# CEntrance DACmini DAC/Amplifier Official Thread



## AustinHorn

Michael informed me tonight that my DACmini was shipped out today via FedEx as part of the initial shipment of his new desktop DAC/amp.  All the hardware & software issues that had caused the shipping delay have been successfully resolved. All of the units with fixed outputs were shipped out late Thursday or early Friday. Units like mine, requested with variable outputs were delayed because of a popping sound heard when the units were turned off.  However, he later informed me that that too has been resolved & my unit did go out late & the others requested with variable outputs will follow.


 So all of you who, like me, had DACmini pre-orders should be getting a nice Thankgiving package from CEntrance sometime next week.  I don't know about anyone else, but given the truly excellent  sound quality Mr. Goodman & his staff were able to produce in the little portable DACport, I can't wait to try his newest creation which wlll be much more powerful & should easily be able to power my HE5LE & hopefully the HE6 I plan on ordering. 


 If you haven't visited the CEntrance DACmini website, I suggest you do so.  Michael is going to eventually have 6 different versions of this dac/amp coming out with this initial unit designated the CX model.  I  am very interested in the upcoming KX model which will be a USB DAC + headphone out + power amp + dock (iphone/ipod). Now if I can just talk him into incluing a small remote with the KX, I will be set!


 As folks receive their units, get them burned in & start listening to them, please post your impressions/reviews.  I for one am very anxious to hear what the other early adopter's think of their new miniCX.  I will post my own thoughts here too as I listen to it & compare it to my other dac/amp combo's including the Nuforce udac, CEntrance's own DACport, my Nuforce HDP, & finally my modded Benchmark HDR.


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## myinitialsaredac

Sounds like a good piece of equipment on paper.
   
  I may look into this as an all-in-one solution.
   
  I am awaiting your impressions,
   
  Dave


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## dookie182

same here,
  I've been waiting the arrival of the Dac mini for month, and I'm inpatient to read your feedbacks and listening impressino.
  Does anyone have information about the dac part of the dacmini?
  best regards.
  quentin


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## AustinHorn

My guess is those shipped out 1st, the ones with the fixed outputs, will start being received on Monday. So if those that get them 1st will give everyone some initial impressions, we all will appreciate it.  I expect mine in by Wednesday (I hope or then it likely will be the following Monday due to the Thanksgiving holidays). As soon as I get mine, I'll start the 100 hour burn-in process that I think I read was recommended, but will also give some initial impressions as both a dac & dac/amp combo.  Since Michael swears it is better & a lot more powerful than the DACport, I have very, very high expectations. I have no problem playing most music using my HE5LEs through the DACport, but there are times I wish it had a little more headroom.


 I love my Nuforce HDP as an all around unit & I think I remember Larry reporting that he thought it was just a little better than the DACport or at least had more headroom & I agree to a certain extent, but as a dac, despite it's input/output limitations, I find it to be outstanding with all my tube amps. So I expect the mini to be a big step up both as a dac & as an amp mainly because of the additional power & some preliminary reports from a few who heard the prototype recently said as much.

  
 With luck, some will get them & have time to report early impressions this coming week, even though it is Thanksgiving. I hope so.


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## AustinHorn

I am sooooo ticked. FedEx which has delivered to my house many dozens of times, has never ever gotten hear before 2 p.m. - that is except today! So I was off running my Thanksgiving errands in the a.m. & what do I find, a tag on my door telling me they missed me & would try again tomorrow.  I was back at 10:30a & they'd been here at 9:00ish. I was & am so mad that I didn't get the amp today so I could start burning it in. 
   
  Surely someone here on HeadFi got their mini's today or even yesterday.  I wish some of them would jump in here & give us some impressions. It was my understanding that all of CEntrance's initial run was pre-sold at the lower price & surely some of those folks are Headfier's. Even if they don't report here, maybe they can start a thread of their own so that those of us who are interested can get some feedback and very early comparisons to their other headphone gear.
   
  I plan to stay at the house all day tomorrow but figure 1st on the truck means last off so I again may be back to normal & get my delivery very late in the day.  Time will tell.  Oh well.....


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## darkoroje

I have received DACMini today. The sound quality is great over optical and coax, but unfortunately I have a problem with USB. I have tried it with several computers running Windows 7, Vista and XP and on all computers I get a "This USB  device cannot be recognized". DACMini is shown as "Unknown device" in Hardware Properties. I would be interested to know if anybody else has experienced a similar problem.


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## haarvi

I have used the DACmini with two laptops.  Both running XP.  Both computers accepted the new hardware.  But oddly, 1 of the 2 gave notice that a driver for the new hardware should be sought.  And then, at my ok,  proceeded to find and install the 'appropriate' driver.
  Did you - darkroje - try restarting your computers with the DACmini attached?  That seemed to be necessary for one of my computers.
  Also,
  What should be obvious - but wasn't to me -  is that you need to go to Audio in Sounds and Audio Devices in the Control Panel and select the Centrance Dacmini as your default sound card.
  I have gotten help from MIchael and David at Centrance.  Both by email and phone.  Suggest anyone having issues do the same.


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## myinitialsaredac

Anyone got a report on sound quality?
   
  Im very interested in possibly picking one of these up
   
  Dave


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## AustinHorn

I too finally got my mini from FedEx about an hour or 2 ago.  I've been running it from my PC thru the Bel Canto USB Link to coax & it sounds great. Using my HE5LEs I have the volume on about 2:30 for most songs.  The volume goes from off at about 7 to full on about 5.  So I have plenty of headroom. On my K702s I need to run at about 1 o'clock.  On the same song, I'm running my HD650s at 12:30.  So as Michael said, after RMAF & suggestions by Larry to up the gain some, they did just that.  Now all I need is for someone with a HE6 to tell me if the gain is high enough for it to play them at acceptable levels. 
   
  I have not tried the USB connection but on both my PCs I was able to connect my usb Link device to the PCs & then to the coax & was good to go w/o needing to reboot. So at least with coax, it was plug & play.  One of my PCs is running XP & the other is Vista.
   
  I agree with harrvi, that it is super important for all of us early adopters to report back to CEntrance regarding any issues with this version of the firmware/hardware.  Micheal is a great guy, as I'm sure David is, & has been very responsive to all of my issues & suggestions both regarding the DACport which I use daily with my iPad & also concerning prototype of the DACmini.  So please let them here from you.
   
  I got an email from Micheal today in response to several questions I had & one thing he told me that since no tubes are involved, very little break-in will be needed.  He mentioned that running it in a couple of days ought to do it!  So that is exactly what I will do.  I've got a burn in disc that I use so by Saturday, the mini should be good to go. To my untrained ear it already sounds great.
   
  Looking forward to hearing everyone elses experience & some reviews & comparisons as time goes on.  I have got several dacs, amps, & dac/amps that I plan to do some comparisons with & I'll report my findings. One thing I can already tell, it is a lot more powerful that the CEntrance DACport & I love that thing.  At least at the 2 hour mark, I'll give it 2 big thumbs up. So far so good though it does sound like Michael & Dave may have some firmware tweaking to do so it will be truly plug & play, at least on some Microsoft operating systems.  After dinner I'll try out the usb & see what problems I run into going straight from the PC to the mini.  I also have an M3Tech HiFace 192kHz digital audio interface I'll try via the coax connection. I initially had big problems with it so if I can get those 2 to work together, I assume that will mean that at least the coax link is good to go.


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## AustinHorn

Others can speak for themselves, but soundwise it so far exceeds my expectations, especially on my HE5LE. On the little DACport, which I think is a sonic & engineering marvel, there are times the port just didn't have enough juice to make the HE5LE open up on some songs.  The mini is way more powerful & it allows these phones to really open up.  Even though it is ss it seems to have a warm tube-like sound to my ear, especially in the mids. Anyway, I'm stoked that it will drive anything I own but I want to hear from someone with the HE6.  That is a headphone that I feel sure is in my future (before the price increases in Jan) so I want to make sure that with the increased gain Michael gave it that I can use it on the mini.


 I don't think anyone has mentioned the build quality.  This thing seems to be built like a tank & I love the look & feel. The inputs & outputs seem to be very high quality. The only complaint I have is that the power supply sent out with my unit is a little small.. But Micheal warned me he hadn't received the shipment of power supplies from China intended for the long term production run.  I'll replace it at some point with a bigger one.  Still it has plenty of power as it is.


 Now I have to get me an Apple mini & set up a music/Video server combo with my PC & Apple TV.


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## mgoodman

Hey everyone, Michael here. Thanks for great comments. We are shipping a new unit out to Darco. It sounds like the USB input is not functioning correctly on his unit. Many apologies. This will be corrected at our expense.
   
  Regarding installation on PC, normally this thing is plug-and-play. It's using the same USB section as DACport, so it should install the same way. On some machines the install would be quiet, on others, you would be prompted to say "yes" to a driver installation, but since Microsoft's native driver will be installed (and since it's already on the system) it should go very quick and smooth. On the mac - even simpler.
   
  The customer with two laptops needed to reboot one of his machines and then DACmini worked fine. He'd mentioned some previous issues with that machine. The sound card on that laptop may have been "hard selected" as opposed to letting the OS auto-select, like it usually does. In any case, it would appear that both of his machines are now working well with the DACmini.
   
  My favorite comment so far is "Great WAF". Believe it or not, I had to look it up. What a noob! LOL!
   
  @ AustinHorn: The power supply we shipped is not a large one, but it was tested to provide sufficient juice. Still, if you want a larger one, I can ship it to you. Contact me privately.


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## AustinHorn

Thanks Michael for taking the time to post.  It is greatly appreciated.
   
  I've tested my mini using the USB on my netbook which is an XP machine & it loaded w/o any problems.  However I had the same exact problem as Darco when I 1st received my Nuforce HDP.  After some hair pulling, the problem turned out to be a faulty USB cable (mine, not the one Nuforce sent with the HDP). My point being that sometimes it isn't the hardware or software at all but can be a faulty cable or even a bad adapter.  It can drive you crazy & for me that is a very short trip.
   
  Anyway I hope more folks will provide their impressions as they have the time.  Since it is Thanksgiving week, it may take some time. 
   
  Happy Thanksgiving everyone.


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## darkoroje

Thank you all for your responses. I have tried another USB cable and two more computers and unfortunately the same problem. Michael has emailed me to send the unit back for replacement which I will do. Other than the USB problem, it looks great and the sound quality over optical to my HD 800 is really good. Hopefully I will get a replacement unit quickly.


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## myinitialsaredac

Mind comparing your listening experience on the dacmini to the HDP Austin?
   
  I am really interested in one of these now.
   
  Dave


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## AustinHorn

Quote: 





myinitialsaredac said:


> Mind comparing your listening experience on the dacmini to the HDP Austin?
> 
> I am really interested in one of these now.
> 
> Dave


 


  I have yet to do a side by side comparison yet since the DACmini is burning in as we speak, but both, IMO, play way above their pay grade. Both have excellent dacs & both have at least very good amps & both have RCAs out to my powered speakers & the speakers sound really, really good from either.  My 1st comparison will be to compare these two against one another both as dacs, amps, & dac/amps over the weekend.  My gut tells me that the mini is a little better based on what I'm hearing out of my speakers, but given the price difference, it ought to be a little better.  I can tell you the HDP is one great piece of gear & it alone allowed me to get rid of 4 or 5 other dacs &/or amps I used to own.  I promise to report my own observations as I have a real chance to compare them.


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## myinitialsaredac

Quote: 





austinhorn said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Great I look forward to it as the 3 amp/dacs im trying to choose between are the DACMini, HDP and Burson HA160D. 
   
  I have a gut feeling the dacmini may be the ticket as my source is going to be usb through my computer. 
   
  IF anyone has heard the ha160 and the dacmini and wants to chime in id be interested also.
   
  Dave


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## AustinHorn

Dave,
   
  I personally haven't heard the HA160D but from the review 6moons recently gave it, it must be a giant killer.  I have heard the Weiss DAC 2 & it was on my wish list (or more likely "wouldn't it be nice" list) & according to the review the Burson is better as a dac. I was shocked.  So if your budget allows, my guess is that it wouldn't be much of a risk to buy it . Personally if you can. I'd recommend you wait until there are some pro reviews & HeadFi reviews of both units & make your decision from that, plus the existing reviews on the HDP..
   
  Based on about 24 hours I can tell you the DACmini is sounding great to me. However, I don't have the ear of some of the senior review guys around here like Headphone Addict & Skylab plus some others. But I do know what I like, & I am really liking the sound of this unit & it is only supposed to get better over the next two days.


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## myinitialsaredac

Quote: 





austinhorn said:


> Dave,
> 
> I personally haven't heard the HA160D but from the review 6moons recently gave it, it must be a giant killer.  I have heard the Weiss DAC 2 & it was on my wish list (or more likely "wouldn't it be nice" list) & according to the review the Burson is better as a dac. I was shocked.  So if your budget allows, my guess is that it wouldn't be much of a risk to buy it . Personally if you can. I'd recommend you wait until there are some pro reviews & HeadFi reviews of both units & make your decision from that, plus the existing reviews on the HDP..
> 
> Based on about 24 hours I can tell you the DACmini is sounding great to me. However, I don't have the ear of some of the senior review guys around here like Headphone Addict & Skylab plus some others. But I do know what I like, & I am really liking the sound of this unit & it is only supposed to get better over the next two days.


 
   
  I plan to wait for reviews on those two units.
   
  How does the DACMini sound vs the HDP?
   
  Dave


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## AustinHorn

myinitialsaredac said:


> I plan to wait for reviews on those two units.
> 
> How does the DACMini sound vs the HDP?
> 
> Dave








I've actually have started comparing them this afternoon on various types of music & both are very,very good. It is a little early for me to make a final assessment but it appears the mini has a warmer feel w/o losing any of the details. I'd call it tube like, which for me is a +. So far I've only used my HD 650s but plan to try my HE5LEs, RS2s, my 600ohm Beyer 880s, & various IEMs I own.


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## dookie182

Too much suspens. are you all dead from audio orgasm????
  looking forward for your impressions. 
  respectfully


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## AustinHorn

OK, I've spent a lot of the weekend listening to my new DACmini & comparing it with my other gear, especially with the Newforce HDP ( also a combo dac/amp) & my other main desktop amp, the mighty Audio-GD Phoenix. All I can say is I'm very impressed by this mini. To be honest, I'm by nature a tube guy, so while I can really appreciate solid state gear, I tend to do most of my music listening via tube amps feeding either my speakers or, when the wife is home, via my headphones or IEMs.

Well, for headphones, that could change, I love the sound of the mini on all my full sized headphones but especially the HD 650s, to my untrained ear these two go to gather like coffee & donuts. After the short 2 day recommended by CEntrance, I really settled in & started listening to it. My setup for most of my sessions was using my pc to feed my M2 Tech HighFace USB to SPIDF feeding the coax connection on the DACmini. My music was via Media Monkey using flac files. Starting out I would listen to the DACmini for about 30 minutes & then I'd swishing & listen to the same songs with the same sets of headphones on the HDP. Going back & forth like that for most of 2 evenings, it became clear to me that on almost all the headphones, I preferred the mini. I found the Nuforce, for the 1st time, to sound slightly sterile compared to the DACmini. If I hadn't known better, I would have thought I was listening to a high end tube amp or hybrid. I find it a warm sound w/o benign colored in any way. I felt the base is very tight & the highs very extended & transparent. But it was the mids where I felt the mini bested the HDP to my ear. Not relying only on my headphones, I routed the music out to my PC speakers, the Audioengine 5s & that move only reinforced my opinion that this is a very special dac/amp combo. In fact last night I got so involved in what I was hearing that I totally forgot to do my switching back & forth, but spent over 2 hours just listening to the music.

Let me be clear, I love the Nuforce HDP a lot, but I'm not the first to say that it's main strength is it's dac rather than it's amp. I have used it for most of the time I've owned it as the dac I use to feed my tube amps. I love it's super small footprint & it's overall flexibility. Had I not heard the mini in a direct comparison, I would have said it was the very best ss dac/amp combo I've ever heard, certainly anywhere in it's price range. When I got the DACport , I did a similar comparison & found it to have much more power than the port so it was a better fit for my harder to drive headphones such as the HE5LE. Still I preferred the tone of the DACport to the HDP & it became & still is my preferred device to use as a portable with my IEMs or with my Grados or 840 headphones. I use it daily with my iPad. So as I've said before, I find the DACmini a DACport on steroids. It will drive all of my headphones including the K702s & HE5LEs to acceptable levels. The one headphone that I have that on a couple od songs I wished I had more headroom on are my new (to me) Beyerdynamic 880 600 ohm cans. With it, I sometimes felt I needed a bit more gain to hear a particular song the way I normally would listen to it. No I do like to listen to music louder than most of the rest of my family so this may not be a problem. However, I did talk to Micheal at CEntrance about it & we will discuss it with his folks. The gain issue is a tough one cause they want to be able to use the mini with IEMs as well as full size hard to drive headphones is a balancing act he said. This is the one area where I felt the HDP was a tiny bit better. To my ear it seemed to be able to play my hard-to-drive full-size headphones to a little higher levels than the mini. Buy 90% of the time, even on the Beyers or HE5LEs both amps played each song beyond even my comfortable listing levels. So I don't think it is a big issue. But since I plan to buy the HE 6, before the introductory price goes up, I must assume it won't be a good match for the DACmini at current gain levels. 

I do plan to do a lot of listening this week with the DACmini using all my IEM, something I havent done. My expectation is that it will be a perfect match for my IEMs. I look forward to testing out that expectation. I also plan to do more testing of the mini as just a dac & just an amp driven by another of my dads, especially my new EE Minimax 32 bit tube dac. I will report back my findings( or really my opinions, which is what they really are). I'm still hoping more headfi early adopters will report their own thoughts on their own experiences with this new production model of the DACmini

Let me know if you have any questions. Ion now a by any means a practiced reviewer & my relatively short time with this unit means I've only just started my planned effort at seeing how it performs & explore it's main strengths or weaknesses. So far, I can say it is a keeper & will be with me for a long time.


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## lmf22

I received the DACmini today.  Sounds pretty good with the DT990 (600 ohm).  It definitely has more power than the DACport.  I listen with the volume control at about 10-11 o'clock positions.  I found that the treble is very smooth with good bass and midrange.  My initial impressions of it is similar to AustinHorn, especially the part about the sound of a hybrid tube amp. 
   
  A few questions:
  When using the USB input, what should the Windows Sound setting be set to?  24-bit 44000Hz or 24-bit 96000Hz?  Also, should the Windows volume control be automatically disabled?  I can still control the volume using the Windows volume control (the one next to the clock on the task bar). 
   
  I've also noticed that there is a bit more clarity with the optical input compared to USB?  Is that possible since the USB input is supposed to be bit-perfect?  Or am I just imagining things?
   
  By the way, I'm using iTunes (Quicktime set to Windows Audio Session) and Windows 7 (64-bit).


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## AustinHorn

Sorry for the delay in responding, but my wife has had a lot of Christmas prep related chores for me plus I've been working 14 hour days. I recommend you direct all those questions to Michael Goodman at CEntrance.  My DACmini installed auto"magically" so I didn't mess with any of the settings on the PCs.
   
  I now have over 300 hours on my mini & I like it even more than my DACport & I love my DACport. However, after going through all of my headphones & many of my IEMs I have to say I really can't recommend it for either the Beyer 880/600 ohm headphones or any of the orthos which are as difficult to drive as either the HE5, my HE5LEs, or especially the HE6.  There is just no headroom on it, with those headphones.  However, it sounds great with the HD650, Shure SRH840, Grado 320si & RS2 plus all my IEMs.  I liked the tone more & more as time went on & felt the base tightened up & extended as time went on and the highs became cleaner & even more extended.  Sonically, I prefer it to the Nuforce as an all around ss dac/amp but it is very close.  However, if you want to use hard to drive full-size orthodynamic or 600 ohm headphones, I'd steer you towards the Nuforce HDP. It just has more headroom.  In fact, I prefer my DACport with my HE5LEs.  I got my DACmini with variable RCA out volume capability so I could use it with my powered PC speaker setup, & maybe that somehow impacted my overall headroom.  I'm still happy, 'cause I prefer my HE5LEs, 880s, & 702s running balanced from my Phoenix anyway, but it would have been nice if the mini was at least as powerful as the HDP & could drive them.  Michael told me in an e-mail that hey were worried about being able to use IEMs with the mini but in my opinion, most folks will tend to use the DACport more often with IEMs than the mini. I feel that CEntrance should have targeted the mini toward harder to drive phones or maybe put in a variable switch or knob.
   
  So, I love the sound, especially with my HD 650s & IEMs, but it lacks power with harder to drive phones - IMO.  But I plan to keep it & use it with my new Xmas gift, an Apple mini.


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## AustinHorn

Man, I have to say I am very impressed with the CEntrance staff. After reading my comments regarding the inability of my DACmini to drive either my 600 ohm Beyers & my HE5LEs to acceptable levels, they've offered to send me a new DACmini tuned to drive both headphones to compare with my existing mini & I can then return the one I end up liking least. Now that is what I call great customer service! I would advise anyone wanting to buy the CEntrance DACmini to communicate with the CEntrance staff what headphone gear they're going to use with the mini so they can avoid this issue. I will report on my findings on the comparison of the two mini's. 

In the mean time, I can't think of any vendor who I am more impressed with than I've been with this company! They are great people who produce very impressive products. I have way too many dacs & amps currently & plan to sell several of them in the near future, but I won't be selling either my DACport or DACmini anytime soon.


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## harpua

That is awesome proactive customer service.


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## AustinHorn

Well, it is now Jan 7th & I've yet to receive the promised 2nd unit or even a shipping notice.  I will count it as primarily a holiday delay plus prepping for CES. Still, I'd expected them to follow through on their promises in a more timely manner than this.  I'll post it when/if I do receive the second unit.  Obviously, they don't have to do this, so if they do, it will be a super bonus to be able to compare the new unit on my harder to drive headphones & then keep the unit that works best with those headphones.  Also, I should receive my new Audeze LCD-2 headphones tomorrow so I'm hoping that second mini will show up soon too. I'd love to see how both DACminis work with it as well as with my 600 ohm 880s & my HE5LEs.  Of course, I already know the last 2 are not ideal companions for my current mini as stated above.  I've read the LCD-2 is easier to drive than HE5LE, so maybe it will work well with it. 
   
  Oh well, time will tell whether CEntrance really does ever ship that promised second unit. Maybe after CES....


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## Jay Listens

Sorry for the delay. Its completely my fault. Our staff has been very busy prepping both DACmini PX (integrated power amp) and our MasterClass Coaxial speakers in order to show them at CES.
   
  I should have communicated the shipping time line more accurately. In all honestly I was hoping we could have sent it out before CES. So again, my apologies.
   
  In any event, it was delivered to FedEx yesterday and should arrive shortly and we are eagerly awaiting your feedback.


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## AustinHorn

Got it today & just hooked it up. I know ss amps aren't supposed to need a lot of burn-in but at least subjectively, I feel I noticed some auditory improvements in my mini over the 1st 30-50 hours. So although I plan to do an initial comparison on how each mini drives my hard-to-drive headphones, I want to wait until the 50 hour mark to start my overall comparison as to the relative sound & matching of each of these two mini's as to how they sound with all my full size headphones, as well as with my IEMs. 

I did just get my Audes'e LCD-2s late last week & learned my 1st DACmini drive it very well. In fact, I found the two to be an excellent match. Though again I would have liked a little more headroom on some songs but hopefully this re-tuned mini will solve that issue with it & also with my HE5LEs & my 880s (600 ohm). 

Again, I can't tell you how impressed I am for CEntrance to do this & do it w/o me even suggesting it. Given that I love their gear anyway, it makes it a slam dunk for me to recommend them to anyone who needs a great dac/amp combo. I have both the DACport & mini & love them both. I'm looking forward to their other models as they are produced, especially the preamp! 

Regarding the delay, I completely understood. It was still the holiday season coupled with CES going on plus a backlog of orders on a new product. I only mentioned it in response to some pm's I'd received ask how the new unit sounded. Anyway, it's all good...


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## AustinHorn

Quick update:  I just did a 1 - 2 back & forth with the old mini & the new one on their ability to drive the HE5LE & the 600 ohm Beyer 880s & the new DACmini is at least 2-4 clicks louder.  The new amp has more headroom with both. There is no doubt their retuning gave this DACmini a comparable loudness on those headphones to the Nuforce HDP - a definite improvement in my book since I now can drive all the songs I've so far listened to  to more than acceptable levels. This was something I was unable to do with the original mini. The HDP will definitely drive those headphones to more acceptable levels. Even my wife, who hates loud music, thought my original mini needed more "omfh" with both the HE5LE & the Beyer.  It was fine with the K702s & HD650.  It was also a wonderful match with the Grado RS-2s & SR325is, something I hadn't expected 'cause I normally only like my Grado's on tube amps - too bright otherwise.  Not so on the DACmini.  Just for kicks, I tried my fav IEMs, the UE 3X10 & they were still great too.  No feedback or noise.  Still, as I said before, I use my IEMs mostly with my DACport with either my iPad or iPod Touch. Still it is nice to know that upping the volume level doesn't prevent one from using IEMs too. I know that was an issue Michael & I talked (argued) about more than once. I generally don't believe that the DACmini would be a target device for someone who favors IEMs as their primary ear speakers. 
   
  Now I'm going to match up this new mini with a cd player & run it 50 hours straight playing my break-in disk set on repeat. After that, I'll pull out all of my headphone gear, including IEMs & compare both mini's to each other & to my Nuforce HDP.


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## Jay Listens

We're really excited you like the modification (so far)!!!
   
  Looking forward to your full evaluation.


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## Jay Listens

What's the impedance of the UE3X10?


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## AustinHorn

Wow! The combo of the DACmini & LCD-2 is really something. It has plenty of headroom on my stock mini & even more on the "tuned" model. But the extra volume is really only needed with the Beyers & HE5LEs. Now whether it will have the power for the HE6 as it sets I don't know. I haven't heard the HE6 & to my knowledge this is the only mini produced so far they've done this on - thought they'd have to confirm that. I know headphone addict had suggested they give it more volume when he heard it at their booth. He too loved it, but with his Orthos, but said it needed more power for them & phones like the T1. Anyway, to anyone considering a single ended amp for the LCD-2. This one is hard to beat. Best I've heard be it ss or tubed & I have a bunch of the more popular amps. It is very tube like & I admit to a tube bias! Anyway, 2 bigs thumbs up for the combo.


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## AustinHorn

The UE triplefi X10vi like mine has an impedance of 32 ohms!
   
  So on both the old & "tuned" mini's I'm able to run 32 ohms with a totally black background, no hum & also play my 600 ohm Beyer 880s, but with a bit more of the needed headroom on your tuned model. Again, my LCD-2s sound great on either & have plenty of headroom.  The HE5LE does better on this "tunded" up model - again more headroom!  I'd like someone with the HE6 to check out the one with the additional gain.  Oh well....
   
  So far I've tried all the following IEM's on the new mini with no problem:
   
  UE triplefi X10vi
  Moster Turbines & Monster Turbine Pro Coppers
  Etymotic hf5s, er6, er6i & er4s
  Klipsch Image X-10i
  Shure se530
  Westone 3
   
  Regarding full-size headphones:
  Ultrasone hfi-700
  Shure srh840
  Senn. HD650
  AKG K702 & K701
  Grado RS-2 & sr325is
  Beyerdynamic DT 880
  Hifiman HE5LE
  Audez'e LCD-2
   
  On the original unit, both the HE5LE & 880 were a bit underpowered.  On the increased gain unit, both played pretty well, though I think the HE5LE would like even more power. On it I don't think 5 or even 6 volts would be too much.  I hear the same is true of the HE6 (even more so) but at least I don't feel it is really underpowered.
   
  I can't tell any tonal differences in the two units & that is a good thing.  I think all your DACmini's ought to have the gain set at least as high as the one you sent me & not a tick or two higher. I know Michael still won't agree, but I don't think you are going to be selling most of your units to IEM users.  This is a desktop unit & at this price & quality, people with T1s 880s & 990s; HD6XXs & HD 800s; HE5, HE5LE, HE6s; LCD1s & 2s are going to be your target buyers.
   
  You guys need to get a beefed up DACmini to Headphone Addict, & Skylab ASAP for review.  Headphone Addict said that he loved your demo model at one of the shows but said he told Michael that it needed more gain.  I think the gain on the one you sent me is good, but even a tick or two more gain would be better. But I'm happy with mine since my primary headphone from this point on will be the LCD-2. When you come out with your pre-amp models, I'd like to see you do two things:  1) Up the power even a bit more & 2) add at least one set of balanced inputs & both a 3 pin & 4 pin output. If so, I'd be first in line to buy & I'd sell a ton of other gear.  Oh & also add a 32 bit sabre chip to the dac while you're at it.  Need to keep up with the "Jones" & that 32 bit dac chip makes an audible difference.
   
  Thanks guys for sending me the modded second unit. I'll return the unmodded one this week.  I'd like a little more comparison time as the new unit gets broken in.  I'd like to do more comparisons with my other dac/amp combos. I'm thinking I can greatly simplify my dac/amp gear now with this unit meeting most if not all my ss needs other than keeping my Phoenix for my Balanced headphones (at least until you guys produce a balanced amp)! I'll still keep some of my tube amps, cause I'm a "tube" kind of guy, but I feel sure my go to dac/amp when I'm on the PC will be this new DACmini.  Very impressed with the sound & finally, with the additional power! I'm a happy camper!  Thanks again!  THAT IS CUSTOMER SERVICE!

  
  Quote: 





jay listens said:


> What's the impedance of the UE3X10?


----------



## pekingduck

It's an interesting product but I have to wonder why there are so few impressions so far?
   
  Also, it's strange that the DACmini is still not available at CEntrance's store yet...


----------



## rymd

Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> It's an interesting product but I have to wonder why there are so few impressions so far?


 

 Quote:



> the DACmini is still not available at CEntrance's store yet...


----------



## AustinHorn

It is there. Go to the web store & the DACmini CX is there for sale. They do need to update their web site I think to make getting to everything easier.
   
  If you Google the DACmini it will lead you to the product page for a little more info.


----------



## AustinHorn

Here is part of a comment HeadphoneAddict (Larry) made on the "Amps for the LCD02" in response to something I'd said.
   
  "I loved my LCD-2 with the DACmini at RMAF.  While the HDP is a nice match for the LCD-2, the DACmini was more refined, smoother and more transparent sounding with the LCD-2 (and as a bonus much smoother sounding with the HD800, and still a good match for my HE-5 LE)."
   
  True this dac/amp is brand new, but if you read the professional reviews of the DACport, which has been around much longer, you'll see these guys know their business.  Now that CES is over I hope Michael & the guys will get key folks here on HeadFi to do some reviews. I know he told me that he planned to do that. NOW wouldn't be toooooo soooooon IMHO!


----------



## budx3385

Yup, I love my DACport, too, so I am now very interested in this new DACmini.
   
  But one question ---
   
  the website says "Future-proof USB implementation features full 24/96 resolution" and mine sounds great with 24/96
   
  but there are several mainstream places now to buy 24/192 FLAC downloads, such as LINN and HDTracks, so when does Michael say it will handle 192KHz via USB, instead of just S/PDIF? Is it even possible via USB, or will we all need to buy Macs and get a Firewire USB-DAC?


----------



## pekingduck

24/192 is possible via USB. The Ayre QB-9 already supports that (though special driver is required)
  
  Quote: 





budx3385 said:


> Yup, I love my DACport, too, so I am now very interested in this new DACmini.
> 
> But one question ---
> 
> ...


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi guys. Michael and I work together at CEntrance. Thanks for bringing this to our attention, we will be updating the website shortly to minimize the confusion.
   
  The reason we used "future proof" was to indicate that our solution will not require any drivers when new versions of OS are released.
  Our technology is class compliant, so that when you upgrade your computer, you won't need to hunt for new drivers. Our products will work right away.
   
  We have been in the business of writing drivers for various pro audio and audiophile vendors for over a decade and the philosophy behind our current USB solution is that it won't "break" due to an OS update. We have seen this happen time and again in pro audio and as a result wanted to avoid this issue with our DAC products. 
   
  As always thanks for the input, as we rely our your feedback in order to deliver great products.


----------



## budx3385

Hi there Jay --- thanks for the clarification on the future LOL
   
  Seriously, since the DACmini can handle 192 via S/PDIF, does that mean that it will someday (soon?) be able to handle 192 via USB?
   
  just for clarification ...


----------



## Jay Listens

There are a variety of options we are looking at. Like I mentioned we have been consulting many other companies on computer interfacing technology (USB, FireWire, etc.) for over a decade. So it would be very reasonable to expect us to also be at the leading edge of 192. We just want to make sure we are implementing it in a way that best serves our customers.
   
  Currently any 192 USB solution is susceptible to compatibility issues after an OS update (ie driver incompatibility). We want to avoid this issue entirely and make sure we deliver products that stand the test of time.
   
  All that being said, I would expect a number of higher resolution devices from CEntrance in the near future.


----------



## ak3r

How near is "near future" ?


----------



## Jay Listens

Well we showed our DACmini PX (integrated DAC and amp) and our MasterClass Coaxial Speakers at CES.
   
  http://www.stereophile.com/content/centrace-dacmini-px
   
  They are slated for release in the summer and we are hoping to have a higher than 96kHz products later this year.
   
  One thing that has been a decade-long focus for us is our USB drivers. We are already licensing 192kHz USB drivers. It can often be overlooked, but I would be cautious about buying a product from a company that outsources its drivers and does not write them internally.


----------



## budx3385

This is all good news, Jay - thank you !!!


----------



## ak3r

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Well we showed our DACmini PX (integrated DAC and amp) and our MasterClass Coaxial Speakers at CES.
> 
> http://www.stereophile.com/content/centrace-dacmini-px
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the information! Interesting!


----------



## AustinHorn

Thanks Jay. Now that my new DACmini was "fixed" by you guys I would like to see if it is now powerful enough to drive the HE6 (which don't own) so I was hoping you guys at CEntrance might fix another mini & try it with an HE6. Any possibility of your doing that? Let me know.


----------



## Jay Listens

We're here to help! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  According to the spec for the HE6, they have an impedance of 50 ohms. 
   
  Your tests show that the DACmini you have can drive the UE X10v (@32ohms) and the Beyer 880s (@600ohms). So, DACmini should be more than powerful enough to drive the HE6.


----------



## AustinHorn

I hear you, but with Orthos, ohms aren't really the whole story. Specs on a lot of amps seem to indicate that a lot of them ought to be able to drive them well, but the truth is many/most can't. At least they can't make them sound their best. My 1st DACmini, for what ever reason wasn't really able to drive either the Beyers or the HE5LEs to their best. The new one does a much better job but still sounds greaat on all my IEMs which still have a totally black noise floor. Much appreciated. 

By the way, the old mini is on it's way back to CEntrance. Thanks a lot guys, great pro-active custormer service.


----------



## vincents

AustinHorn - thanks for your insights. 
   
  Interested in your views to assist me going forward.
   
  I have a DACport which was my first external DAC and pairs beautifully with my K702's. Since then I have acquired an Audi-gd NFB-11 DAC/HeadAmp which uses the ESS 9018 dac chip and now I have acquired a pair of LCD-2.
   
  The DACport was usually about 2:30 pm on the dial whilst the NFB-11 doesn't get past 9 o'clock so has plenty of muscle in reserve. For my listening the DACport worked well with the 702's perhaps softening them a touch whilst the Audio-gd with the ESS 9018 seems a bit more revealing and pairs well with the LCD-2 (I like my treble ! and mainly listen to accoustic/vocals) although as the LCD-2 has had more use it or its cable has opened up more and may be the differences are not so great. 
   
  But my main rig Meridian CD player is dying so it may be time to acquire another source (probably a MacMini this time) and another DAC for the main rig.  I see in your profile that you have the EE unit which also uses the Sabre ESS 9018 chip and is a very similar price to the DACmini.
   
  Could you share your insights into how the EE versus DACmini might compare tone / PRAT wise for a main rig feeding an integrated amp and floor standing speakers ?
   
  many thanks - Vincent


----------



## AustinHorn

Quote: 





vincents said:


> AustinHorn - thanks for your insights.
> 
> Interested in your views to assist me going forward.
> 
> ...


 
  In all honesty, I see the two as very different animals which have very different niches they fill.
   
  In one statement I can say that the EE dac, being fed from my modded HIface USB/BNC connector, can make any headphone amp I own sound BETTER with my headphones than I've ever heard them sound before. That is the bottom line. Using the DACmini as a dac only, makes any amp sound AS GOOD with headphones as any dac before, even my , highly modded, high dollar Benchmark HDR. Soundwise, tonewise, PRaTwise, the EE with that Sabre 9018 is just a better pure DAC.  But the DACmini is a better buy 'cause they cost about the same & the DACmini is a great dac, a better headphone amp, & can also feed my powered PC speakers for essentially the same money. So it gives me a lot more bang for the buck. With this economy, & money being so tight, if I could buy only one, it would be the DACmini.  That isn't even a hard decision.  Thank goodness, I can afford to own both, at least right now. The combo will allow me to sell a lot of gear I've accumulated over the past few years & will make my wife very happy.
   
  I plan for the DACmini to eventually be paired with an Apple TV/Apple Mini for a really nice music/video/TV system in my home office. The EE will eventually end up with my main home theater (maggie based 1.7s, MMGs, + CCR) speaker system, either as a supplement to or even replacement for the HDR.
   
  Now, I haven't yet heard the new Burson Audio dac/amp combo but it seems to be getting rave reviews, but I'd be shocked if that combo is much, if any better as a one box solution for a PC than my DACmini. But the Burson is $200+ more & much bigger the DACmini, with the small footprint, is a better fit for me anyway.  Me, I love the very small footprint of the DACmini & it sounds wonderful with my LCD-2, HE5LE, & my 600 ohm Beyer 880s (finally).   
   
  I currently use my EE as a front end for my AudioGD Phoenix & that is a combo made in heaven running balanced. I've never heard my HD-650s sound sooooo good as with that amp & a balanced cable from SSA. Same for my K702s, HE5LEs, & 880s.  I don't have a balanced cable for my LCD-2 yet, but it will be my birthday gift to myself in February if uncle sam cooperates on my 2010 taxes.   Hope this helps.
   
  Best of luck with your decision. Feel free to PM me if you have other questions.


----------



## vincents

HI Thanks - a good insight. Yes I will be interested to see more reviews of the DAC quality of the Burson - as here in Oz it is much cheaper than the DACmini and a touch more than the EE.
   
  Thanks again for all your posts which are helpful to many of us here !
   
  Vincent


----------



## AustinHorn

Quote: 





vincents said:


> HI Thanks - a good insight. Yes I will be interested to see more reviews of the DAC quality of the Burson - as here in Oz it is much cheaper than the DACmini and a touch more than the EE.
> 
> Thanks again for all your posts which are helpful to many of us here !
> 
> Vincent


 
  Yeah, given where you are, I'd jump at the Burson dac/amp.  Every review I've read says it is great. Several talk about what a wonderful match it is with the LCD-2.  So I don't see a downside.   However, if you're after a preamp front end for your speaker system, I'd probably lean toward the EE or one of the other more expensive dacs with the 32 bit sabre chip. Running on my maggies, I can tell a significant difference between the EE & any of my 24 bit dacs - much more so than on headphones. Also, I'm a tube guy & I think that tube preamp also makes a difference you just don't get in solid state. Even my wife noticed the improvement & that was a big shock to me. She doesn't know an headphone amp from a portable radio.
   
  Also, thanks for the kind words.  I hope some of what I say will keep others from making some of the mistakes I've made.  That can get expensive. I've been helped several times by others here so if I can return the favor with someone else, that's great.


----------



## SennSean

Hi AustinHorn,
   
  I'm using DACport with my HD650 and like it better than the Nuforce Icon HDP (auditioned it extensively).
  Been planning to get a desktop DAC/Amp combo (better connectivity options than the DACport) for both headphones & speakers.
  You've mentioned that the DACmini is like a DACport on steroid, so how does the HD650 sound on the DACmini compare to the DACport?
  I'd imagine they sound the same, just that the DACmini is able to give more headroom to harder-to-drive headphones right?
   
  Thank you.


----------



## AustinHorn

sennsean said:


> Hi AustinHorn,
> 
> 
> 
> ...





 


You hit the nail on the head, similar sound signature, but with a bit more base clout & treble extension. I love my HD650s on them. The only ss amp I prefer them with is my Phoenix & that is in balanced mode.

I love my DACmini setup with my PC. I turn it on it's side so it has a tiny footprint. I use it with my powered Audioengine5 speakers & it is about as good as it gets. It really does rival my maggie surround sound system thoough on a much smaller scale. Highly recommended.

NOTE: I will say, that if you just plan to just listen to your HD650s from your amp, then I'm
not sure I'd pay another $700+ for the mini.. I think my DACport sounds 90%+ as good as my mini with my Senn.headphone. I can only tell the tiny differences by going back & forth & then only on certain songs. Hope this helps.


----------



## SennSean

Well... I'll only be using HD650 & DT880 (250Ohm)... 
  I was so surprised that the cigar sized DACport could drive both of them so well...
   
  Yea... I'm not gonna get any other headphones and I don't have any powered speakers at the moment...
  So I'd probably save the $700+ since they both sounds so similar...
   
  Both the port & mini are great products... 
  If the local reseller had brought in the DACmini I'd probably went with it for future upgrading options...
  But the DACport is about just as good for me...
   
  Thank you so much Austin ^^
  And Kudos to CEntrance!


----------



## AustinHorn

You're so welcome. I hate to kill a sell for Micheal & the CEntrance guys 'cause they are the best, but from everything you say, you'd be better off keeping your bucks until you have an unmet need that the DACport won't fill. This CX mini is only the 1st of several variations they have planned & down the line one of them may better meet your needs than the CX.  I know I plan to upgrade myself when they introduce their preamp version.  I hope at some point they go to a 32 bit dac chip & provide for both balanced inputs/outputs too, but time will tell.... I plan to be a longterm customer based on their 1st two dac/amps.
   
  All the best in the future SennSean.
  
  Quote: 





sennsean said:


> Well... I'll only be using HD650 & DT880 (250Ohm)...
> I was so surprised that the cigar sized DACport could drive both of them so well...
> 
> Yea... I'm not gonna get any other headphones and I don't have any powered speakers at the moment...
> ...


----------



## bcwang

Wow, how did I now hear about the Dacmini until now? 
   
  Now I've heard "totally black background" and "completely silent" before but have been let down many more times than not.  Does the Dacmini really really have no hiss with the most sensitive of IEMs? 
   
  How much volume control on sensitive IEMs do you have, good channel balance at even very low volumes? 
   
  Be really critical about the answers if you have to, even the slightest hint of hiss or the slightest imbalance at the lowest of volumes will probably be a disastrous plain as day flaw once I plug my headphones into it.  This has just simply been my experience.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## mgoodman

Please ping HeadphoneAddict. He has already written about DACmini. Now he has his own unit and has been giving it a critical spin recently.


----------



## bcwang

I don't think HeadphoneAddict will be able to give feedback on those matters to the degree I require.  That's why I've put this question out there for feedback from others as well. 
   
  What will be very interesting is if the Centrance folks were able to answer these due to measured performance with sensitive equipment.  The trouble I have with most equipment is the inability to use well with IEMs because of high levels of hiss and very poor channel matching on very low volume dial levels.  I wonder how well this model pairs with sensitive IEMs.
   
  My current benchmark for inaudible hiss is the Ray Samuels Tomahawk, and for fine volume adjustment with perfect matching the Pico Slim.  I've found nothing else satisfactory when using IEMs so far.


----------



## AustinHorn

Hey BC, it has been a while.  Yeah with your super ears you probably need to talk to Michael & his staff 'cause just because I don't hear anything but a very black background on mine with any of my IEMS won't mean it won't sound to you like being inside a subway tunnel with a train passing.
   
  I have a number of very sensitive IEMs that I've tried with my DACmini & I've had zero problems. In fact my unit's gain was "upped" for me to allow it to match better with my hard to drive full-size phones & still don't hear any hiss with any of my IEMs including my favorites, Westone3, 3X10s, or Monster Coppers. I no longer have any custom fit IEMs, thanks to our new puppy.
   
  If you're interested in the mini, please talk to Micheal or one of the other CEntrance guys & I bet they can tune a CX for even your sensitive ear. I for one would be very interested in "hearing" bach from you here after you've had a chance to try a mini out.  I think it was on the Nuforce HDP thread where we exchanged some posts concerning that unit's "background hiss" issue with you, though I could be wrong.  I monitor lots of threads though I seldom actually post so it could have been another thread.


----------



## bcwang

Hey AustinHorn,
   
  Yup, it was the HDP thread where we were talking about hiss and volume issues with the HDP.   I now use my HDP as a source feeding the Pico Slim when I want to use my IEMs with it.  That's solved the problem for me. 
   
  So would you say the DACmini sounds better than your HDP? 
   
  It was funny when I was first heard about the DACmini I was imagining it being some really small thing, smaller than the dacport.  It was when I finally saw enough pictures of it that I realized it's called DACMini not because it is mini, but because it is the exact same size as a MACmini!


----------



## AustinHorn

bcwang said:


> Hey AustinHorn,
> 
> Yup, it was the HDP thread where we were talking about hiss and volume issues with the HDP.   I now use my HDP as a source feeding the Pico Slim when I want to use my IEMs with it.  That's solved the problem for me.
> 
> ...




I thought it was that thread. Glad to know I remembered correctly.

 Comparing the two, I find the dacs pretty comparable, but much prefer the more 3D warmer sound of the DACmini. I'd call it very hybrid-like. My plan is to eventually buy an Apple mini to match with it for a music/video system in my home office. First I need to sell off some gear that I'm really not using enough any more. But I will be keeping my DACport & DACmini for the long haul. As a one-box solution I do prefer it to the HDP. but it does cost a lot more so deciding performance/cost-benefit becomes a very personal matter. If you just want to use the unit primarily as a dac to feed other gear, either will do a fine job.


----------



## SennSean

Quote: 





austinhorn said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 If I am looking for an upgrade, I thought the DACmini would be a good choice. But for the price, I can have both the DACport & the HDP (for it's preamp, line in, spdif).
  I said in my previous post that I did prefer the tone of the DACport slightly to the HDP, and my HD650 really sounds great on both.
  From pictures, the DACmini looks better than the HDP and it's built like a tank.
  I found the CEntrance sound signature to be a better match for both the HD650 & DT880 (250Ohm), while the HDP sometimes can be a bit painful to the already bright sounding DT880 (to my ears).
  The only other equipment I have tested so far which matches both of them well was the Lavry Da11 but it's way out of my budget.
  However, I'm still not sure about the price premium for the 10%+ improvement from my DACport I get from the mini.
   
  I hope you can give me your valuable opinions regarding which is a better buy.
  Keep the DACport + get the HDP or just get the DACmini and call it a day.
  Is the amp section of your "tuned" DACmini as powerful compared to the HDP and your previously owned HA160.
   
  Thank you.


----------



## AustinHorn

I'd advise you to go for the DACmini.  The clincher in that advice is this is a situation where two are not better than one. The sonic characteristics of the HDP, IMHO, will never ever be a good match for the Beyer's, Having a DACport too won't make up for that. I have all 3 amps mentioned & the one advantage of having the DACport is that with my iPad + an external power supply, I can have that same great sound signature when I'm out & about or in the car. But if I had to choose to keep only 1 unit, hands down I'd choose the mini. It in one unit contains all the advantages of each of the other two & none of the weakness/limitations each of they have. So it is the best buy for you in my opinion at any price. You'd have to spend a lot more & buy the new Burson dac/amp combo to have comparable/better flexibility/features, & I still slightly prefer the tone of the mini to the Burson. 
   
  My "tuned" DACmini has more power/volume than the HDP but even my original stock mini never had any problem driving my HD650 & it could have easily driven the 250ohm version of the 880. I'd suggest you ask CEntrance to "tune" your mini anyway since, if you are like most of us, you'll someday want to try harder to drive headphones like the T1s, or Orthos like my HE5LE, LCD-2 or even the HE6. My new mini is still great with all my IEMs so there isn't a downside of raising the gain. 
   
  Hope this helps. It is just one man's opinion, but it is based on 100s of hours with all 3 products & the headphone brands in question (although my 880 is the 600 ohm version but has same sound signature for most part). Let me know what you decide & why. 
   

  
  Quote: 





sennsean said:


> If I am looking for an upgrade, I thought the DACmini would be a good choice. But for the price, I can have both the DACport & the HDP (for it's preamp, line in, spdif).
> I said in my previous post that I did prefer the tone of the DACport slightly to the HDP, and my HD650 really sounds great on both.
> From pictures, the DACmini looks better than the HDP and it's built like a tank.
> I found the CEntrance sound signature to be a better match for both the HD650 & DT880 (250Ohm), while the HDP sometimes can be a bit painful to the already bright sounding DT880 (to my ears).
> ...


----------



## SennSean

Well... I'd already placed an order for the DACmini with my local store.
  Currently it's out of stock so I have to wait for another 1 month or longer.
   
  I think you've explained clearly why. Haha.. and thanks so much for sharing your experience!
   
  Perhaps I have always wanted a DACmini after reading this thread, just that it wasn't available a month ago and currently so I'd never had a chance to audition the unit.
  That's why I needed an extra push from someone who has a similar setup as mine. (Impressive audio inventory you have!)
  Also, having tested several DAC/Amp & DAC + Amp combo, I'd still prefer the sound signature of CEntrace product and they are quite affordable compared to other system.
   
  Okay... I used to thought the HD650 could never have that kind of airy characteristic of the DT880.
  I knew I was wrong when I heard it on the Lavry Da11, which further leads me to believe that the HD650 can really shine with good amplification.
  You've described that you "much prefer the more 3D warmer sound of the DACmini".
  I'd imagine this could be what I was looking for in my HD650, and might be the 10%+ enhancement that the DACport was lacking slightly.
   
  Well... even if the improvement in sound quality may not be huge, I guess the added features would certainly be worthwhile as a One-Box-Solution, not to mention it is a more elegant setup and I needed something that could sit firmly on my desk. (the DACport have too much movements.)
   
  Anyway, thanks so much Austin!
  Anxiously waiting for my DACmini to arrive!
   
   
  Edit : Forgot to mention that I will sell my DT880 and grab a pair of DT770 (600Ohm) to pair with the DACmini.


----------



## bcwang

I'm really interested in the Rega DAC right now and I wonder how the DACmini would compare as a DAC to the Rega.


----------



## AustinHorn

SennSean, Congrats on your purchase. I can't wait to hear your feedback as soon as you get it. 

BC - I haven't heard the Rega so I can't help on that comparison. I can say, I only have one dac that I think is audibly better to my ear than the mini & even that is close. My 32 bit EE minimax dac is the best pure dac I've ever owned.


----------



## ert

Does plugging in phones mute the rear output connections?  Are the rear outputs volume-controlled or constant level?
   
  EDIT - hmm, it seems mute function is there but not variable out: http://www.centrance.com/products/dacmini/blog/2010/10/12/line-out-jacks/.  I wonder if CEntrance will still provide variable outs as an option.  It would be nice to have this as a dac/amp/preamp with the volume control for studio monitors


----------



## mgoodman

Hi Ert,
   
  To answer your questions - the outputs do mute when you plug in the headphones - no changes there. The RCA out levels are fixed, but if you need it, we can make a custom mod for variable outs. We've found that most people are fine with the fixed outputs, so it looks like the decision to leave them fixed was correct. But if you need it, we'll make it!
   
  Michael


----------



## ert

Michael, thanks for the clarification.  I think the DACmini may be a serious contender in the dac/pre/amp category against the more expensive "pro" models from Benchmark, Lavry, etc.  I've been looking for something similar to (cheaper than!) the pro units and I think the DACmini may be the right choice.  I don't know that most people need the array of outputs and inputs as on the pro models, but I think being able to switch from variable to constant output would be a very nice feature.  What would be the best route for me to order a modified unit with variable output?  I don't see an option for variable output on CEntrance order form.
   
  eric


----------



## Jay Listens

Hey Eric...
   
  After you put in your order in our store, just send me a PM and I will make sure you receive a modded unit. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  -Jay


----------



## burgunder

Great service!


----------



## ert

Ordered! can't wait...


----------



## Jay Listens

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ert* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I think the DACmini may be a serious contender in the dac/pre/amp category against the more expensive "pro" models from Benchmark, Lavry, etc.


 


  Thanks for the kind words.
   
  FYI both of the above mentioned companies are using a CEntrance USB solution.


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Thanks for the kind words.
> 
> FYI both of the above mentioned companies are using a CEntrance USB solution.


 
  Hi Jay,
   
  Has the CEntrance USB solution evolved at all over the different products that used it or is it the exact same implementation?  How well does it control jitter in relation to an asynchronous USB design?
   
  Also, would you be able to tell me if the noise floor and volume control of the DacMini lend it well to use with highly sensitive IEMs?  I have had particular trouble finding devices that can adequately drive my IEMs to satisfaction because of high amounts of hiss, poor volume tracking between left and right channels, and poor control of volume at low levels. 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Jay Listens

Our solution is constantly evolving. The biggest difference in our two headphone products is DACport is powered from the USB bus whereas DACmini has an external power supply and features galvanic isolation. The result is a better experience with DACmini.
   
  Long story short, yes, all the solutions are unique to each product. Comparing to a "different" USB technology is kinda tough. Any product is only as good as the collection of its parts. So there are good and bad USB solutions, but not necessarily bad technologies. Its how you implement the technology that makes the difference.
   
  Manufacturers of other USB technologies will lead you to believe that if you are not using the same methodology you are automatically inferior. We believe both technologies can perform great if implemented well.
   
  As for the IEMs, we specifically designed DACmini to address these concerns. We understand your frustration with hiss, off-center tracking and poor volume control. The reality is most potentiometers will have some sort of tracking error at the very low range. We hand select our pots to minimize this and make it inaudible at the lower range.
   
  DACmini will not give you any hiss issues with your IEMs. Do you plan on only using DACmini with the IEMs?
   
  If so there is always the possibility of tuning your DACmini to the range of those IEMs


----------



## ptrok

Hello Mike and Jay,
   
  I wanted to ask you about the newer iterations that you plan to come out with later this year. What differences will these models have with the current CX model? I'm just curious because I have seen a lot of praise given to your current product as it is and I was wondering what other features you might be providing. Also I was wondering a silly newbie question, with this CX model is there a selector for output (i.e. headphone line out)? One last thing, I am planning to get this shipped to Korea and wondered if you guys supply country specific power cord. Thanks in advance. Have a great one.


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi Ptrok! Really like the avatar pic. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The next DACmini model we have announced is the PX. The only difference between the CX and the PX is it will feature a power amplifier so you can connect it directly to your speakers, but other than that they are identical.
   
  Take a look at what Stereophile had to say:
  http://www.stereophile.com/content/centrace-dacmini-px
   
  The output selector is automatic. So if headphones are plugged into the front of the DACmini CX, the rear RCA outs are disabled. Once the headphone cable is removed, they are re-enabled. We don't ship country specific power cables, but are currently offering FREE international shipping.
   
  Let me know if you have any more questions.


----------



## ptrok

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Hi Ptrok! Really like the avatar pic.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the immediate reply. I was curious as to what comes with the CX models in terms of power cord or usb cables. I am also wondering when the KX is projected to be coming out.  Also, concerning the international shipping that you are providing is there any way around the customs issue. If not I can have a friend ship it. Thanks for your quick reply and help.


----------



## Jay Listens

CX ships with DACmini CX (obviously), a USB cable, a power supply, and a IEC cable. As for KX, its hard to say when exactly it will be shipping. What I can tell you is PX will be shipping this summer. As for customs, we will try to be as accommodating as possible within the law obviously 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Please let me know how else I can help. We're here for you guys!!!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I'm surprised I never saw this thread before.  It will take some time for me to read it all, but in the meantime, here are some links to other posts I've written about the DACmini.
   
RMAF 2010 Impressions Thread has basically a mini-review of the DACmini:
   
 [size=medium] http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/518094/rmaf-2010-denver-canjam-rmaf-impressions-in-case-people-missed-seeing-this-in-the-meet-forum[/size]
 [size=medium]  [/size]
 [size=medium] DACport review thread with list of things the DACmini improves upon:[/size]
 [size=medium]  [/size]
 [size=medium] http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/473473/review-more-to-come-centrance-dacport-24-96-usb-dac-amp/60#post_7277929[/size]
 [size=medium]  [/size]
 [size=medium] LCD-2 headphone amp recommendations thread:[/size]
 [size=medium]  [/size]
 [size=medium] http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/495631/amp-recommendations-for-audeze-lcd-2/1575#post_7287271[/size]
 [size=medium]  [/size]
 [size=medium] http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/495631/amp-recommendations-for-audeze-lcd-2/1665#post_7317056[/size]


----------



## AustinHorn

Hey Larry, Welcome aboard.  I know your links will prove extremely helpful to anyone who's considering a DACmini. Much appreciated.
  
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I'm surprised I never saw this thread before.  It will take some time for me to read it all, but in the meantime, here are some links to other posts I've written about the DACmini.
> 
> RMAF 2010 Impressions Thread has basically a mini-review of the DACmini:
> 
> ...


----------



## isuperfish

Hey, if I just need the DAC part of DACmini because Ive already had some amps, is it kind of waste of money that I just pass the amp part of DACmini?
   
  Or... I mean does DACmini mainly focus on just DAC or both DAC and AMP?
   
  thank you


----------



## ptrok

Thanks to Jonathan I ordered my Dacmini and I am counting down the days. Thanks again for all your help with my endless questions and I'll be sure to post my impressions of the unit as soon as I get to hear it. But I know already the customer service is top notch.


----------



## sfhoo

Why don't you get DACport if you want DAC part only?
  Quote: 





isuperfish said:


> Hey, if I just need the DAC part of DACmini because Ive already had some amps, is it kind of waste of money that I just pass the amp part of DACmini?
> 
> Or... I mean does DACmini mainly focus on just DAC or both DAC and AMP?
> 
> thank you


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





sfhoo said:


> Why don't you get DACport if you want DAC part only?


 

 I'd say the DacMini type layout is better if you are wanting to use it as a DAC only.  It has separate line-outs vs having to go through the headphone amplifier (and degrading the signal quality) of the DacPort when you want to use it as a DAC.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

MORE IMPRESSIONS:
   
  I posted some of this in a PM to another head-fi member, but wanted to say that *since I got the DACmini in February I've listened to the LCD-2 headphones more in the past 4 weeks than I did in the previous 6 months because of the improved synergy with LCD-2* over my other amps.  Prior to this my $1000 ALO Amphora was my best amp with the LCD-2, followed by the HDP.  But the DACmini has taken the lead.
   
  I just didn't have anything with synergy this good with the LCD-2 (I was using HDP > ALO Amphora or HDP alone before).  And since I received the DACmini 4 weeks ago I have put maybe only 5 hours on my Apogee mini-DAC > WA6/eXStatA/SAC/EF5 in the bedroom rig, mostly just for comparisons but not personal listening.  I've also been using the DACmini line-out > SR-71b > HE-6 about as much as the LCD-2, followed by my JH13Pro and ES5.  My basement rig with PS Audio PWD > Woo WES and EC ZDT > HD800, HE60 and O2 Mk1 has been getting ignored too, not because it sounds bad but because the Macbook > DACmini in my bedroom is more convenient.
   
  After spending all this time feeding the DACmini into the SR-71b amp for the HE-6 headphones, the big surprise tonight is that the DACmini drives my HE-6 to normal listening volumes at 2 o'clock, and it plays music at volume levels louder than I like when max'd at 5 o'clock, without having the sound turn south like it's running out of steam.  It still has about 4-5 dB less headroom than my balanced SR-71b at full power, but it's power is now closer to the HDP or EF5 with HE-6 headphones vs the lower gain pre-production model shown at RMAF.  That's totally useable, although I'd like more power with the HE-6 to improve bass impact just a little, but bass depth/presence is still excellent.  So I can't discount the DACmini for people with the HE-6 anymore, and it can always be used to feed a more powerful amp when money becomes available later for an upgrade.  The new DACmini PX model with 25-watt speaker amp might be even better for the HE-6 headphones which like to be plugged into the speaker outputs of powerful amps.  But for now I'm really digging the CX model with my HE-6.
   
  My SAC KH1000 amp for the AKG K1000 headphones has the extra power for the HE-6, but the aggressive nature of the SAC amp means it doesn't sound as transparent/good as the DACmini because it's better suited for the mellower sounding K1000 headphones.  If I didn't want to use extremely sensitive IEM all the time then I might go for the gain of 10 like Austin's modded DACmini instead the standard gain of 8.  I just worry that more gain could increase the noise floor and that might make it less enjoyable to use with my ES3X.  That fear may be unfounded, but I don't want to take the chances, especially when I have been listening to the HE-6 with it for the past couple of hours with the volume only at 2 o'clock and no urge to turn it up more (nor do I want to disturb my sleeping wife).  I still think the more efficient LCD-2 are a better match with the DACmini than HE-6, but this amp can definitely please both camps as well as making HD800 owners happy.
   
  And a few other observations:
   
  1) While the SR-71b has a little better dynamic headroom with the HE-6, I was experiencing some bass clipping and doubling (not sure which) with the HE-6 when using 30Hz test tones and below; and bass notes of 20Hz were difficult to hear while the doubling was much louder than the actual tone.  Switching to the DACmini amp and listening to the test tones I find the DACmini does not exhibit this doubling effect, nor any distortion or bass roll-off.  I was using the DACmini line-out to feed SR-71b, so it was the same source.  The deep bass with the difficult to drive HE-6 is clean and extended through the DACmini, although with headphones other than HE-6 the SR-71b didn't do as poorly.  Note - I only use the SR-71b with full-size headphones if they are balanced, and my balanced LCD-2 cable should ship today.  The SR-71b didn't do very well with my single ended LCD-2.
   
  2) The HDP DAC line-out made the SR-71b amp slightly more aggressive sounding in the upper mids and highs by combining their similar traits and multiplying the effect.  Feeding the DACmini into the SR-71b results in a more refined and balanced/transparent sound out of the SR-71b.  So, I am finding the DACmini is a little better as either a DAC or an amp.
   
  3) I used to feed my Pico DAC-only into my ALO Amphora and SR-71b with my Macbook, but switching to the DACmini as the source also results in a more open and deep soundstage, more so with native 24/96 music where the extra micro-detail adds to the transparency, air, and ambience.  I am one of the earliest loyal buyers of the Pico DAC, and it's a great DAC for the price and obviously more portable, but I don't see myself going back to it very much in this rig.  I like the Pico too much to sell, but not enough to use it in place of the DACmini.  If I need a slightly more laid-back sounding amp I can feed the DACmini into my Amphora, and if I want a slightly more aggressive sounding amp I can feed it into my balanced SR-71b.  But so far I am quite pleased with the DAC and the Amp section alike.


----------



## AustinHorn

Larry, your experience with the DACmini/LCD-2 combo seem to track my impressions exactly. I also find that with my increased gain I'm liking it better than my stock gain unit which I returned to CEntrance after doing an extended comparison with both on all of my full-size headphones (including my HE5LE) & all my IEMs. As I said before, I was a little surprised the higher gain unit was still great with all my IEMs. The noise floor was still better than with my HDP. 

The DACmini is my favorite SE amp with my LCD-2s. The only amp I prefer to it is my Phoenix running in fully balanced mode & even then, it is not a night & day difference. That says a lot fir the overall sound quality of the mini.

Anyway thank you so much for your impressions, I enjoyed reading them.


----------



## Jay Listens

Thanks again guys for all the kind reviews.
   
  I have been getting a ton of PMs and just about every one starts off by saying "Sorry to bother you" or "Sorry for all the questions" etc.
   
  GUYS!!!!
  The reason we are "hear" (sorry for the pun, I couldn't help myself) is to do ONE thing.....ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS AND GET FEEDBACK!!!
   
  Our products are only as good as the people who use them. So, PLEASE by all means feel free to contact me at any time. We really appreciate the opportunity to speak with each and every customer!!!


----------



## AustinHorn

jay listens said:


> Thanks again guys for all the kind reviews.
> 
> I have been getting a ton of PMs and just about every one starts off by saying "Sorry to bother you" or "Sorry for all the questions" etc.
> 
> ...




Thanks Jay. Much appreciated. I do have a request. We now have the DACmini CX model shipping now, with the PX on the horizon. Could you outline for us, to the degree possible, the coming models in the Que & their distinctive features & if possible, gross price points. Also projected timeframes for production & shipping for each.

Any details you can provide would be appreciated. I'm seeing a lot of DACmini related posts now on various threads & I can tell most folks don't know that there are or will be multiple versions of the DACmini, CX, PX,, etc.

I am particularly interested in learning whether or not you guys may create a dac model at some point with a 32 bit based chip set &/or a dac/amp model with balanced inputs/outputs. I'm sure others will have other questions about future plans.


----------



## elnero

I've was home with a sick little girl today so I took the opportunity to do more research on my impending DAC/Amp purchase. I'm finding the DACmini blog a particularly interesting read, the design process, the attention to detail, thoughts on globalization, all give a greater insight into the company and its philosophy.


----------



## ert

Shipping update please.


----------



## mgoodman

Hey there and thanks for pinging us for status. We have had some shipping delays and I feel responsible for this one.
   
  We've been running a blog with status updates on our site, so instead of re-posting that information here and potentially causing confusion with multiple sources of changing data, I suggest that you check that blog for updates. I commit to making daily updates until we are back in stock, which should just be about a week from now (est. April 3rd). Can't imagine that once April arrives the back order will be behind us.. That will be a welcome feeling for both ourselves and for our customers.
   
  http://centrance.com/blog/
   
  Michael


----------



## ert

Michael, thanks for the update.  Supplier issues are understandable.


----------



## Townyj

Does this do ok with IEM's..?? I tend to swap between my headphones and iem's all the time, so im after something that can do both. A gain of 8 seems a little steep after reading Headphone Addict's post. But with the upcoming HE-500 from Head Direct this could be a killer combo.


----------



## AustinHorn

townyj said:


> Does this do ok with IEM's..?? I tend to swap between my headphones and iem's all the time, so im after something that can do both. A gain of 8 seems a little steep after reading Headphone Addict's post. But with the upcoming HE-500 from Head Direct this could be a killer combo.




CEntrance sent me a replacement with a gain of 10 & I find it to still be great with all my IEMs so a gain of 8 will certainly be aOK! If you want less gain, ask them for it when you order.


----------



## mgoodman

A little known secret is that we actually sort the volume pots for perfect tracking. It's an automated test, so goes a little faster than totally manual, but still a chore. Despite the fact that the pot comes from a reputable supplier, the sorting statistics is rather low - about 23% are passed, which means the actual cost of the pot is about triple, but the end result is that the pot we allow to install into DACmini tracks both channels well into the lowest volume settings, which means that IEMs are ok. Incidentally, we have not found a pot that would be specified for better than 1.5 dB tracking error. Most are guaranteed at minimum 3dB error. What we get after sorting is pots that track within less than 1dB. That's pretty good inter-channel tracking.

Michael


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





mgoodman said:


> A little known secret is that we actually sort the volume pots for perfect tracking. It's an automated test, so goes a little faster than totally manual, but still a chore. Despite the fact that the pot comes from a reputable supplier, the sorting statistics is rather low - about 23% are passed, which means the actual cost of the pot is about triple, but the end result is that the pot we allow to install into DACmini tracks both channels well into the lowest volume settings, which means that IEMs are ok. Incidentally, we have not found a pot that would be specified for better than 1.5 dB tracking error. Most are guaranteed at minimum 3dB error. What we get after sorting is pots that track within less than 1dB. That's pretty good inter-channel tracking.
> 
> Michael


 





  Thumbs up to you guys Michael!!


----------



## Townyj

Placed an order for this tonight  Ive wanted something that has a small footprint and has both a dac/headamp for ages. With the current promo deal i couldnt pass it up! Free Shipping! Hells yes!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

townyj said:


> Does this do ok with IEM's..?? I tend to swap between my headphones and iem's all the time, so im after something that can do both. A gain of 8 seems a little steep after reading Headphone Addict's post. But with the upcoming HE-500 from Head Direct this could be a killer combo.




No, 8 is just right. I can use any IEM I own, down to very low volumes.


----------



## WilCox

What is the current promo deal?  On the shopping cart web page, I see a spot to enter a coupon code, but I don't have a code.  Is there a Head-Fi promo going on?
  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> With the current promo deal i couldnt pass it up! Free Shipping! Hells yes!


----------



## Townyj

No no when you get to the checkout is says Free Shipping Promo! So i saved myself $44 on shipping! Which is pretty good imo!

  
  Quote: 





wilcox said:


> What is the current promo deal?  On the shopping cart web page, I see a spot to enter a coupon code, but I don't have a code.  Is there a Head-Fi promo going on?


----------



## WilCox

Yes it is. Thanks!
  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> No no when you get to the checkout is says Free Shipping Promo! So i saved myself $44 on shipping! Which is pretty good imo!


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 How's the low volume tracking and just how low can you get the volume compared to the HDP and uDac2?


----------



## pekingduck

It's an kick ass deal especially for us international head-fi'ers!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> No no when you get to the checkout is says Free Shipping Promo! So i saved myself $44 on shipping! Which is pretty good imo!


----------



## Townyj

Im not sure if its in this thread. But i came across a post where the boys from CEntrance mentioned, actually go through and do a lot of testing with there Volume Controls. About 1 in 4 pass the channel balance/tracking. So far i havent heard anything bad at all.

  
   Quote:


bcwang said:


> How's the low volume tracking and just how low can you get the volume compared to the HDP and uDac2?


 


   

 Tell me about it! Being in Australia is a definite plus! Our exchange rate is ridiculous right now so i jumped on the deal 
  
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> It's an kick ass deal especially for us international head-fi'ers!!


----------



## crumpler

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Im not sure if its in this thread. But i came across a post where the boys from CEntrance mentioned, actually go through and do a lot of testing with there Volume Controls. About 1 in 4 pass the channel balance/tracking. So far i havent heard anything bad at all.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yeah, i took the opportunity to order the DACport that came with free international shipping as well. It was sent on Fedex and arrived down under in 4 days.


----------



## Townyj

4 Days!! Wow!!! Ive been looking at the dacport! Maybe if i get a laptop or Netbook sometime down the track!

  
  Quote: 





crumpler said:


> Yeah, i took the opportunity to order the DACport that came with free international shipping as well. It was sent on Fedex and arrived down under in 4 days.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> How's the low volume tracking and just how low can you get the volume compared to the HDP and uDac2?


 

 The low volume tracking is excellent, and I can go much much lower than with the HDP or uDAC-2.  The best volume knobs I've had are on my DACmini, ZDT, WA6, HR Micro Amp, Meier Headfive desktop amp, and RSA SR-71b.  Amphora doesn't count because it's a Goldpoint stepped attenuator.
   
  I should note that with your very sensitive ears you will likely hear the quiet background hiss with your IEM.  For me I can barely notice it except with my ES3X, and even then it's 3-4x quieter than my Amphora.


----------



## veracocha

Only in soundstage which is better HDP or dac mini ?


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> The low volume tracking is excellent, and I can go much much lower than with the HDP or uDAC-2.  The best volume knobs I've had are on my DACmini, ZDT, WA6, HR Micro Amp, Meier Headfive desktop amp, and RSA SR-71b.  Amphora doesn't count because it's a Goldpoint stepped attenuator.
> 
> I should note that with your very sensitive ears you will likely hear the quiet background hiss with your IEM.  For me I can barely notice it except with my ES3X, and even then it's 3-4x quieter than my Amphora.


 



 The Pico Slim you have doesn't fall under the list as having one of the best volume knobs? 
   
  So I guess that means the Dacmini does hiss, would you say it's on the level of the HDP, uDac2, or somewhere in between?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## kwkarth

IMO, there is NO comparison between the DACMini and the NuForce products.  They are in different worlds.


----------



## Jay Listens

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> So I guess that means the Dacmini does hiss, would you say it's on the level of the HDP, uDac2, or somewhere in between?
> 
> Thanks!


 

 Sorry to be so defensive, but we have yet to have a single customer complain of a hiss issue. Bcwang, have you tried the DACmini yourself or is this simply an "educated guess"?
   
  Again we REALLY value the input from this community and I am just trying to understand if there is the potential for hiss on our products under certain circumstances.
   
  @kwkarth
  Thanks again for all the kind words we really do appreciate it
   
  Again, if anyone has any comments or questions, I am here to answer them so please feel free to contact me!!!


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Sorry to be so defensive, but we have yet to have a single customer complain of a hiss issue. Bcwang, have you tried the DACmini yourself or is this simply an "educated guess"?


 

 I believe he was responding to HeadphoneAddict's post in which he said:
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I should note that with your very sensitive ears you will likely hear the quiet background hiss with your IEM.  For me I can barely notice it except with my ES3X, and even then it's 3-4x quieter than my Amphora.


----------



## crumpler

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> IMO, there is NO comparison between the DACMini and the NuForce products.  They are in different worlds.


 

 Agreed!


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Sorry to be so defensive, but we have yet to have a single customer complain of a hiss issue. Bcwang, have you tried the DACmini yourself or is this simply an "educated guess"?
> 
> Again we REALLY value the input from this community and I am just trying to understand if there is the potential for hiss on our products under certain circumstances.
> 
> ...


 



 You are right, I have never heard it.  I only made an educated guess based on HeadphoneAddict's comment which I understood as: he can hear a slight hiss out of it.  Based on our past experiences, if he can hear the slightest hiss out of an amp with his headphones, when I'm using the se530 I will hear a very loud and unmistakable hiss that can be identified in the loudest of environments.  Sure, the only way to know for sure is to try it, but these aren't exactly available at your local dealer.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> You are right, I have never heard it.  I only made an educated guess based on HeadphoneAddict's comment which I understood as: he can hear a slight hiss out of it.  Based on our past experiences, if he can hear the slightest hiss out of an amp with his headphones, when I'm using the se530 I will hear a very loud and unmistakable hiss that can be identified in the loudest of environments.  Sure, the only way to know for sure is to try it, *but these aren't exactly available at your local dealer.*


 

 Depends upon who your dealer is.  We're lucky to live in StumpTown and our local dealer does carry Centrance products.  Woot!


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Depends upon who your dealer is.  We're lucky to live in StumpTown and our local dealer does carry Centrance products.  Woot!


 

 But do they have the "out of stock" DacMini?   If they do, those people waiting for their online orders won't be happy there are units sitting on dealer shelves!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





veracocha said:


> Only in soundstage which is better HDP or dac mini ?


 

 The DACmini is more spacious sounding like my WA6, although I would not call the HDP closed in or anything - it doesn't seem to get as wide when using the stock PSU.  The HDP is maybe a little more forward at times, while my Amphora has a little deeper stage vs the DACmini.  With the Sigma11 PSU the HDP gets closer to the DACmini with a more holographic sound that becomes more transparent, but not quite to that level.  If you already had a HDP then a S11 PSU upgrade is likely worth it, but if you didn't then going directly to a DACmini makes more sense than picking up the HDP with an S11 PSU for a similar price.
   
  Quote: 





bcwang said:


> The Pico Slim you have doesn't fall under the list as having one of the best volume knobs?
> 
> So I guess that means the Dacmini does hiss, would you say it's on the level of the HDP, uDac2, or somewhere in between?
> 
> Thanks!


 

 Sorry, it was late and I was sleepy, the Pico Slim belongs in the list of amps with good low volume channel balance.  I seem to recall that my old RSA Predator also had good channel balance, and I've checked my Protector which is also very good.
   
  I don't think every knows yet that you have bat-like or dog-like hearing ability.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> But do they have the "out of stock" DacMini?   If they do, those people waiting for their online orders won't be happy there are units sitting on dealer shelves!


 

 You'll have to call Ken and ask him.


----------



## burgunder

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> IMO, there is NO comparison between the DACMini and the NuForce products.  They are in different worlds.


 


  And they should be because of the price bracket.


----------



## K3cT

Is the amplifier section fully DC-coupled from the beginning to the end? I tried reading the product page but it's not too clear there.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Is the amplifier section fully DC-coupled from the beginning to the end? I tried reading the product page but it's not too clear there.


 
   


 [td]  Headphone Amp

[/td] [td]  Direct Class A, no caps in the signal path

[/td]


----------



## bcwang

Was the model of DAC chip ever mentioned anywhere?  Or are they hiding that information from the consumer?


----------



## Jay Listens

To give a bit of background on CEntrance (as I know many of you have not heard of us), we are a design firm who has been helping other companies bring products to market for a decade now. In fact, our USB solution is licensed by Bel Canto, Lavry, Benchmark to name a few. We are a licensed 3rd party design house for Analog Devices, OxSemi, Texas Instruments, AKM, XMOS, and others. We really took a hard look and listen to all the components used in the DACmini especially the DAC which we chose an AKM part.
   
  If you take a look at the DACmini link in my signature there is a link to the DACmini page. Take a look at features tab where we have a case study of all the lessons we have learned from working for other manufacturers for the past 11 years. This should give you an idea of why we made many of the decisions we did on DACmini.
   
  @bcwang we may want to borrow some of that bat-like hearing to test some of our new products in the future 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  And as always please keep the questions coming!!!


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> To give a bit of background on CEntrance (as I know many of you have not heard of us), we are a design firm who has been helping other companies bring products to market for a decade now. In fact, our USB solution is licensed by Bel Canto, Lavry, Benchmark to name a few. We are a licensed 3rd party design house for Analog Devices, OxSemi, Texas Instruments, AKM, XMOS, and others. We really took a hard look and listen to all the components used in the DACmini especially the DAC which we chose an AKM part.
> 
> If you take a look at the DACmini link in my signature there is a link to the DACmini page. Take a look at features tab where we have a case study of all the lessons we have learned from working for other manufacturers for the past 11 years. This should give you an idea of why we made many of the decisions we did on DACmini.
> 
> ...


 


  That's a pretty nice writeup! (design case study), I like reading about that kind of stuff.  More manufacturers should do that, it helps users understand all the thought that goes into a product. 
   
  All the touting of a super matched volume pot and low noise floor, I wonder just how quiet it is and how well it can actually be used with sensitive IEMs.  I'm certainly willing to test for you guys, anything to get more products on the market with a super low noise floor for potential outstanding IEM use.
   
  Why don't you point out that you use an AKM Dac on the website?  The 4396 maybe?  Is it a marketing strategy to avoid mentioning the actual model of the DAC chip?


----------



## songforyou

Semi-off topic gushing reply following. How's this for a banner day: LCD-2s arrive on the same day as a DACport.  Have been listening to the combination for a week now and enjoying it thoroughly.
   
  I should add that I'm usually all vinyl and that digital usually sends me packing.  But the combination noted above is smooth and natural and I can listen (with interest!) for hours.
   
  Looking forward to the DACmini!  Great work guys!


----------



## Jay Listens

When asked about the chips we use in our products, our answer is simple: CEntrance only uses the finest components in its products, to guarantee highest audio quality, professional reliability and longevity of your investment. CEntrance is the official design firm for many IC vendors, so naturally we have early access to the best chips.
   
  But the chip is only half the answer - correct implementation is the other half. If someone tries to use a great chip and gets frustrated, they post on the Internet that the chip is bad and other people read that as true. We prefer to have our customers listen to our products and make their decision on the sound quality, not on what they read about chips on the Internet.
   
  Long story short we prefer people judge our products on the "sum of the parts" not one chip in isolation. As this is not the best way to determine the true SQ of a product. That said feel free to ask any questions you may have about any of our designs.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> When asked about the chips we use in our products, our answer is simple: CEntrance only uses the finest components in its products, to guarantee highest audio quality, professional reliability and longevity of your investment. CEntrance is the official design firm for many IC vendors, so naturally we have early access to the best chips.
> 
> But the chip is only half the answer - correct implementation is the other half. If someone tries to use a great chip and gets frustrated, they post on the Internet that the chip is bad and other people read that as true. We prefer to have our customers listen to our products and make their decision on the sound quality, not on what they read about chips on the Internet.
> 
> Long story short we prefer people judge our products on the "sum of the parts" not one chip in isolation. As this is not the best way to determine the true SQ of a product. That said feel free to ask any questions you may have about any of our designs.


 

 Good post!


----------



## pekingduck

Does the DACmini work with iPad + Camera Connection Kit?


----------



## Jay Listens

Hey Peking!!!
   
  As of right now, the DACmini will not work with iPad as it would need to be recognized as a 48kHz or lower device. I will chat with the engineers and have them look into the possibility of adding this capability.
   
  Thanks for the inquiry!
   
  -Jay


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Hey Peking!!!
> 
> As of right now, the DACmini will not work with iPad as it would need to be recognized as a 48kHz or lower device. I will chat with the engineers and have them look into the possibility of adding this capability.
> 
> ...


 

 I think they changed that with iOS 4.2 for iPad.  I'll test mine tonight, and I can use a powered hub if needed.
   
  ------------
   
*UPDATE* 12mn - since my new post started on a new page I wanted to add this here.
   
   
  The iPad 2 with OS 4.3.0 > Camera Connection Kit > DACmini was tested tonight.  No powered hub needed.

   

  IT DEFINITELY WORKS, and iTunes on iPad2 shows that it's connected the the CEntrance DACmini in the spot where a volume control would normally show up.  And it sounds very good with my LCD-2.

   

  -----------

   

  UPDATE 2:

   

  I also tried DACmini with an iPad 1 and iOS 4.2.1 (jailbroken but with no special audio software installed) - this also works fine with DACmini and Camera Connection Kit with no powered hub needed.  Sounds great just like the iPad 2 that I first tested.


----------



## pekingduck

Thanks Jay and HPA!!!!


----------



## elrod-tom

Great thread!
   
  I've been using a DACPort for about a week at my office.  I'm using it both as a DAC/Amp and as a DAC with dedicated headphone amp, and enjoying it in both configurations.  Nice detail, Class-A sonic signature with low noise floor, and surprisingly adept as a headphone amp.  Does a very nice job with higher rez files (e.g. Rolling Stones "Let it Bleed" from HDTracks), and I've heard some things listening to the 24-bit Beatles remasters that I've not heard before with my DACPort.
   
  I'm using the DACPort as a portable source at the office, and will likely continue to do so.  I'm encouraged by what I'm reading about the DACMini, and will likely pick one up for one of my home rigs.  Nice products!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

iPad 2 with OS 4.3.0 > Camera Connection Kit > DACmini was tested tonight.  No powered hub needed.
   
  IT DEFINITELY WORKS, and iTunes on iPad2 shows that it's connected the the CEntrance DACmini in the spot where a volume control would normally show up.  And it sounds very good with my LCD-2.
   
  UPDATE 2
   
  Also tried DACmini with iPad 1 and iOS 4.2.1 (jailbroken but with no special audio software installed) - this also works fine with DACmini and no powered hub.  Sounds great just like the iPad 2 that I first tested.


----------



## pekingduck

Thanks a lot! This saves me from buying a dedicated digital dock for my upcoming iPad and DACmini. Can't wait 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> iPad 2 with OS 4.3.0 > Camera Connection Kit > DACmini was tested tonight.  No powered hub needed.
> 
> IT DEFINITELY WORKS, and iTunes on iPad2 shows that it's connected the the CEntrance DACmini in the spot where a volume control would normally show up.  And it sounds very good with my LCD-2.
> 
> ...


----------



## Townyj

Arghhh i cant wait to get my grubby hands on my mini!! I hope my order gets shipped out with the next batch.  haha i havent been excited about a new piece of audio gear for sometime now!


----------



## Olias of Sunhillow

Quote: 





elrod-tom said:


> Great thread!
> 
> I've been using a DACPort for about a week at my office.  I'm using it both as a DAC/Amp and as a DAC with dedicated headphone amp, and enjoying it in both configurations.  Nice detail, Class-A sonic signature with low noise floor, and surprisingly adept as a headphone amp.  Does a very nice job with higher rez files (e.g. Rolling Stones "Let it Bleed" from HDTracks), and I've heard some things listening to the 24-bit Beatles remasters that I've not heard before with my DACPort.
> 
> I'm using the DACPort as a portable source at the office, and will likely continue to do so.  I'm encouraged by what I'm reading about the DACMini, and will likely pick one up for one of my home rigs.  Nice products!


 

 The above-quoted post is very helpful -- thanks! I'm actually contemplating simplifying my office rig by replacing my Cullen IV DLIII and Concerto with a DACmini -- especially having read how well it pairs with LCD-2s.


----------



## elrod-tom

Quote: 





olias of sunhillow said:


> The above-quoted post is very helpful -- thanks! I'm actually contemplating simplifying my office rig by replacing my Cullen IV DLIII and Concerto with a DACmini -- especially having read how well it pairs with LCD-2s.


