# Those who waiting Xin amp, post and get your date of arrival !



## kaushama

Since Dr Xin is understandably busy with his amps, what we can do ourselves have an idea of where we are, is to have a thread to post all our order dates. In that post we should include the dates of arrival, those who have recently got it. Like this,

 LuckyGuy: Date of order, 1st May 2006\ Date of arrival 1st July 2006
 Kaushama: Date of order, 5th July 2006\ Date of arrival, XXth XXX XXXX 

 So if we keep on giving the data we will have rough idea of people who are getting the amp now and how many headfiers at least in front of each of us. If all start to post at least we will get rough estimate of daily output too in about weeks time. I have started two threads, one here and one at Xin's support site.


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## kugino

ordered supermini IV on july 05...arrive??


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## skev13

Ordered June 22nd. Yet to recieve.


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## vorlon1

Ordered supermicro July 22. Expected, when Hell freezes over.


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## dslknight

Ordered July 20. I'm guessing I'll be waiting for a while...


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## Nick Christy

Ordered July 11th


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## DennyL

Quote:


 LuckyGuy: Date of order, 1st May 2006\ Date of arrival 1st July 2006 
 

How about:-

 LuckyGuy: Date of order, 1st May 2006\ Date of arrival 1st July 2006. *Delivery time 61 days.*

 The we can all see quickly how long delivery takes without having to work it out from the dates


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## robster

Howdee-

 I ordered a XIN SuperMacro IV on June 30,2006 

 I got an email this morning from Dr. Xin saying it will be shipped this week. I'm keeping toes and fingers crossed. 
 My Portaphile V2 Maxxed is for sale in Head-fi amp classifieds. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


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## aluren

Ordered a Supermacro IV on July 13, 2006 and so far i only got a confirm email from Xin. Emailed him the next day (14th) on when i can expect shipment, but no response. if luckyguy is so lucky and it took 61 days for shipment, then i guess it'll be September when i get mine (damn it hurts just to type this)...

 btw, nice post, kaushama...


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## digitalcat

Dude I don't think Luckyguy is a real person.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_Ordered a Supermacro IV on July 13, 2006 and so far i only got a confirm email from Xin. Emailed him the next day (14th) on when i can expect shipment, but no response. if luckyguy is so lucky and it took 61 days for shipment, then i guess it'll be September when i get mine (damn it hurts just to type this)...

 btw, nice post, kaushama..._


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## Nick Christy

I'm hoping that now he's finished tweaking the amps (this time) that he will work his way through making them pretty quickly.

 He says on his website that he's slow when he's working his way round a problem but a "fast gun" (his words) when he's making them.

 Fingers crossed that 61 days lead time drops, Robster's post suggests it will.

 Nick


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## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_Dude I don't think Luckyguy is a real person.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

LOL, my mistake! i guess i was thinking luckybaer, who usually post about portable amps... nevermind!


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *robster* 
_Howdee-

 I ordered a XIN SuperMacro IV on June 30,2006 

 I got an email this morning from Dr. Xin saying it will be shipped this week. I'm keeping toes and fingers crossed. 
 My Portaphile V2 Maxxed is for sale in Head-fi amp classifieds. 

 Cheers,
 Robert_

 

Guess he's making Macro's faster than Micro's?


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## 883dave

Ordered my Macro IV on July 7th. 

 Dr. Xin advised yesterday I should receive by August 15

 (twiddling my thumbs)


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *883dave* 
_Ordered my Macro IV on July 7th. 

 Dr. Xin advised yesterday I should receive by August 15

 (twiddling my thumbs)_

 

well, that's certainly better than the september timeframe i was estimating 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 good to know that end of june orders are shipping...


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## ComfyCan

ordered SuperMicro IV June 17, 2006. No hint of delivery date yet.


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_ordered SuperMicro IV June 17, 2006. No hint of delivery date yet._

 

No love for us Micro's.


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## Slappy

Ordered super mini IV June 15, CC charged July 15. As of today no amp, no email replys from Xin.


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## Chri5peed

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Slappy* 
_Ordered super mini IV June 15, CC charged July 15. As of today no amp, no email replys from Xin._

 

I emailed for some tehnical support and the man Xin himself replied the next day. Perhaps he ignores email concerning orders?


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## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Chri5peed* 
_I emailed for some tehnical support and the man Xin himself replied the next day. Perhaps he ignores email concerning orders?_

 

this was the case for me too. i had a question about opamp rolling before i ordered the amp. he replied a day after my email. but after i ordered, i asked him about delivery date and got no reponse. i guess he really didn't know when he can start shipping the amps out and telling us that he didn't know would hurt his reputation as a business person.


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## Slappy

Yeah but I thought that having you cc charged was the indication he had shipped you order. I guess maybe the upgrade threw that off? Because he wont respond to my email I have no idea if he shipped my amp, and it got lost in trasit.


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## aluren

here's the latest from dr. xin on his website:

 "Orders placed on 7/1 or earlier will mostly be shipped this week. These orders were actually processed more than a week ago, but I stopped shipping right after, due to the latest tweaks. Sorry I did charge the credit cards as I was not expecting such a holding of shipping.

 Although the changes are big on sound, they look almost no difference.

 The SuperMacro-IV amps shipped on 7/24 have all the critical changes except one last tweak. This last tweak is not critical at all and you may send them back for free upgrading at no rush if you do want the sound to be perfect (really 3D sound stage without any stress)."


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_here's the latest from dr. xin on his website:

 "Orders placed on 7/1 or earlier will mostly be shipped this week. These orders were actually processed more than a week ago, but I stopped shipping right after, due to the latest tweaks. Sorry I did charge the credit cards as I was not expecting such a holding of shipping.

 Although the changes are big on sound, they look almost no difference.

 The SuperMacro-IV amps shipped on 7/24 have all the critical changes except one last tweak. This last tweak is not critical at all and you may send them back for free upgrading at no rush if you do want the sound to be perfect (really 3D sound stage without any stress)."_

 

d'oh! 7/05 order...maybe next week?

 i'd hate to get these 7/24 SMs since i would always feel just a bit inadequate without that last bit of tweaking...but then i'd be wary of sending it back only to wait another month...


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## aluren

i know what you mean! everytime he announces a new tweak, we get the urge to send it back... but on his website, he said that its 99.9999% done. so looks like any new tweaks would improve sound at a minimal standpoint... i'm glad at least he's working on our orders now instead of tweaking the amp and our delivery dates...


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## Chri5peed

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_i know what you mean! everytime he announces a new tweak, we get the urge to send it back... but on his website, he said that its 99.9999% done. so looks like any new tweaks would improve sound at a minimal standpoint... i'm glad at least he's working on our orders now instead of tweaking the amp and our delivery dates..._

 

Its like computers. You could spend a lot of money on a cutting-edge model tomorrow or wait a few months and get the same computer for 75% of the price.
 It doesn't matter when you get your Xin amp, it'll be behind the models being made by Xin the moment he sends yours out.


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## skev13

Got my shipping notice today!


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## GreatDane

Ordered end on June...no delivery info yet.


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## kaushama

So this is the summary so far and where we stand!

 Summary

 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kugino: July 5th
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22

 Important news: 
 1. Orders placed on 7/1 or earlier will mostly be shipped this week. (Xin)
 2. The SuperMacro-IV amps shipped on 7/24 have all the critical changes except one last tweak. (Xin)

So Dr Xin is delivering the amps ordered during the last week of June and hopefully will finish the June batch within this week!! Keep your fingers crossed.


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_So this is the summary so far and where we stand!

 Summary

 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kugino: July 5th
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22

 Important news: 
 1. Orders placed on 7/1 or earlier will mostly be shipped this week. (Xin)
 2. The SuperMacro-IV amps shipped on 7/24 have all the critical changes except one last tweak. (Xin)

So Dr Xin is delivering the amps ordered during the last week of June and hopefully will finish the June batch within this week!! Keep your fingers crossed._

 

Someone's a little anctious!


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## kaushama

Yes I envy you as you got the notice!


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## FreeBlues

I ordered a SuperMicro IV today, 7/26, and received an email confirming my order, but no indication of when I'll get it.


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## Slappy

Supermini shipped on the 25th.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Should be here any day. Has anyone seen a review of the supermini IV yet?


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Yes I envy you as you got the notice! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

so, kaushama...who gets his amp first? you or me? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 sounds as though xin's working on the SMs so you might get yours before my supermini...


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## russdog

Supermacro IV ordered 7/21.
 Now meditating to attain patience and surrender. 
 Ommmmm.... 
 (Or is it Ohmmmm?)


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## ElDanno

Ordered on 17/6. Shipped on 24/7


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## Spoon7

Supermacro IV - paid via paypal - not heard anything - but dont think that is a bad sign.
 Expecting atleast a month - but Im sure its worth it !
 Cheers


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## Sugano-san

On Tuesday I received the following message:

_A package was shipped to you on 07/24/2006 via U.S. Postal Service Global Priority Mail, Large to the following address:

 [address details removed]

 The following optional services were used: None



 Xin Feng_


 I can't remember anymore when I ordered. I did pay with Paypal. But I am happy it wasn't shipped before the main tweaks were included in MkIV. I did keep my old MkIII, but I expect to send it back for a refund (unless someone makes me a better offer than Xin).


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## smith

Supermicro -IV ordered 22 June, shipped 26 July


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## Skylab

No shipping notice so far, but based on all the above, hopefully soon!


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## aluren

so it seems like the average order to shipment date is 5 weeks... those who got them, please keep us in your prayers and share some impressions and pics!! its the least you can do to help us with the wait!


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## Slappy

Xin SuperMini IV recieved today.


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Slappy* 
_Xin SuperMini IV recieved today.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

PICS!


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## kugino

slappy?!?! we demand pictures!! stop listening...or at least type while you're listening!!


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## Slappy

Enjoy. Havent had enough time to post any kind of impression. Must find time to sit down and crank this little thing.


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Slappy* 
_Enjoy. Havent had enough time to post any kind of impression. Must find time to sit down and crank this little thing._

 

thanks slappy...btw, what opamps are in your supermini?


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## Slappy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_thanks slappy...btw, what opamps are in your supermini?_

 

Standard deafult AD8397.


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## ComfyCan

The fedex man dropped a package in my lap about 5 minutes ago, and I just plugged into my new Xin SuperMicro IV. I don't have a digital camera with me, so sorry--no pics today. Construction/case is quite similar to SuperMicro III, although the case is now engraved w/ the name of the amp and the in and out jacks labelled. The volume wheel is more recessed than on the SuperMicro IV, eliminating any chance of accidental change in volume while the amp is in your pocket. The battery contacts are still the same (thin little pieces of copper flashing--be careful they break). 

 I'll be listening this afternoon and will post impressions. After 2 songs listening w/ Laptop>Transit>MicroDac>SuperMicro IV>GS-1000's, I can tell you that this is one kick-ass little amp!! (very clear; very crisp; very revealing). Xin is a magician!!

 You guys are going to be happy. More to come.


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_The fedex man dropped a package in my lap about 5 minutes ago, and I just plugged into my new Xin SuperMicro IV. I don't have a digital camera with me, so sorry--no pics today. Construction/case is quite similar to SuperMicro III, although the case is now engraved w/ the name of the amp and the in and out jacks labelled. The volume wheel is more recessed than on the SuperMicro IV, eliminating any chance of accidental change in volume while the amp is in your pocket. The battery contacts are still the same (thin little pieces of copper flashing--be careful they break). 

 I'll be listening this afternoon and will post impressions. After 2 songs listening w/ Laptop>Transit>MicroDac>SuperMicro IV>GS-1000's, I can tell you that this is one kick-ass little amp!! (very clear; very crisp; very revealing). Xin is a magician!!

 You guys are going to be happy. More to come.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Mine should be here early next week!

 Comparisons to the Xin SuperMicro III?


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skev13* 
_Mine should be here early next week!

 Comparisons to the Xin SuperMicro III?_

 

I'm still furiously plugging, unplugging and comparing. So far, preliminary impressions with Laptop>MicroDac>amp, Iriver>MicroDac>amp, and Iriver straight to amp using analogue lineout are--well--inconclusive with the GS-1000's.

 There does not seem to be an "order of magnitude" difference between the SuperMicro IV and the SuperMicro III with the GS-1000's. It's really too early to give definitive impressions, but on some tracks the III seems to sound better, and on others the IV seems to sound better. (Since I usually listen to the MicroAmp with the MicroDac, I had frankly forgotten just how good the SuperMicro III sounded with the MicroDac).

 Thus, so far, I can't say that I see a world of difference between the amps; they both sound excellant.

 My intended use for this amp is with the Nano or Iriver using IEM's, so that will be the next round of testing, and the one that is most important to me personally.

 It's probably best if I just keep my trap shut until I've really had a good listen; snap judments with new toys are often misleading.

 Edit, a few minutes later
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 :
 I couldn't resist one more premature observation before going home: quick testing with E4c's revealed a much more noticeable difference between the III and the IV: The IV offers more soundstage; a LOT more. I tried it with 2 sources: the Irviver>microdac>amp, and the Denon playing SACD downmixed to 2 channel>amp via analogue RCA/miniplug adapter. In both scenarios, soundstage with IEM's was pretty freaking amazing.

 With the SuperMicro III, the sound with IEM's is sweet but kind of two dimensional. With the IV, it's 3D all the way. Preliminarily, I will even say the perception of soundstage with the SuperMicro IV and the E4C's is better than it is using the Headroom MicroAmp in the same configuration. Now that surprised me. The E4C's now sound more like full size cans than I would have thought possible.

 All of this is subject to change of course, I'm very much in the "first kiss" stage of my relationship with this amp. That said, the difference in perception of soundstage with IEM's is not subtle, and I think it's real. And real good.

 Now, back to trying to keep my trap shut until I've had more time to listen. (I'll probably fail miserably and wind up posting again tonight). God this is fun.


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## aluren

thanks for sharing some impressions, comfycan. so it looks like the micro can easily drive the GS-1000, that is simply amazing.

 regarding the 3D soundstage that you're hearing, do you think it is due to the new 4 channel technology? you're in the perfect position to tell since you have the 3 channel micro.


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## skev13

Eager for some more Nano -> Line out -> amp -> e4c comparisons!


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## vorlon1

Quote:


 (I'll probably fail miserably and wind up posting again tonight). 
 

I hope so! I'd be very interested in how the K 701's sound with it.


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## ElDanno

It has arrived via Global Express mail, very quick delivery to Sydney!

 Ordered on 17/6. Shipped on 24/7. Arrived on 28/7.

 Ordered SuperMacro IV with default config; OPA134.

 I can only compare it to the Corda HeadFive and Maxi Moy Signature with OPA637. After listening for only a couple hours with k701's, its in another league compared to the Maxi Moy - everything is much better. Compared to the HeadFive, it has slightly more detail and bass.

 Amazing sound really from something so small. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Image 1
Image 2
Image 3


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## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_ I couldn't resist one more premature observation before going home: quick testing with E4c's revealed a much more noticeable difference between the III and the IV: The IV offers more soundstage; a LOT more. I tried it with 2 sources: the Irviver>microdac>amp, and the Denon playing SACD downmixed to 2 channel>amp via analogue RCA/miniplug adapter. In both scenarios, soundstage with IEM's was pretty freaking amazing.

 ._

 

This is great to hear, as I always felt that the SM3V6's biggest shortcoming was soundstage. I felt the Porta Corda III was better even in this regard. But the tonality of the SM3V6 was better than the PCIII.

 ALSO: I got my shipping notice today! WOOHOO! Ordered 6/26, shipped 7/28.


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## robster

I ordered a XIN SuperMacro IV 6/30 ,got my shipping notice today 7/28. Hey is XIN in Oregon? Shipping notice sez Priority US Mail,I'm in N.C. so I'm guessing 3-5 days to arrive. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


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## stevenkelby

Hi Comfycan, 

 thanks for the mini review. Would you rate the IV ahead of the headroom micro amp then?

 Why did you get the micro instead of the mini?

 I need something for my ER-4 and DT880's. Only using the line out on my AV710 at the moment

 Thanks,

 Steve.


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_thanks for sharing some impressions, comfycan. so it looks like the micro can easily drive the GS-1000, that is simply amazing.

 regarding the 3D soundstage that you're hearing, do you think it is due to the new 4 channel technology? you're in the perfect position to tell since you have the 3 channel micro._

 

Aluren,
 I am not technical, and honestly don't have the foggiest clue how Xin's amps work.(Actually, I think perhaps he made a deal with the devil at the Crossroads; sold his soul 'cause he wasn't using it, in exchange for the ability to design magic amplifiers). (I hope you saw "O Brother: Where art Thou?; if not, you probably think I'm a nutter, but I digress).

 I think the GS-1000's just plain sound great no matter what you plug them into. Soundstage/headstage is pretty much going to happen based on the design of the phones. That has been my experience with them thus far, and the fact that I noticed no immediate, significant difference between the SuperMicro III and the IV with the GS-1000's would seem to support that as well.


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skev13* 
_Eager for some more Nano -> Line out -> amp -> e4c comparisons!_

 

I've been doing A/B comparison of my I-Tunes collection on the Nano with the SuperMicro III and IV for the last hour or so with my E4C's, and so far the soundstage difference is holding true. I don't know if the term "soundstage" captures the difference completely; these are subjective terms and I'm not sure they mean the same thing to everybody. The difference I am hearing is best described as a more natural "3d" experience with better separation between vocals and instrumentals, and a more "open" sound. There is also more clarity--the III sounds kind of "flat" in comparison.

 Most of the songs on my Nano are a hodge-podge of miscellaneous tracks leftover from my pre-headfi days; My primary music collection is in Flac on my laptop and Iriver H140. All files on the Nano have been either enconded or transcoded to ACC (some 128; some 192), and some rips were done better than others. I always felt the SuperMicro III was pretty "forgiving" of lower quality music files when used with just a lineout rather than a standalone DAC plus amp, and that seems to be holding true with the SuperMicro IV as well.

 I'm loving it!

 More to come, I'm sure.


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_I hope so! I'd be very interested in how the K 701's sound with it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It's on the list of things to do--probably tomorrow if I can sneak away from yard work and such.


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## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_I've been doing A/B comparison of my I-Tunes collection on the Nano with the SuperMicro III and IV for the last hour or so with my E4C's, and so far the soundstage difference is holding true. I don't know if the term "soundstage" captures the difference completely; these are subjective terms and I'm not sure they mean the same thing to everybody. The difference I am hearing is best described as a more natural "3d" experience with better separation between vocals and instrumentals, and a more "open" sound. There is also more clarity--the III sounds kind of "flat" in comparison.

 Most of the songs on my Nano are a hodge-podge of miscellaneous tracks leftover from my pre-headfi days; My primary music collection is in Flac on my laptop and Iriver H140. All files on the Nano have been either enconded or transcoded to ACC (some 128; some 192), and some rips were done better than others. I always felt the SuperMicro III was pretty "forgiving" of lower quality music files when used with just a lineout rather than a standalone DAC plus amp, and that seems to be holding true with the SuperMicro IV as well.

 I'm loving it!

 More to come, I'm sure._

 

Looks like i'll be looking forward to that! Exactly what I was looking for from this amp. Once again, I must thank you for the suggestion to purchase this from a couple of weeks ago!


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* 
_Hi Comfycan, 

 thanks for the mini review. Would you rate the IV ahead of the headroom micro amp then?

 Why did you get the micro instead of the mini?

 I need something for my ER-4 and DT880's. Only using the line out on my AV710 at the moment

 Thanks,

 Steve._

 


 Steve, I'm a big fan of Headroom and loathe to even consider rating this tiny little amp above my beloved MicroAmp w/ Desktop Module. Seriously, this thing looks like something you'd get in a box of Cheerios. However, I can't rule that out as an ultimate conclusion based on initial impressions. I'll need to play around with different phones and configurations further before I can offer an opinion on that. The MicroAmp has features like adjustable gain, crossfeed, and durability that the Super Micro doesn't. 

 I picked the SuperMicro rather than the SuperMini because it's so light, tiny, and simple--a good Nano match. Of course, the SuperMini isn't exactly a brick either.


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## stevenkelby

Wow, that sounds like you must really rate the IV so far, I know it's still new though.

 I would like the supermini IV for it's xfeed etc.

 I have been looking for an amp for a while and this looks like the one. Damn 1 month wait!

 Then I am thinking of a zhaolu dac of micro dac.

 Actually I just ordered the SM IV from Xin, I couldn't stop myself!


 I mainly blame you, comfycan!


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## Nick Christy

Well it looks like Xin is being true to his word and making and shipping these babies quite quickly now. I'm hoping that means the wait just got shorter as I have no fingernails left to chew on.


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## digitalcat

Has anyone considered replacing Xin's supermicro case with something else? It is too tiny for even the smallest hammond case, so what else would be good for the world's smallest headphone amp?


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## Slappy

Just a few quick thoughts. I would consider myself an audiophile in training, so please excuse some unconvention analogies. Also this is my first amp so I cant realy compare it to others. It was like a veil was lifted from all my headphones, a new level of clarity and crispness across the board. Both the k81dj and the sr80 sound better, but the hd555 really came to life. Maybe the laid back nature of the Senn and the aggresive nature of the ad8397 are a perfect match. I have not even begun to mess with the internal switches, but will soon. The main thing I notice across the board is the ability to pick out details at lower volume levels. The bass also seems punchier and tight.


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Slappy* 
_Just a few quick thoughts. I would consider myself an audiophile in training, so please excuse some unconvention analogies. Also this is my first amp so I cant realy compare it to others. It was like a veil was lifted from all my headphones, a new level of clarity and crispness across the board. Both the k81dj and the sr80 sound better, but the hd555 really came to life. Maybe the laid back nature of the Senn and the aggresive nature of the ad8397 are a perfect match. I have not even begun to mess with the internal switches, but will soon. The main thing I notice across the board is the ability to pick out details at lower volume levels. The bass also seems punchier and tight._

 

hey slappy...how is the bass with the k81dj? i'll probably be using the supermini with the k81dj as well, but i'm hoping for a bit of reduced bass or less boomy bass...tighter and punchier would be more toward what i'm hoping...


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## kaushama

Has anybody who ordered the amp after July 1st got the shipping notice?


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## Nick Christy

Not yet. (Ordered 11 July)


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## aluren

me neither (ordered July 13).


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## kugino

kaushama, you and i are both july 5...i haven't received a shipping notice yet...i'm hoping by the end of this week...fingers crossed.


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## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_Has anyone considered replacing Xin's supermicro case with something else? It is too tiny for even the smallest hammond case, so what else would be good for the world's smallest headphone amp?_

 

what about the altoids gum tin? they're pretty small, but maybe still too big.


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## 883dave

Ordered a supermacro July 7th, no notice as of yet. The time of deliverance is shrinking....


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## lostbobby

supermini ordered July 1, but I may have to hit the road soon, I hope UPS doesn't send it back.


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## kaushama

I said good bye for my PA2V2 few days back and now going to give away Xenos 3HA too. I am getting hold of Indian classical music set touched by a modern DJ. I miss my Supermacro. More than anything my PA2V2...... I am sorry pal To give you up like that!!!!


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## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_I hope so! I'd be very interested in how the K 701's sound with it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Vorlon, 
 I tried the K-701's with the transportable rig listed in my sig. below. I expected something more akin to my experience with the GS-1000's (i.e., little or no difference between SuperMicro III and SuperMicro IV). I am pleased to report that I could not have been more wrong!

 The K-701's seem to BLOOM with the SuperMicro IV. The perception of an open, 3-dimensional experience with the K701's was exceptional, and more pronounced than with the E4c's in the same configuration (which, as I already posted, was quite impressive). This is without question the finest my K-701's have ever sounded. I compared the sound to the SuperMicro III and to the Headroom MicroAmp. The IV blew the III away with the K-701's; no comparison. In my opinion, I must say that the SuperMicro IV even outshined the Headroom MicroAmp w/ Desktop Module when used with the MicroDac and a digital source (Iriver H140, optical-out to MicroDac). I had a very big smile pasted on my face with this configuration.

 (I didn't try the K-701's with an analogue line-out, so I don't know how that configuration sounds with the different amps).

 So, here's a summary of my initial impressions with various phones and the sources in my signature below, using 3 different amps: The Xin SuperMicro III, The Xin SuperMicro IV, and the Headroom MicroAmp w/ Desktop Module.

 GS-1000: 
 poor synergy with the Xin SuperMicro IV. These phones sound best with the Headroom Micro Amp. The difference between Xin III and IV is track-dependant; in many cases the III actually sounds better than the IV. More specifically, when listening to the IV, the "S" sound sometimes sounds a bit shrill, like a hissing "Shhh" sound.

 PX-100:
 When used with the MicroDac in the audio chain, the PX-100's do not sound siginficantly different using either Xin amp. There are minor tonal differences, but they are track-dependant and variable. This is also true when using the MicroAmp with the MicroDac and PX-100's, however. The PX-100's seem to sound better with a simple analogue line out; the more revealing sound you get when using a standalone DAC makes the PX-100 sound like what it is: an economy headphone. When the PX-100 was used with the Xin amps using an analogue line out, the IV did have better resolution/soundstage than the III, but it was not a huge difference.

 E4c:
 Wow. The SuperMicro IV really shines with the E4c's. The perception of an open, 3d experience is quite noticeable in comparison to the SuperMicro III. The distinction is most pronounced when used with the MicroDac in the chain, but is still very discernable with just an analogue line out to the amp. 

 K-701's:
 Double-Wow. Really brings the most out of K-701's, at least when used with a standalone DAC in the chain. 

 Now, a couple of qualifiers: I seem to be one of the first to have had the opportunity to post impressions about the Xin SuperMicro IV in it's current "final" configuration. That is significant, if you are considering a purchase based on my impressions. Although I post frequently, I am still quite new to the world of high-end audio. I have very little experience with any equipment other than that which appears in my signature. I do not have a technical background, and I am not a musician. I just love music, and have very recently discovered that quality gear brings music listening to an entirely different level of enjoyment. I am as susceptible to the "placebo effect" as anyone else.


 In other words, I may very well have no idea what I'm talking about
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am looking forward to hearing impressions of the SuperMini IV and the SuperMacro IV (particularly the later). I strongly suspect that these "tweakable" amps will allow owners to find a good match for just about any decent headphone.


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_
 In other words, I may very well have no idea what I'm talking about
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 


 Yes, but you say it so well.








 Great review. Post me your K701s and i will tell you what they sound like with the Supermacro


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_Yes, but you say it so well.








 Great review. Post me your K701s and i will tell you what they sound like with the Supermacro 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





_

 


 How about I just meet you halfway; say around Greenland? Thursday looks good for me.


----------



## kugino

comfycan, thanks for your impressions. i'm hoping that it mates well with the k81dj (my portable headphone)...i'll also pick up the k701 one of these days...if someone will buy my for sale items (shameless plug)


----------



## robster

Howdee-my Xin SuperMacro IV arrived today 7/31,order placed 6/30/06. I'm in North Carolina. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## Skylab

I also got my SuperMacro IV today, ordered it 6/26. Looking forward to listening to it, after I break it in for 50 hours or so.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_I also got my SuperMacro IV today, ordered it 6/26. Looking forward to listening to it, after I break it in for 50 hours or so._

 

Cool; can't wait to hear your impressions, as well as Robster's. 

 I didn't even think about break-in. I have no opinion whatsoever about whether break in is "real" when dealing with solid state amps (I have no basis upon which to render any such opinion). I've always listened to them right out of the box, and can't say I've noticed any changes in any of them over time. Of course, by listening to them every day I also probably destroyed any possibility of detecting changes, since my ear would have adjusted as changes were taking place.

 I do believe in break in for at least some headphones; The K-701's changed quite a bit over a few weeks. The GS-1000's have held pretty steady, to my humble ears.


----------



## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_E4c:
 Wow. The SuperMicro IV really shines with the E4c's. The perception of an open, 3d experience is quite noticeable in comparison to the SuperMicro III. The distinction is most pronounced when used with the MicroDac in the chain, but is still very discernable with just an analogue line out to the amp. _

 

After 10 mins of listening with my SuperMicro-IV, i'd have to say that is quite true. Between ampless and amped, gives a very nice bass boost to the E4c's as well.


----------



## aluren

robster and skylab, could you guys post some pics of the supermacro?? would love to see how it looks like with your rigs.

 nice impressions, comfy can. it makes me wanna get a supermicro and a e4c too! that will be a nice setup for the gym!! (with the ipod nano)


----------



## skev13

Kinda dissapointed in the supermicro casing. Mine didn't come with the little band to keep the lid together.

 Also, some bad machining around the volume knob.

 Size Comparison:





 the Machining:










 So far, sounds great in bringing out the guitars, can really notice the difference. More listening later.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_ it makes me wanna get a supermicro and a e4c too! that will be a nice setup for the gym!! (with the ipod nano)_

 

I really need to remember to grab a camera. I spend 15 minutes every morning gathering my audio toys for the day, but always forget the camera.

 The Nano+Xin+E4c's is, indeed, a killer gym setup. That was how I started this journey--bought a Nano for use at the gym and then stumbled accross the Headfi website. Things got a little out of control after that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The only issue I have with gym use is with the tips: I strongly prefer the yellow foam tips with the Shures, but they get a bit icky with aerobic activity. Therefore, I often use cheap buds or flanged tips on the Shures at the gym unless I'm just hitting the weights.


----------



## aluren

wow, even with the lousy cut on the volume pot, it still looks pretty damn good! comfycan, you gotta post some pics man, you owe us from all the impressions you gave that made us drool!! 

 i think you've talked me into getting the gym setup! let me see how the supermacro sounds when it arrives. still gotta make sure i like the xin amp... then its off to get the supermicro, ipod nano, and the e4c (or maybe the e500 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skev13* 
_Kinda dissapointed in the supermicro casing. Mine didn't come with the little band to keep the lid together.

 Also, some bad machining around the volume knob.

 Size Comparison:





 the Machining:










 So far, sounds great in bringing out the guitars, can really notice the difference. More listening later. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You're right about the case; it is definitely the weakest link. I actually bought a spare case for mine, since the original case cracked on my version III when I sat on it. I ordered a replacement case awhile back, and Xin sent me a SuperMicro IV case (before the SuperMicro IV was released). That case--the one that now houses my old version III, has clean machining for the volume wheel. 

 The two cases that came with the version IV amp look exactly like yours. It appears likely to me that after Xin got through tweaking the innards, the volume wheel did not align properly with the slot, so he had to widen it a bit to accomodate the change. The result is definitely a cosmetic imperfection, but one I'm quite willing to forgive considering the sound.

 Also, I didn't get the polybands with the IV either, although he did send me one with the replacement case ordered earlier for my version III.

 I made a comment on my order form about the quality issues with the SuperMicro housing; Xin included a brief reply on a copy of the invoice enclosed with the amp on delivery that says "Why don't you get SuperMini-IV for better Case?" Typical Xin, and probably good advice.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skev13* 
_Kinda dissapointed in the supermicro casing. Mine didn't come with the little band to keep the lid together.

 Also, some bad machining around the volume knob.

 Size Comparison:





 the Machining:










 So far, sounds great in bringing out the guitars, can really notice the difference. More listening later. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

that machining is awful! i would ask xin to send me another one...i imagine you could throw the innards in a tiny container (altoids gum tin?) while you wait...

 well, more people seem to be getting their amps so i'm optimistic about possibly next week??


----------



## skev13

Ah well. I bought the micro for the size, and i'm quite pleased.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_that machining is awful! i would ask xin to send me another one...i imagine you could throw the innards in a tiny container (altoids gum tin?) while you wait...

 well, more people seem to be getting their amps so i'm optimistic about possibly next week??_

 

You definitely don't buy a SuperMicro for the "bling" factor.
 I thought about trying to make another case, but I really don't have the time or skills to do it. (I suppose I could do it if I applied myself, but it was easier to buy an extra case).

 As with all-things-Xin, you have to give up a bit of gravy in order to get the finest cut of beef. 

 The SuperMini and SuperMacro are definitely much more robust, and that's clearly the route to go unless, like me, you just can't resist having the world's smallest kick-ass headphone amplifier.

 A neoprene sleeve would be fairly simple, and would solve the problem with the lid which, again, is held in place by friction alone unless you wrap a band around it. A neoprene sleeve would not prevent you from cracking it if you sit on it though. That seems to be the biggest real risk--overcompression = cracking. The amp is so light that dropping it is unlikely to hurt it. It wouldn't float down by a feather, but a brisk wind would be enough to effect it's trajectory.

 If anyone is looking for the world's smallest niche market, I'm quite sure an enterprising DIY'r could develop a very happy customer base by designing an after market SuperMicro case. I'd certainly buy one, but then again I buy one of everything, much to my wife's chagrin.


----------



## digitalcat

Where can we find a custom-made metal case that is about the size of supermicro? Anyone?


----------



## ckhirnigs113

Has anyone had the chance to use any of Xin's new creations with their UM2's? I have gone back and forth on whether or not it is worth it for me to get an amp. Right now they sound pretty good coming straight from my iPod.

 The dilemma is, I'm afraid that if I get an amp I won't be able to resist the iMod as well. But that is the Head-Fi way, isn't it?

 On a side note, ComfyCan, where in South Alabama are you from? I'm from Mobile myself. -CK


----------



## Sugano-san

Got my SuperMacro yesterday. Excellent! In particular with my UM2s.


----------



## Nick Christy

Sugano-san,

 When did you order yours?


----------



## Sugano-san

Nick, please refer to my previous post in this very thread.


----------



## aluren

somebody please load up some pics of the supermacro or supermini!!!!


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_somebody please load up some pics of the supermacro or supermini!!!!_

 

Here you go!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_Here you go!




_

 

there's nothing... ???


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_there's nothing... ???_

 

Not sure what you mean...the only other ting it comes with is a cheesy wall wart to charge the batteries.

 I posted a review here


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_Not sure what you mean...the only other ting it comes with is a cheesy wall wart to charge the batteries.

 I posted a review here_

 

i mean the pics... i guess my work firewall is blocking it from display...


----------



## stevenkelby

Nice pic.

 Is the volume knob easy or hard to turn?

 Is it likely to move easily in a pocket?

 Even if it does, I will have to live with that because I just changed my order from a SuperMicro to a SuperMacro.

 Main reason for upgrading was having external access to those switches, I want to use it with a few different 'phones. Also for the charger, onboard charging, playtime, much stronger and better looking case and I may want to use the better upgrade opportunities one day.

 I made a mini and a macro from paper and the size difference doesn't seem to be that much. I have friends with bigger mobiles than a Macro!

 The Macro is 200g / 7 oz with batteries (my Nokia 6230 is 100g) and the Micro is only 55g / 2 oz 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The extra weight is my only "bummer" but thats the price you pay I guess. It will hardly ever be in my pocket so will rarely distress me. (I have a thing with light weight)

 I will mainly use it for daily PC listening but may want to go portable sometimes, plus I'm travelling Eurpoe and US in a couple months. Hope it's here by then


----------



## Skylab

The volume knob isn't hard to turn, but I don't think it will turn in your pocket. I do actually prefer the knob on the SM3 to the one on the SM4. Thinking of seeing if the knobs can be easily switched...

 Main weight of the SuperMacro is the batteries, of course.


----------



## stevenkelby

Thanks for that, why is the SM3 knob better, I haven't seen a SuperMacro III.


----------



## stevenkelby

Just found some pics of the macro III. Looks pretty much the same as th IV apart from the knob.


----------



## Skylab

They are identical except for the knob. I just like the black knurled knob better than the short smooth silver one.


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_They are identical except for the knob._

 


 Only on the outside I hope! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 JK


----------



## aluren

is it hard to change the volume knob? i actually like the sliver one as it looks more modern! but if its less accessible (since its shorter), then the color might not be a good thing....


----------



## kaushama

Nobody got their amps who ordered after July 1st yet? It seems there is another optimization coming up to get rest of the problems addressed. Remember Dr. Xin said his amp is 99.99% correct now? So probably rest of the 0.01% would be corrected. Its good news to get the amp fully optimized but when Xin is in the tweaky mood He is a snail! So may be, we will have to wait up a little more and avoid the trouble of sending the amp back for a "MUST" upgrade. 
 Dr. Xin's unstoppable and irresistible desire for perfection is admirable! He is a true scientist and audiophile than a good businessman.


----------



## Skylab

Not so sure about that - seems like the amps are shipping out now. I don't think he's back in tweaking mode. At least his forum doesn't really indicate that...

 And I really like the SuperMacroIV. I'm glad I stepped up to this version - meaningfully better than the SM3V6 (which I had no trouble selling).


----------



## aluren

yeah goto mentioned on xin's website that the .01% problem was addressed and it looks like we have a complete xin amp... i hope this doesn't translate to another week of delays... i'm way too anxious at this waiting game and actually thought about getting the shure e500...


----------



## kaushama

Yes probably not. But best person to answer that is GOTO2003. He has mentioned in the forum "he's (Xin) trying to figure out how to correct the 0.01% left" If not for this time, we are bound to have another major upgrade sooner. As I said, Xin is a great person and audio perfectionist, who thrives for 100%. We all headfiers are crazy to reach the final inch! Aren't we?


----------



## lostbobby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Nobody got their amps who ordered after July 1st yet? It seems there is another optimization coming up to get rest of the problems addressed. Remember Dr. Xin said his amp is 99.99% correct now? So probably rest of the 0.01% would be corrected. Its good news to get the amp fully optimized but when Xin is in the tweaky mood He is a snail! So may be, we will have to wait up a little more and avoid the trouble of sending the amp back for a "MUST" upgrade. 
 Dr. Xin's unstoppable and irresistible desire for perfection is admirable! He is a true scientist and audiophile than a good businessman._

 

I ordered SuperMini July 1, so i emailed him a few days ago about changing delivery option (hold at UPS depot for pickup). I figured he would feel compelled to reply to that. Nope. But if it's a great amp, I'll just wait, um, a week more.


----------



## goto2003

I finally got a hand free to try the final tweaks developed by Dr. Xin. As claimed, these tweaks were for the 0.01% left. However, the sq I got from this 0.01% is much more than what it means literally, proving how wrong Dr. Xin's 0.01% statement is! Overall presentation is smoother and high is more liquid, the most obvious is in the bass area, effortless with more impact. now it works like a monster seemingly having unlimited energy as the bass now is under complete control. the soundstage is still super, probably even better, but no way to compare. time to send IV's for upgrade again
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 BTW, I think these new tweaks would apply to all IV amps; a must have upgrade, imho.

 Added: after some more listening to my favorite cuts, I was impressed by the improvement in soundstage, even more so than by that in bass. With these tweaks, IV's in another level.


----------



## kaushama

Wow that is good news. I do not mind waiting for the amp for some time if it has all the tweaks and optimizations. Otherwise later I will have to send the amp again and wait again or live with the idea " there is a better thing than this!!!".
 Xin is a genius if these claims are true. I respect him for his quest into making a perfect amp and more for his "non-commercial" way of thinking. That shows his primary concern is to provide a premium product for his followers. 
 So those, who got the amp recently, are BETA-TESTERS!! Even the BETA versions seems to be doing better than most of the gear around. I am happily and patiently waiting. Keep us updated GOTO.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Wow that is good news. I do not mind waiting for the amp for some time if it has all the tweaks and optimizations. Otherwise later I will have to send the amp again and wait again or live with the idea " there is a better thing than this!!!".
 Xin is a genius if these claims are true. I respect him for his quest into making a perfect amp and more for his "non-commercial" way of thinking. That shows his primary concern is to provide a premium product for his followers. 
 So those, who got the amp recently, are BETA-TESTERS!! Even the BETA versions seems to be doing better than most of the gear around. I am happily and patiently waiting. Keep us updated GOTO._

 

somehow i get the feeling that no matter what, the v.IV amps will never be "finished."...so i may get my supermini with these "final" tweaks, but i'm sure xin will find more and more. i just want to get AN amp, nevermind that it's missing the 0.01% or whatever. 

 goto2003, what's the word on the OPA2134 op-amps? is he indeed out of them?


----------



## aluren

so are you sure its 100% complete now or more like 99.9999999%??


----------



## goto2003

"very close to 100.01% perfection" is what Dr. Xin said in his email. for 2134, the "out of stock" was a new two weeks ago, but no update on this and one may email him for an update.


----------



## Sugano-san

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *goto2003* 
_I finally got a hand free to try the final tweaks developed by Dr. Xin. As claimed, these tweaks were for the 0.01% left._

 

Goto, quick question: These "final" tweaks you mention, are these the tweaks that Xin talked about in connection with the 7/24 shipping date (i.e., all amps shipped on that date have "all the tweaks minus one", and all amps shipped afterwards have "all the tweaks")? 

 Or are there even more "final final" tweaks that Xin developed after 7/24? If that's the case, and if they're really that audible (and I have no reason to doubt what you write), then it's really time for sending back the amp. 

 Sigh, will this never end?


 Oh, and what's the deal with the 2134? Does it sound any different than 2 single 134s?

 Thanks.


----------



## goto2003

sorry for the confusion. these tweaks are the "final final" to adress the 0.01% left.


----------



## robster

From reading XIN forum,amps shipped before 8/1/06 are minus the O.01% final must have tweek,hmm snap! mine was shipped 7/28/06 should I send it back to XIN or not? ...Snap double Snap!! ...

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## stevenkelby

If your asking the question you know the answer...


----------



## goto2003

We may have to realize that there must be further tweaks when Dr. Xin said it's 99.99% done given his perfectism. But the point is, even himself didn't think the 0.01% left is critical at that moment as he's never done it right on purpose before without knowing the underlying theory. When he said it's very close to "100.01% perfect", imho, it's really done and no more critical change.


----------



## robster

THat's O'Tay for me! it's a sin to be perfect,LOL. Thanks Goto and Dr XIN for one Kewl amp! 

 cheers,
 Robt


----------



## Skylab

I doubt I will send my SMIV back. It sounds great as it is. I have to let go of my SM3V6 now and I'm not going to be without an amp...


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_I doubt I will send my SMIV back. It sounds great as it is. I have to let go of my SM3V6 now and I'm not going to be without an amp..._

 

here here! just say no to all these updates! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i know how you feel...i had my imod with no amp and just bought a pint while waiting for my supermini...


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *robster* 
_From reading XIN forum,amps shipped before 8/1/06 are minus the O.01% final must have tweek,hmm snap! mine was shipped 7/28/06 should I send it back to XIN or not? ...Snap double Snap!! ...

 Cheers,
 Robert_

 

Robster, I noticed on Fixup.net that Dr. Xin actually answered your question on 8/1 indicating that it had the final tweak (of course, I don't know if he wrote that before or after introducing the latest tweak).

 My SuperMicro shipped on 7/26, so I'm not sure where I fall in the this confusing scenario. I can't seem to log into the fixup.net forum for some reason, so I think I'll kick back for a few days and see how it shakes out. It's not like I'm not loving the amp as-is.


----------



## aluren

no, i think the tweak was set to 99.99% perfect and all amps shipped after 7/24 will have that 99.99% tweak, giving the amp bigger soundstage than before. 

 then yesterday or the day before, 8/2 or 8/3, goto mentioned of another tweak that gives the amp alot more bass. so i don't think robster got this tweak yet. xin told him that he got the 99.99% tweak only... but who knew that the 0.01% would mean so much?? i think i'm at a point where i just want my amp... i don't care if tomorrow xin will improve the amp to 150% or what not... i'm getting a little tired of reading how good the new tweaks are... 

 its like him describing that this cow has the perfect fillet mignon. but oh wait, if i make him drink beer, the meat will taste better. oh wait, if i massage it everyday for 3 months, the meat will be even softer... hmm... theoretically speaking, steroids should enhance the meat even further... i just want my damn beef, just cut off its tail and send that to me, i'll be satisfied with drinking oxtail soup!


----------



## robster

aluren said:
			
		

> no, i think the tweak was set to 99.99% perfect and all amps shipped after 7/24 will have that 99.99% tweak, giving the amp bigger soundstage than before.
> 
> Yep,that's what I read into the posts by Dr. XIN, amps sent out after 7/28 were 99.99% perfect which is swell by me,I ain't sending mine back for a mere 0.01% no way jose'.
> 
> ...


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_n 

 its like him describing that this cow has the perfect fillet mignon. but oh wait, if i make him drink beer, the meat will taste better. oh wait, if i massage it everyday for 3 months, the meat will be even softer... ... want my damn beef,_

 


 Yum yum, Wagyu Beef. Yes please!


 Good point though.

 99.99% perfect amp is 100% better than no amp at all.

 BUT - i know we will stop sulking when we get them.


----------



## russdog

It's *so* confusing. It would be less confusing if Xin would simply number his tweaks.


----------



## lostbobby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *russdog* 
_It's *so* confusing. It would be less confusing if Xin would simply number his tweaks._

 

Yah, we've gone asymptotic. In 4 months we're going to be posting about "did i get the 0.0000000001% tweak?"


----------



## kiwirugby

Then there's the question of whether or not one can detect the 000000000000001% difference!!!

 Personally, I commend Xin in his search for perfection. I have fallen afoul of the continuous upgrades and been without my SM1,2,3 (and 1.1 and 2.1 and 3.1s!!) and IV for a bit (I have a superdual and a SuperMini 3 [antique???] to bide me over. What I do now, is to email Xin and wait however long he takes to get back to me and ask him if the difference is really that great (like between the SM 3 and IV....although I am difference-challenged clearly because I couldn't really remember what teh SM 3 really sounded like before!!!...or what the bloody difference really was....I just think they are all damn good!......I do think the SM IV soundstage is remarkably bigger since for a couple, of weeks I had my SM 3 and a new SM IV at the same time....Xin was kind enough to help me around some long plane flights....and was able to cmpare....but, of course that was two months ago....an eternity in Xin time during which there have been 76 upgrades!).

 Now where was I? Oh yes, waiting for Xin to email back and the say is the difference worth sending it back and see what he says. Of course, after it's been a while the he'll probably say yes. Reading some of the posts by head-fi members like goto and reading Xin's cool talk may help. Regardless of version, I still think we have a quality product.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* 
_
 Now where was I? Oh yes, waiting for Xin to email back and the say is the difference worth sending it back and see what he says. Of course, after it's been a while the he'll probably say yes. Reading some of the posts by head-fi members like goto and reading Xin's cool talk may help. Regardless of version, I still think we have a quality product._

 

I agree with you. Please do post whatever reply you get, though. Thanks.


----------



## djbnh

I mailed in my SuperMacro-3 V6 on 6/14 to get the unit upgraded to the SM-IV. I subsequently heard from Dr. Xin on 8/1 about 1) the final cost and 2) that the amp was to be shipped "very soon". I'll edit this post when the amp's received.

 I'm feeling comfortable about the wait, esp. in light of the rapid series of tweaks and optimizations Dr. Xin has implemented in the SM-IV amp since the date I sent it in for upgrade. The price Dr. Xin charged me for the upgrade was pretty sweet, too. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 [Note: my understanding about upgrade pricing is that it's somewhat dependent on what level of board / component replacement is necessary. My recommendation for those considering upgrading a SM-3 V6 to the SM-IV is send in the amp to Dr. Xin, and he'll subsequently tell you the upgrade cost once he's examined the amp.]

 Edit: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## aluren

djbnh, care to share with us what he charged for the upgrade?

 man, its almost two months since you sent in your sm3 (6/14)... so he responded to you on 8/1 about sending the amp back to you very soon... i wonder what that translate to?? 3 more weeks?


----------



## kaushama

Now what is going on? This should be a major upgrade. We know there was a problem of stability and some oscillation problems. Stability problems were probably corrected on 27th tweak. As Xin is silent he must be in the tweak mood! 
 Goto do you know what is going on? This .01 % tweak still has its own problems needs optimization? Let us know!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Now what is going on? This should be a major upgrade. We know there was a problem of stability and some oscillation problems. Stability problems were probably corrected on 27th tweak. As Xin is silent he must be in the tweak mood! 
 Goto do you know what is going on? This .01 % tweak still has its own problems needs optimization? Let us know!_

 

we are dying here....


----------



## Skylab

FWIW, I have the 99% version I guess, and I have had no problems with it of any kind. Sounds great too!


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_FWIW, I have the 99% version I guess, and I have had no problems with it of any kind. Sounds great too!_

 


 The sad part is that Xin's a rocket scientist, which means he has a *Really* good calculator somewhere, and can easily start tacking on 0's after that "99." 

 "After the mid-afternoon 8/12/06 tweak, version IV is 99.000000000000125 perfect!"

 You gotta love the guy, unless of course you're waiting on delivery...


----------



## mrarroyo

Well I ordered mine today, I hope to get it by the end of September.


----------



## aluren

dr. xin is back! great news, he's finally done with the 100% and will be sending out amps real soon. check out his website for an update by him.


----------



## robster

My XIN Supermacro IV was shipped 7/28/06 minus the .005% tweak so am I correct in reading DR Xin's post today that I should send it back to make it 100% complete? 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## stevenkelby

Thats right, I definetly would send it back or you will always wonder how it *could *sound. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm sure it's great anyway though.


----------



## robster

Howdee XIN IV owners,I'm on the fence about sending my XIN SuperMacro IV back to DR. Xin for the 0.005% tweak. not even sure if my ears could hear a difference. 
 How many folks who have their SMIV plan on sending theirs back? Mine shipped 7/28 with 99.99% of tweaks. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## digitalcat

I would strongly advice you against that. You probably should wait for Xin to ship out all the July orders first before sending it back. Meanwhile just enjoy you 99.99% Supermacro, it's amazing even without the 1%, as in my case. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . And keep in mind that this amp benefits a lot from burn-in. 
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *robster* 
_Howdee XIN IV owners,I'm on the fence about sending my XIN SuperMacro IV back to DR. Xin for the 0.005% tweak. not even sure if my ears could hear a difference. 
 How many folks who have their SMIV plan on sending theirs back? Mine shipped 7/28 with 99.99% of tweaks. 

 Cheers,
 Robert_


----------



## robster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_I would strongly advice you against that. You probably should wait for Xin to ship out all the July orders first before sending it back. Meanwhile just enjoy you 99.99% Supermacro, it's amazing even without the 1%, as in my case. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . And keep in mind that this amp benefits a lot from burn-in._

 


 Thanks,the devil on one shoulder sez send it back send it back! the angel on the other shoulder sez no be happy with 99.99% DR. Xin will take forever and you could be hit by a bus and not enjoy your last days on earth with a sweet portable tunes system. 

 I'll take your kind advice and wait. 
 Also a fellow head-fi-er who lives nearby just got a Larocco PR II that I'm DYING to compare my XIN with. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## goto2003

IMHO, it's really difficult to define whether it's 0.01% or 1% or 10%. From pure sound quality standpoint, it's much more than 0.01%, probably >10% ( seems like hyper as well) for those IV amps that are stable; for those not stable, it's more than 100%


----------



## aluren

so in essence, its not really that the amps are 100% now, its just that xin was able to solve whatever problems he thought existed. of course there could be other problems he finds himself, by you, or some engineer that got their hands on it, of which there will be yet another tweak right? 

 another question, do you know if the boards on the amps are manufactured or does xin have to do it manually for each one? and do you know how long it takes for him to build one amp?


----------



## goto2003

yes, the perfection means he has solved all problems he thought of or encountered. nothing is perfect to headfiers, you know that
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Acutally, Xin's very easy to be satisfied in sound and I doubt he would have made his amp sound super without the feedbacks of his amp users. Whenever he claimed XXX sounds great to him, pls. keep this in mind
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Xin made every amp himself and he once mentioned that it took him around 2 hours to make a Macro.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *robster* 
_Howdee XIN IV owners,I'm on the fence about sending my XIN SuperMacro IV back to DR. Xin for the 0.005% tweak. not even sure if my ears could hear a difference. 
 How many folks who have their SMIV plan on sending theirs back? Mine shipped 7/28 with 99.99% of tweaks. 

 Cheers,
 Robert_

 

I don't plan to send mine back for quite a while, if ever, since I don't want to be without it, and he's certainly really backed up with work currently.


----------



## ComfyCan

Goto,

 Am I correct that the post 8/1 tweaks apply to *ALL* Xin IV models, including the SuperMicro IV? This seems to be the implication of Xin's post, but I never saw any specific mention by anyone on fixup.net concerning the SuperMicro IV. Mine was shipped on 7/26.

 If there has been a tweak(s) since mine was shipped, I think I'll bite the bullet and send it back for rehab, since I am fortunate enough to have a version III to keep me from going nuts during the waiting period.

 For those who don't have a spare, and those that are still waiting on your first amp, you have my empathy.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The price of doing business with a mad genius...


----------



## goto2003

Sorry I can't comment on Micro as I haven't tried the tweaks in Micro. In theory, yes, they can be applied to Micro, but Micro's op's are fixed and have been optimized to quite some extend. Unless someone claims that these new tweaks do improve sq of Micro, it's better off to hold it as it is.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *goto2003* 
_Sorry I can't comment on Micro as I haven't tried the tweaks in Micro. In theory, yes, they can be applied to Micro, but Micro's op's are fixed and have been optimized to quite some extend. Unless someone claims that these new tweaks do improve sq of Micro, it's better off to hold it as it is._

 

Thanks Goto
 So, if I understand you correctly, Dr. Xin is doing something different in building the SuperMicro now than he did before 8/1, but you are not personally sure that it makes a siginficant difference in the sq.?

 If I misunderstood you, I'd appreciate it if you'd clarify.

 (Ordinarily, I'd handle this sort of thing by p.m. but I know I'm not the only one in this situation, so I thought it best to post here). 

 Thank you very much for your assistance to me and the other Xin-folk here.


----------



## kaushama

Has anyone got shipping confirmation after Dr. XIN's reappearance?


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Has anyone got shipping confirmation after Dr. XIN's reappearance?_

 

he did say on his site that the upgraded amps will ship out this week and then the orders after 7/01 after that...so i'm not expecting him to ship out post-7/01 orders until later this week or next week...he still has to build them, too...


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_he did say on his site that the upgraded amps will ship out this week and then the orders after 7/01 after that...so i'm not expecting him to ship out post-7/01 orders until later this week or next week...he still has to build them, too..._

 

This is good to read...or not. I thought Xin forgot about me. I placed my order at the end of June...starting to get nervous. 

 It's good to see others suffering as much as me


----------



## kaushama

Though it is called channel IV layout, it is "Channel V" to my reasoning. It is essentially a PRE-POWER combo in one enclosure with separate ground channel it seems.
 GOTO 100% amp is stable with all opamps? How much can you tell us about new tweaks?


----------



## NiToNi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_Ordinarily, I'd handle this sort of thing by p.m. but I know I'm not the only one in this situation, so I thought it best to post here._

 

Amen. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Does anyone know whether the THS4032 OP amp would work in the Mini? I'm I wrong assuming that the Mini's 5.5V might not be enough to drive this thing satisfactorily (which I think is the case with the OPA2107)...?


----------



## ranma172

I ordered mine yesterday. Now the wait...


----------



## MrYman

XIN SuperMini IV
 ----------------
 Order Date: 06/22/2006 
 Arrival Date: 08/03/2006


----------



## goto2003

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Though it is called channel IV layout, it is "Channel V" to my reasoning. It is essentially a PRE-POWER combo in one enclosure with separate ground channel it seems.
 GOTO 100% amp is stable with all opamps? How much can you tell us about new tweaks?_

 

I am afraid nobody, including Dr. xin could say it's stable with all opamps, too many opamps out there that no way for any of us to try them all out and make such a claim. With often used audio op's, IV is stable; for video opamps, it may not.


----------



## Musicdiddy

SuperMacro iv-

 Date of order: 14th July 2006, Date of arrival: ??????

 And getting more impatient by the day!!!!!!!


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Musicdiddy* 
_SuperMacro iv-

 Date of order: 14th July 2006, Date of arrival: ??????

 And getting more impatient by the day!!!!!!!_

 

Man, you just gotta think about something else. Waiting will make you nuts. In the meantime, be sure to not yell at the kids or kick the dog.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Musicdiddy* 
_SuperMacro iv-

 Date of order: 14th July 2006, Date of arrival: ??????

 And getting more impatient by the day!!!!!!!_

 

in the meantime you can read and post in this thread: http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showt...=187034&page=5

 and if it makes you feel better, someone's been waiting a year for an amp!!


----------



## aluren

anybody who ordered after July 1 got a shipment notice yet? it seems like there was a wave of shipments for orders before July 1, then afterwards there was nothing... i ordered on July 13 and still nothing...


----------



## kaushama

The silence is golden they say. But this silence must be another tweak!!!!! To make it 101% CORRECT? Getting rid of 3HA too next week. I am without an amp. GOTO what is going on? Do you know?


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_The silence is golden they say. But this silence must be another tweak!!!!! To make it 101% CORRECT? Getting rid of 3HA too next week. I am without an amp. GOTO what is going on? Do you know?_

 

He's posted on Xin's site, as he often does. Today's news is that "Dr. Xin is fine toning the IV. It's nothing to do with the stability or change in pcb layout that have been done. It's a choice of component combinations to make the IV's sound more pleasing." At first, I thought that "fine toning" was a typo, but maybe not.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *russdog* 
_He's posted on Xin's site, as he often does. Today's news is that "Dr. Xin is fine toning the IV. It's nothing to do with the stability or change in pcb layout that have been done. It's a choice of component combinations to make the IV's sound more pleasing." At first, I thought that "fine toning" was a typo, but maybe not._

 

Man I'm actually really glad I got my SMIV out of him before he went back into tweak mode. I think it sounds awesome, and I will wait for ALL of this tweaking to end completely before I even entertain the idea of sending it back for upgrading.

 I feel for you folks who are still waiting. The good Dr. Xin really is a mad scientist...


----------



## 883dave

I am new to headphone listening, generally two channel, so I don't know a lot of history on Xin products or other amp designers, does someone know a brief history?

 I have found most other makers have finished products, although not always readily available, they work on the buy, use and forget until the next version comes out, not the beta upgrade path.

 Has there ever been a fully finished (100%-XXXX% complete) Xin product?

 My concern is the upgrade rollercoaster, are little tweaks to should have to must have tweaks, going to turn into super V then super VI. Will a Xin amp spend a good deal of it's life in transit and tweaking?


----------



## stevenkelby

I think thats the whole point of these things. Other amps are not so upgradeable, you are stuck with waht you have whether you like it or not. You can play around with the Xin's. (SuperMicro excepted)

 Also, I boldly assume that they sound better than other amps for the same money, updated or not. We are just extremely lucky that Xin goes to the trouble of constantly trying to improve. Other manufacturers just release a product and thats it for a couple years.

 Almost any product at all can be continually improved, Xin seems to be the only one that bothers with small headphone amps.

 Thats why I chose one anyway, and it's how I'm justifying the wait to myself. I also just ordered some different opamps and buffers to play with too.


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *883dave* 
_I am new to headphone listening, generally two channel, so I don't know a lot of history on Xin products or other amp designers, does someone know a brief history?

 I have found most other makers have finished products, although not always readily available, they work on the buy, use and forget until the next version comes out, not the beta upgrade path.

 Has there ever been a fully finished (100%-XXXX% complete) Xin product?

 My concern is the upgrade rollercoaster, are little tweaks to should have to must have tweaks, going to turn into super V then super VI. Will a Xin amp spend a good deal of it's life in transit and tweaking?_

 

Here's my guess (but I might be wrong): Your main concern is that you've got one on order, and you want it now. That's the boat I'm in, anyway. I'm used to giving somebody my credit card number, and having UPS deliver whatever-it-is by the end of the week. I'm treating this whole 'Xin saga' as a lesson in patience. 

 FWIW, I suggest you meditate on the meaning of "surrender"


----------



## stevenkelby

That's me too.

 I guess you have to make your choice as to whether or not it's worth continually sending your amp back for upgrades. I know some people here won't be sending them back as they are happy with what they have. I would have to send it back or I would always be wondering if it could be better.

 Could get very frustrating for some people.


----------



## kaushama

I am getting rid of my 3HA today. No amps now. May be at the end of this exercise i will get used to live without one.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I am getting rid of my 3HA today. No amps now. May be at the end of this exercise i will get used to live without one._

 

yeah, and maybe you'll cancel your order with dr. xin!! 

 at least he didn't charge my credit card... thank goodness... makes the way just a little easier, knowing that i haven't paid for this wait...


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I am getting rid of my 3HA today. No amps now. May be at the end of this exercise i will get used to live without one._

 

i'm glad i picked up a PINT while waiting for my supermini...but this PINT is really growing on me...


----------



## kaushama

GOTO, It should be something more than component selection. Do you know what is going on?


----------



## kaushama

GOTO repiled to a post in XIN thread as "just got to know that Dr. xin's waiting for components to arrive. It seems he's nailed down to a combination for great sound and stability that need some new parts. let's see..."

 Lets see then.....


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_GOTO repiled to a post in XIN thread as "just got to know that Dr. xin's waiting for components to arrive. It seems he's nailed down to a combination for great sound and stability that need some new parts. let's see..."

 Lets see then.....



_

 

I wonder what the stability issue is. My SuperMacro 4 has been used with Beyer DT801's, Senn HD25-1's, and AKG K81dj's, all with no problems, and with great sound.


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_I wonder what the stability issue is. My SuperMacro 4 has been used with Beyer DT801's, Senn HD25-1's, and AKG K81dj's, all with no problems, and with great sound._

 

I think he was referring to opamp rolling. It looks like Dr. Xin wanted all the usual audio op-amps to work in Supermacro with absolute stability. Personally I don't care that much about rolling opamps, but if the latest modification also improves the sound quality a lot, I'm all for it.


----------



## aluren

me neither... i mean i commend dr. xin for always trying to pursuit perfection, but i think a majority of us will never have a problem with opamp rolling and asking dr. xin why opaXXX works but not opaXYZ... perfection and practicality simply don't mix well...


----------



## kugino

xin's out again! well, he just posted that the "final" tests are done, new parts have been ordered, and the newest batches will all receive the final tweaks (final tweaks as of today, i believe). so, all you pre-july 01 amps, send them back to xin for the upgrades 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i hope i get mine before my birthday next month...or else my wife will say that's my b'day present


----------



## stevenkelby

Oh Man, the wait is driving me nuts. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I listen for at least 5 hours a day and am constantly wishing for my SMacro. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I expected about a month wait and it's only been 3 weeks but I'm finding harder than I though I would. I gues it's because I only have the out on my AV-710 and it just can't drive 880's

 Still I do consider myself very lucky that it's only been 3 weeks and will probably only be another 2 or 3 (guessing).

 Also it's a big plus that I didn't get it 3 weeks ago and then have to send it back for upgrades, that would suck to me!

 When I finally get it I will be so happy that I will feel like buying everyone here a beer.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Going to meditate and practice being patient now.


----------



## GreatDane

I ordered my Supermini IV on June 29...still waiting.


----------



## stevenkelby

I was going to say me too! 

 Then I realised I ordered on JULY 29...

 You poor guy, must be going crazy. At least we can come here to whine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 At least you have other amps!


----------



## aluren

hmm... most of us are going a little crazy by now. i'm sure this will pay off, as xin already said that the upgrades are worth it. i'll take his word, and the wait, for it.


----------



## Skylab

I just got back from a week's vacation at the lake, and I used the SuperMacro IV extensively. It sounds awesome. I'll send mine back...in 2007...


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_I just got back from a week's vacation at the lake, and I used the SuperMacro IV extensively. It sounds awesome. I'll send mine back...in 2007..._

 

wise move, my friend...wise move.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* 
_You poor guy, must be going crazy. At least we can come here to whine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I've been waiting since June 14th for my amp to be upgraded, and don't feel crazy or whiny. IMHO, Dr. Xin's amps are the real deal, a bargain, and well worth patiently waiting for. The man, like some other audio manufacturers on this and other sites, seemingly stives for perfection in his products. OTOH, it is nice to have a back-up stereo rig or two! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djbnh* 
_I've been waiting since June 14th for my amp to be upgraded, and don't feel crazy or whiny. IMHO, Dr. Xin's amps are the real deal, a bargain, and well worth patiently waiting for. The man, like some other audio manufacturers on this and other sites, seemingly stives for perfection in his products. OTOH, it is nice to have a back-up stereo rig or two! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

this is my first xin amp but i still knew that there'd be a long wait and periods of uncertainty...i'm glad i picked up another amp a few weeks ago or i probably would be going insane right now. one day it will show up on my front door...one day.


----------



## mrarroyo

I ordered mine a week ago Tuesday (8/8) and I received it today.






















 Just kidding!


----------



## RockinOut

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_I ordered mine a week ago Tuesday (8/8) and I received it today.

 Just kidding! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## lolos

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_I ordered mine a week ago Tuesday (8/8) and I received it today.






















 Just kidding! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

hehee.. my jaw almost dropped when I read the first line.. it was a weired moment!


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_i'm glad i picked up another amp a few weeks ago or i probably would be going insane right now._

 


 Well thats how I feel. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Don't get me wrong, I regret nothing and the waiting will just make it sound even sweeter I'm sure.

 Nice to know others in the same boat.


 Mrarroyo, thanks for the few seconds of false hope!


----------



## kaushama

It seems the tweaking is soon coming to an end according to GOTO,

  Quote:


 It seems Dr. Xin has the design fixed, but so many parts are replaced that we can assume he's making a new amp for an upgrade. No idea when he's sending out amps.


----------



## aluren

hmm... i bet once he implemented the new parts, there will be other weaknesses that are exposed and we will wait yet again... 

 i'm gonna bet that i'll be getting my amp 2 and a half months after my ordering date.


----------



## digitalcat

I think Dr. Xin needs to put his obsession with perfection to rest for a while and start shipping amps, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . So many poor souls waiting, I feel your pain, brethren...


----------



## 883dave

I agree, what is a business that does not have a product to sell?


----------



## Skylab

I have to say, Xin's "business model", if you can even call it that, is a real irritant, and it doesn't have to be that way.

 Waiting 6 weeks for a product to arrive is bad enough, but now I also have to return mine to get the best sound from the thing? I'm actually kind of ticked off, to be honest. 

 Xin should wait until he has finished the amps before shipping any of them. Pre-announcing their availability, even taking pre-orders, that's OK. But shipping stuff and then essentially recalling them, and being incommunicado about it, it just stinks.

 Just my opinion. But this is almost certainly my last Xin amp.


----------



## aluren

i agree with skylab 100%. xin should worry about shipping amps out first, then on his spare time, he can research on making his amps better. then when he has finalized everything, give everyone a notice of the upgrade. don't give out half-ass update notices only to make the another update 2 days later... i mean, one clear full update. and besides, its not like the first batch of amps xin sent out exploded and burnt down every single house its been in... so i don't see why xin needs to be constantly fixing and tweaking and revising an amp that so far no one has had any problems with... he mentioned that he's tweaking the board to fit every single opamp... i've also yet to hear any typical user that they're having problems with that...


----------



## 883dave

Again I have to agree...

 I ordered an amp from XIN about a month ago. 

 After reading all the posts of people waiting months to receive an amp, just to find that they should send it back so as he can upgrade it to the latest model, then waiting months to get it back, only to find there is a new must have tweak. 

 One person said he sent his amp back on June 15 to have it upgraded and as of yet hasn't received it...Shotty business practises, poor to no communication.

 I have re-thought my purchase and sent a cancellation notice, I will go to either Ray Samuels or Portaphile...any other sugestions????, someone who at least has a completed product to sell. Life is too short waiting on someone else to get their ducks in line. 

 Has XIN ever really had a completely finished product?

 So for all you people who ordered an amp after me, good news...in a month or so your amp will be another few days late, but hey with me out of the loop you are sure to get one all that much sooner.

 Cheers


----------



## khbaur330162

If your amp is not having issues, then why do you feel obligated to send it in for a tune up or whatever? I think you should order and receive your amp and be done with it unless you truly are interested in the upgrades Xin can provide... Order your amp, do your thing, and let him do his. If he feels the need to improve upon his product's design, so be it. He's not in any way saying you are obligated in sending it in to him for upgrade is he? Apart from the fact that it might take him a while to make/ship your amp, (which isn't exactly his fault, he does have a huge list of orders to fill which is still accumulating from the amount of people ordering new units and shipping theirs back for repair/tune ups) I don't see much fault in his business tactics. I have not, nor have I ever, purchased an Xin amp, so I can only imagine the stress of waiting a month or more for one, however this thread in no way is deterring me from placing an order.

 Correct me where I'm wrong.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *khbaur330162* 
_I have not, nor have I ever, purchased an Xin amp, so I can only imagine the stress of waiting a month or more for one, however this thread in no way is deterring me from placing an order._

 

Curious then why you are defending him.

 It's the fact that Xin doesn't TELL anyone what's going on, and then that his rhetoric says that the upgrades are a must. Pretty frustrating is right. I will say this, you do at least eventually get an amp from him, which puts him above some sellers, but he PALES in comparison to Meier Audio or Ray Samuels Audio in terms of being good to do business with.


----------



## digitalcat

Sorry if my previous comment has been somewhat mis-interpreted. I didn't mean to dismiss Xin's business model. Anyone who placed an order for Xin's amp should know what he is getting- a great amp that takes a long time to be delivered. Whether the waiting is too long is up to you to decide. I think it's worth it, and I'm not really upset about the new tweaks, since my amp is great as it is. I just hope now he could focus more on fullfilling the orders, and maybe someday when he's relatively free, I could send back my amp for the upgrade,


----------



## khbaur330162

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_Curious then why you are defending him._

 

It seemed like you guys were being rather harsh on a man that seems to be making and improving upon a great lineup of amps...

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_...and then that his rhetoric says that the upgrades are a must._

 

Does he make money off you sending it back for upgrades? If so (and I would think so) then I believe this is a no-brainer. Don't fix it if it isn't broken. If your amp sounds good to you once you get it, why upgrade? 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_Pretty frustrating is right. I will say this, you do at least eventually get an amp from him, which puts him above some sellers, but he PALES in comparison to Meier Audio or Ray Samuels Audio in terms of being good to do business with._

 

You get a damn good amp if what I've heard is correct. I believe his price vs. size vs. feature set cannot be beaten. This obviously gives him an edge. He also doesn't treat his customers like intruders of his private property by hiding any and all technical specifications about his amps like Ray does. 


 I'd be surprised if some one heard about an Xin amp from a source other than Head-Fi or some equivalent. Given that bit of information, I don't believe it's too far-fetched to say that there's an abundance of information as well as user feedback concerning the SM line-up. When some one orders an amp from Xin, they should have the basic knowledge of what's in store for them (a month long wait, or sometimes more...). If they don't like it, they shouldn't order form him. Perhaps his tech support leaves something to be desired, but nothing is perfect, right? 

 To each their own.


----------



## khbaur330162

You click once; you get two. What are you going to do?


----------



## mrarroyo

Perhaps if you all get upset and cancel your orders I will get mine quicker. Yeah that is the ticket!


----------



## khbaur330162

And then I can step in line right behind you.


----------



## Skylab

Listen, I have had nothing but good things to say about Xin amps on this board over the last 18 months. And I still think his amps are good. But I have also done business with Ray Samuels and Jan Meier, who make excellent products, and whom, in my opinion, are far better at conducting business than Xin. Xin doesn't behave the way he does because he makes products that are light years ahead of his competition. I recently bought a Hornet from RSA and there are some ways in which it's better than the SMIV, and there are some things I like better about the SMIV (the amps are identically priced - I will post a full comparison soon). But to be sure, it is much more pleasant to do business with Ray Samuels than with Xin. I'm not saying Xin is a bad guy, and he does deliver, and makes nice amps. But I don't think it would be too much to ask that he communicate better, and that he finalize his design (at least for a given generation) prior to shipping them out.

 Just my $.02, but I speak here from DIRECT EXPERIENCE.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_Listen, I have had nothing but good things to say about Xin amps on this board over the last 18 months. And I still think his amps are good. But I have also done business with Ray Samuels and Jan Meier, who make excellent products, and whom, in my opinion, are far better at conducting business than Xin. Xin doesn't behave the way he does because he makes products that are light years ahead of his competition. I recently bought a Hornet from RSA and there are some ways in which it's better than the SMIV, and there are some things I like better about the SMIV (the amps are identically priced - I will post a full comparison soon). But to be sure, it is much more pleasant to do business with Ray Samuels than with Xin. I'm not saying Xin is a bad guy, and he does deliver, and makes nice amps. But I don't think it would be too much to ask that he communicate better, and that he finalize his design (at least for a given generation) prior to shipping them out.

 Just my $.02, but I speak here from DIRECT EXPERIENCE._

 

I have bought two amps from Xin and the wait is a pain. This 2nd time I really screwed up and sold my Supermacro III Version 6 before I had ordered the SM4. Oh well, so I ordered me a Go-Vibe 5 to tie me over. Crazy? yes but so what? we are all crazy anyways.


