# [unboxing] KEF LS50 Wireless



## tamsaiming2003

So, one day, a big box landed on my home. A 23kg box! Wow? What's inside?

  
 IsoTek EV03 Premierx2

  
 Gloss Black/Blue (so cyber~)

  
 ^^AV products with lower noise level

  
 It's KEF LS50 Wireless! Bravo! The "active" version of renowned KEF LS50 with 4 Wolfson WM8740E DAC (two on one side)(side-note: 24bit 192khz playback, no native DSD playback supported, to play a DSD file, you need to convert DSD to PCM format(i.e. software decoding)See below:
 Windows: usb dac- foobar2000; 
 MacOS: usb dac- Audirvana Plus; 
 Android: dlna playback-local music: Neutron Music Player, cloud music(Qobuz or Tidal): BubbleUPnP), 
 AMP and DSP, wifi(2.4g and 5g), bluetooth, RCA input, Toslink input, USB type B port......etc, all these new hardware and software with just HKD$10000 more (less than USD$1300)

  
 Mysterious!

  

  

  

  
 The Ports(Back of the right KEF LS50 Wireless)

  
 The uni-q driver is so sexy!
 So, you know the speaker requires more than 500 hours of burn-in time(the uni-q driver, dac and amp). So, how do I "skip" the burn-in time and enjoy the great music?

  
 I pair the KEF LS50 Wireless with my cheap but great DAC and AMP:
Chord Mojo
Nobsound MS-10D Mkii]Nobsound MS-10D Mkii (with Russian 6H1n tubes and Russian 6n1n-EB tubes)
 Cable: 1. Labkable Acoustic Revive PC-triple C 3.5mm male to RCA male
 2. Moon Audio Silver Dragon USB cable (will use)
 Both of them are of high CP values.(Well, I am so poor that I cannot buy a desktop DAC or desktop pre-AMP or desktop AMP or desktop integrated AMP)

  

  
 No extra money to buy a SACD player or CD player......so I use my old blu-ray player

  
 Another angle of the speaker. Oh, the uni-q driver is so handsome!

  
 Aux input

  
 Optical Toslink input

  
 USB input

  
 Wifi(use it with "LS50 Wireless" app, with this app, you can configure speaker distance from edge of the desk, distance from the speaker to the wall, level of bass extension,.etc. Thus, you can tailor-make your KEF sound!)(Again, android-dlna playback:local music: Neutron Music Player, cloud music(Qobuz or Tidal): BubbleUPnP))

  
 Bluetooth aptx (There is no aptx HD codec with this speaker. This is a flagship bookshelf speaker, right? Hope KEF adds aptx HD or LDAC in the next generation LS50.)

  
 Getting ready

  

  
 <<U87>> from Eason Chan (Cantonese, 2005) - Recommended by Time Magazine as one of the five best Asian albums worth buying<<<<<<<A must buy sacd, even if you don't understand Cantonese at all!

  
 A good album from Faye Wong

  
 The big picture
 One more sexy picture of

  
 Chord Mojo and Nobsound MS-10D Mk II
  
 I will share my first impression/review on youtube, stay tuned!
 Thx. for reading! Shut up and take your money out!
  
 The next unboxing and review: Sony MDR-Z1R


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## Adaptivemotion

May I ask where you bought the KEF LS50 Wireless speakers?


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## tamsaiming2003

Hong Kong. KEF has been selling LS50 Wireless with a pair of free IsoTek EV03 Premier since 1/12/2016.


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## KarlMoody

Hey!
  
 It sure looks nice! I never really got around to listening to any respectable wireless Hi-Fi products...maybe I should look into these..
  
 Happy listening!


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## bigbeard

wow...1 year ahead of US release? Why?


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## phoenixdogfan

We won't have to wait a year.  They coming to the US in Jan 2017.


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## andrewinukm

Tom, 新年快樂！
My setup is similar too Mojo to Nobsound to Gallo speakers.

I'm curious about what is your impression of the Nobsound?


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## tamsaiming2003

恭喜發財! Andrew. If you can read Chinese, read this. If not, never mind. It is just a full impression about KEF LS50 Wireless, turntable Teac Tn570, Chord Mojo, Nobdound MS-10D MK II. 
Anyway, back to your question, my impression with Nobsound and russian tubes(red one, RMB 78), starting with the bad are that the sound become very thin and it leans a little bit backward. The bass is completely cut as well as the dynamics. But the good side is the sound is warm, soft and a little bit dark. If you can drop by a Chinese CD shop and buy an album from Faye Wong, or more easily, listen to Tidal or Qobuz(this is the best streaming platform I have ever heard of), listen to "Yue Ding" from Faye Wong. You would be amazed by the sweet soft vocal from Faye Wong. This is what I found good by the Nobsound MS-10D Mkii. 
But I am not satisified with this. I would like a pre-amp which can play on one hand, soft sweet vocal, on the other hand, high dynamics music, clean and solid (deep) bass. Thus, I recently bought this pre-amp with 2 jj ecc82 and 2 jj ecc83s delux package. I also bought two 6u4n rectifiers to replace the stock crap 6z4 rectifiers. So now my setup is, iMac-->Chord Mojo-->new pre-amp-->KEF LS50 Wireless.
I am looking forward for the sonic improvement. 
Hope my impression helps you.


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## s002wjh

is this sealed port or rear ported?


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## tamsaiming2003

All ports are on the back of the (main) right speaker.


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## listen4joy

there a chance that these speakers will sound great without an amp? just plug and play to pc?


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## tamsaiming2003

Yes and no, depends on your desire. If you want something a wired/wireless active speaker can do, LS50W itself is enough and the answer. If you want amp sound with passive LS50, e.g. Marantz PM8005 with passive LS50, then LS50W itself is not enough. You need a pre-amp or passive LS50 with Marzntz PM8005. If you hope for tube sound, buy a tube pre-amp and LS50W or tube pre-amp, tube amp with passive LS50 or tube integrated amp with passive LS50. So, all depends on your desire and wants.


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## KarlMoody

How do these compare to the wired versions?


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## phoenixdogfan

Probably will sound great. It would be interesting for someone who has both a quality LS 50 set up and the wired LS 50 to write up a comparison and post it here.


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## tamsaiming2003

Update: how to reduce the too powerful and clutter bass and make it clean and a pleasing one

According to HK magazine <>, go to LS50 Wireless app, enter speaker setttings, expert mode, set wall mode: -5.5db (range from 0.0db to -6.0 db) and you are good to go.
(I beleive desk mode: mid modification; wall mode: bass modification; treble trim: treble modification)


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## hornytoad

phoenixdogfan said:


> Probably will sound great. It would be interesting for someone who has both a quality LS 50 set up and the wired LS 50 to write up a comparison and post it here.




I can tell you after listening to the Kef LS50 wireless for 2 weeks that it is not as good as a Schiit Yggy dac , a high quality amp like the Rogue Cronos Magnum and the passive Kef LS50's . 

While the wireless model is not broken in I cannot see it surpassing the passives with high quality separates .


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## Ashah

hornytoad said:


> I can tell you after listening to the Kef LS50 wireless for 2 weeks that it is not as good as a Schiit Yggy dac , a high quality amp like the Rogue Cronos Magnum and the passive Kef LS50's .
> 
> While the wireless model is not broken in I cannot see it surpassing the passives with high quality separates .


 
 I tend to agree with you on this one ! although I use the Nova 150 with the LS 50 with KK cables.


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## hornytoad

ashah said:


> I tend to agree with you on this one ! although I use the Nova 150 with the LS 50 with KK cables.


 
 Yeah I dont care what Darko says in Audio review, high quality separates will beat the Kefls50 wireless . 
  
 Of course if you add up the damage, Yggy , Rogue and Passive Ls50's are about 6199 dollars  vs 2199! 
  
 So for the money the Kef ls50 wireless is pretty damn good . I think its the dac area where it is deficient 
 to other dacs.


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## wgb113

hornytoad said:


> I can tell you after listening to the Kef LS50 wireless for 2 weeks that it is not as good as a Schiit Yggy dac , a high quality amp like the Rogue Cronos Magnum and the passive Kef LS50's .
> 
> While the wireless model is not broken in I cannot see it surpassing the passives with high quality separates .


 
 I tend to agree with Darko on this.  I lived with a pair of passives for close to four years, paired with a McIntosh MA6300 and Oppo HA-1.  The LS50W blows it away in every single aspect.  THIS is how KEF intended the LS50 to sound and it is absolutely unbelievable - it's like a different speaker.
  
 I'm not sure ANY reasonable separates setup can match it, let alone surpass it.


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## dogbait

Just picked up a pair. Previously had a Devialet 120 + KEF Reference 1 setup so basically a big brother to the LS50.
  
 The LS50W comes close but it's definitely no cigar as far as fidelity goes.
  
 It's also shy of a pair of Devialet Phantoms but considering the aforementioned setups cost £8.5k and £3.6k respectively the LS50W punches above its weight. My only recommendation is to haggle on the price of the LS50W. I picked it up for a fair bit less than retail thanks to my local dealer offering a discount.
  
 One major issue I'm having with the LS50W is its app. It seems to only see the speakers the first time during setup but any subsequent attempts to access the LS50W fail. Anyone else have this issue?


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## wgb113

Good mention on price - I managed about 15% off of MSRP.
  
 I haven't run into any WiFi issues.  There's been some talk of making sure your WiFi signal's up to snuff and that certain channels work much better than others.


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## dogbait

Did you try the iOS or Android KEF app?


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## wgb113

iOS. So far no issues. It no doubt helps that they sit in the same room as my router.


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## dogbait

Thanks for the info. I've tried ethernet to the speaker, wifi, even setup an isolated network on an Airport Express and connected everything to that.
  
 At a loss - guess I better try and contact KEF support again.
  
 As an aside if you browse to the LS50W web page and check the HTML source it has a *lot* of hidden stuff. Would love it if KEF were able to integrate with Amazon's Alexa...


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## wgb113

Yeah, I'm hoping for Roon integration and potentially MQA.  Both have been rumored.


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## dogbait

Figured out my network issue. My home domain is sub.domain.com.
  
 The app can't find the speaker unless the DNS search domain is blank or just domain.com. To resolve it on iOS I had to go to Settings, WiFi, the connected network, then change my Search Domain to just domain.com. I've notified KEF so hopefully we'll get a bug fix.


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## wgb113

Glad to see you got that worked out.


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## Satir (Jun 24, 2017)

n/a


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## tamsaiming2003

satir said:


> *LS50 Wireless internal DAC is PCM only*. However passive LS50 for money (price has fallen with release of LS50 Wireless) is a very good set of speakers. Careful matching of amplification important to get all passive LS50's are capable of. Owned LS50's mated with Devialet 120 for oustanding sound quality (although Devialet is certainly not an affordable amp/DAC to match with $1200 LS50's). KEF smartly targeted most profitable potential buyer segment with LS50 Wired. Stick with the wired, passive LS50's and good external amplification and external DAC capable of playing all file resolutions if you have large DSD library.



Yes, but you can *play DSD files decently*from LS50 Wireless using *Audirvana Plus 3, for instance*.


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## tamsaiming2003

I am going to post KEF LS50 Wireless in-depth review from a user point of view.
1. Wifi and lan cable(how to get rid of the horrible official app but make best use of it at the same time)
2. BT aptx (Spotify? Youtube?)
3. RCA (Marantz HD-CD1 with an around $120 usd made in PRC pre-amp, I tell u folks, this pre-amp blows you mind of how a $120 usd pre-amp compete with those selling $1000 usd. Solid, punchy but not bloomy bass, Rich and warm mid, Sweet treble.
 a. 1950s Mullard EZ81 x2, printed as Phillip Miniwatt, square getter (with EZ80 to 6Z4 adapter)
b. 1960s Valvo E80cc x2 (fantastic substitute of ecc82), printed in red, gold pin, made by Amperex
c. 1960s Valvo ecc83 x2, made by Amperex
4. Toslink 
5. PC USB(B) (Tidal MQA? Qobuz? 24 bit files? Dsd files? Name them out!)

As I am going to do the review in Cantonese, English and Mandarin, the songs that I pick up would be from three languages as well.

Here are my top favorite CDs:
1. 1：1 母版直刻CD <> 張國榮(4月1號買, 向哥哥致敬)
2. 民歌蔡琴 upm24kcd no.版
3. 酒紅色的心 日本funhouse頭版
4. Adele 21 (Japan bonus track版)
5. 邓丽君 精选20首 LPCD45 M2 第二代 no.版
6. Best of the best Woong San UHQCD
7. 情菲得意 王菲 (LPCD極品天碟1果隻......跳針+根本唔係嬌柔嗲)
8. Lalaland cd
9. 陪着我走 林億蓮 UHQCD no.版
10. Cats 2CD Made in Japan, 1st edition


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## peterinvan

My experience with the LS50W, 10 days and 150 hours of break-in time...  *Spoiler alert:* these are keepers!
  
 I am a retired grey haired wannabe audiophile.  I favor acoustic instruments, Jazz, Blues, Classical, Country, and some Rock.  Love acoustic bass.   95% of listening is on Tidal (HI-FI and MASTERS)

*SET UP*
 Set up was OK till I tried to download/install the Windows7 KEF USB driver.  I finally realized Norton was flagging the setup.exe file and removing it.  Temporarily disabling Norton solved the issue.  Using the CCK on my iPad out to the USB input was simple and sounded as good as my PC.
  
 I hard wired the speakers to my router.  The set up app works OK on iPad, but the app can only be used when the speakers are set to wireless input.  I.e. you can't hear the changes being made in the DSP till you switch back to PC Input (USB).  I didn't try playing local music on the iPad via the Wireless app.
   
  
There are settings for speaker stands, room size and distance from the front wall.  This compensates for my small room and old ears.  I used a existing pair of 29" stands filled with 15lbs of sand each.


  
 For my 8x10' den, I have the Bass setup at -6db and the Treble at +2db.   I would have liked more leeway at both ends.  My den is a bit boomy, and my old ears need help in the treble regions.  I have ten  2" Rockwool panels as bass traps and first reflection dampeners.
  
 I consulted KEF support, and they recommended 140 hours for break in.  This was accurate, as I did notice a marked improvement overall as I patiently waited, and especially in the Bass area.  Now I get clear and taut bass on most tracks, even at lower volumes.  I ran a 35Hz test tone (sinegen.exe) through the speakers every night and played music at normal listening levels all day for a week.
  
 The speakers are toed in towards my La-Z-Boy listening spot.  I found that sweet spot is wider than expected, so a sofa would be covered in a larger room.
  
 The remote control manages the LS50W volume as well as changing tracks in Tidal.  Nice.

*TIMING*
 This is what impressed me the most.  I love the accurate timing and resolution with these powered speakers.  The placement of the instruments on the sound stage, and the sharp boundaries around the players.  Transients on drum solos are crisp.  Noticeably better than my old Meridian Explorer2 DAC & tube amp setup.  The oft used cliche about "hearing parts I never heard before" applies.
  

 Tracks in my Tidal Playlist for testing soundstage:
  
_Wayfaring Stranger _(The New Appellations)
_A Touch of Class (_Patricia Barber)
_High Life_ (Jazz at the Pawnshop)
  
*BASS*

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/music/saint_saens_symphony_3_lp.htm

 I was listening to the final part of this organ piece on my new LS50W speakers. Down to 32Hz!  The very low bass is there, albeit at a lower sound pressure.  In a larger room, a subwoofer would be recommended.

 The Bass is taut and fast on most tracks, but on some acoustic bass tracks it is a bit boomy when the volume is turned up.  I can reduce/eliminate the boominess by listening at a lower volume.  EDM bass is weighty and taut.
  
_Billy Joe_ (Patricia Barber)
_Nardis_ (Patricia Barber - Cafe Blue)
_Willow Weep For Me_ (Sinne Eeg)
_Tango Till The're Sore _(Holly Cole)
_Jersy Girl _(Holly Cole)
_Walk on the Wild Side_ (Lou Reid)
_Here We Go Again _(Ray Charles/Norah Jones)
_A Little World Called Home_ (Bucky Pizzarelli)
_Cold Flame _(Yello)
  
*MIDS*
 The quality of the mids varies from record to record.  Male and female voices are clear with no noticeable overlap from bass harmonics.  Full orchestras are well defined, and instruments are nicely isolated on the sound stage.  Yo-Yo's vintage cello sounds "woody".  Nice.

_Here We Go Again _(Ray Charles/Norah Jones)
_5:15AM_ (Mark Knopfler)
_Trawlerman's Song _(Mark Knopfler)
_Spanish Harlem_ (Rebecca Pigeon)
_Mozart Violin Concertos _(Vilde Frang)
_Inspired by Bach_ (Yo-Yo Ma)
  
*HIGHS*
 Highs are crystal clear, with fast action on cymbals and snares.  The upper registers on the piano are sharp, but not metallic.   I love the resonance off the other strings in the piano with the pedal down.
  
_Nardis _(Patricia Barber)
_Stepping Out_ album (Dianna Krall)

*BLUETOOTH*
 Logging on from my iPhone was no problem.  The sound quality is somewhat reduced over Bluetooth (compared to USB input).
  
*NIGGLY BITS*
 The left speaker cut out once, but it re-synced within 15 sec.

 The app for the iOS devices is like an early beta.  You have to stop the music, and switch over to WiFi on the speaker to adjust the DSP settings.   
  
 The volume control on the remote offers no feedback, and takes a couple of presses to start adjusting the volume. 
  
 After a few failed attempts,  I had to disable Norton anti virus before installing the Windows USB driver.
  
*CONCLUSION*
 Great value for money (compared to separate components of equivalent quality).  I am keeping these, focusing on discovering new music instead of new gear,  and putting up my old rig for sale!


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## hornytoad

peterinvan said:


> My experience with the LS50W, 10 days and 150 hours of break-in time...  *Spoiler alert:* these are keepers!
> 
> I am a retired grey haired wannabe audiophile.  I favor acoustic instruments, Jazz, Blues, Classical, Country, and some Rock.  Love acoustic bass.   95% of listening is on Tidal (HI-FI and MASTERS)
> 
> ...


 
 Nice review and I agree with you. 
  
 I do think the passive and active Ls50's weakest facet is their sound with rock music . I'm talking hard rock specifically. 
  
 I do believe they do require a warmup time frame to sound their best. Maybe 30 minutes or so minimum .