 


  Glad it helps.  I've been listening to it today with AT AD-700's and it's good...but I prefer it with THOSE cans paired with a dedicated headphone amp.  I'd also used it with the B&W P5's, and I think I like it a little better with those.  For me, it seems to pair better with higher impedence cans (I've used it mostly at home with Senn HD 600's and AKG K-240 sextets).  It does a nice job as a headphone amp, but I prefer to use it as a source right now.  That said, convenience will have me using it as a DAC/HPA more often than not I'm thinking.
   
  Oh, and I will be buying a DACMini...I really like the sonic signature, especially with higher resolution files.


----------



## gevorg

Does anyone know if DACmini uses the same DAC chip as DACport?


----------



## niranhopper

New DACMINI owner and i am pleased with the product's sound quality with USB sources. However want to know if i can improve the sound by adding some USB to SPDIF interfaces like Hiface or Musical fidelity V-LINK?


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





niranhopper said:


> New DACMINI owner and i am pleased with the product's sound quality with USB sources. However want to know if i can improve the sound by adding some USB to SPDIF interfaces like Hiface or Musical fidelity V-LINK?


 

 I would expect that the Centrance produce is already superior in that regard.


----------



## stugrammer

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> I would expect that the Centrance produce is already superior in that regard.


 

  
  Agree. If i am not mistaken Bel canto's usb-spdif converter also uses usb interface developed by centrance.


----------



## Townyj

My Mini was shipped today!!


----------



## ptrok

x2


----------



## Townyj

Got my Mini  Sounds amazing! But one thing that annoys me with a new item is when the finish isnt upto scratch... Literally. Big scratch mark on the top. Underneath has marks like its been dragged or grinded along something sharp. Bit disappointed in that respect.
   
  *EDIT*
   
  I was able to buff the scratch out of the top panel, the bottom doesnt bother me to much as its never going to be visible  All good imo!


----------



## ptrok

For those of you on the fence about getting a Dacmini I came across an interesting case study article on the Centrance site outlining their features and how they translate to performance. http://www.centrance.com/products/dacmini/ I purchased one but haven't received it yet but this case study made me feel better about my purchase. Now I just need tot hear it for myself. Should get it here in Korea by next Monday with my LCD-2's. Waiting is just so hard sometimes. Hopefully this is helpful for others.


----------



## ert

^ That's an interesting piece of product literature.  The main thing that caught my attention was the drop guard.  I've seen a few expensive pieces of heavy equipment get damaged because a knob was bumped and crushed the pot.  I never understood why some companies make a blast proof chassis with such fragile knobs.   Still waiting on my mini....


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Well, so far I am still quite pleased with the DACmini since I posted my last impressions here in March. It's definitely a permanent fixture in my home.  
   
  Since my last report I hardly use any of my other home gear, because the DACmini in my bedroom Macbook Pro rig is so convenient and accessible.  I've been using the DACmini with my LCD-2 mostly, and I also feed the analog out into my SR-71b amp for my balanced IEM and HE-6.  I still use the DACport when I'm moving my Macbook around, but that's about it for the past few weeks.  Since I got the DACmini I've rarely been down to use my high-end rig in the basement.
   
  Don't get me wrong - my high-end rig with Perfectwave DAC & Bridge (aka PWD) > Eddie Current ZDT or Woo WES is still glorious sounding with my re-cabled HD800, Stax O2 or Baby Orpheus.  But they sit in my basement rig away from everything else and I don't get to spend much if any time down there, at least not without being a recluse and feeling detached from my family.  Plus my health problems make going up and down the stairs repeatedly a daunting task.  While the DACmini is not as good as a $3000 DAC plus a $2500 - $5000 tube amp like the above, it's relatively faultless and quite enjoyable.  With the DACmini I don't feel like I'm missing a lot when I can't make it downstairs to the big rig, making it a great bang for the buck.  If it had the weight and impact of my ZDT, it would carry it to a whole new level, but what it offers is still quite good.
   
  If I had to guess based on my previous experiences, I'd say the S/PDIF DAC section is on par with other similarly priced DACs like the Apogee mini-DAC, Stello DA100 or Digital Link III (via single ended output).  The DACmini's USB input actually sounds better than I recall the DA100 or DLIII sounding via USB, but the Apogee mini-DAC has a very nice sounding 24/48 USB input.  Last time I checked, the mini-DAC USB sounded as good as its 24/96 optical S/PDIF with my Macbook Pro.  The DACmini's amp section is not very different sounding from my more expensive maxed Woo WA6 (depending on the tubes), except that DACmini has more power than the WA6.  I haven't fired up my WA6 in weeks!  On the other hand the WA6 can be tuned via tube rolling if you want - If you are one who finds the HD800 to be bright then you can roll in darker sounding tubes to compensate.  In comparison to the more expensive ALO Amphora, the biggest difference is that the Amphora sounds a little more laid back and relaxed with a little deeper soundstage (better suited for HD800), although the Amphora is also less powerful like the WA6 and has more hiss with IEM.  If I had to guess again, the DACmini amp section might perform similarly to the Grahm Slee Solo SRG II and PSU1 that I had on loan for two weeks a year ago, except the SRG II is only $150 less with no DAC and was useless with most IEM due to noise. 
   
   
  The only thing I'm really left wishing for is balanced XLR line-out for my balanced SR-71b and eXStatA amps.  Also, since I have the fixed RCA outputs going to another headphone amp, it might be nice if the RCA-output wasn't deactivated when I plug in a headphone.  Sometimes I will be listening to the DACmini amp and want to switch to my SR-71b + balanced IEM, and I get no sound until I remember to unplug the LCD-2 rather than just turning down the volume.  I can see where this is an advatage when feeding the DACmini into a set of powered speakers like my Audioengine A2 or A5, so that the speakers shut off when plugging in headphones, but if I were doing that I would go for the optional variable level outputs.


----------



## Szadzik

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Well, so far I am still quite pleased with the DACmini since I posted my last impressions here in March. It's definitely a permanent fixture in my home.
> 
> Since my last report I hardly use any of my other home gear, because the DACmini in my bedroom Macbook Pro rig is so convenient and accessible.  I've been using the DACmini with my LCD-2 mostly, and I also feed the analog out into my SR-71b amp for my balanced IEM and HE-6.  I still use the DACport when I'm moving my Macbook around, but that's about it for the past few weeks.  Since I got the DACmini I've rarely been down to use my high-end rig in the basement.
> 
> ...


 


  Have you had any experience with Burson HA-160/ 160D? I was wondering how these two would compare.


----------



## Anouk

Hi everyone,
 I am looking for a new dac/headphone combo to use with my es5 iems. My budget is about 1500 dollars but cheaper is always nice. I need a dac with tosslink and usb input so the dacmini fits that bill. The only thing for me that is not so good is that it has no xlr output. My preamp and poweramp are connected to xlr and my preamp has only xlr inputs so I would need to get an adapter cable and i worry that this would degrade the sound. I now have a dacmagic which has xlr outputs and i wonder if a fully balanced dac wouldnt be better in my case.
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi everyone, another question, is the dacmini usb-implementation asynchronous or adaptive? Asynchronous usb seems to be all the rage for the last year or so. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Szadzik

Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi everyone, another question, is the dacmini usb-implementation asynchronous or adaptive? Asynchronous usb seems to be all the rage for the last year or so. Greetings, Anouk,


 


   
  Specs and reviews say asynchronous.


----------



## stugrammer

I thought it is adaptive. Centrance always claims that adaptive is as good as asynchronous when the implementation is right.
   
  Quote: 





szadzik said:


> Specs and reviews say asynchronous.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





szadzik said:


> Specs and reviews say asynchronous.


 
   
  No, it's adaptive, they call their solution AdaptiWave. Their tech has been licensed by Benchmark Media, Empirical, Belcanto, Lavry and many other manufacturers.


----------



## Szadzik

Quote: 





elnero said:


> No, it's adaptive, they call their solution AdaptiWave. Their tech has been licensed by Benchmark Media, Empirical, Belcanto, Lavry and many other manufacturers.


 


   
  You're right and I am wrong - I do not know what I was thinking about when writing that


----------



## Townyj

I have been listening constantly with my RE-262's! I'm actually having trouble getting stuff done around my house since the Mini has arrived  Such an amazing little unit! I have never been really good with writing up comparisons and reviews etc. Im taking it for a hike soon to try with a pair of LCD-2's. Hopefully it will do better then the Talisman T-33H i heard them through the other week.


----------



## stugrammer

I also received my mini two days ago. It is really nice-looking. I like very much the tick-tack sound when I switch among the input sources. The volumne knob is also very comfortable.
   
  Sadly my hd600 fail to work so I try it with my ATH ad700. It provides a better soundstage and low response than my dacport. It also sounds a bit warmer to me than the dacport.
   
  I also try it with the apple's headphone ( i mean the little white in-ear headphone comes with the ipod...). I have to say that I can hear a very low background noise when no music is playing. It is so small that it does not affect my listening experience. (actually I do not use any IEM so it is not a problem for me.)
   
  I will verify my impression after my hd600 come back from the sennheiser service center. Hopefully they will make a good pair.


----------



## tktran

Is anyone still waiting for their shipment notification? No news if my unit has been despatched, in transit etc..


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





stugrammer said:


> I also try it with the apple's headphone ( i mean the little white in-ear headphone comes with the ipod...). I have to say that I can hear a very low background noise when no music is playing. It is so small that it does not affect my listening experience. (actually I do not use any IEM so it is not a problem for me.)


 

 Sounds like another report of hiss.  Oh well, at least it sounds like the channel tracking is still better than average.
   
  It'll be interesting to compare this to the HDP with the linear power supply.  I assume the power supply of the dacmini can be upgraded as well, though it sounds like they claim it won't really make a difference due to the internal regulation.  But it seems like changes in power supply always make a difference regardless of what manufacturers claim.


----------



## pekingduck

I received an email from Michael on the 13th saying "all outstanding orders should be complete next week"
   
  Quote: 





tktran said:


> Is anyone still waiting for their shipment notification? No news if my unit has been despatched, in transit etc..


----------



## stugrammer

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> Sounds like another report of hiss.  Oh well, at least it sounds like the channel tracking is still better than average.
> 
> It'll be interesting to compare this to the HDP with the linear power supply.  I assume the power supply of the dacmini can be upgraded as well, though it sounds like they claim it won't really make a difference due to the internal regulation.  But it seems like changes in power supply always make a difference regardless of what manufacturers claim.


 

 Hi bcwang
   
  I think the hiss is low enough so no problem for me. The power cord that I am using is a very cheap one taken from an old PC, and the electric power in my office is not so clean.
  Or you might try the DACport. At least to me the background is completely quiet, no hiss at all.
   
  It is a bit weird that the dacport sounds quieter than the mini to me. Maybe the electric circuits here are not properly grounded or something... I will test it in my home again.


----------



## ert

Quote: 





tktran said:


> Is anyone still waiting for their shipment notification? No news if my unit has been despatched, in transit etc..


 

 I'm still waiting as well although I requested a modification to the unit so that might delay things a bit for me...


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi guys!!!
   
  Thanks for your patience as we try are hardest to ship out all pending backorders as rapidly as possible. If you have any questions about a specific order please PM directly.
   
  We really appreciate all the great feedback and are excited about more customer reactions in the upcoming weeks. If I missed a question please send me a PM and I can address it personally.
   
  Thanks again for your business, we truly appreciate it!
   





   
  -Jonathan


----------



## lohma004

Hi,
  I am considering getting the DACmini - serioulsy.  In the April issue of Stereophile there is a review of the Musical Fidelity V-Link USB-S/PDIF converter.  The main reason for using this device appears to be to reduce jitter from the USB port.  (there is a comment somewhere in the review about its benefits with "legacy DACs.)   I'm wondering if the DACmini would benefit from this device?  One of the big selling points for the DACmini is that it reduces to jitter to the point that it is not an issue.  Would the V-Link be like splitting hairs that have already been split?  Would one "really" hear any difference?
   
  I'm also trying to create a system with the fewest links in the chain - computer/DAC/amp/speakers.  This would add another. 
  Any thoughts on whether this is a good addition or rather something to muck up the chain?
   
  Thanks.
  Paul


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> Sounds like another report of hiss.  Oh well, at least it sounds like the channel tracking is still better than average.
> 
> It'll be interesting to compare this to the HDP with the linear power supply.  I assume the power supply of the dacmini can be upgraded as well, though it sounds like they claim it won't really make a difference due to the internal regulation.  But it seems like changes in power supply always make a difference regardless of what manufacturers claim.


 
  Centrance seems to pay a great deal of attention to the power supply design already.  It would be difficult to improve on what they've already done.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





lohma004 said:


> Hi,
> I am considering getting the DACmini - serioulsy.  In the April issue of Stereophile there is a review of the Musical Fidelity V-Link USB-S/PDIF converter.  The main reason for using this device appears to be to reduce jitter from the USB port.  (there is a comment somewhere in the review about its benefits with "legacy DACs.)   I'm wondering if the DACmini would benefit from this device?  One of the big selling points for the DACmini is that it reduces to jitter to the point that it is not an issue.  Would the V-Link be like splitting hairs that have already been split?  Would one "really" hear any difference?
> 
> I'm also trying to create a system with the fewest links in the chain - computer/DAC/amp/speakers.  This would add another.
> ...


 

 The DACMini is not a legacy DAC, it already employs state of the art USB translation.  Using an external USB-S/PDIF converter would likely increase jitter not reduce it.  This means doing so, would likely sound worse.


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Centrance seems to pay a great deal of attention to the power supply design already.  It would be difficult to improve on what they've already done.


 
  It sounds like you are talking about the design of the internal power supply and regulation circuitry.  I'm talking about the external power supply feeding the DacMini.  The fact that they say:
   
  "DACmini makes full use of external power, generating isolated +/-15V rails inside and feeding that to all internal analog circuitry. A full 30V of available power lowers the noise and reduces distortion. DACmini is also flexible with regard to the external power supply. This comes from our experience designing professional equipment for our broadcast customers, who don't always have the right power supply nearby, but the show must go on. DACmini can take any power supply with +5...12V DC and 1A of current giving you more flexibility and peace of mind. "
  
  ...leads me to believe they probably ship it with something inexpensive, not an all out low noise linear design.  This is the part I wonder if being replaced with a better unit would improve performance further.  Centrance seems to claim it won't make a difference....


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> It sounds like you are talking about the design of the internal power supply and regulation circuitry.  I'm talking about the external power supply feeding the DacMini.  The fact that they say:
> 
> "DACmini makes full use of external power, generating isolated +/-15V rails inside and feeding that to all internal analog circuitry. A full 30V of available power lowers the noise and reduces distortion. DACmini is also flexible with regard to the external power supply. This comes from our experience designing professional equipment for our broadcast customers, who don't always have the right power supply nearby, but the show must go on. DACmini can take any power supply with +5...12V DC and 1A of current giving you more flexibility and peace of mind. "
> 
> ...leads me to believe they probably ship it with something inexpensive, not an all out low noise linear design.  This is the part I wonder if being replaced with a better unit would improve performance further.  Centrance seems to claim it won't make a difference....


 
  There's an obvious reason for that.  They put their engineering and quality where it makes the most difference...The regulation and filtering side of the power supply.


----------



## pekingduck

Didn't know CEntrance offered this "1-ohm mod"... sounds interesting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





> DACmini stock unit comes with 10 Ohm output impedance at the headphone output. We made a lot of experiments with various headphone models and arrived at this value on purpose. We feel that it offers the most musical sound. Users have described it as “warm” and “analog like”. However, we can make it 1 Ohm, if desired to achieve the flattest possible frequency response. Some people may prefer to have lower output impedance to get the best out of low-impedance headphones. This mod is currently performed for free, but in May, we start charging $99.95 for it. Hurry up to get this amazing value for free if you order before May 2011.


 
   
  Source: http://centrance.com/blog/2011/04/20/dacmini-custom-mods/


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> Didn't know CEntrance offered this "1-ohm mod"... sounds interesting
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I was about to point out their spec page used to say 10 ohm output impedance, now it says 1 ohm.  I was wondering if I had remember wrong but maybe this has something to do with it.
   
  I wonder if lowering the output impedance from 10 to 1 will raise hiss levels even more, or if they've made other adjustments to compensate, thus the $99 price for the mod.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

*CEntrance Dacmini + Audeze LCD2: SPL Levels and Impressions*
  [size=10.0pt] [/size]
 I decided to cross-post my SPL measurements from the head-fi.org 'Audeze LCD2 Orthos' thread, posts #11056 and #11096, and add some additional impressions. Here are the links:[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/453116/audeze-lcd-2-orthos/11055[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/453116/audeze-lcd-2-orthos/11085[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I received my Dacmini with stock gain just over one week ago (thank you, Michael and Jay, for a great piece of gear and excellent pre/post sales support!). The build quality is excellent. It is very flexible, providing RCA variable/fixed line level, Toslink, USB, and Coax inputs. It also has RCA line outputs for DAC/pre-amp duty and a single-ended 1/4" headphone jack.  [size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 The Dacmini + LCD2 SQ is simply beautiful.  The Dacmini's DAC performs very close to my McIntosh MX-136 pre/pro's DAC performance and its noise floor is just as silent.  The Dacmini is fantastic paired with my Audeze LCD2's (thank you Alex, for excellent pre/post sales support!) as well as my Shure SE535, SE425, and Etymotic ER4P IEM's (I'm going to buy the Etymotic P to S impedance cable to see if the Ety ER4P's and Shure SE535's SQ is further improved with amplification). Volume tracking at low volume knob settings when listening to my IEM's is smooth, full, and equal from left to right.  Other features I would value in the Dacmini include balanced connections in/out, an on/off switch, and a remote control. Granted, XLR connections and a remote control would likely place the Dacmini's price point much higher than its current competitive price of $795, but an on/off switch should not significantly increase the price.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I love the Dacmini and Audeze LCD2 combination. The bass extension is deep, tight, fast, and musical. The LCD2's go deep and just keep on going without overpowering the mids and highs. The mids are lush, beautiful, full, and clear. Female vocals, piano, guitar, jazz, and classical rendition are superb.  I enjoy alternative, rock, indy, and chill just as much as my other favored musical genres. The highs are present, maybe a bit tamed/rolled off compared to other headphones, but the LCD2's treble is not "in your face" or fatiguing.  I have upper frequency hearing loss above 11k Hz so I typically EQ the treble for a little more prominence. If you favor quality/quantity in the bass to mid range, you will love this setup. If you favor a treble emphasis, consider other headphones or tweak the EQ like I do. The soundstage delivers good depth and very good instrument placement from left to right. Listening to this combination with eyes closed, I feel as if I am sitting front row, center.  The only modifications I want with my LCD2's are an attractive leather-covered headband, silver grills, and silver headband hardware which would make these phones truly eye-catching.  For an example, go here:  
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/453116/audeze-lcd-2-orthos/10995[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I use my MX-136 RCA variable outputs that make use of the MX-136 DAC allowing me to use the MX-136 remote control or Harmony One to change the headphone volume. Alternatively, I can use the toslink or coax outs from my MX-136 to my Dacmini in order to utilize the Dacmini's DAC.  Another option I really like is the ability connect my Dacmini to my MacBook Pro via mini-toslink or USB for hifi listening at my office.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 The Dacmini head amp has plenty of headroom.  I usually listen to my IEM's at 9 o'clock and with my LCD2's at 12 - 1 o'clock.  At full volume (5 o'clock), the Dacmini + LCD2's deliver 113 dB SPL which is way too loud!  (See SPL readings, below)
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
*CEntrance Dacmini + Audeze LCD2 SPL Levels with 1k Hz Pink Noise*[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
 Signal Chain for Table 1, below:  MacBook Pro Toslink --> McIntosh MX-136 pre/pro Toslink/Coax --> Dacmini --> Audeze LCD2[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I don't have a dummy head (except for the one between my ears, LOL), so I used my DIY headphone SPL adapter described in post #11056. I attached the adapter to my Radio Shack digital SPL meter set to C weighting and slow response. For the present measurements, I used a 1k Hz pink tone for 10 seconds with all Dacmini volume knob settings from 7 o'clock to 5 o'clock (clockwise positions as close to the same positions as possible for all 3 readings).  There are likely slight errors because I set the Dacmini's volume knob and positioned the SPL meter visually for all measurements.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I downloaded the UE iPhone SPL meter app from iTunes and "sandwiched" the iPhone microphone between both LCD2 ear cups.  I insured a tight seal all the way around with the iPhone UE SPL meter and with the Radio Shack SPL meter/DIY adapter. I used my iPhone 3G's default calibration.[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
_Unscientific _SPL Measurements:
  ______________________________________________________________________________
 [size=10.0pt][/size]​ *Table 1  Dacmini + Audeze LCD2 SPL Levels Using 1k Hz Pink Noise*[size=10.0pt][/size]​  [size=10.0pt][/size]
                    iPhone/ UE SPL           Radio Shack SPL          Radio Shack SPL[size=10.0pt][/size]
                         app (dB)                Left ear cup (dB)           Right ear cup (dB)[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
7 o'clock                 41                                57                            58[size=10.0pt][/size]
8 o'clock                 57                                62                            62[size=10.0pt][/size]
9 o'clock                 68                                66                            67[size=10.0pt][/size]
10 o'clock               73                                74                             74[size=10.0pt][/size]
11 o'clock               76                                77                             77[size=10.0pt][/size]
12 o'clock               79                                79                             80  (Safe Zone?)[size=10.0pt][/size]
1 o'clock                 85                                87                             88[size=10.0pt][/size]
2 o'clock                 90                                93                             93[size=10.0pt][/size]
3 o'clock                 94                                97                             97[size=10.0pt][/size]
4 o'clock                 98                               101                           101[size=10.0pt][/size]
5 o'clock                 99                               104                           103[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
Note 1:  Dacmini factory stock gain[size=10.0pt][/size]
Note 2:  Approximate SPL measurements[size=10.0pt][/size]
Note 3:  YMMV[size=10.0pt][/size]
___________________________________________________________________
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
*CEntrance Dacmini + Audeze LCD2 SPL Levels While Playing a CD*[size=10.0pt][/size]
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/453116/audeze-lcd-2-orthos/11055
 [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I cut the center hole of a standard CD clear plastic disc to the same diameter of a Radio Shack digital sound level meter's probe (Model 33-2055A).  I applied 5 layers of duct tape to the disc to secure it to the SPL meter probe and to seal any gaps.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 I set the SPL meter to C weighted, slow response and put on Patricia Barber's CD 'Cafe Blue' and song: "Too Rich For My Blood."  I listened to this song at my favored volume setting of 2 o'clock and then played the same song with the SPL meter DIY adapter disc pressed and sealed against the LCD2's Left ear cushion. I was surprised to see that the SPL ranged from 81 to 97 dB.  That did not seem too loud to me for all but the loudest passages, but obviously it is too loud for extended listening.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 Signal Chain, Settings, and _Unscientific_ SPL level Measurements:[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 Denon 3800BDCI AudioQuest toslink --> McIntosh MX-136 AudioQuest Coax --> Dacmini --> LCD2.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 Note 1: Dacmini factory stock gain.[size=10.0pt][/size]
 Note 2: Approximate SPL readings.[size=10.0pt][/size]
 Note 3: YMMV[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 *Dacmini volume knob set to:*[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 8 o'clock SPL readings: 59 to 72 dB - This is the next to lowest volume setting and too low for listening. For comparison, when using my Shure SE535 <impedance 36 ohms> the loudest volume setting I use is 9 to 10 o'clock  which is roughly equivalent to the LCD2's at 1 to 2 o'clock.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 9 o'clock SPL readings: 63 to 77 dB - Too low to enjoy.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 10 o'clock SPL readings: 64 to 79 dB - Cannot hear headphones 1 foot away; lowest level I would ever use and not loud enough for me.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 11 o'clock SPL readings: 66 to 81 dB - Barely hear headphones 1 foot away; full low-level listening pleasure for me.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 12 o'clock SPL readings: 70 to 86 dB - Pleasing and comfortable SPL's all the way through with very good SQ.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 1 o'clock SPL readings: 75 to 90 dB - My sweet spot for safer SPL levels. May have to turn down at certain passages; easily hear headphones from 3 feet away.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 2 o'clock SPL readings: 81 to 97 dB - Uncomfortable volume at musical peaks and crescendos; I have to turn it down for loudest passages; easily hear headphones from 6 feet away.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 3 o'clock SPL readings: 86 to 101 dB - Too loud for more than 15 seconds; can hear headphones from 10 feet away.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 4 o'clock SPL readings: 88 to 105 dB - Too loud for entire song; painful after a 30 seconds; can hear headphones in the next room.[size=10.0pt][/size]
  [size=10.0pt][/size]
 5 o'clock SPL readings: 90 to 113 dB - This is the highest volume setting and Immediately Painful.
 [size=10.0pt][/size]


----------



## elnero

Thanks for that info, I've got a DACmini on the way to be used with LCD-2's as well as some IEM's so this is some useful information.
   
  In regards to the on/off switch I thought I read somewhere that if you turn the selector switch to the extreme right or left it will turn off the unit.
   
  Also, I believe I'm responsible for the 1 ohm output impedance mod. After I ordered mine there was a post in the uDAC controversy thread in regards to higher output impedance possibly having a detrimental effect on the frequency response of some phones with low impedance IEM's being of particular concern. I've never paid much attention to output impedance but in the thread there was a specific mention of the DACport and DACmini's 10ohm output impedance, granted the post was in defense of the CEntrance products as not having any perceivable effect on the owners IEM's but I was a bit concerned nonetheless as my DACmini could potentially be used with a wide variety of phones. I talked to Jonathan about my concerns who said he would ask the design team about it. At the same time I did some research on my own and talked to a few people who's opinions I have a great deal of respect for and I kept coming to the conclusion that, at least in my situation, a lower output impedance would be preferable. After CEntrance discussed and tested the lower output impedance I was told that it works great. I had been under the impression that all new DACmini's would ship with the lower output impedance, hence I assume the change on the specs page but I guess they've since decided to offer it as a mod for some reason. I had also, possibly wrongly, been under the impression that there wasn't a detrimental effect to the sound.
   
  I have to say, Jonathan has been great in dealing with all my questions and concerns, very responsive and it's impressive that they've listened to their customers and offer these mods, it makes ordering very flexible for the buyers needs.


----------



## Ultraviolet88

hi guys, between DACmini and Schiit Lyr to drive beyerT1/LCD2/K701 kinda phones, which would be a better buy for sonics and musicality alone?
  DACmini seems like a better value due to DAC/preamp outs etc but I already have a decent DAC, just wondering if for pure sound driven from each dacmini vs schiit, any of you
  with experience of the two can share your findings?
  I have heard the Lyr twice but havent heard the DACmini before.
  Thanks for sharing.
   
  Cheers


----------



## K3cT

Does the DACMini sound like the DACPort?


----------



## Townyj

Look back through the thread, you will see Headphone Addict posted a few links about the differences. He preferred the DACmini by a good amount for SQ.

  
  Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Does the DACMini sound like the DACPort?


----------



## K3cT

townyj said:


> Look back through the thread, you will see Headphone Addict posted a few links about the differences. He preferred the DACmini by a good amount for SQ.




Ah, OK. Larry had mentioned that the DACMini shares a similar sound signature with the DACPort. I rather like the DACPort especially its form factor but it was obviously running out of juice when I tried the LCD2 with it. I also thought that it's not exactly neutral, a bit warm even. I honestly prefer a more neutral sound. 

Now we wait for more comparisons between the DACMini and the Burson HA160D.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

einero,
   
 I'm glad to hear you find this information helpful.  You are correct about the on/off.  By turning the source knob far left or far right, the Dacmini is put in standby; not completely off, though.
  
 I emailed Michael about the headphone output impedance option and the on/off question.  Here's what he had to say yesterday (Saturday):
  
 _"To be completely honest with you, the difference between 1 Ohm and 10 Ohm is so slight, it's almost imperceptible. However, we had done some extended evaluations and noticed that 10 Ohms may sound slightly more musical overall. The funny thing is that it's less "correct" from the engineering standpoint, but as is often with the arts, "precision" may not be the same as "pleasurable"._
  
 _"Yours most likely is a 10 Ohm unit. We only shipped a couple out with 1 Ohm (I know who they have gone to) before we got alerted to the difference. We  decided to go back pretty much immediately and keep 10 Ohm standard, offering 1 Ohm to those who need that ulimate engieering flatness. Customers have different tastes, you know..."_
  
 _"Yes, DACmini will go to sleep if you turn the source selector past line or USB input. It's not totally off; more like a power saving mode."_
  
  
 I am very happy with stock gain of 8 which plays louder than I will ever go. I'm also happy with the output impedance of 10 ohms.  
  
 FWIW:  My wife plays classical violin.  She has no idea what I'm talking about when I "speak that audiophile-electronics language."  She has no interest in learning the functions and comparative relationships of DAC's and amps, planar magnetic vs. dynamic drivers, or the inter-relationships of sensitivity, ohms, impedance, frequency response, etc.  She asked how much the Dacmini + LCD2 cost.  I told her I would tell her after she auditioned the setup and added that, "they're worth more to me than I paid."
  
 She is listening to the MacBook Pro + Dacmini + LCD2 combination for the first time, right now:  Beethoven String Quartets in A Minor. She will play these quartets this summer during "chamber music 'camp" at Kent.  She is listening and reading the music. Periodically, she laughs with pleasure.  She's made a couple of comments while listening:  "This is incredible!...I'm hearing notes I've never heard before!...Oh, wow!...This will help me; I'm going to 'nail it!"  She's humming the music and smiling a lot. Next, she listened to Steely Dan Gold, Punch Brothers Antifogmatic, Patricia Barber Cafe Blue and Modern Cool, and Beethoven's 9th symphony.  More favorable sotto voce praises followed.
  
 When finished, she  stated that this combination sounded as good, maybe better than, our McIntosh + B&W 800 series system.  She finally asked about the price.  I used the over-used ad line, "....priceless."  She said, "knowing you, you got the best."
  
 Her guess for the Dacmini + LCD2  ---->  $3000.  
  
 Now, for some lovely Diana Krall Live in Rio and Live in Paris DVD's.... Aaaahhhhhhh
   
  Quote: 





elnero said:


> Thanks for that info, I've got a DACmini on the way to be used with LCD-2's as well as some IEM's so this is some useful information.
> 
> In regards to the on/off switch I thought I read somewhere that if you turn the selector switch to the extreme right or left it will turn off the unit.
> 
> ...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Does the DACMini sound like the DACPort?


 
   
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> Look back through the thread, you will see Headphone Addict posted a few links about the differences. He preferred the DACmini by a good amount for SQ.


 
   
  Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 DACmini has a similar sound signature to the DACport, and you can tell there is a family resemblance.  But I think the DACmini has a little better treble presence which evens out the tonal balance a little more than the DACport - I do think the DACport is slightly warmer tinted than the DACmini.  I find that the DACmini adds better air, ambience and space to the performance than the DACport, and gives the impression of better micro-detail.  It's also noticeably more powerful than the DACport.
   
  I haven't heard the HA160D, sorry.


----------



## K3cT

Thanks for your inputs, Larry. Have you tried plugging your Sigma11 to the DACMini anyway?


----------



## dookie182

K3CT, I deeply second your question, as it seems that power supply does not matter that much in the case of the DACmini. But what about real world tests???
   
  Bay the way what do you guys think of the DAC mini dac side alone as I also intend to use in a livingroom speaker system? Thanks a lot in advance for your reply.
   
  and last but not least, did anyone of you tried the audiophileo device with the DACmini. Centrance seems to already have "state of the art" usb implementation (by the way any recommandation for usb cable wireworld starlight?). On the case of the Anedio D1 dac that claim that every input sounds exactly the same, the audiophileo did make a difference...in the good way!!!
   
  kindest regards.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *bluemonkeyflyer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> _"To be completely honest with you, the difference between 1 Ohm and 10 Ohm is so slight, it's almost imperceptible. However, we had done some extended evaluations and noticed that 10 Ohms may sound slightly more musical overall. The funny thing is that it's less "correct" from the engineering standpoint, but as is often with the arts, "precision" may not be the same as "pleasurable"._
 
   
  That seems like a rather ambiguous description of the difference especially when you consider, at least from how I understand it, that the higher output impedance may have a different effect depending on the phones used. It could have little to no effect with some or it could sound a bit better or possibly worse with others. Now something I couldn't get a handle on was how significant the difference between 1 and 10 ohms would be so, ambiguity aside, the difference may very well be slight.
   
  I could be wrong on this so others more knowledgeable than I please correct me if necessary, at least from what I understand, due to their design the LCD-2's shouldn't be affected much, if at all, by a higher output impedance. My concern lies more with IEM's which typically can have low and widely varying impedance curves that would be more affected by the higher output impedance. After owning but having had to sell JH Audio 13Pro's due to fit problems and issues caused by TMJ, I know my Triple.Fi's aren't the last word in IEM's so I'll eventually be on the hunt for a universal that gets me closer to the performance of the 13Pro's, it's this search and not knowing where it will take me that influenced my desire for the output impedance to have as little influence on the sound as possible. Maybe in this case I was being overly cautious but not having a whole lot of knowledge on the subject I felt it was the safer route for me.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





elnero said:


> That seems like a rather ambiguous description of the difference especially when you consider, at least from how I understand it, that the higher output impedance may have a different effect depending on the phones used. It could have little to no effect with some or it could sound a bit better or possibly worse with others. Now something I couldn't get a handle on was how significant the difference between 1 and 10 ohms would be so, ambiguity aside, the difference may very well be slight.
> 
> I could be wrong on this so others more knowledgeable than I please correct me if necessary, at least from what I understand, due to their design the LCD-2's shouldn't be affected much, if at all, by a higher output impedance. My concern lies more with IEM's which typically can have low and widely varying impedance curves that would be more affected by the higher output impedance. After owning but having had to sell JH Audio 13Pro's due to fit problems and issues caused by TMJ, I know my Triple.Fi's aren't the last word in IEM's so I'll eventually be on the hunt for a universal that gets me closer to the performance of the 13Pro's, it's this search and not knowing where it will take me that influenced my desire for the output impedance to have as little influence on the sound as possible. Maybe in this case I was being overly cautious but not having a whole lot of knowledge on the subject I felt it was the safer route for me.


 
  So order the 1 ohm mod and then you can make your own 10 ohm adapter easily.  That way you can have both.


----------



## pekingduck

Just received an email from Michael saying my modded DACmini was shipped out today


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Thanks for your inputs, Larry. Have you tried plugging your Sigma11 to the DACMini anyway?


 

 I'd want to verify my 15v S11 has the correct polarity first.


----------



## K3cT

headphoneaddict said:


> I'd want to verify my 15v S11 has the correct polarity first.




Should be fine if the specifications in the Centrance site is correct.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Well, if you help me out and you swear that the polarity of the DACmini and HDP PSU is the same I'll try the Sigma 11 with the DACmini soon.  I'm just too tired to look it up right now (pretty sad).


----------



## elnero

My DACmini arrived today. Packaging seems very well done and the build quality of the DACmini itself is outstanding. During the waiting period I started to wonder if I'd made the right choice, especially with all the initial positive feedback on the Lyr paired with the LCD-2's, although I've only had a short time to listen so far it seems those fears were unjustified. I started out listening to the LCD-2's and the combo put a smile on my face but I was curious how my Triple.Fi's would fare so I switched over to them and haven't been able to take them out, the DACmini is breathing new life into this old favorite.
   
  So far I've only got one rather minor gripe, it seems the PSU comes with the plug to the DACmini attached but no power cord to go from the PSU to the wall. I assume this is standard because I bought a second PSU to take into work and it didn't come with one either. Not a big deal for me, I have a couple decent power cords and some standard issue ones floating about but thought it worth mentioning for those that might not have a spare one lying about.


----------



## Townyj

Wow... you used your Triple.fi's with it! I can hardly turn the volume up past 8 1/2 on the attenuator with my GR07's, even with my RE-262's. How low do you have the volume without channel inbalance..??
   
  They dont ship power cords with the DACmini due to so many differences with Country power outlets. I got a piece of paper in mine that stated this. No biggy as i had a spare cord put away.
   
  Quote: 





elnero said:


> My DACmini arrived today. Packaging seems very well done and the build quality of the DACmini itself is outstanding. During the waiting period I started to wonder if I'd made the right choice, especially with all the initial positive feedback on the Lyr paired with the LCD-2's, although I've only had a short time to listen so far it seems those fears were unjustified. I started out listening to the LCD-2's and the combo put a smile on my face but I was curious how my Triple.Fi's would fare so I switched over to them and haven't been able to take them out, the DACmini is breathing new life into this old favorite.
> 
> So far I've only got one rather minor gripe, it seems the PSU comes with the plug to the DACmini attached but no power cord to go from the PSU to the wall. I assume this is standard because I bought a second PSU to take into work and it didn't come with one either. Not a big deal for me, I have a couple decent power cords and some standard issue ones floating about but thought it worth mentioning for those that might not have a spare one lying about.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Wow... you used your Triple.fi's with it! I can hardly turn the volume up past 8 1/2 on the attenuator with my GR07's, even with my RE-262's. How low do you have the volume without channel inbalance..??
> 
> They dont ship power cords with the DACmini due to so many differences with Country power outlets. I got a piece of paper in mine that stated this. No biggy as i had a spare cord put away.


 

 Ahhh yes, that makes sense.
   
  Yeah, there's not a whole lot of usable volume, I was at about the same on the dial, between 8 and 8 1/2 but the channel imbalance is at an extremely low volume so there's enough in between there for it to be usable.
   
  I had borrowed a friends Headroom Desktop Portable amp when I was looking at changing my system around and I found it was fairly reasonable to lug back and forth to work in my backpack so when I realized the DACmini had similar dimensions that became a big part of my decision to buy one. If the DACmini stays the plan is to use it both at home with the LCD-2's and at work with IEM's.


----------



## Townyj

Or you can just sell off your other gear... Keep the DACmini at home and buy a DACport for work with your iems  I might consider the DACport as a buy once i get my grubby hands on a laptop.
   
  Sounds like you have the same volume range as myself, anything higher then 9 with IEM's on the DACmini is way to loud. Hope your enjoying your new toy!

  
  Quote: 





elnero said:


> Ahhh yes, that makes sense.
> 
> Yeah, there's not a whole lot of usable volume, I was at about the same on the dial, between 8 and 8 1/2 but the channel imbalance is at an extremely low volume so there's enough in between there for it to be usable.
> 
> I had borrowed a friends Headroom Desktop Portable amp when I was looking at changing my system around and I found it was fairly reasonable to lug back and forth to work in my backpack so when I realized the DACmini had similar dimensions that became a big part of my decision to buy one. If the DACmini stays the plan is to use it both at home with the LCD-2's and at work with IEM's.


----------



## pekingduck

I see you own the Gilmore Lite, how does the mini fare against that?
  
  Quote: 





elnero said:


> My DACmini arrived today. Packaging seems very well done and the build quality of the DACmini itself is outstanding. During the waiting period I started to wonder if I'd made the right choice, especially with all the initial positive feedback on the Lyr paired with the LCD-2's, although I've only had a short time to listen so far it seems those fears were unjustified. I started out listening to the LCD-2's and the combo put a smile on my face but I was curious how my Triple.Fi's would fare so I switched over to them and haven't been able to take them out, the DACmini is breathing new life into this old favorite.
> 
> So far I've only got one rather minor gripe, it seems the PSU comes with the plug to the DACmini attached but no power cord to go from the PSU to the wall. I assume this is standard because I bought a second PSU to take into work and it didn't come with one either. Not a big deal for me, I have a couple decent power cords and some standard issue ones floating about but thought it worth mentioning for those that might not have a spare one lying about.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Or you can just sell off your other gear...


 
   
  Actually, selling off my other gear is the idea but those funds will have to go on my CC as it's taken quite a hit recently.

   
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> I see you own the Gilmore Lite, how does the mini fare against that?


 

 Actually I sold the Lite about a month back to help finance the DACmini so I can't directly compare. I was using the Lite with my Pico DAC and personally I didn't really like the pairing with the LCD-2's that much.


----------



## K3cT

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Well, if you help me out and you swear that the polarity of the DACmini and HDP PSU is the same I'll try the Sigma 11 with the DACmini soon.  I'm just too tired to look it up right now (pretty sad).


 

 It should work but if you want to make sure, you can check whether the polarity symbol in the DACMini matches with the one in HDP or not. The DACMini's DC supply is a pretty standard affair though.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> It should work but if you want to make sure, you can check whether the polarity symbol in the DACMini matches with the one in HDP or not. The DACMini's DC supply is a pretty standard affair though.


 
  Just remember that a very important part of the power supply needed for the DACMini is inside the DACMini.  Just make sure the wart you plug in can supply the required current as well as the voltage.  A great and critical part of power supply conditioning, filtering, and regulating, all takes place within the DACMini itself.  (Great design on the part of Centrance.)


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Just remember that a very important part of the power supply needed for the DACMini is inside the DACMini.  Just make sure the wart you plug in can supply the required current as well as the voltage.  A great and critical part of power supply conditioning, filtering, and regulating, all takes place within the DACMini itself.  (Great design on the part of Centrance.)


 

 We're assuming the 15v Sigma 11 has the proper current supply.  I can't see why not.


----------



## dookie182

I feel like I'm meltin waiting for the answer to the power supply tweak : does it improve the sonics even further?!
  Headphoneaddict, did you dare to plug the sigma11 in yet? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  kindest regards


----------



## WilCox

I've tried running my DACmini off of an analog supply and SLA battery power but can hear no difference in sound quality.  As Kevin says, the DACmini uses its own well-designed internal switching supplies, so the DC will be converted back to AC in any event.


----------



## WilCox

I did speak with CEntrance about power supply current requirement and they thought that the current draw was only about 1/3 amp.  The switcher supplied is 19V at 1.5A.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





wilcox said:


> I've tried running my DACmini off of an analog supply and SLA battery power but can hear no difference in sound quality.  As Kevin says, the DACmini uses its own well-designed internal switching supplies, so the DC will be converted back to AC in any event.


 

 So you have a DACmini, if you don't mind my asking, how do you feel it stacks up against the other sources and amps you own?


----------



## ptrok

Well after a long wait I finally got my Dacmini today and I am surprisingly impressed. After waiting about 3 months to finally get this bad boy (not all the fault of Centrance, took about a month to finally get it shipped to South Korea after my friend received it) my expectations were at an all time high. Thankfully, I am more than still impressed with the product. Granted my previous amp/dac combo is laughable when compared to everyone else on this site (Fiio E7) but the files I have are all flac files including 24/192 files. 

They completely compliment my LCD-2's even without a break-in. I am listening to the "Explorations in Space and Time" at 24/176.4 even though I am using the USB interface for now so I don't get the benefit from the higher sample rate and I am completely dumbfounded by the sound quality and soundstage that is present compared to the E7 I had. I haven't heard any of the other big named flagships, my only experience is with some AD-700's and HD-598 so take this with a grain of salt. Other things I have noticed is the apparent depth and separation between instruments and the dark background. Very cliche, I know but this is what I noticed.

I know many of you will say there are plenty of better combinations but ignorance is bliss because I am completely satisfied and have no urge to endure upgraditis. For people who have just been introduced into head-fi and don't know they're bearing I would highly recommend this combo because for me the sound is sublime. It represents a very great start and it leads me to regret the baby steps I took to get here. 

I must thank many people on this site for helping reach my conclusion and find what you guys are doing is beyond helpful. HeadphoneAddict and Austin thanks for the great advice you provided on this forum because it has made be extremely happy. For all the other beginners out there lurking the forums, this might be your cup of tea.


----------



## kwkarth

Nice post and congratulations on your new DacMini and LCD-2s!


----------



## ptrok

Thanks Kwkarth, you are definitely one of those contiributors who taught me a lot about head-fi. 

I also wanted to add that Jason was super helpful with all my questions and struck me as one of the most pleasant people to tap for information. I asked a lot of questions and in no way was he stand-offish like some of the other people I have had communications with leading up to my purchase. Really a class act and direct, two things I like about any person I do business with. Just wanted to add this because he was so great and let people know to ask him for anything you need to know. He usually got back to me withing hours of an e-mail. Good stuff.


----------



## WilCox

Quote:


elnero said:


> So you have a DACmini, if you don't mind my asking, how do you feel it stacks up against the other sources and amps you own?


 

 Like HeadphoneAddict, I got the DACmini to use with my LCD-2 in a bedroom system.  It replaced a Bel Canto DAC3/Lehmann Black Cube Linear.  As soon as I started listening to the DACmini, I knew that I wouldn't miss the Bel Canto/Lehmann combo -- it's that good.  I listen to Apple Lossless and hi-res FLAC via a Squeezebox Touch which pairs nicely with the DACmini for hi-res music.


----------



## ert

Quote: 





townyj said:


> They dont ship power cords with the DACmini due to so many differences with Country power outlets. I got a piece of paper in mine that stated this. No biggy as i had a spare cord put away.


 
   
  For $800, they could at least ship with a US AC cable.  There's no excuse for a product in this price range to ship without the AC cord.


----------



## pekingduck

I can confirm the DACmini works with the iPad 1 w/ iOS 4.3.2 and Camera Connection Kit. No powered hub needed.
  
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> iPad 2 with OS 4.3.0 > Camera Connection Kit > DACmini was tested tonight.  No powered hub needed.
> 
> IT DEFINITELY WORKS, and iTunes on iPad2 shows that it's connected the the CEntrance DACmini in the spot where a volume control would normally show up.  And it sounds very good with my LCD-2.
> 
> ...


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





ert said:


> For $800, they could at least ship with a US AC cable.  There's no excuse for a product in this price range to ship without the AC cord.


 

 Give me a break.  Go to Radio Shack and buy a $3 power cord.


----------



## Townyj

LOL! You took the words out of my mouth... I had exactly that typed up but didnt think it was worth a mouse click 
  Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Give me a break.  Go to Radio Shack and buy a $3 power cord.


----------



## Anouk

Hi everyone, Due to the fact that the nuforce dac9 price is higher then expected approx 1700 dollar and even more expensive for me because I have to go through a Dutch dealer, the dacmini is back on my radar. I need a dac with headphone out to use with my es5, I already have a diy active preamp to connect to my poweramp but it only has xlr inputs and the dacmini only has rca outputs and i guess these are non-balanced. I used the dacmagic by cambridge audio in the past and that one had xlr outputs so i could connect it directly to my preamp. I could of course use an adapter cable but I am worried that the sound through my speakers will be less then in the past. My poweramp has rca inputs but I am not sure if its a good idea to plug it into the dacmini (in the first place because I have owned a few headphone amps that dualed as preamp via a loop-through output and my own preamp sounds better then those passive solutions and in the second place because i have a primare 30.2 poweramp that does 120 watt into 4 ohm, with some of the afformentioned solutions it was just too loud even at the lowest volume setting) the reason for me to consider the nuforce dac-9 was that that onehas xlr outputs (fixed and variable). What do you guys think? Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## tktran

A $150 printer doesn't even come with a USB cable, and that is a worldwide standard. An IEC power cable is country specific, and costs a few dollars. Chances are you already have one laying around...


----------



## Jay Listens

Ert,
   
  Sorry the IEC cable was not in your DACmini box. We do ship this cable INCLUDED with DACmini. Please send me a PM and we will either send one, or (I'm noticing you're also located in Chicago) I can even drop one off personally.
   
  Again, our apologies.
   
  -Jay


----------



## ert

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Ert,
> 
> Sorry the IEC cable was not in your DACmini box. We do ship this cable INCLUDED with DACmini. Please send me a PM and we will either send one, or (I'm noticing you're also located in Chicago) I can even drop one off personally.
> 
> ...


 

 Hi Jay, I'm actually still waiting for my mini   I was commenting on *Townyj's* comments, but as it appears he is in the UK I guess there's no issue.
   
   
  Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Give me a break.  Go to Radio Shack and buy a $3 power cord


 
   
  LOL, I hope you don't work in product marketing or sales.


----------



## tktran

After a 5 week wait, they've finally arrived.
   
  Worth the wait?
   
  Build/finish- 4.5 stars.
  Features- 4.5 stars
  Sound- 5 stars
   
  As a D/A converter, no difference to my Apogee gear. Except not just for OSX, but for Windows, Linux, Xbox 360, PS3, TV, PVR, Squeezebox, CD player... 
   
  Let the good times roll...


----------



## songforyou

After reading every post on every thread here (no, really...okay, not every post), I ordered a DACmini yesterday. 
   
  I already own a DACport and have been using it to drive my LCD-2s at my computer.  I've also been using it as a DAC into an integrated amp and as a preamp into an amp.  So impressed with its performance that I thought I'd spring for the mini so I can leave my DACport at my computer desk.
   
  Initially, I was looking for a DAC/amp combo for USB/itunes headphone listening, but the functionality of the DACmini got me thinking (and spending!).  I ended up ordering the variable output option and will be using the mini as a preamp to feed a gloriously refurbished Dynaco ST-70 driving a pair of Spica TC-50s.  It will be my "New meets Old" system.  I'll also use the optical or coax for my DVD and the analog in for my vinyl rig.  And when the kids are doing homework or are in bed, I'll obviously resort to the LCDs.
   
  I'll report back once I've received the DACmini and have given it a good listen, but I have to commend CEntrance on their prompt and detailed responses to my numerous questions over the last little while.


----------



## tktran

I too ordered the pre-amp version aka variable output mod. And so it is ultra flexible. 

I've replaced a class A preamplifier and dac and headphone amplifier all with the one unit.

Of course I'd pay even more for selectable fixed/variable output, motorized remote volume control, updated form factor (fit current Mac mini), black finish, balanced in/outputs, 10 ins 10 outs, FireWire 800, preamps etc....but then... Hey, that's not a dac mini (and cost 5 times as much)


----------



## dookie182

Hi guys,
   
  I just ordered a DACmini thanks to all the positive feedbacks and awsome respondiveness (not sure this word really exist, but it make sens to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) of centrance guys.
  A couple of question I was wondering.
   
  -I think we could state that the Dacmini+audeze LCD2 is one of a great pair. Do you guys use aftermarket cables with your LCD2? And so, I guess that, depending of the aftermarket qualities, it does also impact the synergy of the dacmini+LCD2 in a amazing or not so great way. In so, could you guys share your thougt, impressions or advises. I'm aware there is a particular thread about aftermarket cable for this pair of can, but as I'm particulary interested in this amp/can combo, I think that is was the best way to post here.
   
  -It seems that the design of the powersupply (internal part+external brick combo) is very special, and following the philosophy of pro-audio centrance compagny (polyvalance, adaptability, durability...). So it seems that the dacmini does not respond that much to power supply tweaks or upgrades (I know someone try the battery tweak but didn't find any particular change in the sonics). Did some of you try any further "real world" experiments (headphoneaddict, did you finaly try to plug your sigma11 psu in?) did some of you have the occasion to try different aftermarket cables from "decent quality" to "very high end"? Did you noticed any change/improuvement? Or did you all stick with a "3$ radioshack" one"? (and I'm not implying the one provided by centrance is a 3$ one  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm just quoting someone that made me laugh!)
   
  -Did some of you have the occasion to try your dacmini with/without power conditionner? Did you noticed any change? 
   
  I'm kind og thinking that if, in some way, this unit can give initialy some frustration to the tweaking/optimising side of hifi rig builind, that aslo imply saving a lot of $$$ one side accessories.
   
  looking forward to your comments.


----------



## ptrok

As it stands, I love the combo with the stock cables on the LCD-2 with the Dacmini. However, just made a purchase with Steve Eddy at Q-audio. He has some cables that are highly regarded by some veteran head-fiers on this site. 

They are called black magic cables and there prices are great compared to other cable manufacturers. Also, Steve is a great guy who I don't mind giving my money to. He is very helpful and responsive. (the word you were looking for is responsiveness) I haven't received the cables yet since I live in South Korea but as soon as I get them I will let you know what I think. According to Kwkarth, Skylab ad HK_sends they are great cables and their opinions are highly regarded.

If you are curious about cables, PM Steve Eddy and he can give you some information about the cables or you can search Q-audio cables and probably learn about it that way. Good luck on your search.


----------



## bumblingbooby

Pardon my obtuseness but can this be used purely as a DAC connected to a headphone amplifier? I've just ordered a DNA Sonett and am now venturing into the mind boggling world of DACs. There's so many of them it's overwhelming.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





bumblingbooby said:


> Pardon my obtuseness but can this be used purely as a DAC connected to a headphone amplifier? I've just ordered a DNA Sonett and am now venturing into the mind boggling world of DACs. There's so many of them it's overwhelming.


 
  It can, yes, and one can choose if the line outs are controlled by the volume control or not, at the time of order.


----------



## dookie182

thanks a lot  ptrok for your wise advise, I just PM steve eddy. 
my I ask your advise or fedbacks regarding the power related topic? are you using the standard power cord?
thank you all for keeping this thread and interested and inspireing one


----------



## bumblingbooby

Thank you kwkarth. I've only just commenced my search for a DAC. My preference is for a DAC only to team with the headphone amplifier and laptop to form a desktop audio system. The HRT II+ attracts me as a reasonably priced good quality DAC for this purpose but the DACmini appears very impressive at its price point. I also prefer that it has its own power supply.


----------



## songforyou

Bumbling,
   
  It is my understanding that CEntrance is coming out with a DAC only version of the DACport (no head amp or volume control) very soon (weeks?).  They would know for sure.


----------



## bumblingbooby

That would be ideal. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hopefully it will be cheaper than the DACmini, which exceeds the budget that I've set for a DAC. I'd prefer to keep the purchase of a DAC to around $500 if possible. I sent CEntrance an email enquiry last night so they might make mention of this in their reply. Thanks for the information songforyou.


----------



## ptrok

dookie182 said:


> thanks a lot  ptrok for your wise advise, I just PM steve eddy.
> my I ask your advise or fedbacks regarding the power related topic? are you using the standard power cord?
> thank you all for keeping this thread and interested and inspireing one




Hey Dookie, I wish I could help you out with the power supply issue but it is out of my ability sets. I'm a beginner and do not want to lead you astray. I can only comment on what I have read. From what I have seen, it seems that Centrance's does a good job of eliminating problems with power supply issues. But I can only comment on hearsay. I use the standard power supply and it sounds great with no sonic issues. It seems like a clean representation of how the music was intended to sound. 

Please take my opinion with a grain of salt because I have no background in music or engineering. I'm just a lowly English Teacher with an expensive hobby...LOL. 

Good luck with your search for answers.


----------



## bumblingbooby

Further to songforyou's post, I've exchanged emails with Michael Goodman who advised that CEntrance isn't planning to release a DAC-only version of the DACmini. However, they will be releasing a DAC-only version of the DACport later this summer.


----------



## songforyou

Yes, that's exactly what they indicated to me...a DAC only version of the *DACport *(not the mini).  Hopefully it will be priced competitively with the HRT streamers.  Looking forward to it!


----------



## fierce_freak

Does anyone know the size plug the power input will take?  5.5/2.5?


----------



## Anouk

Hi everyone,
 I bought one of these yesterday, i could not find where to configure its options though so I sent them my requests for that by email.
 I am debating now though wether or not to buy a conversion box so that I get truely balanced output out from it to feed to my pereamp or to just buy an rca to xlr cable instead.
 Oh does anyone know if this thing has a voltage switch or if it switches automatically?
 Thanks
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Townyj

Anouk,
   
  You use windows sound to configure it and choose USB/SPIF etc.
   
  Also the Power pack supplied is auto switching, 100 - 240v. You wont get balanced output from the RCA to XLR cables you buy.
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi everyone,
> I bought one of these yesterday, i could not find where to configure its options though so I sent them my requests for that by email.
> I am debating now though wether or not to buy a conversion box so that I get truely balanced output out from it to feed to my pereamp or to just buy an rca to xlr cable instead.
> Oh does anyone know if this thing has a voltage switch or if it switches automatically?
> ...


----------



## Anouk

Hi, I was referring to options like the ohm at the headphone output and fixed or variable outputs. About balanded output, ok then I will have to look into a converter box from rca to xlr. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

Emailing them is the only way for now. I think there isn't a webpage for choosing the mods, yet.
  
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi, I was referring to options like the ohm at the headphone output and fixed or variable outputs. About balanded output, ok then I will have to look into a converter box from rca to xlr. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Townyj

Yeah Pecking is correct, you can only get these options at checkout if you note it down. Or email them before hand.

  
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi, I was referring to options like the ohm at the headphone output and fixed or variable outputs. About balanded output, ok then I will have to look into a converter box from rca to xlr. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi, well I did not know that before ordering and I could not find any edit field to write my comments. I hope it will be allright but I was in contact with jay bbefore so I guess it iwll be. looking forward to having the unit in my hands. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi again,
   
  As always please send me a PM with any and all questions. Due to the increased amount of work we will need to start charging for all mods (all pricing is updated in our store) but if you contact me here I may be able to still get them added without a charge.
   
  -Jay


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

anouk said:


> Hi, I was referring to options like the ohm at the headphone output and fixed or variable outputs. About balanded output, ok then I will have to look into a converter box from rca to xlr. Greetings, Anouk,




Look for a Jensens Transformers ISOmax box, to convert the SE outputs to balanced via transformers.


----------



## AVU

Does anyone know the D/A chip in this?  Or how it compares to the recent spate of Sabre D/As like the Peachtree Decco2,  EE Minimax, Wyred4Sound D1, or even something older like the Benchmark DAC1?


----------



## Townyj

I have read that its an AKM chip.


----------



## Audiowood

I am deciding between the Headroom Ultra desktop Amp and Centrance for my HD800.  I am currently using Ipod classic > SOLO > Shure Volume in line control > HD800... loving the sound so far. How does this 2 compare.. I am into Vocal Jazz, Newage & Lush music (mostly female vocalist with electronic influence). Should I also go for gain 8 or 10 if used exclusively with HD800? I also wish to get some bass for my HD800 - Thanks in advance for the advice.


----------



## pekingduck

Gain of 8 is good enough. Normal listening level for me with the HD800 is around 9 to 11 o'clock. 12'o clock is already quite loud and beyond that it's deafening.
   

  
  Quote: 





audiowood said:


> I am deciding between the Headroom Ultra desktop Amp and Centrance for my HD800.  I am currently using Ipod classic > SOLO > Shure Volume in line control > HD800... loving the sound so far. How does this 2 compare.. I am into Vocal Jazz, Newage & Lush music (mostly female vocalist with electronic influence). Should I also go for gain 8 or 10 if used exclusively with HD800? I also wish to get some bass for my HD800 - Thanks in advance for the advice.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

FWIW:  My friend liked my Dacmini + LCD2 combo so much he sold his Stax Lambda Pro/SRT1 amp and bought the Dacmini/LCD2's.  He A/B'd the Dacmini against his Levinson No. 360 DAC and said, "It's a toss up, and amazing considering the price difference between the Dacmini and Levinson. Science has progressed!"


----------



## Audiowood

Thanks for the advice. By the way I see that you too have the CLAS. Do you think the CLAS as a DAC match the sound quality of DacMini? Can you give a little example in terms of how these 2 compare? Ie..more mid for Dacmini, less mid bass than CLAS etc...  I have only the CLAS to use as a reference now.
   
  Thanks
  
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> Gain of 8 is good enough. Normal listening level for me with the HD800 is around 9 to 11 o'clock. 12'o clock is already quite loud and beyond that it's deafening.


----------



## Audiowood

You almost had me pull the trigger on the DacMini. Hopefully Peking duck can do a quick comparison on the CLAS vs Dacmini.
  
  Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> FWIW:  My friend liked my Dacmini + LCD2 combo so much he sold his Stax Lambda Pro/SRT1 amp and bought the Dacmini/LCD2's.  He A/B'd the Dacmini against his Levinson No. 360 DAC and said, "It's a toss up, and amazing considering the price difference between the Dacmini and Levinson. Science has progressed!"


----------



## Townyj

These are ment for totally different things... CLAS/Portable, DACmini/Desktop... Buy which has more priority with your gear.

  
  Quote: 





audiowood said:


> You almost had me pull the trigger on the DacMini. Hopefully Peking duck can do a quick comparison on the CLAS vs Dacmini.


----------



## Audiowood

Yes they are for diff things.. But I do hope it will at least match the CLAS SQ or better as its a desktop .. right?
  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> These are ment for totally different things... CLAS/Portable, DACmini/Desktop... Buy which has more priority with your gear.


----------



## Townyj

I would hope so seeing as the DACmini is more for studio use, but i cant compare as i havent heard the CLAS. Would be safer going for the DACmini, the CLAS is $570 by itself... Spend money on other things imo. But thats my opinion  haha.

  
  Quote: 





audiowood said:


> Yes they are for diff things.. But I do hope it will at least match the CLAS SQ or better as its a desktop .. right?


----------



## pekingduck

I just did a very quick comparison with different genres: rock, piano solo and orchestral music etc.
   
  I had the coaxial and line outputs of the Solo fed into the DACmini simultaneously, and used the input selector to quickly switch between the two. I had a hard time telling the difference. They're very very close in tonality, so close that any sonic differences could be attributed to small difference in volume. In short, I don't have a conclusion for now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Regarding the amp part: I was worried that the amp would be too thin and bright for the HD800 but it turned out fine. The sound is transparent and non-fatiguing. Two thumbs up for CEntrance


----------



## elnero

I apologize for the delay in posting further impressions of the DACmini, it's been a hectic couple of weeks which has made getting serious listening time harder. I've managed some though and  I've written a few thoughts which has turned out to be much longer than I intended. I wouldn't look at this as a proper review though, I still think there's more to uncover with the DACmini that only time will allow to show through. In short, thus far I'm very happy with the DACmini's  performance with the exception of a couple of reservations .

*Some background for context*

 A bit of background might help to give my thoughts some context. Selling my JHAudio 13Pro's then buying the LCD-2's signaled a shift back to a home rig, unfortunately after the losses incurred selling the 13Pro's my budget has been rather limited. Originally I thought a Gilmore Lite paired with my Pico DAC would prove to be a suitable first step up on the ladder but the pairing proved less than ideal. Then after a friend loaned me his Headroom Desktop Portable amp which paired much better with the LCD-2's I went looking for alternatives. Not knowing if it was the Pico DAC, the Lite or just the combination of the two I figured I had two routes to go, one was to simply buy another amp to pair with the Pico DAC. In my price range the only thing that looked appealing was the Schiit Lyr. The other option was to sell my portable setup in favor of something like the Desktop Portable that I could still take to work yet is more capable of driving the LCD-2's.

 The DACmini stood out because not only was the pairing with LCD-2's getting some good feedback from a few users but it's size and weight are close to that of the Desktop Portable opening up the possibility of lugging it to work thus replacing my portable setup. I also like the idea that it's a piece that would potentially stick around as I could upgrade the LCD-2 setup around it then have it move into a bedroom rig that would mostly be used with IEM's. After quite a bit of discussion and deliberation I decided to take a leap of faith and give the DACmini a try.

*Impressions With LCD-2's*

 One of the first things I noticed about the DACmini is it brings out more treble in the LCD-2's than I've heard from them previously. I'm not a fan of over emphasized treble so I was a bit concerned at first but thus far the treble has not come across as harsh in any way and there's not been any over-emphasis on sibilance, on the contrary, even though there's more it's very smooth yet detailed. Previously I may have agreed that the LCD-2's were a bit subdued on the top but the DACmini has changed my view of that and allowed me to hear the LCD-2's in a new light.

 Tonality, texture and vocals are areas the LCD-2's excel at and the DACmini allows these traits to show through in a very natural way. Listening to Iron & Wine's live at Wheaton College recording which is a rather unique solo recording of just Sam Beam and his acoustic guitar, the combination of the LCD-2's and DACmini perform that wonderful illusion of transporting the listener "there" in the first row. Sam Beams voice has never sounded more intimate and the tone and detail of the acoustic guitar is rendered in the most realistic fashion I've heard with subtle details showing through in his playing which only add to the illusion of being there. It's like somebody cleaned the window I was looking through allowing me to make more sense of the whole picture.

 Another live recording that first captured my attention back when I had the 13Pro's is The Tiger Lillies "Urine Palace". For those unfamilar with The Tiger Lillies they are a band that is incredibly hard to describe, Martyn Jacques sings in what's described as a castrati style voice while playing accordian and accompanied by drums and double bass. The songs are of a very dark nature but done in a humorful, contrasting, sometimes almost beautiful style. The live setting of "Urine Palace" captures this bizarre band in a way none of the other recordings I've heard from them does. With the crowd close and subtle hints to the surroundings like the occasional beer bottle falling the ambient cues give the impression of a small bar. The 13Pro's had a way of capturing the ambience, the details and the music I didn't think the LCD-2's quite achieved until heard them with the DACmini. Martyn Jacques vocals take on a realism and dynamic quality that is at times goose bump worthy. The same can be said can be said for the whole band but Jacques vocal style is just so captivating that it takes center stage beyond everything else. Obviously I can't do a direct comparison to the 13Pro's anymore but from memory when paired with the DACmini the LCD-2's do at least as good a job with what feels like a more natural quality.

 When planning this amp purchase an area I was concerned about with the LCD-2's was the bass. The 13Pro's have a bump in the sub-bass that gives an added foundation to the music but at times I thought it could sound a bit lean through the mid bass. My old standby Triple.Fi's by contrast have a bump in the midbass and lack the extension in the sub-bass of the 13Pro's. The LCD-2's virtually flat bass seems to offer the best of both worlds but can also sound a bit lean on recordings I'm intimately familar with on the other two. Considering reports of the LCD-2's liking power I've had concerns about any purchase I make having an adverse affect on the bass due to a lack of sufficient power.

 Initially I had a few concerns about the bass with the DACmini but as I've listened it seems those initial concerns were either unfounded or that the bass took some time to fully flesh out. The LCD-2's still don't quite have the sub-bass presence of the 13Pro's, it's not too far off though and is very satisfying nonetheless and it's rendered with all the detail and texture that the rest of the spectrum is. The DACmini does not ever feel like it's running out of steam or that the LCD-2's could use more power. I'm sitting here listening to Brant Bjork's "Jalamanta" which has some very nice bass in it, at times on this recording the 13Pro's bass could actually dominate a bit too much but with the LCD-2's there seems to be a better overall top to bottom balance.

 The DACmini exhibits a slight warmth and smoothness that allows the music to just flow but don't be mistaken, this isn't a tube-like lush warmth. I could see some preferring a lusher presentation than the DACmini provides but often times that  lushness can come at the expense of other areas. The DACmini seems to do a very good job of balancing just the right amount of ingredients without over or under doing any one thing. In short with regards to the LCD-2's I really have no complaints, the DACmini does a superb job of allowing the LCD-2's to do what they do best, play music in a very natural and engaging way.

*Triple.Fi's*

 I haven't listened a whole lot with the Triple.Fi's as I haven't wanted to transport the DACmini to and from work until I am firmly decided that it's staying. It's with the Triple.Fi's that a couple of concerns have cropped up. While the DACmini has taken the Triple.Fi's to a previously unheard level I can only turn the volume up to between 8 and 9 o'clock which doesn't allow for much usable range. My other concern is that there is a low level but noticable amount of hiss that after coming from the black backgrounds of HeadAmp products is a bit disconcerting.

 Luckily any channel imbalance in the volume pot is at a very low range and even with only being able to turn the volume up to 8 or 9 o'clock I still seem to be able to have enough control in that range for it to not be a concern with the Triple.Fi's. Also, the hiss level with the Triple.Fi's is low enough that I don't think it would be intrusive even with soft passages in the music. Where my concern lies is how these things might factor in with future IEM purchases. That I intend for the DACmini to serve double duty with both IEM's and LCD-2's now and possibly closer to full-time with IEM's in the future has had me debating whether the DACmini stays or goes.

*A few suggestions*

 The DACmini seems like a well thought out design with options available to help tailor it's usage to the owners needs. It's also backed by a company that in my experience has bent over backwards to be helpful and take user feedback into consideration. So with that in mind I'll throw out a few suggestions.

 While I like the almost shiny silver finish (is it sandblasted as opposed to brushed?) I would have liked to have had the option for a black one. While on the subject of finishes, I like the DACmini engraving on the top panel but the font usage doesn't seem consistent with what I've seen elswehere. DAC is using a thinner font, I assume the same as the word mini, but on the front panel and in other literature DAC uses a bolder font which IMO looks much nicer.

 I've wondered whether the implentation of a gain switch might be of benefit for those who are using more sensitive IEM's and while on the same track, the addition of a second 1/8" input would be really cool as well.

 And last, I haven't put the feet on yet, the DACmini is sitting on the foam from it's packaging, I'd love to see a better implementation for them, maybe something that screws on using the same screw holes as the base?

*Final Thoughts*

 There's still some time left before the 30 day money back guaratee expires so I'll probably do some further testing and do some comparisons with the Pico DAC and such but I think the DACmini's overall performance and synergy thus far with the LCD-2's, and with the Triple.Fi's for that matter, will outweigh the concerns I have with hiss and usable volume with other potential IEM purchases down the road.

 In conclusion, while I haven't had as much time as I would have liked over the past couple of weeks to really put the DACmini through it's paces it has given a good account of itself nonetheless. I started out looking for an entry level amp to drive the LCD-2's but ended up not only with a new amp but a DAC as well. The purchase was meant as an interim purchase, one that I would eventually upgrade around but I feel as far as the pairing with the LCD-2's is concerned I could happily live with the DACmini for the long term. Of course I'm sure as finances allow I would get curious but until then I wouldn't feel I'm missing anything.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Nice review elnero.  As for the feet - they did it with sticky feet so that the feet could be installed for standing it on the side, without mounting holes showining.


----------



## K3cT

Awesome read elnero! Just to clarify, is your configuration stock or did you opt for the lower impedance output?


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Nice review elnero.  As for the feet - they did it with sticky feet so that the feet could be installed for standing it on the side, without mounting holes showining.


 
   
  I was thinking more along the lines of a solution that would utilize the existing screw holes for the bottom plate, when not used the DACmini would look no different than it does now. There might not be enough room between the screw holes and the edges though, and of course this would mean the user would have to remove the screws for the bottom plate to install the feet which CEntrance might not want. My concern lies mainly with my plan of transporting between home and work, I could see stick on feet getting lost pretty quickly.


  Quote: 





k3ct said:


> Awesome read elnero! Just to clarify, is your configuration stock or did you opt for the lower impedance output?


 

 I have the 1 ohm output impedance.


----------



## Audiowood

Thank you so much Pekingduck, I really appreciate your time in doing the comparison. I am getting ready the cash as we speak..
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> I just did a very quick comparison with different genres: rock, piano solo and orchestral music etc.
> 
> I had the coaxial and line outputs of the Solo fed into the DACmini simultaneously, and used the input selector to quickly switch between the two. I had a hard time telling the difference. They're very very close in tonality, so close that any sonic differences could be attributed to small difference in volume. In short, I don't have a conclusion for now
> 
> ...


----------



## Anouk

Hi Guys, I bought an rca to xlr cable set rom blue jeans audio on sudnay and it is already on its way to me so I should be all set when the dacmini arrives. Any idea of what the general time till delivery is? I know the delivery itself wont take too long because they will be sending it by fedex. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

Mine took 2 days from the US to Hong Kong. Enjoy your mini


----------



## Anouk

Hmmm I ordered mine a week ago but didnt get a shipping notification yet. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Townyj

I think he means shipping took 2 days. Mine took 3 1/2 weeks to build and then 6 days for shipping.

  
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hmmm I ordered mine a week ago but didnt get a shipping notification yet. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

^^ That's what I meant. Mine also took that long from order to ship but it was out of stock at that time. I think they are in stock now but if you requested any custom mods it might take longer.


----------



## Equus

Well, my DACmini is here. Hooked up via digital coax right now to my comp.  Unfortunately, probably not much time to listen to them tonight since I have my normal Tuesday night plans.  Out of the box, however, sounds pretty promising.  Especially for its price.  With the LCD-2 it's nice and clear, good treble without excessive grain, good bass presence, and nice weight through the mids.  Some nice space and imaging.  It sounds a smidge muddy in some vocals, but that's at first blush without any break-in, trying different inputs, or time to get accustomed to the sound and is really really minor (and in comparison to my Assemblage->Stacker).  I'll definitely follow up after I get some time with it.


----------



## pekingduck

I too would like to have a gain swtich! The default gain of 8 is still a bit too much for IEMs, IMO.
  
  Quote: 





elnero said:


> *A few suggestions*
> 
> While I like the almost shiny silver finish (is it sandblasted as opposed to brushed?) I would have liked to have had the option for a black one. While on the subject of finishes, I like the DACmini engraving on the top panel but the font usage doesn't seem consistent with what I've seen elswehere. DAC is using a thinner font, I assume the same as the word mini, but on the front panel and in other literature DAC uses a bolder font which IMO looks much nicer.
> 
> ...


----------



## RedBull

Quote: 





avu said:


> Does anyone know the D/A chip in this?  Or how it compares to the recent spate of Sabre D/As like the Peachtree Decco2,  EE Minimax, Wyred4Sound D1, or even something older like the Benchmark DAC1?


 
   

 Anyone? (vs W4S DAC-2)
  I'm not expecting which one sounds 'better' but more towards how the 'color' difference between the two.


----------



## ert

I received my Dacmini w/ variable out last week and have been enjoying it immensely! The sound quality is really good.  It clearly sounds on par with my Headroom Ultra Desktop/DAC and the Benchmark Dac1Pre.  I wont go into vague descriptions of sound quality other than to just say that it compares favorably with the other two amp/dacs in SQ.  I've been using ER4, RS1s and Dynaudio BM5A with the mini.  This single unit replaces a Headrom ultra micro stack and GoldPoint passive preamp triplet on my desk at work. 
   
  Pros:

 Excellent SQ via phones and variable out
 Small footprint
 24/96 over USB
 Works with Foobar/ASIO4ALL seamlessly
 HP jack is very solid
 Volume knob and input selection knob fluid yet sturdy
 Runs cool
 UL-listed power supply 
   
  Cons:

 [Note: I have not contacted CEntrance prior to this review regarding the condition of the case...I should have done that to be fair]
 The case finish leaves a lot to be desired.  Although it mimics the Mac Mini finish, the quality is not the same.  The unit I received has small scratches and nicks in the top of the case, and a few nice gouges from what looks like prying instruments.  Furthermore, the case top/bottom and front/back really don't fit together that well resulting in uneven gaps all around.  Quite frankly it looks like a Chinese dac/amp you'd get off ebay for < $200. I wanted to open the case to take a look, but one of the hex screws is completely stripped.
 No gain switch.  I can barely get past 10 o'clock with both the phones and variable out to my monitors.
   
  Suggestions to Centrance:

 Case quality control needs improvement
 Add a gain switch or internal jumpers for headphone out gain
 Add a gain switch or internal jumpers for line out
 Add a switch or internal jumper to toggle fixed/variable out
 ADD XLR out as an option
   
  Some pics:


----------



## Jay Listens

Hey Ert,
   
  We are really sorry you are not happy with the condition of the case. Under no circumstances should you have received a unit with scratches. Please PM me directly so we can get you a unit without the scratches. If you are still not happy we do offer a 30-day money back guarantee on ALL products (no restocking fee).
   
  Please let me know how I can help.
   
  -Jonathan


----------



## Equus

Nice pics ert.  I don't think I have a single hard surface in my house as clear as your computer desk there.  LOL


----------



## ert

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Hey Ert,
> 
> We are really sorry you are not happy with the condition of the case. Under no circumstances should you have received a unit with scratches. Please PM me directly so we can get you a unit without the scratches. If you are still not happy we do offer a 30-day money back guarantee on ALL products (no restocking fee).
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks, I may take you up that.  I have noted in my review post that I should have contacted you guys first before complaining about it!
   
  eric


----------



## goofyvic

Mine has just been shipped. Now I'm kind of worried about the quality of finish as I have read similar issues.


----------



## ptrok

goofyvic said:


> Mine has just been shipped. Now I'm kind of worried about the quality of finish as I have read similar issues.




IMHO I think your worries are unfounded. Jason and Michael are good people and if it did come blemished they would take care of it. Also, When I received mine it was in pristine condition even though it traveled half way across the world to South Korea. With these boards you hear the complaints and they seem to be the predominant voice but most people who receive it don't feel the need to tell you theirs came in mint condition so it seems like these incidents are more common than they really are. Have faith and in the rare occurrence that you get something less than expected get in contact with Jason and Mike. Until then, prepare yourself. I got mine to go with my LCD-2's and I love the pairing. It leaves nothing to be desired for me.


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





ptrok said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 x2.  I just received mine, and there are no scratches, dings, smudges, or any other cosmetic issues.  If there were, given the level of communication that the vendor has already shown willing to go to, I'm sure any issues would be taken care of promptly.  Don't go raising your blood pressure and stress over something that may not ever happen, and even if it did, would probably be corrected.


----------



## Jay Listens

Quote: 





equus said:


> even if it did, would DEFINITELY be corrected.


 


  Fixed for fact correction. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Sorry if anyone has received a blemished unit. If you have please PM me and we will get it resolved immediately.
   
  -Jonathan (aka Jason)


----------



## ptrok

jay listens said:


> Fixed for fact correction.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Sorry Jonathan...I'm just a bone head.:blink:


----------



## MorbidToaster

So, I've heard this pairs well with the LCD-2. I'd love to hear some first hand accounts. I've got the (slightly) harder to drive HE 500 on the way and I don't know if my beloved Decco2 will be able to handle it.
   
  Think it'll be a good match for the HE 500? Heck, anyone use it with the D7000? I'd love to have a small (but powerful) set up for home use and a seperate reciever for powering speakers.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





morbidtoaster said:


> So, I've heard this pairs well with the LCD-2. I'd love to hear some first hand accounts...


 
   
  Read through this thread, there's already quite a few impressions with the LCD-2's from various users myself included.


----------



## goofyvic

Quote: 





ptrok said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

      Quote:


equus said:


> x2.  I just received mine, and there are no scratches, dings, smudges, or any other cosmetic issues.  If there were, given the level of communication that the vendor has already shown willing to go to, I'm sure any issues would be taken care of promptly.  Don't go raising your blood pressure and stress over something that may not ever happen, and even if it did, would probably be corrected.


 
   
  Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Fixed for fact correction.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 Thanks everyone for the reassurance. Can't wait to pair it with the Squeezebox and LCD2 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Cheers!


----------



## Equus

Can't help you on those cans except for the LCD-2.  So far so good on my side.  It's a lot of fun to listen to.


----------



## Townyj

Im confused why you would wanna pair it with the Squeezebox... Pretty sure they both share an AKM DAC chip. Not saying they would sound the same, but the DACmini sounds damn fine as a single unit imo.

  
  Quote: 





goofyvic said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## goofyvic

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Im confused why you would wanna pair it with the Squeezebox... Pretty sure they both share an AKM DAC chip. Not saying they would sound the same, but the DACmini sounds damn fine as a single unit imo.


 

 Quote:


jay listens said:


> When asked about the chips we use in our products, our answer is simple: CEntrance only uses the finest components in its products, to guarantee highest audio quality, professional reliability and longevity of your investment. CEntrance is the official design firm for many IC vendors, so naturally we have early access to the best chips.
> 
> But the *chip is only half the answer - correct implementation is the other half*. If someone tries to use a great chip and gets frustrated, they post on the Internet that the chip is bad and other people read that as true. We prefer to have our customers listen to our products and make their decision on the sound quality, not on what they read about chips on the Internet.
> 
> Long story short we prefer people judge our products on the "sum of the parts" not one chip in isolation. As this is not the best way to determine the true SQ of a product. That said feel free to ask any questions you may have about any of our designs.


 

 Well, they both may be using AKM chip but like what Jonathan mentioned, implementation plays an important part. Moreover they may be using different chip.


----------



## edvardd

How is the DAC section without the headamp? Compared to other DACs in the 300-1000 $ price range


----------



## ert

Quote: 





edvardd said:


> How is the DAC section without the headamp? Compared to other DACs in the 300-100 $ price range


 

 Like fried butter.  It compares to the DAC in my Benchmark DAC1Pre.  Yes, that good.

  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> Im confused why you would wanna pair it with the Squeezebox... Pretty sure they both share an AKM DAC chip. Not saying they would sound the same, but the DACmini sounds damn fine as a single unit imo.


 

 SB has digital out...so it seems like a nice player/dac combo.


----------



## WilCox

S/PDIF out from Squeezebox into DACmini gives exceptional performance.  The DAC in the Squeezebox (be it V3 or Touch) is very good for the price, but the DACmini is a big step up in SQ.
  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> Im confused why you would wanna pair it with the Squeezebox... Pretty sure they both share an AKM DAC chip. Not saying they would sound the same, but the DACmini sounds damn fine as a single unit imo.


----------



## Townyj

Erm hence the reason i said they wont sound the same..?? Your just repeating back to me what i already know  I just wanna know why you would want 2 dac's for the one combo...

  
  Quote: 





goofyvic said:


> Quote:
> 
> Well, they both may be using AKM chip but like what Jonathan mentioned, implementation plays an important part. Moreover they may be using different chip.


 

  
   
  I figured this may be the case seeing as the SB is more focused at Multimedia and not Audiophile quality etc. But i didnt want to jump to conclusions and post anything seeing as i have never heard the SB.
  
  Quote: 





wilcox said:


> S/PDIF out from Squeezebox into DACmini gives exceptional performance.  The DAC in the Squeezebox (be it V3 or Touch) is very good for the price, but the DACmini is a big step up in SQ.


----------



## goofyvic

Thanks WilCox, that's my exact intention


----------



## ert

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Erm hence the reason i said they wont sound the same..?? Your just repeating back to me what i already know  I just wanna know why you would want 2 dac's for the one combo...
> 
> 
> I figured this may be the case seeing as the SB is more focused at Multimedia and not Audiophile quality etc. But i didnt want to jump to conclusions and post anything seeing as i have never heard the SB.


 
   
  The value of the SB is entirely as a file transport device...the DAC implementation is probably rather mediocre.  I use it exclusively as a file transport with a Benchmark DAC1Pre in my primary system.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I posted this on the 'Audeze LCD2 Orthos' thread.  I cross-posted, here, for those of you who are interested in the Dacmini but not the LCD2.
  

 I have been wanting a case for safely transporting my Audeze LCD2 and CEntrance Dacmini head gear.  I chose the Pelican 1500 from Amazon for $105 and free shipping with Amazon Prime Membership (which saves me a bundle throughout the year).  

  

 Pelican 1500 Dimensions (Length x Width x Depth in inches):

  

 Exterior = 18.5 x 14.1 x 6.9 (from web site)

 Interior  = 17 x 11.5 x 5.75 (I measured wall to wall and floor to lid, through the foam)

 Usable Interior  = 14.75 x 9.5 x 4.5 (I measured wall to wall excluding the 1" foam buffering on 4 sides and from floor to lid excluding the 1" floor foam but including the corrugated foam in the lid)  

  

 I placed each component on the Pelican 1500, 3.5 inch thick "pick and pluck" foam block to determine the most efficient compartment layout.  I wanted at least 1" of foam block separating each component from the others.  I used toothpicks to mark the perimeter of each compartment. All 3 compartments were excavated all the way through the main foam block.  That part is easy because all you have to do is carefully separate the layers all the way around the perimeter of each compartment, then push it out in one piece.  

  

 Leave the 1" floor foam cushion and the 1" corrugated lid foam cushion untouched.

  

 Partial excavation around the headband was tedious and the result uneven, though functional.  I trimmed it a bit with a razor blade.  I will use the recommended glue to re-attach sections of the "pick and pluck" cells that were accidentally separated when making the compartments.

  

 The LCD2's wide-side ear cushions rest on the 1" floor foam and the driver housings protrude 1" above the main foam block.  This is not a problem, though, because closing the lid only slightly compresses the LCD2 thanks to the corrugated lid foam.   

  

 Here's what I am able to carry in this case:

  

 1. Audeze LCD2.

  

 2. Audeze cable - Dacmini compartment above power cord and beneath Dacmini, each separated by a 1/2" layer of foam.

  

 3. Centrance Dacmini - sits on top of power cord and headphone cable, each separated by a 1/2" layer of foam.

  

 4. Dacmini power supply - front left.

  

 5. Dacmini power cord - Dacmini compartment resting on Pelican foam floor with 1/2" layer of foam on top to separate it from the headphone cable, above it..

