# 2.5mm male to 3.5mm female adapter?



## seanwee

I was wondering if I could convert a 2.5mm balanced output to a 3.5mm se output. 

If I could, will it give me more driving power? I asked a local audio store and they said it will simply convert the 2.5mm balanced output to a 3.5mm se output without increasing the output.


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## artpiggo (Apr 3, 2018)

I don't quite understand the topic and your content question.

In the same DAP with both SE and BAL, balanced port will give double power. So the answer is no, re-terminating the balanced plug to single end plug will not give any more driving power.

Also, you cannot and never use 2.5 male to 3.5 female adapter to convert 3.5 SE plug into 2.5 BAL port, it will cause damage either to your earphone or to AMP module.

Female > Male
BAL > BAL is ok
SE > SE is ok
BAL  > SE is OK
SE > BAL is Not OK


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## seanwee

artpiggo said:


> In the same DAP with both SE and BAL, balanced port will give double power. So the answer is no, converting it to single end will not give any more driving power.


Why won't converting the balanced port to single end give double power if the balanced port gives double power?


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## artpiggo

seanwee said:


> Why won't converting the balanced port to single end give double power if the balanced port gives double power?



Ok I misunderstand your sentence. I thought you mean changing 2.5 mm cable to 3.5 mm AMP port so I edit my post to explain it. Please read it again.


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## seanwee (Apr 3, 2018)

artpiggo said:


> I don't quite understand the topic and your content question.
> 
> In the same DAP with both SE and BAL, balanced port will give double power. So the answer is no, re-terminating the balanced plug to single end plug will not give any more driving power.
> 
> ...


 So this is not OK?


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## artpiggo

seanwee said:


> Is this SE to balanced?



It depends on definition/perspective.

Some people might say "FEMALE" to "MALE". Other might mean "MALE" to "FEMALE"

I am into first type. so this is 2.5 balance to 3.5 se to me.


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## artpiggo

seanwee said:


> So this is not OK?



Of course, Not OK.


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## seanwee

artpiggo said:


> Of course, Not OK.


Got it thanks


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## Jemabaris

artpiggo said:


> I don't quite understand the topic and your content question.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Okay so I wanted to adapt the 2.5mm balanced output of my iBasso DC01 with an adapter to use it with my other headphones which have fixed 3.5mm cables. It makes sence that shorting out anything is not a really good idea of course! I ordered this adapter here:
https://de.aliexpress.com/item/3296...chweb0_0,searchweb201602_2,searchweb201603_53

And all the reviews are very positive and many people use it for the exact same purpose, using their 3.5mm headphones with balanced DAP outputs. So does this adapter do something different maybe? Should I try it? Or would I risk frying something? I'd imagine someone give it a bad rating if it fried his DAP or phones. 
Thanks for any advice!


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## artpiggo

Jemabaris said:


> Okay so I wanted to adapt the 2.5mm balanced output of my iBasso DC01 with an adapter to use it with my other headphones which have fixed 3.5mm cables. It makes sence that shorting out anything is not a really good idea of course! I ordered this adapter here:
> https://de.aliexpress.com/item/3296...chweb0_0,searchweb201602_2,searchweb201603_53
> 
> And all the reviews are very positive and many people use it for the exact same purpose, using their 3.5mm headphones with balanced DAP outputs. So does this adapter do something different maybe? Should I try it? Or would I risk frying something? I'd imagine someone give it a bad rating if it fried his DAP or phones.
> Thanks for any advice!



It might worth the risk. Recently, ranko can do ground from L- and R- in balanced.

From the feedback, i think it might be possible.

However I recommend ranko as link below.because I tested it.

THB 851.52 | RANKO 2.5mm Balance to 3.5mm Stereo Adapter Connector Headphone Plug Converter for Hifi Audio Mobile Phone MP3 MP4 Music Player
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/csSZ5Ocs


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## Jemabaris (Aug 1, 2019)

artpiggo said:


> It might worth the risk. Recently, ranko can do ground from L- and R- in balanced.
> 
> However I recommend ranko as link below.because I tested it.
> .





Okay so you tested it and everything works fine? Because in your earlier post you said that it can't be done with a very logical explanation. I really don't wanna fry the DC01 and even less some very expensive headphones. Just double checking, I'm a bit of a coward when it comes to this


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## pstickne (Aug 1, 2019)

artpiggo said:


> I don't quite understand the topic and your content question.
> 
> In the same DAP with both SE and BAL, balanced port will give double power. So the answer is no, re-terminating the balanced plug to single end plug will not give any more driving power.
> 
> ...


