# Best Active Speakers



## sphinxvc

I started this thread looking for active speakers recommendations, now it's just a discussion thread, I'm open to any kind of speaker related discussion or speaker component discussion.


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## sphinxvc

-


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## eclipes

Swans M1s customs. Spot on at 1K but with shipping, its gonna go over. If not the Swans T200B, a level lower than the M1s at a price of 700$


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## mtkversion

KRK Rokit 10-3
   
  10" woofer, 4" midrange woofer & 1" tweeter (140watts total)
   
  Plenty of sound to fill a 12x10 room.
   
  I had a chance to listen to them at a Guitar Center about two weeks ago and neutral is the first word that came to mind.  I was in one of the listening rooms and closed the door but ambient noise still filtered in so I had to turn them up a bit louder than what I'd listen to them at home, but they had PLENTY of bass and still had a clear sound, no distortion.  If you want transparency these will fit the criteria ... and your budget.
   
  I don't know if they are 'reference' but Genelecs are what come to mind if you want reference quality ... but Genelecs are at a reference price range as well.


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## sphinxvc

Thanks for the recommendations, I've been doing some reading outside of head-fi too.
   
  Has anyone heard of Dynaudio active speakers?


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## Staal

The dynaudios are lovely (and Danish, woohoo!), but I find that the Adam A3/5/7X has a more neutral sound to 'em. Definitely worth checking out.


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## liamstrain

I prefer the Adam ARTist 5 for neutrality over the KRK or Dynaudio (they are what we use for audio mastering), but they are a bit over your budget. I have not done a side by side with the A5x. But if they are even close to the ARTist, they will be fantastic.


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## sphinxvc

^ Looks like those are $800.  Do all these speakers have FR graphs up somewhere?  Like a repository for FRs of speakers (similar to Innerfidelity?)


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## liamstrain

800 each. 
   
  I don't know of a stockpile of FR graphs anywhere.


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## sphinxvc

Ah, I found pairs for $1.2K at B&H.  They look good, I'll have to read up more on them once I get home.  Where does everyone stand on subs for music?  I've heard some say no sub marries well enough for music, and that you don't need a sub if your 2-channel set up is right.


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## Staal

I wouldn't be without one for recreational listening, as I'm into bass-heavy electronica. As long as it's not overpowering, it adds a nice depth. I like to think of it as the sub should be so transparent that you don't notice it's there until you turn it off.
   
  I'd advice against it for mastering and mixing though.


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## liamstrain

Quote: 





staal said:


> I'd advice against it for mastering and mixing though.


 


  +1000.


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## Nepenthe

I'm going with a small Hsu STF-1 sub mated with small Emotiva airmotiv4 active monitors (see other thread). If I were going for the airmotiv6s or something in the 7 or 8 inch woofer range, or something that clawed down into the high 30s -3dB, I might forego the sub but I think this will be a good little combo.
   
  My listening will be purely for enjoyment at my home office desk.


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## liamstrain

Those Airmotiv6 look to have pretty good frequency response, especially for the price ... I'd be curious to hear them.


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## sphinxvc

Quote:


liamstrain said:


> I prefer the Adam ARTist 5 for neutrality over the KRK or Dynaudio (they are what we use for audio mastering), but they are a bit over your budget. I have not done a side by side with the A5x. But if they are even close to the ARTist, they will be fantastic.


 

 Liamstrain, do you have any more information on this you could share?  Seems like you have first hand experience with them.  Hard to find much on google in reviews or graphs.  I was able to dig up a video in german, it didn't help much.
   
  When you listen to the Artist 5s, do you feel a lack of sub-bass or bass?  My room acoustics won't be ideal probably, but I don't want to have to go out and buy a sub because of that.
   
  How "nearfield" are these?  What's distance do you listen at and what's the ideal distance would you say?
   
  Lastly, what are your preferences?  Or, better yet, what headphones do you like & what don't you like?


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## jenneth

Just to throw a few more suggestions-- Focal CMS65 / Solo6 Be, and Genelec 8040A (the latter two cost a bit more than $1.5K, but if you're lucky you might be able to get an used pair for that price).
  
  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Where does everyone stand on subs for music?  I've heard some say no sub marries well enough for music, and that you don't need a sub if your 2-channel set up is right.


 

 That really depends on the kind of monitors you have and the kind of music you listen to. Personally, I don't think it's necessary, but that's just me.


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## liamstrain

Quote: 





> When you listen to the Artist 5s, do you feel a lack of sub-bass or bass?


 
   
   
  Not particularly, no. But for most of my usage, sub bass is not an issue anyway (not in the mix). Bass (aside from sub-bass) is well represented in general. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> My room acoustics won't be ideal probably, but I don't want to have to go out and buy a sub because of that.


 
   
   
   
  Ours are not either. But a few sound absorbing panels go a long way. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> How "nearfield" are these?  What's distance do you listen at and what's the ideal distance would you say?


 
   
   
   
  Not sure I can say. For my use of them, they are at my mixing station in studio. I have them roughly 1m away, and 1.5 m apart, with a 30 degree toe in. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> Lastly, what are your preferences?  Or, better yet, what headphones do you like & what don't you like?


 
   
   
  Sound wise. I tend to gravitate towards mid and high centric cans, with lots of detail. I do my headphone mastering with a set of EQ'd AKG K702. For pleasure listening, I use the 702, Grado 225, Sennheiser 600. I did not like the Senn 650 as much, but I did enjoy the 595 and 555. I have never found an ultrasone I could stand. And as much as I wanted to like them, I didn't enjoy the Denon 2000 or 5000. I've not tried any of the AT's. 

 We also use K240 and 271 AKGs in studio, but outside of that purpose, I've never really compared them for pleasure listening.