  

 6. Centrance Dacmini USB cable - front left, on top of power supply.

  

  

 Edit:  This is important for determining the size case you need to accomodate your gear. The Usable interior dimensions measurement description, above, is not clear.  Here's how I measured: The Usable Length and Width dimensions were measured from Inside the 1 inch foam border on one side to the Inside 1 inch foam border on the other side.  The Usable Depth dimension was measured from Inside the lower chamber from the floor with the 1 inch foam in place and uncompressed by the ruler to the top edge of the lower case chamber + the depth of the lid with the corrugated foam Removed.  I measured the usable depth this way because the corrugated foam is very forgiving and really does not use/compress the 1 inch lid foam when the lid is closed.

  

 Pelican cases are available in many sizes.  Remember to account for the unusable area (1 inch foam perimeter on all sides and bottom of the case; and for greater leeway/protection, consider the lid depth with corrugated foam in place as unusable space) when ordering your case.

  

 High resolution photos substituted for iPhone photos originally uploaded.

   

   



  HeadCase - Ready for loading

   

   



  HeadCase - Exploded

   

   



  HeadCase Reloading - Power Cord, Power Supply, and Audeze LCD2

   

   



  HeadCase Reloading - USB on top of Power Supply. Power Cord beneath green foam and Headphone Cable

   

   



  HeadCase  Reloading - Foam over headphone cable.

   

   

   



  HeadCase - Fully Loaded.

   

   





  HeadCase Locked and Loaded - CD on top for size reference.


----------



## edvardd

bluemonkeyer! Thats awesome! I'm getting my LCD2s soon and it's really inspiring. With something like DACmini you can really take it with you. I would make a computer case combined personally, since I have a 10" computer that would fit well with DACmini.


----------



## MorbidToaster

Pelican cases have TONS of different size options. If you could get one that's a little bit deeper you could fit the Netbook under or on top with a foam buffer between everything.'
   
  EDIT: Yeah, this is amazing. I was thinking about doing this as well with my new HE 500. Laptop, Headphones, (possibly) DACmini. 
  Quote: 





edvardd said:


> bluemonkeyer! Thats awesome! I'm getting my LCD2s soon and it's really inspiring. With something like DACmini you can really take it with you. I would make a computer case combined personally, since I have a 10" computer that would fit well with DACmini.


----------



## Townyj

Ahhh cheers  I havent had much to do with the Squeezebox items, i know you could do this sort of thing but it swept directly over my head.

  
  Quote: 





ert said:


> The value of the SB is entirely as a file transport device...the DAC implementation is probably rather mediocre.  I use it exclusively as a file transport with a Benchmark DAC1Pre in my primary system.


----------



## RedBull

Anyone can share sound impression (DAC alone) against any Audio-Gd DAC, like NFB-2 or something like that?  Thanks a lot.


----------



## Townyj

I used to own the DAC19MK3 and from what i remember i do prefer the sound of the DACmini by a fair bit... Not the best info but you wouldnt be disappointed by the mini imo. Both sound totally different though, the DAC19 is musical and warmish. Where as the Mini just seems to extend further overall. Has an added warmth that makes it very enjoyable to listen to.

  
  Quote: 





redbull said:


> Anyone can share sound impression (DAC alone) against any Audio-Gd DAC, like NFB-2 or something like that?  Thanks a lot.


----------



## RedBull

Thanks Townyj, how would  you say about vocal reproduction, bass detail? which one do you prefer?


----------



## Townyj

Ahhh! Well the DAC19 is rather magical for vocals, I really enjoyed alot of slower Blues, Rock, some Electronic was good aswell. The bass is deep and impactful, but not as detailed as the DACmini. The DACmini is hard to beat as an overall unit and just does things better in certain area's.


----------



## Anouk

Hi, If everything goes right with fedex delivery mine should be here today which makes it two weeks since the day I ordered, not too bad. My rca to xlr cables from blue jean are already here so I am pretty excited to see how it will work with my rig. Has anyone tried this dac with optical vs usb inputs from a laptop and is there a lot of idfference? My two laptops only have usb input but I might in the future consider getting a hiface interface. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Townyj

The usb implmentation of the DACmini is darn good, i honestly doubt you would notice much difference between them both. But thats upto you to decide with your ears in the end. 

  
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi, If everything goes right with fedex delivery mine should be here today which makes it two weeks since the day I ordered, not too bad. My rca to xlr cables from blue jean are already here so I am pretty excited to see how it will work with my rig. Has anyone tried this dac with optical vs usb inputs from a laptop and is there a lot of idfference? My two laptops only have usb input but I might in the future consider getting a hiface interface. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

Yesterday I did a little comparison between the following setups:
   
  iPod Classic > Algorhythm Solo > coaxial > Dacmini
   
  iPad > Camera Connection Kit > USB > Dacmini
   
  The same music (in lossless) was played. I couldn't notice much difference..
   
  Like you said, CEntrance's adaptive USB must be pretty good (or I just have tin ear )

  
  Quote: 





townyj said:


> The usb implmentation of the DACmini is darn good, i honestly doubt you would notice much difference between them both. But thats upto you to decide with your ears in the end.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





anouk said:


> Has anyone tried this dac with optical vs usb inputs from a laptop and is there a lot of idfference?


 

 I did a very brief comparison on my laptop and can't say anything stood out as glaringly different between the two, that might change if I do more extensive back and forth between the two but my initial impression of the USB implementation was quite favorable.


----------



## Anouk

Hi, Well its here, going to unpack it in a moment. I forgot if voltage setting is automatic, i have 220v here. I have to check if i still have a loose power cord lying around and I think it uses the printer like usb cable which I hope I still have a spare off. I would like to know about the voltage though because I dont want to blow anything. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

The voltage is automatic so no worries there. There should be a USB cable included.
   
  I am curious how the DACmini works with the ES5 so please share your impressions. Thanks


----------



## Anouk

Hello again,
 I just unpacked the unit and am pleasantly surprised by how small and light it is.
 I connected the power (found an old printer cable) usb and spdiff but i did not yet put the power on. I found the volume knob on the front and the headphone jack.
 As most of you might or might not know I am blind though os if someone oculd explain the control to the left of the volume control then that would be nice. I suppose it is a sport of input switch of some kind? Is there an on/off button or will it go on automatically after I give it power?
 I also have not yet located the rca jacks.
 i do presume they are to the right of the optical jack but there are four connectors there.
 Thanks in advance for any help!
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## pekingduck

Assuming you are facing the back panel:
   
  The control to the left of the volume knob is the input selector. There are four positions (from right to left): line in, optical, coaxial and USB.
  If you turn the input selector beyond the USB, the DACmini will go into stand-by mode. There's no on/off switch.
   
  Regarding the back panel, the rightmost pair of RCA jacks is output. The next pair is line input.
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hello again,
> I just unpacked the unit and am pleasantly surprised by how small and light it is.
> I connected the power (found an old printer cable) usb and spdiff but i did not yet put the power on. I found the volume knob on the front and the headphone jack.
> As most of you might or might not know I am blind though os if someone oculd explain the control to the left of the volume control then that would be nice. I suppose it is a sport of input switch of some kind? Is there an on/off button or will it go on automatically after I give it power?
> ...


----------



## Anouk

Thanks a lot for that info! I guess rca and headphone output are always active at the seem time? Will the unit give a pop if you put it into standby mode? I guess I will just have to practice a bit with the input selector, i had the seem with my last dac, a dacmagic by cambridgeaudio. It too had a digital input selector, i got used to it quickly. Thanks again for the help, Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi, I just tried the dacmini very briefly with the es5 to see if I got the usb channel. I must say that at first there is no volume and hten when it is there it is immediately fairly loud. Not really loud but it does not start as really soft as with normal volume. Also there seems to be a bit of channel imbalance at low volumes with first the right channel coming in and then, when you turn it up louder, the left channel. This was only a really brief test though because I hadnt gotten my speakers working yet and i wanted to check if the source was set right. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## RedBull

Quote:


townyj said:


> Ahhh! Well the DAC19 is rather magical for vocals, I really enjoyed alot of slower Blues, Rock, some Electronic was good aswell. The bass is deep and impactful, but not as detailed as the DACmini. The DACmini is hard to beat as an overall unit and just does things better in certain area's.


 


 Yeah, I tried Zero, yes, just the "Audio-Gd Zero" and I'm very impressed with the vocal, but the bass is 'rather' dissapointing, a bit too polite and 'lite', I know some will say DAC-19 and Zero is day-and-night difference, but I guess the implementation 'phylosophy' of implementation is similiar.  I tried Phoenix as well, they carry the same 'signature' and style.
   
  How would you say the vocal sound like?  Can I say, Audio-Gd smoother and 'better' on vocal while DACmini does everything else better?
   
  I was very interested for W4S DAC-2, but when I read it can be a little rough on the edge and can be sibilance, I totally refuse it.  I'm very sensitive to rough treble or vocal.


----------



## pekingduck

The RCA output is deactivated when your headphones are plugged in.
   
  You should hear a click sound whenever you turn the input selector.
   
  Hope this helps.
   
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Thanks a lot for that info! I guess rca and headphone output are always active at the seem time? Will the unit give a pop if you put it into standby mode? I guess I will just have to practice a bit with the input selector, i had the seem with my last dac, a dacmagic by cambridgeaudio. It too had a digital input selector, i got used to it quickly. Thanks again for the help, Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Well everything has been connected and is working now. I have to try and turn up the volume of my tv receiver but the pc volume is fine and I dont think the rca to xlr cables have a big negative performance impact. I will have to try the es5 later this evening to see how it works with some music and audio meterials. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## MorbidToaster

Is it really? I'm super disappointed by this...I wonder if I could ask them to disable it if I order.
   
  EDIT: Unless it's a power issue...but still.
  
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> The RCA output is deactivated when your headphones are plugged in.
> 
> You should hear a click sound whenever you turn the input selector.
> 
> Hope this helps.


----------



## Anouk

Hi, I have installed the universal driver from centrance the asio driver. I wonder if I can now use it with foobar/ I can only select the centrance dac but not sure if the driver is now being used. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi Morbid,
   
  We could disable this if you needed it, but in what case do you need both the headphone out and the line out simultaneously?
   
  Jay
   
  -------------------------------------
   
  Anouk,
   
  Make sure the audio application is set to ASIO. Let me know if you have more questions.
   
  Regards,
  Jay


----------



## MorbidToaster

I've used it a little with my Decco2 already. I have my D7000 and my HE 500, and my finacee and I listen together quite often (with different cans before, considering I just got the HE 500). 
   
  Use the DAC and amp for one pair, and the Line Out to another amp. Giving us both control over the power they get. 
   
  It's a little impractical, but it's really great when we listen together. Sure we could use speakers, but that's no fun!
   
  Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Hi Morbid,
> 
> We could disable this if you needed it, but in what case do you need both the headphone out and the line out simultaneously?


----------



## Anouk

Hi again, Not sure yet how to set foobar correctly to work with the asio driver but even without that it sounds nice. Still even its lowest audible volume level without imbalance is SLIGHTLY louder then my normal listening level. I must stress thought hat I am used to listening at rather low volume settings. I have only tried it with audio recordings yet though and have to see how it sounds with music and if the level is comfortable. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Townyj

Anouk, The DACmini does work with IEM's but its not really designed for them. I use my RE-262's and have the volume around 8-9 oclock. They are 150ohm. If you wanted more control you should of had the gain dropped to suit IEM's or gone for the DACport instead.
   
  The channel imbalance is very very low and of course your going to notice it more with IEM's. If you Mainly plan on using it with IEM's, send it back and get the gain dropped/tuned for IEM's. What operating system are you using..?? Win 7, Vista or XP..?? You shouldnt need ASIO for Vista/Win 7 at all. Discard it and just run with the Auto installed CEntrance drivers which you can select from the Sound Options.

  
  Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi again, Not sure yet how to set foobar correctly to work with the asio driver but even without that it sounds nice. Still even its lowest audible volume level without imbalance is SLIGHTLY louder then my normal listening level. I must stress thought hat I am used to listening at rather low volume settings. I have only tried it with audio recordings yet though and have to see how it sounds with music and if the level is comfortable. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi, Well if I had known BEFOREHAND that it would not work ideal with iems I would have let them lower the gain by 2 or 4 db. I use windows xp with the latest service pack. I guess the es5 is just really efficient end sensitive although there is no hiss from the dacmini. I notice that the dac gets reset when I restart my computer even if I listen to another input which I then have to reselect. It works well with my preamp and speakers though. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi, Well the dacmini sounds VERY pleasing, musical and natural with a very black background. I just hope a future version will introduce a gain switch for different headphones sensitivity and impedance/volume matching. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi, I just tried the dacmini very briefly with the es5 to see if I got the usb channel. I must say that at first there is no volume and hten when it is there it is immediately fairly loud. Not really loud but it does not start as really soft as with normal volume. Also there seems to be a bit of channel imbalance at low volumes with first the right channel coming in and then, when you turn it up louder, the left channel. This was only a really brief test though because I hadnt gotten my speakers working yet and i wanted to check if the source was set right. Greetings, Anouk,


 

 I'm listening very quietly to my DACmini via USB with ES5 and the volume knob is turned to about 8 o'clock, with zero volume at 7.  At this point I have no imbalance, and at this setting it's playing a little quieter than I usually listen.  Below that I can get a channel imbalance that "comes and goes" as I drop to extremely low volumes.  That means that as I go down in volume below that one channel may get quieter, but as I keep going down the volume balances out again; and as I continue to approach zero the other channel might start to fade.  So, at extremely low volumes there are a few places on the volume knob where I get balanced sound, and a few where it is not balanced.  
   
  As I turn it up, 9 o'clock is about as loud as I can listen comfortably.  This is why I am happy with the stock gain of 8 and didn't have it modded for a gain of 10 like some other people.
   
  Also, I have the headphone jack to the left of the volume knob, and the switcher to the right of the volume knob (when the unit is set up properly).  Each time the switcher knob is turned 90 degree toone side or the other it rotates through the inputs.  When it is off and I turn it on with a clockwise turn of the switcher, I get analog input, then with each twist of the knob it goes to optical, then coax, then USB, and then it will shut off.  You can also move through the inputs with a turn to the left.
   
  You can use a Westone volume attenuator to tame the volume just a little bit if you need to listen quieter than this, without hurting the sound quality until you rotate the Westone attenuator's volume more than about 4-5mm.


----------



## Anouk

Hi, I guess I just listen at very low volume levels then. Well I will try it for a bit longer, I mostly use it with my speakers anyway and have no wish to loose it for 3 weeks again in transit. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi, I guess I just listen at very low volume levels then. Well I will try it for a bit longer, I mostly use it with my speakers anyway and have no wish to loose it for 3 weeks again in transit. Greetings, Anouk,


 

 Definitely try the Westone volume attenuator.  Or, since you listen so quietly you likely wont be able to hear any loss in bit-rate by using the computer's software volume control in your music player, especially if you are only dropping the volume by about 2-3 dB to listen as quietly as you can.


----------



## ert

Quote: 





anouk said:


> Hi again, Not sure yet how to set foobar correctly to work with the asio driver but even without that it sounds nice. Still even its lowest audible volume level without imbalance is SLIGHTLY louder then my normal listening level. I must stress thought hat I am used to listening at rather low volume settings. I have only tried it with audio recordings yet though and have to see how it sounds with music and if the level is comfortable. Greetings, Anouk,


 
   
  If you have the ASIO4ALL plugin for Foobar installed correctly, the ASIO icon will appear in the task bar when you play a track.  Additionally, the Windows mixer control will be disabled and not affect the sound.  It's interesting that the DACmini by default doesn't bypass the mixer on Windows 7, and my Benchmark DAC1 does...even though both USB implementations were done by CEntrance.


----------



## Anouk

Hi, Ah I forgot about having to download the asio4all driver. I think the dacmini bypasses the volume controls in control panel though with my windows xp system. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi again, I just installed the foobar asio support plugin and then I could choose the centrance asio driver so I dont think I need the asio4all plugin or this to work. Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Anouk

Hi, ok it doesnt work yet after all. I get an irrecoverable playback error in foobar with the message ASIO none of the input channels are assigned to device channels. There is an output page for virtual devices and I can edit the centrance virtual device but there I do indeed see two channels in a combo box but cant really do anything with them. Can anyone point me to or give me instructions on how to set this up properly? Thanks, Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## ert

Anouk,
   
  I got the same error message the first time I tried as well, although I was using ASIO4All and not the CEntrance ASIO driver.  In Foobar under Playback->Output->ASIO Virtual Devices I deleted the default entry and added a new one and configured it to use the DACmini and then it worked ok.  I'll try to get some screen caps when I'm back in the office.


----------



## RedBull

Hi Jay and all,
   
  Could you tell me how much output (mW) it churn out to 50, 300 and 600 respectively.  I saw it on the website "_1.5W (total), drives 32...600 Ohm headphones_", but I don't understand as it is quite general.
   
  And for the line out, what's the voltage out?  I'm not quite understand "_+6.0dBV (RCA outputs)_", also the output impedance for the RCA out.
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## redwarrior191

^^^^^
  i'm also interested to know that..maybe someone from ceentrance can inform us??


----------



## Anouk

Hi,
 Since this morning I am experiencing some problems with m dacmini. Everything worked fine until my toshiba tecra broke down. I had to unplug the usb and the dac didnt work anymore so I put it in the wall socket instead of a shared power output. It worked again but it gave a humming and crackling sound throughout my speakers. I had not heard this before while the unit had its shared power connecter on a power slitter or extension cord however you call it. I then also gave my preamp a wall output but the hum remains. I tried my other laptop because before when the dac was plugged into usb there was no hum but the hum is still remaining. It gets louder when i turn up the volume of my preamp. I do not hear the hum through headphones but the dac is mainly meant to use with speakers.
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## Jay Listens

@Redbull. I am looking into your technical questions and will have answers shortly.
   
  @Anouk Please contact me via PM or email so we can get your technical problem resolved
   
  Jay


----------



## goofyvic

Received my DACmini couple of days ago 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Opened up, condition is excellent, no scratch or blemish whatsoever. Got USB cable and power adapter but no power cord. The power cord is not an issue with me because the cord probably can't be use in my region and I'll be powering it with Energizer powerpack anyway. I need to comment on the aluminium casing though. The finish looks kind of "lower" grade than anodized ones. I think some of the chinese made amps have better finish. If it's going to match the Mac mini, I think the finish is not up to scratch. Asthetics aside, build is excellent.
   
  Listening "fresh" from the box with line out from Squeezebox Touch, the first word that came to my mind was "TRANSPARENCY". Excellent clarity and very detailed, more so compared to the Solo SRG II. SRG II has more body and tonally richer in the mids whereas DACmini sounds leaner. However with the transparency and clarity, I'll choose the DACmini over the SRG II and this is even before burn-in.
   
  Using coaxial digital out from SB Touch to DACmini brought more body to mids. The DAC in the CEntrance is clearly more superior. Imaging, focus and soundstaging are so much better. There is a very slight problem though, whether it's through the S/PDIF coaxial in or the line in, the vocals seems to be slightly off center to the left whereas my previous experience with my other amps have the vocals at the center. Not sure is it because of slight channel imbalance. Need to burn in some more and try other source.
   
  I'm listening using the Audeze LCD2 and finally understand why there are a number of Audeze LCD2 owners using DACmini. It brought the LCD2 to a new level and brought me to a new realm of enjoyment.


----------



## MorbidToaster

It matches the old Mac Mini which had a finish much like the DACmini from what I can see in pictures. It's not made to match the 2010 Mini from what I can tell.
  
  Quote: 





goofyvic said:


> Received my DACmini couple of days ago
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## aleman

Have a dacmini, bought it last month, liked it a lot with usb, so tried to go to coax to see how it sounds with 24/192 hdtracks downloads, using windows 7 and ubuntu linux 10.04 LTS. Sound quality was a step up from usb when using coax for 16/44 and 16/48, 24/96 sounded 'cleaner', 'smoother' more enjoyable with spdif.
   
  When using 24/192 get a perodic 'click' around every 4 seconds which is very annyoying, it seem to be present only when playing music and drops off when music is stopped or the track ends. I am using a dell inspiron 1720 with their spdif coax out adaptor [and dual boot windows 7/ubuntu linux] and is present under both oses so not sure if it is a laptop issue or a dacmini issue, have disabled the mixer and set windows 7 audio playback properties to enable all avaliable sampling rates, under ubalong with ubuntu tried both alsa and pulseaudio plugins along with ubuntu studio pro audio mastering tools.
   
  Overall I am very pleased with its sound signature and smoothness, I can listen for the whole day without fatigue which is amazing because everthing else would hurt my ears after about an hour, this is the first product [other than vinyl] that I can use without ANY listening fatigue.
   
  I dealt with michael goodman at centrance he was a pleasure to deal with and took care of my one day shipping request and everything was perfect when it arrived.
   
   
  I will be a happy camper if this little annoyance with 24/192 can be addressed [maybe its my laptop] but perhaps somebody else could check their 24/192 playback ?


----------



## goofyvic

There's now black anodized mod version! Drool....
   

   
  Darn, Why isn't it released earlier. NICE!


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Yep, got mine 6 weeks ago and love it with LCD2.  Had I known a black one was coming out, I'd have waited.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> Yep, got mine 6 weeks ago and love it with LCD2.  Had I known a black one was coming out, I'd have waited.


 

 Me to, I think I got mine closer to 4 weeks ago and I had actually inquired about black before I ordered.


----------



## goofyvic

Well I ordered mine on 8th May and the option wasn't there yet. Would have chosen it too. The option probably started just last week. I guess good things come to those who wait.


----------



## Townyj

Dammit! I cant afford to send mine back for that option.. Had id have known i would of waited aswell!


----------



## gopack87

Guys, I believe it's their new version of the Mini called the Dacmini PX.  According to their blog, it will have a Class D speaker amp built in.  http://centrance.com/blog/2011/05/08/tokyo-headphone-fest/


----------



## pekingduck

I prefer the black one too and if it were available back then I surely would have chosen that!! However, I took advantage of the free shipping offered back in April so I don't regret at all


----------



## Townyj

This is old news dude... 

  
  Quote: 





gopack87 said:


> Guys, I believe it's their new version of the Mini called the Dacmini PX.  According to their blog, it will have a Class D speaker amp built in.  http://centrance.com/blog/2011/05/08/tokyo-headphone-fest/


 

  
   Ahhh yes i got the free shipping aswell! I forgot about that! Saved a fair amount 
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> I prefer the black one too and if it were available back then I surely would have chosen that!! However, I took advantage of the free shipping offered back in April so I don't regret at all


 

  
  After listening to my HE-500's through this dac/amp i feel that i have definitely found the perfect sound ive been after! My gosh this little thing is quite amazing for such a small little piece. I cannot turn the volume knob past 2 oclock as its to loud. I must say the HE500s keep changing and gettting better and better. Great combo!


----------



## gopack87

After following this thread for the last couple months, I took the plunge and sold my Burson 160D for one of these.  I look forward to hearing my LCD-2's on it later this week.  I loved my 160D but want to try something else and also have a combo that can also be a stand-alone dac.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I read 100's of posts.  I ultimately decided on the Dacmini.  I am completely satisfied with the Dacmini - LCD2 combination.  That said, the Burson 160D was my second choice.  I would love to compare the 2 amps/dacs.  I hope you will post your comparative impressions.
  
  Quote: 





gopack87 said:


> After following this thread for the last couple months, I took the plunge and sold my Burson 160D for one of these.  I look forward to hearing my LCD-2's on it later this week.  I loved my 160D but want to try something else and also have a combo that can also be a stand-alone dac.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I searched but may have missed a hit, so pardon the question if already answered.  
   
  Will the Dacmini adequately drive the HE-6?  If not, what about the HE-500?
   
  Thanks


----------



## MorbidToaster

bluemonkeyflyer said:


> I searched but may have missed a hit, so pardon the question if already answered.
> 
> Will the Dacmini adequately drive the HE-6?  If not, what about the HE-500?
> 
> Thanks




It will definitely power the HE 500, not sure about the HE 6 though.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





morbidtoaster said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, MT.  Did you by chance compare your HE500 to the HE6 and/or LCD2?  I'm happy with my LCD2 + Dacmini but, with above 11k Hz frequency hearing loss and bilateral tinnitus, I'm interested in either the HE500 or HE-6.  That said, I don't know if brighter cans would be any more enjoyable for me than the LCD2's.


----------



## MorbidToaster

I didn't get to compare, but from what I remember I got the HE 500 over the LCD 2. One reason being because they were a great contrast to my D7000. 
   
  The HE 500 is probably my favorite headphone after owning them for a few weeks, but I'm eager to try theLCD 2s again now that I know what to look for.
  
  Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> Thanks, MT.  Did you by chance compare your HE500 to the HE6 and/or LCD2?  I'm happy with my LCD2 + Dacmini but, with above 11k Hz frequency hearing loss and bilateral tinnitus, I'm interested in either the HE500 or HE-6.  That said, I don't know if brighter cans would be any more enjoyable for me than the LCD2's.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> I searched but may have missed a hit, so pardon the question if already answered.
> 
> Will the Dacmini adequately drive the HE-6?  If not, what about the HE-500?
> 
> Thanks


 

 With a gain of 8 it can drive the HE-6 to normal volumes, but not as powerfully as would be optimal.  It drives the HE-500 much better.  
   
  Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> Thanks, MT.  Did you by chance compare your HE500 to the HE6 and/or LCD2?  I'm happy with my LCD2 + Dacmini but, with above 11k Hz frequency hearing loss and bilateral tinnitus, I'm interested in either the HE500 or HE-6.  That said, I don't know if brighter cans would be any more enjoyable for me than the LCD2's.


 

 I posted impressions of HE-500 and comparisons using DACmini here:  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/549413/hifiman-introduces-new-he-500-planar-magnetic-headphones/585#post_7515669  The HE-500 will be a little brighter than the LCD-2, and the HE-6 will be a little brighter than the HE-500.  I don't think either is excessively bright, and if you have a high freq hearing loss like me then the HiFiMan orthos would be a better choice.


----------



## TheMiddleSky

is DACmini supposed to be more powerful than DACport?
   
  but when I read at their site, both of them have the same max power output: 1,5 watt.
   
  I get confuse here


----------



## gopack87

Just received my DACmini and after warming it up for 10 minutes, listened to a couple songs with my LCD-2.  Sounds great so far!  Extremely smooth with a black background and it really shows off the speed of the LCD-2.  Question though.  It seems there is no on/off switch, do any of you guys leave it plugged in 24/7?  I don't want to constantly plug it in but also don't want to damage it in any way.....


----------



## Townyj

Removed post... 
  Quote: 





gopack87 said:


> Just received my DACmini and after warming it up for 10 minutes, listened to a couple songs with my LCD-2.  Sounds great so far!  Extremely smooth with a black background and it really shows off the speed of the LCD-2.  Question though.  It seems there is no on/off switch, do any of you guys leave it plugged in 24/7?  I don't want to constantly plug it in but also don't want to damage it in any way.....


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Dacmini goes into standby when you cycle the source switch all the way left or all the way right.
   
  I'm enjoying mine with LCD2.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





themiddlesky said:


> is DACmini supposed to be more powerful than DACport?
> 
> but when I read at their site, both of them have the same max power output: 1,5 watt.
> 
> I get confuse here


 

 The DACmini clearly seems more powerful to me, with a variety of low and high impedance headphones.


----------



## Townyj

Hmmm maybe i read wrong  I will have to give this a shot haha. Doh!
   
  You sir are right... Sheesh! I feel a bit doey!

  
  Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> Dacmini goes into standby when you cycle the source switch all the way left or all the way right.
> 
> I'm enjoying mine with LCD2.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





townyj said:


> Hmmm maybe i read wrong  I will have to give this a shot haha. Doh!
> 
> You sir are right... Sheesh! I feel a bit doey!


 

 No worries.  I asked the same question a couple of weeks after I received my Dacmini...and felt a bit "doey", too, when someone told me about this function.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> With a gain of 8 it can drive the HE-6 to normal volumes, but not as powerfully as would be optimal.  It drives the HE-500 much better.
> 
> 
> I posted impressions of HE-500 and comparisons using DACmini here:  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/549413/hifiman-introduces-new-he-500-planar-magnetic-headphones/585#post_7515669  The HE-500 will be a little brighter than the LCD-2, and the HE-6 will be a little brighter than the HE-500.  I don't think either is excessively bright, and if you have a high freq hearing loss like me then the HiFiMan orthos would be a better choice.


 

 Thanks for the information, HeadphoneAddict.  Very helpful.


----------



## edvardd

I'm considering getting an DAC/AMP solution like Dacmini. My Current setup is Music Streamer 2+ with Head Direct EF5(upgraded opamps/Telefunken tube). Would the Dacmini be an upgrade or rather a sidegrade?


----------



## goofyvic

edvardd said:


> I'm considering getting an DAC/AMP solution like Dacmini. My Current setup is Music Streamer 2+ with Head Direct EF5(upgraded opamps/Telefunken tube). Would the Dacmini be an upgrade or rather a sidegrade?




With listeners switching from benchmark and bel canto to the DACmini, I believe it would be an upgrade at DAC point of view.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





edvardd said:


> I'm considering getting an DAC/AMP solution like Dacmini. My Current setup is Music Streamer 2+ with Head Direct EF5(upgraded opamps/Telefunken tube). Would the Dacmini be an upgrade or rather a sidegrade?


 
  Big upgrade.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Big upgrade.


 
  Did you get a DACmini?


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





elnero said:


> Did you get a DACmini?


 
  Don't own one yet.


----------



## edvardd

okay. I assume you have heard either MS2+ or a Dacmini that is not your own(considering that yours havn't arrived? I doubt the amp is a big upgrade but the DAC might be.
  Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> Big upgrade.


----------



## sesshin

Anyone using any 3rd party cables with the LCD-2 and DACmini that have brought on a noticeable improvement in sound?


----------



## ptrok

Quote: 





sesshin said:


> Anyone using any 3rd party cables with the LCD-2 and DACmini that have brought on a noticeable improvement in sound?


 

 From my perspective, considering I have the LCD-2's, the Dacmini and Steve Eddy's Q-Audio cables, Besides the obvious ergonomic benefits provided by the Q-audio cables which is worth the bread in itself, The soundstage seemed to open up slightly but the presentation quickened and sounded smoother without the sacrifice of detail. To me the Dacmini open up the high frequency  substantially. I enjoy this immensely over the stock cables which sounded a bit muffled in comparison. My wife who was opposed to me purchasing cables admitted the new cables sounded more musically accurate and could easily distinguish the difference considering her negative bias before even hearing the cables.
   
  This is just an opinion and you have to make the final assertion yourself. Other more prominent members of this site also endorse the Q-Audio Cables even though they don't have the Dacmini to the best of my knowledge. Based on Kwkarth's recommendation I took the chance on the Q-Audio cables despite an earlier desire to purchase ALO cables but I am glad that I listened to his advice because it saved me a lot of money and I met a new friend. Steve Eddy's a stand up guy and I love supporting people like him and will continually give him my business.
   
  I highly recommend giving the Q-Audio cables and the dacmini a listen to before you make the plunge. It is a great combo to put on your short list if you are looking for something economically viable without sacrificing sound quality. Good luck on your search. The traveling is fun but the final destination is even better once you get there.


----------



## goofyvic

edvardd said:


> okay. I assume you have heard either MS2+ or a Dacmini that is not your own(considering that yours havn't arrived? I doubt the amp is a big upgrade but the DAC might be.




Well I have not heard the EF5, but the LCD2 sounds really good with DACmini. Lively, great imaging and soundstage.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





edvardd said:


> okay. I assume you have heard either MS2+ or a Dacmini that is not your own(considering that yours havn't arrived? I doubt the amp is a big upgrade but the DAC might be.


 
  I do not like the sound of the MS2+.  I never have.  It just doesn't do it for me.  The Dacmini that I heard, on the other hand, had definition, resolution, and sweetness, in spades.  It was very impressive.


----------



## edvardd

Okay. I havn't compared MS2+ to any others DACs than my S:flo2 which it beats. I will try the Rega DAC soon and wonder if it is in the same league as DACmini or perhaps higher.
  Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> I do not like the sound of the MS2+.  I never have.  It just doesn't do it for me.  The Dacmini that I heard, on the other hand, had definition, resolution, and sweetness, in spades.  It was very impressive.


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





edvardd said:


> Okay. I havn't compared MS2+ to any others DACs than my S:flo2 which it beats. I will try the Rega DAC soon and wonder if it is in the same league as DACmini or perhaps higher.


 

 I personally like the Rega DAC more, especially in bass.  Still, it depends on the listener and the music choices, and how it fits in to the overall rig.  I'd do a listen to both this weekend to double-check, but my Rega DAC is out for warranty repair/replacement right now.  Boooo.


----------



## edvardd

I see. It's not strange considering the REGA DAC is 10x the size of DACMINI, and it doesn't include a headphone amp. Further, it's more expensive too.
   
  In terms of soundstage, which has the most expansive soundstage of REGA DAC and DACMINI?
   
  From what I've read I go the impression DACMINI had a relatively wide soundstage. I should listen to it myself. It's just that I have to order overseas.
   
  Quote: 





equus said:


> I personally like the Rega DAC more, especially in bass.  Still, it depends on the listener and the music choices, and how it fits in to the overall rig.  I'd do a listen to both this weekend to double-check, but my Rega DAC is out for warranty repair/replacement right now.  Boooo.


----------



## Dangalf

Hi all,
  I'm thinking of buying the DACmini and was wondering if anyone has tried the premium power supply - if so was it worth the extra? Also as I live in the UK will I need to buy an adaptor for the mains or will the power supply (which is worldwide) be suitable?
   
  Thanks for any comments


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





dangalf said:


> Hi all,
> I'm thinking of buying the DACmini and was wondering if anyone has tried the premium power supply - if so was it worth the extra?


 

  I wasn't aware they offered a premium power supply???


----------



## tktran

The default power supply bundled with the Dacmini IS the "Premium Stability" power supply.
  It's a bigger power brick that has a DC connector on one end (connects to Dacmini) and an male IEC socket on the other end (to power cable). 
   
  You plug the mains side of an IEC appliance lead to the wall, and the IEC side to the power supply.
   
   
  This way you've got a truly universal power supply- you just replace the cable! 
  eg. here's an Australian IEC cable:

   
  For travellers wanting a smaller power brick, there is a smaller "low noise" power supply.
  It's got a DC connector on one end, and a US 2 prong (ungrounded) connector on the other:

  So it's more compact, and for mobile people it's 1 less cable to carry/remember.
   
  But rest assured it will just as suitable as to the original power supply. In terms of quality you don't have to worry whether you should use the Premium or the Standard or even anything you already have laying around at home. A laboratory grade variable power supply (typical technician/engineer's toolbox) isn't going to improve it's either sound either.
   
  Premium, or Standard is just way to differentiate the two.
   
  Truth is, Dacmini does it's own DC/DC conversion and will work reliably with a wide range of power supplies. (9VDC to 19VDC)
   
  It's a bit like other switch mode power supplies, eg. your laptop power's brick- take a look at it sometime. It can convert anything from 110V to 240VAC, 50 or 60Hz to the appropriate DC voltages to power your laptop.
   
  But I'm sure uncertainty, doubt or curiosity will creep in and people are bound to try other power supplies, linear power supplies, battery power etc. And you'll hear raving testimonials about how the soundstage opened  up or that bass got tighter etc.
   
  You might as well opt for a black Dacmini, for a blacker background between the notes.
   
  Me, I prefer silver, since it always sounds cleaner.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  [edit for clarity; images 1,2,4 (c) Centrance]


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Well, I am absolutely certain now that I prefer the DACmini headphone output to drive my JH13Pro custom IEM vs my balanced SR-71b or Pico Slim amps (even with DACmini RCA out feeding the other amps).  The dynamic headroom is greater, and the power output without distortion is higher.  Plus, it awakens the JH13Pro mids that seem slightly lacking with the Pico Slim, and improves the bass impact and depth over the SR-71b.  It's the closest I've heard to my Woo WA6 or Eddie Current ZDT driving the JH13Pro, both of which I previously reported were my favorites with the JH13Pro.


----------



## Dangalf

Thanks for the responses guys


----------



## canyondust

Has anyone on this thread bought a DACmini recently? I'm curious as to how long it took you to get one... I ordered 10 days ago and haven't recieved a tracking number yet. Does it usually take a while?


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi Canyon!
   
  Please send me a PM and I can check on the status of your shipment.
   
  -Jonathan


----------



## canyondust

Micheal Goodman sent me a tracking number about 5 minutes after me posting my previous question.
   
  Looks like my Dacmini is on it's way, but because it was shipped USPS, it gets handed over to Canada Post, which is on strike right now.
  I can't wait to get my hands on the unit, as It's not just a hobby for me, I'm on my headphones 8 hours a day! Can't wait to start working on a better headphone system.
  Has anyone tried both the Dacmini and the Mytek Stereo96 DAC? They seem to be very similar in many ways, and I like mytek converters...
   
  Cheers,
  -D


----------



## elnero

Quote:  





> Looks like my Dacmini is on it's way, but because it was shipped USPS, it gets handed over to Canada Post, which is on strike right now.


 

 I don't think the strike should pose much of an issue, they're still delivering 3 days a week with I gather rotating strike days in different cities/provinces. If I didn't hear about it on the radio I probably wouldn't even know the difference.


----------



## edvardd

First impressions from Avguide.com
   
  http://www.avguide.com/blog/first-look-listen-centrance-dacmini-cx-dacheadphone-amplifier


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





elnero said:


> I don't think the strike should pose much of an issue, they're still delivering 3 days a week with I gather rotating strike days in different cities/provinces. If I didn't hear about it on the radio I probably wouldn't even know the difference.


 
   
  It shipped on the 15th and it still hasn't officially entered Canada (though USPS says it's "left the United States".... suspense is killing me.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> It shipped on the 15th and it still hasn't officially entered Canada (though USPS says it's "left the United States".... suspense is killing me.


 
  I hadn't realized, there's actually a lock out now so it looks like mail will be very limited for awhile. I just tried Canada Post's website to see the status but the info page won't load.


----------



## songforyou

I've had the DACmini for a couple of months now and I love it.  I have a pair of LCD-2s and there is no question that the DACmini is a good match.  Everything sounds musical and yet detailed at the same time.  I've resisted commenting on it because I haven't spent much time using it as a headphone amp yet (most of my music listening is through speakers).  But what appeals to me most about the DACmini is its versatility.
   
  I ordered the variable out version and I have to say that as a preamp the unit is fantastic.  Right now I'm using it as a preamp in my 'vintage' system consisting of a restored Dynaco 70 driving a pair of Spica TC-50s.  I love tubes and the Dynaco/Spica combo is peanut butter and jam.  I use USB in on the DACmini for itunes, optical in for DVD/CD and the RCA in for my phono stage and turntable.  The sound is transparent and totally engaging.  And I find the DAC does a great job with my budget DVD player and lossless music files.
   
  The only caveat is that there is no true on/off switch so the computer has to be on (or you have to unplug the power cable and plug it back in) to fire up the DACmini.
   
  I was drawn to the unit for its compatability with the LCD-2s, but the biggest surprise is its preamp functionality.  For $795, the DACmini is outstanding value.


----------



## Townyj

Like i found out recently you can put the DACmini into standby by turning the input selector knob all the way right or left. Since mines selected on USB, just turn it right a little more and the white light will go off 

  
  Quote: 





songforyou said:


> I've had the DACmini for a couple of months now and I love it.  I have a pair of LCD-2s and there is no question that the DACmini is a good match.  Everything sounds musical and yet detailed at the same time.  I've resisted commenting on it because I haven't spent much time using it as a headphone amp yet (most of my music listening is through speakers).  But what appeals to me most about the DACmini is its versatility.
> 
> I ordered the variable out version and I have to say that as a preamp the unit is fantastic.  Right now I'm using it as a preamp in my 'vintage' system consisting of a restored Dynaco 70 driving a pair of Spica TC-50s.  I love tubes and the Dynaco/Spica combo is peanut butter and jam.  I use USB in on the DACmini for itunes, optical in for DVD/CD and the RCA in for my phono stage and turntable.  The sound is transparent and totally engaging.  And I find the DAC does a great job with my budget DVD player and lossless music files.
> 
> ...


----------



## songforyou

Oh yes, I know about the standby and turn it "off" this way all the time.  It's turning it back on that's the issue.  It doesn't turn back on unless your computer is powered up first.  At least that how mine operates.  If the computer isn't on and I turn the selector knob nothing happens.
   
  Again, this isn't a big deal at all, but I think the DACmini is good enough to see duty as a stand alone preamp and DAC in a system that might not even have a computer source.  My system does, so it's all good for me.
   
  I have also used the optical in with a Western Digital HD movie box (WDTV) .  Works great.  I usually listen to movies through my stereo (never took to surround) and the DACmini does a brilliant job with the sound.
   
  Happy Camper, I am!


----------



## Townyj

Ahhhh righto i understand what you mean now!  I can see how it wouldnt turn on without the computer being on etc. But hmmm they may need to look into that small issue.
   
  Quote:


songforyou said:


> Oh yes, I know about the standby and turn it "off" this way all the time.  It's turning it back on that's the issue.  It doesn't turn back on unless your computer is powered up first.  At least that how mine operates.  If the computer isn't on and I turn the selector knob nothing happens.
> 
> Again, this isn't a big deal at all, but I think the DACmini is good enough to see duty as a stand alone preamp and DAC in a system that might not even have a computer source.  My system does, so it's all good for me.
> 
> ...


----------



## canyondust

SONGFORYOU: Are you saying it -needs- a USB connection present (even it unused) to function? mine is currently being shipped, and I plan on using the optical input only.... I hope this is not the case at all....


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi guys! I thought I would chime in.
   
  The DACmini CX works with or without a computer connected. Please contact me via PM or email if you are having any trouble.
   
  -Jonathan


----------



## redwarrior191

Jay, have you measured the output power of Dacmini at variable ohms??


----------



## Jay Listens

Good question!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  50Ω load will draw about 500mW per channel
  300Ω load is up to 240mW per channel
 600Ω load is up to 130mW per channel
   
   
  Let me know if you have anymore questions RedWarrior191.
   
  -Jay


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Good question!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Where does the 1.5W come in, is it 750mW per channel at 32Ω?


----------



## redwarrior191

Quote: 





elnero said:


> Where does the 1.5W come in, is it 750mW per channel at 32Ω?


 

 this..
  actually i was wondering 1.5W is the output power at which impedance level...
  also, will the increased gain of 10 increase the output power by much??


----------



## canyondust

I'm of the impression that the power supply output is 1.5W total.... and since power conversion, filtration, and powering the dac/digital boards all require power, that means the 1.5W is shared between powering the unit and outputting the audio signal? I could be very wrong, but it seems to make sense in my head...


----------



## canyondust

Canada Post is back in action, and I received my Dacmini today. It's currently burning in (while I'm editing with it, no less) and it sounds pretty decent.
  Did a quick comparison to the piece of gear it's replacing (Digidesign mBox2) in this configuration:
   
  Pro tools output 1&2 (aggregate IO) ->mac optical out> dacmini ->AKG K240DF
  Pro tools output 3&4 (aggregate IO) ->mBox2-> AKG K240DF
  Both units volume matched by feeding 1Khz sine and adjusting volume to 70dB spl A weighted metered.
   
  Initial impressions: tonally similar, but the Dacmini resolving much more detail, but not by adding brightness; the clarity is just 'there'. Good clocking I suppose? Bass is tighter and more controlled (I assume due to having more power available on hand vs the mbox2 USB power. No volume knob mistracking (or none that I can resolve).
   
  I was worried about having enough gain to drive my 600ohm K240DFs (I work at approx -10dbFS). At 0dBFS modern pop music is plenty loud at 12:30-1 o'clock.
  In my -10dBFS configuration (broadcast audio work) the same material is loud at 3 o'clock.
  Editing very quiet material (ppp music, or soft dialogue) I can turn the volume up full,  I haven't had material yet that requires more gain than that... but this is day 1.
   
  (mbox2 had less gain, and dynamic content at full gain into 600ohms would distort)
   
  I also briefly plugged in Grado SR-125s, which I still found a little too bright for my liking (but vastly improved bass) so I'm going to let the dacmini burn in for a week and see what that does to the sound.
   
  One nit so far: the volume knob is close to the headphone jack, and I find my fingers get tangled in the rigid part of the headphone cable that inserts into the jack when I'm reaching for the volume knob out of the corner of my eye... I'm sure I will adjust to this in time and reach instinctively in a way that I won't grab the headphone cable when reaching for the volume knob.
   
   
  ** Just plugged in my old fostex T20RPs,  and the bass extension blows the doors off of the K240DF and Grados (resolving 15 to 20hz with real presence).... which is strange because these used to sound bass-light to me... I have no idea what the Dacmini does to these cans, but the difference is very dramatic compared the AKGs or the Grados (That being said, I'm not a huge fan of the T20s, they are way more dense in the mids compared to the SR125s and K240s.... but I might make an extensive re-evaluation of the T20s (I bought them in 1998 and replaced them in 1999 with the K240s)
  Perhaps questioning everything I think I knew?


----------



## pekingduck

headfonia has an article on DACmini/DACport vs other DACs, it's an interesting read.
   
  http://www.headfonia.com/centrance-dacmini-and-dacport/


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Questions for whoever is nice enough to help 

1. DACMini vs the Peachtree iDAC, are they about comparable on the DAC section? In particular the USB section, but also overall. How do these two products compare, and are they the only high end USB DAC game in town? Are there others to look at before I decide?

2. Is the DACMini an excellent DAC with a good headphone amp, an excellent headphone amp with a good DAC, or excellent at both? 

3. Will the DACMini and by extension of house sound, the DACPort match well with the HD 800 phones and will both have the power to drive them? If not, what could drive them?

4. I see mods available at the website that are order-able, which would be desirable for use with the HD 800? Both products if applicable. 

5. If the HD 800 does not match well, should I look at different headphones and/or a different Headphone DAC Amp? Should I consider separate DACs and Headphone Amps?


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Help me Head-Fi-Forum, your my only hope. Obi-Wan doesn't return my calls.


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





neodinardo said:


> Help me Head-Fi-Forum, your my only hope. Obi-Wan doesn't return my calls.


 


 Haha...well, I can't answer all of your questions, but I can take a swing at my opinions:
   
  Quote: 





> 1. DACMini vs the Peachtree iDAC, are they about comparable on the DAC section? In particular the USB section, but also overall. How do these two products compare, and are they the only high end USB DAC game in town? Are there others to look at before I decide?


 
  I have no experience with the Peachtree, so I can't compare.  The USB section of the DACmini is solid, and very good.  When you say "high end USB DAC", however, there are definitely other options...many of which you would pay dearly for.  I've heard better USB DACs, but a lot depends on what sound you're looking for in your source and what options you have for outputs and budget.
  
  Quote: 





> 2. Is the DACMini an excellent DAC with a good headphone amp, an excellent headphone amp with a good DAC, or excellent at both?


 
  IMO, it's a great DAC with a good built-in amp.  I'm partial to hybrid tube amps now, so I'm very much biased on my opinion, however.  Do I use the headphone amp still?  Yes I do, because in my desktop computer rig I haven't made room in the area for one of my other amps, and I may not get around to doing that, truth be told.  The amp section is more than good enough to make me happy, and I don't listen to music sitting right at my desktop as often so far.
   
  Quote: 





> 3. Will the DACMini and by extension of house sound, the DACPort match well with the HD 800 phones and will both have the power to drive them? If not, what could drive them?


 
  I can't imagine the DACmini having issues with powering a HD800, but I haven't tried that.  The DACmini I have almost exclusively is used with an LCD-2.  Don't have any experience with the DACport, so I can't comment.
   
  Quote:


> 4. I see mods available at the website that are order-able, which would be desirable for use with the HD 800? Both products if applicable.


 
  Can't help you on this one.  I don't know if you would need any of them, personally.
   
  Quote: 





> 5. If the HD 800 does not match well, should I look at different headphones and/or a different Headphone DAC Amp? Should I consider separate DACs and Headphone Amps?


 
  Nice thing about the DACmini is that you can always use it as your DAC if you end up getting a separate amp.  I'd personally probably lean toward a hybrid or tube amp with the HD800 because I find them a little on the harsh side, but that's totally subjective.  I think the most I've liked an HD800 is out of a Bottlehead OTL amp, and I didn't even really like the HD800 then, so take that all with a grain of salt.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





equus said:


> Haha...well, I can't answer all of your questions, but I can take a swing at my opinions:
> 
> I have no experience with the Peachtree, so I can't compare.  The USB section of the DACmini is solid, and very good.  When you say "high end USB DAC", however, there are definitely other options...many of which you would pay dearly for.  I've heard better USB DACs, but a lot depends on what sound you're looking for in your source and what options you have for outputs and budget.
> 
> ...


 
  Equus, Neo,
  You took a swing and really connected!  Home run!  I've spent a fair amount of time with the Peachtree IDecco and Peachtree MusicBox and they're both wonderful devices worthy of their price, and capable of good performance.  To my ear, the DACMini (I've only heard the prototype) is in a league above both aforementioned Peachtree DAC/Amp combos.  The Peachtree products have more drive power for the headphones, but are not as transparent to my ears.  The DACs used in the Centrance products are superior to my ears.


----------



## Equus

Heh...thanks for the vote of confidence, kwkarth.  While I cannot compare to the Peachtree line, I can agree that the DACMini is very transparent to my ears.  It has a nice clear sound to it without being fatiguing or clinical.  Both with the built-in amp and as a stand-alone DAC, I find it slightly less involving than my Assemblage and Rega DAC, probably because I perceive a little less weight to the mids and bass, but the lessened weight also means there is almost always superb clarity and resolution without the sounds getting lost in the movement of the piece.  What the listener would prefer in terms of presentation is totally subjective, so the DACMini may be right up someone's alley and hard to beat at that price point.


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Thanks, just the info I needed. I agree, the iDac is $200 more than the DACMini, which at $800 for the DACMini, it makes it hard to want to spend more. For both budget and value reasons. The DacMini is seeminly a steal, I just don't know about matching it with the HD 800. Perhaps another set of phones...


----------



## Equus

There's usually a HD800 at the Seattle meets, so I might be able to listen to a pair with my DACMini.  Course that's a month away, so it'll be a while.


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Lately, I was just thinking I'd benefit more from a slightly warm energetic set, perhaps a top end Grado, to offset the cold revealing nature of the DACmini, I could just order the DACmini in, and take it with me to the store for demos with headphones. I'm in Philadelphia, perhaps there are stores here that have some of the upper end headphones on hand for demo. This is all paper to me currently, the best headphone, pretty much the only headphone I've heard are my Shure SE535s on my iPod with a lossless file. I know, I have a ways to go with sources and evaluation. For now, I may just use my Shures with whatever DAC/Amp I buy (I am leaning towards the DACmini) for movies, just because It is what I have on hand. I just bought an HDTV, so I have Blu-Ray watching on the brain. So I may want something a bit easier to slip on and off for movies, and give me something that the IEMs can't do. I assume the big cans are better in bass slam, imaging and certain other qualities. 
   
  The best stereo I've owned was the NAD/Von. S VR-1 combo.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





neodinardo said:


> Lately, I was just thinking I'd benefit more from a slightly warm energetic set, perhaps a top end Grado, to offset the cold revealing nature of the DACmini, I could just order the DACmini in, and take it with me to the store for demos with headphones. I'm in Philadelphia, perhaps there are stores here that have some of the upper end headphones on hand for demo. This is all paper to me currently, the best headphone, pretty much the only headphone I've heard are my Shure SE535s on my iPod with a lossless file. I know, I have a ways to go with sources and evaluation. For now, I may just use my Shures with whatever DAC/Amp I buy (I am leaning towards the DACmini) for movies, just because It is what I have on hand. I just bought an HDTV, so I have Blu-Ray watching on the brain. So I may want something a bit easier to slip on and off for movies, and give me something that the IEMs can't do. I assume the big cans are better in bass slam, imaging and certain other qualities.
> 
> The best stereo I've owned was the NAD/Von. S VR-1 combo.


 
  I would never characterize the DACMini as cold.


----------



## Equus

Agreed.  While I think there's nice transparency, clarity, and detail, I wouldn't say the DACMini is cold or analytical.  Either as a DAC only or using the built-in amp.


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Good to know on the DAC not being too cold, but how does the sound compare to the current headroom desktop amp for $850?

Headphones wise, I'm going to order up the LCD-2 and demo that vs the grado ps1000 and HD800 at the store. But I think the LCD-2 should do it for me, from what I've read.

Portable wise I still have the Shure se535, but the jh16 pro is also calling my name.

Denon d70000 and the ultrasone 8 were also on my radar, but they didn't quite seem as exciting as the above options. Same with the GR10 and Westone 4.

So DACmini vs Headroom vs the world, I'm undecided.


----------



## RedBull

Has anyone heard DACmini in comparison to Lehmann BCL, as amp?
  or impression against NFB-2 as DAC?
   
  Not that BCL or NFB-2 are bad, but you know, this hobby, we'll never stop 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thanks ....


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





neodinardo said:


> Good to know on the DAC not being too cold, but how does the sound compare to the current headroom desktop amp for $850?
> 
> ...
> 
> So DACmini vs Headroom vs the world, I'm undecided.


 

 I don't have any experience with the Headroom line.  Sorry.  I can say that I've heard the LCD-2 through a fairly decent amount of DACs, however, and the only real thing that I think it might not be so strong in is the weight and body of the lower tones, like low mids and below.  It's not that it's completely gone (or I wouldn't like the DAC at all), but my other DACs and amps tend to have more guts down there.  I realize that it's totally a matter of taste however, and while I think it may not be so strong in that area, it's not particularly weak or bad at any other areas off the top of my head.
   
  And I'm biased towards the LCD-2.  I've heard the Grados, T1s, HD800s, and a few Stax (granted, without higher end amplification), and still prefer the LCD-2 for my applications.
   
  Quote: 





redbull said:


> Has anyone heard DACmini in comparison to Lehmann BCL, as amp?
> or impression against NFB-2 as DAC?
> 
> Not that BCL or NFB-2 are bad, but you know, this hobby, we'll never stop
> ...


 

 No experience with the Lehmann.  I've heard a few audio-gd DACs and while they've been solid, I haven't ever been blown away.  Granted, only experience was at meets or visiting a local head-fier for a half hour or something, so take that with a gigantic grain of salt.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





neodinardo said:


> Good to know on the DAC not being too cold, but how does the sound compare to the current headroom desktop amp for $850?
> 
> Headphones wise, I'm going to order up the LCD-2 and demo that vs the grado ps1000 and HD800 at the store. But I think the LCD-2 should do it for me, from what I've read.
> 
> ...


 
  I found the Headroom desktop (current model) to be a nice sounding setup, plus I do like their crossfeed circuit on occasion.  From memory, I think the DACMini had better low level detail retrieval, better transparency, etc.  If I was going to buy one or the other today, I would have to audition both again at length.


----------



## RedBull

Quote: 





equus said:


> No experience with the Lehmann.  I've heard a few audio-gd DACs and while they've been solid, I haven't ever been blown away.  Granted, only experience was at meets or visiting a local head-fier for a half hour or something, so take that with a gigantic grain of salt.


 

 Thanks, at least something Equus 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Let's say, I'm a sucker for vocal music, with your gigantic grain of salt, which one do you think do you prefer, DACmini or A-gd?
  Considering we both love LCD-2 signature, at least we have similarity somewhere. 
   
  From what I read so far, DACmini has better extension for both bass and treble (vs A-gd), is this your impression as well, (if you can remember)?


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





redbull said:


> Thanks, at least something Equus
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I honestly can't comment much more beyond that without doing the Audio-gd gear a disservice, because I've only heard them for maybe 10 to 15 minutes at a time.  I can safely say that what I've heard hasn't really motivated me to purchase one, and that I don't have any plans to sell my DACMini any time soon.


----------



## WilCox

Quote: 





redbull said:


> Has anyone heard DACmini in comparison to Lehmann BCL, as amp?


 

 I had my Lehmann BCL connected to my DACmini for the past couple of weeks.  Listened mostly to my LCD-2 and HD800.  Concluded that the BCL wasn't giving me anything more than what I was getting from the DACmini amp so I put the BCL back in storage yesterday.
   
  The DACmini may not be perfect, I think it does everything I'm looking for an makes me forget about the equipment and listen to the music.


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





wilcox said:


> The DACmini may not be perfect, I think it does everything I'm looking for an makes me forget about the equipment and listen to the music.


 


  That's a good way of putting it.  If my budget only allowed for the DACMini and I didn't have any of these other rigs around here, I think I could still be very happy with it.  It does a lot right without doing a lot wrong.  Been listening to the soundtrack from The Borrower Arrietty with my LCD-2 through it, and it's fantastic.


----------



## RedBull

Quote:


equus said:


> I honestly can't comment much more beyond that without doing the Audio-gd gear a disservice, because I've only heard them for maybe 10 to 15 minutes at a time.  I can safely say that what I've heard hasn't really motivated me to purchase one, and that I don't have any plans to sell my DACMini any time soon.


 

 Thanks. I understand that.
  
  Quote: 





wilcox said:


> I had my Lehmann BCL connected to my DACmini for the past couple of weeks.  Listened mostly to my LCD-2 and HD800.  Concluded that the BCL wasn't giving me anything more than what I was getting from the DACmini amp so I put the BCL back in storage yesterday.
> 
> The DACmini may not be perfect, I think it does everything I'm looking for an makes me forget about the equipment and listen to the music.


 

 May I know where DACmini strength over BCL?  I use BCL as comparison because I'm very familiar with the sound and then it's easier to imagine how the sound would be.


----------



## firecommon

I'm looking for a sub-1000$ system to power lcd-2. 
  Can anyone comment on comparisons between the dac/pre-amp functions of the dacmini and dacport?
  Basically, is there a big difference (or any at all) between the dacs of the two?
   
  reason being, i'm thinking about going with either
   
  1. just the dacmini - 800$
  2. dacport lx + lyr/ef5 - 800-850$
   
  any help will be appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  edit: price of number 2. is actually 800$... i thought the lyr was 550$ but it's actually 450$.. lol


----------



## WilCox

Quote:


redbull said:


> May I know where DACmini strength over BCL?  I use BCL as comparison because I'm very familiar with the sound and then it's easier to imagine how the sound would be.


 

 I'm not saying that one is better than the other -- just that they both work well with the LCD-2 and are both very satisfying.  I think where the DACmini has the advantage for me is that it is a one-box solution with minimal hassle -- a very good DAC and a very good amp in one small box.  Sound wise, I'd say the DACmini and Lehmann are in the same league which makes the DACmini an excellent value.


----------



## redwarrior191

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Good question!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  how come after this long, Jay still haven't got an answer to this question??


----------



## Jay Listens

Sorry Redwarrior.
   
  Yes, you are correct. 1.5W is both channels given 32 Ohm load.  In other words, 750mW per channel, given 32 Ohm load.  750mW + 750mW = 1.5W
   
  And thanks again to all of you who continue to say wonderful things about our products. It really energizes us to work even harder!
  Let me know how else I can help! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  -Jay


----------



## NeoDiNardo

I narrowed my choices down to the CEntrence DACmini and the Grace M903, how does the two of these stack up? I know they are in difference price leagues and all. I do like the styling of the Grace a slightly more than the DACmini. However, with the Grace it's unclear to me if I'm paying for a possible increase in sound quality, the made in the USA factor, or features I don't need like balanced inputs.
   
  I'm planning on the Audeze LCD-2s for easy slip on and slip off headphones, and the Westone ES5s for on the go, gym, or private use. Seems to be the combination I'm going for.
   
  The nice perks of the Grace include a remote option and dual headphone ports, so I could use both of my headphones, give the guest the LCD-2s for movie watching. Since I have no speakers for my 47" passive 3D HDTV (47LW5600), these features are of particular interest for 3D Blu-Ray movies. If the Grace sounds better, it would be the clear choice for me. But I am unsure of the sound quality between the two, and the above features alone can't justify the cost increase between the two. Not logically anyway 
   
  Also, I noted that although I am limited by the DACmini and Grace M903 digital inputs, I do have 4 HDMI inputs on my HDTV, with optical out. So I was thinking, I could use the HDTV as a digital hub, then feed the headphone amp the optical out from the HDTV, increasing my digital inputs. Would there be any decrease in audio quality in this case?????


----------



## RedBull

Quote: 





wilcox said:


> Quote:
> 
> I'm not saying that one is better than the other -- just that they both work well with the LCD-2 and are both very satisfying.  I think where the DACmini has the advantage for me is that it is a one-box solution with minimal hassle -- a very good DAC and a very good amp in one small box.  Sound wise, I'd say the DACmini and Lehmann are in the same league which makes the DACmini an excellent value.


 

 Thanks WilCox, I'm not saying one is better than other too  ok, maybe my phrasing is wrong, now ... how do you think the sound signature different from DACmini and BCL?  I know 'better' is really subjective, but sound signature, hopefully can be more objective.
   
  Not many have both amps, so really need your help to describe it so I can assess if the sound signature is something that I like or not.
  The one-box-solution advantage, noted.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





firecommon said:


> I'm looking for a sub-1000$ system to power lcd-2.
> Can anyone comment on comparisons between the dac/pre-amp functions of the dacmini and dacport?
> Basically, is there a big difference (or any at all) between the dacs of the two?
> 
> ...


 

 For LCD-2 I think I prefer the DACmini still.  It gives my LCD-2 a better sense of air, ambience and micro-detail, along with delicacy and finesse.  I'd like to re-cap my various posts and impressions below, with what I've posted about the DACmini over the past few months.
   
  At http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/75#post_7325679 I wrote:
   
  [size=medium]Quote:[/size] 





> [size=medium]I'm surprised I never saw this thread before.  It will take some time for me to read it all, but in the meantime, here are some links to other posts I've written about the DACmini.[/size]
> 
> [size=medium]RMAF 2010 Impressions Thread has basically a mini-review of the DACmini:[/size]
> 
> ...


 
   
  [size=medium]At http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/105#post_7374247 I wrote:[/size]
   
  Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  At http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/120#post_7389017 I wrote:
   
  Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  At http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/135#post_7413188 I wrote:
   
   
  Quote: 





> Well, so far I am still quite pleased with the DACmini since I posted my last impressions here in March. It's definitely a permanent fixture in my home.
> 
> Since my last report I hardly use any of my other home gear, because the DACmini in my bedroom Macbook Pro rig is so convenient and accessible.  I've been using the DACmini with my LCD-2 mostly, and I also feed the analog out into my SR-71b amp for my balanced IEM and HE-6.  I still use the DACport when I'm moving my Macbook around, but that's about it for the past few weeks.  Since I got the DACmini I've rarely been down to use my high-end rig in the basement.
> 
> ...


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> For LCD-2 I think I prefer the DACmini still...


 

 Are you specifically referring to the EF5 vs. DACmini or do you have a Lyr now as well?


----------



## NeoDiNardo

Going for the Grace M903, sorry DACmini! The Graces remote and dual headphones did you in.


----------



## kwkarth

Unfortunately, features sometimes win over function and performance.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





elnero said:


> Are you specifically referring to the EF5 vs. DACmini or do you have a Lyr now as well?


 

 Sorry, I should clarify that I've never heard the Lyr, but I hope to at RMAF this October.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Sorry, I should clarify that I've never heard the Lyr, but I hope to at RMAF this October.


 


  Cool, I'll be looking forward to hearing what you think of the Lyr. I keep tossing around the idea of trying one with the DACmini for use with the LCD-2's but can't quite commit to the idea, curiosity will probably win out at some point though.


----------



## kwkarth

There is a thread dedicated to discussion of amplifiers for the LCD-2.  Please use that thread to discuss amps other than Centrance products there.
  Thanks!


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





kwkarth said:


> There is a thread dedicated to discussion of amplifiers for the LCD-2.  Please use that thread to discuss amps other than Centrance products there.
> Thanks!


 

 Seriously? How is this comment even warranted or justified?
   
  First off HeadphoneAddict was replying to a clarification I asked for in regards to his preference of the DACmini with the LCD-2's. Second, the DACmini is both an amp and DAC, my comments regarding trying a Lyr were with the DACmini as a DAC. Both are directly related to the DACmini and far more relevant to the thread than say hamsters would be.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





elnero said:


> Seriously? How is this comment even warranted or justified?
> 
> First off HeadphoneAddict was replying to a clarification I asked for in regards to his preference of the DACmini with the LCD-2's. Second, the DACmini is both an amp and DAC, my comments regarding trying a Lyr were with the DACmini as a DAC. Both are directly related to the DACmini and far more relevant to the thread than say hamsters would be.


 

 Sorry, my bad.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I like hamsters.
   
   
   
  Especially with ketchup.


----------



## Townyj

Thumbs up for the Troll  

  
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I like hamsters.
> 
> 
> 
> Especially with ketchup.


----------



## kwkarth

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I like hamsters.
> 
> Especially with ketchup.


 
  Broiled or boiled?


----------



## RedBull

Deep fried please ...


----------



## canyondust

So it's been about 2 months or so since I've had my DACmini, and I think it's a pretty fantastic unit.... I was going to compare it directly to the Mbox2 that it replaced, but I just cannot be bothered hooking that piece of junk up and reinstalling the drivers. I stand behind what I said before that the DACmini has far more resolution/detail, yet without pushing the highs to achieve it, it's just 'there'. The bass has more extension and is much tighter/faster, which I suspect has to do with the with the fact that the DACmini takes it's power from a brick, whereas the Mbox2 is solely USB powered.
   
  Now as I mentioned before, I'm an audio editor, and I'm often listening to very soft sound, like dialogue at -40dBFS to -50dBFS. I chose to get the DACMini in stock configuration, which is the +8 gain. If I had to do it all over, I'd certainly get the +10 gain mod. Listening to music with modern mastering levels is completely satisfying, even on my 600Ohm AKGs.... but they simply aren't loud enough on the AKGs, and even my 32ohm Grados struggle for SPL when I'm editing soft material.
   
  Interestingly enough, I've broken out my old Fostex T20RPs to edit on, because they were within arms reach and are about 1/10th the impedance of the AKGs (and hence a bit louder) and I'm now an orthodynamic convert. All my other headphones seem to be artificially sweetened somehow... I love the rich warm sound of the Fostex.... but now I'm eyeing up the LCD-2s as my next pair of cans.... even though they're 5dB quieter than the fostex T20RPs....
   
  Do people here love the LCD-2 / DACMini combo?
   
  Can the +10 Gain mod be done after-the-fact? Is it something I could potentially do myself?


----------



## Equus

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> ...
> 
> Interestingly enough, I've broken out my old Fostex T20RPs to edit on, because they were within arms reach and are about 1/10th the impedance of the AKGs (and hence a bit louder) and I'm now an orthodynamic convert. All my other headphones seem to be artificially sweetened somehow... I love the rich warm sound of the Fostex.... but now I'm eyeing up the LCD-2s as my next pair of cans.... even though they're 5dB quieter than the fostex T20RPs....
> 
> Do people here love the LCD-2 / DACMini combo?


 


  One of us...one of us...become one of us...lol.
   
  I'd be hard-pressed to think of another dac and amp at the price of the DACMini that I like as much with the LCD-2.  Good detail, pleasing non-fatiguing sound, well presented imaging, though (to my ears) with less extension in the lower end than my other discrete dekstop DACs and amps.  The caveat, of course, is that the component DACs and amps I have can cost at least as much as (or a lot more than) the DACMini does as an all-in-one.


----------



## dmnc02

I really like the DACmini with the LCD-2, but I recently added a Schiit Lyr and there is no going back to the DACmini alone. I listen mainly to classical music and the weight of the orchestra and the air around it are reproduced much more satisfactorily with the Lyr in the chain.
   
  Of course, the DACmini+Lyr is more expensive than the DACmini alone, but not prohibitively so and I think there is good synergy between the two.


----------



## mamsterla

Crap.  Now I am scared! We Hamsters are afraid of ketchup!


----------



## mamsterla

BTW, I have a set of LCD-2 on order and now I am pretty sure they will be joined by a CEntrance Dacmini soon.  This has been a great thread to get impressions about the product.  I will let people know how it compares to my current Keces 151/RSA Hornet/SE530 setup.  I find that setup a touch bright for long listening and find that the IEMs are a little fatiguing after a couple of hours of listening.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





mamsterla said:


> BTW, I have a set of LCD-2 on order and now I am pretty sure they will be joined by a CEntrance Dacmini soon.  This has been a great thread to get impressions about the product.  I will let people know how it compares to my current Keces 151/RSA Hornet/SE530 setup.  I find that setup a touch bright for long listening and find that the IEMs are a little fatiguing after a couple of hours of listening.


 

 Note, I have no idea how the Rev 2 LCD-2 will sound with the DACmini, but hopefully not brighter.  With my Rev 1 LCD-2 it's perfect.


----------



## Equus

I honestly don't use my DACMini that much, but while with the LCD-2 rev 2 there's a little more treble presence and extension, it's not so much that it gets overly bright, IMO.  I'm listening right now to some Japanese music tracks that I know are mixed on the hot side, and they sound fine.  For the record, I'm kind of sensitive to brightness and probably quicker to shy away from it than many people.


----------



## caracara08

anyone have any insight how this little guy does with the T1 and HD650?


----------



## Equus

Good question.  I may have to try out a T1 again at the next meet, but I'm guessing that it would work pretty well with the DACMini if you're looking for mid tones and clarity.  Off some amps, I found the T1s I've heard to sometimes be a little harsh on the high end, which I personally don't find as a trait of the DACMini.  Please take this as the pure speculation it is, as I haven't heard the combo myself and am only basing this off of recollections of the T1.  Give me a little over a week and a half and I can get back to ya though.


----------



## caracara08

Quote: 





equus said:


> Good question.  I may have to try out a T1 again at the next meet, but I'm guessing that it would work pretty well with the DACMini if you're looking for mid tones and clarity.  Off some amps, I found the T1s I've heard to sometimes be a little harsh on the high end, which I personally don't find as a trait of the DACMini.  Please take this as the pure speculation it is, as I haven't heard the combo myself and am only basing this off of recollections of the T1.  Give me a little over a week and a half and I can get back to ya though.


 


  lol thank you!   i normally like tubes vs not, but this 1 box unit seems interesting to me.   not 100% sold on it yet but your impressions do help a lot. thanks!


----------



## Equus

I generally prefer hybrid amps nowadays myself, but the DACMini has a nice presentation with the LCD-2 that doesn't seem to scream "SOLID STATE" at me.


----------



## canyondust

I'm very close to ordering the LCD-2 as a gift to my DACmini.... I'm excited, and have very high hopes for that set of cans. I'm really hoping it has the FR of the Fostex T20 with the soundstage of the Grado RS1 or better.... I just put on 3 pairs of Grados and went straight back to the Fostex. I'm really digging the DACmini / Fostex combo...  so lush and warm... there is clarity too, but it's not magnified or hyped.. and I'm no long hitting the input jack when I reach for the volume knob  I kind of do this 4-fingers on the top of the unit and adjust the volume with my thumb...


----------



## nieveulv

Got my Dacmini now to pair with my lcd2.....For a mini review first impression..
   
  OMG WOWW!!!!!!!!!! Now the main problem is my Bose onboard car audio system sounds kinda sucks now....i used to think they were alright until i went to work listening to Radioheads "king of limbs" CD and was like "wheres all the detail?????"
   
  Thats it for now 
  Thanks for all the help headfi


----------



## canyondust

I just received the LCD-2s.... and oh baby..... The DACmini+LCD-2 combo is now my new reference when I go from studio to studio....


----------



## RedBull

Quote:


canyondust said:


> I just received the LCD-2s.... and oh baby..... The DACmini+LCD-2 combo is now my new reference when I go from studio to studio....


 

 What was your previous reference?


----------



## canyondust

Previous long-standing reference was the K240DF, which was a 'studio standard' for quite awhile... Most recent was Fostex T20 which brought me down ortho lane to the LCD-2.


----------



## RedBull

^ thanks canyondust, and what was your past best amp that drives your K240DF.


----------



## canyondust

Heyya RedBull, it's a bit unfair, but the best amp that drove the K240DFs was a Bryston 4B (original)


----------



## mamsterla

I got my DACMini and LCD-2 together, but I have not had a chance to listen to the combo due to being hit by a car while commuting on my bicycle from work.  I hope to get back to work soon and I will let people know my long term thoughts about the pairing.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





mamsterla said:


> I got my DACMini and LCD-2 together, but I have not had a chance to listen to the combo due to being hit by a car while commuting on my bicycle from work.  I hope to get back to work soon and I will let people know my long term thoughts about the pairing.


 

 Not sure whether to congratulate you or pray for you!


----------



## plin

Quote: 





mamsterla said:


> I got my DACMini and LCD-2 together, but I have not had a chance to listen to the combo due to being hit by a car while commuting on my bicycle from work.  I hope to get back to work soon and I will let people know my long term thoughts about the pairing.


 
  Hope that you get well soon! Surely you've got one more good reason to return to work ASAP!


----------



## RedBull

Quote:


canyondust said:


> Heyya RedBull, it's a bit unfair, but the best amp that drove the K240DFs was a Bryston 4B (original)


 

 It's ok canyondust, to me, what matters most is the sound, I don't believe a more expensive amp always sound good.


----------



## canyondust

headphoneaddict said:


> Not sure whether to congratulate you or pray for you!





redbull said:


> Quote:
> 
> It's ok canyondust, to me, what matters most is the sound, I don't believe a more expensive amp always sound good.




Well, I certainly hope most people are here for the sound  Truth be told I look silly in LCD-2s and the K240DFs never really inspired me to enjoy listening... But they did translate quite well once used to them (but I guess most things do, "once used to them"

What I meant about unfair comparisons were how a 1.5 watt headphone amp drives a 600ohm load vs how a 250 watt amp does...

still really enjoying LCD-2 + dacmini combo a lot. Still getting used to the presence of information in the 20-40hz region... But my first premix on the combo translated extremely well in studio, which I'm psyched about.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I had a volume control warranty issue with my Dacmini.  The Good Guys at CEntrance fixed it and paid shipping both ways.  Problem solved.  Great customer service.  I am amazed every time I listen to my LCD2 - Dacmini setup.


----------



## ptrok

I totally agree with you. Their customer is top notch, when I had a problem they contacted me immediately and helped me get things up an running again. I also agree with the sound out of the LCD-2's (rev1). I'm really satisfied with this amp and will stick with this for my solid-state amp.


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> I had a volume control warranty issue with my Dacmini.  The Good Guys at CEntrance fixed it and paid shipping both ways.  Problem solved.  Great customer service.  I am amazed every time I listen to my LCD2 - Dacmini setup.


 


  What was your volume control issue? Mine seems to be experiencing a small amount of mis-tracking at very low volume (left channel attenuates faster than right channel) but since I'm not using IEMs and never listen to anything at that volume setting, I've been inclined to let it slide...


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> What was your volume control issue? Mine seems to be experiencing a small amount of mis-tracking at very low volume (left channel attenuates faster than right channel) but since I'm not using IEMs and never listen to anything at that volume setting, I've been inclined to let it slide...


 
   
  A certain amount of mistracking at very low volume is normal.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> What was your volume control issue? Mine seems to be experiencing a small amount of mis-tracking at very low volume (left channel attenuates faster than right channel) but since I'm not using IEMs and never listen to anything at that volume setting, I've been inclined to let it slide...


 

 Initially, I had a minimal tracking issue at very low volume but did not care because I never listened at such a low level.  Recently, I had the music stopped but rotated the volume knob up and down and noticed a scratchy sound.  I was concerned that might indicate a problem that could worsen over time.  I sent in my Dacmini and David replaced the volume mechanism.  No more scratchy sound.  It also turns with slightly more resistance than the original knob; the original knob seemed too loose.  It is now very smooth.  And it sounds wonderful with IEM's and my LCD2's.  Many thanks to the CEntrance guys for a great amp and great customer service.


----------



## soulrider4ever

Just pulled the trigger on lcd-2 v1 and dacmini, will post thoughts when I get them in


----------



## plin

Quote: 





soulrider4ever said:


> Just pulled the trigger on lcd-2 v1 and dacmini, will post thoughts when I get them in


 


  Congrats!


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

^ Good for you.  This is a super combo.  Prepare to be amazed.


----------



## Twinster

I have read the entire thread and the majority is about the excellent synergy between the LCD-2 & DACmini. I'm a new owner of the DACmini (1 Ohms option) and like it a lot with my headphones ( MS2i Woody, HD-650, SRH-940, Not tried the AD-W5000 yet ) and I do not have the LCD-2 on my short list (yet!) but was wondering if owners of the DACmini with other headphones can share their experience too. It's still too early for me to provide in depth analysis and I'm not very good at writing my musical experience (English is not my first language)  but so far I can say that I like how the music is portrayed. Neutral, good soundstage (Better than my Dacport) and better bass impact. Very good extension on both extreme.
   
  Cheer


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





twinster said:


> I have read the entire thread and the majority is about the excellent synergy between the LCD-2 & DACmini. I'm a new owner of the DACmini (1 Ohms option) and like it a lot with my headphones ( MS2i Woody, HD-650, SRH-940, Not tried the AD-W5000 yet ) and I do not have the LCD-2 on my short list (yet!) but was wondering if owners of the DACmini with other headphones can share their experience too. It's still too early for me to provide in depth analysis and I'm not very good at writing my musical experience (English is not my first language)  but so far I can say that I like how the music is portrayed. Neutral, good soundstage (Better than my Dacport) and better bass impact. Very good extension on both extreme.
> 
> Cheer


 


 Glad to hear your liking the DACmini.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





twinster said:


> I have read the entire thread and the majority is about the excellent synergy between the LCD-2 & DACmini. I'm a new owner of the DACmini (1 Ohms option) and like it a lot with my headphones ( MS2i Woody, HD-650, SRH-940, Not tried the AD-W5000 yet ) and I do not have the LCD-2 on my short list (yet!) but was wondering if owners of the DACmini with other headphones can share their experience too. It's still too early for me to provide in depth analysis and I'm not very good at writing my musical experience (English is not my first language)  but so far I can say that I like how the music is portrayed. Neutral, good soundstage (Better than my Dacport) and better bass impact. Very good extension on both extreme.
> 
> Cheer


 


  2 members posting impressions for Hifiman HE-500, read below the following post
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/551345/hifiman-he-500-he-as-in-high-end-please-post-your-impressions-loan-pair-for-uk-pg-28/735#post_7715771


----------



## roker

I like what I've heard in this thread.
   
  I'm about to join the family.
   
  I hope this is a good choice.
   
  -Ray
   
  Last question:  Will these bring the bass to life on my Denons?  I want my bass back and I plan to buy some more bass friendly headphones in the future, and maybe an AKG.
   
  I don't want a treble monster.


----------



## canyondust

I personally don't think there is much of a tilt either way with the DacMini... It's smooth, musical and fairly neutral in my opinion. When I think of the change it had in my system, I mostly noticed increased resolution and detail.... not to be confused with increased brightness (as that is how some companies achieve more perceived resolution and detail).
  The LCD-2s is what brought the bass to life in my system


----------



## bbrewer5

I just had the opportunity to get a few hours of listening in on a Dacmini my friend recently bought and broke in. I'm already sold, and going to order one with the 1ohm mod, and the variable out mod as well. I want mine to be black as everything on my desk, including my desk is black, but there is no way I can justify spending $200+ on a color. Thats 1/4th the price of the device itself.
  For reference, we both have Denon AH-D2000's. I plan on performing the markL mod on mine as well. I'm currently using a Headamp Pico (not the slim model). Its nice, but the Dacmini is on a different level.
   
  Does anyone have any idea why the black model cost $200 more? Seems kind of ridiculous. Oh well, I can live with the Apple Silver.


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





bbrewer5 said:


> I just had the opportunity to get a few hours of listening in on a Dacmini my friend recently bought and broke in. I'm already sold, and going to order one with the 1ohm mod, and the variable out mod as well. I want mine to be black as everything on my desk, including my desk is black, but there is no way I can justify spending $200+ on a color. Thats 1/4th the price of the device itself.
> For reference, we both have Denon AH-D2000's. I plan on performing the markL mod on mine as well. I'm currently using a Headamp Pico (not the slim model). Its nice, but the Dacmini is on a different level.
> 
> Does anyone have any idea why the black model cost $200 more? Seems kind of ridiculous. Oh well, I can live with the Apple Silver.


 
   
  Not sure why it costs $200 more... but perhaps it can be broken down and spray painted?


----------



## roker

I might have missed something, but why the 1 ohm mod?
   
  I'm considering the variable output mod only at this time because I have a nice pair of active speakers that need love.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> I might have missed something, but why the 1 ohm mod?
> 
> I'm considering the variable output mod only at this time because I have a nice pair of active speakers that need love.


 


  The 10 Ohm output resistance do affects considerable sound quality on the majority of IEMs and all other low impedance headphones. On LCD/HE-500 and other orthos, which are low impedance, the 10 Ohm output resistance should, in theory, not effect sound quality, but will lower maximum volume (about 2dB). HE-500 is said to need a more powerful amplifier than DACmini, so the extra 2 dB will likely be more beneficient.
   
  Anyway, I think that 1 Ohm output resistance should be the standard. Charging 100$ for this (and more 100$ for variable output) is *really* overpriced IMHO. About the 200$ for black color option, maybe it is justified because an extra process (black color dying ???) is added.
   
  I am trying to mod myself the 10 Ohm output and make it  even less than 1 Ohm. Although it is something that I do not recommend to anyone with no sufficient electronic skills (and an oscilloscope) I will post, when I am done, the procedure.  I am suprised that  I heard differences with HD-650. HD-650 is a 300 Ohm impedance phone and should not be effected by a mere 10 Ohm output resistance. But the difference, although small, was clearly audible. Bass got more controlled!


----------



## roker

Quote: 





bbrewer5 said:


> I just had the opportunity to get a few hours of listening in on a Dacmini my friend recently bought and broke in. I'm already sold, and going to order one with the 1ohm mod, and the variable out mod as well. I want mine to be black as everything on my desk, including my desk is black, but there is no way I can justify spending $200+ on a color. Thats 1/4th the price of the device itself.
> For reference, we both have Denon AH-D2000's. I plan on performing the markL mod on mine as well. I'm currently using a Headamp Pico (not the slim model). Its nice, but the Dacmini is on a different level.
> 
> Does anyone have any idea why the black model cost $200 more? Seems kind of ridiculous. Oh well, I can live with the Apple Silver.


 


  I'm running the D2000s as well, was the DacMini you listened to 1 ohm?


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





plin said:


> The 10 Ohm output resistance do affects considerable sound quality on the majority of IEMs and all other low impedance headphones. On LCD/HE-500 and other orthos, which are low impedance, the 10 Ohm output resistance should, in theory, not effect sound quality, but will lower maximum volume (about 2dB). HE-500 is said to need a more powerful amplifier than DACmini, so the extra 2 dB will likely be more beneficient.
> 
> Anyway, I think that 1 Ohm output resistance should be the standard. Charging 100$ for this (and more 100$ for variable output) is *really* overpriced IMHO. About the 200$ for black color option, maybe it is justified because an extra process (black color dying ???) is added.
> 
> I am trying to mod myself the 10 Ohm output and make it  even less than 1 Ohm. Although it is something that I do not recommend to anyone with no sufficient electronic skills (and an oscilloscope) I will post, when I am done, the procedure.  I am suprised that  I heard differences with HD-650. HD-650 is a 300 Ohm impedance phone and should not be effected by a mere 10 Ohm output resistance. But the difference, although small, was clearly audible. Bass got more controlled!


 

 Please do post your findings/procedure... I would be curious to compare the sonic differences between the 1Ohm and 10Ohm output impedance, but I'm not about to pay for international shipping + $100 to find out.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> Please do post your findings/procedure... I would be curious to compare the sonic differences between the 1Ohm and 10Ohm output impedance, but I'm not about to pay for international shipping + $100 to find out.


 

 That's what I thought also.
  The difference in sound with HD-650 is small, but audible. A more controlled bass.
  If you open DACmini you can easily find the two 10 ohm SMD 1watt (?) resistors. But if you don't have access to an oscilloscope (or better yet, a network analyser) I do not think it is wise to try to replace them with 1 Ohm. There is danger of oscillation (meaning sound degradation and even amp destruction). I will post the procedure (including pictures), but an oscilloscope and some basic analog electronic skills are necessary.   
  Maybe CEntrance is so kind that wants to tell us the exact circuit modification necessary to have a stable-with-every-load amp with 1 Ohm output resistance?  
  They do seem to have excellent after sales support!


----------



## Jay Listens

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> Not sure why it costs $200 more... but perhaps it can be broken down and spray painted?


 
   
  It's not just a paint but the way that the black chassis is anodized plus the addition of a scratch resistant coating. It's the same upgraded chassis we are using for the DACmini PX. We decided to offer this to our CX customers as an option, and as always we do appreciate the feedback!


