# Schiit Magni 3+ and Magni Heresy - Impressions Thread



## XERO1 (Aug 15, 2020)

Schiit Magni 3+


Schiit Magni Heresy (original version w/ red LED pilot light)


Schiit Magni Heresy (revised version w/o red LED pilot light)


https://www.schiit.com/products/magni-1

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-3601#post-15334257
______________

Schiit has released two new amps, the *Magni 3+* and the *Magni Heresy*!!

One's a *lil' angel* and the other's a *devil's child*_*!! *_

Pick your _*potion*_ or _*poison*_ for only $99 each!


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## genck

those look slick, i'll stick with my asgard 3


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## ahmonge

Ummm, seems to me that op-amps are gaining ground in the cheap desktop headphone amps nowadays. I don’t care, as long as they sound great. Besides, the black and red colour design looks great.


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## GimmeCans (Nov 30, 2019)

Haven't been able to find any info on what improvements Schiit claims for the 'Plus' version.
Also, with the Heresy, Schiit is competing against themselves for the same market space. Seems like that is going to confuse people.
As I write this, Amazon has the *Magni* 3 (not the new 'Plus') on sale for $74 for Black Friday weekend.


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## genck

GimmeCans said:


> Haven't been able to find any info on what improvements Schiit claims for the 'Plus' version.
> Also, with the Heresy, Schiit is competing against themselves for the same market space. Seems like that is going to confuse people.
> As I write this, Amazon has the Modi 3 (not the new 'Plus') on sale for $74 for Black Friday weekend.


There isn't a Modi 3 plus, you're already confused lol


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## GimmeCans (Nov 30, 2019)

It doesn't take much...

*
Magni* 3+, sorry. Will correct.


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## JohnIgel

GimmeCans said:


> Haven't been able to find any info on what improvements Schiit claims for the 'Plus' version.
> Also, with the Heresy, Schiit is competing against themselves for the same market space. Seems like that is going to confuse people.
> As I write this, Amazon has the *Magni* 3 (not the new 'Plus') on sale for $74 for Black Friday weekend.



This is from Jason:

*The Showdown*

The thing is, to have a proper showdown I’d need to have a Magni 3+.

And that, my friends, was a lot more work. Like I said, I knew how to improve Magni 3. It needed a driver stage and some power supply filtering. And, at the same time, it would be smart to include the new matched dual BJTs that we were beginning to use in Nexus™ topology amplifiers—it would reduce the number of packages, and improve performance due to better matching.

*Aside:*_ another challenge of discrete design is that the individual transistors vary more than, say, and op-amp (though those vary as well). The design either has to be insensitive to variation (most of what we do) or everything has to be matched (Nexus™). _

But even by going to the matched devices, I was left with a very complicated amp. Magni 3+, with the addition of a driver stage, had morphed into a tiny Vidar—literally. No kidding, the topology is that close. We even had to add a Vbe multiplier to get control of bias (better than the previous diode bias)…just like Vidar.

As a result, Magni 3+ had to move to a 4-layer board, while Magni 3 had been 2 layers. Magni Heresy had no problem running at 2 layers. More layers equals more money, more parts equals more money. Magni Heresy uses more expensive parts, so it’s kinda a wash, but the fact remains: Magni 3+ is a more complex amp.

It got worse. Early protos of Magni 3+ were unstable. I had to change the compensation to make it work with the driver stage.

*Aside:*_ a question to the engineers out there—what does the driver stage do, and why does it change the loop gain characteristics of an amp? Bonus: why would you want a driver stage in a speaker amp, but maybe not in a headphone amp? Why might you go to Darlington drivers in a speaker amp?_

Luckily, I found a simpler compensation method (technically, Miller Inclusive Compensation) that was both simpler and more effective than Magni 3, so the parts count actually went down on the second prototype.

Eventually, I had both a Magni 3+ and Magni Heresy. I took them both home, together with a current Magni 3, to do some listening comparisons…


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## GimmeCans

Thanks!


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## MonoOno

Still not sure what to make of that write up. So the Magni 3+ is more powerful and probably now more suited for speakers but the Heresy sounds better?


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## ev666il

MonoOno said:


> Still not sure what to make of that write up. So the Magni 3+ is more powerful and probably now more suited for speakers but the Heresy sounds better?



Magni 3+ is _like_ a speaker amp, in the sense that it has so many things in common with Vidar as to be effectively a miniaturized version of it, but it cannot power speakers. Magni 3+ and Magni Heresy have the same power output, and both are designed to drive headphones.

Schiit were also careful not to divulge whether they prefer the sound of one or the other, as that's what they want their customers to tell.

Magni 3+ measures better than Magni 3; Magni Heresy measures even better than Magni 3+.

Magni 3+ is a discrete design, which aligns with Jason's habitual design philosophy; Magni Heresy is a simpler op-amp based design, which overthrows Jason's habitual design philosophy.


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## MonoOno

Thanks ev66il. I think I like your explanation better.


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## XERO1

MonoOno said:


> Still not sure what to make of that write up. So the Magni 3+ is more powerful and probably now more suited for speakers but the Heresy sounds better?


ev666il summed up Jason's comments about their SQ pretty well, but here's exactly what Jason had to say about it:


_*Listening Redacted!*

Sorry, guys, I won’t be giving detailed impressions of what I thought about all the amps.

“Why?” some will cry. “You’re a terrible tease, Mr. Stoddard!”

Here’s why: I’d like you to let me know what you think. And I don’t want to color your impressions. More on how we’ll get your impressions later.

Here’s what I will say: If I thought either amp really sucked, we wouldn’t have introduced them both. You would have ended up with one new Magni, rather than two.

From the first listening, we went on to more detailed measurements.

Magni 3+, for us, was a measurement monster. It posted up THD+N numbers that are 10-15dB better than Magni 3 when loaded at 32 ohms. We’re talking THD+N of -105-106dB at 1V RMS into 32 ohms.

*Aside:* also for the engineers, explain why that’s to be expected when you add a driver stage?

Magni Heresy still beat it handily. Magni Heresy, despite its super-straightforward topology (OPA1662 for gain, OPA1688 x 8 for output buffer, no overall loop feedback, but local feedforward—internal to the OPA1688 topology—in the output stage), is more like THD+N of 113-115dB at 1V RMS into 32 ohms. These are crazy good numbers.

Now, of course, there are two responses to this:

1. “Numbers don’t matter! Tell me which one sounds good!”
2. “Numbers are everything! Why would you buy an inferior product?”

Here’s the thing: both of these absolutes don’t get into the nuances.

*For the “numbers don’t matter,” guys*, here’s the thing: they both sound good. Both are amps I’m proud to sell. Both have strengths and weaknesses, though. So I can see some people preferring Magni 3+ and some other people preferring Magni Heresy. No harm, no foul.

*For the “numbers are everything,”* guys, here’s the other thing: you’re gonna be hard-pressed to find studies claiming that the human ear can perceive the difference between -106dB and -114dB. So it really comes down to which one you like better. If it’s Magni Heresy because of the numbers, again, no worries. If you hear a difference and prefer Magni 3+, also no worries._


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## GimmeCans

Magni 3 on closeout *$59* on Schiit's website in the 'Last Call' section.


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## moriez (Dec 2, 2019)

genck said:


> those look slick





ahmonge said:


> the black and red colour design looks great.



Like.. sooo much nicer? Makes silver look lifeless. Black/silver and black/red should be Schiit's new default schemes. Anything in the way of this @Jason Stoddard?


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## Jason Stoddard

moriez said:


> Like.. sooo much nicer? Makes silver look lifeless. Black/silver and black/red should be Schiit's new default schemes. Anything in the way of this @Jason Stoddard?



I personally really like the black and red, but holy moly, changing over everything...plus lots of people like silver, or have silver. Or want black and gray. Or want a white and black "Stormtrooper" edition (Tyler keeps asking me for that.) 

So, yeah, I hear you...but not really feasible.


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## HumdrumPenguin

Jason Stoddard said:


> I personally really like the black and red, but holy moly, changing over everything...plus lots of people like silver, or have silver. Or want black and gray. Or want a white and black "Stormtrooper" edition (Tyler keeps asking me for that.)
> 
> So, yeah, I hear you...but not really feasible.



Put some Star Wars markings on that Stormtrooper edition and it would sell like hot cake to the older audiophile from back in the day when Star Wars came out. Think of all those audio nerds in their 40s and 50s nowadays. Although I'd say it's more likely for these people to be interested in more premium devices, not the Magni + Modi combo, which ends up becoming a bigger financial gamble making themed Mjolnir + Yg.


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## rascalion

hah! I'd replace my magni 3/modi 3 with a magni 3+/modi 3 in stormtrooper. It would look (and sound) great next to my white/black pc.


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## xuan87

abit late to the game (work, black friday shopping, home renovation etc) but I was quietly catching up and reading everything, I saw the red black Magni photo and that got a "Holy Schiit" out from me. 

Want to get them both, but they're both "want it" rather than "need it" items given that I already have the Jot. We'll see, but sometimes it just boogles my mind what Schiit can squeeze out from 99 buckeroos.


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## moriez (Dec 3, 2019)

Jason Stoddard said:


> I personally really like the black and red, but holy moly, changing over everything...plus lots of people like silver, or have silver. Or want black and gray. Or want a white and black "Stormtrooper" edition (Tyler keeps asking me for that.)
> 
> So, yeah, I hear you...but not really feasible.



No, nothing wrong with silver. That's Schiit. And yet, also because you're known to go crazy sometimes wouldn't it be cool for 2020 and onward to include the black schemes for _all _gear? 'Changing over everything' doesn't seem a thing if finishing stock first. I haven't much of an idea what it takes. For example will prices raise by $10, $20 or more? None?


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## ev666il

Most Schiit gear already offers black as an option. Those few items that don’t, I have no idea why.


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## MonoOno

Yeah, would love to have the option for a black Modi Multibit to match the Heresy but looks like I will have to settle for just a black Modi 3.


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## SeEnCreaTive (Dec 3, 2019)

Jason Stoddard said:


> I personally really like the black and red, but holy moly, changing over everything...plus lots of people like silver, or have silver. Or want black and gray. Or want a white and black "Stormtrooper" edition (Tyler keeps asking me for that.)
> 
> So, yeah, I hear you...but not really feasible.




Oh gosh, black and grey, or Storm Trooper. Or Black and blue. I can see that being a big pain logistically.

Unless you keep the switches and volume knobs unpainted, and just paint the top black like is already happening, The manufacturer would just have to change the one colour after a batch of bottom pieces......

.....Buuuuuuuut I'd want the knob and switches coloured too like the Heresy is.

Also if you make a higher end Op Amp based amp, you should totally call it "Heretic"


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## Asahi Templar

Jason Stoddard said:


> I personally really like the black and red, but holy moly, changing over everything...plus lots of people like silver, or have silver. Or want black and gray. Or want a white and black "Stormtrooper" edition (Tyler keeps asking me for that.)
> 
> So, yeah, I hear you...but not really feasible.



White and black would be pretty awesome.

The Black and red looks really cool have to admit. Would have been better if there was a matching red/black Modi. The black silver one is okay but looks a little strange stacked. Looking forward to seeing people compare these! Its a cool option for people to compare a more exotic kind of amp to a great measuring op amp based design without having to spend a ridiculous amount of money. The improvement in Magni 3+ measurements is really impressive.


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## ev666il

Red and black make everything look better  I’d love to run a red/black Schiit stack, but my chances are looking slim (I’m looking at Bifrost 2/Jotunheim.)


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## makmeksam

Am I the only one who like Heresy very much but can not stand the bold red color?


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## HumdrumPenguin

Samiyuru said:


> Am I the only one who like Heresy very much but can not stand the bold red color?



You are alone.


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## makmeksam

HumdrumPenguin said:


> You are alone.


I can’t believe there should be someone!


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## bboris77

First review and comparison!
https://www.headphones.com/blogs/ne...-heresy-headphone-amplifier-review-comparison

I am on the fence since I have the original Magni 3 and I am wondering if the improvement to the Magni 3+ are worth the purchase.


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## Asahi Templar

bboris77 said:


> First review and comparison!
> https://www.headphones.com/blogs/ne...-heresy-headphone-amplifier-review-comparison
> 
> I am on the fence since I have the original Magni 3 and I am wondering if the improvement to the Magni 3+ are worth the purchase.




That is a great article and the kind of thing I was really hoping would come out of the Magni Heresy  release. Very happy Schiit released these two amps as its a cheap way to get a exotic topology and a excellent OP amp based amp to A/B against each other. Think a lot of great content and information will come out it. They are perfect candidates for blind tests like that.

Would be great if we could see a lot of blind tests between the Heresy and Magni 3 + pop up at meets and events all over the place, would be a great way for people to find out if they can hear a difference. I was very skeptical about how much difference amps/dacs could make until I actually heard it for myself and A/Bed a lot of gear.

I am not suprised that the author couldnt tell the difference between the Heresy and the Atom/Archel I think the low distortion TI op amp  based stuff all does sound much the same. They make amazing starter amps as it gives you a nice baseline to compare other amps to and are really useful for content production where accuracy is paramount. I find other types of amps often sound better for listening to music and gaming though.

It sounds like the Magni 3+ is a solid improvement over the original Magni 3 too, I am one of the people who actually disliked the Magni 3 as I found it sounded compressed. Based on the authors comments that doesnt appear to be the case with the +. Great time to get into HIFI that is for sure, everyone is spoiled for choice now!


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## igorpadrao

makmeksam said:


> Am I the only one who like Heresy very much but can not stand the bold red color?



Au contraire. If I had to choose, soundwise, I would probably go with the Magni 3+. But I like very much the color scheme of Heresy and Hel. I could buy both and trade the shells, but then I would have to deal with that white LED of the Magni 3+. I hate white LED and I don't know if they are easly changeable.


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## ev666il

igorpadrao said:


> Au contraire.



I don’t think this means what you think it means


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## HumdrumPenguin

igorpadrao said:


> Au contraire. If I had to choose, soundwise, I would probably go with the Magni 3+. But I like very much the color scheme of Heresy and Hel. I could buy both and trade the shells, but then I would have to deal with that white LED of the Magni 3+. I hate white LED and I don't know if they are easly changeable.



He is talking about the colour only as I understand. Soundwise, according to reviews, I’d also go with the 3+.


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## igorpadrao

ev666il said:


> I don’t think this means what you think it means



Makmeksam want the Heresy, but do not want the red and black color scheme.
Me, in the other hand, I want the Magni 3+ but do not want the silver, grey and white color scheme.
Au contraire is french for "the opposite" or "the other way around", from what I know. I believe it applys to this situation, but I could really be wrong. Maybe in english the expression has a different meaning? I don't know. English is not my primary language, so I could always incur in some mistakes.


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## ev666il

I could make mistakes too; English is not my native language either 

Makneksam asked, “Am I the only one who dislikes the red/black color scheme?” (I’m paraphrasing) so when you said, “Au contraire” to me that meant you dislike it too. However you mentioned shortly thereafter that you actually like it, which prompted my post.

Cue a native speaker intervening to tell us we’re both wrong


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## HumdrumPenguin (Dec 6, 2019)

ev666il said:


> I could make mistakes too; English is not my native language either
> 
> Makneksam asked, “Am I the only one who dislikes the red/black color scheme?” (I’m paraphrasing) so when you said, “Au contraire” to me that meant you dislike it too. However you mentioned shortly thereafter that you actually like it, which prompted my post.
> 
> Cue a native speaker intervening to tell us we’re both wrong



Igorpadrao used au contraire wrongly. The way it was written implies that Igor prefers the Heresy to the +3, but prefers the colour scheme of the +3.


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## SeEnCreaTive

igorpadrao said:


> Au contraire. If I had to choose, soundwise, I would probably go with the Magni 3+. But I like very much the color scheme of Heresy and Hel. I could buy both and trade the shells, but then I would have to deal with that white LED of the Magni 3+. I hate white LED and I don't know if they are easly changeable.




I took my 2u apart the other day to clean the dust out. The whole thing is held together with just a few screws

But you're right on the LED. The plastic is molded on. But it's only the LED leads holding it to the PCB, so it should be simple if you can solder.... And if Schiit wants to give you the parts


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## KaiFi

Interested to try either one. My problem with the Magni 3 was the noisy pot. Not sure if that's changed, but it's worth a try.


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## makmeksam (Dec 7, 2019)

KaiFi said:


> Interested to try either one. My problem with the Magni 3 was the noisy pot. Not sure if that's changed, but it's worth a try.


It also felt scratchy when turning magni 3 volume pot.


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## HumdrumPenguin

If anyone with an Asgard 3 can compared it to the sound of the Magni 3+, it would be great. I already use the A3 at home, and need another amp for the office, so I'm torn between the 2 (I'll get the Modi 3 for dac to go along with either since now it is also offered in black and I don't need to use a built in dac on the A3 like I did with what I have already). It will be powering an AEON 2 Closed Back btw.


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## Cdog

Has anyone confirmed whether or not the Magni 3 volume control issues have been resolved in these latest releases?

My M3 has developed both the scratchy noises around 10 o'clock and obvious channel imbalances at lower volumes.

Yea, warranty has expired!


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## adydula

OK Jason....

Inquiring minds want to know:

I assume the new Magni's are running in class AB?

So how do you get such good numbers if there is still the AB cross-over distortion issue? I assume there is no coherence stuff in these amps?

I have a Magni 3 and think its one of the best head amps under $1000.

Looks like I have to order these soon!

Great Job!
Alex


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## Kammerat Rebekka (Dec 8, 2019)

I ordered the Heresy simply because I dig the whole Sith thang they’re going for style-wise.
(Doesn’t matter anyways, I’d be very surprised if I could hear any differences between the silver Magni vs the Sith. I’ve certainly never been able to hear differences over any other ss amps once these were hidden from view and level matched.)

One thing that is a little puzzling to me..how on earth has Schiit managed to squeeze 2•2.4 W out of something so incredibly tiny??!!?? That is just mindblowing. They’re using the force alright...
These little badboys will quite literally drive just about anything you care to throw at them. Every can connoisseur out there should be good as gold...maaaybe with the exception of HE-6 owners that mostly listen to music at a 120 dB


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## GearMe (Dec 8, 2019)

Kammerat Rebekka said:


> I ordered the Heresy simply because I dig the whole Sith thang they’re going for style-wise.
> (Doesn’t matter anyways, I’d be very surprised if I could hear any differences between the silver Magni vs the Sith. *I’ve certainly never been able to hear differences over any other ss amps once these were hidden from view and level matched.)...*



So..._if your hearing capabilities are similar to most folks_, then they won't really 'hear' the difference but vote for their favorite based on 'other' reasons.

If I recall, Schiit did a comparison of various tubes at the Schiitr that removed these 'issues'...

Wonder if they'd consider a similar kind of thing for these amps...then the 'better' design / measurements or even the 'cool' colors wouldn't impact the outcome.

FWIW...I'd keep selling them both if it isn't much of a production issue; market segmentation is a beautiful thing!


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## Kammerat Rebekka (Dec 8, 2019)

Careful with the conclusions there
I think most will hear or indeed feel differences if they buy the two and do a little a/b switching. I would too....but it’s an entirely different kettle of fish once you can’t see what is playing...and how many here have actually tried this for themselves?
Yup.

I’d be wildly surprised to see Schiit do blindtests on their own ss gear...at least properly set up ones, but that’s mostly down to me having tried a number of them - realising just how sad my life had become trying to compare cymbal crashes for a couple of hours...to no avail no less!

I also think they should keep making both. People have different colours they go for and also different priorities when it comes to the actual engineering behind the box...which again can add another facet to the appreciation of x piece of gear.
Anyhoo..I think it’s all kinds of awesome that Schiit continues to develop proper gear with this level of affordability.


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## starence

Kammerat Rebekka said:


> Careful with the conclusions there
> I think most will hear or indeed feel differences if they buy the two and do a little a/b switching. I would too....but it’s an entirely different kettle of fish once you can’t see what is playing...and how many here have actually tried this for themselves?
> Yup.
> 
> ...



Prepare to be wildly surprised, they hold events like this regularly. I think they might also setting up a blind test of the 2 Magnis.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-3447#post-15232238


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## adydula

If your spending hours comparing cymbol crashes then your missing a lot IMO.

I have now 12 head amps and a dozen set of cans and I like comparing and there are differences but I try not to go overboard...

I rotate thru my stuff and learn to tell and like them all and spend time enjoying the music!

Life is too short...enjoy the music while you can!

Alex


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## GearMe

adydula said:


> If your spending hours comparing cymbol crashes then your missing a lot IMO.
> 
> I have now 12 head amps and a dozen set of cans and I like comparing and there are differences but I try not to go overboard...
> 
> ...



Yep!


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## Asahi Templar

Kammerat Rebekka said:


> Careful with the conclusions there
> I think most will hear or indeed feel differences if they buy the two and do a little a/b switching. I would too....but it’s an entirely different kettle of fish once you can’t see what is playing...and how many here have actually tried this for themselves?
> Yup.
> 
> ...




They do set up blind tests and people do indeed hear differences. The most interesting result recently is that they did a blind test between their Delta sigma dacs and their multibit dacs and people prefered the Delta sigma based dacs by a large margin. The older Gungnir AKM dac was the most preferred one overall. Very interesting stuff! 

As I understand it they are trying to do more and more blind tests as they find them very useful for product feedback and improving designs. I hope its a trend that catches on as I think level matched blind tests are the best way to find out which products actually sound the best to people. Measurements are really useful for finding serious flaws but cant really tell you which devices people will enjoy listening to the most.


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## Kammerat Rebekka

Hah...well I sorta stumbled into that one myself. Nope I didn’t actually start out comparing cymbal crashes...but when you’ve spent the better part of a weekend listening to everything from huge classical pieces and small choral ensembles to minimalist and altogether modernistic and futuristic genres and hear absolutely no differences...well you end up grasping at straws.
I don’t want to start any negative schiit in here, so I gather I should just bow out of this thread. 
Conversely, I find it extremely interesting that Schiit’s form of blindtests end up completely different to any other I’ve ever witnessed. 
Then again, I’m not entirely sure I trust a blindtest set up by the same folks who manufactured the gear. 
Also because I’ve tested quite a few Schiit ss amps before and they all sounded the same...when levelmatched and hid from view.


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## adydula (Dec 9, 2019)

Well, to be honest I have done many AB and blind tests and I agree with you that its often hard to really discern and real world differences....but often our brains make us think that they
are....

I have spent many hours doing what you have done....but lately as I review and compare I realize there are so many great products out there that will provide one a good listening experience.

My blind tests often wind up being different as well....its not just Schitt......

I might add Jason Stoddard often on this site and their website avoid giving his or their opinion about how things sound or how they perceive their stuff sounds....more so than other vendors IMO.

Grasping at straws tells you something....so why do we do this and for how long??

To me its a hobby and getting new stuff whatever the claims is the only way to "hear" for myself what others claim etc...

Its not that they are wrong or right, we all are different...except for measurements most things are not absolutes when it comes to listening....

That said I will probably buy both if these amps, listen to them both and most likely come to the conclusion they are both good and either one will do just fine!!

All the best
Alex


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## LuckyX2 (Dec 12, 2019)

Just bought the Magni 3+. I like the black/grey color scheme the Modi offers now but the black/red on the Heresy is a bit "adolescent" imo. The silver is more refined.
Besides, if I bought the Heresy, it wouldn't look right stacked on my silver Modi I have now and I'm not going to drop $100 just to get a black Modi when I already have a perfectly fine Modi 3. (not to mention my Vali 2 which has no black option to match)

Personally I think the Heresy should be offered in the traditional silver. That avoids it not matching existing setups and pleases anyone who likes the original color. Plus it's easy to implement since it's the same shell as the 3+, not like anything new needs to be made.
That's just my $0.02

Anyway, color aside, more importantly I think I'll like the sound of the 3+ better anyway judging by the impressions saying it's heavier/darker.
They both measure so well, I think it's at the point where the extra resolve of the Heresy isn't going to be noticeable and it's more about feel. Looking forward to hearing the Magni 3+!


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## makmeksam

makmeksam said:


> Am I the only one who like Heresy very much but can not stand the bold red color?





HumdrumPenguin said:


> You are alone.





makmeksam said:


> I can’t believe there should be someone!





LuckyX2 said:


> Just bought the Magni 3+. I like the black/grey color scheme the Modi offers now but the black/red on the Heresy is a bit "adolescent" imo. The silver is more refined.
> Personally I think the Heresy should be offered in the traditional silver. That avoids it not matching existing setups and pleases anyone who likes the original color. Plus it's easy to implement since it's the same shell as the 3+, not like anything new needs to be made.
> That's just my $0.02


Here is someone!


