# [Preview] FiiO E18 Kunlun – Surprise, Surprise.



## ClieOS

The E18 Kunlun is the latest portable amp/DAC for our favoritest budget amp company FiiO. Different from the E17, the new E18 is built for pretty much exclusive for Android devices. Well, it does work as a USB DAC on PC or as a standalone amp, but being an Android DAC is what it really is all about.
  





  
*Spec*
 The E18 I have is an early sample that should perform the same as the retail version. However the official spec has yet to be released, so instead I will add the detail in once they are available.
  
 [UPDATE]
 Weight: 162g     
 Dimensions: 130×66.2×14.6(mm)
 Audio Input: 3.5mm stereo jack     
 Headphone output: 3.5mm stereo jack
 Volume Control: ALPS Potentiometer     
 Bass Boost: 2 Levels
 Recommended Headphone Impedance: 16~150Ω 
 Charger Requirement: USB 5V/500mA~2A
 Charge Time: Up to 4h
 Battery Capacity: 3500mAh     
 Battery Life: ＞25h（AMP)； ＞12h（ DAC +AMP)
 Output Power: >300mW@32Ω    
 Gain: 2 Levels    
 Output impedance: <0.3Ω
 Frequency Response: 20Hz~20KHz
 Signal to Noise Ratio: >106dB
 USB Sample Rate Support: 32/44.1/48/96KHz @ 16/24Bit     
 Input Overload: 1.5Vrms
 Crosstalk: >72dB@1KHz     
 THD+N: <0.005%@1KHz/32Ω
 Max Gain: >6dB     
 Dynamic Range: >100dB
 Peak Output Voltage: 8 Vp-p
 Max output Current: 94mA
  




  
*Accessories and Build Quality*
 The packaging is fairly similar to any other FiiO products in the market now, which is basically a white and red hard paper box. Most of the accessories are pretty standardized as well, including a microUSB charging cable, 3.5mm interconnecting cable, some rubber band to hold the amp to the source, an S/PDIF adapter cable similar to that from X3 (as E18 can output S/PDIF coax), some stick-on rubber feet, a soft pouch, some simple manual, as well as the all importable micro-to-microUSB interconnecting cable. One thing to complain is the microUSB interconnecting cable – while it works fine, it is too short and only designed for smartphone with microUSB port on the top or bottom. For me as a Sony Xperia user, that’s bad news since Sony usually places the microUSB port on the side. It would have been much better if FiiO would include a few more microUSB cable with different angle and length. Right now I have to look for an alternative cable so I can actual stack the two devices together.
  




  




 The remote buttons are not (from left) Previous, Next, Play, but actually Next, Previous, Play.
  




  
 Build quality is pretty much on par with previous FiiO products. The design is somewhat dull compared to E17, but at least it is still well built. Size wise, it is about the same as the E12 so it is by no mean small. However, it won’t be bigger than most of the top-of-the-line Android phone out there. On one end, there are the volume knob (which double as on/off switch), the 3.5mm headphone-out, the 3.5mm input (which double as line-out with the DAC function) The gain switch, and the bass boost switch. You will also find the three remote control buttons (Play/Pause, Next/Forward and Previous/Backward) on the side. On the other end, there are the S/PDIF out, and two micro USB port – one for charging the E18, the other one for either DAC or power bank function depends on the switch just next to the microUSB port. On top, there is an LED for DAC indication as three LED for battery capacity.
  
 One thing to note, E18 can act as a USB DAC or a power bank (to charge you smartphone, etc), but not at the same time. It is important never to connect the port to a PC when it is in power bank mode, as it could lead to damage.
  
 Last but not least, the three remote control buttons works quite well in the both PC and Android. The ability to skip / pause music without turning the smartphone’s screen on is quite useful, same goes for PC remote control. However, the marking is a bit confusing.  Instead of ‘back / forward / play’, it is actually ‘forward / back / play’. No biggie but it does seem odd at first.
  




  




 The 3.5mm analog-in also double as line-out for the DAC.
  




  
*Gain, Hiss and EMI*
 E18 has two gain setting. Low gain is about +1dB and high gain is about +7.5dB. E18 is pretty much dead silence when it comes to hiss. It does pick up some mild EMI, but not enough to be a big concern unless you absolutely can’t stand any EMI – which will be a tall order given the source is most likely going to be a smartphone.
  
*Battery Life*
 E18 has a 3500mAH li-ion battery that can pump out some juice to charge your device if you choose to. As I have said before, it will be wise never to connect the microUSB port to a PC when it is in power bank mode, since you can’t really recharge a PC.
  
 I haven’t had the time to do a full battery test, but the big battery does look like it can almost out last a modern day smartphone when used together.
  
*Sound Quality*
 Let talk about some of the hardware first: as far as I know, the DAC chip is TI PCM1795 PCM1798 (*identical spec to PCM1795, but limits to 24bits only), which is one of the better DAC from TI and capable of 32bit 24bit 192kHz decoding. But because of the Tenor TE7022 as USB receiver, it will be limited to 24/96 at most. This is if you are running it from PC. On Android, you might not get the full 24/96 but limited to 16/44.1 depends on what your Android can support. DAC aside, E18 runs on an opamp+buffer amp section, which are OPA1612 + dual LMH6643 and should give it a comparable performance to E17 in theory.
  




 White = pure amp; Green = PC's USB DAC; Blue = Green with Bass Boost; Purple = Android DAC on Xperia TX with Power Amp music player; Yellow = Same as Purple, but using Neutron Music Player.
  
 As usual, I did some RMAA measurement on the E18. Because E18 can acts as USB DAC for PC and Android, as well as a standalone amp or a line-out source, I repeat the test quite a few times under different configuration. Both most occasions, either as pure amp or as DAC, E18 has very low noise and good dynamic, easily comparable to Leckerton Audio UHA-4 which I used for reference. As pure amp, E18 is flat from 50Hz to 20kHz, but has a very slight +0.5dB bump from 50Hz down to 20Hz. As either PC or Android DAC (w/ Power Amp), E18 still maintain the same flatness from 50Hz up, but instead has a very slight -0.5dB roll-off from 50Hz down to 20Hz. The deviations are all very mild on all three cases, so there isn’t much to concern. However, for some unknown reason, Neutron Music Player seems not to play well with E18 as it has much more obvious roll-off (-1dB @ 20Hz and -3.5dB @ 20kHz). This is likely caused by conflict between Neutron internal audio engine and the DAC driver. As much as I love Neutron as a music player on my Android, I’ll really advice against it if you are using E18. Output impedance is measured and calculated to be less than 1 ohm. Current output is similar to that of E17, and should be more than enough for even very low impedance load. Line-out is measured to be around 1.25Vrms, which isn’t particularly high (though higher than most iDevice line-out). Max headphone-out (high gain) is measured at around 3Vrms, good for most but probably not for the really high impedance, low sensitivity load.
  




 Size comparison (from left): Sony Xperia TX, E18, FiiO X3, Nano 7G.
  




 Size comparison (from left): C&C BH2, E18, E12.
  
 Let starts with the DAC section first. As far as subjective listening go, the DAC section carries some of the classic TI’s DAC flavor – that is, it has excellent texture and timbre over the mid and bass range, giving a very mild tone of warmth and forwardness. This is quite the contrast to ESS Sabre that is often very clean and open, which gives really good space but tends to be on the lean side. Beyond the different characteristics of the DAC, I’ll say the PCM1798 is just an equal match to any ES9023 based DAC. If you are coming from a Sabre DAC, you might find a more closed in soundstage and lesser upper detail. But in exchange you will get better lower texture and vocal detail. There isn’t a clear winner here in my opinion.
  
 How about the amp section? Quite excellent, actually. I volume matched the E18 to JDS Labs C5, Leckerton UHA-4 (OPA209) and FiiO’s own E12, then them a listen. For overall refinement and resolution, E18 is pretty much on the same level. The only area that is not as good is on the soundstage. While it is quite good, it isn’t nearly as grand as the others. This makes E18 probably the 2nd best sounding amp in current FiiO’s line-up of portable amp, just after E12. If E18 has the equal soundstage to match, I would think E12 might not be the king of the mountain anymore.
  
*EQ*
 Bass boost begin just under 1kHz and peaks around 55Hz @ +5.3dB before rolling back down to +3.5dB @ 20Hz. It actually looks quite similar to the bass boost on older FiiO product. It behaves quite well, since the majority of the boost is in the sub-200Hz region. In essence, you will get a good dose of rumbling with an adequate amount of boominess.
  




 The included USB cable isn't ideal for the TX, but it will work.
  
*Sum-up*
 So far we have covered just about everything on the upcoming E18, so what is the surprise I have mentioned on the title? Well, if you have been chasing Android news as much as I do, you probably should know that USB Audio is supposed to be part of the Jelly Bean. Yet, besides some flagship devices from big brand that comes with their own custom built USB audio driver, the sad news is most of Jelly Bean devices just won’t detect USB DAC. It is a sad situation that I have experienced with my Xperia TX (JB 4.1.2). I have tried as many USB DAC as I could, but as usually, it keep telling me the USB DAC is drawing too much power, even when I have the USB DAC powered externally. Something in the stock Android USB audio driver or the OS itself seems to be missing, and I even started to doubt whether there is actually a stock USB audio driver or not – then comes the E18, takes my doubt away and turns it into joy. Now my TX has been transformed to a proper audiophile player. Okay, the sound quality isn’t quite as good as a DX100 or HM901, but it sure is more than good enough for day to day listening and way better than the smartphone itself. There is no guarantee that your Android will work, but there is more hope than ever. If anything, I reckon this is just about as close as a ‘must have’ for any Android user who suffer from a sub-par headphone-out on their smartphone.
  
 A thank to FiiO for the sample.


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## ksantoshh

Nice review Tai


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## Ashade

Great review! Can´t wait to have this out! I´m so envy you could try it already... I really appreciate they included the bigger bands in this product.


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## Change is Good

Wonderful review yet again, ClieOS!
  
 I wonder if they will make an LOD to use this with the sony f series walkmans? Similar to the L5 but with a micro usb to use with the E18's DAC... (sold separately, of course).


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## carpler

Thanks for this review.
 I've seen the images and I noticed that, without a display as in E07K or E17, there is no way to know the current sample rate. Is right?
  
 On the Fiio site, the new E18 has an official page:
Fiio E18 - Official page
  
 So this it means that the E18 is out now?


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## audionewbi

Fiio deserve all their success, they have design right, performance for what we pay for right and the price never disappointed anyone. They are able to bring good sound to the masses.


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## H20Fidelity

Well done ClieOS! Wonderful quality pictures too!


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## skyline315

Awesome, thanks!
  
 Is that PowerAMP you're using?  Does it play nicely with the E18?


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## ClieOS

skyline315 said:


> Awesome, thanks!
> 
> Is that PowerAMP you're using?  Does it play nicely with the E18?




Yes. You can use Power Amp or any music player, even the stock Android music player. The only music player I won't recommend is Neutron as it seems to have a driver issue with E18.


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## Sushiglobster

Will the E18 work with Google Music streaming? That's my main source of music. I cannot consider the E18 if it does not work with Google Music.


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## Ashade

sushiglobster said:


> Will the E18 work with Google Music streaming? That's my main source of music. I cannot consider the E18 if it does not work with Google Music.




