help me decide if I wanna invest in Desktop R2R DACs.


----------



## emilsoft

Johnfg465vd said:


> After a disappointing experience with the Sparrow (EMI Issues), I was going to either get the W2 or S2 but now this seems like a better option. pricing is reasonable too.
> 
> I'm hoping this device will help me decide if I wanna invest in Desktop R2R DACs.



There's always a catch isn't there - the Sparrow was almost perfect if it weren't for it's EMI issues (I use it with iPad mini and no issues there, but with phone it's unstable with the interference). It did however raise my expectations extremely high in terms of what is achievable in a dongle.


----------



## Andykong (Nov 25, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> That's interesting - the issue I had with N3Pro was i found it's dac section inferior to many others sources including other DAPs in similar price range (using IEMs and HD650). It sounded a little harsh, somewhat congested and dirty/agressive too.. the tube coloring was ok I guess, but the issue with the rather basic dac implementation put me off it - it was no way close to what I'd expect a 500$ source quality to be in terms of technicalities (tube or not)
> 
> The RU6 being an R2R, and some say comparable to R01 I am hopeful it will give a slightly more delicate and superior touch to the signal conversion.. in any case your impressions will be appreciated on how they differ - perhaps you put more value in certain tube characteristics vs converter etc



I can't separate the DAC performance and amplification performance of a DAP unless I use line out to connect the DAP to a different amplifier.  I have connected N3Pro line out to iHA-6, HA1Amk2 and C9 and I find these enjoyable, so it is safe to conclude that I find the DAC implementation of N3Pro satisfactory.

Don't worry, there is no need to establish a common ground because you are entitled to your opinion with N3Pro. I always hold the principle that everyone is entitled to their opinion, whether in the form or a detail impression or with a single line that "this is trash".  Your opinion can be useful, or it can be irrelevant, at the end of the day, its other users who make this judgement.  That's why  N3Pro vs RU6 is a good topic here, but not N3Pro as a standalone device. I suggest you raise your N3Pro opinion in N3Pro thread, you'll find more N3Pro users over there.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> I can't separate the DAC performance and amplification performance of a DAP unless I use line out to connect the DAP to a different amplifier.  I have connected N3Pro line out to iHA-6, HA1Amk2 and C9 and I find these enjoyable, so it is safe to conclude that I find the DAC section of satisfactory.
> 
> Don't worry, there is no need to establish a common ground because you are entitled to your opinion with N3Pro. I always hold the principle that everyone is entitled to their opinion, whether in the form or a detail impression or with a single line that "this is trash".  Your opinion can be useful, or it can be irrelevant, at the end of the day, its other users who make this judgement.  That's why  N3Pro vs RU6 is a good topic here, but not N3Pro as a standalone device. I suggest you raise your N3Pro opinion in N3Pro thread, you'll find more N3Pro users over there.



That's ok - I guess I wanted to take something that I know as a base point in comparison.

In terms of opinion - i try to be objective as much as possible but it's always in relation to other sources I've heard (I try to be fair and compare similar price ranges), so in the instance of the N3 Pro I compared it to other DAPs and sources with similar cost and i try to isolate technicalities - for example i dislike the Fiio M11 Pro tonality as it's a little cold/lean for me, but I appreciate it's technicalities in competition with other sources; wide soundstage, clean instrument separation, clean treble, good transient response.. so I'm hopeful someone can chime in with some base point comparisons between different devices and the RU6 here once deliveries start coming in.


----------



## Deleeh

Hello @Andykong ,

Thanks for the information.
Yes the idea would be as you mentioned, amplifier would be Little Dot 1+ or mobile to use, or to other amplifiers I still have on the PC.


----------



## gikigill

Another addition to my Cayin stable besides the C5 amp and the original N6 DAP. The C5 is 8 years old but holding strong and lets hope the RU6 is just as enjoyable as the C5/N6.


----------



## someyoungguy

Andykong said:


> Yes,  it works, but please read on.  You'll be using the 3.5mm headphone output from RU6 as a DAC line out,  I assume you are connecting to an integrated amplifier?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That reminds me, I wondered how many volume steps there are on the RU6. I'm guessing 100 based on your answer here?


----------



## NewEve

Any chance we'll see other colors for the cases?

On the one hand, there's a design which looks as HiFiesque as possible for a dongle...
... and on the other there's two cases in bright colors looking-like Legos 

While I didn't care for the green case of the N3 Pro, the one we saw for the RU6 was nice.


----------



## alota

Andykong said:


> To be honest, there is a good reason why I mentioned as my concluding statement in RU6 announcement.
> 
> If you look at what Cayin did in past few years, we put vacuum tubes into DAP, spend more effort on Single-end phone out than balanced phone out,  "small power" discrete Class A in compact Audio Motherboard, and develop  discrete R-2R technologies for portable applications, .... none of this options put specification as our priority consideration.


in my opinion specs for a dongle are really good. people want miracles LOL


----------



## Decreate

Really looking forward to the release of this device as I hope this will be a good alternative to the RS6 on days when I want to travel light.


----------



## alota

Decreate said:


> Really looking forward to the release of this device as I hope this will be a good alternative to the RS6 on days when I want to travel light.


Rs6 is r2r too right?


----------



## NewEve

alota said:


> Rs6 is r2r too right?


Yes


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> That's ok - I guess I wanted to take something that I know as a base point in comparison.
> 
> In terms of opinion - i try to be objective as much as possible but it's always in relation to other sources I've heard (I try to be fair and compare similar price ranges), so in the instance of the N3 Pro I compared it to other DAPs and sources with similar cost and i try to isolate technicalities - for example i dislike the Fiio M11 Pro tonality as it's a little cold/lean for me, but I appreciate it's technicalities in competition with other sources; wide soundstage, clean instrument separation, clean treble, good transient response.. so I'm hopeful someone can chime in with some base point comparisons between different devices and the RU6 here once deliveries start coming in.



Shall we move your "opinion" of N3Pro to the appropriate thread?

As I mentioned previously, I always encourage users to wait for reviews or impression if they feel uncomfortable, orhhesitated, or uncertain about the new product.  There is no point to feel worry or uncertain after you rush out to pre-order immediately.


----------



## Andykong

Deleeh said:


> Hello @Andykong ,
> 
> Thanks for the information.
> Yes the idea would be as you mentioned, amplifier would be Little Dot 1+ or mobile to use, or to other amplifiers I still have on the PC.



I have provided a simple procedure in my previous response, I hope you find it useful and can find the sweet spot to connect phone out to your amplifier.


----------



## Andykong

someyoungguy said:


> That reminds me, I wondered how many volume steps there are on the RU6. I'm guessing 100 based on your answer here?



99 steps.  It was written on the opening post of this thread, and when you'll find the details in the RU6 product page of Cayin website later.


----------



## Andykong

NewEve said:


> Any chance we'll see other colors for the cases?
> 
> On the one hand, there's a design which looks as HiFiesque as possible for a dongle...
> ... and on the other there's two cases in bright colors looking-like Legos
> ...



Only two colours are available.


----------



## Mcleenx

Owning a HIFIMAN HM2000, will make the comparison with the miniature RU-6 very interesting.


----------



## musicday

Does it comes with presets movie, game, normal? Thank you


----------



## twister6

musicday said:


> Does it comes with presets movie, game, normal? Thank you



No eq presets.  Please take a look at my previous post with pictures and detailed description of RU6 Settings here.


----------



## twister6

Andykong said:


> Only two colours are available.



Here is how the blue leather case looks under a "natural" light in our kitchen.  For under $20 it's an easy decision.


----------



## twister6

Andykong said:


> 99 steps.  It was written on the opening post of this thread, and when you'll find the details in the RU6 product page of Cayin website later.



Yep, confirm the "short delay" when adjusting the volume.  First time I used it, took me by a bit of surprise until I quickly realized it's probably a switch relay (even before I saw the spec).


----------



## Johnfg465vd

@twister6 could you share your first impressions between this and W2 or S2 please. Thanks.


----------



## NewEve

twister6 said:


> Here is how the blue leather case looks under a "natural" light in our kitchen.  For under $20 it's an easy decision.


This is much better indeed. The orange might be alright then. Thanks!


----------



## NewEve (Nov 25, 2021)

@twister6 So, RU6 or RS6  ?


----------



## twister6

Sorry, I only borrowed Musicteck demo for a few days to check it out.  Will post impressions and full write up when review sample arrives.  I do have some notes which I need to clean up, maybe later when I get some free time.


----------



## emilsoft

NewEve said:


> @twister6 So, RU6 or RS6  ?


Would love to read some comparisons between the two, even if just draft.. I am tempted by the RS6 - I wonder if the gap between the two is massive or if there's some pleasant overlaps


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> Shall we move your "opinion" of N3Pro to the appropriate thread?
> 
> As I mentioned previously, I always encourage users to wait for reviews or impression if they feel uncomfortable, orhhesitated, or uncertain about the new product.  There is no point to feel worry or uncertain after you rush out to pre-order immediately.



No need to move it, some feedom of speech is ok when discussing similar gear and basing some points of reference - maybe someone here aside from yourself will get a chance to compare the two and will chime in when they read the post.

I get that you want to keep very tight focus on this thread but too much policing can give the wrong impression too


----------



## ssriram2791

emilsoft said:


> Would love to read some comparisons between the two, even if just draft.. I am tempted by the RS6 - I wonder if the gap between the two is massive or if there's some pleasant overlaps


I am perplexed with your comments. Comparing a DAP (RS6) vs dongle (RU6) with price differential of about $1100, in addition to this, amplification circuits and power output differences etc.

The primary reason a dongle is existing in this market is because people can get upgraded sound quality (this is up to individual preferences) compared to what today's phone out (LG G8 as an example with Quad DAC) can provide and also a *matter of convenience. *

I perceive the upgradation in sound quality (at least for headphones) in this manner 

Desktop DAC/AMP  > Digital Audio Player >> Dongle

I view convenience in this manner 

Dongle >>> Digital Audio Player >> Desktop DAC/AMP

It is all about trade-offs. 

Given this is just one person's opinion, it may not hold for what others perceive as the best. 

But, it still doesn't make sense for us to compare turbocharged engine (RS6) vs naturally aspirated engine (RU6).


----------



## emilsoft (Nov 25, 2021)

ssriram2791 said:


> I am perplexed with your comments. Comparing a DAP (RS6) vs dongle (RU6) with price differential of about $1100, in addition to this, amplification circuits and power output differences etc.
> 
> The primary reason a dongle is existing in this market is because people can get upgraded sound quality (this is up to individual preferences) compared to what today's phone out (LG G8 as an example with Quad DAC) can provide and also a *matter of convenience. *
> 
> ...



Oh I don't expect the RU6 to really compete up to that level, rather I'm wondering how close is it. It did get compared to the r01 module which is used by an expensive dap too.

Also keep in mind a dongle doesn't have a processor, screen, ram and storage, Bluetooth and WiFi module - all these raise the cost of the dap.

For example Earmen Sparrow almost equals an Fiio M11 Plus sound quality wise when used with iems in balanced (in technicalities, tonality is subjective ).


----------



## Andykong (Nov 25, 2021)

Decreate said:


> Really looking forward to the release of this device as I hope this will be a good alternative to the RS6 on days when I want to travel light.





Andykong said:


> After I tried several IEM and headphone, I personally rated N3Pro above RU6 in many combinations.   The vacuum tube output from 3.5mm phone out of N3Pro rated at similar value against the 3.5mm phone out of RU6, but the dynamic and handling capability of N3Pro is noticeable better than NU6.  Tonality is personal choice, choice of triode and ultralinear modes in N3Pro are comparable to RU6's R2R IMHO.  When I moved to  headphone or more demanding earphones, the much higher output from 4.4mm of N3Pro win hands down.
> 
> The RU6 enables new application, target to another group of users.  NU6 never means to be an N3Pro replacement.  It probably can work for some users, but it won't work for everyone.



I think RU6 is a good alternative to the RS6 on days when you want to travel light.

You have raised a very good point.  The RU6 is a good alternative, but it was not designed to replace any DAP.  It's biggest selling point is compact and lightweight, at 28g, it weight around 10% of regular DAPs only, and that is the biggest selling point of RU6.

Maybe we can elaborate this topic futher .  Desktop amplifier like Cayin HA-6A is equivalent to a desktop computer, N6ii-Ti is like a notebook computer, and RU6 is like a mobile phone.  You cannot compare the processing power of a notebook against a desktop computer, even those so-called desktop replacement notebook can hardly compare to a decent desktop computer at the same price when dealing with demanding games.  Similarly, a mobile phone cannot compare to a notebook computer on processing power.   Having said that, we use computer more often then notebook, and we use notebook more often than desktop computer. 

Portability is a very expensive implementation, miniature is an even more important implementation.   We cannot compare absolute sound quality by excluded the portability and miniature factor.  That's very important pre-requisite when we compare a dongle to a DAP, or compare RU6 to N3Pro like I just did.  Let's learn from the desktop/notebook/mobilephone illustration and put everything in the right context.


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> I am perplexed with your comments. Comparing a DAP (RS6) vs dongle (RU6) with price differential of about $1100, in addition to this, amplification circuits and power output differences etc.
> 
> The primary reason a dongle is existing in this market is because people can get upgraded sound quality (this is up to individual preferences) compared to what today's phone out (LG G8 as an example with Quad DAC) can provide and also a *matter of convenience. *
> 
> ...



Exactly what I have in mind, I think we are typing the same "message" at the same time, from different perspective.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> No need to move it, some feedom of speech is ok when discussing similar gear and basing some points of reference - maybe someone here aside from yourself will get a chance to compare the two and will chime in when they read the post.
> 
> I get that you want to keep very tight focus on this thread but too much policing can give the wrong impression too



That's why I don't enjoy discuss with you.  You are full of your own conspiracy theory.

I want to move/continue the discussion in N3Pro thread because that's where we can involve other N3Pro users.  That's the place where the discussion become productive, become beneficial to a bigger group. 

You just assume I am policing.


----------



## SHOOTINGTECHIE

@Andykong Hey this might be a very easy question but i am still confused though, so i thought i should ask it 😁
Is there any latency while gaming with this on phone or especially on a PC ? And does this work with a PS5 ?
I know these are some rare case scenarios but if someone can chime in here it would be great
Thanks


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> That's why I don't enjoy discuss with you.  You are full of your own conspiracy theory.
> 
> I want to move/continue the discussion in N3Pro thread because that's where we can involve other N3Pro users.  That's the place where the discussion become productive, become beneficial to a bigger group.
> 
> You just assume I am policing.



It's ok I didn't want to discuss the n3 pro really, just wanted to give one reference point and if others have had a chance to compare it in the context of ru6 they might chime in - all good stuff for a healthy discussion.

Still very early days though.


----------



## AP357

I'm hoping this dongle wont suffer with EMI issues when connect to mobile phones.
Gonna wait for impressions


----------



## abitdeef

You can't really measure technicalities with your ears. Everyone's hearing and ears are unique. Specs often don't follow sound quality, I already have several competent daps, but I want the RU6 for a change of sonic flavor, and the ladder or even multibit dacs seem to have a smoother richer and more organic sound. 

I'm very excited for this dongle and I've tried pretty much evey competent dongle out there including the sparrow and using full size cans they just don't have enough oomph- juice for planars or high resistance monitors/iems Not like a full sized dap does.

I'm sure RU6 will be the same, but I'm also pretty sure the sound signature will be less digital and more natural then the other dongles I've tried.


----------



## DBaldock9

musicday said:


> W2 can do 230 mw in 32 ohm, but what's impresive here the 138 mW single ended, where all the dongles can do only 125 mW.





Andykong said:


> To be  honest, the 10mW advantage didn't mean anything significant, 10% different refer to a small advantage if the figures were obtained under the same measurement system.  When the power output were obtained from two different systems, maybe under different THD requirements, you should take the 10% power output advantage of RU6 with a grain of salt.



It takes ~2x the power for a speaker to sound noticeably (3dB or 23%) louder, and ~10x the power to sound twice (10dB or 100%) louder.
So, you'd need ~250-mW to sound noticeably louder than the 125-mW dongles, if you didn't go deaf long before putting that much power into an IEM or earbud.


----------



## abitdeef

Is it me or did the pre order price at musicteck just go up 20 dollars? Interesting.


----------



## ssriram2791

abitdeef said:


> Is it me or did the pre order price at musicteck just go up 20 dollars? Interesting.


I see $249.99 as the pre-order price. It has not changed. If you add accessories, it increases either by $20 or $40


----------



## abitdeef (Nov 26, 2021)

ssriram2791 said:


> I see $249.99 as the pre-order price. It has not changed. If you add accessories, it increases either by $20 or $40



Ahh, maybe it popped up with the cable added. It said 269.99 but now it's  showing 50 dollars lol. Which isn't a deposit as it charged my card 249.99.


----------



## ssriram2791

abitdeef said:


> Ahh, maybe it popped up with the cable added. It said 269.99 but now it's  showing 50 dollars lol.


Could you please avoid google search. Go to official Musicteck page and check the price. I think the good news is it does not say SOLD OUT. So, folks still interested to pre-order, can do that before December 1st.


----------



## abitdeef

ssriram2791 said:


> Could you please avoid google search. Go to official Musicteck page and check the price. I think the good news is it does not say SOLD OUT. So, folks still interested to pre-order, can do that before December 1st.



No I can't really avoid it if I'm searching can I 😉


----------



## Andykong (Nov 26, 2021)

RU6 Product page is online, check *THIS *out for a complete explanation of the RU6 features.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

I pulled the trigger and bought an RU6 today.


----------



## abitdeef (Nov 26, 2021)

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> I pulled the trigger and bought an RU6 today.



Who would have thought we'd have a dongle sized R2R ladder dac/amp. I had to get one, you know as a early Christmas gift for meself. 😀 Congrats- as the old Templar knight In Indiana Jones said... "You have chosen well".


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

abitdeef said:


> Who would have thought we'd have a dongle sized R2R ladder dac/amp. I had to get one, you know as a early Christmas gift for meself. 😀 Congrats- as the old Templar knight In Indiana Jones said... "You have chosen well".


If Andy says something is good, there is a good chance I'll buy it.


----------



## discord

Just ordered now.


----------



## Andykong

SHOOTINGTECHIE said:


> @Andykong Hey this might be a very easy question but i am still confused though, so i thought i should ask it 😁
> Is there any latency while gaming with this on phone or especially on a PC ? And does this work with a PS5 ?
> I know these are some rare case scenarios but if someone can chime in here it would be great
> Thanks



I tested Youtube and watched several gun fight scenes, the gun fire sound matched the firearm flash very well.

I didn't play game at all, so I have no idea if the latency will meet gamer's requirement, and Cayin didn't measure the latency of RU6, we probably need to wait for user impression for that.


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> You can't really measure technicalities with your ears. Everyone's hearing and ears are unique. Specs often don't follow sound quality, I already have several competent daps, but I want the RU6 for a change of sonic flavor, and the ladder or even multibit dacs seem to have a smoother richer and more organic sound.
> 
> I'm very excited for this dongle and I've tried pretty much evey competent dongle out there including the sparrow and using full size cans they just don't have enough oomph- juice for planars or high resistance monitors/iems Not like a full sized dap does.
> 
> I'm sure RU6 will be the same, but I'm also pretty sure the sound signature will be less digital and more natural then the other dongles I've tried.


Yes, there is no reason to assume RU6 is noticeable more powerful than other decent dongle DAC, the major different is quality of music playback, not driving power.


----------



## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> It takes ~2x the power for a speaker to sound noticeably (3dB or 23%) louder, and ~10x the power to sound twice (10dB or 100%) louder.
> So, you'd need ~250-mW to sound noticeably louder than the 125-mW dongles, if you didn't go deaf long before putting that much power into an IEM or earbud.




Experience audiophiles probably should get pass the loudness from how many watt issue.  they should be more focused on transient and headroom, but that is not something we can hear with 10mW or 20mW different.  

Just in case you have better ears than 99% of DAP users, and you can hear the hairline different between 10mW, I bet you won't settle with a Dongle DAC by that time.


----------



## abitdeef

You know though, for us major iem users dongles work very well 😀 I use dap on senn HD 600. But for everything else dongles have been fine. Only thing I really don't like about a dongle is hooking it up to usb port every time, you know if your using a phone as source. 
But I will make exception in ru6 case. 😉


----------



## twister6 (Nov 26, 2021)

OK, as promised, here are some of the notes I took while listening to RU6 final prototype sample I borrowed recently from Musicteck.  And, as the usual disclaimer, this is how _I hear_ it.

Was using RU6 (High Gain, NOS filter) with Traillii and First Times cable (4.4mm) connected to my aging Galaxy S9 (smartphone volume set to max) while streaming Amazon HD (192kHz flacs), volume matched in every comparison.

_already shared this picture, but here it is again_:


*RU6 vs W2* - very similar tonality and sound sig, though RU6 has just a touch more sub-bass rumble.  The main difference I hear is in soundstage expansion where RU6 is noticeably wider and has a more holographic 3D imaging.  I also noticed RU6 having a little blacker background.

*RU6 vs S2* - S2 tonality is a little warmer due to a smoother treble extension in comparison to RU6 having more sparkle in treble and more transparency in mids/vocals.  Also, S2 bass is softer with a slightly slower attack while RU6 packs a faster mid-bass punch.  Furthermore, RU6 soundstage is wider and background is a little blacker.

Also, no problem driving Meze Audio Empyrean (4.4mm BAL), though tonality was a little brighter and more mid-forward, with bass lacking some punch.  Furthermore, was able to drive 470ohm ATH-R70x (from 3.5mm SE), though had to raise the volume to 83.  And again, the sound was a little more mid-forward with bass lacking some impact.

With IEMs it seems to be working great connected directly.  But with some demanding headphones I hooked up RU6 output directly to C9 while setting RU6 volume to 100.  That scaled up the sound without any distortion or artifacts, especially in R70x where the bass came alive and I felt like I was driving these cans to their full potential.


----------



## ssriram2791

twister6 said:


> OK, as promised, here are some of the notes I took while listening to RU6 final prototype sample I borrowed recently from Musicteck.  And, as the usual disclaimer, this is how _I hear_ it.
> 
> Was using RU6 (High Gain, NOS filter) with Traillii and First Times cable (4.4mm) connected to my aging Galaxy S9 (smartphone volume set to max) while streaming Amazon HD (192kHz flacs), volume matched in every comparison.
> 
> ...


Fantastic review !  I love my R70x.. I would recommend you to get some balanced cable someday (seems long overdue )


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Hey @Andykong I've noticed that many dongle DAC's or battery-less DAC's improve with higher powered sources (PC/Laptop). You mentioned the RU6 was designed to use less power from the source to play nice with Apple phones right? Will it automatically detect and draw more power for Android devices or Desktops?


----------



## Andykong

Johnfg465vd said:


> Hey @Andykong I've noticed that many dongle DAC's or battery-less DAC's improve with higher powered sources (PC/Laptop). You mentioned the RU6 was designed to use less power from the source to play nice with Apple phones right? Will it automatically detect and draw more power for Android devices or Desktops?


No it won't, RU6 doesn't have any intelligence to perform handshaking with the host, can't expect it to self-optimized like that. 

Yes, RU6 sounds noticeable better when connect to DAP or PC as source.


----------



## If6was9 (Nov 27, 2021)

*@twister6*

Thanks for the testimony
Could you make a comparison between RU6 and S2 through the 3.5mm?
In your opinion, which one gives a more Analog sound (and less digital), the S2 or RU6?
Thanks

(Sorry for my bad English)


----------



## SHOOTINGTECHIE

Andykong said:


> I tested Youtube and watched several gun fight scenes, the gun fire sound matched the firearm flash very well.
> 
> I didn't play game at all, so I have no idea if the latency will meet gamer's requirement, and Cayin didn't measure the latency of RU6, we probably need to wait for user impression for that.


I can wait or as per the audiophile requirements might just buy one to find out myself 🤣
Thanks for answering 👍


----------



## sahmen

twister6 said:


> OK, as promised, here are some of the notes I took while listening to RU6 final prototype sample I borrowed recently from Musicteck.  And, as the usual disclaimer, this is how _I hear_ it.
> 
> Was using RU6 (High Gain, NOS filter) with Traillii and First Times cable (4.4mm) connected to my aging Galaxy S9 (smartphone volume set to max) while streaming Amazon HD (192kHz flacs), volume matched in every comparison.
> 
> ...


Could kindly provide the full names of the "S2" and "W2" units to  which you're comparing the RUS?  I for one am clueless as to what thu're referring to.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

sahmen said:


> Could kindly provide the full names of the "S2" and "W2" units to  which you're comparing the RUS?  I for one am clueless as to what thu're referring to.


Luxuary & Precision W2 & Lotoo PAW S2


----------



## twister6

If6was9 said:


> *@twister6*
> 
> Thanks for the testimony
> Could you make a comparison between RU6 and S2 through the 3.5mm?
> ...



I will include this comparison when I have the final production unit for review and working on the full detailed write up.


----------



## TomKorn

twister6 said:


> OK, as promised, here are some of the notes I took while listening to RU6 final prototype sample I borrowed recently from Musicteck.  And, as the usual disclaimer, this is how _I hear_ it.
> 
> Was using RU6 (High Gain, NOS filter) with Traillii and First Times cable (4.4mm) connected to my aging Galaxy S9 (smartphone volume set to max) while streaming Amazon HD (192kHz flacs), volume matched in every comparison.
> 
> ...


Wow. Thanks for those impressions! This reads like RU6 might be the best dongle on the market right now. 😲


----------



## twister6

TomKorn said:


> Wow. Thanks for those impressions! This reads like RU6 might be the best dongle on the market right now. 😲


Unless if you fancy a dongle that comes with EQ presets. Keep in mind, these were just quick sound impressions. W2 and S2 do have eq/sound presets (though, can't customize the eq itself), and W2 has coax spdif output while S2 has a remote play/pause/skip playback control and mqa support. And then we have RU6 with a sexy R-2R discrete design. Each one has its pros and cons, need to figure out which one fits your needs better.


----------



## blotmouse

Never once found benefit from EQ presets. (Ok, I used them on the original Firewire iPod) Seems like a superfluous add in to me. They are always so laughably extreme.


----------



## Ufanco

Interesting device and I have a question on the firmware. Is it able to be update and if so how?


----------



## Vanquished

twister6 said:


> *RU6 vs W2* -  *The main difference I hear is in soundstage expansion where RU6 is noticeably wider and has a more holographic 3D imaging. *


For me this is the most important part. Not mqa support nor fancy EQs, but a nice analogue like soundstage. Thank you, Twister.


----------



## stin8x

@Andykong Do I have to buy a USB-C to lightning cable seperately? Because on the website, it says the otg cable is "optional accessory"

@twister6 Which one do you think, between the RU6 and W2, would be a better pair for the UM Mest MK2 if you don't me asking? Talking about sound quality, since I see you have the Mest MK2 as well. Thank you!


----------



## twister6

stin8x said:


> @Andykong Do I have to buy a USB-C to lightning cable seperately? Because on the website, it says the otg cable is "optional accessory"
> 
> @twister6 Which one do you think, between the RU6 and W2, would be a better pair for the UM Mest MK2 if you don't me asking? Talking about sound quality, since I see you have the Mest MK2 as well. Thank you!



Either one pair ups great with Mest MK2 or Mest Indigo.  And, RU6 comes standard with usb-c to usb-c short OTG cable (and usb-c to usb-A adapter) and you need to get usb-c to lightning OTG cable.  I see it listed on Musicteck site as $19.99 option when ordering RU6.


----------



## Andykong

stin8x said:


> @Andykong Do I have to buy a USB-C to lightning cable seperately? Because on the website, it says the otg cable is "optional accessory"
> 
> [
> 
> ...



Yes, the USB-C to lightning cable is an optional accessory, you need to buy it separately.  By the way, you don't have to buy a Cayin USB-C to lightning cable for your RU6.  Any MFI certified or reputable USB-C to lightning cable should works fine.


----------



## sneill321

Andykong said:


> Yes, the USB-C to lightning cable is an optional accessory, you need to buy it separately.  By the way, you don't have to buy a Cayin USB-C to lightning cable for your RU6.  Any MFI certified or reputable USB-C to lightning cable should works fine.



Hi Andy,

Your website advises " _*Please use shielded USB cable_ "

I assume the supplied USB C cable is shielded?
I guess this is to avoid/reduce interference from a mobile phone?


----------



## arch7tect (Nov 29, 2021)

In stock on aliexpress
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003601415433.html?sku_id=12000026480164527


----------



## Andykong

sneill321 said:


> Hi Andy,
> 
> Your website advises " _*Please use shielded USB cable_ "
> 
> ...



The USB-C to USB-C cable provided in RU6 is shielded.  However that's a very short interconnect, we expect some users might need a longer USB-C to USB-C cable if they want to keep the DAP in backpack, and holding the RU6 to adjust volume while listening to their IEM on-the-go, or when they want to connect RU6 to as desktop computer.  For these reason, we want to remind our users that if the need to use a different USB-C to USB-C cable, please make sure they use a shielded cable. 

Shielded cable will reduce interference from 4G/5G, WiFi, BT and other wireless signal.  If your were in congested public transportation, the interference might come from other mobile phones around you.


----------



## gr8soundz

Got my pre-order in but just thought of question (probably for @Andykong ):

Not terribly important, but does the 'Mode' button also work for pausing/playing/skipping tracks?

Also, when used with Android phones, will in-line mic/remote cables work through the RU6's 3.5mm output?


----------



## twister6

gr8soundz said:


> Got my pre-order in but just thought of question (probably for @Andykong ):
> 
> Not terribly important, but does the 'Mode' button also work for pausing/playing/skipping tracks?
> 
> Also, when used with Android phones, will in-line mic/remote cables work through the RU6's 3.5mm output?



No playback control.


----------



## linux4ever

Musicteck has created a UPS tracking info for my RU6 order. So it is going to get shipped out today and expecting it to arrive in 2 days (USA)


----------



## blotmouse

linux4ever said:


> Musicteck has created a UPS tracking info for my RU6 order. So it is going to get shipped out today and expecting it to arrive in 2 days (USA)


When did you place your order? Mine is still in unfulfilled status.


----------



## linux4ever

blotmouse said:


> When did you place your order? Mine is still in unfulfilled status.


Nov 25


----------



## ssriram2791

Interesting.. I placed mine on 17th..Seems like their shipping policy is "Last come, first served"


----------



## blotmouse

linux4ever said:


> Nov 25





ssriram2791 said:


> Interesting.. I placed mine on 17th..Seems like their shipping policy is "Last come, first served"


Typical. I placed Nov. 17th as well. Must be that inbox sorting, lol.


----------



## Headcan

Ordered on 24th

Just received notice that a shipment from Musictech is on it’s way via DHL.


----------



## abitdeef

Mines got a tracking # also. I'm ready for some smoothness


----------



## alota

@Andykong  hi. Now the release is official, you know some E.U. seller? Thanks in advance


----------



## sneill321 (Nov 30, 2021)

alota said:


> @Andykong  hi. Now the release is official, you know some E.U. seller? Thanks in advance



German seller: https://cayin.com

I sent them email query and their reply on Monday 29th advised:
 "_it will be available by the end of next week.
You can pre order for 329€ (-3% pre-order discount) and free shipping within Germany._"

I replied asking if they ship for free within the EU as most of their other items are listed as " _Free shipping within the EU from 100€_"
I will reply back when/if I get a reply on shipping in EU.


----------



## alota

sneill321 said:


> German seller: https://cayin.com
> 
> I sent them email query and their reply on Monday 29th advised:
> "_it will be available by the end of next week.
> ...


Thanks a lot


----------



## hardpike

Mine is shipping today
ETA to UK Friday


----------



## Deleeh

sneill321 said:


> German seller: https://cayin.com
> 
> I sent them email query and their reply on Monday 29th advised:
> "_it will be available by the end of next week.
> ...


Hmm, I don't think they will do it if it means within Germany.
This means that there are still shipping charges, take a look at the page under shipping, it should be there.

I found another Swiss dealer but didn't look at the shipping options.
One option would be to compare and maybe pay less in import duties.
For Eu people the price is almost 1:1 at the moment if you compare the dollar.
And probably won't change much in the near future thanks to inflation.
That one could possibly make a bargain across the big river.


----------



## blotmouse

Received my ship notification as well.


----------



## stin8x

Measurements of RU6 are in: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/cayin-ru6/


----------



## someyoungguy (Nov 30, 2021)

Xmas just arrived early here is Shanghai 

Interesting surprise is the case comes with a few of these leather/3M stickers for magnetically attaching the RU6 to something.





Is there a recommended burn in/run in period for the RU6?


----------



## someyoungguy

Strangely I found that using the lightning-USB-C cable that came with my Violectric Chronos I was getting the lights showing up on the RU6, but no sound. Then, trying the Cayin cable, everything works. No idea why. Just a heads up in case others find they're not getting audio out of an iPhone.


----------



## HarveyLowis

someyoungguy said:


> Xmas just arrived early here is Shanghai
> 
> Interesting surprise is the case comes with a few of these leather/3M stickers for magnetically attaching the RU6 to something.
> 
> ...


is the case have magnet inside like W2 leather case?


----------



## Gaspar74

Is it possible to use as a standalone


----------



## IgeNeLL

Andykong said:


> The USB-C to USB-C cable provided in RU6 is shielded.  However that's a very short interconnect, we expect some users might need a longer USB-C to USB-C cable if they want to keep the DAP in backpack, and holding the RU6 to adjust volume while listening to their IEM on-the-go, or when they want to connect RU6 to as desktop computer.  For these reason, we want to remind our users that if the need to use a different USB-C to USB-C cable, please make sure they use a shielded cable.
> 
> Shielded cable will reduce interference from 4G/5G, WiFi, BT and other wireless signal.  If your were in congested public transportation, the interference might come from other mobile phones around you.


I want to ask about the specification.
Does it need OTG on any side of C -> C cable?


----------



## twister6

someyoungguy said:


> Strangely I found that using the lightning-USB-C cable that came with my Violectric Chronos I was getting the lights showing up on the RU6, but no sound. Then, trying the Cayin cable, everything works. No idea why. Just a heads up in case others find they're not getting audio out of an iPhone.



It is all about the quality of the cable.  Get one of those voltage/current measurement dongles you put in series with a cable so you can read the voltage.  A quality cable should read 5V coming from your iPhone/Android phone.  I tested DDHifi, OE Audio, and new Lotoo v2 usb-c to lightning cables - all reading 5V and working perfectly with RU6 and iPod Touch.  Then, I tested with L&P W2 lightning cable and Lotoo v1 (from S1) lightning cable, they are reading 3.8V and it will not work with RU6.  Now, the same W2 and Lotoo v1 usb-c to lightning cables work OK with corresponding W2 and S1 because those dongles tolerate 3.8V bus voltage.  But RU6 needs 5V, and you need to use a quality cable for it.  Cayin RU6 usb-c to lightning cable yields a proper 5V when connected to iPhone/iPod touch and works fine as well.


----------



## twister6

HarveyLowis said:


> is the case have magnet inside like W2 leather case?



Yes, the case has magnets and those stick on metal plates could be attached to the back of your smartphone.  This way you can attach RU6 in a case to the back of your smartphone or DAP.


----------



## Verificateur

stin8x said:


> Measurements of RU6 are in: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/cayin-ru6/


Tried to translate but my phone is acting up.
Could someone please shed some light what the impressions of RU6 are?


----------



## twister6

Verificateur said:


> Tried to translate but my phone is acting up.
> Could someone please shed some light what the impressions of RU6 are?



The article has no impressions, nothing about how it sounds or pairs up, just measurements which you can see from included graphs without a need for translation.  It's a well known hobby site dedicated to measurements of portable and desktop sources, nothing more or less.


----------



## stin8x (Dec 1, 2021)

Verificateur said:


> Tried to translate but my phone is acting up.
> Could someone please shed some light what the impressions of RU6 are?


I don’t speak Chinese and had to use Google translate also so take this with a grain of salt. The graphs/measurements are not impressive or even rather mediocre since he wasn’t able to evaluate it correctly due to this new tech (R2R?)

Hopefully someone will put out a review soon since I’m on the fence between W2-131 or this.


----------



## IgeNeLL

I think it is very sexy without the case 😄


----------



## If6was9

IgeNeLL said:


> I think it is very sexy without the case 😄


Please,
some impression on the sound ...
Is it sweet and analog, or what?
Thanks


----------



## stin8x

Comparisons between W2 and RU6 please.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 1, 2021)

someyoungguy said:


> Strangely I found that using the lightning-USB-C cable that came with my Violectric Chronos I was getting the lights showing up on the RU6, but no sound. Then, trying the Cayin cable, everything works. No idea why. Just a heads up in case others find they're not getting audio out of an iPhone.



Some cables are directional. Maybe switch ends? 

How's it sound  😀 😃 🙂 🙃

Oh iphone, ignore me lol. I was thinking you had a C to C cable.


----------



## abitdeef

If6was9 said:


> Please,
> some impression on the sound ...
> Is it sweet and analog, or what?
> Thanks



Probably as sweet as fine demerara 😀


----------



## If6was9

abitdeef said:


> Probably as sweet as fine demerara 😀


So, a more analog or digital sound?
Thanks


----------



## abitdeef

If6was9 said:


> So, a more analog or digital sound?
> Thanks



Ha ha, probably is the key word here as I don't have one. But I did stay at a holiday Inn last night 😉


----------



## someyoungguy

abitdeef said:


> Probably as sweet as fine demerara 😀


I think it's a bit too early for me to give a reliable impression of the sound  that's also why I was asking about burn in - I wonder how much it will change (if at all); I wouldn't want to mislead people on first impressions only to realize in two days it's altering.

I used to have N6ii/R01. It's a pity I don't have it here for side-by-side comparison. It was in many ways the most impressive sounding DAP I've heard. But I sold it largely because it felt like the music flowed so smoothly out of the R01 that it felt a little tooo relaxed/unhurried, and since I mainly listen to metal that presented something of a dilemma  But I'm not getting that feeling with the RU6 so far. The resolution is probably bit lower on the RU6 though, based on memory only of the R01 sound - but I wouldn't expect a dongle to sound quite the same.

So all I can really say so far is it sounds good  One thing that really stood out to me with the R01 and now I find the same with RU6 (I wonder if it's the same with all R2Rs) is that different albums have more of their own flavour. It's as if a delta-sigma DAC, or even FPGA like Mojo, has more a normalizing effect where different music is all herded into a similar sound. With the R01 and RU6 the differences between albums in tonality/mixing/instrument timbre are more noticeable than I'm used to hearing with other gear. Which can be good or bad, depending on how well an album is mixed!

The RU6 definitely drains my phone battery faster than the Violectric Chronos, and is a little warm to the touch after use, but certainly not as toasty as Mojo levels. Also, for reference, I'm only using the 3.5mm out as I don't have any balanced cables/headphones.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 1, 2021)

someyoungguy said:


> I think it's a bit too early for me to give a reliable impression of the sound  that's also why I was asking about burn in - I wonder how much it will change (if at all); I wouldn't want to mislead people on first impressions only to realize in two days it's altering.
> 
> I used to have N6ii/R01. It's a pity I don't have it here for side-by-side comparison. It was in many ways the most impressive sounding DAP I've heard. But I sold it largely because it felt like the music flowed so smoothly out of the R01 that it felt a little tooo relaxed/unhurried, and since I mainly listen to metal that presented something of a dilemma  But I'm not getting that feeling with the RU6 so far. The resolution is probably bit lower on the RU6 though, based on memory only of the R01 sound - but I wouldn't expect a dongle to sound quite the same.
> 
> ...



It's cool you're not finding it too smooth. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to enjoy this dongle. Thanks for your firsr impressions.


----------



## IgeNeLL

If6was9 said:


> Please,
> some impression on the sound ...
> Is it sweet and analog, or what?
> Thanks


I will give detail later.
First impression: (NOS)Dynamic is good, the macro dynamic is clear and impact(This is what impressed me). The structure and layer are quite clear. Voice is clean and organic. The top-end lacks airy and extension. I use stock C to C cable with MacBook pro 2019 16"


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 1, 2021)

Quick question to @Andykong, please: I see there is an RU6 driver for Windows on the Cayin official website, on the RU6 product page under ”Downloads (1)“. Is that a special driver, or is it the same as the one for the N6ii? In other words, if one has both the N6ii and the RU6, do I need two drivers on my PC or just one? Thanks.

EDIT: I do see the two driver downloads to have different sizes.


----------



## Andykong

111MilesToGo said:


> Quick question to @Andykong, please: I see there is an RU6 driver for Windows on the Cayin official website, on the RU6 product page under ”Downloads (1)“. Is that a special driver, or is it the same as the one for the N6ii? In other words, if one has both the N6ii and the RU6, do I need two drivers on my PC or just one? Thanks.
> 
> EDIT: I do see the two driver downloads to have different sizes.


They are different USB Audio drivers,  you need both drivers on your PC if you have both N6ii and RU6.


----------



## If6was9

I hope we can make a comparison with the S2, and understand which of the two reproduces a more analog and less digital sound.


----------



## twister6

stin8x said:


> Comparisons between W2 and RU6 please.





If6was9 said:


> I hope we can make a comparison with the S2, and understand which of the two reproduces a more analog and less digital sound.



I did some initial impressions with a brief comparison to W2 and S2 last week here in case if you missed my post.


----------



## twister6

IgeNeLL said:


> I will give detail later.
> First impression: (NOS)Dynamic is good, the macro dynamic is clear and impact(This is what impressed me). The structure and layer are quite clear. Voice is clean and organic. The top-end lacks airy and extension. I use stock C to C cable with MacBook pro 2019 16"



Just curious, when you say it lacks treble air/extension, relative to what other usb-dac dongle and using which IEMs?  Also, what is the source used to drive RU6 and do you have your source set to max volume?  And, how much burn in does RU6 demo you tried in the store has?  Discrete R-2R needs at least 100hrs before sound is finalized and you do need to set your source to max digital volume for the optimal performance.


----------



## Nostoi

twister6 said:


> OK, as promised, here are some of the notes I took while listening to RU6 final prototype sample I borrowed recently from Musicteck.  And, as the usual disclaimer, this is how _I hear_ it.
> 
> Was using RU6 (High Gain, NOS filter) with Traillii and First Times cable (4.4mm) connected to my aging Galaxy S9 (smartphone volume set to max) while streaming Amazon HD (192kHz flacs), volume matched in every comparison.
> 
> ...


The C9 pairing is interesting. I assume there's no actual line out on the RU6, but doesn't this double amping produce noise with the R2R architecture?


----------



## twister6

Nostoi said:


> The C9 pairing is interesting. I assume there's no actual line out on the RU6, but doesn't this double amping produce noise with the R2R architecture?



No noise that I heard, thus why I mentioned no distortion or artifacts when I tested it with R70x.  Correct, no LO in RU6, none of those dongles have dedicated LO, just not enough room.  With C9 by itself, I do hear waterfall hissing with sensitive IEMs, but that is irrelevant of analog source I feed into C9


----------



## Nostoi

twister6 said:


> No noise that I heard, thus why I mentioned no distortion or artifacts when I tested it with R70x.  Correct, no LO in RU6, none of those dongles have dedicated LO, just not enough room.  With C9 by itself, I do hear waterfall hissing with sensitive IEMs, but that is irrelevant of analog source I feed into C9


Good to hear. Because when I paired the R01 with the C9, it really didn't sound good - seem to lose definition and overall coherence. But if the RU6 pairs well, then that's good news. 

Awaiting on EU availability.


----------



## someyoungguy

Here's a few thoughts after a day's listening:

I love how it remembers the last settings between shutdowns/disconnects. Same volume, gain and mode; no more worrying about blowing my ears out when I reattach a dongle 
OS mode seems to give slightly sharper definition and edges to instruments and notes than NOS mode (as advertised). But even then OS doesn't sound over-etched or too precise or clinical as some sources can. I tending towards preferring OS.
To me, low gain with higher volume sounds better than high gain with a lower volume (to achieve the overall same output intensity). I'm using B&W P7s, which are easy to drive over-ear headphones. Although easy to drive I usually use them on a mid-higher gain setting with most sources, as I tend to find higher gain usually suits me better. That's how I've been using the RU6 most of the day. Out of curiosity I tried lower gain this evening and was surprised to find bigger dynamic swings and a better sense of blackness and definition. I've gone back and forth a few times and I swear it can't just be placebo either. Maybe it's something to do with the resistor ladder volume and signal attenuation, but it certainly sounds better to me with lower gain and a higher volume setting.
You can really listen quite loud with this thing \m/. Not that I've been purposely trying! But I've ended up unconsciously doing so; those dynamics can really drive up loud without the harshness that usually makes you reach for the volume down button. Fun times.


----------



## Andykong

IgeNeLL said:


> I want to ask about the specification.
> Does it need OTG on any side of C -> C cable?



You need OTG cable with RU6.  I believe ALL USB Audio device are operated under OTG setting.

on any side?  I didn't know we have to differentiate OTG USB cable into one side OTG or two sided OTG.  Can someone help me on this?


----------



## Andykong (Dec 1, 2021)

someyoungguy said:


> Xmas just arrived early here is Shanghai
> 
> Interesting surprise is the case comes with a few of these leather/3M stickers for magnetically attaching the RU6 to something.
> 
> ...



Yes, there is a piece of magnet at the back of the protective case.

With reference to R01, First 50 hours makes a lot of different, and the DAC will stable after 100 hours, so please give it a few day before you draw your conclusion, or return the dongle to the seller just in case you don't like it.


----------



## MarkParity

Andykong said:


> You need OTG cable with RU6.  I believe ALL USB Audio device are operated under OTG setting.
> 
> on any side?  I didn't know we have to differentiate OTG USB cable into one side OTG or two sided OTG.  Can someone help me on this?


OTG at both ends works fine for me. I see no reason to have OTG at one end only and potentially make the cable directional if an OTG connector is only used at one end and both ends works.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 1, 2021)

I don't know what the purpose of one way interconnects is but 2 of my nicer cables are one way. Woo audio and DD hifi. Always induced panic when I forgot that fact and put them the  wrong way around 😀


----------



## utdeep

Is there a way to get this into a mode where it works with devices like the Nintendo Switch?  This was an awesome feature of the Lotoo dongles.


----------



## If6was9

Having a Dragonfly Cobalt, in your opinion, what difference can there be compared to the RU6?


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 1, 2021)

If6was9 said:


> Having a Dragonfly Cobalt, in your opinion, what difference can there be compared to the RU6?



It's smaller, it's blue, and it's more expensive 😀

Ha ha, couldn't resist. You'll have to wait till someone can compare the two. Not many have the unit yet.


----------



## SeEnCreaTive

@Andykong I LOVE how straight up you are. Telling us the difficulties, and the "not particularly impressive" specs. Makes me know that this product was actually designed with real care. I think once my BTR1k finally wears out, this will be right at the top of my list for a replacement (Bluetooth is nice, but I can work around it)

I've always loved the idea of R2R dacs. Such an analog solution to a digital problem. I find them facinating.


----------



## Goofyboy84

ssriram2791 said:


> @Andykong
> 
> Congratulations ! Nearly half the power of R01 for about 40% of the price. This should be excellent for IEMs and headphones (especially > 100 dB/mW and < 50 ohms)


I have Custom JH Laylas being made as we speak, and I just returned my Audioquest Cobalt and going to buy this RU6. 😊 Just waiting for a couple of things to clear. Laylas are 20 ohm and 117 dB/mW. This should do well for them. My music source is my iPhone 12 Pro Max. I DO have the camera adaptor, so I can convert it to USB and also charge it at the same time. 😊


----------



## Blanka79

When can I buy this in Germany? Looks very promising.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

Goofyboy84 said:


> I have Custom JH Laylas being made as we speak, and I just returned my Audioquest Cobalt and going to buy this RU6. 😊 Just waiting for a couple of things to clear. Laylas are 20 ohm and 117 dB/mW. This should do well for them. My music source is my iPhone 12 Pro Max. I DO have the camera adaptor, so I can convert it to USB and also charge it at the same time. 😊


Congrats on both! 

From my side, I can say that almost anything can Drive the Laylas quite Loud.


----------



## If6was9 (Dec 1, 2021)

SeEnCreaTive said:


> I've always loved the idea of R2R dacs. Such an analog solution to a digital problem. I find them facinating.


Yes,
But now we have to understand if in the case of the RU6, it is actually like this when listening.
Is it analog?


----------



## sneill321

Blanka79 said:


> When can I buy this in Germany? Looks very promising.


refer my post nbr 405 = German seller: https://cayin.com

I sent them email query and their reply on Monday 29th advised:
"_it will be available by the end of next week.
You can pre order for 329€ (-3% pre-order discount) and free shipping within Germany._"


----------



## Goofyboy84

CrocodileDundee said:


> Congrats on both!
> 
> From my side, I can say that almost anything can Drive the Laylas quite Loud.


I’m hoping for a WOW factor. My previous is Westone UM3X universal. Just from iPhone and it’s 3.5mm to lightning dongle. 😊


----------



## SeEnCreaTive

If6was9 said:


> Yes,
> But now we have to understand if in the case of the RU6, it is actually like this when listening.
> Is it analog?


I'm not sure I understand your question

I was referring to how all R-2R type DACs work. Literally just using resistors in a cleaver pattern to convert a digital signal into an analog output


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

I got a shipping notice from Musicteck today.   I can't wait to hear it.


----------



## discord

Mine is on its way, woohoo.


----------



## Goofyboy84

CrocodileDundee said:


> Congrats on both!
> 
> From my side, I can say that almost anything can Drive the Laylas quite Loud.


Since you can see on how I’m having everything set up and will be able to charge the phone at the same time… how should I do the “burn in” process?? Certain sounds or frequencies at say medium volume for a few days, essentially? I don’t wanna turn the Laylas up all the way, cause I don’t want to mess them up… as they may not be in my hears during the initial burn in process. 😊 oh! And I’ll be running the 4.4mm 7 pin cable from JH also. I threw that in there today along with everything else. 😊


----------



## CrocodileDundee (Dec 1, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> Since you can see on how I’m having everything set up and will be able to charge the phone at the same time… how should I do the “burn in” process?? Certain sounds or frequencies at say medium volume for a few days, essentially? I don’t wanna turn the Laylas up all the way, cause I don’t want to mess them up… as they may not be in my hears during the initial burn in process. 😊 oh! And I’ll be running the 4.4mm 7 pin cable from JH also. I threw that in there today along with everything else. 😊


I’m not the best reference for burn in. For me if something needs burn in, the manufecturer must do it, not make us wait 100h after buying a product to be able to have optimal performance…So my burn in is in my years enjoying them. 

@twister6 mentioned 100h would be ideal for it.

I also think the volume level shouldn’t pass 75% during this period.


----------



## Goofyboy84

CrocodileDundee said:


> I’m not the best reference for burn in. For me if something needs burn in, hthe manufecturer must do it, not mke us wait 100h after buying a product to be able to have optimal performance…So my burn in is in my years enjoying them.
> 
> @twister6 mentioned 100h would be ideal for it.
> 
> I also think the volume level shouldn’t pass 75% during this period.


Fair enough. I wish I knew the “thread hold”
Of these monitors… as I don’t want to have a failed driver due to being too loud. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

What I mean is… would the IEMs themselves, be ok at 100% volume, in theory? Or no? That’s what I’m talking about. (My hearing isn’t 100%, so that’s partly why I’m asking). I don’t want them to distort, OR to hurt the amplifier… since that’s the topic here. 

Or would this be appropriate for another topic area of discussion? 🤷🏻‍♂️


----------



## theory_87

someyoungguy said:


> Strangely I found that using the lightning-USB-C cable that came with my Violectric Chronos I was getting the lights showing up on the RU6, but no sound. Then, trying the Cayin cable, everything works. No idea why. Just a heads up in case others find they're not getting audio out of an iPhone.


Can provide some comparison between the 2?


----------



## TomKorn

CrocodileDundee said:


> I’m not the best reference for burn in. For me if something needs burn in, the manufecturer must do it, not make us wait 100h after buying a product to be able to have optimal performance…So my burn in is in my years enjoying them.
> 
> @twister6 mentioned 100h would be ideal for it.
> 
> I also think the volume level shouldn’t pass 75% during this period.


I know that Cayin did burn in the R01 boards for like 150hrs in the factory. Maybe they do the same with the RU6? @Andykong


----------



## IgeNeLL

The blue case definitely more delicious. Haha. Just burn in for 5 hours. I will share the impression after 50hours.


----------



## named name

I picked up a RU6 locally last night and have noticed that playback stutters when adjusting volume. Anyone else experiencing this?


----------



## Goofyboy84

I think I’ll just let it burn in along with my Laylas at the same time. This way I can get the best possible sound with what I have. (As if it’s minute… for me anyway! Haha!) I’ll let it go around 50-75% of the volume. I’ll start a new general thread of my thoughts of BOTH the RU6 and Laylas and if I have any issues or not, etc. 😊


----------



## InvisibleInk (Dec 2, 2021)

named name said:


> I picked up a RU6 locally last night and have noticed that playback stutters when adjusting volume. Anyone else experiencing this?


That’s annoying. 🤨 What are you connecting the dongle to?


----------



## someyoungguy (Dec 2, 2021)

named name said:


> I picked up a RU6 locally last night and have noticed that playback stutters when adjusting volume. Anyone else experiencing this?


That's just the delay from the resistor ladder volume control isn't it? I think Cayin stated there would be a slight delay. I get the same, you press the volume change and half a second later it kicks in, or else hold down the volume button for a bigger change.


----------



## Skev

named name said:


> I picked up a RU6 locally last night and have noticed that playback stutters when adjusting volume. Anyone else experiencing this?


It's to mute the sound whilst switching resistors to prevent any clicking/popping come through I would imagine. Not an issue.


----------



## named name

someyoungguy said:


> That's just the delay from the resistor ladder volume control isn't it? I think Cayin stated there would be a slight delay. I get the same, you press the volume change and half a second later it kicks in, or else hold down the volume button for a bigger change.





Skev said:


> It's to mute the sound whilst switching resistors to prevent any clicking/popping come through I would imagine. Not an issue.



Thanks for that, I didn't pick that up from Cayin / Andy's previous posts.



InvisibleInk said:


> That’s annoying. 🤨 What are you connecting the dongle to?


Have connected to iPhone, PC, Sony A105 & P6000.

Other than that, I like the sound so far for what it is, particular pairing with FiR M4. Keeps the details and treble extension and speed, whilst ever so slightly smoothing out some of the harshness.


----------



## SHOOTINGTECHIE

someyoungguy said:


> Here's a few thoughts after a day's listening:
> 
> I love how it remembers the last settings between shutdowns/disconnects. Same volume, gain and mode; no more worrying about blowing my ears out when I reattach a dongle
> OS mode seems to give slightly sharper definition and edges to instruments and notes than NOS mode (as advertised). But even then OS doesn't sound over-etched or too precise or clinical as some sources can. I tending towards preferring OS.
> ...


Could you please try it on PC and with some games too , to check on latency ? 
Thanks


----------



## Andykong

Goofyboy84 said:


> Since you can see on how I’m having everything set up and will be able to charge the phone at the same time… how should I do the “burn in” process?? Certain sounds or frequencies at say medium volume for a few days, essentially? I don’t wanna turn the Laylas up all the way, cause I don’t want to mess them up… as they may not be in my hears during the initial burn in process. 😊 oh! And I’ll be running the 4.4mm 7 pin cable from JH also. I threw that in there today along with everything else. 😊





Goofyboy84 said:


> Fair enough. I wish I knew the “thread hold”
> Of these monitors… as I don’t want to have a failed driver due to being too loud. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️
> 
> What I mean is… would the IEMs themselves, be ok at 100% volume, in theory? Or no? That’s what I’m talking about. (My hearing isn’t 100%, so that’s partly why I’m asking). I don’t want them to distort, OR to hurt the amplifier… since that’s the topic here.
> ...



Nope, you cannot assume your IEM can sustain at 100% volume of RU6.

There is no such rule as the volume must pass 75% during burn in.  Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

First of all, take a look at the functional diagram below (available at opening post).  Only the Phone Amplifier and Unity Gain Amplifier are affected by the volume, the R-2R circuit, LPF, and Line Drivers are all 100% functional as long as there are designated signal processing.   

Highly-integrated semiconductors don't need long burn in hours.  They sounds good almost immediately.  Give it a day or two normal operation, they are very stable already.  That includes the LPF, Line Driver, Phone Amp. and Unity Gain Amplifier in the functional diagram.  

Discrete circuit is the reason that RU6 required longer burn in time than other Dongle DAC.  As explained above, you can set the volume at 10 and burn in the DAC circuit efficiently.   There is another discrete circuit in RU6:  the resistor array volume control, but since this is only a control circuit, burn in is relatively unimportant when compare to the discrete resistor ladder. 

Again, don't turn your RU6 to 100 when connect to your IEM unless you have heard the playback and confirmed they are within normal operation condition, this is high risk.


----------



## Andykong

Skev said:


> It's to mute the sound whilst switching resistors to prevent any clicking/popping come through I would imagine. Not an issue.





someyoungguy said:


> That's just the delay from the resistor ladder volume control isn't it? I think Cayin stated there would be a slight delay. I get the same, you press the volume change and half a second later it kicks in, or else hold down the volume button for a bigger change.


Thank you, your explanation is right on.    



named name said:


> Thanks for that, I didn't pick that up from Cayin / Andy's previous posts.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There were detail explanation regarding the volume control design and its short coming on the *opening post* , check it out if again when you have some free time, it is fairly informative.


----------



## IgeNeLL

named name said:


> I picked up a RU6 locally last night and have noticed that playback stutters when adjusting volume. Anyone else experiencing this?


It is for volume implementation. You can find the info in the offical website.


----------



## deafdoorknob

an interesting question is, how realistic is W2’s NOS emulation mode compared to the real thing @twister6 ? 

Cirrus Logic’s whitepaper on their faux NOS is fascinating btw


----------



## someyoungguy

SHOOTINGTECHIE said:


> Could you please try it on PC and with some games too , to check on latency ?
> Thanks


I was watching youtube on my PC with it and there's basically no lag. I wondered if perhaps a fraction of a second, but the sound seems almost, if not completely, aligned with speech.


----------



## twister6

deafdoorknob said:


> an interesting question is, how realistic is W2’s NOS emulation mode compared to the real thing @twister6 ?
> 
> Cirrus Logic’s whitepaper on their faux NOS is fascinating btw



I can only analyze by listening with my ears, those are my only "tools", and I try not to pretend to be an expert since DAP/dac/amp measurements are not my area of expertise   Regarding the effect of NOS implementation and how realistic it is in W2 (delta-sigma DAC) vs RU6 (discrete R-2R DAC), you probably will need a special setup to measure and analyze waveforms for comparison, and I still doubt it would be a fully objective comparison.


----------



## someyoungguy

theory_87 said:


> Can provide some comparison between the 2?


I'll try, difficult to find the right words!

One thing that stands out to me with the RU6 and did also with the R01 is the way the whole mid-lower section is presented. It's not that the frequency range is necessarily emphasized, but it feels fuller - almost as if something about the way the dynamics and decoding of the R2R pushes out the sound is different. Of course that may sound crazy, as a sound wave is a sound wave, but they _feel_ like they're pushing more air across the whole bass-mids, or there's more present in that part of the frequency spectrum than a typical delta-sigma DAC. In comparison, the Chronos sounds 'cleaner' or 'tidier' in its presentation in the bass and lower mids, as there's less fulling out the sound in those ranges - as if the instruments that are quieter in the mix are further down, allowing the more forward elements of the bass/mids to stand out more against a quieter backdrop, whereas with the R2R presentation instruments in the mids and lower, like guitars that are still ringing out, are further forward so that in general the R2R sound seems fuller. But one of the things I love about the Chronos is it has a very natural presentation of the upper mids and treble, so both actually come off with a lifelike timbre and natural sound, just in different ways.

In all honesty I'll probably keep both - the Chronos is great, has lower power draw and is a bit smaller for on the go use. RU6 - also great, in a slightly different way. Keep in mind I've still got plenty of burn to do on the RU6; if anything I suspect it will just get better.


----------



## theory_87

someyoungguy said:


> I'll try, difficult to find the right words!
> 
> One thing that stands out to me with the RU6 and did also with the R01 is the way the whole mid-lower section is presented. It's not that the frequency range is necessarily emphasized, but it feels fuller - almost as if something about the way the dynamics and decoding of the R2R pushes out the sound is different. Of course that may sound crazy, as a sound wave is a sound wave, but they _feel_ like they're pushing more air across the whole bass-mids, or there's more present in that part of the frequency spectrum than a typical delta-sigma DAC. In comparison, the Chronos sounds 'cleaner' or 'tidier' in its presentation in the bass and lower mids, as there's less fulling out the sound in those ranges - as if the instruments that are quieter in the mix are further down, allowing the more forward elements of the bass/mids to stand out more against a quieter backdrop, whereas with the R2R presentation instruments in the mids and lower, like guitars that are still ringing out, are further forward so that in general the R2R sound seems fuller. But one of the things I love about the Chronos is it has a very natural presentation of the upper mids and treble, so both actually come off with a lifelike timbre and natural sound, just in different ways.
> 
> In all honesty I'll probably keep both - the Chronos is great, has lower power draw and is a bit smaller for on the go use. RU6 - also great, in a slightly different way. Keep in mind I've still got plenty of burn to do on the RU6; if anything I suspect it will just get better.


Thank you. I suppose for ru6 you are running on balance mode?


----------



## If6was9

Blanka79 said:


> When can I buy this in Germany? Looks very promising.


Mine was shipped today from Germany


----------



## someyoungguy

theory_87 said:


> Thank you. I suppose for ru6 you are running on balance mode?


Just single-ended, haven’t got any balanced-input headphones at the moment.


----------



## alota

If6was9 said:


> Mine was shipped today from Germany


Please can you write the seller? Thank you


----------



## If6was9

alota said:


> Please can you write the seller? Thank you


https://cayin.com/

They have yet to update the site,
but they have it in stock


----------



## sneill321

Deleeh said:


> Hmm, I don't think they will do it if it means within Germany.
> This means that there are still shipping charges, take a look at the page under shipping, it should be there.
> 
> I found another Swiss dealer but didn't look at the shipping options.
> ...



Thanks but the problem buying from USA is shipping fees followed by /before Customs duty then  VAT

e.g Musictek - $249 + $50 shipping = $299
     then say 5% Duty --> $314
     then 20% VAT = $377 which is approx €332

Plus addition most couriers charge a processing fee... so no bargain unfortunatley


----------



## alota

If6was9 said:


> https://cayin.com/
> 
> They have yet to update the site,
> but they have it in stock


bought too orange case. thank you


----------



## Skev

sneill321 said:


> Thanks but the problem buying from USA is shipping fees followed by /before Customs duty then  VAT
> 
> e.g Musictek - $249 + $50 shipping = $299
> then say 5% Duty --> $314
> ...


I just ordered from here in the UK:

https://www.audioemotion.co.uk/cayin-ru6-32746-p.asp

£238 delivered to me. Not a bargain but I'm happy with that. 8-10 days before their stock arrives though.


----------



## If6was9

Is it possible to disable the volume keys on the RU6, and adjust it only via the app (UAPP)?


----------



## Andykong

If6was9 said:


> Is it possible to disable the volume keys on the RU6, and adjust it only via the app (UAPP)?


Read *Post#1**,* High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control section.


----------



## ssriram2791

Awesome out of box ! Time and again CAYIN is doing home run ! 

@Andykong  Why are you making us spend more money.. now R01 is tempting me


----------



## linux4ever

ssriram2791 said:


> Awesome out of box ! Time and again CAYIN is doing home run !
> 
> @Andykong  Why are you making us spend more money.. now R01 is tempting me


R01 is quite good. In fact after getting it, I barely listen to Lotoo PAW 600 & Sony WM1Z (these two were the most frequently used every day) because R01 sound is so addictive.


----------



## Alexzander

Hello, @twister6 !

May you please advise on how RU6 sound compared to Hiby RS6?


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 2, 2021)

Well well what do we have here? 😀 

Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better to me than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding. I'm comparing it with ibasso dx240 and in some aspects I like it more, but the ibasso has more depth and a touch more sparkle. At least I think it does lol. 

Sometimes switching back and forth too much your ears play tricks on you. 😉 😢


----------



## blotmouse

abitdeef said:


> Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding.


This was my assumption already. Great news.


----------



## stin8x

abitdeef said:


> Well well what do we have here? 😀
> 
> Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
> Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding.



I'm glad to hear that, would love to have some more comparisons with W2 from you.


----------



## abitdeef

stin8x said:


> I'm glad to hear that, would love to have some more comparisons with W2 from you.



After some more burn in. 😀 there can be some loud pops when changing volume at certain volume levels. But I guess that's how it had to be designed. 

Plus I just sold w2 so that is from memory but I have no doubt the sound stage and positioning are better on ru6. And there seems to be no loss of detail either. I'm using oversampling but it still seems more analog like.


----------



## Goofyboy84

abitdeef said:


> Well well what do we have here? 😀
> 
> Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
> Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding.


This excites me! I’ll be using my iPhone with a pair of custom Laylas that are being made right now also. I’m going to use the 4.4mm balanced cable. 

What IEMs are you using? Balanaced cable or no? And what phone? 

I posted my setup in here somewhere. iPhone12 pro max to camera adaptor to lightning charger (one side) usb to Cayin to 4.4mm balanced cable to JH Laylas to my ears. 😁😁😁😁

I’ll be purchasing the Cayin in the next day or so… and hopefully everything will arrive around the same time. 😁😁😁


----------



## linux4ever

I'll agree with the other two comments that it sounds awesome out of the box with no  burn-in. It wasn't so with R01. It took some burn-in for R01. Let's see how RU6 settles down after 25 hrs, 50 hrs and 100 hrs.

*Initial Impressions:*
The soundstage is wide and holographic. The bass is quite impactful and I expect it to settle down even better after burn-in.

Compared to R01 I hear a little more sparkle in the highs. R01 soundstage is a little more closer than RU6's soundstage. R01 sounds more organic/analog compared to non-burned-in RU6. 

I'm pairing it with Macbook Pro USB-C to USB-C and listening from the 4.4mm balanced output on RU6 with 64Audio A18t iem.

RU6 is small, compact and beautiful looking. I'm planning to use it without any case. Definitely worth the $250 asking price and more.


----------



## propolis12

abitdeef said:


> Well well what do we have here? 😀
> 
> Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
> Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding.


Are you comparing it to earmen sparrow balanced or single ended ?


----------



## alota

@Andykong  sorry if you wrote but the usb-c cable is included in the package?


----------



## ssriram2791

alota said:


> @Andykong  sorry if you wrote but the usb-c cable is included in the package?


Yes USB-C to USB-C plus USB-A adapter


----------



## musicday

Just wondering how is this dongle sounding for watching movies. At the moment I am using W2 and I am happy but if this is better in this department why not?


----------



## abitdeef

Goofyboy84 said:


> This excites me! I’ll be using my iPhone with a pair of custom Laylas that are being made right now also. I’m going to use the 4.4mm balanced cable.
> 
> What IEMs are you using? Balanaced cable or no? And what phone?
> 
> ...



Balanced, Samsung s21, AK ie8t ii, rose mini 3 pro and hiby beans. Should sound amazing with the Laylas. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the sound. Ha ha.


----------



## abitdeef

linux4ever said:


> I'll agree with the other two comments that it sounds awesome out of the box with no  burn-in. It wasn't so with R01. It took some burn-in for R01. Let's see how RU6 settles down after 25 hrs, 50 hrs and 100 hrs.
> 
> *Initial Impressions:*
> The soundstage is wide and holographic. The bass is quite impactful and I expect it to settle down even better after burn-in.
> ...



I myself am impressed with the sound stage and 3d like imaging. I never heard a dongle sound so 'big'.


----------



## abitdeef

musicday said:


> Just wondering how is this dongle sounding for watching movies. At the moment I am using W2 and I am happy but if this is better in this department why not?



I honestly can see this being great with movies because of the staging.


----------



## abitdeef

propolis12 said:


> Are you comparing it to earmen sparrow balanced or single ended ?



Balanced, I never used the se out.


----------



## Scuba Devils

linux4ever said:


> I'll agree with the other two comments that it sounds awesome out of the box with no  burn-in. It wasn't so with R01. It took some burn-in for R01. Let's see how RU6 settles down after 25 hrs, 50 hrs and 100 hrs.
> 
> *Initial Impressions:*
> The soundstage is wide and holographic. The bass is quite impactful and I expect it to settle down even better after burn-in.
> ...



I've a n6ii-Ti arriving very soon - how long did you find you needed to burn-in R01? RU6 tempting still but I'll get to know R01 first!


----------



## linux4ever

Scuba Devils said:


> I've a n6ii-Ti arriving very soon - how long did you find you needed to burn-in R01? RU6 tempting still but I'll get to know R01 first!


I put it in continuous play mode for 2 days straight. after 50 hours of burn-in, started hearing it on a regular basis. Also use the night times when you're sleeping to burn-in. It all adds up to get a ready player at the earliest


----------



## Deders

abitdeef said:


> Well well what do we have here? 😀
> 
> Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
> Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding. I'm comparing it with ibasso dx240 and in some aspects I like it more, but the ibasso has more depth and a touch more sparkle. At least I think it does lol.
> ...


Are you able to directly access the RU6, bypassing Android's audios using Neutron whilst still being able to use the EQ and panning in neutron?  I was able to do this with my LG V30


----------



## abitdeef

Deders said:


> Are you able to directly access the RU6, bypassing Android's audios using Neutron whilst still being able to use the EQ and panning in neutron?  I was able to do this with my LG V30



Yes!


----------



## Scuba Devils

linux4ever said:


> I put it in continuous play mode for 2 days straight. after 50 hours of burn-in, started hearing it on a regular basis. Also use the night times when you're sleeping to burn-in. It all adds up to get a ready player at the earliest



Perfect, thank you! Looking forward to it.


----------



## Goofyboy84

linux4ever said:


> I put it in continuous play mode for 2 days straight. after 50 hours of burn-in, started hearing it on a regular basis. Also use the night times when you're sleeping to burn-in. It all adds up to get a ready player at the earliest


For what it’s worth… that’s kinda my plan… just because. My Laylas and Cayin SHOULD arrive close to each other… just waiting for a refund to clear and I’ll purchase the Cayin… Laylas will be here in a couple of weeks… I plan on running them for 2-3 days straight while the phone is hooked up to the charger at the same time. 😊 I’ll try them in to make sure everything is in working order for a couple of minutes and that’s it… then just let them sit and burn in. 😊 What are you hooking your Cayin to? 😊


----------



## linux4ever

Goofyboy84 said:


> For what it’s worth… that’s kinda my plan… just because. My Laylas and Cayin SHOULD arrive close to each other… just waiting for a refund to clear and I’ll purchase the Cayin… Laylas will be here in a couple of weeks… I plan on running them for 2-3 days straight while the phone is hooked up to the charger at the same time. 😊 I’ll try them in to make sure everything is in working order for a couple of minutes and that’s it… then just let them sit and burn in. 😊 What are you hooking your Cayin to? 😊


The burn-in was for R01. For RU6, Out of the box it's been amazing. As I'm hearing it, it is getting burnt in. And when I'm not hearing them, I'll continue to burn them in. so the burn-in keeps happening.

I'm connecting RU6 to my Macbook Pro. Sounds so good. I'm liking what I'm hearing so far. I've a feeling that R01 & RU6 will be two slightly differing, yet compelling sound signatures.


----------



## Deders

abitdeef said:


> Yes!


Awesome, I have one on order in the UK, should arrive in 8-10 Days


----------



## ssriram2791

linux4ever said:


> I'll agree with the other two comments that it sounds awesome out of the box with no  burn-in. It wasn't so with R01. It took some burn-in for R01. Let's see how RU6 settles down after 25 hrs, 50 hrs and 100 hrs.
> 
> *Initial Impressions:*
> The soundstage is wide and holographic. The bass is quite impactful and I expect it to settle down even better after burn-in.
> ...


Excellent impressions ! Incredible staging with my Anole VX ! Absolutely gobsmacked !


----------



## abitdeef

Deders said:


> Awesome, I have one on order in the UK, should arrive in 8-10 Days



It exceeded my expectations. I actually thought it would be a little warmer and not quite as detailed as it is. Can't wait for more impressions. 😀


----------



## utdeep

I like the RU6 and it is a perfect fit in my Sennheiser IE900 case. 

I think it’s okay, but not as magical as the N6ii with R01 by any stretch of the imagination.  I don’t think it’s better than the W2 but just different.

I plan on keeping it for a while to see if it gets better as I acclimate to it.


----------



## bnupy

I think i agree with the earlier post on the ru6 and w2 comparision. The layering and staging is superior in the ru6.


----------



## bnupy

Im still waiting on burning in. I think the treble gets a bit tamed the more I burn in.


----------



## linux4ever

I played movies on Netflix and there was no lag. Perfect and good. 

R01 vs RU6 - I still am hearing certain similarities and certain differences. These are slightly varying sound signatures and share common traits being from the same family.

Like having both around to hear the different takes on the sound.


----------



## Jawis

Out of the box I'm feeling that it's sound signature is quite well balanced through the range.  
I got this to try, having listened to my friend's R01 and loved it. I loved the openness, clarity and layered upper end on his unit and so far I think the RU6 stays true to this. 
Comparing it to Cirrus-Logic, Akm and Sabre I think it tends towards Sabre in brightness. As much as I like the 9038 on my E1DA it's not one that it can listen to for long periods as it borders a little on too bright/harsh the longer I listen to it.  
I have been able keep plugged in to the RU6 without feeling fatigued so far. There is a sweetness and layering to the upper end that I'm liking so far. 
I'm happy with the lower end bass. My R01 friend says there is heavy bass slap, but I think it's the IEM more than the dongle.


----------



## felix3650 (Dec 3, 2021)

Is the glass slightly curved on the edges? Like those "2.5D" effects they claim on certain smartphones.

Seems like we have a contender to the W2. Other than stage and imaging, what do they differ/have in common? Soundwise I mean.


----------



## Nostoi

utdeep said:


> I like the RU6 and it is a perfect fit in my Sennheiser IE900 case.
> 
> I think it’s okay, but not as magical as the N6ii with R01 by any stretch of the imagination.  I don’t think it’s better than the W2 but just different.
> 
> I plan on keeping it for a while to see if it gets better as I acclimate to it.


More impressions of IE900 on RU6 - especially in comparison to R01 - would be welcome. 

I find the R01/IE900 pairing about perfect. If the RU6 pairing is merely okay, in comparison, then it sounds like a pass.


----------



## If6was9

However, based on what has been tentatively reported so far, the RU6 does not appear to have an "Analog" sound.
For me it's a shame if confirmed, but I hope I'm wrong


----------



## Andykong

If6was9 said:


> However, based on what has been tentatively reported so far, the RU6 does not appear to have an "Analog" sound.
> For me it's a shame if confirmed, but I hope I'm wrong


In your opinion, what is the attributes that contribute to the magic word "Analog" sound?


----------



## Andykong

linux4ever said:


> I put it in continuous play mode for 2 days straight. after 50 hours of burn-in, started hearing it on a regular basis. Also use the night times when you're sleeping to burn-in. It all adds up to get a ready player at the earliest



Exactly what I did to my RU6 and R01, sounds like this is a viable plan practically.


----------



## Andykong

utdeep said:


> I like the RU6 and it is a perfect fit in my Sennheiser IE900 case.
> 
> I think it’s okay, but not as magical as the N6ii with R01 by any stretch of the imagination.  I don’t think it’s better than the W2 but just different.
> 
> I plan on keeping it for a while to see if it gets better as I acclimate to it.



I sure hope the RU6 is not as magical as the N6ii with R01, otherwise someone in Cayin has make a terrible mistake in setting the pricing for RU6.


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> Awesome out of box ! Time and again CAYIN is doing home run !
> 
> @Andykong  Why are you making us spend more money.. now R01 is tempting me



Thank you, that means we are doing our job properly.    

Stay tune for our next new product.   Yes, we are working very hard.


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> Well well what do we have here? 😀
> 
> Burning the little baby in, out of the box it sounds wonderful. I mean really good with neutron.
> Sounds better with phone than ibasso dx240. Crap Pic. The unit is pretty nice looking IRL. Oh and yes even in this early stage this sounds better to me than W2 and S1 and earmen sparrow. Sounds better than most daps I've heard. Of course I'm just using iems nothing demanding. I'm comparing it with ibasso dx240 and in some aspects I like it more, but the ibasso has more depth and a touch more sparkle. At least I think it does lol.
> ...



Sounds better than most daps I've heard?  This is alarming, even with non-demanding IEM.  Thank you very much for your endorsement.


----------



## someyoungguy

If6was9 said:


> However, based on what has been tentatively reported so far, the RU6 does not appear to have an "Analog" sound.
> For me it's a shame if confirmed, but I hope I'm wrong


Still sounds quite analog to me, definite sibling similarities to R01.


----------



## linux4ever

If6was9 said:


> However, based on what has been tentatively reported so far, the RU6 does not appear to have an "Analog" sound.
> For me it's a shame if confirmed, but I hope I'm wrong


RU6 has the R2R analog/Organic sound. The vocals sound very good. In comparison to Cayin R01, the R01 sounds more analog. But it doesn't mean that RU6 isn't. So no need to worry about this.

RU6 has a top-end sparkle which R01 doesn't have.

Both sound signatures are equally enjoyable.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 3, 2021)

someyoungguy said:


> Still sounds quite analog to me, definite sibling similarities to R01.



Me too, I believe I even mentioned it. It sounds natural to me and not digital. And I suspect that will only improve. I mean the output is analog lol. He won't  really know unless he tries it himself 😉 

That's the only way to know for sure if it will fulfill his analog needs. That hole in his life void of analog. The extreme longing for analog, that can only be quenched by true analog- the most analog of sources. The analogy of analog if you will. 🤣 

If6was9- here's to you kid!


----------



## linux4ever

Jawis said:


> Out of the box I'm feeling that it's sound signature is quite well balanced through the range.
> I got this to try, having listened to my friend's R01 and loved it. I loved the openness, clarity and layered upper end on his unit and so far I think the RU6 stays true to this.
> Comparing it to Cirrus-Logic, Akm and Sabre I think it tends towards Sabre in brightness. As much as I like the 9038 on my E1DA it's not one that it can listen to for long periods as it borders a little on too bright/harsh the longer I listen to it.
> I have been able keep plugged in to the RU6 without feeling fatigued so far. There is a sweetness and layering to the upper end that I'm liking so far.
> I'm happy with the lower end bass. My R01 friend says there is heavy bass slap, but I think it's the IEM more than the dongle.


Out of the box, the mid-bass felt like it needs to settle down. The burn-in will help. Even then, out of the box hearing without burn-in had several thing sounding right. The percussion instruments had a lovely sound. the bass extension was very good too. It also was punchy without overwhelming. I wasn't coloring the sound and presenting what was there in the song.


----------



## utdeep

I am really struggling with whether this device is what I expected it to be.  Listening


Nostoi said:


> More impressions of IE900 on RU6 - especially in comparison to R01 - would be welcome.
> 
> I find the R01/IE900 pairing about perfect. If the RU6 pairing is merely okay, in comparison, then it sounds like a pass.



Well, it definitely isn’t as magical as the IE900 and R01 pairing.  It feels congested at times when I try to match volumes.  I don’t know if I like it as much as the W2 pairing.  Coming off the comparison, I realize that the R01 really is worth it’s weight in gold.  The RU6 makes me realize that I can’t just see R2R in the description of something and expect that it will be better than anything else.

It doesn’t work with the Nintendo Switch.  @Andykong - is this a capability that could be added to the device?  The Lotoo S1/S2 have this mode and I’m wondering if they might be my favorite dongles just for the versatility and the ease of updating firmware on a Mac.  Is there any info on updating RU6 firmware?


----------



## Nostoi

utdeep said:


> I am really struggling with whether this device is what I expected it to be.  Listening
> 
> 
> Well, it definitely isn’t as magical as the IE900 and R01 pairing.  It feels congested at times when I try to match volumes.  I don’t know if I like it as much as the W2 pairing.  Coming off the comparison, I realize that the R01 really is worth it’s weight in gold.  The RU6 makes me realize that I can’t just see R2R in the description of something and expect that it will be better than anything else.
> ...


Thanks, very interesting. Of course, as @Andykong says, given the price difference, the RU6 isn't going to compete with the R01. But then if one already has the R01 (and is perfectly happy with it), then maybe comparing them is going to be inherently a struggle. 

Seems to me that the RU6 would have merit depending on one's needs. But then again, given the R01 itself works as USB DAC via the N6ii, probably the RU6 is unnecessary for someone like me.


----------



## musicday

utdeep said:


> I am really struggling with whether this device is what I expected it to be.  Listening
> 
> 
> Well, it definitely isn’t as magical as the IE900 and R01 pairing.  It feels congested at times when I try to match volumes.  I don’t know if I like it as much as the W2 pairing.  Coming off the comparison, I realize that the R01 really is worth it’s weight in gold.  The RU6 makes me realize that I can’t just see R2R in the description of something and expect that it will be better than anything else.
> ...


Now with the latest firmware you can use W2 with Nintendo switch etc.
The UAC 1 mode been added.


----------



## Jawis

linux4ever said:


> Out of the box, the mid-bass felt like it needs to settle down. The burn-in will help. Even then, out of the box hearing without burn-in had several thing sounding right. The percussion instruments had a lovely sound. the bass extension was very good too. It also was punchy without overwhelming. I wasn't coloring the sound and presenting what was there in the song.


I'll attach a burn in cable and run it overnight. Have been listening to it for several hours already. 
Have been comparing it with my S1 with desktop running Audirvana. I'm getting a wider and fuller stage presence with the RU6. RU6 has a brighter sound to the S1 (EFX off), but I think it's because the RU6 really brings out the upper range. The percussion, cymbals, hihats, high notes sound all sound crisp and clear to me. All sparkle, nothing very sibilant has hit me yet. Perhaps there is more bass emphasis with the S1. Will see if some burn-in will change things in the bass department.


----------



## Jawis

felix3650 said:


> Is the glass slightly curved on the edges? Like those "2.5D" effects they claim on certain smartphones.
> 
> Seems like we have a contender to the W2. Other than stage and imaging, what do they differ/have in common? Soundwise I mean.



The glass edge is ever so slightly curved. Not sharp angled like you see on the S1


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 3, 2021)

Jawis said:


> I'll attach a burn in cable and run it overnight. Have been listening to it for several hours already.
> Have been comparing it with my S1 with desktop running Audirvana. I'm getting a wider and fuller stage presence with the RU6. RU6 has a brighter sound to the S1 (EFX off), but I think it's because the RU6 really brings out the upper range. The percussion, cymbals, hihats, high notes sound all sound crisp and clear to me. All sparkle, nothing very sibilant has hit me yet. Perhaps there is more bass emphasis with the S1. Will see if some burn-in will change things in the bass department.



Yes cymbals and hi hats really sound good on ru6. It sounds like actual metal being struck, not just a hi pitched fizzzz  sound. I'm using NOS now.


----------



## linux4ever

Yes there's a sparkle at the top end for sure in RU6. that's a big difference between RU6 & R01 that I hear from the get go.

@utdeep mentioned "It feels congested at times". Yes I can hear that when there are intense segments in the song. That's why I was mentioning that it needs time to settle down. waiting to hear after 50 hrs and 100 hours of usage to see if this improves. But this happens only on songs where there are lots happening in that segment of the song.

As of now Cayin R01 (with N6ii) > Cayin RU6 ~ Cayin N3Pro


----------



## abitdeef

linux4ever said:


> Yes there's a sparkle at the top end for sure in RU6. that's a big difference between RU6 & R01 that I hear from the get go.
> 
> @utdeep mentioned "It feels congested at times". Yes I can hear that when there are intense segments in the song. That's why I was mentioning that it needs time to settle down. waiting to hear after 50 hrs and 100 hours of usage to see if this improves. But this happens only on songs where there are lots happening in that segment of the song.
> 
> As of now Cayin R01 (with N6ii) > Cayin RU6 ~ Cayin N3Pro



I bet the R01 sounds sweet. Andy did say there is actual burn in on the resistor type dacs. I'd like to see them make a smaller r2r dap. Something that wouldn't be as heavy or expensive as n6ii+ R01.


----------



## ssriram2791

utdeep said:


> I am really struggling with whether this device is what I expected it to be.  Listening
> 
> 
> Well, it definitely isn’t as magical as the IE900 and R01 pairing.  It feels congested at times when I try to match volumes.  I don’t know if I like it as much as the W2 pairing.  Coming off the comparison, I realize that the R01 really is worth it’s weight in gold.  The RU6 makes me realize that I can’t just see R2R in the description of something and expect that it will be better than anything else.
> ...


If you like the synergy between R01 and IE900 very much, that is wonderful. I like synergy of RU6 with Anole VX much better than any of my dongles (W2, S1 to name a few). 

From a business strategy standpoint, if Cayin wants to appeal to mainstream audiences who may not have all the resources (a.k.a money) to buy $1519 DAP (N6ii+R01), they have found the middle ground by incorporating something in a dongle never done before ( L&P W2 btw and it is not inferior by any margin). 

I have all the high end stuff and I am not here comparing RU6 to them, because I understand the R&D that goes into every product determines the price point. As I said in one of my earlier post and further reiterated by @Andykong , if RU6 has to deliver a performance similar to R01, it needs to be priced appropriately . 

Lets all enjoy the music shall we !


----------



## linux4ever

abitdeef said:


> I bet the R01 sounds sweet. Andy did say there is actual burn in on the resistor type dacs. I'd like to see them make a smaller r2r dap. Something that wouldn't be as heavy or expensive as n6ii+ R01.


I was thinking along similar lines. It would be nice to have a microsd card slot and a simple navigation to navigate the folders. In the same form factor as RU6 and priced $300 or in the form factor of Cayin N3 pro with less thickness and priced similar to N3Pro ($375-$400).


----------



## abitdeef

linux4ever said:


> I was thinking along similar lines. It would be nice to have a microsd card slot and a simple navigation to navigate the folders. In the same form factor as RU6 and priced $300 or in the form factor of Cayin N3 pro with less thickness and priced similar to N3Pro ($375-$400).



Yes thinner and maybe even a bit shorter with full Android for 400 lol. One can dream.


----------



## twister6

musicday said:


> Now with the latest firmware you can use W2 with Nintendo switch etc.
> The UAC 1 mode been added.



Just out of my own personal curiosity cause a few people asked me about usb dac dongles and Nintendo Switch compatibility, what is the advantage of using audiophile grade dongles with Nintendo Switch (in UAC1 mode)?  The reason I'm asking, my youngest loves playing Mario cart on his Switch.  So, is there anything else you can run on Nintendo Switch that needs a higher sound quality, besides playing video games?


----------



## abitdeef

twister6 said:


> Just out of my own personal curiosity cause a few people asked me about usb dac dongles and Nintendo Switch compatibility, what is the advantage of using audiophile grade dongles with Nintendo Switch (in UAC1 mode)?  The reason I'm asking, my youngest loves playing Mario cart on his Switch.  So, is there anything else you can run on Nintendo Switch that needs a higher sound quality, besides playing video games?



No n





twister6 said:


> Just out of my own personal curiosity cause a few people asked me about usb dac dongles and Nintendo Switch compatibility, what is the advantage of using audiophile grade dongles with Nintendo Switch (in UAC1 mode)?  The reason I'm asking, my youngest loves playing Mario cart on his Switch.  So, is there anything else you can run on Nintendo Switch that needs a higher sound quality, besides playing video games?



No, not really, you can watch Netflix but it's not as nice as on your phone. It's primarily for gaming.


----------



## HiFlight (Dec 3, 2021)

I received my RU6 earlier today and have spent the hours since conducting listening tests and power measurements.  The RU6 clearly is an upper tier device from a sound standpoint with the flexibility to offer NOS and OS modes.  While both sound good, I find my preferences to be NOS for large instrumental concert hall genres while to me, the OS mode seems more realistic for more intimate acoustic and jazz genres.
Contrary to some earlier posts, I have found volume adjustments to be totally silent and muting is imperceptible during adjustments.

I will avoid any subjective comparison of sound between the RU 6 and several of my other favorite dongles as personal opinions will vary due to listener preferences and hearing anatomy, however I thought power comparisons between dongles might be informative to all.

I streamed my own lossless music files through each device with the volume set to my own comfort level and didn't make changes between dongle swaps.

The RU6 was set at Low gain, NOS and 70 on the volume scale using the SE output. The comparison dongles had no adjustment settings.  SE was chosen as not all of the dongles have a balanced output.

The IEM used for measurements was my Shozy Black Hole as these are neither particularly difficult to drive nor are they super efficient.  Impedance is listed as 16 ohms.

The results are listed from most to least power draw:

Hidizs S9 Pro.          140 MA,  .68 W
RU6 2-R2.                 120MA,  .59 W
EarMen Sparrow.       90MA,  .44W
Questyle M12.           90MA,  .44 W
Periodic Rhodium.   20MA,.  .10 W

Hopefully, these comparisons will prove useful in determining the suitability of ones source devices.


----------



## abitdeef

Mine pops sometimes around 50 volume and 20 volume does anyone else's do this?  Andy is this normal? What's weird is it doesn't do it everytime changing volume. It's quite a loud pop.


----------



## stin8x (Dec 3, 2021)

Looks like W2 is still superior after all, here is an impression from a user posted on a rather popular audio discussion forum in China. Below is the post translated into English using Google Translate.




> [Pre-declaration] The following is only representative of personal opinions. Personal level is extremely limited, and knowledge and level are as low as that. The following assessment has no merit and is only used for personal entertainment. If you have any doubts, it is your right, and it is my honor if you have any recognition.
> 
> [Repertoire for testing]
> 1. Yanni Acropolis concert CD track
> ...



Source: http://www2.erji.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2248411


----------



## abitdeef

Lol, yep that settles it, W2 is king. Although not to my ears 😉 This place.............. 😀

So nobody else experienced popping while changing volume?


----------



## stin8x

abitdeef said:


> Lol, yep that settles it, W2 is king. Although not to my ears 😉 This place.............. 😀
> 
> So nobody else experienced popping while changing volume?



Lol that's just my opinion, one thing for sure though the leather case on the W2 looks way better and more premium


----------



## bnupy

stin8x said:


> Looks like W2 is still superior after all, here is an impression from a user posted on a rather popular audio discussion forum in China. Below is the post translated into English using Google Translate.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So W2 sounds best for classical. Thats sort of what I inferred from the test tracks.


----------



## Stuff Jones

abitdeef said:


> I bet the R01 sounds sweet. Andy did say there is actual burn in on the resistor type dacs. I'd like to see them make a smaller r2r dap. Something that wouldn't be as heavy or expensive as n6ii+ R01.



N3Pro w/R2R please.


----------



## abitdeef

stin8x said:


> Lol that's just my opinion, one thing for sure though the leather case on the W2 looks way better and more premium



You have the ru6?


----------



## Stuff Jones

stin8x said:


> Looks like W2 is still superior after all, here is an impression from a user posted on a rather popular audio discussion forum in China. Below is the post translated into English using Google Translate.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks. Anyone have a  translation for the column headings?


----------



## propolis12

Would like to see serious comparison with earmen sparrow


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 3, 2021)

So the S2 gets 2 out of 5 stars? Not that it really matters.


----------



## Zachik

Stuff Jones said:


> N3Pro w/R2R please.


That is EXACTLY what I asked from @Andykong for a few weeks ago... 
(and a better processor to fix the crappy GUI of the N3Pro)


----------



## Stuff Jones

Zachik said:


> That is EXACTLY what I asked from @Andykong for a few weeks ago...
> (and a better processor to fix the crappy GUI of the N3Pro)



Not at the expense of already mediocre battery life though, please! And don't make it a giant brick either... Lol.


----------



## If6was9

Waiting for the courier, for a comparison with the DF Cobalt


----------



## abitdeef

Stuff Jones said:


> Not at the expense of already mediocre battery life though, please! And don't make it a giant brick either... Lol.



That would be very cool, I love this little thing but I hate dongles, (disconnect/connect) I had to check it out. But I'd rather have an all in one. Plus I don't want to buy n6ii and R01 because of expense and bulk/weight. 

So hopefully


----------



## SemiAudiophile (Dec 3, 2021)

Stuff Jones said:


> N3Pro w/R2R please.


Thats what I'm waiting for...N3ii w/ R2R, tube output, direct streaming, and MQA. 

Actually I'd be fine if it used Sabre or Cirrus logic dac chip. R2R + tube might be too warm. MQA is not necessary, but would be nice.


----------



## utdeep

stin8x said:


> Lol that's just my opinion, one thing for sure though the leather case on the W2 looks way better and more premium


The leather case on the W2 is garbage.  What you don’t see is the place where it just put beyond the screen.


----------



## JasonLucas

Andykong said:


> While we are busy working on our new flagship products, we have also devoted a lot of resource to pass down our new technologies to more affordable applications.  Our R-2R based R01 Audio Motherboards for N6ii was well-received by the Personal Audio community.  While a lot of users urged us to develop a high-end R-2R DAP with latest CPU and software technologies, our priority is to make the R-2R technologies we developed for N6ii more widely available before we move to another high-end R-2R DAP.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


love mine so far! made a quick first impressions and unboxing video


----------



## Jawis (Dec 4, 2021)

Used the RU6 tethered to my Note20 Ultra non-stop for 2 hours while walking about town today. Went from 77-46%. For the SQ I'm getting, 15%/hour I think is quite acceptable.

Was using 4.4mm connection. Was listening to Tidal. Music was mostly downloaded, so minimal streaming.  
Watched the review that was put up here recently on YouTube, so some streaming done there. 
@JasonLucas  , great review.


----------



## HarveyLowis

twister6 said:


> Just out of my own personal curiosity cause a few people asked me about usb dac dongles and Nintendo Switch compatibility, what is the advantage of using audiophile grade dongles with Nintendo Switch (in UAC1 mode)?  The reason I'm asking, my youngest loves playing Mario cart on his Switch.  So, is there anything else you can run on Nintendo Switch that needs a higher sound quality, besides playing video games?


For me, it can drive hard to drive / using 4.4 balance earphone with switch / ps5.


----------



## gr8soundz

abitdeef said:


> Yes cymbals and hi hats really sound good on ru6. It sounds like actual metal being struck, not just a hi pitched fizzzz  sound. I'm using NOS now.



This is one of the 1st qualities I always notice about R2R dacs. I grew up around live music and (by my ears) audio usually sounds more accurate out of R2R.

The RU6 is my 4th R2R dac and the above holds true for it too imo. Received it earlier today (yesterday by the clock now) and finally got a chance for some serious listening. Still need to put some hours on it before making conclusions but so far I'm impressed. Currently have UAPP playing to my Sony Z7s balanced and wondering if I'll manage to put the RU6 down before the sun comes up.....



Spoiler: My short R2R rant:



NOS is also the way to go imo. R2R doesn't leave behind bits like delta sigma designs with their most significant bits processing that requires oversampling and noise shaping to recover the sound back to something listenable. Make no mistake, there's a good amount of DS gear that does a superb (sometimes preferable) job of converting audio but I prefer R2R since first hearing what it could do. I just think many people have become accustomed to DS since it probably makes up more than 95% (my guess) of the market and that oversampled, sometimes airier sound can be just as addictive.

As for measurements, I get it:  Some of us have fewer ways to try gear before purchasing so our research becomes a sort of shopping for audio by numbers. Then I recall that even the best, six-figure vinyl rig can measure worse than a cheap DS dac. Those numbers can be akin to choosing a Tesla over the latest Ferrari for laps around the Nurburgring just because the Tesla _measures_ better from 0-60. There's much more to the immeasurable enjoyment we crave.


----------



## justsomesonyfan (Dec 4, 2021)

Stuff Jones said:


> N3Pro w/R2R please.


please god yes. powerful cheap r2r + tubes, that'd be too much value in one device!


----------



## Blanka79

alota said:


> Please can you write the seller? Thank you


https://cayin.com
Official German Cayin store. Now the offer it


----------



## stin8x (Dec 4, 2021)

abitdeef said:


> You have the ru6?


Believe me when I say this. I might look like a shill for W2 because I seem to bring up W2 everytime I have a chance, but hear me out: I bought the UM Mest MKII and it arrives next week and I have been eyeing on the RU6 and W2 for quite some time now. The thing is, the new revision of W2 which is the W2-131 was said to be released this December but god knows when exactly and still not available to pre-order. So by the time when I got my Mest MKII in my hands (sometime next week), I have nothing to pair with them, nothing due to the 4.4 BAL output and my phone only has Lightning connector. So I was really hoping the RU6 could somehow sound better than the W2 (which is available everywhere to buy where I live, also much cheaper compared to the W2). But the recent reviews don't seem so hot about it, though I plan on demo'ing them tomorrow to see it for myself. But still, really wish the R2R architecture could somehow blow the W2 out of the water lol, but it couldn't I guess.


----------



## Vignelli

gr8soundz said:


> This is one of the 1st qualities I always notice about R2R dacs. I grew up around live music and (by my ears) audio usually sounds more accurate out of R2R.
> 
> The RU6 is my 4th R2R dac and the above holds true for it too imo. Received it earlier today (yesterday by the clock now) and finally got a chance for some serious listening. Still need to put some hours on it before making conclusions but so far I'm impressed. Currently have UAPP playing to my Sony Z7s balanced and wondering if I'll manage to put the RU6 down before the sun comes up.....
> 
> ...


how do you think about r2r in ru6 and terra player?.. 
does ru6 close in sq?


----------



## JasonLucas

Jawis said:


> Used the RU6 tethered to my Note20 Ultra non-stop for 2 hours while walking about town today. Went from 77-46%. For the SQ I'm getting, 15%/hour I think is quite acceptable.
> 
> Was using 4.4mm connection. Was listening to Tidal. Music was mostly downloaded, so minimal streaming.
> Watched the review that was put up here recently on YouTube, so some streaming done there.
> @JasonLucas  , great review.


Thanks man!


----------



## Andykong (Dec 4, 2021)

stin8x said:


> Believe me when I say this. I might look like a shill for W2 because I seem to bring up W2 everytime I have a chance, but hear me out: I bought the UM Mest MKII and it arrives next week and I have been eyeing on the RU6 and W2 for quite some time now. The thing is, the new revision of W2 which is the W2-131 was said to be released this December but god knows when exactly and still not available to pre-order. So by the time when I got my Mest MKII in my hands (sometime next week), I have nothing to pair with them, nothing due to the 4.4 BAL output and my phone only has Lightning connector. So I was really hoping the RU6 could somehow sound better than the W2 (which is available everywhere to buy where I live, also much cheaper compared to the W2). But the recent reviews don't seem so hot about it, though I plan on demo'ing them tomorrow to see it for myself. But still, really wish the R2R architecture could somehow blow the W2 out of the water lol, but it couldn't I guess.


I see, so you don't have RU6.  Thank you for your clarification.


----------



## stin8x (Dec 4, 2021)

Andykong said:


> I see, so you don't have RU6.  Thank you for your clarification.


When did I ever mention that I have an RU6? Nice assumption you got there bud.


----------



## Nostoi

stin8x said:


> When did I ever mention that I have an RU6? Nice assumption you got there bud.


Maybe because of your repeated declarations that the W2 blows the RU6 out of the water, which might just suggest you've heard the RU6. 

But it turns out you just read a list on the interwebz by some random dude.

Top tip - decide for yourself after hearing for yourself, bud.


----------



## Verificateur (Dec 4, 2021)

Expecting to get my RU6 in the coming days.

Anyone here pairing them with Sony IER-Z1R? I have heard that they benefit from some extra power.

Need some advice on whether people mostly use High gain (does it give something extra beyond just volume on the RU6? @Andykong ), or is it more beneficial to use Low gain unless I need the volume? Thanks in advance!


----------



## stin8x (Dec 4, 2021)

Nostoi said:


> Maybe because of your repeated declarations that the W2 blows the RU6 out of the water, which might just suggest you've heard the RU6.
> 
> But it turns out you just read a list on the interwebz by some random dude.
> 
> Top tip - decide for yourself after hearing for yourself, bud.


Actually I expected the RU6 would blow the W2 out of the water so you might want to read my post again lol

Also the graphs of RU6 look horrible but yeah, I still need to hear it myself


----------



## kenz

There’s so much context that need to be addressed with the whole “Cayin RU6 versus Luxury & Precision W2” topic.

The RU6 is about USD 249 and W2 is USD 299.
Cayin has embarked on the R-2R tech in 2020 (Andy correct me if I’m mistaken). 
Luxury & Precision launched their R-2R player, the P6, almost a year prior to Cayin’s R01 module/N6ii Ti R01. 

Since then, L&P launched the W1 and W2, both off the shelf dac solutions, with W2 gaining more popularity thanks to its incredible performance. And Cayin only just days ago, launched this little dongle called the RU6, R-2R goodness packed in a tiny shell. 

The L&P W2 is very impressive and tuned very very R-2R sounding/tonality. That speaks volumes of the team in L&P. 
However, the team at Cayin should be given extra credit and applause, for launching what is perhaps, the World’s FIRST R-2R true dongle sized solution (all others a bricks by comparison). Ahead of other establishments more mature in their portable R-2R solutions. 

Now comes the most important part, the sound. 
R-2R needs time to mature, and any impressions right out of the box, is highly inaccurate. The RU6 sound shifted at the 3 hr mark and again at the 10 hr mark. Recommended run-in takes 50/100/200 hrs to reach sound maturity. 

For me, the RU6 at the 10 hr mark, tonality, staging and layering, has already matched W2 which has over 200 hrs behind it.

The question is, is the R-2R sound for YOU?


----------



## HiFlight

Vignelli said:


> how do you think about r2r in ru6 and terra player?..
> does ru


----------



## HiFlight

Funny you should ask that!  I had a Tera Player for quite some time and I was just thinking how similar the RU2 sounds in comparison to what I remember from the Tera!


----------



## abitdeef

stin8x said:


> Believe me when I say this. I might look like a shill for W2 because I seem to bring up W2 everytime I have a chance, but hear me out: I bought the UM Mest MKII and it arrives next week and I have been eyeing on the RU6 and W2 for quite some time now. The thing is, the new revision of W2 which is the W2-131 was said to be released this December but god knows when exactly and still not available to pre-order. So by the time when I got my Mest MKII in my hands (sometime next week), I have nothing to pair with them, nothing due to the 4.4 BAL output and my phone only has Lightning connector. So I was really hoping the RU6 could somehow sound better than the W2 (which is available everywhere to buy where I live, also much cheaper compared to the W2). But the recent reviews don't seem so hot about it, though I plan on demo'ing them tomorrow to see it for myself. But still, really wish the R2R architecture could somehow blow the W2 out of the water lol, but it couldn't I guess.



All this is pointless, one person marked it higher based on who knows what. One person is undecided and like his R06 better and says ru6 doesn't sound like it. No surprise there as the R01 is pushing more power. So that's hardly a landslide for W2 sounding better. It's all subjective anyways but there's 3 people in this thread who like the sound or ru6 better. 

So you post about people preferring w2 is just silly. W2 is a nice dongle, but there's a certain sound quality- naturalness to the ru6 that I really like. Plus the staging and imaging is better on ru6 to me. Plus there's the burn in factor of all the resistors. I expect it to open up even more. 

Best thing you can do is try them both yourself. But know that demo probably won't sound like one with 200 hours on it. If you really want the bestest sound by something like an ibasso dx240 or the n6ii with r01 or the n8, zx1 calyx m etc. 

This isn't w2 thread, comparisons are good but you don't even have ru6, or w2 so like I said pointless.


----------



## stin8x

abitdeef said:


> All this is pointless, one person marked it higher based on who knows what. One person is undecided and like his R06 better and says ru6 doesn't sound like it. No surprise there as the R01 is pushing more power. So that's hardly a landslide for W2 sounding better. It's all subjective anyways but there's 3 people in this thread who like the sound or ru6 better.
> 
> So you post about people preferring w2 is just silly. W2 is a nice dongle, but there's a certain sound quality- naturalness to the ru6 that I really like. Plus the staging and imaging is better on ru6 to me. Plus there's the burn in factor of all the resistors. I expect it to open up even more.
> 
> ...


Yeah you are right, I should calm myself and try hearing both myself, but please don’t say things like “You don’t own one so your point is invalid” which is probably true but all I did in this thread is posting other’s comparisons. And the whole “burn-in” thing sounds like a myth to me, but still, I’m willing to learn…


----------



## justsomesonyfan

stin8x said:


> Yeah you are right, I should calm myself and try hearing both myself, but please don’t say things like “You don’t own one so your point is invalid” which is probably true but all I did in this thread is posting other’s comparisons. And the whole “burn-in” thing sounds like a myth to me, but still, I’m willing to learn…


the problem was when you used other's comparison and then jumped to a conclusion and used it as your own opinion. the comparisons are there but you, as a person that did not hear both, still cannot give a proper personal opinion. it can be misleading.


----------



## Nostoi

stin8x said:


> Yeah you are right, I should calm myself and try hearing both myself, but please don’t say things like “You don’t own one so your point is invalid” which is probably true but all I did in this thread is posting other’s comparisons. And the whole “burn-in” thing sounds like a myth to me, but still, I’m willing to learn…


It's not complicated. Demo for yourself. Until then, any "impressions" you give are pointless conjecture.


----------



## stin8x

justsomesonyfan said:


> the problem was when you used other's comparison and then jumped to a conclusion and used it as your own opinion. the comparisons are there but you, as a person that did not hear both, still cannot give a proper personal opinion. it can be misleading.


You are right.


Nostoi said:


> It's not complicated. Demo for yourself. Until then, any "impressions" you give are pointless conjecture.


I never gave any impressions so stop putting words into others’ mouths.


----------



## Nostoi

stin8x said:


> You are right.
> 
> I never gave any impressions so stop putting words into others’ mouths.


Exactly hence why I phrased it as "impressions."


----------



## utdeep

You absolutely cannot use other people’s impressions to judge anything in this hobby.  You cannot share them as facts.  However, you can learn a lot about whether a headphone/amp is for you if a reviewer has similar tastes or can describe sound in a way that is relevant to you.  

I liked the s1 more than the W2 on first listen.  I liked the W2 more than the RU6 on first listen.  I know I walked into my experience with the RU6 expecting 60-70% of the N6ii with R01 and that’s not what I have right now.

I don’t believe in equipment burn in as much as I believe in brain burn in.  I’m going to give the RU6 a lot of time before I decide to make any changes.  Unfortunately, that might mean I spend a little less time with the R01.

I hope they implement UAC1 mode!  I can’t believe I sold my W2 before that happened.


----------



## emilsoft

I don’t think I’ve read any reviews that say ru6 is worse sounding than w2. In fact I’ve seen two new first impression videos on YouTube both positive about the ru6. I have it arriving soon here and I will post my first impressions vs earmen sparrow, Qudelix and Sony ZX507. If I’m honest I do expect it to beat all of those in terms of natural/organic/smooth sound, my expectations are high in 2021 for portable sources R2R or not


----------



## abitdeef

stin8x said:


> Yeah you are right, I should calm myself and try hearing both myself, but please don’t say things like “You don’t own one so your point is invalid” which is probably true but all I did in this thread is posting other’s comparisons. And the whole “burn-in” thing sounds like a myth to me, but still, I’m willing to learn…



Well normally I would say burn in is more mental than anything. But in the case of r2r I can see some change with all the resistor ladders. And I only saw one comparison? This thing is new so it will take some time for lots of data to come in. 

And as pointless- I'm referring to the fact that the only opinion that will really matter in the end is yours. After hearing the ru6 I want a r2r dap by cayin. I'm not big on dongles although I think they're cool because they're small. But the unplugging and re connecting can get tedious to me. 

Ymmv. But the ru6 imo is really exciting and I can't wait to see what's coming down the pike.


----------



## twister6

stin8x said:


> You are right.
> 
> I never gave any impressions so stop putting words into others’ mouths.



As others already pointed out, people misinterpreted what you have said but you already cleared it out that _your_ opinion is based on a single point impression by _someone else_, not your own experience since you don't have RU6.

To add to this, since I shared my early impressions a few weeks ago comparing RU6, W2, and S2, and now have the official production RU6 review sample which is on burn in, my initial impressions still hold true.  If you are after the extra _functionality_ as your top priority, S2 will lead the way (remote play/pause/skip, MQA 4x, and UAC1 mode to connect to your Nintendo Switch).  If you want the _top sound_, RU6 and W2 edges ahead of S2.  Now, between RU6 and W2, I still find them to have a very similar tonality and overall signature, but RU6 has better soundstage expansion and more 3D imaging.

And, regarding the _new_ W2, also cased W2-131.  It was released because L&P having a problem sourcing CS43198 DACs, so they switched to CS43131 DAC, all due to chip shortage.  But I also heard (not my impression, but someone else's ), they finetuned it to make sure it sounds close to the original DAC.

Regarding measurements of RU6, while I'm not an expert on dap/dac measurements, it has been pointed out by others that discrete R-2R dacs don't measure as good as delta-sigma dacs so it's not a fair a/b comparison by numbers if you are only going by "measurements".  I can only speak from my personal first hand/ear experience where I have both and they both sound very close tested with my IEMs from 4.4mm BAL output, and I even find RU6 to be ahead due to its soundstage/imaging.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 4, 2021)

abitdeef said:


> Well normally I would say burn in is more mental than anything. But in the case of r2r I can see some change with all the resistor ladders. And I only saw one comparison? This thing is new so it will take some time for lots of data to come in.
> 
> And as pointless- I'm referring to the fact that the only opinion that will really matter in the end is yours. After hearing the ru6 I want a r2r dap by cayin. I'm not big on dongles although I think they're cool because they're small. But the unplugging and re connecting can get tedious to me.
> 
> Ymmv. But the ru6 imo is really exciting and I can't wait to see what's coming down the pike.



And I will say I like expat Japan and twisters style of reviews because instead of a ranking or score it's more like real time moment to moment comparisons as to what they're experiencing with the new gears. Just like we all do when we get a new toy and start to check it out 😀

Oh deer, I quoted my post instead of editing it 😗


----------



## stin8x (Dec 4, 2021)

twister6 said:


> As others already pointed out, people misinterpreted what you have said but you already cleared it out that _your_ opinion is based on a single point impression by _someone else_, not your own experience since you don't have RU6.
> 
> To add to this, since I shared my early impressions a few weeks ago comparing RU6, W2, and S2, and now have the official production RU6 review sample which is on burn in, my initial impressions still hold true.  If you are after the extra _functionality_ as your top priority, S2 will lead the way (remote play/pause/skip, MQA 4x, and UAC1 mode to connect to your Nintendo Switch).  If you want the _top sound_, RU6 and W2 edges ahead of S2.  Now, between RU6 and W2, I still find them to have a very similar tonality and overall signature, but RU6 has better soundstage expansion and more 3D imaging.
> 
> ...





abitdeef said:


> Well normally I would say burn in is more mental than anything. But in the case of r2r I can see some change with all the resistor ladders. And I only saw one comparison? This thing is new so it will take some time for lots of data to come in.
> 
> And as pointless- I'm referring to the fact that the only opinion that will really matter in the end is yours. After hearing the ru6 I want a r2r dap by cayin. I'm not big on dongles although I think they're cool because they're small. But the unplugging and re connecting can get tedious to me.
> 
> Ymmv. But the ru6 imo is really exciting and I can't wait to see what's coming down the pike.



Thanks guys. I apologize for some of the things I said in this thread. I see that the RU6 is a great dongle and I should try to demo it myself, it’s just that I got a bit too hyped about it I guess.

Regarding the measurements, I think you definitely have a point since this R2R architecture is new.

Again, I apologize for overreacting and maybe misleading. I guess I went a bit mad and thought some of you labeled me as a shill for W2 since in fact I’m not lol, I’m actually debating hard which one to buy, and now I’m leaning towards the RU6.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 4, 2021)

stin8x said:


> Thanks guys. I apologize for some of the things I said in this thread. I see that the RU6 is a great dongle and I should try to demo it myself, it’s just that I got a bit too hyped about it I guess.
> 
> Regarding the measurements, I think you definitely have a point since this R2R architecture is new.
> 
> Again, I apologize for overreacting and maybe misleading. I guess I went a bit mad and thought some of you labeled me as a shill for W2 since in fact I’m not lol, I’m actually debating hard which one to buy, and now I’m leaning towards the RU6.



It's OK, we're all very passionate here, and demoing is absolutely the best if possible. You want to make the best choice you can. I don't really think there's a bad choice between w2, ru6, or s1/s2 I haven't heard s2 but s1 still sounds great to me. 

You've got to figure out what's important to you as twister said and then give them a listen. Of course what iems or cans you're going to use is probably even more important. Also remember that new gears get extra love on here 😍 

New=exciting


----------



## If6was9

"Measurements"?
Have you ever seen the graphs between an MSB Dac and any other Sabre chip Dac?
In the charts, MSB almost always loses, 
but on listening ....


----------



## gr8soundz

Vignelli said:


> how do you think about r2r in ru6 and terra player?..
> does ru6 close in sq?



Never got a chance to try the Tera Player. Closest I have to it is a Revamp Acoustics P1 which is my favorite piece of gear since joining head-fi. Not quite R2R but multi-bit and screen-less with 5 buttons similar to the Tera.

Still burning it in but straight out of the box the RU6 already has a wider soundstage than my P1.


----------



## Andykong

stin8x said:


> Thanks guys. I apologize for some of the things I said in this thread. I see that the RU6 is a great dongle and I should try to demo it myself, it’s just that I got a bit too hyped about it I guess.
> 
> Regarding the measurements, I think you definitely have a point since this R2R architecture is new.
> 
> Again, I apologize for overreacting and maybe misleading. I guess I went a bit mad and thought some of you labeled me as a shill for W2 since in fact I’m not lol, I’m actually debating hard which one to buy, and now I’m leaning towards the RU6.



Take it easy my friend.

Want to share one thought with you.  Being an audiophile is about enjoying your music, that's the ultimate goal.  Hardware is a means to an end, not an end in itself.  There are more than one route to enjoy music, like there are many roads lead to Rome.   

There are more than one HIGH QUALITY dongle DAC in the market, and the market is big enough for more than one dongle DAC.  Treat this as a hobby, a music centric passion, not a competition.  Even when it turns out that W2 is your the best match to your preference, there is no point to step on other "competitors".  To be honest, I never treat them as competitors, the market needs variety, variety keep the marketplace exciting.


----------



## ssriram2791

@stin8x  I am not trying to be shill for CAYIN (as you can see in my signature, I have every other audiophile brand DAPs/dongles.. you name it)

@Andykong has been a great asset to this community we have here. He has never shied away from telling the truth, even if it hurts the perception of their product. 

 We (including many of us here) purchase CAYIN's products because of transparency and incredible performance they offer.


----------



## twister6

Btw, a little easter egg, when you hold Mode button and connect RU6 to usb port of your computer, it will display fw# and will do a full reset of the dongle to default (High Gain, OS sampling, and 30s backlight).


----------



## gr8soundz

abitdeef said:


> Well normally I would say burn in is more mental than anything. But *in the case of r2r I can see some change with all the resistor ladders*.



THIS. But for those who don't subscribe to burn-in, R2R warm-up time can be even more crucial. Those ~hundred(s) of resistors take up much more surface area compared to chips and they need time to get to optimal temps.

My dac1101 needs at least 2-3 hours warm-up to sound its best and the difference is huge. My Metrum dac needs a full day or more of warm-up. They still sound great while warming up so not an absolute requirement but if you want to hear the true R2R difference it may need time. Cayin are the first manufacturer brave enough to build an R2R dongle and I'm thankful for the chance to find out how they tackled this potential issue.

Seems the only silver-lining of this chip shortage is that we get more R2R gear. I've waited 6 years for a device like the RU6 and so far I'm not disappointed. NOS, balanced out, no battery to worry about, and no bloat. The price is also competitive despite its dual PCBs and all those resistors which no doubt cost more than one or two DS chips.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

twister6 said:


> If you want the _top sound_, RU6 and W2 edges ahead of S2.  Now, between RU6 and W2, I still find them to have a very similar tonality and overall signature, but RU6 has better soundstage expansion and more 3D imaging.


Are you basing this label of "top sound" based on some objective criteria?    I ask because I own both W2 and S2 and I think they are about the same in sound quality just with different signatures and I prefer the S2 because I prefer its bass response.    When you factor in the fact that the S2 uses less power, the S2 has become my daily source for walking outside.

I get the RU6 next week.  Can't wait to hear it.


----------



## gr8soundz

Andykong said:


> Being an audiophile is about enjoying your music, that's the ultimate goal.  Hardware is a means to an end, not an end in itself.  There are more than one route to enjoy music, like there are many roads lead to Rome.
> 
> There are more than one HIGH QUALITY dongle DAC in the market, and the market is big enough for more than one dongle DAC.  Treat this as a hobby, a music centric passion, not a competition.  Even when it turns out that W2 is your the best match to your preference, there is no point to step on other "competitors".  To be honest, I never treat them as competitors, the market needs variety, variety keep the marketplace exciting.



How true.

There are countless choices nowadays. Too often, it seems comparing audio gear is like being in a parking lot full of supercars and asking: Which cars are slow? when we should be asking ourselves: Which of these FAST cars do _you_ prefer?


----------



## blotmouse

stin8x said:


> Regarding the measurements, I think you definitely have a point since this R2R architecture is new.


R2R is not new, been around for a long time.


----------



## twister6

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Are you basing this label of "top sound" based on some objective criteria?    I ask because I own both W2 and S2 and I think they are about the same in sound quality just with different signatures and I prefer the S2 because I prefer its bass response.    When you factor in the fact that the S2 uses less power, the S2 has become my daily source for walking outside.
> 
> I get the RU6 next week.  Can't wait to hear it.



That's just my personal opinion, of course.  S2 sounds great, but relative to RU6/W2 is has a longer decay of bass notes and less sparkle/air in treble, making it sound smoother and more laidback.  I hear IEMs paired up with RU6 to have a shorter bass note decay, making bass tighter and more articulate, and with more air in treble which brings up higher resolution and better definition to the sound.  So, yeah, better or worse is just a matter of a personal preference which also will have to do with pair up.  Due to its tuning, I find S2 to pair up better with neutral or more revealing IEMs (tames down sibilance), while RU6 is more of an all rounder with different sound sigs.  And yes, you are correct, S2 also draws less current, about 20-30mA less than either RU6 or W2.

Each of these usb dac dongles needs to be evaluated while keeping in mind all Pros/Cons, not just sound quality or functionality alone.


----------



## PopZeus

Is it possible to use the RU6's lightning cable to listen to an iPhone through other Cayin devices with USB-C like the N3Pro?


----------



## gr8soundz

Great pairing (better than I expected) so far with my Oriolus SE02 as EQ/amp. RU6 is easy to detach for solo use with phone.


----------



## blotmouse

gr8soundz said:


> Great pairing (better than I expected) so far with my Oriolus SE02 as EQ/amp. RU6 is easy to detach for solo use with phone.


There's your global EQ everyone!!


----------



## 111MilesToGo

abitdeef said:


> Mine pops sometimes around 50 volume and 20 volume does anyone else's do this?  Andy is this normal? What's weird is it doesn't do it everytime changing volume. It's quite a loud pop.


Sorry to hear. Any news?

Just out of curiosity: Where are you located / did you buy it?


----------



## bnupy

abitdeef said:


> Mine pops sometimes around 50 volume and 20 volume does anyone else's do this?  Andy is this normal? What's weird is it doesn't do it everytime changing volume. It's quite a loud pop.


Just increasing above 20 or to 20. But nothing at 50


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 4, 2021)

111MilesToGo said:


> Sorry to hear. Any news?
> 
> Just out of curiosity: Where are you located / did you buy it?



Musictech, but I found out at high volume sometimes it can pop when switching relays. There's a mute but sometimes it doesn't work. So it's normal. If I change volume slowly I don't get them. Plus I'm at a more normal volume now. And it didn't happen eveytime just occasionally. 

It's normal I guess.


----------



## twister6

abitdeef said:


> Musictech, but I found out at high volume sometimes it can pop when switching relays. There's a mute but sometimes it doesn't work. So it's normal. If I change volume slowly I don't get them. Plus I'm at a more normal volume now. And it didn't happen eveytime just occasionally.
> 
> It's normal I guess.



Yeah, volume control here is very different, using resistor array.  Interesting read per what has been covered in the updated first post of this thread: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb-dongle-dac-with-head-amp.960113/


----------



## abitdeef

Very interesting read about the volume design. All kinds of problems trying to do an r2r in a dongle format. To me they did a great job despite the space and power limitations.


----------



## Currawong

If I try and change the volume quickly I start to get pops.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 5, 2021)

Currawong said:


> If I try and change the volume quickly I start to get pops.



I think the volume relay mute system can't keep up. It's 10 banks of 10 resistors that have to jump from one to the other. I've been changing the volume slower with better results. Andy was upfront about the pops and the lower measuments of r2r in general.

My pops were pretty loud, but I did have an iem jammed in my ear and the volume at 70 on high gain 😉


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 5, 2021)

abitdeef said:


> I think the volume relay mute system can't keep up. It's 10 banks of 10 resistors that have to jump from one to the other. I've been changing the volume slower with better results. Andy was upfront about the pops and the lower measuments of r2r in general.



I think this should be solvable in firmware - it's likely the mute time needs to be extended when it detects fast volume changes, and the unmute should be staggered further. All of this should be achievable in code hopefully. Shame it got past QC.

I have super sensitive Andromedas hopefully I won't be deafened by the pops


----------



## abitdeef

emilsoft said:


> I think this should be solvable in firmware - it's likely the mute time needs to be extended when it detects fast volume changes, and the unmute should be staggered further. All of this should be achievable in code hopefully. Shame it got past QC.
> 
> I have super sensitive Andromedas hopefully I won't be deafened by the pops



I would think it's fixable, and if not it only happened in 2 places in the volume scale to me, around 20 and 50. And that's when I was going fast. Plus I listen to stuff too loud so most won't be bothered I think.


----------



## Vignelli

HiFlight said:


> Funny you should ask that!  I had a Tera Player for quite some time and I was just thinking how similar the RU2 sounds in comparison to what I remember from the Tera!


nice, i really like tera sq 
perhaps ru6 is really good option for R2r fans like me
torn between w2 and ru6
but i slightly toward r2r sound


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> I think the volume relay mute system can't keep up. It's 10 banks of 10 resistors that have to jump from one to the other. I've been changing the volume slower with better results. Andy was upfront about the pops and the lower measuments of r2r in general.
> 
> My pops were pretty loud, but I did have an iem jammed in my ear and the volume at 70 on high gain 😉


If you adjust the volume quickly and jumped two segments of resistor array in one continuous volume adjustment, the system will mute the first switching relay but it won't catch up with secnd switching relay.  If this is what you run into, this is a deIgn limitation of resistor array volume control, not a software bug.  Theoretically if you pause between every 10  steps, this won't happen. If you change 20 steps at a time, yhis will happen. If you change 12 or 15 or 18 steps  at a time, it might or might not happen, depends on where is your initial position in the resistor array segment.  

Can you please try this theory in you set up and check if there the loud pop at 20 or  50 still exist ?


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 5, 2021)

Andykong said:


> If you adjust the volume quickly and jumped two segments of resistor array in one continuous volume adjustment, the system will mute the first switching relay but it won't catch up with secnd switching relay.  If this is what you run into, this is a deIgn limitation of resistor array volume control, not a software bug.  Theoretically if you pause between every 10  steps, this won't happen. If you change 20 steps at a time, yhis will happen. If you change 12 or 15 or 18 steps  at a time, it might or might not happen, depends on where is your initial position in the resistor array segment.
> 
> Can you please try this theory in you set up and check if there the loud pop at 20 or  50 still exist ?



Couldn't the system mute all switching relays at once when adjusting the volume? This way it will handle cases when jumping between the relays - I'm guessing this is handled via firmware control.. or it could be made more intelligent - if the volume step starts getting close to the second switching relay, it can mute it few steps before its reached to give it time... I deal with these kind of problems all the time when I'm programming - how to load data before getting to it to ensure smooth scrolling etc etc. 

Another solution is: cache the volume steps if they're added quickly and only provide periodic volume samples from the relays once they're synchronised with the cached step so it doesn't get quickly overridden by the next volume step (resulting in a pop). The cache effectively can act as a buffer to ensure correct timing synchronisation with the relays muting. Anyway I'm just throwing ideas out there - with firmware update there should be a more elegant solution - as an engineer I dislike computer says no arguments, where there is a will there's a way.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> Couldn't the system mute all switching relays at once when adjusting the volume? This way it will handle cases when jumping between the relays - I'm guessing this is handled via firmware control.. or it could be made more intelligent - if the volume step starts getting close to the second switching relay, it can mute it few steps before its reached to give it time... I deal with these kind of problems all the time when I'm programming - how to load data before getting to it to ensure smooth scrolling etc etc.
> 
> Another solution is: cache the volume steps if they're added quickly and only provide periodic volume samples from the relays once they're synchronised with the cached step so it doesn't get quickly overridden by the next volume step (resulting in a pop). The cache effectively can act as a buffer to ensure correct timing synchronisation with the relays muting. Anyway I'm just throwing ideas out there - with firmware update there should be a more elegant solution - as an engineer I dislike computer says no arguments, where there is a will there's a way.


You are assuming there is microprocessor in RU6 to oversee the resistor array.  A very logical idea and in fact that's how electronically controlled analogue volume chipset such as PGA2311A is fumctioned.  Unfortunately that's a semiconductor level solution, the RU6 implementation is no where near that.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> You are assuming there is microprocessor in RU6 to oversee the resistor array.  A very logical idea and in fact that's how electronically controlled analogue volume chipset such as PGA2311A is fumctioned.  Unfortunately that's a semiconductor level solution, the RU6 implementation is no where near that.



I'm guessing there is some sort of interfacing between pressing the buttons, presenting the volume step on screen, long pressing control for auto scroll, and controlling the resistor array - if the resistor array muting mechanism can't be controlled then perhaps the volume data feed can be staggered before it reaches the resistor array, especially before the jump to the next switching relay to give it enough time.. I'm just throwing ideas I don't know the exact implementation but just that there's some software control (for the screen and speed scrolling) gives me hope  - if there's really zero possible chance to fix this via software then that's a shame and it's something that should have been managed in the original design.  There's no excuse for loud pops and crackles in 2021 when listening to headphones - r2r or not.


----------



## Currawong

I did a live unboxing at someone's suggestion (Why didn't I think of doing that before?!?). I almost drifted off into the music listening though, so the whole thing is a bit long and drawn out. That being said, while not an R01, so far it is doing nicely with the IEMs and even the Meze Elite I have here. Treble is still a bit edgy, but we'll see how it goes after some more hours of use.


----------



## emilsoft

Currawong said:


> I did a live unboxing at someone's suggestion (Why didn't I think of doing that before?!?). I almost drifted off into the music listening though, so the whole thing is a bit long and drawn out. That being said, while not an R01, so far it is doing nicely with the IEMs and even the Meze Elite I have here. Treble is still a bit edgy, but we'll see how it goes after some more hours of use.




Keep us posted please on how it matures with the burn in. I'm hoping the edgy treble you mentioned will be smoothed out as I'm sensitive there.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> I'm guessing there is some sort of interfacing between pressing the buttons, presenting the volume step on screen, long pressing control for auto scroll, and controlling the resistor array - if the resistor array muting mechanism can't be controlled then perhaps the volume data feed can be staggered before it reaches the resistor array, especially before the jump to the next switching relay to give it enough time.. I'm just throwing ideas I don't know the exact implementation but just that there's some software control (for the screen and speed scrolling) gives me hope  - if there's really zero possible chance to fix this via software then that's a shame and it's something that should have been managed in the original design.  There's no excuse for loud pops and crackles in 2021 when listening to headphones - r2r or not.


This is a design limitation.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 5, 2021)

Another idea I can think off the top of my head is digitally muting the signal on before reaching the 10-20-30 etc volume segments coniciding with the relays, so there's no pop.

I guess if Cayin engineers are adamant there's no possible way to do any tweaks at all on how the volume steps are handled from the input to the relays, then that's that.

If the pops when I adjust the volume through my sensitive  Andromeda earphones will endanger my ears I will be returning the RU6. It's not something that was disclosed as design limitation with the official sale of the device


----------



## TYATYA

I got RU6 today.
At the first minutes after unbox, sound pressure level seems slightly goes up down up down few minutes.
(Same as listening music while short notify comes to my smartphone, music volume will down, but actually not any notify coming).
After 2 hours phenomenon's gone.

I don’t get pops when adj volume. It response to a key press within 0.2s.
I think no problem.

Good sounding dac. It drives ibasso SR1 so well.
Feeding to shure 1500 also good.
Worth any penny


----------



## TYATYA

I prefer NOS and Low gain.
Clean, sharp, dry.


----------



## bnupy

TYATYA said:


> I prefer NOS and Low gain.
> Clean, sharp, dry.


I like that mode too. Its still a bit wet comparatively to other sources like W2


----------



## Jawis

I have been trying it with my Oriolus Vaccum Amp and I think the combo goes well. Adds an extra splash of mellow. Nice intimate female vocals.  
I've had a big dose of RU6 over the weekend. I'm sold on the upper end layering of the RU6. Sounds all so natural, detailed and never overpowering. 
Listened to Phil Collins, Thru These Walls from 3mins onwards many times already lol.


----------



## bnupy

Are there going to be chances on firmware updates like the other dongles ?


----------



## abitdeef

Andykong said:


> If you adjust the volume quickly and jumped two segments of resistor array in one continuous volume adjustment, the system will mute the first switching relay but it won't catch up with secnd switching relay.  If this is what you run into, this is a deIgn limitation of resistor array volume control, not a software bug.  Theoretically if you pause between every 10  steps, this won't happen. If you change 20 steps at a time, yhis will happen. If you change 12 or 15 or 18 steps  at a time, it might or might not happen, depends on where is your initial position in the resistor array segment.
> 
> Can you please try this theory in you set up and check if there the loud pop at 20 or  50 still exist ?



Nope there isn't if I pause a second between sector's. It's just when going fast.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 5, 2021)

Jawis said:


> I have been trying it with my Oriolus Vaccum Amp and I think the combo goes well. Adds an extra splash of mellow. Nice intimate female vocals.
> I've had a big dose of RU6 over the weekend. I'm sold on the upper end layering of the RU6. Sounds all so natural, detailed and never overpowering.
> Listened to Phil Collins, Thru These Walls from 3mins onwards many times already lol.



I bet this thing sounds awesome amplified. I really like the tonality but if you've got a dap with a powerful amp you get that more depth and 3d effect. This is true with any dongle I've tried, makes sense since power output is limited. 

Not that it sounds weak by any means the width is excellent, and the tone and speed are great. Good dynamics too. 

I hope they make a stand alone dap with r2r that doesn't break the bank. 😀 that would be an instant buy for me. Still burning junior in


----------



## Nostoi

abitdeef said:


> I bet this thing sounds awesome amplified. I really like the tonality but if you've got a dap with a powerful amp you get that more depth and 3d effect. This is true with any dongle I've tried, makes sense since power output is limited.
> 
> Not that it sounds weak by any means the width is excellent, and the tone and speed are great. Good dynamics too.
> 
> I hope they make a stand alone dap with r2r that doesn't break the bank. 😀 that would be an instant buy for me. Still burning junior in


The BA300s above is not the amp you want for more power. From memory, I think it only adds 3db of gain.

RU6 and Cayin C9 on the other hand...


----------



## abitdeef

Nostoi said:


> The BA300s above is not the amp you want for more power. From memory, I think it only adds 3db of gain.
> 
> RU6 and Cayin C9 on the other hand...



Ahh yes, but it would give it that 3d tube staging.


----------



## Nostoi

abitdeef said:


> Ahh yes, but it would give it that 3d tube staging.


True, though honestly I had this amp myself and within this price range, I'd recommend the Alo CV5 or better still the Fostex HP-V1. Any tube like element stemming from the BA300s is *really* minimal.


----------



## abitdeef

Nostoi said:


> True, though honestly I had this amp myself and within this price range, I'd recommend the Alo CV5 or better still the Fostex HP-V1. Any tube like element stemming from the BA300s is *really* minimal.



Me self, I'd rather just have a dap so I don't have to piggyback. 😉


----------



## Andykong

Nostoi said:


> The BA300s above is not the amp you want for more power. From memory, I think it only adds 3db of gain.
> 
> RU6 and Cayin C9 on the other hand...


6dB


----------



## Nostoi

Andykong said:


> 6dB


OK, I must have had an early model, which had 3db - https://penonaudio.com/oriolus-ba300s.html


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> Nope there isn't if I pause a second between sector's. It's just when going fast.



Thanks for the clarification.  I'll edit the first post tomorrow to alert everyone about this problem.


----------



## abitdeef

Andykong said:


> Thanks for the clarification.  I'll edit the first post tomorrow to alert everyone about this problem.



Yep no pops going slower. I've found a good volume at about 46 on HG balanced out.


----------



## linux4ever

SemiAudiophile said:


> R2R + tube might be too warm.


That would be correct if the R2R implementation is similar to Cayin R01. But if it similar to Cayin RU6, then it wouldn't be. RU6 has some similarities to R01 and different at the same time. RU6 is alittle more bright and the sound signature to my hears is different from R01.

I burned it in for 50+ hours and I've been listening for  2-3 hours at various points in that 50 hour period. The bass has settled and become more clear. In certain songs and certain portions where a lot happens, out of the box sound was a little muddy. Felt congested. And after 50 hours all that is going away. this sounds more different from R01. It is not a mini r01 either.


----------



## abitdeef

linux4ever said:


> That would be correct if the R2R implementation is similar to Cayin R01. But if it similar to Cayin RU6, then it wouldn't be. RU6 has some similarities to R01 and different at the same time. RU6 is alittle more bright and the sound signature to my hears is different from R01.
> 
> I burned it in for 50+ hours and I've been listening for  2-3 hours at various points in that 50 hour period. The bass has settled and become more clear. In certain songs and certain portions where a lot happens, out of the box sound was a little muddy. Felt congested. And after 50 hours all that is going away. this sounds more different from R01. It is not a mini r01 either.



That's why I'm burning mine in now, if it opens up a bit depth wise it will be killer! Probably have 20 hours (at the most) on it.


----------



## Jawis

Nostoi said:


> The BA300s above is not the amp you want for more power. From memory, I think it only adds 3db of gain.
> 
> RU6 and Cayin C9 on the other hand...



Yes, it was more a try out to see what sort of sound signature I would get with a tube combo. 

On it's own, RU6 drive all my IEMs well. Volume at about 30 is usually sufficient in high gain. I have a liking for dynamic driver IEMs and I prefer their performance in high gain. 

I also had quite an enjoyable session with the  Akg K612pro and RU6 earlier. Being 120ohms I would take the volume up to 90-95. Even though I had to nearly max out, volume output was more than adequate. Sound was a little leaner than my IEMs, but I was still enjoying the detail and clarity produced.


----------



## gr8soundz

Jawis said:


> I have been trying it with my Oriolus Vaccum Amp and I think the combo goes well. Adds an extra splash of mellow. Nice intimate female vocals.
> I've had a big dose of RU6 over the weekend. I'm sold on the upper end layering of the RU6. Sounds all so natural, detailed and never overpowering.
> Listened to Phil Collins, Thru These Walls from 3mins onwards many times already lol.



I've been using the same iBasso burn-in cable with similar adapter the past couple nights.

BA300s is one of the few Oriolus amps I don't have. They're unique having no volume controls but still adding some gain. RU6 seems like a perfect match with no line-out yet making good use of the volume buttons. 



Nostoi said:


> True, though honestly I had this amp myself and within this price range, I'd recommend the Alo CV5 or better still the Fostex HP-V1. Any tube like element stemming from the BA300s is *really* minimal.





Nostoi said:


> OK, I must have had an early model, which had 3db - https://penonaudio.com/oriolus-ba300s.html



I briefly had the V1 years ago and have the CV5 but prefer to use it with a dedicated line-out. Still love that added tube sound (currently have no less than 5 portable tube amps) but now leaning more towards solid-state for handheld use paired with warmer headphones.

Originally planned to use the SE02 with my BA10 tube amp but the added boost caused some issues. Expected the SE02 to have no gain flat yet estimate around 3dB increase; never saw specs saying one way or the other. What I didn't expect was the SE02 to sound so wide and dynamic. Glad I didn't return it and waited for the right pairing.


----------



## Verificateur

Hi, @Andykong — could you advise whether there is any difference between using High gain vs Low Gain (beyond just extra volume ceiling on the RU6)? 

Asking because, from reading, in some implementations (eg Shanling M8) changing gain to Turbo has an impact on I/V stages to be at a much higher voltage, which has its benefits depending on the headphones used.


----------



## abitdeef

gr8soundz said:


> I've been using the same iBasso burn-in cable with similar adapter the past couple nights.
> 
> BA300s is one of the few Oriolus amps I don't have. They're unique having no volume controls but still adding some gain. RU6 seems like a perfect match with no line-out yet making good use of the volume buttons.
> 
> ...



I'm using an ibasso cable for burn in too  notice any difference yet?


----------



## gr8soundz

abitdeef said:


> I'm using an ibasso cable for burn in too  notice any difference yet?



Nothing noticeable after the first 10 hours or so. With most gear I've tried where burn-in made a difference, I usually hear a change after that time. Still burning it in now. Got around 25-30 hours on it so far and will check again tonight.

Listened for couple hours last night and didn't detect much change so the RU6 may not need much warm-up which is good news.


----------



## gr8soundz

@Andykong is it possible to have the RU6 autodetect sample rates in Windows 10 for bitperfect?

I installed the driver from your site and can manually change the sample rate (in Windows sound settings) but haven't found any driver settings. Under Foobar2000 the RU6 still shows as just a speaker driver with no option for wasapi or anything else so it always defaults to the previous sample rate.


----------



## blotmouse

gr8soundz said:


> Listened for couple hours last night and didn't detect much change so the RU6 may not need much warm-up which is good news.


It also could need more than a couple days to noticeably start to settle. My Ti did. 

I don't know yet, shipping to the north western US has been super slow with everything lately so I still don't have mine. And I bought it a couple hours after it was up for pre-order. Living vicarious atm.


----------



## abitdeef

gr8soundz said:


> Nothing noticeable after the first 10 hours or so. With most gear I've tried where burn-in made a difference, I usually hear a change after that time. Still burning it in now. Got around 25-30 hours on it so far and will check again tonight.
> 
> Listened for couple hours last night and didn't detect much change so the RU6 may not need much warm-up which is good news.



Yep I haven't noticed any difference either.


----------



## abitdeef

blotmouse said:


> It also could need more than a couple days to noticeably start to settle. My Ti did.
> 
> I don't know yet, shipping to the north western US has been super slow with everything lately so I still don't have mine. And I bought it a couple hours after it was up for pre-order. Living vicarious atm.



You buy it from musicteck? They usually use ups for free shipping which is pretty fast even in these no one wants to work times.


----------



## blotmouse

abitdeef said:


> You buy it from musicteck? They usually use ups for free shipping which is pretty fast even in these no one wants to work times.


Yes, Musicteck.


----------



## abitdeef

blotmouse said:


> Yes, Musicteck.



I know usps is running slow, our distribution center here is understaffed but ups has been running pretty much on time. I'm surprised you haven't received it yet.


----------



## sp33ls

I wonder if headphones.com will eventually distribute the RU6?


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 6, 2021)

I received mine, very first listen is rather positive with my Sony IERM7- it has it's own flavor different to your typical delta sigma source. I will post first impressions once I give it a good few hours. At the moment I'm hearing a little harshness in the upper frequencies come through (high gain with OS on, no burn in)


----------



## Andykong

linux4ever said:


> That would be correct if the R2R implementation is similar to Cayin R01. But if it similar to Cayin RU6, then it wouldn't be. RU6 has some similarities to R01 and different at the same time. RU6 is alittle more bright and the sound signature to my hears is different from R01.
> 
> I burned it in for 50+ hours and I've been listening for  2-3 hours at various points in that 50 hour period. The bass has settled and become more clear. In certain songs and certain portions where a lot happens, out of the box sound was a little muddy. Felt congested. And after 50 hours all that is going away. this sounds more different from R01. It is not a mini r01 either.



Your observation is more related to analogue design than R-2R DAC implementation.  To start with,  R01 and RU6 are targeted to different user group, with different IEM and headphone matching in mind, and competence circuit will work out different solution given these requirements.  

The DAC quality of R01 is definitely superior, given it use better resistors and adopted a hardware interpolation filter.  The analogue circuit of R01 and RU6 is also significantly different, R01 is balanced amplification while RU6 is single-ended primarily.


----------



## Andykong

abitdeef said:


> Yep no pops going slower. I've found a good volume at about 46 on HG balanced out.



By the way, what IEM were you using when you play RU6 at High Gain Vol 70?  That's is very loud even with my IE800.


----------



## Andykong

Jawis said:


> Yes, it was more a try out to see what sort of sound signature I would get with a tube combo.
> 
> On it's own, RU6 drive all my IEMs well. Volume at about 30 is usually sufficient in high gain. I have a liking for dynamic driver IEMs and I prefer their performance in high gain.
> 
> I also had quite an enjoyable session with the  Akg K612pro and RU6 earlier. Being 120ohms I would take the volume up to 90-95. Even though I had to nearly max out, volume output was more than adequate. Sound was a little leaner than my IEMs, but I was still enjoying the detail and clarity produced.



I believe AKG 612Pro is single-ended only and is very difficult to mod balanced, 120 ohm full size headphone on RU6 3.5mm, I think you have push the RU6 to its limit, glad it still sound good, I was worried that the RU6 will sound flat and lifeless when push too hard.


----------



## Andykong

Verificateur said:


> Hi, @Andykong — could you advise whether there is any difference between using High gain vs Low Gain (beyond just extra volume ceiling on the RU6)?
> 
> Asking because, from reading, in some implementations (eg Shanling M8) changing gain to Turbo has an impact on I/V stages to be at a much higher voltage, which has its benefits depending on the headphones used.



From signal handling point of view, high gain causes louder output, or extra volume, but they are not the same thing.  Gain controls the input level of your amplifier, before the signal enter the headphone amplification stage (please refer to the functional diagram of RU6 in post #1).  The higher the gain, the greater the amplitude of your audio signal is increased.

From sonic characteristic point of view, high gain in RU6 will offer 6dB extra headroom on the expense of higher distortion or compressed dynamic, the different is actually more noticeable at low volume.  If you are unfamiliar about the concept of Headroom in audio engineering, there are lots of detail explanation on Google, but I offered two simple example here   (HERE and HERE)


----------



## Andykong (Dec 6, 2021)

gr8soundz said:


> @Andykong is it possible to have the RU6 autodetect sample rates in Windows 10 for bitperfect?
> 
> I installed the driver from your site and can manually change the sample rate (in Windows sound settings) but haven't found any driver settings. Under Foobar2000 the RU6 still shows as just a speaker driver with no option for wasapi or anything else so it always defaults to the previous sample rate.



Both ASIO and WASAPI are available in our Foobar setting for RU6


----------



## Jawis

Andykong said:


> I believe AKG 612Pro is single-ended only and is very difficult to mod balanced, 120 ohm full size headphone on RU6 3.5mm, I think you have push the RU6 to its limit, glad it still sound good, I was worried that the RU6 will sound flat and lifeless when push too hard.


Compared to listening with IEMS yes it's a much leaner sound. I would call it a more balanced sound as the low end bass is somewhat depressed. but I'm still getting nice detail that sounds pleasant enough. It's definitely not flat or lifeless. It's pleasant enough, but I would not necessarily class it as my go to combination. I think it will be quite a struggle with 300-600ohm.


----------



## abitdeef

Andykong said:


> By the way, what IEM were you using when you play RU6 at High Gain Vol 70?  That's is very loud even with my IE800.





Andykong said:


> By the way, what IEM were you using when you play RU6 at High Gain Vol 70?  That's is very loud even with my IE800.



I was using hiby bean at that time. And yes it was pretty loud. But it was an older recording that was mastered lower also.


----------



## sahmen

Is there a manual for the RU6 online? I prefer reading the manuals online, since the fonts on the included paper manual are so tiny.  A link to an online manual, if one exists, would be highly appreciated,.


----------



## CrocodileDundee (Dec 6, 2021)

Annnnddddd… against all odds. I got an RU6 on the way here. 

PS.: I hope it’s a good upgrade from my current DAC/AMP. ;P (sorry couldn’t miss the joke)


----------



## linux4ever

Andykong said:


> Your observation is more related to analogue design than R-2R DAC implementation.  To start with,  R01 and RU6 are targeted to different user group, with different IEM and headphone matching in mind, and competence circuit will work out different solution given these requirements.
> 
> The DAC quality of R01 is definitely superior, given it use better resistors and adopted a hardware interpolation filter.  The analogue circuit of R01 and RU6 is also significantly different, R01 is balanced amplification while RU6 is single-ended primarily.


Thank you for the technical details. It confirms what I'm hearing with both R01 & RU6. There are certain similarities when it comes to vocals, good holographic 3D staging etc. As is to be expected, R01 has more refined sound and the sound is pleasingly analog. R01's sound just captivates from the moment it is turned on. RU6 has its own take and is a different sound signature.

Pairing RU6 sound with a tube would an interesting combo and wouldn't be too warm. Interesting times ahead?


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 6, 2021)

About 8 hours burn in on mine. Compared to Earmen Sparrow, the sparrow sound much cleaner, more direct and less etched - it's technically superior sounding. The RU6 in NOS has this etch/dirt which I'm struggling with a little now (i guess mostly in the treble), but it sounds larger, wider, with weightier bass and has natural, dense and pleasant mids. Usually I don't see massive differences with burn but this has many resistors so who knows.. i hope the etch can settle down a little - i will report after a good more hours. I also struggled with this slightly dirty sound etch with the Cayin N3 pro

Both tested with Sony IERM7 and ifi iusb 3.0


----------



## ian91

emilsoft said:


> About 8 hours burn in on mine. Compared to Earmen Sparrow, the sparrow sound much cleaner, more direct and less etched - it's technically superior sounding. The RU6 in NOS has this etch/dirt which I'm struggling with a little now (i guess mostly in the treble), but it sounds larger, wider, with weightier bass and has natural, dense and pleasant mids. Usually I don't see massive differences with burn but this has many resistors so who knows.. i hope the etch can settle down a little - i will report after a good more hours. I also struggled with this slightly dirty sound etch with the Cayin N3 pro
> 
> Both tested with Sony IERM7 and ifi iusb 3.0



Dirty etch? Can you elaborate any further? Is it a harshness to the treble frequencies?


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 6, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> About 8 hours burn in on mine. Compared to Earmen Sparrow, the sparrow sound much cleaner, more direct and less etched - it's technically superior sounding. The RU6 in NOS has this etch/dirt which I'm struggling with a little now (i guess mostly in the treble), but it sounds larger, wider, with weightier bass and has natural, dense and pleasant mids. Usually I don't see massive differences with burn but this has many resistors so who knows.. i hope the etch can settle down a little - i will report after a good more hours. I also struggled with this slightly dirty sound etch with the Cayin N3 pro
> 
> Both tested with Sony IERM7 and ifi iusb 3.0



Damn etched/dirty treble! 😀 so your ears can discern technical superiority? That's damn impressive.


----------



## Verificateur

Andykong said:


> From signal handling point of view, high gain causes louder output, or extra volume, but they are not the same thing.  Gain controls the input level of your amplifier, before the signal enter the headphone amplification stage (please refer to the functional diagram of RU6 in post #1).  The higher the gain, the greater the amplitude of your audio signal is increased.
> 
> From sonic characteristic point of view, high gain in RU6 will offer 6dB extra headroom on the expense of higher distortion or compressed dynamic, the different is actually more noticeable at low volume.  If you are unfamiliar about the concept of Headroom in audio engineering, there are lots of detail explanation on Google, but I offered two simple example here   (HERE and HERE)


Thank you for the detailed response. 
Trying to digest this info but may need some help — does this mean that it’s always better to use Low gain, and no benefit in using High gain, unless more volume is required on the RU6?


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 6, 2021)

abitdeef said:


> Damn etched/dirty treble! 😀 so your ears can discern technical superiority? That's damn impressive.


As in the sparrow sounds less dirty with blacker background, faster transients and less blur in general in the mids/bass, treble is cleaner (cymbals shimmer and are clearly outlined whilst still sounding smooth and easy to listen to) etc etc. I was careful to say technically better, and not necessarily better sounding - I have to spend some time with it to decide this one, especially after burn in. The RU6 is showing some other qualities which are nice and not so prominent in the Earsparrow - wider soundstage, denser mids and more muscular punchy bass, so i have to take the overall picture and decide over time. The Sparrow is a tough one anyway, it's a freak dongle that reaches for the stars, competition is tough these days for new dongles


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 6, 2021)

ian91 said:


> Dirty etch? Can you elaborate any further? Is it a harshness to the treble frequencies?



I say that with reservation as I'm still going through burn in so take this as 10 hour play point impression. It's not necessarily that the treble is exaggerated, but more of a dirtyness to it - if you have cymbal hitting hard for example, one a refined dac (or even the Earmen sparrow), it will be more of a case of making itself clear that it's loud but not annoying -where the RU6 just adds a touch of low fi grit to it, making the cymbal denser and more prominent CSHNNhHn. - where the sparrow is Cshhhhh.. that's a ridiculous example I know ... but anyway I'm hoping burn in will help a little. Maybe it's an R2R thing, maybe it's lack of burn in, or maybe it just is -I'm giving it more time


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 6, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> I say that with reservation as I'm still going through burn in so take this as 10 hour play point impression. It's not necessarily that the treble is exaggerated, but more of a dirtyness to it - if you have cymbal hitting hard for example, one a refined dac (or even the Earmen sparrow), it will be more of a case of making itself clear that it's loud but not annoying -where the RU6 just adds a touch of low fi grit to it, making the cymbal denser and more prominent CSHNNhHn. - where the sparrow is Cshhhhh.. that's a ridiculous example I know ... but anyway I'm hoping burn in will help a little. Maybe it's an R2R thing..



Odd harmonics, which is true to life. I haven't noticed any change but the treble sounds very clean and accurate to me and also the transients are very fast to my ears. Sparrow was nice but I liked the w2 and ru6 sound more. Will be interesting to see if you hear any changes after burn in.

And although the specs aren't sky high they're still good enough to keep things clean beyond the range of human hearing unless you're blowing your ears out.


----------



## twister6

abitdeef said:


> Odd harmonics, which is true to life. I haven't noticed any change but the treble sounds very clean and accurate to me and also the transients are very fast to my ears. Sparrow was nice but I liked the w2 and ru6 sound more. Will be interesting to see if you hear any changes after burn in.
> 
> And although the specs aren't sky high they're still good enough to keep things clean beyond the range of human hearing unless you're blowing your ears out.



So, Sparrow is just a lot brighter and crisper in tonality?


----------



## emilsoft

twister6 said:


> So, Sparrow is just a lot brighter and crisper in tonality?



It's crisper, faster and more studio neutral i'd say, maybe a touch brighter but the treble is a little more refined/clean. This is out of it's balanced out


----------



## abitdeef

twister6 said:


> So, Sparrow is just a lot brighter and crisper in tonality?



I wouldn't say so but that all depends on who's doing the listening. I find the treble on the ru6 pretty forward, but nice and not sibilant.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 6, 2021)

twister6 said:


> So, Sparrow is just a lot brighter and crisper in tonality?



You've never heard the sparrow? The mids are definitely thinner. It's a nice little dongle and powerful. But to me it had a bit of a digital sound sig and the percived soundstage was smaller than say w2 or s1.


----------



## emilsoft

abitdeef said:


> You've never heard the sparrow? The mids are definitely thinner.


Yep - the RU6 has the  r2r mids - dense, wide, warm and prominent. The sparrow has studio neutral mids (flat). I dig the mids of the Cayin.


----------



## emilsoft

abitdeef said:


> You've never heard the sparrow? The mids are definitely thinner. It's a nice little dongle and powerful. But to me it had a bit of a digital sound sig and the percived soundstage was smaller than say w2 or s1.



Did you use it out of its balanced out? Big difference there... more so than any other source I've tried (where it's mostly been about power)


----------



## abitdeef

emilsoft said:


> It's crisper, faster and more studio neutral i'd say, maybe a touch brighter but the treble is a little more refined/clean. This is out of it's balanced out



Maybe the treble will settle down for you. I haven't noticed any changes after about 30 hours but they could be so subtle I didn't notice.


----------



## abitdeef

emilsoft said:


> Did you use it out of its balanced out? Big difference there... more so than any other source I've tried (where it's mostly been about power)



Yep, sure did. It sounded like typical ess setup. Well like ess with built in amps, which is a great sound. I just liked the presentation of the s1 and especially the w2 more.


----------



## someyoungguy

emilsoft said:


> As in the sparrow sounds less dirty with blacker background, faster transients and less blur in general in the mids/bass, treble is cleaner (cymbals shimmer and are clearly outlined whilst still sounding smooth and easy to listen to) etc etc. I was careful to say technically better, and not necessarily better sounding - I have to spend some time with it to decide this one, especially after burn in. The RU6 is showing some other qualities which are nice and not so prominent in the Earsparrow - wider soundstage, denser mids and more muscular punchy bass, so i have to take the overall picture and decide over time. The Sparrow is a tough one anyway, it's a freak dongle that reaches for the stars, competition is tough these days for new dongles


Out of curiosity is that balanced out on the Sparrow you’re referring to? I see comments that the balanced is much better sounding than the SE on the Sparrow. 

I think I get what you mean for the etched treble on the RU6, and the rest of your impressions line up with what I hear.


----------



## abitdeef (Dec 6, 2021)

Lol the treble sounds much more realistic than the sanitized digital sounds of most daps to me. It's one of the first things I noticed. Real cymbal strikes aren't clean. I sat right by a drummer for years so I have that sound 'etched' in my head. 😀

Most daps and dongles are missing the fullness on brass percussion. I've got dx240 right here and it sounds amazing on of the few that I think sounds realistic on percussion, but I'm sure that's do to the excellent amping. Ru6 gives me that too.

Anyways just my 2 cents.


----------



## sp33ls

I think many (not saying any of you) associate R2R with a similar presentation to most tube amps (lush mids, rolled off highs), but that would be a mistake to assume.

Like @abitdeef is referring to above, I've found the treble on many R2R DACs (not all) to sound more lifelike. And, in real life, a cymbal next to your ear will grab your attention right quick lol.

Live music has a ton of information and space in the upper registers.

This is why I'm excited to grab an RU6 as a portable DAC/amp.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Hey, RU6 users, do you find a decent improvement when jumping from 3.5 to 4.4 on RU6? or do both outputs sound mostly the same?

I ask because on devices like the Sparrow & BTR5 the Single Ended was not as good as the Balanced. This was true for very easy to drive IEM's too, so I'm guessing those units were designed with balanced connection in mind and had Single Ended out for convenience. Is that the same for RU6?


----------



## twister6

Johnfg465vd said:


> Hey, RU6 users, do you find a decent improvement when jumping from 3.5 to 4.4 on RU6? or do both outputs sound mostly the same?
> 
> I ask because on devices like the Sparrow & BTR5 the Single Ended was not as good as the Balanced. This was true for very easy to drive IEM's too, so I'm guessing those units were designed with balanced connection in mind and had Single Ended out for convenience. Is that the same for RU6?



As it was pointed out by @Andykong in the first post of this thread, RU6 is not full balanced, the signal path is singled ended and for convenience of 4.4mm BAL output a unity gain amp was added to convert SE to BAL.  When I'm listening and comparing 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs of RU6, the tonality and technical performance are nearly the same, the only difference is in power output, as expected.  Now, just because the design follows single ended path, I'm comparing it to BAL output of something like W2, and find this pseudo BAL performance to be on the same level, even wider in soundstage expansion and with improvement in 3D imaging.


----------



## linux4ever

I found treble to have the sparkle without being sibilant. And I haven't noticed much change in the Treble after burn-in. I've 80 hours on it now and the changes that I've noticed is at the lower end. The congestion in certain intense sections of some songs are better now.

So far I've been pairing it with my Macbook Pro. I decided today to pair with Cayin Nii. What an upgrade to the sound between the digital out from the Macbook's sound card to N6ii. The output from N6ii is so clear and the RU6 sings so happily.

This tells me that a good source is important for RU6 (Not RU6's fault). Everything is so clean as if a veil has ben lifted. If the output from the source is not good enough or clean, it is going to show up in RU6. 

Also the RU6 sounds distinctly different from N6ii + R01 even though there are similarities.

Planning to try using Cayin N3Pro as a source and see if it could be a good portable combo.


----------



## TYATYA

2nd day with RU6.
I am now unclear if I prefer NOS to OS.
Some tracks sound as rough, dry with NOS that case OS will retouch for more musicality.
For pianos, I like NOS for pureness


----------



## bnupy

emilsoft said:


> About 8 hours burn in on mine. Compared to Earmen Sparrow, the sparrow sound much cleaner, more direct and less etched - it's technically superior sounding. The RU6 in NOS has this etch/dirt which I'm struggling with a little now (i guess mostly in the treble), but it sounds larger, wider, with weightier bass and has natural, dense and pleasant mids. Usually I don't see massive differences with burn but this has many resistors so who knows.. i hope the etch can settle down a little - i will report after a good more hours. I also struggled with this slightly dirty sound etch with the Cayin N3 pro
> 
> Both tested with Sony IERM7 and ifi iusb 3.0


Its mostly with m7 being a warm netural. You will have to work with the treble side of things, whether ru6 can work with that.


----------



## rwelles

I gotta give kudos to @Andykong for all his informative posts in this thread!! This is exactly the type of manufacturer support that makes me to purchase. My RU6 tomorrow should be delivered tomorrow. If I like it as much as I think I will, there's a N6ii/R01 in my near future. My wallet blames you, Andy!!


----------



## Andykong

Verificateur said:


> Thank you for the detailed response.
> Trying to digest this info but may need some help — does this mean that it’s always better to use Low gain, and no benefit in using High gain, unless more volume is required on the RU6?


... unless more headroom is required on the RU6.    

But that's the technical explanation only, personal preference always have priority over technical achievement in our hobby, IMO, so if you happen to like the sound of  high gain better, feel free to stick with High Gain.


----------



## Andykong (Dec 6, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> I say that with reservation as I'm still going through burn in so take this as 10 hour play point impression. It's not necessarily that the treble is exaggerated, but more of a dirtyness to it - if you have cymbal hitting hard for example, one a refined dac (or even the Earmen sparrow), it will be more of a case of making itself clear that it's loud but not annoying -where the RU6 just adds a touch of low fi grit to it, making the cymbal denser and more prominent CSHNNhHn. - where the sparrow is Cshhhhh.. that's a ridiculous example I know ... but anyway I'm hoping burn in will help a little. Maybe it's an R2R thing, maybe it's lack of burn in, or maybe it just is -I'm giving it more time



Are you refer to the decay? That the Sparrow and RU6 has a different decay pattern on High Frequency? 
Maybe this is the different between R-2R or ESS chipset in Sparrow, or it can be a different due to in analogue implementation.  For example, this can relate to handling power or the ability to control your transducer at high frequency.


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> 2nd day with RU6.
> I am now unclear if I prefer NOS to OS.
> Some tracks sound as rough, dry with NOS that case OS will retouch for more musicality.
> For pianos, I like NOS for pureness



You don't have to make that decision, you own both already.


----------



## gr8soundz

Andykong said:


> Both ASIO and WASAPI are available in our Foobar setting for RU6



Thanks Andy. My mistake. After swapping the RU6 from my android phone over to a new laptop, I forgot to install the additional components Foobar needs for asio and wasapi. Bitperfect works fine now.

As others have already stated, thanks again for taking the time respond here to the many questions we've been asking.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> Are you refer to the decay? That the Sparrow and RU6 has a different decay pattern on High Frequency?
> Maybe this is the different between R-2R or ESS chipset in Sparrow, or it can be a different due to in analogue implementation.  For example, this can relate to handling power or the ability to control your transducer at high frequency.


Oh yes to be honest not sure what is I can't articulate yet, I need to give it some time. For sure they're very different topologies and sound quite different both offering something unique on the table.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

twister6 said:


> As it was pointed out by @Andykong in the first post of this thread, RU6 is not full balanced, the signal path is singled ended and for convenience of 4.4mm BAL output a unity gain amp was added to convert SE to BAL.  When I'm listening and comparing 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs of RU6, the tonality and technical performance are nearly the same, the only difference is in power output, as expected.  Now, just because the design follows single ended path, I'm comparing it to BAL output of something like W2, and find this pseudo BAL performance to be on the same level, even wider in soundstage expansion and with improvement in 3D imaging.


That's great to hear. Personally, I don't care if it's fully Balanced or not, I was just curious if there was a difference in sound between the two outputs. Like I mentioned before, when I had BTR5 & Sparrow, I was stuck with Balanced for better sound and since many of my IEM's had 3.5 jack, it was very annoying.


----------



## gr8soundz

abitdeef said:


> Lol the treble sounds much more realistic than the sanitized digital sounds of most daps to me. It's one of the first things I noticed. Real cymbal strikes aren't clean. I sat right by a drummer for years so I have that sound 'etched' in my head. 😀
> 
> Most daps and dongles are missing the fullness on brass percussion. I've got dx240 right here and it sounds amazing on of the few that I think sounds realistic on percussion, but I'm sure that's do to the excellent amping. Ru6 gives me that too.
> 
> Anyways just my 2 cents.





sp33ls said:


> I think many (not saying any of you) associate R2R with a similar presentation to most tube amps (lush mids, rolled off highs), but that would be a mistake to assume.
> 
> Like @abitdeef is referring to above, I've found the treble on many R2R DACs (not all) to sound more lifelike. And, in real life, a cymbal next to your ear will grab your attention right quick lol.
> 
> ...



I was thinking the exact same.

I played drums as a kid (plus tried a few other instruments but wasn't too good at 'em) and can't recall hearing live cymbals that _didn't_ have some harshness. So maybe I'm a bit old school as some of what we hear today may sound preferable even if not entirely authentic.


----------



## emilsoft

abitdeef said:


> Lol the treble sounds much more realistic than the sanitized digital sounds of most daps to me. It's one of the first things I noticed. Real cymbal strikes aren't clean. I sat right by a drummer for years so I have that sound 'etched' in my head. 😀
> 
> Most daps and dongles are missing the fullness on brass percussion. I've got dx240 right here and it sounds amazing on of the few that I think sounds realistic on percussion, but I'm sure that's do to the excellent amping. Ru6 gives me that too.
> 
> Anyways just my 2 cents.



Maybe I just need to finish my burn in. I know what cymbals sound like, I’ve been in bands, I listen to a good vinyl setup etc - I’m not saying RU6 makes fake cymbal sounds but rather that there’s a little extra something in there with the treble.. others have raised this also in their initial impressions. Burn In burn in and let’s see


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 6, 2021)

RU6 vs RME ADI 2 on Sony IERM7. No giant killers here today. 

I know this is far from fair, but given how clean the RME ADI 2 I can easily see what's the problem i've been having with RU6, that etch/dirtyness is very evident when comparing.. its there too when compared with other sources I have like the Earmen sparrow, but not as obviously pointed as with the RME.


----------



## blotmouse

Just got a notice that RU6 will be with me today ahead of schedule!! In 4-5 days I'll be able to say something about it. Yay.


----------



## bnupy

emilsoft said:


> RU6 vs RME ADI 2 on Sony IERM7. No giant killers here today.
> 
> I know this is far from fair, but given how clean the RME ADI 2 I can easily see what's the problem i've been having with RU6, that etch/dirtyness is very evident when comparing.. its there too when compared with other sources I have like the Earmen sparrow, but not as obviously pointed as with the RME.


I have the m9, and i think it works great synergy wise. I do think the treble quality on the m7 is something to be synergized with the source, so the more neutral or neutral bright it is, the more life there is to the m7, otherwise it can be bloat for some people.


----------



## emilsoft

bnupy said:


> I have the m9, and i think it works great synergy wise. I do think the treble quality on the m7 is something to be synergized with the source, so the more neutral or neutral bright it is, the more life there is to the m7, otherwise it can be bloat for some people.


the m7 has well extended treble even if overall it's a warm iem - it highlights any issues up there more so than something like the Andromeda.


----------



## linux4ever

One thing that I noticed between the 2021 Macbook Pro and the Cayin N6ii as the source. the digital output is at 44.1KHZ Macbook Pro and 96KHZ on the Cayin N6ii (as displayed on the RU6). 

also does anybody notice any difference in the 320 Kbps MP3 vs Flac in OS & NOS?


----------



## rwelles

linux4ever said:


> One thing that I noticed between the 2021 Macbook Pro and the Cayin N6ii as the source. the digital output is at 44.1KHZ Macbook Pro and 96KHZ on the Cayin N6ii (as displayed on the RU6).
> 
> also does anybody notice any difference in the 320 Kbps MP3 vs Flac in OS & NOS?


You probably need to open the Audio MIDI Setup utility to change the default sample rate. If you are using the Apple Music app, you will need to adjust the sample rate depending on the song's sample rate. Other music apps (e.g., Audirvana) can do that automatically. hth


----------



## utdeep

UAC1 for Cayin RU6!  Starting to like this thing a lot, but man, this feature might just pull me back to the W2.  Some of the best music I listen to is in my games.


----------



## JayL

Any concerns about durability, riding/bouncing in backpack/pocket etc?  I was thinking maybe due to the R-2R design


----------



## linux4ever

rwelles said:


> You probably need to open the Audio MIDI Setup utility to change the default sample rate. If you are using the Apple Music app, you will need to adjust the sample rate depending on the song's sample rate. Other music apps (e.g., Audirvana) can do that automatically. hth


Thanks for the tip. That worked like a charm


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 6, 2021)

Andykong said:


> You don't have to make that decision, you own both already.


Yeah I see.
I hope in future firmware (if have) a changing: press Menu button (short click) will change the Dac mode (OS/NOS) not regarding screen was on  or off.
And long press that button will wake screen up if it was off.
Do you think it is more convinience?

Tnx



blotmouse said:


> Just got a notice that RU6 will be with me today ahead of schedule!! In 4-5 days I'll be able to say something about it. Yay.



It is not as fast as mine, delivery within 48 hours 
I like it at very moment unboxing.
I tried insert RU6 into audio path between sources (smp, ak1000) and hdv800/hd800s combo it sounds good. No claim.
(AutoEq of NeutronMp was used on the sources for each headphones)


----------



## Jawis

JayL said:


> Any concerns about durability, riding/bouncing in backpack/pocket etc?  I was thinking maybe due to the R-2R design


It has been going out with me everyday since Friday.  So far so good for me. In use I have the phone in the side pocket of jeans and the tethered RU6 dangles outside the pocket. I keep it in a pouch with my headphones when not using it.  I don't plan to use a case for the RU6.


----------



## Goofyboy84

rwelles said:


> You probably need to open the Audio MIDI Setup utility to change the default sample rate. If you are using the Apple Music app, you will need to adjust the sample rate depending on the song's sample rate. Other music apps (e.g., Audirvana) can do that automatically. hth


How do I do this? I have the iPhone 12 Pro Max?


----------



## bnupy

Goofyboy84 said:


> How do I do this? I have the iPhone 12 Pro Max?


I got it running at whatever sample rate when i run Qobuz on the iphone 13 pro... It adjusts. Hope this helps.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Goofyboy84 said:


> How do I do this? I have the iPhone 12 Pro Max?


iOS automatically outputs the highest sample rate that the active DAC allows (24/48 for the built in DAC or Apple Dongle IIRC) for hi-res content. If the content is 16/44 it will output 16/44. The audio midi setup is only an issue on MacOS.


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> Yeah I see.
> I hope in future firmware (if have) a changing: press Menu button (short click) will change the Dac mode (OS/NOS) not regarding screen was on  or off.
> And long press that button will wake screen up if it was off.
> Do you think it is more convinience?
> ...


If short click and long clicked are predefined, what should I do if I need to change the Gain of RU6?


----------



## captblaze

getting my first RU6 listen (ikko OH10) and am finding that the while the image is wide, at times there is a hole in the middle. Imaging in front stage not as present as L/R. Not all tracks, but when i hear it, it is obvious.

That aside, the dongle seems well built and plays nice with my PC and iPhone 13 mini (cable of choice - OEaudio usb c to lightning).

Now to figure out which to pair with KSE1200. RU6 or W2.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> If short click and long clicked are predefined, what should I do if I need to change the Gain of RU6?



I think the menu navigation is very functional as is now 



captblaze said:


> getting my first RU6 listen (ikko OH10) and am finding that the while the image is wide, at times there is a hole in the middle. Imaging in front stage not as present as L/R. Not all tracks, but when i hear it, it is obvious.
> 
> That aside, the dongle seems well built and plays nice with my PC and iPhone 13 mini (cable of choice - OEaudio usb c to lightning).
> 
> Now to figure out which to pair with KSE1200. RU6 or W2.


How are you finding the treble?


----------



## captblaze

emilsoft said:


> I think the menu navigation is very functional as is now
> 
> 
> How are you finding the treble?



listening with the OH10's the treble is present, but not sibilant. When i break out the KSE1200 I will get a better idea of what the RU6 is doing. For now just some casual listening and rolling some IEMs that I think will pair well with the RU6


----------



## emilsoft

captblaze said:


> listening with the OH10's the treble is present, but not sibilant. When i break out the KSE1200 I will get a better idea of what the RU6 is doing. For now just some casual listening and rolling some IEMs that I think will pair well with the RU6


Do you find it more present vs other sources?


----------



## Currawong

Nostoi said:


> True, though honestly I had this amp myself and within this price range, I'd recommend the Alo CV5 or better still the Fostex HP-V1. Any tube like element stemming from the BA300s is *really* minimal.


I still have a CV5. Sadly they are no longer made. I did use it briefly with the RU6 with good results. 



captblaze said:


> getting my first RU6 listen (ikko OH10) and am finding that the while the image is wide, at times there is a hole in the middle. Imaging in front stage not as present as L/R. Not all tracks, but when i hear it, it is obvious.


If there's a hole in the middle, that's usually because something is out of phase, either the track or the wiring on something. If it isn't always present, it could just be some of the tracks.

About the slight etch in the treble, it seems to have gone after leaving it playing music for a couple of days. Using NOS to the SE out to the Campfire Solaris with Spiral Dot tips it has a big, bloomy sound while is wonderful to listen to music with.


----------



## captblaze

emilsoft said:


> Do you find it more present vs other sources?


I don’t have enough listening time with various sources. Just PC and iPhone and neither more than 2 hours a piece. 
And as a disclaimer I have old ears that have been exposed to lots of high decibel noise and am not qualified to give detailed sound impressions


----------



## Nostoi

Currawong said:


> I still have a CV5. Sadly they are no longer made. I did use it briefly with the RU6 with good results.


Yup, wish I kept my CV5. Cute amp. Wish I kept the HP-V1, too. Even though it's been clearly surpassed by the Cayin C9, it had a likeable vibe to it. Plus it could be used in desktop mode, too.


----------



## TYATYA

Andykong said:


> If short click and long clicked are predefined, what should I do if I need to change the Gain of RU6?


Let me try to define Menu button, S=short, L=long:

1. Scr off: S-> change sampling mode.
L-> wake screen up.
2. Scr on: S-> change sampling mode.
L-> goes to Menu.
3. In Menu:
S-> jump to next item.
L-> scr off

I do hope it in future.
Fast toggle sampling mode is big joy


----------



## Andykong (Dec 7, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> I think the menu navigation is very functional as is now
> 
> 
> 
> ...





TYATYA said:


> Let me try to define Menu button, S=short, L=long:
> 
> 1. Scr off: S-> change sampling mode.
> L-> wake screen up.
> ...



To be honest, if we are going to keep a menu option, I prefer the simple Menu system as-is.  UI is suppose to be simple and intuitive, especially with appliance type device like RU6.


----------



## Deders (Dec 7, 2021)

TYATYA said:


> Let me try to define Menu button, S=short, L=long:
> 
> 1. Scr off: S-> change sampling mode.
> L-> wake screen up.
> ...



It would be great for switching back and forth when songs and styles change on random, without having to get the whole thing out of your pocket, risk losing connection etc


----------



## Deders (Dec 7, 2021)

DP


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> To be honest, if we are going to keep a menu option, I prefer the simple Menu system as-is.  UI is suppose to be simple and intuitive, especially with appliance type device like RU6.



The only think I wouldn't mind having is always on option and a little spectrum analyser on the display haha


----------



## TYATYA

emilsoft said:


> The only think I wouldn't mind having is always on option and a little spectrum analyser on the display haha


As you wish it's there in Menu, last line.
Spectrum visualation draws more power than "always on".
I guess base on oled characteristics


----------



## emilsoft

TYATYA said:


> As you wish it's there in Menu, last line.
> Spectrum visualation draws more power than "always on".
> I guess base on oled characteristics


oh wow brilliant i didnt see we had always on option there.

spectrum visualisation would be neat, not sure if possible at all... but it would add to the funk factor


----------



## emilsoft

I would love to see further development of this R2R dongle concept from Cayin.. i wouldn't mind larger size and more stuff:

* class A amplifications (keep IEM focus, no need for gobs of power0
* better resistors, more fleshed out r2r topology
* battery maybe, optional separate power in (can use better power supplies)
* Line out
* Improved power filters, clocking, fpga etc
* Dsp eq etc etc

- see the ifi xdsd gryphon - something of that layout, but with killer desktop level sound quality. I'd be happy to pay more money for this; i feel the 500-600$ segment is currently barren for this kind of high performing portable systems.


