# Cypher Labs Algorhythm Duet



## georgelai57

As the year draws to a close, we have news of another new portable headphone amp, this time from Cypher Labs.
http://www.cypherlabs.com/product/algorhythm-duet/


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## Ultrainferno

I'm so getting it. The Theorem amp is so good I just have to try this one too.


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## seeteeyou

.


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## muzic4life

I am getting this one too once available in my local store. I love cypher products...


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## Ultrainferno

Will be delivered on monday!


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## midnightwalker

My only question is: Does hiss occur when we pair this amp with high sensitive iems?


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## Austin Morrow

I'll be getting one as well. Should be interesting!


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## refault

midnightwalker said:


> My only question is: Does hiss occur when we pair this amp with high sensitive iems?


 
 Yeah I was wondering about this too, especially with 16-32ohm and less IEMs that have a high sensitivity. Can anyone clarify?
  
 The product says it has a "deep and clean background" I think, but does it apply for sensitive IEMs too? If it doesn't hiss w/ low impedance sensitive IEMs, I guess I might save up for it, heh.
  
 Only thing is that it seems the USB charging plug is a bit close to the balanced/single-ended inputs, which might make charging (or keeping the amp plugged in) kinda difficult with shorter "portable" interconnects? I hope that it'd be less of an issue with the ALO Rx Mk3-B+ in that regard, so I could use the amp at my desk without having to unplug it from the charger every time (since the Rx Mk3-B+ in balanced back-end mode has some weird grounding hum/hissing issues when plugged into the charger, at least on my model which I haven't sent in yet to ALO to check if a fix is possible.)
  
 Very interested in this though.


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## Ultrainferno

I don't think anyone has one yet, next week will be better for answers I think


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## LFC_SL

Ooh fully balanced. Have been put off mk3+ due to noise reports with iem. This product makes sense given the divorce with alo. What does not make sense is lack of balanced input on theorem

On a side note the pace of product announcements in portable audio needs to slow down


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## raelamb

ultrainferno said:


> I don't think anyone has one yet, next week will be better for answers I think


 
 I have proudly been beta testing the Duet for a month and can report no hissing with my JH16's on medium gain. This amplifier is truly a revelation in combination with my Cypherlab-db.
  
 Highly recommended.


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## midnightwalker

raelamb said:


> I have proudly been beta testing the Duet for a month and can report no hissing with my JH16's on medium gain. This amplifier is truly a revelation in combination with my Cypherlab-db.
> 
> Highly recommended.


 
  
 Wow, it such a good news today.


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## Poimandres

X2. Looking forward to additional impressions.


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## ANDEROAN

I am ssooo tempted to sidegrade itis? but I need another amp like a hole in the head, I will await some reviews I suppose, I almsot hit the pay button at TTVJ, ssooo close, ggrrr I hate conflict,


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## Poimandres

Agreed it is hard to wait. Hopefully it is dead silent with lower impedance high sensitivity iems/ciems. 

Has anyone received theirs yet?


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## Ultrainferno

poimandres said:


> Has anyone received theirs yet?


 
  
 I missed the FedEx delivery, they'll be back on Thursday


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## Poimandres

Looking forward to your impressions.


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## Cotnijoe

ultrainferno said:


> I missed the FedEx delivery, they'll be back on Thursday


 
  
 So tragic


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## rudi0504

If the sq like Theorem and has more power than Theorem , than I wish to buy this duet from our local store


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## Cotnijoe

Mannnnn... Rudi where u get the cash for all this nice shtuffsssss


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## Ultrainferno

rudi0504 said:


> If the sq like Theorem and has more power than Theorem , than I wish to buy this duet from our local store


 
  
 Exactly my idea!


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## rudi0504

cotnijoe said:


> Mannnnn... Rudi where u get the cash for all this nice shtuffsssss




From my works 
Please don't follow my very bad habit , always like new toys , only my wife is the same for 29 years


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## rudi0504

ultrainferno said:


> Exactly my idea!




If theorem can improve the amp section and less hiss , than I won't buy the duet , theorem is practice two in one box


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## georgelai57

Some photos from Headfonia's FB page https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.687486201296080.1073741839.145341288843910&type=1


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## Ultrainferno

Thanks for the link. looks great. (nice pics too)


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## mtthefirst

My early christmas present.


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## Cotnijoe

Merry Christmas! And the sound???


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## mtthefirst

cotnijoe said:


> Merry Christmas! And the sound???


 
 I'm still burning it. First impression is that background noise is much lower than my current Rx Mk3_B (that will be gone soon). It's much better paring with my sensitive Fitear MH335DW.


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## Cotnijoe

what is that attached to your iphone?


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## mtthefirst

cotnijoe said:


> what is that attached to your iphone?


 
 Those are iDevices DAC called VentureCraft DD Socket 1. It's pretty much the same as CLAS but you can choose OpAmp for pre-amp stage that suit your taste. Mine equipped with dual NJR MUSES01 with is about 50$ each.


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## Cotnijoe

Wow i wasnt aware they come with an iphone case too! Or does your iphone case just blend so well with it it looks like its connected together... hahaha


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## mtthefirst

cotnijoe said:


> Wow i wasnt aware they come with an iphone case too! Or does your iphone case just blend so well with it it looks like its connected together... hahaha


 
 Nope. That's a case made for their products. It fit with all of VentureCraft model.


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## Cotnijoe

great to see venturecraft coming up with these clever products  
  
 they look easier to use than something like the vamp


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## refault

mtthefirst said:


> I'm still burning it. First impression is that background noise is much lower than my current Rx Mk3_B (that will be gone soon). It's much better paring with my sensitive Fitear MH335DW.


 

 Does it have a background hiss at all w/ your Fitears, or is it just quieter/fainter/less bothersome than the background hiss on the Rx Mk3-B?
  
 Also, can you keep the micro-USB charger plugged into the amp while in use?  Does it fit into the micro-USB charger jack w/ all the back-end "portable interconnect" cables coming from your DAC?
  
 Nice impressions + pics so far!  Thanks.


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## mtthefirst

refault said:


> Does it have a background hiss at all w/ your Fitears, or is it just quieter/fainter/less bothersome than the background hiss on the Rx Mk3-B?
> 
> Also, can you keep the micro-USB charger plugged into the amp while in use?  Does it fit into the micro-USB charger jack w/ all the back-end "portable interconnect" cables coming from your DAC?
> 
> Nice impressions + pics so far!  Thanks.


 
 The background noise is still there but much quieter than Mk3-B. It use standard micro-USB port and yes it can be use while micro-USB is plugged. Don't know it's charging or not but the charging led light up.


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## Ultrainferno

I can't say there is any background noise with my ciems. No hiss, no channel imbalance at low volumes either. Very dark background, good bass and midrange body


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## rudi0504

mtthefirst said:


> The background noise is still there but much quieter than Mk3-B. It use standard micro-USB port and yes it can be use while micro-USB is plugged. Don't know it's charging or not but the charging led light up.







ultrainferno said:


> I can't say there is any background noise with my ciems. No hiss, no channel imbalance at low volumes either. Very dark background, good bass and midrange body




Congrats for yours new Duet

According from mithefirst , that Duet power is not bigger than ALO Rx 3 B
Is that equal with the power from Theorem ?

I need amp , that has more power than my Ali Rx 3 B , if not bigger 
I must think again ,should I buy or not ?


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## audionewbi

You have the wagnus you don't need another one 


rudi0504 said:


> Congrats for yours new Duet
> 
> According from mithefirst , that Duet power is not bigger than ALO Rx 3 B
> Is that equal with the power from Theorem ?
> ...


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## AnakChan

rudi0504 said:


> Congrats for yours new Duet
> 
> According from mithefirst , that Duet power is not bigger than ALO Rx 3 B
> Is that equal with the power from Theorem ?
> ...


 
  
 Funny, I thought the Duet was more powerful than the Theorem. I'll check with Cypherlabs. I found the Duet to be quite neutral in it's way of presentation. Didn't seem to lean towards either end of the FR.

 I'm guessing you need more power than the Rx Mk3 for your Abyss. Really though I think you should look at driving that kinda headphone with a proper desktop amp. It's more than just raw power that'll make such a headphone shine.


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## mtthefirst

anakchan said:


> Funny, I thought the Duet was more powerful than the Theorem. I'll check with Cypherlabs. I found the Duet to be quite neutral in it's way of presentation. Didn't seem to lean towards either end of the FR.
> 
> I'm guessing you need more power than the Rx Mk3 for your Abyss. Really though I think you should look at driving that kinda headphone with a proper desktop amp. It's more than just raw power that'll make such a headphone shine.


 
 I got those number from Cypher Labs website and compare it with Rx Mk3_B+ number but I feel that, at low gain, it's more powerful than my Mk3_B.
  
 On Cypher Labs site, it said that balanced output is 70mW @ 32Ω while ALO is 640mW @ 32Ω. It might be a typo on cypher labs (may be 700mW). For the reference, Theorem output is 205mW @ 32Ω. 
  
 On low gain, I can turn the volume of my Mk3_B to 100% and be able to listen with it but it will blow my ear aways with Duet.


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## AnakChan

mtthefirst said:


> I got those number from Cypher Labs website and compare it with Rx Mk3_B+ number but I feel that, at low gain, it's more powerful than my Mk3_B.
> 
> On Cypher Labs site, it said that balanced output is 70mW @ 32Ω while ALO is 640mW @ 32Ω. It might be a typo on cypher labs (may be 700mW). For the reference, Theorem output is 205mW @ 32Ω.
> 
> On low gain, I can turn the volume of my Mk3_B to 100% and be able to listen with it but it will blow my ear aways with Duet.


 
  
 Let's check with David. 70mW is less than the original Go-DAP X .


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## mtthefirst

anakchan said:


> Let's check with David. 70mW is less than the original Go-DAP X .


 
Here are the number from Cypher Labs.

*Balanced output power with both channels driven:*
 • 70mW into 32Ω
 • 100mW into 50Ω
 • 240mW into 300Ω
 • 120mW into 600Ω

*Unbalanced output power with both channels driven:*
 • 70mW into 32Ω
 • 100mW into 50Ω
 • 60mW into 300Ω
 • 30mW into 600Ω

Here are for the Mk3_B

*Power output, balanced mode: *
 • 640mW into 32 Ohms 
 • 630 mW into 50 Ohms
 • 150 mW into 300 Ohms
 • 80 mW into 600 Ohms
*Power output, u**nb**alanced (single-ended) mode:*
 • 320 mW into 32 Ohms
 • 220 mW into 50 Ohms
 • 40 mW into 300 Ohms
 • 20 mW into 600 Ohms


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## AnakChan

mtthefirst said:


> Here are the number from Cypher Labs.
> 
> *Balanced output power with both channels driven:*
> • 70mW into 32Ω
> ...


 
  
 I know. I've seen the web page too. I'm agreeing that it may be a typo as such asking you to reach out to Dave to doublecheck the figures he put up.


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## rudi0504

anakchan said:


> Funny, I thought the Duet was more powerful than the Theorem. I'll check with Cypherlabs. I found the Duet to be quite neutral in it's way of presentation. Didn't seem to lean towards either end of the FR.
> 
> 
> I'm guessing you need more power than the Rx Mk3 for your Abyss. Really though I think you should look at driving that kinda headphone with a proper desktop amp. It's more than just raw power that'll make such a headphone shine.




Thank you Sean 
With my ALO RX 3 B is very good in term of sound quality and power 
Like i meet Sid from Singapore , I brought my portable set up , he like my portable set up for Abyss 
After heard my set up 4 friends bought. abyss , before nobody want buy , because expensive 
And with the set up at Jaben store was not good synergy to Abyss.

I have interest if Duet has more power than my ALO RX 3 B 
If less than I don't want buy duet 

For home use I have my tube amp from T+A. p 10.2
International has big power but the SQ is a bit harsh


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## EH-Yeon

mtthefirst said:


> I'm still burning it. First impression is that background noise is much lower than my current Rx Mk3_B (that will be gone soon). It's much better paring with my sensitive Fitear MH335DW.


 
  
 Nice case. Does it fit in iphone 4 or 5?


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## mtthefirst

eh-yeon said:


> Nice case. Does it fit in iphone 4 or 5?


 
 It's for 5 and 5s but also fit touch G5 too. That's my ipod touch inside the case.


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## AnakChan

MTTF, you've been a little silent. How's the Duet going so far? Any further updates?


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## mtthefirst

anakchan said:


> MTTF, you've been a little silent. How's the Duet going so far? Any further updates?




Sean,

I've been traveling around with my family during new year break, so I didn't have enough listen time. Will be back on the listening session form tomorrow and will post some comparison between duet and mk3 soon.


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## nOtEcH

I am so curious about this comparison.. if the Rx Mk3b had been silent I would have had it.. and now.. maybe a Duet? 

How is the Duet in terms of sound quality? Width? Depth? Highs? Vocals? Bass? Texture? Overall presentation? Musicallity? Fast? Slow? Mellow? Punchy?

I just want the "perfect" portable amp and am hoping that the Duet could be as close at it gets..


I am using T5P (is it silent enough?) and HD800 (has it enough power?)..
Have you (or anyone else) tried those with the Duet?

Edit:
Did just read about the Chord Hugo DAC/AMP.. and I must say it looks darn interesting too!
2014 may be a great year for Head-Fi'ers!


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## mtthefirst

Here is my impression between Duet and Rx Mk3B. My test rig is ipod touch 5G connected to VentureCraft 12V DD Socket 1 limited edition with MUSES01 and Fitear MH335DW CIEM. I didn’t have a lot of time listen to them during new year but, so far, this is my impression on it.
  
 The first thing that hit me when I plug my MH335DW to the Duet is how *quiet* it is. Comparing to Mk3B, Duet background noise is like “Wait!, did I already turn on the amp?”. If you owned or heard Mk3B on sensitive iem before, you will understand with I’m talking about. The background noise is almost unnoticeable. 
  
 Duet sound slightly brighter than Mk3B. Bass is definitely cleaner, tighter, less overwhelming and more controlled than Mk3B. The quality of bass improve a lot toward the upper ends. Both Duet and Mk3B’s mids are very clean and clear. I found that Duet’s mids are slightly forwarded and brighter than Mk3B. Trebles are almost identical between the two.

 Soundstage width is very similar but Mk3B has slightly more depth to it. Mk3B seem to have slightly better 3D representation.


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## nOtEcH

Thanks for your impressions mtthefirst.
  
 I guess that it is a very good amp for iem's? And I guess that the T5P should be ok with the amp then.
  
 And you are pleased with the Duet, and so pleased that you will sell the Mk3b?
 Or do the Mk3b still have a place in your collection?
  
  
 Words like "forward" and "brighter" when describing the mids scares me a little.. even though you also say slightly 
 Is it gonna be a problem with listening fatigue?
  
 I am also curious about how the Duet will work with my HD800's. 
 Has it enough power?
  
  
 (I am also using  VentureCraft 12V DD Socket 1 Limited Edition, but with MUSES02 at the moment.. have not tried MUSES01 yet, but I have them lying around somewhere..)


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## mtthefirst

notech said:


> Thanks for your impressions mtthefirst.
> 
> I guess that it is a very good amp for iem's? And I guess that the T5P should be ok with the amp then.
> 
> ...