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## HumdrumPenguin

makmeksam said:


> Here is someone!



A wild Geodude has appeared.


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## LuckyX2

Maybe I'm crazy but it just gives me cheap "gamer" vibes


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## igorpadrao

LuckyX2 said:


> Maybe I'm crazy but it just gives me cheap "gamer" vibes


From the Pictures, I believe it is much more Burgundy than this open glossy red. I believe that it is more elegant than the people are thinking.

Audio Science Review review:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...gni-3-and-heresy-headphone-amp-reviews.10311/

I believe that everybody knew beforehand the conclusion of that review. As Amirm only cares about measurements, the Heresy would be the winner, in his opinion.

I believe that is more to audio than measumerements alone can ever says.

But here it is another review to take into account.

There is the teardown also:

Schiit Magni 3+ teardown
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/.../schiit-magni-3-headphone-amp-teardown.10328/

Schiit Magni Heresy teardown
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...it-magni-heresy-headphone-amp-teardown.10330/


----------



## Popcancontro

LuckyX2 said:


> Personally I think the Heresy should be offered in the traditional silver. That avoids it not matching existing setups and pleases anyone who likes the original color. Plus it's easy to implement since it's the same shell as the 3+, not like anything new needs to be made.


I absolutely second this. The red is not my bag at all and wish they had the heresy in silver. I just bought the Atom amp and now am wondering if I will need some heresy oomph to run the Argons that are coming in a few weeks.


----------



## gooeyrich

JohnIgel said:


> This is from Jason:
> 
> *The Showdown*
> 
> ...



I'm still not clear on the difference, as in why the need for both to exist. Heresy is apparently more technically capable and comes in a different color, but the price is the same so why not just have the Heresy.

This is from the website:



> Your Choice: High Performance…or Even Higher
> 
> For Magni 3+, we pulled out all the stops in designing the highest performing discrete Magni ever, by any metric—power, distortion, or noise floor. *But it’s easy to get even higher measured performance from integrated (op amp) designs, so we decided to give you a choice, with Magni Heresy. *
> 
> ...



What is the difference between a regular amp and an "integrated op amp"?


----------



## Pete7874 (Dec 15, 2019)

gooeyrich said:


> I'm still not clear on the difference, as in why the need for both to exist.


They exist, because based on the reviews I've read, the two sound a bit different.  Maybe Schiit did not want to force a certain sound signature onto the listener, so instead they gave the listener the options, allowing them to choose the one that sounds better to them.

Besides, Schiit probably wanted something in their portfolio that directly competes with JDS Atom (Heresy), while still giving a more "traditional" option (3+) to their client base.


----------



## ev666il

gooeyrich said:


> I'm still not clear on the difference, as in why the need for both to exist.



It's two different design philosophies applied to the same product, as explained here by Jason himself.

Magni 3+ improves upon the original Magni 3 design and stays consistent with the company's M.O., whereas the aptly named Heresy deviates from Jason's habitual designs to achieve the same goal (a great value desktop headphone amp at the $99 price point.)

Heresy measures better because it employs op-amps, which typically measure better than discrete circuitry. Jason goes into the details in this subsequent chapter (fair warning: lots of engineer speak there.)



gooeyrich said:


> What is the difference between a regular amp and an "integrated op amp"?



Think Jason elaborates on this in the aforementioned links, but in short: op-amps are integrated circuits that cram lots of parts and functions in an itty-bitty living space. They're the reason why smartphones can play music and still get slimmer by the year (among other things.) Nowadays, most audio equipment (except speaker amps) is op-amp based. Now imagine taking an op-amp apart and separating all the things it does into individual (i.e. discrete) components, each of which handles one thing. That's a discrete design. Schiit historically only designed and sold discrete amplifiers; Heresy is the first non-discrete design they've made, hence its name.


----------



## human bass

igorpadrao said:


> From the Pictures, I believe it is much more Burgundy than this open glossy red. I believe that it is more elegant than the people are thinking.
> 
> Audio Science Review review:
> 
> ...


Amirm clearly said he couldnt perceive a difference when he listened to  the amps. So no, he doesnt care only about numbers. He said that since both sound so extremely similar then going with the one with the better numbers makes more sense.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

human bass said:


> Amirm clearly said he couldnt perceive a difference when he listened to  the amps. So no, he doesnt care only about numbers. He said that since both sound so extremely similar then going with the one with the better numbers makes more sense.



I would go further and say that, in such case, go with the colour you like the most or better match your gear. If any colour is ok, then go with the better measurements.


----------



## adydula

Why does it make more sense to go with the one with the better numbers make "more" sense???


----------



## igorpadrao

human bass said:


> Amirm clearly said he couldnt perceive a difference when he listened to the amps. So no, he doesnt care only about numbers. He said that since both sound so extremely similar then going with the one with the better numbers makes more sense.



If Amirm had said it with the words you used, I will completly be fine with it. Even that, for me, if the listening test shows no differences, than the conclusion is buy any for wathever reason. As @HumdrumPenguin said, the color could be a very reasonable motif to buy one or another. A person prefer dicrete over op-amps is another.



> The Magni 3+ is also very competent amplifier and subjectively kept up with Heresy. But my question is why would you buy it? What are you going to do with that "story" of it being discrete? Print it on a sign and put it on your wall? Or sit back and enjoy music knowing that the Heresy provides absolute, provably transparent reproduction whereas the Magni 3+ is very close but may not be there.



He is ostensivly making fun of a person that could, for whenever reason he prioritizes, choses the Magni 3+ over the Magni Heresy.



> But in real-time testing, the two amps are the same. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise!



And here Amirm shows that he is the superior god of sonic neutrality and we are just a bunch of crazy people that hear things that doesn´t exist. Other reviewers heard differences between those two amps. Schiit says that they sound different and I don´t believe these people are just inventing things or being audiofools.

Amirm behaves that way because he only cares about measurements. I do not know how to say in other way. And even that is fine by me. I can understand a person whom prioritizes measurements. I discord, but can understand it. But I would prefer that he doesn´t behave like the king of all things. 

Audio, like a bunch of things in life, is very complex. Trying to simplify it is a mistake in my way of seeying things. As H.L. Mencken once said in reference for complexe problems, "_there is always a well-known solution to every human problem — neat, plausible, and wrong."_ I believe that we must accept the complexity of things and deal with it. But, as I said, it is just my way of seeying (and hearing) things.


----------



## XERO1 (Dec 17, 2019)

I think offering both an all-dicrete amp and an op-amp based amp for the exact same price with the exact same power output is a brilliant idea.

It allows anyone (who's so inclined) to easily answer the question for themselves if Jason's best effort at a $100 all-discrete amp sounds any better (or worse) then his best effort at a $100 all-op-amp amp.

But for Jason, it's also just a way for him to have a little naughty fun by offering two different versions of the exact same thing (_oxymoron alert!_), which he _*knows*_ will drive some people around here nuts!

And knowing him, I'm sure he's getting an evil little chuckle from it all!


----------



## adydula

I bet you a zillon dollars that you cant tell the difference......thats if I had a zillion dollars and I dont!!


----------



## Deckard916

I got a Magni 3 from Amazon for $74, it arrived on Nov 29, the same day that Schiit announced the 3+ and Heresy. GDIT lol. I ordered a 3+ and lived with the 3 for a week until the 3+ came. Sent the 3 back to Amazon. The only real difference that I could notice was that the gain on the 3+ is WAAAaaaaayyy lower, on the low gain setting with LCD MX4 I have to turn the 3+ up to 10 - 11 o' clock whereas on the 3 I could barely get it past 9 o'clock. 3+ is everything you would expect this Schiit to be. Big step up from the Magni 2 I had previously. Still really want to try the Heresy out though, so used to Schiit's discrete amp sound that them making an op-amp makes me want to hear the difference, if there is any.


----------



## Charente (Dec 18, 2019)

MAGNI 3+ Impressions

In summary: A rather good headphone amplifier, … actually, quite remarkable for its size and price. A great achievement by @Jason Stoddard and the Schiit team.

I’ve been following progress of the Magni range over the years, but this is my first purchase, although I own other Schiit (see sig). Jason’s Heresy story got me intrigued and so I plumped for the M3+ as I’m a fan of discrete designs … all that engineering from scratch is awe-inspiring. I’m not really a measurements person, so, I’ll take it as read that they are good. Who am I to argue with them! More importantly to me … how does it sound ?

Initially, I connected the M3+ to the Gungnir MB (in place of the Mjolnir 2) in my main system just to see how it would sound paired with a reasonably top-notch DAC. Headphones were AEON Flow Open (Gen 1), Sennheiser HD650 and Sennheiser (Drop) HD58X … so, my comments are largely with this set-up. I listen mainly to jazz and some classic rock. All comments are my own, personal opinions and you may hear things differently with alternative set-ups.

I felt that the M3+ benefits from a few hours of initial run-in … things smooth out after about 15 hours or so from new, IME.

Right from the off, this is one ballsy, full-bodied amplifier that belies its size and price. There is a pleasant weight to the overall sound presentation and, noticeably, plenty of low-end heft.

Detail is good, even low down, and instrument separation is excellent. Acoustic double-bass is articulate, and the notes are easy to follow. Piano has that satisfying ‘grrrrunggge’ in forte, like a piano should sound, although I do detect some occasional shrillness in upper-mid piano block-chords (think Oscar Peterson). Saxophones reveal their sound textures well, as do guitars, which is important to reflect the expressiveness of the musicians, both in jazz and rock.

The sound stage is not super-wide but perfectly adequate and perhaps not as deep as I’m used to. The stage is fairly close to the listener and perhaps in an ideal world it could be a couple of rows further back.

Headphone pairings:

AEON Flow Open – The M3+ can certainly drive these magnetic planars well, with plenty of detail and bass. However, I felt there is a slight warmish tinge to the sound in this set-up which I don’t hear with my other amps (Mjolnir & Gilmore)

Sennheiser (Drop) HD58X – These easy to drive dynamic headphones sounded at their best with M3+, compared to my other amps. They are relatively inexpensive and could well be a good choice for M3+ owners.

Sennheiser HD650 – These are my preferred pairing … the M3+ cuts through the HD650’s traditional weaknesses effortlessly. The resulting sound is both relaxing and involving. A musically enjoyable experience that verges on the majestic! .. to my ears.

Jason claims that the M3+ (and Heresy) is “... all the amp you’ll ever need”. So, how does it compare against others?

I don’t have any amps at a similar price point, but that didn’t put me off!  The cheapest amp I have is a $249 AUNE X1s (a Dac/Amp, actually). The M3+ knock spots off this, so I won’t go any further with that comparison.

More appropriate is the Gilmore Lite MK2 (by HeadAmp), a discrete design, Class-A amp, producing a maximum of 1.5W of power (much lower), BUT nearly 5 times the price of the M3+. My preferred headphone pairing with the GL2 is AFO, closely followed by HD650 … both are excellent.

So, what does an additional $400 buy you?  There are 3 main areas that are different, IMO, by comparison …

The overall sound of the GL2 comes across as more neutral, clear, transparent and refined. That said, the M3+ has more weight/heft to its presentation than GL2.

On the GL2, there is a greater amount of airiness around the instruments and the sound-stage is both wider, deeper and a bit further back, with more background (ambience) detailing. Transients also seem faster.

Instruments sound a tad more nuanced with even more clarity, and detail on the GL2. At the bottom-end … for example, notes on a low-B string on an electric bass guitar, are better defined. At the top-end, cymbals ‘ting’ more convincingly and splashes are that bit more realistic sounding. Mids are about equal, although the extra weight of the M3+ gives it a pleasant edge.

These two amps are not a million miles apart, but noticeable differences to my ears nonetheless. I wonder how M3+ compares with the new Asgard 3 … would be interesting to hear from anyone that has done that comparison.

So, is it “... all the amp you’ll ever need”? Yes, it probably is all you NEED. At its price/performance point it will be hard, if not impossible, to beat. A great achievement by Jason and his team.


----------



## makmeksam

Why no one has done a youtube video on these amps yet!


----------



## tafens

deleted, wrong thread..


----------



## Currawong (Dec 21, 2019)

gooeyrich said:


> I'm still not clear on the difference, as in why the need for both to exist. Heresy is apparently more technically capable and comes in a different color, but the price is the same so why not just have the Heresy.
> 
> What is the difference between a regular amp and an "integrated op amp"?



Because noisy, measurement-obsessed reviewers have gotten a segment of the audiophile populace wound up and obsessed with products that products that look numerically excellent, even if they don't have a clue what the graphs mean. Most, if my observations are correct, are poor uni students, who love to tell the world that it is wrong, and they are right. When they finally get a job and money, they'll drop the pretence and buy a nice, expensive tube amp that measures like Schiit in comparison.* Until then, the result is better value audio, which isn't really a bad thing.



makmeksam said:


> Why no one has done a youtube video on these amps yet!



Coming, once the amps have arrived and I've recovered from the end-of-year/new year drunken stupor.

*Deliberate inappropriate pun and flaunting of rules intended.


----------



## adydula

I couldnt agree with that more Currawong!

When the Magni3 came out I waited for awhile and bought a B-stock for $79 and its a wonderful amp...so IMO the "upgrade" to these new Magni's have to be wonderful for the same price.

Jason has once again startled this part of the audio world with a price performance, build equality second to none for $99..

I did a experience and review on this website and at https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=165783.0 awhile back...and hope to do the same for these in the near future.

$99!!!! 

Alex


----------



## Autiomatic

Received a Heresy today as a Christmas gift from my wife, and spent the afternoon listening. I was surprised that, of the ATH M50s, Fostex THX00 and PSB M4U, I preferred it with the PSBs. Compared to my Asgard 2, the Heresy seemed to tame some of the brightness and sibilance in the top end on the PSBs.  I was expecting it to be leaner sounding than it is, but actually find the sound signature to lean towards the warmer side, bringing out the bottom end on the PSBs nicely.  I asked for the Heresy over the 3+ due to already owning the A2 and Vali 2, thinking I would like to try the new approach, and I’m glad that I did. Highly recommended!


----------



## tafens

igorpadrao said:


> Au contraire. If I had to choose, soundwise, I would probably go with the Magni 3+. But I like very much the color scheme of Heresy and Hel. I could buy both and trade the shells, but then I would have to deal with that white LED of the Magni 3+. I hate white LED and I don't know if they are easly changeable.



I don’t think they are, but...


----------



## Deckard916

@igorpadrao - the white LED on the Magni 3+ is internal, it's not located next to the volume knob anymore. It's not really noticeable at all unless it's dark in your listening area.


----------



## adydula

I think Jason mentioned this, moving the light internally to help with the folks that dont like bright lights!
:>)
Alex


----------



## tafens

ev666il said:


> Nowadays, most audio equipment (except speaker amps) is op-amp based. Now imagine taking an op-amp apart and separating all the things it does into individual (i.e. discrete) components, each of which handles one thing. That's a discrete design. Schiit historically only designed and sold discrete amplifiers; Heresy is the first non-discrete design they've made, hence its name.



It’s too bad that most amps nowadays are opamp based (at least on the lower end of the dollar scale), and it’s great that Schiit continues on the discrete route, too.

Heresy indeed is the first Schiit amp-only opamp design, but the dac/amp Fulla (and then Hel) were opamp based from the get go (due to size constraints mostly I think).


----------



## makmeksam

tafens said:


> It’s too bad that most amps nowadays are opamp based (at least on the lower end of the dollar scale), and it’s great that Schiit continues on the discrete route, too.


Why do you say op-amp based amps are bad?


----------



## igorpadrao

makmeksam said:


> Why do you say op-amp based amps are bad?



Op-amp based amps are not bad,_ per si_. The problem is when everybody is designing things the same way. We end up with very similar things, in amp case, very similar sound.



Deckard916 said:


> @igorpadrao - the white LED on the Magni 3+ is internal, it's not located next to the volume knob anymore. It's not really noticeable at all unless it's dark in your listening area.



My most common listening scenario is at bed, with all lights off and my wife sleeping by my side. White and blue LED bother a lot, even green LED are a little inconvenient. Red is the only light spectrum that does not disturb us.


----------



## makmeksam (Dec 23, 2019)

igorpadrao said:


> Op-amp based amps are not bad,_ per si_. The problem is when everybody is designing things the same way. We end up with very similar things, in amp case, very similar sound.


That leads to another question. Isn’t the ultimate goal of an amp to be a “wire with gain” or in other words to be “transparent”?


----------



## adydula (Jan 27, 2020)

Even though op amps of the same type are similar they can be used in many different circuits and the results may be very different. Even Jason Stoddard has mentioned when measuring performance specs that there were differences in the same op amps....whether these are discernible to the human ear is debatable.

One thing to note is op amp manufacturers that make these op amps publish tons of charts and graphs of the operating characteristics of their op amps and supply several "reference" circuits that are often used by the el cheopo imports for a low cost.....these folks are the ones that seem to pump out very similar head amps...

The Heresy from Schitt IMO is not one of these, and to get the measurements down to what they are the circuit design (pcb lands layout, parts layout, power supply location etc) have to be really well thought out....if not done right oscillations and instability could easily arise with a simple longer headphone cable or interconnect.

Op amps arent bad and neither are discrete designs...both have produced stellar results when done according to the published design specifications.

Schitt has done a great job here.

Alex


----------



## tafens

makmeksam said:


> Why do you say op-amp based amps are bad?





igorpadrao said:


> Op-amp based amps are not bad,_ per si_. The problem is when everybody is designing things the same way. We end up with very similar things, in amp case, very similar sound.



This is exactly what I mean. In one of the reviews linked earlier in this thread, the reviewer could not tell the opamp based amps apart, but could tell the discrete amps from them (and as I understood it, from each other).

Opamps are not bad in and of themselves, they definitely have their use, and some, like the ones in the Heresy are quite well regarded.



makmeksam said:


> That leads to another question. Isn’t the ultimate goal of an amp to be a “wire with gain” or in other words to be “transparent”?



That’s a very interesting question. It is the classical goal of an amp design, isn’t it? And likewise a very, very hard thing to achieve - especially with all different kinds of loads, from highly sensitive IEMs to power hungry planars.

Also, there is the question of preference; for example, some prefer tube amps (myself included), which are decidedly not wires with gain.

To me, the best amp is not necessarily a wire with gain; but one that provides an enjoyable, dynamic, and engaging listen.


----------



## adydula

Accurate musical reproduction is paramount in amp design...which for the most part is a straight wire with gain....those that have higher levels of distortion and add any coloration can be clouded with how the source material was originally recorded and mastered.

I have three tube amps and nine solid state amps. All give me a great experience...do I have my preferences, yes. If I want to hear what the original material "sounds" like the best way for me to do that is with one of my SS amps..over the tube amps...then if some material is not to my liking for any reason I can change headphones or amps if desired...but I rather use an amp like the Magni Hersey or 3+ to hear how the material really sounds...first before trying to change the sound with gear swaps.

After all how can you tell what the original recording really sounds like except with an amp that is flat as the ace of spades???

Alex


----------



## human bass

And it is important to remember that a super clean powerful 2.4 watts amp for 99 dollars would be considered a pipe dream 4 years ago.


----------



## GearMe

adydula said:


> ...If I want to hear what the original material "sounds" like the best way for me to do that is with one of my SS amps..over the tube amps...then if some material is not to my liking for any reason I can change headphones or amps if desired...but I rather use an amp like the Magni Hersey or 3+ to hear how the material really sounds...first before trying to change the sound with gear swaps.
> 
> After all how can you tell what the original recording really sounds like except with an amp that is flat as the ace of spades???
> 
> Alex



I understand the logic but tend to struggle with this concept when I think that the Engineers/Artists have different hearing capabilities than I (and each one of us) do. 

Then, I think about the fact that they are listening/producing their music through a system (monitors/room acoustics/etc.) that has a certain sound signature which is undoubtedly different than the cans that I'm listening to. 

When it's all said and done, I'm not feeling that the solid state amp really assures me about much of anything...given all the variables that are far more relevant to 'calibrating' my system to align with 'what the original recording [environment] really sounds like'.  

I eventually got to the spot where I'm just listening to the music and not worrying about the gear.  
TBH, I enjoy most songs whether they're played on Tube or Solid State, Senns or Focals, Fostex or Grado's, Audeze or AKG.


----------



## adydula (Dec 26, 2019)

We all have differing hearing and tastes for sure, but there are a lot of hearing similiarites for us humans, usually restricted by our age and shape of our ear parts!!!

That said, IMO is you have a piece of gear that measures very well its a step in the direction where "we think" that if we at least meet some measurements then we can be assured that
at least the amp etc will not introduce a really noticeable influence on the source.

As far as the artist or recording engineers "taste or flavor" thats out of our control for sure....

Heck even when you go hear an artist live...it can be VERY different than what you here in the studio, cafe, venue etc....I have been very disappointed at live shows thinking how terrible
the artist sounds in a particular venue...

Its good you enjoy most songs on your gear! Thats really great compared to many folks just looking for perfection....dont think its out there, but some combinations are very very good!

Alex


----------



## adydula

Read this from the forums at headphone.com from Torq:

The second is Headphone Compensation.

This is a set of data intended to account for the fact that how the ear (and head) shapes and responds to sound coming from, say, a pair of loudspeakers mounted in front of, and pointing back at, the listener vs. having two transducers that are stuck immediately against the head and may fire straight into the ear canal.

The pinnae and the ear canal, and the head itself, all have the effect of boosting certain frequencies and attenuating others, depending on if, where and how sound waves hit them. If a headphone was built that had a genuinely flat response it would sound all sorts of peaky when actually listened to due to these effects. So headphone designers use all kinds of techniques to boost or attenuate different parts of the frequency spectrum in attempt to get a specific sound at the listener’s ear in observance of the different contributions that parts of the ear make to sound waves that actually reach the ear-drum.

Thus, when you measure a headphone with a microphone all those peaks and dips show up. They’re there on purpose. But their purpose is to shape the sound so that what the listener hears is PERCEIVED as being neutral/flat (or whatever signature the designer is going for).

Headphone compensation is simply a way of, well, compensating for those effects so that the measured response of the headphone looks as close to flat (or the desired target curve - of which there are quite a few, the best-known probably being the “Harman Target Response Curve”) as possible.

The “HEQ” compensation profile with the miniDSP EARS is supposed to yield a harman-like response, for example.

And when measuring IEMs you need a different compensation, because you’re bypassing the pinnae and the first part of the ear canal.


----------



## GoldNote

Got my Magni 3+ some days ago and could not be happier! It replaced my Rega Ear mkII. Compared to the Ear it is so much more dynamic and the soundstage is much wider and three dimensional. Have used both my LCD-2 classics and a pair of Shure SE535 IEMs. Love the internal little LED that lights up the amp inside giving it a faint glow through the vents.


----------



## pblogic007

LuckyX2 said:


> Just bought the Magni 3+. I like the black/grey color scheme the Modi offers now but the black/red on the Heresy is a bit "adolescent" imo!



ok, boomer


----------



## adydula

Really!

I wonder how the different paint scheme affects the sound qualities?


----------



## Vvnz100

And how it sounds with the LCD2 Classic?


----------



## jsmiller58

igorpadrao said:


> If Amirm had said it with the words you used, I will completly be fine with it. Even that, for me, if the listening test shows no differences, than the conclusion is buy any for wathever reason. As @HumdrumPenguin said, the color could be a very reasonable motif to buy one or another. A person prefer dicrete over op-amps is another.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



“I would prefer that he doesn´t behave like the king of all things.”

When I watch two groups of polarized individuals arguing it never ceases to amaze me how quick each “side” is to identify how polarized the others are, and how little they recognize the same in themselves.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

jsmiller58 said:


> “I would prefer that he doesn´t behave like the king of all things.”
> 
> When I watch two groups of polarized individuals arguing it never ceases to amaze me how quick each “side” is to identify how polarized the others are, and how little they recognize the same in themselves.