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 7, 2021)

Some stuffs arranging to get in the audio path.
The most crazy thing is to drive hd800s by RU6.
A) my smp w/ Neutron->Ru6
B) SP1K w/ Neutron direct
C) SP1K ->Ru6
Output port: "bal" 4.4

It's not a easy race but ru6 wont die too fast.
At least I am not able to point out what is what. My wife's cooking and fan noise doest support me on listening.

Ru6 can push hd800s to sound loud enough at volume80, lowgain.
I disapoint high gain sq (and OS, with 800s)


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> Some stuffs arranging to get in the audio path.
> The most crazy thing is to drive hd800s by RU6.
> A) my smp w/ Neutron->Ru6
> B) SP1K w/ Neutron direct
> ...


The most crazy thing is to drive hd800s by RU6. I have to agree with you


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> I would love to see further development of this R2R dongle concept from Cayin.. i wouldn't mind larger size and more stuff:
> 
> * class A amplifications (keep IEM focus, no need for gobs of power0
> * better resistors, more fleshed out r2r topology
> ...



You have thrown in a lot of "keyword" that we frequently find in sales and advertisement.  If we were to develop a high-end R2R based DAC, there are a lot of digital engineering enhancement we need to do before we come to the feature you asked for.  Otherwise, the features you requested will only AMPLIFY the fault of the digital circuit.  To start with, we need better resistors (at least 10 times more  accurate with significantly lower TCR),  Hardware solution or powerful DSP improve oversampling and DSD transcoding,  PLL+FemtoClock to reduce jitter,  of if we don't want to transcode DSD to PCM, we'll need second rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD, .... etc etc.

Can we do this?  Yes.  
Will they end up in the 500-600$ segment?  maybe second hand by the time of 2030 .  Something like this can easily sell like a hot cake at $1999 in current market, why should we settle for less?


----------



## armstrj2

Andykong said:


> You have thrown in a lot of "keyword" that we frequently find in sales and advertisement.  If we were to develop a high-end R2R based DAC, there are a lot of digital engineering enhancement we need to do before we come to the feature you asked for.  Otherwise, the features you requested will only AMPLIFY the fault of the digital circuit.  To start with, we need better resistors (at least 10 times more  accurate with significantly lower TCR),  Hardware solution or powerful DSP improve oversampling and DSD transcoding,  PLL+FemtoClock to reduce jitter,  of if we don't want to transcode DSD to PCM, we'll need second rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD, .... etc etc.
> 
> Can we do this?  Yes.
> Will they end up in the 500-600$ segment?  maybe second hand by the time of 2030 .  Something like this can easily sell like a hot cake at $1999 in current market, why should we settle for less?


So when are you launching it?


----------



## Verificateur

TYATYA said:


> Some stuffs arranging to get in the audio path.
> The most crazy thing is to drive hd800s by RU6.
> A) my smp w/ Neutron->Ru6
> B) SP1K w/ Neutron direct
> ...


Very interesting write up, thank you!
So you preferred Low gain vs High gain on the HD800S? 
Is this the same for your other headphones/IEMs?


----------



## Andykong

armstrj2 said:


> So when are you launching it?



We can do it.
We might do it
We are going to do it.
We are doing it.
We have done it.

We are at stage 1 only, stay tune.


----------



## alota

As usual we lose the perception of main objective. We' re talkinh about a simple dongle. The real innovation is r2r dac in a dongle. It is clear that compromises have to be made. For me this dongle is a clear innovation like some years ago the chord mojo. I hope mine atrives this week.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 7, 2021)

Andykong said:


> You have thrown in a lot of "keyword" that we frequently find in sales and advertisement.  If we were to develop a high-end R2R based DAC, there are a lot of digital engineering enhancement we need to do before we come to the feature you asked for.  Otherwise, the features you requested will only AMPLIFY the fault of the digital circuit.  To start with, we need better resistors (at least 10 times more  accurate with significantly lower TCR),  Hardware solution or powerful DSP improve oversampling and DSD transcoding,  PLL+FemtoClock to reduce jitter,  of if we don't want to transcode DSD to PCM, we'll need second rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD, .... etc etc.
> 
> Can we do this?  Yes.
> Will they end up in the 500-600$ segment?  maybe second hand by the time of 2030 .  Something like this can easily sell like a hot cake at $1999 in current market, why should we settle for less?



Its not sales keywords for me, they're typically features I enjoyed and noticed improvements with in my sources - I have a class A amp and it sounds better to me than my non class A amplifications.

Superior clocking (and usb decrapifier like ifi iusb) I have also give me audible improvements.

Better power/battery also gives me audible improvements.

FPGA improvements I can't say that's bit of vodoo for me - I just know my Fiio M11 plus has improvements here apparently Vs the m11 Pro and it sounds better - wether it's due to that exactly I can't say.

- not quite sure why I have to explain this and why you'd think I'm just touting sales words I've read in the latest what hifi digest. I just expressed that I'd like to see portable r2r in th 500-600 USD range that pushes further what the RU6 can do.. wether it's possible to improve upon the RU6 for this cost I'll leave it to the experts.. there isn't much in this price range on offer, so I think creating something unique and quality that slots in here will be a good commercial move


----------



## emilsoft

alota said:


> As usual we lose the perception of main objective. We' re talkinh about a simple dongle. The real innovation is r2r dac in a dongle. It is clear that compromises have to be made. For me this dongle is a clear innovation like some years ago the chord mojo. I hope mine atrives this week.


 The proof is in the pudding - sound quality. I'm still going through burn in and hopefully will reach a happy ending


----------



## Andykong

alota said:


> As usual we lose the perception of main objective. We' re talkinh about a simple dongle. The real innovation is r2r dac in a dongle. It is clear that compromises have to be made. For me this dongle is a clear innovation like some years ago the chord mojo. I hope mine atrives this week.



Unfortunately, that's "If you can do that, why don't you do that" symptoms.  Once we deliver an innovation, people will ask for more innovations,  high price performance ratio, and everything is as straight forward as plugging in the RU6 to your mobile phone.


----------



## bnupy

Sometimes I think i get EMI, when im using usb c-usb a cable to apple camera lightning adapter . I think i'll have to purchase the lightning cable from cayin ( I tried the w2 lightning cable).. hopefully that might solve the EMI issue. Does the case being sold do anything except give a level of covering ? @Andykong


----------



## TYATYA

Verificateur said:


> Very interesting write up, thank you!
> So you preferred Low gain vs High gain on the HD800S?
> Is this the same for your other headphones/IEMs?


I just using day3 since unboxing but never feel I need or satisfying with high gain.
It sounds rude and awful to me.
Low gain always set.
I dont think I turn on H gain mode ever again. To be sure I dont have planar cans to try 
Hd800s driven easily and I dont have any claim of sq even compare to ability of AK SP1000. If give 10 to SP1000, I give 8.5-9 to ru6.
Nos flavor is not same Os (Os drive hd800s quite similar to SPk).
For vocal, I mostly choose os, for instrumental, Nos.


----------



## emilsoft

emilsoft said:


> Another idea I can think off the top of my head is digitally muting the signal on before reaching the 10-20-30 etc volume segments coniciding with the relays, so there's no pop.
> 
> I guess if Cayin engineers are adamant there's no possible way to do any tweaks at all on how the volume steps are handled from the input to the relays, then that's that.
> 
> If the pops when I adjust the volume through my sensitive  Andromeda earphones will endanger my ears I will be returning the RU6. It's not something that was disclosed as design limitation with the official sale of the device



I can confirm the volume segments/pop volume issue mentioned is not a significant issue with my ru6 - even with my andromeda IEMs it's not particularly loud or disturbing so I'm ok with it.


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 7, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> Another idea I can think off the top of my head is digitally muting the signal on before reaching the 10-20-30 etc volume segments coniciding with the relays, so there's no pop.
> ...


Somehow my unit seems mute 0.2s every 10 press.
No pop.
Edit. Yes pop, on in ear.
I though no pop because I didnt check with inear


----------



## hardpike

About 20 hours here
Really love it.
Compared with my w2, not that different but the less "processed" sound of the RU6 makes it a bit more of my taste. Tonality is more natural also to my ears.
W2 going to classifieds soon, but still an amazing device


----------



## twister6

TYATYA said:


> Somehow my unit seems mute 0.2s every 10 press.
> No pop.
> Edit. Yes pop, on in ear.
> I though no pop because I didnt check with inear



Guess what?  This question is being asked every 10 posts 

And the answer is still in the first post of this thread explaining how the volume switching and relay and corresponding mute function works in RU6.  So, all is normal and working as expected.


----------



## Stuff Jones (Dec 7, 2021)

Andykong said:


> The most crazy thing is to drive hd800s by RU6. I have to agree with you





Andykong said:


> Unfortunately, that's "If you can do that, why don't you do that" symptoms.  Once we deliver an innovation, people will ask for more innovations,  high price performance ratio, and everything is as straight forward as plugging in the RU6 to your mobile phone.



Please please don't listen to these people who expect everything. It dilutes products when you have to have 26 different outputs; power to drive everything and sensitivity to not hiss with the most sensitive IEMs; compatibility with every file format and every streaming service etc.

I think there's enough of of us who just want the best sound quality for IEMs in the most portable format at the best price, 8 million features and options be damned.


----------



## dumpsterfire

The request in question was for a hypothetical future product at a different price point. It's not like people are asking for all of that in the $250 dongle.


----------



## kwilkins

Stuff Jones said:


> Please please don't listen to these people who expect everything. It dilutes products when you have to have 26 different outputs; power to drive everything and sensitivity to not hiss with the most sensitive IEMs; compatibility with every file format and every streaming service etc.
> 
> I think there's enough of of us who just want the best sound quality for IEMs in the most portable format at the best price, 8 million features and options be damned.


P6 Pro for you ------ minus "the best price"


----------



## musicday

Will there be any firmware updates for RU6, new features added in the future?


----------



## alota

@Andykong  please a technical curiosity: you wrote the dongle is single ended regarding the amplifier. How the output power is higher in 4.4 out?


----------



## musicday

alota said:


> @Andykong  please a technical curiosity: you wrote the dongle is single ended regarding the amplifier. How the output power is higher in 4.4 out?


*" Amplification, Headphone Output and Other Issues*

First of all, another confession. The RU6 is NOT a full balanced designed Dongle DAC. The 4.4mm phone output is balanced driven, but the signal path is primarily a single-ended design. We added an extra op-amp (identical to the primary headphone amplification Op-Amp) in the final output stage as unity gain amplifier, all it does is to convert the original stereo signal to negative phase. This will provide extra power and current from the regular 3.5mm phone out, but the channel separation is not as good as a full balanced design. "


----------



## Goofyboy84

bnupy said:


> Sometimes I think i get EMI, when im using usb c-usb a cable to apple camera lightning adapter . I think i'll have to purchase the lightning cable from cayin ( I tried the w2 lightning cable).. hopefully that might solve the EMI issue. Does the case being sold do anything except give a level of covering ? @Andykong


The way I’m going to hook mine up is… Layla IEMs to 4.4mm balanced to dongle… from dongle… there’s a little male USB c to make USB c cable included it looks like.. then there’s an adaptor that I presume goes from female USB c to regular USB.. take that and hook it to camera adaptor. Hook camera adaptor to phone. Have the lightning port in the adaptor for charging. 

If I misunderstood the initial question, I’m sorry. But for what it sounds… you don’t need to buy the lightning cable, if you plan on using the adaptor. 

If you’re going from the dongle straight to the phone? You will. But with that route.. you won’t be able to charge it at the same time. 😊


----------



## Verificateur (Dec 7, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> If you’re going from the dongle straight to the phone? You will. But with that route.. you won’t be able to charge it at the same time. 😊


Not sure if you are talking about iPhones or Android phones… but pretty sure you can charge your phone while using the dongle at the same time.

As a matter of fact — I can confirm that this works on my iPhone (being charged) and RU6 ( dongle shouldn’t matter actually) playing by using this:





For Android devices, I would think that any USB C hubs would work?


----------



## TYATYA

Verificateur said:


> Not sure if you are talking about iPhones or Android phones… but pretty sure you can charge your phone while using the dongle at the same time.
> 
> As a matter of fact — I can confirm that this works on my iPhone (being charged) and RU6 ( dongle shouldn’t matter actually) playing by using this:
> 
> ...


I think 99% chance Android world work with this kind of adapter.
Owning several adapter and I can try soon.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Verificateur said:


> Not sure if you are talking about iPhones or Android phones… but pretty sure you can charge your phone while using the dongle at the same time.
> 
> As a matter of fact — I can confirm that this works on my iPhone (being charged) and RU6 ( dongle shouldn’t matter actually) playing by using this:
> 
> ...


Yes, that’s what I meant. 😊


----------



## nwavesailor

Can this be used only as a EQ, not amp or DAC? 

I have a TT2 DAC / Amp and wondered how this might (or might not) work just as a EQ.


----------



## bnupy

Goofyboy84 said:


> The way I’m going to hook mine up is… Layla IEMs to 4.4mm balanced to dongle… from dongle… there’s a little male USB c to make USB c cable included it looks like.. then there’s an adaptor that I presume goes from female USB c to regular USB.. take that and hook it to camera adaptor. Hook camera adaptor to phone. Have the lightning port in the adaptor for charging.
> 
> If I misunderstood the initial question, I’m sorry. But for what it sounds… you don’t need to buy the lightning cable, if you plan on using the adaptor.
> 
> If you’re going from the dongle straight to the phone? You will. But with that route.. you won’t be able to charge it at the same time. 😊


Yeah, it works with the camera adapter, its just a matter of possibly making that cable connection shorter for convinience.. Plus i just want to know if the EMI issue would persist if i get the case, maybe it shields it.


----------



## captblaze

bnupy said:


> Yeah, it works with the camera adapter, its just a matter of possibly making that cable connection shorter for convinience.. Plus i just want to know if the EMI issue would persist if i get the case, maybe it shields it.


https://www.oeaudio.net/oeotg


----------



## Jawis (Dec 7, 2021)

Stuff Jones said:


> I think there's enough of of us who just want the best sound quality for IEMs in the most portable format at the best price, 8 million features and options be damned.


I'm fitting into this category here.

For on the go music the RU6 is really singing for me right now.

For me the strength of RU6 is still at the upper range.  If there is a need for a clash, sparkle or shimmer it seems to do this with ease and I think it begins and ends well consistently. With the other dongles in my arsenal I think there are times the end does not tail off well.

Playing around with bit perfect. I think it helps with the noise floor somewhat. Trying the RU6 with UAPpro and Hiby app. UAPpro sounds airier for me. Being drawn to this right now.


----------



## SemiAudiophile (Dec 7, 2021)

Just received my RU6. Only 2 hrs in, but already quite impressed out of the box. If "analog" is the objective of a digital-to-analog converter; this is _the _*best* DAC I've ever heard. Best way to describe the sound is as if you took the best qualities of digital music and analog music and mashed them together. Clear, detailed, and _smoooooth_.

Some other interesting things I noticed out of this DAC is that music seems to flow in slow motion. Like I was in _The Matrix_ and music was slowly flowing around me.







Other things I noticed bass had better definition and texture. Soundstage nice and _wide_, plus added a bit of depth too. Good layering where I never realized the FD5 was capable of before. Sound is super addicting to the point where I don't wanna take them off and when I am listening to them I have a hard time multitasking, I just want to stop what I'm doing and enjoy.

In the 2 hrs I spent with this so far, it only drained about 7% battery life too which is quite good. 9038S in comparison drains about 10%/hr. Was using balanced in NOS mode in high gain for the most part.

This is amazing innovation in audio. Thanks @Andykong  and Cayin. I'm officially a fan! 👍


----------



## ClieOS

My RU6 should arrive in a few hours.


----------



## Zachik

ClieOS said:


> My RU6 should arrive in a few hours.


My RU6 arrives tomorrow!


----------



## discord

emilsoft said:


> I don’t think I’ve read any reviews that say ru6 is worse sounding than w2. In fact I’ve seen two new first impression videos on YouTube both positive about the ru6. I have it arriving soon here and I will post my first impressions vs earmen sparrow, Qudelix and Sony ZX507. If I’m honest I do expect it to beat all of those in terms of natural/organic/smooth sound, my expectations are high in 2021 for portable sources R2R or not



How does the RU6 compare to the Sony ZX507? I've had the ZX507 for about 3 weeks but will return it if the RU6 beats or even just matches it.


----------



## DBaldock9

I ordered from MusicTeck, and my RU6 arrived today.

When I plugged it into my Kubuntu 21.10 Linux PC, it was immediately recognized.

I set it to NOS mode, and connected my Wong Kuan Wae "Blur 266 MX150" (2.5TRRS, 150-Ω) earbuds to the 4.4mm output, using a DJ44A adapter.
Watched a couple of YouTube videos on a channel I follow, and the RU6 indicated the correct 48-KHz sample rate.
Then I launched JRiver MC28, and played the 24-Bit / 192-KHz Chesky Binaural album, "The Master" by Cuban percussionist Candido Camero.
The Sound Stage is impressively wide, with a clear, out-of-the-head presentation of the musical instruments.

Switching to another album, "Mneme" by Ex Silentio (24-Bit / 96-KHZ), and MC28 hung up, not playing anything through the RU6.
Force-stopped MC28, and relaunched it.
I tried a couple of other albums (44.1-KHz, 96-KHz, and 192-KHz), and none would play (kept having to force-stop / relaunch MC28).
Going back to "The Master", and it played just fine.
Not sure what's going on.

Unplugged / re-plugged the RU6, and now it doesn't show up at all, in the list of audio devices.
My previous audio path still works just fine: USB -> iFi Micro iDSD [SDPIF] -> SPDIF/TOSLINK Convertor -> 4x4 Optical Matrix Switch -> Topping D70 DAC -> iBasso PB2 Amp -> earbuds


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 8, 2021)

discord said:


> How does the RU6 compare to the Sony ZX507? I've had the ZX507 for about 3 weeks but will return it if the RU6 beats or even just matches it.



They're difficult to compare for me still as I'm in the honeymoon phase. I'd say the RU6 sounds both wider and more bloomy/analogue but also grainier than the ZX507. The ZX certainly sounds cleaner and is also warmish - but it's feels a little more accurate and less grainy in a good way, but doesn't have that lets let the hair down feel of the RU6. I'm still fighting the slightly etched treble of the Cayin, the 507's treble is a little more refined (both no way near the refinement of an RME ADI 2 dac which sounds sweet , smooth and delicate - as expected for the price).

I do find the Cayin to enjoy a good usb source - like my ifi isub 3.0. It sounds ok out of macbook pro, a little worse out of ipad, and even worse out my phone.

I will say one thing however, i feel the ZX507 is a little overpriced for the audio performance it gives.. at less than half the price the RU6 gives a unique sound flavour you can't really find in portable device for that price, even if it doesn't quite match the ZX507's composure and clean audio - but they both offer a similar cohesive audio that typically sounds less digital compared to the competition.


----------



## 111MilesToGo

DBaldock9 said:


> I ordered from MusicTeck, and my RU6 arrived today.
> 
> When I plugged it into my Kubuntu 21.10 Linux PC, it was immediately recognized.
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear! Can you try other player software, like mpd+Cantata or DeaDBeeF?

Remark: I ordered the RU6 to replace my old AudioQuest DragonFly Red, limited in its capabilities, but still trusty on everything. My RU6 seems stuck in shipping. Now, with all the reports here, I am sort of afraid of the many tasks ahead of me when it arrives. Testing on Windows, Linux (Tumbleweed, Manjaro), iOS, Android. Those pops during volume adjustment. …


----------



## ClieOS




----------



## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> I ordered from MusicTeck, and my RU6 arrived today.
> 
> When I plugged it into my Kubuntu 21.10 Linux PC, it was immediately recognized.
> 
> ...



If you connect RU6 to a standard PC or mobile phone, can it recognise the RU6?  I want to make sure the RU6 is in good working condition before we move onto other diagnosis.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808 (Dec 8, 2021)

Today, I received an order from Musicteck.   I got the UM MEST Indigo and the RU6.   I spent the majority of the afternoon listening to the Indigo and loving it.   Listened across my S2, DX300 and Chord TT2.   It's a wonderful IEM that is definitely a keeper in the top 5 of my collection already.   It sounds great across all genre of music and across all of my sources.   Very similar to the Traillii in that way.   I can't wait to A/B test them to see which I prefer.  It's going to be close.   The Indigo has such a lively and exciting sound.   Can't wait for that shoot out.   For now, it was time for me to bust out the RU6 to see what it can do.

I am not very much into features.  I care almost entirely about sound quality, tactility and usability.  Since Cayin focused on sound quality, I felt this would be a good purchase for me.  I listened to an hour of various tracks in my library with the Indigo and independently of any comparisons, it is a fantastic product that I wouldn't mind recommending to anyone I know.   Then, I spent 2 hours A/B/C testing the RU6 against the Lotoo PAW S2 and the L&P W2.    After this more critical listening session, I can see why @twister6 says that the L&P W2 and the RU6 are similar in the signature they aim for.    They are strong at similar things.   The S2 is more focused on transparency of sound whereas the W2 and RU6 are seeking a richness of sound.     I focused on 2 tracks.   One Jazz track:   No More Blues by Bill Watrous and a ballad Emotion by Destiny's Child.   Emotion has a tremendous sub bass focus and this would help me understand which dongle handled bass the best.    No More Blues is a Jazz track that I know very well and so I know how it is supposed to sound.  It has some complexity and specific instruments that have a specific sound and balance to them.

The result?    I preferred the RU6 over the L&P W2, but they are close.    The RU6 sounded just a hair more natural to me with great balance.   The difference was that Bill Watrous just a bit more appropriately forward.    The bass on the RU6 is the best of the 3 especially in the sub bass which is clear in Emotion.    Whether or not I prefer the S2 or the RU6 really depends on the track if transparency or richness of sound is more important.   I listening to some tracks where the RU6 sounded very congested when there were a lot of instruments.   The S2 excelled there since its clarity really helped sort out the music.    At the end of the day, to my ear, all 3 of these dongles are about the same and I would be very happy with any of them.   So what will most likely determine which one I use the most are power consumption requirements and how easy it is to carry around with me on my walks.

Well done Cayin.  You've released a great product.  Waiting for you next R2R Android based DAP with a line out that pairs with the C9.   If this the sound you plan to deliver, I am going to love it.


----------



## Headcan

@ClieOS 

What buds are those and which IEM's or buds have you guys found to pair best with the RU6 thus far?


----------



## ClieOS

Headcan said:


> @ClieOS
> 
> What buds are those and which IEM's or buds have you guys found to pair best with the RU6 thus far?


Yincrow RW-3000. It is the new flagship earbud of the brand released just a few weeks ago.


----------



## yaps66

Headcan said:


> @ClieOS
> 
> What buds are those and which IEM's or buds have you guys found to pair best with the RU6 thus far?


I have not tried many yet but my favourite so far is the Tri Starlight with the RU6.


----------



## musicday

ClieOS said:


> Yincrow RW-3000. It is the new flagship earbud of the brand released just a few weeks ago.


Is this the best earbud you have ever tried and why if so, thank you.


----------



## pinkpiglet

musicday said:


> Is this the best earbud you have ever tried and why if so, thank you.


There's an earbud thread that discusses this https://www.head-fi.org/threads/earbuds-round-up.441400/

I hope we don't deviate from the topic too much.


----------



## ryanjsoo

Just received the RU6 a few days ago and can't stop listening to the thing!

Compared to my reference sources and desktop stack, it's definitely not giving me the same resolving power and imaging acuity but holds a different appeal for sure. The RU6 offers a very pleasantly etched sound, it has plenty of crispness but not too much aggression and bite. My friend Deezel describes this best as an ebb and flow of music, notes fade in and out in a smooth and natural fashion. The RU6 is just a pleasant, forgiving listen and does so without being detail deficient. It retains engagement with very immersive imaging and a punchy bass performance. Again, if you want the most detailed or reference sound, then even something like the S9 Pro will outdo this handily, but truly the way the RU6 constructs its musical image as a whole is one of a kind.


----------



## emilsoft

ryanjsoo said:


> Just received the RU6 a few days ago and can't stop listening to the thing!
> 
> Compared to my reference sources and desktop stack, it's definitely not giving me the same resolving power and imaging acuity but holds a different appeal for sure. The RU6 offers a very pleasantly etched sound, it has plenty of crispness but not too much aggression and bite. My friend Deezel describes this best as an ebb and flow of music, notes fade in and out in a smooth and natural fashion. The RU6 is just a pleasant, forgiving listen and does so without being detail deficient. It retains engagement with very immersive imaging and a punchy bass performance. Again, if you want the most detailed or reference sound, then even something like the S9 Pro will outdo this handily, but truly the way the RU6 constructs its musical image as a whole is one of a kind.



I'm in two minds still about the RU6 - I agree with your portrayal that it has a nice ebb and flow of the music, but the etch/crispness you mention is still troubling me.. I have to be honest I had expectation of a warm,  polite and analogue r2r sound - but the etch is contradicting this and sometime masking the nice R2R qualities. Burn in time is under 50 hours and I've gotten used to the sound a little more now, but I can't still say it's an musical improvement and more enjoyable listen than say the cheaper Quidelix - but at least I can say if anything it has me gotten thinking more about higher end r2r and what's possible there; like the Hiby RS6 or Cayin's R01... if they can remove the etch to let just the natural organic r2r bloom and flow coming through that must be quite something...


----------



## HiFlight

I'm not sure I can define the new audiophile description "Etch" as something I can recognize when listening to my R-2R.  Might it be something related to mastering or the trend toward brightness now present in many headphones to simulate more detail?  Perhaps my tin ears are a blessing in disguise! 
At any rate, I am very much enjoying the sense of musical realism I am hearing from my RU6 and consider it to be a huge step forward by the talented folks at Cayin!


----------



## SemiAudiophile

HiFlight said:


> I'm not sure I can define the new audiophile description "Etch" as something I can recognize when listening to my R-2R.  Might it be something related to mastering or the trend toward brightness now present in many headphones to simulate more detail?  Perhaps my tin ears are a blessing in disguise!
> At any rate, I am very much enjoying the sense of musical realism I am hearing from my RU6 and consider it to be a huge step forward by the talented folks at Cayin!


Im not hearing that "etch" either. To me, "etch" is a word I would use to describe BA timbre when poorly implemented.


----------



## econaut

@HiFiHawaii808 and @ryanjsoo :

Do you refer to both NOS and OS modes in your findings?

I find the two modes quite different. OS mode is more similar to Paw S2 than OS mode is similar to NOS mode, for example.

But I just had a quick listen on a not burned in RU6 yesterday.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

econaut said:


> @HiFiHawaii808 and @ryanjsoo :
> 
> Do you refer to both NOS and OS modes in your findings?
> 
> ...


I did not burn in the RU6 and I did not look at the features.  All I did was connect it to my source with a lightning adapter.    I will keep listening to see if there is any change over time.   I like the sound out of the box.


----------



## nwavesailor

So the RU6 is a DAC /amp that has a EQ feature.  It looks like a nice portable device particularly if using IEM's.

Long shot here, but can it be used as a basic EQ w/o the DAC / amp section?


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

SemiAudiophile said:


> Im not hearing that "etch" either. To me, "etch" is a word I would use to describe BA timbre when poorly implemented.


What is this etched sound?   I don't hear anything abnormal in the treble.   The RU6 indeed has a very natural sound and digs deep in the bass.   Much more than I expected.


----------



## vilhelm44

Got my RU6 yesterday and using with the Custom Art F7, which is easy to drive. It's an impressive sound coming out of this small package, the music just sounds effortless with everything nicely balanced. The soundstage is superb as is the layer, even on busy tracks, everything is there, no cues are missed.

I did swear myself off DAPs but now I'm wondering how much more i would get out of the N6ii with R01 with the F7 and whether it would be worth the difference. This hobby has a lot to answer for


----------



## SemiAudiophile

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> What is this etched sound?   I don't hear anything abnormal in the treble.   The RU6 indeed has a very natural sound and digs deep in the bass.   Much more than I expected.


Etch lives in the upper midrange and lower treble where it can sound dry/thin and sometimes piercing or sibilant. Normally found in BA drivers. This is just my definition and the way I hear it. Others might describe it differently.


----------



## TYATYA

nwavesailor said:


> So the RU6 is a DAC /amp that has a EQ feature.  It looks like a nice portable device particularly if using IEM's.
> 
> Long shot here, but can it be used as a basic EQ w/o the DAC / amp section?


No.
Has no EQ ability.
OS / NOS acts as like digital dac filter mode Slow roll off v.s Sharp roll off.
Idk data processing, but hearing similar effect.


----------



## bnupy

I feel like the midrange has a bloom on the OS. I guess thats why the vocals sound more forward.
Also I found the treble out of place initially out of box, but after some burn in, its a bit more controlled.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 8, 2021)

I find the treble to be slightly merging with the other elements, like certain elements that should only take up narrow treble band seem to take wider/denser space making the treble stand out a little more.

This is not a BA or headphone thing as I've compared it only in relation to my other source with same gear: Qudelix, Earmen Sparrow, RME ADI 2, Sony ZX507 - all of these offer slightly different treble forwardness, but none of them have the same amount of density/grain of the RU6 treble - it's not end of the world or a huge glaring problem, but it's there for me and my treble sensitive ears.

I also hear massive improvement over my ifi iusb 3.0 - if you have a usb decrapifier, use it to get some more of that raw r2r goodness. The ifi iusb also feeds cleaner power to the RU, which it appreciates.

It just makes me wish if I could pay a little more, say double the price for this kind of portable r2r product, even if it's larger size, just to eke out a bit more of that r2r sound whilst minimising the side effects a little more.

I like the R2R effect; the visceral muscular bass, a more direct connection to the music, bloom and width - similar to what reasonable vinyl setup can sound like - minus the slight treble etch


----------



## econaut

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> I did not burn in the RU6 and I did not look at the features.  All I did was connect it to my source with a lightning adapter.    I will keep listening to see if there is any change over time.   I like the sound out of the box.


Thanks. Then you used it in OS mode. Makes your findings even more interesting for me!


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

SemiAudiophile said:


> Etch lives in the upper midrange and lower treble where it can sound dry/thin and sometimes piercing or sibilant. Normally found in BA drivers. This is just my definition and the way I hear it. Others might describe it differently.


I know that sound.   It's what drives me crazy about the UM MEST OG.   I actually hear it with many EST implementations.

I am not hearing that etched sound yet.  But,  haven't listened for long enough yet.


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 8, 2021)

Sorry OT.
Share my Neutron setting.
1. In audio hardware, set PCM to DSD convert realtime.
Help improving channel seperation, darker ground. Slightly thinning the overal tonal but just a bit

2. Set 3 major band for low, mid, upper mid- hi and last band highshelf but low frequency to adjust whole range.
Dont care for gain of each, just limit them do not goes too far from 0(-3 to 3).
They, band gain are things to change dêpnding  album, any headphone to be plugged personal flavor.
Except a headphone has too bad peak, spike, this eq will likely help.

I tried AutoEq/wavelet/ Sonarwork...such kind of complex adjustment but finally just manual create 4 bands PEQ.

Listening note20 w/ Neutron PEQ, PCM =>DSD -> Ru6 ->IT00
A cheap, entry level inear IT00 sound crazily as hell with bloat bass, but it did not after EQing.
I think I gonna touch IT00 more than other high rank headphones, since now.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 8, 2021)

Interestingly - just now i tried the RU6 going into my ifi ican nano se headamp with my Sony IERM7, it sounds less strained, less grain, wider and plumper; it's a good improvement. It might be the slightly warmer ican tuning. The etch is still hanging around, but a little softened - it's defo there with RU6 no matter what I do unfortunately, it's fatiguing.


----------



## DBaldock9

Andykong said:


> If you connect RU6 to a standard PC or mobile phone, can it recognise the RU6?  I want to make sure the RU6 is in good working condition before we move onto other diagnosis.



Thanks for the quick reply, but it's just a problem with my Linux PC and/or the JRiver MC28.

Once I had a chance today, I connected the RU6 to the Win10 PC at work (can't install any drivers on this one), and it was detected with no issues.
Playing a YouTube video, the RU6 indicated the correct 48-KHz sample rate.

Then I hooked the RU6 to my LG V35 phone, and while playing the same albums & tracks in UAPP, that I was trying to run in MC28 last night, everything is working fine - with the correct 44.1-KHz, 96-KHz & 192-KHz sample rates being displayed.


----------



## Deders

DBaldock9 said:


> Thanks for the quick reply, but it's just a problem with my Linux PC and/or the JRiver MC28.
> 
> Once I had a chance today, I connected the RU6 to the Win10 PC at work (can't install any drivers on this one), and it was detected with no issues.
> Playing a YouTube video, the RU6 indicated the correct 48-KHz sample rate.
> ...


Is it only when tracks change sample rates?

What method are you using to connect? Asio? I'm unfamiliar with Linux audio system.

I had an issue like that with Jriver and DNLA to my Marantz (HEOS) receiver, but that's network based.

I'm going to mention it just in case it triggers a clue somewhere along the line, but my solution was to right click the DLNA Zone I was using, and near the bottom I have DNLA controller options, then I tick "disable Setnext Support" (for broken renderers)

This stops it from sending the track sample rate and bit depth etc in advance and allows the device to discover and set it itself.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 8, 2021)

DBaldock9 said:


> Thanks for the quick reply, but it's just a problem with my Linux PC and/or the JRiver MC28.
> 
> Once I had a chance today, I connected the RU6 to the Win10 PC at work (can't install any drivers on this one), and it was detected with no issues.
> Playing a YouTube video, the RU6 indicated the correct 48-KHz sample rate.
> ...


Sorry for asking the obvious: On your Linux, what‘s the output from ”aplay -l“ and ”aplay -L“? It should show the RU6 and its technical data / capabilities in detail. Sorry in particular, I should suppose you know Linux well enough.

Thereafter, I‘d like to repeat my suggestion to try other players, like mpd+Cantata and DeaDBeeF.

Thereafter, maybe you could consider to run on another Linux distro… Uhhh. Or wait until I get my RU6 and can test on openSUSE Tumbleweed and Manjaro. But I‘m afraid that would be only after the next weekend.

EDIT: I don‘t know anything about JRiver.


----------



## DBaldock9

Deders said:


> Is it only when tracks change sample rates?
> 
> What method are you using to connect? Asio? I'm unfamiliar with Linux audio system.
> 
> ...



There's a new-ish Linux audio sub-system, called Pipewire, that I'm using that to replace Pulseaudio.
So in MC28, I selected the Pipewire Sound Server as the output device.

When I first plugged the RU6 in to the PC, the Linux Sound Settings showed all of the audio devices (both video cards, D70 DAC, iFi Micro iDSD, & RU6), so I was able to select it and listen to music played through it.
But, after I unplugged / re-plugged it, the RU6 wasn't showing up any longer as a selectable device.
Not sure if there's a system service that I need to restart, or if there's an orphaned system process that I need to kill - that would allow the RU6 to be detected again.
I suspect that rebooting would fix the issue - but I don't want to reboot if it's not required.


----------



## dumpsterfire

nwavesailor said:


> Can this be used only as a EQ, not amp or DAC?
> 
> I have a TT2 DAC / Amp and wondered how this might (or might not) work just as a EQ.


The RU6 has no EQ features.


----------



## 111MilesToGo

DBaldock9 said:


> There's a new-ish Linux audio sub-system, called Pipewire, that I'm using that to replace Pulseaudio.
> So in MC28, I selected the Pipewire Sound Server as the output device.
> 
> When I first plugged the RU6 in to the PC, the Linux Sound Settings showed all of the audio devices (both video cards, D70 DAC, iFi Micro iDSD, & RU6), so I was able to select it and listen to music played through it.
> ...


How about playing directly to alsa then?


----------



## iFi audio

emilsoft said:


> I like the R2R effect; the visceral muscular bass, a more direct connection to the music, bloom and width - similar to what reasonable vinyl setup can sound like - minus the slight treble etch



R2R sound often is on the organic vinyl-like side, but usually has high FR in check.




emilsoft said:


> I also hear massive improvement over my ifi iusb 3.0 - if you have a usb decrapifier, use it to get some more of that raw r2r goodness. The ifi iusb also feeds cleaner power to the RU, which it appreciates.



Thanks! Cleaner USB in general means softer outlines, blacker background and finer textures, so beneficial things all in all


----------



## econaut

iFi audio said:


> R2R sound often is on the organic vinyl-like side, but usually has high FR in check.



This special R2R-sound applies to both NOS and OS mode, correct? Or is this only limited to NOS mode?


----------



## iFi audio

econaut said:


> This special R2R-sound applies to both NOS and OS mode, correct? Or is this only limited to NOS mode?



That's correct. Although noticeable, upsampling doesn't change a product's character so much that it sounds entirely differently. Some R2R DACs feature upsampling and after engaging it they still sound like R2R machines


----------



## someyoungguy

emilsoft said:


> I'm in two minds still about the RU6 - I agree with your portrayal that it has a nice ebb and flow of the music, but the etch/crispness you mention is still troubling me.. I have to be honest I had expectation of a warm,  polite and analogue r2r sound - but the etch is contradicting this and sometime masking the nice R2R qualities. Burn in time is under 50 hours and I've gotten used to the sound a little more now, but I can't still say it's an musical improvement and more enjoyable listen than say the cheaper Quidelix - but at least I can say if anything it has me gotten thinking more about higher end r2r and what's possible there; like the Hiby RS6 or Cayin's R01... if they can remove the etch to let just the natural organic r2r bloom and flow coming through that must be quite something...


My memory of the R01 is that the treble is quite different. I think I hear the same 'etch' characteristic you describe with the RU6, but didn't have that impression at all with the R01.


----------



## ryanjsoo

SemiAudiophile said:


> Im not hearing that "etch" either. To me, "etch" is a word I would use to describe BA timbre when poorly implemented.


Yeah sorry, I probably should have used better terminology! I meant more that it isn't an ill-defined sound rather than being a crisp and sharply defined one. I hope this clears up my thoughts


----------



## rwelles

Mine just arrived. Listened just a bit, then hooked it up burn-in. I'll listen in from time to time for the next couple of days, but initially it sounds purdy-dang gud!

It doesn't appear that volume can be controlled by the source unless I missed something. Any possibility of adding that feature in at a later date??


----------



## twister6

How about a new slogan: get RU6 to scratch the _etch_


----------



## Jawis (Dec 8, 2021)

rwelles said:


> Mine just arrived. Listened just a bit, then hooked it up burn-in. I'll listen in from time to time for the next couple of days, but initially it sounds purdy-dang gud!
> 
> It doesn't appear that volume can be controlled by the source unless I missed something. Any possibility of adding that feature in at a later date??


I can control volume at the source with Audirvana using Windows 10, but I think controlling volume with software may impact SQ.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

twister6 said:


> How about a new slogan: get RU6 to scratch the _etch_


Don't quit your day job for that gig in the Comedy Club.


----------



## pinkpiglet

Jawis said:


> I can control volume at the source with Audirvana using Windows 10, but I think controlling volume with software may impact SQ.


I think that's not what he meant. Some dongle DACs have their HID key function enabled where you can control your volume from the device, but the process of volume attenuation is done on the DAC instead of in the operating system. The W2 and the AK PEE51 are the example of that.


----------



## DBaldock9

DBaldock9 said:


> There's a new-ish Linux audio sub-system, called Pipewire, that I'm using that to replace Pulseaudio.
> So in MC28, I selected the Pipewire Sound Server as the output device.
> 
> When I first plugged the RU6 in to the PC, the Linux Sound Settings showed all of the audio devices (both video cards, D70 DAC, iFi Micro iDSD, & RU6), so I was able to select it and listen to music played through it.
> ...



When I restarted the Pipewire service, using the command line -
_*systemctl --user restart pipewire pipewire-pulse*_
- the RU6 reappeared in the list of selectable devices.
I selected it, relaunched MC28, and it's now playing the 24-Bit / 96-KHz album ("Mneme" by Ex Silentio [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_Silentio ]) that i was trying to play when MC28 hung-up last night.

So like I said a couple of posts ago - the issue last night was due to the Linux PC / MC28, and not a problem with the RU6.

I've switched to my Wong Kuan Wae "Blur hALF/hALF" (150-Ω, 2.5TRRS) Earbuds, still using the DJ44A (4.4mm->2.5mm) adapter.
In my quiet living room, the sound level is fine (hearing details, without being too loud) with the Volume set to 28.

One thing to NOTE: While at work this afternoon, I had the RU6 connected (with the Cayin USB-C cable) to my LG V35, and was definitely disturbed by sporadic "RF / Electrical" noise bursts.


----------



## Jawis

pinkpiglet said:


> I think that's not what he meant. Some dongle DACs have their HID key function enabled where you can control your volume from the device, but the process of volume attenuation is done on the DAC instead of in the operating system. The W2 and the AK PEE51 are the example of that.


Ah. Yes I can't control volume on the RU6 or S1 direct from phone. I can control my iBasso DC-04 volume via phone, but there is no built in hardware buttons. I assumed there would be conflicts controlling volume at the source with units that had controls built in. 
Thanks for clarifying.


----------



## bnupy

pinkpiglet said:


> I think that's not what he meant. Some dongle DACs have their HID key function enabled where you can control your volume from the device, but the process of volume attenuation is done on the DAC instead of in the operating system. The W2 and the AK PEE51 are the example of that.


The pee51 did not have any volume button tho


----------



## pinkpiglet

bnupy said:


> The pee51 did not have any volume button tho


But it has the HID function enabled. My point was to give one example of having a button and not having one.


----------



## TYATYA

rwelles said:


> Mine just arrived. Listened just a bit, then hooked it up burn-in. I'll listen in from time to time for the next couple of days, but initially it sounds purdy-dang gud!
> 
> It doesn't appear that volume can be controlled by the source unless I missed something. Any possibility of adding that feature in at a later date??


For example android world. When plugging ru6 to phone, neutron auto pop up and ask you give it permission to control ru6 fully.
If you allow, neutron volume and/or hard volume button (of the phone) will be disable.
If you dont allow, you can use volume button.
Always prefer 1st way


----------



## 111MilesToGo

DBaldock9 said:


> When I restarted the Pipewire service, using the command line -
> _*systemctl --user restart pipewire pipewire-pulse*_
> - the RU6 reappeared in the list of selectable devices.
> I selected it, relaunched MC28, and it's now playing the 24-Bit / 96-KHz album ("Mneme" by Ex Silentio [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_Silentio ]) that i was trying to play when MC28 hung-up last night.
> ...


Good to hear!

However, let me give a general remark on Linux audio. In the days of pulseaudio, it was and is mandatory to play directly to alsa in order to be sure that all replay is bit perfect. pulseaudio is like the obnoxious Windows Mixer in that MS world. I don‘t know whether that changes with pipewire, but I dare to doubt it.

So my suggestion would be to always play directly to alsa under Linux. That output is selectable in mpd, DeaDBeeF and many others, I suppose also in JRiver.


----------



## LostnAmerica

linux4ever said:


> I found treble to have the sparkle without being sibilant. And I haven't noticed much change in the Treble after burn-in. I've 80 hours on it now and the changes that I've noticed is at the lower end. The congestion in certain intense sections of some songs are better now.
> 
> So far I've been pairing it with my Macbook Pro. I decided today to pair with Cayin Nii. What an upgrade to the sound between the digital out from the Macbook's sound card to N6ii. The output from N6ii is so clear and the RU6 sings so happily.
> 
> ...


Nice be sure to let u know how the N3Pro works out, and how you connect it al together as my N3 I just waiting for a little something more.😉


----------



## If6was9

My, purchased on Cayin.de,
on December 2nd, and shipped with DHL, it is stopped in Germany since December 3rd


----------



## yaps66

If6was9 said:


> My, purchased on Cayin.de,
> on December 2nd, and shipped with DHL, it is stopped in Germany since December 3rd


That's frustrating. I hope this gets sorted out soon.


----------



## alota

Strange. I bought from cayin germany monday and today arrives in portugal with dhl


----------



## econaut

DBaldock9 said:


> One thing to NOTE: While at work this afternoon, I had the RU6 connected (with the Cayin USB-C cable) to my LG V35, and was definitely disturbed by sporadic "RF / Electrical" noise bursts.



I read about EMI noise problems with different dongles quite often. I have never experienced that. How does this sound? How can I maybe cause this deliberetely in order to test?


----------



## 111MilesToGo

I ordered mine from Cayin Germany late Friday; the order was fulfilled on Monday. After presumably sitting in the local DHL store in that little city where Cayin is located for a day or two, the package has now arrived in my region of Germany. So, patience is the name of the game; and that is the price of the season as well as the price for being located in the very nice region of the Taunus hills.


----------



## emilsoft

The RU6 is a very nice pairing for the JVC FDX1 IEM - the natural tone of the Cayin counteracts the slight metallic tinge of the JVC, and the bloom fills out the fast decay of the IEM - it's a super combination. I always found the JVC slightly too aggressive with my other sources such as the Earmen Sparrow, but the RU6 gives a solid inject of bloom and warmth to complement.. Also, because of the FDX1 slight treble roll off, there is no issues with treble etch


----------



## captblaze

Meenova Lignting to USB-C OTG Cable <---- If you want to get some distance between your iPhone and RU6 try this. Not claiming it is made from Unicorn bits or anything like that. It is a cable that interfaces between your iPhone and RU6. There are 2 lengths 4ft. and .5 ft.. There is also a USB-C to USB-C model. 

The 4 ft. cable works with my iphone 13 mini and RU6 with no issue.


----------



## If6was9

111MilesToGo said:


> I ordered mine from Cayin Germany late Friday; the order was fulfilled on Monday. After presumably sitting in the local DHL store in that little city where Cayin is located for a day or two, the package has now arrived in my region of Germany. So, patience is the name of the game; and that is the price of the season as well as the price for being located in the very nice region of the Taunus hills.


Mine has still been stopped for 4 days in Germany, it has to arrive in Italy.
I hope it will be released by today, otherwise I am forced to cancel the order


----------



## vilhelm44

To anyone who has both RU6 and N6ii w/R01, is there a big enough difference in the sound to warrant the extra spend on the DAP? Just talking from sound point only and nothing else. I'm loving the RU6 sounds, and it's got me thinking about N6ii/R01 now.


----------



## Deders

If6was9 said:


> Mine has still been stopped for 4 days in Germany, it has to arrive in Italy.
> I hope it will be released by today, otherwise I am forced to cancel the order


Maybe phone your courier first?


----------



## iFi audio

Deders said:


> Maybe phone your courier first?



If a package is stuck at a customs clearance office that's beyond a courier company, but otherwise it wouldn't harm calling it and ask about any delays.


----------



## econaut

iFi audio said:


> If a package is stuck at a customs clearance office that's beyond a courier company, but otherwise it wouldn't harm calling it and ask about any delays.


In the EU there shouldn't be any customs clearance  

OT Disclaimer: Really sad about Brexit.


----------



## musicday

Anyone in UK can browse Cayin website? Doesn't work for me.


----------



## Andykong

musicday said:


> Anyone in UK can browse Cayin website? Doesn't work for me.



We are in the middle of transition from old web server to new web server.  We have move the Chinese web site already, and is working on the English website this week.  Short term offline is expected but the service should resume shortly.  Well, at least that's what I was promised.


----------



## DBaldock9

111MilesToGo said:


> Good to hear!
> 
> However, let me give a general remark on Linux audio. In the days of pulseaudio, it was and is mandatory to play directly to alsa in order to be sure that all replay is bit perfect. pulseaudio is like the obnoxious Windows Mixer in that MS world. I don‘t know whether that changes with pipewire, but I dare to doubt it.
> 
> So my suggestion would be to always play directly to alsa under Linux. That output is selectable in mpd, DeaDBeeF and many others, I suppose also in JRiver.



The actual Audio Device name that I selected in MC28 is: *pipewire  [ALSA]  Pipewire Sound Server*
So, while pipewire does currently replace pulseaudio, it works with ALSA, instead of completely replacing it.

Quote from - https://wiki.debian.org/PipeWire
"_For ALSA
ALSA clients can be configured to output via PipeWire.
Some may describe this as "replacing ALSA", but as the PipeWire FAQ clarifies: "No, ALSA is an essential part of the Linux audio stack, it provides the interface to the kernel audio drivers. That said, the ALSA user space library has a lot of stuff in it that is probably not desirable anymore these days, like effects plugins, mixing, routing, slaving, etc. PipeWire uses a small subset of the core ALSA functionality to access the hardware. All of the other features should be handled by PipeWire."_"


----------



## Andykong

rwelles said:


> Mine just arrived. Listened just a bit, then hooked it up burn-in. I'll listen in from time to time for the next couple of days, but initially it sounds purdy-dang gud!
> 
> It doesn't appear that volume can be controlled by the source unless I missed something. Any possibility of adding that feature in at a later date??





pinkpiglet said:


> I think that's not what he meant. Some dongle DACs have their HID key function enabled where you can control your volume from the device, but the process of volume attenuation is done on the DAC instead of in the operating system. The W2 and the AK PEE51 are the example of that.



Thanks pinkpiglet for explaining the situation for us.   Since R-2R DAC doesn't support volume control during digital decoding, so even when we enabled USB HIB class, you won't be able to control the volume of RU6 from the source.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

emilsoft said:


> I like the R2R effect; the visceral muscular bass, a more direct connection to the music, bloom and width - similar to what reasonable vinyl setup can sound like - minus the slight treble etch


Yeah I'd akin the sound to vinyl but without hiss, pops, and crackles. It presents a good amount of detail but it's not got give you the hyper amount that a sabre chip can get you. 

I keep thinking about the etch and I think I can kind of hear what you guys are talking about. But it's not super apparent to me, unless I actively listen for it. I just notice a bit of crispiness up top is all, but still burning mines in at about 20hrs at this point.


----------



## Andykong

Ufanco said:


> Interesting device and I have a question on the firmware. Is it able to be update and if so how?





bnupy said:


> Are there going to be chances on firmware updates like the other dongles ?





musicday said:


> Will there be any firmware updates for RU6, new features added in the future?



Yes, you can update firmware in RU6, I have done that already.  My RU6 was an early production unit with beta firmware,  I need to fresh the firmware when the official version was available.    The process is a little bit more complicated than updating DAP firmware because I need to install a firmware update tool and device driver for that purpose.  It is similar to refresh your mobile phone firmware through a wired connection.


----------



## Andykong

SemiAudiophile said:


> Yeah I'd akin the sound to vinyl but without hiss, pops, and crackles. It presents a good amount of detail but it's not got give you the hyper amount that a sabre chip can get you.
> 
> I keep thinking about the etch and I think I can kind of hear what you guys are talking about. But it's not super apparent to me, unless I actively listen for it. I just notice a bit of crispiness up top is all, but still burning mines in at about 20hrs at this point.



Unfortunately once you start "looking" for it, it will bug you more gradually, and eventually affected your listening experience more than you would have anticipated.  This is similar to background hiss with IEM.  Most users are not particularly sensitive to hissing, but once they learned how to look for it, they'll train their ear to detect the hiss gradually and become more sensitive to that.


----------



## emilsoft

SemiAudiophile said:


> Yeah I'd akin the sound to vinyl but without hiss, pops, and crackles. It presents a good amount of detail but it's not got give you the hyper amount that a sabre chip can get you.
> 
> I keep thinking about the etch and I think I can kind of hear what you guys are talking about. But it's not super apparent to me, unless I actively listen for it. I just notice a bit of crispiness up top is all, but still burning mines in at about 20hrs at this point.


Keep burnin' in ..


----------



## utdeep

vilhelm44 said:


> To anyone who has both RU6 and N6ii w/R01, is there a big enough difference in the sound to warrant the extra spend on the DAP? Just talking from sound point only and nothing else. I'm loving the RU6 sounds, and it's got me thinking about N6ii/R01 now.


I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.


----------



## emilsoft

utdeep said:


> I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.



I think what is also key with RU6 is the source. The R01 obviously has a very good power and digital feed... if you just plonk the RU6 on the end of a phone for sure it'll sound far from optimal.. if you want to compare it like for like you need a very good usb source like the ifi iusb or other decrapifiers, also consider battery power (with a split usb cable, one for the data and one for the battery).. ofcourse this brings up the cost.. but for me something like the ifi iusb 3 is a necessity as I use it for almost all my gear, it's probably the best audio investment I've made over the years as it's benefitted almost everything I plugged into it, including the the RU6 to a large extent.

offtopic - @iFi audio  if you're listening, please don't forget about your iusbs - I hope you haven't discontinued your ifi nano iusb, and you're cooking up a iusb micro v4


----------



## vilhelm44

utdeep said:


> I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.


Thanks for that, I think I'll be getting an N6ii/R01 sometime soon.


----------



## emilsoft

vilhelm44 said:


> Thanks for that, I think I'll be getting an N6ii/R01 sometime soon.


How about the Hiby RS6? I wonder how that compares...


----------



## SemiAudiophile

utdeep said:


> I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.


Care to elaborate on the differences between RU6 and R01? Blacker background, detail, etc.


----------



## vilhelm44 (Dec 9, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> How about the Hiby RS6? I wonder how that compares...


I've read up on that and sounds like it could be good but I've never liked having the sockets at the base of a DAP.


----------



## Andykong

utdeep said:


> I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.



The different is indeed noticeable, I can't help from repeating myself here. If the different is minor, than someone in Cayin has make a terrible _mistake_ in setting the pricing for RU6   

Having said that, if you want to compare the RU6 to R01 fair and square, you can use N6ii as USB source to RU6, that would minimise the different caused by inferior source with RU6.  Even with that, the bitstream in N6ii+R01 are transmitted internally in I2S, but for the case of RU6, the digital audio data need to passed from N6ii to RU6 via USB Audio, and then convert to I2S in the USB Audio Bridge in RU6.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

Dammit Andy, I'm trying really hard to resist buying another $2k DAP. 😭


----------



## rwelles

pinkpiglet said:


> I think that's not what he meant. Some dongle DACs have their HID key function enabled where you can control your volume from the device, but the process of volume attenuation is done on the DAC instead of in the operating system. The W2 and the AK PEE51 are the example of that.


Yes, that's exactly what I meant!


Andykong said:


> Since R-2R DAC doesn't support volume control during digital decoding, so even when we enabled USB HIB class, you won't be able to control the volume of RU6 from the source.


Thanks for the clarification, Andy! 

One of my main uses for a dongle is when I walk my dog. Most all buttons on dongles and DAPs are small for me, esp. when I'm wearing gloves. I use my Apple Watch to control playback which is easily done even w/ gloves. So the RU6 won't be used on my walks.

I still can use it around the house w/ my iPhone running Roon. It's been burned in for about 15 hours now. Listening to it now w/ my Odins. It does sound _really_ good!! 

Hmmmm... R01 you say....


----------



## rwelles

utdeep said:


> I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.


Wondering what DAPs you've compared to the N6ii/R01? I'm thinking about getting one. I've been using SPKM, Hugo2Go, and Mojo/Poly. How do they compare? 

Don't want to hijack this thread, so you can pm me.


----------



## Stuff Jones (Dec 9, 2021)

Congrats to Cayin and @Andykong for making a reasonably affordable R2R based dongle that actually sounds like R2R. I thought it might be a gimmick but its not, it actually sounds like R2R. I think this device is a significant step forward for our hobby.

People comparing it to the W2 are missing the point. R2R is a different sound than DS. In my opinion R2R sounds more realistic, less digital. It has better texture and less artificially hard leading edges to notes. To me the difference between R2R and DS is like the difference between DD and BA. I much prefer DD to BA, and similarly much prefer R2R to DS.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

Stuff Jones said:


> Congrats to Cayin and @Andykong for making a reasonably affordable R2R based dongle that actually sounds like R2R. I thought it might be a gimmick but its not, it actually sounds like R2R. I think this device is a significant step forward for our hobby.
> 
> People comparing it to the W2 are missing the point. R2R is a different sound than DS. In my opinion R2R sounds more realistic, less digital. It has better texture and less artificially hard leading edges to notes. To me the difference between R2R and DS is like the difference between DD and BA. I much prefer DD to BA, and similarly much prefer R2R to DS.


I think I generally prefer the R2R sound as well. But DS chips still have a place and I don't see them going away. Each chip has their own characteristic sound and I enjoy hearing the differences between them. It's a different experience but can be equally enjoyable as well.


----------



## ActuallySparky (Dec 9, 2021)

Received my RU6 earlier this week and have been listening and burning in over the last few days. Well done Cayin - this thing is amazing for a dongle. It's not quite as resolving as some of my desktop gear, but the sound it very pleasant to listen to. Subjectively I think I prefer this to the W2 for having a more engaging and authoritative low end, although the W2 might edge it out in detail and imaging. The RU6 is warm blanket sound - I just wanna lay down and wrap myself up in it and listen.

I'm surprised by how much power it can muster. While not shining at their absolute best, both the IER-Z1r and the Legend X sound wonderful on the RU6, and easier to drive stuff is a piece of cake. 1DD IEMs like the Campfire Atlas, Fiio FD5, or even the Blon BL-03 are really nicely paired with the RU-6.

There's a bit of waterfall hiss - sensitive IEMs are very much restricted to low gain and SE, but with those restrictions the hiss isn't too bad when music is playing. The Campfire Ara/Andromeda are listenable, but honestly I'd prefer them on the W2 or another unit with lower hiss to distract me.

Of note: the RU6 seems rather source sensitive. The stage and noise properties change depending on how clean the USB signal its fed, and how good the power from USB is. My iPad Pro is a great match, some of my older computers and phones yield poorer results.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 9, 2021)

The more I listen to it the more I appreciate what it's bringing to the table - it's ever so slightly adding a little warm fuzz to each note, making it hit a little more gently, but still retaining it's definition. The decay also lingers on a touch longer and more naturally, there's a nice warm bloom.
Overall nice coherence and directness to the sound, not to mention very nice width and some 3D imaging..

but the main point is that slightly fuzzy and blunted attack, coupled with nice density of the mids, just takes the edge of a lot of digital and works well with slightly aggressive headphones.

I even tried it on my Woo WA8 with HD800S - that slight fuzziness and lack of ringing you get in many d/s dacs complemented the Sennheisers bright nature.

Cayin defo managed to get the R2R connection through in this dongle. I do think it needs good amount of burn in though.

I think as it's bringing a unique natural tonality it's a little difficult to compare to other d/s dongles, it kind of stands on it's own really and nips at the heels of more expensive d/s dacs that work so hard to bring a sense of organic/naturalness feel, where this comes out of the box for the RU6 (with some side effects of course given the pricing).

The main thing is it has it's heart in the right place I think.


----------



## alota

The delivery of my package was today in a service point of dhl. Sadly the package is missed.


----------



## richoval

alota said:


> The delivery of my package was today in a service point of dhl. Sadly the package is missed.



dhl is just the absolut worst currier… lost a couple of packages already, one with my odin fe! they suck!


----------



## alota

richoval said:


> dhl is just the absolut worst currier… lost a couple of packages already, one with my odin fe! they suck!


Usually in portugal works fine. This time the package did not arrive at sercice point. I chose service point for greater security


----------



## Stuff Jones (Dec 9, 2021)

@Andykong - Is there any risk of damage to store the RU6 close to strong magnets? I would like to transport it in the same case as my Dunu Zen Pro, but they have such strong magnets they stick together...


----------



## musicday

alota said:


> The delivery of my package was today in a service point of dhl. Sadly the package is missed.


Sorry to read this. Hopefully everything will be sorted for you soon.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 10, 2021)

Andykong said:


> Yes, you can update firmware in RU6, I have done that already.  My RU6 was an early production unit with beta firmware,  I need to fresh the firmware when the official version was available.    The process is a little bit more complicated than updating DAP firmware because I need to install a firmware update tool and device driver for that purpose.  It is similar to refresh your mobile phone firmware through a wired connection.


Very good to hear that it is possible in case the need for an update comes due to bugs/improvements. Don‘t be shy of letting us do this by way of extra software. We have all flashed our computer BIOS/EFI just that way, and so many external devices (EDIT: E.g. AudioQuest DragonFlies).


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 10, 2021)

I received mine yesterday (Cayin Germany, DHL). Just ran a few tests with my Windows 8.1 laptop and my iPhone XR. Usually I hate premature early reports, but:

What does work is: foobar2000 on Windows, Qobuz on iOS. With foobar2000, PCM works up to 24/192; but I get clicks when playing DSD (64-256). Will check more deeply.

Failed: Roon on Windows. Setting the device up looks okay, but trying to play a track just doesn‘t start, no error message. Anybody else seeing this?

Not tested yet: Linux.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

emilsoft said:


> The more I listen to it the more I appreciate what it's bringing to the table - it's ever so slightly adding a little warm fuzz to each note, making it hit a little more gently, but still retaining it's definition. The decay also lingers on a touch longer and more naturally, there's a nice warm bloom.
> Overall nice coherence and directness to the sound, not to mention very nice width and some 3D imaging..
> 
> but the main point is that slightly fuzzy and blunted attack, coupled with nice density of the mids, just takes the edge of a lot of digital and works well with slightly aggressive headphones.
> ...


I agree with using the word "natural" to describe the sound of the RU6.   The texture is soft and gentle and not crisp and edgy.    It's like punching your fist into a soft mitt.    It is very nice.


----------



## OspreyAndy

Finally it's here. Cayin RU6. And....from the first listen with my Fostex T40RP MK3, volume at 70/100, sweet analogue sound yet crisp with sharp imaging and excellent micro details. Without a doubt a better performer than both L&P W2 and Lotoo PAW S1. Perhaps on par with PAW S2, at least I can tell RU6 has better sense of space as opposed to S2 more intimate staging. Will spend more time and see what else this baby can do.....


----------



## yaps66

111MilesToGo said:


> I received mine yesterday (Cayin Germany, DHL). Just ran a few tests with my Windows 8.1 laptop and my iPhone XR. Usually I hate premature early reports, but:
> 
> What does work is: foobar2000 on Windows, Qobuz on iOS. With foobar2000, PCM works up to 24/192; but I get clicks when playing DSD (64-256). Will check more deeply.
> 
> ...


I had a similar problem with Roon. What I did was to enable RU6 WASAPI and make sure it plays music. Then enable RU6 ASIO.  Once you hear music on ASIO, you can disable WASAPI.  Hope this works for you.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 10, 2021)

@Andykong, please, just to make sure: Can I run my C9 from the RU6? I am asking this in light of all the precautions with the C9 battery / voltage difference watchdog, as the RU6 is on USB 5 Volts. In particular, what about the BAL connection from RU6 to C9, (a) when using the original Cayin 4.4 interconnect without ground connection, and (b) my special case with a 4.4 interconnect with ground connection? How about SE connection from RU6 to C9 with Cayin 3.5 interconnect?

PS: I know the RU6 and the C9 play in different leagues, but since I have them both plus the N6ii …

PPS: What I can say up to now is: The RU6 simply is a very nice gadget, well worth getting as an easy-to-use quick and good solution.


----------



## musicday

Where do you guys download the drivers from  for RU-6?


----------



## econaut

musicday said:


> Where do you guys download the drivers from  for RU-6?


https://en.cayin.cn/download/?itemid=140


----------



## TYATYA

111MilesToGo said:


> @Andykong, please, just to make sure: Can I run my C9 from the RU6? I am asking this in light of all the precautions with the C9 battery / voltage difference watchdog, as the RU6 is on USB 5 Volts. In particular, what about the BAL connection from RU6 to C9, (a) when using the original Cayin 4.4 interconnect without ground connection, and (b) my special case with a 4.4 interconnect with ground connection? How about SE connection from RU6 to C9 with Cayin 3.5 interconnect?
> 
> PS: I know the RU6 and the C9 play in different leagues, but since I have them both plus the N6ii …
> 
> PPS: What I can say up to now is: The RU6 simply is a very nice gadget, well worth getting as an easy-to-use quick and good solution.


Did you think 4.4 on ru6 is input port?
Correct me if Iam wrong, it is output only.


----------



## musicday

econaut said:


> https://en.cayin.cn/download/?itemid=140


Tried for the last few days and doesn't work.


----------



## TYATYA

musicday said:


> Tried for the last few days and doesn't work.


Pm me email if you need a share. 
May be you tried when their web is under mainternance


----------



## twister6

111MilesToGo said:


> @Andykong, please, just to make sure: Can I run my C9 from the RU6? I am asking this in light of all the precautions with the C9 battery / voltage difference watchdog, as the RU6 is on USB 5 Volts. In particular, what about the BAL connection from RU6 to C9, (a) when using the original Cayin 4.4 interconnect without ground connection, and (b) my special case with a 4.4 interconnect with ground connection? How about SE connection from RU6 to C9 with Cayin 3.5 interconnect?
> 
> PS: I know the RU6 and the C9 play in different leagues, but since I have them both plus the N6ii …
> 
> PPS: What I can say up to now is: The RU6 simply is a very nice gadget, well worth getting as an easy-to-use quick and good solution.



Two weeks ago I shared my experience of C9/RU6 pair up (single ended path) here.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I FINALLY got my refund, 10 days later for the Cobalt… and… I just placed my order for the Cayin RU6. Finally! 

Now I’m hoping they will be here before or when my Laylas arrive in a week. If it doesn’t arrive by then, I’m not opening my Laylas till it comes. I’ll take pics and do a separate thread of everything. 😊


----------



## 111MilesToGo

yaps66 said:


> I had a similar problem with Roon. What I did was to enable RU6 WASAPI and make sure it plays music. Then enable RU6 ASIO.  Once you hear music on ASIO, you can disable WASAPI.  Hope this works for you.


Thank you, @yaps66, good and clear-cut advice. I did as you said, but unfortunately, it works only partially for me with Roon on my Windows 8.1 laptop (both updated to the latest).

What I observe is this:
(0) Yesterday, I had enabled only the RU6 ASIO device and done its settings properly. Roon just doesn't play anything through ASIO, although the "audio path" indicator looks correct. There is no click in the headphone, which normally indicates that the RU6 switches on. This happens for any source, local files, Qobuz, Tidal, and and any bit depth / sample rate. In fact, what Roon does is walk through the album, try each track for some time, then upon failure to play give up and go for the next track.
(1) In Roon, I now did enable the RU6 WASAPI device and did its setting properly, including exclusive mode. Roon plays nicely through WASAPI, the "audio path" is shown properly. The switch-on click can be heard.
(2) Returning to the ASIO device, Roon does play now, proper "audio path".
(3) Switching back and forth between WASAPI and ASIO, all is good.
(4) Then disable the RU6 WASAPI device, select the ASIO, all is good still.
(5) Exit from Roon.
(6) Launch Roon again, the RU6 ASIO is still selected and WASAPI disabled - oops, same error again, Roon refuses to play anything.
(7) Enable and select RU6 WASAPI, Roon does play through it.
(8) Select RU6 ASIO, Roon does play now.

My conclusions are:
(1) It seems that Window's own WASAPI driver is capable of initializing or whatever the RU6 properly, such that playing to it works. It seems the Cayin supplied RU6 ASIO driver (third party) doesn't work properly in the context of Roon.
(2) Usually, I prefer ASIO drivers above WASAPI, since they can handle DSD better than WASAPI. However, it would be a horrendous nuisance to first play through WASAPI in order to "unlock" the RU6, then go to ASIO for serious playback.
(3) So I am sticking to RU6 WASAPI with Roon for the time being and disable the Cayin supplied ASIO driver in Roon.
(4) The thing is: This issue occurs only in Roon with the RU6 ASIO. foobar2000 does play through RU6 ASIO properly, and it handles all sample rate switchings.

@yaps66: I would be glad if you could check whether you can confirm my findings. Your last post quoted above indicated that you could solve the problem by playing through WASAPI just once, then forget about WASAPI forever and stick to ASIO, even after shutting down Roon, launching it again or after rebooting the PC.

@Andykong, I would be glad if you could pick up on this issue in case @yaps66 confirms my findings. The difficulty is that the issue described here seems to be a Roon and Cayin-supplied RU6 ASIO driver "cooperation".

Addendum: This issue does NOT occur with any other USB-DAC or similar device and driver I have. Not with the Cayin N6ii and its ASIO driver (Thesycon, wich is different from the RU6 one), not with the Chord Hugo 2 and its Chord-supplied ASIO driver, and also not with the miniDSP USB-to-Optical Streamer and its miniDSP-supplied ASIO driver (also Thesycon). Of course, when I say manufacturer-supplied driver, in most cases this means that the device manufacturer supplies a third-party driver suitable for the input receiver in the USB-DAC.

2nd addendum: I still have to check thoroughly whether foobar2000 behaves properly with RU6 ASIO. I have the RU6 on burn-in now, with foobar2000 playing a long playlist with many sample rate switchings between tracks.


----------



## claud W

A couple of questions, please
1) Is the RU6 powered just by the USB connection and it does not have any internal battery?
2) What happens when you try to play a MQA encoded song?


----------



## If6was9

emilsoft said:


> I think what is also key with RU6 is the source. The R01 obviously has a very good power and digital feed... if you just plonk the RU6 on the end of a phone for sure it'll sound far from optimal.. if you want to compare it like for like you need a very good usb source like the ifi iusb or other decrapifiers, also consider battery power (with a split usb cable, one for the data and one for the battery).. ofcourse this brings up the cost.. but for me something like the ifi iusb 3 is a necessity as I use it for almost all my gear, it's probably the best audio investment I've made over the years as it's benefitted almost everything I plugged into it, including the the RU6 to a large extent.
> 
> offtopic - @iFi audio  if you're listening, please don't forget about your iusbs - I hope you haven't discontinued your ifi nano iusb, and you're cooking up a iusb micro v4


Yes, I was also thinking of using battery power, with a split cable (power and data)
But in this way (using the battery power, you go to power the smartphone (in my case), and not in dongle dac, right?
In this way, powering through the battery power while it plays, is there a danger of loss of audio quality, or of introducing noise?
Could you recommend a cable or an adapter to connect the battery power and the dac together?
The important thing is that both Usb C to Usb C
(RU6, Smartphone and battery power, all have Usb C)
Thanks


----------



## 111MilesToGo

claud W said:


> A couple of questions, please
> 1) Is the RU6 powered just by the USB connection and it does not have any internal battery?
> 2) What happens when you try to play a MQA encoded song?


Let me try:
1) Yes, only via USB.
2) The RU6 has no MQA capability. Therefore only the capability of the player software are relevant. I tried the Tidal app on my iPhone today, it does the first unfold, such that 88.2 or 96 kHz arrive at the RU6, depending on whether the track is 44.1 or 48 kHz MQA-encoded.


----------



## twister6

111MilesToGo said:


> Let me try:
> 1) Yes, only via USB.
> 2) The RU6 has no MQA capability. Therefore only the capability of the player software are relevant. I tried the Tidal app on my iPhone today, it does the first unfold, such that 88.2 or 96 kHz arrive at the RU6, depending on whether the track is 44.1 or 48 kHz MQA-encoded.



That is correct, but I also noticed something interesting.  With my Galaxy S9 when I use UAPP to play Tidal master, UAPP shows track as 96kHz and RU6 reflects that correctly as well.  But when I load Tidal app to play the same Tidal master, RU6 connected to my phone now shows 192kHz.

Then, I did another experiment with RS6 DAP, which has MQA 16x support.  In there, UAPP shows direct 384kHz and in notification I see full 768kHz unfolding.  When I connect RU6, it still shows in UAPP direct 384kHz, but in notification bar and on RU6 it shows 96kHz.  Then, when I start Tidal, it unfolds to 768kHz without RU6 attached (RS6 16x mqa), but when I connect RU6, it goes down to 96kHz.

So, it seems like the highest sampling rate I can get it by running Tidal app on my smartphone with RU6 attached.

... and if you don't want to deal with this MQA nonsense, just get yourself Amazon HD or Qobuz or Apple Music


----------



## blotmouse

twister6 said:


> That is correct, but I also noticed something interesting.  With my Galaxy S9 when I use UAPP to play Tidal master, UAPP shows track as 96kHz and RU6 reflects that correctly as well.  But when I load Tidal app to play the same Tidal master, RU6 connected to my phone now shows 192kHz.
> 
> Then, I did another experiment with RS6 DAP, which has MQA 16x support.  In there, UAPP shows direct 384kHz and in notification I see full 768kHz unfolding.  When I connect RU6, it still shows in UAPP direct 384kHz, but in notification bar and on RU6 it shows 96kHz.  Then, when I start Tidal, it unfolds to 768kHz without RU6 attached (RS6 16x mqa), but when I connect RU6, it goes down to 96kHz.
> 
> ...


Sounds like some glitchy software there, which is the MQA speciality.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

At the request of another headfier, I paired the RU6 with the Focal Utopia headphones.    This pairing works great.    The Utopia is very easy to drive and sounds good on all sources.   But, some sources really make them come alive.   The RU6 is one such source.    I am listening at 42, so there is a lot of headroom.   The sound is very natural and balanced.   There is decent subbass and the imaging is more 3D giving it an enhanced perception of sound stage which is where the Utopias tend to be weak.   The treble is very good and the RU6 can deliver enough power to take advantage of the nice punch and slam of the Utopia.   The natural tone of the RU6 also slight reduces the metalic timbre that some complain about.    It doesn't bother me and it is not as natural sounding as the HD800S, but you can't be the punch and slam of the Utopia as long as you have a source that can enhance its sound stage and treble.   I like this pairing so much that I am taking with me to listen for the weekend trip I am taking.


----------



## Andykong

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> At the request of another headfier, I paired the RU6 with the Focal Utopia headphones.    This pairing works great.    The Utopia is very easy to drive and sounds good on all sources.   But, some sources really make them come alive.   The RU6 is one such source.    I am listening at 42, so there is a lot of headroom.   The sound is very natural and balanced.   There is decent subbass and the imaging is more 3D giving it an enhanced perception of sound stage which is where the Utopias tend to be weak.   The treble is very good and the RU6 can deliver enough power to take advantage of the nice punch and slam of the Utopia.   The natural tone of the RU6 also slight reduces the metalic timbre that some complain about.    It doesn't bother me and it is not as natural sounding as the HD800S, but you can't be the punch and slam of the Utopia as long as you have a source that can enhance its sound stage and treble.   I like this pairing so much that I am taking with me to listen for the weekend trip I am taking.



This is a nice surprise, didn't expect RU6 and Utopia is a good match.

Base on your expression, we should expect even better result with Focal Stella, and being closed back will make this combo more practical for portable.


----------



## econaut

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> At the request of another headfier, I paired the RU6 with the Focal Utopia headphones.    This pairing works great.    The Utopia is very easy to drive and sounds good on all sources.   But, some sources really make them come alive.   The RU6 is one such source.    I am listening at 42, so there is a lot of headroom.   The sound is very natural and balanced.   There is decent subbass and the imaging is more 3D giving it an enhanced perception of sound stage which is where the Utopias tend to be weak.   The treble is very good and the RU6 can deliver enough power to take advantage of the nice punch and slam of the Utopia.   The natural tone of the RU6 also slight reduces the metalic timbre that some complain about.    It doesn't bother me and it is not as natural sounding as the HD800S, but you can't be the punch and slam of the Utopia as long as you have a source that can enhance its sound stage and treble.   I like this pairing so much that I am taking with me to listen for the weekend trip I am taking.


Wow, now this comes as a suprise to me. Let me explain.

I have the RU6 and the PAW S2 here and haven't decided yet which one to keep. I won't keep both.

While I like many things the RU6 does soundwise, I unfortunately also have a problem with the upper mids / treble. There's a certain harshness (etch?) that makes the RU6 a little (too) fatiguing to my ears. This has not disappeared after 74 hours of burn in yet. Still hoping.

I had Utopias for some time as well. Actually I sold them because of a certain upper mids / treble harshness (combined with "too much" dynamics and other things) - they were too fatiguing to me, although they did many many things great. Similar to the RU6.

So RU6 plus Utopia does not sound as good synergy - from memory and to my ears, of course. YMMV.


----------



## Andykong

twister6 said:


> That is correct, but I also noticed something interesting.  With my Galaxy S9 when I use UAPP to play Tidal master, UAPP shows track as 96kHz and RU6 reflects that correctly as well.  But when I load Tidal app to play the same Tidal master, RU6 connected to my phone now shows 192kHz.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My guess is, UAPP is bit perfect USB Audio, so it will deliver  the 96kHz through USB as-is.  The Tidal App is not bit perfect and is subject to Android SRC, it will output 96kHz as it should be, like the UAPP, but the SRC in Galaxy S9 will upsample it to 192kHz before output to USB Audio.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

econaut said:


> Wow, now this comes as a suprise to me. Let me explain.
> 
> I have the RU6 and the PAW S2 here and haven't decided yet which one to keep. I won't keep both.
> 
> ...


People hear things differently.   It sounds like neither the RU6, nor the Utopia is for you.  No problem.  Lots of headphones and gear to choose from.

I never heard the term "etch" before you mentioned it.   I heard someone else try to explain it in a way that I could understand.  But, I am not hearing that at all with my RU6.  When I hear problems with treble, it manifests itself in a graininess that isn't smooth.  It's a bit grating to my ears and I attribute it at times to a lack of resolution or thinness in the note weight of the treble.  This happens with some vocals.


----------



## Andykong

claud W said:


> A couple of questions, please
> 1) Is the RU6 powered just by the USB connection and it does not have any internal battery?
> 2) What happens when you try to play a MQA encoded song?



(1) Yes, RU6 does not have internal battery

(2) I didn't recall any R-2R DAC can support MQA decoding.  

MQA implementation, in majority cases, are base on manipulation of certain digital filter in the DAC chipset to support the unfolding feature, some latest DAC chipset has even include  hardware MQA support.  This will further simplified the MQA implementation.   For example, the ES9068Q is primarily a ES9038Q2m with hardware MQA support. 

To implement MQA in R-2R, we need to add a DSP engine before the R-2R resistor network, to detect and unfold the MQA audio signal before starting R-2R decoding. That's why we haven't seen any proper MQA support in R-2R DAC product.


----------



## Andykong

musicday said:


> Tried for the last few days and doesn't work.



If you can't download the USB Audio Device Driver form the download link of our website, you can try the alternative download link as highlighted below, this is a Google Drive link, it is more reliable in some countries.


----------



## Andykong

Stuff Jones said:


> @Andykong - Is there any risk of damage to store the RU6 close to strong magnets? I would like to transport it in the same case as my Dunu Zen Pro, but they have such strong magnets they stick together...



No, you won't run into any problem if your IEM and RU6 are magnate to each other.  The only risk here is electromagnetic induction and that only happen if you hold a piece of magnet on the RU6 and rub it up and down quickly. Obvious this won't happen when they stick together because there is no relative movement.


----------



## briantrinh86

Incredible value for r2r portable dac. It beats chord mojo in any aspects


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## econaut (Dec 10, 2021)

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> People hear things differently.   It sounds like neither the RU6, nor the Utopia is for you.  No problem.  Lots of headphones and gear to choose from.
> 
> I never heard the term "etch" before you mentioned it.   I heard someone else try to explain it in a way that I could understand.  But, I am not hearing that at all with my RU6.  When I hear problems with treble, it manifests itself in a graininess that isn't smooth.  It's a bit grating to my ears and I attribute it at times to a lack of resolution or thinness in the note weight of the treble.  This happens with some vocals.


Concerning the Utopias that's correct. Concerning the RU6 I am on the fence. Coincidentally I am listening to the dongles with the Campfire Cascade that has beryllium coated drivers similar (not the same) to the beryllium drivers of the Utopias.

And I am not the guy who introduced the word "etch" here. I just assume I am hearing the same thing that several other people here called "etch" or "edgy treble".

I wouldn't say the RU6 is brighter than the S2, for example. But the S2 is smoother in the treble and less fatiguing with the Cascade and to my ears. OTOH the treble of the RU6 sounds definitely more realistic, especially when listening to cymbals.

Of course the cymbals will still sound realistic after a hundred hours of burn in. The question is if that fatiguing effect will be gone. If yes, the RU6 is a keeper for sure.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

I think the "etch" is dependent on the recording. I can hear it on certain pop tracks for example but not for the majority of others. 

It doesn't bother me that much especially considering the price of this dongle and  I don't find it fatiguing either. I'm sure the R01 or RS6 doesn't have this issue. But those also cost 5x the price.


----------



## twister6

econaut said:


> Concerning the Utopias that's correct. Concerning the RU6 I am on the fence. Coincidentally I am listening to the dongles with the Campfire Cascade that has beryllium coated drivers similar (not the same) to the beryllium drivers of the Utopias.
> 
> And I am not the guy who introduced the word "etch" here. I just assume I am hearing the same thing that several other people here called "etch" or "edgy treble".
> 
> ...



When it comes to RU6 vs S2, I remember reading in one of the threads about S2 having a bit of a roll off in treble (based on measurements) which makes it a lot friendlier with IEMs/headphones that have a peaky lower treble tuning.  So, in theory, RU6 shouldn't make it sound brighter, but rather S2 will make it smoother while RU6 will not be masking it.  Of course, all relatively speaking, and with some hearing it and others don't.


----------



## sahmen

I have posted these on a different forum, but I wanted to post them here as well, and say how pleased I am with the way the RU6 drives my Audeze LCD-5, from both 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs. The pictured cable is the Norne audio Drausk, which is fantastic in the chain. However, I am currently using the Vykari as well, and it ups the ante on several different fronts, and by the way, I hear no etch or anything resembling unpleasant edges anywhere in the spectrum... Just delicious and sumptuous liquidity all around and a weighty textured bass that has removed any desire for EQ'ing... Of course, YMMV, but I am generally happy that RU6 offers me the opportunity to use my LCD-5 on the Go when needed :


----------



## yaps66

sahmen said:


> I have posted these on a different forum, but I wanted to post them here as well, and say how pleased I am with the way the RU6 drives my Audeze LCD-5, from both 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs. The pictured cable is the Norne audio Drausk, which is fantastic in the chain. However, I am currently using the Vykari as well, and it ups the ante on several different fronts, and by the way, I hear no etch or anything resembling unpleasant edges anywhere in the spectrum... Just delicious and sumptuous liquidity all around and a weighty textured bass that has removed any desire for EQ'ing... Of course, YMMV, but I am generally happy that RU6 offers me the opportunity to use my LCD-5 on the Go when needed :


High praise indeed!


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 11, 2021)

twister6 said:


> ... and if you don't want to deal with this MQA nonsense, just get yourself Amazon HD or Qobuz or Apple Music


If you allow me to add my personal opinion, admittedly off-topic:
… and if you don‘t want to deal with ”Conquistadores“, then just go for Qobuz …    YMMV.


----------



## justsomesonyfan

got ru6. my phase of putting terms on everything is kind of over, so this will be a much more simplified opinion.

pairs very well with all my gear (cfa dorado 2020, and two pairs of plunge audio custom iems).

is generally very fun to listen to. great value, love the ui and design. hard recc on this one.


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 11, 2021)

I am comparing ru6 to hdvd800 head amp.
To fast swap I use two digital sources: ss note20ultra and sp1000.
Player is NeutronMp.
Hdvd800 feed same time by both dual xlr to 2.5(with balance adapter to 4.4) and usb line (Furutech cable).
Xlr input : note20ultra (w/ru6)
Usb input : sp1000
I found difference in 3D imagine, layering, treble and base line.
Going to write a post, but I stop to try more:
Switch usb line and xlr line:
Xlr input: sp1000 (w/ru6)
Usb input: note20ultra

Then l found the sound characteristic be switched follow digital sources changing.

So I can not conclude how ru6 sound against hdvd800. Need another way.
Two thing a can conclude from this: ru6 change the sound a little (treble addition). Digital sources change the sound so big!!
Sp1000 give strong base and holograph sound. My samsung phone sound flat.

So, ru6 we heard vaying between people with difference pairing sources


----------



## Stuff Jones

@Andykong, is there any scientific basis for burn in with the RU6? It seems to sound more clear and less bloomy now, but maybe its just brain burn in?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Can someone compare sound quality of RU6 vs Go Blu? I know, different purposes but I'm just curious what the differences are between the two when it comes to sound.

For me, the Go Blu looks like a better product for my use (Gym, Walking...) but if RU6 sounds better, I'd like to get that instead, never heard an R2R before so I'm conflicted.


----------



## HiFlight

Johnfg465vd said:


> Can someone compare sound quality of RU6 vs Go Blu? I know, different purposes but I'm just curious what the differences are between the two when it comes to sound.
> 
> For me, the Go Blu looks like a better product for my use (Gym, Walking...) but if RU6 sounds better, I'd like to get that instead, never heard an R2R before so I'm conflicted.


The Go Blu does have 2 different DSP settings which can be added singly or together.  I mostly used the stock setting which sounded decent but the convenience of Bluetooth was diminished by the weak BT reception and dropouts.  Perhaps I just got a bum unit and ultimately returned it.  OTOH, the RU6 has fully met my expectations and is a definite keeper.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

HiFlight said:


> The Go Blu does have 2 different DSP settings which can be added singly or together.  I mostly used the stock setting which sounded decent but the convenience of Bluetooth was diminished by the weak BT reception and dropouts.  Perhaps I just got a bum unit and ultimately returned it.  OTOH, the RU6 has fully met my expectations and is a definite keeper.


Thanks, could you try and describe the sonic difference between Go Blu & RU6? Is RU6 warmer than Go Blu or smoother...e.t.c

Also, do you notice any EMI issues like popping noise with the RU6? I had this issue with Sparrow & to a small extent with the Mojo too.


----------



## justsomesonyfan

utdeep said:


> I think the difference is huge.  I may have expected too much out of the RU6 after the R01.  I don’t find the W2, S1, or RU6 to be gigantic jumps from each other but I think the R01 with Cayin N6ii is the best DAP I have ever heard.


have you tried it with uapp?


----------



## HiFiHawaii808 (Dec 11, 2021)

sahmen said:


> I have posted these on a different forum, but I wanted to post them here as well, and say how pleased I am with the way the RU6 drives my Audeze LCD-5, from both 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs. The pictured cable is the Norne audio Drausk, which is fantastic in the chain. However, I am currently using the Vykari as well, and it ups the ante on several different fronts, and by the way, I hear no etch or anything resembling unpleasant edges anywhere in the spectrum... Just delicious and sumptuous liquidity all around and a weighty textured bass that has removed any desire for EQ'ing... Of course, YMMV, but I am generally happy that RU6 offers me the opportunity to use my LCD-5 on the Go when needed :


This does not surprise me because I was able to drive the LCD5 with my DX300 and it sounded good.   I found the LCD5 to be too intense in the treble so I think I would prefer it with a warmer source.


----------



## LoryWiv

111MilesToGo said:


> If you allow me to add my personal opinion, admittedly off-topic:
> … and if you don‘t want to deal with ”Conquistadores“, then just go for Qobuz …    YMMV.


I just signed up for a free trial of QoBuz yesterday as it now is supported by my music player...sound quality is excellent and immediate access to this huge library is really something I don't know how I lived without before. I'm impressed.


----------



## HiFlight

Johnfg465vd said:


> Thanks, could you try and describe the sonic difference between Go Blu & RU6? Is RU6 warmer than Go Blu or smoother...e.t.c
> 
> Also, do you notice any EMI issues like popping noise with the RU6? I had this issue with Sparrow & to a small extent with the Mojo too.


My subjective impression is that the RU6 has a more natural and lifelike timbre with precise definition of individual voice and instruments.  I suspect this is, in part, due to limitations of the Bluetooth decoding technology.
The Go Blu is certainly adequate for out and about and gym use but for more critical listening, the RU6 scales up really well and IMO, is the more satisfying instrument.


----------



## yfei

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Then, I spent 2 hours A/B/C testing the RU6 against the Lotoo PAW S2 and the L&P W2.    .   I listening to some tracks where the RU6 sounded very congested when there were a lot of instruments.


Used 4.4 balanced or 3.5 single end only?

When I first tried RU6 using single end I also find it congested. But after using 4.4 I found it very satisfying.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

yfei said:


> Used 4.4 balanced or 3.5 single end only?
> 
> When I first tried RU6 using single end I also find it congested. But after using 4.4 I found it very satisfying.


4.4mm only.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 11, 2021)

Up front: I continue to realize what a cute little thing the RU6 is, most of all soundwise and what has been packed into this small form factor. But I keep coming across some gotchas…

I would like to give an initial report here on my findings with the RU6 and Linux when I feed it from a Linux laptop via USB-A > Cayin USB-A to C > Cayin USB-C to C cable. I am using openSUSE Tumbleweed for now, which is a rolling release distro with everything updated to their latest versions. I did already mention here that I prefer to have the audio player software play directly to alsa in order to ensure bit-perfectness; that means any pulseaudio or pipewire is bypassed. My audio player software are the ”audiophile standard“ mpd+Cantata (Music Player Daemon service with Cantata as graphical control interface) and DeaDBeeF (stand-alone player, similar to foobar2000 on Windows). For your reference, there was a website by Ronald van Engelen (lacocina.nl), which unfortunately is defunct now, but accessible through the wayback machine - this site taught me the basics of audiophile Linux.

As is well known, there is no need for ”external“ (manufacturer-supplied third-party stuff) audio drivers under Linux, since alsa with its kernel modules takes care of talking to the hardware (if it can). My Linux systems (both Tumbleweed as well as Manjaro, the latter not tested with the RU6 yet) work flawlessly out of the box with all my USB-DACs, Chord Hugo 2, Cayin N6ii, and AudioQuest DragonFly Red; EDIT: same for the miniDSP USB-to-optical Streamer.

Unfortunately, I do have a mixed bag of findings to report with the RU6. Most of the time, everything works fine, but there are occasional glitches of various kinds. I’ll restrict myself here to playing PCM from local FLAC files, all standard bit depth / sample rates (BD/SR for short).

What is happening?
(1) When two consecutive tracks have identical BD/SR, playback works fine all the time.
(2) However, when one or both of SR and/or BD change from one track to the next, a failure can occur right from the start of the second track - loud ”white“ noise, which supposedly continues for the entire track (the track time display progresses, but I stopped replay at some point, of course). Such misbehavior occurs with both player apps tested, in identical ways.
(3) I couldn’t find any systematics yet for that gross misbehavior:
(a) It does not occur at all SR/BD changes.
(b) It occurs both when the gapless player apps transition from one track to the next, as well as when I start the second track myself while playing the first one.
(c) When I have encountered a misbehaving track sequence, then the misbehavior is reproducible most of the time, but sometimes not.

All that is so very strange. @DBaldock9: We both do observe that an error occurs at a SR/BD change. But you got a hang-up when using pipewire / JRiver, which I never got up to now. I just get this loud white noise. @DBaldock9: What is your status now, please?

Let me mention again: I don‘t encounter such a gross error with any of my other USB-DACs listed above, when I use them one at a time. Moreover: One can set mpd up to play to several USB-DACs simultaneously, each one hooked up to different USB outputs. Guess what: Only RU6 produces white noise, while any other USB-DAC continues to play properly simultaneously.

And: On a Windows system, my RU6 is well behaved, mostly (cf. above for my issue with Roon & ASIO).

In summary, I get ”white noise“ at some SR/BD changes under Linux. Unfortunately, I am still clueless as to any systematics. I will keep on after the weekend and report back.


----------



## Jawis

Noticed some people here have the Sparrow. I can one up with a Bulbul and it was rather impressed with my new RU6.
Have done quite a few miles on this R2R now and it has me grabbing it for any excuse to listen with. Loving the sound in such a portable set up.


----------



## ClieOS

HiFlight said:


> The Go Blu does have 2 different DSP settings which can be added singly or together.  I mostly used the stock setting which sounded decent but the convenience of Bluetooth was diminished by the weak BT reception and dropouts.  Perhaps I just got a bum unit and ultimately returned it.  OTOH, the RU6 has fully met my expectations and is a definite keeper.


Go Blu's BT signal is indeed not that strong as it has been widely reported.

Also on a minor point, if those DSP you are referring are the XBass and XSpace, they are actually hardware circuit EQ and not done by DSP.


----------



## justsomesonyfan

Jawis said:


> Noticed some people here have the Sparrow. I can one up with a Bulbul and it was rather impressed with my new RU6.
> Have done quite a few miles on this R2R now and it has me grabbing it for any excuse to listen with. Loving the sound in such a portable set up.


damn he's adorable


----------



## kumar402

LoryWiv said:


> I just signed up for a free trial of QoBuz yesterday as it now is supported by my music player...sound quality is excellent and immediate access to this huge library is really something I don't know how I lived without before. I'm impressed.


Once you start streaming the life gets simpler


----------



## DBaldock9

111MilesToGo said:


> ...
> All that is so very strange. @DBaldock9: We both do observe that an error occurs at a SR/BD change. But you got a hang-up when using pipewire / JRiver, which I never got up to now. I just get this loud white noise. @DBaldock9: What is your status now, please?
> ...



My Linux audio sub-system is now presenting an even more annoying problem - with all of my USB connected devices.
Previously, when playing YouTube videos, there were no issues when going from one to the next, since they were all the same 48-KHz sample rate.
Now - whenever I start a new video, there's usually audio in only one channel (mostly left, sometimes right), until I press F5 and reload the screen a time or two - although just opening the "Audio Volume / Device Selection" pop-up from the SysTray sometimes causes the other channel to begin working.
Manually selecting tracks in the Nuvola Qobuz Player also has the issue of one channel audio, so I have to select another track, and then back to the one I want to hear (and sometimes have to restart pipewire) before getting two channel audio.

This is not in any way related to the RU6, because the problem occurs with my other DACs, even when the RU6 isn't connected to the PC.


----------



## econaut

Andykong said:


> Yes, there is a piece of magnet at the back of the protective case.
> 
> With reference to R01, First 50 hours makes a lot of different, and the DAC will stable after 100 hours, so please give it a few day before you draw your conclusion, or return the dongle to the seller just in case you don't like it.



@Andykong I don't doubt this, but could you please elaborate on which parts of the sound become stable? Maybe you have some experience with this. Many thanks


----------



## sahmen

ClieOS said:


> Go Blu's BT signal is indeed not that strong as it has been widely reported.
> 
> Also on a minor point, if those DSP you are referring are the XBass and XSpace, they are actually hardware circuit EQ and not done by DSP.



How about the Ifi hip Dac2.   Does anyone have any ideas as to how it might stack up against the RU6 in performance?


----------



## CrocodileDundee

twister6 said:


> It is all about the quality of the cable.  Get one of those voltage/current measurement dongles you put in series with a cable so you can read the voltage.  A quality cable should read 5V coming from your iPhone/Android phone.  I tested DDHifi, OE Audio, and new Lotoo v2 usb-c to lightning cables - all reading 5V and working perfectly with RU6 and iPod Touch.  Then, I tested with L&P W2 lightning cable and Lotoo v1 (from S1) lightning cable, they are reading 3.8V and it will not work with RU6.  Now, the same W2 and Lotoo v1 usb-c to lightning cables work OK with corresponding W2 and S1 because those dongles tolerate 3.8V bus voltage.  But RU6 needs 5V, and you need to use a quality cable for it.  Cayin RU6 usb-c to lightning cable yields a proper 5V when connected to iPhone/iPod touch and works fine as well.


just found out that the Fiio LT-LT1 doesn't work as well.


----------



## kumar402

I’m more of a desktop guy with Mojo as only transportable device. Recently I got into DAP to use my MDR Z1R. However I wonder what are the positive of using dongle DAC/AMP over DAP like Shanling M3X which is quiet good for it’s price point. Now many will buy dongle to use it on move or as bed side or couch setup but with most of the review saying that due to power limitation it will sound better out of laptop, doesn’t it kind of defeat the purpose of a dongle DAP? Please note that I’m not against any dongle DAC just want to get better understanding of use case of such devices over DAP. One of the reason that I can think of is DAP will get outdated in 2-3 years time due to Android compatibility issue but won’t we move out of dongle DAC as well in 2-3 years time as better products come out?


----------



## Verificateur (Dec 13, 2021)

kumar402 said:


> I’m more of a desktop guy with Mojo as only transportable device. Recently I got into DAP to use my MDR Z1R. However I wonder what are the positive of using dongle DAC/AMP over DAP like Shanling M3X which is quiet good for it’s price point. Now many will buy dongle to use it on move or as bed side or couch setup but with most of the review saying that due to power limitation it will sound better out of laptop, doesn’t it kind of defeat the purpose of a dongle DAP? Please note that I’m not against any dongle DAC just want to get better understanding of use case of such devices over DAP. One of the reason that I can think of is DAP will get outdated in 2-3 years time due to Android compatibility issue but won’t we move out of dongle DAC as well in 2-3 years time as better products come out?



I will just speak for myself — but the dongle just allows me to use my phone as source … for streaming, music, and even YouTube.  😃

Using the phone is very convenient, not to mention it’s also a great user experience (fast UI, graphics etc) — and the dongle sounds great with IEMs and not hard to drive headphones.

I don’t think I could convince myself to go back to using an offline transport again and to have to pre-download tracks, hence my DAP must also be streaming-capable.


----------



## someyoungguy

kumar402 said:


> I’m more of a desktop guy with Mojo as only transportable device. Recently I got into DAP to use my MDR Z1R. However I wonder what are the positive of using dongle DAC/AMP over DAP like Shanling M3X which is quiet good for it’s price point. Now many will buy dongle to use it on move or as bed side or couch setup but with most of the review saying that due to power limitation it will sound better out of laptop, doesn’t it kind of defeat the purpose of a dongle DAP? Please note that I’m not against any dongle DAC just want to get better understanding of use case of such devices over DAP. One of the reason that I can think of is DAP will get outdated in 2-3 years time due to Android compatibility issue but won’t we move out of dongle DAC as well in 2-3 years time as better products come out?


I think many people have the same thoughts as you, I know I did/still do - why use a dongle when a DAP will do? Or vice versa 

I'd say there's no real simple or absolute answer to that question though. Both have their benefits and downsides. For me, these have been:

Dongles, the downsides:

Often (but not always, especially recently) have been lowered powered than many DAPs
Drain power from your phone, which can be annoying/problematic depending on where you are/how easy it is to rent chargers, etc.
Often (but again, not always) have less volume steps than a DAP, since you're limited to the volume steps/slider on your phone, unless the dongle has it's own independent volume control (like the RU6).
The positives though, are that:

Dongles seem to have come leaps and bounds in recent years and now put out sound quality that can challenge many DAPs, even higher priced ones, so long as you're using them with headphones designed for _portable use_, rather than a 600 ohm Beyerdynamic or Susvara.
They put out that sound at a much, much lower cost than a DAP
As you mention, they don't date to the same extent
It's easy to switch between use cases - phone+dongle on the go, laptop/computer+dongle at home, or with a Nintendo Switch for some dongles. Sure many DAPs work as USB DACs and do the same, but they can have a lag in audio making them useless for video or gaming, which I haven't encountered with a dongle yet, and a DAP usually requires more steps and is a bit more fiddly to switch use cases than just plugging in a dongle (i.e. turning on DAP, selecting USB mode, the position of a bulkier DAP compared to dongle, etc).
The positives for a DAP though, are that they don't drain your phone's battery, and for some people they're preferable as a means of putting some distance between your music listening/enjoyment and your phone and interruptions from notifications, etc. Depending on the DAP it may also have more features for EQ, filters, Bluetooth transmission in better codecs than an iPhone, etc.

So in the end I feel that a lot of it now comes down to personal preference. In the past I probably would have said a DAP would likely sound better, but now there seems to be pretty substantial overlap between them in sound quality. To some extent I've also found that just experimenting with both and seeing how you feel about each use case is the best way forward.

To end this on a note directly related to RU6, I've been switching today between my current stock of Plenues - S, M2 and R - the RU6 and Chronos. Each brings their own flavor to the mix and it's difficult to necessarily say (for me) that one is outright better than the others. The RU6 pips the R and M2 in terms of detail, but outright detail isn't really why I have the R or M2 - more the latters unique tonality and the nice crisp sweetness of the former. RU6 has a thicker, weighter low half of the spectrum than the Chronos, and a sharper treble. The S is kind of it's own thing with the Burr Brown sound (mid bass emphasis, smooth/analog transients) and a great sense of space to boot. Choosing one as the 'best' is kind of like choosing a favorite child, or whiskey  . But since neither dongle is necessarily embarrassed by the competition says something in itself, given I paid less for them than I did for the Plenues (all of which I got 2nd hand) - especially the S.


----------



## claud W

Another dongle use
I ordered my RU6 to use as a DAC amp for my beach house IMac IEM and headphone source to listen to Tidal. It will also give me experience with an R2R DAC without the expense of a R2R DAP.


----------



## sahmen (Dec 13, 2021)

kumar402 said:


> I’m more of a desktop guy with Mojo as only transportable device. Recently I got into DAP to use my MDR Z1R. However I wonder what are the positive of using dongle DAC/AMP over DAP like Shanling M3X which is quiet good for it’s price point. Now many will buy dongle to use it on move or as bed side or couch setup but with most of the review saying that due to power limitation it will sound better out of laptop, doesn’t it kind of defeat the purpose of a dongle DAP? Please note that I’m not against any dongle DAC just want to get better understanding of use case of such devices over DAP. One of the reason that I can think of is DAP will get outdated in 2-3 years time due to Android compatibility issue but won’t we move out of dongle DAC as well in 2-3 years time as better products come out?


I am not addressing every question you have asked, but it seems to me that an answer to at least one question is implicit in the passage. If it is indeed true that both DAPs and Dongles might become outdated in 2-3 years, then might there not be some compelling argument for taking the cheaper route by going with a great dongle such as an RU6, rather than some megabucks DAP? After all the music itself would be the same, and my MacOS and IOS devices will give me access to enough streaming services and fanciful GUIs....

I am not asking just to troll.  After getting the RU6, I have been kicking myself for not selling my A & K Kann and Kann Cube quickly enough, just because I was too lazy to think quickly on my feet about both (I have had a couple of dongles before the RU6, so it is not my first either).  I have to confess that I have never really been a big fan of DAPs, not because there is anything inherently  wrong with them, but mainly because my interest evolved away from the DAP idea, to building my HT and speaker rigs after the I-Pod and ipod-touch "revolutions' played themselves out. It may have been my circumstances, but I was not incentivized to dabble in DAPs in the early years of their rise to prominence.

 Nowadays, with dongles becoming more and more versatile and sophisticated, the pairing of a great dongle and my MBP or an IOS device (i-phone/i-pad pro) for access to all the streaming services available to me (Roon w Tidal/Qobuz/local files, Audirvana, Amazon HD etc etc) at home and OTG has almost made DAPs obsolete from my own viewpoint... I always observe the rule of 'never say never" out of caution and prudence, in this hobby, but at the moment, I have very little incentive to buy another DAP, especially given that I have two in perfect working order (Kann and Kann Cube) that I hardly touch anymore.  I almost feel as if the hey days of DAPs have passed me by, but then again, I am not closing any doors here yet, out of prudence.

Yes, I know, different folks, and different strokes. Journeys and mileages may vary, and always do...  This is just my own experience, so far, in the market of DAPs and dongles...


----------



## kumar402

sahmen said:


> I am not addressing every question you have asked, but it seems to me that an answer to at least one question is implicit in the passage. If it is indeed true that both DAPs and Dongles might become outdated in 2-3 years, then might there not be some compelling argument for taking the cheaper route by going with a great dongle such as an RU6, rather than some megabucks DAP? After all the music itself would be the same, and my MacOS and IOS devices will give me access to enough streaming services and fanciful GUIs....
> 
> I am not asking just to troll.  After getting the RU6, I have been kicking myself for not selling my A & K Kann and Kann Cube quickly enough, just because I was too laziness to think quickly on my feet about both (I have had a couple of dongles before the RU6, so it is not my first either).  I have to confess that I have never really been a big fan of DAPs, not because there is anything inherently  wrong with them, but mainly my interest evolved away from the DAP idea, to building my HT and speaker rigs after the I-Pod and ipod-touch "revolutions' played themselves out. It may have been my circumstances, but I was not incentivized to dabble in DAPs in the early years of their rise to prominence.
> 
> ...


Nice to know that you own RU6. I know you had Onyx and now Morpheus which are high end R2R DAC. I also own the same DAC. How would you describe the R2R tonality and timbre out of RU6 as compared to full blown R2R desktop DAC


----------



## econaut

Another reason has not been mentioned yet: You don't have to take care of another battery.

That's actually one of the major reasons for me. I had a Sony NW-WM1A that I almost never used since the pandemic. You have to decide if you charge it every other day although you don't use it (which is not good for the battery) or if you let it go to 0% (which is also not good for the battery).

Of course the Sony is better than the dongles I have: Dragonfly Cobalt, S2 and RU6. But they are _good enough_.


----------



## bnupy

econaut said:


> Another reason has not been mentioned yet: You don't have to take care of another battery.
> 
> That's actually one of the major reasons for me. I had a Sony NW-WM1A that I almost never used since the pandemic. You have to decide if you charge it every other day although you don't use it (which is not good for the battery) or if you let it go to 0% (which is also not good for the battery).
> 
> Of course the Sony is better than the dongles I have: Dragonfly Cobalt, S2 and RU6. But they are _good enough_.


Ive sold the wm1a quite some time back. Hows the sonice difference between ru6 and wm1a, side by side ?


----------



## sahmen (Dec 13, 2021)

kumar402 said:


> Nice to know that you own RU6. I know you had Onyx and now Morpheus which are high end R2R DAC. I also own the same DAC. How would you describe the R2R tonality and timbre out of RU6 as compared to full blown R2R desktop DAC


This is an interesting question, but to respond with the diligence and attentiveness it requires I would need to A/B my morpheus rig and the RU6 very carefully so that I can give you the most reliable answer possible. Yet even an answer such as this should already tell you that the differences between the two are not of the kind that are exaggerated enough to smack the listener in the face, and I already consider that to be high praise for the RU6 given the price delta that separates it from the likes of the Morpheus.

I have not really listened to the Morpheus rig since the RU6 arrived so this should be taken with a grain of salt. The RU6 is definitely in the ballpark of the Morpheus or other R-2R desktops as far as tonality and timbre go. The important differences will lie in other technical areas such as soundstage, spaciousness, separation, detail retrieval, and treble/bass extension, and these remain to be assessed in more rigorous fashion.  Still I can tell you that I have been very impressed by the RU6 in these areas, as paired with the LCD-5. Or to put it differently, the RU6, on its own merits, has not given me the impression that something important is missing in any part of the sonic spectrum, or that some part of it is unpleasant, as in "etched," "sibilant," or fatiguing", and I find that to be already quite gratifying. That probably explains why I have been listening exclusively to my LCD-5/RU6 pairing for about a week now, without missing the Morpheus/Niimbus or my Yggy/Pathos rigs at all.

Of course some caveats must go with these declarations as well, apart from the obvious honeymooning factor :  The LCD-5 is spec'd at 14 ohms with a sensitivity of 90dbs, so it is relatively easier to drive as compared to, say, an Abyss TC or a Susvara, both of which I will never even bother to try out on the RU6 (but then, I have a feeling that the RU6 was not intended for those hard-to drive "monsters" either). Still to the latter's credit, it has performed very well with the likes of the Hifiman Sundara, the He-400i, and the Sennheiser Hd58X so it can hold its own fairly well with a good number of cans once one is out of the hard-to-drive planars territory.  The other caveat is that, without having even AB'ed them side by side, I expect the RU6 to come up short when stacked up against the "big boys" such as at the Morpheus and Yggy rigs, but this is as it should be.  I think the achievement of the RU6 lies less in matching such rigs, pound for pound, than in placing itself in the same conversation and ballpark. I think most who listen to the RU6 would be impressed by that achievement.


----------



## crizzle

Can anyone compare this to the Earmen Sparrow? Ive had the sparrow a week and it does sound great, but i desperately need something with volume buttons


----------



## linux4ever

vilhelm44 said:


> To anyone who has both RU6 and N6ii w/R01, is there a big enough difference in the sound to warrant the extra spend on the DAP? Just talking from sound point only and nothing else. I'm loving the RU6 sounds, and it's got me thinking about N6ii/R01 now.


N6ii w/R01 gives a more refined sound. Can one be satisfied just with RU6? Definitely.

Will one notice a big leap in sound quality from RU6 to N6ii w/R01? Probably not.For some, the refinement in sound and that little increase in sound quality from RU6 is worth spending extra money. I've both and I like both.


----------



## emilsoft

crizzle said:


> Can anyone compare this to the Earmen Sparrow? Ive had the sparrow a week and it does sound great, but i desperately need something with volume buttons


Sparrow is cleaner, better defined, more dynamic and less grainy, and a touch brighter with clearer more focused mids.

RU6 is warmer and fuzzier, more natural organic timbre, touch more dense etched treble, has more bloom and decay, a little grainer. Overall mids are nice and wide and also more relaxed

If you prefer vinyl you might prefer RU6. If you prefer accuracy and technicalities the Sparrow might be more up your street


----------



## econaut

bnupy said:


> Ive sold the wm1a quite some time back. Hows the sonice difference between ru6 and wm1a, side by side ?


Sold my WM1A as well and was using it solely with the Andromedas that I also sold.

Using different headphones now, so no proper comparison possible, sorry.

But from memory and extrapolating the Sony was smoother than the RU6.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I have a random question.. will I notice any difference in sound if I change from my iPhone 12 Pro Max to my iPad Pro (3rd generation, if that matters)? Both will be iTunes, both will be high resolution/lossless files, everything else equal. Just a thought is all. 😊

My stuff will be here this week. I’m just a weee bit excited! 😁


----------



## yfei

sahmen said:


> Still I can tell you that I have been very impressed by the RU6 in these areas, as paired with the LCD-5. Or to put it differently, the RU6, on its own merits, has not given me the impression that something important is missing in any part of the sonic spectrum, or that some part of it is unpleasant, as in "etched," "sibilant," or fatiguing", and I find that to be already quite gratifying. That probably explains why I have been listening exclusively to my LCD-5/RU6 pairing for about a week now, without missing the Morpheus/Niimbus or my Yggy/Pathos rigs at all.



I have tried RU6 for ~10 hours,   compared to W2, RU6's bass is much much better, the best bass from any mobile device I have tried.    Kind of feeling of the famous 'Moffat Bass' from Yggy.


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## HiFiHawaii808

yfei said:


> I have tried RU6 for ~10 hours,   compared to W2, RU6's bass is much much better, the best bass from any mobile device I have tried.    Kind of feeling of the famous 'Moffat Bass' from Yggy.


I completely agree.   Happy to see someone else is hearing it the same way.

Well, I believe the Chord Mojo has better bass.    But, I was thinking of dongles.


----------



## ActuallySparky

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Well, I believe the Chord Mojo has better bass.    But, I was thinking of dongles.


The mojo is a great parallel for the RU6. They have a similar sound profile, similar technical chops, and the same levels of hiss. Kind of amazing the RU6 is so much smaller and doesn't need a battery!


----------



## TYATYA

ActuallySparky said:


> The mojo is a great parallel for the RU6. They have a similar sound profile, similar technical chops, and the same levels of hiss. Kind of amazing the RU6 is so much smaller and doesn't need a battery!


Mojo sounds too warm to my ears.
Ru6 is not warm even when OS mode in use


----------



## emilsoft

ActuallySparky said:


> The mojo is a great parallel for the RU6. They have a similar sound profile, similar technical chops, and the same levels of hiss. Kind of amazing the RU6 is so much smaller and doesn't need a battery!



Not a big fan of the mojo, it sounds unnatural and DSP. The RU6 has the superior sound when used with IEMs.. it delivers the music in a more coherent way even if it's not as warm


----------



## yfei

emilsoft said:


> Not a big fan of the mojo, it sounds unnatural and DSP. The RU6 has the superior sound when used with IEMs.. it delivers the music in a more coherent way even if it's not as warm


Same feelings.  I feel that Mojo tried to have 'warm and analog' sound like R2R by DSP processing tweaks, resulting in unnatural and blurred sound.  But I still kept it, because no other DAC sound like that.
I have also owned Hugo 2, but sold it later, because I feel LG V60 and W2 can achieve same kind of sound signature, and maybe better in some aspects.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

ActuallySparky said:


> The mojo is a great parallel for the RU6. They have a similar sound profile, similar technical chops, and the same levels of hiss. Kind of amazing the RU6 is so much smaller and doesn't need a battery!


I felt the same way about the L&P W2.   The RU6 and L&P W2 are similar, but I slightly prefer the RU6.

The battery in the Mojo gives it more utility.   I can drive full sized headphones a little better although the RU6 does it pretty well.


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## musicday

Did anyone used the RU6 more then 200 hours? Has the sound improved a lot?


----------



## claud W

Is there an iTunes app on my iPhone 12? I can not seem to find a music app on it and I want to put some hiRez music files on it to try out my RU6.


----------



## blotmouse

claud W said:


> Is there an iTunes app on my iPhone 12? I can not seem to find a music app on it and I want to put some hiRez music files on it to try out my RU6.


It's just called "Music" now.


----------



## rwelles

It is possible to hide the iPhone's Music app. If you don't see it, go to Settings > Music and make sure "Show Apple Music" is turned on.


----------



## claud W

rwelles said:


> It is possible to hide the iPhone's Music app. If you don't see it, go to Settings > Music and make sure "Show Apple Music" is turned on.


That's what happened to me. Apple support sorted it.


----------



## Blanka79

Hi guys 

I have got one question:

If I am listening to the Cayin via the Cayin USB to lightning cable and my iPhone 13 pro, the lightning part of the cable is getting pretty warm. Is that normal?

Thank you. 👍🤘


----------



## discord (Dec 14, 2021)

Blanka79 said:


> Hi guys
> 
> I have got one question:
> 
> ...



The connector portion of the cable yes, where it connects to the lighting port, is a bit warm. The remaining part of the cable is just slightly warm.


----------



## yaps66

musicday said:


> Did anyone used the RU6 more then 200 hours? Has the sound improved a lot?


I have. I am hearing more clarity and coherence.


----------



## Blanka79

discord said:


> The connector portion of the cable yes, where it connects to the lighting port, is a bit warm. The remaining part of the cable is just slightly warm.


Thank you very much. So it is no problem I think


----------



## unifutomaki

kumar402 said:


> I’m more of a desktop guy with Mojo as only transportable device. Recently I got into DAP to use my MDR Z1R. However I wonder what are the positive of using dongle DAC/AMP over DAP like Shanling M3X which is quiet good for it’s price point. Now many will buy dongle to use it on move or as bed side or couch setup but with most of the review saying that due to power limitation it will sound better out of laptop, doesn’t it kind of defeat the purpose of a dongle DAP? Please note that I’m not against any dongle DAC just want to get better understanding of use case of such devices over DAP. One of the reason that I can think of is DAP will get outdated in 2-3 years time due to Android compatibility issue but won’t we move out of dongle DAC as well in 2-3 years time as better products come out?



Let's say you have $300 to spend on a source. Among DAPs, you're still playing in the budget space with the M3X and whatever. Among dongles, you're pretty much at the top of the line. The best dongles of today can trade blows with mid-fi DAPs. If you're a price-to-performance fan, a dongle is a no brainer (especially when your phone likely already has great performance, a nice UI, all the music services are compatible, foolproof local file syncing if you have an iPhone), etc.


----------



## emilsoft

unifutomaki said:


> Let's say you have $300 to spend on a source. Among DAPs, you're still playing in the budget space with the M3X and whatever. Among dongles, you're pretty much at the top of the line. The best dongles of today can trade blows with mid-fi DAPs. If you're a price-to-performance fan, a dongle is a no brainer (especially when your phone likely already has great performance, a nice UI, all the music services are compatible, foolproof local file syncing if you have an iPhone), etc.



I'm in two minds about this - the issue with dongles is that they rely on usb data and usb power from the source (usually computers/phones - jitter prone and crappy)... this give the dongles bit of a hard time. For DAPs this is typically a non issue, but then we have added cost for the screen/mem/cpu.

Last night I tried the RU6 with a dual usb cable to use clean data and power from ifi iusb micro and ifi ipower respectively. The improvements were very noticeable to a level that I'm now looking for alternative portable solutions for clean power/usb so I can take it to work.


----------



## schnesim

emilsoft said:


> ...that I'm now looking for alternative portable solutions for clean power/usb so I can take it to work.


Wouldn't ifi's iSilencer be an option for portable use?


----------



## alota

emilsoft said:


> I'm in two minds about this - the issue with dongles is that they rely on usb data and usb power from the source (usually computers/phones - jitter prone and crappy)... this give the dongles bit of a hard time. For DAPs this is typically a non issue, but then we have added cost for the screen/mem/cpu.
> 
> Last night I tried the RU6 with a dual usb cable to use clean data and power from ifi iusb micro and ifi ipower respectively. The improvements were very noticeable to a level that I'm now looking for alternative portable solutions for clean power/usb so I can take it to work.


never had problem with dongles regarding usb, etc. in reverse i have had more or less problems with dap like wifi issues, interferences and noises, unstable os....


----------



## emilsoft

alota said:


> never had problem with dongles regarding usb, etc. in reverse i have had more or less problems with dap like wifi issues, interferences and noises, unstable os....



I meant sound quality wise, usb interface and usb power is typically inferior for sound quality. DAPs don't have this interface so it's less impacted sound quality wise for the  digital signal > dac feed


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## claud W (Dec 15, 2021)

RU6 breaking in starting now. I usually do break in for a week, 24/7, but because of this thread, I am going to do it 200 hours. I am using my Senn 660S in my break in chain playing long playlists from Tidal. USB  cord gave me a fit this morning, but a direct USB-C to computer USB-C solved connection/cable issues


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 15, 2021)

Break in aside, bigger R2R DACs need some time to settle in once switched off. For eg Metrum or Sonnet may be few hrs to warm up and sound good to the best of their ability. Some like schiit may take few days. That’s why even designers of these DAC suggest to keep them on 24/7 if possible. Now that’s not possible with dongle. Do you feel RU6 also gets better after few songs? Or they are good to go since the start of each listening session?


----------



## Deders (Dec 15, 2021)

I've just received mine,  going to listen to it for as long as I can, it sounds fantastic. Softens those harsh digital edges nicely. Currently listening through Hifiman Anandas using the balanced output.

When I eventually stop listening, I will hook it up to my old phone and let it carry on with my IEM's

Can't say I can hear much difference between Nos and Os yet, will experiment more.

I bought a USB splitter that when I tested with my ifi dac allowed me to plug in my portable battery and charge at the same time.  For some reason it doesn't seem to work with the RU6.  Sound comes in and out, mostly out.  I can sometimes get a few consistent seconds of music but it's few and far between.  The ifi worked all the time.  I'll update with a link to the splitter.

Edit: USB-C OTG Adapter with 60W Power... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B09J2MRL8S?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

I think the reason it's hard for me to pick out the difference between NOS and OS modes is the very short time before the screen goes blank doesn't give enough time for the brain to take in the changes,  and we have to go back through the menu to select the other mode. Makes it difficult to compare as it breaks concentration. Would be handy to be able to switch modes quicker.


----------



## Deders (Dec 15, 2021)

I think it has something to do with the supplied USB-C to USB-A adapter not connecting properly in the socket.  If I hold it in place it plays for longer, but not forever.

The splitter has to take power from the USB-C socket, leaving the USB-A for peripherals, meaning I have to use the adapter.

Plus I think it messes with the panning when I do this

I will try a cable


----------



## musicday

The website is still down.


----------



## pinkpiglet

musicday said:


> The website is still down.


I just downloaded the firmware from their website 6 hours ago and it worked just fine. I wonder why it doesn't work for you.


----------



## musicday

pinkpiglet said:


> I just downloaded the firmware from their website 6 hours ago and it worked just fine. I wonder why it doesn't work for you.


I am in UK and both mobile and laptop browsing don't work.


----------



## alota

pinkpiglet said:


> I just downloaded the firmware from their website 6 hours ago and it worked just fine. I wonder why it doesn't work for you.


which firmware?


----------



## pinkpiglet

alota said:


> which firmware?


Whoops wrong word. I meant driver.


----------



## emilsoft

Deders said:


> I think it has something to do with the supplied USB-C to USB-A adapter not connecting properly in the socket.  If I hold it in place it plays for longer, but not forever.
> 
> The splitter has to take power from the USB-C socket, leaving the USB-A for peripherals, meaning I have to use the adapter.
> 
> ...


It also didn't work for me with a battery and splitter cable, music was muting every few seconds or so.. it works perfectly fine when used with a non battery usb power source (like my ifi iusb)..  curious indeed..


----------



## musicday

Website now up and running.👍


----------



## claud W

pinkpiglet said:


> I just downloaded the firmware from their website 6 hours ago and it worked just fine. I wonder why it doesn't work for you.


Please tell me what firmware did you download for the RU6? Are you just talking about the PC driver ?


----------



## alota

claud W said:


> Please tell me what firmware did you download for the RU6? Are you just talking about the PC driver ?


yes. see post 946


----------



## teknorob23

I've only had it couple of days and it ran for 24hrs before i started listening, but my initial impressions are that the DragonFly Cobalt is winning on resolution, stage width and separation. Front to back depth is closer maybe going to the Cayin. Tonally very different, the DFC is far more neutral while unsurprisingly the RU6 is more coloured. All my listening has been with Focal Utopia streaming Qobuz and tidal via roon with a macbook air. 

From a user-ability point of you, the RU6 is pretty smooth to operate but i have been getting the occasional pop when adjusting the volume, but otherwise pretty plug and play. Not as simple as the AQ and i dont really need the on device volume control but others might like it. The form factor is not as well finished as the AQ and its just rectangular box, but it is nice to not have to remember which colour means which bit rate thanks to the screen.

Oh and i've only listened via the SE connection, because i'm just waiting for a 4.4mm connector to arrive, but i'll report back once i've made up a cable.


----------



## econaut

teknorob23 said:


> I've only had it couple of days and it ran for 24hrs before i started listening, but my initial impressions are that the DragonFly Cobalt is winning on resolution, stage width and separation. Front to back depth is closer maybe going to the Cayin. Tonally very different, the DFC is far more neutral while unsurprisingly the RU6 is more coloured. All my listening has been with Focal Utopia streaming Qobuz and tidal via roon with a macbook air.
> 
> From a user-ability point of you, the RU6 is pretty smooth to operate but i have been getting the occasional pop when adjusting the volume, but otherwise pretty plug and play. Not as simple as the AQ and i dont really need the on device volume control but others might like it. The form factor is not as well finished as the AQ and its just rectangular box, but it is nice to not have to remember which colour means which bit rate thanks to the screen.
> 
> Oh and i've only listened via the SE connection, because i'm just waiting for a 4.4mm connector to arrive, but i'll report back once i've made up a cable.


I am pretty sure I would prefer the DFC with the Utopias because of the upper mids / treble region. The Cobalt is more relaxed there than the RU6. What do you think?


----------



## teknorob23

econaut said:


> I am pretty sure I would prefer the DFC with the Utopias because of the upper mids / treble region. The Cobalt is more relaxed there than the RU6. What do you think?



the RU6 now and it is bit more forwarded in the upper mids, but its not too hot or fatiguing and its exactly around the 4-6khz that i'm pretty sensitive too.

I'm listening to some and IDM album by Hoavi that i'm quite addicted to at the moment, which is great for gauging pace, space and separation and while the DFC edges it, with shorter decay sounding more fleet of foot, it is the dryer of the two and and theres some very nice texture with the RU6 bringing lovely analogue sound to digital music, which is very much the way i prefer it.


----------



## RestrictedPocket

I've been eyeing the RU6 for a while now. Anyone got the hip dac/2 for comparison?


----------



## Goofyboy84

My RU6 just arrived today! 😁 Now I’m waiting for my Laylas, which have shipped and will arrive on Friday. 

And yes, it works fine with the iPhone 12 Pro Max to the camera splitter to usb / usb-c coupler to the RU6. No issues. 😊 

I’ll burn everything in at once. Low pass, as I’m only 20 ohms and volume around 50. I have the weekend to do burn in. I’ll listen occasionally for fun. But that’s it. 😊

I’ll just lurk in here and post my thoughts here in a week or so.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Goofyboy84 said:


> My RU6 just arrived today! 😁 Now I’m waiting for my Laylas, which have shipped and will arrive on Friday.
> 
> And yes, it works fine with the iPhone 12 Pro Max to the camera splitter to usb / usb-c coupler to the RU6. No issues. 😊
> 
> ...


Which splitter are you using for the iPhone 12?


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> Which splitter are you using for the iPhone 12?


Apple camera adapter. It goes from the lightning port and splits into a lightning and USB. Lightning port to charge. USB to hook up to the dongle. The dongle comes with a usb to USB-C adapter. Then the Cayin comes with a short USB-c to USB-c. Then the USB-C plugs into the Cayin RU6… then to your headphones on the other end. 😊 It’s pretty long once everything is connected, as you can imagine. I’ll post a pic, hold on.


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> Which splitter are you using for the iPhone 12?


This is the adaptor


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> Which splitter are you using for the iPhone 12?


This is how its connected. It’s about 18” in length including the phone. That’s before I hook headphones up to it. 😊


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 16, 2021)

Okay, let me return to the ”specialty“ use case of driving the RU6 from a Linux computer.


111MilesToGo said:


> Up front: I continue to realize what a cute little thing the RU6 is, most of all soundwise and what has been packed into this small form factor. But I keep coming across some gotchas…
> 
> I would like to give an initial report here on my findings with the RU6 and Linux when I feed it from a Linux laptop via USB-A > Cayin USB-A to C > Cayin USB-C to C cable. I am using openSUSE Tumbleweed for now, which is a rolling release distro with everything updated to their latest versions. I did already mention here that I prefer to have the audio player software play directly to alsa in order to ensure bit-perfectness; that means any pulseaudio or pipewire is bypassed. My audio player software are the ”audiophile standard“ mpd+Cantata (Music Player Daemon service with Cantata as graphical control interface) and DeaDBeeF (stand-alone player, similar to foobar2000 on Windows). For your reference, there was a website by Ronald van Engelen (lacocina.nl), which unfortunately is defunct now, but accessible through the wayback machine - this site taught me the basics of audiophile Linux.
> 
> ...


I had reported on the ”white noise“ issue. I could hunt it down now. The fact is that BIT DEPTH changes (from 16 to 24 or vice versa) from track to track are a hit-or-miss affair. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn‘t.

This can be solved basically by enforcing 24-bit output from the audio player of choice. In my case of mpd+Cantata (Music Player Daemon), it can nicely be set in the mpd.config file by inserting a line for ”allowed_formats“ in the alsa output section. Such a line takes care of enforcing 24-bit PCM, and it can also specify the allowed DSD as DoP formats. Done, works great.

Please note that I can only speak for my Linux version and my use of mpd. DeaDBeeF still needs to be adjusted.

@Andykong: I have no clue whether this issue of failure upon bit depth change from track to track is (a) due to the RU6 firmware, or (b) due to the Linux kernel module (”driver“) which is automatically chosen for the RU6. Remember that Linux (alsa) comes with oodles of hardware modules included, no user installation of third-party drivers needed as on Windows. Thus you might or might not consider diving deeper into this issue; you might consider it ”solved by user“. It is up to you whether you would like to include a hint or a link in the first post of this thread.

EDIT: For the fun of Linux users, cf. the screenshot posted herafter, https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb-dongle-dac-with-head-amp.960113/post-16715439 (next page).


----------



## musicday

I wrote too early yesterday, website is down again .


----------



## SHOOTINGTECHIE

Anyone knows if the CAYIN RU6 supports UAC 1.0 or has a switch to change it from UAC 2.0 to UAC 1.0 like the L&P W2 ?


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 16, 2021)

111MilesToGo said:


> Okay, let me return to the ”specialty“ use case of driving the RU6 from a Linux computer.
> 
> I had reported on the ”white noise“ issue. I could hunt it down now. The fact is that BIT DEPTH changes (from 16 to 24 or vice versa) from track to track are a hit-or-miss affair. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn‘t.
> 
> ...


For the fun of Linux users: Screenshot with Cantata (graphical user interface to mpd [Music Player Daemon]), the RU6 output definition for mpd shown in the editor window, and information from mpd on the track being played as well as from alsa on the hardware parameters (lower right, in the conky).


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> This is how its connected. It’s about 18” in length including the phone. That’s before I hook headphones up to it. 😊



Wouldn't it be cleaner instead of this (3 pieces):





To have just this (1 piece, for $19):





You will loose charging port, but will gain portability


----------



## Deders (Dec 16, 2021)

twister6 said:


> Wouldn't it be cleaner instead of this (3 pieces):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The point is we're looking for ways to extend charge with splitters and batteries.

It seems to work with apple, but not android.

My adapter worked with an ifi dac but not the RU6.


----------



## kumar402

twister6 said:


> Wouldn't it be cleaner instead of this (3 pieces):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Does it come with this lightening to USB C cable or do we have to buy separately?


----------



## twister6

kumar402 said:


> Does it come with this lightening to USB C cable or do we have to buy separately?



Optional, just like S2.  W2 includes it, but it also cost more, though with both adapters all three dongles priced about the same.


----------



## twister6

Deders said:


> The point is we're looking for ways to extend charge with splitters and batteries.
> 
> It seems to work with apple, but not android.
> 
> My adapter worked with an ifi dac but not the RU6.



So, you tried something like this (usb-c splitter with pass through charging, under $15 on amazon) and it doesn't work with your Android phone and RU6?  Wonder if usb-c data/power port for "audio" either current limited or doesn't have 5V output.  Can anybody with such splitter and usb-c power meter dongle confirm?


----------



## If6was9 (Dec 16, 2021)

I use this,
with android smartphone.
It works

P.s.
first connect power cable, then data cable





https://www.amazon.it/gp/aw/d/B098PYB42L/ref=ya_aw_od_pi?ie=UTF8&psc=1

By the way, with the splitter
(powering the smartphone),
through UAPP, in DSD, I can use the DSD on PCM,
while without external power, I could only use the DSD at PCM, because with the DoP, I had continuous stuttering problems, perhaps because it requires more energy


----------



## twister6

If6was9 said:


> I use this,
> with android smartphone.
> It works
> 
> ...



Ordered a similar splitter from Amazon US, should have it on Sat and will share my results.


----------



## Xinlisupreme

I bought DDhifi lightning cable for W2 and it’s better than stock cable.
I’d be curious to know more comparison between W2 and RU6 because I read different opinion about them.
W2 pairs very well with Crassirostris, EM5, Land and Star, I like it also with HS1677ss and I didn’t try it with other IEMs I own as Dark Sky, Aroma Thunder and Duet…
Someone says RU6 has different presentation than W2, someone says are very similar, funny hear so different opinions.😊


----------



## claud W

twister6 said:


> Ordered a similar splitter from Amazon US, should have it on Sat and will share my results.


Twister6, you are a big help with the cables. Thank you. 

When are you going to do a RU6 review? Or better yet a review of the top 3 dongles? A dongle should be an easier review than a DAP since it is a simpler electronic device. 
Thanks again from us dongle folks and Happy Holidays.


----------



## econaut

Is there any small USB type C denoising device (for example made by @iFi audio) that can be used with a smartphone and a dongle DAC?


----------



## dumpsterfire (Dec 16, 2021)

Got mine in today and I am impressed. Even with the positive comments here I wasn't sure what to expect from this little dongle since I am used to the sound quality of a good DAP up through desktop gear. With IEMs at least, the RU6 has a warm-tilted and inviting sound that isn't surgically precise like some D/S chips but rather presents the music with a pleasing tonality and excellent timbre that just makes it so easy to listen and listen and listen. I'm not hearing any etching or peakiness in the treble or upper mids. And this is straight out of the box, I'm sure it will improve even further with burn in.

A few random thoughts:
1. Tried the same file on a Shanling M0, an iPhone 12 Pro Max, and a MacBook Pro. They sounded the same to me, at the same volume levels. Not sure the smaller/lower powered devices are holding back the RU6 as some here have argued.

2. I find I'm preferring OS for 16/44 material and NOS for high res. This makes sense as OS is in theory less necessary as the native sample rate of the file gets higher. On 16/44 files, NOS sounds muddier and less precise.

3. The Cayin USB-C->Lightning cable works a treat, but I did pick up a little EMI when there was no music playing. I know someone posted a link to a good longer USB-C to lightning OTG cable but I'm having trouble finding the link. Does anyone remember the post with that link?


----------



## twister6

Btw, with either Android or iPhone, while listening at your desk you can keep it on a wireless charger while having your dongle plugged in and playing/streaming music.  That's what I usually do.


----------



## kumar402

Is it worth getting the case? Does it look pretty without it? Also does the case come with any attachment which helps in attaching this dongle with phone or tab


----------



## musicday

kumar402 said:


> Is it worth getting the case? Does it look pretty without it? Also does the case come with any attachment which helps in attaching this dongle with phone or tab


Yes get the case to protect it. Is has magnet inside to attach it to your phone, with a small metallic plate.


----------



## kumar402

musicday said:


> Yes get the case to protect it. Is has magnet inside to attach it to your phone, with a small metallic plate.


I have mojo as portable DAC but it has that RFI/EMI issue when stacked right behind phone when it’s on LTE, 
With RU6, when we stack it behind phone on Wi-Fi or mobile network do we get those static?


----------



## HarveyLowis

kumar402 said:


> I have mojo as portable DAC but it has that RFI/EMI issue when stacked right behind phone when it’s on LTE,
> With RU6, when we stack it behind phone on Wi-Fi or mobile network do we get those static?


My RU6 with case when stacked behind my iphone ( airplane mode with and without wifi turning on ) are having RFI / EMI issue. The most loudest is when i put in front / back near power button.
When using with android ( LG and Xiaomi ) and ipad mini ( when stacked near down left 7 oclock position ) got the same problem too.
Im using RU6 usb c cable with android and ddhifi lightning to usb c cable.


----------



## kumar402

HarveyLowis said:


> My RU6 with case when stacked behind my iphone ( airplane mode with and without wifi turning on ) are having RFI / EMI issue. The most loudest is when i put in front / back near power button.
> When using with android ( LG and Xiaomi ) and ipad mini ( when stacked near down left 7 oclock position ) got the same problem too.
> Im using RU6 usb c cable with android and ddhifi lightning to usb c cable.


So you feel it’s better to keep it away from phone a bit by using longer cable?


----------



## yfei

kumar402 said:


> I have mojo as portable DAC but it has that RFI/EMI issue when stacked right behind phone when it’s on LTE,
> With RU6, when we stack it behind phone on Wi-Fi or mobile network do we get those static?


not as bad as mojo.   but still noticible with RU6.
mojo's EMI issue is at unlistenable level, I have to turn the phone to airplane mode everytime.     With RU6, I will turn the phone to airplane mode only when I want to do some critical listening.


----------



## HarveyLowis

kumar402 said:


> So you feel it’s better to keep it away from phone a bit by using longer cable?


when using the otg cable ( about 10cm length ) and let it straight away from phone, i barely hear any RFI / EMI. But if you want to buy the case and stacked with your phone, i dont think longer cable will eliminate RFI / EMI


----------



## yfei (Dec 17, 2021)

Regarding RU6's OS vs NOS,    my feeling is that:     
1. NOS has the best clarity and details, keep all the information.   OS does some smoothing work, reduces details and spatial information.
2. I decide NOS mode or OS mode based on each album.      Based on, for a specific album,  which mode can create best 'realism'.
I found out, for well recorded albums, especially albums recorded using analog chain, no matter it is classic or pop/rock,  NOS mode is better.  Because NOS can preserve the most information,  and these albums won't feel digital at all.    
For digitally mastered albums, in NOS mode I can hear artifacts, digital feeling,   then turn on OS mode it will make these albums smooth and analog.

So, right now for each album I will try both NOS and OS,  and decide which is better for the album:  which mode can create the best realism, while not losing information.


----------



## yfei

When trying new toys like RU6, W2, and other DACs,   
What's the same:  I was wowed by improvement, and can't stop going over all my albums and tracks to find new 'things'
The difference is:   For W2 and all other DACs, I was wowed by small details that I never heard before.
For RU6, I was wowed by the "emotions", and "artist's expressions, real intentions, and ideas" I never realized before.


----------



## Jaabaas

teknorob23 said:


> I've only had it couple of days and it ran for 24hrs before i started listening, but my initial impressions are that the DragonFly Cobalt is winning on resolution, stage width and separation. Front to back depth is closer maybe going to the Cayin. Tonally very different, the DFC is far more neutral while unsurprisingly the RU6 is more coloured. All my listening has been with Focal Utopia streaming Qobuz and tidal via roon with a macbook air.
> 
> From a user-ability point of you, the RU6 is pretty smooth to operate but i have been getting the occasional pop when adjusting the volume, but otherwise pretty plug and play. Not as simple as the AQ and i dont really need the on device volume control but others might like it. The form factor is not as well finished as the AQ and its just rectangular box, but it is nice to not have to remember which colour means which bit rate thanks to the screen.
> 
> Oh and i've only listened via the SE connection, because i'm just waiting for a 4.4mm connector to arrive, but i'll report back once i've made up a cable.


Thanks for this! Im considering both of these options (although for Iems, have headphone amp on the desk for when I'm at home) and kind of assumed the cayin would be better. good to see it's not that clear cut! I'll have to go and find some reviews!


----------



## dumpsterfire

yfei said:


> When trying new toys like RU6, W2, and other DACs,
> What's the same:  I was wowed by improvement, and can't stop going over all my albums and tracks to find new 'things'
> The difference is:   For W2 and all other DACs, I was wowed by small details that I never heard before.
> For RU6, I was wowed by the "emotions", and "artist's expressions, real intentions, and ideas" I never realized before.


Exactly. This is why I opt for Multibit/R2R whenever possible. D/S is great at pulling out details but it feels like the forest is lost for the trees. In a good implementation, I feel R2R preserves and reproduces more of the “soul” of the music than D/S. That’s just been my experience.


----------



## Andykong

twister6 said:


> Btw, with either Android or iPhone, while listening at your desk you can keep it on a wireless charger while having your dongle plugged in and playing/streaming music.  That's what I usually do.



That's what I planned before I receive my RU6, and I didn't exactly, but I make a stupid mistake.

I bought *THIS *wireless charger, the sales told me that this is the only universal wireless charger that support 15W fast charging on wireless (I am using Samsung S20), so I pay for it without a swipe.  

When I try the wireless charger with RU6, this is what I end up with. 







For the record, if you want to wireless and use RU6 at the same time, DON'T buy any standup charge.


----------



## Andykong

SHOOTINGTECHIE said:


> Anyone knows if the CAYIN RU6 supports UAC 1.0 or has a switch to change it from UAC 2.0 to UAC 1.0 like the L&P W2 ?



Sorry, RU6 doesn't support UAC 1.0.


----------



## Andykong

Deders said:


> I think it has something to do with the supplied USB-C to USB-A adapter not connecting properly in the socket.  If I hold it in place it plays for longer, but not forever.
> 
> The splitter has to take power from the USB-C socket, leaving the USB-A for peripherals, meaning I have to use the adapter.
> 
> ...





emilsoft said:


> It also didn't work for me with a battery and splitter cable, music was muting every few seconds or so.. it works perfectly fine when used with a non battery usb power source (like my ifi iusb)..  curious indeed..





If6was9 said:


> I use this,
> with android smartphone.
> It works
> 
> ...





twister6 said:


> Ordered a similar splitter from Amazon US, should have it on Sat and will share my results.



Glad we find a solution to charge and listen to RU6 at the same time.  I want something like this as well and will look for similar Y-split cable locally.

I can think of another useful scenario for this Y-split cable: to connect 2.5" harddisk as OTG storage to DAP,  l'll give it a try when I get my hand on this.


----------



## Andykong

teknorob23 said:


> I've only had it couple of days and it ran for 24hrs before i started listening, but my initial impressions are that the DragonFly Cobalt is winning on resolution, stage width and separation. Front to back depth is closer maybe going to the Cayin. Tonally very different, the DFC is far more neutral while unsurprisingly the RU6 is more coloured. All my listening has been with Focal Utopia streaming Qobuz and tidal via roon with a macbook air.
> 
> From a user-ability point of you, the RU6 is pretty smooth to operate but i have been getting the occasional pop when adjusting the volume, but otherwise pretty plug and play. Not as simple as the AQ and i dont really need the on device volume control but others might like it. The form factor is not as well finished as the AQ and its just rectangular box, but it is nice to not have to remember which colour means which bit rate thanks to the screen.
> 
> Oh and i've only listened via the SE connection, because i'm just waiting for a 4.4mm connector to arrive, but i'll report back once i've made up a cable.



If you are using DFC and RU6 at the same time, what is your volume setting on your Macbook?

The DFC don't have internal volume control, so you can only control the volume from your Macbook, right?

R-2R DAC like RU6 is very demanding on data integrity of incoming digital bit-stream. We advice our users to use bit-perfect USB Audio source whenever possible, or turn the volume to 100 (full output) if bit perfect USB Audio is not available. 

So there is some operation contradiction if you connect both DFC and RU6 to the same USB Audio source.  If you have turn the volume of your Macbook to a relatively low position, the performance of RU6 will be downgraded inevitably.


----------



## Andykong

claud W said:


> Another dongle use
> I ordered my RU6 to use as a DAC amp for my beach house IMac IEM and headphone source to listen to Tidal. It will also give me experience with an R2R DAC without the expense of a R2R DAP.


......  an R2R DAC without the expense of a R2R DAP, that's an interesting statement.


----------



## Andykong

111MilesToGo said:


> Up front: I continue to realize what a cute little thing the RU6 is, most of all soundwise and what has been packed into this small form factor. But I keep coming across some gotchas…
> 
> I would like to give an initial report here on my findings with the RU6 and Linux when I feed it from a Linux laptop via USB-A > Cayin USB-A to C > Cayin USB-C to C cable. I am using openSUSE Tumbleweed for now, which is a rolling release distro with everything updated to their latest versions. I did already mention here that I prefer to have the audio player software play directly to alsa in order to ensure bit-perfectness; that means any pulseaudio or pipewire is bypassed. My audio player software are the ”audiophile standard“ mpd+Cantata (Music Player Daemon service with Cantata as graphical control interface) and DeaDBeeF (stand-alone player, similar to foobar2000 on Windows). For your reference, there was a website by Ronald van Engelen (lacocina.nl), which unfortunately is defunct now, but accessible through the wayback machine - this site taught me the basics of audiophile Linux.
> 
> ...





111MilesToGo said:


> Okay, let me return to the ”specialty“ use case of driving the RU6 from a Linux computer.
> 
> I had reported on the ”white noise“ issue. I could hunt it down now. The fact is that BIT DEPTH changes (from 16 to 24 or vice versa) from track to track are a hit-or-miss affair. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn‘t.
> 
> ...



Sorry for my late response, I didn't pay enough attention to the RU6 thread, didn't notice your problem until today when I sit down and go through all the posts thoroughly in past 1 week.

I am glad that you find a solution promptly and I hope your solution is applicable to other Linux users if they run into similar problem.  I am not a Linux user so I can't really contribute on  your problem technically.  I'll forward your posts to my Engineer next week, and remind them to look in your problem and solution promptly.


----------



## Andykong

sahmen said:


> I have posted these on a different forum, but I wanted to post them here as well, and say how pleased I am with the way the RU6 drives my Audeze LCD-5, from both 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs. The pictured cable is the Norne audio Drausk, which is fantastic in the chain. However, I am currently using the Vykari as well, and it ups the ante on several different fronts, and by the way, I hear no etch or anything resembling unpleasant edges anywhere in the spectrum... Just delicious and sumptuous liquidity all around and a weighty textured bass that has removed any desire for EQ'ing... Of course, YMMV, but I am generally happy that RU6 offers me the opportunity to use my LCD-5 on the Go when needed :





sahmen said:


> This is an interesting question, but to respond with the diligence and attentiveness it requires I would need to A/B my morpheus rig and the RU6 very carefully so that I can give you the most reliable answer possible. Yet even an answer such as this should already tell you that the differences between the two are not of the kind that are exaggerated enough to smack the listener in the face, and I already consider that to be high praise for the RU6 given the price delta that separates it from the likes of the Morpheus.
> 
> I have not really listened to the Morpheus rig since the RU6 arrived so this should be taken with a grain of salt. The RU6 is definitely in the ballpark of the Morpheus or other R-2R desktops as far as tonality and timbre go. The important differences will lie in other technical areas such as soundstage, spaciousness, separation, detail retrieval, and treble/bass extension, and these remain to be assessed in more rigorous fashion.  Still I can tell you that I have been very impressed by the RU6 in these areas, as paired with the LCD-5. Or to put it differently, the RU6, on its own merits, has not given me the impression that something important is missing in any part of the sonic spectrum, or that some part of it is unpleasant, as in "etched," "sibilant," or fatiguing", and I find that to be already quite gratifying. That probably explains why I have been listening exclusively to my LCD-5/RU6 pairing for about a week now, without missing the Morpheus/Niimbus or my Yggy/Pathos rigs at all.
> 
> Of course some caveats must go with these declarations as well, apart from the obvious honeymooning factor :  The LCD-5 is spec'd at 14 ohms with a sensitivity of 90dbs, so it is relatively easier to drive as compared to, say, an Abyss TC or a Susvara, both of which I will never even bother to try out on the RU6 (but then, I have a feeling that the RU6 was not intended for those hard-to drive "monsters" either). Still to the latter's credit, it has performed very well with the likes of the Hifiman Sundara, the He-400i, and the Sennheiser Hd58X so it can hold its own fairly well with a good number of cans once one is out of the hard-to-drive planars territory.  The other caveat is that, without having even AB'ed them side by side, I expect the RU6 to come up short when stacked up against the "big boys" such as at the Morpheus and Yggy rigs, but this is as it should be.  I think the achievement of the RU6 lies less in matching such rigs, pound for pound, than in placing itself in the same conversation and ballpark. I think most who listen to the RU6 would be impressed by that achievement.



I am shocked and speechless, ...  the happy kind.  and I am excited, ...  and grateful. 

I didn't expect RU6 to work fine with LCD-5.   Being a low impedance low sensitivity full size planar, it can run on low voltage but is fairly demanding on current according to its specification.  



> *I have been listening exclusively to my LCD-5/RU6 pairing for about a week now, without missing the Morpheus/Niimbus or my Yggy/Pathos rigs at all.*



This is a very high regard to RU6.  I am sure our team will be very encouraged when they read  your comment.  Thank you very much.


----------



## Andykong

Stuff Jones said:


> @Andykong, is there any scientific basis for burn in with the RU6? It seems to sound more clear and less bloomy now, but maybe its just brain burn in?


I don't have any scientific explanation about burn in, neither have I conducted any ABA test or blind test to verify this.  This is purely based on subjective experience.  If you music chain is improving, spend more time to enjoy your music, that's all I can advice.


----------



## Andykong

econaut said:


> Concerning the Utopias that's correct. Concerning the RU6 I am on the fence. Coincidentally I am listening to the dongles with the Campfire Cascade that has beryllium coated drivers similar (not the same) to the beryllium drivers of the Utopias.
> 
> And I am not the guy who introduced the word "etch" here. I just assume I am hearing the same thing that several other people here called "etch" or "edgy treble".
> 
> ...





econaut said:


> @Andykong I don't doubt this, but could you please elaborate on which parts of the sound become stable? Maybe you have some experience with this. Many thanks



As I shared previously, burn in is an subjective observation only, I don't have scientific explanation to this issue.  In my observation, coherent and tonal balance are the more noticeable improvement during burn-in.  

On the other hand, if you have gone beyond 100 hours already, I don't think there will be any significantly change after that.  The "etch" probably is a done deal already, I don't recommend you to hang on further and hoping it will disappear after another 50 hours or 100 hours.  This is unrealistic.  

Maybe we can just conclude that the RU6 is not a good dongle DAC for your preference.  This is most unfortunate but an appropriate conclusion.


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> I am comparing ru6 to hdvd800 head amp.
> To fast swap I use two digital sources: ss note20ultra and sp1000.
> Player is NeutronMp.
> Hdvd800 feed same time by both dual xlr to 2.5(with balance adapter to 4.4) and usb line (Furutech cable).
> ...





Goofyboy84 said:


> I have a random question.. will I notice any difference in sound if I change from my iPhone 12 Pro Max to my iPad Pro (3rd generation, if that matters)? Both will be iTunes, both will be high resolution/lossless files, everything else equal. Just a thought is all. 😊
> 
> My stuff will be here this week. I’m just a weee bit excited! 😁



R-2R is fairly demanding on data integrity of digital audio input, more than most Delta sigma DAC chipset IMHO.  For this reason, RU6 is sensitive to quality of USB Audio input.  Changing your digital source can change the audio performance of the RU6 noticeably.


----------



## Andykong

yfei said:


> Regarding RU6's OS vs NOS,    my feeling is that:
> 1. NOS has the best clarity and details, keep all the information.   OS does some smoothing work, reduces details and spatial information.
> 2. I decide NOS mode or OS mode based on each album.      Based on, for a specific album,  which mode can create best 'realism'.
> I found out, for well recorded albums, especially albums recorded using analog chain, no matter it is classic or pop/rock,  NOS mode is better.  Because NOS can preserve the most information,  and these albums won't feel digital at all.
> ...





yfei said:


> When trying new toys like RU6, W2, and other DACs,
> What's the same:  I was wowed by improvement, and can't stop going over all my albums and tracks to find new 'things'
> The difference is:   For W2 and all other DACs, I was wowed by small details that I never heard before.
> For RU6, I was wowed by the "emotions", and "artist's expressions, real intentions, and ideas" I never realized before.



One of the most substantial sharing on NOS vs OS.   I think we should give him a round of applause   

The following diagram illustrated why oversampling does some smoothing work:








Unfortunately, oversampling involves digital filters and will introduce aliasing to the signal.  This is a process that produces non-harmonic frequencies that are not part of the input signal. We refer these induced frequencies as digital artifacts of the sampling and digitization process itself. They are folded back into the audio range and create *ringing* and other undesirable noise.  That's why NOS offers better clarity and keep all the original information with minimum distortion.


----------



## Alexzander

Got my RU6 today. If you are impatient as me I recommend you to burn-in the thing using dense Rock, Hard Rock and Electronic music.

In its raw state RU6 is less revolving than W2 and sibilant during some track’s (I use Oriolus Traillii), but overall sound signature is very cohesive, so unless you know that more details should be present you won’t get impression that something is missing.

Bass punch is fun and I’ll give RU6 a win over W2 on this. NOS mode will give one a clear idea of why OS was invented 

Let’s see what will change while the time passes by.


----------



## iFi audio

econaut said:


> Is there any small USB type C denoising device (for example made by @iFi audio) that can be used with a smartphone and a dongle DAC?



We don't have that in our offer, but as far as new designs go we never say never. Thanks for bringing it up, such ideas motivate us!


----------



## econaut

Andykong said:


> R-2R is fairly demanding on data integrity of digital audio input, more than most Delta sigma DAC chipset IMHO. For this reason, RU6 is sensitive to quality of USB Audio input. Changing your digital source can change the audio performance of the RU6 noticeably.





iFi audio said:


> We don't have that in our offer, but as far as new designs go we never say never. Thanks for bringing it up, such ideas motivate us!


Please do it! Reason: see above quote


----------



## felix3650

iFi audio said:


> We don't have that in our offer, but as far as new designs go we never say never. Thanks for bringing it up, such ideas motivate us!


Something of a short type-c to type-c cable with filtering and regeneration for these dongles would be great.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Everything is here!!!!! I did transparent black for the plate and I did transparent yellow for the shell. It felt like forever, but it was worth the wait! Now I get to listen to them! 😊


----------



## masahito24@chart

I've been using  the ipurifier with mines and had great success, but I agree that having a smaller device that's built into a cable or smaller type dongle would be excellent.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I need some help, if someone can help me here or PM me; that’d be great. I audio cuts in and out. 😢😢😢😢😢


----------



## Goofyboy84

I took the balanced cable off and bypassed the amp, using just the old iPhone dongle and it plays fine…. Sigh….


----------



## If6was9 (Dec 17, 2021)

This with the beast Anker battery pack


----------



## dumpsterfire

Goofyboy84 said:


> I need some help, if someone can help me here or PM me; that’d be great. I audio cuts in and out. 😢😢😢😢😢


Are you using it with an iPhone? Did you connect it with the iPhone OTG cable that was being sold with the RU6?


----------



## Goofyboy84

@Andykong have you heard any issues with a setup like mine? I took the amp and the camera adapter variables out of the equation. The normal apple dongle plays fine. I may add the amp and camera adaptor and try it with the 3.5 unbalanced cable. That’d eliminate the cable… if THAT is an issue. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> Are you using it with an iPhone? Did you connect it with the iPhone OTG cable that was being sold with the RU6?


Yes. Everything is apple, Cayin, or now, JH. Nothing oddball or anything.


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> Are you using it with an iPhone? Did you connect it with the iPhone OTG cable that was being sold with the RU6?


And everything is brand new. Except the phone. The adapter, Cayin, JH Laylas, JH balanced cable… etc.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Goofyboy84 said:


> Yes. Everything is apple, Cayin, or now, JH. Nothing oddball or anything.


So connecting it with the USB-C to lightning cable adapter sold from Cayin, you are having audio dropouts?


----------



## Goofyboy84

dumpsterfire said:


> So connecting it with the USB-C to lightning cable adapter sold from Cayin, you are having audio dropouts?


I’m using the Cayin to their USB c to USC c to the usb adaptor to the apple camera adaptor. Which is usb and lightning to lightning. So I can charge the phone at the same time.


----------



## dumpsterfire

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m using the Cayin to their USB c to USC c to the usb adaptor to the apple camera adaptor. Which is usb and lightning to lightning. So I can charge the phone at the same time.


I would recommend trying it with a direct connection in that case, sounds like you'd need a different cable though.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I’m doing it like this. I’m gonna use the unbalanced cable like this and see if it’s the cable. Process of elimination at this point.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Ok! It works with the 3.5 mm UNBALANCED cable!!!!!! I’m just documenting as I go along here. 😊


----------



## Goofyboy84

And this AMP/DAC makes a world of difference instead of straight iPhone!!!! Now! Let’s try the balanced cable. If this works, then this means I had some interference from my vehicle as I was trying everything out as soon as I got everything in the parking lot. 😁


----------



## Goofyboy84

It’s the balanced side that’s doing it. I switched cables and left everything the same. 😢😢😢😢

It’s not the apple adapter, it’s not how I have it hooked up. So it’s either the balanced side of the dongle or it’s the balanced cable from JH.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Here’s one!!!!!!

If I turn the volume from 50 down to 25 and turn OS to on… it seems fine! If I turn the volume to 40 it cuts off… 

It doesn’t like NOS one bit. Has anyone else has this issue. The cable apparently works fine. I’m not upset, if it gets fixed or is a known issue. The Laylas are 20 ohm, if that matters… so I have it on low pass. If I leave it and walk away slowly…. It’s fine… for now….


----------



## Goofyboy84

Welp. That was short lived. It’s cutting out on the 4.4 balanced cable. 😢😢😢😢 I’m convinced it’s the amp. Sigh… 😢😢😢


----------



## Goofyboy84

I hooked it up to my iPad Pro as it has direct USB connection… it’s cut out once so far. Volume 40, right now. I’m scared to touch the dongle as I’m afraid it’ll cut out on me again. Haha!! Right now it’s in OS also. I was wanting to do NOS,…… scratch that.. it cut out at song change.


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> I hooked it up to my iPad Pro as it has direct USB connection… it’s cut out once so far. Volume 40, right now. I’m scared to touch the dongle as I’m afraid it’ll cut out on me again. Haha!! Right now it’s in OS also. I was wanting to do NOS,…… scratch that.. it cut out at song change.



I lost you with all these posts/updates   Are you saying you have RU6 connected directed to iPad Pro with the included usb-c to usb-c cable and having issues when volume is above 40 and music randomly cut out?


----------



## Goofyboy84

The iPad is doing fine. If I wanna use a balanced connection. It has to be more direct, from what I’m seeing. The apple camera adaptor is a no go. Now… if I wanna use an unbalanced connection… I can use the camera adaptor… but the direct USBc connection to the iPad is working fine, for now. 

Now! Let me see if I can use the USBc to lightning cable and be ok with the phone… as in… my phone charger cord. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️ If it works, fine. If not… I’ll buy the USBc to lightning cable from Cayin through MusicTeck and call it a day….

I was hoping I could charge the phone at the same time… but oh well…


----------



## Goofyboy84

twister6 said:


> I lost you with all these posts/updates   Are you saying you have RU6 connected directed to iPad Pro with the included usb-c to usb-c cable and having issues when volume is above 40 and music randomly cut out?


Right now my best luck is with the direct USBc to USBc to the iPad Pro for the 4.4mm balanced. Yes.


----------



## Goofyboy84

My BEST connection so far.


----------



## Andykong

Goofyboy84 said:


> The iPad is doing fine. If I wanna use a balanced connection. It has to be more direct, from what I’m seeing. The apple camera adaptor is a no go. Now… if I wanna use an unbalanced connection… I can use the camera adaptor… but the direct USBc connection to the iPad is working fine, for now.
> 
> Now! Let me see if I can use the USBc to lightning cable and be ok with the phone… as in… my phone charger cord. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️ If it works, fine. If not… I’ll buy the USBc to lightning cable from Cayin through MusicTeck and call it a day….
> 
> I was hoping I could charge the phone at the same time… but oh well…


Any chance the camera adapter connection is drawing more than 120mW from the phone at balanced Vol 40?


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> Any chance the camera adapter connection is drawing more than 120mW from the phone at balanced Vol 40?


How would I check? Cause I just hooked my charging cable (apple) to the RU6 for the phone and it’s not even recognizing it at all now.


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> Right now my best luck is with the direct USBc to USBc to the iPad Pro for the 4.4mm balanced. Yes.



Since you baselined your setup and know that RU6 and stock cable are working ok, focus on what is going on around that apple camera kit adapter, since your problem happens when you add it in series with your connection.  Have you tried it with and without charger connected to apple camera kit?  I would start without power connection first to eliminate another variable.  Also, you mentioned you were only using it in the car, assuming car usb charger?  Try it with a different charger at home, etc.


----------



## Goofyboy84

So… back to the iPad I go. At least it works.


----------



## Andykong

twister6 said:


> Since you baselined your setup and know that RU6 and stock cable are working ok, focus on what is going on around that apple camera kit adapter, since your problem happens when you add it in series with your connection.  Have you tried it with and without charger connected to apple camera kit?  I would start without power connection first to eliminate another variable.  Also, you mentioned you were only using it in the car, assuming car usb charger?  Try it with a different charger at home, etc.


If balanced worked but broken after vol 40,  does that looks like draining too much power from the iphone?  The strange part id broken at vol 40, not 80.


----------



## keenears (Dec 17, 2021)

Ok I read a lot of mqa bashing here. Fine. 

My question is specific to MQA relevance for Tidal Master Quality tracks. In that case it doesn’t matter if DSD / FLAC would have been just as good because it’s MQA and I have to work with it. So when I don’t have my DAP and want to listen to Tidal Master Quality on my iPhone or iPad, how does the MQA unfold capacity in a DAC affect sound quality?

For example, I have an MQA-supporting DDHIFI TC35 Pro which is also useful for Zoom calls. I know the RU6 is a better DAC, as good as the DDHIFI one is. However, because the RU6 doesn’t unfold the MQA is it still receiving the highest quality audio files from Tidal to decode? Will the Tidal technically downgrade sound quality for the RU6 in the case of Tidal Master Quality tracks while sending the full quality MQA to the DDHIFI TC35 Pro?


----------



## Andykong

ilbisonte said:


> Ok I read a lot of mqa bashing here. Fine. My question is, when I don’t have my DAP and want to listen to Tidal Master Quality on my iPhone or iPad, how does the mqa capacity effect sound quality? I have an MQA-supporting DDHIFI TC35 Pro which is also useful for Zoom calls. Will the RU6 technically downgrade sound quality in the case of Tidal Master Quality tracks vs the DDHIFI adapter’s MQA support?


You can only have 2x MQA unfold with RU6, 88.1kHz or 96 kHz.


----------



## keenears

Andykong said:


> You can only have 2x MQA unfold with RU6, 88.1kHz or 96 kHz.


Can you explain that a bit more? I just edited my original post to be clearer as well


----------



## Verificateur

Goofyboy84 said:


> I was hoping I could charge the phone at the same time… but oh well…


Can confirm that I can use RU6 and charge my phone at the same time, using the Apple USB adapter (photo below) with iPhone 11 Pro Max.

RU6 is connected to the USB port, and the charging cable into the lightning port on the adapter.


----------



## ClieOS

ilbisonte said:


> Can you explain that a bit more? I just edited my original post to be clearer as well


He probably meant to say you will only get the first unfold (2X) done by the Tidal app itself, and nothing more as RU6 is neither a MQA Renderer nor Decoder.


----------



## Goofyboy84

twister6 said:


> Since you baselined your setup and know that RU6 and stock cable are working ok, focus on what is going on around that apple camera kit adapter, since your problem happens when you add it in series with your connection.  Have you tried it with and without charger connected to apple camera kit?  I would start without power connection first to eliminate another variable.  Also, you mentioned you were only using it in the car, assuming car usb charger?  Try it with a different charger at home, etc.





Verificateur said:


> Can confirm that I can use RU6 and charge my phone at the same time, using the Apple USB adapter (photo below) with iPhone 11 Pro Max.
> 
> RU6 is connected to the USB port, and the charging cable into the lightning port on the adapter.


I just took mine back since I cannot use the balanced output on the RU6. I’m just running my apple dongle just fine and well… I’m running straight USBc for my iPad and able to use the RU6 with it… with the balanced output. 

So…. Unless something changes… there goes that idea….


----------



## keenears

ClieOS said:


> He probably meant to say you will only get the first unfold (2X) done by the Tidal app itself, and nothing more as RU6 is neither a MQA Renderer nor Decoder.


Thanks. I’m not so familiar with MQA. In such a case would the RU6 be better at 2x than the TC35 Pro fully “unfolded”?


----------



## pinkpiglet

ilbisonte said:


> Thanks. I’m not so familiar with MQA. In such a case would the RU6 be better at 2x than the TC35 Pro fully “unfolded”?


Sorry to intervene, but it's not as clear cut as that. If you are talking about technically better, then yes. The TC35 Pro has the ability for 8x unfold, but if it's musically better or sound more pleasing to the ear, then looking at MQA alone as a factor wouldn't tell you much. Saying better as in higher in fidelity wouldn't be correct as well as there's a whole debate about it. So, it depends. My advice is not  to think about it for too much.


----------



## Louisiana

Mine is on the way - should arrive on Tuesday.


----------



## econaut

pinkpiglet said:


> Sorry to intervene, but it's not as clear cut as that. If you are talking about technically better, then yes. The TC35 Pro has the ability for 8x unfold, but if it's musically better or sound more pleasing to the ear, then looking at MQA alone as a factor wouldn't tell you much. Saying better as in higher in fidelity wouldn't be correct as well as there's a whole debate about it. So, it depends. My advice is not  to think about it for too much.


This. You will probably hear a difference between the two Dongles, but not between the different MQA "unfolding" methods.

Or to put it this way: MP3s will sound better on the RU6 than hi res on the TC35 Pro.


----------



## vilhelm44

Has anyone got any good recommendations please for a really good shielded USB-C to USB-C cable? I'm starting to get a lot of interferance noise from my android phone. It wasn't there before but a little distracting now.


----------



## Doug2507 (Dec 18, 2021)

I'm using mine primarily with tablet / phone for video duties and have noticed that it constantly pops when source is paused / played / changed. When there's something playing it's a non issue but rather annoying in between. Is this common?

Also getting significant static interference on both devices at low volume regardless of cable used.

It stands out as I didn't get this with S1...


----------



## Mr.HiAudio

Hello audiophile 

Does anyone can compare RU6 with players? What level of sound?


----------



## utdeep

@Andykong - any plans to update this with new features through firmware?  I’ve been thinking about my Cayin N6ii and other Cayin products and I think they have stunning hardware but rarely any software updates.   On the other hand , the Lotoo products have had things like MQA, UAC1, and a line out mode through firmware updates.  They’ve also been open about what they work on.

Are you planning on adding any features soon?


----------



## dricas_007

I got mine from Jaben Singapore last week. So far the sound is amazing 🤩


----------



## twister6

utdeep said:


> @Andykong - any plans to update this with new features through firmware?  I’ve been thinking about my Cayin N6ii and other Cayin products and I think they have stunning hardware but rarely any software updates.   On the other hand , the Lotoo products have had things like MQA, UAC1, and a line out mode through firmware updates.  They’ve also been open about what they work on.
> 
> Are you planning on adding any features soon?



Just thinking out loud, firmware updates are either to fix bugs or to add/unlock features already supported by the hardware. Of course, I can't speak on Cayin behalf, but I don't think there are any more hidden tricks left up their hardwares sleeve? Mqa, uac1 mode, and LO (?) was already mentioned as no. So, what else is left out there?


----------



## utdeep

Cool!  Posted my Cayin RU6 on the classifieds in case anyone is interested. 
https://www.head-fi.org/classifieds/cayin-ru6.16536/

Just couldn’t figure out where it fit in my stable against the Woo Audio WA7 3rd Gen, Cayin N6ii with R01, Chord Mojo, or Lotoo S1.  My two headphones are the Audeze LCD-5 and the Sennheiser IE900.  I value bass, soundstage, transient speed, and detail.  Love classical and electronic.

There was just no scenario where I could opt for it against the others.  The mojo, N6ii, and WA7 all felt a tier above.  The Lotoo is just so versatile.


----------



## kumar402

utdeep said:


> Cool!  Posted my Cayin RU6 on the classifieds in case anyone is interested.
> https://www.head-fi.org/classifieds/cayin-ru6.16536/
> 
> Just couldn’t figure out where it fit in my stable against the Woo Audio WA7 3rd Gen, Cayin N6ii with R01, Chord Mojo, or Lotoo S1.  My two headphones are the Audeze LCD-5 and the Sennheiser IE900.  I value bass, soundstage, transient speed, and detail.  Love classical and electronic.
> ...


You already have N6ii with R01 module. I don’t see the point of you keeping it.


----------



## dumpsterfire

twister6 said:


> Just thinking out loud, firmware updates are either to fix bugs or to add/unlock features already supported by the hardware. Of course, I can't speak on Cayin behalf, but I don't think there are any more hidden tricks left up their hardwares sleeve? Mqa, uac1 mode, and LO (?) was already mentioned as no. So, what else is left out there?


Also confirmed no on-device EQ can be added nor can the volume step behavior be changed.


----------



## utdeep

Yup - especially if no features are coming with firmware.  Was hoping to use it with other devices, but amp section isn’t as strong as I need it to be.  Secretly was hoping to keep this and sell the N6ii.


----------



## keenears

econaut said:


> This. You will probably hear a difference between the two Dongles, but not between the different MQA "unfolding" methods.
> 
> Or to put it this way: MP3s will sound better on the RU6 than hi res on the TC35 Pro.


Thanks for this. I was planning on just streaming on the iPad and iPhone and keeping my 1tb of DSD / FLAC on my DAC microsd, since neither phone nor iPad have or otherwise need that storage capacity. Andy’s response had me read more into MQA such as the “deep dive” article and so I’m of course disappointed. So if I want highest quality streaming without MQA encoding, to send the highest quality sound to the RU6, which service would everyone recommend? Ugh… new playlists


----------



## ssriram2791

utdeep said:


> Yup - especially if no features are coming with firmware.  Was hoping to use it with other devices, but amp section isn’t as strong as I need it to be.  Secretly was hoping to keep this and sell the N6ii.


Happy that you have found the one that works best for your use case !

If dongle needs powerful amplifier section, then power consumption will have to increase which smartphones cannot manage (Centrance has one with Class A amplifier that cannot be used with any phones, despite the fact it looks like a dongle) .

 From your earlier posts, I found that you didn't like the synergy with IE900. That's a fair point (because your ears are the judge for yourself).

As I made a post a while back, Cayin has developed a first of kind dongle with R2R that appeals to mainstream folks  who dont want to shell out $1519 like you and I did. 

If there is enough people who can appreciate that fact and like the sound, I would say Cayin has already succeeded in their mission (this opens the market for Cayin, if those people who bought RU6 want to upgrade).


----------



## Blanka79

ilbisonte said:


> Thanks for this. I was planning on just streaming on the iPad and iPhone and keeping my 1tb of DSD / FLAC on my DAC microsd, since neither phone nor iPad have or otherwise need that storage capacity. Andy’s response had me read more into MQA such as the “deep dive” article and so I’m of course disappointed. So if I want highest quality streaming without MQA encoding, to send the highest quality sound to the RU6, which service would everyone recommend? Ugh… new playlists


You could use Vox for iPhone and upload your collection. +new feature - Qobuz support


----------



## dumpsterfire

ilbisonte said:


> Thanks for this. I was planning on just streaming on the iPad and iPhone and keeping my 1tb of DSD / FLAC on my DAC microsd, since neither phone nor iPad have or otherwise need that storage capacity. Andy’s response had me read more into MQA such as the “deep dive” article and so I’m of course disappointed. So if I want highest quality streaming without MQA encoding, to send the highest quality sound to the RU6, which service would everyone recommend? Ugh… new playlists


Qobuz or Apple Music.


----------



## blotmouse

utdeep said:


> Yup - especially if no features are coming with firmware.  Was hoping to use it with other devices, but amp section isn’t as strong as I need it to be.  Secretly was hoping to keep this and sell the N6ii.


Flexible portability yes. Sound quality replacement, no way. $249 vs. $1700+

Lack of firmware updates is a general sign that Cayin has a mature problem free product that should be applauded. Firmware feature updates are generally reserved for Android based products and just named firmware when in fact they are software updates which may or may not include hardware firmware fixes when required.


----------



## keenears (Dec 18, 2021)

Blanka79 said:


> You could use Vox for iPhone and upload your collection. +new feature - Qobuz support


The only library I have is in the Sony Music app and it doesn’t seem like they support anything but iTunes libraries for upload.

Anyway thanks! I quit Tidal and started Qobuz and will enjoy the RU6 fully. I only wish Qobuz had student plans like every other service. We doctoral researchers are paid under local costs of living specifically because we are labeled ‘students’ in order that universities can ‘charge’ us tuition for our independent research, immediately ‘pay it off’ themselves with our salary, claiming that payment part of our compensation for teaching their overcharged student body. At least Tidal Spotify and Apple Music offer us a discount so we get some benefit from the label


----------



## blotmouse

ilbisonte said:


> The only library I have is in the Sony Music app and it doesn’t seem like they support anything but iTunes libraries for upload.
> 
> Anyway thanks! I quit Tidal and started Qobuz and will enjoy the RU6 fully. I only wish Qobuz had student plans like every other service. We doctoral researchers are underpaid specifically because we are labeled ‘students’ in order that universities can ‘charge’ us tuition for our independent research, immediately ‘pay it off’ themselves with our salary, claiming that payment part of our compensation for teaching their overcharged student body. At least Tidal Spotify and Apple Music offer us a discount so we get some benefit from the label


You should write them and ask? If they know they could grow their base offering this, they may do something in the future. They did just decrease their plan pricing, likely due to competitive pressure. 3 months after I paid full price, grrrrrr. Oh well.

The yearly billed Sublime plan I think works out to $15.00/month with the hi-res discounts if you buy. The fact that I can buy a 24-bit 96kHz album for 6.99 sometimes is awesome. The same album elsewhere may be upwards of $24.


----------



## Blanka79

ilbisonte said:


> The only library I have is in the Sony Music app and it doesn’t seem like they support anything but iTunes libraries for upload.
> 
> Anyway thanks! I quit Tidal and started Qobuz and will enjoy the RU6 fully. I only wish Qobuz had student plans like every other service. We doctoral researchers are paid under local costs of living specifically because we are labeled ‘students’ in order that universities can ‘charge’ us tuition for our independent research, immediately ‘pay it off’ themselves with our salary, claiming that payment part of our compensation for teaching their overcharged student body. At least Tidal Spotify and Apple Music offer us a discount so we get some benefit from the labelOo



Ok. I understand. Vox works best with iOS. There is a MAC version and a Windows version is coming soon. You can upload your FLAC library. But I would definitely recommend an iPhone for listening. Sorry. My bad...


----------



## twister6

So, I received usb-c splitter today; many similar ones are available on amazon and ebay, referred to as digital audio/PD charging splitter.  The one I ordered was this, but pretty much they all should be similar and around $15.  While for desktop use I prefer my Galaxy phone on a wireless (horizontal ) charger with RU6 connected directly, on the go this is very convenient to use with a slim power bank like the one from Anker below.  The side labeled with headphones goes to RU6, and the other one goes to your wall charger or a power bank.  Works perfectly!


----------



## captblaze

Apple got it right for a change.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

twister6 said:


> So, I received usb-c splitter today; many similar ones are available on amazon and ebay, referred to as digital audio/PD charging splitter.  The one I ordered was this, but pretty much they all should be similar and around $15. While for desktop use I prefer my Galaxy phone on a wireless (horizontal ) charger with RU6 connected directly, on the go this is very convenient to use with a slim power bank like the one from Anker below.  The side labeled with headphones goes to RU6, and the other one goes to your wall charger or a power bank.  Works perfectly!


Too many wires.   This picture is exactly why I switched to DAPs.    If you are walking and talking on the phone for an hour with your Airpods Pro, then you want to switch to music, you cannot easily set that up system for listening to music.  Then, another call comes in and then what do you do?


----------



## Andykong (Dec 18, 2021)

twister6 said:


> So, I received usb-c splitter today; many similar ones are available on amazon and ebay, referred to as digital audio/PD charging splitter.  The one I ordered was this, but pretty much they all should be similar and around $15. While for desktop use I prefer my Galaxy phone on a wireless (horizontal ) charger with RU6 connected directly, on the go this is very convenient to use with a slim power bank like the one from Anker below.  The side labeled with headphones goes to RU6, and the other one goes to your wall charger or a power bank.  Works perfectly!