 
 My Mk3B will be gone soon. I think Duet is paired with iem better than Mk3B, at least for very sensitive iem. There is almost no channel imbalanced like the one in Mk3B.
  
 Remember that Mk3B is kind of warm amp. Slightly brighter than Mk3B is equal to less warm for me.
  
 MUSES02 is actually give warmer sound than MUSES01.


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## nOtEcH

mtthefirst said:


> My Mk3B will be gone soon. I think Duet is paired with iem better than Mk3B, at least for very sensitive iem. There is almost no channel imbalanced like the one in Mk3B.
> 
> Remember that Mk3B is kind of warm amp. Slightly brighter than Mk3B is equal to less warm for me.
> 
> MUSES02 is actually give warmer sound than MUSES01.


 
  
 Ok. So the Mk3 is so warm that you have tried to make it less warm with MUSES01 in the DAC.
 That makes sense.
  
 Thanks again for your impressions mtthefirst.


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## Cotnijoe

Hey guys! Been quite interested in the duet for a while now.

Just a question though, does the duet have the ability to created balanced output with SE inputs?


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## shigzeo

raelamb said:


> I have proudly been beta testing the Duet for a month and can report no hissing with my JH16's on medium gain. This amplifier is truly a revelation in combination with my Cypherlab-db.
> 
> Highly recommended.


 
 I agree with this. The noise floor is very low. It isn't as low as the Vorzüge amps, but low enough that it will never ever get in the way of good music. The DUET is an amazing amazing amp. I think it will become a huge hit.


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## Poimandres

Have you read Mile at headphonias review? He compares to the amp section of the Theorem.


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## Austin Morrow

poimandres said:


> Have you read Mile at headphonias review? He compares to the amp section of the Theorem.




You mean Lieven at Headfonia?


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## shigzeo

I'm about a week from a full write-up. DUET: rocks. Theorem Rocks. But dude, DUET really really rocks.


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## Cotnijoe

does the duet have the ability to convert single ended input to balanced output like PB2 and RSA amps do?


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## Ultrainferno

austin morrow said:


> You mean Lieven at Headfonia?


 
  
 +1. http://www.headfonia.com/the-duet-cypher-labs-fully-balanced-amp/


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## Poimandres

austin morrow said:


> You mean Lieven at Headfonia?



Yes I am not sure why I typed Mike.


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## rudi0504

Deleted


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## Cotnijoe

Thanks to Rudi... my wallet will be crying soon as i'll probably get one of these... this is ur fault Rudi


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## rudi0504

cotnijoe said:


> Thanks to Rudi... my wallet will be crying soon as i'll probably get one of these... this is ur fault Rudi




I am so sorry Law 
Better buy directly very good ones than buy less good and you sell it again , you loose more money


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## refault

Does the Duet come with that short portable kobiconn balanced mini-to-mini w/ the red Cypher Labs shrink wrap around the ends?
 If so, what do you think about it/the sound quality, and does the interconnect allow enough room for charging the -dB + the Duet in a stack while listening to the combo?
  
 Or was it an add-on/upgrade interconnect sold by Cypher Labs on the side?


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## shigzeo

The Kobicon connector does not come with the DUET. The new usb charge port is a mercy grace lord saving wonderful miracle as it means carrying a near-universal plug and outlet for 3 or four of my devices rather than 3 or four mains adapters. You can charge using the USB adapter with any cable supplying the cables you use use the space correctly. The Kobicon adapter bents outward, away from the USB port and therefor doesn't get in the way of using the amp with any stereo or balanced connector.


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## rudi0504

Duets best pair With Class Solo original

Source : iPhone 4 s
Dac : Cypher Labs Class Solo Original
Amp: Cypher Labs Duet
Headphone : LCD 3 with SAA Endorphin balance 4 Pin , use adapter RSA balance

These set up is excellent , in Medium Gain can drive my LCD 3 at 10 o clock very laud
I never heard my LCD 3 sound quality so full like with this set up
IMO


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## shigzeo

Well dudes, I've officially added my opinion about the DUET here at Headfi and at ohm image, with small variations depending on audience. I didn't expect DUET to be THIS good. Why? 720, as much as it completely rocks, has a higher noise floor than is strictly necessary. DUET has one of the lowest noise floors out there in its class, and in fact should mate perfectly with about 98% of semi-sensitive to sensitive IEMs out there. The gain stage is very good, though not quite as good as the Vorzüge PURE II or latest Rx. But better than Rx is the incredible stereo image, that is probably wider than your ears are used to hearing. In fact, because it is so wide, it may sound dull at first. Get used to it. It's something else. 
  
 Then get used to the smooth, low-noise signal and very high dynamic range. DUET exhibits so little dynamic compression on music. You will be surprised. Anyway, I'm very keen on this amp.


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## shotgunshane

I agree. The duet is superb and the combo with the solo -db exceeds any previous portable experience I've had by quite a decent margain. Awesomely black background with iems- smooth, spacious and detailed with nuance. Very nice indeed. I just wish I could use more of the volume pot with iems on low gain; I use very little of it. Thank goodness it's balance is very good with sensitive stuff. My F111 has never sounded better.


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## Ultrainferno

I even love the L2 with the Duet but usually just use it with my ciems.


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## shigzeo

shotgunshane said:


> I agree. The duet is superb and the combo with the solo -db exceeds any previous portable experience I've had by quite a decent margain. Awesomely black background with iems- smooth, spacious and detailed with nuance. Very nice indeed. I just wish I could use more of the volume pot with iems on low gain; I use very little of it. Thank goodness it's balance is very good with sensitive stuff. My F111 has never sounded better.


 
 My only two real complaints have to do with the volume pot: that it doesn't use the entire travel, and something else, but it is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than the 720 for IEMs. It is a rocking amp for sure.


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## McChickenz

Not sure if you guys know about this yet... but on their facebook page, they're giving away a Duet for free! I think there's only a couple days left to enter, so probably should hurry.

 https://www.facebook.com/CypherLabs/app_192229990808929


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## Cotnijoe

just placed my order of the duet. Now we wait... will give some impressions on running it single ended... then eventually balanced once i get all the cables and stuff right


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## maricius

rudi0504 said:


> Duets best pair With Class Solo original
> 
> Source : iPhone 4 s
> Dac : Cypher Labs Class Solo Original
> ...


 
  
 How does the Duet compare to your Intruder's amp section??


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## Cotnijoe

Just got these, and first impression is how much sense of space and air the duet gives. Makes my fairly dark ASG-2 have a wonderful sense of air. Imaging is also very natural and impressive. So far... after about 15 minutes... im pretty wowed


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## shigzeo

I think a proper listen will give that impression to anyone. Sense of space is daunting to the ear (especially in stereo) but it is there.


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## shotgunshane

The JH13 is pretty much my king of imaging but with the solo/duet, the F111 gives up very little to the JH13 in terms of space and defining the images with in it. I can't remember ever being this impressed with a piece of portable kit.


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## shigzeo

What is the F111? The Fujiya Avic FitEar 111?


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## shotgunshane

Yes, the formally named to go 111:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/619034/fitear-f111-impressions-reviews-discussion-previously-to-go-111


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## shigzeo

You know, they are the FitEar earphone I've spent least time with, but I remember them very well. I'm now a Parterre man.


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## shotgunshane

Hope to try those some day. I prefer the F111 over the TG334.


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## shigzeo

I prefer the TG334 first over both, but Parterre is probably my sounding FitEar earphone.


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## midnightwalker

shotgunshane said:


> Hope to try those some day. I prefer the F111 over the TG334.


 
 We are on the same page.
  


shigzeo said:


> I prefer the TG334 first over both, but Parterre is probably my sounding FitEar earphone.


 
 May be I should try the Parterre.


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## shigzeo

They are amazing earphones and work so well with the DUET.


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## NuClear235

Anybody tried DUET with Sehhheiser HD800 and with iRiver AK100, please?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## shigzeo

I've tried it with the AK100. If you dig the AK100, adding a proper amp to its output works very well. The Duet is a proper amp.


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## LFC_SL

What is japan street price? Cannot see listed on e-earphone yet


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## shigzeo

Knowing the prices for other Cypher Labs stuff, I can imagine it will be around 1000$ or 100.000¥.


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## Cotnijoe

Really?? That's an extra 400 Dollars!


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## shigzeo

Yep. In Japan, the importers charge an arm and a leg. Sometimes, they are another 100% of the price.


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## Cotnijoe

wow... makes me appreciate my Duet that much more


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## Ultrainferno

Order outside of Japan?


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## shigzeo

That is a great option but you lose the quick support you get when you order from Japan, and you may have to pay somewhat hefty import fees. Early adopters do that, but the vast majority would prefer to buy here.


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## AnakChan

shigzeo said:


> That is a great option but you lose the quick support you get when you order from Japan, and you may have to pay somewhat hefty import fees. Early adopters do that, but the vast majority would prefer to buy here.


 
  
 Quite often too makers (who are also online sellers) may not want to offend their local distributors. Afterall the local distributors who are putting in the effort in advertising and promoting the products at shows and events, having access to put the products on bricks 'n mortar stores on display, etc.


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## mtthefirst

I use it with my ipod touch but connect through external DAC like this.
  

  
 The DAC is VentureCraft DD Socket 1 Limited edition which is pretty similar to CLAS.


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## Cotnijoe

I've been using it with my iBasso DX50 and the two is a really strong pairing


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## shigzeo

cotnijoe said:


> I've been using it with my iBasso DX50 and the two is a really strong pairing


 
 Not only that, but because the DX50 is of such high fidelity, you need to match it to a very good amp in order to get anywhere. And the DUET does it. Totally.


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## fiascogarcia

shigzeo said:


> Not only that, but because the DX50 is of such high fidelity, you need to match it to a very good amp in order to get anywhere. And the DUET does it. Totally.


 
  
 So to use with Parterre (used mostly) and HD600, would you have a preference between Duet and Pure II?


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## Cotnijoe

shigzeo said:


> Not only that, but because the DX50 is of such high fidelity, you need to match it to a very good amp in order to get anywhere. And the DUET does it. Totally.


 
  
 Agreed! The pairing gets a super clean and natural sound! I havent gotten a chance to try and extremely high end dacs, but the pairing is the cleanest sound ive been able to make for myself


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## Chui

I just bought a Duet that I am using with  recently  purchased as well Solo R and an iPod touch as the source.  Fantastic combo.  Deciding on cables now.


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## LFC_SL

shigzeo said:


> Knowing the prices for other Cypher Labs stuff, I can imagine it will be around 1000$ or 100.000¥.



Existing CL stuff ¥ pricing still has saving over £ pricing, though not nearly as much as earphones. The SE846 is about 40% less!. AT usual suspect. Might pick up ES700 just because it's less than half UK rate!

Looking forward to seeing what's what when Easter Tokyo visit comes around


----------



## Poimandres

Depends on what you are using them with. The theorem has hiss with high sensitivity low impedance phones. From what I have read the duet does not. If you are using high sensitivity low impedance phones I would go with the solo db and duet. With this combo you also get more options for connection instead of just USB.


----------



## Cotnijoe

if anything, the duet is one of the most quiet amps ive yet to hear


----------



## shigzeo

fiascogarcia said:


> So to use with Parterre (used mostly) and HD600, would you have a preference between Duet and Pure II?


 
 What a question... DUET II's gain stage is less usable over a larger portion of the volume throw but DUET, does in some ways, outperform the PURE II. PURE II is smaller, which is a big plus to me, and easier ergonomics for pocket use. I can't comment for you, but for me, PURE II is an easier, better interface for earphones, than is the DUET. DUET is a do-all and makes certain ergonomic concessions because of it. But are keepers. For primary IEM use, PURE II is my go. But it has less power than DUET for headphones, though far more than is necessary.


----------



## AnakChan

mistofantastico said:


> Have on order iPod touch 64GB and lightning to 30pin adapter.. I know some of you have iPod touches and the Duet, any experience using the lightning to 30 pin LOD with the Duet?
> 
> Also, still on the lookout for a quality portable DAC to use with the iPod touch. One of the issues I'm struggling with is finding info on the line out VRMS values. Anyone know what what kind of power the -dB, -R and GoDAP are putting down at their line outs? Basically I'm trying to find the lowest VRMS in a sad attempt to get more volume control with the SE846. As it stands the amount of volume pot travel, even on low gain, is like a couple of millimeters at best.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Which CLAS? the original CLAS, CLAS -R or CLAS -dB? Note that early released of CLAS -dB were 1.2V and were subsequently revised to 1.69V, but CLAS -dBs you get off the shelf now are 2V. I've not heard of a 2.25V but I can check with Cypherlabs.


----------



## rudi0504

This evening I just received from Cypher Labs my Copper Duet

I will share out the box from my Duet :


----------



## midnightwalker

rudi0504 said:


> This evening I just received from Cypher Labs my Copper Duet
> 
> I will share out the box from my Duet :


 
  
 Too much for audio stuffs, buy a good camera, Rudi


----------



## shigzeo

Rudi, welcome to the club. AnakChan has the DUET now, so I said bye-bye today. I hope to hear his impression soon. Also, lighting is more important than the camera. A couple of good fluorescent lights and you should get amazing images for reviews.


----------



## AnakChan

shigzeo said:


> Rudi, welcome to the club. AnakChan has the DUET now, so I said bye-bye today. I hope to hear his impression soon. Also, lighting is more important than the camera. A couple of good fluorescent lights and you should get amazing images for reviews.


 
  
 Oh my that news traveled fast . I've not even updated my profile to add the Duet to it. Hehehe. I'll give it a listen to it tonight. Cheers for coming all the way out here to hand it over too BTW.
  
 Rudi, as per shigzeo. Welcome to the club - again. 2nd Duet is it?


----------



## rudi0504

midnightwalker said:


> Too much for audio stuffs, buy a good camera, Rudi :atsmile:




You are right 
I am to lazy to shot use dslr camera and upload to my computer , that's why I use iPad air


----------



## rudi0504

shigzeo said:


> Rudi, welcome to the club. AnakChan has the DUET now, so I said bye-bye today. I hope to hear his impression soon. Also, lighting is more important than the camera. A couple of good fluorescent lights and you should get amazing images for reviews.




Thank you shigzeo for your welcome drink


----------



## shotgunshane

anakchan said:


> Oh my that news traveled fast . I've not even updated my profile to add the Duet to it. Hehehe. I'll give it a listen to it tonight. Cheers for coming all the way out here to hand it over too BTW.
> 
> Rudi, as per shigzeo. Welcome to the club - again. 2nd Duet is it?




Look forward to your thoughts. I think the -db and duet connected balanced has an awesome sense of space.


----------



## rudi0504

anakchan said:


> Oh my that news traveled fast . I've not even updated my profile to add the Duet to it. Hehehe. I'll give it a listen to it tonight. Cheers for coming all the way out here to hand it over too BTW.
> 
> Rudi, as per shigzeo. Welcome to the club - again. 2nd Duet is it?




Thank you Sean for your welcome drink too 

Yes one in silver and now one in copper 

I heard already from David 4 weeks ago that you will have Duet , but I keep quiet hahaha


----------



## kh600rr

Any one got any experience pairing this with the new AK-240? I'm trying to find a good portable balanced amp, that can run my HD-800 to a good enough level, with the AK-240 attached.