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## sphinxvc

Quote:


jenneth said:


> Just to throw a few more suggestions-- Focal CMS65 / Solo6 Be, and Genelec 8040A (the latter two cost a bit more than $1.5K, but if you're lucky you might be able to get an used pair for that price).
> 
> 
> That really depends on the kind of monitors you have and the kind of music you listen to. Personally, I don't think it's necessary, but that's just me.


 
   
  Thanks for the additional names.  So how do you like your Genelecs, especially compared to your previous K+Hs and other monitors?


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## sphinxvc

Liamstrain, thanks for all the additional details, really helps.


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## jenneth

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Thanks for the additional names.  So how do you like your Genelecs, especially compared to your previous K+Hs and other monitors?


 

  
  I like my Genelecs quite a bit; they have a very balanced sound, a very smooth top, & a pretty nice low-end. My biggest issue with the K+H O110 is that they are simply too small to have enough bass for my taste.


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## brasewel

Why do you want to spend $1.5k on actives in the first place? I thought your budget was around $500 which is why I suggested actives to you. At that price you might as well take the route I did.
   
  As far as a subwoofer goes, it all depends where your speakers roll off. If you have speakers that roll off below 40-45hz, you don't really need one. However, I thought the addition of a sub did a world of good(mine roll off at 45hz). If you have speakers that roll off at 60-65hz you definitely require one. I would suggest getting a top notch sealed sub(Epik Empire or Rhythmik F12/F15) if you plan on getting one.


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## sphinxvc

Quote:


brasewel said:


> Why do you want to spend $1.5k on actives in the first place? I thought your budget was around $500 which is why I suggested actives to you. At that price you might as well take the route I did.


 

 Re actives, why wouldn't you recommend them?  Is it just the flexibility of passives?  Of being able to swap amps? 
   
   
  Quote:


brasewel said:


> As far as a subwoofer goes, it all depends where your speakers roll off. If you have speakers that roll off below 40-45hz, you don't really need one. However, I thought the addition of a sub did a world of good(mine roll off at 45hz). If you have speakers that roll off at 60-65hz you definitely require one. I would suggest getting a top notch sealed sub(Epik Empire or Rhythmik F12/F15) if you plan on getting one.


 
   
  I'll keep that in mind.  
   
  There's a Dale Pro Audio store in Manhattan, and I'll probably visit soon to listen to some of these Genelecs, etc.  Probably hit up Stereo Exchange too.


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## brasewel

If you don't have a proper room and can't play the speakers loud it's not worth spending that much. I suggest you get something between $300-$500 and a cheap Rotel or Hafler power amp. You get great passive speakers in that price range that would handily beat any headphone.


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## cifani090

@*s*phinxvc , what do you like? Bright sounding music, warm, analytical,etc? Also are you willing to go vintage... you are willing to go used?


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## sphinxvc

I'm not willing to go vintage, but I'm willing to go used.  I've had a bad experience with a vintage receiver before.  I like my warranties too.


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## sphinxvc

Unless of course I decide to go for panel speakers, because as far as I'm aware there aren't any panel actives.


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## brasewel

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> I'm not willing to go vintage, but I'm willing to go used.  I've had a bad experience with a vintage receiver before.  I like my warranties too.  For preferences, I'm into a smooth sound top to bottom and a flat FR.  I find that generally will do justice to the most genres, and would probably be the most transparent.  Basically nothin taken away or added.
> 
> Re passives, I still don't quite get it, unless any passive+power amp combo at a given price would always outperform actives of the same price, then I can't see any reason not to get actives for simplicity's sake.


 

 Passives + pre/power always outperform actives at the same price. Actives are great if you want simplicity, thats all.


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## Jaywalk3r

brasewel said:


> Passives + pre/power always outperform actives at the same price. Actives are great if you want simplicity, thats all.




Not always. I have some powered Boston Acoustics that listed for ~$100 about ten years ago. They sound WAY better than any $100 pair of passive speakers I've ever encountered. Heck, they sound better than any $200 pair of speakers I've ever encountered, and better than some $300-$400 pairs. (Where they fall short is max volume; they'll never win any loudness contest, but that's not important to me.) It's fair to say that $100 passive speaker pair and amp combo would be seriously outclassed.

I've never listened to any $1500 active speakers (in general I'm a fan of passives), but your absolute statement isn't true at at least some lower price points.


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## brasewel

Quote: 





jaywalk3r said:


> Not always. I have some powered Boston Acoustics that listed for ~$100 about ten years ago. They sound WAY better than any $100 pair of passive speakers I've ever encountered. Heck, they sound better than any $200 pair of speakers I've ever encountered, and better than some $300-$400 pairs. (Where they fall short is max volume; they'll never win any loudness contest, but that's not important to me.) It's fair to say that $100 passive speaker pair and amp combo would be seriously outclassed.
> I've never listened to any $1500 active speakers (in general I'm a fan of passives), but your absolute statement isn't true at at least some lower price points.


 

 Agreed, there are always exceptions. But in general you will be hard pressed to beat passives at any price point especially considering how expensive actives can get. Decent new active speakers cost over a grand and at that price you can get some seriously good passives.


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## sphinxvc

Quote:


brasewel said:


> Agreed, there are always exceptions. But in general you will be hard pressed to beat passives at any price point especially considering how expensive actives can get. Decent new active speakers cost over a grand and at that price you can get some seriously good passives.


 

 I'm heading over to Stereo Exchange in Manhattan in the afternoon today, so I'll ask the sales people for their opinion too (of course that's probably not the most reliable source of information, but it will add to the list of viewpoints to consider).  I'm sure they will push separates.  That's surprising to hear that passives _plus_ matching amp will outperform actives of the same budget.  Part of me just wants to avoid drooling over class-A Pass Labs & Krell amplifiers in the future.