Yes, horizontal wireless charge only.  

Now can I try to connect a 4TB 2.5" HDD to N6ii with this adapter?


----------



## twister6

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Too many wires.   This picture is exactly why I switched to DAPs.    If you are walking and talking on the phone for an hour with your Airpods Pro, then you want to switch to music, you cannot easily set that up system for listening to music.  Then, another call comes in and then what do you do?



True, on the go many are not going to drag the whole thing with them.  But it's just another option for those who use RU6 with their smartphone and want to charge at the same time.  Or, for example, some people use bulky phone cases for extra protection where wireless charging doesn't work quite well when you are at your desk.  Or, you are on the go without access to wifi and want to stream, and RU6 + smartphone is the only solution, and as a bonus you don't have to worry about draining your phone battery.  It is always good to have options to choose from, then it will be up to you which one works better


----------



## Andykong

ilbisonte said:


> The only library I have is in the Sony Music app and it doesn’t seem like they support anything but iTunes libraries for upload.
> 
> Anyway thanks! I quit Tidal and started Qobuz and will enjoy the RU6 fully. I only wish Qobuz had student plans like every other service. We doctoral researchers are paid under local costs of living specifically because we are labeled ‘students’ in order that universities can ‘charge’ us tuition for our independent research, immediately ‘pay it off’ themselves with our salary, claiming that payment part of our compensation for teaching their overcharged student body. At least Tidal Spotify and Apple Music offer us a discount so we get some benefit from the label





ilbisonte said:


> Thanks for this. I was planning on just streaming on the iPad and iPhone and keeping my 1tb of DSD / FLAC on my DAC microsd, since neither phone nor iPad have or otherwise need that storage capacity. Andy’s response had me read more into MQA such as the “deep dive” article and so I’m of course disappointed. So if I want highest quality streaming without MQA encoding, to send the highest quality sound to the RU6, which service would everyone recommend? Ugh… new playlists



You are using a closed system Sony DAP? Sony was very much like iPhone, they kept their closed eco system until recently, newer DAP such as A105 are Android based.

To be honest, when you select between Tidal and Qobuz, the most important factor is the content of library, if Tidal has a better library for your preference, you might just keep it.  Don't just look at MQA support or try to calculate your "return" of HiFi expenditure based on MQA unfold.  You have to look at your complete music experience from a "total system" concept:  
If Tidal + RU6 at 96kHz (2x MQA unfold) offers better experience than Tidal + Dongle B at 384kHz (8x MQA unfold), then you should keep the RU6. 
If Tidal + RU6 at 96kHz (2x MQA unfold) offers better experience than Qobuz + RU6, then you should keep the Tidal.  

My sincerely advice is:
Result orientated, total system approach, qualitative > quantitative.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

captblaze said:


> Apple got it right for a change.


That’s the right to do dongle audio. Just missing the battery here. Iphone 13 mini -> RU6


----------



## shez.

econaut said:


> Wow, now this comes as a suprise to me. Let me explain.
> 
> I have the RU6 and the PAW S2 here and haven't decided yet which one to keep. I won't keep both.
> 
> ...


Are you using 4.4mm or 3.5mm output? 
To me, W2 also has sibilance on upper mids from 4.4mm output. In comparison, 3.5mm output doesn't have it.


----------



## sahmen

Am I imagining things or does the sound on this RU6 thing get crispier and more interestingly dynamic as one puts more hours on it? I have always liked the sound,  right from the beginning, but it seems to be playing with even more "swagger" today.


----------



## jeffhawke

econaut said:


> While I like many things the RU6 does soundwise, I unfortunately also have a problem with the upper mids / treble. There's a certain harshness (etch?) that makes the RU6 a little (too) fatiguing to my ears. This has not disappeared after 74 hours of burn in yet. Still hoping.


Do you warm up your RU6 before using it? Like all R2R DACs, it needs a certain amount of time for the resistors to warm up properly, you can feel it to the touch also when it's warm. In order not to drain the battery of my phone when not playing, I keep it connected to my laptop when not playing, so that it is ready at all times. I am also treble sensitive and I feel no harshness.


----------



## econaut

shez. said:


> Are you using 4.4mm or 3.5mm output?
> To me, W2 also has sibilance on upper mids from 4.4mm output. In comparison, 3.5mm output doesn't have it.


I was comparing to the PAW S2, not the W2, in case you misread my post. 

I have never been interested in the W2, because sound signature is too similar to RU6. S2 is different. But RU6 brings a lot to the table that S2 and W2 don't. Disclaimer: I have not heard the W2 with my own ears.

I am using 4.4mm.

I think I'll keep both now. RU6 and S2 are both great in their own right. Oh dear, this hobby...


----------



## jeffhawke

sahmen said:


> Am I imagining things or does the sound on this RU6 thing get crispier and more interestingly dynamic as one puts more hours on it? I have always liked the sound,  right from the beginning, but it seems to be playing with even more "swagger" today.


More then the hours you put on it, what matters more is the time you warm it up before using it. See my reply to @econaut in the post above this one


----------



## shez. (Dec 19, 2021)

econaut said:


> I was comparing to the PAW S2, not the W2, in case you misread my post.
> 
> I have never been interested in the W2, because sound signature is too similar to RU6. S2 is different. But RU6 brings a lot to the table that S2 and W2 don't. Disclaimer: I have not heard the W2 with my own ears.
> 
> ...


I read correct. I am also right now keeping my S1 because W2 that I own, sound harsh on highs when I use 4.4, but it sounds fantastic from 3.5. I am also a walkman user, all my cables are 4.4. So, I keep looking for a better dongle with 4.4 output that can replace at least my wm1a. Seems like RU6 isn’t what I am looking for.


----------



## econaut

jeffhawke said:


> Do you warm up your RU6 before using it? Like all R2R DACs, it needs a certain amount of time for the resistors to warm up properly, you can feel it to the touch also when it's warm. In order not to drain the battery of my phone when not playing, I keep it connected to my laptop when not playing, so that it is ready at all times. I am also treble sensitive and I feel no harshness.


Well, not really. But I will test if this helps. Thanks for reminding me.

I own Yggdrasil and Bifrost 2 and have owned Gungnir and Bifrost 1. So I know that, but it's something different with stationary gear. My Yggdrasil and other components are on 24/7 because of this at my two channel setup. Contributing a not insignificant amount to my electricity bill here in Germany...

But how do you do that? You leave the RU6 connected to the laptop and then disconnect it and connect it to your phone? Do you do this switch swiftly?

Because this is not how the "warm up" works. It is not about temperature, but about a state of "electrical equilibrium" as I understand it (I am not a tech guy). So temperature is a byproduct, but not the reason for the improvement in sound. Actually the more bits the DAC has, the longer it needs to "warm up". I am talking about Schiit multibit here, but I guess it's the same with R2R.

Still, a swift switch or very short power off might not disrupt this state of "electrical equilibrium", I have indeed read about this. So this might work. In the end the ears decide, not theory.

Maybe some more knowleadgable people can chime in. Or others who notice a difference after RU6 warm up.


----------



## emilsoft

After about 100 hours of burn in and lot of listening I don't think I have an issue with treble etch. Because the mids are nice fuzzy and warm, the treble can sometimes feel as if it stands out but its not really the case. My earmen sparrow is I would say now brighter.. I really enjoy the RU6 now it gives a pleasant listen especially with IEMs


----------



## econaut

shez. said:


> I read correct. I am also right now keeping my S1 because W2 that I own, sound harsh on highs when I use 4.4, but it sounds fantastic from 3.5. I am also a walkman user, all my cables are 4.4. So, I keep looking for a better dongle with 4.4 output that can replace at least my wm1a. Seems like RU6 isn’t what I am looking for.


Maybe just upgrade to the S2?

@OspreyAndy says in this post that RU6 and S2 are better than W2, which would mean that the S2 is a major step from the S1 (in regard to his ranking here). I have not heard the S1 myself.


----------



## shez. (Dec 19, 2021)

econaut said:


> Maybe just upgrade to the S2?
> 
> @OspreyAndy says in this post that RU6 and S2 are better than W2, which would mean that the S2 is a major step from the S1 (in regard to his ranking here). I have not heard the S1 myself.


Thanks for the info, I will study his ranking. 
Some people say that is a major step some say it's minor. That is why I keep asking what output that they using. 
For example, W2 from 3.5mm sound so good, that in most aspect (bass, mids) is better than WM1A, however, from 4.4 output, sound slightly better in quality and worse in timbre than S1 from 4.4.
Since the dongles for each output implement amplification differently, the sound from 3.5 and 4.4 in most cases sounds differently...


----------



## jeffhawke

econaut said:


> But how do you do that? You leave the RU6 connected to the laptop and then disconnect it and connect it to your phone? Do you do this switch swiftly?


Yes, I only detach the dongle from the laptop when I'm ready to use it, and attach it to my dedicated streaming phone (LG V30+) immediately. Let us know if it works for you also.


----------



## bnupy

shez. said:


> Thanks for the info, I will study his ranking.
> Some people say that is a major step some say it's minor. That is why I keep asking what output that they using.
> For example, W2 from 3.5mm sound so good, that in most aspect (bass, mids) is better than WM1A, however, from 4.4 output, sound slightly better in quality and worse in timbre than S1 from 4.4.
> Since the dongles for each output implement amplification differently, the sound from 3.5 and 4.4 in most cases sounds differently...


I had the wm1a from memory the single ended was not great. The 4.4mm was leagues better but boring to my liking, since it felt too warm enveloping. When I had the paw s1 and wm1a side by side. The wm1a was a better all encompassing experience. I’ve had the w2 and using it with ier m9, I feel like I enjoyed it quite well out of 4.4. But going to ru6 , feels like an even more improved sound experience that seems so natural. Not sure how the wm1a would have compared with ru6 side by side physically. But I can say, I enjoy thr ru6 more and get bored far less by comparison if memory serves well.


----------



## econaut

bnupy said:


> I had the wm1a from memory the single ended was not great. The 4.4mm was leagues better but boring to my liking, since it felt too warm enveloping. When I had the paw s1 and wm1a side by side. The wm1a was a better all encompassing experience. I’ve had the w2 and using it with ier m9, I feel like I enjoyed it quite well out of 4.4. But going to ru6 , feels like an even more improved sound experience that seems so natural. Not sure how the wm1a would have compared with ru6 side by side physically. But I can say, I enjoy thr ru6 more and get bored far less by comparison if memory serves well.


Interesting. Do you remember how WM1A and S1 compared in terms of warmth and smoothness on 4.4mm?

It's impossible for me to compare from memory, because I use different headphones (Andromedas with WM1A and Cascades now with RU6/S2).

I agree about RU6 sounding very natural/realistic (in direct comparison to S2).


----------



## Goofyboy84

Welp. I’m giving up. I’m using the RU6 with my balanced cable on my ipad… not what I’d hoped for, but it’s where I’m at and so therefore that means… piss on using it with the iPhone 12 max. I was hoping to use the camera adaptor, but I cannot. I took the camera adaptor back on Friday night. Screw that… I’ll take my $40 back for the adaptor if I cannot put it to use. The RU6? I like it. I had my hopes high on portability… that’s not the case for me. Sorry… but it’s not. 😢😢😢😢😢😢

If someone has some bright ideas for me… let me know… or I’m done. Simple as that. 

This mainly applies to the 4.4mm balanced… I’m not messing with the unbalanced… why should I? I have the balanced for a reason… not to just set there and look pretty. 😢😢😢😢


----------



## bnupy

econaut said:


> Interesting. Do you remember how WM1A and S1 compared in terms of warmth and smoothness on 4.4mm?
> 
> It's impossible for me to compare from memory, because I use different headphones (Andromedas with WM1A and Cascades now with RU6/S2).
> 
> I agree about RU6 sounding very natural/realistic (in direct comparison to S2).


Since I had one iem as my reference point. It’s comparatively simpler. Smoother maybe you can say about s1, there was a bass elevation for sure, and the treble took a backstage. Wm1a had a way better treble and resolution. It’s more realistic. It sort of comes down to preference what signature you would like. The staging was limited on the S1.


----------



## Goofyboy84

@Andykong would the USB-c to lightning cable make to where I can use the RU6 on my iPhone? If so, I’ll buy the cable… but if not, I won’t bother. It’s my last option, as I’ve given up on listening to music while charging it… that’s a 100% flop of an idea… sorta on my part. Figured I’d ask, before purchasing. 😊


----------



## WDitters

If anyone want to part with his/hers, just PM me


----------



## Andykong

Goofyboy84 said:


> @Andykong would the USB-c to lightning cable make to where I can use the RU6 on my iPhone? If so, I’ll buy the cable… but if not, I won’t bother. It’s my last option, as I’ve given up on listening to music while charging it… that’s a 100% flop of an idea… sorta on my part. Figured I’d ask, before purchasing. 😊


The Cayin C to lightning cable should work fine for RU6, we have tested it and quite a number of users in this thread had used the cable with their iphone already.


----------



## emilsoft

Cayin RU6 vs Chord Qutest...

I'm highly disappointed the RU6 doesn't sound better... yet again another flop from Cayin! I'm never buying anything from them again, makes me so mad....




Seriously though, i actually prefer the RU6 with my Starfield IEMs, it's more chilled and not overzealous to inject details in my eardrums, just delivers them in a chill confident way, sounds almost slower and more plump, looser and less accurate but in a good way - love it!


----------



## keenears (Dec 19, 2021)

someyoungguy said:


> The positives for a DAP though…for some people they're preferable as a means of putting some distance between your music listening/enjoyment and your phone and interruptions from notifications, etc.


THIS. I don’t get the hateful DAP bashing. If it wasn’t for a DAP I would be commuting with my D-EJ01 or WM-EX20.

I want to bury my phone even though I have it on scheduled “do not disturb” outside 6-8 am/pm every day, in order that I engage with others on my own time rather than theirs. Nevertheless, the browsing temptation right at my fingertips is a problem while I transit in the cities I live in and frequent (Milan, Chicago, Austin)… I sold my car long ago to let someone else lose years of their life to the pinballing of other drivers. I select where I live and stay based on the convenience of the tram or elevated train. In that time I need to escape into my music hands-free, not make myself motion-nauseous reading Head-Fi replies. I *LOVE* my Walkman for this. Its screen too small to browse on even when on Wi-Fi, its tape display and TPS case constantly reminding me of when such disconnected zen-escapism was easier.

Simplifying with one battery is appealing, yes, especially with the short life of my Walkman (which I have largely addressed with this cable-less fast-charge miracle that has all connections built-in and wireless https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B09BN2BZMD/ref=ox_sc_act_image_1?smid=A2SPU154OM6NDD&psc=1). I get it. Simplicity guides me everyday. For example, I know the WM1A is supposedly “better” than my NW-A100TPS (somehow though I doubt the ROI there, since they have almost identical guts), just like the iPhone 13 Pro I sold is “better” than the iPhone 12 mini I replaced it with. But what ever happened to the cross-cultural appeal of the “smaller-is-better” Japanese aesthetic that swept the world from the TPS-L2 through the iPod nano? So I get the dongle. And this RU6 sounds brilliant. I am loving it. And the balanced port is driving my MDR-7s (maybe I don’t need to wait for that Earman Collibri?) But I will only use a dongle with streaming while consumed by my work on my iPad when my Walkman runs out of juice.


----------



## econaut (Dec 19, 2021)

Anyone speaking Indonesian here? Actually I might be able to get some translation in about a week, but maybe someone else is faster here


----------



## keenears (Dec 19, 2021)

econaut said:


> Anyone speaking Indonesian here? Actually I might be able to get some translation in about a week, but maybe someone else is faster here



You don’t need to speak Indonesian. Everything until 10:09 is specs you already know. Simply going off of cognates, calques, some extant latin root words, his prosity, gestures, and what appears to now be a cross-cultural tech video-review speech genre and turn-taking style, you get that he feels the S2 is slightly more musical while the RU6 renders higher frequencies better, is much more airy with a better soundstage, and renders details more precisely. I’m open to correction because I don’t speak Indonesian of course. His final recommendation is based on who prefers each of those characteristics. He’s skimpy on what “more musical” means 🤷🏼‍♂️

Of course, who is he? If you measure the expertise of a reviewer’s ears by their video-production prowess then his opinion carries good weight lol


----------



## All About Metal

G'day people of the Head-Fi-Verse,

Long time lurker, first time posting, hoping to impose on your collective wisdom.

I have an RU6 on the way (in Australia we are always behind with new electronic goodies), which will be used on my desk at work when I have to return to the office, post covid, early next year. Up until now I have had a Schiit Modi Multibit/Magni set up, fed from the line out of my A&K SR15, but in the 18 months I have been at home, work has decided no personal electronic equipment can be fed from company power points 😳🤦🏻‍♂️.

To feed the RU6 from the Micro USB port of the SR15 I am going to use an ifi OTG adaptor, with the USB A to C adaptor supplied with the RU6, and the Cayin C to C cable. While I am sure this will work it is going to be long with a bunch of connections. So my question, does anyone know of a quality Micro USB to USB C OTG cable? I have googled for ages and one doesn't seem to be out there.

Thanks in advance for any advice!


----------



## keenears

All About Metal said:


> G'day people of the Head-Fi-Verse,
> 
> Long time lurker, first time posting, hoping to impose on your collective wisdom.
> 
> ...


Yeah I really like DDHifi’s cables, they’re high quality. Micro to usb C is their TC03 and about 6 inches. Many reputable sites sell them. They also should have a 20cm version for sale on Aliexpress *through their official store*. They are all unidirectional with an arrow on each plug, which is really useful in some cases of use.

I’ve also purchased these and they are excellent. Extremely pliant. You can configure the ends as you please.


----------



## All About Metal

ilbisonte said:


> Yeah I really like DDHifi’s cables, they’re high quality. Micro to usb C is their TC03 and about 6 inches. Many reputable sites sell them. They also should have a 20cm version for sale on Aliexpress *through their official store*. They are all unidirectional with an arrow on each plug, which is really useful in some cases of use.
> 
> I’ve also purchased these and they are excellent. Extremely pliant. You can configure the ends as you please.



Interesting, I almost ordered the DDHifi cable on the weekend, but as it is directional and flows in the wrong direction (C to Micro), I didn't think it would work. Being it's OTG and the player has a micro USB port.


----------



## dumpsterfire

I’ve been burning mine in for the last few days and there is a definite improvement in performance. The sound is more coherent, more textured and detailed. Additionally, I’ve become addicted to NOS almost exclusively. So much so that when I upgrade my main DAC, it’s going to be for a NOS device. Very pleased with the RU6! I just need to find a longer USB-C->Lightning OTG cable to go with it.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> The Cayin C to lightning cable should work fine for RU6, we have tested it and quite a number of users in this thread had used the cable with their iphone already.


I’ll purchase and hope for the best. 😁


----------



## pinkpiglet (Dec 20, 2021)

I received my RU6 6 days ago and I've reached more than 50 hours of burn-in time. Here's what I think.

Before I start any further, I would like to tell you about my expectation for the RU6. The RU6 was advertised to have a reference sound, and because of that I was preparing myself for a sound that's similar or in line with the Soekris 2541, but man it couldn't be any farther from the truth. It doesn't sound like it or anything that I would classify as a reference sound.

*Before burn-in and warm up*
My initial impression for the RU6 was quite bad. I couldn't relate with the impressions that I found online as the RU6 sounds so unrefined. In terms of tonality, it is indeed something different. There's more subbass presence in the RU6 and an elevated bass in general. The mids is more forward, but the highs was not cohesive. It has spikes and it was messy in general. I think this is the reason why people said it was dry or harsh to them. Now, why do I call it bad? It's because of the technical qualities of the sound that was pretty much non existent. For the bass and subbass, there was no texture and seperation. It was muddled up into a jumbled mess. The positioning was also smeared all over the place. Because of this reason, I didn't post my initial impression online.

*After burn-in and warm up.*
After the burn-in everything improves significantly. The thing that I noticed as an immediate improvement was in the cohesiveness of the highs (upper mids and treble to be exact). It sounded way nicer and mellow to some extent. Then there's also the improvement in layering and positioning. So let me break it down one by one.

*Tonality:*
The RU6 had an emphasis on the lower bass and subbass region. The presentation for the mids is also more forward, but interestingly the highs is more subdued. For this reason I would call the RU6 as a warm sounding DAC.

*Soundstage, layering and postioning:*
The RU6 presents everything in a larger soundstage. You can hear that it extends deeper and a little bit higher when compared to LP W2 and Lotoo S1, but if I'm going to look at how the RU6 layers the sound, I would say that it doesn't do a great job in it. The instruments that are layered by the RU6 bleed to one another, giving a smeared impression for me. And the same thing happens for positioning. It was wider and deeper than W2, but the positioning is not pin point exact. It's a smeared image.

*Timbre:*
For me RU6 sounds more natural than the competitions. What I found really nice is the way it presents violin and trumpet (or brass instruments in general). Sometimes there's a little grittiness in the way they're presented, but not in the RU6.

*Transient and decay:*
For me this is the major problem for the RU6. Well depends on how you look at it. The transient was slow and the decay was long. These qualities becomes an advantage when you are listening to acoustic or classical music, but a problem to electronic music and fast beating music. For acoustic music, the long decay and soft transient made the strings sounded cohesive and better mimics the real one, but when it comes to a fast beating music, you lose the impact and the definition of the melody. When there's a snare hit, it felt like the snare was still going when it should've stopped. Hi-hats also doesn't have this sharp and definitive body, which I suspect caused by the soft transient.

*Conclusion:*
For me the RU6 is far from a reference sounding DAC. When someone claims something to be reference sounding, I'm expecting it to present the music as how it is, not giving anything more or taking anything away, but that's not the case for the RU6. The RU6 makes soundstage larger and it also had a soft transient and long decay. The tonality is also quite warm for my taste. If I take away the fact that the RU6 is an R-2R dongle DAC, I would say that the RU6 is a pretty good DAC. It's a natural sounding DAC, but that's about it.

Edit:
*Practicality:*
In terms of practicality, I don't feel like the RU6 to be the most practical one. The resistor array that is used for the volume is the major thing that hinders it from being a practical DAC. There's a slight delay when you change song or videos and the same when you are changing the volume. After a while it becomes annoying, especially when you are watching videos online or going through your playlist quickly.

Edit:
Apparently it was never advertised as reference. I must be drunk seeing it as reference somewhere.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 20, 2021)

pinkpiglet said:


> I received my RU6 6 days ago and I've reached more than 50 hours of burn-in time. Here's what I think.
> 
> Before I start any further, I would like to tell you about my expectation for the RU6. The RU6 was advertised to have a reference sound, and because of that I was preparing myself for a sound that's similar or in line with the Soekris 2541, but man it couldn't be any farther from the truth. It doesn't sound like it or anything that I would classify as a reference sound.
> 
> ...



Give it some more burn in - 50 hours is not enough I think.

Also you have to consider what reference actually means in this context - reference in comparison to d/s dacs like the LP W2 or reference like a good analogue setup (vinyl)? Attack/decay - what is reference? very fast or slower like the RU6 that makes instruments sound more relaxed and natural? It's not so straight forward - if I compare it to my "reference" d/s dac RME ADI 2 fs, it sounds less vivid, less clear, less "technical" but when I compare my RME ADI 2 fs to a good record player setup, it sounds too vivid and excitable, as if its trying too hard to be detailed/neutral... ofcourse RME is 4 times more expensive so overall it's still better even for a d/s dac, but the RU6 does give  a taste for some of that analogue organic sound many of us crave in a good vinyl setup. I think for the money and size, the RU6 is the top dog dongle sound, it sounds quite different vs most other d/s dongle and Cayin have accomplished a major feat here. I am excited to see if they will take this topology and try to push the sound quality even more in future products


----------



## dumpsterfire

pinkpiglet said:


> I received my RU6 6 days ago and I've reached more than 50 hours of burn-in time. Here's what I think.
> 
> Before I start any further, I would like to tell you about my expectation for the RU6. The RU6 was advertised to have a reference sound, and because of that I was preparing myself for a sound that's similar or in line with the Soekris 2541, but man it couldn't be any farther from the truth. It doesn't sound like it or anything that I would classify as a reference sound.
> 
> ...


I’m not trying to gain say your impressions, but I’m wondering where you got the concept this was meant to be a “reference” device? I don’t see that terminology used in the marketing for this device at all.


----------



## pinkpiglet

pinkpiglet said:


> When someone claims something to be reference sounding, I'm expecting it to present the music as how it is, not giving anything more or taking anything away





emilsoft said:


> Also you have to consider what reference actually means in this context - reference in comparison to d/s dacs like the LP W2 or reference like a good analogue setup (vinyl)? Attack/decay - what is reference?





emilsoft said:


> but the RU6 does give a taste for some of that analogue organic sound many of us crave in a good vinyl setup



To me, what you said is not a reference setup. It's a natural setup. Let's say I have a reference setup. Then from that setup I have to be able to differentiate a sample sound that's digitally made and naturally recorded. Maybe this makes sense maybe this isn't, but if you listen to a digitally sampled piano and a naturally recorded piano, a reference setup would present those two sounds as it is, but for me it is not the case for the RU6.


----------



## pinkpiglet (Dec 20, 2021)

dumpsterfire said:


> I’m not trying to gain say your impressions, but I’m wondering where you got the concept this was meant to be a “reference” device? I don’t see that terminology used in the marketing for this device at all.


If I'm not mistaken I saw it from the Musicteck webstore.


----------



## discord

pinkpiglet said:


> If I'm not mistaken I saw it from the Musicteck webstore.



”Reference sound” is not mentioned on their website and it’s not mentioned on the box or instruction manual.


----------



## pinkpiglet

discord said:


> ”Reference sound” is not mentioned on their website and it’s not mentioned on the box or instruction manual.


Yea I just checked the webstore again. I must have seen something else then.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 20, 2021)

pinkpiglet said:


> To me, what you said is not a reference setup. It's a natural setup. Let's say I have a reference setup. Then from that setup I have to be able to differentiate a sample sound that's digitally made and naturally recorded. Maybe this makes sense maybe this isn't, but if you listen to a digitally sampled piano and a naturally recorded piano, a reference setup would present those two sounds as it is, but for me it is not the case for the RU6.



I don't disagree with you - it's an interesting topic and there's no right or wrong necessarily.

For me a more reference source is say a Michell Gyro SE turntable vs say a Chord Qutest or Chord TT - and by a fair margin... does it have faster transients? Not necessarily but it communicates the music more effectively and confidently - even though it measures worse, more distortion and so on, it gives a more lifelike presentation that feels less processed (like in a studio/live performance)- and this is not a placebo.. something gets lost during the digitisation/translation layer.. When I listen to even a relatively modest vinyl setup my jaw drops and I'm reminded that I'm chasing the unattainable with d/s dacs. R2R tries to get some of that back I guess and can get halfway there.

But yes in typical digital reference terminology means super clean neutral and top measuring d/s dac


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> The Cayin C to lightning cable should work fine for RU6, we have tested it and quite a number of users in this thread had used the cable with their iphone already.


I bought the Cayin USB-c to lightning in hopes it works with the balanced cable. I tried my charging cord, as it’s factory Apple USB-c to lightning and it will not work. It’s 3 feet long, maybe the shorter length will help. Maybe the Cayin cable is better quality, as a whole. 😊 It’s worth a shot. I’m happy for now, at least it’ll play on my iPad with no issues. 

If anyone wants to chime in, feel free! Maybe it’s an audio routing issue? 

The apple dongle (3.5 mm to lightning) works fine with the Laylas… just perfectly. But that’s minus the amp, minus the balanced cable. 

I’m not trying to be a pest. And I’ll be 100% happy if the Cayin cable does in fact work!!! 😁

I’m not upset, I’m more just documenting my findings. 

My phone is the 12 pro max updated with the latest software update, if that matters. Using Apple Music. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️ I’m literally stumped. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

What’s y’all’s experience with the iPhone? Anyone else have the issues I’m having? 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️


----------



## Goofyboy84

Verificateur said:


> Can confirm that I can use RU6 and charge my phone at the same time, using the Apple USB adapter (photo below) with iPhone 11 Pro Max.
> 
> RU6 is connected to the USB port, and the charging cable into the lightning port on the adapter.


Interesting!!!!  What cable are you using in your RU6? Can you PM me please?? I took back my adaptor out of frustration. It was the apple camera adaptor.


----------



## Goofyboy84

hemtmaker said:


> Would it work on iPad with usb c port directly without the camera kit?


Yes!!! I have a 4.4 balanced hooked up  via USB-c cable from Cayin that’s included with the dongle. USBc to USBc. Works perfectly, no issue! That’s for the iPad Pro!!!! I have the 3rd Gen, from 2018. No issues! My issues are with my iPhone 12 Pro Max. I ordered the USBc to lightning cable (Cayin) fron MusicTeck tonight. I’ll check back and let y’all know what happens. The factory USBc to lightning from apple does NOT work. So… my hopes are now with Cayin. 😊


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 20, 2021)

pinkpiglet said:


> I received my RU6 6 days ago and I've reached more than 50 hours of burn-in time. Here's what I think.
> 
> Before I start any further, I would like to tell you about my expectation for the RU6. The RU6 was advertised to have a reference sound, and because of that I was preparing myself for a sound that's similar or in line with the Soekris 2541, but man it couldn't be any farther from the truth. It doesn't sound like it or anything that I would classify as a reference sound.
> 
> ...


You can try Planar headphones it may help you overcome those lingering snare hit but not sure if this device can provide enough current to Planar. 
May be a reason why it pairs well with 7Hz timeless.


----------



## kumar402

Just got it delivered. Hopefully a contrast to my Shanling M3X which is neutral


----------



## alota

finally, thanks to a friend, i received mine. really well engineered and well sounding product. well done @Andykong.
With solaris 2020 it is a very high level combo. i think ru6 sounds better in balanced mode; seems less congested


----------



## Louisiana

Mine arrived today


----------



## kumar402

Louisiana said:


> Mine arrived today


Wow the color of adapter looks sleek. Is it from Forza?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

kumar402 said:


> Just got it delivered. Hopefully a contrast to my Shanling M3X which is neutral


Headphonezone right? I recognize that card.

Has anyone tried RU6 with timeless?


----------



## kumar402

Johnfg465vd said:


> Headphonezone right? I recognize that card.
> 
> Has anyone tried RU6 with timeless?


Yes, got it from them. They had it on sale for Christmas


----------



## Louisiana (Dec 20, 2021)

kumar402 said:


> Wow the color of adapter looks sleek. Is it from Forza?


No, its from a User from head-Fi 
Ordered this for my ZMF VC:



Spoiler: Cable


----------



## Verificateur (Dec 20, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> Interesting!!!!  What cable are you using in your RU6? Can you PM me please?? I took back my adaptor out of frustration. It was the apple camera adaptor.


I just saw you mentioned you are using the stock Apple lightning to usb-C cable, the one that they give you for charging?
Well... I think that's the issue, that cable doesn't work with any dongles since it isn't made for audio throughput.

If you want to connect the RU6 to your iPhone, you just need any proper USB-C to Lightning meant for use with audio devices, such as the Cayin one for example.

To answer your question, I am using the Cayin Lightning-USB C, and also the Meenova Lightning-USB C and also the DD Hifi Lightning to USB C with the RU6 connected to the iPhone. All work great.

If you want to use the Apple USB camera adapter, you will need to use the stock USB C + stock USB C to USB 2 adapter that came with RU6 to plug it into the Apple USB camera adapter, which you will plug into your iPhone - and everything should work.


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 21, 2021)

Cayin lightening to USB C works fine and has no dropout. I'm using the same and balanced out to headphone. It's been 3hrs and no dropout so far.
But my volume is at max 30. Above 30 is too loud for me.


----------



## bnupy

Verificateur said:


> I just saw you mentioned you are using the stock Apple lightning to usb-C cable, the one that they give you for charging?
> Well... I think that's the issue, that cable doesn't work with any dongles since it isn't made for audio throughput.
> 
> If you want to connect the RU6 to your iPhone, you just need any proper USB-C to Lightning meant for use with audio devices, such as the Cayin one for example.
> ...


Thanks for the rec  Meenova Lightning-USB C


----------



## keenears

I’m using the straight DDHifi TCO5 to TC28i on an iPhone12 mini and it works really well. The right angle adapter allows nice stable pocket insertion.

There’s something really cool on the iPad Pro if you have the case for both the RU6 and the Smart Folio keyboard  for the iPad Pro 11”. I decided to use the right angle TC05 from DDHifi because the bottom right of the keyboard folio, where it bends outward and where I was going to stick the Cayin magnet, already has a magnet stronger than the adhesive ones that come with the RU6. So the RU6 sits there beautifully with headphone port exiting to your right, out of the way of the screen, usb cable just perfectly long enough to do the job. The stock cable was about an inch too short.

Also, I decided to try a movie on it last night, the new Bond movie, with my IER-Z1R. Wow what rich sound, filled with both brilliance and gravitas.


----------



## emilsoft

kumar402 said:


> Just got it delivered. Hopefully a contrast to my Shanling M3X which is neutral



Looking forward to your comparison with the M3X - I’ve been eyeing that pocket rocket DAP


----------



## keenears (Dec 20, 2021)

Also, when posting reviews, I think it is necessary to mention the DAC mode (OS/NOS) with filetype. I always test on the same tracks, Muddy Waters’ Folk Singer in DSD, Led Zeppelin in DSD,  Evelyn Glennie in HQ FLAC, The Cranberries in cd quality FLAC. Michi from Glennie has such an incredible dynamic range and subtleties that it’s a headphone killer, lays all flaws to bear in any part of the audio chain. The NOS nailed it and the OS not as much. NOS meanwhile was a really nice improvement on the Cranberrries CD quality.

So far I’ve found the RU6 to be beautifully warm while increasing in resolution and instrument separation and soundstage the more I listen to it. The awesome S-Master HX in my NW-A100TPS is still much brighter and detailed, but feels more cold and hollow now compared to the NU6. Now the NU6 seems to be blooming in the direction of the higher frequencies and coming for the S-Master HX…


----------



## emilsoft

ilbisonte said:


> Also, when posting reviews, I think it is necessary to mention the DAC mode (OS/NOS) with filetype. I always test on the same tracks, Muddy Waters’ Folk Singer in DSD, Led Zeppelin in DSD,  Evelyn Glennie in HQ FLAC, The Cranberries in cd quality FLAC. Michi from Glennie has such an incredible dynamic range and subtleties that it’s a headphone killer, lays all flaws to bear in any part of the audio chain. The NOS nailed it and the OS not as much. NOS meanwhile was a really nice improvement on the Cranberrries CD quality.
> 
> So far I’ve found the RU6 to be beautifully warm while increasing in resolution and instrument separation and soundstage the more I listen to it. The awesome S-Master HX in my NW-A100TPS is still much brighter and detailed, but feels more cold and hollow now compared to the NU6. Now the NU6 seems to be blooming in the direction of the higher frequencies and coming for the S-Master HX…



My ZX507 is unfortunately smashed by the the RU6...time for Sony to go back to the drawing board


----------



## keenears

emilsoft said:


> My ZX507 is unfortunately smashed by the the RU6...time for Sony to go back to the drawing board


That’s one way of putting it. I am definitely preferring the RU6 sound


----------



## keenears (Dec 20, 2021)

Small gripe: why is the volume up button positioned on the bottom in most practical senses of the orientation? In the sense of the case text, the oled text, and the idea that one would use the magnets to direct the headphones to orient from the top of a phone?

Also, the adhesive magnet for the case is a nice thought and beautiful, but it has nowhere near the strength necessary to hold the DAC onto anything vertically


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 20, 2021)

My way of adding R2R module to my DAP and who says DAP and Dongle are mutually exclusive


----------



## sahmen

kumar402 said:


> My way of adding R2R module to my DAP and who says DAP and Dongle are mutually exclusive


Interesting. Is the DAP sounding better?  Also, what are you doing to avoid double amping and/or double DACing if those are concerns in this particular chain?


----------



## dumpsterfire

sahmen said:


> Interesting. Is the DAP sounding better?  Also, what are you doing to avoid double amping and/or double DACing if those are concerns in this particular chain?


Since the RU6 is connected by USB, that means the DAP is acting purely as a source via digital line out, so there wouldn't be any issues of double amping or DAC'ing.


----------



## kumar402

sahmen said:


> Interesting. Is the DAP sounding better?  Also, what are you doing to avoid double amping and/or double DACing if those are concerns in this particular chain?


@dumpsterfire has explained it well.
As far as sound goes, I got RU6 today so haven't done any comparison yet but all I wanted was a different sound signature compared TO the DAP which has neutral sound


dumpsterfire said:


> Since the RU6 is connected by USB, that means the DAP is acting purely as a source via digital line out, so there wouldn't be any issues of double amping or DAC'ing.


----------



## Ufanco

Browsing this thread noticed some post recommending using a splitter to charge and use dongle at same time. Wanted to point out that a lot of these have built in dac on the headphone output.

Here is the usb option I use it’s not a splitter but does work well if you have a usb c output on your device.


----------



## econaut

kumar402 said:


> You can try Planar headphones it may help you overcome those lingering snare hit but not sure if this device can provide enough current to Planar.
> May be a reason why it pairs well with 7Hz timeless.


You are the first in this thread who mentions the RU6 has good synergy with the 7Hz timeless.

How come? Might indeed be an interesting combo, but maybe you have a source or experience with it?


----------



## blotmouse

econaut said:


> You are the first in this thread who mentions the RU6 has good synergy with the 7Hz timeless.


There are other threads on Head-fi.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

@kumar402 just noticed your comment about synergy of timeless with RU6. I felt that the timeless lacked adequate soundstage depth, is there any improvement with RU6?


----------



## dumpsterfire

Well, it's clunky but the official Apple lightning to USB 3 camera adapter is allowing me to play the RU6 balanced in high gain around 70 while simultaneously charging with a lightning cable. This is using the included Cayin USB-C->USB-C cable with the also included USB adapter to plug into the camera side of the Apple adapter. Not too necessary when I'm at home but super useful when I'm able to travel again.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Verificateur said:


> I just saw you mentioned you are using the stock Apple lightning to usb-C cable, the one that they give you for charging?
> Well... I think that's the issue, that cable doesn't work with any dongles since it isn't made for audio throughput.
> 
> If you want to connect the RU6 to your iPhone, you just need any proper USB-C to Lightning meant for use with audio devices, such as the Cayin one for example.
> ...


I used the camera adaptor with the Cayin usb adaptor and went to USBc to the Cayin. It worked with 3.5mm, not the 4.4mm. 

I took the camera adaptor back… 

I ordered the Cayin USBc to lightning in hopes this works. 😊


----------



## Verificateur (Dec 20, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> I used the camera adaptor with the Cayin usb adaptor and went to USBc to the Cayin. It worked with 3.5mm, not the 4.4mm.
> 
> I took the camera adaptor back…
> 
> I ordered the Cayin USBc to lightning in hopes this works. 😊


Have you tried the 4.4mm cable with any other setup or device? Maybe it’s a faulty 4.4mm cable…

Or, if you have no sources with 4.4mm, you could try using the 4.4mm cable with a 4.4mm->3.5mm adapter and test it that way, to see if it’s the cable or not?


----------



## Goofyboy84

Verificateur said:


> Have you tried the 4.4mm cable with any other setup or device? Maybe it’s a faulty 4.4mm cable…


My iPad works great with everything. 100% plug and play. 4.4mm cable works perfect. Using the USBc cable from Cayin. 

It’s the iPhone I’m having issues with.


----------



## twister6

Ufanco said:


> Browsing this thread noticed some post recommending using a splitter to charge and use dongle at same time. Wanted to point out that a lot of these have built in dac on the headphone output.
> 
> Here is the usb option I use it’s not a splitter but does work well if you have a usb c output on your device.



I have the same 180deg usb-c to usb-c adapter, and while it works with some dongles (depending on the position of their usb-c jack), it will not with RU6 unless you have a very slim smartphone and use it without a case (both smartphone and RU6 naked).  The distance between usb-c socket and back panel of RU6 won't leave much clearance and you will be putting a lot of pressure/strain on usb-c jack of your phone and RU6.










Also, the splitter I referenced before, just like many other ones, doesn't have built in DAC.  It is designed for usb-c cable IEMs which already have a dac built-in.


----------



## yaps66

Johnfg465vd said:


> Headphonezone right? I recognize that card.
> 
> Has anyone tried RU6 with timeless?


I have tried the pairing. Works well for me.  I find that the RU6 works well with revealing iems.  It is also a great pairing with my HE400i, to my ears anyway.


----------



## HarveyLowis (Dec 20, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> I used the camera adaptor with the Cayin usb adaptor and went to USBc to the Cayin. It worked with 3.5mm, not the 4.4mm.
> 
> I took the camera adaptor back…
> 
> I ordered the Cayin USBc to lightning in hopes this works. 😊


I just tried ipad camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot ) with USB C to USB A cable. Apple Music Hi Res ( 24-bit/ 96 Khz ALAC ), Volume 40+

1. 4.4 mm with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
2. 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
3. 4.4mm with OS mode, High Gain = constant drop out sound
4. 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter with OS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound

But if i lowered volume to 35 (4.4 mm OS mode High Gain ), there will no contant drop out sound anymore.

Just tried connecting RU6 with the same usb C to usb A cable to my computer, there is no drop out sound with 4.4mm, OS mode High Gain volume 40+


----------



## 111MilesToGo

111MilesToGo said:


> I received mine yesterday (Cayin Germany, DHL). Just ran a few tests with my Windows 8.1 laptop and my iPhone XR. Usually I hate premature early reports, but:
> 
> What does work is: foobar2000 on Windows, Qobuz on iOS. With foobar2000, PCM works up to 24/192; but I get clicks when playing DSD (64-256). Will check more deeply.
> 
> ...





yaps66 said:


> I had a similar problem with Roon. What I did was to enable RU6 WASAPI and make sure it plays music. Then enable RU6 ASIO.  Once you hear music on ASIO, you can disable WASAPI.  Hope this works for you.





111MilesToGo said:


> Thank you, @yaps66, good and clear-cut advice. I did as you said, but unfortunately, it works only partially for me with Roon on my Windows 8.1 laptop (both updated to the latest).
> 
> What I observe is this:
> (0) Yesterday, I had enabled only the RU6 ASIO device and done its settings properly. Roon just doesn't play anything through ASIO, although the "audio path" indicator looks correct. There is no click in the headphone, which normally indicates that the RU6 switches on. This happens for any source, local files, Qobuz, Tidal, and and any bit depth / sample rate. In fact, what Roon does is walk through the album, try each track for some time, then upon failure to play give up and go for the next track.
> ...


@yaps66: Any chance you could try the RU6 with Roon on Windows again, please? In my case, the RU6 is working fine with Roon‘s WASAPI. I followed your advice on how to convince ASIO to work. But ASIO with Roon doesn‘t work anymore when closing Roon and launching it again, or when rebooting the computer. What is your experience, please?


----------



## Goofyboy84

HarveyLowis said:


> I just tried ipad camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot ) with USB C to USB A cable. Apple Music Hi Res ( 24-bit/ 96 Khz ALAC ), Volume 40+
> 
> 1. 4.4 mm with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
> 2. 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
> ...


But my issue with THAT is… I’m powering JH Laylas at a whole 20 ohms. I don’t need high pass. I’m doing low pass and was OS or NOS.


----------



## HarveyLowis (Dec 20, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> But my issue with THAT is… I’m powering JH Laylas at a whole 20 ohms. I don’t need high pass. I’m doing low pass and was OS or NOS.


Let me try, iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain Volume 20 with OS and Nos Mode? 4.4 or 3.5 output do you use ? i will report back again after i tried mine.

After i tried, 
1. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS and NOS mode, 3.5 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out
2. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS mode, 4.4 output ) Volume 41++ have constant drop out, but not often like High Gain mode.
3. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS mode 4.4 output ) Volume 40 and lower didnt have any drop out
4. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( NOS mode, 4.4 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out.


----------



## yaps66

111MilesToGo said:


> @yaps66: Any chance you could try the RU6 with Roon on Windows again, please? In my case, the RU6 is working fine with Roon‘s WASAPI. I followed your advice on how to convince ASIO to work. But ASIO with Roon doesn‘t work anymore when closing Roon and launching it again, or when rebooting the computer. What is your experience, please?


Hi 111MilesToGo. Just tried it again and it works.  I have to add that the RU6 is picky with the connection chain.  I was away from my office over the weekend and when I connected the RU6 to my notebook using a generic USB C cable, ASIO would not work.  It would only work on WASAPI.  I have returned to office and am connecting the RU6 over my Wireworld 8 USB cable and ASIO works fine again.  Cannot explain why this is so.


----------



## yfei

HarveyLowis said:


> Let me try, iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain Volume 20 with OS and Nos Mode? 4.4 or 3.5 output do you use ? i will report back again after i tried mine.
> 
> After i tried,
> 1. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS and NOS mode, 3.5 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out
> ...



I guess this is due to iphone has very limited power output ability?  (compared to PC, Mac and some android phones). 
As I remember, Apple's spec for iphone's lightening port is max output limited to ~100 mA at 3,3 volts.    = 0.33 Watt, not that much.   If the external devices try to draw more than 100mA, the consequence is unspecified,  so maybe disconnected, or not able to get enough power to work properly.
Android phone normally can output much more power from their USB type C port.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 21, 2021)

yaps66 said:


> Hi 111MilesToGo. Just tried it again and it works.  I have to add that the RU6 is picky with the connection chain.  I was away from my office over the weekend and when I connected the RU6 to my notebook using a generic USB C cable, ASIO would not work.  It would only work on WASAPI.  I have returned to office and am connecting the RU6 over my Wireworld 8 USB cable and ASIO works fine again.  Cannot explain why this is so.


Thank you for checking. I am using the Cayin USB-C to USB-C cable and the Cayin USB-A to USB-C adapter. So I will try other cables and check back.

@Andykong: Is there anything special to the RU6 USB-C to USB-C cable and adapter to USB-A? I guess any Cayin USB-A to USB-C cable that came with the N6ii and C9 could be used as well. Correct? Thanks.


----------



## kumar402

ilbisonte said:


> I’m using the straight DDHifi TCO5 to TC28i on an iPhone12 mini and it works really well. The right angle adapter allows nice stable pocket insertion.
> 
> There’s something really cool on the iPad Pro if you have the case for both the RU6 and the Smart Folio keyboard  for the iPad Pro 11”. I decided to use the right angle TC05 from DDHifi because the bottom right of the keyboard folio, where it bends outward and where I was going to stick the Cayin magnet, already has a magnet stronger than the adhesive ones that come with the RU6. So the RU6 sits there beautifully with headphone port exiting to your right, out of the way of the screen, usb cable just perfectly long enough to do the job. The stock cable was about an inch too short.
> 
> Also, I decided to try a movie on it last night, the new Bond movie, with my IER-Z1R. Wow what rich sound, filled with both brilliance and gravitas.


Could you post a pic please of this setup. Sounds cool


----------



## kumar402

Johnfg465vd said:


> @kumar402 just noticed your comment about synergy of timeless with RU6. I felt that the timeless lacked adequate soundstage depth, is there any improvement with RU6?


I dont have timeless sorry I was just extrapolating  based on reviews. Sorry if I misguided


----------



## AlexanderV

Does anybody plan to use RU6 with Bluesound NODE (N130)?
On Dec 28 they will enable USB DAC feature via firmware update and it will be possible to connect DAC via USB.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> Give it some more burn in - 50 hours is not enough I think.
> 
> Also you have to consider what reference actually means in this context - reference in comparison to d/s dacs like the LP W2 or reference like a good analogue setup (vinyl)? Attack/decay - what is reference? very fast or slower like the RU6 that makes instruments sound more relaxed and natural? It's not so straight forward - if I compare it to my "reference" d/s dac RME ADI 2 fs, it sounds less vivid, less clear, less "technical" but when I compare my RME ADI 2 fs to a good record player setup, it sounds too vivid and excitable, as if its trying too hard to be detailed/neutral... ofcourse RME is 4 times more expensive so overall it's still better even for a d/s dac, but the RU6 does give  a taste for some of that analogue organic sound many of us crave in a good vinyl setup. I think for the money and size, the RU6 is the top dog dongle sound, it sounds quite different vs most other d/s dongle and Cayin have accomplished a major feat here. I am excited to see if they will take this topology and try to push the sound quality even more in future products



That is a logical move, isn't it?  
AKM said they'll resume partial production by next year, but there is no schedule for AK4497 or AK4499 or equivalent DAC chipset. .  The ESS9038Pro is aged, it is still technically competence but a lot of customers are hesitated to invest their interest on a new product based on a 6 years DAC chipset.


----------



## Andykong

dumpsterfire said:


> I’ve been burning mine in for the last few days and there is a definite improvement in performance. The sound is more coherent, more textured and detailed. Additionally, I’ve become addicted to NOS almost exclusively. So much so that when I upgrade my main DAC, it’s going to be for a NOS device. Very pleased with the RU6! I just need to find a longer USB-C->Lightning OTG cable to go with it.



Glad we have provided an affordable test bench to explore a new direction on your journey to sound.   This is not in our agenda, but glad to be of help.


----------



## Andykong

alota said:


> finally, thanks to a friend, i received mine. really well engineered and well sounding product. well done @Andykong.
> With solaris 2020 it is a very high level combo. i think ru6 sounds better in balanced mode; seems less congested



Amazing.  The Solaris sounds good with all Cayin DAPs once we get passed the hissing test, that is, unfortunately depends on several variables, not just a matter of engineering specification.  The RU6 happens  to be fairly quiet with my Andromeda, so I was looking forward to a positive report from Solaris users since we launch it.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

kumar402 said:


> I dont have timeless sorry I was just extrapolating  based on reviews. Sorry if I misguided


Oh, never mind then. Hopefully someone else can share how timeless or other planar IEM works with RU6. My primary question is if the RU6 drives a planar IEM well and is there an improvement in Imaging with RU6 & planar combo.


----------



## Andykong

emilsoft said:


> My ZX507 is unfortunately smashed by the the RU6...time for Sony to go back to the drawing board



Wow, smashed is a strong adjustive. 
Your impression is rated R for strong language that might cause disturbing emotion of some DAP users. .....


----------



## Andykong

111MilesToGo said:


> Thank you for checking. I am using the Cayin USB-C to USB-C cable and the Cayin USB-A to USB-C adapter. So I will try other cables and check back.
> 
> @Andykong: Is there anything special to the RU6 USB-C to USB-C cable and adapter to USB-A? I guess any Cayin USB-A to USB-C cable that came with the N6ii and C9 could be used as well. Correct? Thanks.



I just tested, USB-A to C cable from N6ii (or N8?  they should be the same cable), playback native 24/96, with Meze LIRIC at high gain 55 NOS mode, works fine. 

I think the only trick is shield of the cable.


----------



## Andykong

HarveyLowis said:


> I just tried ipad camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot ) with USB C to USB A cable. Apple Music Hi Res ( 24-bit/ 96 Khz ALAC ), Volume 40+
> 
> 1. 4.4 mm with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
> 2. 4.4mm to 3.5mm adapter with NOS mode, High Gain = no constant drop out sound
> ...





HarveyLowis said:


> Let me try, iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain Volume 20 with OS and Nos Mode? 4.4 or 3.5 output do you use ? i will report back again after i tried mine.
> 
> After i tried,
> 1. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS and NOS mode, 3.5 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out
> ...


camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot )? So there are multiple Gen of camera adaptor and not all of them are equal?  This is new to me, I am a stranger to iOS ecosystem.


----------



## Andykong

kumar402 said:


> My way of adding R2R module to my DAP and who says DAP and Dongle are mutually exclusive



They are not.  In fact, I have suggested to pair the RU6 with small Android DAP such as Sony A105 as high quality streaming source.   The RU6 is sensitive to input USB Audio quality, and a DAP should works better then a mobile phone on this regard.


----------



## HarveyLowis

Andykong said:


> camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot )? So there are multiple Gen of camera adaptor and not all of them are equal?  This is new to me, I am a stranger to iOS ecosystem.





 this is the one that i use, only usb A slot.





and the other one is this, have usb A and lighting slot.


----------



## claud W

Andykong,
I have been breaking in my RU6 since last Wednesday 24/7 set on NOS, Should I give it another 100 hours set on OS?


----------



## Vignelli

i cant resist the temptation to buy ru6 
since i have never got cheap r2r dac.. thx for cayin to make this real
very addictive sound using noble k10au
i have micro BL for dekstop setup
but i really like this little dongle sound very much


----------



## musicday

claud W said:


> Andykong,
> I have been breaking in my RU6 since last Wednesday 24/7 set on NOS, Should I give it another 100 hours set on OS?


NOS, OS are not related to hardware. The hardware is the one that needs " burn in".
Carry on as you are doing and enjoy listening.


----------



## alota

Andykong said:


> Amazing.  The Solaris sounds good with all Cayin DAPs once we get passed the hissing test, that is, unfortunately depends on several variables, not just a matter of engineering specification.  The RU6 happens  to be fairly quiet with my Andromeda, so I was looking forward to a positive report from Solaris users since we launch it.


No hissing at all. But solaris is very sensible so i listen the noise of tidal when start or stop a track


----------



## kumar402

claud W said:


> Andykong,
> I have been breaking in my RU6 since last Wednesday 24/7 set on NOS, Should I give it another 100 hours set on OS?


so you haven’t heard the dongle yet? You have taken it far too seriously. Yes, there will be incremental improvement but if won’t listen then how would you know? Even Yggdrasil doesn’t take this much to sound good.


----------



## Andykong

claud W said:


> Andykong,
> I have been breaking in my RU6 since last Wednesday 24/7 set on NOS, Should I give it another 100 hours set on OS?


NOS and OS are two different algorithm in digit audio processing, they don't involve extra components, so they don't need to burn in seperately.


----------



## yaps66

Johnfg465vd said:


> Oh, never mind then. Hopefully someone else can share how timeless or other planar IEM works with RU6. My primary question is if the RU6 drives a planar IEM well and is there an improvement in Imaging with RU6 & planar combo.


To my ears they work well. Planars are generally revealing and what the RU6 does is to smoothen the treble. I have used the RU6 with the HE400i as well as the Timeless both on low gain without any issues. They sound great!


----------



## Deders

So for some reason I've not been getting email updated from this thread, but hey ho.

I've bought another splitter from Amazon, and I'm still getting drop outs, (as well as clicks every few seconds on this one).

It seems the more power the RU6 needs, the more likely it is to drop out.  So if the file has a higher sample rate or I enable the filter or raise the volume or switch high gain on, that adds to the power needed and I have to compensate somehow.

With everything turned on, running Hifiman Ananda via the balanced output, I needed to turn the volume all the way down to 62 to stop it cutting out with a 192khz track mixed before the DB war.

Does anyone know of a splitter that will work that is available in the UK that can handle fast charging or at least charge at a reasonable rate so the RU6 won't be a drain?

This one doesn't work...

USB C Headphone Adapter, 2 in 1... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07KXRHGDS?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share


----------



## emilsoft

Deders said:


> So for some reason I've not been getting email updated from this thread, but hey ho.
> 
> I've bought another splitter from Amazon, and I'm still getting drop outs, (as well as clicks every few seconds on this one).
> 
> ...



Might not be the splitter issue, but to do with the battery and how much power it can provide.. I have the same problem when on battery but work perfectly fine when the splitter is powered via one of the extra ifi iusb 3.0 slots


----------



## Deders

emilsoft said:


> Might not be the splitter issue, but to do with the battery and how much power it can provide.. I have the same problem when on battery but work perfectly fine when the splitter is powered via one of the extra ifi iusb 3.0 slots



Which battery are you talking about?  The phone battery or the external battery?

The external battery can charge a variety of configurations including 5v 3A or 9v 2A (15 or 18W)

The phone battery is capable of powering the RU6 on its own without these issues


----------



## Ufanco

Deders said:


> So for some reason I've not been getting email updated from this thread, but hey ho.
> 
> I've bought another splitter from Amazon, and I'm still getting drop outs, (as well as clicks every few seconds on this one).
> 
> ...


Also the one you linked has a built in dac on the headphone output side.


----------



## blotmouse

HarveyLowis said:


> this is the one that i use, only usb A slot.
> 
> 
> 
> and the other one is this, have usb A and lighting slot.


Unless they updated their model the top one is USB 2.0 and the bottom is USB 3.0. The 3.0 sounds quite a bit better and I prefer it over the other, which sucks cause I much prefer the smaller form factor.


----------



## Deders (Dec 21, 2021)

Ufanco said:


> Also the one you linked has a built in dac on the headphone output side.


Oh so it does.  It's really hard to find one without it seems


----------



## Ufanco

Deders said:


> Oh so it does.  It's really hard to find one without it seems


Totally agree I gave up, with the dongle I’m using and iPhone ended up buying a magnetic charger instead. Not every phone charges this way but it’s a descent option if yours does. Hopefully you have better luck finding a splitter for your needs. I think there usb hubs that work but not a feasible option for portable usage.


----------



## Deders

Ufanco said:


> Totally agree I gave up, with the dongle I’m using and iPhone ended up buying a magnetic charger instead. Not every phone charges this way but it’s a descent option if yours does. Hopefully you have better luck finding a splitter for your needs. I think there usb hubs that work but not a feasible option for portable usage.


I really want to be able to use my phone whilst I'm listening and charging


----------



## Verificateur

Deders said:


> I really want to be able to use my phone whilst I'm listening and charging


I believe @twister6 has found a splitter that works well, search a few pages back.


----------



## twister6

Verificateur said:


> I believe @twister6 has found a splitter that works well, search a few pages back.



Indeed, @Deders , check out this post https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cay...ac-with-head-amp.960113/page-71#post-16719816 - it works like a charm!


----------



## Deders (Dec 21, 2021)

twister6 said:


> Indeed, @Deders , check out this post https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cay...ac-with-head-amp.960113/page-71#post-16719816 - it works like a charm!



That's the one I bought!

It has a built in dac which is why I can't reconnect the RU6 if I disconnect it, it has a click in my right ear every just over 1 second and it cuts out if the RU6 demands too much power.

@twister6 what headphones have you tried with it?


----------



## All About Metal

twister6 said:


> Indeed, @Deders , check out this post https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cay...ac-with-head-amp.960113/page-71#post-16719816 - it works like a charm!


Anyone seen one of these with a Micro USB instead of the USB C?


----------



## twister6

Deders said:


> That's the one I bought!
> 
> It has a built in dac which is why I can't reconnect the RU6 if I disconnect it, it has a click in my right ear every just over 1 second and it cuts out if the RU6 demands too much power.
> 
> @twister6 what headphones have you tried with it?



Are you sure?  There is no built-in dac in there.  DAC is digital to analog, while here you have usb-c splitter with one side (labeled with headphones icon) having digital out to connect DAC (like RU6) and the other side is an input to charge your phone.  There is no analog output on the side where you are connecting RU6, it is digital only and intended for usb-c headphones that have dac built into their jack or dac/amp dongles like RU6.

What phone are you using?  What charger do you have connected to power input of the splitter?  Regarding headphones/iems I'm using, I tried a ton connected to RU6 3.5mm and 4.4mm, and even tried connecting external C9 amplifier, never an issue.


----------



## Deders (Dec 21, 2021)

twister6 said:


> Are you sure?  There is no built-in dac in there.  DAC is digital to analog, while here you have usb-c splitter with one side (labeled with headphones icon) having digital out to connect DAC (like RU6) and the other side is an input to charge your phone.  There is no analog output on the side where you are connecting RU6, it is digital only and intended for usb-c headphones that have dac built into their jack or dac/amp dongles like RU6.
> 
> What phone are you using?  What charger do you have connected to power input of the splitter?  Regarding headphones/iems I'm using, I tried a ton connected to RU6 3.5mm and 4.4mm, and even tried connecting external C9 amplifier, never an issue.


That's what I thought but someone pointed out to me a few posts up.  Look at the specs.  It specifies having a DAC if you enlarge the 3rd picture.

I have a Google Pixel 5 and a LG V30.  I'm going to try it on the V30 in the morning when I've charged it up. but I had the same issue with the last adapter on both phones.

I'm trying to run it from an 15/18W USB battery.  I could try chargers and see if it makes a difference.


----------



## twister6

Deders said:


> That's what I thought but someone pointed out to me a few posts up.  Look at the specs.  It specifies having a DAC if you enlarge the 3rd picture.
> 
> I have a Google Pixel 5 and a LG V30.  I'm going to try it on the V30 in the morning when I've charged it up. but I had the same issue with the last adapter on both phones.
> 
> I'm trying to run it from an 15/18W USB battery.  I could try chargers and see if it makes a difference.



Indeed, strange.  No issues here with Galaxy S9, and I did verify it by unplugging and plugging back multiple times while using different streaming and playback apps and different chargers and power bank batteries.


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 22, 2021)

Hi @twister6, just saw your S2 review on your website, https://twister6.com/2021/12/21/lotoo-paw-s2/.

A little bug has slipped through: You once mention a HiBy C9 with NuTubes (p. 3) ……. Nice Smiley here …


----------



## Barndoor

Don't have a RU6, but am following. May grab one next year.

With all this talk of splitters it reminds me of an experience I had with my E1DA.
I had to cut into the wire casing on the source side and break the power cable to get the E1DA to function correctly from the power on the other input.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

AlexanderV said:


> Does anybody plan to use RU6 with Bluesound NODE (N130)?
> On Dec 28 they will enable USB DAC feature via firmware update and it will be possible to connect DAC via USB.


Smart phone or tablet are not enough?    I try to avoid USB as much as possible.   I use Coax or Optical to connect my Bluesound Node to my DACs.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

twister6 said:


> True, on the go many are not going to drag the whole thing with them.  But it's just another option for those who use RU6 with their smartphone and want to charge at the same time.  Or, for example, some people use bulky phone cases for extra protection where wireless charging doesn't work quite well when you are at your desk.  Or, you are on the go without access to wifi and want to stream, and RU6 + smartphone is the only solution, and as a bonus you don't have to worry about draining your phone battery.  It is always good to have options to choose from, then it will be up to you which one works better


I agree with options, especially when the RU6 sounds so good that I put up with the 3 cable solution.   But, I just bought the RS6 because I like the RU6 so much.


----------



## keenears (Dec 22, 2021)

twister6 said:


> So, I received usb-c splitter today; many similar ones are available on amazon and ebay, referred to as digital audio/PD charging splitter.  The one I ordered was this, but pretty much they all should be similar and around $15. While for desktop use I prefer my Galaxy phone on a wireless (horizontal ) charger with RU6 connected directly, on the go this is very convenient to use with a slim power bank like the one from Anker below.  The side labeled with headphones goes to RU6, and the other one goes to your wall charger or a power bank.  Works perfectly!


Wait a second… I assumed the headphone icon means that there is a DAC inside the adapter that converts for headphones. Is that never true? Is that only true in some cases? Is it the lightning / usb c headphones that have the DAC built into them instead and the headphone icon is simply a guide?

EDIT: I see I’m late to the party and this has already been noted. No sense in connecting the RU6 to a cruddy DAC built into a splitter cable.

Splitters need to specifically say PD on one side and Data in the other. They’re hard to find working.


----------



## twister6

111MilesToGo said:


> Hi @twister6, just saw your S2 review on your website, https://twister6.com/2021/12/21/lotoo-paw-s2/.
> 
> A little bug has slipped through: You once mention a HiBy C9 with NuTubes (p. 3) ……. Nice Smiley here …



It's the end of the year, I'm loosing my mind  Was a typo, and as you noticed, in the same paragraph I mentioned Cayin C9 2nd time, just corrected it.


----------



## Jawis

Has anyone tried to connected their RU6 to a Raspberry Pi4 running Volumio? 
I'm getting a looping message where the RU6 connects,  but disconnects and then goes through the process again. 
My other USB dacs connect without issue.


----------



## kumar402

Jawis said:


> Has anyone tried to connected their RU6 to a Raspberry Pi4 running Volumio?
> I'm getting a looping message where the RU6 connects,  but disconnects and then goes through the process again.
> My other USB dacs connect without issue.


May be worth trying from other OS ? Is there any OS level setting to limit power draw from USB? just guessing. I have used DietPi and RopieeXL but just for audio HAT and never with DAC


----------



## dumpsterfire

Jawis said:


> Has anyone tried to connected their RU6 to a Raspberry Pi4 running Volumio?
> I'm getting a looping message where the RU6 connects,  but disconnects and then goes through the process again.
> My other USB dacs connect without issue.


Try it with a powered USB hub. The RU6 may be drawing too much power from the Pi.


----------



## Goofyboy84

HarveyLowis said:


> Let me try, iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain Volume 20 with OS and Nos Mode? 4.4 or 3.5 output do you use ? i will report back again after i tried mine.
> 
> After i tried,
> 1. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS and NOS mode, 3.5 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out
> ...


I’ll buy another camera kit thing in a few days. I’m gonna wait to at least see if the Cayin lightning to USBc cord even works for me. If it doesn’t…. And it’s working for others… then it could be my phone. 

I took the camera adapter back, last Friday out of frustration. 

I get the Cayin cable tomorrow. 😊 If it doesn’t work… I’ll cry. 😂😂😂 If it does work, I’ll be happy. 😁


----------



## Goofyboy84

HarveyLowis said:


> Let me try, iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain Volume 20 with OS and Nos Mode? 4.4 or 3.5 output do you use ? i will report back again after i tried mine.
> 
> After i tried,
> 1. iphone source + camera kit with Low Gain ( OS and NOS mode, 3.5 output ) any volume didnt have any drop out
> ...


Mine will be iPhone, 4.4, OS or NOS, Cayin cord. 

And if THAT works… I’ll buy the camera adaptor again…

iPhone, camera adaptor USB converter to USBc to Cayin to 4.4, OS or NOS.

My point here is… I bought the 4.4mm… why not use it? Ya know? 😊

That’s why I’m not even putting the 3.5 into the equation. 

And my goal is NO cutoff at any volume. 😁

Also… what charger cord are you using, when using the camera adaptor? 

Keep in mind… the iPad works wonderfully! I’m keeping it at 3.5 for now… just cause I don’t wanna constantly change cables if I’m switching. From phone (iPhone dongle 3.5) to 4.4. The 3.5 mm on iPad with Cayin USBc to USBc cable does to volume 75, no issue. I’ve never pushed it beyond that. 

The 4.4 on the iPad does 60-65 (from what I remember) just fine also. 

I’m just documenting everything, so others know also.

I appreciate everyone’s help and advice so far. Sincerely, I do. 😊

Thank you all! I’ll report back tomorrow. 😊

Happy listening! The Cayin itself? Absolutely wonderful! Thank you @Andykong for a great product!! 

Now I want more!!!! Always more!!! But I wanna get this figured out first. 😁


----------



## 111MilesToGo

twister6 said:


> It's the end of the year, I'm loosing my mind  Was a typo, and as you noticed, in the same paragraph I mentioned Cayin C9 2nd time, just corrected it.


Full understanding here. Not only end of the year, but the pandemic shifting gear - so bad and sad.


----------



## Jawis

kumar402 said:


> May be worth trying from other OS ? Is there any OS level setting to limit power draw from USB? just guessing. I have used DietPi and RopieeXL but just for audio HAT and never with DAC



I could try LibreElec on spare Pi. I use Volumio to network offline music and Tidal at home. It's nice to control all the Pis with one app. 
Not a huge issue as I have many other dacs that work fine.


----------



## Jawis

dumpsterfire said:


> Try it with a powered USB hub. The RU6 may be drawing too much power from the Pi.


I think you could be on to something here... Will try this 👍🏻


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> camera adaptor ( gen 1 with only usb slot without lightning slot )? So there are multiple Gen of camera adaptor and not all of them are equal?  This is new to me, I am a stranger to iOS ecosystem.


Oh really!!!! I didn’t know this!!! My camera adaptor had to be updated when I plugged it in, I will say that! It was purchased from the apple store. For what that’s worth! I have an iPhone and iPad… that’s as deep in the echo system I’m in… I have no need for a laptop or desktop.


----------



## Goofyboy84

HarveyLowis said:


> this is the one that i use, only usb A slot.
> 
> 
> 
> and the other one is this, have usb A and lighting slot.


I was using the 2nd one… the one with the lightning port so I can charge my phone at the same time. (That was the whole idea of the adaptor) otherwise I would have bought the Cayin adaptor to begin with and say… piss on the apple adaptor.


----------



## Goofyboy84 (Dec 22, 2021)

I went to Apple today and I made progress! I can use the Apple adaptor. USB-A with the lightning charger. It HAS TO BE the Apple branded charger. I was using a Belkin charger and it wouldn’t work, but I used an APPLE charger… and it works! Volume up to 60-65… I’m pretty sure OS and NOS!!! So this is progress! Maybe I got a bad adaptor last time? Maybe it was the Belkin charger. I’m still awaiting the Cayin cord, as I’ll use it for backup! I’ll play with this a bit and let y’all know what I find out!!! 😁😁😁😁

This is with the 4.4mm balanced cable. 😊


----------



## ctaxxxx

Got this in today and have been listening to it for a bit. This was literally an impulse buy when I saw there was an R2R dongle that was also compatible with the iPhone. So far I'm impressed. Overall better quality than straight out of the phone. Even when playing rhythm games, there's no noticeable lag and the music sounds great!


----------



## Goofyboy84

ctaxxxx said:


> Got this in today and have been listening to it for a bit. This was literally an impulse buy when I saw there was an R2R dongle that was also compatible with the iPhone. So far I'm impressed. Overall better quality than straight out of the phone. Even when playing rhythm games, there's no noticeable lag and the music sounds great!


What is your setup exactly? 😊 I think I have nine as good as I can get it.


----------



## ctaxxxx

Goofyboy84 said:


> What is your setup exactly? 😊 I think I have nine as good as I can get it.


Nothing special. Just phone, dongle, then earbuds/IEMs. It's more of a casual set up. Details in my signature.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Here’s what I found out. This will be my last post on this, as I’m satisfied… 

iPhone 12 Pro max… APPLE camera adaptor …. USB A on the left and lightning charge cable on the right, yes, I repurchased it today. 😊

Using factory Apple lightning to USBC cable… to an apple charger…

USBA to all Cayin products. USBA - USBC adaptor that comes with the RU6, the USBc to USBc that comes with the RU6

The RU6, obviously… 

Balanced cable to JH Layla IEMs 20 ohm

Here goes… 

Gain L

NOS and OS 

Volume limit 65 (I didn’t go any louder, as this is more than enough for me) — no cut out

Gain H

NOS and OS

Volume limit 55 (again I didn’t go any louder… I don’t wanna damage anything) - no cut out

I hope this helps someone here! 

I should receive my Cayin lightning to USBc tomorrow and I’ll use that for if I’m out and about. It’ll make a nice back up, if nothing else. 😊


----------



## kumar402

Goofyboy84 said:


> Here’s what I found out. This will be my last post on this, as I’m satisfied…
> 
> iPhone 12 Pro max… APPLE camera adaptor …. USB A on the left and lightning charge cable on the right, yes, I repurchased it today. 😊
> 
> ...


Good to know that it is finally working out for you. I have no experience with JH Layla but does it need this much juice? May be you are listening outdoors? I’m low level listener and max I have gone on volume is 30 and even that got louder for me personally


----------



## Andykong

If you want to charge your phone when using RU6, why not wireless power bank?


----------



## dumpsterfire

Andykong said:


> If you want to charge your phone when using RU6, why not wireless power bank?


For me, two major reasons:
1. Wireless charging is less efficient than wired and generates more heat, which is in the long term detrimental to the phone battery. 
2. Not every device I want to use the RU6 with also supports wireless charging. 

There is definitely convenience with wireless charging but wired is better for the long term health of the phone.


----------



## kumar402

dumpsterfire said:


> For me, two major reasons:
> 1. Wireless charging is less efficient than wired and generates more heat, which is in the long term detrimental to the phone battery.
> 2. Not every device I want to use the RU6 with also supports wireless charging.
> 
> There is definitely convenience with wireless charging but wired is better for the long term health of the phone.


May be we can use it when we are listening to RU6 and phone is low on battery and avoid wireless charging when using phone standalone. I mean we have to balance between wireless and wired. However I was not aware of detrimental affect of wireless charging now that Apple is whole heartedly supporting it but thanks for info.


----------



## Andykong

dumpsterfire said:


> For me, two major reasons:
> 1. Wireless charging is less efficient than wired and generates more heat, which is in the long term detrimental to the phone battery.
> 2. Not every device I want to use the RU6 with also supports wireless charging.
> 
> There is definitely convenience with wireless charging but wired is better for the long term health of the phone.



I thought charging when listening to RU6 only happens occasionally?


----------



## 111MilesToGo (Dec 23, 2021)

Hi @twister6, although I happily own the RU6, I keep on reading stuff. Please, did you mention which mode (OS/NOS) of the RU6 you were using when comparing to the Lotoo PAW S2 in your long S2 review? [Insert: I suppose OS would be more appropriate for a direct comparison since I guess the AKM DAC chip of the S2 would inherently do oversampling as well?] Thanks a lot in advance for commenting.


----------



## sahmen

Is anyone using some noise-filtering, "decrapifying," reclocking,or jitter-removing device (s) with their RU6? If so, could they share their experiences?


----------



## Fred5ek

fattycheesebeef said:


> Am interested in W2 but since this has appeared, I'm interested to know the comparisons between them!



Maybe it will be useful?   https://twister6.com/2021/12/21/lotoo-paw-s2/


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 23, 2021)

sahmen said:


> Is anyone using some noise-filtering, "decrapifying," reclocking,or jitter-removing device (s) with their RU6? If so, could they share their experiences?



yes spoke about it earlier in the thread. good improvements with ifi iusb micro 3.0.

It's infact so sensitive to quality usb signal as well as quality power i notice changes with all my sources. Even upgrading the ipower 9v supply for the iusb micro to the ipower x brought significant improvements to the RU6.. I dread to think what might happen if I got the ipower elite instead... i've opened a can of worms and audio nervosa


----------



## sahmen

emilsoft said:


> yes spoke about it earlier in the thread. good improvements with ifi iusb micro 3.0.
> 
> It's infact so sensitive to quality usb signal as well as quality power i notice changes with all my sources. Even upgrading the ipower 9v supply for the iusb micro to the ipower x brought significant improvements to the RU6.. I dread to think what might happen if I got the ipower elite instead... i've opened a can of worms and audio nervosa



This looks like the unit you're referring to. Do you know whether the 2.0 version can work the same magic, or are the some vital properties that are exclusive to the 3.0 version?


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 23, 2021)

sahmen said:


> This looks like the unit you're referring to. Do you know whether the 2.0 version can work the same magic, or are the some vital properties that are exclusive to the 3.0 version?



Dont know much about version 2 probably quite similar i guess.

I also noticed improvement when used from an ifi zen stream, perhaps it sounds a little cleaner from it vs the micro iusb where it's a little more euphoric/plump.. both give improvement


----------



## peterinvan (Dec 23, 2021)

Goofyboy84 said:


> Right now my best luck is with the direct USBc to USBc to the iPad Pro for the 4.4mm balanced. Yes.


Please comment on battery drain with iPad Pro Using 4.4mm balanced.  Thx


----------



## kumar402

peterinvan said:


> Please comment on battery drain with iPad Pro Using 4.4mm balanced.  Thx


I played music out of iPad Air and left it playing for whole night with headphone connected from 4.4mm balanced, volume set at 25 in high gain, NOS and in whole night the battery fell from 100 to ~40% for me. Pro May perform better.


----------



## rwelles

dumpsterfire said:


> Wireless charging is less efficient than wired and generates more heat, which is in the long term detrimental to the phone battery.


I only use my Apple MagSafe battery to charge my iPhone mini. Yes, it does generate more heat but it stops charging @ 91%. Long term, I feel that’s less detrimental to the battery.


----------



## Hyde00

Hello guys I've been reading about this but I just want to confirm something about the volume control.

From what I read it says any reduction in volume from source will degrade the sound.  So it's recommended to use 100% source volume (say like from Windows) then volume down using the hardware buttons on the Cayin RU6 is that correct?


----------



## kumar402

Hyde00 said:


> Hello guys I've been reading about this but I just want to confirm something about the volume control.
> 
> From what I read it says any reduction in volume from source will degrade the sound.  So it's recommended to use 100% source volume (say like from Windows) then volume down using the hardware buttons on the Cayin RU6 is that correct?


Yes, that’s correct


----------



## Hyde00

kumar402 said:


> Yes, that’s correct


Lol awesome thank you!


----------



## fon55

Od kilku godzin ru6 pracuje pod prąd, o dziwo ciągnąc hd650 bardzo przyzwoicie, bardzo mnie to dziwi i póki co nie w równowadze.

 Wieczorem podłączę NH bo teraz jestem outsiderem.

 Bravo Cayin bo to co zrobili w takim maluchu zasługuje na słowa uznania, dźwięk jest jak cudownie ująć, kochanie… no właśnie jak granie r2r z ich urokiem muzykalności, świetnym basem i ujmującą średnicą.

 Jeśli ktoś zna się na DAC-ach to wie o co chodzi w R2R, jest dla mnie ujmujący, ta bańka jest świetna i mam kilka stacjonarnych DAC-ów, w tym r2r na pcm1704 pcm63.

 Wracając do cayin ru6, po włączeniu AK pee51 coś odejmuje przyjemności słuchania, nie żeby AK jest dużo gorszy, ale to inny dźwięk i nasycenie, szczególnie na dole skali. HD650 są trudne w prowadzeniu, co jest słyszalne natychmiast po przepięciu.

 Ru6 gra tylko kilka godzin i trzeba mu dać kilkanaście więcej, ale sposób gry zasługuje na uznanie.

 Cóż, jest magia r2r i można ją od razu usłyszeć, regulacja głośności działa świetnie, menu jest tak proste jak budowanie cepa, ten fajny wyświetlacz spełnia swoje zadanie.

 Możesz wybrać wykończenia OS i NOS, co Ci odpowiada, system operacyjny ma świetny subbas, aż trudno uwierzyć, że hd650 gra tak z tą bańką...

 To chyba najlepszy zakup w tym roku ￼

 W trybie NOS wokale słychać bardziej naturalnie, kosztem impulsu w dolnym zakresie, OS daje więcej impulsu w basie, jest bardziej dynamicznie, bardziej rockowo, jestem ciekaw odczuć.

 Ten płaszcz ru6.


----------



## Hyde00 (Dec 24, 2021)

fon55 said:


> Od kilku godzin ru6 pracuje pod prąd, o dziwo ciągnąc hd650 bardzo przyzwoicie, bardzo mnie to dziwi i póki co nie w równowadze.
> 
> Wieczorem podłączę NH bo teraz jestem outsiderem.
> 
> ...


The ru6 has been working against the current for several hours, surprisingly pulling the hd650 very decently, it amazes me a lot and so far it is not in balance.

In the evening I will connect the NH because now I am an outsider.

Bravo Cayin because what they did in such a toddler deserves words of appreciation, the sound is wonderful to describe, honey ... just like playing r2r with their charm of musicality, great bass and charming midrange.

If someone knows DACs, he knows what R2R is about, it is endearing to me, this bubble is great and I have several stationary DACs, including r2r on pcm1704 pcm63.

Coming back to the cayin ru6, after turning on the AK pee51, something subtracts the listening pleasure, not that the AK is much worse, but it is a different sound and saturation, especially at the lower end of the scale. The HD650 are difficult to drive, which is audible immediately after overvoltage.

Ru6 plays only a few hours and you have to give him a dozen more, but the way he plays deserves recognition.

Well there's the magic of r2r and you can hear it right away, the volume control works great, the menu is as simple as building a flail, this cool display does the job.

You can choose the OS and NOS trim that suits you, the operating system has a great subbas, it's hard to believe that the hd650 sounds like that with this bubble ...

This is probably the best purchase this year ￼

In the NOS mode, the vocals are heard more naturally, at the expense of an impulse in the lower range, the OS gives more impulse in the bass, it is more dynamic, more rock-like, I'm curious to feel.

This coat ru6.

===================================================================================================

This is what *google translate* (source is Polish) gives me LOL.  Very good to hear you enjoy the RU6 more than AK PEE51, I was looking at PEE51 for a longgggggggg time but it's always out of stock everywhere so I couldn't buy one.

I already have a desktop unit (Playmate 2 with V6 Vivid on the way) so I probably don't need this but still very tempted to buy one just to try.  I previously owned a Modi Multibit but it has some other issues (outdated USB) but otherwise I do like the tonal balance of R2R dac.


----------



## alota

fon55 said:


> Od kilku godzin ru6 pracuje pod prąd, o dziwo ciągnąc hd650 bardzo przyzwoicie, bardzo mnie to dziwi i póki co nie w równowadze.
> 
> Wieczorem podłączę NH bo teraz jestem outsiderem.
> 
> ...


for sure


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 25, 2021)

Media combo.
LG pocket prj
Ru6
Charge/digital port

Ofcouse need to add a media source (ex. smartphone)and power pack 20000mhA.
Anywhere.Any time


----------



## ian91 (Dec 25, 2021)

My desktop setup drawing power from mains rather than my phone (also have a powerbank for semi-portable use):


----------



## fon55

Zastanawiam się, czy kabel USB c do USB c podłączony do ru6 jest audiofilskiej jakości, czy warto użyć czegoś lepszego, jakiegoś occ, ofc,


----------



## keenears

This is marvelous as is, more compact and elegant of a solution than all the others, and even better if someone can find it all usb c (IF SO PLEASE SHARE). Question responders says it charges, just not PD. An ifi silent power plug adapted would fit the bill: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B094D342TJ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_6YNYN3K29X2Q0X6NJN5B


----------



## peterinvan

Anyone comment on RU6 with Elegia phones?  Thx.


----------



## Verificateur

peterinvan said:


> Anyone comment on RU6 with Elegia phones?  Thx.


Not Eegia, but works superbly with Focal Stellia (using the balanced 4.4mm output, high gain, NOS). Plenty of headroom and a very nice ‘organic’ sound.


----------



## Keko123

And has anyone used RU6 with Hifiman Ananda?

Thanks!


----------



## sahmen (Dec 26, 2021)

Keko123 said:


> And has anyone used RU6 with Hifiman Ananda?
> 
> Thanks!


Not the Ananda, but I am currently using it with the new Arya Stealth magnets, and they rock together in a way that is nothing less than epic. I'm currently listening to them this very minute, so excuse the over-exuberance of my language if  it appears that way...

The RU6 hasn't stopped astounding the hell out of me since it arrived...  first with Audeze LCD-5, and now with the Arya Stealth magnets.  I have a rather strong suspicion that it will not disappoint with the Ananda either, especially since I have also tried it with the Sundara, which produced another stellar pairing.. 

I can't guarantee any verdict about the RU6 with the Ananda, but I think I have heard enough from the Arya and Sundara pairings to feel very optimistic about an Ananda pairing.


----------



## Blanka79 (Dec 26, 2021)

Hey there. I think most of you use the Cayin with an phone/tablet and a streaming service. Which one do you prefer? How does  the DAC behave with Tidal MQA? ( I know what MQA is, I just would like to know 😉)


----------



## TYATYA

Blanka79 said:


> Hey there. I think most of you use the Cayin with an phone/tablet and a streaming service. Which do you prefer? How das the DAC behave with Tidal MQA? ( I know what MQA is, I just want to know)


1st unfold 88k.
I like Qobuz most


----------



## kumar402

Blanka79 said:


> Hey there. I think most of you use the Cayin with an phone/tablet and a streaming service. Which do you prefer? How das the DAC behave with Tidal MQA? ( I know what MQA is, I just want to know)


I use it with Apple Music and Qobuz


----------



## alota

Blanka79 said:


> Hey there. I think most of you use the Cayin with an phone/tablet and a streaming service. Which one do you prefer? How does  the DAC behave with Tidal MQA? ( I know what MQA is, I just would like to know 😉)


I'm not sure if is your point but i have tried with same iem the ru6 and ibasso dc05 mqa compatible. I have no heard significant differencies


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 26, 2021)

How much is the OI of this device? My ZMF VC sounds good out of this dongle and I wonder if balanced out has slightly higher OI assisting my VC


----------



## TYATYA (Dec 26, 2021)

48khz vs 192khz?
I tried 3 times switching 48/192 on my smp running foobar2000.
(Exactly in UI show 96, max but actually 192 shown on the Ru).
I blind test by close my eyes and let only my ears works.
After eyes closing I fast toggle dozen times randomly so my brain can not remember status of oversample toggle is current ON of OFF.
Then carefully start listening and do final toggle, once or two.
My ears tell me the toggle is ON and then I open my eyes to check.
I do 3 checks and all are correct.

I heard people talk about foobar2000 for decade but just tried it on my SP1000 few days. Very clean sound and its Crossfeed function is much more native than the one on Neutron.

My test using smp connect to ru and iem is low-fi ibasso IT000. I did not think that I can point out 48 vs 192.
Oversampling toggle above is the toggle of foobar2000 audio setting, not ru6.
So good.


----------



## Louisiana (Dec 26, 2021)

The RU6 is a wonderful device!





He doesn't need to hide from the big boys either:





I have not yet tried my VC, currently the RU6 drives my HEKSE, and what can I say?
It's amazing what sound comes out of such a small part.


----------



## Goofyboy84

peterinvan said:


> Please comment on battery drain with iPad Pro Using 4.4mm balanced.  Thx


I’ll pay more attention to that, actually. I’ve been just here home, switching from the phone to the iPad, since I got everything working, finally! 😁
Question for you!!! I have the iPad Pro 12.9” 3rd Gen.. so not BRAND NEW… 

I want to find an adaptor that I can plug into the USBC port in the iPad and split it. Kinda like the Belkin Rockstar, but I’m no fan of Belkin. 

I’ve learned some stuff works better than others with this whole thing… and Belkin charger cords isn’t one of them! Ha! 

I have the camera adaptor with the iPhone.. I can listen and charge simultaneously.. but now I wanna do it for the iPad. 😊


----------



## Goofyboy84

kumar402 said:


> Good to know that it is finally working out for you. I have no experience with JH Layla but does it need this much juice? May be you are listening outdoors? I’m low level listener and max I have gone on volume is 30 and even that got louder for me personally


Well, I have hearing issues. But on ANOTHER note… I’m having to get impressions done again and the Laylas reshelled… or fixed. They’re under warranty still. 

The sealing isn’t amazing… but when I had impressions done… the bite block, that had me bite it to where my mouth isn’t open much. Well, I’m a mouth breather… when I open my mouth… it breaks the seal down deep. So…. Maybe after that, I’ll be fine with lower volume. 😊


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> I thought charging when listening to RU6 only happens occasionally?


For me and my iPhone, it’s constant.. that way I have no worries on cutout. The Cayin cable works, if I’m on the go and am very careful with the volume… 

I’m finally happy that I have a working solution. Now I’d like to have just a little longer USBc-USBc cable, but still works fine. Even an inch or 2 longer would be nice.


----------



## WDitters

sahmen said:


> Not the Ananda, but I am currently using it with the new Arya Stealth magnets, and they rock together in a way that is nothing less than epic.


Hmmm interesting that you find the Arya to rock with the RU6 @213mw while I find the R01 @430mw to lack just that tiny little bit of oomph on the Arya 🤔


----------



## yfei

kumar402 said:


> How much is the OI of this device? My ZMF VC sounds good out of this dongle and I wonder if balanced out has slightly higher OI assisting my VC


Not sure about OI (output impedance?),     but RU6's balanced out do have more driving power compared to single end.   with my 64 Audio U12 IEM,   with single ended I set volume to ~20,   and with balanced out I set volume to ~15


----------



## Sharppain

NewEve said:


> Any chance we'll see other colors for the cases?
> 
> On the one hand, there's a design which looks as HiFiesque as possible for a dongle...
> ... and on the other there's two cases in bright colors looking-like Legos
> ...


My review: https://uc.xyz/167fKi?pub=link


----------



## ian91

WDitters said:


> Hmmm interesting that you find the Arya to rock with the RU6 @213mw while I find the R01 @430mw to lack just that tiny little bit of oomph on the Arya 🤔



I guess it's all a matter of taste. I think the RU6 manages my Sundaras just about but does lose a bit of low frequency dynamics. I probably wouldn't be satisfied with it driving the Arya.


----------



## Alexzander

I find RU6 sounding best when fed from SP2000 😂
All the credits goes to better time domain handling over USB I believe.


----------



## drftr

I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:

1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?

2. I'm using the PowerAmp app and I'm very happy with it from a usability point of view, but I do know UAPP sounds a bit better. Will the RU6 avoid the upsampling that PowerAmp uses and take the signal straight from Android? That would be a win-win for me. Or will it get the upsampled PowerAmp signal instead, rendering NOS pretty much useless?

Tnx much...

drftr


----------



## alota

drftr said:


> I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:
> 
> 1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?
> 
> ...


About point 1 why you are concerned about firmware? For now there is no new firmware


----------



## kumar402

drftr said:


> I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:
> 
> 1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?
> 
> ...


1. Yes, you can use it straight out of box. No setup required.
2. This DAC has 2 modes - NOS and OS. In NOS mode the dac wont oversample the signal that your device will send. I haven’t used poweramp but if poweramp sends the oversampled signal then that’s what the DAC will get. You have to find a way to switch it off in the player itself.


----------



## drftr

kumar402 said:


> 1. Yes, you can use it straight out of box. No setup required.
> 2. This DAC has 2 modes - NOS and OS. In NOS mode the dac wont oversample the signal that your device will send. I haven’t used poweramp but if poweramp sends the oversampled signal then that’s what the DAC will get. You have to find a way to switch it off in the player itself.


It can't be switched off in most apps actually, so I hoped the RU6 was able to get the sound signal directly from Android (like UAPP does) while using the functionality of the PowerAmp app. Hope anyone can chime in on this one...

Tnx!

drftr


----------



## drftr

alota said:


> About point 1 why you are concerned about firmware? For now there is no new firmware


Well, there's a webpage for firmware downloads, so I guessed it was a real thing...

drftr


----------



## Mithrandir1980

I have the Lotoo Paw S2 and the L&P W2.

 Is this one worth buying?


----------



## Keko123

Mithrandir1980 said:


> I have the Lotoo Paw S2 and the L&P W2.
> 
> Is this one worth buying?





econaut said:


> Maybe just upgrade to the S2?
> 
> @OspreyAndy says in this post that RU6 and S2 are better than W2, which would mean that the S2 is a major step from the S1 (in regard to his ranking here). I have not heard the S1 myself



I have also had the Luxury & Precision W2, and I prefer the RU6


----------



## Keko123

Mithrandir1980 said:


> I have the Lotoo Paw S2 and the L&P W2.
> 
> Is this one worth buying?


----------



## drftr

After reading all 84 pages may I conclude we haven't found an Android USB-C charger/splitter that has 5V output power without adding DAC nonsense, that allows us to charge the phone wired while simultaneously using the RU6?

That's more than a bit annoying to be honest; not even because of the reading hours involved. It pretty much makes long listening sessions impossible 😥

drftr


----------



## Sharppain

drftr said:


> I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:
> 
> 1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?
> 
> ...


You may use RU-6 withOUT any installation in iOS and Android.
UAPP is fine and, according to me, a must since it goes around the iIOS and Android sound and bit rate twisting. It works fine for me with my in phone libraries and Tidal, has EQ, bit rate perfect and others. It is very stable but does not work off line and has tiny in-app one time pay.


----------



## bnupy

Mithrandir1980 said:


> I have the Lotoo Paw S2 and the L&P W2.
> 
> Is this one worth buying?


Sure if you are interested, For my taste its better than w2 and s1 (I don't want to get into collecting dongles, hence no info on the S2)


----------



## keenears (Dec 26, 2021)

drftr said:


> After reading all 84 pages may I conclude we haven't found an Android USB-C charger/splitter that has 5V output power without adding DAC nonsense, that allows us to charge the phone wired while simultaneously using the RU6?
> 
> That's more than a bit annoying to be honest; not even because of the reading hours involved. It pretty much makes long listening sessions impossible 😥
> 
> drftr


A little bird told me that DDHifi will release a new version of their awesome TC28i with usb c and two female ports, effectively becoming the most compact, solid, well-made usb c splitter that exists. Unfortunately I don’t have any other details 😭 It will be perfect for the RU6, my Walkman, my iPad Pro…


----------



## TYATYA

drftr said:


> It can't be switched off in most apps actually, so I hoped the RU6 was able to get the sound signal directly from Android (like UAPP does) while using the functionality of the PowerAmp app. Hope anyone can chime in on this one...
> 
> Tnx!
> 
> drftr


Neutron, Uapp, Onkyo HF, Maiden audio... are some of group 1.
Jetaudio, VLC, Power amp ... and tons of app are in group2.

Idk what's "direct" in your post but seems you must change your player app to some in group1, a group that bypass Android audio stack.
For ex. if you plug a ext dac into usb port, Uapp or NeutronMp pop up to ask the right of controlling. Since then (after click Yez) you found all system audio effect such as EQ, DSP are no longer affect/altering the output audio.
Ofcouse EQ, DSP OF THE APP is available, when you need it


----------



## Hyde00

Sharppain said:


> You may use RU-6 withOUT any installation in iOS and Android.
> UAPP is fine and, according to me, a must since it goes around the iIOS and Android sound and bit rate twisting. It works fine for me with my in phone libraries and Tidal, has EQ, bit rate perfect and others. It is very stable but does not work off line and has tiny in-app one time pay.


What about for Windows? I think their product page says Windows OS need to download a driver made for RU6 from official website.

Or is it one of those if you want to go higher than certain sampling rate, otherwise plug and play?


----------



## keenears (Dec 26, 2021)

drftr said:


> After reading all 84 pages may I conclude we haven't found an Android USB-C charger/splitter that has 5V output power without adding DAC nonsense, that allows us to charge the phone wired while simultaneously using the RU6?
> 
> That's more than a bit annoying to be honest; not even because of the reading hours involved. It pretty much makes long listening sessions impossible 😥
> 
> drftr


I forgot… some in the forums for my 40th anniversary Walkman swear by this splitter and the RU6 comes with a c to a adapter: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08KPD5S8...abc_8QZ8YT8D9Q6XXEGV5NDH?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

Has it yet been said that the RU6 is the best DAC dongle? This thing renders beautifully rich sound. My only longing is for it to have been truly balanced. I’m over it as soon as I listen again lol


----------



## twister6

drftr said:


> After reading all 84 pages may I conclude we haven't found an Android USB-C charger/splitter that has 5V output power without adding DAC nonsense, that allows us to charge the phone wired while simultaneously using the RU6?
> 
> That's more than a bit annoying to be honest; not even because of the reading hours involved. It pretty much makes long listening sessions impossible 😥
> 
> drftr



Not true, man.  My post you reacted to today, that $15 splitter works perfectly.  Whatever they talk about in the description, either something got lost in translation or that functionality is bypassed because I have been using it for almost a week, and found no issues connected to my Galaxy phone while charging it at the same time.


----------



## hoofman

Keko123 said:


> And has anyone used RU6 with Hifiman Ananda?
> 
> Thanks!






I'm using the RU6 with Hifiman Ananda and I think overall it does a solid job. 
I have a diverse taste of music with classical music, metal, jazz, pop etc. and so far it handles my library just fine. The music is enjoyable and I haven't noticed that RU6 did anything wrong. The sounding is fairly accurate and lively (my setting: high gain + vol ~60-70 + NOS).

Compared to my daily portable combo Sony NW-A35 + PHA-1A, the Sony one sounds a little bit cleaner, has a little bit more details and much finer volume control. But then the Sony one is also bulkier and they needs to be charged while the RU6 use battery from sources (phone, laptop, tablet, etc) directly. Considering all pros & cons I think the RU6 is at an advantage here (enjoyable sound + tiny footprint + no battery + USB-C)

One thing I noticed is that different devices handle the RU6 differently. I tested the RU6 on my Sony Xperia X10 II phone, iPad Air 4, and LG Gram laptop and they all handle the RU6 smoothly, while the Samsung Note 10+ produces hiccup once in a while (there is a short stopping now and then, randomly but fairly frequent, I have no idea why). Also, I tried the RU6 on my friend's phone, Xiaomi something I don't know the model, and it crashed the phone, triggered some beeping alarm that won't go off until we switched the phone off. That happened in the public and gave us a hard time trying to deal with it while avoiding stares from people around.


----------



## drftr

twister6 said:


> Not true, man.  My post you reacted to today, that $15 splitter works perfectly.  Whatever they talk about in the description, either something got lost in translation or that functionality is bypassed because I have been using it for almost a week, and found no issues connected to my Galaxy phone while charging it at the same time.


How did you find out the DAC isn't doing anything? It says the built-in Realtek DAC can handle 24 bit / 96 kHz which at least suggests _something_ is in there and that it limits the signal passing through.

After reading the bad reviews I will try to find something that lasts a bit longer and comes without a DAC. I don't need a DAC in my phone plus one in the dongle plus one in the dongle for the dongle 

drftr


----------



## twister6

drftr said:


> How did you find out the DAC isn't doing anything? It says the built-in Realtek DAC can handle 24 bit / 96 kHz which at least suggests _something_ is in there and that it limits the signal passing through.
> 
> After reading the bad reviews I will try to find something that lasts a bit longer and comes without a DAC. I don't need a DAC in my phone plus one in the dongle plus one in the dongle for the dongle
> 
> drftr



I was researching this topic and apparently USB-C can support "audio accessory mode" to send the analog signal over the digital D+/D- data pins of the connector.  Perhaps, that is one of the operating modes if the DAC built into that splitter detects that you connected earphones and switches to that mode.  Otherwise, when you connect a DAC, it will operate in a default mode, sending digital audio data over usb-c interface to be decoded and converted to analog inside of the external dongle such as RU6.


----------



## sahmen (Dec 27, 2021)

WDitters said:


> Hmmm interesting that you find the Arya to rock with the RU6 @213mw while I find the R01 @430mw to lack just that tiny little bit of oomph on the Arya 🤔


.None of this surprises me, although I find rationalizations and evaluations based solely on statistics and measurements to be somewhat limited. Still keep in mind that :

1. this is the Stealth magnets Arya, which is a lot easier to drive than the previous 2 iterations. The RU6 drives it effortlessly with a lot of headroom left, and without showing the slightest sign of straining...

2. I am using a Norne Audio Silvergarde 4 8 wire to drive my Aryas, and that this 8-wire  version is a beast of a headphone cable which is capable of unlocking details, technicalities, and levels of performance in *any* headphones that the usual stock cables are often incapable of matching, however hard they try...

3.  I have personally never heard the R01 in my own system and with my gear, and therefore I cannot speak to how it might compare favorably or not with the RU6 in my system.  In that sense, if this is merely an experience of "ignorance is bliss," then so be it, since I am not inclined to exchange this kind of bliss with any other kind I know nothing about yet, until I concretely know better.

4.  This is about the RU6, a tiny $250 dongle, and its performance, as compared to other rigs worth more than 20 x its value, hence a small "miracle" when judged in relationship to the performance it can work up as compared to all the 'big boys.'  There would be nothing exceptionally interesting, or worth being excited about if this were the performance of  another rig that was worth say 5k or more.

On the other hand, I do have desktop rigs, such as an Yggy A2 with a Pathos InPol Ear, and a Sonnet Audio Morpheus with a Niimbus US4, which I routinely use with such Headphones as the Susvara, the LCD-5, and the Abyss 1266 TC, and they do provide legitimate templates of audio goodness against which I might compare the performance of the RU6/Arya Stealth magnets pairing.  It is in the light of such comparisons that I find the RU6/Arya Stealth magnets to Rock my world, without necessarily implying that the RU6 exactly matches those other big boy rigs in performance, and even if I have not had the luck of listening to the R0!, which I would like to do, when/if I get the chance.

In the meantime, I think your mileage may legitimately vary, depending on how your R01 sounds within the chains in which it is deployed at your end.  Speaking of chains, I think they do make a significant impact on the performance of their individual components, a fact which renders an evaluation of any individual component unreliable and suspect, when it is done as if they're performing outside a specific chain. There is also the matter of your personal tastes and preferences, which I have no expertise to assess.

With that said, when I say the Arya and RU6 pairing rocks to my ears as opposed or compared to the performance of other chains I am familiar with, I do not feel I am unduly exaggerating any aspect of my experience, as this pairing indeed rocks my ears. There is no denying that. I can't stop listening to the RU6 paired with either the Arya Stealth Magnets or the LCD-5. It is as simple as that. Since the RU6 arrived, I have been ignoring both my Susvara and the 1266 TC because I think they're, first, too hard to drive to make any sense trying to pair them with the RU6. On the other hand, I have been enjoying the RU6 + Arya/LCD-5 pairings so much that I have not even once missed listening to either the Susvara or the 1266 TC, although I remain aware of what both these cans are capable of, which is a lot.  The important thing is that there is nothing in my listening to the RU6 Arya or LCD-5 pairings to convince me that my enjoyment is illegitimate or illusory. I am just having a great time with them, and I feel it is a bit disingenuous to spoil or shortchange that enjoyment with futile speculations about what other "better" or "lesser" chains might produce.

Of course, I do respect the integrity of the experience you report with the R01, which you find to be somewhat subpar, sadly. I wish i could tell you why, which I can't since I am not familiar with the R01 itself or the chain in which it is deployed at your end.

I do not find it entirely constructive or helpful to allow that piece of news to spoil my enjoyment of what i have in hand at the moment, especially if I do not know what I would think, were I to audition the R01 in my own system... i am also trying to wean myself off DAPs at the moment (I no longer listen to either my A & K Kann, or Kann Cube, which are both in excellent working order, but that is an entirely different kettle of fish, I suppose)

I have no expertise regarding how to make the R01 work more to your tastes, since I have no clue what your preferences are, and have never owned the R01. Maybe one day I shall cross paths with the R01 and either find it to be a little on the "meh" side, as you do now,  or get my mind blown to smithereens by it, in spite of my current attitude regarding DAPs... We'll have to wait and see    

I see that my rant has been entirely too lengthy, maybe much more than I would have ideally liked. This probably has nothing to do with your comment, which may have just caught me at a time when I am feeling too loose-tongued and more longwinded than normal.


----------



## syazwaned

Cayin Ru6 or Chord Mojo?


----------



## emilsoft

syazwaned said:


> Cayin Ru6 or Chord Mojo?


 RU6


----------



## Jawis

drftr said:


> I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:
> 
> 1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?
> 
> ...


RU6 and PowerAmp run well together.  My Note 20 defaults to PowerAmp if I don't run the specific UAPpro driver.


----------



## Hyde00

syazwaned said:


> Cayin Ru6 or Chord Mojo?


Was looking at Mojo for a long time too until this come along.


emilsoft said:


> RU6


Damn that's impressive.  Which might work better since I don't want to deal with Mojo's battery actually.


----------



## emilsoft

Hyde00 said:


> Was looking at Mojo for a long time too until this come along.
> 
> Damn that's impressive.  Which might work better since I don't want to deal with Mojo's battery actually.


 RU6 is better. Mojo sounds DSP and processed.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

syazwaned said:


> Cayin Ru6 or Chord Mojo?


It depends on what you are pairing it with.    If you need a warmer presentation and/or power, then Mojo is it.   If you want a more natural presentation, then RU6.     Both are good.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

emilsoft said:


> RU6 is better. Mojo sounds DSP and processed.


You would expect posts like this in the RU6 thread.  If the question was posted in the Mojo thread, you would get the opposite.


----------



## syazwaned

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> It depends on what you are pairing it with.    If you need a warmer presentation and/or power, then Mojo is it.   If you want a more natural presentation, then RU6.     Both are good.


Thanks Friend


----------



## hoofman

Hyde00 said:


> What about for Windows? I think their product page says Windows OS need to download a driver made for RU6 from official website.
> 
> Or is it one of those if you want to go higher than certain sampling rate, otherwise plug and play?


I'm using the RU6 with my Surface Go without any driver installed. It works right out of the box and I don't feel like I'm missing anything (I'm using direct audio though. ASIO and WASAPI don't work. I think you need to install driver to use those)


----------



## Technological

drftr said:


> After reading all 84 pages may I conclude we haven't found an Android USB-C charger/splitter that has 5V output power without adding DAC nonsense, that allows us to charge the phone wired while simultaneously using the RU6?
> 
> That's more than a bit annoying to be honest; not even because of the reading hours involved. It pretty much makes long listening sessions impossible 😥
> 
> drftr


There are options without built in DAC's. It's just the form factor which most are looking for always comes with a built in DAC. It is true that some of those built in DAC's have a pass though mode but depends on the DAC chip and I just prefer to get that out of the signal chain so I suggest using a USB C splitter which splits to USB C for PD and USB A for data. This type doesn't have a DAC built in as they are intended for use with other periferals and then if you use a small USB A to USB C adapter you are good to go. 

Such as thses splitters:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0968Q7...abc_QVMCSSPVCTRQNFAHJC63?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B08C5FW...abc_JJ36YRMM9XB6QKXX9D9B?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

Such as this USB A to USB C adapter
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B072M9L...abc_R7CSYKPSQ2D7FT50WCTT?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## Andykong

hoofman said:


> I'm using the RU6 with my Surface Go without any driver installed. It works right out of the box and I don't feel like I'm missing anything (I'm using direct audio though. ASIO and WASAPI don't work. I think you need to install driver to use those)



It depends whether your Windows system has USB Audio Driver 2.0 pre-installed.  Starting with Windows 10, *release 1703*, a USB Audio 2.0 driver is shipped with Windows. It is designed to support the USB Audio 2.0 device class.  Anything before that will need to install USB Audio Driver to get it work.

Yes, the USB Audio 2.0 driver provided by Windows 10 does not support DAIO and WASAPI, if you want to playback DSD file on your PC to RU6 setup, you still need to install Cayin USB driver even you have windows 10 post 1703.


----------



## Andykong

Technological said:


> There are options without built in DAC's. It's just the form factor which most are looking for always comes with a built in DAC. It is true that some of those built in DAC's have a pass though mode but depends on the DAC chip and I just prefer to get that out of the signal chain so I suggest using a USB C splitter which splits to USB C for PD and USB A for data. This type doesn't have a DAC built in as they are intended for use with other periferals and then if you use a small USB A to USB C adapter you are good to go.
> 
> Such as thses splitters:
> https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0968Q7...abc_QVMCSSPVCTRQNFAHJC63?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1
> ...



I couldn't understand these built-in DAC options.  So you need a purely analogue USB-C terminated headphone in order to use the DAC in the splitter? I didn't see USB-C with analogue signal in the official USB-C pinout.


----------



## Technological (Dec 27, 2021)

Andykong said:


> I couldn't understand these built-in DAC options.  So you need a purely analogue USB-C terminated headphone in order to use the DAC in the splitter? I didn't see USB-C with analogue signal in the official USB-C pinout.


It is confusing for sure.

If you look at any usb c splitter which goes to two usb c connections it is designed to meet the need to using usb c earbuds and usb c charging. Since at the beginning when phone manufacturers were getting rid of the 3.5mm jack there were some analog usb c earbuds these splitters come with built in DAC's so those will be compatible as well (rather than face mixed reviews). Therefore, yes one would need to have analog usb c earbuds to use the built in DAC. However, most modern day usb c earbuds have built in DAC's and thus there is _supposed_ to be a built it pass through mode where usb c data is passed though directly to the DAC built into usb c earbuds rather than the DAC in the splitter. As for the pin outs, I have not seen any for these types of splitters. But analog usb c earbuds use the following usb c pins: Left Channel > D- (A7) ; Right Channel > D+ (A6) ; Ground > GND (A1).

Now the splitters which I linked have one side with female usb a. These do *not *have a DAC built in and the data transmitted from the phone is not tampered with. The usb c side of the splitter just provides power to the phone while data is routed through the usb a.


----------



## Andykong

Technological said:


> It is confusing for sure.
> 
> If you look at any usb c splitter which goes to two usb c connections it is designed to meet the need to using usb c earbuds and usb c charging. Since at the beginning when phone manufacturers were getting rid of the 3.5mm jack there were some analog usb c earbuds these splitters come with built in DAC's so those will be compatible as well (rather than face mixed reviews). Therefore, yes one would need to have analog usb c earbuds to use the built in DAC. However, most modern day usb c earbuds have built in DAC's and thus there is _supposed_ to be a built it pass through mode where usb c data is passed though directly to the DAC built into usb c earbuds rather than the DAC in the splitter. As for the pin outs, I have not seen any for these types of splitters. But analog usb c earbuds use the following usb c pins: Left Channel > D- (A7) ; Right Channel > D+ (A6) ; Ground > GND (A1).
> 
> Now the splitters which I linked have one side with female usb a. These do *not *have a DAC built in and the data transmitted from the phone is not tampered with. The usb c side of the splitter just provides power to the phone while data is routed through the usb a.



A6 and A7 are USB 2.0 data line in USB-C definition.  So the USB-C output from these mobile devices will forfeit USB 2.0 support which is not a big deal.   

On the other hand, as long as you are not using A6 and A7 (or B6 and B7) in the splitter, you have bypassed the DAC already,  am I correct with this assumption?


----------



## Andykong

drftr said:


> I'm considering buying the RU6 but since I'm new to the concept I'm currently reading the whole thread. Being just over halfway I have 2 questions that I'd like to see answered without another day of reading as I'm getting excited! I'd appreciate it if anyone could help on these questions:
> 
> 1. Being permanently travelling I won't have access to a computer. Can firmware be installed using my Android phone or do I _need_ a computer for that? In fact, can I even use it straight out of the box not having a computer for initial setup?
> 
> ...



PowerAmp does not support bit-perfect USB Audio output, so all playback from PowerAmp will go through the SRC (Sample Rate Conversion) in your Android mobile phone.  The output is pleasant and enjoyable, but since the RU6 has a oversampling routine to convert all PCM signal to 24Bit/384kHz, you have gone through TWO layers of oversampling if you are using OS mode of RU6 because of that.



TYATYA said:


> Neutron, Uapp, Onkyo HF, Maiden audio... are some of group 1.
> Jetaudio, VLC, Power amp ... and tons of app are in group2.
> 
> Idk what's "direct" in your post but seems you must change your player app to some in group1, a group that bypass Android audio stack.
> ...



A very good explanation.  I have nothing to add other than including HiByMusic in the group 1 list.


----------



## utdeep

Chord Mojo - by far - in my setup.  Extra headroom, space, and warmth


----------



## drftr

Andykong said:


> PowerAmp does not support bit-perfect USB Audio output, so all playback from PowerAmp will go through the SRC (Sample Rate Conversion) in your Android mobile phone. The output is pleasant and enjoyable, but since the RU6 has a oversampling routine to convert all PCM signal to 24Bit/384kHz, you have gone through TWO layers of oversampling if you are using OS mode of RU6 because of that.


Yeah, I was afraid of that. Tnx for confirming though. Guess it's time to dig up my list with points why I selected PowerAmp over UAPP among others. Would be a pity as I fell in love with its setup, interface, etcetera, but such is life...

Could you please confirm whether I would ever need a computer for any firmware updates or that I'm good with just a smartphone? Tnx...

drftr


----------



## drftr

Technological said:


> There are options without built in DAC's. It's just the form factor which most are looking for always comes with a built in DAC. It is true that some of those built in DAC's have a pass though mode but depends on the DAC chip and I just prefer to get that out of the signal chain so I suggest using a USB C splitter which splits to USB C for PD and USB A for data. This type doesn't have a DAC built in as they are intended for use with other periferals and then if you use a small USB A to USB C adapter you are good to go.
> 
> Such as thses splitters:
> https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0968Q7...abc_QVMCSSPVCTRQNFAHJC63?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1
> ...


Do you also have one in mind with 2 USB-C outputs instead of one being USB-A (and without DAC)? I would use it with a PD charger. I just had a look at Ugreen and DDhifi among others and then came across this Belkin splitter. It's more expensive but comes with 2 year warranty and having had some of their products in the past I have a bit more faith in them than in nameless Chifi brands to be honest. Do you think this would work:

https://www.amazon.com/Belkin-Split...&sprefix=usb-c+splitter+,aps,182&sr=8-18&th=1

Tnx...

drftr


----------



## Technological

Andykong said:


> A6 and A7 are USB 2.0 data line in USB-C definition.  So the USB-C output from these mobile devices will forfeit USB 2.0 support which is not a big deal.
> 
> On the other hand, as long as you are not using A6 and A7 (or B6 and B7) in the splitter, you have bypassed the DAC already,  am I correct with this assumption?


That would be my assumption as well but I have not verified it. That's why I said that is how its supposed to work.


----------



## Technological

drftr said:


> Do you also have one in mind with 2 USB-C outputs instead of one being USB-A (and without DAC)? I would use it with a PD charger. I just had a look at Ugreen and DDhifi among others and then came across this Belkin splitter. It's more expensive but comes with 2 year warranty and having had some of their products in the past I have a bit more faith in them than in nameless Chifi brands to be honest. Do you think this would work:
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Belkin-Splitter-Adapter-Headphone-Charging/dp/B086R4KX23/ref=sr_1_18?crid=JI2HUZ0OGWOM&keywords=usb-c+splitter+for+charging&qid=1640621848&sprefix=usb-c+splitter+,aps,182&sr=8-18&th=1
> 
> ...


That's the only dual usb c splitter I found which seems to not have a DAC built in when I went looking for one as well.

I understand your sentiment about going with a known brand, however that Belkin splitter has a horrible reputation. But you can give it a shot if you want.


----------



## drftr

Technological said:


> That's the only dual usb c splitter I found which seems to not have a DAC built in when I went looking for one as well.
> 
> I understand your sentiment about going with a known brand, however that Belkin splitter has a horrible reputation. But you can give it a shot if you want.


It's partly because this didn't give me much confidence. It's the one Alex posted earlier on. Not sure if I would want this in a multi-thousand dollar chain. But obviously when going for portability there's always a trade-off to be made.






drftr


----------



## keenears (Dec 27, 2021)

twister6 said:


> I was researching this topic and apparently USB-C can support "audio accessory mode" to send the analog signal over the digital D+/D- data pins of the connector.  Perhaps, that is one of the operating modes if the DAC built into that splitter detects that you connected earphones and switches to that mode.  Otherwise, when you connect a DAC, it will operate in a default mode, sending digital audio data over usb-c interface to be decoded and converted to analog inside of the external dongle such as RU6.


If it bypasses the DAC with the RU6 connected then the RU6 would display DSD on a DSD filetype, for example, correct? Or could it be processing the DSD through the DAC and then handing off the processed DSD to the RU6? As I understand, no one has found a USB - C Data / USB - C charge splitter without a DAC yet, right?


----------



## drftr

keenears said:


> As I understand, no one has found a USB - C Data / USB - C charge splitter without a DAC yet, right?


See my link in post 1,276.

drftr


----------



## keenears

drftr said:


> See my link in post 1,276.
> 
> drftr


“Chief Propellerhead” seems to disagree
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/review/B086R4KX23/R3FEETUX7DT1SZ/ref=ask_dp_lswr_rp_hza


----------



## Technological

drftr said:


> It's partly because this didn't give me much confidence. It's the one Alex posted earlier on. Not sure if I would want this in a multi-thousand dollar chain. But obviously when going for portability there's always a trade-off to be made.
> 
> 
> 
> drftr


I see. Well USB just like HDMI has a whole lot of manufacturers which don't follow the specification for the protocol. What is shown in the Amazon review picture you attached is completely fine in regards to isolation between cables and many manufacturers use fiberglass in the center and ground wiring is always exposed. The cabling in that picture was not the reason the adapter did not work for this person.

What feels cheap and probably lead this person to cut the cable is the lack of shielding. Which many, many usb cable manufacturers do. Although that means the cable doesn't meet specification it doesn't pose a major issue other than being susceptible to RF interface as well as putting out minimal amounts of it's own. For example many specially made for audio usb cables do not use shielding.

The only thing which would cause issues to the devices the usb cable is attached to is if there is a connection bridge made during soldering. But that is quite rare to see from any manufacturer. The reason I think the cable in the review pictured did not work was because at one of the soldering points the cable was not soldered very well or broke right before one of the soldering points for one of the cables. Both of which would be hard to catch during QC. As it would pass QC shortly after manufacturing but once handled more would become completely disconnected or an intermittent connection dependent on cable positioning.

All that just goes to say in the end yes its better to go with know and/or trusted manufacturers if possible however that won't always mean you avoid the same types of issues or worse which happen with unknown brands. As I am not sure if you know, but major brands on small simple devices outsource many of the components to the same OEMs used by the unknown brands. In addition very few types of failures from USB cables lead to device damage.


----------



## drftr

keenears said:


> “Chief Propellerhead” seems to disagree
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/review/B086R4KX23/R3FEETUX7DT1SZ/ref=ask_dp_lswr_rp_hza


I honestly can't tell whether a MIDI connection would be similar enough or not. I was lead to believe it works the way we would intend to use it because of this comment:

_"Works as described, can use it to my Hugo DAC, send audio to it and keep my iPhone or iPad 2 charged.  Appears high quality!"_

But if he is somehow wrong, I am too!

Although I don't think we can expect such a thing from Cayin, I _do_ think not having access to a more professional solution severely limits the use of a portable DAC, simply because it isn't really. I for one would hope in the near future products like these will either have a way to connect it to a battery or include a high quality cable that enables charging and playback at the same time. There's 2 choices really: Either you go for top sound quality and you end up with a desktop setup without compromise, or you go for portability without a compromise on portability. But the RU6 seems to be right in between, which obviously is great from a marketing point of view: Very good sound quality and a portable-ish solution for people who want to stop listening to music every few hours to recharge their phone. 

I'll most likely hold off on embracing this as my solution of choice. Not because of the sound quality in which I have great faith, but because I don't want to depend on $3 splitter solutions in a multi kilobuck setup or stopping for an hour just to charge my phone. I'm sure there will be a top manifacturer soon enough to improve this now weakest link. Hopefully someone like @iFi audio can jump in and create a better connection solution for all of us.

drftr


----------



## keenears

drftr said:


> I honestly can't tell whether a MIDI connection would be similar enough or not. I was lead to believe it works the way we would intend to use it because of this comment:
> 
> _"Works as described, can use it to my Hugo DAC, send audio to it and keep my iPhone or iPad 2 charged.  Appears high quality!"_
> 
> ...


I’m also crossing my fingers that DDHifi releases a TC28i USB-C male to two USB-C female adapter asap. What a compact and elegant solution that would be!


----------



## Technological

keenears said:


> “Chief Propellerhead” seems to disagree
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/review/B086R4KX23/R3FEETUX7DT1SZ/ref=ask_dp_lswr_rp_hza


"Chief Propellerhead" was trying to use the headphone out side as a normal full usb c data out. The headphone out side on many of these adapters is not built for designed for the data transmission rates needed for other purposes. That is why I recommend those with full usb a implementation as they don't use chips and circuit design that is a blackbox and does not support all usb applications.


----------



## Technological

drftr said:


> I honestly can't tell whether a MIDI connection would be similar enough or not. I was lead to believe it works the way we would intend to use it because of this comment:
> 
> _"Works as described, can use it to my Hugo DAC, send audio to it and keep my iPhone or iPad 2 charged.  Appears high quality!"_
> 
> ...


MIDI connections are different enough. What's wrong with using the usb adapters with usb a female on one side? Just wondering, as that meets your needs perfectly just is not as visually appealing.


----------



## drftr

Technological said:


> MIDI connections are different enough. What's wrong with using the usb adapters with usb a female on one side? Just wondering, as that meets your needs perfectly just is not as visually appealing.


I just don't think it becomes a more failproof connection: An adapter, for a dongle, for a dongle. Believe me:  If using this as a portable solution every single day while travelling you need back ups because they break when looking at them while you can't get them replaced easily. I'm probably better off simply accepting the crap sound quality of my phone and call it a day.

drftr


----------



## keenears (Dec 27, 2021)

Technological said:


> MIDI connections are different enough. What's wrong with using the usb adapters with usb a female on one side? Just wondering, as that meets your needs perfectly just is not as visually appealing.


USB A on one side would be fine for my NW-A100TPS Walkman when I connect to a desktop DAC, but they haven’t yet worked. The charging takes over and data drops when you connect the charger. But for this RU6 it gets absurd to add their USBC to A adapter between their cable and the adapter which then converts it back to USB C for the Walkman. Visual I guess is one way to put it, but there is also a practical quality to minimal adapters and solders.

I was under the impression MIDI connections are just USB data. That’s what the RU6 needs.


----------



## Sharppain

Mehran said:


> So why these USB dongles can't also work via BT to compete with BTR5 or other BT receivers too?
> Would it considerably increase the build size or something ?


Because BT cripples the music and you loose fidelity.


----------



## keenears

Technological said:


> "Chief Propellerhead" was trying to use the headphone out side as a normal full usb c data out. The headphone out side on many of these adapters is not built for designed for the data transmission rates needed for other purposes. That is why I recommend those with full usb a implementation as they don't use chips and circuit design that is a blackbox and does not support all usb applications.


Sincerely, how is DSD 5.6, for example, not as high a data transmission rate as what a USB 2.0 MIDI connection would require?


----------



## Technological

drftr said:


> I just don't think it becomes a more failproof connection: An adapter, for a dongle, for a dongle. Believe me:  If using this as a portable solution every single day while travelling you need back ups because they break when looking at them while you can't get them replaced easily. I'm probably better off simply accepting the crap sound quality of my phone and call it a day.
> 
> drftr


Fair enough. Thanks for sharing your perspective on it.

I use this set up but only when I need to charge and not that often in general. So can't really talk to use every day.

But I would also like to see a better solution on the market to fill this need. For now I just consider if it's worth building my own custom adapter.


----------



## musicday (Dec 27, 2021)

I wonder if other companies will release R2R dongles in the future.


----------



## H T T

drftr said:


> I honestly can't tell whether a MIDI connection would be similar enough or not. I was lead to believe it works the way we would intend to use it because of this comment:
> 
> _"Works as described, can use it to my Hugo DAC, send audio to it and keep my iPhone or iPad 2 charged.  Appears high quality!"_
> 
> ...


A MIDI cable is designed to transmit MIDI. A USB cable can transmit MIDI and a whole slew of other uses. Am I missing a detail as it makes little to no sense to use a dedicated MIDI cable for portable audio?


----------



## keenears (Dec 28, 2021)

H T T said:


> A MIDI cable is designed to transmit MIDI. A USB cable can transmit MIDI and a whole slew of other uses. Am I missing a detail as it makes little to no sense to use a dedicated MIDI cable for portable audio?


MIDI over USB has been a standard for a decade or two now. It’s how you connect a keyboard to a computer for something like Garageband, for example


----------



## Technological

keenears said:


> USB A on one side would be fine for my NW-A100TPS Walkman when I connect to a desktop DAC, but they haven’t yet worked. The charging takes over and data drops when you connect the charger. But for this RU6 it gets absurd to add their USBC to A adapter between their cable and the adapter which then converts it back to USB C for the Walkman. Visual I guess is one way to put it, but there is also a practical quality to minimal adapters and solders.
> 
> I was under the impression MIDI connections are just USB data. That’s what the RU6 needs.


Ah yeah anytime you use one of these splitters be it the dual usb c or the ones with usb a on one side you should connect up the power first then the DAC. Otherwise it won't work.

But yeah I'm with you guys on minimizing connection points and extra points of failure. Unfortunately we don't have a solution like that on the market yet.

As for usb data, that's a very broad category. MIDI is usb data but it requires a higher data transfer rate. Usb audio needs much less and the dual usb c adapters don't allow full usb 2.0 data transfer rates.


----------



## drftr

H T T said:


> Am I missing a detail


The detail is that I mentioned it for the sole reason that someone had invalidated the splitter because he couldn't use it with MIDI and I had no clue whether that would be a valid disqualifiaction.

drftr


----------



## keenears

Another option is wireless charging while using the RU6. I do it on my iPhone. On my iPad I have a multiport hub that it can power with usb c data and usb c PD but the hub doesn’t work with the Walkman. 

The Walkman has NFC. Apparently, spring 2020 NFC was figured out to have the capacity for 1-3w charging. And yes, I had to dig, but with the existing NFC hardware (the new standard they developed for charging was for the new chargers). It’s not as strong as Qi but the hardware is so small that it’s practical for something with low power like my Walkman. That’s what they say, but an Apple Watch is pretty small and wirelessly charges.

However, I can’t find an NFC charger. I just sent a message to the NFC people asking if they even exist. 🤷🏼‍♂️


----------



## Paramekshu

keenears said:


> Another option is wireless charging while using the RU6. I do it on my iPhone. On my iPad I have a multiport hub that it can power with usb c data and usb c PD but the hub doesn’t work with the Walkman.
> 
> The Walkman has NFC. Apparently, spring 2020 NFC was figured out to have the capacity for 1-3w charging. And yes, I had to dig, but with the existing NFC hardware (the new standard they developed for charging was for the new chargers). It’s not as strong as Qi but the hardware is so small that it’s practical for something with low power like my Walkman. That’s what they say, but an Apple Watch is pretty small and wirelessly charges.
> 
> However, I can’t find an NFC charger. I just sent a message to the NFC people asking if they even exist. 🤷🏼‍♂️


The back of the phone heats up when you use wireless charging. Aren't you concerned about degrading the battery over time?


----------



## keenears (Dec 27, 2021)

Paramekshu said:


> The back of the phone heats up when you use wireless charging. Aren't you concerned about degrading the battery over time?


No I am not.

1) Microwaves heat everything up and a cellphone is nothing but a microwave transmitter / receiver

2) My iPhone allows me to monitor the health of the battery and wireless charging has never depleted battery life for me differently than wired charging (the worst thing you can do is just leave it always charging, which I learned on my macbook)

3) I have AppleCare if the battery fails

4) if I wanted to Apple or other shops enable me to replace the battery even without applecare for a very small cost.


----------



## Paramekshu

keenears said:


> No I am not.
> 
> 1) Microwaves heat everything up and a cellphone is nothing but a microwave transmitter / receiver
> 
> ...


Good to know. I was nervous about wireless charging my Note 20 while using a dongle dac to my IEMs for long periods. Thanks again.


----------



## H T T (Dec 27, 2021)

keenears said:


> MIDI over USB has been the standard for a decade or two now. It’s how you connect a keyboard to a computer for something like Garageband, for example


I am an electronic musician. I use said cables nearly everyday.  I also use MIDI to MIDI cables for my vintage gear. I used the MIDI to MIDI cable as a figure to highlight the incompatibility of a MIDI connection/cable with a phone and a dongle.  I was not understanding and don’t see why someone would use MIDI for a dongle to/from phone interface. Again, maybe my reading comprehension skills/ADHD need work and I am misunderstanding the complete context.









drftr said:


> The detail is that I mentioned it for the sole reason that someone had invalidated the splitter because he couldn't use it with MIDI and I had no clue whether that would be a valid disqualifiaction.
> 
> drftr


Got it, thanks.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

RU6 is my favorite DAC/AMP dongle.  I love the natural sound, the deep subbass and transparent treble response.    I like it so much, I sold my R6 2020 and I just put in an order for an Hiby RS6 and I intend to pair it with my C9.    I am really hoping this DAP has that R2R natural sound and scales nicely with the C9.


----------



## Goofyboy84

keenears said:


> A little bird told me that DDHifi will release a new version of their awesome TC28i with usb c and two female ports, effectively becoming the most compact, solid, well-made usb c splitter that exists. Unfortunately I don’t have any other details 😭 It will be perfect for the RU6, my Walkman, my iPad Pro…


This birdy sounds awesome!!!! This music to my ears… since I also have an iPad Pro. 😁


----------



## keenears (Dec 28, 2021)

H T T said:


> I am an electronic musician. I use said cables nearly everyday.  I also use MIDI to MIDI cables for my vintage gear. I used the MIDI to MIDI cable as a figure to highlight the incompatibility of a MIDI connection/cable with a phone and a dongle.  I was not understanding and don’t see why someone would use MIDI for a dongle to/from phone interface. Again, maybe my reading comprehension skills/ADHD need work and I am misunderstanding the complete context.
> 
> 
> 
> Got it, thanks.



Yes this seems to be becoming confused.

The question is what is going on inside this splitter. What is this splitter actually doing and not doing, since it has its own DAC between the source and the RU6.

The splitter in question has its own DAC for the side you don’t charge through. Is the data arriving at the RU6 from that side 1) a FLAC / DSD / et. al made into PCM by the splitter’s DAC before being sent to the RU6 2) a FLAC / DSD / et al. file that has bypassed the splitter’s DAC because, as drftr said, he believes the splitter doesn’t utilize its own DAC if it recognizes a DAC attached to it (or something to that effect) or 3) another possibility is that the source recognized that the splitter’s DAC could not handle a certain filetype and so it sent the audio as PCM to the RU6 involving or bypassing its own DAC before moving onward into the RU6. This final process is what my Walkman does, send PCM, when it recognizes that the external DAC does not work with the raw files, such as with my Modi Multibit.

The only usefulness of Amazon reviewers highlighting the splitter’s inability to send MIDI over USB is not because we are trying to connect instruments to the phone / device, but rather, because it’s a lowest-common-denominator as USB data which won’t pass through the side of an “audio-only” USB-C splitter. MIDI over USB can’t be processed by the splitter’s DAC. Therefore, because the Amazon reviewer with the odd name said MIDI through the splitter doesn’t work, it suggests that #2 above is perhaps implausible because, if it were true, the splitter would bypass its DAC when moving MIDI data. MIDI data can move over a basic USB data connection, so the only reason it wouldn’t here is if the splitter’s DAC is processing everything.

I haven’t heard back from those who have the splitter whether a format like DSD is identified on the RU6 while using the splitter. That would eliminate one of the possibilities


----------



## elindil

RU6 or IFI Gryphon (both 4.4 output)? Purely from a Sound Quality perspective? Any insights?


----------



## musicday

AMP3 has the RU6 on a nice pre-order 😉👍.


----------



## fon55

czy ktoś słuchał ru6 z Audeze lcd2f, czy ru6 jest w porządku?


----------



## drftr

Just pulled the trigger on the RU6. Tnx for all your well-meant guidance! Much appreciated...

drftr


----------



## Hyde00

I'm also on the fence of pulling the trigger, but I also realize I have very specific taste so a lot of the time buying new dac/amp is like buying lottery for me LOL.

Some background information, I'm currently using Dragonfly Red with Denon D5200.  Recently acquired Burson Playmate 2 and also bought the V6 Vivids and V6 Classic opamp to try.  End up using the Playmate 2 stock opamp (LOL I know, I'll admit I have cheap taste, I think I like the ESS glare LOL, and I'll probably be the first one in history to admit this).

My music preference is a lot of female vocal (need to be very in your face like you can feel the singer spitting on your face) and a lot of rich acoustic guitar / violin / piano.  Though I also realize I watch movie trailers on my PC a lot so nice midbass and subbass rumble is appreciated (also I'm using Denon...... it's like almost a requirement LOL).

That being said, is there enough treble to make female vocal / guitar / piano / violin interesting while still having enough bass rumble for movie trailers?  I end up selling a lot of my past gear generally due to not forward enough vocal (too far or veiled).  I'll admit it could be partially due to Denon D5200 is not very vocal centric headphone so I'm compensating for it I think.  Oh I also realize I like a bit aggressive sound (kind of like Grado sound) for rock.  Some of the dac / amp I tried are too smooth (V6 Vivid and Classic) and making rock kind of bland? (guitar distortion and snare drum hits doesn't have enough bite)

All things considered, would this be something for me or I'm totally looking at the wrong thing?  As I previously said maybe I just have cheap taste???

Again I'm pretty sure RU6 is amazing but I'm trying to see if fits my preference as to there is no right or wrong (kind of like picking food).  I suspect my taste might be towards ESS sound but I did liked the Modi Multibit so it's hard to say.  Figure I'd ask anyway LOL.

Any feedback would be appreciated, thanks!


----------



## kumar402

drftr said:


> Just pulled the trigger on the RU6. Tnx for all your well-meant guidance! Much appreciated...
> 
> drftr


Give it a good burn in before you start critical listening. It does settle in after 100hrs or so


----------



## kumar402 (Dec 28, 2021)

Hyde00 said:


> I'm also on the fence of pulling the trigger, but I also realize I have very specific taste so a lot of the time buying new dac/amp is like buying lottery for me LOL.
> 
> Some background information, I'm currently using Dragonfly Red with Denon D5200.  Recently acquired Burson Playmate 2 and also bought the V6 Vivids and V6 Classic opamp to try.  End up using the Playmate 2 stock opamp (LOL I know, I'll admit I have cheap taste, I think I like the ESS glare LOL, and I'll probably be the first one in history to admit this).
> 
> ...


Well it does have bass and mid bass but don’t expect a punch and impact like big desktop amp however for a dongle it has good amount of bass and mid bass and will rumble with good HP like Z1R. I feel 400Hz to 2Khz is slightly recessed but slightly. Then there is push in upper mids that will make you enjoy the female vocals. Treble has energy but transient is rounded so it won’t sound bright or shrill but there are some peaks which you may like.


----------



## Andykong (Dec 29, 2021)

I almost avoided the splitter discussion completely.  I believe extra dongle/splitter in the music chain will downgrade the audio performance slighlty because it introduce smore conection points and questionable cable implementation (inside the splitter).  In addition, I still couldn't believe this is the hottest topic in past 20 pages of RU6.  Since I didn't test nor paying enough attention to the "hidden" DAC in side the splitter, I find the related discussion fancinating.  The hpothesis are so comprehensive that I seriously suspect the $20 splitter has a Microprocessor or even ADC  built-in to handle the digital audio signal.

On the other hand, battery care and charging are some of my major concerns in past few years: I have to when I need to repeat this topic many times in different DAP threads.  I still convinced that if your mobile phone support wireless charging, get a Qi certified wireless charging power bank to charge your mobile phone "occasionally" is a better option that hunting for this "so-far-non-existed" USB splitter.

I noticed some users are concern that wireless charging will heat up the mobile during charging and shorten the battery life.  I'll take a look at this topic and want to share my observations:

*Will wireless charging heat up the mobile during charging?*

Yes, it will.  According to a recent study by ACS (American Chemical Society) compared the 10W wireless charger against conventional USB charger and noticed that wireless charging wil increase the temperature by 3.5°C for roungly 1 hour per charging cycle.


> With conventional mains power, the maximum average temperature reached within 3 h of charging does not exceed *27 °C.* In contrast to aligned inductive charging, the temperature peaked to *30.5 °C *but gradually reduced for the latter half of the charging period. This is similar to the maximum average temperature observed during misaligned inductive charging. In the case of misaligned inductive charging, the peak temperature was of similar magnitude (30.5 °C) but was reached sooner and persisted much longer at this level (125 vs 55 min). ....



*Will wireless charging shorten the battery life?*

Theoretically , yes, but we cannot quantity the implication at this stage.  Afterall, we are talking about 1 hours of 3.5°C temperature change per charging cycle only.
On a related not not directly relevant subject, ACS noticed that the SoH (State of Health) of 18650 battery will drop slightly (capacity from 94.5% to 92.5%) after 6 month of storage in different temperature chamber.  That is 2% capacity downgrade with 20°C different over 6 month of 7x24 control experiment.   Maybe  1 hours of 3.5°C isn't really such a big deal.






*Other than wireless charging, will there be other charging issue that can heat up the mobile during charging?*

Yes, all fast charging will heat up the mobile more than regular 5V2A charging.  Please be reminded that QC3.0 is 18W based, and PD Profile 3 is upto 36W.  While I didn't measure the temperature change, I do notice 18W QC3.0 is as heated as 10W wireless, if not hotter.  Since the QC3.0 didn't really shorten the charging time by 50% if we measuring a complete charging cycle like the ACS experiement mentioned above, the temperature implication of fast charging should draw similar, if not more concern than the heating issue of wireless charging.

Another charging related issue can be more alarming if we are worrying about the heat issue of wireless charging.  Charging and using the mobile phone at the same time will heat up your mobile phone, again most likely more than  3.5°C IMHO. If we want to keep the battery from heating up, we should avoid charging and using at the same time.  Stop from RU6 for 30-60 minutes when you need to top up your battery,  that will keep your battery cool.

Last but not least, dongle DC will speed up the aging of your phone battery.  For example, if you are using 5 charging cycles per week original, using dongle DAC regularly will probably increase that to 6-7 charging cycles per week.  If the usage remain unchage for a long time, the 500 charging cycles limit will shorten from 100 weeks to 71.5-83.3 weeks.  This observation is bad for Dongle DAC business, but since we are on this subject, we might as well look at the full picutre.

At the end of the day, I hope we can put aside the heating problem of wireless charging and seriously consider this option instead of the never ending splitter searching.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

The one thing that we need to keep in mind is that synergy between dongle and IEM/Headphone matters.    When I give my impressions and provide rank order of dongles, daps or IEMs, my preference is influenced by genre of music and transducer.   Nothing is better than everything.   For example, I said that RU6 is my current favorite dongle based usb DAC/AMP.    But, not for every genre of music or every IEM/Headphone.    I just did an A/B test for another headfier and I much prefer the L&P W2 for pairing with the Oriolus Traillii.   It does a better job of opening up the sound stage and create a more holographic imaging with the Bird than does the RU6.    So, before you buy anything, make sure you ask for impressions based on the type of music you listen to and the IEM or headphones you plan to pair them with.


----------



## kumar402

Andykong said:


> I almost avoided the splitter discussion completely.  I believe extra dongle/splitter in the music chain will downgrade the audio performance slighlty because it introduce smore conection points and questionable cable implementation (inside the splitter).  In addition, I still couldn't believe this is the hottest topic in past 20 pages of RU6.  Since I didn't test nor paying enough attention to the "hidden" DAC in side the splitter, I find the related discussion fancinating.  The hpothesis are so comprehensive that I seriously suspect the $20 splitter has a Microprocessor or even ADC  built-in to handle the digital audio signal.
> 
> On the other hand, battery care and charging are some of my major concerns in past few years: I have to when I need to repeat this topic many times in different DAP threads.  I still convinced that if your mobile phone support wireless charging, get a Qi certified wireless charging power bank to charge your mobile phone "occasionally" is a better option that hunting for this "so-far-non-existed" USB splitter.
> 
> ...


Well last 20 pages were fascinating indeed. Just wanted to add my point here, taking a break to charge the phone will not only recharge the phone battery but will also give our auditory senses a much needed break


----------



## rocketron

Andykong said:


> I almost avoided the splitter discussion completely.  I believe extra dongle/splitter in the music chain will downgrade the audio performance slighlty because it introduce smore conection points and questionable cable implementation (inside the splitter).  In addition, I still couldn't believe this is the hottest topic in past 20 pages of RU6.  Since I didn't test nor paying enough attention to the "hidden" DAC in side the splitter, I find the related discussion fancinating.  The hpothesis are so comprehensive that I seriously suspect the $20 splitter has a Microprocessor or even ADC  built-in to handle the digital audio signal.
> 
> On the other hand, battery care and charging are some of my major concerns in past few years: I have to when I need to repeat this topic many times in different DAP threads.  I still convinced that if your mobile phone support wireless charging, get a Qi certified wireless charging power bank to charge your mobile phone "occasionally" is a better option that hunting for this "so-far-non-existed" USB splitter.
> 
> ...


So from this we can conclude a dongle will shorten a phones battery life by about 30% ?

Will the Cayin RU7 have a battery in it then?


----------



## ssriram2791

rocketron said:


> So from this we can conclude a dongle will shorten a phones battery life by about 30% ?
> 
> Will the Cayin RU7 have a battery in it then?


How big the dongle should be if you start adding batteries in ? Say you get your wish, Why I need to connect something to my smartphone if it is self powered ? Why should I have a giant slab hanging off my smartphone usb-c port (the way we are getting digital data into the device) 

Once you add battery to this so-called Dongle, why cant we add bluetooth as well ? I will just put the so called Dongle in my pocket and use it like Qudelix 5k (Bluetooth DAC Amp)

But Bluetooth DAC AMP would still be using bluetooth connection from smartphone there by still draining battery. 

 Ah.. now I see.. We have something called a Digital Audio Player a.k.a DAP  that can effectively replace the smartphone there by saving its battery life. 

I think we should either ask smartphone manufacturers to provide replaceable batteries again (because of their greed, we are suffering) or make choices that could be deterimental to our wallet, but still we will retain our smartphone battery. 

The answer to your question "Will the Cayin RU7 have a battery?" is a *hard NO* (there is no incentive to call that product a dongle then).


----------



## keenears

Andykong said:


> I almost avoided the splitter discussion completely.  I believe extra dongle/splitter in the music chain will downgrade the audio performance slighlty because it introduce smore conection points and questionable cable implementation (inside the splitter).  In addition, I still couldn't believe this is the hottest topic in past 20 pages of RU6.  Since I didn't test nor paying enough attention to the "hidden" DAC in side the splitter, I find the related discussion fancinating.  The hpothesis are so comprehensive that I seriously suspect the $20 splitter has a Microprocessor or even ADC  built-in to handle the digital audio signal.
> 
> On the other hand, battery care and charging are some of my major concerns in past few years: I have to when I need to repeat this topic many times in different DAP threads.  I still convinced that if your mobile phone support wireless charging, get a Qi certified wireless charging power bank to charge your mobile phone "occasionally" is a better option that hunting for this "so-far-non-existed" USB splitter.
> 
> ...


Sure. A no-brainer, but only for devices that have wireless charging 🙇🏼‍♂️


----------



## Hyde00

kumar402 said:


> Well it does have bass and mid bass but don’t expect a punch and impact like big desktop amp however for a dongle it has good amount of bass and mid bass and will rumble with good HP like Z1R. I feel 400Hz to 2Khz is slightly recessed but slightly. Then there is push in upper mids that will make you enjoy the female vocals. Treble has energy but transient is rounded so it won’t sound bright or shrill but there are some peaks which you may like.


Lol awesome, thank you for the detailed explanation!

You explain it much better than my "I think I like this kind of sound?????" LOL.


HiFiHawaii808 said:


> The one thing that we need to keep in mind is that synergy between dongle and IEM/Headphone matters.    When I give my impressions and provide rank order of dongles, daps or IEMs, my preference is influenced by genre of music and transducer.   Nothing is better than everything.   For example, I said that RU6 is my current favorite dongle based usb DAC/AMP.    But, not for every genre of music or every IEM/Headphone.    I just did an A/B test for another headfier and I much prefer the L&P W2 for pairing with the Oriolus Traillii.   It does a better job of opening up the sound stage and create a more holographic imaging with the Bird than does the RU6.    So, before you buy anything, make sure you ask for impressions based on the type of music you listen to and the IEM or headphones you plan to pair them with.


Yeah I always find headphone and dac/amp pairing is like a math problem.

As long your final results is pleasing to your taste then I think what you do beforehand doesn't matter.


----------



## TYATYA

rocketron said:


> So from this we can conclude a dongle will shorten a phones battery life by about 30% ?
> 
> Will the Cayin RU7 have a battery in it then?


I think it won't.
Gaming heat up the phone as wireless charing does, or even more.
I tried yesterday at 5% and 30% remaining juice. My note20 at balance at 5% (charge equal to discharge) and charge slowly at 30%. It raised 1% per each 10 minutes.
Payload is Ru6, HD youtube via wifi, in room condition.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

Hyde00 said:


> I'm also on the fence of pulling the trigger, but I also realize I have very specific taste so a lot of the time buying new dac/amp is like buying lottery for me LOL.
> 
> Some background information, I'm currently using Dragonfly Red with Denon D5200.  Recently acquired Burson Playmate 2 and also bought the V6 Vivids and V6 Classic opamp to try.  End up using the Playmate 2 stock opamp (LOL I know, I'll admit I have cheap taste, I think I like the ESS glare LOL, and I'll probably be the first one in history to admit this).
> 
> ...


I haven't tried it with my Grado headphones yet but I'm pretty sure it can drive them without a problem. I expect them to match pretty well too. When I had the W2 it matched the Grados pretty good as well.

The Denon D5200 is rated at 25ohms so shouldn't be a problem to drive. 

I think the sound of the RU6 actually matches your musical preferences in fact it's what it excels at. Great for vocals as well as acoustic music. But it's not an aggressive sound like ESS. It's more laid back, vinyl like. 

I'm not sure about watching movies but it does have some midbass warmth that might help.


----------



## Jawis

Jawis said:


> Has anyone tried to connected their RU6 to a Raspberry Pi4 running Volumio?
> I'm getting a looping message where the RU6 connects,  but disconnects and then goes through the process again.
> My other USB dacs connect without issue.





RU6 running fine with Pi/Volumio setup now. It was just a simple change of cable.

No need for powered USB cable. 

The other cable worked fine with S1, but not the RU6.


----------



## Andykong

Jawis said:


> RU6 running fine with Pi/Volumio setup now. It was just a simple change of cable.
> 
> No need for powered USB cable.
> 
> The other cable worked fine with S1, but not the RU6.



Glad to know it works out eventually.  

What cable are you using right now?  The USB C-to-C cable bundled with RU6 didn't work for you?


----------



## Andykong

Andykong said:


> I almost avoided the splitter discussion completely.  I believe extra dongle/splitter in the music chain will downgrade the audio performance slighlty because it introduce smore conection points and questionable cable implementation (inside the splitter).  In addition, I still couldn't believe this is the hottest topic in past 20 pages of RU6.  Since I didn't test nor paying enough attention to the "hidden" DAC in side the splitter, I find the related discussion fancinating.  The hpothesis are so comprehensive that I seriously suspect the $20 splitter has a Microprocessor or even ADC  built-in to handle the digital audio signal.
> 
> On the other hand, battery care and charging are some of my major concerns in past few years: I have to when I need to repeat this topic many times in different DAP threads.  I still convinced that if your mobile phone support wireless charging, get a Qi certified wireless charging power bank to charge your mobile phone "occasionally" is a better option that hunting for this "so-far-non-existed" USB splitter.
> 
> ...



Just want to add one more advantage of wireless charging but this maybe a bit of personal consideration, so I left it out from the previous post in order to stay more focused on the wireless charging technologies.

I don't know if I am the odd one out, I had two USB-C connectors failure out of 3 previous mobile phones.  In both case. the problem started to surfaced after 1 year of extensive usage and the charging speed slowed down noticeablely.  Sometime I need to plug/unplug several time to engage quick charge.  That was a very high failure rate and all three mobile phones have dedicated 3.5mm phone out, so the USB port are used for charging primarily.  I was kind of worrying when I switch to Samsung S20 lately, this is my first mobile phone without 3.5mm phone out, so the USB-C port will cover both audio and charging.  I need a solution to slow down the tear and wear of the USB-C connector, to me the obvious choices are (Bluetooth headphone + wired charging) vs (Dongle DAC + wirelss charging). I believe this is a straight forward choice, especially when I have the RU6 at my disposal.  

Maybe if someone strart a discussion on the best wireless power bank, I'll gald to chime in.


----------



## discord (Dec 29, 2021)

emilsoft said:


> My ZX507 is unfortunately smashed by the the RU6...time for Sony to go back to the drawing board



I ended up returning my ZX507 to Amazon since I was still within the big holiday return period. The RU6 offers a more dynamic sound to me and a bit bigger staging. The Sony can be a bit congested to me.


----------



## emilsoft

discord said:


> I ended up returning my ZX507 to Amazon since I was still within the big holiday return period. The RU6 offers a more dynamic sound to me and a bit bigger staging. The Sony can be a bit congested to me.



ZX507 is unfortunately overpriced for the sound it offers - it has it's heart in the right place however with a nice coherent groovy sound, it just needs to give a little more for the asking price.. it's a lovely bit of kit though


----------



## Jawis

Andykong said:


> Glad to know it works out eventually.
> 
> What cable are you using right now?  The USB C-to-C cable bundled with RU6 didn't work for you?


I'm using a USB-A to Usb-C that I have for my other Audio gear.
I should try the provided cable,  but I left USB-A adapter at the office.  I can report back on it later.


----------



## kumar402

I had my doubts with burn in but I feel this dongle does improve and settle in after 100hrs or so. More cohesive and the upper mid push has mellowed down a bit and 300hz to 1.5Khz has come up just ever so slightly. Has anyone experienced the same or am I imagining?


----------



## sahmen

kumar402 said:


> I had my doubts with burn in but I feel this dongle does improve and settle in after 100hrs or so. More cohesive and the upper mid push has mellowed down a bit and 300hz to 1.5Khz has come up just ever so slightly. Has anyone experienced the same or am I imagining?


I can't say I have, but if you mean you're liking it more and more after 100hrs, then I am totally on board


----------



## emilsoft

I think my burn in time is getting close to 200 hours now - I'm still noticing subtle improvements; it's a little clearer and better defined, seems more reference now. I'm also keeping it powered up constantly


----------



## blotmouse

kumar402 said:


> I had my doubts with burn in but I feel this dongle does improve and settle in after 100hrs or so. More cohesive and the upper mid push has mellowed down a bit and 300hz to 1.5Khz has come up just ever so slightly. Has anyone experienced the same or am I imagining?


Ya man, whole thread since inception commenting on this.


----------



## Andykong

blotmouse said:


> Ya man, whole thread since inception commenting on this.



Since inception.  This is a good description.


----------



## Stuff Jones

@Andykong - What are the parameters that determine how much battery the RU6 draws and how much power it puts out based on source?

I find it sounds best from my laptop. Then next best is from my Shanling Q1. However from the Shanling Q1 it drains the battery super fast. Like maybe 3-4x as fast as playing music from the Q1. I don't remember this issue when I had the L&P W2. From my Google Pixel 4A, the battery drain is much slower but the sound is softer.


----------



## peterinvan

emilsoft said:


> I think my burn in time is getting close to 200 hours now - I'm still noticing subtle improvements; it's a little clearer and better defined, seems more reference now. I'm also keeping it powered up constantly


Keeping it powered up:
If the objective is to keep the DAC warm, would it do any harm to have it plugged into a 5v wall wart when not in use?  I will be using the RU6 from my iPad Pro (3rd gen).


----------



## kumar402

peterinvan said:


> Keeping it powered up:
> If the objective is to keep the DAC warm, would it do any harm to have it plugged into a 5v wall wart when not in use?  I will be using the RU6 from my iPad Pro (3rd gen).


I think it gets warm pretty quickly. May be couple of songs are all that needed.


----------



## Andykong (Feb 12, 2022)

Stuff Jones said:


> @Andykong - What are the parameters that determine how much battery the RU6 draws and how much power it puts out based on source?
> 
> I find it sounds best from my laptop. Then next best is from my Shanling Q1. However from the Shanling Q1 it drains the battery super fast. Like maybe 3-4x as fast as playing music from the Q1. I don't remember this issue when I had the L&P W2. From my Google Pixel 4A, the battery drain is much slower but the sound is softer.



I don't think RU6 will deliver MORE watt (power) when you switch from a current-limited iphone to a laptop or even desktop computer.  I won't doubt that RU6 can sound better from your laptop then your mobile phone, but is has nothing to do with how much power it put out, so there is some serious misundersatnding in your question and I can't answer that direclty.

So what can be the reasons behind the improved audio performance?

First of all, the integrity and quality of USB Audio output from  Window or MacOS based laptop, if setup probably, is better than Android or iOS based mobile phone.   The mobile phones are highly integrated product that put user experience way above audio quality (that's why SRC is a natural solutoin to them).

Secondly, clean and ample power supply will improve sound quality, and I mean improvement in qualitative terms, not quantitive terms like more output power.  It is like when you have a small DAC/Amp that come with a low cost switching power supply, and then you get a decent linear power supply to replace the bundled switching power supply, you can almost certain (99% in my opinion) that the DAC/Amp will sound better because of that.  For the record, some of the mobile phone limited the power darin from their USB-C connection to 100mA to 120mA only, but a fully compatible USB3.0 Type C connection from your computer should provide up to 1000mA (or 1A) power supply.  Try to connect a 2.5" portable HDD to your mobile phone and labtop and you can tell the different immediately.

IMHO, the USB digital audio qualtiy is a more important factor then USB-C power supply.  When I compare a Cayin DAP (N3Pro and N6ii) to my desktop PC as USB Audio source to RU6, I prefer DAP almost exclusively.  The USB-C of Cayin DAP will limit power output to 300mA only, so more power  is not necessarily the winner in this case.


----------



## drftr

@Andykong Andy, we've been discussing splitters more than just a little bit 😁 but that was always with the power going towards the _phone_. What would happen if instead the power goes to the RU6, as in putting the splitter in the dongle instead? We know it can take both signal and power through the same connection as that's what it takes from the phone. But what if we'd only feed it the signal from the phone (if possible) and the power from the socket? Would that work? Or would it refuse because the cable from the phone also keeps sending power? Just curious here.

drftr


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> @Andykong Andy, we've been discussing splitters more than just a little bit 😁 but that was always with the power going towards the _phone_. What would happen if instead the power goes to the RU6, as in putting the splitter in the dongle instead? We know it can take both signal and power through the same connection as that's what it takes from the phone. But what if we'd only feed it the signal from the phone (if possible) and the power from the socket? Would that work? Or would it refuse because the cable from the phone also keeps sending power? Just curious here.
> 
> drftr


Could you explain some laws of physics to help me understand how this works ? 

Phones have batteries which store energy and dissipate/transfer energy . I believe the batteries in phones are DC (direct current) when they are transferring energy (not in AC, the power that comes from wall charger would be AC). 

So, the solution you are proposing seems to be we need AC power passing through dongle to keep it active, but it does not explain how the energy is converted.

*The law of conservation of energy states that energy can neither be created nor destroyed - only converted from one form of energy to another*


----------



## drftr

ssriram2791 said:


> Could you explain some laws of physics to help me understand how this works ?
> 
> Phones have batteries which store energy and dissipate/transfer energy . I believe the batteries in phones are DC (direct current) when they are transferring energy (not in AC, the power that comes from wall charger would be AC).
> 
> ...


I'm exactly the last person on Earth you should ask questions like this...😯

drftr


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> I'm exactly the last person on Earth you should ask questions like this...😯
> 
> drftr


Sorry to ask these questions, but I have seen enough of these posts asking for some solution where the smartphone just sends bits (digital data through USB-C), but no energy is lost in return. 

In fact, I responded earlier to one of the posts asking if next iteration of this dongle will be self powered (that is in-built batteries) with this

*I think we should either ask smartphone manufacturers to provide replaceable batteries again (because of their greed, we are suffering) or make choices that could be detrimental to our wallet, but still we will retain our smartphone battery.*


----------



## kumar402

Over last few days I have been listening to ZMF VC and MDR Z1R out of Cayin RU6 and Shanling M3X And when I use ZMF I reach out for RU6 but with Sony I use M3X. I feel M3X has sweet vocal and is light in mid bass and that helps with Z1R.


----------



## emilsoft (Dec 30, 2021)

Cayin RU6 has just about made most of my other sources irrelevant for now (at least with IEMs) - including Chord Qutest and RME ADI 2. At home i'm running the RU6 exclusively out of ifi iusb micro with dual usb for clean power and that bring the performance high enough to challenge most of my other d/s posh sources in terms of enjoyment.

I've just spent a good time comparing my RME ADI 2 with the RU6 (+ iusb) with my Sony IERM7 - the RU6 is essentially on it's own planet, the r2r planet; it's sound signature is so different to my d/s DACs that it's beyond comparison really; It has huge wide mids, each note has weight and space around it and is projected within it's own aura/reverb, and each element/space is somehow linked to the rest in the music - they all interact in unity with synchronised timing (it all kind of clicks together like lego). This is all without sheen or roughness. Essentially what vinyl rig sound like.

I do feel the RU6 has slightly forward mids so some paring consideration might be needed. Of course it has some shortcomings -little bit of mid forwardness, could use little more sub bass and driving power, could be a little cleaner perhaps and better defined... but it makes music so groovy and enjoyable that comparisons with d/s dacs become irrelevant. I've always though d/s sources sounded kind a similar - from 100$ dongle to a 500$ dac; the dac might be say 20-30% better than the dongle in terms of technicalities but it will still sound like it's from the same family.. it's refreshing to have something that just sounds like it's form a different family, and it's opened a can of r2r worms for me where I likely won't consider another d/s source in a long time

Keep in mind as i've mentioned before, for me the iusb micro elevates things significantly, from this is a nice enough sweet dongle to a how is this tiny thing producing this sound..


----------



## sahmen

emilsoft said:


> Cayin RU6 has just about made most of my other sources irrelevant for now (at least with IEMs) - including Chord Qutest and RME ADI 2. At home i'm running the RU6 exclusively out of ifi iusb micro with dual usb for clean power and that bring the performance high enough to challenge most of my other d/s posh sources in terms of enjoyment.
> 
> I've just spent a good time comparing my RME ADI 2 with the RU6 (+ iusb) with my Sony IERM7 - the RU6 is essentially on it's own planet, the r2r planet; it's sound signature is so different to my d/s DACs that it's beyond comparison really; It has huge wide mids, each note has weight and space around it and is projected within it's own aura/reverb, and each element/space is somehow linked to the rest in the music - they all interact in unity with synchronised timing (it all kind of clicks together like lego). This is all without sheen or roughness. Essentially what vinyl rig sound like.
> 
> ...


If this is the Ifi Micro iUSB3.0 you're referring to, a photo of the whole set up would be nice. I would like to see how the connections between the RU6, the iUSB, and the source (computer/tablet/phone or DAP) are all rigged up, with cables and all, if it is not too much trouble... Sorry in advance for the inconvenience


----------



## emilsoft

sahmen said:


> If this is the Ifi Micro iUSB3.0 you're referring to, a photo of the whole set up would be nice. I would like to see how the connections between the RU6, the iUSB, and the source (computer/tablet/phone or DAP) are all rigged up, with cables and all, if it is not too much trouble... Sorry in advance for the inconvenience


Sure no problem - I have a dual usb cable - two usb ends going to iusb (one slot for which is just for the power), and the other end of the cable is one usb slot - i plug the RU6 in here with another short usb cable.


----------



## sahmen

emilsoft said:


> Sure no problem - I have a dual usb cable - two usb ends going to iusb (one slot for which is just for the power), and the other end of the cable is one usb slot - i plug the RU6 in here with another short usb cable.


Nice!  Thanks. I take it that only one of the three pictured silver-metallic Ifi boxes forms part of this rig; Is that assumption correct, or are the other two part of this particular RU6 chain as well?


----------



## econaut

What are your experiences concerning warm up and sound quality with the RU6?

I have done only one test which was inconclusive.


----------



## Andykong (Dec 31, 2021)

drftr said:


> @Andykong Andy, we've been discussing splitters more than just a little bit 😁 but that was always with the power going towards the _phone_. What would happen if instead the power goes to the RU6, as in putting the splitter in the dongle instead? We know it can take both signal and power through the same connection as that's what it takes from the phone. But what if we'd only feed it the signal from the phone (if possible) and the power from the socket? Would that work? Or would it refuse because the cable from the phone also keeps sending power? Just curious here.
> 
> drftr




I don't know enough about what's going opn inside the USB-C connector, so I have no idea if this is technically correct.





Assuming we have a USB-C to 2xUSB-C spliiter adapter.  There are 6 wires inside the two USB-C cable. If you can open the PVC cover of the USB cable that will connect RU6 to your mobile phone, and cut the two power conductors, this will stop the power supply from your phone to the RU6 "physically".  Theoretically if you connect a power bank to the another USB-C of the splitter adapter, RU6 will draw power from the power bank and data from your mobile phone.     If this experiement  failed, you lost your splitter, not a vey high cost experiment to play with.


----------



## NewEve (Dec 31, 2021)

Cayin's RU6 write-up (and two others) is up as well as here on Head-Fi.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Andykong said:


> IMHO, the USB digital audio qualtiy is a more important factor then USB-C power supply. When I compare a Cayin DAP (N3Pro and N6ii) to my desktop PC as USB Audio source to RU6, I prefer DAP almost exclusively. The USB-C of Cayin DAP will limit power output to 300mA only, so more power is not necessarily the winner in this case


The xDuoo X10T II should pair with RU6 nicely then.


----------



## emilsoft

Andykong said:


> I don't know enough about what's going opn inside the USB-C connector, so I have no idea if this is technically correct.
> 
> 
> 
> Assuming we have a USB-C to 2xUSB-C spliiter adapter.  There are 6 wires inside the two USB-C cable. If you can open the PVC cover of the USB cable that will connect RU6 to your mobile phone, and cut the two power conductors, this will stop the power supply from your phone to the RU6 "physically".  Theoretically if you connect a power bank to the another USB-C of the splitter adapter, RU6 will draw power from the power bank and data from your mobile phone.     If this experiement  failed, you lost your splitter, not a vey high cost experiment to play with.


The way I do it - get a two way usb cable, on one of the usb plugs (the one that will be used for data transfer from source), cover the data line using a scotch tape   https://www.instructables.com/USB-Condom/ - this example is how to make it power only, but you are interested in data only, so cover that data line explained here ( think it's the far right one in the usb plug).

This way you end up with one data and one for power transfer, the data one will not use the dirty power and for the other usb power only plug you can use battery or ifi iusb micro special usb slot that does clean power only


----------



## Currawong (Dec 31, 2021)

Hyde00 said:


> I'm also on the fence of pulling the trigger, but I also realize I have very specific taste so a lot of the time buying new dac/amp is like buying lottery for me LOL.
> 
> Some background information, I'm currently using Dragonfly Red with Denon D5200.  Recently acquired Burson Playmate 2 and also bought the V6 Vivids and V6 Classic opamp to try.  End up using the Playmate 2 stock opamp (LOL I know, I'll admit I have cheap taste, I think I like the ESS glare LOL, and I'll probably be the first one in history to admit this).
> 
> ...


I'd say you need different headphones. Trying to fix something you don't like about a pair of headphones with the amp and DAC is just not a good plan IMO.


Andykong said:


> I don't know if I am the odd one out, I had two USB-C connectors failure out of 3 previous mobile phones. In both case. the problem started to surfaced after 1 year of extensive usage and the charging speed slowed down noticeablely. Sometime I need to plug/unplug several time to engage quick charge. That was a very high failure rate and all three mobile phones have dedicated 3.5mm phone out, so the USB port are used for charging primarily. I was kind of worrying when I switch to Samsung S20 lately, this is my first mobile phone without 3.5mm phone out, so the USB-C port will cover both audio and charging. I need a solution to slow down the tear and wear of the USB-C connector, to me the obvious choices are (Bluetooth headphone + wired charging) vs (Dongle DAC + wirelss charging). I believe this is a straight forward choice, especially when I have the RU6 at my disposal.


One thing that annoys me about the EU directive to get Apple to replace the Lightning connector with USB-C is that the latter is simply such a weak connector in comparison. The USB-C connector on my 2016 MacBook is in poor condition, yet I have an iPhone 5 here that has an absolutely solid Lightning socket.


ssriram2791 said:


> I think we should either ask smartphone manufacturers to provide replaceable batteries again (because of their greed, we are suffering) or make choices that could be detrimental to our wallet, but still we will retain our smartphone battery.


They wont, because customers will swap in dodgy, cheap batteries from China, and then complain to the phone manufacturer when things stop working well. Not to mention warranty claims which people make. It's easier and way more cost-effective to restrict it.

Back to the RU6 though, it didn't want to play well with my iPhone 12 Pro Max, cutting out repeatedly. The W2 didn't fare much better though. I'm using the included Lightning to USB-C cable. I wonder if it is because the battery is below 50%, as it worked fine before, and it works fine out of my iPad Mini.

But it has been fun comparing it with the W2, albeit from a Hiby R6 2020. I've been managing to drive the DCA Stealth from both. I prefer the slightly more bloomy sound from the RU6 for preference, even if the W2 sounds a bit more precise, it's a touch less engaging for me.


----------



## Louisiana

Currawong said:


> Back to the RU6 though, it didn't want to play well with my iPhone 12 Pro Max, cutting out repeatedly. The W2 didn't fare much better though. I'm using the included Lightning to USB-C cable. I wonder if it is because the battery is below 50%, as it worked fine before, and it works fine out of my iPad Mini.



That's weird.
Last night I connected the RU6 to my iPhoneXS, and listened to music for about 2 hours, even in high gain mode since I had my VC connected.
No problems, the only thing I noticed was the Lightning connector gets very warm, almost hot.

All in all, I'm so excited about the little RU6 that I'm now thinking about buying the Cayin 6ii.


----------



## Stuff Jones (Dec 31, 2021)

Andykong said:


> I don't think RU6 will deliver MORE watt (power) when you switch from a current-limited iphone to a laptop or even desktop computer.  I won't doubt that RU6 can sound better from your laptop then your mobile phone, but is has nothing to do with how much power it put out, so tehre is some serious misundersatnding in your question and I can't answer that direclty.
> 
> So what can be the reasons behind the improved audio performance?
> 
> ...



Thank you for detailed reply. Any idea why the RU6 might be draining the battery so fast from my Shanling Q1? Is that likely an issue on your side or Shanling's side?

Also, I'm getting periodic freezing with foobar + RU6 Asio driver + Win11 when I change tracks. I have to unplug the RU6 and plug back in and then it works. Not sure if others have had this issue.


----------



## Jawis

Andykong said:


> Glad to know it works out eventually.
> 
> What cable are you using right now?  The USB C-to-C cable bundled with RU6 didn't work for you?




Brought back the adapter today.  The bundled cable and adapter runs the Cayin with Pi perfectly.  Will likely use the longer cable though.  The Cayin cable more useful for on-the-go use.


----------



## ian91

Not a bad little combo! Consistently impressed by the RU6...


----------



## drftr

emilsoft said:


> The way I do it - get a two way usb cable, on one of the usb plugs (the one that will be used for data transfer from source), cover the data line using a scotch tape   https://www.instructables.com/USB-Condom/ - this example is how to make it power only, but you are interested in data only, so cover that data line explained here ( think it's the far right one in the usb plug).
> 
> This way you end up with one data and one for power transfer, the data one will not use the dirty power and for the other usb power only plug you can use battery or ifi iusb micro special usb slot that does clean power only


Nice one! But I thought this probably shouldn't be necessary, because:

If a splitter can receive 1 power signal and divide it into 2, why wouldn't it be able to do it the other way around: Receive 2 power signals and combine them into 1.

There may be a mechanism preventing power to "flow back" though, but I would expect this mechanism to be in the power device though instead of in a simple cable.

drftr


----------



## musicday

Happy New Year everyone !


----------



## Hyde00

Currawong said:


> I'd say you need different headphones. Trying to fix something you don't like about a pair of headphones with the amp and DAC is just not a good plan IMO.


Lol unfortunately the sound I want in a headphone doesn't exist, that or if it exists will cost me too much money so I have to compensate a bit.

I'm basically looking for Grado sparkle with Denon / Fostex bass in a close back.

Right now D5200 + Dragonfly Red doesn't quite get there but it's "good enough" (85% there) and considering the price it's not bad at all.

I guess I'm just curious as to now RU6 will pair with D5200.


----------



## econaut

Hyde00 said:


> I'm basically looking for Grado sparkle with Denon / Fostex bass in a close back


Campfire Audio Cascade.


----------



## Hyde00

econaut said:


> Campfire Audio Cascade.


Ohhhh interesting, I'll check it out. Thanks!


----------



## Andykong (Jan 1, 2022)

Stuff Jones said:


> Thank you for detailed reply. Any idea why the RU6 might be draining the battery so fast from my Shanling Q1? Is that likely an issue on your side or Shanling's side?
> 
> Also, I'm getting periodic freezing with foobar + RU6 Asio driver + Win11 when I change tracks. I have to unplug the RU6 and plug back in and then it works. Not sure if others have had this issue.



It doesn't necessarily be an issue with RU6 or Shanling, it can be an natural outcome.  The Q1 is equiped with a 1100mAh battery, that is about  30% of a modern mobile phone only.  That means if someone can enjoy RU6 for 4-5 hours with his mobile phone, the Q1 probably will dran it battery after 1.2 to 1.5 hours.

The RU6 USB driver is optimised for Win 7, 8, 8.1 and 10,  We have tested it with our Win11 test station, it works fine so far, but we need more Win11 system installations to conduct testing and fine tune before we can certify (or update) the driver to support Win11.  For the record, although the RU6 driver was released 1 month after Win11 launch, it was developed with Windows 10 primarily.  Win11 is still very unstable from developers point of view and it might take a while before we can release a formal Win11 USB soluton for our DAP and Dongle DAC.


----------



## Andykong

drftr said:


> Nice one! But I thought this probably shouldn't be necessary, because:
> 
> If a splitter can receive 1 power signal and divide it into 2, why wouldn't it be able to do it the other way around: *Receive 2 power signals and combine them into 1.*
> 
> ...





drftr said:


> I'm exactly the last person on Earth you should ask questions like this...😯
> 
> drftr



Now I can understand why you are the last person on Earth when soemone ask you to explain what you believes will work under the laws of physics.   

While you can merge two water pipes into one bigger pipe, kind of similar to receive 2 "water supplies" and combine them into 1.  This is totally different when you want to apply "summation" concept to electrical energy.


----------



## Frombauge

Another USB/DAC dongle coming my way…just had to try an R2R in addition to my plethora of precise, somewhat clinical sounding ESS dongles of different makes…


----------



## alota (Jan 1, 2022)

I spoke with an italian friend about ru6. He is really happy like me. I'm quite happy with my iem and smartphone. My friend had better performance with large headphones with ru6 connected to a pc. The more power from usb drives better large headphones compared to usb from iphone.
My friend and i we have same impressions about the ru6. Same detail of delta sigma dongles but the sound with ru6 is more natural. The headstage is another good point on ru6


----------



## Currawong

It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.


----------



## alota

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.


same experience of my friend with denon


----------



## Hyde00

alota said:


> same experience of my friend with denon


Crap I have a Denon D5200, and was on the fence for a while.  Should I not buy it?

Though I'll run it off my PC which might supply more power so it might be ok......???


----------



## soundblast75 (Jan 1, 2022)

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.


That happens with W2 too.
Also, i tried with iems, also happens(Monarch 2)


----------



## kumar402

Currawong said:


> I'd say you need different headphones. Trying to fix something you don't like about a pair of headphones with the amp and DAC is just not a good plan IMO.
> 
> One thing that annoys me about the EU directive to get Apple to replace the Lightning connector with USB-C is that the latter is simply such a weak connector in comparison. The USB-C connector on my 2016 MacBook is in poor condition, yet I have an iPhone 5 here that has an absolutely solid Lightning socket.
> 
> ...


With my iPhone I never had drop out but ya the connector was getting warm may be due the power it was fetching from device


----------



## kumar402

Louisiana said:


> That's weird.
> Last night I connected the RU6 to my iPhoneXS, and listened to music for about 2 hours, even in high gain mode since I had my VC connected.
> No problems, the only thing I noticed was the Lightning connector gets very warm, almost hot.
> 
> All in all, I'm so excited about the little RU6 that I'm now thinking about buying the Cayin 6ii.


Finally I found someone using VC out of this. I really enjoyed the pairing. But I thought I might be the only one.


----------



## drftr

Andykong said:


> Now I can understand why you are the last person on Earth when soemone ask you to explain what you believes will work under the laws of physics.
> 
> While you can merge two water pipes into one bigger pipe, kind of similar to receive 2 "water supplies" and combine them into 1.  This is totally different when you want to apply "summation" concept to electrical energy.


Care to explain? The voltage remains the same whether you split or not so I assume it's the same for combining. You can make a light bulb work if you use power from 2 sockets while combining plus + and both - as well, so I'm really curious why it wouldn't work with a DAC. And seeing how many people have problems with drops on higher loads and volumes it's not like power isn't a problem.

drftr


----------



## kumar402

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.


It may be the power related. I remember someone complained of same problem earlier in thread of dropouts at high volume out of iPhone.


----------



## blotmouse

In my experience it's probably a problem on the Apple side. "problem" may not be the right word though if you ask them, lol.


----------



## alota

Hyde00 said:


> Crap I have a Denon D5200, and was on the fence for a while.  Should I not buy it?
> 
> Though I'll run it off my PC which might supply more power so it might be ok......???


i think is denon 9200. and the problem is with iphone. i don´t know with android


----------



## gikigill

Apple restricts power draw to 100ma hence the drop outs.


----------



## Hyde00

kumar402 said:


> It may be the power related. I remember someone complained of same problem earlier in thread of dropouts at high volume out of iPhone.





blotmouse said:


> In my experience it's probably a problem on the Apple side. "problem" may not be the right word though if you ask them, lol.





alota said:


> i think is denon 9200. and the problem is with iphone. i don´t know with android





gikigill said:


> Apple restricts power draw to 100ma hence the drop outs.


Ah ok then it's an iPhone problem, got it!

Phew I'm in the clear then lol (PC and Android).


----------



## alota

But now seriously. IMHO dongle is a dongle with inherent limitations due to type of product. If you want a complete hardware that drives large headphones so go to dap. Better batteries, more power!!!


----------



## twister6 (Jan 1, 2022)

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.



Amos, it does sound like you are hitting iPhone current limit for external peripheral device connection. The same happens with W2 and, coincidentally, a volume above 70 where iPhone starts to stutter. You can get one of those cheap usb-c current/voltage measuring tools you put in series with your phone/dongle and monitor the current spike as you increase the volume.


----------



## Hyde00

alota said:


> But now seriously. IMHO dongle is a dongle with inherent limitations due to type of product. If you want a complete hardware that drives large headphones so go to dap. Better batteries, more power!!!


Lol Denon D5200 is pretty easy to drive though. It's like 24 Ohm and high sensitivity (forgot exact number).

I was able to power it fine just straight from my Pixel 3A 3.5mm phone jack. Though Pixel 3A jack sounded pretty crap, the older Pixel 1 sounded much better, but that's story for another day.