Yes, all the sound is redirected through the DAC, except for some system sounds that are doubled.


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## bestguniang

yes, The only music player I won't recommend is Neutron as it seems to have a driver issue with E18.thanks


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## BillsonChang007

Hey ClieOS! Nice review! 

I have a question,
IF the E18 can bypass any Android phone with USB OTG... Does it mean it will work with PSP 2002 as well since it support USB OTG as well?

Billson


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## ClieOS

billsonchang007 said:


> Hey ClieOS! Nice review!
> 
> I have a question,
> IF the E18 can bypass any Android phone with USB OTG... Does it mean it will work with PSP 2002 as well since it support USB OTG as well?
> ...




Since I don't have a PSP2002, I really don't know.


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## twister6

clieos said:


> Yes. You can use Power Amp or any music player, even the stock Android music player. The only music player I won't recommend is Neutron as it seems to have a driver issue with E18.


 
  
 Hi ClieOS, great review!!!
  
 But I'm still a bit confused why it wouldn't work with Neutron.  From your review, you said about Neutron having a specific roll off at 20Hz and 20kHz.  That's EQ setting, not driver?  So if E18 has a different FR, why would it cause a physical conflict of using both?  Your pictures above has Neutron player in there.  Does it not output any audio at all?  What is an artifact of this conflict?
  
 I'm curious because I'm waiting to receive E18 and was planning to use it with my Note 2 and Neutron MP (I have been obsessed with that audio player lately).  It would be very sad if I have to switch to another audio player since I like it's functionality and all the pro control options.


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## AsterFenix

clieos said:


> So far we have covered just about everything on the upcoming E18, so what is the surprise I have mentioned on the title? Well, if you have been chasing Android news as much as I do, you probably should know that USB Audio is supposed to be part of the Jelly Bean. Yet, besides some flagship devices from big brand that comes with their own custom built USB audio driver, the sad news is most of Jelly Bean devices just won’t detect USB DAC. It is a sad situation that I have experienced with my Xperia TX (JB 4.1.2). I have tried as many USB DAC as I could, but as usually, it keep telling me the USB DAC is drawing too much power, even when I have the USB DAC powered externally. Something in the stock Android USB audio driver or the OS itself seems to be missing, and I even started to doubt whether there is actually a stock USB audio driver or not – then comes the E18, takes my doubt away and turns it into joy. Now my TX has been transformed to a proper audiophile player. Okay, the sound quality isn’t quite as good as a DX100 or HM901, but it sure is more than good enough for day to day listening and way better than the smartphone itself. There is no guarantee that your Android will work, but there is more hope than ever. If anything, I reckon this is just about as close as a ‘must have’ for any Android user who suffer from a sub-par headphone-out on their smartphone.


 
 OMG! Can you confirm again that e18 won't be drawing any extra battery from my phone? This is the life-long issue I have when trying to do DAC/AMP combo with android device. Currently using galaxy s4 and tried to hook it up with Ibasso D-zero before. The sound was great but it drains 20%/hour listening which is ridiculous considering I lose only around 5%/hour max listening directly from the device. If E18 somehow figured out a solutin for that and even give me a better sound quality, it's pretty much everything I ever wish for. Can't wait till it's officially out for retail.


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## ClieOS

twister6 said:


> Hi ClieOS, great review!!!
> 
> But I'm still a bit confused why it wouldn't work with Neutron.  From your review, you said about Neutron having a specific roll off at 20Hz and 20kHz.  That's EQ setting, not driver?  So if E18 has a different FR, why would it cause a physical conflict of using both?  Your pictures above has Neutron player in there.  Does it not output any audio at all?  What is an artifact of this conflict?
> 
> I'm curious because I'm waiting to receive E18 and was planning to use it with my Note 2 and Neutron MP (I have been obsessed with that audio player lately).  It would be very sad if I have to switch to another audio player since I like it's functionality and all the pro control options.


 
  
  
 Not EQ, as I don't use EQ at all on any of the player.. My guess is the Neutron internal audio core has a different processing that is conflicting with E18 hardware, and thus causing the roll-off. It will still output sound, but obviously colored.
  


asterfenix said:


> OMG! Can you confirm again that e18 won't be drawing any extra battery from my phone? This is the life-long issue I have when trying to do DAC/AMP combo with android device. Currently using galaxy s4 and tried to hook it up with Ibasso D-zero before. The sound was great but it drains 20%/hour listening which is ridiculous considering I lose only around 5%/hour max listening directly from the device. If E18 somehow figured out a solutin for that and even give me a better sound quality, it's pretty much everything I ever wish for. Can't wait till it's officially out for retail.


 
  
 E18 shouldn't draw any power from any smartphone, as the DAC section (which connects and draws power from the smartphone on other USB DAC) on E18 is fully self-powered.


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## twister6

clieos said:


> Not EQ, as I don't use EQ at all on any of the player.. My guess is the Neutron internal audio core has a different processing that is conflicting with E18 hardware, and thus causing the roll-off. It will still output sound, but obviously colored.


 
  
 I assume you tried it with Dither on/off, EQ reset/off, no DSP effects, played with re-sampling quality, de-selected 64-bit processing, using ARMv7 + Neon version, etc.  I know I'm stating obvious, just that I really trust and respect your opinion but in the back of my mind hoping it ain't so because I really like Neutron MP lol!!!!  I even sent a link to this thread to Neutron MP developer so he can take a look.  You mentioned PowerAMP to be another option, but while looking at the screen shots and spec description I don't see anything close to Neutron.  At least I need to have crossfeed option to control stereo separation and dithering to warm up the sound.  Does PowerAMP support that?


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## ClieOS

twister6 said:


> I assume you tried it with Dither on/off, EQ reset/off, no DSP effects, played with re-sampling quality, de-selected 64-bit processing, using ARMv7 + Neon version, etc.  I know I'm stating obvious, just that I really trust and respect your opinion but in the back of my mind hoping it ain't so because I really like Neutron MP lol!!!!  I even sent a link to this thread to Neutron MP developer so he can take a look.  You mentioned PowerAMP to be another option, but while looking at the screen shots and spec description I don't see anything close to Neutron.  At least I need to have crossfeed option to control stereo separation and dithering to warm up the sound.  Does PowerAMP support that?


 
  
 Yes, every option has been tried during the test. I am a big Neutron supporter as well but it is unfortunately that it just doesn't work that well with E18.


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## twister6

clieos said:


> Yes, every option has been tried during the test. I am a big Neutron supporter as well but it is unfortunately that it just doesn't work that well with E18.


 
  
 Got my E18 today, and spent over an hour playing with it.  You are absolutely correct, using it with Neutron introduces some distortion and reduces high frequency content.  I had to switch to stock audio player.  Everything was good afterwards, but I do miss crossfeed function on Neutron.
  
 Will post my first impression writeup and add a bunch of pictures soon.


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## du2711

Oh that's disappointing about neutron incompatibility as for me Neutron is such a lovely sounding player, and hoped to pair it with the E18....
Thanks for the review


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## twister6

clieos said:


> Yes, every option has been tried during the test. I am a big Neutron supporter as well but it is unfortunately that it just doesn't work that well with E18.


 
  
 Can you please check it out?  Last night Neutron updated their player to v1.7.53 and I just did a very quick test which sounds to me like they fixed the problem?  Btw, the version they have on Google Play doesn't have Neon accelerator.  You need to go directly to Neutron d/l page: http://neutronmp.com/downloads/category/1-generic-android.html# to get Neon version which I find to be a lot faster on my Galaxy Note 2.


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## ClieOS

twister6 said:


> Can you please check it out?  Last night Neutron updated their player to v1.7.53 and I just did a very quick test which sounds to me like they fixed the problem?  Btw, the version they have on Google Play doesn't have Neon accelerator.  You need to go directly to Neutron d/l page: http://neutronmp.com/downloads/category/1-generic-android.html# to get Neon version which I find to be a lot faster on my Galaxy Note 2.


 
  
 Neon version only works with certain processors. Not every smartphone has such a processor.
  
 I did a quick RMAA test and the result seems to be the same as last time.


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## gattari

For the neutron issue...
 In the Neutron audio hardware section there is an option to utilize generic driver.
 Have you tried if it save neutron issue?
  
 edit: anyhow neutron with my note 3 is unable to play usb output over 48 khz, stock sammy player + fiio e17 play hi res files.


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## caableguy

Ok, so How much and when will it be available. ON their website my Note2 is listed in the supported Phones!


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## ClieOS

gattari said:


> For the neutron issue...
> In the Neutron audio hardware section there is an option to utilize generic driver.
> Have you tried if it save neutron issue?
> 
> edit: anyhow neutron with my note 3 is unable to play usb output over 48 khz, stock sammy player + fiio e17 play hi res files.


 
  
 All option have been tested, results are the same.
  
 Android only handles up to 48kHz files for now, so your Note 3 is normal.


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## JamesFiiO

caableguy said:


> Ok, so How much and when will it be available. ON their website my Note2 is listed in the supported Phones!


 
  
 the M.S.R.P is $159 in U.S


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## gattari

With note 3 I have 24 bit 96 khz and 192 khz usb output ;with sammy stock player or google sound player. As specified by Danba forumer  in the android usb tread.


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## twister6

Sorry guys, I'm just using my ears as "measurement" tool. When I tested E18 with Neutron player day before yesterday and early yesterday (their v1.7.52 version) - the difference in sound was significant between Note 2 stock music player and Neutron (in Neutron I had dithering and crossfeed disabled). After last night update to v1.7.53, I just spent some time a/b comparing and it sounds almost identical with a stock music player.  I don't know if its fully transparent, but there is definitely a significant improvement.


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## caableguy

So is this worth getting for my Note2. I just orded the X3, will this be good with the X3 too? My main cans are the W4R and my 15year old HD580's. My main DAC/AMP  has been my old D-Zero.


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## twister6

caableguy said:


> So is this worth getting for my Note2. I just orded the X3, will this be good with the X3 too? My main cans are the W4R and my 15year old HD580's. My main DAC/AMP  has been my old D-Zero.


 
  
 In my opinion it will be an overkill with X3.  It definitely works great with Note 2 (my review of E18 with Note 2 and lots of pics: http://www.head-fi.org/t/688094/fiio-e18-review-from-audiophile-in-training-perspective-with-lots-of-pics).  I personally wouldn't want a dedicated player keeping playlist synced between my N2 and X3 and carrying an extra device.  Again, just speaking from my own perspective where I'm always looking for one universal gadgets to consolidate everything else.  Looks to me you can always use E18 as external battery, dac/amp to drive high impedance headphones (spec says up to 150 ohms), as external dac (through usb otg) for Note 2 which has crappy dac to begin, as external usb card for your laptop, etc.  One of the Fiio marketing guys told me they are working on a clamp for smart phone attachment.  That would be so much better then rubber bands that block touch screen.  So, that's another bonus


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## twister6

clieos said:


> Neon version only works with certain processors. Not every smartphone has such a processor.
> 
> I did a quick RMAA test and the result seems to be the same as last time.