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## brasewel

You don't need to get those outrageous amps. My $150 60W Rotel is great. You won't need anything more powerful unless you have inefficient speakers(<85db) or need to play really loud.


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## Somnambulist

I'd take the Focal Solo BE or Twin BE, Event Opals etc over 95% of passive bookshelf speakers for near to mid field application. Once you're sitting past a certain point and in a room of a certain size then you get into floorstanding/full range speakers and unfortunately for stereo hifi there's not that much to choose from with actives (the cynic in me says that active crossovers are better than passive, but you can make more money selling speakers + amps). For cheaper speakers than those you can probably get more passive speaker for your buck in terms of size/power etc, but then they're usually not designed for nearfield listening and you're paying for aesthetics as well, where as actives tend to be rather plain as they're meant to do a job in a professional environment rather than looking pretty in a listening room.


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## liamstrain

Quote: 





brasewel said:


> You don't need to get those outrageous amps. My $150 60W Rotel is great. You won't need anything more powerful unless you have inefficient speakers(<85db) or need to play really loud.


 


  I've never found a rotel under $600 (the RA-1062). Which model are you referencing? Is it a straight power amp or an integrated?


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## liamstrain

My edit is not showing up. Lowest price I can find for a new rotel amp: $600 (the RA-1062).


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## brasewel

Quote: 





liamstrain said:


> I've never found a rotel under $600 (the RA-1062). Which model are you referencing? Is it a straight power amp or an integrated?


 

 I'm talking used not new. I have a RB-970BX 60W @ 8Ohms that is a very musical amp and has enough power to drive my speakers.


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## liamstrain

Ah - I didn't know we were contemplating used. That does make a difference. Some good NAD amps that would do the job too (3020 or 314). You don't need much juice in a small room for the most part. 
   
  I know my old 40W McIntosh can put out some impressive sound.


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## Mauricio

Quote: 





somnambulist said:


> I'd take the Focal Solo BE or Twin BE, Event Opals etc over 95% of passive bookshelf speakers for near to mid field application.


 


  Amen to that, brotha'!  Make that 98%.


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## The8thst

sphinxvc said:


> For preferences, I'm into a smooth sound top to bottom and a flat FR.  I find that generally will do justice to the most genres, and would probably be the most transparent.  Basically nothin taken away or added.
> 
> Re passives, I still don't quite get it, unless any passive+power amp combo at a given price would always outperform actives of the same price, then I can't see any reason not to get actives for simplicity's sake.




Genelec, Adam, Dyn are the three brands I would recommend for the above sound signature. The Genelec and Adam will be a bit more analytical than the Dyns since they are purpose built for critical listening applications. The Dyn and Genelec are the most forgiving of the 3. All excellent active monitors.

I tend to like actives for monitoring and passives for pleasure listening. The active speakers can perfectly match the power amp sections to each driver and perfectly adjust the EQ and FR to give you the most uncolored and flat FR possible. This is GREAT for mixing, tracking, and mastering but is not always the most enjoyable for casual listening. Budget conscious actives also have a huge hurdle because they have to build both the amps+speakers+crossovers all to hit a single price point. How do you choose which corners to cut when you come in $10 over your manufacturing budget? The last argument against actives for casual listening is that they are a single package. You get what you get and there are no simple upgrade paths other than selling the whole bundle and buying a new pair.

Passive speakers are much more flexible because each piece of the puzzle is built and engineered to it's own price point. It also offers many different upgrade paths to tailor or improve the sound. You can get great sounding used power amps for cheap (Soundcraftsmen, NAD, Carver, Rotel, etc) and a huge array of speaker options. Plus you get to decide which corners to cut in order to meet your overall system budget.

Here is one example of an outstanding power amp that will drive just about any speakers in your budget for less than $150:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Soundcraftsmen-Power-Amplifier-MA5002-Vintage-Original-owner-1978-1979-model-/270948774380?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item3f15ce31ec

That leaves you $1300 to spend on used speakers. Here are a few options that will kill any actives in their price range (assuming you have room for full range towers):
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/focal-814v-like-new--3
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/revel-performa-f30-floorstanding-speakers
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/paradigm-reference-studio-100-v4
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/tyler-tylo-ref-system-ii-ref-system-ii--2

The Revel's and Focal's are probably the flattest response and best deal of the 4. The Tyler comes in 3rd place and Paradigm last, but they all sound great.


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## eugenius

Just get the best Klein&Hummel you can afford.
   
  Bonus if you can afford a pair of glossy white O300d.


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## Mauricio

Didn't K&H disappear and morph into Neumann?
   
  I agree.  While the passive fan boyz are busy with upgrading and tweaking to no end their brutish monoblocks and multi-driver speaker monstrosities, with their bigger is better, might-makes-right system philosophy, I am content to cut to the chase now with a high quality two-way active.


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## eugenius

yes, neumann kh120d/o300d + kh810 beats 99% of home stereo systems


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## Photogeo180

The good news is that you live in the States.[size=8pt][/size]
The even better news is that there are so many sellers who offer a trial / return period for their products.[size=8pt][/size]
Given that every single room is a totally different sound environment my suggestion would be, on condition you have the time for it, try as many as you can before deciding.[size=8pt][/size]
You know, at the end of the day  it’s about YOUR source, music, cables, room and ears….[size=8pt][/size]
Now that you’ve got all the specific suggestions about models, types etc it’s time to remember that the proof of the pudding is in the eating


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## sphinxvc

I kind of forgot about this thread.  
   