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## kaushama

This is my first experiance of Xin amps. I agree he has a unique kind of business model. To me his model is more of a audio freak than a businessman. This waiting kills all of us. Not to mention the fact i have sold all the amps I had to get this jewel.
 But I think Xin is very open and honest kind of guy. As I told in Xin's forum if he continued to sell SM3V6 while developing V4, he would have got more money out of the business, as owners of previous version would not be eligible for free upgrade. The free upgrade option for the "beta" versions speaks volumes for his honesty and enthusiasm for providing the best product for his users. He would have behaved like a genius, who gets the perfect model at the first shot, than letting us know the struggle to make the amp perfect.
 I think he would have silenced most of this critics, if he hired a high school kid to reply the emails and keep a progress update. Even one of us would have volunteered to do the job, though he has few supporters in this respect. And he could have employed another guy to make amps (even beta) while he is researching and send them away when the amps are resonably mature. Later if the customer wishes he can send the amp for the critical updates ( service packs??)
 He is obsessed with perfection. We all are, I think. That's why we spend several loads of $ just to buy a power cord, even when we know that we trek into to zone of diminishing returns. 
 At the end of the day all Xin fans return to buy the stuff and wait agonizingly (while cursing???) despite all his short-comings. Why?? He is producing a quite special product in terms of size and features. Its pretty disheartening to see this lovely man does not exert to improve his business model in the same vigor, he does in making his amps perfect.


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## ranma172

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_I think Dr. Xin needs to put his obsession with perfection to rest for a while and start shipping amps, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . So many poor souls waiting, I feel your pain, brethren..._

 

I agree.

 I will cancel my order, or try to do it, since I did it via paypal and Xin doesn't answer to my mails...

 Maybe if Xin starts to ship amps I will re-order one, if not I will choose another good but faster brand.


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## 883dave

I was looking forward to hearing Xin's product.

 It has been my experience in the audiophile community that people who do not take care of their customers soon find that the customers run out, not saying this is Xin's destiny, but according to the rescent posts today he has lost two customers.

 I sent an e-mail to Ray Samuels, he called me on the phone with-in an hour and spent 20 minutes of so, finding my needs, explaining his products and what would be best for my needs. Now that is what I call customer SERVICE. 

 With Xin purportedly being such a smart man, I find it increadably strange, what with all the comments from people waiting, sugestions of an update system, he would not have realised that this customers are what keep him fed, unless of course he is financially independant.

 Hope that when you all get your amps they are wonderful.

 Just my $20.00 worth (adjusted for inflation)


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## aluren

Quote:


 Just my $20.00 worth (adjusted for inflation) 
 

LOL!

 yeah, looks like he just lost two customers... although we have to appreciate the fact that he strives for perfection, he has to understand that we are all trying to strive for it. those of us that ordered an amp from him solely believes that we are taking a further step to pursuing perfection ourselves. therefore, i believe that all his customers shouldn't be given the shaft simply for his own pursuit of perfection. i am, by no means, under-appreciating his efforts, because it is only through him that we are getting the incredible amps that all of us believe in. again, he shouldn't undermine his customers, and while he doesn't intentionally do this, he is inherently doing so. 

 i believe xin is making it very hard for us customers. whenever he goes to the forum and read his customer's concerns/recommendations, he simply dismisses it by apologizing to us and informing us that his personality does not leave room for customer service. this leads to a love it or leave it style which is not necessary the ideal business model. but then again, this is his business and he can run it in whatever way he pleases. so in the end, it is a little disappointing for those that are waiting for amps...


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## wakeride74

Ordering from Xin is kind of like going to a theme park, you're all excited to get there and as soon as you do you end up waiting in line forever. The ride is good and after the wait most are glad they did but it's still a buzz kill.

 Ray's service is superior and his products are top notch. I have ordered from both and would do so again. I know Ray will provide great service and his stuff is just plain QUALITY. I know Xin needs to hire an assistant but he still has the only portable that size with the opamp and switch options. The problem I have with Xin is not the wait time it's that he won’t just leave it alone. Geez man, I know you strive for perfection but there is a fine line there between obsessing! Release a model and then work on your tweaks for the next years version and handle the customers in between. 

 I still like Xin's stuff, I have only good experiences to report with him and may check out the SM IV as I work on tweaking synergy with my new ES2's but in the mean time the Hornet is doing them very well!


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## Musicdiddy

883dave, out of interest how did you pay for yours? I ordered my Macro six weeks ago by PayPal but because of forthcoming holidays sent Xin an email last week cancelling my order & asking for a refund. I also sent a request via PayPal for my money but I have heard nothing.


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## 883dave

Musicdiddy....

 I was to pay with a credit card, so was not been charged as yet...

 I have sent a few e-mails and also posted on his web site that I want to cancel, (you might try posting on his website also) but it seems the great XIN does not acknowledge correspondence. 

 I would sugest you contact paypal with a claim of non delivery or non communication, they should be able to clear it up and refund your monies.


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## 883dave

Aluren

 I understand what you say about perfection...

 Imagine if Henry Ford was this obsessed...

 August 22, 2006...

 This is a recall notice for all models of model "T" and model "A"due to problems with the starter crank handle. (Not to be confussed with the recall due to the starter crank bearing assembly, or the recall for the magneto stability problem) Please note this is a must have up-grade, not the should have up-grade do to contamination in the finish paint coat recall of last week.

 Also please be advised that anyone who has their vehicles at the dealers for the repair to the seat cushion spring, we must inform you that your vehicle will be kept at the dealer as we are looking into the problem with the windscreen hinge, so your patience is appreciated.


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## aluren

yeah this is getting quite frustrating... i bought a house in a shorter time than some of us who have waited for this amp... that's amazing... those of us that are waiting for an amp, we should collectively sign a petition and tell him that we don't care about those 0.00001% tweaks anymore!! maybe enough sigs will make him start producing amps rather than tweaking...


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## ranma172

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Musicdiddy* 
_sent Xin an email last week cancelling my order & asking for a refund. I also sent a request via PayPal for my money but I have heard nothing.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I'm in the same situation. How did you sent a PayPal request?

  Quote:


 I would sugest you contact paypal with a claim of non delivery or non communication, they should be able to clear it up and refund your monies. 
 

I'll try to do that if Xin doesn't answer. I don't like this situation; Xin seems to be a nice guy... this shouldn't happen...


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## GreatDane

Atleast most of you guys haven't payed Xin yet. I sent him a money order for $205 7 weeks ago. At this point I'm prepaired to never see my amp nor money.

 I sent Xin an email on August 13 asking for an approx. ship date. I haven't received a reply yet...not that I really expected to.

 I'm not happy but as long as I eventually get my amp all will be well. I'm not poor and I have other amps.

 I feel sorry for any young person that saved his/her hard earned money for their first amp and payed Xin in advance as I did thinking they'd receive it in a couple weeks only to find out that it'd be a couple months...I guess no one is a dumb as me though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't worry, be happy


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## Musicdiddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ranma172* 
_I'm in the same situation. How did you sent a PayPal request?:_

 

If you log in on the PayPal site, click on "Request Money" & fill in the details, a request will go through to Dr Xin asking him to refund your payment. I am going to follow this up with a phone call to PayPal.

 I'll try to do that if Xin doesn't answer. I don't like this situation; Xin seems to be a nice guy... this shouldn't happen... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/QUOTE]

 I quite agree.....if only we knew if & when the amps will be shipped, this may not have been necessary.


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## djbnh

*[size=medium]FLASH!!![/size]*

[size=small]News from Around the World in 60 Seconds[/size]

 Cheese and cracker prices have gone through the roof lately on the Head-Fi forum with Wall Street taking notice in late trading. Traders and scientists theorize this may be primarily related to increased cheese and cracker consumption, corresponding to all the w(h)ine being consumed on the Xin amp thread(s) related to the vagaries/permutations of the SMIV amps. It was also noted that w(h)ine production is strongly up in many areas, but a number of persons sampling the latest w(h)ine find it to be of dubious, souring quality.

 Xin-related consumer confidence is sharply down in some places as for some patience wears thin, while others remain bouyed by Xin product performance, features, pricing, and past experiences. Some consumers are reacting strongly and vocally to a number of amp improvement-related delays, with persons being apparently livid and responding angrily, seemingly unable to deal with delaying gratification and being reportedly circumspect of the Xin business model. Other consumers are nonplussed and taking things in stride, grateful for hard work that has resulted in reportedly superb refinement to the amps especially at the product range price points.

_In much less serious or important news:_ Iran continues with its nuclear program; the Israel/Lebanon situation is still unstable; US and other troops continue to die in the Middle East; Iraq unrest remains worrisome; a Russian airline crashed in the Ukraine killing a reported 170 person including 45 children; New Orleans is still rebuilding, with many persons without their homes and belongings; oil prices remain relatively high with gasoline prices slightly dipping but remaining in the close-to-$3.00/gallon range. It is unknown what impact the Xin amp thread is having in these areas.














 YMMV.


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## Skylab

LMAO! Very funny. But dude this is a headphone site - we're allowed to whine about this sort of stuff here, and not have to be consumed by political crisies (the discussion of which is against the rules).


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## 883dave

I agree...

 It appears that XIN does make a good product, judging by the people who have actually received an amp.

 To me it not only takes a good to great product, but also great customer service before I will give anyone my hard earned money. I wonder if XIN would send me an amp to try, with the vague promise that I would send payment in a week or month or two, or maybe partial payment here or there? 

 Quite often it seems that with high end audio products there is a wait, however, anytime I have had to wait, the manufacturer has always gone out of their way to assure me when and how my product will arrive, e-mails and phone calls have never gone un-answered. Point in case is Wilson Audio, I purchased a set of speaker sometime back and they were able to give me the exact ship date for several months in the future.

 No where on his order page does he divulge that this is a beta unit under development....just states delivery in 2 to 3 weeks. I would have thought with all the fuss that people are and have made, XIN would have strived to be a little more forward in expected arrival times.

 One of my major concerns in cancelling, was this constant up-grade cycle. I would not buy a car from GM under the premise that it is not yet complete, and will have to be shipped back to Detroit for up dates. 

 Who knows, maybe once XIN has a product that is 109.56789456% +/- completed, with the last upgrade numerous months to years back, I may consider trying one of his products. But for now I will give my money to a business that actually has a product to offer, and has great customer service.

 end of rant


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## GreatDane

lol


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## ath

So it has now come to a witch hunt. My hope is all your rants does not drive Xin out of business. We will all be a lot poorer without Dr.Xin. You should all have known what you are getting into when you ordered the amp. No point complaining now. I know this has been said over and over by many good folks but some of you are just not getting it. 

 For all those that use paypal, if you happen to use a debit card, funds will be drawn from your account right away. That is how paypal is set up, Xin has nothing to do with that. I have sent my supermini IV for upgrade. You have heard from the man that he is waiting for parts. At this point there is not much we can do but wait.

 I request all of you to exercise some patience. Please forget the fact that you ordered the amp for a couple of weeks. It will start showing up. Xin is a very good man. I have sent him a personal checks and each time he deposited the check only after shipping the amp.

 my humble opinion....

 Anand


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## ComfyCan

I totally understand why the natives are restless, which is why I never suggest a Xin amp to anyone getting their first amp unless they intend to buy a C-Moy or something to hold them over until delivery.

 Xin doesn't rip people off; I've never seen a single post indicating that he has not delivered--eventually.

 Xin has posted several times on his forum discouraging people from using PayPal if they care about cashflow because PayPal results in immediate payment. Rather, he encourages credit card use which he does not charge until he is getting ready to ship the amp.

 I am not endorsing Xin's unusual customer relations practices, but good things WILL come to those who wait--seeemingly forever


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## kaushama

I think he does not deserve this much of beating! He is developing a new concept. He is quite honest about its development progress though he lacks communication skills. People know he is having something special in his hands. He seems to be a quite nice guy. The 2-3 week deadline is put in his site for some time now before he went into develop version 4 amps.
 All I can see is bad timing of letting out the news of version 4 amps and poor communication. He should have kept this under secret and sent SM3V6 amps all this time.


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## 883dave

ATH

 "You should all have known what you are getting into when you ordered the amp. No point complaining now. I know this has been said over and over by many good folks but some of you are just not getting it."

 How is it that we are to know? Sort of like my Enron investments?

 XIN discloses a 2-3 week ship time. I don't remember him stating that the unit is in development.

 I am not complaining, I feel rather disapointed to have to cancel, I was looking forward to hearing his product. I for one have dead lines in life, I made it clear that, as of August 15, I would be away from home, out of contact til spring. XIN did take the time to assure me this date would be no problem. 

 Please explain what it is I don't get???


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## phergus_25

I think taht Xin did what alot of smaller buisnesses seem to do, they are really excited about their new product, so they tell everyone and everyone wants one. By the time they get them done its a while, and then it takes some tial and error to get them perfict. Though it is hard the best way to do this is to wait till you have the product all set to go, then send out the word.

 PS Djbnh, i like the pose, reminds me of a pic i saw somewhere, sometime.


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## kaushama

I am sure, when its out, people will praise him a lot for a great product rather invention. Its a matter of time. For me at least, I would like to have relatively fully baked product. I quite agree on the fact that Dr. XIN should mention the fact amp is under development in the "front" page of his product forum. If you scroll down the thread, all what can see is the various stages of development. Many amp makers dont let the public to see this kind of information. Putting it in front will spare him lot of trouble.


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## FreeBlues

In the venture capital world, we call Xin's situation a "success disaster." Great product, lots of great reviews, everyone jumps on the bandwagon. Pretty soon the company is so overwhelmed by its "success" that it can't cope and explodes.

 I site myself as exhibit A. I'd never heard of Xin, never seen or heard his amp. Based exclusively on reviews and comments on this site I sent a Cashier's Check for the amount (hey GreatDane!)

 I guess you can all blame me if Xin fails.

 ComfyCan - thanks for the reassurance that Xin always, eventually, delivers.


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## lolos

I just want to add that Dr. Xin always replies to my emails, concerns, and questions. However, he doesn't reply to them instantly. If he is busy by tweaking his amps he usually replies later.

 Needless to say, I didn't have to buy anything from him to respond to my emails. He is a very very very nice person, and I talk out of personal experience. Yes he is not the best communicator but he always deliver. 

 I have been waiting for my Supermini IV since July 4th. Knowing what I know today, I would still have made my order.

 Dr. Xin is not all about the money like some in the business. As others have said, he is not a business man rather he is a scientist.

 Simple question though, has anyone came up with a design similar to his amps? For my information, the answer is NO.


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## ath

888Dave,

 Nothing personal in my message. You can think of it as an anti-rant 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am not saying that I'm happy with all the delays. I wont get my frustration ahead of me. I tell myself that it is worth the wait. I had the supermini for a week or so before I sent it back for upgrades ( per Dr.Xin's suggestion that I send it back). 

 The default configuration gave a well burnt-in Hornet a run for the money. I was/am perfectly happy with the hornet and er-4s, the synergy with Supermini- ER-4s takes it to a whole new level. 

 Did you check the support forums on fixup website as well as here on head fi before placing order? I still vividly remember the supermacro III delays earlier this year. If you had searched for delay or frustration on fixup's support forums, you will end up with a ton of messages. Finally, it all worked out for everyone. 

 The bottomline here is that you have every right to be frustrated but I think you made a big mistake cancelling your order. You were really close to getting the best amp for the buck. 

 Dr.Xin is an artist. Sometimes I think that he is in this more for the satisfaction of building and perfecting amps than for the money. 

 Cheers

 Anand

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *883dave* 
_ATH

 "You should all have known what you are getting into when you ordered the amp. No point complaining now. I know this has been said over and over by many good folks but some of you are just not getting it."

 How is it that we are to know? Sort of like my Enron investments?

 XIN discloses a 2-3 week ship time. I don't remember him stating that the unit is in development.

 I am not complaining, I feel rather disapointed to have to cancel, I was looking forward to hearing his product. I for one have dead lines in life, I made it clear that, as of August 15, I would be away from home, out of contact til spring. XIN did take the time to assure me this date would be no problem. 

 Please explain what it is I don't get???_


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## mrarroyo

I am a Xin fan boy, he makes wonderfully sounding amps which the we can tweak to our liking. Any one who has heard one of his units will for the most part agree. Since this is not my first purchase I "new" the 2 to 3 week was not to be believed. I am not saying he is lying but he is being optimistic.

 As a result I ordered a Go-Vibe 5 to tie me over since I made the compound mistake of selling all my portable amps. So here I sit waiting, and not expecting my amp until mid September since I ordered on 8/6. Heck it may be late September. What I do know is that the sound will be amazing, why because Dr. Xin is truly nuts.

 Having said all that I truly feel bad for those who have ordered without knowing how he runs his business (not very business like). Be assure he will deliver, he has done so in the past and I am confident he will in the future.


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## AusTex

GOTO has been keeping everyone up to speed and it seems as if Xin doesn't want to have to do another upgrade if he can help it. I feel very fortunate just to go through this process with him and everyone else at this time because he is inventing something that no one else has. Who knows, this technology may be available in many audio products in the future and we got to hear it first.


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## kaushama

GOTO turned up in XIN forum and posted following,

  Quote:


 As indicated in the last email from xin this morning, he has been working day and night in the past few days. I can understand why it takes this long given most parts in the amp were changed and many tests would have to follow. Theoretically correct is to make the amp works right, yet making it sound pleasing would take much more extra tests by ear. Though I don't have all parts available, but I did change some and the results are very positive. I think xin's doing the final test now. It's really the cost of learning for Xin to pay. My best guess is it would take him one or two more days to clean off everything.


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## kiwirugby

It's hard to know how to placate those eager to receive their amps and the attendant frustration when they wait and wait. I'm sure we all feel the same, especially when the promise of a great product is seemingly so close we can all taste it! Like kids at Christmas!

 I am one of those who has gone back and forth with Xin on my SM V.3 and now IV (and SuperdDual...and one of the original SuperMinis). I can tell you one thing, the post office loves me and knows my first name! I can't claim to know all about Xin's upgrades and modifications (goto, highflight on Xin's forum and others know much better than I, and a big thanks to all of them to helping us less-knowledgeable out) nor can I really determine if what I hear when a modified or upgraded amp comes back is that different. But I still go ahead and follow Xin's counsel (but I always email him first and get an idea of when would be a good time to send the amp in so that it won't be gone long, something I would encourage others to do when sending amps back. He recently told me to wait a couple of months, and with good reason!). It is all my choice entirely. I love working with the guy. And bar the upgrade from SM V.3 to IV, I have never had to pay him anything for the modifications or upgrades and he pays for mailing the amp back. (Post office must love him too!)

 So, for what it's worth, here are some suggestions.

 For those who have ordered and paid, please try to summon up as much patience as possible and wait. It will all be worth it, many will attest. 

 For those thinking about ordering, inform yourself well here and on Xin's forum, and then email him as things calm down and wait for a reply about when would be a good time to order with a minimum amount of build time. I know this is tough when we want "it" now!

 For those of us wanting to upgrade, first see if the upgrades are really signficant, and only Xin and a handful of SM experts can really tell you, and then do like I suggest above. I email Xin every time he says he has made changes and ask him if it's really worth me sending it in, and I will only do so when he says, yes.

 We will all have to wait for Xin to email back. That's a given. But I think we can manage this complicated process a bit better and let Xin work his magic. Regardless, we all now know the situation, so buyer and upgrader be aware....

 I have no idea if this helps the eager and frustrated. I'm sure it doesn't. You're all welcome to my place, bring your rig and listen through my soon-to-be-ugraded-for-the-third-time SM IV before it goes to Xin!!!


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## 883dave

QUOTE

 "Be assure he will deliver, he has done so in the past and I am confident he will in the future."

 This seems to be a common belief. Out of everyone who has said this..

 How many have paid for an amp upfront so as to support XIN in his development stage.

 How many are waiting for an amp to ship before payment is rendered?


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## ath

888Dave,

 Please stop! This is insane. What does it matter who paid upfront or whoever is waiting for an amp, fact is we all are. 

 Dr.Xin delivers is not just a common belief but *is indeed a fact*. 

 Dr.Xin does not need your money to build a prototype. It does not take a million dollars to build the amp. He used to send amps out to folks for feedback and tweaking purposes. Currently what goto2003 is doing. I wish I had the time to do this between my work, commute and two kids I hardly have time to take on such a great responsibility. 

 I have owned Supermini V5.18 purchased in 2003, a superdual purchased in 2004 and a supermini III which I upgraded to mini-IV currently. I have enjoyed each of the amps. Is that proof enough for you that he delivers?


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## aluren

don't stress out, 883dave... we are all waiting here, so its not like xin doesn't favor you or anything... i'd tell you, i'm still waiting for it because i know it will be a great amp. if i were, you should just keep your order, since by the time xin reads your email about cancelling, he would've been done with the amp and ready to ship it out... so regardless if you cancel now, you won't get your money back since xin is too busy. just hang in there. in the end its just an amp, not food or welfare checks... just tell him where you moved/traveled to and have him ship that amp there.


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## GreatDane

Here's some food for hope. Xin replied to my email that was sent several days ago asking about a shipping date.

 His reply:
 ______________________
 Dane,

 Your order was processed right before I started the final tweaks. Now 
 it's 
 done and will ship in 1-2 days.

 Thank you and very sorry about this,
 Xin

 ______________________

 YEAH!


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## Nick Christy

Dane,

 What date did you order on ?

 Nick


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## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_Dane,

 What date did you order on ?

 Nick_

 

I ordered on June 29.


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## stevenkelby

Congrats to GreatDane, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I just got an email from him too regarding some extra opamps and things I am getting with the SMacro. No mention of delivery but I'm patient now.

 Now I'm just glad to be getting one eventually.

 Ordered a month after you, hope it doesn't take a month longer though.


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## Skylab

All I ever asked is that he be more communicative with his customers. Now it appears that perhaps he's starting to be. That would be a major step forward. I like his amps, and he DOES deliver, but my personal choice will be not to buy another amp from him as I just don't have the time for the hassle of his current business model. His amps are great but not much better than some other folks who are more pleasant to do business with. All JMO, of course.


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## kugino

i certainly feel with skylab (and others here who are waiting for their amps)...while most people know what to expect when they order an amp from xin, that still doesn't make it okay for xin to be rather poor about keeping his customers in the dark about the status of the amps. and those of you who defend xin by saying that he's a really good guy or he's a one-man operation, etc...we're not disagreeing with you. my criticisms of xin are not about his character or his business situation, it's about poor communication. i don't care that my amp takes two-plus months to ship, i just want to know what's going on during that process. maybe an update once/week? 

 and no, it's not enough to say "the wait will be worth it"...don't appease me by telling me how good the product is going to be...i already believe it's a good product or i wouldn't have ordered one in the first place. just tell me what the bleep is going on!

 [/end rant]


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## kaushama

Dr. Xin is working on returned amps for upgrades it seems. As lots of parts are replaced in the amp. The new amps are not 100.1% probably. May be another scaling for new upcoming tweaks!!


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## aluren

well i'll believe it when people start getting their amps.... you know, dr. xin kinda reminds me of a politician. he guarantees these great things and great changes, but we never see them...


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## Nick Christy

I agree so far we have had :

 His order page promises delivery in 2 - 3 weeks;
 Two weeks ago he said he was done tweaking and the amps would ship in 1 - 2 days;
 Last week he said he needed some new components and then he was finished;
 This week - nothing.


 What annoys me is that the tweaking is unnecesary. Of the Xin IV amps delivered and reviewed on this site NOT ONE person has claimed sub standard sound. In fact all of the reviews have been unerringly positive. So in fact what we have witnessed is probably the birth of the fifth generation and the fourth never shipped. What a waste of time!

 If the amps NEEDED the tweaking they werent ready to ship in the first place and shouldnt have been announced;
 If the amps DIDNT need the tweaking but would merely benefit from it well thats the V2 upgrade for next winter isnt it ?

 Design them, make them, ship them please Xin.

 When the initial demand dies down, tweak away, when you've finished tweaking, announce the upgrade and go back to making and shipping.

 If you LOVE designing but hate the business side of things (which i suspect is the case and i dont blame you) hire someone to deal with the admin for you, better still hire two people, one for admin and one for making them to your designs, this would then leave you free to tweak to your hearts content without driving your customers away.

 I paid for my amp on 11 July, and so far I havent even had shipping notice and it will be another 10 days from then.

 Not happy, not cancelling, but not returning either.

 Ray Samuels, brace yourself, my credit card is now headed in your direction.


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## jdimitri

For all the ppl complaining..
 If he just found an update, would u REALLY want to send urs back in 2 weeks time or so, so that he can fix it up that'll take, i dunno, another 2 weeks?
 Seriously, its for ur own good, delaying it doesn't benefit him in any way.
 I'd want to send it back to him if he thinks it makes a big sound difference
 And some ppl have posted significant differences (from inferior to dual supermacros to better)


----------



## goto2003

It's truely costy for Xin to send amps before finalized. But I can understand he's not trying to piss his users off. It seems he did believe the designs were perfect enough when he decided to ship them out; but it turned out that he found it's not the case and wanted to fix it. There were a few signs that the old designs had some flaws. First, one or two amps shipped didn't work stable and osciliated with AD8397 under some conditions; Second, the battery drain was larger than expected and batteries didn't last >20hrs per charge in a few amps. But the fixing effort took longer than expected. After playing with the latest tweaks, I tend to agree that these tweaks are necesary given the sq and stability as it is today, and the early SM IV seems to become unaccetable in sound. Just my two cents.


----------



## Nick Christy

Goto ,

 Thanks.

 In 2 minutes there you told me more than Xin has in 2 months.

 Nick


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jdimitri* 
_For all the ppl complaining..
 If he just found an update, would u REALLY want to send urs back in 2 weeks time or so, so that he can fix it up that'll take, i dunno, another 2 weeks?
 Seriously, its for ur own good, delaying it doesn't benefit him in any way.
 I'd want to send it back to him if he thinks it makes a big sound difference
 And some ppl have posted significant differences (from inferior to dual supermacros to better)_

 

of course, but it wouldn't do us any good either if we don't have a basis to compare. it's like saying 'the 2006 lexus model is great and is 99% complete. but if you wait for the 2007 model, the new tweaks will make it 100% complete. but if you wait for the 2008 model, we will be changing the actual parts, it will be much better. we will not send you the 2006 model because we believe it is not perfect, so we will send you the 2008 model when 2008 rolls by.' 

 for me personally, i rather have 99% of something than nothing. once i receive the amp, i will probably not want to send it back in ever again to make sure that the amp works with OPA239i4298734 and AD324jh429s opamps which i will probably not care about...


----------



## kaushama

Great dane posted this on Xin's forum.

  Quote:


 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006
 Dane,
 Your order was processed right before I started the final tweaks. Now 
 it's 
 done and will ship in 1-2 days.
 Thank you and very sorry about this,
 Xin 
 

Has anyone else, who sent amps for upgrading received a shipping notice?


----------



## bregosanto

kaushama, Great Dane posted that note here first. Scroll back up this page. Exciting news though... that things are satrting to move again at Xin's.


----------



## kaushama

Ah! I didn't see it. So GreatDane have you got it? GOTO is there anything new with regards to tweaking?
 I hate listening to my new HD580 through unamped Audigy!! Yuck!! I may get a LDM+ or Xenos REP before I get XIN wonder. Can't live without an amp!!!!


----------



## GreatDane

kaushama,

 Xin sent that email to me this past Wed.I haven't received the amp yet, I'm hoping that the amp will arrive Mon. or Tue.

 I hadn't visited Xins forum for a while and I didn't see any recent comments about shipping dates etc. so I thought my news might bring a bit of relief to some people.


----------



## tnmike1

I ordered my Supermacro IV two Fridays ago and no word. Sent Xin a note via his forum requesting an approx ship date and as of now, still no word. Hopefully I'll get this sometime before Christmas???? I realize I'm in for a long wait, but I thought I'd at least get a confirmation altho I did get an official ID number so I guess that's something


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* 
_I ordered my Supermacro IV two Fridays ago and no word... Hopefully I'll get this sometime before Christmas????_

 

Perhaps Xin will put a nice bow on the amp for effect 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 [size=large]LOL[/size]





 ...well I hope you don't have to wait 2 months.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* 
_I ordered my Supermacro IV two Fridays ago and no word. Sent Xin a note via his forum requesting an approx ship date and as of now, still no word. Hopefully I'll get this sometime before Christmas???? I realize I'm in for a long wait, but I thought I'd at least get a confirmation altho I did get an official ID number so I guess that's something_

 

2 weeks? I bet that no one who has ordered a Xin amp has every taken just 2 weeks.

 Both my Xin amps took about 5 weeks to arrive. Still waiting for the dust to settle before I send my SMIV back for the updates...

 But fear not: Xin WILL get you your amp.


----------



## is2us

After years of being away from this forum, enjoying my Melos SHA/GOLd reference, the Melos died on me.
 I needed portability, so ordered the Supermacro IV, and joined the wait.
 I order mine on AUGUST 13, so I guess I'm in for long wait...
 I paid with PayPal, so I didn't even get any confirmation or ID number.

 I better find another solution meanwhile...

 BTW, does anyone know where I can repair my Melos, since Melos Restoration is out of business?


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* 
_I ordered my Supermacro IV two Fridays ago and no word... I thought I'd at least get a confirmation altho I did get an official ID number so I guess that's something_

 

You got an ID num. That is both "word" and "confirmation". 

 Evidently, delivery estimates are not Xin's strong suit, so any reply on that point sooner than a couple days in advance of shipment would have been equivalent to noise. All evidence indicates that his customers are happy or not, depending almost entirely on their personal ability to not have expectations about delivery dates. Anybody who wants to place and order then have the UPS guy deliver it in a timely fashion is in for a rough time. Those customers who stick with him report unreasonably-excellent service in terms of free upgrades, etc., but not in terms of timely response. 

 For me, personally, it is an exercise in patience. My circumstances permit that, and my wife tells me I could use a lesson or two. So, for me it's OK. However, I have wondered if the fawning glee among some of his fans whenever he says anything on his own forum (even if there is no real information in his messages) might be evidence of something akin to Stockholm Syndrome


----------



## tnmike1

Russdog: Ok thanks for enlightening me. I'm in retail, so my patience factor has grown immensely while awaiting customers to make final decisions. Good to know that number is both acceptnace and confirmation Will just wait the weeks like everyone else and be quiet about it.


----------



## FreeBlues

Just to stir this pot a bit more. While I have a SuperMicro on order (7/29) the impatience got to me. On Thursday, August 24th I broke down and called Ray Samuels. This morning, May 28th my new Hornet arrived. Except for the weekend, it probably would have been here even sooner!

 No I'm not cancelling my Xin order, I'll try them both and perhaps sell the one that finishes in second place. Perhaps not.


----------



## wakeride74

Just remember the Hornet needs 300 hours to settle in.


----------



## kugino

take this with a grain of salt...but someone over in xin's forum said that his upgraded mini just shipped. so looks like xin may be done with tinkering after all, and amps should start shipping quite soon.


----------



## alanz

I got an email today saying that something shipped to me from Xin.

 This should be a second generation SM-IV board that's being upgraded to the latest and greatest.

 As always, I await the package... and know I'll have a smile on my face at the end of that day. Auditioning/comparing his amps is always great fun!


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *alanz* 
_I got an email today saying that something shipped to me from Xin.

 This should be a second generation SM-IV board that's being upgraded to the latest and greatest.

 As always, I await the package... and know I'll have a smile on my face at the end of that day. Auditioning/comparing his amps is always great fun!_

 

yeah, looks like all the upgrades are being taken care of first...and then the new ones.


----------



## nfusion770

I might as well post here. I ordered a super mini July 29th. Changed order to micro Aug 9th. I have no idea where that puts me in the queue.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nfusion770* 
_I might as well post here. I ordered a super mini July 29th. Changed order to micro Aug 9th. I have no idea where that puts me in the queue._

 

merry christmas!


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_merry christmas! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## kaushama

Hansel too got mail from xin. Everything seems to be working well now.


----------



## vorlon1

What are the order dates of people who have been getting shipping notices?


----------



## kaushama

And see how things will change when everyone gets their amps! All praise probably! human mind!!!


----------



## aluren

yeah looks like only the upgrades are being shipped... i checked my credit card and it hasn't been charged yet... we'll see... finally a sign of life from dr. xin.


----------



## goto2003

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_And see how things will change when everyone gets their amps! All praise probably! human mind!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Probably yes, probably not
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Xin made some last minute changes and I just tried them. Honestly, I think they made sound worse and are not my cup of tea. Sorry, guys.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have told him about this and he may reconsider my original configuration suggestion, which sounded right to me.


----------



## kaushama

GOTO Why did Xin wanTed to include those changes if they make the sound worse? Increase the stability?


----------



## goto2003

Because he used RMAA while we used our own ears.


----------



## kaushama

So Did Xin surrender to your Golden ears? 
 How is the battery life now? I heard IV amps drain batteries more than III amps.
 Still the default OPAMP in macro OPA2134?


----------



## kaushama

Since Xin has started shipping upgraded amps please post here again the date of order and date of shipping notice for update purposes!


----------



## Nick Christy

*
 Summary: Order date (update or shipping date)*

 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kugino: July 5th
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_*
 Summary: Order date (update or shipping date)*

 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kugino: July 5th
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22_

 

you got me on there twice...i hope i only ordered one amp


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_*
 Summary: Order date (update or shipping date)*

 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kugino: July 5th
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djbnh, posted 8/5/06* 
_I mailed in my SuperMacro-3 V6 on 6/14 to get the unit upgraded to the SM-IV. I subsequently heard from Dr. Xin on 8/1 about 1) the final cost and 2) that the amp was to be shipped "very soon". I'll edit this post when the amp's received._

 

You don't have me up there at all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Edit: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## mrarroyo

Placed my order for a Supermacro IV on August 6.


----------



## GreatDane

Ordered June 29.


 Received shipping notice on Aug. 23...1 to 2 days 'till ship...still waiting.

EDIT-Just today(Aug.30) Xin sent me an email confirming shipment of my Supermini IV


----------



## stevenkelby

Ordered Macro July 29, had contact but no shipping notice.


----------



## kaushama

djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 

 It seems new amps are made after all amps upgraded. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Goto So the final configuration shipped is your suggestion or XIN's Last edition?


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 

 It seems new amps are made after all amps upgraded. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Goto So the final configuration shipped is your suggestion or XIN's Last edition?_

 

Kaushama,

 Yeah i noticed that. It seems backward to me that those who are paying for their amps (or paid for in my case as i used paypal) are waiting for free upgrades to be completed. IN some cases free upgrades that were sent in weeks later.

 Go figure.






 Nick


----------



## aluren

i guess its easier to upgrade existing amps and implement new parts on the board than to make new amps... so maybe sending amps back for upgrading wouldn't take that long after all, since obviously dr. xin is making that a priority over new orders.


----------



## kaushama

Every dark cloud has a silver lining in it!!!

 dark cloud>  Quote:


 Finally received my updated SM4 today. 10 minutes later I read my email and read a message saying to send it back again. 
 

 drew: XIN Forum

 Silver Lining >  Quote:


 I think with the last minutes tweaks, the stability was improved yet slightly compromised in sq; but I have to admitt that it sounds really great though. At first I thought it didn't sound good was because there's a tiny solder residue between two traces. After cleaning it up, it sounded good to me. 
 

 GOTO2003 : XIN Forum

 So those who got them recently, is it "resend time"??? Or only Drew had a specific problem? We will wait and see!!!!


----------



## goto2003

I haven't encountered instability issue without these last minute tweaks and compromise in sq seems too costy as I could feel the sound with these tweaks was inferior to that without them, not just sounding differently, a big compromise to me. Of course, I may have been too critical on this


----------



## kaushama

GOTO, Suddenly you seem to be unhappy about the SQ of final configuration! Is it a major downgrade? I think there should be a right balance between stability and SQ. Afterall most of us will never try to roll and tweak the amps with all the opamps under the sun!


----------



## goto2003

As mentioned before, I have yet to tweak a SM IV offers better sound than my combo that's too bulky to carry around. Isn't it evil of upgraditis?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Without the newest tweaks, it sounded close enough to my combo, but not better. When Xin told me the tweaks, as always, I was excited to try them out; but it turned out to be a downgrade in sound. Yes, I am unhappy with these new tweaks, but happy with the music from the combo all the time, a big comfort to me though


----------



## bregosanto

goto, have you made noises to Xin re your unhappiness? What has he said in his defence? What now is different from the previous Xin Mk IV amps, what has changed? 
 It's a noticeable downgrade to your ears, but would those that have never had/heard a Xin amp before be dissapointed in the sound output? I'm worried that living in the UK, shipping an amp back and forth (when I finally receive it) will be timely and costly if it needs tweaking again.
 I was excited that the Xin production line had started moving again, but now I'm not so sure... $350 is expensive for an amp that may not be sonically 100% to Xin's confidants.


----------



## aluren

goto, i thought you didn't like the new tweak because there was some dust in a certain part in your amp and that once you cleaned it up, the new tweak does in fact sound better...


----------



## goto2003

It's true. SM IV sounded not right to me at the begining and it's until yesterday that I found there's solder residue on it. After cleaning it off, it's much better, but still not as good as without these new tweaks. Xin knew it and hope he could have a better solution shortly.


----------



## kaushama

But you seem to be quite dissatisfied! As you said 
  Quote:


 imho, SR71 is a safe bite in the "best sounding league". 
 

 in Bigger rivals to SMIV thread. With all tweaks and channel IV technique you Still think SR-71 is better????


----------



## goto2003

SR71 is a great sounding portable, same as SM IV's. I am reluctant to compare the two given the continuing changes in SM IV. Unless Xin fixes his design, it's unlikely to have a conclusion. In addition, there's are many other factors other than sound to define which one is "better"; Finally, everyone has his/her own preference in sound, which making the comparison more difficult. just my two cents.


----------



## digitalcat

Goto, can you identify all the necessary mods that makes supermacro IV sounds best as you perceived? I remember at a certain point you thought the tweaks are really worth it. Maybe we can ask Dr. Xin to do limited tweaks and leave the unnecessary ones out.


----------



## ComfyCan

Talk about a tangled web!

 I suppose we'll just have to wait on reviews by the folks who received version IV amps and then sent them back for tweaking to see if GoTo's observatons are unigue or widespread. Actually, I don't think there are more than a couple of people in the world who heard the version Goto preferred, so we may never know. 

 I still haven't gotten a clear answer whether there has been any actual design change on the Super*Micro* IV since mine was shipped on July 26 (rec'd July 28th), so I don't even know if there is a tweak available. I'm still quite happy with the Micro as-is. 

 I may buy a Macro one of these days, but I'm going to let the dust settle a bit first.


----------



## kaushama

Yes GOTO I asked Dr. XIN also in the forum about apparent SQ decrement in new tweaks. Your were all happy regarding SQ earlier. I think making amp 100% stable is only one way of several, to go which might not serve audiophiles here. Though the signature of XIN amps is tweakability many would not ever touch the amp if SQ is good. 
 Dr. XIN has to keep the right balance and compromise between SQ vs stability. I am yet to See comment of instability amongst members who received bunch of 99.99% amps.
 It is NOT possible for non-US members like us to send the amp back and forth for frequent upgrades. So much so I am going to order a XENOS 0HA or GO-VIBE 5 as a backup now. At one point I almost gave up XIN amp like several others did, to buy a good home amp like SR-71, HR micro or AE-1. 
 We all played this waiting game and had immense amount of patience allowing Dr. XIN to finish his work expecting a gem shined by his special skills. 
 Why these last moment tweaks are so crucial?


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Xin came up with new ideas and I just tried them and the sound is beautiful. Kaushama, I am happy now
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 changes in resistor, caps, etc and has nothing to do with opamp's.

 I think all amps would be influenced. Mini has almost the same scheme as Macro. though it's painful to send it in again. But my ears told me now the sound's right and sweet. Xin may put these amps coming in for 2nd upgrade on the highest priority in his agenda. 
 

 GOTO2003

 Tweaks, Tweaks Tweaks Tweeeeeeks tks!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 If these tweaks were incremental in improving SQ .......... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 May be the best SUPERMACRO IV will be the last one produced just before SUPERMACRO V!!!

 Just kidding! Its kinda boring without an amp these days!! Going nuts???


----------



## aluren

another tweak huh? i wonder just how good this amp is going to be now that goto had mentioned that the SR-71 actually sounded better than the supermacro. you know i was expecting that the xin amp will surpass the sound quality of the SR-71 since so much time has been put in to make and tweak this amp to optimal performance... i must do some opamp rolling when i get the amp since i've waited this long just so that the opamp rolling will work on this amp...


----------



## GreatDane

Supermini IV ordered June 29 , received TODAY
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Can someone give me a link to a users manual or general feedback on use for the Supermini IV? I'm not sure how to use the 4 jumpers. I'm guessing that they're active when the pin is in? So to convert my ER4P into an ER4S I leave the pin in? -and gain, bass boost & xfeed.

 I haven't used it yet and I'm waiting until I know what I'm doing.


----------



## kaushama

GreatDane! Congrads on your new amp. We all are happy and envy you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Try here,

http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?...59&whichpage=1


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I wonder just how good this amp is going to be now that goto had mentioned that the SR-71 actually sounded better than the supermacro. you know i was expecting that the xin amp will surpass the sound quality of the SR-71 since so much time has been put in to make and tweak this amp to optimal performance... 
 

Yes it should bypass SR-71 by quite a margin! But GOTO's recommendation, being one of co-designers, quite puzzling.

 So DR. XIN has started shipping new amps then! I am excited. There were few who received uupgraded amps with most recent tweaks.
 We demand (or rather humbly request) your impressions!


----------



## Skylab

I feel lucky that I have my SupermacroIV, since it works well and sounds good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Even if it is 99.9%, since 100% seems very elusive...


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_I feel lucky that I have my SupermacroIV, since it works well and sounds good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Even if it is 99.9%, since 100% seems very elusive..._

 

i agree. good for you...seems like the latest tweaks were more for stability/compatibility with all (or most) op-amps. if your op-amp choice is running fine, i don't see why anyone would want to send it in for unnecessary tweaking. 

 i'm not sure how many amps were ordered b/n 6/29 and my 7/05, but i hope it's zero 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 should get mine in maybe a week or two? fingers crossed.


----------



## aluren

Greatdane, where are those impressions?? you have the most recent xin amp! what an exlcusive club you're in!!!


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_Greatdane, where are those impressions?? you have the most recent xin amp! what an exlcusive club you're in!!!_

 

Thanks guys but I'm still trying to figure out how to use the pins. I've seen the pics on Xins site like this one:
 {In this picture, the positions of the jumpers set the Amp gain to 8 (high) and enable Crossfeed}-Xin





 I'm confused as to how all of the pins work .I'm going by the pic and I want to enable xfeed(check) So if I want to add 75 Ohms to convert my ER4P to an ER4S do I move the "I" pin from what's shown in the pic .They're so damn small I can hardly see what I'm doing. I took one of the jumpers off and nearly lost the damn thing.

 ...so no, I haven't listened yet.


----------



## aluren

do you really need to play with those switches to use that amp??


----------



## ath

aluren,

 Not really. For most users, default settings and opamps is sufficient. On the other hand, you need to put two AAA batteries 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 to use the amp. 

 GreatDane,

 What you are doing is right with those impedance switches. Make sure that you put the jumper back like shown in the picture for the gain jumpers so that you don't lose it. 

 Using a pair of tweezers is really helpful. If you lose jumpers you should be able to find those at a local electronics store.

 Please have a listen and provide us poor souls some feedback.

 Thanks

 Anand.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_do you really need to play with those switches to use that amp?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

HA! I wish they were actual switches and not these tiny jumpers. It makes turning on and off the features a real pain. I would have bought the Macro but for what I'm using it for primarily it'd be too big.I spent a few months trying to decide which amp I really wanted.

 The Supermini is even smaller than what I imagined. I've stuck some Velcro to the removable panel and it looks tiny while piggybacking on my ZV:M.

 I have figured out the jumpers.

 I prefer:

 -Impedance added( although I've having a tough time discerning the difference)...need to listen more.
 -Gain set at low
 -Bass boost on (very nice)
 -Crossfeed *see below*

_unofficial preliminary review:_

 As I was starting to compare the SM to my HR Micro I realized that the Xinfeed knocks the stereo seperation down a lot more than the HR xfeed. I'm not really liking what I hear with Xinfeed, it almost sounds mono.-I need to listen to more tracks for a final conclusion. I'd like to hear from other Xinfeed users with your results when comparing Xins crossfeed to the HR or Meier...which I haven't compared yet but is my favorite between HR & Meier.

 So, for my quick comparison to my Micro('06 desktop module) I used Patricia Barber - Cafe Blue.The disc is a Mobile Fidelity SACD(aka "Original Master Recording") This title has very clean sounding acoustic instruments, mainly upright bass and various drums with her voice having nice reverberation in the studio.I often use this disc for comparisons."Too Rich For My Blood" is my favorite track and is what I listened to several times.

 I disabled crosfeed & bass boost on the SM and left the added impedance. I used my ER4P with my Pioneer Elite DV-45A as the source.

 Using my Micro I turned off crosfeed and used the medium gain. 

 My impression is that the SM has a more open(better soundstage??), better detailed sound. With the upright bass I can more easily hear the fingers plucking the strings,etc. In general, the Micro has a warmer(would be a nice word) sound where the SM is less veiled...trying to put this nicely.

 I also compared using the line out of my ZV:M > SM vs. headphone out with the ER4P. The amped version was easily more detailed.

 The Supermini IV is a very clean sounding portable amp.

 I've yet to listen with any other cans that I own but I'm eager to try my DT-880.


----------



## kaushama

djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 

 Next in the list at least inthis............ Yeah Kugino and Myself!


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 

 Next in the list at least inthis............ Yeah Kugino and Myself! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

well, kaushama...let's hope that no one else ordered amps in the first few days of july...way back when i estimated a mid-september date...my prognostications may indeed be right


----------



## ComfyCan

Great Dane,
 Thanks for the initial impressions. It sounds like the soundstage/detail characteristics are indeed the "signature" of the IV series: Micro, Mini, and Macro.


----------



## kaushama

If so the channel IV topology works!! Idea being to reduce the distortion and crosstalk to maximum. If the clarity, separation and soundstage is improved significantly we have a winner. Other sonic changes are mainly subjected to opamp characteristics. So with Dr.XIN's last minute efforts, if the amp is very stable, we can play around with it to change the sonic signature with various OPAMP combinations.
 Well done Dr.XIN!


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_Great Dane,
 Thanks for the initial impressions..._

 

You're welcome.

 I've been listening to my "portable" rig for a few hours. I just plugged in my HD650 and what I've discovered re the xfeed problem that I mentioned earlier is that with the SM volume at around 95% max. the seperation returns. As I mentioned, the xfeed seems to be almost mono but with the volume near max., which I needed w/ the 650(amp gain @ low) to get proper volume, the xfeed sounds good to me. 

 Now I'm thinking that my amp is defective. I guess I need to contact Xin (yeah, good luck w/that)


----------



## ath

GreatDane,

 Great review, thanks. I would suggest letting the amp settle a bit. Possibly turn the Crossfeed off for a while. I would suggest experimenting with Bassboost, it really pumps up ER4. 

 Thanks

 Anand


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ath* 
_GreatDane,

 Great review, thanks. I would suggest letting the amp settle a bit. Possibly turn the Crossfeed off for a while. I would suggest experimenting with Bassboost, it really pumps up ER4. 

 Thanks

 Anand_

 

I did wonder if letting the amp break in for a while would change things a bit. I might put in a fresh pair of NiMH and let it "burn-in" for a day. 

 I was just really disapointed when I heard the xfeed because being able to have xfeed with my IEMs in an ultra-portable rig was my main reason for buying the SM.

 I really do like the bass boost with my ER4P , I haven't listened to my E4 yet.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* 
_I did wonder if letting the amp break in for a while would change things a bit. I might put in a fresh pair of NiMH and let it "burn-in" for a day. 

 I was just really disapointed when I heard the xfeed because being able to have xfeed with my IEMs in an ultra-portable rig was my main reason for buying the SM.

 I really do like the bass boost with my ER4P , I haven't listened to my E4 yet._

 

crossfeed isn't always a big audible difference, especially with newer recordings. if you listen to a lot of stuff from the 70s or earlier, crossfeed might be useful, but IMO it's not that big of a deal with newer stuff. but then again, it's my experience with the headfive's crossfeed implementation, which didn't really do it for me. what stuff are you listening to?


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_crossfeed isn't always a big audible difference, especially with newer recordings. if you listen to a lot of stuff from the 70s or earlier, crossfeed might be useful, but IMO it's not that big of a deal with newer stuff. but then again, it's my experience with the headfive's crossfeed implementation, which didn't really do it for me. what stuff are you listening to?_

 

I've been listening to a lot of jazz lately, new & old. Listening to female jazz singers is my weak spot. I like many different genres, new and old music(from early 70's and newer). 

 With my "home" rig I use the Corda Cross-1 about 95% of the time. After getting used to how xfeed sounds,I prefer it with most everything.

 I've not heard the H5 but I imagine that Jan used a very similar design as compared to the CC-1. With the CC-1 I use the least amount of xfeed and vary the bass & treble gains.

 Even with newer recordings that other listeners may not have a problem with, if there's any "ping-ponging" of instruments or voice , my ears get fatigued and it really bothers me. 

 I've done a lot of experimenting with my CC-1 and the xfeed on my Micro, turning it on and off several times with the same track, with hundreds of different tracks.

 Even if I decide that I don't want to use xfeed with a particular track because it doesn't benefit from it, I can still usualy hear the subtle difference. I will agree that xfeed can "kill" detail at times, for instance with classical music with no "ping-pongy" effects but having well suited reverberation.


----------



## is2us

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 




_

 

You can add me at the end of list at AUGUST 13


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *is2us* 
_You can add me at the end of list at AUGUST 13 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I wasnt added either. Ordered Mini July 28th- order changed to Micro- confirmed on Aug 9th. I assume that keeps me in the queue for the 28th but dont really know.


----------



## kaushama

djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 nfusion770: July 28th
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 
 is2us: AUGUST 13

 OK welcome to the suffering!!!


----------



## FreeBlues

As long as you're updating the list, I'm on for July 26th for a SuperMicro.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


 OK welcome to the suffering!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	












 

LOL!!! yeah, welcome to the suffering!


----------



## lolos

Add me for July 4th 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - Supermini ... & still waiting ...


----------



## is2us

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_OK welcome to the suffering!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	











_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_LOL!!! yeah, welcome to the suffering!_

 

You don't realize how much suffering. My Melos broke and I'm now completely ampless !!!!!


----------



## kaushama

djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 lolos: July 4th 
 Kaushama:July 5th 
 Kugino:july 5th
 883dave: July 7th
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 nfusion770: July 28th
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 
 is2us: AUGUST 13

 IOLOS that further suffering for me and Kugino!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			







 is2us I sold all my amps to step up Supermini to Supermacro. I have a new HD580 burning in with my crappy Audigy out! AAArgh thats what I call real suffering!!
 By way orders are processed I am pretty sure, there should be another tweak going around . This may be to resolve the dispute with GOTO.
 GOTO can you enlighten us?


----------



## kaushama

BTW Robster have you got your amp?


----------



## robster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_BTW Robster have you got your amp?_

 

Yep,my Supermacro IV arrived Aug 4th. I placed the order on June 30th. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## is2us

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_is2us I sold all my amps to step up Supermini to Supermacro. I have a new HD580 burning in with my crappy Audigy out!_

 

OK, so you probably suffer a little more, as I have an old HD580 been buring in for 6 years now. And I have the headphone out of SONY D-25s, which I guess is much better than Audigy's. Anyway, it's hard been ampless after 6 years with the Melos. I'll probably find a solution before the Supermacro arrive...


----------



## aluren

looks like all orders before june were fulfilled... i guess xin sets his own deadlines and no orders should be more than 3 months long... so july orders will be shipped in october... have fun guys.


----------



## kaushama

At least we will enjoy other's pleasures. Robster How do you like it? Post some of your pleasures for us to share. 
 Oh Boy! This reminds me, my naughty school days, when we used to get pleasure out of hearing others "pleasure" stories!!!! LOL


----------



## jdimitri

For those waiting, here's a first impression that i'll expand on soon:
http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=196930
 It's worth the wait 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (i got mine used
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Received my upgraded SuperMacro IV on Friday.
 Then I got an email saying I would receive a new bottom board soon.
 Roni 
 

datawolf: XIN Forum

  Quote:


 that's a good news as it seems Xin has taken the "best sound possible" idea seriously and designed new pcb's for it. 
 

 GOTO2003: XIN FORUM

 GOTO We would love to know more about this!


----------



## robster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_At least we will enjoy other's pleasures. Robster How do you like it? Post some of your pleasures for us to share. 
 Oh Boy! This reminds me, my naughty school days, when we used to get pleasure out of hearing others "pleasure" stories!!!! LOL 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Howdee-well let me start off I'm not an audio-fool (phile) I'm just striving for the best sound. So far I love my XIN Supermacro IV with default chipset 2134? whatever is listed as the current default op amp. 
 I mainly use the amp on the go while walking the dogs,hooked up to my RWA Imod Ipod and Senn HD25's and at home with AKG 701's while lounging on the sofa.
 The mids and highs are sweet and smooth like butta'! the bass is just right and tight,
 the only amps I've owned before,a RSA un-modded Hornet and A Portaphile maxxed amp. The Xin is my favorite,it just has a more engaging sound for my ears. 
 A local fellow Head-fi-er has a Larocco PRII and sometime soon we will compare amps. 
 BTW I'm also using Rockbox. 
 Plus the XIN amp is just the right size for my Headroom mini bag and my RnB mini diamond cable WILL fit inside with the bag zippered shut. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## kaushama

wow! That's very good! Almost got an eargasm!! Have I spelled it correct????
 If new PCB achieves XIN's DREAM ever, we are likely to get continuous eargasms hopefully by Christmas! HA HA HA 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Kugino call you feel the heat??? LOL
 And it beats HORNET and PORTAPHILE maxxed! I am happy I waited!


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_wow! That's very good! Almost got an eargasm!! Have I spelled it correct????
 If new PCB achieves XIN's DREAM ever, we are likely to get continuous eargasms hopefully by Christmas! HA HA HA 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Kugino call you feel the heat??? LOL
 And it beats HORNET and PORTAPHILE maxxed! I am happy I waited!_

 

the heat? yeah, it's still in the mid-90s here in northern cali...may be a hundred sometime this week....not that heat? oh, the heat from our amps being shipped soon? no, i don't feel that heat. not at all.


----------



## kaushama

GOTO DO you know anything about new PCBs? HAve they been designed fully and given for fabrication. New PCB may need another round of tweaking!


----------



## aluren

ooo... new boards... what next? new case? new power supply? new color? cryogenically treated boards? 

 i wonder when all this is said and done, will it still be called a version IV or more likely a version V??


----------



## kaushama

I have got the shipping notice by Dr. XIN and will reach here by 4-5 days! I am excited!!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Micro/Mini sounded better than Macro to me from the very begining; it's just after the newest round of tweaks last week that made Macro catch up with Micro/Mini in sound. It makes much sense for Xin to provide a new amping pcb for Macro IV users, a good move, imho. 
 

 GOTO

 There is another person in XIN's forum who received shipping notice and he ordered in July13th. Everything seems to be moving fast now. Kugino have you got yours?


----------



## wangch

ordered on July 9 got an email today, my supermini IV is coming


----------



## lolos

OH boy! I got my shipping notice today too


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_GOTO

 There is another person in XIN's forum who received shipping notice and he ordered in July13th. Everything seems to be moving fast now. Kugino have you got yours?_

 

nope, no shipping notice here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 wonder if i should contact xin...


----------



## kaushama

I think person in XIN forum ordered on 1st July than 13th It may be a typo. He has posted in another place giving the date as 1st.

http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?...10&whichpage=3 and
http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showp...6&postcount=19

 Sorry Kugino!


----------



## Nick Christy

Kaushama, 

 Wangch ordered after Kugino, so Kugino quite rightly should expect to have been notified first. I ordered on 11 July and have heard nothing.

 Nick


----------



## aluren

ordered on july 13 and got nothing yet. wow, kaushama, looks like thiis xin journey is almost over for you! lucky person!!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_ordered on july 13 and got nothing yet. wow, kaushama, looks like thiis xin journey is almost over for you! lucky person!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Oh no, he is just getting started. Now comes the art of rolling OP amps.


----------



## nfusion770

I don't think Xin is the problem- its all the headfiers who are derelict in their responsibility to keep the rest of us informed about Xins shipping the late July orders. Have you people no consideration for the rest of us?


----------



## kugino

i emailed xin about my order (july 05, supermini) and he said that another batch of amps will be shipped today...he kept saying that micros will be shipped so that i should be getting my micro soon. nevermind that i ordered a supermini and it was the title of my email. oh well, i'll see what shows up in a few days


----------



## kaushama

Yeah The journey has only begun. OPAMP rolling and getting upgrades! May be later V5? Need to get a DAC too. Curse you all headhifiers!!!!!
 Late july dudes! Suffer more!!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 But why don't we continue to maintain the log of orders sothat everybody knows how much suffering left.


----------



## kaushama

Here we go!

 djbnh: June 14th
 Slappy: June 15th (CC charged on 15th July)
 Comfycan: June 17th
 Skev13: June 22nd (got the shipping notice on 27th July)
 GreatDane: June 29 (shipping notice on Aug. 23)
 robster: June 30 (Got an email for shipping within this week)
 lolos: July 4th (got the notice)
 [size=medium]Kaushama:July 5th (Got the shipping notice)[/size] 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Kugino:july 5th (Suffer little bit more 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )
 883dave: July 7th (Given up the amp
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )
 wangch: July 9th ( Got the notice) 
 Nick Christy: July 11th
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 nfusion770: July 28th
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. 
 is2us: AUGUST 13


----------



## Skylab

From the "credit where credit is due department"...

 I send Xin an email this afternoon, and in less than 4 hours he replied, indicating that if I sent my amp in it would be turned around quickly. So I am going to do it.


----------



## kaushama

Yeah! His silence, though interpreted as an act of rudeness often, is not that. I think, he is the only person, who thrives to provide perfect products in one generation without considering financial gains. His enterprise is sort of a project continuously evolving products. He is always modest enough to admit that he does not get it at first shot and need more maturing before it lands on the hands of his valued customers, who pay for his living.
 Let alone money, who will devote entire weeks of time and effort for developing a new architecture, when he knows further tweaking will not gain any financial benefits for him. Perhaps financial loss due to upgrading items and shipping them free of charge.
 He is most weird kind of buisinessman, I have ever seen for his honesty and lust for providing best for the customers.
 I am sure, all his critics will praise him for providing unique product at the end of the day.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_From the "credit where credit is due department"...

 I send Xin an email this afternoon, and in less than 4 hours he replied, indicating that if I sent my amp in it would be turned around quickly. So I am going to do it._

 

noooooo.... that means i'm gonna have to wait longer!!


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Yeah! His silence, though interpreted as an act of rudeness often, is not that. I think, he is the only person, who thrives to provide perfect products in one generation without considering financial gains._

 


 Absolute Rubbish.

 Vinnie at Redwine Audio also does this, Gary at Electric Avenues does too and I'm sure there are others.

 The difference is they aren't totally disorganised in their approach and it works seemlessly, no on has to wait for an order or a turnaround and therefore there are no threads complaining.

 Xin's products may be good, but the delay isn't caused because of any altruistic principles of giving his customers the best product. He didnt test them properly to start with, found a problem after taking orders and has had to fix it.

 Xin sells his amps for money, as do all the other manufacturers. It's a business transaction, nothing else.


----------



## kaushama

Yes XIN is doing a business transaction. But I can't see the logic of his way of doing business, if he only thrives to make money.
All the people who got 99% amps agree, it is a step up from SM3V6. All impressions and reviews were good. They never experienced so called problems or lesser sound quality than previous models. In fact few of them still do not want to send amps for upgrading despite all claims that new versions are better.*So the problems of XIN 4 99% amps are unknown to users, if XIN wouldn't have got frank with his amps*.
 If as a typical businessman who wants make maximum out of his creations XIN should have continued to ship 99% amps and later declare almost newly laid present generation as version 5 or "X" version of 4th channel technology. It will give him more purchases and less trouble of sending upgrades for ZERO bucks. He is even loosing money to ship them free.
Its because of his honesty we know that 99% amps have a slight problem. Its because of his honesty in labeling the amps, we still get and enjoy continuously evolving generation 4 amps.
 He is doing illogical things as a businessman, getting himself less profit and more trouble. One can interpret either XIN is extremely foolish in his approach to business or extremely honest without giving much priority to profit making.
 Despite all criticisms people still wait to enjoy his amps ( eVen Critics) If these amps were average eBay CMOY like products nobody would have bothered to even site this thread. 
 He is letting his products to speak volumes about his customer care. I like him for his silence towards critics. What a cool man.
 Whether he is a foolish buisinessman or a honest clever scientist, who gives less priority for earning money, can be deduced by looking at his engineering marvels and the rate he develops new concepts. 
 It is an ongoing audiophile project and less of a business!!! At least to me!!


----------



## Nick Christy

Kaushama,

 I dont diagree with you, I'm just saying that he's not unique or anything special in that regard, just more disorganised.

 Nick


----------



## kaushama

Yes the "business" part of his project is in total disarray! That's why I too suggested him to at least hire few high school kids to reply emails and perhaps make new amps.
 But along with his obsession for perfection, "SOLO performance in every aspect in his enterprise", may be another quality; he himself is obsessed with!


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Yes XIN is doing a business transaction. But I can't see the logic of his way of doing business, if he only thrives to make money.
All the people who got 99% amps agree, it is a step up from SM3V6. All impressions and reviews were good. They never experienced so called problems or lesser sound quality than previous models. In fact few of them still do not want to send amps for upgrading despite all claims that new versions are better.*So the problems of XIN 4 99% amps are unknown to users, if XIN wouldn't have got frank with his amps*.
 If as a typical businessman who wants make maximum out of his creations XIN should have continued to ship 99% amps and later declare almost newly laid present generation as version 5 or "X" version of 4th channel technology. It will give him more purchases and less trouble of sending upgrades for ZERO bucks. He is even loosing money to ship them free.
Its because of his honesty we know that 99% amps have a slight problem. Its because of his honesty in labeling the amps, we still get and enjoy continuously evolving generation 4 amps.
 He is doing illogical things as a businessman, getting himself less profit and more trouble. One can interpret either XIN is extremely foolish in his approach to business or extremely honest without giving much priority to profit making.
 Despite all criticisms people still wait to enjoy his amps ( eVen Critics) If these amps were average eBay CMOY like products nobody would have bothered to even site this thread. 
 He is letting his products to speak volumes about his customer care. I like him for his silence towards critics. What a cool man.
 Whether he is a foolish buisinessman or a honest clever scientist, who gives less priority for earning money, can be deduced by looking at his engineering marvels and the rate he develops new concepts. 
 It is an ongoing audiophile project and less of a business!!! At least to me!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 A few days ago I didnt understand this- although I never complained, I was a little annoyed at his communication and delays. After reading the big thread on his site, I began to understand what he is about. I agree with you- he intends to provide customer service via perfecting his product. I also agree that there isn't any financial incentive for him to operate this way. It's goofy, but its perfectly acceptable from a guy who seems to be this honest/ obsessed. For all the complaining, I dont have the slightest feeling that anyone questions that they will eventually get an amp- one that sounds great. Xin seems a good guy, just unorthadox.


----------



## Skylab

I think Xin cares about both his products and his customers, but I still totally believe that the way he runs his business isn't just unorthodox, it's just plain bad. He isn't evil or dishonest at ALL, just the opposite, as many have pointed out. He always gets you the product you order...eventually. But the way he actually operates his business does not encourage people to buy from him, it actually discourages them. Since I am actually a fan of his amps, I wish he would improve it.


----------



## aluren

yeah and the fact that he's not profit driven doesn't really ring with me either. i rather have the supermacro 2-3 weeks after i ordered, which would be around late july, listen to it and enjoying it for another month or two, then if he announces a new update, i will gladly pay $20-30 bucks for it, rather than not having an amp but have upgrades for free. because frankly, i'm buying a month of my life with the amp for that extra 20-30 bucks...


----------



## russdog

I ordered a SM IV on 7/21, and am still waiting. It's OK, I can wait. I'm not used to waiting for a product, but there's no big hurry. Along the way, I read what everybody says about the amps and the man who makes them. Here's my take: I think Xin is an honorable person who does things the way he wants to do them. I think there is no question of him being a bad guy, I think it is abundantly clear that he is a good guy. At the same time, he arranges his life and his business to suit his own priorities, which is his right, but which also causes inconvenience to others. He treats them honorably but also inconveniences them, due solely to "the way he is". He could make a small number of changes (like hiring one measely assistant) and treat people a lot better. He doesn't do this because he doesn't feel like it.

 These things are OK with me. It is what it is, and he is who he is. I don't especially want to see people down on him. But neither do I want to see all this insane Xin-love either. I know people like him, but some of these people are talking like he's Mother Theresa or Albert Schweitzer. He's not. He's a guy who makes amps for a living. Somebody even made a post about him being a wise and silent father, and we his wayward children. That's just nuts. People on his site post fawning "you're so great" replies to him whenever he posts anything, even when his posts don't say anything much at all. It's as if they're suffering from Stockhom Syndrome. All in all, I'm not down on Xin, but neither is he Saint Xin either. Some of his fans are loopy.


----------



## nfusion770

The alternative would be to sell old amps for the last 5 months while he perfected the new ones. Then in Sept or Oct, when he gets all the details hammered out, slightly irritate all of his most recent customers (like every other company does) by releasing a brand new product. I think the way he is doing it is completely ass backwards, but actually gets the better amp into the hands of his customers (which apparently he upgrades for free).

 I think it is very strange, kind of like beta testing or something, but in a weird way it is actually of benefit to his customers. The only people who have a valid claim (IMHO) are the ones who were charged without shipment before he went back into experiment stage, but even Xin admitted that was a mistake.

 I dont know, I am new to this and think it will be interesting to see if the upgrading continues forever, or if shipping catches up once he stops tinkering.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *russdog* 
_ I don't especially want to see people down on him. But neither do I want to see all this insane Xin-love either. I know people like him, but some of these people are talking like he's Mother Theresa or Albert Schweitzer. He's not. He's a guy who makes amps for a living. Somebody even made a post about him being a wise and silent father, and we his wayward children. That's just nuts. People on his site post fawning "you're so great" replies to him whenever he posts anything, even when his posts don't say anything much at all. It's as if they're suffering from Stockhom Syndrome. All in all, I'm not down on Xin, but neither is he Saint Xin either. Some of his fans are loopy._

 

This made me laugh so hard I spit coffee on my monitor. Well said.


----------



## kaushama

HA ha 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 Now who are behaving like wayward children???!!! I expected this long before when I said that and wanted to hear this. We all can get nervous, furious and arrogant. What XIN does then. Silently makes amps! We do what? Still buy them and suggesting various things.
 He is no saint!! Comparatively we are not either wayward children too, I guess!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 His being honest with 99% amps, does not equal to being a saint and afterall he charged me 350$ for making me an amp! 
 I quite agree he needs to give more consideration into his communication skills and organizing his business.
 But I really like his cool composure!!! Though he is not a saint; while all these things are said, both good and bad about him, what does he do.
 Not a single word!!! He makes amps everybody loves to get and hear.
 What A cool man
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 !!! Like him ( reminds me David in KUNG-FU series)!!!!
 But I am sure he looses lots of money for keeping this cool! It doesn't matter. After all he ain't no saint!!!


----------



## kaushama

And its good to have varying opinions like this for two reasons!
 firstly, if ever XIN looks into these forums (I doubt) he will think hiring someone and do the changes perhaps.
 Secondly, till one gets his amp (DURATION Bottle necked by XIN's own terms) they have good grounds to show their emotions! (My primary concern when I started this thread: Easing out my tension of not having an amp!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )
BUT WE ALL SHARE ONE QUALITY! WE ALL ARE LOVERS OF GOOD MUSIC AND BETTER EQUIPMENT WHICH GIVE US THAT PLEASURE! XIN IS PROVIDING ONE SUCH GEAR!!!! 
 SHALL WE LISTEN TO SOME MUSIC?


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_But I really like his cool composure!!! Though he is not a saint; while all these things are said, both good and bad about him, what does he do.
 Not a single word!!! He makes amps everybody loves to get and hear.
 What cool man
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 !!! Like him ( reminds me David in KUNG-FU series)!!!!_

 

Man, if you'd grown up like a normal kid (you know, with heroes who were baseball players, or rock stars, or whatever), then you wouldn't be acting like a teenager who's in love with an amp-maker who you don't even know...


----------



## kaushama

I am sure I will love his amp!! Hmmm I am not sure about loving XIN!? Nah I will never love him. I have seen so many sexy Hollywood film stars during my teenage!! I really DO LOVE them! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Do we have something in common??


----------



## GreatDane




----------



## skev13

got an IC on the FS forum for my SuperMicro IV


----------



## Skylab

I sold my SuperMacroIV on the FS Forums today.


----------



## aluren

wow, after xin is finally shipping out amps, we have a sudden influx of sales... skylab, robster, slev13... who's next?? 

 i wonder why? seems kinda like an anti-climatic thing... just when we posted like 20 pages of stuff on this thread, we are finally getting the amps.... oh well, i guess i'll have to see how my supermacro is.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_wow, after xin is finally shipping out amps, we have a sudden influx of sales... skylab, robster, slev13... who's next?? 

 i wonder why? seems kinda like an anti-climatic thing... just when we posted like 20 pages of stuff on this thread, we are finally getting the amps.... oh well, i guess i'll have to see how my supermacro is._

 

yeah, it's kinda funny. but i'm sure we'll see many more FS as more and more people get their amps...just part of the normal cycle.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 The great one ;^) lol 






 

Now I am 101% sure! I will never ever love him. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Boy I do love her!


----------



## skev13

Well it's school for me. Books = $$. Wallet = Empty. In order for money, must liquidate something, unfortunately the amp was the first one I can live without... I'm also selling my K81DJ's to a friend, and I may have to pawn off my AudioTechnicas.


----------



## Skylab

I just didn't feel the need for two high-end portable amps, and I decided that I preferred the RSA Hornet.


----------



## digitalcat

Try to figure out which books are absolutely necessary, chances are you don't really have to buy them all. Actually of all the textbooks I used to teach the unders, there're only one or two I found to be worth reading from cover to cover. Depending on the subject, you could even live completely off the classnotes for some courses. And if you happen to know a senior who took the same course, you'd be surprised to know how lazy some professors are.... 
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *skev13* 
_Well it's school for me. Books = $$. Wallet = Empty. In order for money, must liquidate something, unfortunately the amp was the first one I can live without... I'm also selling my K81DJ's to a friend, and I may have to pawn off my AudioTechnicas. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## kaushama

I am waiting for SMIV and XENOS 0HA REP to arrive! I may order a GO-VIBE 5 too.

 When I decided to buy SMIV the intriguing factor for me, was channel IV technology! I wondered whether it gives a significant SQ change in the positive direction. It is yet to be seen with newest XIN amps which are claimed to be less or none of instability problems. If the SQ are on par, I do not see a clear improvement rooting from channel IV layout. If it does not improve SQ to another level indeed there will be an anticlimax!!

 I am a strong believer of point of diminishing return! all 350$ range amps seems to be on par with regards to SQ! May be best bang for buck at present is with amps like GO-VIBE 5, PORTAPHILE V2 MAXXED and even XENOS 0HA REP!

 I can see lots of SMIV amps selling in sales forum if their SQ is not notch above RSA amps. XIN amps have disadvantage of having lesser built quality (Externally) and steep curve in depreciation of value due to frequent upgrades!

 I will do the same, after I compare the amps of lesser pedigree to XIN amp. If someone wants a stable configuration with better aesthetics, price\value and SQwise HORNET "M" or SR-71 may be the safe option. Even GOTO seems to be having that idea! I think the sweet spot lies on GO-VIBE 5 these days!


----------



## lolos

Well.. I don't really know how to start... I don't want to shock some of you.

 But I am quitting this hobby and head-fi. I am even selling my new supermini IV that I haven't recieved yet! I am selling everything... I will go back to a small flash player with my new headphones E500 that I didn't recieve either!!!

 I am sick of waiting.. I am sick of paying toooooooo much money on a hobby no one appreciates among my friends except me... My gf thinks I am crazy!! I think I am crazy too... From a year ago I started this journey which I didn't even have the chance to taste after all this wait!!

 I can't believe I am doing this... but I gotta do it... I used to enjoy a cheapo $20 sony earbuds... never knew there were better headphones that cost thousands of dollars until I stubmled here on head-fi... well, all the rest is history...

 Right now, I own HD650 + RnB Grace 52 cable, ipod 4th generation + ALO cryo mini-mini, Xin Supermini IV, Shure E500, AKG K81 DJ.

 Not to mention the number of headphones and mp3 players I have bought before... what is really surprising me is how long I have waited to have every part in my thought would be the "ultimate portable" rig... 