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## wgb113

hornytoad said:


> Nice review and I agree with you.
> 
> I do think the passive and active Ls50's weakest facet is their sound with rock music . I'm talking hard rock specifically.
> 
> I do believe they do require a warmup time frame to sound their best. Maybe 30 minutes or so minimum .


 
 I agree with him on many points as well.  The inability to hear the changes instantly when using a non-WiFi input is probably my biggest complaint.  I've written to KEF about it, hopefully it's something they fix in the next iteration.
  
@hornytoad with regards to the LS50 and hard rock - I get what you're saying but I'm not so sure it's the speaker's fault.  As I've progressed through this hobby over the past 20 years a lot of hard rock just wasn't made to sound good on quality gear - from 80s metal to 90s Britrock, especially when played back-to-back with stuff that was recorded well.  I lived with a pair of passive LS50s for close to 4 years, spent the last year with a pair of B&W N805s, and have recently moved on to a pair of LS50Ws.  A lot of rock/hard rock is exposed for what it is.  Much of it sounds "better" on my bar area setup: Yamaha A-S501 integrated, AppleTV, Paradigm Monitor 90p.  But the good recordings don't sound anywhere near as good down there as they do on the LS50Ws.
  
 So which then is truly the better speaker?  For me, I like the warts-and-all approach that the LS50W offers but I completely understand how someone with only the space/budget for one setup might choose a speaker like the Paradigms.


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## tamsaiming2003

peterinvan said:


> My experience with the LS50W, 10 days and 150 hours of break-in time...  *Spoiler alert:* these are keepers!
> 
> I am a retired grey haired wannabe audiophile.  I favor acoustic instruments, Jazz, Blues, Classical, Country, and some Rock.  Love acoustic bass.   95% of listening is on Tidal (HI-FI and MASTERS)
> 
> ...



Nice review, my fd. Mine is still recording. There are 3 languages and it takes time. My review focus on how to improve on the already awesome LS50W (bass, mid, treble, dynamics) by spending the least but with tube sound.


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## tamsaiming2003

KEF LS50 vs KEF LS50 wireless (Finally...the battle) (Cantonese, English, Mandarin)

]

Important note: please play the video on computers, or Chrome in Desktop mode. Otherwise, you may not be able to watch it.

Stay tuned on my KEF LS50 Wireless full review(app setup, wifi, lan, cd with pre-amp, toslink, usb(b))


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## peterinvan

After five weeks of pleasurable listening, the LS50W has cured my Gear Acquisition Syndrome (GAS).  I believe I have reached my end game system.

Now, I only read the gear reviews to see the favorite tracks the reviewers are using to test new gear.

I also enjoy discovering  new albums on Tidal.

Does this mean that I am now a Musicphile, and no longer an Audiophile?


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## hornytoad

peterinvan said:


> After five weeks of pleasurable listening, the LS50W has cured my Gear Acquisition Syndrome (GAS).  I believe I have reached my end game system.
> 
> Now, I only read the gear reviews to see the favorite tracks the reviewers are using to test new gear.
> 
> ...



I will admit when I first started listening the to the Kef Ls50's I was a little concerned . They just didn't seem that good compared to my passive Ls50's . 

But they needed some serious breakin time . I have about 200 hours on them now and they are completely different from the initial listening impressions. .

They are crazy good now . I'm very happy . Give them time to break in though .


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## bearFNF

Just got mine set-up and I am now working through fine tuning. So far liking them, the bass is a little boomy and not center for me, It seems to be on the edges of the room and not in the middle. Will work through that eventually. Yet. Definably an improvement over the Klipsch R-15PM's I had. Just need to tune them and burn them in.

little niggly bit: Wish there was some feedback for the remote, flashing light on the front of the speaker would be nice to tell me it got the signal. I know there is one on top but when I am lounging in the couch cant see it.

No issues with connectivity or WiFi for me. I use an Oppo 103 with external HDD, but mostly a Plex server over wireless and Tidal.


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## tamsaiming2003

bearFNF said:


> Just got mine set-up and I am now working through fine tuning. So far liking them, the bass is a little boomy and not center for me, It seems to be on the edges of the room and not in the middle. Will work through that eventually. Yet. Definably an improvement over the Klipsch R-15PM's I had. Just need to tune them and burn them in.
> 
> little niggly bit: Wish there was some feedback for the remote, flashing light on the front of the speaker would be nice to tell me it got the signal. I know there is one on top but when I am lounging in the couch cant see it.
> 
> No issues with connectivity or WiFi for me. I use an Oppo 103 with external HDD, but mostly a Plex server over wireless and Tidal.



Try run-in longer or trim bass to -5.5db in expert mode from KEF LS50 Wireless app

Stay tuned on my KEF LS50 Wireless full review!


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## Ashah (May 18, 2017)

having had LS 50 for over a year  with a Peachtree Nova 150  amplifier  and now I just got the new LS 50 W for my desk top system I changed my mind these sound far better than the LS 50 ( which I have used with Parasound Halo ( which drives my magnipan 1.7i in the living room and a Marantz SR 5005 AV receiver , and and old Outlaw audio 1050 . I still have one month to send them back but looks like they are keepers


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## Audiosonic (May 19, 2017)

Thank you for a good read about the LS50Ws. Since switching to headphones in the mid 90s, I almost bought them after an audition. A reality check and the prospect of equipment creep stopped me. But if an upgraded version came out with DSD decoding, things might be different the next time round.


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## dogbait

New firmware released a few days ago: http://us.kef.com/product-support


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## bigbeard

thanks, just updated.

Does anyone know when the ls50w will be able to decode mqa (do they already)? This way I can enable mqa pass through on tidal.


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## verber

Argh!!  Updating firmware on the LS50 wireless sucks!!! The speaker doesn't have an option to do a self update, the iOS app can't do it, nor is the firmware available as an image which can be uploaded from any machine using a browser via http(s) like modern / sensible systems.  Nope... the updater is a Windows binary?!!  And don't get me started on the iOS app... takes forever to start and about half the time it crashes so it needs to be removed and reinstalled to run.

All that said, the speakers do sound quite good, especially for near field use, but they need some serious help on the software front.


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## IamMathew

tamsaiming2003 said:


> So, one day, a big box landed on my home. A 23kg box! Wow? What's inside?
> 
> 
> IsoTek EV03 Premierx2
> ...



Why would anyone want to pair these with Mojo or amp/ preamp?  These have built in A/D converter right behind their analogue cinch inputs. So even when someone uses Mojo or turntable, these speakers will convert that analogue signal back to digital. Using an external DAC is therefore pointless, since one will always experience those four built in DACs in the speakers themselves, as these can't be bypassed.


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## Jacobal

Very nice!


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## ashenone

HELLO. How much for all these thing. Is those isotek include shipped pack or you bought them seperately?


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## tamsaiming2003

ashenone said:


> HELLO. How much for all these thing. Is those isotek include shipped pack or you bought them seperately?


$18000 hkd. I get the early bird promotion so I get isotek evo 3 premier for free. I heard that people can get the LS50W at around $13000 hkd in HK with warranty  in their ways.


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## ashenone

I Got mine around 1500usd, around 12000hdk. Maybe that the reason i dont have those isotek stuffs.


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## Negyt

ashenone said:


> I Got mine around 1500usd, around 12000hdk. Maybe that the reason i dont have those isotek stuffs.



where did you got it at that price in HK, USA Store?
excellent price for sure


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## ashenone

Im in vietnam. Some store sell with that price.


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## bearFNF

Anyone else having issues with IR remotes (TV/cable box) signals changing volume and turing off their LS50W? 

For instance, my cable remote, when i hit the "last channel" button, it turns the speakers off or on, or when I am in the channel guide, the page up page down turns the volume of the KEFs up or down. What really makes this frustrating is that it doe not happen all the time.


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## wilflare

can't seem to find the main thread for LS50W but it seems like a new update is now live on the KEF site


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## bearFNF

wilflare said:


> can't seem to find the main thread for LS50W but it seems like a new update is now live on the KEF site


yep, new firmware and update to app.


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## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> yep, new firmware and update to app.



did anyone figure how to swap the Left and Right speakers?

my Left speaker sound much softer than the Right. the vocals seem to be weighted on the Right speaker :/


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## bearFNF (Oct 10, 2017)

Borrowed this from the roon forum. Have not tried it yet.
"Kef will be posting this into the fw update release notes but in the mean time…






7639622D-6E8E-4C03-9A2E-5FB2C0B2A916.jpg2224x1668 167 KB


To set Master as Left Channel,

1 In PC source press the space between source select and volume down icon 5 times
2. Press volume up icon once
3. Press A, the blinking icon will swap from C to D.
4. Press B to confirm and exit.

Repeating the above process will swap the channels back again."  Credit to Ratbert


wilflare said:


> did anyone figure how to swap the Left and Right speakers?
> 
> my Left speaker sound much softer than the Right. the vocals seem to be weighted on the Right speaker :/


----------



## drwlf

@bearFNF almost like a Konami code.


----------



## bearFNF

Contra ruled...  


drwlf said:


> @bearFNF almost like a Konami code.


----------



## wilflare

lol. that's some Konami code indeed (I think the Konami code was less convoluted... lol)

is it preferable to actually mess with the sound settings via the app? default sounds good but it gets tad bit boomy but tuning the settings seem to pull back the bass too much


----------



## bearFNF

I did not like the default. I use expert and tune it to the room.


----------



## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> I did not like the default. I use expert and tune it to the room.



any tuning tips? can't seem to get something that sounds good (or decent)


----------



## bearFNF (Oct 11, 2017)

I used one of the articles I read as the baseline and then tweaked form there.
I also tried lots of other settings, takes time, but finally got to where I like it best.
I had a relative come visit and had her listen to the default versus my settings and she liked my setting best.
Didn't tell what I was doing just switched it to default and she said, "Eww, what did you do, it sounds bad now, what did you do? whatever you did put it back."
I switched it back and she said, "Oh yeah, now that's better, I like that a lot beter, don't do that again". It was my mom so obviously I didn't "do that again"... 

Before I post my setting I want to say this, I know someone will say "those settings are whacked, you messed it all up" but, before any of you post it, I really only care that they sound good to me like this and that is enough.

So here are my settings FWIW and YMMV and all that. Your room may be a lot different than mine.
Mine are on stands next to my entertainment center about a foot from the wall. angled into the room 12 foot wide, 23 into open kitchen, 7.5 foot ceiling
Room is very lively (sliding glass door, carpet, lots of furniture)
On the expert tab:
Desk mode: off
Wall mode: on at -5dB
Treble trim: -2dB
Phase correction: on
Bass extension: Standard
High pass frequency: off
Sub out low-pass frequency: 120Hz
Sub Gain: 5dB
Sub Polarity: +

I do tweak it every so often just for kicks. but these setting are there most of the time. I also tune it at times for high Neighbor acceptance factor due to living in an apartment (meaning lower volumes and lower bass rumble).



wilflare said:


> any tuning tips? can't seem to get something that sounds good (or decent)


----------



## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> I used one of the articles I read as the baseline and then tweaked form there.
> I also tried lots of other settings, takes time, but finally got to where I like it best.
> I had a relative come visit and had her listen to the default versus my settings and she liked my setting best.
> Didn't tell what I was doing just switched it to default and she said, "Eww, what did you do, it sounds bad now, what did you do? whatever you did put it back."
> ...



thanks so much! I'll go back and try these settings out. heh.
really just have to fix my left/right speaker imbalance for now.

anyone using a separate DAC with these speakers?

bought them in Singapore... the price is insane and there's no freebies to go along (i.e. isotek power cables, etc. :/)


----------



## bearFNF

As far as I know every signal goes to the internal DAC, no way to bypass it.


wilflare said:


> thanks so much! I'll go back and try these settings out. heh.
> really just have to fix my left/right speaker imbalance for now.
> 
> anyone using a separate DAC with these speakers?
> ...


----------



## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> As far as I know every signal goes to the internal DAC, no way to bypass it.



I'm using my Mimby with them and it sounds like the details are better resolved with the Mimby (not sure if it's placebo).

What I'm bothered with is the vocals being weighted on the right :/


----------



## IamMathew

wilflare said:


> I'm using my Mimby with them and it sounds like the details are better resolved with the Mimby (not sure if it's placebo).
> 
> What I'm bothered with is the vocals being weighted on the right :/



You can still do the blind test to know for sure.


----------



## Matez

Ha, LS50 thread on HF, that's a good one. I've had this product for nearly two years and I had a blast with it. Very good speakers for the price, but their owners here probably know that already


----------



## wilflare

IamMathew said:


> You can still do the blind test to know for sure.



any suggestions for good tracks to test them?

hmm anyone tried replacing the Cat6 cable with something of higher quality?


----------



## wgb113

wilflare said:


> any suggestions for good tracks to test them?
> 
> hmm anyone tried replacing the Cat6 cable with something of higher quality?


I'm using a Belden DataTuff Industrial Ethernet CAT6 patch cord.  It features their proven bonded-pair technology and industrial connectors like those used in the Audioquest Diamond cable.


----------



## wilflare

wgb113 said:


> I'm using a Belden DataTuff Industrial Ethernet CAT6 patch cord.  It features their proven bonded-pair technology and industrial connectors like those used in the Audioquest Diamond cable.



got a link to those cables? 
anyone changed the power cables and/or use a power filter with them?


----------



## wgb113

wilflare said:


> got a link to those cables?
> anyone changed the power cables and/or use a power filter with them?


https://www.belden.com/resourcecent...l_Ethernet_Connectivity_Tools_Accessories.pdf

I rolled my own power cables for them using some Carol Brand 12awg-3c SOOW cable, Wattgate evo connectors, and TechFlex.


----------



## wilflare

oh you rolled your own Ethernet cables as well? wonder if I can get Ghentaudio to do so as well. 

was thinking of getting Isotek power cables


----------



## wgb113

wilflare said:


> oh you rolled your own Ethernet cables as well? wonder if I can get Ghentaudio to do so as well.
> 
> was thinking of getting Isotek power cables


Nope, just the power cables.  The ethernet cables linked to are sold as patch-cords.


----------



## wilflare

wgb113 said:


> Nope, just the power cables.  The ethernet cables linked to are sold as patch-cords.



any discernible sound difference with the new power cables?


----------



## wgb113

wilflare said:


> any discernible sound difference with the new power cables?


Honestly - no.  But they were a better length and look a heck of a lot nicer!


----------



## wilflare

my KEF LS50W is at the service centre for sound imbalance...
bought a Tacima Power Strip/conditioner - wonder how it will affect the sound :/


----------



## Peter Hyatt (Nov 7, 2017)

New owner of the LS50W and am very pleased.  The sound is gorgeous. I did not think wireless could sound this accurate.  

I am going to add the 12" Kube subwoofer so the "Rites of Spring" or Earth Wind & Fire will rattle my filings. 

What a system.   special thanks to Taylor at Gold Print Audio.      http://www.goldprintaudio.com/demopreownedequipmentspecials.html.  I've placed order for the subwoofer through him.  It is the 12b model here:  https://www.kefdirect.com/kube12-subwoofer.html

I did a lot of homework on this and I agree with those who feel it does not need a subwoofer. 

I just *want* it.

The app needs updating but bluetooth from Audirvana is smooth.


----------



## nvfan

I wonder if a passive LS50 can compete with the wireless sound wise?


----------



## hornytoad

nvfan said:


> I wonder if a passive LS50 can compete with the wireless sound wise?


With the right equipment ,yes but the passive LS50's are very finicky about the amps you pair them with.
And you would have to spend more money than the wireless version.


----------



## Peter Hyatt

nvfan said:


> I wonder if a passive LS50 can compete with the wireless sound wise?



I demo'd both and I think the passive can sound equal; it is just a matter of time matching the right amp, pre amp and DAC.  

I think the cost of the LS50w makes it more affordable.


----------



## wilflare

anyone used Bluesound with the LS50W?


----------



## Peter Hyatt

Thus far, I have used the Wifi and Bluetooth --  Wifi with TIDAL has drop offs every so often, but that is in general; not the LS50W.    

Bluetooth Audirvana is our favorite.


----------



## ashenone

Hi there, anybody feel that ls50w treble is recessed, mines have too much bass, i play a song and thing i hear is bass & bass. i adjusted Desk mode & wall mode to -6db each and treble trim to +2db but it almost make no sense.
Sorry for my engrisk, it's bad xD


----------



## bearFNF

Try my settings posted here:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/unboxing-kef-ls50-wireless.829504/page-5#post-13777823



ashenone said:


> Hi there, anybody feel that ls50w treble is recessed, mines have too much bass, i play a song and thing i hear is bass & bass. i adjusted Desk mode & wall mode to -6db each and treble trim to +2db but it almost make no sense.
> Sorry for my engrisk, it's bad xD


----------



## hornytoad

ashenone said:


> Hi there, anybody feel that ls50w treble is recessed, mines have too much bass, i play a song and thing i hear is bass & bass. i adjusted Desk mode & wall mode to -6db each and treble trim to +2db but it almost make no sense.
> Sorry for my engrisk, it's bad xD


No .


----------



## ashenone

bearFNF said:


> Try my settings posted here:
> https://www.head-fi.org/threads/unboxing-kef-ls50-wireless.829504/page-5#post-13777823


Tried your settings, still make no sense but thanks anyway.
Do you have tutorial for expert setting like what is desk/wall mode, treble trim is? I want to understand those.


----------



## peterinvan (Nov 10, 2017)

ashenone said:


> Hi there, anybody feel that ls50w treble is recessed, mines have too much bass, i play a song and thing i hear is bass & bass. i adjusted Desk mode & wall mode to -6db each and treble trim to +2db but it almost make no sense.
> Sorry for my engrisk, it's bad xD



I have a small listening room (8x11), and my solution to the "boomy bass" was to install 10 acoustic panels in the corners and at the first reflection points.  I fabricated my panels using 2" Roxul panels, a simple wood frame and a light burlap fabric.

This tamed the bass, however my old ears needed a bit more top end, so I use the DSP in Roon to add a +6db on a ramped slope from about 9Khz upwards.

My LS50W are set at -5db bass and treble trim to +2db.  Reduced bass.

I prefer accurate, taught bass to heavy "dub" bass.   Especially fond of the acoustic bass.  Very happy with the LS50W.


----------



## Peter Hyatt

interesting settings; I will try. 

Wednesday, the subwoofer arrives.  I'll report back my impressions. 

https://www.kefdirect.com/kube12-subwoofer.html


----------



## bigbeard

I had my LS50w since they first came out in the US. Also had them paired with a dual 15inch PSA 3000i sub. 

