# Sony releases $160 64 GB SD cards marketed for 'Premium Sound'



## comzee

LINK
  
 Thoughts?
  
 EDIT:
  
 I want to add I'm not an "expert" in this area (audio). News sources all over are reporting the "snake oil" concept here. With items like this it's very easy to debunk, so to speak, the benefits it claims to give. 
  
 This is for all my fellow skeptics out there, if you're like me head-fi is a minefield of figuring out what's rhetoric and what's not. What's made up to sell products, and what isn't. Remember conman came from confidence man, which many people have here. A slim few offer up scientific test results. Burn me at the stake now I guess. 
  
 My current list of things that don't add quality:
  
 1. Anything above 320kbps audio
 2. ASIO and similar concepts
 3. Any analogue cable that costs over $15*
 4. FLAC** 
  
  
  
 *first time I heard about cryogenic frozen cables here... -_- no words.
 **In some cases FLAC sounds better then 320kbps mp3 just because it was created from a different master source that might have been better.


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## NawiLlih

I like my lossless personally, but I do think this "premium SD" sound like a load of BS!


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## ProtegeManiac

I'd sooner believe that a smartphone case with copper and ERS paper will make for a blacker background.
  
On airplane mode.


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## IAMBLEST

comzee said:


> LINK
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> ...




What system do you have where you restrict yourself to those 4 principles?


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## Mooses9

protegemaniac said:


> I'd sooner believe that a smartphone case with copper and ERS paper will make for a blacker background.
> 
> On airplane mode.




Yeah this is some crazy bs going they are selling snake oil if anyone was ever doing so.


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## InsanityOne

Hello Head-fi,
  
 Today I have some very interesting news coming from Sony:
  
 Source 1: http://blogs.wsj.com/japanrealtime/2015/02/19/sony-to-offer-premium-sound-memory-card/
  
 Source 2: http://phandroid.com/2015/02/19/sony-premium-sound-quiet-micro-sd-card-160-dollars/
  

  
  


> "We suppose that’s what brought Sony to manufacture an expensive new “Premium Sound” micro SD card that will go on sale next month in Japan. Priced at $160 for only 64GB of storage, it’s definitely a lot more expensive than the $35 cards you’ll find on Amazon, but *Sony’s SD card claims to produce less electrical noise when reading data,* something only those with a really keen ear would be capable of hearing."


 
  
 Less electrical noise from an SD card? Only 64GB for $160? I can get 128GB for less than that! I'm pretty lost on this one, what do you all think? Head on over to the two articles and have a quick read for yourselves!
  
 Edit: I wouldn't mind someone picking one up and offering a review though... 
  
 - Insanity


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## CrocCap

Its products like this that give audiophiles a bad rep amongst those not in the audiophile community. 
 Neither of the sources have any hint of evidence or even logical reasoning why such a product should exist.
  
 I don't know how an sd card would produce electrical noise, as it is a passive unit that doesn't generate power on its own, it doesn't even have any moving parts.  Wouldn't the device reading the card have more to do with electrical noise than the solid state media it is reading?


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## WindowsX

It saddens me whenever I see people trashing Sony's effort to build better quality of storage. Although I don't really know exactly about improvements they made in the product but from its pinout and internal architecture design, I could see how micro SD card can be improved.

  

 1. As for PCB, they could raise copper thickness, improving PCB build quality for reducing interference, redesigning PCB layout for less ground loop, etc. Yeah that would certainly reduce the signal interference in data path.

 2. As for voltage supply, They could improve regulator like adding some sort of power filters or use better power regulator providing cleaner power and more stable voltage.

 3. As for chips, they could use better grade of interface controller for improved low latency performance or upgrade interface driver with better clock synchronization or use better grade of memory core for less access time and stable voltage data block or something.

 4. They could also improve resistors and capacitors using military like high precision 1% or even 0.1% tolerance resistor and lower ripple caps or something.

  

 And yeah these are my assumptions of how you could build better micro SD card in terms that audiophiles would be scientifically satisfied. I don't know what Sony did but they even managed to show measurements of reduced noise spike yet people make fun of it without knowing anything about it. I bet the mass would be trashing audiophile grade Solid stage drive as well if released. Sighs...


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## Azsori

This is why I still have a soft spot always for Sony: 
  
 "A Sony spokesperson told _The Wall Street Journal_ that they’re not even sure how well the product will sell, but they’re making it anyway for customers who demand sound quality."
  
  
What more can you ask for as an audiophile?  And who cares about the bad rep?  I get that for my other hobbies as well: Gaming PC's, HTPC, High End TV, High end home surround sound, Car modifications, Anime collections, DLSR photog gear, One each released tablet/smartphone OS type. A lot of people can't think beyond the tangible.  Either way, it is most likely a superior way to implement the technology.  Over great periods of time these things will trickle down and improve baseline standards.


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## Ari33

Yes, I think they could actually be useful for certain devices. I have read a few posts on here with people wondering why their music sounded better from their devices onboard memory in comparison to their micro SD cards. 
These noise spikes demonstrated in the Sony test might well have something to do with these reports and adds some credibility to them being a worthwhile solution for some people.


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## ProtegeManiac

mooses9 said:


> Yeah this is some crazy bs going they are selling snake oil if anyone was ever doing so.


 
  
 Problem is people like those on Reddit will pick up on it, make fun of all audiophiles as audiophools, and they have no idea that audiophiles are laughing at the idea too.


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## Mooses9

This is very true too.


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## Folex

Hey I am offering audiophile quality banana phone. Only $599


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## Mike37

Excellent! Will you be releasing a "bunch" version that will do 5.1


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## Folex

5.1 being released 2/22/15 for the low price of $1,999.00 w/out optional attachments.


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## Head Injury

folex said:


> 5.1 being released 2/22/15 for the low price of $1,999.00 w/out optional attachments.


 

 I call bull.
  
 I only see 5 channels. Where's the subwoofer?


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## Folex

head injury said:


> I call bull.
> 
> I only see 5 channels. Where's the subwoofer?


 
  
 It's a hybrid design with "flux capacitor" technology. When all 5 channels are engaged it makes a vortex of subterranean banana calls that will produce the ultra-low frequencies.


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## NawiLlih

To give a slightly more balanced perspective, while I'm certain that any benefits from this card will be from placebo effects, if those placebo effects enhance someone's enjoyment significantly it may be worth the £100 to that person.
Doesn't mean it's not snake oil to us, but we certainly should condemn anyone who wants to believe that it works...


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## Mooses9

nawillih said:


> To give a slightly more balanced perspective, while I'm certain that any benefits from this card will be from placebo effects, if those placebo effects enhance someone's enjoyment significantly it may be worth the £100 to that person.
> Doesn't mean it's not snake oil to us, but we certainly should condemn anyone who wants to believe that it works...


 
 i guess this is  true,  i mean its the same idea on silver vs copper cables, i buy silver some people dont believe silver makes a differences i do, so i buy it and believe i get the satisfaction from the product. but with a cable you can test its validity, i dont believe you can test a sd cards validity against say a run in the mill 64gb sd card that kind of where sony has got us.