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> It's not just a paint but the way that the black chassis is anodized plus the addition of a scratch resistant coating. It's the same upgraded chassis we are using for the DACmini PX. We decided to offer this to our CX customers as an option, and as always we do appreciate the feedback!


 

 I wasn't suggestion the Centrance treatment was jsut spraypaint, but I was suggesting it might be an easy DIY way to make a dacmini black


----------



## canyondust

I'm so loving my DacMini right now... I've taken it to a few studios now, and plug it straight into the optical out of their pro tools rigs. As a unit it's really quite light.... the DacMini and LCD-2 headphones are going to be my reference system for a long time to come I feel (and I have Q-audio headphone cables arriving tomorrow). Now I just need to buy a pelican case I can pack both the headphones and dacmini into and I've got a very elegant travel setup!


----------



## markkr

Slightly offtopic, but does the DACport also have a high ohm output resistance which would be bad for IEM's and low imp headphones?
   
  Thanks


----------



## roker

Quote: 





plin said:


> They do seem to have excellent after sales support!


 

 That's the 2nd biggest factor in my decision to purchase the product.  The first biggest factor has been all the positive feedback I've seen on here and elsewhere concerning the device.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





markkr said:


> Slightly offtopic, but does the DACport also have a high ohm output resistance which would be bad for IEM's and low imp headphones?
> 
> Thanks


 


  Yes, according to published specs it has the same 10 Ohm output resistance.


----------



## soulrider4ever

So first impression is good, the DAC is definitely a refined sound and the jitter reduction is clearly better than most DACS.  Seems to tighten up the bass over other amps so it's not as 'bloated' in sound; seems to be a pretty good overall balance of highs/lows/mids, it's def. a great pairing - as they say it's all about synergy.  Thanks for the recommendations.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





soulrider4ever said:


> So first impression is good, the DAC is definitely a refined sound and the jitter reduction is clearly better than most DACS.  Seems to tighten up the bass over other amps so it's not as 'bloated' in sound; seems to be a pretty good overall balance of highs/lows/mids, it's def. a great pairing - as they say it's all about synergy.  Thanks for the recommendations.


 
  I see to your signature that you also have Anedio D1. How do you compare the two? Is Anedio really so much better as the raving reviews say?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I am still very happy with my DACmini.  I keep it in my bedroom rig next to a lot of other very nice gear, including an Apogee mini-DAC feeding an HEV-70 looped out to Woo WA6 and eXStatA amp with loop out into SAC KH1000 amp, a Marantz CD5001 feeding an EF5 amp, a Nuforce HDP feeding an ALO Amphora amp, a Sony portable CD and iRiver H140 with optical out feeding a Headroom Micro DAC and Amp, and I feed the DACmini RCA out into my RSA SR-71b balanced amp.
   
  But the items that get the most use are the DACmini and SR-71b.  If I was forced to sell ALL the other gear in my bedroom rig except these two items and the Stat amp I wouldn't miss the other stuff.  I've posted my thoughts in several posts in this thread, and I want to link to them here until I get my final review done.  I'll be trying to consolidate those thoughts and more into a single review in the review section soon.
   
  First Post http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/75#post_7325679 and quoted below:
   
   
  Quote: 





> I'm surprised I never saw this thread before.  It will take some time for me to read it all, but in the meantime, here are some links to other posts I've written about the DACmini.
> 
> RMAF 2010 Impressions Thread has basically a mini-review of the DACmini:
> 
> ...


 
   
  Then http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/75#post_7330118
   
   
  Quote: 





> MORE IMPRESSIONS:
> 
> I posted some of this in a PM to another head-fi member, but wanted to say that *since I got the DACmini in February I've listened to the LCD-2 headphones more in the past 4 weeks than I did in the previous 6 months because of the improved synergy with LCD-2* over my other amps.  Prior to this my $1000 ALO Amphora was my best amp with the LCD-2, followed by the HDP.  But the DACmini has taken the lead.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





> I'm starting to think that it I only had the DACport / DACmini / SR-71b, plus the HE-6/5LE / LCD-2, along with the ES5 / JH13Pro that I'd be perfectly happy most of the time with this as my home rig.  For portable I mostly use the HM-602 or iPhone 4 with Pico Slim, for driving my ES5 or Westone 4 IEM.
> 
> 
> Currently I mostly listen to my Macbook Pro > DACmini > LCD-2.  That's closely followed by the DACmini > SR-71b balanced amp > HE-6, HE-5 LE, JH13Pro and ES5 (all balanced).  After that I also spend a good bit of time with my Macbook Pro > DACport > ES5 or HE-5 LE.  Occasional my LA7000 headphones come out when I don't want to disturb my wife but not be totally isolated by using IEM.


 
   
  And http://www.head-fi.org/t/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/135#post_7413188
   
   
  Quote: 





> Well, so far I am still quite pleased with the DACmini since I posted my last impressions here in March. It's definitely a permanent fixture in my home.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/360#post_7534298
   
   
  Quote: 





> Well, I am absolutely certain now that I prefer the DACmini headphone output to drive my JH13Pro custom IEM vs my balanced SR-71b or Pico Slim amps (even with DACmini RCA out feeding the other amps).  The dynamic headroom is greater, and the power output without distortion is higher.  Plus, it awakens the JH13Pro mids that seem slightly lacking with the Pico Slim, and improves the bass impact and depth over the SR-71b.  It's the closest I've heard to my Woo WA6 or Eddie Current ZDT driving the JH13Pro, both of which I previously reported were my favorites with the JH13Pro.


 
   
  So, that's it for now but I'll write more in my final review later.  I'll just end by saying that this little DAC/amp is a true marvel in terms of price/performance ratio.  It performs on a similar level to my Apogee mini-DAC > Maxed Woo WA6 at less than half the cost.


----------



## DanBa

Could you compare the DACmini against the balanced SR-71b when driving the LCD-2?
  Thanks.
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> But the items that get the most use are the DACmini and SR-71b.  If I was forced to sell ALL the other gear in my bedroom rig except these two items and the Stat amp I wouldn't miss the other stuff.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I am still very happy with my DACmini.  I keep it in my bedroom rig next to a lot of other very nice gear, including an Apogee mini-DAC feeding an HEV-70 looped out to Woo WA6 and eXStatA amp with loop out into SAC KH1000 amp, a Marantz CD5001 feeding an EF5 amp, a Nuforce HDP feeding an ALO Amphora amp, a Sony portable CD and iRiver H140 with optical out feeding a Headroom Micro DAC and Amp, and I feed the DACmini RCA out into my RSA SR-71b balanced amp.
> 
> But the items that get the most use are the DACmini and SR-71b.  If I was forced to sell ALL the other gear in my bedroom rig except these two items and the Stat amp I wouldn't miss the other stuff.  I've posted my thoughts in several posts in this thread, and I want to link to them here until I get my final review done.  I'll be trying to consolidate those thoughts and more into a single review in the review section soon .............................


 


   
  Very good impressions -detailed almost as a complete review-. Waiting for your final review, something tells me it would be very interesting!


----------



## roker

This may sound weird, but from the sound of Larry's comments, this sounds more like a reference type piece.  I'm not saying that's bad, but I was hoping for more "fun" or analogish sounding gear.
   
  Then again, it also sounds like it'd be a great match up for darker headphones (dark headphones + brighter/airy amp/dac = flavor?)
   
  I'm usually in agreement with Larry, but I don't care for the NuForce house sound.  I'm glad this is preferred over the HDP, but I'm not entirely sure what it means.
   
  I'll know on Tuesday (shipping is taking longer than expected).
   
  edit: I do like the NuForce Icon Mobile, but it's mostly for it's versitlity, size, and price.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





plin said:


> Very good impressions -detailed almost as a complete review-. Waiting for your final review, something tells me it would be very interesting!


 
   
  Quote: 





roker said:


> This may sound weird, but from the sound of Larry's comments, this sounds more like a reference type piece.  I'm not saying that's bad, but I was hoping for more "fun" or analogish sounding gear.
> 
> Then again, it also sounds like it'd be a great match up for darker headphones (dark headphones + brighter/airy amp/dac = flavor?)
> 
> ...


 

  
  Quote: 





danba said:


> Could you compare the DACmini against the balanced SR-71b when driving the LCD-2?
> Thanks.


 

  
  I just posted this in the SR-71b thread, and thought that would be useful here.
   
   
  Quote *HeadphoneAddict*: 





> Before I go on, I should note that I have 49 year old ears.  Also, I only use the SR-71b in balanced output mode, but I don't have a balanced input cable yet.
> 
> When I first got the SR-71b it was slightly more aggressive sounding than totally neutral, but much less aggressive sounding than my Protector.  Over time it did mellow out and become very transparent and uncolored, and I used it most of the time with my HE-6 and JH-13Pro.  I currently find that my DACmini > SR-71b > LCD-2 *rev1*/Silver Dragon is a little darker sounding than the LCD-2 right out of the DACmini headphone jack, but it's certainly not too dark or too bright.  I do prefer the DACmini headphone out just a little more if I'm using my LCD-2; however, the SR-71b pairs up with my HE-500/HE-6 cable just a little better than they do with the DACmini.  It's all about synergy.
> 
> And my SR-71b is also great with my balanced HD600, HD800 and HE-6.  Even my Westone ES5 which have a little stronger top end than my JH-13Pro pair up well with the SR-71b and TWag V2 Eclipse balanced cable.  So for me, I'm betting I'd still be happy with an LCD-2 rev2 with my SR-71b.  I don't find many phones that the SR-71b doesn't get along with nicely.


 
   
  Also, the SR-71b in balanced mode can achieve a little higher listening volumes than the DACmini with LCD-2, but either one can damage your hearing.  I've posted many times that I thought the LCD-2 rev1 were a little darker than I like, and while the DACmini is not a bright amp it seems to bring out the treble and clarity in the LCD-2 a little better than some other amps (like my ZDT).
   
  For roker - I'll add to this that the HDP headphone amp sounded exactly like my RSA Protector in balanced mode, but with more power.  The HDP and Protector had a slightly aggressive sound signature that worked great with HD600, HE-5 LE, and LCD-2, but could be a little harsh with brighter phones like HD800 and HE-6.  The SR-71b had a hint of that sound signature out of the box, and it pretty much went away with burn-in.  Even out of the box the SR-71b was much better with aggressive or bright headphones than the HDP or Protector.  But that sound signature of the HDP is one thing that makes it one of my favorite "budget" amps with the HD600 or LCD-2 rev1 for instance.  For HE-500 and HE-6 I'd rather feed the HDP DAC into an EF5 amp than listen for long periods with the built-in amp.
   
  In contrast, the DACmini is a warm sounding amp, but really has almost no sound signature of it's own.  It seems utterly transparent and spacious, and tends to disappear and get out of the way, but it never does this at the expense of being too neutral, analytical or cold.  One reason I've kept my 4 year old maxed Woo WA6 with pseudo dual power supply was that it had this ability, and it could just about beat or match every other budget amp under $1000 that I tried (except in it's modest power levels).  The DACmini is another one of those marvels that performs above it's pay grade, and it competes well with my Apogee mini-DAC Sigma 11 PSU > Woo WA6 combo for a bit less than half the price, while offering slightly more power output with low impedance phones.  And, it can be "fun" with the right phones, like my JH-13Pro, LCD-2 rev1 or D7000/LA7000.  
   
  Another thing to note is that the HDP does improve noticeably with a Sigma 11 PSU, and it loses a lot of that "house sound" by losing the cheap switching PSU.  But that brings up the cost much closer to the DACmini, at which point I prefer the DACmini's superior low volume channel balance at extremely quiet listening levels. I also like that one can switch between 4 devices on the DACmini, while the HDP is limited to 3 at one time (if using the HDP 3.5mm jack it either disables the RCA input or Coax input depending on what you plug into it).


----------



## DanBa

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Also, I only use the SR-71b in balanced output mode, but I don't have a balanced input cable yet.
> 
> When I first got the SR-71b it was slightly more aggressive sounding than totally neutral, but much less aggressive sounding than my Protector.  Over time it did mellow out and become very transparent and uncolored, and I used it most of the time with my HE-6 and JH-13Pro.  I currently find that my DACmini > SR-71b > LCD-2 *rev1*/Silver Dragon is a little darker sounding than the LCD-2 right out of the DACmini headphone jack, but it's certainly not too dark or too bright.  I do prefer the DACmini headphone out just a little more if I'm using my LCD-2; however, the SR-71b pairs up with my HE-500/HE-6 cable just a little better than they do with the DACmini.  It's all about synergy.  And my SR-71b is also great with my balanced HD600, HD800 and HE-6.  Even my Westone ES5 which have a little stronger top end than my JH-13Pro pair up well with the SR-71b and TWag V2 Eclipse balanced cable.  So for me, I'm betting I'd still be happy with an LCD-2 rev2 with my SR-71b.  I don't find many phones that the SR-71b doesn't get along with nicely.


 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ptrok

>Headphone Addict- I was wondering if the Dacmini benefits from an alternative psu at all. I have the Dacmini and cinsidering your experience with other psu for other amps I was just curious about your opinion on this.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





ptrok said:


> >Headphone Addict- I was wondering if the Dacmini benefits from an alternative psu at all. I have the Dacmini and cinsidering your experience with other psu for other amps I was just curious about your opinion on this.


 

  
According to the manufacturer, no, because DACmini uses a special isolation technology that minimizes effects of lower quality PSU, so there is no need to use a better one:
   


 [td]  [/td] 
 [td] External Power​
[/td] 
 [td]  Whether powered from the wall, or from a DC source, such as a car, boat or a battery, DACmini makes full use of the external power, generating isolated +/-15V voltage rails inside the unit and feeding that to all internal analog circuitry. A full 30V of clean power lowers the noise and reduces distortion. DACmini is flexible with regard to the external power supply. This comes from our experience designing professional equipment for our broadcast customers, who don't always have the right power supply nearby, yet the show must go on. DACmini can take any power supply with +9...19V DC (1A), giving you extra flexibility and peace of mind.

[/td]


----------



## roker

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict*
> /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> In contrast, the DACmini is a warm sounding amp, but really has almost no sound signature of it's own.  It seems utterly transparent and spacious, and tends to disappear and get out of the way, but it never does this at the expense of being too neutral, analytical or cold.


 
   
  Thank you. 
   
  These are words I like to hear.
   
  I have 45 days to return it, but I'm hoping this works out for me.
   
  I may not have the experience you do under your belt, but I'll write a simple review and post here in about 2 weeks.
   
  The test for me is my speakers which are not as forgiving as my D2000s when it comes to source.


----------



## ptrok

>plin- thanks for the info, I appreciate the response.


----------



## roker

I'm trying my hardest to not post a "wowie this is awesome" post
   
  but man, is it awesome so far.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ptrok said:


> >Headphone Addict- I was wondering if the Dacmini benefits from an alternative psu at all. I have the Dacmini and cinsidering your experience with other psu for other amps I was just curious about your opinion on this.


 
   
  Quote: 





plin said:


> According to the manufacturer, no, because DACmini uses a special isolation technology that minimizes effects of lower quality PSU, so there is no need to use a better one:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





roker said:


> Thank you.
> 
> These are words I like to hear.
> 
> ...


 

 I have that 15v Sigma 11 for my Nuforce HDP, which does make a very noticeable differece in the sound.  So I tried the S11 a while back with the DACmini, after confirming that it was (+) center tip like my HDP, but I didn't think there was very much difference in sound.  I wanted to imagine that it sounded a little more organic and transparent with the S11 PSU, but I couldn't reliably with certainty pick which PSU I was using each time, when swapping plugs without looking to see which one I was using.  It absolutely wont make it sound worse, for sure, and if there was an improvement with the S11 it was fairly subtle and I don't think that I would invest $250 on a PSU for such a subtle improvement in sound.  This was with a brief 1-2 hours of listening one night, and I'd probably need to try the S11 for a week or longer and then switch back to the stock PSU to see if there is a noticeable drop in sound quality after acclimating my ears to the S11.
   
  Now, my Apogee mini-DAC is not supposed to benefit from an upgraded PSU either, but I bought it from Iron_Dreamer with an included 12v S11 PSU.  When it arrived the S11's transformer in side had come loose from it's mounts and it pulled some wires loose, so I used it with the stock PSU for a week or two until I could repair it.  When I finally switched to the S11 I found the Apogee to have a more refined sound with a fuller bass response.  So, it's always worth trying a better PSU, because it might indeed help.
   
  Note, here is what Apogee said about using an upgraded PSU, back in 2008: "Thank you for your email.  There is not a lot of merit to doing this. The external power supply is just a "raw" power supply. The actual power supply is inside the unit. It chops up the externally supplied power, converts and regulates it to all voltages required to operate the converter. It does not draw more than 7 watts, which is half of  the included external power supply's capacity. I cannot think of any advantage of having a bigger power supply."


----------



## roker

[size=medium]Totally ridiculous and unnecessary.  I bring to you my CEntrance DACmini unboxing video.  I usually say this is pointless but I find my self looking for them on youtube all the time. I noticed there were barely any CEntrance DACmini vids in general and thought I'd give it a stab.  Now I know it won't top that Auditor vid posted last week, but I'll try my hardest.  Enjoy!
   
   
   




​[/size]

   
  (I took this from my thread ... seemed no one cared.)


----------



## roker

This dac/amp is a total gateway drug.
   
  If the dacport is near/close to the sound the DACmini produces, then I might buy one just to have around.


----------



## tinseljim

Just in case you missed it the DACmini just won a Blue Moon award on 6moons:
   
  http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/centrance/1.html
   
  Brilliant, though doesn't say a lot about the Head-Fi angle and how it compares to others. I did skim read though so could have missed it.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





tinseljim said:


> Just in case you missed it the DACmini just won a Blue Moon award on 6moons:
> 
> http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/centrance/1.html
> 
> Brilliant, though doesn't say a lot about the Head-Fi angle and how it compares to others. I did skim read though so could have missed it.


 

 That's what solid engineering can do!


----------



## roker

Quote: 





tinseljim said:


> Just in case you missed it the DACmini just won a Blue Moon award on 6moons:
> 
> http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/centrance/1.html
> 
> Brilliant, though doesn't say a lot about the Head-Fi angle and how it compares to others. I did skim read though so could have missed it.


 


 I'm not a fan of 6moons, but I am a fan of a great sounding piece of audio equipment.

 After spending the weekend with it, I can't help but feel like I've been missing out for too long.
   
  Oh and congrats to the CEntrance guys.  Talk about some hard working fellas (and gals?)  Great customer service, great product.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





tinseljim said:


> Just in case you missed it the DACmini just won a Blue Moon award on 6moons:
> 
> http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/centrance/1.html
> 
> Brilliant, though doesn't say a lot about the Head-Fi angle and how it compares to others. I did skim read though so could have missed it.


 

 They deserve that award.  Like I said, the DACmini alone gives my Apogee mini-DAC > maxed Woo WA6 a run for the money, for a lot less than half the cost ($795 vs $2000 used, after upgraded tubes).  
   
  While I enjoy listening to one rig about as much as the other, I use the DACmini significantly more in my bedroom rig because I don't have to warm up any tubes to get great sound.  Before I got the DACmini I used the Apogee's headphone out while waiting for the WA6 tubes to warm up.  The Apogee mini-DAC's headphone jack sounds very good, but it's not as refined sounding and has a shallower soundstage than the DACmini's (or WA6) headphone out.  So not only is the DACmini better to use as an amp while the tubes warm up, but it's been good enough that I haven't needed to warm up the WA6 much lately.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> They deserve that award.  Like I said, the DACmini alone gives my Apogee mini-DAC > maxed Woo WA6 a run for the money, for a lot less than half the cost ($795 vs $2000 used, after upgraded tubes).
> 
> While I enjoy listening to one rig about as much as the other, I use the DACmini significantly more in my bedroom rig because I don't have to warm up any tubes to get great sound.  Before I got the DACmini I used the Apogee's headphone out while waiting for the WA6 tubes to warm up.  The Apogee mini-DAC's headphone jack sounds very good, but it's not as refined sounding and has a shallower soundstage than the DACmini's (or WA6) headphone out.  So not only is the DACmini better to use as an amp while the tubes warm up, but it's been good enough that I haven't needed to warm up the WA6 much lately.


 


 You know, I spent some time the other day reading about the 10 things that went into the design of this product and a lot of it is simple yet practical BUT the difference is execution.  The case might look sparse on the inside, but the way they seperated everything and the technology behind it really make this amp shine.  Had they tried to fit everything into a smaller case and perhaps put the entire amp/dac configuration on one PCB, I don't think the same results would've been replicated.


----------



## tinseljim

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> They deserve that award.  Like I said, the DACmini alone gives my Apogee mini-DAC > maxed Woo WA6 a run for the money, for a lot less than half the cost ($795 vs $2000 used, after upgraded tubes).
> 
> While I enjoy listening to one rig about as much as the other, I use the DACmini significantly more in my bedroom rig because I don't have to warm up any tubes to get great sound.  Before I got the DACmini I used the Apogee's headphone out while waiting for the WA6 tubes to warm up.  The Apogee mini-DAC's headphone jack sounds very good, but it's not as refined sounding and has a shallower soundstage than the DACmini's (or WA6) headphone out.  So not only is the DACmini better to use as an amp while the tubes warm up, but it's been good enough that I haven't needed to warm up the WA6 much lately.


 

 That really is high praise. Are there any comparisons to other preamps? If using the DACmini as dac/preamp?


----------



## chirawatf

Jay Listens please check your PM.
   
  Thank you


----------



## soulrider4ever

Quote: 





plin said:


> I see to your signature that you also have Anedio D1. How do you compare the two? Is Anedio really so much better as the raving reviews say?


 


 Honestly - the Anedio is pretty amazing; but the headphone amp is average at best.  The Dacmini is much better as a headphone amp/dac combo.  In terms of raw DAC performance, it's really close the DACmini is really really good, I'd say the Anedio might produce a slightly clearer sound; but it's barely noticable in difference.  If the DACmini had a remote control I'd consider using it in my stereo setup, but for now it's staying at work with the LCD-2's


----------



## TheMiddleSky

Quote: 





soulrider4ever said:


> Honestly - the Anedio is pretty amazing; but the headphone amp is average at best.  The Dacmini is much better as a headphone amp/dac combo.  In terms of raw DAC performance, it's really close the DACmini is really really good, I'd say the Anedio might produce a slightly clearer sound; but it's barely noticable in difference.  If the DACmini had a remote control I'd consider using it in my stereo setup, but for now it's staying at work with the LCD-2's


 


  whoa, it's surprising me a lot after read some really good reviews about Anedio D1 (the things that I really curious actually, as I love DAC+Amp in 1 box solution)
   
  between them, which one has better power and build quality?


----------



## plin

Quote: 





soulrider4ever said:


> Honestly - the Anedio is pretty amazing; but the headphone amp is average at best.  The Dacmini is much better as a headphone amp/dac combo.  In terms of raw DAC performance, it's really close the DACmini is really really good, I'd say the Anedio might produce a slightly clearer sound; but it's barely noticable in difference.  If the DACmini had a remote control I'd consider using it in my stereo setup, but for now it's staying at work with the LCD-2's


 

 Thank you for your comparison between the two. It seems that DACmini can compete even the big guys!


----------



## roker

Quote:


themiddlesky said:


> whoa, it's surprising me a lot after read some really good reviews about Anedio D1 (the things that I really curious actually, as I love DAC+Amp in 1 box solution)
> 
> between them, which one has better power and build quality?


 

 This is probably the best built Amp or DAC I've ever owned.
   
  Not to bad mouth other Chinese electronics, but besides the great build quality (nice knobs, smooth pot, good switch, nice finish), it looks really nice on your desktop.  It looks more like a consumer device than a "scare-the-chicks-away" nerd piece.


----------



## koonhua90

I am officially in the club now. This little thing gives off quite a bit of heat, living up to the name of Class A amp.
   
  With the JH16, the noise floor is a bit higher than I expected. Will have to see if it will still be noisy with a bigger headphone. When turning the volume knob, there is some noise too, but I am nit-picking here.
   
  Overall very neutral, and has a darker background than my Sflo2 + Arrow amp, even though it's noisier (guess it's due to better separation, and imaging). I always feel that the lower mid is a bit sucked out on the Sflo2 and the Arrow amp, in this regard DACmini is much better. Vocals sounds amazingly smooth and natural on the DACmini.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> I am officially in the club now. This little thing gives off quite a bit of heat, living up to the name of Class A amp.
> 
> With the JH16, the noise floor is a bit higher than I expected. Will have to see if it will still be noisy with a bigger headphone. When turning the volume knob, there is some noise too, but I am nit-picking here.


 


 I wonder if that has to do with your IEMs because my Denon's are dead silent.  Even when turning the knob or when there is no music playing.


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





roker said:


> I wonder if that has to do with your IEMs because my Denon's are dead silent.  Even when turning the knob or when there is no music playing.


 

 I don't think so. It makes the same noise with the Etymotic earphone too. The DACmini is not designed to be used with very sensitive earphones in the first place anyway, so I can't blame it for the noise and slight channel imbalance.
   
  It could also be the noise in the AC power, which I think is the case. I gotta go to basement and check if there is a proper ground.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> I don't think so. It makes the same noise with the Etymotic earphone too. The DACmini is not designed to be used with very sensitive earphones in the first place anyway, so I can't blame it for the noise and slight channel imbalance.
> 
> It could also be the noise in the AC power, which I think is the case. I gotta go to basement and check if there is a proper ground.


 


  that blows my mind.  I've had plenty noisy equpment and this is the most silent I've ever owned.  Isn't your etymotic an IEM as well?


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





roker said:


> that blows my mind.  I've had plenty noisy equpment and this is the most silent I've ever owned.  Isn't your etymotic an IEM as well?


 
   
  Yes, Etymotic only makes IEM. 

 Well I am in my 20s, so my ears are still sensitive. I need a good desktop DAC and DACmini fits the bill, the headphone out of my desktop is too noisy to plug earphones into it. I think with full size headphone I won't hear anything.
   
  Can't wait to see what new headphone Audez'e is gonna release, if not I'd have gotten the LCD-2 last week.
   
  Despite the noise, it drives the JH16 beautifully


----------



## roker

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> Yes, Etymotic only makes IEM.
> Well I am in my 20s, so my ears are still sensitive. I need a good desktop DAC and DACmini fits the bill, the headphone out is too noisy to plug earphones into it. I think with full size headphone I won't hear anything.
> 
> Can't wait to see what new headphone Audez'e is gonna release, if not I'd have gotten the LCD-2 last week.
> ...


 


  ok, is there a chance you have a defective unit?
   
  Can other people chime in to agree/disagree?


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





roker said:


> ok, is there a chance you have a defective unit?
> 
> Can other people chime in to agree/disagree?


 

 If you read through this thread there are numerous posts, myself included, who found that with more sensitive IEM's there's a certain amount of background noise. The overall level of noise will be dependent on the sensitivity of the phones themselves, for me it was most apparent with Triple.Fi's but not noticeable at all with LCD-2's.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





elnero said:


> If you read through this thread there are numerous posts, myself included, who found that with more sensitive IEM's there's a certain amount of background noise. The overall level of noise will be dependent on the sensitivity of the phones themselves, for me it was most apparent with Triple.Fi's but not noticeable at all with LCD-2's.


 


  cool. (I mean not cool, but ...)
   
  I just wanted to make sure the user about didn't have a bad unit.
   
  I've never had a more silent amp.  But not a big IEM guy (Only on-the-go listening).
   
  Does that 1 Ohm mod help?  Not that I have interest in doing it as for me, it's "just right".


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





roker said:


> cool. (I mean not cool, but ...)
> 
> I just wanted to make sure the user about didn't have a bad unit.
> 
> ...


 

 No idea, I suspect not because I had the 1 ohm mod in the one I owned myself and I know some of the other people who have mentioned the noise don't have the mod.


----------



## koonhua90

Shouldn't the output impedance be raised to lessen the noise? I have edited my post to make sure there's no misunderstanding. The headphone out of my desktop is too noisy (the original post sounded like I meant that the DACmini HO is too noisy). The DACmini has slight noise to it, I can live with it as long as I don't try to be too picky.
   
  Eventually I might get some quieter amp, possibly some of the Meier Audio ones, if I can't stand the noise or channel imbalance.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> Shouldn't the output impedance be raised to lessen the noise?


 

  
  From my understanding raising the output impedance might help with noise but would have a potential detrimental effect on some lower impedance phones, this is what's behind the school of thought that the closer the output impedance is to 0 the better, ideally it would be 1 ohm or lower.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





elnero said:


> From my understanding raising the output impedance might help with noise but would have a potential detrimental effect on some lower impedance phones, this is what's behind the school of thought that the closer the output impedance is to 0 the better, ideally it would be 1 ohm or lower.


 


  True! Also the sound attenuation by the 10 Ohm resistance is quite small (less than 4dB in most IEMs) so noise attenuation is also small. And the added detrimental effect would by huge!


----------



## K3cT

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> *Shouldn't the output impedance be raised to lessen the noise? I have edited my post to make sure there's no misunderstanding.* The headphone out of my desktop is too noisy (the original post sounded like I meant that the DACmini HO is too noisy). The DACmini has slight noise to it, I can live with it as long as I don't try to be too picky.
> 
> Eventually I might get some quieter amp, possibly some of the Meier Audio ones, if I can't stand the noise or channel imbalance.


 


  That is correct but a higher impedance output will theoretically give lower performance with low-impedance loads.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





k3ct said:


> That is correct but a higher impedance output will *theoretically *give lower performance with low-impedance loads.


 


  I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to get to, but my Denon D2000s sound great with this amp, vanilla.
   
  in fact, I have no desire to change anything except getting the variable output mod.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





tinseljim said:


> That really is high praise. Are there any comparisons to other preamps? If using the DACmini as dac/preamp?


 

 In previous testing my mini-DAC sounded very similar to the Apogee Duet via headphone out and line out, so the DACmini should pass over the Duet headphone out, but I'm not sure yet if I can say the DACmini passes up the Apogee via the line-out.  If I had to guess the DACmini at least as good as the Stello DA100 as a DAC, via optical and coax, and the USB is a bit better than the Stello.  Vs the DA100 I very slightly preferred my Apogee.  Some day I will try to clear out a spot on the dining table and hook up both the Apogee and DACmini to a nice amp, and switch between them to better get a feeling for the differences side by side.  Note - my DACmini is not a preamp, having the fixed outputs.  
   
  Vs my Nuforce HDP (side by side) the DACmini headphone out is a little more holographic sounding, and the frequency response is more balanced and less aggressive sounding.  The Nuforce line-out comes a bit closer than the headphone-out does, but it's still not as refined and organic sounding as the Apogee or DACmini.  The HDP is not bad, and it's amp sounds identical to my old $475 balanced RSA Protector, but it's not on the same level.  See my 2010 RMAF ompressions for a direct comparison between the two at the show.  With a $250 Sigma 11 PSU the HDP actually gets close to the DACmini - but HDP is still slightly behind and doesn't have as nice of a volume control for low volume listening with IEM.  
   
  My PS Audio Perfectwave DAC/preamp is on a whole new level of performance vs these.  I don't have any others to compare to.


----------



## dookie182

ok guys,
  a little comment here cause I'm really trying to think about this synergy factor between dac/amp and cans.
  I've recieved my dacmini about 5 month ago and I have to say that I'm not that excited about it that most of you guys seems to be.
  I'm currently having a beyer DT990 pro (250ohm) and an AKG K501 and if I agree with lots of technical points (black background, good articulation, extension, instrument separation, tight bass, sweet mids....) in the same time I find it a little bit flat, thin and cold. lacking body, involvment and kind of sterile sounding... throug these cans at least, don't get me wrong.
  So now I'm wondering if i should either sell it or pull the trigger on a pair of LCD2.
  any advise is welcome
  kindest regards


----------



## roker

Quote: 





dookie182 said:


> ok guys,
> a little comment here cause I'm really trying to think about this synergy factor between dac/amp and cans.
> I've recieved my dacmini about 5 month ago and I have to say that I'm not that excited about it that most of you guys seems to be.
> I'm currently having a beyer DT990 pro (250ohm) and an AKG K501 and if I agree with lots of technical points (black background, good articulation, extension, instrument separation, tight bass, sweet mids....) in the same time I find it a little bit flat, thin and cold. lacking body, involvment and kind of sterile sounding... throug these cans at least, don't get me wrong.
> ...


 

  I wish I could comment on the 990s, but I will say that my cans are bass friendly and that may be one of the reasons the pairing of the D2000s and the DACmini works so well.
   
  Also, one thing I've noticed about the sound is that it is very transparent, which may lead some people to assume it's thin.  If the original recording didn't have a lot of push in the sub-bass area, then don't expect the DACMini to "fill in the blanks."  As some other amps and/or dacs have done for me in the past, but at the expense of presenting the music as it was originally intended to sound.
   
  It seems there's always tradeoffs.  Perhaps this isn't the sound you're looking for.  If you want deeper bass, you usually sacrifice some detail or texture in the process.  I'd give it another shot with the LCD2s if you can though.


----------



## dookie182

thank you rocker for your insight,
  I'll try to test other headphones with it and see how it goes.
  thanks ;-}


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





dookie182 said:


> ok guys,
> a little comment here cause I'm really trying to think about this synergy factor between dac/amp and cans.
> I've recieved my dacmini about 5 month ago and I have to say that I'm not that excited about it that most of you guys seems to be.
> I'm currently having a beyer DT990 pro (250ohm) and an AKG K501 and if I agree with lots of technical points (black background, good articulation, extension, instrument separation, tight bass, sweet mids....) in the same time I find it a little bit flat, thin and cold. lacking body, involvment and kind of sterile sounding... throug these cans at least, don't get me wrong.
> ...


 

 It's your cans - buy the LCD-2 or HE-500 and you'll be happier.  If you don't sell the old cans, you'll need a hybrid amp with really warm sounding tubes.


----------



## DanBa

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> It's your cans - buy the LCD-2 or HE-500 and you'll be happier.


 


  Which one do you prefer with a DACmini?
  Thanks.


----------



## dookie182

thanks for your point of view larry.
  Your advises are always highly respected (in my book !)
  I'm too thinking that it shurely is a can problem.
  I guess I'll have to start saving money... my wallet will hate me!
  kindest regard.
  Q


----------



## Twinster

I'm using my Alessandro MS-Pro with the DACmini and like it as much as DACmini/MAD EAR+ Purist HD combo. Don't have to warm the tubes anymore. It's also very good with the HD-650 for anyone interested.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





danba said:


> Which one do you prefer with a DACmini?
> Thanks.


 

 I like both, with the HE-500 being a little more open and forward, with a little better treble than my re-cabled LCD-2 rev1.  The HE-500 sound a lot like my vintage Stax Lambda Nova Signature on my KGSS amp, but the HE-500 have a little better bass control, definition and impact and no upper mids etch.  The LCD-2 are a warmer sounding can with a deeper soundstage due to the less pronounced upper mids and treble, which you may not like as much.


----------



## fatpooh

HI, Im a week old owner of the Dacmini and I sure am impressed with what this little box can deliver.. Btw, Im pairing it up with my Ms2i and I have to say that I love the instrumental separation and the expansion of the soundstage. I used to find the Ms2i a little too forward but now it sounds a lot smoother.. Anyway I'm thinking about jumping in and getting the LCD-3 that has just been released.. But Im not sure if Dacmini is able to drive them well.. I know it drives the LCD-2's well but anyone here tried pairing them up with the LCD-3? What do you guys think?


----------



## roker

It's a pretty powerful amplifier.  I'd say off hand it should be fine.
   
  But if push comes to shove you could always send it to CEntrance and have them raise the gain on it (for a price).


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





fatpooh said:


> HI, Im a week old owner of the Dacmini and I sure am impressed with what this little box can deliver.. Btw, Im pairing it up with my Ms2i and I have to say that I love the instrumental separation and the expansion of the soundstage. I used to find the Ms2i a little too forward but now it sounds a lot smoother.. Anyway I'm thinking about jumping in and getting the LCD-3 that has just been released.. But Im not sure if Dacmini is able to drive them well.. I know it drives the LCD-2's well but anyone here tried pairing them up with the LCD-3? What do you guys think?


 

 I briefly tried the DACmini that was feeding the Cavalli Audio Liquid Fire amp at the Audeze table at RMAF, using LCD-3.  I though it was pretty good with them, although it was eclipsed by the LF amp, and also by an Eddie Current 2A3 at the table as well (diff source).  But those amps cost 3-4x as much as the DACmini, and they didn't totally blow it away although the improvement was noticeable in refinement and musicality.


----------



## jisu

Wonder how the Dacmini PX fares against the LA-200 and Decco2. Do you guys think the premium in price is worth it?


----------



## SilentSound

The PX has arrived  mini review later.. for now just a picture....


----------



## plin

Quote: 





silentsound said:


> The PX has arrived


 

 Congrats and happy listening! Black looks very classy.


----------



## FOXY

How the CEntrance DACmini compare to ‪Burson HA-160D?


----------



## scottv50

Quote: 





foxy said:


> How the CEntrance DACmini compare to ‪Burson HA-160D?


 


  Seems like there are quite a few people after this same information, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of opinions. There are a few, such as a review on headfonia but other than that information is pretty scarce.


----------



## FOXY

Thanks for the info, anyone checked how the device functions as pre amplifier?


----------



## roker

Quote: 





foxy said:


> Thanks for the info, anyone checked how the device functions as pre amplifier?


 


  It's a fixed volume control on the outputs unless you get it modded officially by CEntrance.  Using it as a DAC to my speakers sounded fantastic.  There's a few people on here that have had it modded and have been pleased by it's performance.


----------



## FOXY

There a quite a few opinions about the product has a completely neutral sound, is that correct?
   
  I prefer the warm sound like the mhdt havana than the neutral/dry sound.


----------



## chirawatf

Quote: 





foxy said:


> How the CEntrance DACmini compare to ‪Burson HA-160D?


 

 I have both Burson HA160D and Centrance DACmini Cx (rock n roll and variable output mod).
   
  USB in quality;  Dacmini is better in jitter management, dead quiet background, better sound separation, so you can hear whispered sounds in record better.  But for microdetails of each sound that you can hear from both amps, Burson HA160D has more microdetails.
*edit *I use wireworld silver starlight 5.2 USB cable with Burson HA160D and I use Centrance's standard USB cable with DACmini Cx.  Wireworld's USB cable has more details but Centrance's USB cable has smoother treble.  So I think I can hear more details from Burson HA160D because of Wireworld's USB cable.
   
  Sound signature;  Burson has slightly darker signature, with more definition at the bottom so Dacmini sounds thinner.  DAcmini sounds smoother at Mid and treble. 
   
  Power;  Burson HA160D has more power.  For LCD2 listening Burson HA160D needs 12 o'clock but DACmini need 13:30 o'clock on volume to be equally loud.
   
  Dynamic; Both are equal but Burson HA160D has more bass so Burson sounds better for Metal.
   
  Musicallity; Boths are good, the music from both amps can touch listener's emotion.
   
  I like them boths for different musics.
  Dacmini performs its best with standard USB cable and cheap AC cable.  But Burson HA160D needs after market USB cable and AC cable (mine use Wireworld Silver Starlight 5.2 USB cable and Monster power line 400 AC cable).  Burson HA160D sound bad with cheap USB cable and AC power.
   
  Hope this help.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





foxy said:


> There a quite a few opinions about the product has a completely neutral sound, is that correct?
> 
> I prefer the warm sound like the mhdt havana than the neutral/dry sound.


 

  
  I'd say if you're looking for warm and tubey, then this isn't the place to be.
   
  But I would never call the sound of the Dacmini dry, clinical, or overly neutral.
   
  This is more what I would say is referred to as transparent.  It presents the music as it sounds, but has wonderful detail and unbelievable decay.  The bass isn't as impactful as say my Keces was, but it sounds more natural and satisfying.  Never do I hear anything bloated or dark.
   
  On top of that, it's just a fun little amp.  I wish there was a way you could walk into a store and audition it.  Because I think it very change a lot of people's perception of hi-fi audio.  Just take a look at how much attention the DACport received, I wish I didn't ignore it back then, because this really is one heck of a product.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> *Burson HA160D has more microdetails.*


 

  
  You know, I haven't auditioned the 160D, but I've heard the DACmini has the edge in that department, so I think it's interesting to read otherwise.
   
  I was nearly ready to pick the 160D (can't afford the luxury of owning both) but changed my mind based on the pot (I'm not a fan of stepped antennuators) and the lack of an optical input (they guys are not fans at all).
   
  I would still love to give it a shot one day.  Do you listen to Hip Hop, Classic Rock, or new/old Pop?  I would love to hear which you favor in those genres.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> I have both Burson HA160D and Centrance DACmini (rock n roll and variable output mod).
> 
> USB in quality;  Dacmini is better in jitter management, dead quiet background, better sound separation, so you can hear whispered sounds in record better.  But for microdetails of each sound that you can hear from both amps, Burson HA160D has more microdetails.
> 
> ...


 

 The power comparison above can also have something to do with the gain setting of the amp.  The DACmini has a lot of power but it can be held back by the stock gain of 8, and if you want to drive only full size phone and don't plan to use extremely sensitive IEM often, then you should ask to have it built with the gain set at 10.  The higher gain will multiply the input signal more, and result in more power that is closer to the DACmini's real output potential.  The other option is to increase the input voltage coming from the source, but you'd need to use a higher voltage external source to achieve that.  
   
  Regardless, whether one amp has more power to drive a phone to the same volume as another amp has NOTHING to do with where you need to set the volume knob when comparing two different amps.  If both amps can adequately drive the LCD-2 at less than the max setting on the volume pot then NEITHER amp is underpowered.  
   
  Most amps will actually have their volume knob at a different position vs another amp when driving a particular set of phones to a certain volume.  Setting the volume at 12 o'clock position on both amps does not mean 50% of power is being output on both amps - one amp can be at 35% and the other at 65%, and some amps will be at full power well before they can get to max on the knob.  You can probably find an amp that can play the LCD-2 more cleanly at max volume 5 o'clock (and have it putting out more power) than another amp that is at 2 o'clock but pushing the limits of it's power output, just before it starts clipping.


----------



## roker

I was looking at stock pics of the DacMini PX on the offical webpage and it seems they've paired it with the DT880.  I was just wondering, was the 880 used by the engineer when he was fine tuning this sound?  
   
  Would it be wise to purchase the DT880 and use it exclusively with my new amp.?  
   
  It'd be great to have something else to listen besides my D2000. As much as I love my D20000, (comfort, weight, bass, al top notch), I feel like there is an equivalent with all those traits plus more.  A lot of the new or upper echelon of headphones neglect making headphones lighter and even worse, neglect comfort.
   
  I'm open to the idea of purchasing semi-open headphones like the 880s especially if they were made for THIS amp, but I also know closed headphones would make my gf much more happier..  
   
  Anyone own a pair of 880 will to give us impression and could be nice enough to give us a quick review with the DACMini.


----------



## chirawatf

[size=10.0pt]From Headphone Addict's comment, I think both Burson HA160D and DACmini should have comparable power.


 @ roker

 Regards to microdetail.

 I forgot to inform another factors which effect a lot to sonic quality. Receptacle at the wall (propery grounding can reduce distortion of the sound), USB cables (connect computer to DACmini or Burson), AC cable (i had already mentioned.) and cable contaction (all type of cables should avoid contact each other at all cost, for example; if wireworld silver starlight 5.2 USB has contaction to AC cable I can hear distortion at treble and irregular rhythm from Burson HA160D, unbelievable but it does occur.). All factors do effect to sonic quality.

 The quality of USB cable has effect to Microdetails and tonal balance of the sound.  

 Wireworld silver starlight 5.2 USB cable delivers more sonic details than Centrance's standard USB cable (that came in the package when purchase DACmini.)  But Centrance's standard USB cable delivers smoother treble than Wireworld's USB cable.

 I used DACmini with standard USB cable, but I used Burson HA160D with Wireworld silver starlight USB cable.  So I can hear more microdetails from Burson HA160D but smoother treble from DACmini.[/size]
  
[size=10pt]I had tried using Wireworld USB cable with DACmini, the details improof but severely collapse of soundstage so I used DACmini with Centrance's standard USB cable (synergy has a role here).[/size]
   
[size=10pt]For Burson's standard USB cable (came with Burson HA160D's package) has more bass compare to the other two, soundstage is not as good as Wireworld's USB cable so I use it with Fiio E7+E9 (which help increase bass from HF2 to my satisfied level).

 In conclusions both DACmini and Burson HA160D have excellent microdetails, one can produce more microdetails than another if use with better quality and better synergy of USB cable.[/size]
   
[size=10pt]Regard to music generation.[/size]
[size=10pt]I prefer Burson HA160D and PS500 or LCD2 rev.2 with [/size]Hip Hop, Rock, Metal, Jazz, new age because more bass attack, more treble emphasis, more naunce of each note (guitar, piano, drum, percussion instrument's sound).
  I prefer DACmini and RS1i for female singer, wood wind instruments because more fluidity and smoother of the sound.
   
  Chirawat


----------



## plin

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> [size=10.0pt]I forgot to inform another factors which effect a lot to sonic quality. Receptacle at the wall (propery grounding can reduce distortion of the sound), USB cables (connect computer to DACmini or Burson), AC cable (i had already mentioned.) and cable contaction (all type of cables should avoid contact each other at all cost, for example; if wireworld silver starlight 5.2 USB has contaction to AC cable I can hear distortion at treble and irregular rhythm from Burson HA160D, unbelievable but it does occur.). All factors do effect to sonic quality.
> 
> The quality of USB cable has effect to Microdetails and tonal balance of the sound.
> 
> ...


 
  Very informative, thank you!


----------



## K3cT

Quote: 





roker said:


> I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to get to, but my Denon D2000s sound great with this amp, vanilla.
> 
> in fact, I have no desire to change anything except getting the variable output mod.


 


  The lower the output impedance a certain amplifier has, the greater the control it will exert on the headphone's drivers. Ideally you'd want the output impedance to be as low as possible.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> [size=10.0pt]From Headphone Addict's comment, I think both Burson HA160D and DACmini should have comparable power.
> 
> 
> @ roker
> ...


 


  thnx, appreciate that.


----------



## roker

I haven't had my DacMini now for a week.  I sent it back in and decided to get the "always on" mod.  This will simplify using external speakers, as I know right now I'll get annoying by having to unplug the headphones ever time I want to listen to the speakers.
   
  I'll have pics and full impressions (i.e. benefits of mod) in a few days.  My computer is messing up and I think it's about time I installed a new OS.  The audio side of my setup is going to finally be complete.  2 years in the making.  I finally purchased a great dac/amp/preamp, bought expensive speaker stands.   Next on my list:
   
  -Better solid wood desk.
  -New, bigger monitor, with better black levels
  -MacMin, I could've purchased this by selling my macbook, but my gf is insisting we'll be needing a secondary computer.
   
  but yeah, otherwise, this is what I wanted my system to be like 2 years ago (replace Dacmini with Benchmark)
   
  Pictures, impressions, the whole shebang.


----------



## chirawatf

My DACmini Cx has abnormal noise from both channels, it starts at 9-10 o'clock of volume dial.  Sounds like the flamming woods.  Now I am waiting for Jonathan's response for the solution.  I don't know why he doesn't answer my questions yet, i'm waiting his mail for more 24hrs now.
   
  Anyone had this problem before?
   
  Thanks
   
  Chirawat


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi Chirawat. We are really sorry you are having trouble with your DACmini. I am doing everything in my power to get this issue resolved for you ASAP. You sent me an email 2 days ago and I followed up yesterday trying to get further clarification of the issue, to which you then responded again late last night. We have since followed up with RMA instructions and as I indicated in the email I sent yesterday we will do everything we can to make sure you are satisfied with your purchase.


----------



## fgs3121

Can anyone comment on a comparison of the sound of the Dac Mini CX using the USB input vs. SPDIF input?  Is there a stark difference in the sound of 24/96 vs. 24/192?  I'd hope that the convenience of the USB input is not achieved at much of a sonic price by forgoing the higher resolution of the SPDIF connection.  Thanks.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





fgs3121 said:


> Can anyone comment on a comparison of the sound of the Dac Mini CX using the USB input vs. SPDIF input?  Is there a stark difference in the sound of 24/96 vs. 24/192?  I'd hope that the convenience of the USB input is not achieved at much of a sonic price by forgoing the higher resolution of the SPDIF connection.  Thanks.


 


 It sounds better to my ears through USB than SPIDF through my Macbook.  I've always felt that though.  I'm not sure what's the story behind it.  I thought it wasn't possible to get bad sound out of a digital out, but lo and behold, it seems to always sound better through USB on my laptop, even if it's only 24/96.


----------



## plin

*Mod: lowering the output resistance of the DACmini.*
   
*Purpose:*
  DACmini default output resistance is 10 Ohms. This is relatively high, especially for low impedance IEMs. This 10 ohm output impedance is recommended by the maker of the chip (for amplification DACmini uses a popular high quality chip the TPA6120).
  CEntrance offers the ‘1 Ohm’ mod for about $100. I live in Greece and have bought my DACmini second hand, so I find the $100 plus postage to US and back too much for me.
  Inspired by the NWAVguy article dated June 29, 2011 of the QRV09 DIY headphone amplifier based on the same chip in which there are detailed instructions of how to reduce output impedance of the circuit (in the ‘output impedance modification’ section) I made the mod myself. I didn’t use the feritte NWAVguy used because I had readily available a similar through hole part (Murata BL02RN2R1M2B).
  Accessing the 10 ohm output resistance is easy. Just unscrew the bottom (the one without the DACmini sign) cover (and only that) and you will see the two big SMD 10 Ohm resistors -see attached photo, the two 10 ohm resistors are on the left). The difficult part is to ensure that there will be no ill effects, namely oscillation.
   
*ATTENTION*
  As stated by the TPA6120 datasheet the amplifier is very prone to oscillate in MHz region. Oscillations can cause sound degradation, chip overheating (and even destruction) and in some cases DC output on the headphones, resulting in coil destruction.
  Always ALWAYS check the output for any trace of oscillation with a competent oscilloscope or, even better, a network analyser. You should not try to do this mod with no such tools and at least some basic knowledge of analog electronics techniques.
  I recommend testing not only with your real phones but with added capacitance as the NWAVguy article states, because this added capacitance simulates various conditions that could cause a temporary oscillation (sometimes an amplifier is stable in normal temperatures and oscillates in higher ones, sometimes it is stable with a specific load and oscillates when a longer cable is been used, etc). Use various capacitances and I recommend using a good (with fast rise and fall time) square signal input (do not use the internal DAC).
  CEntrance already uses some ferrites on the output section of the DACmini. Maybe this is the reason that I found, even after this mod, that the amplifier was quite stable.
  Before making the mod, check the unaltered amplifier for any overshoot in various square signal inputs. The modded amplifier should not have more than that. You do not want to make any overshooting worst!
   

   
   
*Disclaimer:*
  Do this at your own risk.
  I have done this mod for my own enjoyment and I don’t seek any financial gain by doing this to other people's equipment.


----------



## roker

I just did the "always on" mod (so that the ouput remains active with the headphones plugged in).  I thought about having them lower the Ohms, but to my ears everything sounds great as is.  Don't want to mess with it.  My cans are Denons, I'm not sure if they're quite as sensitive as IEMs, but they're not hard to amplify either.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> I just did the "always on" mod (so that the ouput remains active with the headphones plugged in).  I thought about having them lower the Ohms, but to my ears everything sounds great as is.  Don't want to mess with it.  My cans are Denons, I'm not sure if they're quite as sensitive as IEMs, but they're not hard to amplify either.


 


  It is not about sensitivity. It is about headphone impedance. IEMs have usually lower headphone impedance. DACmini's 10 ohm output impedance has usually negligible effect for headphone impedances more than 100 ohms.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





plin said:


> It is not about sensitivity. It is about headphone impedance. IEMs have usually lower headphone impedance. DACmini's 10 ohm output impedance has usually negligible effect for headphone impedances more than 100 ohms.


 


  
  My headphones are rated at 25 Ohms last time I checked.  How much is the sound going to change?  I read that it becomes more neutral.  Does that translate to less bass?  Like I said earlier I have no immediate plans to get the mod, but if it's that benefiticial, I might consider it.


----------



## Twinster

I have a DACmini with the 1 ohm option (never heard the regular 10 ohms) and when I had my Denon D5000 I thought the Bass was to much on the DACmini. Lower impedance output mean better Bass damping and on my case the bass was very punchy and tight but to much for my liking. For your information I prefer a balanced signature so I'm far from a basshead.  
   
  I'm using the DACmini with my MS-Pro & Magnum and it has very good synergy with them. I have hard time deciding which amplifier to use between my Tube MAD EAR+ HD (one of the best amplifier for Grado headphone) and the DACmini. It's that good (For me).
  
  Quote: 





roker said:


> My headphones are rated at 25 Ohms last time I checked.  How much is the sound going to change?  I read that it becomes more neutral.  Does that translate to less bass?  Like I said earlier I have no immediate plans to get the mod, but if it's that benefiticial, I might consider it.


----------



## roker

I'm more slanted toward a V shape sound (although it's taboo to say that here, so people just say "fun")
   
  When get to reviewing the DACmini I'll talk about how I feel this Dac/amp prefers a more realistic/natural drum over the electronic drums of more modern recordings.  I'm not saying it sounds bad with modern stuff.  On the contrary, it's great for detail and to my ears it has nice impact.  I've noticed that less refined equipment gives you more bass but at the expense of providing you with detail and soundstage.
   
  Which brings me back on subject.  I couldn't live with less bass than it gives right now and if lowering the Ohms does that then I'm right where I belong by not touching it.


----------



## Twinster

Lowering the output impedance will not reduce the bass. It could only get in better.
   
   
  Quote: 





roker said:


> I'm more slanted toward a V shape sound (although it's taboo to say that here, so people just say "fun")
> 
> When get to reviewing the DACmini I'll talk about how I feel this Dac/amp prefers a more realistic/natural drum over the electronic drums of more modern recordings.  I'm not saying it sounds bad with modern stuff.  On the contrary, it's great for detail and to my ears it has nice impact.  I've noticed that less refined equipment gives you more bass but at the expense of providing you with detail and soundstage.
> 
> Which brings me back on subject.  I couldn't live with less bass than it gives right now and if lowering the Ohms does that then I'm right where I belong by not touching it.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> My headphones are rated at 25 Ohms last time I checked.  How much is the sound going to change?  I read that it becomes more neutral.  Does that translate to less bass?  Like I said earlier I have no immediate plans to get the mod, but if it's that benefiticial, I might consider it.


 

 According to Innerfidelity's measurements Denon AHD-2000 have relative low impedance BUT with a flat impedance curve and almost constant zero phase angle, quite impressive actually for dynamic cans, usually only orthos get better than that. Because of this very good impedance graph I believe that you would not gain a lot by applying the 1 ohm mod (although the impedance is quite low). I think that the amount of bass will be the same and you would not gain much more control (it does not seem to have a high mechanical resonance, but a small one about 30Hz, that needs to be damped by low amplifier output resistance). I suspect that your bass will be a tad tighter, but not a lot.
  Of course all the above is just theory, so, please, ask other members in corresponding forums about their experience.
   
  But usually, in most cases, lowering amplifier output resonance means both less amount of mid-bass and better control.


----------



## roker

thank you for the responses
   
  This helps a whole lot in understanding the science behind this stuff.
   
  I think I'm going to roll with the old adage:  "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"
   
  I might consider it in the future, but I don't think I could go without a good amp for 2 weeks again.  It's one of the things I look forward to when I get out of work (after my loving gf and cat of course).  I also have zero plans to buy a new set of headphones as I've been head over heels in love with the Denon sound since day one.
   
  Review and pics forthcoming.  (maybe even a vid if I get a chance).


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





fgs3121 said:


> Can anyone comment on a comparison of the sound of the Dac Mini CX using the USB input vs. SPDIF input?  Is there a stark difference in the sound of 24/96 vs. 24/192?  I'd hope that the convenience of the USB input is not achieved at much of a sonic price by forgoing the higher resolution of the SPDIF connection.  Thanks.


 

 I don't see any point in going higher than 24/96 myself.  Some tech papers (by Benchmark I think) even show why 24/192 is worse.
   
  I think the DACmini with my Macbook Pro via USB is just as good as optical.  And my CDP via coax sounded just about the same as a lossless CD rip on my macbook via USB.  Note - I use Amarra Mini music player on the Macbook Pro.  Without Amarra the CDP is slightly better (more spacious and transparent).


----------



## roker

The shininess of the Dacmini makes it hard to take a photo with a flash.  I need to borrow a good camera and take better pics.
   
   
  I would pay someone to show me or fix my setup to look as wire free as possible.  I think that's reason why people pay so much for fancy wires.  I think my sound system is 80% complete.  I'd like to buy a small subwoofer to get some bass, but it's negligible.  I probably don't need to give my neighbors a reason to complain.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I heard about but have not read Sterophile's review of the Dacmini.  Anyone have the bottom-line of what they had to say?


----------



## plin

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> I heard about but have not read Sterophile's review of the Dacmini.  Anyone have the bottom-line of what they had to say?


 


   
  I have read the Eric Lichte’s Stereophile review. It is interesting, almost humorous. It uses an answers to (imagined I assume) questions style. In short it says the below:
   
  1. DACmini has very good value for money, excellent for computer source music reproduction.
  2. DACmini is more musical than analytical «revealed the musical forest and let the individual trees take care of themselves».
  3. One interesting note: Lichte says that he prefers the sound when using the free proprietary ASIO driver (for windows). Can anybody comment on that? Is beneficial to use the CEntrance ASIO driver?
   
  The measurements by John Atkinson proved a well engineered product (good linearity and low distortions. good implementation of ASCR converter) with _exceptionally _low jitter on USB input, but source dependant jitter on S/PDIF. So, if your source is a computer, it is better to use USB. Also it revealed that 192KHz on S/PDIF doesn’t improve anything compared to 96KHz.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





plin said:


> So, if your source is a computer, it is better to use USB.


 

 BOOM!
   
  I knew it.
   
  I was just complaining about that the other day.
   
  It sounded great through the S/PDIF on my PS3 though.


----------



## koonhua90

Disclaimer: I don't know if I am hearing things, or it might be placebo, or it might be RF interference/coupling on the cables.
   
  I went ahead and compared the USB output with the coaxial output from the computer. All interconnects are cheap cables, nothing fancy. The amp is Schiit Lyr (siemens e188cc tubes) and the headphone is LCD-3, nothing fancy too. Music is lossless, both coaxial and USB at 96kHz, volume matched on computer. Note that the coxial cable is 6ft, a good 2 ft longer than the USB cable. I AB-ed them almost 10 times, but since there was no one around I couldn't do a blind test.
   
  I swore I could hear that the treble was slightly harsher with the coaxial cable, there was a bit more smearing with the high frequencies. The USB output had less grains and was more smooth. Very very subtle, but I just followed my ears and brains, which told me that the USB has slight edge (very imperceptible though) in sound. I believe that my computer coaxial output sucks too much, and has too much jitter. I believe this is not a problem with the DACmini, rather it is my computer or the cables.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *koonhua90* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> .....The amp is Schiit Lyr (siemens e188cc tubes) and the headphone is LCD-3, nothing fancy too.....
> I swore I could hear that the treble was slightly harsher with the coaxial cable, there was a bit more smearing with the high frequencies. The USB output had less grains and was more smooth. Very very subtle, but I just followed my ears and brains, which told me that the USB has slight edge (very imperceptible though) in sound. I believe that my computer coaxial output sucks too much, and has too much jitter. I believe this is not a problem with the DACmini, rather it is my computer or the cables.


 
   
  This is exactly what John Atkinson's tests showed for SPDIF input, low jitter with good (low jitter) digital source, but it gets worst with a mediocre source. You were not imagined things! (and calling LCD-3 a ‘nothing fancy’ headphone is an understatement!).
  Actually, it _is _a problem of DACmini. Jitter rejection is entirely the responsibility of the DAC.
  How much better than the amp section of DACmini is Schiit Lyr?
   
  Can anybody comment about Eric Lichte’s note that CEntrance ASIO driver sound’s better?


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





plin said:


> This is exactly what John Atkinson's tests showed, low jitter with good (low jitter) digital source, but it gets worst with a mediocre source. You were not imagined things! (and telling LCD-3 a ‘nothing fancy’ headphone is an understatement!).
> Actually, it _is _a problem of DACmini. Jitter rejection is entirely the responsibility of the DAC.
> How much better than the amp section of DACmini is Schiit Lyr?
> 
> Can anybody comment about Eric Lichte’s note that CEntrance ASIO driver sound’s better?


 

  
  With the stock tubes, the 6BZ7, the DACmini amp wins. But once I put on the better tubes, the Lyr pulls ahead. Nothing heaven and earth. On the Lyr, 10 o'clock volume equals the 12 or 1 o'clock volume on the DACmini. I prefer to control the volume on my computer, so that is about 50% volume on my comp.
   
  The sound on the Lyr depends a lot on the tubes, I really like the Siemens E188CC, the vocal is less forward, but the separation and the space that it attributes to the vocals is better. Soundstage and imaging improves slightly too. Typical SQ of German made tubes. In short the answer to your question is, if you put in great tubes, yes Lyr is gonna edge out the DACmini amp, just because it's that much more powerful, and due to that reason, at a low listening level, the Lyr sounds more effortless. On the other hand at a high listening level, the DACmini amp will run into headroom problem. 
   
  I should be able to post a short comparison of all the tubes I have on the Lyr tube roll thread, once I get all my tubes in. Then again, if I were to live with only the DACmini, I think I will be fine, as long as I crank up the volume on the computer side.
   
  I have installed the ASIO driver since a long time ago, and never really bother to compare it with anything else. I trust Centrance to know what they are doing.


----------



## plin

Thank you koonhua90 for your reply. it is very thorough!


----------



## deniall83

Hey guys. I'm looking at getting a DACMini and I just read that it can be connected to an iPod. I'm assuming that it would still use the iPods internal DAC and just provide amplification. Is this correct or does it take the files out digitally and convery and amplify them?
   
  Also, if connected to usb does the DAC and amp work or does the DAC only portion of it work and a dedicated headphone amp needs to be used?


----------



## roker

*Hey guys. I'm looking at getting a DACMini and I just read that it can be connected to an iPod. I'm assuming that it would still use the iPods internal DAC and just provide amplification. Is this correct or does it take the files out digitally and convery and amplify them?*
   
  Correct.  You can buy a simple LOD and connect it to the LINE IN on the back of the unit.  Conversely you can buy an Pure i-20 iPod dock 
   
  http://www.amazon.com/Digital-iPhone-Hi-Fi-Quality-Output/dp/B0049MOK92/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1322298437&sr=8-1
   
  Then use the coax out into the coax in and then you can bypass the internal DAC and have your self a nifty little Music server.
   
*Also, if connected to usb does the DAC and amp work or does the DAC only portion of it work and a dedicated headphone amp needs to be used?*
   
  It has powerful Class A amp built in.  No need for separate amplification.  If you want in the future, it has a LINE OUT on the back and you can use that to feed another amp or speakers.  It's a pretty versatile unit.  Definitely the best audiophile purchase I've made to date.


----------



## deniall83

Quote: 





roker said:


> It has powerful Class A amp built in.  No need for separate amplification.  If you want in the future, it has a LINE OUT on the back and you can use that to feed another amp or speakers.  It's a pretty versatile unit.  Definitely the best audiophile purchase I've made to date.


 


  Thankyou for your advice. Quick question, while using the i-20 with the DACMini, does the DACMini supply both DAC and amp or does it use the amp only portion and relies on the DAC from the i-20?
   
  Also, what cable do you suggest?


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





deniall83 said:


> Thankyou for your advice. Quick question, while using the i-20 with the DACMini, does the DACMini supply both DAC and amp or does it use the amp only portion and relies on the DAC from the i-20?
> 
> Also, what cable do you suggest?


 

 You can do both, through 3 connections. Plug the analog out (dual RCA) into the analog in of DACmini, and you use only the amp of DACmini, and the DAC of i20. Plug the coaxial/toslink from the i20 into the DACmini, and the i20 becomes a transport, then you use both the DAC and the amp of DACmini. I'd recommend doing the latter, but you can experiment and see which one you like more.


----------



## deniall83

Sweet! Last question, are Centrance still doing free shipping or any other deals for head-fi members?


----------



## roker

You're going to have to email them or wait for Jay Listens to chime in (you could also sending him a private message).


----------



## chirawatf

Hello everyone

 I am a new user for DACmini, it has a good synergy with grado rs1i, ps500 as I had mentioned 2 weeks ago.  I wonder if DACmini has a good synergy with PS1000 or not?

 Has anyone experience with DACmini-PS1000?  Can it drive PS1000 to the full potential?  Does the sound prone to produce sibilance?

 Thank you.


----------



## turokrocks

May I know how to utilize the dac (from the mini) only when connected to usb (or any other source) I know you can but how? For I want to try it with different amps, without double amping.


----------



## Twinster

Just connect your external amplifier to the Output RCA jacks and select the Input source (USB if connected from PC) from the selector in the front. Make sure you don't have any headphone plugged in the 1/4 connector because that will disable the output RCA jacks.
   
   
   

  
  Quote: 





turokrocks said:


> May I know how to utilize the dac (from the mini) only when connected to usb (or any other source) I know you can but how? For I want to try it with different amps, without double amping.


----------



## turokrocks

Quote: 





twinster said:


> Just connect your external amplifier to the Output RCA jacks and select the Input source (USB if connected from PC) from the selector in the front. Make sure you don't have any headphone plugged in the 1/4 connector because that will disable the output RCA jacks.


 

 Ahhhhh , I have to make sure nothing is connected in-front, thanks.


----------



## turokrocks

I need ti know the DAC chip in the Dacport LX before I buy it, may you confirm please


----------



## Twinster

If you like the  DACmini you won't be disappointed with the DACport. Here's a link to Centrance Blog with the info you looking for.
  Quote: 





turokrocks said:


> I need ti know the DAC chip in the Dacport LX before I buy it, may you confirm please


----------



## roker

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Twinster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Make sure you don't have any headphone plugged in the 1/4 connector because that will disable the output RCA jacks.


 

  
  Yeah, that annoyed me initially because I go back and forth so often in a sitting, plus it'll wear out your connector.
   
  So I had CEntrance perform an "always on" mod, so now I can turn down the volume on the DACmini and use the volume for the speakers then in a moment, turn down the speakers, put the headphones back on and turn up the volume.
   
  It's pretty convenient and I get no "bleeding" from any of the sources.  My speakers' auto off function always works when I have the volume knob for the speakers turned down.


----------



## turokrocks

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> I have mentioned this before, but I would really caution users looking to select a product based on one individual part.
> 
> At CEntrance, we focus on the synergy of parts when we design any product. While the DAC chip is important, so is the powering, chassis, potentiometers, resistors, connectors, as well as the PCB layout and a plethora of decisions that were made in the design phase. It is the sum of these parts that mold the CEntrance sound, not just one individual chip.
> 
> ...


 
  You are 100% totally right, so what is the DAC chip?AK4396?


----------



## Jay Listens

That's the one.


----------



## turokrocks

Quote: 





jay listens said:


> That's the one.


 


  Thanks, so should I PM you for the DAC?


----------



## vrln

Question for Centrance: 
   
  If I remember correctly, you once stated that there will be multiple versions of the DacMini. How about a cheaper DAC+Headphone amp unit strictly made for headphone users? Something like the Burson 160DS, in other words strip away the pre-amp functionality and DAC output and lower the price accordingly. I´d say there´s a market for it, especially at a lower price point.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





vrln said:


> Question for Centrance:
> 
> If I remember correctly, you once stated that there will be multiple versions of the DacMini. How about a cheaper DAC+Headphone amp unit strictly made for headphone users? Something like the Burson 160DS, in other words strip away the pre-amp functionality and DAC output and lower the price accordingly. I´d say there´s a market for it, especially at a lower price point.


 

 I can't see that making a big impact on the price unless the S/PDIF inputs were dropped too.  With USB and headphone only it would lower the cost, and could result in something smaller than DACmini but more powerful than the DACport, assuming it retained the same amp and PSU.


----------



## vrln

USB input only would be perfect, the Centrance solution there is rock solid. Have nothing but good things to say about it


----------



## SilentSound

Initial impressions on the DACmini-PX
   
After a hard day’s work it is even harder to write an impression of a product that one has waited months to arrive. When it is finally at the door the scene is more akin to a little dog digging for a long lost bone hidden in the garden than a civilized hardworking budding audiophile doing a pointless-unpack-video for you-tube. A quick and frantic (DAC)mini photo-session later the little PX (seriously this is small, REAL small)  is rigged to its power, tiny little studio monitors, DT-990 Pro cans and a Lenovo’s desktop replacement laptop (i7, 8G RAM, 500G HDD). The old and trusty, albeit admittedly non-high-brow-audiophile rig  consisting of a Pioneer SACD player, an Onkyo receiver(with integrated headphone-amp) and monitors are assembled together for any comparison to be made.  A set of assorted HiRes music is bought (from Linn Records) and carefully placed in the HDD and back-up disk. The main OS of course being Linux (Ubuntu’s latest 64Bit  LTS at this point of writing) is set up, with mpd providing the grunt and GMPC taking control of the steering wheel . It did take some time to set up a bit perfect system on Linux, but in the the end it all worked out fine (more on that later). An equally endowed Dell laptop with Win-7 along with Centrance device driver installed was set up for comparison.
   
   
I have found that miss Norah Jones (CD-Rip) never fails to sooth stretched nerves and a palpitating heart, _don’t know why_.. The first thing I notice is that the PX makes these little monitors sing (don’t remember them playing this good before)! imaging is perfect , her voice crystal clear, soothing and hypnotic. I almost stretch my hands to get up and go when she intimately beckons and coos _come away with me_. I realise that my eyes were closed, heart rate down and my nerves soothed to a mushy pulp. The silent passages in-between songs and in some songs remain as it should be – Silent. I mean as _silent_ as in the deep-dead-space-silence. With the DT-990, the PX doesn’t disappoint, although the imaging is not as good as the monitors, there is more detail and depth. One last thing  is that the _Nightingale_ to my ears sounded a bit more chirpy than usual. Assuming it might be burn-in issue, I let the PX enjoy the music without me and Norah over-night with a variety of tracks playing in a random-loop.

My turn next - I reply the _Nightingale_ and notice the chirpy bird has migrated for the winter. First up is Kent-Poon’s Audiophile Jazz prologue III. Brilliantly recorded and executed, the collection exudes all-around quality. Even when heard on non-Hi-res equipment, it doesn't disappoint. I don’t believe that I can hear anywhere nearly as good as my neighbor’s old dog but when the .flac’s are opened in Audacity, none of them show waveforms that reach more than 23KHz. The dog is disappointed at the lost opportunity to show one-updogship. _Share and Share Alike_ is a slow moving Jazz where one can dwell on every pluck, every strum, every decay and get intimate with the timber of the Guitar and the Double Bass. The little monitors attached to the PX give up on the bass but are happy to render the guitar pleasantly. Mid-range is where the monitors excel and IMO that is where the DT900 Pros are a bit lacking. The DT900s Pros on the other hand do much much better on bass, they let me sink in really deep and feel the decay of the low frequencies as they fly by unlike the bass-roll-off from the backside of the monitors. It really feels like I am just a few feet away from the Double Bass on the right, the guitar equally distant on the left. The ambiance of the studio comes through as well. The deep breath that the bassist takes at 06:02 is presented in all its raw form... impressive. So is the PX does OK with easy music, 2 instruments and a one deep breath. 24/96 flac -> USB cable -> PX

Back to Norah, this time I don’t even ask her to _turn me on_, she does this without effort, _the glass is waiting for some fresh ice cubes_... indeed. The freshness of her voice is second to none, the very faint quiver is heard which I had not noticed before, seductive. The attack of the drums is presented very well, but the piano doesn't impress, I drop the DT990 switch on the monitors and the Piano shines while the low frequency drum beats disappoint. Looks like I need a upgrade of both the monitors and cans!! Too expensive a proposition for a person who is still reeling from the grand and odd plunked on the PX. Note to self - put an LCD-3 / Beyerdynamic-T1 and Wharfedale-Jade-3 / Dynaudio-Excite-X16 on the wanted list for Santa and hang a big sock for this holiday season. BTW miss Jones was singing via CD -> Pioneer Multi-format player -> Optical cable -> PX.

Just as an Idea, I put the said miss through a double blind test. This one was easy to do and took up just 3 hours to complete and tabulate the whole thing. The CD-rip (flac) was played through the laptop via the USB to PX and the CD itself was playing in the player connected to the PX via optical cable. So all my friend had to do was keep switching between the input selection from USB to Opt. We ensured that the same songs were playing almost at the same time. Since I did not know which one started first nor where the input selection was, it did not matter (After every 30mins, there was a break of 5 minutes so that the numbers, paper, input can be randomized by my friend). All I had were 2 sheets of paper and a pencil to mark which one sounded better against a number written on pater. It turns out, after mapping the numbers to the respective inputs I had chosen CD->Opt->PX->DT990  as better sounding 16 times out of 20 !! Consciously I do not have the words to describe the extremely subtle difference, but there is something about the CD->Optical Cable->PX that my brain liked... _don't know why_.

The idea of a lady(‘)s night came from the local pub where every week on Wednesday they try to attract the pettier of our species by throwing a party and offering drinks and dining at a discount. As I ease into my chair for a Lady's night of my own, I let these talented songstresses take control. Here are my notes which I scribbled down when drowned in the music* 

 Norah Jones : (Rosie’s Lullaby 16/44.1) - More reverbs than other recordings, slow n sweet. Drum attack really good on the DT990. Voicing slightly better on the monitors
 Marcia Seebaran - (Afro Blue 24/96 ) - Luscious, rich and very dark-chocolaty. Immersive and shines on the DT990Pro. Her voice reflects the lyrics of the song... shades of delight, Coco hue, rich as the night... Afro blue. 
 Marcia Seebaran : (You’d be so nice to come home to 24/96) - Smooth as rich red wine with a hint of spice and oak. Clear trumpet and double bass audible. Rich blend.
 Opera with lead vocal (The soldier, tir’d of war’s alarms 24/96) : The PX keeps pace with the Voice, wind instruments, stings especially noted is the with a vice grip on the Trumpets, Cellos and bass. The volume had to be cranked up to 11 to take it all in depth, width and instrument ensemble. The DT900s seems to have issues with keeping up with the PX. The monitors keep pace during all the mids, and practically fart when the bass hits  . Note to self - make sure the upgrade monitors are sealed variety. 
 Dawn Langstroth (elevator music 24/96) - Listed to this thrice  so good. Clear, fresh like the best of white wines. Wonderful image and depth.
 Barb Jungr : (Man in the long black coat 24/96) - Dark, melancholy and the entire feel of a dark rainy day clearly comes through, amazed at the feeling that is coming through. A unique take on Bob Dylan’s favorites.
 Maeve O'Boyle : (Carnival attraction 24/88.2)  Bloody hell ! This ROCKS ! a fitting ode to an other lady who had an equally brilliant voice. DT990Pros shine, tiny monitors almost suck.
 Fiona MacKenzie : (At the bottom of the sea 24/44.1) : Her charming Scottish accent is captivating. Supreme imaging even on the DT990Pros. All instruments are seen distinctly the acoustic guitar, piano, organ, bass, drums, strings. Could have done without the Chorus though. 
 

After some time, I put the paper down and just enjoyed the music till the sun peeped through my window. I made sure that I listened to songs that I had heard first-hand as well, this gave me an idea of how true the presentation and imaging was. A night well spent  and time to hit the bed.

The * was for miss Susan Wong who startled me a bit. Yes, her voice is fresh, a bit edgy and her east-Asian accent is IMHO evident but what I was startled was a wrong note (at least to my ears) during the “_Have you ever seen the rain” [around 1m47s] _.

During the comparison between CD and USB, I noticed that there was jitter when I switch to USB (press play on the GMPC), while the optical-cable from the CD-Player was connected and the selection knob was still on Opt and the song was playing. _*Jay : Any ideas why this happens ?*_

Summary till now : The PX is the quintessential translator, it shows no mercy when it comes to bad recording. With good recordings it simply shines. IMO, It adds no colour nor tonality just presents it as it is.

Next up - The Gentleman’s Club (Male vocals)


----------



## roker

Thanks for the review.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





silentsound said:


> Initial impressions on the DACmini-PX


 

 That was a really enjoyable review, well done!


----------



## BigIron

Anybody else experiencing a buzz sound when a phone (iphone4) is close (from 1 to 2 ft) to your dacmini?
  The only addition was the dacmini when this started to happen.
   
  My setup:
   
  desktop > USB cable > DACmini > denon D5000 = buzz
  desktop > USB cable > DACmini > audioengine A5 = buzz
   
  w/o the DACmini in the chain = NO buzz
   
  --
  bigiron


----------



## roker

Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Anybody else experiencing a buzz sound when a phone (iphone4) is close (from 1 to 2 ft) to your dacmini?
> The only addition was the dacmini when this started to happen.
> 
> My setup:
> ...


 


 no, I usually keep it close by when I play music from it.  I only have two USBs and they're occupied when I have work switching over to WINDOWS on my MAC, so I use my iPhone as a source.  Never had any buzzing sounds.
   
  The A5s are shielded pretty well, so that can't be the problem.
   
  Have JayListens troubleshoot it for you.


----------



## canyondust

Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Anybody else experiencing a buzz sound when a phone (iphone4) is close (from 1 to 2 ft) to your dacmini?
> The only addition was the dacmini when this started to happen.
> 
> My setup:
> ...


 

 Yes, that happens to me, but it's not limited to the DACmini. When I'm working in the studio it happens with other (professional) audio gear as well though, so I think it's one of those unavoidable things...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Anybody else experiencing a buzz sound when a phone (iphone4) is close (from 1 to 2 ft) to your dacmini?
> The only addition was the dacmini when this started to happen.
> 
> My setup:
> ...


 

 My Audioengine speakers buzz when iPhone 4 is near, even if not connected to a DAC, but I never had my DACmini buzz with the phone in the dock sitting on top of it.


----------



## SilentSound

Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Anybody else experiencing a buzz sound when a phone (iphone4) is close (from 1 to 2 ft) to your dacmini?
> The only addition was the dacmini when this started to happen.
> 
> My setup:
> ...


 


   
   
  Nope, no buzz. Tired it with 2 phones and 2 tablets.


----------



## BigIron

Btw, the DACmini is placed on top of the left channel A5 (the powered unit) and the buzz is not constantly happening. If I place the iphone 1ft away in front of the left speaker, it won't buzz right away, something triggers the buzz (not necessarily a phone call), and I have to move the phone away to stop it once it starts.  I don't think it has anything to do with the A5 because I can get the buzz with the D5000 plugged to the DACmini and the A5 turned off.
   
  I'll experiment some more today to find out what exactly triggers it and I'll also try a different USB cable.
   
  thanks for the replies.


----------



## Twinster

I had similar problem but my source was a Squeezebox Touch streaming by WiFi. My chain was <SB Touch wifi - DACmini coax - MAD Ear+ rca - Headphone>. I was hearing interference while using the MAD Ear+ amplifier but if I connected my headphone on the headphone out of the DACmini I could not hear the noise.
   
  I have now relocated my Tube amp and SB Touch in the living room and connected the SQ via Ethernet cable. I'm using my DACmini with my Laptop via USB and got no more interference. Sometime I have my iPhone & iPad just beside the Dacmini (maybe 1 foot away) and cannot hear any noise.
   
  Those the noise / buzz you get repeat itself for 3 short buzz and stop for about 5 seconds and repeat itself? I have that whenever I put my iPhone close to my DACport at work.
  
  Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Btw, the DACmini is placed on top of the left channel A5 (the powered unit) and the buzz is not constantly happening. If I place the iphone 1ft away in front of the left speaker, it won't buzz right away, something triggers the buzz (not necessarily a phone call), and I have to move the phone away to stop it once it starts.  I don't think it has anything to do with the A5 because I can get the buzz with the D5000 plugged to the DACmini and the A5 turned off.
> 
> I'll experiment some more today to find out what exactly triggers it and I'll also try a different USB cable.
> 
> thanks for the replies.


----------



## tink97

Well my dacmini just arrived and this thing is small first off and so far I am liking the sound I am getting from computer......now the burn in beings lol (yep i believe in burn)
   
  Happy holidays to everyone
   
  toivo


----------



## SilentSound

Quote: 





tink97 said:


> Well my dacmini just arrived and this thing is small first off and so far I am liking the sound I am getting from computer......now the burn in beings lol (yep i believe in burn)
> 
> Happy holidays to everyone
> 
> toivo


 


  Enjoy the new Toy Tink97, did you get the CX or the PX ?


----------



## tink97

Heh I got the cx I plan to use it for mainly the dac portion for my mini torri amp when it arrives.  It also very nice that it was a headphone amp so I can run other types of phones thru it.  So far it sounds very nice with my lcd-2 rev1 though for my iem I hear hissing at low volumes and I can't go too much on the volume control before its too much for me.  I just got the stock unit. I do love the size factor of this little guy and just using usb to the computer is very nice without have a converter.  I have a small desk area 
   
  tink97


----------



## Jojomite

i just got the dacmini! I'm loving the size of it, especially since i have a small desk, great for a bedside rig as well! I'm not missing my burson anymore, even for rock, this thing sounds really great! good job centrance!


----------



## Omshallom

Just recently puchased a Dacmini as well, and paired with the LCD-2 , sounds fantastic.. A big step up from my Technics RP-DJ1210 / Iphone 3GS. ( which I did think was godly a few months ago)
   
  I think I'm going to call it a day, this setup will keep me happy for a long time. Gotta to get out of here while the going's good.


----------



## elnero

Quote: 





bigiron said:


> Btw, the DACmini is placed on top of the left channel A5 (the powered unit) and the buzz is not constantly happening. If I place the iphone 1ft away in front of the left speaker, it won't buzz right away, something triggers the buzz (not necessarily a phone call), and I have to move the phone away to stop it once it starts.  I don't think it has anything to do with the A5 because I can get the buzz with the D5000 plugged to the DACmini and the A5 turned off.
> 
> I'll experiment some more today to find out what exactly triggers it and I'll also try a different USB cable.
> 
> thanks for the replies.


 
  I may be wrong on this, I don't have a data plan for my phone so it's forced to use wi-fi at home and work, the only time I hear periodic buzzing is just before a call or text comes in but I believe the same would hold true if the phone was accessing 3G to check email or other periodic app updates. I think the only way to get around it would be to put it in airplane mode.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





omshallom said:


> Just recently puchased a Dacmini as well, and paired with the LCD-2 , sounds fantastic.. A big step up from my Technics RP-DJ1210 / Iphone 3GS. ( which I did think was godly a few months ago)
> 
> I think I'm going to call it a day, this setup will keep me happy for a long time. Gotta to get out of here while the going's good.


 


  Geez, if there's one thing I would love to see under my tree this christmas is the LCD2s
   
  congrats
   
  I'm going to have to wait until my tax return (maybe) to get one.


----------



## Jojomite

does anyone know how these pair with the he500?


----------



## turokrocks

Quote: 





jojomite said:


> does anyone know how these pair with the he500?


 


  ME two want to know


----------



## plin

I have HE-500 driven by DACmini and I am very pleased. You can read my impressions here.
   
  The HE-500 review in avguide states that " I occasionally heard clipping from the CEntrance DAC Mini that I was using, for example, and I think a stronger amp like the Cavalli Liquid Fire or Woo WA22 is merited." I agree with this. I changed the output resistor in order to gain a bit of headroom.  
   
  Some say that HE-500 pairs best with tubes (see impressions from HeadphoneAddict and Project86). I haven't tested it with tubes, but I am really enjoying HE-500 with DACmini!


----------



## Jojomite

haha thats good to hear. what do u mean by clipping? i listen at relatively low volumes so maybe i won't be affected?


----------



## allenwijaya

hey,
   
  im looking to purchase DAC but cant decide whether should i get Dacport LX or Dacmini or competitor product bifrost. 
   
  it will be used on graham slee solo SRG II and Senn HD 650.
   
  can anyone please help me decide


----------



## plin

Quote: 





jojomite said:


> haha thats good to hear. what do u mean by clipping? i listen at relatively low volumes so maybe i won't be affected?


 


  Clipping was apparent on songs (usually acoustic, jazz and mostly classical) heard relatively loud (I cannot say on how much dB levels were) and on loud passages. It wasn' t always there, just occasionally when I was hearing music loud.
  HifiMan recommends 1W power for HE-500. With the 10Ohm output resistance, DACmini will drive them with more than half as that. This is just less than 3dB below 1W. According to Tyll's measurements 500mW will bring about 120dB SPL peak in HE-500. Assuming a generous headroom of 20dB, you can listen to 100dB mean sound pressure with no significant clipping.
   