 
  
 Here is a reply from Neutron MP developer:
  
 "_*Nothing specific was done regarding audio rendering because it is the
 most stable part of the project since day one. May be you had
 overloading of audio due to Preamp above 0? Also please note that AGP
 has additional settings and the most important RESET GAIN value. If
 this value is above 0 on next track Neutron will modify Preamp gain to
 RESET GAIN value and if it is above 0 then most likely you will have
 truncation of audio (in digital domain). RESET GAIN can be also
 modified if you simply make off/on AGP button in Controls screen. May
 be that was the reason.*_
  
_*Best regards,
 Dmitry.*_"
  
 I'm thinking that after upgrading last night to a new version, Reset Gain got reset automatically so now it sounds as expected.  I know it's driving me crazy, but I'm doing a/b comparison at this moment with Low Gain and Bass Off on E18, crossfeed and dithering off on Neutron, and have both stock Music Player and Neutron on pause switching instantaneously between each and it sounds identical to me.


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## caableguy

So, I'm thinking of getting this for out an about, then using the X3 for more home use, since my wife can throw something at me if my phone starts to ring and I can't hear it while listening to my music.
  
 The Nuetron player works better when the pre-amp is disabled?


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## ClieOS

It is better just not to use Neutron with E18.


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## caableguy

Good enough. 

So now I wonder with player controls on the e18 if we can use headsets with Android control headphones to control player controls on the e18? I have a pair of TF10's with silver stranded cables with Android controls that I use with my Note 2


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## ClieOS

caableguy said:


> Good enough.
> 
> So now I wonder with player controls on the e18 if we can use headsets with Android control headphones to control player controls on the e18? I have a pair of TF10's with silver stranded cables with Android controls that I use with my Note 2


 
  
 No, the remote control on the headset itself won't work any more.


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## lofthanza

Any ideas on how the Fiio e18 compares to the Fiio x3 in sound quality!!
 Thanks!


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## ClieOS

lofthanza said:


> Any ideas on how the Fiio e18 compares to the Fiio x3 in sound quality!!
> Thanks!


 
  
 I'll say E18 sounds better overall, though not vastly.


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## Zenthelld

How does it compare to the E17? It's not much more expensive in the UK so I expect the performance to be about the same, but do their sound signatures/characteristics differ much?


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## jonyoo

Its only been a couple months since I started using the E17 with my HTC One...sigh
 Thx for the detail review though!


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## ClieOS

zenthelld said:


> How does it compare to the E17? It's not much more expensive in the UK so I expect the performance to be about the same, but do their sound signatures/characteristics differ much?


 
  
 E17 is not even on the same playing field. E18 easily beats it out on both DAC and amp section.


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## cswann1

twister6 said:


> I'm thinking that after upgrading last night to a new version, Reset Gain got reset automatically so now it sounds as expected.  I know it's driving me crazy, but I'm doing a/b comparison at this moment with Low Gain and Bass Off on E18, crossfeed and dithering off on Neutron, and have both stock Music Player and Neutron on pause switching instantaneously between each and it sounds identical to me.


 
  
  
 This is good to read.  I've just ordered my e18 and plan to use it almost exclusively with my Galaxy S4 (occasionally with my laptop).  I was delighted to learn that there was a media player that was engineered with audio quality as a core design goal AND included crossfeed.  WOOT!  and have been using it happily since.
  
 The fact that there is a reported roll-off at 20hz and 20khz doesn't bother me in the least as there is practically no musical information at these extremes.


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## jonyoo

Really nice that it has remote button functions and an extended battery capacity compared to the E17. Guess it'll be a while till they distribute it into Korea huh...? Is the overall sound quality worth the upgrade in your opinion? I've been pretty satisfied with E17's output quality/value connected to the HTC One via OTG but really looking forward to hearing more about this one.


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## garysohn

So if I buy a Kunlun and want to connect it to to my Note 3 what cable is required?  Is this cable included with Note 3? Thank you in advance for your kind attention in this matter.


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## botakgorilla

garysohn said:


> So if I buy a Kunlun and want to connect it to to my Note 3 what cable is required?  Is this cable included with Note 3? Thank you in advance for your kind attention in this matter.


 
 E18 comes with a OTG usb cable that you can use to connect it to your Note 3, or any other supported android device for that matter.


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## garysohn

ordered!!!
  
 Thanks everybody.


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## Zenthelld

clieos said:


> E17 is not even on the same playing field. E18 easily beats it out on both DAC and amp section.




Oh awesome, thanks for the reply


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## atistatic

clieos did u compared this dac&amp with JDSLabs C5D?


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## Perfectlap

To the OP, you just made me spend $160! 
  
 After plunking down full cost for my Note 3 on Verizon (in order to keep my unlimited data) I decided to maximize my smartphone by picking up a pair of ATH-M50 ($115).  Not too impressed with the flat sound I picked up the FiiO E11 ($53). Big improvement for such a small price but I decided to give the Mont Blanc E12  a shot ($106) since they seem to increase performance for a still modest sum.  Well that hasn't even arrived in the mail yet but the temptation of a 3,500 mAh battery in the E18 vs. the E12's ~800 mAh's was too great to resist. I spend 15+ hours a week on trains, busses and take at least one 3 hour flight per month. I also craved the convenience of track selection without having to mess with the Note 3's screen. I got too used to that convenience from my LG Tone BT headphones, as well as its AWESOME battery life. The ability to adjust volue by turning a knob from inside my coat or without having to look down is nice on the FiiO's as well.
  
 Great forum, I was completley new to any audiophile anything up until like two weeks ago. I can't believe I put up with bad sound for so long. It's amazing how many new sounds I can hear from my usual playlists with just the $50 E11. 
  
 My strategy was to maximize my phone's functionality. First I picked up the Chromecast for use at home (awesome for YouTube addicts), then I picked up the Nexus 7 wifi tablet (feeding LTE via FoxFi) for downloaded/pinned movie watching. Last night I watched "1" a Formula 1 documentary and the M50's and E11 completely changed the experience, the engines never sounded so alive.


----------



## ClieOS

atistatic said:


> clieos did u compared this dac&amp with JDSLabs C5D?


 
  
 No I didn't. Since I already own the C5, I am not sure I'll want to get the C5D as the two should be pretty much identical sounding on the amp section.
  


perfectlap said:


> To the OP, you just made me spend $160!


 
  
 Haha, enjoy your toys!


----------



## caableguy

perfectlap said:


> To the OP, you just made me spend $160!
> 
> Your post sounds like me. I did the same thing with my Note 2 last year, now next month again for the Note 3, for the same reason. I bought the Chromecast too for watching on hotel tv's. The original Nexus 7 last year and the Note8 a few months ago. I ordered the X3 which I like, but after reading on this post I broke down and ordered the E18. I should have it next week. My birthday gift to myself. This will be powering my W4R, and my HD580's until the new UAH760 gets released. And I picked up a Zerolemon battery for my note and a Jackery12,000 mAh power Pack with 2 charging ports with one being 2.1 amp.
> 
> ...


----------



## TsukiNick

Just ordered one from Amazon I'll post my experience with it and my Galaxy S4 i545 (Verizon).


----------



## Za Warudo

I want a dac/amp combo for my portable headphone/iems but I'm not sure if I should get the E18 for my Galaxy S4 or the X3 DAP.  The X3 costs $40 more but comes with a free Brainwavz R3 iem which retails for $130 on Amazon.  I don't really need another iem so I might sell it to cover the price difference.  Is the DAC and amp on the E18 so much better than the one on the X3 to warrant getting it?


----------



## TsukiNick

Do you really even need an amp with IEMs?


----------



## Za Warudo

tsukinick said:


> Do you really even need an amp with IEMs?


 
 Most IEM don't need an amp to drive to high volume, but the better ones sounds better with an amp.


----------



## FishHead

Purchased for use with my Galaxy 3s and RE0's. Has anyone noticed any change after breaking it in? Thanks for the review!


----------



## atistatic

and what about x3 dac vs e18 dac??


----------



## ClieOS

atistatic said:


> and what about x3 dac vs e18 dac??


 
  
 Purely as DAC, I like E18 a little better - mainly because WM8740 on the X3 can come out a little bland sometime.


----------



## atistatic

So ... Purely as Amp who win? C5 vs E18?


----------



## ClieOS

They are roughly on the same level, but C5 is a little ahead for overall refinement.


----------



## garysohn

"Not too impressed with the flat sound" PerfectLap
  
 Yes, the Note 3 (or at least the SM-N900P that I have) sounds absolutely terrible.  poor dynamics, indistinct, no transient response, an apparently limited frequency range, etc. I don't listen to music, it is that bad.
   Seriously, my old HTC EVO 4G sounded so much better than there is simply no comparison.


----------



## Ashade

clieos said:


> They are roughly on the same level, but C5 is a little ahead for overall refinement.


 
  
 What about ODAC+O2? How would it compare with them soundwise?


----------



## ClieOS

ashade said:


> What about ODAC+O2? How would it compare with them soundwise?


 
  
 O2 is definitely a better amp than E18. As for ODAC, it is ESS Sabre ES9023 based so it has been covered on the first post.


----------



## Ashade

clieos said:


> O2 is definitely a better amp than E18. As for ODAC, it is ESS Sabre ES9023 based so it has been covered on the first post.


 
  
 Thank you very much ClieOS. Well, I know O2 is a much better amp regarding amplification and power, I was probably referring more to transparency, although honestly I expect the O2 to be better as well in this regard. Thank you for the great review.


----------



## ClieOS

I haven't really heard any portable amp that is more transparent than the O2, that should answer some of your question.


----------



## Anouk

Hi Clieos,
 Thanks for the great review!
 I have 2 questions:
 1. will the e18 work with google nexus 5? Sorry if this seems silly but i dont know anything about android. Have an iphone now but might want to switch coming year.
 2. If I, at this point, use the e18 primarily as a laptop soundcard(lineout)/headphone amp, is there a way to turn the battery off so that it wont get charged over time (like you can do with the e17)?
 I am afraid that i would otherwise ruin the battery and not be able to use the amp/dac powered or unpowered.
 I know this unit is mostly made for portable use and not as a stationary laptop device but, for personal reasons, i prefer this model with physical buttons above the e17s meny system.
 Thanks again!
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## ClieOS

anouk said:


> Hi Clieos,
> Thanks for the great review!
> I have 2 questions:
> 1. will the e18 work with google nexus 5? Sorry if this seems silly but i dont know anything about android. Have an iphone now but might want to switch coming year.
> ...


 
  
 1. I assume it should work with nexus 5 since there is no reason why it won't, but there is no way for me to confirm it since I don't have a nexus 5.
  
 2. Actually there is no easy way to charge and use E18 (as PC's USB DAC) at the same time because of the configuration of the USB ports (charging and DAC are two separated port). Which is one of the reason why I don't recommend it as PC USB DAC. It is however possible to use two USB cables to connect E18 to PC: one for charging while the other of DAC, though I am not sure it is recommended or not.