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## NawiLlih

mooses9 said:


> i guess this is  true,  i mean its the same idea on silver vs copper cables, i buy silver some people dont believe silver makes a differences i do, so i buy it and believe i get the satisfaction from the product. but with a cable you can test its validity, i dont believe you can test a sd cards validity against say a run in the mill 64gb sd card that kind of where sony has got us.




Well on Sony's Japanese launch site, they have a graph of something...

What makes me extra suspicious, though, is that there is no scale on the graph, presumably to hide that the differences are negligible.
What it does mean is that there is some measurable difference in something, whatever that something is - I can't read Japanese so I can't tell honestly...


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## InsanityOne

The "Bannana Audio" products above are truly amazing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 But in all seriousness the only way I would EVER buy this is if someone was able to tell the difference between it and a regular SD card in some form of double-blind testing scenario.


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## Mooses9

i donno i am sure they would have some type of depiction showing how their memory card outweighs other ''run in the mill'' memory cards  and its going to be to the benefit of the sony card. i can go to my local micro centre and get a 64gb or larger card for about $15.00.
  
 you'd have to wonder if one who buys the card and believes they hear a change in sound quality is it because a spent $160.00? not hatin but just question motive.


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## Head Injury

nawillih said:


> Well on Sony's Japanese launch site, they have a graph of something...
> 
> What makes me extra suspicious, though, is that there is no scale on the graph, presumably to hide that the differences are negligible.
> What it does mean is that there is some measurable difference in something, whatever that something is - I can't read Japanese so I can't tell honestly...


 

 The measurable difference, if there is any, is in the electrical noise added to the signal when data is pulled off the card. I think that's what they're marketing this card as, low noise, which is what the article says.
  
 Any electrical noise added to a digital signal will do nothing audible unless there's so much that bits are flipped from 0 to 1 or vice versa. If bits are not flipped, they will be read by the DAC as exactly the same values regardless of noise level, this is one of the benefits of digital audio. In the case that bits are flipped, you'll get static, pops, and dropouts once the analog signal is reconstructed, not subtle loss of quality or lower signal-to-noise ratio. The regular SD cards we have now work fine, or we'd know about it. The amount of noise they add is insignificant, the new card is just a little more insignificant.


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## NawiLlih

head injury said:


> The measurable difference, if there is any, is in the electrical noise added to the signal when data is pulled off the card. I think that's what they're marketing this card as, low noise, which is what the article says.
> 
> Any electrical noise added to a digital signal will do nothing audible unless there's so much that bits are flipped from 0 to 1 or vice versa. If bits are not flipped, they will be read by the DAC as exactly the same values regardless of noise level, this is one of the benefits of digital audio. In the case that bits are flipped, you'll get static, pops, and dropouts once the analog signal is reconstructed, not subtle loss of quality or lower signal-to-noise ratio. The regular SD cards we have now work fine, or we'd know about it. The amount of noise they add is insignificant, the new card is just a little more insignificant.




That was sort of what I expected to be the case, as it is Trading Standards (or foreign equivalents) can't take them up on it because it does do *something,* just something not worth doing :|


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## Ch1Kn

Just want to point out that asio isn't for sound quality its for near zero latency for sound production which is something that is not currently possible with most stock soundcard drivers (talking about realtek here). This is a HUGE problem when trying to record for example raw keyboard input with latency that often exceed 500 miliseconds on a lot of stock soundcard  drivers. This makes it impossible to keep everything on beat (impossible as in no human could possibly do this at all).


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## justin w.

The Sony audiophile SD card sounds way better if you draw a line on it with a Sharpie


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## trevorlane

Only if you huff the fumes before the ink dries, and then you have a listen


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## InsanityOne

justin w. said:


> The Sony audiophile SD card sounds way better if you draw a line on it with a Sharpie


 
 Oh really...?
  


trevorlane said:


> Only if you huff the fumes before the ink dries, and then you have a listen


 
 Now it makes sense...


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## comzee

ch1kn said:


> Just want to point out that asio isn't for sound quality its for near zero latency for sound production which is something that is not currently possible with most stock soundcard drivers (talking about realtek here). This is a HUGE problem when trying to record for example raw keyboard input with latency that often exceed 500 miliseconds on a lot of stock soundcard  drivers. This makes it impossible to keep everything on beat (impossible as in no human could possibly do this at all).


 
 Yup, I actually do some keyboard production with FL Studio and use ASIO in that regard. Just not sure why people think it would give any better audio quality. I guess maybe someone heard an audio engineer was using it and automatically assumed stuff.


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## tsktsk

I can't wait for the initial reviews on this thing. Wondering if any keen ears will report a difference!


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## h1f1add1cted

That is not possible to hear a difference between microSD cards. Placebo + Voodoo if someone tell that. In a real world blind testing would no one can hear any difference. Only possible scenario is, if the microSD card is too slow like a very old class 2 and you want to play DXD or DSD256 file with 2 GB or above, it would/could stuck with the playback and this would be a indicator which card is used...


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## Folex

New and improved sony card. Now with racing stripes for an added 35hp and a flux capacitor so it can go back in time.


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## Mooses9

comzee said:


> Yup, I actually do some keyboard production with FL Studio and use ASIO in that regard. Just not sure why people think it would give any better audio quality. I guess maybe someone heard an audio engineer was using it and automatically assumed stuff.


 






 well maybe people on headfi will avoid the product and see through its rouge hopefully


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## cel4145

protegemaniac said:


> I'd sooner believe that a smartphone case with copper and ERS paper will make for a blacker background.
> 
> On airplane mode.




Faraday cage for your phone? LOL

Gotta love one of the headlines for the coverage of this new card: Sony just unveiled the stupidest product in the history of the universe.


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## ProtegeManiac

cel4145 said:


> Faraday cage for your phone? LOL


 
  
At which point, it ceases being a phone, does it? I'm not actually insane enough to do that, unlike that idiot on YouTube who wrapped everything including the internals of his gear with ERS paper AND the terminals where he soldered on some cables, then has his preamp on a Spider Rack and his CD transport just sitting on his Ikea table. What, dumbest thing ever - not even audiophile storage devices can top that.


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## cel4145

protegemaniac said:


> At which point, it ceases being a phone, does it?




Yeah. I don't expect the phone antenna will work well, no matter how you hold it.


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## feverfive

Compared to the snake oil we've all seen in audiophile-land, this one doesn't even bother me.  With $1,000 being the price of entry for TOTL DAPs, I think I am now desensitized to pricing.  That is not to say I'll necessarily buy what the vendors & selling. I'm just no longer surprised.


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## InsanityOne

folex said:


> New and improved sony card. Now with racing stripes for an added 35hp and a flux capacitor so it can go back in time.


 
 Flawless.


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## abvolt

Sorry but imo this is bs nice looking sd card but really who in there right mind would buy this at that price..