  After the mod I made, clipping almost disappeared, but there is also something else that changed the way I hear music. HE-500 makes me hear music in lesser levels that my old trustworthy HD-650, not because it has more distortion or it is more fatiguing - on the contrary -, but because it has more resolution (or should I say analysis) in significant lower levels. See also here and here. 
   
  Clipping is the specific distortion made by electronic amplification when is driven beyond its headroom. It is quite easy discernible, and makes music very harsh and distorded.
   
  Be warned though: Some say that HE-500 scales well with much higher wattage.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> hey,
> 
> im looking to purchase DAC but cant decide whether should i get Dacport LX or Dacmini or competitor product bifrost.
> 
> ...


 


 The LX is only useful if you plan on running some bookshelf speakers as well, other wise it's a waste.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> hey,
> 
> im looking to purchase DAC but cant decide whether should i get Dacport LX or Dacmini or competitor product bifrost.
> 
> ...


 

 You have already an amp (and a rather good one!) so why are you considering DACmini instead of a pure DAC like Dacport LX or bitfrost?


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> The LX is only useful if you plan on running some bookshelf speakers as well, other wise it's a waste.


 

 I believe you may confused DACport LX with DACmini PX. DACport LX has no amplifier, it's just a DAC, like bitfrost.


----------



## roker

PX LX CX
   
  he did say port though
   
  got my apples mixed up.


----------



## allenwijaya

Quote: 





plin said:


> You have already an amp (and a rather good one!) so why are you considering DACmini instead of a pure DAC like Dacport LX or bitfrost?


 


   


  Quote: 





plin said:


> I believe you may confused DACport LX with DACmini PX. DACport LX has no amplifier, it's just a DAC, like bitfrost.


 


   


  Quote: 





roker said:


> PX LX CX
> 
> he did say port though
> 
> got my apples mixed up.


 

 Nope didnt get mixed up.
   
  considering dacmini CX since lot of review saying that dacmini cx is a better DAC rather than dacport LX.
   
  so will it be a waste if im getting dacmini cx instead of dacport?


----------



## Twinster

No it would not be a waste. Even if you only use the DAC from the DACmini it offers more flexibility with more input ports compare to the DACport. And the amplifier section is pretty good too.
  
  Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> Nope didnt get mixed up.
> 
> considering dacmini CX since lot of review saying that dacmini cx is a better DAC rather than dacport LX.
> 
> so will it be a waste if im getting dacmini cx instead of dacport?


----------



## roker

Quote: 





twinster said:


> No it would not be a waste. Even if you only use the DAC from the DACmini it offers more flexibility with more input ports compare to the DACport. And the amplifier section is pretty good too.


 

  
  The amp section is transparent and powerful.  Very clean and punchy for a solid state, but doesn't have that "color" of the tubes which is why I picked it up.
   
  I wouldn't buy the mini for only the DAC though, seems like a waste considering the amount of options the device gives you.


----------



## allenwijaya

Quote: 





twinster said:


> No it would not be a waste. Even if you only use the DAC from the DACmini it offers more flexibility with more input ports compare to the DACport. And the amplifier section is pretty good too.


 

 Quote:


roker said:


> The amp section is transparent and powerful.  Very clean and punchy for a solid state, but doesn't have that "color" of the tubes which is why I picked it up.
> 
> I wouldn't buy the mini for only the DAC though, seems like a waste considering the amount of options the device gives you.


 

 kay thx for the advice. ill just grab dacport LX then, since bifrost havent been release yet in where i do live right now.


----------



## turokrocks

Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> Quote:
> 
> kay thx for the advice. ill just grab dacport LX then, since bifrost havent been release yet in where i do live right now.


 

 Hope you enjoy your LX, as it will be my next purchase (was considering the Bifrost) but the ability to use it in my work and home is a big factor in my decision.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





jojomite said:


> does anyone know how these pair with the he500?


 

 Pairs very nicely.  I brought the DACmini to RMAF and displayed it with the HE-500 and LCD-2.  The HE-500 sounded similar to the Stax Lambda Nova Signature on the KGSS amp I brought, but HE-500 were slightly better with more control and clarity in the bass (LNS are a little sloppy in comparison).


----------



## plin

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Pairs very nicely.  I brought the DACmini to RMAF and displayed it with the HE-500 and LCD-2.  The HE-500 sounded similar to the Stax Lambda Nova Signature on the KGSS amp I brought, but HE-500 were slightly better with more control and clarity in the bass (LNS are a little sloppy in comparison).


 


  Although LNS are not one of the top of the line Stax headphones available now, this result speaks a lot for the quality of the DACmini & HE-500 combination. Thank you for this!
  Were you using DACmini's DAC section for KGSS's source?


----------



## allenwijaya

damn i finally got home with DACmini... the sound so much better with graham slee solo SRG II. still listening to it right now


----------



## markkr

Quote: 





roker said:


> The amp section is transparent and powerful.  Very clean and punchy for a solid state, but doesn't have that "color" of the tubes which is why I picked it up.


 

  
  Based on this statement, can I assume that amplifier section would match/exceed an older Gilmore Lite? I love the way my GL sounds but I cant seem to find a DAC that I like with it... If I could get an all-in-one solution like the mini, I could clear up space on my desk too. I just dont want to lose the clarity of the GL.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> damn i finally got home with DACmini... the sound so much better with graham slee solo SRG II. still listening to it right now


 


  Congrats and enjoy your new toy! 
  Please, if it is possible, I would like a small comparison between DACmini's amp section and SRG II.


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





allenwijaya said:


> damn i finally got home with DACmini... the sound so much better with graham slee solo SRG II. still listening to it right now


 

 glad u like it!


----------



## Jojomite

do any of u guys know how the dac section compares to the bifrost?


----------



## roker

Quote: 





jojomite said:


> do any of u guys know how the dac section compares to the bifrost?


 


  I'm not sure the biFrost has been out long enough for someone to own both.

 I can say this though, the DACmini in general is more versatile as audio unit, but this means nothing to you if you're looking for a particular sound.
   
  If you want transparent with a slight tilt of warmth (slight), I'd take the DACmini.  Not sure what to expect from the Bifrost though.


----------



## plin

AVguide has posted a review of DACmini:
http://www.avguide.com/review/centrance-dacmini-cx-dacheadphone-amp-playback-52


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





plin said:


> AVguide has posted a review of DACmini:
> http://www.avguide.com/review/centrance-dacmini-cx-dacheadphone-amp-playback-52


 


  cool, thanks!


----------



## DanBa

http://www.stereophile.com/content/centrance-dacmini-cx-da-converter


----------



## plin

Quote: 





danba said:


> http://www.stereophile.com/content/centrance-dacmini-cx-da-converter


 


  Stereophile updated their measurement equipment. So it is not possible to easily compare DACmini's measurements with lots of older tested equipment. Only some of the most recent ones. Still, one can be impressed by how well it compares with the Simaudio moon evolution 650d cd player!


----------



## Jojomite

does anyone know if an aftermarket ac cable would improve performance?


----------



## roker

Quote: 





jojomite said:


> does anyone know if an aftermarket ac cable would improve performance?


 

  
  I believe there was a discussion about this a few pages back and the answer was no due to the DACmini handling power duties internally.

 I could be wrong though.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> I believe there was a discussion about this a few pages back and the answer was no due to the DACmini handling power duties internally.
> 
> I could be wrong though.


 
  Yes, you are right. CEntrance uses a wall power adaptor. CEntrance states that any wall type power supply can be used with no detrimental effects, just make sure it has the necessary power specs (9-19VDC 1A, if I remember correctly).


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





plin said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  oh ok thanks guys! was wondering if a change in cables would improve the sound greatly like how ppl have liked the improvements when they changed the power cable for the burson... guess not


----------



## redwarrior191

From the stereophile measurement conclusion, "Although its measured performance includes some idiosyncrasies, the CEntrance DACmini CX is, overall, a well-engineered component."
   
Could anyone explain to me about the idiosyncracies in the measurement?? I'm not really good at reading those graphs...


----------



## plin

Quote: 





redwarrior191 said:


> From the stereophile measurement conclusion, "Although its measured performance includes some idiosyncrasies, the CEntrance DACmini CX is, overall, a well-engineered component."
> 
> Could anyone explain to me about the idiosyncracies in the measurement?? I'm not really good at reading those graphs...


 

 I believe the answer lies in the following two paragraphs from the Stereophile measurement web page:
   
  'Fig.1 shows the DACmini's frequency response tested via S/PDIF with data sampled at 44.1kHz (green and gray traces), 96kHz (cyan and magenta traces), and 192kHz (blue and red traces). As you can see, the expected increase in bandwidth from the 192kHz sampling is absent, the response being the same for 192kHz data as for 96kHz data. The DACmini uses an asynchronous sample-rate converter chip (an Analog Devices AD1896), so I suspect that, like the Benchmark DAC1, the DAC chip is fed data at a fixed rate that, although sufficient for 96kHz data, is less than 192kHz.'
   
'However, this graph was taken with the DACmini driven by the AP SYS2722's digital output, which has very low jitter. Repeating the test using the same 15' length of plastic TosLink, but from the RME soundcard fitted to the PC in which the Miller Analyzer resides, increased the level of the sidebands at ±229Hz to give an estimated jitter of 440 picoseconds. Though this is still low in absolute terms, the difference in measured jitter between the Audio Precision and RME sources suggests that the DACmini does have some sensitivity to the source in use via S/PDIF.'


----------



## chirawatf

For me, after market AC cable does improof the sound from DACmini.
   
  I compared between cheap AC cable VS Monster powerline 300 which has very good dynamic.
  I say improofment around 10-15 percent. 
  Better focus, fuller bass, better dynamic.
   
  During comparison I listened to PS1000 which can reveal all the change in system.

  
  Quote: 





jojomite said:


> does anyone know if an aftermarket ac cable would improve performance?


----------



## plin

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> For me, after market AC cable does improof the sound from DACmini.
> 
> I compared between cheap AC cable VS Monster powerline 300 which has very good dynamic.
> I say improofment around 10-15 percent.
> ...


 

 Can you please explain where do you used it?
  Does the power supply of DACmini has a IEC C14 male connector (with a detachable power cord)?
  I have the travel option and it is just a wall type of PSU, with no power cord.


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> For me, after market AC cable does improof the sound from DACmini.
> 
> I compared between cheap AC cable VS Monster powerline 300 which has very good dynamic.
> I say improofment around 10-15 percent.
> ...


 


  thats interesting! maybe i can go down to the shops one of these days and see if they will lend me any cables to try


----------



## chirawatf

@ plin and Jojomite
   
  In DACmini's package, there is external external 19V DC adaptor with male IEC C14 which you can connect aftermarket AC cable to the wall's receptacle (mind is wattgate 381 gold).
   
  Try AC cable at least 200-400 USD price range, and let us know the result.
   
  One other thing my Monster powerline 300 performed its best at 300-400 hrs of usage (after burn in period, the sound has less grainy, improof dynamic).


----------



## markkr

here we go again...


----------



## chirawatf

^
  We all trust our own ears which have too many variations.


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





chirawatf said:


> ^
> We all trust our own ears which have too many variations.


 


  haha thats true^^ i might just order a new usb cable to see if it improves the sound


----------



## flurry

Started using my unit today. It's great with my k240 - awesome neutrality.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





plin said:


> Although LNS are not one of the top of the line Stax headphones available now, this result speaks a lot for the quality of the DACmini & HE-500 combination. Thank you for this!
> Were you using DACmini's DAC section for KGSS's source?


 

 I was using an Apogee mini-DAC via coax with a Nuforce CDP-8, and feeding the Apogee balanced output into the KGSS and the single ended output into the DACmini - so they both used the same source at the same time.


----------



## plin

It seems that our small DACmini gets quite attention lately. Another review (on page 52) with a Publisher's Choice Award (on page 206) for 2011:
   
http://www.tonepublications.com/MAGPDF/TA_042.pdf
   
   
  Only one note: The reviewer states that replacing the external switching power supply was beneficial and that 'It’s always a great idea to keep such little switching power supplies away from your audio gear, and adding the clean power ... enhances the listening experiences.' 
  BUT the DACmini uses anyway an internal switching power supply. Even if you upgrade the external one to a non-switching one, the internal one still remains and will chop the pristine clear power anyway.


----------



## gevorg

For those who got it, has anyone *not* like the 1-Ohm mod for DACmini?


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





gevorg said:


> For those who got it, has anyone *not* like the 1-Ohm mod for DACmini?


 

 yea interested on this as well! wondering whether it was better...and the differences in sound of course


----------



## Jojomite

Quote: 





plin said:


> It seems that our small DACmini gets quite attention lately. Another review (on page 52) with a Publisher's Choice Award (on page 206) for 2011:
> 
> http://www.tonepublications.com/MAGPDF/TA_042.pdf
> 
> ...


 

 true, haha i would say its worth a shot though!


----------



## turokrocks

My O2 amp with the LX DAC, are giving me great soundstage with my HE-500, I can't put my finger on it, but everything sounds more natural and cleaner, no excess or emphasize on anything, thank you Centrance


----------



## schaqfu

I'm very interested to hear the answer to this as well.  In particular, I'm curious whether the 1-Ohm mod on the DACmini will benefit the performance of the Ultrasone Edition 8, which are 30 ohm impedance headphones.  I'm also curious how much it helps with IEMs like the Shure SE530 and UE Triple.Fi.  I know this has been discussed in spurts earlier in this thread, but has anyone had an opportunity yet to do some more definitive comparisons?
   
  Thanks!
  
  Quote: 





gevorg said:


> For those who got it, has anyone *not* like the 1-Ohm mod for DACmini?


----------



## Twinster

I own a 1 ohm DACmini and like it alot. I never heard the regular DACmini but I have a DACport and my Magnum Bass is very solid out of the DACmini. Much punchier and detail. I have not tried any of my earphone with the DACmini but I will try to do it this weekend and report back. I have the Shure e500 (equivalent of the SE530 I believed) Ortofon eQ5 and Klipsch X10. 
  
  Quote: 





schaqfu said:


> I'm very interested to hear the answer to this as well.  In particular, I'm curious whether the 1-Ohm mod on the DACmini will benefit the performance of the Ultrasone Edition 8, which are 30 ohm impedance headphones.  I'm also curious how much it helps with IEMs like the Shure SE530 and UE Triple.Fi.  I know this has been discussed in spurts earlier in this thread, but has anyone had an opportunity yet to do some more definitive comparisons?
> 
> Thanks!


----------



## schaqfu

That's great, Twinster, thanks!  I look forward to your thoughts, as, I'm sure, do others.
  
  Quote: 





twinster said:


> I own a 1 ohm DACmini and like it alot. I never heard the regular DACmini but I have a DACport and my Magnum Bass is very solid out of the DACmini. Much punchier and detail. I have not tried any of my earphone with the DACmini but I will try to do it this weekend and report back. I have the Shure e500 (equivalent of the SE530 I believed) Ortofon eQ5 and Klipsch X10.


----------



## Twinster

As promise here is a mini review of two of my IEM with the DACmini. Please bare with me because I'm not very good with reviews. My audiophile vocabulary is very limited.
   
  Shure E500 (ES530)
  - Moving the volume knob I can ear some static noise
  - Normal volume level the pot is between 8 & 9 o'clock
  - The Shure retain is characteristic with rolled off hi, amazing mid's and well define and controlled bass notes.
   
  Ortofon eQ5
  - Moving the volume knob also generate a static noise.
  - Volume level is the same as the Shure between 8 & 9.
  - The eQ5 get way better hi's. They are balanced and retain their great sound signature with the DACmini. Great level of details and the stage is very good.
  - The low frequencies are perfect to me with good impact and definition.
   
  Songs used for mini review:
  Lazarus - Porcupine Tree
  Reckoner - Radiohead ( I love the beginning of this song )
  Una Notte A Napoli - Pink Martini
  Nocturne/ Bohemian Rhapsody - Lucia Micarelli
  Le Temp Des Cathédrales - Bruno Pelletier
  Sail - Awolnation ( The bass is just great on this track )
  Quote: 





schaqfu said:


> That's great, Twinster, thanks!  I look forward to your thoughts, as, I'm sure, do others.


----------



## schaqfu

Very cool.  Thanks for your thoughts, Twinster, and for taking the time to form them.
   
  Is the static associated with turning the volume pot expected behavior?
  
  Quote: 





twinster said:


> As promise here is a mini review of two of my IEM with the DACmini. Please bare with me because I'm not very good with reviews. My audiophile vocabulary is very limited.
> 
> Shure E500 (ES530)
> - Moving the volume knob I can ear some static noise
> ...


----------



## Twinster

No problem.  I never notice the static noise with my other headphones but I will make sure I try it tonight. I didn't ear any noise while the music was playing.
  
  Quote: 





schaqfu said:


> Very cool.  Thanks for your thoughts, Twinster, and for taking the time to form them.
> 
> Is the static associated with turning the volume pot expected behavior?


----------



## roker

You might have a defective unit.
   
  I was having static issues with my volume knob as well, so I sent it back to CEntrance and had it fixed.
   
  No problems at all since then.


----------



## Twinster

Good to know. I forgot to check last night if it was doing the same noise with my full size headphone. My only problem is that I bought my DACmini from someone here on the forum and found out after that the warranty was not transferable. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I own both the DACmini & DACport but cannot get any support from Centrance. I was very disappointed to find that out. I think every manufacture should allow warranty transfer of their product. I do not understand the rational behind that.
   
  If Centrance can explain  this to me it would be great. (anyone listening/reading from Centrance??) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





roker said:


> You might have a defective unit.
> 
> I was having static issues with my volume knob as well, so I sent it back to CEntrance and had it fixed.
> 
> No problems at all since then.


----------



## roker

I thought it was only an issue with one of headphones but noticed it was present with everyone of them, though fainter on some.
   
  I'd contact the account here for CEntrance about the problem.


----------



## Jay Listens

Hi Twinster,
   
  We go thru alot to hand test every product we sell. This this is true for both individual parts and retesting fully assembled products. Our warranty covers all products shipped from our facilities just outside of Chicago, as well as all CEntrance Authorized dealers worldwide. When you buy from us or from one of our authorized partners we have a means of assuring quality. When you make a 2nd hand purchase (on a forum/ebay/etc) we cannot assure this level of quality. Our warranty is given to all of our customers who purchase new products. It is impossible for us to maintain this level of quality assurance from a non-authorized 3rd party selling a used piece of equipment.
   
  Hope this helps explain the rationale behind our policy. I'm also going to send you a subsequent PM so we can hopefully resolve the pot issue.
   
  -Jay


----------



## dnell87

That doesn't make much sense at all. Even Dell allows for warranty's to be transferred between parties when sold used.


----------



## schaqfu

I succumbed (willingly) and purchased a DACmini CX directly from CEntrance with the 1-ohm mod yesterday.  Hopefully it arrives in time for me to bring it to the Washington, DC meet on January 28, which would be a fantastic opportunity to compare it head-on (no pun intended, but recognized) to a number of other units.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





schaqfu said:


> I succumbed (willingly) and purchased a DACmini CX directly from CEntrance with the 1-ohm mod yesterday.


 

 Happy listening and sorry for your wallet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, althought I believe DACmini has higher than average perfomance-to-price ratio.


----------



## Twinster

Thank you for following up on this matter Jay. Much appreciated. I'll pm you for the follow up.
  
  Quote: 





jay listens said:


> Hi Twinster,
> 
> We go thru alot to hand test every product we sell. This this is true for both individual parts and retesting fully assembled products. Our warranty covers all products shipped from our facilities just outside of Chicago, as well as all CEntrance Authorized dealers worldwide. When you buy from us or from one of our authorized partners we have a means of assuring quality. When you make a 2nd hand purchase (on a forum/ebay/etc) we cannot assure this level of quality. Our warranty is given to all of our customers who purchase new products. It is impossible for us to maintain this level of quality assurance from a non-authorized 3rd party selling a used piece of equipment.
> 
> ...


----------



## Twinster

I've just verified my DACmini with full size headphone and I cannot hear any static noise. I put my IEM back ( UE700 40 ohms 113db ) and can ear the noise while music on pause. Try my O2 amplifier and got a black background. Not bad for $100.


----------



## 3rdear

Any thoughts on the O2 amp vs. DACmini's? Is one an upgrade to the other or just a different flavor?


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

3rdear said:


> Any thoughts on the O2 amp vs. DACmini's? Is one an upgrade to the other or just a different flavor?




This please.


----------



## Twinster

I will went I have more time. I'm busy at work these days.
   
  I did a quick A/B this week for about 10 minutes but I was focusing on the headphone not the amp but I can say that the O2 was not disappointing. One think for sure is the amazing black/silent background. No noise at all. Even at full volume with sensitive IEM. I also believe the bass impact was a bit better on the DACmini. Both amplifier are very clean & detail.
   
  That's it for now guys. I'll try to do a more in depth but I'm not very good with the audiophile lingo/jargon. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





3rdear said:


> Any thoughts on the O2 amp vs. DACmini's? Is one an upgrade to the other or just a different flavor?


 

 Quote:


mad lust envy said:


> This please.


----------



## 3rdear

Cool, Thanks. I already pulled the trigger on the DACmini, just waiting for it to come in, and wanted to know if the O2 would be a good, substantial future addition.


----------



## MotifXF

I have been listening to the LCD-2 and Dacmini all week and they pair great like others have said in the past. The Dacmini has plenty of juice at low impedance and the neutral sound signature is perfect for the LCD-2.


----------



## canyondust

I too have the noisy volume pot... The kind fellows at Centrance told me to send it in to get fixed, but I just haven't had the time (I use the unit for work in an audio facility)... and I don't really want to part with it, because it RULES. I'm using it to drive LCD-2r2s, and wow.... what a lovely combo. I -LOVE- listening to music on this combo.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> I too have the noisy volume pot... The kind fellows at Centrance told me to send it in to get fixed, but I just haven't had the time (I use the unit for work in an audio facility)... and I don't really want to part with it, because it RULES. I'm using it to drive LCD-2r2s, and wow.... what a lovely combo. I -LOVE- listening to music on this combo.


 


  1 Ohm mod or not?
   
  I always have to ask, as I'm wondering if it's the next thing I should do.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





roker said:


> 1 Ohm mod or not?
> 
> I always have to ask, as I'm wondering if it's the next thing I should do.


 


  With orthos I do not think it really matters. Orthos principle of operation makes them immune to damping factor and frequency responce  variations due to amp impedance output.


----------



## YtseJamer

Has someone tried the LCD-3 with the DACmini ? How's the synergy ?
   
  Thank you
   
  Patrick


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





ytsejamer said:


> Has someone tried the LCD-3 with the DACmini ? How's the synergy ?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Patrick


 
   
  I sold my LCD-3 last week, so can't give you a very precise description now. The sound was pretty good, except that the soundstage is a bit closed in. And I need to crank up the volume quite a bit to reach normal listening level. 
   
  When I still had my Lyr, with proper tubes like the Valvo CCa or the Amperex 7308 that I had, the Lyr powers the LCD-3 with a degree of authority and power that is noticeably better than the DACmini. As for finesse, can't say for sure, somehow the sound of the pairing doesn't wow me, so I have moved on to some cheap Stax. Perhaps the sound of the headphone isn't for me...


----------



## YtseJamer

Thanks koonhua90.


----------



## vincents

HI SilentSound - thanks for your review - is part 2 posted somewhere as I cannot find it ?
   
  I have just bought myself a new DACmini PX, which if I am lucky I will get burned in in time for it to be my birthday present later this month. I acquired a DACPort as my first DAC, then an Audio-GD NFB-11 (with the Sabre ESS9018 chip) to go with my LCD-2. I am hoping that the reviews I read of the great synergy with the LCD2 and the improved power supply and isolation of the DACmini will be another step up. 
   
  I was able to buy the PX from the dealer for the same price as a CX black so it seemed a no brainer - probably won't use the amp function at all though as I was after a high end Dac-headamp combo on there are not that many single units around.
   
  Interested to see your next reviews when they come.
   
  regards - Vincent


----------



## Iorek

Hello all,
   
  I recently ordered and received a DACmini CX with the 1ohm mod. I'll be ordering a pair of Audio Technica W1000x headphones to pair with it soon, but for now I'm using Sennheiser HD595s as well as a Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 system. It looks and sounds great; however, I do have one problem with it, as well as a few questions.
   
  My problem is volume imbalance at low volumes. I've read that you're supposed to max out the volume control inside of Windows, but if I do that I can only set the volume knob on the CX to ~7-8 o'clock. There is a clear imbalance at this volume. If I set the primary Windows volume to 50% and foobar2000 to 25%, I can turn the volume knob up to 9 o'clock, and the imbalance is gone. My question is is this normal/optimal? How much is the sound degraded by having to use these volume settings, and is that degradation even audible?
   
  Now for my (noob) questions:
   
  Are the universal drivers only necessary if you're going to be recording? If I'm only using the DACmini for headphones and speakers, is it necessary?

 Along those lines, I assume the latency test is for recording equipment? When I tried it out it threw an error and said to "check your connections and verify if input/output levels match."

 Secondly, in the Windows 7 sound options, under the DACmini properties on the Advanced tab, when I do the format test the sound is distorted static-y. Is this normal? During normal playback I haven't gotten any static, but it's odd that it would have static there.
   
  Also, if it matters, I'm using USB input.
   
  Thanks guys!


----------



## canyondust

When you say you set the volume at 9 o clock, is that too loud on both headphones and the speaker system? If the volume is ok on the headphones, lower the gain on the input of the speaker system. If not, it sounds like there is gain being added in your software somewhere, but I don't know where to look as I'm unfamiliar with windows... Hopefully that helps


----------



## plin

Quote: 





iorek said:


> My problem is volume imbalance at low volumes. I've read that you're supposed to max out the volume control inside of Windows, but if I do that I can only set the volume knob on the CX to ~7-8 o'clock. There is a clear imbalance at this volume. If I set the primary Windows volume to 50% and foobar2000 to 25%, I can turn the volume knob up to 9 o'clock, and the imbalance is gone. My question is is this normal/optimal? How much is the sound degraded by having to use these volume settings, and is that degradation even audible?
> Are the universal drivers only necessary if you're going to be recording? If I'm only using the DACmini for headphones and speakers, is it necessary?
> Along those lines, I assume the latency test is for recording equipment? When I tried it out it threw an error and said to "check your connections and verify if input/output levels match."
> Secondly, in the Windows 7 sound options, under the DACmini properties on the Advanced tab, when I do the format test the sound is distorted static-y. Is this normal? During normal playback I haven't gotten any static, but it's odd that it would have static there.


 
   
  Volume imbalance is one thing that CEntrance says that check individually. From DACmini case study p9:
  «We sort potentiometers with the help of the sophisticated, Audio
  Precision-based automated test and relentlessly discard those, which fail a very
  narrow acceptance range. This is why  every DACmini features extreme channel
  balancing down to the noise floor, along with a smooth, quiet volume tracking curve.» So, probably this is a defective (not properly short-out) unit.
   
  Universal drivers are not necessary, you can enjoy your DACmini with standard Windows drivers, but some say that CEntrance Universal drivers offer a bit of more performance.
   
  Latency test is not applicable to DACmini.
   
  Sorry, I cannot help you with the format test, cannot think what may be wrong there.
   
  Enjoy your DACmini, it is a fine piece of audio equipment!


----------



## Iorek

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> When you say you set the volume at 9 o clock, is that too loud on both headphones and the speaker system? If the volume is ok on the headphones, lower the gain on the input of the speaker system. If not, it sounds like there is gain being added in your software somewhere, but I don't know where to look as I'm unfamiliar with windows... Hopefully that helps


 

 Sorry, I should have clarified. I'm really only concerned with the headphones. While the speakers are also imbalanced, they operate on their own potentiometer, so I'm sure that's their problem.
   
  At 9 o'clock is where I consider the volume to be comfortable, but that's after having turned down the Windows volume to 50% and foobar2000 to 25%. That's pretty low considering the general rule of thumb for best quality is to keep them at 100%.

  Quote: 





plin said:


> Volume imbalance is one thing that CEntrance says that check individually. From DACmini case study p9:
> «We sort potentiometers with the help of the sophisticated, Audio
> Precision-based automated test and relentlessly discard those, which fail a very
> narrow acceptance range. This is why  every DACmini features extreme channel
> ...


 

 Hmm, yeah, I can definitely hear an imbalance at low volumes. I can actually hear the imbalance shift from the left to the right and back to the left again as I turn the volume up. At 8 o'clock the imbalance is just slightly to the left. At 9 o'clock it seems to be relatively centered.
   
  Regarding the format test inside of the Windows sound menu, I'd just like to know if that's normal to have static. As I said I don't experience any static during normal playback, so I thought that was weird.


----------



## canyondust

I also have channel imbalance with my dacmini, but my headphones are 50ohms and not very sensitive.
What headphones are you using with the dacmini?

Having to reduce the gain digitally in 2 steps of -50% and -25% does seem too much. I have enjoyable playback at 9-10 o'clock with my software set to 100% (iTunes at 100%, system volume bypassed) 

Instinct tells me that in your situation there has to be some digital gain somewhere, or your headphones are 16ohm and have a sensitivity of >100db


----------



## plin

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> Having to reduce the gain digitally in 2 steps of -50% and -25% does seem too much. I have enjoyable playback at 9-10 o'clock with my software set to 100% (iTunes at 100%, system volume bypassed)


 
  Not really, this is just 2 bits (assuming linear volume control - in log would be much higher). DACmini is 24 bit, assuming that 'real' digital resolution in most high end24 bit  DAC's are around 21 bits, we can safely say that *for 16 bit music files*  one can use as much as 5 bits (almost 30db!) attenuation without SQ degradation.


----------



## Iorek

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> I also have channel imbalance with my dacmini, but my headphones are 50ohms and not very sensitive.
> What headphones are you using with the dacmini?
> Having to reduce the gain digitally in 2 steps of -50% and -25% does seem too much. I have enjoyable playback at 9-10 o'clock with my software set to 100% (iTunes at 100%, system volume bypassed)
> Instinct tells me that in your situation there has to be some digital gain somewhere, or your headphones are 16ohm and have a sensitivity of >100db


 

 Right now I am using Sennheiser HD595s, but I'm about to upgrade to Audio Technica W1000x, which are even more sensitive.

  
  Quote: 





plin said:


> Not really, this is just 2 bits (assuming linear volume control - in log would be much higher). DACmini is 24 bit, assuming that 'real' digital resolution in most high end24 bit  DAC's are around 21 bits, we can safely say that *for 16 bit music files*  one can use as much as 5 bits (almost 30db!) attenuation without SQ degradation.


 

 I'm using the USB input which according to CEntrance's site has a S/N of 113dB, so I can only lower the volume 17 dB before degradation starts. After testing more extensively last night, I've discovered that I need to lower the foobar volume by -12dB in order to put the CX at 9 o'clock for a comfortable listening level. Doable, but not much wiggle room, and I'm worried since the W1000x is even more sensitive.


----------



## canyondust

You don't happen to have the +10 Gain mod do you?


----------



## Iorek

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> You don't happen to have the +10 Gain mod do you?


 

 Heh, no, just the 1ohm mod... unless they did that one by mistake!


----------



## Iorek

So I'm borrowing a pair of HD800s from a friend, and with the Windows volume maxed, I can only take the volume knob to 8 o'clock. In the 6moon review of the DACmini they state that when using the HD800 with the DACmini most people would want the volume at 12-2:30. For me even 10 o'clock is *extremely* loud. I can't help but think I have something set up incorrectly for there to be such a difference in volumes.
   
  Any ideas?


----------



## canyondust

I'd say try your dacmini on another computer (stock, no added things like foobar) and see what kind of gain you get. If its STILL really loud, either your unit isnt per normal spec, or you have very sensitive hearing


----------



## some1x

Just upgraded the power supply to a Welborne Labs PS. Highly recommended. I found the Dacmini more effortless and dynamic; better bass definition;  some glare and hardness removed. Most importantly, less fatiguing.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





some1x said:


> Just upgraded the power supply to a Welborne Labs PS. Highly recommended. I found the Dacmini more effortless and dynamic; better bass definition;  some glare and hardness removed. Most importantly, less fatiguing.


 

 I haven't read many good things about that company's PS.


----------



## plin

Quote: 





some1x said:


> Just upgraded the power supply to a Welborne Labs PS. Highly recommended. I found the Dacmini more effortless and dynamic; better bass definition;  some glare and hardness removed. Most importantly, less fatiguing.


 

  I am not arguing what you are hearing, but according to CEntrance, there is no need for an upgraded power supply. DACmini is designed to operate with a various range of PSUs, it just needs adequate voltage and current. 
  There is a good technical reason for this, the DACmini chops the power fed from the external PSU, isolates it and re-regulates it. So, _in theory_, DACmini *is completely immune* to external PSU ripple, noise (common mode or not), etc.
  Personally I haven’t any experience with a better external PSU. I am just using an _inferior _external PSU (a Chinese made very cheap 12V 1A PSU) with no sound quality degradation at all compared to the stock one. 
  It would be interesting if others chime in and share their experiences with upgraded and / or linear power supplies with DACmini.


----------



## WilCox

Quote: 





plin said:


> It would be interesting if others chime in and share their experiences with upgraded and / or linear power supplies with DACmini.


 

 I've used my Kingrex linear PSU (13V 3A) to power the DACmini and was not able to detect any difference in sound quality with my LCD-2 or HD 800.
   
  Regarding the Welborne Labs power supply, I built one a few years ago for a Squeezebox and it is a very nice supply.  However, like with the DACmini, I was unable to detect any perceivable difference from the stock switching supply.  (Like the DACmini, the Squeezebox also chops up the external DC power with its internal switching supplies.)


----------



## mac336

Anyone know how much of an improvement I should expect going from the audio gd NFB-12 to the dacmini ?
   
  Also, is the dacmini a better pairing with the he-500 than a bifrost/lyr combo?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





mac336 said:


> Anyone know how much of an improvement I should expect going from the audio gd NFB-12 to the dacmini ?
> 
> Also, is the dacmini a better pairing with the he-500 than a bifrost/lyr combo?


 

 Can't respond to the NFB-12 question.  As for #2, I don't know if I would say better, but both rigs were quite good with the HE-500 at RMAF, although the DACmini is not as powerful and has slightly less impact.  They were in different parts of the room and a side-by-side listen wasn't possible.  
   
  When I brought my gear to RMAF to display, my dynamic rig was the DACmini with only the HE-500 and LCD-2, because I thought this was good enough for people to get an idea of what Head-Fi is about. And my Stat rig was the balanced KGSS with SR-007 and HE-60, which was not hugely better than the dynamic rig.  I used an Apogee mini-DAC to drive both rigs at the same time from the same source, but the Apogee is only slightly better than the built-in DAC of the DACmini (but offers balanced output for the KGSS).
   
  Chris_Himself was using an HDP for his HE-500 and switched to the Schitt gear and thinks it was an upgrade.  All I can say about DACmini is that it's also an upgrade over the HDP.


----------



## ringyring

For everyone who has experience with the LCD-2/DACmini combo, whats your opinion on how it does female vocals? I was also wondering how the combo handles pop music. Thanks in advance.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ringyring said:


> For everyone who has experience with the LCD-2/DACmini combo, whats your opinion on how it does female vocals? I was also wondering how the combo handles pop music. Thanks in advance.


 

 I've posted several times in here that the LCD-2/DACmini is a great pairing, and that's with female vocals, pop, rock, classical, jazz, new age, acoustic, etc.  Alex at Audeze was impressed enough to buy a DACmini at RMAF 2011.


----------



## ringyring

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I've posted several times in here that the LCD-2/DACmini is a great pairing, and that's with female vocals, pop, rock, classical, jazz, new age, acoustic, etc.  Alex at Audeze was impressed enough to buy a DACmini at RMAF 2011.


 


  Yeah I had previously read though the entire thread, just wanted to see if anyone had any other thoughts.
   
  That Audeze tidbit is cool, pretty high praise for a combo/product when the co-founder decides to get one himself.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Excellent customer service!
   
  I had a problem with static when turning the volume knob. I requested warranty support and Michael Goodman responded immediately. CEntrance is replacing the volume pot and I'm adding the 1 Ohm mod while it's in the shop. These guys take very good care of their customers.
   
  I use my Dacmini with my LCD2, Etymotic ER4P, Shure SE 535, and modded Fostex T50RP. The sound quality is superb with each one. I'm hoping the 1 Ohm mod improves the SQ even more. If so, great. If no difference, Still great! 
   
  BMF


----------



## plin

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> Excellent customer service!
> 
> I had a problem with static when turning the volume knob. I requested warranty support and Michael Goodman responded immediately. CEntrance is replacing the volume pot and I'm adding the 1 Ohm mod while it's in the shop. These guys take very good care of their customers.
> 
> ...


 
  Please, post your impressions about SQ after the mod.


----------



## dukeskd

I agree, CEntrance customer service is A++. The SQ is very good, but lacks power for the HD800s IMO.


----------



## Twinster

Quote: 





dukeskd said:


> I agree, CEntrance customer service is A++. The SQ is very good, but lacks power for the HD800s IMO.


 
  Same here with the T1.


----------



## WilCox

Quote: 





dukeskd said:


> I agree, CEntrance customer service is A++. The SQ is very good, but lacks power for the HD800s IMO.


 
  I don't find any lack of power for the HD800, or K702 for that matter.  Are you sure you are not confusing gain with power?


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





wilcox said:


> I don't find any lack of power for the HD800, or K702 for that matter.  Are you sure you are not confusing gain with power?


 

 By power I mean that the HD800 doesn't have its potential fullfilled, the amp can control the volume but the SQ is lacking. When I bought the Lyr and tried it out with the HD800, it was like a powerhorse compared to the light amp of Dacmini. The same goes with my LCD-2s. When I first had the Dacmini, and it was my only amp I was satisfied with the sound but I knew it could get better and hence I bought the Lyr. When comparing them, it is apparent how they differ, sometimes when I plug the headphones back to the Dacmini I miss the Lyr's power that I remove it almost immediately and put it back to the Lyr.


----------



## dukeskd

Y'all can check out my pictures of the DACMini and the HD800 + LCD-2 + D7000 with the Lyr also and a short review of all these phones and the amps at:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/609125/hd800-vs-lcd-2-rev-2-vs-d7000-shootout


----------



## autarch1

Has anyone used the DacMini with Ultrasone Ed. 8's? If so, was it the stock configuration or with the 1 ohm mod? Any impressions would be appreciated.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

O.K. I received my Dacmini from the CEntrance shop 4 days ago. I wanted to listen over an extended period of time before offering my impressions. The CEntrance "Boys" did a great job, once again. I had a scratchy noise when turning the volume knob that irritated me. Michael, Kenny, and David All emailed me with updates along the way. They informed me they now have a new volume pot that meets their Quality Control specs and that's what I got.  They also installed the 1 ohm output impedance mod and tightened up the selector knob. On top of that, they covered all this Out of Warranty because I sent my Dacmini in once before for the same problem and because of the 4 week wait while they tested the new volume pot. If that was not enough, they did not charge me for the 1 ohm mod. Talk about Customer Service Excellence! These guys have been great to deal with; super fast communication, top notch service, and nice guys to boot.
   
  Now, for the sound. Auditory memory is ephemeral and subject to placebo and Halo Effects.  All I can say is that the sound quality I'm hearing from my Audeze LCD2's and modded T50RPs is magic. I have a good friend who heard my Dacmini paired with my LCD2's. He sold his Stax Lambda's and bought the Dacmini + LCD2's within the same week. He recently bought a Benchmark HD and we had a mini shootout. We took turns switching out the Dacmini and Benchmark paired with our LCD2's and my modded T50RP's. Neither of us could tell one amp from the other.


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> O.K. I received my Dacmini from the CEntrance shop 4 days ago. I wanted to listen over an extended period of time before offering my impressions. The CEntrance "Boys" did a great job, once again. I had a scratchy noise when turning the volume knob that irritated me. Michael, Kenny, and David All emailed me with updates along the way. They informed me they now have a new volume pot that meets their Quality Control specs and that's what I got.  They also installed the 1 ohm output impedance mod and tightened up the selector knob. On top of that, they covered all this Out of Warranty because I sent my Dacmini in once before for the same problem and because of the 4 week wait while they tested the new volume pot. If that was not enough, they did not charge me for the 1 ohm mod. Talk about Customer Service Excellence! These guys have been great to deal with; super fast communication, top notch service, and nice guys to boot.
> 
> Now, for the sound. Auditory memory is ephemeral and subject to placebo and Halo Effects.  All I can say is that the sound quality I'm hearing from my Audeze LCD2's and modded T50RPs is magic. I have a good friend who heard my Dacmini paired with my LCD2's. He sold his Stax Lambda's and bought the Dacmini + LCD2's within the same week. He recently bought a Benchmark HD and we had a mini shootout. We took turns switching out the Dacmini and Benchmark paired with our LCD2's and my modded T50RP's. Neither of us could tell one amp from the other.


 

 +1
  The Dacmini is not only a great product but from a great company.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





dukeskd said:


> +1
> The Dacmini is not only a great product but from a great company.


 
   
  I've had my Dacmini back from the shop, now, for a week. I got the 1 ohm output impedance mod.
   
  I've had lots of time to listen to my LCD2's and modded T50RP's. I can say without a doubt that the treble is extended and more detailed in both than when the output impedance was set at 10 ohms. I don't hear any difference in the bass and midrange which remain "killer."
   
  I believe the 1 ohm mod is responsible for improved top end since it's the only variable in my audio chain that's different. The 1 ohm mod works great for me.


----------



## Jay Listens

Thanks for the kind words guys!!!
   
  Really glad the mod is working out for you. Let me know if you need anything else.
   





   
  -Jay


----------



## bayac

Ordered mine last week. Can't wait to see it on my desk!


----------



## IV10K

I want to ask the bass really differ from DACMini And Burson ? as I see some members saying Burson has a better bass,
  Thanks


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





iv10k said:


> I want to ask the bass really differ from DACMini And Burson ? as I see some members saying Burson has a better bass,
> Thanks


 

 Burson has the better PRaT and I have to say, bass that comes with it (PRaT goes linearly with bass in my book). DACMini has a more analytical nature with less PRaT and I think it enhances the soundstage quite nicely, including the great synergy in treble with my LCD-2 and HD800.


----------



## IV10K

Quote: 





dukeskd said:


> Burson has the better PRaT and I have to say, bass that comes with it (PRaT goes linearly with bass in my book). DACMini has a more analytical nature with less PRaT and I think it enhances the soundstage quite nicely, including the great synergy in treble with my LCD-2 and HD800.


 
  Better as It's significantly better ? I mean when you listen to Burson and then back to DACMini you feel the lack of the Bass ?
  Thanks


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





iv10k said:


> Better as It's significantly better ? I mean when you listen to Burson and then back to DACMini you feel the lack of the Bass ?
> Thanks


 

 Well its not the first thing that comes up when listening through the DacMini. When you listen to the Burson amp, it feels as if it was specially designed for Rock/Electronic music because of the concentration on prat and bass dynamics. DacMini is more universal, as it will suit all genres.


----------



## IV10K

Thanks that's what I wanted to know ! +1


----------



## IV10K

Do you know how to make DACMini read songs digitally from iPad ? Is there some kinda Lod cable that could make this happen ?
  Thanks


----------



## IV10K

I'm having problem with the amp It's weak to drive T1 I had to max the volume level on it so I can reach okay level,
  Does sound card has to do something with it ?


----------



## underhysteria

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> O.K. I received my Dacmini from the CEntrance shop 4 days ago. I wanted to listen over an extended period of time before offering my impressions. The CEntrance "Boys" did a great job, once again. I had a scratchy noise when turning the volume knob that irritated me. Michael, Kenny, and David All emailed me with updates along the way. They informed me they now have a new volume pot that meets their Quality Control specs and that's what I got.  They also installed the 1 ohm output impedance mod and tightened up the selector knob. On top of that, they covered all this Out of Warranty because I sent my Dacmini in once before for the same problem and because of the 4 week wait while they tested the new volume pot. If that was not enough, they did not charge me for the 1 ohm mod. Talk about Customer Service Excellence! These guys have been great to deal with; super fast communication, top notch service, and nice guys to boot.
> 
> Now, for the sound. Auditory memory is ephemeral and subject to placebo and Halo Effects.  All I can say is that the sound quality I'm hearing from my Audeze LCD2's and modded T50RPs is magic. I have a good friend who heard my Dacmini paired with my LCD2's. He sold his Stax Lambda's and bought the Dacmini + LCD2's within the same week. He recently bought a Benchmark HD and we had a mini shootout. We took turns switching out the Dacmini and Benchmark paired with our LCD2's and my modded T50RP's. Neither of us could tell one amp from the other.


 
   
  Thanks for your wonderful input..
   
  So the 1 ohm mod is recommended to drive low impedance headphones like the LCD-2?


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

underhysteria said:


> Thanks for your wonderful input..
> 
> So the 1 ohm mod is recommended to drive low impedance headphones like the LCD-2?




Yes. And I definitely hear the improvement with my LCD's and modded Fostex T50RP's, especially in the treble range.


----------



## Jay Listens

Thanks for the feedback BlueMonkeyFlyer!!!
   
  I've been personally partial to the stock sound of the 10ohm output, but we have seen a big spike in those pairing the LCDs with the 1ohm mod as of recent.
   
  Not sure if we are doing our annual Independence Day Sale, but if anyone has questions about this mod, what is involved in the process or wants a coupon code. Please just send me a PM. I'm more than happy to help.
   
  -Jay


----------



## vjmh802

Hi all,
   
  I've had the DACmini now for over a year and I love it and have no reason to upgrade any of my gear or any need. However, now I'm thinking of getting the HD 800 and using the DACmini to drive them. I drive other headphones I have with the DACmini, and they all sound great. Would the DACmini be able to drive the HD 800 to their fullest? If not, I was thinking of getting the USB option of the Violectric HPA V200 headphone amp. However, it costs quite a lot and would make me have to wait for the HD 800 probably another year. 
   
  So basically, can the DACmini be able to drive the Senn HD 800 to their fullest or somewhat close to their fullest?
   
  Thanks


----------



## plin

Quote: 





vjmh802 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I've had the DACmini now for over a year and I love it and have no reason to upgrade any of my gear or any need. However, now I'm thinking of getting the HD 800 and using the DACmini to drive them. I drive other headphones I have with the DACmini, and they all sound great. Would the DACmini be able to drive the HD 800 to their fullest? If not, I was thinking of getting the USB option of the Violectric HPA V200 headphone amp. However, it costs quite a lot and would make me have to wait for the HD 800 probably another year.
> 
> ...


 
  I have not tested the HD-800 with DACmini  but I do not think HD-800 is difficult as a load. But some say it has 'difficult' sound signature (must be paired with warm gear). DACmini is on the warm side of neutral.


----------



## vjmh802

From the reviews I've read of the DACmini, they've said that they had no problems driving the HD 800's.. so I'll probably just stick with the DACmini. Just need to save up for the 800's now.


----------



## roker

If anyone is on the fence about buying the DACmini, I'd just like to say this:
   
  AWESOME customer service.
   
  They're located in the US, they do all warranty work here, they answer emails in a very timely manner, and they make it worth your while (should something go wrong).
   
  Oh, and it sounds fantastic.
   
  Whether I'm listening to music through my computer or using the headphone amp portion with my turntable, this is a fantastic piece of equipment.


----------



## TheMiddleSky

Quote: 





vjmh802 said:


> From the reviews I've read of the DACmini, they've said that they had no problems driving the HD 800's.. so I'll probably just stick with the DACmini. Just need to save up for the 800's now.


 
  Power wise, DACmini really has no problem to drive HD800, though if we talk about quality wise, you can get better sound by adding high quality external desktop amp.


----------



## dukeskd

themiddlesky said:


> Power wise, DACmini really has no problem to drive HD800, though if we talk about quality wise, you can get better sound by adding high quality external desktop amp.



 
 Agree with this, it has power but doesnt pronounce all the best features of the HD800, thats why I got the Lyr and power them in combo, the DAC is DACMini and amp = Lyr.


----------



## vjmh802

I think I'm going to get the Violectric HPA V200, and either pair it up with the DACmini or get the USB option.


----------



## canyondust

I just got my DACmini back from repair (volume pot replace) and I'm so glad to have it back. My mind is actually trying to convince me it sounds better than when I shipped it back... which is actually feasible if your volume pot is problematic... but it's far more likely I just got used to listening to my crummy Mbox2  I will say it DID come back to me missing it's front two rubber feet, so I have a cloth under the front so it doesn't scratch my table up. I have no doubt the rubber feet will be out on the first flight my way; the Centrance guys are really good about that kind of thing.
   
  AND for those wanting to know, the newer pot feels a bit sturdier than the last one, has more resistance (which I don't mind one bit). Also for those who care about such things: channel tracking at very low volume is a bit more pronounced than my old pot, and could be an issue for someone who listens fairly quietly on low impedance IEMs (like UEs) but it's a non issue on my 50ohm LCD-2s, the imbalance seems to dissipate with volume pot settings louder than approx 45dB, so fairly quiet. My quietest listening volume would be around 50dB, and anything lower than that would mean I was trying to listen to music and something external at the same time..


----------



## shigzeo

I've a review of this little bugger coming along. Personally, I could spend the rest of my days with this amp and none other. I've been using the PX Audiophile Desktop System, and found myself most surprised with the quality of the power amp and speakers, which surpassed my expectations in an integrated system for the price. 2000$ isn't cheap, but considering the DAC/amp/power amp/speakers in this system, it is a paltry sum. Bass I was not expecting from such small speakers, and such a low noise floor I was not expecting from a system with a rather cheap power supply.
   
   



plin said:


> I have not tested the HD-800 with DACmini  but I do not think HD-800 is difficult as a load. But some say it has 'difficult' sound signature (must be paired with warm gear). DACmini is on the warm side of neutral.


 

  The DACmini should have zero problems with the HD800. You'll get enough volume and have no impedance mismatch problems. 10Ω or so output is much lower than the absolute lowest bound the HD800 hits in any wild impedance swing.
   
  It is quite an impressive system.


----------



## appletree

Probably a silly question, but does dacmini CX do the playback in _real-time_ ? Like it can be used for gaming ? Asking just to be sure (because I read it uses some sort of internal buffering to defeat jitter)


----------



## roker

Quote: 





appletree said:


> Probably a silly question, but does dacmini CX do the playback in _real-time_ ? Like it can be used for gaming ? Asking just to be sure (because I read it uses some sort of internal buffering to defeat jitter)


 
   
  real time


----------



## Matter

Anyone knows how the dacmini pairs with IEMs?
  Looking for a dac for my computer and I happen to chance upon the dacmini and am considering getting it.
   
  Also will be getting a pair of headphones in the near future so will this be a good piece of equipment to purchase?
   
  Thanks


----------



## roker

Quote: 





matter said:


> Anyone knows how the dacmini pairs with IEMs?
> Looking for a dac for my computer and I happen to chance upon the dacmini and am considering getting it.
> 
> Also will be getting a pair of headphones in the near future so will this be a good piece of equipment to purchase?
> ...


 
   
  depends on the IEMs, but for the most part, I'd say it's overkill.  I'm not sure why people made a big stink about this amp and IEMs, personally if I using IEMs as my primarly headphone, I'd probably buy a smaller amp, fine tuned for those types of things.  That's not to say it doesn't perform well.  I use my Phonak 022s on occasion when I need absoulte silence around me.  I haven't had balance issues since they replaced the pot on my amp, then again, the Phonaks seem to be a little more demanding than your average IEM (not to say that it needs an amp, but it can take a bit more to push it).


----------



## dwreedii

I ordered one this morning...I can't wait to take it for a spin when it arrives!!!


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





matter said:


> Anyone knows how the dacmini pairs with IEMs?
> Looking for a dac for my computer and I happen to chance upon the dacmini and am considering getting it.
> 
> Also will be getting a pair of headphones in the near future so will this be a good piece of equipment to purchase?
> ...


 

 Hey Matter,
   
  As Roker said, it does somewhat depend on the IEMs you are using. There is definitely more than enough power to run IEMS as well as most headphones you may be considering. It is only a matter of type due to varying frequency responses of certain IEMs. Some customers request a 1 ohm hp modification to help keep those variations to a minimum. We also offer low and high gain modifications to help customize each unit for certain tastes and needs.
   
  Feel free to send me a message if you have any more questions!
   
  -Kenny


----------



## joashtzh

Just bought a second-set locally (singapore) a couple days ago, and my initial impressions with lcd 2 rev 2 are very very positive. 
   
  Coming from nuforce HD, there's considerable improvement in resolution, accuracy, soundstage and overall coherence in sound. The music just sounds so much more involving and fun while being more detailed at the same time.


----------



## nieveulv

will the dacmini have enough power to drive the beyer t1 or ath w3000anv?


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





nieveulv said:


> will the dacmini have enough power to drive the beyer t1 or ath w3000anv?


 

 Hi Nieveulv!
   
  Kenny from CEntrance here. Just wanted to let you know that beyer t1's have been known to receive quite sufficient power from the DACmini. They are one of the pair that we use here at the headquarters to test each unit. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I do not have experience with the ath w 3000anv, but with a low impedance of 40 ohms, and a sensitivity of 102 dB, I do think it would drive them fine. We do offer a high gain modification for those that want a bit of extra juice.
   
  Be sure to send me a message for more details on mods or if you have any other questions.
   
  -KS


----------



## plin

Quote: 





nieveulv said:


> will the dacmini have enough power to drive the beyer t1 or ath w3000anv?


 
  Yes. These are fairly sensitive dynamic phones and dacmini should be capable of driving them to maximum levels.


----------



## roker

I think I spied some DacMini marketing stuff with the T1s used for photo shoots.  That's a positive sign as any.  
   
  I'm thinking of adding a headphone more equip for vocals.  Anyone here rocking the Senn 600/650s?


----------



## appletree

May I ask if the dacmini cx is really packed without power cord ? Mine has arrived that way. Adapter was there just nothing with which to plug it into wall   Had to use some old PC cable...


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





appletree said:


> May I ask if the dacmini cx is really packed without power cord ? Mine has arrived that way. Adapter was there just nothing with which to plug it into wall   Had to use some old PC cable...


 
   
  Sorry about that appletree!

 It certainly should have been there. Send me a message with your info and I will send you one.
   
  -KS


----------



## Lazyboy_sg

Quote: 





ksef10 said:


> Hi Nieveulv!
> 
> Kenny from CEntrance here. Just wanted to let you know that beyer t1's have been known to receive quite sufficient power from the DACmini. They are one of the pair that we use here at the headquarters to test each unit.
> 
> ...


 
  HI Kenny,
   
  So do I have to opt for the High Gain mod in order to drive the T1, LCD 2.2, LCD 3 and W3000ANV to a sufficient level? I may at sometime in the future acquire a HE-6 but I suspect even with High Gain Mod that the DAC Mini CX will not be supplying enough juice for the HE-6.


----------



## Ksef10

Hi Lazyboy,
   
  In my opinion, there is enough power to drive t1's and LCD's without the high gain mod. We have all of those for testing purposes. The W3000ANV should also fit within that categories according to its specs. Some people like to get the mod just so they have more headroom and can keep the dial a little lower or because they simply like to listen loud.
   
  It has been reported that the gain of 10 mod does help provide the HE-6 with a more adequate amount of drive than the stock version of DACmini. There have been users that have used the power amp section on our DACmini PX to sufficiently drive them (http://centrance.com/blog/2011/11/04/dacmini-px-drives-he-6/). They are known as one of the hardest to drive cans and I certainly would love to try them out with the DACmini but have yet to get a chance.
   
  Anyone else have experiences with the DACmini and HE-6?
   
   
  -Kenny


----------



## elnero

I had the regular gain paired with LCD-2's, depending on the recording the volume dial was between 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock, but usually closer to 10. I certainly don't think increasing the gain would have been necessary.
   
  While I haven't had the opportunity to hear the DACmini with the W3000ANV, they're a fairly easy drive so high gain wouldn't be necessary, in fact possibly even detrimental as it would lessen the usable volume.


----------



## mikemercer

the DACmini (CX and PX) also makes a killer line-stage with their "variable output mod" - just FYI.
  I used it for a long time on my desktop system w/ my Macbook running Amarra Hifi (50 bucks) and my Audioengine A2's.
  So it did a great job as a line-stage there, and when I went to my Audeze LCD3's it was also a killer headphone amp.
   
  The ALO Audio Pan Am is blowin' my mind right now however.
   
  I plan on keeping the DACmini PX (as part of my Audiophile Desktop System) as a reference.
  It's especially cool in black, and, with a Red Wine Audio Black Lightning power supply!!!!


----------



## ptrok

General question to Centrance: Does Jay listens a.k.a. Jonathan still work for Centrance because I sent him a P.M about my Dacmini and never got a response. It's been about 3 weeks. Thanks to whom ever replies with the information.


----------



## mgoodman

Sorry about slower responce. We are very busy with our new product HiFi-M8. I will make sure we respond on Monday.


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





ptrok said:


> General question to Centrance: Does Jay listens a.k.a. Jonathan still work for Centrance because I sent him a P.M about my Dacmini and never got a response. It's been about 3 weeks. Thanks to whom ever replies with the information.


 
  Hey Ptrok,
   
  My name is Kenny and I also work for CEntrance.
   
  Feel free to send me a PM with any questions!
   
  -KS


----------



## ptrok

Thanks for your fast response. I will be sending a pm.


----------



## zilch0md

I've joined the club - ordered a DACmini CX with the 1-Ohm mod, today.
   
  The DACport LX has made me a CEntrance fan.
   




   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> I've joined the club - ordered a DACmini CX with the 1-Ohm mod, today.
> 
> The DACport LX has made me a CEntrance fan.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Glad I was able to help you out via PM's.  Looking forward to your impressions.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Glad I was able to help you out via PM's.  Looking forward to your impressions.


 
   
  Yes, thank you!  
   
  And your reviews of the DACmini CX with LCD-2 were very influential.  
   
  Mike


----------



## Xenobium

does anyone have any idea if the dacmini pairs well with the grado rs1i?


----------



## bayac

I wonder if it's possible to order a spare top plate of the chassis.
  Mine got scratched by my friend's DDC at a local meet...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





xenobium said:


> does anyone have any idea if the dacmini pairs well with the grado rs1i?


 
   
  I really liked the pairing of my RS-1 (APS V3 cable) with DACmini at RMAF when the DACmini was first introduced.  Unfortunately, I sold the RS-1 about 3 months before I got my own DACmini, so I didn't get to try it out again.  For two years in a row I loaned those RS-1 to CEntrance for the RMAF show, since the pairing was so much better than with their DT-880 that they'd bring.  The 1st time it was to show off the DACport, and then the next year it was the DACmini if I recall correctly.


----------



## Twinster

I use my SR325 with my DACmini (1 ohm output) and I like the combo very much. It save me on time for not warming up the MAD.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> I've joined the club - ordered a DACmini CX with the 1-Ohm mod, today.
> 
> The DACport LX has made me a CEntrance fan.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Uhhh...   It's here...   and...   I'm astonished.  
   
  I hate first impressions like that, but...  this is unbelievably good.
   
*96/24 WAV -> Foobar -> USB -> DACmini CX with 1-Ohm Mod -> Toxic Cables Silver Poison -> LCD-2 rev. 1*
   
  Keep in mind that the only amps I've ever heard before tonight are the Schiit Lyr, the Meier Stepdance, and the iBasso PB2, so I wish I could say I've been around the block more than I have, but still, this DACmini CX is blowing them all away.  
   
  It can't be placebo effect.  I've been missing so much.   
   
  Scary hobby, this - the more you spend, the better it gets.  Stop me before I listen to anything nicer.
   
  Mike


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Glad I was able to help you out via PM's.  Looking forward to your impressions.


 
   
  And thank you again Larry for your very patient and generous responses to all of my questions.  
   
  The posts you've made regarding the DACmini CX caught my attention, but I thank you sincerely for all the time you've spent discussing alternatives.  
   
  You inspire me to help others.
   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Uhhh...   It's here...   and...   I'm astonished.
> 
> I hate first impressions like that, but...  this is unbelievably good.
> 
> ...


 
   
  My DACmini is fairly comparable to my Stello DA100 Signature feeding my maxed Woo WA6 with upgraded tubes (except with HD800 where the WA6 is better when I roll in the right tubes).  It's still amazing what they can squeeze out of the DACmini for less than 1/2 what I put into the other rig.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> My DACmini is fairly comparable to my Stello DA100 Signature feeding my maxed Woo WA6 with upgraded tubes (except with HD800 where the WA6 is better when I roll in the right tubes).  It's still amazing what they can squeeze out of the DACmini for less than 1/2 what I put into the other rig.


 
  I feel much the same way. I liked my Dacmini with stock 10 ohm output impedance. I sent it in a couple of months ago for a volume pot upgrade and while there decided to get the 1 ohm mod. I'm glad I did because the sound improved significantly in the treble department. My LCD2 v1 and modded T50RP's sound much better in the upper frequency range. Whether the perceived improvement is due to placebo or if it's real makes no difference to me. It still sounds better to me and has from Day 1. The guys at CEntrance have been responsive, friendly, helpful before and after the sale.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> I feel much the same way. I liked my Dacmini with stock 10 ohm output impedance. I sent it in a couple of months ago for a volume pot upgrade and while there decided to get the 1 ohm mod. I'm glad I did because the sound improved significantly in the treble department. My LCD2 v1 and modded T50RP's sound much better in the upper frequency range. Whether the perceived improvement is due to placebo or if it's real makes no difference to me. It still sounds better to me and has from Day 1. The guys at CEntrance have been responsive, friendly, helpful before and after the sale.


 
   
  I have to admit that your testimony, much earlier in this thread, regarding your decision to go for the 1-Ohm output impedance mod was very influential in my decision to order the DACmini CX with that upgrade. It's still burning in, but I want to say at the moment that I am extremely satisfied with the just-right brightness and neutrality/transparency of the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod into Toxic Cables Silver Poison and LCD-2 rev.1. 
   
  Thank you for sharing the details of your decision-making at that time.  This forum is a wealth of information for anyone willing to dig for it, thanks to articulate contributors like you, Larry, and many others, of course.
   
  Mike


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Uhhh...   It's here...   and...   I'm astonished.
> 
> I hate first impressions like that, but...  this is unbelievably good.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Glad you like it!


----------



## RedBull

I'm just wondering, if the 1 ohm mod is so good, why don't Centrance just make it factory default?
Anyone know what the 'side effect' of this mod? Eg. More hiss with IEM? Or?


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





ksef10 said:


> Glad you like it!


 
   
  Thanks Ksef10,
   
  Here's what I wrote in a PM to HeadphoneAddict, yesterday (an early assessment of the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod):
   
   
   Quoting myself:
   


> How do I like it?   I'm absolutely floored by how good it sounds with the LCD-2!   I'm beginning to wonder if there's a problem with my interconnect cable that I've been using to connect the various sources to either the Stepdance or the PB2.
> 
> The DACmini CX is SO much nicer than any chain I've ever heard before!   Of course, with my limited experience, that's not saying much, but still - it's leaps and bounds ahead of anything else I've heard.  It even has better dynamics and more killer bass control and extension than the DACport LX -> 16V iBasso PB2 with aforementioned op-amps.  But it also has greater transparency and resolution than the DACport LX - 15V Stepdance.  I'm absolutely certain of what I'm saying here, on both counts!   But it gets better...  There's a whole new world of imaging and soundstage, separation of instruments, ambiance, and naturalness, as well as detail with smoothness that I've NEVER heard before.  I can't believe how hog-tied my LCD-2 have been.  The LCD-2 has been unleashed with the DACmini CX!
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'd like to elaborate by saying that where the DACport LX - > 16V-powered PB2 is allegedly putting out 2500mW vs. the DACmini's alleged 1500mW, the DACmini has better dynamics and tighter control of the bass - audible traits you would expect to improve with an increase in power.  
   
  When using the 16V PB2 with LME49990s and HA5002s as my desktop amp, _I was willfully forfeiting the higher resolutions and more neutral response _a PB2 can produce with _less powerful_ op-amp and buffer combinations (i.e. OPA1612s with dummy buffers) - just to enjoy the dynamics and bass control of the LCD-2 that come with more power.  It was a compromise, and having borrowed a Schiit Lyr for about four weeks, last summer, I can say that my use of the PB2 was somewhat like using the_ lower-resolving, less neutral_, but spectacularly powerful, and thus wonderfully dynamic Schiit Lyr, where you can enjoy dynamics and bass control at the expense of resolution - which, in my understanding, is typical of both hybrid and tube amps. There are exceptions, of course.  Read reviews of the Peak/Volcano for an uber-detailed hybrid with fast transients. 
   
  On the flip side, if I wanted to enjoy high resolution and spectacular neutrality (the closest I had heard to true transparency), I would reach for the DACport LX -> 15V Meier Stepdance combination, which I primarily used as a portable rig (with the LCD-2).  But again, I did so _willfully forfeiting the dynamics and bass_ that I could only enjoy with the PB2.  Another compromise.
   
  Well, you know the punch line, from what I wrote in my PM to Larry - I'm getting the best of both worlds with the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod.  It offers an _exceptional balance of virtues - _ traits that seem to run at odds with each other, normally.  I don't doubt that spending a lot more on a DAC and amp combo might take me to places I can only imagine at the moment, where _the balance between power and finesse_ are just as good or better, and the overall sound quality is somehow more superior still, but for now, the DACmini CX is checking all the boxes like nothing my relatively novice ears have heard before.  
   
  Oh, the music!  I actually get little euphoric rushes that take me by surprise from time to time, giggling at just how good this rig sounds.
   
  Mike


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Thanks Ksef10,
> 
> Here's what I wrote in a PM to HeadphoneAddict, yesterday (an early assessment of the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod):
> 
> ...


 
   
  Mike,
   
  Thanks for the report of impressions.  The Dacmini is "Killer" with modded Fostex T50RP's and my LCD2's!
   
  Keith


----------



## zilch0md

Hi RedBull,
    
  Quote:


redbull said:


> I'm just wondering, if the 1 ohm mod is so good, why don't Centrance just make it factory default?
> Anyone know what the 'side effect' of this mod? Eg. More hiss with IEM? Or?


 
   
  The 1-Ohm mod works really well with the LCD-2 and no doubt with some other headphones, but the default 10-Ohm output impedance is surely the better way to go with still other headphones.  
   
  I suspect that CEntrance decided to make the 10-Ohm impedance the default because they believe it would sound best with more headphones than would the 1-Ohm impedance.  So, even though 1-Ohm sounds GREAT with the LCD-2, in my opinion, it can't be great with every headphone and every person's taste.
   
  In my case, I've never heard a DACmini CX with the 10-Ohm output impedance, but decided to order the 1-Ohm mod because I read that several LCD-2 owners prefer it -AND- CEntrance describes the 1-Ohm mod as being more neutral sounding - which is a trait I personally prefer.  Lastly, bluemonkeyflyer writes that the 1-Ohm mod sounds brighter than the 10-Ohm mod - again, a trait I prefer - I don't like "dark" chains.  
   
  I've tried my DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod using the Shure SE530, this evening, and I don't hear any hiss, by the way.
   
  I hope that helps,
   
  Mike


----------



## RedBull

Thanks Mike. That surely helps. As I like more 'darker' sound, then I guess I should be liking the 10 ohms more.

Good to hear that DACmini don't hiss with SE530, which I like very much but notoriously hiss sensitive. My SE530 mostly hiss with my laptop headphone out.


----------



## Xenobium

So my dacmini cx just arrived - loving the sound but there is one major problem - shielding is extremely poor. If I have a phone within 2 meters of the unit, buzzing goes off. This isnt a headphone problem as I have tried a few cans with the same result. Any thoughts are appreciated!


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





xenobium said:


> So my dacmini cx just arrived - loving the sound but there is one major problem - shielding is extremely poor. If I have a phone within 2 meters of the unit, buzzing goes off. This isnt a headphone problem as I have tried a few cans with the same result. Any thoughts are appreciated!


 
   
  I can listen within 1 foot without hum or buzz using LCD2, Shure 535, Ety ER4P, and modded T50RP.  Contact Michael Goodman. He will make it right, right now.


----------



## shigzeo

It's taken longer than I expected it to take, but I've finally got a full review of the Centrance DACmini PX ADS system up at TouchMyApps. RMAA scores are here.
   
  At first, I was just going to borrow for review, but the size, shape, sturdiness, and sound for the headphones I use most often, really played into a hankering. That and my wife has been bugging me to get an all-in-one system as she really wants to hear music again (we've not had a speaker system since late 2000's).
   
  I'm impressed as much with the power amp portion as I am with the headphone amp, particularly because I had very low expectations from a bundled system. 
   
  The MasterClass speakers, however, deliver the goods: very good bass resolution and space, decent mid range and good extension up high. There is some bunching up going on from time to time, but nothing adverse to listening. Again, very impressed. 
   
  Who would have thought that such a black background could be had from an integrated system. Obviously, it's been around for a long time, so I have nothing new to bring to the table except a lot of respect.


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





shigzeo said:


> It's taken longer than I expected it to take, but I've finally got a full review of the Centrance DACmini PX ADS system up at TouchMyApps. RMAA scores are here.
> 
> At first, I was just going to borrow for review, but the size, shape, sturdiness, and sound for the headphones I use most often, really played into a hankering. That and my wife has been bugging me to get an all-in-one system as she really wants to hear music again (we've not had a speaker system since late 2000's).
> 
> ...


 

 Excellent review Shigzeo! Thanks a lot for all the kind words! I am glad you (and your wife) are enjoying the system.
   
  One small mistake I noticed is the mention of the output impedance mod. We offer a 1 ohm mod, not a 0 ohm.
   
  Thanks again,
   
  Kenny


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I have all my impressions spread out through this thread, and I really need to whip up the energy to consolidate it all into one review.  But I have so much data and notes on my computer that I don't know where to start.  
   
  In summary, I just can't say enough good things about my DACmini CX - it compares quite well with my bedroom rig's Stello DA100 + maxed Woo WA6 that costs 2.5x as much for the combo.  I haven't turned on the Stello and Woo in ages now, except a few times to do some comparisons, and then it just sits there doing nothing the rest of the time.  I typically would use the Stello/Woo for HD800 and the DACmini for everything else like LCD-2, HE-500, D7000.  I have a Nuforce DAC-100 that's even better with HD800, and about as good with the others as the WA6, but the LCD-2, HE-500 and D7000 still perform best with the DACmini (in this price range).


----------



## zilch0md

RedBull,
   
  Quote: 





redbull said:


> Thanks Mike. That surely helps. As I like more 'darker' sound, then I guess I should be liking the 10 ohms more.
> Good to hear that DACmini don't hiss with SE530, which I like very much but notoriously hiss sensitive. My SE530 mostly hiss with my laptop headphone out.


 
   
  Having previously said that there's no hiss to be heard with the DACmini CX (1-Ohm mod) -> SE530, I'm compelled to provide this update to my original assessment.
   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> RedBull,
> 
> 
> Having previously said that there's no hiss to be heard with the DACmini CX (1-Ohm mod) -> SE530, I'm compelled to provide this update to my original assessment.
> ...


 
   
  I suspected that might happen, and since the stock output impedance doesn't mess with IEM I'm glad I have it, but it sounds like the hiss is pretty minimal with yours and IEM.


----------



## zilch0md

Yes, the hiss is low enough that I had to do A/B comparison with the Stepdance to notice it, but to put things into perspective, on the one hand, the SE530 is known for being sensitive to hiss, and on the other, my ears begin to roll-off at about 12.5kHz.  So... buyer beware.  If I can hear hiss with the 1-Ohm DACmini CX -> SE530, YMMV.
   
  I do still very much like the neutral, uncolored sound of the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm impedance mod.  I haven't heard the default 10-Ohm version, but going by CEntrance' description of the 1-Ohm mod, I feel as if their description is not at all misleading - keeping in mind that I listen primarily with the shelved highs of the LCD-2 rev.1, coupled with the shelved highs of my ears.  
   





   
   Quoting CEntrance:
   


> "Headphone Linearity" Mod (1 Ohm output)
> 
> DACmini CX stock unit comes with 10 Ohm headphone output impedance. To our ears, it offers the most musical, transparent sound. Users have described it as "warm" and "analog-like". However we can lower the output impedance to 1 Ohm, if flattest possible frequency response is desired in your application. Customers have described the sound of this mod as "more clinical".
> 
> Tip: Use this mod to get the best out of low-impedance headphones.


 
   
  Mike


----------



## RedBull

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> RedBull,
> 
> Having previously said that there's no hiss to be heard with the DACmini CX (1-Ohm mod) -> SE530, I'm compelled to provide this update to my original assessment.
> 
> Mike


 
   
  Thanks for the update Mike.  I'll take note of that.


----------



## mikemercer

Quote: 





ksef10 said:


> Excellent review Shigzeo! Thanks a lot for all the kind words! I am glad you (and your wife) are enjoying the system.
> 
> One small mistake I noticed is the mention of the output impedance mod. We offer a 1 ohm mod, not a 0 ohm.
> 
> ...


 
  I still say the CEntrance ADS is the BEST desktop system bundle for the money, hands DOWN.
  I listen to it every day in my home office.  There's ways to squeeze eve more performance out of it as well.
  KILLER, just KILLER.  I wast most excited about this product when I worked there, cept maybe their upcoming HiFi-M8!!!!


----------



## mikemercer

Ksef10
   
  You guys a Sponsor of Head-fi now?!?!
  Again, NICE.  I was screaming for that for months!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

*DACport original and DACport LX compared to DACmini's built-in USB as source for the DACmini amp** - I'm cross posting to the DACport thread:  *
   
*I borrowed a DACport LX from zilch0md to compare to my original DACport as a USB DAC.  He's been using LCD-2 and SE-530 to evaluate the gear, and he's been thrilled with his new DACmini driving the phones vs his old rig of DACport LX feeding an iBasso PB2 amp.  I started with LCD-2 rev1 and switched to the more resolving HD800 after a while.  *
   
*Here are my findings - The DACmini's built-in USB is a better source than either DACport, and which model of DACport comes closest the DACmini's performance seems to depend on what headphones you are using during the evaluation.*
   
With the LCD-2 and Moon Audio Silver Dragon V3 cable the DACport LX feeding the DACmini holds up pretty well.  It's not a huge difference with the LCD-2 and I had to switch to my re-cabled HD800 to confirm what I was hearing.  With the HD800 and Locus-Design Hyperion cable I could hear the difference in DACs better, so let's talk about that first.
  
 So far the biggest difference between the "DACport LX feeding the DACmini CX" and using the built-in USB of the DACmini alone is that the soundstage is a little deeper and more holographic by itself, while the DACport LX feeding the mini sounds a little more forward and a little flatter front to back, but sometimes it seemed a little wider.  The LX just didn't quite make the music sound as transparent and etherial with HD800 as the DACmini alone.  But it's pretty damn good.  With the HD800 the sound usually comes from everywhere except from those "little speakers" next to my ears, and when using the DACmini alone I was just a little less aware of the headphones being there in between me and the music.  
  
 Secondly, there is the air and ambience which seems a little more present and available with the DACmini alone, while with the DACport LX the background between the notes seems a little blacker, as if something between the notes that should be there is missing or not heard.  But with the less resolving LCD-2 rev1 I couldn't really hear deep enough into the music to easily discern this "blackness" difference.  This "blackness" or missing air is also part of that lessened holographic soundstage I think.  However, the tiny decrease in treble detail (or increased blackness) also tended to take that slight edge off the HD800.  Unfortunately, with the DACport LX in the chain the music seemed to be slightly lacking in presence and body in exchange for less listener fatigue with long listening sessions.
  
 Finally, the bass foundation with the DACmini's built-in USB is ever so slightly more solid feeling vs the DACport LX as source.  It's not such a big enough difference to matter much, although it did leave me the sense that the DACmini alone offers a little better body and weight with the HD800.  It's still the soundstage, micro-detail, air and treble that seems to improve more with the DACmini alone, more so than the bass.  And this is not by a huge amount, but I'm sure I could tell which source I was listening to mostly by the difference soundstage depth and size.
  
 Hold onto your socks now.  Here is the part I didn't expect - when I am using the HD800 I prefer the original DACport with the volume set at about 95% (to volume match) over the DACport LX as source, despite it having a headphone out instead of a line-out.  Go figure. The original DACport + DACmini combo improves the bass foundation and weight (and maybe some extra), plus offers most but not all of the air and ambience of the DACmini alone, with only that small change in the soundstage that I also heard with the LX.  
  
 I don't understand why this is so, but this was almost as good as the DACmini built-in USB in terms of performance, and falls between the DACmini alone and the DACmini with DACport LX.  So, basically the original DACport fed into DACmini makes the HD800 sound about as fun or enjoyable as the DACmini alone, or more fun because the bass is a little stronger, the mids are slightly warmer and fuller, and the treble less fatiguing, without seeming to sacrifice much (if any) detail - all things the HD800 need from a synergistic source and amp.  It still has that slightly flatter "less-deep but still wide" soundstage of the LX, but with improved warmth and improved ability to relax while listening with the HD800.  That's a big plus to me, especially since the HD800 soundstage is so big even with a more restrictive source.  I'd give up that little bit of final resolution for improved musicality and synergy with HD800.
  
 And no surprises here - switching back to the LCD-2 r1 with the original DACport > DACmini combo then made the LCD-2 r1 feel a little Too Dark.  This was even after I spent some time acclimating to the change in sound from the HD800.  The LCD-2 rev1's recessed treble makes listening to this combo feel like there was also a bit less detail than with the HD800, maybe due to my 50 year old ears.  The DACport LX > DACMini is definitely better with the LCD-2 r1 than when using the original DACport as source, as it gives the LCD-2 good detail and sparkle that the original DACport > mini lacks with LCD-2.  With LCD-2, the DACport LX is not really a downgrade as a source, as the LCD-2 don't reveal the differences as well as the HD800 do.
  
 Basically, adding the DACport LX back into the mix doesn't seem to make things worse if I'm using the LCD-2, and they retain the sparkle and detail that I expect from the DACmini amp, while the HD800 lose a just little body, warmth and depth with the LX.  Both the original DACport and the LX actually help with what I feel are recessed mids in the LCD-2 by bringing them more forward, but the LX preserves the crisp treble that the LCD-2 r1 really need out of a DAC and amp.  I did not have a problem becoming immersed in the music when using the DACport LX > DACmini > LCD-2 (or DACmini alone).  That was more of an issue with the HD800 with the LX, or the LCD-2 with the original DACport as source.
  
 *IN SUMMARY - with LCD-2 headphones the DACport LX is a much better choice for source than the original DACport, and with HD800 the original DACport is a better choice for source.*  If I had to pick just one version of DACport to use with ALL headphones, I'd say the LX is more versatile.  Either way the DACmini seems to contain a little better USB DAC than it's brethren, where we all know only a 5-10% improvement can double the price in a rig.  While I've always maintained that the DACmini isn't perfect for the HD800, I think that the DACmini/HD800 is still very enjoyable although ruthless in revealing flaws in the recording.  However, I'd be happier listening to HD800's with the original DACport feeding the DACmini.  Note - neither my DACport nor DACmini have the 1 ohm mod. 
  
  
MORE NOTES - to me the LCD-2 are still less resolving than the HD800 even with my most synergistic gear, and that is why I thought there was less difference between the DACport LX and DACmini built-in DAC when I used the LCD-2.  The phones were the weakest link in the chain, and so the differences between the more resolving DACs was harder to discern.  Even with my HE-500 I could discern the differences better than with LCD-2, although not as easily as with the HD800.  However, while some details may be masked by the LCD-2 rev1, the frequency response differences can still be heard with the LCD-2, which is why the original DACport was the darkest with them, the LX was better, and the CX was even better.  Since the LCD-2 border at the edge of darkness to my ears, the original DACport is the straw that breaks the camel's back in terms of treble quantity.  
   
In contrast, since the HD800 are slightly tilted towards the treble with many amps, the original DACport doesn't make them feel dark.  But the DACmini CX at the other end of the spectrum can make them sound slightly fatiguing with the wrong music.  So, with the HD800 I could still pick out the details with the original DACport, because the HD800 don't hold anything back.  If I was only using the LCD-2 for this comparison then I would have agreed with Mike's (zilch0md) impressions that the LX performs almost the same as the DACmini, since the LX does seem more detailed and airy than the original DACport when used with darker sounding phones.
   
I believe that ambience, air and space is increased with (a) better micro-detail and (2) better treble extension, and it's more likely associated with the impression of "venue size" than soundstage depth, where the location where the recording takes place is more "live" or "dead", i.e. more "relective" or "absorptive".  Maybe soundstage depth is more closely related to phase coherence?  Regardless, a source, amp or phone with better detail (especially in the treble) is more likely to accurately portray a bigger "venue size" if it's in the recording, because the ambience, air and space resides in the little details hiding between the louder notes.  More detail or treble wont magically make a recording in a small venue sound big, but it wont mask the details that make a recording sound more live.  
   
It's pretty clear that the wrong combination of gear can subtract even more from what you hear than with using just one wrong component alone.  So the original DACport may have slightly less detail than the DACport LX, but it's magnified when combined with the wrong phones.


----------



## zilch0md

Bravo Larry!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I just stumbled into this, knowing that it was in the works, and I'm thrilled to see how much effort you've put into describing all those combinations, logically, and articulately!  
   
  You have filled a pretty large void in the information available to those who have tried to find solid information regarding what distinguishes these three CEntrance products.  Thank you!
   
  Your conclusions are indeed surprising - especially that the DACport, feeding the DACmini's amp section, could offer better synergy with the HD800 than either the DACport LX or the DACmini's own DAC, through the DACmini's amp section.  But your explanations make a lot of sense as to why this is so.    
   
  Another eyebrow-raising moment, for me, was your statement that (in the context of comparing rendered detail), the LCD-2 rev.1 could be the weakest link when used with either the DACport LX > DACmini amp, or the DACmini CX alone.  That's a huge compliment to the resolving power of the LX and DACmini DACs as well as to the DACmini's amp section, despite the LCD-2 falling short of some other, notable headphones, for resolution.
   
  My profile reveals that I can actually carry all of my headphones with two hands, but the SE530 is among them, so I've long been aware that the LCD-2 rev.1 doesn't offer the ultimate in resolution.  With my recent acquisitions of the DACport LX and DACmini CX, however, that has become even more obvious, as the gap between SE530 detail and LCD-2 detail has widened using CEntrance gear.  
   
*These CEntrance machines are indeed VERY resolving and there's an odd comfort in knowing that my LCD-2 is, at last, properly nourished!*
   
  Thanks again for your time and effort to perform these comparisons, Larry.
   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Bravo Larry!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Yep.  Weak links in the chain are not that hard to identify IF you have the right gear to compare with.  In your case you can use the SE-530 to pick up the slight decrease in resolution when you switch over to the LCD-2, etc.  And the LCD-2 are pretty detailed on their own, and probably more so than the D7000 or HF-2, but not at the top of the dynamic food chain like the LCD-3, HE-500/HE-6, HD800, Beyer T1, K1000, HP-1000, etc.. (ignoring stats for the time being)
   
  Someone out there could easily do a review of the DACport LX vs the DACmini and report that the LX is every bit as good as the DACmini; but we have to look at what headphones or speakers they used in the review to know if there is noticable weak link in the chain.  A weak link reduces everything to the same level of performance, instead of letting the better gear stand out above the lesser piece.  In my opinion, it's a lot more likely for the headphones to be the weak link than the DAC or the Amp, because the electro-to-mechanical conversion is so much harder to achieve perfection.  
   
  Basically, IF I am stuck using my LCD-2 rev1 headphones as the only way to evaluate two rigs, I just can't say that my $3000 PS Audio Perfectwave DAC + $2700 Eddie Current ZDT is any more resolving than the DACmini alone.  Sure, the more expensive rig has more power with a bigger, deeper, wider soundstage and is a little more refined sounding when paired with the LCD-2, but in terms of sheer resolution and transparency the LCD-2 just don't pick up on the increased micro-details and other cues like a more resolving headphone.  If I switch to the HE-500 or HD800 then the differences become more apparent, and not just to me but my son and brother-in-law have noted this too.  
   
  And then there's the whole conundrum of synergy.  Sometimes you have it and sometimes you don't.  Good synergy is a requirement in picking any gear to use for a review.  The LCD-2 are very good, but not my first choice for reviewing gear unless the synergy is there.  Just because the LCD-2 and HE-500 sound better with my DACmini than with my Woo WA6 doesn't mean the WA6 isn't as good an amp as the DACmini.  It just means it's worse with some phones than others, and in return the WA6 beats the DACmini when using my HD600 and HD800, while with the LA7000 the two amps are pretty much equal.  Likewise, just because the SR-71b amp sounds better than the WA6 with balanced LCD-2 or HE-500, it doesn't mean the SR-71b is a better amp than the WA6, because the WA6 is a bit better than the SR-71b with HD800 and Grado RS-1.  Sometimes the synergy comes from voltage swing, or current delivery, or impedance matching, or power output, and other times they just balance each other out in frequency response.