----------



## Varoudis

twister6 said:


> In my opinion it will be an overkill with X3.  It definitely works great with Note 2 (my review of E18 with Note 2 and lots of pics: http://www.head-fi.org/t/688094/fiio-e18-review-from-audiophile-in-training-perspective-with-lots-of-pics).  I personally wouldn't want a dedicated player keeping playlist synced between my N2 and X3 and carrying an extra device.  Again, just speaking from my own perspective where I'm always looking for one universal gadgets to consolidate everything else.  Looks to me you can always use E18 as external battery, dac/amp to drive high impedance headphones (spec says up to 150 ohms), as external dac (through usb otg) for Note 2 which has crappy dac to begin, as external usb card for your laptop, etc.  One of the Fiio marketing guys told me they are working on a clamp for smart phone attachment.  That would be so much better then rubber bands that block touch screen.  So, that's another bonus


 
  
 Hi,
  
 I believe Note 2 has a wolfson dac. Does this sound bad? How does its sound (as a source to an Amp for example) compare to the iPod 5G for example?
  
 T


----------



## elwappo99

garysohn said:


> "Not too impressed with the flat sound" PerfectLap
> 
> Yes, the Note 3 (or at least the SM-N900P that I have) sounds absolutely terrible.  poor dynamics, indistinct, no transient response, an apparently limited frequency range, etc. I don't listen to music, it is that bad.
> Seriously, my old HTC EVO 4G sounded so much better than there is simply no comparison.


 
 Huh! I went from an Evo 4G to a Note 2 and found the opposite. I really didn't listen on my Evo because it was so bad. With the Note 2, I don't fret too much listening with earphones on the go. 
  
 Any more comments on the E18 vs the Leckerton unit on hand? 
  
 What's the best deal running on this unit? Looks like Micca might be the only one stocking it right now?


----------



## Varoudis

SQ wise, is a Note2 + e18 better or just a FiiO X3?
  
 T


----------



## KetchupNinja

clieos said:


> 1. I assume it should work with nexus 5 since there is no reason why it won't, but there is no way for me to confirm it since I don't have a nexus 5.
> 
> *2. Actually there is no easy way to charge and use E18 (as PC's USB DAC) at the same time because of the configuration of the USB ports (charging and DAC are two separated port). Which is one of the reason why I don't recommend it as PC USB DAC. It is however possible to use two USB cables to connect E18 to PC: one for charging while the other of DAC, though I am not sure it is recommended or not.*


 
  
 I'm kind of disappointed in this.  I was wanting one to replace my E17...looks like I'm waiting for the E17K next year.


----------



## pekingduck

Would the E18 work with iDevices w/ iOS7 and the CCK?


----------



## gkanai

New Nexus 5 owner here. Very interested to see how it does on the N5 with KitKat. I'm going to see if they have the E18 at e-earphone or Fujiya AVIC.


----------



## ClieOS

varoudis said:


> SQ wise, is a Note2 + e18 better or just a FiiO X3?
> 
> T




What source is not important, ad long as it works. SQ is determined by the E18, so it should be netter sounding than X3 alone.




pekingduck said:


> Would the E18 work with iDevices w/ iOS7 and the CCK?



I don't see why not given the USB receiver is TE7022 and it is known to be pretty Android anf iOS friendly. Of course I can't confirm it either, since I am not much of an Apple user.


----------



## blitzio

Another Nexus 5 owner here, I'm also waiting to see if the e18 is compatible with it.


----------



## reginalb

clieos said:


> ...One thing to complain is the microUSB interconnecting cable – while it works fine, it is too short and only designed for smartphone with microUSB port on the top or bottom. ...


 
  
 Did you ever find anything? Just stumbled across this, but I have never heard of the store, and have no idea what the quality of the product is:
  
http://hakshop.myshopify.com/products/micro-to-micro-otg


----------



## Ashade

reginalb said:


> Did you ever find anything? Just stumbled across this, but I have never heard of the store, and have no idea what the quality of the product is:
> 
> http://hakshop.myshopify.com/products/micro-to-micro-otg


 
  
 For that price I would just take the risk.


----------



## Zenthelld

Probably a really dumb question, but would the E18 be powerful enough to decently amp a pair of T50RPs?


----------



## Ashade

zenthelld said:


> Probably a really dumb question, but would the E18 be powerful enough to decently amp a pair of T50RPs?


 
  
 I don't think it's dumb, and in fact I was wondering the same (Mad Dogs). I was thinking as well if it would drive Alpha Dogs. I guess it's gonna fall I little bit short though...


----------



## ClieOS

reginalb said:


> Did you ever find anything? Just stumbled across this, but I have never heard of the store, and have no idea what the quality of the product is:
> 
> http://hakshop.myshopify.com/products/micro-to-micro-otg


 
  
 I have ordered some left angled microUSB socket so I am going to build myself a custom cable. Will post picture if it works.


----------



## reginalb

zenthelld said:


> Probably a really dumb question, but would the E18 be powerful enough to decently amp a pair of T50RPs?


 
  
 I would be shocked if it didn't. Those are relatively sensitive, and not all that high an impedance. Honestly, those shouldn't be all that hard to drive. And the E18 has no trouble, btw, powering my Q701s on low gain.


----------



## Varoudis

How e18 amp section compares to other sub-200 portable amps? In terms of sound quality mainly.
  
 Thanks
  
 edit:spelling


----------



## TsukiNick

E18 Working perfectly with my Galaxy S4 Verizon (SCH-i545) on Android 4.3; if you own this version of phone you should have no troubles with it.  No need to use that USB Recorder app.unless you want the non upsampled 48khz playback the Galaxy S4 does.


----------



## Zenthelld

tsukinick said:


> E18 Working perfectly with my Galaxy S4 Verizon (SCH-i545) on Android 4.3; if you own this version of phone you should have no troubles with it.  No need to use that USB Recorder app.unless you want the non upsampled 48khz playback the Galaxy S4 does.




Would you mind commenting on the main differences you notice between the E18 sound and the default S4 sound? Soundstage, separation, resolution etc.


----------



## Ashade

clieos said:


> O2 is definitely a better amp than E18. As for ODAC, it is ESS Sabre ES9023 based so it has been covered on the first post.


 
  
 You know what? You were absolutely right. The E18 is a very good piece of equipment, but still not at the level of ODAC+O2. I am going to try just the DAC part of the E18 with the O2 and see what happens as well. I can live with the E18 for on the go though.


----------



## elwappo99

Sonic Electronix now lists this on their amazon page, which means they'll soon have it on their website (with some promos running)


----------



## n2it

anouk said:


> 1. will the e18 work with google nexus 5? Sorry if this seems silly but i dont know anything about android. Have an iphone now but might want to switch coming year.


 
 no
  


pekingduck said:


> Would the E18 work with iDevices w/ iOS7 and the CCK?


 
 yes


----------



## Zenthelld

reginalb said:


> I would be shocked if it didn't. Those are relatively sensitive, and not all that high an impedance. Honestly, those shouldn't be all that hard to drive. And the E18 has no trouble, btw, powering my Q701s on low gain.




It's not so much about impedance and sensitivity as it is to do with the T50RPs being planar magnetic. At least to my limited knowledge planar magnetic drivers crave power.


----------



## BenF

Why wouldn't E18 work with Nexus 5? Nexus 5 does support OTG USB:
http://www.androidbeat.com/2013/11/nexus-5-supports-usb-otg-box/


----------



## Ashade

benf said:


> Why wouldn't E18 work with Nexus 5? Nexus 5 does support OTG USB:
> http://www.androidbeat.com/2013/11/nexus-5-supports-usb-otg-box/




Supporting USB OTG doesn't mean it supports USB audio. The nexus 5 is reported to not work with the E18.

I read somewhere the internal code talks about USB audio in logs, but it is probably not completely implemented. This is actually something good (inside the bad...) because it opens the doors to third party development.



zenthelld said:


> It's not so much about impedance and sensitivity as it is to do with the T50RPs being planar magnetic. At least to my limited knowledge planar magnetic drivers crave power.




Exactly, that's why I'm not so sure... waiting for somebody to confirm to start thinking in pulling the trigger on the Mad Dogs.


----------



## BenF

That's a shame... I thought it was supposed to get better as Android versions go on, not worse...


----------



## Ashade

benf said:


> That's a shame... I thought it was supposed to get better as Android versions go on, not worse...




LOL! I mean, it gets better, but not for every phone. For example, I'm a Samsung fan and Samsung introduces pretty neat features in every new version. Now, if you are more in the pure Android experience side and the nexus devices... you will have to stick with that. Everything has upsides and downsides. I'm pretty sure you will get a kernel with audio USB support sooner than later. Man, it's a Nexus, there is nothing with more side development than a Nexus.


----------



## garysohn

For what it is worth, the LG G2 works with Kunlun. I hope that gives you hope.


----------



## BenF

garysohn said:


> For what it is worth, the LG G2 works with Kunlun. I hope that gives you hope.


 

 Nexus 5 is based on G2! So confusing...


----------



## TekeRugburn

benf said:


> Nexus 5 is based on G2! So confusing...




How is it confusing? Usb audio isn't a main concern for Android. Very few people use it. 

Stock pure vanilla Android aka aosp Android does not have usb audio. 3rd party oems (Samsung, LG, HTC, etc) put the usb audio when they skin or overlay Android with touchwiz, sense and whatever else they call it.


----------



## ClieOS

tekerugburn said:


> How is it confusing?* Usb audio isn't a main concern for Android. Very few people use it.*
> 
> Stock pure vanilla Android aka aosp Android does not have usb audio. 3rd party oems (Samsung, LG, HTC, etc) put the usb audio when they skin or overlay Android with touchwiz, sense and whatever else they call it.


 

 USB Audio Class support is actually the 3rd most user  requested feature in AOSP.


----------



## TekeRugburn

clieos said:


> USB Audio Class support is actually the 3rd most user  requested feature in AOSP.




That doesn't mean anything. How many people ACTUALLY posts requests they have to Google? The percentage that do is a very very very very small percentage of the people who use Android. 

Also, the ones that's actually do request it doesn't request it for the same reasons we do. They could care less about the dac and bypassing the dac in their phone ..... They want their car cd player or home receiver to detect the songs from their phone and use the controls on the receiver/car deck to navigate through music.


----------



## ClieOS

tekerugburn said:


> That doesn't mean anything. How many people ACTUALLY posts requests they have to Google? The percentage that do is a very very very very small percentage of the people who use Android.
> 
> Also, the ones that's actually do request it doesn't request it for the same reasons we do. They could care less about the dac and bypassing the dac in their phone ..... They want their car cd player or home receiver to detect the songs from their phone and use the controls on the receiver/car deck to navigate through music.


 
  
 Then again, how many people ACTUALLY care enough to post request they have to Google on anything vs. those who choose to sit on the side and make do? You see only the actual number of request, but I see also those who also want it but simply think they are not going to make a difference and choose to be silence in the background.
  
 If no one ever asks for anything, nothing will ever get done.
  
 Also - detect songs and remote control? Are we talking about the same thing here? USB Audio Class? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Well, if that get the job done, I don't see why not.


----------



## TekeRugburn

clieos said:


> Then again, how many people ACTUALLY care enough to post request they have to Google on anything vs. those who choose to sit on the side and make do? You see only the actual number of request, but I see also those who also want it but simply think they are not going to make a difference and choose to be silence in the background.
> 
> If no one ever asks for anything, nothing will ever get done.
> 
> Also - detect songs and remote control? Are we talking about the same thing here? USB Audio Class? :blink: Well, if that get the job done, I don't see why not.




If they didn't care enough enough to request it... Then it's simply not that big of a deal. Yeah i know what I'm talking about.... People who request it aren't requesting for external dac support.