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## InsanityOne

abvolt said:


> Sorry but imo this is bs nice looking sd card but really who in there right mind would buy this at that price..


 
 I think we all kind of feel the same way. We will never truly know until multiple people test/review it though!


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## staceycope91

I think this was my favourite thread read today haha


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## Mooses9

feverfive said:


> Compared to the snake oil we've all seen in audiophile-land, this one doesn't even bother me.  With $1,000 being the price of entry for TOTL DAPs, I think I am now desensitized to pricing.  That is not to say I'll necessarily buy what the vendors & selling. I'm just no longer surprised.




This is true but some of these daps have dacs and amps that hold validity and technology and research and development to yield their price point. Other things you can just see right through it. Technology that you can't actually show on paper the differences between one and another and the differences it yeilds. Just my opinion.


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## Currawong

The noise levels of individual components are taken into consideration when a product is designed, so I reckon it'd be interesting to try in a few DAPs for curiosity's sake. I'm equally doubtful how much difference it'd make though.


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## Ari33

Yes, way, way too expensive for a start. Snake oil? I'm not sure either way yet, I'd like to read a definative review using high end kit by someone with no afiliations to any companies before jumping to conclusions.
 I have read a few posts on here from a few who have claimed to hear an audible difference from a devices (Was it the colorfly C3?) onboard memory compared to listening to the same song from an SD card in the same device. I found that quite strange and put it down to jitter.. but then we aren't supposed to be able to hear that right?
 I now cant help wondering if noise from the SD card is what the difference was. :/


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## drummerben04

Sony claims the card will premium card will produce less electrical noise. I didn't know 1's and 0's were prone to noise haha!


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## NawiLlih

drummerben04 said:


> Sony claims the card will premium card will produce less electrical noise. I didn't know 1's and 0's were prone to noise haha!




They are if you process then really hard


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## KaminKevCrew

It would be interesting to see if anyone has a pair of AK240s, or something similar that they can test side by side, but have someone shuffle them around so they don't know which is which. (or better yet, have 3 of them, with two have the cheaper cards, and one have the new sony, so that they cant just say that one is different from another, they would have to have two that sound different from the other three.) 
  
 Anyone wanna jump down that rabbit hole? 
  
 (I think a fiio x1 or something would work just as well, but it might have a more audible noise floor/more variance between products.)


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## InsanityOne

kaminkevcrew said:


> It would be interesting to see if anyone has a pair of AK240s, or something similar that they can test side by side, but have someone shuffle them around so they don't know which is which. (or better yet, have 3 of them, with two have the cheaper cards, and one have the new sony, so that they cant just say that one is different from another, they would have to have two that sound different from the other three.)
> 
> Anyone wanna jump down that rabbit hole?
> 
> (I think a fiio x1 or something would work just as well, but it might have a more audible noise floor/more variance between products.)


 
 Now that would actually be a pretty good way to test! Now if only someone has three X1's or three AK 240's just sitting around...


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## cel4145

insanityone said:


> Now that would actually be a pretty good way to test! Now if only someone has three X1's or three AK 240's just sitting around...




Anyone who can afford to have three AK 240s sitting around won't be too concerned about whether Sony's new card measures better. They'll just buy it


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## InsanityOne

cel4145 said:


> Anyone who can afford to have three AK 240s sitting around won't be too concerned about whether Sony's new card measures better. They'll just buy it




That's so true. Hopefully someone does then!


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## stuartfang

...lost all my respect for Sony after this. Just can't take their crap anymore. Sony's going on my avoid list.


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## cel4145

stuartfang said:


> ...lost all my respect for Sony after this. Just can't take their crap anymore. Sony's going on my avoid list.




Sony's flash card crap has been going on for years. What about their proprietary memory sticks when everyone else moved to SD?


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## bikerboy94

It will give you much better sound than any other card out there. Worth 4 times the price if you have the right equipment.


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## stuartfang

cel4145 said:


> Sony's flash card crap has been going on for years. What about their proprietary memory sticks when everyone else moved to SD?


 
  
 Those weren't overpriced and served a much bigger community (PSP, CyberShot, etc.) than this audiophile-based gimmick.


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## PeterPenHK

looking forward to in-depth reviews on 1st April


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## Mad Max

Freaking Sony had a few too many mushrooms.


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## Decoy

Now, I do not believe that this could make a difference in sound quality, but there is more than just the flash storage on an SD card.  There is a flash memory controller that is powered when it is inserted into a device.  Unlike the passive memory cells, the controller is an active piece of silicon handling the IO.  So there is the possibility that the memory controller could be designed to have less noise.  A lot of people seem to be saying that the product is a farce because a flash card cannot produce noise, when in fact they can and do just like any other active computer component.  I don't think anyone would be able to hear the difference, but we should have our facts straight before mocking Sony.


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## NCSUZoSo

This is just like that old DDR2 SLI/CFX RAM that used to be on the market!!  That stuff sold out fast, lol.


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## AnakChan

A little necroposting.

 So this past weekend Fujiya had their usual Spring Festival and Sony was an exhibit naturally. On one little corner of their table they set up 2x ZX2s both having the same tracks. One has the standard 64GB Sony MicroSD, and the other had the PremiumSound MicroSD. I was requested to listen and judge for myself.

 I listened on their MDR-R10's and thought I heard a difference. So I switched to use my FitEar MH335DW-SRs instead and the difference is blatantly obvious. I don't know how, I don't know why, but this demo listening station was enough to convince me. If I still have a DAP I'd probably go out and pick up a couple of these MicroSD cards as at least to me that demonstration works.

 So I asked them what exactly is going on? I was thinking of increased transfer speed, maybe coating in their contacts, etc. Answer was no & no. In fact the card is even a little slower in transfer speed compared to other 64GBs. Apparently all SD Cards suffer from electronic noise (don't know what this means), and they've found a way to minimise it. I went on asking how (of course they won't say how), and what was the downstream impact....e.g. does it lower jitter, etc. They told me they're not certain (or maybe they know but it's too hard to explain in layman's terms) but the resulting effect of lowering electronic noise was a fuller, smoother, and micro-detailed sound.

 Throughout the whole Fujiya Show this past weekend I had various people asked me what I thought was the highlight/surprise/best thing I heard. To their surprise, this Sony Premium Sound experience was probably the shocker out of all exhibits I saw at the show. A real "to be heard to believe" moment.


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## Currawong

The closest thing I can imagine is this: When you put power into a circuit, to some degree it will generate RF or other noise which it will emit to the detriment of the components around it. That is why some manufacturers don't like making DAC/amps, as the DAC will produce enough noise to increase the distortion of the amp. I guess an SD card emits some degree of RF, possibly into the circuit it is connected to and Sony made one which doesn't emit as much.


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## cel4145

It is also possible that it's a flaw in the Sony ZX2 card reader, and that the card somehow performs better in that reader than the other card they were using.