----------



## shigzeo

Indeed, a fully integrated system with all the fixings for both headphones and sensitive speakers, the ADS is amazing. The only thing is, you have to keep the speakers off the ground, especially for movies, as there is a nasty bit of boom in the upper bass and low-mid mids. Apart from that, it is fantastic. 
   
  It is worth the layout of dosh and easily one of the best bets for high-end audio for both headphones and speakers. Oh yes, and the inputs rock. If it's a headphone system you are looking for, the DACmini really is all you need. 
  Quote: 





mikemercer said:


> I still say the CEntrance ADS is the BEST desktop system bundle for the money, hands DOWN.
> I listen to it every day in my home office.  There's ways to squeeze eve more performance out of it as well.
> KILLER, just KILLER.  I wast most excited about this product when I worked there, cept maybe their upcoming HiFi-M8!!!!


----------



## zilch0md

Larry,
   
  Your last post, above, explains so many peoples' frustration with upgrades not adding any audible value, especially subtle enhancements like custom cables, that can be so controversial - precisely because party A has the gear with which to hear the enhancement when party B does not.
   
  The resolution of a system as a whole can be calculated by taking the reciprocal of the sum of reciprocals for every component's individual limit of resolution, as follows:
   
  1 / Total System Resolution = 1/R + 1/R + 1/R + 1/R ...
   
  Looking at this equation, with a little thought, it becomes apparent that IF the individual resolutions are all in the same league, so to speak (having a small standard deviation), the total resolution will be pretty much equal to the limit of resolution imposed by any one of individual components.  But IF just ONE of the components in the chain limits resolution to a value that significantly deviates from the rest, its impact on total resolution is dramatic, and must be addressed first, ahead of any concern for improving the others..  
   
  I realize, that what I've written here isn't very profound to anyone who understands "weakest link in the chain" (which is pretty much everyone), but for those who can look at equations and "feel" them, this sum of reciprocals is illuminating.  The hard part, of course, is identifying which component in the system is dragging down the rest.
   
  For the record, I'm much more a consumer of mathematics, than I am a mathematician. In fact, I'm closer to being nothing more than an arithmetician.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Mike


----------



## Duke40

Hello Michael or Kenny @ CEntrance,
   
   
  I have noticed that some headphone amp manufacturers (eg. Burson, Schiit) are tending to increase the available wattage on new models.
  I believe the rise and popularity of planar technology headphones (such as Audez'e or HiFiMan)
  are influencing this power increase for headphone amps.
   
  While I enjoy music using my DACport and Audez'e LCD-3 at an enjoyable safe volume,
  I notice an improvement with my DACmini CX (10ohm, gain of 8) due to it being more powerful.
   
   
  *** So, I have been wondering how a "Supercharged" DACmini CX , with say, 5 Class A watts would sound like.***
   
   
  I respect you are busy with development of the M8 at the moment, though I thought I would mention this.
   
  Personally, I would be willing to pay more for a "Supercharged" DACmini CX as I do not need a lot of gear, though I do appreciate and respect quality.
  I get quality with the CEntrance products, it is just that going from DACport to DACmini provided "more of everything", was wondering if a yet more powerful DACmini would be a possibility (so I could experience yet another improvement), due to the rise of the planar headphones.
   
   
  John


----------



## mgoodman

Please consider the DACmini PX integrated Amp ($999.95). Its power amp features 25W per channel and is ideal for driving HE-6. We had a head-fi guy at RMAF use a banana cable adapter to go from speaker outputs to his headphones. He really liked the sound quality and output level.

Michael


----------



## zilch0md

I had seriously considered getting the PX instead of the CX, with the notion of using its speaker terminals to drive the LCD-2.  It seemed like a no brainer given that the black finish, alone, is a $200 upgrade for the CX - so basically, getting a PX is like ordering a CX in black finish, that includes a free 25-Watt Class D amplifier!
  
 I hit the brakes, however, because...
  
 A)  It's a Class D amplifier (although I'm willing to assume its design - by CEntrance, after all - defies my understanding of Class D weaknesses.)
  
 B)  It's got a 25-Ohm output impedance (theoretically not a good match for the 50-Ohm LCD-2 rev. 1 - I'd rather see a 5-Ohm output impedance, at most - just going by the 8:1 rule of thumb - one of the reasons I ordered my CX with the 1-Ohm mod).
  
 C)  I was afraid I could damage the LCD-2 if an exceptionally strong pop or other noise artifact suddenly came barreling down at whatever peak the PX is capable of hitting above 25 Watts RMS.  (The LCD-2 rev.1 are only rated at 15-Watts max.)
  
 D)  I really don't have any interest in connecting loudspeakers to something like the PX (despite the very credible reviews regarding the ADS system as a whole).
  
 So, count me as not interested in using a DACmini PX for LCD-2 (or LCD-3), but VERY interested in the "Super-charged" DACmini CX that Duke40 has imagineered.  
  
 My DACport LX and DACmini CX have made me a die hard loyal fan, so *I will wait as long as it takes* for CEntrance to revisit the desktop arena and produce a 5-Watt (or greater) solid state, balanced headphone amp!  A DAC/amp combo would be even better, but I think you'd reach a larger market with just an amp.  
  
 Thanks!
  
 Mike


----------



## plin

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> B)  It's got a 25-Ohm output impedance (theoretically not a good match for the 50-Ohm LCD-2 rev. 1 - I'd rather see a 5-Ohm output impedance, at most - just going by the 8:1 rule of thumb - one of the reasons I ordered my CX with the 1-Ohm mod).


 
  This is the impedance of the line output, not to be confused with the speaker output which should be much less than 1 Ohm.


----------



## zilch0md

Oh yeah!  I just went back to the specs.  Thank you!  
   
  They don't indicate what the output impedance is actually (for the 25-Watt amp), but it does say, "drives 4...8 Ohm speakers."
   
  So it should be OK with a 50-Ohm load (and the power into 50-Ohms would be less than 25W - a good thing when using headphones rated at 15W max.)
   
  Hmmm...  Now I want to hear my LCD-2 on a PX.   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Mike


----------



## mikeaj

Solid-state speaker amps mostly all have very low output impedance (especially relative to headphone impedances), as far as I know.  When you're driving 4 ohm speakers, you don't want half of the power to be lost internally to the amp just because of the output impedance, that's for sure...
   
  Also, for that matter, many people say that their planar magnetics sound just fine on higher-Z sources.


----------



## zilch0md

Thanks Mike!


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Oh yeah!  I just went back to the specs.  Thank you!
> 
> They don't indicate what the output impedance is actually (for the 25-Watt amp), but it does say, "drives 4...8 Ohm speakers."
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hey, wait a minute....  
   
  If the DACmini PX' Class D amp is rated at 25 Watts into 8 Ohms, it will deliver 4 Watts into the 50-Ohm LCD-2.
   
  but...
   
  If the DACmini PX' Class D amp is rated at 25 Watts into 4 Ohms, it will deliver 2 Watts into the 50-Ohm LCD-2.
   
  Now I don't feel so bad having recently purchased the CX instead of the PX, given that I might have ended up preferring the 1.5 Watt Class A headphone amp in either case.


----------



## mgoodman

> If the DACmini PX' Class D amp is rated at 25 Watts into 4 Ohms, it will deliver 2 Watts into the 50-Ohm LCD-2.

We would suggest that you use the output voltage as the basis for a rough calculation, as follows:

- DACmini PX should deliver about 20V Peak at the speaker output terminals.
- 20V across 50 Ohms equals 0.4A of current per channel.
- 20V multiplied by 0.4A gives you 8 Watts, peak.

In summary, you would have around 6dB additional gain at the speaker outputs compared to the headphone outputs. The output impedance at the speaker outputs is a fraction of an Ohm, compared to 1 or 10 Ohms at the headphone output. This would deliver additional power across the headphones connected to the speaker output, compared to the headphone output. Distortion would still be extremely low since we are using the latest amp technology.

Disclaimer: I'm not a loud listener, so this level would be out of my comfort zone for LCD's. I can't guarantee this but I don't think you will blow up your LCD's -- it looks like you should be safe and have just enough output power for that extra kick. HE-6 owners are going to be very happy.

Regarding trying this out: We offer a 30-day money back guarantee, so trying is easy. Let me know if any questions. 

Michael


----------



## Duke40

Michael @ CEntrance , thank you for taking the time to respond & answer our questions.
   
  John


----------



## zilch0md

Yes, thanks Michael!
   
  I'm tempted by your very generous 30-day return policy, but I'm too easily hooked once something is in my possession.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
   
  And frankly, although I've done it twice now, with other Head-Fi manufacturers, I really feel bad when I take advantage of money-back guarantees.  On both occasions, I made the purchases with the intention of keeping the items, but was too disappointed to stay the course.   
   
  Still, I very much appreciate the offer - you make it a lot easier for us by doing so.
   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Yes, thanks Michael!
> 
> I'm tempted by your very generous 30-day return policy, but I'm too easily hooked once something is in my possession.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Maybe you don't try the PX and return it within 30 days.  Maybe you return the CX and use the credit towards the PX, and keep it?


----------



## zilch0md

That's a great idea Larry, but...
   
  There are no returns on DACmini's with mods (I have the 1-Ohm output impedance)...
   
  -AND-
   
  I'm past the 30-day mark...
   
  -AND-
   
  I'd have to ask Kablemeister to make me make me a banana-plug set with pig tail adapter for my Hirose-terminated Silver Poison balanced cable, before I could listen to the Class D amp with my LCD-2 - and I'm currently only two weeks into a six-week wait for him to make a 6.3mm TRS-to-Hirose Silver Poison pig tail. Anything I tried to craft myself as a temporary solution would likely compromise the sound.
   
  -AND- 
   
  I might not be impressed by the 2-Watt into 50-Ohms Class D amp - leaving me disappointed that I spent another $200 for...  a black finish and an amp I don't use.  Not to mention a $100 bannana plug to Hirose pig tail adapter that I'd have a hard time selling...
   
  -AND-
   
  (Thus) I'd simply have to order the ADS speakers, too - out of curiosity.  We know I would LOVE what I hear!  Buying a PX without the ADS speakers would be like buying a Ferrari without wheels.  Trite analogy, yes, but appropriate.
   





   
  I'll have to leave the PX purchase for some day in the distant future when I choose to get into near-field HiFi.
   
  Thanks!
   
  Mike


----------



## Xenobium

Can someone from centrance let me know the minimum distance from a dacmini cx where I should not be able to hear interference from my mobile phone when my headphones are plugged in? I am still hearing interference from a mobile phone as far as 2m - 2.5m away. Nothing solves the issue - different headphones, different mobile phone or having the unit plugged into various power sockets in various rooms. I understand that the dacmini is shielded extremely well and this should not happen. One option is to wrap the entire dacmini with aluminium foil but that in itself is a crime as the dacmini is such a beauty. 
   
  I love my dacmini. The only minor flaws are the shielding issue and also the fact that my speakers or headphones (whichever is plugged in) make an extremely loud buzzing noise whenever my PC boots up. This probably occurs as I always leave the usb input from my PC plugged in - again, is this normal?
   
  Don't get me wrong, I am very happy with how this unit performs, so much so that I will gladly keep the unit even with these issues if they are indeed present on all dacmini cxs. Would just like to know if I got a defective unit and should get it replaced?
   
  Thanks very much


----------



## mgoodman

We won't be offended either way


----------



## mgoodman

The "not offended" comment was in reference to the questions about the trial period (30-day money back).

Regarding cell phone interference, please send email to info at centrance dot com. We will help you out. Something must be funky with the wiring.

Michael


----------



## Xenobium

sure, will send you guys an email. no way I am sending this back


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> ...
> 
> I might not be impressed by the 2-Watt into 50-Ohms Class D amp - leaving me disappointed that I spent another $200 for...  a black finish and an amp I don't use.  Not to mention a $100 bannana plug to Hirose pig tail adapter that I'd have a hard time selling...
> 
> ...


 
   
  I though that Michael Goodman did the math in an earlier post, and used the actual output voltage and current it can deliver into 50 ohms to come up with an 8 watt number in 50 ohm, not 2 watts.
   
  EDIT - Yep, he posted that here http://www.head-fi.org/t/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/780#post_8788608


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





xenobium said:


> Can someone from centrance let me know the minimum distance from a dacmini cx where I should not be able to hear interference from my mobile phone when my headphones are plugged in? I am still hearing interference from a mobile phone as far as 2m - 2.5m away. Nothing solves the issue - different headphones, different mobile phone or having the unit plugged into various power sockets in various rooms. I understand that the dacmini is shielded extremely well and this should not happen. One option is to wrap the entire dacmini with aluminium foil but that in itself is a crime as the dacmini is such a beauty.
> 
> I love my dacmini. The only minor flaws are the shielding issue and also the fact that my speakers or headphones (whichever is plugged in) make an extremely loud buzzing noise whenever my PC boots up. This probably occurs as I always leave the usb input from my PC plugged in - again, is this normal?
> 
> ...


 
   
  My iPhone is frequently only 12 inches away and I have no interference (like GSM buzz).  You could try getting those RF blocking cards for your phone from http://www.quickbridgesolutions.com - you may be able to find some used ones somewhere now that they aren't made anymore.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I though that Michael Goodman did the math in an earlier post, and used the actual output voltage and current it can deliver into 50 ohms to come up with an 8 watt number in 50 ohm, not 2 watts.
> 
> EDIT - Yep, he posted that here http://www.head-fi.org/t/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/780#post_8788608


 
   
  Oh, I hadn't seen Michael's edit to that post, thank you!
   
  OK, so 8 Watts peak x 0.70711 = 5.657 Watts rms  
   
  That's impressive!  
   
  I should have bought a PX.
   
   
  Too late, now...


----------



## redchoco

can minidac drive he-500 enough?
  cuz i'm planning to get he-500 and also i need dac/amp too. so now i'm considering between minidac and burson 160ds.
  if minidac can drive he-500 good enough, i'll get minidac.


----------



## mgoodman

Yes. DACmini drives HE-500 very well. You will like it. Let me know if any questions.


----------



## canyondust

FWIW, I park my iPhone less than a foot from my DACMINI and get no interference... In a specific spot. However, if I move my phone to a couple other locations around the DACMINI, it does catch the gsm signal... maybe some weird angle thing or whatnot... But most of the time it's 7-8 inches away and dead quiet.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





redchoco said:


> can minidac drive he-500 enough?
> cuz i'm planning to get he-500 and also i need dac/amp too. so now i'm considering between minidac and burson 160ds.
> if minidac can drive he-500 good enough, i'll get minidac.


 
   
  Yes it does work very well with those - better than my Woo WA6 or Nuforce DAC-100 with HE-500 or LCD-2 (while I tend to only use the others with my HD800 these days).  I set up a rig at CanJam @ RMAF 2011 with the DACmini and I only had HE-500 and LCD-2 there to use with it.


----------



## DTrewwye

I posted a question on the DACport thread, thought I would post it here as well.
   
  How well does the DACport drive orthos (Stock T50RP)?  Does it drive it to its full potential? 
   
  Also, with a StepDance in the chain - is it worth upgrading to a DACmini?
   
  Currently FB2K (WASAPI) > DACport > Stepdance(not here yet) >T50RP/SRH940


----------



## Xenobium

Quote: 





canyondust said:


> FWIW, I park my iPhone less than a foot from my DACMINI and get no interference... In a specific spot. However, if I move my phone to a couple other locations around the DACMINI, it does catch the gsm signal... maybe some weird angle thing or whatnot... But most of the time it's 7-8 inches away and dead quiet.


 
   
  Thanks for the feedback guys. I think something is wrong with my unit


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





dtrewwye said:


> I posted a question on the DACport thread, thought I would post it here as well.
> 
> How well does the DACport drive orthos (Stock T50RP)?  Does it drive it to its full potential?
> 
> ...


 
   
  DACport can drive the orthos like HE-500 and LCD-2 to sound very good, but it doesn't drive them as authoritatively as the DACmini or HiFI-M8.  I have compared the DACmini to a pre-production StepDance and the DACmini is still a bit better sounding, especially with the orthos.  StepDance is a very good portable amp, but it's not a desktop amp although it's better with a 15V PSU attached.


----------



## redchoco

Thanks for the information
  I'm gonna get he-500 and dacmini soon as possible


----------



## tama

I just got my HE500s and will be getting a dacmini shortly


----------



## Ksef10

Hey Tama and Redchoco,
   
  Thanks for your interest in DACmini. Let me know if you have any more questions about it.
   
  Also, you may want to take a look into our Audiophile Desktop System for the complete package. It is now more affordable than ever.
http://centrance.com/products/new/blog/2012/10/26/centrance-offers-economic-stimulus-package/
   
  -Kenny


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





ksef10 said:


> Hey Tama and Redchoco,
> 
> Thanks for your interest in DACmini. Let me know if you have any more questions about it.
> 
> ...


 
   
  My Dacmini with the 1-Ohm mod is wonderful with my IEMs and LCD2s.
   
  Wow! That's a great deal and very tempting on the Audiophile Desktop System. Looks like you basically get the speakers, cables, and Pelican case for free if you buy the System. If I didn't already have a B&W Zeppelin, I'd buy this Desktop System today.
   
  I just looked over the HiFi M8 portable DAC/Amp. Where do I sign up? I definitely want one of those.


----------



## Ksef10

Send an e-mail to HiFi-M8@centrance.com for pre-order information.


----------



## dparker83

I recently purchased an Audiophile Desktop System (unfortunately this was before they decided to drop the price 500$), and have noticed something strange that maybe someone here can help with.
   
  On my Mac's audio settings for the DACmini, it allows me to choose the sample rate (44.1, 96).   But the bit depth is set to 24 bit and can't be changed to 16 bit.  I'm worried that my computer is having to resample all my 44.1/16 audio to 44.1/24 before sending to the DAC.
   
  If i use an optical cable (my Mac's Built-In Output in audio settings) this is not the case, I am able to successfully set the output to 44.1kHz/16-bit.
   
  I can't find any online discussions of this.
   
  Thanks for any help.
   
  David


----------



## mgoodman

No need to worry. What happens within a PC is this: When going over to the DAC, audio data normally travels in 24-bit containers. This means that a 16-bit sample is "padded" by zeros (they add nothing and subtract nothing from the audio) and "stuffed" inside a 24-bit "holder", or container. Modern computers find it easier to operate with 24-bit containers. On arrival at the DAC, the zeros are discarded and the full 16-bit sample is used. The change happens when the audio. Is sampled at 32-bit (still a very rare occasion). In this case the system is reconfigured to use 32-bit containers. So, there would be a difference in how 24-and 32-bit data is handled, but there is typically no difference in how the 16- and 24-bit data is handled. All is to say that you have nothing to worry about -- the most crucial part of the equation is the D/A converter, followed by speaker design and then the amp technology. All three are top notch kit in that system. Enjoy the mastering quality sound of your Audiophile Desktop System! Let me know if you have any other questions.


----------



## dparker83

Thanks Michael!  I am extremely pleased with this system.  Outstanding sonics.  Easily as enjoyable as my 6500$ living room system..and with a pregnant wife you can bet I'll be spending more time in my office enjoying it.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





dparker83 said:


> Thanks Michael!  I am extremely pleased with this system.  Outstanding sonics.  Easily as enjoyable as my 6500$ living room system..and with a pregnant wife you can bet I'll be spending more time in my office enjoying it.


 
   
  That's so sweet that you want to be in the office with her all the time.


----------



## dparker83

Baby sleeping...bye bye to subwoofer.


----------



## redchoco

Which is better dac/amp for HE-500? HiFi M8 or DACmini?
  My musical taste is most of all genre especially pop(vocal), jazz fusion, and classic


----------



## dparker83

Do you want portable listening or just desktop listening?


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





dparker83 said:


> Do you want portable listening or just desktop listening?


 
   
  If I remember correctly, the Dacmini CX outputs 1.5 watts per channel which is the same as the M8. The M8 has rechargeable batteries for on the go listening whereas the Dacmini is desktop, only. The Dacmini CX has more connection options than the M8. Michael or Kenny, correct me if I'm wrong.
   
  If CEntrance offerred the M8 with wifi connectivity, how sweet would that be?!


----------



## redchoco

Quote: 





dparker83 said:


> Do you want portable listening or just desktop listening?


 
   
  Amp for desktop. Especially for HE-500.
  I have many portable headphones but, I think they are good enough without amp.


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





dparker83 said:


> Thanks Michael!  I am extremely pleased with this system.  Outstanding sonics.  *Easily as enjoyable as my 6500$ living room system*..and with a pregnant wife you can bet I'll be spending more time in my office enjoying it.


 
  That is great! I'm glad you are enjoying the system!


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





redchoco said:


> Amp for desktop. Especially for HE-500.
> I have many portable headphones but, I think they are good enough without amp.


 

 You will probably want to go with DACmini then. Although if your HE-500 are balanced, then M8 will be useful for that


----------



## Ksef10

Hey Everyone,
  We bring you even more good news! Black Chassis upgrades for our DACmini CX are _free_ while supplies last. Just add the mod to your cart in our store when purchasing a DACmini.
   
  -Kenny


----------



## Focker

Hey guys...
   
  So I've been eyeballing the DacMini for a while. I've never quite been able to pull the trigger because I'm just not sure the price is worth it in my particular situation (i.e. where I already have a modest DAC and amp that I like). I am still trying to make a decision, but in the meantime I wanted to tell you how impressed I am with the customer service. 
  
  several months ago I had an email exchange with Michael Goodman of Centrance and I was really impressed with his candor, as well as his background and experience. Well, last night I sent an email off to the company to ask a follow up question about the recent price changes, and this guy sent me a response at like midnight lol. I tend to email companies when Im in the research phase, and Im pretty happy when I just get a response the next business day. This is the first time that I sent a message off late at night and got a response a few minutes later. And on top of that, it was the main guy himself taking the time to do that. 
   
  Additionally, there was no hard sell at all. He seemed genuinely eager to help me with my questions, while also remaining confident in his product and its ability to meet my needs. I don't expect him to be up answering emails at midnight all the time, of course, but I have to say that this did leave a very positive impression on me. With all the crap customer service out there, it's nice to see someone who gets it done on the other end of the quality spectrum. 
   
  Needless to say, I'm pretty sure I'll be a customer in the near future. 
   
  (Of course, there is also the chance that Michael Goodman is a vampire, which would make this experience less impressive in terms of the customer service, but score a lot of points in terms of awesomeness.)


----------



## mgoodman

What do you say to that? -- Thanks for the positive vibe, man! We live for this stuff.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





mgoodman said:


> What do you say to that? -- Thanks for the positive vibe, man! We live for this stuff.


 
   
  I was trying to keep your night owl proclivities a secret so that you could be more productive when you can't sleep.  The secret is out now.  Vampire it is.


----------



## Taliesin

I was wondering if anyone has tried the dacmini with either the AKGQ701 or the sennheiser HD700/HD800


----------



## redchoco

Quote: 





taliesin said:


> I was wondering if anyone has tried the dacmini with either the AKGQ701 or the sennheiser HD700/HD800


 
   
  I have hd800 with DACmini. I won't say it's perfect. But it sounds pretty good to me.
  Very detail, fairly wide, and also no harsh at all in my point of view.
   
  I just start headphile, so I might be wrong. But at least I'm satisfied with hd800+DACmini combo.


----------



## tama

Just got a black dacmini for my birthday. They make my HE500 sound amazing


----------



## Puffery

This goes here
   
   

   
  Really awesome sounding combo and it will probably keep me away from upgrades for a the next few years.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





redchoco said:


> I have hd800 with DACmini. I won't say it's perfect. But it sounds pretty good to me.
> Very detail, fairly wide, and also no harsh at all in my point of view.
> 
> I just start headphile, so I might be wrong. But at least I'm satisfied with hd800+DACmini combo.


 
   
  I also think the HD800 and DACmini sounds pretty good.  However, over time I find the pairing to become a little fatiguing, for no clear reason.  But, If I feed a warmer sounding DAC into the DACmini, such as my original DACport, then the HD800 pairing is substantially better and I really really enjoy the amp section driving the HD800.


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





puffery said:


> This goes here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Becareful with putting the LCD-2s on top of the DACmini, scratches are more than imminent (from personal experience).


----------



## dukeskd

When I paired the DACmini with the HD800, I did not find it satisfying and I always felt there was something missing. When I bought the Phonitor along and compared them side-by-side, I knew what I was missing the whole time.
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I also think the HD800 and DACmini sounds pretty good.  However, over time I find the pairing to become a little fatiguing, for no clear reason.  But, If I feed a warmer sounding DAC into the DACmini, such as my original DACport, then the HD800 pairing is substantially better and I really really enjoy the amp section driving the HD800.


 
  I agree, changing the DAC can really help.


----------



## mgoodman

> Originally Posted by *Puffery* 




 > This goes here
  
 Dear Puffery, may I have your permission to feature your picture on our website?
  
 Michael


----------



## Puffery

Sure thing Michael that would be really cool.

I only placed it on top for the picture but yeah I'll watch out for scratches.


----------



## mgoodman

Thank you!


----------



## YtseJamer

Is the Dacmini compatible with the new iPad4/iPad Mini/iPhone5 through the Lightning to USB cable ?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ytsejamer said:


> Is the Dacmini compatible with the new iPad4/iPad Mini/iPhone5 through the Lightning to USB cable ?


 
   
  If you use the "lightning to USB camera connection kit" between the DACmini and the iPad.


----------



## tama

Has anyone upgraded the stock USB cable and did you find any improvement?


----------



## zeinharis

My thoughts a bit about the Dacmini http://www.head-fi.org/t/551345/hifiman-he-500-he-as-in-high-end-please-post-your-impressions-loan-pair-for-uk-pg-28/2715#post_9087175


----------



## Ksef10

Hey thanks for the kind words Zeinharis!
   
  Also, anyone that is wondering how DACmini compares to audio-gd reference 10.2 DAC(more than twice the cost), heres a recent article that does a mini shootout:
  "It’s abundantly clear why both companies have a formidable reputation amongst more seasoned head-fi-ers. I could live with either unit as daily headphone amplifier.  Both handle AKG K-702s with aplomb – something you can’t say about many rival all-in-one units."
http://www.tonepublications.com/macro/audio-gd-reference-10-2-dac-and-more/
   
  -Kenny


----------



## aras

Did anyone tried Dacmini with Westone W4 IEMs? I'm trying to decide between Audiolab M-DAC, Benchmark Dac1 and CA Dacmagic Plus. Any feedback will be greatly appreciated


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





aras said:


> Did anyone tried Dacmini with Westone W4 IEMs? I'm trying to decide between Audiolab M-DAC, Benchmark Dac1 and CA Dacmagic Plus. Any feedback will be greatly appreciated


 
   
  I've used the W4 with the DACmini many times, and it's a great match.  I actually love the DACmini with most of my IEM, including Westone ES3X and ES5, and JH Audio JH13 and JH16.


----------



## aras

Great! Do you have the 0 ohm headphone output impedance mod or the standard 10 ohm? I'm reading that 10ohm output impedance maybe too much for IEMs which causes loss of bass power and other stuff.


----------



## roker

biggest con for those looking to purchase a DACmini: There's a big big big chance you'll find yourself coming to this site less often ... yeah, that's a veiled pro, but I haven't felt the need to sell and upgrade at all since buying it.  My D2000s sound fantastic on it.
   
  The only thing I was thinking of ever adding were a set of open, more mid/high centric headphones to compliment my bassy Denon's (good bassy, not Dre bassy)


----------



## mav2944

I auditioned a Dacmini against a Burson HA160D and a Burson HA160ds with a pair of Sennheiser HD 650. I much preffered the Dacmini. I compared the Dacmini against an Ray Samuels Sr71 with an Arcam Rdac. I also felt that the Dacmini was quite a bit better than that pairing. I will tell you now that there are sound differences from amp to amp and dac to dac. Then there are sound differnces between combinations and different headphones. I have enjoyed audio for many years and all these components can vary sound. I recently purchased a pair of LCD2 which I like a lot. I would have really liked to have heard the above amps with it. I felt like the Burson combo was way too bass heavy for my taste with the 650 and logic tells me I would probably have felt the same way with the lcd2  since it is not lacking in bass. I feel that the
  dacmini and the LCD2 match up well. I believe in synergy between components.


----------



## zeinharis

Alot of members love the LCD2 and Dacmini combo, including myself


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





aras said:


> Great! *Do you have the 0 ohm 1 Ohm headphone output impedance mod or the standard 10 ohm?* I'm reading that 10ohm output impedance maybe too much for IEMs which causes loss of bass power and other stuff.


 
   
  Unless he has upgraded it since I last corresponded with him, Larry (HeadphoneAddict) is using the default DACmini CX, with 10-Ohm output impedance.
   
  Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> Alot of members love the LCD2 and Dacmini combo, including myself


 
   
  +1  
   
  I'm using an LCD-2 rev.1 with a DACmini CX that has the 1-Ohm mod.  I've never heard the 10-Ohm version, but I wanted to brighten the LCD-2, not make it darker or warmer than it is with a neutral amp like the Meier Stepdance.  
   
  I'll add that except for the Burson Soloist sounding a little bit warmer and just a tiny bit smoother in the highs, the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod sounds pretty much the same in every other trait.  It even renders up a little more detail than the Soloist, but without being harsh or fatiguing.   I'm talking about very subtle differences between these two amps - and don't forget, the DACmini CX includes a great DAC, for less money than the Soloist.   Lastly, I'll add that with my LCD-2, the Soloist offers nothing extra in terms of headroom, dynamics, bass control, etc.   
   
  In short, in my opinion and many others', the DACmini CX can be considered the end of the journey for LCD-2 owners (and for LCD-3, in some peoples' opinion.)
   
  Mike
   
  (Listening to _Ballad of a Runaway Horse_, from Jennifer Warnes' _Famous Blue Raincoat - The Songs of Leonard Cohen - 20th Anniversary 24k Gold Edition)_


----------



## bareyb

This is the last Amp I haven't tried that I'd like to. Any thoughts on how this would compare to a Tube/Solid State Hybrid Amp? I need a lot of oomph for my Orthos and I'm wondering how much power this thing has in the real World. It sounds like a wonderful Amp and the price isn't too bad. I especially like the small footprint. How is the Bass control with these?


----------



## bareyb

Well I decided to buy one and give it a try. I just hope it gets loud enough with HE500s...


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





townyj said:


> This is old news dude...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Man I hope you're right. I just ordered a set of HE500s and I bought the Dac Mini to drive them. I was very concerned that it isn't going to get loud enough, but from reading the thread it sounds like it will probably be okay with the 8 dB gain. It's nice to know they can up the gain if need be though...
   
  Here's an odd question...
   
  Would it be at all possible to run the "headphone out" from an E17 to the "headphone In" on the Dac Mini? I'd like to use the E17 as a preamp to take advantage of the Bass and Treble controls. Now before anyone jumps on me, this will be a rare occurrence. Most of the time it will be running from USB off my laptop. Just wondering if theoretically that would work. I hate the idea of using a software EQ and having to digitially process every single frequency except the bass. Why don't large Amps come with Bass boost? A user selectable gain control would be a huge plus too as I'm concerned about the power out put of the Dac Mini. I am returning an Icon HDP because it didn't have enough Ooomph. I hope the Dac Mini does better...


----------



## pekingduck

You can feed the output of the E17 to the line-in of the DACmini, but in this case, you are double-amping the signal. Some people say this will degrade the signal.
   
  Be sure to report back on the combo, cos I am seriously considering buying a pair of HE500's as well 
  Quote: 





bareyb said:


> Man I hope you're right. I just ordered a set of HE500s and I bought the Dac Mini to drive them. I was very concerned that it isn't going to get loud enough, but from reading the thread it sounds like it will probably be okay with the 8 dB gain. It's nice to know they can up the gain if need be though...
> 
> Here's an odd question...
> 
> Would it be at all possible to run the "headphone out" from an E17 to the "headphone In" on the Dac Mini? I'd like to use the E17 as a preamp to take advantage of the Bass and Treble controls. Now before anyone jumps on me, this will be a rare occurrence. Most of the time it will be running from USB off my laptop. Just wondering if theoretically that would work. I hate the idea of using a software EQ and having to digitially process every single frequency except the bass. Why don't large Amps come with Bass boost? A user selectable gain control would be a huge plus too as I'm concerned about the power out put of the Dac Mini. I am returning an Icon HDP because it didn't have enough Ooomph. I hope the Dac Mini does better...


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> You can feed the output of the E17 to the line-in of the DACmini, but in this case, you are double-amping the signal. Some people say this will degrade the signal.
> 
> Be sure to report back on the combo, cos I am seriously considering buying a pair of HE500's as well


 
  I was going to just barely turn up the E17 to match whatever volume level  is coming out of the Line-out on the iPod (I was gonna plug my phones directly into the line-out of my iPod and see how loud it is). Hopefully I can match it up that way. I'm going "line-in" from the iPod to the E17.
   
  It probably would degrade the sound somewhat, but I'm wondering if it would degrade it as much as using a software EQ and cutting all but the lowest frequencies... That almost seems worse to me than simulating a "line-out" condition. Tough call...


----------



## Taliesin

Has anyone tried the HD700 with the dacmini. If they have is there good synergy.


----------



## bareyb

I like the fact that it has a built-in DAC. I may not use it all the time, but it's great to have it for when I can... I just hope the Amp works out...


----------



## bareyb

Any thoughts on the bass response from the DACmini? Would it be considered more "Midcentric" and  "Bass Light"?


----------



## RedBull

Dacmini bass is not light at all, it's fun and punchy as it gets. I tried with DT100 and UM3X.
I cant consider Dacmini as mid centric.


----------



## zeinharis

redbull said:


> Dacmini bass is not light at all, it's fun and punchy as it gets. I tried with DT100 and UM3X.
> I cant consider Dacmini as mid centric.




And the treble it's just sweet on the Dacmini


----------



## bareyb

Alright. I'm listening to one of them now. Dammit. I don't think it's going to be enough power for my headphones. It gets fairly loud, but not loud enough. Sure sounds sweet though. I would say the Bass is pretty neutral. Not boosted, but not cut. I just wish it got a little louder. I know I can have the gain increased, but I hate to have to do that. Especially if it's going to cost me another hundred bucks. They really should add a Gain Switch to these...  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Man it sounds good at low volumes though... Really good. Voices are very real.  I'm trying really hard to convince myself it's going to be powerful enough... It's not like I always rock out... Just want to have the option. I'm getting rid of my current amp (Icon Ido)  because it's too weak so I want to make sure I don't make the same mistake again.


----------



## pekingduck

I just read your impressions over in the HE-500 thread. Does your DACmini have the 1-ohm mod applied?
   
  Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> And the treble it's just sweet on the Dacmini


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> Alright. I'm listening to one of them now. Dammit. I don't think it's going to be enough power for my headphones. It gets fairly loud, but not loud enough. Sure sounds sweet though. I would say the Bass is pretty neutral. Not boosted, but not cut. I just wish it got a little louder. I know I can have the gain increased, but I hate to have to do that. Especially if it's going to cost me another hundred bucks. They really should add a Gain Switch to these...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  That strange because I can't go far beyond 2 or 3 o'clock on the Dacmini volume control, beyond that it's way to loud for me to hear
   
  Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> I just read your impressions over in the HE-500 thread. Does your DACmini have the 1-ohm mod applied?


 
   
  No I don't apply the mod, nevertheless the volume it's loud enough for the HE-500 on the non-mod Dacmini


----------



## bareyb

Okay.... It might work out... You can up the GAIN from within iTunes (EQ) and it doesn't seem to be causing any distortion and it gets plenty loud now. I upped the GAIN by about 4 dB and it helps... This may work after all. I'll just have to use my laptop for my source instead of the iPod....


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> Okay.... It might work out... You can up the GAIN from within iTunes (EQ) and it doesn't seem to be causing any distortion and it gets plenty loud now. I upped the GAIN by about 4 dB and it helps... This may work after all. I'll just have to use my laptop for my source instead of the iPod....


 
   
   
  Ooo i see now, CMIIW.. you are using your ipod as your transport when you don't have enough volume on the Dacmini. I'm using my laptop as my transport and using the foobar2k as my player


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> Ooo i see now, CMIIW.. you are using your ipod as your transport when you don't have enough volume on the Dacmini. I'm using my laptop as my transport and using the foobar2k as my player


 
  I decided to dump the iPod idea. Makes it too difficult to get a digital connection between the two (you need an iDo) so I am going to use my Macbook Pro 13" for my source. It's got a nice EQ in it and a Preamp Gain controller. So far so good. The sound quality is amazing on the Mini. Simply. Amazing... Found myself smiling and even occasionally laughing at how dynamic it sounds. There's no question about the quality of the DAC or the AMP in this one.


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> I decided to dump the iPod idea. Makes it too difficult to get a digital connection between the two (you need an iDo) so I am going to use my Macbook Pro 13" for my source. It's got a nice EQ in it and a Preamp Gain controller. So far so good. The sound quality is amazing on the Mini. Simply. Amazing... Found myself smiling and even occasionally laughing at how dynamic it sounds. There's no question about the quality of the DAC or the AMP in this one.


 
   
  Glad you like the combo


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> Glad you like the combo


 
  Well... I just upgraded my Heaphones to HE500s and while it can push them just fine, it's clear to me I'm going to need a more powerful Amp to drive them. So while I love the DACmini, it just doesn't have quite enough power for the volume levels I want. Nothing against the Mini though. It's a fantastic piece of equipment.


----------



## tama

You have maxed out your Dacmini and it doesn't drive your HE500 load enough? Is it the stock dacmini?



bareyb said:


> Well... I just upgraded my Heaphones to HE500s and while it can push them just fine, it's clear to me I'm going to need a more powerful Amp to drive them. So while I love the DACmini, it just doesn't have quite enough power for the volume levels I want. Nothing against the Mini though. It's a fantastic piece of equipment.


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





tama said:


> You have maxed out your Dacmini and it doesn't drive your HE500 load enough? Is it the stock dacmini?


 
  It's stock with the +8 dB gain. I can turn it all the way up and for MOST of my material it's "right there" and gets plenty of volume. In fact, a lot of the time I have it at about 3 o'clock and it's enough. For other softer material I have found it's not _quite_ enough and it starts to get fairly strident if I push it too hard. Usually I can back off the volume a little and it sounds very clean.
   
  My other issue is, for some reason it crashes my computer every night and each morning I come out and have to do a hard reboot. So that's a little bit of a concern as well. Not sure what's happening there as it works fine while I'm using it. 
   
  At any rate, I sent them a PM asking about the Gain upgrade and they never got back to me.  At this point I don't think the gain mod is really going to help me anyway. It's just going to move the point of distortion farther back in the Volume's range and probably wouldn't gain me any useable volume anyway.
   
  I actually ended up starting a thread looking for a more powerful DAC and Amp All-in-one solution. Bottom line is the Burson Conductor has the most power you can get in an all-in-one, so that's what I went with. It will be here tomorrow and we'll see how they compare.


----------



## mikemercer

The output is a clean watt on the DACmini, which is also a good reason for its standing the test of time.  That said, I use one occasionally, but not as my main reference anymore.  It's still a KILLER buy.  
   
  HE500's aren't happy with a clean watt?


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





mikemercer said:


> HE500's aren't happy with a clean watt?


 
   
  Sure they do, i love mine


----------



## aras

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> It's stock with the +8 dB gain. I can turn it all the way up and for MOST of my material it's "right there" and gets plenty of volume. In fact, a lot of the time I have it at about 3 o'clock and it's enough. For other softer material I have found it's not _quite_ enough and it starts to get fairly strident if I push it too hard. Usually I can back off the volume a little and it sounds very clean.
> 
> My other issue is, for some reason it crashes my computer every night and each morning I come out and have to do a hard reboot. So that's a little bit of a concern as well. Not sure what's happening there as it works fine while I'm using it.
> 
> ...


 
  Please let us know how it compares to the dacmini.


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





aras said:


> Please let us know how it compares to the dacmini.


 
  Will do. I hope it sounds as good as the Mini. I'm very happy with the sonic characteristics of it. Very nice Bass and sweet highs. I probably have hearing loss or something because everyone always turns it down when I let them wear my headphones. Only reason for leaving the Mini is to get more volume. That's it. Otherwise it's a great little package that lightweight and easy to move. I'd think the Mini would be enough power for most folks. It's got 3/4 of a wpc _RMS (which a lot of mfrs. would call 1.5 wpc)_. That's no slouch for such a small package.


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> Will do. I hope it sounds as good as the Mini. I'm very happy with the sonic characteristics of it. Very nice Bass and sweet highs. I probably have hearing loss or something because everyone always turns it down when I let them wear my headphones. Only reason for leaving the Mini is to get more volume. That's it. Otherwise it's a great little package that lightweight and easy to move. I'd think the Mini would be enough power for most folks. It's got 3/4 of a wpc _RMS (which a lot of mfrs. would call 1.5 wpc)_. That's no slouch for such a small package.


 
   
   
  The conductor have 4W of power output because i believe the conductor is using the same amp sections as the soloist, it's a very solid for an SS amps, i haven't tried it myself, but i've tried the soloist with my HE-500 and the result is pretty good


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> The conductor have 4W of power output because i believe the conductor is using the same amp sections as the soloist, it's a very solid for an SS amps, i haven't tried it myself, but i've tried the soloist with my HE-500 and the result is pretty good


 
  Yep it's the exact same Amp section. It's probably closer to 3 wpc at 32 ohm, but it still by far the most powerful AIO. Most all of them top out at about 1.5 watts.  The only thing that would make it perfect is if it had a remote control, but that is apparently not that easy to find (there's exactly one that I could find). So if it sounds good and has some power to spare I should be very happy with it. But you never know until you hear it. Tomorrow I will know more.


----------



## bareyb

UPDATE: Well... I had an epiphany last night when I was setting everything up out in my workshop (as I do every night) and it occurred to me that if the unit had a remote control, I could simply leave it on the work bench and operate it from my work area without having to constantly move the unit around. It would also allow me to leave it plugged in and not have to break down the whole system each night and morning...
   
  Anyway, long story short, I decided NOT to go with the Conductor (I refused delivery and sent it back unopened) and to go with the Benchmark DAC2 (or possibly DAC1 for $500.00 less). It's got a remote control, a very good headphone amp, and  preamp outs so I figure even it I outgrow the Amp inside it, I can use the DAC part and buy a separate Amp. In other words, it's a lot more scalable and with the money I save I could afford to buy a Lyr or some other more powerful Amp.
   
  So there it is, I feel like a tool that I didn't think of it before but then again this whole journey into HiFi has be wrought with mistakes and poor decisions (mostly for the sake of trying to save some $$$). I hope the Benchmark is a good way to go. I will of course post impressions.


----------



## dukeskd

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> UPDATE: Well... I had an epiphany last night when I was setting everything up out in my workshop (as I do every night) and it occurred to me that if the unit had a remote control, I could simply leave it on the work bench and operate it from my work area without having to constantly move the unit around. It would also allow me to leave it plugged in and not have to break down the whole system each night and morning...
> 
> Anyway, long story short, I decided NOT to go with the Conductor (I refused delivery and sent it back unopened) and to go with the Benchmark DAC2 (or possibly DAC1 for $500.00 less). It's got a remote control, a very good headphone amp, and  preamp outs so I figure even it I outgrow the Amp inside it, I can use the DAC part and buy a separate Amp. In other words, it's a lot more scalable and with the money I save I could afford to buy a Lyr or some other more powerful Amp.
> 
> So there it is, I feel like a tool that I didn't think of it before but then again this whole journey into HiFi has be wrought with mistakes and poor decisions (mostly for the sake of trying to save some $$$). I hope the Benchmark is a good way to go. I will of course post impressions.


 

 Just a FYI,
  Grace and Mytek also have remotes.


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





dukeskd said:


> Just a FYI,
> Grace and Mytek also have remotes.


 
  Comparing the GRACE to the Benchmark as we speak. It looks like it's got comparable features. The Mytek has about half the power from the headphone amp than the other two. I'm hoping to get one that's powerful enough to use "on the go" (transportable) and then use the preamp outs to go to a nicer (more powerful) Amp that will remain on my workbench. That would be Heaven. The remote control is now key in my mind. That's the "have to have" feature to make it all work. So I guess that narrows the field considerably. 
   
  As i understand it, Apple only uses 24 bit for iTunes "out" anyway, so the DAC1 is already more than I need. The DAC2 is tempting and more "future proof"  but I can't get past the fact that with that extra $400.00 I could have a head start on a really nice Amp. Decisions, decisions... DAC1 or DAC2? Any thoughts? I'm leaning towards saving the $$$ and getting the DAC1. It's available on PRIME (DAC2 is not)  and it could be here tomorrow if I order it now...


----------



## bareyb

Just heard from GRACE. Here are the specs for the M Series all in ones:
   
   


> [size=medium] Hi Barry,
> The m903 and m905 both contain reference quality headphone amplifiers and DA converters. The power output capabilities are listed below.
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## pekingduck

Something strange happened to my DACmini earlier today, I could hear a high-pitched whining noise after plugging my XP8000 battery pack into it. The sound was from within the DACmini, not through the headphones. It's there even when no music was playing. There's no noise if I used the AC adapter.
   
  Any idea what caused the noise?


----------



## pekingduck

By the way, I received my HE500's today and the DACmini drives them well. In fact I can't turn the volume knob pass 12:30 even with softer material (very well recorded classical pieces). With pop/rock albums is like 9:00/10:00 for me.


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> By the way, I received my HE500's today and the DACmini drives them well. In fact I can't turn the volume knob pass 12:30 even with softer material (very well recorded classical pieces). With pop/rock albums is like 9:00/10:00 for me.


 
   
  Did you do the 1 ohm mod?. Congrats on your purchase, they are wonderful headphones


----------



## mgoodman

pekingduck said:


> Something strange happened to my DACmini earlier today, I could hear a high-pitched whining noise after plugging my XP8000 battery pack into it. The sound was from within the DACmini, not through the headphones. It's there even when no music was playing. There's no noise if I used the AC adapter.
> 
> Any idea what caused the noise?




Please email sales (at) centrance (dot) com and we will help you


----------



## pekingduck

I didn't request the mod bcos it wasn't available when I bought mine.
   
  The HE500's are indeed very very good 
   
  Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> Did you do the 1 ohm mod?. Congrats on your purchase, they are wonderful headphones


----------



## czqdtc

Hmm, I found the T1, Dac-mini combo too be a bit too bright ... Anyone feel the same way?


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> Hmm, I found the T1, Dac-mini combo too be a bit too bright ... Anyone feel the same way?


 
  I tried it with the HE400s and HE500s and it was a tad bright at higher volumes. Then again, the mids and vocals on the DACMini are some of the best I've heard. So it's kind of a trade off that designers have to make. If you want clear sparkling highs and mids you run the risk of having too bright an amp for some material. On the other hand, if you go too smooth on the highs, then you lose some midrange and treble clarity. I switched to the GRACE m903 and it's got a darker signature than the DACMini, plus twice the power output (and twice the price too). I've been very happy with it. It matches up nicely with bright 'phones and has the best Bass I've heard in an AIO.


----------



## czqdtc

Quote: 





bareyb said:


> I tried it with the HE400s and HE500s and it was a tad bright at higher volumes. Then again, the mids and vocals on the DACMini are some of the best I've heard. So it's kind of a trade off that designers have to make. If you want clear sparkling highs and mids you run the risk of having too bright an amp for some material. On the other hand, if you go too smooth on the highs, then you lose some midrange and treble clarity. I switched to the GRACE m903 and it's got a darker signature than the DACMini, plus twice the power output (and twice the price too). I've been very happy with it. It matches up nicely with bright 'phones and has the best Bass I've heard in an AIO.


 
  Thank you very much for your comments.
  Well, I am not planning to get any big dac/amps so I might have to live with it for a while. It pairs well with the LCDs though, I mean the dac-minis. I suspect it is good for HD600/650 too : )


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





pekingduck said:


> Something strange happened to my DACmini earlier today, I could hear a high-pitched whining noise after plugging my XP8000 battery pack into it. The sound was from within the DACmini, not through the headphones. It's there even when no music was playing. There's no noise if I used the AC adapter.
> 
> Any idea what caused the noise?


 
   
   

   
   
*Did you use the XP8000's (blue) 16-20V jack or the (green) 9-12V jack?*
   
  When fully charged, I've measured voltages as high as 21.0 Volts from the XP8000's blue jack.
   
   
   

   
*The DACmini CX power input is labeled 9- to 19-VDC, so it's possible to exceed the 19V maximum by using the XP8000's blue jack.*
   
  Given that the DACmini CX doesn't really care what voltage you supply, as long as it's within the specified range, it's safer to use the XP8000's (green) 9-12V jack.
   
  At this point, I don't know which voltage you were using, but in any case, I've never heard any noise coming from my DACmini CX when powering it from my XP8000's 12V (green) jack.
   
  I just now hooked it up (not playing music) - turned it on - and pressed my ear to the DACmini's case...  dead silent with 12V from the XP8000.
   
   

   
   
  Then I used my Willy Cable WI16 inline voltage regulator, which offers a switchable 16V or 19V output from the blue jack of the XP8000 - again, no noise at 16V, and no noise at 19V.  I'm not willing to go higher than 19V.
   
  Mike


----------



## bareyb

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> Thank you very much for your comments.
> Well, I am not planning to get any big dac/amps so I might have to live with it for a while. It pairs well with the LCDs though, I mean the dac-minis. I suspect it is good for HD600/650 too : )


 
  I thought it sounded great. My headphones at the time were fairly inefficient though, so I had to turn it all the way up to get to fairly loud volume levels. That was really my only gripe. If it had a user adjustable gain, there's a very good chance I'd still own it, although I'm loving having a remote control.


----------



## pekingduck

Hi Mike,
   
  Thank you for the informative post. I did use the 16-20V so I guess it's the voltage that was causing the problem.
   
  I had tried that the blue jack a couple times before but this was the first time I heard that whining noise.
   
  (I was going to try the 9-12V jack but I couldn't find the right tip...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
   
  I'll just use the power supply for now.
   
  Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> ........
> 
> *Did you use the XP8000's (blue) 16-20V jack or the (green) 9-12V jack?*
> 
> ...


----------



## czqdtc

OK, so, just to provide some information for future owners.
  Dac-mini and T1 is definitely not an ideal combo. It is way too bright. The K701 is ok with this dac, I can listen to all music with no fatigue. But with T1, I can't listen to some tracks for more than 30 seconds before my head/ear started aching... Ouch...Now I understand what is harsh/piercing highs.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> OK, so, just to provide some information for future owners.
> 
> *Dac-mini and T1 is definitely not an ideal combo. It is way too bright. *


 
   
  I completely agree.  For my tastes, *the T1 needs a darker signal - it can't handle a neutral signal.*  I don't see this as the fault of the DACmini CX - not at all.  The T1 appreciation thread reveals that a lot of people find the T1 to be bright and a little too crisp in the treble when used with neutral sources.   
   
  The T1 is tolerable in this regard on the Burson Soloist, using the DACmini CX' DAC section, only because the Soloist is warmer - more analog - and it smooths out the treble for any headphone - somehow without killing the detail much at all.  *The DACmini CX amp actually delivers a little more detail, though (without being harsh or etched in and of itself), than does the Soloist.*
   
  But even with the Soloist, Head-Fi member Focker - a huge fan of the Beyerdynamic T1 - uses a tube buffer between his DAC and the Soloist.  The Soloist, alone, cannot tame the T1 treble. Another T1 fan (can't think of his name at the moment) uses a Maverick Audio Tube Magic D1 DAC to tame the T1.   And yet another T1 owner raves about how great it sounds with the $249 iFi iCAN amp, thanks to the tone control bass-boost feature that gives the T1 what it lacks.
   
  So...* the T1 is simply not a good match for the very neutral, detailed, and transparent DACmini CX.*
   
  For me, the ideal headphone for the DACmini CX is the Audeze LCD-2.   And because the LCD-2 has shelved highs, I ordered my DACmini CX with the 1-Ohm output impedance mod, making it more neutral (less warm) still than the default 10-Ohm version.   It's a wonderful combination - with plenty of sparkle in the highs, stunning mids, and that terrific bass that a T1 cannot deliver on any amp.  
   
  And get this:  If you do the math, the Soloist is supposed to put out 1.28 Watts per channel vs. the DACmini CX 480 mW per channel - but I'm telling you, having spent many, many hours listening to the LCD-2 on both the DACmini CX and the Soloist, the DACmini CX actually delivers slightly better dynamics, punch, slam, whatever you want to call it, than does the Soloist. It must be a matter of synergy - where the DACmini CX just "gets it right" with the LCD-2.
   
  I have to add, that HeadphoneAddict (Larry) once wrote that if he had to sell the majority of his headphone inventory, he would not part with his DACmini CX and his LCD-2 (nor his RSA SR-71B).  It was his experience and affection for the DACmini CX for use with the LCD-2 that led me to buy the DACmini CX.
   
  I'll also add that I have an Australian friend who came to headphones after several years of working his way up to a very expensive HiFi system that includes a Nelson Pass amp, Focal loudspeakers, a $3500 power conditioner, etc.  He has good ears.  Guess where he has ended up for his Head-Fi listening?   DACmini CX > LCD-3.  And that's after buying and selling a lot of expensive gear - including HD800 and Ultrasone Ed 8.  He is willing to spend money, as if it grows on trees, but he doesn't care one bit about impressing anyone with what he has - he's after good sound and he found the DACmini CX > LCD-3 to be the end of the road for Head-Fi. And, by the way, he settled on the DACmini CX before he met me!  
   
  I like the DACmini CX and LCD-2 so much, I'm thinking of selling both the Burson Soloist and T1.  I really don't enjoy that allegedly state-of-the-art combo as much as I do the more modest hardware!  When you've arrived, you've arrived.  Knowing that you've arrived is half the battle.
   
  Mike


----------



## aras

Very convincing write-up zilch0md. I'm wondering how dacmini sounds with headphones such as hd600 and hd650. I'm thinking they would be good match considering they kind of dark.


----------



## zilch0md

I would think so, too, but I've never heard the HD600 or HD650.  Still, from what I've read, they would be great with a DACmini CX.
   
  Mike


----------



## hyunsac

Hey peeps, don't post too often here but add me to the club. Just bought a 1 year old Dacmini with +10 gain and Variable output for $700.  Not bad eh? Pairing it up with an HE-500, all arriving later this week. Super excited. My other rig is an HD650 + dacport. Eager to see how the Dacmini compares to the Dacport as well as the HE-500 and HD650.


----------



## czqdtc

I was comparing several headphones/earphones out of the dac-mini today.
  The result is surprising.
  T1, like I said, is too bright on the dac-mini.
  LCD3, lacks impact and weight, vocal sounds a bit thin, seems lacking power (haven't break them in yet though, they are brand new).
  JH16, surprisingly good, really shines, outperforms the 2 big brothers, not harsh, mid-range is not recessed anymore, bass is superb.


----------



## zeinharis

Thank you for your insight, it is going to be Dacmini - mjolnir - LCD3 then


----------



## zilch0md

Hey hyunsac,
  Quote: 





hyunsac said:


> Hey peeps, don't post too often here but add me to the club. Just bought a 1 year old Dacmini with +10 gain and Variable output for $700.  Not bad eh? Pairing it up with an HE-500, all arriving later this week. Super excited. My other rig is an HD650 + dacport. Eager to see how the Dacmini compares to the Dacport as well as the HE-500 and HD650.


 
   
  You did well - I'm looking forward to your DACmini CX vs. DACport comparison.  Look for any difference in signature, aside from a difference in power-related traits.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Mike


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





zeinharis said:


> Thank you for your insight, it is going to be Dacmini - mjolnir - LCD3 then


 
   
  That should do the trick!  Sweet!


----------



## LIJOE848

Has anyone experiencing issue with the USB connection keeps coming loose on Dacmini? I noticed that the USB type B input on the back does not secure the cable very well. The power connector also not secured, I am not sure if I have pushed the cables all the way in but I am don't want to force it.


----------



## pekingduck

Both USB and power connectors aren't loose on mine. Try pushing them in further , don't think you'll break it lol.


----------



## czqdtc

lijoe848 said:


> Has anyone experiencing issue with the USB connection keeps coming loose on Dacmini? I noticed that the USB type B input on the back does not secure the cable very well. The power connector also not secured, I am not sure if I have pushed the cables all the way in but I am don't want to force it.


same here, can never push them all the way in and I really don't think I can


----------



## hyunsac

Dacmini arrived today and driving my powered monitors. Knob at 7:30 for full volume. Wow, I've had the dacport and dacmagic for a few years, but this is noticeably better. Super high resolution, you can hear all the textures, light and airy but full bodied, immerses you into the music. Love this so far. HE-500s coming monday and HD650's at work so headphones will have to wait. This little thing is pretty amazing.


----------



## bahorn

Did anyone consider the Asus Xonar Essence One (standard or Muses) before getting the DACmini?  I'm looking for an all-in-one solution.  I'm leaning towards the DACmini since it has the features I want and I like the form factor.  Thanks.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





hyunsac said:


> Dacmini arrived today and driving my powered monitors. Knob at 7:30 for full volume. Wow, I've had the dacport and dacmagic for a few years, but this is noticeably better. Super high resolution, you can hear all the textures, light and airy but full bodied, immerses you into the music. Love this so far. HE-500s coming monday and HD650's at work so headphones will have to wait. This little thing is pretty amazing.


 
   
  Yay!


----------



## thegrobe

Any recommendation on regular vs."high gain" mod for use with the latest revision LCD-2's? 

I would also like to be able to use CIEM's with the Dacmini so maybe the standard gain is best? 

Thanks for any thoughts, etc..


----------



## Ksef10

Hey Everyone,
   
  We have a small quantity of B-stock DACmini for just $549.95!

 *These B-stock units sound and operate the same as stock units*

 B-Stock units may have small cosmetic imperfections, such as a nick in the aluminum chassis. They are fully inspected at our US factory and carry full warranty. Get them while they are available!

http://www.centrance.com/store/cart.php?target=product&product_id=16174


----------



## zilch0md

That's a good deal!
   
  I feel like I should buy a "backup" unit and put it in the closet.
   




   
  Mike


----------



## pekingduck

I have a stock DACmini (8x gain and 10-ohm output impedance) and it's a bit too loud for my Westone ES5 once you're past the channel imbalances. Also you can hear hiss.
   
  The LCD-2's were great though. Don't think you'll need high gain mod unless you listen very loud.
   
  Quote: 





thegrobe said:


> Any recommendation on regular vs."high gain" mod for use with the latest revision LCD-2's?
> 
> I would also like to be able to use CIEM's with the Dacmini so maybe the standard gain is best?
> 
> Thanks for any thoughts, etc..


----------



## thegrobe

pekingduck said:


> I have a stock DACmini (8x gain and 10-ohm output impedance) and it's a bit too loud for my Westone ES5 once you're past the channel imbalances. Also you can hear hiss.
> 
> The LCD-2's were great though. Don't think you'll need high gain mod unless you listen very loud.



Cool....Thanks for the input.


----------



## Bostonears

ksef10 said:


> Hey Everyone,
> 
> We have a small quantity of B-stock DACmini for just $549.95!
> 
> ...


 
   
  Can Custom Mods be applied to these units?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> Hmm, I found the T1, Dac-mini combo too be a bit too bright ... Anyone feel the same way?


 
   
  Slightly, yeah I'd agree.  Same with HD800, not bad, but not quite optimal synergy since the HD800 can occasionally be fatiguing without just the right amp.  With everything else DACmini is quite good.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> For me, the ideal headphone for the DACmini CX is the Audeze LCD-2.... It must be a matter of synergy - where the DACmini CX just "gets it right" with the LCD-2.
> 
> I have to add, that HeadphoneAddict (Larry) once wrote that if he had to sell the majority of his headphone inventory, he would not part with his DACmini CX and his LCD-2 (nor his RSA SR-71B).  It was his experience and affection for the DACmini CX for use with the LCD-2 that led me to buy the DACmini CX....
> 
> Mike


 
   
  I typed a big long post and lost it, and I'm in no condition to type it again.  Sorry.
   
  Agreed to always having the DACmini, especially for my orthos like LCD-2 and HE-500 and all my IEM. It seems to be great with everything including all my IEM, but I though that the T1 and HD800 need a little more warmth from an amp (but it's better with HD800 than T1, which is why I didn't buy a T1 after trying it out).  Keeping the SR-71b isn't nearly as important as the DACmini.
   
  The SR-71b is slightly warmer and darker sounding than the DACmini, and sometimes with the orthos the SR-71b might seem to have a little more low-end punch; but overall it's not quite up to the same level as the DACmini although surprisingly good for such a small portable amp.  I feel like I get slightly less ambience and air out of it with my LCD-2 and HE-500.  So, I use it mostly for my balanced HD800 with Black Dragon cable to tame the slightly fatiguing nature of the HD800; but the SR-71b could be replaced as my HD800 amp with other amps, such as my WA6 and the right tubes or with the ALO Amphora. 
   
  Since the Nuforce DAC-100 is better with HD800 than my other mid-level amps, that could take the place of the SR-71b, but it's frustrating that it lacks the analog input or the power of the DACmini and SR-71b.  And it has a bit of hiss with low impedance IEM or sensitive full-size phones.  So DAC-100 is not nearly as versatile as the DACmini in how many headphones it has synergy with.  DAC-100 sounds a lot like the WA6 with almost as much power, but the WA6 and DACmini can be used with IEM unlike the Amphora or DAC-100 that hiss.  That's why WA6 is still on the list of possibilities to pair with DACmini as source HD800.  
   
  The Nuforce HAP-100 is also very good with HD800 and has analog input, sounds slightly more forward than DAC-100 with power that fall closer to the DACmini - but it's output impedance and hiss is still too high for very sensitive IEM although it's noticeably less than the DAC-100.  So the HAP-100 might still make the cut over the SR-71b, but it isn't quite up to replacing the DACmini for everything.  It's also not as good with HE-500 as the DACmini, although with LCD-2 it's closer.  I'd say the HAP-100 is a closer match to the WA6 with HD800, better with LCD-2, but neither is as good with LCD-2 or HE-500 as the DACmini.
   
*Overall, the DACmini is just such a well rounded jack of all trades, and even with the HD800 it's very enjoyable*.  At the 2011 RMAF show CEntrance borrowed my HD800 at their table to demo the DACmini, and it cleanly beat out the Beyers they had there.  I still wouldn't use DACmini for the original HE-5 orthos or the current HE-6 (fairly underpowered with either which makes these 2 phones brighter and less punchy).  
   
  So, I could trim my bedroom rig down from 20+ pieces of gear that I rotate through, down to the DACmini + one amp.  The main rig in the basement is tougher to thin out, but I'd be happy if all I had was my Perfectwave DAC feeding the KGBH, ZDT and EF6 amps. Between those three amps I can enjoy every headphone and IEM in the house including a couple of vintage normal bias stats (the ZDT is driving a transformer through the speaker out for those).  That means only parting with the KGSS or Marantz 2240 receiver down there.


----------



## zeinharis

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I typed a big long post and lost it, and I'm in no condition to type it again.  Sorry.
> 
> Agreed to always having the DACmini, especially for my orthos like LCD-2 and HE-500 and all my IEM. It seems to be great with everything including all my IEM, but I though that the T1 and HD800 need a little more warmth from an amp (but it's better with HD800 than T1, which is why I didn't buy a T1 after trying it out).  Keeping the SR-71b isn't nearly as important as the DACmini.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hi Larry, it's been a while since I see you.
   
  Anyway, excellent review, as always


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> Hmm, I found the T1, Dac-mini combo too be a bit too bright ... Anyone feel the same way?


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Slightly, yeah I'd agree.  Same with HD800, not bad, but not quite optimal synergy since the HD800 can occasionally be fatiguing without just the right amp.  With everything else DACmini is quite good.


 
   
  Agreed!  I've got the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm output impedance mod, which I understand to be a little more neutral than the standard (10-Ohm) DACmini CX, and the Beyerdynamic T1 is pretty much unusable with so neutral a DAC and amp - for my tastes, it's way too bright.  But the LCD-2, with its shelved highs, sounds absolutely wonderful with the very neutral DACmini CX (1-Ohm), and no doubt, with the standard DACmini CX, too, which CEntrance describes as being more "musical" than the 1-Ohm version.
   
  What amazes me most about the DACmini CX is how much slam it has for its power rating of 480mW into 50 Ohms.   The dynamics are actually better with the DACmini CX into LCD-2 than when using the DACmini CX DAC section with the Burson Soloist. Though very detailed, the Soloist is laid back, almost lazy in terms of dynamics, and somewhat analog sounding for a solid state amp, which helps the T1 a little bit, but the T1 needs a tube amp (or a tube buffer + solid state amp) in my opinion. 
   
  Mike


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I typed a big long post and lost it, and I'm in no condition to type it again.  Sorry.
> 
> Agreed to always having the DACmini, especially for my orthos like LCD-2 and HE-500 and all my IEM. It seems to be great with everything including all my IEM, but I though that the T1 and HD800 need a little more warmth from an amp (but it's better with HD800 than T1, which is why I didn't buy a T1 after trying it out).  Keeping the SR-71b isn't nearly as important as the DACmini.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Larry,
   
  That's a shame you lost your original post - I always feel compelled to redo the whole thing when that happens.  I can't just walk away from it, but I empathize with how frustrating that can be.
   
  Thanks for reinforcing you original comments to me regarding the DACmini CX + LCD-2.   I'm so grateful I came across your many posts on that subject about a year ago, and the PMs we exchanged that eventually led to my ordering the DACmini CX.   Your assessments have proven to be very, very credible - beyond just our having the same taste in audio signatures.  I don't want to embarrass you, but I've often told others that you are among a very short list of people whose opinions I trust - having so much experience AND the ability to communicate what you hear, accurately.
   
  Long live the DACmini CX and LCD-2, my favorite combo!
   
  Thanks!
   
  Mike


----------



## Ksef10

Quote: 





bostonears said:


> Can Custom Mods be applied to these units?


 

 Yes you can add the mods into the cart the same as you would normally. There are black units available also.


----------



## thegrobe

I just ordered up one of these to use with my LCD's and Heir CIEMs..and of course I am stunned that Michael personally helped me answer questions, etc. Not like he's busy, right? LOL

Some stellar customer service. It will be interesting to compare this with the M8 when that ships...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

*I THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL IF I CONSOLIDATED MOST OF MY IMPRESSIONS OR LINKS TO IMPRESSIONS FROM 2 YEARS AGO THAT HAD A LOT OF INFO, WITH MY RECENT POST:*
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I'm surprised I never saw this thread before.  It will take some time for me to read it all, but in the meantime, here are some links to other posts I've written about the DACmini.
> 
> RMAF 2010 Impressions Thread has basically a mini-review of the DACmini:
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> MORE IMPRESSIONS:
> 
> I posted some of this in a PM to another head-fi member, but wanted to say that *since I got the DACmini in February I've listened to the LCD-2 headphones more in the past 4 weeks than I did in the previous 6 months because of the improved synergy with LCD-2* over my other amps.  Prior to this my $1000 ALO Amphora was my best amp with the LCD-2, followed by the HDP.  But the DACmini has taken the lead.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> The low volume tracking is excellent, and I can go much much lower than with the HDP or uDAC-2.  The best volume knobs I've had are on my DACmini, ZDT, WA6, HR Micro Amp, Meier Headfive desktop amp, and RSA SR-71b.  Amphora doesn't count because it's a Goldpoint stepped attenuator.
> 
> I should note that with your very sensitive ears you will likely hear the quiet background hiss with your IEM.  For me I can barely notice it except with my ES3X, and even then it's 3-4x quieter than my Amphora.


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> The DACmini is more spacious sounding like my WA6, although I would not call the HDP closed in or anything - it doesn't seem to get as wide when using the stock PSU.  The HDP is maybe a little more forward at times, while my Amphora has a little deeper stage vs the DACmini.  With the Sigma11 PSU the HDP gets closer to the DACmini with a more holographic sound that becomes more transparent, but not quite to that level.  If you already had a HDP then a S11 PSU upgrade is likely worth it, but if you didn't then going directly to a DACmini makes more sense than picking up the HDP with an S11 PSU for a similar price.
> 
> Sorry, it was late and I was sleepy, the Pico Slim belongs in the list of amps with good low volume channel balance.  I seem to recall that my old RSA Predator also had good channel balance, and I've checked my Protector which is also very good.
> 
> BC, I don't think every knows yet that you have bat-like or dog-like hearing ability.


 
   



headphoneaddict said:


> iPad 2 with OS 4.3.0 > Camera Connection Kit > DACmini was tested tonight.  No powered hub needed.
> 
> IT DEFINITELY WORKS, and iTunes on iPad2 shows that it's connected the the CEntrance DACmini in the spot where a volume control would normally show up.  And it sounds very good with my LCD-2.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Well, so far I am still quite pleased with the DACmini since I posted my last impressions here in March. It's definitely a permanent fixture in my home.
> 
> Since my last report I hardly use any of my other home gear, because the DACmini in my bedroom Macbook Pro rig is so convenient and accessible.  I've been using the DACmini with my LCD-2 mostly, and I also feed the analog out into my SR-71b amp for my balanced IEM and HE-6.  I still use the DACport when I'm moving my Macbook around, but that's about it for the past few weeks.  Since I got the DACmini I've rarely been down to use my high-end rig in the basement.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I typed a big long post and lost it, and I'm in no condition to type it again.  Sorry.
> 
> Agreed to always having the DACmini, especially for my orthos like LCD-2 and HE-500 and all my IEM. It seems to be great with everything including all my IEM, but I though that the T1 and HD800 need a little more warmth from an amp (but it's better with HD800 than T1, which is why I didn't buy a T1 after trying it out).  Keeping the SR-71b isn't nearly as important as the DACmini.
> 
> ...


----------



## zilch0md

Excellent!
   
  All in one place, for future reference.
   
  Thanks again, Larry!


----------



## Bostonears

roker said:


> Totally ridiculous and unnecessary.  I bring to you my CEntrance DACmini unboxing video.  I usually say this is pointless but I find my self looking for them on youtube all the time. I noticed there were barely any CEntrance DACmini vids in general and thought I'd give it a stab.  Now I know it won't top that Auditor vid posted last week, but I'll try my hardest.  Enjoy!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't usually watch unboxing videos, but I just happened to watch this one posted a long time ago by Head-Fier *roker*.
   
  I was laughing out loud at this exchange between roker and the camerawoman.
   
  camerawoman: What is this?
  roker: This is an amp/DAC, baby.
  camerawoman: Another one?
  roker: I sold the other ones. This is a disease. We’re all afflicted by this disease on Head-Fi.org.
  camerawoman: That means I can buy another pair of shoes?
  roker: You’re gonna buy ‘em anyway. 
   
  Thanks for sharing, roker, and thanks for giving me the best chuckle of the day.


----------



## Calypso

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> With the Sigma11 PSU the HDP gets closer to the DACmini with a more holographic sound that becomes more transparent, but not quite to that level.  If you already had a HDP then a S11 PSU upgrade is likely worth it.


 
  Would there be an improvement to the Dacmini as well, if you replaced the original switchmode PSU with a linear PSU like the S11?


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





bostonears said:


> I don't usually watch unboxing videos, but I just happened to watch this one posted a long time ago by Head-Fier *roker*.
> 
> I was laughing out loud at this exchange between roker and the camerawoman.
> 
> ...


 
   
  +1   Yeah, give your gal a hug from all of us Roker!  She made my day, too!


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





calypso said:


> Would there be an improvement to the Dacmini as well, if you replaced the original switchmode PSU with a linear PSU like the S11?


 
   
  Hi Calypso,
   
  It's unlikely you would enjoy any sonic improvements by doing that, going by my experiments, at least. The DACmini CX practically re-manufactures the power coming in.  I've done A/B testing between the switch mode AC adapter and several different battery rigs, running DC voltages at 19V, 15V, 12V and 9V - and it all sounded the same at the other end - using the hiss-sensitive Shure SE530.   
   
  Mike


----------



## thegrobe

headphoneaddict said:


> *I THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL IF I CONSOLIDATED MOST OF MY IMPRESSIONS OR LINKS TO IMPRESSIONS FROM 2 YEARS AGO THAT HAD A LOT OF INFO, WITH MY RECENT POST:*




Holy smokes that's a lot of useful information....also the stuff you posted over on the LCD-2 thread. 
Thanks for consolidating it here!

"Headphone Addict" is quite the suitable moniker! 

You have just made me very excited for the Dacmini/ LCD-2 combo I have lined up. Also fairly confident that I made a good choice. Then with the Hi-FiM8 as a mobile solution I should be a happy camper!


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





thegrobe said:


> [snip]
> 
> You have just made me very excited for the Dacmini/ LCD-2 combo I have lined up. Also fairly confident that I made a good choice. Then with the Hi-FiM8 as a mobile solution I should be a happy camper!


 
   
  Yeah, I'm really looking forward to your feedback, thegrobe.   
   
  I had planned to attend the Austin, Texas meet about a month ago, but got sick and couldn't go.   I was really looking forward to setting up the DACmini CX with my Burson Soloist on its output.  A/B testing the two amps then becomes very easy, as all you have to do is move the headphone cable back and forth between the DACmini CX and the Soloist, with relays inside the the DACmini CX toggling as you do so, to route the DAC appropriately.  
   
  I wish *everyone* could hear the difference between the DACmini CX and Soloist, using LCD-2.  Dynamics and resolution are actually better with the DACmini CX than with the Soloist. It's very subtle - not huge, but noticeable.  The Soloist is laid back, with smoother highs, which are surprisingly smooth for how detailed they remain, but they are not as detailed as the DACmini's highs, which with the LCD-2, have _just the right amount of sparkle_.  Bass extension is about the same, but bass impact is slightly better in the DACmini CX.  It's somewhat a matter of taste - as I prefer a more forward, aggressive, detailed, yet still organic and natural sound (that I get with the LCD-2 with truly neutral and transparent sources), than the more analog, laid-back, smoother sound of the Soloist, which works better with my Beyerdyamic T1, and I suspect, with something like the HD800.   But anyone who is using the LCD-2 with a Burson Soloist, really needs to hear the DACmini CX.
   
  Long live CEntrance! 
   
  Disclaimer:  I now own the DACport, the DACport LX, and the DACmini CX - so I might be biased.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

calypso said:


> Would there be an improvement to the Dacmini as well, if you replaced the original switchmode PSU with a linear PSU like the S11?




I am told it won't make a difference, and the DACmini will regulate the power internally regardless of PSU. I believe the amps use a different power cable so I can't try it.


----------



## Poetic

Hey guys, do you know how the Dacport LX fairs up against the Dacmini CX, I am interested in purchasing the Dacmini Cx,  I will be using their awesome USB technology, along with the Hifiman He-500 and He-400. I currently own the Dacport LX, and it a wonderful pure DAC. I was wondering if the Dacmini CX would be a great upgrade.
   
   
  Thankyou


----------



## zilch0md

Hi Poetic,
   
  If you're comparing the DACport LX to the DAC section of the DACmini CX, they are very similar with any given amplifier, but especially so when the USB port that's supplying power to the LX is "noise-free" and can supply the 500mA of current at 5 votls that's supposed to be available according to the USB 2.0 spec.
   
  The DACmini's DAC section is far more consistent from one PC to the next, because it has very stable and clean power thanks to how it remanufacturs the power coming in from any DC supply of 9V to 19V with at least 2.5 Amps of current. 
   
  In terms of sound signature, assuming the LX is not compromised by power quality, I personally can't hear much difference when I'm routing the output from the LX into the DACmini's amp section vs. using the DACmini by itself - except that my LX doesn't quite have as much air and micro detail as my DACmini's DAC - and that very subtle difference is only detectable with tracks that have a lot of blackness around a brush on cymbal, for example.  My noise floor is pitch black with both the LX and the DACmini (as long as I'm not using the LX on one of my laptops that has noisy power when its plugged into its AC charger).  But again, as long as power quality is ideal for the LX, it sounds pretty much the same as the DACmini's DAC - which is terrific! 
   
  I'm just kidding, of course, but _don't forget _the DACmini CX has a great amp, too!
   
  Are you going to jump on one of the B-stock DACmini CX units (for $550)?
   
  Mike


----------



## thegrobe

Hey I've got a (maybe) stupid question. My Dacmini is arriving tomorrow. Other than downloading the Centrance drivers, is there anything I should be doing to be sure the DAC is fully bypassing all the crummy windows stuff on my laptops? 
   
  The other question, is there any kind of hardware related specs, etc. that would make one or the other laptop a more preferable source?  I know USB is just sending the digital signal out but I want to make sure my laptops aren't mucking my signal up at all on the way to the Dacmini. If one is a more preferable transport I'd like to know how to figure that out. BTW - one laptop is running XP, the other Win 7.
   
  I have used my Leckerton UHA 6S MKII as USB DAC before, but only on occasion and I never really bothered to research if I had things really optimized. I want to make sure things are running at 100% for the Dacmini.
   
  Thanks


----------



## Poetic

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Hi Poetic,
> 
> If you're comparing the DACport LX to the DAC section of the DACmini CX, they are very similar with any given amplifier, but especially so when the USB port that's supplying power to the LX is "noise-free" and can supply the 500mA of current at 5 votls that's supposed to be available according to the USB 2.0 spec.
> 
> ...


 
  Can the CX play 24BIt 192? my connection will be through USB, but I do plan to use other connections in the future


----------



## pekingduck

USB only does 24/96 but SPDIF supports up to 24/192.
    
  Quote: 





poetic said:


> Can the CX play 24BIt 192? my connection will be through USB, but I do plan to use other connections in the future


----------



## Armaegis

I must be losing my mind... after selling off a bunch off stuff I just took the plunge on a PX to see how it fares with my HE-6 from the speaker taps. I'll be writing up a review to compare it vs my Nuforce stack (Icon2 + HDP) as an all-in-one desktop solution for the HE-6. 
   
  edit: will also compare vs the new Nuforce STA-100.


----------



## Puffery

I am excited to hear your results super interesting stuff!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I must be losing my mind... after selling off a bunch off stuff I just took the plunge on a PX to see how it fares with my HE-6 from the speaker taps. I'll be writing up a review to compare it vs my Nuforce stack (Icon2 + HDP) as an all-in-one desktop solution for the HE-6.
> 
> edit: will also compare vs the new Nuforce STA-100.


 
   
  I'll be comparing my Emotiva BDP-1 75-watt amp driving HE-6 and speakers to the Nuforce STA-100, so it should be interesting.


----------



## thegrobe

I have had my DACmini CX for about a week and a half now, and wanted to share some initial impressions. My CX has the “1 ohm” mod and the “black case” mod. My headphones are the LCD-2 latest revision (2.2?) and Heir Audio 4.A and 8.A CIEM’s.  
   
  I’m using Foobar as my player, and have it setup to use either ASIO or WASAPI out via USB to the DAC and seems to be working quite well.
   
  First off, the sound quality is just a tremendous jump up from anything else I have had to date. Until the DACmini, I have used all manner of iPods (including DIY iMods) and a Leckerton UHA-S6 MkII as my portable amp and computer DAC/amp. So it’s not like I have a huge arsenal of stuff to compare to, but the DACmini decisively takes a huge jump ahead. The aforementioned sources are not bad by any means, but CEntrance has ruined them for all me. And I’m okay with that.
   
  The areas of improvement that jump out at me the most are: The pure blackness of the background, the clarity of and “3D” placement of each individual instrument, and the ease of picking up minor details in the sound.  And most importantly how the whole presentation melds together as a cohesive whole that sounds realistic and natural with just the right amount of warmth.
   
  So I have had a taste of what a decent DAC can do for my listening enjoyment and wow, what a great improvement.
   
  The DACmini/ LCD-2 combo does sound pretty fantastic. I am coming from pretty much only IEM’s and this is my first shot at a full size can setup. I won’t go into all the descriptions that have already been put out here about this combo (by those much more experienced than me) but I will say I am quite pleased. The combo only has about 50 hours or so of burn-in so perhaps there is a touch more refinement still to be had. I also have a replacement cable on order from Norse Audio so looking forward to that. But as it stands, the overall performance of the setup is really hard to fault. Also, there seems to be enough power on tap for any reasonable listening level. I can’t foresee any need to go past 2 O’clock on the dial without leaving straight away to the ear doctor afterwards. Usually much lower than that gets the job done, around 9 to 11 O’clock.
   
  If I had to pick a shortcoming of the DACmini/LCD-2,  I guess at times I find myself wanting a bit more in the bass department....Now this is coming from my Heir 8.A’s which is a mallet whack of bass thark injected into your soul via the ear-holes. So take this into account. I may be coming from a skewed perspective.
   
  On some tracks it seems the combo could have a bit more heft, a bit more grunt, a bit more something….then again on other tracks it is just spot-on. There is no question about the quality of the bass, the punch, details, and layering is fantastic. Just sometimes I am wishing for a bit more oomph. I do realize, however that more bass is a slippery slope. More bass is like adding more salt while cooking. You got to have enough, but if you add too much, you have ruined everything. For a large majority of tracks though, the bass quantity seems fine so this tells me that the setup is running right on the edge of the correct amount of “salt”…um, I mean bass.
   
  Now switching over to the CIEM’s….The CIEM’s have never sounded better than through this DAC...'Nuff said.
   
  One problem I have with the setup however is useable volume using the DACmini as DAC and amp. The 4.A’s get just a crack of the volume knob and that’s all they can really take. So for all purposes the 4.A’s have no volume control, just on and off. I can knock the volume slider in Foobar down a bit and that takes care of that but I’m not sure how I feel about digitally chopping my source down. The 8.A’s have a little more wiggle room but still not a lot. But I kind of expected this so it’s not a huge disappointment. Remember I mentioned the occasional want of a touch more bass with the LCD-2’s? Well that’s not an issue here. In addition to smooth, clear and just great sounding output there is gobs of bass on tap, probably on the cusp of a bit too much with the 8.A’s and a nicely balanced amount with the 4.A’s
   
  So I have found that I can use the DAC section of the DACmini and run the line out to the analog line in of the UHA-6S and run the CIEM’s off that for the best possible setup. The headphone amp section on the UHA is hard to beat with the CIEM’s (and has rollable opamps for fine tuning) and pairing the DACmini DAC with that amp section is just pure awesomeness. I am unbelievably happy with this combo. Volume control still takes place pretty low on the UHA dial but it’s certainly an improvement. In hindsight, I wish I had gotten the variable output mod for this setup but I guess I can always pay to have it done later if need be.
   
  Edit: I have spent a little more time with the CIEM's and have to change my opinion on something: The 8.A's do just fine out of the DACmini. The 4.A's I still prefer sending through the UHA amp section to get a little more wiggle room. The portable amp just matches them better. 8.A can plug right into the DACmini and sound fantastic. 
   
  The drawback for this setup with the CIEM’s? Well…. it’s not portable. It just so happens that I am in the M8 pre-order group so that’s just the trick to scratch that itch. From what I am getting out of the DACmini…if the M8 is even 75% as good in the sound department I will be very pleased. I have a feeling however it will be much closer than that. Then throw in the variable output to address the volume issues with the CIEM…and the tone shaping …all looking very promising.
   
  Enough rambling from me… Good job, CEntrance. The DACmini is just great. Thanks.


----------



## zilch0md

It was really fun reading your ramblings!   I'm glad you like the DACmini.  It's a keeper!
   





   
  Mike


----------



## thegrobe

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> It was really fun reading your ramblings!   I'm glad you like the DACmini.  It's a keeper!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks...rambling must be my strong point. Ha ha.
   
  After a bit more time, I changed my mind on something and made an edit to the above post:
   
Edit: I have spent a little more time with the CIEM's and have to change my opinion on something: The 8.A's do just fine out of the DACmini. The 4.A's I still prefer sending through the UHA amp section to get a little more wiggle room. The portable amp just matches them better. 8.A can plug right into the DACmini and sound fantastic.


----------



## candrifter

spdif is the way to go with high res files


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I must be losing my mind... after selling off a bunch off stuff I just took the plunge on a PX to see how it fares with my HE-6 from the speaker taps. I'll be writing up a review to compare it vs my Nuforce stack (Icon2 + HDP) as an all-in-one desktop solution for the HE-6.
> 
> edit: will also compare vs the new Nuforce STA-100.