Everyday I am amazed and truly enjoy the sound. Even people who would never looked at audio the way we do are impressed by the clarity the sound of the speakers. Pairing them with a sub provides a mind blowing experience each time.

One off topic question...do you guys, which have the speakers connected to a computer, put windows sound settings for the speakers at 24bit/192khz? The DAC in these will convert it to that regardless of the input, correct? So it would not be best to have windows/programs convert the sound just to have it converted again by the speakers' DAC.


----------



## Peter Hyatt

UPS out for delivery on KEF Kube subwoofer.  I'll revert with opinion...


----------



## Peter Hyatt

I have the KEF KUBE 2 b (12) and it is something special.

It is very powerful but understated.  It makes acoustic bass gorgeous and although it can rattle your fillings, it does not over modulate nor lose its musicality.  

I said that KEF LS50W may not need a subwoofer, but once added, I can't imagine not having it.  It is spoiling. 

The balance between the two (LS50W and subwoofer) is terrific.  

We tested classical and some heavy bass stuff.


----------



## jcn3

bigbeard said:


> I had my LS50w since they first came out in the US. Also had them paired with a dual 15inch PSA 3000i sub.
> 
> Everyday I am amazed and truly enjoy the sound. Even people who would never looked at audio the way we do are impressed by the clarity the sound of the speakers. Pairing them with a sub provides a mind blowing experience each time.
> 
> One off topic question...do you guys, which have the speakers connected to a computer, put windows sound settings for the speakers at 24bit/192khz? The DAC in these will convert it to that regardless of the input, correct? So it would not be best to have windows/programs convert the sound just to have it converted again by the speakers' DAC.



You should have the flag set to allow exclusive mode. This bypasses Windows sound making that setting moot.


----------



## wilflare

thinking of getting some isotek power cables and higher quality ethernet cables - anyone tried and heard a tangible difference?


----------



## canali

i'm about to sell my naim muso and return to 2.0  with these kefs.
I am to use them for both home audio and ht (with my new tv...replacing my 10 yr old rear projection).
i'm also using Roon, Tidal and have a microrendu/lps 1 power supply.

the Kef rep i spoke to suggested the R400b as a sub ...but man that is pricey!
or the kef kube 12 b.....what of other subs from SVS or Hsu?


----------



## wilflare

finally got my replacement set of KEF LS50W (the previous set was having some imbalance issues)
- I LOVE IT
- the sound is now rightly centred!
- the rubber groves fit my Aperta stands perfectly!

Upgrades I'm thinking of
- The Ethernet interconnect between the L/R speakers (any suggestions?)
- The 2x Power cables (do the Isotek cables actually make any difference?)
- The USB cable and Network cable (to really minimise the noise, etc.)
- The subwoofer but I'm actually thinking of going with the JL Audio subs (I auditioned them and they are just insane)


----------



## bearFNF

This may be a silly question, but did check the balance knob on the back of the left speaker on the speakers that had the imbalance issue? Just curious.

Also, what model JL Audio sub?



wilflare said:


> finally got my replacement set of KEF LS50W (the previous set was having some imbalance issues)
> - I LOVE IT
> - the sound is now rightly centred!
> - the rubber groves fit my Aperta stands perfectly!
> ...


----------



## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> This may be a silly question, but did check the balance knob on the back of the left speaker on the speakers that had the imbalance issue? Just curious.
> 
> Also, what model JL Audio sub?



yup! I've ensured it but it made no difference. 
I brought it to the shop/showroom and there was a difference between my set and their demo units. 

thinking of either the D or E series. yet to decide.


----------



## bearFNF

OK, the reason I ask is that I did even know the knob was there until a few weeks a go.


----------



## canali

might be picking up the white version and matching stands this wkend.....


----------



## Decommo

I am seriously considering to get rid of all of speaker, amp and dac etc and consolidate all into KEF LS50W. 

I read manuals etc and one thing that I cannot figure out is if there is a way LS50W internal DAC can be connected to separate headamp. So if I want to listen via headphone during the night, I can still use internal dac connected to external headamp. Is this even possible?


----------



## canali

the iso acoustic ''aperta''  stands (aluminum) look quite nice...seems you can use them on any regular speaker stands, too
http://www.isoacoustics.com/home-audio/


----------



## canali (Nov 23, 2017)

guys...any issues w these speakers as below?
from Roon community thread by LS50 wls owners.

i2 threads that are a bit disconcerting...maybe some of you guys will pay the thread a visit and chip in.

1 https://community.roonlabs.com/t/poll-of-kef-ls50-wireless-owners/32500/64
2 https://community.roonlabs.com/t/hardware-reliability-issues-with-the-kef-ls-50w/31422/7

_Rik_Carter_
_25d_
_Here’s a quick summary of the poll results so far:

No. of people who own the LS50 Wireless : 20
No. of people who have experienced some kind of fault: 10

So, 50% of KEF LS50W owners have experienced a problem/fault of increasing severity:

i. Flashing lights indicating a ‘system failure’ and the loss of sound from one or both speakers. Normally fixed by power cycling the master speaker.
ii. Bricking the speaker due to a flaky firmware upgrade process/software. Some have recovered after a hard reset; others have been less fortunate.
iii. Hardware issue with ‘clicking’ or distortion in one speaker requiring the speakers to be replaced.

And, what is more concerning, is that at least 3 owners have had mutliple hardware failures even with replacement speakers.

Now clearly this poll is not statistically significant but, still, this is not a positive outcome for KEF._


----------



## bearFNF (Nov 23, 2017)

I am one that responded to that survey Rik put up.

I would say that even with the issues it is worth tying these speakers. IMO
So much so that I talked my mom into getting a pair and she is loving them.
YMMV and all that.

The 50% is of the people responding to the poll and all owners, BTW.



canali said:


> guys...any issues w these speakers as below?
> from Roon community thread by LS50 wls owners.
> 
> i2 threads that are a bit disconcerting...maybe some of you guys will pay the thread a visit and chip in.
> ...


----------



## canali (Nov 23, 2017)

bearFNF said:


> I am one that responded to that survey Rik put up.
> 
> I would say that even with the issues it is worth tying these speakers.
> So much so that I talked my mom into getting a pair and she is loving them.
> ...



thanks...always good to get perspective. guess digital active speakers are still a work in progress.
have read great things about dynaudio focus xd200 but they're double the price...don't know if are Roon approved, either.

so would you say: just have an ethernet connection (so they're wired) to lessen any issues?
any other suggestions?


----------



## bearFNF

The KEF are not fully "ROON ready" as they can not use RAAT. Bui  they can act as an endpoint, just cant group them with other zones.
I still use a RPi with hifiberry digi+ pro hat ro drive them.



canali said:


> thanks...always good to get perspective. guess digital active speakers are still a work in progress.
> have read great things about dynaudio focus xd200 but they're double the price...don't know if are Roon approved, either.


----------



## canali

bearFNF said:


> The KEF are not fully "ROON ready" as they can not use RAAT. Bui  they can act as an endpoint, just cant group them with other zones.
> I still use a RPi with hifiberry digi+ pro hat ro drive them.



i have an ipad mini 4...was to use ipeng app from what i've read.
i also need either a sonictransporter i5 (anyone wants to sell me one?) or build my own nuc.

i only have 2 rooms.


----------



## bearFNF

I went the NUC route. Very convenient, I also use RoPieee with a 7" screen on the Rpi/hifiberry. Puts a nice screen next to my TV to see what paying and have some control.


----------



## Haris Javed

Hello - thank you for posting your un-boxing. I am thinking about getting these, do you  know if they run full range or if you connect a subwoofer they send 80hz or below to the subwoofer? 

thank you


----------



## canali

bearFNF said:


> I went the NUC route. Very convenient, I also use RoPieee with a 7" screen on the Rpi/hifiberry. Puts a nice screen next to my TV to see what paying and have some control.



did you just follow this route?
http://kb.roonlabs.com/Roon_Optimized_Core_Kit

i'm also considering this nuc (DIY) route vs a sonictransporter i5


----------



## bearFNF (Nov 23, 2017)

They are 45Hz-28kHz depends on settings, you can connect a sub and control the low pass via the app.
Here's a screen shot for the spec sheet found on kefdirect.com


----------



## bearFNF

Yes pretty much, used the I7 SSD for ROCK and internal data drive route. So it is easily transported to other locations if needed.


canali said:


> did you just follow this route?
> http://kb.roonlabs.com/Roon_Optimized_Core_Kit
> 
> i'm also considering this nuc (DIY) route vs a sonictransporter i5


----------



## bearFNF

see my response above, forgot to quote you so you would get a notice.


Haris Javed said:


> Hello - thank you for posting your un-boxing. I am thinking about getting these, do you  know if they run full range or if you connect a subwoofer they send 80hz or below to the subwoofer?
> 
> thank you


----------



## wilflare

still thinking whether to spend the money on the IsoTek EVO3 Initium for my LS50 Wireless :/


----------



## jcn3

canali said:


> did you just follow this route?
> http://kb.roonlabs.com/Roon_Optimized_Core_Kit
> 
> i'm also considering this nuc (DIY) route vs a sonictransporter i5



if you're not going to go the roon route for a while, you can just use minimserver as a media server.  install minimserver on your nas or a computer running full time.  you'd then just the using the dlna/upnp capabilities in the ls50w.  then add a nuc (running rock) or a sonictransporter i5 when you go to roon.

edit:  installing rock on a nuc is a piece of cake.  it's so easy, calling it diy makes it sound more complicated than it is.


----------



## bearFNF (Nov 25, 2017)

There are plenty of good YouTube videos, also.
This guy does a decent job: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCR4tuhqPppVp-PD0q17sPEA


----------



## canali (Nov 25, 2017)

hey guys, thanks...i already have a roon lifetime subscription.

andrew from sgc is offering bundles for blk friday, and one of them
had the sonictranporter i5 with a linear power supply and ultrarendu as below.
https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/collections/black-friday-deals/products/wonderful-bundle-6

_but another person in the AV forum suggested that since the Kef ls50 wireless are now Roon endpoints then
i might no longer need to buy an additional MR or linear power supply_
 ( which i have an mr and lps 1 for my desktop speakers) ...that some people who have the kefs and Roon
are now able to sell their MR as the sound quality with Roon integration is pretty good ...see below.

thoughts?

_me:
but i always thought a microrendu would enhance the feed going to the DAC ...that the usb feed (to dac) from ethernet is cleaner with MR in place

---End Quote---

reply:
Roon integration is really good. A lot of people have sold their micro Rendu a or ultra Rendu  once it came out. Look on the computer audiophile forum._
-----------


----------



## bearFNF

My mom also just got the KEF and then bought an OPPO 203 (ROON Ready!!) so she can use it to feed the KEF.
The cool part is that he OPPO then puts the ROON album art etc on the TV screen she tells me.
I have not seen this yet, will be back at her place for Christmas and will check it out then.

I might have to get a new Oppo now......


----------



## canali (Nov 26, 2017)

well i'm now an official member of the kef club as I just ordered a pair of the white ls50w.

to be safe i also took out a 5 yr extended warranty for only cdn$250...i usually don't on electronics but given some of the issues with these babies, i thought it best to do that...will help
with resale, as well...isoacoustic aperta silver/aluminum stands coming next week.


----------



## canali

guys....i'm  now researching subs...hsu, kef's new subs, sunfire etc.
(but admittedly love the dsp/eq modes in the new kef subs)

also reading of how 2 subs deal better with standing waves and room acoustics than does just one.
so i emailed kef and they said that, despite the active speaker only having one sub out,
that i can run 2 subs in my system:...
_''You will need an RCA Y adapter cable. One end will have a single RCA
 to connect to the LS50W, the other end will have two RCAs, one for each subwoofer.''
_
anyone running 2 subs in their system?
my place is small 11' wide by 14' deep and with another 11' behind me into an open kitchen.


----------



## AlanU

canali said:


> guys....i'm  now researching subs...hsu, kef's new subs, sunfire etc.
> (but admittedly love the dsp/eq modes in the new kef subs)
> 
> also reading of how 2 subs deal better with standing waves and room acoustics than does just one.
> ...



I've auditioned those LS50's and they do satisfy the ears for detail but depending on the room configuration the bass might be lacking. 

If I were to search for subs I'd do research on active subs that are known for musical character. Kef subs have never had the reputation for being stellar performers. I use Kef speakers for my home theater setup but I'm a Totem acoustic owner too. If I wanted to add  a sub for your application I'd also consider totem subs. 

Do not put the speakers in a shelf or close to a wall. You'd want the ports in the back of the speaker to have some room to breath.

If you've ever auditioned a Kef R100 bookshelf it has a very similar sound signature to the Kef LS50. I've run my R100 with a Simaudio amplifier and it sounds very good with a nice refined treble. Bass is taught just like the LS50 and the glossy cabinet is just as beefy and heavy like the non amplified LS50. The beauty of the wireless LS50 is the clean and powerful amplification.

I'd honestly get one sub and see how it performs in your room. You can move it around the room to hear audible differences in how it reacts with the room acoustics. Room positioning and room tuning is just as critical as the gear in many cases. 

Depending the kind of music you listen too I would just listen to the setup as is. The Kef driver needs to be broken in. I'm not jaded...... the speakers suspension and other components in the speaker needs to relax and you'll notice a difference in how the music flows. Fresh kef drivers will sound better over time. This is definitely NOT your "brain conditioning". I found with my R100 and R300 the speaker just improved in SQ especially the mids and lows. The cross over in the Ls50 has a very pleasant treble. Now the new Q series (cheaper line) has modified the cross over as it seems they are tuning the speakers more for laminate hard wood floors the creates terrible reflection.   

I've tested my R300 with Simaudio amplifier and in my room which is aprox 11' by 22" does NOT need a sub. The large bookshelf true 3 way (not common these days) has a warmer less fast presentation than my R100 (your ls50) but when the R300 were new they sounded muddy. Now that I put many hours on them over time the R300 would shake even your room configuration without a sub. 

I'll have to say the imaging from Kef's proprietary speaker Q driver is very good especially for the price.  If you want that full body sound you will need to fill in the lower frequency with a sub. 

I like to tweak but my typical thing to do is to use a Blue circle Canadian made passive power conditioner and Audio Sensibility (CDN made) power cable.


----------



## canali

thanks...i've now done a complete 360 on the kef sub....am looking at Rythmik F12 or a Rel t/i7 or i/9


----------



## AlanU

canali said:


> thanks...i've now done a complete 360 on the kef sub....am looking at Rythmik F12 or a Rel t/i7 or i/9



AVSforum has a lot of chatter when it comes to subs. Possibly a sealed sub will be more controlled for musical nature. 

The dedicated kef streamer seems neat using a tablet/smart phone device. 

I'm torn in some ways as I'm a speaker/amplifier kind of guy. I like swapping cabling and using usb to spdif converters to colour sound. If  you've ever dabbled in that stuff you can hear  difference using a Stello U3 in the chain for 24bit music. There are folks colouring the "regular" LS50 with tube amplification and vinyl. The LS50 ventures into the detail speaker almost like the Senn HD800(s) detail monster. 

Rel and Rythmik seems to be something to consider for a sub.


----------



## canali (Dec 9, 2017)

AlanU said:


> AVSforum has a lot of chatter when it comes to subs. Possibly a sealed sub will be more controlled for musical nature.
> 
> The dedicated kef streamer seems neat using a tablet/smart phone device.
> 
> ...



AVS ..yes that is where i got the Rythmik and PSA brand ideas to check out.
hell perhaps even a used Funk 18.0c if i could find one....


----------



## canali

seems even highly regarded Paul McGowan of PS Audio
 loves the concept of active speakers..just not enough demand for them for PS Audio to go there.
maybe in the future things will change...who knows


----------



## davidland

great! I want it!


----------



## AlanU

The draw to higher end active speakers is definitely in it's infancy or different realm of audio.  I can agree on Paul regarding HIFI owners want to use their own gear to drive speakers.

I'm assuming many HIFI lovers want to enjoy the hobby by mix and matching to create a synergy that caters to their personal ears. A McIntosh amp/DAC will sound very different than a Bryston amp/DAC and I haven't eve discussed different Pre amps in the chain of events on a KEF LS50. 

Headphone world people will probably say pre amp HUH?? 

I think the beauty of the wireless Kef LS50 is that it sounds great and if you latch onto that sound signature it's a great all in one. No playing with different configurations in seeking different synergy or tube rolling for people seeking fun in the hobby of a seeking audio nirvana. 

I sure hope things evolve even more and have larger selection in the active speaker world. At this moment I think the LS50 has perfect applications for sleek simplicity look which is ultra clean.


----------



## canali (Dec 13, 2017)

1.  i know that *dynaudio *also has their  active speaker line under the new* focus hd* series
but i don't think that they are Roon ready ..and are also 3-4x the price.
https://www.dynaudio.com/home-audio/focus-xd/focus-20-xd

i'd read of one guy who had listened to both systems...definitely no sub needed with the dynaudios (larger driver and woofer)...
but in his op they weren't 3-4x worth the extra price (of course it's just one person's thoughts)...dynaudio makes great products, even drivers for other companies i'm told.

2. i_* bought a sub today..*_.
*SVS is having a limited run of their SB2000 in white piano gloss...will match my incoming (this sat) kef ls50 w speakers/stands both in white, too.*
https://www.svsound.com/products/sb-2000
couldn't resist...so i bought one...might eventually go for two, but can't afford right now.


----------



## wilflare

my friend's LS50 Wireless does not seem to work on WiFi.
He can't even complete the onboarding process. He keeps getting this error "Unable to retrieve a list of networks. Ensure that you have working Wi-Fi network and try again"

any ideas?


----------



## Haris Javed

wilflare said:


> my friend's LS50 Wireless does not seem to work on WiFi.
> He can't even complete the onboarding process. He keeps getting this error "Unable to retrieve a list of networks. Ensure that you have working Wi-Fi network and try again"
> 
> any ideas?



Hello - have you checked if your friends router supports 2.4ghz, and 5.0 ghz bands? The Kef ls50 will support both. Also ask your friend if the sisid is set to visible and not hidden. 

thank you


----------



## AlanU

canali said:


> 1.  i know that *dynaudio *also has their  active speaker line under the new* focus hd* series
> but i don't think that they are Roon ready ..and are also 3-4x the price.
> https://www.dynaudio.com/home-audio/focus-xd/focus-20-xd
> 
> ...