 I never owned an amp to try out my HD650 and suddenly I decided to sell EVERYTHING. I don't know what hit me but just after Dr. Xin sent me the notice... I started that feeling... BTW, I was wrong when I said "Perfection should be praised." Nothing is perfect and it is yet so stressing not even enjoyable anymore... Again, I used to enjoy a cheapo earbuds.. what is wrong happened to me???

 I don't know why I am typing this... or if it makes any sense or if my spelling or grammar is correct... but I AM QUITTING, that is what it is all about... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 and I have never been happier!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I just hope my E500 would fit my small ear canals though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I do however, LOVE head-fi and everyone here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks!


----------



## kaushama

Indeed it is a sad post! In the mean time I wish I too had the courage to quit this "mean" hobby! Good for you! But why do you want to be so drastic ? keep at least a pair of KOSS KSC35! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I think we need more comparisons between HORNET and SMIV when they arrive. HORNET seems to be the best yardstick for the assesment of the improvements of new SMIV!!!


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lolos* 
_But I am quitting this hobby and head-fi. I am even selling my new supermini IV that I haven't recieved yet! I am selling everything... I will go back to a small flash player with my new headphones E500 that I didn't recieve either!!!_

 

Well, since you did buy all this junk, you might as well listen to it for a month before you sell it. Why not enjoy it before you dump it? (Is there more to this than meets the eye? Did gf get mad about it or something?)


----------



## Tuarreg

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *russdog* 
_Well, since you did buy all this junk, you might as well listen to it for a month before you sell it. Why not enjoy it before you dump it? (Is there more to this than meets the eye? Did gf get mad about it or something?)_

 

PREDICTION: IoIos upon hearing the E500 will be amazed and then wonder... hmmm, will this sound just a tad better in the midrange... perhaps more open soundstage and extended highs IF I ran it thru an amp? He would then rue the day he sold his Mini and then order Superamp version 5. You see, the fact that he hasn't gotten rid of ALL his equipment means he's doomed. It's like I got rid of my carton of cigarettes but I kept one pack in case of an emergency. Deal with it! 

 Muahahahahaha!

 Tuarreg


----------



## kugino

got a shipping notice from xin for...well, i don't know what for. i ordered a supermini but he kept referring to my supermicro in an email exchange...we'll see what shows up at my door next week


----------



## aluren

this is what goto posted on the xin forums:

  Quote:


 In the past few weeks, I have been wondering what Xin's doing. I knew he's making some amps, but not many, in fact, very limited in number; I knew he's perfecting the amps as well, but to me, it's hard to believe that these would consume all his energy. It's in the last week that he finally felt satisfied with the SM IV in sound. I have been listened to the SM IV with the most updated configuration for three days and agree the sound's in the "best sounding" leagure..Things started to move in the right direction, however...

 Yesterday Xin complained that he's under too much pressure on delivering amps and he couldn't help from shipping some out. At the same time, he implied that there would be a surprise on Saturday. When I tried to trick him for more detail, he had his lip tight, which led me to pull my hair for 24 hours!

 In the morning, a Fedex package shown up. When I opened the package, I was stunned; what a germ; it's the most beautiful and finest work of art from Xin, very different from the familiar SM IV. I knew it's something special; Later on, I got to know that Xin has been working on a secret project for a few weeks while perfecting the IV amps. It's a new version of SM that combines all his achievements in the past including those for the latest SM IV. I quickly gave it a trial. It didn't take me more than one minute to tell this is the best sounding amp from Xin, period.

 What a shame. This new design has gone quietly for quite some time along with the perfection for the IV amps; and it's his true flagship and he may name it of SuperMacro V. How about the Macro IV? I doubt it would be in his catalog anymore. What's more, it's a finalized design and ready to go anytime. When I felt exciting about this new achievement, I felt sorry for the challenges he faces in upgrading and current IV amps. Let's keep our finger crossed. 
 

so we might see the Supermacro V before most people even got a chance to listen or review the IV. i'm pretty excited. i hope the wait is finally over and xin can ship out some amps.


----------



## digitalcat

WOW!!! this is getting a little ridiculous, in a somewhat good way. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. And,


----------



## Tuarreg

Are you guys serious?

 You would wait two + months for a 1% upgrade and then claim you can hear the difference when you finally get your amps back? *A 1% UPGRADE?????????*
 Let's not even talk about blind tests.

 Am I the only one here that thinks this is insane?

 Tuarreg


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I only got the PCB that looks very different. The case maybe just the same as Macro IV. I think people will get it shortly and impressions will come crazy
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 To put it simple, the V sounds better than IV in every aspect, soundstage is bigger, better layer, better image, more refined high, more powerful bass (extremely relaxing though), more coherent freqency response, you name it.

 V with OPA134+2XBUF634 for L&R.

  Quote:


 So those who got the amps shipped out recently last week, (I got my shipping notice on last thursday) will have to send the amp back again? 
 

Not sure; it depends on Xin. Probably he will offer extra pcb of V? GOTO2003 
 

I have mailed Dr. XIN asking, whether recent batch has the same PCB or the earlier one! If it was going to finalized soon, we could have waited few days anyway. I think frequent pressure form people, finally must have got in to the nerves of EVER CALM AND COOL Dr. XIN!


----------



## skev13

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_Try to figure out which books are absolutely necessary, chances are you don't really have to buy them all. Actually of all the textbooks I used to teach the unders, there're only one or two I found to be worth reading from cover to cover. Depending on the subject, you could even live completely off the classnotes for some courses. And if you happen to know a senior who took the same course, you'd be surprised to know how lazy some professors are...._

 

Unfortunately, my program is so competitive that, if I go a few weeks without the textbook, i'm done for.

 Im already trying hard to be able to keep my amp, but its the only thing I can sell without losing a rig. (I'll still have Nano-> e4c's)


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 got a shipping notice from xin for...well, i don't know what for. i ordered a supermini but he kept referring to my supermicro in an email exchange...we'll see what shows up at my door next week 
 

At last Good for you! Still you defeat me as you are in US! You will get it before me!


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Tuarreg* 
_Are you guys serious?

 You would wait two + months for a 1% upgrade and then claim you can hear the difference when you finally get your amps back? *A 1% UPGRADE?????????*
 Let's not even talk about blind tests.

 Am I the only one here that thinks this is insane?_

 

The thing is that the "1%" is just an arbitrary number Xin thought up in a forum post. It's not like he measured it and found that compared to the old model it's technically 1% better, it's just a made up number. Even if he did that, who can say what effect that 1% could have on sound? Some people who have heard it say that sonically it's much more than 1%.

 Honestly I agree it is all somewhat insane but if Xin can upgrade these 99% boards and make them sound much better then I'm happy to send mine back when the dust settles a bit.


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I have mailed Dr. XIN asking, whether recent batch has the same PCB or the earlier one! If it was going to finalized soon, we could have waited few days anyway. I think frequent pressure form people who have *paid money, not received an amp or an apology or an email*, finally must have got in to the nerves of EVER *uncommunicative, disorganised *Dr. XIN! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Fixed in the interests of factual accuracy.

 Kaushama, stop. please.

 I have paid for an amp that i have not received that would now appear to have been superceeded and i have no idea which i will get. A significant number of those that have been delivered have been sold, suggesting that the amps are not a league ahead of everything else as you seem to repeatedly suggest.

 Your incessant and unjustified praise is irritating to say the least. I can just about tolerate Xin's mode of operation, i understand why he is the way he is and i am well aware he does it in our best interests. HOWEVER I cannot tolerate your repeated inferences that we are wrong to feel frustration that he has taken 3 times longer than promised to deliver, or that we shouldnt ask him what is going on. My irritation isnt with him, it's with you and you might find if you stop acting like the good doctor walks on water, a lot of the negative comments might stop. 

 When you get your amp, post a review, until then, please stick to the facts.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_I have paid for an amp that i have not received that would now appear to have been superceeded and i have no idea which i will get. A significant number of those that have been delivered have been sold, suggesting that the amps are not a league ahead of everything else as you seem to repeatedly suggest._

 

I'd like to have a more accurate view of how these amps compare to others myself. My "99%" Supermacro IV in the default configuration doesn't sound that great to me but it seems harsh to come out say much more than that on a non-100% product where I can send it back for a free upgrade that may significantly improve the sound quality. I have no idea how much it will improve with an upgrade or some opamp rolling but there are ultimately limits as to what kind of performance you can get out of opamps. At this point I'm not completely sure if any opamp based amp will provide the SQ I'm looking for or how something like Ray Samuel's amps will compare.

 The switches and tweaking options on the Xin amps are fine and all but given choice between that or good sound, I will take good sound every time. I'm currently using my SM IV at work but at home where I have better available it's just getting ignored entirely.


----------



## aluren

wow, this thread has holster alot of emotions from us head-fiers. it has been the most interesting thread so far! (equipment wise anyways) the amp, the wait, and dr. xin himself, has gotten us all shook up and emotional. i hope i can play mediator here:

 nick christy, your comments are a little too harsh. while i do agree that kaushama can be a little too positive sometimes, in the end, it is how he feels and there's nothing wrong with his opinions... i don't think i can stay too positive about the current wait either, but hey, if he can, then good for him! he has a lot of patience, something you or me don't have... but yet we are all still waiting, so what will make him different from me or you? nothing really... so don't worry about how one feels about the situation because it doesn't change a thing. you should respect his opinions if you expect him to respect yours.


----------



## jdimitri

Telling people on the xin forum to go here to 'post your support' is pretty corny..
 It's like when bad advertising draws people away from the product..
 We all know that they're great amps and it takes a while for him to process orders
 I love xin's amps, the size and mini's sound is perfect for me
 Next purchase: next gen supermacro.


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_
 nick christy, your comments are a little too harsh. while i do agree that kaushama can be a little too positive sometimes, in the end, it is how he feels and there's nothing wrong with his opinions...._

 

I agree, but i do object when he tells us all it's time to give "praise and respect" to Dr Xin, and his comments about "frequent pressure" getting under Dr Xin's skin . Personally, in 2 months i've sent Xin one email.

 Additionally it is worth noting that with all of the positivity that Kaushama radiates about the SMIV, he hasn't even received it yet. There may be others reading this thread (and other threads), who arent aware of that and that read him post that the SM IV will "run away with the trophy" compared to the SR 71, Hornet, TBh , etc and go and buy the amp. I think that's uneducated opinion at best, and bordering on dishonest at worst (albeit for unintentional reasons). A big part of the reason I come here is to learn about the options out there, when people start posting about things they havent even heard, i feel that dilutes the good work that many people do here.

 When he's got his SM IV and he buys a Hornet, and he posts his opinions THEN i will respect them. Until then I cant do anything but take them with a pinch of salt. 

 I dont mean to start a thread war here, and i do envy Kaushama's ability to stay endlessly positive, but i wanted this thread to be a means to find out what is going on (because Xin doesnt tell me) and a means to manage my expectations for delivery times. Instead it seems to have turned into a Dr Xin love in, and talented as the man may be, i dont feel its the place.

 Sorry if anyone else feels i overstepped the mark. Amazingly I may suddenly be alot more cheerful when my amp turns up (whether it's the SM IV v7 or an SM V remains to be seen.)

 Nick


----------



## jdimitri

Whoa.. didn't realize i double posted till now
 Thanks digitalcat


----------



## jdimitri

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_
 Additionally it is worth noting that with all of the positivity that Kaushama radiates about the SMIV, *he hasn't even received it yet*.
 Nick_

 

Ok that's new info 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 You're supporting xin blindly?
 OMG, ur xin's bitch


----------



## kaushama

Nick! No worries about your comments at all! That is how we interpert things around depending on our own way, own yardstick and own emotions! We are mostly biased in our opinions and the extent rapidly increases when we are emotionally tense!

 I am not praising Dr. XIN like a blind follower at least. I myself pointed out several times his uncommunicative and unconventional methods of handling people should be changed, if he wishes so (of course) I have never told his products are running with the trophy and in fact challenging the multichannel concept scientifically !

Multiple channel topology! Do they make a difference in SQ? 

 And in this thread,

  Quote:


 When I decided to buy SMIV the intriguing factor for me, was channel IV technology! I wondered whether it gives a significant SQ change in the positive direction. It is yet to be seen with newest XIN amps which are claimed to be less or none of instability problems. If the SQ are on par, I do not see a clear improvement rooting from channel IV layout. If it does not improve SQ to another level indeed there will be an anticlimax!! 
 

 Quote:


 I can see lots of SMIV amps selling in sales forum if their SQ is not notch above RSA amps. XIN amps have disadvantage of having lesser built quality (Externally) and steep curve in depreciation of value due to frequent upgrades!

*I will do the same, after I compare the amps of lesser pedigree to XIN amp. If someone wants a stable configuration with better aesthetics, price\value and SQwise HORNET "M" or SR-71 may be the safe option. Even GOTO seems to be having that idea! I think the sweet spot lies on GO-VIBE 5 these days*! 
 

 Quote:


 I think he would have silenced most of this critics, if he hired a high school kid to reply the emails and keep a progress update. Even one of us would have volunteered to do the job, though he has few supporters in this respect. And he could have employed another guy to make amps (even beta) while he is researching and send them away when the amps are resonably mature. Later if the customer wishes he can send the amp for the critical updates 
 

 Quote:


 All I can see is bad timing of letting out the news of version 4 amps and poor communication. 
 

 Quote:


 Dr. XIN has to keep the right balance and compromise between SQ vs stability. I am yet to See comment of instability amongst members who received bunch of 99.99% amps.
 It is NOT possible for non-US members like us to send the amp back and forth for frequent upgrades. So much so I am going to order a XENOS 0HA or GO-VIBE 5 as a backup now. At one point I almost gave up XIN amp like several others did, to buy a good home amp like SR-71, HR micro or AE-1. 
 

Best sub100$ amp Xenos 0HA-REP? (with option of opamp rolling?) 

  Quote:


 Complexity of the design does not have a linear relationship to the SQ always! I am not going to say XENOS will sound better. How can I without hearing it?
 But a good example is PA2V2. Very good amp with a very basic design. 
 PINT is another!
 Very popular GAINCLONE with LM chiPS another very good example. A very expensive gainclone by a certain manufacturer only uses very few parts without PCB. Components are linked directly to get shortest signal paths. It is sold for a massive amount for its sound quality. The LM chip used does not have a better THD rating than other chips yet have surprisingly better SQ. 
 

 Quote:


 Andrea I am so excited! I will be getting a XeREP shipped on 11th! Can't wait to compare it to new SUPERMACRO! I think, I will sell SMIV later as I feel guilty for 350$ I spent! If XeREP gives it a good head-on (I do not think it will beat SMIV) I will certainly save selling it and buy either a HEED canMAP or MF X-CAN V3 later! After I upgrade my sources. (LITE DAC and H120)
 Many seem to like GV5 though it seem to colour the sound in specific way with recessed mids! 
 



 I am going to compare XENOS 0HA REP with SMIV!!!! What a strong follower of XIN I am ?!!!!

 So you see bro, I am not at all believing XIN amps like god or religion of mine! I have got the nerve to wait till XIN finishes the layout. I thought he should be allowed to do it at his pace and with clear mind. I do respect him for not manipulating his fast evolving concepts for money making.
 In fact I will most probably sell SMIV after I listen to it and go for HORNET "M"
 I wish I had the money to buy the two at the same time.
 The idea of starting this thread and posting XIN forum updates like a mad teenager was to keep our all headfiers known the progress of the amp. 
 (When XIN doesn't do his duties properly) As I knew the feeling of in the darkness, I wanted to collectively see how it progresses.
 It was not necessary for me to smash XIN like most members as there were plenty to do that. I pointed out the good qualities of XIn to show he is not all evil for delaying the amp for us.
 The nerve getting to him more or less shows me that he is more human than anybody in this amp drama. If I were him as adamant as he was thought to be, I will never surrender to the pressure of cries of critics!
 After all He ain't saint at all.
 Nick No hard feelings at all! I don't think you have been too harsh to me. The way I interpret things is quite different from yours at least for some reasons. That is quite acceptable! Isn't it?


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Ok that's new info 
 You're supporting xin blindly?
 OMG, ur xin's bitch 
 __________________ 
 

No comments there as the content itself gives a good measure of the class of the poster! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I was the one who started the thread originally when everyone was speculating in the dark! I do not have any relationship and do not know him at all. ( Except for 2-3 mails he sent me regarding my order) In fact I think Dr. XIN may be thinking, I will be a big nuisance later if XIN amps are clearly not ahead in SQ than simple 2 channel siblings. The present BUZZ was revolving around 4th channel layout. Wasn't it? So he better prove it practically.

 One thing I disliked from the beginning is to rush him to conclude the concept he was developing. He is known for these qualities for ages now! Best we could achieve by thrashing him is to bring him to a state like; " Whats the hell as the amps sound better as it is, I will let them to have the amps and let them go to ...." If he is devoted as he is claimed to be to bring the best configuration, Pressurizing him without any praise (all evil Dr. XIN) will bring nothing but a prematurely developed concept. *By having patience now we have at least Version "V" PCBs at least. That is the only positive thing left here. I do not think his so called bad qualities have changed a bit by frequent criticisms!!!*
 When you are into a mind wrecking project like this, the inventor needs some peace of mind! I didn't want to follow the common way of getting best out of him. Let him finish his work fully. Then I am sure, I will be one of the MOST unbiased persons looking at the new amps if you can understand the quotes given in the previous post!

 Have your own ideas and own comments guys!

 Chow Chow!


----------



## robster

Can you hear me SCREAMING!!!!!!!!!!so now there's a version V XIN amp! well geeze Louise!! I'm keeping my SuperMacro IV and sending it back to be upgraded to version V which is currently no longer for sale in the classifieds. I was going to sell it to buy a LaRocco PRII. 

 Cheers,
 Robert


----------



## Skylab

I actually think this latest development, if it comes to pass, is another example of what Dr. Xin has done wrong here. If it really is necessary to move all the way to a SM V, then the SMIV should never have been sold to anyone.

 Oddly, the SMIV in it's basic config was a good sounding amp. But since this amp is more for the op-amp-rolling type, and it was that feature that didn't work well, then the SMIV should never have been announced until it was 100% ready to go. I think this is what has soured me, and a bunch of others, on this whole thing.


----------



## goto2003

It may have been my fault that made the whole thing's even more complicated without providing comprehensive and objective information.

 In the morning I did some critical comparison between the IV with all the latest tweaks and the V with the same setup as IV. V was burned over night and IV was used >200hrs. I kept listening to the 1st track of "Hunter" and I have to admit that the difference was minor and the more I listened to it, the more I realized there were actually some virtues on the IV side given its less prominent in high. My first impression may have something to do with the excitement on anything new and gave too much credit to the cool new pcb. Does "eyeball" effect exist? I think so. I will report back with more listening to have a firmed impression. In addition, I haven't got any confirmation on whether Xin would use the new design and it's me to imply that he would based on the information I get.

 Sorry for any confusion.


----------



## kaushama

I agree skylab! What XIN does wrong here is not to follow the traditional business model. He should have saved lot of trouble himself if he continued to ship SM3V6 and when channel 4 is mature announce the new amps! He indeed did a mistake by announcing them prematurely! He is offsetting it by providing free updates. But this on-going project like model will do him more harm than good.

 This is my solution! He should sell last mature model to end users and select a group of beta testers to check his new models! Then he can earn more too selling more amps for less trouble to end-users. He can hire people to build the last mature model. He can do all research. Then coming out of the new model will be more dramatic and eye catching than slowly evolving concept like this. He can keep new developing areas a secret to end-users.

 He has done the basic mistake of considering all his clients as audio enthusiasts than end-users. Only his beta testers should be in the above category! 
 But whatever we see and suggest here will only be speculations. Dr. XIN will be DR. XIN for coming years to come. Whether he will be success story is to be seen!


----------



## jdimitri

Kids.. CHILL OUT!
 As goto said, he's the only one who's recieved it so far and now we know that the sound is only very slightly different
 maybe it's just an internal design change, even goto doesn't know what it is yet (correct me if i'm wrong)
 The cause? Maybe lower cost, xin running out of the old boards, who knows


----------



## jdimitri

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_This is my solution! He should sell last mature model to end users and select a group of beta testers to check his new models! Then he can earn more too selling more amps for less trouble to end-users. *He can hire people to build the last mature model. He can do all research.* Then coming out of the new model will be more dramatic and eye catching than slowly evolving concept like this. He can keep new developing areas a secret to end-users._

 

That would cost SO much it's not funny
 As full as xin's hands are with orders, its NOT thousands of amps
 He probably makes 2 or 3 on good days, and while doing more research at the same time
 If this is xin's only source of income, there's no way he can afford people to work for him
 What would that cost him to pay the worker, $20/hr x how many hours?
 And soldering TINY parts is something that very few people can do
 You have to realize that heaphone amps is not a big industry
 And out of those tiny part of the population that know of headphone amps, xin's customer doesn't make up even 5% of this community
 Stop changing sides


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Nick No hard feelings at all! I don't think you have been too harsh to me. The way I interpret things is quite different from yours at least for some reasons. That is quite acceptable! Isn't it?_

 


 Absolutely. I think Skylab just hit the nail on the head. If SM IV needed this much work, then it shouldn't have been shipped.

 Oh well, I cant comment properly either as I haven't received my amp yet.

 Let's see what another week brings.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Stop changing sides 
 

My dear friend I was never in a side! If you have read the quotes in my previous thread, I am only interested in seeing whether multichannel layout have objective advantage over conventional simple layout! I am shaping a logical argument towards that. If XIN is so obssesed with evolving amp He has no option than hiring a high-school kid for communication and some soldering work as I suggested long before. Not to run a factory!

  Quote:


 I think he would have silenced most of this critics, if he hired a high school kid to reply the emails and keep a progress update. 
 

Now we should not be in two opposing sides as I do not have a side in this amp saga! As I respect XIN I respect all other individuals including yourself for having their own free concepts, despite being called "Bitch" in public! I would never make such remarks even for dire adversary, whom I know very well! I am sure you should be a very nice person for thousand reasons, about which I do not know, leaving aside the things I know.

 So respecting others is a quality in my class at least! I respect you for being a member of headfier family!

 Have a nice day!


----------



## goto2003

I may be biased to provide any conclusive information; yet based on the understanding on Xin's work; It's too critical to accuse him of releasing the amp too early. Xin's a human and he's just a designer and audiophier (probably not correct as he's not very critical in sq). He released the IV, a good amp from any standpoint. Micro and Mini sounded incredible even from the very begining; Early Macro had some compromise in sq given the complexity of the design. Then I (or including some others) reported that Macro sounded not as good as micro and Mini and suggested him to consider if it's possible to improve it to even better than Micro and Mini given its higher price tag. To Xin, they all sounded the same good (again, for his not so critical ears). While tweaking to improve the sq of Macro, he implemented some succeful tweaks in Micro and Mini and made them sound even better - again, Macro's not as good as Micro/Mini. Given the pressure to deliver amps, he did ship some out and I am quite sure they sounded better than previous versions as proved by many others. For him, the biggest problem may be that he takes our opinions too seriously and want to make a Macro the true flagship of his amps. The new V thing is just his another effort to make it; but he himself not sure if it sounds any better than the finalized Macro IV and asked for my opinion. That's the how the story started for this V. Again, for the new design, it's finalized but not sure if it sounded better than the IV. Since I am the only one to provide feedback on this so far and I have to admit that it's tough to tell where's the improvement in sound given now both sounded very good and close to me. But the bottle line is - either one will be good enough.


----------



## jdimitri

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_ despite being called "Bitch" in public!_

 

Just for clarification, i said 'xin's bitch' as a joke, that's why the 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 was there
 Completely different meaning from 'bitch', mate

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_ I think all friends of Dr. XIN should support him for the wonderful work he has been doing.

 Please visit,

http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showp...5&postcount=23

 and post your support for him!
 Friends its now our time to appreciate!!!_

 

That's supporting him, and then you contradict it by criticising his ways
 I have no problem with you supporting xin, i think his amps are some of the best portable amps
 it's just that when people's strong opinion is shown publicly and then changes that opinion
 It gets other people thinking if they should change opinions too


----------



## kaushama

Fine! So be it! 

 I misinterpreted it! Sorry for that! No hard feelings again! OK? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 But I am not anyone's agent! I am a free thinking person, who sees things somewhat differently and logically! 

 Lets see Dr.XIN's achievements are practical realities or not!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *goto2003* 
_But the bottom line is - either one will be good enough._

 

you know, i think that really puts dr. xin in a dilemma. yes we all want good sound, but how bad do we want it? xin probably wants it more than any of us. but yet one man's wants shouldn't be outweighed by the wants of many? sounds like a dictatorship if you ask me. what about the happiness of its people?? 

 i think dr. xin needs to fill all the orders first. then he can go into silence and do whatever freakin upgrades/tweaks he pleases. because i got a good feeling that the new V or whatever it is wil be going through even more tweaks...


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 That's the how the story started for this V. Again, for the new design, it's finalized but not sure if it sounded better than the IV. Since I am the only one to provide feedback on this so far and I have to admit that it's tough to tell where's the improvement in sound given now both sounded very good and close to me. But the bottle line is - either one will be good enough. 
 

That is why I do believe that you all should be beat testers and these finer details of development should be kept away from end-users GOTO! It's a diverse society! Everbody is not same in their thinking patterns! Nobody is better or worse! Its just the diveristy of concepts!!!


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jdimitri* 
_Just for clarification, i said 'xin's bitch' as a joke, that's why the 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 was there
 Completely different meaning from 'bitch', mate_

 

A smiley may not neutralize all the negative vibe in the words, especially when you doublepost it, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Let's all calm down a little bit and give the man a few weeks to ship the amps out. No matter how good the design is, it's pointless if we can't hear it. For now it's all speculations. It's like debating who is the stronger leader, Optimus Prime or Rodimus Prime...


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Originally Posted by kaushama
 I think all friends of Dr. XIN should support him for the wonderful work he has been doing.

 Please visit,

http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showp...5&postcount=23

 and post your support for him!
 Friends its now our time to appreciate!!!



 That's takin sides 
 

Again depends how you want to interpret it! My idea was to get more views into forum when it becomes one-way traffic thrashing XIN! My primary concern being premature ending of the development of the amp, I wanTed more positive ideas supporting him. You see my friend we all posters here being customers, who waits amp impatiently, its natural to see more criticism and withdrawals of orders here! To have balancing opinions at least people who knows him well should post here. If trend started to erupt ( once it came to close ) most people, who waited this long, would have moved away forcing XIN to finish the amp project quickly!

 And I have never hesitated to point out his weak points days before than this! And I supported him, when majority are thrashing him to see the development will not hamper due to that. I am proud of it as that is who I am! It does not mean, I will hesitate to give unbiased opinion of the amp when it comes out!

 As you seen in above post by GOTO XIN didn't want to drag this for this long. He doesn't seem to have critical ears!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 He would have stopped this long before if the traffic was set otherwise!

 I have become a member of XIN's forum after I placed the amp order only. But if you want to believe so badly I am partial to XIN its your own free will and you are welcome to do it! Lets look forward to future.

 And if I think, I should be partial to XIN because his amps are so superior in performance, i will take that decision according to my free will, in future!

 Again no hard feelings pal!! Have a great day!


----------



## Tuarreg

*"My idea was to get more views into forum when it becomes one-way traffic thrashing XIN! My primary concern being premature ending of the development of the amp, I wanTed more positive ideas supporting him."* =kaushama

 I think you summed it up best in your own words, so let's just leave it at that and let the chips of public opinion fall as they may.

 Tuarreg


----------



## kaushama

I will get my SMIV today hopefully.

 Following all discussions we had elsewhere, I do believe that SONIC signature of an amp is a product of OPAMP characteristics mostly. The layout is important to reduce cross-talk, power supply noise, loop backs, ground problems and oscillation.... and so on! But the simplest of design, can reduce these without any problem over more complex topologies!
 I have been always fascinated by amps like CANAMP, XENOS, GO-VIBE and GAINCLONE! Even HORNET!
 They seems to be having simplest of design but yet delivering sweet sound.

 So we are eager to see the improvements of channel 4 layout objectively!!! 

 We need more objective comparisons between HORNET and SMIV than subjective speculation! I do believe HORNET should be the ideal candidate for comparison for following factors!

Its size
2 channel layout Vs Multi-channel layout
Features; charging and gain control
price

 I wish I had a HORNET too. I am restricted from buying it due to unavailability of Paypal locally. Local banks go mad, when I ask 350$ for such small item and they start looking at me as if I am mad or a money scam!
 (In my country the price of HORNET\SMIV equals to 6-7 month income of an average person!!!! Whoa!)


----------



## Tuarreg

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I will get my SMIV today hopefully.

 Following all discussions we had elsewhere, I do believe that SONIC signature of an amp is a product of OPAMP characteristics mostly. The layout is important to reduce cross-talk, power supply noise, loop backs, ground problems and oscillation.... and so on! But the simplest of design, can reduce these without any problem over more complex topologies!
 I have been always fascinated by amps like CANAMP, XENOS, GO-VIBE and GAINCLONE! Even HORNET!
 They seems to be having simplest of design but yet delivering sweet sound.

 So we are eager to see the improvements of channel 4 layout objectively!!! 

 We need more objective comparisons between HORNET and SMIV than subjective speculation! I do believe HORNET should be the ideal candidate for comparison for following factors!

Its size
2 channel layout Vs Multi-channel layout
Features; charging and gain control
price

 I wish I had a HORNET too. I am restricted from buying it due to unavailability of Paypal locally. Local banks go mad, when I ask 350$ for such small item and they start looking at me as if I am mad or a money scam!
 (In my country the price of HORNET\SMIV equals to 6-7 month income of an average person!!!! Whoa!)_

 

If you are singling out the Hornet, then perhaps you need to frame the debate in a way that would assess some of the advantages of owning a Hornet, like for instance:

 * Sound 
 * Built
 * Warranty
 * Customer service

 In the end, subjective as it might be, great SOUND is what we strive for, is it not?

 Tuarreg


----------



## aluren

kaushama, where do you live?


----------



## kaushama

Yes I agree! 

  Quote:


 Its size
 2 channel layout Vs Multi-channel layout
 Features; charging and gain control
 price 
 

These are the factors, which make HORNET ideal candidate for comparison with SMIV to see whether SQ is better. They are similar in price, size and more or less with features. So the compounding factors are more or less similar. The main striking difference between two is 2 channel VS 4 Channel topology! 
 I agree those factors you mentioned too, should be taken into consideration and they are the strong points of RSA amps that we already know! So RSA amps have an edge there even before the comparison as I mentioned in an earlier post!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 kaushama, where do you live? 
 

At present I live in one kind of a "paradise" Island 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 But I will be moving to UK in two months of time!!

 BTW has anyone got their amps? I am still waiting!


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_At present I live in one kind of a "paradise" Island 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But I will be moving to UK in two months of time!!

 BTW has anyone got their amps? I am still waiting!_

 

i think mine was sent on 9/09...from oregon to northern california should take 2 days so i'm expecting it tomorrow. i'll also pick up the new ipod nano tomorrow (fingers crossed) so i should have a new portable rig...

 edit: superMINI received, along with 2134 op-amp. it's tinier than i imagined...will listen later tonight. main point is that i received it and got exactly what i ordered (including extra op-amps)...


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I do think that it is almost impossible to describe the "sound" of the latest SM-IV, as it does not really have a sound of its own. If asked, I would say that it sounds exactly as the original music sounds. Of course, to realize the absolute potential of any of these amps, one must have quality equipment at both ends of the chain! A $40 mp3 player and earbuds will clearly not demonstrate the quality of sound and soundstage that these amps are capable of delivering. Highflight 
 

 Quote:


 There's one thing surprises me - It's after these critical comparison that I realized that IV with the most latest tweaks does sound great, very pleasing. I think going after IV is the safest; after all it has gone through so much critical tests and listening that proved it's a great performer; I don't know V has any uncovered issue or not.

 Yes, I got my DAC back today and just connected it to Macro IV. They sounded fantastic! BTW, just got an email from Xin and he agrees that the difference between V and IV is minor, if there's difference at all to him both in RMAA benchmark and sound. The end of the story is he's gonna use the finalized SM IV. It's a smart move, imho. Peace. GOTO 
 

I think at last the sanity returns! Indeed it is the safe route to go. If there is some uncovered issues with "V" there will be another series of tweaks and if there is no significant gain, why should he use an untested PCB?


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 SuperMINI received, along with 2134 op-amp. it's tinier than i imagined...will listen later tonight. main point is that i received it and got exactly what i ordered (including extra op-amps)... 
 

So you got it before me!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I envy you!
 Hope to hear some impressions soon, Kugino!


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_So you got it before me!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I envy you!
 Hope to hear some impressions soon, Kugino!_

 

should be awhile before i get any good listening time in...or critical listening. hopefully i'll be picking up a new nano tomorrow (8GB?) so will also need to get a dock, too...


----------



## digitalcat

You guys have been awefully quiet today. Give us some impressions!


----------



## kaushama

Who else got their shipping notices recently? Dr. XIN seems to be clearing the backlog of orders it seems!


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Who else got their shipping notices recently? Dr. XIN seems to be clearing the backlog of orders it seems!_

 

I thought you got it already? I'm hoping that you could give us some thoughts on the amp.


----------



## kaushama

I got the shipping notice. I will post my impressions, ..... Kugino What do you think?


----------



## kaushama

And I need HORNET "M" badly to compare. If I buy one will I be able to sell it without any loss? I wish RAY could give me one free!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 I am afraid to buy as if I gets the idea to keep the both. Ohh I will die, out of guilt and may be in hunger!!!!!


----------



## kaushama

*[size=large]The return of XIN!!![/size]*











  Quote:


 It's very difficult to tell the timetable. Just as I thought I was able to ship the amps, then there was another change. I usually had no idea how long it would take. As long as it is normal, 2 weeks are enough for me to ship all the new and returned amp.

 So it is not about how busy I am, it is about some unexpected development and I usually have no idea about how long it takes.

 All I can tell is: as soon as changes are settled down, it'll be very fast. For example, it only took me the past 2 days to upgrade/repair all returned amps. Even old III and V1 amps are upgraded with all the latest possible tweaks. DR XIN: XIN FORUMS


----------



## bregosanto

I emailed Xin at the weekend asking about the SM V and if he would upgrade IV to V. He replied last night with "_The V is only an experiment, too early. The latest IV is as good as anything can be._"

 (I replied to say thanks for the update and asked when I was likely to get my SMIV which I ordered July 20. No answer yet, but due to the time difference I couldn't expect an immediate reply!)


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I got the shipping notice. I will post my impressions, ..... Kugino What do you think?_

 

i've listened to it a little, but not critically...i listen to my PINT while on the computer since it's nicely setup with my alien DAC. finishing up a dissertation here in the next couple of weeks so i won't be doing any comparison listening for a while...but in a month i should get around to it.


----------



## aluren

woohoo!! just got my shipping notice from dr. xin today. he said the amp will ship in 1 or 2 days!! i ordered on July 13, after 2 months of grueling wait, i will finally get it!!!


----------



## kaushama

WoW! That's very nice to hear. I am sure you will be happy!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Does anyone know the weight of the HORNET with the battery? Compared to SUPERMACRO less heavy?


----------



## aluren

thx kaushama... so are you really going to compare the SMIV to the Hornet? you should get used to your SMIV first. then maybe couple months later, go for the hornet (after you get used to the SMIV sound and your wallet recovers! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_WoW! That's very nice to hear. I am sure you will be happy!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Does anyone know the weight of the HORNET with the battery? Compared to SUPERMACRO less heavy?_

 

The Hornet is a little lighter. Without batteries, the Hornet is heavier than the Xin, and is better built to be sure. But the Xin uses 8 AA, and the Hornet just one 9V, which makes the Supermacro a little heavier when both are loaded.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_The Hornet is a little lighter. Without batteries, the Hornet is heavier than the Xin, and is better built to be sure. But the Xin uses 8 AA, and the Hornet just one 9V, which makes the Supermacro a little heavier when both are loaded._

 

Little heavy in the sense, is it marginal? I think both are not pockectable then! Supermini seems to be surely pockectable! VERY significantly smaller.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Little heavy in the sense, is it marginal? I think both are not pockectable then! Supermini seems to be surely pockectable! VERY significantly smaller._

 

Yes, pretty marginal. Both are small and light enough for my needs, but neither would fit in a shirt pocket when paired with an iPod...


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Little heavy in the sense, is it marginal? I think both are not pockectable then! Supermini seems to be surely pockectable! VERY significantly smaller._

 

if you want small and light, nano and supermini are the way to go...man, i can't believe how tiny this combo is. waiting on an ALO cable (the six-shooter) to really do some good listening, but for now, i love the way this combo looks...part of me wants to get the supermicro to get a truly tiny portable setup...we'll see


----------



## kaushama

so you are not sourceless anymore?


----------



## aluren

any impressions??

 kaushama, i think you've gotten your amp already right? was it worth the wait??


----------



## kaushama

Yes! In fact, ....... you guys are going to kill me for this, I got it on Monday!








 I was patiently listening and burning it in! I think ,I have burnt it enough at least to have initial impressions. After two months of patient waiting, why should I jump and come into premature conclusion?
 I will post my thoughts later today. But I am very impressed with SQ. There are some points about the amp, I thought, I do not like too. 
 In short i am happy for I waited to get the amp. But I had to have some phenomenal patience for waiting for it, while being positive about it.


----------



## mirumu

Yes, we want your 100% complete opinion, not a 99% opinion that needs to be tweaked for a few weeks.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mirumu* 
_Yes, we want your 100% complete opinion, not a 99% opinion that needs to be tweaked for a few weeks. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





_

 

LMAO!!! Funniest post in weeks.


----------



## Nick Christy

Alternatively you could consider your first opinion, and tell us that you are about to post it. Then realise that your opinion could be slightly improved and amend it, and test it on a few close friends first. 

 THEN, while they consider whether they prefer the original opinion, or the revised opinion, completely change your opinion and post that first.

 Obviously, all of your opinions are highly flexible and can be amended by each of us recipients through a process to be known as "adjective rolling" and therefore those of us who wish your opinion to be "excellent" as opposed to "very good" can apply to any of the dictionary publishers for some free samples of "words" that we can insert in your opinions, if we dont like the sound of them in the first place.






 Completely up to you though, obviously.


----------



## kaushama

Hmmmm...


----------



## robster

"Live and Learn,die and forget it all! " 
 " No matter where you are you are always there" 


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_Alternatively you could consider your first opinion, and tell us that you are about to post it. Then realise that your opinion could be slightly improved and amend it, and test it on a few close friends first. 

 THEN, while they consider whether they prefer the original opinion, or the revised opinion, completely change your opinion and post that first.

 Obviously, all of your opinions are highly flexible and can be amended by each of us recipients through a process to be known as "adjective rolling" and therefore those of us who wish your opinion to be "excellent" as opposed to "very good" can apply to any of the dictionary publishers for some free samples of "words" that we can insert in your opinions, if we dont like the sound of them in the first place.






 Completely up to you though, obviously._


----------



## kaushama

I missed an amp almost two months and I love this sound! I think I should listen more to the music before finding some friends to edit my essay on SMIV!


----------



## kaushama

Ok.

 Here are some negative points I noticed! (For a change I will first become negative!)

Form factor and weight

 I ordered Supermini first then changed my order to MACRO. MACRO being top of the line XIN amp is a bit of a paradox to me. Its too heavy with its 8AAAs to be truly portable and pockectable. I think SUPERMINI is better value as a portable amp with its same SQ or Better and same options (Though) internal. For additional 150$ MACRO provides fast charging, external switches more bulk and weight. If someone needs true portable solution MINI is better value IMHO.

Battery life

 It is surely a power hog! It gives me only 10-12 hours with Energizer 900MH batteries as opposed to XIN's claims of 50 hours of battery life. ( I have default OPA134 with buffers) I posted in XIN's forum too. I mailed Dr. XIN and as usual no response. I think he needs to edit his site.
 It is an issue when it comes to long flights. If it had 9V one could have easily carried extra battery. Now charged 8 AAAs! No Way! Opamp swapping to THS4032, may be a remedy for this problem, according to Hifight! 
 I wonder about the battery life of SUPERMINI. If it has more life than MACRO additional bulk is another paradox except for porviding more headroom in MACRO.
 The heat it emits while charging even when trickle charging is considerable. It can't be all that healthy for the batteries and may be for tiny SMD components life span! Heat is cholesterol for electronic components.

MIDS right out of box

 Mids were bit distant (Not recessed) right out of box. Now it has settled a bit. Mids being distant is due to the fact that it has very wide soundstage. 

Highs

 Trebles may be the weakest link of MACRO right out of box. It gave me an impression of lesser extension with less control than desired. But after hours of burning it has now settled to better control and defintion. No sibilance at all. Good extension now.

which version?

 Though most recently shipped, when asked Dr. XIN is not sure about the version and then whether it needs some last tweak involving some replacement of two capacitors. He wanted me to send a photo of the PCB.

Waiting waiting waiting

 This needs no description doesn't it? We all are victims and I am a victim and a convict for waiting and defending him while waiting!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




For future.......

 If I need to add more, edit and for adjective rolling.....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Wait for positives!


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_
 If I need to add more, edit and for adjective rolling.....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Wait for positives!_

 


 That's my boy !


----------



## kaushama

Now the positives, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Soundstage, definition, clarity and separaton

 The strong point of SMIV!!! It gives widest, if at all, soundstage and layering I have heard so far in a portable. (I have experience of listening to my friend's: person who got me to this hobby, OPEUS and X-CAN V3 some time back). It gives 3d expansion and placement of instruments in various places in space beautifully. Amazing! I feel the space is getting widened with burning.
 No hiss at all! I am using my 12V THREAD than stock adapter which I think unregulated one. Very clear!

Timbre and attack

 Another strong point! Pretty accurate timbre and extremes of tonal spectrum is pretty fast.

Bass

 Very Strong! Well implemented Bass BOOST. Bass is punchy, clear and extends to lowest. One thing, I noticed is clarity and definition of BASS. As human ear is pretty insensitive to sublte details of BASS (Thats why we have central subwoofers) if some gear brings out BASS separation into soundstage it is doing very well. SMIV can do that.

MIDS and HIGHS
Though I was not entirely happy with the MIDS and HIGHS at the begining they are settled now. Trebles are more settled than MIDS. Highs extend to highest points and accurate. I still feel little backwardness of mids. It may be related to OPAMPS! It does not give front presentation at all. I assume wide soundstage has some bearing with it.

WOW factor

 Plenty! I have listened to lesser portable amps up to now though I have experience with those two home wonders. I can hear things which I didn't hear ever in my music collection. I am listening to them all over again.

Options Options

 Self-explanatory! Isn't it? It is a small box of features! It will give me a whole new experience when I drain pocket with OPAMP rolling. God forbid me!!

Burning in

 I think it needs at least 150+ hours of burning as I feel everyday SQ becoming refined and mids are getting clearer.

Worth waitng?

 Certainly for me! It gave a new dimension for my listening and superb SQ!

For future


----------



## kaushama

A full essay with pictures will follow later, when I listen enough!


----------



## GreatDane

kaushama,

 So how's the crossfeed on your amp? I think you may know how I feel about mine.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I emailed Xin yesterday about sending mine back for inspection, of course no reply yet. I want to upgrade my Mini to Macro. I'm not too fond of the fragile plastic tabs that lock the case together, along with the tiny jumpers.


----------



## kaushama

Yes Greatdane! I agree it gives a narrow soundstage and impression of monophonic sound when used with modern recordings. I listened to some old Beatles songs with it and found it quite pleasing. Pl lLet know us your situation after Dr. XIN comes back to you.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Yes Greatdane! I agree it gives a narrow soundstage and impression of monophonic sound when used with modern recordings. I listened to some old Beatles songs with it and found it quite pleasing. Pl lLet know us your situation after Dr. XIN comes back to you._

 

Well it's good to know I'm not crazy
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've simply given up using crossfeed on my Mini. I really do desire a portable amp with crossfeed, I love everything about my Micro Amp except that it's not really portable...that's why Jan should be sending my Porta Corda MkIII-USB next week
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'll chime in when I hear back from Xin.


----------



## jamato8

"Burning in

 I think it needs at least 150+ hours of burning as I feel everyday SQ becoming refined and mids are getting clearer."

 I don't think anything can be judged in electronics until sufficient time for the forming of the caps, dialetric changes (dialetric has capacitance and other factors) and other changes in the power supply and even new batteries. I have observed that while good and bad changes occur around 50 to 100 hours and more that for a real settling of sound a few hundred hours of a musical signal is required. But I also think it is fun to hear the changes and to know that they will occur and to not get too excited when the sound is fantastic during this change or if it is flat and dull. I have a dual setup with my Xin amps using one for a pre and one for an amp. After some changes in the amps I had to wait for everything to settle down. i get excellent sound now but it did take some time and this is not my "ears" adjusting to the new sound as I have a standard amp that I can compare to that has a few thousand hours of music through it.


----------



## kaushama

Some pics!

















 I agree Jamato. This is my preliminary impression. Now it has run about 40-50 hours roughly. I know battery life too will be extended after few cycles of charge. I will revisit the performance after it run for about 200 hours. 

 All I can say, is the SQ is amazing for its soundstage clarity and definition. And I am happy.


----------



## Nick Christy

I just cancelled my order.

 I ordered my SMIV on July 11 when the website promised delivery within 2- 3 weeks.

 I heard nothing about my amp being shipped.

 In August Dr Xin said he had finished tweaking and that the amps would ship in 1 - 2 days.

 I still heard nothing about my amp being shipped.

 Two weeks ago I emailed Dr Xin and asked when my amp would ship, he said "this week or next". Those two weeks finished yesterday.

 I've still heard nothing about my amp being shipped.

 I have seen on his forum that people who sent their amps in for a FREE upgrade AFTER i had PAID for my amp to be made, have had their amps upgraded and returned already.

 I've still heard nothing about my amp being shipped.

 Yesterday morning I emailed Dr Xin and asked that he make good on his promise to ship my amp "this week or next" and to confirm by the end of the day that my amp was being shipped.

 I heard nothing.

 What I have heard from these forums is that the "tweaking" has decreased the sound quality, affected the crossfeed and decreased the battery life. At least half of the SMIV's that I have seen reviewed on here have been sold on within weeks.

 So I've cancelled my order.

 Dr Xin may have good intentions at heart and i can accept some "slippage" in delivery times, but i think that given an original promise of 2 - 3 weeks delivery and that 11 weeks on I am still waiting for notification of shipping, and that shipping will take 6 - 10 days, my patience is exhausted.

 When my money is refunded I will be buying a Hornet.


----------



## mirumu

I understand why you'd cancel your order, but I hadn't seen anything suggesting that the sound quality had decreased after the tweaking. Quite the opposite. Are there comments or posts I've missed?


----------



## kursed

I think he's talking about the following post onwards.. 

http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showp...&postcount=277


 And I placed an order for my Supermini IV - now hoping that i'll get it before christmas :s


----------



## GreatDane

Hi Dane,

 The crossfeed might be too strong after recent changes. Anyway, I'm 
 going to 
 ask all IV amps to come back for a important change, so you should send 
 it 
 back and I'll check the crossfeed.

 Xin


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kursed* 
_I think he's talking about the following post onwards.. 

http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showp...&postcount=277


 And I placed an order for my Supermini IV - now hoping that i'll get it before christmas :s_

 


 Thats the one.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* 
_Hi Dane,

 The crossfeed might be too strong after recent changes. Anyway, I'm 
 going to 
 ask all IV amps to come back for a important change, so you should send 
 it 
 back and I'll check the crossfeed.

 Xin_

 

They need to come back AGAIN??? LMAO...

 I really am glad I sold my SMIV. I have never regretted it, and I continue to really enjoy the RSA Hornet.

 If anything, I think I might slightly regret having sold my SM3V6 when I heard the IV was coming out. That would have made a good back-up amp to the Hornet.


----------



## mirumu

If that's the case then sending my 99% one back for the tweaks seems pointless, I'm not happy with the sound quality as it is. Might have to sell then.


----------



## aluren

wow, so now there is a crossfeed tweak? i am getting pretty tired of this crap... next thing you know, xin will ask us to send back our amps because some dude used it on the beach and it exploded because of exposure to the sun. as a master design that xin claims to be, why are there always issues?? nobody ever claims ray samuels to be this amp god, but yet he designs and delivers perfectly working amps...


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* 
_They need to come back AGAIN??? LMAO...
 ._

 

I asked him if I could have him inspect my amp because of my issue with the crossfeed sounding like mono.

 Xins reply to my questions are only one day old (Fri, 15 Sep 2006 22:38). I haven't kept up with what the upgrades accomplish.

 It seems crazy...wait, wait, then wait some more...then return it for upgrades...then talk of SQ being degraded.

 I'll stick it out and hope the final product is golden. I'm glad I have other amps and have accepted that this could take even more time to resolve.

 I can't believe that Xin would let his final design be inferior in any way to previous releases. He is also offering these upgrades free. 

 This is all a test of patience for me.I trust that in the end of all of these upgrades Xin will have given an amp that is worthy of his reputation.


----------



## nfusion770

I bought skylabs supermacro and have a supermicro on order. It seems my supermicro order should be coming up pretty soon. It also appears that most of the current tweaks involve the macro. As soon as I get the micro (hopefully a complete product), and I get reports that imply Xin is done tweaking the macro, I will send the macro in for upgrades. I guess having multiple amps makes all of this easier to swallow, but I dont regret buying the macro and selling the sr-71. I cant say the macro sounds any better than the sr-71, it is very close in overall quality, but it is so much smaller and just so versitile. If I only had a single amp I would have stuck with that awesome little sr-71, but its nice to know it found a happy home.


----------



## kaushama

I listened to it again after 24 hours of straight burning. The mids are refined now. Not backward and improving. Trebles are sweet now. 
 Oh No Another upgrade? It will cost me about 30$ + for back and forth journey. When I mailed him couple of days back, he said most likely that I need no upgrade and asked for PCB pictures. Anyway I shwould wait till my XENOS HA REP arrives.

 GOTO and HIFLIGHT can you provide some info?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mirumu* 
_I understand why you'd cancel your order, but I hadn't seen anything suggesting that the sound quality had decreased after the tweaking. Quite the opposite. Are there comments or posts I've missed?_

 

If you go to fixup.net you will see other people have posted that the sound was not as good. Some have posted the Supermini sounds better.

 It was the comments that the Supermini IV sounds better than the Supermacro IV that caused me cancelling my order earlier this week. I do not mind waiting and thus ordered a Go-Vibe 5 (which by the way sounds awesome) to tie me over. However I will not pay $150 more to get an amp that sounds worse than the Supermini IV. It is sad because I thought the Supermacro III Version 6 which I had sounded awesome, in hindsight I should have kept it.

 I was going to order The Hornet "M", but I really want the xinfeed and the bassboost so I will wait a couple of months and hopefully Dr. Xin will tweak the Supermacro IV to make it sound better. Then I will probably re-order.


----------



## kaushama

mrarroyo Where do you find people postng in FIXUP that MACRO sounds worst? I think there were few posts pointing to once GOTO's comment of inferior SQ of MACRO. Later GOTO said with latest tweaks MACRO is doing fine now.
 But it seems Dr. XIN is having problems with MACRO than other amps. I curse myself changing MINI to MACRO!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 All the latest IV amps are oscillation-free. It was a very hard work, as oscillation is quite random, and why the latest tweaks took so long. DR.XIN 
 

It seems the newest upgrade is very critical! May be solving the SUPERMACRO problems. 
 But I wonder about the timing of sending the amp. 

  Quote:


 Shipping back is free for 1st class and airmail. For oversea mail, you should add $10 for registered mail or $20 for express mail (both are secure). 
 

He is not specific about whether this is for upgraded version 111 amps or all amps.

 I feel I should wait for dust to settle. Can't be sending amp every month for 34$ to USA!!!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 There are four things about battery life:

 1) Configuration. For the default OPA134+BUF634(1x), battery life should be about 18 hours. 10 hour is shorter than normal.

 2) Charging. For some NiMH batteries, especially when they are new and room temperature is low, the fast charging may stop too early and they are then not fully charged. To isolate this, try use an external charger to charge them and then test them in SuperMacro.

 3) Oscillation. Some SuperMacro-IV shipped before today do suffer from oscillation, sometimes and under some conditions. Please send them back and I can guarantee there won't be any oscillation, under all conditions.

 4) Over-discharge protection. The protection circuit may turn the amp off too early. This is not likely to happen as all the amps are fully tested. But you know, human error happens.

 The most important is: please send your amp back, I promise this is the last time. You'll enjoy your music and the best sound, and put all those hassles behind. 
 

Latest reply from Dr.XIN to my post in FIXUP! So it is now sending time!!!!!!


----------



## Pete7

Man, I really feel for you guys that have to make a return. After having the PR II for like a month, I had to send it in for a defective buffer. Wow,did that suck. I thought 2 weeks without a portable amp was a big deal. Here's hoping this is the last time.


----------



## cerbie

While not waiting on a IV, I've gotten so far as to have a box with packing in it to send my Supermini-3 in for updates...and just couldn't do it!

 Luckily, his recent announcement of low turn-around time comes at a time when my sinuses are in hell (humid cool weather = smog hanging in the air--yecch), so I'm not listening to headphones much anyway. I think I'll send it out tomorrow.

 Xin just keeps tweaking and updating things. I do think he should try to get someone else involved to handle PR, and maybe push deadlines here and there (many people will be happy with a not-quite-perfect amp, but he makes them wait), because he's clearly a technical person who gets really wrapped up in it. As such, he's got stuff nobody else does, but certainly loses some customers here and there for that behavior. Being of a similar mind, I can empathize and wait (I knew very well when I ordered my amp, it wouldn't be coming on time, and he had a 4 week wait listed!), but I certainly understand the frustration it is to many folks. FI, I'm sure having someone socially minded on the side handling customers like Nick up there would have gotten him something, and others who have had similar experiences.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 The following pictures show these two configurations. Both sound fantastic with super long battery life - 20 hours per charge (based on 1000mAh Ni-MH). 
 

Dr.XIN has just corrected the forum front page on battery life.

 Sgheadphone forum compares SMIV with SR-71 for their discussions. They even compare SM3V6 with SR-71. I think SUPERMINI can give a match to HORNET. The comparison of SMIV should be drawn against SR-71.
 I don't mind waiting times, return for upgrades and even extra shipping cost (Though I think charging international customers bit unfair, having waited so much, for a beta product).
But I need superior SQ!! and period. I have not listened to HORNET or SR-71. Its bit costly for me to try them too and compare. I am satisfied with SQ of SMIV as it is, even it may be having oscillation problems. But my experience of high-end portable amps is limited, though I listened to very best of home setups.
 As more impressions and reviews come with other amps, I will decide. In fact I need the very best of SQ with SMIV, as it is claimed to have, for waiting and keeping faith on Dr.XIN's inventions. I think it is not unfair at all.
 I am going to send the amp for upgrade when XENOS arrives. Will see how it goes.


----------



## kugino

started listening to my supermini for the first time today since my ALO six-shooter arrived...still working to get it bent enough so my nano lays flat on the supermini, but i'm afraid of bending the cable too much. listening impressions to follow in a few weeks.

 quick question, though...while i was changing the jumper to increase the resistance, one popped out, flew somewhere, and i can't find it. anyone know where i can get another one of those little jumpers in the supermini? or do i just contact xin? thanks...


----------



## kaushama

In a discarded motherboard or sound card, etc....?


----------



## kaushama

Anyone has Maxxed out SMIV with 2X buf-cs? Battery life???!


----------



## mirumu

Hmmmm, I guess I'll bite the bullet and send my SM IV back for the fixes. I still doubt I'll be happy with the SQ but that way I might be pleasantly surprised. At the very least it should be easier to sell a 100% model than a 99% model.


----------



## kaushama

Mirumu! Why do you dislike the SQ? Just want to know as it will help us the gauge the performance as well. Specific reasons


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Anyone has Maxxed out SMIV with 2X buf-cs? Battery life???! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I've got the 2X buffers in my 99% amp, two BUF634s for both the left and right and two HA5002s on the 3&4. Battery life lowered to about 12 hours for me but the SQ is better with 2X buffers. It makes it sound more effortless. Currently it still has the default opamps though.


----------



## kaushama

Still want to know about SQ! What other amps do you have and think better?


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Mirumu! Why do you dislike the SQ? Just want to know as it will help us the gauge the performance as well. Specific reasons 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It's a number of things. My worst problem is that it sounds veiled, largely I feel due to a lack of treble extension or roll off starting somewhere in the upper midrange. The midrange overall is okay but doesn't excite me, it's bland. There is no denying the bass is good but it does not satisfy me, I want it tighter and going down deeper. Also, there is detail in the music that it is hiding from me, I know it is there because I have heard using the same gear with other amps. I think the SM IV is designed to look very good on the spec sheet but this doesn't translate into the SQ. I also think Xin's use of the Etymotic ER4 IEMs is telling since I believe they would compensate for the treble deficiencies in the amp and the good bass response (especially with the bass boost) would compensate for the ER4's less forward bottom end.

 I suspect I am being too picky since I'm comparing to things like the Sennheiser HE60s with HEV70 amp but it's not about cost, I prefer my cheaper Xiang Sheng 708B tube amp to the SM IV by far. The portability of the SM IV is great but I don't really need it and wouldn't want to sacrifice this much sound quality.


----------



## kaushama

So you too agree with my initial impressions? Treble being a bit of a weak link and distant mids! Thanks for impressions!
 I too listened to Opeus but not ABed to MACRO!
 I quite agree on your comment on portability vs SQ! I posted this few days ago in another thread.

  Quote:


 The 350-400$ price point seem to be the boundary for "high-end" portable amps and better home-desktop solutions, which are not bottle necked by the size factor. After getting my SUPERMACRO IV, I have serious doubts of these 300$ + amps, ESP if one goes for price perfornance rato. The money one pays from 200$ => 300$ seems to be getting you only 10-20% of performance boost maximum. (From the minnow amps like GO-VIBE, XENOS REP against HORNET, SR-71 and SUPERMACRO)

 If you want high-end portable stuff, XIN Supermini for 199$ may be the last option I consider. It gives performance and feature of SUPERMACRO (a contender to HORNET), very small size and good value. After I saw the SUPERMACRO I honestly feel that comparison from XIN line to HORNET, should be SUPERMINI than MACRO. 

 The portable usage gives another factor to consider. If you use the amp for portable usage only or exclusively (Main reason that one needs a portable solution), are they used in the settings and environments, which gives the owner to listen so analytically? I heard, when RAY produced original HORNET his idea was to provide an amp, which gives energetic SQ with front end presentation. Subsequently he was blamed for narrow suondstage giving birth to "M" HORNET. If so original HORNET is well designed for its intended purpose then.

 IMHO for real critical analytical listening one should go for a desktop solution, of which the design is not constrained by portability. How analytical one needs to listen in the circumstances that need portability, is subjected to debate. So the way I think is one should go for value portable solution and save money for a well regarded desktop\home solution. 
 

But if SUPERMACRO can give best SQ in its class, I would keep it as a transportable solution with flexibility due to features. I guess, I too will send it, when XENOS arrives.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_So you too agree with my initial impressions? Treble being a bit of a weak link and distant mids! Thanks for impressions!
 I too listened to Opeus but not ABed to MACRO!
 I quite agree on your comment on portability vs SQ! I posted this few days ago in another thread.

 But if SUPERMACRO can give best SQ in its class, I would keep it as a transportable solution with flexibility due to features. I guess, I too will send it, when XENOS arrives. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I guess we are agreeing but you seemed more positive about the amp than me. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe these characteristics just annoy me more? I think if I needed extreme portability I would probably keep it but most of my listening is at work and I have access to power sockets. 

 My immediate plans are to buy an amp for electrostatic headphones but I can't really use that at work as I prefer isolating IEMs there. I think sometime I'll probably pick up a smaller Darkvoice or Singlepower amp for my dynamic headphones to go with my Xiang Sheng. Whichever sounds best stays at home and the other will go to work.


----------



## kaushama

Mirumu! Do you use Senn HD580\600 line. I thought, "Senn Veil" of HD580 may have too contributed to mid being distant. When I listen with HD497 and KSC35 mids were better.
 I should audition it with DT880 (pre2005) too. I will post my impressions later.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I guess we are agreeing but you seemed more positive about the amp than me.


----------



## krmathis

I think its hilarious that XIN keep "improving" the SMIV even after releasing it.
 In such way that he have not been able to deliver the amplifier to those who placed their order more than two (2) months ago. And the lucky ones who have receiver theirs, need to send it back. Because it is "broken".

 He would be much better of announcing an amplifier when it is ready for the masses. Then ship out the amplifier, and enjoy the feedback from all the happy customers!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *krmathis* 
_...He would be much better of announcing an amplifier when it is ready for the masses. Then ship out the amplifier, and enjoy the feedback from all the happy customers! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

So true!


----------



## NiceCans

Although I have a great deal of respect for Dr Xin and his designs, after witnessing this fiasco I am very glad I decided to go in another direction and would be very hesitant to place an order in the future unless his track record on delivery greatly improves.

 IMO the Super-Mini is the ideal portable, but it's a real shame that the negatives of his delivery record offset the greatness of his designs.

 Perhaps he will take a lesson from this?
 I imagine so. 
 I'd hate to see it impact him negatively, the community cannot afford to lose such innovative contributors.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I'd hate to see it impact him negatively, the community cannot afford to lose such innovative contributors. 
 

I agree 100%! His desire for new inventions and perfecting them is quite admirable. The scientist and inventor XIN is a bad businesman obviously.

 XIN FENG company, being a single man enterprise, is a bad model for conventional business. My sincere hope, too, all these criticisms of his business model should not affect the relentless inventor, Dr.XIN. That was my sincere hope when I was all praising him. I just voluntarily erased Dr.XINs businessman image, while i was suffering like everyone without an amp. Most often than not people like them get so depressed, their countless moments spent to develop a new concept, is heavilily criticized by public; for reasons, to which they are so ignorant due to their inventive nature. 

 I really wish him good luck, for his hunger for future innovations and for the present one as well.


----------



## krmathis

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiceCans* 
_I'd hate to see it impact him negatively, the community cannot afford to lose such innovative contributors._

 

The later problems certainly have made scratches in his reputation.
 But lets hope it will be mostly gone in a couple of months, when he (hopefully) deliver amplifiers to the customers within the 2-3 weeks he mention on his website.

 Then I _might_ consider ordering one...


----------



## Quake1028

So, what's the average delivery time now roughly?


----------



## 883dave

I agree...

 I am one of the people who have cancelled...

 It is ashame the man does not understand that releasing a BETA test unit to the public under the guise of a finished product is very bad business. He also doesn't seem to understand (or is it care?) that people expect a certain amount of contact and customer service before and after purchasing a product. 

 It is great that he offers free upgrades, however I would expect that with a product that is not complete.

 Hope in the future he is able to ship amps in the timeline stated on his order form...or at least change the time to reflect the real world.

 I do feel sorry to all that have been waiting, just to find that there is another must have tweak...

 Once all this settles, hope there is a lot of positive reviews about Xin products as well as an increase in customer service. This hobby does need as may manufactures as possible.


----------



## krmathis

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gloomfire* 
_So, what's the average delivery time now roughly?_

 

From reading this thread I would say 2 months (more or less).
 At least I have seem people who placed their order July 13. and 20. which still have not received their amplifier.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 The noise level of the latest IV amps (dated 09/14/06) is -105dB. I have not seen any amp has such low noise. So nobody can hear any hiss, regardless what headphones. XIN 
 

So the newest solution to strike a balance between SQ and stability seems to have worked. After the upgrade, one will get much longer battery life and even better sound it seems.

  Quote:


 All the latest IV amps are oscillation-free. It was a very hard work, as oscillation is quite random, and why the latest tweaks took so long. 
 

Lets hope this is the final recipe for a very successful product and everything to be back on order. GOTO may be knowing more details about this, provided he is willing to come out with details.


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiceCans* 
_
 but it's a real shame that the negatives of his delivery record offset the greatness of his designs.
_

 

I think that sums it up perfectly.


 And to answer the question regarding delivery times, I waited two months and a week before i cancelled my order.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Mirumu! Do you use Senn HD580\600 line. I thought, "Senn Veil" of HD580 may have too contributed to mid being distant. When I listen with HD497 and KSC35 mids were better.
 I should audition it with DT880 (pre2005) too. I will post my impressions later._

 

I've mostly been listening with my Shure E500s but I also tried my Sennheiser HD595s and Grado SR-80s. I also tried a friend's AT W5000s for a short time. I feel the E500s sound the best with the SM IV, I don't seem to be able to listen to the other headphones with it for more than 30 minutes without wanting to switch amps. I wouldn't expect the HD580 or HD600 would have good synergy with this amp. Who knows though, I haven't heard them together.


----------



## cerbie

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_started listening to my supermini for the first time today since my ALO six-shooter arrived...still working to get it bent enough so my nano lays flat on the supermini, but i'm afraid of bending the cable too much. listening impressions to follow in a few weeks.

 quick question, though...while i was changing the jumper to increase the resistance, one popped out, flew somewhere, and i can't find it. anyone know where i can get another one of those little jumpers in the supermini? or do i just contact xin? thanks..._

 

Probably get Xin. I believe these are them, though.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_In a discarded motherboard or sound card, etc....?_

 

Not likely. The amp uses 2mm jumpers, which are common for SCSI drives, and only randomly and rarely used elsewhere.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *krmathis* 
_He would be much better of announcing an amplifier when it is ready for the masses. Then ship out the amplifier, and enjoy the feedback from all the happy customers! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I think the problem is that Xin has a tendency to release based on good looking graphs and specs. As far as SQ goes, he has admitted himself that he relies on feedback from others to get the sound right. I feel it would be better though if he got their feedback well before any announcement or release no matter how good the numbers look. 

 When you read Xin's comments or the comments of others who know his methods such as Goto, you can see Xin is a perfectionist and wants to know the _technical_ reasons why one design sounds better than another. When he wants to justify how good a design is he will back it up with graphs and numbers. I don't have a problem with that approach, in fact I respect his dedication wanting to know everything about his designs and why they work the way they do but I feel this leads to a process of trial and error when a design that looks good on paper doesn't pan out in terms of sound quality.


----------



## NiceCans

_BETA TESTING_
 I am more than certain there are any number of qualified Head-Fi'ers who would rush to volunteer to be a Xin Beta Tester. This would allow him to get his feedback and work out any 'bugs' and perform any tweaks prior to public sales thus preventing ruffled feathers.
 just a thought


----------



## Tuarreg

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mirumu* 
_I think the problem is that Xin has a tendency to release based on good looking graphs and specs. As far as SQ goes, he has admitted himself that he relies on feedback from others to get the sound right. I feel it would be better though if he got their feedback well before any announcement or release no matter how good the numbers look. 

 When you read Xin's comments or the comments of others who know his methods such as Goto, you can see Xin is a perfectionist and wants to know the technical reasons why one design sounds better than another. When he wants to justify how good a design is he will back it up with graphs and numbers. I don't have a problem with that approach, in fact I respect his dedication wanting to know everything about his designs and why they work the way they do but I feel this leads to a process of trial and error when a design that looks good on paper doesn't pan out in terms of sound quality._

 

Miramu

 I find your observations very plausible in that they explain quite a few things about Dr. Xin and his search for audio perfection. In the end, however, it would be difficult to really assess the true SQ of Xin's amps due to the constant revisions and the fact that the consumer can somewhat tailor the sound to his/her preferences with the bass boost and the Op-amp configurations. In a way this works as far as perpetuating the myth of Dr. Xin's path to audio nirvana, but less so when the consumer wants to make an informed decision on which amp best suits his needs, especially ones designed by Dr. Xin.

 For me, with Ray Samuel's M-Hornet, I got what I bargained for and I got what was promised... a high quality, well-built portable amp that exceeded my own expectations of sound quality. I am indeed, enjoying some wonderful music as I never heard before. In the end, that's all a consumer can realistically expect from any audio equipment.

 Just my personal thoughts,
 Thanks.

 Tuarreg


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiceCans* 
_BETA TESTING
 I am more than certain there are any number of qualified Head-Fi'ers who would rush to volunteer to be a Xin Beta Tester. This would allow him to get his feedback and work out any 'bugs' and perform any tweaks prior to public sales thus preventing ruffled feathers.
 just a thought_

 

BINGO!!! He's damaging his reputation unnecessarily.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Tuarreg* 
_Miramu

 I find your observations very plausible in that they explain quite a few things about Dr. Xin and his search for audio perfection. In the end, however, it would be difficult to really assess the true SQ of Xin's amps due to the constant revisions and the fact that the consumer can somewhat tailor the sound to his/her preferences with the bass boost and the Op-amp configurations. In a way this works as far as perpetuating the myth of Dr. Xin's path to audio nirvana, but less so when the consumer wants to make an informed decision on which amp best suit his needs, especially ones designed by Dr. Xin.

 For me, with Ray Samuel's M-Hornet, I got what I bargained for and I got what was promised... a high quality, well-built portable amp that exceeded my own expectations of sound quality. I am indeed, enjoying some wonderful music as I never heard before. In the end, that's all a consumer can realistically expect from any audio equipment.

 Just my personal thoughts,
 Thanks.

 Tuarreg_

 

I think you are correct. Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting Xin is doing anything special other amp designers aren't and I'm not making excuses for him. I don't think there's any valid justification for the kind of customer service we've seen. At this point I'd be very happy owning a Hornet, at least I'd know how good the amp I owned actually was without worrying about tweaks.

 What I am suggesting is that Xin appears to feel good graphs and specs can identify an amp that sounds great and is ready for release/sale without proper feedback from listeners. I do believe good specs are an indicator as to what is a good amp but it is not the be and end all. Even if the specs are totally perfect, someone (preferably more than one person) capable of detecting sonic nuances should have to listen to it and give feedback before the design is finalized and sold. It is Xin's business so he can run it how he wants but I feel if he wants to keep credibility and give customers confidence, beta testing, as Nicecans says, is essential.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cerbie* 
_Probably get Xin. I believe these are them, though.

 Not likely. The amp uses 2mm jumpers, which are common for SCSI drives, and only randomly and rarely used elsewhere._

 

thanks cerbie...i'll look around for a used HD somewhere...or just order the 24-pack of them...i imagine i'll be losing quite a bit of those...


----------



## cerbie

I've lost two, but luckily have some around (only 3 spare, now, though, or I'd offer to mail you a few). This is another thing that Xin could be helped in by having someone less involved in the technical side: have a bag of 8 or 10 as a $0.50 or $1 add-on to any order. Simple, effective, and more people that might lose them would think about that before they actually did lose them (seeing that as an option for the amp would make that person think about it).


----------



## Pete7

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiceCans* 
_BETA TESTING
 I am more than certain there are any number of qualified Head-Fi'ers who would rush to volunteer to be a Xin Beta Tester. This would allow him to get his feedback and work out any 'bugs' and perform any tweaks prior to public sales thus preventing ruffled feathers.
 just a thought_

 

Xin has his own forum, as well.


----------



## aluren

looks like there's gonna be more parts to be added. goto mentioned that the addition sound much better than before... hmm... i lost count on how many times i've heard this...


----------



## kaushama

Yes! It gives a test result of noise floor of 105dB! I am in a dilemma now. Whether to send the amp for upgrade or not. According to XIN it corrects all oscillation problems, improve battery life and SQ! As I am out of US it will cost me some bucks to send it.
 But whether the technical data translates into real world performance yet to be seen.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_looks like there's gonna be more parts to be added. goto mentioned that the addition sound much better than before... hmm... i lost count on how many times i've heard this..._

 

My impression on reading Goto's post is that it's the same latest mods we've been talking about here recently that he has been listening to. At least Goto and Xin seem to agree this one is good. I'm cautiously optimistic.


----------



## kaushama

Dr. XIN seems to be pretty confidant when he said, to me, 

  Quote:


 The most important is: please send your amp back, I promise this is the last time. You'll enjoy your music and the best sound, and put all those hassles behind. 
 

He was talking about amps dated 09/14/06. GOTO recently seems to tested the tweak.

 But I am too cautiously waiting to see whether it is going to be real final stages! Besides I need to get my XENOS before I send this.


----------



## kaushama

At least whats evident, is amps shipped after 09/14/06 will not have oscillation problems which plagued SMIV. The high frequency oscillation (above audible range) said to have degraded the stability, battery life and SQ.

 Shall we call this batch of amps "914" batch? ( To avoid confusion? ) Whether 914 amps corrected the crossfeed problem is not clear yet.


----------



## vorlon1

I was fortunate to buy this Super Mini new from another member and received it this morning. It has been burning in most of the day, and for the benefit of all the people waiting I am going to post some impressions at this point in the amp's development. First, in simple terms, it sounds good! The amp is very small and compact, see picture below next to an SR 71, new Nano and 60 g Video Ipod. 