Also I was splitting hair A/B my Dragonfly Red and Burson Playmate 2 (3.5W, Class A) for 2-3 weeks now. Basically I like Dragonfly Red TONAL balance better and Playmate 2 TECHNICALITY better. But even so it felt like splitting hair it's probably 5-10% difference.

So I'm convinced Denon don't need that much power? Also I had zero usable volume range with Playmate 2 it's like at volume 1 (out of 100) low gain it's already like 50% loud for me (assuming 80% loud is max "listenable" level). Night time I like something like 20-30% loud.

I think at this point I'm just a bit intrigued by the R2R aspect also want something with usable volume range LOL. I'm hoping this would be like a good middle ground???

Oh forgot to say this is for desktop use so no need for DAP lol.


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> Care to explain? The voltage remains the same whether you split or not so I assume it's the same for combining. You can make a light bulb work if you use power from 2 sockets while combining plus + and both - as well, so I'm really curious why it wouldn't work with a DAC. And seeing how many people have problems with drops on higher loads and volumes it's not like power isn't a problem.
> 
> drftr


Not sure what you are talking about... I don't have any problem with my Windows 10 laptop or Android phone regarding dropouts. I would like to know how many non-Apple users are experiencing problems as reported in this thread. 

Apple is a unicorn smartphone manufacturer that has developed their own proprietary USB technology which provides challenges/limitations on power consumption due to their OS battery management strategy. That is why Apple dongle (Apple users love their ecosystem, right ?) exists that can provide you measly 30 mW @ 32 ohms. 

RU6 provides 213 mW @ 32 ohms. That is about 6 to 10 dBA headroom, which is quite good for driving even moderately sensitive headphones (95-105 dB/mW) - Dynamic and Planar ones. 

Coming to the light bulb comment,  are we talking about alternating current (as in the power that comes to your home from power stations through transformer) or direct current (batteries) ?  How is light bulb and DAC/amplifier circuits related in terms of how they can be powered ?


----------



## drftr

ssriram2791 said:


> How is light bulb and DAC/amplifier circuits related in terms of how they can be powered ?


The underlying question is what happens if the RU6 receives power from both the socket and the smartphone. Are they both accepted? Is one blocked? Does the thing explode?

The question was asked because it would be more efficient to power the dongle from the socket while using the smartphone for signal, versus first charging the smartphone then listen until it's empty, charge again, etcetera. If we're not longer depending on smartphone charging ot would remove one hurdle. Especially because some people may want to use the phone at the same time as listening because then the power would just vanish even quicker. Another example is that at the end of a listening session you suddenly have to go BUT your phone's battery is almost empty. Same charging situation.

It's like when you connect your smartphone to a tablet and get the choice between only accepting data from the tablet or data + power.

Yes, I know we can all buy a power bank plus a wireless charger, etcetera. But this is a portable device for a reason. If it doesn't have to be portable we'd possibly pick up a different device with more headroom. So ideally the use case should define the trade-offs.

drftr


----------



## Currawong

twister6 said:


> Amos, it does sound like you are hitting iPhone current limit for external peripheral device connection. The same happens with W2 and, coincidentally, a volume above 70 where iPhone starts to stutter. You can get one of those cheap usb-c current/voltage measuring tools you put in series with your phone/dongle and monitor the current spike as you increase the volume.


I might have to get one of those at some point. It's a pity, as the 12 Pro Max has quite a large battery.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

I have been using my RU6 with the iPhone 13 mini with no problem or stuttering. But my volume doesn’t pass 35 with any of my IEMs. 

the ultimate portability stack would be to add the magsafe powerbank.


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> The underlying question is what happens if the RU6 receives power from both the socket and the smartphone. Are they both accepted? Is one blocked? Does the thing explode?
> 
> The question was asked because it would be more efficient to power the dongle from the socket while using the smartphone for signal, versus first charging the smartphone then listen until it's empty, charge again, etcetera. If we're not longer depending on smartphone charging ot would remove one hurdle. Especially because some people may want to use the phone at the same time as listening because then the power would just vanish even quicker. Another example is that at the end of a listening session you suddenly have to go BUT your phone's battery is almost empty. Same charging situation.
> 
> ...


Does tablet have a battery ? Does phone have a battery ? If Tablet or Phone are capable of charging each other and also transferring data simultaneously, the one common thing that exists is source of power which is called "Battery".

Why cant you say that you need a battery inside a so-called dongle ?


----------



## drftr

ssriram2791 said:


> Why cant you say that you need a battery inside a so-called dongle ?


Because that option is not available I'm looking for the 2nd best option.

drftr


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> Because that option is not available I'm looking for the 2nd best option.
> 
> drftr


I think the 2nd option looks like a pipe dream  and no manufacturer would seriously waste their time doing that (rather they can focus making internal components of the dongle more efficient). This is just one person's opinion. I will tip off my hat to you if some one really pulls off your 2nd option (looks long shot to me).

I can still see a situation where may be dongles have batteries (hate them if so, because dimension of the dongle increases significantly), but in firmware you may have an option of enabling charge using phone or using the battery from the dongle itself. This has been successfully implemented by Centrance for their Hifi-M8 V2 DAC/Amp (which looks like a DAP or bigger than that)


----------



## Hyde00 (Jan 1, 2022)

ssriram2791 said:


> I think the 2nd option looks like a pipe dream  and no manufacturer would seriously waste their time doing that (rather they can focus making internal components of the dongle more efficient). This is just one person's opinion. I will tip off my hat to you if some one really pulls off your 2nd option (looks long shot to me).
> 
> I can still see a situation where may be dongles have batteries (hate them if so, because dimension of the dongle increases significantly), but in firmware you may have an option of enabling charge using phone or using the battery from the dongle itself. This has been successfully implemented by Centrance for their Hifi-M8 V2 DAC/Amp (which looks like a DAP or bigger than that)


Dongle with battery like Chord Mojo?

Though I wonder at that point is it easier to get something like BTR5 or Qudelix 5k and call it a day lol.

*EDIT:* ah I see he want it to double as power bank. Then Mojo is out of the option.


----------



## drftr

Hyde00 said:


> Dongle with battery like Chord Mojo?
> 
> Though I wonder at that point is it easier to get something like BTR5 or Qudelix 5k and call it a day lol.
> 
> *EDIT:* ah I see he want it to double as power bank. Then Mojo is out of the option.


? Not me... Unfortunately this happens when people respond that don't have an answer so I can't blame you! 

I think only Andy can answer the original question.

drftr


----------



## ssriram2791

Hyde00 said:


> Dongle with battery like Chord Mojo?
> 
> Though I wonder at that point is it easier to get something like BTR5 or Qudelix 5k and call it a day lol.
> 
> *EDIT:* ah I see he want it to double as power bank. Then Mojo is out of the option.


Exactly.. this is what I have been saying throughout this thread (if you look up my other posts)... 

What's the point really in calling something like that a dongle (i.e one with a battery - self powered giant piece of slab hanging of my $1500 smartphone USB-C port, remember if it fails, I lose $1500 instead of $300 dongle) ? I am not discounting the chances of the 2nd option that is being proposed. I am not going to believe it will happen, until it really happens.


----------



## ssriram2791

drftr said:


> ? Not me... Unfortunately this happens when people respond that don't have an answer so I can't blame you!
> 
> I think only Andy can answer the original question.
> 
> drftr


Just to be clear, it is not that I don't have an answer (at least, I am looking for some physics around how things work in this world) , I don't see your proof of concept to be really working, until someone shows me that. 

Until then you don't have the answer either. No more debating this. Thanks!


----------



## CrocodileDundee

As Andy mentioned before. It’s IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone. The human being is never satisfied.


----------



## drftr

CrocodileDundee said:


> As Andy mentioned before. It’s IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone. The human being is never satisfied.


I agree on that, but Andy hasn't answered my question. Instead he made fun out of my water example. I prefer "I don't know" or "It's not possible" instead so that I can put it up for sale. I'm not here to waste anybody's time. I'm here to get my question answered, which I think should be possible on a forum. But if that's not acceptable then I have to give up.

drftr


----------



## Andykong (Jan 3, 2022)

drftr said:


> I agree on that, but Andy hasn't answered my question. Instead he made fun out of my water example. I prefer "I don't know" or "It's not possible" instead so that I can put it up for sale. I'm not here to waste anybody's time. I'm here to get my question answered, which I think should be possible on a forum. But if that's not acceptable then I have to give up.
> 
> drftr


It is not possible to the best of my knowledge.

Cayin  has no intention to develop similar product.

No further comment on anything related to this topic.  RU6 is designed to work within certain limitations.


----------



## drftr

If anyone is interested in a new RU6 please PM me. Preferably in EU. Tnx...

drftr


----------



## hoofman

@Andykong I love my RU6 because it is exactly what I was looking for: a reasonable size USB-C dongle that works with my phones and laptops, easy to operate, plug and play and ignore just enjoy the music, AND it uses power from my devices directly so I don't have to charge it to use! If we add an extra mechanism for power in like a power bank or smth and make it bigger thr RU6 may lose its main selling point.
IMHO the RU6 is a great tiny device, perfect as it is! Cayin gained a new fan 🥰!


----------



## gikigill

Currawong said:


> I might have to get one of those at some point. It's a pity, as the 12 Pro Max has quite a large battery.


https://thomas.vanhoutte.be/miniblo...os-13-this-accessory-requires-too-much-power/

Save your money mate, it's a known issue. The phone starts throttling the usb output and considering music does not have a uniform power requirement and changes beat to beat, it starts hitting the limiter and stuttering. 

Quite similar to VU meters hitting a hard clip.


----------



## Andykong

hoofman said:


> @Andykong I love my RU6 because it is exactly what I was looking for: a reasonable size USB-C dongle that works with my phones and laptops, easy to operate, plug and play and ignore just enjoy the music, AND it uses power from my devices directly so I don't have to charge it to use! If we add an extra mechanism for power in like a power bank or smth and make it bigger thr RU6 may lose its main selling point.
> IMHO the RU6 is a great tiny device, perfect as it is! Cayin gained a new fan 🥰!



From a product developer point of view,  the next viable step is a portable DAC/Amp similar to Chord Mojo.  Trying to provide a work around solution to dongle DAC is not a viable product concept because iPhone or even Android can change their power management policy and invalidate the workaround solution anytime.   Dongle DAC + portable DAC/Amp is a more reliable product combination that covers a larger customer base in our opinion.  

Having said that, Cayin didn't have a portable DAC/Amp in current R&D plan.  We just roll out the RU6 and we want to collect more information about this market before we make another move.  The semiconductor and and electronic component market is very volatile in past two years, we need to take our time to formulate new product in order to control our risk at acceptable level.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

drftr said:


> I agree on that, but Andy hasn't answered my question. Instead he made fun out of my water example. I prefer "I don't know" or "It's not possible" instead so that I can put it up for sale. I'm not here to waste anybody's time. I'm here to get my question answered, which I think should be possible on a forum. But if that's not acceptable then I have to give up.
> 
> drftr


My comment was not really pointed to you, as we had many different comments across many threads of new product releases with many different requests from the product being released. So it’s a general observation using Andy’s previous comment.


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> From a product developer point of view,  the next viable step is a portable DAC/Amp similar to Chord Mojo.  Trying to provide a work around solution to dongle DAC is not a viable product concept because iPhone or even Android can change their power management policy and invalidate the workaround solution anytime.   Dongle DAC + portable DAC/Amp is a more reliable product combination that covers a larger customer base in our opinion.
> 
> Having said that, Cayin didn't have a portable DAC/Amp in current R&D plan.  We just roll out the RU6 and we want to collect more information about this market before we make another move.  The semiconductor and and electronic component market is very volatile in past two years, we need to take our time to formulate new product in order to control our risk at acceptable level.


That makes perfect sense Andy. You have a great product in the RU6.  It is my perfect companion when I am on the road (together with my Hip Dac 2 though I tend to use the RU6 more often than not) whether this is plugged into my Win 10 PC or my iPhone.  I love the sound and cannot imagine life on the road without it!!! Just take our suggestions (and criticisms) here as our personal wish lists but ultimately you and your team and the best judge of what the next product should be.  Looking forward to it though!!!


----------



## SemiAudiophile (Jan 2, 2022)

Andykong said:


> From a product developer point of view,  the next viable step is a portable DAC/Amp similar to Chord Mojo.  Trying to provide a work around solution to dongle DAC is not a viable product concept because iPhone or even Android can change their power management policy and invalidate the workaround solution anytime.   Dongle DAC + portable DAC/Amp is a more reliable product combination that covers a larger customer base in our opinion.
> 
> Having said that, Cayin didn't have a portable DAC/Amp in current R&D plan.  We just roll out the RU6 and we want to collect more information about this market before we make another move.  The semiconductor and and electronic component market is very volatile in past two years, we need to take our time to formulate new product in order to control our risk at acceptable level.


R2R portable dac/amp with dedicated line out and Bluetooth LDAC/UAT transmission? 🙏 

Oh and tubes would be a bonus. Loved the way it was implemented on the N3Pro. It was perfect. 👌

Cayin R2D2


----------



## crizzle

I have the drop 2.5mm balanced cable for my hd600s. Would getting a balanced 4.4mm adapter be kosher with this dongle, or should i go ahead and get a dedicated 4.4?


----------



## kumar402

crizzle said:


> I have the drop 2.5mm balanced cable for my hd600s. Would getting a balanced 4.4mm adapter be kosher with this dongle, or should i go ahead and get a dedicated 4.4?


If you already have a good cable then just get an adapter.


----------



## sahmen (Jan 3, 2022)

crizzle said:


> I have the drop 2.5mm balanced cable for my hd600s. Would getting a balanced 4.4mm adapter be kosher with this dongle, or should i go ahead and get a dedicated 4.4?


I would imagine getting an adapter that would match the quality of the cable might be the easier and cheaper way to go.  This is probably also the mmost sensible choice.

On the other hand (since you asked), if you would like to up your game on the cable, and money is no object, then a higher quality aftermarket cable with a dedicated 4.4 termination might just be what the doctor ordered.

Not trying to diss your Drop cable by any means.  I'm just saying that one can often do a little or much better when it comes to stock cables provided by Drop. But then again, one can do a little or much better when it comes to everything else, including the headphones themselves, so this is neither here not there,.  These are just data points that you might find useful or not.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

crizzle said:


> I have the drop 2.5mm balanced cable for my hd600s. Would getting a balanced 4.4mm adapter be kosher with this dongle, or should i go ahead and get a dedicated 4.4?


Just get an Adapter, the sound quality improvements of a new cable would not be worth the cost.


----------



## TYATYA

crizzle said:


> I have the drop 2.5mm balanced cable for my hd600s. Would getting a balanced 4.4mm adapter be kosher with this dongle, or should i go ahead and get a dedicated 4.4?


You can search this one


----------



## dumpsterfire

Andykong said:


> From a product developer point of view,  the next viable step is a portable DAC/Amp similar to Chord Mojo.  Trying to provide a work around solution to dongle DAC is not a viable product concept because iPhone or even Android can change their power management policy and invalidate the workaround solution anytime.   Dongle DAC + portable DAC/Amp is a more reliable product combination that covers a larger customer base in our opinion.
> 
> Having said that, Cayin didn't have a portable DAC/Amp in current R&D plan.  We just roll out the RU6 and we want to collect more information about this market before we make another move.  The semiconductor and and electronic component market is very volatile in past two years, we need to take our time to formulate new product in order to control our risk at acceptable level.


Whatever you do, I think there will be good demand for a $400-$600 R2R portable device. Whether that's a DAC/amp or a DAP, just something that fills the gap in your product line from the $250 RU6 to the >$1k DAP with R2R module. Based on the performance of the RU6, I would absolutely be interested in a device that can be used with portable sources but also can scale up to desktops. I would never spend anywhere near $1k on a portable device like a DAP, so the existing R2R upgrade in your lineup is well out of consideration for me.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

kumar402 said:


> If you already have a good cable then just get an adapter.


disagree.  You can get a good balanced cable for $70.  Those adapters suck.  They don't last long and they lose connectivity pretty quickly.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

dumpsterfire said:


> Whatever you do, I think there will be good demand for a $400-$600 R2R portable device. Whether that's a DAC/amp or a DAP, just something that fills the gap in your product line from the $250 RU6 to the >$1k DAP with R2R module. Based on the performance of the RU6, I would absolutely be interested in a device that can be used with portable sources but also can scale up to desktops. I would never spend anywhere near $1k on a portable device like a DAP, so the existing R2R upgrade in your lineup is well out of consideration for me.


There is the RS6 available now.    Of course, everyone would prefer it if the price was $400-600 for that product.  Perhaps it's not profitable to make the product you want.


----------



## dumpsterfire

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> There is the RS6 available now.    Of course, everyone would prefer it if the price was $400-600 for that product.  Perhaps it's not profitable to make the product you want.


Part of it is that this is the first wave of R2R portable devices (that I'm aware of). First attempts of most things are going to be expensive. Usually that tech trickles down. What's interesting is that this trickled down from over $1k to $250. The only way I couldn't see a $400-$600 product in this line being viable would be if there's a big performance delta between the lower end transistors used in the RU6 and the higher end ones in the R01, with no real in between available. Even so, a larger form factor could allow for improvements in the power and output sections, allow for different implementation options, added value features, etc.


----------



## SemiAudiophile

I think having an all-in-one DAP is nice. But I still prefer using my phone's UI. And if not having a screen means shaving a few hundred dollars off the cost that would be welcome. 

Some instances I just want to connect the dac to an external desktop amp a screen isn't even needed. And I wouldn't have to worry about scratching it.


----------



## kumar402

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> disagree.  You can get a good balanced cable for $70.  Those adapters suck.  They don't last long and they lose connectivity pretty quickly.


If you have various amp and DAP with different output, it makes sense to get an adapter rather than changing cable in headphone and in process damaging the headphone connector someday. Quality adapters don’t suck


----------



## gr8soundz

dumpsterfire said:


> Part of it is that this is the first wave of R2R portable devices (that I'm aware of). First attempts of most things are going to be expensive. Usually that tech trickles down. What's interesting is that this trickled down from over $1k to $250. The only way I couldn't see a $400-$600 product in this line being viable would be if there's a big performance delta between the lower end transistors used in the RU6 and the higher end ones in the R01, with no real in between available. Even so, a larger form factor could allow for improvements in the power and output sections, allow for different implementation options, added value features, etc.



Hifiman already did it at 599 with the R2R2000 red (dap) and the HM1000 red (screenless dac/amp/player). I have the HM1000 but, as many have experienced with Hifiman's questionable QC, my first one had some issues.

Afaik, both are discontinued but there was also the new HM-901R. No screen like the HM1000 so also requires smartphone app for full use but it has a new R2R chip of their design plus it has swappable amp cards like their first portables from a decade or so ago.


----------



## Bitsir (Jan 3, 2022)

My comparison of Cayin Ru6 & Ovidius B1.

Out of phone with 3.2 USB-C using UM MEST MK2 & TinHifi T3+.

Cayin RU6 (NOS)

Forward, visceral, raw, snappy, immediate, natural, textured, midcentric, large, spacious, cohesive, layered, dynamic, vibrant, clear, high PRaT (fast, great timing).

Ovidius B1

Laid back, smooth, processed, polished, neutral, separated, contained.




There is a huge difference in how the music is presented here. The RU6 pulls you into one room where you’re inside a cohesive performance, each instrument occupying one large space (intimately around your head) and fighting for the space. It’s very visceral & chaotic and it gets your attention. This is not for background listening in my opinion.

The B1 by contrast presents music with each instrument being contained inside its own little pocket dimension. This hurts cohesiveness but greatly increases sense of separation and it organizes the music for you. The end result feels like you’re peering at the music from a distance as opposed to being inside it.

With the B1 you may be getting a slightly better understanding of the music as everything is neatly in its own space and not echoing outward over the entire soundstage. It is easy to listen to at all times with a polished, smooth delivery of notes. It is not nearly as dramatic.

With the Ru6 you’re getting lots more exposure to the texture and surface detail but not as much detail in terms of intelligibility of the song - it’s not as organized or prepared if you will. It may offend at times with its raw quality. The dynamic pop is huge here and it excels especially with acoustic, live, natural music. Everything is given a sense of snap and immediacy that’s more akin to his sound unfolds In real life. So while it sounds more realistic, it can become fatiguing in the long run.

Bass

B1 seems to hit a bit harder with more authority but it’s not as wide and perhaps not as extend as Ru6.

Texture goes to Ru6.

Mids

B1 more balanced, neutral, nothing obviously recessed or forward.

Ru6 more forward, midcentric sound overall. Again, greater sense of texture. Every note sound more fleshed out and fully realized.

Treble

B1 has smooth extended treble with slightly higher sense of detail retrieval.

Ru6 has a rougher and sharper treble with emphasis in the presence region I believe. Not quite as detailed or extended yet it sounds far more realistic and engaging.

Stage

Stage width goes to Ru6 by virtue of its large instruments. It has natural, slightly longer decay to notes which helps it sounds more spacious.

B1 is crisper, drier, tighter. Stage is more focused and put together, more for analytical observation of the music.

Conclusion

I like the Ru6 a fair bit more, even out of the box. It offers a distinctly different take on music than chip DACs. It is intoxicating to listen to with a much higher engagement factor. Vocals especially have far more emotive power as if the vocal cords of the singer become more sensitive.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Currawong said:


> I'd say you need different headphones. Trying to fix something you don't like about a pair of headphones with the amp and DAC is just not a good plan IMO.
> 
> One thing that annoys me about the EU directive to get Apple to replace the Lightning connector with USB-C is that the latter is simply such a weak connector in comparison. The USB-C connector on my 2016 MacBook is in poor condition, yet I have an iPhone 5 here that has an absolutely solid Lightning socket.
> 
> ...


I’m a little late here, but the best scenario I have with my iPhone q2 pro max is hooking the camera adaptor to the phone so I can simultaneously charge the phone while listening. It takes the 100% portability out of it. But I’m OK with that.. also.. I have to use the apple factory charging cord. Nelken won’t work, I’ve tried… it’s like… it draws power from itself.

as a whole? I prefer listening to it from my iPad Pro 3rd Gen. I don’t have to worry about cutouts.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.


And this is what I’ve been screaming about for the last couple of weeks… and finally gave up.. and just settle. I’m glad you’re having this issue also, so I don’t feel alone. Thank you for speaking on this matter.


----------



## TYATYA

Bitsir said:


> My comparison of Cayin Ru6 & Ovidius B1.
> 
> Out of phone with 3.2 USB-C using UM MEST MK2 & TinHifi T3+.
> 
> ...


Mid centric, bloomy, warmmer, bolder when OS is selected, but sometimes NOS does the same effect.
So I want a fast switching button.
I generally use Os for vocal and Nos for instrumental


----------



## musicday

AMP3 UK opens tomorrow, for who have pre-ordered the RU-6.


----------



## peterinvan

Enjoying my new Cayin RU6 out of an iPad Pro.    
First impressions are that this is a "bright" DAC with very good ambiance, wide sound stage,  good PRAT and isolation.  Nice detail.
It easily drives my LCD-XCs (on high gain) and brightens up my Focal Elegias (on low gain).


----------



## Zachik

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> You can get a good balanced cable for $70.


Which would you recommend in the sub-$100 price range?


----------



## BaTou069

RU6 vs S9pro anyone?


----------



## Andykong

peterinvan said:


> Enjoying my new Cayin RU6 out of an iPad Pro.
> First impressions are that this is a "bright" DAC with very good ambiance, wide sound stage,  good PRAT and isolation.  Nice detail.
> It easily drives my LCD-XCs (on high gain) and brightens up my Focal Elegias (on low gain).



Amazing, another happy RU6 experience with fullsize planar.  I must say this is one of the most interesting pair, 28g RU6 with 677g~700g headphone.   

Are you using the 2020 or 2021 version of LCD-XC? or the original 2014 version?  Are they all rated at 101dB/mw?


----------



## Andykong

Goofyboy84 said:


> And this is what I’ve been screaming about for the last couple of weeks… and finally gave up.. and just settle. I’m glad you’re having this issue also, so I don’t feel alone. Thank you for speaking on this matter.



I thought you have drop-out when you charge and listen at the same time with non-Apple charging cable? When you use Cayin C-to-lightning cable directly, you didn't experience any drop  out?  Quite a different problem when compare to what  Currawong is dealing with.


----------



## Deders (Jan 5, 2022)

Andykong said:


> I thought you have drop-out when you charge and listen at the same time with non-Apple charging cable? When you use Cayin C-to-lightning cable directly, you didn't experience any drop  out?  Quite a different problem when compare to what  Currawong is dealing with.


They could be related.  I'm thinking that some of the USB splitters limit the power (can't remember which V or A, probably amps) to 1.0 instead of 1.2 like some phone manufacturers limit the usb ports

It sounds like both @Goofyboy84 and @Currawong are having the same symptoms, probably caused by not having enough power but for different reasons.

Edit: I should probably explain for those who don't want to trawl back through posts, Currywonga is experiencing dropouts when he plugs in headphones that need a lot of power, whereas Goodyboy and myself are experiencing dropouts when using USB splitters but not when plugged directly into the phone.

I've ordered a third splitter that was recommended a few pages back, I will update the post with a link.  Apparently other users in this forum swear by it, not at it, so worth a shot when it finally gets here from the states.

USB C OTG Adapter with Power, 2 in 1 USB C to USB with 60W PD Charging Adapter Compatible with iPad Pro, Dell XPS, Galaxy S21/S20+/Note10, Google Pixel 5/4XL Google Chromecast with Google TV https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09LM71CZ9/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_SVPNQBM32Q0VKMTQY2M7


----------



## Andykong

Bitsir said:


> My comparison of Cayin Ru6 & Ovidius B1.
> 
> Out of phone with 3.2 USB-C using UM MEST MK2 & TinHifi T3+.
> 
> ...



Thank you for your RU6 impression, glad you like the RU6, intoxicating to listen to with a much higher engagement factor is a very encouraging feedback, we hope you'll continue to enjoy the RU6 after 50 or 100 hours of usage.  

There are one point that I am not fully understand and I hope you don't mind if I ask for more detail.  Please be assured that I am not picking bone out of your reivew, I respect all user impressions and I don't think RU6 or any product can please everyone compeltely, so even negative impression are valuble contribution as long as they are sincere and impartial sharing.

You said the RU6 is very visceral and "it gets your attention. This is not for background listening in my opinion."  which I undertand and shared the same view, but you also mentioned "chaotic" here and this is where I am confused.  This is the first time I saw visceral & chaotic together in the same impression description. In my expereince, when something is  chaotic, I find it difficult to focus and lost attention very quickly, so maybe we have different meaning of chaotic? or response to chaotic differently? I am kind of worry that this is part of my inadequacy in English so I wan to take this opportunity to rectify my mistake.


----------



## Andykong (Jan 5, 2022)

Deders said:


> They could be related.  I'm thinking that some of the USB splitters limit the power (can't remember which V or A, probaky amps) to 1.0 instead of 1.2 like some phone manufacturers limit the usb ports
> 
> It sounds like both @Goofyboy84 and @Currawong are having the same symptoms, probably caused by not having enough power but for different reasons.
> 
> ...



Not exactly, he was using Apple camear adapter at that time.  He returned the adapter but later he bought the adapter again becuse he test the setup in Apple store and everything works fine when he used a apple factory charging cord.  Apparantly the Apple adapter didn't like his Nelken charging cord and causing the problem, its the famous  protection mechanism in Apple ecosystem.


----------



## Andykong

Currawong said:


> It seems my drop-out problems are definitely an issue with full-sized headphones and higher volume settings. At 70 in high gain with the Stealth, I get drop-outs if I use my iPhone. Dropping it down below 60 and the cut-outs stop, as does using my iPad or a DAP instead. Of course, this isn't a problem with IEMs.





gikigill said:


> https://thomas.vanhoutte.be/miniblo...os-13-this-accessory-requires-too-much-power/
> 
> Save your money mate, it's a known issue. The phone starts throttling the usb output and considering music does not have a uniform power requirement and changes beat to beat, it starts hitting the limiter and stuttering.
> 
> Quite similar to VU meters hitting a hard clip.



I do encourage Currawong to acquire one of those usb-c current/voltage measuring tool suggested by Alex.  As a reviewer, he need to prove and show the problem to his YouTubew audience after founding an answer to a question, especially when the demonstration is not difficult or expensive to achieve.


----------



## kumar402

Andykong said:


> Amazing, another happy RU6 experience with fullsize planar.  I must say this is one of the most interesting pair, 28g RU6 with 677g~700g headphone.
> 
> Are you using the 2020 or 2021 version of LCD-XC? or the original 2014 version?  Are they all rated at 101dB/mw?


No one can beat me with the contrast in weight of headphone and DAC/AMP. I’m using Ironwood Verite closed with this. As the name suggest it is ironwood


----------



## Andykong

SemiAudiophile said:


> R2R portable dac/amp with dedicated line out and Bluetooth LDAC/UAT transmission? 🙏
> 
> Oh and tubes would be a bonus. Loved the way it was implemented on the N3Pro. It was perfect. 👌
> 
> Cayin R2D2



So we moved from a minimalist, "back-to-old-school"  to a modern full-fetch swiss knife?   

When someone suggested we should add a battery to the "Dongle", I did give it a try before I say No.   The height increased from 13.5mm to 22mm, the weighted increased from 28g to 80g,  I listened to Youtube for a while, try to browse and select songs in between.  I can't convince myself to draft a proposal to R&D for something like this.


----------



## Frombauge (Jan 5, 2022)

Finally (and after swift DHL delivery) got my RU6 from @MusicTeck …first impressions are positive and promising…high resolving, airy, natural, musical with excellence PRaT…need another week to make a more detailed assessment of the RU6 compared to my other ESS-based dongles…BTW no clipping when changing between open apps on my phone (unlike e.g. THX Onyx)…


----------



## Blanka79

Using the Cayin RU6 with my iPhone, iPad and MacBook. It sounds awesome. Sometimes I think a nice DAP would be nice too. I have had the N3 Pro. It was great. Still not sure if steaming is better/worse than buying my music... I would love to see a DAP that is like the N3 Pro but with Apple Music support... The RU6 will stay anyway  Great product!


----------



## NewEve

Anyone here could compare the RU6 in NOS with Lotoo's PAW 6000?


----------



## NewEve (Jan 5, 2022)

@Andykong A midrange DAP with RU6's tech inside, 4 inch screen, good battery life and a bit more power will be a home run which will sell better than the N3 Pro.

Just saying  (But if you end-up making one, do send me a sample at least, deal  ?)


----------



## kumar402

Blanka79 said:


> Using the Cayin RU6 with my iPhone, iPad and MacBook. It sounds awesome. Sometimes I think a nice DAP would be nice too. I have had the N3 Pro. It was great. Still not sure if steaming is better/worse than buying my music... I would love to see a DAP that is like the N3 Pro but with Apple Music support... The RU6 will stay anyway  Great product!


 Hopefully we will get NuTubes and R2R in DAP at a good price point


----------



## Blanka79

NewEve said:


> Anyone here could compare the RU6 in NOS with Lotoo's PAW 6000?


That is the DAP i might buy…


----------



## Deders

kumar402 said:


> Hopefully we will get NuTubes and R2R in DAP at a good price point





Andykong said:


> So we moved from a minimalist, "back-to-old-school"  to a modern full-fetch swiss knife?
> 
> When someone suggested we should add a battery to the "Dongle", I did give it a try before I say No.   The height increased from 13.5mm to 22mm, the weighted increased from 28g to 80g,  I listened to Youtube for a while, try to browse and select songs in between.  I can't convince myself to draft a proposal to R&D for something like this.


Queue pictures like this but with tubes either side


----------



## CrocodileDundee

kumar402 said:


> Hopefully we will get NuTubes and R2R in DAP at a good price point


Not sure aboute "good" price point...but Cayin N8II is just around the corner and will probable tick those boxes.


----------



## kumar402

CrocodileDundee said:


> Not sure aboute "good" price point...but Cayin N8II is just around the corner and will probable tick those boxes.


Ya but it may be in the range of $3K. I’m more of ~ $1K guy for portable setup


----------



## hoofman

Andykong said:


> When someone suggested we should add a battery to the "Dongle", I did give it a try before I say No.   The height increased from 13.5mm to 22mm, the weighted increased from 28g to 80g,  I listened to Youtube for a while, try to browse and select songs in between.  I can't convince myself to draft a proposal to R&D for something like this.


LOL This is the best way to demonstrate what you said in the previous post.


Andykong said:


> From a product developer point of view,  the next viable step is a portable DAC/Amp similar to Chord Mojo.  Trying to provide a work around solution to dongle DAC is not a viable product concept because iPhone or even Android can change their power management policy and invalidate the workaround solution anytime.   Dongle DAC + portable DAC/Amp is a more reliable product combination that covers a larger customer base in our opinion.
> 
> Having said that, Cayin didn't have a portable DAC/Amp in current R&D plan.  We just roll out the RU6 and we want to collect more information about this market before we make another move.  The semiconductor and and electronic component market is very volatile in past two years, we need to take our time to formulate new product in order to control our risk at acceptable level.


Cayin already has the N3Pro which can be used in USB/DAC mode, so I guess the new DAC/Amp may need to be somewhere between the RU6 or the N3Pro, or something very different. That is tough. Still I'm very interested to see how the future will unfold in this segment. Please keep us update Andy. Now back to my RU6 and


----------



## twister6

CrocodileDundee said:


> Not sure aboute "good" price point...but Cayin N8II is just around the corner and will probable tick those boxes.



Some of the N8ii design details are here. Dual NuTube, New DAC, but not R2R.


----------



## Andykong

NewEve said:


> @Andykong A midrange DAP with RU6's tech inside, 4 inch screen, good battery life and a bit more power will be a home run which will sell better than the N3 Pro.
> 
> Just saying  (But if you end-up making one, do send me a sample at least, deal  ?)




We have three models in our DAP line up.  The N3Pro is our "entry-level", N6ii is our midrange DAP, and N8 is our flagshp and soon to be replaced by N8ii.  What you said is certainly feasible, technically.


----------



## Andykong

Deders said:


> Queue pictures like this but with tubes either side


and 4x18650 because tubes drain a lot of current?

I see, we moved to a C9 with R01 bundle?


----------



## Bitsir

Andykong said:


> Thank you for your RU6 impression, glad you like the RU6, intoxicating to listen to with a much higher engagement factor is a very encouraging feedback, we hope you'll continue to enjoy the RU6 after 50 or 100 hours of usage.
> 
> There are one point that I am not fully understand and I hope you don't mind if I ask for more detail.  Please be assured that I am not picking bone out of your reivew, I respect all user impressions and I don't think RU6 or any product can please everyone compeltely, so even negative impression are valuble contribution as long as they are sincere and impartial sharing.
> 
> You said the RU6 is very visceral and "it gets your attention. This is not for background listening in my opinion."  which I undertand and shared the same view, but you also mentioned "chaotic" here and this is where I am confused.  This is the first time I saw visceral & chaotic together in the same impression description. In my expereince, when something is  chaotic, I find it difficult to focus and lost attention very quickly, so maybe we have different meaning of chaotic? or response to chaotic differently? I am kind of worry that this is part of my inadequacy in English so I wan to take this opportunity to rectify my mistake.


Thank you for your kind words! If anyones English is inadequate, it is mine.  I should mention that I only have 5-6 hours on it so far, I will be burning it in overnight from now on.

Let me try to clarify; 
When I said "chaotic" in that context, I mean that in a _positive light_ as I find it to be very immersive. I find the RU6 to be chaotic in the sense that every instrument sound as if they share ONE and the same space, so when there is a lot going on, you are being "assaulted" by instrumental images so large that you sense the _texture_ of the instrument before you sense the contour of the instrument. 
Hope that makes sense. 
In addition, the great dynamism of RU6 makes everything POP and has this exciting sense of immediacy to it. 

With the B1, each instrument is "confined" inside its own little room, offering a more neatly organized presentation of music and is less chaotic, but it also ends up sounding neutered and less coherent by comparison. It's less of a "performance" happening in your head (RU6) and more of a processed, artificial composition of individual instruments together doing their best to form an impression of the song.


----------



## crizzle

for installing the drivers with a mac, can i complete the task just using Crossover, or do i  need to run Parallels?


----------



## BaTou069

crizzle said:


> for installing the drivers with a mac, can i complete the task just using Crossover, or do i  need to run Parallels?


You need a driver for Mac? Just ordered a RU6 from Cayins AliExpress store hope it’s not a PITA to get them working


----------



## blotmouse

Mac's are driverless. It's plug and play.


----------



## BaTou069

Did anyone hear a difference from temperature changes? I live in a hot country where ppl tend to freeze the inside with ac. I wonder if that will influence the sound


----------



## TYATYA (Jan 5, 2022)

BaTou069 said:


> Did anyone hear a difference from temperature changes? I live in a hot country where ppl tend to freeze the inside with ac. I wonder if that will influence the sound


I don’t heard the difference or did not focus on it so didn't heard it.
Btw, just few times Ru6 reach apprx 38 Celcius.
IMO unless too wide changing of device's temperature, change of sq is quite small


----------



## gr8soundz

BaTou069 said:


> Did anyone hear a difference from temperature changes? I live in a hot country where ppl tend to freeze the inside with ac. I wonder if that will influence the sound



Not that I could detect which is rare among R2R dacs in my experience. Good thing since it's meant for portable use so no worries about warm-up or keeping it powered all the time.

Mine did get noticeably warmer when set to OS though.


----------



## bnupy

crizzle said:


> for installing the drivers with a mac, can i complete the task just using Crossover, or do i  need to run Parallels?


No.


----------



## Ufanco

Was thinking about the issue of charging and using a dongle at same time. I haven’t tested this but think in might work. Connect the c side to power then usb side with adapter to plug in the dongle.
https://www.amazon.com/MOSWAG-Adapt...c7301&pd_rd_wg=Ae4wB&pd_rd_i=B08Y6VQN99&psc=1


----------



## cleg

My video about RU6. In short, it's really good. But I think it's not surprising


----------



## dakchi

Hi,
I have a Dragonfly Cobalt dongle and have always been curious whether this Caryin dongle could provide me the same pleasing warm sound that I get from my Denafrips R2R Dac. If they managed to put the same R2R sound characteristics in such a small form factor, then I will pull the trigger right now and purchase one. Has anyone compared RU6 to Dragonfly dongles? does RU6 has the same warm 3D sound as its big R2R Dac brothers?
Thank you


----------



## rarewolf

Hello all from the Avalon Peninsula, Newfoundland … I’m new here, and thanks for the add…

With regard to the Cayin RU6, is anyone here familiar with JRiver’s Media Center, specifically using its media server and the iOS app JRemote for streaming the MC library to connected headphones? I’m currently using JRemote to simply stream to the iPhone (Xs), which works rather elegantly with the Soundblaster E5 Bluetooth DAC/Amp and Shure SRH940 headcans. I’m looking to upgrade…

That is, I’m particularly interested is the Cayin’s suggestion of bitstreaming to the DAC at the smartphone’s highest volume setting. Presently, I’m waiting for delivery next week, but I’ve posted a similar inquiry at the JRiver forum, to ask if anyone is familiar with JRemote and modern portable DAC’s, and also informing them that this is no ordinary DAC with respect to volume control. I had asked if the JRemote engineers could possibly add Cayin’s specifications to the app’s list of output devices. 

Looking forward…


----------



## teknorob23

dakchi said:


> Hi,
> I have a Dragonfly Cobalt dongle and have always been curious whether this Caryin dongle could provide me the same pleasing warm sound that I get from my Denafrips R2R Dac. If they managed to put the same R2R sound characteristics in such a small form factor, then I will pull the trigger right now and purchase one. Has anyone compared RU6 to Dragonfly dongles? does RU6 has the same warm 3D sound as its big R2R Dac brothers?
> Thank you



Yes I have and in a word no it doesn’t. It’s very good thought and has natural detailed sound, but the staging is wider and better separated on the dfc… imo


----------



## BaTou069

rarewolf said:


> Hello all from the Avalon Peninsula, Newfoundland


I heard they found a lot of gold nuggets in nuggetville 
Welcome


----------



## rarewolf

BaTou069 said:


> I heard they found a lot of gold nuggets in nuggetville
> Welcome


Thanks… and thanks for not mentioning what they found in Dildo…


----------



## Deders

rarewolf said:


> Hello all from the Avalon Peninsula, Newfoundland … I’m new here, and thanks for the add…
> 
> With regard to the Cayin RU6, is anyone here familiar with JRiver’s Media Center, specifically using its media server and the iOS app JRemote for streaming the MC library to connected headphones? I’m currently using JRemote to simply stream to the iPhone (Xs), which works rather elegantly with the Soundblaster E5 Bluetooth DAC/Amp and Shure SRH940 headcans. I’m looking to upgrade…
> 
> ...


I use Jriver, mostly for Video and DNLA audio but I'd assume that just like any other DAC that you wanted to bitstream to, you would use just use Wasapi or Asio instead of Windows default audio renderer?


----------



## rarewolf

Deders said:


> I use Jriver, mostly for Video and DNLA audio but I'd assume that just like any other DAC that you wanted to bitstream to, you would use just use Wasapi or Asio instead of Windows default audio renderer?


At my age, I choose to remain ignorant of how everything works, but I’m not sure why the Windows audio drivers would need to come into play at all. That is, the way JRemote “seemingly” works with the remote Media Center server is to only make the audio (and video) files available for iOS to play locally. For example, the server provides for an option to downsample (transcoding) to lower bitrate MP3 for slower household LANs (even WANs if you can get past the ISP’s modem). I disable the transcoding for streaming 24bit FLACs within the LAN, but have to admit I sometimes get cutouts for sample rates >96kHz (downstairs to upstairs). Like for Youtube video, JRemote offers 2 progress bars, one for “playing” progress and another that shows “streaming” progress. In any case, I cannot imagine how/why JRiver would necessarily involve any Windows drivers ^and^ offer transcoding for downsizing the bitstream(?)

I don’t really expect JRemote to fail at bitstreaming properly to the Cayin—at least not yet—but I did want to avoid the need of turning up the iPhone’s volume every time I settle in for listening. But, like I said, I’m largely ignorant, but I also don’t imagine the players for streaming services (e.g., Tidal) offering an output setting for untouched streaming to a DAC/Amp(?)

Another question for exposing the level of my ignorance is to ask how you all are “breaking in” your RU6. I imagine installing the Cayin’s Windows driver, plugging the RU6 into USB, and having JRiver throw a huge playlist at it. I could do the same via JRemote. The question is does it need a load like a speaker or amplifier?


----------



## Deders

rarewolf said:


> At my age, I choose to remain ignorant of how everything works, but I’m not sure why the Windows audio drivers would need to come into play at all. That is, the way JRemote “seemingly” works with the remote Media Center server is to only make the audio (and video) files available for iOS to play locally. For example, the server provides for an option to downsample (transcoding) to lower bitrate MP3 for slower household LANs (even WANs if you can get past the ISP’s modem). I disable the transcoding for streaming 24bit FLACs within the LAN, but have to admit I sometimes get cutouts for sample rates >96kHz (downstairs to upstairs). Like for Youtube video, JRemote offers 2 progress bars, one for “playing” progress and another that shows “streaming” progress. In any case, I cannot imagine how/why JRiver would necessarily involve any Windows drivers ^and^ offer transcoding for downsizing the bitstream(?)
> 
> I don’t really expect JRemote to fail at bitstreaming properly to the Cayin—at least not yet—but I did want to avoid the need of turning up the iPhone’s volume every time I settle in for listening. But, like I said, I’m largely ignorant, but I also don’t imagine the players for streaming services (e.g., Tidal) offering an output setting for untouched streaming to a DAC/Amp(?)
> 
> Another question for exposing the level of my ignorance is to ask how you all are “breaking in” your RU6. I imagine installing the Cayin’s Windows driver, plugging the RU6 into USB, and having JRiver throw a huge playlist at it. I could do the same via JRemote. The question is does it need a load like a speaker or amplifier?


Apologies I missed the reference to iOS, read all the other references assumed that you would be using it like I use DACs and plugging it directly into a Windows machine.

It seems that you are streaming via DNLA to your phone using their remote app. Whether that app can bitstream or not over USB will be up to Jriver, but if it can't the next best thing is having the volume all the way up on your phone.

As for burning in, I would assume that having something for it to amplify would be required?


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 7, 2022)

Louisiana said:


> Last night I connected the RU6 to my iPhoneXS, and listened to music for about 2 hours, even in high gain mode since I had my VC connected.


Which iOS app are you using as the player, and are the audio files local to your iPhone Xs or are they being streamed from a server (e.g., DNLA)? Or, are you playing a service (e.g., Tidal)?

Edit: I was looking at the DNLA players available at the iOS appstore, and I saw Neutron mentioned before in this thread. Is anyone with a RU6 familiar with Neutron (iOS)?


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Hi everyone! Does this dongle support volume adjusting and phone calls via inline mic and remote control on the headset?


----------



## Garney

Popping in to sing more praises for the RU6. New-to-me unit came in yesterday courtesy of another Head-Fier (kindly pre-burned in with 200 hours on the clock) and I've been using it with the Timeless via an HP laptop. This my first experience with R2R, and a dongle DAC/AMP for that matter, and I'm flat out impressed with just how good this little unit is. NOS has been my flavor of choice thus far and will most likely be my main mode for most music.

Awaiting delivery of an interconnect with a 4.4mm termination for my LCD-2's and can't wait to hear how full size cans sound fed from the RU6.

@Andykong - My kudos to you and the team at Cayin!


----------



## Louisiana

rarewolf said:


> Which iOS app are you using as the player, and are the audio files local to your iPhone Xs or are they being streamed from a server (e.g., DNLA)? Or, are you playing a service (e.g., Tidal)?



I listened to music with the iPhone XS and iPad Air4 via Tidal and Qobuz, as well as via ROON.
All without problems, only the Lightning -> USB C cable gets very hot at the Lightning port.


----------



## rarewolf

10 minutes after kicking myself for not opting for expedited delivery, a text arrives letting me know my Cayin RU6 has been delivered. Lots o’ kudos for the Headphone Bar (Vancouver BC) for getting it into the outgoing mail late Wednesday and for Canada Post for delivery to St John’s 4 days early in spite of bad weather. 

Currently listening to Fleetwood Mac’s “Rumours” (192kHz), and via JRemote it sounds great, but keep in mind I can only relate to the iPhone’s own DAC and that of the Soundblaster E5. The RU6 provides for a much more comfortable sound, voices are intimately close, and the stage it sets is all around me (Shure SRH940 headcans). 

The RU6 is reporting ‘192kHz’ (NOS), and the only question at this point is that I had thought the RU6 would report the oversampling but it instead reports the original sampling. It appears I was totally wrong to doubt JRiver’s implementation of JRemote delivering an accurate bitstream, although the iPhone still has control of the volume. 

I’m using Cayin’s own OTG cable, and not hearing any dropouts with RU6 set for ‘low gain’ and volume ‘75’ which is a listening level just right for me. Large files (192kHz) are streaming perfectly well, but then, I’m downstairs near the primary mesh router.

Breaking in begins today. Life is good!


----------



## peterinvan (Jan 7, 2022)

Garney said:


> Popping in to sing more praises for the RU6. New-to-me unit came in yesterday courtesy of another Head-Fier (kindly pre-burned in with 200 hours on the clock) and I've been using it with the Timeless via an HP laptop. This my first experience with R2R, and a dongle DAC/AMP for that matter, and I'm flat out impressed with just how good this little unit is. NOS has been my flavor of choice thus far and will most likely be my main mode for most music.
> 
> Awaiting delivery of an interconnect with a 4.4mm termination for my LCD-2's and can't wait to hear how full size cans sound fed from the RU6.
> 
> @Andykong - My kudos to you and the team at Cayin!


I got the HEDDPhone 4.4mm cable for my LCD-XC (2019) at $99 CAD.
Enjoying this DAC for it's sound stage, detail retrieval, and isolation of instruments.
NOS sounds better to my ears.
It is attached to my iPad Pro all day.


----------



## Garney

peterinvan said:


> I got the HEDDPhone 4.4mm cable for my LCD-XC (2019) at $99 CAD.
> Enjoying this DAC for it's sound stage, detail retrieval, and isolation of instruments.
> NOS sounds better to my ears.
> It is attached to my iPad Pro all day.


That's good to hear! I have a cable I use with LCD-2 currently that terminates to mini-XLR and utilizes short (~6") interconnects to swap termination types. 

How's the volume headroom when using with the LCD-XC? I've only tried the RU6 with IEMs so far (Timeless and Nio) and I haven't felt the need to go higher than 45 on low gain.


----------



## Louisiana

RU6 & LP6K & HEKSE 

Nice!


----------



## sahmen

Louisiana said:


> RU6 & LP6K & HEKSE
> 
> Nice!


Aaaand how does the rig sound?


----------



## Louisiana

sahmen said:


> Aaaand how does the rig sound?


Absolutely clear and "true to nature", I think here you say organic?
I listen to a lot of music with stringed instruments, the reproduction of these is wonderful, as well as female voices almost always give me goosebumps.

However, to listen with the HEKSE, I have to set the RU6 to high gain, then I move around 70 - 75dB, depending on the recording quality.


----------



## Blanka79

Louisiana said:


> Absolutely clear and "true to nature", I think here you say organic?
> I listen to a lot of music with stringed instruments, the reproduction of these is wonderful, as well as female voices almost always give me goosebumps.
> 
> However, to listen with the HEKSE, I have to set the RU6 to high gain, then I move around 70 - 75dB, depending on the recording quality.





Louisiana said:


> RU6 & LP6K & HEKSE
> 
> Nice!


Hello. Nice Player. The one I am considering to buy. The RU6 six is already mine 
One question. Why would you buy such a great DAP and connect a dongle DAC to it? This is really something, I don't understand at the moment. Isn't the DAC in the LP6K not already great?

Thank you in advance


----------



## Louisiana

Blanka79 said:


> Hello. Nice Player. The one I am considering to buy. The RU6 six is already mine
> One question. Why would you buy such a great DAP and connect a dongle DAC to it? This is really something, I don't understand at the moment. Isn't the DAC in the LP6K not already great?
> 
> Thank you in advance


Hi 

That I connected the RU6 to the LP6K was more for fun, for the photo.
I bought the RU6 in mid-December, and was so excited about the concept of being able to listen to my music "mobile", that I bought the Lotoo.

The RU6 is already for sale on EKA.


----------



## Blanka79

Louisiana said:


> Hi
> 
> That I connected the RU6 to the LP6K was more for fun, for the photo.
> I bought the RU6 in mid-December, and was so excited about the concept of being able to listen to my music "mobile", that I bought the Lotoo.
> ...


Thank you 👍


----------



## peterinvan

Garney said:


> That's good to hear! I have a cable I use with LCD-2 currently that terminates to mini-XLR and utilizes short (~6") interconnects to swap termination types.
> 
> How's the volume headroom when using with the LCD-XC? I've only tried the RU6 with IEMs so far (Timeless and Nio) and I haven't felt the need to go higher than 45 on low gain.


Using low gain, NOS,  I find that 40-55 on the volume is loud enough.


----------



## rarewolf

This DAC/Amp has impressed me so much I think ill upgrade my headcans. But, only after doing a bit of research as to how to match the characteristics of this DAC with over-ear closed-back headcans. Some of the concerns here in this thread have raised at least one question as to how far I can go. 

Those concerns are about the limitations Apple has apparently put on the lightning connector regarding how much power it can supply. That is, last night I experienced some cutouts at higher volumes than used the night before. Those settings were gain=low volume=75, and provided a relatively high volume level for my Shure SRH940 over-ear closed-back headcans that are impedance rated at 42ohms. I dropped the volume only to 70 and no more dropouts. My thinking is that I’ve most likely reached the lightning limitation, and that’s my first question(?)

My second question is about using a balanced cable with the new headphones. The RU6 specs state its balanced output wattage almost doubles its SE output. Does this imply better efficiency and less power draw, and a possible answer to the power dependency problem, or does it mean the RU6’s balanced output will exacerbate the problem?

I’ll have other questions about best matching the RU6 to headphones, but first things first…


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Did anyone experience EMI noise with the RU6? I'm gonna order mine tomorrow.

And how much better is the Balanced Out on RU6? Wondering If I should get a Balanced Cable for CA Honeydew IEM along with the RU6.


----------



## kumar402

Johnfg465vd said:


> Did anyone experience EMI noise with the RU6? I'm gonna order mine tomorrow.
> 
> And how much better is the Balanced Out on RU6? Wondering If I should get a Balanced Cable for CA Honeydew IEM along with the RU6.


Haven’t experienced EMI while playing musicfrom my iPhone on Wi-Fi. RU6 doesnt not have a balanced architecture so unless you need extra oomph for you IEM you don’t necessarily need it.


----------



## Deders

rarewolf said:


> My second question is about using a balanced cable with the new headphones. The RU6 specs state its balanced output wattage almost doubles its SE output. Does this imply better efficiency and less power draw, and a possible answer to the power dependency problem, or does it mean the RU6’s balanced output will exacerbate the problem?



It just adds a 2nd amplifier to boost output.  In my experience if you are worried about power draw, best stick to the 3.5mm.


----------



## richoval

Johnfg465vd said:


> Did anyone experience EMI noise with the RU6? I'm gonna order mine tomorrow.
> 
> And how much better is the Balanced Out on RU6? Wondering If I should get a Balanced Cable for CA Honeydew IEM along with the RU6.



I experience EMI when used with my iphone 12 mini quiet often, not as often as with my W2. but it sucks…


----------



## alota

Johnfg465vd said:


> Did anyone experience EMI noise with the RU6? I'm gonna order mine tomorrow.
> 
> And how much better is the Balanced Out on RU6? Wondering If I should get a Balanced Cable for CA Honeydew IEM along with the RU6.


I had emi noise only in the change track when ru6 is joined to my phone. Otherwise i had no interference. About balanced in my opinion the difference in terms of sound presentation is small. Of course you have more power but again the difference is small


----------



## Deders

alota said:


> I had emi noise only in the change track when ru6 is joined to my phone. Otherwise i had no interference. About balanced in my opinion the difference in terms of sound presentation is small. Of course you have more power but again the difference is small


I'm not sure you can strictly class the noise we hear at the end of each track as EMI.  It's more of a residual noise. If it was EMI you would be able to hear something during the track say if you brought your phone closer to the DAC.  What we hear has nothing to do with electo magnetic impluse and doesn't interfere with the track until right at the very end.


----------



## richoval

Deders said:


> I'm not sure you can strictly class the noise we hear at the end of each track as EMI.  It's more of a residual noise. If it was EMI you would be able to hear something during the track say if you brought your phone closer to the DAC.  What we hear has nothing to do with electo magnetic impluse and doesn't interfere with the track until right at the very end.


so you would hear the emi even if playing music with high volume?


----------



## alota

Deders said:


> I'm not sure you can strictly class the noise we hear at the end of each track as EMI.  It's more of a residual noise. If it was EMI you would be able to hear something during the track say if you brought your phone closer to the DAC.  What we hear has nothing to do with electo magnetic impluse and doesn't interfere with the track until right at the very end.


Thanks for explanation. In this case i have no EMI issues lol


----------



## peterinvan (Jan 9, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> This DAC/Amp has impressed me so much I think ill upgrade my headcans. But, only after doing a bit of research as to how to match the characteristics of this DAC with over-ear closed-back headcans. Some of the concerns here in this thread have raised at least one question as to how far I can go.
> 
> Those concerns are about the limitations Apple has apparently put on the lightning connector regarding how much power it can supply. That is, last night I experienced some cutouts at higher volumes than used the night before. Those settings were gain=low volume=75, and provided a relatively high volume level for my Shure SRH940 over-ear closed-back headcans that are impedance rated at 42ohms. I dropped the volume only to 70 and no more dropouts. My thinking is that I’ve most likely reached the lightning limitation, and that’s my first question(?)
> 
> ...


*"Balanced":*
The RU6 is not a true balanced output, as there is only one DAC feeding Left and Right.  It looks like there is another separate amplifier feeding the right channel at the output to the 4.4mm socket.  However I am really enjoying my RU6 4.4mm output to Elegias and LCD-XC.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

@kumar402 @richoval @alota Thanks for the quick response, now all I need to do is wait, My unit should arrive in 4-5 days.


----------



## peterinvan

I seem to prefer the NOS setting on the RU6, however I wonder if Tidal Masters are oversampled when they are processed by Tidal?

Sorry to bring up MQA again.


----------



## rarewolf

peterinvan said:


> *"Balanced":*
> The RU6 is not a true balanced output, as there is only one DAC feeding Left and Right.  It looks like there is another separate amplifier feeding the right channel at the output to the 4.4mm socket.  However I am really enjoying my RU6 4.4mm output to Elegias and LCD-XC.


I imagine I could be wrong in thinking the dropouts was a power problem. Is your M11 your only source of music and power? Or, are you augmenting a smart phone too?

Have you compared both outputs to your Focals?


----------



## TYATYA

peterinvan said:


> I seem to prefer the NOS setting on the RU6, however I wonder if Tidal Masters are oversampled when they are processed by Tidal?
> 
> Sorry to bring up MQA again.


You can see!


----------



## Iznodur

i am waiting mine today!!!


----------



## Andykong (Jan 10, 2022)

@ryanjsoo has published a comprenhensive *review* on RU6, I always enjoy reading Ryan's review, they are very informative but not strongly opinated, so we can always gathered useful detail even when we have a different perference on music presentation. His photos are very appealing toop, even with boring boxy items like RU6.


----------



## Frombauge (Jan 10, 2022)

After almost one week and +50 hours of listening to the Cayin RU6 I’m ready to share my more detailed opinion.

*Cutting to the chase, I’m now actively searching for a Cayin n6ii with R01 (or other R2R dap) and a good R2R dac for my home audio system. Guess that says something of my opinion of the Cayin RU6…

Disclaimer*
As always my ears are my ears, and my impressions are my subjective impressions. I honestly find it hard to put words in ”how something sounds” and the music library and timbre preference also plays a major role in perception of a device. I’m not a true believer in “audiosciencereview”, resolution >130 dB and SNR >120 dB etc., as music ultimately is all about the feeling and enjoyment created by the music.​
*General observations*

Pairing with different IEMs is of course affecting the overall perception of upstream equipment
My assessment here has been done using the UM MEST MkII with 3.5 mm cable
My ESS dac/amp dongles are in general a bit more detailed and analytical than the RU6
My ESS dac/amp dongles are in general more prone to sibilance and fatigue after longer listening sessions
For my ESS dac/amp dongles the amp implementation is coloring the sound into warmer or colder timbre (i.e. more or less shrill sounding)
For normal listening the “brain burn-in” makes it hard to judge diminutive differences in timbre and sound quality
I see no real life need for MQA (apologies to any still existing audiophile fan of MQA)
I see no real life need for higher bit resolution than 24 bits (I’m more than 50 years old and my hearing is what it is in the upper trebles)
I prefer device volume controls over UAPP (or other player) volume controls
On an R2R dac NOS is the only filter mode I would consider as these devices are bought for their “analog sounding” characteristics
4.4 mm balanced is always better than 3.5 mm single ended, but again for this assessment 3.5 mm single ended was used for a like for like comparison
On the RU6 and for this comparison I prefer the high gain setting when using the 3.5 single ended output as I perceive this to render in better dynamics (no need for the raw power on IEMs or <60 Ohm headphones)
The RU6 is a wonderful device with a warm and cosy timbre while maintaining sufficient detail perfect for longer non-fatiguing listening sessions in a home or office environment
I need to buy a good R2R dap as a complement to my phone and dongle setups (my eyes are currently on the Cayin n6ii Ti)
I need to buy a good R2R dac for my larger and very stationary home audio system (my eyes are currently on the Musician Pegasus)
*Comparisons*
*iBasso DC05* - RU6 has a warmer timbre, not as analytical but without lacking anything in terms of details and perceived resolution. I find the DC05 to have a tad better and a tad more airy treble representation bordering to sibilance, and the RU6 has far better bass/mid bass representation with full weight and warmth. For mids and vocals I find the RU6 very natural whereas the DC05 is more forward. Overall I prefer the RU6 for longer sessions due to the warm, cosy feeling that it provides.​I would recommend the RU6 for a larger spectrum of IEMs with different timbres, whereas I would not recommend the DC05 for bright IEMs unless you are a true treble-head. Furthermore the RU6 is less sensitive to imperfect recordings. For music on the go with “darker“ IEMs the DC05 is good and inexpensive option.​​*THX Onyx* - More similar in initial timbre. I find the RU6 a bit more warm and natural sounding, and a tad less analytical. On timbre the Onyx is a bit more mid/treble forward and shines over the RU6 when doing analytical listening sessions with e.g. electrical guitar plucking, good female vocalists and electric pop with good mixing. I find the Onyx to have a bit faster bass response and slightly better punch, but for longer listening sessions I get fatigued by the more emphasized mids/treble on the Onyx.​I would recommend both the RU6 and Onyx for a larger spectrum of IEMs with different timbres, whereas I would not recommend the the RU6 for music on the go where the Onyx is a better choice given more power (single ended) and better portability. Furthermore the RU6 is less sensitive to imperfect recordings than the Onyx.​​*Audioquest Cobalt* - RU6 every day of the year. I don’t even like the Cobalt for some reason.​​*NextDrive Spectra X* - RU6 every day of the year. The Spectra X was good when it was released, but time flies and today i find it a bit harsh sounding.​


----------



## rarewolf

Frombauge said:


> After almost one week and +50 hours of listening to the Cayin RU6 I’m ready to share my more detailed opinion.
> 
> *Cutting to the chase, I’m now actively searching for a Cayin n6ii with R01 (or other R2R dap) and a good R2R dac for my home audio system. Guess that says something of my opinion of the Cayin RU6…
> 
> ...


Thanks for the review!

Can you please comment on the hardware that is providing the RU6’s input signal and power?

Can you comment on why the balanced output is “always better than 3.5mm single ended”, especially because the RU6 balances the output via a separate amplifier on the output instead of 2 DACs up front?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 10, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> Thanks for the review!
> 
> Can you please comment on the hardware that is providing the RU6’s input signal and power?
> 
> Can you comment on why the balanced output is “always better than 3.5mm single ended”, especially because the RU6 balances the output via a separate amplifier on the output instead of 2 DACs up front?



RU6 is single-ended designe from DAC to 3.5mm headphone output, and that include the volume control which is 2 channel only.  A fully balanced design requires 4 channel volume control.  The 4.4mm phone out of RU6 is balanced driven, it does meet the differentiate amplification condition technically.  Althought it won't have all the advantages such as channel seperation of fully balanced design, it does offer more headroom and current capability.

You cannot determine whether the circuit is single-ended or balanced based on number of DAC.  One or two DAC is not a the determining factor, especially on R-2R DAC design.  You have to look at the output stage of the DAC circuit design. Some DAC chipset can provide differentiate output without needing 2 DAC.


----------



## kumar402

Well I bought this dongle to pair with my JVC but I’m using it with by ZMF VC when I’m away from my desk and result is very satisfying. Great for Vocals with ZMF


----------



## ian91

NewEve said:


> @Andykong A midrange DAP with RU6's tech inside, 4 inch screen, good battery life and a bit more power will be a home run which will sell better than the N3 Pro.





Andykong said:


> We have three models in our DAP line up.  The N3Pro is our "entry-level", N6ii is our midrange DAP, and N8 is our flagshp and soon to be replaced by N8ii.  What you said is certainly feasible,
> technically.



This would be all I need! Please consider looking into it  

Also, thankyou @Andykong for being so active and involved with the community - it's this discussion and your work that will keep Cayin going from strength-to-strength.


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> RU6 is single-ended designe from DAC to 3.5mm headphone output, and that include the volume control which is 2 channel only.  A fully balanced design requires 4 channel volume control.  The 4.4mm phone out of RU6 is balanced driven, it does meet the differentiate amplification condition technically.  Althought it won't have all the advantages such as channel seperation of fully balanced design, it does offer more headroom and current capability.
> 
> You cannot determine whether the circuit is single-ended or balanced based on number of DAC.  One or two DAC is not a the determining factor, especially on R-2R DAC design.  You have to look at the output stage of the DAC circuit design. Some DAC chipset can provide differentiate output without needing 2 DAC.


Thanks Andy for your input regarding clarifying Cayin’s implementation of “balanced output”…

I think I just wanted to hear what @Frombauge would base his “always better” statement on, and what he heard from the RU6 that justified it.

At the risk of pushing the RU6 too hard; that is, to ask it to draw too much power from the iPhone’s lighting port, I’m presently weighing the cost of a 4.4mm balanced cable against the possible benefits to what I hear from 46ohm closed-back headphones. I find myself wishing I could borrow a nearly CA$300 cable, but finding one that would work with my headphones would be rare anywhere, impossible in Newfoundland. The RU6’s 3.5mm SE output is already much better than what I had been used to. It’s torturing me to want the best out of it…


----------



## peterinvan (Jan 10, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Andy for your input regarding clarifying Cayin’s implementation of “balanced output”…
> 
> I think I just wanted to hear what @Frombauge would base his “always better” statement on, and what he heard from the RU6 that justified it.
> 
> At the risk of pushing the RU6 too hard; that is, to ask it to draw too much power from the iPhone’s lighting port, I’m presently weighing the cost of a 4.4mm balanced cable against the possible benefits to what I hear from 46ohm closed-back headphones. I find myself wishing I could borrow a nearly CA$300 cable, but finding one that would work with my headphones would be rare anywhere, impossible in Newfoundland. The RU6’s 3.5mm SE output is already much better than what I had been used to. It’s torturing me to want the best out of it…


I found that the RU6 drives the following on the 4.4mm socket with plenty of headroom and great sound quality…

Sennheiser HD820 (300 ohms) high gain
Audeze LCD-XC (2019) high gain
Fostex T50RP high gain
Oppo PM-3 high gain on 3.5mm socket
Focal Elegia low gain
Source is my iPad Pro 12.9” series 3 USB-C


----------



## oldkid

I have been using the RU6 for one week now and it is by far the less "digital" sounding DAC I have ever heard. 
Timbre is decidedly different from any chip based DAC and I believe it is more natural on the RU6. Dynamics and details are very good and imaging is excellent. 
The only thing leaving to be desired is soundstage, though it might be more realistic than the expansive soundstage of my Audirect Atom 2.

I just have one question. 
Since the OS mode upsamples everything to 384khz, when I stream Qobuz and Tidal in DSD 256 (11.2Mhz) from Audirvana, there is no difference between OS or NOS mode on the RU6. Is that right?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 10, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Andy for your input regarding clarifying Cayin’s implementation of “balanced output”…
> 
> I think I just wanted to hear what @Frombauge would base his “always better” statement on, and what he heard from the RU6 that justified it.
> 
> At the risk of pushing the RU6 too hard; that is, to ask it to draw too much power from the iPhone’s lighting port, I’m presently weighing the cost of a 4.4mm balanced cable against the possible benefits to what I hear from 46ohm closed-back headphones. I find myself wishing I could borrow a nearly CA$300 cable, but finding one that would work with my headphones would be rare anywhere, impossible in Newfoundland. The RU6’s 3.5mm SE output is already much better than what I had been used to. It’s torturing me to want the best out of it…



Shure 1540? 4.4mm will almost always work better for full size headphone pairing with RU6, the extra headroom are important to large dynamic drivers.

Having said that, I am not sure if it worth to spend  CA$300 on headphone cable when you want to squeeze the final 5% or 10% from the $250 Dongle.  This is a matter of personal judgement and priority.


----------



## TYATYA

peterinvan said:


> I found that the RU6 drives the following on the 4.4mm socket with plenty of headroom and great sound quality…
> 
> Sennheiser HD820 (300 ohms) high gain
> Audeze LCD-XC (2019) high gain
> ...



I will add to your list:
Hd800s (300 Ohm) at 75-85 Low gain, 4.4 
Ibasso SR1 (40 Ohm) at 50-60 L 4.4
Caliber 1H at 40-50 L 3.5


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 10, 2022)

peterinvan said:


> I found that the RU6 drives the following on the 4.4mm socket with plenty of headroom and great sound quality…
> 
> Sennheiser HD820 (300 ohms) high gain
> Audeze LCD-XC (2019) high gain
> ...


That’s good to hear… but I have to wonder if Apple puts the same power limitations on the iPad’s USB-C as it does on an iPhone’s lightning connector. Whether or not this is a real problem with driving the RU6 with a iPhone remains conjecture as I consider it a rumor regarding reported dropouts in this forum thread, and because I cannot find any confirmation elsewhere on the web.

I figure I’d be able to judge the quality of “balanced” output by purchasing a ‘4.4mm to L&R RCA’ adapter cable, and hook the RU6 up to an auxiliary input on my Denon AVR, and then to A-B the RU6 outputs with my headphones of choice. But it still would be difficult to A-B critically, and wouldn’t make me any more comfortable with the possible power dependency problem with using with an iPhone.

You wouldn’t have an extra balanced 4.4mm cable for Shure SRH1540 headphones, would you?

Edit: I left some info out of my “A-B test”. I’ve already tried the RU6 with my Windows 10 JRiver computer. It works well, and it’s this I considered as a source for my test. However, I don’t see why I cannot use the iPhone instead and still connect the 4.4mm-to-RCA to my Denon. And, that may even also test the iPhone current draw question(?)


----------



## Louisiana (Jan 10, 2022)

Source: Lotoo Paw 6000

Verite Closed @ 70 - 80, H, 4.4
HEKSE @ 60 - 75, H, 4.4

With the VC, however, I always had the feeling that something was missing.
With the HEKSE the playback is just beautiful, at no time do I feel that anything is missing.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> ...



4.4mm to L&R RCA? This won't prove anything because the advanage is extra headroom, but you have (1) convert 4.4mm balanced output back to single-ended (RCA), and (2) your Denon AVR has hided all the headroom and driving power advantage behinds its audio circuit.


----------



## TYATYA

oldkid said:


> I have been using the RU6 for one week now and it is by far the less "digital" sounding DAC I have ever heard.
> Timbre is decidedly different from any chip based DAC and I believe it is more natural on the RU6. Dynamics and details are very good and imaging is excellent.
> The only thing leaving to be desired is soundstage, though it might be more realistic than the expansive soundstage of my Audirect Atom 2.
> 
> ...


Tidal, qobuz and dsd?
Because  RU6 is not true dsd dac (it use cpu to convert to pcm) and also two streaming is not dsd, I think no merit when you do that way.
NOS is much difference to OS: Warmer, thicker and more direct (sharp and no retouching).
OS is closer to a dac chip sound, less density for mid but more clear feeling of low and highs with darker background...
NOS and OS on ru6 does that way for whatever you input.
Pcm to dsd trick brings some benefit is when I use Onkyo HF and set 2.8Mhz High precision for saved offline tracks, with true dsd dac.
Higher SNR, separation but pay for thickness of mid (especially with 5.6Mhz conversion)


----------



## Frombauge (Jan 10, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> Thanks for the review!
> 
> Can you please comment on the hardware that is providing the RU6’s input signal and power?
> 
> Can you comment on why the balanced output is “always better than 3.5mm single ended”, especially because the RU6 balances the output via a separate amplifier on the output instead of 2 DACs up front?


The source is mainly a Samsung S21 Ultra using UAPP (with MQA add-on for those who are believers in MQA) and Tidal Masters. Have also tried a PC with Tidal Masters as the source. For music streaming using mobile phones android devices are generally speaking preferred to iOS devices. Since my initial post I have also tried the RU6 with my Focal Clears with 55 Ohm impedance. This worked perfectly fine also on my iPad Air Gen 4 with the Ru6 on high gain and volume contol at 80. Not a problem for the device, more so for my ears due to the high volume.

The comment on balanced vs. single ended comes from noise suppression, resolution and last but not least the sheer difference in output voltage and drive capability across the terminals. My use of the term balanced is related to the amplifier implementation rather than the DAC implementation (in this case R2R ladder DAC implementation) as I use a digital domain source with two channels.

Most integrated circuit audio DACs have two channels which is sufficient for stereophonic audio and can be used for balanced output in the analog domain (using my use of the term balanced). Some integrated circuit DACs have multiple channels (usually in pairs and more than one pair) which can be used for multi-channel digital sources or for two channel digital sources where the implementations using multiple DAC channels for the same digital input signal (at least theoretically) increase the SNR and channel separation in the analog domain.

Another thing worth mentioning is the superiority of resistor ladder volume controls. In my experience one should aim for this implementation also in desktop solutions.

Either way, I can really recommend the RU6 as a natural and pleasant sounding dac/amp dongle with sufficient detail and musicality satisfying most audiophiles using their ears rather than audio analyzers for making up their minds on sound quality.


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 10, 2022)

Andykong said:


> 4.4mm to L&R RCA? This won't prove anything because the advanage is extra headroom, but you have (1) convert 4.4mm balanced output back to single-ended (RCA), and (2) your Denon AVR has hided all the headroom and driving power advantage behinds its audio circuit.


Damn! Without knowing for sure, I did wonder if the AVR would handle the output to headphones differently. Thank goodness for the experts!!

You wouldn’t have an extra balanced 4.4mm cable for Shure SRH1540 headphones that I could borrow, would you?

Edit: Regarding spending $$ for the 5-10% improvement in sound with balanced being subjective… goes without saying, but if it worked it would be a long term investment. However, if it didn’t I’d be stuck with a mighty expensive 4’ dog leash. What I really need to understand is the question regarding the RU6 drawing what Apple believes is too much power. That is, I’d expect an error message before I expected dropouts…


----------



## dakchi

Frombauge said:


> After almost one week and +50 hours of listening to the Cayin RU6 I’m ready to share my more detailed opinion.
> 
> *Cutting to the chase, I’m now actively searching for a Cayin n6ii with R01 (or other R2R dap) and a good R2R dac for my home audio system. Guess that says something of my opinion of the Cayin RU6…
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing your review. I have an Audioquest Cobalt and wondering whether RU6 would be a good upgrade for me. I do like warm holographic sound. Cobalt has very good details, but it can be sibilant sometimes. How would you describe RU6 compared to it?


----------



## Frombauge

dakchi said:


> Thank you for sharing your review. I have an Audioquest Cobalt and wondering whether RU6 would be a good upgrade for me. I do like warm holographic sound. Cobalt has very good details, but it can be sibilant sometimes. How would you describe RU6 compared to it?


The RU6 is softer, smother and less fatiguing. Without lacking detail in any shape or form, the RU6 is not as shrill as the Cobalt. 

RU6 more for enjoying the music and Cobalt and other ESS-based dongles for analyzing the music. From my dongles THX Onyx is a more balanced and musical ESS-based dongle, but still not as smooth as the RU6.

RU6 is in my humble opinion a good complement to a brighter ESS-based dongle.


----------



## oldkid

TYATYA said:


> Tidal, qobuz and dsd?
> Because  RU6 is not true dsd dac (it use cpu to convert to pcm) and also two streaming is not dsd, I think no merit when you do that way.
> NOS is much difference to OS: Warmer, thicker and more direct (sharp and no retouching).
> OS is closer to a dac chip sound, less density for mid but more clear feeling of low and highs with darker background...
> ...


I use Audirvana Studio on my laptop to output Qobuz and Tidal in DSD256 format, so the RU6 receive this quality as an input. I don't think the OS mode does anything in that case because DSD256 is the equivalent of 384khz PCM


----------



## musicday

Is in stock since this morning at AMP3.


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Is RU6 comparable with N3Pro in terms of sound signature?


----------



## Hyde00

Frombauge said:


> The RU6 is softer, smother and less fatiguing. Without lacking detail in any shape or form, the RU6 is not as shrill as the Cobalt.
> 
> RU6 more for enjoying the music and Cobalt and other ESS-based dongles for analyzing the music. From my dongles THX Onyx is a more balanced and musical ESS-based dongle, but still not as smooth as the RU6.
> 
> RU6 is in my humble opinion a good complement to a brighter ESS-based dongle.


I'm a bit torn...... I like more organic presentation for acoustic songs but I also like the aggressiveness of ESS chip for rock.  I've had smooth dac/amp before and it's just not satisfying for rock.

Does RU6 still have enough "bite" for rock?

Currently using Dragonfly Red LOL.


----------



## Frombauge (Jan 10, 2022)

Hyde00 said:


> I'm a bit torn...... I like more organic presentation for acoustic songs but I also like the aggressiveness of ESS chip for rock.  I've had smooth dac/amp before and it's just not satisfying for rock.
> 
> Does RU6 still have enough "bite" for rock?
> 
> Currently using Dragonfly Red LOL.


When you say rock, is that classic musical rock genres or more aggressive genres like speed metal, heavy metal or similar?

For classic guitar, bass guitar, vocals centric and harmonic rock including early 70s hard rock - e.g. Tony Joe White, Nils Lofgrem, Gary Moore, Allan Taylor, Joe Bonamassa, Dire Straits, Snowy White, Gary Moore, Jeff Beck, Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Violent Femmes, Pink Floyd, America, Deep Purple - the RU6 is really good sounding, both dynamic and technical with enough bite. Here I would say that the pairing with IEMs or low impedance headphones and their respective technicalities are more limiting than the dac/amp dongle. Nothing that I have listed to is shrill/sibilant and too much in your face with the RU6.

Have not tried speed metal, heavy metal and similar since I’m not a huge fan of those genres.

Anyway, buy and try. If not happy sell or trade. Although being on the pricey side when dac/amp dongles are concerned, It’s not like the RU6 is a multi-thousand dollar DAP, and the second hand market for an RU6 is good since an R2R is more unique than the average ”ESS or CS ” dac/amp dongle.


----------



## blotmouse (Jan 10, 2022)

r-2r has enough "bite" for anything but the fastest of fast blast beats. Only then does it get congested. Because the music is congested.
Having a digital sharpness and filter to take away some of the note decay and reverbs on some of those recordings can help them breath, but it's not exactly true to life. It's just a more standard cheap digital presentation, kind of like throwing away detail in an mp3.

I'd choose OS mode instead of NOS for filtering to make it sound a little more like ESS. Still doesn't get the shrill right though, lol.


----------



## Frombauge

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Andy for your input regarding clarifying Cayin’s implementation of “balanced output”…
> 
> I think I just wanted to hear what @Frombauge would base his “always better” statement on, and what he heard from the RU6 that justified it.
> 
> At the risk of pushing the RU6 too hard; that is, to ask it to draw too much power from the iPhone’s lighting port, I’m presently weighing the cost of a 4.4mm balanced cable against the possible benefits to what I hear from 46ohm closed-back headphones. I find myself wishing I could borrow a nearly CA$300 cable, but finding one that would work with my headphones would be rare anywhere, impossible in Newfoundland. The RU6’s 3.5mm SE output is already much better than what I had been used to. It’s torturing me to want the best out of it…


Unfortunately the problem of this hobby is that there is always something better out there. Complacency is more uncommon than OCD. We continue the chase despite full awareness of the law of diminishing returns.

Why change something at a cost if you’re happy as is? Just enjoy the music on the wonderful device that the RU6 is (irrespective of utilizing the balanced or single-ended output)!


----------



## musicday

Do I need to USB driver for Windows 10? I cannot access the official website.


----------



## ssriram2791

musicday said:


> Do I need to USB driver for Windows 10? I cannot access the official website.


https://en.cayin.cn/down1/show?id=13630

Answer to question is "YES". The link above connects you directly to download from Cayin's website. 

If that does not work, here is a google drive link below for downloading zip file

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rLunG-9bDYljocJciucew70YqOTaXfBk/edit


----------



## musicday

ssriram2791 said:


> https://en.cayin.cn/down1/show?id=13630
> 
> Answer to question is "YES". The link above connects you directly to download from Cayin's website.
> 
> ...


Thank you kind, much appreciated.


----------



## Hyde00

ssriram2791 said:


> https://en.cayin.cn/down1/show?id=13630
> 
> Answer to question is "YES". The link above connects you directly to download from Cayin's website.
> 
> ...


Awww I was hoping for plug and play.

To clarify does it need drive to work AT ALL OR it needs driver to unlock full feature?  But could it work without driver just not running at highest sampling rate?

Asking because I might potentially use this for work computer in the future and we might not be able to install extra things on it.

Thanks!


----------



## Hyde00

Frombauge said:


> When you say rock, is that classic musical rock genres or more aggressive genres like speed metal, heavy metal or similar?
> 
> For classic guitar, bass guitar, vocals centric and harmonic rock including early 70s hard rock - e.g. Tony Joe White, Nils Lofgrem, Gary Moore, Allan Taylor, Joe Bonamassa, Dire Straits, Snowy White, Gary Moore, Jeff Beck, Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Violent Femmes, Pink Floyd, America, Deep Purple - the RU6 is really good sounding, both dynamic and technical with enough bite. Here I would say that the pairing with IEMs or low impedance headphones and their respective technicalities are more limiting than the dac/amp dongle. Nothing that I have listed to is shrill/sibilant and too much in your face with the RU6.
> 
> ...


Hmmmm this is one of the song I listen to recently:



This is one of my test track song:



For this song you can listen to the beginning the guitar riffs and snare drum hits.  Some dac/amp if it's too smooth it cannot convey the aggressiveness properly.

Though in the grand scheme of things my "rock songs" are still not that hard hahaha.  I guess it's like softer modern rock.  So it's really not that demanding technically.

But since I just sold my D9200 recently I guess I do have some money to experiment a bit.  As you said RU6 is not too expensive and should also be fairly easy to sell if I do change my mind later.

Thanks for the suggestions though!  


blotmouse said:


> r-2r has enough "bite" for anything but the fastest of fast blast beats. Only then does it get congested. Because the music is congested.
> Having a digital sharpness and filter to take away some of the note decay and reverbs on some of those recordings can help them breath, but it's not exactly true to life. It's just a more standard cheap digital presentation, kind of like throwing away detail in an mp3.
> 
> I'd choose OS mode instead of NOS for filtering to make it sound a little more like ESS. Still doesn't get the shrill right though, lol.


lol I don't think my music is that congested I guess just the general smoothing on some dac/amp.  For example in my listed songs I think for its purpose and intentions you kind of want the sharpness.

I might still just order one and try it out haha.


----------



## Ben86

I wonder how it can compete to an entry-mid range dap like the ibasso dx160. I do really like SQ and presentation of this dap, but also want to try RU6. How do they differ in SQ and overall presentation?


----------



## Frombauge

Hyde00 said:


> Hmmmm this is one of the song I listen to recently:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just tried the two songs with the RU6. Both are reproduced perfectly fine on my MEST MkIIs using the RU6 on high gain. Fir the latter there are some bite differences when using NOS or OS setting on the RU6. What you prefer is obviously subjective, but the OS setting gives a bit more rough, unpolished timbre where distortion (overlaying of multi-tones] is more “industrial“ than the more smooth NOS setting. Both are reproduced in a good way and the rest is individual preferences.


----------



## Hyde00

Frombauge said:


> Just tried the two songs with the RU6. Both are reproduced perfectly fine on my MEST MkIIs using the RU6 on high gain. Fir the latter there are some bite differences when using NOS or OS setting on the RU6. What you prefer is obviously subjective, but the OS setting gives a bit more rough, unpolished timbre where distortion (overlaying of multi-tones] is more “industrial“ than the more smooth NOS setting. Both are reproduced in a good way and the rest is individual preferences.


Awesome, that's good to hear.  Thanks!!!


----------



## Andykong

Hyde00 said:


> Awww I was hoping for plug and play.
> 
> To clarify does it need drive to work AT ALL OR it needs driver to unlock full feature?  But could it work without driver just not running at highest sampling rate?
> 
> ...



It depends, some Windows 10 computers can work directly (as reported by Ryan So in his recent RU6 review), some don't.    Microsoft has included a USB Audio 2.0 driver since Windows 10, release 1703, but the driver was reported as "problematic", so MS has revised their driver in different Windows releases.  From what I know, the latest version of Microsoft USB Audio 2.0 driver still don't support ASIO and WASAPI.  

So if you are using the  latest release of Windows 10, it should work, but you need the Cayin driver to unlock some features.  IF you are using Windows 10 prior to release 1704, iit won't work, you need to install the driver definitely.  For anything in between, you need to test the compatibility yourself.


----------



## TYATYA (Jan 11, 2022)

@Andykong I am on Windows 10. Two laptops are plug and play ok with Ru6 but the sound is just so so.
I don’t find any improve compare to the headphone line of my laptop.
Both are just cheap laptops.
I installed driver from Cayin website on one of laptop - HP Pavilion and found no improvement neither.
(After driver's installed I did not found any new on audio driver setting as ASIO nor ASAPI....).
It's strange. I believe on ru6.
Somehow it is not working at full potential on (my) windows


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 11, 2022)

Frombauge said:


> Unfortunately the problem of this hobby is that there is always something better out there. Complacency is more uncommon than OCD. We continue the chase despite full awareness of the law of diminishing returns.
> 
> Why change something at a cost if you’re happy as is? Just enjoy the music on the wonderful device that the RU6 is (irrespective of utilizing the balanced or single-ended output)!


I know…

I guess I’m showing my age. I began putting this stuff together in the late ‘60’s. Cables were never a major component and/or a financial consideration back then…

Edit: If it’s any consolation to all of us here with a similar syndrome, if I decide at all for upgrading to balancing the input to my new cans, I believe I’ll be choosing the lesser expensive standard military grade copper cable from Surf rather than opting for color, a fancy splitter and OOC copper from LQi…


----------



## takoyaki (Jan 11, 2022)

I will report it because it seems to be a problem.

I have a Cayin RU6 connected to Windows 10 PC.
1. Play music without problems (itunes)
2. Put my PC into sleep mode (several hours)
3. Resume my PC
4. When I play music from this state, a large noise is generated from the left and a small noise is generated on the right side as the music is played.
5. Remove RU6 and reconnect it to fix it.


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Hi @Andykong! I hope you can provide this information. Does RU6 support headsets with inline mic for phone calls when it's paired with Android smartphone?


----------



## Deders

I can confirm that this model splitter does work for me without cutting out at higher volumes.  It also fits the Cayin USB3 to type-c adapter much more snuggly than the previous adapter.

One thing I did notice with my particular setup, I don't know if it will carry over to other people's, is that the panning was affected slightly, but that's easily fixed with Neutron.

USB C OTG Adapter with Power, 2 in 1 USB C to USB with 60W PD Charging Adapter Compatible with iPad Pro, Dell XPS, Galaxy S21/S20+/Note10, Google Pixel 5/4XL Google Chromecast with Google TV https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09LM71CZ9/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_navT_g_VCYBJ9TBAE0YQ6MPXN1A?psc=1


----------



## PieroIM

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Hi @Andykong! I hope you can provide this information. Does RU6 support headsets with inline mic for phone calls when it's paired with Android smartphone?


I also wanted to ask the same question: I read the whole thread and noticed that this has already been asked previously by at least 2 users (one of them asked @Andykong directly) but no one answered.

There is someone here that has the RU6 and can test it with an Android phone, connecting an IEM with a cable equipped with a microphone? It would be very helpful!

Also, I'd like to ask if the RU6 is a good match for the 7Hz Timeless: is there anyone who can give impressions and opinions?

Many thanks in advance!


----------



## dumpsterfire

RU6 is a nice match with the Timeless. The RU6 is a bit bassy and the Timeless already has a bit of a bass emphasis, as a result with some tracks the bass can feel a little loose. Overall though, they match very nicely.


----------



## DBaldock9

Hyde00 said:


> Awww I was hoping for plug and play.
> 
> To clarify does it need drive to work AT ALL OR it needs driver to unlock full feature?  But could it work without driver just not running at highest sampling rate?
> 
> ...



The RU6 works just fine on my Win10 work PC (where I can not install drivers or applications).


----------



## Hyde00

DBaldock9 said:


> The RU6 works just fine on my Win10 work PC (where I can not install drivers or applications).


lol cool good to hear!  I mean I'm working from home now at the moment so doesn't really matter.  But once covid is over (LOL god knows when) and if I ever have to work in the office again this might come in handy.

Thanks for the feedback!


----------



## DBaldock9

Hyde00 said:


> lol cool good to hear!  I mean I'm working from home now at the moment so doesn't really matter.  But once covid is over (LOL god knows when) and if I ever have to work in the office again this might come in handy.
> 
> Thanks for the feedback!



My work PC currently has Windows 10 Enterprise, Version 1909, OS Build 18363.1977.


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

PieroIM said:


> I also wanted to ask the same question: I read the whole thread and noticed that this has already been asked previously by at least 2 users (one of them asked @Andykong directly) but no one answered.
> 
> There is someone here that has the RU6 and can test it with an Android phone, connecting an IEM with a cable equipped with a microphone? It would be very helpful!
> 
> ...


Here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/iem...d-rock-ultimate-solution.885104/post-16737909 you can also find a reply.


----------



## PieroIM

dumpsterfire said:


> RU6 is a nice match with the Timeless. The RU6 is a bit bassy and the Timeless already has a bit of a bass emphasis, as a result with some tracks the bass can feel a little loose. Overall though, they match very nicely.


Thank you for providing your feedback! 

I have decided to buy a portable DAC / amp and at the moment I would be oriented towards the RU6, mainly because I am intrigued by its "analog" sound.

To tell the truth, I would like a DAC that is an all rounder that can pair well with IEMs that have a very different signature, since I would like to have at least 2-3 IEMs well differentiated from each other: my doubt is that the RU6 is a little too particular for this, but I am attracted precisely by its uniqueness compared to all the other portable DACs available so far.

I am also considering the W2 and the PAW S2: do you think one of them is more suitable as an all rounder? Here in my home (Italy) and in Europe in general these last two products seem to be difficult to find and I have no intention of importing them from the USA because at present the additional costs due to customs duties and Italian taxes would raise the price by over 30%, taking it to unacceptable levels IMHO.

I also considered the Violectric CHRONOS but I am not too convinced because of the power limitation.


----------



## PieroIM

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Here https://www.head-fi.org/threads/iem...d-rock-ultimate-solution.885104/post-16737909 you can also find a reply.


Thank you!


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

PieroIM said:


> Thank you for providing your feedback!
> 
> I have decided to buy a portable DAC / amp and at the moment I would be oriented towards the RU6, mainly because I am intrigued by its "analog" sound.
> 
> ...


I'm also considering the dongles you've mentioned. And thx onyx in addition to your list.


----------



## Ichos

Wrong thread...


----------



## Hyde00

TYATYA said:


> @Andykong I am on Windows 10. Two laptops are plug and play ok with Ru6 but the sound is just so so.
> I don’t find any improve compare to the headphone line of my laptop.
> Both are just cheap laptops.
> I installed driver from Cayin website on one of laptop - HP Pavilion and found no improvement neither.
> ...


From what I read people recommend burn in the unit for 100+ hours?

Though you should still notice any different off the bat though.  Did you play around with OS vs NOS and is there any difference at all?


----------



## alota

Error sorry


----------



## alota

PieroIM said:


> Thank you for providing your feedback!
> 
> I have decided to buy a portable DAC / amp and at the moment I would be oriented towards the RU6, mainly because I am intrigued by its "analog" sound.
> 
> ...


Pm sent


----------



## hoofman

PieroIM said:


> I also wanted to ask the same question: I read the whole thread and noticed that this has already been asked previously by at least 2 users (one of them asked @Andykong directly) but no one answered.
> 
> There is someone here that has the RU6 and can test it with an Android phone, connecting an IEM with a cable equipped with a microphone? It would be very helpful!
> 
> ...


I plugged in the RU6 and tried Skype Echo Sound Test Service on my Android phone Xperia 10 II and it didn't seem to work. I don't think the RU6 has the mic input function.

I tested the Timeless at the showroom with my RU6. I noticed that the amount of bass response is a bit on the light side and there was a little bit hissing but those are only obvious in some recordings. It could as well be a characteristic of the Timeless which I'm not used to. I would say that they didn't do anything particularly wrong and it was an overall enjoyable combo.


----------



## OspreyAndy (Jan 12, 2022)

My full review on RU6 here, in case you are interested to read:
https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/


----------



## Hyde00

OspreyAndy said:


> My full review on RU6 here, in care you are interested to read:
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/


Yes been waiting for this!

My wallet is trying to spend money but I told myself I'd wait for your review first LOL.

I think at this point I'm pretty much sold on RU6 but before I pull out my credit card just want a last sanity check.  Could you give a very brief impression as to how RU6 compare to the following?

*L&P W2* = My friend is trying to convince me to go for W2 since it's suppose to be the highest resolution dongle dac.  Though I keep reading it's boring, for me sound signature > resolution.  Is my assessment correct?
*L&P W2 131* = Due to dac chip shortage they were forced to make a new model, suppose to be slightly more intimate but also warmer sounding.  Also less terrible on 3.5 mm output compare to the original (where only balance sounds good).  But since this is new so I'd totally understand if you haven't try it yet.
*Questyle M12* = lol did RU6 manage to beat one of your top 5?
*Colorfly CDA M1* = You mentioned you got it but not sure if you get a chance to listen to it yet?  This one I just heard has very good quality to price ratio so I was a bit intrigued.

Headphone used will be Denon D5200 3.5 mm cable (don't have balanced cable yet) and music preference is forward female vocal, sparkly treble and soul crushing bass (I mean I did buy a Denon...... lol).  So I'd say I like colored sound not really looking for neutral (which to me is a bit boring...... did I mention I have a Denon....... lol).

Thanks again for your dedication in dongles!!!


----------



## OspreyAndy

Hyde00 said:


> Yes been waiting for this!
> 
> My wallet is trying to spend money but I told myself I'd wait for your review first LOL.
> 
> ...


Thanks. Ok will try to make this as concise as possible:

W2 undoubted is one hell of amazing unit. It is a perfect Dongle if analyzing music is your thing. But if you prefer to enjoy music then I will always pick RU6 over W2. The resolution of W2 despite being great is not as wildly stellar as how it was hyped. Even Asus ROG Clavis can do a much cleaner output than W2, so does REIYIN DA-Plus. The biggest setback of W2 being super anemic and uninspiring as the load goes up, it is super amazing if you already have TOTL level IEMs that are super competent on their own

I haven't tried the W2 131 as I am no longer keen on getting the variation of W2, especially if I have to pay $299 to sate my curiosity. So I don't know.

M12 remains one of my favorite, but if you check the latest ranking on my site today, M12 now sits at No.3 and RU6 at No.2.

CDA M1, yes I have already listened to it. It does sound very well balanced and polished. Very natural for an ESS Sabre DAC/Amp. No annoying Pina brightness that are prominent on many ESS Dongles. However so far I have found that M1 is only optimized for highly efficient devices. It does not have enough juice to run more demanding stuffs. So if you don't have a need for demanding stuffs, M1 is indeed a great option. For me personally I am okay with it.


----------



## Hyde00 (Jan 12, 2022)

OspreyAndy said:


> Thanks. Ok will try to make this as concise as possible:
> 
> W2 undoubted is one hell of amazing unit. It is a perfect Dongle if analyzing music is your thing. But if you prefer to enjoy music then I will always pick RU6 over W2. The resolution of W2 despite being great is not as wildly stellar as how it was hyped. Even Asus ROG Clavis can do a much cleaner output than W2, so does REIYIN DA-Plus. The biggest setback of W2 being super anemic and uninspiring as the load goes up, it is super amazing if you already have TOTL level IEMs that are super competent on their own
> 
> ...


Yeah I think I'll be sticking with D5200 for a while and not foresee myself buying anything demanding any time soon.  D5200 is 24 Ohm and 103 dB/mW sensitivity, so I think I'll be ok lol.

Oh though I do hear that biodynas need a bit current to sing.  Though I wouldn't know which dongle provide more current (this is beyond my electrical knowledge).

LOL I think I was ready for RU6 but as you said CDA M1 is actually not bad, now I need to re-think about this again.  But I'd imagine is it at this point is it's more "different" and "preferences" rather than a clear cut "better"?  Though for a "natural sounding ESS", would you say you like M12 better or CDA M1?

Sorry I know it's getting late at night time we can chat more tomorrow.

Again thank you so much for all your feedback!


----------



## OspreyAndy

Hyde00 said:


> Yeah I think I'll be sticking with D5200 for a while and not foresee myself buying anything demanding any time soon.  D5200 is 24 Ohm and 103 dB/mW sensitivity, so I think I'll be ok lol.
> 
> Oh though I do hear that biodynas need a bit current to sing.  Though I wouldn't know which dongle provide more current (this is beyond my electrical knowledge).
> 
> ...


Yes, it's clear cut M12 is superior to CDA M1. M12 remains the one right after Apogee Groove for very mature natural sound from the ESS Sabre camp. As it is, taste play a big role too, always remember these can be very subjective and we are talking about devices that are already great in their own rights


----------



## yaps66

OspreyAndy said:


> My full review on RU6 here, in care you are interested to read:
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/


Nice review! Very enjoyable read. Kudos!!


----------



## PieroIM

hoofman said:


> I plugged in the RU6 and tried Skype Echo Sound Test Service on my Android phone Xperia 10 II and it didn't seem to work. I don't think the RU6 has the mic input function.
> 
> I tested the Timeless at the showroom with my RU6. I noticed that the amount of bass response is a bit on the light side and there was a little bit hissing but those are only obvious in some recordings. It could as well be a characteristic of the Timeless which I'm not used to. I would say that they didn't do anything particularly wrong and it was an overall enjoyable combo.


Thank you for your precious feedback!

Yes, I also suspected that the mic function was not supported by the RU6. I do not know if it is a problem inherent to the type of device and therefore unsolvable, but it is certainly a big limitation for a device that is born mainly for portability - which nowadays means 99% that it is connected to a smartphone (and therefore there is is the need to be able to make / answer calls).


----------



## PieroIM

OspreyAndy said:


> My full review on RU6 here, in care you are interested to read:
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/


Fantastic review! You did a hell of great job!
Can I ask your opinion on which do you think could be more suitable between BAL and SE in combination with 7Hz Timeless? Thanks!!!


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

hoofman said:


> I plugged in the RU6 and tried Skype Echo Sound Test Service on my Android phone Xperia 10 II and it didn't seem to work. I don't think the RU6 has the mic input function.
> 
> I tested the Timeless at the showroom with my RU6. I noticed that the amount of bass response is a bit on the light side and there was a little bit hissing but those are only obvious in some recordings. It could as well be a characteristic of the Timeless which I'm not used to. I would say that they didn't do anything particularly wrong and it was an overall enjoyable combo.


Thank you, much appreciated!


----------



## OspreyAndy

PieroIM said:


> Fantastic review! You did a hell of great job!
> Can I ask your opinion on which do you think could be more suitable between BAL and SE in combination with 7Hz Timeless? Thanks!!!


Thank you. For 7Hz Timeless, despite being one of the most efficient Magnetic Planar, it is still a Magnetic Planar which means Timeless will scale up better with more power. So I would use the 4.4mm BAL


----------



## PieroIM

OspreyAndy said:


> Thank you. For 7Hz Timeless, despite being one of the most efficient Magnetic Planar, it is still a Magnetic Planar which means Timeless will scale up better with more power. So I would use the 4.4mm BAL


Thanks for the clarification


----------



## Andykong

OspreyAndy said:


> My full review on RU6 here, in care you are interested to read:
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/



Thank you very much for sharing your RU6 review with us.    

When I prepare the product review plan for RU6 before our product launch, I checked your donglemadness list and noticed that you decided to "retire" from your Dongle DAC adventure.  I have kind of disappointed that we missed the opportunity.  This is a happy surprise, glad to see you back onlilne.  Of course we are excited to receive a strong recognition from you.


----------



## Andykong

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Hi @Andykong! I hope you can provide this information. Does RU6 support headsets with inline mic for phone calls when it's paired with Android smartphone?





PieroIM said:


> I also wanted to ask the same question: I read the whole thread and noticed that this has already been asked previously by at least 2 users (one of them asked @Andykong directly) but no one answered.
> 
> There is someone here that has the RU6 and can test it with an Android phone, connecting an IEM with a cable equipped with a microphone? It would be very helpful!
> 
> ...



From what I recall, I tested RU6 with my 99Classic that come with a inline mic.  I was on a wechat online meeting but they can't hear me at all, I need to disconnect the RU6 to continue the meeting.


----------



## Andykong

takoyaki said:


> I will report it because it seems to be a problem.
> 
> I have a Cayin RU6 connected to Windows 10 PC.
> 1. Play music without problems (itunes)
> ...



Looks like the multitasking from Windows 10 didn't works up to speed, when you reconnect the RU6, the Window will detect and activate the device driver again.



TYATYA said:


> @Andykong I am on Windows 10. Two laptops are plug and play ok with Ru6 but the sound is just so so.
> I don’t find any improve compare to the headphone line of my laptop.
> Both are just cheap laptops.
> I installed driver from Cayin website on one of laptop - HP Pavilion and found no improvement neither.
> ...



When I use Foobar2000 after I installed the Cayin driver, I have the ASIO option shown up as below:


----------



## oldkid

@Andykong I'm really starting to appreciate the RU6 as it should be, in NOS mode with FLAC encoded music. But I'm also a fan of DSD.
Could you confirm how the RU6 handles DSD?

In John Darko's article, it's said that any DSD signal is converted to 384khz PCM, but I can't seem to find this information anywhere else.

Is that true that the RU6 can't process native DSD or DoP at all?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 17, 2022)

oldkid said:


> @Andykong I'm really starting to appreciate the RU6 as it should be, in NOS mode with FLAC encoded music. But I'm also a fan of DSD.
> Could you confirm how the RU6 handles DSD?
> 
> In John Darko's article, it's said that any DSD signal is converted to 384khz PCM, but I can't seem to find this information anywhere else.
> ...



On page 1 post #1, we stated that RU6 support up to PCM 384kHz and DSD 64/128/256, but under the *24Bit Discrete R-2R Reistor Ladder DAC* paragraph,  we stated clearly that the Audio Bridge will convert DSD to PCM 24 Bit/384kHz.

So RU6 supports DSD, but it won't playback DSD natively, it will convert all DSD to PCM before decoding.

If native DSD is a deal breaker,  R-2R is probably not your choice of decoding technology.


----------



## PieroIM

Andykong said:


> From what I recall, I tested RU6 with my 99Classic that come with a inline mic.  I was on a wechat online meeting but they can't hear me at all, I need to disconnect the RU6 to continue the meeting.


Thank you for the additional feedback on this topic. As I wrote in one of my previous post, making a portable DAC allow you to use the microphone would, in my opinion, be a wise choice and a great selling point...because nowadays "portable" for such a device means connected to the smartphone.


----------



## oldkid

Andykong said:


> On page 1 post #1, we stated that RU6 support up to PCM 384kHz and DSD 64/128/256, but under the *24Bit Discrete R-2R Reistor Ladder DAC* paragraph,  we stated clearly that the Audio Bridg will convert DSD to PCM 24 Bit/384kHz.
> 
> So RU6 supports DSD, but it won't playback DSD natively, it will convert all DSD to PCM before decoding.
> 
> If native DSD is a deal breaker,  R-2R is probably not your choice of decoding technology.


Ok, thank you for your answer. It's not a deal breaker at all. I have other DACs with chips that handle native DSD very well.
The RU6 being such an uncommon dongle DAC design, I just wanted to clarify what it can or can't do.


----------



## takoyaki

Andykong said:


> Looks like the multitasking from Windows 10 didn't works up to speed, when you reconnect the RU6, the Window will detect and activate the device driver again.


Hi Andykong.
If possible, I hope it will be fixed in the driver or firmware.
Please consider it.


----------



## Andykong

takoyaki said:


> Hi Andykong.
> If possible, I hope it will be fixed in the driver or firmware.
> Please consider it.



I don't think this is related to the driver.  The problem lies with Microsoft multitasking management.


----------



## takoyaki

Andykong said:


> I don't think this is related to the driver.  The problem lies with Microsoft multitasking management.



Okay, I will try with other USB DAC dongles.
(I remember it didn't happen in Shanling UA2. I don't know in L&P W2, so I'll test those two dongles.)


----------



## soundblast75

Is anyone using the case magnet circle bit, doesn't really hold the unit for me, am i doing it wrong?


----------



## tod-hackett

soundblast75 said:


> Is anyone using the case magnet circle bit, doesn't really hold the unit for me, am i doing it wrong?


I tried the magnet circle bit on my V30 and it didn't work out so I put the sticker back on and put it back in the box. I think it might be able to hold if you can find a "sweet spot"; no guarantees though.


----------



## tod-hackett

takoyaki said:


> Hi Andykong.
> If possible, I hope it will be fixed in the driver or firmware.
> Please consider it.


Do you use a USB hub? Mine sometimes has problems when my hub is overloaded...


----------



## OspreyAndy

Andykong said:


> Thank you very much for sharing your RU6 review with us.
> 
> When I prepare the product review plan for RU6 before our product launch, I checked your donglemadness list and noticed that you decided to "retire" from your Dongle DAC adventure.  I have kind of disappointed that we missed the opportunity.  This is a happy surprise, glad to see you back onlilne.  Of course we are excited to receive a strong recognition from you.


The pleasure is mine. I must thank RU6 for reigniting #donglemadness spirit. A tuning approach that I really admire. And I hope Cayin will continue to innovate sound appreciation that stays true to Analogue presentation. Cheers


----------



## sahmen

OspreyAndy said:


> My full review on RU6 here, in case you are interested to read:
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/27677/


This is such a nice review that it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside owning the RU6.  Thanks.  Still, I notice that you rank the CEntrance DACport HD higher and it is the only competitor to enjoy this privilege.  Could you elaborate a bit on what gives the CEntrance DACport HD the edge over the RU6 since I have not been able to see any comparative reviews yet?

Many thanks


----------



## OspreyAndy

sahmen said:


> This is such a nice review that it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside owning the RU6.  Thanks.  Still, I notice that you rank the CEntrance DACport HD higher and it is the only competitor to enjoy this privilege.  Could you elaborate a bit on what gives the CEntrance DACport HD the edge over the RU6 since I have not been able to see any comparative reviews yet?
> 
> Many thanks


DACport HD is literally a desktop grade DAC/Amp that masquerade as a Dongle. It is the only one in existence that runs on legitimate Class A amplification and thus being the only one with 775 mW of power on tap. The price DACport HD paid for that power is utilization efficiency at which it will suck the life out of any battery powered host like no tomorrow. For one, CEntrance is a company that actually work with musicians and they understand music, hence the tuning for their devices are optimized for music. Sound wise, DACport HD and RU6 does share similar signature and timbral bias - both of which are the closest thing to being Analogue (so does Ovidius B1, Lotoo PAW S2 and Apogee Groove). The miniscule difference, DACport HD has the upper hand at being smoother while being crisp at the same time. But that's only obvious to me if I am to compare them side by side. Either way both already at the pinnacle, at least from my own perspective


----------



## Andykong (Jan 12, 2022)

OspreyAndy said:


> DACport HD is literally a desktop grade DAC/Amp that masquerade as a Dongle. It is the only one in existence that runs on legitimate Class A amplification and thus being the only one with 775 mW of power on tap. The price DACport HD paid for that power is utilization efficiency at which it will suck the life out of any battery powered host like no tomorrow. For one, CEntrance is a company that actually work with musicians and they understand music, hence the tuning for their devices are optimized for music. Sound wise, DACport HD and RU6 does share similar signature and timbral bias - both of which are the closest thing to being Analogue (so does Ovidius B1, Lotoo PAW S2 and Apogee Groove). The miniscule difference, DACport HD has the upper hand at being smoother while being crisp at the same time. But that's only obvious to me if I am to compare them side by side. Either way both already at the pinnacle, at least from my own perspective



When we develop RU6, we have a hard time to work within the power supply limit of mobile phones, or iPhone to be exact.  We have to limited the power drain at peak output to avoid the famous "uses too much power" error message from iPhone.  Wanders how DACport HD can get away from this at such high output?

Recently we noticed Android mobile phones has implemented similar power drain limitation from user reports (Android 12 devices), let's hope they don't step up their protection on the USB-C/Lightning power drainage in foreseeable future.


----------



## OspreyAndy

Andykong said:


> When we develolp RU6, we have a hard time to work within the power supply limit of mobile phone, or iPhone to be exact.  We have to limited the power drain at peak output to avoid the famous "uses too much power" error from iPhone.  Wanders how DACport HD can get away from this at such high output?
> 
> Recently we noticed Android mobile phones has implemented similar power drain limitation from user reports (Android 12 devices), let's hope they don't step up their protection on the USB-C/Lightning power drainage.


Totally understand Andy, the thing is, DACport HD also will not work with iOS, same case with Apogee Groove and Ovidius B1. These devices are more on purist approach that they are willing to sacrifice some element of compatibility for sheer power. Unfortunately we can't have everything. For what RU6 does, being able to run on iOS while still delivering top notch power is already very admirable. I have seen many Dongles flunked miserably trying to achieve what RU6 capable of


----------



## Andykong

OspreyAndy said:


> Totally understand Andy, the thing is, DACport HD also will not work with iOS, same case with Apogee Groove and Ovidius B1. These devices are more on purist approach that they are willing to sacrifice some element of compatibility for sheer power. Unfortunately we can't have everything. For what RU6 does, being able to run on iOS while still delivering top notch power is already very admirable. I have seen many Dongles flunked miserably trying to achieve what RU6 capable of


Giving up iOS is a very big sacrifice, these non-compatible Dongle DAC deserve a round of applause for their devotion. 

We have debated this topic over and over during the R&D period.  On one hand we have devoted a lot of resource  to implement purist solutions such as R-2R DAC and resistor array volume control in RU6, adding a worthy amplifier seems logical. On the ither hand, I was the devil advocate in the team, keep reminding them that we shouldn't give up iOS users financially and morally.  Fortunately we strived a compromise that both Engineering and Marketing are happy with.   I wish there is a chance that we can showcase our prouded, uncompromised version of RU6.  Let's hope for the best when we are fighting for a better tomorrow somewhere.


----------



## keenears

Well, considering I’ve been indirectly mocked here for the splitter topic I’ll have to give up using this dongle. Drains my Walkman battery in less than an hour. Around 45 minutes. No joke. The NW-A105 doesn’t have wireless charging. I can use it with my iPad or iPhone but I never listen to music on them. Too bad because it sounds and looks great with its orange case connected to the TPS2 case on my Walkman, which always had the orange Hot Line button on the classic. What a waste


----------



## Hyde00

keenears said:


> Well, considering I’ve been indirectly mocked here for the splitter topic I’ll have to give up using this dongle. Drains my Walkman battery in less than an hour. Around 45 minutes. No joke. The NW-A105 doesn’t have wireless charging. I can use it with my iPad or iPhone but I never listen to music on them. Too bad because it sounds and looks great with its orange case connected to the TPS2 case on my Walkman, which always had the orange Hot Line button on the classic. What a waste


Hey dude sorry your question hasn't been fully answered.  I do think this being an hobby forum everyone should be a little bit less critical when it comes to helping each other out.  I think the issue was that maybe the idea wasn't communicate clearly, that we're either not sure exactly what you need or we might've just missed the point entirely.  And there is a possibility that something you want might simply not exist.

That being said, I think a few members pointing out something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Charging-Splitter-Charge-Compatible/dp/B098SVSDYW/ref=sr_1_3?crid=VDB6IK2ESH6N&keywords=otg+usb+splitter+with+fast+charging&qid=1642035291&sprefix=otg+usb+splitter+with+fast+charging,aps,51&sr=8-3&th=1

or this

https://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Female-Charging-Splitter-Compatible/dp/B08KPD5S82/ref=sr_1_6?crid=VDB6IK2ESH6N&keywords=otg+usb+splitter+with+fast+charging&qid=1642035291&sprefix=otg+usb+splitter+with+fast+charging,aps,51&sr=8-6&th=1

Though I remember at the time you said it will won't work.  I can't recall exactly what was the reason anymore.

I took a quick look at the Sony NW-A105, it sounds like the number 1 complaint from users review is actually about the battery life.  I think even without the RU6 the battery life isn't too long to begin with?  Though it does seem like it supports fast charging.  So it might still work with the splitter cables?  But is the issue now that you're restricted to a wall plug/wall charger, then do you need a battery pack?  Or the splitter cable simply does not support the voltage or amperage you need?

Again maybe as I said maybe I don't fully understand your exact need.  Also I'm not trying to dig another hole if we more or less reached conclusion before.

I think sometimes in life there's just really no solution to everything so we just take the next closest thing.  Hopefully you find something that's close enough to be a good compromise.


----------



## PA3BPAT

Andykong said:


> DSD bitstream will convert to PCM in the Audio Bridge, and the oversampled to 24Bit/768kHz before feeding to R2R resistor network.



May I ask why 24Bit/768kHz not 24Bit/705.6kHz? DSD frequencies of commercially delivered files are multiples of 44.1kHz, not 48kHz...


----------



## ssriram2791

Andykong said:


> When we develop RU6, we have a hard time to work within the power supply limit of mobile phones, or iPhone to be exact.  We have to limited the power drain at peak output to avoid the famous "uses too much power" error message from iPhone.  Wanders how DACport HD can get away from this at such high output?
> 
> Recently we noticed Android mobile phones has implemented similar power drain limitation from user reports (Android 12 devices), let's hope they don't step up their protection on the USB-C/Lightning power drainage in foreseeable future.


What.. Come on Google.You cannot do this to us. 

Thanks @Andykong for the heads up. I think next generation dongles have to eventually come with battery source, my god. I don't like one bit what Google is doing.


----------



## ekjellgren

There really should be some way to document these forum conclusions. Because they are worth their weight in gold, but are often lost in all other information. And every conclusion gets repeated over and over again. Perhaps a wiki page connected to each product thread?


----------



## rarewolf

How “special” is the ‘lightning to USB-C cable OTG cable that Cayin provides? That is, I’m usually enjoying music while browsing/reading with my iPad mini. The lightning port is on the bottom because I'm reading with the mini in portrait position while I’m either reclined or in bed, and the cable kinks because I’m not holding up & away from by body. That is, the cable should be right-angled to be safe from kinking. I’ve not yet found a similar cable, but I think I should be aware of what is special to know what I’m looking for.

I just remembered that the new iPad mini dumped Lightning for USB-C. I've considered upgrading before, and it’s an option. Finding a generic USB-C cable with one right-angled connector would be a lot easier than finding a “special” lightning OTG cable.


----------



## captblaze

rarewolf said:


> How “special” is the ‘lightning to USB-C cable OTG cable that Cayin provides? That is, I’m usually enjoying music while browsing/reading with my iPad mini. The lightning port is on the bottom because I'm reading with the mini in portrait position while I’m either reclined or in bed, and the cable kinks because I’m not holding up & away from by body. That is, the cable should be right-angled to be safe from kinking. I’ve not yet found a similar cable, but I think I should be aware of what is special to know what I’m looking for.
> 
> I just remembered that the new iPad mini dumped Lightning for USB-C. I've considered upgrading before, and it’s an option. Finding a generic USB-C cable with one right-angled connector would be a lot easier than finding a “special” lightning OTG cable.


Search for this —-> ddhifi mfi06 lightning to usb type c


----------



## Fred5ek

oldkid said:


> @Andykong Naprawdę zaczynam doceniać RU6 tak, jak powinien, w trybie NOS z muzyką zakodowaną w formacie FLAC. Ale jestem też fanem DSD.
> Czy mógłbyś potwierdzić, jak RU6 radzi sobie z DSD?
> 
> W artykule Johna Darko jest napisane, że każdy sygnał DSD jest konwertowany na PCM 384 kHz, ale nigdzie indziej nie mogę znaleźć tej informacji.
> ...


Podobnie jak Lotoo Paw S1iS2, zawsze konwertuje DSD na PCM, zanim trafi do DAC-a.


----------



## rarewolf

captblaze said:


> Search for this —-> ddhifi mfi06 lightning to usb type c


Thanks Capt! Found one at hifigo… right-angled at both ends, and a bit expensive, so let me ask…

I would’ve thought the term ‘MFi’ (as in mfi06) would indicate “Apple certified” and would be not OTG(?) Ddhifi does make comments regarding other dongle DACs and how to “turn off charging”, and it does seem to me that has something to do woth OTG, but what do I know…


----------



## captblaze

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Capt! Found one at hifigo… right-angled at both ends, and a bit expensive, so let me ask…
> 
> I would’ve thought the term ‘MFi’ (as in mfi06) would indicate “Apple certified” and would be not OTG(?) Ddhifi does make comments regarding other dongle DACs and how to “turn off charging”, and it does seem to me that has something to do woth OTG, but what do I know…


The Mfi refers to the Mfi chip inside, but it is an OTG cable also. I took this screen cap from the DDHiFi official store on aliexpress


----------



## peterinvan

rarewolf said:


> How “special” is the ‘lightning to USB-C cable OTG cable that Cayin provides? That is, I’m usually enjoying music while browsing/reading with my iPad mini. The lightning port is on the bottom because I'm reading with the mini in portrait position while I’m either reclined or in bed, and the cable kinks because I’m not holding up & away from by body. That is, the cable should be right-angled to be safe from kinking. I’ve not yet found a similar cable, but I think I should be aware of what is special to know what I’m looking for.
> 
> I just remembered that the new iPad mini dumped Lightning for USB-C. I've considered upgrading before, and it’s an option. Finding a generic USB-C cable with one right-angled connector would be a lot easier than finding a “special” lightning OTG cable.


Would rotating the iPad 180 degrees solve your issue?   I have my RU6 plugged into the top of my portrait orientated iPad Pro.


----------



## rarewolf

peterinvan said:


> Would rotating the iPad 180 degrees solve your issue?   I have my RU6 plugged into the top of my portrait orientated iPad Pro.


That will work! Not all of my apps will accommodate the flip, but my fav reader will, and that’s when I don’t have to depend the ‘home’ button in its usual place. However, even with the flip I’d prefer the cable came over the top from an angled connector.


----------



## IgeNeLL

At present time, it is ny best sounding setup for Ru6. NOS, low gain.
Treble extension has recover due to the usb cable. Happy with that to listening to Hilary Hahn performance.


----------



## Hyde00

IgeNeLL said:


> At present time, it is ny best sounding setup for Ru6. NOS, low gain.
> Treble extension has recover due to the usb cable. Happy with that to listening to Hilary Hahn performance.


Looking good!  Though could you explain a bit on the part where you mentioned "treble extension has recover due to the usb cable"?  Was the previous cable not good?


----------



## IgeNeLL

Hyde00 said:


> Looking good!  Though could you explain a bit on the part where you mentioned "treble extension has recover due to the usb cable"?  Was the previous cable not good?


Compared with stock and one after market cable. The sound is totally different.


----------



## dakchi

IgeNeLL said:


> Compared with stock and one after market cable. The sound is totally different.


Which cable are you using?


----------



## elira

dakchi said:


> Which cable are you using?


The good one, obviously.


----------



## rarewolf

IgeNeLL said:


> ….
> Treble extension has recover due to the usb cable. …


I’m also looking for an alternative to the optional OTG lightning cable. Can you describe what you heard before and after, and where you purchased your cable?


----------



## dakchi

elira said:


> The good one, obviously.


what brand?


----------



## bnupy

captblaze said:


> https://www.oeaudio.net/oeotg


After going back and forth on this, pulled the plug. And waiting close to 2 weeks, this thing works! Thanks for the rec, blaze! I don't believe in cable supremacy, but... these have made my ru6 sound clearer than going through the lightning camera adapter and then to usb c!


----------



## Hyde00

bnupy said:


> After going back and forth on this, pulled the plug. And waiting close to 2 weeks, this thing works! Thanks for the rec, blaze! I don't believe in cable supremacy, but... these have made my ru6 sound clearer than going through the lightning camera adapter and then to usb c!


A bit surprised since usually people say analogue cable makes a difference, but didn't think digital cable would make a difference too.

Will read into it..... thanks!


----------



## Ufanco

Thought this might be of some interest as a dongle holder.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PF2BFY...b36125c589b8d&btn_ref=srctok-ed3b36125c589b8d


----------



## kumar402

Hyde00 said:


> A bit surprised since usually people say analogue cable makes a difference, but didn't think digital cable would make a difference too.
> 
> Will read into it..... thanks!


If the source is noisy then cable with better shields do make a difference. I experienced the same when I exchanged default USB cable with Supra USB in my desktop DAC. It’s not like Supra is expensive but are well made. Also digital cables for connection such as I2S makes bigger difference as clock information is taken by DAC as is from source via I2S and hence better cable is needed for I2S


----------



## DBaldock9

Took my RU6 (with 4.4mm->2.5mm adapter), along with my LZ A7 earphones & balanced cable, when I went to Lunch on Friday.
Had the DAC connected to my LG V35 phone (with Battery Saver on).
Was listening to UAPP / Qobuz, playing the album _Yahudky_ by *DakhaBrakha*.
The RU6 was in NOS mode, Volume at ~24, and the tracks were streaming over WiFi at 16-Bit/44.1-KHz.

While listening to the music, I was viewing this forum in the Opera Android Browser, and viewing Facebook with the Facebook app.
During the 1-hour lunch, the phone's battery dropped 20%, from 95% to 75%.


----------



## keenears

Hyde00 said:


> Hey dude sorry your question hasn't been fully answered.  I do think this being an hobby forum everyone should be a little bit less critical when it comes to helping each other out.  I think the issue was that maybe the idea wasn't communicate clearly, that we're either not sure exactly what you need or we might've just missed the point entirely.  And there is a possibility that something you want might simply not exist.
> 
> That being said, I think a few members pointing out something like this:
> 
> ...


Thank you. Its battery life without a dongle is decent. I tried your latter white adapter without luck, plugging in the charger shuts off audio over the other USB. I haven’t yet tried the black adapter there. Though any C/A splitter requires using the C to A adapter with the Ru6, and at that point it seems to become a Frankenstein adapter chain. A graceful solution is preferred. Ideally a male C to dual (charge and data) female C adapter, one that doesn’t pass data through its own internal dac, would put this issue to rest. Unfortunately it doesn’t seem to exist. I have a dongle multiport for my iPad with a data USBC female and pd USBC female port on it, but it has the same issue as the white adapter.

DDHIFI Help us with a tiny usb c splitter please!


----------



## dakchi (Jan 15, 2022)

Hi,
I just received my RU6 and plugged it to my Macbook Pro. I played music from Tidal app. I notice that sound cuts randomly very often. Is this normal?
I used RU6 with an IEM that does not require a lot of power, but still I have to increase the volume to 70 to have enough juice. If RU6 is not powerful enough for an IEM, I can't imagine this thing can be used with headphones
Out os the box, RU6 is disappointing. Bass overlaps with mids and soundstage is very narrow. Separation of instruments is not there. Sub-bass and mids are forward. RU6 struggles in busy songs where there are a lof instruments and vocals. I hope that with burn-in, things will get better, otherwise it will go back


----------



## TYATYA

dakchi said:


> Hi,
> I just received my RU6 and plugged it to my Macbook Pro. I played music from Tidal app. I notice that sound cuts randomly very often. Is this normal?
> I used RU6 with an IEM that does not require a lot of power, but still I have to increase the volume to 70 to have enough juice. If RU6 is not powerful enough for an IEM, I can't imagine this thing can be used with headphones
> Out os the box, RU6 is disappointing. Bass overlaps with mids and soundstage is very narrow. Separation of instruments is not there. Sub-bass and mids are forward. RU6 struggles in busy songs where there are a lof instruments and vocals. I hope that with burn-in, things will get better, otherwise it will go back


Your cable or mac is the reason.
My ru6 ok (I am with Android) but I know my ak120ii got problem with a cable of Anker (comes with Anker battery pack). After I use charging cable of samsung phones and be ok, I know cable is a big thing to be checked.
The cable with ru6 (for android) is ok but I still think it's not full specs of usb-C, bcs when I connect my ak sp1000 to my phone using that cable, nothing happen (no connection is made)


----------



## captblaze

TYATYA said:


> Your cable or mac is the reason.
> My ru6 ok (I am with Android) but I know my ak120ii got problem with a cable of Anker (comes with Anker battery pack). After I use charging cable of samsung phones and be ok, I know cable is a big thing to be checked.
> The cable with ru6 (for android) is ok but I still think it's not full specs of usb-C, bcs when I connect my ak sp1000 to my phone using that cable, nothing happen (no connection is made)


I have a few cables that power up the RU-6, but no audio is present while playing a track. switch to a different cable and magically the audio is pushed to my ears.
The same cable works with other dongles, but not RU-6. 

Perhaps @Andykong can get with engineering and get an answer why some cables can, and some cannot complete the audio chain from source to ears yet still power the device?


----------



## tjw321

dakchi said:


> Hi,
> I just received my RU6 and plugged it to my Macbook Pro. I played music from Tidal app. I notice that sound cuts randomly very often. Is this normal?
> I used RU6 with an IEM that does not require a lot of power, but still I have to increase the volume to 70 to have enough juice. If RU6 is not powerful enough for an IEM, I can't imagine this thing can be used with headphones
> Out os the box, RU6 is disappointing. Bass overlaps with mids and soundstage is very narrow. Separation of instruments is not there. Sub-bass and mids are forward. RU6 struggles in busy songs where there are a lof instruments and vocals. I hope that with burn-in, things will get better, otherwise it will go back


I am in exactly the same position. I picked up my RU6 this morning and so far have only tried it with my Macbook Pro. However my experience is very different. I switched from high gain to low gain, I had no issues with sound cuts (only an occasional click when I was changing settings, so not a surprise) and the sound is really good. I mean _really_ good.

FWIW my Macbook is the 16" pro from 2019, so an Intel one and I was using the original Sennheiser Momentum headphones.

Maybe the Tidal app is causing problems?


----------



## CrocodileDundee

captblaze said:


> I have a few cables that power up the RU-6, but no audio is present while playing a track. switch to a different cable and magically the audio is pushed to my ears.
> The same cable works with other dongles, but not RU-6.
> 
> Perhaps @Andykong can get with engineering and get an answer why some cables can, and some cannot complete the audio chain from source to ears yet still power the device?


The guys already answered here, your cable needs to be able to push 5W, not all cable does it. Good quality ones will do. I have an OTG cable fro Fiio and it doesn’t work on RU6, I had to get another one from Hiby to get it working with my iPhone.


----------



## captblaze

CrocodileDundee said:


> The guys already answered here, your cable needs to be able to push 5W, not all cable does it. Good quality ones will do. I have an OTG cable fro Fiio and it doesn’t work on RU6, I had to get another one from Hiby to get it working with my iPhone.


thanks... although at least one of my failures supposedly can match that requirement.


----------



## dakchi

TYATYA said:


> Your cable or mac is the reason.
> My ru6 ok (I am with Android) but I know my ak120ii got problem with a cable of Anker (comes with Anker battery pack). After I use charging cable of samsung phones and be ok, I know cable is a big thing to be checked.
> The cable with ru6 (for android) is ok but I still think it's not full specs of usb-C, bcs when I connect my ak sp1000 to my phone using that cable, nothing happen (no connection is made)


Actually I am using the cable that comes with RU6. When I use it with my iPhone, I have no problem. There might be a compatibility issue with Macbook. I have the latest Macbook Pro
Using my iphone, I don't have to increase the volume as much as Macbook, but the sound is still congested. When I A/B compare with Dragonfly Cobalt, it is very clear that Cobalt opens-up the sound much more and has a much better soundstage. Will the burn-in significantly improve the sound of RU6? I will see, but so far I'm not convinced by RU6


----------



## dakchi

tjw321 said:


> I am in exactly the same position. I picked up my RU6 this morning and so far have only tried it with my Macbook Pro. However my experience is very different. I switched from high gain to low gain, I had no issues with sound cuts (only an occasional click when I was changing settings, so not a surprise) and the sound is really good. I mean _really_ good.
> 
> FWIW my Macbook is the 16" pro from 2019, so an Intel one and I was using the original Sennheiser Momentum headphones.
> 
> Maybe the Tidal app is causing problems?


I switched to low gain but still have the problem of sound cuts. I don't have it with my iphone though
Good that you like the sound out of the box, but maybe you did not compare it with other dongles. I compared it with Dragonfly Cobalt and it is far superior in all possible ways. Maybe the burn-in will improve the sound but so far the Cobalt is a clear winner


----------



## tjw321

dakchi said:


> I switched to low gain but still have the problem of sound cuts. I don't have it with my iphone though
> Good that you like the sound out of the box, but maybe you did not compare it with other dongles. I compared it with Dragonfly Cobalt and it is far superior in all possible ways. Maybe the burn-in will improve the sound but so far the Cobalt is a clear winner


It compares well with all my hardware. For example Chord Mojo, FiiO M11 Plus LTD, and even my ifi micro stack so I don't think it is due to a lack of references to compare it with .
I don't think there will be any real difference with changing the gain settings. I mentioned that merely to illustrate that there is plenty of power available for me.
It sounds like you may have an M1 Mac. Is there an M1 native Tidal app yet? That could be an issue.


----------



## sahmen (Jan 15, 2022)

dakchi said:


> I switched to low gain but still have the problem of sound cuts. I don't have it with my iphone though
> Good that you like the sound out of the box, but maybe you did not compare it with other dongles. I compared it with Dragonfly Cobalt and it is far superior in all possible ways. Maybe the burn-in will improve the sound but so far the Cobalt is a clear winner


Okay, sorry to show you this photo, if you have already seen it before on this thread. The point I am making, for what it is worth, is that this setup appears to be very similar to yours, and I can assure you that the RU6 rocks i like bonkers in it with no apparent downsides, even as compared to the performance of my more costly desktop rigs. The only cutouts I have ever experienced are those little "blips" that sometimes occur when my finger lingers for a bit too long on the volume knob. While I am not sure where your issue is coming from, I am just hoping this data point will help you sort out the problem : a fully functional MBP plays very nicely with a fully functional RU6 : their pairing is meant to be hassle-free plug and play 






Hoping you get the problem sorted ASAP, as there is a lot of audio goodness awaiting you at the end of this (hopefully minor) troubleshooting "tunnel"


----------



## tjw321

sahmen said:


> Okay, sorry to show you this photo, if you have already seen it before on this thread. The point I am making, for what it is worth, is that this setup appears to be very similar to yours, and I can assure you that the RU6 rocks i like bonkers in it with no apparent downsides, even as compared to the performance of my more costly desktop rigs. The only cutouts I have ever experienced are those little "blips" that sometimes occur when my finger lingers for a bit too long on the volume knob. While I am not sure where your issue is coming from, I am just hoping this data point will help you sort out the problem : a fully functional MBP plays very nicely with a fully functional RU6 : their pairing is meant to be hassle-free plug and play
> 
> 
> 
> Hoping you get the problem sorted ASAP, as there is a lot of audio goodness awaiting you at the end of this (hopefully minor) troubleshooting "tunnel"


Yes. Exactly my experience - but you said it so much better. Thank you.


----------



## dakchi

tjw321 said:


> It compares well with all my hardware. For example Chord Mojo, FiiO M11 Plus LTD, and even my ifi micro stack so I don't think it is due to a lack of references to compare it with .
> I don't think there will be any real difference with changing the gain settings. I mentioned that merely to illustrate that there is plenty of power available for me.
> It sounds like you may have an M1 Mac. Is there an M1 native Tidal app yet? That could be an issue.


Yes I have a M1 Pro Mac. I don't know if the Tidal app is native but it doesn't matter. I don't have the problem of sound cuts with my other dongle Dragonfly Cobalt. Anyway, since I don't have that problem with iPhone, it's still OK. I bought RU6 to use it with my iPhone
I haven't heard any of your gears, but to me RU6 provides a congested sound so far. Yes it is warm but soundstage and separation of instruments is not on par with my Dragonfly Cobalt. I guess these are the areas where ESS Dacs are excellent. I'll see what burn-in will do


----------



## TYATYA

dakchi said:


> Actually I am using the cable that comes with RU6. When I use it with my iPhone, I have no problem. There might be a compatibility issue with Macbook. I have the latest Macbook Pro
> Using my iphone, I don't have to increase the volume as much as Macbook, but the sound is still congested. When I A/B compare with Dragonfly Cobalt, it is very clear that Cobalt opens-up the sound much more and has a much better soundstage. Will the burn-in significantly improve the sound of RU6? I will see, but so far I'm not convinced by RU6


You'd better to try with usbC cable of a samsung phone like Note or S series.
I am sure it is fully functioning cable for chargingn data..etc.
(Or just my case, it's best bcs my phone is ss one).

Ru6 supprised me at unboxing moment with its base and mid.
I just found a strange thing: volume lvl seems up down continuosly and slightly but sure it was there.
After 3 hours it's gone.
I don’t need wait untill pass 80-100hours. Got satisfying at day 2 (after volume variation matter gone).

I compare to 2.5 out from ak sp1000, hdvd800 amp... and shortest word on ru6: Worth!
Special think I got: my ears can stand when crank up volume with ru6 than others source.
Sp1000 feed Ru6 or direct analog or toslink to Hdvd800 dac/amp. Hd800s


----------



## Hyde00

dakchi said:


> Yes I have a M1 Pro Mac. I don't know if the Tidal app is native but it doesn't matter. I don't have the problem of sound cuts with my other dongle Dragonfly Cobalt. Anyway, since I don't have that problem with iPhone, it's still OK. I bought RU6 to use it with my iPhone
> I haven't heard any of your gears, but to me RU6 provides a congested sound so far. Yes it is warm but soundstage and separation of instruments is not on par with my Dragonfly Cobalt. I guess these are the areas where ESS Dacs are excellent. I'll see what burn-in will do


I bought a RU6 off a fellow member here but it hasn't arrive yet.  Will update you guys once I got it.

But in general as you said that I do find ESS tend to be more "airy" sounding, and R2R is a bit "thicker" sounding which might seem more congested.  Different pros and cons since I do find ESS is better at presenting space while R2R is more correct timbre.

Though they do recommend at least 100+ hours burn in so hopefully it clear up after.

I'll let you know once I get my unit (might be a while though, shipping across boarder sucks LOL).  But my daily driver now is Dragonfly Red and I did have Dragonfly Cobalt previously.


----------



## dakchi

I played music from my Macbook hard drive (not Tidal) and I still have sound cuts. I'm on low gain with volume at 60. It's the same cut as when we switch from OS to NOS. By the way, do you prefer OS or NOS?


----------



## TYATYA

dakchi said:


> ... RU6 provides a congested sound so far. Yes it is warm but soundstage and separation of instruments is not on par with my Dragonfly Cobalt. ...


It's right. Congested, untidy, not organized instruments.
Pinpoint, layering, spacing... is not a strongest point of it.
Mid is so exposure...
Burn-in will helps.
Mine unit is over 240 hours, and above characteristics still fall behind my stuff but I this ru6 is the one I can listen to it at higher SPL than others.
And it can handle complex music tracks, even when drive directly a fullsize hp


----------



## dakchi

The sound cuts on my Macbook Pro don't seem to go no matter what I do. Am I the only one who has this problem? it might be that I have a defective RU6


----------



## sahmen (Jan 15, 2022)

I'm sorry but characteristics such as "congested" and "untidy" do not resonate at all with my experience of the RU6. When it arrived, I listened to it exclusively with my LCD-5, and later with my Hifiman Arya Stealth Magnets, for more than two consecutive weeks, while easily ignoring and not missing either my Niimbus US4/Sonnet Morpheus or my YggyA2/Pathos InPol stacks at all.  Sure these latter stacks are better performing, as they should be.  Yet if the RU6 had sounded even remotely like some congested, sub-par, and untidy mess lacking separation and air,  and glitching endlessly, neglecting my other rigs for 2 consecutive weeks would have been an exercise in sheer masochism.


Of course, there was no such "masochism" in the 2-week experience I have just described...  I am not claiming that anyone is deliberately misrepresenting their experiences with the RU6 here. I do recognize that "mileages" in subjective preferences legitimately vary.  However, there is something about the current discordant and conflicting impressions that is making me suspect there is still some aspect of this entire picture that requires further clarification.


----------



## sahmen

dakchi said:


> The sound cuts on my Macbook Pro don't seem to go no matter what I do. Am I the only one who has this problem? it might be that I have a defective RU6


I'm really sorry that you're having this experience.  It is making me wish I was close by so that I can swap mine with yours in order to help you diagnose the problem quickly, and hopefully fix it.  Have you tried e-mailing your dealer for a possible replacement, just in case?


----------



## TYATYA

dakchi said:


> The sound cuts on my Macbook Pro don't seem to go no matter what I do. Am I the only one who has this problem? it might be that I have a defective RU6


May not.
1. It work with ur ip
2. Reason may be connection/usbC port/music app

Do you have NeutronMp app to try when it controll ru6 fully?
I think you can let ur unit operates 10 hours continously.
Then reconnect again and confirm.

P.S my unit has pass 3 times temperature raise up to abnormal than usual. Hot, but not too hot, not kind of harmful.
If Apple product was connected in that case, will be lack of energy but mine phone is android. It drives hd800s via ru6 directly w/o lacking power


----------



## Andykong (Jan 15, 2022)

dakchi said:


> The sound cuts on my Macbook Pro don't seem to go no matter what I do. Am I the only one who has this problem? it might be that I have a defective RU6


Can you describe your cnnection? Or show us a photo of your setting? 

Did you turn the volume of your MacBook to max.?

Are you using an OTG USB A-to-C cable from MacBook Pro to RU6? or the A-to-C adapter and short C-to-C cable that come with RU6？ What music App are you using when you playback your own music in MacBook Pro?


----------



## dakchi

Andykong said:


> Can you describe your cnnection? Or show us a photo of your setting?
> 
> Did you turn the volume of your MacBook to max.?
> 
> Are you using an OTG USB A-to-C cable from MacBook Pro to RU6? or the A-to-C adapter and short C-to-C cable that come with RU6？ What music App are you using when you playback your own music in MacBook Pro?


I'm connecting RU6 to my Macbook Pro M1 using the stock cable  C to C that comes with RU6
When selecting RU6 as sound output, the volume of Macbook is not used
I have tested with Tidal, Youtube, music stored in my NAS and played in my Macbook...I always have sound cuts. If I use the same cable to connect to iPhone through camera adapter, I have no sound cut

Apparently someone who has an Intel Macbook Pro had the same issue, but it has been fixed by changing to low gain. I did the same but I still have sound cuts


----------



## tjw321

dakchi said:


> ...
> Apparently someone who has an Intel Macbook Pro had the same issue, but it has been fixed by changing to low gain. I did the same but I still have sound cuts


I think you mean me, but that isn't what I meant. I didn't have any issues. One of your problems was insufficient power and my comment was illustrating that I had more than enough power to the extent that I switched to low gain because that was sufficient for me. As I said before:
"I don't think there will be any real difference with changing the gain settings. I mentioned that merely to illustrate that there is plenty of power available for me."
Apologies if I wasn't clear.


----------



## dakchi

Hello,
I have good news: after rebooting my Macbook Pro, I'm not getting sound cuts anymore with RU6. I can't explain why but it looks my RU6 does not have any problem. Now let burn-in starts. I will give my impressions after 100h


----------



## Hyde00 (Jan 15, 2022)

dakchi said:


> Hello,
> I have good news: after rebooting my Macbook Pro, I'm not getting sound cuts anymore with RU6. I can't explain why but it looks my RU6 does not have any problem. Now let burn-in starts. I will give my impressions after 100h


Can't go wrong with the classic "turn if off, unplug, wait 30 seconds, plug it back, turn it back on" fix to anything computer related issues LOL.

But very happy to hear you got it sorted out.


----------



## dakchi

Hyde00 said:


> Can't go wrong with the classic "turn if off, unplug, wait 30 seconds, plug it back ,turn it back on" fix to anything computer related issues LOL.


Things have evolved. In the past, we had to format the pc to fix these issues LOL


----------



## oldkid

dakchi said:


> Actually I am using the cable that comes with RU6. When I use it with my iPhone, I have no problem. There might be a compatibility issue with Macbook. I have the latest Macbook Pro
> Using my iphone, I don't have to increase the volume as much as Macbook, but the sound is still congested. When I A/B compare with Dragonfly Cobalt, it is very clear that Cobalt opens-up the sound much more and has a much better soundstage. Will the burn-in significantly improve the sound of RU6? I will see, but so far I'm not convinced by RU6


A similar behavior exist on Android that is comparable with what you're describing on Macbook.
When the DAC receive the wrong sample rate, the sound is weak and very bad quality.
You have to make sure that the DAC is able to bypass the fixed system-wide sample rate, typically 48khz on Android.
As soon as it can do that, it will sound fantastic in NOS or OS mode


----------



## sahmen (Jan 15, 2022)

oldkid said:


> A similar behavior exist on Android that is comparable with what you're describing on Macbook.
> When the DAC receive the wrong sample rate, the sound is weak and very bad quality.
> You have to make sure that the DAC is able to bypass the fixed system-wide sample rate, typically 48khz on Android.
> As soon as it can do that, it will sound fantastic in NOS or OS mode


This sounds like an idea that would typically calls for tweaks in the Mac's audio midi settings, if I'm reading this correctly.  I am glad the OP has been able to get the problem resolved with a simple reboot.


----------



## yfei (Jan 16, 2022)

dakchi said:


> I used RU6 with an IEM that does not require a lot of power, but still I have to increase the volume to 70 to have enough juice. If RU6 is not powerful enough for an IEM, I can't imagine this thing can be used with headphones
> Out os the box, RU6 is disappointing. Bass overlaps with mids and soundstage is very narrow. Separation of instruments is not there. Sub-bass and mids are forward. RU6 struggles in busy songs where there are a lof instruments and vocals. I hope that with burn-in, things will get better, otherwise it will go back


What IEM do you use?   with 64 Audio U12 I use volume 15~22, low gain.     (in balanced mode, volume 10~20)

Regarding sound quality,   balanced mode will have better clarity and less congested.
And give it more listen.  Comparing to great DS dacs, RU6 doesn't win on details,  it wins on 'presentation'


----------



## Andykong

dakchi said:


> Hello,
> I have good news: after rebooting my Macbook Pro, I'm not getting sound cuts anymore with RU6. I can't explain why but it looks my RU6 does not have any problem. Now let burn-in starts. I will give my impressions after 100h


Glad your problem is solved. Looks like  your MacBook Pro couldn't recognise the dongle until reboot.  Your impression sounds like turning down the volume of my mobile phone to below 50, may be we can learn from your experience and be able to help new comers better down the road.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

RU6 arrived 3 days ago and I'm curious about something. If I use Jriver Media Center, I get a lot more volume at a given volume level when compared to just using Youtube or Groove Music.

For example: If I played a song on Windows Groove Music and need to set the volume on RU6 at ~60 for normal listening. The same file played on Jriver with the same cable & Headphones needs only ~46 volume level to sound equally loud. I used balanced in both scenarios.

Volume on Windows & Groove is set to Max and samplerate is set to 44.1Hz, file is a 44.1Hz Flac. Same thing with Youtube (Chrome) vs the video downloaded and played on Jriver.

What could the reason be? Not sure if it's because of the extra volume but RU6 sounds better with JRiver.


----------



## rarewolf

Johnfg465vd said:


> RU6 arrived 3 days ago and I'm curious about something. If I use Jriver Media Center, I get a lot more volume at a given volume level when compared to just using Youtube or Groove Music.
> 
> For example: If I played a song on Windows Groove Music and need to set the volume on RU6 at ~60 for normal listening. The same file played on Jriver with the same cable & Headphones needs only ~46 volume level to sound equally loud. I used balanced in both scenarios.
> 
> ...


It could be that Groove and Youtube are using the default Windows audio output driver while you were able to specifically choose a different audio driver, or driver options, with JRiver. 

Have you tried streaming JRiver to a smartphone yet?


----------



## tod-hackett (Jan 16, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> RU6 arrived 3 days ago and I'm curious about something. If I use Jriver Media Center, I get a lot more volume at a given volume level when compared to just using Youtube or Groove Music.
> 
> For example: If I played a song on Windows Groove Music and need to set the volume on RU6 at ~60 for normal listening. The same file played on Jriver with the same cable & Headphones needs only ~46 volume level to sound equally loud. I used balanced in both scenarios.
> 
> ...


I am not sure about the reason but you might be able to further your own insight by using Windows Loudness Equalization in the sound settings. I am not entirely sure if loudness equalization is still an option these days but it normalizes the sound levels.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

rarewolf said:


> It could be that Groove and Youtube are using the default Windows audio output driver while you were able to specifically choose a different audio driver, or driver options, with JRiver.


Yes, I'm using ASIO with JRiver & RU6. I never had other DACs sound louder with ASIO though, is it something unique to R2R? I will try setting the driver to WASAPI or Direct Sound and see if there is any difference.



rarewolf said:


> Have you tried streaming JRiver to a smartphone yet?


No, do you want me to?



tod-hackett said:


> I am not sure about the reason but you might be able to further your own insight by using Windows Loudness Equalization in the sound settings. I am not entirely sure if loudness equalization is still an option these days but it normalizes the sound levels.


I don't want to increase the volume, just curious why there would be a volume level difference. Aren't you messing with signal purity using loudness equalization? It's been awhile but the last time I tried volume normalization, the dynamic range took a hit so I tend to avoid any sort of normalization.


----------



## captblaze

@Johnfg465vd - is replay gain enabled?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

captblaze said:


> @Johnfg465vd - is replay gain enabled?


No, running everything as pure as possible on both instances. Only difference is JRiver using ASIO. Will try other drivers when I get back home and report my findings.


----------



## rarewolf

captblaze said:


> @Johnfg465vd - is replay gain enabled?


Good catch! If that’s the answer, the OP should be able to create a “RU6” zone player that would allow independent output options for streaming to DACs…

@Johnfg465vd … No, I didn’t need you to try streaming to your smartphone. It’s just that it’s my primary use of my Cayin. I haven’t yet gotten around to Windows…


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 16, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> No, running everything as pure as possible on both instances. Only difference is JRiver using ASIO. Will try other drivers when I get back home and report my findings.


So, ‘output format’ (which offers gain, gain equality, equalizer, …) is disabled under JR MC settings(?)

For output to my AVR, my MC ‘audio device’ is set to something other than default Windows driver (direct sound or WASAPI). That is, my nVidea hardware/driver (HDMI) can actually acknowledge my Denon AVR, and MC offers that output as either ‘direct sound’ or ‘WASAPI’. I suspect your MC settings offer you something similar, and that it’s set to something other than the Windows default(?)

Edit: Here is advice from another DAC manufacturer for ensuring bitperfect streaming from JR MC via the DAC’s driver. It might provide some insight while not being entirely applicable…
https://exasound.com/Blog/tabid/74/...perfect-ASIO-Playback-with-exaSound-DACs.aspx

Edit#2: Although I often find needing updates, JR’s wiki should also provide some insight…
https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/DAC_Settings


----------



## rarewolf

I installed the Windows RU6 driver on mt Windows 10 Photoshop workstation this morning, and it offers an audio driver option that I can find no information on. Other than drivers for other hardware, I now have a choice of 4 options for the RU6:

Cayin RU6 USB device (ASIO)​Cayin RU6 [WASAPI]​Cayin RU6 [kernel streaming]​Cayin RU6 [Direct Sound]​
I believe the top option showed up without installing the driver (but the installation could’ve updated it). What is the difference between it and the “kernel streaming” option?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

rarewolf said:


> I installed the Windows RU6 driver on mt Windows 10 Photoshop workstation this morning, and it offers an audio driver option that I can find no information on. Other than drivers for other hardware, I now have a choice of 4 options for the RU6:
> 
> Cayin RU6 USB device (ASIO)​Cayin RU6 [WASAPI]​Cayin RU6 [kernel streaming]​Cayin RU6 [Direct Sound]​
> I believe the top option showed up without installing the driver (but the installation could’ve updated it). What is the difference between it and the “kernel streaming” option?


Just use ASIO or WASAPI (with Exclusive access).

WASAPI is a newer API which has windows support and is updated routinely.

ASIO drivers provided by the Manufacturer (Cayin in this case) are better than Direct Sound or third party plugins like ASIO4ALL.

Kernal Streaming is an old or Legacy API.

From what I can remeber reading about them, All three send Bit-Perfect audio to the DAC and I doubt anyone would notice the difference between them.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

I had to face palm myself for a bit. After trying to analyze different combination to try and figure out my volume level problem when using JRiver for half an hour.

A simple restart of my PC and that problem is gone. Not sure why it happened but everything works as it should. Maybe keeping my PC "On" for more than a week is not a good idea.


----------



## oldkid

Johnfg465vd said:


> Just use ASIO or WASAPI (with Exclusive access).
> 
> WASAPI is a newer API which has windows support and is updated routinely.
> 
> ...


Kernel streaming is the oldest method but it doesn't mean it's obsolete. Audirvana rely on it to implement its most advanced features.

It's the same for R2R design being dismissed by some audiophile because it's older than delta sigma DAC chips


----------



## Hyde00

Johnfg465vd said:


> I had to face palm myself for a bit. After trying to analyze different combination to try and figure out my volume level problem when using JRiver for half an hour.
> 
> A simple restart of my PC and that problem is gone. Not sure why it happened but everything works as it should. Maybe keeping my PC "On" for more than a week is not a good idea.


Lol it's ok you're not alone, we just talked about this in the previous page. It happens.


----------



## alota

oldkid said:


> Kernel streaming is the oldest method but it doesn't mean it's obsolete. Audirvana rely on it to implement its most advanced features.
> 
> It's the same for R2R design being dismissed by some audiophile because it's older than delta sigma DAC chips


I'w waiting for a dac with older philips tda1541 lol


----------



## dakchi

I'm looking for a good lightning cable for my RU6. Any recommendation? I have shortlisted oeaudio and DDHifi cables. Anyone has experience with those?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

oldkid said:


> Kernel streaming is the oldest method but it doesn't mean it's obsolete. Audirvana rely on it to implement its most advanced features.
> 
> It's the same for R2R design being dismissed by some audiophile because it's older than delta sigma DAC chips


I've got nothing against Kernel streaming. I just stated that it's an older API (which it is). I also said all three (WASAPI, ASIO & Kernel) should be fine and will send Bit-Perfect audio. The only reason I did not suggest Kernel Streaming option is because I sometimes had some stutters and errors pop up at playback when using that driver. Not sure if it was because of the driver or JRiver, last I tried that option was more than 2 years ago so... maybe it's fixed with newer updates. I honestly cannot tell a difference between ASIO or WASAPI Exclusive so I doubt Kernel Streaming would be any different.

If someone wants to dismiss R2R design without trying, just because they are older designs, that's their loss, Who cares. Having tried the RU6, I do think it has it's benefits and also some disadvantages compared to DS Designs. Some of these have already been covered by others with some of the comparisons like that of W2 & RU6 in aspects like clarity, details... e.t.c. I'll share my impressions soon, I'm almost done with my notes.


----------



## PA3BPAT

Andykong said:


> For Oversampling mode, the Digital Audio Bridge will upsample the digital audio data to 384kHz through digital filters.


Why to 384kHz ONLY? Records with 44.1/88.2/176.4/DXD are not multiples from 48kHz (as 384kHz is), so "oversampling" them to 352.8kHz would bring less distortion and will not generate digital noice from imprecise recalculation.

And let me reiterate previously ignored question: why 24Bit/768kHz not 24Bit/705.6kHz? DSD frequencies of commercially delivered files are multiples of 44.1kHz, not 48kHz...

I hope those questions are not too uncomfortable...


----------



## Andykong

Another raving review on Cayin RU6 Dongle DAC/Amp, they just keep comoing.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			










> "It is an arduous task to design a step volume combined with an R-2R circuit from the ground up but the effort seems worth it with some unexpectedly good transients from a USB-powered audio device.
> The output on RU6 is exceptionally natural, smoothly articulated, and organic in presentation for a dongle product, and that alone immediately puts it in the tier of TOTL dongles ...."


Please check out *Headfonics review *to find out why James give RU6 the highest score among all Dongle DAC/Amp.


----------



## Andykong

PieroIM said:


> Thank you for the additional feedback on this topic. As I wrote in one of my previous post, making a portable DAC allow you to use the microphone would, in my opinion, be a wise choice and a great selling point...because nowadays "portable" for such a device means connected to the smartphone.



We have no plan to include such feature in RU6 or any Donble DAC product since our early R&D feasibility. 

The Dongle DAC are designed for one-way communication: audio signal from mobile phone to Dongle DAC to headphone/IEM.  The feature you suggested required to add a secondary route pass your audio speech from inline mic back to mobile phone via USB Audio, most likely after some very simple Analog-to-digital conversoin process.  We can't achieve that without imposing negative implication to sound quality of the Dongle DAC.

Have you identified any high-fidelity based Dongle DAC that offer this feature?  Maybe we can learn from them?


----------



## dakchi

dakchi said:


> I'm looking for a good lightning cable for my RU6. Any recommendation? I have shortlisted oeaudio and DDHifi cables. Anyone has experience with those?


I will appreciate your recommendations. Thanks


----------



## Andykong

keenears said:


> Well, considering I’ve been indirectly mocked here for the splitter topic I’ll have to give up using this dongle. Drains my Walkman battery in less than an hour. Around 45 minutes. No joke. The NW-A105 doesn’t have wireless charging. I can use it with my iPad or iPhone but I never listen to music on them. Too bad because it sounds and looks great with its orange case connected to the TPS2 case on my Walkman, which always had the orange Hot Line button on the classic. What a waste



Someone has proposed to DIY splitter for RU6 in Facebook group, you can check it out *HERE*.


For the recrod, the USB 3.0 cable is composed to two power conductors and 6 data conductors. Any cable makers who offer after-market USB Audio cable should be able to custom make this splitter cable.


----------



## Andykong

ekjellgren said:


> There really should be some way to document these forum conclusions. Because they are worth their weight in gold, but are often lost in all other information. And every conclusion gets repeated over and over again. Perhaps a wiki page connected to each product thread?



If someone can compile a list, I can include them at the end of the opening post of this thread at page 1.


----------



## Andykong (Jan 17, 2022)

captblaze said:


> I have a few cables that power up the RU-6, but no audio is present while playing a track. switch to a different cable and magically the audio is pushed to my ears.
> The same cable works with other dongles, but not RU-6.
> 
> Perhaps @Andykong can get with engineering and get an answer why some cables can, and some cannot complete the audio chain from source to ears yet still power the device?





CrocodileDundee said:


> The guys already answered here, your cable needs to be able to push 5W, not all cable does it. Good quality ones will do. I have an OTG cable fro Fiio and it doesn’t work on RU6, I had to get another one from Hiby to get it working with my iPhone.



Thankyou for helping out, was kind of occupied by a new product translation work in past few days (probably till end of month), I couldn't go through all quesitons thoroughly for a while.

Someone shared a feedback on Lightning to USB-C cable earlier on (on the same page, only 10 posts away), if you click into the *link*, there is a small section that wrote:


> Most of the Lightning OTG cables, which have output of 3.3V 100mA cannot fulfill the need for portable DACs. We redesigned the circuit, which the OEOTG cable can achieve a 5V 200mA output



So the requirement is not unique to RU6, I am surprised that this information has not been widely spread given Dongle DAC is such a hot toic in 2021 and Cayin was  infact a late comer to this category.


----------



## Andykong

PA3BPAT said:


> May I ask why 24Bit/768kHz not 24Bit/705.6kHz? DSD frequencies of commercially delivered files are multiples of 44.1kHz, not 48kHz...





PA3BPAT said:


> Why to 384kHz ONLY? Records with 44.1/88.2/176.4/DXD are not multiples from 48kHz (as 384kHz is), so "oversampling" them to 352.8kHz would bring less distortion and will not generate digital noice from imprecise recalculation.
> 
> And let me reiterate previously ignored question: why 24Bit/768kHz not 24Bit/705.6kHz? DSD frequencies of commercially delivered files are multiples of 44.1kHz, not 48kHz...
> 
> I hope those questions are not too uncomfortable...



No, no where near uncomfortable in any sense, I just missed your question earllier on.  

Majority of RU6 users are connecting their Dongle DAC to mobile phones and modern smart phones all designed with some of Sample Rate conversion in  place. From what we understand, 48kHz and 192kHz are the most frequently used default SRC setting, so we implement our oversampling algorithm based on the assumption that 48kHz and 192kHz are the *mode* of RU6 input sample frequencies, stistically speaking.  

For users who want to maintain the "quality"of original sampling frequency, the NOS option will provide that option already.


----------



## Stuff Jones

Andykong said:


> I wish there is a chance that we can showcase our prouded, uncompromised version of RU6.



Any chance of releasing an RU6 Pro version that isn't restricted by Apple power limitations? I listen from my laptop mostly, and can only imagine how good the RU6 with a better amp could sound.


----------



## Andykong

Stuff Jones said:


> Any chance of releasing an RU6 Pro version that isn't restricted by Apple power limitations? I listen from my laptop mostly, and can only imagine how good the RU6 with a better amp could sound.



That you don't have to imagine.  RU6Pro = RU6 with better resistors, better amplifier and better audio bridge = R01.


----------



## oldkid (Jan 17, 2022)

Andykong said:


> That you don't have to imagine.  RU6Pro = RU6 with better resistors, better amplifier and better audio bridge = R01.


If you increased the size of the casing, would you be still able to include that quality of components in a USB dongle?

A slightly larger unit the size of a FiiO Q3 would be perfect for your next R2R dongle DAC in my opinion.

R2R sound so good that they don't have to be as small as chip based DACs if it means compromising sound quality.


----------



## Andykong

oldkid said:


> If you increased the size of the casing, would you be still able to include that quality of components in a USB dongle?
> 
> A slightly larger unit the size of a FiiO Q3 would be perfect for your next R2R dongle DAC in my opinion.
> 
> R2R sound so good that they don't have to be as small as chip based DACs if it means compromising sound quality.



Smaller size won't have a lot of implication to core digital circuit, budget is the bottleneck here.  The thin film resistors of R01 and RU6 are the same size.  We need to trim down the pre-DAC digital circuit ( Audio Bridge) but if you have high quality digital source, the difference is less significant.

Smaller size will limit the power supply and analogue circuit, especially output power.


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 17, 2022)

Andykong said:


> […]
> So the requirement is not unique to RU6, I am surprised that this information has not been widely spread given Dongle DAC is such a hot toic in 2021 and Cayin was  infact a late comer to this category.


Hmmmm(?) … the optional Cayin OTG cable works just fine with my iPhone Xs, and only drops its battery ~10-15% per hour(?)

Edit: Hmmm(?) … my apologies… I thought I had responded to a post claiming his iPhone was being drained in only a couple of hours, and had given up on the RU6… FRIG!…


----------



## Chill iLL

Doug2507 said:


> I'm using mine primarily with tablet / phone for video duties and have noticed that it constantly pops when source is paused / played / changed. When there's something playing it's a non issue but rather annoying in between. Is this common?
> 
> Also getting significant static interference on both devices at low volume regardless of cable used.
> 
> It stands out as I didn't get this with S1...


Did you ever solve the interference? Does cable swapping help? I’m getting significant interference when using my iPhone- which is disappointing.


----------



## Doug2507

Chill iLL said:


> Did you ever solve the interference? Does cable swapping help? I’m getting significant interference when using my iPhone- which is disappointing.


I did. Solved it by swapping it out for an S2.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

I barely have interference with mine, mostly coming from the OTG cable. RU6 is much much better  than my old S1 , that was unusable.


----------



## Chill iLL

CrocodileDundee said:


> I barely have interference with mine, mostly coming from the OTG cable. RU6 is much much better  than my old S1 , that was unusable.


I picked up a new cable to see if it'll help.


----------



## PA3BPAT

Thanks, Andykong, for the answer. It tells more that it says )) I won't touch the subject anymore. Or almost anymore. ))



Andykong said:


> For users who want to maintain the "quality"of original sampling frequency, the NOS option will provide that option already.



But, again, not for DSD stream, where frequencies never match - NOS or OS regardles...

By the way, does R01 board follows the same frequencies conversion rules? 

Any chances/plans to make a PCIe docking DAC board able to accommodate R01/T01/E02 ? That one I would buy in an instance!


----------



## cybergalaxy

This looks like a great product.
Does anyone have experience to use this to drive 
HD6xx and dan clark audio aeon closed x? Both are hard to drive headphone and its seem the high gain setting of ru6 is not so good so I am a bit concerned. 

Thanks!


----------



## jsmiller58

What have you heard about the RU6 high gain and why you think it is not good?


----------



## twister6

jsmiller58 said:


> What have you heard about the RU6 high gain and why you think it is not good?



Wondering if he meant not enough power to drive those demanding headphones?


----------



## jsmiller58

twister6 said:


> Wondering if he meant not enough power to drive those demanding headphones?


That makes sense!


----------



## cybergalaxy

I think I saw some earlier threads stating the SQ in High gain mode is not nice. So I think if I buy it, I will stick to Low Gain setting but then I am not sure if it would be powerful enough to drive Headphone.... If anyone has any actual usage experience, it would be great to hear from you!


----------



## OspreyAndy

twister6 said:


> Wondering if he meant not enough power to drive those demanding headphones?


RU6 drives my 600 Ohm (96db sensitivity) Beyerdynamic DT880 great offering 80% of fidelity level as heard and compared against my ZEN DAC V2 + ZEN Can stack (which churned out 15.1 Vrms). And 90% fidelity for my equally stubborn magnetic planar of Fostex T40RP MK3 (50 Ohm, 91db sensitivity). The only other dongles that can do better are CEntrance DACport HD or Apogee Groove


----------



## Capunk

Might sound a bit strange but have anyone compared RU6 soundsig to Denafrips Ares II? how do they fare? soo curious


----------



## kumar402

Capunk said:


> Might sound a bit strange but have anyone compared RU6 soundsig to Denafrips Ares II? how do they fare? soo curious


RU6 doesn’t have a line out so I’m not sure at what volume does it output 2v. One is dongle for mobile use and one is proper desktop DAC  and are not really comparable.


----------



## Andykong (Jan 18, 2022)

cybergalaxy said:


> I think I saw some earlier threads stating the SQ in High gain mode is not nice. So I think if I buy it, I will stick to Low Gain setting but then I am not sure if it would be powerful enough to drive Headphone.... If anyone has any actual usage experience, it would be great to hear from you!



I don't think this is a valid generalisation, it is most likely a matter of synergy.  Did he mentioned the IEM or headphone he used to arrive at that conclusion? 

If someone arrive at the conclsuion that he prefer the SQ in low gain mode when he is using a typcial IEM, and then someone stated that he prefer the SQ in high gain mode when he is using a full size planar headphone, are they contradictive?  Definitely not.  The whole point to include a gain control is to facilitate more mix and match options with different handling requirements. 

Having said that, we must awared that RU6 is a Dongle DAC designed to work under the limitation of mobile phone power supply. If you plan to use it with full size headphone primarily, you have to live with certain compromise in performance. I would even suggest you to assume that the RU6 does not have enough power to drive your full size headphones, and you need to find evidence or audition opportunity disprove  your standpoint.  Since you are located in Hong Kong, finding a headphone shop to demo RU6 should be fairly straight forward, I definitley suggest you make the trip instead of figuring out your way to based on "I think I saw some earlier threads stating the ...."


----------



## Andykong

Capunk said:


> Might sound a bit strange but have anyone compared RU6 soundsig to Denafrips Ares II? how do they fare? soo curious



The Ares II is superior to RU6 is all area.  FULL STOP.

I heard the Ares II in a show previously, they are very competitive for their price.  There is no way RU6 can compete with Ares II on a speaker system or a properly setup desktop heapdhone system.


----------



## Andykong

Chill iLL said:


> I picked up a new cable to see if it'll help.



If interference is your main concern, please make sure the OTC cable are desinged with good shielding.


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> The Ares II is superior to RU6 is all area.  FULL STOP.
> 
> I heard the Ares II in a show previously, they are very competitive for their price.  There is no way RU6 can compete with Ares II on a speaker system or a properly setup desktop heapdhone system.


Love the candid and honest response Andy.  I still love the RU6 and it gives my Topping SingXer stack a run for its money!!


----------



## Andykong

PA3BPAT said:


> Thanks, Andykong, for the answer. It tells more that it says )) I won't touch the subject anymore. Or almost anymore. ))
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You are perfectly correctly, but since we can only select one clock frequency as base in RU6, when we need to select between 352.8kHz for DSD output and 384kHz for mobile phone output, the decision is pretty straight forward to us, we opted for 384kHz over sampling. 

The R01 is a completely different design on pre-DAC processing.  We adopted a hardware 8x oversampling solution for R01 but we only use the DSP filter upto 4x, so the output from oversamling chip is either 705.6kHz or 768kHz, depends on the sampling frequencyu of the incoming bitstream.   We can't accomodate the same solution in RU6 due to space, power consumption and budget consideration.

PCIe docking DAC board for computer? Never appear in any internal discussion.  I can safely say this is not going to happen.  If any computer manufacturing brand are interested in our solution and want to discuss OEM opportunities, our doors are opened.  Producing a PCIe board might be very similar to what we do right now, but we don't have the facilities to test thousands of PCIe boards after a production batch, let alone provide decent after sales support to our users.   Our sales networks are appliance based retailers, we need to develop a new sales network to sell and support  the new product.  This type of solution probably works better for brands like Creative or RME wjem they have approprite supporting system in place already.


----------



## oldkid

yaps66 said:


> Love the candid and honest response Andy.  I still love the RU6 and it gives my Topping SingXer stack a run for its money!!


Yes I guess the RU6 can't compete with a full size R2R DAC designed for a living room hi-fi system, but as my first R2R DAC, I find it to be the more musical of my dongle collection.

I don't know if I would describe its sound as "analog" but it certainly sounds as the high end CD players that I remember from the early 90s. 

I never had that feeling with a chip based DAC


----------



## Capunk

Andykong said:


> The Ares II is superior to RU6 is all area.  FULL STOP.
> 
> I heard the Ares II in a show previously, they are very competitive for their price.  There is no way RU6 can compete with Ares II on a speaker system or a properly setup desktop heapdhone system.


Appreciate your thought! thanks for the input!


----------



## cybergalaxy

yaps66 said:


> That makes perfect sense Andy. You have a great product in the RU6.  It is my perfect companion when I am on the road (together with my Hip Dac 2 though I tend to use the RU6 more often than not) whether this is plugged into my Win 10 PC or my iPhone.  I love the sound and cannot imagine life on the road without it!!! Just take our suggestions (and criticisms) here as our personal wish lists but ultimately you and your team and the best judge of what the next product should be.  Looking forward to it though!!!


How does the sound of RU6 compare against Hip Dac 2? I have a Hip Dac 1 and am looking to get RU6. Which headphone or IEM do you use btw?


----------



## yaps66

cybergalaxy said:


> How does the sound of RU6 compare against Hip Dac 2? I have a Hip Dac 1 and am looking to get RU6. Which headphone or IEM do you use btw?


They sound different and I love both so much so that I carry both on the road. The iem that is currently in my rotation are the Starlight, FD5, FD7, Timeless and ZexPro. I use the EM5 when I need to be more aware of my surroundings.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

cybergalaxy said:


> This looks like a great product.
> Does anyone have experience to use this to drive
> HD6xx and dan clark audio aeon closed x? Both are hard to drive headphone and its seem the high gain setting of ru6 is not so good so I am a bit concerned.
> 
> Thanks!


If it helps, I tried it with Sundara using Balanced Out, High Gain and can get good volume at ~80. Does it drive the Sundara to it's full potential, No. Like @Andykong said it's not really designed for Headphones.

It Sounds good with IEM's and I did not notice any sound quality difference between High & Low gain with IEM's. I think I see some benefit with High Gain on Meze 99C but could just be my brain being tricked by higher volume.


----------



## rarewolf

Johnfg465vd said:


> If it helps, I tried it with Sundara using Balanced Out, High Gain and can get good volume at ~80. Does it drive the Sundara to it's full potential, No. Like @Andykong said it's not really designed for Headphones.
> 
> It Sounds good with IEM's and I did not notice any sound quality difference between High & Low gain with IEM's. I think I see some benefit with High Gain on Meze 99C but could just be my brain being tricked by higher volume.


From what I can find, the Sundara headphones are less than 40ohms, so I’m a bit surprised the RU6 isn’t driving them that well. My Shure cans are rated very close to that, and single-ended listening volumes are only 40-60 although high gain(?)

On another subject, regarding the RU6’s power draw with balanced output, what are you using to power the DAC?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 18, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> From what I can find, the Sundara headphones are less than 40ohms, so I’m a bit surprised the RU6 isn’t driving them that well. My Shure cans are rated very close to that, and single-ended listening volumes are only 40-60 although high gain(?)
> 
> On another subject, regarding the RU6’s power draw with balanced output, what are you using to power the DAC?



Impedance is not a good sole-index to compare the laoding requirement of two headphones.

Wander which Shure headphone you are using? Shure SRH1540 is rated at 99 dB/mW at 46Ohm, SRH1840 is rated at 96 dB/ mW at 65 Ohms, so shall we use Shure SRH1540 as an example in our discussion?

The Sundara is rated at  94db/mW at 37Ω, that is 5dB lower in sensitivity when compare to Shure SRH1540.  Electrically, we can rougly estimat that Sundara will required 3.16 times more power than Shure SRH1540.   In addition, full size planar draws more current then dynamic drivers from the same impedance/sensitivity, so the Sundara can be even tougher if you take that into consideration.

But definitely, RU6 is not designed for full size headphones, they might work, but not necessarily desirable when compare to the performance of a decent desktop amplifier at the same price of your headphone.


----------



## oldkid

For now, I'm satisfied with how the RU6 drives my Focal Elegia, even on low gain. I can't physically go further than 60 or 62% volume.


----------



## OspreyAndy

Andykong said:


> Impedance is not a good sole-index to compare the laoding requirement of two headphones.
> 
> Wander which Shure headphone you are using? Shure SRH1540 is rated at 99 dB/mW at 46Ohm, SRH1840 is rated at 96 dB/ mW at 65 Ohms, so shall we use Shure SRH1540 as an example in our discussion?
> 
> ...


I must applaud your candid openness on this subject Andykong. While you made that declaration of RU6 not designed for headphones, yet here I am still using my RU6 to drive my Fostex T40RP MK3 (50 Ohm, 91db sensitivity) magnetic planar which is even harder to drive than Sundara. And I am not missing anything by much if I am to switch to my iFi ZEN Stacks. Without being critical at A/B, RU6 is amazingly capable of satisfying performances. But then perhaps need to factor in that I have trained my ears to listen at lower loudness, perhaps it is different for people who prefer higher level of outright volume


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> Impedance is not a good sole-index to compare the laoding requirement of two headphones.
> 
> Wander which Shure headphone you are using? Shure SRH1540 is rated at 99 dB/mW at 46Ohm, SRH1840 is rated at 96 dB/ mW at 65 Ohms, so shall we use Shure SRH1540 as an example in our discussion?
> 
> ...


Thank you straightening me out regarding the subtleties of understanding the fine points of audio. 

Yes, mine are the SRH1540, and they sound excellent driven by the RU6. It appears I’ve been listening to Bluetooth for too long, but I’ll still save shopping for pairing with IEMs until next Christmas…


----------



## rarewolf

OspreyAndy said:


> I must applaud your candid openness on this subject Andykong. While you made that declaration of RU6 not designed for headphones, yet here I am still using my RU6 to drive my Fostex T40RP MK3 (50 Ohm, 91db sensitivity) magnetic planar which is even harder to drive than Sundara. And I am not missing anything by much if I am to switch to my iFi ZEN Stacks. Without being critical at A/B, RU6 is amazingly capable of satisfying performances. But then perhaps need to factor in that I have trained my ears to listen at lower loudness, perhaps it is different for people who prefer higher level of outright volume


I replied similarly in the SRH1540 thread. The context was the difference and similarities of the 1540 v 940, and that many believe the 1540 is too warm. In fact, I thought so too the 1st time I tried them out at my usual listening level. However, this headphone/DAC/Amp marriage begs the question “Why am I at this listening level?” Dropping the volume lowers the dominance from the low end, and there’s no loss of detail and nuance due to the RU6”s unique control over volume. I imagine the RU6 has made lower volume listeners out of many of us…


----------



## yfei

Andykong said:


> ”making a portable DAC allow you to use the microphone would, in my opinion, be a wise choice and a great selling point...because nowadays "portable" for such a device means connected to the smartphone.“
> 
> We can't achieve that without imposing negative implication to sound quality of the Dongle DAC.   Have you identified any high-fidelity based Dongle DAC that offer this feature?  Maybe we can learn from them?



I don't know any USB Dongle DAC have this feature.       Bluetooth+USB hybrid DAC like Hiby R3 have this feature.
Personally I'd like dongles to have this feature.    Because I use my 64 Audio U12 as every-day headphone with my phone, carry it all the time to do everything including making phone calls,  tele-conferencing, etc.   (I use 3.5mm single end IEM cable with microphone and volume control buttons.   The sound quality of this calbe is actually quite excellent.)

 If adding this feature will compromise sound quality, then don't add it.


----------



## Andykong

OspreyAndy said:


> I must applaud your candid openness on this subject Andykong. While you made that declaration of RU6 not designed for headphones, yet here I am still using my RU6 to drive my Fostex T40RP MK3 (50 Ohm, 91db sensitivity) magnetic planar which is even harder to drive than Sundara. And I am not missing anything by much if I am to switch to my iFi ZEN Stacks. Without being critical at A/B, RU6 is amazingly capable of satisfying performances. But then perhaps need to factor in that I have trained my ears to listen at lower loudness, perhaps it is different for people who prefer higher level of outright volume



Thank you very much for the kind word.  

Indeed, having administer shows and event for several years and meeting hundreds of headfiers in different environment, I noticed that the preferred listening level and ambience nosie level (especially for open-back headphones) contributes signifantly when we consider the issue of can or cannot drive something satisfactory.  So someone like you who tends to listen at lower loudness and having the Sundara in an quiet personal office vs someone playing EDM at sitting room with household members and TV are totally different requirements.  