----------



## Ultrainferno

I think Mike from Headfonia has, check there?


----------



## kh600rr

Nope, not yet, just started checking into the Cypher Labs AlgoRhythm Duet about 10 minutes ago. I'll check, thanks


----------



## midnightwalker

rudi0504 said:


> Yes one in silver and now one in copper


 
  
 Where is the one in Black?


----------



## rudi0504

midnightwalker said:


> Where is the one in Black?




I Dont like Duet or Theorem In black 
Copper look more Classy and elegance


----------



## Bluebear

How come no one compares the Duet against RSA's SR-71B? Anyone owns both or has heard both can give some feedback?


----------



## midnightwalker

The DUET is dead quite, even when I pair with the high sensitive Fitear. Cypher Labs have done a great job on it.


----------



## zeppu08

midnightwalker said:


> The DUET is dead quite, even when I pair with the high sensitive Fitear. Cypher Labs have done a great job on it.




What's your source with it? And how is the SQ?


----------



## mike_hell

Anybody ever compare ak100+duet vs ak120..?? In term of sq which one is better..?


----------



## midnightwalker

zeppu08 said:


> What's your source with it? And how is the SQ?


 
  
 AK120 + DUET + LCD-X/Fitear 111
  
 Great transparency and details. It improves the low range of F111. The amp section of AK120 is weak, it really needs to improve when pairing with high impedance headphone.


----------



## rudi0504

bluebear said:


> How come no one compares the Duet against RSA's SR-71B? Anyone owns both or has heard both can give some feedback?




I own Duet , rs 71 b and intruder 
Rs 71 B
High : more crisp than Duet 

Duet 
Has better mid and bass 

Duet is on par with Intruder 
SQ is more balance than Rs 71 b
Rs 71 b overall sound thiner compare Duet and Intruder 

IMO


----------



## jaganeee

Recently i bought clas db and searching for better balanced portable amp to pair with he500. Will duet do good job then rxmk3 and sr71b.


----------



## rudi0504

My Copper Duet is just come back to me this evening , thank you David for sending my Copper Duet 
Tonite I have more time to listen my rigs , because tomorrow we have Easter holiday until Monday .

Source : iPhone 5s
Dac : Venture Craft Go Dap DD 1 Limited Edition 12V With op amp Muse 02 ( black color )
 Venture Craft Go Dap DD 1 9 Volt with op amp muse 01 ( blue color )
Amp : Copper Duet 
Cable : mini to mini crystal cable Dreamline diy 
 Lightning to USB from japan 
Iem : Earsonic SM 64 v2
Headphone : Fostex TH 900


High : clear and clean , very good in detail and very good
Presence , that I can hear the cymbals more in my 
TH 900
Mid : very clean and clear mid and very sweet too 
I can hear how the Sanger breath and every lyrics 
I can hear better than my tiger set up 
Bass : very detail and clean bass , very good bass impact
Has very deep bass too 
Separation : is one of my best set up from my portable 
Collection 
Soundstage : wide and very good depth 

Overall : 
Very good pronounce and has fuller sound and very good clarity , I love this set up , that I can hear very good clarity in midrange and very sweet and intimate .
Very good bass detail and very good bass impact .
This set up can give you owed and depth for close headphone .
You hear for long listening time , never get fatigue 
IMO


----------



## rudi0504

jaganeee said:


> Recently i bought clas db and searching for better balanced portable amp to pair with he500. Will duet do good job then rxmk3 and sr71b.




I have pair. My LCD 2 rev 3 , my previous LCD 3 send LCD XC with class DB + Duet = SQ is excellent 

ALO Rx 3 B has more power than Duet ,Duet has better synergy to my LCD 

I think he 500 is ortho , should be very good pair with class DB + Duet 

Rs 71 B pair with CL class DB to thin for your HE 500


----------



## midnightwalker

jaganeee said:


> Recently i bought clas db and searching for better balanced portable amp to pair with he500. Will duet do good job then rxmk3 and sr71b.


 
  
 Personally, I prefer the DUET much more than the RXMk3. It seems the only advantage of the RXMk3 compare to other portable amps is power. However, in order to get better sound quality and quite noise floor for IEMs, I will take the RXMk3 out of my list. Besides, the DUET has enough power to drive LCD series very well so you do not need a more-powerful portable amp to drive your HE500. If I need more powerful amp than the DUET, I would rather change to desktop setup.


----------



## jaganeee

Thanks for ur replies. Hope duet will do good job with he500. In some review shows the duet has not get enough soundstage.


----------



## midnightwalker

jaganeee said:


> In some review shows the duet has not get enough soundstage.


 
  
 Compare to....?


----------



## Cotnijoe

The duet has wonderful soundstaging. at least in my book...


----------



## jaganeee

Compared to rx mk3 b+


----------



## jaganeee

What is the sound signature of the duet ?

is it neutral.


----------



## rudi0504

jaganeee said:


> Compared to rx mk3 b+




I don't have Rx 3 B+ , I have Rx 3B 
I heard Rx 3 B+ m The advantage to Rx 3 B+ is Only better bass impact and bass body , the rest i prefer My Rx 3B has better clarity and better separation and better soundstage 
Thats why i keep My Rx 3 B Not buy Rx 3 B+

For Me Duet has better SQ than My Rx 3 B, and The soundstage is on par With My Rx 3 B

IMO


----------



## rudi0504

jaganeee said:


> What is the sound signature of the duet ?
> 
> is it neutral.




Yes is neutral


----------



## midnightwalker

The RXMk3 is "too digital" to me. Mid bass is punchy and powerful but the sub bass is not very good. The mid range is dry which never brings me to the mood when I listen to vocal music. I prefer the the PANAMP most in Alo product line. It pairs really well with my Audeze headphones.


----------



## jaganeee

Have u seen the review for duet by headfonia and ohm image. They have the quite opposite review. How it happens.


----------



## maricius

jaganeee said:


> Have u seen the review for duet by headfonia and ohm image. They have the quite opposite review. How it happens.


 
  
 Opinions and interpretations of the things we hear will differ from person to person, check the comments of Headfonia's Audeze LCD-XC. The websites other moderator and frequent writer, Mike, wrote a mini-review/his own impressions of the Duet. It's different from the two you've mentioned but leaning towards the one done by ohm-image (who is actually now also writing for Headfonia)


----------



## shigzeo

jaganeee said:


> Have u seen the review for duet by headfonia and ohm image. They have the quite opposite review. How it happens.


 
 Shoot, I've got to read the Headfonia one!


----------



## Ultrainferno

Where can I find Mike's review? I cant see it in the article.

Just read the ohm review and I dont find them too different. Headfonia says there is more focus on the bass and mids where ohm says they are more linear but they agree on the treble. I have the Duet and I do feel there is a bass and mids focus


----------



## zeppu08

ultrainferno said:


> *Where can I find Mike's review? I cant see it in the article.*
> 
> Just read the ohm review and I dont find them too different. Headfonia says there is more focus on the bass and mids where ohm says they are more linear but they agree on the treble. I have the Duet and I do feel there is a bass and mids focus





You can check it out on the comments section of the LCD-XC review. Its just a short comment about the Duet compairing it to the MK 3B...


----------



## jaganeee

ultrainferno said:


> Where can I find Mike's review? I cant see it in the article.
> 
> Just read the ohm review and I dont find them too different. Headfonia says there is more focus on the bass and mids where ohm says they are more linear but they agree on the treble. I have the Duet and I do feel there is a bass and mids focus


 
 but ohm preferred duet than theorem but Lieven preference is quite reverse


----------



## Ultrainferno

well that's a personal preference and it depends on your headphone collection


----------



## jaganeee

ultrainferno said:


> well that's a personal preference and it depends on your headphone collection


 
 that's well said. 
 waiting for my duet arrival. yet to be shipped.


----------



## shigzeo

jaganeee said:


> but ohm preferred duet than theorem but Lieven preference is quite reverse


 
 I prefer DUET due to its slightly more laid back upper midrange and much less background noise. 720 is an awesome amp/DAC but if you use earphones, you will hear the hiss, no matter the make. The DUET is nearly silent and also has great control over the usable volume range through its volume pot. The 720 is more aggressive. If I was using headphones only, I'd probably prefer the DT880 with the DUET and the HD600 with the 720. But that is preference. Both are very high performance amps, but the DUET has a much quieter background. I can't pass that up. If you primarily use headphones either one will be great. Of course, if you don't need the DAC, or if you need it, there is only one choice for you. 
  
 Me? I'm a DUET guy as most of my battery headphone amp listening is done portably, and with earphones. Lieven is probably more of a home listener. And my ears have been called 'hiss kings', meaning, I hear hiss with grave alacrity. It's a curse.


----------



## refault

shigzeo said:


> I prefer DUET due to its slightly more laid back upper midrange and much less background noise. 720 is an awesome amp/DAC but if you use earphones, you will hear the hiss, no matter the make. The DUET is nearly silent and also has great control over the usable volume range through its volume pot. The 720 is more aggressive. If I was using headphones only, I'd probably prefer the DT880 with the DUET and the HD600 with the 720. But that is preference. Both are very high performance amps, but the DUET has a much quieter background. I can't pass that up. If you primarily use headphones either one will be great. Of course, if you don't need the DAC, or if you need it, there is only one choice for you.
> 
> Me? I'm a DUET guy as most of my battery headphone amp listening is done portably, and with earphones. Lieven is probably more of a home listener. And my ears have been called 'hiss kings', meaning, I hear hiss with grave alacrity. It's a curse.


 
 How are you able to carry around a 3-stack (iphone -> clas db -> duet) in your pocket though? That's the main reason I prefer the Theorem for portable use, as the stack is smaller and the hiss with my IE800s is tolerable for portable use.


----------



## shigzeo

I don't use a CLAS dB when out and about. And honestly, when I use stacks, it is from my bag. The DUET is large, but if you wear cargos it and a source do well enough. Truth be told, when I go light, I go with an iPod shuffle 512mb and my favourite earphones.


----------



## oriise

Just curious - if you love the Duet so much, why are you selling it?
  
 Regards, Ole.


----------



## oriise

shotgunshane said:


> I agree. The duet is superb and the combo with the solo -db exceeds any previous portable experience I've had by quite a decent margain. Awesomely black background with iems- smooth, spacious and detailed with nuance. Very nice indeed. I just wish I could use more of the volume pot with iems on low gain; I use very little of it. Thank goodness it's balance is very good with sensitive stuff. My F111 has never sounded better.


 
 Sorry - here is the original post I was referencing above. I am very intrigued with the Duet - just curious why shotgunshane is selling it if it is that good. 
  
 Appreciate your thoughts.


----------



## shotgunshane

oriise said:


> Sorry - here is the original post I was referencing above. I am very intrigued with the Duet - just curious why shotgunshane is selling it if it is that good.
> 
> Appreciate your thoughts.




I'm selling strictly due to size. The solo>duet stack is transportable but not pocketable. Most of my listening is on the go (office, commute, front porch, etc) and I just find myself less and less willing to deal with the bulk, so I'm looking to replace it with something pocketable. Most likely a high end dap. If money were no object I would definitely keep it but must sell to fund a dap (solo alread sold). I'll miss how well the F111 scales with it, especially connected balanced.


----------



## oriise

shotgunshane said:


> I'm selling strictly due to size. The solo>duet stack is transportable but not pocketable. Most of my listening is on the go (office, commute, front porch, etc) and I just find myself less and less willing to deal with the bulk, so I'm looking to replace it with something pocketable. Most likely a high end dap. If money were no object I would definitely keep it but must sell to fund a dap (solo alread sold). I'll miss how well the F111 scales with it, especially connected balanced.


 
 Makes total sense. Portability is a key issue. Thanks for the quick reply. Your comment triggers one more question if you don't mind. Do you hear a noticeable difference when connected balanced mode? Some folks don't notice a difference in reviews of other gear - I have always been a big believer conceptually (and love my all-tube balanced amp for the home) but never really AB tested the difference versus single-ended.


----------



## shotgunshane

oriise said:


> Makes total sense. Portability is a key issue. Thanks for the quick reply. Your comment triggers one more question if you don't mind. Do you hear a noticeable difference when connected balanced mode? Some folks don't notice a difference in reviews of other gear - I have always been a big believer conceptually (and love my all-tube balanced amp for the home) but never really AB tested the difference versus single-ended.




I easily noticed a difference just connecting the solo to duet balanced versus single ended, using single ended iems. That combo connected balanced, really showed me how competitive to TOTL iems the single BA F111 can be. Spaciousness and imaging both improved noticeably.


----------



## oriise

That's great to hear. I am glad I spent the extra bucks to get the B-mod on my AK120. Now I am very seriously considering the Duet - it sounds like the current winner in the portable balanced category. Thanks again for the input.


----------



## shigzeo

oriise said:


> Makes total sense. Portability is a key issue. Thanks for the quick reply. Your comment triggers one more question if you don't mind. Do you hear a noticeable difference when connected balanced mode? Some folks don't notice a difference in reviews of other gear - I have always been a big believer conceptually (and love my all-tube balanced amp for the home) but never really AB tested the difference versus single-ended.


 
 You also need to know that most balanced armature drivers still are not wired for bi-polar usage and can experience unstable operation in balanced mode. Dynamic drivers do not have the same problem. There is no doubt you will hear differences between single ended and balanced outputs when driving balanced armature earphones, but those differences still today, should be less stable than manufacturer spec. You may like them, you may dislike them. For sure, you will hear differences. 
  
 Measurably, they should be wilder than the differences heard when dynamic drivers are measured in balanced and single ended playback. Put simply, very few of today's balanced armature drivers are ready to be fed real balanced output.


----------



## dnnaudio

shigzeo said:


> You also need to know that most balanced armature drivers still are not wired for bi-polar usage and can experience unstable operation in balanced mode. Dynamic drivers do not have the same problem. There is no doubt you will hear differences between single ended and balanced outputs when driving balanced armature earphones, but those differences still today, should be less stable than manufacturer spec. You may like them, you may dislike them. For sure, you will hear differences.
> 
> Measurably, they should be wilder than the differences heard when dynamic drivers are measured in balanced and single ended playback. Put simply, very few of today's balanced armature drivers are ready to be fed real balanced output.


 

 Shigzeo, will this issue also arise if the CLAS and Duet are connected balanced, but the IEM cable remains stock single ended. I am thinking of going this route with the Shure 846 w/c I believe is balanced armature type.


----------



## zeppu08

dnnaudio said:


> Shigzeo, will this issue also arise if the CLAS and Duet are connected balanced, but the IEM cable remains stock single ended. I am thinking of going this route with the Shure 846 w/c I believe is balanced armature type.




+1 single ended iems/ciems and headphones.. 

Will it still be a fully balanced set up using the Single Ended headphone out?


----------



## shigzeo

dnnaudio said:


> Shigzeo, will this issue also arise if the CLAS and Duet are connected balanced, but the IEM cable remains stock single ended. I am thinking of going this route with the Shure 846 w/c I believe is balanced armature type.


 
 The signal into the amp and that the amp processes will be balanced, but the output into a single ended port will be single-ended. Unless your earphones are dynamic, or use non-polar balanced armature drivers, performance up to manufacturer's spec will best be had in single-ended mode. Headphones and dynamic drivers are a completely other matter. They are almost always better and more stable in balanced mode. BA drivers are simply not across the board there yet. As manufacturers change poles and signal pathways to best accommodate balanced signals, that will change.
  