  Never updated after my visit to the hifi shop in January.  So I had two trips to Stereo Exchange, the first was dismal: I listened in a room with some $6K full-size speakers (I forget the brand).  It had an all Ayre rack behind it that was probably worth $10K.  I was totally unimpressed and the net sound of the system...wasn't all that much better than my LCD-2s.  Since I didn't have $16K to spend anyway, I lost some interest.
   
  Then I visited again a couple of weeks later and tried a pair of Devore Fidelity bookshelves driven by some boutique $6K integrated.  I can't remember exactly, but it might have been a Bel Canto DAC as the source.  This room just blew me away.  Holographic soundstage, full presence, all the merits of speaker listening.  But the speakers were $4K and again, far out of my budget at the moment. 
   
  I've spent a fair amount of money since then, so my budget is down to sub $1K for both speakers and amplifiers (if they are not actives).
   
  I'll post an illustration of my listening space later.


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## Zulkr9

what about emotiva airmotiv series read some good things about them !


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## sphinxvc

This problem has solved itself, kind of - a friend gave me a pair of Mordaunt Short speakers and a Creek CAS 4040 integrated to keep.  It's vintage equipment and I have yet to test it out.


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## customNuts

I'm in the same position. I had Tannoy Arena 5.1 with Marantz NR1501 which I'm selling so I can get some actives. I want something pretty compact and can spent $1-2g. With the reading I've done I am leaning towards the Neumann KH-120's. I want something very detailed and accurate but also with some musicality. It will be running off my Audio Gd Ref 7.1 & Master 5 Preamp.
   
  Sound like I'm on the right track?? 
   
  Or what about Event BAS 20/20's??
   
  Any help would be appreciated.


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## sphinxvc

I still have an eye on this as well.  The Mordaunt short speakers I have are a little bright up top and the Creek amplifier seems to be shot (it sounds terrible).  I know it's had a few caps replaced recently but it doesn't seem to have helped.  Moreover, there's a crossover network in the speaker that might have caps leaking, it's been 20+ years so I wouldn't be surprised.
   
  So between opening up the speakers, checking for leaking caps, and getting an amp as an experiment to this problem, OR getting actives, I'm still undecided.  
   
  In any case Customnuts, I'm curious to see what others recommend you.  I think after all the research I did, if I did go for a pair of sub $2K actives, it would either be K&H/Neumann or Genelecs probably.


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## customNuts

I should also mention that these will be purely for listening pleasure at my desk & not mixing.


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## Mauricio

My top picks at around $1,500:

 Focal CMS 65
 Neuman KH120


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## customNuts

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> My top picks at around $1,500:
> 
> Focal CMS 65
> Neuman KH120


 
  Thanks Mauricio, & would you have a preference between the two?
  & what about a pref between KH120 & Solo 6be??


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## Lenni

Quote: 





customnuts said:


> Thanks Mauricio, & would you have a preference between the two?
> & what about a pref between KH120 & Solo 6be??


 
   
  if you don't mind me asking, I wonder whether these preferences are based on having auditioned these "top" speakers, or on something else. I think it should be mentioned...


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## Mauricio

I have heard the Focal CMS 65 on a couple of occassions in a studio setting.  The sole authorized Focal dealer in Indonesia is primarily a recording/mixing/mastering studio so I got to hear them in situ.  I've also heard the Solo6 Be, but I would not dare insult your intelligence or presume to be immune to cognitive bias with a comparison between the two Focal monitors because the listening arrangment between the two was different.  What I can tell you is that the CMS 65 look very cool in a modern, industrial way with their all cast-aluminium enclosure while the Solo6 Be look gorgeous and look the part with their wood side paneling and taut build.
   
  I have not heard the Neumann KH120.  One reason is that they are relatively new, but they seem to be garnering accolades on the pro/studio fora.  I would opt for the Focal CMS 65 simply because the accompanying Neumann subwoofer sells at an astronomical price due to its 5.1 (or is it 7.1) capabilities which I will never need  Another reason is that the Focal, with its 6.5" driver, likely has a deeper bass extension that could allay the immediate purchase of the subwoofer.
   
  Having said that, my dream transportable, minimalist audiophile setup would be built on the basis of the Neumann KH120*D* (with a built-in DAC):
   
   
   
   
​  ​  ​


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## AVU

All the artists I know use Genelecs, but when I borrowed a friend's tiny ones the other week for something, they struck me as massively underpowered without a subwoofer.  Maybe it's just a matter of taste, but if you want a big sound, I would not go for those tiny actives.  I think the larger K&H or Genelecs sound amazing, but those are perhaps $10k for two.  Still probably a good deal considering all you're getting, but sort of illustrates why Head-Fi came into existence in the first place: headphone systems give you similar quality at less than 1/5 the price.


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## sphinxvc

avu said:


> All the artists I know use Genelecs, but when I borrowed a friend's tiny ones the other week for something, they struck me as massively underpowered without a subwoofer.  Maybe it's just a matter of taste, but if you want a big sound, I would not go for those tiny actives.  I think the larger K&H or Genelecs sound amazing, but those are perhaps $10k for two.  Still probably a good deal considering all you're getting, but sort of illustrates why Head-Fi came into existence in the first place: headphone systems give you similar quality at less than 1/5 the price.




We're you listening near field?


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## Mauricio

Quote: 





avu said:


> headphone systems give you similar quality at less than 1/5 the price.


 
   
  Apples and oranges.  I know of no headphone that can render a stereo soundstage and imaging like a pair of speakers/monitors.  I know of no headphone that can give one the visceral impact of deep bass.  I know of no headphone that has as neutral and balanced a frequency response as many speakers/monitors.  Apples and bicycles, really.


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## Mauricio

There's Genelecs and then there's Genelecs.  The really good Genelec stuff starts around $2,000/pair.  Don't waste your money on Genelec below that price floor.