----------



## ClieOS

Who care what they want as long as it helps to get us all to the same point at the end of our journey? There are people who want USB Audio Class on Android, and why they want it is irrelevant. As far as I care, 15 people who request for proper support of USB Audio Class is better than 3 separated group of 5 each asking for remote control, DAC and song detection - it just shows that there is a demand, so why no makes it happens? In fact, if implementing one USB Audio Class can add three features to Android, I'll call that a win-win for both user and Google.


----------



## JohnSantana

Can this be used with iPhone or just limited to PC and Android phone only ?


----------



## ClieOS

johnsantana said:


> Can this be used with iPhone or just limited to PC and Android phone only ?


 
  
 PC and Android only. To be more precise, some models of Androidphone only.


----------



## Varoudis

clieos said:


> PC and Android only. To be more precise, some models of Androidphone only.


 
 are you sure its not IOS7 compatible? its just USB audio1


----------



## ClieOS

varoudis said:


> are you sure its not IOS7 compatible? its just USB audio1


 
  
 Maybe. I don't have any iOS7 devices to try, but E18 isn't designed to run on iDevice nor have the MFi chip inside.


----------



## willyvlyminck

But the LG also have Hi-res Audio, and should be the best sounding Smartphone on the planet right now, so does it bring something to upgrade it with the Kunlun? Maybe the E12 will make more sence?


----------



## ClieOS

willyvlyminck said:


> But the LG also have Hi-res Audio, and should be the best sounding Smartphone on the planet right now, so does it bring something to upgrade it with the Kunlun? Maybe the E12 will make more sence?


 
  
 Having HD playback capability doesn't in anyway indicates that a smartphone is good sounding, left alone being best.


----------



## vermilions

Any updates regarding the E18 being able to drive the Mad Dogs or not?


----------



## JohnSantana

clieos said:


> Maybe. I don't have any iOS7 devices to try, but E18 isn't designed to run on iDevice nor have the MFi chip inside.




ah, so that is the key, mFi chip to be able to determine if an amp can be used by iPhone lightning adapter on iOS device


----------



## ClieOS

johnsantana said:


> ah, so that is the key, mFi chip to be able to determine if an amp can be used by iPhone lightning adapter on iOS device


 
  
 MFi chip makes compatible iOS devices capable of hosting / using the DAC natively with any additional setup. But there is still a chance that you might get it to work with the Camera Connection Kit and perhaps also a powered USB hub. Not really portable that way though.


----------



## Varoudis

clieos said:


> MFi chip makes compatible iOS devices capable of hosting / using the DAC natively with any additional setup. But there is still a chance that you might get it to work with the Camera Connection Kit and perhaps also a powered USB hub. Not really portable that way though.


 
  
 MFi is the 'system' before iOS 7. that includes iPod classics etc. Devs with iOS7 work with the CCK over the USBAudio1 protocol. (I haven't tested it, but technically it should work! Powered hub is for the units without the good 'self powered' design, E18 has a good one. so you just need a CCK to test)


----------



## JohnSantana

clieos said:


> MFi chip makes compatible iOS devices capable of hosting / using the DAC natively with any additional setup. But there is still a chance that you might get it to work with the Camera Connection Kit and perhaps also a powered USB hub. Not really portable that way though.




Cool, thanks for the explanation man


----------



## Varoudis

johnsantana said:


> Cool, thanks for the explanation man


 
 NP, but please remember that my explanation is only technical, I havent tested the thing!  (e.i don't buy it if you are not sure too!!   )


----------



## carlymart

A quick question above it say it works with ios7 that's great but do the controls work can you play pause skip tracks as well?


----------



## Makiah S

Very nice... I might have to pick this up one day for some use with DI.Fm to see how much of a quality increase I can get out of my terrible CellPhone Audio! 
  
 Hopefully, once I get a chance to listen, I'll have something worth while to recommend to all those Droid Using Music lovers! At least will we can convince em to get something like the X3 or an hm 601


----------



## willyvlyminck

An X3 or the coming X5 with Android would make the E18 obsolete , so that won´t happen altrough I would wish a Wlan chip.


----------



## Makiah S

willyvlyminck said:


> An X3 or the coming X5 with Android would make the E18 obsolete , so that won´t happen altrough I would wish a Wlan chip.


 
 well the E18 would be the first step to getting these Cell Phone music lovers into an X5. Any one who owns an E18 might wind up on head fi, which would be a grat place to sell their E18 after they upgrade to an X3 or X5.
  
 ANd X5 with Droid... EWW. Not sure how I feel about that honestly... oh well I'm not a HUGE Fiio Fan so I could care less... still I'm also having to get my HM 801 repaired next month so I might try the X3 or DX50 while my HM 801 is out


----------



## Arniesb

Hi, everybody! Can i use fiio e18 + e12 with my Note 2 at the same time? If yes, are usb on the go cable is incuded in e18 accsessories?


----------



## BenF

You can use them simultaneously.
 The cable is included in the package.


----------



## jonyoo

mshenay said:


> Very nice... I might have to pick this up one day for some use with DI.Fm to see how much of a quality increase I can get out of my terrible CellPhone Audio!
> 
> Hopefully, once I get a chance to listen, I'll have something worth while to recommend to all those Droid Using Music lovers! At least will we can convince em to get something like the X3 or an hm 601


 
 Listening to di.fm right now


----------



## Arniesb

benf said:


> You can use them simultaneously.
> The cable is included in the package.


Thanks mate e12 do not need to conect to 18 right? Just in phone?


----------



## BenF

arniesb said:


> Thanks mate e12 do not need to conect to 18 right? Just in phone?


 

 Only one audio output can be active at a time - you can't connect E18 to USB and E12 to 3.5mm outputs of the phone and have both of them active.
 I thought you wanted to use E12 to amplify E18's signal.


----------



## Nirvana1000

willyvlyminck said:


> But the LG also have Hi-res Audio, and should be the best sounding Smartphone on the planet right now, so does it bring something to upgrade it with the Kunlun? Maybe the E12 will make more sence?


 
  
 Which LG phone are you referring to anyway?Or is this a joke?


----------



## wayward91

i am presuming it will be fine but i was just wondering . how would this cope driving beyerdynamic dt250 250ohm's ? 
 the highest recommended  is 150ohm .
 the beyers are however fairly sensitive in comparison to some .
 if anyone has any comment on it driving higher impedance headphones this would be appreciated . 
  
 EDIT..... actually the manual says 300ohm , slightly conflicting. 
 cheers all ed


----------



## Arniesb

And where to conect e12? In e18 line out? Please forgive me mate for my stupid questions I'm new in this audiofile stuff


----------



## BenF

arniesb said:


> And where to conect e12? In e18 line out? Please forgive me mate for my stupid questions I'm new in this audiofile stuff


 

 Yes, you connect E12's input to E18's line out (the one near the headphone output).


----------



## Arniesb

O yeah! Thats good


----------



## willyvlyminck

LG G2, why should I joke about this, the German HiFi press Audio - Stereoplay said nothing than good things about this one.


----------



## Makiah S

jonyoo said:


> Listening to di.fm right now


 
 indeed it's a nice enough service. A shame they don't sell 320k streaming... [jerks] but for less than $5 a month I can't complain to much


----------



## Solrighal

Does anyone know a likely release date for the UK market? I think it should work well with my Galaxy Note 3.


----------



## carpler

solrighal said:


> Does anyone know a likely release date for the UK market? I think it should work well with my Galaxy Note 3.


 

 As reported in the other E18 thread here on head-fi, on the official Fiio's Facebook page a post written 2 weeks ago says:
  
*The new revision will ship internationally on the 15th*
  
 Still no confirmation about that. The official seller here in Italy says that the device will be available the first week of January.


----------



## willyvlyminck

I just did receive the Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 for my birthday, and  the Sound in Connection with my Yamaha EPH-100 is just amazing,at least for my not audiophile ears, For a bit more bass I use my JVC HA-FX 1000 in ears, but I don´t feel the Need to upgrade with an E18 amp, as it won´t get much better than it already is, the backside of this Quality is that non-remastered seventies recordings become unlistenable,for examply some Anthony Phillips ( ex-Genesis) Private Parts recordings.The Bob Dylan Boot siries from 1 to 6 sounds great if a bit thin, but with my JVC in ears, the Problem is solved.


----------



## garysohn

I bought one of these and can not get it to function with LG2.  Tried it both ways.


----------



## garysohn

referring to Hak cable.


----------



## silentmoon

Does anybody make a review, pairing the E18 and other Android phone?  

 I have a few questions , kinds of ... 

 Which android version that E18 will be compatible with? 

 Does E18 need any firmware upgrading ? 

 About the OTG Cable, there's a lot of low quality OTG Cables on the market right now, i'm wondering if i loose ( or mine is broken ), will Fiio sell another one ?


----------



## ClieOS

silentmoon said:


> Does anybody make a review, pairing the E18 and other Android phone?
> 
> I have a few questions , kinds of ...
> 
> ...


 
  
 1. You'll need at least 4.1 / JB and above. However, Android varies on each model of smartphone so there is no guarantee it will work.
  
 2. No.
  
 3. I found that other OTG cable I have don't work with E18. Have to use the stock cable.


----------



## silentmoon

In my shop in VietNam, we sell E18, too. The problem is that we have a Sony Xperia Arco S ( the only android phone in my shop  ). It's 4.1.2 stock version of this model ( updating is impossible since sony doesn't support ). 

 I connect my Sony with E18 but it doesnt work at all. In fact, i can use the media controller, but cant hear any sound coming out from my AKG K702. 

 So, do i have to ... root my phone? I'm just afraid it's gonna be a brick  

 Really need help.


----------



## ClieOS

Rooting your smartphone won't give you USB Audio class support, so there isn't any need to do so. Try download 'USB Audio Player Pro' from Playstore (a free trial version is available) and see if it will detect the E18 or not.
  
 Also, because it is a old model, it might not have the hardware inside to support any kind of USB Audio device. In those case, you just have to use another, newer smartphone.


----------



## wayward91

solrighal said:


> Does anyone know a likely release date for the UK market? I think it should work well with my Galaxy Note 3.


 
 iv just got mine this morning from ea audio (also available on amazon) . have not used it yet its still charging but ill be using it (hopefully ) with a moto g .


----------



## silentmoon

clieos said:


> Rooting your smartphone won't give you USB Audio class support, so there isn't any need to do so. Try download 'USB Audio Player Pro' from Playstore (a free trial version is available) and see if it will detect the E18 or not.
> 
> Also, because it is a old model, it might not have the hardware inside to support any kind of USB Audio device. In those case, you just have to use another, newer smartphone.


 

 Dear ! 

 I installed USB Audio Player Pro and my whole set-up still a brick  

 I try to pair E18 with my Nexus 4 and the same thing happens. We've got 5 units of E18 here and cannot make them sound like they should


----------



## ClieOS

Have you selected 'DAC' instead of 'CHG' on the bottom of E18?


----------



## silentmoon

clieos said:


> Have you selected 'DAC' instead of 'CHG' on the bottom of E18?


 
 Yes , I'm pretty sure about this section.... I Choose " Phone -in " , mine is REV B ( after 20/12/2013) 
 BTW, How many post do i need to post picture in this forum?