 
   
  So I've been listening and comparing over a week now. The PX is a fine fine unit, and does a great job as an all-in-one feeding the HE-6. If I had to pick a preference from these early impressions though, I think I'm still leaning towards my Nuforce stack (Icon2 + HDP + LPS). Granted, the PX trumps them all for size and feature set in a single unit, though I suppose if I were going for the smallest size possible I'd just wrangle the Icon2 by itself. 
   
  I'll have more impressions in the near future, but some brief notes:
  Icon2 only = amazing value, most compact (size of a book)
  Icon2 + HDP + LPS = better dac and overall cleaner sound than above, but big added cost and complexity, most impact
  DAC + HAP + STA-100 = most aggressive, most expensive, biggest featureset
  Centrance PX = as a single unit it's better than Icon2 by itself, neutral sound, most compact after Icon2


----------



## mikemercer

I'm psyched to see this thread still going strong!
  My DACmini (I kept a PX, in case I needed to drive small speakers for review) is still a vital part of my personal audio reference system at home.
   
  I'm using it as the DAC ahead of my E.A.R HP4 tube headphone amp, and Ray Samuels The DarkStar balanced amp (getting better and better
  as it settles and burns in).  I enjoy the sound of the CEntrance DACmini, when paired with those two headphone amps, more-so than I do my
  dCs Delius or Sim Audio/Moon D100 (whose USB DAC is nothing great anyway)!  
   
  I also realized just how much I love the damn thing, and why I'm so proud to have been on the CEntrance team, even if only for a little while!
  Their products stand-up to stuff that costs a helluva lot more!  Why?  Simple - Michael Goodman has been providing technical solutions for 
  many high end audio companies (even extremely pricey stuff like Playback Designs) for years!
   
  Today I introduced the Bel Canto mLink into my desktop rig - because I wanted to try it.  The DACmini supports up to 192k at its SPDIF
  input, but 96k at the USB end (perfectly fine for me) and I wanted to see how the mLink performed between the DACmini and my MacBook/Amarra
  rig- giving me Async USB-to-SPDIF conversion, with support up to 192k...  This way I don't have to switch inputs to get 192k for some of my high rez stuff.
   
  Well, compared to going straight into the DACmini PX via USB?
  The DACmini's presentation is so much more engaging, dynamic, and open without anything in the signal path before it!!
  So much for that review.
   
  The Bel Canto works: It's a USB-SPDIF converter, so I'm not hating on the unit.
  But it's another testament to the DACmini's quality.
   
  I also go back to the DACmini constantly when trying out other headphone amps too.
  I feel like an old school operator from the fifties sometimes, plugging and unplugging the 1/4" jacks!!
   
  It's quality is still what I would consider to be "reference" level (to me that always means a component that gets the hell out of the way of the music, 
  that seems to impart very little of itself onto the sound in terms of coloration/distortion, etc.).  
   
  Another TIP OF THE HAT to Michael and his team at CEntrance for the DACmini.
  I remember when it first came out and stacked on the old school MACmini's!  Brilliant...


----------



## zilch0md

+1 to all of that Mike. 

Until further notice, *my favorite desktop combo is still the DACmini CX (with 1-Ohm output impedance mod) to my LCD-2 Rev1 via Toxic Cables' Silver Poison * - using the USB input from WAV and Foobar 2000 with WASAPI. I prefer this to every possible combination I've tried with the following gear: 

DACport LX

15V-powered Meier Stepdance (using either the DACport LX or the DACmini CX DAC section and Emotiva interconnects)

16V-powered iBasso PB2 with balanced output (using either the DACport LX or the DACmini CX DAC section and Emotiva interconnects)

Burson Soloist (using either the DACport LX or the DACmini CX DAC section and Emotiva interconnects)

AKG K550

Beyerdynamic DT1350 

Beyerdynamic T1

Mix and match 'til I'm blue in the face, the DACmini CX (1-Ohm) with Silver Poison cables to LCD-2 rev. 1 just continues to come out on top. Everything I've purchased since discovering this combination a year ago has been a distraction rather than an improvement. 

And, as with you, the DACmini CX has become my reference component.



Mike


----------



## mgoodman

Thank you, Michael (Mercer). Looking forward to seeing you in Newport soon!


----------



## mikemercer

Looking forward to seeing you too brotha!
  So, what up with the big M8????
   
  Though I know - we gotta keep it to DACmini here.


----------



## dparker83

Just got my Isoacoustics L8r130 stands today and put the masterclass speakers on em.  Wow!  Best 79$ upgrade ever....smoother midbass and better imaging...immediately noticeable.  Highly recommend these stands for the CEntrance audiophile desktop.


----------



## Taliesin

I'm tring to decide between the centrance DACmini PX or the Musical Fidelity M1 HPA with M1 PWR. both would be paired with a hd650 and KEF ls50


----------



## dparker83

I have DACmini PX with HD650.  Sounds amazing...I ended up getting rid of my Zu Mobius MKii cables because they really didn't add as much once I used the DACmini...almost a little too bright.  But the stock cables (or cables that aren't too bright) will sound really good with HD650/DACmini combination.


----------



## Armaegis

Anyone here have trouble getting the Dacmini via usb to work through wasapi? 
   
  I'm using J.River Media Center and I can only get music to play using "direct sound". If I try wasapi or wasapi-event style, it says I need to change the settings to 24/96 but even when I do it doesn't work. 
   
  Before this I've been feeding it optical/coax without any issue.


----------



## remilio

A couple of guys compared Anedio D1 and DACmini, but how about D2? I'm interested in USB performance only.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> Anyone here have trouble getting the Dacmini via usb to work through wasapi?
> 
> I'm using J.River Media Center and I can only get music to play using "direct sound". If I try wasapi or wasapi-event style, it says I need to change the settings to 24/96 but even when I do it doesn't work.
> 
> Before this I've been feeding it optical/coax without any issue.


 
   
  I can't contribute to this one, except to say that my DACmini CX has not had any problems using WASAPI event with Foobar 2000.  I've never tried J. River Media Center.
   
  Mike


----------



## Twinster

armaegis said:


> Anyone here have trouble getting the Dacmini via usb to work through wasapi?
> 
> I'm using J.River Media Center and I can only get music to play using "direct sound". If I try wasapi or wasapi-event style, it says I need to change the settings to 24/96 but even when I do it doesn't work.
> 
> Before this I've been feeding it optical/coax without any issue.



Did you download the Universal driver from the Centrance site?


----------



## Armaegis

I forgot all about that... but they're supposed to work wthout drivers anyways aren't they?


----------



## Armaegis

Well I got it to work with the drivers, but I'm still not sure why I couldn't get it to work without them.


----------



## Poetic

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Hi Poetic,
> 
> If you're comparing the DACport LX to the DAC section of the DACmini CX, they are very similar with any given amplifier, but especially so when the USB port that's supplying power to the LX is "noise-free" and can supply the 500mA of current at 5 votls that's supposed to be available according to the USB 2.0 spec.
> 
> ...


 
  Im planning on using the Hifiman He-500 headphones along with the HE-400 on the CX so i would need driving power. Would the B - stock be the version to get ? Also i was looking at the New Hifi M8 and i was wondering if i should just wait for that


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





poetic said:


> Im planning on using the Hifiman He-500 headphones along with the HE-400 on the CX so i would need driving power. Would the B - stock be the version to get ? Also i was looking at the New Hifi M8 and i was wondering if i should just wait for that


 
   
  "B-stock" just means it's one of their slightly scratched or dented DACmini's.  I don't know if that deal is still available, but if you look back in this thread, you can find a link to the CEntrance page where they were selling these less expensive DACmini's.  
   
  I have no experience using a DACmini CX with the HE-400 or HE-500, but I believe that it could do a good job with either of them.  Again, not on my personal experience, but rather my understanding from what other's have written, I would get the standard 10-Ohm output impedance version of the DACmini CX - there's no need to pay extra for the 1-Ohm output impedance if you are intending to use it with the HiFiMan HE-400 or -500, as they are not as dark as the Audeze LCD-2.
   
  Mike


----------



## Armaegis

I've experimented with output impedance with the HE-6, LCD2 and HD595/650/800, using the NuForce HAP-100 which has an output module with jumpers to bypass the 15ohm output resistors. So it's not exactly the same as the DacMini, but the comparison should have some relevance. I found the differences are noticeable with the Sennheisers (which have the impedance spike in the midbass), but very very minor with the orthos such that I could really only notice when doing a very quick A/B. The higher output impedance doesn't really make them sound darker. The edges in music are perhaps a smidge softer, but that's it. 
   
Incidentally, I've been using the DacMini PX speaker outputs into the HE-6 and they sound fantastic.


----------



## zilch0md

Hi Armaegis,
   
  Good point - as I've often read that ortho-planars are almost purely resistive and thus, not very sensitive to impedance mismatches.   With that in mind, the CEntrance description of their standard 10-Ohm output impedance for the DACmini CX as being "more musical" where they describe the 1-Ohm mod as "more neutral," must be applicable only to dynamic headphones.  I use my 1-Ohm version primarily with the LCD-2, but I do enjoy being able to connect it to other low-impedance IEMs and headphones.
   
  Mike


----------



## Armaegis

With the dynamics, the impedance spike manifests very clearly as a boost in the frequency response. It's not unpleasant, and the effect is generally small with the likes of the Senn HD580+. It's much more noticeable with the HD595 which swings from something like 50 to 250, but then you're also jumping from above and below the "1:8" rule. Changing in damping are not noticeable when you have the frequency shift to contend with.
   
  With planars, there is no change in frequency response and the differences in damping are barely noticeable. I can pick them apart if I'm A/B'ing the two right next to each other and listening to a very small repeated section of music over and over. There's no way I'd be able to tell the difference if I had any time in between.


----------



## muzic4life

I have a very small dislike about the dacmini, practically. I love everything about it, except the default input is being USB every time i turn ON the device. I use the coax input, so every time i want to listen music i need to turn the knob to coax. Why don't they just make it being able to stay at the last input we chosen? I prefer something like attenuator select could be better.


----------



## aras

Couldn't agree more. Everytime I turn it on, I have to go through all inputs to reach USB input.


----------



## thegrobe

aras said:


> Couldn't agree more. Everytime I turn it on, I have to go through all inputs to reach USB input.




But the selection switch IS the on/off switch. You can go from "off" to "USB" with one click. I can see a minor gripe with coax or optical, but "line" and "USB" are right next to the "off" detent/positions.


----------



## Armaegis

Um, you guys know that the power/input selector can start on either side, depending which way you turn it...
   
  If the device is off and you turn the knob to the left (counterclockwise), the selector will start on the right.
  If the device is off and you turn the knob to the right (clockwise), the selector will start on the left


----------



## aras

Wow! I thought it was one way only!! Thanks for tip! I feel quite dumb for not trying it the other way


----------



## roker

Quote: 





bostonears said:


> I don't usually watch unboxing videos, but I just happened to watch this one posted a long time ago by Head-Fier *roker*.
> 
> I was laughing out loud at this exchange between roker and the camerawoman.
> 
> ...


 
   
  woot!
   
  glad you enjoyed it!  
   
  I was a tad bit overweight back then, kind of hard to believe, but In a few months I will have had it for 2 years and I still use it.


----------



## muzic4life

armaegis said:


> Um, you guys know that the power/input selector can start on either side, depending which way you turn it...
> 
> If the device is off and you turn the knob to the left (counterclockwise), the selector will start on the right.
> If the device is off and you turn the knob to the right (clockwise), the selector will start on the left




Now i wish they put the coax at the very left  ...good information btw.


----------



## Armaegis

Seriously guys, from the off position it's at most two clicks to get to any particular input. It's a half second of effort.


----------



## Twinster

armaegis said:


> Seriously guys, from the off position it's at most two clicks to get to any particular input. It's a half second of effort.




This is just proving that their is not much to complain about the DACmini.


----------



## Armaegis

Here's my mini shootout of the PX vs some Nuforce amps, driving the HE-6... http://www.head-fi.org/t/666077/mini-shootout-desktop-amping-solutions-for-the-he-6-nuforce-icon2-sta-100-and-centrance-dacmini-px


----------



## Poetic

After recieving the Dacmini CX on friday. I do consider it an upgrade above my Dacport LX. I've been using the Dacmini CX along with my Hifiman HE-500 and 400 Headphones and they sound awesome. One thing for sure is that the Dacmini CX surprisingly is on par with my DX100.
  I thought the CX would've blown away my IBasso DX100 but they're both on par with each other in terms of sound quality. Some people complained about the overly bright sound signature with the HE-500 on the CX but i haven't experienced that at all with the CX.
   
  The bass in the CX is ridiculously good. It sounds a bit better on the CX in terms of bass quality for the HE-500/HE-400, i just can't believe how clean and detail the bass sounds in this unit. The Soundstage is pretty much the same on both. Both of the Mids and highs are clean on both of the Units but the DX100 highs feels a bit more extended. The CX seems more natural, but less airiness than the DX100. The DX100 definatetly has better treble extension , more detail/seperation, and sounds more refined/Reference is what i would describe it. This test was with firmware 1.2.7 of the DX100. The Clarity is a tab bright and clear on 1.2.7. Which gives off a bit more microdetail. I've always been a fan of the ESS 9018 Sabre. The CX and DX100 both give off this sense of euphorica. If i could describe the color of the sound of the DX100 it would be Sunny Orange. The CX sound color would seem to be the color of Sky Blue.
   
  But all that doesn't amaze me as much as the CX and it's musicality and naturality. The Music feels like Natural elements. It definately gives my He-500 and He-400 a better imaging , tone, and the music felt a bit real compared to the DX100, it feels alive. I think that is part of the reason of why i want to get the Hifiman 901 music player. The CX sounds so lovely and musical to my ears, while still giving off great detail and Transparency. The Sonic Sound signature of the CX sounds so beautiful and quick. It definately gives my headphones that sonic pairing i've always wanted. and OMG the bass just rocks my socks off !
   
  The CX soundstage is wide, and has the best bass quality i've ever heard from a source. It sounds alot like the Dacpot LX that i've recently owned but better. Im at the point where I may just sell my Dx100 and use the CX as my music source since my dad already has a DX100 of his own and barely uses it. Im at a tough decision because if the Hifi M8 is better than the CX, I will for sure buy the M8. Centrance continues to impress me each time I buy a product from them. The Dacport LX was a great starting source for me, although i had to use a USB hub recommended from Lee, because at first i wasn't getting enough power from the unit. and it made the sound really veil. The CX and DX100 both have an Amazing Internal amp section and both is clearly a step above The Dacport LX.
  
  If the M8 is better than the CX then i have no reason to jump to another DAP ( HM901). The CX and DX100 seems to both be on par with each other in terms of Overall Sound Quality, and they both give off a different sound signature that makes me enjoy music in a different way. It was very hard for me to describe how they compete with each other  because they both sound remarkable!. The CX is still definately an impressive piece of Audio, I may just sell my DX100 and get the M8.
   
  Next week on my day off ill be able to test the CX with the HE-6, ill report back to you guys soon . Excellent Job Centrance, You've made me a big fan of your audio these past 2 days. Keep up the good work , You have an excellent company Michael


----------



## muzic4life

My impressions about dacmini cx mirrors to yours. Its definitely an upgrade from dacport lx. In term of bass..clarity...neutrality...musicality...is exactly like what u said as i like it much too. However...i feel like the amp section of dacmini is not enough muscle to pump the harder to drive cans. I tried it using hd650 and the T1. The dacmini can drive them fine but somehow i feel like a bit of loosing its juicyness. Not enough oomph and requires just a bit sense of a warmth. I feel like the amp section of the dacmini is tend to be sort of bonus to the dac it self. Having said that...i like its dac section quality over the amp section of dacmini. (Currently i am using dacmini' dac + burson soloist).

If i compare the dac alone between my clas db / fostex hpp1 / dacmini....they almost the same. They are very good in term of detail and clarity. But i will rate fostex hpp1 on top of the three in term of smoothness and the dacmini in term of more natural...more intimate...and more bodied to the sound. 

I had my chance to compare my ak100 vs the dacmini (as an amp)....to me...the sound of dacmini is WAY better in everything than the ak100.


----------



## Poetic

Quote: 





muzic4life said:


> My impressions about dacmini cx mirrors to yours. Its definitely an upgrade from dacport lx. In term of bass..clarity...neutrality...musicality...is exactly like what u said as i like it much too. However...i feel like the amp section of dacmini is not enough muscle to pump the harder to drive cans. I tried it using hd650 and the T1. The dacmini can drive them fine but somehow i feel like a bit of loosing its juicyness. Not enough oomph and requires just a bit sense of a warmth. I feel like the amp section of the dacmini is tend to be sort of bonus to the dac it self. Having said that...i like its dac section quality over the amp section of dacmini. (Currently i am using dacmini' dac + burson soloist).
> 
> If i compare the dac alone between my clas db / fostex hpp1 / dacmini....they almost the same. They are very good in term of detail and clarity. But i will rate fostex hpp1 on top of the three in term of smoothness and the dacmini in term of more natural...more intimate...and more bodied to the sound.
> 
> I had my chance to compare my ak100 vs the dacmini (as an amp)....to me...the sound of dacmini is WAY better in everything than the ak100.


 
  The CX seemed to drive my HE-500 very well to my liking at least. The HE-500 do improve alot when it gets power. But i think it's the way they recieve power. However if i use the Emotiva Mini X a-100 or the JDS Labs O2 on the DX100 Lineout then use the HE-500, it's a much better performer than the Dacmini CX. I still like how the HE-500 sounds on the Dacmini CX reguardless though. I love the Natural tone it gives the music. I haven't listened to any other source ever since i got the DX100, and hearing music in a different way definately makes me intrigued with the CX. With the DX100 without an external amp vs the CX, they both seemed to be on par with each other. Also im using the Mid Gain of the DX100. The High Gain of the DX100 only found useful for different firmwares. But still overall Im very impressed with the DACmini. It drove my HE-400 effortless , and gave my Grado's a musical taste .
   
  EDIT: I would also like to add that theQ701's sounds waaaaaaaay better on the CX than my DX100. It gives my Q701's a much more easy listening balanced sound. The DX100 makes the Q701's sound way to agressive.The highs felt to strong on the DX100. But I now have a source that i can listen to my dad's Q701's with. Very Happy  as the Q701's is one of my favorite headphones ^_^


----------



## muzic4life

I think we have a similar taste here 
I too love driving my ps500 via dacmini. It so musical and the sound is so alive without feeling any sibilant and harshness. Really love the sound actually.


----------



## Poetic

Quote: 





muzic4life said:


> I think we have a similar taste here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  The sound of the Grado 325 sounds soo soo delicious on the CX. it feels like im live on stage hearing the band play right next to me!


----------



## muzic4life

poetic said:


> The sound of the Grado 325 sounds soo soo delicious on the CX. it feels like im live on stage hearing the band play right next to me!




Just to make sure again...i am listening to it now with my grado....i think we both is right


----------



## Poetic

Quote: 





muzic4life said:


> Just to make sure again...i am listening to it now with my grado....i think we both is right


 
  I had a listen to the PS500 a couple months ago. Makes me wonder how they would sound on the Dacmini. Since they are different from the grado line up .


----------



## Poetic

Received my This Providence - CD today in the mail. Ripped it into 24Bit 96 Wav, played it on the DACmini. I am amazed of how this album sounds with the He-500. I literally heard Dan Young blow into the mic on the song Anything Is possible. It's amazing how this dacmini keeps sounding better and better . I'm sure the "Burn In" is kicking in at the moment!


----------



## 282432

Does anyone know how's the pairing of the Denon AH-D7000 and the DACmini CX with the 1 ohm mod ?


----------



## Twinster

tjcheong said:


> Does anyone know how's the pairing of the Denon AH-D7000 and the DACmini CX with the 1 ohm mod ?




I'm using my D7000 with the DACmini with th 1 Ohm output and it's a very nice combo IMO.


----------



## 282432

twinster said:


> I'm using my D7000 with the DACmini with th 1 Ohm output and it's a very nice combo IMO.



Thanks for your input, Twinster. Do you mind elaborating how does it change the D7000's SQ ?


----------



## netmask254

Can IEM or low impedence headphone work well with DACmini? I have a Westone 4 IEM and Sennheiser Momentum headphone. Though buying DACmini is major for HD650, I hope it can also work well with other cans in hand. Some advices are appreciated.


----------



## DrPyro2k

Netmask, I have something similar.  I have a DACMini PX setup that i use 3 different ways.  I bought the Audiophile Desktop system when it went on sale at the beginning of the year.  So, I use the desktop speakers most of the time for generic listening since I often have to get up and down when someone yells at me to do something.  If i want more critical listening I use a pair of Sennheiser HD580 headphones and they work well enough for me.    I sometimes use Sleek Audio SA-6 IEMs, when i want to isolate the background noise.  I don't often use the IEMs since i use them all day at work, but it works good enough for my needs.  But the Westone 4 are much nicer than my Sleek Audio set, so you may be more picky about sound quality...  I am getting really close to ordering a pair of custom IEMs, because i am tired of the Sleek Audio cable issues.
   
  -DrPyro


----------



## netmask254

Quote: 





drpyro2k said:


> Netmask, I have something similar.  I have a DACMini PX setup that i use 3 different ways.  I bought the Audiophile Desktop system when it went on sale at the beginning of the year.  So, I use the desktop speakers most of the time for generic listening since I often have to get up and down when someone yells at me to do something.  If i want more critical listening I use a pair of Sennheiser HD580 headphones and they work well enough for me.    I sometimes use Sleek Audio SA-6 IEMs, when i want to isolate the background noise.  I don't often use the IEMs since i use them all day at work, but it works good enough for my needs.  But the Westone 4 are much nicer than my Sleek Audio set, so you may be more picky about sound quality...  I am getting really close to ordering a pair of custom IEMs, because i am tired of the Sleek Audio cable issues.
> 
> -DrPyro


 

 DrPyro, thanks a lot for your sharing! Ideally I was going to get a Burson Audio conductor, but it's really expensive to me comparing with DACMini currently  May need to wait some time.


----------



## Solitary1

Does anybody own or heard the Dacmini that can make some comparisons with the Audio-GD NFB-11.32. I sold my Maverick Audio A1/D2 combo and was considering the Dacmini PX to power my speakers and as a another headphone amp, but, if the two are close, I will probably get the Nuforce DDA-100 to power the speakers.


----------



## Taliesin

Has anyone compaired the DACmini with the Audiolab M-DAC, both in terms of the dac and the headphone out?


----------



## dparker83

Anyone using Dacmini with Audeze LCD3?
   
  I'm very satisfied, with the exception of the sensitivity of the gain.  Can't crank past 8 o'clock on most tunes, and it takes very, very, very small adjustments to find the right volume.  If you go too low, the right channel starts to drops out.
   
  Guess it could be a problem with the unit.  Or maybe I just have a low tolerance for high spl's.


----------



## Armaegis

You could try lowering the volume digitally. That would at least give you some more useable range on the knob.


----------



## zilch0md

dparker83 said:


> Anyone using Dacmini with Audeze LCD3?
> 
> I'm very satisfied, with the exception of the sensitivity of the gain.  Can't crank past 8 o'clock on most tunes, and it takes very, very, very small adjustments to find the right volume.  If you go too low, the right channel starts to drops out.
> 
> Guess it could be a problem with the unit.  Or maybe I just have a low tolerance for high spl's.




For what it's worth, a friend of mine, who very painstakingly built himself a killer HiFi system (PS Audio, Nelson Pass, Focal, etc.), then turned his attention to Head-Fi and after testing a lot of gear, concluded that, for his tastes, nothing beats the LCD-3 on a DACmini CX. He says he normally listens with the volume at 9 o'clock. Me too, with the LCD-2 rev. 1.


----------



## ejong7

Correct me if I'm wrong but is the PX  a CX + the black case mod (thus scratch resistant) + a speaker amplifier? I'm choosing between the CX/PX and the WA7 and I probably would wanna pair it with a LCD2/3. So the PX can power the HE6 with the speaker out but not the headphone out right? Just wanna confirm that as I would think I might upgrade to a LCD3 and the Dacmini (CX/PX) would have enough power to drive it.


----------



## Armaegis

I've been running the PX into my HE-6 for a little while now and posted some thoughts here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/666077/
   
  The headphone jack has a lot of power, but for the HE-6 it's definitely better off the speaker taps.


----------



## ejong7

Does anybody (need to ) run any of their headphones (except the HE6) through the speaker out? How do you guys run your LCD3's? And is the case for the PX already scratch resistant?


----------



## dparker83

Yes it's anodized


----------



## barid

So, I just got my Dacmini PX over the weekend and I'll share some thoughts on it vs the Soloist. 
   
  - They sound very similar for the most part, if I sat down to a blind ABX test between them I would be hard pressed to tell them apart.
  - Soloist feels a bit more laid back, and I think that quality may give the impression of better separation or tonality on the Soloist.  In other    words instruments sounded more 'correct' to me, but this is also possibly b/c I am used to the Soloist by this point.
  - DACmini kind of has a bright edge to it, but again I don't find this glaringly noticeable unless you're looking for it.
   
  Ended up with the PX b/c I  was looking to drive some passive desktop speakers and also have very little desk room.  If you were deciding between these 2 amps I don't think you could really go wrong, I did not think one was too far off the other.  Keeping the PX simply for ergonomic reasons.


----------



## Armaegis

Have you tried running your headphones off the speaker taps yet?


----------



## barid

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> Have you tried running your headphones off the speaker taps yet?


 
   
  Have not yet.  I think the only pair I have that might be worth it to try would be the LCD2's....probably have to find a cable for that


----------



## aras

Dacmini sounds amazing with Senn IE80s even better than my W4s.
   
  These are my complaints about Dacmini;
  -the fact that the charge $100 extra for something as simple as line-out volume adjustment. 
  -power and Usb connections are quite loose.
  -dacmini freezes if you forget to turn it off before shutting down your PC. You will need to remove the AC adapter to reset it. My $150 Audioengine D1 DAC is much more stable.
   
  Things I love:
  -tiny size and build quality (looks beautiful in black)
  -execellent headphone out and line-out. Sounds equally good with my speakers and my headphones/earphones. Most importantly, sound signature is consistent among the two outlets. Sound is expansive with very good extension on both directions.


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





aras said:


> -dacmini freezes if you forget to turn it off before shutting down your PC. You will need to remove the AC adapter to reset it. My $150 Audioengine D1 DAC is much more stable.


 
   
  I think it depends on the usb of the computer. I can shut off my computer with the Dacmini still on and it'll work just fine on boot up, but if I unplug the usb cable while the dacmini is on, it freezes sometimes (for sure if there's music playing, only sometimes when I don't have my player loaded).


----------



## aras

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I think it depends on the usb of the computer. I can shut off my computer with the Dacmini still on and it'll work just fine on boot up, but if I unplug the usb cable while the dacmini is on, it freezes sometimes (for sure if there's music playing, only sometimes when I don't have my player loaded).


 
  Yeah it will work fine when your reboot into your PC. The problem is that it is stuck if you don't reboot your computer. You can't turn it off, it will stay ON. You need to unplug the power cable or turn on the PC. Basically it is not very stable like my Audioengine D1 dac.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





barid said:


> So, I just got my Dacmini PX over the weekend and I'll share some thoughts on it vs the Soloist.
> 
> - They sound very similar for the most part, if I sat down to a blind ABX test between them I would be hard pressed to tell them apart.
> - Soloist feels a bit more laid back, and I think that quality may give the impression of better separation or tonality on the Soloist.  In other    words instruments sounded more 'correct' to me, but this is also possibly b/c I am used to the Soloist by this point.
> ...


 
   
  Wow Barid! 
   
  I'm really excited to read your comparison of the DACmini PX headphone amp vs. the Burson Soloist!   I've been comparing the DACmini CX to the Soloist for seven months, now, and I couldn't agree more with your impressions.  Seriously!
   
*1) It's hard to tell them apart (Soloist vs. DACmini) - Agreed!*
  (At the recent Dallas meet, I tried to get some people to A/B the DACmini CX vs. Soloist, but couldn't find any takers.  One guy said, "I don't want to waste my time listening to the CX when I've got a Soloist sitting here!")
   
*2) The Soloist is more laid back than the DACmini CX/PX - Agreed! *
  (The Soloist sounds like fourth-row seating vs. on-stage.)
   
*3) The Soloist is smoother in the treble and just a little bit darker than the DACmini - Agreed! *
  (I think it's because the DACmini's DAC has a wee bit of etch in the treble that carries through the DACmini's amp section but is smoothed out in the Soloist, yet not so much in other amps I've heard.)
   
  Here's something else I'd like you to compare:  *I've concluded that the DACmini CX actually offers better dynamics (more slam) than the Soloist. * It's subtle, but listen to how fast and energetic the bass is with the DACmini vs. the Soloist.  
   
  I've recently put both my Beyerdynamic T1 and Burson Soloist up for sale because, although they work well together, I'm hooked on the signature of my LCD-2 Rev.1 and the DACmini CX outperforms the Soloist with my LCD-2 - barely!  That slight etch and brightness of the DACmini is PERFECT for the shelved highs and less than ideal resolving power of the LCD-2.  
   
  I love my DACmini CX and continue to be amazed at how little attention it receives - seriously underrated as everybody chases after the latest and greatest (including me).
   
  I've got a friend in Melbourne who's been heavy into HiFi for many years.  He ended up settling on the DACmini CX with LCD-3 after spending a lot of money experimenting with head-fi gear, selling everything else eventually to keep that seemingly modest DAC/amp combo.
   





   
  Mike


----------



## muzic4life

Hi mike..
I could not agree more with your point 1, 2, 3. I have a very similar experience same like that.
However...regarding about "more slam"..i think this is where the modded dacmini better when compared to the standart one. I tried using LCD2...and definitely Soloist has more slam to the standard dacmini. Imo..standard dacmini also has somewhat a bit of mids oriented sound. Not like pure mids oriented..but i feel like the mids has more appealing presentation. Driving cans like Momentum, beyer DT1350 and also my Grado, sound is very good from standard dacmini, very well match and better compared to Soloist.

And yes...dacmini as dac with soloist is a very good match. And my favorite cans to go with that are the T1 and ATH3000ANV.

Cheers.
Yon.


----------



## zilch0md

Good points, Yon!
   
  You're very astute to have recalled that my DACmini CX has the 1-Ohm output impedance mod - which does make it more neutral and perhaps less "fun" than the 10-Ohm version.  I somehow overlooked the distinction in my reaction to barid's post.  
   
  But that makes three of us (and counting?) who can testify that the DACmini CX can hold its own with the Soloist (at least with the Audeze products).
   
  I agree with you that the T1 sounds better with the Soloist, but for my taste, it's just too analytical.  The more I experiment with other headphones, the more I come running back to the not-neutral, yet very transparent, organic sound of the LCD-2 on a neutral solid state DAC and amp.
   
  Mike


----------



## Armaegis

While not with the Dacmini, I did A/B two Nuforce HAP-100's, one with a 15 ohm resistor on the output and one without, using an LCD2 and HE-500. There was a bit more oomph in the one with the output resistor, accounting for the lower damping factor (and yes, I did volume match). The one without seemed perhaps cleaner with a sharper upper end, but that could have been a residual effect from less midbass oomph.
   
  With the LCD2, I preferred the higher damping factor (without output resistor). With the HE-500, I preferred the lower one (with output resistor). Mind you, these differences were tiny. I would be extremely hard pressed to tell the difference if I weren't A/B'ing directly.


----------



## Bostonears

Quote: 





aras said:


> -dacmini freezes if you forget to turn it off before shutting down your PC. You will need to remove the AC adapter to reset it. My $150 Audioengine D1 DAC is much more stable.


 
   
  I had a similar issue with my DACmini, but the problem went away after downloading and installing CEntrance's "Universal Driver".
   
  It's also possible that your PC could have BIOS settings that impact how it interacts with USB devices when supposedly shutdown.


----------



## barid

Quote: 





zilch0md said:


> Wow Barid!
> 
> I'm really excited to read your comparison of the DACmini PX headphone amp vs. the Burson Soloist!   I've been comparing the DACmini CX to the Soloist for seven months, now, and I couldn't agree more with your impressions.  Seriously!


 
   
  Yeah I have to kind of temper my opinions on new gear because I tend to have a always prefer the old sound I'm more familiar with.  When I moved from the 106D to the Soloist I hated the presentation, but came to appreciate its strengths.  Same notion holds true for the DACmini vs Soloist, I find myself noticing some grain/etch in the treble on the DACmini that makes it more fatiguing over time, and also more mid-range detail in the Burson.  These things aren't really swaying my choice though as I find the differences minor.  The more time spent with the gear you just happen to pick up these little idiosyncrasies.


----------



## kabukix

Can anyone compare mini to violectric v800 ?


----------



## barid

Anyone here using the centrance drivers on windows rather than just plug and play?  Notice any difference?


----------



## Bostonears

barid said:


> Anyone here using the centrance drivers on windows rather than just plug and play?  Notice any difference?


 
  I'm using the CEntrance Universal Driver on a Windows 7 PC. I haven't noticed any difference in sound quality. However, with the standard plug and play driver, the DACmini seemed to get confused by the PC shutting down, and in that situation the DACmini would often lock up, requiring that I pull the power plug on it to temporarily to reset it. With the CEntrance driver installed, the DACmini turns itself on and off properly when the PC gets shut down or started up.


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

I have channel imbalance with L>R when using Dacmini RCA Line OUT to other amps. I posed this question to Centrance support and was told that their engineers have never encountered this problem. I wonder if any Dacmini owners have had the same problem and/or if anyone can suggest a solution that I may have overlooked. If not, I'll have to send it in for repairs at $100/hour.
   
  Here's the description and thanks in advance!
   
 The problem is channel imbalance with L>R when using Dacmini as the DAC and feeding other amps via Dacmini's RCA Line OUTs.  The imbalance is approximately 70:30 such that the sound stage is shifted to the Left.
  
 The Right RCA Output is not totally "out."
 There is no distortion.
 The Left side works fine.
 I have tried 3 different RCA cables, Glass Toslink from MacBook Pro to Dacmini, and USB from MacBook Pro to Dacmini with the same results.
 I have tried 2 different amps with the same result.
 I do not have variable Out in my Dacmini.
 The Dacmini 1/4" headphone Out jack - the SE TRS plug - works fine with no imbalance.
  
 I also tried:
  
 1. Reversing the cables (Red cable to White Dacmini RCA Out, and vice versa with the same results.
  
 2. Bypass the Dacmini and use my MacBook Pro's Headphone Out > mini TRS to RCA Y-splitter > Same 2 Amps as above and there's No imbalance. 
  
 3. Bypass the Dacmini and use my iPhone 4S as DAC > mini TRS to RCA Y-splitter > Same 2 amps as above and there is No imbalance.
  
 4. MacBook Pro or iPhone as DAC > mini TRS to RCA Y-splitter > Dacmini Line In > Dacmini Headphone Out and there is No imbalance.
  
 5. MacBook Pro or iPhone as DAC > mini TRS to RCA Y-splitter > Dacmini Line In > Dacmini RCA Line Out > Same 2 amps and there Is channel imbalance.
  
 I don't know if it matters, but there seems to be less resistance when inserting an RCA plug into the Dacmini Right Channel Line In....probably does not matter since there is no imbalance with #4, above.
  
 I believe I've narrowed it down to the Dacmini Right RCA Line Out unless I'm missing the obvious.
  
 I can't think of anything else to try.


----------



## zilch0md

I've never heard of this either, but it sounds as if you're no where near imagining the problem.  I suggest sending it in to CEntrance for repair.


----------



## thegrobe

I have not encountered such a thing myself or heard if it. Looks like repair...$100 an hour? Ouch. Guess it's not under warranty. Well, I guess the upside is that those guys are good and will probably find/fix it quickly. (Low repair hours)


----------



## dparker83

I have the exact same issue with the headphone output when listening at very low volumes.  Image shifts to the left, right channel drops several dB.
   
  Would you mind testing your unit's headphone output to see if you experience my issue at low volume?
   
  Thanks

 David


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Quote: 





dparker83 said:


> I have the exact same issue with the headphone output when listening at very low volumes.  Image shifts to the left, right channel drops several dB.
> 
> Would you mind testing your unit's headphone output to see if you experience my issue at low volume?
> 
> ...


 
  If you're talking about very low volume, yes, but the SPL is too low to matter in my case.
   
  The channel imbalance I'm having just started a week ago and present at all volume settings IF another amp gets its analog feed from the Dacmini RCA Line OUTs. It's odd. I haven't dropped, spilled, or otherwise done anything that can account for this.


----------



## Armaegis

How odd... I just hooked mine up to do some testing and at first thought there was a change when I flipped between sources, but then I realized I had my L/R flipped on one of my cables 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I can't detect any imbalance on mine. Checked through rmaa as well.


----------



## Bostonears

bluemonkeyflyer said:


> The channel imbalance I'm having just started a week ago and present at all volume settings IF another amp gets its analog feed from the Dacmini RCA Line OUTs. It's odd. I haven't dropped, spilled, or otherwise done anything that can account for this.


 
  Maybe a passive component, like a resistor or capacitor, crapped out in the DACmini. If so, that should be easy for CEntrance to repair.
   


dparker83 said:


> I have the exact same issue with the headphone output when listening at very low volumes.  Image shifts to the left, right channel drops several dB.


 
  That's probably due to imbalance in the volume control itself. (Many potentiometers have imbalance at very low volume.) That wouldn't be the case for bluemonkeyflyer, though, since his unit doesn't have variable output on the RCA jacks, i.e. the volume control doesn't affect the Line Out.


----------



## mgoodman

Please send to us for repair. I don't see more than one hour of work here.

Michael


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

Kenny sent me a RMA number. I plan to send it tomorrow. Thanks, Michael and Kenny.


----------



## Armaegis

Might as well upgrade to the PX model


----------



## muzic4life

Anyone knows is there any difference between px and cx in the dac section alone?


----------



## mgoodman

muzic4life said:


> Anyone knows is there any difference between px and cx in the dac section alone?


No difference in DAC. Just in output power. Speaker amp + headphone amp (PX) vs. only headphone amp (CX)


----------



## muzic4life

mgoodman said:


> No difference in DAC. Just in output power. Speaker amp + headphone amp (PX) vs. only headphone amp (CX)




Thanks Michael.


----------



## Taliesin

I was wondering about the amp section of the dacmini. How does it fit into the dacmini casing when there is already the dac and headphone amp in there? Where does the space for the amp fit in? What kind of class D amp is in the dacmini? What is the dacminis power output into 8 ohms?
Has anykind of dedicated intergrated centrance amp ever been thought about over at centrance HQ because that would be my dream amp because i dont think the dacmini px will be able to power kef r300/ls50.


----------



## Bostonears

taliesin said:


> I was wondering about the amp section of the dacmini. How does it fit into the dacmini casing when there is already the dac and headphone amp in there? Where does the space for the amp fit in? What kind of class D amp is in the dacmini? What is the dacminis power output into 8 ohms?
> Has anykind of dedicated intergrated centrance amp ever been thought about over at centrance HQ because that would be my dream amp because i dont think the dacmini px will be able to power kef r300/ls50.


 
   
  CEntrance provides very little info on the Class D amps in the DACmini PX, not even what chips power it. (Perhaps someone from CEntrance will chime in here.) CEntrance's own web site doesn't even show what the power amp board looks like, but 6Moons.com has a review of the DACmini PX with a picture that shows one side of it.
   
  With Class D amps, you can't tell much by looking, because they all look underwhelming. I used to own a multi-channel Rotel amp with Bang & Olufsen ICEpower 100 watt per channel Class D amp modules. It equaled (and slightly surpassed) the sound quality of a Bryston 120 wpc amp that weighed five times more and was priced three times higher. However, I'd be surprised if the amp modules in the PX are up to the B&O ICEpower level of sound quality, and at only 25 wpc, they're likely to be inadequate for your KEF speakers unless you're listening in a nearfield setup that doesn't require much power.


----------



## mgoodman

taliesin said:


> I was wondering about the amp section of the dacmini. How does it fit into the dacmini casing when there is already the dac and headphone amp in there? Where does the space for the amp fit in? What kind of class D amp is in the dacmini? What is the dacminis power output into 8 ohms?
> Has anykind of dedicated intergrated centrance amp ever been thought about over at centrance HQ because that would be my dream amp because i dont think the dacmini px will be able to power kef r300/ls50.


DACmini PX is a desktop integrated amp. Its 25 per channel watts of power is plenty for our MasrerClass 2504 Near-Field Monitors. The amp board sits in the back half of the unit, on the second floor, directly before the speaker terminals. We use modern TI technology in the amp.

PX may not be the best choice for larger floor standing speakers, it was designed to be used on the desktop, where 25W per channel is plenty.

We are currently working on a very unique portable solution (HiFi-M8) and may switch back to amp technology later. Right now we don't offer a higher powered amp, but thank you for your interest and good words.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I haven't posted here in a while but wanted to chime in that lately, while I've been not feeling well, that I spend a lot of time listening to music in my bedroom but not posting here much.  
   
  Most of my listening for the past 5-6 months is with my Macbook retina 15" > DACmini > LCD-2 rev2, LA7000, HE-500, and JH16Pro Freqphase.  I also do a fair bit of listening with my Nuforce DAC-100 > HD800 for their great synergy.  I sometimes use a Nuforce iDo as a digital dock for listening with my iPad if I don't want to use the Macbook.  With several tens of thousands of dollars worth of DACs, amps and other headphones at home, the above is the gear that I use the most because it's where it's most convenient.  
   
  If I want to listen to speakers I can use my Apple TV > Audioengine D2 wireless DAC > Nuforce STA-100 speaker amp with my PSB Imagine Mini bookshelf speakers.  I can move the D2 receiver, STA-100, and speakers anywhere around the house, and control the music via my iPad and apple remote software.
   
   
  I have pretty much ignored my big headphone rig in the basement for months, which is my PS Audio PWD with Bridge > Eddie Current ZDT, EF6, KGSS and KGBH amps > Stax SR-009, SR-007, Senn HE-60 and HiFIMan HE-6.  It often feels like too much trouble to head down to the basement where I'm too isolated and have to wait for the amps to warm up.  That's about $22K in gear that's being wasted, but I can't bring myself to sell it because when I do use it I find the sound to be heavenly.
   
  How crazy is that?


----------



## Armaegis

I often find myself leaning the way of convenience as well. I've got the big Nuforce-100 stack sitting around, but tend to use the smaller HDP or Dacmini more. Actually I use the HE-6 with the HDP/Icon2 and the Dacmini is currently in a flight case.
   
  Heck, often I just use a PX100-ii with a Focusrite VRMbox and call it a day.


----------



## mgoodman

headphoneaddict said:


> I haven't posted here in a while but wanted to chime in that lately, while I've been not feeling well, that I spend a lot of time listening to music in my bedroom but not posting here much.
> 
> ...



Larry - feel better soon! 
More cool gear is coming...


----------



## bluemonkeyflyer

armaegis said:


> I often find myself leaning the way of convenience as well. I've got the big Nuforce-100 stack sitting around, but tend to use the smaller HDP or Dacmini more. Actually I use the HE-6 with the HDP/Icon2 and the Dacmini is currently in a flight case.
> 
> Heck, often I just use a PX100-ii with a Focusrite VRMbox and call it a day.




How do you like Dacmin (dac and anp)i + HE-6?


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





bluemonkeyflyer said:


> How do you like Dacmin (dac and anp)i + HE-6?


 
   
  I really like it. Feeding off the speaker taps (I have the PX version) it drives them with aplomb. I have more notes written up here:
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/666077/mini-shootout-desktop-amping-solutions-for-the-he-6-nuforce-icon2-sta-100-and-centrance-dacmini-px
   
  Right now I'm defaulting to my Nuforce HDP/Icon2/LPS stack because I like the tonality just _slightly _more, but it's a bit clunky. If I wanted a single no-nonsense all-in-one unit to drive my HE-6, the Dacmini PX would be an easy choice.


----------



## nk77

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I really like it. *Feeding off the speaker taps (I have the PX version) it drives them with aplomb*. I have more notes written up here:
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/666077/mini-shootout-desktop-amping-solutions-for-the-he-6-nuforce-icon2-sta-100-and-centrance-dacmini-px
> 
> Right now I'm defaulting to my Nuforce HDP/Icon2/LPS stack because I like the tonality just _slightly _more, but it's a bit clunky. If I wanted a single no-nonsense all-in-one unit to drive my HE-6, the Dacmini PX would be an easy choice.


 
   
  Without any resistors? No issues with volume control?


----------



## Armaegis

None at all; I go straight wire into the XLR. Volume control is just fine and I have a good range of use. I tried it briefly with the standard Hifiman arrangement (didn't like it) and with the 10ohm parallel (ok). It sounds best without anything.


----------



## Armaegis

Ugh, the dacmini hates my ceiling fan. Whenever I switch the fan speed, it kills the dacmini and I have the unplug the power to reset it. It also seems particularly susceptible to the bad power in my home, as people turning on and off appliances (like a microwave, tv, etc) will cause clicks and pops. The surge protector I have does nothing. I wonder if a beefier power distribution bar would work? or a UPS? or a full out power conditioner?
   
  I'm guessing the Dacmini has some sort of protection relay that locks it down when it gets some sort of transient spike in the power rails? or is this possibly some weird usb glitch causing the freeze? (I know, I know, power issues are fiendishly difficult to narrow down)


----------



## mgoodman

Does this happen when the computer is connected to the DACmini? Try to turn the fan on/off while DACmini is not communicating with the computer (USB cable is not connected). If it continues to reset, then it's the unit itself, but I'm suspecting but the USB connection is breaking and that's known to freeze the unit.


----------



## Armaegis

Yeah, I just double checked and it's from the usb connection. I know this is more a household power/computer issue, but any ideas on a workaround for this? As this is for my secondary rig I was hoping to not have to drop too much extra cash on a solution. I suppose a usb-spdif bridge would work, or maybe a usb isolator like this? http://us.hifimediy.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=69&product_id=62


----------



## mgoodman

I





armaegis said:


> Yeah, I just double checked and it's from the usb connection. I know this is more a household power/computer issue, but any ideas on a workaround for this? As this is for my secondary rig I was hoping to not have to drop too much extra cash on a solution. I suppose a usb-spdif bridge would work, or maybe a usb isolator like this? http://us.hifimediy.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=69&product_id=62
> 
> [/quoteDo the computer and the DACmini share the power strip?
> 
> ...


----------



## Armaegis

Nope, the computer runs just fine. Most puzzling.
   
  p.s. it's an old Toshiba Satellite known for suffering from ground loops; I know you said the Dacmini already has a line isolator built in, but it's the only other thing I can think of


----------



## mgoodman

armaegis said:


> Nope, the computer runs just fine. Most puzzling.
> 
> p.s. it's an old Toshiba Satellite known for suffering from ground loops; I know you said the Dacmini already has a line isolator built in, but it's the only other thing I can think of




Here is from one of our engineers:


Is DACmini and the computer plugged in to the same outlet or power strip? Are the outlets loose (worn)?

Is the 'computer' a laptop with 2 or 3-prong AC cord? Is there a 'cheater-plug' used either for DACmini, the computer, power strip, or anything else electrically connected to the audio setup?

Is there gear attached to DM's coax input? Does this gear use a 2 or 3-prong AC cord? Does it use a cheater-plug?

Try placing a powered hub between DACmini and the computer. But this depends on whether the hub's output is compromised during power glitches.


----------



## zilch0md

On your USB cable, try putting a thin slice of tape over the pin shown in this photo, so that only data can come from the PC:
   
   

   
  Mike


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





mgoodman said:


> Here is from one of our engineers:
> 
> 
> Is DACmini and the computer plugged in to the same outlet or power strip? Are the outlets loose (worn)?
> ...


 
   
  The dacmini and computer are plugged into the same power strip (no other devices plugged in other than a table lamp which has been off the entire time). All outlets are reasonably firm. There is nothing plugged into the second outlet either. Nothing else plugged in for the entire room actually.
   
  Laptop has a 3-prong power cord. No cheater plugs are in use on any equipment
   
  No other gear attached to the Dacmini PX inputs. Only the usb is in use.
   
  I do not have any powered usb hubs, but I'll see what I can dig up.


----------



## zilch0md

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> The dacmini and computer are plugged into the same power strip (no other devices plugged in other than a table lamp which has been off the entire time). All outlets are reasonably firm. There is nothing plugged into the second outlet either. Nothing else plugged in for the entire room actually.
> 
> Laptop has a 3-prong power cord. No cheater plugs are in use on any equipment
> 
> ...


 
   
  Defer to Mr. Goodman's advice (and you're own understanding of all things electronic, which is considerable given your posts I've read), but here's a thought: I think you can rule out a ground loop by attaching a cheater plug to the 3-prong plug of the DACmini's AC adapter.  (That may be why he was asking - to see if that potential "fix" was already in place.)
   
  Waiting for Michael's feedback on this...
   
  Mike


----------



## mgoodman

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> The dacmini and computer are plugged into the same power strip (no other devices plugged in other than a table lamp which has been off the entire time). All outlets are reasonably firm. There is nothing plugged into the second outlet either. Nothing else plugged in for the entire room actually.
> 
> Laptop has a 3-prong power cord. No cheater plugs are in use on any equipment
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sorry guys - was away for the weekend. Please email me and we will solve it offline, it would be much faster that way.


----------



## Armaegis

Hi Michael, thanks for the response. I haven't posted since because I have had difficulty replicating the original problem consistently. I want to at least get a better idea of the cause before I send you guys on a goosechase.
   
  For anyone else coming into the thread just now, this isn't a problem with my dacmini which works just fine. It's a weird hiccup with my household wiring/ceiling fan/appliances that's causing blips, and Michael and co have been very gracious in trying to help me track it down.


----------



## mgoodman

Let us know if you find something else.


----------



## Armaegis

Thanks. At the moment, I think the issue arises when the dryer is running, if someone turns on the microwave, if a smartphone tries connecting to the wifi, when the moon is full, when squirrels are hopping on the power lines, or when unicorns prance across the street.
   
  I really have no idea anymore.


----------



## zilch0md

Meanwhile, my DACmini CX is doing a fine job with my near-field monitors.
   

   
   
  WAV > Foobar 2000 WASAPI event mode > USB > Moon Audio Blue Dragon USB cable > CEntrance DACmini CX Line Out > Emotiva RCA interconnects > TBI Millenia MG3 > KnuKonceptz Kord 10-AWG 462-strand OFC > Definitive Technology SM45 monitors (with the MG3 powered by a four-cell 1000 mAh LiPo pack that produces 16.8V at full charge, requiring recharge at 12.0V)
   
  The MG3 puts out 32 Watts into an 8-Ohm load with 24 DC supply voltage.
   
  The amp's designer, Jan Plummer, is shipping me a separately purchased impedance matching box for use with my 50-Ohm LCD-2.
   
  http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue67/tbi_millenia.htm
   
  http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/definitive-technology-studiomonitorsm-45-loudspeakers-hi-fi/
   
  Mike


----------



## jamesng45678

Does the dacmini px has the difference in power output and sound as compared to the Cx.


----------



## zilch0md

I don't have the PX, but my understanding is that it contains the same DAC and headphone amp as the CX, but adds a speaker amp.
  
 So, if you plug your headphones into the headphone jack of a PX, you will hear the same sound quality as heard with a CX.
  
 I recall hearing that some people have tried connecting power-hungry headphones like the HiFiMan HE-6 to the speaker terminals of the PX, but I don't recall any impressions, good or bad.
  
 The CX amp section has plenty of power for most headphones and sounds great with both the Audeze LCD-2 and LCD-3.  
  
 For the LCD-2, I still prefer the DACmini CX over the Burson Soloist (headphone amp), the Emotiva a-100 Mini-X (speaker amp), and the TBI Milena MG3 (speaker amp) with resistor network.  
  
 In my opinion, the DACmini CX is one of yesterday's heroes that still deserves a lot of attention. 
  
 If you want an all-in-one solution for driving speakers, too, get the DACmini PX.


----------



## Armaegis

I have the PX and have powered my HE-6 directly off the speaker taps. I've got some impressions written up here: link


----------



## jamesng45678

Do not insert headphones directly into speaker output, it will damage both the amp and the headphones.


----------



## Armaegis

My headphones are wired with 4-pin XLR. There is no common wire anywhere. Connecting directly to the speaker outputs is fine.


----------



## jamesng45678

Sorry I am new here, can you explain to me how many watts are going into your HE-6 through the speaker output. I have a beyerdynamic t90, is it alright if i connect this headphone to the speaker output?


----------



## Armaegis

The PX is spec'd for 50W. Assuming that's at 4ohm, then the 50ohm load of the HE-6 should see roughly 4W at max.
  
 You should be able to connect your T90 to the speaker taps as long as it is wired for "balanced" and you have the proper adapter.


----------



## jamesng45678

How do you connect the speaker output to the 4 pin XLR.


----------



## Armaegis

You just need to make an adapter...
 pin1 = L+
 pin2 = L-
 pin3 = R+
 pin4 = R-
  
 Considering that you have a T90 though, you're better off using the headphone output on the front which is a separate class-A output.


----------



## jamesng45678

Just discover the dacmini is actually 3 Watt per channel when it is at 16ohms when compared to the more expensive 4 Watt per channel at 16 ohms Burson Conductor. Not much difference here.


----------



## Armaegis

I'm not sure where you're pulling those numbers from.


----------



## jamesng45678

From a discussion at Audeze between the burson conductor and centrance dacmini, they are doing some maths at their discussion. However, someone thought that the centrance Dacmini only has 0.75W at 32 ohm which is wrong. It should be 1.5W. The reason Burson has a 4 Watt output is because it is at 16ohms.


----------



## Armaegis

And these massive power figures only really matter for something like the HE-6. You'll go deaf with anything else at that kind of output.


----------



## jamesng45678

Thank you for your comments. I have really learn a lot from you today.


----------



## jamesng45678

Would any recommend the DACmini or the Woo Audio Wa2 for my beyerdynamic T90. I do not know what I should choose. Thanks


----------



## barid

jamesng45678 said:


> Would any recommend the DACmini or the Woo Audio Wa2 for my beyerdynamic T90. I do not know what I should choose. Thanks


 
  
 I do not have experience with the T90, but the T1 on the WA2 is very nice.  I'm not sure how close those 2 beyer models are, but I would take the T1 with the WA2 over the DACmini. 
  
 Although I think all advice should be taken with a grain of salt here; solid state vs tube preferences etc.  From my experience, expectations and sound signature preferences come into play a lot more than just "this one is better than that one".


----------



## jamesng45678

Could you explain in more detail the differences between the sound signature of the Wa2 and the Dacmini.


----------



## barid

jamesng45678 said:


> Could you explain in more detail the differences between the sound signature of the Wa2 and the Dacmini.


 
  
 The DACmini is a typical solid state sound.  Compared to something like a Burson Soloist (I had previously) its a bit bright, forward, and slightly harsh up top, bass is solid and tight.
  
 The WA2 has a really lush midrange and kind of softens up the treble in comparison to the DACmini.  The T1 may not seem as sharp, quick, or thin due to to this.  I believe this is why people find the T1 / WA2 pairing synergistic.


----------



## zilch0md

barid said:


> The DACmini is a typical solid state sound.  Compared to something like a Burson Soloist (I had previously) its a bit bright, forward, and slightly harsh up top, bass is solid and tight.
> 
> The WA2 has a really lush midrange and kind of softens up the treble in comparison to the DACmini.  The T1 may not seem as sharp, quick, or thin due to to this.  I believe this is why people find the T1 / WA2 pairing synergistic.


 
  
 I find your description of the DACmini CX to be spot on, Barid.  And from what I've read of the WA2, that's well said, too!
  
 I didn't like the DACmini CX with the T1, but have never heard the T90.
  
 Mike


----------



## jamesng45678

I am still hesitating to get the dacmini. Not sure if it is good. How does it compare to the Burson Conductor or the Woo Audio Wa7?


----------



## zilch0md

The WA7 is much more like the WA2 than the DACmini CX.  Read Barid's posts on the previous page, then order the WA7.  If you don't like it, sell it and try the DACmini CX.  If you don't like it, sell it and try...


----------



## jamesng45678

How about Burson Conductor with the Dacmini. Is there any differences between both of them?


----------



## zilch0md

The Burson Conductor has the same amp as the Burson Soloist.  I preferred the Burson Soloist > Beyerdynamic T1 over the DACmini CX > Beyerdynamic T1.  (If that tells you anything useful.)
  
 Again, see Barid's post for a brief comparison of DACmini CX to Burson Soloist:  http://www.head-fi.org/t/523850/centrance-dacmini-dac-amplifier-official-thread/1050#post_10306181


----------



## jamesng45678

Hello everyone i am new here.I owned a pair of beyerdynamic T90 headphones and is wondering if I should upgrade to a Burson Conductor. Would there be a significant difference between the dacmini and the conductor? I am open to all replies as the conductor is double the price of the dacmini.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

jamesng45678 said:


> Hello everyone i am new here.I owned a pair of beyerdynamic T90 headphones and is wondering if I should upgrade to a Burson Conductor. Would there be a significant difference between the dacmini and the conductor? I am open to all replies as the conductor is double the price of the dacmini.


 
  
 Personally, I would change the headphone and keep the DACmini.  You'd be very surprised by the DACmini with the LCD-X, LCD-2 rev 2, or even the HE-500.  I was blown away by the LCD-X and DACmini at RMAF, and equally amazed at them with my HiFi-M8.
  
 The HE-500 with DACmini sound almost exactly like a Stax Lambda Nova Signature on a KGSS amp, which is better than any Stax Lambda headphone currently sold.  The LCD-2 and LCD-X add to that with improved bass impact and imaging, as well as being a little more efficient.  Micro-detail and speed is outstanding with all of these orthodynamics.
  
 The Beyer T1 was decent with DACmini, and better than HD800 with the DACmini (HD800 are too picky).  Sure, the T90 might pair better with another amp, but they will hold you back. Sell the T90 and buy an LCD-X. Total out of pocket will be similar.


----------



## jamesng45678

The T90 and T1 sound signature are quite similar, this shows that I should get the dacmini. However, what is the key difference between the dacmini and the Burson Conductor.


----------



## Audiowood

headphoneaddict said:


> Personally, I would change the headphone and keep the DACmini.  You'd be very surprised by the DACmini with the LCD-X, LCD-2 rev 2, or even the HE-500.  I was blown away by the LCD-X and DACmini at RMAF, and equally amazed at them with my HiFi-M8.
> 
> The HE-500 with DACmini sound almost exactly like a Stax Lambda Nova Signature on a KGSS amp, which is better than any Stax Lambda headphone currently sold.  The LCD-2 and LCD-X add to that with improved bass impact and imaging, as well as being a little more efficient.  Micro-detail and speed is outstanding with all of these orthodynamics.
> 
> The Beyer T1 was decent with DACmini, and better than HD800 with the DACmini (HD800 are too picky).  Sure, the T90 might pair better with another amp, but they will hold you back. Sell the T90 and buy an LCD-X. Total out of pocket will be similar.




I am thinking of getting the dacmini, does it pair well with iem like shure 846?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

audiowood said:


> I am thinking of getting the dacmini, does it pair well with iem like shure 846?


 
  
 I don't own the Shure to try out, but I can honestly say that it sounds good with EVERY decent IEM in my gear list in my profile (except the < $100 bright earphones that can't be helped without EQ).


----------



## jamesng45678

How does the dacmini fair against the Burson Conductor? Is the Burson Conductor better? Sorry I am new here and is now making a tough decision.


----------



## zilch0md

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...


----------



## Bostonears

audiowood said:


> I am thinking of getting the dacmini, does it pair well with iem like shure 846?


 
 I haven't tried the Shure 846 with my DacMini, but with other Shures I've tried, the sound is great but the sensitivity of the IEMs is so high that there's very little usable range on the DacMini's volume control.


----------



## Audiowood

headphoneaddict said:


> I don't own the Shure to try out, but I can honestly say that it sounds good with EVERY decent IEM in my gear list in my profile (except the < $100 bright earphones that can't be helped without EQ).


thanks for the reply, always wanted a dac mini when it launched but was sidetracked to other stuff. I am glad there is still praises after these years.. i need to get one of these before it discontinued.


----------



## Audiowood

bostonears said:


> I haven't tried the Shure 846 with my DacMini, but with other Shures I've tried, the sound is great but the sensitivity of the IEMs is so high that there's very little usable range on the DacMini's volume control.


Ok noted. In this case, I might request for a mod..


----------



## Audiowood

zilch0md said:


> Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...


lol.

.Jamesng look at a few pages back, there are already links to your questions..


----------



## Bostonears

audiowood said:


> Ok noted. In this case, I might request for a mod..


 
 I just noticed that CEntrance now has a low gain IEM mod available (for $99 extra). I don't think that existed when I bought my unit, although the high gain mod was. (My unit has the standard gain, which works great for my 300 ohm Sennheisers.)


----------



## zilch0md

You might also want to consider the 1-Ohm output impedance mod if your IEM or headphone has an impedance of 80-Ohms or less.  
  
 Mike


----------



## Audiowood

Yeap, I am going for the 1 ohm mod as well..


----------



## thegrobe

bostonears said:


> I haven't tried the Shure 846 with my DacMini, but with other Shures I've tried, the sound is great but the sensitivity of the IEMs is so high that there's very little usable range on the DacMini's volume control.







audiowood said:


> Yeap, I am going for the 1 ohm mod as well..




When I had my Dacmini, it was a 1 ohm mod as well. And it performed very well with my CIEM's. With one drawback... very little usable range on the volume knob, as Bostonears mentioned. 

What I did was apply around 6db or so (if I recall correctly) digital attenuation in jriver using internal volume. There was no perceptible decrease in SQ with a bit of digital attenuation, and allowed a much better range on the volume control. (Although others may disagree... Some adamantly state that digital signal must be kept at 100%). II your player has good volume control, it's not an issue to run the volume down a bit.

Using full size headphones though, I'd run volume at 100%. And liked having the gain right where it was (standard).I guess you need to weigh what your usage would primarily be, headphones or iem's as far as ordering with the low gain mod. 

All that said, I really prefer the hifi M8 for CIEM's, due to selectable gain and tone shaping. I like the flexibility. Just my opinion though.


----------



## jamesng45678

Should I get the high gain mod for my Beyerdynamic T90 headphones. Is it worth the money?


----------



## Armaegis

If you're considering doing the high gain mod, then I'd recommend looking at the PX instead and get the headphone recabled so you can use an adapter to power off the speaker taps. You'll ultimately have more versatility that way.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

armaegis said:


> If you're considering doing the high gain mod, then I'd recommend looking at the PX instead and get the headphone recabled so you can use an adapter to power off the speaker taps. You'll ultimately have more versatility that way.


 
  
 Excellent Idea.  Or, they can feed the DACmini into a small speaker amp like my Emotiva BDP-1 which drives Stax transformers and HE-6 with 3x the power of the PX at 1/2 the total price.


----------



## jamesng45678

Is there a difference in sound between the class A headphone amp and class D speaker amp.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

jamesng45678 said:


> Is there a difference in sound between the class A headphone amp and class D speaker amp.


 
  
 Yes, Maybe, No, Sometimes.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

It depends on what you are driving, and it's resistance and capacitance, and other stuff beyond my understanding...


----------



## Armaegis

headphoneaddict said:


> Excellent Idea.  Or, they can feed the DACmini into a small speaker amp like my Emotiva BDP-1 which drives Stax transformers and HE-6 with 3x the power of the PX at 1/2 the total price.


 
  
 Fair point, but then you're also into two boxes instead of one.
  
 The high gain mod is an extra $100 which really doesn't make that much of a difference (maybe 2dB?), and since there's only a $200 difference between the CX and PX, I figure the PX would be a better value in that regard.
  
 I've driven stax transformers off a 20-30W amps before with no problem, so the PX should handle that just fine.
  


jamesng45678 said:


> Is there a difference in sound between the class A headphone amp and class D speaker amp.


 
  
 Yes there is. I've already written about that a couple times, and there's even more impressions if you follow the links in my profile.


----------



## jamesng45678

I am just afraid that the sound from the speaker output may not be as refined as the sound from the class A headphone output.


----------



## zilch0md

"I have never known any distress that an hour's reading did not relieve."    - Charles de Montesquieu


----------



## Audiowood

Thanks folks, PX seems like a good all in one.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

armaegis said:


> Fair point, but then you're also into two boxes instead of one.
> 
> The high gain mod is an extra $100 which really doesn't make that much of a difference (maybe 2dB?), and since there's only a $200 difference between the CX and PX, I figure the PX would be a better value in that regard.
> 
> I've driven stax transformers off a 20-30W amps before with no problem, so the PX should handle that just fine.


 
  
 $200 difference?  I thought it was $699 for CX and $1499 for PX.  I'll have to go look it up again I suppose. For a $200 diff the choice is obvious.


----------



## barid

headphoneaddict said:


> $200 difference?  I thought it was $699 for CX and $1499 for PX.  I'll have to go look it up again I suppose. For a $200 diff the choice is obvious.




And if u see them on the FS forums they usually go for around $700. Not bad for an all-in-one with a tiny footprint.


----------



## jamesng45678

I believe the dacmini is just almost perfect in everyway.


----------



## jamesng45678

Dacmini pairs very well with my T90 headphones.


----------



## Armaegis

Glad to hear it. Wow, you must have had some insanely fast shipping. You were only asking about this two days ago...


----------



## jamesng45678

Hear it from a shop but not yet delivered to my house yet


----------



## Armaegis

Which version (and/or mods) are you getting?


----------



## jamesng45678

Getting the dacmini px with 1 ohm mod and high gain mod.


----------



## zilch0md

Congratulations!


----------



## jamesng45678

Thanks


----------



## saer

I am thinking about upgrading, if anyone is looking to purchase this unit for a considerable discount please contact me. Thought I'd give you guys a heads up before I post it in the marketplace


----------



## zilch0md

Dude!  What size hat do you wear?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

His avatar is an optical illusion, first he's looking directly at us with half his face covered, and then he's looking to the side.  He doesn't have a squished head in the avatar.


----------



## jamesng45678

How does the lehmann audio black cube linear usb fair against the dacmini?


----------



## WilCox

I just sold my BCL a couple of weeks ago, but my impression was that the BCL was more "linear" in frequency response with a flat and extended treble, while the DACmini is a bit more "polite" in the treble.  Both are great at driving low impedance planars such as the Audeze as well as the high impedance dynamics such as the Sennheisers.  Both are fine, classic amps.


----------



## jamesng45678

Lehmann audio bcl usb has a much more refined sound as compared to the dacmini. Hope this information helps


----------



## Armaegis

And the Linear is nearly twice the price, with fewer connectivity options.


----------



## Armaegis

I'm still waiting on that 2in/4out interface Michael


----------



## joespride

Just agreed to purchase a dacmini cx, anxious to hear it, my previous dac experience has been audio gd 11.32, schiit Bifrost uber, and california audio labs alpha 16 bit...............I have been searching the net for weeks now daily every hour or so and finally settled on the centrance  for a couple reasons
  
 I liked the features of the centrance, stereophile has considered the centrance class A product for 3 years running, I keep hearing tubes used in the description of sound
  
  
 I own a dedicated Tube headphone amp, and truly plan t use the centrance as a dediicated dac but I love the idea that I can use a battery to power this on the go if I need to and have an amp and dac in 1 unit
  
 I would really like to hear anyones opinion of comparisons between the uber bifrost and the dac mini cx


----------



## mgoodman

If you buy from CEntrance, we have a 30 day policy, so you are safe. But I don't think you will return the DACmini. People tend to keep it


----------



## joespride

would love to buy new but frankly dont have the $$$$


----------



## Armaegis

While I haven't compared the Dacmini to the Bifrost(v1) directly, going from memory I liked the tonality of the Dacmini more. Granted, I've always found something slightly off in the tone of Schiit gear (not wrong, but doesn't quite jive with me), and again this is from memory so take with a heaping pile of salt.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Yeah, wont sell mine!  
  
 I haven't touched my balanced Stello DA-100 and maxed WA6 in almost a year, so I decided I should sell them soon.  They are great but waiting for the WA6 to warm up when I only have 20 minutes to listen is a pain, and while fantastic with the HD600, HD800, and D7000 or HF-2, I absolutely love the DACmini with my LCD-2 and HE-560.
  
 All I use lately in my bedroom rig is my DACmini and HiFI-M8, and I'll never give those up.  In my main rig in the family room I use my PS Audio Perfectwave DAC II with an Eddie Current ZDT, EF6, and KGBH stat amps.  In my basement rig I have the Nuforce DAC-100 and HAP-100.  That's really all I need, and makes me wonder why I need dozens of DACs and amps all around the house anymore.


----------



## Armaegis

headphoneaddict said:


> That's really all I need, and makes me wonder why I need dozens of DACs and amps all around the house anymore.


 
  
 Because we have this compulsion... this sickness that makes us acquire more and more gear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I've been terribly contemplating an M8 to serve as dac for my Nuforce HA-200 monos. Any chance you've heard that combo?


----------



## joespride

armaegis said:


> While I haven't compared the Dacmini to the Bifrost(v1) directly, going from memory I liked the tonality of the Dacmini more. Granted, I've always found something slightly off in the tone of Schiit gear (not wrong, but doesn't quite jive with me), and again this is from memory so take with a heaping pile of salt.


 
 Thanks for the comparisons, I was kind of curious because they both use an AKM chip (different versions of the chips) and so was wondering if the would be somewhat close in signature
  
 will find out soon I guess


----------



## fallingreason

Just picked up a DACmini CX with the VarOut mod.  Loving it so far, but I've notice there is a slight amount of play in the volume knob.  Is this normal?


----------



## Armaegis

I don't have that on mine.


----------



## zilch0md

I hate to chime in on bad news, but my volume know has no "play" in it, either.  
  
 The good news is that CEntrance surely has among the best customer service out there.


----------



## fallingreason

Thanks for the feedback guys, I'll contact centrance about this.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Problem solved, opened the case and tightened the two hex screws securing the volume knob to the pot's spindle. Solid as a rock now and tracking has a nice resisted feel.


----------



## joespride

My mini showed up today, I am about 1 hour in as a stand alone unit.................i am impressed with it so far, not blown away mind you, it sounds great as a stand alone. The amp signature is surprising I always expect a bit of high etch / grain with SS. so far I dont feel that here
  
 The dac is pretty comparable with the Bifrost uber, as they both use AKM I was actually hoping this would be the case........................This is *TONS AHEAD OF AUDIO GD 11.32*, the amp is much better and the software is a no brainer, i also found the saber a tad bright / thin
  
 this evening I will pare it with the Kenzie tube amp and see if it improves, frankly right now I am feeling I could live with the dac mini and he500 just fine


----------



## joespride

Ok I have an issue
  
 I want to hook this up so I can use it as a stand alone or as a dac only,  this way I can go back and forth between amps, (tube and built in) what I am doing is hook up rca from the output to my external amp (external amp is off), plug headphones into the mini I get a nasty hum, pull the rca the hum goes away.
  
 Plug phones into external amp power it on and I get no hum from the phones
  
 I dont want and dont expect to have to plug in and remove RCA cables everytime I want to use externals
  
  
 any ideas ???????


----------



## joespride

further details, I just found the culprit to my hum
  
 I had a Schiit sys in between using as a source switch, The mini out went to the in on the sys, the 2 outputs on the sys went to my external headphone amp, and my speaker amp, turns out if I remove the speaker amp the mini is silent
  
 so I have a ground issue on the speaker amp which is a cheapo and only uses a 2 prong power cord
  
  
 I am just happy I dont have an issue with the MINI 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  
 I rarely use the speakers anyway so it no loss, it just made things easy


----------



## joespride

Connected to the Kenzie Tube Headphone amp and all I can say is WOW, currently doing Dave Brubeck Take Five 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 something that is really sticking out is the quiet, Everything just seems to appear from nothing...................My bifrost etc were all quiet but this thing is almost eerily quiet
  
  
  
  I feel like the onboard amp is very good and I could live with it, But after the Kenzie warms up there is no doubt it is better


----------



## joespride

now I am finding where this beats out Bifrost Uber
  
 cleaner edges to the individual instruments, better separation yet remains very analog and musical, while Bifrost uber was very good IMHO and was very musical it was not able to reveal the separation like the mini, 
  
 I am having a problem putting the sound to words........................the synergy I have here is almost sinful, Absolutely the best I have heard the HE500's sing
  
  
 Death Cab for Cutie,  Plans is sublime  I have a long night ahead


----------



## zilch0md

It's always nice to see someone having a good time, appreciating their gear!
  
 Enjoy!


----------



## mgoodman

joespride said:


> Ok I have an issue
> 
> I want to hook this up so I can use it as a stand alone or as a dac only,  this way I can go back and forth between amps, (tube and built in) what I am doing is hook up rca from the output to my external amp (external amp is off), plug headphones into the mini I get a nasty hum, pull the rca the hum goes away.
> 
> ...



Sounds like a grounding problem, possibly with the wiring. DACmini's audio ground (RCA connector ground) is isolated from the mains, so it is insensitive to bad ground wiring, but I don't know about the other amp. Check to see that ground is correctly connected in the other amp and not reversed in the power cable - that would be my first guess.


----------



## joespride

Problem was resolved, I was using the centrance as a dac only through a passive pre to 2 different amps 1. The Kenzie Headphone amp, and 2. a cheap digital receiver which I use to power bookshelves,  turned out the cheap digital was causing the hum
  
 I now have it set up to use with the kenzie or the built in amp with no issues at all
  
 although the kenzie amp sounds better it does take the normal tube warm up in order to do so, I like just turning on the centrance and have good sound, as a bonus I will save some tube life


----------



## ptrok

Wondering if anyone can lend me their expertise in electronics to help me with hooking up my Dacmini. I recently moved my room around and went to hook up the dacmini up again and it kept resulting in the tripping of the breaker in my home. I had no problems before this and I plugged in all the other essentials before plugging in the power like it is suggested in their website. Is there anything I need to know when setting this up that I might have messed up. Thanks for your help in advance.


----------



## Bostonears

ptrok said:


> Wondering if anyone can lend me their expertise in electronics to help me with hooking up my Dacmini. I recently moved my room around and went to hook up the dacmini up again and it kept resulting in the tripping of the breaker in my home. I had no problems before this and I plugged in all the other essentials before plugging in the power like it is suggested in their website. Is there anything I need to know when setting this up that I might have messed up. Thanks for your help in advance.



If you plug the AC adapter into the power line before it's plugged into the CEntrance, does the breaker trip, or does it only trip when power gets into the CEntrance?


----------



## DevEng

ptrok,
  
 Because the breaker is tripping, let's start with basics.  Please use caution when investigating power cables.
  
 By 'breaker', are you referring to the switch that controls power to an entire room or rooms of your house, or are you referring to the outlet that is something like a Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI) that has a reset button?  I suspect the former, but please confirm.
  
 Is your DACmini CX or PX?
  
 When you "moved my room around", did you change DACmini's outlet location?  If yes, does DACmini work at the previous location?
  
  
 1) do what Bostonears said, except I'd like to request that you do so without any peripheral connected to DACmini - no RCA, USB, etc.  The fewer the variables, the better.
  
 If the AC adapter by itself causes the breaker to trip, try the AC adapter by itself on another outlet.
  
 2a) If the breaker does not trip when DACmini's power supply is connected to power, then connect one item to DACmini (USB, etc.), and then reconnect power.
 2b) repeat, connecting each peripheral one at a time.
  
 3) if circuit breaker trips only when a peripheral is connected to DACmini, then you need to carefully inspect the peripheral connected to DACmini.
  
 Looking forward to your findings.


----------



## ptrok

Thanks for your input guys. I tried connecting each component one at a time and discovered that it was the iMac that was causing the breaker to trip. Since looking into it, it seems the iMac is a little charged itself. If I touch it with my bare skin there is a slight shock that I get and I am not sure why? Does anyone have any idea why this may occur. Kind of sucks to be without music, I think I learned a lesson, never rearrange my room. LoL. Thanks for your quick responses. By the way, it is a CX model.


----------



## ptrok

A sad day. I figured since the iMac was shocking me so I would try another power cord and it fixed the problem of getting shocked. So I went to plug in the Dacmini, now the Dacmini won't turn on anymore. Think it might have got fried by the experiments. Are there any other possibilities on why this may have occurred? To DevEng, is there any way for me to repair this and how much would it cost to repair this? Thanks everyone for your help.


----------



## DevEng

> I figured since the iMac was shocking me so I would try another power cord and it fixed the problem of getting shocked


 
  
 I recommend the following next step:
  
 Immediately have a qualified electrician look at the wiring and power cables of your room - to get a shock from an iMac sounds a loud alarm in my mind.  Something is not right with your house wiring or cables, and it should be fixed as soon as possible before you get hurt.  I cannot emphasize that enough.  I cannot determine if swapping power cords fixed the root problem, but I have enough experience to know we should _not assume the root problem is resolved_.
  
 I'm reluctant to troubleshoot any further, until you have a qualified electrician evaluate the situation.  I will be very glad to help and answer your questions about DACmini after hearing a report from a qualified electrician.  Yes, the thought of a potentially-dead DACmini really sucks, but I think it is secondary at this moment.
  
 Re-reading this, I hope my tone doesn't come across as harsh, but I do think this is urgent and vital.  Ok?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Looking forward to hearing more.
  
 Best Regards,
 DevEng


----------



## ptrok

Thanks for the concern and you did not come off as harsh, just logical. Had a guy come in yesterday to look at it, from what I understood, it was due to the surge protector socket that was faulty. I switched that out and everything seems ok. Since he was speaking Korean and my skills are limited, this I guess is true. I asked him many times if it was safe and he reassured me all was good.
  
 Out of curiosity, when plugging in the dac mini, is it normal to see a charge from the power cable to the unit? This was always something I wanted to ask about but kept putting it off since everything was working fine. I think I need to send the unit back to you guys to get it looked at and repaired and am wondering if it might be a good idea to send the power brick too because of this charge. I know it will cost to get this repaired, but do you have any idea what the most it will cost before I send it in so I can assess the feasibility of getting this repaired. Thank you in advance.


----------



## DevEng

Big, big sigh of relief!  I'm very glad you found the source of the problem. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 The charge you see is normal.
  
 I'll PM you to discuss troubleshooting and repair.
  
 For everyone else reading this, if you ever experience a *shock* while touching electronic devices, please contact a qualified electrician.  The electrician's bill will be far cheaper than the alternative.  Note: I am not referring to electrostatic discharge, i.e., low humidity + carpet.


----------



## Bostonears

One of these AC receptacle testers is a handy to have around. Of course it is not a substitute for a qualified electrician, but it can help diagnose some common problems with AC outlet wiring.


----------



## sandmanct

Awaiting a Centrance Dacmini PX.  Can't wait!


----------



## zilch0md

Joy!


----------



## jamesng45678

I am buying a new DAC for my Lehmann audio BCL so how does the dacmini compared against Grace m903?


----------



## NazgulKing

Does anyone know of a 2.1 powered speaker setup that goes well with the Dacmini CX?


----------



## Armaegis

In this case, it doesn't really matter much that you're pairing with the CX. Just grab anything that suits your space. How big is your room? How much desk space do you have? Near a wall? These parameters determine what you should be looking for moreso than the specific pairing with the dac.
  
 edit: oh and budget?


----------



## NazgulKing

armaegis said:


> In this case, it doesn't really matter much that you're pairing with the CX. Just grab anything that suits your space. How big is your room? How much desk space do you have? Near a wall? These parameters determine what you should be looking for moreso than the specific pairing with the dac.
> 
> edit: oh and budget?


 
 I'm looking to spend 800USD at most I think. I have enough desk space to mount the two. As for room size... probably 150 sq ft? My desk is right next to the window on one side of the room.


----------



## Armaegis

Do you need the sub? You're sort of on the cusp of room size where you could do either bigger speakers or do a 2.1 setup. If it's an enclosed space (like a bedroom), a large sub might run away and get boomy.
  
 Pro audio active monitors are pretty good in that price range. These seem to be rated quite highly...
 http://emotiva.com/products/emotiva-pro/powered-monitors-0


----------



## NazgulKing

armaegis said:


> Do you need the sub? You're sort of on the cusp of room size where you could do either bigger speakers or do a 2.1 setup. If it's an enclosed space (like a bedroom), a large sub might run away and get boomy.
> 
> Pro audio active monitors are pretty good in that price range. These seem to be rated quite highly...
> http://emotiva.com/products/emotiva-pro/powered-monitors-0


 
 Wouldn't mind one if it works out well.
  
 Though for the Pro Audio options those you suggested, do you use the left/right outputs or do you use the coaxial?


----------



## NazgulKing

armaegis said:


> Do you need the sub? You're sort of on the cusp of room size where you could do either bigger speakers or do a 2.1 setup. If it's an enclosed space (like a bedroom), a large sub might run away and get boomy.
> 
> Pro audio active monitors are pretty good in that price range. These seem to be rated quite highly...


 
 I wouldn't mind a sub if it works. For those monitors you suggest, do I use the left/right outputs or the coaxial from the Dacmini CX?


----------



## Armaegis

There is no coax output on the CX, only an input.
  
 Subs are tricky because you have to integrate them with the speakers and they get a lot more room interference. I'd only recommend it if you want them for movies/gaming etc. For more accurate music reproduction in a small room, I'd lean towards larger size monitors.
  
 I'd also recommend checking out your local guitar center and seeing what they have in their desktop active monitors. Nothing beats hearing the speakers for yourself.


----------



## fallingreason

My DACmini breathed new life into my sub =).


----------



## fallingreason

On a separate note, has anyone here experienced their input selector switch behaving weirdly?   The other day my DACmini shut off on its own, and the input selector switch would only function in one direction.  It then shut off on its own a couple of times. After unplugging everything and reconnecting it worked fine. This is the only hiccup its ever had and has been fine since.  
  
 Any thoughts?


----------



## Armaegis

I've had that issue only when connected via usb and when the computer cycles through a sleep mode or tries to go into a power saving mode of some sort. It's a really really annoying Windows things that mucks with a lot of usb dacs.


----------



## Bostonears

I agree with Armaegis that the problem is likely due to USB quirkiness with a connected PC. Check the manual for your motherboard to see if there are BIOS settings that impact USB behavior.


----------



## zilch0md

I found a golden nugget in this thread from almost two years ago:



headphoneaddict said:


> I also think the HD800 and DACmini sounds pretty good.  However, over time I find the pairing to become a little fatiguing, for no clear reason.  But, If I feed a warmer sounding DAC into the DACmini, such as my original DACport, then the HD800 pairing is substantially better and I really really enjoy the amp section driving the HD800.




I've been listening to this chain for a few hours yesterday and today:

*Foobar > DACport LX > DACmini CX with 1-Ohm output impedance mod > un-modded HD800 (stock cable)
*
Both my DACport LX and DACmini are a little more neutral than Larry's versions, but driving my DACmini with the DACport LX has warmed the HD800, just the same.

I really like this chain a lot - it's a better solution for the HD800 than Foobar > OPPO HA-1 > un-modded HD800. It's much less fatiguing in the treble, yet still very detailed, with more bass energy, too. The HD800 doesn't really need a lot of power.

Thanks for this idea, Larry!

Mike


----------



## muad

Just a heads up to anyone interested. Everyone's favourite groupbuy website has the Centrance dacmini cx on sale for 50% off or $399.
  
 Enjoy


----------



## fallingreason

Good deal if the warranty is included.


----------



## turambar333

1st post!  Just wanted to chime in here as the deal mentioned is amazing and we need more people on board.  Looks like 1-ohm mod will be added with just 6 subscribers.
  
 Trying to get the word out


----------



## fallingreason

Hmm, I want to order another DACmini so I can also have a unit with 1 Ohm... but I don't want to pay more than 399 =(


----------



## muad

I think the 1ohm mod is included for free now. They're trying to generate interest.
  
 I just bought a used 1ohm with variable output for 399, otherwise I would have been all over this deal! It is impossible to find a well regarded and properly tested dac/amp/preamp under 500$. Everything else comes up short, either in performance, functionality or durability/reputability. Really looking forward to hearing this unit, should be here next week. Still going to hang onto my o2/odac as well. Never know when it will come in handy!


----------



## turambar333

Yup, $399 with 1-ohm mod if 6 people join/commit, which it seems to have reached now.  There is also the variable out mod for an extra $99 if interested.


----------



## utdeep

I've committed to join the drop but I'm not certain at all about the variable out mod.  What would be the application for this?  I've never had a DAC that had a volume control on the line out.
  
 I'm looking forward to trying this with my LCD-X.  I was waiting for the WA7 to pop up again but I felt like 50% off was a good deal for the DACmini especially because I could link it up with my Playstation 4 via optical and my AudioEngine A5+ speakers with the RCA output.  
  