At one point Totem was using dynaudio drivers for the Totem Forest until Buzz developed his own signature driver that literally looks identical.

In audio diminishing returns or "is it worth it" are totally so personal. Digital filters seem to work somewhat but there is still no substitution to swapping DACs, pre amps or amplification. Throw analog harmonics from tube gear will change the sound one set of speakers entirely. I'll play some Paul Hardcastle and use my solid state dac but put piano into the mix... my tube DAC gets used instead of solid state. My Totem Earths sounds totally different.

Great choice on the sub!!


----------



## wilflare

Haris Javed said:


> Hello - have you checked if your friends router supports 2.4ghz, and 5.0 ghz bands? The Kef ls50 will support both. Also ask your friend if the sisid is set to visible and not hidden.
> 
> thank you



thanks! think his router is only 2.4GHz
His SSID is set to broadcast/visible

The Bluetooth on the LS50 Wireless works fine though


----------



## bearFNF

You might do a site survey with something like "Wifi Analyzer" app to check the signal strength near the speakers.


----------



## wilflare

bearFNF said:


> You might do a site survey with something like "Wifi Analyzer" app to check the signal strength near the speakers.



thanks! I think the frustrating thing for him is that all his WiFi stuff worked (all other devices) until the LS50W came along


----------



## davidland

wireless always sounds nice!


----------



## guido

just installed my new set of LS50 wireless....I find the mid/bass a bit boomy and overbearing....do you guys think this will change with burn-in?


----------



## hornytoad

guido said:


> just installed my new set of LS50 wireless....I find the mid/bass a bit boomy and overbearing....do you guys think this will change with burn-in?


I don’t . Maybe fool with the room settings if you haven’t done so already .


----------



## tamsaiming2003

guido said:


> just installed my new set of LS50 wireless....I find the mid/bass a bit boomy and overbearing....do you guys think this will change with burn-in?


Under app setting, trim bass to -5.5db


----------



## tamsaiming2003

tamsaiming2003 said:


> Under app setting, trim bass to -5.5db


Expert tab


----------



## guido

thanks, I have fiddled with the settings but it did not improve much...maybe better solid stands may help and I need to experiment with room placement


----------



## tamsaiming2003

guido said:


> thanks, I have fiddled with the settings but it did not improve much...maybe better solid stands may help and I need to experiment with room placement


LS50 Wireless run-in time, imho, 200 hours


----------



## peterinvan (Jan 12, 2018)

Boomy Bass... I have a small listening room.  My solution to the bass boom is to use advanced settings to -5,5db Bass, and +2 onTreble in the KEF Setup.  In addition, I have installed 10 acoustic panels (2” Roxul rock wool).  I also play with the DSP in Roon when necessary.   To my old (70) ears, this works really well.  I also use the iOS app Analyzer (with full spectrum Pink Noise) to locate peaks around the room and to ensure my sweet spot does not have any nasty peaks. My speakers are on sand filled stands, with the tweeter at ear height.  I like to toe them in such that I see a sliver of the inside walls of the enclosure from my listening chair.  I use an 8’ triangle setup.

 Now I listen to the LS50W speakers much more than headphones.  I love the “feel” of the sound in my body, and the the fantastic sound stage and instrument separation.

I agree that the run in is about 200 hours.


----------



## bearFNF

Yep, agree with whats been said for settings and stands. My KEF are getting a lot of time on them vs my headphones lately, also.


----------



## guido

they are sounding better already after a bit of experimentation with settings and positioning...lets see how they progress in time....and I also need to get some dedicated stands for them


----------



## AlanU

guido said:


> just installed my new set of LS50 wireless....I find the mid/bass a bit boomy and overbearing....do you guys think this will change with burn-in?



Are you using stable speaker stands?? Auralex (other brands) foam pads? Iso acoustics? 

I truly feel speakers can change with burn in. Speaker suspension IMO can slightly change as breakin occurs.  

I guess we can rule out the amplification to a certain degree. What is your source? 

I found with my Kef R100 (very similar to LS50 IMO) it had a sound like restriction. Hard to describe but the speaker had some restricted sound but over time they opened up and the bass relaxed. I know my R300 sounded muddy initially but breakin the speakers became more "accurate" and clarity improved. Price point the R300 is an extremely nice speaker IMO. 

I would give the LS50 some more time to breakin'........


----------



## AlanU

guido said:


> they are sounding better already after a bit of experimentation with settings and positioning...lets see how they progress in time....and I also need to get some dedicated stands for them



You do not really need to toe in those speakers. The Kef uniQ speakers sound dispersion is very good with excellent imaging. 

Room acoustics and speaker stands can play a large role in how the speakers sounds. Pick up some 2+ inch thick Maple wood boards underneath the speakers or speaker spikes (tonne of stuff on the market).  Tweaking is personal fun stuff!!


----------



## guido

Thanks for all your replies and suggestions.

I have the LS50s on marble stands [53cm high] and Iso Acoustic stands in between.

The marble stands are from my Norh Marble 9 speakers and may not be ideal so I will be on the lookout for dedicated stands soon...


----------



## nvfan

guido said:


> just installed my new set of LS50 wireless....I find the mid/bass a bit boomy and overbearing....do you guys think this will change with burn-in?



No, because while the resonant frequency might move around 3Hz, it would be a miracle if the room mode that was being excited was exactly the same frequency as the free air resonance frequency of your driver. Your best bet is to either move the speakers further from the walls, or run a sweep with Room EQ Wizard, figure out which frequency range is being excited, and then EQ the fundamental frequency down with something like Equalizer APO.


----------



## guido

with regards to stands I am ordering these...any thoughts?

http://www.atacama-audio.co.uk/p/hms-2-1-speaker-stands-600mm-23-6-supplied-as-a-pair


----------



## peterinvan

guido said:


> with regards to stands I am ordering these...any thoughts?
> 
> http://www.atacama-audio.co.uk/p/hms-2-1-speaker-stands-600mm-23-6-supplied-as-a-pair



My stands are 29" high and sitting in my La-Z-Boy chair, the tweeters are now at the height of my ears.  They are not expensive stands, but I filled them with dense sand and installed carpet spikes.  Very happy.

These 24" stands look a bit low.  Measure your ear height in your listening chair.


----------



## guido (Jan 14, 2018)

24" is the recommended height for this size of speaker...any higher would be above ear level for most sitting situations on a sofa or couch...at least for my height and furniture choices


----------



## guido

oh my gosh...these KEFS are starting to make my jaw drop...and they have not even run in yet and are not sitting on very solid stands...can't wait for the Atacamas to arrive


----------



## guido

My wife who knows nothing about hi-fi or common terminology sat down and took a listen to some Tin Hat Trio and her first words were..."they sound like they are playing in 3D"....


----------



## Blueshound24

guido said:


> My wife who knows nothing about hi-fi or common terminology sat down and took a listen to some Tin Hat Trio and her first words were..."they sound like they are playing in 3D"....



Yes, if you get them just right they are very holographic in their soundstage, I think due to the concentric tweeter they are so coherent, especially good for nearfield.


----------



## peterinvan

Blueshound24 said:


> Yes, if you get them just right they are very holographic in their soundstage, I think due to the concentric tweeter they are so coherent, especially good for nearfield.



I believe the DSP and timing synchronization also plays a big part in producing such a clear image around the instruments and artists.  No passive crossovers muddying the waters.


----------



## Blueshound24

peterinvan said:


> I believe the DSP and timing synchronization also plays a big part in producing such a clear image around the instruments and artists.  No passive crossovers muddying the waters.



I only have the lowly un-powered passive LS50's, and they do not have the _magic_ of this "DSP" you speak of, and I think they are just fine without it.


----------



## AlanU

Blueshound24 said:


> I only have the lowly un-powered passive LS50's, and they do not have the _magic_ of this "DSP" you speak of, and I think they are just fine without it.



Blueshound at least you can colour the sound by adding harmonics with Tube gear. There's more options with crossover passive speakers to a degree. 

Sound dispersion of the uniQ speaker is very impressive considering the price point of the speakers. 

Everyone has different ears but sometimes Tube amps can create holographic sound that is unlike solid state amplification. Amplification with digital solid state transistors still has a different sound that separates from tube gear.

I guess attempting to make some form of analogy it's like comparing a pair of Senn HD800S vs Hifiman HE1000 v2.


----------



## canali (Jan 22, 2018)

seems Elac is in the game of active speakers, too, such that it garnered kudos at the latest CES:

let's hope more players step up with additional active speaker offerings.

*Best of CES 2018: 
ELAC Argo B51 Wireless Powered Speakers *
http://www.avsforum.com/best-of-ces-2018-elac-argo-series-powered-speakers/


----------



## guido

After having read the reports about sound quality using the RCA inputs and an external DAC on these speakers I tried it myself and am pleasantly surprised by the results. 

I am using a heavily modified Yulong DA8 DAC and definitely feel there is an improvement in detail retrieval and overall sound quality compared to using the USB input on these speakers.

I have no idea why this is the case, especially bearing in mind that the RCA analog inputs are resampled by the internal DAC of the speakers...


----------



## canali

guido said:


> After having read the reports about sound quality using the RCA inputs and an external DAC on these speakers I tried it myself and am pleasantly surprised by the results.
> 
> I am using a heavily modified Yulong DA8 DAC and definitely feel there is an improvement in detail retrieval and overall sound quality compared to using the USB input on these speakers.
> 
> I have no idea why this is the case, especially bearing in mind that the RCA analog inputs are resampled by the internal DAC of the speakers...



i contacted kef on this as i was wanting to experiment with my chord mojo... impression i got is that
you can't override  kef's internal dac as everything (even an analog signal) goes their their digital system.


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## guido

Yes, I know the internal DAC cannot be bypassed but the result is as I reported...perhaps the external DAC being of high quality interprets the digital signal in its own special way and then sends it to the DAC of the KEFS which modifies it less...

Perhaps try with your Mojo and see what happens....


----------



## canali

from kef:

_(KEF America)

Jan 22, 11:09 EST

Good Morning,
There is no way to bypass the internal DAC on the speakers.
 What specifically were you trying to accomplish--I can possibly 
point you to another means of achieving your preferred sound.
Best,

Technical Services Agent_


----------



## guido

yes, I get the part that the RCA inputs are resampled by the DAC...what I wanted to know was if people have noticed differences when using an external DAC


----------



## canali

guido said:


> yes, I get the part that the RCA inputs are resampled by the DAC...what I wanted to know was if people have noticed differences when using an external DAC



yes interesting...i sent kef this thread and got this f/u.
maybe i'll fool around with my chord mojo after all.

_Good Afternoon,
It is possible that there is a very slight coloration of the music as interpreted by the DAC 
the poster has placed in line in his set up. In either case, it will be represented with high fidelity
 after having been interpreted by the internal DAC. Pleases bear in mind that ultimately, these
 are subjective suggestions. There is nothing wrong with using an additional DAC, but whenever you 
add components into the signal path you will add the potential for distortion. 
Best,

KEF Technical Services Agent_


----------



## AlanU

canali said:


> from kef:
> 
> _(KEF America)
> 
> ...




I’m blown away that there is no bypass of the internal dac 

I would assume there would be difficulties in colouring the source.  I guess analyze and play with other external dac,


----------



## maskapl

Hi there. I’ve a technical question which I can’t find answer anywhere online so far. I understand that all rca input into Kef Ls50 Wirless are going through the internal dac, is that mean that music play through turntable and cd will sound similar because signals are going through internal dac?


----------



## peterinvan

maskapl said:


> Hi there. I’ve a technical question which I can’t find answer anywhere online so far. I understand that all rca input into Kef Ls50 Wirless are going through the internal dac, is that mean that music play through turntable and cd will sound similar because signals are going through internal dac?


My understanding is that analogue into the RCA will be digitized through an ADC.  Then it is processed by the DACs, and the DSP before the internal amplifiers.  The analogue source (phono or CD player) may sound different.  Trial is the only way I am aware of to determine how different.


----------



## AlanU

maskapl said:


> Hi there. I’ve a technical question which I can’t find answer anywhere online so far. I understand that all rca input into Kef Ls50 Wirless are going through the internal dac, is that mean that music play through turntable and cd will sound similar because signals are going through internal dac?



It would be a nice comparison you can do yourself.  I would assume the vinyl / analog signal would already have some changes that is "coloured" vs a digital CD.  

If Kef's internal dac has a neutral presentation you should hear a difference since the source from a turntable should sound different between a CD. I'm not too keen on an analog signal going through stages of Analog to digital then back to analog. This takes away the hobby of playing with components to seek synergy/character you can tweak.


----------



## maskapl

Thanks guys. I’ll try to do this comparision, and I’m bit confused about how to judge signla from vinyl to KEFs. I’ve sold my passive ls50 and nice amplifier now to get wirless version. It will be good to compare two setups to find out level of detail from vinyl.


----------



## AlanU

maskapl said:


> Thanks guys. I’ll try to do this comparision, and I’m bit confused about how to judge signla from vinyl to KEFs. I’ve sold my passive ls50 and nice amplifier now to get wirless version. It will be good to compare two setups to find out level of detail from vinyl.



I'm eager to hear about your comparison.

As we all have different pairs of ears ....we'll all have different preferences. I do enjoy my Kef R300 as they have more bass and sweeter mids than the LS50 and it also has a coloured kef signature that is a little warmer/darker. The female vocals sounds more intimate with "real" presence  to my ears compared to the LS50 or R100 (I own the R100 which are surprisingly very similar to the LS50) speakers. Beauty is I can change the signature a bit by using solid state DAC or Tube dac. The LS50 has excellent imaging which is common in all of the Kef UniQ configuration. 

The wireless Ls50 I auditioned resolved the music with great detail. I think the passive LS50 with organic analog vinyl would present differently than a vinyl fed to the digital cct setup in the wireless LS50.

Please do tell.....


----------



## maskapl

I had Ls50 with Rogue Audio Sphinx V2 and it sounds amazing, but hiss from tubes was just killing me. I couldnd bear it any more. Wirless version with vinyl sounds amazing, definitely better and very organic than my past set up. All the instruments are on the perfect possition. It was more technical question, “on paper” , how the signal from cartrige is delivered to ears via kef ls50w. Do we loose resolution of detail from cartrige? To my ears sound amazing and they are keepers for sure.


----------



## jologskyblues (Feb 7, 2018)

It's looking like speaker companies are taking notice of the potential of these Hi-Fi consumer actives. I wouldn't be surprised if more and more hi-fi speaker companies followed suit. I do think the rising popularity of consumer hifi active speakers are starting to worry audio component manufacturers because that would cannibalize the sales of certain segments of their product stack.

I for one, look forward to seeing more consumer hifi actives because of my numerous experiences of buyers remorse with component mismatches after having spent my hard earned money and ending up with disappointing performance and the hassle of returning or selling off the offending component. For example,  I still remember going through a lot of DACs before I found the right one and while I was happy in the end, the journey to get there was agonizing. Shops in my country do not have easy return or exchange policies and they do not usually allow home auditions to really test out the synergy of things. Self contained active speaker systems with all the optimization done by the manufacturer takes the guesswork and trial and error out of the equation and makes my auditioning and purchasing decisions more straightforward so I can stop worrying about the hardware and just go straight to enjoying the music.


----------



## guido

I concur 100%  ,,,  and no more tinkering with speaker cables, interconnects, endless tweaks and permutations...since unboxing my KEF LS50 wireless I have been enjoying music like never before without continuously worrying about tweaking everything and swapping things around dozens of times.


----------



## maskapl

guido said:


> I concur 100%  ,,,  and no more tinkering with speaker cables, interconnects, endless tweaks and permutations...since unboxing my KEF LS50 wireless I have been enjoying music like never before without continuously worrying about tweaking everything and swapping things around dozens of times.



Amen


----------



## techtonic

Around the 16:00 is relevant to the discussion but the rest is good too. Also the ELAC Argo B51 Wireless is looking to compete with the LS50W.


----------



## jcn3

maskapl said:


> Hi there. I’ve a technical question which I can’t find answer anywhere online so far. I understand that all rca input into Kef Ls50 Wirless are going through the internal dac, is that mean that music play through turntable and cd will sound similar because signals are going through internal dac?


no -- vinyl lps and cds are different technologies so you're not really listening to the same thing, so it'll sound different.
btw -- if you want to use a turntable, you'll need a phono pre (unless there's one built into your turntable).


----------



## AlanU

guido said:


> I concur 100%  ,,,  and no more tinkering with speaker cables, interconnects, endless tweaks and permutations...since unboxing my KEF LS50 wireless I have been enjoying music like never before without continuously worrying about tweaking everything and swapping things around dozens of times.



  I'm shocked as I literally do not know any audio hifi person fully 100% satisfied with the synergy of audio components.   Most hifi folks are not easy to please 

Glad to hear the LS50 sings to your ears. Speakers are like selecting headphones.....I see why people have different sets of headphones for certain genre music. 

Still think source is more critical as a good digital amp shouldn't be colouring the sound as it should be neutral. Colouring with tubes is another story


----------



## JohannLiebert

The LS50W are so good they are making me sell my whole headphone equipment. Greatly enjoy them.


----------



## peterinvan

JohannLiebert said:


> The LS50W are so good they are making me sell my whole headphone equipment. Greatly enjoy them.


I understand your enthusiasm, however, don't sell ALL your headphones, as there are times you will need to listen quietly to your music, and not disturb the neighbors or your family/friends.  Enjoy!


----------



## Peter Hyatt

peterinvan said:


> I understand your enthusiasm, however, don't sell ALL your headphones, as there are times you will need to listen quietly to your music, and not disturb the neighbors or your family/friends.  Enjoy!



I agree.  

I, too, love the LS50Ws but there are not only quiet moments but times when I want to have deep critical listening. Ambient noise doesn't allow for this.  If it is not a financial issue, I hope you can keep both.


----------



## JohannLiebert (Jun 25, 2018)

Of course I will not sell off atleast my last portable IEM.
I will keep either my Prophile 8, Earsonics ES5 or Oriolus. Before I switched between them at home but now it is 90% LS50W


----------



## canali (Jun 25, 2018)

i am so not into headphone gear the last little while.
prefer speakers' sound 95% of the time.
heck i'll even take the sonos play 3 at my kitchen table vs 
 my chord mojo and iems or confining headphones
...there is just something about sound coming from outside my head 
that i find immensely more enjoyable


----------



## AlanU

I would definitely keep a pair of decent IEM's at least.