 The sound quality is moderately warm, but very full and with excellent detail. It sounds not unlike the SR 71, but the vocals in recordings are a bit more forward and slightly larger. The soundstage is very deep and wide, to my ears a bit deeper and wider than the SR 71, which I am using as a reference amp for the purposes of these comments. Instruments are very well placed in space and in orchestral music there is no congestion. I am using the default configuation, and Shure E 500's sound excellent, as do Ety 4 P's, and Grado SR 60's. DT 880's and K 701's need more gain than this configuration delivers to play as loud as I like, but at the volume produced sounded fine. I haven't changed the jumpers to increase the gain for the full size cans yet, and I may not as I will use this as a portable with mostly the Shure's. There is no hiss with the Shure's with the default configuration. Overall, I am very happy with the sound qualities of this amp after these few hours of burn in. The highs lacked a bit of sparkle for the first hour or two, but have really improved as the day has gone on, and are now very clean and clear with no harshness. My only concern is that I read there may be another tweak since 9-14, even for the Mini, and I hate to send it back. Anyone know anything definitive on this?

 Here are the actual innerds of the amp, although it is probably the same as Xin's website.


----------



## kaushama

Vorlon1 from What I know about 914 tweaks, it gave SMIV the stability which it lacked all these days and the same tweak can be applied to mini too. But I am going to wait for sometime till dust to settle a bit. After all if SUPERMINI sounds as good as you report waiting will gain more benefit. That's my 0.05.


----------



## GreatDane

Hello Dr. Xin,

 I received my SuperMini IV on Sept. 1 . I believe that my crossfeed 
 circuit is not working properly. With it engaged, the stereo 
 separation 
 collapses into mono or very close to mono. If I turn the volume to 
 maximum, the signal regains its stereo width and sounds much like 
 what I'm 
 used to with the Meier or HeadRoom crossfeed versions. Does what I'm 
 describing sound typical of your crossfeed?

 If not, Is it possible for you to inspect my amp if I send it to 
 you?

 Thank you for your time, I realize that you're very busy these 
 days.

 Dane

 >>>>>>>


 Hi Dane,

 The crossfeed might be too strong after recent changes. Anyway, I'm 
 going to 
 ask all IV amps to come back for a important change, so you should send 
 it 
 back and I'll check the crossfeed.

 Xin


----------



## vorlon1

Yeah, I'll just let this keep burning in for a few days and then see what to do about sending it to him.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_Yeah, I'll just let this keep burning in for a few days and then see what to do about sending it to him._

 

I may just have to get this! Maybe event the solid tube as well. By the way did you get the 6 Gb Mini?


----------



## vorlon1

Got the 8G nano instead.


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_DT 880's and K 701's need more gain than this configuration delivers to play as loud as I like, but at the volume produced sounded fine._

 

I noticed that in your picture the gain jumper is set to low. Have you tried to set it to higher gain? As far as I can remember the high-gain mode gives more than enough volume for AKG K501.


----------



## vorlon1

Right, I left it set as it arrived from Xin, since I am using it with E500s I don't want it on high. I imagine it will drive the K701s fine set to high, and when I decide to get "adventurous" I will go in there and change it to see.


----------



## kaushama

I think I am falling in love with SUPERMINI!


----------



## kaushama

I think I am not 100% happy with the treble response of my supermacro! It lacks some zip for me! It is not grainy or harsh. But lacks some extension with HD580. My amp is pre-914 one with low battery life. It might be suffering from some oscillation!


----------



## aluren

kaushama, so you have both the supermini iv and supermacro iv?? i hope you don't find that the supermini is superior to the supermacro because then i would've just bought the supermacro and save $150...


----------



## cerbie

aluren: if you're concerned about that, then save your money. Xin clearly states all of them should have the same, or at least similar, SQ, and Goto2003 has stated, as a customer, this to be, and actually has been more impressed by the mini and micro (likely due to whatever problems have occured in the Macro of this generation). The Supermacro offers more flexibility than any other amp out there, the Supermini is smaller than most amps out there, and still quite flexible, and the Supermicro is just damn small. SQ should not be a reason for which one you choose.


----------



## aluren

that's true. i completely forgot about the opamp/buffer rolling of ther supermacro. it is why i decided on the supermacro in the first place. anyways, i still haven't got my amp yet. xin told me it'll ship in 1-2 days on 9/13. i guess my amp is incorporating the 914 tweak. yay, another wait... how exciting.


----------



## kaushama

aluren I don't have both. But after reading the performance and better value I was getting a lust for SUPERMINI! I ordered SUPERMINI first and then changed over to MACRO later for more flexibility. A decision still haunts my mind for its credibility. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I think Dr. XIN is fine tuning the 914 amps now.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 The highs lacked a bit of sparkle for the first hour or two, but have really improved as the day has gone on, and are now very clean and clear with no harshness. 
 

What is your impression of the treble department of SUPERMINI burning further? MACRO'S trebles sounded recovery during initial hours but later I feel lack of zip in it.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_





 I think I am not 100% happy with the treble response of my supermacro! It lacks some zip for me! It is not grainy or harsh. But lacks some extension with HD580. My amp is pre-914 one with low battery life. It might be suffering from some oscillation! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes, I'd like to know the cause of the lack of treble extension too. It's just not right and it's easily noticeable with all of the headphones I own, especially when compared with other gear. I'll try and arrange to send mine back to Xin for the latest tweaks now, I was going to wait for some other gear to arrive but I can live without it for a while.


----------



## GreatDane

WOW this thread has over 15,000 views. People sure are interested in this whole mess. 

 I'm still waiting to send my amp back to Xin...just in case, knowwhatimean?

 For the past 3 hours I've been listen using my ZV:M(line out) into the Mini. I've always wanted to EQ the E4 because the highs seem rolled off. Today I was happy with no EQ... E4 sounds better than ever. I'm hearing very good treble detail with the E4. Since I was using the added impedance with my ER4P, I left the Mini this way, bass boost on, no crossfeed, low gain.

 I'm listening to Pink Floyd's The Wall right now,big wide open sound. If the upgrade that Xin makes to my Mini makes it even better...watch out!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've decided not to push my luck, I'm not planning to change to a Macro.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I've decided not to push my luck, I'm not planning to change to a Macro. 
 

But I did!!!


----------



## jdimitri

So what's this 914 tweak thing?


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_What is your impression of the treble department of SUPERMINI burning further? MACRO'S trebles sounded recovery during initial hours but later I feel lack of zip in it._

 

After day two the treble still sounds clean and clear, but I do notice a slight attenuation. It sort of reminds me of how a tape deck sounds that records only up to 14,000 hz vs. one that records to 18, 19, or 20,000 hz. It can sound clean and clear, but it just lacks the highest extension and you notice the lack of it. Has there been any discussion of this in any of the Xin forums?


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jdimitri* 
_So what's this 914 tweak thing?_

 

This refers to tweaks Xin made to the design of the SuperMacro IV amps on and after 09/14/06.


----------



## digitalcat

Treble! I noticed that too! It almost sounded like coffee with too much smoother. But rest assured, mine got better after that and now it's perfect. I think this might be a particular burn-in process due to the special design and layout of Xin's amp. Guys, don't be too insecure, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (reference to another thread).


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_Treble! I noticed that too! It almost sounded like coffee with too much smoother. But rest assured, mine got better after that and now it's perfect. I think this might be a particular burn-in process due to the special design and layout of Xin's amp. Guys, don't be too insecure, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (reference to another thread)._

 

Except I've had my amp since the start of August. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe the tweaks will help.


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mirumu* 
_Except I've had my amp since the start of August. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Maybe the tweaks will help._

 

For what it's worth I got it in June. So for me a long burn-in is worth it, YMMV.


----------



## kaushama

I have posted the treble problem in XIN's forum. I have seen mirumu too joining. But still no response. Meanwhile Dr.XIN seems to have made a batch of 914 amps and running final tests on them before he ships out them.
 It is quite possible that dry treble is due to oscillation according to GOTO.
 I hope 914 tweak will cure the oscillation for good.


----------



## Pete7

Have you tried switching op-amps? It could be a characteristic of OPA2134 you are hearing, and not oscillation.


----------



## kaushama

I haven't! But did users of SM3V6 with OPA2134 report a treble roll off? I do not think so. 
 I think some superminies with AD8397 too, suffer from it.
 But I agree, there is a possibility of that too.


----------



## vorlon1

Thing is, I have a mini with an AD 8397 and similar treble issues, although I think it is improving some today, and I don't want to make any definitive judgements without more burn-in time.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pete7* 
_Have you tried switching op-amps? It could be a characteristic of OPA2134 you are hearing, and not oscillation._

 

I'd love to try that and see but my opamps haven't shipped yet.


----------



## vorlon1

I've got some opamps, if someone can point me to some clear instructions on how to change them in the Mini.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 The latest tweaks included changing 50% of the parts in the amping area of SM IV compared to the pre-9/14 version. Simply put, flawless sound - extrmely smooth, excellent high, warm and airy, a sign of osciliation free. 
 

GOTO2003

 Well the problem with highs seems to have solved!


----------



## kaushama

I think; he refers to 419 tweak, which raises the SMIV to a new level. It has a noise floor of 105dB and oscillation free it seems. This may mark the end of XIN's pursuit of making IV amps oscillation free.


----------



## cerbie

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_I've got some opamps, if someone can point me to some clear instructions on how to change them in the Mini._

 

If they are DIP, you plug them in, making sure pin 1 is in the same place it was in the stock one. A screwdriver just small enough to fit under the chip will work for prying it out. If your stock was AD8397, you'll likely need a buffer opamp, as well (goes in the socket which, by default, has jumper wires). I'm not sure if the AD8397 sounds good, or really likes, being used as a buffer, itself, for another opamp. Xin's forum thread on the IV series amps will have an image showing which socket is what.


----------



## vorlon1

Thanks for the help. Here is a picture of the amp. See the 8397 is soldered, but around it are the sockets to put a different opamp in, but do I have to remove it first? If so, I can't do anything, because I wouldn't want to do any soldering in the unit.


----------



## cerbie

The amp there is not in a DIP-8 package. That yellow board it is soldered to allows it to be physically inserted into a DIP socket.




 This shows which is which (the one there w/o an amp chip is for a buffer). If I had my mini-3, I'd take some macros to show, but alas, it's in USPS' hands, now.

 Anyway, you slip the screwdriver head (or anything similar that doesn't have too sharp an edge) between the top of the socket (black, 8 holes) and the circuit board the amp is soldered to. pry it a little, stick the head all the way under, then twist gently and pry it up. When one side of pins is all the way out, you can pull it off with your fingers.

 On your picture, pin 1 is the red dot. Something will be different on each DIP amp to denote the corner that has pin 1.

 Try to be fairly careful pulling the jumper wires out, though. Remember or diagram their positions for possibly putting them back, later (if you lose/break them, you can either get a dummy opamp from Xin, or cut non-stranded wire to fit in there). Personally, I made a dummy out of a DIP socket and CAT 5 wires.

 As an aside, oxyride is probably not the thing to use. If amps are anything like flashlights when used for reasonable periods (probably are, given typical battery life), oxyrides die much quicker than NIMH or alkalines. For some reason, oxyrides actually die very quickly when under low drain, and last longer than normal alkalines when under short periods of high drain. If you're using the DC boost, Lithiums would probably be the best, else stick w/ plain alkies or NIMHs (Duracell and Rayovac normal are good, and extended life are OK, but generally, the extra life alkaline stuff is hype more than anything else, or act really freakin' weird, like oxyrides).


----------



## vorlon1

Thanks for all that excellent and useful information.


----------



## NiceCans

You should be able to grab the little circuit board that the opamp chips are soldered to (called 'Brown-Dog adapters') with your fingers and with a slight gentle wiggle simply pull them upwards and out.
 I would avoid using a screwdriver if possible due to concerns of damaging something . . . . . . some opamps on Brown-Dogs have another opamp under the Brown-Dog as well (2 - single channel opamps, one on / top one underneath . . . i.e. OPA637).


----------



## cerbie

If you can get your fingers in there, yes, it should work. I didn't think about that--I sure can't get mine in there (and yours is even more packed). Just be cautious in general, and all should be well.


----------



## vorlon1

Thanks to everyone's help I was able to put an LM 6172 in there, and it has seemed to improve the highs a bit. Later on I am going to put something else in the 3rd and 4th slot, possible an AD 8620, and switch them back and forth and see what happens.


----------



## AusTex

I got an email reply from Xin - 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Hi Bill,

 You may not believe it, I have been making the final changes and have held 
 shipping for a long time. The good news is: almost done now and shipping 
 might start as soon as this week.

 Xin


----------



## aluren

sounds good. i got my email notice from xin last week saying it'll ship in 1-2 days and its been a week now. so its nice to know that he's finalizing the tweaks.

 but i think if xin posted this on his forum website, it'll save himself some time from having to answer you, me, and others through individual emails that have concerns on delivery. it goes against reason why he doesn't do that.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_sounds good. i got my email notice from xin last week saying it'll ship in 1-2 days and its been a week now._

 

ditto


----------



## vorlon1

After using an AD 822, LM 6172 and the stock AD 8397s in various combinations I found that the LM 6172 in 3 and 4 and the AD 8397 in the Opamp socket gave the best sound. Much improved highs that don't sound rolled off, very large soundstage, and much better transparency and detail. I'm sure I'm still going to send it to Xin for the 9-14 tweak anyway though.


----------



## digitalcat

When this thread dies and nobody is complaining about not receiving orders, I'll send my amp back for upgrade, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I've recently found my PPA to be a great match with HD600, nice backup for the supermacro.


----------



## kaushama

Yes I was too looking for best configuration for SMIV than default. Still I think 914 tweak will cure, most of the problems of IV amps. From what I know it gives another performance boost to SMIV making it comparable to best. It is sure to better the SQ, if it cures the oscillation problem. Oscillation in non-audible range can downgrade the performance of the amp drastically.

 I think I should ask Dr.XIN to check my charging circuit too. Even when it is in trickle mode, amp sometimes gets quite warm and this happens randomly.


----------



## kaushama

I think after 24 hours of straight burn SMIV now has little improved trebles and less roll off. It may be that it needs longer hours of burn in or oscillation, as Dr.XIN himself reported, occur randomly.
 But its bass response is very impressive!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* 
_When this thread dies and nobody is complaining about not receiving orders, I'll send my amp back for upgrade, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I've recently found my PPA to be a great match with HD600, nice backup for the supermacro._

 

smart man!


----------



## mirumu

I've contacted Xin to negotiate the return and upgrade of my SM IV. I don't mind a bit of a wait for it, I don't particularly enjoy the SM IV as-is and I should have a STAX SR-005A system arriving in a few days anyway.


----------



## kaushama

Kugino! I see your amp for sale (wrong forum though)! You never posted your impressions. What do you think?


----------



## kaushama

Another point worth mentioning is GOTO's impression about newest tweaks. He has been very conservative regarding the IV amps before. As this IV concept rooted from the pre-power combo of GOTO, he was always in the opinion that IV amps should sound at least on par with his SM3V6 pre-power combo. As pre914 amps suffered from oscillation they did not give performance comparable to combo. Even some superminies were supposed suffer from the ailment.

 They do suffer from oscillation. My SMIV has whistling\bird sounds, when its volume cranked up to maximum, connected to iaudio G3. I can hear it quite loud when iAudio's volume is zero. It reminds me the first STK4192 chip amp project of mine few years back. Due to ground loop problem in my preamp it gave these whistling sounds of oscillation and IC was getting warm like nothing. Sound quality was horrible. But when ground loop was cleared it gave sweet sound.

 But I am quite impressed with its SQ. Particularly its definition and sound-stage. The best, I have heard in a portable so far. If SMIV can perform like that even when it oscillates, I am sure the mature product, will be a kick-ass amp.That is why, I think SMIV should be given time to mature.

 Its sure Dr.XIN is paying with his reputation for the sin of premature product announcement. The good news is, GOTO now thinks SMIV can give a head-on for his pre-power combo. This is after 914 tweaks. Dr.XIN may be fine tuning the 914 tweak. He is as silent, he is known to be. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But I am going to wait till dust settles to get 914 tweak. If it cures oscillation problem (the main problem of SMIV all these days), we may be able enjoy a kick-ass amp.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Kugino! I see your amp for sale (wrong forum though)! You never posted your impressions. What do you think? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

lol

 Thats what I was thinking. I guess it wasn't very enjoyable. I look forward to having my Mini fixed...I'm just too lazy right now and I'm also waiting for another amp to arrive from Germany first
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 {{{what could it be
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




}}}


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* 
_lol

 Thats what I was thinking. I guess it wasn't very enjoyable. I look forward to having my Mini fixed...I'm just too lazy right now and I'm also waiting for another amp to arrive from Germany first
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 {{{what could it be
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




}}}_

 

yeah, my impressions...well, i thought the supermini was okay, not great, though. i didn't like the cross-feed (though i don't really care for it in general...didn't like it on the head-five, either)...the design isn't my cup o'tea...though i'm using it with my nano, i'm happy to carry a slightly bigger amp. my PINT will be fine for now until i get another amp for portable purposes (i like the PINT paired with the alien DAC on my imac). 

 what i did like? well, the bass boost was implemented quite well...it's amazing how much stuff xin gets packed into that little case, too. i'll just sell it as is...someone can listen to it and decide if they want to send it in for the latest update (though i don't know how necessary that is).


----------



## Nick Christy

I cancelled my order 10 days ago by emailing Xin. He didnt reply so i followed it up with a second email last Saturday.

 At the same time I ordered a Hornet from Ray.

 To date Xin hasnt replied, but i do know Ray has shipped my amp.

 It will be interesting to see if Ray can ship an amp from the US to London faster than Xin can answer an email.

 I paid for my amp by Paypal so I am $400 out of pocket at the moment. I've now emailed Xin a second reminder (i.e 3 unanswered emails in total). If i havent heard anything by the end of Tuesday I'll have to get my money back from Paypal via their complaints procedure.

 Xin's really not covering himself in glory at the moment with the way he looks after his customers.


----------



## Nick Christy

Update - sorry if i get this wrong.

 Skylab - Amp Received - *AMP SOLD*
 djbnh: June 14th - Amp received
 Slappy: June 15th - Amp received
 Comfycan: June - Amp received
 Skev13: June 22nd - Amp received - *AMP SOLD*
 GreatDane: June 29 - Amp received - *CROSSFEED DOESNT WORK*
 robster: June 30 - *CANCELLED ORDER*
 lolos: July 4th - Amp received
 Kaushama:July 5th - Amp received - *CROSSFEED DOESNT WORK*
 Kugino:july 5th Amp received - *AMP FOR SALE*
 883dave: July 7th - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 wangch: July 9th - Amp Received
 Nick Christy: July 11th - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 nfusion770: July 28th
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 is2us: AUGUST 13


 Thats a lot of unhappy people.


----------



## kiwirugby

That's nine unhappy people. There may be some others who haven't said they are unhappy. But I am not sure that nine plus some others constitutes "a lot."

 There is no number for those satisfied or happy. Perhaps that would be helpful to balance the "equation."

 I have had to send my SM IV back to Xin three times, wait for him to email me and wait for the amp to be sent back. But I'm okay with this, happy and satisfied. I like what I hear coming from his amp. Also, I have known about his "business style" for over three years so I know what I am getting into and don't care how long it takes. I just like his amps.

 What would be more constructive is to say what you don't like about the process, go on record and move on.


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* 
_
 What would be more constructive is to say what you don't like about the process, go on record and move on._

 

I'll move on when i get my money back.

 I agree that some of the people above are happy - all i did was pick up the earlier list and post updates for what has been put in here. I know comfycan really likes his micro, and Kaushama is happy with the amp other than the crossfeed and treble roll off, BUT the 9 above is out of 21 people which is 42 %. There may be happy people out there but if they werent in the original list and havent posted here so i can only update for what i see.

 It's a statement of fact and not my opinion.

 What i dont like about the process is that I have paid for an amp i havent received, had 4 broken promises of delivery, been ignored when i've asked questions and cancelled my order, and , to date, havent been refunded or told when i will be.

 I'm glad you're happy with your amp. I'm sure I would have been too if i had received it. 

 The amps may be great- the service sucks, and it sucks way beyond what i was led to believe when i originally ordered. My hopes werent high, the website said 2 - 3 weeks delivery and i thought it would be at least double that BUT i waited 10 before i cancelled. I dont think i was that impatient at all.


----------



## GreatDane

I agree with all points made by Nick and others who have made their dissatisfaction be known. 

 I sent Xin an email 10 days ago in reply to his message that told me to send my Mini back in for "important updates". I was asking him if I could upgrade to a Macro but I've since changed my mind. I just want to get my Mini working properly and be done with this mess.

 I do intend intend to keep my Mini. I did know about Xins slow service and was prepaired for a long wait but to find out that the amp wasn't a properly working version has me upset.

 If I would have known this outcome prior to my ordering I would have chosen a different amp with crossfeed, which was my main reason for wanting the SuperMini.


----------



## kaushama

By Dr.XIN's silence after the announcement of 914 tweak, I get the feeling that he is again into some major experiment!!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I don't think Dr.XIN will answer the emails or forums, until he solves the IV puzzle. He seems to be determined to solve it silently despite whatever losses he going to suffer. I guess that is how he operates. He seems to be content with customers, who wait for him to finish the tweaks.


----------



## Lusamars

I dont have any headamp, never had and i wants one. I will wait as long as it takes for that supermini's to be fully release to check it and read what others think about it.
 For a long time that i've been folowing DR. Xin's work with quiet admiration. I think he is a very peculiar and interesting person, with a diferent work/business approach that i personaly like.
 If the supermini became what in theory what he wants, for 200 bucks will be mine for sure. it's small, light, op's manageable, and powerfull enough to drive my HD580 and ER4P.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_Update - sorry if i get this wrong.

 Skylab - Amp Received - *AMP SOLD*
 djbnh: June 14th - Amp received
 Slappy: June 15th - Amp received
 Comfycan: June - Amp received
 Skev13: June 22nd - Amp received - *AMP SOLD*
 GreatDane: June 29 - Amp received - *CROSSFEED DOESNT WORK*
 robster: June 30 - *CANCELLED ORDER*
 lolos: July 4th - Amp received
 Kaushama:July 5th - Amp received - *CROSSFEED DOESNT WORK*
 Kugino:july 5th Amp received - *AMP FOR SALE*
 883dave: July 7th - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 wangch: July 9th - Amp Received
 Nick Christy: July 11th - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 aluren: July 13
 dslknight: July 20
 Vorlon1: July 22
 airbender :smIV for upgrade: july 25 (shipping notice: august 28)
 nfusion770: July 28th
 stevenkelby:July 29 
 mrarroyo: August 6. - *ORDER CANCELLED*
 is2us: AUGUST 13


 Thats a lot of unhappy people._

 

FYI - I have NOT received my amp yet. Got an intent-to-ship notice from the good Dr. on 9/12 that the amp should be shipped in "1-2 days". However, my understanding is that Dr. Xin made another tweak to the SuperMacro IV on 9/14; I imagine implementing that tweak is the hold up for my amp at this stage of the game. 

 My amp's been in Dr. Xin's hands since 6/14, and I can understand if others have reached the limit of their respective patience with his/her individual situation. Even though I've been waiting over three months for the amp to get back to me, I'm lucky enough to have other equipment that seems to be keeping the blues away and blood pressure at normal. I also feel fortunate that my wallet hasn't had to bite on a number of potential back-and-forth shipping costs to get the amp caught up with the numerous changes.

 Best of luck to all.

 Edit: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## aluren

nick, you forgot the most important person on the list: lolos. he actually quit this hobby because of this... that's a big tragedy!


----------



## soundaudio

I ordered Xin amp last week.Hopefully can receive it before end of the year as New Year Gift for myself.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_nick, you forgot the most important person on the list: lolos. he actually quit this hobby because of this... that's a big tragedy!_

 

I find that hard to believe, it was most likely an excuse to get out. For God's sake this are just "things" is not like a loved one is ill or dying.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 For God's sake this are just "things" is not like a loved one is ill or dying. 
 

LOL!


----------



## jamato8

I have been reading this thread just about from its inception and I have to admit it is interesting to see the range of emotions this waiting has elicited, which is understandable. What I would like to interject is not for those who have thrown their hands up and have said forget it, which again I find understandable for them, but for those waiting. I have been listening to the version V, which is much the same as the IV that will be the amp version used. The sound is excellent in all areas. I have been using a modified combo setup of the V3 and V6 with the V6 as the preamp section and I find the V competes head on with this setup. To do this there has to be a current delivery to the amp section that is unencumbered, and I find this to be spot on with regards to bass impact, transparency, detail and attack. Frequency extremes is natural and pleasant to listen to with no perceptible humps in any particular area. 

 Sony 955 (optical out), Monica II (Black Gate modified), SMV, HD650's, PortaPros, or UM2's.


----------



## kaushama

And...... I don't see a slightest change in DR.XIN's way of handling things. Even we discuss, shout, criticize, blame, crucify and assassinate.....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Whatever said and done, he does not and will not change his way. He seems to be only interested in getting his IV amps correct. There may be 45% drop off and more unhappy people. Still I can see people are interested in progress of amps by number of visits to this thread. Some are just marking time to order when it is ready. Even he is doing so wrong in the eyes of typical consumers, his amps get public interest because they are unique products.

 It is more than true, when someone said in Xin's forum,

  Quote:


 I think though that most of Xin's customers are not "typical consumers" and I am not even shure if he is really interrested in having "typical consumers" as customers 
 

 !!

 But he has some number of atypical supporters too. If smoeone now visit support forum one can see that.

 So I don't see any productivity discussing these aberrations over and over again. It might serve a purpose to drive away typical customers. But I wonder whether Dr.XIN cares! I guess sensible thing for typical customers to do move away for more stable configuration and have a "music lovers" amp like HORNET and may be later have a look here, when dust settles. XIN amps are "Tweaker's amps" and a tweaker will never stop doing various changes to gear. If you visit PC hardware forums, you will see the crazy things they do just to overclock. And they never stop.

 People, who love to tweak and change things around dynamically; "Tweakers" will stay with XIN and will have the patience to follow his products. In the true sense XIN's amps are that! Aren't they? Dr.XIN wants a miniature amp with so many options and he wants it to be stable with every known OPAMP for tweakers to play around. A typical consumer like music lover does not want that! Do they?

 So shall we stop at that and move away on our own directions? I think following up the progress of XIN amps, will be a more fruitful exercise here than speculating the impossible. (Dr.XIN's rehabilitation) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It will serve tweakers to determine the optimal timing for updates. And perhaps typical consumers to buy a stable configuration, if they ever wish to do that!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 I have been listening to the version V, which is much the same as the IV that will be the amp version used. The sound is excellent in all areas. 
 

So jamato8
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Is this the same version V PCB goto2003 referred to earlier? The 09\14 tweak involves earlier IV PCB or V PCB? What we know is 09\14 tweak reduced the noise floor to -105db and got rid of oscillation problems.
 Will newest SM amps carry V PCB when tweaking is over?

 Thanks for your information!


----------



## ComfyCan

Just curious; while twiddling thumbs waiting on Xin amps, what exactly is oscillation anyway? (technically, and how does it manifest itself in listening).

 Thanks, and continued empathy for those still waiting on delivery.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_I find that hard to believe, it was most likely an excuse to get out. For God's sake this are just "things" is not like a loved one is ill or dying._

 

well when i said tragedy, i meant it in a sarcastic way... i think there should be a sarcastic smilie so it can be used in the appropriate words.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_So jamato8
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Is this the same version V PCB goto2003 referred to earlier? The 09\14 tweak involves earlier IV PCB or V PCB? What we know is 09\14 tweak reduced the noise floor to -105db and got rid of oscillation problems.
 Will newest SM amps carry V PCB when tweaking is over?

 Thanks for your information!_

 

okay...i am confused. there's a version V?!?! and we pre-9/14 amps are supposed to send it back for what? for a version IV update or a v.V update? i want to sell mine but may send it back for the update and then sell it afterward...i don't know. i'm confused. did i mention i'm confused?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_Just curious; while twiddling thumbs waiting on Xin amps, what exactly is oscillation anyway? (technically, and how does it manifest itself in listening).

 Thanks, and continued empathy for those still waiting on delivery._

 

Occillation is the response, a type of vibration, of a device to a frequency (that may be so low you can not hear it to very high above the hearing level to anywhere in between). Something in the circuit often causes this and through circuit design hopefully the problem will be corrected. What happens with this reponse can be a harmonic, which is a lower or higher multiple of that frequency. Say you have a 60 cycle sound. You may have a sound at 120hz, 240hz and so on. With occilation, which may begin at the super frequencies, a high pitched sound may be heard as this harmonic goes down to the hearing level, or you may just hear distortion in the sound. This distortion may be very noticable or just something that irritates but you are not sure why. Occitlation can be very hard to tame but often is dealt with by using a bypass capacitor, which shunts this frequency to ground while not passing any other frequency. Also a resistor is sometimes used, as is often used on tube preamps and some amps on the input to the driver tube or sometimes the power tube of the amplifier. There is much more but this is the basics, though i am sure others will have input to add.

 From what I understand, though not heard, the IV had a high pitched frequncy response to the input from some devices. This could be a squeal, wine, buzzing or any combination of sound that would not enhance the sound.


----------



## kaushama

Kugino,

  Quote:


 okay...i am confused. there's a version V 
 

There was a version V, once GOTO reported here and made some confusion then too. Later it was told that Dr.XIn decided to continue to use version IV PCBs. Version IV PCBs were extensively tested before. I just wanted to know whether for the 09\14 tweak PCB used is V or IV!
 From the latest I know it seems all version IV PCBs will be used in future. And 9\14 tweaks most probably involve, version IV PCBs. 
 As I reported here earlier my SMIV has squealing sounds when it is connected to iAudio G3! It is a sure sign of oscillation. This oscillation seems to be the biggest problem plagued version IV amps. Still with oscillation my SMIV has impressive bass response and sound-stage. There is a treble roll-off which I think will go away if oscillation is cured. So I am optimistically waiting.


----------



## 883dave

kaushama said:
			
		

> Still I can see people are interested in progress of amps by number of visits to this thread.
> 
> I wonder how many are here for the amps and how many are here for the Soap-Opera ?
> 
> ...


----------



## Skylab

I think kaushama hit it on the head. The Xin stuff is for tweakers. You have to really like that aspect of these things to fully appreciate his work.

 I am not a tweaker at all. I like gear, but I don't have any interest in thing like op-amp rolling. And contrary to Xin's hyperbole, his amps are not better than other competitors. They are competitive. So for people like me, the RSA Hornet makes much more sense than a SMIV, which is why I sold mine and have stayed with the wonderful sounding (and incredibly well made) Hornet.


----------



## nfusion770

I am not sure that I am tweaker either, but the impedance/gain/bass switches on the Supermacro are pretty handy. Its nice to be able to adjust the amp for different headphones.

 I really feel for anyone going through this xin drama without a backup amp. If I was in a similar position I would have bailed long ago.


----------



## GreatDane

I'm also not a tweaker and I didn't plan to roll op amps. The impedance, crossfeed and bass boost in combination with the small size of the Mini are what interested me.

 After comparing my ER4P with the 75 Ohms added vs. not , I agree that the "S" version sounds better.

 Using bass boost with my ER4P brings them very close to my E4 in terms of bass quantity and basically fixes the low-end deficiency...another advantage.

 ...now if Xin is able to fix the crossfeed on my Mini I'll be very satisfied with my purchase as far as actual function is concerned.


----------



## Pete7

Not to rain on anyone's parade, but there are other portable amps that are "tweakable." This thread is like a soap opera. People canceling orders. People slamming Xin. Staunch Xin loyalists doing damage control...It's got everything.


----------



## kaushama

The impedance/gain/bass switches on the Supermacro gives the user to tweak the settings and play with many headphones. So XIN provides many options for various extents. His amps are made to be flexible. The flexibility may not be very important for every consumer, who wants stable product. 

 But I say it is our minds than anything else. If Dr.XIN kept IV amps as a secret and further applied latest tweaks to SM3V6 and named it SM3V6 special edition or something, how many of us would have bought it and enjoyed it?

 I have seen mrarroyo saying he feels that SM3V6 sounded better than the Hornet or the SR71. There may have been many like that. But since now there is BETA SMIV, will any consumer be content in buying a SM3V6? We all want SMIV to be finished early and enjoy it. What if it was not announced? Its all in our minds than anything. Typical customer, who needs reassured that he has the latest and best for some time to come (sense of self security) will buy product lines suits that need. XIn wanting always to improve his products will not provide that sense of security.


----------



## Pete7

Maybe tweakable to you means being able to play with the switches, but op-amp rolling is what I had in mind. No switch tweaks the sound more than that.


----------



## 883dave

"But I say it is our minds than anything else. If Dr.XIN kept IV amps as a secret and further applied latest tweaks to SM3V6 and named it SM3V6 special edition or something, how many of us would have bought it and enjoyed it?"

 I for one would have purchased at least one. Since cancelling my supermacro order I have purchased two hornet's, and am thinking about a third (christmas presents).

 I was looking forward to the versability of the Xin amp, but the 99% tweak, the 100.05% tweak, the 9/14 tweak, the should have up-grade, the must have up-grade, made me rethink having one of his un-completed un-advised BETA products at this time.

 I do hope that he is able to fully complete this product, as in the future I would like to hear what his products can do.


----------



## is2us

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nick Christy* 
_I'll move on when i get my money back._

 

Please let us know how long it took, from when you canceled the order to receive the refund. Becuase if it will take Xin weeks to refund a canceled order, then the problem is much worse than just tweeking and perfection.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djbnh* 
_FYI - I have NOT received my amp yet. Got an intent-to-ship notice from the good Dr. on 9/12 that the amp should be shipped in "1-2 days". However, my understanding is that Dr. Xin made another tweak to the SuperMacro IV on 9/14; I imagine implementing that tweak is the hold up for my amp at this stage of the game._

 

Got e-mail from Dr. Xin tonight that indeed it was the recent changes that were holding up the amp. He says "all is well" and that I should receive a shipping notice tomorrow. Hooray! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 Edit: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## kaushama

I think this saga is nearing its very end now!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And it has been real fun!!!!


----------



## kaushama

And new SMIV seems to have reached the heights of SM3V6 pre-power combo, from what I hear. I think its time for me to send it back.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 [9/24/06] Please send back your IV amps for the latest and last change, including SuperMacro-IV, SuperMini-IV and SuperMicro-IV. 

 Once you have your amp upgraded, just enjoy your music and put all other things behind. It was tough, but I got everything done right, finally. All other amps, as long as they are single-power-supply type, are all still wrong by design. The latest IV amps are all perfect, design-wise and sound-wise.

 Shipping starts tomorrow.

 I'm closing this thread, as it is done. I'll continue to update the first page.

 Thank you and enjoy the best sound!

 Dr.XIN - XIN's FORUM 
 

Are we closing down this thread too???!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 But I really miss it. All those fun and drama!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by * Dr Xin* 
_ Sugano-san and all others: please send your amps back, this is the last time, I promise._

 

hmm... what if this isn't the last time?? will we all get a free supermicro??


----------



## Nick Christy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *is2us* 
_Please let us know how long it took, from when you canceled the order to receive the refund. Becuase if it will take Xin weeks to refund a canceled order, then the problem is much worse than just tweeking and perfection._

 


 Xin just refunded me in full. To be fair to him, he refunded me immediately he got my emails, he just hadnt checked his emails for 9 days.

 Dont close the thread down yet people, if Xin is about to start shipping the final amps then we need a few reviews when people get them back. We need to know whether the wait was worth it.


----------



## GreatDane

Xin replied to my email and told me that I could upgrade to Macro from Mini if I want. 

 I'm glad to see this all coming to and end. I do hope to read plenty of user feedback here in the next few weeks.

 I guess its time for me to send back my Mini.


----------



## aluren

goto, do you have any comments on the now 'perfect' IV amps? usually you're the one that tell us impressions on xin's tweaks before he announces them. but this time xin just mentioned that the design is now perfect. and its been known that he base his opinion on performance charts rather than ears. just wanted to know what you have discovered with this finalized desgin.


----------



## kaushama

GOTO is busy these days and this is what he told me regarding new amps. I hope he won't mind I post it here.

  Quote:


 After some listening, I think Xin finally made SM IV sound too good to be true. I am happy because now all three, including Macro sound excellent to me, and can stand firmly against my combo. I felt kind of disapointed for a few months as Xin couldn't make his amps sound as good as my combo. Now I think he made it as the IV sounds close enough to the combo and there's no flaw in sound but beautiful music.


----------



## FreeBlues

I've been following this thread since inception and am wondering if I'm confused. It seems almost all the chatter has related to the Macro and to a lesser degree the Mini. Does anyone know what's going on with the Micro?

 I ordered a Micro on July 27th and, like everyone, am still waiting. Were all/any of the tweaks being discussed here applicable to the Micro? If the Macro starts shipping, do we know if the Micro (and Mini) will start shipping as well?


----------



## aluren

thanks kaushama. that's basically what i wanted to know. hopefully i can get my amp since i still haven't received it yet...


----------



## Sture

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FreeBlues* 
_I've been following this thread since inception and am wondering if I'm confused. It seems almost all the chatter has related to the Macro and to a lesser degree the Mini. Does anyone know what's going on with the Micro?

 I ordered a Micro on July 27th and, like everyone, am still waiting. Were all/any of the tweaks being discussed here applicable to the Micro? If the Macro starts shipping, do we know if the Micro (and Mini) will start shipping as well?_

 


 Xin emailed me today and he promise shipping my Supermicro-IV few days, withing next week. I order August 4.


----------



## digitalcat

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FreeBlues* 
_I've been following this thread since inception and am wondering if I'm confused. It seems almost all the chatter has related to the Macro and to a lesser degree the Mini. Does anyone know what's going on with the Micro?

 I ordered a Micro on July 27th and, like everyone, am still waiting. Were all/any of the tweaks being discussed here applicable to the Micro? If the Macro starts shipping, do we know if the Micro (and Mini) will start shipping as well?_

 

I think they'll all start shipping very soon. The micro is possibly free of the problems mentioned in this thread, as nobody seems to be complaining about its sound. Then again, not many people have really received their supermicro yet,


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sture* 
_Xin emailed me today and he promise shipping my Supermicro-IV few days, withing next week. I order August 4._

 

I am happy for you- I ordered mine on the 29th of July- wheres my email Xin!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Actually, I changed my order from a mini to a micro in early august, so I am still unclear what my actual order date is.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djbnh on 9/24/06* 
_Got e-mail from Dr. Xin tonight that indeed it was the recent changes that were holding up the amp. He says "all is well" and that I should receive a shipping notice tomorrow. Hooray! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

Things do indeed seem to be moving right along, CC got billed today. Thanks Dr. Xin!

 Edit: Just got shipping notice! Very much looking forward to start burn-in with the amp in a couple days and enjoying the fruits of Dr. Xin's hard work (and I'd say a bit of patience on my part). The expericne is evocative of the Grateful Dead tune, "What a long, strange trip it's been". I hope others will soon be receiving their respective shipping notice and have many, many hours of blissful sonic enjoyment.

 Edit #2: Amp received on 9/27/2006. Thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## mirumu

I got an email from Dr. Xin yesterday confirming the details for sending my SM-IV back for the fixes. Definitely looks like he's getting through his backlog.


----------



## nfusion770

I have yet to recieve the email, but I was just charged $184.97 on a credit card I havent used in months. Either Xin has something in store for me, or I have a big mess to deal with in the morning.

 Edit- even more exciting, I just got an email from Vinnie- imod is on the way!!!! 

 What a great day!


----------



## aluren

nice upgrades, nfusion. you'll love the imodded ipod!! it looks like you got a complete portable setup: imod to cryo to xin amp to e500. once i get my supermacro, we'll have the same setup. then we'll be set!!


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_nice upgrades, nfusion. you'll love the imodded ipod!! it looks like you got a complete portable setup: imod to cryo to xin amp to e500. once i get my supermacro, we'll have the same setup. then we'll be set!!_

 

I have an early July macro that I bought second hand- I think it sounds great the way it is so I imagine you will be pleased. I am sending the macro back for upgrades as soon as I get the long awaited micro. Once I get all this stuff back it will be time to slow down and enjoy some of it..... ahh who am I kidding, there will always be something to buy or sell off.


----------



## kugino

sent my supermini back today for the upgrades...we'll see.


----------



## dslknight

WOOHOO!! Shipping notice recieved today! I haven't contributed anything to this thread but count me in for a large portion of the thread views.


----------



## aluren

me too!! just got a shipment notice!! after 2 and a half months of waiting, its finally gonna come. my PA2v2 days will soon pass.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nfusion770* 
_Edit- even more exciting, I just got an email from Vinnie- imod is on the way!!!! _

 

I too have an iMod, and with the SMIV (mine's back in Xin's garage) you will be so happy. Great sound. Congratulations!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_sent my supermini back today for the upgrades...we'll see._

 

I thought you were selling it!


----------



## vorlon1

I placed my order on July 22 and no word from Xin yet. Any of you guys that got notices or charges, order close to that date? (Hopefully not after).


----------



## nfusion770

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* 
_I too have an iMod, and with the SMIV (mine's back in Xin's garage) you will be so happy. Great sound. Congratulations!_

 

Its nice to see so many of us are like minded, in that we can wade through all the BS and just get all the best stuff. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Seriously, with all the accolades I am very excited about the imod. I still dont believe the micro can possibly be as small as it is supposed to be. The macro is actually pretty small itself. Its gonna be a fun week, but its almost going to be like work playing with all this new stuff.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_I thought you were selling it!_

 

i might as well listen to the "final" product before selling it! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i'm actually not a fan of all the options - don't use the impedance switch, don't like crossfeed, not really into op-amp rolling...basically, i just need a small amp that maybe has a bass-boost option. don't worry...it'll be back for sale sometime next week when i get it back


----------



## kaushama

Waiting here till MY Xenos 0HA REP arrives! But I feel there is a significant improvement in SQ of SMIV, after extensive burn in.

 It has been fun last few weeks. Hasn't it? I really enjoyed backing up Dr.XIN when he was the underdog!!! When the chips are down I felt there should be at least few who should back him up. Thats who I am. I made several friends too in the process. 

aluren, Nick, kugino, mirumu, digitalcat, GreatDane and several others It was fun to have you guys around.

 I think we all did bring emotion and interest into this thread. And it was a good place to disperse energy eminating from our strong emtions

 Its good finally Dr.XIN got it correct. I think when he first announced IV he didn't know the oscillation problem. That is the starting point for all this drama. But I envy his endurance in getting it corrected. I never knew him before. later only I realized he doesn't care for public criticism and when he is in inventive mode he is ruthless. So there was no need of us to back him up too. I don't think he will change his model too. 

 We should be thankful to GOTO, HIFLIGHT and JAMATO8 for their valuable information. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Looking forward to see lots of impressions here.

 I don't think my frequent *(irritating)* posting here is necessary now! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 The visit count is now 17,509!!


----------



## jamato8

Yes a high count and on Xin's site for the IV is over 60,000! Well all I can say is that for those waiting, I think they will be very happy unless they don't like great sound. For Xin, well he is used to all this and god does he work hard. I am surprised he still has hair on his head. I have never known of someone so dedicated to giving people upgrade after upgrade, and while some may be upset by the changes, Xin stands behind what he is doing and giving the benifits to the customer.


----------



## aluren

yeah, kaushama, what a rollercoaster this was. all your positivity has gotten many people through this gruesome wait. if it weren't for all the positive comments i've read from you, i just might have cancelled my order. now let's hope that the xin amp finally live up to our expectations and we all finally get what have been wanting for 2-3 months now. next stop on this rollercoaster: impressions!


----------



## kaushama

There is another good news too. As Dr.XIN & clan think the final configuration is so right and good, he will not be issuing anymore upgrades and tweaks. He will stick to this configuration for year or more. After all Dr.XIN is doing some changes in his approach. 
 He is simply sick of frequent upgrades as most of others are. For those who want sense of security with their gear that would be good news.
 I think we should convince him to have a good case work too. We will see!


----------



## aluren

its nice to know that all this mayhem is finally over. yeah, if dr xin can design a better case, that would be great. it just looks too generic when compare to the hornet.


----------



## russdog

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_I placed my order on July 22 and no word from Xin yet. Any of you guys that got notices or charges, order close to that date? (Hopefully not after)._

 

I ordered a SuperMacro on July 21. He sent me an "it was shipped today" notice late yesterday (9/25) afternoon (It was timestamped 6pm CDT; so 7pm EDT).


----------



## krmathis

Good news!
 I will consider buying a SuperMacro IV when he keep up with the stated 2-3 weeks shipment time.


----------



## aluren

for those of you that got amps already, how long does it usually take from shipment notice to receipt??


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_for those of you that got amps already, how long does it usually take from shipment notice to receipt??_

 

Xin sent me notice of shipment on 8/30 and I received it on 9/1.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_for those of you that got amps already, how long does it usually take from shipment notice to receipt??_

 

For my SuperMicro III, I think it was 2 days. I didn't get one for the SuperMicro IV (or it got nabbed by the spam filter).

 I'm glad you are FINALLY going to get your amp! You're a page one veteran, as I recall.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_i might as well listen to the "final" product before selling it! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i'm actually not a fan of all the options - don't use the impedance switch, don't like crossfeed, not really into op-amp rolling...basically, i just need a small amp that maybe has a bass-boost option. don't worry...it'll be back for sale sometime next week when i get it back 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

If you decide to sell it send me a PM. Thanks.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_If you decide to sell it send me a PM. Thanks._

 

yeah, i'll let you know if i do...will PM you before putting it up FS.


----------



## stevenkelby

Vorlon1, you had the 3rd post here, got a shipping notice yet?

 Ordered end July, I got my notice today, Xin knows I am going away for 5 weeks on the 7th Oct so need it asap.

 Should be here in Australia by end of week. 

 Can't wait!

 Thanks for the constant entertainment, I have read here everyday since 1st post!


----------



## nfusion770

As I posted above, I was charged on Monday for my July 29th (early August modified) Micro order, but still no email regarding shipping. I would be satisfied if a little box arrived outside my house 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, but I anticipate mine is still in the pre- shipment stage.


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* 
_Vorlon1, you had the 3rd post here, got a shipping notice yet?_

 

I emailed Dr. Xin last night and got this response.

 "Rob, I made the micro amps today and will ship them tomorrow including 
 yours. Xin"

 So things look good.


----------



## aluren

just checked the usps for delivery status and it should arrive at my house when i get off from work!! i'm psyched! its been a good 2 and a half months and FINALLY! traffic's gonna be especially tough for me today!


----------



## djbnh

Amp received this evening - thanks Dr. Xin.


----------



## bamboobrown

Order Date: 30 Jul 2006
 Shipping Date: 25 Sep 2006
 Arrival Date: 27 Sep 2006

 Long wait, but I'm sure well worth it.


----------



## dslknight

Just got my amp today! So just wanting to update my times with the arrival date of: Sept. 27. Now back to the music...


----------



## nfusion770

Just got my email. Supermicro ordered July 29th (order changed to micro Aug 8th?) has shipped.


----------



## vorlon1

Supermicro ordered July 22.

 A package was shipped to you on 09/28/2006 via U.S. Postal Service Priority
 Mail, Flat Rate


----------



## aluren

after listening to a couple hours, all i can say is WOW!!! the bass, treble, highs, soundstage, instrument separation are all there!! i love the four switches too. the bass boost plus high gain made my DT 880 sound more powerful and more bass impact, which i'm sure most of you that have the DT 880 know that they are bass lacking phones. i have the max out OPA 627 version. i will try to take out 1 buffer and see how it sounds like. i also have some opamps, which i will try out as well. also, some pics on the way. but for now, i am utterly impressed!! definitely worth the wait and money!


----------



## FreeBlues

SuperMicro ordered July 27th, shipped September 28, come on US Postal Service!


----------



## aluren

my supermacro came with the HA5002 buffers instead of the BUF634. I just took out 3 buffers and the OPA 627 and switched it with the OPA134, thus making mine the default supermacro. with this setup, the treble is extended a little more, but the trade off is soundstage and bass. i'm now a firm believer in opamp rolling!


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_my supermacro came with the HA5002 buffers instead of the BUF634. I just took out 3 buffers and the OPA 627 and switched it with the OPA134, thus making mine the default supermacro. with this setup, the treble is extended a little more, but the trade off is soundstage and bass. i'm now a firm believer in opamp rolling!_

 

My one came with the HA5002 buffers as well. I stacked two of them on the channel 3/4 socket and then put some stacked BUF634s in Hi-C mode on the left and right channels. It shortened the battery life but made the bass a bit more visceral than with the default configuration. This is on a 99% SM IV though, who knows if the same would hold true for the current version.


----------



## ComfyCan

Cool; amp arrivals at last.

 Somebody who gets a Micro, please post picks of innards so I can compare layout to my "pre-tweak" release. 

 I don't know that I'll be able to tell much just from appearance, but I would be interested nonetheless.

 I'll probably send mine back for "rehab" one of these days, but I hate parting with it.


----------



## jdimitri

I sent mine for repairs 3 weeks ago, about 3 days turnaround time, shipped back today
 Nice


----------



## cerbie

Sent mine in on the 19th for upgrading, and a ST-WV: waiting, having, "should I have sent it with insurance or something?" kind of thoughts. I've emailed him and am waiting for a reply.

 If it's there and in the queue, that's fine by me. Since he had a "final" update on the 24th for the IVs, I wouldn't be surprised if he's pretty much swamped with amps (and certainly, those who have been waiting for 2+ months on a new one need it faster than I do).


----------



## GreatDane

I plan to buy insurance and delivery confirmation when I send my Mini back. These extras are not expensive and worth the peace of mind.

 I'm waiting until a new amp purchase arrives before I send mine back. It's good to read that there's a quick turn around time.


----------



## kaushama

I got my Xenos 0ha-REP today. I have already sent my SMIV for upgrade. I really miss the SMIV! Hoping to see another sweet surprise when I have it back with upgrade.

 Its very good to see everybody is happy now. Aluren You seem to be loving the amp. Happy for you! Worth the wait! Isn't it?


----------



## ath

kaushama,

 Does you oha-rep allow you to roll opamps? Can you start an new thread posting your impressions of the Xenos amp? One amazing thing with Xin amps ( especially Supermini ) is that it shines out of the box. I wonder "burn-in" makes any difference at all.

 Anand


----------



## kaushama

Although my XENOS doesn't allow opamp rolling XENOS may include it in their future releases. I will post me impressions when I listen more. I really miss my SMIV and still my ears are used to sweetness of SMIV.


----------



## dslknight

After listening for a few days, I am blown away by how good this amp is. Worth waiting over 2 months for? Absolutely! Currently setup is 5g iPod->ALO Cotton Dock->Xin SMIV->E500. Listening to Giuliano Carmignola's Vivaldi: Late Violin Concertos, I could believe that I was sitting in a concert hall listening to him play ... somewhere in the first ten rows. Without using the Xin it's like I'm in the concert hall but in a separate room having the sound pass through glass windows. Flick on the output impedance, and crank the volume to compensate and it's like you're taken up to the second floor balcony seats where the treble isn't as bright but the music still sounds sweet. Does the Xin take the place of going to a classical concert? Not if you like the atmosphere or seeing your favorite orchestra play. But if you don't want to go anywhere and have a perfect recording of the piece you want to hear, it's just like being there until you close your eyes ... then you ARE there.


----------



## nfusion770

Xin Supermicro has landed (ordered July 29th). I cannot believe how small it is. After about an hour of testing I think it may have a cleaner sound that the my early July version of the Macro- NOTE I SAID *EARLY JULY VERSION*, which I will be sending in for an update soon. Then again it may be volume, I am not sure. I really like this little thing and think integrates into my portable setup quite nicely.

 Pics- hopefully this gives those who havent seen it an idea of its ridiculous size. Honestly a little thicker and a little taller than a 9v battery!!! 
 Sorry about the glare- I am no photographer.


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ComfyCan* 
_Cool; amp arrivals at last.

 Somebody who gets a Micro, please post picks of innards so I can compare layout to my "pre-tweak" release. 

 I don't know that I'll be able to tell much just from appearance, but I would be interested nonetheless.

 I'll probably send mine back for "rehab" one of these days, but I hate parting with it._

 

My micro arrived today, so here are some pictures of it. I'd be fascinated to know if you can tell any changes from these pics. Also, got shipping notice today on the Mini I sent in earlier in the week for the latest tweaks. Things seem to be moving rapidly over at Xin's.


----------



## jamato8

Tiny, tiny. You could get that lost with the dust in your pocket. :^). I understand the sound is much like the Macro IV and that to me for the price and size is insanely good. 

 So who is going to do a full review?????


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_My micro arrived today, so here are some pictures of it. I'd be fascinated to know if you can tell any changes from these pics. Also, got shipping notice today on the Mini I sent in earlier in the week for the latest tweaks. Things seem to be moving rapidly over at Xin's.















_

 


 Nice rig you got there Rob. Enjoy it!


----------



## vorlon1

Thanks, Miguel. Feel free to come by and listen to it. For those wanting some word as to the SQ, I'm one of those who thought the highs on the Mini were somewhat attenuated and non-extended, so I sent it in for the upgrade (got shipping notice on that today). The highs on this micro are fine, sound completely "normal" clean, no harshness, and they don't sound constricted at all. 
 The soundstage on this is huge! It has a very similar sonic signature to the Mini that I sent in, except the highs are very good. I am using it with an Imod and Shure E 500s, but it also drove a pair of K 701s to a decent level, but not a powerful one. With the IEMs it has plenty of power. I don't think you can even turn it up half way before it becomes way too loud. There is no hiss without music until it is amost at full volume (this is with E 500's which are very sensitive). There is no harshness to the sound I am hearing from it, in fact it is kind of a warm analogue type of sound with my gear, good air and separation of instruments, good depth, background detail is good, but maybe not spectacular (I think background details may be a bit sharper on my SR-71, but this is a very preliminary impression and may not hold up with more time). After all this has only been in my possession since 3 PM today, and needs more time to settle in before any definitive impressions can be stated with any conviction......Yes, in response to another thread topic, I am one of those burn-in believing folks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, I doubt if this little amp will disappoint for its intended use.


----------



## nfusion770

Substitute the DT990 for your K701 and mini for a macro and I have very similar impressions to you. It seems this amp was made for IEMS or lower impedance headphones. DT990s (which I feel are nearly identical to drive as the k701's) play almost as loud as I would ever want to listen to them, maybe a little less. 

 I sold my sr-71 a few weeks ago, but I actually think it sounded a little better than either of my Xin amps- (the presonus amps trump all three, actually). Thats ok for the micro, but I had high hopes for the macro, which is going in for updates soon.

 In any case, the micro is an astounding little amp that sounds fantastic with e500's and I am very excited to see what burn in brings me.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_Thanks, Miguel. Feel free to come by and listen to it. For those wanting some word as to the SQ, I'm one of those who thought the highs on the Mini were somewhat attenuated and non-extended, so I sent it in for the upgrade (got shipping notice on that today). The highs on this micro are fine, sound completely "normal" clean, no harshness, and they don't sound constricted at all. 
 The soundstage on this is huge! It has a very similar sonic signature to the Mini that I sent in, except the highs are very good. I am using it with an Imod and Shure E 500s, but it also drove a pair of K 701s to a decent level, but not a powerful one. With the IEMs it has plenty of power. I don't think you can even turn it up half way before it becomes way too loud. There is no hiss without music until it is amost at full volume (this is with E 500's which are very sensitive). There is no harshness to the sound I am hearing from it, in fact it is kind of a warm analogue type of sound with my gear, good air and separation of instruments, good depth, background detail is good, but maybe not spectacular (I think background details may be a bit sharper on my SR-71, but this is a very preliminary impression and may not hold up with more time). After all this has only been in my possession since 3 PM today, and needs more time to settle in before any definitive impressions can be stated with any conviction......Yes, in response to another thread topic, I am one of those burn-in believing folks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, I doubt if this little amp will disappoint for its intended use. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## vorlon1

Yes, I am very interested to see what burn-in does, too.


----------



## cerbie

Package sent today. My balance is the same, though, so I'll have to inquire later about the rest--but I'll at least wait a bit. It took long enough that I think he's got a fair bit of work going on.


----------



## aluren

glad to hear that many of you are enjoying the xin amps as much as i am. however, my supermacro seems to make my e500 sound alot worst. the e500 sounds very muddy with it and it seems like there is a veil over the sound. does anybody know why? is it cuz i have 2x stacked buffers or is the OPA627 just doesn't go with IEM's? i've upped the impedance but to no effect...


----------



## jamato8

I would email Xin as my V, which is a prototype and much the same as the IV, is anything but muddy. I am getting some very fine results with the UM2's. The buffers or the opamp would not be doing this normally.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_glad to hear that many of you are enjoying the xin amps as much as i am. however, my supermacro seems to make my e500 sound alot worst. the e500 sounds very muddy with it and it seems like there is a veil over the sound. does anybody know why? is it cuz i have 2x stacked buffers or is the OPA627 just doesn't go with IEM's? i've upped the impedance but to no effect... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The veil you mention sounds like it could be the treble roll off we talked about here a while ago. That was certainly what I found with my 99% SM IV and my E500s. I don't believe the buffers affect this, I've tried other buffer combinations. As far as I'm aware, the number of buffers only affects the current supplied to the headphones. My guess it that it's the opamps causing the problem (I'm hoping it's not inherent in the amp design) although I can't really comment until I get mine back from the upgrade. When kaushama and I posted to Xin's forums about the treble roll off he suggested using a OP275 opamp in channels 3&4.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_Thanks, Miguel. Feel free to come by and listen to it. For those wanting some word as to the SQ, I'm one of those who thought the highs on the Mini were somewhat attenuated and non-extended, so I sent it in for the upgrade (got shipping notice on that today). The highs on this micro are fine, sound completely "normal" clean, no harshness, and they don't sound constricted at all. 
 The soundstage on this is huge! It has a very similar sonic signature to the Mini that I sent in, except the highs are very good. I am using it with an Imod and Shure E 500s, but it also drove a pair of K 701s to a decent level, but not a powerful one. With the IEMs it has plenty of power. I don't think you can even turn it up half way before it becomes way too loud. There is no hiss without music until it is amost at full volume (this is with E 500's which are very sensitive). There is no harshness to the sound I am hearing from it, in fact it is kind of a warm analogue type of sound with my gear, good air and separation of instruments, good depth, background detail is good, but maybe not spectacular (I think background details may be a bit sharper on my SR-71, but this is a very preliminary impression and may not hold up with more time). After all this has only been in my possession since 3 PM today, and needs more time to settle in before any definitive impressions can be stated with any conviction......Yes, in response to another thread topic, I am one of those burn-in believing folks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, I doubt if this little amp will disappoint for its intended use. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Rob, not many amps can play loud enough for you. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have seen how loud you listen and I am in owe! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I will contact you this week and perhaps I can go by next Saturday. Thanks.


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_Rob, not many amps can play loud enough for you. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have seen how loud you listen and I am in owe! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I will contact you this week and perhaps I can go by next Saturday. Thanks._

 

There is no denying that, I absolutely play things loud!! BTW, I have been running the Micro all night and the sound has improved, more open, detail is better and it is also playing louder and is able to get the K 701s to a level loud enough for me, believe it or not, even though I am unlikely to use them often with this amp, but just as a gauge of output power....


----------



## jdimitri

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* 
_There is no denying that, I absolutely play things loud!! BTW, I have been running the Micro all night and the sound has improved, more open, detail is better and it is also playing louder and is able to get the K 701s to a level loud enough for me, believe it or not, even though I am unlikely to use them often with this amp, but just as a gauge of output power...._

 

Should've asked xin for higher gain, it goes up to 20..
 Yours would probably be somewhere around 2-6
 Imagine the possibilites 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Not worried about your hearing?


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jdimitri* 
_Should've asked xin for higher gain, it goes up to 20..
 Yours would probably be somewhere around 2-6
 Imagine the possibilites 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Not worried about your hearing? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, what you don't know is that I am kidding back and forth with Miguel. He is known for using very low listening levels, so in comparison I listen loud, but I would say that I listen on the moderate side of loud by general standards, and I listen mostly to classical music, jazz, and accoustic folk music, and not loud rock music. My hearing is just fine, as is the gain on the micro.


----------



## nfusion770

I plan to use the micro with my iems and for that reason, I like the gain exactly where it is. I cant think of many more unpleasant audbile experiences than iems blasting directly into your ear drum. It seems to me an increase in the gain, could make the volume wheel a little too sensitive.


----------



## vorlon1

I agree with you. It's plenty loud with IEMs, but not so much gain as any hissing ocurs.


----------



## mrarroyo

What Op-Amp is used in the Micro? BTW I just ordered one.


----------



## kugino

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* 
_What Op-Amp is used in the Micro? BTW I just ordered one. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

finally ordered one, huh miguel! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 my supermini IV was sent back for the final tweaks the middle of last week and i got an email yesterday that it is on its way back to me. so for those of you waiting to send yours in, it's quite fast.

 i've decided to sell mine as i have a glut of portable amps...but i, too, did think that the supermini IV did not drive my k81dj and ksc-75 to extremely loud levels coming out of my nano. had i been using some high-ohm headphones i certainly didn't think the supermini could drive them very well...maybe i'm wrong. but i only have IEMs and low-ohm cans so can't test this for sure. i will do a little listening test with the supermini IV and some other portables i have before selling it...


----------



## digitalcat

And it's set at higher gain?
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kugino* 
_i've decided to sell mine as i have a glut of portable amps...but i, too, did think that the supermini IV did not drive my k81dj and ksc-75 to extremely loud levels coming out of my nano. had i been using some high-ohm headphones i certainly didn't think the supermini could drive them very well...maybe i'm wrong._


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mirumu* 
_The veil you mention sounds like it could be the treble roll off we talked about here a while ago. That was certainly what I found with my 99% SM IV and my E500s. I don't believe the buffers affect this, I've tried other buffer combinations. As far as I'm aware, the number of buffers only affects the current supplied to the headphones. My guess it that it's the opamps causing the problem (I'm hoping it's not inherent in the amp design) although I can't really comment until I get mine back from the upgrade. When kaushama and I posted to Xin's forums about the treble roll off he suggested using a OP275 opamp in channels 3&4._

 

yeah i've read about the treble roll off issue and i thought that since my amp was shipped after xin had 'perfected' the design, i didn't really thought that the treble roll off would be a problem. i will take your advice and try the OPA275 in the 3&4 channels.

 what tools would be preferred to use to remove opamps from the board? i've used a small screwdriver and kind of 'pry' it out, but i figured it will be quite damaging to the board. if a tweazer is suggested, does anybody know where i can buy one? thanks in advance.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_yeah i've read about the treble roll off issue and i thought that since my amp was shipped after xin had 'perfected' the design, i didn't really thought that the treble roll off would be a problem. i will take your advice and try the OPA275 in the 3&4 channels._

 

You'll probably get to try the OPA275 before me then, I won't have my amp back for a while. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I figure Xin must have suggested it for a good reason.

  Quote:


 what tools would be preferred to use to remove opamps from the board? i've used a small screwdriver and kind of 'pry' it out, but i figured it will be quite damaging to the board. if a tweazer is suggested, does anybody know where i can buy one? thanks in advance. 
 

Well you can get dedicated IC extractors but I don't know if there's room around the chips to use one of those on the SM IV. I've never found tweezers much good for removing chips, personally I just used a small screwdriver gently on good leverage points that won't hurt the surrounding components.


----------



## aluren

i already have the opa275, but i find it hard to remove opamps in the 3rd channel... yeah i've used a screwdriver to try to pry it out, but i tend to somehow not pry it out straight, and i end up bending the tip. it's already happened 3 times with my opa627 and i don't wanna break an expensive opamp. but i guess the screwdriver is the best way huh mirumu?


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_i already have the opa275, but i find it hard to remove opamps in the 3rd channel... yeah i've used a screwdriver to try to pry it out, but i tend to somehow not pry it out straight, and i end up bending the tip. it's already happened 3 times with my opa627 and i don't wanna break an expensive opamp. but i guess the screwdriver is the best way huh mirumu?_

 

At a guess, it might make things easier if you take out the buffer for channels 3&4 first. That one is quite easy to remove I find being on the bottom of the board and with it out you would have a bit more room around the opamp.

 Edit: I also don't really pry them out, I get a flatter screwdriver and turn it back and forth under the opamp. That stops too much pressure being put on the amp if it suddenly comes free.


----------



## aluren

wow you're right, mirumu. i've just put the opa275 in the 3/4 channel and the veil is completely gone! i am so impressed with the e500. good stuff! thanks for the advice!

 EDIT: i shouldn't say "completely gone", but rather, it is better than the OPA2134. that opamp pretty much put a blanket over the sound and everything sounds muddy. with the OPA275, the sound is revealed a bit more. i need to do more listening before saying anything else.


----------



## aluren

another question i have is, do opamps need to be burn in? it seems like everytime i switch opamps, the sound tend to be pretty harsh at first...


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_wow you're right, mirumu. i've just put the opa275 in the 3/4 channel and the veil is completely gone! i am so impressed with the e500. good stuff! thanks for the advice!_

 

Well I was only passing on Dr. Xin's advice. Now I'm really looking forward to getting my amp back and putting one of those in there too.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_another question i have is, do opamps need to be burn in? it seems like everytime i switch opamps, the sound tend to be pretty harsh at first..._

 

Not sure 100% but I have heard many comments from people complaining of opamp harshness before they've burnt in. I do remember Dr. Xin saying somewhere on his forums that the SM IV needs some burn in time too.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_another question i have is, do opamps need to be burn in? it seems like everytime i switch opamps, the sound tend to be pretty harsh at first..._

 

Everything envolved with the electron flow needs some time to settle. There are the internal components of the opamp and so forth.


----------



## Cuppa

I've got a default config on order (with I assume the 134 opamps). I've not had a shipping notice yet and am UK based so opamps are a little harder to obtain. 

 Should I ask for the 275 setup while I can instead based on the above re treble rolloff, or a maxout potentially?

 My phones are Shure e4c and Grado BD GS-1000.


----------



## goto2003

OP275 and AD8610 are more detailed than OPA627, let alone OPA2134. BB chips tend to be rich and dark.


----------



## aluren

another question, my xinfeed doesn't seem to make a difference when i turn it on. is there suppose to be very very subtle difference that takes time to adapt?


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_another question, my xinfeed doesn't seem to make a difference when i turn it on. is there suppose to be very very subtle difference that takes time to adapt?_

 

Atleast your xinfeed works. On my Mini it sounds like mono. Xin told me he'll check it out when I send mine back.

 Depending on the music, you may not notice much difference. Try some 60's music such as The Beatles...or it is possible that your amps xinfeed isn't working properly.

 Give yourself some time, like you say, your ears may need some time to adapt and pick up on the subtle changes that xfeed makes.


----------



## mrarroyo

For those asking about the Xin feed I went to his website and here is what he has to say as well as a test signal. Hope it helps.

  Quote:


 Try play this test signal and switch back and forth the XinFeed switch to hear the effect:

http://www.fixup.net/tips/pktamp/xfeed.mp3

 This test audio produces white noise to left, right and then center channel. When it is playing L or R signal, try enable XinFeed, the sound position moves slightly from very left or very right towards the center, which you'll feel is more pleasant and less pressure. When you bypass XinFeed, the test sound pushes to very left or very right, which is not so pleasant and puts some pressure on your ears. When it is playing the center signal, you should not hear any difference when you switch XinFeed back and forth. This test reveals very well the idea of xfeed and how ideal XinFeed is compared to other xfeed implementations. You won't hear any tonal changes with XinFeed; just some subtle mix.


----------



## kaushama

Aluren I too thought in my first impressions it has some distance nature to mids and later thought it might be due to Sennheiser veil of my HD 580. I asked Dr.Xin about the pricing of OP275 to buy additional one. I might as well ask Dr.XIn for OP275 to be installed instead of OPA2134. Do you think OP275 affects battery life by any means?


----------



## stevenkelby

SuperMacro recieved today!

 Only had an hour with it so far, but I hear power and clarity that Iv'e been missing. Haven't tried many hp amps though. Got some other opamps too. Can't wait for more time alone with my new baby.


----------



## aluren

thanks, mrarroyo, i will download it later and test it myself!

 congrats, stevenkelby, on finally getting the xin amp. i've been rolling opamps like crazy this past couple days and i'm sticking to the OPA627. that opamp has impressed me the most. you'll also find that its quite tedious to change opamps, so i don't think i will change opamps for awhile. it takes a good 10 minutes to change them...


----------



## FreeBlues

Hey all, perhaps this is a post for a new thread, but let's start here.

 My Micro arrived yesterday. I fired it right up and I have to say I'm underwhelmed. Now, to be fair, I'm comparing it to a fully burned in Hornet M, but I was hoping the comparison would be closer than it is.

 Without getting into any sort of comparison just yet, what would you think an appropriate burn in time for these Xin amps would be?

 I promise to post a more complete review and comparison after the Xin burns in and settles down.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FreeBlues* 
_Hey all, perhaps this is a post for a new thread, but let's start here.

 My Micro arrived yesterday. I fired it right up and I have to say I'm underwhelmed. Now, to be fair, I'm comparing it to a fully burned in Hornet M, but I was hoping the comparison would be closer than it is.

 Without getting into any sort of comparison just yet, what would you think an appropriate burn in time for these Xin amps would be?

 I promise to post a more complete review and comparison after the Xin burns in and settles down._

 

150 to 200 hours.


----------



## vorlon1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *FreeBlues* 
_ I fired it right up and I have to say I'm underwhelmed. Now, to be fair, I'm comparing it to a fully burned in Hornet M, but I was hoping the comparison would be closer than it is._

 


 I found my micro started to sound quite good after about 10 hours. I sold my original hornet some months ago, but in comparison with the SR-71 the micro has a larger soundstage in width and depth, and is more transparent. The SR-71 has greater impact and weight, and maybe sightly more prominent backround detail (it's close though). I'd be interested to see how your micro develops as you listen to it.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Aluren I too thought in my first impressions it has some distance nature to mids and later thought it might be due to Sennheiser veil of my HD 580. I asked Dr.Xin about the pricing of OP275 to buy additional one. I might as well ask Dr.XIn for OP275 to be installed instead of OPA2134. Do you think OP275 affects battery life by any means?_

 

I have asked Dr. Xin about getting an additional OP275 as well. I'm more than happy to swap them around myself, just want to find what sounds best to me.


----------



## digitalcat

It's interesting to see two opposite impressions on supermicro. Could it be a faulty unit or simply differences in taste?


----------



## kaushama

mirumu Do you know the cost of an addtional OP275? Dr.XIN has been silent for last few days for my emails. I guess he must be busy building amps.
 GOTO its nice to see you are back again in the forum.


----------



## cerbie

Sent: 9/19
 Shipping notice: 9/30
 Recieved: 10/04

 My returned Supermini-3 looks just like it did before, confirmed by pictures. The only visible differences are the LED and one cap are tilted very low, and the battery contacts are extra stiff. Also, I don't think I sent the amp in with the opamp in the default position, but I might be wrong, there.

 My AAAs read 1.19 and 1.24v, I'm charging them before listening. I will post if I hear any KSC75 or KSC35 differences, but I'm not sure about E3c*.

 Edit: I got my batts out early (they were both near 1.38v--good enough!), and...ah, wonderful! I can't say anything popped out as being really different, but I don't think I will be going unamped like this again (I fully plan to make a few, as well). I popped on Queensryche's No Sactuary...the sweetness of Tate's voice has certainly been lacking in these last two weeks, and the bass has some decent deep kick. At the least, I'm quite pleased to have something back that can make my KSC75 and KSC35 feel like they're each really worth $15 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 * I sent these in to Shure recently for what I think were cable problems. However, I never liked the sound, and the returned pair is new in the box, so selling them is a tempting option. But, I only heard the amp hiss clearly before w/ the E3c.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_mirumu Do you know the cost of an addtional OP275? Dr.XIN has been silent for last few days for my emails. I guess he must be busy building amps.
 GOTO its nice to see you are back again in the forum. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, at online stores it appears to be in the US$3-$10 range but they usually want you to buy at least 50 of them. I haven't heard back from Dr. Xin yet either but he hasn't got my amp yet and I still have to pay him for the return shipping. I was hoping to add the price of a OP275 in with the payment.


----------



## cerbie

If you can't do that, Futurlec carries the OP275P for $2.90, not bad before shipping ($4, I think). I think they pretty much ship anywhere.


----------



## aluren

I have another question for the supermacro. On the 3rd/4th channel, it seems like people are using either the OPA2134 or OPA275. Are there any other opamps that can be used there?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_I have another question for the supermacro. On the 3rd/4th channel, it seems like people are using either the OPA2134 or OPA275. Are there any other opamps that can be used there?_

 

The 8397.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *cerbie* 
_If you can't do that, Futurlec carries the OP275P for $2.90, not bad before shipping ($4, I think). I think they pretty much ship anywhere._

 

Thank you very much, you just made my day. I had searched high and low for a place like that but had no luck. Some of their other prices are very good too. Already put in an order.