But @igorpadrao only mentioned that, based on what people who heard both amps said, there may be a difference to be heard. He also says he understands that some would rather have the amp with better measurements just for the sake of it, assuming sound differences didn't exist (although he sees no point to it). That's not being an extremist. I guess that, making it in a simple sentence, he wishes @amirm would also take into consideration that different people have different priorities and tastes, and many of them couldn't give two screw about measurements. Pardon if I got it all wrong btw


----------



## genck

HumdrumPenguin said:


> But @igorpadrao only mentioned that, based on what people who heard both amps said, there may be a difference to be heard. He also says he understands that some would rather have the amp with better measurements just for the sake of it, assuming sound differences didn't exist (although he sees no point to it). That's not being an extremist. I guess that, making it in a simple sentence, he wishes @amirm would also take into consideration that different people have different priorities and tastes, and many of them couldn't give two screw about measurements. Pardon if I got it all wrong btw


Amir is full of cocka


----------



## jsmiller58

HumdrumPenguin said:


> But @igorpadrao only mentioned that, based on what people who heard both amps said, there may be a difference to be heard. He also says he understands that some would rather have the amp with better measurements just for the sake of it, assuming sound differences didn't exist (although he sees no point to it). That's not being an extremist. I guess that, making it in a simple sentence, he wishes @amirm would also take into consideration that different people have different priorities and tastes, and many of them couldn't give two screw about measurements. Pardon if I got it all wrong btw



In my opinion, for whatever little my opinion is worth, that would have been a much better way to say it.  Hurling insults at someone usually obscures the rest of a message.  But, that’s just how I think.


----------



## atomicbuni (Jan 6, 2020)

Just got my Magni 3+ today which upgraded my Magni v1.

[Exterior and Build]
- Love the new finish over the v1 and my Modi 2 Uber, much higher shine and finer manufacturing look. Very nice.
- Pressed in feet (YES!)
- Stepped volume is much better feel and control over v1 (obviously a huge jump but really like it)
- Change to in-chassis illumination over front facing LED is actually nice and subtle, I'm a fan especially since this takes the top slot on my stack so it's enough to know it's on.
- New wall wart is much bigger so if you'd got limited room keep it in mind.
- Hilarious list of "included" components on the manual (+100pts)

[Initial Sound Impressions]
Obviously being so many generations after my first generation Magni, the sound profile is completely changed but I'm very pleased.  Using as few bits of flavored vocabulary, separation between instruments and detail of each is much improved and has more punch for each element in the mix.  Sound feels darker compared to the first generation but sound profile was bound to change and I don't mind it.  Finding myself cruising through my collection of music more than I have in a very long time re-discovering some albums which is exactly what I was hoping to get from this upgrade.  HI Gain has been able to drive my Hifiman HE-4XX, AKG K7XX and Sennheiser 598 cans wonderfully, having twice the wattage would do that I suppose.  In-ears and Grado SR60e sound wonderful as well using LO gain which is really nice to have both gain settings when switching between what I'm feeling for the day.  Will continue listening over the next couple days and report back once I get a few more side-by-sides with my older setup.

Thank you @Jason Stoddard and Mike.  I love everything about it.  Really enjoy supporting your methods of madness.


----------



## igorpadrao

> Hey all,
> 
> I thought I'd give you a quick report from the blind listening last night. A more full report will come from Brian at Audio-Head probably within a few days, and I'm sure I'll be doing a chapter on blind listening in the future, because it's insanely interesting.
> 
> ...



Just posting these feedbacks of the first blind listening session of these amps by Schiit.


----------



## makmeksam

igorpadrao said:


> Just posting these feedbacks of the first blind listening session of these amps by Schiit.


Very interesting. Seems like what amir at ASR says about these 2 amps is right after all.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...eresy-headphone-amp-reviews.10311/post-285861


----------



## igorpadrao

makmeksam said:


> Very interesting. Seems like what amir at ASR says about these 2 amps is right after all.
> https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...eresy-headphone-amp-reviews.10311/post-285861



https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...eresy-headphone-amp-reviews.10311/post-302513


----------



## Viper Necklampy

Is it possible to order and try Schiit Heresy and Magni 3+ both here in Italy, and return which one of the two i don't like? Shipping would be high cost?


----------



## adydula

What I got out of this is something I already new....its all good!!!

And any obsession over the .01 -------> .000000000000001 stuff is really a "DONT CARE!"....

From these statements:

But let me tell you, *the differences between these amps are very small*, especially when doing fast switching and short listening. Not familiar with the music? Pretty much no chance of telling for me. No voices? That made it much much harder for me. Not really sitting and concentrating on the differences? Probably not gonna get that either. Again, we're talking tiny differences here, not night-and-day stuff, even with an amp thrown in with 1000x the distortion.

*The bottom line is that we had three very similar amps in this blind test, and I'd personally be happy with any one of them for long-term listening. *
*
You know who wins? Sane people. People who don't want to go crazy nervosa nuts about every little thing.*

So objective and subjective folks get over it and buy 1 and be HAPPY!!

:>)

Alex


----------



## Deckard916

Man, I'm gonna have to order a Heresy to go along with my Magni 3+ just so I can have both.


----------



## Currawong

Here's my take on them:



A couple of thoughts: Most "opamp-based" amps just have 2 single or one dual opamp for the output. The Magni Heresy has 8. That's a bit different from the usual.

My guess is that the subtle differences are down to the slightly better linearity of the 3+ which is the result of matched components. It only showed up on some tracks for me.


----------



## tdockweiler (Jan 31, 2020)

I got the Magni 3+ in earlier today. Loving it so far!
I didn't really have a huge need for a new amp, but wanted to give Schiit amps a second chance.
Always hated the Asgard1, but felt the original Magni was pretty good, but not great.
The Magni and O2 never stayed in my collection long or got much use though.
Instead of being a Schiit fanboy, i've always been a Headroom fanboy. Sorry! 
I've actually been trying to find an amp under $300 that was better to ME than my Headroom Micro Amp and worked well with everything.
The closest i've come was the Ifi Ican I heard a few years ago.

I was going to get the Heresy but figured that it might be too close in sound to my Micro Amp.
The Heresy has 8 op-amps. I think the Micro has 6 or 8, but uses the OPA2134 instead.

No really major differences in sound, which is a positive for me. All my music basically sounds the same. Well, duh.
The biggest difference is that the soundstage from the recordings almost always seems much wider. Not sure why exactly.
What's weird is that when things like this happen it's usually due to a change in my DAC and NOT the amp!
Sometimes i'm confused by how much more often stuff is coming at me from what feels like outside my head in more directions.
This may make a good budget gaming headphone amp. Going to try it tonight.

The DT-990 Pro now feels more like an open headphone and not semi-open!

For whatever reason I have noticed that on the Magni 3+ the difference in sound quality between random tracks is a LOT more noticeable now.
It's most likely that the Magni 3+ is a little more transparent than the Micro Amp. I think the Micro has a very tiny hint of warmth, but not enough to change a headphones sound.

I've only used the DT-990 Pro so far, but I have little doubt it will sound equally good with my Q701 and HD-650. If not, i'll post something about it.
The AKG K400 has always sounded bad to me, but i'll give that a try too.


PS pretty cool how you can get free next day delivery on Schiit amps on Amazon with Prime.
The Amazon price is $20 more than Schiit's website, but Amazon has TONS of fees Schiit has to pay.
That whole $20 is probably going to Amazon commissions.

Also...pretty sure this beats my $300 Headroom Amp I absolutely love. Still early though, but pretty impressive that i'm saying this so soon. Didn't think it was possible for so cheap. I tried before.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

tdockweiler said:


> I got the Magni 3+ in earlier today. Loving it so far!
> I didn't really have a huge need for a new amp, but wanted to give Schiit amps a second chance.
> Always hated the Asgard1, but felt the original Magni was pretty good, but not great.
> The Magni and O2 never stayed in my collection long or got much use though.
> ...



Why not shoot straight up to the Asgard 3 if you were looking for a good sub 300 bucks option? I've never heard the Magnis (any of them), but I can put the Asgard 3 against the Drop 789 and the A3 will pull ahead in MANY songs, to my taste of course.


----------



## tdockweiler (Jan 31, 2020)

HumdrumPenguin said:


> Why not shoot straight up to the Asgard 3 if you were looking for a good sub 300 bucks option? I've never heard the Magnis (any of them), but I can put the Asgard 3 against the Drop 789 and the A3 will pull ahead in MANY songs, to my taste of course.



I think there was a pretty good chance that I wouldn't like the Asgard 3 and didn't want to risk it. Someday if I go to a meet i'd like to try it.
I did try the Asgard 2 and didn't like it. I had some weird technical issues with mine that I wasn't able to fix. The unit wasn't broken, but all my other equipment worked fine.
Possibly some weird interference/compatibility issues with my setup. No idea how this is even possible!

I also wanted to try the latest Headroom amp, but they went out of business 
Sadly I never got a chance to try out the Matrix M-Stage (or whatever it's called now).
I heard that's like a Fiio E9 on steroids (same op-amp too).

I don't really want to feed my addiction any further. I do however want to try the Modi 3!
I WAS a huge fan of the original one when it came out. I only sold it when I found something better (for 3x as much!).

Schiit needs to make a battery powered portable amp that sounds as good as the Magni 3+ 

BTW it's so weird switching to the HD-650 after listening to the DT-990 Pro for 5 hours! Everything suddenly sounds so much warmer/fuller. Kind of more closed in somehow, but still not too bad. I don't know if I could ever use HD-650 as my only headphone.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

tdockweiler said:


> I think there was a pretty good chance that I wouldn't like the Asgard 3 and didn't want to risk it. Someday if I go to a meet i'd like to try it.
> I did try the Asgard 2 and didn't like it. I had some weird technical issues with mine that I wasn't able to fix. The unit wasn't broken, but all my other equipment worked fine.
> Possibly some weird interference/compatibility issues with my setup. No idea how this is even possible!
> 
> ...



Yeah, try them out and see what you think. It has SE power enough to drive you to the moon. The 650 are great in my opinion. They would be one of the few I could think of that would be just enough for anything.


----------



## tdockweiler

Tonight I was going to stop work at 9pm, but instead stayed at my desk until midnight!
Of course it was all for listening to my new amp (sorry..my music!) and still somehow getting some work done. 

The Magni 3+ definitely sounds fine with all my headphones. No such thing anymore of the Magni requiring certain types of headphone signatures to sound good.
I bet Schiit tried this thing with 200 headphones and got good results with them all. 

The biggest improvement by far was with the DT-990 Pro. That headphone is pretty amazing with the Magni 3+. Noticeably clearer too than on my other amp. 
I don't know why. I don't want to even bother listening to my other headphones now. On all of them that are open I'm missing some low bass that only the DT-990 Pro has anyway.
I find that headphone nowhere near V-shaped. Sounds neutral to me with slightly elevated bass (but not treble). I don't get a lot of clamp though, but it's not loose.

Strangely the Q701 seems to benefit less from the Magni 3+ compared to my other amp. Didn't hear much difference so far.
I haven't bothered over-analyzing any differences and I won't ever do this.
The Q701 was always like this and that headphone made it sometimes harder to hear minor changes to your setup.
The K712 SEEMED a little better in this area, but I think those got the best versions of the K702 driver.

Unlikely I could hear any difference between the Magni 3+ and Heresy, but if I did it would have to be with specific headphones. Don't even care really since this sounds so good.
I'm sure on even the HD-650 and Q701 it would be much harder, if not impossible (for me).
I guess it would be easier on maybe a Beyerdynamic T1 or HD-800. 
For a budget headphone, it would be worth a try telling them apart with a DT-990 Pro.
I imagine the only audible differences are changes in the soundstage width.

Also, my all time favorite headphone the Koss Pro DJ200 with M50 pads sounds very very good with this too.
Listening to live concerts feels like I'm listening to an open headphone and it's closed!

So after at least 6 hours of listening I can't find any negatives about this amp yet.
Totally smooth with no annoying treble issues or fatigue.


----------



## tafens

tdockweiler said:


> I think there was a pretty good chance that I wouldn't like the Asgard 3 and didn't want to risk it. Someday if I go to a meet i'd like to try it.
> I did try the Asgard 2 and didn't like it. I had some weird technical issues with mine that I wasn't able to fix. The unit wasn't broken, but all my other equipment worked fine.
> Possibly some weird interference/compatibility issues with my setup. No idea how this is even possible!



The Asgard3 is a completely different amp / topology than the Asgard2. They are both solid state and shares the name, but the similarities ends somewhere about there. So the issues with the 2 most probably won’t be a problem with the 3.



tdockweiler said:


> Schiit needs to make a battery powered portable amp that sounds as good as the Magni 3+



+1 to that!


----------



## tafens

HumdrumPenguin said:


> Yeah, try them out and see what you think. It has SE power enough to drive you to the moon.



And the Lyr3 has even MOAR POWAH, so if Asgard3 can drive you to the moon I wonder where one would end up with the Lyr3? 



HumdrumPenguin said:


> The 650 are great in my opinion. They would be one of the few I could think of that would be just enough for anything.



Agree totally. I haven’t tried many other headphones, but I also haven’t felt the need to.


----------



## BabetakCZE (Feb 2, 2020)

Today I am having little troubles with my new headphones - Aeon Flow Open in combination with Magni 3+.
After a while - 30 minutes+ I got some sound imbalance with AFO. Could AFO cause some overheating that would start channel imbalance? 
Because when i try AFO with my CD player or PC there is no imbalance. 
There is no imbalance with other headphones in combination with Magni 3+ just with AFO. When I turn Magni off for some time and then turn it on, there is no imbalance.


----------



## tafens

BabetakCZE said:


> Today I am having little troubles with my new headphones - Aeon Flow Open in combination with Magni 3+.
> After a while - 30 minutes+ I got some sound imbalance with AFO. Could AFO cause some overheating that would start channel imbalance?
> Because when i try AFO with my CD player or PC there is no imbalance.
> There is no imbalance with other headphones in combination with Magni 3+ just with AFO. When I turn Magni off for some time and then turn it on, there is no imbalance.



This doesn’t seem normal to me, and as the AFOs seem fine, the fault seems to be in the Magni3+.
Maybe some component is bad and works fine when cold but becomes off spec when hot.

Some thoughts; Have you tried with other headphones? If the imbalance has manifested, is it still there if you change to other headphones?

I’d say contact Schiit about it and describe to them the problem as thoroughly as possible.


----------



## BabetakCZE

Yes, with other headphones - HD 660 S there is no imbalance. Problem is only with AFO.


----------



## kinkling

Do you folks think I should go with Magni3+ or Jotunheim?  Newer vs. higher-up-in-the-line?


----------



## genck

kinkling said:


> Do you folks think I should go with Magni3+ or Jotunheim?  Newer vs. higher-up-in-the-line?


Do you need balanced? Obviously not since you are comparing a balanced and non-balanced amp. Go for the Asgard 3 if you want something a step above the Magni 3+.


----------



## kinkling

I can use either/or; I thought the Jot had a single-ended output as well.  I have the opportunity to grab one at almost the price of an Asgard.


----------



## genck

kinkling said:


> I can use either/or; I thought the Jot had a single-ended output as well.  I have the opportunity to grab one at almost the price of an Asgard.


It does, if you have that opportunity then it sounds like a good purchase.


----------



## kinkling

genck said:


> It does, if you have that opportunity then it sounds like a good purchase.


Thanks for the quick response.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

kinkling said:


> Thanks for the quick response.



The Asgard SE output is better than the Jot SE output. I would consider the Jot if using balanced only.


----------



## tdockweiler (Feb 3, 2020)

Has anyone tried both the Heresy and Magni 3+ with the Q701?
It'd be interesting to compare them for a few weeks and see which one you prefer.
I'd like to try the Heresy with the Q701. Maybe the Q701 has a preference for opamps. 
Turns out I can hear some differences between my old amp and Magni 3+ using the Q701. It's not really hard.

The Magni 3+ seems a little more clear and detailed. Soundstage width is even bigger. The treble is nowhere near as smooth.
On my Headroom Micro it's like the amp is saying "This treble is harsh and annoying in the recording, but I won't bother you too much. Ok, maybe a little."
So chances are the Magni 3+ is just not caring about what you think. Probably just more accurate with the recording. Who knows.
I think the Micro has a tiny hint of warmth that seems to work well with the Q701. Q701's treble is also NEVER fatiguing at all ever with that amp.

In comparison the DT-990 Pro's treble on the Magni 3+ could NEVER bother me. Not even with the worst recordings probably.

I believe the Matrix M-Stage, Ifi Ican and Fiio e9 all use the OPA2134 (same as Micro), so it's possible that's a good choice for the Q701 for whatever reason.
I do know those are very good with the Q701 (tried them all).

Magni 3+ is really really impressive with the DT-990 Pro and DJ200 with M50 pads though. I mentioned this already though.
It'd be worth getting the Magni 3+ just for the results I got with the DT-990 Pro alone! It's just that good.

When I listen to the DT-990 Pro on this amp I don't want to take them off. I could be perfectly happy with this as my only headphone.

I have a feeling the Q701 would prefer the Heresy, but who knows. Probably zero difference of course.

PS it also could be that the Magni 3+ is just more revealing of my Headroom DAC than the actual Micro Amp (!).
It uses a Cirrus CS4398 chipset, which could a poor match for the Q701 (it's not even remotely warm IMO).

I guess it's a good time to try a bunch of different sources and see what results I get.

Definitely one of the best amps i've heard so far! Really glad I bought it.

Update:

I tried hooking my onboard soundcard's line out to the Magni 3+. First time I ever tried onboard sound to an external amp! Yes, it sounds bad, but not quite as awful as  expected. I saw some frequency graphs for my Realtek chipset and it's pretty flat mostly.

Those same minor treble issues with the Q701 were also heard on the onboard chipset. Looks like my Micro Amp is very slightly taking the edge off that somehow. It doesn't roll off the treble at all, so this is pretty weird.

Oh and yes, no more onboard sound for me. An hour of that was bad enough.

So yes, the Magni 3+ is just doing it's job really.


----------



## AppleheadMay

Does anyone have an idea when the Heresy will be available in Europe?


----------



## KaiFi

How's the volume knob on the Magni 3+? I sent back my Magni 3 because the pot was noisy. But now I'm realizing my Burson Fun has a noticeable "buzz" even at listening volume, so I'm looking to replace it. Thinking of going back to Schiit.


----------



## nicdub (Feb 5, 2020)

I’ve had the Magni 3+ for a couple weeks now and haven’t experienced any issues with the volume pot, in either low or high gain.  No sort of static when turning up or down, seems pretty smooth overall.

Also, the only hissing I've experienced was with the Cardas EM5813 when the amp was on high gain, otherwise it is nicely silent.  The Cardas is very sensitive, very few amps I've tried have passed the silence test with the EM5813.


----------



## Picard7

Another Magni 3+ owner here...no problems with the volume pot.


----------



## Magic77

Just got the Magni Heresy. Outstanding amp! Just as good as the new Asgard which I also own, in my opinion. If you’re on a budget, get the Heresy, it’s amazing.


----------



## tdockweiler

I've been using the Magni 3+ since day one straight from the wall. Zero problems. Every amp I ever had always sounded best straight from the wall.

Tonight I used the Magni 3+ connected to a Tripp-Lite Isobar 4 with lots of EMI/RFI noise filtering and it sounds so much worse. My brain must be playing tricks on me or something. It's like someone had robbed me of some of my treble. Everything sounded warmer (not in a good way) and more closed in. Totally bizarre. Impossible you'd think. I imagine most amps already have noise filtering anyway.

I have a cheap Furman SS-6B surge protector that seems to be a lot better for amps. It has surge protection, but probably offering the bare minimum. I don't even think it has any listed specifications anywhere online. I only bought it when in the past I found that most surge protectors made my headphone amps sound worse.


----------



## Currawong

KaiFi said:


> How's the volume knob on the Magni 3+? I sent back my Magni 3 because the pot was noisy.



If you're hearing noise while adjusting the volume, turn the volume knob from min to max and back a few dozen times. That will fix it.



tdockweiler said:


> Tonight I used the Magni 3+ connected to a Tripp-Lite Isobar 4 with lots of EMI/RFI noise filtering and it sounds so much worse. My brain must be playing tricks on me or something. It's like someone had robbed me of some of my treble. Everything sounded warmer (not in a good way) and more closed in. Totally bizarre. Impossible you'd think. I imagine most amps already have noise filtering anyway.



Excessively strong noise filters will do that to amps. I have an old Audio-gd power strip which has -50dB and -70dB filters. The -50dB is fine with amps, but the -70dB would kill dynamics noticeably.


----------



## KaiFi

Currawong said:


> If you're hearing noise while adjusting the volume, turn the volume knob from min to max and back a few dozen times. That will fix it.



I tried that and it alleviated the problem for about a day or two. Then the noise came back soon after. That's why I sent it back. I wasn't going to deal with that when there are amps with completely silent pots out there.

I ordered the 3+ so I'll give it a shot. With the 3, the noisy knob was noticeable right off the bat.


----------



## Shotland

Does anyone have both? Would love to hear your takes on them in comparison. I want Schiit to make a Heresy version of the Vali- could be neat!


----------



## AppleheadMay

Magni Heresy, 3+ and Modi 3 available at Schiit UK if anybody in Europe is waiting for these.
I just ordered the Heresy with a black Modi 3.


----------



## Charente

Schiit in the Netherlands has Heresy but out of stock of the 3+ ... does that mean they have had more orders for the 3+ ? ... unusually for me, I got my 3+ straight from the US .. got to France really quick ... €129 on Schiit-Europe site vs $99 USD ... no import duty and a little bit of VAT and handling ... maybe a bit cheaper overall direct.


----------



## stumpie

tdockweiler said:


> Magni 3+ is really really impressive with the DT-990 Pro



 What ohm version do you have on your DT 990 Pro's ?


----------



## tdockweiler

stumpie said:


> What ohm version do you have on your DT 990 Pro's ?



Mine is the 250 ohm version. Isn't that the only one available?
I know the DT-990 Premium comes in 32, 250 and 600 ohm versions.
I had bad luck with those due to the shallow pad depth.

Going to give the DT-770 Pro 80 another try soon. The 250 ohm version was a bit too bass heavy.


----------



## Deckard916

Shotland said:


> Does anyone have both? Would love to hear your takes on them in comparison. I want Schiit to make a Heresy version of the Vali- could be neat!


I just got the Heresy after having the 3+ since just after it was released. The Heresy is a bit more analytical to my ears, the 3+ being a bit warmer. Also, I've noticed the 3+ sounds better on high gain with my LCD MX4 whereas the Heresy is better on low gain.


----------



## AppleheadMay

Deckard916 said:


> I just got the Heresy after having the 3+ since just after it was released. The Heresy is a bit more analytical to my ears, the 3+ being a bit warmer. Also, I've noticed the 3+ sounds better on high gain with my LCD MX4 whereas the Heresy is better on low gain.



Been wondering about those MX4. Any idea how they compare to the 4z? 
Do the Magnis power them easily?
Do you plan on keeping both amps or find out what one is best?


----------



## ticoss

Charente said:


> Schiit in the Netherlands has Heresy but out of stock of the 3+ ... does that mean they have had more orders for the 3+ ? ... unusually for me, I got my 3+ straight from the US .. got to France really quick ... €129 on Schiit-Europe site vs $99 USD ... no import duty and a little bit of VAT and handling ... maybe a bit cheaper overall direct.


In reality, Schiit in the Netherlands don't have the Heresy 



So, i'll following your advice


----------



## Picard7

Shotland said:


> Does anyone have both? Would love to hear your takes on them in comparison. I want Schiit to make a Heresy version of the Vali- could be neat!



The 3+ is a bit warmer and arguably more engaging and approachable. 

That bloke on Z Reviews has compared them as has Headphones.com.


----------



## Shotland

Picard7 said:


> The 3+ is a bit warmer and arguably more engaging and approachable.
> 
> That bloke on Z Reviews has compared them as has Headphones.com.



Interesting. Good to know, thanks! Haha, I hate zReviews' style... but there are so few reviewers out there!


----------



## AppleheadMay

Shotland said:


> Interesting. Good to know, thanks! Haha, I hate zReviews' style... but there are so few reviewers out there!



Here’s a very different review for you then: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...gni-3-and-heresy-headphone-amp-reviews.10311/
And there’s a nice blind testing thread on the “other” forum as well.


----------



## Outaphase

Got my Heresy and I'm stoked!

*The analytical review:*  I needed just a little more oomph for my headphones, a little more dynamic range out of my AKG K240's, that my source, while good, felt a little bit starved for power on the low end.  Like switching to beating a 4-cylinder compact engine to something larger that isn't struggling.  No major coloration that I could detect.

I couldn't get any sound from the top-firing internal speaker so I plugged in some headphones instead.  JUST KIDDING!