----------



## dikkiedirk

So far I haven't been able to get it working with my Galaxy S4. Just got the E18 this morning, so I might miss something.
  
 The E18 and S4 are connected through the short micro USB cable.
  
 Need any setting be changed or software installed on the S4.
  
 Please help, like to get it working.


----------



## Solrighal

wayward91 said:


> iv just got mine this morning from ea audio (also available on amazon) . have not used it yet its still charging but ill be using it (hopefully ) with a moto g .




Thanks for the info my friend. Do you know if it's the revision B model?


----------



## wayward91

mine is (it charges on pc usb) . i am however a little disapointed that the moto g doesnt work without the usb audio player pro app. it almost does but not quite and very inconsistently . it sounds good though , better than i had expected.


----------



## dikkiedirk

I updated the fw on my Galaxy S4 and sound over USB works now. Is the FLAC player that play upto 24bit/192 kHz and possibly downsample to 96 kHz on the fly, because the E18 does'nt't go higher???


----------



## BenF

dikkiedirk said:


> I updated the fw on my Galaxy S4 and sound over USB works now. Is the FLAC player that play upto 24bit/192 kHz and possibly downsample to 96 kHz on the fly, because the E18 does'nt't go higher???


 

 It is being downsampled


----------



## GioF71

I received my e18 two days ago, for my Samsung s3.
I am experiencing good results, although I noticed some interference noise when tre phone struggles to connect to some mobile network. this happens on the train especially.
IMHO, the FIIO E18 sound quality looks more than adeguate for the price.


----------



## bowei006

Nice review Clieos, I finished mine up a bit back so I thought I'd see what you thought! Keep up the good work!


----------



## willyvlyminck

or a tablet for that matter, I have the 2014 Edition of the Samsung Galaxy 10.1 and this one sounds already great in Standard mode, so I wonder what the E18 can bring extra in case anyone of you tried this already out? In March-April Comes the new Galaxy 5 Smartphone, so I would use the E18 for both if any progess is possible, because I prefere this Option instead of a musicplayer only because the Topmodels have no Android and or Wlan, and I mainly stream my Music, not Spotify but Wimp who offer far more better Sound and more prog,avant-rock and beyond than most other,but ok, this is my personal taste.


----------



## LimeANite

willyvlyminck said:


> or a tablet for that matter, I have the 2014 Edition of the Samsung Galaxy 10.1 and this one sounds already great in Standard mode, so I wonder what the E18 can bring extra in case anyone of you tried this already out? In March-April Comes the new Galaxy 5 Smartphone, so I would use the E18 for both if any progess is possible, because I prefere this Option instead of a musicplayer only because the Topmodels have no Android and or Wlan, and I mainly stream my Music, not Spotify but Wimp who offer far more better Sound and more prog,avant-rock and beyond than most other,but ok, this is my personal taste.



According to the compatibility thread (http://www.head-fi.org/t/690036/fiio-e18-does-your-smartphone-work-with-it-for-usb-audio-tell-us-about-it-here-and-we-will-award-you-10-internets), the Note 2014 is supported.


----------



## Nirvana1000

I guess it's too early for talk about the Galaxy S5 which I saw that the specs are released.I cant remember if they are official specs.


----------



## money4me247

nirvana1000 said:


> I guess it's too early for talk about the Galaxy S5 which I saw that the specs are released.I cant remember if they are official specs.


 
 OMG i can NOT waitttt for the S5!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!! ...prob won't be out until march, but some of the rumored specs are sickkkknessssss.
  
 edit: there are no confirmed official specs out yet. they are all rumors, but some info does seem very likely. it's so sad that the current smart phone market place is so sorely lacking in android phones with removable batteries & sd cards.


----------



## Nirvana1000

It says you can chose between an all steel body or plastic.Withe the steel costing more.I'll see if I can find the specs to post.


----------



## money4me247

nirvana1000 said:


> It says you can chose between an all steel body or plastic.Withe the steel costing more.I'll see if I can find the specs to post.


 
 the metal version (most like aluminium not steel) would probably have better internal specs too from what i've read


----------



## jonyoo

I'm curious if there is someone who has tried this with the HTC One.


----------



## Head-Head

Is this devise only charged by USB?
 BIG thanks.


----------



## BenF

head-head said:


> Is this devise only charged by USB?
> BIG thanks.


 
  
 yes.


----------



## lukeap69

For LG G2 users, this works straight out of the box for the stock 4.2.2 ROM but not on Kitkat stock ROM (4.4.2). In fact, on kitkat ROM, when my phone is connected to my JDSLabs CmoyBB amp, there is hissing/static (don't know the correct term) which does not go away even when the music is playing (so for now avoid Kitkat!)
  
 On my ASUS T100 Windows 8.1 tablet, it works just fine (connect as a PC using the micro USB to micro USB cable.)
  
 Overall, very nice.


----------



## willyvlyminck

But limited for the use with smartphones wich learn us that a E12 will do,right?


----------



## Solrighal

This is something that I must admit concerns me. At the moment my Galaxy Note 3 runs Android 4.3 (Jelly Bean) and as far as I can tell I'll have no problems when I buy an E18 as it'll work fine. However, it would seem that if I update my phone to Android 4.4 (KitKat - which should be rolling out here soon) I may end up with a device which won't work any more. 

Have I got this right or am I worrying over nothing?


----------



## Solrighal

Bump


----------



## FangJoker

Crap. I have a moto x kitkat DE phone and was looking for something like this,  but must work with kitkat.   Is there any other portable dac/amp less than 300 bucks I should look at?


----------



## Solrighal

I've read some people saying it does work with certain phones. I'm simply trying to find a more definitive opinion but I'm not getting anywhere as you can see.


----------



## klam

solrighal said:


> This is something that I must admit concerns me. At the moment my Galaxy Note 3 runs Android 4.3 (Jelly Bean) and as far as I can tell I'll have no problems when I buy an E18 as it'll work fine. However, it would seem that if I update my phone to Android 4.4 (KitKat - which should be rolling out here soon) I may end up with a device which won't work any more.
> 
> Have I got this right or am I worrying over nothing?


 
  
 If you stick with the OEM software I don't see why USB OTG audio would be removed? Most of the manufacturers were adding USB OTG audio for the last few generations of devices. I had USB OTG audio on my S3 going back to 4.1 I think. Most manufacturers' recent versions of Android now have USB OTG now (Sony, Samsung, LG, HTC) and it'll probably stay this way. My S3 kept USB OTG audio through successive version updates since I got it. 
  
 When I flashed Cyanogenmod 10 (Android 4.3) last year I lost USB OTG audio as it wasn't included in the software. I'm not running Cyangenmod 11 (Android 4.4) now and USB OTG audio is back and working great with my E18. So it's a software thing usually, but I don't see why OEM software would remove it in future versions.
  
 I know the Nexus devices out of the box don't support USB OTG audio. But flashing something like Cyanogenmod 11 adds it to devices like the Nexus 4, 5.


----------



## Solrighal

That's good enough for me thanks very much.


----------



## FangJoker

Anyone knows if moto x supports USB otg? I don't want to have to spend that much on a portable amp since I work from home and wouldnt use it that much. Maybe just to listen in bed before I sleep. 

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk


----------



## CoastGuy

vegasf1 said:


> Anyone knows if moto x supports USB otg? I don't want to have to spend that much on a portable amp since I work from home and wouldnt use it that much. Maybe just to listen in bed before I sleep.
> 
> Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk


 
 It seems you may be in luck  
  
http://www.head-fi.org/t/628254/fiio-e18/705#post_10010765


----------



## FangJoker

coastguy said:


> It seems you may be in luck
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/628254/fiio-e18/705#post_10010765


 
 My moto x is on 4.4.2. and probably will get updated to 4.4.3. because of known battery drain issues.  I need someone with kitkat to confirm it working.  But the usb otg should work in theory, but who knows.   These upgrades sometimes breaks more things than it fixes.


----------



## CoastGuy

vegasf1 said:


> My moto x is on 4.4.2. and probably will get updated to 4.4.3. because of known battery drain issues.  I need someone with kitkat to confirm it working.  But the usb otg should work in theory, but who knows.   These upgrades sometimes breaks more things than it fixes.


 
 I see your concern.  As klam stated a few posts ago though, there should be no reason you will lose OTG support with the update, since already available on 4.4.2.


----------



## jonyoo

Has no one still tried this with the HTC One?


----------



## lukeap69

It's working with HTC One, stock ROM 4.4.2 even without UAPP or UARP.


----------



## Tr1ppy

Has anyone tried the E18 with the Xperia Z1 Compact?

I'm looking to get this phone so I'd like to know if it works, preferably with stock setup (without rooting or installing cyanogenmod)

Thanks


----------



## SharkysMachine

HTC One with Sennheiser PXC-450 Noise Cancelling
  
 Looking for some advice. 
  
 I own these over these ear noise cancelling phones.  Spec'd at 450 ohms active mode / 150 ohms in passive.
 Since I will get 99% of my use on airplanes, they'll be in active (noise cancelling) mode unless I run out of batteries.
  
 Given this information, would I be better off using the internal sound card on the HTC One and getting the massive grunt of the E-12...
 Or, will the E-18 supply plenty of gain and control and be superior in SQ becasue of its DAC?
 I've read that the HTC One sound card is pretty good (mind you, this only in comparison to other cell phones).
 Perhaps the high 450 impedance of these phones is non-issue because this is only when they are in active mode and their iternal electronics are engaged (just guessing).
  
 Right now, with phones plugged straight into cell phone, they lack warmth, bottom end lacks heft, and volume is always near max. on both cell and headphones.  (Despite reviews I've read that these headphones were a bit bass heavy).
  
 All praise ta dose wit da knowledge.


----------



## SharkysMachine

Oh, FLAC apps recommendations for this cell phone would be welcome -- Thanks


----------



## Solrighal

I can't help you with your first query I'm afraid. If you're looking for an android player which deals with FLAC well, they all do. Neutron has the best sound quality.


----------



## SharkysMachine

Thanks Zorro, for the advice on flac player. Kind regards,
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
  
 Does anyone, have advice on which FiiO for HTC One given my usage above ?


----------



## cascius

Just as an FYI, I just got my Galaxy S5 and it works flawlessly with it. 
  
 - Cascius


----------



## fauxdiophile

jonyoo said:


> Has no one still tried this with the HTC One?


 
 I just tried it with the HTC One M8, works over USB OTG. I imagine you're asking about the M7 because of your post date, though.


----------



## jonyoo

fauxdiophile said:


> I just tried it with the HTC One M8, works over USB OTG. I imagine you're asking about the M7 because of your post date, though.


 
 Yes, I am having trouble getting it to work with poweramp...Anybody know what I have to do?


----------



## RiazKhan

Hello Buddy,
  
 What is the best matching audiophile headphones for E 18.
  
 I have been looking at HD 650/hd700; HE400/HE 500; LCD 2. Or are these headphones too heavy to be driven by E 18. If so which portable amp should i look for?
  
 I use galaxy note 3 kitkat 4.2 version. as a source will it work with E 18.
  
 Is it better to buy E 12 or E 18.
  
 Please reply... look forward. Cheers!