----------



## kaushama

Thanks cerbie! If Dr. XIN doesn't reply I will buy from there. They have other opamps too Very good prices!


----------



## aluren

that is a bargain. i'd pick it up in no time!

 another question, for the supermacro power swtich, there's three positions to flicker it to - up, middle, and down. switching it down means its off, but switching it to middle and up both turns on the amp and i was wondering if there's any difference.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_that is a bargain. i'd pick it up in no time!

 another question, for the supermacro power swtich, there's three positions to flicker it to - up, middle, and down. switching it down means its off, but switching it to middle and up both turns on the amp and i was wondering if there's any difference._

 

Straight from Dr. Xin's online SuperMacro manual:
  Quote:


 Power Switch and Auto-off Timer

 The 3-position power switch offers another unique feature - auto off timer. From down, middle to up, it is off, auto and on, respectively. When the power switch is turned from "on" to "auto", the amp will shut off automatically. The timer is variable from 0 to 60 minutes, depending on how long you wait before you move the switch from "on" to "auto". If you turn the switch from "off" to "on" and wait for 2 seconds or longer before you turn it to "auto", the timer will be set to the longest - 60 minutes. If you wait for less than 2 seconds, then the timer will be shorter than 60 minutes; the less you wait, the shorter the timer will be, vise versa. If you leave it at "on" position, the amp will not shut itself off. Switch it to "off" position to manually shut the amp off. 
 

Try the search feature at Xin's site for even more information about this amp.


----------



## kiwirugby

I hope a review section of the latest versions of SuperMicro/Mini/Macro is strated soon. But I will pots a little observation here on my latest SM IV.

 My fourth generation SM111 -> IV (four separate upgrades/modifications/etc.) was waiting for me when I came back from England last night. I have been listening for a little bit and one thing I noticed is that when listening to classical solo piano music the veil (a dull top) and sometimes "tinniness" has disappeared completely.

 I'll post more later. Just want to enjoy.


----------



## aluren

thanks djbnh! what a feature that is. i was listening to music one night and fell and asleep and of course, the next morning i woke, the battery's dead...

 as for a review thread, i'm just waiting for someone to post one. i'm not one of those that can get too technical about the sound when it comes to writing it. but i'll definitely throw in what i can. i'm still trying to get used to the sound and compare it to the PA2v2, as well as listening to different opamps and burning them in.


----------



## kaushama

Or shall we ask moderaters to name this as Xin amp owner's thread?

 Or else we can use this! I started it when we were waiting for Xin amps. Nobody posted as it was untimely posted thread. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







http://www5.head-fi.org/forums/showt...&highlight=xin


----------



## AusTex

6/10/06 - Sent in my SM3 to be repaired (a copper battery contact was messed up)
 7/4 - Received email informing me that the boards were fried, but could get it fixed for free. Also, option to upgrade to SM IV - hmmm, should I???
 7/4-8/3 - A lot going on with tweaks and more tweaks, better wait.
 8/4 - placed order for maxed out 100% SM IV
 9/21 - email received that amp has been completely redesigned again
 10/6 - email received that the amp has been sent
 I can't imagine it sounding any better than it did. If it does, it will be worth the wait. Well, if counting from the time he said he got the final design worked out - it really only took three weeks like he has on his website


----------



## jamato8

"I can't imagine it sounding any better than it did. If it does, it will be worth the wait."


 Yes, it will be worth the wait. I have both to compare and what you will get will not sound like a portable amp.


----------



## kiwirugby

My fourth generation SMIII - IV arrived last week. (It's been in the shop four times for the latest mods over the past year or so.) I have been listening to it off and on this week and there are some interesting differences to me that have emerged. This is not a review, but just some cursory observations between what I remember from when I sent Xin my SM for the final tweak/upgrade/modification some time back in late September, 2006 (yes 2006 not 2005!!!). They are these.

 1. Whereas before the volume to drive the K81DJs with a 4th gen. iModded 60gb iPod with no switches enabled was at about 1 o'clock, it's now at 10 o'clock. More power?

 2. The noticeable veil on high frequencies, especially with solo piano, has gone completely.

 3. The presentation is clearer and the frequency categories (highs, mids, lows) more coherent and continuous. I often thought the mids were a trifle muddy and hard to distinguish from top and bottom, but no more.

 4. I really think the soundstage is even bigger, something I thought impossible! I will need to try my rig with my AKG501s and really hear sounstage at its fullest!

 5. On good recordings, I am not hearing any fuzziness (sorry not very technical speak here!!) that I would occasionally, but maybe that's more related to 2 and 3 above. But beware of poor recordings, you'll hear every flaw. I was listening to an older recording of Brendel play Beethoven piano sonatas and the veil and roll-off on the original CD are really readily discernable. Still some great perfomances though!

 Sorry to disappoint if anyone was expecting a review. Plus, please remember the contrasts I list above are based on memory not side-by-side comparisons. Caveat emptor!

 I sum, I think that what I have is indeed a better product. I thought it was good before, but my ears say even better now.

 By the way, I never had to pay for any of my mods other than postage to Oregon. The longest I had to wait was three weeks. Yes, there were long periods of silence, but the wait was worth it.


----------



## kaushama

Does anyone have an idea about the turnaround times for upgrading these days?


----------



## vorlon1

I sent my mini in September 24th, he got it around the 26th or 27th and sent it back to me by air mail on the 30th. It just got here today, I wish he would use priority mail, it is much faster. In any case he did the mods fast, but the return mail was a bit slow. BTW the mods have completely gotten rid of the attenuated highs many of us were complaining about, and the mini is sounding very good across the board.


----------



## kaushama

Is there a delay in getting amps and upgrades again? My SMIV was delivered on 6th but there is no news after that.


----------



## crypt@

Ordered Macro 7mins past mid-night 27 Sep, so just getting to the end of its 2nd week...


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_Is there a delay in getting amps and upgrades again? My SMIV was delivered on 6th but there is no news after that._

 

I got a shipping notice from Dr. Xin a few days ago but I'm not entirely sure if it was for my upgraded amp since I'd also ordered a few parts from him in a separate order.


----------



## wangch

I think you might be right, there must be a delay, I sent my supermini IV in on Sept 27 for latest upgrade, still havent heard anything


----------



## kaushama

I got a mail from Dr.XIn saying my amp will be shipped tomorrow! There new information about upgrading amps in Xin's forum.

  Quote:


 [10/11/06] Some changes to the IV design. Not critical at all, but affect all current amps: SuperMacro-IV, SuperMini-IV and SuperMicro-IV. If you like, you may send your amp back to apply these changes. The idea is to drop default support to some very special OPs such as AD8397, so the design can be more ideal with popular audio OPs. 
 

So I will be getting the newest design. I am so excited.


----------



## wangch

I got my email from him to, soon to see my supermini IV again


----------



## nfusion770

Sent my supermacro in for updates via priority mail on 10/2. Received shipment notification on 10/12. Xin has really picked up the pace- at least on updates.


----------



## kiwirugby

Xin emailed me this morning (10/13) to say he has found a better OP for 3/4 and recommends I send my SM IV back to him. I received my 4th upgrade/tweak/mod during the week of October 2nd. So things have changed again quite recently, at least since the end of Spetember, I would think.

 Who was it talked about frequent miles for Xin amps??????? Personally, I really don't mind since I have one of his SuperDuals and an original (but modded c. 2004) supermini. But I thought I would share this so that others could make decsions about what they want to do.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* 
_Xin emailed me this morning (10/13) to say he has found a better OP for 3/4 and recommends I send my SM IV back to him. I received my 4th upgrade/tweak/mod during the week of October 2nd. So things have changed again quite recently, at least since the end of Spetember, I would think.

 Who was it talked about frequent miles for Xin amps??????? Personally, I really don't mind since I have one of his SuperDuals and an original (but modded c. 2004) supermini. But I thought I would share this so that others could make decsions about what they want to do._

 

what is this better opamp that xin is talking about?


----------



## jdimitri

With the newest update, the amps require a special AD8397 in 3rd/4th channel socket


----------



## kiwirugby

That's correct from what I gather from all the chatter. Does anyone know exactly what that means in terms of any improvement?


----------



## goto2003

An op with high current capacity with low current drain. I don't think it's neccessary to send the amp in to get this op as one can surely get it easily from on-line stores.


----------



## vorlon1

What on-line stores would you recommend? I'm having trouble finding them.


----------



## Snacks

I found Texas Instruments. They give free samples as well.

http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/pro...hdr_p_products


----------



## aluren

Analog Devices also give out free opamps. I got free AD 8397 and AD 8620 from them couple weeks ago. You're only limited to 2 per opamps and 3 different opamps at once, but better than nothing right?


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *goto2003* 
_An op with high current capacity with low current drain. I don't think it's neccessary to send the amp in to get this op as one can surely get it easily from on-line stores._

 

So, goto, this is a battery life preserving change and makes little or no difference to sound quality? If I don't send the amp I received around 10/2 I won't be losing anything, save batteries that go down a bit faster?

 Thanks, by the way, for all your technical help on here and fixup about the SM IV and its various iterations. I think many have learned a great deal from you. I know I have.

 Roger


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Snacks* 
_I found Texas Instruments. They give free samples as well.

http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/pro...hdr_p_products_

 

Can you please provide the appropriate part number for the opamp Dr. Xin has changed?


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_Analog Devices also give out free opamps. I got free AD 8397 and AD 8620 from them couple weeks ago. You're only limited to 2 per opamps and 3 different opamps at once, but better than nothing right?_

 

http://www.analog.com/en/prod/0,2877,AD8397,00.html is the link for Analog Devices' AD8397 opamps. Can anyone tell me which would be the right one, if any, per Dr. Xin's latest change?


----------



## Pete7

AD8397ARZ is the SOIC version and can be ordered as a sample. That's the one you want.


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pete7* 
_AD8397ARZ is the SOIC version and can be ordered as a sample. That's the one you want._

 

Pete7, ty 4 the prompt reply.


----------



## Pete7

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *djbnh* 
_Pete7, ty 4 the prompt reply._

 

There's only one problem with just ordering the AD8397 op-amp. From the pictures on Xin's site of the Super Macro IV, the AD8397 has to be soldered onto an adapter. There's no DIP8 version of the AD8397 like OPA2134, so it can't be used directly in the configuration. It needs to be soldered on to an adapter. It looks like Xin is selling AD8397's pre-mounted on adapters on his site for $19.99. The same goes for AD8620, as far as needing to be mounted on an adaptor is concerned.


----------



## nfusion770

Just got the updated Macro today. Background noise really does seem to be reduced. Still needs much burn in I am sure, but if it burns in like the micro, I think I can hear the makings of a great amp- at least I hope so.


----------



## kaushama

Got my SMIV today! I am listening it and will swap 3rd 4th with OPA275 tomorrow!


----------



## goto2003

Has anyone tried JRC4580 for 3rd and 4th? It may be even better than OP275. Higher current capacity, lower current drain, and lower open-loop impedance.


----------



## kaushama

I like op275 in 3rd and 4th! It completely removes the mid range veil and treble is much improved with OP275! I will allow amp to burn in at least 100 hours.
 Goto could you pl tell other opamp combinations which will give more bright open sound?


----------



## kaushama

I think everyone should try OPA275 on 3rd and 4th before settling on stock 14558D JRC. It is wonderful. Sweeeet mids and treble. No roll off at all.


----------



## mirumu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* 
_I think everyone should try OPA275 on 3rd and 4th before settling on stock 14558D JRC. It is wonderful. Sweeeet mids and treble. No roll off at all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I'm really looking forward to getting my amp back and trying this for myself.


----------



## jdimitri

I just sent mine off again for lowering gain..
 While it's there, might as well get the latest updates 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *waits for it to get back in a month or so..*


----------



## iamjacksears

I am interested in the set-up Xin has a pic of posted on his forum:

_"This picture shows a very expensive setup: 2X stacked buffers (BUF634) in Hi-C mode with OPA637. Such a top-end configuration is only found in few $$$$ home headphone amps and it is unseen in portable amps."_

 Can anyone comment on the sound this config would offer as well as price and ordering? There doesn't seem to be an option to select this on the site but it seems advertised through the pic on the forum.


----------



## aluren

you can choose the maxout options at the "cool stuff" menu. i got the opa627 maxout option and compared to the default setup (i have the default opamps as well), the maxout version has a warmer, fuller sound. the improvements are definitely there and imo worth the extra $100. of course if you're an expert DIY, it probably would only cost you 1/3 of that price. i haven't listened to any other 'high end' amps as xin had mentioned so i cannot tell you if they are comparable. but in the end, i was very pleased with the maxout option.


----------



## iamjacksears

I'm talking about the OPA6*3*7 which I do not see offered anywhere on his site. Here is the pic from his forum and my last post has the first part of the description.


----------



## aluren

they're almost the same, unless for some reason the opa627 gives you cancer... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




http://www.fixup.net/products/macro/details.htm


----------



## iamjacksears

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* 
_they're almost the same, unless for some reason the opa627 gives you cancer... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





http://www.fixup.net/products/macro/details.htm_

 

hmmmm... didn't see that, his site is not the easiest to navigate! How is the soundstage on the maxxout that you got? I'm looking for a huge soundstage, big bass and liquid smooth highs. 

 Xin's description of the OPA637 caught my attention because he compared it expensive home amps... a bold claim but one worth investigating IMO.


----------



## crypt@

@iamjacksears: I've conversed with Xin regarding the same question, as I have a SM3 with 637 in Class-A.

 Xin no longer recommend 637 (as it requires compensation to be added to the circuitary,) nor does he recomend setting any OPAMP into Class-A. That picture on fixup was of an older configuration before he made some major tweaking back in mid-Sep. 627 is the *max'ed* version, and 627 is an internally compensated version of 637.


----------



## is2us

I was the last in the list:
 SuperMacro order on august 13. Received shipping notice today- November 9.

 I lost track of whats going on. What do I get? ver IV, ver V. will I still need some tweeks?


----------



## is2us

I was the last in the list:
 SuperMacro order on august 13. Received shipping notice today- November 9.

 I lost track of whats going on. What do I get? ver IV, ver V. will I still need some tweeks?


----------



## jamato8

You will get the IV with all the updates and what should turn out to be some great listening. Post what you think, I look forward to reading the impressions.


----------



## jamato8

posted twice


----------



## jlingo

I ordered mine on Aug 18, I haven't received any shipping notification yet. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Can't wait for this baby.


----------



## is2us

Well, it arrived a day after the notice.
 Boy, it is much smaller than I expected.

 I did a bit of listening, but I don't want to judge before it breaks in for a few hours.


----------



## Simplex

Ordered Aug 10th and finally arrived today 11/10 it's charging right now.
 What little I heard sounds so good I was expecting a lot and was caught off-guard with how it sounded even better than I though t it would.


----------



## jlingo

Ordered Aug 18.2006
 It's shipped Today, Nov 13, 2006, Wohooo!

 Now, Xin is definitely in his production mode!!


----------



## jlingo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *is2us* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, it arrived a day after the notice.
 Boy, it is much smaller than I expected.

 I did a bit of listening, but I don't want to judge before it breaks in for a few hours._

 

You need at least 100hours of breaking in before you can judge properly. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 That's what I found with my supermacro III.


----------



## miztahsparklez

I shipped my SM-III to xin in mid-late oct. received back yesterday, dec 11.


----------



## ghiberti

date of order: aug. 23, 2006

 date of arrival: dec. 23, 2006 ... four months


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_date of order: aug. 23, 2006

 date of arrival: dec. 23, 2006 ... four months
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 


 You bought one of each? Are you mad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 Four months is crazy. I hope you enjoy them.


----------



## ghiberti

I just wanted to know how Xins sounded like.

 I'll leave just one of them, my favorite and put others on fs forum
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 wow, supermini/supermicro is very impressive, way better than I expected


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just wanted to know how Xins sounded like.

 I'll leave just one of them, my favorite and put others on fs forum
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 wow, supermini/supermicro is very impressive, way better than I expected
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I have a Supermacro LE on order, if you decide to sell the Supermicro IV let me know because I would like to purchase it. Currently I have Vorlon1's Supermicro IV and IMO it is the best portable amp out there.


----------



## SK138

That's a good endorsement. I hope I will get mine soon. 

 I emailed Xin how long my Supermicro will take for delivery and he sent back with only one word, "soon". That was two weeks ago. Oh well...2.5months and counting
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I know he will deliver. It's just matter of (long) time.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a Supermacro LE on order, if you decide to sell the Supermicro IV let me know because I would like to purchase it. Currently I have Vorlon1's Supermicro IV and IMO it is the best portable amp out there._


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SK138* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 I emailed Xin how long my Supermicro will take for delivery and he sent back with only one word, "soon" ._

 

LOL 

 Sorry. It will come...and it will be good.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hey, Xin told me 2~3 days until my upgraded Mini would ship, that turned out to be over a week. I think Xin lives in a parallel universe where space and time has slowed to a crawl. In this outer worldy place he does manage to make some very nice portable amps. 

 My original purchase was a 2 month wait, upgrade was another 6 weeks.


----------



## SK138

With my luck, Xin will announce some major breakthrough improvement in all of his IV series amps when I get my Supermicro IV
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It happened before...last time when I purchased Supermini III. Back then, I decided to sell it rather than wait for ever to get it (temporarily) upgraded.

 In the end...it will come...yes, I love the sound of Xin's amps. He should stop tweaking and get some family time
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL 

 Sorry. It will come...and it will be good.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hey, Xin told me 2~3 days until my upgraded Mini would ship, that turned out to be over a week. I think Xin lives in a parallel universe where space and time has slowed to a crawl. In this outer worldy place he does manage to make some very nice portable amps. 

 My original purchase was a 2 month wait, upgrade was another 6 weeks._


----------



## brandonink2001

Man, these amps must be like crack to a crackhead with this Type A/demanding audience willing to throw money and orders at this guy, then wait Lord knows how long to get your product.

 Hmmm, sounds like just the kind of Kool-Aid I want! Where's the end of the line?


----------



## ghiberti

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_if you decide to sell the Supermicro IV let me know because I would like to purchase it._

 

will do.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SK138* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I emailed Xin how long my Supermicro will take for delivery and he sent back with only one word, "soon"._

 

cool!! he's da man
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ Hey, Xin told me 2~3 days until my upgraded Mini would ship._

 

uhhh... what upgrade? it's not something we don't know yet, right?::


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered June 29.


 Received shipping notice on Aug. 23...1 to 2 days 'till ship...still waiting.

EDIT-Just today(Aug.30) Xin sent me an email confirming shipment of my Supermini IV_

 

That above quote was from my original purchase. Soon after that is when Xin announced an upgrade. It's a bit confusing to me now and there may have been more than one upgrade, mine seems to be the final upgrade.

 I waited 4 weeks to send mine back to Xin, I've been enjoying my upgraded Mini for about 6 weeks now.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *brandonink2001* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man, these amps must be like crack to a crackhead with this Type A/demanding audience willing to throw money and orders at this guy, then wait Lord knows how long to get your product.

 Hmmm, sounds like just the kind of Kool-Aid I want! Where's the end of the line?_

 

I gave up on drugs years ago and would lose my nursing license if I took them, well if I got caught but I could never risk someone's life because of selfishly taking drugs. Anyway, I take headphone amplifiers now. :^)

 I have the SM3 version 6 converted to a IV and I wasn't getting quite what I wanted with the supplied opamp from Xin so I changed it to a bypassed 5534 and wham, got it. That is what I like about the amps, besides a dedicated builder who borders on/ teeters on the edge of insanity when it comes to getting it right. Not everyone's cup o'tea but fine for me.


----------



## Happy Camper

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_date of order: aug. 23, 2006

 date of arrival: dec. 23, 2006 ... four months
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

could you get a shot of something to reference their size. I have the macro 4 and am "wowed" by this device driving K701s. 

 I read some of everyone's torments waiting for delivery. I sympathize with the agony. A simple post on delivery delays would go a long way with the customer. It may lose some orders, but so does not communicating. We wouldn't take it personal. Now that I have an amp, I would buy another one from Xin. But next time, I want to try a RS amp. 

 Doc, 
 Please get some manufacturing labor. Your considerable talents are wasted, customers lost, reputation suffers and time marches on. More people want to hear your work and how you can impact electronics design. It's not rocket science, but it sure makes people smile to hear your products. Your followers are loyal to this delay practice. Is it fair to ask? Your products are too good not to be put out to as many hobbyists possible. If you do it all yourself, you make more per unit at the sacrifice of number of units. Less profit per unit but more sold still fills the pockets with bling. More time for product development to ensure your technological legacy.


----------



## ghiberti

this kind of one?

 uhhh... I found I couldn't use ken's cables that had canare plug with supermini.

 it's too big for it


----------



## achristilaw

Ordered a super mini IV. End of November 06. Should be in time for summer 07. Maybe?


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just wanted to know how Xins sounded like.

 I'll leave just one of them, my favorite and put others on fs forum
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 wow, supermini/supermicro is very impressive, way better than I expected
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Sent you a pm.

 Thanks


----------



## GaryAR

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...wow, supermini/supermicro is very impressive, way better than I expected
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Xin's business practises & customer support leave a whole lot to be desired, but the supermicro iv is one absolutely amazing little amp... once you hear it all the wait and hassle of getting one immediately becomes worthwhile. 

 Gary


----------



## pelayostyle

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ghiberti* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_this kind of one?

 uhhh... I found I couldn't use ken's cables that had canare plug with supermini.

 it's too big for it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







_

 

You have a PM


----------



## kiwirugby

Mailed SM IV on 12/11 for 26th upgrade. Xin received it on 12/13. Shipping notice from Xin, 1/3/07.


----------



## chowk

Sorry for coming in a little off topic, but I had some questions to the supermicro owners:

 1) How low does the volume start out? I'm looking for very low volumes and as small increments as possible...
 2) Does this amp pair well with shure e500s? Does it rectify the treble roll off?
 3) How does it compare to the RSA Hornet / Tomahawk in terms of SQ and volume control?

 Trying hard to work out what my first portable amp should be. I had my heart set on a RSA Tomahawk, but the portability of a SuperMicro has brought it into contention. Any advice is gratefully received!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chowk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry for coming in a little off topic, but I had some questions to the supermicro owners:

 1) How low does the volume start out? I'm looking for very low volumes and as small increments as possible...
 2) Does this amp pair well with shure e500s? Does it rectify the treble roll off?
 3) How does it compare to the RSA Hornet / Tomahawk in terms of SQ and volume control?

 Trying hard to work out what my first portable amp should be. I had my heart set on a RSA Tomahawk, but the portability of a SuperMicro has brought it into contention. Any advice is gratefully received!_

 

1. Yes the volume pot is very forgiving and starts at low volume with a gradual gain.
 2. Yes, send a PM to Vorlon1 who has the E500. I have used extensively the Supermicro IV with UM2, Ety ER4P, and the V-Moda. Excellent sound.
 3. For this you should read the review Vorlon1 and I did a couple of moths ago at: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=203445

 I prefer the Supermicro IV but any of the amps listed are very good. Good luck.


----------



## mrarroyo

Just received an email from Dr. Xin, amp and additional OP-Amps for rolling have been shipped. Man it will arrive when I am on vacation.


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just received an email from Dr. Xin, amp and additional OP-Amps for rolling have been shipped. Man it will arrive when I am on vacation. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Ouch! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But at least you have a present waiting for you when you get back! Hope you still get to enjoy your vacation.


----------



## chowk

My thanks for mrarroyo and vorlon1 for their help. I've placed an order for a supermicro. Now to join the back of the line...


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chowk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My thanks for mrarroyo and vorlon1 for their help. I've placed an order for a supermicro. Now to join the back of the line..._

 

Good for you, that is one great amp!


----------



## pelayostyle

I, too, just placed an order for a supermicroIV and black case. Hopefully i get it before my b-day in august =P


----------



## chowk

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *pelayostyle* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I, too, just placed an order for a supermicroIV and black case. Hopefully i get it before my b-day in august =P_

 

Good choice - I also got the black! But I don't want to wait till August 

 mrarroyo - do you know what the gain is on the supermicro and if it's changable by request?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chowk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good choice - I also got the black! But I don't want to wait till August 

 mrarroyo - do you know what the gain is on the supermicro and if it's changable by request?_

 

Sorry I do not recall, however send an Email to Dr. Xin. Lately he has been answering his emails quite fast (same day).


----------



## chowk

Ta, will do


----------



## chowk

Two more questions for supermicro owners...

 1) I heard the battery contacts are a bit weak? Is that the case?
 2) Does the internals fit the case snugly? I ask because I'd like to exercise with the amp, so want to make sure I don't damage it...


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Mailed SM IV on 12/11 for 26th upgrade. Xin received it on 12/13. Shipping notice from Xin, 1/3/07._

 

It arrived on the 6th just in time for a long trip to the western Pacific. I'm set! No more upgrades.....PLEASE!


----------



## crypt@

Ordered 27 Sep 2006
 Arrived 8 Jan 2007


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *crypt@* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_[iHP-140] -> / [Azur 840C] -> [SuperMacro-IV] -> [MDR-E484] / [ER-4P -> ER4P-24] / [ATH-W5000]_

 

What's does "ER-4P -> ER4P-24" mean?


----------



## pelayostyle

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It arrived on the 6th just in time for a long trip to the western Pacific. I'm set! No more upgrades.....PLEASE!_

 

Is he giving priority to upgrades rather then new builds ??


----------



## SK138

I got the shipping notice from Xin today for my Supermicro IV which I ordered 3 months ago
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






 The problem is I am stuck in Manila for another 3 weeks on business


----------



## alanz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *procreate* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What's does "ER-4P -> ER4P-24" mean?_

 

The ER4P-24 is a short accessory cable from Etymotic that adds 75 ohms of resistance. This essentially transforms an ER4P into an ER4S (resistance being the significant different between the two versions).

 The Xin SuperMacro amps have an optional switch that adds 75 ohms, serving the same purpose as the accessory cable.


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *alanz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The ER4P-24 is a short accessory cable from Etymotic that adds 75 ohms of resistance._

 

Ah, thanks. Yeah, I'm expecting delivery of my SMIVLE this or next month.


----------



## iamjacksears

Supermacro IV

 Order date: 10/20/06
 Ship date: 1/12/07

 I should have it Mon or Tues... I hope it was worth it!


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1. Yes the volume pot is very forgiving and starts at low volume with a gradual gain.
 2. Yes, send a PM to Vorlon1 who has the E500. I have used extensively the Supermicro IV with UM2, Ety ER4P, and the V-Moda. Excellent sound.
 3. For this you should read the review Vorlon1 and I did a couple of moths ago at: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=203445

 I prefer the Supermicro IV but any of the amps listed are very good. Good luck._

 


 Xin definitely must have changed the default gain on the SuperMicro then; with my 1st generation, pre-tweak SuperMicro IV, you can blow out an eardrum with a 1/8" turn of the volume pot using IEM's. (I use an attenuator for safety when using IEM's). That's good news.

 I still haven't sent mine in for repairs to the battery contacts/tweaks. I just can't seem to get the courage to ship it off, even though I have other portable amps to use while waiting for it to return. There is nothing in my inventory that can compare to the sound of the SuperMicro IV.


----------



## sant430

My order date was the 21st of October and my ship date was the 12th too. I'm also hoping for Monday too.....



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iamjacksears* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Supermacro IV

 Order date: 10/20/06
 Ship date: 1/12/07

 I should have it Mon or Tues... I hope it was worth it!_


----------



## procreate

Date of order: 30th October 2006

 Shipping notice received on the 16th January 2007!

 I really didn't mind the wait for my SMIVLE, but I'm sure these next few days will be passing excruciatingly slow.


----------



## sant430

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sant430* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My order date was the 21st of October and my ship date was the 12th too. I'm also hoping for Monday too....._

 

Arrived today....tonight I hook it up and start the burn in!!


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *procreate* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Date of order: 30th October 2006

 Shipping notice received on the 16th January 2007!

 I really didn't mind the wait for my SMIVLE, but I'm sure these next few days will be passing excruciatingly slow. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Got it! Not bad, 4 days using GEM. Time to burn in that b1g a55 cap (How street does that sound? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## aluren

i just ordered a supermicro iv. i guess i won't get it until april...


----------



## srikeerthi

Another name to the list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Xin Supermicro-IV

 Order date: 1st March 2007

 Thw wait begins...


----------



## Sanddancer

My Supermicro IV order went through this morning...

 Getting impatient already!


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Another name to the list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Xin Supermicro-IV

 Order date: 1st March 2007

 Thw wait begins..._

 

I ordered mine on February 20th and received a notice of receipt of order. I am expecting it to arrive December 31st.........................2011, and won't I be surprised when it arrives early.....if it does?????!!

 At least I have a vintage SuperMini, SuperDual (remember that?? It still sounds really good) and a SuperMacro IV to tide me over.


----------



## bellsprout

ordered december 15

 still no reply


----------



## fl00r

Ordered mine today. 'Ship in 2-3 weeks'


----------



## bellsprout

I just received an email from Dr Xin. My Supermicro IV has been made!

 Anyway, can someone tell me a few things about the Supermicro IV:
 -Do the stock opamps sound any good, or should I roll others?
 -How long should I burn it in for?


----------



## vorlon1

I don't think you will be able to roll the opamp in there without a whole lot of serious builder skill. Also, there is no reason to, the micro iv is considered by many (myself included) as one of the best, if not THE best sounding portable amp available.


----------



## kaushama

Its again upgrade time for those who has Supermacro. It seems Dr. Xin working on major series of tweak which makes SQ of Supermacro better than Micro!


----------



## hd650

I want to know which one of Macro, Mini, and Micro can drive my er4p best.
 I am so confused......


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hd650* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want to know which one of Macro, Mini, and Micro can drive my er4p best.
 I am so confused......_

 

If you want to be able to convert them to ER4S then you need Macro or Mini.

 I've read that Micro sounds best. I have a Mini and I love what it does for my ER4P.


----------



## bellsprout

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you want to be able to convert them to ER4S then you need Macro or Mini.

 I've read that Micro sounds best. I have a Mini and I love what it does for my ER4P._

 

I'm pretty sure Micro can drive ER-4S. In fact, the synergy is supposed to be amazing because Xin used ER-4S to monitor the Micro design


----------



## itobito

I want to order supermicro and I have fear to wait months


----------



## JimP

x


----------



## ERNEST T

I got my supermacro April 2. I was so mad with Xin's business practices and the waiting I was going to sell it. But I made the mistake of listing to it last night. It sounded great not even burnt in. I have decided to keep it. Truly a work of art.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want to order supermicro and I have fear to wait months
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Dude, just charge it to a credit card (he doesn't charge it until he ships) and just forget about it and consider it *Christmas in August*!

 I ordered mine on Feb 19th and should be getting a early summertime surprise!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ERNEST T* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got my supermacro April 2. I was so mad with Xin's business practices and the waiting I was going to sell it. But I made the mistake of listing to it last night. It sounded great not even burnt in. I have decided to keep it. Truly a work of art._

 

good idea to keep it... i mean you did wait a long ass time for it...


----------



## Copperjacket

I think too much is being said about Xin's so-called "business practices". 

 Members of this forum must by now all be aware of the 4 month or so waiting list and if this is not acceptable then you have a clear choice...

 From all accounts those who have patiently waited have been more than delighted and I believe his existing customer service is very good i.e. free upgrades etc. 

 Furthermore if you pay by credit card you are not charged until a few days prior to dispatch. 

 Somethings are worth waiting for ...


----------



## gtp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Copperjacket* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think too much is being said about Xin's so-called "business practices". 

 Members of this forum must by now all be aware of the 4 month or so waiting list and if this is not acceptable then you have a clear choice...

 From all accounts those who have patiently waited have been more than delighted and I believe his existing customer service is very good i.e. free upgrades etc. 

 Furthermore if you pay by credit card you are not charged until a few days prior to dispatch. 

 Somethings are worth waiting for ..._

 

My only objection is that Xin's website lists 2-3 weeks to ship! That is practically a lie, luring in customers with a false hope. Further, not every buyer will read through this entire thread to come to the conclusion that 2 weeks actually equals 4 months real time.


----------



## hd650

i ordered supermini in middle of march, but going to move out in june. how do I contact Xin to change my shipping address. God bless me to get it in May.lol


----------



## MonkeyButt

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_could you describe briefly what the latest updates that Xin is/has done on SMIV, referred to above? Is he done now, or I need to wait a bit longer?

 I have an old SM (do you call it version 1?) sitting around...maybe I'll send that in for upgrade._

 

I was wondering myself and nothing had been posted about his efforts recently so I went to his message board and found some quotes from emails that he sent to others regarding what he was up to during the last month or so:

 "After the huge change to the power/battery circuit, Macro still did not 
 sound as good as SuperMini (the latest Mini sounds better than Micro to me). 
 I have been looking for the last bottleneck...."

 "OK, I think I have finally done with the current Macro. 
 Now the sound is MUCH better than Mini and Micro, I can easily tell. The 
 most outstanding is OPA637. It is still the king, just need to do everything 
 right first before it can show up fully. I can even tell the difference 
 between 637 and 627 in some stability tests.

 The RMAA data also confirms my ears: distortion is 0.0003%, IMD is 0.0024%, noise -105.1dB, crosstalk -103.0dB. If my memory serves, these numbers were never all reached before. And the most important thing is: these numbers are all exactly the same for 33 ohm and 300 ohm loads. This is a very sure sign that the amp has reached its peak. There should be no more any bottleneck, otherwise it will show as a difference between high and low loads. In the past, at least IMD was higher with 33 ohm load.

 I think I'll keep the current Macro as it is, as it does offer all the 
 flexibilities without significant compromise on sound, after all these 
 tweaks. Tough, man." 

 So there it is from his own lips or actually his finger tips. Maybe its been good for me not to receive my SMIV even after more than 3 months of waiting. Though I can pretty much guarantee that he will make additional changes down the line even though he says that its finished based on his past behavior.

 In terms of upgrades though, he will not upgrade a version 1 to version 4 for free – not sure if that is what you meant since he does provide more limited upgrades for free. The design has changed way too much including many new parts. In fact, the upgrade he provides for version 3 does not make it a version 4. 

 Hope this helps or at least enlightens . . . I just want my SMIV!


----------



## itobito

Conspiracy theory 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 : 

 Xin has a very clever strategy of business.

 Let wait for 4 months, after that, psychologically exhausted the user starts thinking that amp has the best sound. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Well, unfortunately paradox enough it functions.

 Lets be serious, if I order it now, after 4-5 months perhaps I am not at all an Audiophyle any more.


----------



## Happy Camper

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Conspiracy theory 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 : 

 Xin has a very clever strategy of business.

 Let wait for 4 months, after that, psychologically exhausted the user starts thinking that amp has the best sound. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Well, unfortunately paradox enough it functions.

 Lets be serious, if I order it now, after 4-5 months perhaps I am not at all an Audiophyle any more. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

No, but who ever you give/sell it to will be.


----------



## EFN

I placed order for my SuperMicro IV on 14 Dec 2006

 Now it's.....still waiting


----------



## Biff Wellington

Ordered my Supermicro today (4/9/07). After going through this thread, I was momentarily disheartened. Then I thought, "Well, why not follow the advice of several users and get a Ray Samuels amp. By the time the SMIV shows up, the RS will be burned in and you can put them up against each other."
 As I'm bored at work currently, that's exactly what I plan to do. I'm not going to start a thread within a thread (SR-71 vs. Hornet vs. Tomahawk). HOWEVER, I'm am curious about the Hornet "M" - the RS website doesn't mention any "M." Is this a modification I have to get through a third party? Or is the "M" just the newer version of the Hornet?

 Did that make sense? I hope so...


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Biff Wellington* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered my Supermicro today (4/9/07). After going through this thread, I was momentarily disheartened. Then I thought, "Well, why not follow the advice of several users and get a Ray Samuels amp. By the time the SMIV shows up, the RS will be burned in and you can put them up against each other."_

 

I did the same, but with a Go-Vibe, to see if I could appreciate the difference of a more expensive amp.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Biff Wellington* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_HOWEVER, I'm am curious about the Hornet "M" - the RS website doesn't mention any "M." Is this a modification I have to get through a third party? Or is the "M" just the newer version of the Hornet?_

 

You will get an "M" Hornet when you order from Ray. However, iirc, there won't be any new Hornets made for a couple of months as Ray's waiting for some crucial parts. If you e-mail him, I'm sure he'll tell you when he can ship again. Tomahawk then?


----------



## Biff Wellington

No Hornet? Bogus.

 Well, I guess now it's Tomahawk v. SR-71, or maybe I should expand to less portable amps (since the Micro will be my travel amp unless I hate it). Aluren seems fired up about her Tomahawk (along with countless others on here).

 I'll investigate this Go-Vibe as well. I have time to spare...


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Biff Wellington* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No Hornet? Bogus.

 Well, I guess now it's Tomahawk v. SR-71, or maybe I should expand to less portable amps (since the Micro will be my travel amp unless I hate it). Aluren seems fired up about her Tomahawk (along with countless others on here).

 I'll investigate this Go-Vibe as well. I have time to spare..._

 

While waiting for your SuperMicro IV to arrive, I recommend that you try Go-Vibe V6 8620/8610. I had mine sold last week to another Head-Fier and I sold it off not because of SQ. Suffice to say GV6 can actually scale up to deliver as good as my Tomahawk in certain aspects and considering that it is 2X (or 3X) cheaper, GV6 is trully awesome. But in the end Tomahawk got the best of me due to superb battery life and small from factor. And Tomahawk does have that important edge over GV6 in terms of separation layering, solid highs control and as TH progressed (burn-in) Ray Samuels sound signature vibe becan to entice me. LOL!

 Well I am still waiting for my SMIV


----------



## kiwirugby

I don't want to jinx anything or raise expectations, but I heard from Xin yesterday, and this is what he said.


 I think just last night I finally finished the last bit of tweaking for IV amps and I'm processing orders right now. (April 10th, 4:32pm pst)


 I have been emailing every so often since February 20th when I order a SuperMicro. So, I'm hopeful. But my experience is not to think that this would necessarily mean amps will start flying out of his shop!


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't want to jinx anything or raise expectations, but I heard from Xin yesterday, and this is what he said.


 I think just last night I finally finished the last bit of tweaking for IV amps and I'm processing orders right now. (April 10th, 4:32pm pst)


 I have been emailing every so often since February 20th when I order a SuperMicro. So, I'm hopeful. But my experience is not to think that this would necessarily mean amps will start flying out of his shop!_

 

What kind of SICK, CRUEL, JOKE IS THIS XIN!?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't get your hopes up too high!


----------



## MonkeyButt

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't want to jinx anything or raise expectations, but I heard from Xin yesterday, and this is what he said.


 I think just last night I finally finished the last bit of tweaking for IV amps and I'm processing orders right now. (April 10th, 4:32pm pst)


 I have been emailing every so often since February 20th when I order a SuperMicro. So, I'm hopeful. But my experience is not to think that this would necessarily mean amps will start flying out of his shop!_

 

Hearing something is better than nothing. I figure my ticket has to come up soon. Coming up on about four months! Appreciate the update. Thanks.


----------



## Morph201

4 months?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ah, I see.. deprive your senses of music for 4 months and then when the amp arrives..BAM! 

 Kinda like starving yourself a month and then eating a regular ol' cracker... 

 "Mmm.. wow, this aint no regular cracker, no no no this is one of those premium Ritz crackers, right?" (kiddin)


----------



## MonkeyButt

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_4 months?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ah, I see.. deprive your senses of music for 4 months and then when the amp arrives..BAM! 

 Kinda like starving yourself a month and then eating a regular ol' cracker... 

 "Mmm.. wow, this aint no regular cracker, no no no this is one of those premium Ritz crackers, right?" (kiddin) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yeah, I have been "slumming it" with my SMIII for a while now. Its on its last legs (some contact problems) and needs to be sent back into Xin for him to fix and upgrade it. For a while I was living with nothing (Ipod -> E500s) and it was terrible. Its really surprising to me when some people state that they hear no difference in SQ when listening to IEMs with or without an external amp. The SQ across the full range of freqs is noticeably diminished when using the ipod alone. This effect is most noticeable in the bass or lack of coming from the ipod. I was just really hating it when the 500s were coming straight out of the ipod. Anywho, I finally figured out a way to temporarily fix the SMIII and my listening experience has been much better. 

 Can't wait to have my head blown away with the IV. Obviously I have high expectations!


----------



## itobito

I Ordered my Supermicro IV today 11/04/07...

 how many month must I wate?


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I Ordered my Supermicro IV today 11/04/07...

 how many month must I wate? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

July or August....most likely August.


----------



## Morph201

LOL! That's insane! Well look at it like this, while you wait for the amp to arrive you can learn to build your own! That way you can do your own mods to it instead of sending it back for another 3 months for an upgrade!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 [kiddin of course!].. you guys are better than me!


----------



## mrarroyo

A friend of mine received his Supermicro IV last week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I hope the rest get theirs soon.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A friend of mine received his Supermicro IV last week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I hope the rest get theirs soon._

 

When did he order it?


----------



## Morph201

probably December '06...


----------



## itobito

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_July or August....most likely August._

 

August???? this is 5 months waiting !!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 that is really, really not normal!!!

 just ill


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_August???? this is 5 months waiting !!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 that is really, really not normal!!!

 just ill_

 

August is 4 months away.


----------



## itobito

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_August is 4 months away._

 

oh yes, is correct! now I am so lucky


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh yes, is correct! now I am so lucky 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Bahahaha! 4 months vs 5 months!


----------



## grndslm

I too took the plunge...

 I figure, worst case scenario...I can cancel the order if I find something else that pleases me, or I can sell it to someone else here for the same reason.

 Man, I'm glad I didn't buy the Supermacro, tho... I almost thought it woulda been good enough...but there's no way it's worth twice as much as the micro. No way.

 Thanks Head-Fi, my mom's credit card is hurting.

_Which won't be charged until it's shipped, right?_ I don't wanna break the news to her before necessary.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh yes, is correct! now I am so lucky 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Lol hilarious


----------



## bellsprout

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Which won't be charged until it's shipped, right? I don't wanna break the news to her before necessary._

 

yep. for a 4 month long wait that's the best consolation of all.


----------



## EFN

A Revelation came to my inbox today.....it says "A package was shipped to you on 04/11/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Global Express Mail to the following address: ............"


 WoHOOOO!!! Dr. Xin has finally ship my SuperMicro IV after almost 4 months....not bad uh considering that I was pretty much settled to receive my SuperMicro IV in May LOL!


----------



## chris_ah1

Ordered my supermacro LE almost a week ago I think with some audio opamp requests. Hopefully it will arrive before 20th June. 

 Reason for going for the bigger model: longer battery life, opamp swapping, just as good resale value. switchable to IV. 

 Not a word from Xin yet at all.


----------



## MonkeyButt

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A Revelation came to my inbox today.....it says "A package was shipped to you on 04/11/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Global Express Mail to the following address: ............"


 WoHOOOO!!! Dr. Xin has finally ship my SuperMicro IV after almost 4 months....not bad uh considering that I was pretty much settled to receive my SuperMicro IV in May LOL!_

 


 Got mine last night as well after almost 4 months. Looks like he is in production mode.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A Revelation came to my inbox today.....it says "A package was shipped to you on 04/11/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Global Express Mail to the following address: ............"


 WoHOOOO!!! Dr. Xin has finally ship my SuperMicro IV after almost 4 months....not bad uh considering that I was pretty much settled to receive my SuperMicro IV in May LOL!_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MonkeyButt* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got mine last night as well after almost 4 months. Looks like he is in production mode._

 

Let's see some pictures guys!


----------



## MonkeyButt

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MonkeyButt* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got mine last night as well after almost 4 months. Looks like he is in production mode._

 

 Quote:


 Let's see some pictures guys! 
 

"Got mine" meaning that just got the notice that its in the mail . . .


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MonkeyButt* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"Got mine" meaning that just got the notice that its in the mail . . ._

 

Oh, I wouldn't know...I'm still waiting


----------



## mrarroyo

Yes it appears Dr. Xin is back in production mode. Today he posted on his site that he has been working on why the Supermicro sounded the best. He wrote it took him 6 months to figure it out and that amps (Supermini and Supermacro)shipped after 4/11 have the mod.


----------



## Biff Wellington

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_4 months?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ah, I see.. deprive your senses of music for 4 months and then when the amp arrives..BAM! 

 Kinda like starving yourself a month and then eating a regular ol' cracker... 

 "Mmm.. wow, this aint no regular cracker, no no no this is one of those premium Ritz crackers, right?" (kiddin) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 I FINALLY figured out where that Ritz cracker quote is from. Thank you, Morph201.

 Now my next step here is determining whether to get a 4P-->4S adapter or really go big-time and get some UE-10s. So...hungry...

 Oh, and still waiting for my Supermicro IV. It's almost been a week!!! (jokes...).

 Go Flames.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes it appears Dr. Xin is back in production mode. Today he posted on his site that he has been working on why the Supermicro sounded the best. He wrote it took him 6 months to figure it out and that amps (Supermini and Supermacro)shipped after 4/11 have the mod. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 So does that mean that I can send my Supermini IV in for another quick upgrade 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 yeah, ummm, seriously.


----------



## legbone

placed an order for a super micro IV today. will update when it is received. good thing they don't charge the card until it ships. only problem is, i hope it ships before my card expires a year from now


----------



## TC44

Order mine on 26 Dec 06 and noticed my credit card was charged on 11 Apr...should be seeing that shipping notice any day! Now to inform the wife


----------



## JarodL1

I ordered mine on the 7th of April, hoping to have it by July. 

 I don't understand what takes so long? How many orders could he possibly get? Is this just a side job for him? I don't mind the wait as long as there is a good reason, but if he is just sitting around and working on them when he feels like it then that is a poor way to run a business.


----------



## BushGuy

JarodL1 - you're making some pretty nasty and unfounded suppositions.

 If you read these and the testing, and impressions pages you would know that those who care enough to spend the time and money to compare many amps have found Xin's Supermicro IV to be the finest-sounding portable amp they have heard. Dr. Xin has been working to find why the larger amps have not quite been reaching that same plateau in sound quality. Well, he re-appeared on his forum with some exciting statements in postings of 4/11/07, and 4/12.......................................he states he has finally found the answers and Supermini IV, Supermacro IV, and Supermacro LE shipped from 4/11 onward will be equal to the Supermicro.

 That being said, I'm glad I ordered my Supermacro LE on 12/29, because on 4/12 Dr. Xin finally charged my CC............meaning my Supermacro LE is ON ITS' WAY!!!!!....................of course this means my Supermini IV will be visiting its "father" for the final tweaks.


----------



## Nattydraddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, he re-appeared on his forum with some exciting statements in postings of 4/11/07, and 4/12.......................................he states he has finally found the answers and Supermini IV, Supermacro IV, and Supermacro LE shipped from 4/11 onward will be equal to the Supermicro._

 

I also have problems finding the relevant messages in his forum. But if found an extract (in a german forum), in this he writes on the 04-04-2007:
  Quote:


 "OK, I think I have finally done with the current Macro.
 Now the sound is MUCH better than Mini and Micro, I can easily tell. The
 most outstanding is OPA637. 
 

Seems logic for me that the Supermacro sounds better with it´s higher price and larger power-support. (A SM LE or a supermini have just two AAA batteries and a OPA637 needs more power).

 But following your post they sound equal? So i would be better of with the supermini IV, which cost just $199?


----------



## PFKMan23

Doesn't the SuperMacro LE run on 4 AAAs not just 2?


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PFKMan23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Doesn't the SuperMacro LE run on 4 AAAs not just 2?_

 

Correct.


----------



## JarodL1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_JarodL1 - you're making some pretty nasty and unfounded suppositions.

 If you read these and the testing, and impressions pages you would know that those who care enough to spend the time and money to compare many amps have found Xin's Supermicro IV to be the finest-sounding portable amp they have heard. Dr. Xin has been working to find why the larger amps have not quite been reaching that same plateau in sound quality. Well, he re-appeared on his forum with some exciting statements in postings of 4/11/07, and 4/12.......................................he states he has finally found the answers and Supermini IV, Supermacro IV, and Supermacro LE shipped from 4/11 onward will be equal to the Supermicro.

 That being said, I'm glad I ordered my Supermacro LE on 12/29, because on 4/12 Dr. Xin finally charged my CC............meaning my Supermacro LE is ON ITS' WAY!!!!!....................of course this means my Supermini IV will be visiting its "father" for the final tweaks._

 

I'm not doubting the product's quality. I simply can't understand why it takes 3 months to ship out products.


----------



## BushGuy

Yes, the Supermacro LE runs on 4 batteries, and the Supermini is 2 batteries.

 The Xin posts I mentioned are on the Support page, and the thread is :"supermicro a class above mini and macro? "


 JarodL1 - you wrote " but if he is just sitting around and working on them when he feels like it then that is a poor way to run a business."

 and yes, digitalCat - "I'm picturing an army of ungodly creatures ravaging the headfi world and desperately looking for the beloved creator".....I often get the same feelings when reading posts on Head-Fi , except they are also busy devouring one another 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .......................remember, I know what goes on across the Hudson R. and Kill Van Kull . New York needs to erect a fence from just below Nyack to the Pennsylvania border, and quadruple the bridge and turnnel tolls (a form of natural selection).


----------



## digitalcat

Your words appropriately enhanced Xin's image as a mad scientist.... I'm picturing an army of ungodly creatures ravaging the headfi world and desperately looking for the beloved creator. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_of course this means my Supermini IV will be visiting its "father" for the final tweaks._


----------



## Skylab

I just reviewed NFusion770's SuperMicroIV for my portable amp roundup, - and it's VERY good sounding!


----------



## JarodL1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, the Supermacro LE runs on 4 batteries, and the Supermini is 2 batteries.

 The Xin posts I mentioned are on the Support page, and the thread is :"supermicro a class above mini and macro? "


 JarodL1 - you wrote " but if he is just sitting around and working on them when he feels like it then that is a poor way to run a business."

 and yes, digitalCat - "I'm picturing an army of ungodly creatures ravaging the headfi world and desperately looking for the beloved creator".....I often get the same feelings when reading posts on Head-Fi , except they are also busy devouring one another 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 .......................remember, I know what goes on across the Hudson R. and Kill Van Kull . New York needs to erect a fence from just below Nyack to the Pennsylvania border, and quadruple the bridge and turnnel tolls (a form of natural selection).
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You dont seem to understand my point. I don't doubt the quality or Xin's reputation. All I am questioning is why does it take 3 months to ship out orders? He doesn't hold peoples money (unless they use paypal). I can't imagine these things take that long to make or he gets enough orders to backup his time for 3 months.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You dont seem to understand my point. I don't doubt the quality or Xin's reputation. All I am questioning is why does it take 3 months to ship out orders? He doesn't hold peoples money (unless they use paypal). I can't imagine these things take that long to make or he gets enough orders to backup his time for 3 months._

 

Ok, he was not happy with the sound coming out of his amps. When that happens he goes on development mode and hardly any work gets completed. Many people get upset and cancel orders or simply do not order from him.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just reviewed NFusion770's SuperMicroIV for my portable amp roundup, - and it's VERY good sounding!_

 

Skylab, Dr. Xin just tweaked all his amps including the Supermicro IV. Specifically the power supply, he says they are all sounding much better. The mod is on amps built/modified 4/11/07 or later.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Skylab, Dr. Xin just tweaked all his amps including the Supermicro IV. Specifically the power supply, he says they are all sounding much better. The mod is on amps built/modified 4/11/07 or later. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That's cool, that means my order is going to be fulfilled with the new version! I'm even more excited now!

 I wonder if my order is going to be filled while he's in production mode? hmmmm...


----------



## BushGuy

Heh, heh, you missed it guys - my shipping notice for Supermacro LE is 4/12/07


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ok, he was not happy with the sound coming out of his amps. When that happens he goes on development mode and hardly any work gets completed. Many people get upset and cancel orders or simply do not order from him._

 

I think the frustration comes into play when there's NO communication... And he (Dr. Xin) does all this development for minimal gain compared to other amps? To be honest I'm not sure how much better the post 4/11/07 amps are, but to totally alienate your consumer base is not cool. I would be interested to have Skylab review the new Xin amps against the current ones in his stable and see if it even tops a larocco (bad example since he's even worse with customers) or RSA amp in SQ by leaps and bounds. Once again, I know this is Sky's opinion, but so far I've agreed with Sky's assessment on certain amps so I trust him.


----------



## Skylab

This is an example of why reviewing a Xin amp is frustrating - it's a constantly moving target. If I had a nickel for every time Xin had now "perfected" his design, I could buy a top of the line Singlepower or Rudistor amp


----------



## Kabeer

Hey guys, 
 Im trying to keep on the updates on Xin;s forum. but the thread for the IV amps http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1759
 Only displays a topic from 2006 on the last page (33rd page).

 Whereas the main page says that Xin has made a post in the thread yesterday :S.

 Any clues on how to view it?

 Thanks


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey guys, 
 Im trying to keep on the updates on Xin;s forum. but the thread for the IV amps http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1759
 Only displays a topic from 2006 on the last page (33rd page).

 Whereas the main page says that Xin has made a post in the thread yesterday :S.

 Any clues on how to view it?

 Thanks_

 

He just updated the very first post.


----------



## TC44

I received my notice on 12 April that my Mini IV has shipped
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm stoked about the improvements that Dr. Xin has made, but now I'm slightly confused. Before the improvements, the stock Mini configuration came with the AD8397. I requested and paid extra for the ST-WV configuration. The new configuration states that a "tube-alike" opamp is now the standard configuration. I wouldn't have ordered the ST-WV if I knew the change was coming. Does anyone know if I will receive the stock op amp setup in addition to the the ST-WV? I'd really like to hear the stock Mini configuration now.

 Anyone have any comments on how the ST-WV will compare with the new standard configuration?

 Thanks


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think the frustration comes into play when there's NO communication... And he (Dr. Xin) does all this development for minimal gain compared to other amps? To be honest I'm not sure how much better the post 4/11/07 amps are, but to totally alienate your consumer base is not cool. I would be interested to have Skylab review the new Xin amps against the current ones in his stable and see if it even tops a larocco (bad example since he's even worse with customers) or RSA amp in SQ by leaps and bounds. Once again, I know this is Sky's opinion, but so far I've agreed with Sky's assessment on certain amps so I trust him._

 

I have also compared the same amps that Skylab has. Overall I agree in his placement of the top 5/6 with one exception. To me the Supermicro IV is the number 1 not 6. As far as the rest the LaRocco and the SR71 are pretty much equivalent except for convenience. The LaRocco has a gain switch, and it recharges batteries. On the other hand the SR71 is dead silent while the LaRocco is not (with sensitive IEMs).


----------



## Skylab

The top 6 amps in my review are all good enough, IMO, that ranking them is quite hard. And different ears do hear differently


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The top 6 amps in my review are all good enough, IMO, that ranking them is quite hard. And different ears do hear differently 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes, I agree. For a general guideline, your review and the one provided by Miguel and vorlon are excellent. Even they cannot agree on which amp is best. And even then, there's the matter of source and headphones.

 The good news is, all of you provide an invaluable service to the community.

 The bad news is, only I can be the judge of what sounds best to me (read: It costs _me_ money to find out for myself. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have also compared the same amps that Skylab has. Overall I agree in his placement of the top 5/6 with one exception. To me the Supermicro IV is the number 1 not 6. As far as the rest the LaRocco and the SR71 are pretty much equivalent except for convenience. The LaRocco has a gain switch, and it recharges batteries. On the other hand the SR71 is dead silent while the LaRocco is not (with sensitive IEMs)._

 

No worries pal. Next couple of days my SuperMicro IV (04/11 batch) will arrive and I expect a tough showdown between my 600 hours Tomahawk and SuperMicro IV.

 But honestly I do hope that SMicro IV can deliver more because I am an Ety guy and SuperMicro was developed by "the Doctor" using ER-4S almost exclusively - that may proved pivotal. IMHO, Tomahawk has always been more of a "Shure" lineage because Ray has used non Ety IEM more during the development. I on the other hand is a staunch believer in synergy, so the development history of a specific amp matters a lot to me. 

 (I will explain all this in detail when the time comes)


----------



## druelle

I was just about to order a Firestone Cute Beyond amp when I read Skylab's update to the portable amp review thread. Upon reading his [well-written] observations (and cross-referencing them to the myriad other SuperMicro appreciation threads) ordered the SuperMicroIV (and bought War & Peace from my local bookshop to keep me occupied until it comes) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered the dark green case, but considering it'll probably be velcroed under my iPod, that's not too important in the grand scheme of things... what's important is the unbelievable sound the SM produces, from what I've read.

 Thanks everyone, and especially Skylab for the convincing review! I'll be back in 4 months to share my glee.


----------



## antonyfirst

I've just ordered the Supermicro IV. I hope it'll arrive as soon as possible (on his website Xin says 2-3 week).


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The top 6 amps in my review are all good enough, IMO, that ranking them is quite hard. And different ears do hear differently 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

That is why we end up with one of each!


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That is why we end up with one of each! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

LOL! Indeed. I am thinking of ordering a SuperMacro IV when (if?) Xin says the IV is "finished".


----------



## chris_ah1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL! Indeed. I am thinking of ordering a SuperMacro IV when (if?) Xin says the IV is "finished"._

 

Apparently I have the 'finished' supermacro LE on order right now. Everything shipped post 11th April will be the last afaik. I think Xin is 'very happy' with the latest tweaks to the power supply bringing the macro to beyond supermicro quality. It's all on the forums at fixup.net. He seems to be cranking them out too now. Hopefully I will have mine in two months not three.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *antonyfirst* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...I hope it'll arrive as soon as possible (on his website Xin says 2-3 week)._

 

I hate to be a barer of bad news, but it said that too when I ordered mine...on Feb 19th. From what I've seen, it's always said that.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I hate to be a barer of bad news, but it said that too when I ordered mine...on Feb 19th. From what I've seen, it's always said that._

 

Whislt 2-3 weeks is probably out of the question, maybe the waiting time will not be as long as 3 months now, since Xin is back in production mode?


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Whislt 2-3 weeks is probably out of the question, maybe the waiting time will not be as long as 3 months now, since Xin is back in production mode?_

 

Exactly. The way he shuts down during R&D is the same as during production. Trust me that's he's going full-force!


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *procreate* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Exactly. The way he shuts down during R&D is the same as during production. Trust me that's he's going full-force!_

 

Lol I didnt understand what you said. Are you saying that in prodution mode he will be the same slow speed as he was in his r&d mode? 
 Or that now he is in production mode itll be much faster than before?

 Thanks


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lol I didnt understand what you said. Are you saying that in prodution mode he will be the same slow speed as he was in his r&d mode? 
 Or that now he is in production mode itll be much faster than before?

 Thanks_

 

While in Research Mode Dr. Xin refused to send out amps because he was unhappy with them. Now that is solved he should be on full throttle clearing the backlogs

 and any new orders should be also processed faster I trust


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lol I didnt understand what you said. Are you saying that in prodution mode he will be the same slow speed as he was in his r&d mode? 
 Or that now he is in production mode itll be much faster than before?_

 

Sorry, my bad. What EFN said. With "shuts down", I meant that he disconnects from the outside world and puts his undivided attention into what he's doing, be it R&D or production.


----------



## Kabeer

Cool, fingers crossed it will only be a month or two


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_While in Research Mode Dr. Xin refused to send out amps because he was unhappy with them. Now that is solved he should be on full throttle clearing the backlogs

 and any new orders should be also processed faster I trust_

 

That would be really cool! I've always been interested in the SMIV...I may finally see one in my hands soon....one can only hope!


----------



## nickknutson

Anone else get shipping notices today?


----------



## jamato8

Remember what time of year it is in the US, tax time. I would imagine after the 17th things should open up again.


----------



## kaushama

Its high time for me to send the Supermacro for latest upgrades. I received my canamp and should fully mod it before I listen to it.
 I should buy a Supermini too for portable usage.
 Jamato Are you in a position to let me know information I asked about chinese DACs?


----------



## aluren

i'm kinda kicking myself now that i already sold my supermacro iv. but it's cool... ordered a supermicro in Jan 07, so i'm constantly checking my email for the shipping notice. i have never been so eager for someone to charge my credit card!


----------



## Thelonious Monk

well, when i see reports of people getting their xin amps quite quickly, you can bet i'll buy one again. and a bunch of aaas.


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Its high time for me to send the Supermacro for latest upgrades. I received my canamp and should fully mod it before I listen to it.
 I should buy a Supermini too for portable usage.
 Jamato Are you in a position to let me know information I asked about chinese DACs?_

 

Is Xin offering free upgrades on any previous version of IV amps? I have a Supermini IV that has been upgraded once already. I forget when I bought it but that info is in this thread, many, many pages back.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GreatDane* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is Xin offering free upgrades on any previous version of IV amps? I have a Supermini IV that has been upgraded once already. I forget when I bought it but that info is in this thread, many, many pages back._

 

Best if you call the doctor himself and I think he may still provide upgrades. Even if he ask topup $ I don't mind.


----------



## EFN

Dammm, I called the post office just now and they said my SuperMicro has just cleared customs late last night.....and now my precious long awaited amp is with the postman
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








 ....now every minutes drained me of my blood


----------



## GreatDane

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Best if you call the doctor himself and I think he may still provide upgrades. Even if he ask topup $ I don't mind._

 

I guess I need to make my request official. I'll e-mail Xin and see what he can offer me. 

 That'd be cool if I could kick my Supermini IV up a notch.


----------



## EFN

Speak of the Devil! the Postman being an Audiophile himself came flying with my SuperMicro! (JK)

 15 minutes ago:





 EXTREMELY URGENT! LOL!





 Yummy......





 UH OH!!!! those monkeys at the Postoffice - don't they have feeling?!

 OMG It's SOOO Tiny!










 Enuff Room to carry TWO amps


----------



## Morph201

Wow! Grats!!! IMPRESSIONS!!!!


----------



## GreatDane

Congrats.

 The _loooooonnngg_ wait is over


----------



## aluren

lucky person!!! i'm drooling.


----------



## denisavu

X2!!


----------



## Kabeer

EFN, how did you get a black case???


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_EFN, how did you get a black case???_

 






 my order was placed in December 2006....at that time solid black case was still an option


----------



## itobito

black case 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 never saw


----------



## itobito

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Best if you call the doctor himself and I think he may still provide upgrades. Even if he ask topup $ I don't mind._

 

I can´t find nummber of xin, can you please say to me.

 thanks


----------



## BushGuy

The Eagle (oops, I mean 4/12 built Supermacro LE) has landed. Any typos are do to listening Nano/SupermacroLE/Darths as I write 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 All I'll say is that Dr. Xin was correct to say it now equals SQ of "vaunted" Supermicro and soundstage is huge. Now letting the burn-in and informal experiments begin.


----------



## aluren

when did you order it?


----------



## BushGuy

Dec 29th


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_lucky person!!! i'm drooling._

 

I'm sobbing! But happy for you, EFN!!!


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm sobbing! But happy for you, EFN!!!_

 

Thanks.....wait for my full review and you'll be screaming


----------



## rcw

As I posted on fixup.net:
 Ordered Mini 8616/8616 on 20061226.
 Shipping notice 20070413: 108 days.
 Received 20070416, Cleveland, Ohio: 111 days, (about the same time as tomatoes & broccoli, seed to harvest).
 Fantastic sound as soon as switched on.


----------



## BushGuy

"Fantastic sound as soon as switched on."

 I can say I'm surprised at your reaction. I had a Supermini III, then moved to a Supermini IV, and finally received my 4/12 Supermacro LE. I didn't quite have the same reaction to the others as I did yesterday with this one. I may be accused of being a dittohead in reacting in kind, but also say "Fantastic sound as soon as switched on." and incredible sounstage. You begin to wonder just how great this piece of equipment could possibly become.

 It's tempting to rub some noes in the mud and say that this is one of those times that very good things come to good people who wait.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks.....wait for my full review and you'll be screaming
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	











_

 

now that's cruel!!! But I will be eager to read your review...

 I think my micro is scheduled to arrive, July.........2011.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_now that's cruel!!! But I will be eager to read your review...

 I think my micro is scheduled to arrive, July.........2011._

 

oh really? me too! what a coincidence!


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh really? me too! what a coincidence! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Sorry......I think! Glad to know I have company! Maybe EFN could share the wealth?????? Nah!

 And when I placed my order back in the 90s (!!), Xin asked me to send back my SMIV for the latest and greatest. Not on my life! I always want one Xin amp in hand!


----------



## aluren

yeah i thought about ordering a supermacro LE so that in 6 months time, i will feel a need to upgrade my portable amps and VIOLA! the LE shows up right on my doorsteps!


----------



## simxpower

Finally shipped 'supermicro' 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 18 April 2007

 Order date
 Date : 25 Dec 2006 - 08:06
 Order ID : 38157800


----------



## Kabeer

Lol I knew the risks of timing going in, but with this forum it makes the waiting harder


----------



## brospin

Supermicro IV ordered on Jan 20. Credit card charged Apr 20. No shipping confirmation yet. Seems like my Supermico pregnancy is coming to an end.


----------



## BushGuy

I think it was 2 days from CC charge to shipping notice. Last year it was sameday...............also, USPS isn't reliable as it used to be. Many times these day it'll notified by shipper and tracking number issue, but they fail ever mentioning receipt of the package. It least that's my experience.....suddenly the package is on your doorstep - the tracking page still reports the same as it did originally.


----------



## JarodL1

Be interested to know how many orders Xin gets a month. Anyone have an idea?


----------



## djbnh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Be interested to know how many orders Xin gets a month. Anyone have an idea?_

 

I think the number of orders per month certainly affects wait time, as does Dr. Xin's time spent in the circuit tweaking / development phase (very important to Dr. Xin and his customers), as well as Dr. Xin spending time upgrading existing amps post-development phase. I'm currently waiting for Dr. Xin to post instructions regarding the latest set of upgrades.


----------



## EFN

This will be a VERY busy period fro Dr. Xin.
 - Clearing backlogs dating all the way from December 2006
 - Finishing amps for delivery
 - Entertaining upgrade requests

 Yes he has gone into production mode again but we should hold our horses because he will need the space and time to get the abovestated cleared.....


 And once that's done, I have an itch to place an order for SuperMacro-LE


----------



## ttnl

Look like Xin has shipped orders placed around Jan 17th. Hopefully there are not a lot of orders in Feb and March.


----------



## kaushama

Yes Dr. XIN is a real work horse when he is in the production mode. He will soon reduce the wait time to 3-4 weeks as mentioned in the web site. I think now is the time for me to send my amp for upgrading and order a new supermini!


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes Dr. XIN is a real work horse when he is in the production mode. He will soon reduce the wait time to 3-4 weeks as mentioned in the web site. I think now is the time for me to send my amp for upgrading and order a new supermini!_

 

I believe so. When he is on production mode and has no backlogs in hand, we can expect Xin to mett up the 3-4 weeks turn time


----------



## fl00r

I am watching this thread like a hawk.
 It's been 2 months since I ordered a Supermini IV.
 Stupid enough I have returned my SuperMacro III for an upgrade at the same time.
 I cross my fingers...


----------



## nickknutson

I just saw this on Xin's forum

  Quote:


 Ordered a Supermini IV on January 17th
 Shipped on April 21st
 Total wait = around 15 weeks 
 

Xin's getting caught up, baby!
 At this pace, I should be getting mine in the next week or two!


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just saw this on Xin's forum



 Xin's getting caught up, baby!
 At this pace, I should be getting mine in the next week or two!_

 

LOL! Whoooooaaa... just under 4 months! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 For a 4 month wait that amp better knock ya socks off AND then get you a sandiwich,beer and a cigarette afterwards!


----------



## leco

I ordered mine early January (4th I believe), it was shipped April 20th and I got it today! Four days from Oregon to Edmonton, Alberta must be a record! Woohoo! 

 I'm now happily enjoying my new micro, oh yea baby.

 Percy


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *leco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered mine early January (4th I believe), it was shipped April 20th and I got it today! Four days from Oregon to Edmonton, Alberta must be a record! Woohoo! 

 I'm now happily enjoying my new micro, oh yea baby.

 Percy_

 

WELCOME to XinPhilia!!!!!


----------



## denisavu

I'm jealous...at this pace, I won't see mine until July with a March order!


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *denisavu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm jealous...at this pace, I won't see mine until July with a March order!_

 

Pretty much.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *denisavu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm jealous...at this pace, I won't see mine until July with a March order!_

 

July which year?????? 2011?????

 Nah, you'll get yours fairly soon...maybe...

 (I'm waiting for mine too...ordered February 20th and no word.)


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_July which year?????? 2011?????

 Nah, you'll get yours fairly soon...maybe...

 (I'm waiting for mine too...ordered February 20th and no word.)_

 

Lament not buddy. Seems that Xin is clearing December and January backlogs now, yours should be next in line


----------



## bigizzy75

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH........

 Sorry that was my wallet.

 Well guys I pulled the trigger last night. I did it.... I purchased the Xin Supermicro IV with a Dark blue Case. Somewhat it feels like I'm taking a risk. I was moving back and forth from SMIV to Tomahawk. But I decided to go with the SMIV its so small yet from what I hear its better than the Tomahawk....even though I feel that the plastic might break, or that in the long run I'll be spending more on batteries (but hey no one said any hobby was cheap).

 Anywho I hope I made the right decision.....but now I"m just not going to look back and let the waiting begin. 

 Order Date: 04/25/07

 Shipping Date: Lets hope soon


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bigizzy75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH........

 Sorry that was my wallet.

 Well guys I pulled the trigger last night. I did it.... I purchased the Xin Supermicro IV with a Dark blue Case. Somewhat it feels like I'm taking a risk. I was moving back and forth from SMIV to Tomahawk. But I decided to go with the SMIV its so small yet from what I hear its better than the Tomahawk....even though I feel that the plastic might break, or that in the long run I'll be spending more on batteries (but hey no one said any hobby was cheap).

 Anywho I hope I made the right decision.....but now I"m just not going to look back and let the waiting begin. 

 Order Date: 04/25/07

 Shipping Date: Lets hope soon_

 

Nice!


----------



## naamanf

Let's go Febuary orders!


----------



## choariwap

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bigizzy75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...even though I feel that the plastic might break, or that in the long run I'll be spending more on batteries (but hey no one said any hobby was cheap)._

 

bec its so small, the plastic can really take a beating. 

 also you should get rechargeables (sanyo eneloops FTW), no more battery cost problems. it even sounds better on rechargeables.


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Supermicro IV in dark green case ordered 04/26/07, Sanyo eneloops already on the shelf waiting for it.


----------



## aluren

i'm still waiting for my january order... =(


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lament not buddy. Seems that Xin is clearing December and January backlogs now, yours should be next in line 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Aye, EFN. Thanks for the encouragement.

 I am gald you received yours and gave us all such an excellent review. Of course, you know that made it all the much harder to bear the waiting.

 I have been "working" with Xin for a few years, and this is the longest I have waited for anything from him. Sporadic emails but no shipping notice! But since I have an original mini from three years ago or so, a SuperDual (coupled to my 1st generation 4gb nano with a n ALO micro...waiting to be replaced by the SuperMicro), and an SMIV, I'm not with out any amps. Xin wanted me to send the SMIV in for yet another upgrade (number five, I think, since I bought it!) but I told him I would wait until the SuperMicro arrived. I'm glad I did!

 So, not much lamenting here, but the more I hear about how good the little monster is, the more eager I become!


----------



## kaushama

Yes. Well worth waiting for Xin Amps! I have one supermini on the way too. I received my GS-1. I can say, Supermacro can give GS-1 a good competition, as it has so impressive clarity, sound-stage and depth. This is with latest OPAMP configurations I have been trying lately. My Supermacro is waiting to get new upgrades. I can how good it will sound, when it gets upgrades!


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes. Well worth waiting for Xin Amps! I have one supermini on the way too. I received my GS-1. I can say, Supermacro can give GS-1 a good competition, as it has so impressive clarity, sound-stage and depth. This is with latest OPAMP configurations I have been trying lately. My Supermacro is waiting to get new upgrades. I can how good it will sound, when it gets upgrades!_

 

Enuff Poison!!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 I will be putting up another order for SuperMacro-LE very soon - time for some opamp rolling & crossfeed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.....once all listed above have receive their amps (backlog clears)


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will be putting up another order for SuperMacro-LE very soon - time for some opamp rolling & crossfeed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.....once all listed above have receive their amps (backlog clears)_

 

Don't forget about bass boost. Very nice for when you're not in a silent environment. The ER•4 responds very well to it.


----------



## srikeerthi

Got a mail from Xin saying that my Supermicro should be ready by this week (ordered March 1st). So I should be having the amp with me in 2-3 weeks


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got a mail from Xin saying that my Supermicro should be ready by this week (ordered March 1st). So I should be having the amp with me in 2-3 weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

are you kidding me? my order of the supermicro is Jan 27 and you already got yours shipped? that's just bs...


----------



## shiezan

Hey if I order an additional plastic case along with the one I ordered a while back, will it come along with the amp on the same day?
 What if I order the case after my amp arrives? Will that take 3 months?