 The SE846 is a balanced armature earphone. And, it is awesome. Completely awesome. Best universal I've used across the board. There are some with more lush midranges or more detailed highs or more headroom in the bass, but across the board, I've yet to use an earphone that comes close to its engineering perfection.


----------



## shotgunshane

I preferred having the solo/duet combo connected balanced for all my iems, whether dynamic, single ba or multi ba, even though they were connected single ended. Overall it improved spaciousness, staging and imaging.


----------



## kelske

cotnijoe said:


> does the duet have the ability to convert single ended input to balanced output like PB2 and RSA amps do?


 
  
  
 Hey all, 
  
 I couldn't quite find a definitive answer to this question later in the thread, can anyone shed some light on this for me? 
  
 So, single ended input + balanced output... possible? Or does it have to be single to single / balanced to balanced?
  
 Cheers


----------



## rudi0504

kelske said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I couldn't quite find a definitive answer to this question later in the thread, can anyone shed some light on this for me?
> 
> ...




So Far i have tested My Duet pair With Class DB 

iPhone 5s > lightning to mini USB > Class DB > use balance RSA to RSA > Duet = line In balance 

You can use HO In single ended or balance 

You can notice The different 

SQ improve In better Way if you use Headphone Out / HO In balance too 


The Other Way i tested With Venture Craft Go Dap DD1 With op amp Muse 01 

iPhone 5s > Lod 30 PIN to USB > mini to mini plug > Duet line In = line In In Singke Ended

You can use HO In Single Ended or Balance 

You can motive also the SQ different 


FULL BALANCE if you use Balance IN and OUT 

In portable i havent found 100 % FULL BALANCE , because The SOURCE must Be BALANCE TOO 
In these set Up above My IPhone 5s is not in BALANCE 

It is possible at the moment Only at home set Up 
From Source / transport > DAC > Speaker =. ALL MUST IN BALANCE 

IMO


----------



## kelske

Awesome, thanks for the quick and thorough response!


----------



## Cotnijoe

kelske said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I couldn't quite find a definitive answer to this question later in the thread, can anyone shed some light on this for me?
> 
> ...


 
  
 When you use the Duet, unless you use balanced source in, you're not getting a balanced sound. The Duet does not have the signal splitter mechanism like the PB2 or the ray samuel amps do.


----------



## rudi0504

kelske said:


> Awesome, thanks for the quick and thorough response!




You are welcome


----------



## Herman92929

To get fully balanced, you need a cable with balanced connector as well.no of fence,but how could people don't know that when comes to this stage you guys should know about that,anyway I ain't mad and I would like to answer any question. Im using fully balanced with solo db and duet in fully balanced mode together with my custom cable which has balanced connector.rudi knows it


----------



## kelske

herman92929 said:


> To get fully balanced, you need a cable with balanced connector as well.no of fence,but how could people don't know that when comes to this stage you guys should know about that


 
  
 Who doesn't know that...?  
  
 My question was to do with this situation:
 - Where your source only outputs to single ended (e.g. ALO The Key)
 - You want to connect your headphones to it through an RSA (even though you won't get the fully balanced sound improvements this way). 
  
 So, single ended input to balanced output. My main concern was whether the balanced output would be *active* if the balanced input wasn't also being used.


----------



## Herman92929

kelske said:


> Who doesn't know that...?
> 
> My question was to do with this situation:
> - Where your source only outputs to single ended (e.g. ALO The Key)
> ...



From my understanding, I think it wont be active just like you connect your iPod to solo r instead if solo db, then connect your duet through 3.5 with solo r,then connect your headphone to your amp though balanced you still don't get balanced.do you mean that? Or I get your question wrong?nvm


----------



## ANDEROAN

WOW!!!!!!!!! I'm very lucky to just getting cotnijoe's Duet, my I simply say, holy shiitzus,
  
 it is a great marriage along with an -R, and my ASG-2s, in scientific terms it is magical,


----------



## Cotnijoe

You enjoy urself now my brotha


----------



## Herman92929

anderoan said:


> WOW!!!!!!!!! I'm very lucky to just getting cotnijoe's Duet, my I simply say, holy shiitzus,
> it is a great marriage along with an -R, and my ASG-2s, in scientific terms it is magical, :atsmile:



Congratulations bro ! Sad to say I didnt find duet that good


----------



## rudi0504

herman92929 said:


> Congratulations bro ! Sad to say I didnt find duet that good




Why you don't like Duet Herman ?
What is your source and DAC ?


----------



## Herman92929

rudi0504 said:


> Why you don't like Duet Herman ?
> What is your source and DAC ?



Ipc(all wav from cd uncompressed) and solo db, in balanced mode.I just dont find it that good but this setup isnt bad.


----------



## ANDEROAN

cotnijoe said:


> You enjoy urself now my brotha


 
  
 hey Cotnijoe, Thanks for my one more place! the Duets world that is,
  


herman92929 said:


> Ipc(all wav from cd uncompressed) and solo db, in balanced mode.I just dont find it that good but this setup isnt bad.


 
  
 for me it has alot to do with the synergy of components, and atm my synergy centers around my adorable and magically diliciously ASG-2s!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, I wish I had the tech speak to descride the synergy that the ASG-2 shares with the Duet
  
 cuz I've been everywhere man, I've been everywhere man, across the W4s man, back thru the MDR's man,
  
 most recent amp was Decwares Zen Head, what a bute she was, now can't hold a candle to this Duet, another graduation day for me!
  
 my Digiziod ZOv1 has gotten me alot of that synergy, what an awesome little thumping  piece of gear it is! but now with the Duet there is NO more need for that little go getter? because the Duet does an amazing job controlling the ASG's monster bass and mids, and now the Duet is more then able to bring some ever so slight sparkle into the treble, making my ASGs sound spot on (well most of the time, well with some of my poorer recordings and all, but over all I am in bliss) and opening up the soundstage in an, I am in the third row hearing it all, if that's right, or more like I am there and hearing it in person effect?
  
 anywho, my audio therapy is progressing even more nicely now thanks to the Duet!
  
 and to some very very very very very very very very very great SYNERGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  
 peace!
  
 Happy Listening!


----------



## tracyca

Cypher labs duet sound great with dx90!


----------



## zeppu08

tracyca said:


> Cypher labs duet sound great with dx90!




Ant comparison of the dx90 HO vs dx90>Duet SE HO?


----------



## jaganeee

Got my solo db with duet paired to he 500. Completely enjoying the rig.

is there any low battery status indicator in duet ?


----------



## Ultrainferno

I _think _the little LED goes red before it dies


----------



## maricius

jaganeee said:


> Got my solo db with duet paired to he 500. Completely enjoying the rig.
> 
> is there any low battery status indicator in duet ?


 
  
 Impressions? How's the pairing with the -dB? I'm unsure whether buying the -dB is the next step for me.
  
 In my experience, the sound coming out fluctuates as well as its volume… then it dies. Unless there's an update, the blue light that indicates it's on doesn't change.


----------



## jaganeee

Haven't anything other than db for direct comparison. IMO its superior than my prev dacport lx.
pairing is one of the cleanest ouput u will get with neutral sound signature.


----------



## maricius

jaganeee said:


> Haven't anything other than db for direct comparison. IMO its superior than my prev dacport lx.
> pairing is one of the cleanest ouput u will get with neutral sound signature.




Lovely. It's another (previous) owner of the LX. Were you able to use your DACport LX with the Duet? Even if the comparison wouldn't be direct, what are the improvements of the -dB over the LX in terms of performance and not features?


----------



## ANDEROAN

a saturday report,
  
 ggrrrr, wow what an amp!
  
 this is an eerie sounding amp! I am reengaged with the music in the best of ways,
  
 when I was first getting into audio, I started with a set of the morray razors and an Archos 704 player? and how I thought that that was the sh!t? I was just tickled pink with being able to listen to my music on the go, I was a huge dummy, I got into the audio world on a fluke, a friend of mine bought an older ipod, and I was amazed that you could listen on the run(iPods had been out for a loooong time, classic iPods where out at that time, lol) and that's what led me to the Archos? and so as if it where my first time again, I am just blown away but now starting out with awesome gear!!?? lol, this thing is an amazing amp!!! I though my first posting was going to be a fanboy post? but I am still just as blown away and amazed at the sound this beast has along with the ASG-2s,
  
 the volume controler reminds me of Graham Slees Voyager, where increasing the the volume increases the amping aswell? if that makes sense, well whatever it's doing, it is increasing more then just the volume?!!!
  
 "the Duet has an ultra low deep and clean background, with POWERFUL, BOLD, AUTHORATIVE, UBER EXPANSIVE BASS!!!" taken from the included manuel, but the bass doesn't cover up the mids or treble, those have benn included along with the bass, the treble seems to get a little hot on certain songs(poor recordings), but only a little, the soundstage is awesome, not the biggest but has ALOT of seperation and details! I am sure it has to do with the deep and cleen background, a front to back effect, not so much tall and wide, so more intimate, the Zenhead has a wide and very expansive SS, harder to fill up?
  
 and so this little beastie is having an eerie effect on what I am hearing,


----------



## tracyca

I love my Duet amp, with se 846 explosive! My pico slim is having some quiet time now.


----------



## Herman92929

tracyca said:


> I love my Duet amp, with se 846 explosive! My pico slim is having some quiet time now.



Congratulations


----------



## oriise

shigzeo said:


> I agree with this. The noise floor is very low. It isn't as low as the Vorzüge amps, but low enough that it will never ever get in the way of good music. The DUET is an amazing amazing amp. I think it will become a huge hit.


 
 Shigzeo,
  
 How would you characterize the Duet vs the Mark III B+ in balanced mode with sensitive IEMS (mine are UE 11 Pros)? I am leaning towards the ALO as my AK120 B Mod is a little lean in the bass (line out) and the warmer signature plus bass "boost" is mighty tempting. Soundstage width and depth is also important to me. Is the ALO unit much noisier or just slightly noisier (liveable)? How about dynamics and slam? Would appreciate any input on this as I have yet to find any direct impressions sharing the differences between the two.
  
 Thanks, Ole.


----------



## oriise

shotgunshane said:


> The JH13 is pretty much my king of imaging but with the solo/duet, the F111 gives up very little to the JH13 in terms of space and defining the images with in it. I can't remember ever being this impressed with a piece of portable kit.


 
 Shotgunshane,
  
 Noticed in your profile that you own the AK240. How does the Duet marry with this unit? I own the AK 120 B Mod and can't decide between the Duet or the Mark III B. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Is the Duet better in a single-ended mode using the Solo DAC or do you like it just as much balanced with the AK?
  
 Thanks, Ole.


----------



## maricius

oriise said:


> Shigzeo,
> 
> How would you characterize the Duet vs the Mark III B+ in balanced mode with sensitive IEMS (mine are UE 11 Pros)? I am leaning towards the ALO as my AK120 B Mod is a little lean in the bass (line out) and the warmer signature plus bass "boost" is mighty tempting. Soundstage width and depth is also important to me. Is the ALO unit much noisier or just slightly noisier (liveable)? How about dynamics and slam? Would appreciate any input on this as I have yet to find any direct impressions sharing the differences between the two.
> 
> Thanks, Ole.


 
  
 I'm unsure if you've seen this but here is Mike's impressions and comparisons with the Duet (he uses the a AK240 + Duet combo for his Audeze LCD-XC)
  
"I like it better than the ALO Rx MK3B+. The ALO is more powerful with a stronger bass impact and more forward mids. Usually stronger bass is my thing but in this comparison, I prefer the Duet. It's more spacious, cleaner sound, blacker background, and a bit more laid back.

It also sounds like a fresh breath of air compared to the Intruder with its usual RSA weighty lows-sound. The comparison is also similar to the RX. The Duet is cleaner, more spacious, blacker background, a bit more laid back.

This puts the Duet as being more spacious than any of the current ALO or RSA portable amp I know. The only thing that's wider is Fostex's new HP-V1 but the Fostex is a bit weak on bass impact so I don't really enjoy the tradeoff.

If you've listened to the Vorzuge Pure, the Duet is a bit to that direction except that the Duet is wider, has a better depth, blacker background. The Vorzuge is a bit smoother though."
 
 You'll find this in the comments section in his LCD-XC review. Also, Shigzeo, Nathan, has his reviews of the Duet and the RX in his signature just in case you haven't read them!!
  
 Good luck!! (get the duet)


----------



## shotgunshane

oriise said:


> Shotgunshane,
> 
> Noticed in your profile that you own the AK240. How does the Duet marry with this unit? I own the AK 120 B Mod and can't decide between the Duet or the Mark III B. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Is the Duet better in a single-ended mode using the Solo DAC or do you like it just as much balanced with the AK?
> 
> Thanks, Ole.




Hey Ole,
I no longer have the Duet. I sold it and the solo to fund the AK240. And I have no plans to amp the AK240. I've learned that if I cannot easily pocket my portables, my usage wanes. 

That being said, the Duet is the most spacious amp I've heard. The Ak240 by itself is also very spacious but the Duet's left and right separation is quite amazing and when you add that to its utterly black background, it's pretty awesome. The F111 had great synergy with it. 

I ran the Duet almost exclusively with the solo -db. The two units were connected balanced for most of my usage, even when using single ended iems. 

If you are an iem user, I'd probably stay away from the ALO unit. Everyone I know with it says there is noise and/or hiss with many of their iems (doesn't apply to headphones). 

Sorry I couldn't be of more value on that question but Shiqzeo might be able to help if he still has the Duet, as he is currently borrowing Anakchan's AK240.


----------



## zeppu08

Any one have tried the Duet pair with the DX90? Any thoughts?


----------



## Cotnijoe

zeppu08 said:


> Any one have tried the Duet pair with the DX90? Any thoughts?


 
  
 I can give some input on that. Duet soundstage and separation, as shane mentioned, is pretty hard to beat. The width is noticably wider and overall sound on the duet is more neutral and detailed than just the DX90 alone. Duet also gives a really nice sense of air and space.
  
 The DX90 on the other hand (fw 2.0.0), is overall more forward sounding and for me a more engaging and fun sound with a little more bass impact.
  
 I did end up selling the Duet to fund a desktop rig and stick with just the DX90 for portable use since when im on the go, i dont need all the last little bit of detail the Duet pumps out, and I do enjoy the more engaging sound from the DX90 for on the go use. Plus without the stack the DX90 is pocketable.
  
 The Duet has a very nice dark background with iems with minimal hissing, but DX90's background is even cleaner.
  
 Overall if you're looking for an amp to pair with the DX90, the clean sabre DAC of the DX90 + the very clean sound of the Duet makes for really quite an impressive combo. I just personally went with the more portable and purely for music enjoyment route.


----------



## zeppu08

cotnijoe said:


> I can give some input on that. Duet soundstage and separation, as shane mentioned, is pretty hard to beat. The width is noticably wider and overall sound on the duet is more neutral and detailed than just the DX90 alone. Duet also gives a really nice sense of air and space.
> 
> The DX90 on the other hand (fw 2.0.0), is overall more forward sounding and for me a more engaging and fun sound with a little more bass impact.
> 
> ...