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## gopanthersgo1

I'm not one to believe in lots of these audio products, but I feel like this may make a difference, I know on my clip plus when I load a song or seek through the SD card it does make some electronic noise for a second, and that it doesn't do so with the onboard flash, but that may just be due to bad shielding. I do thing it would make a difference in at least that case though, currently I'm using a 64GB Samsung Pro SD. (Got it for $35 on BF!) This Sony SD wouldn't be worth the price if it did fix this IMO, but to each their own.


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## interpolate

I think the Dre. Beats sound was the biggest known hype known to man and beast.


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## Ruben123

gopanthersgo1 said:


> I'm not one to believe in lots of these audio products, but I feel like this may make a difference, I know on my clip plus when I load a song or seek through the SD card it does make some electronic noise for a second, and that it doesn't do so with the onboard flash, but that may just be due to bad shielding. I do thing it would make a difference in at least that case though, currently I'm using a 64GB Samsung Pro SD. (Got it for $35 on BF!) This Sony SD wouldn't be worth the price if it did fix this IMO, but to each their own.


 

 That is the very slow CPU youre hearing. Has nothing to do with sd cards. By the way I hope many people here have enough common sense to not trap in Sony's trick If theyre so sure about it, explain how it works instead of keeping it to those vague explanations.


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## kaneman

Regardless of your opinion on the card; the reviews on Amazon.co.jp are riotous even through Google Translate.

It even heals tone deaf  daughter-in-laws.


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## bmichels

ruben123 said:


> That is the very slow CPU youre hearing. Has nothing to do with sd cards. By the way I hope many people here have enough common sense to not trap in Sony's trick If theyre so sure about it, explain how it works instead of keeping it to those vague explanations.


 
 Are you sure that for the demo they put the exact same quality music files on the SONY microSD card and on the other MicroSD ?


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## bmichels

another explanation for this Sony's Premium Sound MicroSD : just for the demo they put good high-res music files on the SONY microSD card and... lousy music files (of the same music) on the other MicroSD ?


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## jonstatt

kaneman said:


> Regardless of your opinion on the card; the reviews on Amazon.co.jp are riotous even through Google Translate.
> 
> It even heals tone deaf  daughter-in-laws.


 
  
 On the NW-ZX2 some SD cards create some RF that results in a faint noise when reading from it that you can hear through the IEMs, particularly when browsing the catalogue of files. I was very disappointed when I heard this on my Lexar 128GB card, so tended to try and organize my music so my more popular listens were on the internal memory to avoid this. The Sony SD card doesn't cause this when I try it. So I just wanted to point out that while talk of a memory card making music sound different is ridiculous to me, in the ZX2 it does eliminate an interference problem. It could be argued this is poor design on the ZX2 though.
  
 Similarly if, and I mean if, there is a sound difference between Black, Copper and regular finishes, it may point to weak design choices instead of some intentional wonderful achievement. There is a analogue circuitry from the DAC onwards, including of course a headphone amplifier built-in to the AK380. If it is being influenced by the materials around it, it may suggest an inherent weakness than a strength....and it just happens the copper one sounds "better". I have the AK380cu, mainly because i wanted something different....altlhough I am now regretting it because I am a perfectionist, and I have had two units with scratches on the top surface, and despite trying many polishes, the finish only stays looking good for a few days before starting to tarnish (I can't find anything that lasts).


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## piponi

Louis is poor victim of marketing.. Awfull result of misseducation. Sd card like ass is just a digital data carrier. Like a book for you. The way to pronounce the words of book is area of ​​responsibility of other "devices"

Отправлено с моего SM-N910C через Tapatalk


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## HiFiGuy528

I have the Samsung 64GB (better) + 128GB and Sandisk 200GB + AK380 + ZX2 so I'll give the them a listen and judge for myself.


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## TaylorDawe

jonstatt said:


> On the NW-ZX2 some SD cards create some RF that results in a faint noise when reading from it that you can hear through the IEMs, particularly when browsing the catalogue of files. I was very disappointed when I heard this on my Lexar 128GB card, so tended to try and organize my music so my more popular listens were on the internal memory to avoid this. The Sony SD card doesn't cause this when I try it. So I just wanted to point out that while talk of a memory card making music sound different is ridiculous to me, in the ZX2 it does eliminate an interference problem. It could be argued this is poor design on the ZX2 though.
> 
> Similarly if, and I mean if, there is a sound difference between Black, Copper and regular finishes, it may point to weak design choices instead of some intentional wonderful achievement. There is a analogue circuitry from the DAC onwards, including of course a headphone amplifier built-in to the AK380. If it is being influenced by the materials around it, it may suggest an inherent weakness than a strength....and it just happens the copper one sounds "better". I have the AK380cu, mainly because i wanted something different....altlhough I am now regretting it because I am a perfectionist, and I have had two units with scratches on the top surface, and despite trying many polishes, the finish only stays looking good for a few days before starting to tarnish (I can't find anything that lasts).


 
 Thank you for your level-headed comments.


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## fattycheesebeef

I guess different finishes may be due to material costs, hence the extravagant pricing?


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## Dillan

I'm starting to become absolutely convinced that Louis is joking with us literally. No disrespect if you're not, I just get mind blown by some of the beliefs you guys have. Maybe I am the crazy one..


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## TaylorDawe

dillan said:


> I'm starting to become absolutely convinced that Louis is joking with us literally. No disrespect if you're not, I just get mind blown by some of the beliefs you guys have. Maybe I am the crazy one..


 
 If you are, Dillan, then that makes two of us.


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## Dillan

jonstatt said:


> On the NW-ZX2 some SD cards create some RF that results in a faint noise when reading from it that you can hear through the IEMs, particularly when browsing the catalogue of files. I was very disappointed when I heard this on my Lexar 128GB card, so tended to try and organize my music so my more popular listens were on the internal memory to avoid this. The Sony SD card doesn't cause this when I try it. So I just wanted to point out that while talk of a memory card making music sound different is ridiculous to me, in the ZX2 it does eliminate an interference problem. It could be argued this is poor design on the ZX2 though.
> 
> Similarly if, and I mean if, there is a sound difference between Black, Copper and regular finishes, it may point to weak design choices instead of some intentional wonderful achievement. There is a analogue circuitry from the DAC onwards, including of course a headphone amplifier built-in to the AK380. If it is being influenced by the materials around it, it may suggest an inherent weakness than a strength....and it just happens the copper one sounds "better". I have the AK380cu, mainly because i wanted something different....altlhough I am now regretting it because I am a perfectionist, and I have had two units with scratches on the top surface, and despite trying many polishes, the finish only stays looking good for a few days before starting to tarnish (I can't find anything that lasts).


 

 The interference (EMI) issues are the only thing I can see that could audibly change the sound quality. That goes for the case material of the 380 as well as the SD card and even the USB cable arguments. Thats my professional opinion anyway. The only other argument I could see are poor quality control and they all sound different (not just because of their color). People say the black sounds darker, the copper sounds warmer.. maybe because your brain tells you that due to the color of the unit.. Even with cables.. "silver sounds brighter, copper sounds warmer".. they just literally go by the color and their brain tricks them into thinking they hear certain things.
  