The end result is that I want to listen *past* my gear, and the Heresy really did the trick to my ears.  I don't have the sense that it is an additional inline component.

*The subjective review:*
WOW - thank you thank you thank you!

Maybe I listened to too much prog-rock back in the day, but little touches out of the box mean a LOT to me.  Factory-sealed sticker is #1.  Now the whole Feng-Shui vibe.  Two tone colored scheme, two or three different textures.  Someone took the time to match the pcb color to the case color.  It's too bad the back is not seen, because the gold rca jacks and the maroon case work well together.  The bat toggle switches remind me of my days programming my long gone Altair computer.  Seriously OG here.  The point is that someone actually took a little bit of time to think about it, and not just slap something together.  I get it, even if ultimately it doesn't matter.   Call it soul if you want to go that far.

Oh, my source to feed it all:  a CCrane Skywave SSB portable for the fm/tuner combo, not so much the other bands.  No line out, so I'm running on headphone out with the Heresy at high-gain.  A custom-calibrated "half thumb turn" on the 'Crane's volume pot.  The trick here is that this sucker is a Silicon Labs dsp tuner, not your average analog tuner circuitry.  And a nice little 1-Watt low noise amp.  But it needed some help from the Heresy to get the best out my cans.  I covered this in more detail in the portable source forum.

Let's put it this way - NOW I feel like I can step up to some sweet AKG K812's or whatever floats my boat without worry.

No noise detected with the wall-wart or cabling.  But like all things with electrolytic caps inside, I won't leave it plugged in for 15 years straight, and let it discharge every once in awhile and plug back in every year or so.  (you guys at radio stations where gear that NEVER gets power cycled and cringe when the light goes out and wonder if it all comes back know what I mean.)

So Jason - thank you.  It's awesome.


----------



## TS0711

Got my Heresy paired with the Modi 2 Uber.  It's a very warm pairing with plenty of speed and dynamics.


----------



## TS0711

I also tried mixing and matching it with the Modi 3.  But my best Schiit stack is the Bimby with the Asgard 2...


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 12, 2020)

Weird sensation here - that was freakin' fun!  It wasn't just about consuming and putting more "stuff" on the desk.

I sure could have used this amp back when I was a kid who placed a 6x9 speaker in my lap, ran the leads to the positive terminals of the L/R speakers, and tripped out listening to Weather Report.  I couldn't afford an amp dedicated to a faux 2.1 back then. 

Sorry about that nostalgic trip the Heresy triggered.

*Update:  Informal RFI test*
The Heresy is a welcome guest in this radio geeks home.

I could use my portable FM stereo tuner right on top of the amp with no problems, but of course I don't run that way blocking the vents.

Any problems with AM or hf shortwave?  I don't own a spectrum analyzer, but a quick spin through the high frequency bands showed no major carriers popping up.

Took a very small am radio and it's internal loopstick tuned way down to about 520 khz - it's where I pick up a lot of data "hearbeats" and other nasties with some other gear.  Heresy is running and fully loaded with about 4 antennas (cabling).  Wow - it was only until I got ridiculous and placed the loopstick right on the case next to the internal rectifiers did I hear anything at a low level.  Moving it a quarter-inch away and all is clean.  Heh, if I wanted to do some AM dx'ing, I could do so just an inch away from the Heresy.

Schiit gets some mad respect from me in the (non) RFI department.


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 13, 2020)

Gosh, hope I'm not talking too much, but here we go with my wish for the Heresy II 

To me the Heresy case is just a tasteful departure from the usual, and not any sort of statement.  I like it, but I have a functional design suggestion now that I'm all touchy feely and have finished listening to ELP's Pictures at an Exhibition through it.  I think Rachel Flowers would approve.

Edit: in the end we're all just human beings behind our knobs, sliders, cans and specs..


1) Bring back a heavy "Black Crinkle" instead of powdercoat.  Enough time has passed that us OG's know the feel, and the younger crowd has never touched it.

2) SLIDER POT.   Now THAT would be making a statement.  I see enough space in the front panel for it, and since the company logo is so understated in contrast, why not?

*Real-world reason:*
I don't operate the Heresy like a piece of lab equipment in front of me.  It is to my right on a waist-level end-table beside the couch.  Facing forwards, not towards me.  That means I am manipulating the volume by FEEL, and not by sight.

The natural position of doing that means your palm, pinkie, and ring-fingertips touch and have a solid grip on the heavy black crinkle.  Thumb and forefinger now move a smooth finished slider knob.  You know, that whole different-texture groove.  In the same hand.  Makes you want to touch your Heresy.

I know lurkers have assured themselves that I am off my rocker, and perhaps so, but I'd buy something like this in a heartbeat even though I just got my Heresy.

Call me an audio rebel.  I don't mind.


----------



## Outaphase

Um, am I the only one with Heresy impressions?

I'll make this my last impressions since the amp passes a very big test:

Listen to Robin Trower - "Long Misty Days".  An original, not some butchered remaster.

The Heresy brought even more intensity to James Dewar's bass, and didn't interfere with his vocals.   I'm in the right headspace because I'm NOT listening to my gear, but breaking down in non-manly ways missing some very dear old girlfriends.  Weeping willow indeed.

That Schiit made me cry.


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 14, 2020)

Ok, I lied, but this is more of a suggestion.  Hey, we're talking Heresy here right?

Throw another bat toggle on the amp and have it function as a leading-edge impulse slicer / attenuator.  In your spare time of course.  What is this freak talking about?

Laugh at my AKG K240's if you must.  But if you hunt around, you'll see charts showing that the leading edges of high frequency impulses start out of phase / attenuated.  Most other cans don't do this. (although it looks like the AKG K712 and 812 do to an extent).   I talked it up in that specific thread, but the gist is that metallic "strikes" of things like cymbals, triangles, and even cowbells are muted, yet you still hear the "ring" of the instrument.  The "grainy" treble sound if you will.  Obviously reduces fatigue.

Inspired by Trower, I thought "what if that kind of circuitry could be an optional toggle in an amp itself, and not have to rely on headphones providing it ?"

The example source I use is this one.  Crank it up appropriately for rocking, and you may not be able to make it through with all that leading edge impulses coming from the cowbells and hard-edge piano key strikes.  The negative going impulse suppression of the AKG K240's however means I can listen to it at even a LOUDER volume (but not ear damaging) because the impulses from that aren't fatiguing me.  And still hold a conversation immediately afterwards.

*Procul Harum - Whiskey Train*


Seriously - be careful here not to damage your hearing.  The first symptom is lowering the volume to Tony Orlando and Dawn level (sorry Tony!).

So just a heretical thought - put a switch on the amp to do this itself, and that would open up a wider range of cans for my unique tastes.


----------



## Outaphase

Not my thread, but what makes me such a blabbermouth who won't shut up is that Schiit introducing TWO new Magni's is a, um, very rock-n-roll / progressive thing to do.

I guess I'm more turned on by that move than any sort of discrete vs op-amp discussion.  I mean, what manufacturer does something like that?  Only one that I know of.  It was that kind of thinking that got me to pull the trigger, and not getting bogged down into bench-racing specifications that swayed my decision.

Even though my mouse nibbled on the Heresy first, I'm quite sure the discrete Magni would make me just as happy.  Schiit pulled off a very cool move here.


----------



## Propagandist

I got a Magni 3+ / Modi 3 stack so I could have something cheap for work.  I was shocked at how good the amp is.  For $99, I really, really was not expecting much.  The Magni 3+ has some spunk.  Compared to beefier amps, it does have a compressed soundstage, but holy smokes the thing has plenty of power and does everything I would really need it to do, especially for work.  I'm amazed you can get something that does this much for so cheap.


----------



## hifi nub

I have the modi3 I love and the magni 3 that pumps juice to my m100 masters.

They work wonders and sound is so great, there was a sound that sounded like it was right in front of me and I look down and and it was my desk but it came through my headphones it's so realistic it's unbelievable.


----------



## N0sferatu

Can't wait to get my Magni Hersey should be here tomorrow.

Both my friend and I bought the HiFiMan Arya. He got his first (I should have mine Tuesday).  Tried them on my Audio GD FUN. Plenty of oomph but lifeless.  Had friend bring over his Magni (the one that's now end of life) and for such a tiny box it spanks my FUN.  Easy no brainier purchase.  Will likely keep the FUN for DAC for now but maybe sell for Modi to clear some space.  Will be curious to see how the Hersey sounds.  Was going to buy the Gilmore mk2 but not for 5x the price for what this thing sounds like.


----------



## Outaphase

Well, with a decent amp, we'll see how the Heresy pushes my AKG K712's arriving tomorrow in comparison to the 240's.  Thanks to all the head-fi impressions authors for both.

My test-track will be that classic childhood tune from 1972 - Captain Beefheart's "Big Eyed Beans From Venus".



Is it music?  Art?  Perhaps medicine?  Will the Heresy shut down in protest, or recognize the true genius of FUN.


----------



## tdockweiler

Tempted to try the Heresy to compare it to my Magni 3+, but what's the point? Already love the Magni 3+ so I don't want to bother. If it's even 1% better i'd be surprised.
I've also gotten sick of comparing and over-analyzing all my gear anyway. 

I've been getting a ton of more office work done at the computer thanks to this amp. I actually look forward to doing my tedious office work at the PC now.

Other than the increase in soundstage width, another big difference between my old $300 amp is that now it's a lot easier to pick apart the differences in recording quality between tracks. I mean now you get songs that are thin and harsh and just overall poorly recorded and then ones that seem almost too warm and very full sounding. On some you even have recordings where it sounds like the person at the studio made the recording sound like it has bloated bass and called it a day. Then on some older recordings it feels like there is no soundstage at all in the recording and everything is right in your face. I haven't experienced this sort of variation between tracks this much since I had the Beyerdynamic DT-880. 

It would be super easy to accidentally describe how the amp sounds when it's really just the recording or DAC it's connected to. It's also possible my previous AMP was holding back what my DAC was capable of. Who knows.

I'd say now the biggest difference between my old amp is how much clearer better recordings sound. I mean seriously I don't know what it is that makes my brain think this. I noticed this even on a Youtube video for the Final Fantasy XI soundtrack!

Since I got the amp I haven't wanted to use anything but the DT-990 Pro with it. That combo is near perfect. I think it's a better headphone now than my Q701.

BTW I found this track at random on Youtube and it fools my brain into thinking sounds are spinning around me and even directly BEHIND my head!



Probably the best audio equipment purchase I've made since maybe 2007! Yes it's that good IMO.
Usually I find something to complain about within a week of buying something, but not yet with this amp.


----------



## N0sferatu

Okay got the Magni Heresey.  Smokes my Audio-GD FUN as I expceted.  Just using it as a DAC (the FUN).  

I always use Peace to EQ my headphones.  I got levels of slam out of the HD 600 I haven't experienced before.  High gain and EQ'ing it down 10dB so I can amplify the bottom end and I have plenty of head room.  I briefly (off my ears) ramped it up to max volume mother of wow...for a 300 ohm can I'm impressed.

Using my Fostex TH900 low gain is plenty of punch.  I also EQ the bass (even though it's a bass jamming headphone already) and wow does it crank.  High gain at the 9 o'clock position is stupid loud.

Now I just need my Arya to arrive can't wait to slam the planars on this thing!!!


----------



## Viper Necklampy

Does it also smokes the Jds Atom? Anyone who own them both??


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 17, 2020)

Heresy steps out of the way!

Ok, got the AKG 712's in.  Absolutely no problem driving them with the Heresy.

The best part is that it is doing what it supposed to do - tightens up the bass with the 240's, but didn't add any colorization to my sources, which are trippy enough, so I don't need more of that.  Yet even us freaks like good fidelity, but no point in chasing zero's on spec sheets around. 

Which means that I am more into a source / headphone impression thing, and not an amp impression thing at this point. which is good I suppose.  First time I even paid more for headphones than an amplifier which blows my mind.

So thanks for putting in the engineering to make my Heresy step out of the way.

*UPDATE:*  Now that I feel the amp is out of the way sonically, I feel the sudden need for the LOKI equalizer.  But it is the wrong color-scheme. 

I'm not sure Mr. Zoot Horn Rollo would care if the eq I used was done via discrete vs op-amps.  Is it even possible for an op-amp to eq adequately?  If so, I'm in if you feel the need for a "heretical" Loki!

OMG, I can't believe this bug has bitten again - but now it's not the size of 19" rack gear....


----------



## Currawong

With all the AKG discussion, I got out the K7XX again and hooked it up to the Modi Multibit and Magni 3+. While a bit lacking in clarity compared to what I'm used it, given the very random selection of music I listen to, it is a very satisfying combo.


----------



## Outaphase

Currawong said:


> With all the AKG discussion, I got out the K7XX again and hooked it up to the Modi Multibit and Magni 3+. While a bit lacking in clarity compared to what I'm used it, given the very random selection of music I listen to, it is a very satisfying combo.



Oh man - I guess I could put a LOKI equalizer under it after seeing that picture.  But not that I absolutely need it.  Honestly, I probably would have been just as satisfied with the 612's.  A tiny tweak with the LOKI and I'm end-game. 

I get random too at times, but still the source has to be good.  Believe it or not that's very selective *radio*.  Shameful plug: KHUG 97.5 (also streaming) LPFM.  This cat puts so much care into his signal and sources that I do it old school with a modern tuner (Silicon Labs chipset).  The Heresy doesn't know and that was vitally important - if I put in a reception report, or comment on audio quality, it had better be right.

Maybe I'll put a KHUG sticker on my future LOKI just put a little soul in it...


----------



## tdockweiler

Kind of a bit off-topic, but does the K7XX measure almost identically to the K702 65th Anniversary edition?
I didn't like the 65th at all and found it too warm, muffled and closed in sounding. I think there was an earlier version with less deep pads that didn't sound as good.
The 65th I tried had pads that are not as deep as the K712 pads and were more doughnut shaped.

BTW I once tried a Q701 bass modded with those memory foam pads. Sounded terrible! It would be OK I imagine if the bass mod was reversed.

I did like the K712 but felt the Q701 bass modded version was a bit smoother sounding, but not as full sounding in the lower mids.


----------



## N0sferatu

I can say the Arya sing on this little amp.  I'm enjoying tonight.  Got all my new gear the Topping, the Schitt, and the Arya!!!


----------



## XERO1

It looks like Schitt has sold through it's original batch of Magni Heresys with the front red pilot LED. 

RIP, little guy.


----------



## Outaphase

tdockweiler said:


> Kind of a bit off-topic, but does the K7XX measure almost identically to the K702 65th Anniversary edition?



Funny thing about all that - the s/n ratio of impressions across that whole line made me just take a chance on the 712 and the Magni Heresy.  Got lucky it fit my groove, but was prepared to sell it and try something like the Sennheiser HD660's or similar. 

Heh, I'd be happy with just a 2-channel bass/treble op-amp in the Magni for those of us who just put the *slightest* of tweaks on things, not 20db changes.


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 19, 2020)

XERO1 said:


> It looks like Schitt has sold through it's original batch of Magni Heresys with the front red pilot LED.
> RIP, little guy.



Ah, so that's what happened - the led in my Heresy is internal.

Which got me thinking - recut the top ventilation holes so that it projects Schiit on my ceiling!


----------



## Outaphase (Feb 19, 2020)

tdockweiler - you got my gears going with AKG thought - and sorry about the stream of consciousness ....

Magni Heresy + "micro" Loki in one unit?

Hear me out - 2 channel bass / treble eq in a Heresy -- very very fine bass boost / treble cut and visca versca, like 1.5 - 2db. Not even on a pot, but perhaps just a +2 / 0 / -2 switch.  At the worst you'd be going through 2 op-amps, and possibly just a single one, say for "treble cut" only.   Leave mids alone.  Tiny band-aids just to get you through.

Example:  The AKG 70x series, noted for being lean on bass and kind harsh in treble could use these just to take the edge off, or make bass recognizable at least - or both.  It might be enough that all one needs with those.

This way, it still leaves room for the LOKI to exist with much fuller eq control if you want that.  I'd hate to have to get the LOKI and just rotate one pot a hair away from center for just a minor fix.  My thought is that if you need major full pot-rotation eq, then you need new cans!

Whether this would be cost-effective or clean enough is not in my wheelhouse..  had to throw it out there..


----------



## Deckard916

AppleheadMay said:


> Been wondering about those MX4. Any idea how they compare to the 4z?
> Do the Magnis power them easily?
> Do you plan on keeping both amps or find out what one is best?


I've never heard the 4z, but from what I understand the MX4 are a bit less mid forward than the 4z. The Magnis power them easily, I'll be keeping both but so far the Heresy is my favorite, even beating out my Ragnarok when paired with my Oppo 205. There's just something about it........


----------



## AppleheadMay

Deckard916 said:


> I've never heard the 4z, but from what I understand the MX4 are a bit less mid forward than the 4z. The Magnis power them easily, I'll be keeping both but so far the Heresy is my favorite, even beating out my Ragnarok when paired with my Oppo 205. There's just something about it........



I kindof wonder if the MX4 might be an über GX. 
I have the GX here by the way, bought it for gaming and movies but I actually enjoy it with movies as well.
Also less focused on mids than the LCD-3 and XC (from memory), more airy and spatial, ample bass but not a bass monster, smooth highs.

I had a bit of a bad trip with the Schiit stack I ordered: Modi arrived in the wrong color, Magni 3+ had a defective gain switch. I tried the 3+ with the HD800S on low gain and that simply wasn't powerful enough and with that switch I couldn't try high gain. I also ordered a Vali that would be shipped the next day according to the website but 2 days later it still wasn't shipped. Add to that the experience with the Modi and Magni and I cancelled and returned the whole stack and ordered me a Lyr instead. Fingers crossed.


----------



## bcaulf17

Would it be worth upgrading from the Magni 3? Also hard to tell which of these guys is better. Most people seem to prefer the Heresy, but a review on headphones.com preferred the Magni 3+. I like a full bodied sound, which it seems like both provide, but with whichever one has the most detail and the cleaner treble.

My headphones are HD6XX, DT 177X Go and B&O H6 Gen 2.


----------



## tdockweiler

bcaulf17 said:


> Would it be worth upgrading from the Magni 3? Also hard to tell which of these guys is better. Most people seem to prefer the Heresy, but a review on headphones.com preferred the Magni 3+. I like a full bodied sound, which it seems like both provide, but with whichever one has the most detail and the cleaner treble.
> 
> My headphones are HD6XX, DT 177X Go and B&O H6 Gen 2.



I've read a lot of posts where people who owned the Magni 3 felt the 3+ was an upgrade. I personally have not tried the Magni 3, but owned the Magni 1. 
I believe one review said there was a increase in soundstage size. For me, I felt an increase in soundstage width when upgrading from my old amp.

The Magni 3+ won't give your headphones a full bodied sound unless they already have that (with a decent amp).
I imagine it would be good for the HD6XX and not alter it's normal sound. I use the HD-650 with my Magni 3+ and really like it.
I would never describe the Magni 3+ as even a remotely warm sounding amp. If there is a hint of warmth in there somewhere I'd probably have to use a DT-880 or similar to hear it!

With this amp I don't know if I could trust reviews. It would almost have me feeling like i'm listening to someone describing the sound of their recordings rather than the amp


----------



## Mikem53

GimmeCans said:


> Haven't been able to find any info on what improvements Schiit claims for the 'Plus' version.
> Also, with the Heresy, Schiit is competing against themselves for the same market space. Seems like that is going to confuse people.
> As I write this, Amazon has the *Magni* 3 (not the new 'Plus') on sale for $74 for Black Friday weekend.



I picked up a Magni 3 off amazon for that price, then I got the modi multibit, then I listened, then I bought same stack for my son for Christmas..
I think it’s a great sounding lil amp.. smooth and fairly detailed..  enjoying this combo for my desk setup..


----------



## Dionysus

Picked up a Magni 3+ Modi dac stack and it arrived today. First impressions is that it’s bit warm relative to what I’ve owned. I’ll let it burn for a few day before I form an opinion. I’ve had an Hd800s now for more than 6 months that was gifted to me and my Dap was not driving it well. So I decided to grab this stack based on price and some pretty good reviews.


----------



## Goldvein

I have a doubt about the 3+ and heresy.
I'm about to buy one of them to be able to listen to my turntable with my headphones.
My normal amplifier is the Chord Mojo, and i can't bypass the DAC si i can't listen to my vinyls normally. 
My headphones are the Focal Clear. Will they do well together? I think i'll go with the 3+
Also, what cable do i need if i want to connect my Mojo with the Magni? Only output from the Mojo is normal 3.5mm Jack and the magni only seem to have RCA cable input. It seems like a rookie question, but i don't know how it works.


----------



## Dionysus

You could go chord mojo in line out mode


----------



## Goldvein

Dionysus said:


> You could go chord mojo in line out mode


Will it make a difference would it be the same to just use my Mojo?


----------



## tafens

Goldvein said:


> I have a doubt about the 3+ and heresy.
> I'm about to buy one of them to be able to listen to my turntable with my headphones.
> My normal amplifier is the Chord Mojo, and i can't bypass the DAC si i can't listen to my vinyls normally.
> My headphones are the Focal Clear. Will they do well together? I think i'll go with the 3+
> Also, what cable do i need if i want to connect my Mojo with the Magni? Only output from the Mojo is normal 3.5mm Jack and the magni only seem to have RCA cable input. It seems like a rookie question, but i don't know how it works.



You could try something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-3-5mm-2-Male-Adapter-Stereo/dp/B01D5H8KO2

If you try this, please let us know how the Magni3+ fares against the amp of the Mojo!


----------



## igorpadrao

Can I use the Topping P50 linear power suply with these new Magnis?


----------



## thornygravy (Mar 19, 2020)

igorpadrao said:


> Can I use the Topping P50 linear power suply with these new Magnis?



The topping psu puts out DC and these take AC, so no.

Side note, I was getting some hiss at low volume on high gain.. I took out my multi-meter and noticed the top plate wasn't grounded from paint isolating the metals. This is my first schiit product but I did some searching and it looks like this is pretty common with schiit. 

I sanded down the paint down where 4 screws meet and it got rid of the hiss, I've talked to some other people with magni 3+'s & heresy's that say they don't have this problem.. but I still wanted to mention it in case someone does, worth a shot.


----------



## no00wa (Apr 5, 2020)

tdockweiler said:


> I've read a lot of posts where people who owned the Magni 3 felt the 3+ was an upgrade. I personally have not tried the Magni 3, but owned the Magni 1.
> I believe one review said there was a increase in soundstage size. For me, I felt an increase in soundstage width when upgrading from my old amp.
> 
> The Magni 3+ won't give your headphones a full bodied sound unless they already have that (with a decent amp).
> ...



Are you referring to the Amazon posts, or where exactly are people saying that it's an upgrade over the normal 3?

I'm in the exact same boat and if the Heresy/3+ do provide an upgrade I want to order one, especially if that is in the gaming department (soundstage?) as that's what do mostly. I'm on the AKG 712 pro's for now if that matters by the way.


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

Hey all -
I've gone down the Schiit rabbit hole and have the Vali 2, Magni 3, & Magni 3+.... and several SYS, 2 LOKI, and a WYRD for an easy USB switch. Many of these are B-stock as I love the deals.
Impressions:
The Vali 2 is a lot of fun! And I'm enjoying all the tube rolling to change it's sound profile.
The Magni 3 is a great and very capable amp.
The Magni 3+ is amazing!! 

Impressions:
My first purchase was the Magni 3 a while a back. Love it. I got it at a B-stock price that was awesome. Sounds very good. Definitely a keeper.

Second purchase was the Vali 2. Another great amp with lots of power and I'm impressed with how much a single tube can make a difference. I like how different tubes can affect the bass and vocals.

Third purchase was Magni 3+ that I received yesterday. Initial impression: Wow, wow, wow, and more wow. Clearer than the Magni 3 and a bit louder. Noticeable less distortion at higher volumes. Not really noticeable under about about the 2 o'clock position. But I definitely need to more testing.
I compared with Sennheiser 6XX. But have several more headphones to try out.

Results? I'm keeping all of them.
Winner? Well depends. Vali 2 & 3+ are a tie just because they fill different roles.
Want a simple & super clear amp? 3+ is where it's at.
Vali 2 if you want to go tube (duh) and spend lots of time (and have fun) tube rolling with the ability to change sound profiles with different tubes.
Have a Magni 3? Keep enjoying it! Especially for the clearance price I have it on. 