Thanks for that detailed inputs! Have you tried it with FW 2.05? Im using the new one which i find more neutral. Any thoughts? Thanks!


----------



## Cotnijoe

zeppu08 said:


> Thanks for that detailed inputs! Have you tried it with FW 2.05? Im using the new one which i find more neutral. Any thoughts? Thanks!


 
  
 Unfortunately I sold my Duet before 2.0.5 was released. Sorry


----------



## zeppu08

cotnijoe said:


> Unfortunately I sold my Duet before 2.0.5 was released. Sorry




Ow no worries.. Its ok.. Just wondering if any external amp can boost more the dx90.. Im using iems only at the moment and if im planning to get an amp for future headphone(looking on th lcd-xc) im leaning towards the duet and vorgz pure 2 only..


----------



## oriise

maricius said:


> I'm unsure if you've seen this but here is Mike's impressions and comparisons with the Duet (he uses the a AK240 + Duet combo for his Audeze LCD-XC)
> 
> "I like it better than the ALO Rx MK3B+. The ALO is more powerful with a stronger bass impact and more forward mids. Usually stronger bass is my thing but in this comparison, I prefer the Duet. It's more spacious, cleaner sound, blacker background, and a bit more laid back.
> 
> ...


 

 Maricius,
  
 Wow. Thanks a bunch for steering me to these impressions. Just what I was looking for. Boy, this is really a tough one as I do like a little bass slam and impact on the go. But these comments speak to what value even more, wide and deep soundstaging. That's why I went with HD800's with my home rig instead of the Audeze in fact. The HDs are not the last word in bass impact by any means but the spacious and "you are in the room" presentation is just out of this world. I have a little more thinking to do but I am really now leaning strongly to the Duet. Thanks again for all the great input.
  
 Regards, Ole.


----------



## oriise

shotgunshane said:


> Hey Ole,
> I no longer have the Duet. I sold it and the solo to fund the AK240. And I have no plans to amp the AK240. I've learned that if I cannot easily pocket my portables, my usage wanes.
> 
> That being said, the Duet is the most spacious amp I've heard. The Ak240 by itself is also very spacious but the Duet's left and right separation is quite amazing and when you add that to its utterly black background, it's pretty awesome. The F111 had great synergy with it.
> ...


 

 Shotgunshane,
  
 Thanks for the great input. I myself had an Algorhythm solo going into an ALO amp before buying the AK120. It really took the sound quality to a whole new level. And having an ALO amp right as we speak, I am definitely familiar with the noise level. I though perhaps they had fixed this with the Mark III B+ but if not, that's pretty much a deal killer for me. Plus, I am all about spaciousness and air, even at the cost of some bass slam (there's always trade offs) so the Duet sounds like it would be a great match for my AK 120 B Mod. I will post my impressions once I pull the trigger. Thanks a lot for your valuable help. It's great to have a solid perspectives from fellow passionate headfiers like yourself.
  
 Cheers, Ole.


----------



## NuClear235

What OPAs and BUFFERs are inside Duet ?
 Type of them define sound the most...


----------



## refault

Regardless of the background hiss, so far I slightly prefer the Rx MkIII-B+ in terms of overall sound-quality than the Duet, especially (even) when using the AKG K3003is (~8ohm) or even the IE800 (~18ohm.)
  
 The hiss on the K3003is is definitely quite noticeable on the Rx MkIII-B+, but it is hardly bothersome after getting used to the amp's overall sound-signature with TOTL low-impedance/high-sensitivity IEMs... IMO, the Rx MkIII-B+ tends to add a clearer and more spacious/extended/"defined"/articulate detail retrieval w/ a more "3D out of head" soundstage/imaging perception when compared to the Duet, completely covering up the ALO's background hiss w/ most low-impedance IEMs (although in my experience, cheaper IEMs like the IE80 have an unbearable hiss with the Rk MkIII-B+, probably due to the dark, less detailed/resolute/clarity focused sound-signature of the IE80s vs. the universal TOTL IEMs out there.)
  
 The Duet seems to provide a more "intimate" in-your-face sound; and yet, although it completely lacks any of that noticeable background hiss w/ sensitive low-impedance IEMs that plagues the Rx MkIII-B+, I find the Duet's overall sound-signature a bit too sterile or "boring" overall when compared to the ALO amp. I've noticed that the Duet seems to be really articulate, "clear"-sounding, tends to reproduce an up-front/front-row "presence" sound-signature (especially to the more minute details within recordings, in which the Duet articulates much more sharply and aggressively than the ALO amp), and gives off a "brighter"/more detail-focused-on-the-mids-section sound when compared to the ALO Rx MkIII-B+ in my opinion.


----------



## LFC_SL

Seems CL in a hurry to release second portable amp 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/717847/cypher-labs-new-product-vacuum-tube-headphone-amplifier-prautes/0_100#post_10572722


----------



## maricius

lfc_sl said:


> Seems CL in a hurry to release second portable amp
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I think the Prautes is anything but portable 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




… that price though, I hope they're worth the $3900 they cost


----------



## kh600rr

Help!!!! So I just hooked up my Duet to my AK-240, in balanced mode, only getting sound from the right channel. When I switch over to single ended, I get both left& right working. I switched my HD-800 cable to Balanced, to run out of the AK-240 on it's own, both left & right work. Any ideas??


----------



## AnakChan

I'd guess when SE mode you're hearing kinda mono? i.e. the one channel of the music track is coming out of both left & right channel of the headphones?


----------



## kh600rr

Yup. But when running balanced, only the right channel is working. Think maybe I blew something?


----------



## AnakChan

I'm more inclined to think that your balanced cable is improperly wired. Is this the first time you've tried using the balanced cable too? It's a 2.5mm TRRS -> Kobinconn (RSA)?


----------



## LFC_SL

maricius said:


> I think the Prautes is anything but portable  … that price though, I hope they're worth the $3900 they cost



Read the entire post I linked to


----------



## kh600rr

anakchan said:


> I'm more inclined to think that your balanced cable is improperly wired. Is this the first time you've tried using the balanced cable too? It's a 2.5mm TRRS -> Kobinconn (RSA)?




Yuppers,2.5mm got all my connects from Drew. He's not real likely to screw something up. Plush I've had them for a few months, and they've worked in the past.


----------



## kh600rr

I'll be at Headphonium 2014 today, I'll bring along the Duet, maybe someone there can come up with some more ideas. Thanks for the help AnakChan


----------



## maricius

lfc_sl said:


> Read the entire post I linked to


 
  
 OH THAT oops, my bad. I didn't notice it at first in the thread. I do remember Cypher Labs asking on their Facebook page if people would like a smaller Duet for easier to drive headphones/IEMs and greater portability. I wonder if it's this


----------



## LFC_SL

Now announced:
 http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2014/06/cypher-labs-algorhythm-picollo-portable-will-run-for-24-hrs/
 http://www.cypherlabs.com/products/algorhythm-picollo/
  
 Looks like 3.5mm out only so Duet still has a role.
 If that is right then there appears to be a slight mistake in the comparison table on the CL site as it says Picollo has balanced headphone out.


----------



## Duncan

I had my finger on the purchase button for the Duet, but - at the last moment switched to the Vorzuge Duo, am wondering if it is still worth pursuing the Duet...

What do you guys think re law of diminishing returns etc., considering there is zero chance of a demo of the Duet?

LOVE (capitalised for effect) the Duo with the IE800s, but that little niggling part of my brain that held my finger away from buying is now wanting me to do the opposite lol.


----------



## x RELIC x

duncan said:


> I had my finger on the purchase button for the Duet, but - at the last moment switched to the Vorzuge Duo, am wondering if it is still worth pursuing the Duet...
> 
> What do you guys think re law of diminishing returns etc., considering there is zero chance of a demo of the Duet?
> 
> LOVE (capitalised for effect) the Duo with the IE800s, but that little niggling part of my brain that held my finger away from buying is now wanting me to do the opposite lol.




Aren't you still on your Vorzuge honeymoon?! 

I'm in the same boat as you. As I mentioned in the X5 thread I'm very interested in the Duet, but can't demo one.


----------



## Duncan

x relic x said:


> Aren't you still on your Vorzuge honeymoon?!
> 
> I'm in the same boat as you. As I mentioned in the X5 thread I'm very interested in the Duet, but can't demo one.


Definitely am 

Like I say though, my finger was hovering over the purchase button, and - am still tempted, so hoping the consensus will be that the Duet isn't worth the expense if having the Duo ;o)


----------



## x RELIC x

duncan said:


> Definitely am
> 
> Like I say though, my finger was hovering over the purchase button, and - am still tempted, so hoping the consensus will be that the Duet isn't worth the expense if having the Duo ;o)




Didn't Lieven and Mike at Headfonia like the Duet for the bass? If you're divorcing the e12 because of a mid bass hump then I wonder how the Duet would be in comparison.


----------



## maricius

Is anyone gonna volunteer to make a AlgoRhythm Picollo thread or is it too early? I'm honestly quite excited to how'd they sound compared to the Duet for sensitive headphones and IEMs


----------



## tomscy2000

maricius said:


> Is anyone gonna volunteer to make a AlgoRhythm Picollo thread or is it too early? I'm honestly quite excited to how'd they sound compared to the Duet for sensitive headphones and IEMs


 
  
 Too early. But the prospect is indeed exciting.


----------



## rudi0504

HD 25 Aluminium best set Up 

Source : AK 100 Gold Japan Edition
Amp : Cypher Labs Duet silver 
Headphone : Sennheiser HD 25 Aluminium Edition 
Cable : Crystal Cable Dream Line : mini to mini and adapter mini Female to mini plug


----------



## zeppu08

Hi! Any one tried the Duet pair to a DX90? Any thoughts? Thanks!


----------



## oriise

refault said:


> Regardless of the background hiss, so far I slightly prefer the Rx MkIII-B+ in terms of overall sound-quality than the Duet, especially (even) when using the AKG K3003is (~8ohm) or even the IE800 (~18ohm.)
> 
> The hiss on the K3003is is definitely quite noticeable on the Rx MkIII-B+, but it is hardly bothersome after getting used to the amp's overall sound-signature with TOTL low-impedance/high-sensitivity IEMs... IMO, the Rx MkIII-B+ tends to add a clearer and more spacious/extended/"defined"/articulate detail retrieval w/ a more "3D out of head" soundstage/imaging perception when compared to the Duet, completely covering up the ALO's background hiss w/ most low-impedance IEMs (although in my experience, cheaper IEMs like the IE80 have an unbearable hiss with the Rk MkIII-B+, probably due to the dark, less detailed/resolute/clarity focused sound-signature of the IE80s vs. the universal TOTL IEMs out there.)
> 
> The Duet seems to provide a more "intimate" in-your-face sound; and yet, although it completely lacks any of that noticeable background hiss w/ sensitive low-impedance IEMs that plagues the Rx MkIII-B+, I find the Duet's overall sound-signature a bit too sterile or "boring" overall when compared to the ALO amp. I've noticed that the Duet seems to be really articulate, "clear"-sounding, tends to reproduce an up-front/front-row "presence" sound-signature (especially to the more minute details within recordings, in which the Duet articulates much more sharply and aggressively than the ALO amp), and gives off a "brighter"/more detail-focused-on-the-mids-section sound when compared to the ALO Rx MkIII-B+ in my opinion.


 
 Hi refault,
  
 Thanks for your great impressions. Since you own both the Duet and the MkIII B+, your opinion carries a lot of weight. On hiss factor alone with sensitive IEMs, on a percentage basis, how much more hiss would you say you hear between tracks at normal listening levels with the ALO versus with the Duet?? And for the bass part, would you say the bass also, although more impactful, is perhaps less defined than with the Duet? Finally, would you say the overall ALO presentation is just ever so slightly "muddy" or dare I say "distorted" versus the Duet? (that was my experience with an older Mark II - fun sounding but less detailed and slightly dirtier sounding than other amps in its class? Don't want to put words in your mouth - just trying to zero in on the issues that I am most interested in clearing up. Appreciate your thoughts.


----------



## refault

oriise said:


> Hi refault,
> 
> Thanks for your great impressions. Since you own both the Duet and the MkIII B+, your opinion carries a lot of weight. On hiss factor alone with sensitive IEMs, on a percentage basis, how much more hiss would you say you hear between tracks at normal listening levels with the ALO versus with the Duet?? And for the bass part, would you say the bass also, although more impactful, is perhaps less defined than with the Duet? Finally, would you say the overall ALO presentation is just ever so slightly "muddy" or dare I say "distorted" versus the Duet? (that was my experience with an older Mark II - fun sounding but less detailed and slightly dirtier sounding than other amps in its class? Don't want to put words in your mouth - just trying to zero in on the issues that I am most interested in clearing up. Appreciate your thoughts.


 

 Thanks for your response oriise. I'm glad to get some feedback on my impressions in-between the Rx MkIII B+ and the Duet so far, .
  
 With regards to the hissing, I'd say the hiss on the Duet is practically non-existent with my sensitive/low-impedance IEMs (K3003i and IE800 both exhibit a fairly black background and quiet soundfloor with the Duet.) Of course the K3003is and IE800s exhibit hissing (or a slightly "raised" soundfloor/not as "black" background) with the Rx MkIII B+, but as I said earlier it isn't that bothersome once you get used to the sound signature of the amp, and the hiss shouldn't get in-the-way at all while listening to music or watching movies on both IEMs with the ALO amp.
  
 The only IEM that I've had major trouble with in regards to hissing with the ALO Rx MkIII-B+ amp is the Sennheiser IE80; the hiss on the IE80s is almost unbearable and doesn't really 'disappear' into the background when listening to music/watching movies/etc. like it does when listening to the TOTL IEMs (AKG K3003i/Sennheiser IE800.) Maybe the sound-signature itself of the IE80 (cheaper, due to not being TOTL) has something to do with the hiss being more prominent/unavoidable/unbearable with the ALO Rx MkIII-B+ amp though? Not sure the reason for it myself (could be the muddier sound-signature of the IE80 making the hiss more pronounced), but I'm glad the hiss 'disappears' in the background w/ the K3003i/IE800 at least.
  
 On the issue of bass, I do find the bass on the Duet to be slightly less defined than on the Rx MkIII-B+, yes, but mostly b/c the Duet seems to be really mids-centric/focused more than anything else in my experience. I find the ALO amp reproduces bass in a more "open"/"less confined" manner than on the Duet, which tends to add a slight amount of texture/detail to the bass when compared.
  
 I've never tried the Mark II amp myself, but I wouldn't consider the Rx MkIII-B+ to sound at all "muddy" or "distorted" when compared to the Duet; it's just that the Duet has a much more mids-focused and sharp/detailed/"clarity" focused sound-signature when compared to the Rx MkIII-B+'s more open, airy/spacious/resolute sound-signature. With that said, it does make the Rx MkIII-B+ sound a bit "further back" in a concert-hall when compared to the Duet's up-front in-your-face mids presentation, but I wouldn't consider it at all muddy/distorted sounding (except for the hissing, which as I stated earlier is pretty easy to ignore on the TOTL IEMs I've tried it with.) The hissing might give the perception that the sound seems a little "dirtier" though when compared to the dead-silent Duet; and along with being more 'spacious' sounding than the Duet, the details aren't as "pushed" in-your-face on the Rx MkIII-B+ as the Duet tends to present details (especially mids details.) At times I've found the Duet to sound just a tad-bit "grainy" at times even too due to this.
  