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## customNuts

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> I have heard the Focal CMS 65 on a couple of occassions in a studio setting.  The sole authorized Focal dealer in Indonesia is primarily a recording/mixing/mastering studio so I got to hear them in situ.  I've also heard the Solo6 Be, but I would not dare insult your intelligence or presume to be immune to cognitive bias with a comparison between the two Focal monitors because the listening arrangment between the two was different.  What I can tell you is that the CMS 65 look very cool in a modern, industrial way with their all cast-aluminium enclosure while the Solo6 Be look gorgeous and look the part with their wood side paneling and taut build.
> 
> I have not heard the Neumann KH120.  One reason is that they are relatively new, but they seem to be garnering accolades on the pro/studio fora.  I would opt for the Focal CMS 65 simply because the accompanying Neumann subwoofer sells at an astronomical price due to its 5.1 (or is it 7.1) capabilities which I will never need  Another reason is that the Focal, with its 6.5" driver, likely has a deeper bass extension that could allay the immediate purchase of the subwoofer.
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks so much for all the info Mauricio. Everything your saying augments the multitude of reviews I've read. 
  If I had a dedicated room with some treatment & an ideal desk, I would definitely go for the focals - probably all the way to the solo 6be as truth be told - I'm smitten. 
  But my needs are basically really hi-end multimedia speakers ie run from my balanced dac at my computer for when headphones are tiring. I wanted something small with great sound that didn't need a sub unless for big-deep bass which is over kill for my room/house.
  So I am leaning toward the kh120 - I just wish I could hear them. Might have to make a trip to Brisbane.


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## The8thst

mauricio said:


> There's Genelecs and then there's Genelecs.  The really good Genelec stuff starts around $2,000/pair.  Don't waste your money on Genelec below that price floor.



Agree 1000%

The real Genelecs would fit your requirements perfectly, but are out of your price range. Maybe try to find a pair of used Genelecs since there project studios are always getting shut down these days.

I do have to point out that I am basing this opinion on many many hours of listening to a pair of Genelec 1032A monitors which list for around $2400 (each).
You might also be able to find some Adam S2X monitors used for your price range. I think the X-Art ribbon tweeters are phenomenal.
The Dynaudio BM15A's are about $1200 (each) and are very musical. Just make sure to get matching left and right models because they are not the same.


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## mac336

I'm looking for a whole setup (speakers, amp, DAC, whatever else I need) for around 1,500.  Some questions I have:
   
  Are high end reference/monitors a good option even if the majority of your library isnt highest quality (upwards of 192kbps) ?
   
  Would you recommend buying a pair of speakers of is a single sound good on its own?
   
  any speaker recommendations would be appreciated also


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## Mauricio

The first step should be to upgrade your library to 16/44.


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## mac336

sorry for ignorance, but can you explain to me what exactly 16/44 is and how I would go about upgrading


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## AVU

Agreed with everybody about the Genelec price floor.
   
  And yes, apples and oranges, and bicycles, or whatever.  But, c'mon, you can say that about a lot.  I mean, I'd like the experience of standing 10ft away from a 8ft tall bass cabinet with 50,000 watts please.  You're not going to get a home stereo to do that at any price range.  It's a unique experience.  Personally, I didn't like the small near-fields as much as I did my JH13s.  But yes, if I had my own medium-sized room, and a $5000 for speakers, I'd get a nice pair of genelecs any day.


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## wberghofer

Quote: 





mac336 said:


> but can you explain to me what exactly 16/44 is and how I would go about upgrading



  
 It’s typical insider jargon for digital audio with a bit depth of 16 bits per sample and a sampling rate of 44.1 kHz per second. These are the parameters used on standard audio CDs, also known as “red book audio”. Don’t worry about upgrading to higher resolution playback, since I’m pretty sure you’re part of the population’s 99.999 percent which will not be able to detect any difference. See → this thread for more details about one of the most popular digital audio myths.
  
 I don’t appreciate the prevalent use of insider jargon on this and other similar forums, since doing so makes it very difficult for interested “outsiders” to understand what the enlightened, cool dudes are talking about, and it is certainly an indicator for lack of respect and empathy for others.
  
 Werner.


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## Losingedge

Just stating my opinion: genelecs all the way in the ~1000euro price class.


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## Mauricio

Is the proposition that the differences between 192kbps and RedBook are not audible?


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## mac336

ok, so does anyone have any recommendations on active speakers?
   
  looking for some for casual listening on my pc.......budget $1,000


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## sphinxvc

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> Is the proposition that the differences between 192kbps and RedBook are not audible?


 
   
  No one said anything of the kind.  
   
  Quote: 





mac336 said:


> ok, so does anyone have any recommendations on active speakers?
> 
> looking for some for casual listening on my pc.......budget $1,000


 
   
  If you look earlier in this thread, there are a lot of recommendations in that price range.


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## estreeter

The only thing I can add to this thread is that those who want actives for nearfield use really need to check out come of the YouTube vids to get an idea of just how much bigger a speaker with an 8-inch woofer is over one with a 5-inch woofer - I know there is more to it than that, but I was blown away by how  *huge* the Rokit 8s seem after the 5-inch Yamaha's in one of the comparison vids. Seeing reference to upcoming 15-inch models below one of the vids completely does my head in - outside of a studio, who would think of using such a monster on a desktop, just a couple of feet from your ears ? I only say this because many head-fiers strike me as 'moar power' junkies, particularly when it comes to bass impact. If that isnt you, fine - accept my apologies and be on your way, good sir ! 
   