 The WA7 made my LCD-3 sing.  While I was not impressed with the CEntrance Hifi-M8, I'm very hopeful for this product.


----------



## muad

Variable out is if you want to use it as dac with a preamp, to adjust the volume of powered speakers or a power amp.


----------



## utdeep

muad,
  
 Thanks for the info!  I guess I would never be in the audience for this mod.


----------



## fallingreason

Might be a silly question, but does the 1 Ohm mod apply to both the headphone out and line-level out?


----------



## zilch0md

Only to the headphone out - it's the amp's output impedance.


----------



## fallingreason

zilch0md said:


> Only to the headphone out - it's the amp's output impedance.


 

 That's what I thought. Thanks =)


----------



## daerron

Worthwhile pairing this with the Hifiman HE-500/560? Was hoping the power output was 1500mW per channel but seems to be the total headphone output?


----------



## fallingreason

daerron said:


> Worthwhile pairing this with the Hifiman HE-500/560? Was hoping the power output was 1500mW per channel but seems to be the total headphone output?


 

 Yes, 1.5W total.  This is plenty for almost all headphones.  You can pair it with those models, but you may want to consider the "Gain of 10" mod which bumps the gain from 8 to 10.


----------



## fallingreason

Been using my secondary DAC/amp (NuForce uDAC2)  while my DACmini is at CEntrance being repaired...  Really hope I get it back this week... don't know what you have until its gone.  =(


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

fallingreason said:


> Been using my secondary DAC/amp (NuForce uDAC2)  while my DACmini is at CEntrance being repaired...  Really hope I get it back this week... don't know what you have until its gone.  =(


 

 Yeah, the uDAC2 is not bad and my uDAC2 SE is on about the level of my Audioengine D1, but the DACport was a step up from that, and the DACmini is even further above the DACport.  I kept finding the DACmini to sound about as good as my $1200 maxed Woo WA6 with upgraded tubes being fed by my $995 Stello DA-100 signature DAC, but at a considerably lower price.
  
 So, when you get used to something so good, then the lesser gear doesn't sound as good as when you first got it. Same thing with my moving down from a 320hp Infiniti to a 250hp Subaru...


----------



## daerron

utdeep said:


> I've committed to join the drop but I'm not certain at all about the variable out mod.  What would be the application for this?  I've never had a DAC that had a volume control on the line out.


 


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






> I'm looking forward to trying this with my LCD-X.  I was waiting for the WA7 to pop up on massdrop again but I felt like 50% off was a good deal for the DACmini especially because I could link it up with my Playstation 4 via optical and my AudioEngine A5+ speakers with the RCA output.
> 
> The WA7 made my LCD-3 sing.  While I was not impressed with the CEntrance Hifi-M8, I'm very hopeful for this product.


 
  


  
 Controlling active speakers mainly. The variable output mod is quite expensive. If you don't mind another device you can always add a Schiit Sys which is a passive volume attenuator for $49 which is cheaper than the mod.


----------



## Bostonears

utdeep said:


> I've committed to join the drop but I'm not certain at all about the variable out mod.  What would be the application for this?  I've never had a DAC that had a volume control on the line out.


 
 I use the variable output on mine to drive a tube power amp (for speakers).
  
 I paid a lot more than $399 for my DACmini, and as much as I love it, $99 seems like way too high a price to charge for the variable output mod. IMO, CEntrance should just make fixed vs. variable output user selectable, for example by changing a jumper on a board. Benchmark has that on some of its headphone amps/DACs. Not only would that save buyers money, more importantly it would give them flexibility to change the configuration if their system needs change.


----------



## daerron

bostonears said:


> I use the variable output on mine to drive a tube power amp (for speakers).
> 
> I paid a lot more than $399 for my DACmini, and as much as I love it, $99 seems like way too high a price to charge for the variable output mod. IMO, CEntrance should just make fixed vs. variable output user selectable, for example by changing a jumper on a board. Benchmark has that on some of its headphone amps/DACs. Not only would that save buyers money, more importantly it would give them flexibility to change the configuration if their system needs change.


 

 What bugged me a bit from CEntrance description it appears that the variable output follows the headphone gain level, so the maximum output at the RCA ports could be around 5Vrms which is quite high. Most power amps I've seen spec between 0.8-2.2Vrms so I don't know whether that has an affect on how much effective play you've got on the volume knob? Maybe its entirely inconsequential.


----------



## Bostonears

daerron said:


> What bugged me a bit from CEntrance description it appears that the variable output follows the headphone gain level, so the maximum output at the RCA ports could be around 5Vrms which is quite high. Most power amps I've seen spec between 0.8-2.2Vrms so I don't know whether that has an affect on how much effective play you've got on the volume knob? Maybe its entirely inconsequential.


 

 The specs for DACmini say the RCA output level is about +6dBV. According to this calculator, that's 1.99 Vrms. With my amp and speakers, the volume knob range seems normal, typically between about 8 and 12 o'clock on the knob.


----------



## daerron

bostonears said:


> The specs for DACmini say the RCA output level is about +6dBV. According to this calculator, that's 1.99 Vrms. With my amp and speakers, the volume knob range seems normal, typically between about 8 and 12 o'clock on the knob.


 

 That's when you choose a fixed output. 2Vrms is pretty much standard.


----------



## Bostonears

daerron said:


> That's when you choose a fixed output. 2Vrms is pretty much standard.


 
 The spec I've seen doesn't distinguish between fixed and variable output. (Is there a spec specifically for the variable output?) Given that analog volume knobs (potentiometers) work by attenuation, how/why would variable output of the device exceed its fixed output level? Do you believe that CEntrance actually boosts the output amplification level for the RCAs when they do the variable output mod?


----------



## daerron

bostonears said:


> The spec I've seen doesn't distinguish between fixed and variable output. (Is there a spec specifically for the variable output?) Given that analog volume knobs (potentiometers) work by attenuation, how/why would variable output of the device exceed its fixed output level? Do you believe that CEntrance actually boosts the output amplification level for the RCAs when they do the variable output mod?


 

 I thought I found it somewhere in this thread, but I can't find the post again. Let me clarify it with them on the group buy, before I spew rubbish specs around again.


----------



## daerron

I see CEntrance confirmed the variable output is from 6dBV and down so 2Vrms and lower on the volume knob.


----------



## utdeep

Looks like we are headed for free variable output.  It may not be something I use, but it can't hurt resale value!


----------



## bobby12

utdeep said:


> Looks like we are headed for free variable output.  It may not be something I use, but it can't hurt resale value!




All those discounted sales probably will  Looks like there's someone selling their cx with both mods for $400 on the forums

Hopefully I won't be disappointed by the dacmini cx


----------



## Armaegis

Keep adding more people and maybe it'll bump up to the PX


----------



## pieman3141

So, I've got a few questions about the mod:
  
 1. How much effect will the 1-ohm mod have on a pair of AKG K712s, or a high-impedance headphone?
 2. Will the variable-out affect anything if I ever use a power amp to power passive speakers? I know the var-out is good for powered speakers.
 3. If I choose the 10-ohm impedance, will a high gain help with powering high-impedance headphones? Will it negatively affect lower impedance headphones?
  
 I do wish that the gain was selectable on this thing.


----------



## Armaegis

1) It doesn't make a world of difference with high impedance cans. Your damping factor will be a bit better, but unless you really know what to look for you probably won't notice. That said, it's nice to have and brings up resale value for later.
  
 2) What do you mean by "affect anything"? If you mean sound quality, no you won't notice. If you're using a strict power amp, then it also lets you skip a preamp in the chain.
  
 3) High impedance headphones will actually see LESS of a difference with the 10 ohm output impedance on the amp. You don't really need a super high gain for most headphones. If you're aiming for that much power, you might as well get the PX and feed your headphones off the speaker taps.


----------



## pieman3141

Thanks! I bit the bullet on the site which shall not be named. The mods were free anyhow.


----------



## Paspasero

What accessories come with the dacmini cx unit? I can't seem to find that information anywhere...


----------



## mgoodman

Power cord, power supply, USB cable, DACmini CX, quick start guide, rubber feet.


----------



## Paspasero

mgoodman said:


> Power cord, power supply, USB cable, DACmini CX, quick start guide, rubber feet.


 
  
 Perfect thank you!


----------



## jamesng45678

How is the dac section performance of the dacmini when compared to other dacs such as Grace m903, Naim dac v1, Chord Hugo?


----------



## zilch0md

I have no experience with the other DACs you've listed, but I can say that, compared to ESS9018 and ESS9023 DACs (stereotyping them with the disclaimer that the chip isn't everything), I've always found the DACmini CX' proprietary DAC to exhibit none of the sheen or glare that sometimes accompanies the SABRE DACs. It's crisp, neutral and detailed, and the USB receiver is amazingly good. 
  
 Mike


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

No sooner do I sell my Stello DA-100 Signature DAC then my son takes over my DACmini to use with his HE-560.  He had a choice of Nuforce HDP or Icon DAC, HiFiMan EF5, or his own Nuforce uDAC-2, Millett Hybrid and Schiit Audio Modi/Magni stack, but noooooo, he's gotta take the DACmini.  He's got a V-MODA Vamp Verza and the DACmini gave him the most noticeable upgrade.
  
 If I hadn't just spent $770 on license plates for a new car I'd be getting another DACmini (PX) right now...  It's a good thing my HiFi-M8 is so good.


----------



## wormsdriver

Man! are those Audiophile license plates!?


----------



## Armaegis

C'mon Larry, you know you want that PX to run headphones off the speaker taps


----------



## llcook51

Where can I get a replacement power cord and power supply?


----------



## zilch0md

info@centrance.com


----------



## llcook51

I lost the AC power supply when i moved recently. Where can I get a compatable one?
 Thanks.


----------



## zilch0md

If you don't want to order a replacement from CEntrance...  
  
 You could try looking for a *regulated, switchmode power supply* rated anywhere between 9 VDC and *19 VDC*  (preferably toward the high end, but no higher than 19 VDC), with a *2.8-Amp* (or higher) current capacity, having a standard 5.5 x 2.5mm coaxial power connector (tip positive).
  
  
 This would probably work, but I can't guarantee anything:
  
 http://www.powerstream.com/ac-1830.htm
  
 Get the power supply and the set of 7 adapters, too.


----------



## llcook51

Thanks so much.


----------



## zilch0md




----------



## Paspasero

So I just got my CX unit from Massdrop with the variable output and 1 ohm mods and I am very disappointed... As soon as I plugged in my headphones and turn the volume dial up there is a loud hum from the unit. Between the 11 and 5 o'clock positions on the dial there is a loud buzzing. It occurs with or without my pc speakers plugged into the line out terminals. I am going to mess around with my equipment to see if I can find a source of the hum. I hope it isn't the modifications.. 
  
 I waited over 5 weeks for this... Really disappointed...


----------



## mgoodman

paspasero said:


> So I just got my CX unit from Massdrop with the variable output and 1 ohm mods and I am very disappointed... As soon as I plugged in my headphones and turn the volume dial up there is a loud hum from the unit. Between the 11 and 5 o'clock positions on the dial there is a loud buzzing. It occurs with or without my pc speakers plugged into the line out terminals. I am going to mess around with my equipment to see if I can find a source of the hum. I hope it isn't the modifications..
> 
> I waited over 5 weeks for this... Really disappointed...


No good. Not typical. Sorry. 

Please contact me by email and we will make it right.

info at CEntrance dot com.


----------



## Paspasero

I know I just posted but something is seriously wrong with my unit/ ac adapter. I tried plugging and replugging the ac adapter and when I accidentally touched the metal casing the adapter started to spark.. There is now a serious burning smell and my unit is now blemished from the sparks..


----------



## Paspasero

mgoodman said:


> No good. Not typical. Sorry.
> 
> Please contact me by email and we will make it right.
> 
> info at CEntrance dot com.


 
  
  
 Thank you. I just sent an email.


----------



## fallingreason

paspasero said:


> So I just got my CX unit from Massdrop with the variable output and 1 ohm mods and I am very disappointed... As soon as I plugged in my headphones and turn the volume dial up there is a loud hum from the unit. Between the 11 and 5 o'clock positions on the dial there is a loud buzzing. It occurs with or without my pc speakers plugged into the line out terminals. I am going to mess around with my equipment to see if I can find a source of the hum. I hope it isn't the modifications..
> 
> I waited over 5 weeks for this... Really disappointed...


 

 This happens with my VarOut CX unit from the mass drop order as well, and I am currently waiting for CEntrance to get back to me. They said they are researching the problem.


----------



## Paspasero

fallingreason said:


> This happens with my VarOut CX unit from the mass drop order as well, and I am currently waiting for CEntrance to get back to me. They said they are researching the problem.


 
 Have you had any luck yet? They are in contact with me as well but have been a little sluggish, hopefully because they are trying to research the problem. 
  
 Does your unit have any buzzing when only the headphones and ac power are plugged in?
  
 My unit does it is faint but definitely audible and only gets worse when I plug in the USB and line out to my speakers to take advantage of the variable out. 
  
 I got mine with the mod with the intention that I could easily switch between speakers and headphones but thanks to the buzzing I just leave the speakers unplugged because it can clearly be heard over the music. 
  
 Another thing I tried was switching to optical over USB which seemed to help lower the buzzing noise.


----------



## fallingreason

paspasero said:


> Have you had any luck yet? They are in contact with me as well but have been a little sluggish, hopefully because they are trying to research the problem.
> 
> Does your unit have any buzzing when only the headphones and ac power are plugged in?
> 
> ...


 

 No luck yet, they have not offered a solution so far.  They take a few days to respond to my emails =(.   
  
 Mine seems to have the same symptoms as yours. There is a slight amp hiss with only USB/AC/headphones plugged in but there is an electric/static hum once RCA's are connected to either Line In or Line Out.  I have another older DACmini and the headphone amp on that unit is dead silent.


----------



## mgoodman

fallingreason said:


> No luck yet, they have not offered a solution so far.  They take a few days to respond to my emails (.
> 
> Mine seems to have the same symptoms as yours. There is a slight amp hiss with only USB/AC/headphones plugged in but there is an electric/static hum once RCA's are connected to either Line In or Line Out.  I have another older DACmini and the headphone amp on that unit is dead silent.


Hang in there guys, we are working to figure this out. This is actually quite strange. We will get back to you shortly.


----------



## sfhoo

My VarOut, 1Ohm CX also hiss between 12 - 5 with Denon AHD-7000. But it stop hiss pass 5. :/


----------



## Paspasero

sfhoo said:


> My VarOut, 1Ohm CX also hiss between 12 - 5 with Denon AHD-7000. But it stop hiss pass 5. :/


 
  
 I have the same exact issue with the same exact unit. Contact CEntrance they will take care of you. They have had awesome support so far.


----------



## fallingreason

Mine had the same issue, shipped it back to CEntrance for the to take  a look today.


----------



## sfhoo

paspasero said:


> I have the same exact issue with the same exact unit. Contact CEntrance they will take care of you. They have had awesome support so far.




Hiss all around with my westone 4R


----------



## Paspasero

Would CEntrance ever consider making a tube amp/dac in the same/similar form factor as the DACmini?


----------



## sfhoo

fallingreason said:


> Mine had the same issue, shipped it back to CEntrance for the to take  a look today.


 
 How long does it take for CEntrance to respond your email? I have not hear from them at all.


----------



## fallingreason

sfhoo said:


> How long does it take for CEntrance to respond your email? I have not hear from them at all.


 

 Sometimes a few days. They just told me they received my unit and will be looking at it soon to determine how to fix the problem.


----------



## Paspasero

Have you heard anything back yet? I emailed them 5 days ago and no response thus far.


----------



## fallingreason

nope, nothing yet.


----------



## russdog

utdeep said:


> Looks like we are headed for _*free variable output*_.  It may not be something I use, but it can't hurt resale value!


 


pieman3141 said:


> Thanks! I bit the bullet on the site which shall not be named. _*The mods were free*_ anyhow.


 
  
 I just now went there to sign up... while the 1-ohm option is free, the var-out is $100.
  
 Am I doing something wrong?  Or did they take back the free var-out?


----------



## Paspasero

Probably not available on the drop this time around. On the last order they had to order a lot more parts to do the variable mod which is why they might not be offering it this time around. Also with the last batch a few people with the variable output mod (including me) had issue with hissing/buzzing on their units.


----------



## fallingreason

I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't offer Var Out for free. It sounded like it was a bit crazy for them to perform such a large quantity of that mod for people who ordered it "just in case since its free"


----------



## russdog

fallingreason said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't offer Var Out for free. It sounded like it was a bit crazy for them to perform such a large quantity of that mod for people who ordered it "just in case since its free"


 
  
 Apparently, it went from $100 to a free option last time once 50 people signed up for the DacMini CX.  Right now, it's at 24. I'm hoping 26 more will join, maybe that will make it free.  But with 4 days left, who knows if that many more will sign up?


----------



## Bostonears

russdog said:


> Apparently, it went from $100 to a free option last time once 50 people signed up for the DacMini CX.  Right now, it's at 24. I'm hoping 26 more will join, maybe that will make it free.  But with 4 days left, who knows if that many more will sign up?



I'd join the MassDrop if the variable output mod is included at no extra charge. It's a catch-22, because I won't commit to the drop otherwise, and CEntrance hasn't said they'll offer it free even with a minimum number of orders.


----------



## rage3324

Can anyone comment on how this pairs with grad sr325i or AKG 702/712? I am looking to upgrade my dac and have a solid state amp alternative to my little dot i+


----------



## russdog

rage3324 said:


> Can anyone comment on how this pairs with grad *sr325i* or *AKG 702/712*? I am looking to upgrade my dac and have a solid state amp alternative to my little dot i+


 
  
 Of special interest is whether the std and 1-ohm versions perform equally well for low-ish impedance cans such as these. If they do, then the choice between the std version and the 1-ohm option can be made based on one's personal preference for the std version's warmer sound vs. the 1-ohm's more neutral sound.  
  
 What's not clear (to me, at least) is at what point headphone impedance is low enough to call for the 1-ohm option.  Does the 8:1 rule-of-thumb not apply?  Is the answer known, or is this a hazy issue?


----------



## russdog

russdog said:


> Of special interest is whether the std and 1-ohm versions perform equally well for low-ish impedance cans such as these. If they do, then the choice between the std version and the 1-ohm option can be made based on one's personal preference for the std version's warmer sound vs. the 1-ohm's more neutral sound.
> 
> What's not clear (to me, at least) is at what point headphone impedance is low enough to call for the 1-ohm option.  Does the 8:1 rule-of-thumb not apply?  Is the answer known, or is this a hazy issue?


 
  
 I sure hope the guys from the company stop by and tell us what they know about this question before the Massdrop clock is up...  I know they're busy trying to fix whatever their QA problem is about, but still... what's it been, about 2 weeks since they've said boo to anybody?


----------



## russdog

By the way... just to pass the time while we're waiting, who's got a theory about what suddenly afflicted their normally wonderful and generally impeccable devices?  
  
 It's probably not voodoo or Martians, or anything like that.  
  
 The best theory I can make up out of thin air, based on absolutely nothing, is that maybe they got a boatload of parts from China that failed to meet quality-spec.  So, I wonder if they've been on the phone, yelling at people in Mandarin.  (If you're in a business like that, do you learn how to yell in Mandarin?  Or do you rent somebody to do that for you?)
  
 Also, didn't a couple people receive silver boxes that had something loose?  Or did I just make that up?  If I didn't make it up, then maybe they had some screwer-together-ers who were suddenly asleep at the wheel for reasons unknown.
  
 There might be better theories, but that's the best story I can fabricate... especially since I know absolutely nothing about it...


----------



## fallingreason

russdog said:


> By the way... just to pass the time while we're waiting, who's got a theory about what suddenly afflicted their normally wonderful and generally impeccable devices?
> 
> It's probably not voodoo or Martians, or anything like that.
> 
> ...


 

 It's possible that with the high demand, they had to hire a temp staff to perform mods and/or assembly which was not as skilled as the CEntrance house staff.
  
 Long hours and quick, time-constrained work can also take a toll on quality.  May just be an unwanted side effect of the Massdrop order to push sales.


----------



## rage3324

russdog said:


> Of special interest is whether the std and 1-ohm versions perform equally well for low-ish impedance cans such as these. If they do, then the choice between the std version and the 1-ohm option can be made based on one's personal preference for the std version's warmer sound vs. the 1-ohm's more neutral sound.
> 
> What's not clear (to me, at least) is at what point headphone impedance is low enough to call for the 1-ohm option.  Does the 8:1 rule-of-thumb not apply?  Is the answer known, or is this a hazy issue?


 

 Answer from CE via massdrop
  
 "You don't need any more power than what DACmini provides, be it 1 ohm or 10 ohm. This thing is a monster. And power difference is very small between 1 and 10 ohm, so it's not an issue. It's only about neutral vs. warmer sound."
  
 "I would personally stay with 10 ohm. We voiced this thing to please the most ears, so you should be quite happy."
  
 "Look, don't even think of the High Gain mod unless you don't like your hearing... Not needed in 99.9 % cases."


----------



## zilch0md

I have had the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm output impedance mod for a couple of years, now, and can say that it is truly the most neutral amp I've owned with the exception of its equal, in terms of neutrality - the portable Meier Stepdance - they are both dead neutral - benchmarks of neutrality, really. 
  
 The 1-Ohm version sounds great with headphones that have a coloration I like (i.e. LCD-2, HD650, etc.), but if the headphone itself is dead neutral and/or bright (AKG K550, etc.), I find myself wishing my DACmini CX had the default 10-Ohm output impedance mod.
  
 Wishing isn't enough, however, because the impact of the 10-Ohm "coloration" varies with the impedance of the headphone.  The 8:1 rule of thumb is accurate enough as a guide, I suppose, but I don't think of it as a hard line in the sand because there's a smooth transition as you approach and go beyond the 8:1 to ratio.
  
 Just consider that 100- through 600-ohm headphones will not be affected as much (colored as much) by* a 10-Ohm output impedance *as will 16- to 80-Ohm headphones. The closer a headphone's impedance is to the default 10-Ohm output impedance, the more it will be warmed by the DACmini CX.  Thus, my 50-Ohm LCD-2 rev.1 would sound warmer on the 10-Ohm output impedance than it does on my 1-Ohm DACmini CX, but a 250-Ohm Beyerdynamic DT 880 would probably not sound any warmer at all.
  
 So, the question becomes: 
  
 Do you want all of your low-impedance headphones to be "warmed," while your high-impedance headphones remain unaffected?  (Get the 10-Ohm default)
  
 -OR-
  
 Would you prefer your low-impedance headphones to also remain unaffected, while your high-impedance headphones remain unaffected?  (Get the 1-Ohm mod)
  
 Without question, I agree with the CEntrance conclusion that_ most people _would prefer the 10-Ohm output impedance, but the choice is _yours._
  
 -----------
  
 Regarding the Gain mod:
  
 I've got the default Gain and can say, for any amp, if you increase the gain, you will also raise the noise floor, which can hurt you with all but the most inefficient of headphones (i.e HE-6).  You can end up with a constant hiss when too much gain is used with efficient IEMs, for example. 
  
 A good rule of thumb with amps that allow _you_ to adjust the gain is to always use the lowest gain setting possible that can still provide sufficient volume with a given headphone - even if you have to turn the volume control nearly all the way up.  That keeps the noise floor down in the most silent portions of good recordings -and- it gives you more "finesse" in adjusting the volume control.
  
 The DACmini CX has _plenty of power _for most headphones, including everything that Audeze makes. I absolutely love how it drives my LCD-2 rev.1 and I have a friend who settled on buying the CEntrance DACmini CX with his LCD-3, after trying several amps and several flagship headphones - eventually selling everything except for that pairing.  (He's got the default 10-Ohm output impedance, by the way.)
  
 Mike


----------



## VintageSTX

Interesting.... trying to decide if this drop is worth it as twice the price over the Schiit Stack. So your think it would be better to buy the low impedance output model if using low-impedance planars?


----------



## russdog

vintagestx said:


> So your think it would be better to buy the low impedance output model if using low-impedance planars?


 
  
 Lots of folks report that it's not an issue with their planars... something about the nature of planars makes them immune, I gather... plus, the ones I know about aren't really low-impedance, they're more like low-ish... or not-high, or something like that... but not really low...


----------



## VintageSTX

Interesting, Thanks.


----------



## Armaegis

I have the Dacmini PX with 1-ohm and variable out mod and have used it for desktop speakers and my HE-6. For what it's worth, I'd pick it over the Schiit Mjolnir/Gungnir.


----------



## Paspasero

vintagestx said:


> Interesting.... trying to decide if this drop is worth it as twice the price over the Schiit Stack. So your think it would be better to buy the low impedance output model if using low-impedance planars?


 
  
 The Dacmini is much better than the schiit stack (magni-modi). I even had the Asgard 2 and I felt like the DACmini bested it.


----------



## fallingreason

paspasero said:


> The Dacmini is much better than the schiit stack (magni-modi).


 
  
 Yes... that is without question.  The DACmini is hard to beat.


----------



## Rewkie

Have some HD650s atm, wondering if i should go for the great deal that's on massdrop ATM for the Dacmini CX, or just get a BH Crack and a cheap-ish dac instead?  Right now i'm just running them off of an Astro Mixamp Pro 2013.


----------



## russdog

rewkie said:


> Have some HD650s atm, wondering if i should go for the great deal that's on massdrop ATM for the Dacmini CX, or just get a BH Crack and a cheap-ish dac instead?  Right now i'm just running them off of an Astro Mixamp Pro 2013.


 
  
 I don't understand why you would prefer a cheap dac to the DACmini CX.  All the reviews say that the CX is a killer deal at its normal price, and the current deal is half-off.  What's the rational for doing the other thing?


----------



## Paspasero

rewkie said:


> Have some HD650s atm, wondering if i should go for the great deal that's on massdrop ATM for the Dacmini CX, or just get a BH Crack and a cheap-ish dac instead?  Right now i'm just running them off of an Astro Mixamp Pro 2013.


 
 Well the HD650s are supposedly a great match with the Crack, never heard it myself, although I do own HD650s. I will say that the DACmini is an awesome product with a very neutral sound and great clarity. Either way its a step up.


----------



## Rewkie

russdog said:


> I don't understand why you would prefer a cheap dac to the DACmini CX.  All the reviews say that the CX is a killer deal at its normal price, and the current deal is half-off.  What's the rational for doing the other thing?


 
 I meant "cheap-ish" as in under $200.  And the crack is supposedly extremely good with HD650s, but i'll probably just go with the DACMini anyway.


----------



## Armaegis

The Bottlehead Crack is fantastic with high impedance Sennheisers and Beyers. If I had to choose between the Dacmini and Crack... my vote swings towards the Crack unless space is an issue (and let's be honest, desk space is a premium for most of us). I also enjoy building Bottlehead kits and have all the tools necessary, so my relative costs there have already been absorbed.


----------



## Rewkie

How hard is it to build a crack?  I've got a soldering iron, but i'm not very good with it...


----------



## Armaegis

Even for someone with little experience, it shouldn't be more than a three-evening build. The manual is very nicely laid out.


----------



## pieman3141

Yeah, all the mods were free last round. I heard that the Var-out mod slowed things down quite a bit last time, so I'm guessing that they're not offering it as a free mod this time.
  
 EDIT:
  
 To then guy that asked about the K712 pairing, I can tell you that the K712 pairs wonderfully with the 1-ohm mod. Everything sounds as it should sound to me. 11 o'clock is the loudest I can turn it up, though, or else things get too loud. I wish that there was a low/high gain switch.
  
 Pairing my ATH-IM70s, I can only turn it up a smidgen before things get too loud. It also starts hissing at the 10 o'clock mark, but I don't dare play any sound because by that point, things get painfully loud for me. Again, the high/low gain switch would be awesome for this.


----------



## Paspasero

pieman3141 said:


> Yeah, all the mods were free last round. I heard that the Var-out mod slowed things down quite a bit last time, so I'm guessing that they're not offering it as a free mod this time.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> ...


 
 Slowed the process down by almost 2 weeks because they had to order more parts for the var out.


----------



## Tagjazz

To All DACmini CX owners out there….
  
 I just purchased one (the standard 10 ohm) to run my new AKG K7xx and it sounds amazing. 
  
 My other 32 ohm headphones sound horrible with it though. Has anyone any experience with lower impedance planers like Alpha's, HiFiman's or Oppo? Looking to upgrade my closed HP's but worried that the lower impedance ones will not perform well.
  
 Any advice welcome.


----------



## zilch0md

The default 10-Ohm output impedance is apparently not to your liking with low-impedance headphones.  
  
 You might want to send it in to get the 1-Ohm output impedance mod applied.  Mine sounds just as good with headphones under 80-Ohms as it does with higher impedance loads.
  
 Mike


----------



## Armaegis

Though planar headphones don't care so much about output impedance.


----------



## rage3324

tagjazz said:


> To All DACmini CX owners out there….
> 
> I just purchased one (the standard 10 ohm) to run my new AKG K7xx and it sounds amazing.
> 
> ...


 
  
 That has me a little concerned.. The guys at CEntrance convinced me to stick with the 10 ohm version for my AKG K7xx and Grados. Now I am thinking about not opening the box and returning..


----------



## Bostonears

tagjazz said:


> To All DACmini CX owners out there….
> 
> I just purchased one (the standard 10 ohm) to run my new AKG K7xx and it sounds amazing.
> 
> ...


 
 When you say that the 32 ohm phones "sound horrible", can you elaborate on exactly what sound characteristics are problematic? And exactly which other headphones?
  
 My Denon D2000 (25 ohms) and Audio-Technica ESW9 (42 ohms) sound great with the 10 ohm version of the DACmini. And the AKG KXX is awesome through it.


----------



## hyunsac

I have both an NAD HP50 (37ohms) and HE500 (38 ohms) with a Dacmini and Dacport. I used them both at 10ohms for several years and modded them to 1ohm for the past 6 months. The differences are minimal and both headphones sounded great with either 10 ohm or 1ohm output.


----------



## Tagjazz

Definitely open the box. DACmini sounds awesome with the AKG and heaps of other headphones by the sounds of it. I also have NAD viso HP50 which are mainly for portable use so maybe DACmini is just too powerful for them. Great excuse to upgrade my closed headphones.
  
 Enjoy the DACmini - you'll get a really rich and detailed sound from your AKG's for sure.
  
 Happy listening.


----------



## Tagjazz

tagjazz said:


> To All DACmini CX owners out there….
> 
> I just purchased one (the standard 10 ohm) to run my new AKG K7xx and it sounds amazing.
> 
> ...


 

 SOLVED! Found out that it was actually the 6.3mm adapter that was causing the problem, when pushed in fully, it was not giving a proper sound. Have it half way out now and the NAD Visos sound good.
  
 Apologies for the confusion and thanks for the help.


----------



## Armaegis

A problem like that is usually a poor ground connection or something shorting, which leads to a very noticeable distortion or echo-like sound.
  
 There's no way output impedance would ever create distorted sounds like that. The worst that a high output impedance can do is create a boost at impedance peaks (which are usually in the midbass ~80-100 Hz) with only a few specific headphones. People get far too bent out of shape over output impedance and think it affects more than it does.


----------



## BIG Dave

I got in on the recent Massdrop for the PX. Scheduled to arrive in a couple days. Can't wait!


----------



## VintageSTX

I got my CX from the massdrop buy a few weeks ago and love it so far with DT800's 600 ohm (10-ohm model). Soo quiet and clear. I'll try to test it with some lower impedance cans and IEMs to see about that.


----------



## rage3324

Has anyone used the Dacmini (10 ohm) with the Grado PS1000? 
  
  
 Is anyone running the dacmini in dac mode and find it to be on the bright side? I have mine paired with the WA7 and the dacmini dac provides more clarity but it feels a bit bright in comparison. I am using HD800 and PS1000


----------



## Armaegis

Has anyone here tried the Schiit Wyrd with the Dacmini? Mine does not work at all and I'm wondering if it might possibly be a faulty Wyrd (it works with some of my dacs, but not others).


----------



## rage3324

Does the usb connect only accept 24/44.1 and not 16/44.1? Audirvana is saying the DAC only supports 24 bit. This is on a mac
  
 --Update--
 I found my answer. Centrance pads zeros.


----------



## Matter

I had an issue with the PX and sent it back for repairs but after 1 week I still have not heard back from them even after they acknowledged receiving my unit.
  
 I emailed them again to check but again no reply.
  
 Is there any cause for concern and has anyone encountered this before?


----------



## wolfz

russdog said:


> Of special interest is whether the std and 1-ohm versions perform equally well for low-ish impedance cans such as these. If they do, then the choice between the std version and the 1-ohm option can be made based on one's personal preference for the std version's warmer sound vs. the 1-ohm's more neutral sound.
> 
> What's not clear (to me, at least) is at what point headphone impedance is low enough to call for the 1-ohm option.  Does the 8:1 rule-of-thumb not apply?  Is the answer known, or is this a hazy issue?


 

 A bit old this post........
  
 I have the 10 Ohm version. With some low impedance headphones the bass can sound a bit loose, not well controlled.
 I made this experience with the Ultrasones Sig Pro and ED12 ( around 30 Ohm ). Changing from the Dacmini to the Meier Corda Classic amp ( 0-1 Ohm app. ) the difference is quite obvious.


----------



## Poimandres

I just hopped in on the current CX Massdrop sale. 

Quick question I will be using the CX with both my senn 650 and jh13 pro fp. I'm assuming I should go with the 1 ohm mod? Will it effect sound with the 650?

Regarding variable output I intend to use the CX line out into the upcoming Cavalli liquid carbon. Is it better to go for the variable output mod or not? I was thinking that it would be better not to as it may cause degradation of signal, etc. Any thoughts?


----------



## fallingreason

matter said:


> I had an issue with the PX and sent it back for repairs but after 1 week I still have not heard back from them even after they acknowledged receiving my unit.
> 
> I emailed them again to check but again no reply.
> 
> Is there any cause for concern and has anyone encountered this before?


 

 CEntrance is very slow with communication and repairs in my past experience.  I had a DACmini CX repaired and it took just over 3 months from when I dropped it off to when it was returned to me.


----------



## Mad Max

Anyone ever look inside to see what the 1-ohm version looks like?  Especially the bottom PCB that has the headamp, DAC, and upsampling chip.
  
  
  
 Quote:


poimandres said:


> I just hopped in on the current CX Massdrop sale.
> 
> Quick question I will be using the CX with both my senn 650 and jh13 pro fp. I'm assuming I should go with the 1 ohm mod? Will it effect sound with the 650?
> 
> Regarding variable output I intend to use the CX line out into the upcoming Cavalli liquid carbon. Is it better to go for the variable output mod or not? I was thinking that it would be better not to as it may cause degradation of signal, etc. Any thoughts?


 
  
 HD650's bass and soundstaging may be slightly less tight with the 1-ohm version.
  
  
  


armaegis said:


> Has anyone here tried the Schiit Wyrd with the Dacmini? Mine does not work at all and I'm wondering if it might possibly be a faulty Wyrd (it works with some of my dacs, but not others).


 
  
 Wyrd adds a bit of latency, from what I'm told, that could be the cause.  I have a USB-SPDIF converter that doesn't work with my Wyrd, but anything else does.


----------



## Poimandres

Thanks. In the 650 thread a lot of folks there think that the 650 benefits from lower output impedance devices.


----------



## Mad Max

poimandres said:


> Thanks. In the 650 thread a lot of folks there think that the 650 benefits from lower output impedance devices.


 
  
 It depends on the device.


----------



## Armaegis

mad max said:


> Wyrd adds a bit of latency, from what I'm told, that could be the cause.  I have a USB-SPDIF converter that doesn't work with my Wyrd, but anything else does.


 
  
 The wyrd also doesn't work with my Echo2, which is a proaudio 2in/4out interface... BUT it works when I have the external power supply connected. Very strange.


----------



## Acknown3

Hey guys, I'm considering getting a CX because the two free upgrades on the site that shall not be named are very tempting. How does the CX match up to the Audinst HUD-mx2, Fostex HP-A4, and Matrix Mini-i PRO? Those are the other all-in-ones that I'm considering, but I can only find limited reviews on them through Google.
  
 My only concern is that I already own an Asgard 2 and Modi 1, which are both powering my HE-400i. I know that the Modi and DACmini use the same chip, but I see a bunch of anecdotal evidence where people claim the CX is better than the Schiit stack, and even to the Asgard/Biifrost combo. Could this possibly come from how the DACmini is wired and isolated, or is a majority of this sentiment coming from the amp itself? Thanks!


----------



## zilch0md

Perhaps the most unheralded strength of both the CX and the PX is that they have really incredible power conditioners built right into them.  
  
 If you have less than perfectly clean AC power, it's no problem with the DACmini CX or PX or even with the DACport and DACport LX. CEntrance put a lot of attention into literally re-manufacturing the power coming into these units. The first hint of this is that the CX and PX can be powered by your choice of any voltage ranging from 9V to 19V.  How is that possible?  
  
 There's a team of little hard-hat wearing nanobots inside that separate all of the incoming electrons and stack them up in a big pile from which some more nanobots clean and polish them, then put them on a conveyor belt where yet more nanobots reassemble the electrons into exactly what each of the isolated DAC and analog circuits need to make clean, pure, music for your headphones!
  
 Just kidding, of course, but seriously - compare the CEntrance design philosophy to the Beresford Bushmaster or Caiman DAC/amps and you'll understand why Stanley Beresford can sell his stuff for so much less - and - why you have to power the Beresford gear with a battery pack to enjoy a low noise floor.  
  
 ---
  
 I'm still using my DACmini CX almost daily, to drive a battery-powered TBI Millennia MG3 speaker amp and Definitive Technology SM45 near-field monitors - which, together, present a very, very detailed, clean, and neutral reproduction of anything I pipe into the CX.  
  
 I don't like listening to music with a laptop in front of me, so I use this setup as my auditioning station lately - where I use Tidal HiFi to find new music, marking favorites, creating playlists and such, for later playback at my recliner, with my more expensive HD800 setup, and without a laptop keyboard tempting me to surf and check email and such, instead of just relaxing and getting into the music.
  
  

  
  
 Unfortunately (for the sake of my very patient and gracious wife) the table in formal dinging room has been my audio work bench for over four years now.
  
 Here's how it typically looks - but the clutter changes rapidly - I'm sitting in front of a royal mess right now, as I type this.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  

  
 I will likely never sell either my CEntrance DACmini CX or my Centrance LX. They are marvelous tools.
  
 Mike


----------



## Armaegis

zilch0md said:


> There's a team of little hard-hat wearing nanobots inside that separate all of the incoming electrons and stack them up in a big pile from which some more nanobots clean and polish them, then put them on a conveyor belt where yet more nanobots reassemble the electrons into exactly what each of the isolated DAC and analog circuits need to make clean, pure, music for your headphones!
> 
> 
> I will likely never sell either my CEntrance DACmini CX or my Centrance LX. They are marvelous tools.
> ...


 
  
 C'mon Mike, get your science straight! Nanobots are way too big to handle that kind of structure. We need femtobots 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 As an aside, I think the Dacport may be discontinued soon. People better pick them up while they still have a chance.


----------



## zilch0md

armaegis said:


> C'mon Mike, get your science straight! Nanobots are way too big to handle that kind of structure. We need femtobots
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Oh man!  You're so right!  But you have to be a super-geek to know about femtobots!   
  
 Feel the praise!


----------



## Armaegis

(let's just ignore the fact that electrons lack physical struture and are considered zero radius elementary particles... but uh I guess a theoretical representation of them puts them in the 10-15m scale... or something like that)


----------



## zilch0md

Haha!  You are absolutely ruining my humorous attempt to explain what happens inside the power supplies of CEntrance gear!


----------



## Armaegis

Fairies man. Gotta be fairies in there.


----------



## Nhare90

holy mother.. just received the dacmini cx (1ohm mod, variable output) from another site something like dassmop or something  but man...gotta say i do not prefer it for my hd800's but my umpro50's... dear lord i do now believe in witchcraft and whatever centrance is doing in that tiny little silver box is surely the work from a seasoned dark arts doer. the bass punch, slight increase in highs comparative to the darker ish sounding umpro50's just make the entire back in black cd sound like something i haven't heard from before. i have been apart of this hobby for years and i have to say that i haven't felt an emotional attachment to the music like i have now listening to the CX since my dad left me in his truck while he inspected a c-5 hercules (not abuse- i was not allowed in there any more as i touched/moved/played with anything and everything and lockheed did not approve) this made time for me to simultaneously kill my fathers truck (didn't understand the truck needed to be running in order to prolong audio nirvana) and listen to this very acdc album at pretty much ear bustlingly high levels and loved every second of it... until it died, at max volume, and i could see my dad walking back to the truck apparently already angry because no one ever checked one of the engines for operation. anyways- thanks centrance- people never forget the way you made them feel and you made me feel like a scared ****less 11 year old about to get his ass tore up for killing his fathers truck and lying about listening to the music without it cranked like he asked me not to do- the proof was when he started it and the music was still turned up to the same level. i tore up his speakers and he tore up my ass. its okay though i told my mother and he slept on the couch for leaving me in the living room


----------



## zilch0md

^ Haha!
  
 I agree that the DACmini CX with 1-Ohm mod is a bad match for the HD800, but it's great with the Audeze LCD-2 - it does a great job with the OPPO planar magnetics, too.
  

  
 Mike


----------



## aerosuffly

I just received my DACmini today, and it finally made my DT990 600 Ohm sound as good as it is supposed to be ... until an hour ago. It just stop working ... no sound on both the headphone and the speaker on any of the input.


----------



## Poimandres

How does the dacmini compare to the burson conductor or the marantz had-dac1?


----------



## Koolpep

poimandres said:


> How does the dacmini compare to the burson conductor or the marantz had-dac1?


 

 I had the DACMini CX with the 1 Ohm mod. So the sound signature is slightly different from the standard 10 Ohm version according to Centrance. Now I have the Burson Conductor and I think the major differences are:
  
 - DACmini is a bit more detailed, clinical
 - Conductor has more oomph and lower end impact (could be just the power advantage)
  
 But are extremely versatile and high quality all-in-ones. I used to have the DACMini used as DAC/Amp for IEMs and low impedance headphones and for planars and hit impedance headphones used the DACmini as DAC and the Gustard H10 as amp, a glorious combo.
  
 With the Burson Conductor - I just use the Conductor. Best of both worlds. However, I am not a fan of the stepped attenuator on the Burson.
  
 Cheers,
 K


----------



## Poimandres

Sweet. It's nice to know that the dacmini can compete with the Burson. A great deal it seems for those that were able to get into the Massdrop sale a little while back.


----------



## zilch0md

Yes, I actually prefer the DACmini CX amp section to the Burson Soloist (which I sold), for use with my LCD-2 rev.1.
  
 To me, the DACmini CX amp is more forward (front row seating), where the Soloist was laid back (10th row seating).  
  
 The DACmini CX amp also has a more detailed treble, where the Soloist was almost excessively smooth, depending on your headphones.
  
 The DACmini CX' proprietary DAC section is where the somewhat clinical edge comes from, in my opinion, not from its amp section. This makes it perfect, again in my opinion, for use with the shelved highs and less than spectacular resolution of the LCD-2 or with the somewhat rolled-off highs of the OPPO PM-1 or PM-2.  But that same analytical signature of its DAC makes it unsavory for use with something like the HD800.
  
 Mike


----------



## Poimandres

Well I decided to order one from Centrance and it just arrived today. Hopefully I will be able to give it a listen this weekend.


----------



## Poimandres

Does anyone have the dacmini and the alpha prime or alpha/mad dogs? I am wondering how they pair?


----------



## Poimandres

If anyone is interested MD has these on again.  You cant beat the price.....


----------



## scrypt

koolpep said:


> Now I have the Burson Conductor and I think the major differences are:
> 
> - DACmini is a bit more detailed, clinical
> - Conductor has more oomph and lower end impact (could be just the power advantage)


 
  
 Your observation about the "power advantage" makes me wonder whether you purchased your DACmini before 2013 (in which case it might have had a less robust power supply). 
  
 I don't dispute your comparison, esp. since I haven't auricled the Burson. I merely wondered whether the updated power supply might offer a more prime-cut sound than the one you've described (practically shrieking). 
  
 A steakier impact, perhaps. More filet-mignonesque.


----------



## Koolpep

scrypt said:


> Your observation about the "power advantage" makes me wonder whether you purchased your DACmini before 2013 (in which case it might have had a less robust power supply).
> 
> I don't dispute your comparison, esp. since I haven't auricled the Burson. I merely wondered whether the updated power supply might offer a more prime-cut sound than the one you've described (practically shrieking).
> 
> A steakier impact, perhaps. More filet-mignonesque.


 

 Hi!
  
 Well, I also have a bit of the 1 Ohm sauce and a side of headphones. The 1 Ohm mod apparently makes the DACMini CX a bit more clinical. According to CEntrance it was "voiced" with the 10 Ohm output impedance (which I should have gone for). 
  
 So all the difference might just be in this little mod that I thought at that time I need but ended up not needing it at all. However, this was only apparent with my Planars and the overall sound quality was still absolutely amazing.
  
 Cheers,
 K


----------



## Rynsin

koolpep said:


> I had the DACMini CX with the 1 Ohm mod. So the sound signature is slightly different from the standard 10 Ohm version according to Centrance. Now I have the Burson Conductor and I think the major differences are:
> 
> - DACmini is a bit more detailed, clinical
> - Conductor has more oomph and lower end impact (could be just the power advantage)
> ...


 
  
  
 Would you be willing to go into a bit more detail about the H10/DACmini pairing?
  
 What IEMs did you amp with the DACmini? I've yet to hear a substantial difference between amplifiers with my RE-600s, but I'm curious.
  
 I'd also love to hear more specifics about the DACmini -> H10 -> planars setup -- which planars? What advantages does the H10 have over the amp built into the DACmini?
  
 In your experience, do you find that the "best part" of the DACmini is the DAC? Is the amp sort of just an added bonus? Have you tried inferior DACs with the H10, and, if so, how did it compare to the DACmini -> H10 setup?
  
 I was considering getting an H10 to use as an amp with my Maverick TubeMagic D1, but when I saw the DACmini on Massdrop I decided to try out an upgraded all-in-one. From my understanding, the DACmini is really more of a DAC with a bonus amplifier thrown in (if this is not the case, please correct me!), so I'm curious to hear more about the H10 with it.
  
  
 Edit:
  
 For anyone else looking for DACMini / Gustard info, here are the other posts I've found:
  
 Koolpep posts:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/1260#post_11524479
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/2310#post_11665062
  
 Jozurr, who listened to Koolpep's setup:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/2340#post_11669366
  
 Olek:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/2505#post_11705220


----------



## Koolpep

rynsin said:


> Would you be willing to go into a bit more detail about the H10/DACmini pairing?
> 
> What IEMs did you amp with the DACmini? I've yet to hear a substantial difference between amplifiers with my RE-600s, but I'm curious.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi!
  
 H10/DACMini pairing.... Let's say, it's one of the best pairings for the money you can get. Equally good as let's say a Burson Conductor, maybe even better. My H10 has seen these headphones: LCD2f, HE-560, T90, HD650, K7XX, PM-3, HE-400, Momentum, MDR-1A, DT770LE - these are all mine and these I borrowed from friends or listened to on mini meets with the H10/DACMini combo: HE-1000, LCD-X, HE-6, PM-2, T1.
  
 I don't think I could find a DAC/Amp combo that can drive this plethora of headphones even remotely as good for that price. I was very happy with what I heard. Yes, a WA5 with all options does sound better by a large stretch but then the costs are as well.....large.
  
 The amp of the DACMini is really good. It was a bit bright for my taste but again, that could be the 1 Ohm mod (and I was warned but ignored that  you might also say: it was too detailed. A bit less musical than with the H10. A bit less enjoyable. That might again, totally change without the 1 Ohm mod. For some planars like the HE560 I preferred the H10 it felt like the H10 had a better grip on them, everything was more impactful an direct. 
  
 Yozurr and me tried blind tests with the H10 as amp, the DACMini, Schiit Modi, Schiit Modi2Uber and X5 as DAC. Same song, same volume. Three of these DACs have the very same AKM chip but whatever CEntrance did with them, it sounded best, no flabbiness in the bass, perfectly articulate Yozurr had a 100% hit rate. The other DACs were not as refined and well done/implemented than the DACMini. 
  
 I would still happily use this setup. However, I needed a balanced amp and helped a friend out who needed money, so we switched amps, DACMini against Burson Conductor and cash, once I had the Conductor I used the Conductor as DAC (also very very nice) and the H10 as amp. But the H10 and Conductor amps are pretty close as well so I decided to sell the H10 as well. Is the Conductor as good as the DACMini/H10 setup - yes, but it's not better. 
  
 I used the DACMini for JVC HA-FX850, UE900S and SE846 and they all sounded the best I have heard with it. Until I got the wifi iDSD micro. You can see already, nothing stays too long with me - when so much amazing gear is coming your way (thanks to reviews) there is always a bigger temptation to get new stuff once you tried them extensively and liked what you heard. 
  
 Again, I was actually "settled" on the DACMini and H10 and thought this is my dream config that I will use for a long time, just a few tempting deals prevented that. 
  
 My current setup is:
 Burson Conductor as DAC and Amp (for single ended use)
 Sansui AU-2200 via Hifiman HE-Adapter as balanced amp for HE-560, LCD2f (though the headphone out is absolutely amazing too) - 40 years old and sounds magic
 Headphones: HE-560, LCD2f, K7XX, HE-400
  
 Office:
 BH Crack for T90 and HD650 (might shift that home soon as office is too noisy recently)
 ifi iDSD micro with Oppo PM-3, D600, RHA T20, UE900s and sometimes momentum
  
 My H10 is currently doing duty driving an HE-560 and the DACMini is happily powering an HD650 - both with friends. I asked for both to have the first right to buy it back before they sell it on, if they do  -> I still like them a LOT....
  
 Cheers,
 K


----------



## Rynsin

koolpep said:


> Hi!
> 
> H10/DACMini pairing.... Let's say, it's one of the best pairings for the money you can get. Equally good as let's say a Burson Conductor, maybe even better. My H10 has seen these headphones: LCD2f, HE-560, T90, HD650, K7XX, PM-3, HE-400, Momentum, MDR-1A, DT770LE - these are all mine and these I borrowed from friends or listened to on mini meets with the H10/DACMini combo: HE-1000, LCD-X, HE-6, PM-2, T1.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thank you -- this is extremely useful information. I think I'll listen to the DACMini amp for a while and decide if it's sufficient. It's good to know I can get a nice upgrade for (relatively) cheap with the addition of the H10.
  
 For better or worse, I did get the 1 Ohm mod on the DACMini. I suppose that might just give me a good excuse to get the H10!


----------



## Rynsin

twinster said:


> I will went I have more time. I'm busy at work these days.
> 
> I did a quick A/B this week for about 10 minutes but I was focusing on the headphone not the amp but I can say that the O2 was not disappointing. One think for sure is the amazing black/silent background. No noise at all. Even at full volume with sensitive IEM. I also believe the bass impact was a bit better on the DACmini. Both amplifier are very clean & detail.
> 
> ...


 

 I hate to pull this back up from... three years ago... but did you ever get around to doing a serious comparison here? I'd be especially interested in what you (or anyone else, of course!) thought about using the O2 to amp the output of the DACmini.
  
 Since both of these were recently on Massdrop, I imagine I'm not the only one wondering. I did my best to search, but this is the most recent post I found mentioning both the DACmini and the O2.


----------



## vinylvalet

I've been using the DACMini/K702 combo for about five years. Very happy, no desire to upgrade. These days I'm using it just as a headphone amp in my main, LP only system.


----------



## Adamora

Having a lot of issues after updating to windows 10 with the DACmini CX.
  
 Sound randomly cuts off for short to long periods of time, freezing up any other tasks until after it's been restored. Static noises happen randomly no matter what my latency is set to, be it opening an image file or closing a browser, it'll crackle and pop from time to time.
  
 Any chance of a new driver coming out =/?


----------



## Bostonears

adamora said:


> Having a lot of issues after updating to windows 10 with the DACmini CX.
> 
> Sound randomly cuts off for short to long periods of time, freezing up any other tasks until after it's been restored. Static noises happen randomly no matter what my latency is set to, be it opening an image file or closing a browser, it'll crackle and pop from time to time.
> 
> Any chance of a new driver coming out =/?


 
 Have you contacted CEntrance directly about a new driver for Windows 10? Have you tried uninstalling and reinstalling the existing CEntrance Universal Driver? (I'm planning to install Windows 10 on one of my PCs, and want to know beforehand if it will be a problem for the DACmini.)


----------



## Adamora

bostonears said:


> Have you contacted CEntrance directly about a new driver for Windows 10? Have you tried uninstalling and reinstalling the existing CEntrance Universal Driver? (I'm planning to install Windows 10 on one of my PCs, and want to know beforehand if it will be a problem for the DACmini.)


 
  
 I'm afraid to do so, due to any driver related inquiries I've made in the past years to different vendors ending up with a (It's probably your computer) excuse.
  
 That aside, the crackles aren't really killing me at the moment (Very brief and infrequent), and the sound cutting off has only happened once in the last 2 weeks.


----------



## Armaegis

adamora said:


> I'm afraid to do so, due to any driver related inquiries I've made in the past years to different vendors ending up with a (It's probably your computer) excuse.
> 
> That aside, the crackles aren't really killing me at the moment (Very brief and infrequent), and the sound cutting off has only happened once in the last 2 weeks.


 
  
 It doesn't hurt to ask at least.
  
 Unfortunately, random usb quibbles are par for the course when it comes to computer audio. On my laptop I had all sorts of weird glitches when I was running Vista, then when I upgraded to Win7 everything worked beautifully. I'm hesitant to try 10, so I'm waiting to see how that pans out in the next couple months.
  
 Some other things to try:
 - uninstall the reinstall the current driver (instead of just reinstalling on top)
 - uninstall drivers from other audio devices you don't use anymore (I don't know why, but this has cleared up other issues for me before)
 - check the power settings of the usb ports in device manager, give it priority and turn off power saving


----------



## Fungus

I just realised how much better the dacport lx is than any other portable dacs I've owned when I just sold off my ipod and 1st gen solo (used with my jds labs c5. I could never really hear much improvement from listening straight out of my lg g3 except a tad more bass and power due to the increase in out put voltage. 
 By swapped out with the dac lx, the increase in sound stage, resolution and bass is much more noticeable.


----------



## Chu

bostonears said:


> Have you contacted CEntrance directly about a new driver for Windows 10? Have you tried uninstalling and reinstalling the existing CEntrance Universal Driver? (I'm planning to install Windows 10 on one of my PCs, and want to know beforehand if it will be a problem for the DACmini.)


 
  
 Are there 3rd party drivers for this DAC?  I've been researching it since I am in need of a new DAC/AMP, and from what I can tell doesn't doesn't it just rely on USB Audio Class 1 support in the OS?
  
 Speaking of, what are all of your guys opinion about buying a DAC in 2015 that doesn't have USB Audio Class 2 support?  I am in need of a new integrated DAC/AMP for a workstation, and was putting together a list of all candidates I should research.  I dismissed this particular amp because it appeared to only support USB Audio Class 1 -- but it seems to be incredibly popular on that 3rd party site everyone is referencing despite that.


----------



## citylights

paspasero said:


> I know I just posted but something is seriously wrong with my unit/ ac adapter. I tried plugging and replugging the ac adapter and when I accidentally touched the metal casing the adapter started to spark.. There is now a serious burning smell and my unit is now blemished from the sparks..


 

 Something similar to you. Just received a couple of DACMini CXs with 1 ohm and variable output from the latest MassDrop. Only opened up one so far, but huge sparks each time I plug in the AC adapter (fortunately haven't touched the surrounding metal yet).
  
 In my case no hiss, but the variable output mod seems not to be working at all: at volume 0, line out to the power amp gave my neighbours a full wake up call. USB source also periodically drops out; with ASIO driver much worse.
  
 About to reach out to CEntrance.


----------



## Rynsin

citylights said:


> Something similar to you. Just received a couple of DACMini CXs with 1 ohm and variable output from the latest MassDrop. Only opened up one so far, but huge sparks each time I plug in the AC adapter (fortunately haven't touched the surrounding metal yet).
> 
> In my case no hiss, but the variable output mod seems not to be working at all: at volume 0, line out to the power amp gave my neighbours a full wake up call. USB source also periodically drops out; with ASIO driver much worse.
> 
> About to reach out to CEntrance.


 
  
  
 I don't get sparks when I plug mine in (MassDrop, 1ohm + variable as well), but it'll spark a little bit if I touch the power cord terminator to the metal frame. A little scary the first time it happened! After de-stressing the power cable (it was a little stretched under my desk), the issue seemed to go away -- might work for you too?
  
 I haven't had any issues with the USB drivers on the audio side, been using Windows 10. BUT -- when I turn off my computer, the DACmini sometimes won't switch away from USB mode when I hit the toggle. I imagine I'm being outsmarted by "smart selection" -- haven't actually looked in the manual yet, as there might be an easy solution. It might also be the crummy USB cable I'm using, but I' haven't investigated fully yet.


----------



## Adamora

Mine sparks like a flint on a lighter.

Briefly though.

I keep it on 24/7 now.


----------



## Armaegis

Geez guys, why not use a power bar with a switch that you can toggle instead of fiddling with the cord and accidentally shorting the power to chassis?


----------



## zilch0md

^ Good idea!


----------



## lalala6

.


----------



## Acknown3

Anyone have issues where changing the volume knob produces really loud static in the left driver/speaker? It only happens while changing the volume, but it has me worried.


----------



## Armaegis

acknown3 said:


> Anyone have issues where changing the volume knob produces really loud static in the left driver/speaker? It only happens while changing the volume, but it has me worried.


 
  
 Scratchy pots are not uncommon and it happens to virtually all analog volume controls at one point or another. This is typically due to dust and wear on the contact elements inside the pot itself. If it's not too bad, shut the power off and do a few complete sweeps of the pot to try and brush and particles away from the main area. A shot of deoxit plus sweeps is also doable if you can open up the cover (just spraying the surface of the pot near the knob joint should be ok, unless you're feeling adventurous enough to open the pot itself but it's not recommended)


----------



## Bostonears

This stuff from Radio Shack also works well for cleaning dirty volume pots, and you might be able to find it locally.


----------



## Armaegis

Any electronics shop should have some kind of contact electrical cleaner. I believe there are even specialized types for pots.


----------



## jisu

For those waiting for a Windows 10 driver, I have managed to nab a beta version from Centrance. Unfortunately I don’t have a working PC at the moment so I can’t test it.

 If you’d like to try it out PM me with your email.


----------



## JoeDoe

Soon to be DM CX owner checking in. My cans are RS1s and HE400i's. I got a decent deal on a used model, but it doesn't have the 1ohm mod. For the Hifiman, is this a mod that I _need_ or will I be alright without it? 97% of my listening with the Grado is through my MAD Ear HD.
  
 thanks in advance!


----------



## Armaegis

I wouldn't worry about it. Grado impedance curves are actually quite flat, so the effect on frequency response will be minimal. Some will crow on about damping factor, but the effect is not that apparent.


----------



## JoeDoe

armaegis said:


> I wouldn't worry about it. Grado impedance curves are actually quite flat, so the effect on frequency response will be minimal. Some will crow on about damping factor, but the effect is not that apparent.




Thanks for your input.


----------



## roker

So I got the 1 ohm mod a long time ago:
  

 _"Headphone Linearity" Mod (1 Ohm output)_
 _DACmini CX stock unit comes with 10 Ohm headphone output impedance. To our ears, it offers the most musical, transparent sound. Users have described it as "warm" and "analog-like". However we can lower the output impedance to 1 Ohm, if flattest possible frequency response is desired in your application. Customers have described the sound of this mod as "more clinical"._
 _Tip: Use this mod to get the best out of low-impedance headphones._

  
 Thing is, now I'm considering buying some Senn HD600s, will this be a problem?


----------



## zilch0md

^ Not in my opinion.  I have the CX with the 1-Ohm mod and found it to be a good match to the neutral HD600.  If it was your goal to have a warmer amp, then the default output impedance would be better, but it has its greatest impact on low-impedance headphones, where the ratio of the headphone impedance to the amp's output impedance is much less than 1:1 8:1.
  
 The HD600 is renowned for being neutral so, again, I think the 1-Ohm modded CX is the better way to go.
  
 Mike
  
Updated errors in my original post - I was in too big a hurry.


----------



## Rynsin

roker said:


> So I got the 1 ohm mod a long time ago:
> 
> 
> _"Headphone Linearity" Mod (1 Ohm output)_
> ...


 
  
 I agree entirely with Mike/zilch -- I've used the HD600s with my 1-ohm modded DACmini, it's great. 10-ohms is just too much resistance. In general, unless you have a headphone with crazy, 30db swing like the HD800, you'll want the amp and DAC to have a flat frequency response.


----------



## roker

Thanks, fellas!
  
 I've been rolling with my Denon D2000s for a long time and felt a nice change of pace would be nice with the more open design of the HD600s.
  
 I'll do a mini-review when I score a pair!


----------



## wolfz

I heard that the gain mod can improve the SQ when driving the Beyer T1.
 Is there anybody who has experience with this?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Armaegis

No personal experience with that combo specifically, but I highly doubt it. The T1 doesn't actually need that much power behind it, and typically lower gain is friendlier overall regarding distortion and assorted voodoo.


----------



## zilch0md

^ I agree.
  
 I still have the default gain CX with 1-Ohm mod and I previously owned the T1.  The default gain CX had plenty of power for the T1.  Adding more gain would raise the noise floor and give you less finesse at the volume control.


----------



## JoeDoe

Well I ended up returning the CX that did not have the 1 ohm and picked up one that has the 1-ohm and Variable Out Mods. Funny thing with that is that now I have a Geek Pulse Infinity and I need to sell the CX. If you're interested, I'm letting it go for a good price.


----------



## thatonenoob

Hello chaps, first time here and I suppose better now than never! 
  
So I just got the DACmini CX - it's very nice, and I do like it very much.  However, I do have a question.  Does it have to be plugged into a computer the whole time?
 
I plug my DAP in through the Coaxial, and my computer through the USB.  
 
When I play my DAP with the CX in coax, things work great.  However, the moment I unplug the USB (even though it's inactive), I am no longer able to switch the input _or _hear music from the DAP until I plug in the USB again!  I need to plug in the USB before the DAC becomes functional again.
 
I've emailed Centrance with this question, but I was hoping that community feedback could resolve this a little faster -and whether or not people have similar experiences.


----------



## Armaegis

If I unplug the usb from my computer (PC) while the Dacmini is on (any input), then it freezes. If it's in standby mode, it's usually ok for me.


----------



## thatonenoob

If it's on standby and unplug usb...can't really turn the thing on. Need to unplug power and so on and so forth. Odd quirks.


----------



## Armaegis

Hmm that's too bad. I'm guessing it's because there's a digital control board in there, which goes a bit wonky when usb is disconnected. The coax input has no effect because the communication is only one way. The only workaround I can see is to use a usb-spdif bridge to utilize the other digital input.


----------



## Koolpep

armaegis said:


> If I unplug the usb from my computer (PC) while the Dacmini is on (any input), then it freezes. If it's in standby mode, it's usually ok for me.




Was the same on my Mac.


----------



## thatonenoob

armaegis said:


> Hmm that's too bad. I'm guessing it's because there's a digital control board in there, which goes a bit wonky when usb is disconnected. The coax input has no effect because the communication is only one way. The only workaround I can see is to use a usb-spdif bridge to utilize the other digital input.




I see. Was wondering if there was something wrong with my unit but it looks to be more of a design problem than anything.


----------



## Jhir

Hello,
  
 My first post and I have a question regarding the dacmini cx and turntable setup. So I'm trying to see if I could hook up my dacmini cx to the turntable via TT->phono preamp->dacmini cx->Lcd-2 and, uh, I can't seem to get it working. Pretty sure I have all the cables hooked up correctly. Am I missing something here?
  
 Relevant notes would included that the dacmini cx may or may not have the 1ohm mod and variable output. Bought from another user from supposedly the massdrop sale a year or two ago but can't verify. Any help appreciated.


----------



## Armaegis

You're not giving us much to work on here. Can you verify all the components work separately on their own? Can you take a picture of all the hookups?


----------



## Jhir

Right! I did check that all components did work possible exception being the phono preamp. I mean it turns on and all but I don't know any other way to check if it works.
  
 Photos: http://imgur.com/a/cC0gL


----------



## Armaegis

So... how about just plugging the turntable directly into the Dacmini? It won't sound right (and you'll have to turn it up), but at least it lets you rule out the phono-pre as a culprit.


----------



## Jhir

Alright, I did just that and you're right. I did get the music through to the dacmini cx directly if albeit static-y and quiet. So phono preamp is fine? Wouldn't it suggest the opposite?


----------



## Armaegis

Well if sound passes through without the prono-pre in the chain, that would suggest that it's your phono-pre that's at fault. I don't suppose you have a different one to try?


----------



## Jhir

guess I have to send it back to the manufacturer and see if there's any problem with it.


----------



## terlingua

rynsin said:


> I agree entirely with Mike/zilch -- I've used the HD600s with my 1-ohm modded DACmini, it's great. 10-ohms is just too much resistance. In general, unless you have a headphone with crazy, 30db swing like the HD800, you'll want the amp and DAC to have a flat frequency response.


 
  
 Agreed, I have HD650 and stock 10-ohms. HD650 are not so loud on 10-ohms output mod, sometimes I'm listening on 90% volume and I could go more... I wish there was a gain switch somewhere on the back...


----------



## jisu

I've been skimming this thread for the past few days and quite a number of people have the same issue of the input selector freezing under various circumstances but all related to the USB connection.
  
 For me, mine freezes when my PC goes into sleep mode.
  
 I spoke to Michael Goodman and he suggested an independently powered USB hub, which I'm not so keen on.

 He also mentioned that the DACmini is discontinued and this issue will be resolved in the 'next version' *hint!*
  
 In the meantime, has anyone actually come up with a working fix to the input selector freezing?


----------



## Armaegis

jisu said:


> In the meantime, has anyone actually come up with a working fix to the input selector freezing?


 
  
 The only thing that works for me is to shut off/unplug.
  
 To be fair though, the Dacmini is not unique in this problem. I have had many usb dacs that glitch out due to sleep mode. It seems to happen most with those that also have external power units. I suspect (but could be entirely wrong) that this is because the usb receiver chip still receives its power directly from the usb cable while the rest of the dac has its own power supply. So upon sleep mode part of the data chain goes poof, the rest of the dac glitches out, and booting the computer back up doesn't do anything because you can't restart a broken connection. So you need to hard reset to get it back working again.


----------



## jisu

That's what I suspected, just wondering if anyone has gone the USB hub route with any success.


----------



## Armaegis

Shutting off the power-saving mode might help.
  
 I rarely have any issues with mine these days. I always move the switch to standby before shutting my computer down, and that seems to skirt the problem entirely.


----------



## rush1

Thought of selling mine, but then I tried a simple use for the dac mini... I think I it will stay for awhile...


----------



## zilch0md

rush1 said:


> Thought of selling mine, but then I tried a simple use for the dac mini... I think I it will stay for awhile...


 
  
 Wow!  The DACmini CX is standing proud in that rig!   I don't know what kind of amp or speakers you have - they're beautiful - but I also love the fact that you are using Tidal HiFi > iDevice > CCK as your source.  I've been doing this myself ever since Tidal HiFi was first offered and I love how "silent" the iDevices can be when a USB signal is pulled from them this way - compared to power-noisy laptops and PCs.  
  
 Another plus with the DACmini CX is that it supplies its DAC with very clean power, without requiring 5V power from the USB input - which also makes it a "perfect" for use with Tidal HiFi > iDevice > CCK, as the iDevices cannot supply 5VDC power to a USB-powered DAC.
  
 All-in-all, you have a very smart combination of components here!  Tell us about the amp and speakers, please.  
  
 Thanks,
  
 Mike


----------



## rush1

zilch0md said:


> Wow!  The DACmini CX is standing proud in that rig!   I don't know what kind of amp or speakers you have - they're beautiful - but I also love the fact that you are using Tidal HiFi > iDevice > CCK as your source.  I've been doing this myself ever since Tidal HiFi was first offered and I love how "silent" the iDevices can be when a USB signal is pulled from them this way - compared to power-noisy laptops and PCs.
> 
> Another plus with the DACmini CX is that it supplies its DAC with very clean power, without requiring 5V power from the USB input - which also makes it a "perfect" for use with Tidal HiFi > iDevice > CCK, as the iDevices cannot supply 5VDC power to a USB-powered DAC.
> 
> ...


 

 Hi Mike, Thank you for the kind words... The amp is _Tube Lover_ 845 single ended integrated with 25 watts, I am currently using nos telefunkens to sweetened it up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. As for the speaker they are _Vienna Acoustic Haydn Grand Symphony_ in Rosewood.
  
 Actually in the photos, I was playing via iTunes, Tidal isn't available yet in where I live, they said its coming soon. I certainly hope it does, so I can stream in higher quality sounds... But playing via Apple Music and Spotify is much pleasure already.
  
 I agree with you, Centrance doesn't need power from USB, thus a perfect match with idevices. More over I can "remote controlled" it with my other idevice. All in all, the Centrance does hold up in this small system, it sounds so musical and unfatiguing.


----------



## jisu

armaegis said:


> The only thing that works for me is to shut off/unplug.
> 
> To be fair though, the Dacmini is not unique in this problem. I have had many usb dacs that glitch out due to sleep mode. It seems to happen most with those that also have external power units. I suspect (but could be entirely wrong) that this is because the usb receiver chip still receives its power directly from the usb cable while the rest of the dac has its own power supply. So upon sleep mode part of the data chain goes poof, the rest of the dac glitches out, and booting the computer back up doesn't do anything because you can't restart a broken connection. So you need to hard reset to get it back working again.


 
 Interestingly, mine starts working again once the PC is turned back on.
  
 Quote:


armaegis said:


> Shutting off the power-saving mode might help.
> 
> I rarely have any issues with mine these days. I always move the switch to standby before shutting my computer down, and that seems to skirt the problem entirely.


 
  
 Sorry I should have clarified, the issue remains regardless of sleep mode, turning off the PC, and even switching the DACmini to standby beforehand.


----------



## Bostonears

On many PCs, only certain USB ports retain power during sleep mode, and in some cases the BIOS will let you configure whether or not ports retain power.


----------



## Allanmarcus

Hello. I'm thinking of getting a DACMini PX to use as a DAC with the Liquid Carbon and as a speaker amp for my MartinLogan LX16 speakers (near field). My alternative is the Oppo HA-1 with some sort of external class D amp or possibly an Emotiva A-100, if I can find one at a decent price. Another alternative is a Sony UDA1, again, if it can be had at a good price.
  
 How is the PX as a DAC and speaker amp? Are there any concerns about it's older USB implementation? Anyone herd any news of an upgraded model?
  
 Many thanks,
  
 Allan


----------



## Armaegis

The PX is a fine all-in-one unit. The dac is perhaps a little outdated, but honestly most will not be able to tell in the slightest. There's occasionally a usb blip that freezes the PX if you shut off your computer while it is on the usb setting, but making sure the PX is in standby mitigates this. There are no updates to the PX to my knowledge. There have been recent deals on the PX, so finding a used one at a decent price is not out of the question.
  
 The HA-1 is a travesty to be avoided.


----------



## Allanmarcus

armaegis said:


> The PX is a fine all-in-one unit. The dac is perhaps a little outdated, but honestly most will not be able to tell in the slightest. There's occasionally a usb blip that freezes the PX if you shut off your computer while it is on the usb setting, but making sure the PX is in standby mitigates this. There are no updates to the PX to my knowledge. There have been recent deals on the PX, so finding a used one at a decent price is not out of the question.
> 
> The HA-1 is a travesty to be avoided.


 
  
 Thanks for the info.
  
 We will have to agree to disagree on the HA-1. I find it great, as do many others. 
  
 If the pro iCan had speaker terminals, I would seriously consider it and a decent DAC from Schiit. The Rag to just too huge.
  
 I hope CEntrace updates the PX as it's one of the few left that does what it does, but maybe the work is moving to active speakers ;-(


----------



## Armaegis

NAD D3020 (or D7050) and NuPrime IDA-8 are two other all-in-one options to consider.


----------



## Allanmarcus

armaegis said:


> NAD D3020 (or D7050) and NuPrime IDA-8 are two other all-in-one options to consider.


 

 Thanks. I have a D3020. No pre-out, so no way to use it as a DAC for a real headphone amp. It appears the IDA-8 has the same limitation. As do many of the similar Teacs and Denons. 
  
 So fat the Sony UDA1 and the PX are the only desktop DAC/Amps (meaning relatively small footprint). The Sound Blaster X7 also looks like it's a DAC, speaker amp, and has a line out. It's just so... not audiophile


----------



## Armaegis

Er... the IDA-8 does actually have a pre-out.


----------



## Allanmarcus

armaegis said:


> Er... the IDA-8 does actually have a pre-out.


 

 Whoops! I saw "sub out" and got confused. Many thanks.
  
 update: Umm, the manual says that out is specifically for a sub. Odd.
  
 reading more. it appears to only have variable output on the RCA out. not great for my needs, but not a show stopper. I would prefer fixed. 
  
 So, anyone want to venture a comparison between the IDA-8 and the PX?


----------



## Armaegis

I own both and would say the IDA-8 is a step up in all aspects except size and noise floor. The NuPrime also leans a bit to the warmer side.
  
 I've used the "sub out" to feed headamps and power amps without issue.


----------



## Allanmarcus

armaegis said:


> I own both and would say the IDA-8 is a step up in all aspects except size and noise floor. The NuPrime also leans a bit to the warmer side.
> 
> I've used the "sub out" to feed headamps and power amps without issue.


 

 Si if I got the PX , connected speakers and headphone amp to the line out, if I wanted to listen to headphones I would turn not he PX, turn the volume to 0, and then just use the headphone amp.
  
 If I got the IDA-8 I don't see how that would work with variable output for the line out.


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## Armaegis

Yeah that sounds about right with the PX, provided you get the one with the fixed line out (it's an option to buy them with variable lineout, which is what mine has).


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## manualvin

Hi,

I have an Ifi phono 2 plugged into the centrance px dacmini connected to centrance masterclass speakers as part of a setup and now connected to a pro jet debut carbon turntable utilizing dacmini as a speaker amp.

There's an incredible loud humming once connected and I have been informed by the Ifi team it might be due to grounding or rather lack of grounding.

Any one have a similar connectivity using dacmini px to turntable or via a turntable phono amp?

My turntable works fine connected to a sprout and speakers directly but I was hoping for a better quality performance via iPhono 2 and dacmini px.

Thanks in advance,
Manualvin


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## Armaegis

Can you narrow down which component specifically causes the humming? try just the ifi phono2 by itself, and even just the turntable by itself without the pre


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## pbui44

I just hooked some old JVC HA-FX35 "Marshmallow" in-ears to the CX model with 1 ohm HP mod and they are very clear with serious bass!

Now, I had the CX power some Anax-Modded HD800 and GS2000e with great results...but now 6-7 year old $20 JVC Marshmallow ear buds sound like JVC SZ1000! I'm impressed.


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## pbui44

The more I listen to my CX, the more I am convinced that I don't need a balanced setup for headphones. I say this because it sounds about 80% of this $12k Questyle stack:





Power and soundstaging don't quite match up, but everything else does very closely.


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## roker

I'm looking to do an upgrade so this might move from being in my main rig to a desktop rig. Which is more than fine. 

A good piece of equipment like this should stay put. I purchased it 5 years ago and it's still going strong.


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## Armaegis

I've had a Dacmini PX as a secondary rig for a while now. The headphone output admittedly doesn't get used very much; it's used primarily with Centrance's own 2504 speakers.


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## pieman3141

I'm using my CX (with 1-ohm, var-output) with a Vali 2. Sounds absolutely wonderful. I've heard better sounding and costlier equipment, but the difference in quality is pretty minimal.


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## wrswldo

Hello,
  
 I'm new to the audio world and finally broke down and purchased a pair of Senns HD 650's. I have been looking for an amp/dac and the CEntrance DACmini CX has caught my eye. I wanted to ask for opinions regarding buying used, whether they are a good match for the HD650 and if there was a comparable choice around the $350 mark (around what they are selling for used) that you might want if you didn't already own the DACmini.
  
 Thanks!


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## TigreNegrito

Read through this thread a bit... the thread starter talks specifically about the pairing of HD 650's with this amp (post #21).
  
 Unless you're looking for a dedicated desktop DAC/Amp, you might consider CEntrance's forthcoming DACportable.
  
 I've been very happy with my PX, though as Armaegis said above, its primarily used to drive the 2504's at work, though it has easily handled any cans I've thrown at it.
  
 Good luck.  Welcome to Head-Fi.  Sorry about your wallet.


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## wrswldo

Does the 1 ohm headphone mod for the CX effect how higher impedance headphones sound? I have read about the 1/8 rule for output impedance but I'm confused if this affects cans that  wouldn't need the mod.


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## Armaegis

If your headphones have something like 250 or 300 ohm nominal impedance, then I wouldn't worry about it. The differences would be minimal.


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## gvl2016

Is it possible to DIY-undo the 1 Ohm impedance mod? I got my CX second hand and it came with the mod. I'm using it with NAD Viso HP50s and the sound is just too bright causing quick listener fatigue. I absolutely love CX as a DAC but not as a headphone amp, at least with my NAD cans which aren't supposed to be too bright. The NADs are butter-smooth when listening through JDS Labs O2 fed from CXs line out, so it must be the headphone amp section with the 1Ohm mod being the suspect.


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## Armaegis

The O2 has a low output impedance. Lowering it on the Dacmini isn't going to appreciably change the sound if you don't like it now, so it'll probably be wasted effort.


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## gvl2016

Different amps may respond differently to changing the impedance but you're probably right. I'd be willing to try it if it's a relatively simple mood.


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## Armaegis

Rather than fiddling inside the dacmini, the easiest thing to do is build an adapter cable with some 10ohm resistors in-line.


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## gvl2016

armaegis said:


> Rather than fiddling inside the dacmini, the easiest thing to do is build an adapter cable with some 10ohm resistors in-line.


 
  
 Good point. Did some quick reading on output impedance, seems like increasing it actually emphasizes treble, so this would probably be a move in the wrong direction given the original problem. Curious if the original Centrance mod did more than just changing a resistor that is in series with the headphones, after all they do say that 10Ohm units sound warmer.


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## Armaegis

The warmer sound is usually attributed to impedance interaction with dynamic headphones which exhibit impedance humps in the midrange (classical example: Sennheiser HD598/HD600). There's a small effect on resolution due to lesser damping factor which may effect the treble range, but this is small compared to the midbass bloom.


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## gvl2016

Thanks. I just find it a bit strange that I get his type of sound with my cans with so many happy CX owners out there. And while I generally like bright I get tired after 15 minutes listening through the CX. All Viso HP50 reviewers found them to be neutral sounding which is also my observation, at least when not using them with the DACMini. A bit puzzled by this, but I guess this wouldn't be the first time 2 otherwise fine pieces of gear don't work well with each other. I also have a Dacport Slim, it is easier to listen to but still the highs are still over-emphasized.


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## pbui44

Does anyone feel that the dacmini cx with 1 ohm HP mod is one of the few Single-Ended all-in-one setups that sound closest to a Balanced all-in-one setup? I had the a left-over FiiO 3.5mm-to-3.5mm 6" line-out cable connected to a Koss E90 energizer and 6.35mm adapter on the other end, and they made a perfect combo with my ESP-950. I am now getting a Stax SR-L500 and SRM-212 and looking at upgrade options, but I am only interested in the Stax SE-input Amps, as I don't like the Stax Balanced-input amps for some reason. Of course, I will use a 3.5mm-to-RCA cable for the Stax setup.


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## pbui44

Nevermind about the above post. I switched from the HP out to the RCA out in the back and the sound is fuller on the SR-L500.


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## Armaegis

Next step is to upgrade to the PX to drive the stax transformers


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## pbui44

armaegis said:


> Next step is to upgrade to the PX to drive the stax transformers




No Schiit.


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## Armaegis

I did that briefly with the Woo WEE and the SR-007.


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## Seamaster

I don't get it why people like the 1Ohm version, they traded musicality with more dynamic and detail.


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## gvl2016

I never heard the 10Ohm but 1Ohm doesn't sound particularly pleasant to my ears, so I use line out to O2.


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## pbui44

seamaster said:


> I don't get it why people like the 1Ohm version, they traded musicality with more dynamic and detail.




Well, the 1 ohm HP mod still goes great with my ATH-W1000X with HM5 hybrid ear pads, as it is not that hard to drive and wooden warmth is always there. Goes great with the ESP-950, too. It's just that it's not so great with Stax.


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## pbui44

armaegis said:


> I did that briefly with the Woo WEE and the SR-007.




I thought about the various electrostatic diaphragm designs of Stax products and which ones were mostly used, which were apparently the Lambda series. According to this review article:

http://kenrockwell.com/audio/stax/sr-lambda-pro.htm

Capitol records got rid of all of their Lambda Pro setups in 2001 for less pricey setups "to be sure mixes sound good on ordinary equipment, not just on the very best equipment." (quoted from the kenrockwell.com link) 

For CEntrance's artist's testimony page:

http://centrance.com/artists/

CEntrance bases a whole lot of their engineering on what their artists hear. It is very possible that many of these artists used the equipment Capitol records had, before and after 2001. 

I have wondered if any record labels used any of the Omega series setups, because all Omega series setups I used just did not have the right background recording projections for my ears, no matter what DAC or amp was used. It did not have to do with channel imbalance, but on the circular edges of the electrostatic diaphragm emitting different sound projections at the exact same time during more spatial notes and demonstrations from songs. I never heard this from my HE-4 or other orthodyamics, just the Omega series. 

Eh, maybe it's just my ears.


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## cricus3945

HI. does this amp-dac pair well with akg q 701?. Any experience?


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## russdog

I've got a CX (without the 1-Ohm mod)... love it... use it with several pairs of cans...

I have no experience with a tube amp, and have no easy way to try any... will a Project Ember or a BH Crack change my life for the better?  Whatcha think?


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## gvl2016

True story, somehow I got disappointed with the CX at some point and stopped using it and later sold on that auction site. The dude who bought it ran into some issues with it which I never experienced and I was kind enough to take it back. Funny thing now I'm in love with it, well more or less, at least like it much better than before, definitely more than a Modi Multibit I had, sold and don't miss at all. Galvanic isolation actually works, with other DACs I get some buzzing at max volume over the USB connection from my laptop, I tried iFi iPurifier, iDefender, Shiit Wyrd for this issue to no avail. The CX is dead silent, even when I use its line input from another DAC which normally buzzes when connected directly to the amp.


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## revolutionz

Reviving this thread for this beaut...Still using my CX at my home office desk.  Recently switched from HD700s to Focal Elegia (needed to move to closed back).  Sounds good as ever, but the upgrade bug is biting...thinking of moving this to my work office desk and selling the hifi-m8 I have there, and looking at buying a Burson Conductor 3P for my home office.

Question is, has anyone tried to feed the CX with android OTG?  Any ideas if it will work?


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## ZzZzZzZ

Centrance DACMINI 2 is announced!! Are you guys excited??


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## revolutionz

ZzZzZzZ said:


> Centrance DACMINI 2 is announced!! Are you guys excited??



I really did enjoy my original DACmini but have since moved on to Burson units.  Undecided yet if I'll go for a DACMini 2, although I'm sure it will be a great product knowing CEntrance's track record.


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## ZzZzZzZ

revolutionz said:


> I really did enjoy my original DACmini but have since moved on to Burson units.  Undecided yet if I'll go for a DACMini 2, although I'm sure it will be a great product knowing CEntrance's track record.


I have booked mine through the prebook deal. Let's hope it get reviewed soon, so we could have an idea about its capabilities and more folks would also get interested in the new Dacmini2 once they get to know what they would be getting from Centrance in Dacmini2!!


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## Armaegis

Early surveys were asking if people would be interested in a mic input. I would have liked that, but I'm in the minority on that one.


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## revolutionz

Armaegis said:


> Early surveys were asking if people would be interested in a mic input. I would have liked that, but I'm in the minority on that one.


I actually do use the mic input on my gaming PC on my Burson units, I feel like it wouldn't have taken much to put one on there.


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## Armaegis

There's a difference between the full XLR mic inputs and a small trrs mic input though, but I suppose if they could support both that would have been nice.


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## Max Choiral

Have anyone compared DACmini with Centrance M8 V1 or V2?
There are very few impressions on that with limited details.


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