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_are you kidding me? my order of the supermicro is Jan 27 and you already got yours shipped? that's just bs..._

 

Hey when did i say its shipped!!!

 I said what I got in mail from Xin. He said it should be ready in the batch of this week. Adding couple of weeks as buffer for shipping i said i could have it in 3 weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm not promising you'll get yours, just sharing the feeling that mine is not as far away as thought


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey when did i say its shipped!!!

 I said what I got in mail from Xin. He said it should be ready in the batch of this week. Adding couple of weeks as buffer for shipping i said i could have it in 3 weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm not promising you'll get yours, just sharing the feeling that mine is not as far away as thought 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

well i wasn't trying to be bitter, just that all the excitement and impressions on the supermicro got me anxious!! speaking from a previous xin order, i got an email notice of shipment for my supermacro and it only took 3 days to arrive. so you should be getting yours soon.


----------



## sWirL

wOoohOoo...ordered a SuperMini IV on April 17. Thought that it's going to be a 4 month way but hey....i'm getting more optimistic about it coming earlier!


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well i wasn't trying to be bitter, just that all the excitement and impressions on the supermicro got me anxious!! speaking from a previous xin order, i got an email notice of shipment for my supermacro and it only took 3 days to arrive. so you should be getting yours soon._

 


 Well staying in Kuala Lumpur (Malaysia) means a longer wait for me. Seeing that EFN got his package in less than a week after receiving the mail of shipping, I'm still hopeful of getting it soon.

 But your's should be there sooner. Happy waiting


----------



## simxpower

Order date
 Date : 25 Dec 2006 - 08:06
 Order ID : 38157800

 back frm HK yesterday, n WOW Xin Supermicro IV arrived.


----------



## AlanE49

At long last . . . 

 Ordered SuperMicro IV 1/21/07
 Shipped Today 5/1/07

 Hooray!


----------



## chris_ah1

Wahey - only 4months behind. catchup time.


----------



## rcw

As on fixup:
 Micro:
 Ordered 20070125
 Ship notice 20070501, 96 days
 Arrived Cleveland, Ohio 20070504, 99 days


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

You know what? If I am Dr.Xin's marketing consultant I will tell him to put all this info on his website. Turn the whole "waiting for Xin amps" into a community binding experience.

 I, for one, wouldn't mind seeing a big display of the most recent shipment's date of order, number of days it took, or even having the receiver reports back on shipping time etc. Of cause the lucky guy with shortest waiting time get his name in honorable place, until someone else beats him.

 But oops! it's going to take more of Dr.Xin's time so, must be a fansite instead. Anyone interest in building one? Hehe


----------



## Wildcard30

Ordered mine Aprill 11th waiting patiently


----------



## bigizzy75

Hi guys,

 You know when you order your Xin Product. And then you get that sales e-mail from fixup.net. IS the price that is listed there the final price or is there still sale tax to be included or what not?

 Thanks guys,

 bigizzy75


----------



## Frihed89

These are good times for hifi equipment mfrs. The global economy is booming and the middle class has money to spend, burning holes in their pockets. But for small mfrs., this can be a nightmare. Competition increases, the backlog mounts, people start complaining and it's impossible to find qualified staff to reduce the backlog.

 There are two extreme responses to this: 

 The first is for the mfr. to tell the truth about the backlog and then make good on his commitment, even if it involves a 6-month wait.

 The second is to give a highly unrealistic delivery date that the mfr knows he can not meet (a lie) and fend anxious-to-angry customers off with more stories (lies).

 There are lots of shades in between.

 Where does Xin lie on this scale?


----------



## BushGuy

Bigizzy - purchases via Paypal HAVE to be charged immediately - that's is how Paypal works. When you pay via a CC - it is NOT charged until day of shipping by Dr. Xin. There are no financial surprises. No tax. Simply, you are charged for what you order at the prices posted, and the shipping cost posted.

 Frihed - to class Dr. Xin, Headphile, or other such people as Mfgrs. is a bit of a misnomer. They need to be recognized more as artizens and do not work on an assembly-line basis.........and what they do is highly personal for them. They do whatever they do because they psychically enjoy their craft, as much as any renumeration. They are pleasing themselves (and I would not wish them to anything else). You need to accept them and their products for what they are, and enjoy them....... or not. They are scrupulous in being very fair to their customers, and deliver very high quality, unique products. Those who carp about how an individual runs his own business should conserve his energy and simply move on to a cooky-cutter-styled manufacturer.


----------



## bigizzy75

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Bigizzy - purchases via Paypal HAVE to be charged immediately - that's is how Paypal works. When you pay via a CC - it is NOT charged until day of shipping by Dr. Xin. There are no financial surprises. No tax. Simply, you are charged for what you order at the prices posted, and the shipping cost posted._

 

Thank you very much BushGuy.

 bigizzy75


----------



## Sinclair

SuperMicro IV
 Ordered 01/22/07
 Ship notice 05/01/07, 99 days
 Arrived Japan 05/08/07, 106 days


----------



## brospin

Supermicro IV:
 Ordered Jan 20
 CC charged Apr 20
 Shipped May 1
 Arrived May 5
 4 days from Oregon to Spain (and this stuff goes through the customs office)!!


----------



## shiezan

i ordered my supermicro sometime in early march, and dr xin told me it will arrive before june 14 for sure.
 but i cant wait!


----------



## Shurado

Ordered a Supermini about a half an hour ago. I hope by the time it gets shipped I'll be able to pay for it.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i ordered my supermicro sometime in early march, and dr xin told me it will arrive before june 14 for sure.
 but i cant wait!_

 

I ordered at that time as well. How do you know it will be at your doorstep before June 14? I mean, I have BEGED Xin for an ETA but no reply at all


----------



## jamvanman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Bigizzy - purchases via Paypal HAVE to be charged immediately - that's is how Paypal works. When you pay via a CC - it is NOT charged until day of shipping by Dr. Xin. There are no financial surprises. No tax. Simply, you are charged for what you order at the prices posted, and the shipping cost posted.

 Frihed - to class Dr. Xin, Headphile, or other such people as Mfgrs. is a bit of a misnomer. They need to be recognized more as artizens and do not work on an assembly-line basis.........and what they do is highly personal for them. They do whatever they do because they psychically enjoy their craft, as much as any renumeration. They are pleasing themselves (and I would not wish them to anything else). You need to accept them and their products for what they are, and enjoy them....... or not. They are scrupulous in being very fair to their customers, and deliver very high quality, unique products. Those who carp about how an individual runs his own business should conserve his energy and simply move on to a cooky-cutter-styled manufacturer._

 

I fully agree. In many ways, this is part and parcel of what these guys produce. If Dr Xin ran things differently he wouldn't be who he is and probably wouldn't make the amps he does.


----------



## JarodL1

Seems like Xin has slowed down over the last week and a half. I haven't seen any orders past Jan 20's shipped out.


----------



## srikeerthi

Another revision on the way 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 j/k he did say my march 1st order would be shipped by last week.. seems to have slowed down since then.


----------



## aluren

got this email from xin last night:

  Quote:


 I'm processing the next batch of orders right now and your is the first in this batch. Xin


----------



## nickknutson

Congrats aluren! It's been a long time coming


----------



## aluren

yeah well, i smell another 2-3 weeks of waiting... hopefully sooner, of course.


----------



## onocentaur

I also got an email from Xin saying my order was going to be 'processed next week _mostly_' (italics mine!) - fingers crossed!


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *onocentaur* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I also got an email from Xin saying my order was going to be 'processed next week mostly' (italics mine!) - fingers crossed!_

 

When did you place your order?


----------



## fl00r

It seems that Xin is out of the running due to sickness: http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?...92&whichpage=3


----------



## Otaku-Cyber

wow, this thread really shows how well accepted xin can be! is it NO1 in America so far?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It seems that Xin is out of the running due to sickness: http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?...92&whichpage=3_

 

Glad you posted it, good thing is he appears to be back and ready to build/ship amps.


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

This thread led me to Xin's webboard and once I'm done reading I have to say man, what a perfectionist he is


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SONGsanmanwah* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This thread led me to Xin's webboard and once I'm done reading I have to say man, what a perfectionist he is 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

He is indeed. His amps are simply amazing for a very affordable price. Xin is always tweaking his amps to the max and provides 'life-time' free upgrades.

 But every medal has two sides: please allow for long delivery times.


----------



## nickknutson

Anyone get a CC charge or shipping notice lately?


----------



## onocentaur

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you place your order?_

 

Sorry. 2nd Feb.


----------



## dle4e_2005

I ordered a Supermicro on 7th of May 2007 with clear and dark blue casing.
 Hope to received it from the postman before August.


----------



## ChickenGod

Ordered: May 13, 2007
 Hoping around Aug 28, 2007.

 Why?

 Because that is my birthday


----------



## JarodL1

Haven't seen any shipping notices for a couple weeks now.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Haven't seen any shipping notices for a couple weeks now._

 

There's been posts on his forum that he's been out sick.


----------



## tbmusic

Ordered: May 08, 2007

 Hope to received on: July 2007

 Likely date of arrival: September 2007


----------



## JarodL1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There's been posts on his forum that he's been out sick._

 

For 2.5 weeks?


----------



## Pangaea

Are all his models back ordered? Or just the micro. I just ordered the SuperMini... can I expect it before fall?


----------



## Shurado

Whether you ordered a SM LE, Supermini, or Supermicro, there's only one person building them so yes, they're all backordered. Delivery times depends on what Xin does in the future but the general idea is around three-four months.


----------



## vexeus

Anyone know the best way to let Xin know that I'm moving and he should ship to another address? I've tried e-mail twice but he hasn't responded to either.


----------



## Shurado

E-mail is the best way to go short of leaving a voice-mail (scroll all the way down for the #) but as it said, he usually doesn't call back. There is a chat system as well on his website but I never tried it. My best guess is, Xin hasn't been checking his messages lately so I suppose e-mailing him more would only compound the problem.


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

As I understand he'll email you ahead of shipping time. You should be able to reply to that to give new shipping address.


----------



## procreate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone know the best way to let Xin know that I'm moving and he should ship to another address? I've tried e-mail twice but he hasn't responded to either. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Strange, I've always gotten replies on my e-mails. The max wait for a reply has been a day for me. Have you tried the following as subject:

 <order number> Change of shipping address

 Hope it helps.


----------



## noypi

just got my xin super micro 4.. and it rocks!!! woohoo!!! i ordered about novermber and got it something like april.. unfortunately, due to certain circumstances (family matters), its only now that i got it. when i ordered it, i got an e-mail the next day confirming my order.. its titled as receipt..


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *noypi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_just got my xin super micro 4.. and it rocks!!! woohoo!!! i ordered about novermber and got it something like april.. unfortunately, due to certain circumstances (family matters), its only now that i got it. when i ordered it, i got an e-mail the next day confirming my order.. its titled as receipt..
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

WOW! thats a Looonngg time. Man I really hope the good doctor has reduced the waiting time.


----------



## PPkiller

guys.. i have a good news and a bad news...

 bad news is... Dr xin just went down into his dungeon...

 good news is... this is coming out.. 

 "
 a new SuperMacro-IV Reference Edition is coming out in few days, 
 you may consider that. Here is some info:

http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0036.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0037.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0038.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0049.jpg
 "


----------



## nickknutson

MY CARD HAS FINALLY BEEN CHARGED FOR MY ORDER!!!

 Order Date: Feb 19, 2007


----------



## Shurado

Well, that's three months on the dot right there. If that keeps up, I should have my Supermini in August!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PPkiller* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_guys.. i have a good news and a bad news...

 bad news is... Dr xin just went down into his dungeon...

 good news is... this is coming out.. 

 "
 a new SuperMacro-IV Reference Edition is coming out in few days, 
 you may consider that. Here is some info:

http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0036.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0037.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0038.jpg
http://www.fixup.net/products/re/IMGP0049.jpg
 "_

 

I opened a thread on just this new toy.


----------



## nickknutson

I added a SuperMacro-IV Reference Edition to my order and will get it next week!


----------



## justin2net

sorry to add to the confusion, but when do you think xin will finish the backlog; that is when i may consider his supermini.


----------



## dle4e_2005

Why not order it now?
 You could always change or cancel your order.

 I doubt he will ever clear the backlog soon due to orders being placed everyday.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *justin2net* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_sorry to add to the confusion, but when do you think xin will finish the backlog; that is when i may consider his supermini._

 

I wouldn't count on it happening any time soon...if ever.


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_MY CARD HAS FINALLY BEEN CHARGED FOR MY ORDER!!!

 Order Date: Feb 19, 2007_

 

Hmm... I really hope not many people ordered in March. There's a local meeting here in 5 weeks time and if my late April order can be...

 Alright, I know I'm not being realistic.


----------



## kiwirugby

Received at email from Xin on Friday, May 18th, about my SuperMicro with a receipt receievd on February 20th, saying, "should be shipped no later than next week. Xin"


----------



## aluren

ordered 1/27/07
 shipped 5/18/07

 finally!!! (originally ordered supermicro, but changed my order to xin reference amp.)


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ordered 1/27/07
 shipped 5/18/07

 finally!!! (originally ordered supermicro, but changed my order to xin reference amp.)_

 

Does he send you an email saying it was shipped? Or did you have to ask?


----------



## aluren

i had to ask before he sent me the tracking number... funny because my credit card wasn't charged yet... but speaking from a previous order, my card was charged about 2 weeks after i received my amp...


----------



## MrJingles

I ordered the SuperMini-IV on April 29th. I'll let you know when I receive it. Can't Wait!! (I guess I have no choice but wait!)


----------



## MrJingles

I just e-mailed Dr. Xin with my order number to see if he will respond with a delivery estimate. I'll keep everyone informed, if and when I receive a reply.


----------



## som4ew

SuperMacro4 max637+Reference amp
 Order Feb 9, 07 will be shipped May 21, 07


----------



## aluren

so now it finally looks like xin is in production mode again. congrats to everyone (me included) on getting our amps soon!


----------



## sWirL

really looking forward to it......i ordered on 24th April! Patiently waiting!!


----------



## srikeerthi

Cool! Order date has come till feb 9th.. March 1st date (my order) is just 3 weeks away


----------



## fl00r

I ordered mine March 8.....


----------



## MrJingles

Hey everyone, I just received this from Dr. Xin:
 "Should ne within 2-3 weeks. Thank you, Xin"
 I ordered the Mini-IV on April 29th. Let's hope he is somewhat accurate. If so, only a couple of months wait time.


----------



## aluren

YES!! just tracked my package through USPS and it's arrived! can't wait to check it out after work.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_YES!! just tracked my package through USPS and it's arrived! can't wait to check it out after work._

 

Nice! Can't wait to hear your impressions...and pics?


----------



## naamanf

Placed my order on the Feb 20th for a Macro. Heard nothing yet. But I did add a RE to the order


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Placed my order on the Feb 20th for a Macro. Heard nothing yet. But I did add a RE to the order
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Your order should be shipped at the same time as mine...I ordered on Feb 19th. I emailed Xin and he said my amps will be going out today.
 So, good news for you.


----------



## naamanf

Oh that really sucks. I am in the field doing Army stuff for the next three weeks.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey everyone, I just received this from Dr. Xin:
 "Should ne within 2-3 weeks. Thank you, Xin"
 I ordered the Mini-IV on April 29th. Let's hope he is somewhat accurate. If so, only a couple of months wait time._

 

Hi,

 I got the same quoted reply yesterday, my order was on April 2nd.
 If this is actually happens then GREAT!! lol, but 2-3 weeks is the time Dr Xin has been quoting all the time.......even when he wasnt in production mode (at least I think he kept quoting this time, if I am incorrect my apologies).
 But lets hope he is back on full form and quoted time is real


----------



## vorlon1

Ordered 2-7-07, arrived today. This is a light blue one and it is almost transparent. Here are four angles of it.


----------



## sWirL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey everyone, I just received this from Dr. Xin:
 "Should ne within 2-3 weeks. Thank you, Xin"
 I ordered the Mini-IV on April 29th. Let's hope he is somewhat accurate. If so, only a couple of months wait time._

 

OMG....hope it will really be that soon! but wait...i ordered a go-vibe to last me through the wait but it will be arriving next week. aRgh....


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered 2-7-07, arrived today. This is a light blue one and it is almost transparent. Here are four angles of it.




















_

 

Nice looking amp you have there Vorlon1. Saturday we will be comparing that sucker to the "Xin Reference" I received today.


----------



## PPkiller

use rechargable.. hear it sounds better


----------



## kiwirugby

Order Date: February 20, 2007

 Shipping Date: None

 Receipt: May 23rd, 2007

 Time: 98 days

 I'm never coming back to head-fi......!


----------



## kiwirugby

Should have said ordered a SuperMicro. Sorry.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kiwirugby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm never coming back to head-fi......!_

 

Hehe you only lasted 2 minutes


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hehe you only lasted 2 minutes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I did didn't I??? And I am back again!!! This place is killing me.

 Just started to listen to the SuperMicro (1st gen. Nano 4gb, ALO Cryo micro and DJ81s) and what an amzing sound this is....for something this tiny! Full and resonant. Goodness!

 For all those waiting.....you're in for some seriously good listening whatever Xin amp you have coming. Soon!


----------



## jamato8

The amp I don't see many people talking about is the Mini IV. I have one now and it is incredible. I love the size and feel but the sound . . . . Boston never sounded much better.


----------



## mlarn

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The amp I don't see many people talking about is the Mini IV. I have one now and it is incredible. I love the size and feel but the sound . . . . Boston never sounded much better._

 

Do you think the Mini IV has now "caught up" with the Micro IV? It seemed like the Micro always got the better reviews around here, but post 4/11 power mods Xin seemed to think the others had caught the Micro. Do you find this?


----------



## jamato8

I don't know right now as they both need to break in more. The Mini sounds different and is a different circuit but it sound very good. The Micro seems to have that big open sound that is so much fun and in good recordings, very real.


----------



## marscay

Ordered Feb 8
 Received May 24

 I actually emailed Xin and cancelled my order as i ended up buying a Tomahawk from Ray but i never got a reply and i just decided if it turned up well i'd just deal with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have to say i am pretty well blown away with it after only using it for 30 mins so far, size v performance well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait till i can put a couple of hundred hours into it and open it up like my tomahawk.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *marscay* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Feb 8
 Received May 24

 I actually emailed Xin and cancelled my order as i ended up buying a Tomahawk from Ray but i never got a reply and i just decided if it turned up well i'd just deal with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have to say i am pretty well blown away with it after only using it for 30 mins so far, size v performance well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait till i can put a couple of hundred hours into it and open it up like my tomahawk.











_

 

Congratulations! you're in the same boat like me. It would be interesting to see how your SMIV compares with RSA Tomahawk.

 Well most of you already know which amp I decided to keep in the end. Let's see how it work for you. Enjoy!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *marscay* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Feb 8
 Received May 24

 I actually emailed Xin and cancelled my order as i ended up buying a Tomahawk from Ray but i never got a reply and i just decided if it turned up well i'd just deal with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have to say i am pretty well blown away with it after only using it for 30 mins so far, size v performance well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait till i can put a couple of hundred hours into it and open it up like my tomahawk.











_

 

Congrratulations! I did the comparison and I know which is my favorite! Although both could have a purpose. BTW IMO the Supermicro IV needs about 100 hours or so of burn in. Maybe even less.


----------



## marscay

i think i have a pretty good idea which amp i like the best already 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 just put rockbox onto my 5.5g 80gb tonight too, it's been a long wait 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but a good week for portable audio for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 what do you guys recommend for burn-in radio/pink/white/random playlists ???


----------



## ElDanno

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *marscay* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Feb 8
 Received May 24

 I actually emailed Xin and cancelled my order as i ended up buying a Tomahawk from Ray but i never got a reply and i just decided if it turned up well i'd just deal with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have to say i am pretty well blown away with it after only using it for 30 mins so far, size v performance well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait till i can put a couple of hundred hours into it and open it up like my tomahawk._

 

I have an Imod Ipod on the way and ordered a XIN SuperMicro last week. Not sure i can wait 3 months...might have to get the Tomahawk as well.

 Is there a big difference between the Tomahawk and the SuperMicro IV?


----------



## Wildcard30

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ElDanno* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have an Imod Ipod on the way and ordered a XIN SuperMicro last week. Not sure i can wait 3 months...might have to get the Tomahawk as well.

 Is there a big difference between the Tomahawk and the SuperMicro IV?_

 

Thats what I did still waiting for my Supermicro emailed xin he said 2 to 3 weeks.


----------



## ElDanno

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wildcard30* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thats what I did still waiting for my Supermicro emailed xin he said 2 to 3 weeks.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Amps orderered in Feb are shipping now.

 He is an optimistic sorta guy by the sounds of it, or he can really crank them out when he is at full steam


----------



## Wildcard30

Ordered mine beginning of April.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ElDanno* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...Is there a big difference between the Tomahawk and the SuperMicro IV?_

 

IMO yes, it is huge in soundstage, detail, and clarity. With the Supermicro IV being the better one.


----------



## MrJingles

What's the burn in time for the Xin Mini-IV? I should be getting mine in a couple of weeks. Thanks.


----------



## ChickenGod

May 23, 2007 @*%(&@(%*@&%)@(*&%@*%&)@% PLEASE COME SOON!


----------



## shiezan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *marscay* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Feb 8
 Received May 24

 I actually emailed Xin and cancelled my order as i ended up buying a Tomahawk from Ray but i never got a reply and i just decided if it turned up well i'd just deal with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I have to say i am pretty well blown away with it after only using it for 30 mins so far, size v performance well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 can't wait till i can put a couple of hundred hours into it and open it up like my tomahawk.











_

 


 i see a e500 in the pic. how does it sound with the supermicro? how do other amps compare against it? i also have a e500 and im expecting my supermicro to come in about 2-3 weeks.


----------



## tbmusic

May 8: Ordered a supermicro
 Today: Can't decide among the Supermicro, the Supermini and the Reference

 I can order all three but I must also eat.

 Ahhhhh


----------



## Mr Do

I ordered a *BLACK* SuperMicro IV from Xin on May 25, 07.

 I emailed him about using a black case from here. Scroll down to see case. Should not be a problem if specified in the comment section of payment. 






 Enjoy.
 Do!


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbmusic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_May 8: Ordered a supermicro
 Today: Can't decide among the Supermicro, the Supermini and the Reference

 I can order all three but I must also eat.

 Ahhhhh_

 


 Happened to me a while ago but this helped calm me down. Hope it does the same to you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=239647


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't know right now as they both need to break in more. The Mini sounds different and is a different circuit but it sound very good. The Micro seems to have that big open sound that is so much fun and in good recordings, very real._

 

jamato, my decision between Micro and Mini lies on your shoulders. How much different is the sound? What do you mean by your above statement that you can't believe the Mini isn't being talked about... and aren't the Micro and Mini the *same* circuitry?

 Thanks for making my decision!


----------



## tbmusic

Thanks SONGsanmanwah!

 I think that I will wait for the reviews of the amps by Vorlon1 and Jamato8. For now, I am sticking with the supermicro. 

 pre 4/11: micro for sure
 post 4/11: 50% micro vs 50% mini
 now: 40% micro vs 30% mini vs 30% reference
 next week: I don't even want to think about it


----------



## dle4e_2005

While ordering: 60% micro vs 40% mini
 Yesterday: 40% micro vs 45% Reference vs 15% mini
 After reading review: 50% micro vs 35% Reference vs 15% Mini

 The percentage might change once there is a review on the new board for Reference by Xin.


----------



## grndslm

Soo....the post-4/11 crew still believes the SuperMicro wins the Best Sound Award??

 Can any of you (post-4/11 crew *only*) give me a greater insight as to how the SuperMini sounds differently (in addition to being less spacious, or is it too similar to notice, and what opamps do you have?), as it is the only other amp I will consider due to the size (Ref is too large for me)??

 Thanks for your opinions, guys!


----------



## goto2003

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Soo....the post-4/11 crew still believes the SuperMicro wins the Best Sound Award??

 Can any of you (post-4/11 crew *only*) give me a greater insight as to how the SuperMini sounds differently (in addition to being less spacious, or is it too similar to notice, and what opamps do you have?), as it is the only other amp I will consider due to the size (Ref is too large for me)??

 Thanks for your opinions, guys!_

 

Post 4/11 till 5/19 Mini has different circurt scheme from Micro, though they share the same DC-DC boost circurt. That said, they sound different. Post 5/19 Mini would sound closer to Micro; Now Xin's in developmnet mode as he has decided to redesign Mini/Macro/LE using the scheme of Micro. I think post June 1st Mini would sound very similar to Micro, if not the same.


----------



## grndslm

Dang! More waiting, but for a better cause if it's going to give the Mini's extra cost a purpose!

 I'm soooo glad that I ordered 6 weeks ago.


----------



## dle4e_2005

Anybody received their Xin amp recently?


----------



## tracyrick

So is the Reference essentially a Micro that is built like a tank plus a large capacitor? What will a person be missing now by buying a Micro (for its small size) instead of a Reference?


----------



## vexeus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dle4e_2005* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anybody received their Xin amp recently?_

 

I think he stopped production to tweak the reference. But I'm judging that only by the lack of posts in this thread.


----------



## jamato8

The Reference isn't the Micro in a bigger case. Xin wants the Reference to stand on its own and be uncompromising in sound. The Micro is great but the Reference can be even more.


----------



## jjb

Has Xin ever considered farming out his production so he can concentrate on development I wonder ?

 The sporadic, variable production with a months long wait is holding me back from ordering one.


----------



## Mr Do

2 weeks and still counting on my Supermicro IV.
 sigh....

 later.
 Do!


----------



## grndslm

Start shipping, Xin!!

 If you really need an extra $5/amp to cover fees for assembly peons, go for it. Just think of all the extra orders you'd make from no one dissing your customer service (which actually is amazingly fast when he isn't in research mode).

 DAMN research mode!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Start shipping, Xin!!

 If you really need an extra $5/amp to cover fees for assembly peons, go for it. Just think of all the extra orders you'd make from no one dissing your customer service (which actually is amazingly fast when he isn't in research mode).

 DAMN research mode!_

 

Do not forget free upgrades even if you are not the original owner.


----------



## Zaroff

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jjb* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The sporadic, variable production with a months long wait is holding me back from ordering one._

 

Ditto.


----------



## Mr Do

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Do not forget free upgrades even if you are not the original owner. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That makes absolutely no sense to me that someone can buy a used amp for less and have it upgraded for free. It probably would have been quicker to get the amp that way. Anyone know if upgrading is a quicker turn around then buying a new amp? 

 Do!


----------



## Wildcard30

I just got a Supermicro IV from someone on Head-Fi and wow does it sound great and it only has about 10 hrs on it. I must burn it in now.


----------



## Mr Do

Wildcard30 your an evil man. I could have looked used but I wanted a black case. What headphones are you using? You'll probably be able to have your amp upgraded before I receive my new one in *black* of course.


----------



## Wildcard30

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wildcard30 your an evil man. I could have looked used but I wanted a black case. What headphones are you using? You'll probably be able to have your amp upgraded before I receive my new one in *black* of course._

 

I am using my E500's with it and right off the bat I like the sound better then my Hornet and I still have my order in for a reference and a black supermicro IV from the beginning of April have not decided whether to cancel or not yet.


----------



## jamato8

The Reference is built on the concept of the Micro so if you like the Micro you will really like the Reference. I can't imagine why someone would get rid of the Micro with only 10 hours of use. They have no idea what they passed up.


----------



## Wildcard30

Just from the short time I have spent with it I can't believe how great the soundstage is.


----------



## jamato8

Yep, it is unbelievable. Such a tiny package. I would be happy with the Micro and nothing else. One battery and no real worries. Carry a couple of extra batteries that take a few seconds to change and you can go for many days.


----------



## Wildcard30

thanks I will be sure to do that it is amazing what is in this tiny package.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wildcard30* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got a Supermicro IV from someone on Head-Fi and wow does it sound great and it only has about 10 hrs on it. I must burn it in now._

 







 Im soooooooooooooo jealous!! Lol, Im waiting, and waiting and waiting....... :'(


----------



## Wildcard30




----------



## MrJingles

I ordered the Mini-IV on April 19th, received e-mail May 21st that it would be ready in 2-3 weeks....keeping my fingers crossed!


----------



## Mr Do

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yep, it is unbelievable. Such a tiny package. I would be happy with the Micro and nothing else. One battery and no real worries. Carry a couple of extra batteries that take a few seconds to change and you can go for many days._

 

Can you recommend a AAA battery? I was planning on getting a *ACCUPOWER 1200MAH AAA - 2PK*
 Any idea how long a rechargeable will last compared to an alkaline battery?

 Thanks.
 Do!


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can you recommend a AAA battery? I was planning on getting a *ACCUPOWER 1200MAH AAA - 2PK*
 Any idea how long a rechargeable will last compared to an alkaline battery?

 Thanks.
 Do!_

 

Dr Xin reccomended eneloop rechargables for the supermicro.

 For battery life see my post: battery life


----------



## Mr Do

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dr Xin reccomended eneloop rechargables for the supermicro.

 For battery life see my post: battery life_

 

Hey, thanks. Exactly what I needed.
 I just picked up a Eneloop AAA NiMH 800 mAh 4pack from amazon.com with my $30 amazon credit.

 Do!


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered the Mini-IV on April 19th, received e-mail May 21st that it would be ready in 2-3 weeks....keeping my fingers crossed!_

 

Strange...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered mine March 8 and haven't heard from Xin since.


----------



## young&wild

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Strange...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered mine March 8 and haven't heard from Xin since. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You're probably not alone. I ordered mine around March 1st/2nd. I have yet to heard a word from Dr Xin.


----------



## mp101

ordered mine just over 1 week ago, no response yet, I even emailed and asked for an estimated build date, no reply.

 Yet strangely enough, I had a reply to 2 other questions within 1 hour, all before I placed the order.


----------



## fl00r

One thing I learnt from this whole Xin adventure is that he has a selective and unfathomable way of communicating


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One thing I learnt from this whole Xin adventure is that he has a selective and unfathomable way of communicating 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Lol, very true. Look dont worry all you guys, Xin just seems to go in and out of research mode, hence slwoing down production at random times. I also got that 2/3 week estimate from Dr. Xin, which if it is true then great!!

 But either way end of the month is my 3 month mark anyway so I would expect then.

 You March guys should be getting yours soon hopefully.


----------



## fl00r

Thanks Kabeer , you really know how to put fresh heart into me! Just what I needed


----------



## ChickenGod

What about me!? I'm a late May person T_T Should have ordered earlier. It took me like 2 weeks to figure out which amp I was gonna buy. I just blindly chose the SuperMicro 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I hope its well worth the wait!


----------



## Wildcard30

The Supermicro is a great sounding amp you will not be disappointed.


----------



## ChickenGod

Thats good to hear


----------



## Skinny Ho

I am in hong Kong. I placed my order for Supermicro and haven't received it yet.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skinny Ho* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am in hong Kong. I placed my order for Supermicro and haven't received it yet._

 

don't worry, 99% of xin customers that placed orders recently haven't gotten their amps either...


----------



## GreenLeo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skinny Ho* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am in hong Kong. I placed my order for Supermicro and haven't received it yet._

 

When did you order it? Has Dr. Xin charged you yet?


----------



## Skinny Ho

Sorry, I forgot to state the day I ordered the Supermicro, it was February 23. It is more than 3 months now.


----------



## jacob23

If xin don't ship them since 6/1(Newest&last tweak), my SuperMacro might be the latest batch.
 Ordered 2/16/07
 Charged 5/18/07
 Shipped 5/29/07
 Arrived 6/7/07


----------



## PbR

Well!! Jumped into the SMIV bandwagon today. Let the wait begin....


----------



## jpnz

I think Xin should just stop with the "free upgrades" to shorten the wait time.


----------



## Mr Do

I couldn't wait any longer for my SuperMicro IV so I bought a new Tomahawk about a minute ago. This should last me till I receive my SuperMicro in 3 months. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Do!


----------



## GreenLeo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I couldn't wait any longer for my SuperMicro IV so I bought a new Tomahawk about a minute ago. This should last me till I receive my SuperMicro in 3 months. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Do!_

 

What a smart move! That's what I did before.


----------



## CAvanessia

i had a question for people who have bought from Xin before. does Dr. Xin produce the amps in huge quantities for a brief period of time and then go back into development for a long time?

 I placed an order a week ago. Suppose Dr. Xin goes into production this very second, would it be possible for him to produce the backlog of orders from 4 months ago until today's orders (i.e. including me)? Or maybe he'll only produce X (lets say 50) then disappear again for four months?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *CAvanessia* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i had a question for people who have bought from Xin before. does Dr. Xin produce the amps in huge quantities for a brief period of time and then go back into development for a long time?

 I placed an order a week ago. Suppose Dr. Xin goes into production this very second, would it be possible for him to produce the backlog of orders from 4 months ago until today's orders (i.e. including me)? Or maybe he'll only produce X (lets say 50) then disappear again for four months?_

 

When Dr. Xin goes in production mode it is amazing the number of amps he can make in one day, let alone in a week/month. I hope he goes out of research mode soon.


----------



## mp101

I couldn't wait, ordered a Hornet now (red), I know Ive only been waiting 2 weeks, but still no acknowledgement from him.

 I know the guys busy, and try not to hassle him.


----------



## kokohore

Ordered Supermini Mar/04/2007... 108 days and no word from Xin.
 Any of you March guys heard anything?


----------



## vexeus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Supermini Mar/04/2007... 108 days and no word from Xin.
 Any of you March guys heard anything? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Ordered mine March 8th and no word yet.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered mine March 8th and no word yet._

 

Same date, not a single word....


----------



## srikeerthi

I ordered on March 1st. Still waiting... But I've got used to it now, I don't waiting a couple of weeks more, then I'd get anxious too


----------



## kokohore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered on March 1st. Still waiting... But I've got used to it now, I don't waiting a couple of weeks more, then I'd get anxious too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I'm getting used to waiting too, it's not always bad.
 Even if I finally get the supermini, I still have *Westone 3* to wait...


----------



## ChickenGod

It's been one month and some days since I ordered mine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ordered 5/13/07


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Do you guys/gals knows if Xin sends out an automatic email confirmation acknowledging your order? I don't think I got one, which makes me feel a little uneasy, and I can't remember my exact order date.


----------



## jamato8

No, normally no email from what I know.


----------



## GSurge

You guys must be crazy...


----------



## Sinsen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Do you guys/gals knows if Xin sends out an automatic email confirmation acknowledging your order? I don't think I got one, which makes me feel a little uneasy, and I can't remember my exact order date._

 

I got an email confirmation...


----------



## rxc

Supermicro

 Ordered Feb. 10

 Arrived around the beginning of June.

 No confirmation email but Xin did include a napkin in the box presumably to wipe off the drool.


----------



## ChickenGod

Oh really? No confirmation? Shoot, I should have ordered with a Credit Card instead of Paypal T_T


----------



## Mr Do

Argh!!! I ordered a RSA Tomahawk June 15th to last me till my SuperMicro IV arrives. No word on the Tomahawk either. What! With my luck I 'll get them both around Christmas 2008. Now I'm frustrated. $510 spent with nothing to show for. Any ideas on how long RSA takes?

 Thanks.
 Do!


----------



## chowk

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Argh!!! I ordered a RSA Tomahawk June 15th to last me till my SuperMicro IV arrives. No word on the Tomahawk either. What! With my luck I 'll get them both around Christmas 2008. Now I'm frustrated. $510 spent with nothing to show for. Any ideas on how long RSA takes?

 Thanks.
 Do!_

 

Ray usually ships the following business day (provided stock is available). If you're outside the US, there's a pretty good chance it's held up in customs.


----------



## Mr Do

I live in the U.S. The only email I got was saying that I owed him $8.27 for paypal fees. I sent him the $8.27 on June 17th. I've emailed him 3 times since with no response. What! My guess is he's out of stock. What I don't understand is why he's hasn't let me know what is going on. It just bugs me the only response I've gotten was a request for more money. I understand it was my fault for not sending the correct amount and I do not blame him for that. I guess I'm spoiled because I've dealt with RWA and ALO with the best service ever.

 DO!


----------



## Wildcard30

Give Ray a call he will answer all of your questions he's a really nice guy to deal with.


----------



## Mr Do

Maybe I will. I'm sure he's a pleasure to deal with but I hate to sound like I'm nagging him. I'm just bummed because now I'm waiting for two amps.

 Thanks.
 Do!


----------



## Wildcard30

It is just the next logical step if he hasn't responded to your emails you have a right to know if and when it was shipped.


----------



## Mr Do

I just tried calling him but no answer and no machine... this is classic. The God's are against me... sigh. Now it's the weekend and I'm not sure he'll be around on Saturday.. lol!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Bummer.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just tried calling him but no answer and no machine... this is classic. The God's are against me... sigh. Now it's the weekend and I'm not sure he'll be around on Saturday.. lol!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Bummer.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hey bro, I understand your feelings, but I wouldn't freak out. As you know Ray's turnaround times are usually excellent, so if he's not answering emails or returning phone calls, he's probably just away right now on vacation or a business trip.


----------



## Mr Do

Funny.
 I was just thinking that and said the same thing to a friend of mine whom was giving me a hard time. I respect Xin and Ray very highly and just amused at the situation I'm in. My friend thinks I'm crazy but I guess to be a true Headfier you have to be a little crazy. Thanks for letting me rant. I'm done. I can't wait to post pics of my rig when it's complete. I hope others receive there amps soon as well.

 Enjoy.
 Do!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

LOL, maybe ray and xin are vacationing together and laughing it up.


----------



## Mr Do

Ray's back from vacation LOL!!!
 He just sent me a fed ex tracking #.... wooh hooh!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Do!


----------



## grndslm

Xin must have forgotten about us!

 Oh no NO!


----------



## jamato8

No, Xin has not forgotten you. He just wants the amp to be perfect.. . there is nothing that is truly perfect . . . oh no. . .


----------



## bluey_02

Oh oh oh, I sent an email off to Xin on Monday asking when I'd receive my SuperMicro that I ordered 2nd of March (!) and he said he was sorry and processing the next batch and mine was in it! Ok so no mention of how long that would take but it is better than nothing. And to think I'd almost given up any hope of seeing my amp before October.. Suffice to say I am excited.

 Can anyone guess when it'll arrive?


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Nevermind, I was wrong. I thoroughly checked my email records and discovered that I DID receive a confirmation email for my order. Score one point for Xin's customer service! That brings his score up from -23 to -22


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Take heart! Dr.Xin said this 2 days ago: 

 Posted - 06/26/2007 : 17:56:38 
 I've been holding shipment, as I've been working on the latest tweaks which will improve all amps not just the Reference.


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SONGsanmanwah* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Take heart! Dr.Xin said this 2 days ago: 

 Posted - 06/26/2007 : 17:56:38 
 I've been holding shipment, as I've been working on the latest tweaks which will improve all amps not just the Reference._

 






 LOL!! It never ends... I guess this is the final latest last update? Bahaha..

 Maybe you guys should just buy concert tickets and see live events! That's about as perfect as it gets! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Bahahaha!!


----------



## jamato8

Sometimes there's too many people being obnoxious at live events. So what do you do, fight? When everyone hears, if you choose to purchase one, the Reference, it will be well worth it.


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sometimes there's too many people being obnoxious at live events. So what do you do, fight? When everyone hears, if you choose to purchase one, the Reference, it will be well worth it._

 

LOL! What kind of live events do you go to??? Stop going to Slayer and Celtic Frost concerts... I never seen a brawl take place at a Wynton Marsalis event! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But, if you must go to "those" type of concerts, then I would suggest a case of bud lite BEFORE the event, that'll get ya in the mood! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm sure the Reference will sound superb when it's finally "perfected"...


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ I'm sure the Reference will sound superb when it's finally "perfected"... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

That should be about around the time when the Westone 3 finally comes out, eh Morph?


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL! What kind of live events do you go to??? Stop going to Slayer and Celtic Frost concerts... I never seen a brawl take place at a Wynton Marsalis event! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I've never seen a fight at a concert either... like Bonnaroo, Voodoo Fest, JazzFest. jamato must be a thug or somethin'.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But, if you must go to "those" type of concerts, then I would suggest a case of bud lite BEFORE the event, that'll get ya in the mood! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

... At least drink Budweiser and get your money's worth. Who would want a headphone lite?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm sure the Reference will sound superb when it's finally "perfected"... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It better because Armageddon's coming later this year, and I might never get to hear this amp that I lust for daily!


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SONGsanmanwah* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Take heart! Dr.Xin said this 2 days ago: 

 Posted - 06/26/2007 : 17:56:38 
 I've been holding shipment, as I've been working on the latest tweaks which will improve all amps not just the Reference._

 

Lol!! Wow, even more improvements! I guess thats always a good thing. I hope my order is in the next batch too (ordered Apr 3rd).


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've never seen a fight at a concert either... like Bonnaroo, Voodoo Fest, JazzFest. jamato must be a thug or somethin'.

 ... At least drink Budweiser and get your money's worth. Who would want a headphone lite?

 It better because Armageddon's coming later this year, and I might never get to hear this amp that I lust for daily! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hahaha!! I hear with this next improvement, you flip a switch and your favourite artist pops OUT of the amp and performs RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF YOU!!


----------



## bluey_02

You know, I don't think I'll ever sell my SuperMicro when it arrives just because of how long it's take to arrive..


----------



## PPkiller

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hahaha!! I hear with this next improvement, you flip a switch and your favourite artist pops OUT of the amp and performs RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF YOU!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

/me play my sexy lady


----------



## jamato8

My referal to a fight was something no one would know about unless I explained it. I went to a live event and there were some obnoxious drunks there. The woman I was with expected me to get up and face off with them. I thought, your as stupid as they are why would I want to get in a fight, to impress you? I never saw them or her again.


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My referal to a fight was something no one would know about unless I explained it. I went to a live event and there were some obnoxious drunks there. The woman I was with expected me to get up and face off with them. I thought, your as stupid as they are why would I want to get in a fight, to impress you? I never saw them or her again._

 

Off Topic: That was very smart of you... If you don't mind me asking, who was the headliner at this event?


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

My card is not charged until my amp shipped so, it's not like he's ripping me off. I don't know. If he offers an option of immediate charge and getting amp in fixed time but without any future free upgrade, do you think many people would take that?


----------



## BushGuy

Jamato8 - you didn't think thru the situation. Obviously they were record company execs. and a RIAA guy. They deserved a beat-down. After you successfully become a "hero"....................only then do you dump da broad. Then, she will have learned what she lost.


----------



## ChickenGod

98&@*!&$*!&$!&$!(^$ Grrr! I am leaving out of the country on July 30th and I don't want my Xin SuperMicro IV to arrive at my dad's office because his co-workers will toy around with it. I sent e-mails to Xin for 3 days already and no reply! Should I send a 4th? I don't really want to annoy him because I know he's a busy man and stuff but I really need an answer...


----------



## jamato8

Put in the subject line, "Please answer this". I don't know if it will work but maybe it will get his attention. Why would coworkers open up a package that is not theirs? I have lived in many different countries and cultures and I have not found this to a practice anywhere. 

 I think the Micro is also awaiting the improvements fromt he Reference line.


----------



## ChickenGod

Well like not open it up but like put the box in places and lose it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Alright I'll try that title. Thanks!


----------



## shiezan

I ordered my xin supermicro sometime in march, and it still hasnt come in.
 should i switch the order to a tomahawk?

 which of the 2 amps would go best with my e500?
 im planning on using them with my iMod.


----------



## Wildcard30

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered my xin supermicro sometime in march, and it still hasnt come in.
 should i switch the order to a tomahawk?

 which of the 2 amps would go best with my e500?
 im planning on using them with my iMod._

 

Both sound great with the E500 but the Supermicro definately sounds better IMO.


----------



## dissembled

To clarify..it's best to order AFTER August when the Reference is released to skip the 5 month wait? 
 Or to wait until the next batch of improved Xins come in? I'm guessing that's in August as well?

 When will Xin's research mode 'turn off' exactly?


----------



## jamato8

So why did the scorpion sting the frog as they crossed the river causing them both to drown? It was his nature.


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So why did the scorpion sting the frog as they crossed the river causing them both to drown? It was his nature._

 






 ??


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_





 ??_

 

"When will Xin's research mode 'turn off' exactly?"


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So why did the scorpion sting the frog as they crossed the river causing them both to drown? It was his nature._

 

I thought it was a fox (frog)?


----------



## jamato8

Different cultures, different animals. The fox, turtle, frog, duck, . . . all drowned but it was always the scorpion's nature. :^)


----------



## Kabeer

Well iv hit 3 months as well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I really want the supermicro soon lol. I hope Dr. Xin doesnt stay in reasearch mode for long.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *SONGsanmanwah* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My card is not charged until my amp shipped so, it's not like he's ripping me off. I don't know. If he offers an option of immediate charge and getting amp in fixed time but without any future free upgrade, do you think many people would take that?_

 

I don't think it would be in his nature to do something like that. He's more like an artist than a businessman so when the research urge grabs him he just has to go that way regardless.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

...god bless artists, but this guy is running a business and needs to hire somebody to handle assembly, shipments, etc. Then he can do research to his heart's content, and he'll probably double or triple his business in the meantime...

 but yeah yeah, i know, scorpion's nature and all that crap... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I guess it's just a matter of deciding whether or not you want to be the frog.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...god bless artists, but this guy is running a business and needs to hire somebody to handle assembly, shipments, etc. Then he can do research to his heart's content, and he'll probably double or triple his business in the meantime...

 but yeah yeah, i know, scorpion's nature and all that crap... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I guess it's just a matter of deciding whether or not you want to be the frog._

 

I think he is of the opinon that nobody else can do the assembly job to the standards he wants and I also think he still is a little gun shy from the SuperDual debacle some years back.


----------



## BushGuy

One of the beauties of sole proprietership - is that you run a business as you so choose. Who is anyone on any forum to tell a proprieter how he should run his business. I have had 3 amps from Dr. Xin and have absolutely no problems with him and how he runs his business. I strongly suggest critics should create a product and a business, and we'll see how YOU choose to run it..........and then we'll have the opportunity to judge YOUR success......or abject failure.


----------



## Morph201

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One of the beauties of sole proprietership - is that you run a business as you so choose. Who is anyone on any forum to tell a proprieter how he should run his business. I have had 3 amps from Dr. Xin and have absolutely no problems with him and how he runs his business. I strongly suggest critics should create a product and a business, and we'll see how YOU choose to run it..........and then we'll have the opportunity to judge YOUR success......or abject failure._

 

It's all about customer service... i.e. the CUSTOMER is always right.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Morph201* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's all about customer service... i.e. the CUSTOMER is always right. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Wrong! a Paying Customer is right most of the time!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I strongly suggest critics should create a product and a business, and we'll see how YOU choose to run it.........._

 

LOL, ok I'm going to do that. Want to know my business plan? I'm going to buy bulk supplies of Dr. Xin's amps and then sell them on Head-Fi with immediate shipping and a 300% markup! How's that sound? Seriously, I bet people would pay more to get around that wait... I know I would 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One of the beauties of sole proprietership - is that you run a business as you so choose. Who is anyone on any forum to tell a proprieter how he should run his business. I have had 3 amps from Dr. Xin and have absolutely no problems with him and how he runs his business._

 

You're right, who am I to offer any suggestions, or have an opinion, about anything really? Especially on a forum...

 Main Entry: fo·rum
 Function: noun
 Etymology: Latin; akin to Latin foris outside, fores door 
 1 a : the marketplace or *public place* of an ancient Roman city forming the center of judicial and *public business* b : a *public meeting place for open discussion* c : a medium (as a newspaper or online service) of *open discussion or expression of ideas* 

 Interesting, a quick look at Webster's now has me wondering: who are you on any forum to say I can't? Look guy, relax... I'm not saying Xin's business model isn't working for him. Obviously it is, as he's still in business. I also have a SuperMicro on order, so it hasn't kept me from becoming a paying customer. But that doesn't mean I have to like it! It doesn't mean I can't lobby, as a paying customer, for system change. It's called customer feedback, it encourages invention and competition, and it generally results in more innovations and better products/services.


----------



## dissembled

Xin's amps are undoubetedly one of the best amps out there. The Supermicro as small as it is manages to dethrone the bigger players out there that cost 3x more. Excellent value no doubt.

 That plastic Supermicro case though....WHOO! $10! Has anyone managed to make a custom case for the Micro? Would love to pay for one of those instead.


----------



## rxc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dissembled* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin's amps are undoubetedly one of the best amps out there. The Supermicro as small as it is manages to dethrone the bigger players out there that cost 3x more. Excellent value no doubt.

 That plastic Supermicro case though....WHOO! $10! Has anyone managed to make a custom case for the Micro? Would love to pay for one of those instead._

 

I think Xin's Supermicro case is pretty customized. The hole for the volume wheel appears to be cut out by hand.


----------



## Mr Do

At first I thought the case price was excessive but now I'm not so sure. Yeah, the case alone is cheap but the labor of installing the amp and the skill to modify the case by hand is undefinable. I can't do it and to complain about spending $10 is kind of silly. If you want a custom case DIY or spend someone else way more then $10 for there time, skill, shipping, and better materials if you like.

 Do!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Can anyone that owns the case comment on how much additional size/weight it adds to the amp (SMIV)?


----------



## Mr Do

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can anyone that owns the case comment on how much additional size/weight it adds to the amp (SMIV)?_

 

You should be asking how much weight the amp adds to the case. The case weighs almost nothing. Here is a good link for size and weight specs.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered a *BLACK* SuperMicro IV from Xin on May 25, 07.

 I emailed him about using a black case from here. Scroll down to see case. Should not be a problem if specified in the comment section of payment. 







 Enjoy.
 Do!_


----------



## rxc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mr Do* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You should be asking how much weight the amp adds to the case. The case weighs almost nothing. Here is a good link for size and weight specs._

 

You SHOULD be asking, how much weight the battery adds to the case and amp


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Well, come to think of it I don't have anything that was hand assembled by its designer in my possession. I sure will adore my Xin amp when it arrive.


----------



## dissembled

How's durable is the plastic case that comes with the Micro? Strong enough to overcome sporadic drops, I hope?


----------



## rxc

The walls of the Supermicro case is fairly thick and the case overall seems very durable. Can't say much about the sporadic drops though.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rxc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The walls of the Supermicro case is fairly thick and the case overall seems very durable. Can't say much about the sporadic drops though._

 

The case is think and the amp is lite. I just dropped it from about 4 feet but I think you would have to throw it hard to break it. If you are in the habbit of thowing amps then I guess any of them would get chipped, dented or broken but since I don't think that is what you are asking, yes I think the case is quite strong for the application and day in and day out use with the occasional descent to the floor. How does the source like this? I think an iPod would show much more impact residual. I know my Sony portable cd player might not make it, even though it is metal.


----------



## ldj325

Does anyone have a working e-mail address for Dr. Xin (one that he tends to get and respond to--not a digital circular file) to ask about my amp ordered and paid via PayPal (my mistake) about 2 1/2 months ago?

 You can post here or PM me, which would be even better.

 Thanks


----------



## toopeach

Just be sure to follow closely his instruction:
 In subject put your order number and yur concern specifically.
 Use plain text format (no HTML format!)

 At least for me, this worked.


----------



## BushGuy

Yes, as toopeach just said. I've never (at least don't remember any lapses) had a problem when you do it that way.


----------



## MrJingles

I ordered mine April 15th and it's coming up on the 3 month mark. Just a FYI.


----------



## ChickenGod

Thats tax day and my friends birthday!


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered mine April 15th and it's coming up on the 3 month mark. Just a FYI._

 

I ordered mine April 12th 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. . . My 3 month mark will be tomorrow. I wonder how much longer 'til Xin gets everything "perfected". I wish he would give us some kinda notice on progress at least.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Xin proverb #7: When the student is ready, the teacher will appear... sometime between 3-4 months later, give or take.


----------



## vexeus

March 8th seems so long ago. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Anyone know what he's doing now?


----------



## jamato8

The power supply has made some very good advances. The wait should not be much longer but then again . . .


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The power supply has made some very good advances. The wait should not be much longer but then again . . ._

 

How do you know so much about Xin? I know you both live in Oregon, but do you test his stuff often and/or work with him?


----------



## jamato8

Living in Oregon doesn't help. He has been busy working and testing the power supply. I listen to some of his beta amps and give some feedback but Xin does all of his own work. From time to time I hear from him and I have visited him a couple of times.


----------



## Goh

What does this "power supply" refer to?


----------



## jamato8

The internal supply that any device has that is electrically powered. There are many strange things that electrons do on their way to completing their task and not having resonance frequencies and other nasties is one of the confounding issues of designing trully high end equipment. Everything can look good on paper with nice low ESR caps and figuring out at what frequency they work best and what does and what the current will and not carry since the AC musical signal is carried on the DC. You want to get the DC as pure as possible and there are so many interactions that the issue is not a simple or strateforward one. I even bypass by Black GAte caps but not with other types but only with BG's or the resonance problems can arrise. I find that BG caps play well together, esp. the nonpolar high Q ones.


----------



## kokohore

Ordered mine Mar/04/2007... now more than 4 months and still no word. I'd been thinking that the waiting would be between 3 and 4 months...
 What is the longest waiting record? 6 months? Or even more?


----------



## srikeerthi

Its been 138 days since I ordered my Supermicro. I think it will reach 150 days soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hoping that it will be all worth it.


----------



## nc8000

It will be worth it but that is one long frustrating wait, especially for those who paid with paypal and therefore have been without money and communication for so long. I know Xin is not good on communication but it bothers me because he gets a lot of flak he could avoid, but that is the way he is and not much anybody can do about it. It must be the artist rather than the business man in him. I often wonder how he can survive.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ I often wonder how he can survive._

 

Some say he feasts off the rotting flesh of dead men who ordered their amps decades ago but never lived to see the day...


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Some say he feasts off the rotting flesh of dead men who ordered their amps decades ago but never lived to see the day..._

 

I hope you mean that in jest, Dr. Xin has always delivered and has never stiffed anyone.


----------



## AudioDwebe

Will the wait time get reduced to something a bit more normal once he's done with developing the Reference? Or is it aways a "Pay now and get a pleasant surprise within a year" with Xin amps?

 I've read somewhere in the post that once he starts manufacturing the new amps he'll be able to assemble 50 a week. Wouldn't that make the wait time a week or two, tops? Or are his amps so in demand that there's thousands waiting in queue?


----------



## Goh

Does his email communication improve during production periods as well? If I wanted him to suggest a gain setting for the Reference, would he actually respond?


----------



## wakeride74

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AudioDwebe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Will the wait time get reduced to something a bit more normal once he's done with developing the Reference? Or is it aways a "Pay now and get a pleasant surprise within a year" with Xin amps?

 I've read somewhere in the post that once he starts manufacturing the new amps he'll be able to assemble 50 a week. Wouldn't that make the wait time a week or two, tops? Or are his amps so in demand that there's thousands waiting in queue?_

 

I think it's gotten worse... hopefully it will get better but when I first joined headfi and ordered my SMIII it took about 3 weeks IIRC and now people are passing the 4 month mark.

 It's really a shame because Xin makes a kick ass product but his obsessive tweak disorder seems to put his amps in a constant "incomplete" or "without the [insert date] mods" status and wait times continue to rise.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I hope you mean that in jest, Dr. Xin has always delivered and has never stiffed anyone._

 

I absolutely meant that in jest about people not receiving their amps. However, I am dead serious about Dr. Xin feasting on human flesh.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AudioDwebe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Or is it aways a "Pay now and get a pleasant surprise within a year" with Xin amps?_

 

This is only if you pay with paypal and no different to f.ex. the people who preordered Westone3's from Earphonesoloutions using paypal. If you order using credit card it will not be charged until the amp ships. 

 The "within a year" bit however unfortunately seems to be getting closer to reallity, it didn't use be like that. Before the IV amps his stated 2-3 weeks normally was correct. It reminds me a bit of a computer software project I worked on years ago for a customer. Everytime we were about to put it in production the customer would come back and say "we need just this little extra thing before it's just right". After 2 years of doing this and never getting the system in production DOS was out and Windows was in and the system was scraped. This ofcourse will not happen with a Xin amp but the process reminds.


----------



## tbmusic

Someone should tell Dr. Xin that there is no such thing as a "perfect amp". For a company, R&D should be interrupted by actual products going out to the customers. Intel and AMD must generate millions of chips knowing that a faster and better microprocessor is just around the corner.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbmusic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Someone should tell Dr. Xin that there is no such thing as a "perfect amp". For a company, R&D should be interrupted by actual products going out to the customers. Intel and AMD must generate millions of chips knowing that a faster and better microprocessor is just around the corner._

 

Dr. Xin already does what you are describing. He goes through periods of R&D while not shipping any amps, then switches to production mode and pumps out a large volume of amps to his customers. If you think about it, Intel and AMD never go out of research mode. I guarantee you that it's a nonstop process. The difference is that they have multiple departments, so that R&D can do its thing while the marketing department handles customer communications, the distribution schedules product shipments, the production department guarantees a number of units built, etc

 I don't think there's anything wrong with Xin's constant pursuit of the perfect amp... his compulsive tweaking disorder (LOL) is probably why his product is so damn good. In my view, the problem is that Dr. Xin is the only department. He is R&D, he is production, he is distribution. It sounds like this worked ok in the past (someone mentioned 2-3 weeks lead time) but 3-4 months really is a bit ridiculous. Does anyone know the reason for this? Is it because his amps have become more popular? Does Xin spend more time now tweaking than he used to? 

 I know a lot of people who want to try his amp but refuse to go through the wait. Does anyone (Jamato?) specifically know why Xin doesn't believe in hiring people for help with production? Did he have a bad experience with this in the past? Is he worried about trade secrets getting out? I believe he would see a significant boost in business by eliminating that lead time.


----------



## robk

I have a super macro III, and I want to send it in for upgrades, but I don't know how long I will be without it if I do. I would also like to get a reference amp and/or super micro IV, but I don't want to wait, so I haven't ordered them.

 When I got my III, I waited about 10 days between payment and receiving it. That included 2 weekend days, so only 8 business days.

 rob


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does anyone know the reason for this? Is it because his amps have become more popular? Does Xin spend more time now tweaking than he used to? 

 I know a lot of people who want to try his amp but refuse to go through the wait. Does anyone (Jamato?) specifically know why Xin doesn't believe in hiring people for help with production? Did he have a bad experience with this in the past? Is he worried about trade secrets getting out? I believe he would see a significant boost in business by eliminating that lead time._

 

It is my feeling that the last year or so he has been spending more and more time in R&D mode. I also remember him quit clearly stating on his own site some time ago that he does not beleive that anybody else (at least not anybody he can get hold of) can do the level of welding and assembly he can (and requires to be happy). Another reason could be that his installed base keeps growing and that multiplies the worklod when it comes to upgrading. And as to the "bad experience" he did have a bad one about 3 years ago with the SuperDual amp that he designed but somebody else were to produce and sell. I don't know the details of this but it definately went belly up. The result of that then was the first SuperMacro and he has stayed on his own since then.


----------



## GreenLeo

First of all, I am a new customer of Xin and my order submitted on 26 Apr 07 so I truly understand the feelings of have been waiting for nearly 3 months. 2ndly this is my first time to purchase an amp from Xin so I am not a fan of him if you like. This decision is solely based on my impressions from the thread of head-fi.

 However, I do want to speak something for Xin even though I don't know him personally nor have enjoyed any of his products so far. I THINK I understand why he's stopping in delivering Supermicro IV -- just because he knows that some unsolved problems are still there. It is better to deliver something that is complete rather than to deliver something that Xin knows that is of minor defects. Incidentally my order is also a Supermicro IV so I'm one who's waiting for Xin to fill his back order as well. Still I appreciate a manufacturer trying his best to deliver the best goods he has to the customer.

 For the payment business. Do not use the Paypal, as mentioned MANY times in this thread, and use credit card instead. Xin will not charge you until the delivery then.

 For who can afford to have two amps for a short while:
 Buying a Tomahawk from Sam or a Move from Jan or what so ever and then wait for the Xin amp patiently is the only way and MAY be the best way. That's what I did. You may sell the other amp after the Xin amp arrives and your comparison.

 I am no golden ear and I've tried a few amps before as shown in my signature. The first amp that I am really happy with is the Toma. However, I've lost a few months in time to enjoy music just to find the items that fitted and have 'waste' some money in buying amps that I found not good enough for keeping. To me, it is harder to find a good item that fits then to earn the money to buy an amp($300 is not very hard to earn in half a year). Given the good quality of Xin's amp and it is so cheap when compare to something with similar quality (SR 71, Hornet, say), it's definitely worth the wait.

 my 2 cents.


----------



## jamato8

""Does anyone (Jamato?) specifically know why Xin doesn't believe in hiring people for help with production? Did he have a bad experience with this in the past? Is he worried about trade secrets getting out? I believe he would see a significant boost in business by eliminating that lead time.""


 I do not want to speak for Xin but there have been a few things happen in the past. Also his technique for assembly is different, requiring a good degree of skill, and this all takes time and effort to do correctly. Also, as noted, he is R&D and production, etc, etc, and as such, what do you do with the person you have trained if there is a down time and you can not use them? Xin has a line of packages with little wonders to be upgraded in section of his work area. I think Xin would really like this to be the last amp with no need for upgrades so people can get what they have been waiting for with no more changes and at the same time enjoy a sound that few portables can equal. I don't think he is trying to "better" anyone else but he does want to have his amps as the best Xin amps you can get. His motivation has not been money but for the joy of listening that he can impart to others. In doing this he has spent countless hours researching different topologies, theories, white pages, and tech manuals by himself with no staff or other person to assist. I have seen the thick volumes on chips and information that he combs through. You have someone that was trained in rocket science in China with a PhD in that field, working on a portable amp for heapdphones.


----------



## Goh

Man, that rocket scientist thing gets me every time. What a privilege!


----------



## ldj325

So I am one of the people who didn't know and paid with PayPal. I did e-mail Xin a few weeks ago asking for an update, but I heard nothing.

 Does anyone know if there is a way for me to switch from PayPal (getting a refund) to credit card payment.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I would think that if you want a refund from Paypal, you should contact them. I'm not sure about this, but I thought I heard something about their 60-day policy (refund? return?)


----------



## nc8000

I think you are out of luck with paypal If you don't complain within 30 days of paying. You just have to wait either till you get your amp or till Xin acknowledges your email


----------



## ldj325

Thanks for the information on PayPal. Sounds like ot's too late to correct this mistake, as Xin hasn't bothered to answer my other e-mail.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Hey, here's an idea. Maybe if Xin doesn't trust someone else to build his amps, he could at least hire someone to answer emails


----------



## fc911c

I don't know maybe I am wrong here but four months seems like a ridiculously long time to wait for such a tiny amp.

 Frank


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't know maybe I am wrong here but four months seems like a ridiculously long time to wait for such a tiny amp.

 Frank_

 

Well size doe not really come into this but yes 4 months is a very long time.
 However there is not really anything anybody can do about it except taking their business elsewhere, it' just the way Dr. Xin works.
 All I can say is that the result is worth the wait.
 The only people I really think have proper grounds to grumble are the ones who paid with paypal expecting 2-3 weeks turnaround and neither getting an amp nor getting replys to emails. Anybody else haven't really lost anything (not that I for one minute thinks that the paypal customers will loose anything but they are stuck and don't have the option of taking their business elsewhere).


----------



## fc911c

You make some good points, as far as size goes my point was it's not nearly as much work as building a full sized amp, a lot less part's and work. So I think in this case it's relevent.

 And BTW he should take that 2-3 week wait off, it's not right.


 Frank

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well size doe not really come into this but yes 4 months is a very long time.
 However there is not really anything anybody can do about it except taking their business elsewhere, it' just the way Dr. Xin works.
 All I can say is that the result is worth the wait.
 The only people I really think have proper grounds to grumble are the ones who paid with paypal expecting 2-3 weeks turnaround and neither getting an amp nor getting replys to emails. Anybody else haven't really lost anything (not that I for one minute thinks that the paypal customers will loose anything but they are stuck and don't have the option of taking their business elsewhere)._


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You make some good points, as far as size goes my point was it's not nearly as much work as building a full sized amp, a lot less part's and work. So I think in this case it's relevent._

 

I am not much of a diy genius my self (I can hardly tell the difference between the ends of a soldering iron) but looking at dr. Xin's pcb I think quite a bit of work is involved in fitting things on them and he drills all the holes in the front and back and does the engraving so I actually think a fair bit of times goes into each amp. He actually spend several hours hand building a volume knob for my Reference so my big woody 1/4" plugs could fit and I doubt that I am the only customer getting this kind of service. It's all in the details.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And BTW he should take that 2-3 week wait off, it's not right._

 

I absolutely agree. The thing is that it is a fair estimate if he was actually just building amps under normal circumstances, this is what turn around used to be for several years until about a ½ a year to a year ago.


----------



## Nailzs

So is it fair to say the amp will come, eventually?
 I'm wanting to get a Supermicro IV, but I can wait as I just got an iBasso T2, so I'm in no big hurry. It'll be paid by CC.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nailzs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So is it fair to say the amp will come, eventually?
 I'm wanting to get a Supermicro IV, but I can wait as I just got an iBasso T2, so I'm in no big hurry. It'll be paid by CC._

 


 They always have.


----------



## Liver

when the amp does ship, does he send an email? So you can be on the look for it?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Liver* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_when the amp does ship, does he send an email? So you can be on the look for it?_

 

That has been my experience, I have bought and received two of his amps.


----------



## rxc

Some people get emails some don't. I didn't.


----------



## nc8000

I'm on my 5th Xin amp (6th a SuperMicro is on order) over 3-4 years and the only times I have not received a shipping e-mail is for amps I have send back for upgrades


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I'm wondering if anyone has gotten an amp lately. So... how reliable is this thread for posting when Xin goes into production mode? Do people start posting that they received an email or their amp? Also, what is box happening?


----------



## jamato8

Great link, great. . . too much. . great. . . 

 No, no amps being sent out that I know of that are not betas. 

 But more posts like your link would be good for now. :^)


----------



## Dexter Morgan

So glad you liked the link... isn't that hilarious? I'll try and rack my brains for any other good stuff I've stumbled across...


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm wondering if anyone has gotten an amp lately._

 

I usually check here and his forum: http://www.fixup.net/talk/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=4


----------



## Sanddancer

My SuperMicro IV has been on order since early March and I'm still waiting. Sent an e-mail a coulple of weeks ago asking for an ETA, but never got a reply.

 Thinking about just forgetting about it and getting a Tomahawk.


----------



## _j_

I'm another early March SuperMicro as well (3/13). Over 4 months ~ definitely thought it would be here by now, but alas I am left with only my patience...

 Then my patience then got bored and ordered the iBasso T2 to hold me over 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I wonder what the longest wait time ever for a Xin amp has been....?


----------



## fc911c

looks like 6 months is the new bench mark. It looks like mine will be here for Christmas if I'm lucky.



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm another early March SuperMicro as well (3/13). Over 4 months ~ definitely thought it would be here by now, but alas I am left with only my patience...

 Then my patience then got bored and ordered the iBasso T2 to hold me over 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I wonder what the longest wait time ever for a Xin amp has been....?_


----------



## kokohore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm another early March SuperMicro as well (3/13). Over 4 months ~ definitely thought it would be here by now, but alas I am left with only my patience...

 Then my patience then got bored and ordered the iBasso T2 to hold me over 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I wonder what the longest wait time ever for a Xin amp has been....?_

 

Ordered SuperMini 4/Mar/07. About 140days with no word... now I'm waiting iBasso T2 as well, expecting it arriving within a week or so 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 (actually, I got a T1, but couldn't fix the noise issue 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )


----------



## yourtoys7

My SuperMicro IV has been ordered July 01.07 will see how long my patience last :>


----------



## aluren

just ordered a supermicro again on 7/25/07. early plans for a x'mas present!


----------



## MrJingles

Ordered SuperMini-IV April 15th and still waiting....................
 I hear that Xin's amps are definitely worth waiting for!


----------



## Biff Wellington

Ordered Supermicro on April 9. Not too upset about it since I've gotten the chance to get to know my Hornet better. Great little amp with the ER-4S and Imod. Trying to figure out if I actually need to pull the trigger on the UE-10s. Probably...


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Post deleted... you'll never know


----------



## MrJingles

Please talk me down from the ledge! I'm getting a bit frustrated with the wait time for my SuperMini-IV that I ordered, and paid for, April 15th. I'm seriously considering cancelling my order and going with the RSA Tomahawk. As you can see, I'm currently using the Meier Corda Porta II, and it sounds good, but I really want to step up in SQ. Is it really worth the wait for the Xin? Any thoughts on the subject from you knowlegable Head-Fiers?


----------



## PPkiller

i have heard a super micro(pre 4-11) and a tomahawk.. it's worth the wait..


----------



## MrJingles

Thanks PPkiller. If you heard the pre 4-11 Super Micro and thought it was better than the Tomahawk, then the 4-11 updated models should be unreal.
 Again, thanks for the input.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks PPkiller. If you heard the pre 4-11 Super Micro and thought it was better than the Tomahawk, then the 4-11 updated models should be unreal.
 Again, thanks for the input._

 

It is! look for the 25 amp comparison we are finalizing in this thread to see how good the Supermicro IV really is.


----------



## EFN

I mentioned this soo many time before and I will say it again. Xin amps will take time to receive. Allocate at least 3-4 months for delivery, mine arrived nearly after 5 months - in the process I sweared and cursed at Xin and got myself a Tomahawk and Go-Vibe V6 to accompany me. *BUT I kept my order at Xin alive*.

 And now you all know which amp I decided to keep. It's a waiting game and it's worthwhile to get yourself another amp to ease your mind away from the painful wait.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's a waiting game and it's worthwhile to get yourself another amp to ease your mind away from the painful wait._

 

Yeah, I'm doing the same thing while I wait, only for me substitute "another amp" with "several prostitutes"


----------



## onocentaur

I imagine they're not so happy when you try plugging in your headphones, though.


----------



## MrJingles

Ok all, I will continue to wait since everyone here is saying it's worth it. Just itchin' to listen to it with my configuration. Thanks guys!


----------



## shiezan

LOL
 I'm in the exact same situation as you!
 We both have iMods, ALO interconnects, shure e500's, and can't wait to get our hands on our supermicros! Haha its almost been 5 months now since I ordered it in early March.


----------



## subfocus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *onocentaur* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I imagine they're not so happy when you try plugging in your headphones, though._

 

LOL - Just had a coffee through the nose experience reading that one .


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *onocentaur* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I imagine they're not so happy when you try plugging in your headphones, though._

 

Not if I use the right sized adapter. And anyways, they're into that kinky kind of ****


----------



## leftnose

I just placed an order today for a SuperMicro IV with a black case. We'll see how long it takes to arrive.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Aw man, I feel for you. It'd probably be best for you to try and forget about it, then be suddenly surprised with an unexpected gift next year


----------



## mrarroyo

Or gets it next week ahead of everyone else!


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *leftnose* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just placed an order today for a SuperMicro IV with a black case. We'll see how long it takes to arrive._

 


 LOL! see you again next winter


----------



## callanish

Would it be worth it to drive all the way to Oregon, pull up to Dr. Xin's house and break down in tears pleading for my amp in order to get ahead of the line?


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *callanish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Would it be worth it to drive all the way to Oregon, pull up to Dr. Xin's house and break down in tears pleading for my amp in order to get ahead of the line?_

 

Would you pick mine up while you are there and send it to me!!!


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *callanish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Would it be worth it to drive all the way to Oregon, pull up to Dr. Xin's house and break down in tears pleading for my amp in order to get ahead of the line?_

 


 It sure is, and while you're there don't forget to tell him about a friend half the globe away in Thailand who's also down on his knees begging for another amp. GET ME ONE. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Lol, late as usual!


----------



## EFN

Dont forget to bring Pizzas, treat him some juicy Pepperoni - he may be distracted enuff to let you have some unfinished amps (errr still under tweaking...)


----------



## leftnose

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL! see you again next winter
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





_

 

I've ended up doing what most people suggest: buying an RSA Tomhawk or other high quality amp to use while waiting for the SMIV and then selling the one not liked (except I bought the TH in February). I plan on keeping both, though. I figure that by the time I get the SMIV, the next generation Nano will be out and I will pair the two for an ultra-portable rig. I'll keep the TH for my 4G 40GB for a slightly less portable rig.


----------



## rhythmdevils

Oh man. I just ordered one today to replace my supermacro 3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I would love to have my supermacro upgraded, but then I'd be waiting on 2 amps! AHH!


----------



## fl00r

Good news: Big X has spoken again!

 please see: http://www.fixup.net/talk/topic.asp?...28&whichpage=2
 (goto2003)

 Xin is about to release the Reference Whaaaahahaha!!