I will continue to use my Vali 2 for gaming, TV setup, and miscellaneous fun listening.
I will use the 3+ for the ultimate in clinical (not saying sterile) listening as I'm a classical musician.
I will use the 3 in my practice studio as a workhorse for playing along with music and practice tools.


----------



## VerseTheBandit

Has anyone been able to try the DT 990 Pros (25o Ohm) with the Heresy or 3+? Interested in grabbing one but not sure which will fit best!


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

Well.. for what it's worth I have DT990 Pro 80 ohm with the Magni 3+.... And they sound amazing! And more amazing with my Sennheiser 6XX... Can't go wrong.


----------



## tdockweiler

VerseTheBandit said:


> Has anyone been able to try the DT 990 Pros (25o Ohm) with the Heresy or 3+? Interested in grabbing one but not sure which will fit best!



I'm using the DT-990 Pro 250 ohm and it's perfect with the 3+.
I actually heard some improvements on that headphone when upgrading from my older and more expensive amp.
The soundstage also seemed a bit wider for whatever reason. Not sure what causes this.

Even if I just had ONLY the DT-990 i'd have felt the Magni 3+ was a purchase just for that headphone alone.

Haven't tried the Heresy yet, but perfectly happy with the 3+


----------



## genck

tdockweiler said:


> I'm using the DT-990 Pro 250 ohm and it's perfect with the 3+.
> I actually heard some improvements on that headphone when upgrading from my older and more expensive amp.
> The soundstage also seemed a bit wider for whatever reason. Not sure what causes this.
> 
> ...


What DAC are you feeding the Magni 3+ with? If it has 2V out, what is your volume knob at for typical listening volume with those headphones?


----------



## tdockweiler

genck said:


> What DAC are you feeding the Magni 3+ with? If it has 2V out, what is your volume knob at for typical listening volume with those headphones?



Sorry for the late reply.
I'm using the Headroom Micro DAC which is AC powered and uses the CS4398 chipset.
My normal volume with the DT-990 Pro 250 is about 55% (high gain).
I don't really listen at loud levels.
I could probably crank it to 100% without it blowing my ears up though.

This is of course with all desktop volume settings at 100%.

I don't think I've had to increase it much higher with anything else I own. Maybe the AKG K400 at the highest volume setting if I recall.

Tempted to try the Modi 3 someday, but probably would be more of a side-grade. Had the Modi 1 previously and didn't have any issues with it.
Never saw any measurements for it though.


----------



## tmb821

I’ve got a heresy on the way. I’ll be feeding it with a fiio k3 that gets signal from my laptop. I use either akg k240s or shp 9500. I know neither of these are particularly hard to drive. My k3 can power the phones ok, but it leaves me wanting more. I have used the nx3s that I have in the past, but it’s a pain when using the laptop. It’s great when using my es100 for portable use. I’m hoping this setup will be ok.


----------



## jdowne04

How does the Heresy compare with the O2?


----------



## GearMe (Apr 19, 2020)

It's waaaayyyyyyy cooler looking!  

Seriously though...both have clean power.  The Heresy just has ~3-4x more of it.











Specs below...

*Magni Heresy*

Frequency Response: 20Hz-20Khz, +/-0.04dB

Maximum Power, 16 ohms: 2.8W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 32 ohms: 2.4W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 50 ohms: 1.6W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 300 ohms: 410mW RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 600 ohms: 215mW RMS per channel

THD+N: 
High Gain: Less than 0.0014% (-97dB) at 1V RMS into 32 ohms
Low Gain: Less than 0.0002% (-113dB) at 1V RMS into 32 ohms

IMD: 
High Gain: Less than 0.002% (-95dB) at 1V RMS into 32 ohms, CCIF
Low Gain: Less than 0.0006% (-105dB) at 1V RMS into 32 ohms, CCIF

SNR: 
High Gain: Greater than 104dB, A weighted, referenced to 1V RMS
Low Gain: Greater than 115dB, A weighted, referenced to 1V RMS


*Drop Objective 2*

SPECS

Input: RCA 
Output: 6.35 mm 
Power: Battery (not included) or AC adapter (included, select 110V or 220V)
Gain: 2.5x and 6.5x / 1.0x and 3.3x (select your configuration)
Volume potentiometer taper: Alps 15A or 3B
Frequency response: +/-0.1 dB (20 Hz–20 kHz)
THD at 1 kHz, 150 ohms: 0.0016%
IMD CCIF at 15 ohms: 0.001%
IMD SMPTE: 0.002%
Noise (ref 400 mV): -105 dB
Max output (33 ohms): 613 mW
Max output (150 ohms): 355 mW
Max output (600 ohms): 88 mW
Output impedance: 0.54 ohms
Crosstalk (15 ohms): -65 dB
Channel balance (50% volume): 0.6 dB




Crosstalk: Less than -70dB, 20 Hz-20 kHz in either gain

Output Impedance: Less than 0.25 ohms at either gain
Input Impedance: 25k ohms


----------



## snoopyfb

jdowne04 said:


> How does the Heresy compare with the O2?



In human words,,,
I think heresy sounds slightly better for me. It also measures better.


----------



## fjblair

tdockweiler said:


> I think there was a pretty good chance that I wouldn't like the Asgard 3 and didn't want to risk it. Someday if I go to a meet i'd like to try it.
> I did try the Asgard 2 and didn't like it. I had some weird technical issues with mine that I wasn't able to fix. The unit wasn't broken, but all my other equipment worked fine.
> Possibly some weird interference/compatibility issues with my setup. No idea how this is even possible!
> 
> ...




I would love to see that happen. A man can dream.


----------



## tmb821

Just got my heresy! Been playing around with different inputs. Right now I’ve got my es100 feeding it. I had the k3 on it earlier plugged into the laptop. Where should I be setting the volume on the k3? I’ve been using the line out on the k3 and it is Adjustable. Does it really matter? Just turn it all the way up and go? Should it be setting the k3 on low gain or high gain? Am I over thinking it? Just do what ever sounds best to me?


----------



## jasonb (Apr 27, 2020)

So I have an old Magni 2 Uber. It still works fine and sounds fine, but would the 3+ or Heresy be a noticeable upgrade? It would be used primarily with a Focal Elear with the Focal Utopia pads on it. The 2 Uber does just fine on with this headphone on low gain with the volume dial around the 9 o'clock position, but am just wondering if I'm missing anything by sticking with this old amp.

My Magni 2 Uber is being fed by an old JDS Labs ODAC which I don't plan on replacing, at least not yet.

I ordered a Heresy, but I'm still interested in knowing if anyone has heard both or could compare both. I guess the Magni 2 is 5 years old now, and I'd imagine the much newer Heresy should be better.


----------



## RickB

I've been using my new Magni 3+ for almost a month. Safe to say it's a little brighter and less warm than the Magni 3. The Magni 3 to me was like a SS version of the Vali 2, the 3+ is not like that. The 3+ is more detailed and has more of an "audiophile" tuning than the Magni 3.

I did notice the volume pot is much better than the one on the 3, so far. 

All IMO, of course.


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

RickB said:


> I've been using my new Magni 3+ for almost a month. Safe to say it's a little brighter and less warm than the Magni 3. The Magni 3 to me was like a SS version of the Vali 2, the 3+ is not like that. The 3+ is more detailed and has more of an "audiophile" tuning than the Magni 3.
> 
> I did notice the volume pot is much better than the one on the 3, so far.
> 
> All IMO, of course.


That’s a good description!


----------



## tmb821

I’m confused to why I would use the rca out for my powered speakers? I normally just use the line out from my Fiio k3. Am I gaining anything from using the rca out from my heresy that is connected to the k3?


----------



## Eddie C

tmb821 said:


> I’m confused to why I would use the rca out for my powered speakers? I normally just use the line out from my Fiio k3. Am I gaining anything from using the rca out from my heresy that is connected to the k3?



It would function as preamp, strengthening the analog signal to help reduce noise and distortion


----------



## jasonb

So nobody has upgraded from the Magni 2 or Magni 2 Uber to the Heresy?


----------



## bcaulf17

RickB said:


> I've been using my new Magni 3+ for almost a month. Safe to say it's a little brighter and less warm than the Magni 3. The Magni 3 to me was like a SS version of the Vali 2, the 3+ is not like that. The 3+ is more detailed and has more of an "audiophile" tuning than the Magni 3.
> 
> I did notice the volume pot is much better than the one on the 3, so far.
> 
> All IMO, of course.


This is interesting. I’m looking into getting a 3+ or Heresy and it seems like the Heresy is the better performer by a hair, and maybe not as bright. Although I could just keep my Magni 3.

Is there any reason to get a Heresy if I already have a Magni 3?


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

bcaulf17 said:


> This is interesting. I’m looking into getting a 3+ or Heresy and it seems like the Heresy is the better performer by a hair, and maybe not as bright. Although I could just keep my Magni 3.
> 
> Is there any reason to get a Heresy if I already have a Magni 3?


Hmmm depends if you want to spend money 
I have the 3 and 3+ 
I'm definitely keeping both but I like the 3+ better. The 3 is still a great amp it's in one of my setups.
I know that doesn't answer the Heresy question but figured I'd you know my thoughts.


----------



## RickB

bcaulf17 said:


> This is interesting. I’m looking into getting a 3+ or Heresy and it seems like the Heresy is the better performer by a hair, and maybe not as bright. Although I could just keep my Magni 3.
> 
> Is there any reason to get a Heresy if I already have a Magni 3?



TBH, I got the 3+ just to have the latest version of the amp. The Magni 3 is perfectly adequate if you don't suffer from upgradeitis.


----------



## TS0711

I'll add to the confusion a bit, having both the Heresy and Vali 2, as well as the Modi 2U and Modi 3.  After mixing and matching using a SYS as a switching device... I found the most pleasing to be the Heresy with the Modi 2U.  I used that on my night table along with the Etr for bit before grabbing an Asgard 2 on closeout.  I found the Heresy/Modi2u to be just as warm as the Vali 2/Modi3 with the speed and attack you would expect from solid state.  For whatever reasons I felt the Hersey paired better with the older Modi 2U than the newer Modi 3, there was a bite (on the Modi 3)  I didn't like that the tubed Vali 2 seams to correct.


----------



## jasonb

Just got my Heresy which has an old JDS Labs ODAC feeding it. It seems to sound very good with my Focal Elear with Utopia pads on it. Its early, but it seems to be at least a few % better than the old Magni 2U I've been using. I especially like how the gain stages are on the Heresy better than the old M2U. High gain at about the 8-9 o'clock area seems to be the right spot for me with my Elear. High gain on the M2U sounded better than low gain on the M2U, but with the Elear the volume control was a bit touchy and sometimes there would be channel imbalance. Low gain on the Heresy seems like it would actually be low enough for an IEM. 

Will report more later when I can listen some more.


----------



## jasonb (May 7, 2020)

So my Elear with Utopia pads sounds great with the Magni Heresy. Everything about it seems to be kicked up a notch compared to the old Magni 2 Uber I was using.

One of the best differences is that this combination sounds great at any volume. With the Magni 2 Uber the Elear sounded better at louder volumes, and I kept finding myself listening louder than I usually do. I've heard people say that there is a sweet spot on the volume dial to make the Elear sound it's best, and that still may be, but with the Heresy they sound great and dynamic at lower volumes than with the Magni 2 Uber.

I could go on and on about this Heresy and Elear combo, but to summarize, this amp sounds better than the Magni 2 Uber in every way. Bigger soundstage, better detail, better dynamics, but another noticeable improvement is better sub-bass. I keep hitting pause to make sure I'm hearing something in the music, and not a helicopter flying over or something of that sort that's rumbling. I didn't really think the sub-bass was lacking before, but now it definitely isn't.

One last thing I'll mention is the better volume control and a better high vs low gain. The Magni 2 Uber sounded better to me on high gain, but that left me with very little movement on the volume dial and would run into channel imbalance. The Heresy has a lower output on low gain in comparison(probably best for IEM's), so I've been using high gain but somehow there is a lot better control of the volume output here and no channel imbalance.

So a definitely worthy upgrade for only $125 shipped.


----------



## tmb821

Does anybody know if there is a different power supply I can use for my heresy? The one it comes with is so big and ungainly. I transport it between my house and my semi truck, I’m hoping I can find a smaller power supply to make it easier to transport. Tia.


----------



## igorpadrao

tmb821 said:


> Does anybody know if there is a different power supply I can use for my heresy? The one it comes with is so big and ungainly. I transport it between my house and my semi truck, I’m hoping I can find a smaller power supply to make it easier to transport. Tia.


I don't think so. At least at a reasonable price since Schiit chose to use an AC adapter (and not a normal DC power supply).


----------



## tmb821

igorpadrao said:


> I don't think so. At least at a reasonable price since Schiit chose to use an AC adapter (and not a normal DC power supply).


Darn... thanks anyway


----------



## bcaulf17

This might be a dumb thing to ask in a thread for $100 amps (albeit great ones) but I’m kind of stuck in a situation and not sure which direction to take.

I was originally gonna just get a Magni 3+ or Heresy with a Modi but I figured the more logical upgrade from the Magni 3 would be the THX 789, especially now since it’s $300, so I ordered it. But I started getting cold and wondering if it was really worth the extra coin. So I’m considering returning it and getting these instead.

The most demanding headphones I plan on using are the HD6XX and Sundara, which should be no problem for the Magnis, and the Magnis are actually more powerful in SE than the THX.  

Thing is, I don’t know if I would be able to tell the difference between amps. And I don’t want to sit around and strain myself to hear them, that’s just too stressful. The 789 is probably the last amp I’d ever need, but I don’t know if it’s really necessary if the Heresy is just as good. But then, I may be left wondering if I’m missing anything from the 789. Also, I would need to wait until I score a Grace SDAC Balanced.

Some people say there’s no difference and it would be a waste of money unless I need the extra features (which I don’t, although I do love the aesthetic of the THX), some say there’s small differences. Others say there’s huge difference.

I know “listen for yourself” and yadda yadda but does anyone have any advice? All I really want is clean power to drive my headphones. Only recently I learned that some people perceive large differences between two amps that measure nearly identical.


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

I just looked at the THX and I guess the question is if you want balanced or not.


----------



## bcaulf17 (May 15, 2020)

oakparkmusicguy said:


> I just looked at the THX and I guess the question is if you want balanced or not.


Yeah. That is it’s biggest feature. Some say the amp is overkill if you’re just using SE. But who knows if I need balanced in the future? I probably won’t. I don’t think there are many headphones where it’s necessary.

Honestly, I do love the design of the THX. Probably the biggest draw to me. I doubt I would be able to tell differences in sound. I feel people make out the differences to be bigger than they are. Maybe if the headphones are highly demanding but idk.


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

About 6 months ago I thought about getting balanced gear. I read and researched a bit. And in the end I decided it wasn't worth it since I'd have to change over a lot of gear and the sonic / power returns weren't there for me. My Schiit gear sounds great through all my headphones and any further percent gains would not provide any more happiness / enjoyment. I think of a TV I was going to buy that was, let's say, 20% better than my current TV. It was not providing anywhere near 20% more happiness


----------



## bcaulf17

oakparkmusicguy said:


> About 6 months ago I thought about getting balanced gear. I read and researched a bit. And in the end I decided it wasn't worth it since I'd have to change over a lot of gear and the sonic / power returns weren't there for me. My Schiit gear sounds great through all my headphones and any further percent gains would not provide any more happiness / enjoyment. I think of a TV I was going to buy that was, let's say, 20% better than my current TV. It was not providing anywhere near 20% more happiness


Good point thank you. Even if the THX were better it’s so negligible to the point where the extra cost probably won’t matter. After all, it’s about the headphones in the end


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

I agree! Schiit just has such a great bang-to-buck ratio and sounds great. Looks good too. Save some money and enjoy. Headphones make so much more difference.


----------



## RickB

oakparkmusicguy said:


> About 6 months ago I thought about getting balanced gear. I read and researched a bit. And in the end I decided it wasn't worth it since I'd have to change over a lot of gear and the sonic / power returns weren't there for me. My Schiit gear sounds great through all my headphones and any further percent gains would not provide any more happiness / enjoyment. I think of a TV I was going to buy that was, let's say, 20% better than my current TV. It was not providing anywhere near 20% more happiness



The problem with upgrading to new gear is that whatever sound quality level you achieve becomes the new normal and then becomes "meh". Why not just be happy with what you got, if it has an acceptable level of quality. Why keep chasing the dragon?


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

RickB said:


> The problem with upgrading to new gear is that whatever sound quality level you achieve becomes the new normal and then becomes "meh". Why not just be happy with what you got, if it has an acceptable level of quality. Why keep chasing the dragon?



Excellent points! I agree... Well maybe doing a bit better than 'acceptable'... but soon after it's just not worth the tiny gains...


----------



## RickB

oakparkmusicguy said:


> Excellent points! I agree... Well maybe doing a bit better than 'acceptable'... but soon after it's just not worth the tiny gains...



By acceptable, I mean what sounds good to you.


----------



## bcaulf17

oakparkmusicguy said:


> Excellent points! I agree... Well maybe doing a bit better than 'acceptable'... but soon after it's just not worth the tiny gains...


Tiny gains you may or may not even hear!


----------



## GearMe

bcaulf17 said:


> This might be a dumb thing to ask in a thread for $100 amps (albeit great ones) but I’m kind of stuck in a situation and not sure which direction to take.
> 
> I was originally gonna just get a Magni 3+ or Heresy with a Modi but I figured the more logical upgrade from the Magni 3 would be the THX 789, especially now since it’s $300, so I ordered it. But I started getting cold and wondering if it was really worth the extra coin. So I’m considering returning it and getting these instead.
> 
> ...



Just my .02...I'd be looking for $300 of additional music, a complimentary set of cans, or possibly some combination thereof! 
(maybe the Meze 99 Noirs and $100 of new tunes!)


----------



## bcaulf17

GearMe said:


> Just my .02...I'd be looking for $300 of additional music, a complimentary set of cans, or possibly some combination thereof!
> (maybe the Meze 99 Noirs and $100 of new tunes!)


The next and last headphone I’m looking at buying to complete my collection is the Hifiman Sundara, and it’s the one that’s made me consider upgrading my amp setup.


----------



## GearMe

Sounds like a plan...
That leaves $300 for more music! 

FWIW...my HiFiMans sound fine through the Magni 3; so expect you'd be good with one of the newer versions


----------



## tmb821

My hifiman 4xx sound fantastic with my heresy. As do my k240s and my shp9500s...


----------



## tafens

bcaulf17 said:


> This might be a dumb thing to ask in a thread for $100 amps (albeit great ones) but I’m kind of stuck in a situation and not sure which direction to take.
> 
> I was originally gonna just get a Magni 3+ or Heresy with a Modi but I figured the more logical upgrade from the Magni 3 would be the THX 789, especially now since it’s $300, so I ordered it. But I started getting cold and wondering if it was really worth the extra coin. So I’m considering returning it and getting these instead.
> 
> ...



If you have both amps, I’d say give it a try and compare them for yourself. Regardless of what anyone says about the one vs the other, the only way to know if you hear a difference, and more importantly, if the difference matters to you, is you.
Even if you don’t hear any differences, that’s great too because then you know you can make the decision between them purely on features and price - and knowing you’ll never have to look back and wonder if that other one could have sounded better.
What other people think can be good indicators of course, especially if many say similar things, but in the end they have their ears and you have yours.

I have compared some amps and headphones for myself a couple of times (mostly Schiit vs Schiit amps/dacs or Senn vs Senn headphones, but also tubes) and managed to hear differences between them. Sometimes subtle, sometimes obvious. The point being, I didn’t think I would be able to hear differences before I tried, either.

In my experience, rapidly switching back and forth gets you nowhere. Instead it has worked a lot better for me to just let the music flow for a bit and switch to the other, and then back at both longer and shorter intervals. A quick switchover is preferable of course. At one time or another something feels different. Keep doing this and brain starts to quantify the differences and the feeling starts to sum up to a description, perhaps “flatter”, “more dynamic”, or “punchier”, or whatever it may be. It doesn’t really matter if the description is correct “audio lingo” either as long as you know what it means to you.

That’s my $0.02 anyway, I hope it can be helpful


----------



## bcaulf17

tafens said:


> If you have both amps, I’d say give it a try and compare them for yourself. Regardless of what anyone says about the one vs the other, the only way to know if you hear a difference, and more importantly, if the difference matters to you, is you.
> Even if you don’t hear any differences, that’s great too because then you know you can make the decision between them purely on features and price - and knowing you’ll never have to look back and wonder if that other one could have sounded better.
> What other people think can be good indicators of course, especially if many say similar things, but in the end they have their ears and you have yours.
> 
> ...


That is helpful, thank you. I gave it some more thought and I’m deciding to keep the THX 789. Yeah it cost a little more but in that cost I have peace of mind knowing I have the best option in my budget and it has everything I could need from an amp, so I wouldn’t have to worry anymore and be happy for years to come. I also got it at the cheapest price it’s ever been.


----------



## oakparkmusicguy

Good for you! There isn't a wrong choice here. Enjoy!


----------



## TS0711

I thought a balanced rig was one of those thing I could live without, until I heard my HD6xxs with a balanced cable plugged into Neil Young's famous fail, the Pono player.  Fast forward to today and I rocking a Schiit Jotunhien with balanced HD6xx's.  It's sourced from a PC into an Etir and then at 24/96 into a very old Mark Levinson MB dac.  Life never sounded so good.

So my advise would be to buy the best you can reasonably afford (in the used market), with the most current feature set for that price point.  Even if it takes years to get a balanced dac/amp combo having the feature in one piece (even unused) isn't a bad thing and could help with resale.


----------



## Koren

helllo.  currently there is nowhere to order schiit heresy amplifier?  Europe?


----------



## Koren

where can i order a schiit heresy device from europe now?


----------



## h.rav

I just got a Magni 3+, I really like the amp, except the small volume pot.
Sound-wise, the amp is never fatiguing, neutral, black background.


----------



## McLambo

Koren said:


> where can i order a schiit heresy device from europe now?



I'm afraid there are not many options right now. Schiit-europe has no stock. Schiit UK cannot ship to many countries in EU. You could try Schiit USA and take a gamble on importing and tax costs


----------



## Richsvt

I have a Heresy coming soon. Haven't had a Magni since 3. Really looking forward to its sound. Love the color scheme. Wish my Lyr 2 and Bimby was in that color...going to use primarily with the Dekoni Blue and HD6XX. Really thinking of getting a Loki again, that was a fun piece of gear.


----------



## Poimandres

h.rav said:


> I just got a Magni 3+, I really like the amp, except the small volume pot.
> Sound-wise, the amp is never fatiguing, neutral, black background.


I don’t think that there is a stack out there that can compete with the magni 3+/modi 3 objectively or subjectively for the cost.  I kept the schiit stick and returned the smsl sp200/m200 stack.


----------



## Charente

McLambo said:


> I'm afraid there are not many options right now. Schiit-europe has no stock. Schiit UK cannot ship to many countries in EU. You could try Schiit USA and take a gamble on importing and tax costs



I imported from the USA ... no import duty into France but freight was a bit steep and then the freight company charged me €25 euros on top for handling


----------



## Richsvt

Just got the Heresy and setting it up to tune out:
M2X will act as transport for the moment


----------



## jasonb

Richsvt said:


> Just got the Heresy and setting it up to tune out:
> M2X will act as transport for the moment



Enjoy. I enjoy my Heresy a lot. I'm enjoying it with a Focal Elear with Utopia pads right now.


----------



## genck

RickB said:


> The problem with upgrading to new gear is that whatever sound quality level you achieve becomes the new normal and then becomes "meh". Why not just be happy with what you got, if it has an acceptable level of quality. Why keep chasing the dragon?


Did you forget what forum you're on?


----------



## Maximiliano Campo

Hey guys, wondering if anyone can help me, I'm using this amp connected to my Astell and Kern SP1000M, is it better to max out the amp volume and control the music volume from my DAP, or is it better to max out the DAP and control the music volume from amp?

How do you control the source VS amp volume for optimal listening quality?

Or is it a case of it doesn't matter?


----------



## RickB

Maximiliano Campo said:


> Hey guys, wondering if anyone can help me, I'm using this amp connected to my Astell and Kern SP1000M, is it better to max out the amp volume and control the music volume from my DAP, or is it better to max out the DAP and control the music volume from amp?
> 
> How do you control the source VS amp volume for optimal listening quality?
> 
> Or is it a case of it doesn't matter?



It would be better to max out the DAP volume and control the volume from the amp, UNLESS you experience clipping doing that. If you experience clipping, reduce the volume on the DAP just enough so it is no longer a problem.