Maybe my philosophy is slightly different, I think steering people away from inappropriate choice is as important as attracting potential customer from buying our product.  If I pull someone onboard knowing this is a marginal case, and the case turn sour, he/she probably won't come back again.  On the other hand, if I steer someone away so that he/she has a better music experience, I am sure I'll meet him/her again down the road and win him/her onboard for good.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Thank you straightening me out regarding the subtleties of understanding the fine points of audio.
> 
> Yes, mine are the SRH1540, and they sound excellent driven by the RU6. It appears I’ve been listening to Bluetooth for too long, but I’ll still save shopping for pairing with IEMs until next Christmas…



Next Christmas?  You are a visionary, most HeadFiers are planning their shopping in month or even weeks, you are planning for next Christmas already.   

Keeping looking out for new toys that will bring you closer to your music, maybe you'll find something interesting ealier than you expected.


----------



## LoryWiv

yfei said:


> I don't know any USB Dongle DAC have this feature.       Bluetooth+USB hybrid DAC like Hiby R3 have this feature.
> Personally I'd like dongles to have this feature.    Because I use my 64 Audio U12 as every-day headphone with my phone, carry it all the time to do everything including making phone calls,  tele-conferencing, etc.   (I use 3.5mm single end IEM cable with microphone and volume control buttons.   The sound quality of this calbe is actually quite excellent.)
> 
> If adding this feature will compromise sound quality, then don't add it.


Perhaps I am misreading the requested feature description but it sounds like my FiiO BTR5. I'm not suggesting it's as innovative as RU6, but when working I connect it as USB DAC to my PC, also paired with my phone. I plug in my favorite IEM's, listen to music and if an incoming call comes in I can answer from the unit, using BTR5's built in mic for the call. It is quite nice to be able to listen to music while working w/o concern I'll miss a call due to being immersed in my music.


----------



## cybergalaxy

briantrinh86 said:


> Incredible value for r2r portable dac. It beats chord mojo in any aspects


Just to clarify: did you conduct ab test between mojo vs Ru6?


----------



## domiji

I received my RU6 last week and i really enjoyed it so far. Very fluid and organic sound. Normally i want to use it as a interim solution until my Lotoo PAW Gold Touch Titanium arrives but seriously with my IEMs there is maybe no need for such an expensive DAP. Really impressive what Cayin did here...


----------



## alota

domiji said:


> I received my RU6 last week and i really enjoyed it so far. Very fluid and organic sound. Normally i want to use it as a interim solution until my Lotoo PAW Gold Touch Titanium arrives but seriously with my IEMs there is maybe no need for such an expensive DAP. Really impressive what Cayin did here...


i have solaris 2020. you listen solatris in s.e. or balanced?


----------



## domiji

alota said:


> i have solaris 2020. you listen solatris in s.e. or balanced?


In Balanced mode because i don't have a 3.5mm cable on hand at the moment   

There is some hiss with the Solaris and it is not dead silent but it is okay.


----------



## DBaldock9

Happy Birthday @Andykong !!!


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> …
> 
> Keeping looking out for new toys that will bring you closer to your music, maybe you'll find something interesting ealier than you expected.


Not sure how to respond. Not all of us can afford the music we listen to, let alone the gear. I decided a long time ago (1971) to assign the priority to the library…


----------



## domiji

Listen to Carmen Gomes - Sings the blues with the RU6 and my Campfire Solaris LE (Flowers) and it sounds bloody amazing! It feels to me that burn-in is really a thing with this device.


----------



## rarewolf

Carmen does indeed have a sweet voice!

How do your A&K Dianas compare to the Solaris?


----------



## domiji

The Solaris are simply a complete other Level and type of sound. The technicalities on the Dianas are far behind the Solaris. Diana is dark, smooth and non fatiguing. They are super comfortable and build quality is really good. The cable on the Dianas is the best stock cable that I have experienced.


----------



## PA3BPAT

Hello,



Andykong said:


> PCIe docking DAC board for computer? Never appear in any internal discussion. I can safely say this is not going to happen. If any computer manufacturing brand are interested in our solution and want to discuss OEM opportunities, our doors are opened. Producing a PCIe board might be very similar to what we do right now, but we don't have the facilities to test thousands of PCIe boards after a production batch, let alone provide decent after sales support to our users. Our sales networks are appliance based retailers, we need to develop a new sales network to sell and support the new product. This type of solution probably works better for brands like Creative or RME wjem they have approprite supporting system in place already.



R01 looks like a really nice product to buy, however, it is hard/limited to use. If it could be piggybacked to a number of devices in different classes (PCIe board, stationary HiRes player, Stationary network player, AV-receiver [probably with several slots], desktop USB-DAC, etc.) - that would be a completely different story. For me at least.


----------



## atr3yu (Jan 20, 2022)

How to make it work on windows 7?
Of course it's connected, but when i install drivers it shows:


----------



## ian91 (Jan 20, 2022)

@Andykong I've been struggling since purchase with intermittent sound drop outs, lasting about a second, while connected to my android phone playing through Qobuz. This happens probably every sound once or twice. The USB is connected securely at both ends and there device itself doesn't disconnect from the phone (which would return a message to notify me if it did).

It only seems to happen on high gain above about 60 on the volume indicator. I vaguely remember this being raised by previous members of this thread...

Was there ever a resolution found to this issue?


----------



## Andykong

ian91 said:


> @Andykong I've been struggling since purchase with intermittent sound drop outs, lasting about a second, while connected to my android phone playing through Qobuz. This happens probably every sound once or twice. The USB is connected securely at both ends and there device itself doesn't disconnect from the phone (which would return a message to notify me if it did).
> 
> It only seems to happen on high gain above about 60 on the volume indicator. I vaguely remember this being raised by previous members of this thread...
> 
> Was there ever a resolution found to this issue?



What headphone are you using with RU6?  If it only happen at high gain Volume 60, can you test your connection again by turning it down to 50 and tell us what happened?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 25, 2022)

atr3yu said:


> How to make it work on windows 7?
> Of course it's connected, but when i install drivers it shows:



Looks like your windows cannot detect the RU6 correctly.  When you insert the RU6 to your PC, your window OS should be able to detect the hardware even without the USB Audio Driver. Do you hear a beep sound or any alert in the Window notification center?

How  do you connect RU6 to your computer? With regular A to C cable?  The cable is OTG compatible?

Probably not related but please check if the Window driver signature enforcement has been disabled.


----------



## Andykong

PA3BPAT said:


> Hello,
> 
> 
> 
> R01 looks like a really nice product to buy, however, it is hard/limited to use. If it could be piggybacked to a number of devices in different classes (PCIe board, stationary HiRes player, Stationary network player, AV-receiver [probably with several slots], desktop USB-DAC, etc.) - that would be a completely different story. For me at least.



This is RU6 thread, and RU6 is not designed to work with any of the application in your list.  Sorry.


----------



## gr8soundz

atr3yu said:


> How to make it work on windows 7?
> Of course it's connected, but when i install drivers it shows:



Are you running Windows 7  32-bit or 64-bit?

Had the same issue trying to install the RU6 driver on an old PC of mine but chalked it up to the 32-bit Win7 on that machine. Haven't tried it on Win7 64 but no issues on multiple Win10 64 driver installs for the RU6.


----------



## atr3yu

Andykong said:


> Do you hear a beep sound or any alert in the Window notification center?
> 
> How do you connect RU6 to your computer? With regular A to C cable? The cable is OTG compatible?


Yes, i have alert and i use stock cable.


gr8soundz said:


> Are you running Windows 7 32-bit or 64-bit?


64-bit

Tommorow i will check on another PC.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I’ve been out of the loop for a couple of weeks because I had to send my Laylas back to get reshelled. The fitment was awful and I had impressions done with a different audiologist. Now I’m having sound woes. I just contacted JH about this and I’m awaiting a reply. The fitment is amazing, now it sounds like there’s a short in one of them as it’s distorting. This does NOT involve the Cayin. I’m just… perturbed right now.

But I’m glad to see I’m not the only one who was experiencing cut out issues. I just got these in today. Sigh…. 

I’ll go thumb through the 20 pages I missed. 😊


----------



## Goofyboy84

Andykong said:


> Not exactly, he was using Apple camear adapter at that time.  He returned the adapter but later he bought the adapter again becuse he test the setup in Apple store and everything works fine when he used a apple factory charging cord.  Apparantly the Apple adapter didn't like his Nelken charging cord and causing the problem, its the famous  protection mechanism in Apple ecosystem.


You nailed it! The Belkin charger was giving me fits. I was fine with the Apple charger with the apple camera adaptor… 😊


----------



## Goofyboy84

My Laylas have been sent back to JH audio as of this evening. I had them a whole couple of hours… and MAYBE an hour of listening. I hope this time fixes the new issue. 

I’ll drop out till I get my Laylas back.


----------



## oldkid

I really have to praise the RU6 sound quality once more.

Yesterday, I forgot my RU6 near my listening corner and went to work without it. My total commuting time in one day is quite long, so I have more than one hour of listening time 

All I had instead in my bag was my Hilidac Audirect Atom 2 and my Hiby FC3

I started listening some MQA music with the Atom 2 but quickly find the sound hollow with to much echo and smear. I used to like this DAC wide soundstage but it was really not enjoyable this time.

Then, I switched to the FC3 and it was a bit better, as it is a much faster and more precise DAC. But I immediately noticed the timbre was off compared to the RU6. The sound was harsh and sibilance was quite irritating. I couldn't believe this was the same DAC and spent the majority of last summer listening and praising.

I hope this is only the beginning of R2R dongle DACs because I think I'm done with chip based DACs.


----------



## elira

Do you get drops when adjusting the volume? Mine does that and it's annoying.


----------



## hoofman

elira said:


> Do you get drops when adjusting the volume? Mine does that and it's annoying.


It was designed that way because of some technical limitation. I remember Andy talked about the reasons in the first post of this thread.


----------



## cybergalaxy

oldkid said:


> I really have to praise the RU6 sound quality once more.
> 
> Yesterday, I forgot my RU6 near my listening corner and went to work without it. My total commuting time in one day is quite long, so I have more than one hour of listening time
> 
> ...


Well ru6 is 4x the price cf the other 2 dac you mentioned....


----------



## TYATYA

No need to crank up more than 77.
Small but strong enough for fullsize.
I alway feel RU6 sound Crossfeed if i pull out the jack from ru6 then plug it directly in the dap -sp1000.
In other words, ru6 is not such stereo, 3d imagine... but, it draw me to music.


----------



## Hyde00

I noticed on a lot of dac/amp I tried (including desktop units) high gain always sound better than low gain when volume matched.

Anyone know for RU6 if low gain / high gain sound different?


----------



## peterinvan (Jan 21, 2022)

Hyde00 said:


> I noticed on a lot of dac/amp I tried (including desktop units) high gain always sound better than low gain when volume matched.
> 
> Anyone know for RU6 if low gain / high gain sound different?


I use Low @ 40db (on average) driving Focal Elegias Via 4.4mm, out of iPad Pro.
Switch to High gain, volume matches at about 35db.  I can’t detect any difference in sound quality.

currently enjoying Cowboy Junkies Trinity Revisited… RU6 shows off detail retrieval, sound stage and PRAT


----------



## Andykong (Jan 21, 2022)

TYATYA said:


> No need to crank up more than 77.
> Small but strong enough for fullsize.
> I alway feel RU6 sound Crossfeed if i pull out the jack from ru6 then plug it directly in the dap -sp1000.
> In other words, ru6 is not such stereo, 3d imagine... but, it draw me to music.



You are using AK SP1000SS as USB Audio source for RU6?  I assume you are trying to explore the potential of RU6 when it is not locked by limited power supply of mobile phone? The SP1000SS should sound superior over RU6, especially when paired with demanding heapdhone such as HD820.

L Gain Vol 77, that's not bad for HD820, especially if you find it enjoyable with RU6.


----------



## tod-hackett

My Cayin RU6 is listed as "Speakers" under sound: is that normal?


----------



## twister6

tod-hackett said:


> My Cayin RU6 is listed as "Speakers" under sound: is that normal?



Yes, normal


----------



## Andykong

elira said:


> Do you get drops when adjusting the volume? Mine does that and it's annoying.



I believe you are referring to the mute delay of the resistor array volume control.  We have explained the implementation constraint previously:


> Our main hesitation with resistor array volume control is not about technical difficulties or budget consideration. The Resistor Array volume control involves switching relays when you hop from one segment to another. The relay will produce very mild pop sound with speakers and is inaudible when you are 2 or 3 meters away from the speaker. Unfortunately the pop noise will become very annoying to sensitive IEM users. For this reason, we need to mute the output for a short moment when a relay kicks in. This will introduce a small delay (around 40ms) in volume adjustment, definitely a set back from user experience point of view. For dedicated audiophiles who put audio performance, this is a small price to pay in order to implement R-2R resistor ladder network in a dongle DAC. but we can understand some users might consider this as a deal breaker, that's why we explained this in detail up front.



For more detail, please refer to the *High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control section* of the *opening post*.


----------



## Andykong

oldkid said:


> I really have to praise the RU6 sound quality once more.
> 
> Yesterday, I forgot my RU6 near my listening corner and went to work without it. My total commuting time in one day is quite long, so I have more than one hour of listening time
> 
> ...



Thank you very much for your recognition of RU6.   

The icebreaking venture is not particularly easy, we sure hope there more developer will attempt R2R Dongle DAC.  This will expand the market and hopefully more supporting components such as low noise low power consumption electronic volume control will be available from updstream, this will simplify the development process significantly.


----------



## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> Happy Birthday @Andykong !!!



Thank you , I took a day off and had a nice meal with my wife.  We have cut down our dine out significantly after COVID, let's hope we can go back to our old lessure life before my next birthday.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Not sure how to respond. Not all of us can afford the music we listen to, let alone the gear. I decided a long time ago (1971) to assign the priority to the library…



I start my music journey with radio, almost free of charge at the good old day.  Spotify still have free mode, you need to listen to short advertisement clip but when compare to the commericals in radio at my time, this is very acceptable. 

One thing I learn after being audiophile for several decades: this hobby cost a lot of money, and will continue to consume us, but the cost of my equipment has very little to do with how close I am with my music.


----------



## DBaldock9

tod-hackett said:


> My Cayin RU6 is listed as "Speakers" under sound: is that normal?



I've noticed that nearly every USB connected portable DAC is shown that way in Win7 and Win10. I always update the icon, and rename the device, if I want it to have a more concise name.


----------



## Hyde00

DBaldock9 said:


> I've noticed that nearly every USB connected portable DAC is shown that way in Win7 and Win10. I always update the icon, and rename the device, if I want it to have a more concise name.


I find it's hit or miss for me, sometimes they do show up with proper name other times it's just "speakers".

I think it might have more to do with USB class 1 vs USB class 2 I think..... I think USB class 1 show up with proper name and USB class 2 show up as "speakers".

Though I could be wrong, more testing needed..... LOL.


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> I start my music journey with radio, almost free of charge at the good old day.  Spotify still have free mode, you need to listen to short advertisement clip but when compare to the commericals in radio at my time, this is very acceptable.
> 
> One thing I learn after being audiophile for several decades: this hobby cost a lot of money, and will continue to consume us, but the cost of my equipment has very little to do with how close I am with my music.


Your perspective as the engineer behind the RU6 at least has me looking around. I have to admit there  are many highly rated IEMs on the market that are also very affordable (eg, 7Hz Timeless, Moondrop Kato, …). It’s difficult to tell if some of these reviews are relative to other offerings in the same price range, or if the accolades, scores, and qualifiers, are representative of all. For example, one reviewer listed all their IEM reviews, along with scores, and the scores apparently had nothing to do with cost. 

Still, for a guy on a fixed income in the midst of increasing costs, it’s difficult to throw even $200 at gear I’d read about but wasn’t able to listen to. That is, I cannot help but believe I luck’d out with the RU6. On top of that, it’s difficult to believe $200 is going to up my current listening experience with the RU6, even while it’s currently matched with “inappropriately power demanding” headphones that definitely up’d my experience from a Soundblaster E5. 

If RU6 users here might be aware of, or have experience with IEMs in the price range $200-$300, I’d appreciate their experience.

Regarding internet radio and services, I will turn to the CD quality streams from Radio Paradise daily, which is listener supported (also by me), but I have say the RU6 has now demonstrated to my ears the differences between lossless 16bit and lossy MP3/AAC from the likes of iTunes or Spotify. RP is highly recommended for those who want a CD quality casual background, and an up-to-date selection of today’s artists and tunesmiths.


----------



## peterinvan

rarewolf said:


> Your perspective as the engineer behind the RU6 at least has me looking around. I have to admit there  are many highly rated IEMs on the market that are also very affordable (eg, 7Hz Timeless, Moondrop Kato, …). It’s difficult to tell if some of these reviews are relative to other offerings in the same price range, or if the accolades, scores, and qualifiers, are representative of all. For example, one reviewer listed all their IEM reviews, along with scores, and the scores apparently had nothing to do with cost.
> 
> Still, for a guy on a fixed income in the midst of increasing costs, it’s difficult to throw even $200 at gear I’d read about but wasn’t able to listen to. That is, I cannot help but believe I luck’d out with the RU6. On top of that, it’s difficult to believe $200 is going to up my current listening experience with the RU6, even while it’s currently matched with “inappropriately power demanding” headphones that definitely up’d my experience from a Soundblaster E5.
> 
> ...


 I seem to prefer single dynamic drivers to balanced armature.
I am happy using the Meze Rai Solo with the RU6.  Clever driver innovation.  
 Listening to Tidal out of my iPad Pro.  Good bass, clear vocals, good soundstage, no harsh high notes.  Non-fatiguing, easy listening.  Very comfortable in my ears.


----------



## peterinvan

rarewolf said:


> I’m also looking for an alternative to the optional OTG lightning cable. Can you describe what you heard before and after, and where you purchased your cable?


I am using the 36” Apple USB-C to USB-C charging cable for my iPad Pro.  No issues.


----------



## rarewolf

peterinvan said:


> I seem to prefer single dynamic drivers to balanced armature.
> I am happy using the Meze Rai Solo with the RU6.  Clever driver innovation.
> Listening to Tidal out of my iPad Pro.  Good bass, clear vocals, good soundstage, no harsh high notes.  Non-fatiguing, easy listening.  Very comfortable in my ears.


Well now… add Meze Rai Solo to the short list for further study. I do note these aren’t as easy to drive as are the Kato or the Timeless. It would be interest to hear from @Andykong regarding whether these are outside the RU6’s sweet spot with respect to power demand and getting power from an iPhone(?)


----------



## peterinvan

rarewolf said:


> Well now… add Meze Rai Solo to the short list for further study. I do note these aren’t as easy to drive as are the Kato or the Timeless. It would be interest to hear from @Andykong regarding whether these are outside the RU6’s sweet spot with respect to power demand and getting power from an iPhone(?)


*Meze Rai Solo, silver 4.4mm cable:*

on Low gain, volume is 30db (to match my Focal Elegias which were at 40db).  Sound is much warmer than the Elegias.  More bass quantity, but less accurate attack/decay.


----------



## Brain Damage

peterinvan said:


> I seem to prefer single dynamic drivers to balanced armature.
> I am happy using the Meze Rai Solo with the RU6.  Clever driver innovation.
> Listening to Tidal out of my iPad Pro.  Good bass, clear vocals, good soundstage, no harsh high notes.  Non-fatiguing, easy listening.  Very comfortable in my ears.


I'm tending to prefer this too. I keep returning to my Tin Hi-Fi T4s - they are so balanced and neutral sounding. Some would argue maybe sterile sounding - but I like that signature. Good recordings (via Tidal and Qobuz on my LGV30) sound great and poor recordings sound average: but, hats off to the T4s: isn't that how it should be? Like all good DACs should sound the same right? Regardless of chip, amplification type and tuning? If they're doing the job right anyway.

If I had to choose a favourite BA IEM from my possessions, it would have to be my Rose Mini MKII. They sound pretty good - the detail and instrument separation on these are unbelievable. But, not as balanced or as neutral as the T4s.


----------



## alota

rarewolf said:


> Well now… add Meze Rai Solo to the short list for further study. I do note these aren’t as easy to drive as are the Kato or the Timeless. It would be interest to hear from @Andykong regarding whether these are outside the RU6’s sweet spot with respect to power demand and getting power from an iPhone(?)


I had meze rai solo and sold quickly. Now i'm using campfire vega 2020 single dynamic and solaris 2020 both tried is se and balanced. Well. I'm considering to sell solaris. I love so much vega with ru6. In this period you find some vega at good price.  Add in your list lol


----------



## oldkid

cybergalaxy said:


> Well ru6 is 4x the price cf the other 2 dac you mentioned....


Go check the price asked for other portable devices including a R2R ladder DAC


----------



## Misunari

Just received mine today after reading through most of this threads pages. I got very curious about R2R, so I decided to just try it.
I haven't had the chance to listen too much yet, but I'm enjoying the combination with the MEST MKII a lot so far. A very comfy sound, very smooth and detailed. 
Between NOS and OS I prefer NOS on initial impression, but it's cool to have both options either way!







It will be interesting to see how much power it draws in my daily life since that's one of my only concerns long-term. The "plug" part of the cable connected to my iPhone/iPad definitely gets very warm. I haven't had any disconnects because of power draw so far, but I didn't try to push anything yet.
There has been some small "skips" when changing volume sometimes, but it's not too big of a deal and I'm not really changing it too much anyways after I started listening.


----------



## qboogie

Is anybody rocking this dongle with the Thieaudio Monarch? I did a search within this thread and found no mention. The headfonics review of the RU6 mentions bass rolloff. I'm nervous that it will cut into the Monarch's subbass, which is incredibly satisfying. 

Can anyone comment?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

qboogie said:


> Is anybody rocking this dongle with the Thieaudio Monarch? I did a search within this thread and found no mention. The headfonics review of the RU6 mentions bass rolloff. I'm nervous that it will cut into the Monarch's subbass, which is incredibly satisfying.
> 
> Can anyone comment?


not sure about Monarch but with some of my neutral IEM's RU6 did seem a bit low impact compared to LG G8x. I had no issues when pairing Honeydew so if Monarch is already Bass heavy, I don't think it will be a problem.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

has anyone tried connecting the RU6 to an Amp? If so, have you experienced any degradations in sound?

I'm thinking of getting a portable Amp like Aune B1s or xCan. Make a budget R2R setup, but since there's no lineout here, I don't know how the setup will sound. I did the same experiment with Mojo with decent result but that thing has no Amp so...


----------



## oldkid

Johnfg465vd said:


> has anyone tried connecting the RU6 to an Amp? If so, have you experienced any degradations in sound?
> 
> I'm thinking of getting a portable Amp like Aune B1s or xCan. Make a budget R2R setup, but since there's no lineout here, I don't know how the setup will sound. I did the same experiment with Mojo with decent result but that thing has no Amp so...


I'm listening right now to the RU6 connected to my desktop "reference" set-up. RU6=> xDuoo MT-601 with 6N23P Reflector tube=> FiiO Q3 => Focal Elegia with Meze balanced cable. It is a Frankensteined mess of cables but it sounds so damn good!

To answer your question, there is no audible degradation whatsoever, but I tried earlier with only the tube amp connected to the RU6 and there was low level noise between tracks.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

@oldkid Thanks, What volume level have you set on the RU6, Max?


----------



## oldkid

Johnfg465vd said:


> @oldkid Thanks, What volume level have you set on the RU6, Max?


No more than 54 with low gain and NOS


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

rarewolf said:


> Your perspective as the engineer behind the RU6 at least has me looking around. I have to admit there  are many highly rated IEMs on the market that are also very affordable (eg, 7Hz Timeless, Moondrop Kato, …). It’s difficult to tell if some of these reviews are relative to other offerings in the same price range, or if the accolades, scores, and qualifiers, are representative of all. For example, one reviewer listed all their IEM reviews, along with scores, and the scores apparently had nothing to do with cost.
> 
> Still, for a guy on a fixed income in the midst of increasing costs, it’s difficult to throw even $200 at gear I’d read about but wasn’t able to listen to. That is, I cannot help but believe I luck’d out with the RU6. On top of that, it’s difficult to believe $200 is going to up my current listening experience with the RU6, even while it’s currently matched with “inappropriately power demanding” headphones that definitely up’d my experience from a Soundblaster E5.
> 
> ...


Plenty of good IEMs in the $200-300 price range.  You've named some.   My favorites are UM 3DT, 7hz Timeless.   You can get an Oriolus Isabellae used for around $400.    Blessing 2 Dusk is $329 new.  Cheaper if you buy resale.   

You can pair these with an Apple Dongle or something better for $100 like a Lotoo PAW S1 used.

I own a lot of TOTL IEMs and I would total endorse these products as being very good


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

qboogie said:


> Is anybody rocking this dongle with the Thieaudio Monarch? I did a search within this thread and found no mention. The headfonics review of the RU6 mentions bass rolloff. I'm nervous that it will cut into the Monarch's subbass, which is incredibly satisfying.
> 
> Can anyone comment?


Yes, I own both the Monarch OG and MKii.   The RU6 does a very good job at bringing the Monarch to life.   It has reference tuning which can sound boring to some.  The RU6 gives it more life.    I am listening to the Monarch OG now with RU6.    I still hear good sub bass rumble, but it is slightly attenuated relative to my DX300.    The difference is that the treble is better with the RU6 than say my DX300 with AMP12 so treble has more emphasis.    The gains in naturalness and liveliness of sound more than makes up for any small attenuation of subbass.    If you want more subbass, get an Empire Ears LX or EVO.


----------



## qboogie

Appreciate the suggestions. I'll pull the trigger on the RU6 and see how it goes


----------



## yaps66

qboogie said:


> Appreciate the suggestions. I'll pull the trigger on the RU6 and see how it goes


Enjoy the ride! I hope you find as much joy as many of us here have with this amazing dongle!


----------



## TYATYA (Jan 23, 2022)

You know ru6 sound thick and solid base, bold mid.
I think it does not drives ibasso IT00 - a bloat bass iem well.
And actually confirmed.

I post these pictures showing how eqing and dsp for improvement sq so much.
Concept is to neutralize fr error roughly then convert it to another sound target fr for better sens of open space.

Ru6 shows, may be (not yet confirm) large error when it take such complicate digital raw matterial : result from a parametric eq and dsp process (morph a headphone to sound like other one) by UAPP.

Or, UAPP calculates not well in 44k sampling rate and ru6 just amplify those error larger.
UAPP dev wrote in the oversampling function "usually gives LOWER quality" (when set ON)
I don’t think so with any EQing or dsp.
The higher sample rate, the more accurate calculation it will does.
This case,  minimum rate is 88k for a good sound, really gooood!
44k REALLY bad with metallic output which and musicallity's destroyed.


----------



## oldkid (Jan 23, 2022)

Andykong said:


> The Ares II is superior to RU6 is all area.  FULL STOP.
> 
> I heard the Ares II in a show previously, they are very competitive for their price.  There is no way RU6 can compete with Ares II on a speaker system or a properly setup desktop heapdhone system.


Now that I know that I prefer R2R to Delta sigma, I have been looking at review of that Denafrips DAC.

In his review GoldenSound insist on the fact that the Ares II is not a true NOS DAC, it always upsamples the input signal. It is implied that it's the reason why it is so cheap.

So, I was wondering if the RU6 or even the R01 module were true NOS DACs in the way that they could pass the test shown in this video successfully.


----------



## ssriram2791

oldkid said:


> Now that I know that I prefer R2R to Delta sigma, I have been looking at review of that Denafrips DAC.
> 
> In his review GoldenSound insist on the fact that the Ares II is not a true NOS DAC, it always upsamples the input signal. It is implied that it's the reason why it is so cheap.
> 
> So, I was wondering if the RU6 or even the R01 module were true NOS DACs in the way that they could pass the test shown in this video successfully.



R01 is does not have NOS feature at all. Oversampled to 768 kHz or 384 kHz, if I am not wrong. 

For RU6, you may want to look at the block diagram that @Andykong posted in the first page of this thread. The input signal (assuming bit-perfect) that comes into RU6 through digital audio bridge would either go unaltered (bypass oversampling filter) through to 24 bit R2R DAC (which is non-oversampling) or go through oversampling process. You have the option to chose in the setting. 

I can really hear the difference between NOS and OS, and I love the former. For the price of $250, I would say implementation of NOS mode is pretty good. 

If you like someone to test NOS is true or false, I think you need to find a very experienced reviewer or some one with test capabilities (which is $$$$) to evaluate all this. Good luck with that !


----------



## oldkid

ssriram2791 said:


> R01 is does not have NOS feature at all. Oversampled to 768 kHz or 384 kHz, if I am not wrong.
> 
> For RU6, you may want to look at the block diagram that @Andykong posted in the first page of this thread. The input signal (assuming bit-perfect) that comes into RU6 through digital audio bridge would either go unaltered (bypass oversampling filter) through to 24 bit R2R DAC (which is non-oversampling) or go through oversampling process. You have the option to chose in the setting.
> 
> ...


I do hear the difference between NOS and OS too and I do prefer NOS as well. I think it makes FLAC sound like DSD, which is an incredible achievement. 
I am just curious and surprised that more people aren't talking about the world first NOS R2R portable DAC/amp.


----------



## ssriram2791

oldkid said:


> I do hear the difference between NOS and OS too and I do prefer NOS as well. I think it makes FLAC sound like DSD, which is an incredible achievement.
> I am just curious and surprised that more people aren't talking about the world first NOS R2R portable DAC/amp.


We have 117 pages in this thread where people have discussed, provided impressions and criticisms of the product as well. 

I think this has been quite well received and has been a massive success for Cayin (@Andykong can chime in) and those who have liked this have kept this and sold other popular dongles in this forum. I think it is all down to synergy and music that you enjoy ! Keep listening !


----------



## schnesim

Anyone else having issues with Android devices detecting the RU6? And is there a fix for this issue?

I just received mine and neither my Android phone nor my tablet detect the RU6 reliably. I have to unplug and replug the device maybe 20 times until it works. No issues whatsoever when connecting the DAC to my laptop.


----------



## alota

schnesim said:


> Anyone else having issues with Android devices detecting the RU6? And is there a fix for this issue?
> 
> I just received mine and neither my Android phone nor my tablet detect the RU6 reliably. I have to unplug and replug the device maybe 20 times until it works. No issues whatsoever when connecting the DAC to my laptop.


tried another cable?


----------



## TYATYA

schnesim said:


> Anyone else having issues with Android devices detecting the RU6? And is there a fix for this issue?
> 
> I just received mine and neither my Android phone nor my tablet detect the RU6 reliably. I have to unplug and replug the device maybe 20 times until it works. No issues whatsoever when connecting the DAC to my laptop.


I do. 
It happen sometimes. One think I usually do on that situation: flip side of cable and/or connect at locked screen


----------



## Andykong

schnesim said:


> Anyone else having issues with Android devices detecting the RU6? And is there a fix for this issue?
> 
> I just received mine and neither my Android phone nor my tablet detect the RU6 reliably. I have to unplug and replug the device maybe 20 times until it works. No issues whatsoever when connecting the DAC to my laptop.



Mind telling us what Android phone and teblet you have run into trouble with? With the bundled C-to-C cable? What version of Android OS?  

My mobile phones (Samsung A71 and S20FE, both Android 11) can recognise the RU6 most of the time.  I didn't count the successful rate but definitely over 90%, maybe around 95%.  In the rare occasion that the RU6 was not recognised, I just unplug and plug in again "slowly" and firmly and it always work in second attempt.  If you need to unplug and replug the device for 20 times before it get recognise, something is not right.


----------



## schnesim

Andykong said:


> Mind telling us what Android phone and teblet you have run into trouble with? With the bundled C-to-C cable? What version of Android OS?


My phone is a LG G6 running Android 9 and the tablet is a Galaxy Tab A with Android 8. I used the bundled cable but also tried other ones I had lying around but without better results.

Before the RU6 I used a Dragonfly Black and not once did I run into it not being recognized. I wonder whether it might be a power issue since I noticed the RU6 draws more power than the Dragonfly and there are no issues when using a PC.


----------



## ssriram2791

schnesim said:


> My phone is a LG G6 running Android 9 and the tablet is a Galaxy Tab A with Android 8. I used the bundled cable but also tried other ones I had lying around but without better results.
> 
> Before the RU6 I used a Dragonfly Black and not once did I run into it not being recognized. I wonder whether it might be a power issue since I noticed the RU6 draws more power than the Dragonfly and there are no issues when using a PC.


Have you tried to reset the USB debugging in developer options and restart the phone and replug it in ?

I have LG G8X and so far not seen any issue with RU6 or any other dongle.


----------



## alota

Any issue with lg v50


----------



## Andykong

schnesim said:


> My phone is a LG G6 running Android 9 and the tablet is a Galaxy Tab A with Android 8. I used the bundled cable but also tried other ones I had lying around but without better results.
> 
> Before the RU6 I used a Dragonfly Black and not once did I run into it not being recognized. I wonder whether it might be a power issue since I noticed the RU6 draws more power than the Dragonfly and there are no issues when using a PC.



What music applications are  you using with RU6? Do they support bit perfect audio output?  If not, did you turn the volume of your mobile device to 100 and use the volume control of RU6 instead?


----------



## Andykong

Misunari said:


> Just received mine today after reading through most of this threads pages. I got very curious about R2R, so I decided to just try it.
> I haven't had the chance to listen too much yet, but I'm enjoying the combination with the MEST MKII a lot so far. A very comfy sound, very smooth and detailed.
> Between NOS and OS I prefer NOS on initial impression, but it's cool to have both options either way!
> 
> ...



Hope you'll enjoy the RU6 even after the honeymoon period. I do, but my opinion didn't count.   

The "skips" are caused by the switching delay of the resistor array volume control. We have explained the implementation constraint previously:


> Our main hesitation with resistor array volume control is not about technical difficulties or budget consideration. The Resistor Array volume control involves switching relays when you hop from one segment to another. The relay will produce very mild pop sound with speakers and is inaudible when you are 2 or 3 meters away from the speaker. Unfortunately the pop noise will become very annoying to sensitive IEM users. For this reason, we need to mute the output for a short moment when a relay kicks in. This will introduce a small delay (around 40ms) in volume adjustment, definitely a set back from user experience point of view. For dedicated audiophiles who put audio performance, this is a small price to pay in order to implement R-2R resistor ladder network in a dongle DAC. but we can understand some users might consider this as a deal breaker, that's why we explained this in detail up front.



For more detail, please refer to the *High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control section* of the *opening post*.


----------



## Andykong

ssriram2791 said:


> R01 is does not have NOS feature at all. Oversampled to 768 kHz or 384 kHz, if I am not wrong.
> 
> For RU6, you may want to look at the block diagram that @Andykong posted in the first page of this thread. The input signal (assuming bit-perfect) that comes into RU6 through digital audio bridge would either go unaltered (bypass oversampling filter) through to 24 bit R2R DAC (which is non-oversampling) or go through oversampling process. You have the option to chose in the setting.
> 
> ...



You are correct, R01 didn't have NOS mode.  Our initial R01 design was a pure NOS approach. We didn’t have the Audio Bridge and Oversampling filter in place, the digital audio signal was feed into the Serial to Parallel Shift Register directly. The prototype performs satisfactory with standardized 24bit hi-res music files. Unfortunately we run into serious problems when we conduct further test with multi-format music library and highly sensitive IEMs.  To solve the problem, we added an Audio Bridge and a high-end hardware 8x interpolation oversampling filter before the R-2R circuit, so R01 only offers OS mode by design.

The NOS mode in RU6 ovly work for PCM source.  DSD bitstream will go through All-to-PCM in Audio Bridge and converted to PCM before entering NOS/OS mode selection.  This is unfortunately inevitable because R-2R DAC design cannot handle PCM and DSD natively in one DSC circuit.


----------



## oldkid

Andykong said:


> You are correct, R01 didn't have NOS mode.  Our initial R01 design was a pure NOS approach. We didn’t have the Audio Bridge and Oversampling filter in place, the digital audio signal was feed into the Serial to Parallel Shift Register directly. The prototype performs satisfactory with standardized 24bit hi-res music files. Unfortunately we run into serious problems when we conduct further test with multi-format music library and highly sensitive IEMs.  To solve the problem, we added an Audio Bridge and a high-end hardware 8x interpolation oversampling filter before the R-2R circuit, so R01 only offers OS mode by design.
> 
> The NOS mode in RU6 ovly work for PCM source.  DSD bitstream will go through All-to-PCM in Audio Bridge and converted to PCM before entering NOS/OS mode selection.  This is unfortunately inevitable because R-2R DAC design cannot handle PCM and DSD natively in one DSC circuit.


Thank you @Andykong , I had already figured out that oversampling didn't do anything with DSD sources but it's nice to have confirmation it is indeed the case.

I have said in a previous post that RU6 made PCM sound like DSD. It's not quite the case when compared to a dongle DAC with a dedicated path for DSD like the Hidizs S9 AKM version.

But the RU6 certainly is the best dongle DAC I have heard for PCM. It blurs the lines between CD quality and Hi RES recordings in a spectacular manner even without using the OS mode.

This device really taught me what PRaT really is.
Only native DSD recordings on specialized DACs can exceed the sound quality and emotional impact than the RU6 offers for everything single recording you throw at it.


----------



## leeperry

I've read on another forum that transients/dynamics aren't all that on RU6 together with this link that was also posted there: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/cayin-ru6/

Will this be changed in future fw updates?


----------



## blotmouse

leeperry said:


> I've read on another forum that transients/dynamics aren't all that on RU6 together with this link that was also posted there: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/cayin-ru6/
> 
> Will this be changed in future fw updates?


Measurements have never played well with r-2r and don’t really matter. Your ears are the only things that matter. 
Music is pleasurable due to favorable impurities and happy accidents. Tubes, distortion, etc. without those “errors” its just flat and boring. 
If it was all mathematically perfect, it would suck.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Your perspective as the engineer behind the RU6 at least has me looking around. I have to admit there  are many highly rated IEMs on the market that are also very affordable (eg, 7Hz Timeless, Moondrop Kato, …). It’s difficult to tell if some of these reviews are relative to other offerings in the same price range, or if the accolades, scores, and qualifiers, are representative of all. For example, one reviewer listed all their IEM reviews, along with scores, and the scores apparently had nothing to do with cost.
> 
> Still, for a guy on a fixed income in the midst of increasing costs, it’s difficult to throw even $200 at gear I’d read about but wasn’t able to listen to. That is, I cannot help but believe I luck’d out with the RU6. On top of that, it’s difficult to believe $200 is going to up my current listening experience with the RU6, even while it’s currently matched with “inappropriately power demanding” headphones that definitely up’d my experience from a Soundblaster E5.
> 
> ...





HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Plenty of good IEMs in the $200-300 price range.  You've named some.   My favorites are UM 3DT, 7hz Timeless.   You can get an Oriolus Isabellae used for around $400.    Blessing 2 Dusk is $329 new.  Cheaper if you buy resale.
> 
> You can pair these with an Apple Dongle or something better for $100 like a Lotoo PAW S1 used.
> 
> I own a lot of TOTL IEMs and I would total endorse these products as being very good



Right on. You don't need to buy megadollar IEM to enjoy y our music.  Give me Five.   

@rarewolf if you check out Cayin's product line, you probably will be surprised by number of products we are making, and they span across a very wide price range.  We have  integrated tube amplifiers from $400 to $8,000 (the lower-end items are exclusively for domestic market, the shipping cost and maintenace cost is too high to market time internationally), and from $250 RU6 to $3,699 N8 Brass Black, and there is a story behind this crazy practise. 

Cayin was founded in 1993, and a lot of our customers probably aren’t aware that Cayin is a state-owned company. We are a subsidiary of Aviation Industry Corporation (AVIC) of China, a state-owned aerospace and defense enterprise. Back in the early 90’s, the President of AVIC was a dedicated audiophile, he wanted to contributed to the society by promoting music appreciation, so he gathered several engineers and started the Zhuhai Spark Electronic Equipment Co., Ltd. The company started off as an OEM shop and develop tube amplifiers under the name of Spark. Our product carried distinctive cultural connotation and span over a very wide price range because we are determined to make music accessible to all sectors, not just the high net worth group. 

So Cayin honestly believes that everyone should be able to appreciate and enjoy music , and we build audio products to realise this conviction.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Well now… add Meze Rai Solo to the short list for further study. I do note these aren’t as easy to drive as are the Kato or the Timeless. It would be interest to hear from @Andykong regarding whether these are outside the RU6’s sweet spot with respect to power demand and getting power from an iPhone(?)





peterinvan said:


> *Meze Rai Solo, silver 4.4mm cable:*
> 
> on Low gain, volume is 30db (to match my Focal Elegias which were at 40db).  Sound is much warmer than the Elegias.  More bass quantity, but less accurate attack/decay.



You probably won't believe this.  RU6 + Rai Solo is my standard "accessories" when I use my mobile phone for music.  I am more on casual side when I use this setup: from Youtube to Tiktok, from Spotify to KKBox.  While I have other setup for critical listening, the RU6 + Rai Solo probably pick up more hours than my N6ii + Rai Penta (and Mest II).

The Rai Solo is a fairly easy loading among sihngle DD IEMs.  I have no problem to enjoy it with RU6.


----------



## Andykong (Jan 25, 2022)

leeperry said:


> I've read on another forum that transients/dynamics aren't all that on RU6 together with this link that was also posted there: https://www.l7audiolab.com/f/cayin-ru6/
> 
> Will this be changed in future fw updates?


There is no plan to modify RU6 sound signature or audio performance via firmware update.  In fact, Cayin has never modify or "rescue" the audio performance of our products through firmware update.  This is not our practise.

No comment on the l7audiolab review you have quoted, my only advise is to check out the RU6 with your own IEM and music.  If you can't do that, than read more reviews,  don't just make up your mind with one review.  Check out impresson from actual users in this thread will also helped.

By the way, do you read Chinese? or you read that article through online translatoin tool?


----------



## ssriram2791

Andykong said:


> There is no plan to modify RU6 sound signature or audio performance via firmware update.  In fact, Cayin has never modify or "rescue" the audio performance of our products through firmware update.  This is not our practise.


If people are looking for analytical sound (which could sound cold/sterile and boring) , they should follow the measurements... If you are looking for some exciting and lively sound and not think about technical jargons like distortion and SINAD, then Cayin has covered you pretty well with RU6 and other products in their lineup.


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> You probably won't believe this.  RU6 + Rai Solo is my standard "accessories" when I use my mobile phone for music.  I am more on casual side when I use this setup: from Youtube to Tiktok, from Spotify to KKBox.  While I have other setup for critical listening, the RU6 + Rai Solo probably pick up more hours than my N6ii + Rai Penta (and Mest II).
> 
> The Rai Solo is a fairly easy loading among sihngle DD IEMs.  I have no problem to enjoy it with RU6.


Thanks Andy! Believe me, I am giving the Rai Solo a very hard look. However, I believe I’ll end up with the Moondrop Kato. It seems many users are very happy with the Kato line of IEMs, and it seems safe for entry level and it should suit my listening habits without equalization. The Crinicle collaboration with See Audio (the “Midnight”) also looks very interesting, but too new… but then, my birthday is only 2 months away…


----------



## Andykong

oldkid said:


> I do hear the difference between NOS and OS too and I do prefer NOS as well. I think it makes FLAC sound like DSD, which is an incredible achievement.
> I am just curious and surprised that more people aren't talking about the world first NOS R2R portable DAC/amp.





ssriram2791 said:


> We have 117 pages in this thread where people have discussed, provided impressions and criticisms of the product as well.
> 
> I think this has been quite well received and has been a massive success for Cayin (@Andykong can chime in) and those who have liked this have kept this and sold other popular dongles in this forum. I think it is all down to synergy and music that you enjoy ! Keep listening !



Well, to certain extend, RU6 is aimed at a very small niche market inside a niche market, we are not feature packed, we can't go wireless, we can't MQA, we can't EQ, we didn't mearsure well,  ....  and we are fairly expensive among Dongle DACs, so I am not surprised that we are not as popular as other Dongle DACs in the market.   Besides, we don't have a social media team so not suprsied that you'll only find relevant discussion when you know where to look for.


----------



## ssriram2791

Andykong said:


> Well, to certain extend, RU6 is aimed at a very small niche market inside a niche market, we are not feature packed, we can't go wireless, we can't MQA, we can't EQ, we didn't mearsure well,  ....  and we are fairly expensive among Dongle DACs, so I am not surprised that we are not as popular as other Dongle DACs in the market.   Besides, we don't have a social media team so not suprsied that you'll only find relevant discussion when you know where to look for.


Leave all those aside, I have never seen a manufacturer that has been constantly engaging with their customers in Headfi as much you do Andy.

I think when someone buys a product and after sales support is not there, they lose touch with the brand and typically don't come back.

 You have been at the forefront of connecting with everyone's queries and answering them with best intention and knowledge/expertise you have. You are also very open and transparent about what the product can or cannot do, not just for RU6, but for other products in your lineup as well. 

I believe you will retain the user base as long this connect (conversations in Headfi) exists. Keep continuing the good work !


----------



## schnesim

Andykong said:


> What music applications are  you using with RU6? Do they support bit perfect audio output?  If not, did you turn the volume of your mobile device to 100 and use the volume control of RU6 instead?



Yes, volume is set to max. And WHEN the RU6 is detected, it works with all apps I tested. USB audio player pro, Tidal, even Spotify.

Rebooting phone/tablet and resetting options didn't help either.


----------



## ssriram2791

schnesim said:


> Yes, volume is set to max. And WHEN the RU6 is detected, it works with all apps I tested. USB audio player pro, Tidal, even Spotify.
> 
> Rebooting phone/tablet and resetting options didn't help either.


USB debugging is enabled in developer options, and still it doesnt work, correct ? 

Not sure what other usb settings might be hidden in android.


----------



## alota (Jan 25, 2022)

blotmouse said:


> Measurements have never played well with r-2r and don’t really matter. Your ears are the only things that matter.
> Music is pleasurable due to favorable impurities and happy accidents. Tubes, distortion, etc. without those “errors” its just flat and boring.
> If it was all mathematically perfect, it would suck.


Perfect
And edit: with uapp is a remarkable portable system and i repeat portable


----------



## Hyde00

blotmouse said:


> Measurements have never played well with r-2r and don’t really matter. Your ears are the only things that matter.
> Music is pleasurable due to favorable impurities and happy accidents. Tubes, distortion, etc. without those “errors” its just flat and boring.
> If it was all mathematically perfect, it would suck.


One of my head-fi friend always tell me music always sounds better with a bit of alcohol.  I personally don't drink but I'll trust his words for it LOL.


ssriram2791 said:


> Leave all those aside, I have never seen a manufacturer that has been constantly engaging with their customers in Headfi as much you do Andy.


Yes definitely much appreciated on all the communications.  A lot of companies kind of get lost touch with their customers once a product is released.  It's amazing that you're still here answering all the questions.


ssriram2791 said:


> You have been at the forefront of connecting with everyone's queries and answering them with best intention and knowledge/expertise you have. You are also very open and transparent about what the product can or cannot do, not just for RU6, but for other products in your lineup as well.
> 
> I believe you will retain the user base as long this connect (conversations in Headfi) exists. Keep continuing the good work !


And it's even more impressive that you guys are 100% transparent about everything.  Not hiding / dodging certain topics like some other companies out there.

Much appreciated!!!

Oh and my RU6 should arrive this week, looking forward to it.


----------



## schnesim

ssriram2791 said:


> USB debugging is enabled in developer options, and still it doesnt work, correct ?
> 
> Not sure what other usb settings might be hidden in android.


USB debugging is enabled, yes. And it doesn't work most of the time. Sometimes it does.


----------



## kadinh

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Plenty of good IEMs in the $200-300 price range.  You've named some.   My favorites are UM 3DT, 7hz Timeless.   You can get an Oriolus Isabellae used for around $400.    Blessing 2 Dusk is $329 new.  Cheaper if you buy resale.
> 
> You can pair these with an Apple Dongle or something better for $100 like a Lotoo PAW S1 used.
> 
> *I own a lot of TOTL IEMs and I would total endorse these products as being very good*


No kidding, you are like the lord of all the IEMs I want to try out. 3DT and Isa are both on my list to check out.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

kadinh said:


> No kidding, you are like the lord of all the IEMs I want to try out. 3DT and Isa are both on my list to check out.


Haha.  We must be reading the same threads and listening to the same reviewers.


----------



## Currawong

Andykong said:


> Well, to certain extend, RU6 is aimed at a very small niche market inside a niche market, we are not feature packed, we can't go wireless, we can't MQA, we can't EQ, we didn't mearsure well,  ....  and we are fairly expensive among Dongle DACs, so I am not surprised that we are not as popular as other Dongle DACs in the market.   Besides, we don't have a social media team so not suprsied that you'll only find relevant discussion when you know where to look for.


And it's the nicest dongle DAC I've experienced so far. To add to the supposedly terrible technicalities of it, I was listening for a while with the Meze Elite direct from the RU-6 and enjoying it, even though there was quite a drop-off in bass compared to anything else in my main system. It just makes listening enjoyable, and how much something is enjoyable, can't be measured.


----------



## Hyde00 (Jan 26, 2022)

Currawong said:


> It just makes listening enjoyable, and how much something is enjoyable, can't be measured.


Oh you just wait ASR will come up with something. Something fancy sounding like emotional involvement index level (dub EIIL) LOL. 

Also it's partially why I stuck with Dragonfly Red for so long over the years. Despite it being a bit outdated and not as resolving as newer dongle dacs, I just like how it sounds and how musical it is. I've tried really hard to replace it but always end up coming back to it despite owning more resolving units (i.e. Burson Playmate 2 + V6 opamps).

Though I have PEE51 coming in today and RU6 come in some point this week so let's see if they manage to finally convince me to switch.


----------



## twister6

Currawong said:


> And it's the nicest dongle DAC I've experienced so far. To add to the supposedly terrible technicalities of it, I was listening for a while with the Meze Elite direct from the RU-6 and enjoying it, even though there was quite a drop-off in bass compared to anything else in my main system. It just makes listening enjoyable, and how much something is enjoyable, can't be measured.



Have you tried Elite with RU6+C9?  While I don't have Elite, only Empyrean, adding C9 improves the sub-bass extension, adds more rumble, and overall, adds more weight and impact to the bass.  Using it with my Android phone, HibyMusic app (Exclusive HQ USB audio access enabled, usb output set to USB Audio Performance mode, and USB Audio vol locked to max), RU6 set to 100, and C9 in Line Input and controlling the volume.  I also tried C9 in Pre-Amp mode while adjusting the volume from RU6, but that didn't sound as good with C9, resolution was reduced.  So, C9 Line Input is the best with RU6 (dongle set at max vol) if you need extra boost with more demanding headphones.


----------



## yaps66

Currawong said:


> And it's the nicest dongle DAC I've experienced so far. To add to the supposedly terrible technicalities of it, I was listening for a while with the Meze Elite direct from the RU-6 and enjoying it, even though there was quite a drop-off in bass compared to anything else in my main system. It just makes listening enjoyable, and how much something is enjoyable, can't be measured.


Agree with currawong. RU6 makes all my iems sound very enjoyable. I reach for it almost always now.


----------



## overcom3

i read ru6 is warmer than w2-131. is it good pair for warm iem like ier-m7?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

overcom3 said:


> i read ru6 is warmer than w2-131. is it good pair for warm iem like ier-m7?


Yes, RU6 can sound warm. If you are worried about RU6 muddying the Bass, it won't. If you find the IER-M7 is too laid back in the treble region then no, RU6 might not be a better pairing.


----------



## overcom3

Johnfg465vd said:


> Yes, RU6 can sound warm. If you are worried about RU6 muddying the Bass, it won't. If you find the IER-M7 is too laid back in the treble region then no, RU6 might not be a better pairing.


so, for ier-m7, you can tell RU6 can't help its treble?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

overcom3 said:


> so, for ier-m7, you can tell RU6 can't help its treble?


I don't have the IER-M7 but judging by how the RU6 paired with my IEMs. It pairs better with more resolving, neutral or bright-neutral gear.

If the IER-M7 sounds warm to you with not enough Treble energy, you won't be as wowed by the overall synergy with the RU6.


----------



## bnupy

Johnfg465vd said:


> I don't have the IER-M7 but judging by how the RU6 paired with my IEMs. It pairs better with more resolving, neutral or bright-neutral gear.
> 
> If the IER-M7 sounds warm to you with not enough Treble energy, you won't be as wowed by the overall synergy with the RU6.


Unless its the IER-M9 that hits the right sweet spot. Having the treble extension works in the favor.


----------



## twister6

For those who are interested, my full detailed review of RU6 is up!  Enjoy the read


----------



## lfgoodsound

received mine yesterday, sound is pretty nice, but i have sibilant highs with iems that should not sound like that at all. will the problem go away with time?


----------



## Andykong (Jan 27, 2022)

All members in Cayin will start our Chinese New Year holiday today. During the holiday, all orders, inquires and after sales service will be processed immediately when we resume office on 10th February. 2022.

Thanks for all the support and we wish everyone to stay safe, healthy, and to have a wonderful Year of Tiger.






PS.  Unlike previous years, I'll will take a break during the Chinese New Year vacation.  I'll only check on forum occasionally.  Please pardon me if I didn't resposne to your exchanges or PM promptly.


----------



## alota

twister6 said:


> For those who are interested, my full detailed review of RU6 is up! Enjoy the read


agree about solaris 2020. i tried several times the solaris  balanced vs. s.e. with the same cable and i prefere balanced. but the volume is low and sometimes i have some noise


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 27, 2022)

twister6 said:


> For those who are interested, my full detailed review of RU6 is up! Enjoy the read



You didn’t happen to measure the current draw for testing with the higher impedance ‘full size’ headphones, did you? Single-ended vs balanced? These measurements might better inform iPhone users regarding the RU6’s power demands, and what to expect from iPhones… and there being some noise about Android phones also thinking about governing the USB-C port…


----------



## twister6

rarewolf said:


> You didn’t happen to measure the current draw for testing with the higher impedance ‘full size’ headphones, did you? Single-ended vs balanced? These measurements might better inform iPhone users regarding the RU6’s power demands, and what to expect from iPhones… and there being some noise about Android phones also thinking about governing the USB-C port…



Don't have iPhone, but can measure tonight after work using ipod touch?


----------



## rarewolf

twister6 said:


> Don't have iPhone, but can measure tonight after work using ipod touch?


Thanks Twister6… I just thought power demand would be the same independent of the source, but maybe that’s something to check as well(?)


----------



## OspreyAndy

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Twister6… I just thought power demand would be the same independent of the source, but maybe that’s something to check as well(?)


As with many USB implementation, the voltage supply may be capped at 5V. Some even hovers at 3.7V. But what is more important the current being supplied throughout the voltage range. In this case I have found that iPhones typically has lower current than most Android devices. Some android devices like Samsung Galaxy S20, capable of providing 900 mA of current (USB 3.0), while most other devices capped at 500 mA (USB 2.0)


----------



## twister6

OspreyAndy said:


> As with many USB implementation, the voltage supply may be capped at 5V. Some even hovers at 3.7V. But what is more important the current being supplied throughout the voltage range. In this case I have found that iPhones typically has lower current than most Android devices. Some android devices like Samsung Galaxy S20, capable of providing 900 mA of current (USB 3.0), while most other devices capped at 500 mA (USB 2.0)



It is also cable dependent, not only device dependent.  For example, S1 with its original usb-c to lightning cable connected to iPod touch was measuring only 3.85V and had issues at high volume in BAL (more current draw) where output became choppy.  They updated the cable in S2 and under the same test conditions with S1 I measured a solid 5V.

I also verified Cayin optional usb-c to lightning cable and with iPod touch and RU6 it was measuring a solid 5V.  I just don't recall exactly how much current it was syncing with balanced output connected to ATH-R70x, so have to double check it tonight.


----------



## linux4ever

twister6 said:


> For those who are interested, my full detailed review of RU6 is up! Enjoy the read


Very nicely written, as always.


----------



## blotmouse

lfgoodsound said:


> received mine yesterday, sound is pretty nice, but i have sibilant highs with iems that should not sound like that at all. will the problem go away with time?


r-2r designs do benefit greatly from a burn/break in period, and will change quite a bit throughout the 1st 200 hrs of use. 
Hrs 40-100 will show the most dramatic changes with some additional refinement coming later. 
RU6 straight out of the box wasn't very impressive to me, nor was the R01 module. It was "OK", then it was holy sheeeeet!


----------



## BaTou069

Not my review but a very interesting one by archimago including measurements 
https://archimago.blogspot.com/2022/01/review-measurements-cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb.html


----------



## peterinvan

Hyde00 said:


> One of my head-fi friend always tell me music always sounds better with a bit of alcohol.


You should listen with a little THC...


----------



## BaTou069

peterinvan said:


> You should listen with a little THC...


Too high of a tolerance for a little


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> All members in Cayin will start our Chinese New Year holiday today. During the holiday, all orders, inquires and after sales service will be processed immediately when we resume office on 10th February. 2022.
> 
> Thanks for all the support and we wish everyone to stay safe, healthy, and to have a wonderful Year of Tiger.
> 
> ...


Happy New Year Andy! Enjoy your holidays and time with your loved ones!


----------



## twister6

rarewolf said:


> Thanks Twister6… I just thought power demand would be the same independent of the source, but maybe that’s something to check as well(?)



my R70x only has SE cable, so even at volume 74 from SE, RU6 doesn't draw more than 130mA from iPod touch.  I switched to Empyrean which I have with balanced cable, and did the same, pushing it harder, way beyond listening volume from BAL output with RU6 connected to iPod touch (through multimeter dongle), and noticed that as I pushed it beyond volume 60 on RU6, the current went up from 130mA to 140mA.  No issues playing music.


----------



## bnupy

BaTou069 said:


> Not my review but a very interesting one by archimago including measurements
> https://archimago.blogspot.com/2022/01/review-measurements-cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb.html


That's a really big conclusion in that article.


----------



## CJMike

lfgoodsound said:


> received mine yesterday, sound is pretty nice, but i have sibilant highs with iems that should not sound like that at all. will the problem go away with time?


Interesting that you mentioned this, yesterday I had an audition of the RU6, to my surprise I had the same finding with sibilance pairing with FiiO FHE and Westone W60 earphones (both not normally sibilant), only until I tried UM Mest MkII was the treble at an acceptable level, Mest II is known for it's nice treble. Checking with the shop, the testing unit is only for auditioning purposes for some hours, that did not go through a proper burn-in process. I was all set to bring the RU6 home, but this was a deal breaker for me and completely different to the reviews I've read.

Pls keep us updated if burn-in or usage over time improves on this.


----------



## dakchi

For those who are interested in Lightning to USB C cable for their iPhone-RU6, I just received the cable from Oeaudio this morning. When I unboxed it, I was surprised to see how short it is. It is a good thing because so far I was using the camera adapter cable-USB A to USB C of RU6-USB C to USB C cable USB C cable. This combination of cables and adapters can become very cumbersome. It is also a bad thing because 35$ for such a short cable is crazy expensive
My first impressions of the sound with this cable: it is more bright (has more air), has less body than the combination of cable-adapters. The bass is also less tight. I'm a bit puzzled about this cable
In summary, if for you RU6 is too warm sounding and does not have enough 'air', you can balance with this cable. If the sound changes in the future, I will let you know


----------



## twister6

dakchi said:


> For those who are interested in Lightning to USB C cable for their iPhone-RU6, I just received the cable from Oeaudio this morning. When I unboxed it, I was surprised to see how short it is. It is a good thing because so far I was using the camera adapter cable-USB A to USB C of RU6-USB C to USB C cable USB C cable. This combination of cables and adapters can become very cumbersome. It is also a bad thing because 35$ for such a short cable is crazy expensive
> My first impressions of the sound with this cable: it is more bright (has more air), has less body than the combination of cable-adapters. The bass is also less tight. I'm a bit puzzled about this cable
> In summary, if for you RU6 is too warm sounding and does not have enough 'air', you can balance with this cable. If the sound changes in the future, I will let you know



Not sure if camera adapter contributes to some changes, maybe some reflection in digital signal due to impedance mismatch which affects the sound, somehow.  But when I compared original Cayin vs OE Audio vs DDHifi (all usb-c to usb-c), everything sounded nearly the same to my ears.  When straightened, OE Audio is exactly the same length as stock cable, but it is very stiff due to extra shielding.  Also, very high quality build and nice shiny connectors.


----------



## dakchi

twister6 said:


> Not sure if camera adapter contributes to some changes, maybe some reflection in digital signal due to impedance mismatch which affects the sound, somehow.  But when I compared original Cayin vs OE Audio vs DDHifi (all usb-c to usb-c), everything sounded nearly the same to my ears.  When straightened, OE Audio is exactly the same length as stock cable, but it is very stiff due to extra shielding.  Also, very high quality build and nice shiny connectors.


I agree, it is a high quality build cable. I was hesitating between Oeaudio and DD Hifi that you have. Which one do you prefer?


----------



## BaTou069

twister6 said:


> But when I compared original Cayin vs OE Audio vs DDHifi (all usb-c to usb-c), everything sounded nearly the same to my ears.


 Not surprised at all, did you expect a change?


----------



## lfgoodsound

blotmouse said:


> r-2r designs do benefit greatly from a burn/break in period, and will change quite a bit throughout the 1st 200 hrs of use.
> Hrs 40-100 will show the most dramatic changes with some additional refinement coming later.
> RU6 straight out of the box wasn't very impressive to me, nor was the R01 module. It was "OK", then it was holy sheeeeet!


oh, i listened mine only for like 20+ hours, ok. ill let it a chance, gonna listen for 150+ hours more.


----------



## twister6

BaTou069 said:


> Not surprised at all, did you expect a change?



I was just replying to another poster who heard a difference.


----------



## oldkid

BaTou069 said:


> Not my review but a very interesting one by archimago including measurements
> https://archimago.blogspot.com/2022/01/review-measurements-cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb.html


Fascinating read! Way too technical for me but all of my questions about the RU6 are answered in this review.

RU6 is indeed a true NOS DAC and measures as such.
Oversampling is useless for DSD sources.
However DSD 64 is converted to 352.8 khz and not 384 khz which is better.

The DAC can't benefit from Hi Res audio sources as its resolution is fairly limited

None of that is a deal breaker especially when one considers it is a truly unique product.

Even if it's the sonic equivalent of an early 90s CD player, that's precisely why I love its sound. I even compared it to one in a previous post. Glad to see thoroughly run tests confirm what my ears have been telling me for weeks.


----------



## Goofyboy84

I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


----------



## sahmen

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


Never had this experience before, although I have spent several hours per day binge-listening on it, especially during the first month I had it.


----------



## powersfineart

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


I have never had it cut out, even during 3 hour listening sessions or longer through an iPhone 12 Pro to the RU6 to Etymotic EVO IEMs with a balanced SuperBaX cable from the 4.4mm jack. My volume level is usually around 36 to 39 with this setup.


----------



## TYATYA

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


It may off due to connection unstable when touching the jack or something similarly. 
Shutoff due to heat is never found on mine, even in some case high temperature reach apprx 43 or more (usually less than 38) 
It is rare or very rare the heat up happen after 2 month (to be exact, I hadnt found it again)


----------



## Goofyboy84

Ok. Here’s my final post on this whole entire situation. I’m blaming nobody in particular… but here goes.. as I have nothing to lose here…

I’m 100% frustrated with the amp cut out crap. It’s old and I’m done with that. I’ve thrown tons of money toward this. When the amp works, it sounds amazing. Top notch… then suddenly it just poops the bed. 

Now… portability? There is none with the amp. I have to constantly be tied to a charger, if I use my phone. I can hook it to the iPad just fine.. and that’s that. 

My apple lightning headphone dongle for less than $10 after tax has been 100% most reliable for me. 
I’ve tried most every solution I know of…. 

Maybe I’ll just do a desktop amp… I mean… it almost can’t be any less reliable than what I’m working with right now. If I’m not going to be portable… might as well go big. Ya know?? 
This whole thing breaks my heart, but it is what it is… I’ll just cut my losses. Enjoy my Laylas with what I have. 

Have a good night…. Zach


----------



## Goofyboy84

TYATYA said:


> It may off due to connection unstable when touching the jack or something similarly.
> Shutoff due to heat is never found on mine, even in some case high temperature reach apprx 43 or more (usually less than 38)
> It is rare or very rare the heat up happen after 2 month (to be exact, I hadnt found it again)


Connection where??? Everything is brand new… I just bought a new apple dongle today.. just to make sure. I’m done throwing money at it. 😢😢😢


----------



## TYATYA (Jan 28, 2022)

Goofyboy84 said:


> Connection where??? Everything is brand new… I just bought a new apple dongle today.. just to make sure. I’m done throwing money at it. 😢😢😢


My dap SP1000 randomly restart while in use and I am sure it is not new but not too old.
My ru6 also new (2 months) not 2nd hand. I got more problem with it than you: hot, volume variation at unbox moment, and sometimes plug in but it did not power on (only this existing now)
New or old, may not relation. 

I think audio journey is a lesson also. We learnt from it, with fees.
I want to stop since shure kse1500 and SP1000ss but I still try something I though funny. I do not think I will got a new thing (w/o tons of money) beyond my stop spot.
But still corious some small stuffs.
Kaldas RR1, Ibasso SR1, Ru6 are blind bind items.

I learnt that: when maximize a potential of a stuff, amazing reward I will get.
Hope you can find a way to deal with your RU6.

Constrast with reviews, SR1 was crap for me, it even did not reproduce in a correct way a note of piano or bass guitar on the 1st day.
2nd day I decided  to digging the reason.  Then mod it on day3.
I still keep it (so it appears in my sig) while others has left away. If chose my hd800s to keep or my SR1, I can not decide easily !

At the time posting this I am listening to UAPP(on my phone) with PEQ + Ru6 + Silver cable + it00 from ibasso.
(Cable $280, it00 $69).
I am sure that I love this (280 + 69)bug more than my shure535 in the pass (wich was $520 in my local) or my hd650 (oh yes, so similar to that sound but in form of an iem!)
This peq, it00+cable+ru6 in a combination is latest lesson I learnt


----------



## blotmouse

I run my ru6 24/7 for weeks on end while burning in iems. I don’t have any heat issues at all. Connected to a TB3 port on an iMac. 
@Goofyboy84 You should have it looked at or replaced. Something is wrong with your unit.


----------



## OspreyAndy

blotmouse said:


> I run my ru6 24/7 for weeks on end while burning in iems. I don’t have any heat issues at all. Connected to a TB3 port on an iMac.
> @Goofyboy84 You should have it looked at or replaced. Something is wrong with your unit.


Agreed. My own RU6 close to 400 hours now with regular use. No heating up issues, no disconnection. And I pair it with two different phones, a laptop. Driving all sorts of IEMs and Headphones. It is not unusual to have a bad unit among many. Even the most prominent of brands can have this issue. Just ask Cayin for a replacement


----------



## Goofyboy84

blotmouse said:


> I run my ru6 24/7 for weeks on end while burning in iems. I don’t have any heat issues at all. Connected to a TB3 port on an iMac.
> @Goofyboy84 You should have it looked at or replaced. Something is wrong with your unit.


If you thumb through the whole thing here… I’ve had nothing but issues… little crap… but all the time…


----------



## Goofyboy84

OspreyAndy said:


> Agreed. My own RU6 close to 400 hours now with regular use. No heating up issues, no disconnection. And I pair it with two different phones, a laptop. Driving all sorts of IEMs and Headphones. It is not unusual to have a bad unit among many. Even the most prominent of brands can have this issue. Just ask Cayin for a replacement


Mine gets HOT! I have freakin Laylas with a balanced cord! Not exactly a hellacious load here! 20 ohms. Sooo… yeah…


----------



## Goofyboy84

Goofyboy84 said:


> If you thumb through the whole thing here… I’ve had nothing but issues… little crap… but all the time…


I’m past my 30 days. But the crappy thing is… half the time… my Laylas have been at JH getting remolded… then I had static.. returned them… the Laylas are fine.. so I paid $9.xx whatever and bought an apple headphone-lightning dongle… as my old one may have a short. Ok fine. That works flawlessly now.

Hook the amp up to the camera adaptor to the phone… blah blah… everything is Apple branded, Cayin, or JH audio. No junk brand here… I’ve tried a Belkin charging cord in the beginning… nope! Apple only. I’m ok with the apple only. I wouldn’t excpect anything less from apple…. Haha! 

It’s just frustrating. I was hoping 100% plug and play… I mean… I paid enough… didn’t I? 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️


----------



## Goofyboy84

OspreyAndy said:


> Agreed. My own RU6 close to 400 hours now with regular use. No heating up issues, no disconnection. And I pair it with two different phones, a laptop. Driving all sorts of IEMs and Headphones. It is not unusual to have a bad unit among many. Even the most prominent of brands can have this issue. Just ask Cayin for a replacement


I have like… 100-150… maybe??? Hell! They’re just barely burned in!!! 😢😢😢😢 that’s EVERYTHING. And yes… I was hoping to use anytime and as much as I wanted. No issues. Ya know? 

I’ve put it in the box. I’ll see what happens in the next couple weeks. I won’t bother Andy right now. He’s doing his holiday celebration. 

I’m just bitching. Frustrated.


----------



## yaps66

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


It has not happened to me.  I just run mine for 48 hours with the case on and the screen turned on the entire time without any issues.  It only felt warm to the touch.


----------



## alota

Goofyboy84 said:


> I have like… 100-150… maybe??? Hell! They’re just barely burned in!!! 😢😢😢😢 that’s EVERYTHING. And yes… I was hoping to use anytime and as much as I wanted. No issues. Ya know?
> 
> I’ve put it in the box. I’ll see what happens in the next couple weeks. I won’t bother Andy right now. He’s doing his holiday celebration.
> 
> I’m just bitching. Frustrated.


Sorry but why you don't ask replacement of ru6?


----------



## yfei

CJMike said:


> Interesting that you mentioned this, yesterday I had an audition of the RU6, to my surprise I had the same finding with sibilance pairing with FiiO FHE and Westone W60 earphones (both not normally sibilant), , but this was a deal breaker for me and



Maybe this is due to issues with host's software/app settings?


----------



## oldkid (Jan 29, 2022)

Just bought a nice RCA to jack cable for my xDuoo MT-601. Now I can use the real line output and not the amplified headphones output like I used to at the preamp stage. It's a lot more cleaner and I can now enjoy the RU6 in a real desktop setup that sounds so freaking good! 🤤


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m past my 30 days. But the crappy thing is… half the time… my Laylas have been at JH getting remolded… then I had static.. returned them… the Laylas are fine.. so I paid $9.xx whatever and bought an apple headphone-lightning dongle… as my old one may have a short. Ok fine. That works flawlessly now.
> 
> Hook the amp up to the camera adaptor to the phone… blah blah… everything is Apple branded, Cayin, or JH audio. No junk brand here… I’ve tried a Belkin charging cord in the beginning… nope! Apple only. I’m ok with the apple only. I wouldn’t excpect anything less from apple…. Haha!
> 
> It’s just frustrating. I was hoping 100% plug and play… I mean… I paid enough… didn’t I? 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️



Maybe you are outside of
return window, but you are still under warranty. Since nobody else having this issue, just contact the place where you purchased it to get a replacement. 

Another thing, I remember the whole saga of you going through half a dozen of different charging cables and splitters trying to listen and charge at the same time, using different off brand or whatever, splitters, adapters, etc. Not rulling out something didn't burn out. 

But right now, if you are just using a simple connection with your iPhone, usb-c to lightning otg cable and RU6, does it still get warm? Forget about splitters and charging while listening. Let's get down to basic connection.


----------



## hoofman

oldkid said:


> Just bought a nice RCA to jack cable for my xDuoo MT-601. Now I can use the real line output and not the amplified headphones output like I used to at the preamp stage. It's a lot more cleaner and I can now enjoy the RU6 in a real desktop setup that sounds so freaking good! 🤤


Can you share a diagram/photo of your setup? Are you connecting the RCA cable to the 3.5mm jack and then plug to the RCA input of your amp? How about gain & volume setting on the RU6?


----------



## oldkid

hoofman said:


> Can you share a diagram/photo of your setup? Are you connecting the RCA cable to the 3.5mm jack and then plug to the RCA input of your amp? How about gain & volume setting on the RU6?


My detailed setup is : RU6 => 4.4mm to 3.5mm balanced cable =>MT-601 =>RCA to 3.5mm cable =>FiiO Q3=> Focal Elegia. 
I'm connecting the RCA part of the cable my tube amp line out, making it a proper pre-amp, then the 3.5mm plug goes into the Q3 aux in to use the device in amp mode. 
With the pre-amp level set to max, RU6 on NOS mode with low gain, around 50-51 is enough volume. I can fine tune it with the Q3 volume knob


----------



## rarewolf (Jan 29, 2022)

hoofman said:


> Can you share a diagram/photo of your setup? Are you connecting the RCA cable to the 3.5mm jack and then plug to the RCA input of your amp? How about gain & volume setting on the RU6?


Edit… I am moving from the RU6 to the W2. The thing about the RU6 is that its “accuracy” (note quotes) is as much dependent on using its own volume control (while the source volume at max) as using the R2R DAC.

I enjoyed the RU6 sound, and it drove my Shure headcans very well, but I’m also investing in IEMs, and felt I needed equalization for best adapting to both types of listening…

Cheers from the Avalon Peninsula…


----------



## hoofman

Goofyboy84 said:


> I’m back. Laylas are back… does the RU6 randomly shut off or crap out once it hits a certain temperature? Just curious. Mine is suddenly doing this… just since I plugged it in and started listening for… an hour maybe?


Mine never shut off randomly, but it does hiccup in some specific app setting. I use my RU6 with Sony Music Centre app on both PC and Xperia 10 ii phone without issue, but when I use the RU6 with Samsung Note 10+ and Music Centre music will stop randomly every few minutes. I then switched to Samsung Music on the Note 10+ and the issue went away. Which setup are you using?


----------



## hoofman

oldkid said:


> My detailed setup is : RU6 => 4.4mm to 3.5mm balanced cable =>MT-601 =>RCA to 3.5mm cable =>FiiO Q3=> Focal Elegia.
> I'm connecting the RCA part of the cable my tube amp line out, making it a proper pre-amp, then the 3.5mm plug goes into the Q3 aux in to use the device in amp mode.
> With the pre-amp level set to max, RU6 on NOS mode with low gain, around 50-51 is enough volume. I can fine tune it with the Q3 volume knob


As I understand here in your setup we have the RU6 for R2R DAC, and then MT-601 as pre-amp, and Q3 in amp only mode. That is interesting I have never tried anything like that. 
Why did you use the Q3 instead of the MT-601 for amp here? Is it for more driving power or something else like synergy pairing?


----------



## CJMike (Jan 29, 2022)

yfei said:


> Maybe this is due to issues with host's software/app settings?


I actually had the RU6 running off a Shanling M0 DAP, was set to get the RU6 for at home/high quanlity listening (and was hoping to pick up the Mest II as well which fell through too but that's a different story)
At the same time I was looking for a more entry level dongle for the M0 since the 3.5mm out's acting weird, (off topic the Shanling UA2 and UA1 actually sounds really good and worked beautifully with the M0)




Still reading a bunch of forum threads and reviews to try and understand the sibilance issue..
Only possibilities I could think of:
1. That particular RU6 haven't enough burn-in time. OR
2. The M0 wasn't feeding enough power for the RU6 to shine... thinking back, I forgot to test the RU6 with my phone and laptop (which I had with me, gahhh)
3. RU6 only show it's true colour with TOTL pairings, the FHE/W60 are not good enough? that's not the impression I get from all the reviews and owner impressions...

Still really want the RU6..

Thanks for the thought anyhow..


----------



## oldkid

hoofman said:


> As I understand here in your setup we have the RU6 for R2R DAC, and then MT-601 as pre-amp, and Q3 in amp only mode. That is interesting I have never tried anything like that.
> Why did you use the Q3 instead of the MT-601 for amp here? Is it for more driving power or something else like synergy pairing?


Yes, MT-601 is the pre-amp and Q3 is the amp.
The reason I connected them in this order is to be able to use the balanced output of the Q3. Focal Elegia just sound better with a balanced connection. (Or maybe I have never tried a really good single ended output).
Also I believe that tubes perform better when used at the pre-amp stage


----------



## TYATYA (Jan 29, 2022)

New found on connection: some app as NeutronMp or UAPP request the right for directly access and control usb port.
So need to close the app BF plug it RU6 again!!
Example, Uapp ask the control right and I click Yes, then using it. Now unplug the cable and plug again.
My phone lost control of usb port and it WON'T found that Ru6 was plugged.
UAPP still pause after first unplug so it wont found the ru6 too.
Ten tried and all fail.

For that kind of app, before pluging the cable, we need:
1)close the app, or
2)click play (it plays sound to device's speaker, yes)


----------



## oldkid

TYATYA said:


> New found on connection: some app as NeutronMp or UAPP request the right for directly access and control usb port.
> So need to close the app BF plug it RU6 again!!
> Example, Uapp ask the control and I click Yes, then using it. Now unplug the cable and plug again.
> Your phone lost control of usb port and it WON'T found that Ru6 was plugged.
> Ten tried and all fail.


If you are on Android, you have the option to give the app this permission once and for all, so that it won't have to ask you each time you plug your DAC


----------



## TYATYA

oldkid said:


> If you are on Android, you have the option to give the app this permission once and for all, so that it won't have to ask you each time you plug your DAC


Known that but I dont set it.
Bcs I want to play youtube via ru6 too.
When plug in, just click any where on scr but not OK or Yes button if I wanna use youtube.


----------



## BaTou069

bnupy said:


> That's a really big conclusion in that article.


Agreed 


oldkid said:


> Fascinating read! Way too technical for me but all of my questions about the RU6 are answered in this review.
> 
> RU6 is indeed a true NOS DAC and measures as such.
> Oversampling is useless for DSD sources.
> ...


To me that article puts not only the RU6 but the whole DAC industry in a new perspective.


----------



## oldkid

BaTou069 said:


> Agreed
> 
> To me that article puts not only the RU6 but the whole DAC industry in a new perspective.


How so? Were those measurements so much surprising to you?


----------



## rarewolf

oldkid said:


> How so? Were those measurements so much surprising to you?


It was surprising to me! I understand that it’s debatable as to whether most expensive dongle DACs can resolve 20bits, but his measurements would imply the RU6 can barely resolve 16bits (CD quality)…


----------



## alota

CJMike said:


> I actually had the RU6 running off a Shanling M0 DAP, was set to get the RU6 for at home/high quanlity listening (and was hoping to pick up the Mest II as well which fell through too but that's a different story)
> At the same time I was looking for a more entry level dongle for the M0 since the 3.5mm out's acting weird, (off topic the Shanling UA2 and UA1 actually sounds really good and worked beautifully with the M0)
> 
> 
> ...


Try ibasso dc05 for entry level dongle 3.5


----------



## alota

rarewolf said:


> It was surprising to me! I understand that it’s debatable as to whether most expensive dongle DACs can resolve 20bits, but his measurements would imply the RU6 can barely resolve 16bits (CD quality)…


The bit resolution is just one aspect. Many 24 or 32 bit are only in the paper


----------



## oldkid (Jan 29, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> It was surprising to me! I understand that it’s debatable as to whether most expensive dongle DACs can resolve 20bits, but his measurements would imply the RU6 can barely resolve 16bits (CD quality)…


Yes, but does it change how enjoyable this DAC is to listen to?
Before I read the measurements results, I knew that the difference between CD quality and Hi Res or even DSD was unusually thin on this DAC. What I didn't know is that CD quality is the ceiling for RU6, not the floor.
But, again, it is my DAC of choice to listen to FLAC without any kind of oversampling going on.
For DSD, I would rather pick my Hidizs S9 because the RU6 cannot reproduce the dynamic range correctly.
I would really like to try a R2R DAC with native DSD support, but that is expensive


----------



## rarewolf

oldkid said:


> Yes, but does it change how enjoyable this DAC is to listen to?
> Before I read the measurements results, I knew that the difference between CD quality and Hi Res or even DSD was unusually thin on this DAC. What I didn't know is that CD quality is the ceiling for RU6, not the floor.
> But, again, it is my DAC of choice to listen to FLAC without any kind of oversampling going on.
> For DSD, I would rather pick my Hidizs S9 because the RU6 cannot reproduce the dynamic range correctly.
> I would really like to try a R2R DAC with native DSD support, but that is expensive



Personally, I enjoyed the output from the RU6 into my shure headcans, even though I thought it made the result ~2~4db warmer than my headcans already were. Still, I adapted to it, and ultimately found nothing wrong with it. 16bit CD quality is perfectly capable of the full experience, and that includes the output from the RU6. However, the RU6 does limit your ability to properly marry its output with whatever IEM or headphones you best enjoy, because it insists on a untouched bitstream at maximum volume, and offers no equalization for better matching all your ear-devices.

I believe 16bits is all that’s required for musicians to deliver what they wanted to your ears to hear… as a final product. However, they didn’t get to the final product via 16bits. Similarly, if you feel modifying that 16bit result so as to better match a variety of ear-devices (i.e., equalization), then you want the amplifier working with a DAC that had as many bits to work with as possible.


----------



## LinkAudio (Feb 2, 2022)

[Deleted]


----------



## elira

rarewolf said:


> It was surprising to me! I understand that it’s debatable as to whether most expensive dongle DACs can resolve 20bits, but his measurements would imply the RU6 can barely resolve 16bits (CD quality)…


If I recall properly, not even the best DACs are capable of resolving 24 bits. 16 bits are enough for most content though.


----------



## rarewolf

elira said:


> If I recall properly, not even the best DACs are capable of resolving 24 bits. 16 bits are enough for most content though.


I acknowledged exactly that in my previous posts… but, also, what if…


----------



## Goofyboy84 (Jan 29, 2022)

twister6 said:


> Maybe you are outside of
> return window, but you are still under warranty. Since nobody else having this issue, just contact the place where you purchased it to get a replacement.
> 
> Another thing, I remember the whole saga of you going through half a dozen of different charging cables and splitters trying to listen and charge at the same time, using different off brand or whatever, splitters, adapters, etc. Not rulling out something didn't burn out.
> ...


Right now I’m omitting the RU6. It’s in the box. I’m using phone -apple branded lightning to headphone jack- 3.5mm unbalanced cable… to JH Laylas.

Nothing there to get hot.

Nothing was complicated with the other process…

Phone… apple camera adaptor that splits into lightning charger and USB. Go from usb to the Cayin usb to USBc converter (included with the RU6) to the Cayin USBc to USBc cord… included with the RU6… to the RU6 DAC/amp dongle… to 4.4 mm balanced cable from JH audio… to Laylas.


My Laylas and all supplied cables have been sent to JH. Nothing wrong there.

I have purchased the adaptor a couple of weeks ago.. brand new from apple…

I purchased the dongle thing… apple… lightning to headphone adaptor yesterday.

I can at least listen to my Laylas now.

When the RU6 works… it sounds anazing

When it cuts out… or just doesn’t work… well… it’s dead to me. It’s currently in the box.

I’m burned out on this, honestly. Done.

I was hoping for a nice sounding system… that is portable, that’s reliable… I’ve paid good money to have. And well…. Obviously it’s not the case. 😢😢😢😢😢

So, tell me where I went wrong here.


----------



## Goofyboy84

yaps66 said:


> It has not happened to me.  I just run mine for 48 hours with the case on and the screen turned on the entire time without any issues.  It only felt warm to the touch.


Hell… I don’t even have a case for the RU6 and I’m glad I don’t!!!!! It’ll almost melt!!!


----------



## BaTou069 (Jan 29, 2022)

oldkid said:


> How so? Were those measurements so much surprising to you?


Hehe 
Yes, it was. It made me think how small of a difference DACs actually do to our musical enjoyment, no matter if they measure crazy good or worse than a 80s' CD player, as was mentioned in the review. And that the differences ppl report on from different dacs, amps or cables most probably aren't night and day (as so many ppl write) but really only nuances, if any.
From a psychological standpoint I can understand that someone who spent a lot of money (what accounts for a lot of course varies from person 2 person) in gear that is not a headphone or speaker did so for an improvement in sound, and nobody wants to throw out money for no change, so ppl many times imagine it.
I remember when I bought almost 10y ago my first DAC/Amp (Fiio E18), I really wanted to be blown away from the sound and expected a huge change from the sound of my phones Headphone out and sticked to it, but deep inside I was disappointed and hoped for more. Maybe thats whats keeping people buying more and newer stuff, the search, like that first time on molly lol
Man I even remember that had a Uptown Regen that was supposed to change everything, and in the Regen thread were those who swore even more night and day differences when using a LPS for it... I call that wishful hearing 

Well, lets see if I'll order a Mojo2 in the next 48 h 



Goofyboy84 said:


> Right now I’m omitting the RU6. It’s in the box. I’m using phone -apple branded lightning to headphone jack- 3.5mm unbalanced cable… to JH Laylas.


The apple dongle is one of the best in terms of value for money, is very convenient and it measures incredible, just not much power


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> Right now I’m omitting the RU6. It’s in the box. I’m using phone -apple branded lightning to headphone jack- 3.5mm unbalanced cable… to JH Laylas.
> 
> Nothing there to get hot.
> 
> ...



Sorry, I think you missed my point.  I'm just trying to help you with troubleshooting of your problem.  When you are using splitters, adapters, different ways of side-charging, different cables, etc. you are introducing too many variables between your phone and your RU6.  If you do care, after all, this is not some budget $25 dongle, simplify it down to your iPhone, RU6 and something like Cayin's own $19 usb-c to lightning short OTG interconnect cable.  Does it work without hiccups and running cool as expected?  Then, when you start adding more stuff in-between, if possible, do one thing at a time, to figure out root cause of your problem.  Even if you got some adapter/splitter with input for external charging, don't connect yet the charger, see how it work and if it starts to overheat without it.

Like I said before, your product is still under warranty, and you should contact the retailer who sold it to you, but they will probably ask you similar troubleshooting questions.


----------



## oldkid (Jan 29, 2022)

BaTou069 said:


> Hehe
> Yes, it was. It made me think how small of a difference DACs actually do to our musical enjoyment, no matter if they measure crazy good or worse than a 80s' CD player, as was mentioned in the review. And that the differences ppl report on from different dacs, amps or cables most probably aren't night and day (as so many ppl write) but really only nuances, if any.
> From a psychological standpoint I can understand that someone who spent a lot of money (what accounts for a lot of course varies from person 2 person) in gear that is not a headphone or speaker did so for an improvement in sound, and nobody wants to throw out money for no change, so ppl many times imagine it.
> I remember when I bought almost 10y ago my first DAC/Amp (Fiio E18), I really wanted to be blown away from the sound and expected a huge change from the sound of my phones Headphone out and sticked to it, but deep inside I was disappointed and hoped for more. Maybe thats whats keeping people buying more and newer stuff, the search, like that first time on molly lol
> ...


I kinda disagree with you. Everyone hears differently, but I know I can identify all my DACs instantly. They all sound different and I know each sound signature really well.

How a given pair of headphones sound is heavily impacted by the DAC being used.
Amps are mostly transparent as they should always be.

I think brain burn-in is real in a way. We get used to each incremental improvement in sound quality and it's difficult to go back to something that sound worse.

The only way to identify a bad headphones reliably is to compare it to a better sounding one.

That's why reviewers might destroy a headphones or DAC that you really like. At first, you will think they are crazy, but they only do that because they have heard much better, unlike the rest of us, who can't afford to try every new model.


----------



## DBaldock9

I ordered a KAEI TAP-1S Fully Balanced Tube Hybrid Amp & Desktop Power Supply on 12-JAN-22, and it arrived in the mail on Friday.
It's got 4x tubes in the preamp, 2x socketed op-amps in the driver stage, and the output stage apparently uses discrete transistors (to provide up to 1.5-W/Ch in portable mode, and 2.45-W/Ch in desktop mode).

Really enjoying listening to YouTube videos and FLAC tracks, using my RU6 in NOS mode.

Signal Path: Linux PC (Chrome Browser / JRiver MC28) [USB-A] -> [USB-C] Cayin RU6 NOS R-2R DAC (Volume = 100) [4.4mm TRRRS] -> [4.4mm TRRRS] Kaei TAP-1S (Desktop / Tube mode) [4.4mm TRRRS] -> 4.4mm TRRRS -to- 2.5mm TRS adapter -> various balanced earphones & earbuds


----------



## hoofman

oldkid said:


> Yes, MT-601 is the pre-amp and Q3 is the amp.
> The reason I connected them in this order is to be able to use the balanced output of the Q3. Focal Elegia just sound better with a balanced connection. (Or maybe I have never tried a really good single ended output).
> Also I believe that tubes perform better when used at the pre-amp stage


Ah I see it makes sense now. I was not aware of 4.4 mm to 3.5 mm before. I can try that to connect my RU6 to my S2 Panda, and may be pre-amp with tube amp if I have a chance to do so. Thanks for sharing.


----------



## oldkid

DBaldock9 said:


> I ordered a KAEI TAP-1S Fully Balanced Tube Hybrid Amp & Desktop Power Supply on 12-JAN-22, and it arrived in the mail on Friday.
> It's got 4x tubes in the preamp, 2x socketed op-amps in the driver stage, and the output stage apparently uses discrete transistors (to provide up to 1.5-W/Ch in portable mode, and 2.45-W/Ch in desktop mode).
> 
> Really enjoying listening to YouTube videos and FLAC tracks, using my RU6 in NOS mode.
> ...


Interesting device. But is it possible to change the tubes easily on that thing? Tube rolling is at least half of the fun with tube amps


----------



## DBaldock9

oldkid said:


> Interesting device. But is it possible to change the tubes easily on that thing? Tube rolling is at least half of the fun with tube amps



No, the tubes are soldered to the circuit board.
I believe that the TAP-1S is using the same New Old Stock Raytheon JAN5784WB (VHF Radio Tube) tubes as the current Little Bear B4-X - probably since the availability of the JAN5899 (UHF Radio Tube), used in the first version of the B4-X, has been depleted.  And, I don't think there are any direct cross reference replacement tubes available.


----------



## Goofyboy84

twister6 said:


> Sorry, I think you missed my point.  I'm just trying to help you with troubleshooting of your problem.  When you are using splitters, adapters, different ways of side-charging, different cables, etc. you are introducing too many variables between your phone and your RU6.  If you do care, after all, this is not some budget $25 dongle, simplify it down to your iPhone, RU6 and something like Cayin's own $19 usb-c to lightning short OTG interconnect cable.  Does it work without hiccups and running cool as expected?  Then, when you start adding more stuff in-between, if possible, do one thing at a time, to figure out root cause of your problem.  Even if you got some adapter/splitter with input for external charging, don't connect yet the charger, see how it work and if it starts to overheat without it.
> 
> Like I said before, your product is still under warranty, and you should contact the retailer who sold it to you, but they will probably ask you similar troubleshooting questions.


I have the Cayin interconnect. I have literally everything Cayin or Apple. I have issues hearing, so the Cayin works with the phone alone… to a certain point. It cuts out. It does a bit better if the phone is charging at the same time, but alas… it still cuts out. 

And I know it’s not some $25 dongle. I’m fully aware of that. I’m also fully aware that I’ve spent north of $2,000 for this set up, including the Laylas, and I’m stuck here using what’s 100% reliable… the iPhone dongle.. using the 3.5mm cable. 

So… I literally have over $500 in stuff… sitting here. 

RU6 $250

Adaptor $40 or so 

Cayin cable $20 or so 

Balanced cable from JH $200

This I’m aware of also.


----------



## SHOOTINGTECHIE

Goofyboy84 said:


> I have the Cayin interconnect. I have literally everything Cayin or Apple. I have issues hearing, so the Cayin works with the phone alone… to a certain point. It cuts out. It does a bit better if the phone is charging at the same time, but alas… it still cuts out.
> 
> And I know it’s not some $25 dongle. I’m fully aware of that. I’m also fully aware that I’ve spent north of $2,000 for this set up, including the Laylas, and I’m stuck here using what’s 100% reliable… the iPhone dongle.. using the 3.5mm cable.
> 
> ...


Would suggest to RMA it , i guess the RU6 is malfunctioning 

Contact the retailer they can help since it will be under warranty 😁


----------



## oldkid

DBaldock9 said:


> No, the tubes are soldered to the circuit board.
> I believe that the TAP-1S is using the same New Old Stock Raytheon JAN5784WB (VHF Radio Tube) tubes as the current Little Bear B4-X - probably since the availability of the JAN5899 (UHF Radio Tube), used in the first version of the B4-X, has been depleted.  And, I don't think there are any direct cross reference replacement tubes available.


Ok, too bad for tube rolling. I suppose it is not really feasible to have swappable tubes in a "portable" design. 
I suppose it is a class A amp? 

My listening tests are showing that the RU6 really prefers class A amplification. Class D amps seem to kill its imaging and soundstage, even though I really don't know how to explain this strange phenomenon.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

Goofyboy84 said:


> I have the Cayin interconnect. I have literally everything Cayin or Apple. I have issues hearing, so the Cayin works with the phone alone… to a certain point. It cuts out. It does a bit better if the phone is charging at the same time, but alas… it still cuts out.
> 
> And I know it’s not some $25 dongle. I’m fully aware of that. I’m also fully aware that I’ve spent north of $2,000 for this set up, including the Laylas, and I’m stuck here using what’s 100% reliable… the iPhone dongle.. using the 3.5mm cable.
> 
> ...


Welcome to my world.  same thing here.


----------



## DBaldock9

oldkid said:


> Ok, too bad for tube rolling. I suppose it is not really feasible to have swappable tubes in a "portable" design.
> I suppose it is a class A amp?
> 
> My listening tests are showing that the RU6 really prefers class A amplification. Class D amps seem to kill its imaging and soundstage, even though I really don't know how to explain this strange phenomenon.



I suspect that overall, the TAP-1S probably runs in class A/B, since it doesn't get very warm, even when it's running in desktop mode for hours.
.
So far, I've used my RU6, connected to these Balanced Amps, and I think they all sound good with my earbuds & earphones:
1.) Kaei TAP-1S (Tube Hybrid, Portable / Desktop)
2.) Loxjie P20 (Tube Hybrid, Desktop, 2x Reflektor 6N3P-DR Tubes (1980 NOS) ; 4x Dual OPA627AU Mono Op-Amps on DIP-8 headers)
3.) iBasso PB2 (Solid State, Portable / Desktop, 2x Sparkos SS3602 Discrete Op-Amps ; 4x BUF634P Mono Buffer w/Class A Bias Resistor)
4.) S.M.S.L. sAp-9 (Solid State, Desktop - at work)


----------



## dakchi

Is it normal that after 30 hours of burn-in, RU6 starts to become too bright. The highs are too harsh. I thought that R2R DACs provide sweet warm sound without edging highs. Anyone experienced this?


----------



## oldkid

DBaldock9 said:


> I suspect that overall, the TAP-1S probably runs in class A/B, since it doesn't get very warm, even when it's running in desktop mode for hours.
> .
> So far, I've used my RU6, connected to these Balanced Amps, and I think they all sound good with my earbuds & earphones:
> 1.) Kaei TAP-1S (Tube Hybrid, Portable / Desktop)
> ...


Thanks, I wasn't aware of the existence of the Loxjie P20. I could get that if I end up wanting something cleaner sounding than my unbalanced xDuoo MT-601.
I'm using the same Reflector tube as you by the way


----------



## oldkid

dakchi said:


> Is it normal that after 30 hours of burn-in, RU6 starts to become too bright. The highs are too harsh. I thought that R2R DACs provide sweet warm sound without edging highs. Anyone experienced this?


I have listened to mine for many hours, it was never too bright. What headphones are you using?


----------



## dakchi

oldkid said:


> I have listened to mine for many hours, it was never too bright. What headphones are you using?


IMR Semper. I've used it with many DAPs and dongles. It has never been bright


----------



## DBaldock9

oldkid said:


> Thanks, I wasn't aware of the existence of the Loxjie P20. I could get that if I end up wanting something cleaner sounding than my unbalanced xDuoo MT-601.
> I'm using the same Reflector tube as you by the way



If you check out the Loxjie P20 thread here on Head-Fi, you'll find photos of the various mods I've done to mine.
One simple mod, that makes a big difference, is adding Gold Pin Bakelite Tube Socket extensions, to lift the tubes up out of the case - so it runs much cooler.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KOTBMMM/

Due to having several DACs & Amps with various different types of Balanced connectors, I'm building a switch box, and adapter cables, that use a common 5-Pin XLR intermediate connector.  The adapter cables will allow me to patch everything together more easily.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

dakchi said:


> Is it normal that after 30 hours of burn-in, RU6 starts to become too bright. The highs are too harsh. I thought that R2R DACs provide sweet warm sound without edging highs. Anyone experienced this?


Nope.  Highs are nearly perfect which along its natural sound is what makes the RU6 and the RS6 so appealing to me.


----------



## TYATYA

If you use dsp or eq then try with those set to off. 
I found it with uapp. 
When it happen, I confirm it happen also to other dac, means ru6 not cause bright sound.


----------



## 3Putter

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Most of the best DAPs come from China.


I know, don't own a DAP. Yet. Trying to keep it 'Merica...Difficult


----------



## ssriram2791

3Putter said:


> I know, don't own a DAP. Yet. Trying to keep it 'Merica...Difficult


Not sure which company makes dongles or DAPs in US (I would be interested to know as well). 

I do know few companies that make IEMs - 64 Audio/Empire Ears well regarded, if something "Made in America" you would like to try and support a business here.


----------



## frestoinc

Is there a "optimal" setup for Hiby music player running on Android 11 with the RU6 other than what was posted on the first page? I'm getting some random cutoff when listening while using other apps. Maybe something to do with the USB bandwidth?


----------



## justanut

3Putter said:


> I know, don't own a DAP. Yet. Trying to keep it 'Merica...Difficult


Music has no national boundaries bro


----------



## dakchi

ssriram2791 said:


> Not sure which company makes dongles or DAPs in US (I would be interested to know as well).
> 
> I do know few companies that make IEMs - 64 Audio/Empire Ears well regarded, if something "Made in America" you would like to try and support a business here.


I think that Audioquest Dragonfly is made in US


----------



## 3Putter

dakchi said:


> I think that Audioquest Dragonfly is made in US


They are but I've read enough on them I'm not convinced it's what I want. I have the Black 1.5v and it sounds good but I'm looking for great. I don't know of any DAP's from an American company. Sony is Japanese. I'm not even sure I'd get that much better sound quality from a DAP than I would from my iPhone to my streamer's DAC. I have Periodic Audio IEM's, which I love. I'm about to purchase a set from Campfire Audio next. Empire Ears is outside my budget but the longer I wait the more impatient I become to buy something. I have a pair of old Grado headphones that sound good but again, not great. Doing my best to keep buying American but this hobby makes it hard.


----------



## oldkid

3Putter said:


> They are but I've read enough on them I'm not convinced it's what I want. I have the Black 1.5v and it sounds good but I'm looking for great. I don't know of any DAP's from an American company. Sony is Japanese. I'm not even sure I'd get that much better sound quality from a DAP than I would from my iPhone to my streamer's DAC. I have Periodic Audio IEM's, which I love. I'm about to purchase a set from Campfire Audio next. Empire Ears is outside my budget but the longer I wait the more impatient I become to buy something. I have a pair of old Grado headphones that sound good but again, not great. Doing my best to keep buying American but this hobby makes it hard.


The dongle DAC form factor is much more appealing in my opinion. You're always going to carry your phone anyway, so it makes more sense.

The only benefit a DAP would have is better driving power and better battery life. 

Driving power is not a issue as I only use IEMs when I'm out and about, never full sized headphones.

Battery life is manageable too


----------



## Hyde00 (Jan 31, 2022)

3Putter said:


> They are but I've read enough on them I'm not convinced it's what I want. I have the Black 1.5v and it sounds good but I'm looking for great. I don't know of any DAP's from an American company. Sony is Japanese. I'm not even sure I'd get that much better sound quality from a DAP than I would from my iPhone to my streamer's DAC. I have Periodic Audio IEM's, which I love. I'm about to purchase a set from Campfire Audio next. Empire Ears is outside my budget but the longer I wait the more impatient I become to buy something. I have a pair of old Grado headphones that sound good but again, not great. Doing my best to keep buying American but this hobby makes it hard.


Uhhhh this is a complicated question.

For example Toyota/Honda while being Japanese company have a lot of US plants, so most Toyota/Honda cars sold here are made in US/Canada.  So does that make it an American/Canadian car or is it still Japanese car?

Now we step back a little bit, how "American made" are you thinking?

Sony is Japanese company but they have a lot of branches in America though maybe most things are still made in China / Japan (depending on level of product).  Though as others have said most good DAPs these days are made in China, possibly even the American brands too.

If you want American brand + American made it is pretty rare these days.  Maybe just Schiit / AudioQuest / Grado but they don't make DAPs.

Then again as I said I'm not too familiar with DAPs so correct me if I'm wrong, but is there actually any American companies that make DAPs?  Maybe iPad....??? Does that even count?  But Apple products is known to be "Designed in California and assembled in China" lol.

That being said, the tour videos are pretty cool though:


----------



## 3Putter

Hyde00 said:


> Uhhhh this is a complicated question.
> 
> For example Toyota/Honda while being Japanese company have a lot of US plants, so most Toyota/Honda cars sold here are made in US/Canada.  So does that make it an American/Canadian car or is it still Japanese car?
> 
> ...



I’m with you all wanting a dongle. Would like to go Audioquest. Was told the best dongles are Chinese, too. No DAP made here that I know of. I’d be fine with a Toyota dongle made here in the USA. I run my AQ black through my JDS Labs amp. May just purchase their DAC or a Schiit set up.


----------



## ssriram2791

3Putter said:


> I’m with you all wanting a dongle. Would like to go Audioquest. Was told the best dongles are Chinese, too. No DAP made here that I know of. I’d be fine with a Toyota dongle made here in the USA. I run my AQ black through my JDS Labs amp. May just purchase their DAC or a Schiit set up.


I hope you find the product that suits your music tastes made within USA. Also, I hope we dont want to go off topic further in this RU6 thread. If you any specific questions about this dongle, please feel to free ask. I am sure most of us would prefer to keep political discourse if any out of these threads. Much appreciated !


----------



## 3Putter

Departing now.


----------



## justanut

Just 30hrs into burning in the RU6... This is going to be such a LONG week... I probably won't be able to hold off listening to it once it hit 100hrs


----------



## kadinh

justanut said:


> Just 30hrs into burning in the RU6... This is going to be such a LONG week... I probably won't be able to hold off listening to it once it hit 100hrs


then dont  "burn it in" by listening to it and see how much it changes


----------



## Hyde00

3Putter said:


> Departing now.


Ops one last thing, as others have said since this is a RU6 thread so I'll keep it short to not derail it too much.

https://andyaudiovault.com/donglemadness/

According to Andy's personal rank (again, his preference, so your preference might be different).

He rank Centrance Dac Port HD #1, and RU6 #2.

If I recall correctly Centrance is American company, not sure where it's made.  But might be worth checking it out.

According to Andy I think even though he rank them #1 and #2 but both should be close enough that you can't really go wrong with either.

Good luck!


----------



## oldkid

Hyde00 said:


> Ops one last thing, as others have said since this is a RU6 thread so I'll keep it short to not derail it too much.
> 
> https://andyaudiovault.com/donglemadness/
> 
> ...


Every ranking is subjective, but Creative SXFI Amp is ranked higher than Hidizs S9 🤯


----------



## blotmouse

Hyde00 said:


> Ops one last thing, as others have said since this is a RU6 thread so I'll keep it short to not derail it too much.
> 
> https://andyaudiovault.com/donglemadness/
> 
> ...


Also, pretty sure you can't use that Centrance on a phone. Power req is too high. Or if you could hack it, enjoy your 2 hours of use, lol.


----------



## OspreyAndy

blotmouse said:


> Also, pretty sure you can't use that Centrance on a phone. Power req is too high. Or if you could hack it, enjoy your 2 hours of use, lol.


On the contrary, I use CEntrance DACport HD as my primary portable dongle. Yes it will drain my 4000 mAH phone within 5 hours as opposed to RU6 draining it in 6-7 hours, but to assume that DACport HD require hacking to run portably is not true. Any USB 2.0 that comes after Android 7 and above will run it fine. Even better with the use of USB Exclusive mode through HiBy Music Player or UAPP - which will then bypass Android SRC and allowing any dongles to perform on equal terms as if they are attached to a Windows PC. Read my full review on it. I have tested it extensively in every possible way. 3.5 hours is what I get from a 2700 mAH Sony Phone. But most phones nowadays come in at least 4000 mAH configuration


----------



## OspreyAndy

oldkid said:


> Every ranking is subjective, but Creative SXFI Amp is ranked higher than Hidizs S9 🤯


Because Creative SXFi deserves it, with all the tests and real life usage all considered, SXFi deliver the performances exceeding its price. It has great fidelity as it does with power. It is more musical than S9 Pro while keeping highly technical when subjected to no less than 6 different type of pairing from 600 Ohm DT880 to a magnetic planar and all the way to the most sensitive hybrid IEMs I have, not forgetting how seamless it worked with my Shure KSE1500 Electrostatic unit. All things considered, it may not be the hype, nor the price point to suggest it is a great unit, the fact is, it is an amazing dongle


----------



## noahherzog

Hello. I am new to this forum so please forgive me if I am posting incorrectly. I have just bought the RU6 and burned it in for 100 plus hours. It is remarkably good when coming out of my Mac with the included USB-C cable but when plugged into my iPhone 12 pro with the Cayin Lightning to USB I hear distortion. It sounds like overdrive or too hot a level when recording. Has anyone else experienced anything like this? I updated the iPhone in case there was a software issue with the external DAC, but I still hear distortion. Thanks very much, Noah


----------



## blotmouse (Jan 31, 2022)

OspreyAndy said:


> On the contrary, I use CEntrance DACport HD as my primary portable dongle. Yes it will drain my 4000 mAH phone within 5 hours as opposed to RU6 draining it in 6-7 hours, but to assume that DACport HD require hacking to run portably is not true. Any USB 2.0 that comes after Android 7 and above will run it fine. Even better with the use of USB Exclusive mode through HiBy Music Player or UAPP - which will then bypass Android SRC and allowing any dongles to perform on equal terms as if they are attached to a Windows PC. Read my full review on it. I have tested it extensively in every possible way. 3.5 hours is what I get from a 2700 mAH Sony Phone. But most phones nowadays come in at least 4000 mAH configuration


Thanks for the correction. I use iPhone's exclusively due to work, so since PAW S1 has power draw issues and barely works on iPhone, I could only assume this would further the initial draw issue? I should have been clear as I was only really talking iPhone from my myopic view of things. Cheers for the work you do, man.


----------



## OspreyAndy

blotmouse said:


> Thanks for the correction. I use iPhone's exclusively due to work, so since PAW S1 has power draw issues and barely works on iPhone, I could only assume this would further the initial draw issue?


No worries. iPhones will never work with power intensive dongles. Ovidius B1, A&K PEE51, Apogee Groove and even E1DA 9038SG3 will not work with 90% of iPhones. The limit of iPhone USB power just not cutting it. Before you can even begin to establish link, iPhones will likely issue a warning that the connected device attempting to draw to much power. And since then I have jump over to full Android camp, sold off my iPhone 7 and 8 in favor of Samsung S20, Sony Xperia X Compact and now LG V50. All of which proved capable host for those power hungry dongles


----------



## dakchi

I found the reason why I had sound cuts randomly when listening to music with my RU6 over Macbook Pro: it is weird but when I browse internet with Chrome, I have these cuts. As soon as I close Chrome windows, I don't have them. I don't understand why. Is Chrome interfering with RU6? can someone listen to RU with Macbook while browsing in Chrome and confirm he has sound cuts?


----------



## oldkid

OspreyAndy said:


> Because Creative SXFi deserves it, with all the tests and real life usage all considered, SXFi deliver the performances exceeding its price. It has great fidelity as it does with power. It is more musical than S9 Pro while keeping highly technical when subjected to no less than 6 different type of pairing from 600 Ohm DT880 to a magnetic planar and all the way to the most sensitive hybrid IEMs I have, not forgetting how seamless it worked with my Shure KSE1500 Electrostatic unit. All things considered, it may not be the hype, nor the price point to suggest it is a great unit, the fact is, it is an amazing dongle


I have both dongles and I desagree, but that's fine. My requirements are my own and I always judge equipment on the highest quality recordings they are able to handle. The SXFI sound signature is nice and spacious, but the sheer power and amplitude of sound the S9 is able to reproduce when feed with DSD 512 is just jaw dropping. Because of that, the AKM version is superior to the ESS based S9 Pro in my opinion.

Let's stop there with the off topic discussion. I'm sure we'll have plenty of opportunities to talk about dongle DACs on other threads


----------



## justanut

OspreyAndy said:


> No worries. iPhones will never work with power intensive dongles. Ovidius B1, A&K PEE51, Apogee Groove and even E1DA 9038SG3 will not work with 90% of iPhones. The limit of iPhone USB power just not cutting it. Before you can even begin to establish link, iPhones will likely issue a warning that the connected device attempting to draw to much power. And since then I have jump over to full Android camp, sold off my iPhone 7 and 8 in favor of Samsung S20, Sony Xperia X Compact and now LG V50. All of which proved capable host for those power hungry dongles


The RU6 is running off my iPhone 13 Pro Max -> Camera Connector -> RU6 -> HD800S with Volume at 80, no cut outs, no warnings.


----------



## rarewolf

justanut said:


> The RU6 is running off my iPhone 13 Pro Max -> Camera Connector -> RU6 -> HD800S with Volume at 80, no cut outs, no warnings.



Personally I doubt OspreyAndy’s “90%” evaluation of iPhone’s power. My RU6 worked fine with my iPhone Xs, as well. It’s difficult to believe the iPhone doesn’t supply enough power when I never saw a warning, and raising the volume above 60 (HG) hurts… and I’m talking about a set headcans, not IEMs. 

It isn’t that I don’t believe those who are complaining. It’s definitely a “YMMV” for many users, and depends on the load you’re asking the dongle to carry. I just don’t believe it affects most iPhone owners… #jussayin


----------



## justanut

rarewolf said:


> Personally I doubt OspreyAndy’s “90%” evaluation of iPhone’s power. My RU6 worked fine with my iPhone Xs, as well. It’s difficult to believe the iPhone doesn’t supply enough power when I never saw a warning, and raising the volume above 60 (HG) hurts… and I’m talking about a set headcans, not IEMs.
> 
> It isn’t that I don’t believe those who are complaining. It’s definitely a “YMMV” for many users, and depends on the load you’re asking the dongle to carry. I just don’t believe it affects most iPhone owners… #jussayin


I've never had an issue with the L&P W2 previously either. On the go, it's almost always with IEMs, kind of difficult to draw too much power. I only tried the 800S on a lark, and was pleasantly surprised it actually managed to be driven to loud volumes, sounding full and not lacking any power.

Anyway, I'm not planning to use it with the iPhone. Will only be using it with the MacBook Pro or the iPad when I'm working / reading where it isn't convenient to be using the 300Max.

That said, approaching 40hr burn-in! Eagerly awaiting 100hrs~ I hope I can hear a difference from the Sigma Delta DAPs!


----------



## OspreyAndy

rarewolf said:


> Personally I doubt OspreyAndy’s “90%” evaluation of iPhone’s power. My RU6 worked fine with my iPhone Xs, as well. It’s difficult to believe the iPhone doesn’t supply enough power when I never saw a warning, and raising the volume above 60 (HG) hurts… and I’m talking about a set headcans, not IEMs.
> 
> It isn’t that I don’t believe those who are complaining. It’s definitely a “YMMV” for many users, and depends on the load you’re asking the dongle to carry. I just don’t believe it affects most iPhone owners… #jussayin


I never said RU6 has issues running on iPhones. Check again my statement, I specifically mentioned CEntrance DACport HD, Apogee Groove, Ovidius B1, A&K PEE51 and E1DA 9038SG3 which failed to run on two of my iPhone 8 and one iPhone 7, not once did I ever mention anywhere RU6 has issues with iPhones. Extensively tested, not merely speculating. I don't speculate and assume, I only say what I tested.


----------



## rarewolf

OspreyAndy said:


> I never said RU6 has issues running on iPhones. Check again my statement, I specifically mentioned CEntrance DACport HD, Apogee Groove, Ovidius B1, A&K PEE51 and E1DA 9038SG3 which failed to run on two of my iPhone 8 and one iPhone 7, not once did I ever mention anywhere RU6 has issues with iPhones. Extensively tested, not merely speculating. I don't speculate and assume, I only say what I tested.



My apologies. I simply assumed as much because the RU6 is the subject of this forum topic, and because you never excluded it…


----------



## OspreyAndy

rarewolf said:


> My apologies. I simply assumed as much because the RU6 is the subject of this forum topic, and because you never excluded it…


No worries. Lets get back to RU6 shall we? No more discussions on non RU6 stuffs. My apologies as well


----------



## yaps66

Still loving my RU6 and still my go-to on-the-go device.  Would be interesting to see how the RU6 compares to the new Mojo2 sound wise.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

yaps66 said:


> Still loving my RU6 and still my go-to on-the-go device.  Would be interesting to see how the RU6 compares to the new Mojo2 sound wise.


Mojo 2 is definitely going to be better. I had both the Mojo 1 and the RU6, Mojo was better than the RU6.


----------



## oldkid

Johnfg465vd said:


> Mojo 2 is definitely going to be better. I had both the Mojo 1 and the RU6, Mojo was better than the RU6.


For more than twice the price and a less pocketable design, it should be expected. But I have yet to listen to one of these FGPA DACs. I'm not convinced that they can sound better than R2R DACs


----------



## Johnfg465vd

oldkid said:


> For more than twice the price and a less pocketable design, it should be expected. But I have yet to listen to one of these FGPA DACs. I'm not convinced that they can sound better than R2R DACs


Then it might be a good time to try. with the release of Mojo 2, used Mojo's should pop up.

You are right about the size though, much better pocketability.


----------



## kadinh

oldkid said:


> For more than twice the price and a less pocketable design, it should be expected. But I have yet to listen to one of these FGPA DACs. I'm not convinced that they can sound better than R2R DACs


I'm between options for mobile/take-to&from-work

RU6 vs L&P W2 vs Lotoo PAW S2 vs Go Blu vs UTWS5 2-pin


----------



## alota

kadinh said:


> I'm between options for mobile/take-to&from-work
> 
> RU6 vs L&P W2 vs Lotoo PAW S2 vs Go Blu vs UTWS5 2-pin


between ru6 and fiio, ru6 without any doubt. a friend of mine had lotoo s2 sold for ru6


----------



## 1nilla

kadinh said:


> I'm between options for mobile/take-to&from-work
> 
> RU6 vs L&P W2 vs Lotoo PAW S2 vs Go Blu vs UTWS5 2-pin


I've just ordered RU6 and own W2. And I owned Go blu before. Compared to other bluetooth dac like es100 and qudelix 5k, I think Go blu is clearly winner in terms of sound quality but it has lot of noise when using low impedance iem. So beware of it. And W2 sounds a lot better than Go blu without any issue. I only hope it has a bit more depth and 3d imaging. Well, that's why I want to try RU6.


----------



## speCD

1nilla said:


> I've just ordered RU6 and own W2. And I owned Go blu before. Compared to other bluetooth dac like es100 and qudelix 5k, I think Go blu is clearly winner in terms of sound quality but it has lot of noise when using low impedance iem. So beware of it. And W2 sounds a lot better than Go blu without any issue. I only hope it has a bit more depth and 3d imaging. Well, that's why I want to try RU6.


Will RU6 has more depth? It seems RU6 is more mid-forward.


----------



## oldkid

speCD said:


> Will RU6 has more depth? It seems RU6 is more mid-forward.


RU6 soundstage is average. But imaging is one of the best of any dongle DACs I have tried so far. When I pair it with my class A hybrid tube amp, soundstage and imaging are greatly improved. In that configuration, it performs like a full sized DAC


----------



## TYATYA

I just have facing EMI interference matter. 
Condition for it to happen: 
Weak coverage zone AND cayin stock C to C cable in use. 
Fly  mode and a long C to C from samsung proves that. 

-> it is better to use long cable (>0. 8m) than the one supplied with ru6.


----------



## AlfeedE

It at lest has sound to me like an amazing piece of gadget. Unfortunately after an hour of listening with the Ru6 connected to an IPhone Pro really disturbing noise interferences start to show on my IEM (Vision Ears Phonix) and lots of contact noises/hissing. Any solution for this? Or do I just have to send the device back to Cayin?


----------



## AlfeedE

My RU6 gets really hot when connected to my IPhone Pro. Is this normal?


----------



## hoofman

AlfeedE said:


> My RU6 gets really hot when connected to my IPhone Pro. Is this normal?


Depends on what you mean by "really hot". Mine does get a little bit warm, almost like when I charge my phone with the wireless dock but no more than that.



AlfeedE said:


> It at lest has sound to me like an amazing piece of gadget. Unfortunately after an hour of listening with the Ru6 connected to an IPhone Pro really disturbing noise interferences start to show on my IEM (Vision Ears Phonix) and lots of contact noises/hissing. Any solution for this? Or do I just have to send the device back to Cayin?


This should not happen. Is your cable shielded?


----------



## TYATYA

AlfeedE said:


> My RU6 gets really hot when connected to my IPhone Pro. Is this normal?


As hot as a Chord mojo running, or a ss note20 recording video by its tele cam?
If you found it sometimes b/f 1st 100 hours then it's normal. 
Ru6 realy stable after that. 
Other fact as covering (have or not), environment temperature, load (your hp) need to be watch also. 

About EMI, do you check when your ip set to flight mode?
If it was EMI, it should end after get your ip in flight mode


----------



## AlfeedE

hoofman said:


> Depends on what you mean by "really hot". Mine does get a little bit warm, almost like when I charge my phone with the wireless dock but no more than that.
> 
> 
> This should not happen. Is your cable shielded?


It is the Original cable from Cayin


----------



## AlfeedE

TYATYA said:


> As hot as a Chord mojo running, or a ss note20 recording video by its tele cam?
> If you found it sometimes b/f 1st 100 hours then it's normal.
> Ru6 realy stable after that.
> Other fact as covering (have or not), environment temperature, load (your hp) need to be watch also.
> ...


Sorry, What is EMI?
My IPhone has to be in Flight Mode otherwise I get a distortion in My IEM?


----------



## hoofman

AlfeedE said:


> It is the Original cable from Cayin


Then it should be shielded.


AlfeedE said:


> Sorry, What is EMI?
> My IPhone has to be in Flight Mode otherwise I get a distortion in My IEM?


I think it was meant to be atest. If the distortion goes away when you activate Flight Mode then it's very to be EMI => https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_interference
Otherwise it could be some other problems.


----------



## AlfeedE

hoofman said:


> Then it should be shielded.
> 
> I think it was meant to be atest. If the distortion goes away when you activate Flight Mode then it's very to be EMI => https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_interference
> Otherwise it could be some other problems.


Thanx for your insights.


----------



## hoofman

AlfeedE said:


> Thanx for your insights.


I hope you fix that issue soon. That is definitely not normal.


----------



## yfei (Feb 3, 2022)

AlfeedE said:


> Ru6 connected to an IPhone Pro really disturbing noise interferences start to show on my IEM (Vision Ears Phonix)


Yes, normal.  Ru6's has EMI noise, but the issue is not as bad as Mojo.    And the issue does not always show up, when I traveled to different places the issue dissapeared.  (maybe due to differences of how busy is the wifi network?   4G/5G network ?  or air moisture level, or ... ?)
To solve this, either turn on ' flight mode ' of the phone, or try different USB cable.

One thing I don't understand is that: Ru6's EMI noise appear after ~2 mins of usage, for the initial 1~2 mins there is no EMI noise.


----------



## AlfeedE

Thank you very much. Cayin is kind enough to send me a replacement. If the issue continues I will try your suggestions.


----------



## justanut

OMGEEE..... RU6 + MEST II is one potent mix on this track!

https://tidal.com/browse/track/1745186


----------



## hollandstein

I just got this in and I love it, however I primarily use it to feed my power amp from my MacBook Pro via RCA. When doing so, should I max out the volume on the DAC?


----------



## oldkid

yfei said:


> Yes, normal.  Ru6's has EMI noise, but the issue is not as bad as Mojo.    And the issue does not always show up, when I traveled to different places the issue dissapeared.  (maybe due to differences of how busy is the wifi network?   4G/5G network ?  or air moisture level, or ... ?)
> To solve this, either turn on ' flight mode ' of the phone, or try different USB cable.
> 
> One thing I don't understand is that: Ru6's EMI noise appear after ~2 mins of usage, for the initial 1~2 mins there is no EMI noise.


I have that problem too. Even at home when using 4G/LTE. Flight mode is not an option as Qobuz/Tidal are my primary sources of music. 
I have replaced the stock USB cable with the one from my Hiby FC3. Hopefully, it has better shielding


----------



## AlfeedE

oldkid said:


> I have that problem too. Even at home when using 4G/LTE. Flight mode is not an option as Qobuz/Tidal are my primary sources of music.
> I have replaced the stock USB cable with the one from my Hiby FC3. Hopefully, it has better shielding


Tried the Ifi cable, no music! Seems to be incompatible


----------



## peterinvan

I am using my iPad Pro to RU6.  Supplied USB-C cable and/or iPad charging cable.  No interference at all.


----------



## oldkid

The cable from my FiiO Q3 seems to be the most efficient against EMI noise. I'm going to keep that one attached to the RU6 as I rarely use my FiiO Q3 as a DAC


----------



## TYATYA

oldkid said:


> I have that problem too. Even at home when using 4G/LTE. Flight mode is not an option as Qobuz/Tidal are my primary sources of music.
> I have replaced the stock USB cable with the one from my Hiby FC3. Hopefully, it has better shielding


After 3 months using I found the 1st EMI happened. Thought that not happen to me but the fact we just found it in certain conditions:
1. No music playing moment
2. Ru6 close to a phone
3. The phone in weak calling signal
4. In calling received/transmittion
5. No happen to daps

All above need take to account when talking about emi


----------



## TYATYA

Describe the sound by imagines. 

To you, which pic below is the sound of Ru6?
And which pic as the sound of your other dac/dap?

Just curiosity.


----------



## lfgoodsound

After 200 hours of playing, my RU6 sounds better, so just let it work for a while.


----------



## oldkid (Feb 5, 2022)

EMI noise is still not solved by new cables. I won't carry a long cable with me on public transportation. Maybe a shielded case for the DAC would solve the problem


----------



## TYATYA (Feb 5, 2022)

oldkid said:


> EMI noise is still not solve by new cables. I won't carry a long cable with me on public transportation. Maybe a shielded case for the DAC would solve the problem


It wont help.

Look at my test.

I still found it happen when I make a call ( a silence call)
But when I do the same with my dap: a dap feeding ru6 when my phone close to both -> nothing happen.
Conclude: emi does not happen to dap. It happen to phone under connection.






I roughly estimate in cities emi will not a big problem. 
Even if short cable of ru6 and nothing covering for anti emi, even stop playing music, even do a call to check, I found noise (means not pitchblack back ground) very very low level during call and 2 second before and after the call emi happen only, very low. 

Moving around city may not problem with emi also. 

For country side people, emi will be more clearly


----------



## majo123

Hi all, just picked one of these up a few days ago. Im pretty much out of the hobby and only pop in now and again, don't post very much anymore either but the ru6 was such a standout product for me I felt I needed too.
Absolutely loving the sound with the grado 325x and hemp, very smooth very natural without losing any detail to my ears, great layering staging and instrument placement everything just seems correct and not forced.  I have had a few standout products over the years which for me at the time really stood out and were imo and for my tastes class leading, 2 that stick to mind were Mojo and opus1 dap both very natural and resolving and I would put this up there although others may disagree (we all have our likes and dislikes and would be a boring world if we didn't) 
Anyway awesome job cayin! This is a keeper for sure! 
Can't wait to see where you go with this tech in the future.


----------



## rarewolf

TYATYA said:


> It wont help.
> 
> Look at my test.
> 
> ...



How do you know it’s EMI, and not coming from the voltage supplying the DAC via your phone? What kind of phone is it?


----------



## TYATYA

rarewolf said:


> How do you know it’s EMI, and not coming from the voltage supplying the DAC via your phone? What kind of phone is it?


I don’t think any thing relate to voltage unless plugged in to wall charger. 
Anything heard when on/off flightmode and/or doing a call ofcouse radio interference - emi. 
The only thing isn't clear: what part cause the noise?
As i did not found the noise when feeding by dap, while ru6 and cable close to a calling phone, it mostly emi generated by the phone, goes via cable to ru6.


----------



## oldkid

TYATYA said:


> It wont help.
> 
> Look at my test.
> 
> ...


I live in Paris, France the western city with the highest density of population.
It's not related to weak cellular network signal. The RU6 has a shielding problem. None of my other DACs does that


----------



## TYATYA

oldkid said:


> I live in Paris, France the western city with the highest density of population.
> It's not related to weak cellular network signal. The RU6 has a shielding problem. None of my other DACs does that


Agree on this. 
My dacs also does not have EMI problem when use my phone as digital transport.


----------



## Hyde00

I remember someone was asking about this a while back, 90 degree angled lightning to usb c adaptor.

https://drop.com/buy/hyper-design-lightning-to-type-c-otg-adapter?mode=guest_open

Would this fit the bill?


----------



## Zachik

TYATYA said:


> Look at my test.


Looks like my potato side from last night's dinner... 1 hour 400F Air-Fry on the toaster oven - yummy!


----------



## Ritvik

Does anyone own the RU6 and the Cayin N6ii with the R01 module?

Cost/features/ergonomics etc. aside, would the R01 be a better option for someone with the N6ii?


----------



## alota

Ritvik said:


> Does anyone own the RU6 and the Cayin N6ii with the R01 module?
> 
> Cost/features/ergonomics etc. aside, would the R01 be a better option for someone with the N6ii?


I think exists a compairison in the review of @twister6


----------



## sebek

Maybe it has already been asked, but how does it compare to Lotoo Paw S1?

Is it a step forward worth € 150 more?


----------



## twister6

alota said:


> I think exists a compairison in the review of @twister6



Thanks!  Yes, @Ritvik, I had my take on it at the end of comparison section in RU6 review.  Of course, just a personal opinion.  Don't think it's a better option, just a different flavor which is more convenient for sure.


----------



## TYATYA (Feb 7, 2022)

My 800s sounds like this on its amp (hdvd800):





And it sounds like this when ru6 inserted to the path:




I love latter way.
I dont need to watch how sharp tiger whisker are, how constrast and dynamic of colors, how detail the hairs are...

Just feel of the realistic of a tiger picture.
Is that more "analog"? 
Is the upper one quite digital, artifact?


----------



## blotmouse

Ritvik said:


> Cost/features/ergonomics etc. aside, would the R01 be a better option for someone with the N6ii?


For the cost of just buying the r01 board, yes I’d do it in a heartbeat. 
My RU6 is nice to have around but it doesn’t get used hardly ever. 

Biggest thing to navigate is the tuning differences. R01 has better resolution, more clear, more layered, more powerful. But is brighter than ru6 and doesn't have the NOS option. 

Perspective: 
I don’t know anyone saying ru6 is better than M8 or sp2000. But quite a few like R01 better.


----------



## blotmouse

sebek said:


> Maybe it has already been asked, but how does it compare to Lotoo Paw S1?


Different league’s. 
Ru6 could cost $500 more than S1 and I’d believe it. 
I have s1 kicking around but it gets used less than the ru6. Actually never, lol. Its backup. 

My current sound quality list: 
Cayin n6ii Ti
Ar-M2
Ru6
DacportHD (somewhat new) 
S1
Cobalt


----------



## sebek

blotmouse said:


> Different league’s.
> Ru6 could cost $500 more than S1 and I’d believe it.
> I have s1 kicking around but it gets used less than the ru6. Actually never, lol. Its backup.
> 
> ...


Since you also mention the Dragonfly Cobalt, I will say that it is my favorite sound among the dacs / amps I have tried.

I liked it more than Chord Mojo, IFI Micro IDSD Black Label, Xduoo XD-05 Plus, FIIO BTR5.


----------



## alota

In my opinion a compairison between dap and dongle is nice but it is more logic to compare dongle with dongle


----------



## pkcpga

justanut said:


> I've never had an issue with the L&P W2 previously either. On the go, it's almost always with IEMs, kind of difficult to draw too much power. I only tried the 800S on a lark, and was pleasantly surprised it actually managed to be driven to loud volumes, sounding full and not lacking any power.
> 
> Anyway, I'm not planning to use it with the iPhone. Will only be using it with the MacBook Pro or the iPad when I'm working / reading where it isn't convenient to be using the 300Max.
> 
> That said, approaching 40hr burn-in! Eagerly awaiting 100hrs~ I hope I can hear a difference from the Sigma Delta DAPs!


How does the W2 compare to the RU6 connected to an iPhone/iPad?  Do you have any interference noise with the RU6?


----------



## peterinvan

pkcpga said:


> How does the W2 compare to the RU6 connected to an iPhone/iPad?  Do you have any interference noise with the RU6?


No interference with iPad Pro to RU6


----------



## justanut

pkcpga said:


> How does the W2 compare to the RU6 connected to an iPhone/iPad?  Do you have any interference noise with the RU6?


Both had interference with iPhone / with phone in close proximity.

I do not own the W2 any longer, but I sold it because my 300Max made it obsolete.

I intend to keep the RU6 because it is a different architecture and complements what I currently own.


----------



## rarewolf

pkcpga said:


> How does the W2 compare to the RU6 connected to an iPhone/iPad?  Do you have any interference noise with the RU6?



Using it with an iPhone Xs, I would get an occasional “blip” if I asked the phone to do something computational. I could never tie anything to EM interference—it was always coincident with the phone being busy…


----------



## Lacas

powersfineart said:


> I have never had it cut out, even during 3 hour listening sessions or longer through an iPhone 12 Pro to the RU6 to Etymotic EVO IEMs with a balanced SuperBaX cable from the 4.4mm jack. My volume level is usually around 36 to 39 with this setup.


Hi,
is the RU6 a good pairing with the EVO? Is it worth to get if I have a Chord Mojo? I was thinking maybe the R2R sound could smooth and make the sound of the BA drivers a bit more meaty in the EVO


----------



## Hyde00

OMG my RU6 finally arrived!!!

After 3.5 weeks wait coming from Israel!!!  LOL though still much appreciated to the head-fi member who sold it to me at good price and in pretty much brand new condition.  Only problem is that me being impatient so I end up buying PEE51 and M12 while waiting, so the money I saved from getting RU6 at a good price is out the window LOL.

In any case, some background story.  I've been trying to replace my Dragonfly Red for sooooooooooooooooo long and maybe 10-20 pieces later and I'm still searching.  But today I got the RU6, plugged it in and listen and I was like........ what......???  This is pretty much 90% the same sound signature wise.  Why is it that people crap on Dragonfly Red so much and praise RU6 so much.  This is the first dongle that I got that it just felt right at home.  Granted it's recommended to burn in for 100 hours and I think the person who sold it to me said he only did 20-30 hours so I still have a long way to go.  But first impression is GOOD.  This might potentially be the first item that I bought in a long time that can overtake Dragonfly Red.  Previously the closest combo to Dragonfly Red sound is Modi Multibit + Vali 2+ with Telefunken Black Diamon E88CC tube (R2R + tube = yes a very colored sound).

And I went back and forth a few times but I THINK low gain might sound a little bit better.  Which is ironic because most dac/amp I tried generally speaking high gain always sounds better when volume matched.  This is the first instance where I feel like low gain sounds better.  And with my quick 5 min testing I find OS clean everything up bit is a little bit more bright sounding while NOS while looser sounding but is more bassy and "raw" sounding for lack of better word.  So right now I'm using NOS and low gain to drive my Denon D5200.

So as I mentioned I bought PEE51 and M12 while waiting.  I do think RU6 beats both of them at least for me.  But I want to give PEE51 an honorable mention where it's a bit uneven, some area I think does better than RU6 (detail retrieval, texture and sometimes the bass just come out of nowhere), other area where it's weaker (roll off on both end of spectrum, sometimes you wonder where the bass went).  RU6 is a bit more consistently good.  M12 to me is just netural and a bit boring...... and vocal not as forward.

In anycase, I only listened to it day 1, the member who sold it to me burn in for 20-30 hours.  So my impression will change as it goes.  But so far so good.  And I noticed "blip" at every 10th volume interval (i.e. 10, 20, 30, 40.....etc).  But it's documented on the first page so it's expected.  Though I still find it slightly annoying but oh well, can't have it all LOL.  Hopefully next version they can implement to allow switching of hardware volume or using OS to control hardware volume (basically the OS volume = 100% but OS volume actually controls hardware volume, a lot of dongle dac already does this).

Otherwise so far so good!


----------



## alota

Lacas said:


> Hi,
> is the RU6 a good pairing with the EVO? Is it worth to get if I have a Chord Mojo? I was thinking maybe the R2R sound could smooth and make the sound of the BA drivers a bit more meaty in the EVO


I had mojo some time ago. I sold mojo due to my stupidity because is a really good product. Mojo has internal battery but it is big compared to ru6. So for listening on the go ru6 is better. About the sound they are at same level wiith different signature. So i'm sorry but only you decide the best for your taste.


----------



## Hyde00

Oh something random, as I said I just got RU6 today and I'm using it as a desktop unit.  So I was thinking to leave the screen on all the time.

But it's OLED right?  So is it better to have it auto turn off so it doesn't kill its life or doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things?


----------



## romekbono

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Yes, I own both the Monarch OG and MKii.   The RU6 does a very good job at bringing the Monarch to life.   It has reference tuning which can sound boring to some.  The RU6 gives it more life.    I am listening to the Monarch OG now with RU6.    I still hear good sub bass rumble, but it is slightly attenuated relative to my DX300.    The difference is that the treble is better with the RU6 than say my DX300 with AMP12 so treble has more emphasis.    The gains in naturalness and liveliness of sound more than makes up for any small attenuation of subbass.    If you want more subbass, get an Empire Ears LX or EVO.


How is the combo RU6 with the LX ??

I have just bought the RU6 and was curious if the ru6 will drive properly my LX ?


----------



## Hyde00

Okay I've been listening music tonight, off the bat I find the resolution and soundstage is a bit lacking......????  Is it something burn in will solve?  Maybe it's too new?

Like everything sounds a bit blurry....... and very close in.  Should I be patient?


----------



## Ichos

The manufacturer suggested about 100-150 hours of burning before critical listening.


----------



## powersfineart

Lacas said:


> Hi,
> is the RU6 a good pairing with the EVO? Is it worth to get if I have a Chord Mojo? I was thinking maybe the R2R sound could smooth and make the sound of the BA drivers a bit more meaty in the EVO


I don’t have a Mojo so I cant comment on that. I can say, however, that I personally am enjoying the EVO with the RU6 a lot. You are correct that the EVO comes across a bit meatier in combination with the RU6. I’m addicted to the sound signature of the two together. YMMV.


----------



## yfei (Feb 10, 2022)

Lacas said:


> Hi,
> is the RU6 a good pairing with the EVO? Is it worth to get if I have a Chord Mojo? I was thinking maybe the R2R sound could smooth and make the sound of the BA drivers a bit more meaty in the EVO



I have both Mojo and RU6.  They sound different, to me it's hard to say which is better.    I think that applies to all DACs: they all sound different, but I am not sure which one is absolutely better than which one.

My impression:     Mojo is my 'sleeping' gear, it is smooth and forgiving, I can listen to it at night in the bed and fall to sleep nicely.  it has some colorization, and fun to listen to.   I feel that Mojo is still 'DS' sounding, RU6 is more R2R sounding:  more correct, no artifacts, denser mids and bass.   I don't feel RU6 'smoother', it's high is simple, raw, correct, no special treatment, so I like it very much,  but I won't decribe it as 'smooth'.
Compared to good DS DACs,  RU6 may have less details, and can be a little 'congested' when playing very complex music.  I guess due to accuracy of the resistors it used. This is not a inherient issue of R2R, higher-end R2R DACs like YGGY wins DS DACs on every aspect.


----------



## Hyde00

yfei said:


> I have both Mojo and RU6.  They sound different, to me it's hard to say which is better.    I think that applies to all DACs: they all sound different, but I am not sure which one is absolutely better than which one.
> 
> My impression:     Mojo is my 'sleeping' gear, it is smooth and forgiving, I can listen to it at night in the bed and fall to sleep nicely.  it has some colorization, and fun to listen to.   I feel that Mojo is still 'DS' sounding, RU6 is more R2R sounding:  more correct, no artifacts, denser mids and bass.   I don't feel RU6 'smoother', it's high is simple, raw, correct, no special treatment, so I like it very much,  but I won't decribe it as 'smooth'.
> Compared to good DS DACs,  RU6 may have less details, and can be a little 'congested' when playing very complex music.  I guess due to accuracy of the resistors it used. This is not a inherient issue of R2R, higher-end R2R DACs like YGGY wins DS DACs on every aspect.


Thank you for the impression, this really helps!

I too was on the fence if I should get RU6 or Mojo.  I end up getting RU6 but often wonder if I should've went for Mojo instead.  But I'll be using on my desktop and I don't want to deal with Mojo battery dying when always plugged in / always charged.  I also don't want to buy Mojo 2 (too expensive) even though it has a solution now for the battery issue.

I think based from your description RU6 probably is more for me.  I tend to not like when something is too smooth / relaxing because I want my music vivid and energetic and exciting LOL.


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 11, 2022)

On a side note, I've always read that in windows we should set to either 16 bit or 24 bit with 44.1 khz because CD is typically mastered at 16 bit and 44.1 khz.  So I've been doing that for a while.

But I realize with RU6 with NOS on 24 bit 44.1 khz the resolution sounded really low (somehow not noticeable with other dongle dac).  I was scratching my head for a while.  Out of curiosity I tried 24 bit and 384 khz in windows setting and it improved a lot.

Is that the correct setting we're suppose to use?  Also to my understanding that RU6 is a 24 bit native dac so I use 24 bit, and OS (oversample) setting up sample it to 384 khz, NOS (no oversample) uses native resolution (whatever windows feed it).

So if I use windows 384 khz with NOS setting does that mean windows is doing the upres then feed 384 khz to RU6 then RU6 don't touch that number (NOS)?

And if I use OS in RU6 it just take whatever I feed it (depending on my windows setting) and upres to 384 khz?

A little bit confusing but so far I find I have best result set windows to 24 bit and 384 khz and do NOS on RU6.  What's everyone's experience?

LOL to clarify I just run off Spotify Premium since I'm lazy and not using any fancy software on it.


----------



## Bitsir

Please someone knowledgable answer - Can I use the 4.4mm output on the Cayin Ru6 straight into the iFi Zen Can 4.4mm Pentaconn input without damage?

I am asking because I read somewhere that the balanced output on Cayin Ru6 isn't a true balanced circuitry... So will that end in disaster or what? I think it will right?


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 11, 2022)

Bitsir said:


> Please someone knowledgable answer - Can I use the 4.4mm output on the Cayin Ru6 straight into the iFi Zen Can 4.4mm Pentaconn input without damage?
> 
> I am asking because I read somewhere that the balanced output on Cayin Ru6 isn't a true balanced circuitry... So will that end in disaster or what? I think it will right?


I think someone else might have better answer than me so don't quote me on it.

The only thing I'd worry about is double amping, because RU6 doesn't have dedicated line out so you're taking an already amped signal.  And I'm not too sure how high is the output from RU6.  I know some dongle you can just put 100% volume at 2 vrms and call it a day.

As for balanced, I think what they meant is that it was technically taking single ended signal and duplicate it for balanced output.  Where as true balanced output would be separate signal since the beginning all the way through the chain.  Where as RU6 it's basically single ended and only become balanced at the last step.

I think they explained somewhere in the thread (although yes it's 131 pages long now LOL so totally understandable).

But it's still technically a balanced signal so I don't think it would damage anything, you just might not get the same clarity / separation......etc vs a true balanced chain all the way through I THINK.  As I mentioned don't quote me on it but this is my understanding.

https://en.cayin.cn/products_info?itemid=140

If you look at the Functional Diagram part I think it's the part that says Unity Gain Amplifier that does the duplication I THINK.


----------



## Bitsir

Hyde00 said:


> I think someone else might have better answer than me so don't quote me on it.
> 
> The only thing I'd worry about is double amping, because RU6 doesn't have dedicated line out so you're taking an already amped signal.  And I'm not too sure how high is the output from RU6.  I know some dongle you can just put 100% volume at 2 vrms and call it a day.
> 
> ...


thanks for the quick answer, that does make sense. I mean as long as the signal is balanced in the last step, there shouldn't be a short of any kind. Otherwise a balanced 4.4mm cable for IEMs wouldn't work... I almost feel a bit silly for asking the question.


----------



## Hyde00

Bitsir said:


> thanks for the quick answer, that does make sense. I mean as long as the signal is balanced in the last step, there shouldn't be a short of any kind. Otherwise a balanced 4.4mm cable for IEMs wouldn't work... I almost feel a bit silly for asking the question.


It's ok I don't fully get the balanced signal thing either, that's why I say don't quote me on it LOL.

Though I remember reading a few people doing what you did in the thread.  Like taking the balanced out and plug it into another amplifier.  I just don't know what setting they used (high / low gain, what volume level.....etc).

Let's wait and see what they say lol.


----------



## TYATYA

Bitsir said:


> Please someone knowledgable answer - Can I use the 4.4mm output on the Cayin Ru6 straight into the iFi Zen Can 4.4mm Pentaconn input without damage?
> 
> I am asking because I read somewhere that the balanced output on Cayin Ru6 isn't a true balanced circuitry... So will that end in disaster or what? I think it will right?


I don’t think input device get any harmful as your idea.
You can solder all poles of a 4.4 male jack then put it on female 4.4 of input port.
Nothing happen.
But never do plug it to an oitput port.


----------



## rocketron

TYATYA said:


> I don’t think input device get any harmful as your idea.
> You can solder all poles of a 4.4 male jack then put it on female 4.4 of input port.
> Nothing happen.
> But never do plug it to an oitput port.


Yes I think it would be ok.
If your worried ask IFI.
They sell a 4.4 interconnect .
Ask on one of the IFI threads.


----------



## Andykong

Hyde00 said:


> On a side note, I've always read that in windows we should set to either 16 bit or 24 bit with 44.1 khz because CD is typically mastered at 16 bit and 44.1 khz.  So I've been doing that for a while.
> 
> But I realize with RU6 with NOS on 24 bit 44.1 khz the resolution sounded really low (somehow not noticeable with other dongle dac).  I was scratching my head for a while.  Out of curiosity I tried 24 bit and 384 khz in windows setting and it improved a lot.
> 
> ...



If you are using Spotify Premium from a Window PC, we need to confirm several questions before we move on.

Did you set the output to "Very High" quality setting?
Have you turn off Spotify's automatic volume normalization?
Did you turn the volume of your computer to maximum?
I assume you have done all these correctly, but I need to clear these simple questions as early as possible.

if I use OS in RU6 it just take whatever I feed it (depending on my windows setting) and upres to 384 khz?  Yes, that's correct.

if I use windows 384 khz with NOS setting does that mean windows is doing the upres then feed 384 khz to RU6 then RU6 don't touch that number (NOS)? Yes, that's correct too, but in fact, in regardless of your Windows setting is 44.1kHz or 384kHz, RU6 won't change the sampling frequency of the incoming bitstream.

I haven't tried Spotify on my desktop with RU6, but I have tried Spotify on my mobile phone to RU6 NOW, even with the Android SRC in place, it doesn't sound sd bad as you have described, so I guess something is not right.  

To verify the optimum setting with your PC, may I suggest you download several " original CD  16BIT/44kHz" music files from* 2L* and then playback with different PC settings?


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 11, 2022)

Andykong said:


> Did you set the output to "Very High" quality setting?
> Have you turn off Spotify's automatic volume normalization?
> Did you turn the volume of your computer to maximum?


1. Yupe I set to use highest setting regardless of my internet bandwith.
2. Yupe turned off volume normalization.
3. Yupe in Windows I run 100 volume.  Spotify also max volume.


Andykong said:


> if I use windows 384 khz with NOS setting does that mean windows is doing the upres then feed 384 khz to RU6 then RU6 don't touch that number (NOS)? Yes, that's correct too, but in fact, in regardless of your Windows setting is 44.1kHz or 384kHz, RU6 won't change the sampling frequency of the incoming bitstream.


Oh that I find a bit odd, because I'm running NOS but I did notice if I set Windows to 24 bit 44.1 khz then it sounded quite low quality vs NOS and Windows 24 bit at 384 khz then it sounded more detailed.

Which I thought is odd because as you said it should take source bit rate no matter what.  And I was previously using Dragonfly Red and even if Windows is set to 44.1 khz it still sounded good.

*EDIT:*  Actually I need to test this more..... will have to get back to you on this also.


Andykong said:


> To verify the optimum setting with your PC, may I suggest you download several " original CD 16BIT/44kHz" music files from* 2L* and then playback with different PC settings?


Okay I will give this a try a bit later and report back.  Since I'm technically still working now LOL don't want to take too much time away from work (work from home).

Will get back to you on this later, thanks!!!


----------



## alota

Hyde00 said:


> Thank you for the impression, this really helps!
> 
> I too was on the fence if I should get RU6 or Mojo.  I end up getting RU6 but often wonder if I should've went for Mojo instead.  But I'll be using on my desktop and I don't want to deal with Mojo battery dying when always plugged in / always charged.  I also don't want to buy Mojo 2 (too expensive) even though it has a solution now for the battery issue.
> 
> I think based from your description RU6 probably is more for me.  I tend to not like when something is too smooth / relaxing because I want my music vivid and energetic and exciting LOL.


Go to ru6 and possibly use uapp


----------



## Currawong

Bitsir said:


> Please someone knowledgable answer - Can I use the 4.4mm output on the Cayin Ru6 straight into the iFi Zen Can 4.4mm Pentaconn input without damage?
> 
> I am asking because I read somewhere that the balanced output on Cayin Ru6 isn't a true balanced circuitry... So will that end in disaster or what? I think it will right?


Yes, it's fine. The 4.4mm output is a proper, balanced output. 

The DAC itself is not balanced, but runs through an opamp acting as a phase splitter, creating the balanced output. What you were thinking of is some devices that might use a 4-pin XLR or 4.4mm output, but that is only connected to a single-ended circuit internally.  In those cases, you would connect the SE output of the device to the SE input of an amplifier.


----------



## kumar402

It’s fun to play with RU6 and HQPlayer


----------



## oldkid

kumar402 said:


> It’s fun to play with RU6 and HQPlayer


That's one way to do it. What I do is upsample everything to DSD 64 in Audirvana Studio. RU6 will convert that to 352.8khz PCM


----------



## keenears (Feb 12, 2022)

Hyde00 said:


> I remember someone was asking about this a while back, 90 degree angled lightning to usb c adaptor.
> 
> https://drop.com/buy/hyper-design-lightning-to-type-c-otg-adapter?mode=guest_open
> 
> Would this fit the bill?


DDHifi makes one like that, the tc28i. Works great: https://audio46.com/products/ddhifi-tc28i-lightning-to-typec-otg-adapter

Pairs well with their short straight, short angled, or long straight usb c cable tc05: https://audio46.com/products/dd-ddhifi-tc05-2021-type-c-to-type-c-usb-otg-cable

But some may just find their mfi06 to be better. https://audio46.com/products/dd-ddhifi-mfi06-lightning-to-typec-data-cable?variant=40606847762622

Note their cables are directional.


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 12, 2022)

I asked this a while back but no one said anything but,* is it bad to leave the RU6 screen on all the time* (as oppose to have it turn off after 10 seconds).

I plug into my PC so power is not an issue, more worried about burn in / wear out the screen since it's OLED it has fixed lifespan right?

Or it doesn't really matter I worry too much LOL.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Hyde00 said:


> I asked this a while back but no one said anything but,* is it bad to leave the RU6 screen on all the time* (as oppose to have it turn off after 10 seconds).
> 
> I plug into my PC so power is not an issue, more worried about burn in / wear out the screen since it's OLED it has fixed lifespan right?
> 
> Or it doesn't really matter I worry too much LOL.


It will wear out eventually like any oled display, so setting the RU6 to automatically turn off it's display is the smart thing to do.

My XD-05 screen got dim and stopped working after 1 and half year of use.


----------



## Hyde00

Johnfg465vd said:


> It will wear out eventually like any oled display, so setting the RU6 to automatically turn off it's display is the smart thing to do.
> 
> My XD-05 screen got dim and stopped working after 1 and half year of use.


lol ok good thing I set it back to turn off after 10 seconds then.


----------



## Brain Damage

Well, thanks to this thread, I've decided to purchase the RU6. It will be interesting to see how this compares to my LGV30, Dragonfly Black and Zorloo Ztella. 

If anyone has experience of these comparisons to the RU6, please share 👍. Can't wait 🎧.


----------



## alota

Brain Damage said:


> Well, thanks to this thread, I've decided to purchase the RU6. It will be interesting to see how this compares to my LGV30, Dragonfly Black and Zorloo Ztella.
> 
> If anyone has experience of these comparisons to the RU6, please share 👍. Can't wait 🎧.


Had lgv30 and have lg v50. Others dongles ibasso dc04 and 05. Only dc05 imho is near to level of ru6 but it is always the same history. Ds versus ladder. Sometimes i want detail of sabre but in the end i always prefere ru6
Of course lg solution is more pratical. Just the phone and the iem


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 13, 2022)

Brain Damage said:


> Well, thanks to this thread, I've decided to purchase the RU6. It will be interesting to see how this compares to my LGV30, Dragonfly Black and Zorloo Ztella.
> 
> If anyone has experience of these comparisons to the RU6, please share 👍. Can't wait 🎧.


I only got mine not too long ago so take my impression with grain of salt. The previous owner said it's probably at 20-30 hours and I might have put in maybe another 10-20 hours on top so I'm still far from the 100 hours recommend time, hopefully it improves.

Otherwise I have Dragonfly Red and used to own Zorloo Ztella.

Currently RU6 is the first dongle that ever get close to Dragonfly Red in terms of richness and vivid kind of sound. Though I'd say Dragonfly Red still pushed a bit further into the "vivid" direction where I think it's the closest to tube sound in solid state form (minus the holographic 3D thing that only tube can do). Some might argue Dragonfly Red did it in a way that it just sound like EQ and too "processed", but I personally think it sounds good. It has forward vocal and in general pronounced mids and mid bass. One of the more bassy dongles. Compare to Zorloo Ztella which has more typical ESS sound so it's a bit thin and bright, where as DFR and RU6 just has more everything.

I do think imaging wise RU6 is really good, also help it has a lot of realistic texture so it really captures every breath from the singer.

If anything that I'd say RU6 lose out (again I don't know if burn in solves this) right now is that layering and sound stage is pretty flat right now. At the moment DFR beats it in this category. Also doesn't help that I also have PEE51 at hand where it's really good with layering and sound stage.

Another area RU6 lose out now is that it doesn't extend as deep on sub bass compare to DFR (again, maybe burn in some more?). RU6 is definitely engaging and provide plenty of bass for music, but for watching movie trailers it just doesn't have the same "bwaaaaaaaa" as DFR.

And I've only demo Dragonfly Black for 5 min at the store before I bought Dragonfly Red, so my impression could be wrong. But I remember DFB being not as good at layering and soundstage compare to the Red but Black has more of that edgy attack which is good for rock.  But both Red and RU6 will be better at layering soundstage and more smooth (lose a bit of that sharpness with Black) while still maintain good attack.

Sorry it's getting too long so I'll wrap it up.  As it stands, for music I like DFR a little bit more (a bit more colored/vivid for my taste), for gaming I like RU6 more (imaging and detail is good, paints a realistic surrounding for me).  If after 100 hours all the flaws I pointed out improves, then at that point RU6 should overtake DFR as my daily driver.  As of now, not yet lol.

Will keep you guys updated!

*EDIT:*  Though if you like the AudioQuest "house sound" in DFB and you also own Zorlee Zetella, I'd almost say you should try DFR LOL.  Cobalt is more technical (better layering, sound stage....etc) than Red but it loses a bit of that musicality and go towards neutrality a bit.  So depending on your preference you could go that way too, but I went back to Red since I value musicality over technicality.


----------



## oldkid (Feb 13, 2022)

alota said:


> Had lgv30 and have lg v50. Others dongles ibasso dc04 and 05. Only dc05 imho is near to level of ru6 but it is always the same history. Ds versus ladder. Sometimes i want detail of sabre but in the end i always prefere ru6
> Of course lg solution is more pratical. Just the phone and the iem


Sometimes, I wonder why I just don't use my phone's internal DAC. It's capable of outputting 384khz 32bit audio via UAPP but the amp is just too weak, even for IEM listening.

RU6 is the best DAC/amp combo in the dongle DAC form factor that I know of. It's capable to drive all my headphones really well. 

Other dongles often have crappy amps and only come alive when plugged to a desktop amp


----------



## alota

oldkid said:


> Sometimes, I wonder why I just don't use my phone's internal DAC. It's capable of outputting 384khz 32bit audio via UAPP but the amp is just too weak, even for IEM listening.listening


Indeed. But when i went from lg phones i start to searching anothee solution because with my westone the power was low ( only good when phone was forced to high impedance mod). Now only with my solaris i'm satisfied with output of lg buf after tried the dongles honestly lg is in the last place. In other side the lg is too pratical outdoor. But for outdoor use i bought the bluetooth modules form Fiio


----------



## rarewolf

oldkid said:


> Sometimes, I wonder why I just don't use my phone's internal DAC. It's capable of outputting 384khz 32bit audio via UAPP but the amp is just too weak, even for IEM listening.
> 
> RU6 is the best DAC/amp combo in the dongle DAC form factor that I know of. It's capable to drive all my headphones really well.
> 
> Other dongles often have crappy amps and only come alive when plugged to a desktop amp



The L&P W2 offers a bit additional power over the RU6, not much more, but it is also in the “no slouch” group of dongle DACs, short of those that include their own battery…


----------



## lfgoodsound

rarewolf said:


> The L&P W2 offers a bit additional power over the RU6, not much more, but it is also in the “no slouch” group of dongle DACs, short of those that include their own battery…


what about the sound tho?does w2 have more dry and neutral sound than RU6?


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 14, 2022)

lfgoodsound said:


> what about the sound tho?does w2 have more dry and neutral sound than RU6?


I've been wondering the same, if anyone can answer this that would be amazing.

Like right now I have RU6 but I'm actually hoping it would be richer in the upper mids / low treble and wider sound stage LOL.  Or is that opposite direction of W2 / W2-131?  RU6 feels a bit congested at the moment in terms of sound stage.

Also now W2 and W2-131 is on sale at MusicTeck, so I wonder if it's worth it to try W2 or W2-131 or just keep burning in my RU6.

*EDIT:*  Tomorrow is last day of sale.  So I'm hoping to order tonight lol (if I do).


----------



## lfgoodsound

Hyde00 said:


> I've been wondering the same, if anyone can answer this that would be amazing.
> 
> Like right now I have RU6 but I'm actually hoping it would be richer in the upper mids / low treble and wider sound stage LOL.  Or is that opposite direction of W2 / W2-131?  RU6 feels a bit congested at the moment in terms of sound stage.
> 
> ...


if you'll manage to order,please leave a feedback, i need to know that info bro


----------



## H T T

Hyde00 said:


> I've been wondering the same, if anyone can answer this that would be amazing.
> 
> Like right now I have RU6 but I'm actually hoping it would be richer in the upper mids / low treble and wider sound stage LOL.  Or is that opposite direction of W2 / W2-131?  RU6 feels a bit congested at the moment in terms of sound stage.
> 
> ...



With the MusicTeck sale, I am considering the 131. Battery life/draw is a priority for me. That and the eye-catching Prussian blue casing.


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 14, 2022)

lfgoodsound said:


> if you'll manage to order,please leave a feedback, i need to know that info bro


lol ok will definitely let you know!


H T T said:


> With the MusicTeck sale, I am considering the 131. Battery life/draw is a priority for me. That and the eye-catching Prussian blue casing.


I'm actually using it as desktop unit LOL (I'm weird I know) so battery draw is not concern for me.

But I do like the glass back more (W2-131) than carbon fibre back (W2).  Never been a fan of the carbon fibre look.  Also sound wise I do like intimate vocal which is why I lean towards W2-131.  Though I already have RU6 so people suggest I get W2 instead, choices......


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Hyde00 said:


> I've been wondering the same, if anyone can answer this that would be amazing.
> 
> Like right now I have RU6 but I'm actually hoping it would be richer in the upper mids / low treble and wider sound stage LOL.  Or is that opposite direction of W2 / W2-131?  RU6 feels a bit congested at the moment in terms of sound stage.
> 
> ...


Go with W2 if you want more detail, less congestion and more energy in the upper frequencies. Keep RU6 as a complimentary pair.


----------



## stacey

Hyde00 said:


> I've been wondering the same, if anyone can answer this that would be amazing.
> 
> Like right now I have RU6 but I'm actually hoping it would be richer in the upper mids / low treble and wider sound stage LOL.  Or is that opposite direction of W2 / W2-131?  RU6 feels a bit congested at the moment in terms of sound stage.
> 
> ...



Interesting. I have the W2-131 and I’m thinking of getting the RU6 as a compliment.


----------



## alota

Congestion in ru6?


----------



## Hyde00

alota said:


> Congestion in ru6?


Yeah again I'm not sure because if I listen to it too early (before 100 hours) or that's just how it is.

Feels like too much going on and not enough separation / sound stage.  That or maybe I listen to PEE51 recently and it's a very layered dongle.

Too many questions not enough answers LOL.


----------



## bnupy

Hyde00 said:


> Yeah again I'm not sure because if I listen to it too early (before 100 hours) or that's just how it is.
> 
> Feels like too much going on and not enough separation / sound stage.  That or maybe I listen to PEE51 recently and it's a very layered dongle.
> 
> Too many questions not enough answers LOL.


I think the PEE51 is really sharp imaging but its neutral bright. The ru6 after some burnin has some really good imaging and sounstage. layers above the PEE51 in musicality.


----------



## Hyde00 (Feb 14, 2022)

bnupy said:


> I think the PEE51 is really sharp imaging but its neutral bright. The ru6 after some burnin has some really good imaging and sounstage. layers above the PEE51 in musicality.


Ah okay back to the burn in process then lol, thanks!

Anyone who has tried W2 or W2-131 can you share some impression as to how much bass quantity there is relative to RU6?

I like the amount of bass on RU6, would W2 or W2-131 have less bass?


----------



## alota

Honestly i found my delta sigma based  dongle better in details but i have no complaint about the soundstage and separation in ru6


----------



## yfei

Hyde00 said:


> Ah okay back to the burn in process then lol, thanks!
> 
> Anyone who has tried W2 or W2-131 can you share some impression as to how much bass quantity there is relative to RU6?
> 
> I like the amount of bass on RU6, would W2 or W2-131 have less bass?



My feeling:  both W2 and RU6 has good amount of bass (slighly more bass than reference sounding.  that's fine, reference sounding is not somthing that makes everyone happy and enjoy.)   The difference is, W2's bass is more 'loose, soft',    RU6's bass is more 'dense, coherent',  reminds me of the famous 'Moffat bass' from Shiit audio YGGY.


----------



## bnupy

Hyde00 said:


> Ah okay back to the burn in process then lol, thanks!
> 
> Anyone who has tried W2 or W2-131 can you share some impression as to how much bass quantity there is relative to RU6?
> 
> I like the amount of bass on RU6, would W2 or W2-131 have less bass?


I think the W2 has a similar signature. but the ru6 has a bit of oomph..(must be the sub bass). There's a hazy sparkle in the treble, I felt like the ru6 is smoother in the treble. Sort of depends what's your iem or headphone of choice for your desired sound


----------



## Hyde00

alota said:


> Honestly i found my delta sigma based  dongle better in details but i have no complaint about the soundstage and separation in ru6





yfei said:


> My feeling:  both W2 and RU6 has good amount of bass (slighly more bass than reference sounding.  that's fine, reference sounding is not somthing that makes everyone happy and enjoy.)   The difference is, W2's bass is more 'loose, soft',    RU6's bass is more 'dense, coherent',  reminds me of the famous 'Moffat bass' from Shiit audio YGGY.





bnupy said:


> I think the W2 has a similar signature. but the ru6 has a bit of oomph..(must be the sub bass). There's a hazy sparkle in the treble, I felt like the ru6 is smoother in the treble. Sort of depends what's your iem or headphone of choice for your desired sound


Thanks for the replies guys, I've decided to save the money for now and keep burning in my RU6 and see how it goes!

Thanks again!


----------



## kadinh

I was finally able to snag a RU6 from the classifieds, excited to hear what all the fuss is about.


----------



## TYATYA

Ru6 does not break sq and I keep it in audio path.
Spec is not great but sq.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Hyde00 said:


> Ah okay back to the burn in process then lol, thanks!
> 
> Anyone who has tried W2 or W2-131 can you share some impression as to how much bass quantity there is relative to RU6?
> 
> I like the amount of bass on RU6, would W2 or W2-131 have less bass?


https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lux...-info-on-post-1.949448/page-295#post-16734108


----------



## Hyde00

Andrew_WOT said:


> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/lux...-info-on-post-1.949448/page-295#post-16734108


Nice, good reminder thanks!

I think I read it before but forgot about it after reading review after reviews after reviews my brain just can't retain all the info anymore LOL.

But I'm on the same boat as other guy where I plan to find "the one" and sell the rest, I don't think I'd keep multiple ones.

Currently leaning on W2-131, but we'll see.  Sometimes I get too excited and impulse buy, gonna let me brain cool off for a few days and go from there.


----------



## tummus

How's the RU6 for IEMs? Does it pick up any noise?


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Hyde00 said:


> Nice, good reminder thanks!
> 
> I think I read it before but forgot about it after reading review after reviews after reviews my brain just can't retain all the info anymore LOL.
> 
> ...


If 10% power saving is not critical for you, W2 OG might be a better choice, L&P were forced to switch chip due to shortage, not because of sonic improvement.


----------



## Hyde00

Andrew_WOT said:


> If 10% power saving is not critical for you, W2 OG might be a better choice, L&P were forced to switch chip due to shortage, not because of sonic improvement.


Yeah I read the soundstage / presentation changes a bit, I think it was described as:

W2 - Concert Hall
W2-131 - Jazz Venue
RU6 - Recording Studio

From what I gathered is that 43198 = dac only, 43131 = dac/amp, but the dac portion is otherwise identical.

I was leaning on W2-131 because generally I like forward / upfront female vocal (like singing right infront of you), coming from Dragonfly Red it's how the vocal was presented (just resolution/imaging isn't up there).  To my understanding W2 vocal sound a bit distant?  I mean it's why I picked RU6 in the first place because of smallest stage lol.

But I'm still a bit curious to try W2 or W2-131, I guess W2 would be better value at the moment since there's a lot of classified sales so I can find it cheaper.  Though I was hoping W2-131 would bring the vocal closer?  I wonder what other dac/amp out there that also has forward vocal presentation (aside from Dragonfly Cobalt, which I like Red more).


----------



## alota

tummus said:


> How's the RU6 for IEMs? Does it pick up any noise?


I have no noise with my iems. Sometimes i heard the noise from phone only


----------



## Johnfg465vd

TYATYA said:


> Ru6 does not break sq and I keep it in audio path.
> Spec is not great but sq.


I'm planning to try a similar chain with RU6 & Gryphon.



tummus said:


> How's the RU6 for IEMs? Does it pick up any noise?


There is some noise when using Balanced out, but it's faint and not bothersome at all.


----------



## Brain Damage

My RU6 arrived today. Really enjoying it so far I have to say. The whole frequency range is silky smooth but not in a mushy way. Have tried with my DT880 pros in High gain mode and it powers them easily. The RU6 shows up some delta sigma dongles when it comes to its ability as a headphone amp. My beyers can sound lean and thin with some dongles, but not at all with the RU6. The detail retrieval through my Rose Mini MKIIs with the RU6 is brilliant too. Very happy so far. Can't wait to listen more 🎶


----------



## TYATYA

Johnfg465vd said:


> I'm planning to try a similar chain with RU6 & Gryphon.
> 
> 
> There is some noise when using Balanced out, but it's faint and not bothersome at all.


I use NeutronMp dsp:
+Crossfeed cutoff 538Hz, 0.8dB
+AutoEq for my IEM (with revised pre-gain to minus 7dB. It keep my Input pad (of iem amp) stay at neutral (zero)
+Max vol on RU6

I prefer ru6 there in audio path than w/o it.


----------



## TYATYA

tummus said:


> How's the RU6 for IEMs? Does it pick up any noise?


My IT00 pick up no hissing. 
EMI matter was there but unusually, can say rare for me, not a deal breaker.


----------



## briantrinh86

hi guys, does anybody use the ru6 with focal radiance? is it enough to drive the radiance at its full potential?


----------



## Frombauge

briantrinh86 said:


> hi guys, does anybody use the ru6 with focal radiance? is it enough to drive the radiance at its full potential?


Not with the Radiance but with the Clear OG which has higher impedance. Sound pressure on Clear is sufficient but dynamics are better using a desktop anp or something else above 500 mW.


----------



## briantrinh86

does anybody use the ru6 as a dac connect to headphone amp?


----------



## oldkid

briantrinh86 said:


> hi guys, does anybody use the ru6 with focal radiance? is it enough to drive the radiance at its full potential?


It drives my Elegia perfectly and the Radiance is basically the same headphones with another tuning


----------



## oldkid

briantrinh86 said:


> does anybody use the ru6 as a dac connect to headphone amp?


Yes, I use it with my xDuoo MT 601 tube amp through an audio jack to RCA cable. It sounds great but it doesn't impact the sound as much as with Delta sigma DACs.


----------



## blotmouse

oldkid said:


> Yes, I use it with my xDuoo MT 601 tube amp through an audio jack to RCA cable. It sounds great but it doesn't impact the sound as much as with Delta sigma DACs.


Just to be clear you're using it as a "dac", but you are double amping. There is no dac only feature.


----------



## oldkid (Feb 17, 2022)

blotmouse said:


> Just to be clear you're using it as a "dac", but you are double amping. There is no dac only feature.


Yes, I know there is no real line out on the RU6. Most dongle DACs don't offer that option.

As a matter of fact, my current "desktop" set-up is a tad more complex than that. I also have the Creative Sound BlasterX G6 in between the DAC and the amp as a spatial sound hardware DSP.
It makes Qobuz tracks sound like Dolby mixes found on Tidal or Apple Music


----------



## kumar402

blotmouse said:


> Just to be clear you're using it as a "dac", but you are double amping. There is no dac only feature.


All DAC have output stage to push out 2v etc so there is nothing like double amping here. If RU 6 is double amping then won’t Chord Mojo etc double amp ?


----------



## Andykong

kumar402 said:


> All DAC have output stage to push out 2v etc so there is nothing like double amping here. If RU 6 is double amping then won’t Chord Mojo etc double amp ?



Yes, if you were to user RU6 as line out and connect to another amplifier, you are double amping.

Not all line out are the same, and not all 2V output stage is equivalent to line out.    I have explained the concept of line out and pre-out in *C9 thread*, maybe that can clarify the technical concept behind these terms.


----------



## PA3BPAT

Andykong said:


> of if we don't want to transcode DSD to PCM, we'll need second rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD, .... etc etc.



I wonder, if a similar form-factor R2R DAC with 1) a rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD native decoding and 2) transcoding any PCM signal inside the bridge to DSD - would sound more interesting, airy?.. And I don't expect you need so many R2R resistor pair for such DAC. And, perhaps, simpler engineering?


----------



## oldkid

Andykong said:


> if we don't want to transcode DSD to PCM, we'll need second rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD, .... etc etc.


Would it be possible to keep the existing RU6 design and add a software feature to switch between the existing PCM mode and this new true DSD mode?

I would pay double the price just for that option. 

Imagine a pocketable R2R NOS DAC with native DSD capabilities 🤤


----------



## rarewolf (Feb 18, 2022)

blotmouse said:


> Just to be clear you're using it as a "dac", but you are double amping. There is no dac only feature.



Designating the SPDIF output should disable the WU amplifier, should it not?

Oops!… wrong DAC…


----------



## rarewolf

PA3BPAT said:


> I wonder, if a similar form-factor R2R DAC with 1) a rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD native decoding and 2) transcoding any PCM signal inside the bridge to DSD - would sound more interesting, airy?.. And I don't expect you need so many R2R resistor pair for such DAC. And, perhaps, simpler engineering?



I believe all R-2R DACs inherently need PCM, whereas sigma-delta DACs inherently need DSD. Note the decoders as the 1st operation each DAC employs…
https://www.mojo-audio.com/blog/dsd-vs-pcm-myth-vs-truth/


----------



## alvin59 (Feb 18, 2022)

Andykong said:


> Yes, if you were to user RU6 as line out and connect to another amplifier, you are double amping.
> 
> Not all line out are the same, and not all 2V output stage is equivalent to line out.    I have explained the concept of line out and pre-out in *C9 thread*, maybe that can clarify the technical concept behind these terms.


Hi Andy, i recently gotten the RU6 as my first "real" dac/amp after owning several delta sigma dongle based dac/amp. Admittedly, it's the only r2r i can afford and i gotta say it's worth every penny. Just some afterthoughts on the ru6,

1) would there software to offer the user full functionality of the ru6 in the event the physical buttons were to fail one day?


----------



## TYATYA

L gain and H gain, which you guys using?

At the time my unit was new, I never touch H gain bcs its ugly output to the whole signal path. 
Day by day it getting older and I CAN listen to H mode.

My unit is now >400hours, I still found L mode is the best. 
I insert RU6 in and bcs of this, double amping.
I prefer the output than plugging IEM directly to my sp1000.

H mode sounds more like dynamic compression. I hear some notes shaper, impact and  a bit brighter.
In L mode spectrum is full and flat.


----------



## oldkid

TYATYA said:


> L gain and H gain, which you guys using?
> 
> At the time my unit was new, I never touch H gain bcs its ugly output to the whole signal path.
> Day by day it getting older and I CAN listen to H mode.
> ...


Low gain everytime. I want to experience the NOS R2R sound as pure as possible.

I'm double amping too, despite technically using 3 amps. I have changed my setup again in my never ending war against noise.

I have the RU6 connected to my tube amp, then the headphone out goes to the line in of the Sound BlasterX G6 and finally I plug my headphones to the line out of this last device, bypassing its amp stage.

What I get is the warm sound and natural timbre of the RU6 magnified by the tube and the noise is kept low by the G6.

Optionally, I can apply the SBX spatialisation DSP for great Dolby Atmos like result.

I'm very happy with that configuration


----------



## Hyde00

I'm still under 100 hours so my unit might still be changing.  But so far I did test low and high gain then volume match it, I find low gain show better details and vocals so I kept at low gain.  High gain feels like there's a bit more power to the sound at the cost of masking details.

So I end up using low gain on RU6.

Which is actually surprising because most of my previous desktop amps, high gain always sounds better (more open, better layering, better dynamic range.......etc).


----------



## cybergalaxy

oldkid said:


> Yes, I know there is no real line out on the RU6. Most dongle DACs don't offer that option.
> 
> As a matter of fact, my current "desktop" set-up is a tad more complex than that. I also have the Creative Sound BlasterX G6 in between the DAC and the amp as a spatial sound hardware DSP.
> It makes Qobuz tracks sound like Dolby mixes found on Tidal or Apple Music


Can you explain a bit more how you connect RU6 to a desktop amp? At what volume I should set the RU6 to be so that it doesn't blow up the Desktop Amp? I would like to connect RU6 to a Drop THX 789 AMP. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!


----------



## Brain Damage

TYATYA said:


> L gain and H gain, which you guys using?
> 
> At the time my unit was new, I never touch H gain bcs its ugly output to the whole signal path.
> Day by day it getting older and I CAN listen to H mode.
> ...


I have really only used H gain when using more power hungry iems/headphones that possess a higher impedance (e.g. when listening with my Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pros, which have an impedance of 250ohms (>50ohms)). L gain is for iems/headphones with a low impedance/higher sensitivity (e.g. <50ohms). 

H and L gains both give the same sonic quality in terms of output; it's just the level of amplitude is greater with H gain (for more power hungry iems/headphones).

It's the same for the LG V30 phone. The Quad DAC inside the phone matches the impedance level of the headphone/iem:
HiFi status: <50ohms
High Impedance mode: >50ohms (up tp 600ohms)
Auxiliary mode: when headphone jack triggered as a line out.

This is my understanding anyway. Don't know what others think.


----------



## cybergalaxy

kumar402 said:


> RU6 doesn’t have a line out so I’m not sure at what volume does it output 2v. One is dongle for mobile use and one is proper desktop DAC  and are not really comparable.


Did you manage to find an answer for this please? Thanks.


----------



## Brain Damage

This album on tidal has never sounded so good. Thank you @Andykong and the RU6


----------



## TYATYA (Feb 19, 2022)

Brain Damage said:


> I have really only used H gain when using more power hungry iems/headphones that possess a higher impedance (e.g. when listening with my Beyerdynamic DT 880 Pros, which have an impedance of 250ohms (>50ohms)). L gain is for iems/headphones with a low impedance/higher sensitivity (e.g. <50ohms).
> 
> H and L gains both give the same sonic quality in terms of output; it's just the level of amplitude is greater with H gain (for more power hungry iems/headphones).
> 
> ...


I usually don't run an amp at 70% or more.(*)
Unless power is a matter, default thing is volume must be same when and before talking sonic quality (and mostly no need to mention here in headfi, I think).
My hd800s sounds loud enough at 75 (I see, a bit over 70) on the ru6 so ofcouse I chose L gain.
(I see H gain would keep same volume with 60 or 66 but I am not prefer its sound).