  On the earlier point re power output, some of the JBL powered stage monitors would send you to hospital, with permanent hearing damage, in the wrong hands. Not my idea of a good  time, but they weren't designed for muppets needing a pair of nearfield monitors. As Lionel Hutz would say, I rest my case.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Your *Chief Muppet* and Bottlewasher, estreeter


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## Staal

So, I went to an audio store and auditioned the Adam A7X and Focal CMS 65 the other day. I liked the CMS 65 much more than the A7X. 
   
  Before I go out and pick up a pair of CMS 65, are there any other speakers I should look into? I'm looking for a set of actives that'll be somewhat neutral and analytical while still attaining a slight bass emphasis. They'll be used solely for listening near field and playing "up the room" which is 18 square meters on occasion, when I have company over. I don't intend on getting a sub, which is why I want the speakers to be able to present a bit of "oomph" by themselves. I'll be listening to electronica most of the time and my budget is around $2000. 
   
  Any and all help is much appreciated.


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## Mauricio

There were suggestions at Gearslutz that the Focal CMS line was a flash in the pan, a flavour of the day monitor, but the accolades and positive feedback just keep on rolling in.  Me thinks they are the real monty.  So much so that I too plan to get a pair of CMS65 within the next six weeks.
   
  You might wish to audition to the *Dynaudio BM12*,($2,000/pair) but I think you should just go with the CMS65 and pocket the $400 difference.


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## Staal

I haven't found a place to audition those yet, and I don't really like the look of those speakers. It's a real shame though, because Dynaudio is Danish just like me and I'd love nothing more than to support a local business. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Think it's gonna be the CMS 65 and then hoping I won't feel the need to get a sub at some point.


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## estreeter

Quote: 





staal said:


> So, I went to an audio store and auditioned the Adam A7X and Focal CMS 65 the other day. I liked the CMS 65 much more than the A7X.
> 
> Before I go out and pick up a pair of CMS 65, are there any other speakers I should look into? I'm looking for a set of actives that'll be somewhat neutral and analytical while still attaining a slight bass emphasis. They'll be used solely for listening near field and playing "up the room" which is 18 square meters on occasion, when I have company over. I don't intend on getting a sub, which is why I want the speakers to be able to present a bit of "oomph" by themselves. I'll be listening to electronica most of the time and my budget is around $2000.
> 
> Any and all help is much appreciated.


 
   
  May I ask for more detail re your sources/music in the audition, good sir ? I dont have a dog in this fight, but I know that others will stagger into this thread in 6 months time and wonder the very same thing.


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## customNuts

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> There were suggestions at Gearslutz that the Focal CMS line was a flash in the pan, a flavour of the day monitor, but the accolades and positive feedback just keep on rolling in.  Me thinks they are the real monty.  So much so that I too plan to get a pair of CMS65 within the next six weeks.
> 
> You might wish to audition to the *Dynaudio BM12*,($2,000/pair) but I think you should just go with the CMS65 and pocket the $400 difference.


 
  Hey Mauricio, what about the Quad 11L/12L actives? Has anyone heard them and if so how they compare to similar priced studio monitors (especially KH120 or Focal cms 65)??


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## Mauricio

Don't know anything about Quad.  Sorry.


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## DaveBSC

Quote: 





mauricio said:


> You might wish to audition to the *Dynaudio BM12*,($2,000/pair) but I think you should just go with the CMS65 and pocket the $400 difference.


 
   
  I had BM12s for awhile, I thought they were pretty dull sounding, and I got my pair on eBay for $1200. They definitely aren't worth $2,000. I'm hoping to check out the Genelec 8040A soon to see how they compare. It's been awhile since I've heard the Dynaudios, but from my memory they were very soft and dark in the treble region, and didn't have much in the way of a soundstage, at least on a desk placement. It's possible that they would do better on stands with a few feet of space behind them.
   
  Genelec's new 8260A with the concentric midrange/tweeter design seems really interesting, but they're also $11K a pair!


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## estreeter

You're a braver man than I - buying speakers off e-bay. Granted, there are reputable sellers and there are shonks, but it seems like one piece of kit I would have to audition first.


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## DaveBSC

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> You're a braver man than I - buying speakers off e-bay. Granted, there are reputable sellers and there are shonks, but it seems like one piece of kit I would have to audition first.


 

 Active studio monitors are pretty rare on Audiogon, so eBay is usually the best place to find them. The buyer beware rule always applies, but I had no issues with the Dynaudios. They arrived in their original packaging as advertised without a scratch. I sold them on eBay for the same $1200 once I decided I didn't like them.


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## Hawaiiancerveza

Magnepan mini system.  Meant for desk top


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## tzjin

HK GLA-55 looks amazing. Mixed reviews though.


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## bonfirehay

The Neumann KH 120 are the new kids on the block and everyone says wonders about them.


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## customNuts

I bought the kh120's not long ago and I must say I'm really impressed. I am using them with my balanced dac as basically hi-end computer speakers if u will - 95% for music. I cant pump them too loud due to neighbours and I feel they deserve to be let loose more. They have some big gonads for small monitors.They pump. 
  I was worried they would be too linear/flat since they are monitors but fear not, these are really musical for a super accurate presentation.
  Highly recommended.


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## bonfirehay

And they are they are small


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## lukeahale

Quote: 





tzjin said:


> HK GLA-55 looks amazing. Mixed reviews though.


 
  I actually just ordered a refurbished pair from Harman for $499.  I did a lot of research, and they may not be worth the $999 new (I wouldn't have bought them at that price), but from what I have gleaned from the few reviews I have found, they should be pretty impressive at the $499 price I paid...at least I hope so.  Some reviews thought they were very much worth it at full price, and some thought it was not so much worth it. 
   