 People should really double blind test the same tracks and try to be more down to earth. Also read audiophile myths and studies. You'll enjoy the music more in the long run and you'll probably save some money and make more educated decisions.


----------



## sonickarma

kiats said:


> Thanks for the heads up, Anakchan. Nice to have a level head on a crazy day in the world.


 
 One of the funniest things is to go to amazon japan find SR-64HXA:
  
https://www.amazon.co.jp/%E3%82%BD%E3%83%8B%E3%83%BC-microSDXC%E3%83%A1%E3%83%A2%E3%83%AA%E3%83%BC%E3%82%AB%E3%83%BC%E3%83%89-Class10-%E9%AB%98%E9%9F%B3%E8%B3%AA%E3%83%A2%E3%83%87%E3%83%AB-SR-64HXA/dp/B00TXWKC7W
  
 Then google translate - everyone is giving 5 stars and then sarcastically mentioning the miracles that the card performs. - Its hilarious - a snippit below,


----------



## Rei87

jonstatt said:


> On the NW-ZX2 some SD cards create some RF that results in a faint noise when reading from it that you can hear through the IEMs, particularly when browsing the catalogue of files. I was very disappointed when I heard this on my Lexar 128GB card, so tended to try and organize my music so my more popular listens were on the internal memory to avoid this. The Sony SD card doesn't cause this when I try it. So I just wanted to point out that while talk of a memory card making music sound different is ridiculous to me, in the ZX2 it does eliminate an interference problem. It could be argued this is poor design on the ZX2 though.
> 
> Similarly if, and I mean if, there is a sound difference between Black, Copper and regular finishes, it may point to weak design choices instead of some intentional wonderful achievement. There is a analogue circuitry from the DAC onwards, including of course a headphone amplifier built-in to the AK380. If it is being influenced by the materials around it, it may suggest an inherent weakness than a strength....and it just happens the copper one sounds "better". I have the AK380cu, mainly because i wanted something different....altlhough I am now regretting it because I am a perfectionist, and I have had two units with scratches on the top surface, and despite trying many polishes, the finish only stays looking good for a few days before starting to tarnish (I can't find anything that lasts).


 



 I really dont understand why people would protest statements without first hearing the actual product......I've heard it, and there are actual audible differences. I will not say that the sony card is 'better' because 'better' is highly contestable, but ther differences some cards present may push the sound presentation towards one that suits the listener, the opposite and make it worse, I understand that the thought of a potentially long journey in A/B SD cards is one most ppl will cringe at, and hence reject it. But still, it IS there.

 A shot of some SD cards that I happened to find around me in which my audio circle has spent time testing for sonic differences
 . 
  
   
 And as for the old argument of CU, Black and normal not sounding any different. AK may claim that it doesnt, but almsot everyone who has heard both units simultaneously will almsot certainly disagree. Is the CU better? Prehaps, but once again, because 'better' is highly subjective in audio, I'll refrain from making a subjective ranking. None the less, they are no doubt different.  

  

  


dillan said:


> People should really double blind test the same tracks and try to be more down to earth. Also read audiophile myths and studies. You'll enjoy the music more in the long run and you'll probably save some money and make more educated decisions.


 


I hope these pictures will suffice to show that we can, and have indeed carried out the necesssary tests? Or what's next? That it is a placebo effect because we sunk in so much money into this hobby that we intuitively sensed when gears were swapped during the blindfold test?


----------



## Dillan

I could certainly see EMI being reduced in both the copper 380 and the "audiophile grade" SD card.


----------



## Dillan

rei87 said:


> I really dont understand why people would protest statements without first hearing the actual product......I've heard it, and there are actual audible differences. I will not say that the sony card is 'better' because 'better' is highly contestable, but ther differences some cards present may push the sound presentation towards one that suits the listener, the opposite and make it worse, I understand that the thought of a potentially long journey in A/B SD cards is one most ppl will cringe at, and hence reject it. But still, it IS there.
> 
> A shot of some SD cards that I happened to find around me in which my audio circle has spent time testing for sonic differences
> .
> ...


 

 I just have a science and fact based personality and don't really give in to audiophile myths and claims. In my opinion its ruining the hobby. But each persons opinion is different and I respect that you might have went to an audio show and did a quick demo. iRiver probably does their quality assurance like they do their support (mediocre at best).. which might have something to do with everyone hearing different sound signatures with different colored devices.
  
 The copper is heavy and impractical for "real" portable use, as well as gets ugly prints and tarnished. Therefore it might make sense for others to keep an open mind before buying it because other people claim it "sounds better". It may shield more electromagnetic interference, thats the only argument I could see. Changing the color or the case isn't going to widen the soundstage or increase accuracy. If it helps with EMI, perhaps the internal components should've been made better in the first place to avoid that.
  
 Just my opinion!


----------



## Rei87

dillan said:


> I just have a science and fact based personality and don't really give in to audiophile myths and claims. In my opinion its ruining the hobby. But each persons opinion is different and I respect that you might have went to an audio show and did a quick demo. iRiver probably does their quality assurance like they do their support (mediocre at best).. which might have something to do with everyone hearing different sound signatures with different colored devices.
> 
> The copper is heavy and impractical for "real" portable use, as well as gets ugly prints and tarnished. Therefore it might make sense for others to keep an open mind before buying it because other people claim it "sounds better". It may shield more electromagnetic interference, thats the only argument I could see. Changing the color or the case isn't going to widen the soundstage or increase accuracy. If it helps with EMI, perhaps the internal components should've been made better in the first place to avoid that.
> 
> Just my opinion!


 


 I'm sorry, I did not go to an audio fest for a quick demo. Everything that you see in those pictures are personal units.  

 My uni major also demands a stringent research and statistical significance before I'll accept a result, but neither would I just ignore deviants and outliers which dont fall within the line without first seeking some form of explanation. Tons of ppl have heard a difference between models, I wish I hadn't, but I have. So therein lies my misfortune of sorts if you may. 

 But I thoroughly agree that there should not be a difference. But the fact of the matter is that, unfortunately there are less than subtle differences. I personally suspect that some of the components in the CU are different from the standard AK, but I'll only know at the end of the year when I send it to be stripped for modding, and then compare them side by side.


----------



## Dillan

rei87 said:


> I'm sorry, I did not go to an audio fest for a quick demo. Those are personal units.


 

 No need to apologize I still can respect someone else opinion, I just know that for me it's best to stay down to earth and believe in sound science and technology and fact. Its what I have done all my life, even professionally and it has gotten me quite far.
  
 Again - I tend to sway from opinion and focus on fact and things that are real and make sense.
  
 Good luck!


----------



## Rei87

dillan said:


> No need to apologize I still can respect someone else opinion, I just know that for me it's best to stay down to earth and believe in sound science and technology and fact. Its what I have done all my life, even professionally and it has gotten me quite far.
> 
> Again - I tend to sway from opinion and focus on fact and things that are real and make sense.
> 
> Good luck!


 


 Cheers. To each his own. 