 Overall, I enjoy both amps, but I prefer the Rx MkIII-B+s more "fun" sound-signature/spacious sound-signature for my uses in general. This is not to say I don't enjoy the Duet (as the clarity and detail/mids-focus can be enjoyable also) due to being hiss-less among other things, though. I guess it's just as a personal-preference that I still favor the Rx MkIII-B+ even with low-impedance/high-sensitivity TOTL IEMs slightly more than the Duet.


----------



## oriise

refault said:


> Thanks for your response oriise. I'm glad to get some feedback on my impressions in-between the Rx MkIII B+ and the Duet so far, .
> 
> With regards to the hissing, I'd say the hiss on the Duet is practically non-existent with my sensitive/low-impedance IEMs (K3003i and IE800 both exhibit a fairly black background and quiet soundfloor with the Duet.) Of course the K3003is and IE800s exhibit hissing (or a slightly "raised" soundfloor/not as "black" background) with the Rx MkIII B+, but as I said earlier it isn't that bothersome once you get used to the sound signature of the amp, and the hiss shouldn't get in-the-way at all while listening to music or watching movies on both IEMs with the ALO amp.
> 
> ...


 

 Refault,
  
 Thanks a bunch. Very helpful. I am now leaning towards the ALO. Just a couple of final questions - how would you characterize the differences over the Duet on 1/ the degree of difference in width and depth to the soundstage 2/ high frequency detail/extension and 3/ the amount of ambient cues/wetness/reverb trails? Though I like the Duet on some level, I find it somewhat closed in on soundstaging, have darker/subdued highs and loosing some ambient cues that I would hear on my home rig. If you feel the ALO bests the Duet to a noticeable degree in any or ideally all of these areas, I would be willing to deal with some hiss to get there. Looking forward to your thoughts here. Thanks, Ole.


----------



## DucatiMatt

Will these drive the beyerdynamic T1 decently?


----------



## maricius

ducatimatt said:


> Will these drive the beyerdynamic T1 decently?


 
  
 Will they drive them? For sure. Decently? That's up to you to decide but it is one of the top portable amps currently being sold


----------



## DucatiMatt

Thanks I'll try them out


----------



## palermo

Looks nice, more IEM user friendly, smaller footprint, longer battery life too. I think Cypher labs need to build another CLAS without extra balance output.  
 Quote:


maricius said:


> Is anyone gonna volunteer to make a AlgoRhythm Picollo thread or is it too early? I'm honestly quite excited to how'd they sound compared to the Duet for sensitive headphones and IEMs


----------



## maricius

I think Cypher Labs should build a new CLAS PERIOD. The sound quality is still good but with the advent of the CCK and newer tech, CL's biggest selling point, iDevice integration, is seeming less and less important. Also, I believe the newcomers such as the RL Herus, iDSD Nano, Geek Out, are already comparable in sound quality.


----------



## LFC_SL

"Belief" is not the same as basing upon personal demo and if you have not heard it then you should avoid commenting

It is true if Apple continue to allow digital audio out via cck then mfi certification is not important and a manufacturer need only concentrate on power management

In my demo of Herus and clas dB side by side the CL device is still class above


----------



## maricius

lfc_sl said:


> "Belief" is not the same as basing upon personal demo and if you have not heard it then you should avoid commenting


 
  
 My apologies as I'm merely sharing the possibility. Sound is subjective of course and I find even the DACport LX to be comparable than the CLAS -dB…


----------



## LFC_SL

That's not what my post meant. This is an influential forum and people spend large sums of money based on the forum advice. Nothing personal but your post did not read like personal experience. By all means please say more if based on your own listening!


----------



## AnakChan

maricius said:


> Is anyone gonna volunteer to make a AlgoRhythm Picollo thread or is it too early? I'm honestly quite excited to how'd they sound compared to the Duet for sensitive headphones and IEMs


 
  
 I've started one :-

 http://www.head-fi.org/t/724709/cypherlabs-algorhythm-picollo-impressions-thread
  
 Includes unboxing too but I'm running out for dinner so no time to test it.


----------



## rudi0504

Please try it Duet Amps as double amping :
SQ is incredible , No distorsion


----------



## midnightwalker

It looks like triple amps to me


----------



## maricius

If only I had the spare cash to get another Duet…


----------



## rudi0504

midnightwalker said:


> It looks like triple amps to me :blink:




Thank you 
You are right , if you account The amp Section on AK 100 Gold , these are 3 amping


----------



## rudi0504

maricius said:


> If only I had the spare cash to get another Duet…




If you have chance please try it First before you buy another Duet

Please read My impression below 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/716203/please-share-your-opinion-and-impression-with-double-amping-in-your-portable-rigs


----------



## maricius

rudi0504 said:


> If you have chance please try it First before you buy another Duet
> 
> Please read My impression below
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/716203/please-share-your-opinion-and-impression-with-double-amping-in-your-portable-rigs




Yes Rudi!! I actually visited your thread just last night!! Interesting concept. I think it would be like tube amp where very slight distortion but more enjoyable sound


----------



## rudi0504

maricius said:


> Yes Rudi!! I actually visited your thread just last night!! Interesting concept. I think it would be like tube amp where very slight distortion but more enjoyable sound




Hi Mericius 
If you like Tube pre amp , please buy Wagnus Tube pre amp Valvola , you Will like it , Valvola is pure Tube pre amp 1 :1 No volume control


----------



## maricius

rudi0504 said:


> Hi Mericius
> If you like Tube pre amp , please buy Wagnus Tube pre amp Valvola , you Will like it , Valvola is pure Tube pre amp 1 :1 No volume control


 
  
 I mean to say double amping is like tube amp!! Double amping may have slight distortion like how tube amps have slight distortion but also more euphonic sound quality
  
 Also, I cannot buy Wagnus Valvola as I'm saving my money for iFi micro iDSD DAC/amp and HiFiMan HE-560. You should really look at it too!! I think Cypher Labs will have new competition… maybe even Chord Hugo will have competition. 
  
 Rudi, please check it out
  
 http://ifi-audio.com/portfolio-view/micro-idsd/
  
 http://www.technoheadphone.com/amplifier-dac/dac/ifi-audio-micro-idsd-features/
  
 I hope my Duet won't become useless once I get this.


----------



## rudi0504

maricius said:


> I mean to say double amping is like tube amp!! Double amping may have slight distortion like how tube amps have slight distortion but also more euphonic sound quality
> 
> Also, I cannot buy Wagnus Valvola as I'm saving my money for iFi micro iDSD DAC/amp and HiFiMan HE-560. You should really look at it too!! I think Cypher Labs will have new competition… maybe even Chord Hugo will have competition.
> 
> ...




Thank you maricius and noted 

I havent heard ifi micro iDSD , but i heard at Stereo Singapore non micro ifi

I Dont Think you Will let Your Duet Go


----------



## kh600rr

I just want to give a shout out and say thanks to David Maudlin at Cypher Labs. I had a issue with my Duet, and David immediately responded to my emails, and ended up replacing my unit, for a new one. Great Amp, better customer service..


----------



## AnakChan

kh600rr said:


> I just want to give a shout out and say thanks to David Maudlin at Cypher Labs. I had a issue with my Duet, and David immediately responded to my emails, and ended up replacing my unit, for a new one. Great Amp, better customer service..


 
  
 +1. Same here. My Duet had one channel getting cut out in balanced (but fine in SE) and he replaced it immediately.


----------



## midnightwalker

kh600rr said:


> I just want to give a shout out and say thanks to David Maudlin at Cypher Labs. I had a issue with my Duet, and David immediately responded to my emails, and ended up replacing my unit, for a new one. Great Amp, better customer service..


 
  
 hehe I do not feel surprised with that as Cypher Labs always provide the 1st customer service.


----------



## LFC_SL

anakchan said:


> +1. Same here. My Duet had one channel getting cut out in balanced (but fine in SE) and he replaced it immediately.



Sorry if you posted before but you used to pair mk3b with clas dB. Now you rock the duet. What differences? No opportunity to demo alo in UK  (shame as product line really interesting)


----------



## AnakChan

lfc_sl said:


> Sorry if you posted before but you used to pair mk3b with clas dB. Now you rock the duet. What differences? No opportunity to demo alo in UK
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sadly I can't respond to this 'cos I had them separately and never listened to them side-by-side. I sold my Rx Mk3 to another member, and months later got the Duet. The only thing I can say for certain is that the Duet has a lower noise floor. Aside from that, I honestly can't remember the SQ differences (aside from the Rx Mk3's bass knob).


----------



## journey2nirvana

Help please, no local shop here has the HE-500 on hand.
  
Can the CL Duet power the HE-500 with no compromises or run them with authority in other words.
Plan on buying the HE-500 in a few weeks
  
Chain will be Laptop > CLAS -db > Duet > HE-500 
  
Thanks in advance for your help guys.


----------



## midnightwalker

journey2nirvana said:


> Chain will be Laptop > CLAS -db > Duet > HE-500


 
  
 I don't see any problem with that. The DUET has enough power to drive the HE500.


----------



## journey2nirvana

midnightwalker said:


> I don't see any problem with that. The DUET has enough power to drive the HE500.


 
  
 Thanks! 
  
 Will be adopting an HE-500 soon.


----------



## maricius

Just out of curiosity, does the Duet feature an op-amp or is it fully discrete?


----------



## Schopenhauer

Would anyone mind sharing impressions of the Duet paired with the K712, LCD-2 (Fazor), T90 and, although it was brought up a few posts ago, the HE-500? Phenomenologically rich descriptions are preferred!


----------



## NuClear235

I am interested about construction of Duet too!


----------



## Schopenhauer

schopenhauer said:


> Would anyone mind sharing impressions of the Duet paired with the K712, LCD-2 (Fazor), T90 and, although it was brought up a few posts ago, the HE-500? Phenomenologically rich descriptions are preferred!


 
 Thread's dead?


----------



## AnakChan

schopenhauer said:


> Thread's dead?


 
  
 I guess no one (active) here has the K712, LCD-2, T90, nor HE-500 with the Duet. It's a pity, I think the CLAS/Duet rigs are a blast but doesnt' get as much love as it deserves.


----------



## Schopenhauer

anakchan said:


> I guess no one (active) here has the K712, LCD-2, T90, nor HE-500 with the Duet. It's a pity, I think the CLAS/Duet rigs are a blast but doesnt' get as much love as it deserves.




It really is a pity. I'll read around and see if I can find the relevant testimonials. I'm just curious if it offers sound (roughly) on the level of hifi stay at home systems.


----------



## tracyca

I also agree, I Love my solo db & duet rig! I only rock IEM and I honestly can say Cypher Labs delivers top of the class products! I recently purchace the new AK100 ii and for its size it is great but to me it don't come close to my Cypher Labs stack! First Class sound and top notch construction.


----------



## journey2nirvana

Yes Cypher Labs CLAS + CL Duet = 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 i am very happy with them, if it can help other's they sound amazing with V-Moda XS, V-Moda M100 & LCD X.
  
 They are more than capable to drive your music with the head phones i have owned (can't say for other headphones that i don't have experience) as a transportable rig with out missing your desktop Rig.
  
 MY desk top rig is LapTop > X-Sabre > Burson Soloist > Headphones (my baseline vs CLAS + Duet)
  
 i was just not sure with the HE-500 even if my experience is good with the LCD X. 
  
 my plan is LCD x at home and HE-500 @ the office.
  
midnightwalker confirmed that Laptop > CLAS > CL Duet > HE 500 would be fine or he did not see any problems.
  
 so now i am saving up for a HE-500 or might just go for a HE-560 still deciding.
  
 if i cant try them out for myself yes i trust others opinions here at the forum, they have lead me in the right so far


----------



## Schopenhauer

journey2nirvana said:


> Yes Cypher Labs CLAS + CL Duet =
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Excellent, thanks. I might pull the trigger on a Duet in the next few weeks. If so, I'll let you know how it pairs with the HE-500. But I just heard/read somewhere that the HE-500 was discontinued. I need to confirm this. In any event, I've heard great things about the Soloist + HE-500 pairing. So you might be covered either way.


----------



## LFC_SL

http://hifiman.com/Products/?pid=197


----------



## Schopenhauer

lfc_sl said:


> http://hifiman.com/Products/?pid=197


 
 Go on.


----------



## delrosa81

anakchan said:


> I guess no one (active) here has the K712, LCD-2, T90, nor HE-500 with the Duet. It's a pity, I think the CLAS/Duet rigs are a blast but doesnt' get as much love as it deserves.


 

 It seems to me cypher labs products don really get much love.....even the Picollo, I posted in the thread and nobody responded at all........


----------



## LFC_SL

schopenhauer said:


> Go on.



Have not demo HE560 yet so cannot help beyond drawing it to your attention. Several threads on the forum. Also be aware HiFiman have refreshed new HE400i


----------



## zeppu08

Anyone who uses the Duet to power the very hungry alpha dogs?


----------



## journey2nirvana

delrosa81 said:


> It seems to me cypher labs products don really get much love.....even the Picollo, I posted in the thread and nobody responded at all........




They got my love CLAS -db & CL Duet sound amazing. 

Hugo might be the only audio bling that passes them in sound quality in the portable world but they cost way more $$$


----------



## LFC_SL

That may depend on market and amp pairing. In the UK Clas -dB + plus a decent portable amp would run you £1k. It's not 'that' much a further savings leap to the Hugo


----------



## delrosa81

journey2nirvana said:


> They got my love CLAS -db & CL Duet sound amazing.
> 
> Hugo might be the only audio bling that passes them in sound quality in the portable world but they cost way more $$$




I like cypher labs products too. Just got the Picollo recently and looking forward to getting more products. 



lfc_sl said:


> That may depend on market and amp pairing. In the UK Clas -dB + plus a decent portable amp would run you £1k. It's not 'that' much a further savings leap to the Hugo




Yup you are right, combined they run very close to the Hugo but it does not mean Hugo is better absolutely. I have the Hugo and I would also like to own the Cypher labs combo dac/amp too. Cypher labs make pretty good products.


----------



## maricius




----------



## zeppu08

maricius said:


>




NOW THIS IS WHAT IM LOOKING FOR!

How was the pairing? Also eye-ing for this combo to pair with my V6-Stage and alphadogs/dt1350..


----------



## maricius

zeppu08 said:


> NOW THIS IS WHAT IM LOOKING FOR!
> 
> How was the pairing? Also eye-ing for this combo to pair with my V6-Stage and alphadogs/dt1350..


 
  
 The pairing looks great, sounds great. Ample power that can be a little too much for my FAD Heaven VI unless I lower the digital volume control of the line out (which would make the DX90 not BitPerfect anymore. Sound impressions are neutral and very slightly dark, great bass impact. Treble is slightly toned down due to the Duet but the sound is not warm at all. Soundstage and imaging is amazing.
  
 I could honestly live with this setup with my Fidelio L2 if I hadn't heard iFi Audio's micro iDSD which is a little more intimate and very very analog sounding. The reason I'm actually giving this pairing a chance is because I might sell my Duet if I no longer see a use for it. DX90's coaxial out to the micro iDSD is very satisfying not to mention more powerful yet more flexible with sensitive IEMs.