That seems off/backwards per the “Female > Male” heading.. transposed incorrectly? Usually the AMP has the F socket..

A 2.5mm BAL (M, cable) can adapt to a 3.5mm SE (F, AMP output) just fine. It’s just a Y split to two isolated transducers.

However, I suspect that it takes more than “just a wire” go BAL (F, AMP output) to Stereo SE (M, cable) as in the primitive form that effectively feeds each BAL channel into each other.


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## artpiggo

Jemabaris said:


> Okay so you tested it and everything works fine? Because in your earlier post you said that it can't be done with a very logical explanation. I really don't wanna fry the DC01 and even less some very expensive headphones. Just double checking, I'm a bit of a coward when it comes to this



Thats why I say "recently". Because in 2018, they cant do.


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## artpiggo

pstickne said:


> That seems off/backwards per the “Female > Male” heading.. transposed incorrectly? Usually the AMP has the F socket..
> 
> A 2.5mm BAL (M, cable) can adapt to a 3.5mm SE (F, AMP output) just fine. It’s just a Y split to two isolated transducers.
> 
> However, I suspect that it takes more than “just a wire” go BAL (F, AMP output) to Stereo SE (M, cable) as in the primitive form that effectively feeds each BAL channel into each other.



That is how difference of the way we say for adapter.

In Thailand, most people buy adapter because they have cable with different plugs. So they need adapter to use with DAP. Thai people will start stating from Female (of adapter) to Male (of adapter) typically. Because they concern about cable first, not DAP.


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## ClieOS

*NOTE*: 

1) You can plug any balanced wired headphone to single-ended (SE) source using an adapter. The adapter will effectively convert the balanced wiring on the headphone back to single-ended wiring, so it becomes SE headphone to SE source.

2) You *SHOULD NOT* plug a single-ended headphone to a balanced source using an adapter. The adapter in this case will short-circuit the balanced output in the source. It might seem to work in the short run, but you are on borrowed time as you are slowly damaging the balanced circuit on your source and can lead to a burn out of the circuit.


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## Tysun

ClieOS said:


> *NOTE*:
> 
> 1) You can plug any balanced wired headphone to single-ended (SE) source using an adapter. The adapter will effectively convert the balanced wiring on the headphone back to single-ended wiring, so it becomes SE headphone to SE source.
> 
> 2) You *SHOULD NOT* plug a single-ended headphone to a balanced source using an adapter. The adapter in this case will short-circuit the balanced output in the source. It might seem to work in the short run, but you are on borrowed time as you are slowly damaging the balanced circuit on your source and can lead to a burn out of the circuit.



Thanks fellow Malaysian Head Fier, you answer has been quoted in E1DA DAC thread FAQ. This same question has been raised again and again, almost on daily basis.


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## PERRY8912

ClieOS said:


> *NOTE*:
> 
> 1) You can plug any balanced wired headphone to single-ended (SE) source using an adapter. The adapter will effectively convert the balanced wiring on the headphone back to single-ended wiring, so it becomes SE headphone to SE source.
> 
> 2) You *SHOULD NOT* plug a single-ended headphone to a balanced source using an adapter. The adapter in this case will short-circuit the balanced output in the source. It might seem to work in the short run, but you are on borrowed time as you are slowly damaging the balanced circuit on your source and can lead to a burn out of the circuit.


I understand that 2.5mm male to 3.5mm female will not be a good idea. 

But what about the following options? 2.5mm male + 3.5mm male to 3.5mm female? It is for A&K player.
The reason I'm looking at the options is I really want to use the extra power from balanced output without changing the cables. 
Let me know your thought on this.
Thanks


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## ClieOS

PERRY8912 said:


> I understand that 2.5mm male to 3.5mm female will not be a good idea.
> 
> But what about the following options? 2.5mm male + 3.5mm male to 3.5mm female? It is for A&K player.
> The reason I'm looking at the options is I really want to use the extra power from balanced output without changing the cables.
> ...



A&K is famous for having some of the (*mechanically) weakest socket on its DAP. Often the socket will brake off from its soldering join internally when it is used extensively. To reduce the issue, A&K instead made the original 'joined' adapter so both sockets can be plugged in at the same time to provide more anchored point and thus more resistant to internal breakage due to mechanical failure. it DO NOT give the output more power in any way as these kind of adapter merely connecting balanced to balanced and single-ended to single-ended (so 2.5mm to other balanced or 3.5mm to 3..5mm). They do not mix the signal internally.