IMO, running OS+H mode will make ru6 no more being itself. It like DS chip.

*Addendum: for driving. For feeding (amp) I run up to  vol lvl 100


----------



## Brain Damage

TYATYA said:


> I usually don't run an amp at 70% or more.(*)
> Unless power is a matter, default thing is volume must be same when and before talking sonic quality (and mostly no need to mention here in headfi, I think).
> My hd800s sounds loud enough at 75 (I see, a bit over 70) on the ru6 so ofcouse I chose L gain.
> (I see H gain would keep same volume with 60 or 66 but I am not prefer its sound).
> ...


Do you use OS or NOS when in L gain mode? I'm enjoying L gain NOS.


----------



## TYATYA

Brain Damage said:


> Do you use OS or NOS when in L gain mode? I'm enjoying L gain NOS.


L, NOS and 3.5

That's shortest signal path internal of ru6.


----------



## DBaldock9

Hyde00 said:


> I'm still under 100 hours so my unit might still be changing.  But so far I did test low and high gain then volume match it, I find low gain show better details and vocals so I kept at low gain.  High gain feels like there's a bit more power to the sound at the cost of masking details.
> 
> So I end up using low gain on RU6.
> 
> Which is actually surprising because most of my previous desktop amps, high gain always sounds better (more open, better layering, better dynamic range.......etc).



Thanks for the observation about Low Gain providing better details & vocal performance.
.
The 4.4mm TRRRS output of my RU6 is going to the 4.4mm TRRRS input on my Kaei TAP-1S fully Balanced Tube Hybrid amp, and I've got my new Smabat ST-20 earbuds connected to the balanced output of the TAP-1S.
.
After switching from High to Low Gain - One thing I'm noticing, that's due to the clearer details, is the apparent improvement of instrument & vocal placement in the Sound Stage.  Tracks just seem to have better width & depth.


----------



## oldkid

cybergalaxy said:


> Can you explain a bit more how you connect RU6 to a desktop amp? At what volume I should set the RU6 to be so that it doesn't blow up the Desktop Amp? I would like to connect RU6 to a Drop THX 789 AMP. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks!


I have modified my setup again to reduce noise at the tube amp output stage. I use the balanced cable from my Sony MDR-1AM2 which is a 4.4mm TRRS to 3.5. TRRS cable to connect the RU6 to the aux in if my xDuoo MT-601.
Then, I connect the headphones out to the line in of the Sound Blaster G6 and finally my headphones are plugged directly to the line out of the Sound Blaster.
This is the best way to preserve the R2R + tube sound that I want while having control on the noise level.

I use the volume knob on the tube amp and the Sound Blaster to find a level where noise is inaudible, then I start the music and use the RU6 buttons to control the volume during playback. So, it can be anywhere between 50 and 100, always on low gain and NOS mode. It really depends on the balance I do just before.

I never knew I could blow up my amp 😂


----------



## yaps66

Brain Damage said:


> This album on tidal has never sounded so good. Thank you @Andykong and the RU6


I was just listening to this in the afternoon.  Have mine in FLAC.  Amazing album!!!


----------



## peterinvan

Brain Damage said:


> Do you use OS or NOS when in L gain mode? I'm enjoying L gain NOS.


NOS, Low Gain.  Drives my Elegias nicely.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Did you guys see measurements from NOS filter, it's different DAC, but filter wise the same principle.


----------



## oldkid (Feb 19, 2022)

Andrew_WOT said:


> Did you guys see measurements from NOS filter, it's different DAC, but filter wise the same principle.


R2R DACs measure poorly, NOS DACs measure poorly, dongle DACs generally measure poorly compared to desktop DACs.
That being said, RU6 is a R2R NOS dongle DAC, so it should be crappy, right? Yet, it sounds amazing with every headphones I have tried it with.

At the end of the day, it depends on what you trust the most, your ears or your oscilloscope.


----------



## yaps66

oldkid said:


> R2R DACs measure poorly, NOS DACs measure poorly, dongle DACs generally measure poorly compared to desktop DACs.
> That being said, RU6 is a R2R NOS dongle DAC, so it should be crappy, right? Yet, it sounds amazing with every headphones I have tried it with.
> 
> At the end of the day, it depends on what you trust the most, your ears or your oscilloscope.


Hear hear (pun intended)!!


----------



## TYATYA

Andrew_WOT said:


> Did you guys see measurements from NOS filter, it's different DAC, but filter wise the same principle.


I care just for actual output from hp.
If you got hd800, bright one, so no filter mode should be fine right?
(Just seeing graphs).
And human mostly did not know  how well his/her ears currently being. 20k or 17k is ability of child, teenage only.
For my ears which ability is 14200hz include reduction some dB at the end, I just care for 20-10k (most importance).
AK dap have 5 or 6 dac filters, I like supper slow mode. It is a bad graphic.
Default mode which they set, sounding quite thin to my ears.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

TYATYA said:


> If you got hd800, bright one, so no filter mode should be fine right?


I don't think any portable dongle can do HD800 justice, no matter filter used, but in desktop setup I am using Linear (Fast) filter on Auralic Vega DAC with HD800 (SDR) and it sounds sublime to my ears. Not saying that everyone should do exactly the same, was just pointing out on how much noise NOS filter introduces, negating all the engineering efforts to minimize DAC jitter and THD. It's just an interesting phenomena that some prefer their sound "dirty".


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Double post


----------



## TYATYA

Andrew_WOT said:


> I don't think any portable dongle can do HD800 justice, no matter filter used, but in desktop setup I am using Linear (Fast) filter on Auralic Vega DAC with HD800 (SDR) and it sounds sublime to my ears. Not saying that everyone should do exactly the same, was just pointing out on how much noise NOS filter introduces, negating all the engineering efforts to minimize DAC jitter and THD. It's just an interesting phenomena that some prefer their sound "dirty".


I can prove you on dacs sound the same by ... paper.
Measurement post on the box of AK dap shows Ak120ii sound cleaner than SP1k and SP1k so, is dirtier.
Your headphones are atleast 10x dirtier than your dap, and your speaker usually more 10x dirtier compare to headphones.
So, specs no matter.
Use ears to buy stuffs.

Who like specs should goes for DS chip. Avoid tube and r2r, always win.


----------



## oldkid

Andrew_WOT said:


> I don't think any portable dongle can do HD800 justice, no matter filter used, but in desktop setup I am using Linear (Fast) filter on Auralic Vega DAC with HD800 (SDR) and it sounds sublime to my ears. Not saying that everyone should do exactly the same, was just pointing out on how much noise NOS filter introduces, negating all the engineering efforts to minimize DAC jitter and THD. It's just an interesting phenomena that some prefer their sound "dirty".


Were you alive when everyone was listening to analog tape and vinyls? If you think a modern R2R DAC like the RU6 sounds "dirty", surely any analog medium is pure garbage.
Hi-Fi in the good old days was a matter of keeping the noise at the lowest level possible.

Nowadays, we audiophiles have the choice to go for chip based delta sigma DACs which sound cleaner than real life or we can try to emulate the analog sound of the past by using tube amps and R2R DACs.
If you choose the latter, measurements are irrelevant


----------



## Andrew_WOT (Feb 19, 2022)

oldkid said:


> If you think a modern R2R DAC like the RU6 sounds "dirty"


You are probably missing the point of my post, with RU6 you can get cleaner signal just as well as with anything else, just not with NOS.
Another good article on NOS vs Oversampling filters, summary section in particular.


----------



## Jawis

dakchi said:


> IMR Semper. I've used it with many DAPs and dongles. It has never been bright


I'm finding it OK with Semper, but I am using black/black filters.  I suspect with the blue upper range filter the electrostats could over reach in treble range. Is there a particular combo filter you are using?
Will be interesting if you will get same experience with the Avalons? Looking forward to trying the RU6 with these.


----------



## oldkid

Andrew_WOT said:


> You are probably missing the point of my post, with RU6 you can get cleaner signal just as well as with anything else, just not with NOS.
> Another good article on NOS vs Oversampling filters, summary section in particular.


What you call a "clean" or "dirty" signal can only be seen on a scope. Several people on this very thread have said that NOS mode sounded better to their ears and I fully support this observation.

Again, if the scope shows the opposite of what you hear, please don't tell me you would believe the scope


----------



## Andrew_WOT

oldkid said:


> Again, if the scope shows the opposite of what you hear, please don't tell me you would believe the scope


I'll just quote extract from the blog I linked above.


> While this might be true in some circumstances especially in the old days, who ever said this was universally applicable? After decades, with the maturity of sound technology, assuming the collection of measurements was done appropriately, an alternate explanation is just as likely: _*"If it measures bad and sounds good, maybe your hearing isn't as good as you think."*_ I think it would be hard to argue against this perspective when a subjective writer waxes poetic about stair-stepped squarish waves coming out of an old NOS DAC as if there is some special, non "digital-sounding" quality. From my perspective, these squarish waves are as "digital-sounding" as it gets! Another example of this might be how forgiving our ears/mind are to the effects of jitter; objectively, it takes quite a lot of timing irregularity before most people would be able to put their finger on an audible problem. Yet think of all the times various reviewers have claimed that cables of all things affect jitter significantly or manufacturers seem to think femtoseconds are audible...
> 
> _When the technology is advanced enough to exceed perceptual thresholds, this is exactly what one would expect._ The human perceptual system has been surpassed in many domains already. When this happens and there is a desire to differentiate devices, creative imagination becomes a greater factor and the mind projects descriptions of the devices fed by psychological expectations and biases than objective reality.


----------



## TYATYA

Andrew_WOT said:


> I'll just quote extract from the blog I linked above.


I found on that post a thing below.
So how good your ears are?
And i have 2 simple questions: How much your headphone reduction or gain a tone of 15khz?
Is that less than what you found in the chart of FR with NOS?

If you bypass headphone side, just looking the chart relate to dap measurement AND trust it than your ears, you have not enough envidence to conclude NOS.
With error value, 1% and 0.002% and 0.0005٪,... I never care for 2 second value in life, IF i do not see 1st value


----------



## kumar402 (Feb 20, 2022)

Andrew_WOT said:


> I don't think any portable dongle can do HD800 justice, no matter filter used, but in desktop setup I am using Linear (Fast) filter on Auralic Vega DAC with HD800 (SDR) and it sounds sublime to my ears. Not saying that everyone should do exactly the same, was just pointing out on how much noise NOS filter introduces, negating all the engineering efforts to minimize DAC jitter and THD. It's just an interesting phenomena that some prefer their sound "dirty".


There is no ground rule that says all R2R NOS DACs measure poorly. Holo Audio, Sonnet have shown good measurement out of their DAC.
Also now a days we have very good streamers and DDC available to take care of Jitter. So it has just become a fancy word that’s gets thrown around. Very few are using bad streamer and DDC with bad optical or SPDIF


----------



## oldkid

Andrew_WOT said:


> I'll just quote extract from the blog I linked above.


So, your trust the machine more than yourself. That must be a sad life.


> The human perceptual system has been surpassed in many domains already.


This cannot be proven. Just because you can put 2 microphones in something that grossly ressemble a human head, doesn't mean you understand perfectly how people hear sounds. Only neuroscience researchers could settle this debate between measurements nerds and musicality geeks


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

oldkid said:


> Were you alive when everyone was listening to analog tape and vinyls? If you think a modern R2R DAC like the RU6 sounds "dirty", surely any analog medium is pure garbage.
> Hi-Fi in the good old days was a matter of keeping the noise at the lowest level possible.
> 
> Nowadays, we audiophiles have the choice to go for chip based delta sigma DACs which sound cleaner than real life or we can try to emulate the analog sound of the past by using tube amps and R2R DACs.
> If you choose the latter, measurements are irrelevant


R2R DACs and tube amps deliver my preferred sound.    To me RU6 is the king of dongles.


----------



## oldkid (Feb 21, 2022)

The EMI noise on 4G network is the only major issue I have about this DAC. I think I will get the leather case and try to fit some aluminum foil inside to get rid of this annoyance


----------



## alota

oldkid said:


> The EMI noise on 4G network is the only major issue I have about this DAC. I think I will get the leather case and try to fit some aluminum foil inside to get rid of this annoyance


I have this noises sometimes. I have ordered a longer usb cable. Will see


----------



## Currawong

kumar402 said:


> All DAC have output stage to push out 2v etc so there is nothing like double amping here. If RU 6 is double amping then won’t Chord Mojo etc double amp ?


Something to add to what Andy said, is that, if the input impedance of an amplifier is sufficiently high, which most are, then you likely wont get any current gain from a headphone amplifier output stage anyway. 

What people are referring to with a "true line out" is only a single, voltage gain stage after the DAC, rather than the dual dual-stage, voltage and current amplifiers used for headphones.

Chord DACs aren't the same. The reason for this is that one of the critical aspects of a regular DAC is for the first gain stage to filter out high-frequency noise that is output alongside the music. That isn't an issue with Chord DACs, so they only require one gain stage for everything.



PA3BPAT said:


> I wonder, if a similar form-factor R2R DAC with 1) a rail of R-2R dedicated for DSD native decoding and 2) transcoding any PCM signal inside the bridge to DSD - would sound more interesting, airy?.. And I don't expect you need so many R2R resistor pair for such DAC. And, perhaps, simpler engineering?



This sounds appealing on the surface, but would not really be sensible. Converting to DSD requires a lot of power, and the quality of the conversion would suffer in a portable device. It would also not produce any useful sonic benefit, but just move complexity elsewhere, switching from a complex R2R ladder to a complex high-frequency circuit, converter, and filter. You could, conceivably use DSD upsampling with something like Onkyo's HFPlayer on a phone, but that tends just to make the sound somewhat soft and blunted, depending on what it is fed to.

Something people forget is that _real, live music sounds raw and edgy._ What people call "analog" is the opposite of natural. It's nicer, in some respects, to listen to music that has been softened by whatever means, but if you listen to even something as simply as a drum set relatively close, you realise that most music has had the actual dynamics grossly muted, even at best.



kumar402 said:


> There is no ground rule that says all R2R NOS DACs measure poorly. Holo Audio, Sonnet have shown good measurement out of their DAC.



Holo Audio does this by using a cheap, generic over-sampling chip, which nobody in their right mind uses to listen to music with (as using it sounds awful in my experience) just to get good measurements for standard test signals. Basically, they are gaming the system.


----------



## alota

I read many post about some crazy exercices about ru6. Welll. ..ru6 is just a dongle that sounds really good. No line output but if you want you connect to an amplifier do it without problems. C' mon guys it is just a dongle. I had many things in the past. When i listen ru6 wuth my iems sometimes i ask to me: why you don' t sell mains system? And c'mon twice. Just enjoy ru6 like a dongle  end of history


----------



## Johnfg465vd

alota said:


> I read many post about some crazy exercices about ru6. Welll. ..ru6 is just a dongle that sounds really good. No line output but if you want you connect to an amplifier do it without problems. C' mon guys it is just a dongle. I had many things in the past. When i listen ru6 wuth my iems sometimes i ask to me: why you don' t sell mains system? And c'mon twice. Just enjoy ru6 like a dongle  end of history


Sadly, I see this way too often. People expecting "X" feature from a device intended to be used as a "Y". If not Line Output, some one will ask for bluetooth input or EQ and so on... I kinda get where they are coming from but 🤷

@Andykong In the future, is there any chance for a portable R2R DAC? RU6 is a good sounding dongle but does not sound in the same level as the Mojo or iDSD Signature.

A battery powered R2R DAC, that's not limited by power constraints & size. Something priced at a similar price to Mojo 2 or Gryphon (I would not mind it costing less 😁).

There is the Cayin R01 but, I don't wanna pay extra for feature (Display, OS, Chipset...) I won't use.


----------



## bnupy

Does the leather case get rid of some of the EMI ?


----------



## oldkid

bnupy said:


> Does the leather case get rid of some of the EMI ?


That's what I would like to know as well. It would be easy to solve the problem with a shielding layer inside the leather case


----------



## TYATYA (Feb 21, 2022)

bnupy said:


> Does the leather case get rid of some of the EMI ?


No.
Even if you wrap a ru6 with aluminium sheet.


----------



## oldkid

Johnfg465vd said:


> Sadly, I see this way too often. People expecting "X" feature from a device intended to be used as a "Y". If not Line Output, some one will ask for bluetooth input or EQ and so on... I kinda get where they are coming from but 🤷
> 
> @Andykong In the future, is there any chance for a portable R2R DAC? RU6 is a good sounding dongle but does not sound in the same level as the Mojo or iDSD Signature.
> 
> ...


I use the RU6 as a DAC in a desktop setup that I have described in several of my previous messages.
It sounds a bit different when double amping, but its remarkable musicality is preserved.
It's my D.I.Y. version of the Ares 2 😁


----------



## Andykong

oldkid said:


> The EMI noise on 4G network is the only major issue I have about this DAC. I think I will get the leather case and try to fit some aluminum foil inside to get rid of this annoyance





bnupy said:


> Does the leather case get rid of some of the EMI ?



From what we observed, the biggest source of EMI interfernce comes from the USB cable, it act as an antenna to attract EMI signal and then passed it into RU6. Adding a layer of aluminum foil around RU6 won't make a lot of different.   Maybe an USB cable with stronger shilding can help to eliminate the EMI noise.  

If you want to perform some test with aluminum foil, you can wrap the USB-C cable and test if the EMI noise is reduced.  To stop the EMI to go into RU6, you should warp the USB-C connector that you'll connect to RU6, and then twisted the alumimum foil to cover roughly the half the cable.



alota said:


> I have this noises sometimes. I have ordered a longer usb cable. Will see



Make sure your new cable has better shielding when compare to your current USB cable.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Wondering if USB cable with ferrite chokes will help.


----------



## Andykong (Feb 21, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> Sadly, I see this way too often. People expecting "X" feature from a device intended to be used as a "Y". If not Line Output, some one will ask for bluetooth input or EQ and so on... I kinda get where they are coming from but 🤷
> 
> @Andykong In the future, is there any chance for a portable R2R DAC? RU6 is a good sounding dongle but does not sound in the same level as the Mojo or iDSD Signature.
> 
> ...



I think similar questions have been raised many times, and our resposne are consistent.  First of all, we don't have any plan to develop another dongle, this is not in our roadmap.   

Secondly, we don't think adding battery to dongle is a good idea  from our product planning perspective.  Dongle are mean to be small, dongle trades performance for form factors and portabilities.  If we were to develop a R2R product with battery built-in, it will become a DAC/Amp like Chord Mojo, but most like a lot more expensive.  Think about that, if we re-engineer R01 into a DAC/Amp with its own USB and SPDIF digital receiver, lithnium battery, power management circuits, and a chassic with practical UI and decent finishing ..., I am not surpirsed that this new DAC/Amp will sell at 2x of R01 suggested retail price.

Can we do this with reference to RU6 instead of R01?  Technically yes, but that is not a good business  practise.  Honestly speaking, we should maximize our profit while offering high quality product. When we have an business opportunity open up right in front of us, we should identical all viable alternatives and always select the most profitable choice, shouldn't we?


----------



## oldkid

Andykong said:


> I think similar questions have been raised many times, and our resposne are consistent.  First of all, we don't have any plan to develop another dongle, this is not in our roadmap.
> 
> Secondly, we don't think adding battery to dongle is a good idea  from our product planning perspective.  Dongle are mean to be small, dongle trades performance for form factors and portabilities.  If we were to develop a R2R product with battery built-in, it will become a DAC/Amp like Chord Mojo, but most like a lot more expensive.  Think about that, if we re-engineer R01 into a DAC/Amp with its own USB and SPDIF digital receiver, lithnium battery, power management circuits, and a chassic with practical UI and decent finishing ..., I am not surpirsed that this new DAC/Amp will sell at 2x of R01 suggested retail price.
> 
> Can we do this with reference to RU6 instead of R01?  Technically yes, but that is not a good business  practise.  Honestly speaking, we should maximize our profit while offering high quality product. When we have an business opportunity open up right in front of us, we should identical all viable alternatives and always select the most profitable choice, shouldn't we?


Thank you for your honest answer about seeking profit, which is the ultimate goal of every company. I understand that RU6 is your cheapest product and that the rest of your offering normally cost a lot more. Cayin is seen as a luxury brand in the audiophile world and you want to cultivate that image.

I won't name any other company here but there are other R2R DAPs that could be miniaturized into the dongle DAC form factor like you did with the R01.
That might be a good thing to keep your advantage on this niche as you are the first to market.

Well, I don't know anything about business and hardware manufacturing but I would buy anything that ressemble the RU6 with even more performance and features in a heartbeat.


----------



## bnupy

TYATYA said:


> No.
> Even if you wrap a ru6 with aluminium sheet.


..... alright. sexy.


----------



## alota

Andykong said:


> Make sure your new cable has better shielding when compare to your current USB cable.


Yes of course. My actual cable is from cayin. In any case you sell replacement cable?


----------



## Frombauge (Feb 22, 2022)

TYATYA said:


> No.
> Even if you wrap a ru6 with aluminium sheet.


Where’s the grounding/earthing wire to the tin foil. That’s needed for EMI attenuation. Unless the EMI is wire-bound or originates from the source. Looks like something some shady people try and sell you in dark alleys…in this case with wires sticking out of it…


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Andykong said:


> Secondly, we don't think adding battery to dongle is a good idea from our product planning perspective. Dongle are mean to be small, dongle trades performance for form factors and portabilities.


I was hinting at a transportable device (Hip-DAC, Mojo... size) and not a dongle. As a dongle, RU6 is already on a slightly larger size and adding a battery to increase the size and weight would be bad. A separate product that sits between RU6 and N6ii + R01, My LG G8x battery level went from 95% to 23% when connected to RU6 (~5 Hours) and having a DAC with it's own battery would mean longer battery for my phone, not to mention more power to drive Headphones better.



Andykong said:


> Think about that, if we re-engineer R01 into a DAC/Amp with its own USB and SPDIF digital receiver, lithnium battery, power management circuits, and a chassic with practical UI and decent finishing ..., I am not surpirsed that this new DAC/Amp will sell at 2x of R01 suggested retail price.


Even if such a device costs 2x the price of R01, it's still better than getting N6ii + R01 right? especially for those not looking for a large DAP. I don't know how the pricing is in other places but here N6ii is ~1,500 USD and importing R01 would be ~550 USD excluding customs. So, a portable DAC 2x the price of R01 would be ~1,100 USD vs ~2,000 USD for N6ii + R01.



Andykong said:


> Can we do this with reference to RU6 instead of R01? Technically yes, but that is not a good business practise. Honestly speaking, we should maximize our profit while offering high quality product. When we have an business opportunity open up right in front of us, we should identical all viable alternatives and always select the most profitable choice, shouldn't we?


As a company, definitely understandable.


----------



## Andykong

Johnfg465vd said:


> I was hinting at a transportable device (Hip-DAC, Mojo... size) and not a dongle. As a dongle, RU6 is already on a slightly larger size and adding a battery to increase the size and weight would be bad. A separate product that sits between RU6 and N6ii + R01, My LG G8x battery level went from 95% to 23% when connected to RU6 (~5 Hours) and having a DAC with it's own battery would mean longer battery for my phone, not to mention more power to drive Headphones better.
> 
> 
> Even if such a device costs 2x the price of R01, it's still better than getting N6ii + R01 right? especially for those not looking for a large DAP. I don't know how the pricing is in other places but here N6ii is ~1,500 USD and importing R01 would be ~550 USD excluding customs. So, a portable DAC 2x the price of R01 would be ~1,100 USD vs ~2,000 USD for N6ii + R01.
> ...



Let stay with SRP as that will make life easier for me, if I discuss discounted price publicly, I'll be disliked by my dealers.

R01 is $619, if we works on someohting 2x R01, that will be $1249.  

I have seen someone done this before, actually quite a few have done this:
N6ii+T01 is $1199, N6ii+T01+R01 = $1818, sell T01 to recover some cost, say $250, the final price is $15xx.  

In fact, that's why 600 units of N6ii-Ti sold out quicly, at $1899, the premium are a lot less than other Titanium DAP options.


----------



## PA3BPAT

rarewolf said:


> I believe all R-2R DACs inherently need PCM, whereas sigma-delta DACs inherently need DSD.


That would be a simplification. Passive (DACless, chipless) DSD decoding is possible and there were some schematics of that. Looks for example for *Lampizator DSD DAC *(I believe it is discontinued now, but you can easily dig some info)*. *


----------



## Currawong

My review is up (finally!)


----------



## ducnsh

Hi guys, I am newbie here, is there any difference among iPhone models on lightning current output to RU6? Thanks!


----------



## oldkid

Currawong said:


> My review is up (finally!)



Good review with no measurements at all, just comparisons and listening impressions. 👍 
And I learned about even order harmonic distortions. I'll look into it as I'm a fan of both R2R and tube sound


----------



## yaps66

Currawong said:


> My review is up (finally!)



Great review! Love how you contrasted it with the L&P W2 in terms of features (or the lack of it) and how the RU6 was just musical!  The RU6 is just different and an outlier in the dongle dac space and such a pleasure (almost guilty) to listen to!!


----------



## kadinh

ducnsh said:


> Hi guys, I am newbie here, is there any difference among iPhone models on lightning current output to RU6? Thanks!


all models with lightning ports should be the same


----------



## kadinh

Currawong said:


> My review is up (finally!)



thank you for your review. did you find that the SE output sounded better since the 4.4mm goes through an OP?


----------



## rarewolf (Feb 22, 2022)

ducnsh said:


> Hi guys, I am newbie here, is there any difference among iPhone models on lightning current output to RU6? Thanks!



Despite possible difference between models, not all compatible OTG cables are the same with regard to what you can get from the lightning ports. Someone had reported here on the Hifigo and OEAUDIO OTG cables upping the output voltage to 5V, and someone else had reported having measured the output volts for manufacturers’ (e.g., L&P, Cayin) OTG cables also upping it to 5V. I'm sorry I don’t have the references, but you should be able to search the Hifigo and OEAUDIO stores.


----------



## Currawong

kadinh said:


> thank you for your review. did you find that the SE output sounded better since the 4.4mm goes through an OP?


Ahh, that was in a different take that I shot before: The SE output seems to have less bass with some IEMs.  But I didn’t notice any other significant sound difference Between them. Likewise, external upsampling didn’t seem to help anything either, so it didn’t get mentioned.


----------



## adriansticoid

Got my RU6 a few days ago. Is it normal that there is a bit of a static noise on the left side when a new song starts? I'm using Hiby.


----------



## yaps66

adriansticoid said:


> Got my RU6 a few days ago. Is it normal that there is a bit of a static noise on the left side when a new song starts? I'm using Hiby.


I do not have this experience.


----------



## alota

I will try this cable


----------



## TYATYA

adriansticoid said:


> Got my RU6 a few days ago. Is it normal that there is a bit of a static noise on the left side when a new song starts? I'm using Hiby.


Static noise or EMI?
You are 1st member report that if I remember correctly


----------



## adriansticoid

TYATYA said:


> Static noise or EMI?
> You are 1st member report that if I remember correctly


Not sure if it's EMI because I put my phone in airplane mode and that noise was still there.


----------



## TYATYA

adriansticoid said:


> Not sure if it's EMI because I put my phone in airplane mode and that noise was still there.


So if noise still there with a litght app (example VLC) while your source in flight mode, I think you should return and do another order  (yes, ru6 but other one).
At first check if you got hissing, normal phenomenal when high power dap drives high sensivity iem.
Btw my IT00 catch zero hissing from my ru6


----------



## yfei (Feb 23, 2022)

Few words about RU6,    vs LG V60,   W2,   Dragonfly Cobalt,  Mojo.       Using 64 Audio U12 IEM.
(For LG V60,  I use UAPP, and turn on 'RAW' of HiRes driver flags.  This will by-pass the 3 LG HiFi filter settings.  I feel its result is similar to set RU6 to NOS mode)





(The following is RU6 in NOS mode,   LG V60 in LG HiFi filters OFF mode)

Is the sound 'true', artifact-free?        RU6: yes, absolutely.  I can hear no artifacts, unrealistic feelings that can be found in Delta sigma dacs.  10/10
W2 and Mojo: sometimes I can hear some artifacts, some unrealistic instrument presentation   7.         LG V60:  everything is correct and realistic as RU6, it's hard to achieve this by DS  10/10.       Cobalt: similar sound as LG V60,  9/10
Bass quality?      RU6: great density,   however I feel it is not deep and linear enough, and a little bumped.   8/10.
LG V60: perfect, fast, linear, deep and right amount.  10/10.     Cobalt: great, a little bumped.  7/10.     W2: a little boosted, not deep and linear enough.  7/10.    Mojo: not deep enough.  7/10
Details, resolution?      RU6: great, it's not blurred or anything, and the amount of information is balanced through-out the frequency range.  when listening to RU6 I don't feel I miss anything.     But compared to it, DS dacs can push crazy amount of details to my face.   So from listening experience point of view, RU6 should be 10/10.     But for technical comparison, it should be 5/10.
LG V60:  absolute TOTL amount of information, details.   it is absolutly transparent, direct, no information is missing at all.   at the same time there is no digital feeling, it is not clinical at all.   LG V60 is just amazing.        10/10
Cobalt:  although it is DS, but it is not very detailed.  5/10        W2: great amount of information, I think technically it's chip's ability is == LG V60, however I feel that a little bit filter has been applied,  so it's detail level is slightly lower than V60.   9/10            Mojo: great, 7/10
Sound stage?    RU6: great.   9/10
LG V60:  great.  9/10       Cobalt: small.  5/10         W2:  great,  8/10          Mojo: magical, life-like, widest.   10/10
Tonal balance?    RU6: good, but bass is a little bumped.  8/10
LG V60:  reference level correct.  10/10     Cobalt:  bass is boosted.  7/10       W2 and Mojo:  bass is not linear and deep enough  5，6

The following is subjective, higher score mean it is 'better' or 'worse' depends on personal preference:

Realistic and refined highs?      RU6：in NOS mode, highs are truethful reproduction of the recording.   So, for bad recordings, it can be 'grainy' and 'digital'.  5/10.   For bad recordings if turn on OS mode, it will filter out all the 'digital' and 'grainy' feeling, making it just perfectly smooth and musical.   7/10
（NOS mode is more truethful, more information, better sound stage and bass.    So I use NOS by default for every album, but will try OS mode to see if it can make this album much more 'realistic',  if yes, then I will use OS for this album,  otherwise NOS is the best.)
LG V60,  similar to RU6,  I can turn on the filter and turn off the filter, get different result.   5 and 7
Cobalt:  no filter setting.  it has some grainy feeling on bad recordings.  6/10
W2:  has 'magic' filter,  making highs really refined and realistic feeling.   9/10
Mojo:   it's filter is not as 'magic' and 'high-end' feeling as W2.   7/10
Musical like listening to tape?     RU6:  nope.  it is direct, true,   but nothing like tape.  6/10
LG V60:  nope.  it is absolutly truthful, not like tape.      5/10
Cobalt:   it is fine.   7/10.           W2:  musical.  8/10.        Mojo:   Amazing, it is like listening to tape!  10/10




*What I like the most,   used most often?*
1. RU6.   although I gave LG V60 higher scores, but RU6 is more energetic, mids and lows are denser,     it make music more exciting and enjoyable than V60.
2. Mojo.   tape-like feeling is fun and reminds me of old-school times.

*What is the most under-estimated, under-discussed DAC?*
LG V60!      Maybe I am just crazy.    If I am not crazy, then LG V60 really deserve some attention and serious reviews.
I feel it is a reference level, amazing DAC.


(I have had Hugo 2 for awhile.       It is in between Mojo and LG V60.       Compared to Mojo,  Hugo 2 is moving toward the direction of V60 (more details and truthful, less musical),  but hasn't really achieved V60 yet.     If Mojo is 1,   V60 is 10,  then Hugo 2 is at 8 or 9.          I sold Hugo 2 because I already have the two ends: Mojo and V60,   I don't see why I need to keep something in the middle.)


----------



## drftr

yfei said:


> Few words about RU6,    vs LG V60,   W2,   Dragonfly Cobalt,  Mojo.       Using 64 Audio U12 IEM.
> (For LG V60,  I use UAPP, and turn on 'RAW' of HiRes driver flags.  This will by-pass the 3 LG HiFi filter settings.  I feel its result is similar to set RU6 to NOS mode)
> 
> 
> ...


Great write-up! Can you describe "musical" in a different way than listening to tape though? Not sure what you're referring to here. Tnx...

drftr


----------



## Andrew_WOT

Great, phone beats them all, yay.


----------



## yfei

drftr said:


> Great write-up! Can you describe "musical" in a different way than listening to tape though? Not sure what you're referring to here. Tnx...
> 
> drftr


'musical',  I think I mean:   better flow continuity, warmth, smooth, life like.


----------



## drftr

yfei said:


> 'musical',  I think I mean:   better flow continuity, warmth, smooth, life like.


Ouch! That would make the V60 become worst instead of best for me all of a sudden...

drftr


----------



## alota

yfei said:


> Few words about RU6,    vs LG V60,   W2,   Dragonfly Cobalt,  Mojo.       Using 64 Audio U12 IEM.
> (For LG V60,  I use UAPP, and turn on 'RAW' of HiRes driver flags.  This will by-pass the 3 LG HiFi filter settings.  I feel its result is similar to set RU6 to NOS mode)
> 
> 
> ...


I don' t know lg v60 but had v30 and have v50. I think no big differencies between models. I agree with your opinion. I found lg models better with sensible and with low impedance iems. But for example i found ibasso dc05 superior to my lg in terms of ds performance. In the end i prefere ru6 ober other stuffs


----------



## Andrew_WOT

LG V30 Quad DAC is very good, but not as good as L&P W2 or even ES100 MK2. But may be whatever they packed into V60 is a true miracle?


----------



## alota

Andrew_WOT said:


> LG V30 Quad DAC is very good, but not as good as L&P W2 or even ES100 MK2. But may be whatever they packed into V60 is a true miracle?


I don't think so. I heard small differencies between lg v50 and v30 due probably to meridian algoritm


----------



## yfei (Feb 24, 2022)

Andrew_WOT said:


> LG V30 Quad DAC is very good, but not as good as L&P W2 or even ES100 MK2. But may be whatever they packed into V60 is a true miracle?





alota said:


> I don't think so. I heard small differencies between lg v50 and v30 due probably to meridian algoritm


I have used LG v10, 20, 30, 40, 50 and 60.   Technically the difference is V60 used a different chip than other models: ESS 9219.  From paper, this chip integrated all the peripheral circuits, removed the need of any manufacture tuning.    (ESS chip is famous for it is hard for manufactures to design peripheral circuits, hard to tune the sound)

All other LG V models sounded more similar than different, sound is great but: 1) sometimes can hear unrealistic instruments, 2) I like LG tuning than B&O and Meridian tuning, they make it even more unrealistic, and not balanced frequency response, 3) these 3 hi-fi filters, none of them is perfect, cause some uncomfortness.

When I first listen to V60: the sound is very different than other Vs.  It is vinyl like feeling (analog with great details), and all instruments are rendered correctly, I can not find anything unrealistic.
However its highs is fatiguing to me, it is a strange kind if fatigue, feels like software bug.
Later I found out using UAPP and set 'RAW' flag can disable these 3 hi-fi filters, the sound is like turning on NOS mode.  And 1) sound is more direct, the uncomfortable feeling of the 3 filters disappeared. 2) highs fatiguing issue solved.
3) less 'analog' feeling. More grains on bad recording.
(Now after 1+ year use, several OTA firmware upgrades, there is no more highs fatigue issue even if turning on the 3 filters.   Maybe one of the OTA update solved the issue)


----------



## Goofyboy84

I’m baaaaaaack!!!!! 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄 There’s a short in the amp…. At the USBc end… ****!!!!!


----------



## Goofyboy84

I have been using my trusty apple dongle because it serves me the best. Now I’m not happy. I’ve dealt with this ever since this fiasco… I’ve given up on the amp and let it just sit… I’m sick of the issues. I think I found the culprit…. It’s a short in the son of a bitch. I know I cant return it… cause I would in a heartbeat… along with my balanced cable…. Yeah…. Not happy. 😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢 I’m close to just throwing it away now.


----------



## cybergalaxy

Andykong said:


> We have three models in our DAP line up.  The N3Pro is our "entry-level", N6ii is our midrange DAP, and N8 is our flagshp and soon to be replaced by N8ii.  What you said is certainly feasible, technically.


How does the sound compare between RU6 and N3Pro?


----------



## Goofyboy84

No wonder it got soooooooo so hot to the touch… I’ll call musictek tomorrow and see about returning for a full refund. I’ll do a desktop amp at this point… as this is hardly portable in the first place. I’m sorry it came to this… but… here we are. I refuse to throw another single dime to this amp/dac combo thing.


----------



## yfei

Goofyboy84 said:


> No wonder it got soooooooo so hot to the touch… I’ll call musictek tomorrow and see about returning for a full refund. I’ll do a desktop amp at this point… as this is hardly portable in the first place. I’m sorry it came to this… but… here we are. I refuse to throw another single dime to this amp/dac combo thing.


I haven't met this issue,   here I am in winter, room temperature ~24C,   RU6 gets warm,  but never hot.


----------



## kumar402

Goofyboy84 said:


> No wonder it got soooooooo so hot to the touch… I’ll call musictek tomorrow and see about returning for a full refund. I’ll do a desktop amp at this point… as this is hardly portable in the first place. I’m sorry it came to this… but… here we are. I refuse to throw another single dime to this amp/dac combo thing.


I guess you got the faulty unit. Why not return it and get the new unit unless you don’t like the sound signature at all.


----------



## adriansticoid

adriansticoid said:


> Got my RU6 a few days ago. Is it normal that there is a bit of a static noise on the left side when a new song starts? I'm using Hiby.


So I was speaking with John from Cayin and we have found the issue. Normally, I set my USB DAC to maximum volume (whenever possible) and I control the volume through my phone. That's just how I prefer it and this is how I do it with my FiiO KA3 without issues (the KA3 doesn't have a physical volume control but it does have hardware volume control through the FiiO Connect app).  Now with the RU6, if I set the volume to 90-100, that is when the static noises come up. If I set my phone to maximum volume and set the RU6 to my listening levels, around 30-60 depending on the gear plugged in, that noise is gone and the background is really, really clear. I do hope that Cayin can fix this through a firmware update.


----------



## Haden2866

Goofyboy84 said:


> No wonder it got soooooooo so hot to the touch… I’ll call musictek tomorrow and see about returning for a full refund. I’ll do a desktop amp at this point… as this is hardly portable in the first place. I’m sorry it came to this… but… here we are. I refuse to throw another single dime to this amp/dac combo thing.


With respect, why not request a replacement from Musictek under manufacturers warranty, as has been suggested several times, since your unit is faulty?


----------



## twister6

Goofyboy84 said:


> No wonder it got soooooooo so hot to the touch… I’ll call musictek tomorrow and see about returning for a full refund. I’ll do a desktop amp at this point… as this is hardly portable in the first place. I’m sorry it came to this… but… here we are. I refuse to throw another single dime to this amp/dac combo thing.



Getting hot to the touch, is that something new?  Cause I don't remember you mentioning that before when you were daisy-chaining and switching between all those splitters, adapters, cables.  If it is overheating now, then you are right, you probably shorted something.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

yfei said:


> Few words about RU6,    vs LG V60,   W2,   Dragonfly Cobalt,  Mojo.       Using 64 Audio U12 IEM.
> (For LG V60,  I use UAPP, and turn on 'RAW' of HiRes driver flags.  This will by-pass the 3 LG HiFi filter settings.  I feel its result is similar to set RU6 to NOS mode)
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for doing the comparison.   What is the LG V60?    Is that a smartphone?    The DAP in your picture looks like a HIby R3 Pro.


----------



## blotmouse

Haden2866 said:


> With respect, why not request a replacement from Musictek under manufacturers warranty, as has been suggested several times, since your unit is faulty?


Naw, easier to flame a single possibly faulty unit that may or may not have been damaged by a ludicrous daisy chaining of cheap adapters with known fragility, like the Apple adapters I need to replace due to shorts 4 times a year.


----------



## peterinvan

adriansticoid said:


> So I was speaking with John from Cayin and we have found the issue. Normally, I set my USB DAC to maximum volume (whenever possible) and I control the volume through my phone. That's just how I prefer it and this is how I do it with my FiiO KA3 without issues (the KA3 doesn't have a physical volume control but it does have hardware volume control through the FiiO Connect app).  Now with the RU6, if I set the volume to 90-100, that is when the static noises come up. If I set my phone to maximum volume and set the RU6 to my listening levels, around 30-60 depending on the gear plugged in, that noise is gone and the background is really, really clear. I do hope that Cayin can fix this through a firmware update.


The RU6 user instructions clearly ask you to set the USB source device (phone or computer) to max volume and to control the volume by the RU6 buttons.  This is design feature that suits the R2R DAC, and not something that needs to be "fixed".
With my iPad pro I find that the iPad volume has no effect (so long as it is not muted).


----------



## F208Frank

Who those who tried both w2 and ru6. Which do you prefer and why?

Thanks in advance!


----------



## OspreyAndy

F208Frank said:


> Who those who tried both w2 and ru6. Which do you prefer and why?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


W2 is treasured for being slightly more resolving than most Dongles, but it suffered from lack of power which is lower than the manufacturer suggested. Keep it driving something already very sensitive and it is flawless. RU6, the X factor for it is that RU6 is among the very few Dongles that has analogue sound which I consider as realistic. It is as resolving as it can be and most importantly it has the power to emit an output that is rich in density and textures. Even when subjected to driving 600 Ohm Beyerdynamic DT880, RU6 was able to match the output of iFi ZEN Stack of ZEN DAC V2 + ZEN Can at approx 90%, losing only on absolute headroom staging and Mids density due to less power (2 Vrms) as opposed to ZEN stack 15.1 Vrms. At the mark of over 40 Ohm, W2 will start to sound lean and sometimes slightly dry, but not RU6. So it depends on your needs, driving super sensitive IEMs that are already very efficient and technical, W2 would appear suitable. But in the bigger picture RU6 is simply superior in many aspect and a better value overall. Yes I owned both and have tested them very extensively with all sort of pairing partners


----------



## F208Frank (Feb 24, 2022)

OspreyAndy said:


> W2 is treasured for being slightly more resolving than most Dongles, but it suffered from lack of power which is lower than the manufacturer suggested. Keep it driving something already very sensitive and it is flawless. RU6, the X factor for it is that RU6 is among the very few Dongles that has analogue sound which I consider as realistic. It is as resolving as it can be and most importantly it has the power to emit an output that is rich in density and textures. Even when subjected to driving 600 Ohm Beyerdynamic DT880, RU6 was able to match the output of iFi ZEN Stack of ZEN DAC V2 + ZEN Can at approx 90%, losing only on absolute headroom staging and Mids density due to less power (2 Vrms) as opposed to ZEN stack 15.1 Vrms. At the mark of over 40 Ohm, W2 will start to sound lean and sometimes slightly dry, but not RU6. So it depends on your needs, driving super sensitive IEMs that are already very efficient and technical, W2 would appear suitable. But in the bigger picture RU6 is simply superior in many aspect and a better value overall. Yes I owned both and have tested them very extensively with all sort of pairing partners


Since W2 is more resolving if I am only using IEMs, would you lean towards w2 or still would consider the ru6? I specifically have the a18t/u18t, are those considered sensitive iems? I do not even know.


----------



## kadinh

F208Frank said:


> Since W2 is more resolving if I am only using IEMs, would you lean towards w2 or still would consider the ru6? I specifically have the a18t/u18t, are those considered sensitive iems? I do not even know.


out of the 100+ dongles andy has rated, the RU6 is #2 overall. the W2 is not even in the top 10.


----------



## F208Frank

I did see that yes, but I did not want to rely on just one reviewer. He must be really highly regarded for you to point that out.

I generally enjoy gathering multiple perspectives, but noted and thanks!


----------



## OspreyAndy

F208Frank said:


> Since W2 is more resolving if I am only using IEMs, would you lean towards w2 or still would consider the ru6? I specifically have the a18t/u18t, are those considered sensitive iems? I do not even know.


Not for me to decide on your behalf. I merely share my findings that perhaps can give you some ideas since you asked for comparisons between W2 and RU6. And I don't know your preference in sound specifically. We all have different way of appreciating sound, to me W2 is just uninspiring when it comes to musical element compared to RU6. But if technicalities is more important to you, then W2 with highly efficient partners


----------



## Andrew_WOT

kadinh said:


> out of the 100+ dongles andy has rated, the RU6 is #2 overall. the W2 is not even in the top 10.


With Centrance DACPort HD taking the crown, why not get that instead, cheaper too?


----------



## Zachik

F208Frank said:


> I did see that yes, but I did not want to rely on just one reviewer. *He must be really highly regarded for you to point that out.*


He is, IMHO


----------



## yfei

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Thanks for doing the comparison. What is the LG V60? Is that a smartphone? The DAP in your picture looks like a HIby R3 Pro.


Yes, DAP is HiBy R3.   The photo was taken by LG V60 phone, so it is not in the picture.    And I didn't compare HiBy R3, I use it's COAX out to drive Mojo.


----------



## ClieOS

OspreyAndy said:


> W2 is treasured for being slightly more resolving than most Dongles, but it suffered from lack of power which is lower than the manufacturer suggested....


I disagree. Besides actual listening, I measured both W2 and RU6 (under load) myself, and I have seen Audio Precision measurements of both that correspond to my own measurement - did not find W2 to lack power compared to RU6.


----------



## lfgoodsound

guys, anybody tried ru6 with another usb cable?i heard sound changes a LOT, cuz stock cable is really slow quality


----------



## alota

lfgoodsound said:


> guys, anybody tried ru6 with another usb cable?i heard sound changes a LOT, cuz stock cable is really slow quality


I bought one. I'll try this weekend


----------



## oldkid

lfgoodsound said:


> guys, anybody tried ru6 with another usb cable?i heard sound changes a LOT, cuz stock cable is really slow quality


I have just bought this FiiO shielded cable from my local Hi-Fi retailer today:
https://www.son-video.com/article/accessoires-cables-informatiques-cables-usb/fiio/lt-tc1

I'm happy to announce that it seems to completely solve the EMI noise problem.

But on the other hand, Cayin should definitely have included a good cable in the box. This DAC is made for on the go listening after all.


----------



## peterinvan

lfgoodsound said:


> guys, anybody tried ru6 with another usb cable?i heard sound changes a LOT, cuz stock cable is really slow quality


I tried the USB-C charging cable from my iPad Pro.  No noticeable sound difference.
I have abused the stock cable, bending a lot it during use.  No problems so far.


----------



## TooPoorForHiFi (Feb 25, 2022)

Question, Are the Volume control separate when using the RU6 with PC? or is it Linked with Windows Volume?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

TooPoorForHiFi said:


> Question, Are the Volume control separate when using the RU6 with PC? or is it Linked with Windows Volume?


Volume control is not linked to the source device.


----------



## MEBooBEM

lfgoodsound said:


> guys, anybody tried ru6 with another usb cable?i heard sound changes a LOT, cuz stock cable is really slow quality


I heard sound changes too. For me the Oehlbach Evolution CC cable sounds the best. Connection: mobile phone with HiBy Musik App - USB CC - Cayin RU6- Sony ier z1r balanced.


----------



## alota

MEBooBEM said:


> I heard sound changes too. For me the Oehlbach Evolution CC cable sounds the best. Connection: mobile phone with HiBy Musik App - USB CC - Cayin RU6- Sony ier z1r balanced.


In portugal i found this cable for 120 euros. Insane price


----------



## MEBooBEM

alota said:


> In portugal i found this cable for 120 euros. Insane price


I only paid 48 € here for 50 cm.


----------



## Andrew_WOT

MEBooBEM said:


> I only paid 48 € here for 50 cm.


I ONLY paid 48 € for a USB cable. LOL.


----------



## alota

MEBooBEM said:


> I only paid 48 € here for 50 cm.


Where please?


----------



## MEBooBEM

alota said:


> Where please?


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...EQFnoECCsQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2x4IefLgB93uVPY150GAPt


----------



## justanut

I bought USB cables from here on recommendations from others. Works like a charm and very well built.


----------



## twister6

justanut said:


> I bought USB cables from here on recommendations from others. Works like a charm and very well built.


I'll 2nd that, OE Audio usb otg cables have one of the best build quality, very well engineered IC.


----------



## 111MilesToGo

justanut said:


> I bought USB cables from here on recommendations from others. Works like a charm and very well built.





twister6 said:


> I'll 2nd that, OE Audio usb otg cables have one of the best build quality, very well engineered IC.


… and, according to their website, they have a couple of distributors around the world. Even in a sort of ”under-developed“ HiFi country like Germany.


----------



## keenears

Where does one acquire a replacement adhesive magnet disc? I had two that came with my orange RU6 case and put one on my iPad and one on my iPhone. Inserting and removing my phone from its case wore the leatherette off of the magnet.


----------



## Andykong (Feb 28, 2022)

keenears said:


> Where does one acquire a replacement adhesive magnet disc? I had two that came with my orange RU6 case and put one on my iPad and one on my iPhone. Inserting and removing my phone from its case wore the leatherette off of the magnet.



Something like *THIS  *(or this) should work. I hope you find them in smalle quantity.


----------



## kadinh

justanut said:


> I bought USB cables from here on recommendations from others. Works like a charm and very well built.


I'll have to check those out


----------



## rwelles (Mar 1, 2022)

I really love the sound of the RU2 RU6. So much so that I purchased an RS6. However, I find that I don't use at all these days. I need to be able to control the volume from the source. That doesn't mean it's a bad product by any stretch; just not suitable for my specific use case.

I'm going to sell it with an unused blue case for 220USD (including shipping to cont. US). It is in excellent condition. Unfortunately I'm not able to find the original USB C>A adapter so I'm including the one from my LP W2.

If you're interested in a much loved, but little used RU2 RU6, shoot me a pm.


[edit: corrected model number]


----------



## Currawong

kadinh said:


> out of the 100+ dongles andy has rated, the RU6 is #2 overall. the W2 is not even in the top 10.


I have both the W2-131 and RU6 here and both are great. There's a difference in their sound, obviously, but I wouldn't describe the differences so dramatically.  I suppose that the R2R NOS sound was more of a big deal for him than it is others.


----------



## kadinh

Currawong said:


> I have both the W2-131 and RU6 here and both are great. There's a difference in their sound, obviously, but I wouldn't describe the differences so dramatically.  I suppose that the R2R NOS sound was more of a big deal for him than it is others.


out of all the dongles i would buy, the OG W2 would be the other one i would check out. i would still like to hear one and compare to the RU6.


----------



## oldkid

The dreaded EMI noise problem is still not solved even with my new FiiO shielded cable. It is less prominent though. But when carrying the RU6 and my phone in the same pocket, it will inevitably happen.

The RU6 shielding if it exists at all is really really bad.

This is still one of the best sounding dongle DACs in the World but if I had to review it now, I would give it 4 stars out of 5, because it cannot be used as intended with a phone on the go.

I will still try to get the leather case and DIY a shielding layer with aluminum foil inside of it, but there is no guarantee it will work


----------



## Johnfg465vd

oldkid said:


> The dreaded EMI noise problem is still not solved even with my new FiiO shielded cable. It is less prominent though. But when carrying the RU6 and my phone in the same pocket, it will inevitably happen.
> 
> The RU6 shielding if it exists at all is really really bad.
> 
> ...


Have you tried using some other phone with the RU6? If you still get EMI then maybe you have a faulty unit. I've experienced severe EMI with EarMen Sparrow and to some extent with Mojo but not with RU6. I'm using stock USB Cable with mine.


----------



## alota

oldkid said:


> The dreaded EMI noise problem is still not solved even with my new FiiO shielded cable. It is less prominent though. But when carrying the RU6 and my phone in the same pocket, it will inevitably happen.
> 
> The RU6 shielding if it exists at all is really really bad.
> 
> ...


Ahahah i ordered fiio cable. I have noise not in my pocket but when move in my house. I don' t know if happens when phone disconnect from wifi


----------



## cybergalaxy

alota said:


> I bought one. I'll try this weekend


Awaiting your thoughts, though usually i don't believe in cable =)


----------



## crabdog

My thoughts on the RU6 here:


----------



## alota

cybergalaxy said:


> Awaiting your thoughts, though usually i don't believe in cable =)


Me too. Tried the cable. Nothing new. Now ordered fiio cable


----------



## H T T

I just ordered an RU6. I am hoping the lightning cable holds up.


----------



## Juns

H T T said:


> I just ordered an RU6. I am hoping the lightning cable holds up.


Personally, did not work well with iPhones. iPad, it worked better.


----------



## kadinh

ive been using my RU6 with my iphone with the included usbc to usbc cable and TC28i adapter and it has worked fine.


----------



## Juns (Mar 2, 2022)

rwelles said:


> I really love the sound of the RU2. So much so that I purchased an RS6. However, I find that I don't use at all these days. I need to be able to control the volume from the source. That doesn't mean it's a bad product by any stretch; just not suitable for my specific use case.
> 
> I'm going to sell it with an unused blue case for 220USD (including shipping to cont. US). It is in excellent condition. Unfortunately I'm not able to find the original USB C>A adapter so I'm including the one from my LP W2.
> 
> If you're interested in a much loved, but little used RU2, shoot me a pm.


I'm the opposite. Now I have RU6, I'm planning on selling my RS6. My only complaint with RU2 is that it drains phone battery very fast.


----------



## kadinh

Juns said:


> I'm the opposite. Now I have RU2, I'm planning on selling my RS6. My only complaint with RU2 is that it drains phone battery very fast.


what is the RU2?


----------



## rwelles

kadinh said:


> what is the RU2?


@kadinh thanks for pointing out my error. I've corrected my post.


----------



## justanut

oldkid said:


> The dreaded EMI noise problem is still not solved even with my new FiiO shielded cable. It is less prominent though. But when carrying the RU6 and my phone in the same pocket, it will inevitably happen.
> 
> The RU6 shielding if it exists at all is really really bad.
> 
> ...


I use the RU6 with my iPhone when I’m commuting.. no EMI detected so far.. 

Another possible reason could be your headphone cables.. if they are properly built and shielded?


----------



## alota (Mar 2, 2022)

Received today from fiio.de  From dimensions seems similar to cayin cable. I will try soon
Edit: with ibasso dongles and samw phone never heard interference


----------



## kadinh

rwelles said:


> @kadinh thanks for pointing out my error. I've corrected my post.


sorry, i was just making sure i wasnt missing a new/different device. hope my post didnt come off wrong!


----------



## Juns

kadinh said:


> what is the RU2?


Corrected. Sorry.


----------



## kadinh

Juns said:


> Corrected. Sorry.


see the post above yours. i didnt mean any disrespect.


----------



## Juns

kadinh said:


> see the post above yours. i didnt mean any disrespect.


I know. I'm not taking it that way. don't worry.


----------



## alota

Tried fiio cable. Same thing of cayin cable. So save your money. And if i move the cable i loose the connection lol
Money on garbage


----------



## H T T (Mar 3, 2022)

Received my RU6 today. I have only been able to use it a short while. Initial impressions: this is one fantastic sounding dongle! I don't think the question or debate is to whether buy the RU6 or the W1/W2. The debate should be which one to buy first...

No EMI so far for me. I am using the Cayin lightning cable.

@MusicTeck had the unit to my door remarkably fast. Thanks, Andy!

Using iPhone 13 Pro and Apple Music

edit: spelling


----------



## alota

H T T said:


> Received my RU6 today. I have only been able to use it a short while. Initial impressions: this is one fantastic sounding dongle! I don't think the question or debate is to whether buy the RU6 or the W1/W2. The debate should be which one to buy first...
> 
> No EMI so far for me. I am using the Cayin lightining cable.
> 
> ...


Which phone or iem?


----------



## H T T (Mar 3, 2022)

alota said:


> Which phone or iem?


iPhone 13 Pro and SeeAudio Bravery. I will test other IEMs later. I am initially finding that I prefer the OS mode for the RU6. Sweet but detailed. The NOS mode sounds rather jagged, at least initially, to my ears.

What is recommended burn-in period for the RU6?

After a few hours: the RU6 pairs sublimely with the Bravery. Wonderful synergy with the two. Single ended stock cable. 

Power consumption from my iPhone is fairly significant. Anecdotally, more than L&P W1, certainly more than Paw S1.


----------



## ClieOS

These two complements each other exceptionally well: RU6 with SMABAT ST-20 Pro.


----------



## jump_man95 (Mar 4, 2022)

Andykong said:


> While we are busy working on our new flagship products, we have also devoted a lot of resource to pass down our new technologies to more affordable applications.  Our R-2R based R01 Audio Motherboards for N6ii was well-received by the Personal Audio community.  While a lot of users urged us to develop a high-end R-2R DAP with latest CPU and software technologies, our priority is to make the R-2R technologies we developed for N6ii more widely available before we move to another high-end R-2R DAP.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Super exciting to see a portable r2r DAC option in the market now. I'm just wondering, you talk a lot about the limitations imposed by the form factor of a dongle DAC. I have to ask, is there much of a chance Cayin would release a larger portable r2r DAC/Amp in the future? Something around the size of the ifi Gryphon or so? I'd buy that.


----------



## yfei (Mar 5, 2022)

jump_man95 said:


> Super exciting to see a portable r2r DAC option in the market now. I'm just wondering, you talk a lot about the limitations imposed by the form factor of a dongle DAC. I have to ask, is there much of a chance Cayin would release a larger portable r2r DAC/Amp in the future? Something around the size of the ifi Gryphon or so? I'd buy that.


Me too,   I don't mind the dongle's size being larger.       E.g. the size of Mojo, HiBy R3 is fine.    
For me, from usability point of view, the smaller dongle size (like Dragonfly, W2, RU6) has no advantage,   I use them the same way as I use Mojo:  

either
1)  place both phone and DAC on the office desk,   or 2) use a rubber band to bound my phone and DAC together and put in my pocket, and use it outdoors,  or  3) put them on my bed, and go to sleep with music.
for these use cases,   small dongle and mid-size dac (mojo, hiby r3) has no difference at all.

For me, Hugo is a different category.  It's too large, not portable.


----------



## Andykong

jump_man95 said:


> Super exciting to see a portable r2r DAC option in the market now. I'm just wondering, you talk a lot about the limitations imposed by the form factor of a dongle DAC. I have to ask, is there much of a chance Cayin would release a larger portable r2r DAC/Amp in the future? Something around the size of the ifi Gryphon or so? I'd buy that.



Normally we don't dicuss our future plan with users, we had a lot of bad expereince (mainly in China forums) when our words were taken out of context and spread out to a lot of platforms, cauing a lot of disturb and inconvenient to our dealers, but I believe our previous discussion (*HERE*) has explained Cayin's position clearly.

Cayin cannot be the only company responsible to push the R-2R technologies "horizontally" and drive down the cost of R-2R products.  Its about time for us to deploy this technologies to our other product range "vertically".  If low cost R-2R implemenation is the goal and interest of the personal audio community, its time to involve everyone for that matters.


----------



## LostnAmerica

twister6 said:


> I'll 2nd that, OE Audio usb otg cables have one of the best build quality, very well engineered IC.


On the recommendation of several, I ordered one also...   Thx Twister6 your comment put me into I want to purchase category, and I did.  
Cheers


----------



## LostnAmerica (Mar 5, 2022)

I just found one (gently used) and the sound is uncanny (in a good way), as the only headphones/iems I have with me now are the Opera Factory Jr OS1-Pro, ($25).  And I ill say that the sound is incredible from my 12" MacBook  and iTunes (24/88.2 AIFF).  Yeah, I know, I have to go with what I have on hand


----------



## LostnAmerica

oldkid said:


> The dreaded EMI noise problem is still not solved even with my new FiiO shielded cable. It is less prominent though. But when carrying the RU6 and my phone in the same pocket, it will inevitably happen.
> 
> The RU6 shielding if it exists at all is really really bad.
> 
> ...


Greetings,  I've only had this dac/dongle for a few days and hooked up to my MacBook with zero EMI issues.  I agree, the Sound is really pleasing,  I've ordered the cable for my iPhone xR (see post #2131), and then I'll check it out... Hopefully this will work, but knowing the apple "system" who knows.
Cheers


----------



## alota

LostnAmerica said:


> Greetings,  I've only had this dac/dongle for a few days and hooked up to my MacBook with zero EMI issues.  I agree, the Sound is really pleasing,  I've ordered the cable for my iPhone xR (see post #2131), and then I'll check it out... Hopefully this will work, but knowing the apple "system" who knows.
> Cheers


Just for curiosity: whit macbook you don' t need drivers right? The volume is only in the cayin or in the mac too?


----------



## blotmouse

alota said:


> Just for curiosity: whit macbook you don' t need drivers right? The volume is only in the cayin or in the mac too?


No drivers on Mac. Volume control only on RU6.


----------



## LostnAmerica (Mar 6, 2022)

alota said:


> Just for curiosity: whit macbook you don' t need drivers right? The volume is only in the cayin or in the mac too?


Correct, I have the 12" MacBook (2018?), and adjust your midi settings and iTunes at 24/88.2 sounds pretty darn good. 😉 Forgot to add, volume control is only from the dongle. Unless there is a setting to change that on he MacBook or dongle? And I don't think you need drivers.


----------



## rarewolf

twister6 said:


> I'll 2nd that, OE Audio usb otg cables have one of the best build quality, very well engineered IC.



I’ll 2nd your 2nd. The only thing I don’t like about the OE OTG cable is that it’s difficult to get a grip on its shiny chrome ends..


----------



## dakchi

I tried the 4mm jack of RU6 for the first time today. OMG, what an improvement compared to the SE output! the sound is much more dynamic. I had to lower the volume a lot to reach a listenable level. The harshness I was having sometimes with the SE output disappeared. It's like I'm having a different dongle


----------



## H T T

@Andykong   What are the chances of some different case colors? I would like forest green, burgundy, Prussian blue, or a medium brown. Thanks!


----------



## rarewolf

dakchi said:


> I tried the 4mm jack of RU6 for the first time today. OMG, what an improvement compared to the SE output! the sound is much more dynamic. I had to lower the volume a lot to reach a listenable level. The harshness I was having sometimes with the SE output disappeared. It's like I'm having a different dongle



Curious… is that true across all your IEMs?


----------



## leilei787 (Mar 7, 2022)

nm


----------



## yfei (Mar 7, 2022)

dakchi said:


> I tried the 4mm jack of RU6 for the first time today. OMG, what an improvement compared to the SE output! the sound is much more dynamic. I had to lower the volume a lot to reach a listenable level. The harshness I was having sometimes with the SE output disappeared. It's like I'm having a different dongle



I had similar experience (switching from SE to 4mm balanced, there is a big improvement in sound quality),    however later I found out it is mainly due to the difference in cable:   My 4mm balanced cable is 8 wire high quality one, while SE cable is a standard one.       Later I purchased a matching cable,   8 wire high quality SE cable made by the exact same manufacture,   this cable improved SE sound quality alot,   closed the gap between balanced and SE.

I feel that, what contribute to the difference in sound:

different IEM > different cable > different DAC > SE vs. Balanced


----------



## buggy

ClieOS said:


> These two complements each other exceptionally well: RU6 with SMABAT ST-20 Pro.



OS or NOS mode? I like the OS mode with High gain when listening some slow and emotional songs. But I feel that the OS mode makes the dongle slightly more heat than NOS mode. By the way, the SMABAT ST-20 Pro looks huge!


----------



## dakchi

yfei said:


> I had similar experience (switching from SE to 4mm balanced, there is a big improvement in sound quality),    however later I found out it is mainly due to the difference in cable:   My 4mm balanced cable is 8 wire high quality one, while SE cable is a standard one.       Later I purchased a matching cable,   8 wire high quality SE cable made by the exact same manufacture,   this cable improved SE sound quality alot,   closed the gap between balanced and SE.
> 
> I feel that, what contribute to the difference in sound:
> 
> different IEM > different cable > different DAC > SE vs. Balanced


I have used the same cable and noticed a big improvement with 4mm


----------



## leilei787

Guys, I just got a Ru6, plug into my V40 using Uapp and listening Tidal. The Ru6 telling me 96kHz. Do you guys getting higher sample rate out of cellphone? And how? 

Thanks!


----------



## alota

leilei787 said:


> Guys, I just got a Ru6, plug into my V40 using Uapp and listening Tidal. The Ru6 telling me 96kHz. Do you guys getting higher sample rate out of cellphone? And how?
> 
> Thanks!


Yes. Had same problem. When you connect you need to select uapp in exclusively mode. I have lg v50. When connect ru6 appears a message


----------



## leilei787

alota said:


> Yes. Had same problem. When you connect you need to select uapp in exclusively mode. I have lg v50. When connect ru6 appears a message


So what’s max sample do you get out UAPP? I do see 192khz coming out of Amazon HD. But I wonder if it is true 192khz, just really confused with using a phone and dangle


----------



## Andykong

If you are playing back local music stored on your mobile phone or TF card, please try to use music player app that support bit-perfect USB Audio output.  For example, UAPP, Neutron or HiByMusic.

If you are listening through streaming app, then there is a very good chance that your USB output has gone throught he internal SRC feature of your mobile phone, so in regardless of the Hi-Res servcie from Tidal or Qobuz, you'll always fixed at 48kHz or 192kHz etc.  To resolve from this, you need to find out the bit perfect setting of our streaming app, or to use streaming gateway from bit perfect player such as UAPP.


----------



## leilei787

Andykong said:


> If you are playing back local music stored on your mobile phone or TF card, please try to use music player app that support bit-perfect USB Audio output.  For example, UAPP, Neutron or HiByMusic.
> 
> If you are listening through streaming app, then there is a very good chance that your USB output has gone throught he internal SRC feature of your mobile phone, so in regardless of the Hi-Res servcie from Tidal or Qobuz, you'll always fixed at 48kHz or 192kHz etc.  To resolve from this, you need to find out the bit perfect setting of our streaming app, or to use streaming gateway from bit perfect player such as UAPP.


thanks Andy, i am using V40+ RU6 with UAPP. i can get 96khz...but i tried different setting, never seen 192Khz with streaming...i wonder if this is just the limit...my goal is to see if i can use RU6 as the dac and old phone as a streamer.


----------



## alota

leilei787 said:


> So what’s max sample do you get out UAPP? I do see 192khz coming out of Amazon HD. But I wonder if it is true 192khz, just really confused with using a phone and dangle


the max sample is the same of the output in UAPP


----------



## alota

leilei787 said:


> thanks Andy, i am using V40+ RU6 with UAPP. i can get 96khz...but i tried different setting, never seen 192Khz with streaming...i wonder if this is just the limit...my goal is to see if i can use RU6 as the dac and old phone as a streamer.


you read my first post with you? you need to use UAPP exclusively with ru6. UAPP jumps android and goes directly to RU6. i repeat one more time: when you connect ru6 to lg appears a message related with uapp. choose yes


----------



## leilei787

alota said:


> you read my first post with you? you need to use UAPP exclusively with ru6. UAPP jumps android and goes directly to RU6. i repeat one more time: when you connect ru6 to lg appears a message related with uapp. choose yes


okay, got it, thank you!!


----------



## Andykong (Mar 8, 2022)

leilei787 said:


> thanks Andy, i am using V40+ RU6 with UAPP. i can get 96khz...but i tried different setting, never seen 192Khz with streaming...i wonder if this is just the limit...my goal is to see if i can use RU6 as the dac and old phone as a streamer.



Did you enable UAPP to exclusive USB output with RU6, UAPP will still suffer from SRC in Android if you don't do that.

I don't have 384kHz music file on my mobile phone, I basically don't store anything above 24/96 on mobile, takes up too much space, and the different between 96vs384 is hardly meaning on mobile phone anyway.  I used my N3Pro DAP as source to show you how RU6  handle 352.8kHz in NOS mode.  You can download this file from 2L test bench.


----------



## Andykong

alota said:


> you read my first post with you? you need to use UAPP exclusively with ru6. UAPP jumps android and goes directly to RU6. i repeat one more time: when you connect ru6 to lg appears a message related with uapp. choose yes



To make sure everyone is on the same page, alota refer to the follow pop-up dialog box.





I don't have UAPP in my mobile phone, but it should be the same dialog, just differen App name.  

When you agree to this dialogue, the Application will gain exclusive access to Cayin RU6, when you playback from other App such as Youtube  or Tidal,  RU6 simply won't response to them. Until you unplug RU6 from your mobile phone, RU6 is exclusively assigned to this app.

If you have installed two or three app that support bit perfect USB Audio, the mobile phone will ask them one by one according to your previous usage record.  You can simply select Cancel if this is not the App you want to use in this connection, your mobile will continue to prompt the second and then the third App. until you selected OK with one app, or until you select Cancel with all bit-perfect App (which mean you are free to use any app but under SRC restriction).


----------



## alota

Andykong said:


> To make sure everyone is on the same page, alota refer to the follow pop-up dialog box.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes. Thank you. Same message. Otherwise ru6 works only at 96khz. On windows i had same experience. Need to select maxx resolution on audio settings


----------



## leilei787

alota said:


> Yes. Thank you. Same message. Otherwise ru6 works only at 96khz. On windows i had same experience. Need to select maxx resolution on audio settings


maybe i am just too stupid...i swear to god that i select OK when i plug RU6 into my phone, it is asking " Open USB audio player Pro to handle Cayin Ru6?" and i click on Yes

go into UAPP, click on Tidal, stream Master album, it shows either 88.2 khz or 96 khz. In the UAPP setting, i only changed bit perfect mode to be "ON".....maybe for streaming, it andriod can only do up to 96 khz.


----------



## blotmouse (Mar 8, 2022)

Your not stupid, you just didn't search this thread.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cayin-ru6-r-2r-usb-dongle-dac-with-head-amp.960113/page-70

edit: None of Cayin's r-2r stuff is MQA certified for hardware unfolds. Software only (which tops out at 96 kHz)


----------



## alota

leilei787 said:


> maybe i am just too stupid...i swear to god that i select OK when i plug RU6 into my phone, it is asking " Open USB audio player Pro to handle Cayin Ru6?" and i click on Yes
> 
> go into UAPP, click on Tidal, stream Master album, it shows either 88.2 khz or 96 khz. In the UAPP setting, i only changed bit perfect mode to be "ON".....maybe for streaming, it andriod can only do up to 96 khz.


In the ru6 shows 88.2 or 96 too?


----------



## leilei787

alota said:


> In the ru6 shows 88.2 or 96 too?


96....i am actually reading UAPP thread about 60 pages now....it seems for MQA, UAPP software rendering to either 88.2 or 96

i think thats the answer.


----------



## alota (Mar 8, 2022)

leilei787 said:


> 96....i am actually reading UAPP thread about 60 pages now....it seems for MQA, UAPP software rendering to either 88.2 or 96
> 
> i think thats the answer.


Really sorry but i made a mistake with your old post.i confused 96 with 48. Sorry again. Yes it is true. I had 192 only with ibasso dc05 that has mqa hardware decoding. But in the reality i heard pratically no differencies. Sorry again for my mistake


----------



## leilei787

alota said:


> Really sorry but i made a mistake with your old post.i confused 96 with 48. Sorry again. Yes it is true. I had 192 only with ibasso dc05 that has mqa hardware decoding. But in the reality i heard pratically no differencies. Sorry again for my mistake


no problem, just learning curve for me.


----------



## majo123

After thoroughly enjoying the ru6 i had the chance to pick up a n6ii Ti r01 and I have to say im very happy with the purchase.
Its definitely a clear step up and after a brief listen a/bing the ru6/ n6ii r01 I reckon the ru6 is an absolute steal. The ro1 is better at almost everything (maybe not width) but on a price performance ratio imo it's in no way 6/7 time's less performance and even though I think the ro1 is by far better and a definite keeper it also confirmed what I already thought about the little ru6.
I have never been a measurements guy and both of these put a smile on my face which is all the measurement I need.


----------



## justanut

majo123 said:


> After thoroughly enjoying the ru6 i had the chance to pick up a n6ii Ti r01 and I have to say im very happy with the purchase.
> Its definitely a clear step up and after a brief listen a/bing the ru6/ n6ii r01 I reckon the ru6 is an absolute steal. The ro1 is better at almost everything (maybe not width) but on a price performance ratio imo it's in no way 6/7 time's less performance and even though I think the ro1 is by far better and a definite keeper it also confirmed what I already thought about the little ru6.
> I have never been a measurements guy and both of these put a smile on my face which is all the measurement I need.


How different are they when RU6 in in NOS + low gain mode? Just wondering because the main differentiator is the lack of NOS in R01.


----------



## majo123

justanut said:


> How different are they when RU6 in in NOS + low gain mode? Just wondering because the main differentiator is the lack of NOS in R01.


It's a bit hard to quantify as I feel although they are similar they both have there strengths and weaknesses, first of all I prefer the ru6 in nos overall as it just sounds more natural to me, the ro1 I'm still deciding which filter I prefer (not had it long) as they do alter the sound a little.
The differences on a short comparison of about an hour are noticeable, the ro1 has better detail, better bass textures, better depth of staging, mids/vocals are some of the best I have heard on anything and it's just a much more polished sound than ru6 .
Ru6 has better width and maybe a bit better transients and comes across a slightly more open sound but I feel this is just because the r01 is more smooth.
The r01 is clearly more technically advanced but as I said in my first post the ru6 is no slouch and for the money is up there with a lot of midfi daps , I owned dx160 and for sheer enjoyment I would take the ru6.
This my opinion others may differ.


----------



## justanut

majo123 said:


> It's a bit hard to quantify as I feel although they are similar they both have there strengths and weaknesses, first of all I prefer the ru6 in nos overall as it just sounds more natural to me, the ro1 I'm still deciding which filter I prefer (not had it long) as they do alter the sound a little.
> The differences on a short comparison of about an hour are noticeable, the ro1 has better detail, better bass textures, better depth of staging, mids/vocals are some of the best I have heard on anything and it's just a much more polished sound than ru6 .
> Ru6 has better width and maybe a bit better transients and comes across a slightly more open sound but I feel this is just because the r01 is more smooth.
> The r01 is clearly more technically advanced but as I said in my first post the ru6 is no slouch and for the money is up there with a lot of midfi daps , I owned dx160 and for sheer enjoyment I would take the ru6.
> This my opinion others may differ.


Do share your updated impressions once you've had more time with them! I have an opportunity to purchase a N6ii TI at a very good price now so I'm a little tempted to up the portable R2R game.


----------



## majo123

justanut said:


> Do share your updated impressions once you've had more time with them! I have an opportunity to purchase a N6ii TI at a very good price now so I'm a little tempted to up the portable R2R game.


Ok will do


----------



## russsellsthings

Just purchased a RU6 and am absolutely loving it! Just noticed an odd quirk and was wondering if anyone had a similar experience or if I have a defective unit? I purchased from a dealer so would be able to return it if I needed to.

I have noted that when I crank the volume on my RU6, it starts to clip whenever I'm playing a bass heavy track. For acoustic or vocal tracks, no clipping occurs. It only happens with heavy bass notes and it sounds like stuttering / pauses in the track. I only notice this when running the RU6 at High gain at Volume 70 or Low gain at volume 76. When running OS mode, it clips at a lower volume level (65) but in NOS mode, it clips at a higher volume level (70s). Also, when running the ru6 off my macbook at similar levels, there is no clipping. I wouldn't say I listen at these levels to protect my hearing, but I just wanted to push it a bit and noticed this issue.

I have a feeling this is a power draw issue from my iPhone 13 pro using a Penon Lightning to USB-C cable as it gets worse when I push the volume louder, and then gets better when I push the volume softer. It also is better when using single ended because the power draw is lower.

The rest of the chain: Tidal Masters / Tidal HiFi --> iPhone 13 pro --> Penon Lightning to USB-C cable --> RU6 --> 4.4mm to Meze Liric.

I am debating purchasing the official Cayin Lightning to USB-C cable CS-L2C to see if that makes a difference. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!!!


----------



## Andykong (Mar 11, 2022)

russsellsthings said:


> Just purchased a RU6 and am absolutely loving it! Just noticed an odd quirk and was wondering if anyone had a similar experience or if I have a defective unit? I purchased from a dealer so would be able to return it if I needed to.
> 
> I have noted that when I crank the volume on my RU6, it starts to clip whenever I'm playing a bass heavy track. For acoustic or vocal tracks, no clipping occurs. It only happens with heavy bass notes and it sounds like stuttering / pauses in the track. I only notice this when running the RU6 at High gain at Volume 70 or Low gain at volume 76. When running OS mode, it clips at a lower volume level (65) but in NOS mode, it clips at a higher volume level (70s). Also, when running the ru6 off my macbook at similar levels, there is no clipping. I wouldn't say I listen at these levels to protect my hearing, but I just wanted to push it a bit and noticed this issue.
> 
> ...



Most likely you are hitting the limit of your iphone power supply to external device.  Based on the observation from other iphone users, iOS will limit the output to 120mA, when compare to 1000mA from standard USB 3.0 Type C connection of your notebook.  You can check with Penon on the specification of your Lightning to USB-C cable. It the cable support up to 5V already, changing to Cayin CS-L2C is not going to help.

For the record, I have tried RU6 with Liric using my Samsung Android phone as soruce, I can get a stable playback at NOS high gain 70.


----------



## rarewolf

Andykong said:


> Most likely you are hitting the limit of your iphone power supply to external device.  Based on the observation from other iphone users, iOS will limit the output to 120mA, when compare to 1000mA from standard USB 3.0 Type C connection of your notebook.  You can check with Penon on the specification of your Lightning to USB-C cable. It the cable support up to 5V already, changing to Cayin CS-L2C is not going to help.
> 
> For the record, I have tried RU6 with Liric using my Samsung Android phone as soruce, I can get a stable playback at NOS high gain 70.



Is the 1000mA USB-C spec also true for the Apple connectors on iPads? I ask because the only reason Apple has given for governing its lightning connector is to save its battery, which would logically carry over to iPads(?)


----------



## russsellsthings

Andykong said:


> Most likely you are hitting the limit of your iphone power supply to external device.  Based on the observation from other iphone users, iOS will limit the output to 120mA, when compare to 1000mA from standard USB 3.0 Type C connection of your notebook.  You can check with Penon on the specification of your Lightning to USB-C cable. It the cable support up to 5V already, changing to Cayin CS-L2C is not going to help.
> 
> For the record, I have tried RU6 with Liric using my Samsung Android phone as soruce, I can get a stable playback at NOS high gain 70.


Thanks so much Andy! I reached out to Cayin support and they said the same thing!

Would using the Apple Lightning to USB A adapter help (and adding the Cayin USB A to USB C converter)? I am guessing not if the problem is with the iPhone output itself!


----------



## justanut (Mar 11, 2022)

russsellsthings said:


> Thanks so much Andy! I reached out to Cayin support and they said the same thing!
> 
> Would using the Apple Lightning to USB A adapter help (and adding the Cayin USB A to USB C converter)? I am guessing not if the problem is with the iPhone output itself!


No clipping with volume at 85, driving my 800S…

*Edit* I’ve just played an entire track at 100… no clipping, skipping or any other artefacts… I would suggest first checking your cable, then your RU6. I've also not faced any power issues with the L&P W2 previously out of an iPhone.


----------



## alota

russsellsthings said:


> Thanks so much Andy! I reached out to Cayin support and they said the same thing!
> 
> Would using the Apple Lightning to USB A adapter help (and adding the Cayin USB A to USB C converter)? I am guessing not if the problem is with the iPhone output itself!


i wrote in another post that a friend of mine had same issue with headphone connected and iphone like source. with windows no problems at all


----------



## Garney

I too run into clipping when using my iPhone 12 Pro Max at volumes above ~50 (low gain). I never really listen that high volume-wise so it's a non-issue for me. I'm using the ddHiFi MFi06 Lightning to USB-C cable. 

Zero issues with clipping at any volume when playing from my HP laptop via USB-A to USB-C.


----------



## Andykong

russsellsthings said:


> Thanks so much Andy! I reached out to Cayin support and they said the same thing!
> 
> Would using the Apple Lightning to USB A adapter help (and adding the Cayin USB A to USB C converter)? I am guessing not if the problem is with the iPhone output itself!



It won't help because  the bottleneck is not on the cable, changing to lightning to USB A won't solve the bottleneck.


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> Is the 1000mA USB-C spec also true for the Apple connectors on iPads? I ask because the only reason Apple has given for governing its lightning connector is to save its battery, which would logically carry over to iPads(?)


From what I recall, other users reported both iPads and iPad Pro works fine without running into power supply limitation.


----------



## justanut

Garney said:


> I too run into clipping when using my iPhone 12 Pro Max at volumes above ~50 (low gain). I never really listen that high volume-wise so it's a non-issue for me. I'm using the ddHiFi MFi06 Lightning to USB-C cable.
> 
> Zero issues with clipping at any volume when playing from my HP laptop via USB-A to USB-C.


I stopped using ddHifi cables because they seemed to be the main issue in most cases. I've also owned their OTG adaptor for USB-C cables on iPhones, which had the same problems and became loose / unusable after just a month. The OEAudio cable I have display none of those limitations in my use thus far. I usually carry my iPhone in my jeans pocket with the RU6 hanging out of them just by the USB cable, with no skips or disconnects.


----------



## Garney

justanut said:


> I stopped using ddHifi cables because they seemed to be the main issue in most cases. I've also owned their OTG adaptor for USB-C cables on iPhones, which had the same problems and became loose / unusable after just a month. The OEAudio cable I have display none of those limitations in my use thus far. I usually carry my iPhone in my jeans pocket with the RU6 hanging out of them just by the USB cable, with no skips or disconnects.


Good to know. Luckily I rarely use my iPhone as my source with the RU6. 90% of the time it's my laptop or desktop PC. Hopefully the ddHiFi cable holds up as it wasn't cheap ($30 if I recall). I'll go for an OEAudio cable next time.


----------



## H T T (Mar 11, 2022)

russsellsthings said:


> Just purchased a RU6 and am absolutely loving it! Just noticed an odd quirk and was wondering if anyone had a similar experience or if I have a defective unit? I purchased from a dealer so would be able to return it if I needed to.
> 
> I have noted that when I crank the volume on my RU6, it starts to clip whenever I'm playing a bass heavy track. For acoustic or vocal tracks, no clipping occurs. It only happens with heavy bass notes and it sounds like stuttering / pauses in the track. I only notice this when running the RU6 at High gain at Volume 70 or Low gain at volume 76. When running OS mode, it clips at a lower volume level (65) but in NOS mode, it clips at a higher volume level (70s). Also, when running the ru6 off my macbook at similar levels, there is no clipping. I wouldn't say I listen at these levels to protect my hearing, but I just wanted to push it a bit and noticed this issue.
> 
> ...


I have not had my RU6 more than a couple weeks. So, take this with a grain of salt. I am running iPhone 13 Pro->Cayin USB-C to Lightning cable->RU6 in low gain OS mode->SeeAudio Bravery/Penon Globe in SE or Penon Serial in 4.4 "balanced". I have not, as of yet, had clipping. I don't run my volume higher than 60 though.


----------



## russsellsthings

justanut said:


> No clipping with volume at 85, driving my 800S…
> 
> *Edit* I’ve just played an entire track at 100… no clipping, skipping or any other artefacts… I would suggest first checking your cable, then your RU6. I've also not faced any power issues with the L&P W2 previously out of an iPhone.


Thanks for checking on this for me! I can infer based on your picture... but you are running high gain NOS and 4.4mm output? Do you mind trying with High Gain OS and 4.4mm output?


----------



## russsellsthings

Andykong said:


> It won't help because  the bottleneck is not on the cable, changing to lightning to USB A won't solve the bottleneck.


I had too much time on my hands and I borrowed a Apple Lightning to USB Camera Adapter and used the Cayin USB A to USB C adapter, then used the Cayin USB C- USBC cable. I can say the stuttering playback is actually worse using this method sadly. Now I get clipping when using NOS mode, High gain, and volume of 75, but only with bass heavy music. No real issues with playing my usual jazz/acoustic. 

Thanks to everyone for their replies! It looks like this is primarily an iPhone mV output problem, not a problem with the RU6, nor with my Penon cable. I guess the question is: just because I never listen to music at that high of a volume.... does knowing it has this behaviour bother me enough to use a different dongle? More Diana Krall I guess and less The Weeknd as I really love the sound of the RU6!


----------



## russsellsthings

justanut said:


> No clipping with volume at 85, driving my 800S…
> 
> *Edit* I’ve just played an entire track at 100… no clipping, skipping or any other artefacts… I would suggest first checking your cable, then your RU6. I've also not faced any power issues with the L&P W2 previously out of an iPhone.


Sorry, a follow up question: is that an OEAudio Lightning to USB C OTG cable? (https://oeaudio.shop/products/oeotg-digital-cable?variant=40577134624821 )


----------



## kadinh (Mar 11, 2022)

russsellsthings said:


> Sorry, a follow up question: is that an OEAudio Lightning to USB C OTG cable? (https://oeaudio.shop/products/oeotg-digital-cable?variant=40577134624821 )


i would guess yes, it is. im about to order one right now.

Edit: ordered


----------



## TYATYA

Iphone lacking power while android supply tone of power.
Two time I forgot to turn down so ru6 was at full volume when this low impedance high sensivity toy on my ears.

Btw IT00* with ru6 is compact for everyday carying.

* a bloat bass iem but sounds so good with wavelet or NeutronMp AutoEq  + remove metal mesh (dust cover)


----------



## justanut

kadinh said:


> i would guess yes, it is. im about to order one right now.
> 
> Edit: ordered


Sorry for late reply. Yup it is. Awesome!


----------



## yaps66

russsellsthings said:


> Thanks for checking on this for me! I can infer based on your picture... but you are running high gain NOS and 4.4mm output? Do you mind trying with High Gain OS and 4.4mm output?


This is my setup:

Listening to Lingus -  Snarky Puppy over Roon on my iPhone 11Pro Max attached to the RU6 using the Cayin lightening to USB C cable on high gain NOS

Listening on the Thie Audio Legacy 5 it clips at vol 55

Listening on the Tri Starshine and there is no clipping at vol 75. It starts to clip at volume 80 (about 90% of the time). It clips more at vol 85 (about 60% of the time).

Hope this helps!


----------



## alota (Mar 12, 2022)

I made a big big big mistake with fiio usb-c. Really sorry to Fiio. This cable has direction and side. But is really really sensible to position. No interference at all but if i move the cable i lost the sound
Edit now is died. Probably defective unit. Amen


----------



## oldkid

alota said:


> I made a big big big mistake with fiio usb-c. Really sorry to Fiio. This cable has direction and side. But is really really sensible to position. No interference at all but if i move the cable i lost the sound
> Edit now is died. Probably defective unit. Amen


I have the same cable and it is working as intended. 
I have also bought the Cayin leather case but I have never used it. The EMI noise problem is now completely solved by keeping my phone and the RU6 as far from each other as possible while using the FiiO cable


----------



## dakchi

I played master quality songs in Tidal through my iPhone and had randomly sound cuts. When I changed the setting to NOS, it was fixed. Does it mean that we cannot listen to master quality music in OS mode?


----------



## alota

oldkid said:


> I have the same cable and it is working as intended.
> I have also bought the Cayin leather case but I have never used it. The EMI noise problem is now completely solved by keeping my phone and the RU6 as far from each other as possible while using the FiiO cable


Yes works perfectly. But my unit was defective and now died. No signal only power


----------



## dakchi

What I am experiencing with my RU6 is very weird: when I go out and I play music in Tidal with OS through 4G, I get sound cuts every 2s. It is not listenable at all. When I switch to NOS, I have no problem at all. When I play music in Tidal with either NOS or OS at home, I have no problem of sound cuts through wifi and 4G. I cannot explain this. Is anyone having the same problem?


----------



## rarewolf

dakchi said:


> What I am experiencing with my RU6 is very weird: when I go out and I play music in Tidal with OS through 4G, I get sound cuts every 2s. It is not listenable at all. When I switch to NOS, I have no problem at all. When I play music in Tidal with either NOS or OS at home, I have no problem of sound cuts through wifi and 4G. I cannot explain this. Is anyone having the same problem?



I’m not sure what it may have to do with NOS v OS, but you should try to rule out poor 4G reception, home v out&about, because variable cellular reception does exist…


----------



## dakchi

rarewolf said:


> I’m not sure what it may have to do with NOS v OS, but you should try to rule out poor 4G reception, home v out&about, because variable cellular reception does exist…


Well, normally 4G reception outside should be better than at home. Even though, why I don't have this issue when I switch to NOS?


----------



## rarewolf

dakchi said:


> Well, normally 4G reception outside should be better than at home. Even though, why I don't have this issue when I switch to NOS?



Most of us here are confused with NOS. That is, why does “not doing something” actually act like it is “doing something”?


----------



## russsellsthings

dakchi said:


> What I am experiencing with my RU6 is very weird: when I go out and I play music in Tidal with OS through 4G, I get sound cuts every 2s. It is not listenable at all. When I switch to NOS, I have no problem at all. When I play music in Tidal with either NOS or OS at home, I have no problem of sound cuts through wifi and 4G. I cannot explain this. Is anyone having the same problem?


I suspect this is an issue similar to the one I have been having with the iPhone maximum power output over lightning. I am not 100% sure but I feel like OS uses more power and NOS uses less power. Thus, when I was having clipping issues when playing Tidal Masters using my iPhone, it would always happen more frequently in OS mode than in NOS mode. As an example, when I play a bass heavy track on Tidal (The Weeknd - Starboy) using my iPhone, I could induce clipping in OS mode in High Gain at a volume of 60, but in NOS mode, I could induce clipping in NOS mode at High Gain at a volume of 74. 

Try playing with the volume settings, playing with the Gain and maybe you'll find you have a similar issue. 

As an aside, Penon Audio informed me that their Lightning - USB C cable is 5V and 200mAh so it shouldn't be the issue. Butttt I splurged and bought the OEAudio OTG cable that many have recommended. Will update the group when it arrives and see if this resolves my clipping problem. 

Honestly, it isn't a huge deal as I don't listen to my music that loud and the Meze Liric is quite efficient but it just sorta bugs me that I can't use the full range of the wonderful RU6!


----------



## dakchi

russsellsthings said:


> I suspect this is an issue similar to the one I have been having with the iPhone maximum power output over lightning. I am not 100% sure but I feel like OS uses more power and NOS uses less power. Thus, when I was having clipping issues when playing Tidal Masters using my iPhone, it would always happen more frequently in OS mode than in NOS mode. As an example, when I play a bass heavy track on Tidal (The Weeknd - Starboy) using my iPhone, I could induce clipping in OS mode in High Gain at a volume of 60, but in NOS mode, I could induce clipping in NOS mode at High Gain at a volume of 74.
> 
> Try playing with the volume settings, playing with the Gain and maybe you'll find you have a similar issue.
> 
> ...


I doubt it is the same issue because I was listening at volume 40 with low gain but on 4mm output. What I don't understand is why I have this issue only when I am outside using 4G and with OS. I don't have it at home even when I am on 4G
I have OEAudio OTG cable. It is good and well isolated. You should be satisfied with it although it is an expensive cable


----------



## majo123

justanut said:


> Do share your updated impressions once you've had more time with them! I have an opportunity to purchase a N6ii TI at a very good price now so I'm a little tempted to up the portable R2R game.


Ok after owning the n6ii Ti r01 for a few days I can honestly say it's a very clear step up from ru6, I still stand by what I said about the ru6 it's as good as many mid fi daps and a very musical, great portable source that represents a lot of what the ro1 has to offer and a fantastic buy imo, I still will use my ru6 on a regular basis as it's just so convenient on the go and better than carrying a mid fi dap about.
 If you like the ru6 and can go to the n6ii ro1 then I wouldn't hesitate as the audio is truly stunning and a big step up IMO. Better imaging staging,  layering, micro details , bass textures, depth of field and in all honesty probably the best audio I have owned period! vocals, overall textures, staging placement are stunning! The more I listen the more I appreciate how technical the ro1 actually is and definitely up there when it comes to fidelity.
The n6ii maybe a couple of years old and there are faster, lighter, more advanced featured daps now and for on the go use then maybe not but I would wager audio wise it still kills most.
A fantastic purchase and I couldn't be more happy with it.
 For anyone else reading this the ru6 got me here!


----------



## kadinh

Seems like the RU6 doesn’t have enough juice to power the IER Z1R. The Qudelix 5K seems to sound more open and dynamic…

:-/


----------



## justanut

kadinh said:


> Seems like the RU6 doesn’t have enough juice to power the IER Z1R. The Qudelix 5K seems to sound more open and dynamic…
> 
> :-/


Hmmm... the IE900 too is a monster that takes loads of power to drive to its potential. I do find them enjoyable on the RU6 though. Could it be the R2R that you're not yet attuned to? Takes a while for your brain to start registering the differences~


----------



## kadinh

justanut said:


> Hmmm... the IE900 too is a monster that takes loads of power to drive to its potential. I do find them enjoyable on the RU6 though. Could it be the R2R that you're not yet attuned to? Takes a while for your brain to start registering the differences~


very possible


----------



## dakchi

Quick update regarding my clipping issue with my RU6: it is indeed fixed by decreasing the volume. What is weird is that I listen to music at a volume lower than 50 using OS and 4mm output. As soon as I set the volume at 47, the clipping starts. If I was using hard to drive headphones at a high volume, I would have understood to have clipping, but I am listening to easy to drive IEM at a volume of 47 and I already get clipping!!! this is a very very annoying limitation. It means that RU6 drains a lot of battery even at low volume
I had the same issue with my Macbook, but still investigating the root cause


----------



## majo123

dakchi said:


> Quick update regarding my clipping issue with my RU6: it is indeed fixed by decreasing the volume. What is weird is that I listen to music at a volume lower than 50 using OS and 4mm output. As soon as I set the volume at 47, the clipping starts. If I was using hard to drive headphones at a high volume, I would have understood to have clipping, but I am listening to easy to drive IEM at a volume of 47 and I already get clipping!!! this is a very very annoying limitation. It means that RU6 drains a lot of battery even at low volume
> I had the same issue with my Macbook, but still investigating the root cause


I'm no expert but to me it still sounds like a power draw problem still.... possibly the more volume the more power your source will need to exert which is resulting in it clipping.
I would try it through another source like android or Windows based then at least you can rule out it's the ru6 or your source's.


----------



## majo123

Only slightly off topic.
 I have used/tried various dac amps and in my experience clipping can be caused by various causes.... recordings, cables, source, source app I have experienced clipping as a result of all of these at some point.


----------



## justanut

dakchi said:


> Quick update regarding my clipping issue with my RU6: it is indeed fixed by decreasing the volume. What is weird is that I listen to music at a volume lower than 50 using OS and 4mm output. As soon as I set the volume at 47, the clipping starts. If I was using hard to drive headphones at a high volume, I would have understood to have clipping, but I am listening to easy to drive IEM at a volume of 47 and I already get clipping!!! this is a very very annoying limitation. It means that RU6 drains a lot of battery even at low volume
> I had the same issue with my Macbook, but still investigating the root cause


Well, as I've shared in earlier posts, I would suspect the USB cable or the RU6 itself being faulty as I've not had issues with the RU6 nor the W2 driving even my 300ohm HD800S out of my iPhone at loud volumes. I even tested at 100 volume and there was no clipping for the entire song (streamed via WIFI).


----------



## dakchi

justanut said:


> Well, as I've shared in earlier posts, I would suspect the USB cable or the RU6 itself being faulty as I've not had issues with the RU6 nor the W2 driving even my 300ohm HD800S out of my iPhone at loud volumes. I even tested at 100 volume and there was no clipping for the entire song (streamed via WIFI).


I am using OEAudio cable which an excellent one. If the issue was the cable, It wouldn't have gone by decreasing the volume or switching to NOS that does not consume a lot of power


----------



## russsellsthings

dakchi said:


> I am using OEAudio cable which an excellent one. If the issue was the cable, It wouldn't have gone by decreasing the volume or switching to NOS that does not consume a lot of power


If you are having the same issue with the MacBook output, it may be the cable? AndyKong was saying above, the MacBook usbC output should be adequate to supply the ru6. In my experience, my MacBook can output give huge volumes without any clipping with my RU6 so I suspect it is either my cable (Penon lightning) or the iPhone max output itself. My OEAudio cable shipped so I’ll update everyone once I test it out!


----------



## justanut

dakchi said:


> I am using OEAudio cable which an excellent one. If the issue was the cable, It wouldn't have gone by decreasing the volume or switching to NOS that does not consume a lot of power


I'm using the same cable, but cables can have manufacturing faults as do every other product. I would suggest trying to identify where the fault is by using different cables, different devices etc. If I read correctly you are facing similar issues even when using a laptop to power it? That doesn't sound right because laptops, especially on USB-C / 3.1, have even less power draw issues.


----------



## rwelles

dakchi said:


> I am using OEAudio cable which an excellent one. If the issue was the cable, It wouldn't have gone by decreasing the volume or switching to NOS that does not consume a lot of power


I agree that it would be good to try different cables just to see if that's the root cause. It would be very useful to get a USB tester to measure the milliamps being drawn. I bought this one. The Apple spec for the iPhone accessory power limit is 100mA @ 3.2V. I'm thinking you are running into that limit. I realize that you said it didn't clip at vol. of 50 but it did at 47. The important number here is the mA draw, not the volume setting (though the two can be interrelated). HTH


----------



## dakchi

justanut said:


> I'm using the same cable, but cables can have manufacturing faults as do every other product. I would suggest trying to identify where the fault is by using different cables, different devices etc. If I read correctly you are facing similar issues even when using a laptop to power it? That doesn't sound right because laptops, especially on USB-C / 3.1, have even less power draw issues.


Guys, it is not the cable. I have used Cayin stock cable with Apple camera adapter and I have the same problem: above 47 I have clipping with my iPhone 12 Max. If I switch to NOS or decrease the volume, I have no clipping
I have clipping with my Macbook Pro M1 Pro since day 1. I noticed that when I restart my Macbook, the clipping is gone for some time and then it appears again. I don't think that Macbook has the same power limitation as iPhone


----------



## kadinh

dakchi said:


> Guys, it is not the cable. I have used Cayin stock cable with Apple camera adapter and I have the same problem: above 47 I have clipping with my iPhone 12 Max. If I switch to NOS or decrease the volume, I have no clipping
> I have clipping with my Macbook Pro M1 Pro since day 1. I noticed that when I restart my Macbook, the clipping is gone for some time and then it appears again. I don't think that Macbook has the same power limitation as iPhone


you are correct, it does not have the same limitation. you might contact the seller or Cayin to see if you can get a new one. i have the iphone 13 pro max and i usually use the RU6 with low gain, NOS, and like 60-70 volume and get no clipping


----------



## dakchi

kadinh said:


> you are correct, it does not have the same limitation. you might contact the seller or Cayin to see if you can get a new one. i have the iphone 13 pro max and i usually use the RU6 with low gain, NOS, and like 60-70 volume and get no clipping


Have you tried it with OS and 4mm output? I have no clipping with NOS


----------



## H T T

dakchi said:


> Have you tried it with OS and 4mm output? I have no clipping with NOS


I have with an iPhone 13 Pro, OS and 4.4 with a Penon Serial. I have not had any clipping. I don't go above 60.  I have had the volume stutters when adjusting volume. But, that is how it is.


----------



## oldkid

My mobile carrier has upgraded my data plan to 5G and the EMI noise problem is not a thing with a 5G connexion


----------



## kadinh (Mar 15, 2022)

dakchi said:


> Have you tried it with OS and 4mm output? I have no clipping with NOS


iPhone 13 PM + ddhifi usbc to lightning adapter + cayin usbc to usbc OEM cable + RU6 + Monarch MKII 4.4mm + OS

RU6 starts clipping at 63 volume


----------



## twister6

kadinh said:


> iPhone 13 PM + RU6 + Monarch MKII 4.4mm + OS
> 
> RU6 starts clipping at 63 volume



Can you lower RU6 volume by setting your iPhone to max volume and RU6 to max gain?  Would that help with Monarch MKII?


----------



## kadinh

twister6 said:


> Can you lower RU6 volume by setting your iPhone to max volume and RU6 to max gain?  Would that help with Monarch MKII?


i think by default, the RU6 sets the iphone volume to max anyways, so the volume on the device is auto set to max.


----------



## twister6

kadinh said:


> i think by default, the RU6 sets the iphone volume to max anyways, so the volume on the device is auto set to max.



Sorry, since I'm not iPhone user, was just curious.  On Android phones/daps, there is no default "max" volume setting unless you use HibyMusic and set exclusive HQ usb audio access with usb audio volume lock; and maybe there are other apps they do similar.  What I was getting at, if you set digital volume of your source to max and set RU6 gain to high, you won't have to push RU6 output volume at high.


----------



## kadinh

twister6 said:


> Sorry, since I'm not iPhone user, was just curious.  On Android phones/daps, there is no default "max" volume setting unless you use HibyMusic and set exclusive HQ usb audio access with usb audio volume lock; and maybe there are other apps they do similar.  What I was getting at, if you set digital volume of your source to max and set RU6 gain to high, you won't have to push RU6 output volume at high.


no worries  

tbh, listening at 60+ volume is unpleasant with the MKII; way too loud to be enjoyable.


----------



## justanut

twister6 said:


> Sorry, since I'm not iPhone user, was just curious.  On Android phones/daps, there is no default "max" volume setting unless you use HibyMusic and set exclusive HQ usb audio access with usb audio volume lock; and maybe there are other apps they do similar.  What I was getting at, if you set digital volume of your source to max and set RU6 gain to high, you won't have to push RU6 output volume at high.


iPhones transfer volume control to the connected DAC. Like a line-out. Adjusting volume on the iPhone does nothing while the RU-6 is connected.

I'm really curious why there are many complaints on clipping on iOS supposedly due to a lack of power because I've not experienced it myself, at least not with the RU-6 and the OEAudio cables. I did experience clipping with the W2 and ddHifi cables in the past, but I'm not suspecting the cable / device and not iPhones (at least not on the 13 Pro Max) in my experience.


----------



## kadinh

kadinh said:


> iPhone 13 PM + ddhifi usbc to lightning adapter + cayin usbc to usbc OEM cable + RU6 + Monarch MKII 4.4mm + OS
> 
> RU6 starts clipping at 63 volume


I edited my original post to put the cable and adapter in. i have my OEAudio cable on the way, will test when i get it in.


----------



## H T T (Mar 15, 2022)

kadinh said:


> i think by default, the RU6 sets the iphone volume to max anyways, so the volume on the device is auto set to max.


The volume automatically maxing out on the phone is what I get when I plug the RU6 into my iPhone 13 Pro.

For others, no clipping for me. I use the RU6 with IEMs (SeeAudio Bravery; Penon Serial, FAN, and Globe;  2021 Tanchjim Hana). I rarely go above 40 in low gain, OS mode.


----------



## bgillis (Mar 16, 2022)

Hi head-fiers,

Does anyone know if there are any advantages to couple Cayin RU6 with Cayin C9 ?
What are the main disadvantages ? Should double-amping be avoided at any cost ?
Should I use Cayin RU6 or Cayin C9 alone instead ? Why ?

I will mainly use this combo with my

Sennheiser HD660s,
DCA Aeon Noire,
Dunu SA6.
Thanks to you all for your input 

PS: I have posted the same questions in the Cayin C9 thread; if any one is following one or the other Cayin product thread only.


----------



## alota

More two to try amazon basic and cablecreation


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Hi there! Can anyone provide a brief comparison between RU6 and Ifi gryphon? I mean in regard of sound quality aside from the obvious difference in output power, Bluetooth functionality and price. RU6 has r2r implementation whereas gryphon has multibit dac and reviewers describe them as analog and musical sounding devices. I was wondering whether they have the similar sound signature or there are some noticeable differences?


----------



## Ichos (Mar 19, 2022)

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Hi there! Can anyone provide a brief comparison between RU6 and Ifi gryphon? I mean in regard of sound quality aside from the obvious difference in output power, Bluetooth functionality and price. RU6 has r2r implementation whereas gryphon has multibit dac and reviewers describe them as analog and musical sounding devices. I was wondering whether they have the similar sound signature or there are some noticeable differences?


It is not that simple.
The overall texture is the same by the means that both favor an analogue and organic sound signature, the RU6 a touch more.
But then the Gryphon has better technicalities, is dead silent, more refined, has increased clarity, more headroom etc.
Although not as visceral and holographic as the RU6.
If you don't mind the size the Gryphon is technically superior but the RU6 has a slightly more "tubey" character.


----------



## Ichos

Dear friends, here is my take on the RU6.

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/28176/

Very addictive and analogue sounding.

Thanks for reading.


----------



## TYATYA

I found zero difference in audio quality of 3.5 vs 4.4
A/B test, I myself switch the toggle and even through, I heard nothing difference at any means.
So I must unplug a channel of RCA to verify I did not bunco myself


----------



## TYATYA

Ichos said:


> Dear friends, here is my take on the RU6.
> 
> https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/cayin-ru6-discrete-r-2r-usb-c-dac-amp.25607/review/28176/
> 
> ...


Well writing! Thanks


----------



## TYATYA (Mar 20, 2022)

After A/B Ru6 2 output 3.5 and 4.4, I seriously try A/B Ru6 against SP1K output.

Insane? NO!

I know, I heard Ru6 by HD800S from day1 I got ru6 and found something special to draw me to the music.

@Andykong  said SP1000 wins every meaning.
I today said ru6 wins SP1000 when feeding to the amp hdvd800.
(Both bal, se, all dac filter mode in AK)

Ru6 sound liquid, wider imagine (something like adding echoing but actually not), holographic, same clarity, nothing hash.

Idk why when UAPP shows a same moment on my smp(connect to ru6) and on SP1000, output of ru6 is much sooner (apprx 2 seconds!).
(All dsp off on Ak, try all dac filter include short delay)

Ak fw1.66cm
Super Slow roll off : the most close to ru6 but still 2D, not 3D like
Short delay Slow roll off: the most use of mine for directly drives hd800s. But sound worst when feed to the amp.
Mid imagine locate and focus at center, lacking detail overal
Short delay Sharp roll off (default mode): focus mid on center, forward, clarity than other modes, but I feel harsh abit. 

Ru6 sounds something mix of Super slow roll off and Default mode but in 3D imagine.
Mid from ru6 so special! 3D, stay backward a bit, wide, realistic timbre.

Update: uapp is something wrong on AK. 
Test with Default music app of AK again and I update later


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

bgillis said:


> Should double-amping be avoided at any cost ?


This issue also interests me. Can we couple RU6 with other amplifiers via line-in?


----------



## oldkid

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> This issue also interests me. Can we couple RU6 with other amplifiers via line-in?


That's what I do when I use the RU6 with my xDuoo MT-601. It works well


----------



## Hyde00 (Mar 21, 2022)

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fiio-concept-design-from-jamesfiio.962641/#post-16874091

LOL remember a while back we talked about dongle dac with battery pack?  FiiO took a crack at it LOL.

Personally I don't need this but it's funny to see it being put into action.


----------



## Hyde00

TYATYA said:


> I found zero difference in audio quality of 3.5 vs 4.4
> A/B test, I myself switch the toggle and even through, I heard nothing difference at any means.
> So I must unplug a channel of RCA to verify I did not bunco myself


My guess is because RU6 is not technically a true balanced dac.  What I mean is that it only duplicated the signal at the last stage (stated by Cayin also there is diagram on 1st page of this thread).

So you probably get more power but otherwise identical source signal?

Other "true balanced" dongle dac split the signal earlier in the steps.  My guess is that in order to do "true balanced" they need to double the resistors which make the size limitation impossible?


----------



## justanut (Mar 21, 2022)

Hyde00 said:


> My guess is because RU6 is not technically a true balanced dac.  What I mean is that it only duplicated the signal at the last stage (stated by Cayin also there is diagram on 1st page of this thread).
> 
> So you probably get more power but otherwise identical source signal?
> 
> Other "true balanced" dongle dac split the signal earlier in the steps.  My guess is that in order to do "true balanced" they need to double the resistors which make the size limitation impossible?



Known fact, and various different people have measured SINAD differences between L/R~ It's not perfect, but it sounds good.






In particular NOS mode, even though the majority of us prefer using NOS...


----------



## Ichos

Hyde00 said:


> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fiio-concept-design-from-jamesfiio.962641/#post-16874091
> 
> LOL remember a while back we talked about dongle dac with battery pack?  FiiO took a crack at it LOL.
> 
> Personally I don't need this but it's funny to see it being put into action.


I love it, clever and innovative as long as the battery stays in place!


----------



## mattbass

Going the RU6 fan club here. Everything just sounds a little better coming from this thing: richer, fuller, weightier with better extension on both ends of the audio spectrum compared to the basic Apple dongle.

It does hammer my iPhone's battery, which is totally expected. As a non-scientific experiment, RU6 sucked roughly 20% battery charge in 50 minutes playing downloaded Spotify music on an iPhone 12 mini in airplane mode. So, if you're using my particular phone, you're looking at little over 4 hours of listening.


----------



## justanut

mattbass said:


> Going the RU6 fan club here. Everything just sounds a little better coming from this thing: richer, fuller, weightier with better extension on both ends of the audio spectrum compared to the basic Apple dongle.
> 
> It does hammer my iPhone's battery, which is totally expected. As a non-scientific experiment, RU6 sucked roughly 20% battery charge in 50 minutes playing downloaded Spotify music on an iPhone 12 mini in airplane mode. So, if you're using my particular phone, you're looking at little over 4 hours of listening.


Doesn't the 12 mini only have like 6hours of SOT anyway? That's pretty good! xD


----------



## twister6

In the past, we had a discussion about using RU6 connected to a smartphone while charging the phone.  One solution was to use usb-c splitter, another one to charge the phone wireless so there is no need for a splitter.  But you have to be sure wireless charging pad is horizontal, unlike some wireless charger stands that block usb-c port at the bottom.

Here, I found the ultimate portable wireless solution for use on the go  *Anker PowerCore III *10k powerbank with 10W wireless Qi charging.  Just bought it, only $50, and it's a perfect for my S22 when on the go with RU6.   You can use it with a splitter as well since it is a powerbank, but why bother if your phone supports wireless.  Here, it is next to my regular S22.  I mean, it is a universal solution for any phone with a wireless charging and any usb-dac dongle.


----------



## mattbass

twister6 said:


> Here, I found the ultimate portable wireless solution for use on the go  *Anker PowerCore III *10k powerbank with 10W wireless Qi charging.  Just bought it, only $50, and it's a perfect for my S22 when on the go with RU6.   You can use it with a splitter as well since it is a powerbank, but why bother if your phone supports wireless.  Here, it is next to my regular S22.  I mean, it is a universal solution for any phone with a wireless charging and any usb-dac dongle.



I was going to do something similar, but honestly battery-life hasn't been an issue yet. If it was, I'd velcro the RU6 to a MagSafe battery back, which sticks onto the back of the iPhone. Too bulky for everyday, but good for travel.


----------



## justanut

mattbass said:


> I was going to do something similar, but honestly battery-life hasn't been an issue yet. If it was, I'd velcro the RU6 to a MagSafe battery back, which sticks onto the back of the iPhone. Too bulky for everyday, but good for travel.


Stick the RU6 to the side instead! You're welcome~


----------



## RPJ12

kadinh said:


> out of the 100+ dongles andy has rated, the RU6 is #2 overall. the W2 is not even in the top 10.


Where can I find that list?


----------



## yaps66

RPJ12 said:


> Where can I find that list?


https://andyaudiovault.com/donglemadness/


----------



## justanut

yaps66 said:


> https://andyaudiovault.com/donglemadness/


To be fair, outside of the top 5, can't really tell on ranking. And I'm amazed he has the SXFI in the 4.5 star list~! I guess it sounds ok as long as you don't actually use the SXFI "3D" effects...


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Has anyone listened to heavy music on RU6, isn't it too smooth for extreme metal?


----------



## Garney

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Has anyone listened to heavy music on RU6, isn't it too smooth for extreme metal?


It works well with metal. Plenty of punch in the low end (but not elevated) and the R-2R architecture takes a _slight_ edge off of cymbal crashes but it's definitely not too smooth. I don't hear it rounding off notes per se. There's still good note definition and detail retrieval but it presents everything with a slightly analog tonality which sounds more organic and natural compared to some delta sigma DACs. I almost always use NOS which is a bit smoother than OS. IEM dependent though of course. I've had good results with the RU6 paired with VE EXT, 64 Audio Nio and the 7Hz Timeless. 

Black, death, tech death, prog, doom, etc. all sound great through the RU6.


----------



## ddmareo

How does it compare to DAP such as Ibasso DX160? I was just wondering because I went for the DX160 instead of the Cayin RU6


----------



## TYATYA

I compare again Ru6 vs AK SP1000 by various include:
-Bal or SE
-Which App and which dac filter
-OS or NOS

I found there's a combination makes me answer wrongly which device is sounding. That is when 2 devices sound identically, happen when AK in SE output + Default player or Neutron + Short delay slow roll-off filter, while Ru6 in Os mode (3.5 or 4.4 doesnt mater).

In 2.5(bal) and using short delay sharp roll off mode, AK wins with more 3D imagine and resolution. If it got 5 point, Ru6 will be 4.5

Luckily I found old version of Uapp is not good on AK from this comparision.
On THAT Uapp version I did not found a case AK sound better than Ru6, just approaching. 

Super slow roll off sound worst on AK.
Slow roll off is 2nd worst, for feeding to headamp, but I prefer using it to drives directly a headphone.

Ru6, a really impresive toy


----------



## TYATYA

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Has anyone listened to heavy music on RU6, isn't it too smooth for extreme metal?


Ru6 performance scale up with digital transport.


----------



## Hyde00 (Mar 23, 2022)

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Has anyone listened to heavy music on RU6, isn't it too smooth for extreme metal?


I can't say for metal but I find for rock, the cymbals / crash and snare drum felt a little bit polite for me.  Most notably with snare drum.  Kick drum is also slightly softer than how I'd like.  But guitar sounds good though.  Just snare drum you don't feel the metal coil under the drum.

LOL I think I'm picky on how snare drum sounds and most higher end dongle dac tend to over smooth it.  Somehow the cheaper dongle dac tend to do this better since it's less smooth.  It's kind of like Grado where it's more rough / coarse but works better in genre that favours that roughness / edginess.

RU6 is not as smooth as W2 / W2-131 but smoother than Dragonfly Red.


----------



## Garney

Hyde00 said:


> I can't say for metal but I find for rock, the cymbals / crash and snare drum felt a little bit polite for me.  Most notably with snare drum.  Kick drum is also slightly softer than how I'd like.  But guitar sounds good though.  Just snare drum you don't feel the metal coil under the drum.
> 
> LOL I think I'm picky on how snare drum sounds and most higher end dongle dac tend to over smooth it.  Somehow the cheaper dongle dac tend to do this better since it's less smooth.  It's kind of like Grado where it's more rough / coarse but works better in genre that favours that roughness / edginess.
> 
> RU6 is not as smooth as W2 / W2-131 but smoother than Dragonfly Red.


Do you find a touch more edge to cymbal hits (and snare hits too I guess) in OS versus NOS? I tend to always listen with NOS but I remember when I first got the RU6 noting that OS came off a bit more aggressive. I need to revisit OS to confirm, though.


----------



## Hyde00 (Mar 23, 2022)

Garney said:


> Do you find a touch more edge to cymbal hits (and snare hits too I guess) in OS versus NOS? I tend to always listen with NOS but I remember when I first got the RU6 noting that OS came off a bit more aggressive. I need to revisit OS to confirm, though.


I didn't test OS too much I just remember NOS sounded more analogue and OS sounded more like other delta sigma dacs so I just stuck with NOS lol.  But I do remember reading that people mentioned OS is a little bit more aggressive than NOS.

I've since sold the RU6 though so can't test it anymore unfortunately. 

I sold it because I prefer source volume control (since I use keyboard to control volume) so I went with other dongles with source volume control.  Also I find RU6 has subbass roll off and treble roll off somewhere.  For example currently I'm using Dragonfly Red / W2 / W2-131 all 3 have more subbass extension, and all 3 have more treble quantity (though quantity is preference).  But I'll give it to RU6 for imaging, where it beats the other 3 by far.  Like I really enjoyed playing game with RU6.  But I also remember the softer bass always bugged me.

LOL different trade off.


----------



## majo123 (Mar 24, 2022)

ddmareo said:


> How does it compare to DAP such as Ibasso DX160? I was just wondering because I went for the DX160 instead of the Cayin RU6


I have owned both dx160 and ru6 and still own ru6.
Firstly they are both very good devices so i wouldn't be too disappointed which ever you chose and they definitely more or less compete audio wise at the same level imo. I personally preferred the ru6 though audio wise and not really for any technical reasons  just because I found it just more enjoyable musically and maybe a little because I hadn't really heard anything else quite like it. Also hardware wise for me it was better for my usage , no need to charge, smaller portability and if you have a pretty good smart phone which I do then a joy to use and I have had no issues ever with it.
Dx160 is very good at it's price range but my Bluetooth was awful and WiFi meh so I wouldn't buy 160 for this usage, obviously with a top smart phone no such issues if this is your intended usage. Both sound really good though and maybe a bit of new toy syndrome different type sound but I did I think I prefer the ru6 overall.


----------



## justanut

Just PO from RU6 into WA8... background is still black, which is impressive considering it isn't a pure LO. However I'm finding this pairing a little too warm for the IE900 I'm using.


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Does RU6 scale with good power amp, if so in what qualities?


----------



## justanut

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Does RU6 scale with good power amp, if so in what qualities?


Power basically... and amplifies the good and the bad out of the RU6~ I only have the WA8 to try it with though so YMMV


----------



## gken92

RU6 + Monarch MKII combo is just amazing to my ears. Monarch MKII can be a bit spicy at the treble when paired with my Earstudio HUD100 (i listen to multiple genre music, i can listen to classical songs one day and modern pop songs on the next day lol). The RU6 noticeably smoothen out all the slight treble peaks that I heard from the HUD100, making Monarch MKII so enjoyable to listen to for long period and more forgiving for poorly mastered/recorded songs. 
The HUD100 does push a little bit more details, but that might be due to more prominent treble at the top and overall thinner sound. RU6 sounds smooth and thicker without sacrificing too much of its detail retrieval.


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> I found zero difference in audio quality of 3.5 vs 4.4
> A/B test, I myself switch the toggle and even through, I heard nothing difference at any means.
> So I must unplug a channel of RCA to verify I did not bunco myself





Hyde00 said:


> My guess is because RU6 is not technically a true balanced dac.  What I mean is that it only duplicated the signal at the last stage (stated by Cayin also there is diagram on 1st page of this thread).
> 
> So you probably get more power but otherwise identical source signal?
> 
> Other "true balanced" dongle dac split the signal earlier in the steps.  My guess is that in order to do "true balanced" they need to double the resistors which make the size limitation impossible?



Very much on the point, RU6 is a single-ended DAC with balanced drive headphone output.  We added an unity amp in negative phase to the single end phone out to do that, so it will offer more power, more current, but not the full benefit of balanced design such as better channel serperation.

If we keep the current R2R DAC circuit but use a fully balanced analog circuit, the improvement will be very noticeable already.  That will include duplicated LPF, Resistor array volume control and Line Drivers for the negative phase, and two independent Op-Amp for phone output.  Unfortunatley, we don't have enough space inside RU6, and need to reduce output power in order to fit this design within the 120mA limit of power supply form some mobile phone.


----------



## Andykong

TYATYA said:


> After A/B Ru6 2 output 3.5 and 4.4, I seriously try A/B Ru6 against SP1K output.
> 
> Insane? NO!
> 
> ...





TYATYA said:


> I compare again Ru6 vs AK SP1000 by various include:
> -Bal or SE
> -Which App and which dac filter
> -OS or NOS
> ...



I still find this fancinating, this is David vs Goliath.  Hong Kong has a interesting slag to describe this kind of comparison: consider yourself a winner if you can see my tail light when I cross the finishing line. That's why I said SP1000 wins every meaning, RU6 is not even close.  

This is really too good to be true, but I'll take your word. I should, unless I don't want to work for Cayin anymore, right?


----------



## Andykong

justanut said:


> Just PO from RU6 into WA8... background is still black, which is impressive considering it isn't a pure LO. However I'm finding this pairing a little too warm for the IE900 I'm using.



I have steer users away to use RU6 as DAC to portable amplfiier becuse it doesn't have a line out, and the noise characteristic of R2R DAC is technically not ideal for "pseudo" line out application.   However, I did try to connect RU6 to C9 to test how it work out.  On top of using the pre-amp input mode of C9, which was frequently used with DAP without a proper line out, I noticed that when I connect RU6 to 3.5mm line input of C9, the quality is actually better then using 4.4mm balanced line input of C9.  Therefore if someone really want to sue RU6 as line out to external amplifier, I'll recommend you to stay with single-ended connection.


----------



## russsellsthings

russsellsthings said:


> I suspect this is an issue similar to the one I have been having with the iPhone maximum power output over lightning. I am not 100% sure but I feel like OS uses more power and NOS uses less power. Thus, when I was having clipping issues when playing Tidal Masters using my iPhone, it would always happen more frequently in OS mode than in NOS mode. As an example, when I play a bass heavy track on Tidal (The Weeknd - Starboy) using my iPhone, I could induce clipping in OS mode in High Gain at a volume of 60, but in NOS mode, I could induce clipping in NOS mode at High Gain at a volume of 74.
> 
> Try playing with the volume settings, playing with the Gain and maybe you'll find you have a similar issue.
> 
> ...



So my OEAUDIO Lightning to USB C OTG cable arrived yesterday! And..... I can confirm that the clipping is definitely an iPhone power draw issue. Sigh. For my testing, I used my iPhone 13 pro, Tidal Masters using Wifi, with the MQA track Florence and the Machine - My Love (Edit). 

OEAudio OTG Lightning to USB C Cable
High Gain - OS - Clips at Volume 57
High Gain - NOS - Clips at Volume 61
Low Gain - OS - Clips at Volume 66
Low Gain - NOS - Clips at Volume 72

Penon Audio Lightning to USB C OTG Cable
High Gain - OS - Clips at Volume 56
High Gain - NOS - Clips at Volume 62
Low Gain - OS - Clips at Volume 66
Low Gain - NOS - Clips at Volume 74

The RU6 does not clip at any volume when using USB C output from my Macbook. I would be curious if any Android users have power draw clipping issues using their USB C outputs! Damn you iOS!

Fortunately... The volume required to produce clipping is pretty darn loud and requires some pretty heavy bass thumps so not really a major issue for me. 

If anyone is Canada is interested... I have an OEAudio OTG Lightning to USB C cable for sale...


----------



## russsellsthings

As an aside, I also have now faced the dreaded EMI issue with my iPhone 13 pro, with both Penon Lightning and the OEAudio OTG cable. It only happens when I turn off wifi and play Tidal Masters using 4G LTE. When I am playing off of wifi, I don't hear any EMI. My internet went down yesterday and decided to play some tracks using LTE and that was the first time I've noticed it. 

The RU6 is a wonderful dongle DAC and has gotten me interested in trying out larger R2R for my desktop and main room set up. However, to get such wonderful sound, there are some compromises when it is such a small form factor.


----------



## justanut

Andykong said:


> I have steer users away to use RU6 as DAC to portable amplfiier becuse it doesn't have a line out, and the noise characteristic of R2R DAC is technically not ideal for "pseudo" line out application.   However, I did try to connect RU6 to C9 to test how it work out.  On top of using the pre-amp input mode of C9, which was frequently used with DAP without a proper line out, I noticed that when I connect RU6 to 3.5mm line input of C9, the quality is actually better then using 4.4mm balanced line input of C9.  Therefore if someone really want to sue RU6 as line out to external amplifier, I'll recommend you to stay with single-ended connection.


Exactly what I'm doing currently. 3.5mm out to WA8 which also only takes 3.5mm in. Thankfully still a very black background, so while it isn't a line-out, it is more than useable~ Enjoyable even. A very musical and powerful combo~


----------



## yfei

russsellsthings said:


> The RU6 does not clip at any volume when using USB C output from my Macbook. I would be curious if any Android users have power draw clipping issues using their USB C outputs! Damn you iOS!


I have built USB accessories for Android phones and iPhones,      Android phones generally has much more power output capacity, easy to build accessories.      Build accesory for iPhone is pain in the a**, because Apple set very limited current availablity.  
Android manufactories are like,  'users what this?  ok, I will give you that'.     Apple is like: 'user what this?   no, you don't understand yourself, I understand you better, you don't need it.   You need to live in the way that I design you to live in.'


----------



## justanut

yfei said:


> I have built USB accessories for Android phones and iPhones,      Android phones generally has much more power output capacity, easy to build accessories.      Build accesory for iPhone is pain in the a**, because Apple set very limited current availablity.
> Android manufactories are like,  'users what this?  ok, I will give you that'.     Apple is like: 'user what this?   no, you don't understand yourself, I understand you better, you don't need it.   You need to live in the way that I design you to live in.'


Actually the problem’s mostly with failure to register under their MFI programme and working with them to ensure devices work as intended. 

Apple has to contend with more flak than Android phone manufacturers so MFI makes sense for them and their scale of operations, especially if you consider how long their devices are supported for. 

Letting accessory makers run wild would just end up becoming Apple who pays for their mistakes. 🤷🏻‍♂️

Anyway.. just to say, I’m on Apple Music Hi-Res streaming / downloads. No clipping / power issues encountered with anything I throw at the RU6. Maybe I should try with Tidal hmm


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Dear Cayin, please release a true balanced battery powered r2r dac with line out. I'd be so grateful to you!

P.S. Bluetooth with ldac is optional


----------



## TYATYA

justanut said:


> Exactly what I'm doing currently. 3.5mm out to WA8 which also only takes 3.5mm in. Thankfully still a very black background, so while it isn't a line-out, it is more than useable~ Enjoyable even. A very musical and powerful combo~



I use ru6 as adac to feed my hdvd800.
It is good to have ru6 in the path.


----------



## rarewolf

yfei said:


> I have built USB accessories for Android phones and iPhones,      Android phones generally has much more power output capacity, easy to build accessories.      Build accesory for iPhone is pain in the a**, because Apple set very limited current availablity.
> Android manufactories are like,  'users what this?  ok, I will give you that'.     Apple is like: 'user what this?   no, you don't understand yourself, I understand you better, you don't need it.   You need to live in the way that I design you to live in.'



I read a report this morning that Apple is considering removing all ports from the iPhone 15 Pro. I had heard rumours weeks ago, but I was hoping Apple would at least, keep with their iPads and allow for the USB-C port for all Pro models, and leave Bt to the lesser models. Thankfully, that’s a ways off, and who knows where the Bt codecs will be 3 years from now…


----------



## yaps66

rarewolf said:


> I read a report this morning that Apple is considering removing all ports from the iPhone 15 Pro. I had heard rumours weeks ago, but I was hoping Apple would at least, keep with their iPads and allow for the USB-C port for all Pro models, and leave Bt to the lesser models. Thankfully, that’s a ways off, and who knows where the Bt codecs will be 3 years from now…


We seem to be moving gradually to a port-less world! It just means there will be more of a play for DAPs when that happens. It would be a sad day for my RU6.  Hopefully BT will be lossless by then!!!


----------



## ducnsh

yaps66 said:


> We seem to be moving gradually to a port-less world! It just means there will be more of a play for DAPs when that happens. It would be a sad day for my RU6.  Hopefully BT will be lossless by then!!!


I am currently using an iPhone SE2020 for Cayin RU6, I never use my primary phone (13 Pro) to connect external DAC/AMP so I think it will not be problem


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> I read a report this morning that Apple is considering removing all ports from the iPhone 15 Pro. I had heard rumours weeks ago, but I was hoping Apple would at least, keep with their iPads and allow for the USB-C port for all Pro models, and leave Bt to the lesser models. Thankfully, that’s a ways off, and who knows where the Bt codecs will be 3 years from now…



Most likely remain AAC by that time.


----------



## Andykong

justanut said:


> Actually the problem’s mostly with failure to register under their MFI programme and working with them to ensure devices work as intended.
> 
> Apple has to contend with more flak than Android phone manufacturers so MFI makes sense for them and their scale of operations, especially if you consider how long their devices are supported for.
> 
> ...



The MFI is a very effective revenue generation and eco-system protection mechanism.


----------



## Andykong

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Dear Cayin, please release a true balanced battery powered r2r dac with line out. I'd be so grateful to you!
> 
> P.S. Bluetooth with ldac is optional



We did hint in N8ii thread that Cayin is working on R2R DAP, we just don't have any date or price or features confirmed at this stage, everything is subject to change at early stage of product development.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

@Andykong 

I am done with my listening of the Liric.  Shipping it to the next reviewer tomorrow.   Took this picture of a set up that should bring a smile to your face.   Except for the cables, all of your products.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

Andykong said:


> We did hint in N8ii thread that Cayin is working on R2R DAP, we just don't have any date or price or features confirmed at this stage, everything is subject to change at early stage of product development.


Fantastic.   If you had a preorder form up now, I would buy it


----------



## Andykong

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Fantastic.   If you had a preorder form up now, I would buy it



Cayin didn't sell direct, so you won't see preorder from us at any time, unfortunately.


----------



## Andykong

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> @Andykong
> 
> I am done with my listening of the Liric.  Shipping it to the next reviewer tomorrow.   Took this picture of a set up that should bring a smile to your face.   Except for the cables, all of your products.


Great, but did you try RU6 with Liric? 

I have mentioned C9 with Elite and Liric several times in different thread, they are very good options IMHO, but looks like I need to stop saying that because some readers will interprate different when I am a sponsor of Meze and Cayin.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

Andykong said:


> Great, but did you try RU6 with Liric?
> 
> I have mentioned C9 with Elite and Liric several times in different thread, they are very good options IMHO, but looks like I need to stop saying that because some readers will interprate different when I am a sponsor of Meze and Cayin.


I didn't.   Let me try it.   Liric is really light in treble.   And R2R DAC would help in that regard.   Let me try it before I box it up.


----------



## HiFiHawaii808

Okay.   I listened with it.  It sounds good.   I had it on high gain and 70/100.  Not much head room, but it sounded good.   As I said, the Liric is lower treble light and the RU6 (and RS6) have good treble so it sounded more balanced than with my other DAPs.    I have been DAP rolling with 5 DAPs to see which ones I like the most and I have pretty much decided that now.   Going to keep N8ii, M9 and RS6+C9.  Those 3 DAPs meet all of my use case needs.


----------



## rarewolf

yaps66 said:


> We seem to be moving gradually to a port-less world! It just means there will be more of a play for DAPs when that happens. It would be a sad day for my RU6.  Hopefully BT will be lossless by then!!!



I found this last night. Qualcomm is promising Bluetooth 5.3 this year. I was wondering why the Bluetooth dongle manufacturers have been so quite lately…
https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/qualcomm-s3-s4-snapdragon-sound-lossless-audio-bt-le/

It seems Apple won’t be adopting the Qualcomm chips into their own HPs and earbuds, but I find it hard to believe Apple Music (lossless) won’t support other Bt device manufacturers… they’d lose too much business to Qobuz and the like.


----------



## Andykong

HiFiHawaii808 said:


> Okay.   I listened with it.  It sounds good.   I had it on high gain and 70/100.  Not much head room, but it sounded good.   As I said, the Liric is lower treble light and the RU6 (and RS6) have good treble so it sounded more balanced than with my other DAPs.    I have been DAP rolling with 5 DAPs to see which ones I like the most and I have pretty much decided that now.   Going to keep N8ii, M9 and RS6+C9.  Those 3 DAPs meet all of my use case needs.



I shared similar experience with this combo.  I describe the RU6+Liric pairing as "reasonable but not outstanding".


----------



## Andykong

rarewolf said:


> I found this last night. Qualcomm is promising Bluetooth 5.3 this year. I was wondering why the Bluetooth dongle manufacturers have been so quite lately…
> https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/qualcomm-s3-s4-snapdragon-sound-lossless-audio-bt-le/
> 
> It seems Apple won’t be adopting the Qualcomm chips into their own HPs and earbuds, but I find it hard to believe Apple Music (lossless) won’t support other Bt device manufacturers… they’d lose too much business to Qobuz and the like.



 If Apple didn't support LDAC which is almost free, why should we expect they'll pay Qualcomm and use their BT codec?


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Andykong said:


> We did hint in N8ii thread that Cayin is working on R2R DAP, we just don't have any date or price or features confirmed at this stage, everything is subject to change at early stage of product development.


That's great! Please consider also version without DAP functionality (only DAC).


----------



## kumar402

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> That's great! Please consider also version without DAP functionality (only DAC).


There are so many great R2R DAC in market. R2R DAP at good price is niche and currently we don’t have many option.


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

kumar402 said:


> There are so many great R2R DAC in market.


How many of those are battery powered?


----------



## kumar402

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> How many of those are battery powered?


Ok you are asking for something like Mojo. My bad I thought you were asking for desktop DAC.


----------



## yaps66 (Mar 29, 2022)

rarewolf said:


> I found this last night. Qualcomm is promising Bluetooth 5.3 this year. I was wondering why the Bluetooth dongle manufacturers have been so quite lately…
> https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/qualcomm-s3-s4-snapdragon-sound-lossless-audio-bt-le/
> 
> It seems Apple won’t be adopting the Qualcomm chips into their own HPs and earbuds, but I find it hard to believe Apple Music (lossless) won’t support other Bt device manufacturers… they’d lose too much business to Qobuz and the like.


Sometimes Apple does what Apple wants, and it is not always logical! Haha!


----------



## Andykong

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> That's great! Please consider also version without DAP functionality (only DAC).



Similar questions have been asked repeatedly. Please refer to our previous discussion *HERE* and *HERE*.


----------



## lil BANE

yaps66 said:


> Sometimes Apple does what Apple wants, and it is not always logical! Haha!


Apple wants to sell you their AIrPods…why give you options?


----------



## tonedeafmelomaniac

Andykong said:


> Similar questions have been asked repeatedly


Maybe it's a sign that there is a demand for such a device? For example mojo and gryphon have gained high popularity.


----------



## Andykong (Mar 30, 2022)

tonedeafmelomaniac said:


> Maybe it's a sign that there is a demand for such a device? For example mojo and gryphon have gained high popularity.



Yes, there are definitely, but running a business is not about taking every opporuntiy in the market.  Cayin is not big enough to cover every product category that has a demand, we need to focus and remain efficient with what we are doing.

From this point onward, I shall ignor all questions or requests related to this subject. We have repeatedly explained that we are occupied by other projects, we are not going ot do this.  THIS IS FINAL at this stage, there is nothing we can add in this thread on these issues.


----------



## Andykong

After we heard the disappointing "portless" rumor of iPhone, Google


rarewolf said:


> I read a report this morning that Apple is considering removing all ports from the iPhone 15 Pro. I had heard rumours weeks ago, but I was hoping Apple would at least, keep with their iPads and allow for the USB-C port for all Pro models, and leave Bt to the lesser models. Thankfully, that’s a ways off, and who knows where the Bt codecs will be 3 years from now…



This is disappointing.  

On the other hand, we have good news from Google that Pixel 6 will support "Direct USB Access" by June and that should open the door to better DAC support.



> Direct USB Access” in Android 12 is described by Google as a path to allow apps on a smartphone to directly access an external DAC (digital-to-analog converter). This, in turn, would open up support to more USB DACs as well as improving support within apps.


----------



## H T T

rarewolf said:


> I read a report this morning that Apple is considering removing all ports from the iPhone 15 Pro. I had heard rumours weeks ago, but I was hoping Apple would at least, keep with their iPads and allow for the USB-C port for all Pro models, and leave Bt to the lesser models. Thankfully, that’s a ways off, and who knows where the Bt codecs will be 3 years from now…


That is probably just a trial balloon rumor. The other part of the rumor is that the 15 won’t have a SIM slot… The EU is forcing all manufacturers to go USB-C for all wired chargers. Apple doesn’t like to be told what to do. (And they like to make money off of certified accessories).  Let’s see what happens and what the market says. 

I keep my phones for 6+ years. I have an iPhone 13. I will have a port for quite some time. 😉


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> After we heard the disappointing "portless" rumor of iPhone, Google
> 
> 
> This is disappointing.
> ...


For iphone users, in anticipation of this disappointing news, just need to get any Cayin DAP and you all you need to to interconnect the RU6 to experience R2R goodness! Better still, get the n6ii with the RO1 module and you kill two birds with one stone!


----------



## DBaldock9

H T T said:


> That is probably just a trial balloon rumor. The other part of the rumor is that the 15 won’t have a SIM slot… The EU is forcing all manufacturers to go USB-C for all wired chargers. Apple doesn’t like to be told what to do. (And they like to make money off of certified accessories).  Let’s see what happens and what the market says.
> 
> I keep my phones for 6+ years. I have an iPhone 13. I will have a port for quite some time. 😉



If they provide a Wireless Charger with a USB-C input, then they should be in compliance with the EU rule.


----------



## H T T

DBaldock9 said:


> If they provide a Wireless Charger with a USB-C input, then they should be in compliance with the EU rule.


I am not sure. I would assume there will be behind-the-scenes talks. Maybe a corporate lawyer could way in?

It doesn't directly affect me as a law/rule as I don't live in the EU.


----------



## majo123

Andykong said:


> We did hint in N8ii thread that Cayin is working on R2R DAP, we just don't have any date or price or features confirmed at this stage, everything is subject to change at early stage of product development.


Now this is interesting! ... I have both ru6 and n6ii ro1 and love them both , breath of fresh air bringing something different to the table and both sound excellent IMO .
Will definitely be looking in on this development.


----------



## lordearl

@Andykong is it possible on the next firmware upgrade for RU6 to have the display show bitrate? At the moment the RU6 shows only sample rate on playback.


----------



## kadinh

i would love to have the ability to change media playback with the hardware buttons


----------



## lostrockets

Just got one of these.. curious what settings do you like on the ru6 and why?


----------



## yaps66

lostrockets said:


> Just got one of these.. curious what settings do you like on the ru6 and why?


For me the most meaningful setting that I use often is OS and NOS modes. My preference is NOS as it sounds the most analogue. Of course OS mode does offer more clarify but it just doesn't sound as musical.


----------



## TYATYA

lostrockets said:


> Just got one of these.. curious what settings do you like on the ru6 and why?


Low gain, NOS.
OS sounds tend to be DS dac.
And when does not need the volume, 3.5 is my prefer.
4.4 and 3.5 sound the same [with assume that an ext amplifier is equally design of bal and se route]
I found 4.4 is better to feed stax srm007Ta and I think it is due to the amp.
On other amp found nothing difference.


----------



## lostrockets

TYATYA said:


> Low gain, NOS.
> OS sounds tend to be DS dac.
> And when does not need the volume, 3.5 is my prefer.
> 4.4 and 3.5 sound the same [with assume that an ext amplifier is equally design of bal and se route]
> ...


Thanks for sharing this! Curious about the 007t is it modded? What do you mean by better?


----------



## TYATYA (Apr 2, 2022)

lostrockets said:


> Thanks for sharing this! Curious about the 007t is it modded? What do you mean by better


Better separation and transparent.
But I need to edit: on 007t I found balance input better than se that was with ak sp1000 (NOT ru6) and reason relate to the sp1000 (it has true balance circuit).
007t means the stat.amp of stax, original.
Also, today I use sp1000 - se out RCA - 007t to compare with my smartphone- ru6- 4.4 out xlr3 - 007t.
I switch input mode 2 and 3 on the amp to A/B test then I found there is no or little difference in treble, ru6 a little britle.
Comparision 4.4 and 3.5 of ru6 I did not found any thing difference on hdvd800. On 007t I could not A/B (can not match the volume bcs 007t have no gain adjust on input)


----------



## kadinh

Got my OEAudio cable today…loses connection because the cable is not terminated correctly. If it is moved after it finally makes a connection, the connection is interrupted. 

:-/


----------



## yaps66

kadinh said:


> Got my OEAudio cable today…loses connection because the cable is not terminated correctly. If it is moved after it finally makes a connection, the connection is interrupted.
> 
> :-/


Sorry to hear that!


----------



## Brain Damage (Apr 3, 2022)

yaps66 said:


> For me the most meaningful setting that I use often is OS and NOS modes. My preference is NOS as it sounds the most analogue. Of course OS mode does offer more clarify but it just doesn't sound as musical.


I have to agree and would add keeping in low gain. However, with one exception - when pairing with my Beyer DT880 Pros - hi gain (NOS) is the only mode that truly amplifies/drives them. Still sounds musical and analogue sounding


----------



## yaps66

Brain Damage said:


> I have to agree and would add keeping in low gain. However, with one exception - when pairing with my Beyer DT880 Pros - hi gain (NOS) is the only mode that truly amplifies/drives them. Still sounds musical and analogue sounding


The RU6 has been a game changer for me.  It has reignited my love for discovering new music! The Mojo2 is in my sights just to see what different flavour it brings but really like the RU6! Kudos Cayin!!


----------



## H T T

yaps66 said:


> For me the most meaningful setting that I use often is OS and NOS modes. My preference is NOS as it sounds the most analogue. Of course OS mode does offer more clarify but it just doesn't sound as musical.


I prefer OS. Different strokes... and different settings in 2 seconds.


----------



## sydofne

Hi folks,

Tried to searching but didnt find any info, but does the RU6 has a Line Out mode to connect to an external amplifier? It would be nice to use as a at home, transportable DAC for planars.
Many thx


----------



## Brain Damage

H T T said:


> I prefer OS. Different strokes... and different settings in 2 seconds.


I have to say, I am preferring the 2L classical recordings I have when listening on OS mode.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

sydofne said:


> Hi folks,
> 
> Tried to searching but didnt find any info, but does the RU6 has a Line Out mode to connect to an external amplifier? It would be nice to use as a at home, transportable DAC for planars.
> Many thx


No, it does not have a line out.

Similar to many RU6 users, I've tried double amping and it works out pretty well, no noticeable distortion or clipping. In my case, I'm using RU6 Max volume & Low gain connected to the iFi xDSD Gryphon (in Amp mode) via a short 3.5mm to 3.5mm Aux cable. RU6 on it's own can drive my Sundara to sufficient volume but lacks enough authority, adding Gryphon (with 1W of power & xBass) helps improve the sound nicely.


----------



## sydofne

Johnfg465vd said:


> No, it does not have a line out.
> 
> Similar to many RU6 users, I've tried double amping and it works out pretty well, no noticeable distortion or clipping. In my case, I'm using RU6 Max volume & Low gain connected to the iFi xDSD Gryphon (in Amp mode) via a short 3.5mm to 3.5mm Aux cable. RU6 on it's own can drive my Sundara to sufficient volume but lacks enough authority, adding Gryphon (with 1W of power & xBass) helps improve the sound nicely.


Exactly how I feel my N5iiS driving the Sundara on 2.5mm, enough volume but no authority. I was searching for a transportable solution for the Sundara. How do you feel the gryphon on its own?
Many thx


----------



## Johnfg465vd

sydofne said:


> Exactly how I feel my N5iiS driving the Sundara on 2.5mm, enough volume but no authority. I was searching for a transportable solution for the Sundara. How do you feel the gryphon on its own?
> Many thx


I'd say Gryphon drives it 90% well. The iDSD Signature drives it 100% but it's not as portable and does not have bluetooth. RU6 would probably be 60%.

With Sundara, I have to dial the volume on Gryphon to ~80 (out of 106) and on Signature ~12 O' Clock on Normal Mode, so lots of head room with later and it sounds a bit better too.

If you like the N5iiS sound, you could also get a portable Amp to pair with N5iiS's Line-Out? something like the Topping NX7 or iFi xCAN should be enough to drive Sundara nicely while being less expensive.


----------



## justanut

Constantly being impressed by the super clean PO of the RU6. Using PO to my WA8 turns this into a very potent R2R combo~

Currently using this combo to drive the HD650 for pop songs, extremely beautiful female vocals


----------



## Andykong

sydofne said:


> Hi folks,
> 
> Tried to searching but didnt find any info, but does the RU6 has a Line Out mode to connect to an external amplifier? It would be nice to use as a at home, transportable DAC for planars.
> Many thx



You come to the right place.  If you use the search function to look for line out discussion in this thread, you'll find a lot of information in this thread, this is one of the most frequently asked question in this thread. 

Among the posts I responed, *THIS *and *THIS* is a good starting point.


----------



## Andykong

yaps66 said:


> The RU6 has been a game changer for me.  It has reignited my love for discovering new music! The Mojo2 is in my sights just to see what different flavour it brings but really like the RU6! Kudos Cayin!!



Thanks you, this is exciting feedback to product developer, bring people closer to music is the main objective to develop HiFi products, we wish you all the best in your music journey.


----------



## yaps66

H T T said:


> I prefer OS. Different strokes... and different settings in 2 seconds.


Yes. Different strokes for different folks. Just amazed that we even have the option in such a small device!


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> Thanks you, this is exciting feedback to product developer, bring people closer to music is the main objective to develop HiFi products, we wish you all the best in your music journey.


I know it has been said before but worth saying again. Thanks Andy for all your responses to this thread.  You are one of the reasons why many of us love Cayin products!  Am so looking forward to the development of the R2R DAP!


----------



## DanielListening

The RU6 is magical. I just wish it was a DAP with a bit more power. I cannot afford a DAP >$1,000 USD. Maybe I will score a used N6ii with the R2R amplifier. Cayin is now the brand I look to for DAPs after hearing the RU6 and the N8ii. 🙏🏻


----------



## lostrockets

Andykong said:


> I have steer users away to use RU6 as DAC to portable amplfiier becuse it doesn't have a line out, and the noise characteristic of R2R DAC is technically not ideal for "pseudo" line out application.   However, I did try to connect RU6 to C9 to test how it work out.  On top of using the pre-amp input mode of C9, which was frequently used with DAP without a proper line out, I noticed that when I connect RU6 to 3.5mm line input of C9, the quality is actually better then using 4.4mm balanced line input of C9.  Therefore if someone really want to sue RU6 as line out to external amplifier, I'll recommend you to stay with single-ended connection.


What would cause the 3.5 out to be better than 4.4 when put in front of an amplifier? I curently use. 3.5 mm to rca to amp,but was considering getting the 4.4 to rca connector for more power


----------



## Andykong

lostrockets said:


> What would cause the 3.5 out to be better than 4.4 when put in front of an amplifier? I curently use. 3.5 mm to rca to amp,but was considering getting the 4.4 to rca connector for more power



Just in case  you don't aware that RU6 is not a full balanced design, check *HERE*.

4.4mm from RU6 offers more power but not the usual benefit of full balanced design, such as channel seperation and better noise and interference control.   The noise level of 4.4mm phone out is slightly higher than 3.5mm phone out.  If you were to use it as phone output, the higher power normally will out-weighted the noise issue, but if  you are using it as balanced line out, the extra power is not necessary an advantage buy you need to deal with the increased noise.


----------



## Brain Damage

Can someone please tell me how you connect the Cabin RU6 to a smartphone that utilises micro USB (e.g. HTC Desire Pro 10 (micro USB 2.0)). I've tried:

a) a micro USB to USB C coverter
b) a micro USB to USB A OTG cable (Dragontail) whilst attaching the RU6 to the Dragontail using the Cayin's USB C to USB A adapter.

Note: I'm using UAPP and have selected the correct settings.

Was wanting to just use my HTC as an audio player (DAP). Any advice would be appreciated.


----------



## yaps66

Brain Damage said:


> Can someone please tell me how you connect the Cabin RU6 to a smartphone that utilises micro USB (e.g. HTC Desire Pro 10 (micro USB 2.0)). I've tried:
> 
> a) a micro USB to USB C coverter
> b) a micro USB to USB A OTG cable (Dragontail) whilst attaching the RU6 to the Dragontail using the Cayin's USB C to USB A adapter.
> ...


I'm sure you can easily find a micro USB to USB C OTG cable.  I have the Xduoo one that came with my Xduoo XD05 Basic. However I don't have a micro USB device to test it on.


----------



## Brain Damage

yaps66 said:


> I'm sure you can easily find a micro USB to USB C OTG cable.  I have the Xduoo one that came with my Xduoo XD05 Basic. However I don't have a micro USB device to test it on.


Thanks. I ordered one yesterday on Amazon - should arrive today. Fingers crossed. Thanks 👍.


----------



## audio123

Just got the Cayin RU6. Looking to pair with PW First Times Type C - Type C cable.


----------



## Majid Mute

hi .ru6 Connects to iPhone with 
ddhif mfi06 cable?


----------



## ducnsh

Hi guys, have anyone tried the normal USB A to C (from Aukey, Anker) to connect Ru6 with PC? I asked because I am going to buy a 1meter cable to play with PC, thanks!


----------



## Stevko

Can I use this one with my iphone? or will it only work with ipad? 
People in this thread have problem with "uses too much power "....


https://redirect.viglink.com/?forma...2500_thumb.png" alt="1637814204224.png">


----------



## justanut

Stevko said:


> Can I use this one with my iphone? or will it only work with ipad?
> People in this thread have problem with "uses too much power "....
> 
> 
> https://redirect.viglink.com/?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_164932666111910&key=1e99669452acedd7650a94861c9354cb&libId=l1ouibik0101zlp1000DLgskpfs0e&loc=https://www.head-fi.org/threadgallery/960113?page=6&v=1&opt=true&out=https://cdn.head-fi.org/a/11632500.png&ref=https://www.head-fi.org/threadgallery/960113?page=7&title=Cayin RU6: R-2R USB Dongle DAC with Head-Amp - Thread Gallery | Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org&txt= <img src="https://cdn.head-fi.org/a/11632500_thumb.png" alt="1637814204224.png">


Search "iPhone" in this thread. Many different takes. I myself have had no issues even driving full sized headphones.


----------



## Stevko

thanks for the tip. so it depends on the iems/hps , phone and volume


----------



## H T T (Apr 7, 2022)

Stevko said:


> Can I use this one with my iphone? or will it only work with ipad?
> People in this thread have problem with "uses too much power "....
> 
> 
> https://redirect.viglink.com/?forma...2500_thumb.png" alt="1637814204224.png">



The RU6 sucks 20+ percent of battery power per hour out of my iPhone. It hurts but the RU6 sounds sooooo good. For longer listening sessions my FiiO Q3 or Paw S1 get used.


----------



## Andykong

Stevko said:


> thanks for the tip. so it depends on the iems/hps , phone and volume



The warning is related to the famous power supply limit imposed by iOS, several reviewers has reported that the limit is 120mA according to their measurement.  So Choice of headphone/IEM (related to loading of the device), music content and volume (related to ouptut level) will be some of the direct cause to reach that 120mA limit.


----------



## Wes S

Hey ya'll!  I've been out of the portable game for a while now and it's been all about building up my full sized desktop rig for the past year or so, but that is all about to change. . .I have a RU6 on the way as well as a pair of Moondrop KATO and Penon Serial and can't wait to have a quality portable setup again.  The weather is getting better in Texas with Spring in full effect, and I love to listen to quality music outside during my daily walks, and figure it's time to get back into the portable side of hobby.  This will be my first Cayin product and I can't wait to hear this thing!


----------



## yaps66

Wes S said:


> Hey ya'll!  I've been out of the portable game for a while now and it's been all about building up my full sized desktop rig for the past year or so, but that is all about to change. . .I have a RU6 on the way as well as a pair of Moondrop KATO and Penon Serial and can't wait to have a quality portable setup again.  The weather is getting better in Texas with Spring in full effect, and I love to listen to quality music outside during my daily walks, and figure it's time to get back into the portable side of hobby.  This will be my first Cayin product and I can't wait to hear this thing!


Enjoy the RU6! I have the Penon Serial on the way too. Hearing good things about them.


----------



## ActuallySparky (Apr 8, 2022)

So I've had the Cayin RU-6 for a few months, and I felt like I ought to post my thoughts. TL;DR is I really like it.






First up, the deal breakers (for some, but not for me): The RU-6 has a bit of hiss for super sensitive IEMs. It got better over time though and no longer really bothers me (that or I've gotten deaf enough not to care). Next up the RU-6 needs to warm up for a minute or two to sound its best. Right when I plug it in it's always a little flat and boring. Finally, like all dongles, it's very dependent on the source device to provide clean power and jitter-free data. The RU-6 needs a full power USB-C port to sound its best.

So none of those scared you off? Man, you might like the RU-6. It's got a very musical, relaxing sound to it. The low end has punch and growl, mids are natural, and the highs are relaxed and smooth. It's such comfort music - like wrapping yourself in a warm blanket.

OS mode adds some clarity, but can be fatiguing. This is very pair-up dependent though, the 64 Audio Nio's Tia treble doesn't get harsh or spiky in OS mode. For most music and IEMs I use NOS mode though - what I lose in clarity seems to be made up for by feeling more effortless and natural.

I have a bunch of other dongles I like, but none of them quite compare. The L&P W2 is more precise and technical, but has a limp, whispy low end. The Lotoo PAW S1 and A&K PEE51 both have similar clean and punchy sound, but both can get fatiguing if I listen for a long time or to peaky music. The Lotoo and A&K both sound great alone, but when I A/B test against the RU-6 come away feeling like they are trying too hard.

I guess the highest praise I can give the RU-6 is how much I use it. Even when I'm sitting at a desk near one of my "nice" stacks, I'll often reach for the RU-6 and chill out with it. I now listen to music on the RU-6 more than all my other sources combined.

The magical synergy for me is iPad Pro > RU-6 (low gain, NOS) > Nio. This combo gels with me in a way no other sound ever has. The iPad Pro has a nice clean USB-C port and provides all the power needed for the rest of the chain. The smooth treble on the RU-6 and the relaxed qualities of Tia treble work together and seem to lean into each others strengths for a spacious sound that still feels gentle and open. Sure it's a bit euphonic and warm, but that suits me just dandy with the post rock and electronica I spend most of my time listening to.

Thanks Cayin - I'm a believer, and if I ever get a nice DAP, 100% its going to be an R2R one made by you.


----------



## Andykong (Apr 8, 2022)

ActuallySparky said:


> So I've had the Cayin RU-6 for a few months, and I felt like I ought to post my thoughts. TL;DR is I really like it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you very much.   If you wrote this two weeks after you have the RU6, we probably will contribute the positive response as part of your new toy symdrone, but now you wrote this after using the RU6 for few month, and looks like you are going to stick it for quite a while (because Cayin don't have new R-2R DAP in near future), this is a definitely a passion-driven sharing.

When I read "Even when I'm sitting at a desk near one of my "nice" stacks, I'll often reach for the RU-6 and chill out with it",  I checked  your signature and noticed you have two desktop system: Sony TA-ZH1es > IER-Z1R and Bifrost 2 > SA-1 > Legend X, wander which "one" were you referring to?  I put my money on Z1R, ....


----------



## majo123

Andykong said:


> Thank you very much.   If you wrote this two weeks after you have the RU6, we probably will contribute the positive response as part of your new toy symdrone, but now you wrote this after using the RU6 for few month, and looks like you are going to stick it for quite a while (because Cayin don't have any R-2R DAP in near future), this is a definitely a passion-driven sharing.
> 
> When I read "Even when I'm sitting at a desk near one of my "nice" stacks, I'll often reach for the RU-6 and chill out with it",  I checked  your signature and noticed you have two desktop system: Sony TA-ZH1es > IER-Z1R and Bifrost 2 > SA-1 > Legend X, wander which "one" were you referring to?  I put my money on Z1R, ....


Had mine quite a while, led me to buy n6ii ro1 ...I now have r2r syndrome, but hey not a bad condition


----------



## Brain Damage

Just bought a Tripowin balanced cable for my Tin HiFi T4s to take full advantage of the 4.4 balanced output and it sounds amazing .
As the RU6 isn't balanced in terms of its architecture, does this mean you could use a 3.5 to 4.4 adapter for headphones? Wondered if harder to drive single ended headphones (Beyerdynamic DT880 pros) can make use of the 4.4 output???


----------



## Andykong

Brain Damage said:


> Just bought a Tripowin balanced cable for my Tin HiFi T4s to take full advantage of the 4.4 balanced output and it sounds amazing .
> As the RU6 isn't balanced in terms of its architecture, does this mean you could use a 3.5 to 4.4 adapter for headphones? Wondered if harder to drive single ended headphones (Beyerdynamic DT880 pros) can make use of the 4.4 output???



Do you mean using a 4.4mm male to 3.5mm female adapter on RU6 4.4mm output to drive your 3.5mm terminated DT880?

This will work technically, but I am not sure if you can drive the DT880Pro to satisfactory level.  If I remember it right, the DT880Pro can't be mod to 4.4mm through simple rewiring. so this is the best you can get with RU6.


----------



## Andykong

majo123 said:


> Had mine quite a while, led me to buy n6ii ro1 ...I now have r2r syndrome, but hey not a bad condition



You are not the first one, but TBH, we never expect to sell N6ii + R01 from RU6, this is way beyond our expectation.


----------



## ActuallySparky

Andykong said:


> When I read "Even when I'm sitting at a desk near one of my "nice" stacks, I'll often reach for the RU-6 and chill out with it",  I checked  your signature and noticed you have two desktop system: Sony TA-ZH1es > IER-Z1R and Bifrost 2 > SA-1 > Legend X, wander which "one" were you referring to?  I put my money on Z1R, ....



I like both of those chains for different reasons. The RU-6 is very much in the same sound signature as the Bifrost>SA-1, but a bit more relaxed. I think the desktop amp does a better job of driving Legend X than the RU-6 does, but pairs very poorly with the Nio - all that power makes the bass kinda bloated for some reason. Both the Bifrost and RU-6 are somewhat forgiving which I like - a lot of the music I listen to isn't perfectly recorded.

On the flip side, the Sony stack is a very different experience. It's much more 'audiophile' and has TOTL stage, space and technicalities. But all that detail makes it harder to enjoy in long stretches. I very much enjoy the Z1r experience a few times a week, particularly for well-recorded acoustic music, but that chain is unforgiving of peaky treble or poor mastering. The wrong track will make it feel like that super tweeter is shredding your eardrums!


----------



## Andykong

ActuallySparky said:


> I like both of those chains for different reasons. The RU-6 is very much in the same sound signature as the Bifrost>SA-1, but a bit more relaxed. I think the desktop amp does a better job of driving Legend X than the RU-6 does, but pairs very poorly with the Nio - all that power makes the bass kinda bloated for some reason. Both the Bifrost and RU-6 are somewhat forgiving which I like - a lot of the music I listen to isn't perfectly recorded.
> 
> On the flip side, the Sony stack is a very different experience. It's much more 'audiophile' and has TOTL stage, space and technicalities. But all that detail makes it harder to enjoy in long stretches. I very much enjoy the Z1r experience a few times a week, particularly for well-recorded acoustic music, but that chain is unforgiving of peaky treble or poor mastering. The wrong track will make it feel like that super tweeter is shredding your eardrums!



Thank you very much for your detail explanation, I am sure RU6 users or potential uers will understand the RU6 audio perofrmance from your comparision.


----------



## majo123

Andykong said:


> You are not the first one, but TBH, we never expect to sell N6ii + R01 from RU6, this is way beyond our expectation.


Well I'm definitely spreading the word even if I'm a bit late to the table with n6ii ro1..... genuinely ru6 and ro1 have both exceeded expectations.
Ru6 especially and n6ii ro1 are getting some great reception, hopefully in the future we will see cayin doing more R2R


----------



## Brain Damage

Andykong said:


> Do you mean using a 4.4mm male to 3.5mm female adapter on RU6 4.4mm output to drive your 3.5mm terminated DT880?
> 
> This will work technically, but I am not sure if you can drive the DT880Pro to satisfactory level.  If I remember it right, the DT880Pro can't be mod to 4.4mm through simple rewiring. so this is the best you can get with RU6.


Thanks @Andykong . Yes a 4.4mm male to 3.5mm female adapter is what I was referring to. Worth asking before spending money unnecessarily 👍


----------



## russsellsthings

Stevko said:


> Can I use this one with my iphone? or will it only work with ipad?
> People in this thread have problem with "uses too much power "....
> 
> 
> https://redirect.viglink.com/?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_164932666111910&key=1e99669452acedd7650a94861c9354cb&libId=l1ouibik0101zlp1000DLgskpfs0e&loc=https://www.head-fi.org/threadgallery/960113?page=6&v=1&opt=true&out=https://cdn.head-fi.org/a/11632500.png&ref=https://www.head-fi.org/threadgallery/960113?page=7&title=Cayin RU6: R-2R USB Dongle DAC with Head-Amp - Thread Gallery | Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org&txt= <img src="https://cdn.head-fi.org/a/11632500_thumb.png" alt="1637814204224.png">


From a battery usage perspective, my RU6 draws about 15% of my iphone 13 pro per hour. Thankfully, the 13 pro has pretty good longevity so I find I can do 2-3 hour listening sessions and not have too much battery anxiety.

From a power draw perspective, because iOS limits the amount of power out of the Lightening port, my Cayin RU6 will start to get sound clipping if I turn up the volume too high. It is worse if I use the OS mode (as compared to the NOS mode, I suspect that the OS mode uses more power). It really only occurs during bass heavy tracks and only if you are playing your music pretty loud. Day to day, I never notice this issue but it is something to be aware of if you like bone shaking loudness in your headphones.


----------



## HK_sends

New RU6 owner on board.  Just got the wrapper off so it'll be a while before I can post meaningful impressions.  My main system DAC is a R2R as well so I know the sound will be worth the patience and effort.

Cheers and All the Best!  
-HK sends


----------



## Wes S (Apr 9, 2022)

HK_sends said:


> New RU6 owner on board.  Just got the wrapper off so it'll be a while before I can post meaningful impressions.  My main system DAC is a R2R as well so I know the sound will be worth the patience and effort.
> 
> Cheers and All the Best!
> -HK sends


Nice!  I too own a very nice R2R/NOS desktop DAC (Sonnet Morpheus), and I am hoping the RU6 can give me that beautiful R2R/NOS sound that I love on the go.  I am looking forward to hearing how it works out for you.


----------



## Brain Damage (Apr 10, 2022)

Brain Damage said:


> Thanks @Andykong . Yes a 4.4mm male to 3.5mm female adapter is what I was referring to. Worth asking before spending money unnecessarily 👍


I am delighted to say that the Geekria Apollo 4.4mm balanced Male to 3.5mm female adapter works a treat with my Beyer DT880 Pros. It now allows me to connect these headphones to the 4.4mm output socket of the RU6. It definitely gives the additional amplification boost required to drive these headphones. They have never sounded so good. Can't get over how amazing the output power from the RU6 is for a dongle DAC.


----------



## twister6 (Apr 10, 2022)

Brain Damage said:


> I am delighted to say that the Geekria Apollo 4.4mm balanced Male to 3.5mm female adapter works a treat with my Beyer DT880 Pros. It now allows me to connect these headphones to the 4.4mm output socket of the RU6. It definitely gives the additional amplification boost required to drive these headphones. They have never sounded so good. Can't get over how amazing the output power from the RU6 is for a dongle DAC.



Wait, you took unmodified Beyer DT880 Pro cans with single ended 3.5mm TRS (L/R/Gnd) terminated cable and used balanced 3.5mm TRRS (L+/R+/L-/R-) to balanced 4.4mm TRRRS (L+/L-/R+/R-/Gnd) adapter to connect to 4.4mm BAL input of RU6?  Do you see where I'm going with this?  You can NOT convert from single ended to balanced because SE only has one left and one right channel and a common ground while balanced uses 2 differential pairs.  Basically, you can not split GND into L-/R- unless you are doing a physical DT880 mod of cutting the cable and adding headphone sockets to each earcup, like here.

The Geekria Apollo adapter is only for rare 3.5mm balanced TRRS cables (used only by some Hifiman iems) to convert them to 4.4mm balanced.  I had quite a few people pinging me about that amazon listing with geekria apollo adapter, which btw has customer warnings with people telling you not to use it with single ended 3.5mm cables.  Basically, what you are doing now is shorting 4.4mm output inside RU6 and could damage it, if it is not damaged already.


----------



## TYATYA

Brain Damage said:


> I am delighted to say that the Geekria Apollo 4.4mm balanced Male to 3.5mm female adapter works a treat with my Beyer DT880 Pros. It now allows me to connect these headphones to the 4.4mm output socket of the RU6. It definitely gives the additional amplification boost required to drive these headphones. They have never sounded so good. Can't get over how amazing the output power from the RU6 is for a dongle DAC.


I think you may want THIS:


----------



## TYATYA

twister6 said:


> Wait, you took unmodified Beyer DT880 Pro cans with single ended 3.5mm TRS (L/R/Gnd) terminated cable and used balanced 3.5mm TRRS (L+/R+/L-/R-) to balanced 4.4mm TRRRS (L+/L-/R+/R-/Gnd) adapter to connect to 4.4mm BAL input of RU6?  Do you see where I'm going with this?  You can NOT convert from single ended to balanced because SE only has one left and one right channel and a common ground while balanced uses 2 differential pairs.  Basically, you can not split GND into L-/R- unless you are doing a physical DT880 mod of cutting the cable and adding headphone sockets to each earcup, like here.
> 
> The Geekria Apollo adapter is only for rare 3.5mm balanced TRRS cables (used only by some Hifiman iems) to convert them to 4.4mm balanced.  I had quite a few people pinging me about that amazon listing with geekria apollo adapter, which btw has customer warnings with people telling you not to use it with single ended 3.5mm cables.  Basically, what you are doing now is shorting 4.4mm output inside RU6 and could damage it, if it is not damaged already.



I usually though as above post, but I found this one.
They wrote no shorting in the notes


----------



## DBaldock9

TYATYA said:


> I usually though as above post, but I found this one.
> They wrote no shorting in the notes



It looks like instead of using electronics, they're using magic...


----------



## twister6

TYATYA said:


> I usually though as above post, but I found this one.
> They wrote no shorting in the notes



That ddhifi adapter works, I have it and used it with E02 card since it has only 4.4mm output and some people were curious if they can use SE cables with it.  There is no magic in that adapter, it maps L/R/Gnd of 3.5mm TRS plug into L+/R+/Gnd of Pentaconn TRRRS plug, so you are connecting only to ONE side of balanced output.  That specific ddhifi adapter is for convenience of using your 3.5mm headphones with 4.4mm socket without any benefits of extra power from a balanced amplifier output since you are only connected to one side of balanced ckt.

The Geekria adapter which the person above was trying to use is only for 3.5mm BAL to 4.4mm BAL.  If you are using that adapter with 3.5mm SE, you can short the circuit of RU6.


----------



## Brain Damage (Apr 10, 2022)

twister6 said:


> Wait, you took unmodified Beyer DT880 Pro cans with single ended 3.5mm TRS (L/R/Gnd) terminated cable and used balanced 3.5mm TRRS (L+/R+/L-/R-) to balanced 4.4mm TRRRS (L+/L-/R+/R-/Gnd) adapter to connect to 4.4mm BAL input of RU6?  Do you see where I'm going with this?  You can NOT convert from single ended to balanced because SE only has one left and one right channel and a common ground while balanced uses 2 differential pairs.  Basically, you can not split GND into L-/R- unless you are doing a physical DT880 mod of cutting the cable and adding headphone sockets to each earcup, like here.
> 
> The Geekria Apollo adapter is only for rare 3.5mm balanced TRRS cables (used only by some Hifiman iems) to convert them to 4.4mm balanced.  I had quite a few people pinging me about that amazon listing with geekria apollo adapter, which btw has customer warnings with people telling you not to use it with single ended 3.5mm cables.  Basically, what you are doing now is shorting 4.4mm output inside RU6 and could damage it, if it is not damaged already.


Thanks for your insight - I have stopped using and have ordered the adapter you highlighted. Also tested Cayin 4.4mm with balanced iems and it's undamaged (working perfectly well). I did have a suspicion about the fact it mentioned 3.5mm balanced female connection; however, why would it still work with headphones that have an unbalanced 3.5mm single ended jack?


----------



## twister6

Brain Damage said:


> Thanks for your insight - I have stopped using and have ordered the adapter you highlighted. Also tested Cayin 4.4mm with balanced iems and it's undamaged (working perfectly well). I did have a suspicion about the fact it mentioned 3.5mm balanced female connection; however, why would it still work with headphones that have an unbalanced 3.5mm single ended jack?



There is something fishy about that Geekria Apollo adapter.  When you read customer comments under the listing, the top one says:




 

But either way, usually you can go from balanced to single ended, but not the other way around because you can't split Gnd into L-/R-.

Glad everything is working OK with your RU6   It's a fantastic dongle!


----------



## yaps66

twister6 said:


> The Geekria adapter which the person above was trying to use is only for 3.5mm BAL to 4.4mm BAL.  If you are using that adapter with 3.5mm SE, you can short the circuit of RU6.


Yikes! Certainly don't want that happening to the RU6!

It's such a sweet dongle!


----------



## majo123

There is also an ifi 3.5 to 4.4 and it works fine with no worries.
https://ifi-audio.com/products/headphone-adapter-3-5mm-to-4-4mm/


----------



## DBaldock9

twister6 said:


> That ddhifi adapter works, I have it and used it with E02 card since it has only 4.4mm output and some people were curious if they can use SE cables with it.  There is no magic in that adapter, it maps L/R/Gnd of 3.5mm TRS plug into L+/R+/Gnd of Pentaconn TRRRS plug, so you are connecting only to ONE side of balanced output.  That specific ddhifi adapter is for convenience of using your 3.5mm headphones with 4.4mm socket without any benefits of extra power from a balanced amplifier output since you are only connected to one side of balanced ckt.
> 
> The Geekria adapter which the person above was trying to use is only for 3.5mm BAL to 4.4mm BAL.  If you are using that adapter with 3.5mm SE, you can short the circuit of RU6.



So Cayin has wired the Sleeve of the 4.4mm jack to GND? In one of the Head-Fi threads, I asked about the 4.4mm GND, and the answer I remember is that with portable audio, since balanced headphones don't have "GND", the 5th contact isn't normally connected.


----------



## majo123

DBaldock9 said:


> So Cayin has wired the Sleeve of the 4.4mm jack to GND? In one of the Head-Fi threads, I asked about the 4.4mm GND, and the answer I remember is that with portable audio, since balanced headphones don't have "GND", the 5th contact isn't normally connected.


----------



## Brain Damage

DBaldock9 said:


> So Cayin has wired the Sleeve of the 4.4mm jack to GND? In one of the Head-Fi threads, I asked about the 4.4mm GND, and the answer I remember is that with portable audio, since balanced headphones don't have "GND", the 5th contact isn't normally connected.


Also, I was under the impression the Cayin RU6 isn't truly balanced based on its architecture, so how does this affect the 4.4mm output? And why would the beyerdynamic DT880s (SE 3.5mm) work at all with the Geekria Apollo adapter if the female socket on the Geekria is for balanced 3.5mm only. Is the RU6 truly balanced out of the 4.4mm or does it just offer further amplification? I don't know if it uses differential amplification (usually associated with balanced outputs). Maybe someone could offer clarity on this?


----------



## Wes S

My RU6 has arrived and I spent all night being enamored by this little wonder.  I hooked up my Kato and was completely blown away by the sound.  Using NOS mode, the holographic staging is quite impressive and the way it sounds so natural and cohesive yet still detailed and textured is stunning.  Owning a Sonnet Morpheus (very well reviewed high-end full sized NOS/R2R DAC), I have become quite familiar and in love with the NOS sound, and the RU6 does not disappoint one bit.  In fact, I was enjoying listening with the RU6 and Kato pairing last night so much, that I did not even feel the need to fire up my desktop rig, of which is a very well respected setup costing around $10k.  I have not even burned this thing in yet and it's already very impressive.  This is my first Cayin product and I can assure you it will not be my last.  Well done Cayin!


----------



## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> So Cayin has wired the Sleeve of the 4.4mm jack to GND? In one of the Head-Fi threads, I asked about the 4.4mm GND, and the answer I remember is that with portable audio, since balanced headphones don't have "GND", the 5th contact isn't normally connected.



I can't speak for others, but all 4.4mm phones out from Cayin DAP and amplifiers are grounded, we follow the JEITA definition and wired all 5 poles of our 4.4mm phone out socket properly.


----------



## Andykong (Apr 14, 2022)

Brain Damage said:


> Also, I was under the impression the Cayin RU6 isn't truly balanced based on its architecture, so how does this affect the 4.4mm output? And why would the beyerdynamic DT880s (SE 3.5mm) work at all with the Geekria Apollo adapter if the female socket on the Geekria is for balanced 3.5mm only. Is the RU6 truly balanced out of the 4.4mm or does it just offer further amplification? I don't know if it uses differential amplification (usually associated with balanced outputs). Maybe someone could offer clarity on this?



There is a difference between a fully balanced designed amplifier to a balanced-driven headphone output.

The 4.4mm phone output of RU6 is balanced driven, but the signal path is primarily a single-ended design. We added an extra op-amp (identical to the primary headphone amplification Op-Amp) in the final output stage as a unity gain amplifier, all it does is convert the original stereo signal to a negative phase. This makes the 4.4mm phone out a balanced output technically.


----------



## Andykong

Wes S said:


> My RU6 has arrived and I spent all night being enamored by this little wonder.  I hooked up my Kato and was completely blown away by the sound.  Using NOS mode, the holographic staging is quite impressive and the way it sounds so natural and cohesive yet still detailed and textured is stunning.  Owning a Sonnet Morpheus (very well reviewed high-end full sized NOS/R2R DAC), I have become quite familiar and in love with the NOS sound, and the RU6 does not disappoint one bit.  In fact, I was enjoying listening with the RU6 and Kato pairing last night so much, that I did not even feel the need to fire up my desktop rig, of which is a very well respected setup costing around $10k.  I have not even burned this thing in yet and it's already very impressive.  This is my first Cayin product and I can assure you it will not be my last.  Well done Cayin!