When I want easy listening and less reference sound I enjoy a pair of my Kef R300. However there are times I'd prefer my Tube dac source feeding my Totem Acoustics Earth speakers for substantially more sound dispersion and emotion than the Kef LS50.  I still truly like the sound of a tube amplifier adding harmonics to make the non amplified KEF LS50's more musical and less digital/reference. The key factor is listening space..........

Amazing how we all have preferences.  Listening to my Totem's it makes my Campfire Andromeda's sound like Apple iphone earbuds


----------



## Chikolad

Hi Everyone,

I'm copying this post from the one I just made at the Roon forums as you might also be able to help me.

Today I bought a pair LS50W’s second hand from a local guy (sadly they are not sold in my country).
Now, I have zero experience with loudspeakers, as thus far I have been into headphones exclusively. My reference setup is currently Audeze LCD-3 headphones connected to a Chord Hugo 2.
I brought the speakers home and hooked them up, and I put them on my IKEA TV cabinet (this one, if it matters: https://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/60239715/) as I have no speaker stands yet. I reckon the distance between the speakers was 1.2-1.3 meters. And the cabinet is 50 cm high. The speakers were maybe 15-20 cm from the wall (>30cm is recommended, I know).

After reading all of the rave reviews I expected to be blown away by these speakers… but I wasn’t.
The bass felt one-note at times and uneven, the treble didn’t sparkle as I imagined it would… it just didn’t feel “hifi” enough. The sound was rather smooth though, pretty cohesive, and vocals stood out rather nicely. Sound stage wasn’t very good imo and didn’t feel 3-D like or holographic. Everything was happening in the space between the speakers.

Granted, I only had about an hour to play around with them. I tried the different switches of the EQ to represent the room and the physical setup but eventually, weirdly, preferred the default setting.

I’m trying to understand if the fault is with the placement of the speakers and the room (can the difference be that big?), my expectations (coming from a really good headphone setup), or the speakers themselves.
I have found 2 examples online, one of them on Amazon, of people who received speakers that didn’t sound faulty but also didn’t sound very good. They compared them to passive LS50’s that sounded better. These people had their LS50W’s replaced and the new ones sounded a lot better.

Reading through this thread, I didn’t see anyone having a problem with the sound of the speakers, just with various defects.

Could it be that I was sold one of those not so great sounding pairs? I would hate to think so…
I would appreciate any thoughts on this matter from experienced people like you


----------



## D2Girls (Aug 6, 2018)

@Chikolad 

I can tell you that 1.3m distance apart is not enough. Try at least 2 meters. It really depends on your room but youre going to want to pull them at least 2 feet away from the wall and at least 6 feet apart. From the sounds of your descriptions on they sound its a room and placement issue.


----------



## bearFNF

Chikolad said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I'm copying this post from the one I just made at the Roon forums as you might also be able to help me.
> 
> ...



i posted some ideas for you over there.


----------



## jologskyblues

Chikolad said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I'm copying this post from the one I just made at the Roon forums as you might also be able to help me.
> 
> ...



One note bass from a good speaker is a sign that the room acoustics may be major issue in your case that even the built in room correction cannot compensate for. Experiment with positioning, get stands and perhaps invest in bass traps. 

On th other hand, it may be that the sound is simply not in line with your preferences and expectations. At worst, the LS50W speakers you got are defective. In any case, a proper audition would have been more prudent prior to making that purchase decision.


----------



## Chikolad

D2Girls said:


> @Chikolad
> 
> I can tell you that 1.3m distance apart is not enough. Try at least 2 meters. It really depends on your room but youre going to want to pull them at least 2 feet away from the wall and at least 6 feet apart. From the sounds of your descriptions on they sound its a room and placement issue.


Thank you! I sure hope that it's just the room acoustics


----------



## Chikolad

bearFNF said:


> i posted some ideas for you over there.


Thanks! I replied to you over there


----------



## Chikolad

jologskyblues said:


> One note bass from a good speaker is a sign that the room acoustics may be major issue in your case that even the built in room correction cannot compensate for. Experiment with positioning, get stands and perhaps invest in bass traps.
> 
> On th other hand, it may be that the sound is simply not in line with your preferences and expectations. At worst, the LS50W speakers you got are defective. In any case, a proper audition would have been more prudent prior to making that purchase decision.



I actually paid after I listened to them in my house. At that time I couldn't imagine that they can be defective but sound "normal", i.e. no obvious signs of something being broken. Only later I read about those cases where defective sets just didn't sound impressive enough.
With the reviews I read they seemed like the perfect choice for me because I have no amp and didn't want to invest in a new DAC. I will use these in the living room for more casual listening with the family and to connect to the TV.
I will try to play around with the room and hopefully reach something I'm satisfied with.


----------



## AlanU

How many hours of breakin??? Some may not believe breakin but for the LS50 the suspension needs to work in a bit for the speakers to open up. I spoke to a local high end shop and they told me the LS50 wireless sounded HORRIBLE when they first unboxed the units. It took them weeks and weeks of playing the speakers non stop after hours when the shop was closed for the night. 

I take my easy listening Kef R300 bookshelves over my Kef R100 (very similar to the LS50 non amplified). R300 is Warmer, marginally less transparent but much more enjoyable to listen too. Bass response is much deeper than the LS50. 

The only way I would listen to the LS50 is using a tube amp for more analog sound that is less critical. This is just my taste so everyone is different.

If you want to have critical listening I think the wireless LS50 is a good one package deal. Less tweaking capabilities but "it is what it is" and in the hifi world that's not accepted with open arms in most cases.

The price of non amplified LS50 is an extremely inexpensive bargain for what you get. Matching that with a capable amp and vinyl or tube dac would sound much better than a digital wireless in my views.

Just my take on the speaker world.....


----------



## Chikolad

AlanU said:


> How many hours of breakin??? Some may not believe breakin but for the LS50 the suspension needs to work in a bit for the speakers to open up. I spoke to a local high end shop and they told me the LS50 wireless sounded HORRIBLE when they first unboxed the units. It took them weeks and weeks of playing the speakers non stop after hours when the shop was closed for the night.
> 
> I take my easy listening Kef R300 bookshelves over my Kef R100 (very similar to the LS50 non amplified). R300 is Warmer, marginally less transparent but much more enjoyable to listen too. Bass response is much deeper than the LS50.
> 
> ...


They're second hand so plenty of break in... 
Tried a little more tweaking today, still no stands but managed to set them further apart and I also toed them in a little. The result is better, and they definitely sound much better with the volume turned way up (not surprising). I highly doubt that they're faulty but it still worries me because I find it hard to believe that all of the reviewers and owners heard something similar to what I'm getting and thought it was the best thing since sliced bread.
Maybe my living room is really that bad... I just expected them to be crisper and shinier, if that makes any sense. The sound is decent, but not what I'd call audiophile.


----------



## JohannLiebert

Well they are on the smoother side. They won't throw details on you like Adam Monitors for example would or any headphones.
Still it is all a preference game. I think they are wonderful at what they are doing.


----------



## Chikolad

JohannLiebert said:


> Well they are on the smoother side. They won't throw details on you like Adam Monitors for example would or any headphones.
> Still it is all a preference game. I think they are wonderful at what they are doing.


Well that's comforting I guess 
Like I said I have no speaker experience so I don't know what a system at that price should sound like.


----------



## guido

I tested he analog RCA inputs vs the PC inputs again.

The analog RCA inputs fed by my Aries Femto streamer > Yulong D8 [highly modified] DAC sound way better than the Aries straight into the PC [USB] inputs or using the KEF app as a streamer.

It is not even close....there is so much more warmth, realism ...everything improves through the analog inputs even though I know the analog signal is resampled by the  KEFs DAC .

Obviously this analog signal I am sending the KEFs is of a much higher quality then the one decoded by only the KEFs DAC.....

Just sharing my experience....


----------



## jologskyblues (Aug 8, 2018)

AlanU said:


> How many hours of breakin??? Some may not believe breakin but for the LS50 the suspension needs to work in a bit for the speakers to open up. I spoke to a local high end shop and they told me the LS50 wireless sounded HORRIBLE when they first unboxed the units. It took them weeks and weeks of playing the speakers non stop after hours when the shop was closed for the night.
> 
> The only way I would listen to the LS50 is using a tube amp for more analog sound that is less critical. This is just my taste so everyone is different.
> 
> ...



That's strange, my experience with my own LS50W was quite the contrary. Like so many others, when I got this pair of actives, out of the box, it was anything but horrible and I was actually impressed with the detail and mainly, the quality (and quantity) bass response that these compact actives were able to deliver. This was before they were even broken in.

Another good thing about them is that they come with settings that allow the user to tweak and tune its sound and the firmware and control app updates have also improved the software package which by now, pretty much resolved the bugs they had when the model launched. The sub out management section of the sound settings app of the LS50W is a godsend, especially now that I have a dual sub setup. Along with my miniDSP UMIK-1 mic and REW, the subwoofer management really made integration a breeze to do to make sure the subs only step in to handle the lowest of the low frequencies whilst minimizing overlapping frequency issues between the mains and the subs. The only thing it needs now is a distance (time alignment) setting which hopefully could be introduced in a future firmware/app update.

I previously owned the passive LS50 and while it was great overall, particularly with the sound stage and holographic quality of the sound courtesy of the Uni-Q array, it's main weakness was that the bass was quite bloated and uncontrolled. I had to fully plug the ports to run it sealed and set my SVS SB12NSD sub to take over the bass duties at around 100~110Hz on the LPF to make them sound perfect. Also, it's quite well known that the LS50's also need powerful and (expensive) amps to do them justice. Something that I don't have to worry about anymore with the Wireless version.

Sound-wise and feature-wise, the LS50W totally blows the passive LS50 out of the water at least in my experience. There was no comparison.



guido said:


> I tested he analog RCA inputs vs the PC inputs again.
> 
> The analog RCA inputs fed by my Aries Femto streamer > Yulong D8 [highly modified] DAC sound way better than the Aries straight into the PC [USB] inputs or using the KEF app as a streamer.
> 
> ...



I also noticed that the ADC converter of the KEF is the most transparent I've ever heard. I tried using an outboard HRT DAC connected to the AUX inputs and while that may seem counter intuitive with the double conversion happening, I still heard the familiar warm sound signature of that DAC through the LS50W's ADC. The only difference was the output volume is slightly lower. I have since connected my Rega Planar 3 turntable and again, the analog sound of vinyl was fully resolved by the ADC.


----------



## guido

...another advantage of using the RCA inputs is that one can take full advantage of the DSD and upsampling features of an external DAC instead of being limited to 192 on the USB input...


----------



## AlanU

I guess that there is no passive filter there is more "tweaking" capabilities.

I am impressed with Kef. I actually use the Kef's R series and T300 slim line speakers for my 9.1 channel home theater and not for critical listening.  For my chill background music I'm using HEOS and stream Tidal on my Denon AVR. I also have a 5.1 setup in my bedroom using Q series and T100 slim series. 

Since we are subjective in hearing I will say the price point of the Kef LS50W is a great bang for the buck. The kef sound is quite nice. I listened to a pair of $3200 Emit M30 dynaudio towers with a Moon neo 240 integrated and it was questionably tad better than the LS50W. Diminishing returns even for cheap mid/hifi gear.    

The original passive speaker folks can use any type of amplification, DAC, interconnects and speaker wires. Throwing on vinyl to a tube dac or solid state dac you can change the sound exactly the way you like it. 

The Kef dac reprocessing RCA's just baffles me but I guess it works. Hifi 2 channel people are different folks that typically seem to look down upon equalizer or using digital filters on DAC's. They will tweak with power conditioning, cabling, different pre amps/amps and tweak a room before telling friends they used an equalizer. However speaking with a person proud of their home theater they'll admit they love room calibration via software. 

I stopped buying speakers after I purchased Canadian made Totem Earth speakers. I tame them with my power rectifier and tube dac setup and it' quite analog sounding like vinyl. My friends certainly have much more expensive stereo's but at the end of the day we must be happy with our ears.

I've auditioned the kef LS50W in a tuned sound room and it did sound very good. I also listened to my R300 with a Nait Supernait integrated amp. All sorta has kef wide soundstage with great imaging but the R300 just sounds more pleasing to me for reasonably priced R series speakers. The R300 true large 3 way speaker is not very common these days I suppose but the bass just is not as tight as the LS50W but the R300 seems to dig deeper giving me more "full" satisfaction.


----------



## Blueshound24

Chikolad said:


> They're second hand so plenty of break in...
> Tried a little more tweaking today, still no stands but managed to set them further apart and I also toed them in a little. The result is better, and they definitely sound much better with the volume turned way up (not surprising). I highly doubt that they're faulty but it still worries me because I find it hard to believe that all of the reviewers and owners heard something similar to what I'm getting and thought it was the best thing since sliced bread.
> Maybe my living room is really that bad... I just expected them to be crisper and shinier, if that makes any sense. The sound is decent, but not what I'd call audiophile.




Have you tried placing the foam plugs in the port in the rear? I've found that really tightens up everything and with more detail, especially if you can't get them out away from the wall very much.


----------



## Chikolad

Blueshound24 said:


> Have you tried placing the foam plugs in the port in the rear? I've found that really tightens up everything and with more detail, especially if you can't get them out away from the wall very much.



I don't have any foam plugs 
They don't come with the LS50W as far as I know


----------



## Blueshound24 (Aug 9, 2018)

Chikolad said:


> I don't have any foam plugs
> They don't come with the LS50W as far as I know



They came with my wired LS50, I would think they should come with the wireless as well?

If not, you should be able to make your own out of some foam to experiment with.

(Edited for clarity on wireless vs wired)


----------



## Chikolad

Blueshound24 said:


> They came with my non-wireless LS50, I would think they should come with the wired as well?
> 
> If not, you should be able to make your own out of some foam to experiment with.


They don't. I think maybe because KEF relies on its DSP features to be able to adjust the bass and match it with the room.


----------



## jologskyblues

The wireless version doesn't come with the foam plugs unlike the passive version which has those oval-shaped 2-piece foam plugs. The wireless version doesn't need them because the bass extension can be adjusted electronically.

Anyway, I used to just use socks to plug the rear ports of my old speakers. It seemed to work. lol


----------



## canali (Aug 17, 2018)

i might be selling my MR 1.4, cardas cable, and lps ultracaps power supply.
from what I understand, the MR has  no use with the kefs (closed digital dac system and now ROON ready)...and i hardly listen to cans at my desk anymore.
i'm happy with my sonos play 3 at my desk...or chord mojo and iems on the go.


----------



## canali

is anyone here using the microrendu with their kef ls50 w speakers?
i've read with last update to kef speakers it almost makes the MR unnecessary, however.


----------



## guido

Can anyone get the new Kef Control app to work on IOS?



Mine stops working after the first attempt and I have to reinstall it every time...


----------



## jologskyblues (Aug 20, 2018)

guido said:


> Can anyone get the new Kef Control app to work on IOS?
> 
> 
> 
> Mine stops working after the first attempt and I have to reinstall it every time...



The KEF Control app runs fine on my iPhone. My only issue is that my sound settings for the subs resets after turning off the speakers so I have to re-apply the saved preset every time I turn on the speakers.

Edit:

The KEF Control App was just updated. You might want to try updating to see if that solves your issues.


----------



## smilemantts

guido said:


> Can anyone get the new Kef Control app to work on IOS?
> 
> 
> 
> Mine stops working after the first attempt and I have to reinstall it every time...



Ditto on my iPad, although seems to work fine on the iPhone.


----------



## guido

KEF's apps are truly horrendous...


----------



## Cadtot

Today, my Kef LS50 Wireless speakers made a very loud crack noise, the UPS on my NAS indicated a power variation and the speakers are now DEAD. I purchased them in April 2017, so they are only 18 months old. Scanning the Internet, the symptoms indicate that the power supply has failed on the right speaker.

Very good speakers but as a 40-year user of Kef speakers, this is a bit disappointing, and I expected better.

Hopefully, they will be repaired under warranty?


----------



## jologskyblues

New KEF control app and firmware update just released. Stream app now supports gap less playback over WiFi. App and WIFI connectivity with the LS50W is also more reliable now. 

Probably the most interesting thing in the KEF ontrol app change log is the added support for the KEF LSX. Must be an upcoming wireless active model. If so, I’m glad to see that KEF is continuing to pursue actives in the consumer Hifi segment.


----------



## canali

thanks for the heads up.

hey anyone use the ifi spdif ipurifier with the kefs and (let's say) their TV?
i'm just trying to enjoy these for hd /4k tv concerts ...


----------



## peterinvan

I am using the original iPurifier and the Original iPower in series with my USB feed to the LS50W.  I also have ferrite collars on all my interconnects (Ethernet/USB).
I owned all these components before I bought the LS50W.

I cannot say with certainty that they make any difference, as my Windows system has never showed signs of interference or distortion.


----------



## canali

thanks...i have one svs sb2000 sub (in piano white to match the kefs) ...now considering adding a 2nd (same) sub for more even bass distribution and to get rid of the nulls/peaks/dips (whatever it's all called)


----------



## jologskyblues (Oct 20, 2018)

canali said:


> thanks...i have one svs sb2000 sub (in piano white to match the kefs) ...now considering adding a 2nd (same) sub for more even bass distribution and to get rid of the nulls/peaks/dips (whatever it's all called)



I suggest you do a bit more research on how to connect and integrate two subs to the KEF LS50W before deciding to invest in a second sub. I bought a second SB12NSD connected via Y-splitter to the  speakers a couple of months ago and until now, I haven't quite figured out how to properly level-match and configure a dual sub setup so I've left the other sub unused for now since it's actually easier for me to tweak a single sub to sound right with the LS50Ws and the room. I'm pretty sure I'm doing something wrong.

On another note, I just saw this interesting interview of Andrew Jones talking about actives vs. passives and the guy really makes sense about the two sides.


----------



## canali

jologskyblues said:


> I suggest you do a bit more research on how to connect and integrate two subs to the KEF LS50W before deciding to invest in a second sub. I bought a second SB12NSD connected via Y-splitter to the  speakers a couple of months ago and until now, I haven't quite figured out how to properly level-match and configure a dual sub setup so I've left the other sub unused for now since it's actually easier for me to tweak a single sub to sound right with the LS50Ws and the room. I'm pretty sure I'm doing something wrong.
> 
> On another note, I just saw this interesting interview of Andrew Jones talking about actives vs. passives and the guy really makes sense about the two sides.
> 
> ...