----------



## only500made

man...the thing about waiting for 3-4 months is thats something better (for sure) will pop up. you dont want to put your money in for that long and then the next big thing pop's up. 

 oh well


----------



## ICU

Kinda wondering if he does each amp himself, why he doesnt hire some gnomes, or outsource it to the Peeples Republic of Zorlandia. And a few QC Po-Lice.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 

 Prices should come down a tad, as well.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 .
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Need a few good amp (MAKERS).


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ICU* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Kinda wondering if he does each amp himself, why he doesnt hire some gnomes, or outsource it to the Peeples Republic of Zorlandia. And a few QC Po-Lice.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

 Pices should come down a tad, as well.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 .
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Need a few good amp (MAKERS)._

 

The problem is Dr. Xin is a compulsive perfectionist. He is very paranoid about other people doing stuffs for him. With every single amp he produces, he insist on working on each of them personally - even delivery!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The problem is Dr. Xin is a compulsive perfectionist. He is very paranoid about other people doing stuffs for him. With every single amp he produces, he insist on working on each of them personally - even delivery!_

 

If only his perfectionism extended to delivery time


----------



## jpnz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The problem is Dr. Xin is a compulsive perfectionist. He is very paranoid about other people doing stuffs for him. With every single amp he produces, he insist on working on each of them personally - even delivery!_

 

Ahh that explaines the long waiting time; he also brings the amps himself personally! He is without a doubt the busiest man on earth.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ahh that explaines the long waiting time; he also brings the amps himself personally! He is without a doubt the busiest man on earth.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

LOL!!!


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If only his perfectionism extended to delivery time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 good one


----------



## vexeus

I'm so excited. Today is my 5 month anniversary.


----------



## jamato8

Maybe a new thread should be started for the longest wait period. The winner gets to wait some more.


----------



## sinsiang

Yes the new thread should be started. I have been in list since march.


----------



## jamato8

So much of the experience is in the journey. No matter how good the Reference will be, once you get it you will no longer be on the journey, you will have come to your destination. All that anticipation and excitement of the wait and posting here will be gone and what will you do then. I think for everyone's good, we should stay on the journey. :^)


----------



## naamanf

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sinsiang* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes the new thread should be started. I have been in list since march._

 

I have been on since February. Suck it.


----------



## sinsiang

Sucks doesn't it
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Ah, well it comes when it comes.....

 siang


----------



## acidtripwow

I sent my Supermacro in for repair about 2 months ago and haven't heard back. I sent like 3 emails asking for updates and I didn't receive any response. Did he go into business with the people over at Larocco?


----------



## hd650

i ordered march 15, 2007.
 Dear god, when can I get it?


----------



## bluey_02

12 March baby, you've still got a long time to wait if naamanf has ordered his in February..


----------



## shiezan

Im sure everyone who ordered in March and Feb will get their amps before mid September.
 I think I ordered mine a couple days before or after 3/15.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Im sure everyone who ordered in March and Feb will get their amps before mid September.
 I think I ordered mine a couple days before or after 3/15._

 

I hope you're right, but I've found that in this strange world of hi-fi, one can never be sure of anything. Jamato, since you have a direct line to Xin, would you be willing to give him a *tap* and remind him that people are coming up on the half-year mark? I don't know what your relationship with him is like, so this might be inappropriate, I dunno. But I can just picture the guy lost in his world of tweak, unaware that so much time has passed...


----------



## naamanf

Sweet Oden's Raven! Just received an email from Xin saying that I am first in line for the next batch. Yippy!


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I hope you're right, but I've found that in this strange world of hi-fi, one can never be sure of anything. Jamato, since you have a direct line to Xin, would you be willing to give him a *tap* and remind him that people are coming up on the half-year mark? I don't know what your relationship with him is like, so this might be inappropriate, I dunno. But I can just picture the guy lost in his world of tweak, unaware that so much time has passed..._

 

I think things should start to break loose but I don't have any better connection than anyone else here.


----------



## MrJingles

I sent an email to Dr. Xin to cancel an order on Aug 2nd, have sent 3 more emails in the last 7 days, left a voicemail message this morning and still no response. Very frustrating. The Move will be any day now....thank goodness.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think things should start to break loose but I don't have any better connection than anyone else here._

 

I dunno man... the moment the thought enters your mind we start hearing about sweet oden and his raven. Seems you have amazing psychic powers, limited to one man.


----------



## jamato8

Maybe because one of my two ravens took off. The sword is a little dull, but the battle rages on for the conquest as the Reference will slay those before it.


----------



## callanish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sweet Oden's Raven! Just received an email from Xin saying that I am first in line for the next batch. Yippy!_

 

What does a batch normally mean? 25% of all his back orders, 10%. In other words, when he's in full production mode and you've been waiting for a few months, does that usually mean he won't get around to yours until batch 3 or 4? Just wondering if anyone has any insider knowledge.


----------



## jamato8

He makes runs of amps and then ships them off. He can do about ten at a time (that is not a run) and keeps working away at them. All are made by hand by Xin with each chip, capacitor, resistor placed by him. I would go nuts after a while but then that is makes us all different.


----------



## callanish

Thanks! He must have the patience of a saint doing that kind of tedious microscopic work repetedly. I just couldn't possess that kind of focus on that kind of thing day in and day out and would go as far as to say I'd probably end up in the funny farm wearing a really snug fitting straight jacket with capacitors, chips and resistors haunting my nightmares.


----------



## EFN

Being a DIY junkie myself, it took me 1 full day for make an iMod 5G dock, that's about one of the most complex DIY I manage to pull off. And now this professor Xin, he can sit there and continue to work over 10 amps at one go (and yet keeping focus on ech of them)? that's insane


----------



## kaushama

Dr. Xin just replied one of my emails! He is out of the tweaking mode now. I think shipping will start very soon.
 Good news guys!


----------



## sinsiang

Good to hear, hope we all can get our amps soon.


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

YESSSSS!


----------



## EFN

WOOOHOOO!!!!!!!


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dr. Xin just replied one of my emails! He is out of the tweaking mode now. I think shipping will start very soon.
 Good news guys!_

 

I also just received a reply!!! Saying shipping notices are coming soon. And apologizing about the wait. Looks like development mode is finally done!.


----------



## EFN

This could mean that my XIN Reference stand a chance to be delivered sometime in September


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This could mean that my XIN Reference stand a chance to be delivered sometime in September
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Unless. . . . . You know. . . I noticed that bass could use a boost . . I wonder if Xin could fix this? . . .


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Unless. . . . . You know. . . I noticed that bass could use a boost . . I wonder if Xin could fix this? . . . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Dang you....Xin has been in Research Mode long enuff....and now you gonna give him ideas to tinker about


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Unless. . . . . You know. . . I noticed that bass could use a boost . . I wonder if Xin could fix this? . . . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

SSHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhHHHHHHHHHH 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Unless. . . . . You know. . . I noticed that bass could use a boost . . I wonder if Xin could fix this? . . . 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 






 Well said! I think you have many new friends with that statement.


----------



## jamato8

You think! well I always like new friends. . . I wonder if they want my address so they can come and visit?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You think! well I always like new friends. . . I wonder if they want my address so they can come and visit?_

 

And come knocking on the door ..... quietly ......


----------



## jamato8

I don't get it. . . no matter how fast I turn around. . . no one is there. . . ? . . . or is there . ? . . . woo . who was that??


----------



## BushGuy

It was me..........the ghost of Xin - his alter ego. No matter what you say or do......I will be changing boards, going into research mode, experimenting with caps. You will not see me............but, I'll be there.


----------



## nickknutson

Does anyone know if Xin reads this forum? I'm sure he does, but I was wondering if anyone knows for sure.


----------



## jamato8

No, he does not read this forum.


----------



## ChickenGod

BUT I READ THIS FORUM :]


----------



## hd650

I just received xin's email. He accepted my order change from supermini to reference. Thanks Xin.


----------



## ChickenGod

I'm still waiting for my email reply.

 Its been hmm... almost 3 months since I ordered.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

It shouldn't surprise you... there are others in line in front of people like you and I that have been waiting 5 months.


----------



## jamato8

Yikes! 5 months? What did you order?


----------



## shiezan

Haha, I've been waiting for 5 months already just for a supermicro.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Uhhh... lemme see if I can find an example...

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered mine Mar/04/2007... now more than 4 months and still no word. I'd been thinking that the waiting would be between 3 and 4 months...
 What is the longest waiting record? 6 months? Or even more? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Its been 138 days since I ordered my Supermicro. I think it will reach 150 days soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hoping that it will be all worth it._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My SuperMicro IV has been on order since early March and I'm still waiting. Sent an e-mail a coulple of weeks ago asking for an ETA, but never got a reply.

 Thinking about just forgetting about it and getting a Tomahawk._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm another early March SuperMicro as well (3/13). Over 4 months ~ definitely thought it would be here by now, but alas I am left with only my patience...

 Then my patience then got bored and ordered the iBasso T2 to hold me over 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I wonder what the longest wait time ever for a Xin amp has been....?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered SuperMini 4/Mar/07. About 140days with no word... now I'm waiting iBasso T2 as well, expecting it arriving within a week or so 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 (actually, I got a T1, but couldn't fix the noise issue 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm so excited. Today is my 5 month anniversary. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have been on since February. Suck it.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bluey_02* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_12 March baby, you've still got a long time to wait if naamanf has ordered his in February.._

 

Keep in mind most of these were posted last month, hence the 5 months.


----------



## jamato8

Geez, the 5 month club. Well, they all have something in common. . . just think how excited everyone will be when it arrives. . . . right? . . . no I am not telling anyone where I live. .


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Indeed, they are bonded together in fellowship, forged under the strains of anticipation, tested by the fires of doubt, but ultimately rewarded beyond expectation.


----------



## jamato8

LOL ROTFL . . . Ok, if you say so. 

 Get them all together and toss a Micro or Reference in the middle of the group and see what happens. . . .


----------



## chukwe

Why doesn't Dr Xin employ ppl to help him?


----------



## kaushama

Because then people run away with his secret recipes As he experianced earlier!! That is, what has been told about his reluctance to employ people!


----------



## shiezan

Someone stole his recipe before?
 When was this?


----------



## chukwe

Hire a family member


----------



## stevenkelby

Hire me!


----------



## Sanddancer

I e-mailed Xin about my early March order for a SuperMicro and got a reply a couple of days ago.

 "Hi Tony, sorry for the delay. Have been working on some changes, working on the orders now. Thank you, Xin"


----------



## _j_

That's fantastic that people are starting to get some comms from Dr. Xin! Won't be long now.... *crosses fingers*

 I'm very excited as today is my order anniversary as I join the 5 month club...
 Help me celebrate!















 I also see that Xin has the black case available again also for SMicro IV... Might be worth an email....


----------



## kaushama

Even though he started to reply mails I am not very optimistic about shipping dates until he posts in FIXUP forums. I think he still waits for beta testers opinion on newest boards.
 I have sent my Supermini for upgrades and without an amp for 3 months now. Bad timing! Though he has replied few days back for my mails he never mentioned the exact days of production.
 I have bought a Hornet M to tide up the period and will compare Supermini, Hornet and reference when they arrive. 

  Quote:


 Someone stole his recipe before?
 When was this? 
 

I think few years back some person stole and reproduced his Supradural and he is ever so pessimistic about personal help ever since.


----------



## tk3

Pulled the trigger on a Ref with the money I got from selling my Hornet ..hope this won't take 4+ months to get here since the only portable amp I got at the moment is my iBasso P1 which is big when you're used to Tomahawk/Hornet size.

 Can't really use my DAP without an amp either since it's an iMod photo.


----------



## lisnalee

Nearly a week since i orfered my reference, only 4 months & 3 weeks to go 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Seriously though has anyone ordered something from xin and actually forgot about it until it arrived on their doorstep because it took 5 or 6 months?


----------



## jamato8

I think I read somewhere that someone did get a surprise but normally he sends you an email that it has shipped. 

 The 5 month club is exclusive, so you will have to wait for your turn to join, sorry.


----------



## srikeerthi

I'm in the 5+ month club too! 167 days and counting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I had bought an Xtra X1-Pro amp to help me through the wait, but even that is not working now. Waiting for Xin Supermicro to arrive soon. 

 Since Xin is replying to mails and saying he is working on orders, I think it wont be too long!


----------



## lmfboy01

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Pulled the trigger on a Ref with the money I got from selling my Hornet ..hope this won't take 4+ months to get here since the only portable amp I got at the moment is my iBasso P1 which is big when you're used to Tomahawk/Hornet size.

 Can't really use my DAP without an amp either since it's an iMod photo._

 

hi,
 just wanted to let you know that i have contacted iBasso about my P1, they said they will be coming out with a iBasso P2 by the end of the month. They did mention a upgrade/trade-in program of some sorts for the P2 for P1 users. It isn't clear of the exact details yet for upgrade/trade-in... It is smaller and has a better circuit design than the P1, so this might be what you need. Give em an email, they responded to me within a day or two. BTW hows your P1? Mine acts up when charging, it can charge 24/7 with only the red light on....


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Seriously though has anyone ordered something from xin and actually forgot about it until it arrived on their doorstep because it took 5 or 6 months?_

 

I haven't thought about the SuperMini I ordered in mid-April for about a month or so. It was sooo nice to forget for awhile.

 Looks like I'll be teetering on making it to the FMC (Five Month Club)!


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lmfboy01* 
_just wanted to let you know that i have contacted iBasso about my P1, they said they will be coming out with a iBasso P2 by the end of the month._

 

Oh, really?? If iBasso says by the end of the month, that means by the middle to end of the *next* month.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lmfboy01* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hi,
 just wanted to let you know that i have contacted iBasso about my P1, they said they will be coming out with a iBasso P2 by the end of the month. They did mention a upgrade/trade-in program of some sorts for the P2 for P1 users. It isn't clear of the exact details yet for upgrade/trade-in... It is smaller and has a better circuit design than the P1, so this might be what you need. Give em an email, they responded to me within a day or two. BTW hows your P1? Mine acts up when charging, it can charge 24/7 with only the red light on...._

 

That sounds kind of neat, although I don't think I'll do it, cause I've been wanting to try a Xin amp for awhile, and I don't want to spend the money on another amp (shipping to asia 1 way would cost around $25-30 already, + the upgrade costs).

 My P1 is OK, when I first got it the unit would emit a hum often when it was touched by bare skin, but that seems to have stopped after some weeks, no idea why.
 Besides that, the right channel would cut out sometimes when the supplied IC was moved, but I think that's a problem with the IC, and not the input jack.

 For its price it does sound good though, I like the way it pairs with my ER4S better than it did with the more expensive Hornet I recently sold.


----------



## stevenkelby

Xin is in Oregon, USA, not Asia! 

 Don't worry , I jumped to the same conclusion.

 I have an 80GB imod with NO portable amp. I have my RPX-33 for home use which is great but everywhere else I have to use the HP out. Lucky I didn't get a 4G. I ordered my reference early, but I would like a super micro to tide me over, I can use that at the gym too with my U3. Might start another WTB. Good luck to me...


----------



## tk3

If you're talking to me, I mean that I think iBasso is based in Asia (Hong Kong?), not Xin.


----------



## Henry Flower

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin is in Oregon, USA, not Asia! 
_

 

He's talking about his iBasso, not the Xin! I believe they hang out in Hong Kong.


----------



## stevenkelby

Oh yeah. I was talking about Xin. I am the idiot!


----------



## kaushama

I received my Hornet and I miss my post 4/11 supermini more now!


----------



## tk3

Quote:


 Posted - 08/17/2007 : 13:07:21 Show Profile Reply with Quote
 Yes, I received notice of shipping of my Reference 2 days ago. Looking forward to delivery!! 
 

Quote from Xin support board, hopefully the rest of us will soon follow!


----------



## kaushama

That was a response by Ron (Highfight). I am not sure whether to consider it as a normal order as he is one of, the beta testers and the first persons to order it through email.
 I will take it as a sure sign of production if one of the regular customers get his shipping notice.
 I think dr. Xin still is in the final round of tweaking. Only problem with this tweaking is that he has to wait 400 hours before he test a specific design as it is the usual burn in time for reference (due to that large cap). I think he is still burning in, the final configuration before he ships.


----------



## naamanf

I was told I was the first one in line when the next round ships and I have not heard anything yet. I am also just a "regular" customer.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was told I was the first one in line when the next round ships and I have not heard anything yet. I am also just a "regular" customer._

 

What's that on your avatar!?
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Are you planning to shoot yourself (or Xin) because of the long wait?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Hold on man!


----------



## naamanf

It's a turkey hat. And the turkey gets it if I don't get my amp soon


----------



## jpnz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was told I was the first one in line when the next round ships and I have not heard anything yet. I am also just a "regular" customer._

 

How long ago did you make an order from Xin? I'm almost a half year waiting for my Supermicro IV. The longer the waiting time, the cooler you are.


----------



## jamato8

Hey, the six month club! You guys are really cool.. . sorry . . . Maybe this is a lesson in gaining inner quiet, a stillness of self and need. . . 






 or not.


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey, the six month club! You guys are really cool.. . sorry . . . Maybe this is a lesson in gaining inner quiet, a stillness of self and need. . . 






 or not._

 

LOL 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It is a test of patience no doubts. 4 more days away from entering the 6 month club


----------



## som4ew

What mode is Xin in now?
 So far only Highfight got his Reference.


----------



## naamanf

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How long ago did you make an order from Xin? I'm almost a half year waiting for my Supermicro IV. The longer the waiting time, the cooler you are._

 

I ordered mid Feb.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What mode is Xin in now?
 So far only Highfight got his Reference._

 

I think he could be back in development mode, at least I have not been able to get a reply to mails the last 1½ week, but honestly I don't know.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The longer the waiting time, the cooler you are._

 

If the waiting time is a measurement for how cool you are, Naamanf is about to freeze 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered mine early March.


----------



## PPkiller

This is getting longer and longer....


----------



## gonzalo

supermicro IV ordered end of july 07, hoping it's in spain before christmas


----------



## som4ew

I duobt that the first lot of Ref. could be shipped in August. If he need to wait for large cap to be properly burning in ,that will take him at least 200-400 hours, before he decide to use in Ref.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I'm worried about Xin - his obsessional tweaking is comparable with the behavior of a meth addict. I am not suggesting that Xin is using drugs, which makes his behavior all the more disturbing. I think we may need to stage an intervention, ala road trip. 

 Shotgun!


----------



## jamato8

Been there done that. Doesn't help but it could be a fun ride. :^)


----------



## tnmike1

so what I'm getting from y'all is that if I want to return my SM IV LE for upgrades I should wait until the current torrent of orders hs been filled--like maybe wait 'til January? OR do you think he's doing upgrades along with making References. Have one on order, but would also like my LE upgraded to current standards. So, bottom line: howlong do I ait to send it off???


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so what I'm getting from y'all is that if I want to return my SM IV LE for upgrades I should wait until the current torrent of orders hs been filled--like maybe wait 'til January? OR do you think he's doing upgrades along with making References. Have one on order, but would also like my LE upgraded to current standards. So, bottom line: howlong do I ait to send it off???_

 

Don't ait! Send it now! You could be waiting for eternity for Xin to "stop tweaking", that's like waiting for the world to stop spinning. If you don't have another amp, get one before sending the LE back.

 I've been waiting 4 and a half years for my Reference and had to wait almost 6 years for the SM IV.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Maybe if we picked up some of his family members on the way to his house, to include in our intervention? I can't begin to imagine how long it's been since he called his mother.


----------



## jamato8

She's in Hunan Province, China, you are going to have a long car ride.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Don't be ridiculous, we'll take a plane


----------



## choomanchoo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't be ridiculous, we'll take a plane 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The scenery is better if you walk, take a camera too.


----------



## jamato8

Click on my link if you want pictures.


----------



## Skinny Ho

I ordered Supermicro IV on February 23, 2007. I received Dr. Xin's email on August 10 telling me that he was busy on latest changes and asking me whether I wanted to switch the order to Reference. I immediately replied yes but I haven't heard from him up to now. I guess I would probably got my Xin amp in 2008


----------



## fc911c

He can keep mine, I'm done waiting. Perhaps before he goes off in other directions he should finish 6 month orders first.

 Frank


----------



## chukwe

Can someone pay Dr Xin some extra money to get a quick delivery date like 1 month?


----------



## digitalcat

I fail to see the point of all these fine tunings by Xin, honestly. There's no such thing as the best amp, no matter how hard you try. I'm not against his noble quest for the best, but deliverying his products on time shouldn't have been his last concern.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *digitalcat* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I fail to see the point of all these fine tunings by Xin, honestly. There's no such thing as the best amp, no matter how hard you try. I'm not against his noble quest for the best, but deliverying his products on time shouldn't have been his last concern._

 

I couldn't agree more.


----------



## EFN

I am upset too with Xin's business practice. But after a while I figured this guy actually don't care much about selling stuffs for business. It is a passion for him to make amps and so happen he feels like selling them.

 I ask myself a question, knowing that he'll be doing what he does best, keeping the whole world waiting - should I still buy amps from him? hell yeah.

 While I am uspet with his CS, I am very happy with his amps. So when I pulled the trigger on a SuperMicro-IV on December 2006, I knew all too well that it will take ages to get a sniff of the ordered amp. So I opt to forget and let my Credit Card do the talking - after all Xin does not charge when he's not shipping.

 I was utterly happy with my Go-Vibe V6 and Tomahawk then - almost forgetting my order for SuperMicro-IV. Then out of the blue I recieved my SMIV.

 The key thing is, I want Xin's amp because it was built with lotsa passion. He's a freak for tweaking and I have no doubt the result will be superb. CS aside, I could live with it.

 Just my 2 cents


----------



## Chimpy

I already have a Hornet - is there any reason to think about trying to win the Xin Reference lottery?


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am upset too with Xin's business practice. But after a while I figured this guy actually don't care much about selling stuffs for business. It is a passion for him to make amps and so happen he feels like selling them.

 I ask myself a question, knowing that he'll be doing what he does best, keeping the whole world waiting - should I still buy amps from him? hell yeah.

 While I am uspet with his CS, I am very happy with his amps. So when I pulled the trigger on a SuperMicro-IV on December 2006, I knew all too well that it will take ages to get a sniff of the ordered amp. So I opt to forget and let my Credit Card do the talking - after all Xin does not charge when he's not shipping.

 I was utterly happy with my Go-Vibe V6 and Tomahawk then - almost forgetting my order for SuperMicro-IV. Then out of the blue I recieved my SMIV.

 The key thing is, I want Xin's amp because it was built with lotsa passion. He's a freak for tweaking and I have no doubt the result will be superb. CS aside, I could live with it.

 Just my 2 cents_

 

To each his own, I can understand your way of thinking. For me I feel it's time to move on and take the money and put it towards and amp that I could listen too in the near future. I am not really a portable guy anyway's.


----------



## dealmaster00

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I couldn't agree more._

 

I couldn't disagree more.

 Xin isn't trying to run a business, he's trying to make the best amp. If you don't like that, then fine, go spend your money elsewhere. Plus I'll get my amp quicker that way. xD


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dealmaster00* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I couldn't disagree more.

 Xin isn't trying to run a business, he's trying to make the best amp. If you don't like that, then fine, go spend your money elsewhere. Plus I'll get my amp quicker that way. xD_

 

ok Fanboy, yeah I'm sure it will really speed up your wait time. LOL Not running a business? oh so he's giving them away, never mind I'll wait then.


----------



## jamvanman

The way I think of it, this is just part and parcel of who Dr Xin is. Not right or wrong, just is. No doubt he could make more money if he did things differently, but its pretty clear that this isn't what motivates him. And probably just about everyone who buys an amp from him knows the situation. Been waiting since April myself.


----------



## DennyL

I'm not waiting for a Xin amp, but I plan to order a Reference.

 There are plenty of electronics manufacturers who build up the business, subcontract manufacture to China or whatever, then the suits suits come in to maximize profitability, etc, and make it big. In the small world of headphone amps there are those who develop a range of products and happily make them for several years with no evident thought of development and improvement. I think of Xin as more like a Stradivarius, an artist in electronics, who cares only for how good he can get his products, and those of us who sympathise with what he is doing can order one and join the ride, and one day own something special. Others can order elsewhere, there's plenty of choice. I don't see the point of ordering from Xin and then complaining. We all know how he works.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_don't see the point of ordering from Xin and then complaining. We all know how he works._

 

2X


----------



## tk3

I agree, I just think of my Xin order as a nice surprise coming up in some months that I might've even forgotten about.
 What I do think would be nice is if he would post some status updates on his website, even if its announcing that the product is still X months away, it's much better than no communication at all, and it only takes a minute or less for him to do so.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm not waiting for a Xin amp, but I plan to order a Reference.

 There are plenty of electronics manufacturers who build up the business, subcontract manufacture to China or whatever, then the suits suits come in to maximize profitability, etc, and make it big. In the small world of headphone amps there are those who develop a range of products and happily make them for several years with no evident thought of development and improvement. I think of Xin as more like a Stradivarius, an artist in electronics, who cares only for how good he can get his products, and those of us who sympathise with what he is doing can order one and join the ride, and one day own something special. Others can order elsewhere, there's plenty of choice. I don't see the point of ordering from Xin and then complaining. We all know how he works._

 

 "I don't see the point of ordering from Xin and then complaining. We all know how he works."
 __________________

 Well I do see the point of complaining. When I ordered I knew nothing of this thread, all I seen was wait time two weeks on his site (which was still there BTW last time I looked). Then I found out it would be more like 3 months and I was still ok with that. Now I am hearing guys waiting 6 months and still don't have them and some that have paid for them. Then on top of it three unanswered emails to boot. It amazes me that people will put up with this. You better hope he doesn't decide to develop another amp you might be waiting years, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 happy waiting

 edit: He want's to develope then why doesn't he stop taking orders? The way Mapletree does untill he get's caught up, he is also very busy, and has the time and courtesy to answer your questions. There are some here that will make every excuse in the world for his way of conducting business, it baffels me.


----------



## fc911c

"What I do think would be nice is if he would post some status updates on his website, even if its announcing that the product is still X months away, it's much better than no communication at all, and it only takes a minute or less for him to do so".


 Don't hold your breath on that one, it still says 2 weeks wait time.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"I don't see the point of ordering from Xin and then complaining. We all know how he works."
 __________________

 Well I do see the point of complaining. When I ordered I knew nothing of this thread, all I seen was wait time two weeks on his site (which was still there BTW last time I looked). Then I found out it would be more like 3 months and I was still ok with that. Now I am hearing guys waiting 6 months and still don't have them and some that have paid for them. Then on top of it three unanswered emails to boot. It amazes me that people will put up with this. You better hope he doesn't decide to develop another amp you might be waiting years, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 happy waiting

 edit: He want's to develope then why doesn't he stop taking orders? The way Mapletree does untill he get's caught up, he is also very busy, and has the time and courtesy to answer your questions. There are some here that will make every excuse in the world for his way of conducting business, it baffels me._

 

I sympathise with your frustration if you didn't know his reputation when you placed your order, but can you have no warm feelings for him now you know more about him? He is not like any other amp makers, and I don't think he'll go on for ever working as he does now. I have heard The Reference and I think, as many others on this forum do, that it is really special. Those wanting good communication with prompt shipping and a good product have plenty of choices. Don't point your guns at Xin, he is to be cherished as long has he goes on developing wonderful products.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Is it not possible to both appreciate Xin as a modern Stratavarius _and_ be irritated by the wait?


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I sympathise with your frustration if you didn't know his reputation when you placed your order, but can you have no warm feelings for him now you know more about him? He is not like any other amp makers, and I don't think he'll go on for ever working as he does now. I have heard The Reference and I think, as many others on this forum do, that it is really special. Those wanting good communication with prompt shipping and a good product have plenty of choices. Don't point your guns at Xin, he is to be cherished as long has he goes on developing wonderful products._

 

Hi

 Yes I do feel for his passion and there are no guns pointed at him, in return I don't think anyone should point them at me either. I am a bit of a perfectionist myself perhaps that is why I get so ticked off when I am ignored as I would not do this. Being a perfectionist has nothing to do with doing the right thing, period.


 Frank


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is it not possible to both appreciate Xin as a modern Stratavarius and be irritated by the wait? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 I suppose it could be. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 look all I am saying is how about a little compassion for the customers I don't think it to much to ask, Customer service and perfection both can be done.


----------



## jamato8

I know it is frustrating to read of some who have the betas or finished (? :^) ) product. I wish Xin would start shipping. Something is going on, what I don't know. 

 The Reference is a work of art. It transcends its size and the mind set of what a portable should or has sounded like. I have the D1 now and it is very good sounding, better than others I have heard, after burn in, but the Reference is the reference. It is better than my home amps. I am sure there are those who will get it and not wait the very long time required for the large cap to form and say it did not match there expectations but for those who wait, it will be fun.


----------



## mamboman

Just ordered my Xin Refence. The wait begins


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"What I do think would be nice is if he would post some status updates on his website, even if its announcing that the product is still X months away, it's much better than no communication at all, and it only takes a minute or less for him to do so".


 Don't hold your breath on that one, it still says 2 weeks wait time._

 

Actually it no longer says anything about delivery times on his "Coll stuff" page and hasn't for some weeks now.

 The people I feel sorry for are the people who ordered using paypal because they can't just take there business anywhere else without first getting in touch with Xin to get a refund (and we all know that getting in touch with him is no easy feat), and the people who have send amps in for repair/upgrade since they also can't do anything or go anywhere else. Those with credit card orders can just cancel the order and buy something somewhere else.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Actually it no longer says anything about delivery times on his "Coll stuff" page and hasn't for some weeks now.

 The people I feel sorry for are the people who ordered using paypal because they can't just take there business anywhere else without first getting in touch with Xin to get a refund (and we all know that getting in touch with him is no easy feat), and the people who have send amps in for repair/upgrade since they also can't do anything or go anywhere else. Those with credit card orders can just cancel the order and buy something somewhere else._

 


 Well if you want to get an answer to your emails just cancel it, out of the 3 or 4 I sent it was the only one answered. LOL


----------



## yourtoys7

I have no problem waiting but I do have an isue when someone selling anything, and I do mean anything is not comunicating back to you. I is not reasonable cust.service practice by any measure.
 I'll waith for my, but will recieve it as surprice instead of a purchase that you would normally do.
 Just because Xin's amps are so good, doens't mean his cust.service should be so bad.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *yourtoys7* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have no problem waiting but I do have an isue when someone selling anything, and I do mean anything is not comunicating back to you. I is not reasonable cust.service practice by any measure.
 I'll waith for my, but will recieve it as surprice instead of a purchase that you would normally do.
 Just because Xin's amps are so good, doens't mean his cust.service should be so bad._

 


 another voice of reason thank you.

 Thanks
 Frank


----------



## aluren

well, when you decided that you want to purchase a xin amp, use your credit card. once you place your order, go research head-fi and buy yourself another amp to hold you off. i got myself a tomahawk while waiting for the supermicro (later changing it the reference), and i didn't even think about the wait time since i have the tomahawk to use. then once the xin amp came in, make a comparison of the two amps and sell one of them so that your wallet won't be in a deep hole...


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Well, there's a thread named 'Those who waiting...' and so far it goes 70 pages. Not that we've not been warned, right?


----------



## mamboman

Or there are others who have been warned but still don't know better but to place an order. myself included.


----------



## gp_hebert

Call me suicidal, but I just ordered a SuperMicro from Xin. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now I've got to find a way to erase that from my memory so the wait time will appear shorter...


----------



## silverrain

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's a turkey hat. And the turkey gets it if I don't get my amp soon
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

(Turkey taps playing in background....)


----------



## Wotan1

Anyone interesed and having the time in doing the math on how many headfiers in this thread are actually waiting on which amp?


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone interesed and having the time in doing the math on how many headfiers in this thread are actually waiting on which amp?_

 

I would and I am sure that there are many more who don' even come to HeadFi.


----------



## kaushama

I see the same cycle of events as last year. Only flaw that I can see in Dr. Xin's approach is that he doesn't mention the long wait times and the mode that he is in by himself in the site. Both "those who waiting threads" here and Fixup forums were started by me to mend this problem and they are serving customers to know in advance that there is a long waiting time. Once that is known I don't see a reason for grumbling as anyone can cancel the order and look elsewhere if he cannOT wait. 
 Only thing is, it better to order always with a credit card than Paypal.
 I think Dr. Xin has gone into the development mode again, despite indications of finalizing reference few weeks back.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone interesed and having the time in doing the math on how many headfiers in this thread are actually waiting on which amp?_

 

I'm in, got nothing better to do than waiting for my Reference anyway


----------



## naamanf

It's on it's way! My Reference shipped today! That means the rest of your amps should be on their way soon!

 But then again I mentioned that I had to leave for Iraq next week. So the rest of you may still have to wait a while
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If it wasn't for the above fact I would be super happy.


----------



## shiezan

When did you order your amp?


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you order your amp?_

 

 Maybe I am missing something here, but I am trying to figure out how these amps are being shipped when they weren't even available when I ordered my Macro and didn't get it, and others that have been waiting six months.


----------



## naamanf

What? I ordered mine the middle of February.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What? I ordered mine the middle of February._

 

I could be wrong, I don't remember seeing anything about a Referance amp there when I ordered. If you say you ordered in Feb I stand corrected.


----------



## naamanf

Okay I see what your getting at. I actually changed my order. I think Xin just takes who placed the last order and ships it that way no matter what changes have been made. Or something like that. I'm just glad I'm done waiting. We will see how it does in 130deg heat next week.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay I see what your getting at. I actually changed my order. I think Xin just takes who placed the last order and ships it that way no matter what changes have been made. Or something like that. I'm just glad I'm done waiting. We will see how it does in 130deg heat next week._

 


 no problem enjoy the new amp, god know's you waited long enough.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay I see what your getting at. I actually changed my order. I think Xin just takes who placed the last order and ships it that way no matter what changes have been made. Or something like that. I'm just glad I'm done waiting. We will see how it does in 130deg heat next week._

 

Let us know how it goes for you. I was in Vietnam and this reminds me of it all over again. Take care.


----------



## Quaddy

OT a little - i didnt want to make a new thread, but was wondering if you guys have any suggestions as to what gain i should opt for on my reference order.

 it will be solely driving grado SR-325i and an imod 4g

 i am no good at this gain stuff and i think by default it ships with '3'

 but would anyone have an idea as to whether i need to shoot xin a note to change it maybe?

 tia

 p.s. @naamanf - good luck in iraq man - take care.


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OT a little - i didnt want to make a new thread, but was wondering if you guys have any suggestions as to what gain i should opt for on my reference order.

 it will be solely driving grado SR-325i and an imod 4g

 i am no good at this gain stuff and i think by default it ships with '3'

 but would anyone have an idea as to whether i need to shoot xin a note to change it maybe?

 tia

 p.s. @naamanf - good luck in iraq man - take care._

 


 I had the same thoughts when I got my SMacro IV to use with HF1s. Stock gain of 3 was perfect. Those 325is are easy to drive, only 32ohm iirc. 3 is a pretty low gain and any less might not drive any bigger cans in your future. More gain would give less fine control and useable range with the volume knob, and increases the chances of introduce background noise.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I had the same thoughts when I got my SMacro IV to use with HF1s. Stock gain of 3 was perfect. Those 325is are easy to drive, only 32ohm iirc. 3 is a pretty low gain and any less might not drive any bigger cans in your future. More gain would give less fine control and useable range with the volume knob, and increases the chances of introduce background noise._

 

great stuff, i will leave it at default then. many thanks for the help!!


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_great stuff, i will leave it at default then. many thanks for the help!!_

 

My pleasure. Higher gain would be good if you had something very hard to drive like 600ohm beyers or even HD650 maybe. 

 Hope you get the reference soon, but not before me!


----------



## Frihed89

When was the last time an order was filled (as reported here)?
 How long did that person have to wait?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OT a little - i didnt want to make a new thread, but was wondering if you guys have any suggestions as to what gain i should opt for on my reference order.

 it will be solely driving grado SR-325i and an imod 4g

 i am no good at this gain stuff and i think by default it ships with '3'

 but would anyone have an idea as to whether i need to shoot xin a note to change it maybe?

 tia

 p.s. @naamanf - good luck in iraq man - take care._

 

I would just like to throw in that Gain = (voltage out)/(voltage in). It doesn't have anything directly to do with power, current or impedance, but it has a lot to do with the output voltage of the source, which in many cases can be adjusted.


----------



## tk3

Is Xin's forum not reachable at the moment?
 I've been getting a server error since a few days.


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would just like to throw in that Gain = (voltage out)/(voltage in). It doesn't have anything directly to do with power, current or impedance, but it has a lot to do with the output voltage of the source, which in many cases can be adjusted._

 

Yeah good point but it's all related. For a given system, turning up the gain will give you more volume.



 I noticed Xins forum is down since a couple days too. I hope he's ok. Maybe he is furiously building our amps and hasn't eating or slept in days and hasn't noticed the site is down.

 Or maybe he took our amp money and moved to the Bahamas 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .


----------



## jamato8

He is fine but off and on over the years has had problems with one server after another. I haven't been able to get on the site for a day or so.


----------



## sugarinthegourd

Thinking of ordering a Xin reference on 9/1. Wonder what the ETA would be. Does he take your money up front, or only when it ships?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sugarinthegourd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thinking of ordering a Xin reference on 9/1. Wonder what the ETA would be. Does he take your money up front, or only when it ships?_

 

from what i am lead to believe, takes money when it ships approximately.
 not sure on ETA a lot people been waiting 5mths +, i am still wet behind the ears, only ordered mine 3 weeks ago.
 HTH


----------



## HiFlight

Dr Xin knows the site is down. It is a server problem and he has contacted them regarding the outage. He has had many problems with this server. One can log onto the main page, (www.fixup.net) however selecting a link results in the server error.


----------



## stevenkelby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sugarinthegourd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thinking of ordering a Xin reference on 9/1. Wonder what the ETA would be. Does he take your money up front, or only when it ships?_

 

Paypal, you pay now. With Credit card, he charges when he ships. Make sure you have funds available 6 months down the line! 

 I suspect that waits will clear up in a couple weeks. When he gets building instead of tweaking he is very fast. I can see a 4-6 week wait being the go next month. Who knows though...


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stevenkelby* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Paypal, you pay now. With Credit card, he charges when he ships. Make sure you have funds available 6 months down the line! 

 I suspect that waits will clear up in a couple weeks. When he gets building instead of tweaking he is very fast. I can see a 4-6 week wait being the go next month. Who knows though..._

 

when did you order your ref steven?


----------



## stevenkelby

Oh man I don't know. Maybe 4-6 weeks ago? I didn't get an email from him yet and don't have a record of it. I will try to figure it out.

 Twice in the past I have emiled him *URGENT* messages regarding a SMIV and SMicro and he replied quick. I think he reads his email but doesn't respond until he's ready with your order.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's on it's way! My Reference shipped today! That means the rest of your amps should be on their way soon!

 But then again I mentioned that I had to leave for Iraq next week. So the rest of you may still have to wait a while
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 If it wasn't for the above fact I would be super happy._

 

Naamanf, what did you pay for the Reference? $279.99 or $249.99?
 I can imagine you paid the latter since you waited more than 6 months?

 I am queued since March 15 and want to change my order from Mini to Reference. Do I have to wait two days before ordering (September) or will an email to Xin be enough 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Beside that, why is the Ref cheaper when you order later?


----------



## BushGuy

Don't bother canceling the current order to change amp - simply email him with the current order # in the title............and tell him what you want to do. He'll act accordingly..........just as I changed my orig. Reference order to the one with both 1/4" and miniplug outs. But, of course, my order is CC.

 What Dr Xin will do re the Sept sale price - it is impossible for anyone to accurately prognosticate about it. Personally, I won't have a hissy-fit no matter what he chooses to do about it. My order is in and I won't worry about getting the discount, or not.


----------



## tnmike1

X2


----------



## sugarinthegourd

It will be Sept 1 in China in a couple of hours. Think the price on fixup will go down immediately?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sugarinthegourd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It will be Sept 1 in China in a couple of hours. Think the price on fixup will go down immediately? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Dr. Xin is in the USA!


----------



## slwiser

Yes, Dr. Xin lives in the United States. This is not in China, at least not yet.


----------



## sugarinthegourd

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dr. Xin is in the USA! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

D'oh!

 I thought I read somewhere that he lived in Hunan province. OK, so 2 hours to go till the new price?


----------



## jamato8

His parents live in Hunan Province and that is where he came from but not now, he lives in Oregon, up here where the deer and rivers run and geese poop everywhere.


----------



## Sugano-san

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HiFlight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One can log onto the main page, (www.fixup.net)._

 


 No. One cannot.



 At least not at this point.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_His parents live in Hunan Province and that is where he came from but not now, he lives in Oregon, up here where the deer and rivers run and geese poop everywhere._

 

and apparently no one owns shotguns so they can have venison and goose dinners???


----------



## SONGsanmanwah

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_His parents live in Hunan Province and that is where he came from but not now, he lives in Oregon, up here where the deer and rivers run and geese poop everywhere._

 

So does Phil LaRocco IIRC. Two milestone portable amp designers enjoying nature. Must be a good place to visit.


----------



## sugarinthegourd

OK, the new September price for the Xin reference is now up on fixup.net and it's only $149! 



























 Just kidding, site is still down...

 (ducking and running)


----------



## mamboman

And now the site is down! sigh


----------



## naamanf

I guess it's a good thing I got this yesterday


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I guess it's a good thing I got this yesterday 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







_

 

congratulations, kind of like you have found the holy grail or something!!!!






 maybe you can now be the first person to add your date of order and recieved date to the thread . which you have kind of done, but when did you order it?


----------



## fkclo

Sent my SuperMacro IV to Xin for a maxxed out + update in mid Apr.

 Paypal payment in Jun 2007 after reading about the cost of the update power supply.

 Asked Xin to switch to Reference in early July.

 Still waiting....... have no Xin amps with me for over 4 months. 

 ....waiting


----------



## naamanf

Ordered Feb 22. 
 Received Aug 31.


----------



## kaushama

So how does it sound? We are eagerly waiting for your impressions!!


----------



## jamato8

Pretty good but it will take some time to settle. I think the new Reference with the 22,000uf cap and a few changes has great sound right out of the box, which to me is not totally unusual but how good it sounds without some of the ups and downs is a surprise. I got one day before yesterday like the above pictured. I am also listening with my new PROline 750's and they are not broke in and it is reported they take at least 200 hours but I notice I am hearing things like tape hiss on Dire Straits that I had noticed much before.

 Oh, and I love being able to use the 1/4 jack, what a great idea.


----------



## slwiser

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 Oh, and I love being able to use the 1/4 jack, what a great idea._

 

Thanks, I will take credit for that one. I really enjoy it too on mine. When it is plugged into the quarter the connection feels so stable. My unit looks just like the one pictured.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Ordered Feb 22. 
 Received Aug 31. 
 

So is this an indication of production mode or slow transition???


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sugarinthegourd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OK, the new September price for the Xin reference is now up on fixup.net and it's only $149! _

 

Heh, you had me going there for a sec. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 But just one sec.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered Feb 22. 
 Received Aug 31._

 

Wow. Just look at that! It defies the mind. 

 Xin might consider changing the "appearance" of his ordering process. For instance, if instead of placing an _order_ on a certain date, you place a _request_ and go on the waiting list. I think people might complain less about time passed if they're on a so-called waiting list rather than waiting indefinitely for an something they believe they have already ordered/paid for (even though Xin doesn't usually charge until he ships). There's obviously no difference here... you get the amp when you get it, but psychologically it might lower the expectations of the customer regarding lag time.


----------



## slwiser

^ The Reference did not come into mind until May. What he did was to order another version and changed it to the Reference mostly likely.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

^Yeah, ok fine, but how exactly does that invalidate my point?


----------



## slwiser

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_^Yeah, ok fine, but how exactly does that invalidate my point?_

 

I did not say it did...just noting the path and as a matter of fact it does nothing to invalidate your point.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I hate the internet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It removes too many communication cues we take for granted


----------



## mamboman

Is Xin back in production mode?


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mamboman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is Xin back in production mode?_

 

Pray that he is


----------



## shiezan

He's in the mystery mode right now.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, and I love being able to use the 1/4 jack, what a great idea._

 

Are you referring to the 1/4 input or output jack?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Are you referring to the 1/4 input or output jack?_

 

I would personally say both. I avoid a plug converter on the output side and the 1/4" plug is just so much more mechanically stable


----------



## only500made

Quote:


 Wow. Just look at that! It defies the mind.

 Xin might consider changing the "appearance" of his ordering process. For instance, if instead of placing an order on a certain date, you place a request and go on the waiting list. I think people might complain less about time passed if they're on a so-called waiting list rather than waiting indefinitely for an something they believe they have already ordered/paid for (even though Xin doesn't usually charge until he ships). There's obviously no difference here... you get the amp when you get it, but psychologically it might lower the expectations of the customer regarding lag time 
 

Totally agree. 

 This is what's keeping me from buying any of Dr. Xin's creations.The waiting period without any "progress report" is for people who are VERY patient. 

 I don't think I can have a piece of mind sending out my CC information out there for long, it's like sleeping at night with your doors wide open/unlocked. Even though he/she will charge you at the time of shipping, the bottom line is: your CC information is still out there. 

My only tip: have a final production model.

 It's a good thing he/she is a perfectionist but somehow you gotta put out of final product out there and it should be the basis for the production model. These tweeks or upgrades, for me, is a sign of selling an unfinished product.
 When you put something out there for sale, it should be final. I can understand repairs, but tweeks, furthur research, etc? Give me a break. That tells me:

 1. the person does it on his/her personal time or whenever he's free to do it and that;

 2. the person is not dedicated to his business.

 I understand the concept of supply and demand,but come on. You can't have hundreds of people waiting at a time. 

 Now this doesn't mean I won't but anything from Dr. Xin (and in fact I might someday), but I just hope he changes his production and selling practices. I'm pretty sure that if he changes his practices, people will notice it and recognize him and probably have a good share on the amp market right now.

 my .02


----------



## shiezan

lol,
 thats what everyone has been saying for the last 73 pages in this thread.


----------



## icantusefizz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_lol,
 thats what everyone has been saying for the last 73 pages in this thread._

 

Amen. I vote for "no complaining". All in favour say "Kindly resist moving your lips xin-haters".

 -Fizz
 ps. I've been waiting over 5 months.


----------



## BushGuy

You must have seen that absurdly low price that suddenly appeared as posted above. It strongly suggests to me that there was a hacking incident to his pages and they're working so that it doesn't get repeated - at least that's my take on the situation.
 .......and I'm getting a little sick of the comments that infer he could possibly be less than totally honorable. They're totally unwarranted. Whether serious or presumed to be jest - shame on such posters. Talk is exceedingly cheap on the 'net.


----------



## sugarinthegourd

Quote:


 You must have seen that absurdly low price that suddenly appeared as posted above. 
 

That was my post above, and if you read it again, you will see it was just a joke on my part. Apologies for any confusion!


----------



## kugino

it's funny how every few pages you see the same post: "is xin in production mode yet?" he makes a good product, but way too much of a wild card for me...


----------



## kaushama

This whole thread serves people to just express their concerns. And perhaps rough date of arrival when production starts. 
 There had been many cycles of same thing happening throughout the history of the whole thread if you carefully see. some Thrashing and criticizing; some patronizing him. Some being neutral watching things.
 It has been a long time after it was started. None of the comments has changed Dr. xin's way of conduct! In fact it has become worse.
 However strong we shout here, there are few things that newbies understand if they march into Xin's zone.

He is always improving his designs and it is a dynamic audio project.

He is not very communicative esp when he develops a design.

There is a very long waiting time (several months) before you get the amp. But one always get his amp as he never cheated someone by not sending an amp.

When you order it is better to order with Credit card as he doesn't charge the card till he ships it. So that if one decides, he can cancel the order.

You always get a very good amp; one of the best amongst competitors.

He is the very unique in providing life long support and upgrades to his products, irrespective of the order of ownership.

He is not very keen on making his project similar to a typical business model, however hard his critics shout at him. In fact he never visits this place.

 So one should get involved in Xin's amps, if he understands these few facts. Irrespective of being so distractive, I still see lots of people chase his products simply because they are very good. Buying a Xin amp is like getting a subscription to sample his on-going audio project. It will never stop but you get a ticket to enjoy various stages of his development. Better way of enjoying them is to get an amp and enjoy it for long period without paying too much attention to minor tweaks he does. Even without these tweaks they are kick-ass amps. If he stops at a random moment and tells you this is the final product, we all will take it as final!!! Won't we? He doesn't do that. always try to take it to next level and give the result free of charge. That's good! 
 So best way to enjoy them get an amp! Enjoy! Don't run behind every little upgrades or fixes! When it becomes a service pack over a long period send it for upgrade! But have a back up for long wait time.
 If you don't like it that way just stop cursing and getting yourself tense!! Look somewhere else. Simple as that!!!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

kaushama, that's like the ultimate sticky on xin 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 it's pretty accurate and fair, you should maybe add it to the first post on this thread (and xin might stick it on fixup.net as well! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )


----------



## fl00r

I have been waiting 4 times 9 months for my wife to deliver, so Xin isn't that slow.


----------



## Quaddy

omg - its really quite simple, *everyone knows* about the epic wait involved with ordering, therefore by definition those who order, myself included must really wish to aquire an amp that is of the best quality possible.

 the wait although a small detractor, serves as a mere annoying inconvenience, heck, i actually think it adds kudos and gravitas to those who eventually own a XIN, its like, wow - welcome to the club man, i know what you have been through. 

 after all, as mentioned in various topics and posts on this forum, we are talking about audiophiles, who will strive to get the best at all costs, disproportionate as it may seem to the non-believers

 at the end of the day the last laugh is with those who have ordered, and will end up with a magnificent power house of an amp, not the discreditors whos only negative against the man is a poor customer service, of which probably 99% havent even experienced first hand, just heard about.

 the old proverb, "_Good things come to those who wait_" is most apt here.


----------



## tnmike1

add one more point I don't think has been mentioned: some of us own two or more of Xin's amps. I personally own the SUpermacro IV LE--bought here from Antonyfirst--and have the Reference on order. So when Reference comes, I'll send back the SM IV for upgrades, then wait 4-5 months for its return. Meanwhile, I've got a Xin amp to listen to.

 In other words, some of us usually have one amp in upgrade mode while we use the one we have "in hand" for listening. This way, we aren't without at least one Xin amp at all times

 Makes the waiting easier


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This whole thread serves people to just express their concerns. And perhaps rough date of arrival when production starts. 
 There had been many cycles of same thing happening throughout the history of the whole thread if you carefully see. some Thrashing and criticizing; some patronizing him. Some being neutral watching things.
 It has been a long time after it was started. None of the comments has changed Dr. xin's way of conduct! In fact it has become worse.
 However strong we shout here, there are few things that newbies understand if they march into Xin's zone.

He is always improving his designs and it is a dynamic audio project.

He is not very communicative esp when he develops a design.

There is a very long waiting time (several months) before you get the amp. But one always get his amp as he never cheated someone by not sending an amp.

When you order it is better to order with Credit card as he doesn't charge the card till he ships it. So that if one decides, he can cancel the order.

You always get a very good amp; one of the best amongst competitors.

He is the very unique in providing life long support and upgrades to his products, irrespective of the order of ownership.

He is not very keen on making his project similar to a typical business model, however hard his critics shout at him. In fact he never visits this place.

 So one should get involved in Xin's amps, if he understands these few facts. Irrespective of being so distractive, I still see lots of people chase his products simply because they are very good. Buying a Xin amp is like getting a subscription to sample his on-going audio project. It will never stop but you get a ticket to enjoy various stages of his development. Better way of enjoying them is to get an amp and enjoy it for long period without paying too much attention to minor tweaks he does. Even without these tweaks they are kick-ass amps. If he stops at a random moment and tells you this is the final product, we all will take it as final!!! Won't we? He doesn't do that. always try to take it to next level and give the result free of charge. That's good! 
 So best way to enjoy them get an amp! Enjoy! Don't run behind every little upgrades or fixes! When it becomes a service pack over a long period send it for upgrade! But have a back up for long wait time.
 If you don't like it that way just stop cursing and getting yourself tense!! Look somewhere else. Simple as that!!!_

 

Very well said. Couldn't add more to this.

 Peace to all.

 F. Lo


----------



## noypi

i ve got a question regarding my super micro iv, and it is off topic.. but my super micro turns off when the battery is moved.. liked when the batter is rotated a little in the case, it suddenly turns off, and when i rotate the battery again, it suddenly turns on again.. should i mail this back to xin or is there a fix to this.??
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 coz, i know that by sending this back, ill be waitng again.. hahaha!! but if there is no fix, i know its worth the wait.. this amp really really is great.. just plain awesome..


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This whole thread serves people to just express their concerns. And perhaps rough date of arrival when production starts. 
 There had been many cycles of same thing happening throughout the history of the whole thread if you carefully see. some Thrashing and criticizing; some patronizing him. Some being neutral watching things.
 It has been a long time after it was started. None of the comments has changed Dr. xin's way of conduct! In fact it has become worse.
 However strong we shout here, there are few things that newbies understand if they march into Xin's zone.

He is always improving his designs and it is a dynamic audio project.

He is not very communicative esp when he develops a design.

There is a very long waiting time (several months) before you get the amp. But one always get his amp as he never cheated someone by not sending an amp.

When you order it is better to order with Credit card as he doesn't charge the card till he ships it. So that if one decides, he can cancel the order.

You always get a very good amp; one of the best amongst competitors.

He is the very unique in providing life long support and upgrades to his products, irrespective of the order of ownership.

He is not very keen on making his project similar to a typical business model, however hard his critics shout at him. In fact he never visits this place.

 So one should get involved in Xin's amps, if he understands these few facts. Irrespective of being so distractive, I still see lots of people chase his products simply because they are very good. Buying a Xin amp is like getting a subscription to sample his on-going audio project. It will never stop but you get a ticket to enjoy various stages of his development. Better way of enjoying them is to get an amp and enjoy it for long period without paying too much attention to minor tweaks he does. Even without these tweaks they are kick-ass amps. If he stops at a random moment and tells you this is the final product, we all will take it as final!!! Won't we? He doesn't do that. always try to take it to next level and give the result free of charge. That's good! 
 So best way to enjoy them get an amp! Enjoy! Don't run behind every little upgrades or fixes! When it becomes a service pack over a long period send it for upgrade! But have a back up for long wait time.
 If you don't like it that way just stop cursing and getting yourself tense!! Look somewhere else. Simple as that!!!_

 


 VERY well said mate, you summed it all in.

 My SuperMicro-IV is of 04/11 batch, and I know that Xin did another tweak to SuperMicro-IV after that. But you know what? my SuperMicro-IV is sooo freakin good that I don't give a crap if it's not as updated. They really kick ass. So much so that my decision to get a Xin Reference was purely due to curiosity (Xinphilia). I am convinced the SuperMicro-IV 04/11 will hold steadfast pitted against Xin Reference because the SuperMicro-IV has passed the trial of fire for my application (stellar synergy with my rig).

 So, if you decide to get a Xin amp, pull the trigger and enjoy the ride - it's not gonna be a smooth ride for sure


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *noypi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i ve got a question regarding my super micro iv, and it is off topic.. but my super micro turns off when the battery is moved.. liked when the batter is rotated a little in the case, it suddenly turns off, and when i rotate the battery again, it suddenly turns on again.. should i mail this back to xin or is there a fix to this.??
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 coz, i know that by sending this back, ill be waitng again.. hahaha!! but if there is no fix, i know its worth the wait.. this amp really really is great.. just plain awesome..
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It's quite easy to fix. The SuperMicro-IV uses thin copper for the battery contact. If you are not getting a good fit for your AAA, you can bend (very carefully) the copper strip with your finger so that it will snug into the battery terminals closer. And then you can put in some sort of wedge at the side of the battery - a rolled masking tape will do the trick.


----------



## HiFlight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mamboman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is Xin back in production mode?_

 

Yes he is...I spoke with him this evening. He is now delivering the Reference and working thru his backlog of amps that have been sent to him for upgrading. A very busy man! 

 His server remains down, and he is still trying to get things fixed. The problem is not his, but rather the server who handles much of that type of website/forum. Hopefully, it will be up again soon.


----------



## icantusefizz

I just did possibly the most extreme/awesome dance a heterosexual white man could accomplish, in public, strictly due to the news i have just read. 

 Thank you god,
 Thank you Xin,

 Now i just have to wait till it arrives, then wait the 400ish hours it takes to burn in, and im GOOD TO GO!

 -Fizz
 ps.


----------



## srikeerthi

Thanks for the update HiFlight!

 But does that mean he is working/delivering only new References only? Or other amps too (I ordered SuperMicro IV)?


----------



## tk3

Wow, that's great news!


----------



## kokohore

That's good to hear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered SMini 04/Mar/2007, 
 and finally we, the members of the 6months club are getting our amps soon, right?


----------



## dle4e_2005

His server is no longer down.

 I'm have just entered the 4 month club.
 Hope to get my Reference soon.


----------



## Jeremy1234

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dle4e_2005* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_His server is no longer down.

 I'm have just entered the 4 month club.
 Hope to get my Reference soon._

 

Same here. Hope this time will be faster since he is in production mode now.


----------



## Biff Wellington

5 month anniversary today WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Biff Wellington* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_5 month anniversary today WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!_

 

Comiserations, short term

 but congratulations long term


----------



## Nailzs

I ordered my reference amp yesterday. In the message box I wrote "EMERGENCY ! PLEASE RUSH!!"


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Totally agree._

 

I don't *totally* agree.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is what's keeping me from buying any of Dr. Xin's creations.The waiting period without any "progress report" is for people who are VERY patient._

 

The people that find out about Xin, know what they're getting in for. They, for one reason or another, don't NEED a[nother] portable amp in order to live.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't think I can have a piece of mind sending out my CC information out there for long, it's like sleeping at night with your doors wide open/unlocked. Even though he/she will charge you at the time of shipping, the bottom line is: your CC information is still out there._

 

The bottom line is, every time you give your CC info to anyone over the internet... it's prolly not as secure as you'd wanna believe. And that CC info is still stored on any website that you buy from, until the card expires. Did you know that you can use Google to search databases for CC info?

 Sending CC info is certainly not a legitimate reason to not trust Xin, because he has tons of customers who adore his work and talk about it all the time. Even if your CC info was compromised, your money is insured up to a pretty decent amount, I believe. So there shouldn't be too much to worry about.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's a good thing he/she is a perfectionist but somehow you gotta put out of final product out there and it should be the basis for the production model. These tweeks or upgrades, for me, is a sign of selling an unfinished product.
 When you put something out there for sale, it should be final. I can understand repairs, but tweeks, furthur research, etc? Give me a break. That tells me:

 1. the person does it on his/her personal time or whenever he's free to do it and that;

 2. the person is not dedicated to his business._

 

Wow.. you don't know much of anything do you? You're prolly a creationist, am I right? You don't believe evolution is necessary? Why must Apple only release one final version of their iPod; what do you have against different iPods being constantly flushed and slightly upgraded every few months or so??

 Xin is a perfectionist, and that's why I chose to buy one of his amps. He loves his job and his work so much that he will NOT let anyone piece the amps together other than himself. How many CEOs and owners give a crap about your experience with them or how well the product performs for you, or even spend more than 20 hours of real, actual work in an entire year so that you can get top-notch quality and so that less can come out of their paycheck?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I understand the concept of supply and demand,but come on. You can't have hundreds of people waiting at a time._

 

I think Xin customers who are patient enough to wait a few months are patient enough to wait a few more months for a better amp with even more refinement.

 If I heard about Intel's Q6600's (quad-core processor) new G0 stepping which requires less power, stays cooler, and gets better overclocks than the older B3 stepping version of this very same 2.4GHz quad-core processor... but Newegg or Dell or whoever sends me the hotter, power sucking, piece of crap instead. . . I'd be super pissed with the product from Day 1. With Xin, I know I've got the best product that his massive cranium has thought about within the past week.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Now this doesn't mean I won't but anything from Dr. Xin (and in fact I might someday), but I just hope he changes his production and selling practices. I'm pretty sure that if he changes his practices, people will notice it and recognize him and probably have a good share on the amp market right now._

 

He's certainly an odd fellow. But most smart and intriguing people are a lil' odd. I really wish he would find some people he can trust to follow his directions to properly piece these tiny amps together, but everybody is different and maybe he really is the only person he's met that's right for the job? I guess I'm just one of the ones that could & will continue to wait for his amp because I've prolly got another 70+ years to live if we actually don't nuke each other, and I'd like to purchase products with the best value so that I don't spend too much time working on bills or working on repairing or replacing crappy purchases.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *only500made* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_my .02_

 

Ditto.


----------



## tnmike1

wonder who wee wee'd in grndslm's cereal this morning. Sure sounds a little cranky.


----------



## tk3

He is prolly sick of people whining about Xin's business practice considering it's been done to death, just to look at the length of this topic, or the fact that it exists at all.


----------



## tnmike1

tk3: O OK--just wasn't sure, since there's no profile for him/her, whether it was the time of morning (3 a.m.) andhe/she was tired or some other time of day if he/she is in Europe, Asia or whatever and he/she was stressed out. Just sounded overall grumpy and not too happy with life


----------



## jamato8

My "new" Reference with the 1/4 and 1/8 Xin and out is burning in just fine. I thought the bass might need a bit more impact and that my 12,000uf Reference was quicker but as the 22,000uf is burning in what a beauty this is. Open, spacious, open, and spac, . . . sorry. This amp is fun and frankly like a fine violin. What a creation. So free of any artifacts of electronic heaviness. This amp just flows.

 I really, really like being able to use the 1/4 jack as it is very solid and with my big phones, no more adapters.


----------



## tk3

Does that mean you got one of the finished references, Jamato?


----------



## sugarinthegourd

I ordered a Reference last night.


----------



## slwiser

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My "new" Reference with the 1/4 and 1/8 Xin and out is burning in just fine. I thought the bass might need a bit more impact and that my 12,000uf Reference was quicker but as the 22,000uf is burning in what a beauty this is. Open, spacious, open, and spac, . . . sorry. This amp is fun and frankly like a fine violin. What a creation. So free of any artifacts of electronic heaviness. This amp just flows.

 I really, really like being able to use the 1/4 jack as it is very solid and with my big phones, no more adapters._

 

My near final Beta sound much like the one you have. I have been very surprised at how it compares with my other amps.


----------



## gnychis

supermicro ordered 9/06/07


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_wonder who wee wee'd in grndslm's cereal this morning. Sure sounds a little cranky._

 

I'm a night person... but really, I'm just confused how these people can complain when they know what they're getting into.


----------



## wgleich

So I placed an order for a SuperMicro iV on May 31st, 2007 and have send at least one email (July 19th) to check status with no response. So I have decided to move on and cancel my order. I hold nothing against Xin and wish him best of luck, the likes of Ray Samuels and other fine business's will be getting my cash. I have no doubt that his product sounds amazing, but wondering where and when it will showup it taking to much attention.

 Good luck to the patient ones ...

 Warren


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm a night person... but really, I'm just confused how these people can complain when they know what they're getting into._

 

Nothing is black and white like that with human beings, man. We make decisions from moment to moment, and sometimes we later have second thoughts, regrets, change our minds, change them back. 

 I read your post and I really understand the perspective you're coming from. But it's not the only valid perspective. For instance, there are people like me. I realized the wait I was getting into (well, 3 months was my expectation), but I just had to try a Xin amp, so I agreed to stomach the wait, to go through the mental pain, all for the sake of that final prize. I was willing to do that 5 months ago. I'm still willing to do it now. But don't ask me to grin and bear it... don't ask me to smile and say thank you through this uncomfortable process. I guess my point is that I think I have a right to be a Xin customer _and_ complain. I think customer feedback helps a business in the end. 

 You talk about the value of evolution in his products. I believe in that too - only I'd like an evolution in his customer service. 

 I guess I have two final thoughts. First, I think people have the right to voice their opinions, experiences and, yes, complaints on an internet message board for God's sake. Second, and perhaps this underlies your (and others') frustration with the people who complain, I don't think any amount of wanking is going to change Xin and his business practices. So perhaps the final message to people on this thread should be this: "Yes, you have the right to complain, and no it's not going to do any good."


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So perhaps the final message to people on this thread should be this: "Yes, you have the right to complain, and no it's not going to do any good."_

 

"....So please do us a favor and post your order and arrival date like what the thread was meant to be."


----------



## som4ew

"....So please do us a favor and post your order and arrival date like what the thread was meant to be."
 x2


----------



## vandread

ordered ref on aug 7, 2007. So today is my 1 month aniversary...... a few month to go.......


----------



## wgleich

It is painful to not have any idea where your order is in processing and the only tangible feedback is the community that has order and received their amps. I was prepared for a several month wait when I ordered my SMIV back in May (31st to be exact), what I was not anticipating was Xin going into a development phase for a new product and then shipping that new product without even responding to my inquiries about my order. It certainly does not make you feel like a valued customer. I understand he is a one man shop and an "artisan". The shame of the matter is I know he reads email as when I cancelled my order I received a confirmation within a matter of hours.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"....So please do us a favor and post your order and arrival date like what the thread was meant to be."
 x2_


----------



## Aaron622

Ordered my Reference on August 12.


----------



## som4ew

I sent both my Ref and Macro max out on the end of May, after had been playing them for 1 week, hoping to get them back in 2-3 week as said.I have not heard from Xin since then with exception of a couple short reply mails. But I know they in the process, and I know I will get it when my turn come.


----------



## tk3

I ordered mine early August, I'll consider myself lucky if it's here before November is over.


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Aaron622* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered my Reference on August 12._

 

I ordered mine the 8th, so lets wait 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 and see who is getting his first.


----------



## Pokato

I ordered my Reference on Aug 10.


----------



## dealmaster00

I'm approaching the 4 month waiting time!


----------



## bunsco

Hi Guys

 Ive decided to join the pain!!

 8th September AD 2007 and counting......

 just what have i just got myself into - hope it sparks 'true' life into my HD595/ipod classic combo - when it comes.

 gonna order line out from apuresound.com - if they offer a good budget/cheaper solution.


----------



## gp_hebert

Just bought a used RSA Hornet while waiting for my SuperMicro that should be here in 4-5 months.


----------



## som4ew

Nobody seem to receive XIN amp lately.


----------



## nc8000

I assume he is in development mode again as I have not been able to get any replies to several emails the last 3 weeks


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I assume he is in development mode again as I have not been able to get any replies to several emails the last 3 weeks_

 

x2


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HiFlight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes he is...I spoke with him this evening. He is now delivering the Reference and working thru his backlog of amps that have been sent to him for upgrading. A very busy man! 

 His server remains down, and he is still trying to get things fixed. The problem is not his, but rather the server who handles much of that type of website/forum. Hopefully, it will be up again soon._

 

What about this? Posted on 4 sept.

 Oh Xin, you're like a heroin addict.
 "just 1 more shot, I'll quit tomorrow, honest!" OK, REALLY just one more this time. Hey wait, this needs some tweaking too, guess I'll do that really fast."


----------



## lisnalee

ordered mine in august and my westone 3's back in april, I wonder which one will turn up first. My money's on xin


----------



## jamato8

I have a feeling there is some work going on in the bass section. Not that I think it needs it but Xin may and he knows what he wants.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I'm under the impression that Xin is still tweaking the Reference, and that he's also tweaking the SuperMicroIV (post 4/11). Is that correct, or is he just working on the ref now?


----------



## som4ew

You mean he's in seclusion again


----------



## rxc

Man, I'm thinking I should've bought two Supermicros. One to send into upgrade and one to use.


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 Man, I'm thinking I should've bought two Supermicros. One to send into upgrade and one to use. 
 

I got 2 xin amps but sent both to upgrade.


----------



## Computerstud

Ordered on Sept 4, 2007. 

 For those who have heard the Xin Reference; is it comparable to a good home amp in the same price range?


----------



## icantusefizz

Sigh. I've been so patient with xin. But im beginning to get frustrated. I knew what i was getting myself into when i ordered my amp but i keep getting my hopes up about getting it soon. 

 Oh well. The wait continues.

 -Fizz


----------



## tk3

When did you order? Just curious.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Computerstud* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered on Sept 4, 2007. 

 For those who have heard the Xin Reference; is it comparable to a good home amp in the same price range?_

 

I find that it is better than any home amps in its price and better than ones I have heard for much more.


----------



## icantusefizz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you order? Just curious._

 

march 25th


----------



## sbulack

At one point there were three Beta Versions, with 12000, 15000 and 22000 caps, each with identifiable strengths - with folks wondering which ONE Xin would pick as THE product. At this point, I'm wondering if he's trying to deliver as THE product an amp with the strengths of ALL of the Betas. If so, I can see why he's still in development mode, and it makes the wait all the more worth it, IMO. While I wait, I'm VERY happy with what I'm listening to. I find the anticipation to be on the delicious side, especially given the descriptions of the three Betas with different sized caps. I, for one, am REALLY GLAD that the good Dr. Xin is not rushing to fill Reference orders (including mine). I'm confident that the improvements bought for the price of the additional development time will be well worth it.

 BTW, I sent payment via PayPal with an order for a Reference (with both 1/8" and 1/4" jacks on both Xin and Out sides) on August 8, 2007. I'll post again when it arrives. If you guys don't hear from me again before then, "Happy New Year, 2008".


----------



## PPkiller

"Happy New Year, 2009" ?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I find that it is better than any home amps in its price and better than ones I have heard for much more._

 

The only amp I have heard that betters the Reference is my EarMax AE and not by a factor any where comparable to the price difference between them. The Reference really is a little wonder and works fantastic for me with my iMod and Ety's, it is actually the reason why I went and rebought Ety's.


----------



## shiezan

I think the reason why Xin always goes into research mode is because he probably reads all the comments about his products on this forum like
 "The supermicro sounds better than mini and macro"
 and takes every word seriously.

 If we wanna shorten the wait time and just have him ship his amps because theyre already good enough, we shouldn't say anything that will make him feel insecure about the perfection in his amps.


----------



## som4ew

He's not read this forum.


----------



## Sanddancer

Passed the 6 month mark about a week ago. Still no e-mail or amp


----------



## fl00r

x2 ...unfortunately...


----------



## rxc

6 months worth of backorders and upgrades...I wonder how long it will take Xin to clear it. Just the thought makes me cringe.


----------



## clc220

i wonder how the amp compares to the move and ibasso d1 ? anyone ?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rxc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_6 months worth of backorders and upgrades...I wonder how long it will take Xin to clear it. Just the thought makes me cringe._

 

Yeah, I have just today send my SuperMini back for repair plus possible upgrade as the right channel of the input jack is flaky and cuts out. I probably will not see the amp again this year but at least I have plenty of other amps to go around and at the moment the SuperMini is actually the weakest of the lot.


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *clc220* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i wonder how the amp compares to the move and ibasso d1 ? anyone ?_

 

i have not compare with Move but d1 stnad no chance against ref. my ref is a beta2 ref. ref just throw you into a bigger room with much better extension and energy. currently for portable range of amp, i only find SR71 and Lisa3 worth comparing to ref. Both SR71 and Lisa3 have something that ref is missing but oso missing something ref have.


----------



## BushGuy

There should be some peace amongst the natives in the outer-reaches of Xin-Land. A friend just emailed me that he's received notice that his Reference is winging its' way to his house.


----------



## tk3

Good news, did he also mention when he ordered it?


----------



## BushGuy

It would be a guess on my part, but I know it was AFTER I'd ordered mine. So the good news is some folks are getting theirs - but, where's mine? His note made me check if a charge had been made against my account. No, alas and alack - at this moment I'm slated for.............nothing


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It would be a guess on my part, but I know it was AFTER I'd ordered mine....._

 

BushGuy - 
 I see in this thread where you posted that you ordered your SuperMacro LE on 12/29 and it was shipped on 4/12. But I don't see where you posted in this thread when you ordered your Reference. When did you order the Reference?


----------



## BushGuy

You seem to be really, really observing - which might be nice if you were a slim, attractive YL..........I have doubts.
 An accurate answer would be somewhat involved. I used a subterfuge on the order form (since the Reference was not yet on the order form). August 9th I followed up to check whether the order was still "live" by adding the miniplug and 1/4 output option.........whereupon I was asked to resend CC info - that there had been some mishap with the retention of the info.. My friend would have made his order at or around that same August date.


----------



## tk3

Hey, that's really hope giving, thought you and you friend might be one of the guys that ordered their amp in Feb/March or so.


----------



## _j_

Today I join the esteemed 6 Month Wait club. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Can't be much longer now... or can it?
 We got anyone here on 7 months?


----------



## som4ew

you'll never know.


----------



## jamato8

I would imagine Xin, well I know Xin is, working on some aspect of the Reference or the like. I am listening to a current version and love the 1/4 jack and sound. I wish everyone had this to enjoy and feel bad that those who have ordered have such a long wait. Hopefully shipping will start soon. I know that whatever Xin comes up with will please. I guess it is like waiting for a fine instrument from a very very, very, very exacting creator.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would imagine Xin, well I know Xin is, working on some aspect of the Reference or the like. I am listening to a current version and love the 1/4 jack and sound. I wish everyone had this to enjoy and feel bad that those who have ordered have such a long wait. Hopefully shipping will start soon. I know that whatever Xin comes up with will please. I guess it is like waiting for a fine instrument from a very very, very, very exacting creator._

 

Like a Stradavarius. Nice image, John.