----------



## Maximiliano Campo

Thanks a lot. 



RickB said:


> It would be better to max out the DAP volume and control the volume from the amp, UNLESS you experience clipping doing that. If you experience clipping, reduce the volume on the DAP just enough so it is no longer a problem.


----------



## pappy97 (Aug 13, 2020)

I'm fuming and hope my head fi ers can help.

Ordered Heresy off ebay and got it today. It doesn't work.

It came with this power supply.
https://imgur.com/gallery/211ZSAT

Does this work for the Heresy? The light comes on but, no sound. I fear this supply doesn't work, it's obviously the wrong supply, but I also really fear that it will damage the Heresy. Any thoughts? The manual says the protection relay mutes the output for 15-20 seconds, and then will engage with a click. I never get a click!

If it is wrong, can someone point me to one on Amazon that works so I can get it quickly and enjoy my Heresy? Thanks!  (ebay seller says just return it, but I've been waiting weeks for this because idiot seller sent to wrong address so it had to go all the way back to him and re shipped to me. And now here I am and it's incredibly disappointing and frustrating!)


----------



## Asahi Templar (Aug 13, 2020)

That is not the correct adapter, I would recommend just returning it as I don't think that it outputting the correct voltage and the seller is liable if they did not inform you that the original adapter was included.

Edit: originally thought it was outputting ac current because my brain misfired which would have been real bad but looks like it is undervolting it which probably won't damage it but I would not take the chance personally.


----------



## pappy97

Asahi Templar said:


> That is not the correct adapter, I would recommend just returning it as I don't think that it outputting the correct voltage and the seller is liable if they did not inform you that the original adapter was included.
> 
> Edit: originally thought it was outputting ac current because my brain misfired which would have been real bad but looks like it is undervolting it which probably won't damage it but I would not take the chance personally.



Thank you, that is what I'm doing.  The post didn't say original adaptor, but the adaptor included did not match the one from the photo.  It's just really angers me because I've been looking for a Heresy on ebay, finally see one, save a few bucks, and then: (1) the seller sends it to the wrong address so it goes all the way from FL to TX, and then back to FL, and then he sent it to correct address and (2) this adaptor debacle. Ughhhh.  I think I'm going to just order Heresy from Schiit tonight. Screw ebay. 

Thanks!!


----------



## prozonelayer

pappy97 said:


> Thank you, that is what I'm doing.  The post didn't say original adaptor, but the adaptor included did not match the one from the photo.  It's just really angers me because I've been looking for a Heresy on ebay, finally see one, save a few bucks, and then: (1) the seller sends it to the wrong address so it goes all the way from FL to TX, and then back to FL, and then he sent it to correct address and (2) this adaptor debacle. Ughhhh.  I think I'm going to just order Heresy from Schiit tonight. Screw ebay.
> 
> Thanks!!


Not sure how good a deal you got on eBay, but Schiit has a few Heresy B-Stock available if you're looking to save a few bucks.


----------



## RickB

pappy97 said:


> I'm fuming and hope my head fi ers can help.
> 
> Ordered Heresy off ebay and got it today. It doesn't work.
> 
> ...



This is what you need: Power Supply: “Wall wart” style 24VA 14VAC

https://www.schiit.com/products/magni-1

Schiit does sell the adapter separately.


----------



## pappy97

I went ahead and ordered it from Schiit directly. 

Just FYI, the ebay seller is still reselling it and I thought I'd warn people here. Here's the link
https://www.ebay.com/itm/353169847835


----------



## adydula

Currawong said:


> Here's my take on them:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My first impression for all the op amps was for increased current capability....and then I read this at the Schiit webiste:

OPA1688 for output—eight (8) OPA1688 stages per channel, for low output impedance and very high current capability

Tada!!
Alex
:>)


----------



## diddus (Nov 4, 2020)

Hi,
I wonder if someone could help me with this.

I got a brand new Schiit Magni 3+ today. It sound nice, but the volume knob annoys me. It hast some play (kind of a dead zone you can turn easily before the actual pot is turned). It's not the knob itself, but the pot which is kinda wiggly. Problem is, that I'm technically not the original owner (don't have warranty). I bought it from another guy who ordered a few because they are really hard to source here in the EU at the moment.

So is that a common problem with the Magni? Any advice how to fix it?


----------



## hifi nub

mine been sitting for almost about 8 months. with the headphone amp or whatever it's been so long that I forgotten the names of my two devices that puts power to my headphones which I forgot as well. I so need to get back into PC gaming I'm getting old. been PC gaming since 1993 or 92, just uninterested and I need to get back into it I haven't listened to it in a long time.


----------



## hifi nub

am I missing an orange cord? what is that orange cord in my profile pic?


----------



## Charente

diddus said:


> Hi,
> I wonder if someone could help me with this.
> 
> I got a brand new Schiit Magni 3+ today. It sound nice, but the volume knob annoys me. It hast some play (kind of a dead zone you can turn easily before the actual pot is turned). It's not the knob itself, but the pot which is kinda wiggly. Problem is, that I'm technically not the original owner (don't have warranty). I bought it from another guy who ordered a few because they are really hard to source here in the EU at the moment.
> ...



Had mine for some months and no 'dead-zone' when turning. It's very secure and moves smoothly. Can't help with how to fix your problem DIY ... above my pay-grade


----------



## ssmith3046 (Nov 20, 2020)

I sold my Asgard 2 to buy an Asgard 3 without checking to see if the A3 was in stock.  The day my A2 sold the A3 was back ordered.   I had owned a Magni 3+ but sold it to try a Rupert Neve amp to use the balanced outputs on the Modius.  The Neve was good but I sold it and had been using the A2 but read the A3 was better.  Anyway I decided to buy another Magni 3+ while waiting on more A3 stock. I really liked the first 3+ I owned.  I have to say after burning in the 3+, yes I'm one of those,  my new Focal Clears sound great with the 3+.  I'll still probably get an A3 but im in no hurry now. It's just weird to look at that little amp sitting on top of my Modius.


----------



## ahmonge

ssmith3046 said:


> It's just weird to look at that little amp sitting on top of my Modius.



It would be great if you share a picture of them with us.


----------



## ssmith3046

ahmonge said:


> It would be great if you share a picture of them with us.


I'll do that later.  I've been looking at the A2 for so long I had forgotten how small the Magni is.  Big sound from such a little amp!


----------



## ssmith3046

ahmonge said:


> It would be great if you share a picture of them with us.


----------



## ssmith3046 (Nov 21, 2020)

A small amp but it really performs!


----------



## ahmonge

They look beautiful!


----------



## BobSmith8901

ssmith3046 said:


> A small amp but it really performs!



Nice set-up!

Speaking Schiitilly...My older-tech Magni2 Uber was gathering dust recently and having experienced some lack of enthusiasm coming from my 6XX-s and 4-XX's with my various portable amps and Daps, I hooked both of those cans up to the Magni and it breathed new life into my musical experience. I'd forgotten (had to find my Schiit paperwork) that the M2U pumps out a gargantuan 1.5W into 32 Ohms and it's more than enough for either of those cans. I'd love to have the 3+ or the Heresy for their better specs and improved sound but I think my M2U will suffice for now. Hats off to the folks at Schiit!


----------



## ssmith3046

BobSmith8901 said:


> Nice set-up!
> 
> Speaking Schiitilly...My older-tech Magni2 Uber was gathering dust recently and having experienced some lack of enthusiasm coming from my 6XX-s and 4-XX's with my various portable amps and Daps, I hooked both of those cans up to the Magni and it breathed new life into my musical experience. I'd forgotten (had to find my Schiit paperwork) that the M2U pumps out a gargantuan 1.5W into 32 Ohms and it's more than enough for either of those cans. I'd love to have the 3+ or the Heresy for their better specs and improved sound but I think my M2U will suffice for now. Hats off to the folks at Schiit!


If it sounds good to you then that's what matters.  I've owned the Schiit Modi multibit, Modi 3, Bifrost multibit, Bifrost 4490, and Asgard 2.
I'm a big Schiithead.  The Modius is really a great DAC and I have no plans on getting rid of it for now. The Asgard 3 is supposed to be back in stock in December so I'm waiting for those to show back up. Long live Schiit!


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## ssmith3046

ahmonge said:


> They look beautiful!


Thank you. And what's really amazing is what $300 will buy you. A lot of bang for the buck from the Schiit boys!


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## adydula (Nov 21, 2020)

Magni 3 is an underrated amp IMO. I have an original Magni 3 and its really a nice little workhorse...for $99 jolly gee its a steal...I have many Schiit amps here...and recently had the Lyr 1,  Lyr 3, , Asgard 1, Asgard 3, Magnius, Vahalla 2 and Jotenheim....all great in their own space.

I ordered a B stock Hersey and it will be here next wed! Looking forward to comparing it to the old OG Magni 3.

Your absolutely correct it is amazing on what $200 - $300 will buy you ......lots of great choices out there and Schitt is right in the mix!!

Alex


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## ahmonge

Awesome stack!


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## adydula

The Asgard 3 and some others are missing.....but they are here hiding!!

lol

Alex


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## ssmith3046

adydula said:


> Magni 3 is an underrated amp IMO. I have an original Magni 3 and its really a nice little workhorse...for $99 jolly gee its a steal...I have many Schiit amps here...and recently had the Lyr 1,  Lyr 3, , Asgard 1, Asgard 3, Magnius, Vahalla 2 and Jotenheim....all great in their own space.
> 
> I ordered a B stock Hersey and it will be here next wed! Looking forward to comparing it to the old OG Magni 3.
> 
> ...


That stack is the SCHIITS!  I'd like to know how you like the Hersey when you try it out.


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## adydula

Will do late next week!
Alex


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## ssmith3046

adydula said:


> Magni 3 is an underrated amp IMO. I have an original Magni 3 and its really a nice little workhorse...for $99 jolly gee its a steal...I have many Schiit amps here...and recently had the Lyr 1,  Lyr 3, , Asgard 1, Asgard 3, Magnius, Vahalla 2 and Jotenheim....all great in their own space.
> 
> I ordered a B stock Hersey and it will be here next wed! Looking forward to comparing it to the old OG Magni 3.
> 
> ...


How do you like your Magnius?  Do you go balanced with it?


----------



## adydula

I had the Magnius here for a week and returned it. Only because I have so many amps and wanted to try the amp out. It wasnt any better for me here with my stuff. But it wasnt any worse also. A great amp if your getting into this hobby.

i have 5 Schiit amps here right now.

I buy and test stuff just to see how good it is etc..

I used both SE and Balanced from a Bifrost 2. So I could listen to both and decide for myself which was better etc.

IMO there is NO real world discernable difference in either except for the power output in each mode as describe in the spec section at the Schiit site.

Some folks have stated the SE is not as good spec-wise that the balanced, while that is true, can YOU really tell the difference when listening to music...for me it was NO.

A $199 box with SE and Balanced and a real Balanced Alps Pot is a real winner all around. 

I have all those Schiit amps noted above and all of them do very, very well for me...its just different, slightly different flavors of sound...etc

Alex


----------



## ssmith3046

adydula said:


> I had the Magnius here for a week and returned it. Only because I have so many amps and wanted to try the amp out. It wasnt any better for me here with my stuff. But it wasnt any worse also. A great amp if your getting into this hobby.
> 
> i have 5 Schiit amps here right now.
> 
> ...


I had a Rupert Neve RNHP, bought it because I wanted to try the balanced route. On that particular amp there wasn't much difference between the SE and balanced except volume levels.  The Neve is a nice quality amp but I have since parted ways with it.


----------



## adydula

Thats pretty much it with the old SE vs Balanced discussions...for the most part its really a "dont care".....tbh.

It adds to cable and adapter cost.

Some folks start out with SE and wonder about the mystical balanced connection and their more costly cable and adapters...If u start out with SE and get an amp with balanced then you have to purchase, build etc to get the another cable. Then only to realize there really isnt any difference at all.

Such a fun hobby!

Alex


----------



## bifcake

I don't have either one, but a lot of the reviewers say that they don't really hear a difference and if there is, it's not substantial.  I would guess you can't go wrong with either one and in the end, it's 6 of one and half a dozen of the other.

BTW, here's a question, how much power does each of them put out into a 300ohm headphone?


----------



## adydula

Maximum Power, 300 ohms: 410mW RMS per channel


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## adydula (Nov 23, 2020)

The Heresy is here!

Plugged into and being fed by a Schiit Bifrost 2.

B-stock...looks brand new here...everything works just fine.

Using it to drive a pair of Meze Emperyeans.

What an excellent $99 high performance amp.

Crystal clear, stunning sound....no noise, distortion, more than enough power to drive most anything. It was this B-stock for $89 vs B-stock Magni3 + for $69. I am glad I got this smart little black/red box version. A year ago I built a DIY amp using the OPA 1688's and its interesting to see what Schiit has done with them in the Heresy.


Maximum Power, 16 ohms: 2.8W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 32 ohms: 2.4W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 50 ohms: 1.6W RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 300 ohms: 410mW RMS per channel
Maximum Power, 600 ohms: 215mW RMS per channel

LIstening to some of the Schiit videos I thing Jason mentioned this Magni has more power than the OG Magni 3 which I have here also. I think he said it might even top out closer to 3 watts!

Imagine this!  Thank the high-quality op-amps used: OPA1662 for gain, OPA1688 for output—eight (8) OPA1688 stages per channel, for low output impedance and very high current capability.

High current is what many planars really like...So i am sitting here with a $89 amp driving a $3K pair of TOTL headphones, with no issues at all..

How does it sound? It doesnt...its neutral, flat what u put into it comes out amplified!

Isnt that what an amp is supposed to do??

HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!

Alex


----------



## bifcake

Congratulations!  Enjoy your purchase!


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## ssmith3046 (Nov 23, 2020)

adydula said:


> The Heresy is here!
> 
> Plugged into and being fed by a Schiit Bifrost 2.
> 
> ...


Great!  Is there a discernable difference between the Magni 3+ and your new amp?


----------



## adydula

What a value for this price!!

Simply astonishing....


----------



## ssmith3046

Sounds like a fantastic bargain!


----------



## ssmith3046

adydula said:


> What a value for this price!!
> 
> Simply astonishing....


If you had to choose between the Magni 3+ and Hersey.........?


----------



## adydula

Either one would perform equally as well.

The reason I picked the Hersey over the 3+ is I already have a discrete Magni 3 and want to try the op amp version. Many do not pay attention to the actual chips or op amps used in and amplifier. I do.

The TI OPA1688's are in the SoundWise series of op amps designed especially to be used in headphones amplifiers.

OPA168x SoundPlus 36-V, Single-Supply, 10-MHz, Rail-to-Rail Output Operational Amplifiers datasheet

I Used these op amps in a DIY project several months ago and they are EXCELLENT op amps. World Class performance.  These devices also offer wide bandwidth, fast slew rate, and high output current, Schiit took these op amps and utilized them in a neat manner.

Thank the high-quality op-amps used: OPA1662 for gain, OPA1688 for output—eight (8) OPA1688 stages per channel, for low output impedance and very high current capability. With these advanced parts (the OPA1688 even uses feedforward in its topology), we’re getting 6-8dB lower THD+N than Magni 3+, which is already 10-15dB lower THD+N than Magni 3.  

I have a set of planars that like current and the Heresey does the job here quite well.

IMO this op amp, amp is not sterile like the THX series of amps have been reported to be like.

Alex


----------



## ssmith3046

adydula said:


> Either one would perform equally as well.
> 
> The reason I picked the Hersey over the 3+ is I already have a discrete Magni 3 and want to try the op amp version. Many do not pay attention to the actual chips or op amps used in and amplifier. I do.
> 
> ...


----------



## Garney

I received my Heresy yesterday and man is it an impressive little amp. I'm coming from a all-in-one, budget DAC/AMP (FX Audio DAC-X6) and the power output of the Heresy is simply mind blowing. It can drive my HE-400i cans to near ear shattering levels on hi-gain at around 1-2 o'clock with no distortion. I don't dare go any higher for fear of hearing loss! I'm finding that lo-gain at around 3 o'clock is about perfect for my ears. For $100, this amp is a heck of a deal. I don't think that I'll ever need to upgrade. And it looks super sharp stacked on a black Modi 3. I think an Interpose cross connect or Snake Oil Mini-Link is in my future to complete the stack and tidy it up.


----------



## FastAndClean

Garney said:


> I received my Heresy yesterday and man is it an impressive little amp. I'm coming from a all-in-one, budget DAC/AMP (FX Audio DAC-X6) and the power output of the Heresy is simply mind blowing. It can drive my HE-400i cans to near ear shattering levels on hi-gain at around 1-2 o'clock with no distortion. I don't dare go any higher for fear of hearing loss! I'm finding that lo-gain at around 3 o'clock is about perfect for my ears. For $100, this amp is a heck of a deal. I don't think that I'll ever need to upgrade. And it looks super sharp stacked on a black Modi 3. I think an Interpose cross connect or Snake Oil Mini-Link is in my future to complete the stack and tidy it up.


it drives planars nicely , i use it with he400i 2020


----------



## ssmith3046

Heresy owners seem to love this little amp!


----------



## jasonb

On high gain I can never exceed the 10 o'clock area with the Heresy and my Elear with Clear pads. Usually I'm at the 8 to 9 o'clock area. It really is a great sounding amp though. Sounds much better than the old Magni 2 Uber I was using prior to this.


----------



## FastAndClean

i had magni 2 before and on high volume it had some king of glare in the upper mids, Heresy stays composed on high volume, overall without able to compare them side to side it is improvement for sure


----------



## GMcDougal

For FPS gaming only....Hersey or Magni3+?
Headphones are DT990 250ohm.


----------



## 529128

Having previously owned the Chord Mojo I acquired the Heresy to provide my Sundaras with more power. I am stacking the Heresy with Modi 3+ and this combo is a great listen and definitely more enjoyable than the Mojo at least to my ears. I had a very brief tenure with A3, which I loved with the HD650. But imho I prefer the Sundara/Heresy to the A3/HD650. Wider, deeper, more articulate, tight low end, sparkling top end and a very balanced middle spectrum. 
highly recommended!


----------



## hollandstein

I’ve had the Heresy for a minute now, and frankly
I keep going to the Vali 2 instead about 90% of the time using 6XX and TR-X00 Purplehearts.

I guess I just like the “tubey” sound better.


----------



## hollandstein

That said, the Heresy is a really great amp. Super clear and neutral. Awesome for its purpose.


----------



## tmb821

I love my heresy. But I recently acquired a xDuoo xd05 plus. And now... using the dac from the xd05, I’m having a hard time finding a preference between the two. The only real difference is I swapped the opamp in the xd05 to a ne5532p, my favorite, and I think I prefer the sound out of the xd05. I’m driving some he-4xx.


----------



## ngower

Howdy friends, hope this is the right place to ask: I've never owned Schitt gear before, but they seem to hav a decent enough reputation. I'm eyeing the Modi/Magni Heresey combo to use with either HD6XX or Sundara's (settling on a pair, leaning towards HD6XX). My primary uses would be (a) music from USB-C port on Macbook Pro for lossy streaming services (apple music, spotify, etc), (b) from  PS5 for gaming and (c) from Apple TV for movies/TV at night. With B/C it seems like I might have to go through the TV's toslink to get things to work, and with A I'm concerned about having a mess of adapters/wires to get things to work. I'm wondering, before I make my purchase, if there's a more graceful DAC/Amp pairing for getting these three sources to work well enough together? I have a hi-fi setup that's in storage temporarily while I rent a room (there's no space for it) so I'm looking for sort of middle/high end of entry level.

I'm also wondering if it might be better to just go with an Audeze Penrose for the gaming/media side of things and narrow headphone setup to just music?

Thanks in advance for any input you can provide.


----------



## wideload

I use the Sundara with Modi/Magni 3+ and I love it. I added a 6xx for a different flavor, and because I want a Valhalla 2 to scratch my tube itch.


----------



## 529128

ngower said:


> Howdy friends, hope this is the right place to ask: I've never owned Schitt gear before, but they seem to hav a decent enough reputation. I'm eyeing the Modi/Magni Heresey combo to use with either HD6XX or Sundara's (settling on a pair, leaning towards HD6XX). My primary uses would be (a) music from USB-C port on Macbook Pro for lossy streaming services (apple music, spotify, etc), (b) from  PS5 for gaming and (c) from Apple TV for movies/TV at night. With B/C it seems like I might have to go through the TV's toslink to get things to work, and with A I'm concerned about having a mess of adapters/wires to get things to work. I'm wondering, before I make my purchase, if there's a more graceful DAC/Amp pairing for getting these three sources to work well enough together? I have a hi-fi setup that's in storage temporarily while I rent a room (there's no space for it) so I'm looking for sort of middle/high end of entry level.
> 
> I'm also wondering if it might be better to just go with an Audeze Penrose for the gaming/media side of things and narrow headphone setup to just music?
> 
> Thanks in advance for any input you can provide.


I can definitely vouch for Sundara with Heresy and Modi. Excellent pairing. I used to have the HD650 powered from the Asgard 3 and I much prefer my current setup.


----------



## duncan4791

ngower said:


> My primary uses would be (a) music from USB-C port on Macbook Pro for lossy streaming services (apple music, spotify, etc), (b) from  PS5 for gaming and (c) from Apple TV for movies/TV at night. With B/C it seems like I might have to go through the TV's toslink to get things to work, and with A I'm concerned about having a mess of adapters/wires to get things to work.



Your right the PS5 and Apple TV will have to be routed through your TV's toslink port. You can get a single USB-c to USB-micro cable and a cheap toslink from Amazon. The separates path will cost $400-550 while the Penrose is $300. The Playstation Penrose will allow voice chat through the Playstation and using the USB 2.4g doggle through the Mac. If you can wait till the end of January I'd go with the Penrose and hold off on audiophile stacks and hi-fis.


----------



## hottyson (Jan 7, 2021)

ngower said:


> Howdy friends, hope this is the right place to ask: I've never owned Schitt gear before, but they seem to hav a decent enough reputation. I'm eyeing the Modi/Magni Heresey combo to use with either HD6XX or Sundara's (settling on a pair, leaning towards HD6XX). My primary uses would be (a) music from USB-C port on Macbook Pro for lossy streaming services (apple music, spotify, etc), (b) from  PS5 for gaming and (c) from Apple TV for movies/TV at night. With B/C it seems like I might have to go through the TV's toslink to get things to work, and with A I'm concerned about having a mess of adapters/wires to get things to work. I'm wondering, before I make my purchase, if there's a more graceful DAC/Amp pairing for getting these three sources to work well enough together? I have a hi-fi setup that's in storage temporarily while I rent a room (there's no space for it) so I'm looking for sort of middle/high end of entry level.
> 
> I'm also wondering if it might be better to just go with an Audeze Penrose for the gaming/media side of things and narrow headphone setup to just music?
> 
> Thanks in advance for any input you can provide.