So if Music Heaven is being a good boy and following the same design logic as A&K's original mechanical adapter, then you will not (_*and should not_) get any sonic benefit from using their adapter, but merely mechanical benefit, as the 3.5mm female socket should only receives electrical signal from the 3.5mm male plug while the 2.5mm plug is solely there to provide only mechanical strengthening. BUT if Music Heaven is bad at their design and indeed mixed the two together, then you are looking at another stupid adapter that can damage your A&K in the long run.


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## PERRY8912

ClieOS said:


> A&K is famous for having some of the (*mechanically) weakest socket on its DAP. Often the socket will brake off from its soldering join internally when it is used extensively. To reduce the issue, A&K instead made the original 'joined' adapter so both sockets can be plugged in at the same time to provide more anchored point and thus more resistant to internal breakage due to mechanical failure. it DO NOT give the output more power in any way as these kind of adapter merely connecting balanced to balanced and single-ended to single-ended (so 2.5mm to other balanced or 3.5mm to 3..5mm). They do not mix the signal internally.
> 
> So if Music Heaven is being a good boy and following the same design logic as A&K's original mechanical adapter, then you will not (_*and should not_) get any sonic benefit from using their adapter, but merely mechanical benefit, as the 3.5mm female socket should only receives electrical signal from the 3.5mm male plug while the 2.5mm plug is solely there to provide only mechanical strengthening. BUT if Music Heaven is bad at their design and indeed mixed the two together, then you are looking at another stupid adapter that can damage your A&K in the long run.



Hey, thanks for your reply. I thought the extra 3.5mm male will provide some extra connection, so it may not short the circuit. But maybe I was wrong.

Anyway in order to push some full-size headphones(HE1000SE, D8000,etc.), What's the best way to utilize the extra power from balanced output? I don't really want to change the cables, as it is more expensive and may change the sound somehow.


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## ClieOS

PERRY8912 said:


> Hey, thanks for your reply. I thought the extra 3.5mm male will provide some extra connection, so it may not short the circuit. But maybe I was wrong.
> 
> Anyway in order to push some full-size headphones(HE1000SE, D8000,etc.), What's the best way to utilize the extra power from balanced output? I don't really want to change the cables, as it is more expensive and may change the sound somehow.



Actually, changing the cable to balanced might be the cheapest way for you to get more power, assuming that you didn't get the most expensive cable around.


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## Sandiego77 (Sep 19, 2020)

ClieOS said:


> *NOTE*:
> 
> 1) You can plug any balanced wired headphone to single-ended (SE) source using an adapter. The adapter will effectively convert the balanced wiring on the headphone back to single-ended wiring, so it becomes SE headphone to SE source.
> 
> 2) You *SHOULD NOT* plug a single-ended headphone to a balanced source using an adapter. The adapter in this case will short-circuit the balanced output in the source. It might seem to work in the short run, but you are on borrowed time as you are slowly damaging the balanced circuit on your source and can lead to a burn out of the circuit.


This is the best example i have found. Still i have two questions. First from 1) 2.5 mm balanced male could be transfered to 3.5 mm non balanced male, but need adapter? My headphone manufacturer add cable 2.5 mm balanced male to 3.5 mm non balanced male, is it safe? Second question from 2) adapter 3.5 mm non balanced female to 2.5 mm balanced male isnt safe, so 3.5 mm non balanced female to 4.4 mm balanced male is also not safe?


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## Chris Kaoss

Hi
1) Yes / Which headphone is it you're talking about?
2) Yes, it's the same thing like 2.5mm.


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## Sandiego77 (Sep 19, 2020)

Denon gc30 has cable with 2.5 mm Non balanced male (trrs plug) to 3.5 mm non balanced male (trs plug). I took multimeter to figure out how it's connected. Talking about 2.5 mm male, going from s to t, s and r2 was ground, r1 was right, t was left. They invented own standand. Also I got balanced 4.4 mm male to balanced 3.5 female, maybe this one is safe?


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## Chris Kaoss (Sep 19, 2020)

This looks depended to the internal wiring in the headphone.
Like my Oppo PM-3, with which you are able to use a 3.5mm unbalanced and a 3.5mm balanced termination on headphone side.
But the Denon is forced to use a 3.5mm balanced only.
So you're free to use a 2.5mm/4.4mm balanced male to 3.5mm balanced male cable. 
But keep an eye on the wiring before use and make sure it fits your source.