 I'm just curious tho, have you demo-ed all 3 models?


----------



## Dillan

rei87 said:


> Cheers. To each his own.
> 
> I'm just curious tho, have you demo-ed all 3 models?


 
  
 I've briefly heard the Meteoric Titan, own the black and never heard the copper. Never double blind tested all 3 side by side. If I did, it is possible I would hear a difference. The difference wouldn't be because the different chassis put magic into the internals and made them sound better or worse though. It would be because Astell&Kern were inconsistent with their production and _all of them _sound different to each other. The other argument I make is the potentially faulty internals could be susceptible to EMI which certain materials could help with - this includes the SD cards.
  
 Some things I don't have to test if I look at the inner circuitry and have the specs laid out in front of me. If someone told me the rush of jumping out of a plane is good enough to not need a parachute because you could glide down on a rainbow then I probably would roll my eyes and still grab my parachute.
  
 I have never been one to think spending more money equals better audio quality, I would rather trust myself and my ability and my ears and I HATE being tricked.. which is the feeling I get when I hold the AK380, because frankly it isn't that impressive compared to other DAPs.
  
 Just my blunt honesty.
  
 Cheers


----------



## sawrym

rei87 said:


> I really dont understand why people would protest statements without first hearing the actual product......I've heard it, and there are actual audible differences. I will not say that the sony card is 'better' because 'better' is highly contestable, but ther differences some cards present may push the sound presentation towards one that suits the listener, the opposite and make it worse, I understand that the thought of a potentially long journey in A/B SD cards is one most ppl will cringe at, and hence reject it. But still, it IS there.
> 
> A shot of some SD cards that I happened to find around me in which my audio circle has spent time testing for sonic differences
> .
> ...


 
 I don't know about SD cards cause if there is a difference it probably won't matter to me as it is very small. 

 Similar it goes to AK380. Even there are differences between all versions they won't be huge. And like U said it's all about tastes and perspective. everybody has different expierience with audio equipment so my advice is: write about own impressions and stop making states that something is the best, cause i say so. Share our feelings and don't let brand, pricetag or somebody theory influence us too much.


----------



## Dillan

sawrym said:


> I don't know about SD cards cause if there is a difference it probably won't matter to me as it is very small.
> 
> Similar it goes to AK380. Even there are differences between all versions they won't be huge. And like U said it's all about tastes and perspective. everybody has different expierience with audio equipment so my advice write about own impressions and stop making states that something is the best cause i say so. Share our feelings and don't let brand, pricetag or somebodys theory influence us too much.


 

 I agree with you!
  
 Honestly at the end of the day, if you hear a difference or feel compelled that one thing is better to YOU, then go for it.. I will be happy for you! I just like playing devils advocate and I like helping people to think a little bit more. The brain is a funny thing and can trick you, and so can the clever marketing of these companies. I want to inform people as much as I can. The audiophile community is often laughed at by others for believing in things that aren't real. We need to make sure we keep our heads screwed on tight and show them and especially overpriced audio makers we mean business!


----------



## x RELIC x

louisarmstrong said:


> I tried using different SD cards and it seems that there is a major difference in SQ among different brands and volumes. I won't list them out yet, but for those who don't already have it, try the Samsung Evo+ 64GB card. You will be floored when you switch to it. *It affects the sound even if your songs are not stored in the card but in the unit's memory. The difference is just astonishing. *




This is what has me raising an eyebrow. :rolleyes:


----------



## warrior1975

x relic x said:


> This is what has me raising an eyebrow. :rolleyes:




Agreed. But if it does, maybe it has more to do with interference. 

How about without SD card? Any noticeable difference?


----------



## Dillan

Im led to believe Louis has supersonic inhuman hearing and perhaps borderline mind reading capabilities. If you were to paint his headphones a different color he would swear the change would put him directly in front of the artist singing.
  
 Edit: Just kidding Louis!


----------



## LouisArmstrong

No worries dude. As I said, everyone here knows what the science is and how things "should be", so there is no need to flash your scientific skepticism mind of Stephen Hawking here - all is moot until you actually go try and listen. It is just as ridiculous as buying a $3500/$4000 DAP in the first place - until you go and hear it.


----------



## Dillan

louisarmstrong said:


> No worries dude. As I said, everyone here knows what the science is and how things "should be", so there is no need to flash your scientific skepticism mind of Stephen Hawking here - all is moot until you actually go try and listen. It is just as ridiculous as buying a $3500/$4000 DAP in the first place - until you go and hear it.


 

 Best of the best of the best!


----------



## mysony1

anakchan said:


> I've moved all posts after the above to the Sony Premium Sound MicroSD thread.http://www.head-fi.org/t/755709/sony-releases-160-64-gb-sd-cards-marketed-for-premium-sound





I bought this sony premium card for my ak380 copper.

At first I was shock with the price of this card however after I used this and is really amaze me with the sound quality improvement compare with few number big branding sd card I used to own it.

Everything more focus especially clarity.

If you ask me how much does it improve my ak380 copper sound quality, I would said improve by 30%.

And is worth buying this before upgrading your earphone cable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## LouisArmstrong

Exactly. What surprised me even more is that different SD cards change not only the sound quality of the songs played from the SD card - but also those in internal storage. Definitely going to get the Sony one to see how much more improvement it can make. I am surprised at how many people wouldn't blink at buying a $3500 DAP yet would be concerned about the cost of these things. If we had paid the price for a player, that probably means we are trying to do anything to get the best SQ of an IEM, and passing up such a chance at a relatively small cost does not make any sense to me.


----------



## warrior1975

LouisArmstrong I agree with you in regards to the price and some people not willing to invest in a better SD card. If it improves the sound, excellent investment. I find the SD card improving the sound a lot easier to believe than a lot of other things, exception being how it effects the internal memory. I suppose it's possible if it's in there, again, based on it causing interference some how.


----------



## raypin

mysony1 said:


> I bought this sony premium card for my ak380 copper.
> 
> At first I was shock with the price of this card however after I used this and is really amaze me with the sound quality improvement compare with few number big branding sd card I used to own it.
> 
> ...


 
  
 mmm.....now, you've got my attention. I'm intrigued enough to place an order and hear for myself. At worst, I end up with a grossly overpriced memory card that is more durable than the ones I have been using (Sandisk).


----------



## Ruben123

dillan said:


> The interference (EMI) issues are the only thing I can see that could audibly change the sound quality. That goes for the case material of the 380 as well as the SD card and even the USB cable arguments. Thats my professional opinion anyway. The only other argument I could see are poor quality control and they all sound different (not just because of their color). People say the black sounds darker, the copper sounds warmer.. maybe because your brain tells you that due to the color of the unit.. Even with cables.. "silver sounds brighter, copper sounds warmer".. they just literally go by the color and their brain tricks them into thinking they hear certain things.
> 
> People should really double blind test the same tracks and try to be more down to earth. Also read audiophile myths and studies. You'll enjoy the music more in the long run and you'll probably save some money and make more educated decisions.