*Sorry, I cannot provide any input on the Audeze Penrose as I am not familiar with it's sound. Nor, am I familiar with Sundara as they are out of my price range. However, I have listened to the Sennheiser HD6XX on the Schiit Magni Heresy/ Schiit Modi 3+ stack. My order of sound quality preference with cheap amps changes drastically depending on the headphone. When paired with the HD6XX this is my preferred order:*

*1st = Schiit Magni 3 (not plus) but it is only capable at low volumes with the HD6XX
2nd = Topping L30 
3rd = Schiit Magni Heresy
4th = JDS Labs Atom
5th and 6th tie = Monolith Liquid Spark 
5th and 6th tie = S.M.S.L. SP2000*

*This order of sound quality is almost the exact opposite when listening to Beyerdynamic DT-990. So, don't take this list as gospel when listening to Sundara or other headphones. Each of these amps sound great in one aspect or the other and a bargain for what they provide. However, do note that my Topping L30 is a cheap made in China amplifier that already died after only one month of use. So, perhaps you might consider going straight to the Schiit Magni Heresy to get made in USA quality and a local company that you can deal with for warranty service.*


----------



## bithloman

+1 for heresy amp , absolutely amazing and a audible upgrade to the liquid spark. at least with hard to drive planars aeon 2 and m1070, i wonder if its from design or just the extra power @hottyson


----------



## hottyson (Jan 20, 2021)

*Okay, so I got curious and bought the HiFiMan Sundara. I am still listening to them and have not come to my final conclusion. But, here are my initial rating placement of amplifiers when paired with the HiFiMan Sundara:



*
*1st = Schiit Magni 3 (not plus) - I like this one best, but it does not have prominent bass that many might like.
2nd = S.M.S.L. SP2000 - Most might like this better as it has good bass and bass slam. The sound stage is very wide and enveloping.
3rd = Schiit Magni Heresy
4th and 5th tie = JDS Labs Atom
4th and 5th tie = Monolith Liquid Spark*
*The Topping L30 was made of cheap Chinesium and died, killing my headphones in the process. So, I no longer rate this piece of garbage Topping L30 amplifier. Stay far away from Topping!*


----------



## hottyson

*Oh, and I **recommend** that all stay away from the Schiit Magni Heresy B-stock. It is almost the same price as new, $89 vs $99. I have already had problems with my Magni Heresy B-stock going into protection twice within the first month and I am having to ship it back to them for repair. The first time it went into protection, the Magni Heresy burnt out a headphone driver on a OneOdio headphone that I returned to Amazon. It was a horrible headphone anyway so I was happy to return it to Amazon. The second time the Magni Heresy went into protection was my Fostex T50RP MK3 that was buzzing and was in protection mode. However, I quickly pulled out the headphone cable and it appears to be fine. I will end up paying more money shipping the Heresy back and dealing with all the **hassle when** I could have paid ten more dollars from the start for a new trouble free unit. Such a headache for a just a cheap amplifier. Next time I will just buy Schiit new or maybe I will just stay away from $100 amplifiers in general. Lesson learned.*


----------



## Garney

hottyson said:


> *Oh, and I **recommend** that all stay away from the Schiit Magni Heresy B-stock. It is almost the same price as new, $89 vs $99. I have already had problems with my Magni Heresy B-stock going into protection twice within the first month and I am having to ship it back to them for repair. The first time it went into protection, the Magni Heresy burnt out a headphone driver on a OneOdio headphone that I returned to Amazon. It was a horrible headphone anyway so I was happy to return it to Amazon. The second time the Magni Heresy went into protection was my Fostex T50RP MK3 that was buzzing and was in protection mode. However, I quickly pulled out the headphone cable and it appears to be fine. I will end up paying more money shipping the Heresy back and dealing with all the **hassle when** I could have paid ten more dollars from the start for a new trouble free unit. Such a headache for a just a cheap amplifier. Next time I will just buy Schiit new or maybe I will just stay away from $100 amplifiers in general. Lesson learned.*


I was under the impression that B-stock Schiit items meet all of the performance standards that their new products meet, but may have cosmetic blemishes and that's why they're B-stock. FWIW, my new Heresy has the scratchy volume pot issue. Only noticeable when using sensitive IEMs, but it's there.


----------



## hottyson (Jul 29, 2021)

Garney said:


> I was under the impression that B-stock Schiit items meet all of the performance standards that their new products meet, but may have cosmetic blemishes and that's why they're B-stock. FWIW, my new Heresy has the scratchy volume pot issue. Only noticeable when using sensitive IEMs, but it's there.


I don't mind scratch pots because they are only an issue when adjusting the volume. However, the B-stock cannot be exchanged for an upgraded model and that is what I really want to do because I think I am done with $100 amps as they have been not worth my time and now the added hassle. I am very disappointed with my Magni Heresy purchase and regret buying it. I would like to trade up the Magni Heresy to the Asgard 3 amp but Schiit does not allow upgrade trade in on B-stock. So, Schiit said no Asgard 3 trade up for me. If I had not purchased B-stock I would have been allowed to trade up and been a happy camper. Ultimately, I did not save any money buying B-stock and have serious buyers remorse. In fact, I don't think it is even worth my time to pack this amplifier up to send back to Schiit now. Perhaps I may just mark Schiit off as a mistake and forget about it on the back shelf.
*.*
*Update: Schiit HAS paid for my shipping the amplifier back to them and a refund IS on it’s way back to me. I take back all that I said about their customer service.*


----------



## ssmith3046

hottyson said:


> *I don't mind scratch pots because they are only an issue when adjusting the volume. However, the B-stock cannot be exchanged for an upgraded model and that is what I really want to do because I think I am done with $100 amps as they have been not worth my time and now the added hassle. I am very disappointed with my Magni Heresy purchase and regret buying it. I would like to trade up the Magni Heresy to the Asgard 3 amp but Schiit does not allow upgrade trade in on B-stock. So, Schiit said no Asgard 3 trade up for me. If I had not purchased B-stock I would have been allowed to trade up and been a happy camper. Ultimately, I did not save any money buying B-stock and have serious buyers remorse. In fact, I don't think it is even worth my time to pack this amplifier up to send back to Schiit now. Perhaps I may just mark Schiit off as a mistake and forget about it on the back shelf.*


Sorry to read about your troubles. I took delivery on an Asgard 3 after owning an Asgard 2 and Magni 3+.  Both of those are great amps but the Asgard 3 is an outstanding amp and bargain at $200.


----------



## hottyson

bithloman said:


> +1 for heresy amp , absolutely amazing and a audible upgrade to the liquid spark. at least with hard to drive planars aeon 2 and m1070, i wonder if its from design or just the extra power @hottyson


*On my headphones -

The Liquid Spark beats the Magni Heresy with these headphones:*

*Grado SR325e*
*Grado SR225e*
*Grado SR225*
*AKG K712*
*Philips X2HR*
*Philips SHL3300*
*Beyerdynamic DT-990PRO (250-ohm)*
*Beyerdynamic DT-880 (2003)*
*Cooler Master MH-752*
*Beyerdynamic DT-770PRO (80-ohm)*
*Grado SR80*
*Grado SR80e*
*Koss PortaPro*
*Koss KSC75*
*Sennheiser PX-100*
*Shure SCL4*
*Shure E2C*
*Panasonic RP-HTX7*
*Marantz MPH-2 pads upgraded*
*Sony MDR-EX15LP*
*The Magni Heresy beats the Liquid Spark with these headphones:*

*Sennheiser HD-650*
*Fostex T50RP MK3*
*Hifiman Sundara*


----------



## bithloman

hottyson said:


> *On my headphones -
> 
> The Liquid Spark beats the Magni Heresy with these headphones:*
> 
> ...


yes it does seem to be mostly noticeable on planars. or high impedance cans. i think its mostly the 1 watt of higher power and better measurements


----------



## hottyson

bithloman said:


> yes it does seem to be mostly noticeable on planars. or high impedance cans. i think its mostly the 1 watt of higher power and better measurements


*Very likely. Also, the Liquid Spark has a colored dark sound that does not bode well when paired with planars.
Beyerdynamics that have excessive highs when paired with cheap amps pair so much better with Liquid Spark over the Magni Heresy. The Liquid Spark not only adds a darkness to the sound but also provides textures to violins and french horns that no other $100 amp can replicate through these Beyerdynamic headphones.*


----------



## kingk6673 (Feb 5, 2021)

hottyson said:


> *Very likely. Also, the Liquid Spark has a colored dark sound that does not bode well when paired with planars.
> Beyerdynamics that have excessive highs when paired with cheap amps pair so much better with Liquid Spark over the Magni Heresy. The Liquid Spark not only adds a darkness to the sound but also provides textures to violins and french horns that no other $100 amp can replicate through these Beyerdynamic headphones.*


Have not been on the thread in a while and just had a chance to pick up the heresy and the Magni 3+ to try both.  Have to say that the heresy is much tighter with better sound stage, details, and instrument separation compared to the Magni 3+.  The Magni 3+ is warmer, and have owned the Magni 3 and used it in past, and the 3+ is warmer but does not seem as detailed as the Heresy.  For background, I am set up off of a Chord Qutest Dac, streaming tidal masters, through anti cables USB and RCAs to the Heresy, and then through Moon Audio Silver Dragon V3 unbalanced into Hifiman Arya.  To say that it may be heresy to hook the Schiit Heresy at the end of the chain and expect it to perform on the same level is a reasonable assumption. To say I am surprised about the detail and clarity and synergy and how the Heresy performs WAAY above its price point with this setup is an understatement!  Selling my 2-year-old much more expensive headphone amp that was supposedly a great one because there is no comparison with the heresy.  To sum it up, I think it is the pairing and the chain that makes a difference.  Qutest provides a torrential amount of data for its price point, the heresy is very detailed and can present the information better without getting muddled and drives the Aryas beautifully.  Just wanted to pass on to others that the Heresy can do justice and fit in well with the Qutest and Arya


----------



## bithloman

kingk6673 said:


> Have not been on the thread in a while and just had a chance to pick up the heresy and the Magni 3+ to try both.  Have to say that the heresy is much tighter with better sound stage, details, and instrument separation compared to the Magni 3+.  The Magni 3+ is warmer, and have owned the Magni 3 and used it in past, and the 3+ is warmer but does not seem as detailed as the Heresy.  For background, I am set up off of a Chord Qutest Dac, streaming tidal masters, through anti cables USB and RCAs to the Heresy, and then through Moon Audio Silver Dragon V3 unbalanced into Hifiman Arya.  To say that it may be heresy to hook the Schiit Heresy at the end of the chain and expect it to perform on the same level is a reasonable assumption. To say I am surprised about the detail and clarity and synergy and how the Heresy performs WAAY above its price point with this setup is an understatement!  Selling my 2-year-old much more expensive headphone amp that was supposedly a great one because there is no comparison with the heresy.  To sum it up, I think it is the pairing and the chain that makes a difference.  Qutest provides a torrential amount of data for its price point, the heresy is very detailed and can present the information better without getting muddled and drives the Aryas beautifully.  Just wanted to pass on to others that the Heresy can do justice and fit in well with the Qutest and Arya


Nice I was wondering how it's scaled beyond my m1070 planars. Have you tried the modi 3+ dac? How does it compare to more expensive dacs


----------



## Telin

hottyson said:


> *Okay, so I got curious and bought the HiFiMan Sundara. I am still listening to them and have not come to my final conclusion. But, here are my initial rating placement of amplifiers when paired with the HiFiMan Sundara:
> *
> *1st = Schiit Magni 3 (not plus) - I like this one best, but it does not have prominent bass that many might like.
> 2nd = S.M.S.L. SP2000 - Most might like this better as it has good bass and bass slam. The sound stage is very wide and enveloping.
> ...


Looks like you have the exact same blue aluminium volume knob on your SMSL SP200 as I have.
Good to see I'm not the only one that picked blue.


----------



## kingk6673 (Feb 5, 2021)

bithloman said:


> Nice I was wondering how it's scaled beyond my m1070 planars. Have you tried the modi 3+ dac? How does it compare to more expensive DACs


I have not tried the modi 3+ dac so I cannot say.  I am not sure if this helps, but the Chord Qutest DAC is the same as the Chord Hugo without the headphone amplifier component.  I have used iFi Nano, Micro, Black label, and Audioquest dragonfly Cobalt and Red, and I think that the limitation in the output for the Heresy could be the DAC depending on how resolving it is.  From all the reviews the Qutest pulls out a lot of data and is detailed which makes it a great partner for the Heresy with the Arya headphone pairing.  It says a lot of the Heresy that it can manage the data with aplomb and sound fantastic with the Aryas.  I actually have not heard these headphones sound nearly as good with multiple other headphone amplifiers: iFi Black Label headphone out, iFi Ican plus, Magni 3, Magni 3+ and iFi Ican Pro.  To sum it up, the Heresy is able to handle a lot of data / input from a very resolving DAC really well and the output is superb with my setup so should do well with the Modi 3+ and be able to get the most out of the DAC.

Somewhat of a spoiler alert: I was reading a more recent review about Hifiman Arya and it can be positively affected per the reviewer by tweaks (cables, etc..) I think the cables that I have make a difference with the sound chain and what is heard.


----------



## bithloman

kingk6673 said:


> I have not tried the modi 3+ dac so I cannot say.  I am not sure if this helps, but the Chord Qutest DAC is the same as the Chord Hugo without the headphone amplifier component.  I have used iFi Nano, Micro, Black label, and Audioquest dragonfly Cobalt and Red, and I think that the limitation in the output for the Heresy could be the DAC depending on how resolving it is.  From all the reviews the Qutest pulls out a lot of data and is detailed which makes it a great partner for the Heresy with the Arya headphone pairing.  It says a lot of the Heresy that it can manage the data with aplomb and sound fantastic with the Aryas.  I actually have not heard these headphones sound nearly as good with multiple other headphone amplifiers: iFi Black Label headphone out, iFi Ican plus, Magni 3, Magni 3+ and iFi Ican Pro.  To sum it up, the Heresy is able to handle a lot of data / input from a very resolving DAC really well and the output is superb with my setup so should do well with the Modi 3+ and be able to get the most out of the DAC.
> 
> Somewhat of a spoiler alert: I was reading a more recent review about Hifiman Arya and it can be positively affected per the reviewer by tweaks (cables, etc..) I think the cables that I have make a difference with the sound chain and what is heard.


people kept telling me that the heresy was not an upgrade to the liquid spark, but when i got it i was blown away at least with planars. it just added so much to the music. and then i got the modi 3+ and it added that extra crisp air that i was missing with my more entry level fiio DAC. really a great combo. i have the modius for my speaker amp and that is very impressive for 200$ schiit is my current favorite audio company for people on a budget.


----------



## Telin

Imagine what Schiit could sell when they finally get their supply chain to europe running properly. 

Me and most likely many orders looked a Schiit stack to buy. Realized it's about impossible to obtain outside America. Calculated the shipping costs, import taxes and customs fees to order/import it from America and decided it's not worth that much extra money and buy a SMSL stack instead.


----------



## bithloman

Telin said:


> Imagine what Schiit could sell when they finally get their supply chain to europe running properly.
> 
> Me and most likely many orders looked a Schiit stack to buy. Realized it's about impossible to obtain outside America. Calculated the shipping costs, import taxes and customs fees to order/import it from America and decided it's not worth that much extra money and buy a SMSL stack instead.


It is a small company and it is sad that your continent has sold its economic soul to China. There is no reason why the import taxes are so high from America but not from China. It's basically the same distance. I will never buy another Chinese audio product again. They're the most digital sounding boring equipment I've heard. Not to mention basically non-existent customer service and after warranty support. I'm sure there are plenty of Good products made in Europe there is no need to support China other than certain disposable items or if someone is in poverty and has no choice


----------



## Telin (Feb 6, 2021)

bithloman said:


> There is no reason why the import taxes are so high from America but not from China.


It's easy actually. Companies like SMSL (and others) have distribution chains and actual stock inside europe. So once someone decides to buy a SMSL unit the unit will be shipped from within the European Union, which means lower or free shipping costs and no additional import taxes or customs fees.
For those reasons Schiit Europe is created. But unlike their competitors Schiit never got it properly off the ground for years now. Schiit is a small company but if they would have invested in getting a proper foot hold in Europe they would have been much bigger now.

Yes products from SMSL, Topping and the like are sounding "digital" because the units are designed and manufactured with only one thing in mind; the race for the best measuring unit. The actual sound comes after that. It's sad but that is what the audiophile market demands these days and so they to their best to deliver on that part.


----------



## bithloman

Telin said:


> It's easy actually. Companies like SMSL (and others) have distribution chains and actual stock inside europe. So once someone decides to buy a SMSL unit the unit will be shipped from within the European Union, which means lower or free shipping costs and no additional import taxes or customs fees.
> For those reasons Schiit Europe is created. But unlike their competitors Schiit never got it properly off the ground for years now. Schiit is a small company but if they would have invested in getting a proper foot hold in Europe they would have been much bigger now.
> 
> Yes products from SMSL, Topping and the like are sounding "digital" because the units are designed and manufactured with only one goal in mind; measure as good as possible. The actual sound comes after that. It's sad but that is what the audiophile market demands these days and so they to their best to deliver on that part.


They do deliver a good value. I have heard most of their products. Schiit from my knowledge has gotten better about restocking their EU store. But that is just a few stories. I don't think it's a fair comparison considering topping SMSL and aune are basically a giant corporation. At least their distributors are. Funny then the new line of schiit products like the magnious then I used for my balanced speaker amp. Measure better than the Chinese competitors. Maybe not the top of the line but noticeably better than something like the D10S which would be insane 2 years ago.


----------



## ahmonge

Also Schiit has one hole in its offering: DAC+Headphone amps in one unit with full digital inputs at an entry level price (200-400€). In my case, this is the reason why I didn’t consider it when purchasing audio equipment.


----------



## Okrelayer

i have the Magni 2, would you guys say the Magni 3+ is less bright sounding? My Grados can get a little fatiguing out of the Magni 2


----------



## bithloman

Okrelayer said:


> i have the Magni 2, would you guys say the Magni 3+ is less bright sounding? My Grados can get a little fatiguing out of the Magni 2


probably however it is very neutral despite being a discrete design. so if you believe amps can "color" the sound go for it. you have a better chance of that with the asgard 3 however i would suggest lyr 3 for grados.


----------



## FLN Luco (Feb 19, 2021)

Hello. I bought a brand new *Schiit Stack* _(Modi 3+, Magni 3+ and Vali 2+)_ and I just received it, but, so far, I noticed some small “problems”:

*1)* I noticed that there were some *small “scratches”* in all of them and always in the same place (screw hole). I contacted Schiit and they answered that: _“Those are common marks. Since they are the result of the anodizing process they will all have that mark”_.







*2)* I noticed on it when I went to adjust the *volume knob* it did not feel smooth when turning it, it felt scratchy when turning it. After some minutes, I realized that the knob was pressed against the chassis of the amp, so I took the knob off and then place the knob back with a little space between the knob and the chassis.

*My question is: Is this really normal with Schiit equipment or I've got bad ones?*
_*as you may have noticed by my English (hahaha), I am not from the USA, so unfortunately it would be too expensive for me to send them back to replace them._

Thanks.


----------



## hottyson

FLN Luco said:


> Hello. I bought a brand new *Schiit Stack* _(Modi 3+, Magni 3+ and Vali 2+)_ and I just received it, but, so far, I noticed some small “problems”:
> 
> *1)* I noticed that there were some *small “scratches”* in all of them and always in the same place (screw hole). I contacted Schiit and they answered that: _“Those are common marks. Since they are the result of the anodizing process they will all have that mark”_.
> 
> ...


1) I checked my Schiit Modis and Schiit Magnis and only ONE out of the FIVE of them have that dent marks in the screw holes. I never noticed them until you pointed it out. Not really noticeable unless you are looking for it.
2) The volume knobs on mine came like that as well where they rub against the chassis. So, like you I just pulled a little and it went away. Pot scratchiness is not rub, but the sound that is produced electronically that causes a scratchy sound through your headphone drivers. That sound is always there when you move the pots in these cheap amps. However, it should not bother you once you have the volume set to where you want it.


----------



## RhisorHier

I have a question for fellow Magni Heresy orders. I'm not able to get anything outputting the RCA outputs. I have my Topping E30 >RCA> Magni Heresy input. Magni Heresy outpout> RCA > Powered Monitors. I have tried other things like another amp, but I get nothing. This Heresy has been sent back before to Schiit for repairs due to blowing out a couple of months ago. I never used the RCA's before since I didn't have powered monitors. Is there something I am missing for getting it to work? Thanks.


----------



## Garney

RhisorHier said:


> I have a question for fellow Magni Heresy orders. I'm not able to get anything outputting the RCA outputs. I have my Topping E30 >RCA> Magni Heresy input. Magni Heresy outpout> RCA > Powered Monitors. I have tried other things like another amp, but I get nothing. This Heresy has been sent back before to Schiit for repairs due to blowing out a couple of months ago. I never used the RCA's before since I didn't have powered monitors. Is there something I am missing for getting it to work? Thanks.


You don't have headphones plugged into the 1/4" jack when trying to play sound out of the powered monitors, right?


----------



## CB7FB8KgYh24E (Mar 5, 2021)

New to the scene - I have two amps I want to A/B test by playing music, and simply manually switching the headphones plugs in between them.

Could I just go source->Modi DAC->Magni (input), then connect Magni Output to the input of the other amp I want to test, while just having the Magni power switch turned off? Would that work, kind of like pass-thru?
Can I accomplish this with no extra equipment, or do I need a switcher? Because fiddling with switching RCA cables from the DAC between the two amps is annoying.

Also, the manual of my other amp that arrived (Liquid Spark) mentions to never unplug headphones or cables when the amp is turned on as it could cause damage to things.

Is this true, or are they just covering their butts?

Is it safe to plug and unplug RCA cables and headphones from/to powered on amps? Or do you really want to power them off and on and waiting on muting relay, even for switching headphone plugs? That would make quick A/B testing impossible since by the time you've done all that, the sound signature faded from memory!


----------



## hottyson

CB7FB8KgYh24E said:


> New to the scene - I have two amps I want to A/B test by playing music, and simply manually switching the headphones plugs in between them.
> 
> Could I just go source->Modi DAC->Magni (input), then connect Magni Output to the input of the other amp I want to test, while just having the Magni power switch turned off? Would that work, kind of like pass-thru?
> Can I accomplish this with no extra equipment, or do I need a switcher?


You need a splitter. Modi output RCA split to both input RCA on each Magni amp.
Here is one on Amazon but it costs too much. https://amzn.to/3bmTX4J Find one like it, but cheap.


----------



## hottyson

hottyson said:


> You need a splitter. Modi output RCA split to both input RCA on each Magni amp.
> Here is one on Amazon but it costs too much. https://amzn.to/3bmTX4J Find one like it, but cheap.


Here is my cheap recipe to split to many:

I use stereo 3.5mm to RCA cables plugged into these 3.5mm star shaped splitters.
star shaped splitter: https://amzn.to/3uW96l7
pack of 10 x stereo 3.5mm to RCA cables: https://amzn.to/3rnfFuE


----------



## CB7FB8KgYh24E (Mar 5, 2021)

hottyson said:


> Here is my cheap recipe to split to many:
> 
> I use stereo 3.5mm to RCA cables plugged into these 3.5mm star shaped splitters.
> star shaped splitter: https://amzn.to/3uW96l7
> pack of 10 x stereo 3.5mm to RCA cables: https://amzn.to/3rnfFuE


Oh jeez, that's way too many pieces, expenses, and work, for my needs! I'll simply continue to switch the headphone & RCA cables between the Magni and LS and keep comparing that way, trying to remember details in between.

Out of curiosity, what's the technical reason what I described/hoped for, wouldn't work?
p.s the LS has two sets of RCAs - one called I (the letter, I assume. Input?), one called P (maybe pre-amp)? idk if that changes anything here
Magni just has an In RCA set, and an Out RCA set. Not sure what this I and P are about


----------



## bithloman

CB7FB8KgYh24E said:


> Oh jeez, that's way too many pieces, expenses, and work, for my needs! I'll simply continue to switch the headphone RCA cables between the Magni and LS and keep comparing that way, trying to remember details in between.
> 
> Out of curiosity, what's the technical reason what I described/hoped for, wouldn't work?
> p.s the LS has two sets of RCAs - one called I (the letter, I assume), one called P (maybe pre-amp)? idk if that changes anything here
> Magni just has an In RCA set, and an Out RCA set. Not sure what this I and P are about


it depends on how the amps are made. the rca output or pre amp could just be a passthrough or it could go through part or all of the amp first which would color the sound and make it useless to compare. which is why you usually want to split before the amp not after. the liquid spark is not going to be hugely different from the heresy or 3+ i upgraded and i could tell but i have anandas which are quite resolving. you could also notice if you have something that is hard to drive like hd600 or something . i do think its an upgrade no doubt and twice the power better measurements. made in US


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## CB7FB8KgYh24E (Mar 5, 2021)

bithloman said:


> it depends on how the amps are made. the rca output or pre amp could just be a passthrough or it could go through part or all of the amp first which would color the sound and make it useless to compare. which is why you usually want to split before the amp not after. the liquid spark is not going to be hugely different from the heresy or 3+ i upgraded and i could tell but i have anandas which are quite resolving. you could also notice if you have something that is hard to drive like hd600 or something . i do think its an upgrade no doubt and twice the power better measurements. made in US


Ah, well maybe I could try DAC->to input of LS->from "P" (?) to Magni In. As long as there's no danger of ruining something, lol, I could at least try.

I actually received the LS today and notice I no longer have a lot of highs that "bother" me (unpleasant and too loud sounding) that I would frequently notice on the Magni, and the sounded just feels more rounded off and more pleasant and inviting. But I'm going off my memory and haven't been able to direct A/B yet. But right away I feel the LS sounds better to my ears, with my Hifiman 400i 2020. But that's off-topic 

All quick and dirty first impressions so far. Am hoping I'll come to realize they either sound the same or I could achieve similar sound to the LS, but on the Magni, using the Loki I have coming in this week.