If i read your post correctly, the 2.5mm plug has an uncommon wiring.
Be aware of.

Edit.
The 2.5mm goes to the headphone with to me unknown wiring sheme.

Take a look at the most common pinouts here:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/3-5mm-and-2-5mm-trrs-balanced-cable-questions.869527/post-13969168

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/som...iring-for-balanced-audio.875730/post-14131694


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## Sandiego77

Chris Kaoss said:


> This looks depended to the internal wiring in the headphone.
> Like my Oppo PM-3, with which you are able to use a 3.5mm unbalanced and a 3.5mm balanced termination on headphone side.
> But the Denon is forced to use a 3.5mm balanced only.
> So you're free to use a 2.5mm/4.4mm balanced male to 3.5mm balanced male cable.
> ...


My story is today i was looking info about adapters, cause I got my 4.4 bal male to 3.5 bal female adapter and still was not sure about safety. After reading this thread and other else I decided to don't use it. I saw similar info from your link, and got idea solder my 4.4 bal male to denons 2.5 male jack, cause it should be balanced, but after testing wiring I decided don't do it because wiring didn't match info on web


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## Chris Kaoss

yep, it looks a bit confusing.

The 2.5mm jack on the headphone side, like you mentioned above, is the opposite of what i know a 2.5mm is wired normally.
Did you have measured the 3.5 unbalanced to 2.5 balanced cable?
It looks really strange to me.


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## Sandiego77

Chris Kaoss said:


> yep, it looks a bit confusing.
> 
> The 2.5mm jack on the headphone side, like you mentioned above, is the opposite of what i know a 2.5mm is wired normally.
> Did you have measured the 3.5 unbalanced to 2.5 balanced cable?
> It looks really strange to me.


I took example from web and adopted, this is adapter plus cable, left is 4.4, middle is 3.5, right is 2.5. I don't really know is it + or - signal, I assumed it is 3.5 traditional trs and measured with multimeter where is signal.


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## Chris Kaoss

Ah, ok.
So you don't know exactly what the 2.5mm pinout on the headphone connector looks like?


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## Sandiego77

Chris Kaoss said:


> Ah, ok.
> So you don't know exactly what the 2.5mm pinout on the headphone connector looks like?


I'm not sure about my explaining. This is real headphones cable with plugs. And connecting is like I wrote before.


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## Chris Kaoss (Sep 19, 2020)

Ok.
tip = left +
ring 1 = right +
ring 2 = left -
sleeve = right -

Looks like the pinout of my PM-3.

You've mentioned it above in the wrong direction.


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## Sandiego77

Chris Kaoss said:


> Ok.
> tip = left +
> ring 1 = right +
> ring 2 = left -
> ...


Yes, you are right, I done mistake, will fix it. Further to 3.5 trs:
Tip: left + 
Ring: right +
Sleeve: right - and left -, it's ground? 
Talking about 2.5 plug, ring 2 and sleeve has connection between themselves, it's also ground?


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## Chris Kaoss

Not necessarily.
The 2.5mm plug has seperated "grounds" for left and right, what them makes a balanced connection.
The 2 grounds are wired to the sleeve of the 3.5mm unbalanced plug as a common ground.
You can use a balanced wire with 2.5mm on both sides, which should fit to your source device.

My cable for the PM3 is wired like this, as example:




It's the most used connection sheme ( AK dap ) out there for source devices.


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## Sandiego77

Chris Kaoss said:


> Not necessarily.
> The 2.5mm plug has seperated "grounds" for left and right, what them makes a balanced connection.
> The 2 grounds are wired to the sleeve of the 3.5mm unbalanced plug as a common ground.
> You can use a balanced wire with 2.5mm on both sides, which should fit to your source device.
> ...


Thank you for answers, really good info


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## Chris Kaoss

My pleasure.
Enjoy your gear and happy listening.


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## shimigg

So I have the FH7 from fiio with their thin 2.5mm balanced cable , can I convert it to 3.5mm SE ?
just don't want to switch cables all the time between my amp and smartphone.


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## Chris Kaoss

shimigg said:


> So I have the FH7 from fiio with their thin 2.5mm balanced cable , can I convert it to 3.5mm SE ?
> just don't want to switch cables all the time between my amp and smartphone.


Yes.
This is the preferred way.
I do the same with my xlr-cable to 3.5 se for listening with my V30.


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