Dilan I've been trying to educate members of such AK, Pono, cable and amplifier threads for years, but is has no use. They will keep believe what they believe and disregard science when it doesn't fit their subjective interpretations. What i said few days ago: never having listened to an AK though i can perfectly predict how the different colours sound. Though I've been in great wars here when I advice a member NOT to buy that $500 headphone cable to make the sound just a bit colder. Or getting another DAP, amp etc. 
Just don't use common sense and science outside the science threads. It even is forbidden to talk about science, double blind tests etc outside of the science thread lol


----------



## bmichels

Even IF It sound better, problem Is that It's highest capacity Is 64Mb while we can now have 200Mb ( even 256 from Samsung).


----------



## haiku

One if not the biggest lesson to learn is, that there are no authorities when talking about what sounds best. It´s all about your subjective taste.
 If you get that, you have obtained the inner freedom to tweak the sound so that it sounds the best of the best of the best TO YOU!


----------



## mysony1

B





raypin said:


> mmm.....now, you've got my attention. I'm intrigued enough to place an order and hear for myself. At worst, I end up with a grossly overpriced memory card that is more durable than the ones I have been using (Sandisk).





You will not regret for this...


----------



## Rei87

ruben123 said:


> Dilan I've been trying to educate members of such AK, Pono, cable and amplifier threads for years, but is has no use. They will keep believe what they believe and disregard science when it doesn't fit their subjective interpretations. What i said few days ago: never having listened to an AK though i can perfectly predict how the different colours sound. Though I've been in great wars here when I advice a member NOT to buy that $500 headphone cable to make the sound just a bit colder. Or getting another DAP, amp etc.
> Just don't use common sense and science outside the science threads. It even is forbidden to talk about science, double blind tests etc outside of the science thread lol


 


 Except prehaps when said forum members have actually conducted double blind tests and are able to accurately and repeatedly identify components at a rate for it to be more than chance. Of couse, we didnt hit statistical significance (we dont have time to do 100 tests), but when u hit it every single time out of 20 odd tests, its pretty damn clear that you might have something going on.

 But heys, dont let that convince you. I'm sure that your innate beliefs will have already convinced you that its all BS, and that actual real world tests make little difference. 

 its one things to talk about science, but another to actually make a statement without actually testing it out for yourself.


----------



## Ruben123

rei87 said:


> Except prehaps when said forum members have actually conducted double blind tests and are able to accurately and repeatedly identify components at a rate for it to be more than chance. Of couse, we didnt hit statistical significance (we dont have time to do 100 tests), but when u hit it every single time out of 20 odd tests, its pretty damn clear that you might have something going on.
> 
> 
> But heys, dont let that convince you. I'm sure that your innate beliefs will have already convinced you that its all BS, and that actual real world tests make little difference.
> ...




Did you know 0.2 dB makes an perceptible difference? Blind testing is not everything.


----------



## cel4145

dillan said:


> The interference (EMI) issues are the only thing I can see that could audibly change the sound quality.




Makes sense. 

That ought to be pretty easy to test with the right signal testing equipment. I think I'll definitely wait until someone does that sort of testing before worrying about that myself though.


----------



## Rei87

ruben123 said:


> Did you know 0.2 dB makes an perceptible difference? Blind testing is not everything.


 


 Same player, same earphone, with friends who are willing to sit down and swap SD cards while you face a wall. I didn't know that .2db makes a perceptible difference, but if it said difference was in the SD card, then that too would be due to the difference in SD card too. 

 Because, as you have so strongly asserted a short while back, that science says that SD cards shouldnt matter, and hence by extension there shdn't be a .2 db difference to begin with....


 Still, I wonder, you must something more than a theoretical understanding to be so adamant on your stand. Care  to share? All I, and some others here, have are real world tests and listening experience.....I'm sure you have something else to add....


----------



## cel4145

rei87 said:


> Still, I wonder, you must something more than a theoretical understanding to be so adamant on your stand. Care  to share? All I, and some others here, have are real world tests and listening experience.....I'm sure you have something else to add....




Since you are so adamant about this, can you share the link to the Head-Fi thread with the tests you describe here:



rei87 said:


> Except prehaps when said forum members have actually conducted double blind tests and are able to accurately and repeatedly identify components at a rate for it to be more than chance.




Didn't see any evidence of that in this thread.


----------



## Overkill Red

Well, if anyone doesn't want their cards anymore/can't hear a difference and would like to let go of their wasted $160 investment, do let me know..!


----------



## AnakChan

rei87 said:


> I really dont understand why people would protest statements without first hearing the actual product......I've heard it, and there are actual audible differences. I will not say that the sony card is 'better' because 'better' is highly contestable, but ther differences some cards present may push the sound presentation towards one that suits the listener, the opposite and make it worse, I understand that the thought of a potentially long journey in A/B SD cards is one most ppl will cringe at, and hence reject it. But still, it IS there.
> 
> A shot of some SD cards that I happened to find around me in which my audio circle has spent time testing for sonic differences
> .
> ...


 
  
 And you bought your Sony card 2nd hand. You know, I've not seen them sold in e-earphone since then. I've been camping hoping to pick them up again . Agreed that the difference you heard of the Premium vs non wasn't necessarily deemed as "better".
  
 P.S. [OT]My AK380Cu looks small compared to your (then) new AK380 black.[/OT]


----------



## Rei87

anakchan said:


> And you bought your Sony card 2nd hand. You know, I've not seen them sold in e-earphone since then. I've been camping hoping to pick them up again . Agreed that the difference you heard of the Premium vs non wasn't necessarily deemed as "better".
> 
> P.S. [OT]My AK380Cu looks small compared to your (then) new AK380 black.[/OT]


 


 Heys its still new now....its been less than a month since I got it lol.....


----------



## mysony1

anakchan said:


> rei87 said:
> 
> 
> > I really dont understand why people would protest statements without first hearing the actual product......I've heard it, and there are actual audible differences. I will not say that the sony card is 'better' because 'better' is highly contestable, but ther differences some cards present may push the sound presentation towards one that suits the listener, the opposite and make it worse, I understand that the thought of a potentially long journey in A/B SD cards is one most ppl will cringe at, and hence reject it. But still, it IS there.
> ...





Totally agree


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jonstatt

On the Sony NW-ZX2, some SD cards generated quite a bit of electrical noise that transferred to the IEMs. You could hear it as a  buzz-buzz-buzz--------buzz-buzz-buzz very faintly as it was accessing the card. The stupidly expensive Sony one cured this. However I think the real fault is the ZX2 design for allowing this electrical noise to influence the analog circuitry.
  
 I think it is also worth mentioning that the difference in price between an AK380 and an AK380cu is not that much. In fact in the UK the Black and Copper versions retail for the same price with only the original "finish" being cheaper. Sony are releasing their copper premium walkman with a MASSIVE increase in price over the aluminum version!
  