Thank you for your good word, comparing RU6 to a $10K high-end setup is flattering.  

Wonder what is the source you are using? a mobile phone? PC?   I haven't heard the Moondro Kato, I'll check out the RU6 and Kato paring later this month when I had the opportunity to visit a headphone shop.


----------



## Wes S (Apr 15, 2022)

Andykong said:


> Thank you for your good word, comparing RU6 to a $10K high-end setup is flattering.
> 
> Wonder what is the source you are using? a mobile phone? PC?   I haven't heard the Moondro Kato, I'll check out the RU6 and Kato paring later this month when I had the opportunity to visit a headphone shop.


Sure thing!  I like to give good products recognition and the RU6 is awesome.  I am only using a Samsung S10+ as my source at the moment, so I know it can get even better.  As for the Kato, they are fantastic for the money.  My preferences are all about being engaged with a natural tonality and timbre first and foremost and hooked up to the RU6 they don't disappoint.


----------



## Richsvt

I just purchased the RU6 and awaiting its arrival. Thought this was an easy way to hear an R2R signature without dropping a bundle of cash.


----------



## blotmouse

Richsvt said:


> Thought this was an easy way to hear an R2R signature without dropping a bundle of cash.


It is. 👍


----------



## bormak

I found it is very unstable when use with  iPhone13 (ios15.4). Both ok with MacBook and android phones.
I tried with few lighting to usb-c cables but nothing changed.



My luxury & precision w2 and lotoo paw s1 both can work great on iPhone.


----------



## Andykong

bormak said:


> I found it is very unstable when use with  iPhone13 (ios15.4). Both ok with MacBook and android phones.
> I tried with few lighting to usb-c cables but nothing changed.
> 
> 
> ...



Can you tell us what the RU6 setting (gain, volume, NOS or OS) and choice of headphones?

Regarding the USB cable, please make sure your Lightning to USB-C cable is good for 5V.  Take the OEAudio cable for example, it explained clearly that:



> Most of the Lightning OTG cables, which have output of 3.3V 100mA cannot fulfill the need for portable DACs. We redesigned the circuit, which the OEOTG cable can achieve a 5V 200mA output​


----------



## bormak

Andykong said:


> Can you tell us what the RU6 setting (gain, volume, NOS or OS) and choice of headphones?
> 
> Regarding the USB cable, please make sure your Lightning to USB-C cable is good for 5V.  Take the OEAudio cable for example, it explained clearly that:


I tried four cables also the CS-L2C 

I tried NOS and OS with both high gain and low gain. Volume around 35 -45


----------



## ducnsh

bormak said:


> I tried four cables also the CS-L2C
> 
> I tried NOS and OS with both high gain and low gain. Volume around 35 -45


I think your device has some problems, my Ru6 just unstable when volume is above 70, below that value is stable, nothing happens, tried both CS-L2C and 2 DIY Cables.


----------



## justanut

Quick update:

I've been enjoying the RU6 + WA8 combo immensely. While it's not a dedicated line-out, it might as well be on the RU6 - clean dark background at 100 volume into external amps.

RU6 + WA8 is a portable unbeatable combo for vocals, jazz, blues... lush and wet~ Just beautiful.


----------



## Edon

Hi. Is it possible to use RU6 on iPhone? I have iPhone 13 Pro. When I connected RU6 to iPhone there is no sound from 3.5 mm or 4.4mm.

I'm using cable from iFi Audio xDSD GRYPHON - it works with iPhone and Ifi or other dongles I have (like LP W2), but don't work with RU6


----------



## yaps66

Edon said:


> Hi. Is it possible to use RU6 on iPhone? I have iPhone 13 Pro. When I connected RU6 to iPhone there is no sound from 3.5 mm or 4.4mm.
> 
> I'm using cable from iFi Audio xDSD GRYPHON - it works with iPhone and Ifi or other dongles I have (like LP W2), but don't work with RU6


My RU6 works with my iPhone 11 Pro Max. I am connecting with the Cayin OTG cable that I purchased together with the RU6.


----------



## yaps66

justanut said:


> Quick update:
> 
> I've been enjoying the RU6 + WA8 combo immensely. While it's not a dedicated line-out, it might as well be on the RU6 - clean dark background at 100 volume into external amps.
> 
> RU6 + WA8 is a portable unbeatable combo for vocals, jazz, blues... lush and wet~ Just beautiful.


Nice! Amazes me that we are talking about the RU6 together with the WA8 in the same breath! The RU6 is such an outlier!


----------



## Freia

Hi, will the RU6 benefit from a linear power supply? I'm considering getting one for portable and ad hoc desktop use, or I'm better off getting a stack with the same budget?


----------



## justanut

yaps66 said:


> Nice! Amazes me that we are talking about the RU6 together with the WA8 in the same breath! The RU6 is such an outlier!


Haha yeah... it's amazing for what it does. Barely any reason for me to even consider getting a RS6 or a N6ii for R2R. I sometimes run the RU6 out through the 3Max even~


----------



## yaps66

justanut said:


> Haha yeah... it's amazing for what it does. Barely any reason for me to even consider getting a RS6 or a N6ii for R2R. I sometimes run the RU6 out through the 3Max even~


On the same token, the RU6 should pair very well with the C9 then. Interesting!


----------



## Richsvt

It is still very early in my usage but from the last few hours of use, I am very much happy with what I'm hearing. I tried some simple, loose A/B from the sources I'm using and can clearly hear the differences. I tried the OS a little but really liked the NOS much more. Love that this adds a new layer to my listening. So simple yet so enrapturing.


----------



## yaps66

Richsvt said:


> It is still very early in my usage but from the last few hours of use, I am very much happy with what I'm hearing. I tried some simple, loose A/B from the sources I'm using and can clearly hear the differences. I tried the OS a little but really liked the NOS much more. Love that this adds a new layer to my listening. So simple yet so enrapturing.


"Enrapturing" is a great way to describe it!


----------



## Wes S (Apr 19, 2022)

So, I have put quite a few hours of burn-in on my RU6 and it is continuing to impress.  Also, I just got a new Samsung S22+ and the RU6 pairs with it perfectly.  I was originally using the RU6 with my old Samsung S10+ and I was getting some intermittent noise/interference with a couple of my iems (Serial and Timeless), and I am happy to report that the noise issues are completely gone with the S22+.  I love this dongle!


----------



## lostrockets

Andykong said:


> The Ares II is superior to RU6 is all area.  FULL STOP.
> 
> I heard the Ares II in a show previously, they are very competitive for their price.  There is no way RU6 can compete with Ares II on a speaker system or a properly setup desktop heapdhone system.



How about compared to a soekris 1101 or 1321?


----------



## Wes S

The RU6 and 7hz Timeless is a killer pairing!  I listen with total amazement, and want for nothing with this combo.


----------



## RPJ12

Anyone compared the RU6 with the Mojo 2? If so, thoughts?


----------



## Nostoi

RPJ12 said:


> Anyone compared the RU6 with the Mojo 2? If so, thoughts?


None of these dongles are going to be able to compete with the Mojo2 in any form aside from perhaps a tonal similarity.


----------



## CrocodileDundee

Nostoi said:


> None of these dongles are going to be able to compete with the Mojo2 in any form aside from perhaps a tonal similarity.


size?


----------



## RPJ12 (Apr 21, 2022)

CrocodileDundee said:


> size?


Size for sure! Wondering if the warm analogue sound of R2R RU6 can me accomplished with the DSP EQ on Mojo 2 and then have the freedom to adjust for other sound signatures of other dongles or accordingly for headphones/IEMs. I currently just have a set of 64Audio A12ts. Obviously cant really change the soundstage but sound profile freedom would be cool.


----------



## peterinvan

Low Gain/High Vol?

Any opinion on using low gain with higher volune, vs. High gain with lower volume??


----------



## peterinvan

I have been enjoying my Focal Elegias (Dekoni Fenestrated Sheepskin pads) with the RU6, out of my iPad Pro.  
It drives the Focals with a firm grip.  Great match IMHO.


----------



## Nostoi

Nostoi said:


> None of these dongles are going to be able to compete with the Mojo2 in any form aside from perhaps a tonal similarity.


I have obtained the RU6 since this remark. To my ears, better than S1, S2, W2. But still, nowhere close to Mojo2. That said, probably the best dongle I've heard. W2 is more defined but rather anemic in timbre.


----------



## RPJ12

Nostoi said:


> I have obtained the RU6 since this remark. To my ears, better than S1, S2, W2. But still, nowhere close to Mojo2. That said, probably the best dongle I've heard. W2 is more defined but rather anemic in timbre.


I also enjoyed the RU6 over all the ones you listed. By a long shot. It has so much more character but still maintains details and all the other technical stuff. 

What does it lack in comparison to Mojo 2 in your mind?


----------



## Nostoi

RPJ12 said:


> I also enjoyed the RU6 over all the ones you listed. By a long shot. It has so much more character but still maintains details and all the other technical stuff.
> 
> What does it lack in comparison to Mojo 2 in your mind?


The Mojo 2 basically has more authority in every area - power, dynamics, imaging, detail, soundstage, etc. 

But this is to be expected: the RU6 is a dongle, Mojo 2 is a DAC/AMP unit that can compete with 1k DAPs (if not beyond). 

RU6 is very good, though. Cayin have done a great job on it.


----------



## Nostoi

I'd also say - I was quite impressed with both C9 and WA8 pairing on the RU6 despite the lack of LO. It scales well especially on SE mode.


----------



## audio123

Cayin RU6 + PW First Times Type C to Type C is wow. The sonic improvement is big.


----------



## Wes S

audio123 said:


> Cayin RU6 + PW First Times Type C to Type C is wow. The sonic improvement is big.


Awesome!  Is this a custom order, or where can I find this?


----------



## audio123

Wes S said:


> Awesome!  Is this a custom order, or where can I find this?


Custom order.


----------



## Richsvt

@audio123 That PW Audio connector looks very nice. Please relate any feedback about how it changed the quality. I'm a sucker for a good connector...


----------



## antdroid

Bought one earlier this week from MusicTeck and they just arrived. 
I normally don't put too much stock into burn-in, but with my R-2R experience, I've seen some subtle changes over time with burn-in and also with just leaving them on. Now gotta figure out how to keep this thing warm. 

Initial impressions out of the box:
Warm lows, generally soft sound. Upper-mids is slightly peak with a bit of harshness. Treble is roll-off but gently and not bothersome. (generally sweet).  
Using the Unique Melody MEST Custom with 4.4mm balance cable.


----------



## ClicketEKlack

antdroid said:


> Bought one earlier this week from MusicTeck and they just arrived.
> I normally don't put too much stock into burn-in, but with my R-2R experience, I've seen some subtle changes over time with burn-in and also with just leaving them on. Now gotta figure out how to keep this thing warm.
> 
> Initial impressions out of the box:
> ...


How do you feel the RU6 compares to the iBasso DAP?


----------



## antdroid

ClicketEKlack said:


> How do you feel the RU6 compares to the iBasso DAP?



Very brief and quick impressions:

Song: Joy of my Life from Chris Stapleton

iBasso DX240 (Amp8 MK2) - This one is slightly more leaner, but with a small amount of better clarity and detail. It sounds a little more effortless and graceful with a more balanced and even sound signature. It has more mature sound to it overall.

RU-6, NOS - This is much more mid-focused sounding, and with more emphasis on the low-mids and mid-bass region. There's more meat in drum kicks, and Stapleton's voice sounds deeper and thicker. Overall warmer tonality.

I already starting to hear the upper-mid harshness wearing out now after about 30 mins of use.


----------



## Richsvt (Apr 29, 2022)

While using with the DX160, in NOS mode, see it as a little more forward in the mids, bass and treble almost the same. I use this almost always in NOS. Still trying to balance its positioning when attached to another device. First time using such a dongle. I really like its signature. I've been a DAP guy for so long that it's a change for me. Listening to Ringo on my Macbook and it's great:


----------



## trez0r

antdroid said:


> CUT
> 
> Initial impressions out of the box:
> Warm lows, generally soft sound. Upper-mids is slightly peak with a bit of harshness. Treble is roll-off but gently and not bothersome. (generally sweet).
> Using the Unique Melody MEST Custom with 4.4mm balance cable.


If U hear harshness after burn-in, I suggest to connect RU6 to e.g. phone rather PC. I think low powered usbs something taming those peaks


----------



## MeetYourMaker

What smartphone do you use with your ru6 dongle? I've been using my LG V30 for many years, never felt the need to upgrade smartphone often because I only use it to make phone calls, music listening and occasionally check emails. Unfortunately my V30 isn't working properly anymore, and LG discontinued making phones and so I thought about choosing other brand


----------



## Brain Damage

MeetYourMaker said:


> What smartphone do you use with your ru6 dongle? I've been using my LG V30 for many years, never felt the need to upgrade smartphone often because I only use it to make phone calls, music listening and occasionally check emails. Unfortunately my V30 isn't working properly anymore, and LG discontinued making phones and so I thought about choosing other brand


It is a V30 I use, although I have been of late using my old phone - HTC Desire 10 pro with a micro USB to USB C OTG adapter. Have purchased a second hand V40 to supersede the HTC, but also to sample for myself the difference in tuning between the Bang & Olufsen Quad DAC v Meridian's.


----------



## blotmouse

MeetYourMaker said:


> What smartphone do you use with your ru6 dongle? I've been using my LG V30 for many years, never felt the need to upgrade smartphone often because I only use it to make phone calls, music listening and occasionally check emails. Unfortunately my V30 isn't working properly anymore, and LG discontinued making phones and so I thought about choosing other brand


iPhone, 13 or 12 or, idk actually. iOS 14 maybe, super don't care, and doesn't matter. 
If you are buying to also be the best transport for the RU6, get the biggest battery you can find with as much power to external devices they advertise. Limitless if possible, lol.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

MeetYourMaker said:


> What smartphone do you use with your ru6 dongle? I've been using my LG V30 for many years, never felt the need to upgrade smartphone often because I only use it to make phone calls, music listening and occasionally check emails. Unfortunately my V30 isn't working properly anymore, and LG discontinued making phones and so I thought about choosing other brand


I switch between LG G7, LG G8x & Tab S6 for portable use. If you are looking for a phone with a good DAC, ROG Phone 5 looks like a good replacement for LG. The X10T II is also an interesting product, should provide a clean signal but not sure if it outputs enough power to drive a batteryless DAC.


----------



## chemosapien

Just got the ru6 from musictek open box sale a few days back, I've been listening to it as much as my batteries will allow sourced out of an ibasso dx160 directly into dunu zen pro iems, and also having it feed into my xduoo mt604 both into zen pros and a creative stage air soundbar. I've been listening exclusively in os mode to many flac files and some bt streaming the audio from my phone(mostly YouTube videos).


I have been very impressed by a clear improvement across the board, exceptional vocals and truly amazing clarity in the bass rumble.  The difference is so clear that I can't listen to the dx160 on its own anymore, without either the tubes mt604 or the r2r ru6(or both) the dx160 sounds weak, slow, muddied, just unmistakably worse in all respects... and yet just a couple months ago I was impressed by how awesome an improvement the dx160 alone was over my phone and laptop audio...I guess that's just how this hobby goes


----------



## Wes S

.


----------



## Wes S

audio123 said:


> Cayin RU6 + PW First Times Type C to Type C is wow. The sonic improvement is big.


After seeing this post, I am gonna do a bit of testing today with some lower cost options, just to see what kind of difference they make.  Of course, these are not at the level of the First Times. . .


----------



## nymz

Can someone give me a rundown of the top differences between Class A (that I own) and R2R? Is it worth?


----------



## chemosapien

nymz said:


> Can someone give me a rundown of the top differences between Class A (that I own) and R2R? Is it worth?


Well the quick rundown is class a refers to a type of amp, while r2r is a type of dac...r2r is usually compared to delta sigma dacs, which is the only other type of dac I know, generally r2r is said to give better vocals and a more natural sound, but that is an over simplification.


----------



## Wes S (May 2, 2022)

Wes S said:


> After seeing this post, I am gonna do a bit of testing today with some lower cost options, just to see what kind of difference they make.  Of course, these are not at the level of the First Times. . .


The GU Craftsman for the win, with deeper harder hitting bass, more detail and bite in the mids and highs, bigger/deeper stage expansion, and a blacker background.   The DD Hifi was very similar to the stock Cayin cable, being a bit smoother in the mids and top end.  Now, I am interested in seeing what some higher end offerings will bring. . .


----------



## dakchi

Wes S said:


> The GU Craftsman for the win, with deeper harder hitting bass, more detail and bite in the mids and highs, bigger/deeper stage expansion, and a blacker background.   The DD Hifi was very similar to the stock Cayin cable, being a bit smoother in the mids and top end.  Now, I am interested in seeing what some higher end offerings will bring. . .


Where did you get it from? I can't find it in Aliexpress


----------



## chemosapien

dakchi said:


> Where did you get it from? I can't find it in Aliexpress


https://www.amazon.com/GUCraftsman-...ystal-XD-05PLUS/dp/B09MLFPLZS?ref_=ast_sto_dp


----------



## dakchi

chemosapien said:


> https://www.amazon.com/GUCraftsman-...ystal-XD-05PLUS/dp/B09MLFPLZS?ref_=ast_sto_dp


Thanks. It's not available


----------



## Wes S

dakchi said:


> Where did you get it from? I can't find it in Aliexpress


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09MLFPLZS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## justanut

Wes S said:


> The GU Craftsman for the win, with deeper harder hitting bass, more detail and bite in the mids and highs, bigger/deeper stage expansion, and a blacker background.   The DD Hifi was very similar to the stock Cayin cable, being a bit smoother in the mids and top end.  Now, I am interested in seeing what some higher end offerings will bring. . .


But... it isn't an analog cable... Ok nvm, taboo subject haha...


----------



## Wes S (May 2, 2022)

justanut said:


> But... it isn't an analog cable... Ok nvm, taboo subject haha...


Let's not go there.  I have a feeling I know which camp you are in and it's all good either way.


----------



## Zachik

Wes S said:


> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09MLFPLZS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


The amazon photos make the wires look a different color than your earlier photos! 
I wonder if that is due to lighting, or whether these guys change the wire material depending on availability (and thus may sound very different)...


----------



## Wes S (May 2, 2022)

Zachik said:


> The amazon photos make the wires look a different color than your earlier photos!
> I wonder if that is due to lighting, or whether these guys change the wire material depending on availability (and thus may sound very different)...


Just different lighting.  The guy that make cables for GU Craftsman has been using the exact same 6n silver wire for years, and has nothing but positive reviews.  I wouldn't ever share a link to a seller that did shady stuff like that.


----------



## Currawong

justanut said:


> But... it isn't an analog cable... Ok nvm, taboo subject haha...


No mystery here. USB cable should have a 90 Ohm characteristic impedance. If not, you get signal reflections (readily visible on a 'scope) which affect different components to different degrees.  Different amounts of shielding may affect things as well.   I've tried the OE cables, which use proper USB 2.0 spec shielded cable, and noticed a bit of difference from the stock cable as well. I highly doubt that the braided silver cable is to USB spec, but it something is more sonically pleasing, then I don't see why it would matter.


----------



## TYATYA

https://www.fujiya-avic.co.jp/shop/g/g200000060693/

Is there anyone tried it yet?


----------



## dakchi

TYATYA said:


> https://www.fujiya-avic.co.jp/shop/g/g200000060693/
> 
> Is there anyone tried it yet?


what justifies such price tag for a very short cable!


----------



## chemosapien

dakchi said:


> what justifies such price tag for a very short cable!


Shielding and quality of materials used in the conductor mostly.  It's a common myth to believe that because a signal is digital it has perfect integrity and coherence... this is plainly false.


----------



## TYATYA

dakchi said:


> what justifies such price tag for a very short cable!


Its price tag apprx $95 for a Furutech's product. I think it is usual.
Cost comes from both brand and processing tech.


----------



## chemosapien

Wes S said:


> The GU Craftsman for the win, with deeper harder hitting bass, more detail and bite in the mids and highs, bigger/deeper stage expansion, and a blacker background.   The DD Hifi was very similar to the stock Cayin cable, being a bit smoother in the mids and top end.  Now, I am interested in seeing what some higher end offerings will bring. . .


I snagged one of those silver gucraftsman interconnects myself and tried it out, and while I haven't done a/b testing to see if I hear a difference, I have noticed that it's improved the battery life...I suspect the lower impedance of the silver is causing less drain.


----------



## justanut

Currawong said:


> No mystery here. USB cable should have a 90 Ohm characteristic impedance. If not, you get signal reflections (readily visible on a 'scope) which affect different components to different degrees.  Different amounts of shielding may affect things as well.   I've tried the OE cables, which use proper USB 2.0 spec shielded cable, and noticed a bit of difference from the stock cable as well. I highly doubt that the braided silver cable is to USB spec, but it something is more sonically pleasing, then I don't see why it would matter.


Love my OEAudio USB C-C cable as well. No sonic differences noticed, except no iPhone power issues, and less noticeable interference. I will never understand how cable material affects bits... but I guess if you hear them you hear them. Enjoy the music!


----------



## MeetYourMaker

Can you help me choose an IEMs that work best with the RU6? My budget is $800-$1000. I came across an IEMs ranking list by a head-fi member named crinacle and his most value IEMs pick is the thieaudio monarch mkii, which is within my budget so this is what I lean toward, I just don't know how this IEMs will sound with my RU6


----------



## chemosapien

MeetYourMaker said:


> Can you help me choose an IEMs that work best with the RU6? My budget is $800-$1000. I came across an IEMs ranking list by a head-fi member named crinacle and his most value IEMs pick is the thieaudio monarch mkii, which is within my budget so this is what I lean toward, I just don't know how this IEMs will sound with my RU6


Friend, a brief word on professional reviewers... they're shills, take anything they say very critically and as a rough starting point for your own research at best... consider the type of music you listen to, try to audition a few different kinds like DD, BA, hybrids, planars...any iem will sound much better on the ru6 than from a phone alone


----------



## Vanquished

MeetYourMaker said:


> Can you help me choose an IEMs that work best with the RU6? My budget is $800-$1000. I came across an IEMs ranking list by a head-fi member named crinacle and his most value IEMs pick is the thieaudio monarch mkii, which is within my budget so this is what I lean toward, I just don't know how this IEMs will sound with my RU6


It's all on you. One will work for someone but it won't work for you. Go in a hifi store and try different earphones or buy online and return them if you don't like them. No one can decide for you what are your music tastes and preferences.


----------



## antdroid

MeetYourMaker said:


> Can you help me choose an IEMs that work best with the RU6? My budget is $800-$1000. I came across an IEMs ranking list by a head-fi member named crinacle and his most value IEMs pick is the thieaudio monarch mkii, which is within my budget so this is what I lean toward, I just don't know how this IEMs will sound with my RU6


I have my own ranking list (in my sig), but you need to provide more info than a budget. You'll need type of music you listen to, your current or current gear you like, etc... otherwise you can be recommended anything from something super-bassy to something super bright and anything in-between. It's a pretty personal thing as you'll see people disagree a lot on what they think is good and bad.


----------



## 426563

Which portable amp can you recommend for the Cayin RU6 that doesn't distort the sound, doesn't make it cleaner and has decent power?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> doesn't make it cleaner


?


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> ?



by clean I mean sterile. I want an amp that doesn't distort the sound but has a high output power and that can be combined with the RU6


----------



## DBaldock9 (May 5, 2022)

DrSteinein said:


> by clean I mean sterile. I want an amp that doesn't distort the sound but has a high output power and that can be combined with the RU6



If you order a KAEI TAP-1S, you have the option of getting the desktop power supply, or operating it from the internal rechargeable battery. You also have the option of switching the vacuum tube input section on or off; and using the balanced or single-ended input, and output.  The power output into 32-Ω ranges from 1.5-W/ch (battery) to 2.45-W/ch (power supply).

EDIT:  There are also 2x socketed dual op-amps that can be swapped - but due to the case design, only devices around the height of a standard DIP will fit, and not the various discrete op-amps.  Even the fairly short Burson V5i-Dual is too tall.  The amp is available from Linsoul - https://www.linsoul.com/products/wishcolor-kaei-tap-1s?variant=42342154207449

NOTE: The photos I've seen of the amp all show a gain switch on the back, with 0dB & -6dB, but the amp I received has the switch labeled as 10dB & 0dB.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> by clean I mean sterile. I want an amp that doesn't distort the sound but has a high output power and that can be combined with the RU6


Got it. The xCAN would be my rec, if you can find it. Other non-sterile alternatives are Gryphon (my setup with RU6) or the XD-05 Plus/BAL with an Opamp swap to suit your tastes, I recommend Burson v5i.

On the higher end, I've read a lot of good things about Cayin C9 and RU6 pairing.


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> Got it. The xCAN would be my rec, if you can find it. Other non-sterile alternatives are Gryphon (my setup with RU6) or the XD-05 Plus/BAL with an Opamp swap to suit your tastes, I recommend Burson v5i.
> 
> On the higher end, I've read a lot of good things about Cayin C9 and RU6 pairing.


Thqnk you very much for your choices. Which one is the best for sensitive Custom InEars? Is the Gryphon worth twice the price?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> Thqnk you very much for your choices. Which one is the best for sensitive Custom InEars? Is the Gryphon worth twice the price?


Gryphon has a fair amount of noise (Balanced Out) which can be eliminated using the inbuilt IEMatch setting, toggling it "On" does increase the Output Impedence upto 10 Ohm if I remeber correctly, which effects the frequency response of some IEMs for better or for worse. 

It's been a while since I sold my xCAN but I don't remeber it being noisy. The XD-05 Plus has some noise (less than Gryphon), XD-05 BAL has even lesser noise. You can get the IEMatch accessory if you do notice noise with sensitive IEM's.

As an AIO package, Gryphon does a lot of things right, but if you don't need the extra features i.e. purely considering sound quality, it's not worth the cost. To my ears, the micro iDSD Signature was a better product for a modest increase in price over the Gryphon. the XD-05 BAL is a better AIO option IMO because it costs less and sounds just as good as Gryphon with the ability to swap Opamps to tune the overall sound.

To pair with the RU6 and with cost to performence in mind, the xCAN>BAL>Gryphon.


----------



## Currawong

chemosapien said:


> Friend, a brief word on professional reviewers... they're shills, take anything they say very critically and as a rough starting point for your own research at best... consider the type of music you listen to, try to audition a few different kinds like DD, BA, hybrids, planars...any iem will sound much better on the ru6 than from a phone alone


Hi from a "professional reviewer". 

Definitely consider music first, but also, critically, how loud you listen. The demands on amplification rise exponentially with volume.


----------



## chemosapien

Currawong said:


> Hi from a "professional reviewer".
> 
> Definitely consider music first, but also, critically, how loud you listen. The demands on amplification rise exponentially with volume.


C'mon now aus bro, you know I didn't mean anything by that, everybody wants your to hear your recommendations on the best high power tube amp to pair with the ru6.


----------



## 426563 (May 7, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> Gryphon has a fair amount of noise (Balanced Out) which can be eliminated using the inbuilt IEMatch setting, toggling it "On" does increase the Output Impedence upto 10 Ohm if I remeber correctly, which effects the frequency response of some IEMs for better or for worse.
> 
> It's been a while since I sold my xCAN but I don't remeber it being noisy. The XD-05 Plus has some noise (less than Gryphon), XD-05 BAL has even lesser noise. You can get the IEMatch accessory if you do notice noise with sensitive IEM's.
> 
> ...


I could get the xCan for 200€. I love the RU6 in combination with my Vision Ears VE8 Custom InEars, but I have the feeling that when the volume is lower, the dynamics and the definition in the sound suffer. With high gain, I get nicer, stronger, more lifelike vocals, but the hissing and hissing noises make it not the most pleasant experience. My hope is that with an external amp there is more power behind the sound even at low volume, so that the sound sounds full even at lower volume and low gain on the RU6. Should I get the xCan for my purpose?


----------



## chemosapien

If there's a drawback to the ru6 it's the significant battery draw and the fact that it doesn't work properly at low volumes... Feeding into my mt604 it still needs significant volume, at least 30+, to sound good, but boy does it sound good 

I've found that getting all pure silver for the interconnects helps with the battery life, the lower impedance wire draws less


----------



## 426563

chemosapien said:


> If there's a drawback to the ru6 it's the significant battery draw and the fact that it doesn't work properly at low volumes... Feeding into my mt604 it still needs significant volume, at least 30+, to sound good, but boy does it sound good
> 
> I've found that getting all pure silver for the interconnects helps with the battery life, the lower impedance wire draws less



I don't want to move on that territory. I only have two choices. Either an external amp that regulates the power better even at low volume or a device up to €500 that has the same sound level but also has a lot more power


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> Gryphon has a fair amount of noise (Balanced Out) which can be eliminated using the inbuilt IEMatch setting, toggling it "On" does increase the Output Impedence upto 10 Ohm if I remeber correctly, which effects the frequency response of some IEMs for better or for worse.
> 
> It's been a while since I sold my xCAN but I don't remeber it being noisy. The XD-05 Plus has some noise (less than Gryphon), XD-05 BAL has even lesser noise. You can get the IEMatch accessory if you do notice noise with sensitive IEM's.
> 
> ...



Which cable do I need to connect the Cayin RU6 to the xCan to operate both as Balanced on my mobile phone via USB C


----------



## HiFlight (May 7, 2022)

I


chemosapien said:


> If there's a drawback to the ru6 it's the significant battery draw and the fact that it doesn't work properly at low volumes... Feeding into my mt604 it still needs significant volume, at least 30+, to sound good, but boy does it sound good
> 
> I've found that getting all pure silver for the interconnects helps with the battery life, the lower impedance wire draws less


I'm not sure that your final statement is correct as an infinitely high impedance (IE: unplugging the interconnects ) would draw zero current.  According to Ohm's Law, increasing resistance decreases current.  ( E/R=I )
Below is a practical rather than theoretical example:

Silver and Copper Conductivity

 Measured in ohms, the difference in the resistance (the amount of electricity lost as a current travels from point A to point B through a material) of 24-gauge, 1000-foot-long silver and copper wire is minor. The resistance of the *copper wire is a mere 2 ohms higher*.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> I could get the xCan for 200€. I love the RU6 in combination with my Vision Ears VE8 Custom InEars, but I have the feeling that when the volume is lower, the dynamics and the definition in the sound suffer. With high gain, I get nicer, stronger, more lifelike vocals, but the hissing and hissing noises make it not the most pleasant experience. My hope is that with an external amp there is more power behind the sound even at low volume, so that the sound sounds full even at lower volume and low gain on the RU6. Should I get the xCan for my purpose?


With my gear, I don't have any of the issues you mentioned. I'm using Kinera Norn, CA Mammoth & Meze 99C. Infact, RU6 has lower noise than Gryphon or XD-05 Plus in my testing.

If you just want to eliminate noise and have some headroom, why not give just the IEMatch a try? If power is also an issue then external Amp is worth a try.


DrSteinein said:


> Which cable do I need to connect the Cayin RU6 to the xCan to operate both as Balanced on my mobile phone via USB C


For the xCAN you need a short 3.5mm to 3.5mm Aux cable, you can use the Balanced Headphone out on the xCAN even with SE Input so a 4.4mm (RU6) to 2.5mm (xCAN) won't be necessary i think, maybe it will have a bit more power because of higher power output on RU6 with 4.4? need to test that.

Remeber to Max the volume on phone & RU6, volume adjustments should be done on the xCAN.


----------



## chemosapien

HiFlight said:


> I
> 
> I'm not sure that your final statement is correct as an infinitely high impedance (IE: unplugging the interconnects ) would draw zero current.  According to Ohm's Law, increasing resistance decreases current.  ( E/R=I )
> Below is a practical rather than theoretical example:
> ...


The numbers you are using there are for the theoretical maximum purity metals, and for equal cross sectional areas of wire... Neither are true in this case because the stock cable is much smaller cross sectional area than the gucraftsman silver cable


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> With my gear, I don't have any of the issues you mentioned. I'm using Kinera Norn, CA Mammoth & Meze 99C. Infact, RU6 has lower noise than Gryphon or XD-05 Plus in my testing.
> 
> If you just want to eliminate noise and have some headroom, why not give just the IEMatch a try? If power is also an issue then external Amp is worth a try.
> 
> ...


I use other headphones, of course the experience is always different and not universally applicable and representative. That's why I can only say how it is with the VE8. Do you think the xCan would help? would it bring more volume or power at a lower volume


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> I use other headphones, of course the experience is always different and not universally applicable and representative. That's why I can only say how it is with the VE8. Do you think the xCan would help? would it bring more volume or power at a lower volume


xCAN will drive some IEMs/Headphones with more authority compared to RU6 sure and the onboard DSP is nice to have, the trade off is a small decrease in clarity, probably because of double amping but in this case that can't be avoided.

For my gear (Norn, Diana, Meze, Mammoth...) this is not much of an issue, and I will confidently recommend xCAN to anyone using similar gear, with VE8 🤷‍♂️. If you don't mind the risk, go for the xCAN. If not, hopefully someone else here can chime in.


----------



## 426563

Thank you please send me a link for the cable i need to run it balanced


----------



## Johnfg465vd (May 7, 2022)

DrSteinein said:


> Thank you please send me a link for the cable i need to run it balanced


get a cable like this





google is your friend here, I have no experience with this type of cable.

Just to clarify RU6 does not have a true balanced output and so you won't get better sound using 4.4 out, just more power and even if you use 3.5 input with xCAN, you can use the balanced headphone out of xCAN for more power without any issues.


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> get a cable like this
> 
> 
> google is your friend here, I have no experience with this type of cable.
> ...



Im just found cables like this no others


----------



## Andykong

chemosapien said:


> If there's a drawback to the ru6 it's the significant battery draw and the fact that it doesn't work properly at low volumes... Feeding into my mt604 it still needs significant volume, at least 30+, to sound good, but boy does it sound good
> 
> I've found that getting all pure silver for the interconnects helps with the battery life, the lower impedance wire draws less



It'll need significant volume, at least 30?  Do you refer to the volume level of RU6 or the volume of your mobile phone after connecting to RU6?


----------



## Andykong (May 7, 2022)

MeetYourMaker said:


> What smartphone do you use with your ru6 dongle? I've been using my LG V30 for many years, never felt the need to upgrade smartphone often because I only use it to make phone calls, music listening and occasionally check emails. Unfortunately my V30 isn't working properly anymore, and LG discontinued making phones and so I thought about choosing other brand


Can't tell exactly which mobile is the best match, but I'll recommend you to avoid:

Apple phones because they strict the power supply to peripherals.
Google *Pixel 6 *can't work with external DAC, Google is working on the bug and expect to provide a solution by June, but we better wait till someone test and confirm that the fix is working fine with popular Dongle and DACs.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> Im just found cables like this no others


you can find the cable on AliExpress. If not, look at Linsoul, Hifigo...


----------



## chemosapien (May 7, 2022)

Andykong said:


> It'll need significant volume, at least 30?  Do you refer to the volume level of RU6 or the volume of your mobile phone after connecting to RU6?


I was referring to the volume on the ru6, I connect my dx160 to it and the volume control on the dx160 does nothing at all at that point, but that is for feeding into my amp, the mt604, and I believe that volume setting is what's an approximation of a line level out since ru6 doesn't have a set line level out


----------



## Ckro

Joining the pack.
Using the RU6 with a DCA Aeon Closed RT, so far so good, I do like what I hear. 

Will spend more time with iems tomorrow.


----------



## quawn0418

Hey guys, i just purchased the RU6 to use on the go with my UM Mest OG and while I’m loving the sound and will be keeping it (the Shanling UA5 loses)…I’m surprised to see that people are using it with external amps even tho there’s no line out functionality, isn’t that unpractical? Or has cayin deemed it safe? I’m just a bit confused is all


----------



## TYATYA

quawn0418 said:


> Hey guys, i just purchased the RU6 to use on the go with my UM Mest OG and while I’m loving the sound and will be keeping it (the Shanling UA5 loses)…I’m surprised to see that people are using it with external amps even tho there’s no line out functionality, isn’t that unpractical? Or has cayin deemed it safe? I’m just a bit confused is all


It works like a preamp for that case.
Also if connect an SP2000 to a hp amp it also double amping, isn't it?


----------



## quawn0418

TYATYA said:


> It works like a preamp for that case.
> Also if connect an SP2000 to a hp amp it also double amping, isn't it?


Yea that’s what i mean, couldn’t think of the correct term, but double amping is what i meant.


----------



## HiFlight (May 13, 2022)

Double-amping is not really an issue when using it as a source for your headphone amp as the amp input impedance is very high, typically about 50K ohms hence making an extremely easy load for the RU6.


----------



## slex

quawn0418 said:


> Hey guys, i just purchased the RU6 to use on the go with my UM Mest OG and while I’m loving the sound and will be keeping it (the Shanling UA5 loses)…I’m surprised to see that people are using it with external amps even tho there’s no line out functionality, isn’t that unpractical? Or has cayin deemed it safe? I’m just a bit confused is all


Nothing wrong to attach ext.amp to RU6, i just set volume at 99 from RU6. Abit cumbersome if you bringing it outdoor for the setup.


----------



## Andykong

quawn0418 said:


> Hey guys, i just purchased the RU6 to use on the go with my UM Mest OG and while I’m loving the sound and will be keeping it (the Shanling UA5 loses)…I’m surprised to see that people are using it with external amps even tho there’s no line out functionality, isn’t that unpractical? Or has cayin deemed it safe? I’m just a bit confused is all





slex said:


> Nothing wrong to attach ext.amp to RU6, i just set volume at 99 from RU6. Abit cumbersome if you bringing it outdoor for the setup.


Double amping is safe, especially with low output devices such as Dongle DAC. it might introduce audible distortion with some combination, but it is unlikely that it will blow anything up unless you abuse your equipment.  

For Dongle DAC that uses the digital volume of the delta-sigma DAC chipset, we normally set it to full output so that you can get full output from the DAC chipset.

For Dongle DAC that uses dedicated analog volume such as RU6, since the DAC circuit always outputs at full power and you are controlling the volume in the analog domain, there is no need to go for full output when double amping.  I suggest you start with 70 and then gradually move up to 85 and find the sweet spot for your setup.  This sweet spot is a variable that depends on the matching with your amplifier in the second half of the chain.  This is what we did on desktop systems when we want to add a preamp to an integrated amp., we never push the preamp to full output when we do that.


----------



## yaps66

Andykong said:


> Double amping is safe, especially with low output devices such as Dongle DAC. it might introduce audible distortion with some combination, but it is unlikely that it will blow anything up unless you abuse your equipment.
> 
> For Dongle DAC that uses the digital volume of the delta-sigma DAC chipset, we normally set it to full output so that you can get full output from the DAC chipset.
> 
> For Dongle DAC that uses dedicated analog volume such as RU6, since the DAC circuit always outputs at full power and you are controlling the volume in the analog domain, there is no need to go for full output when double amping.  I suggest you start with 70 and then gradually move up to 85 and find the sweet spot for your setup.  This sweet spot is a variable that depends on the matching with your amplifier in the second half of the chain.  This is what we did on desktop systems when we want to add a preamp to an integrated amp., we never push the preamp to full output when we do that.


That's very useful. Thanks Andy!


----------



## antdroid

I've been using RU6, NOS, Low Gain at 75 to the iBasso P5 Amp last few days and enjoy having a proper volume knob on my desk at work. Also gives me a little more power to use with my Hifimans at work.


----------



## TYATYA

Long time plugging hd800s (directly)  into ru6 again.
This cans very sensitive with input signal and it is so clear below things:
1. L gain sounds better than H
H gain sounds dry and has a tiny echoing effect to hd800s.
2. NOS has more base and boomming mid, more musical. Hd800s love this mode.
OS has more brightness on treble and thinning mid. More "clarity" and sharpness


----------



## DBaldock9

For the last month, I've had my RU6 connected as one of the USB DACs on my Linux PC at home - really enjoy how it sounds.
Until I get my Balanced Passive Attenuator / Switch Box assembled, the RU6 is the only Balanced output DAC I can connect directly (4.4mm <-> 4.4mm) to my KAEI TAP-1S amp.
Otherwise, my Topping D70 DAC is connected directly (XLR <> XLR) to my Loxjie P20 amp.
Once the Switch Box, and all the adapter cables, are finished - any Balanced output can be switched to any input (it also attenuates / switches single-ended signals).
It's also going to have a "Master Mute" switch - to allow for quick "commercial killing" when watching TV (I still have to design/assemble the individual channel mute boards).


----------



## Stuff Jones

Andykong said:


> For Dongle DAC that uses dedicated analog volume such as RU6, since the DAC circuit always outputs at full power and you are controlling the volume in the analog domain, there is no need to go for full output when double amping.  I suggest you start with 70 and then gradually move up to 85 and find the sweet spot for your setup.  This sweet spot is a variable that depends on the matching with your amplifier in the second half of the chain.  This is what we did on desktop systems when we want to add a preamp to an integrated amp., we never push the preamp to full output when we do that.



Thanks for this tip - I was wearing out my volume buttons going between my IEM listening level of 30ish and my amp input volume level of 100. Why do you recommend the 70 to 85 range?


----------



## Brain Damage

I've been listening to the RU6 in NOS mode LdB with my Tin HiFi T4s using a Linsoul Tripowin Zonie 16 core silver plated 4.4mm balanced cable. Honestly, this is the closest to endgame I've been. I can't imagine any improvement. Simply a delight.


----------



## 426563

Does it worth to upgrade from the RU6 to the Fiio 15 or the Sony WM1A?


----------



## Stuff Jones

DrSteinein said:


> Does it worth to upgrade from the RU6 to the Fiio 15 or the Sony WM1A?



Once you go R2R you can't go back.


----------



## chemosapien

DrSteinein said:


> Does it worth to upgrade from the RU6 to the Fiio 15 or the Sony WM1A?


I have a Sony Xperia pro I, and I can confirm that the dsee ultimate oversampling is nice but just doesn't hold water compared to the ru6


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> Does it worth to upgrade from the RU6 to the Fiio 15 or the Sony WM1A?


You are going to get a more refined sound for sure, improved details, separation, power... but if you are looking for a direct portable upgrade, why not consider getting R2r DAPs like HiBy RS6 or Cayin N6ii (with R01 board). I've heard the M11 and have read that it has a similar sound signature to M15 but less refined. To me it was a few steps ahead of the RU6 in technicalities, power and refinement but not as musical.


----------



## justanut

DrSteinein said:


> Does it worth to upgrade from the RU6 to the Fiio 15 or the Sony WM1A?


What are you trying to improve? Adding an amp might be a more worthwhile upgrade imo. Unless u want an all in one.


----------



## Stuff Jones

justanut said:


> What are you trying to improve? Adding an amp might be a more worthwhile upgrade imo. Unless u want an all in one.



If you want to listen in one place, I can vouch for the sound of the RU6 + Schiit Vali 2+. For 400 dollars you have a nice little R2R + tubes desktop setup.


----------



## 426563

Stuff Jones said:


> If you want to listen in one place, I can vouch for the sound of the RU6 + Schiit Vali 2+. For 400 dollars you have a nice little R2R + tubes desktop setup.


Thats a nice idea! But the Vali 2 ist sold out everythere


----------



## Stuff Jones

DrSteinein said:


> Thats a nice idea! But the Vali 2 ist sold out everythere



Not here: https://www.schiit.com/products/vali-3


----------



## 426563

Johnfg465vd said:


> You are going to get a more refined sound for sure, improved details, separation, power... but if you are looking for a direct portable upgrade, why not consider getting R2r DAPs like HiBy RS6 or Cayin N6ii (with R01 board). I've heard the M11 and have read that it has a similar sound signature to M15 but less refined. To me it was a few steps ahead of the RU6 in technicalities, power and refinement but not as musical.



How does compared the sound between the HiBy RS6 or Cayin N6ii (with R01 board)? I would get the RS6 for around 700€ maybe i would give it a try


----------



## chemosapien

DrSteinein said:


> How does compared the sound between the HiBy RS6 or Cayin N6ii (with R01 board)? I would get the RS6 for around 700€ maybe i would give it a try


There's two major factors in r2r decoders, the total number of resistors and the precision of the matching of the resistors, ru6 is the most budget friendly entry into r2r and while it sounds very nice coming from budget tier delta sigma dacs, it is a clear step down from hiby or the r01, which are fairly close in performance to each other


----------



## 426563

chemosapien said:


> There's two major factors in r2r decoders, the total number of resistors and the precision of the matching of the resistors, ru6 is the most budget friendly entry into r2r and while it sounds very nice coming from budget tier delta sigma dacs, it is a clear step down from hiby or the r01, which are fairly close in performance to each other


my hope was that the RU6 could keep up with the other DAPs and deliver a similarly good sound due to the hardware savings such as processor, screen, battery etc. then I will get the HiBy RS6 and compare. could you tell me what sound I get compared to the RU6


----------



## chemosapien

DrSteinein said:


> my hope was that the RU6 could keep up with the other DAPs and deliver a similarly good sound due to the hardware savings such as processor, screen, battery etc. then I will get the HiBy RS6 and compare. could you tell me what sound I get compared to the RU6


While I haven't done any proper a/b comparison of the two myself, in general r2r performance, the natural smooth characteristic of the sound is enhanced the higher quality the r2r ladder is


----------



## 426563 (May 16, 2022)

chemosapien said:


> While I haven't done any proper a/b comparison of the two myself, in general r2r performance, the natural smooth characteristic of the sound is enhanced the higher quality the r2r ladder is


I know it's one of those stupid hi-fi terms, but what's really important to me with audio devices over time is that the background is "black", that there's no noise from the amp or DAC. difficult to explaine.

Im a bit confused the Hiby RS6 which i found: 

https://m.de.aliexpress.com/item/10....0.21ef5c5fmdBj7j&gatewayAdapt=gloPc2deuMsite

Is this a different Player? It has the same Name and the Dealer is Hiby official


----------



## trez0r

DrSteinein said:


> I know it's one of those stupid hi-fi terms, but what's really important to me with audio devices over time is that the background is "black", that there's no noise from the amp or DAC. difficult to explaine.
> 
> Im a bit confused the Hiby RS6 which i found:
> 
> ...


it's so called "R6 New", not RS6. Everythings on that offer is fine. R6 is based on ess 9038Q2M.


----------



## 426563 (May 16, 2022)

Its so confusing, why they dont use another name


----------



## blotmouse

DrSteinein said:


> I know it's one of those stupid hi-fi terms, but what's really important to me with audio devices over time is that the background is "black", that there's no noise from the amp or DAC. difficult to explaine.


SNR from r-2r is usually higher than delta sigma.


----------



## trez0r

DrSteinein said:


> Its so confusing, why they dont use another name


Not really  'R6 New' is older than RS6...


----------



## 426563

In such a market where audio players are already a special niche, one does oneself no favors by naming one's products, which vary greatly in specs, almost identical. In addition, "new" is also rather misleading because it automatically suggests something better.


----------



## trez0r

DrSteinein said:


> In such a market where audio players are already a special niche, one does oneself no favors by naming one's products, which vary greatly in specs, almost identical. In addition, "new" is also rather misleading because it automatically suggests something better.


Looking at the offer now, its maybe misunderstandings. I think called this device 'New' is quite right, when U keep in mind... that first R6 is launch ca. 2017-2018, then R6 Pro  year or two later.


----------



## 426563

trez0r said:


> Looking at the offer now, its maybe misunderstandings. I think called this device 'New' is quite right, when U keep in mind... that first R6 is launch ca. 2017-2018, then R6 Pro  year or two later.


So give it another name or number.


----------



## trez0r

DrSteinein said:


> So give it another name or number.


I'm not related to hiby , but DAPs lineup with those numbers is known from "years" from e.g 2/3/5/6/8, Pro or not... and corresponding to price points... tech specs.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

DrSteinein said:


> How does compared the sound between the HiBy RS6 or Cayin N6ii (with R01 board)? I would get the RS6 for around 700€ maybe i would give it a try


Have not heard the N6ii (read it's an improvement over RU6 on multiple posts). I did get the chance to play with the RS6 and it definitely is an improvement over RU6. A few things I noticed after the first few minutes of listening to the device were

1. It's a lot more weightier sound, like vocals and bass feel more solid and weighty.
2. Bass hits harder than RU6
3. Instrument separation and placement was better.
4. Was able to drive Headphones with more authority.

there were other improvements but the above were the first things that hit me.


DrSteinein said:


> my hope was that the RU6 could keep up with the other DAPs and deliver a similarly good sound due to the hardware savings such as processor, screen, battery etc. then I will get the HiBy RS6 and compare. could you tell me what sound I get compared to the RU6


Above points.

Personally, I'm not a fan of DAPs so, I'm waiting for some brand to release a portable R2R DAC, something in the same league as iDSD Signature, Mojo 2.... RU6 is an mazing device for the price and at the moment, I'll recommend it to death but it has it's issues like battery drain, power (for headphones), weight (for a dongle).


----------



## justanut

Johnfg465vd said:


> Have not heard the N6ii (read it's an improvement over RU6 on multiple posts). I did get the chance to play with the RS6 and it definitely is an improvement over RU6. A few things I noticed after the first few minutes of listening to the device were
> 
> 1. It's a lot more weightier sound, like vocals and bass feel more solid and weighty.
> 2. Bass hits harder than RU6
> ...


Many of the points may be attributed to the amp section tho. I run my RU6 thru WA8 and it's right up there with high end DAPs imo


----------



## Johnfg465vd

justanut said:


> Many of the points may be attributed to the amp section tho. I run my RU6 thru WA8 and it's right up there with high end DAPs imo


I'm not so sure about that. I have tried an external Amp (xDSD Gryphon & Topping A30 Pro) and while I was not able to directly compare RU6 (w/ external Amp) vs RS6, I did a thorough test of just the RU6 vs RS6 and to my ears RS6 is definitely better than RU6, as it should be for the price.

The problem with pairing an external Amp to the RU6 was that I noticed some distortion (RU6 Volume at 85 Low Gain, also tested at 100). Let's assume, adding WA8 or C9 would bring RU6 more inline with high-end DAPs, but then if you are spending so much, why not get an R2R DAP/DAC? much more portable  overall and affordable right? and you'll have Line-Out capability to connect to external Amps without distortion.

Again, I like my RU6, it's better than any of the dongle DACs I've tried and in some cases, better than a few budget portable DACs too. It has become my everyday carry but it's just not something that'll replace higher-end DACs/DAPs when it comes to sound IMO.


----------



## Andykong

chemosapien said:


> There's two major factors in r2r decoders, the total number of resistors and the precision of the matching of the resistors, ru6 is the most budget friendly entry into r2r and while it sounds very nice coming from budget tier delta sigma dacs, it is a clear step down from hiby or the r01, which are fairly close in performance to each other



The number of resistors shouldn't matter, the bit depth determined the number of resistors.  I suppose most implementations will aim at 24bit (16-bit is not a good selling point and 32-bit is impossible to implement within practical budget) and that means 96 resistors for a stereo circuit.  no more and no less. 

If I have to list the critical success factor to R2R implementation, I would suggest the following three in the same priority:

(1) High Precision of resistor
(2) Low TCR resistors
(3) Low jitter high precision DDC (Audio Bridge in RU6 or R01 design framework)


----------



## Andykong (May 17, 2022)

Stuff Jones said:


> Thanks for this tip - I was wearing out my volume buttons going between my IEM listening level of 30ish and my amp input volume level of 100. Why do you recommend the 70 to 85 range?



When you double amp, you want to:

maximize the dynamic range
minimize the noise/distortion of the final output
provide an output that is close enough to the default line out, that is 2V for single-ended and 4V for balanced.

If you set the volume to 50 or below, the noise and distortion are very low, but the output is not meeting the required level which means you have underfed that amplifier in the second part of the signal chain.  If you set the volume to 100, you get maximum dynamic and the output level, but the noise and distortion will be fairly high, and you lost the black background and the final output probably will sound fatigued. 

As I mentioned previously, the volume sweet spot is a variable that depends on the matching with your amplifier, it can be the gain ratio of your amplifier, or it can be the Signal/Noise ratio that affects your final setting.  Or in a uncommon situation, you need to go beyond the range I suggested, this is not a black-on-white rule that always works.


----------



## Andykong

justanut said:


> Many of the points may be attributed to the amp section tho. I run my RU6 thru WA8 and it's right up there with high end DAPs imo





Johnfg465vd said:


> I'm not so sure about that. I have tried an external Amp (xDSD Gryphon & Topping A30 Pro) and while I was not able to directly compare RU6 (w/ external Amp) vs RS6, I did a thorough test of just the RU6 vs RS6 and to my ears RS6 is definitely better than RU6, as it should be for the price.
> 
> The problem with pairing an external Amp to the RU6 was that I noticed some distortion (RU6 Volume at 85 Low Gain, also tested at 100). Let's assume, adding WA8 or C9 would bring RU6 more inline with high-end DAPs, but then if you are spending so much, why not get an R2R DAP/DAC? much more portable  overall and affordable right? and you'll have Line-Out capability to connect to external Amps without distortion.
> 
> Again, I like my RU6, it's better than any of the dongle DACs I've tried and in some cases, better than a few budget portable DACs too. It has become my everyday carry but it's just not something that'll replace higher-end DACs/DAPs when it comes to sound IMO.



If you roll up and read the two posts immediately before this one, you'll notice there are digital audio issues that differentiate a decent R2R implementation (such as R01) from a budgeted R2R implementation (such as RU6).  So it can be a lot more than the amplifier section.

On the other hand, I have avoided getting involved in the discussion on RU6 + external amplifier in the very beginning, but then I find out that I can't.  The topic is too popular, I receive too many PM, and users are going to try it anyway.  So I have provided some simple guidelines *HERE*, and it so happened that Volume at 85 is the upper limit of my recommendation and volume at 100 is definitely not recommended.  

Having said that, I still hold the point that RU6 is not an ideal line-out source.  If you have an amplifier lying around, no harm to give it a try.  However, I don't recommend something to buy a new amplifier and using the RU6 as the DAC of a larger system.


----------



## chemosapien

Andykong said:


> The number of resistors shouldn't matter, the bit depth determined the number of resistors.  I suppose most implementations will aim at 24bit (16-bit is not a good selling point and 32-bit is impossible to implement within practical budget) and that means 96 resistors for a stereo circuit.  no more and no less.
> 
> If I have to list the critical success factor to R2R implementation, I would suggest the following three in the same priority:
> 
> ...


Pic is the luxury and precision p6 r2r ladders, 2x100 resistors, 200 total discrete resistors used in decoding


----------



## Andykong (May 17, 2022)

chemosapien said:


> Pic is the luxury and precision p6 r2r ladders, 2x100 resistors, 200 total discrete resistors used in decoding


Can't comment on the implementation of a competitor, but the R-2R design is well-documented, you can cross-check through Google.


----------



## justanut

Andykong said:


> On the other hand, I have avoided getting involved in the discussion on RU6 + external amplifier in the very beginning, but then I find out that I can't.  The topic is too popular, I receive too many PM, and users are going to try it anyway.  So I have provided some simple guidelines *HERE*, and it so happened that Volume at 85 is the upper limit of my recommendation and volume at 100 is definitely not recommended.


I don't think people are buying the RU6 to use with amplifiers... but for owners of the RU6, because we like it so much, we are finding ways to use it in our other chains. And despite not having a proper LO, it's surprisingly good. I've successfully used it at 100 volume with no discernible distortion using my headphones and IEMs. But of course YMMV.

If I'm going out with my laptop in tow, I find myself reaching for the RU6 and my WA8 to bring along (often just the RU6), rather than a DAP. I almost never use it with my phone. The RU6 is one of the most versatile piece of audio equipment in my tiny arsenal. Strangely I did not feel the same with the W2 hmmm


----------



## chemosapien

justanut said:


> I've successfully used it at 100 volume with no discernible distortion using my headphones and IEMs


Same here, I feed it from my phone and have the phone volume and my amp both lower volume, no added distortion in my chain


----------



## chemosapien

chemosapien said:


> Same here, I feed it from my phone and have the phone volume and my amp both lower volume, no added distortion in my chain


I tried the same but removing my amp and there was definitely some distortion noticeable above about 75 volume, I think the tubes in my amp were covering for it pretty well


----------



## TYATYA (May 18, 2022)

Wide stage, a little bold bass and blooming silky smooth mid, NOS mod pair well with hd800s in both straight driving or via a head amp.
Ru6 does have optical in, what a pity I must turn on head amp when I use my LG HU85LS to watch netflix, youtube...
HDVD800 includes a PCM1792A dac chip inside, so RU6 may not really need. But I guess who own an HDVA600 which is a pure amp, RU6 may be a need.
When double-amping I heard output to be blurry in compairison with straight driven by ru6, but it still enough to enjoy.


----------



## Andykong

justanut said:


> I don't think people are buying the RU6 to use with amplifiers... but for owners of the RU6, because we like it so much, we are finding ways to use it in our other chains. And despite not having a proper LO, it's surprisingly good. I've successfully used it at 100 volume with no discernible distortion using my headphones and IEMs. But of course YMMV.
> 
> If I'm going out with my laptop in tow, I find myself reaching for the RU6 and my WA8 to bring along (often just the RU6), rather than a DAP. I almost never use it with my phone. The RU6 is one of the most versatile piece of audio equipment in my tiny arsenal. Strangely I did not feel the same with the W2 hmmm


You'll be surprised, I received numerous inquiries about whether they should purchase the RU6 as an entry-level R-2R DAC for their home audio system.  

The noise and distortion issue is related to the gain ratio of the amplifier and the sensitivity of the IEM downstream.  As an end=user, you only need to be concerned about whether it might or might not appear in your system.  To me, I need to worry if it will affect 1 out of 100 combinations.


----------



## peterinvan

Andykong said:


> Having said that, I still hold the point that RU6 is not an ideal line-out source.  If you have an amplifier lying around, no harm to give it a try.  However, I don't recommend something to buy a new amplifier and using the RU6 as the DAC of a larger system.


I am using my RU6 (3.5mm out) to drive my living room stereo amp (Onkyo A-9110).  
I find it provides a high quality source with no distortion etc.  Volume is controlled on both the RU6 and the Onkyo.

Tidal is running on my iPad Pro, with USB-C out. It is set at minimal volume.  The volume setting on the iPad makes no difference to the RU6 so long as it is not set to mute.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Out of curiosity, what benefits would there be in using Balanced Out on RU6 into an external Amp vs using 3.5 Out on RU6?

The only thing I could think of was improved headroom. Ex. with Gryphon, I'm at ~80/106 to get adequate volume with Sundara. If I pair RU6 (85 Volume) & Gryphon with 3.5 to 3.5 Interconnect, I have to push the volume to 100+ to get a good enough volume level. I'm guessing using a 4.4 to 4.4 Interconnect would mean I get more voltage and so less need to push the Amp harder? any other benefits?

Also, has anyone tried using USB purifiers (AudioQuest Jitterbug, iFi iSilender+...) with RU6?


----------



## peterinvan (May 18, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> Out of curiosity, what benefits would there be in using Balanced Out on RU6 into an external Amp vs using 3.5 Out on RU6?
> 
> The only thing I could think of was improved headroom. Ex. with Gryphon, I'm at ~80/106 to get adequate volume with Sundara. If I pair RU6 (85 Volume) & Gryphon with 3.5 to 3.5 Interconnect, I have to push the volume to 100+ to get a good enough volume level. I'm guessing using a 4.4 to 4.4 Interconnect would mean I get more voltage and so less need to push the Amp harder? any other benefits?
> 
> Also, has anyone tried using USB purifiers (AudioQuest Jitterbug, iFi iSilender+...) with RU6?


I would be careful with balanced-out unless you have balanced-in on the amp.  Shorting the left and right common to ground may damage the RU6 (or any balanced source). 
I run the RU6 at 50% high gain, and the Onkyo at 50% volume.  Plenty loud.

I have the Ifi silencer and a Jitterbug, but I see no reason to put something else in the data path, since my iPad Pro is a clean noise free source.

As far as headphones, I can drive my LCD-XC directly from the RU6 with plenty of headroom.  Sounds great.


----------



## emilsoft

426563 said:


> my hope was that the RU6 could keep up with the other DAPs and deliver a similarly good sound due to the hardware savings such as processor, screen, battery etc. then I will get the HiBy RS6 and compare. could you tell me what sound I get compared to the RU6



The RS6 is a desktop R2R dac replacement IMO. It has a bold muscular sound with focus on mids, lower mids and bass. It sounds unrestrained and very open and direct. It opens up my speakers so much so that they disappear from the room leaving only holographic musicians in front. It can make some IEMs sound like full open back headphones.. you get where I'm going with this - i.e. the RS6 is worth its flagship asking price. The RU6 punches above it's weight in the price range (simply because there are no other R2R dongles), but it is not as massive, unrestrained and bold sounding as the RS6. When a wall of sound hits you from the RS6 you'll know what I mean.

but - the Hiby absolutely needs its 200 hours of burn in. Before that it can change it's signature (sometimes in a weird way) until it settles.


----------



## TYATYA

Johnfg465vd said:


> Out of curiosity, what benefits would there be in using Balanced Out on RU6 into an external Amp vs using 3.5 Out on RU6?
> 
> The only thing I could think of was improved headroom. Ex. with Gryphon, I'm at ~80/106 to get adequate volume with Sundara. If I pair RU6 (85 Volume) & Gryphon with 3.5 to 3.5 Interconnect, I have to push the volume to 100+ to get a good enough volume level. I'm guessing using a 4.4 to 4.4 Interconnect would mean I get more voltage and so less need to push the Amp harder? any other benefits?
> 
> Also, has anyone tried using USB purifiers (AudioQuest Jitterbug, iFi iSilender+...) with RU6?


Except higher output SPL, I mostly do not find improvement when I feed RU6 to 2 headamp (one electrodynamic, one e.stat).
There a very littleeeee as placebo effect or real I am not so sure: 4.4 is more dynamic and 3.5 is fuller.

When ru6 drives hd800s I found volume lvl 90 and 91 has difference: lvl91 sound not smooth as 90 and 91 feel dry sound (or some one may feel distortion). But if feed to a amp, I run ru6 at vol 100%


----------



## emilsoft (May 19, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> Out of curiosity, what benefits would there be in using Balanced Out on RU6 into an external Amp vs using 3.5 Out on RU6?
> 
> The only thing I could think of was improved headroom. Ex. with Gryphon, I'm at ~80/106 to get adequate volume with Sundara. If I pair RU6 (85 Volume) & Gryphon with 3.5 to 3.5 Interconnect, I have to push the volume to 100+ to get a good enough volume level. I'm guessing using a 4.4 to 4.4 Interconnect would mean I get more voltage and so less need to push the Amp harder? any other benefits?
> 
> Also, has anyone tried using USB purifiers (AudioQuest Jitterbug, iFi iSilender+...) with RU6?



Aside from the significantly increase power output, I find balanced out a little broader, more weighty and somewhat smoother sounding vs the 3.5mm - this is even with very sensitive IEMs. Maybe it's due to output impedance interaction with balanced armatures or what have you I'm not sure, but I prefer it.

I also use the ifi micro iusb 3.0 usb decrapifier and clean power supply and it makes the RU6 whisper sweet nothings in my ears. In general the imicro makes everything sound better so this is expected. What is interesting though is that the RU6 still sounds very good out of a computer directly and doesn't cry out for a decrapifier like many other delta sigma dacs where it's almost a necessity


----------



## Andykong

Johnfg465vd said:


> Out of curiosity, what benefits would there be in using Balanced Out on RU6 into an external Amp vs using 3.5 Out on RU6?
> 
> The only thing I could think of was improved headroom. Ex. with Gryphon, I'm at ~80/106 to get adequate volume with Sundara. If I pair RU6 (85 Volume) & Gryphon with 3.5 to 3.5 Interconnect, I have to push the volume to 100+ to get a good enough volume level. I'm guessing using a 4.4 to 4.4 Interconnect would mean I get more voltage and so less need to push the Amp harder? any other benefits?
> 
> Also, has anyone tried using USB purifiers (AudioQuest Jitterbug, iFi iSilender+...) with RU6?



If you are connecting the RU6 to an external Amp, I'll suggest you stay with the Single-ended connection.  I have shared my observation *previously*. 

The 4.4mm phone output of RU6 is balanced driven, but the signal path is primarily a single-ended design. We added an extra op-amp (identical to the primary headphone amplification Op-Amp) in the final output stage as a unity gain amplifier, all it does is convert the original stereo signal to a negative phase. This makes the 4.4mm phone out a balanced output technically, it will offer extra power and current to drive your IEM, but it won't exhibit the normal benefit of the fully balanced circuit (such as low noise, and better separation).  When you connect RU6 to an external amplifier, the extra power and current is almost meaningless, it will only introduce extra noise into your signal path.  So I'll suggest you start with single-ended connection.


----------



## emilsoft

Would love to see a simplistic spectrum analyser (as an option instead of displaying the sample rate) in future fw update  so I can admire my sexy dongle even more whilst listening to music.

And maybe when RU7 comes along, an onboard parametric eq will be possible.


----------



## musicday

Any firmware update been released for RU6, can't access the website.


----------



## eswng679

I just purchased the RU-6 and love how it sounds with my IEMs so far. It might be a dumb question but does the RU-6 stay on if its plugged in to my computer?
Is unplugging the only way to "turn off" the unit?


----------



## captblaze

eswng679 said:


> I just purchased the RU-6 and love how it sounds with my IEMs so far. It might be a dumb question but does the RU-6 stay on if its plugged in to my computer?
> Is unplugging the only way to "turn off" the unit?


No on board battery, so it takes power from the transport it is connected to.

Simple answer Yes unplug is only way to "power off" the RU6


----------



## eswng679 (May 19, 2022)

I've been listening to the Cayin RU-6 --> 4.4 mm output --> Moondrop Variations since last Thursday. NOS with Low Gain. Source is Amazon HD via PC.
Very _very _good synergy. The Variations has a pretty big dip in the mid-bass. With the RU-6, the added warmth and smooth treble brings the Variations to life. I literally cannot put this combo down.

I feel like I don't need to use APO for this set up anymore. To think that I was about to sell the Variations...

Thank you @Andykong and Cayin team!


----------



## rafaelroxalot

I have bought an Unique melody Mest mk2 came with a 4.4 cable.
Anyone tried mest 2 with Ru6 and iphone 13 pro max? No problem?
Im between cayin ru6 and ua5 shangling, don't know what fits best


----------



## chemosapien

rafaelroxalot said:


> I have bought an Unique melody Mest mk2 came with a 4.4 cable.
> Anyone tried mest 2 with Ru6 and iphone 13 pro max? No problem?
> Im between cayin ru6 and ua5 shangling, don't know what fits best


Ua5 has better battery life(less drain on your phone) but IMHO the ru6 it's smoother more natural sound


----------



## quawn0418

rafaelroxalot said:


> I have bought an Unique melody Mest mk2 came with a 4.4 cable.
> Anyone tried mest 2 with Ru6 and iphone 13 pro max? No problem?
> Im between cayin ru6 and ua5 shangling, don't know what fits best


Good luck my brother, I’m having the same problem trying to decide which of the two to keep, throw the ifi go bar in the mix.


----------



## rafaelroxalot

Unique melody Mest Mk2 is sensitive do cayin ru6? Or no hiss at all?


----------



## yaps66

chemosapien said:


> Ua5 has better battery life(less drain on your phone) but IMHO the ru6 it's smoother more natural sound


Plus you can choose between NOS or OS to further fine tune the sound!


----------



## rafaelroxalot

I think i will try the RU6, but a little worried if my iphone will have the power supply to run mest mk2 higher volume without clipping because of low power... i will get the cayin lightning cable to usb, hope that could run my iem without problems


----------



## Stevko

Buy the camera 3 adapter and you can power it with a powerbank when running harder loads


----------



## Johnfg465vd

rafaelroxalot said:


> I think i will try the RU6, but a little worried if my iphone will have the power supply to run mest mk2 higher volume without clipping because of low power... i will get the cayin lightning cable to usb, hope that could run my iem without problems


If it helps, I tried Mest MKII with my RU6 connected to an iPhone SE 2020 and did not notice any issues. Both the MKII & iPhone were borrowed from a friend and I only tried this setup for ~10 mins when I met with him.


----------



## AlexanderV

Hi Guys.

Just tried the subject with PC (both win10 and win11 tried, different laptops) and experienced interrupts approximately once in a minute in random periods. A song interrupts for a second and then play continues. Do you know what's going on and how to fix it? Thanks in advance.


----------



## justanut

rafaelroxalot said:


> I have bought an Unique melody Mest mk2 came with a 4.4 cable.
> Anyone tried mest 2 with Ru6 and iphone 13 pro max? No problem?
> Im between cayin ru6 and ua5 shangling, don't know what fits best





rafaelroxalot said:


> Unique melody Mest Mk2 is sensitive do cayin ru6? Or no hiss at all?





rafaelroxalot said:


> I think i will try the RU6, but a little worried if my iphone will have the power supply to run mest mk2 higher volume without clipping because of low power... i will get the cayin lightning cable to usb, hope that could run my iem without problems



There are zero issues with the combo. No hiss at all, no power issues (I also use it with way harder to drive HD800S).


----------



## Laleo

Hi. Well guys I'm not yet ordered the RU6, but I would like to connect both DAC+AMP (desktop ones) to a Bluetooth functionality.
So I could hear Bluetooth from PC. Any suggetstion?


----------



## Frombauge

rafaelroxalot said:


> I think i will try the RU6, but a little worried if my iphone will have the power supply to run mest mk2 higher volume without clipping because of low power... i will get the cayin lightning cable to usb, hope that could run my iem without problems


I have no problems with this combo (MEST MK II & RU-6). In fact it sounds great. Smooth and musical.


----------



## yaps66

Laleo said:


> Hi. Well guys I'm not yet ordered the RU6, but I would like to connect both DAC+AMP (desktop ones) to a Bluetooth functionality.
> So I could hear Bluetooth from PC. Any suggetstion?


Not really relevant to this thread but one option is here.


----------



## oldkid

I don't think it has been discussed on this thread but RU6 is an excellent MQA DAC when used with an app that does the first unfolding like UAPP on mobile or Audirvana on PC. 

Only a very small percentage of Tidal streaming catalog goes above 48khz anyway, which in MQA translates to 96khz, confirmed by RU6 screen. When listening with my phone in my pocket, I'm often able to notice the increase in quality when a MQA file begins following a CD quality FLAC. 
Many people hate this format but what I have just described is what I hear


----------



## Sunstealer

Just ordered an RU6 from advancedmp3players (15% off this weekend). Have done some research and am looking forward to listening to this. I have an Ovidius B1 which I love (apart from the hissing and no hardware volume control). Sold Mojo 1 as it's too warm for me. I'll be posting a review in a couple of months once I have settled into the RU6's sound.


----------



## shwnwllms

Just picked up an RU6 and a Blessing 2 for a portable rig. I don’t travel as much for work now so it will probably be mainly used around the house. So far this is a nice combo and didn’t break the bank. Sounds better than expected given it hasn’t been completely burned in yet.


----------



## keenears

New release, great for the NU6 with iPads and iPhones on the go, and a USB C version is coming soon for my Walkman: https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html


----------



## twister6

keenears said:


> New release, great for the NU6 with iPads and iPhones on the go, and a USB C version is coming soon for my Walkman: https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html



Oh, not just coming soon, already here   This little data/power adapter from ddHiFi is brilliant.  No need for splitters or usb-c to lightning adapters or camera kits.  It's a small adapter with lightning connector going to your iPhone/iPod Touch and then one side with usb-c data output (for your usb dac/amp) and the other side with usb-c power input (for charging).

Here, took a few very quick pictures with iPod Touch.  Ironically, I use the latest gen iPod touch for all my "iPhone" testing and its battery is dead, can't hold a charge for more than 4-5min.  Now, I can test it for as long as I want to because I'm charging at the same time.  Btw, also got their usb-c to usb-c OTG cable (Nyx series, TC09S model).  Regardless of what I thought of a short usb-c OTG cable can do, this one gives RU6 a wider soundstage, and I'm still scratching my head because I'm hearing a difference loud and clear.  The only secret sauce here is extra isolation of every wire and keeping data and power completely separate.  Plus, core of the wire is pure silver while shielding is OFC and SPC.


----------



## Sunstealer

@twister6 is there a quality Android equivalent for dual usb c charging/OTG? A lot of the ones I have looked at have poor reviews saying they don't work.


----------



## twister6

Sunstealer said:


> @twister6 is there a quality Android equivalent for dual usb c charging/OTG? A lot of the ones I have looked at have poor reviews saying they don't work.



I talked to ddHiFi and I believe they will be working on usb-c adapter version, similar to the one above with a separate data and charging ports.  Otherwise, just go with a usb-c splitter, I have one, talked about it before in this thread, it works, but adds bulk.  Plus, many companies that make these splitters use cheaper usb-c connectors.  ddHiFi quality is usually better.

For now, your alternative is something like this:


----------



## shady1991

I have a big issue with Cayin RU6's noise floor. I am not talking about the typical hiss, but rather weird almost glitchy noise during very quite parts of very high dynamic range music.  
This noise increases every time volume makes that 'glitchy' step(for example from 40 to 41). This means that the signal to noise ratio is worst right above those critical steps, and very best right below it. Now, I could tolerate the best case scenario but at some volumes the SNR is really unacceptable. Of course it is not an issue for most of music out there, which are compressed and brickwalled to oblivion but when listening to well recorded violin concertos for example, it really bothers me. I am 99.99% this is a design issue and not my unit or setup's problem, but anyway, has anybody experienced this?


----------



## shady1991

I have a theory about the volume control, please correct me if there is any information which disproves this.

The resistor volume control has only 8 steps (probably by having 3 resistors with different combinations) and substeps between them change volume only digitally (at the dac level or before). This means that when the volume is for example 30, it is digitally maxed out and at 31 it switches to a lower resistance resistor combination. Now this would increase volume and noise floor a lot, but to compensate for this it decreases volume digitally. Therefore what we get is increased noise by a lot, with barely louder music, hence the damaged SNR.  Then moving from 31 to 40 the noise does not change because the volume is increased digitally, and at 40 the dac is using its full potential again. 

Anyway, one thing is clear that if we want to maximize quality, we should listen to volumes right below the 'critical' steps. But it is really frustrating that the noise level in this dac is already not great and it does not even use its less than stellar full potential because of imperfect volume control. I wonder why cayin could not implement completely analog volume control, maybe like 6 resistors and 64 steps or smth.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

twister6 said:


> Btw, also got their usb-c to usb-c OTG cable (Nyx series, TC09S model). Regardless of what I thought of a short usb-c OTG cable can do, this one gives RU6 a wider soundstage, and I'm still scratching my head because I'm hearing a difference loud and clear. The only secret sauce here is extra isolation of every wire and keeping data and power completely separate. Plus, core of the wire is pure silver while shielding is OFC and SPC.


Have you tried OEAudio Cable? mine is onroute and after reading your impressions of TC09S, I'm curious if I made the right purchase.


----------



## DBaldock9

shady1991 said:


> I have a theory about the volume control, please correct me if there is any information which disproves this.
> 
> The resistor volume control has only 8 steps (probably by having 3 resistors with different combinations) and substeps between them change volume only digitally (at the dac level or before). This means that when the volume is for example 30, it is digitally maxed out and at 31 it switches to a lower resistance resistor combination. Now this would increase volume and noise floor a lot, but to compensate for this it decreases volume digitally. Therefore what we get is increased noise by a lot, with barely louder music, hence the damaged SNR.  Then moving from 31 to 40 the noise does not change because the volume is increased digitally, and at 40 the dac is using its full potential again.
> 
> Anyway, one thing is clear that if we want to maximize quality, we should listen to volumes right below the 'critical' steps. But it is really frustrating that the noise level in this dac is already not great and it does not even use its less than stellar full potential because of imperfect volume control. I wonder why cayin could not implement completely analog volume control, maybe like 6 resistors and 64 steps or smth.



If you read the discussions, in earlier posts, about how the Analog Volume control circuit works, you'll see that it does not, in any way, affect the operation of the preceding DAC stage.  It's basically just the same as a switched resistor attenuator - that happens to be switched electronically, rather than being a manually turned rotary switch.


----------



## twister6

Johnfg465vd said:


> Have you tried OEAudio Cable? mine is onroute and after reading your impressions of TC09S, I'm curious if I made the right purchase.



I got them all.  Love OE Audio as well, and you didn't make a wrong decision.  It's a great little cable, has a very compact connector housing, high quality wiring, a bit stiff, but good quality cable.  But with ddHiFi and my S22 + RU6 the sound is just more holographic.  But you can see from the picture, it has bigger size connectors, two wires side by side, also stiff.  In terms of sound quality, OE Audio is between stock and TC09S, and as I reviewer I have no scientific explanation lol!!!  Silver material shouldn't influence the sound quality of a cable that carries digital signal.  The cable is too short to worry about jitter or anything related to timing.  It does have a proper isolation; noise from 5V supply/wires could couple into data, contributing to noise floor which could mess up a few 0 and 1  TC09S definitely has a proper isolation, literally, split into two different shielded wires.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

twister6 said:


> I got them all.  Love OE Audio as well, and you didn't make a wrong decision.  It's a great little cable, has a very compact connector housing, high quality wiring, a bit stiff, but good quality cable.  But with ddHiFi and my S22 + RU6 the sound is just more holographic.  But you can see from the picture, it has bigger size connectors, two wires side by side, also stiff.  In terms of sound quality, OE Audio is between stock and TC09S, and as I reviewer I have no scientific explanation lol!!!  Silver material shouldn't influence the sound quality of a cable that carries digital signal.  The cable is too short to worry about jitter or anything related to timing.  It does have a proper isolation; noise from 5V supply/wires could couple into data, contributing to noise floor which could mess up a few 0 and 1  TC09S definitely has a proper isolation, literally, split into two different shielded wires.


Good to know there's some improvement with OEAudio over stock cable. I like the looks of ddHiFi one though, looks more expensive and "audiophily".


----------



## Zachik

twister6 said:


> I got them all.  Love OE Audio as well, and you didn't make a wrong decision.  It's a great little cable, has a very compact connector housing, high quality wiring, a bit stiff, but good quality cable.  But with ddHiFi and my S22 + RU6 the sound is just more holographic.  But you can see from the picture, it has bigger size connectors, two wires side by side, also stiff.  In terms of sound quality, OE Audio is between stock and TC09S, and as I reviewer I have no scientific explanation lol!!!  Silver material shouldn't influence the sound quality of a cable that carries digital signal.  The cable is too short to worry about jitter or anything related to timing.  It does have a proper isolation; noise from 5V supply/wires could couple into data, contributing to noise floor which could mess up a few 0 and 1  TC09S definitely has a proper isolation, literally, split into two different shielded wires.


So, the ddHiFi cable that @twister6 loves, or the GUCraftsman braided cable that @Wes S recommends?  Choices... choices...


----------



## shady1991

DBaldock9 said:


> If you read the discussions, in earlier posts, about how the Analog Volume control circuit works, you'll see that it does not, in any way, affect the operation of the preceding DAC stage.  It's basically just the same as a switched resistor attenuator - that happens to be switched electronically, rather than being a manually turned rotary switch.


That does not explain increased noise only at every tenth/twelveth step at all. If every step was analog at the same stage of the circuit, SNR would not fluctuate like that.


----------



## justanut

shady1991 said:


> That does not explain increased noise only at every tenth/twelveth step at all. If every step was analog at the same stage of the circuit, SNR would not fluctuate like that.


Do you mean the static that only appears when changing volume or a consistent noise floor?

If it's the latter, I don't experience any with IEMs or Headphones at any volume. Neither when I run it at 85 to my external amp.


----------



## Wes S

Zachik said:


> So, the ddHiFi cable that @twister6 loves, or the GUCraftsman braided cable that @Wes S recommends?  Choices... choices...


I actually ended up preferring the stock Cayin cable in the end.


----------



## shady1991

justanut said:


> Do you mean the static that only appears when changing volume or a consistent noise floor?
> 
> If it's the latter, I don't experience any with IEMs or Headphones at any volume. Neither when I run it at 85 to my external amp.


It is not static, it is a weird noise during the very quiet sounds (but not during the silence). It can only be noticed during very quiet parts of high dynamic range music. But for the demonstration you can reduce the source volume a lot(almost to 0), then increase cayins volume and check the noise difference between 64 and 65 for example, you will know what I am talking about.


----------



## justanut

shady1991 said:


> It is not static, it is a weird noise during the very quiet sounds (but not during the silence). It can only be noticed during very quiet parts of high dynamic range music. But for the demonstration you can reduce the source volume a lot(almost to 0), then increase cayins volume and check the noise difference between 64 and 65 for example, you will know what I am talking about.


What is your source for the RU6?


----------



## shady1991

justanut said:


> What is your source for the RU6?


Multiple things, LG v35 with UAPP, Ibasso DX160, PC, Tablet.. It does not matter, the result is always the same, because as I said, it is not a static I believe it is just imperfection of the DAC.


----------



## justanut

shady1991 said:


> Multiple things, LG v35 with UAPP, Ibasso DX160, PC, Tablet.. It does not matter, the result is always the same, because as I said, it is not a static I believe it is just imperfection of the DAC.


Unfortunately I still am unable to understand what you are describing and it would seem as if you've already made up your mind rather than figure out if it's an isolated problem with your gear or your particular RU6.


----------



## shady1991

justanut said:


> Unfortunately I still am unable to understand what you are describing and it would seem as if you've already made up your mind rather than figure out if it's an isolated problem with your gear or your particular RU6.


Well, did you try what I suggested? lower the source volume almost to 0 and increase it on the DAC, and pay attention to what happens to noise during volume steps.  I feel like you are the one disregarding my claims without checking it. If I hear any counter arguments or counter evidence to what I say I will change my mind easily.


----------



## Andykong (Jun 7, 2022)

shady1991 said:


> It is not static, it is a weird noise during the very quiet sounds (but not during the silence). It can only be noticed during very quiet parts of high dynamic range music. But for the demonstration you can reduce the source volume a lot(almost to 0), then increase cayins volume and check the noise difference between 64 and 65 for example, you will know what I am talking about.



Please don't.  R2R is demanding on the data integrity of incoming bitstream, when you lower the source volume to a certain level, the R2R decoding algorithm fails to perform correctly.

It is VERY IMPORTANT to keep the source at full output level when you use R2R-designed DAC.  If you need to control the volume at the source level, delta-sigma DAC probably suits your needs better.


----------



## Andykong

shady1991 said:


> I have a theory about the volume control, please correct me if there is any information which disproves this.
> 
> The resistor volume control has only 8 steps (probably by having 3 resistors with different combinations) and substeps between them change volume only digitally (at the dac level or before). This means that when the volume is for example 30, it is digitally maxed out and at 31 it switches to a lower resistance resistor combination. Now this would increase volume and noise floor a lot, but to compensate for this it decreases volume digitally. Therefore what we get is increased noise by a lot, with barely louder music, hence the damaged SNR.  Then moving from 31 to 40 the noise does not change because the volume is increased digitally, and at 40 the dac is using its full potential again.
> 
> Anyway, one thing is clear that if we want to maximize quality, we should listen to volumes right below the 'critical' steps. But it is really frustrating that the noise level in this dac is already not great and it does not even use its less than stellar full potential because of imperfect volume control. I wonder why cayin could not implement completely analog volume control, maybe like 6 resistors and 64 steps or smth.



The volume control of RU6 is known as* Resistor Array volume control*, it is not a new technology, you can find this type of volume control in many high-end integrated amplifiers and pre-amplifier.  We have explained our design consideration and implementation detail of the Resistor Array volume control at the opening post of this thread   The Resistor Array volume control involves *switching relays* when you hop from one segment to another, so it is different from your theory.  The RU6 volume control is 100% analog, so when you said "moving from 31 to 40 the noise does not change because the volume is increased digitally, and at 40 the dac is using its full potential again" is a completely wrong assumption.  

 we need to mute the output for a ~40s when a relay kicks in. This will introduce a small delay in volume adjustment at 10, 20, 30,... etc.  A lot of users have experienced the delays, but I didn't recall any user complaints regarding high noise level at the step when you jump from one volume segment to another.  Theoretically, this will happen when your RU6 fails to mute the switching relays properly, but the mute mechanism is very reliable theoretically, I'll be very surprised if this happens in your RU6.   

I have copied and pasted the  Resistor Array volume control paragraph from Post #1 to here for your reference, but please go through the complete opening post to make sure you understand and operate the RU6 properly.



> Cayin tested numerous off-the-shelf volume options, unfortunately they cannot meet the high precision, low noise, and low power consumption requirements in dongle DAC application. For instance, we have used PGA2311A in several DAPs and R01 Audio Motherboards, we tried to repeat the trick but the RU6 developed unacceptable background noise. There are better volume chipset in the market, but they are either too big physically, or drain a lot of power, making it inappropriate for Dongle DAC application. Eventually Cayin bite the bullet and developed a high precision resistor array volume control circuit that provides 99 steps volume control through 9 segments of resistors and switching relays.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## shady1991

First of all, thank you for responding. 


Andykong said:


> Please don't.  R2R is demanding on the data integrity of incoming bitstream, when you lower the source volume to a certain level, the R2R decoding algorithm fails to perform correctly.


I am not doing this, of course. It was just to demonstrate issue that is difficult to notice without reducing volume (but is still there at max volume during very very quiet parts of music).


Andykong said:


> A lot of users have experienced the delays, but I didn't recall any user complaints regarding high noise level at the step when you jump from one volume segment to another.


I am not experience noise during switching, what I said is that noise that is already there increases at these volume steps (and is constant during other volume steps).
Here is the quick image to demonstrate what I meant all this time, and I could not communicate well enough, since everyone misunderstood. 





Andykong said:


> The RU6 volume control is 100% analog, so when you said "moving from 31 to 40 the noise does not change because the volume is increased digitally, and at 40 the dac is using its full potential again" is a completely wrong assumption.


I stand corrected, I trust that it is not digitally controlled, but could you please explain why the noise behaves the way I showed on diagram? Or would you say I am wrong about this and noise always increases proportionally at every step?


----------



## Andykong

shady1991 said:


> First of all, thank you for responding.
> 
> I am not doing this, of course. It was just to demonstrate issue that is difficult to notice without reducing volume (but is still there at max volume during very very quiet parts of music).
> 
> ...



Now we are getting somewhere. 

These are the noise characteristics of an R-2R DAC circuit, it has nothing to do with the Resistor Array volume control, in fact, the resistor array volume helps to control the R-2R noise significantly.  If we use an off-the-shelf volume chip such as PGA2311A, the R-2R noise will be even worse, significantly worse. (we have also explained this in the opening post of the RU6 thread). 

We didn't explain the noise pattern specifically in the RU6 thread, but we have explained it in detail in N6ii thread.  We only mentioned the noise problem when we discuss Line out option from RU6  (or to put it correctly, the noise pattern has discouraged the implementation of line out from RU6.

The R-2R noise pattern of RU6 is similar to R01 Audio Motherboard (for obvious reasons).   You can read the R01 Audio Motherboard announcement *HERE*.  For convenience sake, I have copied and pasted the more related paragraph below:



> The R01 is a headphone-output-only Audio Motherboard. Like E01, It does not have a line-out feature. We have been fighting very hard to fit the R-2R Resistive Ladder Network into the Audio Motherboards PCB. Line out from the sigma-delta DAC chipset is relatively straightforward because we can take the LPF output as the foundation of the line out signal. The R-2R design requires more work to deliver a dedicated line out. The background noise pattern of the R-2R network also makes it inappropriate for pseudo lineout implementation. In other Audio Motherboards, the background noise basically remains the same level at all volume levels, so it will affect the sensitive IEM users as they tend to listen to low volume settings (i.e, same amount of noise but lower output level). On the other hand, the background noise of the R-2R ladder DAC circuit will increase as you turn up the volume. While sensitive IEM users might welcome this pattern, it makes pseudo line out inappropriate because when you max out the volume of the amplification circuit, the background noise becomes audible.



We have also mentioned the R-2R noise pattern *HERE*, *HERE,* and *HERE*.

If you want to look into the fine detail of R-2R noise, they are mainly thermal noise: when you pack a larger number of resistors into a very tight space, the resistors will warm up and generate thermal noise.  The noise is output-related, when you drive your circuit to a higher output level, thermal noise will increase.  When you implement R-2R in a more spacious environment, the thermal noise will decrease.  Unfortunately, R01 Audio Motherboard and RU6 Dongle DAC are among the smallest and most cramped implementations ever, that's why RU6 suffers more thermal noise than other R-2R implementation.


----------



## shady1991

Andykong said:


> Now we are getting somewhere.
> 
> These are the noise characteristics of an R-2R DAC circuit, it has nothing to do with the Resistor Array volume control, in fact, the resistor array volume helps to control the R-2R noise significantly.  If we use an off-the-shelf volume chip such as PGA2311A, the R-2R noise will be even worse, significantly worse. (we have also explained this in the opening post of the RU6 thread).
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot for this very informative answer. 
I do not want to sound very stubborn but one thing is still unclear. As you quoted "the background noise of the R-2R ladder DAC circuit will increase as you turn up the volume", which makes perfect sense, but the noise I am talking about is not increasing at every step.
The noise level is exactly the same at all volumes from 21 and 30 for example, and then jumps up to at volume 31(as I showed on the diagram).


----------



## Andykong (Jun 8, 2022)

shady1991 said:


> Thanks a lot for this very informative answer.
> I do not want to sound very stubborn but one thing is still unclear. As you quoted "the background noise of the R-2R ladder DAC circuit will increase as you turn up the volume", which makes perfect sense, but the noise I am talking about is not increasing at every step.
> The noise level is exactly the same at all volumes from 21 and 30 for example, and then jumps up to at volume 31(as I showed on the diagram).



I don't hear what you described, and I seriously doubt human hearing can compare noise levels accurately, especially when we are using different IEM or headphone.


----------



## shady1991

Andykong said:


> I don't hear what you described, and I seriously doubt human hearing can compare noise levels accurately, especially when we are using different IEM or headphone.


If you tried the test I described, lowering volume of the source and increasing it on the RU6 and then checking the noise levels you would know right away what I am talking about, because it is very apparent.
So either my unit is defective (which I doubt) or no one here really tried to understand what I said. Anyway, thanks for your time.


----------



## crizzle

does anyone have the details with the warranty of this product? Mine loses its power and connection constantly when anything touches the usb c


----------



## twister6

crizzle said:


> does anyone have the details with the warranty of this product? Mine loses its power and connection constantly when anything touches the usb c



Does it happen with usb-c to usb-c cable (when connected to your smartphone) as well as usb-c to usb-A cable (connected as usb dac to your laptop)?  If both are failing and you tried multiple cables, then usb-c plug on RU6 could be at fault.  Otherwise, could be an issue related to one of the cables.


----------



## keenears

twister6 said:


> I talked to ddHiFi and I believe they will be working on usb-c adapter version, similar to the one above with a separate data and charging ports.  Otherwise, just go with a usb-c splitter, I have one, talked about it before in this thread, it works, but adds bulk.  Plus, many companies that make these splitters use cheaper usb-c connectors.  ddHiFi quality is usually better.
> 
> For now, your alternative is something like this:


That’s why I said the USBC version was coming soon


----------



## crizzle

twister6 said:


> Does it happen with usb-c to usb-c cable (when connected to your smartphone) as well as usb-c to usb-A cable (connected as usb dac to your laptop)?  If both are failing and you tried multiple cables, then usb-c plug on RU6 could be at fault.  Otherwise, could be an issue related to one of the cables.


tried multiple cables as well as connecting to my macbookj.


----------



## justanut

crizzle said:


> tried multiple cables as well as connecting to my macbookj.


Sounds like ur RU6 connector plug is indeed faulty. Call your dealer~


----------



## justanut (Jun 14, 2022)

I know AK will roll his eyes at me, but is anyone else using the RU6 as a source to amps? I'm running mine to the HA-300ii with great results. Some noise that I can live with and barely noticeable when music is playing~ 

*Ok low noise but soundstage reduced and imaging non existent haha.. prob have to say this is not recommended unless in a pinch*


----------



## Sunstealer (Jun 14, 2022)

I made a 4W copper 3.5mm - RCA interconnect for my Ovidius B1 to Zen Can but haven't gotten round to using it with the RU6. I have found with the B1 and the Chord Mojo that the Can tended to change the sound towards the house Ifi sound. Good for the Chord (removing some of the excessive mid bass) but blunting the attack and energy of the B1. I'll try it with the RU6 in time but don't really want the RU6 sound to change that much!


----------



## docked seaman

twister6 said:


> I got them all.  Love OE Audio as well, and you didn't make a wrong decision.  It's a great little cable, has a very compact connector housing, high quality wiring, a bit stiff, but good quality cable.  But with ddHiFi and my S22 + RU6 the sound is just more holographic.  But you can see from the picture, it has bigger size connectors, two wires side by side, also stiff.  In terms of sound quality, OE Audio is between stock and TC09S, and as I reviewer I have no scientific explanation lol!!!  Silver material shouldn't influence the sound quality of a cable that carries digital signal.  The cable is too short to worry about jitter or anything related to timing.  It does have a proper isolation; noise from 5V supply/wires could couple into data, contributing to noise floor which could mess up a few 0 and 1  TC09S definitely has a proper isolation, literally, split into two different shielded wires.


Does it also make a difference in sound quality using a TC28i Pro or apple camera kit?


----------



## hartphoto (Jun 14, 2022)

Thread lurker here , read through most of the 170ish pages last week….y’all (and the linked reviews) twisted the wallet open.

Delivery of a shiny RU6 today, blue case and the iPhone cable. Journey through the library begins again, listening for all the musical nuances I’ve been reading about.

Setup will mostly be iPhone 12 Pro Max, RU6 & 7hz Timeless. First 3 hours of listening, just awesomeness all around.

One simultaneous charging option I don’t remember being mentioned, is using a MagSafe charger. Maybe I missed it. I have one of the 15w off brand chargers, connected to an Anker 30w USB-C wall adapter. 2 hours in, not using anything, I went down from 50% to 30%ish, then started using the charger, still oscillating between FlacBox files and Apple Music. iPhone charged back into the 70% range in a little over an hour. For my ears….zero interference or musical change noticed.


----------



## yaps66

hartphoto said:


> Thread lurker here , read through most of the 170ish pages last week….y’all (and the linked reviews) twisted the wallet open.
> 
> Delivery of a shiny RU6 today, blue case and the iPhone cable. Journey through the library begins again, listening for all the musical nuances I’ve been reading about.
> 
> ...


Welcome to the club! These are special!


----------



## oknenir

Anyone can suggest a USB-C cable for simultaneous charging (of the phone) and DAC use, please?


----------



## bgillis

oknenir said:


> Anyone can suggest a USB-C cable for simultaneous charging (of the phone) and DAC use, please?


Currently using Belkin CONNECT USB-C with success since around 6 months.


----------



## oknenir

Thanks. Was hoping to find something for like €10 on Aliexpress


----------



## majo123

My friend @mbwilson111 just pmd me a link to a thread that looks like it has a been defunct for years! But I found it quite amusing and definitely a bit of fun , so I'm posting the link around to maybe try and revive it a little, if it does it does if doesn't no drama just a bit of fun...
In going to post on it now.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/which-headphone-gave-you-your-first-eargasm.136992

Maybe do one for source as well, I'm sure Ru6 will get plenty of love.


----------



## Richsvt

@majo123 
Some good stuff to revitalize. Good to see you about here. Hope you're well my friend.
I love the RU6. I need to pay more attention to it. Cheers.


----------



## majo123

Richsvt said:


> @majo123
> Some good stuff to revitalize. Good to see you about here. Hope you're well my friend.
> I love the RU6. I need to pay more attention to it. Cheers.


Hey my friend good to see you too... I'm around sort of, not as much as before for health reasons and other stuff but still pop in ..
Anyway glad you're enjoying the ru6, love mine.... and the r01.


----------



## justanut

justanut said:


> I know AK will roll his eyes at me, but is anyone else using the RU6 as a source to amps? I'm running mine to the HA-300ii with great results. Some noise that I can live with and barely noticeable when music is playing~
> 
> *Ok low noise but soundstage reduced and imaging non existent haha.. prob have to say this is not recommended unless in a pinch*


Update:

I was previously using 4.4 to XLR cables but my 3.5 to RCA have now come in, and at volume 80 on RU6, vol at 1 o'clock on the HA-300ii, I'm again getting a very clean and beautiful output from my MacBook streaming Apple Music.

Compared to my AK4499 output, this is narrower in soundstage, less depth and poorer imaging, but organic and enjoyable for vocal jazz. No point for orchestral.


----------



## Brain Damage

justanut said:


> Update:
> 
> I was previously using 4.4 to XLR cables but my 3.5 to RCA have now come in, and at volume 80 on RU6, vol at 1 o'clock on the HA-300ii, I'm again getting a very clean and beautiful output from my MacBook streaming Apple Music.
> 
> Compared to my AK4499 output, this is narrower in soundstage, less depth and poorer imaging, but organic and enjoyable for vocal jazz. No point for orchestral.


Goes to show how analogue sounding the RU6 is. I had been listening to Qobuz and Tidal (UAPP) through the RU6 on low gain NOS on 45 volume with Beyerdynamic DT770 pros for a matter of weeks. Fancied a change so dug out my LG V40 and listened on High Impedance Mode. Went straight back to RU6 as its more organic, musical and analogue sounding across almost all genres of music. Not saying the V40 is not a fantastic DAC - it's clean, detailed and with great instrumental clarity and imaging by comparison; but I now realise I now gravitate more towards the R2R sound. Wouldn't have known this had I not purchased the RU6. Such a great purchase


----------



## PopZeus

Got a chance to check out the RU6 at CanJam and it won me over almost immediately. So much so that I'm going to tweak my portable setup to include it. The 5K is a difficult beast to overcome when it comes to portability, so we'll see how this goes!


----------



## EvilMunchkin

Hey lads. I just bought an RU6 to pair with my Mest MK2 and I'm having some issues. The sound is wonderful but I am getting constant clicking and hissing noises while playing music through it. It isn't too bad on louder songs but makes anything soft unlistenable. 
It only seems to do this when its hooked up to my phone, not while on my laptop. My phone is an LG G8x and I mostly listen through UAPP (but it also happens through spotify), not sure if those could be affecting it. I'm guessing its EMI coming from my phone, but before I return the RU6 I want to see if anyone's had a similar issue as I like the sound a lot. Thanks!


----------



## majo123

EvilMunchkin said:


> Hey lads. I just bought an RU6 to pair with my Mest MK2 and I'm having some issues. The sound is wonderful but I am getting constant clicking and hissing noises while playing music through it. It isn't too bad on louder songs but makes anything soft unlistenable.
> It only seems to do this when its hooked up to my phone, not while on my laptop. My phone is an LG G8x and I mostly listen through UAPP (but it also happens through spotify), not sure if those could be affecting it. I'm guessing its EMI coming from my phone, but before I return the RU6 I want to see if anyone's had a similar issue as I like the sound a lot. Thanks!


Get some friends try there phones before you send back .... sounds probably like your phone to me.


----------



## Andykong

justanut said:


> Update:
> 
> I was previously using 4.4 to XLR cables but my 3.5 to RCA have now come in, and at volume 80 on RU6, vol at 1 o'clock on the HA-300ii, I'm again getting a very clean and beautiful output from my MacBook streaming Apple Music.
> 
> Compared to my AK4499 output, this is narrower in soundstage, less depth and poorer imaging, but organic and enjoyable for vocal jazz. No point for orchestral.



RU6 vs AK4499 DAC?

I did recommend sticking with single-end 3.5mm output instead of the balanced 4.4mm output if you must use RU6 as the line out to your amplifier.


----------



## Andykong

EvilMunchkin said:


> Hey lads. I just bought an RU6 to pair with my Mest MK2 and I'm having some issues. The sound is wonderful but I am getting constant clicking and hissing noises while playing music through it. It isn't too bad on louder songs but makes anything soft unlistenable.
> It only seems to do this when its hooked up to my phone, not while on my laptop. My phone is an LG G8x and I mostly listen through UAPP (but it also happens through spotify), not sure if those could be affecting it. I'm guessing its EMI coming from my phone, but before I return the RU6 I want to see if anyone's had a similar issue as I like the sound a lot. Thanks!



When you connect RU6 to your mobile phone with UAPP, did you notice a pop-up window to request exclusive USB Audio access right?

When you use Spotify with your mobile phone, did you turn the volume of the mobile phone to maximum and use the volume control of RU6 instead?


----------



## Sunstealer

I've been using my RU6 in "pretend" line out  - Low Gain, Vol 70 into a ZEN CAN with a home made 3.5mm TRS-RCA Mogami 2893 (from Cosmic Cables) cable. I like it - there is a slight loss of note density but greater soundstage depth and authority, if that makes sense.


----------



## Trevandar1315

schnesim said:


> Да, громкость установлена на максимум. И КОГДА RU6 обнаружен, он работает со всеми приложениями, которые я тестировал. USB audio player pro, Tidal, даже Spotify.
> 
> Перезагрузка телефона/планшета и сброс настроек тоже не помогли.


----------



## shady1991

Sunstealer said:


> I've been using my RU6 in "pretend" line out  - Low Gain, Vol 70 into a ZEN CAN with a home made 3.5mm TRS-RCA Mogami 2893 (from Cosmic Cables) cable. I like it - there is a slight loss of note density but greater soundstage depth and authority, if that makes sense.


Use it on 76 instead, or one of the volumes right before the skip happens (64, 76, 88, 100). Trust me, you will get much less noise this way, and overall cleaner sound.


----------



## EvilMunchkin

Andykong said:


> When you connect RU6 to your mobile phone with UAPP, did you notice a pop-up window to request exclusive USB Audio access right?
> 
> When you use Spotify with your mobile phone, did you turn the volume of the mobile phone to maximum and use the volume control of RU6 instead?


I figured it out, it actually was EMI. Going into Airplane Mode stopped the noise but I couldn't stream, so on a hunch I turned off my mobile data and that completely fixed it. Its a bit annoying to have to do it every time I listen but worth it for the RU6. Thanks for the advice though!


----------



## Trevandar1315

Background
For a long time I doubted whether I needed such a device at all now. I already have Fiio Ka3 on hand, which during the time I have been using it (and this is already almost half a year) has never disappointed or let me down, and generally satisfied with the sound. But there was a nice price, and I took the device new from my hands, and even the case was included. In general, I decided to close the issue of a high-quality portable source for myself for a very long time.

Kit and build quality
Simple but sufficient.
The device is assembled in a monolithic way, so that you don’t dig in, the appearance is strict, but with style, without showing off, and I really like it. There are definitely no complaints about the assembly. It feels very nice and solid, which for someone can also become an important aspect when "communicating" with the device.

Convenience
The device is not small, if you carry it in your pocket, then only with a case, in my opinion. But I'm not going to do that, I'll have it for my house. The native cable is not bad, there are no questions to it. The cover does not increase it much, on the whole it is made correctly, the screen and the glass itself protects. The device heats up very moderately (compared to Fiio, for example), so I don’t consider the case a problem here either.

Working with software players
But it works without any problems. Tried with Hiby, UAPP, Neutron (my main one now), and even Fiio. Does not lag, connects and plays. As you probably know, its volume control is only internal, analog, with 99 resistors, which means that it can only be controlled from the physical DAC buttons, and that’s why it doesn’t seem very convenient to me to use it on the road, but it doesn’t matter to anyone. For me, such a volume control is unusual, but for three days it has ceased to strain at all. I haven't tried it on Windows, Mac or Ios, so I can't offer any advice here.

Power, gluttony, control and options
From the usb output of the TV box and the output of the smartphone, I did not observe a difference in power, at least significant. From a single power with Fiio they have +/- the same, there is no way to check the balance.
And in terms of gluttony, Cayin was pleasantly surprised: I thought that he would champ at least on par with Ka3, but no, he turned out to be much more tolerant of the smartphone’s battery, which is cool.
The screen, although small, is informative and well-organized, the brightness is also good. Everything is controlled by three buttons. Speaking of buttons: they all have the same backlash, if it’s important to someone, but it doesn’t soar for me, and I even like it for some reason.) I’ll dig into the fact that I would prefer the buttons themselves to be flatter and larger in area, but it's already if you get to the bottom of it.
Menu of three options: boost mode, nos/os, screen backlight time. I liked that everything changes on the go without any problems and that you can set "do not turn off the screen", but at the same time it can be turned on / off by briefly pressing the menu button, this is convenient for me. Pauses of 40 ms at every 11 volume division turned out to be not soaring at all, although I was worried about this. The adjustment is very smooth, bravo to the engineers for such an implementation.

Sound and others
(The main impressions are written regarding the NOS option, OS will be discussed separately, the gain is basically High)
That's what this device is bought for, right? Yes, we can say that in terms of graphics and performance, it will merge even a very inexpensive normal implementation of delta-sigma, that these are just show-offs from developers and an attempt to rip money off buyers. But I'm with this, listening to this contraption, I will not agree.
So what about the sound? The first thing that impresses immediately is the stage and positioning. This is an individual thing, of course, but in my ear it is more wide than deep, although in both directions it is noticeably better than in Fiio. Strangely enough, this struck me the most on my inexpensive Guideray GR-I hybrids, which sounded like other headphones. In general, the wow effect regarding the scene was unambiguous. I will touch on it again when I talk about ranges.

Bass: According to the reviews, I expected that there would be some kind of mid-bass pumping, but it turned out that it works even more accurately with bass than the Ka3, which gives a very lean bass, biting and percussive. Yes, in RU6 you can hear some softness and roundness (I will use this word more than once), but at the same time it is in no way inferior to Fiio in speed. It's more like the difference in the thickness of the brush when painting the same picture, like a nickel and a pure silver flute: the result is about the same, but the presentation is different, and therefore it is perceived differently. And for myself, I could not decide what I definitely like more: both are good, and the other, but for a different mood. Sub-bass is also well heard, but here it is generally even, without any emphasis, so it may not be enough for someone. I've had enough.

Medium: here I agree with the reviewers that they fall in love with themselves. Such physicality, such texture, emphasizing the nature of a person's voice, and at the same time maintaining softness without any loss of detail - in my opinion, this is worth a lot. At the same time, there is no forced pulling of images to the fore, but rather, everything that is there is given more space and conditional air, it is better outlined. Of course, you can say that the vocalists are getting a little closer to you, but I hear it in such a way that the voice is given a little more space (conditionally, if in default the voice goes like a cylinder, then Cayin sends it to you through a cone, a horn). I understand that this is all kapets as an individual, but you already understand that everything said above and below is just my IMHO. Music. I will give you one example today, my regular one, but it demonstrates this difference very well: Musica Nuda - Complici. In Fiio, it's as if the cello is close to you and a little hypertrophied, while the textures of the bow strikes on the strings are very tangible. And here, when I turned it on on RU6, I was VERY amazed: the cello was in space, a little to the left of the center, it was not right in front of your nose, but a little further away. And the most impressive thing is that I very clearly felt the VOLUME and DIMENSIONS of the instrument itself, literally its dimensions. At the same time, he worked with strokes more accurately, less "aggressively" than Ka3, but at the same time retaining texture, even if it was not so pronounced. And I bring all this to finally try to explain to you two words, "softness" and "naturalness", which people like to use so often: the whole texture and tactile qualities of the instrument / voice practically do not change, but you begin to perceive it not in a conditional vacuum, but TOGETHER with what makes that sound, where it makes that sound. Adjusted for features, this can be attributed to other ranges. In fact, this is the result of a mixture of detail and positioning, but this is a very, very rough analogy. It is heard immediately, but not immediately realized. It's the same with the vocals - it feels like Petra is standing to the left and slightly ahead of Ferrucho (the cellist). And they, the sounds, do not close to each other, but "live" in the same room, but each in its own way. I’ll clarify right away that I don’t apply all the terms to real recording conditions and that this is how they stood in the studio, but that’s how I perceive it. Hope it didn't get too confusing. More about the mids: they don’t brighten me in the upper mids, as some wrote, but on the contrary, they were able to somewhat round off the aggressive peak in my Audio-Technica SR5, due to which solo piano, for example, or female vocals were perceived unnaturally. But I do not have enough headphones for more complex conclusions on this matter.

Trebles: they don’t try to specifically draw attention to themselves, stand out from the general background, say “here, look at what plates are here” or “don’t you hear the guy with the triangle puffing from behind? that’s not the point, here he is!”. I don’t want to say that KA3 is bright or something like that, I still consider it very even. But damn, it's nice to hear the way Cayin does it. Perhaps, if you turn on the golden-eared mode, you can say that the aftersound in Fiio is better, the trails are longer and that's all, and it's a sin to hide, I love all these bells and whistles in high, but Cayin, while maintaining a conditional 95% percent of all these nuances, makes you hear and listen to high frequencies more holistically, along with the rest of the musical canvas, which just gives us (never happened before, and here again) the naturalness of the presentation. Want a little more audiophile? There is a solution!

OS: in oversampled mode, I can hear the scene getting narrower, less airy in the mids, but the clarity of the highs definitely increases, maybe a bit longer (but not sure). Therefore, if there is a desire, we turn it on, listen and enjoy. The general character, of course, is preserved, so I would call these differences nuanced and purely taste. I personally prefer to use NOS for the time being.

A little bit of perversion: yes, I connect Sennheiser HD-600 to both of them, and what will you do to me?) } -) Okay, seriously, I understand perfectly well that these portable DACs were not created for this, but I never bought any kind of amp, which I definitely plan to do now, but now it’s not about that. I just tested the maximum volume indicators on them so that there was a load and so that I would not burn any other headphones, and just they showed plus or minus the same VOLUME (maybe Fiio was even a little louder, but not much). But in terms of quality, Cayin exported them better. Even at maximum speeds, he tried in volume and did not break into a scream when the Fiio began to sound flat and bright. I remind you that this is a perversion and I listen to 600 like that only because I want to listen, otherwise there’s nothing else for now. But in both cases, for this format of devices, the results are simply excellent. On the Cayin at high gain, the volume is usually between 60 and 90, depending on the material and recording. In terms of serving with Sennheiser, Fiio comes to me more (although if you turn on OS, it’s debatable), but in terms of quality, Cayin.

Background and noise and pickups: this was also often written about. Well, with hybrids at 16 ohms there is no noise at all, with Sony xba-1 armatures, which collect any noise at all, there is, but very moderate, even in quiet compositions it does not pay attention to itself at all. Of course, you should listen in advance if you have Andromedas or Solaris, there will definitely be some noise, but in the vast majority of headphones it is unlikely. Andy wrote that the technology is such that when you switch to higher clusters of volume control resistors, the noise shelf will increase, and this is true, at 90+ I heard it quite clearly, but there is one small nuance: you will go f*cking deaf along the way, but then Noise won't bother you. In general, this is not a problem for me, for most people too, but if you know if you are sensitive to this or if you have ultra-sensitive headphones, keep in mind and preferably check in advance.
And I didn’t catch any pickups at home, although there is enough wave interference of all kinds. The close proximity to the phone also did not affect it in any way. But this makes no guarantees for you personally, however.

Material quality requirements
Well, it seems to me that in addition to frank slang, it will be pleasant to listen to material of any quality with him, but the better, the more he will be able to give you. Something audiophile recorded, concerts and the like is amazing to listen to. But something of lesser quality will not let blood out of your ears. And the versatility in a device of this class is a very good quality, as for me.

Warming up
I am more than sure about the heating of the headphones (not all of them, of course), in the lamps, for example, too, but in the sources... On the other hand, a lot of people with this device confirm this, and the same Andy did not deny it, so we'll see in a couple of months, but I think that in the case of DAC, psychoacoustics will be much more important. But if it warms up, I definitely won't mind.

General conclusions
Well, my first device from this company, my first source in this price range, my first multibit. And all this leaves very positive emotions and impressions, I really want to use the device, I want to listen to music with it. And the fact that it is called not a Hi-Res device, that the technology inside is as ancient as a mammoth (although show me another device of such dimensions with such minced meat inside, moreover, very well cooked and for a similar cost) - it does not matter to me at all. Nothing is perfect (especially for the money), so the pros of the RU6 for me easily outweigh its cons. By the way, there are two Hi-Res Audio stickers in the kit, and I have not tried it, but if you buy, you can stick them in the right place in your opinion, and maybe, but this is not certain, you will have a more defined bass or more sparkling treble , but who knows?)) 
Cayin are handsome who took a chance and made such a little thing. In our time, a copy-paste of this enthusiasm is very lacking.
I do not pretend to be truth, I pretend to be honest on my part. RU6 has enough competitors (S2, W2, Go Bar), for every taste and budget, take what you want and can. I am very pleased with the purchase and closed my research in portable sources for a long time, probably until the time when I can get to good players.
Enjoy the music, ladies and gentlemen, and remember that we are all the same, but very different. Peace to you!


----------



## yaps66

Trevandar1315 said:


> Background
> For a long time I doubted whether I needed such a device at all now. I already have Fiio Ka3 on hand, which during the time I have been using it (and this is already almost half a year) has never disappointed or let me down, and generally satisfied with the sound. But there was a nice price, and I took the device new from my hands, and even the case was included. In general, I decided to close the issue of a high-quality portable source for myself for a very long time.
> 
> Kit and build quality
> ...


Epic! 💕


----------



## Andykong

Trevandar1315 said:


> Background
> For a long time I doubted whether I needed such a device at all now. I already have Fiio Ka3 on hand, which during the time I have been using it (and this is already almost half a year) has never disappointed or let me down, and generally satisfied with the sound. But there was a nice price, and I took the device new from my hands, and even the case was included. In general, I decided to close the issue of a high-quality portable source for myself for a very long time.
> 
> Kit and build quality
> ...



Spend an hour reading through your sharing slowly on a Sunday afternoon.  I read it slowly because your sharing has recalled a lot of precious moments when I was a young, (well, much younger than today) passionate audiophile spending hours sharing my thoughts and answering questions on Usenet newsgroups (anyone still recalls this good old platform?).  Yes, we don't necessarily be very knowledgeable, but we share and contribute with honesty.

A minor clarification regarding the Resistor Array Volume Control in RU6.    You are correct that the volume control is composed of many resistors, but we don't need "99 resistors" to provide 99 steps of volume control.  The resistor array is organized into 9 segments, each segment provides 10 volume control steps, and you only need 4 resistors in each segment to facilitate 10 control steps.  So we only need, theoretically, around 40 resistors to compose this resistor array volume controller. 

Regarding the background noise at a higher volume level, you are correct to state that "when you switch to higher clusters of volume control resistors, the noise shelf will increase, and this is true, at 90+ I heard it quite clearly,...".  This is because the resistors in the R-2R ladder DAC are sensitive to heat, when you drive the amplification circuit harder, the heat generated by the circuitry will affect the resistors in R-2R, and introduce thermal noise into the background.  Using resistors with a better coefficient of resistance (TCR) will improve the problem but this is where budget control kicks in.  The TCR of the Thin-Film Resistors used in RU6 is rated at TCR25 (±25 ppm/℃).  In other words, the resistor value will fluctuate within 25/1,000,000 per 1-degree change in temperature.   For the record, *R01 Audio Motherboard* uses thin-film resistors with TCR10 (= ±10 ppm/℃) and offers much better noise-control capability, relatively.


----------



## Trevandar1315

Andykong said:


> Spend an hour reading through your sharing slowly on a Sunday afternoon.  I read it slowly because your sharing has recalled a lot of precious moments when I was a young, (well, much younger than today) passionate audiophile spending hours sharing my thoughts and answering questions on Usenet newsgroups (anyone still recalls this good old platform?).  Yes, we don't necessarily be very knowledgeable, but we share and contribute with honesty.
> 
> A minor clarification regarding the Resistor Array Volume Control in RU6.    You are correct that the volume control is composed of many resistors, but we don't need "99 resistors" to provide 99 steps of volume control.  The resistor array is organized into 9 segments, each segment provides 10 volume control steps, and you only need 4 resistors in each segment to facilitate 10 control steps.  So we only need, theoretically, around 40 resistors to compose this resistor array volume controller.
> 
> По поводу фонового шума на более высоком уровне громкости вы правы, что "при переключении на более высокие группы резисторов регулятора громкости шумовая полка будет увеличиваться, и это правда, на 90+ я это отчетливо слышал,.. .". Это связано с тем, что резисторы в многозвенном ЦАП R-2R чувствительны к теплу, и когда вы нагружаете схему усиления сильнее, тепло, выделяемое схемой, будет воздействовать на резисторы в R-2R и привносить тепловой шум на задний план. Использование резисторов с лучшим коэффициентом сопротивления (TCR) устранит проблему, но здесь вступает в действие контроль бюджета. TCR тонкопленочных резисторов, используемых в RU6, оценивается как TCR25 (±25 ppm/℃). Другими словами, номинал резистора будет колебаться в пределах 25/1 000 000 при изменении температуры на 1 градус. Для записи,*Материнская плата R01 Audio* использует тонкопленочные резисторы с TCR10 (= ± 10 ppm / ℃) и предлагает относительно гораздо лучшие возможности контроля шума.


Hi Andy, thanks for taking the time to read my review, I really appreciate it. Thanks for the clarification on the number of volume resistors, I had read about 120 pages by the time I got the RU6, but I don't remember the information about it. As for the effect of heat on noise, I would like to clarify: the amount of heat generated by the amplification part will depend on what load is connected, or does it just depend on what actual power they are working at?


----------



## oknenir

EvilMunchkin said:


> Hey lads. I just bought an RU6 to pair with my Mest MK2 and I'm having some issues. The sound is wonderful but I am getting constant clicking and hissing noises while playing music through it. It isn't too bad on louder songs but makes anything soft unlistenable.
> It only seems to do this when its hooked up to my phone, not while on my laptop. My phone is an LG G8x and I mostly listen through UAPP (but it also happens through spotify), not sure if those could be affecting it. I'm guessing its EMI coming from my phone, but before I return the RU6 I want to see if anyone's had a similar issue as I like the sound a lot. Thanks!


Try putting the Ru6 in your hand and see of the pops go away.

I've noticed 2 things: 
1. if you put the RU6 and a phone n the same pocket, it picks EMI which is sort constant rythmic popping.
2. Occasional pops which I believe is ESD. With limited experience with RU6 I thought it was my Moondrop Kato cable combined with specific clothing material. Putting my hand on the RU6 fixed it.


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## CayinSupport (Jun 28, 2022)

Dear RU6 users, we have recently updated the Windows USB Audio Driver for RU6,

it enhanced compatibility with more Windows 10 PCs, please head to the following link to download,

https://en.cayin.cn/drive/9/18/484.html


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## DBaldock9

CayinSupport said:


> Dear RU6 users, we have recently updated the Windows USB Audio Driver for RU6,
> 
> it provides a better user experience on Windows 10, please head to the following link to download,
> 
> https://en.cayin.cn/drive/9/18/484.html



I hope it's not required, since I've been using my RU6 with a Win10 work PC, where I'm not allowed to install drivers.

When I'm using it at home, it's connected to a Kubuntu 22.04 Linux PC, running a v5.15.0-40 Kernel, and with the latest pipewire audio subsystem.  Are there any updates for Linux?


----------



## yaps66

CayinSupport said:


> Dear RU6 users, we have recently updated the Windows USB Audio Driver for RU6,
> 
> it provides a better user experience on Windows 10, please head to the following link to download,
> 
> https://en.cayin.cn/drive/9/18/484.html


Have installed and works great! Definitely a much better experience on Windows 10. Previously I would have some issues especially over Roon when using the ASIO driver. Those issues are now solved. Thanks Cayin!


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## peterinvan

CayinSupport said:


> Dear RU6 users, we have recently updated the Windows USB Audio Driver for RU6,
> 
> it enhanced compatibility with more Windows 10 PCs, please head to the following link to download,
> 
> https://en.cayin.cn/drive/9/18/484.html




Using Windows 11.  

Downloaded drivers are blocked by Windows Defender and Norton as "not safe".

Suggestions?


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## Andykong

peterinvan said:


> Using Windows 11.
> 
> Downloaded drivers are blocked by Windows Defender and Norton as "not safe".
> 
> Suggestions?



They probably don't like our security cert?  There arw two download button on the driver page, the one on far right is Google Drive, hopefully your Widows Defender will not block a Google Driver download.


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## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> I hope it's not required, since I've been using my RU6 with a Win10 work PC, where I'm not allowed to install drivers.
> 
> When I'm using it at home, it's connected to a Kubuntu 22.04 Linux PC, running a v5.15.0-40 Kernel, and with the latest pipewire audio subsystem.  Are there any updates for Linux?



It is not required unless you run into some trouble with your existing setup. If your setup works fine right now, you don't need the new driver.   The USB Audio 2.0 drivers provided by Windows 10 or 11 work fines in general, but it didn't support advanced features such as ASIO.

There is no need to install USB Audio Driver for Linux setup.


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## Andykong (Jun 29, 2022)

Trevandar1315 said:


> Hi Andy, thanks for taking the time to read my review, I really appreciate it. Thanks for the clarification on the number of volume resistors, I had read about 120 pages by the time I got the RU6, but I don't remember the information about it. As for the effect of heat on noise, I would like to clarify: the amount of heat generated by the amplification part will depend on what load is connected, or does it just depend on what actual power they are working at?



No, we didn't mention the number of resistors in the volume control, we focused on the number of segments and problems when users jump from one segment to another.  Whether each segment contains 4 resistors or 10 resistors is not really important, in our humble opinion.  For those who are interested to find out these details, this is a very fundamental binary digital processing concept: 
With one resistor, you can provide 2 volume steps: on and off.  
With two resistors, you have 4 volume steps:  on/on, on/off, off/on, off/off
With three resistors, you have 8 volume steps, so on and so forth.

Why would you drive the amplifier circuit to full load if you are connecting to a high-sensitive (easy load) earphone?  That doesn't make sense, right? You only push the circuit to its limit because you have a load that needed the extra power.  That's why you can't separate the two variables independently.


----------



## Andykong

oknenir said:


> Try putting the Ru6 in your hand and see of the pops go away.
> 
> I've noticed 2 things:
> 1. if you put the RU6 and a phone n the same pocket, it picks EMI which is sort constant rythmic popping.
> 2. Occasional pops which I believe is ESD. With limited experience with RU6 I thought it was my Moondrop Kato cable combined with specific clothing material. Putting my hand on the RU6 fixed it.



That's because you earthed the device when you put your hand on the RU6.

From what we tested, most Android and iPhone won't cause severe interference to RU6, but there are always the odd case that can be caused by the hardware design of the phone (e.g., the position of the wireless antenna), or certain software that caused the phone to operate the transmission or reception in high power.


----------



## DBaldock9

Andykong said:


> It is not required unless you run into some trouble with your existing setup. If your setup works fine right now, you don't need the new driver.   The USB Audio 2.0 drivers provided by Windows 10 or 11 work fines in general, but it didn't support advanced features such as ASIO.
> 
> There is no need to install USB Audio Driver for Linux setup.


At work, I'm mainly listening to 48KHz YouTube videos.


----------



## Andykong

DBaldock9 said:


> At work, I'm mainly listening to 48KHz YouTube videos.



The MS Window driver works fine in this case.


----------



## RROWI

For me, I note that the pop sound disappear when listen to Tidal, I dont now if its related with some cache improvement.


----------



## bnupy

What is an unsafe level of hotness for the dongle. And what causes it.


----------



## bnupy

Is there a way to give clean output to the ru6 ?


----------



## Goofyboy84

I’m back!!!!!! I just laid the amp down for a few months and never touched it. I’ve been happy-ish with my iPhone source as it’s the most reliable thing I have. But… my amp has a short in it. That’s what the issue with mine has been. 😢😢😢😢😢😢

I don’t know if @MusicTeck will exchange it or if I should just throw it in the trash. Or I’ll sell the amp plus a 7 pin balanced cable from JH for $200 obo. (I have no clue what to sell it for. I’m not trying to screw anyone.) I have the USBc connector also from Cayin. 

I’m sorry to have disappeared for so long… but I was 100% over the whole thing at the time. Done. 

Zach


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Any owners of ThieAudio Oracle or Excalibur here? How does it pair with the RU6? I'm planing to get one of these IEMs.

As someone who thinks Blessing 2 is a bit shouty and bright, do you think I'll have issues with Oracle or Excalibur? or would pairing it with my RU6 balance things out in the higher frequencies.


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## denis1976

Hello my RU6 don't work with my phone, I plug it into the type c of the phone and nothing happens, this just started few minutes ago, before that when I plug it the uapp popped and the dongle was on.. Is no a RU6 problem because it works when I connect it to my sp2000, is there something that I can do?


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## PopZeus

This is on sale now. Shoulda waited a week.


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## Goofyboy84 (Jul 2, 2022)

I think I’m just going to throw the RU6 in the trash and never go down this route again. I don’t want to have to deal with throwing more money at it on sending it in and everything like that. I just don’t. I’m sorry I’ve had such a horrid experience with this device. When it works? It’s amazing. Otherwise? It’s literally a brick. 😢😢😢😢

@Andykong


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## oknenir

Johnfg465vd said:


> or would pairing it with my RU6 balance things out in the higher frequencies.


RU6 smoothes out things, but it won't fix a bright earphone.


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## Johnfg465vd

oknenir said:


> RU6 smoothes out things, but it won't fix a bright earphone.


I guess, a better question would be are these IEMs (Oracle/Excalibur) so bright that even RU6 won't help? I have asked this in the ThieAudio thread, it should help me decide on my next upgrade.

If there are any owners of above IEMs or if you have heard them with RU6 just PM me about your thoughts on this pairing. It'll really help me save a lot of time and money.


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## BrokenHill (Jul 4, 2022)

Johnfg465vd said:


> I guess, a better question would be are these IEMs (Oracle/Excalibur) so bright that even RU6 won't help? I have asked this in the ThieAudio thread, it should help me decide on my next upgrade.
> 
> If there are any owners of above IEMs or if you have heard them with RU6 just PM me about your thoughts on this pairing. It'll really help me save a lot of time and money.


I have the RU6 and I had the Oracle, although they did not coincide in time, I'm sorry. It is somewhat difficult to recommend IEMs, because we each have our own tastes, but from what I see we have similar trajectories. I had the Blessing 2 Dusk, and moved on to the Oracle. I no longer have either of them. I also considered B2D somewhat garish. The Oracle didn't convince me of its tuning, and as soon as I tried the Penon Volt, I sold it. I do not regret. Today, in the approximate price range of the Oracle, there is the Yanyin Moonlight, and I couldn't think of any other to recommend. For me it is perfect. It's not shrill with any source, they have the best treble I've ever heard on a tribrid with EST. Pairs well with the RU6 especially with Jazz, Acoustic and Rock music. The genres where the extra warmth of the RU6 stands out.

EDIT: Apart from allowing me that recommendation... other ways to tone down the treble peaks that you don't like are: EQ (the most efficient, cheapest and that gives you more control) or tips or cable rolling.


----------



## Milen007

Hi all

I am interested in ru6. Anyone have any experience connecting it to amplifier for higher power? I want to drive hd6xx. Any amp recommendation that work well with ru6?


----------



## oldkid

Milen007 said:


> Hi all
> 
> I am interested in ru6. Anyone have any experience connecting it to amplifier for higher power? I want to drive hd6xx. Any amp recommendation that work well with ru6?


I often use the RU6 in my desktop set-up, with a tube preamp and a class A amp. It works flawlessly with the RU6 volume set to 100.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

BrokenHill said:


> I have the RU6 and I had the Oracle, although they did not coincide in time, I'm sorry. It is somewhat difficult to recommend IEMs, because we each have our own tastes, but from what I see we have similar trajectories. I had the Blessing 2 Dusk, and moved on to the Oracle. I no longer have either of them. I also considered B2D somewhat garish. The Oracle didn't convince me of its tuning, and as soon as I tried the Penon Volt, I sold it. I do not regret. Today, in the approximate price range of the Oracle, there is the Yanyin Moonlight, and I couldn't think of any other to recommend. For me it is perfect. It's not shrill with any source, they have the best treble I've ever heard on a tribrid with EST. Pairs well with the RU6 especially with Jazz, Acoustic and Rock music. The genres where the extra warmth of the RU6 stands out.
> 
> EDIT: Apart from allowing me that recommendation... other ways to tone down the treble peaks that you don't like are: EQ (the most efficient, cheapest and that gives you more control) or tips or cable rolling.


When I was looking for IEMs I did come across the Yanyin Moonlight but the lack of reviews and unavailability at local stores made me dismiss it. The Volt though, it's the first time I heard about it and after reading some reviews, they seem exactly what I'm looking for.

They too are not available locally and I have to import them but I'm really tempted. Thanks for the great suggestion.


----------



## BrokenHill

Johnfg465vd said:


> When I was looking for IEMs I did come across the Yanyin Moonlight but the lack of reviews and unavailability at local stores made me dismiss it. The Volt though, it's the first time I heard about it and after reading some reviews, they seem exactly what I'm looking for.
> 
> They too are not available locally and I have to import them but I'm really tempted. Thanks for the great suggestion.


I have no chance to try them in local stores and I have to trust the reviews. I tend to prefer end-user opinions and reviews from forums like this one. Trying it out for yourself is always best, if you can. The Yanyin Moonlight is relatively recent. There's an excellent review here, which also compares them to the Volt. I couldn't resist... and I have both


----------



## Milen007

Can ru6 drive hifiman edition xs?


----------



## dakchi

Milen007 said:


> Can ru6 drive hifiman edition xs?


If you use your RU6 with a laptop, it drives the XS well. However, when I use it with my iPhone, I get clippings due to power limitation in iPhone I guess


----------



## Milen007

dakchi said:


> If you use your RU6 with a laptop, it drives the XS well. However, when I use it with my iPhone, I get clippings due to power limitation in iPhone I guess


Excellent. Thx alot for the reply. I am getting one


----------



## peterinvan (Jul 5, 2022)

*RU6 with Grado SR325is Balanced*

I cut the cables coming out of the Grado cups just above the Y junction, and added 3.5mm Mono Sockets. 
Using a 4.4mm "silver" cable from Meze, I am really enjoying the RU6/SR325is combo.  Volume around 30db. 

Very realistic sound stage.  Good bass response (with new flat pads). 

Vocals are the most enjoyable of my HP collection.  Lizz Wright fans:  https://tidal.com/browse/album/232582153


----------



## Milen007

Just got my ru6. Sound very fatiguing. How long usually need to burn in?


----------



## peterinvan

Milen007 said:


> Just got my ru6. Sound very fatiguing. How long usually need to burn in?


My experience was that at 50 hrs, the sound matured and has not changed since.  

What headphones/earphones are you using?


----------



## Milen007

I am using hifiman edition xs and fiio fh7


----------



## Andykong

Milen007 said:


> Just got my ru6. Sound very fatiguing. How long usually need to burn in?


What is your source to RU6?  mobile phone or PC?  Can you set USB bit-perfect USB Audio (or exclusive USB Audio) path for RU6? What is the volume value of your mobile phone/PC and RU6  when you pair your RU6 with Hifiman edition xs and Fiio FH7 respectively?


----------



## oknenir

Milen007 said:


> Just got my ru6. Sound very fatiguing.


Can't believe you're saying this about RU6 . Could be some sort of EQ on your source? Or the cayin is faulty... 
Did you try switching OS/NOS modes? Although I can't call neither fatiguing. 

Could it be some demanding headphone causing to clip or something?


----------



## oknenir

I've installed Tidal on my new Android phone. I've got 2 Tempotec dongles, and Tidal / Hiby (app) feeeze after I give them permission to used USB audio. 

When I connect RU6 though, Tidal doesn't even ask for this permission. It just plays everything through the usual Android path with resampling to 48kHz  
Any suggestions how to fix this?


----------



## PhenixS1970

How to upgrade a mid-tier DAP (A&K sr25)


----------



## Milen007

oknenir said:


> Can't believe you're saying this about RU6 . Could be some sort of EQ on your source? Or the cayin is faulty...
> Did you try switching OS/NOS modes? Although I can't call neither fatiguing.
> 
> Could it be some demanding headphone causing to clip or something?


It gets better after 15hrs burn in. Fatiguing Maybe wrong word. A bit harsh might be better word


----------



## Milen007 (Jul 8, 2022)

Andykong said:


> What is your source to RU6?  mobile phone or PC?  Can you set USB bit-perfect USB Audio (or exclusive USB Audio) path for RU6? What is the volume value of your mobile phone/PC and RU6  when you pair your RU6 with Hifiman edition xs and Fiio FH7 respectively?


Source: Note 20 ultra at max volume with wifi and cellular of playing wav and aif locally from mem card

Yes. Using uapp bit perfect.


Getting better with burn in after 15hrs.

+will update after settling in


----------



## Ichos

Harsh, fatiguing or bright it would be the last word I use to describe the RU-6.
This thingy needs at least 100 hours to settle down be a believer or not.


----------



## balleklorin

Milen007 said:


> It gets better after 15hrs burn in. Fatiguing Maybe wrong word. A bit harsh might be better word


From a test here at Head-fi: 
... while it comes as a surprise that the RU6 is a touch metallic sounding in the upper mids/treble and can become just a bit edgy.
The RU6 is somewhat bolder and aggressive compared to the Go bar which is calmer and more polite.


----------



## Brain Damage (Jul 9, 2022)

balleklorin said:


> From a test here at Head-fi:
> ... while it comes as a surprise that the RU6 is a touch metallic sounding in the upper mids/treble and can become just a bit edgy.
> The RU6 is somewhat bolder and aggressive compared to the Go bar which is calmer and more polite.


Sorry, I have to totally disagree. I find many ESS dacs that I own to be more edgy in terms of treble and upper mids - especially the ESS dacs that opt for a completely silent noise floor and extremely detailed, high clarity sound signature - which I now (having had the RU6 for 6 months) find to be quite sterile and the opposite of musical.

The RU6 has an amazing balance - it is still very detailed and offers great soundstage and clarity across the whole frequency range whilst maintaining an analogue, musical vibe across most genres of music that I just can't seem to get with ESS or AKM dacs. I do know some people have said that the Questyle M12 & M15 has a more analogue tuning/implementation of its ESS dac chips. And I'd love to know how the iBasso DC06 sounds.


----------



## bnupy

Brain Damage said:


> Sorry, I have to totally disagree. I find many ESS dacs that I own to be more edgy in terms of treble and upper mids - especially the ESS dacs that opt for a completely silent noise floor and extremely detailed, high clarity sound signature - which I now (having had the RU6 for 6 months) find to be quite sterile and the opposite of musical.
> 
> The RU6 has an amazing balance - it is still very detailed and offers great soundstage and clarity across the whole frequency range whilst maintaining an analogue, musical vibe across most genres of music that I just can't seem to get with ESS or AKM dacs. I do know some people have said that the Questyle M12 & M15 has a more analogue tuning/implementation of its ESS dac chips. And I'd love to know how the iBasso DC06 sounds.


Ive tried out the m15 in comparison. its a bit more clinical in how it sounds, what you are meant to hear in the most digital sense. Yet, its still natural in its presentation. 
No digital sharpening. But ru6 is a bit more of a pleasant sounding. I'd use m15 if i were using it for audio related editing, but ru6 for music.


----------



## hartphoto

Brain Damage said:


> <SNIP>
> 
> The RU6 has an amazing balance - it is still very detailed and offers great soundstage and clarity across the whole frequency range whilst maintaining an analogue, musical vibe across most genres of music <SNIP>



^^^^^^^
This describes the RU6 perfectly to my ears also. I'm using the RU6 with an iPhone 12 Pro Max, along with another recent aquisition, the Audeze LCD-X 2021. RU6 is set to high gain, NOS. OS is a bit much clarity for me.

I've spent the last day off and on comparing SQ (identical tracks, many genres) from Apple Music, FLACBox (my own ripped FLAC files), and Qobuz (still in the trial period). While I ultimately prefer FLACBox (using EQ for slight tuning), Qobuz is a _very close_ second. Apple Music isn't bad by any means to these ears, it has a certain 'blackness' I like, which seems to create a bigger soundstage in all directions. However, at the same time, the overall experience presents a bit more recessed/sterile.


----------



## shwnwllms

Picked up a UM MEXT the other day. Impressed so far. Seems to be a great combo especially with the smoothed out treble on the RU6. (Some have complained about the highs on the MEXT but I’m not hearing any issues whatsoever)


----------



## Milen007

Pass 50hrs of burn in. It begins to soften up. Nice. Micro details is superb. Very Musical.


----------



## Milen007

balleklorin said:


> From a test here at Head-fi:
> ... while it comes as a surprise that the RU6 is a touch metallic sounding in the upper mids/treble and can become just a bit edgy.
> The RU6 is somewhat bolder and aggressive compared to the Go bar which is calmer and more polite.


Agreed. I prefered own ripped file as well. Tho its only cd quality. Less noise


----------



## simpleworld (Jul 17, 2022)

Has anyone tried using a 3ft or longer USB-C cable with the RU-6?  I just got mine, letting it burn in on my windows machine.  If I use a 3ft USB-C cable the unit will work for a few minutes and then windows audio stops and I have to unplug and reconnect the cable.  Edit: It was not the 3ft usb-c cable it was the USB port on my PC.  I was using one of the ports on the front of the case which are wired differently than the ports on the back directly attached to the motherboard.  Switching to the port on the back works fine.  With the standard short USB-C that comes with the RU-6 the front port works fine too, maybe the front ports just don't provide enough power or maybe line loss which manifests with the longer cables.

Edit:  I do have the RU-6 Windows USB driver installed.  Interestingly, the dongle works without the driver too.

Edit 2:  Loving the sound on this thing.  The difference between OS and NOS is quite noticeable.  Decent amount of power, drives my 80ohm DT770's well in high gain mode with volume around 70-90, depending on the track.  Curious to see how my IEM's and LCD-X sounds.


----------



## eswng679 (Jul 13, 2022)

simpleworld said:


> Curious to see how my IEM's...sounds.


The RU-6 is silent with low impedance IEMs and is just a lovely experience overall.

To my ears, it sounds excellent with the IEMs in my collection, along with the ones I previously had (Olina / Variations / Fiio FH7 / U12T) . It adds a bit of warmth to more analytical sets but retains the details. For example, I was back and forth on selling the Variations, which are known to have a mid-bass dip; however, when I paired them with the RU-6, it was a magical listening experience. I found that I no longer needed EQ for the Variations with the RU-6. In the end, I only sold because of fit issues.


----------



## animalsrush

Quick question.. I just got RU6. How to check the firmware and make sure I have the latest and second where to get the firmware 

Thanks pc


----------



## simpleworld

animalsrush said:


> Quick question.. I just got RU6. How to check the firmware and make sure I have the latest and second where to get the firmware
> 
> Thanks pc


As far as I'm aware, there have never been firmware updates for the ru-6.  I'm not even sure the unit is updateable.


----------



## Milen007

Any amp recommendation that goes well with ru6? 

Nx7
Sa1?

I dont mind if portable or desktop

Thx


----------



## justanut

Milen007 said:


> Any amp recommendation that goes well with ru6?
> 
> Nx7
> Sa1?
> ...


You'd best set some parameters such as price, dimension, weight, power requirements (intended to drive which headphone?) etc.


----------



## Milen007

Milen007 said:


> Any amp recommendation that goes well with ru6?
> 
> Nx7
> Sa1?
> ...


Price under usd 1k

Primary headphones are hd6xx, hifiman edition xs and fiio fh7


----------



## justanut

Milen007 said:


> Price under usd 1k
> 
> Primary headphones are hd6xx, hifiman edition xs and fiio fh7


I've paired the HD650 with RU6 via WA8, and that's a fantastic sounding portable (or rather transportable) duo. U can find used sets for just under 1k sometimes.


----------



## becauseim

twister6 said:


> Oh, not just coming soon, already here   This little data/power adapter from ddHiFi is brilliant.  No need for splitters or usb-c to lightning adapters or camera kits.  It's a small adapter with lightning connector going to your iPhone/iPod Touch and then one side with usb-c data output (for your usb dac/amp) and the other side with usb-c power input (for charging).
> 
> Here, took a few very quick pictures with iPod Touch.  Ironically, I use the latest gen iPod touch for all my "iPhone" testing and its battery is dead, can't hold a charge for more than 4-5min.  Now, I can test it for as long as I want to because I'm charging at the same time.  Btw, also got their usb-c to usb-c OTG cable (Nyx series, TC09S model).  Regardless of what I thought of a short usb-c OTG cable can do, this one gives RU6 a wider soundstage, and I'm still scratching my head because I'm hearing a difference loud and clear.  The only secret sauce here is extra isolation of every wire and keeping data and power completely separate.  Plus, core of the wire is pure silver while shielding is OFC and SPC.


It only allows you to charge the iPhone at the same time or provides additional power for the USB DAC? in other words, the device contributes to a better sound or just allows you to charge your smartphone in parallel?

When I tested the L&P W2 dongle, the sound from the macbook was slightly better than from the iPhone. as far as I understand, due to the higher transport power.


----------



## twister6

becauseim said:


> It only allows you to charge the iPhone at the same time or provides additional power for the USB DAC? in other words, the device contributes to a better sound or just allows you to charge your smartphone in parallel?
> 
> When I tested the L&P W2 dongle, the sound from the macbook was slightly better than from the iPhone. as far as I understand, due to the higher transport power.



The data/power to RU6 comes from iPhone/ipod Touch in this case. The additional (and optional) usb-c power port is only to charge the smartphone. 

It still works without power cable connected, so you can use it either way. I tested it with and without a power cable connected, and there was no difference in sound quality. 

This adapter is for convenience, letting you use usb-c cable with your iPhone without a need to get lightning cable and also being able to charge the host (iPhone) at the same time.


----------



## hartphoto (Jul 15, 2022)

twister6 said:


> The data/power to RU6 comes from iPhone/ipod Touch in this case. The additional (and optional) usb-c power port is only to charge the smartphone.
> 
> It still works without power cable connected, so you can use it either way. I tested it with and without a power cable connected, and there was no difference in sound quality.
> 
> This adapter is for convenience, letting you use usb-c cable with your iPhone without a need to get lightning cable and also being able to charge the host (iPhone) at the same time.


^^^THIS^^^

A little additional info. Apple has very specific power requirements, or power availability to pass on to devices plugged into the lightning port. That's why you may see the error message about some devices not being compatible, or drawing to much power.

The ddhifi TC28i Pro doesn't have the Apple Certified 'mifi' rating (or it's not shown in advertising if it does). That doesn't mean I wouldn't use it myself, it only means that ddhifi didn't go through the certification process (takes time, $$$, and other resources).

They do however make the claim of better sound. Advert of ddhifi's below. Whether this is a change that can be heard...like @twister6  mentioned, he didn't find it. Secondary question for @twister6, did you ever get any pop up messages when using the ddhifi TC28i?


----------



## twister6

hartphoto said:


> ^^^THIS^^^
> 
> A little additional info. Apple has very specific power requirements, or power availability to pass on to devices plugged into the lightning port. That's why you may see the error message about some devices not being compatible, or drawing to much power.
> 
> ...



I can double check with my daughter's iPhone 13, but with iPod Touch 7th gen I used for testing, there were no warning messages.  I mean, the whole purpose of this adapter is to use it with iPhone, so I'm sure DDhifi did a thorough testing.  But I will double check it.  I'm Android guy, and in our household only my oldest teen uses iPhone 

Regarding sound quality improvement, the only way to make such claim is relative to another similar adapter, don't know how else you would compare it since everything else will be apples to oranges, if you know what I mean.  TC28i and TC28i Pro are similar, didn't hear any difference.  And with or without power cable, I didn't hear any difference either.  Now, as I mentioned before, their TC09S usb-c to usb-c cable does improve the sound, can't explain why, but I tested it and hear wider soundstage with RU6 and relative to other cables.  That OTG cable is a beast, two separate conductors for power and data, fully isolated and with extra shielding of each.



I actually just posted a mini review covering that usb-c cable, lightning power adapter, and a few of their other accessories, tested with RU6.


----------



## hartphoto

twister6 said:


> I can double check with my daughter's iPhone 13, but with iPod Touch 7th gen I used for testing, there were no warning messages.  I mean, the whole purpose of this adapter is to use it with iPhone, so I'm sure DDhifi did a thorough testing.  But I will double check it.  I'm Android guy, and in our household only my oldest teen uses iPhone


I don't doubt the thorough testing, the ddhifi line looks like nice products, well though out/designed, just haven't run into a use case for me. The MFi standards can be researched, they've been out for quite awhile. A companies product can be lightning adapter compatible without the official Apple MFi process (although they probably shouldn't use that labeling, as Apple legal would be all over them).

I only bring it up as I've crossed an iPhone warranty situation with non MFi charging cables. We've been mostly iPhones since 2007, however I had a brief 4 year stint on Android. Currently playing w/Android 11 on an iBasso DX320. Android is a tweaker's delight if one wants.

By the way, love the reviews. The LCD-X 2021 review helped seal the deal for my purchase last month.


----------



## simpleworld (Jul 18, 2022)

The NOS mode on this DAC, what a unique feature.  But, it's use is frustratingly hindered by sample rate conversion in Windows and Android.

NOS implies that the DAC should get a bit-perfect signal in it's native sample rate.  A 44.1 track should reach the DAC as 44.1 in order for the true NOS sound to be heard.

For example, Amazon Music bit perfect output on Windows 10 requires one to _manually set the bit depth and sample rate in the Windows sound settings to match the format of what you are listening to_.  Amazon Music _does not automatically adjust the sample rate of the bitstream going to the DAC to match the source media, regardless of if it's in "exclusive" mode or not._  I typically run windows audio at 24bit 384khz on my desktop DAC and thus, all media played by Amazon Music gets upsampled by windows to 384khz.  You can only get bit perfect output (confirmed by the correct sample rate display on the RU6) by _manually matching the windows sound settings sample rate to the sample rate and bit depth of track being played_ in Amazon Music (this is very inconvenient).
*I think this is very important since the NOS mode on the RU6 should be fed a non-upsampled signal to truly shine. 
What's the point of using NOS if the media is all being upsampled before it hits the DAC?*

What about Android?  Well, with Android 12 on my Pixel 6 Pro, everything gets upsampled.  I tried Amazon Music as well as Qobuz.  Android SRC takes over.

The ONLY way I've found to get bit perfect out of android is by using USB Audio Player Pro and logging into Qobuz that way.  This method sends the correct bit depth and sample rate media to the DAC without any android SRC.  As I switch through tracks, the RU6 display changes according to the native sample rate of the track.

How is everyone handling this?  Why can't the Amazon Music or Qobuz Android app adjust sample rate to match the track being played?

Edit: the Qobuz windows app works perfectly.  I just set the output device to "Cayin RU6 wasapi exclusive" mode and Qobuz sends a bit perfect stream to the DAC.

Edit 2: Just read a post where Andy covered these limitations on page 147 of this thread.


----------



## peterinvan

simpleworld said:


> *I think this is very important since the NOS mode on the RU6 should be fed a non-upsampled signal to truly shine.
> What's the point of using NOS if the media is all being upsampled before it hits the DAC?*
> 
> What about Android?  Well, with Android 12 on my Pixel 6 Pro, everything gets upsampled.  I tried Amazon Music as well as Qobuz.  Android SRC takes over.
> ...


*Tidal with RU6*
I am using my Windows 11 to feed the RU6 in NOS.  In Tidal, I set it to "Use Exclusive Mode".   "Master" tracks show 88.2KHz.   

I am not sure that this indicates bit perfect feed from the Windows Tidal app.


----------



## simpleworld

peterinvan said:


> *Tidal with RU6*
> I am using my Windows 11 to feed the RU6 in NOS.  In Tidal, I set it to "Use Exclusive Mode".   "Master" tracks show 88.2KHz.
> 
> I am not sure that this indicates bit perfect feed from the Windows Tidal app.


What does the RU6 screen show when you play a regular non-MQA track in Tidal?

I do believe that tidal does bypass all the windows APO's and SRC.


----------



## ExTubeGamer

Would it be really worth it to replace my Topping D10s desktop DAC with a RU6? My experience with dongle DACs so far was that these dongles cannot compete in sound stage with a desktop DAC.


----------



## peterinvan

simpleworld said:


> What does the RU6 screen show when you play a regular non-MQA track in Tidal?
> 
> I do believe that tidal does bypass all the windows APO's and SRC.


Windows 11, Tidal, Master Streaming Quality, Use Exclusive Mode >  RU6 (NOS):

*HiFi* shows 44.1Khz
*Master* shows 96Khz e.g. Wilco, _Cruel County_ (or 88.2Khz on some tracks, e.g. Billie Eilish _TV_))


----------



## eins2dreivier

Would the RU6 or the M15 be a better companion to the Meze Elite? Where I live there's no chance to listen to either device before purchase.


----------



## Ichos

eins2dreivier said:


> Would the RU6 or the M15 be a better companion to the Meze Elite? Where I live there's no chance to listen to either device before purchase.


I don't think that any of these - excellent by any other means - dongles can do justice to the Elite.


----------



## eins2dreivier

Ichos said:


> I don't think that any of these - excellent by any other means - dongles can do justice to the Elite.


I'm aware of that. But my listening time away from the desktop is so limited that I can't justify spending more than 200-300 bucks on a portable solution. Both dongles should me way better than the one I got with my Pixel 2...


----------



## Ichos

eins2dreivier said:


> I'm aware of that. But my listening time away from the desktop is so limited that I can't justify spending more than 200-300 bucks on a portable solution. Both dongles should me way better than the one I got with my Pixel 2...


Definitely better!
Well, both sound great, the M15 a little more technical and the RU-6 a little more analogue.
I would also add to your list the iFi Go bar which I think is the more powerful.


----------



## sahmen

Ichos said:


> Definitely better!
> Well, both sound great, the M15 a little more technical and the RU-6 a little more analogue.
> I would also add to your list the iFi Go bar which I think is the more powerful.


Speaking of the IFi Go Bar (Anniversary Gold plated edition), do you think it is worth getting if one already has the RU6? I nearly bought one yesterday when they became available again at a dealer I know, although I could not make up my mind. Does the GoLD Bar bring enough performance difference (from the RU6) to justify adding it to my collection of dongles? To complicate matters even further, I also have the Ifi Micro idsd Signature edition, which is transportable, rather than portable as the GoLD Bar dongle is, but still...

Although I found the Gold bar attractive for its looks and its potential use case as a dongle, I was not sure whether it was bringing enough "new performance" capabilities as a dongle to justify its cost in my case, but I would like to know your opinion about this.


----------



## Ichos

sahmen said:


> Speaking of the IFi Go Bar (Anniversary Gold plated edition), do you think it is worth getting if one already has the RU6? I nearly bought one yesterday when they became available again at a dealer I know, although I could not make up my mind. Does the GoLD Bar bring enough performance difference (from the RU6) to justify adding it to my collection of dongles? To complicate matters even further, I also have the Ifi Micro idsd Signature edition, which is transportable, rather than portable as the GoLD Bar dongle is, but still...
> 
> Although I found the Gold bar attractive for its looks and its potential use case as a dongle, I was not sure whether it was bringing enough "new performance" capabilities as a dongle to justify its cost in my case, but I would like to know your opinion about this.


As you probably already know this is a difficult answer that cannot be based in strictly "objective" criteria but it lies in the realm of subjectiveness.
The answer should be "NO" when judged considering actual performance against the gear you already own.
The transportable device is better and the RU-6 is as competent although slightly different.
But then, if you ask the devil's advice then he would say "YES" because the Gold bar is so good sounding that is worth having even if you own the best gear.
I almost bought one myself but a sudden refrigerator failure has defeated the Devil 👿!


----------



## sahmen (Jul 26, 2022)

Ichos said:


> As you probably already know this is a difficult answer that cannot be based in strictly "objective" criteria but it lies in the realm of subjectiveness.
> The answer should be "NO" when judged considering actual performance against the gear you already own.
> The transportable device is better and the RU-6 is as competent although slightly different.
> But then, if you ask the devil's advice then he would say "YES" because the Gold bar is so good sounding that is worth having even if you own the best gear.
> I almost bought one myself but a sudden refrigerator failure has defeated the Devil 👿!


That's a terrific two pronged (or two-horned) answer, with the additional burden of a devil to defeat... I am totally inspired! Thanks


----------



## peterinvan (Jul 29, 2022)

*RU6 overheating with Grados???*

I am using RU6 NOS, High Gain,  29db volume in all these use cases...

iPad Pro > Tidal > RU6 4.4mm balanced > Focal Elegia  (Fluke meter 31.2 ohms)
With the Focals the RU6 just gets a bit warm.

iPad Pro > Tidal > RU6 4.4mm balanced > Grado SR325is  (Fluke meter 34.2 ohms).  Grados modified to use Meze 4.4mm balanced "silver" cable (1 ohm).
With the Grados the RU6 gets hot within 5 minutes.  I can hold it in my hand, but it's pretty hot.

I also notice that on my desktop PC > RU6 > Grados, playing the same album in HiFi (from Foobar2000) and Tidal Master:
44.1Mhz, RU6 gets warm.
88.2 Mhz RU6 gets hot.

With the Focals it's just a little bit warmer playing the "Master" version.

Anyone else notice this?
Would +4 ohms draw that much more power?
Does it take more power to process 88.2 Mhz?

Any ideas?

Thanks


----------



## oldkid

peterinvan said:


> *RU6 overheating with Grados???*
> 
> I am using RU6 NOS, High Gain,  29db volume in all these use cases...
> 
> ...


You might be onto something there. I use my RU6 everyday on the go. Sometimes, it gets really hot to the point I can't put it in my pocket. I'll try to see if it happens specifically when listening to MQA, even if there shouldn't be any MQA decoding happening with this DAC


----------



## justanut

oldkid said:


> You might be onto something there. I use my RU6 everyday on the go. Sometimes, it gets really hot to the point I can't put it in my pocket. I'll try to see if it happens specifically when listening to MQA, even if there shouldn't be any MQA decoding happening with this DAC


There isn't. Your transport device does the 1st unfold and passes it to RU6. Strange. Is it your device heating up and not RU6 though?


----------



## peterinvan (Jul 30, 2022)

peterinvan said:


> *RU6 overheating with Grados???*
> 
> I am using RU6 NOS, High Gain,  29db volume in all these use cases...
> 
> ...





oldkid said:


> You might be onto something there. I use my RU6 everyday on the go. Sometimes, it gets really hot to the point I can't put it in my pocket. I'll try to see if it happens specifically when listening to MQA, even if there shouldn't be any MQA decoding happening with this DAC


New test…
iPad > RU6 3.5mm > Oppo PM-3.   39db volume.  Tidal “HiFi”.  88.2 Mhz.  Does not even get warm.

Can anyone from Cayin step in and tell us what causes the RU6 to heat up, and more importantly at what temperature will the device be damaged??


----------



## gr8soundz

peterinvan said:


> New test…
> iPad > RU6 3.5mm > Oppo PM-3.   39db volume.  Tidal “HiFi”.  88.2 Mhz.  Does not even get warm.
> 
> Can anyone from Cayin step in and tell us what causes the RU6 to heat up, and more importantly at what temperature will the device be damaged??



Only used mine at home so far but I noticed my RU6 gets much hotter in oversampling mode.


----------



## animalsrush (Jul 30, 2022)

Ru6 NOS mode+ one plus 8T or iPad Pro 2020 + poweramp player ( flacbox  on iPad)+ 50 clicks volume driving either 64 audio Nio or Noble K10 using balanced or 3.5 mmTRRS. It gets quite warm ..

Same goes for moonriver 2 . But lotto s2 never got warm


----------



## Brain Damage

Well, I have just tested: PC>Audirvana>Qobuz>RU6>iFi Zen CAN>Beyerdynamic DT880 pros and wow, this synergy is really nice. Just proves the RU6 is really an amazing dongle dac with both headphones (including hard to drive cans) and IEMs.


----------



## peterinvan (Jul 31, 2022)

gr8soundz said:


> Only used mine at home so far but I noticed my RU6 gets much hotter in oversampling mode.


*What causes heating...*

I am not overly concerned about excessive heat causing any damage, but I am still trying to undersand the causes.  Further experiments with four different headphones.  PC > RU6 (NOS, High gain)...

Playing balanced vs single ended (4.4mm vs. 3.5mm).  RU6 gets slightly warmer playing from the balanced amps (4.4mm)

With Tidal, playing at 44.1 Khz it gets warm.  E.g. Allison Krauss, _Forget About It._
Playing a "Master" track at 96khz, it gets much warmer.  E.g. Allison Krauss _Windy City_.  With this album the Grado SR325is balanced out is the hottest.

So, balanced out and high sampling rates ==> RU6 runs hotter.

@gr8soundz reports heating when in OS mode.


Anyone else been able to pinpoint the cause(s) of heating?


----------



## gr8soundz

peterinvan said:


> *What causes heating...*
> 
> I am not overly concerned about excessive heat causing any damage, but I am still trying to undersand the causes.  Further experiments with four different headphones.  PC > RU6 (NOS, High gain)...
> 
> ...



I'm usually in Low Gain mode, NOS, average volume around 80, using balanced out and mine still runs fairly cool (even with the case on). Have a number of hi-res albums but most of my collection is 16/44 so I'll let others chime in about running at High Gain with hi-res via balanced.

However, can't overlook the fact of just how much Cayin packed into this little guy. The RU6 has 2 double-sided PCBs inside, giving it roughly 2-4x more components than other (non-discrete) dongles so its bound to run warmer.

Recently found this teardown of the RU6 which shows it better:
http://audiotop.net/newsinfo/2524361.html


----------



## peterinvan (Aug 1, 2022)

peterinvan said:


> *What causes heating...*
> 
> I am not overly concerned about excessive heat causing any damage, but I am still trying to undersand the causes.  Further experiments with four different headphones.  PC > RU6 (NOS, High gain)...
> 
> ...


Now more confused than ever…. Today my Grado SR325 (balanced) listening to the same 96 Khz album, out of my iPad pro…. No heating at all… room temp.  Same with 88.2 Khz tracks.
💁


----------



## Andykong

peterinvan said:


> *RU6 overheating with Grados???*
> 
> I am using RU6 NOS, High Gain,  29db volume in all these use cases...
> 
> ...





peterinvan said:


> New test…
> iPad > RU6 3.5mm > Oppo PM-3.   39db volume.  Tidal “HiFi”.  88.2 Mhz.  Does not even get warm.
> 
> Can anyone from Cayin step in and tell us what causes the RU6 to heat up, and more importantly at what temperature will the device be damaged??





peterinvan said:


> *What causes heating...*
> 
> I am not overly concerned about excessive heat causing any damage, but I am still trying to undersand the causes.  Further experiments with four different headphones.  PC > RU6 (NOS, High gain)...
> 
> ...





peterinvan said:


> Now more confused than ever…. Today my Grado SR325 (balanced) listening to the same 96 Khz album, out of my iPad pro…. No heating at all… room temp.  Same with 88.2 Khz tracks.
> 💁



First of all, there is no need to worry that RU6 will be damaged by heat basic on your description.  The thin film resistors are good for 100°C or above, and other electronics and semiconductors are good for 80°C or above.  If you can hold it in my hand, the device probably is around 45°C, well within the operation margin of RU6.

I tested my RU6 with the following setting: Samsung A71 > HiBy Music Player at Exclusive mode, 24Bit/96kHz local music file > RU6 (NOS, High gain, Vol=70).  I  used Gardo RS1 from the single-ended 3.5mm phone out of RU6.

I didn't find it warmer than my regular RU6 usage.   I can't test the 4.4.mm phone out because I didn't mod my Gardo, so I can't call this a replicate of your setup.  At this stage, we can't explain the "excessive" heat problem until we can replicate a particular scenario when the RU6 suddenly heated up as you described.




t


----------



## peterinvan

Andykong said:


> First of all, there is no need to worry that RU6 will be damaged by heat basic on your description.  The thin film resistors are good for 100°C or above, and other electronics and semiconductors are good for 80°C or above.  If you can hold it in my hand, the device probably is around 45°C, well within the operation margin of RU6.
> 
> I tested my RU6 with the following setting: Samsung A71 > HiBy Music Player at Exclusive mode, 24Bit/96kHz local music file > RU6 (NOS, High gain, Vol=70).  I  used Gardo RS1 from the single-ended 3.5mm phone out of RU6.
> 
> ...


Thanks for taking the time to run your test.  I will report back if I run into another use case that causes the RU6 to heat up.

It is good to know the device can run hot without damage.


----------



## hartphoto

Just added a 3' Apple Lightning to USB-C OTG cable to the setup. Really like having my iDevice on a stand or on my lap, which with the Cayin purchased cable...puts the RU6 either in the way or has it hanging oddly off to the side when in landscape viewing/listening mode (adding unnecessary strain/pressure on the lightning connector in general).

Movies/soundtracks are also awesome with the Cayin RU6!


----------



## bnupy

I want sequel


----------



## peterinvan (Aug 11, 2022)

peterinvan said:


> Thanks for taking the time to run your test.  I will report back if I run into another use case that causes the RU6 to heat up.
> 
> It is good to know the device can run hot without damage.


*RU6 HEATING UP - USE CASE*

I found a strange use case that really heats up the RU6....

Testing two pairs of Grados (SR325is and SR325x).  One with 3.5mm cable, and one with 4.4mm balanced cable.
Constantly switching the head phones caused the RU6 to really heat up.

Now I unplug the RU6 from my USB source before switching headphones.  The RU6 is slightly warm, no problem.

*EDIT*:  note that the same use case causes my *Fiio M11 Pro* to really overheat as well.


----------



## wolfstar76

How do you guys compare dongles? Currently I am using PC->RU6 (low gain, NOS) vs PAW S1 (low gain) -> Z1R. I tried EDM, male and female vocal, very briefly but I just cannot find any difference.


----------



## peterinvan

wolfstar76 said:


> How do you guys compare dongles? Currently I am using PC->RU6 (low gain, NOS) vs PAW S1 (low gain) -> Z1R. I tried EDM, male and female vocal, very briefly but I just cannot find any difference.


You may try my test playlist.  It has a wide variety of genres.

https://tidal.com/browse/playlist/fa6622ac-b9ca-4482-97a4-24e6480b4449


----------



## bnupy

Had the screen come off recently. Possibly the heat wave we’ve been experiencing. Idk. I might have to send this unit to musicteck if they are cool with it for a replacement.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

I will be getting home after a few months of touring and I have one of the RU6s waiting for me to give it a whirl. I'm stoked to see what this dongle has up its sleeve for sure!


----------



## wolfstar76

I have been using RU6 for a few days now and my intention is to get a "feel" of the musicality of R2R to help me make a choice between Hiby RS2 and iBasso DX170. 

Today I did a quick A/B test using RU6 as DAC to compare Schiit Modi3, other in the chain is PC -> RU6/Modi3 -> FA-10 -> HE6SE V2. RU6 is in NOS high-gain mode. An apparent difference is the low-end, bass is much more punchy with Modi3. This leads me to suspect that R2R based dongles or DAPs may have weakness in bass performance.


----------



## dakchi

wolfstar76 said:


> I have been using RU6 for a few days now and my intention is to get a "feel" of the musicality of R2R to help me make a choice between Hiby RS2 and iBasso DX170.
> 
> Today I did a quick A/B test using RU6 as DAC to compare Schiit Modi3, other in the chain is PC -> RU6/Modi3 -> FA-10 -> HE6SE V2. RU6 is in NOS high-gain mode. An apparent difference is the low-end, bass is much more punchy with Modi3. This leads me to suspect that R2R based dongles or DAPs may have weakness in bass performance.


Really!! I'm very surprized by your statement. RU6 has a lot of bass, sometimes I even find it too much. It is just not as fast as delta sigma DACs but in terms of quantity it is way enough


----------



## Johnfg465vd

dakchi said:


> Really!! I'm very surprized by your statement. RU6 has a lot of bass, sometimes I even find it too much. It is just not as fast as delta sigma DACs but in terms of quantity it is way enough


It depends on what you are pairing it with, on some of my gear, I notice quicker bass roll off and on others I don't.



wolfstar76 said:


> Today I did a quick A/B test using RU6 as DAC to compare Schiit Modi3, other in the chain is PC -> RU6/Modi3 -> FA-10 -> HE6SE V2. RU6 is in NOS high-gain mode. An apparent difference is the low-end, bass is much more punchy with Modi3


For me, the bigger change I noticed between RU6 and some of my other DS dongle DACs was in the mids. Mids on RU6 have good body and more organic tonality.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

So far I have only done maybe 45 minutes of listening with this setup: UAPP on my phone sending bit perfect 24bit from Qobuz into the RU6 with my AKG K812 Pros plugged into it. I have mostly been running the RU6 on the NOS setting and I am loving how natural and musical the midd are without picking up the fuzziness and blurred edges you often get with stacks or combos considered to be musical. The stepped volume control circuitry has been nice as well. I haven't had too much time for critical listening yet, but the RU6 is definitely a keeper. It offers me a nice 2nd option to my ultra clean/clinical ifi Gryphon.


----------



## dharmasteve

My RU6 needs about half a hour to warm up and get it's best sound and took a couple of weeks to burn in and produce Bass thump.


----------



## wolfstar76

dakchi said:


> Really!! I'm very surprized by your statement. RU6 has a lot of bass, sometimes I even find it too much. It is just not as fast as delta sigma DACs but in terms of quantity it is way enough


It's not the quantity, just feel a little soft compare to Modi3 (mine has the original AK chip).


----------



## wolfstar76

dharmasteve said:


> My RU6 needs about half a hour to warm up and get it's best sound and took a couple of weeks to burn in and produce Bass thump.


I indeed did not take that much time to warm up. Will try it later.


----------



## wolfstar76

Johnfg465vd said:


> It depends on what you are pairing it with, on some of my gear, I notice quicker bass roll off and on others I don't.
> 
> 
> For me, the bigger change I noticed between RU6 and some of my other DS dongle DACs was in the mids. Mids on RU6 have good body and more organic tonality.


Yes, the mids seems to be thicker.


----------



## fizzytao (Aug 14, 2022)

wolfstar76 said:


> I indeed did not take that much time to warm up. Will try it later.


For me, the warm up takes like 3 songs and then I will be ‘immersed’ into the music……It is that good.


----------



## autoexec

Can you use the RU6 as a line-out, DAC-only device to connect to other amps without double amping? I'm guessing you cant with the 4.4 since an op-amp is involved but how about the 3.5?


----------



## wolfstar76

autoexec said:


> Can you use the RU6 as a line-out, DAC-only device to connect to other amps without double amping? I'm guessing you cant with the 4.4 since an op-amp is involved but how about the 3.5?


I think so, at least I tried with the 3.5mm to RCA able to connect to my amp. However, in that regard, RU6 lost the battle to Schiit Modi3 in my very short comparison. Haven't got time to check if it is pure DAC mode or pre-amp.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

autoexec said:


> Can you use the RU6 as a line-out, DAC-only device to connect to other amps without double amping? I'm guessing you cant with the 4.4 since an op-amp is involved but how about the 3.5?



They RU6 doesn't have a line out and I will double check my manual, but I don't believe it has a bypass for the integrated amp either.

Are you just wanting to use it as an R-2R DAC option with a more powerful amp or something?


----------



## autoexec (Aug 23, 2022)

wolfstar76 said:


> I think so, at least I tried with the 3.5mm to RCA able to connect to my amp. However, in that regard, RU6 lost the battle to Schiit Modi3 in my very short comparison. Haven't got time to check if it is pure DAC mode or pre-amp.


Thanks.



JAnonymous5150 said:


> They RU6 doesn't have a line out and I will double check my manual, but I don't believe it has a bypass for the integrated amp either.
> 
> Are you just wanting to use it as an R-2R DAC option with a more powerful amp or something?


Yes, I want to use it with my THX 789 so power won't be an issue with a more power demanding HPs or even HPs that perform better with extra power available on tap.


It is obvious to me that there is no dedicated line-out port in the device even in the settings. But it got me curious since iiWi Reviews on youtube has mentioned that you can use it as a DAC and wamted to confirm on other users here. It's not that I don't trust the guy in fact, I love his videos. I just want to dig in more to the legitimacy of this "unofficial feature" if you will. Here's his reply when I asked about it in the comments:


----------



## Johnfg465vd

@autoexec like @JAnonymous5150 said, there is no Line-Out. You can try using the RU6 as a DAC and see how it plays in your system. I've read posts here mentioning good results when using some Tube Amps or Class-A Amps with RU6 but personally when I tried pairing it with A30 Pro (3.5 to RCA) I didn't like it, it sounded distored and less clean & dynamic, but YMMV.

If you feel like trying, something to keep in mind is, Cayin recommended 70-80 volume when pairing RU6 with an external Amp, according to them that's the sweet spot to get good dynamics and less distortion.


----------



## autoexec

Johnfg465vd said:


> @autoexec like @JAnonymous5150 said, there is no Line-Out. You can try using the RU6 as a DAC and see how it plays in your system. I've read posts here mentioning good results when using some Tube Amps or Class-A Amps with RU6 but personally when I tried pairing it with A30 Pro (3.5 to RCA) I didn't like it, it sounded distored and less clean & dynamic, but YMMV.
> 
> If you feel like trying, something to keep in mind is, Cayin recommended 70-80 volume when pairing RU6 with an external Amp, according to them that's the sweet spot to get good dynamics and less distortion.


That's very helpful, thanks a lot!


----------



## JAnonymous5150

autoexec said:


> That's very helpful, thanks a lot!



I checked the manual for you just to be sure and the RU6 doesn't have a bypass for the amplification circuit so if you still want to use an external amp for more power it will largely come down to whether or not you can find a level to set the RU6 at that plays well with your other amp (AKA doesn't cause too much noise/distortion). I didn't know Cayin recommended 70-80, but that's good info.

I would start with the RU6 set in that recommended zone and adjust from there as needed until you find the sweet spot for your amp. I have never done this with the RU6, but I have used an external amp with other combos and the sweet spot where they two play well together us often different from device to device. 

Just make sure you keep the volume really low when you plug in and turn up slowly so you don't blow your ears to hell by accidentally plugging in to a double amped signal that's louder than you anticipated lol! Also, if you change between different pairs of headphones it can be a good idea to turn down and start with low volume and slowly turn up for each new pair just to be safe.

Let us/me know how it works out if you don't mind.


----------



## Dan DRC

I have been using an RU6 with an iFi xCAN for about the last three weeks with the volume on the RU6 at 100 with excellent results. I would start with the Cayin recommended vol setting of 70 to 80 and see what works best for your system and go from there.  I am using the 3.5mm single ended output on the Cayin to the 3.5mm SE input on the xCAN with the headphones on the xCAN's 2.5mm balanced output. I did not feel I would get much benefit from using the 4.4mm balanced out on the Cayin as it is not a true balanced design.


----------



## tikue666

Has anyone experience a drop in USB audio connection when using the RU6 with a phone? I've noticed mine to lose connection every now and then, at first I thought it was a faulty cable issue but I tried wiggling the cable and the connectors and the connection was still perfect. It wasn't until I noticed that it drops connection whenever there's some other audio source that comes into play other than the music I am playing eg. a message notification or sometimes audio coming from a video when browsing facebook or instagram. I noticed that it just gets dropped and normally you see the sampling rate displayed on the dongle but when it drops, it's just a blank display.

Anyone having this issue? Or is there some settings that I need to do on my phone? I am using a Samsung A73 as source by the way.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

tikue666 said:


> Has anyone experience a drop in USB audio connection when using the RU6 with a phone? I've noticed mine to lose connection every now and then, at first I thought it was a faulty cable issue but I tried wiggling the cable and the connectors and the connection was still perfect. It wasn't until I noticed that it drops connection whenever there's some other audio source that comes into play other than the music I am playing eg. a message notification or sometimes audio coming from a video when browsing facebook or instagram. I noticed that it just gets dropped and normally you see the sampling rate displayed on the dongle but when it drops, it's just a blank display.
> 
> Anyone having this issue? Or is there some settings that I need to do on my phone? I am using a Samsung A73 as source by the way.



Have you set the music app you're using to ignore other apps requests for audio focus or audio ducking? It sounds like your app is allowing other apps to take over the audio focus and thus it's pausing the music being fed to the DAC. I could be wrong, bit this would be the first thing I would check because when I have a music app set to ignore audio focus or ducking requests it doesn't pause the music stream when another app attempts to make a sound.


----------



## tikue666

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Have you set the music app you're using to ignore other apps requests for audio focus or audio ducking? It sounds like your app is allowing other apps to take over the audio focus and thus it's pausing the music being fed to the DAC. I could be wrong, bit this would be the first thing I would check because when I have a music app set to ignore audio focus or ducking requests it doesn't pause the music stream when another app attempts to make a sound.


Thanks for the tip, I am using the Hiby Music App with USB exclusive mode so I guess its already set to ignore other audio source to take over but I'll try toggling it again. The weird thing is I do notice that this loss in connection happens also when in other scenarios like when I am watching something on youtube, it happens more often when it's a notification audio. To recover I would need to plug out the RU6 and plug it back in to resume connection. It does get kinda annoying when you need to do it one too many times.

I've also noticed that the music playback does pause for about a second or two whenever I am switching apps.


----------



## dakchi

tikue666 said:


> Thanks for the tip, I am using the Hiby Music App with USB exclusive mode so I guess its already set to ignore other audio source to take over but I'll try toggling it again. The weird thing is I do notice that this loss in connection happens also when in other scenarios like when I am watching something on youtube, it happens more often when it's a notification audio. To recover I would need to plug out the RU6 and plug it back in to resume connection. It does get kinda annoying when you need to do it one too many times.
> 
> I've also noticed that the music playback does pause for about a second or two whenever I am switching apps.