  I honestly think, and this is of course complete conjecture, that they probably didn't so much get a fair chance due to the knee-jerk reaction to this type of speaker... I mean honestly when looking at them many people will automatically just think "oh give me a break..." 
   
  I predict that I will find them to be quite impressive for what they are, and nothing more, but at least a good deal for the price I paid.  Hopefully I am surprised in a positive way.


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## tzjin

I got the impression that the most favorable reviews came from people who didn't have much to compare it to. The more experienced reviewers seemed to rate it well, but not amazingly. I do think they should sound very good for their price.

 Keep us updated!


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## lukeahale

Well, they have officially shipped, should be here by Thursday 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.  I have been doing more research, and I did find another positive review that's not really of a "commercial" type.   He doesn't so much compare it to his other equipment, but he seems to be more experienced with higher end speakers and finds the GLA-55 impressive enough to include in his favorites, which is a positive sign. 
   
http://www.hifi-advice.com/hk-gla55-review.html


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## buson160man

If there are no budgetary restraints I nominate the atc scm 150.I have heard the atc scm 100 and that was a impressive speaker.I heard it in a large loft playing back a count basie recording.It sounded like the band was in the room literally.The 100s can play loud and clean and has realistic dynamics.I have purchased the emotiva stealth 8s myself and so far though they are not completely fleshed in things do sound promising.Unfortunately emotiva has lowered the sale price an additional 40 dollars apiecs(damn the thirty day free trial period is over on mine).But even though they cost me 80 dollars more I still think they were worth the cost.
    I have made some comments on another blog about the stealth 8s but I still have to flesh them in abit before I can make any final assessments of there performance.


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## uchihaitachi

Quote: 





buson160man said:


> If there are no budgetary restraints I nominate the atc scm 150.I have heard the atc scm 100 and that was a impressive speaker.I heard it in a large loft playing back a count basie recording.It sounded like the band was in the room literally.The 100s can play loud and clean and has realistic dynamics.I have purchased the emotiva stealth 8s myself and so far though they are not completely fleshed in things do sound promising.Unfortunately emotiva has lowered the sale price an additional 40 dollars apiecs(damn the thirty day free trial period is over on mine).But even though they cost me 80 dollars more I still think they were worth the cost.
> I have made some comments on another blog about the stealth 8s but I still have to flesh them in abit before I can make any final assessments of there performance.


 
  Nobody seems to mention Focal speakers. They are also very impressive.


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## SimonReborn

Best value for your money? I got a rather weird suggestion that I'm currently rocking. 

Get out and try finding a Bang & Olufsen 32inch Avant TV, It is equipped with a pair of WONDERFUL active speakers, great clarity and impactful bass! If you don't mind a ****** giant piece of art standing next to whatever you gonne use it with, Its your best bang for ya buck!

(I'm on the lookout for my second one. I plan to split the signal to get them going as a pair of stereo speakers next to my computer rig. I really gonne have to make some space tho :/)

I've actually seen a handfull of people who is throwing them out since they don't appreciate CRT technology anymore. As a retro gamer, I own over 8 B&O CRT TVs, they are wonderful for my purpose.

If you want, the option to take out the speakers is also there for more efficient storage. Just make sure its the 32 inch model since the 28 inch one got a pair of cheaper speakers ^^


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## uchihaitachi

Quote: 





simonreborn said:


> Best value for your money? I got a rather weird suggestion that I'm currently rocking.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I have found that Bang & Olufsen is 90 percent design and 10 percent quality. I have been to multiple B & O showrooms and owned some of their stuff. Their sound quality never amazed me.


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## SimonReborn

uchihaitachi said:


> I have found that Bang & Olufsen is 90 percent design and 10 percent quality. I have been to multiple B & O showrooms and owned some of their stuff. Their sound quality never amazed me.


 Their price/performance ratio is outrageous. You're paying for the branding and the georgous design. IMO they got pretty much the perfected audio for the average consumer (with a phat wallet). Very likeable sound that is very enjoyable/easy to listen to. Calling out their products as being 90% design and 10% is pretty narrow minded,Its more likely that your are paying a large margin for the design than the audio. The audio/quality itself is fine. 

Now, I'm not defending B&O in any shape or form, I don't really see anyone else but unkowledged people or people with money to blow going out buying a B&O product. With that being said, I was still surprised over the quality you'll end up getting if you go with my previous mentioned setup, especially if you consider the price you'll end up paying. (If you find yourself a bargain, so the speak.)


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## uchihaitachi

Quote: 





simonreborn said:


> Their price/performance ratio is outrageous. You're paying for the branding and the georgous design. IMO they got pretty much the perfected audio for the average consumer (with a phat wallet). Very likeable sound that is very enjoyable/easy to listen to. Calling out their products as being 90% design and 10% is pretty narrow minded,Its more likely that your are paying a large margin for the design than the audio. The audio/quality itself is fine.
> 
> Now, I'm not defending B&O in any shape or form, I don't really see anyone else but unkowledged people or people with money to blow going out buying a B&O product. With that being said, I was still surprised over the quality you'll end up getting if you go with my previous mentioned setup, especially if you consider the price you'll end up paying. (If you find yourself a bargain, so the speak.)


 
  In fact, I believe I am being generous with the percentages I provided. I think it is closer to 99% design and 1% performance. B&O's price performance ratio is probably one of the worst you will ever come across. You can find many cheaper alternatives with significantly better specifications and performance. I mean their 17000 GBP flagship 65 inch TV is worse than Samsung's 65 inch TV at 2500 pounds.


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## SimonReborn

uchihaitachi said:


> In fact, I believe I am being generous with the percentages I provided. I think it is closer to 99% design and 1% performance. B&O's price performance ratio is probably one of the worst you will ever come across. You can find many cheaper alternatives with significantly better specifications and performance. I mean their 17000 GBP flagship 65 inch TV is worse than Samsung's 65 inch TV at 2500 pounds.