----------



## jologskyblues

canali said:


> what do you mean y can't level match them? i thought the volume would be the same between them...or am i not understanding?



In my near field desktop setup, the relative placement and orientation of the subs affected each sub's acoustic room/corner response where one sub was noticeably louder than the other even if the settings were identical. I had to lower the gain setting on the other sub almost to the point of having no output and I wasn't even sure if the bass sounded balanced. I have very limited space so I don't have much flexibility on finding the optimal positions for the subs. It was much easier for me to position and dial in the settings for one sub only to get the most even sounding bass from my listening location.

I'm still planning on figuring out a way to do dual subs properly though. It's just that I'm pretty happy with what I've got at the moment.


----------



## canali

ok i get it...but what about the bass...i hear it's more uniform,less boomy with less nulls etc?
i'm considering a 2nd sub but i rent in a home...if i have to leave to an apt or other in future i'll inevitably have to sell it.
(as you know most condo/apt dwellers hate subs)


----------



## jologskyblues

canali said:


> ok i get it...but what about the bass...i hear it's more uniform,less boomy with less nulls etc?
> i'm considering a 2nd sub but i rent in a home...if i have to leave to an apt or other in future i'll inevitably have to sell it.
> (as you know most condo/apt dwellers hate subs)



From what I recall, I honestly couldn't accurately tell whether the having dual subs made the bass response have less nulls or peaks because bass sounded quite uniform and not boomy with one sub to begin with. It was just that with two subs, the sum of both subs' output made the bass more prominent. 

Of course, this was in my case and your setup and room are different from mine so YMMV on dual subs.


----------



## psikey (Nov 2, 2018)

Yep, just ordered a set of black KEF LSX, released yesterday in UK. No idea on shipping time yet. Its a mini LS50W at half the price !!







First video review by Darko

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...239D4051FB56FA458093239D4051FB56&&FORM=VRDGAR


----------



## canali (Nov 2, 2018)

nice, congrats.
 i saw that Darko review yesterday
..these would be good for a small room, kitchen or desktop or a more limited budget of course.
...am interested in these to replace my sonos 3 in kitchen.

btw, what colour did you get?

please do share your impressions once set up.

enjoy!


----------



## koven

I also ordered the LSX. LS50 was too big for my desktop but the X looks perfect size!


----------



## psikey (Nov 3, 2018)

Getting the Black ones. Really like the Green & Blue but ultimately needs to fit with my décor so gone safe with the Black.

Just had KEF update that UPS are delivering mine on Monday. Booked Tuesday off work to set-up & have a good play.

I was actually about to order a set of LS50W for £1629 but really too large for my rooms. My lounge is only 4m x 4m and my gaming/music room where they are going is only 2.5m x 2m.

Speakers to go each side of monitors


----------



## psikey (Nov 5, 2018)

Arrived and installed using some dense foam yoga block for RHS as stand for anti-vibration and height levelling.

Totally balanced sound with ultra clear mids, impactful but not over bearing or muddy base and nice tingly treble. Certainly no need for a separate woofer in my room. Speaker version of my SE846's 

Tidal fully integrated with KEF App and the best sounding with Tidal Master tracks. Currently Spotify only works connected via BT but still sounds great as does optical from PS4Pro and even 3.5mm out of my PC's onboard sound.

Total simplicity to set-up.

Photo from listening position on sofa.





Only issues I'm finding at the moment is the KEF Streaming app for Tidal account where the next song sometimes seems to take a while to start playing and the physical remote next/previous buttons don't do anything when playing Tidal (play/pause does). Not tried tracks on my NAS DLNA yet.

These will not replace a good 5.1 system for movies but seem to be awesome for music. For my room size they seem perfect & can't image how they could be improved to be honest.

Just went straight to using cable link between the pair (24/96) not wireless (24/48) so don't know If sounds any different wireless.

With some tracks its like I'm in the bar listening live ! Can't believe the impact of the base for the size.

Massive volume potential. Its loud for me at 52%. I'm in a detached house but anything over 65% is unbearable to my hearing (as I said, my room is only 2.5mx2m)


----------



## crafft

Nice!! I'm also interested in the LSX. Hope they will be available soon in the Netherlands.


----------



## alex804

If i use computer as source playing dsd or other format file and output via usb to my audiolab M-Dac+, and then rca out to ls50w, will the sq be benefited adding an external dac for my case? do it bypass the internal dac of ls50w? The M-Dac+ can decode dsd but ls50w cannot.


----------



## guido

Read my posting and others too....using the RCA input from an external DAC you do not bypass the internal DAC in the KEFs but for some reason it definitely sounds better ....to my ears and with my DAC at least

Try both setups and decide for yourself


----------



## jologskyblues (Nov 7, 2018)

alex804 said:


> If i use computer as source playing dsd or other format file and output via usb to my audiolab M-Dac+, and then rca out to ls50w, will the sq be benefited adding an external dac for my case? do it bypass the internal dac of ls50w? The M-Dac+ can decode dsd but ls50w cannot.



As guido has already explained above, the internal DACs are not bypassable due to the active DSP design of the speakers. The RCA inputs go through an ADC step but the good thing about the LS50W's ADC, DSP and internal DACs are that they're high resolution (24-bits 192KHz) and very transparent so that the sound signature of any source connected is quite audible including outboard DACs. Actually, I have a Rega P3 turntable hooked up to it and I can very much hear the distinctive analog sound of vinyl through the LS50W.

About the LSX, I'm pretty disappointed that it doesn't have a USB input seeing that these would make ideal desktop computer speakers. I can definitely tell that the USB connection sounds superior to the WiFi and Bluetooth connections on my LS50W.


----------



## beemarman

psikey said:


> Getting the Black ones. Really like the Green & Blue but ultimately needs to fit with my décor so gone safe with the Black.
> 
> 
> I was actually about to order a set of LS50W for £1629 but really too large for my rooms. My lounge is only 4m x 4m and my gaming/music room where they are going is only 2.5m x 2m.
> ...



Hi,

Where can you get the LS50W   for £1629?


----------



## psikey

beemarman said:


> Hi,
> 
> Where can you get the LS50W   for £1629?



Price gone up a bit

https://www.bax-shop.co.uk/home-audio-speakers/kef-ls50-wireless-gloss-white-hi-fi-speaker-set. £1647

Also Black & Grey for same price


----------



## beemarman

psikey said:


> Price gone up a bit
> 
> https://www.bax-shop.co.uk/home-audio-speakers/kef-ls50-wireless-gloss-white-hi-fi-speaker-set. £1647
> 
> Also Black & Grey for same price


Thanks


----------



## llamaluv

guido said:


> Read my posting and others too....using the RCA input from an external DAC you do not bypass the internal DAC in the KEFs but for some reason it definitely sounds better



This has been my experience as well. 

Fed via RCA, the LS50W manages to retain the positive sonic qualities I've grown to love from my external DAC. Direct from USB by contrast, the speakers sound a little harsher in the upper-mids and a little more digital.


----------



## crafft

Went to the iEar audio show in the Netherlands this weekend to hear the LSX. They were demoed alongside the LS50w. As much as I liked the bigger LS50w I was not happy with the sound of the LSX. I heard a demo in a large crowded room as well as in a small room. Each time I heard the LSX there was an annoying resonance to the sound. And each time they sounded rather nasal. I came to the conclusion these are not for me.


----------



## psikey (Nov 24, 2018)

crafft said:


> Went to the iEar audio show in the Netherlands this weekend to hear the LSX. They were demoed alongside the LS50w. As much as I liked the bigger LS50w I was not happy with the sound of the LSX. I heard a demo in a large crowded room as well as in a small room. Each time I heard the LSX there was an annoying resonance to the sound. And each time they sounded rather nasal. I came to the conclusion these are not for me.



We all hear things differently. Five main reviews now on the net and all giving full marks describing them as little wonders.

Haven't stopped listening to music since I got them, and now have full Roon Endpoint & Spotify Connect.


----------



## Flater

Anyone who compared LS50 wireless with Neumann KH 120?


----------



## Mr.Z

I have a white pair. It is great speakers. I also bought a kef sub to complement the bass.


----------



## bsmpower

Really in doubt to sell my KEF LS50 Wireless and buy the KEF LSX with subwoofer (kube 10b?) for the same price. Which one / combination would sound better?


----------



## canali

bsmpower said:


> Really in doubt to sell my KEF LS50 Wireless and buy the KEF LSX with subwoofer (kube 10b?) for the same price. Which one / combination would sound better?



doubt kef would sell some new speakers at 1/2 the price of their big brother, thinking just adding a sub would make them sound similar.
my suggestion, bud: _get a sub for your ls50s._...i have the svs sb2000 and that just makes the whole SQ sing so much more.
love that added meaty bottom end.


----------



## bsmpower

canali said:


> doubt kef would sell some new speakers at 1/2 the price of their big brother, thinking just adding a sub would make them sound similar.
> my suggestion, bud: _get a sub for your ls50s._...i have the svs sb2000 and that just makes the whole SQ sing so much more.
> love that added meaty bottom end.


Thanks! Yes I thought about that, but then I need to spend more money. If I sell my LS50W for around 1500,- (?), I can buy back the LSX + kube10b (or similar priced (second hand) subwoofer) for that money.


----------



## AlanU

bsmpower said:


> Really in doubt to sell my KEF LS50 Wireless and buy the KEF LSX with subwoofer (kube 10b?) for the same price. Which one / combination would sound better?



Your better off experimenting with passive LS50 and a nice tube amp and roll tubes or test different Dacs.  However I prefer my Kef R300 a lot more than the LS50w or original passive. More presence in analog realism over the ls50.

LSX has zero appeal to me as it’s for smaller form factor. If the ls50w had a analog bypass to use other sources rather than integral stock dac I’d consider the wireless version. 

Lots of alternatives in the audio world.


----------



## bsmpower

I had a 5.0 setup (2 towers, center, 2 bookshelf) with receiver. Reason I changed to the KEF LS50W is that I wanted it more clean (less equipment, cables, etc..). So not planning to go back.. Placing a extra subwoofer is not what I intended, but sometimes a miss that litte bit extra in the low. Also thought to buy desktop stand (Isoacoustic Aperta for example) to improve the sound? A lot of choices and alternatives indeed!


----------



## aldinho878

I am considering getting the ls50 wireless to use with a MacBook pro via USB. If you use the USB connection, the amp and dac working is the one from the kef speakers, not the laptop itself correct? Would USB be the best way to get the highest quality sound from these connected to a MacBook? Also as far as adding a chord mojo or Hugo into the setup, would it provide better sound, or should I stick to the internal Kef dac/amp? Thanks


----------



## aldinho878

And if I was to add a mojo or Hugo to the setup, which connection would give me the best quality? 3.5mm or optical? Sorry for all the questions, I'm fairly new to the speakers world


----------



## crafft

Mojo has only 3.5mm analog output. 
My guess is MBP via usb/optical to mojo via minijack to LS50w would be the best sounding route! 
I tried Mojo's different digital inputs several times and to me the usb input is best. I use a Wireworld or Furutech usb cable!


----------



## canali

aldinho878 said:


> And if I was to add a mojo or Hugo to the setup, which connection would give me the best quality? 3.5mm or optical? Sorry for all the questions, I'm fairly new to the speakers world



see here: a few articles here if you open and scroll down.
https://darko.audio/?s=KEF+LS50+wireless
ethernet is best connection to kefs...their native app sucks
i use Roon/Tidal (since they're now Roon ready)

also lots on google search"
https://www.google.ca/search?rlz=1C...StJjfAhWQ0VQKHYDXC30QBQgpKAA&biw=1280&bih=922


----------



## canali (Dec 12, 2018)

Peter Hyatt said:


> I have the KEF KUBE 2 b (12) and it is something special.
> 
> It is very powerful but understated.  It makes acoustic bass gorgeous and although it can rattle your fillings, it does not over modulate nor lose its musicality.
> 
> ...



i agree bud...once you go quality subwoofer to any system with monitors it's hard to go back.

heck *i might be adding a 2nd sub* to experiment ..you know see if it's true about the 'duals being better than 1' theory ...
smoothening, taming the bass and take care of those nulls in my med to larger sized room...will might add a few bass traps/diffusor panels, too.
my sub is  the svs sb2000....i can get a 2nd sub piano gloss finish from my seller in toronto (mint, bstock was unboxed for US$635 shipped/taxes in).

so if i don't like it I can always sell it for near the same cost.


----------



## shw24

I'm torn between KEF LS50W or KEF LSX for my 50m2 living room. The environment would not be ideal. Will LSX is sufficient? In headphone, I'm very happy with 1p2. Music wise mainly jazz classical and instrument. For Christmas, I got 25% discount on LS50W while LSX is 18% from local store. Since environment is not ideal, would not be used for critical listening, but at least should be enjoyable. This gonna be my first purchase on speaker so please help me to choose


----------



## canali

shw24 said:


> I'm torn between KEF LS50W or KEF LSX for my 50m2 living room. The environment would not be ideal. Will LSX is sufficient? In headphone, I'm very happy with 1p2. Music wise mainly jazz classical and instrument. For Christmas, I got 25% discount on LS50W while LSX is 18% from local store. Since environment is not ideal, would not be used for critical listening, but at least should be enjoyable. This gonna be my first purchase on speaker so please help me to choose



best to go have a listen side by side...i'd only use the lsx as computer speakers myself.
otherwide ls50w with a nice sub is the way to go.


----------



## Mr.Z

aldinho878 said:


> And if I was to add a mojo or Hugo to the setup, which connection would give me the best quality? 3.5mm or optical? Sorry for all the questions, I'm fairly new to the speakers world


Thought the whole point of wireless is to use bluetooth or wifi


----------



## shw24

Thanks Canali.... i dont have chance to try side by side... the the reason for asking. Its not ideal living room with 3 years old son running around. So ls50 is thr way to go?


----------



## Mr.Z

canali said:


> best to go have a listen side by side...i'd only use the lsx as computer speakers myself.
> otherwide ls50w with a nice sub is the way to go.


50 m2 is a large living room. If you want to fill the room, I am not sure a ls50 is enough.


----------



## shw24

Well i tend to be background music most of time when my family is in the house and only start doing listening when i’m alone.... which is rare.... i’m debating myself because of this  The 2nd possible room is about 30m2. Pricewise i’m comfortable with lsx due to situation above but i dont want to be dissapointed, should be good enough.


----------



## psikey

My LSX is fantastic for a small room and without need for a separate woofer (for pure music use) but not sure it would fill a large room adequately compared to LS50W. You'd really have to have a listen. Every review to-date (over 10 I've seen now) rightly state the LSX are superb and punch above their size.


----------



## canali

psikey said:


> My LSX is fantastic for a small room and without need for a separate woofer (for pure music use) but not sure it would fill a large room adequately compared to LS50W. You'd really have to have a listen. Every review to-date (over 10 I've seen now) rightly state the LSX are superb and punch above their size.



good to hear it man...enjoy...i'm using a pair of sonos play 1 speakers (got 'em mint for a deal: $150 pair...looking at stands as well for $55)
so it's for my desktop/kitchen table (dual purpose)....regardless i'm going to go and have a listen to the kefs today or tomorrow.
the price diff would be 6-7x...unsure if the sq would be that much of an improvement.


----------



## Matez

I look forward to hearing to LSX myself. My good buddy had LS50 (the very first version available, black&gold) and I was impressed by those. Now I'm on a lookout for something similar but smaller and highly likely might end up with LSX if they're as good as people say...


----------



## ChasingDopamine

Quick question regarding the LS50W. does everyone plug each speaker into a seperate power outlet? Would i run into issues if i tried to run them both off a single outlet with a surge protector?

i ask as i only have 2 mains outlets in my room and im trying to figure out if i can also power a powered sub and/or tv, or if i would need to have extra outlets installed?


----------



## jologskyblues

ChasingDopamine said:


> Quick question regarding the LS50W. does everyone plug each speaker into a seperate power outlet? Would i run into issues if i tried to run them both off a single outlet with a surge protector?
> 
> i ask as i only have 2 mains outlets in my room and im trying to figure out if i can also power a powered sub and/or tv, or if i would need to have extra outlets installed?



There will be no issues plugging both LS50W speakers to the same power strip connected to a single power outlet. That's how I've set up mine, and I haven't run into any problems.


----------



## ds2k

shw24 said:


> I'm torn between KEF LS50W or KEF LSX for my 50m2 living room. The environment would not be ideal. Will LSX is sufficient? In headphone, I'm very happy with 1p2. Music wise mainly jazz classical and instrument. For Christmas, I got 25% discount on LS50W while LSX is 18% from local store. Since environment is not ideal, would not be used for critical listening, but at least should be enjoyable. This gonna be my first purchase on speaker so please help me to choose


For that room size you might need LS50W + sub


----------



## canali

question gang: has anyone had room treatments done..bass traps or wall / celing diffusers/reflectors put in?
were they worth it in the end?

i am asking as my audiophile friend says they really do make a difference and i'd be looking at $1k or so if i was go get a configuration installed
(corner bass traps, a few ceiling reflectors, and side wall panels) for my 13 wide by 23 deep open space.
place is pretty bright (not much paintings on walls, or rugs...yet) with min furniture.


----------



## ChasingDopamine

canali said:


> question gang: has anyone had room treatments done..bass traps or wall / celing diffusers/reflectors put in?
> were they worth it in the end?
> 
> i am asking as my audiophile friend says they really do make a difference and i'd be looking at $1k or so if i was go get a configuration installed
> ...



Acoustic treatment is the best way you can spend your money for SQ. Absolutley worth it and .a massive difference. You never really listen to just speakers, you always listen to speakers in a room. I can't recommend treatment enough. #1 most overlooked thing in stereo audio.

Start by treating your first reflection points. Hearing is believing.


----------



## canali (Jan 1, 2019)

thanks!

the thing is right now i'm renting and so don't wish to spend too much on such esp if i move i'll have to most likely
sell the gear (different configs etc)...i'd love to get some of the vicoustic or gk gear (lovely aesthetics!) but $$$.

so you'd do side wall reflections first...then corner basstraps?
what of the ceiling diffusors or reflectors?
i'm just trying to find a one time solution without breaking the bank
and covering most of the bases.