I exactly have the same behavior when playing from Tidal. I think it is a software issue but I don't know how to fix it, except by unplugging and replugging RU6


----------



## oldkid

tikue666 said:


> Has anyone experience a drop in USB audio connection when using the RU6 with a phone? I've noticed mine to lose connection every now and then, at first I thought it was a faulty cable issue but I tried wiggling the cable and the connectors and the connection was still perfect. It wasn't until I noticed that it drops connection whenever there's some other audio source that comes into play other than the music I am playing eg. a message notification or sometimes audio coming from a video when browsing facebook or instagram. I noticed that it just gets dropped and normally you see the sampling rate displayed on the dongle but when it drops, it's just a blank display.
> 
> Anyone having this issue? Or is there some settings that I need to do on my phone? I am using a Samsung A73 as source by the way.


It's likely to be a lack of RAM. Try to find the android setting to ignore battery optimization for your music player app. This should give the player more available RAM


----------



## tikue666

oldkid said:


> It's likely to be a lack of RAM. Try to find the android setting to ignore battery optimization for your music player app. This should give the player more available RAM


Thanks! Will try that.


----------



## animalsrush

tikue666 said:


> Thanks! Will try that.


I have same issue with Hi by app when using using USb priority access. When any new notifications arrive it stops playing music .I have to restart Hi by to get playing again. So now I keep it off


----------



## tikue666

animalsrush said:


> I have same issue with Hi by app when using using USb priority access. When any new notifications arrive it stops playing music .I have to restart Hi by to get playing again. So now I keep it off


By keeping it off, you mean turning USB exclusive/priority access mode off?


----------



## animalsrush (Aug 24, 2022)

tikue666 said:


> By keeping it off, you mean turning USB exclusive/priority access mode off?


Yes. I could hardly tell the difference between bit perfect and not so bit perfect


----------



## Dan DRC

Just wanted to add for this info incase someone was looking to try a similar setup. I have been using the Cayin RU6 with an Raspberry Pi 4 running  vitOS as a Roon endpoint without issues. Roon recognized the RU6 almost immediately upon connection of USB. I believe some users have reported noise issues when using the RU6 with an RPI(not sure of the software they are using) but I have not experienced that with my setup.


----------



## autoexec

animalsrush said:


> Yes. I could hardly tell the difference between bit perfect and not so bit perfect


I can quite tell bit perfect and resampled stuff especially non-multiples (i.e. 44.1kHz -> 48kHz which is most common in my case). The pause and sometimes losing focus happens to me in Neutron. nit with RU6 (mine's still in transit) but with my external DAC Topping E30. My solution for it is to just slient my phone (turn on silent mode) so it doesn't get distracted by notifications / videos playing in news feed (unless you toggle the audio on for those vids). Might work for those having the issue as well.


----------



## richoval

tikue666 said:


> Has anyone experience a drop in USB audio connection when using the RU6 with a phone? I've noticed mine to lose connection every now and then, at first I thought it was a faulty cable issue but I tried wiggling the cable and the connectors and the connection was still perfect. It wasn't until I noticed that it drops connection whenever there's some other audio source that comes into play other than the music I am playing eg. a message notification or sometimes audio coming from a video when browsing facebook or instagram. I noticed that it just gets dropped and normally you see the sampling rate displayed on the dongle but when it drops, it's just a blank display.
> 
> Anyone having this issue? Or is there some settings that I need to do on my phone? I am using a Samsung A73 as source by the way.



I have this issue as well, but until now i was convinced that it was a cable/usb-c port issue… tried a sturdier usb-c -> lightning cable and it was better for a while, now it started again. Totally annoying, especially since the dongle is great beside that issue!


----------



## JAnonymous5150

I'm primarily using UAPP with the RU6 and my phone and I haven't had this problem at all. Maybe you guys should try UAPP and see if it works as well for you as it has been working for me. I will see about trying the Hiby app to see if I have the problem when using it instead of UAPP.


----------



## tikue666

autoexec said:


> I can quite tell bit perfect and resampled stuff especially non-multiples (i.e. 44.1kHz -> 48kHz which is most common in my case). The pause and sometimes losing focus happens to me in Neutron. nit with RU6 (mine's still in transit) but with my external DAC Topping E30. My solution for it is to just slient my phone (turn on silent mode) so it doesn't get distracted by notifications / videos playing in news feed (unless you toggle the audio on for those vids). Might work for those having the issue as well.


Thanks! Turning phone to silent is a good workaround, I'll try and see if it solves the problem.



JAnonymous5150 said:


> I'm primarily using UAPP with the RU6 and my phone and I haven't had this problem at all. Maybe you guys should try UAPP and see if it works as well for you as it has been working for me. I will see about trying the Hiby app to see if I have the problem when using it instead of UAPP.


Do let us know how it goes, thanks!


----------



## JAnonymous5150

tikue666 said:


> Do let us know how it goes, thanks!



I did indeed have this same problem with when using the Hiby Music app, but only with apps like messages and calls when I didn't have "do not interrupt" engaged. When I set my phone up to not interrupt me with calls, messages, and notification sounds I no longer hand the problem. With UAPP I don't have this problem at all so I think it has something to do with the difference in how the to apps handle audio focus and audio ducking, but I could be wrong.


----------



## tikue666

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I did indeed have this same problem with when using the Hiby Music app, but only with apps like messages and calls when I didn't have "do not interrupt" engaged. When I set my phone up to not interrupt me with calls, messages, and notification sounds I no longer hand the problem. With UAPP I don't have this problem at all so I think it has something to do with the difference in how the to apps handle audio focus and audio ducking, but I could be wrong.


That's so weird, your symptoms seems the other way around with the exclusive mode OFF.


----------



## Brain Damage

Dan DRC said:


> I have been using an RU6 with an iFi xCAN for about the last three weeks with the volume on the RU6 at 100 with excellent results. I would start with the Cayin recommended vol setting of 70 to 80 and see what works best for your system and go from there.  I am using the 3.5mm single ended output on the Cayin to the 3.5mm SE input on the xCAN with the headphones on the xCAN's 2.5mm balanced output. I did not feel I would get much benefit from using the 4.4mm balanced out on the Cayin as it is not a true balanced design.


I have also been using this setup for the last month having purchased the xCAN too. I agree it is great. I purchased the iCAN so that I could drive my Beyer DT880s with a bit more juice. Great synergy 👍


----------



## Andykong

RU6 only supports 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced headphone output, there is no line out or pre-amp output from RU6, not even shared or pseudo line out is supported. If you connect RU6 to an external amplifier, you will double amping.  

To do that, and understand the reasons behind my suggestion, you need to know the NOISE PATTERN or RU6, so please read *THIS*.

Then please read my suggestion to set up your system for *double amping *with a dongle DAC that uses dedicated analog volume, such as RU6

Finally, please understand the reason behind the *volume setting* in RU6 double amping.

If you still want to proceed with double amping, I personally recommend 3.5mm single-ended output over 4.4mm balanced output, as discussed *HERE *and *HERE*.


Please be reminded that Cayin officially discourages using RU6 as DAC to external amplifiers because it doesn't have a line out, and the noise characteristic of R2R DAC is technically not ideal for "pseudo" line out applications, so these are my suggestion based on my personal experience,


----------



## autoexec

Andykong said:


> RU6 only supports 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced headphone output, there is no line out or pre-amp output from RU6, not even shared or pseudo line out is supported. If you connect RU6 to an external amplifier, you will double amping.
> 
> To do that, and understand the reasons behind my suggestion, you need to know the NOISE PATTERN or RU6, so please read *THIS*.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for a lot of very informative stuff! Can't wait for my RU6 to arrive


----------



## wolfstar76

Okay, that's explained why my setting ( RU6 -> Flux FA-10 sounds so inferior to Modi3 -> FA-10).


----------



## mekap

Andykong said:


> RU6 only supports 3.5mm single-ended and 4.4mm balanced headphone output, there is no line out or pre-amp output from RU6, not even shared or pseudo line out is supported. If you connect RU6 to an external amplifier, you will double amping.
> 
> To do that, and understand the reasons behind my suggestion, you need to know the NOISE PATTERN or RU6, so please read *THIS*.
> 
> ...


I connect my RU6 to the BURSON Soloist via a 3.5 jack to 2xRCA cable, while setting the volume on the RU6 to 100 and choosing NOS, and on the BURSON Soloist I set the volume comfortable for my ears and I do not hear any distortion, the sound is so good. like a real DAC R2R


----------



## JAnonymous5150

mekap said:


> I connect my RU6 to the BURSON Soloist via a 3.5 jack to 2xRCA cable, while setting the volume on the RU6 to 100 and choosing NOS, and on the BURSON Soloist I set the volume comfortable for my ears and I do not hear any distortion, the sound is so good. like a real DAC R2R



Is the RU6 not a real R-2R DAC? I was under the impression it was which is why I'm asking.

I'm probably being thick or failing to understand some technical delineation that makes the RU6 a pseudo R-2R DAC instead of a real one so don't be too brutal when explaining my stupidity to me, please.


----------



## DBaldock9

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Is the RU6 not a real R-2R DAC? I was under the impression it was which is why I'm asking.
> 
> I'm probably being thick or failing to understand some technical delineation that makes the RU6 a pseudo R-2R DAC instead of a real one so don't be too brutal when explaining my stupidity to me, please.



It's a true R-2R DAC, with selectable Over-Sampling or No Over-Sampling.
It doesn't have a true Line Out, so @Andykong has recommended setting the output level to 70-80 to start with, to get a pseudo Line Level voltage, to drive the input of of a connected amplifier.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

DBaldock9 said:


> It's a true R-2R DAC, with selectable Over-Sampling or No Over-Sampling.
> It doesn't have a true Line Out, so @Andykong has recommended setting the output level to 70-80 to start with, to get a pseudo Line Level voltage, to drive the input of of a connected amplifier.



That's what I thought. If you read the post I replied to the poster says "like a real R2R DAC" so I figured I must be missing something. I like mine a lot so it wouldn't have changed that for me, but for a second I felt a bit stupid lol! Thanks for setting the universe right again.


----------



## mekap (Aug 28, 2022)

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Is the RU6 not a real R-2R DAC? I was under the impression it was which is why I'm asking.
> 
> I'm probably being thick or failing to understand some technical delineation that makes the RU6 a pseudo R-2R DAC instead of a real one so don't be too brutal when explaining my stupidity to me, please.


maybe I wanted to say like a real stationary DAC R2R))


----------



## Vignelli

hi guys, currently i am waiting for my yuin pk1 just for nostalgia thing
do you guys think ru6 enough to feed pk1's 150 ohm power hungry

or it will become underpower


----------



## JAnonymous5150

mekap said:


> maybe I wanted to say like a real stationary DAC R2R))



No worries. I was just making sure I understood the product I owned like I thought I did. That's all.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Vignelli said:


> hi guys, currently i am waiting for my yuin pk1 just for nostalgia thing
> do you guys think ru6 enough to feed pk1's 150 ohm power hungry
> 
> or it will become underpower



I have used the RU6 with my 160ohm Ucotech ES-P1s (100db/mW sensitivity) and 150ohm HE 150Pros (103db/mW sensitivity) and it does an admirable job. Your PK1s are more sensitive (109db/mw according to Penon Audio) than either of them so I think the RU6 will drive them quite well.


----------



## bnupy

bnupy said:


> Had the screen come off recently. Possibly the heat wave we’ve been experiencing. Idk. I might have to send this unit to musicteck if they are cool with it for a replacement.


I'm surprised my comment some weeks back got overlooked in the myriad of celebrating this tech. I get it a lot of you like this device, after pages and pages. but this is a serious problem and could happen to you after months.


----------



## mekap

bnupy said:


> I'm surprised my comment some weeks back got overlooked in the myriad of celebrating this tech. I get it a lot of you like this device, after pages and pages. but this is a serious problem and could happen to you after months.


If the RU6 itself works, then the fact that the screen has peeled off is not a big problem, you can fix it at the service center where smartphones are repaired, they will glue this protective glass of the screen.


----------



## autoexec (Sep 2, 2022)

Mine arrived yesterday and just a few minutes of listening and boy was it a bliss to listen with. This is my first experience with an R2R DAC but I have a pretty good idea of highly resolving sources as I've tried various gears that are plain underwhelming to my ears regardless of price which I won't name here.

For me this dongle is not warm by any means. It has a very realistic note definition which makes them weightier than a typical DAC hence the impression that it is leaning on the warm side. The sound to me is very open. Spatial information is very good given the spherical stage. There is a lot of information with each instrument and nothing sounded forced. I was really expecting a warmer and less resolving sound presentation but this device is very clean sounding and didn't lack any resolution to my ears. It pairs very with well with my HD 560S. I prefer NOS like 99% of the time but use OS from time to time with my ER2SE. What a great product.


----------



## Brain Damage

Vignelli said:


> hi guys, currently i am waiting for my yuin pk1 just for nostalgia thing
> do you guys think ru6 enough to feed pk1's 150 ohm power hungry
> 
> or it will become underpower


The RU6 can power my beyers (770 pro & 880 pro) which both have an impedance of 250Ω. With this in mind, and considering the RU6 lends itself better to IEMs, the RU6 will be absolutely fine with 150Ω loads. I just personally find that when paired with an external headphone amp like the ifiCAN, this better drives my beyers with better dynamic range and punch. I only use an external amp with the RU6 when I want to listen to these harder to drive cans otherwise it's completely unnecessary. However, if doing this be careful to bear in mind the advice given by @Andykong in terms of volume on RU6 in conjunction with volume knob on amplifier. If you get it right, there is no distortion or unwanted background noise. Enjoy your music through the RU6 👍🎧 🎶.


----------



## autoexec

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Let us/me know how it works out if you don't mind.


To be able to match the same volume of my Topping E30 (2.1Vrms) line level with my RU6, I had to use the max volume (100) of HIGH gain. To be honest I couldn't hear any clipping at all but I feel there's quite some distortion but I'm not 100% sure and it could be my mind playing with me. For peace of mind  I followed AndyKong's suggestion and used volume 83 in LOW gain. Regarding SQ, it doesn't sounded like the typical double amping as it's still very good maybe because my amp is very clean(?) which is THX 789. But, RU6 seem to drive all my headphones pretty well as is, so unless I'm listening to speakers, I plug my headphones directly to it. It drives my Sundara pretty darn good and loud at LOW gain volume 66 balanced. Nothing felt underpowered and I actually feel I'm connected to a very capable desktop amp. Unlike when driving it directly with my DAP (FiiO M11+ ESS), I feel that underpowered vibes (slightly laid back mids and lack of character and definition) and I'm sure it's not the DAC in my DAP because if I use it as lineout to my amp everything sounds superb with the same HP. The takeaway is RU6 is a pretty powerful device.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

autoexec said:


> To be able to match the same volume of my Topping E30 (2.1Vrms) line level with my RU6, I had to use the max volume (100) of HIGH gain. To be honest I couldn't hear any clipping at all but I feel there's quite some distortion but I'm not 100% sure and it could be my mind playing with me. For peace of mind  I followed AndyKong's suggestion and used volume 83 in LOW gain. Regarding SQ, it doesn't sounded like the typical double amping as it's still very good maybe because my amp is very clean(?) which is THX 789. But, RU6 seem to drive all my headphones pretty well as is, so unless I'm listening to speakers, I plug my headphones directly to it. It drives my Sundara pretty darn good and loud at LOW gain volume 66 balanced. Nothing felt underpowered and I actually feel I'm connected to a very capable desktop amp. Unlike when driving it directly with my DAP (FiiO M11+ ESS), I feel that underpowered vibes (slightly laid back mids and lack of character and definition) and I'm sure it's not the DAC in my DAP because if I use it as lineout to my amp everything sounds superb with the same HP. The takeaway is RU6 is a pretty powerful device.



Thanks for the rundown! I haven't tried it myself yet, but I might at some point in the future so this is good info to have. The RU6 has proven itself to be a very capable dongle for sure. It handles most headphones I have thrown at it and it offers a nice wamer, more analog-esque sound sig for use on the go when compared to my ultra clean ifi Gryphon. I couldn't be happier with it.

Re the power issue on the M11: I have only ever tried the AKM based version and not the new ESS based plus model, but assuming they have the same output power specs I'm not surprised at the issue driving your Sundaras. When I demoed the M11 while looking for DAPs, it struggled a bit with my K702s. I wasn't completely surprised since the K702s are a moderately difficult pair to drive, but given the output specs I had hoped that the M11 would be able to handle it. The volume was there, but the bass was lifeless and their was a noticeable loss in soundstage width and micro detailing. It made me wonder if perhaps Fiio is reporting specs that the M11 have trouble reaching in reality since I have tried other DAPs and DAC/Amp combos with similar output power that were able to handle the demands of the K702s much better. The ES9068 is a perfectly capable chip so I think you're right about that not being the issue.

Thanks again for reporting back on your experience!


----------



## autoexec

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Thanks for the rundown! I haven't tried it myself yet, but I might at some point in the future so this is good info to have. The RU6 has proven itself to be a very capable dongle for sure. It handles most headphones I have thrown at it and it offers a nice wamer, more analog-esque sound sig for use on the go when compared to my ultra clean ifi Gryphon. I couldn't be happier with it.
> 
> Re the power issue on the M11: I have only ever tried the AKM based version and not the new ESS based plus model, but assuming they have the same output power specs I'm not surprised at the issue driving your Sundaras. When I demoed the M11 while looking for DAPs, it struggled a bit with my K702s. I wasn't completely surprised since the K702s are a moderately difficult pair to drive, but given the output specs I had hoped that the M11 would be able to handle it. The volume was there, but the bass was lifeless and their was a noticeable loss in soundstage width and micro detailing. It made me wonder if perhaps Fiio is reporting specs that the M11 have trouble reaching in reality since I have tried other DAPs and DAC/Amp combos with similar output power that were able to handle the demands of the K702s much better. The ES9068 is a perfectly capable chip so I think you're right about that not being the issue.
> 
> Thanks again for reporting back on your experience!


Thanks for sharing your insights as well!

Another thing I've experienced that I wanted to share is that my RU6 performs noticeably worse from a PC source (Dell Inspiron laptop running win10) compared to my android sources (Galaxy S10 / FiiO DAP). The sound is underwhelmingly soft and seems to lack background blackness. It's like listening to a 192kbps mp3 is how I would describe it. The vibrance and important nuances were gone. I've already installed the driver and tried WASAPI besides ASIO. I did not try using other usb ports but what I've tried is hook up the RU6 with my ifi USB iPurifier 3. That instantly solved the problem. I think it is now even slightly better than my Android sources. I've never heard such improvement from the iPurifier with my Topping E30 (I even thought it's snake oil lol) but I'm guessing that DAC has better noise handling protocols than a tiny device like the RU6 which can explain why I don't hear any sound improvement with it before. I'm happy with this setup that I decided to use it even with an Android source. This way I won't prematurely wear out the stock cable and I can use any cable I want. It slightly increased the battery consumption tho and that iPurifier runs quite hot.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

autoexec said:


> Thanks for sharing your insights as well!
> 
> Another thing I've experienced that I wanted to share is that my RU6 performs noticeably worse from a PC source (Dell Inspiron laptop running win10) compared to my android sources (Galaxy S10 / FiiO DAP). The sound is underwhelmingly soft and seems to lack background blackness. It's like listening to a 192kbps mp3 is how I would describe it. The vibrance and important nuances were gone. I've already installed the driver and tried WASAPI besides ASIO. I did not try using other usb ports but what I've tried is hook up the RU6 with my ifi USB iPurifier 3. That instantly solved the problem. I think it is now even slightly better than my Android sources. I've never heard such improvement from the iPurifier with my Topping E30 (I even thought it's snake oil lol) but I'm guessing that DAC has better noise handling protocols than a tiny device like the RU6 which can explain why I don't hear any sound improvement with it before. I'm happy with this setup that I decided to use it even with an Android source. This way I won't prematurely wear out the stock cable and I can use any cable I want. It slightly increased the battery consumption tho and that iPurifier runs quite hot.



I wonder what the cause is for the performance problems with the computer set up. I'm no tech guru, but my RU6 works great with my laptop.


----------



## wolfstar76

I can assure that my RU6's performance connected to my PC desktop is way, way above that from my Samsung S20 ultra.


----------



## wolfstar76

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I wonder what the cause is for the performance problems with the computer set up. I'm no tech guru, but my RU6 works great with my laptop.


What's your setup? RU6 as DAC connected to ifi dongle as amp? though we already learned that RU6 don't have the capacity to act as DAC mode, only result in double amping


----------



## JAnonymous5150

wolfstar76 said:


> What's your setup? RU6 as DAC connected to ifi dongle as amp? though we already learned that RU6 don't have the capacity to act as DAC mode, only result in double amping



No i only use it as a dac/amp by itself. I'm not the person having problems. The guy i replied to was


----------



## autoexec

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I wonder what the cause is for the performance problems with the computer set up. I'm no tech guru, but my RU6 works great with my laptop.


Most likely electrical noise from the laptop. I'm using SE in that scenario and not sure if using balanced will lessen the issue. And it might be that particular USB C port that's very noisy as I haven't tried the other USB A ports.



wolfstar76 said:


> What's your setup? RU6 as DAC connected to ifi dongle as amp? though we already learned that RU6 don't have the capacity to act as DAC mode, only result in double amping


That ifi is not a dongle nor an amp. It's a USB purifier designed to reject common USB noise. To answer your question:
Source -> Purifier -> RU6 -> Headphone


----------



## Dan DRC (Sep 9, 2022)

Dan DRC said:


> I have been using an RU6 with an iFi xCAN for about the last three weeks with the volume on the RU6 at 100 with excellent results. I would start with the Cayin recommended vol setting of 70 to 80 and see what works best for your system and go from there.  I am using the 3.5mm single ended output on the Cayin to the 3.5mm SE input on the xCAN with the headphones on the xCAN's 2.5mm balanced output. I did not feel I would get much benefit from using the 4.4mm balanced out on the Cayin as it is not a true balanced design.


I now have settled in to using the RU6 at low gain with volume at 85 connected to the xCAN. This is a great DAC, mainly in NOS mode but from time to time I have found the OS to work well on some recordings. In NOS mode it just has this kind of thing going for it that you can't quite put your finger on. I know the terms musical and organic are overused in describing sound but yeah whatever it is the RU6 has it. This is the 5th DAC I have owned since 1994  and I am enjoying the RU6 the most.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Dan DRC said:


> In NOS mode it just has this kind of thing going for it that you can't quite put your finger on. I know the terms musical and organic are overused in describing sound but yeah whatever it is the RU6 has it. This is the 5th DAC I have owned since 1994  and I am enjoying the RU6 the most.



Musical and organic are definitely overused, but in this situation those terms certainly seem like valid descriptors to me. The RU6 has a euphonic quality that I have also described as a certain musicality to it's presentation. I guess there's a reason those terms became popularized lol!

Thanks for the info on settings. I still haven't gotten around to trying my RU6 driven by a different amp, but I plan on trying it at some point.


----------



## toni2068

JAnonymous5150 said:


> The RU6 has a euphonic quality that I have also described as a certain musicality to it's presentation. I guess there's a reason those terms became popularized lol!


Yeah, they should have sent a poet.


----------



## Majid Mute

hi guys
I received ru6 today 
I have the ddHiFi MFi06S and MFi09S otg cable and use it to connect my RU6 to my iPhone 13Pro Max. 
It sounds good! 
I will say I do run into clipping at higher volumes (over 50 volume on low gain and high gain)
my iem monarch mkii
How do I fix my problem?


----------



## yaps66

Majid Mute said:


> hi guys
> I received ru6 today
> I have the ddHiFi MFi06S and MFi09S otg cable and use it to connect my RU6 to my iPhone 13Pro Max.
> It sounds good!
> ...


Congratulations!


----------



## twister6

Majid Mute said:


> hi guys
> I received ru6 today
> I have the ddHiFi MFi06S and MFi09S otg cable and use it to connect my RU6 to my iPhone 13Pro Max.
> It sounds good!
> ...



I don't use iPhone, but curious if your 13 Pro is at max volume? Are you playing local files or streaming? Try to maximize the volume of your source.


----------



## Majid Mute

twister6 said:


> I don't use iPhone, but curious if your 13 Pro is at max volume? Are you playing local files or streaming? Try to maximize the volume of your source.


play in apple music app.
and volume in iphone not work after conect ru6.


----------



## dakchi

Majid Mute said:


> hi guys
> I received ru6 today
> I have the ddHiFi MFi06S and MFi09S otg cable and use it to connect my RU6 to my iPhone 13Pro Max.
> It sounds good!
> ...


I have ordered this: https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html
It is supposed to overcome iPhone power restriction. I will test when I receive it


----------



## twister6

dakchi said:


> I have ordered this: https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html
> It is supposed to overcome iPhone power restriction. I will test when I receive it



Yes, this one definitely helps as well. I covered it here in a short overview.


----------



## peterinvan (Sep 9, 2022)

Majid Mute said:


> hi guys
> I received ru6 today
> I have the ddHiFi MFi06S and MFi09S otg cable and use it to connect my RU6 to my iPhone 13Pro Max.
> It sounds good!
> ...


I assume you have ruled out poorly recorded tracks?  Many have been recorded with over the top volumes.

I drive my RU6 out of an iPad Pro, and heve never experienced clipping.  I use high gain and on all my phones, I seldom go above 35 volume before I fear hearing damage.

The volume on the iPad is just above minimum as it does not effect the RU6 volume.


----------



## Majid Mute

peterinvan said:


> I assume you have ruled out poorly recorded tracks?  Many have been recorded with over the top volumes.
> 
> I drive my RU6 out of an iPad Pro, and heve never experienced clipping.  I use high gain and on all my phones, I seldom go above 35 volume before I fear hearing damage.
> 
> The volume on the iPad is just above minimum as it does not effect the RU6 volume.


ipad pro type c
ru6 with all type c conector ok
iphone 13 pro max lightning conector


----------



## Andykong

Mid-Autumn Festival is held on the full moon of the 8th month of the lunar calendar.  In Chinese Culture, roundness symbolizes completeness and togetherness, therefore, the Mid-Autumn Festival is a time for friends and family to come together and appreciate the union and completeness of our life.  This might be a small wish that we take for granted in the past, but COVID has taught us to treasure every moment of gathering and reunion, and we wish all our users and friend a Happy Mid-Autumn Festival.

I want to share a personal plan with all my partners and friends in HeadFi forum.  I'll take a long break later this month, and this will probably last till the end of 2022.  I'll stay out of the radar completely and will resurface when I feel confident that I am fit to handle my job again. @Cayin will take over my role for Cayin audio and I'll hand over my ongoing activities and responsibilities to them gradually next week.   So if you need to PM me on a Cayin-related issue, please include or address your problem to @Cayin.  I really enjoy my time with the HeadFi forum and am looking forward to meeting with you again after my long vacation.


----------



## Andykong

peterinvan said:


> I assume you have ruled out poorly recorded tracks?  Many have been recorded with over the top volumes.
> 
> I drive my RU6 out of an iPad Pro, and heve never experienced clipping.  I use high gain and on all my phones, I seldom go above 35 volume before I fear hearing damage.
> 
> The volume on the iPad is just above minimum as it does not effect the RU6 volume.





Majid Mute said:


> ipad pro type c
> ru6 with all type c conector ok
> iphone 13 pro max lightning conector



While both iPhone and iPad Pro are iOS devices, they behave very differently when connect to an external Dongle DAC. The iPhone has restricted power output from its lightning port. and fellow friends and users have agreed that, via different tests, the legit output from iPhone is as low as 120mAm, which explains why the connected Dongle DAC will fail to work properly when you turn up the volume past a certain level: your headphone and Dongle DAC has drawn too much power as per your iPhone and they wae shutting it down.  For the record, the power drain is headphone-related.  Some users didn't experience power restrictions from iPhones when they are using a pair of high-sensitivity IEMs. others are having trouble at volume 70 or 75, but if your using full-size headphones with RU6, the power restriction issue will kick in earlier.  So if you have checked your connection as Alex Twister has suggested below and eliminated the possibility of connection and setup problems, then we are more or less certain that it is the power restriction of the iPhone that causing your problem and there is nothing we can do at RU6 to remedy the situation.  Well, theoretically we can lower the output of Ru6 so that it won't trigger the power restriction of iPhone, but if we do that, it probably won't drive your headphone satisfactorily even at volume 100, so that is not a meaningful solution.



twister6 said:


> I don't use iPhone, but curious if your 13 Pro is at max volume? Are you playing local files or streaming? Try to maximize the volume of your source.


----------



## discord

Selling an RU6 with lightning adapter if anyone is interested:

https://www.head-fi.org/classifieds/cayin-ru6.32657/


----------



## Brain Damage

I can't think of a pair of IEMs that don't match well with the RU6. Obviously I don't own every IEM to verify this claim; however, the RU6 is the only dongle in my artillery that provides great synergy with *ALL* of the IEMs I have thrown at it (which range diversely from BAs, dynamic drivers, hybrid BAs and DD; and which range in terms of tuning and tonality). Fall deeper in love with RU6 each day


----------



## fizzytao (Sep 12, 2022)

Andykong said:


> Mid-Autumn Festival is held on the full moon of the 8th month of the lunar calendar.  In Chinese Culture, roundness symbolizes completeness and togetherness, therefore, the Mid-Autumn Festival is a time for friends and family to come together and appreciate the union and completeness of our life.  This might be a small wish that we take for granted in the past, but COVID has taught us to treasure every moment of gathering and reunion, and we wish all our users and friend a Happy Mid-Autumn Festival.
> 
> I want to share a personal plan with all my partners and friends in HeadFi forum.  I'll take a long break later this month, and this will probably last till the end of 2022.  I'll stay out of the radar completely and will resurface when I feel confident that I am fit to handle my job again. @Cayin will take over my role for Cayin audio and I'll hand over my ongoing activities and responsibilities to them gradually next week.   So if you need to PM me on a Cayin-related issue, please include or address your problem to @Cayin.  I really enjoy my time with the HeadFi forum and am looking forward to meeting with you again after my long vacation.


Your support to we users has been very much appreciated. Thank you!

Take a good rest during your long vacation and see you here again soon.


----------



## cactus_farmer

Does the RU6 have enough power to drive a Sennheiser HD800s to comfortable volume levels without clipping it and damaging its drivers?

And what about a Hifiman Arya (non-Stealth), or is that pushing it?


----------



## equalspeace (Sep 14, 2022)

cactus_farmer said:


> Does the RU6 have enough power to drive a Sennheiser HD800s to comfortable volume levels without clipping it and damaging its drivers?
> 
> And what about a Hifiman Arya (non-Stealth), or is that pushing it?



They don't have enough juice to give the HD650 good dynamics/control, if that helps. For easier to drive HPs and iems you can't do much better than the RU6.


----------



## cactus_farmer

Is the RU6 so weak that it would produce clipping that would damage the driver of the HD800s when attempting to drive it to normal listening levels?

I don't mind if the sound is a little underwhelming but I do mind if they're going to be actually destroying my headphones...


----------



## JAnonymous5150

cactus_farmer said:


> Is the RU6 so weak that it would produce clipping that would damage the driver of the HD800s when attempting to drive it to normal listening levels?
> 
> I don't mind if the sound is a little underwhelming but I do mind if they're going to be actually destroying my headphones...



No, I can get my HD800S louder than I would normally listen with the RU6 without clipping. I agree that it isn't the best way to drive them, but it's good enough for some on the go casual listening if that's what you're asking.

How much you'll like the pairing is another issue altogether. I like the super clean and detailed approach of headphones like the HD800S or my AKG K812/K872 and I think they sound best with sources that are super clean leaning towards "clinical." The RU6 definitely has some smooth musicality to it which may or may not be something you like. That's totally subjective though.

The HD800S are reasonably sensitive headphones. Sensitive enough that you can get volume from something like the RU6. Like the other poster said though, it tends to lack some low end control and round off some micro details.

Edit: And I apologize for answering when I wasn't asked. Jusy trying to be helpful.


----------



## ClieOS

cactus_farmer said:


> Is the RU6 so weak that it would produce clipping that would damage the driver of the HD800s when attempting to drive it to normal listening levels?
> 
> I don't mind if the sound is a little underwhelming but I do mind if they're going to be actually destroying my headphones...


Clipping doesn't damage headphones.


----------



## Krassi

Hi!
I was also interested in an affordable and flexible R2R dac an got my RU6 today.

Headphones run nice on it but especially hooking this up on a 80s technics SU-V3 Amp and 80s speakers was the reason to try them out.. Well i like it! 
It really sounds different than my Sigma dacs or also my E1DA Powerdac 2.1 in a good way.

Also tired sundaras and Sash tres on them and i reeeaaaally love the bass from this dac.


----------



## wolfstar76

Krassi said:


> Hi!
> I was also interested in an affordable and flexible R2R dac an got my RU6 today.
> 
> Headphones run nice on it but especially hooking this up on a 80s technics SU-V3 Amp and 80s speakers was the reason to try them out.. Well i like it!
> ...


If you like RU6, better try RS2 since your setting technically is not supported by RU6. RU6 does not have line out and you will be double amping when you hook RU6 with amp. Good news is, if you actually enjoy this, you will enjoy RS2 a lot more, which does have a proper line out and can actually serve as DAC mode.


----------



## Krassi

Yeah i actually forgot about all the specs of the hiby RS2.! . well since i got my ru6 used for 160 euros it was a no brainer if i would keep it 

Paired with the Technics it sounds actually really good! i use a kadas toneboard normally on this amp. The SU-V3 beats the crap out of all my tube amps so i actually got two of them 
my speakers with coral M-100 midhorn and H-70 sound really good with this without missing clarity..i really like that bass really kicks on the ru6.
I also have 3 tube amps that i will try with the ru6.

Main reason for the ru6 was curiosity and the price .. well maybe if i stumble upon a used rs2 ill go for it since i love hiby daps.


----------



## Krassi

Krassi said:


> Yeah i actually forgot about all the specs of the hiby RS2.! . well since i got my ru6 used for 160 euros it was a no brainer if i would keep it
> 
> Paired with the Technics it sounds actually really good! i use a kadas toneboard normally on this amp. The SU-V3 beats the crap out of all my tube amps so i actually got two of them
> my speakers with coral M-100 midhorn and H-70 sound really good with this without missing clarity..i really like that bass really kicks on the ru6.
> ...


Well glad i didnt pulled the trigger on the used one.. found the same pictures and extra cable in a bay auction but thats from a different city.. 
I have one from amzn right now (wich i can send back) and well maybe i should check the rs2 if i can get my hands on it. 

Still amazed by the sound of the ru6 with amp and loudspeakers even if its not supposed to do this


----------



## Brain Damage

I don't know what your source is; but one thing to bear in mind with the RS2 is that it doesn't include streaming (in case your source is a streaming platform like Qobuz or Tidal) 👍


----------



## Krassi

i am not streaming so i though "well thats a device made especially for me" when i read the specs )
But i really like the RU6 more and more.. 

Works great with sash tres, sundaras have not enough power on this, but i was able to run my K340 "a bit loud" on this 
I am glad i did not gest scammed with the used ru6.


----------



## borkenarrou

Noob question, does the RU6 have a inbuilt battery, asking because I don't like battery powered devices anymore, as they are more or less disposable after the battery runs out. I searched this info but can't seem to find a clearcut answer.


----------



## richoval

borkenarrou said:


> Noob question, does the RU6 have a inbuilt battery, asking because I don't like battery powered devices anymore, as they are more or less disposable after the battery runs out. I searched this info but can't seem to find a clearcut answer.


it does not, drains my phone pretty hard….


----------



## borkenarrou (Sep 18, 2022)

richoval said:


> it does not, drains my phone pretty hard….


No battery makes me interested, but bit concerned that Passion For Sound noticed some random EMI noise from his RU6, not sure if this from his particular unit or a general issue with this device, I'll research a bit.

Regarding the battery draining issue I'll only use this occasionally with my smartphone, more with my laptop and as a DAC feed to my main headphone amp, I want to get a feel the R2R magic everyone is taking about 🙂


----------



## richoval

borkenarrou said:


> No battery makes me interested, but bit concerned that Passion For Sound noticed some random EMI noise from his RU6, not sure if this from his particular unit or a general issue with this device, I'll research a bit.
> 
> Regarding the battery draining issue I'll only use this occasionally with my smartphone, more with my laptop and as a DAC feed to my main headphone amp, I want to get a feel the R2R magic everyone is taking about 🙂


yeah, i get some electrical interferences in combination with my phone, not with my laptop. also i have an iphone 12mini, the battery is already really weak…


----------



## borkenarrou

Is there a way to use the RU6 in DAC only mode and bypass the inbuilt amp of the RU6 altogether, this will avoid unnecessary processing when I pair with a higher quality external amp, not sure NOS mode does this other than doing NOS obviously.


----------



## borkenarrou

borkenarrou said:


> Is there a way to use the RU6 in DAC only mode and bypass the inbuilt amp of the RU6 altogether, this will avoid unnecessary processing when I pair with a higher quality external amp, not sure NOS mode does this other than doing NOS obviously.


Unfortunately not, got the answer in previous posts, this would have made this truly a winner in my case, maybe something for next version.


----------



## Dan DRC

borkenarrou said:


> Unfortunately not, got the answer in previous posts, this would have made this truly a winner in my case, maybe something for next version.


Several are using the RU6 3.5mm output to an external amp with good results. The settings on the RU6 will depend on the external amp you want to use. Basically you would just need to try it out an let your ears decide. On my RU6 I have the volume set at 85 in low gain in NOS mode. I take the 3.5 out to an ifi xCAN amp. The results may very from amp to amp. I personally have not had issues with noise floor or distortion, it sounds great. I do agree it would be nice if the RU6 had a true line out but I sometimes think too much is made over "double amping" . As they say your mileage may vary. Doesn't hurt to experiment again let your ears decide.


----------



## borkenarrou

Dan DRC said:


> Several are using the RU6 3.5mm output to an external amp with good results. The settings on the RU6 will depend on the external amp you want to use. Basically you would just need to try it out an let your ears decide. On my RU6 I have the volume set at 85 in low gain in NOS mode. I take the 3.5 out to an ifi xCAN amp. The results may very from amp to amp. I personally have not had issues with noise floor or distortion, it sounds great. I do agree it would be nice if the RU6 had a true line out but I sometimes think too much is made over "double amping" . As they say your mileage may vary. Doesn't hurt to experiment again let your ears decide.


Thanks for the tips, I also thought 3.5mm will better for external amping cos it will not be routed via the 4.4mm opamp because the RU6 is not a true balanced design, I still haven't got the RU6 but I'll try these settings if/when I do get it.


----------



## tikue666

Hi, has anyone ever experienced playback stutters? I've been experiencing stutters a lot lately with the RU6 connected to my PC playing music from MusicBee with WASAPI exclusive mode, sometimes it gets annoying as it happens 2-3 times over the span of 10 seconds, stutters and pauses for a whole second and resumes. No volume adjustments were made when these stutters happen.


----------



## tikue666

> tikue666 said:
> 
> 
> > Hi, has anyone ever experienced playback stutters? I've been experiencing stutters a lot lately with the RU6 connected to my PC playing music from MusicBee with WASAPI exclusive mode, sometimes it gets annoying as it happens 2-3 times over the span of 10 seconds, stutters and pauses for a whole second and resumes. No volume adjustments were made when these stutters happen.
> ...


----------



## yaps66

Music only stutters for me if I am listening at very high volumes.  It is more like clipping.  Otherwise, no stutters for me.  Hope you find a solution though.  It is irritating.

Perhaps you could try on a phone to see if you get the same stutters?  If not then perhaps it is an issue with the PC?


----------



## yaps66

I have been listening to the Longyao Yinman 龙谣音曼 2.0 600Ω Limited Edition>RU6 (NOS High gain Vol 60)>PC (Win 11)>Roon.  Just sublime!  The analogue nature of the RU6 really brings to life the Yinman 600.  The music is so lifelike and engaging.  The star of the show is the bass of course.  So textured and deep.   Can't imagine this is sound coming from an earbud!  I am in love!


----------



## justanut

It's crazy how well this tiny dongle holds its own against DAPs much more expensive than it. The fact that the Acoustune Sho is a fantastic IEM helps too ^ ^


----------



## borkenarrou

I got mine today, at work now so haven't unboxed but new stuff butterflies in my stomach lol 😋


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Sounds like it could be a clock issue where the clock info from the RU6's DAC doesn't match the info coming from the computer. I only use my RU6 with my Android so I'm not sure what options you have, but if you've got a way to disable the clock info that may help.

It could also just be a simple buffer issue. If the buffer isn't big enough it will skip when the buffer runs out. Increase the buffer size and it may eliminate the problem as well.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

yaps66 said:


> I have been listening to the Longyao Yinman 龙谣音曼 2.0 600Ω Limited Edition>RU6 (NOS High gain Vol 60)>PC (Win 11)>Roon.  Just sublime!  The analogue nature of the RU6 really brings to life the Yinman 600.  The music is so lifelike and engaging.  The star of the show is the bass of course.  So textured and deep.   Can't imagine this is sound coming from an earbud!  I am in love!



Don't you find the RU6 to be a little under powered for the Yinman 600s? I have run my 600s on it a few times and they get loud enough and sound pretty good, but their performance, especially in terms of soundstage, control, and micro details, increased for me when using amplification capable of supplying more current for the very insensitive drivers used in the 600s.

They fact that I have to use such heavy duty equipment to get the best out of them, is one of the few criticisms I have of the Yinman 600s. Clearly they're capable of sounding pretty good on the RU6 so I'm not disagreeing. I'm just curious if you found the same increase in performance with a beefier amp/combo/source.


----------



## yaps66

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Don't you find the RU6 to be a little under powered for the Yinman 600s? I have run my 600s on it a few times and they get loud enough and sound pretty good, but their performance, especially in terms of soundstage, control, and micro details, increased for me when using amplification capable of supplying more current for the very insensitive drivers used in the 600s.
> 
> They fact that I have to use such heavy duty equipment to get the best out of them, is one of the few criticisms I have of the Yinman 600s. Clearly they're capable of sounding pretty good on the RU6 so I'm not disagreeing. I'm just curious if you found the same increase in performance with a beefier amp/combo/source.


I am on high gain and volume at 55 and I do find the soundstage wide enough for me to enjoy jazz or some electronic.  The RU6 renders mids so sweetly for me.  However, switching over to my desktop rig obviously increases the stage size and this lets me enjoy classical symphonies much better.


----------



## borkenarrou

Are there any longer type-c cables known to work with the RU6.


----------



## richoval

borkenarrou said:


> Are there any longer type-c cables known to work with the RU6.


my usb-c loading cable that came with my ipad works


----------



## peterinvan

borkenarrou said:


> Are there any longer type-c cables known to work with the RU6.


I successfully tried the USB-C charger cable from my iPad Pro.


----------



## DBaldock9 (Sep 24, 2022)

borkenarrou said:


> Are there any longer type-c cables known to work with the RU6.



I've got some Joto 10-ft USB-A/USB-C cables from Amazon, that work fine with my USB-C connected DAC devices (Zishan DSDs, Shanling M0, Cayin RU6, HiBy RS6).
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B017COHTJ6/

*EDIT: Fixed the URL*


----------



## borkenarrou

DBaldock9 said:


> I've got some Joto 10-ft USB-A/USB-C cables from Amazon, that work fine with my USB-C connected DAC devices (Zishan DSDs, Shanling M0, Cayin RU6, HiBy RS6).
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B017COHTJ/


I think you meant this one https://www.amazon.com/JOTO-Type-C-Charging-Braided-Nintendo/dp/B017COHTJ6/


----------



## borkenarrou

I am getting some noise with my LCD-X (2021) after 65 volume,  I usally listen in the 65-70 range, high gain, OS mode, it sound like its clipping, is it normal?


----------



## captblaze

borkenarrou said:


> I am getting some noise with my LCD-X (2021) after 65 volume,  I usally listen in the 65-70 range, high gain, OS mode, it sound like its clipping, is it normal?


PC or cellphone? If iPhone you are a victim of IOS limitation in output from lightning port


----------



## borkenarrou

Phone but Galaxy s22 ultra, but yes indeed from PC the issue is solved, but then agin I do want to use my phone considering this is a portable device, so any workaround for Android?


----------



## captblaze

borkenarrou said:


> Phone but Galaxy s22 ultra, but yes indeed from PC the issue is solved, but then agin I do want to use my phone considering this is a portable device, so any workaround for Android?


I don't have android experience


----------



## JAnonymous5150

borkenarrou said:


> I am getting some noise with my LCD-X (2021) after 65 volume,  I usally listen in the 65-70 range, high gain, OS mode, it sound like its clipping, is it normal?



Hold on, so you've used it with this phone in the past on these settings and with these headphones and had no problem and then the RU6 just started with the noise/clipping out of nowhere? I just want to pin that down before I start speculating and potentially wasting time. 

It would also be helpful if you could connect another pair of headphones to the RU6 and the same phone and see if it produces the same sound or clipping as you increase the volume. This will help determine possibilities for the cause.


----------



## borkenarrou

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Hold on, so you've used it with this phone in the past on these settings and with these headphones and had no problem and then the RU6 just started with the noise/clipping out of nowhere? I just want to pin that down before I start speculating and potentially wasting time.
> 
> It would also be helpful if you could connect another pair of headphones to the RU6 and the same phone and see if it produces the same sound or clipping as you increase the volume. This will help determine possibilities for the cause.


I got the RU6 2 days back, having this issue from the very start, now I have checked the Porta Pros in low gain, still getting noise, both OS/NOS, all these is with my S22 Ultra, laptop works fine.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

borkenarrou said:


> I got the RU6 2 days back, having this issue from the very start, now I have checked the Porta Pros in low gain, still getting noise, both OS/NOS, all these is with my S22 Ultra, laptop works fine.



Sounds like an issue with the S22 eg a malfunctioning usb c port or some kind of compatibility issue since the RU6 functions fine on your laptop. Does lowering the device volume on your S22 make any difference at all? Does it make the noise softer or does it stay the same?


----------



## equalspeace

Have to take back what i said about the RU6  working well with the HD650. Maybe it needed a bit of run in time or for my ears to adjust, but it's doing a pretty great job with it at the moment. It can handle harder to drive cans on high gain. Sounds fine.


----------



## borkenarrou

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Sounds like an issue with the S22 eg a malfunctioning usb c port or some kind of compatibility issue since the RU6 functions fine on your laptop. Does lowering the device volume on your S22 make any difference at all? Does it make the noise softer or does it stay the same?


It seems the S22 ultra works better using the provided short type-c cable, earlier I was using a 3rd party long cable, so it can be EMI noise or probably the cable has more resistance, I'll have to test more on this, but one thing I noticed is the Laptop still sound better, has more impact, more authoritative, I will test the S22 ultra later with a powered USB hub to see if it gives some improvement.


----------



## peterinvan

Deleted


----------



## JAnonymous5150

borkenarrou said:


> It seems the S22 ultra works better using the provided short type-c cable, earlier I was using a 3rd party long cable, so it can be EMI noise or probably the cable has more resistance, I'll have to test more on this, but one thing I noticed is the Laptop still sound better, has more impact, more authoritative, I will test the S22 ultra later with a powered USB hub to see if it gives some improvement.



Let me know how your tests go. I'm not sure of the stats on the S22, but the only reason I can think of for the laptop sounding better would be if the s22 is creating a choke point for your audio chain by not providing enough juice for the RU6 to convert to fully power it's amp section. It would be similar to using a 5v power supply on an amo that requires 12v. The amp will (depending on design) still give you sound, but it will be underpowered and thus have noticeably hanstrung performance. That said, I want to reiterate that I haven't looked up the S22 to know if that's what's going on. Just speculating at this point.


----------



## Goofyboy84

Has this AMP/Dongle been a headache for anyone? Or was it just me??? Search my name and you’ll find a treasure trove of issues I had. Musictek wound up not returning it, so… I got fed up and sold it as is for like $70 shipped or so. 

Never again will I do something like this again. 

Zach


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Goofyboy84 said:


> Has this AMP/Dongle been a headache for anyone? Or was it just me??? Search my name and you’ll find a treasure trove of issues I had. Musictek wound up not returning it, so… I got fed up and sold it as is for like $70 shipped or so.
> 
> Never again will I do something like this again.
> 
> Zach



Never again will you do something like what?

Personally, I have nothing but good experiences to report. I used my RU6 often and I really like it. Any product is going to have a certain number of QC or compatibility issues and I haven't noticed sn abnormal number with the RU6, but that's just me. I'm sorry it didn't work out for you though. Do you mind if I ask what problems you had with it?


----------



## animalsrush

Absolutely love mine. I like it so much that I sold all my DAPs including my beloved Sony WM1Z  . This allows all my devices to sound nery as good as my Sony WM1Z. I use it primarily with my phone OnePlus 8T and my 2020 iPad pro. It has a stellar anog sound .. sorry you had issues with it


----------



## BrokenHill

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Let me know how your tests go. I'm not sure of the stats on the S22, but the only reason I can think of for the laptop sounding better would be if the s22 is creating a choke point for your audio chain by not providing enough juice for the RU6 to convert to fully power it's amp section. It would be similar to using a 5v power supply on an amo that requires 12v. The amp will (depending on design) still give you sound, but it will be underpowered and thus have noticeably hanstrung performance. That said, I want to reiterate that I haven't looked up the S22 to know if that's what's going on. Just speculating at this point.


The S22 are one of the few (along with OnePlus and some Oppo) where the USB is actually 3.2. In other brands, they are implementations of the USB 2 protocol on the C connector. It should not be a power problem, since more power is delivered on USB3. I just received my S22 Ultra and I will try to compare it with my previous mobile and my DAP, which are the ones I used mainly with the RU6


----------



## wolfstar76

animalsrush said:


> Absolutely love mine. I like it so much that I sold all my DAPs including my beloved Sony WM1Z  . This allows all my devices to sound nery as good as my Sony WM1Z. I use it primarily with my phone OnePlus 8T and my 2020 iPad pro. It has a stellar anog sound .. sorry you had issues with it


You should try RS2.


----------



## wolfstar76 (Oct 2, 2022)

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Never again will you do something like what?
> 
> Personally, I have nothing but good experiences to report. I used my RU6 often and I really like it. Any product is going to have a certain number of QC or compatibility issues and I haven't noticed sn abnormal number with the RU6, but that's just me. I'm sorry it didn't work out for you though. Do you mind if I ask what problems you had with it?


I used RU6 with my S20 Ultra without any problem. However, most of the time I used RU6 with my laptop or desktop, I have to say that it will be hard to press to find another DAC/AMP better than RU6 to drive IEMs.

I tried RS8 and RS2 during CanJam and RS8 is THE best DAPs I tried, much better than the new AK SP3k to my ears. For RS2, I only spent a few min and it is also pretty good.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

BrokenHill said:


> The S22 are one of the few (along with OnePlus and some Oppo) where the USB is actually 3.2. In other brands, they are implementations of the USB 2 protocol on the C connector. It should not be a power problem, since more power is delivered on USB3. I just received my S22 Ultra and I will try to compare it with my previous mobile and my DAP, which are the ones I used mainly with the RU6



Definitely keep me updated. I don't have any Samsung phones and definitely don't have the S22. In that post I was literally just speculating and trying to put ideas out there that might account for what he was encountering. 

I had no idea that the usb c protocol implementation was different though my thought was less about the protocol and more about certain manufacturers using various means to limit voltage output to OTG usb devices by their phones.

Apple does this and I have heard that certain models from various Android manufacturers have employed this at various points. Basically, it was a shot in the dark, but seemed like a possibility. Either way, updates on how it goes with S22 would be appreciated.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

wolfstar76 said:


> I used RU6 with my S20 Ultra without any problem. However, most of the time I used RU6 with my laptop or desktop, I have to say that it will be hard to press to find another DAC/AMP better than RU6 to drive IEMs.
> 
> I tried RS8 and RS2 during CanJam and RS8 is THE best DAPs I tried, much better than the new AK SP3k to my ears. For RS2, I only spent a few min and it is also pretty good.



I actually tried the RS8 at CanJam SoCal as well and was impressed. If I didn't already have two very nice and very capable DAPs and if I hadn't liked the DCA Expanse so much I might have ended up buying it and selling off my N8ii. I really like the N8ii though and the Expanse were just too good to say no to so DCA ended up with my money...

Are you planning on buying the RS8 or the RS2?

What IEMs make for your best pairing with the RU6? I really like the way it runs with basically any of mine, but I particularly like how it pairs with my Andro 2020s and my EJ07Ms. I'm also a big earbud fan and the RU6 is perfect with my Simphonio Dragon 3s too.


----------



## borkenarrou

Recently I had a weird incidence, while playing via my mobile, the loudness dropped suddenly and became kind of out of phase and echoey, after sometime I decided to unplug the RU6 form the mobile and hp and reconnect it and it became normal again, not sure what happened maybe a flaky capacitor or resistor acting up, now I am bit worried about its longevity, can be a one off but anyone else here faced similar incidence?


----------



## animalsrush (Oct 2, 2022)

wolfstar76 said:


> You should try RS2.


I think I found a sound signature with RU6 I like across multiple devices so going back to a DAP would be hard now. Can't see the advantage of having another place to maintain my audio files.  Another thing I found with this was usb c cables make a huge difference. The one that came with it sounds good but I started using the cable that came with my Samsung T5 ssd. It is a thicker cable. The sound seems more dynamic..also I only use iems and there is enough power with RU6 I am barely go past 50 on vol 

Having said that I heard lot of good things about hiby dap. I use their music app on the android phone with RU6


----------



## wolfstar76 (Oct 2, 2022)

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I actually tried the RS8 at CanJam SoCal as well and was impressed. If I didn't already have two very nice and very capable DAPs and if I hadn't liked the DCA Expanse so much I might have ended up buying it and selling off my N8ii. I really like the N8ii though and the Expanse were just too good to say no to so DCA ended up with my money...
> 
> Are you planning on buying the RS8 or the RS2?
> 
> What IEMs make for your best pairing with the RU6? I really like the way it runs with basically any of mine, but I particularly like how it pairs with my Andro 2020s and my EJ07Ms. I'm also a big earbud fan and the RU6 is perfect with my Simphonio Dragon 3s too.


I planned to buy both . However, I will buy RS2 first since it fits my need right away. For RS8, I still need more time to justify the use (not the sound, it is the best) since I almost never use DAPs in my home and RS8 is too heavy to carry them outdoors.

For RU6, I have hybrid, DD, or planar IEMs all pairing pretty well with it. I will never use RU6 for my headphones though.


----------



## peterinvan

wolfstar76 said:


> For RU6, I have hybrid, DD, or planar IEMs all pairing pretty well with it. I will never use RU6 for my headphones though.


I am enjoying my RU6 on...

PC > iFi USB Power > RU6
iPad Pro > RU6
All my headphones and IEMs work well from the 4.4mm socket...

Focal Elegia
Audeze LCD-XC
Grado SR325is (modded to use 4.4mm balanced cable)
Meze Rai Solo
Shure SE535


----------



## animalsrush

wolfstar76 said:


> I planned to buy both . However, I will buy RS2 first since it fits my need right away. For RS8, I still need more time to justify the use (not the sound, it is the best) since I almost never use DAPs in my home and RS8 is too heavy to carry them outdoors.
> 
> For RU6, I have hybrid, DD, or planar IEMs all pairing pretty well with it. I will never use RU6 for my headphones though.


Hybrid DDs shine with RU6. My 64 audio Nio which is hybrid with MX module has great synergy I think it unleashes it full potential, with my k10s which are full BA the sound is great but I don’t feel the energy ..


----------



## wolfstar76

animalsrush said:


> Hybrid DDs shine with RU6. My 64 audio Nio which is hybrid with MX module has great synergy I think it unleashes it full potential, with my k10s which are full BA the sound is great but I don’t feel the energy ..


I no longer have all BA IEMs (well, actually I do have one though it is no longer in use, maybe I should try it).


----------



## peterinvan (Oct 2, 2022)

Just did a quick test.  Listening to _Big Yellow Taxi _(Tierney Sutton) on my Fiio M11Pro, using Grado SR325is (modified)

https://tidal.com/browse/track/36713951

Fiio USB-C > RU6 4.4mm out vs. the Fiio's 4.4mm balanced out

With the twin AK4497EQ DACs, arranged in a dual-mono set-up, and THX AAA amplification, the DAP sounds better to my ears...
more forward and precise, breathy vocals, and the drums/cymbals are more realistic.

Not a huge difference, but I could do a blind test and easily pick out the DAP.

Mind you, the DAP costs more than twice the price of the RU6.


----------



## animalsrush

Is there like a warm up time for RU6. Yesterday I was tip swapping and when I turned on RU6 it sounded so flat. I thought the tip was wrong. But I played like 3 songs and then sound was dynamic. I then replayed the first song again the difference was huge, there was enough body , soundstage and dynamics with same tip

So that makes me think unlike chip based DACs , this needs some warm up time like tubes.. thoughts?


----------



## TYATYA

peterinvan said:


> Just did a quick test.  Listening to _Big Yellow Taxi _(Tierney Sutton) on my Fiio M11Pro, using Grado SR325is (modified)
> 
> https://tidal.com/browse/track/36713951
> 
> ...


 I compare ru6 to a dap that cost 14x.
I can identify the sound, quite easily when RU6 is on NOS mode, but, I can not say what I like more than the other.
It depending on music tracks.
Ru6 has a charming vocal!
Weakness at sharpness in comparision against +3k dap is there but isn't deal breaker.
I supose that if a sale man at a shop told me: These are all +3k daps, lets close the eyes and listen to each, then take one -> If I select one and pay 3k for it, when I open my eyes I may see it:  Ru6.
May be Ru6 and may not.


----------



## TYATYA

animalsrush said:


> Is there like a warm up time for RU6. Yesterday I was tip swapping and when I turned on RU6 it sounded so flat. I thought the tip was wrong. But I played like 3 songs and then sound was dynamic. I then replayed the first song again the difference was huge, there was enough body , soundstage and dynamics with same tip
> 
> So that makes me think unlike chip based DACs , this needs some warm up time like tubes.. thoughts?


Just one time I heard volume slightly swing between 2 chanels, after I unpack ru6 few hours.
I am not sure but thinking you plug 3.5 or 2.5 jack did not perfectly fit and cause mono or as like mono connection. 
Also, you posibly switched OS<-> NOS mode


----------



## animalsrush

Sound is not Mono ,just doesn’t have the body. I am in NOS mode only. Jack is fitted correctly. This is a repeatable process atleast for me. Every day when I turn on RU6 it needs atleast 2 songs to gain full body..


----------



## peterinvan (Oct 4, 2022)

animalsrush said:


> Is there like a warm up time for RU6. Yesterday I was tip swapping and when I turned on RU6 it sounded so flat. I thought the tip was wrong. But I played like 3 songs and then sound was dynamic. I then replayed the first song again the difference was huge, there was enough body , soundstage and dynamics with same tip
> 
> So that makes me think unlike chip based DACs , this needs some warm up time like tubes.. thoughts?


I never found that a warm up on my RU6 was needed (although large R2R DACs are well known for this requirement).

I found another anomaly:  with the RU6 heating up.  After much testing I believe that the RU6 heats up much more than normal when I do a lot of switching between headphones, and between 3.5mm and 4.4mm sockets.  No one offered any explanation.  I now unplug the USB-C (i.e. reboot the RU6) between headphone (and cabling) swaps.  Normally my RU6 just runs warm.

Listening now on 4.4mm with my Focal Elegias with fenestrated sheepskin pads from Dekoni and a “silver” cable from Meze.  Delightful


----------



## artkillen

animalsrush said:


> Is there like a warm up time for RU6. Yesterday I was tip swapping and when I turned on RU6 it sounded so flat. I thought the tip was wrong. But I played like 3 songs and then sound was dynamic. I then replayed the first song again the difference was huge, there was enough body , soundstage and dynamics with same tip
> 
> So that makes me think unlike chip based DACs , this needs some warm up time like tubes.. thoughts?


In my experience, yes. The RU6 sounds flat for the first couple of songs, in my system. After it gets slightly warm to the touch, the sound seems to breathe more.


----------



## dakchi

Those who have clippings when playing from an iPhone, I have the solution for you: I purchased ddhifi adapter TC28I PRO that allows to power RU6 instead of the iPhone doing it. The result is very positive. I have no clipping anymore even with full size headphone. Combined with TC09S cable from ddhifi, the sound and build quality are excellent. I had Oeaudio cable in the past that broke after 3 months as I was expecting. This one seems to be much more solid
​


----------



## equalspeace

RU6 is just phenomenal. Makes alot of DAPs just not needed and at reasonable cost


----------



## simpleworld

Maybe it was my initial bias but I just can't hear a difference between OS and NOS modes anymore.  Does anyone know a song where the difference is apparent?  Not sure what to listen for at this point.  When I first got the ru6 I thought I could hear a difference but now I can't.  I assume it's more apparent on tracks that are 44.1khz compared to higher sampling rates.  Thoughts?


----------



## oldkid

The newest dongle DAC in my collection, the Tempotec Sonata E44 has replaced RU6 in my pocket for a few days. It sounds noticeably more detailed that Cayin R2R dongle and almost as musical. Those Cirrus Logic DAC chips sound way more natural than ESS and AKM in my opinion. Imaging was also very good on the Tempotec. Now, I'm back to my usual ladder DAC goodness. The sound is less impressive but still very pleasant.


----------



## jairhifi

hey, it's normal when you up or down the volume there's a noticeable silence gap?


----------



## TYATYA

simpleworld said:


> Maybe it was my initial bias but I just can't hear a difference between OS and NOS modes anymore.  Does anyone know a song where the difference is apparent?  Not sure what to listen for at this point.  When I first got the ru6 I thought I could hear a difference but now I can't.  I assume it's more apparent on tracks that are 44.1khz compared to higher sampling rates.  Thoughts?


What IEM or hp are you pairing with ru6?


----------



## TYATYA

jairhifi said:


> hey, it's normal when you up or down the volume there's a noticeable silence gap?


Yes normal. Got once every 10 press vol button


----------



## jairhifi

TYATYA said:


> Yes normal. Got once every 10 press vol button


I don't think it is useful to me... any way to disable it?? thanks


----------



## Headcan (Oct 7, 2022)

jairhifi said:


> I don't think it is useful to me... any way to disable it?? thanks


Andy has explained it many times throughout this thread.  I think you may get a better grasp and appreciation for why, by reading the first page, under "High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control"


Andykong said:


> Our main hesitation with resistor array volume control is not about technical difficulties or budget consideration. The Resistor Array volume control involves switching relays when you hop from one segment to another. The relay will produce very mild pop sound with speakers and is inaudible when you are 2 or 3 meters away from the speaker. Unfortunately the pop noise will become very annoying to sensitive IEM users. *For this reason, we need to mute the output for a short moment when a relay kicks in. This will introduce a small delay (around 40ms) in volume adjustment, definitely a set back from user experience point of view. For dedicated audiophiles who put audio performance, this is a small price to pay in order to implement R-2R resistor ladder network in a dongle DAC. but we can understand some users might consider this as a deal breaker, that's why we explained this in detail up front.*


----------



## jairhifi

Headcan said:


> Andy has explained it many times throughout this thread.  I think you may get a better grasp and appreciation for why, by reading the first page, under "High Precision Resistor Array Volume Control"


I see... I had no idea, I thought it was something relative to software... I'll check better the answers before to post... thanks


----------



## simpleworld

TYATYA said:


> What IEM or hp are you pairing with ru6?


Dt770 (80ohm).  I have not tried iems with it yet but I will out of curiosity.


----------



## helloh3adfi (Oct 9, 2022)

TYATYA said:


> Yes normal. Got once every 10 press vol button


I get it more often. It sounds like clipping tbh.

I also hate the fact that my OS can't increase the volume over "15%". I can increase the %, but the volume won't increase! Only way to increase/decrease volume is on the amp itself. Why the hell? This is annoying. Fiio KA3 works properly with my OS and it comes without hardware buttons. The Cayin is my first amp/dac where OS volume control isn't fully supported...


----------



## blacksesame

hey guys, anyone know how to reduce or eliminate the cell phone noise with ru6? I'm using Samsung s10 plus phone and notice it happens a lot.  I'm using stock cable and ru6 with the leather case


----------



## jairhifi

blacksesame said:


> hey guys, anyone know how to reduce or eliminate the cell phone noise with ru6? I'm using Samsung s10 plus phone and notice it happens a lot.  I'm using stock cable and ru6 with the leather case


do you have a longer cable to test it? I've the noise sometimes with the stock cable...


----------



## Johnfg465vd

blacksesame said:


> hey guys, anyone know how to reduce or eliminate the cell phone noise with ru6? I'm using Samsung s10 plus phone and notice it happens a lot.  I'm using stock cable and ru6 with the leather case


Yes, test with a longer cable and also try Airplane mode and see if that noise goes away.


----------



## borkenarrou

Had anyone experinced the RU6 abruptly sounding kind of out of phase (loudness decreases and vocal is echoey like singing in a well) especially after long listening session, had occurred twice and it resolved itself after I unplug it from the source for sometime and then tried them again.


----------



## TYATYA

helloh3adfi said:


> I get it more often. It sounds like clipping tbh.
> 
> I also hate the fact that my OS can't increase the volume over "15%". I can increase the %, but the volume won't increase! Only way to increase/decrease volume is on the amp itself. Why the hell? This is annoying. Fiio KA3 works properly with my OS and it comes without hardware buttons. The Cayin is my first amp/dac where OS volume control isn't fully supported...


It (the dap) also inactivate the EQ?
That bcs of the dap(s) completly handover controlling to ru6.
All dsp usually does by the dap will be disable/not working, including adj of volume.
If you connect ru6 to a phone, you can use phone's volume buttons.


----------



## helloh3adfi

TYATYA said:


> It (the dap) also inactivate the EQ?
> That bcs of the dap(s) completly handover controlling to ru6.
> All dsp usually does by the dap will be disable/not working, including adj of volume.
> If you connect ru6 to a phone, you can use phone's volume buttons.


I haven't got a DAP. I'm running my Cayin from a PC. I fixed the volume problem after I switched the sound settings from "analog output" to "digital output". That way the volume control works properly. Does it even matter if it's analog or digital? It's strange, because all my other DACs don't have problems with the "analog output".


----------



## blacksesame

Johnfg465vd said:


> Yes, test with a longer cable and also try Airplane mode and see if that noise goes away.


Thanks I'll try a longer cable. I dont want to put phone on airplane mode because I'd like to receive messages still. I find it happens more when I'm in public. at home seems better


----------



## blacksesame

jairhifi said:


> do you have a longer cable to test it? I've the noise sometimes with the stock cable...


how much longer would you say? is the idea to keep the dongle away from phone? or is it transmitted through the cable and longer ones would defuse the EMI? sorry not really knowledgeable in this area.


----------



## mekap

blacksesame said:


> how much longer would you say? is the idea to keep the dongle away from phone? or is it transmitted through the cable and longer ones would defuse the EMI? sorry not really knowledgeable in this area.


keep the dongle away from phone


----------



## jairhifi

blacksesame said:


> how much longer would you say? is the idea to keep the dongle away from phone? or is it transmitted through the cable and longer ones would defuse the EMI? sorry not really knowledgeable in this area.


the idea is to keep away the dongle from the phone... the noises are caused because of the electromagnetic waves...


----------



## alvin59 (Oct 17, 2022)

helloh3adfi said:


> I haven't got a DAP. I'm running my Cayin from a PC. I fixed the volume problem after I switched the sound settings from "analog output" to "digital output". That way the volume control works properly. Does it even matter if it's analog or digital? It's strange, because all my other DACs don't have problems with the "analog output".


Hi, im experiencing the same issue too. Mind sharing how did you switch from "analog output" to "digital output" ? I assume you're on windows ?


----------



## simpleworld

alvin59 said:


> Hi, im experiencing the same issue too. Mind sharing how did you switch from "analog output" to "digital output" ? I assume you're on windows ?


If I'm understanding your question correctly, these are the key settings that either enable or disable Windows volume control.  There is no "Analog" output to a DAC.






If you leave "Enable Audio Enhancements" checked, it will allow control of volume from Windows as well as the use of EQ (like Equalizer APO or similar tools).

Some music apps like Quobuz have a WASAPI Exclusive/Direct mode that will bypass the Windows audio pipeline and disable EQ as well as disable windows volume control, transferring it to the DAC (only the buttons on the DAC can affect volume).


----------



## alvin59

simpleworld said:


> If I'm understanding your question correctly, these are the key settings that either enable or disable Windows volume control.  There is no "Analog" output to a DAC.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yup im currently using the above settings as well.
I used to be able to control the master volume of the cayin ru6 in windows 10, up till a certain windows update/cayin driver version.

Since then, the master volume on windows 10 acts like a mute/unmute function for the cayin ru6. As a workaround ive been using Eartrumpet to control the volume. helloh3adfi seems to have solved the issue.

*Volume control on Foobar works fine tho.


----------



## Xinlisupreme

I’m loving so much RU6 with Fitear TG334, I can’t believe what I’m hearing.
I connected RU6 to N6ii Ti using UAPP😍


----------



## helloh3adfi (Oct 18, 2022)

alvin59 said:


> Hi, im experiencing the same issue too. Mind sharing how did you switch from "analog output" to "digital output" ? I assume you're on windows ?


I'm using Linux systems. For some reason you can choose digital or analog.

And yeah you have to find some compatible USB cables for the Cayin. Some will be prone to electromagnetic waves, and others had latency issues.


----------



## borkenarrou

helloh3adfi said:


> I'm using Linux systems. For some reason you can choose digital or analog.
> 
> And yeah you have to find some compatible USB cables for the Cayin. Some will be prone to electromagnetic waves, and others had latency issues.


Agree, bought an Amazonbascis cable much less noise than the last one, I gues it was not properly shielded, but I still have keep the phone a bit far away which I guess you can't avoid.


----------



## wheels55

Hi just pulled the trigger on a RU6. Was just wondering if I can use the 3.5mm or 4.4mm out as a DAC to my darkvoice from windows? Anxious to try the combo of R2R and tubes.


----------



## yaps66

I believe you can but there will be double amping since it is not a true line out.  You can use either the single ended or balanced but the advice is to use single ended and to keep the volume at max 70 (this was mentioned somewhere and could be arbitrary but I have tried it without any no issues).


----------



## Xinlisupreme

I plugged Acoustune HS1677ss to RU6, another fantastic matching!
So happy to chose it, but i'd test M15 also


----------



## peterinvan

wheels55 said:


> Hi just pulled the trigger on a RU6. Was just wondering if I can use the 3.5mm or 4.4mm out as a DAC to my darkvoice from windows? Anxious to try the combo of R2R and tubes.


I am not sure about using the balanced out 4.4mm to RCA input to another amplifier.  Won’t this ground the two negative sides of the balanced out circuit?  Is this harmful?


----------



## yaps66

peterinvan said:


> I am not sure about using the balanced out 4.4mm to RCA input to another amplifier.  Won’t this ground the two negative sides of the balanced out circuit?  Is this harmful?


Good point. I am not sure so someone else with the knowledge please chime in! At the moment I am connecting the RU6 to my Aroma A100TB via a 4.4mm to 4.4mm cable. The A100TB has a 4.4mm input.


----------



## Brain Damage (Oct 19, 2022)

It was suggested by Andy Kong to not connect RU6 to an external amp via the 4.4mm output of the Cayin as this only emphasises the distortion/interference/noise caused by the heat from the ladder of resistors.


----------



## Goatsandmonkeys

I just got my RU6. I absolutely love it. I'm hoping to tap into the headfi brain trust for some help. I want to use the RU6 as a DAC with my Cavalli liquid platinum amp. What is the best volume level to use if I am using the SE out to a line level input?


----------



## borkenarrou

wheels55 said:


> Hi just pulled the trigger on a RU6. Was just wondering if I can use the 3.5mm or 4.4mm out as a DAC to my darkvoice from windows? Anxious to try the combo of R2R and tubes.


3.5mm, Darkvoice only support single ended input, you can use a 4.4mm to RCA converter, but it is considered bit risky as can potentially damage the DAC, single ended to balanced conversion is considered fine.


----------



## alvin59

helloh3adfi said:


> I'm using Linux systems. For some reason you can choose digital or analog.
> 
> And yeah you have to find some compatible USB cables for the Cayin. Some will be prone to electromagnetic waves, and others had latency issues.


can confirm the pc volume adjustment works on linux (elementary OS) but not windows.


----------



## peterinvan

alvin59 said:


> can confirm the pc volume adjustment works on linux (elementary OS) but not windows.


On my iPad Pro, USB-C out, the iPad volume control has no effect other than full mute.


----------



## Orfik

Could I connect this to a cheap dap if I wanted Bluetooth functionality out of it?


----------



## twister6

Orfik said:


> Could I connect this to a cheap dap if I wanted Bluetooth functionality out of it?



Get Hiby R2, about $100, and that little dap has 2-way BT and wifi with built in Tidal and Qobuz native apps.


----------



## Orfik

twister6 said:


> Get Hiby R2, about $100, and that little dap has 2-way BT and wifi with built in Tidal and Qobuz native apps.


So to make sure, my idea is to connect the dap to the ru6 via usb then use the dap as a Bluetooth receiver and stream from my phone. Will that work and is it even a good idea?


----------



## Currawong

yaps66 said:


> I believe you can but there will be double amping since it is not a true line out.  You can use either the single ended or balanced but the advice is to use single ended and to keep the volume at max 70 (this was mentioned somewhere and could be arbitrary but I have tried it without any no issues).


It's a fairly moot point, as both a DAC and dongle DACs both use opamps for output/amplification. The difference is usually that a DAC/amp will have a second opamp/amp stage to increase the current output. Given that the input impedance of an amp will be extremely high, this wont matter.


peterinvan said:


> I am not sure about using the balanced out 4.4mm to RCA input to another amplifier.  Won’t this ground the two negative sides of the balanced out circuit?  Is this harmful?


Indeed, use the single-ended 3.5mm output using a 3.5mm to RCA converter cable. That has the most direct output from the DAC anyway.


Goatsandmonkeys said:


> I just got my RU6. I absolutely love it. I'm hoping to tap into the headfi brain trust for some help. I want to use the RU6 as a DAC with my Cavalli liquid platinum amp. What is the best volume level to use if I am using the SE out to a line level input?


The answer is buried in one of Andy's posts I think. Usually, you might want to set the volume of the RU6 to minimum, and the Cavalli to max to bypass the Cavalli's volume control. But, if you hear hiss doing that with no music playing, then go the opposite way. Also, if you hear distortion, then the output of the RU6 is too high for the amp and again, you should set it lower and use the volume control of the amp.


----------



## borkenarrou (Oct 24, 2022)

I connected the RU6 to my Topping A90D, found the volume to be quite low, on RU6 Low Gain, NOS, 85 vol, 3.5mm out (to RCA in A90D), on A90D side, XLR HP out, High Gain, using my HD6xx I need to go upto 75 volume on the A90D to be just ok listening level, using my D90 I need to be about 55 volume on my A90D to achieve same loudness level.


----------



## animalsrush

blacksesame said:


> hey guys, anyone know how to reduce or eliminate the cell phone noise with ru6? I'm using Samsung s10 plus phone and notice it happens a lot.  I'm using stock cable and ru6 with the leather case


Try this ..worked for me. Got it from Amazon. Also provides subtle sound enhancement 

GUCraftsman USB C Type C to Type C Headphone Amplifier Cable 6N Single Crystal Silver for FiiO BTR5 Q1 Q3 Q3s Qudelix 5K xDuoo Link2 XD-05PLUS E1DA 9038G3 9038S 9038D Lotoo PAW S2¡ https://a.co/d/gTpseA8


----------



## blacksesame

animalsrush said:


> Try this ..worked for me. Got it from Amazon. Also provides subtle sound enhancement
> 
> GUCraftsman USB C Type C to Type C Headphone Amplifier Cable 6N Single Crystal Silver for FiiO BTR5 Q1 Q3 Q3s Qudelix 5K xDuoo Link2 XD-05PLUS E1DA 9038G3 9038S 9038D Lotoo PAW S2¡ https://a.co/d/gTpseA8


thanks but import to Canada makes it almost double in price. I'll see if I can find this elsewhere


----------



## borkenarrou (Oct 26, 2022)

blacksesame said:


> thanks but import to Canada makes it almost double in price. I'll see if I can find this elsewhere


I have this Amazon Basics one (3ft), working flawlessly, the supplied cable had lots of noise, now no noise at all, quality I feel is quite good and cheap too, the trick is to keep the phone away from the dongle by about a foot or so.

Amazon Basics Aluminum Braided 100W USB-C to USB-C 2.0 Cable with Power Delivery - 3-Foot, Gray https://a.co/d/bj24tbc


----------



## blacksesame

borkenarrou said:


> I have this Amazon Basics one (3ft), working flawlessly, the supplied cable had lots of noise, now no noise at all, quality I feel is quite good and cheap too, the trick is to keep the phone away from the dongle by about a foot or so.
> 
> Amazon Basics Aluminum Braided 100W USB-C to USB-C 2.0 Cable with Power Delivery - 3-Foot, Gray https://a.co/d/bj24tbc


thanks but for traveling with it..I find 3 ft too long. I think ill try to find the gucraftsman. will wait for Ali 11.11 sales


----------



## dakchi

You should try DD TC09S. It is an excellent cable and very well built


----------



## Tybot

Are there any cares other than the blue and orange from Cayin?


----------



## wheels55 (Oct 28, 2022)

Mine finally arrived and sounds great! Question though is it normal for the playback speed to occasionally go weird (too slow or fast) using musicbee. It happens if I fast forward or rapidly skip tracks? It's usually rectified by unplugging and plugging back into the PC


----------



## jairhifi

wheels55 said:


> Mine finally arrived and sounds great! Question though is it normal for the playback speed to occasionally go weird (too slow or fast) using musicbee. It happens if I fast forward or rapidly skip tracks? It's usually rectified by unplugging and plugging back into the PC


it never happened to me... sounds really weird. what if you use another player?


----------



## wheels55

jairhifi said:


> it never happened to me... sounds really weird. what if you use another player?


I'm suspecting it's musicbee causing it. Will give it a try in foobar and see what happens... thanks. Main objective is fulfilled though. Sounds really great feeding the darkvoice 336se


----------



## borkenarrou

wheels55 said:


> Mine finally arrived and sounds great! Question though is it normal for the playback speed to occasionally go weird (too slow or fast) using musicbee. It happens if I fast forward or rapidly skip tracks? It's usually rectified by unplugging and plugging back into the PC


In my case it's almost always the attached phone, if i am using the phone or some app starting while connected to the RU6 it disrupt the playback sometimes.


----------



## jairhifi

borkenarrou said:


> In my case it's almost always the attached phone, if i am using the phone or some app starting while connected to the RU6 it disrupt the playback sometimes.


I'm using UAPP on the phone, and no problems at all... but should be the same on any player... if you could try different players and other phones and check if the problem still there


----------



## peterinvan

*iPhone 6 will not drive Cayin RU6*

I tried max volume on the iPhone 6, and the RU6 just lights up, but no music.  Using only the FLAC Player app on the iPhone.

I bought the FiiO KA3 for my phone.  
Works well, but not the sound quality I get from the RU6 out of my iPad Pro USB-C.


----------



## helloh3adfi

Never tried it, but is it possible to drive 2 IEMs out of the R6 simultaneously? One SE, other Balanced?


----------



## TYATYA

helloh3adfi said:


> Never tried it, but is it possible to drive 2 IEMs out of the R6 simultaneously? One SE, other Balanced?


1000% it's okay!
I mean no smoke, no harmful... It sounds. 


peterinvan said:


> *iPhone 6 will not drive Cayin RU6*
> 
> I tried max volume on the iPhone 6, and the RU6 just lights up, but no music.  Using only the FLAC Player app on the iPhone.
> 
> ...


You can try feeding ru6 by external energy source like using a adapter allow you to plug both ru6 and batter pack into it, then it plug into your ip6.
It's said that ip6 lacking supply power to ru6 properly. Someone just use apprx 60% vol bcs that reason


----------



## helloh3adfi

TYATYA said:


> 1000% it's okay!
> I mean no smoke, no harmful... It sounds.


I was just wondering because Fiio KA3 seems not to be able to power 2 outputs simultaneously. I could use the RU6 to burn in 2 IEMs at once.


----------



## TYATYA

A track to see how NOS and OS sounds.
I plug it to hd800s, 4.4 jack, vol 87, L gain, directly driven. 
Mid imagine center focus with NOS and Highs extend on OS.


----------



## oldkid

RU6 still manages to surprise me after all this time listening to it almost daily. Tonight, I'ce decided to give my FiiO LT TC1 USB cable another try, and to my surprise the sound difference was immediately noticeable. There is a boost in clarity, almost to the point of sounding like a chip based DAC.

The complete audio chain was:
Streaming Qobuz and Tidal playlist from Mconnect. Upsampling to DSD 128 with Neutron Player. 

FiiO USB cable => RU6 at max volume in NOS mode, 4.4mm balanced output => Aune X7s 2021 on 0dB gain setting => Focal Elex with XLR balanced cable and fenestrated sheepskin Dekoni pads.

This setup sounds remarkably close to my Tempotec Sonata E44, but just a tad smoother.

Clarity and detail perception are definitely boosted compared to generic USB cables


----------



## wheels55

In regards to my original post this pairing is everything I hoped. Never heard acoustic guitars so life like !


----------



## Brain Damage

Please help. I purchased a usb c splitter adapter so that I could charge my phone whilst listening to my RU6 simultaneously. 

It didn't work and now when I plug my RU6 directly into my android, the usb power supply/file transfer dialogue box opens. Phone not recognising it as a dac.

What do I do to fix this issue?


----------



## peterinvan

Brain Damage said:


> Please help. I purchased a usb c splitter adapter so that I could charge my phone whilst listening to my RU6 simultaneously.
> 
> It didn't work and now when I plug my RU6 directly into my android, the usb power supply/file transfer dialogue box opens. Phone not recognising it as a dac.
> 
> What do I do to fix this issue?


I assume you did the old cold boot on the phone?


----------



## borkenarrou

There maybe static buildup in one of capacitor/resistor, you can try the following without the phone attached, get a 3.5mm aux cable and insert one end to the RU6 and the other end to any conductive metal surface (make sure to touch all the layered pins), then do the same thing using a USB-C cable on the other side if the circuit is isolated, phone shutdown-restart as adviced by @peterinvan, try the RU6 after 10 mins or so.

I didn't try a Y-splitter, but have a powered Anker USB-C hub which worked.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

If their suggestions don't work you can also go into the developer settings and change your default USB settings. I found with at least one other DAC (not the RU6) that changing the default USB setting to a random option and then back to no data transfer "reset" the USB connection with the DAC so my phone started recognizing the DAC again. Obviously YMMV, but it's easy to do and has worked for me before.

If you're interested, the DAC I did this with was the ifi Hip DAC. This was a few years ago when my Moto G8 stopped recognizing my Hip DAC after I had updated it's firmware on my laptop.


----------



## TYATYA

Brain Damage said:


> Please help. I purchased a usb c splitter adapter so that I could charge my phone whilst listening to my RU6 simultaneously.
> 
> It didn't work and now when I plug my RU6 directly into my android, the usb power supply/file transfer dialogue box opens. Phone not recognising it as a dac.
> 
> What do I do to fix this issue?


Unless there was wrong connection due to the cable (ex.feed 5v to data line), your ru6 still alive.
I plugged mine to samsung charge all days long when I warm it up.
It is safe!
FYI, usbc port is 5V in and usba is where ru6 plugged in


----------



## dakchi

I need help: I am using RU6 with my Macbook Pro M1 Pro. Since I upgraded to MACOS Ventura, the Macbook does not recognize sometimes RU6 when I plug it in through USB C. RU6 is not in the list of sound output. I have to reboot my Macbook to have it back. Does anyone of you have the same problem?


----------



## Brain Damage

peterinvan said:


> I assume you did the old cold boot on the phone?


Yes - this was my first point of call.


----------



## Brain Damage

JAnonymous5150 said:


> If their suggestions don't work you can also go into the developer settings and change your default USB settings. I found with at least one other DAC (not the RU6) that changing the default USB setting to a random option and then back to no data transfer "reset" the USB connection with the DAC so my phone started recognizing the DAC again. Obviously YMMV, but it's easy to do and has worked for me before.
> 
> If you're interested, the DAC I did this with was the ifi Hip DAC. This was a few years ago when my Moto G8 stopped recognizing my Hip DAC after I had updated it's firmware on my laptop.


I will give this a go. Thanks


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Brain Damage said:


> I will give this a go. Thanks


*Fingers Crossed* 🤞


----------



## Brain Damage

JAnonymous5150 said:


> *Fingers Crossed* 🤞


So, after trying all hints and tips, my RU6 is still not working. Absolutely gutted 😢😢😢


----------



## peterinvan

Brain Damage said:


> So, after trying all hints and tips, my RU6 is still not working. Absolutely gutted 😢😢😢


Have you tried another device, like iPad, Windows PC?


----------



## Brain Damage

peterinvan said:


> Have you tried another device, like iPad, Windows PC?


Yeah, I tried it through my laptop with Audirvana.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Brain Damage said:


> So, after trying all hints and tips, my RU6 is still not working. Absolutely gutted 😢😢😢



Wow. I'm sorry it didn't help. I think it might be time to contact your seller and/or Cayin and setup an RMA. You could also ask them if they have any tips you can try that we didn't think of. I wish I had something more helpful to say, but I don't. Equipment failures and having to deal with RMAs sucks. 

That said, I have actually dealt with Cayin for getting my N3 repaired after it's screen got shattered in a car accident and they were actually very quick once it got to them and sent it back with a new outer shell and case too at no extra cost. I only paid for the screen, but they saw a ding and scratches on the body that happened during the crash as well and went the extra mile and replaced it. For that all I did was contact the dealer I purchased the DAP through and Cayin agreed to perform the work and sent me the shipping details and even setup the logistics so that I just paid a reasonable shipping fee with my credit card and printed off a label they sent me. The whole thing was actually pretty painless.


----------



## TYATYA

Brain Damage said:


> So, after trying all hints and tips, my RU6 is still not working. Absolutely gutted 😢😢😢


Do this and keep a day.
Then try again plugging ru6 to a laptop, phone...
I think, if there was something wrong with your cable, adapter...that lead to 5V line feeding to data line -> your ru6 was death.
If it it wasn't, your ru6 still be alive


----------



## JohanneMusic

Hello,

I have been lent a Cayin RU6 by an audio friend who thought I might like the sound of the R2R Dac - which he is right about! Maybe it's all imagination, but compared to my Dragonfly Red, which I have used as a DAC until now, the Cayin just sounds distinctly... "more musical" and/or "more real". Hard to describe, but I'm sure you know what differences I'm talking about . So: I must now also have an R2R DAC.

Now I'm spoiled for choice: I can either buy a new RU6, of which I know what I'm getting, or I can buy a used Audio-GD R2R-11 (not MK2). Price-wise, both cost about the same.

Does anyone have experience and can tell me which one sounds "better"? Or where the differences are? The sound is most important to me, that the RU6 for example is portable, I do not care much.

Especially important to me is the reproduction of voices. Damien Rice, Nick Drake, Sun Kil Moon, this is the kind of music I like to listen to the most.

Many greetings


----------



## OCC7N

Im in search for a cheap portable setup that will give my laptop alittle upgrade:

I have purchased Sony 1AM2 headphones, and now need a good dac for it.

Is Cayin RU6 the only small/portable R2R dac?


----------



## oldkid

OCC7N said:


> Im in search for a cheap portable setup that will give my laptop alittle upgrade:
> 
> I have purchased Sony 1AM2 headphones, and now need a good dac for it.
> 
> Is Cayin RU6 the only small/portable R2R dac?


Pretty much, yes. The only other choice that I know of would be something like the Hiby RS2 which is a DAP, so it's inherently less pocketable and more expensive


----------



## OCC7N

oldkid said:


> Pretty much, yes. The only other choice that I know of would be something like the Hiby RS2 which is a DAP, so it's inherently less pocketable and more expensive


Im going to test Cayin RU6 I got excited. I will demo it for a while. I will compare it between iFi Diablo.


----------



## TYATYA

2 things waiting for your comments.

1. Usb cable makes sq improvement
2. External (via an usbC/hdmi multi adapter) power feeding sq improvement.


----------



## OCC7N

TYATYA said:


> 2 things waiting for your comments.
> 
> 1. Usb cable makes sq improvement
> 2. External (via an usbC/hdmi multi adapter) power feeding sq improvement.


Which lightning cable can you recommend?


----------



## TYATYA

OCC7N said:


> Which lightning cable can you recommend?


Im not on ip but android.
A 100w PD power cable.


----------



## dakchi (Nov 10, 2022)

Fixed


----------



## davide256

Liking the RU6 very much. It has its limitations as a portable DAC, really need OS enabled for good treble and the leading edge of notes are fuzzy
compared to the sharpness of a Chord Mojo. But its meaty, much more engaging for me than a Mojo. Putting it into a main system with HQPlayer
DSD up-sampling is a real treat, most of the leading edge fuzziness goes away, Not as smooth as a Denafrips Ares II but I think its a better balanced sound


----------



## oldkid

davide256 said:


> Liking the RU6 very much. It has its limitations as a portable DAC, really need OS enabled for good treble and the leading edge of notes are fuzzy
> compared to the sharpness of a Chord Mojo. But its meaty, much more engaging for me than a Mojo. Putting it into a main system with HQPlayer
> DSD up-sampling is a real treat, most of the leading edge fuzziness goes away, Not as smooth as a Denafrips Ares II but I think its a better balanced sound


I always listen to my RU6 with DSD upsampling too, even when streaming from Qobuz and Tidal on the go


----------



## animalsrush

davide256 said:


> Liking the RU6 very much. It has its limitations as a portable DAC, really need OS enabled for good treble and the leading edge of notes are fuzzy
> compared to the sharpness of a Chord Mojo. But its meaty, much more engaging for me than a Mojo. Putting it into a main system with HQPlayer
> DSD up-sampling is a real treat, most of the leading edge fuzziness goes away, Not as smooth as a Denafrips Ares II but I think its a better balanced sound


You got me thinking there. I always used NOS before because I thought it added body to the overall making it more analog sounding. After reading this I thought let me try and there is subtle difference with highs making them airy and I love this sound better. Initially before the burn In period I really couldn’t tell the difference much but now I can definitely hear the subtle change


----------



## OCC7N

Something that could be interesting is finding the smallest player(size of cayin) and connect it to cayin.

That could be awesome.


----------



## TYATYA

animalsrush said:


> You got me thinking there. I always used NOS before because I thought it added body to the overall making it more analog sounding. After reading this I thought let me try and there is subtle difference with highs making them airy and I love this sound better. Initially before the burn In period I really couldn’t tell the difference much but now I can definitely hear the subtle change


I heard the difference right after first day of use and realize a quick toggle for NOS/OS is my wish.
Not always Os or NOS sounds better to my ears. It depending on tracks.
For airy, DS chip like, go to OS.
For organic, realistic,  blooming and center forcus vocal, go to NOS.

Adding external DC 5V line to the ru6, it will sounds more solid, more airy and layering of highs.
Dont know why. It is like volume increase a bit when feed by external power (I am not sure and cant measure)


----------



## cybergalaxy

TYATYA said:


> I heard the difference right after first day of use and realize a quick toggle for NOS/OS is my wish.
> Not always Os or NOS sounds better to my ears. It depending on tracks.
> For airy, DS chip like, go to OS.
> For organic, realistic,  blooming and center forcus vocal, go to NOS.
> ...


How did you add external DC 5V please?


----------



## TYATYA

cybergalaxy said:


> How did you add external DC 5V please?


I use this one from Amz
USB Type C HDMI 変換アダプタ, USB3.1，PD... https://www.amazon.jp/dp/B0821QRJCB?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share


----------



## OCC7N

TYATYA said:


> I use this one from Amz
> USB Type C HDMI 変換アダプタ, USB3.1，PD... https://www.amazon.jp/dp/B0821QRJCB?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share


Please explain this does not make sense to me.

You rather use an extra “hub” than just plug it in the same usb port or other?


----------



## OCC7N

You mean like this?
USB C OTG Adapter with Power, USB C Splitter with 60W USB C Charging and USB A Female Compatible with Chromecast with Google TV/Samsung S21 S20 S20+ Ultra Tab S8/Pixel 5 4 4 XL /LG V40 V30/3D Printer
https://a.co/d/fC6oimN


----------



## TYATYA (Nov 11, 2022)

OCC7N said:


> Please explain this does not make sense to me.
> 
> You rather use an extra “hub” than just plug it in the same usb port or other?



Cable1: if it is the comes in box of B&O headphone -> pop/click happen, even it still sounds
I use Anker PD100W cable as cable1, good.
Compare to short cabe of ru6: more holograph while stock cable 2D, in plane sounds.
Cable2: nothing to note

Addition:
Pop/click I found on cable (luckky the stock cable of ru6 is ok on this term) is very subtle but surely confirmed it comes from the cable. It can be easily think the cause is pop/click of recording track.
If someone facing pop/click, lets change the cable.


----------



## TYATYA

OCC7N said:


> You mean like this?
> USB C OTG Adapter with Power, USB C Splitter with 60W USB C Charging and USB A Female Compatible with Chromecast with Google TV/Samsung S21 S20 S20+ Ultra Tab S8/Pixel 5 4 4 XL /LG V40 V30/3D Printer
> https://a.co/d/fC6oimN


Seeing this pic I don’t know which, laptop or charger will feed 5V DC to the usb disk.
It shows you can get usb disk conmecting same time while/with the charging.

My hub/dongle feed 5V to ru6 by charging cable (AC charger, batter pack...). When I unplug my phone, ru6 still on (ofcouse just power on, no digital signal)


----------



## dakchi

I am using DD TC28I for the same purpose. It allows me to drive headphones that are hard to drive with my RU6


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Johnfg465vd said:


> Any owners of ThieAudio Oracle or Excalibur here? How does it pair with the RU6? I'm planing to get one of these IEMs.
> 
> As someone who thinks Blessing 2 is a bit shouty and bright, do you think I'll have issues with Oracle or Excalibur? or would pairing it with my RU6 balance things out in the higher frequencies.



I don't know if you're still wondering about this, but I just got my Excaliburs like two weeks ago and as someone who also finds the B2s to be shouty, I can tell you that you won't have a problem with the Excaliburs at all. They higher frequencies on them are very nicely done, kicking out A LOT of detail, without even a hint of shoutiness or sibilance. 

I sold my OG Oracles and replaced them with the Excaliburs because I wanted that slight v shaped tuning and I felt like the Oracles were too similar to other IEMs I owned. I would add that the graphs I have seen floating around of the Excaliburs are a bit deceptive. They indicate a moderate V when in reality they are a very mild, but noticeable, V. And, yes, they pair quite well with my RU6.

If you have any specific questions feel free to ask. Heck, you probably already dealt with this issue, but I came across your post in a search and figured I would answer anyways, just in case.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I don't know if you're still wondering about this, but I just got my Excaliburs like two weeks ago and as someone who also finds the B2s to be shouty, I can tell you that you won't have a problem with the Excaliburs at all. They higher frequencies on them are very nicely done, kicking out A LOT of detail, without even a hint of shoutiness or sibilance.
> 
> I sold my OG Oracles and replaced them with the Excaliburs because I wanted that slight v shaped tuning and I felt like the Oracles were too similar to other IEMs I owned. I would add that the graphs I have seen floating around of the Excaliburs are a bit deceptive. They indicate a moderate V when in reality they are a very mild, but noticeable, V. And, yes, they pair quite well with my RU6.
> 
> If you have any specific questions feel free to ask. Heck, you probably already dealt with this issue, but I came across your post in a search and figured I would answer anyways, just in case.


Thanks for taking the time. Since there weren't many comparisons at the time, I went with the Hook-X out of caution and have been happy since.

I'll probably get a Tribrid later on when I feel the need to upgrade so I'll keep your impressions of Excalibur in mind.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Johnfg465vd said:


> Thanks for taking the time. Since there weren't many comparisons at the time, I went with the Hook-X out of caution and have been happy since.
> 
> I'll probably get a Tribrid later on when I feel the need to upgrade so I'll keep your impressions of Excalibur in mind.



No problem. I figured with how fast this hobby generally moves that you had likely already moved on. Anyways, I'm glad the Hook-X is working out for you. Are you running it off an RU6?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

JAnonymous5150 said:


> No problem. I figured with how fast this hobby generally moves that you had likely already moved on. Anyways, I'm glad the Hook-X is working out for you. Are you running it off an RU6?


I was using it with the RU6 but have since moved on to BTR7. For me the main problem with RU6 was battery drain followed by slight issue with the RU6's ability to resolve and separate sounds in the higher regions.

The BTR7 fixes these issues and adds a lot more features but I do miss the musicality of R2R a bit. I planning to get the HiBy RS2 which should be a good sonic upgrade over both and still be portable enough.


----------



## Orfik

This is a strange dongle. It's resolving but not detailed, bright but rolled off, the bass is full yet soft and it's technically weak but it sounds beautiful.


----------



## borkenarrou

Orfik said:


> This is a strange dongle. It's resolving but not detailed, bright but rolled off, the bass is full yet soft and it's technically weak but it sounds beautiful.


Magic of R2R


----------



## simon740

Hello,

anyone use LG V series phone with this RU6? I have LG V40 and Moondrop Aria. 

regards,
Simon


----------



## Johnfg465vd

simon740 said:


> Hello,
> 
> anyone use LG V series phone with this RU6? I have LG V40 and Moondrop Aria.
> 
> ...


I've tried RU6 with LG G7, G8x & V60. Is there anything you wanna know about the pairing?


----------



## simon740

Johnfg465vd said:


> I've tried RU6 with LG G7, G8x & V60. Is there anything you wanna know about the pairing?


Hello,

any problems with connection? I use UAPP on V40.

regards,
Simon


----------



## Johnfg465vd

simon740 said:


> Hello,
> 
> any problems with connection? I use UAPP on V40.
> 
> ...


I did have one small issue, the supplied Type-C Cable did not work with my LG V60 (did not test with other phones) I had other Cables and those worked fine, so maybe my unit had a faulty Cable.

Right now I'm using the OEAudio Cable but other Cables like the one that came with Gryphon, AmazonBasic Cable... Work fine.

Apart from that, there are no issues with the pairing.


----------



## simon740

Johnfg465vd said:


> I did have one small issue, the supplied Type-C Cable did not work with my LG V60 (did not test with other phones) I had other Cables and those worked fine, so maybe my unit had a faulty Cable.
> 
> Right now I'm using the OEAudio Cable but other Cables like the one that came with Gryphon, AmazonBasic Cable... Work fine.
> 
> Apart from that, there are no issues with the pairing.


Thank you. What about EMI interferences?


----------



## Johnfg465vd

simon740 said:


> Thank you. What about EMI interferences?


No issues with EMI. I have had that issue with Sparrow & Mojo but not with BTR7.


----------



## simon740

Johnfg465vd said:


> No issues with EMI. I have had that issue with Sparrow & Mojo but not with BTR7.


Thank you. I think I will try this RU6. I had Ares II in my speaker system so I like R2R sound.

regards,
Simon


----------



## borkenarrou (Nov 13, 2022)

simon740 said:


> Thank you. I think I will try this RU6. I had Ares II in my speaker system so I like R2R sound.
> 
> regards,
> Simon


Once you get it please share your impression of the RU6 vs the Ares II, I am also interested in getting an Ares II, currently using the RU6 in my main system as a cheap R2R solution.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

simon740 said:


> Thank you. I think I will try this RU6. I had Ares II in my speaker system so I like R2R sound.
> 
> regards,
> Simon


Just keep in mind that when adjusting volume you get small pops occationally that get a bit annoying. Also, while there is no EMI, there is a very slight improvement in sound using clean sources like DAPs, Phones (with Airplane mode)... vs using with Laptops and PCs.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

borkenarrou said:


> Once you get it pleasr share your impression of the RU6 vs the Ares II, I am also interested in getting an Ares II, currently using the RU6 in my main system as a cheap R2R solution.


There is no competition, I have auditioned Ares II (with Burson Soloist 3X) and own EF400 both of which are a few levels above RU6, even when using IEMs. Most notable changes are in details, Imaging precision and Bass weight among other things.


----------



## borkenarrou

Johnfg465vd said:


> There is no competition, I have auditioned Ares II (with Burson Soloist 3X) and own EF400 both of which are a few levels above RU6, even when using IEMs. Most notable changes are in details, Imaging precision and Bass weight among other things.



That is great to hear!I I too wanted a Burson Soloist 3XP but instead opted for a Violectric V280, because some said that while the soundtage width of the 3XP is good but it is  somewhat less compared tp other class-A amps (in the 1k or above range), did you notice the Ares II remedy this a bit because R2R is known to providfe a bigger soundstage, my only concerns is my HEKv2 has a good soundtage and I dont want to affect that.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

borkenarrou said:


> That is great to hear!I I too wanted a Burson Soloist 3XP but instead opted for a Violectric V280, because some said that while the soundtage width of the 3XP is good but it is  somewhat less compared tp other class-A amps (in the 1k or above range), did you notice the Ares II remedy this a bit because R2R is known to providfe a bigger soundstage, my only concerns is my HEKv2 has a good soundtage and I dont want to affect that.


The V280 isn't available here so I've decided to get the Singxer SA-1 instead. The 3XP was nice but in my limited time testing, it wasn't a big enough upgrade over SA-1 for the cost.


----------



## borkenarrou

Johnfg465vd said:


> The V280 isn't available here so I've decided to get the Singxer SA-1 instead. The 3XP was nice but in my limited time testing, it wasn't a big enough upgrade over SA-1 for the cost.


There are advantages of the 3XP over the V280 like better resolution and power, I hope you got the Supercharger too as most people says it increase the performance of the 3XP.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

borkenarrou said:


> There are advantages of the 3XP over the V280 like better resolution and power, I hope you got the Supercharger too as most people says it increase the performance of the 3XP.


No, I did not get to try the SuperCharger. I'm happy with my Desktop setup at the moment but will give the 3XP or 3XP GT with SuperCharger a try when I feel the need to upgrade.


----------



## Orfik

borkenarrou said:


> Magic of R2R


Apparently. I've never had something make me care so little about its obvious and significant shortcomings because the presentation is so good. I can't take them out.


----------



## TYATYA (Nov 14, 2022)

Orfik said:


> Apparently. I've never had something make me care so little about its obvious and significant shortcomings because the presentation is so good. I can't take them out.


My SP1000 sound much virtually since I heard ru6.
Sometimes my brain can not determine position of singer.
Its sound like Iriver trick audio with echoing and reverb, at very tiny quantity...
I found it in the pass when I goes to SP1000 from AK120ii but not much. Also I feel hash/rough in 120ii after months I listen to 1000 then try 120ii again.

But ru6 sound with sharpness as like 120ii but nothing hash. Smooth, sweet but not lacking detail. Quick kicking, direct and straight sounding but musical. It's magical.


Addendum: Does anyone here try DDhifi TC09S for ru6?
Tear drop pricy 😞 
I do think improvement in sq but how much compare to a good PD usbC cable?


----------



## dakchi

TYATYA said:


> My SP1000 sound much virtually since I heard ru6.
> Sometimes my brain can not determine position of singer.
> Its sound like Iriver trick audio with echoing and reverb, at very tiny quantity...
> I found it in the pass when I goes to SP1000 from AK120ii but not much. Also I feel hash/rough in 120ii after months I listen to 1000 then try 120ii again.
> ...


I am using DDhifi TC09S with my RU6. It is the best build quality cable I have seen so far. With regards to the sound, it is a bit more airy and detailed compared to stock cable, but don't expect it to be night and day difference


----------



## yaps66

TYATYA said:


> My SP1000 sound much virtually since I heard ru6.
> Sometimes my brain can not determine position of singer.
> Its sound like Iriver trick audio with echoing and reverb, at very tiny quantity...
> I found it in the pass when I goes to SP1000 from AK120ii but not much. Also I feel hash/rough in 120ii after months I listen to 1000 then try 120ii again.
> ...





dakchi said:


> I am using DDhifi TC09S with my RU6. It is the best build quality cable I have seen so far. With regards to the sound, it is a bit more airy and detailed compared to stock cable, but don't expect it to be night and day difference


I too am using the DDhifi TC09S. it is a great cable both from the build and sonic perspectives. I agree with @dakchi that it is more airy and detailed compared to stock. I have also discovered that the connection to my PC is much more stable. Roon recognises it immediately whereas with stock I often have to reconnect it to be recognised. I am very happy with the DDhifi TC09S.


----------



## BS5711

yaps66 said:


> I too am using the DDhifi TC09S. it is a great cable both from the build and sonic perspectives. I agree with @dakchi that it is more airy and detailed compared to stock. I have also discovered that the connection to my PC is much more stable. Roon recognises it immediately whereas with stock I often have to reconnect it to be recognised. I am very happy with the DDhifi TC09S.



I am in agreement.

I use the short TC09S with iFi Go Bar.

It is an incredibly well built cable and as others have said it seems to create a slightly cleaner, crisper, open and airy sound. Not night and day but noticeable I think ….. could be placebo with fancy expensive cable ! 😂


----------



## maceto

BS5711 said:


> I am in agreement.
> 
> I use the short TC09S with iFi Go Bar.
> 
> It is an incredibly well built cable and as others have said it seems to create a slightly cleaner, crisper, open and airy sound. Not night and day but noticeable I think ….. could be placebo with fancy expensive cable ! 😂


+1 I use it with my Mojo2 - it’s a little short and the usb - c itself seems to be a millimeter larger than standard to get a snug fit in my MacBook Pro.


----------



## davide256 (Nov 15, 2022)

Having some fun now using the RU6 balanced 4.4 mm to XLR on class D amp. Not as solid or deep in the bass as a NOS Metrum Octave but with upsampling to 384 or DSD it’s far cleaner and more detailed, the Octave only goes to 192k, no DSD


----------



## TYATYA

yaps66 said:


> I too am using the DDhifi TC09S. it is a great cable both from the build and sonic perspectives. I agree with @dakchi that it is more airy and detailed compared to stock. I have also discovered that the connection to my PC is much more stable. Roon recognises it immediately whereas with stock I often have to reconnect it to be recognised. I am very happy with the DDhifi TC09S.


Imediately found super fast responding when plugging, even more than my Anker 100W PD can do.
Stock cable not only slow it make 2,3 or 4 times plug/unplug sometimes to got a connection.
Sonic quality: I heard a much detail in bass, feeling of bass texture very well, fast attack and quick cut-off. No tail, no slowly decay. 
Stock cable sound just bloat, dull bass
It less rumble but high quality of beat.
3D sound field with good spacing of instruments. So clean and clear.
If 5 core is for stock one, 8 is for a well build one as 100W PD charging cable and 9 for TC09s


----------



## sjssusma

I've enjoyed this amp/dac so far and love the tube like sound qualitys its given with my thieaudio clairvoyance.


----------



## davide256

Using the balanced connection is quite an improvement over single ended connection to main stereo system. There is treble irritation I’ve been struggling to tame with RCA that greatly diminished using 4.4 mm <>XLR  cable to amp. Overall effect is a softening, less harshness. Was skeptical about balanced vs singled ended but now I really want to order balanced for Meze 99 classics to compare


----------



## peterinvan (Nov 21, 2022)

davide256 said:


> Using the balanced connection is quite an improvement over single ended connection to main stereo system. There is treble irritation I’ve been struggling to tame with RCA that greatly diminished using 4.4 mm <>XLR  cable to amp. Overall effect is a softening, less harshness. Was skeptical about balanced vs singled ended but now I really want to order balanced for Meze 99 classics to compare


I have the Meze 4.4mm balanced cable, and it drives my Meze 109 Pros, and Elegia nicely.  It would be easy to add 3.5mm mono sockets to your Grados, if you are handy with a soldering iron.

.https://headphonebar.com/collections/cables-and-cases/products/meze-99-balanced-2-5mm-cable


----------



## davide256

peterinvan said:


> I have the Meze 4.4mm balanced cable, and it drives my Meze 109 Pros, and Elegia nicely.  It would be easy to add 3.5mm mono sockets to your Grados, if you are handy with a soldering iron.
> 
> .https://headphonebar.com/collections/cables-and-cases/products/meze-99-balanced-2-5mm-cable


What I really want to try is balanced with Audeze LCD 1 but can’t seem to find a cable for sale because of their dual channel headphone jacks


----------



## Brain Damage

Well, I am delighted to say that after sending my RU6 back to the retailer for extensive testing, I am getting a replacement unit sent out. I should receive it today - can't wait. Long live the RU6.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Brain Damage said:


> Well, I am delighted to say that after sending my RU6 back to the retailer for extensive testing, I am getting a replacement unit sent out. I should receive it today - can't wait. Long live the RU6.



Did they happen to tell you what they found wrong with it?


----------



## Andykong

After taking a long break, I finally return to my computer and lurk around quietly. Turns out I didn't miss my Facebook but I miss this forum. 

I spent a few days checking out discussions and PMs. I read a lot of greetings and support, more than I deserved. Thank you all sincerely. I'll respond to all the PMs "briefly" if they are not outdated or resolved already. However, I can't cover the questions of discussion that were addressed to Cayin or me in various product threads during my absence, so please pardon my silence if you have @ me in this thread but I didn't get back to your question after I resume duty.

By the way, 2023 will be a fascinating year for Cayin, with lots of exciting ideas queueing up for their 30th Anniversary, COVID makes it impossible to drop by and check out these new developments in person, but l am looking forward to them.


----------



## Andykong

davide256 said:


> Using the balanced connection is quite an improvement over single ended connection to main stereo system. There is treble irritation I’ve been struggling to tame with RCA that greatly diminished using 4.4 mm <>XLR  cable to amp. Overall effect is a softening, less harshness. Was skeptical about balanced vs singled ended but now I really want to order balanced for Meze 99 classics to compare



Sounds like you have a very transparent amplifier in your main stereo system. Is that a speaker system or full-size headphone system?


----------



## davide256

Main system, Orchard Audio GaN mono blocks connected to Magnepan 1.7's. 

Any chance of a  future enhanced version of the RU6 thats unfettered by mobile player power constraints?


----------



## Brain Damage

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Did they happen to tell you what they found wrong with it?


Sadly not no.


----------



## peterinvan (Nov 23, 2022)

davide256 said:


> What I really want to try is balanced with Audeze LCD 1 but can’t seem to find a cable for sale because of their dual channel headphone jacks


There are several choices on Amazon and Ebay


----------



## o0genesis0o

Andykong said:


> After taking a long break, I finally return to my computer and lurk around quietly. Turns out I didn't miss my Facebook but I miss this forum.
> 
> I spent a few days checking out discussions and PMs. I read a lot of greetings and support, more than I deserved. Thank you all sincerely. I'll respond to all the PMs "briefly" if they are not outdated or resolved already. However, I can't cover the questions of discussion that were addressed to Cayin or me in various product threads during my absence, so please pardon my silence if you have @ me in this thread but I didn't get back to your question after I resume duty.
> 
> By the way, 2023 will be a fascinating year for Cayin, with lots of exciting ideas queueing up for their 30th Anniversary, COVID makes it impossible to drop by and check out these new developments in person, but l am looking forward to them.



Hey, you are back! Last time we "met" was the Advar tour. Welcome back, mate.


----------



## peterinvan (Nov 23, 2022)

See Audeze cable options on Amazon and Ebay


----------



## maceto

dakchi said:


> I found the reason why I had sound cuts randomly when listening to music with my RU6 over Macbook Pro: it is weird but when I browse internet with Chrome, I have these cuts. As soon as I close Chrome windows, I don't have them. I don't understand why. Is Chrome interfering with RU6? can someone listen to RU with Macbook while browsing in Chrome and confirm he has sound cuts?


I have this with Mojo2 at times - any browser.


----------



## wheels55

Amazing that synergistic moment when the chain all works. RU6 to Little Dot 1+ with Voshkod 6AK5 tubes and Burson V5i opamp. to Beyerdynamic DT880 32 ohm. Feel fair and square in the recording studio!


----------



## DBaldock9

wheels55 said:


> Amazing that synergistic moment when the chain all works. RU6 to Little Dot 1+ with Voshkod 6AK5 tubes and Burson V5i opamp. to Beyerdynamic DT880 32 ohm. Feel fair and square in the recording studio!



I remember my folks having the 8-Track Tape of Tom Jones' 1967 album, "Green, Green Grass of Home", that we listened to on a portable 8-Track player, when we were out camping.


----------



## Brain Damage (Nov 27, 2022)

wheels55 said:


> Amazing that synergistic moment when the chain all works. RU6 to Little Dot 1+ with Voshkod 6AK5 tubes and Burson V5i opamp. to Beyerdynamic DT880 32 ohm. Feel fair and square in the recording studio!


I have had that moment too - RU6 with Beyer DT880s (source: Audirvana). I feel like I am in the studio with Tom Waits during his Closer album. Surely sound quality cannot get much better than this? 
Sooo glad I got my replacement RU6 - I was like a fish without air for a few days.


----------



## baru8

My RU6 work great whit my DAP & Tidal as a source.

RU6 on my notebook Windows 11 & Tidal, plays "masters" only 48 KHz.
Sampling NOS is enabled.
Any suggestion to fix it ?


----------



## TYATYA (Nov 27, 2022)

baru8 said:


> My RU6 work great whit my DAP & Tidal as a source.
> 
> RU6 on my notebook Windows 11 & Tidal, plays "masters" only 48 KHz.
> Sampling NOS is enabled.
> Any suggestion to fix it ?


Deleted


----------



## davide256

If anyone wants to try the RU6 into XLR pre/amp, this cable worked for me

https://www.amazon.com/4-4mm-Balanced-Headphone-Adapter-Silver/dp/B07WSRRN1X?ref_=ast_sto_dp


----------



## wheels55

DBaldock9 said:


> I remember my folks having the 8-Track Tape of Tom Jones' 1967 album, "Green, Green Grass of Home", that we listened to on a portable 8-Track player, when we were out camping.


Yep developed the love for music from my folks who had a massive record collection.  The studio echo/reverb translates so well on tom jones/elvis/dusty Springfield etc and the ru6 does it justice. Was my reasoning for purchase. A cheapish pathway to resistor ladder dacs.


----------



## peterinvan

baru8 said:


> My RU6 work great whit my DAP & Tidal as a source.
> 
> RU6 on my notebook Windows 11 & Tidal, plays "masters" only 48 KHz.
> Sampling NOS is enabled.
> Any suggestion to fix it ?


Windows 11 > Tidal Windows App > RU6
NOS enabled.  Gain set to High 

Tidal Streaming set to "Master"
Tidal Source set to RU6 in exclusive mode.

RU6 displays 96Khz bit rate

Sample track:
https://tidal.com/browse/track/255413400


----------



## peterinvan

*RU6 glass lifting*
The glass on my RU6 lifted today.  Purchased Dec 2021.  Lots of handling, but never dropped.

Easy to fix with a tiny amount of silicon glue.


----------



## yaps66

peterinvan said:


> *RU6 glass lifting*
> The glass on my RU6 lifted today.  Purchased Dec 2021.  Lots of handling, but never dropped.
> 
> Easy to fix with a tiny amount of silicon glue.


Sorry to hear that! Hope the fix is not visible!


----------



## baru8 (Nov 28, 2022)

peterinvan said:


> Windows 11 > Tidal Windows App > RU6
> NOS enabled.  Gain set to High
> 
> Tidal Streaming set to "Master"
> ...


Now they work properly
This was the problem: "Tidal Source set to RU6 in exclusive mode"

Thank you!


----------



## JAnonymous5150

peterinvan said:


> *RU6 glass lifting*
> The glass on my RU6 lifted today.  Purchased Dec 2021.  Lots of handling, but never dropped.
> 
> Easy to fix with a tiny amount of silicon glue.



Is it because of battery swelling or did the adhesive just fail?


----------



## peterinvan (Nov 28, 2022)

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Is it because of battery swelling or did the adhesive just fail?


*RU6 glass lifting*
I looks like the adhesive failed.  It was simple to carefully glue it back without the repair showing.

There is no battery in the RU6, as it is USB powered.  It does get quite warm when driving demanding phones (like Audeze LCD-XC) at higher volume.


----------



## DBaldock9

JAnonymous5150 said:


> Is it because of battery swelling or did the adhesive just fail?



No battery in the RU6.  

Possibly assembled with less glue than optimal - and then the circuit heating caused fatigue.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

DBaldock9 said:


> No battery in the RU6.
> 
> Possibly assembled with less glue than optimal - and then the circuit heating caused fatigue.



I love how I own one and know this, but it my covid/fever induced haze I legitimately forgot that it didn't have a battery lol 😂🤦‍♂️

I just remembered my first Fiio BTR5 (OG Version) that had the screen pop off because of battery swelling. You guys are gonna have to cut me some slack on this one...🙄


----------



## yaps66

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I love how I own one and know this, but it my covid/fever induced haze I legitimately forgot that it didn't have a battery lol 😂🤦‍♂️
> 
> I just remembered my first Fiio BTR5 (OG Version) that had the screen pop off because of battery swelling. You guys are gonna have to cut me some slack on this one...🙄


----------



## JAnonymous5150

yaps66 said:


>



LOL 🤣 I am so keeping this gif! It's awesome and I'm not much of a gif user. Now I'm gonna be on the lookout for situations to use it in and I'll probably wear it out real fast. 🤪


----------



## glpsace

Hello friends,

I am new to the forum as to the audiophile world. 
My discovery of instrumental progressive metal and specifically, Scale the Summit, as made me want, for the first time in 46 years, to step up my game to give the sound I hear the quality it deserves.

Unfortunately I do not have opportunity to test any of these "high-end" products and therefore I kind of make blind guesses based on your opinions and reviews, guessing what I may like or not.

I have a Grado Hemp on the way which I'll be thinking to use at home with my new cd player (Tascam CD 200), connected directly to it, when I'm not listening to the Tascan connected to the soundbar, via optical cable, just for a convenience question.

I will also pair the Grado with my Imac 24 source, for streaming from Apple Music or ripped FLAC´s. For this purpose, at the moment, I plan to use the RU6 as DAC and amp to drive the Hemp. Once I made up my mind about the type of sound / "signature" I like, I may get a R2R (or other) for desktop use purposes, or even a second RU6 if I like it too much. I believe the Hemp will not be hard to drive.

But the main purpose for the RU6 is to use on the street with my iPhone 13 mini, and a IEM. Still haven't got any and I believe it must be something easing to drive in order to avoid problems with the iPhone. I usually like to listen to my music rather loud.

I was thinking that something like the Linsoul 7HZ Timeless could be a ver nice pairing without braking the bank. I know these prices are nothing compared to what this market offers, but for someone like me just starting, they are not cheap, especially considering that I'm investing in several gear simultaneously. I believe it can be connected to the RU6 by using the 4,4 BAL socket, but not sure if there is any advantage compared to the 3,5 SL. 

I would like to read your opinion based on everything I just wrote and more particularly regarding the IEM option I present (or any equivalent in the same price range) and its connections to the RU6.

Cheers and thank you very much!


----------



## oldkid (Dec 5, 2022)

glpsace said:


> Hello friends,
> 
> I am new to the forum as to the audiophile world.
> My discovery of instrumental progressive metal and specifically, Scale the Summit, as made me want, for the first time in 46 years, to step up my game to give the sound I hear the quality it deserves.
> ...


The RU6 is my daily driver as far as on the go listening is concerned despite the fact that I have portable DACs that measure way better.

I use my RU6 with a pair of 7hz Salnotes Zero on which I have replaced the cable with a Triptowin C8 balanced cable.
Maybe try something like the Zero instead of the Timeless as a first pair of "good" IEMs.


Balanced is more efficient than single ended so you won't have to crank up the volume as much with a balanced cable. It will ultimately save you some battery life. Sonically it's tricky to say that I can hear a difference when I listen to my music in a crowded subway with a ton of outside noise.

The tips are the most important part of any IEM setup. The seal has to be perfect, this is by far the thing that will have the biggest impact on sound quality.

RU6 won't disappoint you wether you use it in a desktop setup or on the go that's for sure


----------



## sportster44

I use the RU6 with the Timeless and it's a wonderful pairing.  As @oldkid mentioned , play with the tips to get  the fit and sound right for you


----------



## glpsace

oldkid said:


> The RU6 is my daily driver as far as on the go listening is concerned despite the fact that I have portable DACs that measure way better.
> 
> I use my RU6 with a pair of 7hz Salnotes Zero on which I have replaced the cable with a Triptowin C8 balanced cable.
> Maybe try something like the Zero instead of the Timeless as a first pair of "good" IEMs.
> ...


Thank you very much for your insight and suggestions. I understand perfectly the IEM´s logic, but I know myself and it can't be too cheap or a couple of weeks later I will be itching to replace them anyway, despite the sound it produces.  

I know it is not comparable but I'm using at the moment, with my iPhone, the AirPods third generation so it must be a nice improvement or I will be sort of disappointed


sportster44 said:


> I use the RU6 with the Timeless and it's a wonderful pairing.  As @oldkid mentioned , play with the tips to get  the fit and sound right for you


Thank you! Nice to read about the synergy. I will for sure!

Thank you once again and cheers!


----------



## Vanheim

Hey everyone, hope all’s going well. I got the RU6 few days back after having drooled over it ever since I sold my cayin n6ii with the r01 module. And man…the ru6 does not disappoint. NOS mode is what I’ve chosen to stick with after fiddling for two days of receiving the unit. I tried using it with the a90 and found it to be good but not as gooey and warm as the direct out, I might get a Violectric v280 to use as an external desktop amplifier and this little r2r monster as the core of the system!


----------



## davide256

glpsace said:


> Hello friends,
> 
> I am new to the forum as to the audiophile world.
> My discovery of instrumental progressive metal and specifically, Scale the Summit, as made me want, for the first time in 46 years, to step up my game to give the sound I hear the quality it deserves.
> ...


The RU 6 is a good choice if mid range timbre and acoustical instrument detail is what you enjoy most. It does have some trade offs in slam and deep bass but I suspect
that is intentional due to the current limitations of a portable source. Just pair it with earphones that have good bass, moderate efficiency or better. If hard rock is your thing
a FiiO BTR7 may be an alternative to consider


----------



## Orfik

Why does the RU6 sound so much cleaner out of my iPhone compared to my Macbook? It's so muddy it's almost unlistenable out of the Macbook.


----------



## Orfik (Dec 7, 2022)

glpsace said:


> Hello friends,
> 
> I am new to the forum as to the audiophile world.
> My discovery of instrumental progressive metal and specifically, Scale the Summit, as made me want, for the first time in 46 years, to step up my game to give the sound I hear the quality it deserves.
> ...


I love my RU6 but it's not the best for portable use, especially with an iPhone. On high gain, the Cayin can only go to about 55-60 on the volume meter before it starts clipping and can't be used anymore. It will also shut itself off sometimes and the phone will give you an error that the device is not supported. Finally, it's a dongle and will simply get in the way and add an awkward bulk that is hard to overcome if you use your phone a lot, which most do.

Also, I have the 7hz Timeless and I don't think it matches well with this device. The Timeless is pretty warm with bloomy bass and has fairly weak instrument separation, resolution and imaging if not driven from a very clean source like the Topping G5. The Cayin is also not great in any of those areas so pairing them (especially on the iPhone which can't drive the Cayin properly) is not the best listening experience. My FiiO FH7 work much, much better in this setup.

If I were you I'd get a FiiO BTR5 (The BTR7 is also a good choice but it's bulky, has very sharp edges and doesn't offer much improvement to my ears, I returned it and kept the BTR5). The FiiO is much better suited to mobile use since it's got Bluetooth, is far more powerful when used with an iPhone (you can drive your IEMs or easily driven headphones to earsplitting levels from the balanced output), and its imaging, soundstage and technicalities are better than the Cayin (when used with an iPhone).

Again, I love the Cayin and highly recommend it but for your specific use case it is not the best option.


----------



## archisan

So not recommended for iphone users? Can it be fixed w/ firmware? Last question. Could this drive Arya Stealth? I have ifi Hip Dac 2 and somehow it powers them…


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Orfik said:


> I love my RU6 but it's not the best for portable use, especially with an iPhone. On high gain, the Cayin can only go to about 55-60 on the volume meter before it starts clipping and can't be used anymore. It will also shut itself off sometimes and the phone will give you an error that the device is not supported. Finally, it's a dongle and will simply get in the way and add an awkward bulk that is hard to overcome if you use your phone a lot, which most do.
> 
> Also, I have the 7hz Timeless and I don't think it matches well with this device. The Timeless is pretty warm with bloomy bass and has fairly weak instrument separation, resolution and imaging if not driven from a very clean source like the Topping G5. The Cayin is also not great in any of those areas so pairing them (especially on the iPhone which can't drive the Cayin properly) is not the best listening experience. My FiiO FH7 work much, much better in this setup.
> 
> ...



I don't have an iPhone, nor am I familiar with them, but this shouldn't be happening. Does the iPhone have an app like USB Audio Player Pro, Hiby Music, etc that let you play directly to a connected DAC and bypass the phone's drivers? That would be the first thing I would try.

If not can you turn off any DSP, equalization, and other audio processing apps to see if that makes a difference? Sometimes apps that process or alter the digital signal can cause problems when used with certain hardware.

Lastly have you tried your RU6 with any non-Apple devices like an Android phone or tablet or windows laptop or computer just to verify that it's working correctly to begin with? If not, do you have such a device available to you that you could try the RU6 on really quick? Knowing that it functions properly with other devices would certainly eliminate a variable from the troubleshooting process.


----------



## Orfik

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I don't have an iPhone, nor am I familiar with them, but this shouldn't be happening. Does the iPhone have an app like USB Audio Player Pro, Hiby Music, etc that let you play directly to a connected DAC and bypass the phone's drivers? That would be the first thing I would try.
> 
> If not can you turn off any DSP, equalization, and other audio processing apps to see if that makes a difference? Sometimes apps that process or alter the digital signal can cause problems when used with certain hardware.
> 
> Lastly have you tried your RU6 with any non-Apple devices like an Android phone or tablet or windows laptop or computer just to verify that it's working correctly to begin with? If not, do you have such a device available to you that you could try the RU6 on really quick? Knowing that it functions properly with other devices would certainly eliminate a variable from the troubleshooting process.


I've seen a number of other users report the exact same problem in this thread and I haven't seen a solid fix or reason, but I might have missed it. I'm not sure if iPhones have an app that can do exclusive usb out, I'll check. 

I've used it with the Hiby R5 Gen 2 which does have exclusive usb audio access and it works perfectly.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Orfik said:


> I've seen a number of other users report the exact same problem in this thread and I haven't seen a solid fix or reason, but I might have missed it. I'm not sure if iPhones have an app that can do exclusive usb out, I'll check.
> 
> I've used it with the Hiby R5 Gen 2 which does have exclusive usb audio access and it works perfectly.



That's terrible and I'm sorry to hear it. I hope you can find an app that bypasses the drivers your phone uses as I suspect that's probably where the issue lies. Have you contacted Cayin about the problem?


----------



## archisan

Is it just an iPhone issue? Just wondering if ru6 works well with iPads or macs


----------



## JAnonymous5150 (Dec 7, 2022)

archisan said:


> Is it just an iPhone issue? Just wondering if ru6 works well with iPads or macs



I have a friend who uses his with a Macbook laptop sometimes and he has never mentioned having this issue to me. I'll ask him hust to make sure though.

Edit: He texted me back and said he has no issues using the RU6 on his Macbook.


----------



## Orfik

archisan said:


> Is it just an iPhone issue? Just wondering if ru6 works well with iPads or macs


I don't have any problems running it from my Macbook, but it does sound noticeably better driven from my iPhone from the balanced out. Soundstage is smaller but bass is more controlled and snappier, imaging is better (it's muddy on the Macbook), and it's just generally more refined.


----------



## BrokenHill

I don't have an iPhone, but I have read on this forum on various sites that Apple limits the output current to a device, so as not to harm the battery.  So any device powered by its own battery, such as the btr7, would be a better option in principle.


----------



## Orfik

Andykong said:


> The warning is related to the famous power supply limit imposed by iOS, several reviewers has reported that the limit is 120mA according to their measurement.  So Choice of headphone/IEM (related to loading of the device), music content and volume (related to ouptut level) will be some of the direct cause to reach that 120mA limit.


I believe this is the root of the problem.


----------



## Orfik

BrokenHill said:


> I don't have an iPhone, but I have read on this forum on various sites that Apple limits the output current to a device, so as not to harm the battery.  So any device powered by its own battery, such as the btr7, would be a better option in principle.


In principle and in practice. Even if the clipping weren't a factor my BTR5 is just a superior mobile device because of Bluetooth and a battery. 

Having a dongle the size of the Cayin attached to your phone all day is ridiculous for 99.999% of users.


----------



## peterinvan

archisan said:


> Is it just an iPhone issue? Just wondering if ru6 works well with iPads or macs


RU6 works very well out of my iPad Pro (2019).
My iPhone 6 will not power it.  I bought a FiiO KA3 for the phone.  Not as good SQ as the RU6 but fine for out and about.


----------



## o0genesis0o

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I don't have an iPhone, nor am I familiar with them, but this shouldn't be happening. Does the iPhone have an app like USB Audio Player Pro, Hiby Music, etc that let you play directly to a connected DAC and bypass the phone's drivers? That would be the first thing I would try.
> 
> If not can you turn off any DSP, equalization, and other audio processing apps to see if that makes a difference? Sometimes apps that process or alter the digital signal can cause problems when used with certain hardware.
> 
> Lastly have you tried your RU6 with any non-Apple devices like an Android phone or tablet or windows laptop or computer just to verify that it's working correctly to begin with? If not, do you have such a device available to you that you could try the RU6 on really quick? Knowing that it functions properly with other devices would certainly eliminate a variable from the troubleshooting process.


The lightning port of iPhone has less current output than USB-C on Android. Many dongles that I review outright refuse to work with iPhone (S9 Pro, ACMEE V4). Some works but with strange volume behavior (XO: no output until around 50% volume). Only KA3 works normally, but I found that it does not sound as good as when powered by USB-C. There is not much user can do about this from the software. RU6 is a draining dongle, so likely it does not work.


----------



## davide256

Orfik said:


> I love my RU6 but it's not the best for portable use, especially with an iPhone. On high gain, the Cayin can only go to about 55-60 on the volume meter before it starts clipping and can't be used anymore. It will also shut itself off sometimes and the phone will give you an error that the device is not supported. Finally, it's a dongle and will simply get in the way and add an awkward bulk that is hard to overcome if you use your phone a lot, which most do.
> 
> Also, I have the 7hz Timeless and I don't think it matches well with this device. The Timeless is pretty warm with bloomy bass and has fairly weak instrument separation, resolution and imaging if not driven from a very clean source like the Topping G5. The Cayin is also not great in any of those areas so pairing them (especially on the iPhone which can't drive the Cayin properly) is not the best listening experience. My FiiO FH7 work much, much better in this setup.
> 
> ...


Curious… sounds like you are using a bad match for impedance/ efficiency. Even my Audeze sines do fine with the Cayin and an 11 pro max iphone


----------



## Orfik

davide256 said:


> Curious… sounds like you are using a bad match for impedance/ efficiency. Even my Audeze sines do fine with the Cayin and an 11 pro max iphone


You're saying that like it's normal for a portable device. The combination shouldn't matter when it comes to whether or not the device is functional. 

I understand it's an Apple problem but my point still stands, this is not the best portable for iPhone users.


----------



## yaps66

Orfik said:


> I love my RU6 but it's not the best for portable use, especially with an iPhone. On high gain, the Cayin can only go to about 55-60 on the volume meter before it starts clipping and can't be used anymore. It will also shut itself off sometimes and the phone will give you an error that the device is not supported. Finally, it's a dongle and will simply get in the way and add an awkward bulk that is hard to overcome if you use your phone a lot, which most do.
> 
> Also, I have the 7hz Timeless and I don't think it matches well with this device. The Timeless is pretty warm with bloomy bass and has fairly weak instrument separation, resolution and imaging if not driven from a very clean source like the Topping G5. The Cayin is also not great in any of those areas so pairing them (especially on the iPhone which can't drive the Cayin properly) is not the best listening experience. My FiiO FH7 work much, much better in this setup.
> 
> ...


Apologies but I am late to the game here.   Out of curiosity, I tried the following Roon on PC>iPhone 11 Pro Max>generic lightening to c calbe>RU6>tgxgear tofino 130ohm buds single ended.  I am on NOS and High gain and am listening to Peace Bird performed by Genius of Time on volume 85 and have experienced no clipping even on aggressive sections of the song.

Have you tried rolling the OTG cable?


----------



## oldkid

Orfik said:


> In principle and in practice. Even if the clipping weren't a factor my BTR5 is just a superior mobile device because of Bluetooth and a battery.
> 
> Having a dongle the size of the Cayin attached to your phone all day is ridiculous for 99.999% of users.


If you are an audiophile, the dongle DAC form factor is totally fine compared to the sound quality it offers compared to using a smartphone alone. 

I have a Sony Xperia 1 II a phone with an internal DAC capable of 32bit 384khz PCM playback on 8 channels but it's not even close to something like RU6 sound quality wise


----------



## Orfik

yaps66 said:


> Apologies but I am late to the game here.   Out of curiosity, I tried the following Roon on PC>iPhone 11 Pro Max>generic lightening to c calbe>RU6>tgxgear tofino 130ohm buds single ended.  I am on NOS and High gain and am listening to Peace Bird performed by Genius of Time on volume 85 and have experienced no clipping even on aggressive sections of the song.
> 
> Have you tried rolling the OTG cable?


I have, no luck. I already quoted a Cayin rep above, the problem isn't the cable, it's the dependent on the headphones you use. I don't have this problem when I use my HD6xx, but that is useless as a portable and doesn't sound that good out of the Cayin to me.


----------



## Orfik

oldkid said:


> If you are an audiophile, the dongle DAC form factor is totally fine compared to the sound quality it offers compared to using a smartphone alone.
> 
> I have a Sony Xperia 1 II a phone with an internal DAC capable of 32bit 384khz PCM playback on 8 channels but it's not even close to something like RU6 sound quality wise


I don't care if it sounded like a HE-1, this dongle is too awkward and unreliable to be a primary portable device in my opinion. 

Being an audiophile doesn't mean eating salad with a butter knife. The RU6 is great hanging out at home or in the office, but if I'm mobile I'm using a Bluetooth capable player or a DAP.


----------



## oldkid (Dec 8, 2022)

Orfik said:


> I don't care if it sounded like a HE-1, this dongle is too awkward and unreliable to be a primary portable device in my opinion.
> 
> Being an audiophile doesn't mean eating salad with a butter knife. The RU6 is great hanging out at home or in the office, but if I'm mobile I'm using a Bluetooth capable player or a DAP.


I don't even see the point of bringing bluetooth into this conversation. The gap in sound quality between bluetooth and a high end R2R DAC such as RU6 is just too big.

Plus, your criticism can be applied to any other dongle DAC. People that choose to buy such devices generally agree that they are more convenient than carrying a full sized DAP in addition to the smartphone you are already carrying around.
Having to deal with wires can be more convenient that having to charge multiple devices too


----------



## davide256

Orfik said:


> You're saying that like it's normal for a portable device. The combination shouldn't matter when it comes to whether or not the device is functional.
> 
> I understand it's an Apple problem but my point still stands, this is not the best portable for iPhone users.





Orfik said:


> You're saying that like it's normal for a portable device. The combination shouldn't matter when it comes to whether or not the device is functional.
> 
> I understand it's an Apple problem but my point still stands, this is not the best portable for iPhone users.


Sounds to me more like a small battery trying to drive inefficient headphones. Generally dongles should be used with  IEM's or efficient 
headphones as their current output is limited by the source device. Its even possible that you have some sort of current limiting option 
kicking in protecting the phone. I always buy larger version iPhones to get the bigger battery/greater current reserve for mobile play.


----------



## archisan

Orfik said:


> You're saying that like it's normal for a portable device. The combination shouldn't matter when it comes to whether or not the device is functional.
> 
> I understand it's an Apple problem but my point still stands, this is not the best portable for iPhone users.


I agree, I think something with its own power supply, like the Hip Dac, is better suited. Now if ifi decides to do an R2R instead of burr brown D/S , even though I really like the burr brown signature it would be something!


----------



## glpsace

Orfik said:


> I love my RU6 but it's not the best for portable use, especially with an iPhone. On high gain, the Cayin can only go to about 55-60 on the volume meter before it starts clipping and can't be used anymore. It will also shut itself off sometimes and the phone will give you an error that the device is not supported. Finally, it's a dongle and will simply get in the way and add an awkward bulk that is hard to overcome if you use your phone a lot, which most do.
> 
> Also, I have the 7hz Timeless and I don't think it matches well with this device. The Timeless is pretty warm with bloomy bass and has fairly weak instrument separation, resolution and imaging if not driven from a very clean source like the Topping G5. The Cayin is also not great in any of those areas so pairing them (especially on the iPhone which can't drive the Cayin properly) is not the best listening experience. My FiiO FH7 work much, much better in this setup.
> 
> ...


I have read a lot before deciding on the RU6 and the Timeless (within this budget of course). It is the first time I read about this. Unfortunately I already ordered and only the RU6 hasn't arrived yet. So, for now I will try the Timeless and if I concur your opinion, I will send it back. Thank you for your insight. I already knew that the iPhone / RU6 relation was not the best but people that used it with the timeless didn't report any major issues as it was not very power hungry.


----------



## Orfik

oldkid said:


> I don't even see the point of bringing bluetooth into this conversation. The gap in sound quality between bluetooth and a high end R2R DAC such as RU6 is just too big.
> 
> Plus, your criticism can be applied to any other dongle DAC. People that choose to buy such devices generally agree that they are more convenient than carrying a full sized DAP in addition to the smartphone you are already carrying around.
> Having to deal with wires can be more convenient that having to charge multiple devices too


Is this some kind of joke? My portable setup is an OG BTR5 -> FiiO FH7. The BTR5 through bluetooth sounds significantly better in some ways than the RU6. The sound signature is apple and oranges in the first place, but when it comes to imaging, instrument separation and technicalities the BTR5 wipes the floor with the RU6. The RU6 is a nice unit but people need to stop making it out to be some mythical device, it has a lot of issues.


----------



## JAnonymous5150

Orfik said:


> Is this some kind of joke? My portable setup is an OG BTR5 -> FiiO FH7. The BTR5 through bluetooth sounds significantly better in some ways than the RU6. The sound signature is apple and oranges in the first place, but when it comes to imaging, instrument separation and technicalities the BTR5 wipes the floor with the RU6. The RU6 is a nice unit but people need to stop making it out to be some mythical device, it has a lot of issues.



I don't necessarily agree with his characterization of the RU6 as a "high end" R2R DAC, but I also don't think his opinion is a joke or that he's mythologizing the RU6. I like my BTR5 too, but I also don't think it "wipes the floor" with the RU6. I'm sorry that you've had a bad experience with the RU6, but your latest posts come off almost like someone who's bitter about the device and trying to trash it.

His high opinion of the RU6 is perfectly valid and there's no reason to refer to it as a joke. That said, we're all grown-ups here so I'll leave it at that.


----------



## Orfik (Dec 8, 2022)

JAnonymous5150 said:


> I don't necessarily agree with his characterization of the RU6 as a "high end" R2R DAC, but I also don't think his opinion is a joke or that he's mythologizing the RU6. I like my BTR5 too, but I also don't think it "wipes the floor" with the RU6. I'm sorry that you've had a bad experience with the RU6, but your latest posts come off almost like someone who's bitter about the device and trying to trash it.
> 
> His high opinion of the RU6 is perfectly valid and there's no reason to refer to it as a joke. That said, we're all grown-ups here so I'll leave it at that.


There's no bitterness at all, I really like my RU6 and I certainly wouldn't get rid of it. It just is what it is - a flawed but worthwhile entry to hi-fi portable audio.

And the BTR5 doesn't wipe the floor with it overall but image separation and dynamics are well above the RU6. At least when we're talking about driving a FiiO FH7 from Bluetooth vs Cayin direct from iPhone. Not even close.


----------



## yaps66 (Dec 9, 2022)

Orfik said:


> There's no bitterness at all, I really like my RU6 and I certainly wouldn't get rid of it. It just is what it is - a flawed but worthwhile entry to hi-fi portable audio.
> 
> And the BTR5 doesn't wipe the floor with it overall but image separation and dynamics are well above the RU6. At least when we're talking about driving a FiiO FH7 from Bluetooth vs Cayin direct from iPhone. Not even close.


To each his own. I have both the BTR5 and the RU6 and I am reaching for the RU6 every time I want to use a dongle to listen out of my iPhone or PC (when travelling).   What the RU6 does for me is to give it the unique and organic sound and is a great segue into the world or R2R at a relatively affordable price. I have other devices that I would use to give me the more technical experience. That said, the BTR5 is a great device that also punches above its price point. For my use case and preferences though, it gets reached for less and less. YMMVAAT!


----------



## oldkid

Orfik said:


> There's no bitterness at all, I really like my RU6 and I certainly wouldn't get rid of it. It just is what it is - a flawed but worthwhile entry to hi-fi portable audio.
> 
> And the BTR5 doesn't wipe the floor with it overall but image separation and dynamics are well above the RU6. At least when we're talking about driving a FiiO FH7 from Bluetooth vs Cayin direct from iPhone. Not even close.


This current drawing limitation only exists on iPhone and Apple is the only one to blame here. 

RU6 works as intended on Android and is an excellent on the go solution that can drive even full sized headphones. No Bluetooth DAC can compare to RU6 sound quality wise.


----------



## Orfik

glpsace said:


> I have read a lot before deciding on the RU6 and the Timeless (within this budget of course). It is the first time I read about this. Unfortunately I already ordered and only the RU6 hasn't arrived yet. So, for now I will try the Timeless and if I concur your opinion, I will send it back. Thank you for your insight. I already knew that the iPhone / RU6 relation was not the best but people that used it with the timeless didn't report any major issues as it was not very power hungry.


Don't get me wrong, the Timeless sounds objectively great out of the RU6. It's only when you compare it against something better that flaws start popping out but if you're just listening to them both on their own you won't have many complaints.


----------



## XERO1 (Dec 8, 2022)

I used to own an RU6 and I loved it's SQ, but since I use an iPhone 13mini, I ran into the same clipping and heat issues that are now well known, so I sold it and moved on.

But I came across (and own) a Lightning-to-USB-C cable that may solve (or at least reduce) the clipping issue. It has excellent build quality, it's connectors don't get super hot (but the Lightning connector does get slightly warm), and it has been tested to output up to 5V-200mA (1W) of power.

It's the OE Audio OEOTG Digital Audio Cable. https://oeaudio.shop/products/oeotg-digital-cable?variant=40577134624821

I'm not sure if this cable has been mentioned before in this thread, but because it's so long, I'm not about to check.

Since I no longer own an RU6, I can't confirm if it will help with or fix the RU6's clipping issue with iPhones, but I think it's worth taking a look at.


----------



## Andykong

I think everyone has made their point already, I hope we don't develop into arguing instead of constructive discussion.  

I do agree with the point, in principle, that if you are using iPhone as your mobile source, a Dongle DAC (without any battery or built-in power supply) is not really your best bet unless you choose your IEM carefully, and that put most on-ear or over-ear headphones out of the picture. If you can find a pairing that works well, I am happy for you.   The problem is the power limitation enforced by iPhone, it is not an iOS issue.  If you are using iPad or other iOS devices that don't have the power restriction, the situation is a lot better. 

Let's respect that and focus in sharing our impression, I don't think it is a good idea to challenge others' opinions.  Everyone is entitled to his own preference and bottom line,


----------



## davide256

am finding that the RU6 makes me much aware of the driver resonances in a Meze 99 classic, that Audeze Sine and LCD 1 are much cleaner. 
But that does drain phone battery fast. Wondering if  Aeon 2 users  are doing any better with the RU6 for battery life?


----------



## Orfik

Andykong said:


> I think everyone has made their point already, I hope we don't develop into arguing instead of constructive discussion.
> 
> I do agree with the point, in principle, that if you are using iPhone as your mobile source, a Dongle DAC (without any battery or built-in power supply) is not really your best bet unless you choose your IEM carefully, and that put most on-ear or over-ear headphones out of the picture. If you can find a pairing that works well, I am happy for you.   The problem is the power limitation enforced by iPhone, it is not an iOS issue.  If you are using iPad or other iOS devices that don't have the power restriction, the situation is a lot better.
> 
> Let's respect that and focus in sharing our impression, I don't think it is a good idea to challenge others' opinions.  Everyone is entitled to his own preference and bottom line,


Why does the sound seem cleaner when I'm playing it from my iPhone compared to playing it from my MacBook? Am I imagining it or is there some signal interference?


----------



## Andykong

Orfik said:


> Why does the sound seem cleaner when I'm playing it from my iPhone compared to playing it from my MacBook? Am I imagining it or is there some signal interference?


If your USB-C to USB-A cable is robust, anti-interfered, and 100% functional, then it might be related to your MacBook System settings and/or Software utilization.  When you use a notebook computer as a source, be it Windows or MacBook, the software side plays a very important role in the final outcome, if not more influential.  I remember one user mentioned that he need to turn off Chrome on his MacBook in order to use the RU6 properly.  I am a Window guy, who never uses iOS-based devices, so I tend to excuse myself from debugging discussion that involves iOS devices.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

Orfik said:


> Don't get me wrong, the Timeless sounds objectively great out of the RU6. It's only when you compare it against something better that flaws start popping out but if you're just listening to them both on their own you won't have many complaints.


I had the RU6, BTR7, Sparrow... DAC/Amps and to my ears all of them were good devices for the price. Better than budget stuff but not as good as higher priced devices like Mojo 2, micro iDSD Signature... What you are describing as "better"  sonically, could just be that you like the way your IEM pairs with the BTR5.

In my testing, I really liked the planar Hook-X with BTR7 while on the other hand some dynamic driver IEM's like FH5 & Honeydew paired better with RU6.

At the end of the day, get something that has the features you need, in your case, it seems like an internal battery and bluetooth is important to you so get a DAC/Amp with said features and enjoy. There's no need to crap on a product because it does not have the features you need.



XERO1 said:


> It's the OE Audio OEOTG Digital Audio Cable.


I have that Cable and it's a good one. A bit stiff though and can cause some awkwardness when stacking a phone and DAC really close.


Orfik said:


> Why does the sound seem cleaner when I'm playing it from my iPhone compared to playing it from my MacBook? Am I imagining it or is there some signal interference?


Source noise or bad Cable.


----------



## glpsace

XERO1 said:


> I used to own an RU6 and I loved it's SQ, but since I use an iPhone 13mini, I ran into the same clipping and heat issues that are now well known, so I sold it and moved on.
> 
> But I came across (and own) a Lightning-to-USB-C cable that may solve (or at least reduce) the clipping issue. It has excellent build quality, it's connectors don't get super hot (but the Lightning connector does get slightly warm), and it has been tested to output up to 5V-200mA (1W) of power.
> 
> ...


I have the iPhone 13 mini and I'm waiting for the RU6 to arrive. I'm gonna pair it with the 7HZ Timeless and yes, the cable you refer has been mentioned before, I have ordered it also but since I'm in Europe and only found one place that sells it (They should have it in stock by next week) I'm waiting for it also. I believe in a couple of weeks I will be able to say, for sure, how the Mini with the dongle and that specific cable works. Cheers.


----------



## glpsace

Andykong said:


> I think everyone has made their point already, I hope we don't develop into arguing instead of constructive discussion.
> 
> I do agree with the point, in principle, that if you are using iPhone as your mobile source, a Dongle DAC (without any battery or built-in power supply) is not really your best bet unless you choose your IEM carefully, and that put most on-ear or over-ear headphones out of the picture. If you can find a pairing that works well, I am happy for you.   The problem is the power limitation enforced by iPhone, it is not an iOS issue.  If you are using iPad or other iOS devices that don't have the power restriction, the situation is a lot better.
> 
> Let's respect that and focus in sharing our impression, I don't think it is a good idea to challenge others' opinions.  Everyone is entitled to his own preference and bottom line,


Thank you once again for your wise words. I have read this all thread before deciding to go for it, even knowing the power limitations of the iPhone. I'm not that worried if it won't work 100% as I also plan to use it with my IMAC 24 desktop, doubling it with the Lake People G111 MKII amp and connected to the Grado Hemp cans.

Anyway, my advice to anyone is to read the all thread or at least search the thread for keywords like "iPhone" and so on for those of you who who will use one with the RU6. Everything is explained, several times, in the very informative and complete thread. I believe there is nothing I don't know, at this point, about the RU6... and I still don't have it!


----------



## glpsace

Orfik said:


> Why does the sound seem cleaner when I'm playing it from my iPhone compared to playing it from my MacBook? Am I imagining it or is there some signal interference?


Are you using Apple Music for streaming? If so check on the MacBook options/definitions, under the Music tab if you have both Equalizer and volume adjusting off/deactivated. (sorry but my iPhone is in Portuguese so don't know the exact words in the English menu).


----------



## Orfik

Johnfg465vd said:


> I had the RU6, BTR7, Sparrow... DAC/Amps and to my ears all of them were good devices for the price. Better than budget stuff but not as good as higher priced devices like Mojo 2, micro iDSD Signature... What you are describing as "better"  sonically, could just be that you like the way your IEM pairs with the BTR5.
> 
> In my testing, I really liked the planar Hook-X with BTR7 while on the other hand some dynamic driver IEM's like FH5 & Honeydew paired better with RU6.
> 
> ...


Once again, I'm not crapping on anything. I own and enjoy the RU6 along with other dongles and Bluetooth dac/amps. At no point in this thread did I ever say I disliked the RU6. I said it's not the best fit for a primary portable if you're an iPhone user, something Cayin's own rep agrees with.

The RU6 does have real sonic drawbacks. That is not up for debate. You don't need to be so defensive about the device, it's a great unit but nothing is perfect, certainly not a $250 dongle.


----------



## davide256

Orfik said:


> Why does the sound seem cleaner when I'm playing it from my iPhone compared to playing it from my MacBook? Am I imagining it or is there some signal interference?


I would suspect that the EMI and RFI manufacturing standards are more stringent for a device thats basically a radio transceiver held next to your head. 
Because its powering the DAC, its critical for a source player to minimize induced noise contaminants to the lightning/USB port.


----------



## Marlowe (Dec 9, 2022)

Orfik said:


> Is this some kind of joke?



Gee, thin skinned much? Why is it so hard to acknowledge there are different strokes for different folks and leave it at that? (And accept it that most people on a board devoted to the RU6 are unlikely to agree with you on these matters.) For various reasons, I primarily use the RU6 for convenience at home to listen away from my desktop setup (or for gaming on my computer so as not to degrade the life of the tubes in my Liquid Platinum), but while your reasons may be valid for you on portability, they make no sense to me. I just don't use Bluetooth. Ever. (I'm using a couple of desktop DACs that have Bluetooth; I don't even have the antennas attached.) And while the RU6 is on the large size for a dongle, in the greater scheme of things it is tiny and weighs almost nothing. Attaching it to my phone with a rubber strap I had from an old FiiO device and using the short stock USB C cable is a very minor inconvenience when weighed against its benefits. If you disagree, great--you don't have to use it and no one is forcing you to. Why do you feel it necessary to tediously keep telling people who do use it as a portable device that they are wrong?


----------



## Orfik

Marlowe said:


> Gee, thin skinned much? Why is it so hard to acknowledge there are different strokes for different folks and leave it at that? (And accept it that most people on a board devoted to the RU6 are unlikely to agree with you on these matters.) For various reasons, I primarily use the RU6 for convenience at home to listen away from my desktop setup (or for gaming on my computer so as not to degrade the life of the tubes in my Liquid Platinum), but while your reasons may be valid for you on portability, they make no sense to me. I just don't use Bluetooth. Ever. (I'm using a couple of desktop DACs that have Bluetooth; I don't even have the antennas attached.) And while the RU6 is on the large size for a dongle, in the greater scheme of things it is tiny and weighs almost nothing. Attaching it to my phone with a rubber strap I had from an old FiiO device and using the short stock USB C cable is a very minor inconvenience when weighed against its benefits. If you disagree, great--you don't have to use it and no one is forcing you to. Why do you feel it necessary to tediously keep telling people who do use it as a portable device that they are wrong?


Sorry, it's just so far away from my experience it seemed like you couldn't be serious. You seem pretty upset and adamant about your position so I won't make the situation worse, I hope all is well on your end.


----------



## Marlowe

Orfik said:


> Sorry, it's just so far away from my experience it seemed like you couldn't be serious. You seem pretty upset and adamant about your position so I won't make the situation worse, I hope all is well on your end.


Actually, I very rarely listen to music on the go any more. (Though there was a time that I regularly paired my phone with a FiiO Q1 MkII, which is considerable larger than a RU6.) But I found your attitude that your personal opinion was so unquestionably right for everyone that no one could disagree with it except as a joke to be, bluntly, offensive.


----------



## Orfik

Marlowe said:


> Actually, I very rarely listen to music on the go any more. (Though there was a time that I regularly paired my phone with a FiiO Q1 MkII, which is considerable larger than a RU6.) But I found your attitude that your personal opinion was so unquestionably right for everyone that no one could disagree with it except as a joke to be, bluntly, offensive.


I'm glad that seems like a reasonable mobile solution to you. Cheers!


----------



## davide256

Anyone played around with the Hifiman EF400 and want to share their thoughts on how their R2R DAC section sound quality compares to the RU6?


----------



## quawn0418

davide256 said:


> Anyone played around with the Hifiman EF400 and want to share their thoughts on how their R2R DAC section sound quality compares to the RU6?


A recent reviewer stated that the EF400 gave him Delta-Sigma like sound in comparison to the RU6…i heard the EF400 at Canjam last year but the showroom isn’t quiet enough to compare on such a level.


----------



## Johnfg465vd

quawn0418 said:


> A recent reviewer stated that the EF400 gave him Delta-Sigma like sound in comparison to the RU6…i heard the EF400 at Canjam last year but the showroom isn’t quiet enough to compare on such a level.


Ah no. It does not sound like a delta-sigma DAC, especially in NOS mode and after Burn-In.


davide256 said:


> Anyone played around with the Hifiman EF400 and want to share their thoughts on how their R2R DAC section sound quality compares to the RU6?


I had the RU6 and really liked it's sound signature, I sometimes even preferred it more than my Gryphon but I needed more power. I initially experimented with using external Amps like Topping A30 Pro, Zen CAN... with unsatsfactory results. They added more power but also more distortion. So I ended up getting the EF400.

Sonically, it's a big upgrade over the RU6. In comparision to the EF400, the RU6 is a bit relaxed sounding with slightly rolled off/subdued treble presentation and also less extension in the lows with a more easy going sound. The EF400 is more neutral with a crazy amount of power. It also resolves better, has bigger Bass impact, has more detail, sounds wider and has a more refined sound.

I mostly use Headphones but for IEMs there is slight issue with limited volume range because of high output power.


----------



## davide256

@Johnfg465vd , I hear you on the desire for more power. IME the RU6 does causes random "gasps" during playback using planar headphones
when there are complex loud passages with low bass driven by iPhone, which doesn't happen if NUC connected. Would be nice to see
a "MK II" offer that had its own battery, unfettered by source power limitations for low bass.


----------



## glpsace

When searching for the RU6 feedback, outside of this forum, the general opinion about this dongle seems to be way more negative than positive. What puzzles me is how can there be such extreme feelings about the same product?

There is a particular forum that reviewed it and just trashed it from first to last post almost. s u p e r b e s t a u d i o f r i e n d s


----------



## maceto

glpsace said:


> When searching for the RU6 feedback, outside of this forum, the general opinion about this dongle seems to be way more negative than positive. What puzzles me is how can there be such extreme feelings about the same product?
> 
> There is a particular forum that reviewed it and just trashed it from first to last post almost. s u p e r b e s t a u d i o f r i e n d s


What you hear and what you measure is different. There’s plenty of good reviews too. Think a record from 1930’s with plenty of distortion - can sound amazing in its own way. A perfectly measured product can sound harsh and metallic because no sound you’re used to hearing is perfect. Think TV with super resolution, some colors are better than in real life. Or polarized sunglasses… you’ll see thing in the best way, but is it right or wrong?


----------



## glpsace

maceto said:


> What you hear and what you measure is different. There’s plenty of good reviews too. Think a record from 1930’s with plenty of distortion - can sound amazing in its own way. A perfectly measured product can sound harsh and metallic because no sound you’re used to hearing is perfect. Think TV with super resolution, some colors are better than in real life. Or polarized sunglasses… you’ll see thing in the best way, but is it right or wrong?


Indeed, I have no doubt about that. I know that the review was based mostly in measurements but across the posts, many tried it an would still bash it left and right. Anyway, I was just amazed by the Love it or hate it groups. Almost no in-between  

Anyway, I received my unit which unfortunately was faulty (and I believe it was used before. Does the box usually comes sealed? like with a plastic over it or is it just a sort of "sticker" that could easily be removed if one really wanted by opening it very carefully..

It was the only one in stock so I got refunded. Meanwhile I found a coworker who had one (just bought it himself a week ago) and was kind enough to borrow it for a couple of days. I really liked the sound even if break-in time was not over yet.

So now I have to find another source in Europe to order from (not many available at nice prices). Probably after Christmas will be easier to snatch a good deal.

Cheers.


----------



## maceto

glpsace said:


> Indeed, I have no doubt about that. I know that the review was based mostly in measurements but across the posts, many tried it an would still bash it left and right. Anyway, I was just amazed by the Love it or hate it groups. Almost no in-between
> 
> Anyway, I received my unit which unfortunately was faulty (and I believe it was used before. Does the box usually comes sealed? like with a plastic over it or is it just a sort of "sticker" that could easily be removed if one really wanted by opening it very carefully..
> 
> ...


I think it's going to be about clean sound vs. sound with color on this one. I am getting mine in 2 days. Mine is an open box so mine will have been used for a little (demo version). I don't think the seal should be opened if a new version so that sounds strange.  I am getting a few dongles and amps to try out a few options before I make a more substantial purchase in the early year.


----------



## Andykong

Thanks for being such an important part of the Cayin community. Hope you have a great Christmas and New Year!


----------



## Andykong

On the last day of 2022, we want to thank our friends and users for your long-term support and participation. Your contribution is the main reason that endorses RU6 as one of the benchmarks for the Personal Audio community. Both *Headfonics *and *Dongle Madness *have named RU6 as the Best DAC/Amp Dongle in 2022, and we believe RU6 is also the best Dongle DAC to a lot of personal encaustic in this thread.

2022 is a difficult year, we are looking forward to 2023 and with your support, we'll bring more joy and fun to all cayin friends and users in the coming year.


----------



## AlexCBSN

So just got mine, a little late in the audiophile world since 1 month after something it's released it becomes dull and out of hype, anyways. I own plenty of DACs including ifi go bar, W2, peek51, ltp S2 and q15.  

So far this is quite astonishing, bass lacks a bit of depth imo, but I'm coming from the colorfly cda m1 which imo it's the most analogue dongle there is, the ru6 is quite interesting, imo one of the best I tried in a while. I love the mids, it made my IMR opus mia come to life, it needs more power than some other iems I own 

Sorry for the lazy question. Is there a firmware update for this? 

Was a bit freaked out by not getting the tidal exclusive mode but I already saw the info in the first page. 

Rumble is good, but coming from the q15 and the apogee grove I can tell there's the slightest bit missing, still, an amazing option. Size is not a problem since I think it's a bit narrower than the q15. 

Soundstage it's tremendous, not a fan of oversampling but still will try it. 

Now the question, is this better than r01 (again. Not lazyness but I'm swamped with work) I own e01, t01 and a01, but I never carry my n6ii with me, too much bulk and risk to take out an expensive dap into mexico city just because audio hehehe


----------



## drftr

Anyone using RU6 with UAPP? I always miss the first second of an album or of any track I jump to. I know there is an option in UAPP to delay the start but that's not helping me. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem and/or this can be fixed through a firmware update?

The delay doesn't happen if I just use UAPP on my phone, and neither does it happen if I use Poweramp with RU6, so this is really pointing towards a combination of the 2 I guess.

Tnx...

drftr


----------



## YanaMJ (Friday at 4:01 PM)

Hello, just bought the Cayin RU6, I love the sound but have some interferences with my Samsung S21 ultra , no interference with the cable of the S2 ultra but I have problem of disconnect. Could you help me and tell me which cable I need to buy...Thanks.


----------



## sportster44

drftr said:


> Anyone using RU6 with UAPP? I always miss the first second of an album or of any track I jump to. I know there is an option in UAPP to delay the start but that's not helping me. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem and/or this can be fixed through a firmware update?
> 
> The delay doesn't happen if I just use UAPP on my phone, and neither does it happen if I use Poweramp with RU6, so this is really pointing towards a combination of the 2 I guess.
> 
> ...


Odd, I  use both with no misses at all.


----------



## davide256

sportster44 said:


> Odd, I  use both with no misses at all.


Kind of an information missing discussion. UAPP description says it has its own USB out audio driver that ( hopefully) can be used in place of the default android driver. I’d suspect this as a possible cause


----------



## animalsrush

YanaMJ said:


> Hello, just bought the Cayin RU6, I love the sound but have some interferences with my Samsung S21 ultra , no interference with the cable of the S2 ultra but I have problem of disconnect. Could you help me and tell me which cable I need to buy...Thanks.


There are good cables from DDHifi on Ali express. However I got this and works really well 

GUCraftsman USB C Type C to Type C Headphone Amplifier Cable 6N Single Crystal Silver for FiiO BTR5 Q1 Q3 Q3s Qudelix 5K xDuoo Link2 XD-05PLUS E1DA 9038G3 9038S 9038D Lotoo PAW S2¡ https://a.co/d/f0D0O9C


----------



## maceto

animalsrush said:


> There are good cables from DDHifi on Ali express. However I got this and works really well
> 
> GUCraftsman USB C Type C to Type C Headphone Amplifier Cable 6N Single Crystal Silver for FiiO BTR5 Q1 Q3 Q3s Qudelix 5K xDuoo Link2 XD-05PLUS E1DA 9038G3 9038S 9038D Lotoo PAW S2¡ https://a.co/d/f0D0O9C


GUCraftsman didn’t work for me - had to return it.


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## animalsrush

maceto said:


> GUCraftsman didn’t work for me - had to return it.


Oh .. it works well with my one plus 8T 5G and iPad Pro 2020. It is interesting how these cables work on some devices and don’t on others. Stock cable was noisy , Samsung cable was good but had RFI with iPad. This gucraftsman works on all.


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## maceto

animalsrush said:


> Oh .. it works well with my one plus 8T 5G and iPad Pro 2020. It is interesting how these cables work on some devices and don’t on others. Stock cable was noisy , Samsung cable was good but had RFI with iPad. This gucraftsman works on all.


This was just broken I think - iPhone 13 Pro. I have 3 others that all work. One is so expensive I’ve not used it yet lol


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## wolfstar76

I love RU6, however, I only use DAP outdoors. The only use of RU6 for me is with computers. I found RU6 incredible with either my MacBook pro or PC, it really shines with more powerful sources


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## Johnfg465vd

YanaMJ said:


> Hello, just bought the Cayin RU6, I love the sound but have some interferences with my Samsung S21 ultra , no interference with the cable of the S2 ultra but I have problem of disconnect. Could you help me and tell me which cable I need to buy...Thanks.


Just try a different Cable. I used an OEAudio Cable and it worked fine.


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## drftr

davide256 said:


> Kind of an information missing discussion. UAPP description says it has its own USB out audio driver that ( hopefully) can be used in place of the default android driver. I’d suspect this as a possible cause


I see various driver tabs and settings. Which one are you referring to specifically and how should it ideally be set?

drftr


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## drftr

wolfstar76 said:


> I love RU6, however, I only use DAP outdoors. The only use of RU6 for me is with computers. I found RU6 incredible with either my MacBook pro or PC, it really shines with more powerful sources


Have you tried amping the result coming out of RU6 as well?

drftr


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## dharmasteve (Saturday at 7:08 AM)

I find 'where' I use the RU6 makes a difference to the background noise. Sometimes for no logical reason, it can suffer RF interference that is for sure, but it can be clean as a fresh sheet.


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## andlum

I almost always have RFI when carrying the RU6 inside my pocket together with my iPhone. Solution was letting the RU6 hanging out.


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## glpsace (Saturday at 9:43 AM)

Use it with everything. 
It double amps nicely with the RNHP (but of course it does not replaces a Desktop DAC).
Since I got the OEAUDIO OEOTG Cable that it works flawlessly with my iPhone 13 mini and IEM´s as my Grado Headphone.
Nevertheless when I fall asleep at night listening to music, in the morning I wake up and the iPhone battery is dead. So for those occasions I'm thinking of getting the RS2 DAP. I really like the R2R type of sound.


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## davide256

drftr said:


> I see various driver tabs and settings. Which one are you referring to specifically and how should it ideally be set?
> 
> drftr


I don't have the app and UAPP doesn't make it obvious where to find a user manual.  The advert page below is what I found; 

https://www.extreamsd.com/index.php/hires-audio-driver

in general when dealing with a problem and proprietary drivers, a good first step is to switch to the default system driver. Manufacturers don't have
the resources to debug problems with 3rd party cottage industry software but will give you credence if what you are having a problem with is out
of the box functionality from another manufacturer. If the problem exists with the default driver, a user could likely get some level of support from
Cayin but if its linked solely to UAPP's proprietary USB driver, thats needs to be put in the lap of UAPP developers to fault isolate.


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## davide256 (Saturday at 11:13 AM)

glpsace said:


> Use it with everything.
> It double amps nicely with the RNHP (but of course it does not replaces a Desktop DAC).
> Since I got the OEAUDIO OEOTG Cable that it works flawlessly with my iPhone 13 mini and IEM´s as my Grado Headphone.
> Nevertheless when I fall asleep at night listening to music, in the morning I wake up and the iPhone battery is dead. So for those occasions I'm thinking of getting the RS2 DAP. I really like the R2R type of sound.


A cheaper solution would be this adaptor  which allows a USB C device connection and a USB C charging connection  (~$45)

https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html

its very solid for connection, unlike the apple CCK connectors, but may require a little "whittling" if you use a phone protector case to allow clearance
for the USB C cable and lightning socket

one of the reasons I also use this is that over time (~3 months) lightning to USB Cables, CCK  wear out at the jack if you are using a dongle 20~30 hours a week


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## glpsace (Saturday at 1:48 PM)

davide256 said:


> A cheaper solution would be this adaptor  which allows a USB C device connection and a USB C charging connection  (~$45)
> 
> https://www.ddhifi.com/productinfo/1350761.html
> 
> ...


I agree with you for the last part. That is why I'm thinking about a DAP solution for many situations (iPhone will still be used with the RU6 in many others occasions). I don't believe it would be the best solution to solve my night "issues" since that would stress the battery overtime. Keeping the charger connected all night to the iPhone that will charge it every time the RU6 is sucking the battery juice doesn't seem very healthy, in the long run, for my iPhone.

Nevertheless I really appreciate the suggestion and cheers.


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## wolfstar76 (Saturday at 2:17 PM)

drftr said:


> Have you tried amping the result coming out of RU6 as well?
> 
> drftr


I tried, it was not bad but not as good as I thought. There is no true line out from RU6 and you will be double amping in this case.

However, with RU6 from my desktop, the sound quality rival my desktop setup (Modi Multibit 2 + FA-10, which is over $1k) with IEMs.


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## glpsace

wolfstar76 said:


> I tried, it was not bad but not as good as I thought. There is no true line out from RU6 and you will be double amping in this case.
> 
> However, with RU6 from my desktop, the sound quality rival my desktop setup (Modi Multibit 2 + FA-10, which is over $1k) with IEMs.


Indeed. A lot of mix feelings about the RU6 around the worlds. There is a forum where they bash it from the first to the last post, but I personally love the sound of it and will always find ways to use it, no matter what I will get. I have it connected to the Rupert Neve amp (and what a sweet sound they make together in my Grado Hemp) while I wait for the Bifrost 2/64 DAC to arrive from the European store (out of stock). Afterwards it will go for a pairing with my iPhone for my every day walks outside.


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## Haden2866

drftr said:


> Have you tried amping the result coming out of RU6 as well?
> 
> drftr


I'm double-amping mine with an Analog Artistry Leo - a little 9v 'analog modelled' amp that was crowd-funded a few years ago.
Leo has an adjustable 'effect' mix control - it's actually a bass lift, like a loudness button on some old-school hifi amps.
Works a treat with my Fostex headphones. I'm listening to Only Love From Now On by Carmen Villain on Tidal and it sounds amazing.
I'm <100 hours in and feel like the RU6 is still improving over time.


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## ExTubeGamer

Today I had the pleasure of recieving my RU6 in the mail. I bought it used for just 150€.

This DAC far exceeded my expectations. The sound is perfectly clear but without the treble glare in ESS chips. Especially the instrument seperation is fantastically.


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## Haden2866

glpsace said:


> Indeed. A lot of mix feelings about the RU6 around the worlds. There is a forum where they bash it from the first to the last post, but I personally love the sound of it and will always find ways to use it, no matter what I will get. I have it connected to the Rupert Neve amp (and what a sweet sound they make together in my Grado Hemp) while I wait for the Bifrost 2/64 DAC to arrive from the European store (out of stock). Afterwards it will go for a pairing with my iPhone for my every day walks outside.


I know which forum you mean, and wouldn't pay too much attention to it. I think the culture there is very specific and they seem to enjoy exaggerating tiny, perceived faults of otherwise well received gear, to try and burst the hype bubble for sport, I guess.
The best approach, I find, is to read as many reviews as possible, then take an average of all the sentiments. And listen for yourself, of course.


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## antdroid

A couple months back, I wrote a quick shootout comparison of various dongles, and I ended up ... well picking the one I bought as my favorite... this one, the RU6.

That said, most of these were pretty good, but the RU6 was the most unique sounding, and I enjoyed it for my set of gears.

https://www.audiodiscourse.com/2022/10/dongle-discourse.html


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## ExTubeGamer

The RU6 has a really noticeable slow bass decay. In general instruments decay slow and very natural sounding. This DAC still sounds very resolving, especially how natural micro-details can be presented. Vinyl hiss and and details are getting reproduced very realistically. Your typical ESS chip sounds bright and fast in comparision.

For my taste this is the perfect DAC. At least until a better R2R USB-C DAC gets released on to the quickly changing market.


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## glpsace

ExTubeGamer said:


> The RU6 has a really noticeable slow bass decay. In general instruments decay slow and very natural sounding. This DAC still sounds very resolving, especially how natural micro-details can be presented. Vinyl hiss and and details are getting reproduced very realistically. Your typical ESS chip sounds bright and fast in comparision.
> 
> For my taste this is the perfect DAC. At least until a better R2R USB-C DAC gets released on to the quickly changing market.


My only gripe is the lack of a LO. You can only double amp with it and not use it just as a DAC. Still ok but the first option would have been gold, even if the price would be a little steeper. That is why I'm also getting a RS2 DAP for those occasions (together with whenever a DAP will be better for my needs and my iPhone battery saving).


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## antdroid

a BT dongle version would also be great for a lot of folks. Not sure about the battery consumption though.


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## dharmasteve

We would love to know your IEM preferences. Voting closes on the 14th. 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/the-head-fi-members-poll-for-iems-2022.966386/


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## davide256

antdroid said:


> a BT dongle version would also be great for a lot of folks. Not sure about the battery consumption though.


???  … use a lossy protocol with NOS R2R? Now make it powered like a Mojo, more like a portable Hifiman EF400..that would be very useful… the RU6 does best with planars but they do go through a battery fast


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## fattycheesebeef

I'm facing random interference with RU6. A bit annoying~


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## YanaMJ

fattycheesebeef said:


> I'm facing random interference with RU6. A bit annoying~


Same problem...try a longer usb-c cable


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## glpsace

YanaMJ said:


> Same problem...try a longer usb-c cable


Or maybe a better shielded cable, if you're not using one already.
I´m using this one (in this case it is for my iPhone but the same cable can be purchased usb-c to usb-c) without any issues at all. A great 5V shielded cable. Not cheap tough.


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## YanaMJ

glpsace said:


> Or maybe a better shielded cable, if you're not using one already.
> I´m using this one (in this case it is for my iPhone but the same cable can be purchased usb-c to usb-c) without any issues at all. A great 5V shielded cable. Not cheap tough.


Yes I'm waiting for a shielded cable. I hope to receive it before this week-end.


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## fattycheesebeef

Lol I bought Cayin's USB C to Lightning so I assume it should do its job?


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## YanaMJ

fattycheesebeef said:


> Lol I bought Cayin's USB C to Lightning so I assume it should do its job?


Not sure regarding interference...because this is the same cable than the usbc usbc we find in the box. Not a shielded cable.


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## kadinh

glpsace said:


>


I invested in that same cable and it was well worth it


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## Haden2866

glpsace said:


> Or maybe a better shielded cable, if you're not using one already.
> I´m using this one (in this case it is for my iPhone but the same cable can be purchased usb-c to usb-c) without any issues at all. A great 5V shielded cable. Not cheap tough.


What cable is it?


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## glpsace (Today at 6:35 PM)

Haden2866 said:


> What cable is it?


OEAUDIO OEOTG​
https://www.oeaudio.net/oeotg

You can also find it at audiophonics in France, for those in Europe. This was the only place I found it if my mind doesn't trick me.


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## fattycheesebeef

YanaMJ said:


> Not sure regarding interference...because this is the same cable than the usbc usbc we find in the box. Not a shielded cable.



I see. Quite disappointing when have to purchase something and it's not shielded


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