We all got our opinions, man. I really don't see why try to continue this argument in a thread about a guy asking for a pair of speakers. What the hell does a TV comparison have anything to do with the thread subject?!

On the side note, It all depends on how much you think the design is worth. You are buying art, much like a painting or a sculpture, and we all already know how much a well appreciated painting can go for.


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## blazer78

Quote: 





the8thst said:


> Agree 1000%
> 
> The real Genelecs would fit your requirements perfectly, but are out of your price range. Maybe try to find a pair of used Genelecs since there project studios are always getting shut down these days.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Agree 10,000%, Genelecs all the way!


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## eugenius

O500c and Adam Tensor - pro/hifi.


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## Theogenes

After reading through this thread, I'm actually really surprised that there's only one recommendation for ATC actives, and that it took 6 pages to get it... A disproportionate number of the world's best studios (think Blackbird Studios in Nashville, etc) use ATCs, and in the (admittedly few) conversations I've had with studio engineers, ATCs are generally considered the gold standard for accuracy. They are pretty expensive, but I picked up a pair of ATC SCM 10-2A monitors for $1600 used a couple of years ago, and they are spectacularly neutral and resolving. In fact, I went to audition a pair of $12k B&W speakers one time and was surprised to find that were not more timbrally accurate nor resolving than the ATCs-- in fact, the only thing I could find that they did appreciably better was imaging. It can be difficult to audition them in some places (even Nashville with all its pro audio heritage didn't have a dealer until about 2 months ago), but I find them to be completely worth the effort to get a listen. 
   
  In case anyone is interested: 
   
ATC Homepage
ATC Forum
   
  As an aside, when I purchased the 10-2A, I bought them from an engineer in Nashville and met him at his home studio to pick them up. While there, we talked about some of his other gear and I got a chance to listen to some stuff on his setup, and he had a few sets of other ATCs and Genelecs (and a few other things, don't recall what they all were) stacked up around the room, and his impression was that there were other speakers (like Genelecs) that could be more cost effective, but that nothing beat the ATCs for fidelity. My experience in speakers is certainly going to be far more modest than many other members here, but I've found nothing to indicate the existence of better sound than ATC provides thus far. 
   
  Hope this helps!


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## MayaTlab

In addition to other suggestions above, let me add mines. Two european monitor brands (I know it seems like a shameless plug to get the economy going here, but please bear with me) :
  http://www.me-geithain.de/index.php/en/studio/products/active-loudspeaker
  http://www.psiaudio.com/products
  Both are pretty expensive, starting at around 2400 euros / pair (PSI A17 or Geithain RL906). But I was a fair bit impressed by what they produced when I tried them. Apparently it's a little difficult to find them outside Europe though, but I sincerely believe they're worth a listen if possible.
   
  In more general terms I have the feeling active speakers are likely to give you more bang for your buck for most applications.


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## Fred Bob

I have a pair of Paradigm Active 40's, which in their heyday were a fantastic deal.  To this day, they continue to hold their value well on audiogon, etc.  Still i wholeheartedly recommend them as a good intro speaker for someone looking to explore actives as an alternative to the traditional route.  They've been such a good ride, I won't ever spend the extra dough to go for separates.  
   
  When the wife let's me, I really want to try the PTE Phoenix active speaker:
   
http://pteacoustics.com/


----------



## aneep

I second Theogenes. ATC are the best active monitors IMHO. Their midrange driver is probably one of the best in the world - if not the best . I myself own a pair of PTE acoustics Phoenic monitors and apart from ATC these are the best Ive heard.


----------



## Theogenes

I hadn't heard of PTE prior to the recommendations in this thread, but after doing a little web searching, I plan to audition them someday. Thanks for the rec!


----------



## mBkS

Im going with 2.1 rather than full range 3 way powered monitors. better separation and more control. much better in long run.
   
  my 2nd studio room is the whos who of common active monitors. I have spent $1k's on adams as well as sky and jbl 2.1 systems but my favorite which is not so fragile are my economy mackies with my outlaw 12. iv been swithing around from my sky 2.1 to my Mackie, adams and jbls all new up to date with my fathom 10 then outlaw12 now my cv lw12's which running a pair is interesting. Mind you I run a true 14.2 ss media room with crown 2500 on chorus 2's and a bgw 750g on 2 radian rcs118's(in large cabs) then center are 2 klipsch professional 2502 stacked powered by a modded yaqin10l and that only part of the front. my prestige 225&325's are my peaceful time.
   
  I suggest getting the small Mackies if your looking to buy. I hate powered 8;s unless its a velodyne powered sub..


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## Fred Bob

I also have to give props to my little Dynaudio desktop actives. They are very good.  Cant remember the model designation, but they dont offer them anymore anyway.  
   
  But I have seen their 110 model bookshelf actives on clearance.  Do a search.  I wish they had been on clearance when I got mine.


----------



## aneep

How are the kef ls50, anyone used the so far?


----------



## Currawong

The KEFs aren't active monitors. 
   
  I'm curious about the Unity Audio The Rock speakers. ELAC drivers with E.A.R. amps built in. A friend described them to me as "ruthless".


----------



## Theogenes

Quote: 





currawong said:


> The KEFs aren't active monitors.
> 
> I'm curious about the Unity Audio The Rock speakers. ELAC drivers with E.A.R. amps built in. A friend described them to me as "ruthless".


 
   
  Just looked those up, pretty interesting! Tim de Paravicini-designed amps is a neat touch... Any guy with a beard like that just _has_ to know something the rest of us don't.


----------