----------



## quluman

So Algorhythm Duet is just Theorem without the DAC unit ? 
  
 Am I correct?


----------



## zeppu08

maricius said:


> The pairing looks great, sounds great. Ample power that can be a little too much for my FAD Heaven VI unless I lower the digital volume control of the line out (which would make the DX90 not BitPerfect anymore. Sound impressions are neutral and very slightly dark, great bass impact. Treble is slightly toned down due to the Duet but the sound is not warm at all. Soundstage and imaging is amazing.
> 
> I could honestly live with this setup with my Fidelio L2 if I hadn't heard iFi Audio's micro iDSD which is a little more intimate and very very analog sounding. The reason I'm actually giving this pairing a chance is because I might sell my Duet if I no longer see a use for it. DX90's coaxial out to the micro iDSD is very satisfying not to mention more powerful yet more flexible with sensitive IEMs.




Thanks for the feedback! Im also thinking of the iDSD but i guess its not that portable? If you need to choose one combo, the iDSD or Duet?

Btw, can you post a pic with the dx90 stack to the iDSD.. Just want to see how it will look..


----------



## maricius

zeppu08 said:


> Thanks for the feedback! Im also thinking of the iDSD but i guess its not that portable? If you need to choose one combo, the iDSD or Duet?
> 
> Btw, can you post a pic with the dx90 stack to the iDSD.. Just want to see how it will look..




If I'm truly going portable, I wouldn't attach the DX90 to anything external…unless for long distance travelling. That's why I bought the DX90 in the first place. If I had to choose, I'd honestly pick the iDSD unless you're into a more neutral sound with colder timbre. 

I'll try to post some pictures when I get home but maybe the pictures here may be to your satisfiaction

http://pdfserver.macusers.nl/reviews/van-klanten-voor-klanten/J-Dam.pdf


----------



## ddaktiv

Is this thread still relevant? Actually how do you guys like your duet so far? Any issues? Wondering are you all using the balanced out?


----------



## raelamb

The Duet/ - db is my go- to combo and I am using it balanced all the way through. It is positively sublime


----------



## onlychild

I'm getting mine tomorrow and will do a short comparison with rx mk3b+ and rsa f-35 using balanced out of my rwak240+ with Roxannes and hd650


----------



## PCWar

Same configuration and same impressions from me, too. Absolutely perfect bottom end, full, deep and punchy. I'm finding bass perfect on the Duet. Mids are sweet and perfectly balanced to the low end and highs are just that bit recessed to sound not fatiguing especially for long listening sessions.The other impressive aspect of the Duet is soundstage especially depth and instrument separation. Again here, the weight of the lowest notes contributes a lot to the naturalness of the presentation imho.
  
  
  
 Another thing I've noticed is that on every upgrade of the solo db / Duet stack sound quality keeps improving. Meaning...
  
  
 Solo db + Silver Dragon RSA RSA + Duet + Tralucent 1Plus2 Balanced
  
 >
  
 Solo db + Silver Dragon RSA RSA + Duet + Tralucent 1Plus2 SE
  
 >
  
 Solo db + Mini to Mini SE + Duet + Tralucent 1Plus2 SE
  
  
 Again, improvement is mainly noted on soundstage width and separation. One cannot distinguish that the 1P2 are just iems when running fully balanced. They sound like a TOTL full-size. I would go as long as saying that they sound fuller than the HD800 due to them going deeper in the lowest notes.


----------



## SounDFeVeR

Bump .
  
 Waitng for mini review comparison of onlychild's rig.


----------



## onlychild

Had to send the Duet back to Cypherlabs to get the case fixed. Just got the amp back yesterday. Will spend the weekend listening to it and the other amps I have. Mini review will probably be up sometime late next week.

Thx


----------



## ddaktiv

onlychild said:


> Had to send the Duet back to Cypherlabs to get the case fixed. Just got the amp back yesterday. Will spend the weekend listening to it and the other amps I have. Mini review will probably be up sometime late next week.
> 
> Thx




What happened to the case? Anyone using an Ak240 here paired w duet using balanced cable? It seems redundant but I wanna know what's your impression on the sound like?
I'm asking coz seems with balanced on the ak240 the soundstage feels smaller than on the 3.5..


----------



## eargasmo22

can someone make comparison between the 02 and cypher labs duet? It would be very helpful. Thanks!


----------



## axax

Hi everbody,
  
 My tralucent cable is not single ended it is rsa balanced.So I will have a duet.I will use it my ak100II.I am waiting it.According to your experiences how is it affect sound quality ? Bas,mid,treble,soundstage etc...


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

Hi all,
  
 Anybody found the best IEM for the Duet ? 
  
 I am considering either Shure SE530 or Westone 4R's running from balanced connector ! 
  
 My Duet is balanced linked to my Cypher Labs Solo db


----------



## Ultrainferno

There is no best, there might be a "best for you" though


----------



## jastone

Hi guys,

After a lot of research I have decided to purchase a set of LCD XCs and a Cypher Labs Duet to run off my AK 120II.

Does anybody have any advice as to cables as I want to run fully balanced AK to amp, amp to LCDs and have no idea what I need. I've never seen a mini 4pin connection like that before. 

Thanks in advance and sorry if I'm asking a stupid question!


----------



## AnakChan

For the Kobiconn connector amp side, it should be as below :-
  

  
 For your LCD-XC side you may wanna ask the Audeze chaps.


----------



## jastone

Thanks for reply, yeah I put a post on the Audeze LCD XC thread but so far no joy. Anyway this helps so thanks


----------



## AnakChan

jastone said:


> Thanks for reply, yeah I put a post on the Audeze LCD XC thread but so far no joy. Anyway this helps so thanks


 
  
 Errr, I actually meant mailing the Audeze support.


----------



## jastone

Lol, sorry, but no worries, I have found the Moon Audio site and they sell the equipment and necessary cables so I will order direct from them. Thanks anyway


----------



## Poimandres

Is this amp neutral? Does anyone have hiss with jh13 pro fp's?


----------



## raelamb

Duet is sublime and no hiss with my JH-16 fp.


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

Duet is a great portable amp that drives my HD800's, HD650's and Westone 4R all fully balanced with great authority.  
  
 Have it linked to the Cypher Labs db DAC with ALO Audio balanced kobicon cable which makes a fantastic portable package and great value for money.


----------



## Poimandres

Sweet, I ordered the packaged combo with the balanced cable and bag. 

How does the stack compare against desktop rigs in the same price range?


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

poimandres said:


> Sweet, I ordered the packaged combo with the balanced cable and bag.
> 
> How does the stack compare against desktop rigs in the same price range?


 

 Very comparable. 
  
 In fact at last weeks Cambridge UK meet both myself and other HeadFier's stated that it sounded a lot better than very expensive desk top amps when powering the HD800's ! 
  
 For the money and that it is also portable I think it is hard to beat.  Would rather have this rig than a AK240 costing a lot more as I have also heard the AK240 in balanced mode !


----------



## Poimandres

Thanks. That gets me stoked, I can't wait to receive it. I may cancel my order for the LC.


----------



## PCWar

I confirm that it is an excellent combo and matches perfectly the HD800 imho. You'll gone love it.


----------



## Poimandres

Thanks, I will be pairing them with my jh13fp's and my senn hd650's. 

 Bonesy where did you get your balanced cable for your 650's or did you build your own?


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

poimandres said:


> Thanks, I will be pairing them with my jh13fp's and my senn hd650's.
> 
> Bonesy where did you get your balanced cable for your 650's or did you build your own?


 

 Hi Poimandres,
 I bought my Moon Audio Silver cable from a fellow headfi.org member.   It is the type with a mini XLR connector (like the connectors fitted to Audeze headphones) at the bottom which allows you to fit any type of connector adaptor to it i.e. kobicon balanced connector, double XLR, single XLR, 1/4" jack etc.  
  
 As the HD650's are a tad dark and the Cypher Labs Duet is a touch warm I would recommend you go for a silver based cable. 
  
 The difference between the stock HD650 cable with a standard jack connected to an adapter to fit the Duet and my Moon Audio Silver cable with balanced connector is like night and day with everything i.e. music clarity more bass, bigger soundstage, more power etc.


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

bonesy jonesy said:


> Hi Poimandres,
> I bought my Moon Audio Silver cable from a fellow headfi.org member.   It is the type with a mini XLR connector (like the connectors fitted to Audeze headphones) at the bottom which allows you to fit any type of connector adaptor to it i.e. kobicon balanced connector, double XLR, single XLR, 1/4" jack etc.
> 
> As the HD650's are a tad dark and the Cypher Labs Duet is a touch warm I would recommend you go for a silver based cable.
> ...


 

 My cable is a Moon Audio Silver Dragon.
  
 The cable has 3 parts:
 1. xlr3 / mini xlr (1 feet)
 2. mini / mini xlr (10 feet)
 3. mini xlr / HD650 connectors (1 feet).
  
 So when you change headphones it is easy to change the cable. 
  
 Here are some pics.
  

  

  

  
 Its a great cable which as well as desk top rigs is also ok for portable use as the cable is very flexible (although mine is very long).


----------



## Poimandres

Thanks,
  I am tinkering with the idea of making a balanced cable for the 650's out of the stock cable.  I purchased the kobiconn connectors from digikey.
  
 I must say I am blown away by the duet/db combo straight out of the box (after fully charged first of course).  It is completely dead silent with my JH13 FP's, single ended to the phones.  JRiver, wasapi, bit depth to auto.....not too sure on JRiver settings very new to it.  Utilizing the balanced kobiconn cable from Cypher Labs from the dB to the Duet.  We know how our sonic memory serves us, with that I will say that I am unable to recall enjoying my music this much.  Absolutely incredible.


----------



## PCWar

Yes, that's one hell of a combo. I personally use it with a pair of Tralucent Ref 1 with Uber cable and it feels like high end full size cans.


----------



## Poimandres

onlychild said:


> Had to send the Duet back to Cypherlabs to get the case fixed. Just got the amp back yesterday. Will spend the weekend listening to it and the other amps I have. Mini review will probably be up sometime late next week.
> 
> Thx



What happened to the case?


----------



## onlychild

There were gaps between the front and back plates and the maint part. Light from the front LEDs would also shine through the top. 

Cypher Labs replaced the case with a perfect unit free of charge, even after mentioning I purchased it used from Head-fi.


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

onlychild said:


> There were gaps between the front and back plates and the maint part. Light from the front LEDs would also shine through the top.
> 
> *Cypher Labs replaced the case with a perfect unit free of charge, even after mentioning I purchased it used from Head-fi.*


 
  
 Yes,  David from Cypher Labs did the same for me with a faulty DAC.   A great company.   Hope they are coming to London CanJam in August with their big tube amp.  Looks amazing.


----------



## Poimandres

They replaced with a brand new factory sealed unit?


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

poimandres said:


> They replaced with a brand new factory sealed unit?


 

 Not sure but it was a later more recent serial number.   Believe Cypher Labs had some issues with the earlier db DAC's !


----------



## Poimandres

You can't beat their customer service, David is a great guy.  Currently enjoying the 650's single ended with the CLAS Stack (CLASS).  The kobiconn connectors that I ordered through digi key came in and I think I will try my hand at re-terminating the stock 650 cable to balanced.


----------



## AnakChan

The CLAS stack is still a very good setup but it's largely overshadowed by the newer components like Hugo & Flow.


----------



## Poimandres

Well there will always be something newer.....I think this is my end game.....for a while at least.


----------



## Bonesy Jonesy

anakchan said:


> The CLAS stack is still a very good setup but it's largely overshadowed by the newer components like Hugo & Flow.


 

 I think the  Cypher Labs db DAC and Duet amp both running fully balanced sounds better than the Hugo having heard the Hugo with HD800's and LCD3's and I am a big Chord Electronics fan !


----------



## x RELIC x

bonesy jonesy said:


> I think the  Cypher Labs db DAC and Duet amp both running fully balanced sounds better than the Hugo having heard the Hugo with HD800's and LCD3's and I am a big Chord Electronics fan !




That's a mighty big statement!


----------



## Poimandres

I have never heard the Hugo however I wouldn't have a hard time believing it. 

The CLAS Stack definitely is top shelf in terms of both build and sound quality, it surpasses anything I have previously owned. I can't remember ever enjoying music this much.


----------



## Poimandres

maricius said:


> Just out of curiosity, does the Duet feature an op-amp or is it fully discrete?



It is not discreet and uses an op amp.


----------



## Poimandres

I must say as great as the Duet and the HD650 sound single ended, it sounds even better balanced.  I unsuccessfully tried to upgrade my stock hd650 cable and ended up purchasing a silver plated copper kobiconn balanced cable from Ted.  Completely floored by the sound, I suspect it is more to do with the fact that I am balanced and have additional power than because of the silver plated copper.  The cable however is great, I only wish that the outer sheathing was black, I will get used to the tan though 
  
 Dire Straits has never sounded so f'n good, time to re-discover all of my redbooks!  Kudos to David at Cypher Labs and also Ted at headphone lounge!


----------



## AnakChan

poimandres said:


> I must say as great as the Duet and the HD650 sound single ended, it sounds even better balanced.  I unsuccessfully tried to upgrade my stock hd650 cable and ended up purchasing a silver plated copper kobiconn balanced cable from Ted.  Completely floored by the sound, I suspect it is more to do with the fact that I am balanced and have additional power than because of the silver plated copper.  The cable however is great, I only wish that the outer sheathing was black, I will get used to the tan though
> 
> Dire Straits has never sounded so f'n good, time to re-discover all of my redbooks!  Kudos to David at Cypher Labs and also Ted at headphone lounge!


 


 What did you have before your Duet?


----------



## Poimandres

Quite a bit all single ended though. Check my signature.


----------



## Poimandres

Does the duet have enough power in balanced mode for the alpha primes?


----------



## FiJAAS

So I plan to get the duet and -dB to pair with my ipc. Would the Beyerdynamic 1350 be a great headphone to start off with it?


----------



## Ultrainferno

Imo the DT1350 doesn't really need the Duet, but it's an excellent setup for later full sized headphones


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## FiJAAS

ultrainferno said:


> Imo the DT1350 doesn't really need the Duet, but it's an excellent setup for later full sized headphones




Oh okay. I plan to get a pair of Audeze later in the year. What's a good full sized starter headphone around $250 that would pair well with the setup? Closed back would be great.


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## Poimandres

Stretch a little and go open, grab the hd600 or 650's. Stretch a little more and stay closed and take advantage of the mr speakers sale on the alpha dogs or alpha primes.


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## Ultrainferno

Or the EL8s


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## FiJAAS

poimandres said:


> Stretch a little and go open, grab the hd600 or 650's. Stretch a little more and stay closed and take advantage of the mr speakers sale on the alpha dogs or alpha primes.







ultrainferno said:


> Or the EL8s




Thanks, I was interested in the 1350 for the portability and would purchase a full sized can for home use. I'll look into the 600, 650 and the EL-8.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

fijaas said:


> Thanks, I was interested in the 1350 for the portability and would purchase a full sized can for home use. I'll look into the 600, 650 and the EL-8.


 

 I ran 1350's from my Duet single ended.  Nice sound but found a good quality IEM i.e. Westone 4R with balanced cable sounds far better.   Regarding larger headphones try and go balanced to get the best out of the Duet.   HD650's & LCD2's V2 nice although a bit dark.  The HD800's sound great through the Duet.