----------



## Solrighal

I have an SGN3 & pair it with an E18 primarily to drive V-Moda M-100's. I've also used it to drive my Sennheiser HD 650's and it does that job well. There's no shortage of power & the sound is very good.


----------



## zikarus

That was exactly my Combo too... 

... until I bought a DX90 and a Focal Spirit Classic. 



solrighal said:


> I have an SGN3 & pair it with an E18 primarily to drive V-Moda M-100's. I've also used it to drive my Sennheiser HD 650's and it does that job well. There's no shortage of power & the sound is very good.




Note 3 tapatalking....


----------



## scottder

I am using my E18 with an Samsung S5. So fart it only works with the USB Audio Player. Has this been the case for others?


----------



## CasperBxl

I got my galaxy S5 and E18 and they work with all the software.
  
 I'm running the PowerAmp Pro, works like a charm.
 Also with all other music players.


----------



## scottder

casperbxl said:


> I got my galaxy S5 and E18 and they work with all the software.
> 
> I'm running the PowerAmp Pro, works like a charm.
> Also with all other music players.




What version of Android are you running. My S5 only works with the USB Audio Player.


----------



## CasperBxl

scottder said:


> What version of Android are you running. My S5 only works with the USB Audio Player.


 

 Hi Scott,
  
 Mine is running factory standard + 1 update that came in:
  
 Android 4.4.2
 Version: G900FXXU1ANE2
  

  
   
Do not forget to use the correct sequence.

 It could be the you'll have to kill your playing app's after you connected the E18 + turned it on.
 Then start you music app again.
  
  
 I hope this can help,
  
 Casper


----------



## scottder

casperbxl said:


> Do not forget to use the correct sequence.
> It could be the you'll have to kill your playing app's after you connected the E18 + turned it on.
> Then start you music app again.


 
 Ahh that seems to have been my issue, thanks!


----------



## spbach

Just ordered this with a pair of HD 25-1 II's and a BTG recable. Source will be a Galaxy SIII using Neutron Player and I was wondering if I could still use the DAC with Neutron, and compensate for the treble roll-off with some EQ?


----------



## Solrighal

Yes you can. The DAC in the E18 is far superior to the one in the phone. Also, Neutron is the best player too, IMHO. Good luck.


----------



## spbach

solrighal said:


> Yes you can. The DAC in the E18 is far superior to the one in the phone. Also, Neutron is the best player too, IMHO. Good luck.




Would you happen to know what frequency to increase and by how much?


----------



## Solrighal

I have no idea, that's for you to find out. I wouldn't be too quick to use EQ anyway. Just wait & see how it goes.


----------



## jonyoo

Sigh having trouble using it with the htc m8.


----------



## TheThirdFret

jonyoo said:


> Sigh having trouble using it with the htc m8.


 
 What problems are you running into? I have the One m7 and am considering this amp... I'm wondering if any of the problems might translate to the m7.


----------



## jonyoo

thethirdfret said:


> What problems are you running into? I have the One m7 and am considering this amp... I'm wondering if any of the problems might translate to the m7.


 
 I use to use the m7 with the E17 and it worked fine using poweramp until a firmware update. Then I got the E18. It seems the new firmware messed with the USB audio out and it's like that on the m8 as well. I think rooting with a custom ROM or something might be needed.


----------



## TheThirdFret

jonyoo said:


> I use to use the m7 with the E17 and it worked fine using poweramp until a firmware update. Then I got the E18. It seems the new firmware messed with the USB audio out and it's like that on the m8 as well. I think rooting with a custom ROM or something might be needed.


 
 Thanks for the feedback, I'll keep it in mind that I may need to root the phone.


----------



## jonyoo

thethirdfret said:


> Thanks for the feedback, I'll keep it in mind that I may need to root the phone.


 
 This is the response that I have got from FiiO CS
  
*Dear Jonathan,*

*Thank you for your mail and support to FiiO!

 Regarding to your problem, we suggest you use a tool to press your E18's reset hole then change another usb otg cable to have a try. Pls make sure each connection is good contact. 
 Or you can purchase an USB OTG cable, then connect the supplied usb cable to the USB OTG cable to realize another micro-micro USB cable, like the attached picture. 

 We suggest you use the built-in player. Pls try to move the bottom switch to CHG then move it back to "Phone in" to have a try. 

 In theory, the E18 can compatible with HTC one m8. *
  
 In theory lol...


----------



## TheThirdFret

jonyoo said:


> This is the response that I have got from FiiO CS
> 
> [COLOR=222222]*Dear Jonathan,*[/COLOR]
> 
> ...





in theory...Oh boy...:rolleyes:
I find it funny that despite the fact the m7 is used in the illustrations on their website, I'm still uncertain of its compatibility... I think I'm just paranoid. plus I was considering upgrading to the m8... oh well, we'll see.


----------



## jonyoo

thethirdfret said:


> in theory...Oh boy...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 The thing is it use to be compatible with the m7 until the firmware update...That stupid firmware update messed it all up. I really don't want to use the stock music player...


----------



## mark5hs

How does this compare to the C5D? I'm debating between the two.


----------



## atticu5

Hey everyone,
  
 I think this is my first post but I wanted to mention two things:
  
 1. This is my amp/dac that I got for my V-Moda Crossfade M-100 and I've been mostly pleased, more on that later. It makes my M100s sound far better than they do through my laptop's (macbook w/retina) internal card. By this I mean that the bass hits HARD, if I turn it up my cans WILL shake. I found the mids on the M100s a bit weak and the E18 certainly improves them. The highs are also clearer. 
 The main thing that I noticed was the sound is wider, if that's the right word. What I mean is that everything sounds more separated; when I rewatch Futurama or Archer, I can hear sounds that I'd not heard before and they are more isolated from the rest of the noises. I'm not really an audiophile on the same level as a lot of this forum so I can't go deeper into the sound than I have. I can appreciate good sound when I hear it though.
  
 2. The dac and charger work with the Moto X. I just got my Moto X since ATT has then cheap right now and I was concerned if my E18 would work since it had not worked with my Nexus 4 and I HAD to run cyanogen mod for it to work with my Nexus 5.
 My Moto X is running stock with whatever the latest update is.


----------



## wigglepuff

Hello, does the e18 work while charging at the same time? no issues of distortion or noise?
  
 is it also possible to disable the bat and just plug this in like a permanent usb powered dac/amp?


----------



## rudolffischer

I guess playing hirez content on Android phones is a bit of a cumbersome affair at the moment (at least for Samsung). With the advent of "Android L" this should become easy and out of the box.
 I noticed that the E18 does NOT support 88.2kHz samplerate. In my view this seriously limits the future proof of the E18 with regard to hirez content. Does anyone have any info from fiio about a firmware upgrade that might fix this?
 Thanks and regards
 Rudi


----------



## jamor

rudolffischer said:


> I guess playing hirez content on Android phones is a bit of a cumbersome affair at the moment (at least for Samsung). With the advent of "Android L" this should become easy and out of the box.
> I noticed that the E18 does NOT support 88.2kHz samplerate. In my view this seriously limits the future proof of the E18 with regard to hirez content. Does anyone have any info from fiio about a firmware upgrade that might fix this?
> Thanks and regards
> Rudi


 
 Good point.
  
 The E18 is a year old and the E17 is almost 2 years old now.  So surely FiiO will be coming out with something soon that supports hirez?  Would love some inside information teasers if anyone had any.


----------



## ZackRahn1986

Does anyone know if the Kunlun E18 compatible with the Samsung Note 4?  I should have looked more closely at the supported devices on the specifications before I placed my order....


----------



## Solrighal

It works fine with my Note 3 and I'd be amazed if it didn't with the Note 4.


----------



## Hellkitchen

Hello all, yesterday I tried in a shop both the E12 and E18 and I bought the E12. The only combo I didn't try was the E18 as andorid DAC with E12 as amp attached through the E18's line out..
  
 Can this be done or they cannot be used in such a way?


----------



## ClieOS

hellkitchen said:


> Hello all, yesterday I tried in a shop both the E12 and E18 and I bought the E12. The only combo I didn't try was the E18 as andorid DAC with E12 as amp attached through the E18's line out..
> 
> *Can this be done or they cannot be used in such a way?*


 
  
 Of course they can, though the question are, do you really want to carry such heavy a setup around and do you really need that much power around?


----------



## Hellkitchen

clieos said:


> Of course they can, though the question are, do you really want to carry such heavy a setup around and do you really need that much power around?


 
  
 Well your is a good point. To be honest no; when I travel I bring with me the DX50 + E12 but for home listening I also like to use smartphone since with google play unlimited I usually discover new bands. So I was wondering if maybe that setup could be done. I've tried the E18's amp yesterday and with my UM Pro 30 I didn't like it so much (or at least I didn't seems as good as E12's one).
  
 Obviously I just whant to know if this is possible, maybe I will never use it in this way.


----------



## Hellkitchen

At the end I've bought also the E18 and I'm quite amazed by it. It perfectly works with my Nexus 5 with lollipop (tried before buying anyway) and it is quite good also as standalone amp also if I prefer the E12. Now it's still a preliminary phase but I will give more opinions after more detailed test!


----------



## Hellkitchen

I'm trying the E18 right now as desktop DAC and it works wonderfully. Immediately recognized by the PC and really wonderful sound. Excellent instruments separation, clarity and detail using a pair of HD 598 + a Mstage V2 amp! I think my Xfi HD will not be used anymore!


----------



## freeryder05

I use the E18 when I got to the library to study and it is fantastic. It drives my AKG 495NC, ATH M50s and Shure SE425 very well. It has not been very good for a desktop amp though. I much rather use my Aune TK1 when I am at home on my computer. It does charge though while acting as a DAC so that is a really nice plus. Overall, I love this amp because it works with my HTC One M8 and my computer.


----------



## Hellkitchen

Hey guys anyone knows is it's possible to bypass the Windows internal mixer using chrome with Play unlimited as source?
  
 For serius listening I use music bee with WASAPI and FLACS but I'm trying to go with 320 kbs mp3 and see if the quality is good enoght (yes, I think).. further play unlimited is great for comfortable listening and for discovering new bands and songs!


----------



## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> Hey guys anyone knows is it's possible to bypass the Windows internal mixer using chrome with Play unlimited as source?
> 
> For serius listening I use music bee with WASAPI and FLACS but I'm trying to go with 320 kbs mp3 and see if the quality is good enoght (yes, I think).. further play unlimited is great for comfortable listening and for discovering new bands and songs!


 
 if it's possible I have not found a way to do it. If you let find out I would love to know though. I really love Play Unlimited for the reasons you mentioned and would love to bypass windows mixer.


----------



## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> if it's possible I have not found a way to do it. If you let find out I would love to know though. I really love Play Unlimited for the reasons you mentioned and would love to bypass windows mixer.


 

 Ok I don't think to spend much time in looking a way to do that as I'm happy with the SQ. I tried to go with FLACs but they are way to big.. I still don't know if I will keep that format just for my DX 50 or if switch entirely to mp3 also to have more albums on it.


----------



## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> Ok I don't think to spend much time in looking a way to do that as I'm happy with the SQ. I tried to go with FLACs but they are way to big.. I still don't know if I will keep that format just for my DX 50 or if switch entirely to mp3 also to have more albums on it.