----------



## bithloman

CB7FB8KgYh24E said:


> Ah, well maybe I could try DAC->to input of LS->from "P" (?) to Magni In. As long as there's no danger of ruining something, lol, I could at least try.
> 
> I actually received the LS today and notice I no longer have a lot of highs that "bother" me (unpleasant and too loud sounding) that I would frequently notice on the Magni, and the sounded just feels more rounded off and more pleasant and inviting. But I'm going off my memory and haven't been able to direct A/B yet. But right away I feel the LS sounds better to my ears, with my Hifiman 400i 2020. But that's off-topic
> 
> All quick and dirty first impressions so far. Am hoping I'll come to realize they either sound the same or I could achieve similar sound to the LS, but on the Magni, using the Loki I have coming in this week.


again i dont think that would be that great of an AB test of the amp. you are using an amp to feed another amp using the sound signature of the first. if you use the P on the liquid spark to feed the shciit than you will get that rounded warm sound of the LS with the schiit maybe not as much but still its worth getting a 4$ RCA splitter from the dac and plug back and forth from the quarter inch on the front instead of RCAs using pass through. also the 400i probably does benifit from LS warmth. i prefer a more detailed sound but they are both good.


----------



## CB7FB8KgYh24E (Mar 5, 2021)

That is true. Another minor thing I noticed about the LS is that it drives the headphones volume on these 400i's WAY higher. To get max comfortable sound levels I go to the 11:00 clock position on the dial. Anything more than 12:00 (goes to 5) is way loud (but not at all distorted). On the Magni 3+ to get 11:00 sound levels from the LS I have to turn the dial all the way to 4-5. Both on low gain settings. But I feel like the high gain on the LS doesn't "gain" as much, as the Magni. So if you really needed high gain Magni 3+ is probably better (but I can't test high volume AND high gain for fear of ruining my headphones).
High gain sounds like 1.25-1.5x the loudness of low gain on the LS. On Magni 3+ high gain sounds 2x+ louder than low gain

Also on the Magni 3+ when I would adjust the volume I would get a temporary noticeable hiss as I'm adjusting. This isn't the case with the LS

edit: listened to more songs, A/Bing them on the Modi 3+ DAC. LS, for my ears and headphones, wins, and it's noticeable. I can hear more details, and the highs don't kill my ears anymore. Everything is more dynamic and more dimensional.
I've had the Magni 3+ for 3.5 weeks at this point, used it daily, so it's burnt in and I'm used the sound of it. Switching back and forth to the LS, I definitely prefer the LS. The highs always bothered me but I honestly didn't know what the source was. Now I know! Definitely keeping the LS over the Magni 3+ for me. This is just the first evening with it, will update if my views change over the next few days as I keep testing


----------



## bithloman

CB7FB8KgYh24E said:


> That is true. Another minor thing I noticed about the LS is that it drives the headphones volume on these 400i's WAY higher. To get max comfortable sound levels I go to the 11:00 clock position on the dial. Anything more than 12:00 (goes to 5) is way loud (but not at all distorted). On the Magni 3+ to get 11:00 sound levels from the LS I have to turn the dial all the way to 4-5. Both on low gain settings. But I feel like the high gain on the LS doesn't "gain" as much, as the Magni. So if you really needed high gain Magni 3+ is probably better (but I can't test high volume AND high gain for fear of ruining my headphones).
> High gain sounds like 1.25-1.5x the loudness of low gain on the LS. On Magni 3+ high gain sounds 2x+ louder than low gain
> 
> Also on the Magni 3+ when I would adjust the volume I would get a temporary noticeable hiss as I'm adjusting. This isn't the case with the LS


yes i think the magni has better volume because it is less sensitive on low gain and more on high. so i can use iems on my heresy and also planars on high gain at like 10am, the hiss is just the volume pot scratch schiit is famous for it but it doesnt bother me or hurt the sound.


----------



## tameral

Does anyone happen to have a recommendation for Magni 3+ vs Heresy for an amp to pack along on a trip with some LCD-2s and a modi 3+ (understanding the differences are very small probably, maybe largely unnoticeable from an immediate listen)?


----------



## bithloman

tameral said:


> Does anyone happen to have a recommendation for Magni 3+ vs Heresy for an amp to pack along on a trip with some LCD-2s and a modi 3+ (understanding the differences are very small probably, maybe largely unnoticeable from an immedia


I have heard people comparing the two that the heresy is slightly more detailed than the three plus it would definitely be a good pairing with the darker LCD2


----------



## tameral

I was definitely leaning that way - I do keep reading people preferring the magni 3+ as particularly special and the heresy as being just kind of like the atoms and the other op amp budget dacs but then again I already have the magni 3 but I understand there was a big upgrade from 3 to 3+.  Seems like not much risk at 100 to get the heresy


----------



## bithloman

tameral said:


> I was definitely leaning that way - I do keep reading people preferring the magni 3+ as particularly special and the heresy as being just kind of like the atoms and the other op amp budget dacs but then again I already have the magni 3 but I understand there was a big upgrade from 3 to 3+.  Seems like not much risk at 100 to get the heresy


If you believe in any of the special things between almost identical amplifiers as far as specs go then go for the three plus I debated about it and found a good deal on a heresy for like 80 bucks from the b stock on their website and I love it it's actually quite a big upgrade from the liquid spark amp that I thought would be identical but I was very happy with it incredibly detailed and clean with a ton of power Also in red and black it looks really cool along with my black modi 3 plus DAC


----------



## schmalgausen

What is acceptable input voltage for the Magni? O2 has 14-20 VAC range. Maybe the power is alike?


----------



## adydula

Listening with a new Hersey and Hedd's Heddphones which are not a super efficient set of AMT driver cans...





I have several other amps in house costing much, more than this $99 Hersey.

The match or pairing with these Hedd's is spectacular for critical listening.

Crisp, clear and just a 10/10.....overall tonality is close to perfection.

This amp easily competes with others costing tons more!

An amazing value.

Alex

Note: All my amps are fed with redbook flacs, ripped and from a Schiit Bifrost 2 MB DAC.


----------



## tudedude

Added a One Little Bear as a preamp to the Magni 3+, who needs a Vali when you can do this.  I actually prefer the Little Bear by itself but this looks cool as a stack.


----------



## WaveTheory

I posted an IEMagni review here: https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/schiit-iemagni.25299/reviews#review-26329


----------



## Saturday

Using the Clear MGs this week, I found that the Magni Heresy out-resolved the Naim Unity Atom, some fancy Moon amp with balanced outputs, a Marantz, and a bunch of others. It was embarrassing frankly.


----------



## HumdrumPenguin

Saturday said:


> Using the Clear MGs this week, I found that the Magni Heresy out-resolved the Naim Unity Atom, some fancy Moon amp with balanced outputs, a Marantz, and a bunch of others. It was embarrassing frankly.


I sold an Asgard 3 that I quite liked once I got a Hegel H120 for my speakers. Once I plugged my headphones on the Hegel, the difference was just wow. The interesting party is that on the H120 there is no dedicated headphone circuitry, so the amplification for the headphones is exactly the same for the speakers. I wonder if that’s what made the huge difference.


----------



## schmalgausen

There were some issues with old Magni 3 (scratchy pot, hum noise) in appropriate thread and no any here. Is it less popularity or better quality?


----------



## tamleo (Nov 8, 2021)

schmalgausen said:


> There were some issues with old Magni 3 (scratchy pot, hum noise) in appropriate thread and no any here. Is it less popularity or better quality?


All people That I know have scratchy volume knob issue on their mangi3 after a while since buying (including me)
But I don’t hear any harm to the amp’s sound quality . My new Ifi Zen can signature has this issue right after unboxing


----------



## adydula (Nov 8, 2021)

Rk09 pot vs RK 27....just use some wd40 or contact cleaner...works good for me....
Had several Magnis, some of them had noisy pots, sent back and fixed. 
Others I just did the wd40 clean or contact or deoxit down the pot shaft and rotate a few times..works ok.


----------



## schmalgausen

I mean I saw no claims on 3+.


----------



## ishmaelk

I don't know if this has been discussed. I ran a search in this thread but couldn't find anything. 
Is there any benefit to using a linear power supply on the Magni 3+?
Thanks.


----------



## G0rt

ishmaelk said:


> I don't know if this has been discussed. I ran a search in this thread but couldn't find anything.
> Is there any benefit to using a linear power supply on the Magni 3+?
> Thanks.


None whatsoever, since the actual power circuitry is internal to the Magni, any Magni. 

The wall wart only supplies unregulated AC.


----------



## ishmaelk

G0rt said:


> None whatsoever, since the actual power circuitry is internal to the Magni, any Magni.
> 
> The wall wart only supplies unregulated AC.


I hadn't realized it says AC in in the Magni. 
Thanks for the help.


----------



## G0rt

ishmaelk said:


> I hadn't realized it says AC in in the Magni.
> Thanks for the help.


As much as we all dislike wall warts, getting the transformer away from the amp pays dividends in terms of heat, weight, size, noise, stray magnetic fields and cost. I guess I can live with that. 🙂


----------



## adydula

Schiit does tout linear power supplies in products...like this MODI:

*Power Supply: *
Modi 3: USB powered with +/-5V switching rail generator; auxiliary USB power input for 0mA USB power draw devices (like phones and tablets)
Modi Multibit: Included 14-16VAC wall-wart with 100% linear power supply


----------



## wolfstar76 (Feb 27, 2022)

My Mogni heresy got repaired and the power brick failed. I just ordered a generic 15VAC from amzon.


----------



## wolfstar76

It doesn't work at all, the Schiit warranty repair department just send me a dud? My email got totally ignored by Schiit.


----------



## motorradmike

hottyson said:


> 1) I checked my Schiit Modis and Schiit Magnis and only ONE out of the FIVE of them have that dent marks in the screw holes. I never noticed them until you pointed it out. Not really noticeable unless you are looking for it.
> 2) The volume knobs on mine came like that as well where they rub against the chassis. So, like you I just pulled a little and it went away. Pot scratchiness is not rub, but the sound that is produced electronically that causes a scratchy sound through your headphone drivers. That sound is always there when you move the pots in these cheap amps. However, it should not bother you once you have the volume set to where you want it.


Generally, a scratchy pot can be cleared by rotating the knob several times to clear the internal wipers.


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## hottyson

motorradmike said:


> Generally, a scratchy pot can be cleared by rotating the knob several times to clear the internal wipers.


And, if it gets severe on my really old gear, I turn to Deoxit. https://caig.com/deoxit-d-series/


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## TinearedOne

Just received my Magni 3+.  Performs exactly as expected.  Dead silent through my amp and speakers on low gain with the level of detail I thought I’d get.  No need to move up for me at the moment. Top end is plenty smooth.  Nice control of the Hifiman HE-X4 I bought along with the amp, too.  Still plenty of listening to do with those and my AKG K612 Pro’s.


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## TinearedOne

After a good deal of listening, I'll be holding on to the Magni 3+.  It meets my criteria.  

As a preamp running two sources through my SYS, even on vinyl, the music comes from a completely silent background.  No hum, not even a slight hiss from the tweeter.  Nice reproduction of music.  It pairs well with my Hafler amp and Energy speakers, yielding up enough detail for me to be happy and envision a nice stable stereo image.  I need to A/B it a little more with my Hafler preamp for the speakers, because the depth of the soundstage seems a little shallower - just from memory, though - we'll see if my memory is accurate.  

As a headphone amp, it works well with all of my current cans and I don't plan to upgrade to anything it doesn't have the power to handle.  No Susvaras for me.  It brings out the best traits of the SkullCandy Hesh 2, AKG K612 Pro, and Hifiman HE-X4 headphones I have, and after hours of listening, no fatigue with any of them whatsoever.  The Hesh 2 are bassy and rolled off on the top - but not as veiled as through my computer.  The K612 are smooth.  The HE-X4 are detailed enough for my hearing with that little bit of sparkle the other two headphones don't really have - and a little more air because of it.  From what I'm hearing, the amp has plenty of room for other headphones I may want.

For people with similar levels of gear, it is a good buy.  I am quite pleased.  I was tempted by the Heresy, but audio being a bit aesthetic, I didn't want the red and black.


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## amigastar

'Hello,
i have a question, is the Magni 3+ powerful enough to drive the Hifiman He-500 with authority?


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## schmalgausen

Magni is the most powerful amp. I don't have HE-500 but T50RP is ok.


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## adydula

schmalgausen said:


> Magni is the most powerful amp. I don't have HE-500


https://www.headphonesty.com/headphone-power-calculator/

The answer is quite evident..


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## adydula

Just ordered a Magni 3+, I have most of the Schiit amps etc here and wanted to compare to my other amps....for $99 this is a STEAL!

:>)
Alex


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## adydula

Magni 3+ just arrived! Plugged in and warming up......


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## schmalgausen

Is it hot enough?


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## TinearedOne

adydula said:


> Magni 3+ just arrived! Plugged in and warming up......


…and?


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## adydula

TinearedOne said:


> …and?


Coming soon..I promise !


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## ssmith3046

I use my Asgard 3 and retired my Magni 3+ but I still think it's a hundred dollar little marvel.


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## adydula (Apr 30, 2022)

Well I have been on the road and did not have time to post impressions on the new Schiit Magni 3 + .

After three days and driving it with several dacs and listening to some of my demo material the amp is operating just wonderfully.

With high dollar headphones like my Final Audio D8000 Pros and my ATH-ADX 5000's there is nothing missing when using this amp over other
much more costly amps. Yup, just as good to my ears...once level matched its so very close that its hard to justify spending $3000 + for an amp when
a $99 amp gets you so close....

One might ask well are you going to sell those more costly amps....answer is maybe yes and maybe no. I am a real hard ass amp guy that just loves amp design
and technology. So having these amps from $99 to $3000 + IMO is part of the fun. I have had more than 30 + amps over the past 5 years and now have only 8 amps left in house. Many reasons for keeping what I have....but some are just classics, have a design I really appreciate....but they all work really very well over a wide variety of loads.

But honestly a Schiit Magni 3+ will perform with a WIDE variety of headphones at a stellar low cost!

I have the OG magni, Magni 3, Vali 2 and have gone thru the Asgard 1 and the lastest Asgard, the Magnius, Lyr 1 and Lyr 3, and tons more other brands.
Even the Schiit Hersey and OG Jot and the latest Jotenheim. All good.

If you dont need balanced (and you really do not)...this Magni 3 + is about as good as a discrete circuit can get for $99...tons of power. Quiet. Two gain settings.
Drove my stuff fro 32 ohms to 420 ohms with aplumb.

If your on a budget, my advice is save for a really good dac first and use a Magni 3+ as the amp.....and when you want to upgrade OR PAYMORE...well have at it.
Do a comparison test for your ears and then you can decide!

Hats off to Jason Stoddard @Jason Stoddard at Schiit for staying the "discrete" course and providing us with such a stellar little solid state discrete headphone amp!

Life is good...now go enjoy your music!

Alex
:>)


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## amigastar

I have a Garage 1217 Project Ember 2 tube amp, but still want to try the Magni 3+ amp. Too bad Schiit Europe doesn't have any for sale.


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## amigastar (May 10, 2022)

So i'm currently waiting for my Schiit Magni 3+ to arrive and i have a question.
For my Hifiman HE-500 do i use the Lo or Hi gain, i guess Hi, right? And do i have to turn the amp off while switching from let's say Lo to Hi?


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## hottyson

amigastar said:


> So i'm currently waiting for my Schiit Magni 3+ to arrive and i have a question.
> For my Hifiman HE-500 do i use the Lo or Hi gain, i guess Hi, right? And do i have to turn the amp off while switching from let's say Lo to Hi?


Often the intent of the high and low gain is to adjust for higher or lower volume matching to headphones. However, in the case of most Schiit headphone amplifiers, the gain switch also substantially changes the sound. The differences are as if there were two different amplifiers to choose from. For all of my Hifiman planar headphones, I prefer the high gain mode with my Schiit amps. Try them both and see which you prefer. Just be careful not to damage your hearing when you turn to high gain. First turn down the volume because it can get really loud.


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## amigastar (May 10, 2022)

hottyson said:


> Often the intent of the high and low gain is to adjust for higher or lower volume matching to headphones. However, in the case of most Schiit headphone amplifiers, the gain switch also substantially changes the sound. The differences are as if there were two different amplifiers to choose from. For all of my Hifiman planar headphones, I prefer the high gain mode with my Schiit amps. Try them both and see which you prefer. Just be careful not to damage your hearing when you turn to high gain. First turn down the volume because it can get really loud.


Ah, ok. Got it thanks. So i don't need to turn off the amp for changing Gain? Is there really such a difference in the gain settings? Wow, didn't know that.


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## helloh3adfi

You just lower the volume to prevent hearing damage. I think you need to turn off the amp if you pull out the cable, is that neccessary? Some people told so to prevent driver damage.


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## hottyson

amigastar said:


> Ah, ok. Got it thanks. So i don't need to turn off the amp for changing Gain? Is there really such a difference in the gain settings? Wow, didn't know that.


No need to power down for gain switch use. 

Adjust volume to low.
Flip the gain switch to high.
Adjust volume to comfortable level.
Dance, within reasonable distance that the headphone cable allows for.


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## amigastar

hottyson said:


> No need to power down for gain switch use.
> 
> Adjust volume to low.
> Flip the gain switch to high.
> ...


Cool, thx


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## TinearedOne

amigastar said:


> So i'm currently waiting for my Schiit Magni 3+ to arrive and i have a question.
> For my Hifiman HE-500 do i use the Lo or Hi gain, i guess Hi, right? And do i have to turn the amp off while switching from let's say Lo to Hi?


I prefer the high gain for my HE-X4's, and I believe the HE-500's are supposed to be a little harder to drive.


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## adydula

Driving the new Magni 3+ with a iFi iDSD dac. Using Final Audio D8000 Pros and Audio Technica ADX 5000's.
Able to use LOW gain with the D8000's with LOW gain on the iFi.
Volume at 12 oclock...very loud, clear and nothing is missing here...

Highly recommended!

"The Little Amp That Could......!!!! 

It hangs in there with the BIG boys as well!!! OMG!


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## schmalgausen

Am I right that volume to MAX excludes the pot from the circuit?


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## r343

Yikes, Magni 3+ B started to cut out sound with HD6xx, i can hear relay clicking and sound returns then goes off again. Amp lasted like 3 months, quite meh.


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## GearMe

r343 said:


> Yikes, Magni 3+ B started to cut out sound with HD6xx, i can hear relay clicking and sound returns then goes off again. Amp lasted like 3 months, quite meh.



Schiit's very good about service...should be under warranty -- yes?


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## r343

GearMe said:


> Schiit's very good about service...should be under warranty -- yes?


Yes it should but things ended up with very un-expected turn!  Played some music with Arya and it did not cut out sound, this was very confusing.

Played again with HD6xx and sound cutted out, wondered What is going on.

Turns out HD6xx cables 6.3mm Adaptor has gone bad, swapped other and sound went from mono like to stereo and cut out stopped. Never expected thing like this could happen and there is no fault in the amplifier.


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## tafens

r343 said:


> Yes it should but things ended up with very un-expected turn!  Played some music with Arya and it did not cut out sound, this was very confusing.
> 
> Played again with HD6xx and sound cutted out, wondered What is going on.
> 
> Turns out HD6xx cables 6.3mm Adaptor has gone bad, swapped other and sound went from mono like to stereo and cut out stopped. Never expected thing like this could happen and there is no fault in the amplifier.


I’m glad you found the fault and it was an easy fix! First thing I did with my HD6XX was to replace its cable with an original HD650 one bought directly from Senneheiser. Better length and no adapter required


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## adydula

Been listening with the ADX 5000's with the Magni 3+ with a NOS dac...and its really very very good.
Excellent Pairing!


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## DeckHiFi (Sep 10, 2022)

^ I’m using a hd600 with magni 3+ and modius (I know I’m using the modius single ended). With a minor eq change to help the sub bass. It’s amazing how enjoyable this experience is when you get the volume right on low gain. I know part of this hobby is to always look elsewhere for something better. But Schiit was right when they are basically saying this is all you need. It’s an incredible experience. I might consider getting something else someday to change the sound. But All I know is - this is special.


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## adydula (Sep 11, 2022)

It's rare that people are happy with a  low cost setup. It's Indeed a good one!!

Enjoy the music!!


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## schmalgausen

DeckHiFi said:


> ^ I’m using a hd600 with magni 3+ and modius (I know I’m using the modius single ended). With a minor eq change to help the sub bass. It’s amazing how enjoyable this experience is when you get the volume right on low gain. I know part of this hobby is to always look elsewhere for something better. But Schiit was right when they are basically saying this is all you need. It’s an incredible experience. I might consider getting something else someday to change the sound. But All I know is - this is special.


Have you tired other amps with HD600?


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## DeckHiFi

schmalgausen said:


> Have you tired other amps with HD600?


Not yet! Just loving this at the moment. Should I? I’ve watched a ton of reviews on other amps. I probably will try a different sound sometime soon or in next year. So many choices : )


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## schmalgausen

I don't know. I used O2 + ODAC for many years and thought it was enough for any headphones. But when I tried OTL and found that HD6xx sounds funnies with it.


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## DeckHiFi (Sep 11, 2022)

Yea I think this is a really great solid state sound. Determining what I would need to pay for a different sound is difficult because there are so many different opinions. Then there’s also the point that just because something is different - doesn’t mean it’s better. You could make the argument one way to go is a couple different headphones for when you want to favor soundstage and more intimate for example. But then there’s also tube and no tube, do dacs matter at all ? Maybe but maybe only when they are changing the sound to sound more analogue? (Not saying there aren’t small differences) It’s hard to have any working theories with all the different things you read. You could be convinced of one path and then someone says that’s not true at all for them.


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## schmalgausen

I asked because only HD6XX are so capricious to amplification, all others from my collection work fine with Magni 3+.


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## DeckHiFi

schmalgausen said:


> I asked because only HD6XX are so capricious to amplification, all others from my collection work fine with Magni 3+.


What did you notice with that set up?


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## schmalgausen (Sep 12, 2022)

HD6xx + OTL? More lively and fascinating sound.


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## DeckHiFi

Thanks! I’ll definitely consider that soon.


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## gooeyrich

Does anyone know how much voltage the Heresy delivers at 600 ohms?


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## schmalgausen

P=U2/R
U=SQR(P*R)=SQR(0.215*600)=11V 
?


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## gooeyrich

schmalgausen said:


> P=U2/R
> U=SQR(P*R)=SQR(0.215*600)=11V
> ?



Thank you.

The reason I ask, is because from what I've gathered for high impedance headphones voltage swing(and to an extent high amplifier output impedance) is what matters more than current(mW).

Everyone thinks the DT 880 and 990 need hundreds of mW of current, but they don't. *Beyers own website says they take a maximum of 100 mW.*

What really opens them up is high voltage swing capacity, and to an uncertain(to me) extent, higher amplifier output impedance.


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## DeckHiFi (Oct 22, 2022)

Random thoughts about Magni 3+ today:
This amp setup with my Modius and HD600 is amazing! I think about updating to a different amp all the time, but it's amazing how good this thing is still. Thoughts...

I read some reviews that said the Magni 3 is better in high gain, and maybe it's placebo, but I'm starting to agree. It's almost like the instruments and overall sound is less cluttered. Again, could just be a good day where I'm feeling good and everything sounds amazing.

Here is what I recommend with this amp with the HD600, add a low shelf EQ. It fixes the lack of bass impact this headphone has and sounds incredible in my rig. Might not be ideal for Jazz or Orchestral, but sounds nearly perfect with other kinds of music. I do a preamp -3.0 dB with a LOW shelf: 75 Freq., Gain: 3.0 dB. Then use high gain on the Magni 3+ and I like the dial at around 10 or 11 o'clock (obviously depends on the song/album as this is just a general guide). This is the shiz or Schiit. Whatever you prefer. Enjoy!!

I found this EQ suggestion from a forum post in the audio science forums and I think it's the key find for this headphone setup.


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## schmalgausen

DeckHiFi said:


> This amp setup with my Modius and HD600 is amazing


Have you tried something else?


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## DeckHiFi

schmalgausen said:


> Have you tried something else?


Ha not yet. I'm trying to make that decision. Even though I love this sound I might try a new amp like the Valhalla 2 soon as people seem to like the pairing with the HD600 and I like the Schiit brand.


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