 In general, I see less over-sell of snake oil by the Japanese than even some US companies (for example some ridiculously priced ethernet cable for audio purposes from a brand I won't mention). So maybe there really is something in the use of a copper chassis. However I wouldn't pay thousands extra for it as Sony are asking....


----------



## Ruben123

jonstatt said:


> On the Sony NW-ZX2, some SD cards generated quite a bit of electrical noise that transferred to the IEMs. You could hear it as a  buzz-buzz-buzz--------buzz-buzz-buzz very faintly as it was accessing the card. The stupidly expensive Sony one cured this. However I think the real fault is the ZX2 design for allowing this electrical noise to influence the analog circuitry.
> 
> I think it is also worth mentioning that the difference in price between an AK380 and an AK380cu is not that much. In fact in the UK the Black and Copper versions retail for the same price with only the original "finish" being cheaper. Sony are releasing their copper premium walkman with a MASSIVE increase in price over the aluminum version!
> 
> In general, I see less over-sell of snake oil by the Japanese than even some US companies (for example some ridiculously priced ethernet cable for audio purposes from a brand I won't mention). So maybe there really is something in the use of a copper chassis. However I wouldn't pay thousands extra for it as Sony are asking....




That actually has nothing to do with the SD card then, but is more of a design fault of the Sony device itself!


----------



## jonstatt

ruben123 said:


> That actually has nothing to do with the SD card then, but is more of a design fault of the Sony device itself!


 
  
 I agree! While I won't accuse Sony of going as far as creating a problem on purpose in order to then make a new product to fix it, a well designed walkman should adequately shield noise induced by the SD card and the reader. However, what Sony advertise as "improved" in their expensive card, is actually true....just you shouldn't need it!


----------



## 1note

Head-Fi is an amazing resource and influence on me in different ways, and the source of considerable enjoyment for me. I love this hobby.  After reading the absolutely enlightening Stax SR-L700 thread yesterday I went out and bought then today as what was described fitted exactly what I wanted.  And now after reading this thread I have just ordered 2 of these sound cards on principle. I can understand speculation and theorizing both ways and I think this is healthy and the fun of the hobby. But what I find objectionable is outright dismissal of something on the basis of one's own "scientific" view without hearing the cards. It reminds me of poor Dr Lister who was ridiculed for some 20-30 years and nearly thrown out of the British Medical Association for observing that he had a vastly improved patient survival rate after he operated with clean hands and clean clothing due to things floating around and on surfaces that could not be seen ie that the doctors of the day could not objectively determine existed. Admittedly this should have been more easy to verify due to actual statistical survival rates but why do we put something down that we have zero experience with? It has been my experience that anything but not everything can make a difference in hi-fi, sometimes good, sometimes bad. The proof is in eating the pudding.  I do not care whether I or others can or cannot explain something that apparently makes a difference to me.  I try and be open-minded but cautious given the massive price gouging that is now going on in our hobby in relation to many products that are mediocre cost wise or even rubbish.  But this does not mean I reject everything that I am not familiar with out of hand. Thanks for a informative thread and happy Mid-Autumn Festival!


----------



## haiku

On the AK380 thread one member made the recommendation to try the Samsung Evo+ MicroSD if one wants the best SQ. Mine arrived yesterday. I´m just baffled how this is possible, but the Samsung sounds so much better than the Sandisk I´ve used before. Maybe it´s the Samsung´s resistance against electro - magnetic radiation which makes the big difference. Anyway, my AK Dap sings so beautiful now, for me this is just jaw dropping. What an upgrade. Worth every penny imo.


----------



## HiFiGuy528

haiku said:


> On the AK380 thread one member made the recommendation to try the Samsung Evo+ MicroSD if one wants the best SQ. Mine arrived yesterday. I´m just baffled how this is possible, but the Samsung sounds so much better than the Sandisk I´ve used before. Maybe it´s the Samsung´s resistance against electro - magnetic radiation which makes the big difference. Anyway, my AK Dap sings so beautiful now, for me this is just jaw dropping. What an upgrade. Worth every penny imo.


 
  
 That was me and a few others.  Sammy has good micro-SD cards.


----------



## haiku

hifiguy528 said:


> That was me and a few others.  Sammy has good micro-SD cards.


 
  

 Thanks again, buddy. Great recommendation.


----------



## karloil

Now i want to try this out - IT Show is just around the corner and hopefully i get a good price for the Evo+. Just curious, i know it's a challenge to get the Sony card but has anyone tried the Pro and/or Pro+? Any feedback? Or should i just settle with the Evo+?


----------



## karloil

Yep, background sounds more 'silent', 'blacker' (for the lack of a better term) - I was once a cable non believer until i tried it - not this microSD topic has proved me wrong again!!!
  
 if you're a Sandisk user (like me), we just wasted our money and should have jumped to Samsung cards to start with.


----------



## Indrajit

karloil said:


> Yep, background sounds more 'silent', 'blacker' (for the lack of a better term) - I was once a cable non believer until i tried it - not this microSD topic has proved me wrong again!!!
> 
> if you're a Sandisk user (like me), we just wasted our money and should have jumped to Samsung cards to start with.



Hi i was reading this posts. I have a Cayin N3 music player and a sandisk memory card. I have a question - Does the samsung EVO plus sound better/cleaner compared to sandisk?


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## karloil

Indrajit said:


> Hi i was reading this posts. I have a Cayin N3 music player and a sandisk memory card. I have a question - Does the samsung EVO plus sound better/cleaner compared to sandisk?



my vote goes to Evo+ - they sound better in the sense that the background is more darker. So in some genres, it may bring some improvements to the rest of the frequency range.


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## Indrajit

Th


karloil said:


> my vote goes to Evo+ - they sound better in the sense that the background is more darker. So in some genres, it may bring some improvements to the rest of the frequency range.



Thanks


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## Indrajit

karloil said:


> my vote goes to Evo+ - they sound better in the sense that the background is more darker. So in some genres, it may bring some improvements to the rest of the frequency range.



Hi i tried a newly--arrived Evo+ with my N3 music player. I did not feel any differences in clarity or noise reduction through Evo. On the opposite i felt the old sandisk ultra class10 sounded slightly punchier and more revealing. So i wanted to ask if a memory card needs to be used for some time to perform at its optimum level as i am not getting any differences in the present ?


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## Indrajit

haiku said:


> On the AK380 thread one member made the recommendation to try the Samsung Evo+ MicroSD if one wants the best SQ. Mine arrived yesterday. I´m just baffled how this is possible, but the Samsung sounds so much better than the Sandisk I´ve used before. Maybe it´s the Samsung´s resistance against electro - magnetic radiation which makes the big difference. Anyway, my AK Dap sings so beautiful now, for me this is just jaw dropping. What an upgrade. Worth every penny imo.



Hi i tried a newly--arrived Evo+ with my N3 music player. I did not feel any differences in clarity or noise reduction through Evo. On the opposite i felt the old sandisk ultra class10 sounded slightly punchier and more revealing. So i wanted to ask if a memory card needs to be used for some time to perform at its optimum level as i am not getting any differences in the present ?


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