 
  
 That's fine. Sorta figured that would be the case. I guess test and see what you hear. I know that I have to transcode my 24bit for portable because it takes up WAY too much space and for mobile listening. I usually convert to V0, but 320 should give you a solid sound.


----------



## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> That's fine. Sorta figured that would be the case. I guess test and see what you hear. I know that I have to transcode my 24bit for portable because it takes up WAY too much space and for mobile listening. I usually convert to V0, but 320 should give you a solid sound.


 
 Yes I'm still undecided and a bit scary to convert all I have to mp3 and to delete all my FLACs. I think I will start with my prefs and see how the will sound to my ears. I don't I will be able to detect differences in outdoor listening between flacs and 320kbs 
  
 The only issue is that I don't know ho to batch process all my flacs in order to convert them to mp3.. It will be a pain to process them one by one...


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## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> Yes I'm still undecided and a bit scary to convert all I have to mp3 and to delete all my FLACs. I think I will start with my prefs and see how the will sound to my ears. I don't I will be able to detect differences in outdoor listening between flacs and 320kbs
> 
> The only issue is that I don't know ho to batch process all my flacs in order to convert them to mp3.. It will be a pain to process them one by one...


 
 Oh man I would never recommend deleting the FLAC entirely! That's crazy man! Do you have the budget for an external HDD? If you want to batch process conversion from flac you can use a program like dbpoweramp (it's a fantastic program that is very customization to retain quality during transcodes.


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## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> Oh man I would never recommend deleting the FLAC entirely! That's crazy man! Do you have the budget for an external HDD? If you want to batch process conversion from flac you can use a program like dbpoweramp (it's a fantastic program that is very customization to retain quality during transcodes.


 
 LOL I'll never do that actually


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## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> LOL I'll never do that actually


 
 Phew, just making sure! Give dbpoweramp a try for batch conversion. You can also use trader's little helper or the built in on foobar or mediamonkey (I have never used either of these, but I hear they work!)


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## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> Phew, just making sure! Give dbpoweramp a try for batch conversion. You can also use trader's little helper or the built in on foobar or mediamonkey (I have never used either of these, but I hear they work!)


 
  






 I'll go with musicbee as always, let's see how it converts flacs


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## Korse

Yeah, you scared me when you said you were going to delete your FLACS. I did that a long time ago when I wanted to compress my music catalogue to mp3s. I so regret it now, but I didn't have the money in college for an external hard drive.
  
 Ah well, I know better now. Just store them on an HD so you have a back up somewhere. Oh and I use Mediamonkey for batch processing mp3s. But I've also been using mediamonkey for years.


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## Hellkitchen

korse said:


> Yeah, you scared me when you said you were going to delete your FLACS. I did that a long time ago when I wanted to compress my music catalogue to mp3s. I so regret it now, but I didn't have the money in college for an external hard drive.
> 
> Ah well, I know better now. Just store them on an HD so you have a back up somewhere. Oh and I use Mediamonkey for batch processing mp3s. But I've also been using mediamonkey for years.


 
  
 MMh I think this has been a sick idea due to hype moment regarding E18 comfort as Mobile DAC.. The DX50 is born for Flac and hi-res music and I'll continue using it as it deserve.. with FLAC. Soon I will buy a 2Tb external HD so everithing will be in the same place.. I'm quite maniac in these things.. I don't like to have all music in different drives etc..


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## Solrighal

hellkitchen said:


> MMh I think this has been a sick idea due to hype moment regarding E18 comfort as Mobile DAC.. The DX50 is born for Flac and hi-res music and I'll continue using it as it deserve.. with FLAC. Soon I will buy a 2Tb external HD so everithing will be in the same place.. I'm quite maniac in these things.. I don't like to have all music in different drives etc..


 
  
 You have a way to go then if 2TB is enough.


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## Hellkitchen

Guys what do you think about E18's internal amp? I'd like to see what other people think about it. In my case I found it to be really nice but to me E12 has better bass impact and seems overall better. I need to make a better comparisons but this is my actual impressions. In point for E18 is that with IEM it is dead silent with no hiss or noise while E12 has background noise.


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## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> Guys what do you think about E18's internal amp? I'd like to see what other people think about it. In my case I found it to be really nice but to me E12 has better bass impact and seems overall better. I need to make a better comparisons but this is my actual impressions. In point for E18 is that with IEM it is dead silent with no hiss or noise while E12 has background noise.


 
 I agree with the no hiss or noise with nothing on and IEMs. I don't have the E11, but I think difference is probably negligible.


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## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> I agree with the no hiss or noise with nothing on and IEMs. I don't have the E11, but I think difference is probably negligible.


 
 Well I wouldn't say that the difference between E12 and E18 amp is small. It depends of what you are driving but I found the E12 to be better with UM Pro 30 and with HE400 while with my senn HD598 also the E18 was really great. Spacious sound and great instrument separation as well as a lovely tonality. 
  
 The E12 seems to have a more "deep" sound.. dunno how to explain also because probably it's just my perception. Anyway none of them are near to my MStage V2 with opa627 as soundstage and spaciousness of sound. No way


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## Hellkitchen

Anyone has noticed some interference from the smartphone when using E18 as DAC/AMP?  Sometime I can hear some "noise" like if some signal is interfering. Fortunately this happend randomly in the first moments after I plug the phone to E18!


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## CasperBxl

hellkitchen said:


> Anyone has noticed some interference from the smartphone when using E18 as DAC/AMP?  Sometime I can hear some "noise" like if some signal is interfering. Fortunately this happend randomly in the first moments after I plug the phone to E18!


 
  
 Hi,
  
 On my Samsung Galaxy S5 I do not have the issue, even with the E18 strapped to its back with Velcro.
  
 On the forum i did see some people with issues.
 Some suggested putting tinfoil in between the phone and device. I do not know whether this helped though.
  
  
 Kind regards,
  
 CasperBxl


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## Hellkitchen

casperbxl said:


> Hi,
> 
> On my Samsung Galaxy S5 I do not have the issue, even with the E18 strapped to its back with Velcro.
> 
> ...


 
  
 MMh it can be some interference from the phone! Fortunately it's not something costant but that appears randomly


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## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> MMh it can be some interference from the phone! Fortunately it's not something costant but that appears randomly




This drives me crazy. Does the tinfoil trick work for you?


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## JamesFiiO

The interference from smart phone is cause by the GSM signal which can' be solve right now. very sorry.


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## JamesFiiO

BTW, just compare with SONY's PHA-2, the noise is almost the same. and I am not saying it is normal but just want to say it is quite difficult to us to solve such issues.


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## Hellkitchen

freeryder05 said:


> This drives me crazy. Does the tinfoil trick work for you?


 

I haven't try yet!


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## CasperBxl

jamesfiio said:


> The interference from smart phone is cause by the GSM signal which can' be solve right now. very sorry.


 
  
  
 Hi James,
  
 Very best season wishes from Belgium!
  
  
 PS:  My dad ordered an X1.
        Do you know if using a stereo to mono cable poses an issue (as there is no setting in most modern devices for this)?
        He is completely deaf in 1 ear.
  
  
 Kind regards,
  
 CasperBxl


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## CasperBxl

freeryder05 said:


> This drives me crazy. Does the tinfoil trick work for you?


 
  
  
 As James said it is a general, known issue with Cell phones.
 It is like when you put a cell phone close to a PC or hifi speaker.
  
 I assume it has to do with how the phone is constructed, what type of GSM signal is used and how hard the emitter has to work (good or bad signal).
  
Some info on the issue:
 http://www.geek.com/mobile/what-causes-gsm-buzz-1538169/
 http://blogs.howstuffworks.com/keep-asking/why-do-speakers-make-a-hideous-sound-when-you-put-gsm-phones-near-them.htm
  
  
 With kind regards,
  
 CasperBxl


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## Hellkitchen

jamesfiio said:


> The interference from smart phone is cause by the GSM signal which can' be solve right now. very sorry.


 
  
 Anyway this a great DAC and this can be considered a minor issue! I know it's annoying sometimes but it's still a great product!
 The experience with Windows as well as with Adroid in really positive! Plug and play with great sound quality for the money! 

 This my third FiiO product and I'm really satisfied


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## Tr1ppy

+1
  
 E18 is a great little device, especially for the money


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## freeryder05

hellkitchen said:


> Anyway this a great DAC and this can be considered a minor issue! I know it's annoying sometimes but it's still a great product!
> The experience with Windows as well as with Adroid in really positive! Plug and play with great sound quality for the money!
> 
> 
> This my third FiiO product and I'm really satisfied







tr1ppy said:


> +1
> 
> E18 is a great little device, especially for the money




I agree. This is my third dac and I have loved them all!


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## David1521

Will this work with spotify on my galaxy s5?


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## CasperBxl

david1521 said:


> Will this work with spotify on my galaxy s5?


 
  
 Yes it will. (although spotify is not the higest resolution, i think).
  
 The E18 is a DAC (Digital to Analog Converter), so it will do all the "sound production" instead of the internal DAC of your phone.
  
  
 Hope this can help,
  
 CasperBxl


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## Hellkitchen

I think spotify can reach 320kbs under subscription.. I use it with Google play unlimited and I get 320 kbs.


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## saba

For hd 598 wich one is better
E12 or E18 ?
why?


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## willyvlyminck

saba said:


> For hd 598 wich one is better
> E12 or E18 ?
> why?


 in the E18 is also a DAC, but the E12 might be the better amp, as it doesn't have to compromise.


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## saba

I know that but for hd 598 which one is better ?
I use samsung tab 3.8.0
for waching film and listening to rock music.


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## Solrighal

Well, the DAC in the E18 is probably better than the Tab's built-in one so there's a boost right away. The E18 amp isn't quite as powerful as the E12 but it's more than enough for most headphones you're likely to use with a portable device.


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## bldmovs

Has anyone had any recent luck using a Nexus 5 (stock, Android 5.1, no custom ROM) and the Fiio E18?  Thanks!


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## laksid

Where should I look for characteristics of pcm 1798 chip? (Im interested in large music scene width and better dynamics.)


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## coco-bun

Just got an E18k to replace my E7. So far I'm happy except I randomly get very quiet static when the 3.5mm plug swivels. 

Hardware is OnePlus One -> E18k (gain and bass is off or low) -> headphones. 
Software is stock cyanogen OS with latest updates and using Poweramp (full version). 

I tried using my UE Triplefi10, AudioTechnica M50, and Denon D7100 but they all seem to have static when the 3.5mm jack swivels. I get no static when using my Denon 300USB DAC with any of my headphones. The Triplefi10 being most prone to this random static. Could be coincidence but it's most noticeable when it's in between tracks or playing youtube... strangely and fortunately, it seems to be just fine when it's playing music via Poweramp software.

Anyone else have this issue?


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## coco-bun

Okay, just found this link on fiio... Are these really that prone to interference from my phone? I don't think my E7 was like this... 
http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=40345&extra=

PS: Went through this thread but I hope this isn't a topic already covered.


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## stuck limo

What are the main advantages (or not) to using the Kunlun with an Android phone vs the  Alpen 2 E17-K? Which one generally has the better audio quality and ease of use?


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## divineatma

I have a Swans M10 powered speaker unit.. Can I connect the input of those to the e18 output?


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