----------



## ChasingDopamine

canali said:


> the thing is right now i'm renting and so don't wish to spend too much on such esp if i move i'll have to most likely
> sell the gear (different configs etc)...i'd love to get some of the vicoustic or gk gear (lovely aesthetics!) but $$$



I'd say the cost is worth it, it will definitely make a huge difference. Much more than cables, lossless formats, DACs, even amps. Having demoed my LS50W in untreated and fully treated rooms they sounded like completely different speakers.

Yeah it's pretty expensive for the professionally constructed stuff but I'd say it's worth it. Unlike electronics they won't break down on you and Will last a lifetime. They will also hold a reasonable resale value. I've got some GIKs and they are very good build. 

Other alternatives I looked into are DIY panels (if you are handy and have the space and skills to construct them) or used off gumtree/eBay for collection. I got my GIKs from thier EU EBay B-stock store at about half price. Slight imperfections or returns prevents them selling it as new but they are essentially the same panels. I rewrapped them in acoustically transparent Camira fabric (I think it's Guildford of Maine in the US) to go with the colour scheme.

Renting may prevent you from drilling into the walls, but you could easily stack them on top of a little riser or box, or even another panel to get the right height.


----------



## mogulmaster

Hey team,

I've had the LS50w for about 50 hours. They do sound fantastic and I'm going to keep them. However, I'm having trouble getting the bass to sound really good. It seems whenever they try to put out sub-bass it gets muddy. Any tips? 

I have a 11x10x8 room, which is pretty close to square. A couple of the corners of the room get a lot of bass, and there is a dead spot in the center of the room.


----------



## ChasingDopamine (Jan 24, 2019)

mogulmaster said:


> Hey team,
> 
> I've had the LS50w for about 50 hours. They do sound fantastic and I'm going to keep them. However, I'm having trouble getting the bass to sound really good. It seems whenever they try to put out sub-bass it gets muddy. Any tips?
> 
> I have a 11x10x8 room, which is pretty close to square. A couple of the corners of the room get a lot of bass, and there is a dead spot in the center of the room.



I expirence the same thing whenever I set bass extension to 'extra'. At the end of the day the  LS50W has a 5.25inch midbass driver but can pump out a solid 40hz. Theres only so much a small driver can do and there is a compromise with the midrange clarity in my expirence.

I found it was someone compensated by the increased clarity i got through acoustic treatment, but the only real solution is to get a sub to handle the down and dirty frequencies and free up the LS50W midbass driver to exclusivley handle upper bass and above.


----------



## mogulmaster

ChasingDopamine said:


> I expirence the same thing whenever I set bass extension to 'extra'. At the end of the day the  LS50W has a 5.25inch midbass driver but can pump out a solid 40hz. Theres only so much a small driver can do and there is a compromise with the midrange clarity in my expirence.
> 
> I found it was someone compensated by the increased clarity i got through acoustic treatment, but the only real solution is to get a sub to handle the down and dirty frequencies and free up the LS50W midbass driver to exclusivley handle upper bass and above.



Thank you. So are you thinking it's more of a sub thing than a room-correction thing? I have my dad's sub that I could try out, just need to get a cable.


----------



## ChasingDopamine

mogulmaster said:


> Thank you. So are you thinking it's more of a sub thing than a room-correction thing? I have my dad's sub that I could try out, just need to get a cable.



It could be that the producing the low frequencies are just interfering with the midbass drivers ability to produce clearer mids. If the bass is muddy it could be the room which can be corrected for with acoustic treatment or room correction software, ideally both. To get a real idea you'll need a USB microphone and REW software to measure your room response.

By all means get the sub out, see if it makes a difference. It's always good to use a sub.


----------



## mogulmaster

ChasingDopamine said:


> It could be that the producing the low frequencies are just interfering with the midbass drivers ability to produce clearer mids. If the bass is muddy it could be the room which can be corrected for with acoustic treatment or room correction software, ideally both. To get a real idea you'll need a USB microphone and REW software to measure your room response.
> 
> By all means get the sub out, see if it makes a difference. It's always good to use a sub.



The mids actually sound fantastic, it's just the bass that seems to get muddy. I'll try out the sub and report back


----------



## Cadtot

I am running my LS50 Wireless set with a Kef 30B 12" sub from around 2000.  IMHO, the LS50 needs some sub underpinning to support the base.
I also run a LS50 passive stereo set that are underpinned with 2 REL S2 subs - provides good tight impact base support.


----------



## bsmpower

I had the same experience with the bass. It was not bad for a bookshelf speaker but I missed something in the lows. It performed best on high volumes but I have kids so I didnt play a lot on that volumes. For that reason I sold my LS50W and bought the smaller LSX. Does a great job in my room and for the lows I will buy a subwoofer. The LSX with a subwoofer is cheaper than the LS50W and I think (for me) I get a better sound.


----------



## AlanU

Cadtot said:


> I am running my LS50 Wireless set with a Kef 30B 12" sub from around 2000.  IMHO, the LS50 needs some sub underpinning to support the base.
> I also run a LS50 passive stereo set that are underpinned with 2 REL S2 subs - provides good tight impact base support.



I've auditioned the LS50W in a conditioned room and it really does sound very good...for what it is for a 2 way bookshelf.

I still find that my passive speakers...soon to be discountinued Kef R300 for the music genre I often listen too is a speaker that does not need to rely on active matched subwoofers. 

The LS50W looks stealth for a clean looking setup. Issue is lack of control in swapping DACs. For background casual listening I wouldn't mind a set of the LS50W. The R300 darker nature sounds more natural and real to life over the LS50 IMO.


----------



## koven

I use the smaller LSX as desktop speakers, it sounds wonderful.


----------



## mark007

For the LS50W is there a recommended Windows 10 driverdto use?

The driver from the KEF support site is dated 2016 from C-Media. By default Microsoft installs it's own audio driver dated 2018.

The C-Media one seems much louder but other than that I'm not sure what the differences are.

Any thoughts or has anyone compared the two anywhere?


----------



## sanvara (Mar 16, 2019)

techtonic said:


> Around the 16:00 is relevant to the discussion but the rest is good too. Also the ELAC Argo B51 Wireless is looking to compete with the LS50W.




I recently owned the LS50W and loved it. Then decided to A/B test them with Elac Navis ARB51 powered speakers (previously known as Argo). I now use the Navis because for sound quality the Elac speakers won the A/B test. If you have a preamp and good DAC the Navis are amazing. Bigger, fuller and richer sound vs LS50W. LS50W is an all in one solution so it's sends everything through it's internal dac. That's something to consider if you have a turntable and want to keep your vinyl playback in the analog realm. The Navis doesn't have an internal dac so it won't digitize your analog signals.


----------



## yatishn1

Hi All,

Newbie here so apoloigies for anything that may be basic.

I have an LS50 Wireless, and I am using Spotify Premium right now using the app on my Iphone. 

I want to have Tidal MQA, and see that the latest version of Tidal now supports this on IOS. Is it simply a case of using the Tidal wireless app to stream Tidal Masters now to the LS50W?

I also have a Windows 10 PC connected to the LS50W via the PC cable. If I get the Tidal desktop app, would it be a case of using say a Dragonfly USB Dac, and then connecting the PC via that DAC to my LS50W? I see the Iphone Tidal HiFi app is £25.99 / month due to the premium Apple place on the app.

What is the simplest way I can get Tidal Masters lossless on my speakers please?

Thanks


----------



## peterinvan

yatishn1 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Newbie here so apoloigies for anything that may be basic.
> 
> ...



Download the PC app from Tidal, not Apple (cheaper).  I am happy playing Masters (24/96 first unfold) with this path:

Windows PC > iFi USB conditioners > LS50W.

Spend any extra money on tuning your listening room (lots of ideas on line).


----------



## yatishn1

Thank you Peter - appreciate the response.

But what if I want to listen to the sold called "ultimate" Tidal Masters MQA 24/192 Hi-Res tracks? How would I do that from Laptop to LS50 Wireless? Is it possible even?

Thanks


----------



## peterinvan

yatishn1 said:


> But what if I want to listen to the sold called "ultimate" Tidal Masters MQA 24/192 Hi-Res tracks? How would I do that from Laptop to LS50 Wireless? Is it possible even?
> 
> Thanks


You will need an MQA decoding DAC.  
I tried my Meridian Explorer 2 into the RCA sockets on the LS50W... I preferred the sound of the Masters without the DAC in line.


----------



## RA66

Just ordered a pair of the LS50W. Could not be more excited to set them up and try them out.


----------



## peterinvan

RA66 said:


> Just ordered a pair of the LS50W. Could not be more excited to set them up and try them out.



Let them break in for at least 100 hours (as recommended by KEF) before any critical listening.  Next  try the KEF settings for your speaker positions - trial and error.  
In my small listening room I have 10 acoustic panels (2" Rockwool panels in the corners and reflection positions), and I set the treble to maximum and the bass to -5db.  

Sweet!


----------



## Peter Hyatt

Strange question— power outage yesterday while playing KEF LS50W. (Surge protector) 

When power was restored, the power KEF speaker has static & distortion when the volume is raised. 

Did power reset & button reset to no avail. 

I fear it’s fried. 

Any recommendations? 

The passive speaker is fine & I love these things. I don’t think the powered is sold alone.


----------



## canali

Peter Hyatt said:


> Strange question— power outage yesterday while playing KEF LS50W. (Surge protector)
> 
> When power was restored, the power KEF speaker has static & distortion when the volume is raised.
> 
> ...



sorry to hear this...i'd contact kef tech support for their imput


----------



## guido

What sub are you guys using successfully with the KEF LS50Ws?



I want to integrate a sub to free the KEFs from having to play the very low bass frequencies but my previous attempts using an Adam Audio 8 sub have been unsuccessful ....it is a cheaper sub and just simply sounds boomy unless I turn it way down almost to the point of not being there at all. I do not want to spend a fortune on a sub, perhaps something second hand might do....any suggestions?



Also what settings do you guys use on your sub integrations?


----------



## Peter Hyatt

Update—KEF warranty is covering parts and labor as well as return shipping.


----------



## ecva

Hi, has anyone experienced a ticking sound after unplugging? It's happening on the left speaker.


----------



## IdleHeroe

Is it me or is the KEF speakers lacking in the lows?


----------



## guido

its you..


----------



## IdleHeroe

guido said:


> its you..



Oh god, i need an ear check


----------



## coolmilo

guido said:


> What sub are you guys using successfully with the KEF LS50Ws?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I highly recommend SVS SB3000. The KEF LS 50 Wireless system paired with the SVS sub is magical! I am crossing over at 100 hrz (currently). The SVS sub is very musical and features deep powerful bass. I wonder if you could find a used SB3000...


----------



## guido

The SVS sub looks really interesting and I like the fact that it can be controlled by an app...similar to the Elac subs.

I see the app on the Elac subs also controls the subs response delay....this may be very useful too...I wonder if SVS has a similar adjustment possibility?

I have been offered an Elac Adante sub 3070 at a really attractive price...

https://www.elac.com/product/asw-121-adante-powered-subwoofer/


----------



## bsmpower (Apr 26, 2019)

I sold my LS50W and bought the LSX. The LS50W where a little to big for my living room (about 5x4m), missed the lower frequencies (bass) and liked the sound of the LSX a little more (less high/crisp) and more forgiving with Spotify for example.

Ofcourse the bass is less then the LS50W, I knew, and bought a small sub. The B&W ASW608 in my case. Really happy with it and more than enough bass for my room size. In the end lot cheaper then the LS50W and better sound overall (for me personally).

PS I got a lot of positive reactions on the looks of my green coloured LSX’s. Didnt get any on my previous glossy white LS50W.


----------



## Peter Hyatt

bsmpower said:


> I sold my LS50W and bought the LSX. The LS50W where a little to big for my living room (about 5x4m), missed the lower frequencies (bass) and liked the sound of the LSX a little more (less high/crisp) and more forgiving with Spotify for example.
> 
> Ofcourse the bass is less then the LS50W, I knew, and bought a small sub. The B&W ASW608 in my case. Really happy with it and more than enough bass for my room size. In the end lot cheaper then the LS50W and better sound overall (for me personally).
> 
> PS I got a lot of positive reactions on the looks of my green coloured LSX’s. Didnt get any on my previous glossy white LS50W.




It’s nice to read things worked out well for you. I hope you get many hours of musical enjoyment.


----------



## canali

guido said:


> What sub are you guys using successfully with the KEF LS50Ws?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



svs sb2000 matching white for white kef speakers


----------



## dhananjay

Hello,
recently I have purchased KEF LS50W. Need your advise for below:
My room size is 12 ft x 11 ft. 
1) do i need subwoofer?  if yes...which one shall be suit my room?  please suggest one.
2) At present I am feeding analog from my DAP (Cowon Plenue 2).  I understand that all analog sound pass through analog to digital conversion in LS50W.  So does it matter to use good DAP as a input? When I use my smartphone(S Note 9), the sound quality via DAP found me better that smartphone. 
So, what is best way of input?  is anyone uses any preamp/ amp?  Need views from members.


----------



## guido

1] no
2] the analog inputs are excellent even though it does a double conversion...I really liked them using a high end DAC ...so source is extremely important

Best way is to use Roon on a MAC or PC and use the wi-fi connection...


----------



## dhananjay

guido said:


> 1] no
> 2] the analog inputs are excellent even though it does a double conversion...I really liked them using a high end DAC ...so source is extremely important
> 
> Best way is to use Roon on a MAC or PC and use the wi-fi connection...



thanks for immediate response. 
I will try Roon.
Which hi-end DAC do you use?


----------



## guido

I dont use a DAC anymore...generally not possible with Roon since it does all the conversions in the MAC or PC....but when I did use a DAC it was a highly modified Yulong DA8


----------



## dhananjay

guido said:


> I dont use a DAC anymore...generally not possible with Roon since it does all the conversions in the MAC or PC....but when I did use a DAC it was a highly modified Yulong DA8



thanks...
I shall explore Roon at my end.


----------



## Peter Hyatt

will KEF do an update so that LS 50 W works with Airplay 2?


----------



## Sonic Defender

guido said:


> 1] no



Why wouldn't he/she benefit from a sub? I have KEF R300s in a similar room and I use two small REL T-Zero subs and in my opinion having subs makes a positive difference as despite themselves being small drivers, the T-Zeros are able to go significantly deeper than the R300s. While not true super deep sub bass, the RELs still make the bass sound more complete and integrated. The LS50W must roll off pretty early so some help in the sub bass I would think would help, but that is just my thoughts, everybody differs.


----------



## guido

the general consensus and believe me I have tried subs is that if you like audiophile sound a sub is really difficult to integrate with the LS50W and 99% of the time just sounds overbearing or simply awful....depends a lot on music, room acoustics etc of course so ymmd


----------



## coolmilo

dhananjay said:


> Hello,
> recently I have purchased KEF LS50W. Need your advise for below:
> My room size is 12 ft x 11 ft.
> 1) do i need subwoofer?  if yes...which one shall be suit my room?  please suggest one.
> ...



I have added a SVSound SB3000 sub to my LS50W and I am very happy with the improvement the sub makes in the system. IMO, a sub is an essential add-on for the LS50W and the LSX too. I do love music that extends deep into the bass region such as jazz featuring a standup bass and electronica ambient music. I have taken time to carefully calibrate the sub so that it does not overpower the system. The SB3000 is a very musical sub and good match for the LS50W.


----------



## Sonic Defender

guido said:


> the general consensus and believe me I have tried subs is that if you like audiophile sound a sub is really difficult to integrate with the LS50W and 99% of the time just sounds overbearing or simply awful....depends a lot on music, room acoustics etc of course so ymmd


Makes sense, but I would suspect that if one equalized the LS50W to trim back what I will assume without seeing any frequency response graphs is somewhat overcooked mid-bass, some of the overbearing bass would be reduced. I find the R300 also has a little of that, but to this point I haven't bothered using EQ as it is a minor issue. So if the LS50W is equalized that would allow some sub bass to be added, and likely it is needed. I think all in one driver designs may suffer a little from the signature being tuned to sound very full in order to compensate for the normal rolled off low and sub bass. 

If that is the case trimming back the bass on the speakers is a good thing, then gently blending in some sub bass via a sub or subs. Based on experience and research frequently people turn their subs up too loud and that of course muddies and causes the sound to become unbalanced. You should barely hear a sub, it should more be perceived as a overall sound pressure increase, but I suspect you know this so sorry for perhaps stating the obvious.


----------



## bearFNF

We added a sub to one of our setups with the LS50W in a large open room and ut made a significant difference.  The other setup in a smaller more cluttered area the sub was not really needed.  So like others have said, it depends on the application. YMMV


----------



## Sonic Defender

bearFNF said:


> We added a sub to one of our setups with the LS50W in a large open room and ut made a significant difference.  The other setup in a smaller more cluttered area the sub was not really needed.  So like others have said, it depends on the application. YMMV


It can't be the sub bass acting as clutter, unless people crank up the volume on the sub which is the users issue. The LS50W will produce no meaningful sub bass at all, but the clutter is the mid-bass it produces. Adding the sub bass properly could not cause any clutter. The clutter was solely the domain of the LS50W in the room and if it was trimmed back by EQ the addition of sub bass (at appropriate levels) could only improve the sound, that is absolutely guaranteed.


----------



## bearFNF

Sonic Defender said:


> It can't be the sub bass acting as clutter, unless people crank up the volume on the sub which is the users issue. The LS50W will produce no meaningful sub bass at all, but the clutter is the mid-bass it produces. Adding the sub bass properly could not cause any clutter. The clutter was solely the domain of the LS50W in the room and if it was trimmed back by EQ the addition of sub bass (at appropriate levels) could only improve the sound, that is absolutely guaranteed.


What I meant by "cluttered" was chairs, couches, shelves, exercise bike, sliding glass doors, etc.  The sub was not needed regardless of what it did to the sound...no amount of tuning was going to fix the room and it was not worth the effort, in this case.


----------



## Sonic Defender

bearFNF said:


> What I meant by "cluttered" was chairs, couches, shelves, exercise bike, sliding glass doors, etc.  The sub was not needed regardless of what it did to the sound...no amount of tuning was going to fix the room and it was not worth the effort, in this case.


Fair enough, cheers.