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## FiJAAS

bonesy jonesy said:


> I ran 1350's from my Duet single ended.  Nice sound but found a good quality IEM i.e. Westone 4R with balanced cable sounds far better.   Regarding larger headphones try and go balanced to get the best out of the Duet.   HD650's & LCD2's V2 nice although a bit dark.  The HD800's sound great through the Duet.




I'm not really a fan of iems, I prefer on or over the ear. I'm thinking the HD650 will complete my needs, the HD800 are a little pricey for me.

How is the bass on the HD650? I listen to a lot of music that requires a good thumping.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

fijaas said:


> I'm not really a fan of iems, I prefer on or over the ear. I'm thinking the HD650 will complete my needs, the HD800 are a little pricey for me.
> 
> How is the bass on the HD650? I listen to a lot of music that requires a good thumping.


 

 Bass is good on the HD650's if the recording has it of course.  The HD650's are far superior to the 1350's in all accounts (music and comfort) and you may find yourself trying to find opportunities to use them instead of the 1350's.  
  
 One issue I had with the 1350's was comfort as they sit on the ears not over them or in them.  The other is to have them modified for a balanced cable.  I think there are better headphones out there for the Duet.  I prefer my WR4's to the 1350's for comfort, lightness, portability and sound. 
  
 Make sure any headphone you connect to the Duet is balanced as some headphones with high impedances are far superior balanced than single ended across all the sound frequencies.


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## Skyfall

I was wondering if there's anyone own both Intruder and Duets and how they compare. A brief impression mentioned at Headfonia : " even compare to Intruder Duets feels like a breath of fresh air "


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## racer11

the chips look outdated and i doubt they can rival newer models from competitors.


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## AnakChan

Actually choice of chips play a little part of the whole story. Design behind the chips play s big part.


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## Skyfall

I've been enjoying Intruder and I think it is such a fantastic portable amp when using balance with AK120II. 
I also own Rx3+ and I want to know if if Duets will be an upgrade or just a different flavor.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

skyfall said:


> I've been enjoying Intruder and I think it is such a fantastic portable amp when using balance with AK120II.
> I also own Rx3+ and I want to know if if Duets will be an upgrade or just a different flavor.


 

 I have the Rx3 and Duet and for high impedance headphones (110ohm + )  Duet is a better amp.   For low to medium impedance headphones there isn't a lot of difference except the Rx3 can give a bit more bass with the additional bass gain knob.


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## refault

bonesy jonesy said:


> I have the Rx3 and Duet and for high impedance headphones (110ohm + )  Duet is a better amp.   For low to medium impedance headphones there isn't a lot of difference except the Rx3 can give a bit more bass with the additional bass gain knob.


 

 I agree with this... when combined with the Sennheiser HD650s (balanced), I find the ALO Rx Mk3-B+ to sound a little distant, with mediocre soundstaging and imaging, being overall a generally boring sound-signature (with or without the bass-gain knob turned on.) However, when listening to the HD650s out of my Duet, the soundstage and imaging become quite impressive and expansive, making the overall sound-signature of the HD650+Duet pair quite fun to listen to.
  
 With lower impedance IEMs like the Sennheiser IE800, the Rx Mk3-B+ does have a noticable background hiss, but I found the sound-signature to be a little more enjoyable than the Duet, although the Duet beats the Rx Mk3-B+ in terms of detail retrieval and imaging to a slight extent, probably stemming from the Rx Mk3-B+'s high noise-floor with lower impedance, high-sensitivity IEMs. Generally, however, I've been using my Duet a lot more than the Rx Mk3-B+ these days, both with my IEMs (the lack of background hiss/raised noise-floor is nice) and higher impedance headphones (e.g., Sennheiser HD650.)


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## Bonesy Jonesy

refault said:


> I agree with this... when combined with the Sennheiser HD650s (balanced), I find the ALO Rx Mk3-B+ to sound a little distant, with mediocre soundstaging and imaging, being overall a generally boring sound-signature (with or without the bass-gain knob turned on.) However, when listening to the HD650s out of my Duet, the soundstage and imaging become quite impressive and expansive, making the overall sound-signature of the HD650+Duet pair quite fun to listen to.
> 
> With lower impedance IEMs like the Sennheiser IE800, the Rx Mk3-B+ does have a noticable background hiss, but I found the sound-signature to be a little more enjoyable than the Duet, although the Duet beats the Rx Mk3-B+ in terms of detail retrieval and imaging to a slight extent, probably stemming from the Rx Mk3-B+'s high noise-floor with lower impedance, high-sensitivity IEMs. Generally, however, I've been using my Duet a lot more than the Rx Mk3-B+ these days, both with my IEMs (the lack of background hiss/raised noise-floor is nice) and higher impedance headphones (e.g., Sennheiser HD650.)


 

 ++A


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## Skyfall

Thanks guys. 
The way you describe it sounds like Intruder should be on par with Duet with it's black background and super low noise floor. 
However, Rx3+ has a bit wider sound stage than Intruder though. 
Trio might be fun to have.


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## Superpong

Hi

I just got Duet and wonder how it detects balanced and unbalanced input signal. 
I use AK100II and have unbalanced (3.5mm) and balanced (ALO/RSA) headphone. 

I will buy 2.5mm balanced to RSA/ALO cable for Duet but I'm curious how or will Duet work efficiently in following scenarios? 

Unbalanced input -> Unbalanced headphone
Unbalanced input -> Balanced headphone
Balanced input -> Unbalanced headphone

Does Duet utilize all channels (R+,R-,L+,L-) in its circuit?


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## PCWar

Just an up for this wonderful amp. It had kept me company longer than all my other amps for a reason.


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## cscales

Hi All. I was looking for a possibly more appropriate thread to post this, but decided it was best to ask CL fans. I have an HD800 coming and have settled on CL for amping. I see Picollo, Duet and Theorem as the top 3 choices. Any thoughts? Due to compatibility issues with my Samsung Tab S, the dac in the Theorem may be irrelevent for my purposes, and I would use it purely as an amp. Anyone care to chime in with a vote? They all appear to have enough juice to drive the 800s, correct? Thanks in advance!


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## AnakChan

cscales said:


> Hi All. I was looking for a possibly more appropriate thread to post this, but decided it was best to ask CL fans. I have an HD800 coming and have settled on CL for amping. I see Picollo, Duet and Theorem as the top 3 choices. Any thoughts? Due to compatibility issues with my Samsung Tab S, the dac in the Theorem may be irrelevent for my purposes, and I would use it purely as an amp. Anyone care to chime in with a vote? They all appear to have enough juice to drive the 800s, correct? Thanks in advance!


 
  
 They all do. Actually in my sig you'll see there's another CL amp you didn't mention, which is the Trio. Out of all CL amps I have with me (Duet, Theorem, Trio, Picollo), I think my personal favourite is still the Duet. However I'm driving all off them from the CLAS -dB usually (and more recently trying out the AK380 as the transport/source). The HD800 I have at the moment belongs to @Currawong.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

cscales said:


> Hi All. I was looking for a possibly more appropriate thread to post this, but decided it was best to ask CL fans. I have an HD800 coming and have settled on CL for amping. I see Picollo, Duet and Theorem as the top 3 choices. Any thoughts? Due to compatibility issues with my Samsung Tab S, the dac in the Theorem may be irrelevent for my purposes, and I would use it purely as an amp. Anyone care to chime in with a vote? They all appear to have enough juice to drive the 800s, correct? Thanks in advance!


 

 The Duet hands down.   I run my HD800's from the Duet's balanced connection.   With the Cypher Labs AlgoRhythm Solo dB DAC balanced connected to the Duet it sounds fantastic.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

anakchan said:


> They all do. Actually in my sig you'll see there's another CL amp you didn't mention, which is the Trio. Out of all CL amps I have with me (Duet, Theorem, Trio, Picollo), *I think my personal favourite is still the Duet. *However I'm driving all off them from the CLAS -dB usually (and more recently trying out the AK380 as the transport/source). The HD800 I have at the moment belongs to @Currawong.


 

 A+


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## jaibautista

Apologies for necroposting but I believe this is the proper thread where I can post my query.
  
 I'm a proud owner of a CL Duet that I got second-hand a couple of months back. I'm currently using it with a Senn HD600 (and eventually with a HifiMan HE400i that I got via the BF sale). At the back of my mind, though, I am thinking if I will be better served with a dedicated desktop amp, such as the Lake People G109-A. I know that the CL Duet performs an admirable job driving the HD600 (and I've already tried demoing the HE400i with it and I enjoyed how the pair sounded) but is there a significant "performance jump" from the CL Duet to the G109-A?
  
 Thanks in advance to whoever is going to answer my query.


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## Hi-Fi'er

Greetings,
  
 I have Cypherlabs setup. SInce this is old stuff was wondering if there is better. My setup is IPOD LOD>Cypherlabs -R>AlgoRhythm Duet with various IEM's and headphones. Was wondering if a Fiio X5ii is better to replace all the Cypherlabs and the IPOD? I don't care about portability etc, just if the Fiio would sound better with the same ALAC files that are now on the IPOD. 
  
 Thanks in advance.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

hi-fi'er said:


> Greetings,
> 
> I have Cypherlabs setup. SInce this is old stuff was wondering if there is better. My setup is IPOD LOD>Cypherlabs -R>AlgoRhythm Duet with various IEM's and headphones. Was wondering if a Fiio X5ii is better to replace all the Cypherlabs and the IPOD? I don't care about portability etc, just if the Fiio would sound better with the same ALAC files that are now on the IPOD.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
  

 The IPOD doesn't give the best sound source into the DAC.  I found the sound quality to be much better when I plugged my Mac Book Pro running _*Audirvana *_software both for CD Redbook files and higher res files.   Running the R AlgoRhythm & Duet system is also much better when running completely balanced including balanced out for headphones.


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## PCWar

Despite the Cypher Lab stack may seem not very common in the community I find it quite comparable to good desktop rigs. Compared for example to the AK120 II which I had the opportunity to listen lately the CL stack is a step above. Doubt the X5II will be better.


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## Hi-Fi'er

pcwar said:


> Despite the Cypher Lab stack may seem not very common in the community I find it quite comparable to good desktop rigs. Compared for example to the AK120 II which I had the opportunity to listen lately the CL stack is a step above. Doubt the X5II will be better.


 
 That's good news! Thank you!


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## Bonesy Jonesy

pcwar said:


> Despite the Cypher Lab stack may seem not very common in the community *I find it quite comparable to good desktop rigs*. Compared for example to the AK120 II which I had the opportunity to listen lately the CL stack is a step above. Doubt the X5II will be better.


 
  
 Yes I agree 100% with PCWar's comment.   
  
 The Cypher Labs is a great system for the money.   It has driven my HD600's, HD800's and Westone WR4's IEM's very well with very good sound quality for its small size especially with balanced out to the headphones.


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## Hi-Fi'er

bonesy jonesy said:


> Yes I agree 100% with PCWar's comment.
> 
> The Cypher Labs is a great system for the money.   It has driven my HD600's, HD800's and Westone WR4's IEM's very well with very good sound quality for its small size especially with balanced out to the headphones.


 
 That's awesome. I was fearing it was outdated and new DAC/DAP's chips got better over the years. Good to know it's still in the ring.


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## PCWar

Age does not tell much in the audio world. My main desktop rig relies on a Theta Generation V DAC produced in 1994. You can easily find comparisons here on head-fi of this dac to today ones and you may be surprised of the outcome.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

pcwar said:


> *Age does not tell much in the audio world. *My main desktop rig relies on a Theta Generation V DAC produced in 1994. You can easily find comparisons here on head-fi of this dac to today ones and you may be surprised of the outcome.


 
  
 A++........  Vintage tube pre-amps and amps are another example !


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## Hi-Fi'er

pcwar said:


> Age does not tell much in the audio world. My main desktop rig relies on a Theta Generation V DAC produced in 1994. You can easily find comparisons here on head-fi of this dac to today ones and you may be surprised of the outcome.


 
 With technology getting better and better would think things are better like every year new amps and headphones come out that blow the previous models away. Good it's not completely true, at least in my case.


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## PCWar

Still rocking my Duet. It seems there are very few users of it here in the forum. Has anybody compared it to other portable amps?


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## Hi-Fi'er

I have. It's better than my Ray Samuels P-51, and  C&C BH2 and WISS Sound Gun2. It just has better power compared to my Aune B1, but not by huge leaps.


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## Skyfall

A new Duet owner here, and this thing drives my LCD X on balance to a level I've never heard before on portables. It satisfies my craving ear for that perfect sound stage that has a excellent imaging, placements, depth and layering. Simply musical amp


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## Hi-Fi'er

skyfall said:


> A new Duet owner here, and this thing drives my LCD X on balance to a level I've never heard before on portables. It satisfies my craving ear for that perfect sound stage that has a excellent imaging, placements, depth and layering. Simply musical amp


 
 Yes it's hard to fault. I strongly compare it to my Aun1 B1 which cost A LOT less, and is hard to tell apart and was released after the Duet. The Duet used to be my best portable amp but the Aune B1 has replaced it being smaller and lighter. The battery life is not even close to the Duet only.


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## Skyfall

I have B1. I'm gonna take a listen to them tonight..


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## ddaktiv

hi-fi'er said:


> Yes it's hard to fault. I strongly compare it to my Aun1 B1 which cost A LOT less, and is hard to tell apart and was released after the Duet. The Duet used to be my best portable amp but the Aune B1 has replaced it being smaller and lighter. The battery life is not even close to the Duet only.


 
 Sounds interesting. How does it perform with big cans like the Audezes? I was quite surprised how well the Duet can handle the LCD2...still waiting on my balanced cables but I was pleasantly surprised when i plugged my LCD-dap-Duet for the first time sans the Mojo in the stack.


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## Hi-Fi'er

ddaktiv said:


> Sounds interesting. How does it perform with big cans like the Audezes? I was quite surprised how well the Duet can handle the LCD2...still waiting on my balanced cables but I was pleasantly surprised when i plugged my LCD-dap-Duet for the first time sans the Mojo in the stack.


 
 Don't have the Audezes, sorry.


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## Bonesy Jonesy

ddaktiv said:


> Sounds interesting. How does it perform with big cans like the Audezes? I was quite surprised how well the Duet can handle the LCD2...still waiting on my balanced cables but I was pleasantly surprised when i plugged my LCD-dap-Duet for the first time sans the Mojo in the stack.


 

 The LCD2's great balanced out from the Duet.  Much better than single ended out.  
  
 So do the HD800's and the HD650's sound great along with my Westone IEM's.     
  
 For its size, battery life and cost the Duet is hard to beat.  Connect it balanced to its sister DAC and you have a great on the go or desktop rig.   Only downside I have with it is the weight especially when travelling short journeys on the plane and you only have 10kg hand luggage limit.   The amount of times I have also had to show Security at the airport that it plays music has also been an interesting experience.  When you see passengers next to you staring when you take it out and then you let them hear a song or two and see the look on their faces is most rewarding of all


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## Skyfall

I'm letting go of my Duet if anyone is interested


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## Ultrainferno

Forget about the Picollo, go Duet, balanced if possible


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