----------



## dhananjay

coolmilo said:


> I have added a SVSound SB3000 sub to my LS50W and I am very happy with the improvement the sub makes in the system. IMO, a sub is an essential add-on for the LS50W and the LSX too. I do love music that extends deep into the bass region such as jazz featuring a standup bass and electronica ambient music. I have taken time to carefully calibrate the sub so that it does not overpower the system. The SB3000 is a very musical sub and good match for the LS50W.



what is your room size? ( for SB 3000 with LS50W).
This weekend i am going to audition for SB2000.  The shop nearby don't have SB3000 now.


----------



## coolmilo

dhananjay said:


> what is your room size? ( for SB 3000 with LS50W).
> This weekend i am going to audition for SB2000.  The shop nearby don't have SB3000 now.


So, my room is a bedroom converted into an office/media room. It is only 10 ft x 8 ft. The sb2000 would be fine for my room. I went for the sb3000 for the features, including building profiles using my phone. I bought directly from svsound because of their upgrade policy (one year upgrade and receive full cost for your trade in) and free in home trial. I believe there are more benefits buying direct.


----------



## jologskyblues

For the past year, I've been a bit bothered that my LS50W sounded like it lacks stereo coherency in near-field. Well, I tried to disable phase-correction and lo and behold, left and right now sounds seamlessly connected with that nice natural phantom center. The listening sweet spot has noticeably widened so I guess, phase-correction may actually be counterproductive in a near-field listening setup.


----------



## SQ13

just chance in this thread, am using ken kreisel sub with the 50s


----------



## greenkiwi

For anyone waiting to get some LS50 Wireless, they are currently on sale for $1799.


----------



## thegurge

I've been trying to integrate a SVS SB-2000 with my LS50Ws. First time I've ever had a sub so it's all new for me and I'm struggling to get it right. I think I've found a roughly decent sweet spot, but yeah the struggle is real.


----------



## jologskyblues (Nov 24, 2019)

I just found out that there's a new firmware update for the LS50W.



> 19-Nov-2019 Wi-Fi v3.0.0, MCU v4.1.0
> 
> Fixed subwoofer volume issue
> Fixed IR control issue on speaker volume
> ...



The change log says that the issue with the subwoofer volume not being saved has been fixed. Finally, after over two years of having this problem, I guess enough people sent emails about it for KEF to be compelled to fix it. They also fixed the annoyingly sluggish response of the remote control volume settings.


----------



## Chikolad

jologskyblues said:


> I just found out that there's a new firmware update for the LS50W.
> 
> 
> 
> The change log says that the issue with the subwoofer volume not being saved has been fixed. Finally, after over two years of having this problem, I guess enough people sent emails about it for KEF to be compelled to fix it. They also fixed the annoyingly sluggish response of the remote control volume settings.


Cool!


----------



## peterinvan

jologskyblues said:


> I just found out that there's a new firmware update for the LS50W.
> 
> 
> 
> The change log says that the issue with the subwoofer volume not being saved has been fixed. Finally, after over two years of having this problem, I guess enough people sent emails about it for KEF to be compelled to fix it. They also fixed the annoyingly sluggish response of the remote control volume settings.



I had no trouble with the last update, however with this one I had trouble during the update.  My set up:

PC (Win7) to USB to LS50W.
Both PC and LS50W are hard wired to my local net (and Internet).​
Downloaded the update, and ran it.  It does fine till step 5 (rebooting).  Got to 98% and stalled.  After a time out, a dialogue box said "Network connection problems".
I followed the requests to reboot the Modem;  tried twice to no avail.  Stepped through the reboot request again, and it timed out again.
Turned off the Speakers.  Powered up again, and the speakers now work OK.  The remote response seems to be better, so I assume the update was successful.


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## Chikolad

peterinvan said:


> I had no trouble with the last update, however with this one I had trouble during the update.  My set up:
> 
> PC (Win7) to USB to LS50W.
> Both PC and LS50W are hard wired to my local net (and Internet).​
> ...



Is step 5 the final one or is it before updating the R/L speakers separately? 
There is more than one update in the bundle, maybe some went through and some didn't?


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## peterinvan

UPDATING ISSUES



Chikolad said:


> Is step 5 the final one or is it before updating the R/L speakers separately?
> There is more than one update in the bundle, maybe some went through and some didn't?


Yes, I don't know if the final steps updating the R/L speakers was performed.  

Can someone tell me how to check the current status of my speakers (i.e. to see the current release numbers, and did the latest updates installed)?


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## Chikolad

peterinvan said:


> UPDATING ISSUES
> 
> 
> Yes, I don't know if the final steps updating the R/L speakers was performed.
> ...


What about if you run the update tool again? At first it says which versions are currently installed.


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## peterinvan

UPDATING ISSUES



Chikolad said:


> Is step 5 the final one or is it before updating the R/L speakers separately?
> There is more than one update in the bundle, maybe some went through and some didn't?





Chikolad said:


> What about if you run the update tool again? At first it says which versions are currently installed.



Your suggestion worked... the update app jumped to step 5 where it left off, and updated the master and slave speakers.  THANKS!


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## jologskyblues

I also had initial troubles with this firmware update. At first, the speakers weren't being detected despite following all the step-by-step instructions. On the third try, it just suddenly installed. Since then, I'm quite happy with the updated LS50W.


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## Chikolad

peterinvan said:


> UPDATING ISSUES
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cool! I'm glad to hear, and it's also reassuring


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## Peter Hyatt

With new update—how do I do it?

I have MacBook Pro that has no wired connection to LS50W.  


The notice “there is an update...” flashes when I first open the app but disappears. 

I don’t use the app much...too wonky.


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## Chikolad

Peter Hyatt said:


> With new update—how do I do it?
> 
> I have MacBook Pro that has no wired connection to LS50W.
> 
> ...


You need to download the update tool from https://us.kef.com/product-support and connect your computer to the speakers via USB.
Follow the instructions that come with the tool.


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## Peter Hyatt

Chikolad said:


> You need to download the update tool from https://us.kef.com/product-support and connect your computer to the speakers via USB.
> Follow the instructions that come with the tool.




The update can be done without hardwiring?


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## Chikolad

Peter Hyatt said:


> The update can be done without hardwiring?


I don't think so, it specifically says to connect the computer to the speakers via USB.


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## AlanU

Speaking of subs.......I'd suggest looking into a Kef Kube12B if you want some nice fill bass without really breaking the bank. This was a major improvement over the first implementation from the kef company. I bought one for my 9.1 HT setup and this sub is great for your medium sized room.

I know the wireless LS50 is intended for simplicity. The cost of the units now it's definitely easier on the wallet.

Speaking of kef........One thing I'd suggest is still buying a nice modest integrated amp and going with a pair of old R300 or the new kef R3 if you miss bass. Much more romantic and there is little need for a sub to supplement. Having separates allows more tweaking to your liking. Try adding a furutech 314AG power cord to the amp  and then do an A/B comparison with a S55N (or DPS-4 $$$$)  diy power cord with gold or Rhodium plug ends. The LS50 is resolving enough and If you cannot tell the difference the two cords you definitely need your ears checked. Also you can use a tube dac to warm up the fast hyper detail characteristics of the speaker. If your into female vocals comparing an R3 vs LS50W is like comparing a refined smooth romantic and emotional speaker vs a fast paced intense speaker. All depends on your music genre. I've contemplated on buying an ls50w strictly for back ground music decent looking piece. If you want the rhythm and pace and emotion adding a DAC to the wireless misses something as the AD to DA effects the feed from your DAC ( if you incorporate one).  

The LS50 definitely needs some hours on it to break in.  The speaker's suspension really creates a congestion muddy sound from out of the box. Once the ls50w break's in  the sound quality improves.


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## honeyjjack

I am on the verge of buying a set of ls50w for nearfield use, but the fact that it always uses it's dac bothers me as i already have dacs worth more than it. Does anyone know if theres any way to bypass the dac even if it means opening up and doing some diy? Thanks.


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## AlanU

honeyjjack said:


> I am on the verge of buying a set of ls50w for nearfield use, but the fact that it always uses it's dac bothers me as i already have dacs worth more than it. Does anyone know if theres any way to bypass the dac even if it means opening up and doing some diy? Thanks.



TMK there is no option to bypass. From what I gather you'd be doing an ADDA conversion (external dac) feeding rca input to the Kef ls50w.

For the current price of a non wireless kef LS50 new or even better on the pre owned sections..... buy a integrated amp if you are already considering on feeding the speakers with an external dac. I'd be certain it would sound substantially better and you can cater the sound too.

This is where one must decide the simple minimalistic wireless speaker setup. Some choose the alternative of  a tiny clean integrated amp setup with your own dac you currently own.


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## CoFire

AlanU said:


> TMK there is no option to bypass. From what I gather you'd be doing an ADDA conversion (external dac) feeding rca input to the Kef ls50w.
> 
> For the current price of a non wireless kef LS50 new or even better on the pre owned sections..... buy a integrated amp if you are already considering on feeding the speakers with an external dac. I'd be certain it would sound substantially better and you can cater the sound too.
> 
> This is where one must decide the simple minimalistic wireless speaker setup. Some choose the alternative of  a tiny clean integrated amp setup with your own dac you currently own.



For this reason, is love to hear some comparisons of LS50W alternative options that can either bypass the DAC or only integrate the AMP. The ELAC Navis and Vanatoo T1 Encore look interesting for this reason.

Any suggestions?


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## honeyjjack

Ive been looking at the navis too. With my dac and preamp id only need a power amp and size is no concern for me. If the passive sounds better that would be better for me. However ive been hearing that the wireless sounds better than passive with high end gear.


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## AlanU

honeyjjack said:


> Ive been looking at the navis too. With my dac and preamp id only need a power amp and size is no concern for me. If the passive sounds better that would be better for me. However ive been hearing that the wireless sounds better than passive with high end gear.



I've heard the LS50W and it's great if you like that digital solid state sound. I've auditioned the LS50 (non amplified version)  with a tube amplifier and vinyl setup and it had an enjoyable  great organic analog sound. I assure you the "wireless" version would NOT sound that warm and organic!!!!!! Feeding an external dac to the wireless LS50 is unlikely going to be as responsive as a DAC/Preamp/AMP setup.

I think most hifi enthusiast like to mix and match to achieve a combo with synergy.  I've often appreciated usb to spdif conversion fed to an preamp when I'm using my solid state dac setup. There is just way more flexibility with a non amplified LS50.  Not sure if a 30W class AB is anything to get excited about dedicated for high frequencies. Class D for the rest........

What music genre you typically listen too or the size of the room you have? 

If you like the warmth and darker sound, the older Kef R300 or newer R3 kef speaker IMO sound more full/meat to the bones setup compared to the LS50 or R100 passive speaker. This is also determined with your room setup. 

I almost purchased a pre owned Devialet amp $$$$$ for my home system. I decided to pass as it also has the extreme limitation of ADDA conversion that strips me the opportunity to tweak. 

Just warning you the Kef LS50 speaker/woofer suspension needs to get some hours on it. In the beginning the LS50 wired or wireless sounds congested and restricted. Put hours on it and it will become more effortless. Breaking in speakers is very noticeable with the ls50. My R300 sounded muffled and it took some hours to open up........


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## honeyjjack

AlanU said:


> I've heard the LS50W and it's great if you like that digital solid state sound. I've auditioned the LS50 (non amplified version)  with a tube amplifier and vinyl setup and it had an enjoyable  great organic analog sound. I assure you the "wireless" version would NOT sound that warm and organic!!!!!! Feeding an external dac to the wireless LS50 is unlikely going to be as responsive as a DAC/Preamp/AMP setup.
> 
> I think most hifi enthusiast like to mix and match to achieve a combo with synergy.  I've often appreciated usb to spdif conversion fed to an preamp when I'm using my solid state dac setup. There is just way more flexibility with a non amplified LS50.  Not sure if a 30W class AB is anything to get excited about dedicated for high frequencies. Class D for the rest........
> 
> ...



I listen to a variety of music from jazz and classical to pop and hip hop. Im stuck to a very small room as i am a student living in a studio and will be using them nearfield. Currently i have the musical parasdise mp-d2 tube dac and audio gd master 9 hp amp/preamp running a pair of abyss ab-1266 headphones and a18 ciems. Ive also heard good things about r300/r3 but i feel i might be overkill for my use. I would like warm over bright as both my headphone and earphone are slightly bright. Maybe tube integrated like WA5 or tube preamp with ss monoblocks with the ls50 might suit me better but then ive also heard the Elac Navis has more body than the kef.


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## AlanU

honeyjjack said:


> I listen to a variety of music from jazz and classical to pop and hip hop. Im stuck to a very small room as i am a student living in a studio and will be using them nearfield. Currently i have the musical parasdise mp-d2 tube dac and audio gd master 9 hp amp/preamp running a pair of abyss ab-1266 headphones and a18 ciems. Ive also heard good things about r300/r3 but i feel i might be overkill for my use. I would like warm over bright as both my headphone and earphone are slightly bright. Maybe tube integrated like WA5 or tube preamp with ss monoblocks with the ls50 might suit me better but then ive also heard the Elac Navis has more body than the kef.




Appears you really have some nice stuff!

The Elac Navis sounds like a nice set of speakers with  Class AB amplification. The 4 inch drivers would probably need some decent run in time to perform the best.

The LS50W  you auditioned hopefully had several hundreds of  hours on them to open up. The suspension on the Kef driver do seem rather tight straight out of box. One local shop even said in the evenings they had to run the speakers rather loud to add more breakin time while the shop was closed. Very big noticeable difference once they break in.

I would bank on a Primaluna dialogue integrated (awards from Stereophile and hifipig) using the sweet/open goodness of Even harmonics from a KT150 tube would be an insane ear pleaser with a wide variety of wired monitors. This is where the wireless speaker (Elac, Kef) would not even come close using the onboard amplifier. This is also based on budget...….

I'll say the sound dispersion and imaging in the Kef LS50 or even the gloss black R100 is excellent for sub 1000 speaker. You know you're opening up a can of worms if you start looking for higher end gear.

The LS50 with good amplification typically has a nice refined high frequency range and not shrill. If you are using these speakers for near field (for your desk??????) I think the imaging will be very impressive. Not sure how hardcore you are but for a small room with the speakers 5-7 feet apart to fill the room you'd still appreciate a sub just to fill in the lower frequencies. But if you're happy with decent/good fill bass, sweet mids and smooth high's the price point of the wired LS50 is a nice deal. 

I'd be certain a good quality integrated tube amp would blow away a digital amp found internally in the ls50w for many music genre's for holographic imaging unlike the typical solid state "sound". This is where people select their gear based on their needs. I'm the sort that really loves the hobby and love tweaking.


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## honeyjjack

AlanU said:


> Appears you really have some nice stuff!
> 
> The Elac Navis sounds like a nice set of speakers with  Class AB amplification. The 4 inch drivers would probably need some decent run in time to perform the best.
> 
> ...



Yup it will be on my desk. Maybe ill put a cinderblock between the speaker and the desk to stop my desk from becoming a giant vibrator. It would probably be 3ft apart. Like you said i think a tube amp like the dialogue would work great with the ls50. Now im leaning between the navis and ls50 with amp. Since i will have to buy new for the navis while ls50 and amp is easy to find used, the total price would not be too different. Either way i love tweaking my gear too and will proably dip my toes into upgrading the crossover components.


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## greenkiwi

honeyjjack said:


> I am on the verge of buying a set of ls50w for nearfield use, but the fact that it always uses it's dac bothers me as i already have dacs worth more than it. Does anyone know if theres any way to bypass the dac even if it means opening up and doing some diy? Thanks.


I have a pair for near field listening and have been really enjoying them.  I do have DACs that are worth just about as much, but I have really enjoyed the simplicity of the system.  I believe that having DSP specifically designed for the LS50 is a plus. 

At their current price on Amazon $1799, they present quite a good value.


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## AlanU

honeyjjack said:


> Yup it will be on my desk. Maybe ill put a cinderblock between the speaker and the desk to stop my desk from becoming a giant vibrator. It would probably be 3ft apart. Like you said i think a tube amp like the dialogue would work great with the ls50. Now im leaning between the navis and ls50 with amp. Since i will have to buy new for the navis while ls50 and amp is easy to find used, the total price would not be too different. Either way i love tweaking my gear too and will proably dip my toes into upgrading the crossover components.




Auralek foam pads will be a good isolation solutions for inexpensive desktop simplicity. Some even use high density yoga foam pads.

The Navis does look like a ultra clean solution if you desire such configuration. LS50W is starting to pop up more often in the preowned sections but dramatically reduces your tweaking capabilities.

Good to see that you're experimenting and open to ideas.....


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## jologskyblues

In the almost two years of owning the KEF LS50W for use in a near-field application, I've never had the urge to get into tweaking with different hardware for synergy or any of that stuff. I only felt the need to tweak the DSP settings, the sub integration, speaker positioning and room acoustics to get what I want out of it. After that, it's all about enjoying the music. 

I've heard the LSX though, it sounded warmer and more organic than the LS50W although the latter has more detail and room-filling power.


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## greenmac

Arrived yesterday and loving them


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## greenkiwi

They look great.


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## ridhoyudi

I just installed wifi at home and want to use LS50W in wifi mode. But there is a problem where my LS50W is connected to the internet (white solid) but can't be found in the kef stream app and spotify on the smartphone.

LS50W with latest firmware, My router is Huawei HG8245H5 2,4 GHz only , smartphone is Galaxy Note 8 Android 9.

I tried changing the settings on the router, I found that if my wifi uses b/g mode then the problem is solved. But when I use b/g/n mode, the LS50W can't be found in the kef stream app. I want to use b/g/n mode.

If I use 4G mobile data tethering to smartphone and LS50W, kef stream app and spotify can see the speaker.

Is there something wrong with my router settings?


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## jologskyblues (Sep 19, 2020)

...


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## dbkwall

Any word on KEF LS*60*s?


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## robi20064

Does anyone still have LS50W_FW_UpgradeTool_V4.0.0 or LS50_Wireless_Firmware_Up date_Tool_V4.0.0 and would mind sharing? Seems KEF removed all their original LS50 Wireless related content from their site.


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## peterinvan

robi20064 said:


> Does anyone still have LS50W_FW_UpgradeTool_V4.0.0 or LS50_Wireless_Firmware_Up date_Tool_V4.0.0 and would mind sharing? Seems KEF removed all their original LS50 Wireless related content from their site.


PM me with your email address.  I will forward the file to you.


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## greenkiwi

dbkwall said:


> Any word on KEF LS*60*s?


I saw some reviews, I think that they will be pretty amazing.  I'd love to get a pair when they finally go on sale


----------