 I still have my SuperMacro IV (last "updated" sometime early this year) and a post 4/11 SuperMicro ready to go back to Xin for new moodifications. I am so glad I held on to them! It will be a while before they go back....separately!


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 I still have my SuperMacro IV (last "updated" sometime early this year) and a post 4/11 SuperMicro ready to go back to Xin for new moodifications. I am so glad I held on to them! It will be a while before they go back....separately! 
 

You're so lucky for holding back your amps.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You're so lucky for holding back your amps._

 

When it seems that an upgrade/modification is appropriate or recommended by reading this and Xin's forum, I always email Xin and ask him if he's ready to receive my amp(s) AND be able to honour a quick turn around. Either I don't hear from him or he tells me to send in the amp. Then I ask him if he is sure, and sometimes I don't hear from him (!!) and sometimes he says, yes. Then, and only then, do I send in an amp. The five times I have done this over the past three years, turn around has been a week or less. 

 Pain? Yes, but I always have a good amp!

 I have on old micro, a superdual (that still sounds so good!), a SuperMacro IV and SuperMicro IV. I never will be without one of the Micro IVs, sending in one or the other at a time for upgrades.


----------



## som4ew

It's my bad, I emailed ask him after I sent MacroIV back ,and he told I need to send Ref.back as well.


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 I have on old micro, a superdual (that still sounds so good!), a SuperMacro IV and SuperMicro IV. I never will be without one of the Micro IVs, sending in one or the other at a time for upgrades. 
 

That's what I plan to with my Macro IV and Ref. and on order Micro,so I'll never be without Xin amp again.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's what I plan to with my Macro IV and Ref. and on order Micro,so I'll never be without Xin amp again._

 

Smart man!!


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You seem to be really, really observing - which might be nice if you were a slim, attractive YL..........I have doubts.....
 My friend would have made his order at or around that same August date._

 

Sorry, Search is my good friend, and I'm a fairly typical Head-Fier (middle-aged guy, balding, with belly). But, anyway, thanks for the order/delivery info. It could portend well of things to come with the good (albeit inscrutable) and esteemed Dr. Xin.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Smart man!!_

 

X2!!


----------



## edwardsean

I have a supermini that I sent in for upgrades. I have heard that a few people here and there have received production References, has anyone received an upgraded unit? I'm willing to wait, I'm just curious.


----------



## bluey_02

Well, two days ago I reached the 6 month anniversary..siiigh*

 At this point I can only hope to receive my SMicro before Christmas..


----------



## ath

I sent it in for upgrades end of April, 2007 ( Yeah! year matters 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





) and still waiting. I exchanged emails with him earlyJune but have not heard anything since. I think he is focussing more on the reference than anything else for now. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *edwardsean* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a supermini that I sent in for upgrades. I have heard that a few people here and there have received production References, has anyone received an upgraded unit? I'm willing to wait, I'm just curious._


----------



## TAF94

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Passed the 6 month mark about a week ago. Still no e-mail or amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 Gee whiz, I'm appalled at that wait time for delivery. I was just about to order a SuperMicro-IV when I found this thread. Should I just buy an amp elsewhere or is it really worth the longsuffering months of anticipation?


----------



## jamato8

You don't understand, it is part of the whole experience. If you have not had to wait then you have not received a true Xin amp. :^) The sad thing is some people got so excited when they received their amp they did the touchdown dance and slammed it to the ground, only to realize an instant later what they had done. It wasn't pretty.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You don't understand, it is part of the whole experience. If you have not had to wait then you have not received a true Xin amp. :^) The sad thing is some people got so excited when they received their amp they did the touchdown dance and slammed it to the ground, only to realize an instant later what they had done. It wasn't pretty._

 

Quite the spin doctor and image builder, John! That's pretty funny!!

 I am so glad I held on to my two amps when it appeared that Xin was going into R&D hibernation. You have to be pretty vigilant and read these threads daily almost.


----------



## Duheed

considering my source is a laptop, would the xin do a better job than a d1/move


----------



## ChickenGod

I just recently hit the 4 month mark!

 May 13, 2007 - Sept 13, 2007

 So it's been 4 months and one day.


----------



## rxc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TAF94* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Gee whiz, I'm appalled at that wait time for delivery. I was just about to order a SuperMicro-IV when I found this thread. Should I just buy an amp elsewhere or is it really worth the longsuffering months of anticipation?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes it's worth the suffering but to ease it a bit just order the Xin amp and another amp (maybe a Tomahawk, Move, etc.). So while your Xin order is being processed you have something to tie you over.


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 Yes it's worth the suffering but to ease it a bit just order the Xin amp and another amp (maybe a Tomahawk, Move, etc.). So while your Xin order is being processed you have something to tie you over. 
 

I have used Hornet for 4+4 months now.


----------



## Duheed

can sum1 please answer my question


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Duheed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_can sum1 please answer my question_

 

no - to answer your first question, that is.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Duheed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_can sum1 please answer my question_

 


 An amp can only amplify what is the source is giving it and most dacs in laptops and the circuitry isn't the best so taking the digital signal off of the laptop and using a higher quality off board dac will get you a better source signal for the amp to work with. The finest amp in the world won't sound good if the source is suspect. Having said this I still think a better amp will end up sounding better than one of poorer sound quality from a source that is not totally lacking. Geez, I don't think I said anything to answer your question. :^)


----------



## lostbobby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Duheed* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_considering my source is a laptop, would the xin do a better job than a d1/move_

 

apple laptop: decent, listenable source

 my 2-year old Toshiba laptop: utterly miserable source, must have DAC.


----------



## Duheed

thanks for ur help


----------



## dimm0k

9/16/07 - Supermicro IV ordered...


----------



## yourtoys7

Just purchased RCA Tomahawk' silver, having trouble waiting. I'll be nice to compare once it comes...


----------



## zeckwsr

march 1 till now.....still waitin!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 6.5 months


----------



## PPkiller

someone should have bought the rights from xin to manufacture the amp on his behalf... this will solve so much pain everyone is going through...


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PPkiller* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_someone should have bought the rights from xin to manufacture the amp on his behalf... this will solve so much pain everyone is going through..._

 

hmmm, i think that wouldnt be the same, its cause xin is a hands on perfectionist that i like to buy his stuff.

 the pain of waiting is a rights of passage


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zeckwsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_march 1 till now.....still waitin!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 6.5 months_

 

i ordered in early september..i'll be waiting a while needless to say


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zeckwsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_march 1 till now.....still waitin!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 6.5 months_

 

I too ordered on the 1st of March. Welcome to the 200+ days club


----------



## Dexter Morgan

You've been waiting four months? Yeah, yeah, big deal. Six months? Join the club. You're going to need at least nine months to impress me now.


----------



## Happymonkey

Ordered:
 Xin Reference w/ 1/4 & 1/8 input/output.
 Date:
 Sept. 17th, 2007. 
 Arrived:
 ????????????


 I'm in for the long wait, hopefully the good Doctor will...well do what he does best 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 .


----------



## aluren

looks like some people have been getting their xin reference amps... i noticed two FS threads already... hopefully they didn't turn out too bad having to sell them so quick...


----------



## tk3

Think they are both beta versions, at least nc3000's is.
 And in the other one's FS thread it's asking for what cap, so that probably isn't the final model either unless Xin is releasing multiple versions with different caps.

 Oh, I so await the day this thread or board is flooded with "shipped" messages, I hope that when he does finally send them out it'll go relatively fast, say a batch of xx amps each week.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And in the other one's FS thread it's asking for what cap, so that probably isn't the final model either unless Xin is releasing multiple versions with different caps._

 

I bought that one...actually I reaquired it, because it was mine in the first place
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I didn't look what cap it had when I had it (it was only a couple days), but I will when I get it on Thursday.


----------



## tk3

Any word on the happenings in Xin-land from you more informed people?


----------



## PhaedrusX

i put in an order for the reference a short time ago.

 this is crazy.

 seriously.

 i shake my head whenever i think about it.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Any word on the happenings in Xin-land from you more informed people?_

 

I don't think anyone is hearing from him. I could be wrong but if anyone is hearing something they haven't posted it. One person who normally always hears from Xin hasn't for more than a month and I used to get replies but I do not either. Deep in development I guess. ??


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't think anyone is hearing from him. I could be wrong but if anyone is hearing something they haven't posted it. One person who normally always hears from Xin hasn't for more than a month and I used to get replies but I do not either. Deep in development I guess. ??_

 

Or going for bankruptcy. No amp output > no $$ income.


----------



## evilking

I'm so glad I cancelled my order a month ago. His amps just don't seem unique any more, what with everybody and their cousin producing portable amps now, the choice is overwhelming.

 Honestly, who can defend _6 month_ waiting times? Not only that but developing and _releasing_ another amp with so many long outstanding orders? Awful business practices. 


 Thumbs down 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 EK


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Or going for bankruptcy. No amp output > no $$ income.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

He is also a computer specialist and has been in great demand in the past. I know he is doing some work in this field now so I don't think he is filing bankruptcy by any stretch of the imagination.


----------



## MrJingles

I feel for you guys, but I cancelled a couple of months ago and am so glad I did. The Pico will be out in 2 months and I doubt any of you will have your Xin amps, even by then. 
 Good luck!


----------



## Nailzs

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He is also a computer specialist and has been in great demand in the past. I know he is doing some work in this field now so I don't think he is filing bankruptcy by any stretch of the imagination._

 

So we can assume that amp building is a side profession for Xin?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nailzs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So we can assume that amp building is a side profession for Xin?_

 

I can not assume one way or the other. I do know that Xin devotes much time to the development of his amps and has much space specifically for this purpose.


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrJingles* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I feel for you guys, but I cancelled a couple of months ago and am so glad I did. The Pico will be out in 2 months and I doubt any of you will have your Xin amps, even by then. 
 Good luck!_

 

Pico? BTW, if you think Xin is bad, head over to ipastudio.com and ask them about the larocco audio diablo...


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Pico? BTW, if you think Xin is bad, head over to ipastudio.com and ask them about the larocco audio diablo..._

 

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=257961

 Jam


----------



## greydragon

Seems like there are a lot of other folks who ordered the Xin Reference... like me. I bet there will be a long wait time for these Xin Refs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (4-8 months?)

 I can only hope that they better the Tomahawk to justify the tortuous wait.


----------



## gp_hebert

I don't get the thing about canceling a Xin order... You're not charged until it ships and you can sell it for at least as much as you paid once you get it if you don't like the sound. It's pretty much risk-free and you can certainly enjoy another amp (Hornet in my case) while waiting. But, more cancellations means I will get my SuperMicro faster, so keep canceling guys.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gp_hebert* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But, more cancellations means I will get my SuperMicro faster, so keep canceling guys. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 x2!!


----------



## Computerstud

It is not the wait that kills you it is the not knowing when that is most painful. If Xin were to say, "your wait will be 6 months or 4 months" that would be fine. However, the unknown is what scares me the most. I'm sure/unsure there are tons of people ahead of me waiting for the reference and with the one man show that is Xin's industry I feel almost lost without a glimpse of hope for the arrival of the amp.


----------



## jamato8

I wish I knew what was going on. I would guess there are very few of the new version out there and this version may very well change. I am listening to one now and it is good, well very good and not even burnt-in yet. I don't understand what is going on. The 1/4 inch jack is very nice. 

 Jam


----------



## greydragon

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Computerstud* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It is not the wait that kills you it is the not knowing when that is most painful. If Xin were to say, "your wait will be 6 months or 4 months" that would be fine. However, the unknown is what scares me the most. I'm sure/unsure there are tons of people ahead of me waiting for the reference and with the one man show that is Xin's industry I feel almost lost without a glimpse of hope for the arrival of the amp._

 

I totally agree. Xin knows that his amp business is doing great, so why doesn't he hire associates to help build the amps and he does the final touch-ups and QA?


----------



## flargosa

He is a perfectionist, he probably doesn't feel comfortable letting someone build with him. His amp designs and building technique are probably his own kept secret too, certainly don't want someone else copying it. 

 I am also hoping my Reference will arrive soon, been waiting two months now, but definitely don't want to get it now, might get a beta version.


----------



## Corbet

Why does Xin use cheap looking ugly parts? I'm sure everyone well say "All that matters is SQ!" but seriously, Xin's volume knobs look very cheap looking.


----------



## shiezan

Yea, its very cheap looking, but very durable.


----------



## jlingo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm so glad I cancelled my order a month ago. His amps just don't seem unique any more, what with everybody and their cousin producing portable amps now, the choice is overwhelming.

 Honestly, who can defend 6 month waiting times? Not only that but developing and releasing another amp with so many long outstanding orders? Awful business practices. 


 Thumbs down 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 EK_

 

You are glad you cancelled since you haven't tried listening to his amp.
 If your friend own Xin Amps, and you did listen to it, YOU MAY eventually REGRET YOU CANCELLED YOUR ORDER. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't live in Denial,
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 heheh admit it you were lusting after Xin Amp, until you had to reprogram your brain to stay happy even after cancelling your order hahaha.

 My friend once said, " Ignorance is a Bliss!"


----------



## Corbet

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jlingo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You are glad you cancelled since you haven't tried listening to his amp.
 If your friend own Xin Amps, and you did listen to it, YOU MAY eventually REGRET YOU CANCELLED YOUR ORDER. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't live in Denial,
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 heheh admit it you were lusting after Xin Amp, until you had to reprogram your brain to stay happy even after cancelling your order hahaha.

 My friend once said, " Ignorance is a Bliss!"_

 

Except for the fact that someone can purchase and enjoy a different amp for 6+ months before he even has the chance for the XIN to get to him.

 Not worth it.


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Corbet* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Except for the fact that someone can purchase and enjoy a different amp for 6+ months before he even has the chance for the XIN to get to him.

 Not worth it._

 

And that's what they usually do. Then they sell one or the other that they don't prefer. I think most people who end up ordering a Xin amp has a backup in mind or already has an amp. "Worth" is relative 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## jlingo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Corbet* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Except for the fact that someone can purchase and enjoy a different amp for 6+ months before he even has the chance for the XIN to get to him.

 Not worth it._

 

Xin doesn't charge my credit card unless it's ready for shipping, so in the mean time, while waiting for his amp to come I still have my budget to buy other amps.

 Also, Worth, is a very hard word. Unless you have listened to Xin Amp before, then you are entitled to your opinion on how much this amp worth. If you haven't even listened to his amp, how would you know if something Worth it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's like me saying, it's not worth it to go to visit Universal Studio. But, I have never even been to The Universal Studio all my life. How would I know whether it's worth it. It doesn't really make sense does it?

 Just a thought.


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jlingo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin doesn't charge my credit card unless it's ready for shipping, so in the mean time, while waiting for his amp to come I still have my budget to buy other amps.

 Also, Worth, is a very hard word. Unless you have listened to Xin Amp before, then you are entitled to have opinion of how much this amp worth. If you haven't even listened to his amp, how would you know if something Worth it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's like me saying, it's not worth it to go to visit Universal Studio. But, I have never even been to The Universal Studio all my life. How would I know whether it's worth it. It doesn't really make sense does it?

 Just a thought._

 

It's funny how people who have never heard a Xin amp before come in an blurt their nonsense about how it's not worth it. I think it's their wallet screaming no, instead of them .


----------



## Corbet

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jlingo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin doesn't charge my credit card unless it's ready for shipping, so in the mean time, while waiting for his amp to come I still have my budget to buy other amps.

 Also, Worth, is a very hard word. Unless you have listened to Xin Amp before, then you are entitled to have opinion of how much this amp worth. If you haven't even listened to his amp, how would you know if something Worth it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It's like me saying, it's not worth it to go to visit Universal Studio. But, I have never even been to The Universal Studio all my life. How would I know whether it's worth it. It doesn't really make sense does it?

 Just a thought._

 

I'm done argueing but one could evaluate the pros/cons of going to Universal Studios compared to another destination and decide which place is "worth" going to.

 I just hope Xin knows he is losing out on business by taking this long on amps. If I could order one this month and have it within 30 days I'd be all for getting one of his, but for someone who wants a decent "first" amp, I'm not waiting 6+ months.


----------



## rxc

This is now the Xin survivor thread, who will last, who will make it, who will crack.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rxc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is now the Xin survivor thread, who will last, who will make it, who will crack._

 

it "_separates the wheat from the chaff_" - those who end up getting a xin amp shipped to their door from XiN are, as you say, the sole survivors of an apocolyptic struggle, those who dont, "_folded under questioning_" during the eons that passed.

 thats why you get a whole lot more than just the amp when it arrives. you get the lifestyle and respect of your peers! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 it doesnt make you a bad person if you cant hack the wait, hell i feel like that each day - but wouldnt cancel, and am even gonna order a supermicro IV just cause i havent had enough punishment with the reference saga


----------



## callanish

Just as a shot in the dark question fishing for a few attempts at how long do you really think my Xin amp will take to get to the front door; I'm only at or around the 3 - 4 month waiting time, so my guess is close to a total time of a year before I'll see my Supermicro IV. Based on the fact that there doesn't seem to be too much activity on people receiving their amps on the forum and added to that 6+ month buyers seem to be in abundance here. Would that be a realistic guess; 1 year of total time before I'm going to see my Xin amp?


----------



## tk3

I'd say no one knows, perhaps he'll go _"eureka!"_ in the coming week and start building/shipping amps in a frenzy, or we may not hear from him again for x months more.
 Your guess is as good as mine, although I hope mine is closer to the truth.


----------



## Chri5peed

His orders must have shot up. Back in the day a few years ago, I asked him about my SM3 and something about rocket fuel.
 He sent me a huge reply in days.


----------



## aluren

he also haven't posted replies on his own website for awhile... someone go knock at his door and check up on him!


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jlingo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You are glad you cancelled since you haven't tried listening to his amp.
 If your friend own Xin Amps, and you did listen to it, YOU MAY eventually REGRET YOU CANCELLED YOUR ORDER. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't live in Denial,
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 heheh admit it you were lusting after Xin Amp, until you had to reprogram your brain to stay happy even after cancelling your order hahaha.

 My friend once said, " Ignorance is a Bliss!"_

 

I've heard many of Xin's amps (with _endless_ opamp combinations 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). I actually have a Supermini IV with me right now (I give it back this weekend, maybe 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).

 The complete lack of communication is the problem, three emails with no reply (about payment and changing shipping address). I move residence frequently, both national and international, I don't have time to monitor Xin's manufacturing processes or worry about changing the shipping address.

 While I can admire the size and sound of his amps, they just aren't good enough for me to hassle over.

 EK


----------



## ajsaxin

i see this is the best place to come across xin reference and hornets so would some one give me a short comparison between the two ,which is more capable to drive larger headphones .with regards to the sq i am sure both are good.


----------



## ajsaxin

oops forgot ,i just ordered a reference today ,do you guys seriously think it would take four months .i assumed that since he is foods with the testing production would in up.anyways are you sure if charges the card just before shipping in that case il go buy a ibasso d1 lol.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ajsaxin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oops forgot ,i just ordered a reference today ,do you guys seriously think it would take four months .i assumed that since he is foods with the testing production would in up.anyways are you sure if charges the card just before shipping in that case il go buy a ibasso d1 lol._

 

Yes, Dr. Xin charges the CC right at shipping time. It could take 6 months!


----------



## DigiPete

Got off that merry-go-round years ago
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Get the headamp pico and be done with it...


----------



## Agent Kang

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rxc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is now the Xin survivor thread, who will last, who will make it, who will crack._

 

You can add me to the list. I lost all willpower to resist and ordered a supermicro.


----------



## fl00r

After all most 7 months of waiting I am not expecting anything anymore; I am comfortably numb and I think that's the way to go to survive


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After all most 7 months of waiting I am not expecting anything anymore; I am comfortably numb and I think that's the way to go to survive 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

sounds like a good defence mechanism


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Corbet* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm done argueing but one could evaluate the pros/cons of going to Universal Studios compared to another destination and decide which place is "worth" going to.

 I just hope Xin knows he is losing out on business by taking this long on amps. If I could order one this month and have it within 30 days I'd be all for getting one of his, but for someone who wants a decent "first" amp, I'm not waiting 6+ months._

 

Xin is a craftsman, not a businessman; he could care less about lost sales; not everyone in this world conforms to the Industrialized world's roboticization of life and subscribes to the "I must have it now, I'm a spoiled little first world economy consumer!" mentality. Think of him as akin to the OCC or Boyd Coddington of the headphone amp world.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin is a craftsman, not a businessman; he could care less about lost sales; not everyone in this world conforms to the Industrialized world's roboticization of life and subscribes to the "I must have it now, I'm a spoiled little first world economy consumer!" mentality. Think of him as akin to the OCC or Boyd Coddington of the headphone amp world._

 

Exactly!


----------



## ath

What's the point? We can all yell and scream nothing is going to change. Xin will be the way he is. A word or two is greatly appreciated from him but that ain't going to happen.

 My supermini is out for upgrades since April. I miss the portability. At this rate, I will be pleasantly surprised if I get it back April '08.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ath* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What's the point? We can all yell and scream nothing is going to change....._

 

It seems to me that pretty much everything that can be said by us at this point HAS been said, but it also appears to me that there are still folks who would be helped by having a chance to say it.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It seems to me that pretty much everything that can be said by us at this point HAS been said, but it also appears to me that there are still folks who would be helped by having a chance to say it._

 

The degree of awareness and wisdom embodied in that statement is stunning. It's perhaps the most intelligent, most compassionate, most humane sentiment I have ever, and probably will ever, read on Head-Fi. Sbulack, you found the words to something I've been trying to express on this thread for a very long time.

 And if you don't mind, I'd like to put it in my sig.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The degree of awareness and wisdom embodied in that statement is stunning. It's perhaps the most intelligent, most compassionate, most human sentiment I have ever, and probably will ever, read on Head-Fi. Sbulack, you found the words to something I've been trying to express on this thread for a very long time.

 And if you don't mind, I'd like to put it in my sig._

 


 X2!

 An important part of the attraction to this forum is the occassional words of wisdom and intellectual exchanges that never stopped to fascinate me. 

 I admit that I learn quite a bit from here - something I will never learn at work, or from a MBA course.

 Great words.

 F. Lo


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fkclo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_X2!



 I admit that I learn quite a bit from here - something I will never learn at work, or from a MBA course.

 Great words.

 F. Lo_

 

Maybe a psychology course would help


----------



## callanish

I think someone should knock on Dr. Xin's door in Oregon just to make sure he's okay!!


----------



## icantusefizz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *callanish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think someone should knock on Dr. Xin's door in Oregon just to make sure he's okay!!_

 

I concur. Also politely tell him "get on with it", as done in monty-python and the holy grail. Except Instead of the grail....its a quest for the holy reference.

 -fizz


----------



## chukwe

I wake up each day thinking of Dr Xin's Ref. Please Dr Xin, get on with it.


----------



## immtbiker

I have since requested 2 Paypal refunds from Xin for my Reference, and have receive no responses from him.

 I might have to go the route of contesting it with Paypal, as others have done to get their money back.

 This is no way to do business. I would rather deal with Ray or Justin to make a legitimate business deal.
 This silence is just wrong. Wished I used CC instead.

 You can defend him all you want, but not knowing an eta for your product is bad business, whether he cares or not. There are plenty of willing fish in the sea.

 Dealing with Cesar of Portaphile and Takei of Taket T and Ray Samuels Audio offered me e-mail responses within 5 hours. I would buy from them again and again.


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 This is no way to do business. I would rather deal with Ray or Justin to make a legitimate business deal.
 This silence is just wrong. Wished I used CC instead.

 You can defend him all you want, but not knowing an eta for your product is bad business, whether he cares or not. There are plenty of willing fish in the sea. 
 

*Thank god one order less,next!*


----------



## greydragon

I wonder how many orders are actually placed and are in queue? Maybe it seems overwhelming to him, and he likes to procrastinate like most people do when overwhelmed.

 Besides, how long should it take him to finish an amp?


----------



## som4ew

Looooooong and looooooooong long time.
 There are who're waiting more than 6 months, the longest waiting time is +7month.Wanna try?


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have since requested 2 Paypal refunds from Xin for my Reference, and have receive no responses from him.

 I might have to go the route of contesting it with Paypal, as others have done to get their money back.

 This is no way to do business. I would rather deal with Ray or Justin to make a legitimate business deal.
 This silence is just wrong. Wished I used CC instead.

 You can defend him all you want, but not knowing an eta for your product is bad business, whether he cares or not. There are plenty of willing fish in the sea.

 Dealing with Cesar of Portaphile and Takei of Taket T and Ray Samuels Audio offered me e-mail responses within 5 hours. I would buy from them again and again._

 

I totally agree. Xin's amps are fine, but they are not, IMO, superior to other fine amps that are out there (I have heard everything but the Reference), and I strongly prefer to do business with people like Jan Meier and Ray Samuels who actually attend to their customers. For people who are into self-torture, the Xin waiting game may be great fun. But outside from that, it's really not defensible. The idea that just because his model is well known "buyer beware", or that if you pay by CC you don't get charged, isn't a valid excuse for behaving this way. It's the total lack of communication that stinks. The only person worse than Xin is Larry Milligan at Larocco Audio. At this point it's quite possible he's an actual criminal - at least Xin isn't THAT bad


----------



## jamato8

Skylab, yes Xin needs to answer emails, fill orders and communicate in general. On the sound of the Reference 12,000uf amp, if you heard it you would know that it is superior. I do not say this as someone defending anything or a need to do so but as one who has compared it to some good home amps and been amazed. What is unfortunate is that this version may not see the light of day in production. I have never heard an amp this good. Only a couple of References were made like the one I have but I hope more will be made. I have conveyed this to Xin and wait like everyone else.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I totally agree. Xin's amps are fine, but they are not, IMO, superior to other fine amps that are out there (I have heard everything but the Reference), and I strongly prefer to do business with people like Jan Meier and Ray Samuels who actually attend to their customers. For people who are into self-torture, the Xin waiting game may be great fun. But outside from that, it's really not defensible. The idea that just because his model is well known "buyer beware", or that if you pay by CC you don't get charged, isn't a valid excuse for behaving this way. It's the total lack of communication that stinks. The only person worse than Xin is Larry Milligan at Larocco Audio. At this point it's quite possible he's an actual criminal - at least Xin isn't THAT bad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

I agree that it is tough on people who order a Xin amp not knowing what Dr Xin is like, but for the rest of us who know and still order his amps, Xin and his customers are consenting adults and I don't see any point in placing an order and then complaining. Dr Xin clearly has no aspiration to be a conventional businessman, he is a craftsman with high ideals to make the best amp he can, and do everything himself, and criticising him for being what he is is pointless. There are plenty of fine amp builders who follow more conventional business practices and we can all choose to buy from them. I have heard a Reference and I was *very* impressed by it. Dr Xin won't go on for ever, and when he stops the world will be a poorer place, and Xin amp owners will own a part of audio history. I don't mind whether I wait six or nine months for mine, I just hope it will arrive one day.


----------



## jamato8

Having sat and talked with Xin in the past I can say that his one goal with the amp is the best sound that can be obtained from a portable or from most amps. This is his concern and drive. He disires that people are able to enjoy this but if they can not wait then it is fine with him if they buy something else. He is not in business so much as to make money but for the goal, quest of providing an amp that transcending the normal listening experience. 

 As some have stated, you are waiting for a fine instrument rather than an off the line one. I do agree that people when going to his site should be forewarned of this with regards to the wait period.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't see any point in placing an order and then complaining._

 

For head-fiers I agree with that. For the informed, just make the choice. I choose a modicum of customer service


----------



## HiFlight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I agree that it is tough on people who order a Xin amp not knowing what Dr Xin is like, but for the rest of us who know and still order his amps, Xin and his customers are consenting adults and I don't see any point in placing an order and then complaining. Dr Xin clearly has no aspiration to be a conventional businessman, he is a craftsman with high ideals to make the best amp he can, and do everything himself, and criticising him for being what he is is pointless. There are plenty of fine amp builders who follow more conventional business practices and we can all choose to buy from them. I have heard a Reference and I was *very* impressed by it. Dr Xin won't go on for ever, and when he stops the world will be a poorer place, and Xin amp owners will own a part of audio history. I don't mind whether I wait six or nine months for mine, I just hope it will arrive one day._

 

Denny...

 Very well-said!!! +1


----------



## Quaddy

well i must be silly or a sado masochist or ..... a XiN amp lover,

 as i just hit the button on a supermicro IV, thats about 2 mths after placing my reference order.

 i will eventually be the proud owner of 3 XiNs.

 those two months have flown by.....heres to the other 6 behaving similarly.


----------



## ath

After all this silence, hope he does not come up with a totally new amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I disliked the idea of a Reference amp when issues with the Version IV remained unresolved. That's just my point of view.

 No comparisons to Larry please... that is downright insulting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I just hope he is in good health. His silence baffles me!!!!!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ath* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After all this silence, hope he does not come up with a totally new amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I disliked the idea of a Reference amp when issues with the Version IV remained unresolved. That's just my point of view.

 No comparisons to Larry please... that is downright insulting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I just hope he is in good health. His silence baffles me!!!!!_

 

I also hope he is doing well, like others I have not been able to get a response lately. Jamato8 I would love to hear your version of the Reference. Skylab, I wish you had heard the Supermicro IV w/ the 4/11 mods truly outstanding and as I understand it there have been further refinements to it as well.


----------



## immtbiker

If you guys remember, this same thing (long period of silence and MIA) happened the same time last year.

 To those on the "defend Xin" side of the fence, just imagine if the whole world worked this way. It would be utter chaos.
 I'm cool with those who are accepting of long waiting periods and lack of corresponence, but if an offer was made to refund anyone's money that didn't want to wait anymore, it is totally unacceptable to not answer a member who is asking for a refund. There is no defense for this, and as a mod, this is borderline "bannable" for a MOT.

 If you sent someone money for something that you bought on Head-Fi and didn't hear from the seller for a long time, and are out a couple of hundred dollars, the first thing most members would do, is notify a mod, and leave bad feedback.
 Why should Xin be different?

 Other MOT's like Jan and Ray and Vinnie, tell you when they can't fulfill their timeframe promises. That's acceptable. Silence is not.

 When Mikhail didn't chime in, when everyone was asking about a certain build, most people were very upset. Why should it be different with Xin?

 As we say in the field repair world, an ETA will calm almost any customer down. It shows care. Even if you say you'll make it tomorrow and they are losing a lot of money while waiting, they just need to hear from somebody. If you can't make your promised eta, you re-negotiate it. 

 In this case there is no eta and there is no line of communication.

 I know of 2 memebers that had to file a report to get their money back through Paypal. This is totally unnecessary.

 *End of Rant*


----------



## Agent Kang

Quote:


 , but if an offer was made to refund anyone's money that didn't want to wait anymore, it is totally unacceptable to not answer a member who is asking for a refund. 
 

This is a very good point.


----------



## jamato8

I just changed my 22,000uf Reference to a 12,000uf with two 47uf HiQ Black Gates in Super E Configuration. I prefer the 12,000 and this Ref has the 1/4 jacks as well as the 1/8. I will see how it shapes up.


----------



## ldj325

In defense of Xin in terms of ethics, not knowing better I paid for an amp with PayPal. When I realized the error of my ways, I asked for a refund and to put the amp on a credit card instead. A number of e-mails went unanswered while Xin was in his "research mode." But when he finally surfaced briefly awhile back he answerd my e-mail and sent a refund. So I suspect that he simply doesn't look at e-mails when in mad scientist mode--but that the money will eventually be refunded.

 To me if Xin would only remove that statement on his web site estimating shipping within 2 weeks or ordering and didn't allow for PayPal pre-orders (or gave fair warning that the funds are withdrawn 4-6 months prior to arrival of the amp) then all would be cool.

 And I think new Head-fiers would do well to have another amp in hand before ordering a Xin. Otherwise the wait could be unbearable.


----------



## jlingo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I totally agree. Xin's amps are fine, but they are not, IMO, superior to other fine amps that are out there (I have heard everything but the Reference), and I strongly prefer to do business with people like Jan Meier and Ray Samuels who actually attend to their customers. For people who are into self-torture, the Xin waiting game may be great fun. But outside from that, it's really not defensible. The idea that just because his model is well known "buyer beware", or that if you pay by CC you don't get charged, isn't a valid excuse for behaving this way. It's the total lack of communication that stinks. The only person worse than Xin is Larry Milligan at Larocco Audio. At this point it's quite possible he's an actual criminal - at least Xin isn't THAT bad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

What did Larry Milligan do? Sorry just out of curiosity


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just changed my 22,000uf Reference to a 12,000uf with two 47uf HiQ Black Gates in Super E Configuration. I prefer the 12,000 and this Ref has the 1/4 jacks as well as the 1/8. I will see how it shapes up._

 




 Jamato,

 I don't know all of the technical lingo or specs, but I just placed an order for the Reference, then I saw where you requested a bunch of changes.

 I thought Xin was putting the best stuff he could in the Reference to make it sound as good as possible. The more I read, the more I get confused.

 I thought the 22,000uf was supposed to be better. But, I don't even quite understand what the different parts do yet.

 Why is the 12,000uf better than the 22,000 uf?
 And what do these number pertain to - sorry for my ignorance - ..... yeah, I'm a Newbie!

 I have read through a bunch of posts and without always understanding what I am reading, I have gathered that the "Black Gates" - whatever they are - are highly regarded.

 Since you are adding them, I am guessing the Reference doesn't normally come with them.... But, I am not under the impression that anyone really knows what will be in the References when they ship (??????????????).
 Do you know what will be in the final version of the Reference - or whatever might ship within the next 1-12 months?

 Can you explain Black Gates and why someone might want to upgrade to Black Gates in the Reference?
 And what are the different Black Gate options? You mentioned: "two 47uf HiQ Black Gates". 
 Why those particular 47uf HiQ Black Gates?

 Also, what is: "Super E Configuration"?

 You listed three custom change requests (four if you count "two" Black Gates), but I don't see any of those options on Xin's order page. How do you make these custom request/changes? I am under the impression that Xin doesn't really communicate via email.... So, how?

 How much do these changes cost (each)?

 I have an 80gig iPod video and just received some Shure E500's today. I want a portable amp that will sound as good as my E500's can sound. I thought that was what I was getting with the Reference.

 Can you provide insight to why I should consider all or part of your specific upgrade requests vs. letting Xin ship his Reference as he intends to build it (however that may ultimately be?????????).

 I would appreciate any further help.


----------



## jlingo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I also hope he is doing well, like others I have not been able to get a response lately. Jamato8 I would love to hear your version of the Reference. Skylab, I wish you had heard the Supermicro IV w/ the 4/11 mods truly outstanding and as I understand it there have been further refinements to it as well._

 

Anyone could contribute how Reference compared to Lisa III?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In defense of Xin in terms of ethics, not knowing better I paid for an amp with PayPal. When I realized the error of my ways, I asked for a refund and to put the amp on a credit card instead. A number of e-mails went unanswered while Xin was in his "research mode." But when he finally surfaced briefly awhile back he answerd my e-mail and sent a refund. So I suspect that he simply doesn't look at e-mails when in mad scientist mode--but that the money will eventually be refunded.

 To me if Xin would only remove that statement on his web site estimating shipping within 2 weeks or ordering and didn't allow for PayPal pre-orders (or gave fair warning that the funds are withdrawn 4-6 months prior to arrival of the amp) then all would be cool.

 And I think new Head-fiers would do well to have another amp in hand before ordering a Xin. Otherwise the wait could be unbearable._

 

The 2 weeks delivery estimate has been removed from the web site for a fair while, there is just a blank space now.


----------



## kaushama

I think I should quote my previous post again here!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Quote:


 This whole thread serves people to just express their concerns. And perhaps rough date of arrival when production starts. 
 There had been many cycles of same thing happening throughout the history of the whole thread if you carefully see. some Thrashing and criticizing; some patronizing him. Some being neutral watching things.
 It has been a long time after it was started. None of the comments has changed Dr. xin's way of conduct! In fact it has become worse.
 However strong we shout here, there are few things that newbies understand if they march into Xin's zone.

 1. He is always improving his designs and it is a dynamic audio project. 
 2. He is not very communicative esp when he develops a design. 
 3. There is a very long waiting time (several months) before you get the amp. But one always get his amp as he never cheated someone by not sending an amp. 
 4. When you order it is better to order with Credit card as he doesn't charge the card till he ships it. So that if one decides, he can cancel the order. 
 5. You always get a very good amp; one of the best amongst competitors. 
 6. He is the very unique in providing life long support and upgrades to his products, irrespective of the order of ownership. 
 7. He is not very keen on making his project similar to a typical business model, however hard his critics shout at him. In fact he never visits this place. 

 So one should get involved in Xin's amps, if he understands these few facts. Irrespective of being so distractive, I still see lots of people chase his products simply because they are very good. Buying a Xin amp is like getting a subscription to sample his on-going audio project. It will never stop but you get a ticket to enjoy various stages of his development. Better way of enjoying them is to get an amp and enjoy it for long period without paying too much attention to minor tweaks he does. Even without these tweaks they are kick-ass amps. If he stops at a random moment and tells you this is the final product, we all will take it as final!!! Won't we? He doesn't do that. always try to take it to next level and give the result free of charge. That's good! 
 So best way to enjoy them get an amp! Enjoy! Don't run behind every little upgrades or fixes! When it becomes a service pack over a long period send it for upgrade! But have a back up for long wait time.
 If you don't like it that way just stop cursing and getting yourself tense!! Look somewhere else. Simple as that!!! 
 

Food for thought!


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Jamato,

 I don't know all of the technical lingo or specs, but I just placed an order for the Reference, then I saw where you requested a bunch of changes.

 I thought Xin was putting the best stuff he could in the Reference to make it sound as good as possible. The more I read, the more I get confused.

 I thought the 22,000uf was supposed to be better. But, I don't even quite understand what the different parts do yet.

 Why is the 12,000uf better than the 22,000 uf?
 And what do these number pertain to - sorry for my ignorance - ..... yeah, I'm a Newbie!

 I have read through a bunch of posts and without always understanding what I am reading, I have gathered that the "Black Gates" - whatever they are - are highly regarded.

 Since you are adding them, I am guessing the Reference doesn't normally come with them.... But, I am not under the impression that anyone really knows what will be in the References when they ship (??????????????).
 Do you know what will be in the final version of the Reference - or whatever might ship within the next 1-12 months?

 Can you explain Black Gates and why someone might want to upgrade to Black Gates in the Reference?
 And what are the different Black Gate options? You mentioned: "two 47uf HiQ Black Gates". 
 Why those particular 47uf HiQ Black Gates?

 Also, what is: "Super E Configuration"?

 You listed three custom change requests (four if you count "two" Black Gates), but I don't see any of those options on Xin's order page. How do you make these custom request/changes? I am under the impression that Xin doesn't really communicate via email.... So, how?

 How much do these changes cost (each)?

 I have an 80gig iPod video and just received some Shure E500's today. I want a portable amp that will sound as good as my E500's can sound. I thought that was what I was getting with the Reference.

 Can you provide insight to why I should consider all or part of your specific upgrade requests vs. letting Xin ship his Reference as he intends to build it (however that may ultimately be?????????).

 I would appreciate any further help._

 

These changes I made and are not ones that Xin does. the 22,000uf referes to the capacitor size in the Reference. There was also a 12,000uf size that is smaller in capacitance but does the same job. 

 Another user of the Reference has the 12,000uf one and likes it stock with no changes and has plenty to compare to. If available I would get a 12,000uf Reference and just go with that but I do not know when they will be available.

 Super E Configuration is using two nonpolar Black Gates in parallel. On a nonpolar there is an inner lead to the middle of the cap and an outer one to the outer most part of the cap (internal to the metal housing). By taking the lead of on cap and soldering it to the outer lead of the other and taking the other two leads and soldering them together you lower the enternal series resistance (ESR) that the current sees to almost nothing so you have an enhanced current flow to the chips and you all but do away with any inductance that will affect the flow. The AC musical signal (because music is a wave form) rides on the direct current (DC) from the power supply. The cleaner the DC the less infuence it has on the musical signal and the faster and cleaner power also increase bass response and dynamics and every other aspect of the music. The cap in the Reference already has an extremely low esr but I like to use Black Gates and just push this a little further. I have also never found a cap like them but everthing does have to be in balance or even a Black Gate will not be correct in the power supply or wherever else it is used. If you use the wrong cap or value of a cap, you start to get into resonance frequencies that are carried on the DC which can mess with the sound.


----------



## Computerstud

Okay I accept the long wait time. 
 However, it is unacceptable to treat his customers in this fashion. 

 How long does it take to send out a simple email to just one of us so we can pass on the message?

 Hypothetical Example: 
*CS:* Hey Dr. Xin, how's the development of the Xin Reference coming? Do you have an ETA as of yet? Drop me a quick email and I'll pass it on.
*XIN:* Hey ComputerStud, How's the stud business doing? Are you still the ladies man you have always been? With regards to the Xin Reference, I'm still in development and won't be able to complete orders for at least "enter time frame". 
*CS:* I'm still studding Dr. Xin. I will pass on the message. Thanks.

 I feel that Xin has been treating his customers unfairly without taking a few minutes out of his schedule to pass on a simple message. 

 As paying customer and a collective group of Audio-fiends, are we not entitle to a few minutes of Dr. Xin valuable time? 

 A single email every few weeks (to just one of us to pass it on) is all I ask but somehow he is too busy for even that.


----------



## chukwe

We're not Dr Xin's customers, but guinea pigs.


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_We're not Dr Xin's customers, but guinea pigs._

 

And we are...'Lost'..


----------



## jamato8

A bunch of guinea pigs just wondering around. Bumping into each other every once in a while and wondering off again. 

 The Lost tribe of guinea pigs.


----------



## DDW

Computerstud,

 I am very new here, but I have read a bunch of posts. I have to be honest, I don't like this type of business model. But, like it or not, the world is full of compromises.
 It is apparent that Xin's intent and goal is to provide quality. He seems to have proven that he "WILL" provide quality and his customers apparently "Always" get what they orde eventually.
 Apparently, Xin also does provide excellent customer service "in part" - in that if you have a problem with a component, part or something that needs service, he apparently does take care of it...... eventually.

 What is compromised in his case is communication and any sense of urgency.

 Yes, there are other good amps on the market that offer much better communication and faster response with communication and providing of service and goods.

 But, I beleive I read that Xin does this as a side job. So, he has only "X" amount of time. And apparently he won't let anybody else help him. I know how that is. I know that often much more efficiency can be gained by hiring other people, but often quality can be compromised when others are not as passionate about what they are doing as you might be.

 So, it is apparent that we all have a decision to make here: Are we willing to wait without communication and without any time commitment to get what is fairly strongly proven quality.

 You are partially correct that it doesn't take long to respond to an email. But, I am guessing Xin is getting hundreds of emails asking about time frames. And I am guessing that Xin probably doesn't really know any time frame since I am guessing he works random numbers of hours doing this part time (????????).
 Often one single email leads to 2 or 5 more follow up emails with lots more questions times possible hundreds!!!

 Emails, as simple as a single response seems like it can be, can add up to VERY time consuming in numbers.

 I personally waste way too much time on a handfull of forums. If Xin were to try to stay on top of his forums, he would probably spend most of his "spare" time on the forums and very little time building and working on amps - theory on my part.

 This is just speculation on my part based on what I have read.

 I gather that if you order it, you will get it eventually and it will be good.

 From piecing lots of little things together, I gather Xin doesn't want to commit to time-frames. Based on the same piecing of info, I am guessing that he probably just doesn't know how long this stuff will take him (????????).

 Just trying to consider all possible scenarios here. But, it is what it is.....

 I ordered a Reference... I hope I see it soon. But, I am not holding my breath. I am assuming 4-12 months at this point. 

 Honestly, I don't like it. But, at least I knew prior to putting in my order.

 For the record, to put it in perspective, I also collect knives. 
 Most custom knifemakers are like Xin appears to be. They do things themselves and they do things their own way. They don't like to farm out parts of the production process. And they don't like to be rushed or hounded.

 If they don't produce quality, they are not in demand and they don't succeed. Then they are relegated to doing it as a hobby and/or must have a real job to sustain their income.
 But, highly regarded knife-makers can have back-logs for 4-5 years worth of orders!!!

 There is another option. They can raise prices to reduce demand.

 I don't have anything conclusive without hearing any of my options, but based on my research Xin's products appear to be highly regarded and comparable to amps costing $100 - $250 more.

 But, if you want a Xin amp, the choice really isn't ours - unless you can make a purchase on the secondary market.

 I guess we should try to look at the good side: he provides a great product at a comparatively reasonable price and he does appear to consistently deliver.

 Yes, there are some down sides......

 Sorry for my long ramble.....


----------



## Computerstud

^^^ Was all that for me DDW?
 Truthfully, if it wasn't for members that I respect vouching for his products as well as his integrity...I think you get the point. 

 How about we as a group come together and elect a representative. Instead of bombarding Xin with thousands of emails, let Jamato8 (aka the Jamster) be our voices and concerns?


----------



## immtbiker

I want a refund and will take action if this is not remedied within a weeks time.
 I feel this, plus time already served, is a fair amount of time.

 End of story!


----------



## tnmike1

immtbiker: Feel the pain. what about us that have a Reference on order PLUS sent a SM LE IV back for upgrades??? What to do, what to do. For that kinda cash outlay could've put a nice down payment on a Gary Fisher bike


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Computerstud* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_^^^ Was all that for me DDW?
 Truthfully, if it wasn't for members that I respect vouching for his products as well as his integrity...I think you get the point. 

 How about we as a group come together and elect a representative. Instead of bombarding Xin with thousands of emails, let Jamato8 (aka the Jamster) be our voices and concerns?_

 


 It sounds like a good reasonable idea to me.

 Someone who is willing to read through common questions on the threads, condense the questions into straight forward questions, submit them to Xin and hopefully have Xin reply.

 But, a similar solution would just be for Xin to post updates every week or two about what is being developed, worked on, shipped, etc.

 However, since he seems reluctant to be tied to any form of commitment in regards to time frames.... I am doubtful.

 And you have to find someone who Xin will actually respond to!!!

 .


----------



## icantusefizz

You all have very valid points. I would like to add my fair share to this discussion..ehem:

 *rabble rabble rabble*

 That is all.

 -Fizz
 ps. 6 months 5 days 4 hours 10 minutes 33seconds (give or take a day)


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want a refund and will take action if this is not remedied within a weeks time.
 I feel this, plus time already served, is a fair amount of time.

 End of story!_

 


 As a moderator, you would have the power to do "something".

 As a forum full of people who apparently support Xin so much, I don't know what the ideal punishment should be.

 I have by no means read every post about Xin, but I tried to read a bunch. I have yet to come across a post where he didn't deliver eventually.

 However, many businesses have been known to do very well in the eyes of there customers all the way up to the day they close their doors and those last customers eat the mess.

 Banning a member for not reading emails, or not reading this forum, or for taking way longer than normal to deliver a product - I don't know - ?????.

 Can you prove Xin received the emails requesting refunds?
 When you sent the email, by any chance did you mention "refund" or "Refund Request" or similar in the title? Did you use confirmation read receipt?

 If so, this is very relevant information regarding Xin's integrity as a business owner.

 We can all argue that we feel he should take more responsibility as a business owner.... But, as frustrating as the delivery time issue may be, this really is not uncommon for many various highly desired products in the world - especially if and when being made by someone who might be catagorized (one way or another) as an artist.

 However, if he "refuses" to give a refund and there is proof he has recieved a request for a refund, then I definitely feel there are some issues that I want to know about. And I feel something should be done.

 Aside from hard-to-deal-with delivery times, IMO, at the very least, I feel he "should" read through his business related emails and respond accordingly. - Whether it be give a promt refund or just to say: "I don't have an exact delivery time right now" or "I don't know." or whatever.

 If anyone has the ability to contact Xin, it seems Xin needs to be made aware that certain responses are expected.

 I don't like rolling the dice. Even though I hear good things about his amps and the that he always delivers eventually. You always feel like your are hanging if you can't get communication.

 I don't know the answer....??????????

 .


----------



## immtbiker

As a mod, one of the only things that I can do, is provide a *Sticky* in the amps section detailing Xin's practices and provide newcomers adequate warnings.
 I will discuss the options with my peers.

 As a mere mortal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, I can go through Paypal and file a complaint.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As a mod, one of the only things that I can do, is provide a *Sticky* in the amps section detailing Xin's practices and provide newcomers adequate warnings.
 I will discuss the options with my peers.

 As a mere mortal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, I can go through Paypal and file a complaint._

 


 Honestly, I think that is very reasonable and fair.

 Further, I agree that would probably be good to discuss it with your peers / fellow mods.

 It seems that any way you slice, it would be appropriate for people who are reading about Xin in this forum, get excited about his products and are interested in his products should be made very clear as to what to expect & NOT expect from Xin.

 I have seen it mentioned multiple times as a good idea to pay with credit card vs. PayPal. Apparently, he doesn't charge your credit card until the item is about to ship. But, if you pay via PayPal, you pay instantly and are out funds for many months.

 I am sure there is other advice that should be added. But, such a sticky should be carefully worded, and well thought through.

 Possibly even locked so as to not muddy the water too much with hundreds of other comments. As a Mod, you can probably edit the sticky as needed or as appropriate with newer info.

 Again, I don't know... just throwing out some thoughts.

 good luck.


----------



## immtbiker

All Stickies are locked. They are for info sharing, not discussion


----------



## esmallits01

I think everyone of us will feel better if we treat Dr Xin as an artist rather than a business person selling audio equipments. It is true he is not very bothered with people getting frustrated or cancelling their orders. He is just like an artiste with a weird behavior.. But we cant deny he produces real good amps at very decent prices. 

 During periods where he is into production, his replies with email is so fast I have a problem catching up. And for all those Reference Beta testers, he is nice enough to send us the new boards at no charges, disregarding the fact we actually end up with a few Xin Ref Amps and can sell them for profits. 

 We all know how Xin operates. So there really isnt a need to get frustrated or agitated. 

 Caveat emptor is the way to go. 

 Lets enjoy the products Dr Xin is creating and at the prices he is charging and respect him for more of an audio artiste rather than an audio manufacturer.

 Cheers.


----------



## immtbiker

But he *is *an audio manufacturer and has to follow the same rules and courtesies as any MOT.

 A lot of money is involved here...this is not the Museum of Modern Art.
 Actually, with the long wait times, it seems more like the Museum of Natural History.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *esmallits01* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think everyone of us will feel better if we treat Dr Xin as an artist rather than a business person selling audio equipments. It is true he is not very bothered with people getting frustrated or cancelling their orders. He is just like an artiste with a weird behavior.. But we cant deny he produces real good amps at very decent prices. 

 During periods where he is into production, his replies with email is so fast I have a problem catching up. And for all those Reference Beta testers, he is nice enough to send us the new boards at no charges, disregarding the fact we actually end up with a few Xin Ref Amps and can sell them for profits. 

 We all know how Xin operates. So there really isnt a need to get frustrated or agitated. 

 Caveat emptor is the way to go. 

 Lets enjoy the products Dr Xin is creating and at the prices he is charging and respect him for more of an audio artiste rather than an audio manufacturer.

 Cheers._

 


 I can appreciate your view and I personally have tried to be objective about that aspect.

 I am not a decision maker here. Just expressing views and hopefully being open-minded about the situation.

 I actually recently placed an order for the Reference knowing what I was about to get into.

 But, as you said: "Caveat emptor" = Buyer Beware!

 I happened to research enough to know that the waits tend to be from very long to excrutiatingly long. But, also that he apparently makes a terrific product at a comparably reasonable price. And that he has a track record of ultimately providing the goods - in spite of poor communication and horribly long wait times.

 With this info, I am still not excited at all or looking forward to the wait, but I was "Aware" of what to expect!

 I am agreeing with Immtbiker about a sticky because I think it would be prudent and responsible for a forum of this stature to notify potential buyers about what they very well MAY have to deal with in regards to Xin.

 There are obviously quite a few people on this forum that have been around and have developed an understanding of what to expect because they have spent a long time here reading MANY posts and threads.

 esmallits - The most significant flaw I see in your statement is when you say: "We all know how Xin operates". You are making a huge assumption that everyone who might order a Xin amp has been around these forums and read a bunch of posts that inidicates this info.

 But, there are many people like myself who may just get into this and started by general searching to end up at these forums and doing more detailed searching. Luckily for me, I spent a couple of weeks and MANY hours to the point where I understood how Xin is.

 Many others might just read a few great reviews about Xin's products, then run to his web-page and place a bunch of orders without knowing what to expect. I assure you they are going to be much more upset about the situation.
 In general, people do NOT expect wait periods like 6-12 months for something like a portable amp. And people DO expect return communication.


 Most people will be able to handle the situation much better if there is a better understanding of what to expect in regards to Xin's lack of communication and delivery times.


 If anything, I view a sticky with well worded information as something that "Might" be good for all involved including Xin.

 Being for-warned may help prevent Xin from being bashed all over the place on these forums.... might not, but I would still argue that an informed buyer is better for everybody.

 If Xin is so blasé about defection of his buyers and doesn't want to be "bothered" with emails and people bugging him about status and similar, then he should endorse the idea of people being made aware of how he works.


 Great product.. Artist... poor communication... poor delivery times... - Whatever.

 But, Immtbiker was specifically referring to issues related to Xin not responding to a refund request.

 Not returning emails and not posting information about production and delivery times is frustrating and generally not appreciated at all by customers.... OK... So, maybe we try to view Xin as an Artist who just doesn't want to be bothered when he is working on his art-work. Great. I can "try" to deal with that since I know about it in advance.

 But, Artist or not, he should be responsible and held accountable in regards to responding to refund request.. IMO.

 Artist or Business.... Money is involved. And you can't just "Blow Off" people who have intrusted you with their money!

 When you have peoples money and you haven't delivered your product or service, you DO have a responsibility.

 .


----------



## srikeerthi

All this discussion about amp and still no updates! I hope he is OK tho 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 PS: Hooraaay! I'm in the 7 months club


----------



## fkclo

I have been watching this thread for a while and think it would be helpful to mention a few facts:-

 Xin did state in his forum at www.fixup.net about two things :-

 1) When he is in research mode he cannot attend to anything else, and he did apologise to and seek understanding from his fellow customers.

 2) He made it clear that if he were to choose between spending time responding to emails and focusing on completing the orders he would choose the latter. He wrote if he spend time responding to emails that he has to delay delivery of the outstanding orders even further. 

 Granted, these are not in the form of stickies in his forum so new comers may miss out, but to be fair to Xin he did make it very clear in public about how he works.

 Also, for those of us who are frustrated at order delays and/or lack of response, the best place to vent/rant is in his own forum, NOT here - because Xin seldom attend to this forum, but he does watch what is happening on his.

 Just my 2 cents.
 F. Lo


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_All this discussion about amp and still no updates! I hope he is OK tho 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 PS: Hooraaay! I'm in the 7 months club 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Actually this is my biggest worry. As Xin is a one-man business who keep almost everything to his heart I am worried about his health - is he sick ? or get robbed and thrown on the street ? or knock-down by a car ? No one seems to know unless he "makes his appearance" once a while in his forum. But not much is happening there.

 His well being is my biggest concern.

 F. Lo


----------



## chukwe

I'm not bothered about his well being. I'm worried & concerned about my money & Ref Amp


----------



## nc8000

I have send my SuperMini-III back for repair about 3 weeks ago and requested an email from him saying that he has received it (both via an included letter and via emails send to him). Have not heard from him yet and he ought to have received the parcel by now. Danish postal services do not have a traked service to the US (or most other places for that matter) so I can't follow it. If Xin don't email me within a week I will have to report the parcel lost to danish post and then they will have to search. As it has been send as a sign-for parcel he will have signed for it if it got thru so I will know that way. Just seems a bit drastic to have to do it that way but it's the only option. He can take as long as he will repairing and upgrading it as it is only my backup map, I just want to know that he has received it.


----------



## chukwe

Can't someome contact Dr Xin's next of kins?


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...I can go through Paypal and file a complaint._

 


 That's how I got my refund. Don't waste any time.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm not bothered about his well being. I'm worried & concerned about my money & Ref Amp_

 

That is a terrible thing to say.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That is a terrible thing to say._

 

Feel sad about this too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 F. Lo


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's how I got my refund. Don't waste any time._

 

Would that work after that long time ?
 I thought you had to complain within 30 days for paypal to do anything.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm not bothered about his well being. I'm worried & concerned about my money & Ref Amp_

 

While I can certainly understand your frustration (I'm not immune to that feeling my self), health and well being should be more important than material things


----------



## flargosa

Has Dr. Xin stopped shipping all amps or only the Reference Series Amps?


----------



## rxc

All amps.


----------



## ajsaxin

I kind of feel we are being a bit vicious over here ,accepted he is completely non responsive .But then going by the way he works I think some of the reason for the delay is also caused by his large-hearted ness shown by xin.I see no purpose in taking back amps already sold to modd it further and that to for free. This I am sure takes a lot of his time. If he has a newer version any one interested should go ahead and buy that instead of sending their orders ones to have it modified.
 We have to accept the fact that he is a one man show and he has too many orders compared to what he could make, reason being not only quality but also the price. If he hikes up the price to match a PR II, I am sure he would find orders coming in are a lot more manageable and a neat profit margin to but then his intention is not that and I must appreciate him the price he is offering is definitely help ful to a lot of us not earning in dollars or pounds lol.
 I accept the fact that he might not be able to reply to e mails as he would be flooded with them however if he could leave an update atleast on a weekly basis on either his forum or head-fi that would definitely help us. And would prevent his inbox from being bombarded with e mails.
 I do notice its those who make payments via pay pal who seem to have serious issues, accepted as they are being charged for it immediately but then when we know how he works and when we know he does not charge our card why don’t we just place the orders via CC.I am sure our cards do provide us with adequate security in case of any mishaps.

 ** end of the day he has never advertised nor tried hard to make any of us buy from him its completely voluntary and I am sure a lot of us who have issues were aware of his working style yet we choose to place the orders so see no use in complaining. We just might frustrate the man such that he might just stop selling amps. Which I am sure a lot of us will not like.


----------



## Wotan1

I've seen a thread of a person who visited Xin at his home. I couldn't find it anymore and I do not remember who this person was -but he/she has a direct and i presume a personal link with Xin. Maybe it's an idea this person could contact Xin and check status/well beeing and update us all.


----------



## subfocus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've seen a thread of a person who visited Xin at his home. I couldn't find it anymore and I do not remember who this person was -but he/she has a direct and i presume a personal link with Xin. Maybe it's an idea this person could contact Xin and check status/well beeing and update us all._

 

 I also searched earlier for that thread earlier and couldn't track it down ...this does sound like a good idea though. I'm more concerned about Dr Xin than the amp situation and if someone could perhaps pay him a visit then that would reassure a lot of us. I'm guessing he's actually in full on tweak mode ........but it would be good if someone who knows where he lives could check to see he's ok...


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've seen a thread of a person who visited Xin at his home. I couldn't find it anymore and I do not remember who this person was -but he/she has a direct and i presume a personal link with Xin. Maybe it's an idea this person could contact Xin and check status/well beeing and update us all._

 

I have visited with Xin a few times but I am no longer in the area. He was quite ill a few months ago and was not able to pull himself from bed. I hope he is not ill again. I have tried to contact him to no avail. I have personal phone numbers but no response. I am concerned and hope all is well.

 At this time I would not send an order for anything until something is heard from Xin unless it is by means that does not take money until the order is filled..


----------



## nc8000

As I remember that is jamato8 who visited Xin but he also don't seem to be able to get in touch with him. I generally used to be able to get responses from him every few weeks but have not heard anything for like 6 weeks now. Speaking as one who my self has experienced a minor depression due to stress I'm a bit worried as he is displaying all the signs I was told I did.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *subfocus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I also searched earlier for that thread earlier and couldn't track it down ...this does sound like a good idea though. I'm more concerned about Dr Xin than the amp situation and if someone could perhaps pay him a visit then that would reassure a lot of us. I'm guessing he's actually in full on tweak mode ........but it would be good if someone who knows where he lives could check to see he's ok..._

 

im not trying to be funny but i highly doubt XiN is anything other than ok, i am sure he has friends and family that are able to check on that should situtation call for it.

 whilst it may be well intentioned and i care about peoples wellbeing, i find it just doesnt sit right and is a bit sickly that people scattered all over the world are wanting to knock at this poor sods door 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 although we have paid him monies in some case and placed an order, i cant help but feeling this personal interjection by a lot of us, is a bit well, disengenuious and unwarranted.

 worried as we may be about our order. we do know do we not that this is exactly what happens and is just another cycle in the life of ordering a XiN amp.

 if we want to be treated like customers of a business, lets keep it business.


----------



## Wotan1

To be honest I do not agree. Xin will probabely be aware about this thread and no one -what ever mode he is - will neglect this without even a word. Personally I think It looks like there might be a problem with Xin. I'm not asking *anyone *to knock on his door.The fact that even Jamoto8 can't get in thouch with him and Nc8000 does not get an answer indicates that he is not on air at the moment. He must have some *friends *here who knows him personaly and lives in the neighbourhood? Or knows anyone who does? I do not care about the money (payed through paypall and not with drawing the payment).


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It looks like there might be a problem with Xin. Who else knows him personaly and lives in the neighbourhood? Or knows anyone who does?_

 

No one else does.


----------



## speedbird151

Doesn't Ken from ALO live in Portland? I think that's a 90 minute drive to Corvallis. Not sure if anyone knows Ken well enough to even bring it up.


----------



## rxc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *speedbird151* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Doesn't Ken from ALO live in Portland? I think that's a 90 minute drive to Corvallis. Not sure if anyone knows Ken well enough to even bring it up._

 

lol, send Ken to find Xin.


----------



## speedbird151

sorry it was a stupid idea. hope he's ok.


----------



## Skylab

This has gotten out of hand. Xin is a grown man, people. Concern is nice, but this is almost getting creepy. I'm sure he knows how to get help if he needs it.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_While I can certainly understand your frustration (I'm not immune to that feeling my self), health and well being should be more important than material things_

 


 I have to agree with this and say this was well spoken.

 I don't think it is realistic for us as consumers to just not care about our own investments, but we should be a little more concerned about the well being of another person.

 Xin has frustrated a lot of people by not returning emails and not shipping withing what would normally be considered reasonable times.

 But, he has provided everybody who has received his products with something that is apparently very special and a product that Xin has obviously put a lot of time, care and effort into - for US.

 There is no evidence to show he means poorly towards other people. He might be eccentric in his ways for handling business and communicating. But, it seems apparent that he "CARES" enough to try to deliver the very best product he is capable of to his customers. So, while he may consider emails and communication a bother, I think we have to give him credit for his extreme efforts as well.

 I personally feel that someone who is willing to put his level of effort and care into his product and still provide it at a reasonable price to other people has a lot of merit as a person!

 I think we need to try to be objective here.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have visited with Xin a few times but I am no longer in the area. He was quite ill a few months ago and was not able to pull himself from bed. I hope he is not ill again. I have tried to contact him to no avail. I have personal phone numbers but no response. I am concerned and hope all is well.

 At this time I would not send an order for anything until something is heard from Xin unless it is by means that does not take money until the order is filled.._

 


 That is not good to hear!


 But, an interesting thing to consider: Somebody is managing his website to have made the price reduction available on the Reference...???????

 An argument could be made/assumed that the available price reduction would be intended to "Promote" more orders.


----------



## subfocus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_im not trying to be funny but i highly doubt XiN is anything other than ok, i am sure he has friends and family that are able to check on that should situtation call for it.

 whilst it may be well intentioned and i care about peoples wellbeing, i find it just doesnt sit right and is a bit sickly that people scattered all over the world are wanting to knock at this poor sods door 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 although we have paid him monies in some case and placed an order, i cant help but feeling this personal interjection by a lot of us, is a bit well, disengenuious and unwarranted.

 worried as we may be about our order. we do know do we not that this is exactly what happens and is just another cycle in the life of ordering a XiN amp.

 if we want to be treated like customers of a business, lets keep it business._

 

 Sorry, don't agree... if you find peoples concern for Dr Xin's well being a bit too *disingenuous *for your tastes then so be it . As has been mentioned .....the vast majority of people (including myself) pay for Xin amps by Credit card...(when he ships) , therefore the money/amp thing isn't the main factor in considering his welfare. Sorry you can't get your head around that one


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_im not trying to be funny but i highly doubt XiN is anything other than ok, i am sure he has friends and family that are able to check on that should situtation call for it.

 whilst it may be well intentioned and i care about peoples wellbeing, i find it just doesnt sit right and is a bit sickly that people scattered all over the world are wanting to knock at this poor sods door 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 although we have paid him monies in some case and placed an order, i cant help but feeling this personal interjection by a lot of us, is a bit well, disengenuious and unwarranted.

 worried as we may be about our order. we do know do we not that this is exactly what happens and is just another cycle in the life of ordering a XiN amp.

 if we want to be treated like customers of a business, lets keep it business._

 


 Hmmmm - I don't know that I agree with your statement/assumption: "i highly doubt XiN is anything other than ok, i am sure he has friends and family that are able to check on that should situtation call for it."

 Maybe he is fine, but you/we don't know.

 And you have no way of knowing he has friends and family to check on him.

 Maybe you have friends and family to check on you, but many people in this world do NOT.
 Even if he did, his friends and family may not have a clue as to how to communicate about his business on these forums, email or etc.


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This has gotten out of hand. Xin is a grown man, people. Concern is nice, but this is almost getting creepy. I'm sure he knows how to get help if he needs it._

 

I agree, i'm however not suggesting we all have have to rush to the rescue.I just wanted to see if there was someone out there with a *personal* link into xin who is able to check status and inform us.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_To be honest I do not agree. Xin will probabely be aware about this thread and no one -what ever mode he is - will neglect this without even a word. Personally I think It looks like there might be a problem with Xin. I'm not asking *anyone *to knock on his door.The fact that even Jamoto8 can't get in thouch with him and Nc8000 does not get an answer indicates that he is not on air at the moment. He must have some *friends *here who knows him personaly and lives in the neighbourhood? Or knows anyone who does? I do not care about the money (payed through paypall and not with drawing the payment)._

 


 I have to agree with Wotan here.

 I don't really believe most people would feel that a "Customer" knocking on your HOME door would genuinely be concerned about your well being. It would likely be considered very intrusive!

 If Jamato had visited multiple times and could still, that may be a possibility, but since he can't, ???????


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't really believe most people would feel that a "Customer" knocking on your HOME door would genuinely be concerned about your well being. It would likely be considered very intrusive!_

 

That was exactly my point, yes.


----------



## GUNS

Just a little tease the date to have the reference at $249 has been set to 10/10. Fairly sure this was a recent update as i didn't notice it the other day. Hopefully this means that Xin may actually start producing a few amps after this date, of course that is totally unknown. At least it shows that he is still alive!


----------



## jamato8

Yes, I didn't notice the 10/10 the other day either. Strange to say the least. Maybe something beyond expectations is coming, who knows. ?


----------



## immtbiker

I filed a complaint with the Paypal resolution Center and they told me:

_Paypal says they do not deal with these type of cases (paid for items but did received) and told me to deal with the seller personally.

 What?

 Dispute Xin Feng Company 4ET127461V892510G Aug. 12, 2007 -$19.99 USD Non-receipt Oct. 1, 2007 Deferred PP-344-740-227 sales@fixup.net 
 Dispute Xin Feng Company 4PL46811GM178954W Aug. 7, 2007 -$285.98 USD Non-receipt Oct. 1, 2007 Deferred PP-344-739-574 sales@fixup.net_


----------



## jamato8

That doesn't make since. You used their service to buy something, didn't get it and they will not help? When do they help? And what do you do if you can't get a hold of the seller?


----------



## Skylab

When did you pay? Paypal only handles those types of issues within 45 days, IIRC...


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you pay? Paypal only handles those types of issues within 45 days, IIRC..._

 

It shows as Aug 7 and 12th from the info in his post.


----------



## Skylab

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It shows as Aug 7 and 12th from the info in his post._

 

In that case, you just missed the cut. I checked - 45 days is indeed the limit for "I didn't get it" Paypal assistance. I remembered this from when I was trying to get my money back from Larry Milligan at Larocco Audio...


----------



## jlingo

I think Xin should change its policy to only accept credit card orders. No more paypal. Besides, I think he is still overloaded anyway with credit card orders. Then he would be saved from problems such as refunds.


----------



## immtbiker

Oh damn...I was thinking *Sept *7th and 12th. I couldn't figure out how I missed the cutoff.

 Either way, unless Xin sends me an amp or my money, I'm screwed. I just bought a Tomahawk and was going to use that money to pay for the deficit (my wife is getting more into this hobby than I can afford, but I suppose worse things could happen 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





)


----------



## Skylab

Wow, lucky you! I have never been able to make an audiophile out of my wife. She loves music, and cares a little about sound, but not enough to bother with anything like a headphone amp...

 Anyway, good luck getting your money back from Xin. You are like simply going to get an amp, someday.


----------



## drc73rp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Skylab* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow, lucky you! I have never been able to make an audiophile out of my wife. She loves music, and cares a little about sound, but not enough to bother with anything like a headphone amp..._

 

X2!!!


----------



## immtbiker

She took control of my bedside rig (Headroom Desktop and Dedicated P/S).

 I get woken up at 3 a.m. hearing music bleeding out of her DT880's. I have to put on ear plugs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The only issue that I have is, that she is stuck in "the Blues Mode". I can't get her to listen to other genres, even though she sits on the couch with me occasionally and listens to everything from Ella and Sarah to Radiohead.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_She took control of my bedside rig (Headroom Desktop and Dedicated P/S).

 I get woken up at 3 a.m. hearing music bleeding out of her DT880's. I have to put on ear plugs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The only issue that I have is, that she is stuck in "the Blues Mode". I can't get her to listen to other genres, even though she sits on the couch with me occasionally and listens to everything from Ella and Sarah to Radiohead._

 

I wish I could get my wife to listen to Ella or Sarah!


----------



## musicmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GUNS* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just a little tease the date to have the reference at $249 has been set to 10/10. Fairly sure this was a recent update as i didn't notice it the other day. Hopefully this means that Xin may actually start producing a few amps after this date, of course that is totally unknown. At least it shows that he is still alive!_

 

I emailed Xin this afternoon regarding waiting times for the Xin reference and got a response from him in a couple of hours. So yes he is alive.


----------



## aluren

and what did he say?


----------



## musicmaker

"Hi Manu, no in stock right now. I expect waiting time to be 1 month.
 Thank you, Xin"


----------



## musicmaker

I really want to order this amp but the wait times seem maddening not to mention the lack of communication. Haven't decided yet.


----------



## aluren

well at least he responded to you. but yeah, don't let it fool you, 1 month will turn into 10 months! lol...


----------



## DDW

Hmmm ... Interesting.

 Glad to hear he is at least well enough to answer one email. Hope he is O.K.

 ... don't know about one month delivery. I assume it is possible, but based on history, it seems improbable.

 I think I will tell myself 6-9 months and be pleasently surprised if sooner.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think I will tell myself 6-9 months and be pleasently surprised if sooner._

 

This what I'm doing.


----------



## musicmaker

This amp must be bloody good for you guys to endure a 6 - 9 month wait.


----------



## ahamric

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This amp must be bloody good for you guys to endure a 6 - 9 month wait._

 

x2. Especially if you haven't heard it. (I didn't read back far enough to see whether you did or not.)


----------



## musicmaker

i haven't heard it which is why this is a tough decision.


----------



## GUNS

It's the only set of amps of which everyone has given a good review.. or even better an exceptional review. I'm pretty sure its worth it. But i guess that we will find out soon if he is getting abit more active with e-mails and the website then i guess it means he is getting back to the business of making the amps. He must have a large backlog of orders though.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GUNS* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He must have a large backlog of orders though._

 

Building a hundred, say, amps would drive me crazy. I can imagine all those little circuit boards lined up waiting to be poplulated. then dealing with the paperwork, packaging, etc. He even has a range of amps! Does the guy ever sleep or take a day off? He seems superhuman to me.


----------



## drc73rp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i haven't heard it which is why this is a tough decision._

 

In my opinion, if this is one of the best portable amps to be made (if not the best), and there's a good chance of it basing on several reviews by beta testers (who have some good experience in this forum to be credible), and its only going to cost $249 (until 10/10), you know you're going to want it. 

 So the question is, do you wait 6-9 months for all of us to get ours and confirm what we all suspected, of it being the best for 249 despite the long wait, before you start your own 6-9 months (making it 12-18 months), or, do you pull the trigger now (which doesn't cost you any if you use CC), and join in in this emotional (sometimes ridiculous, often pathetic, mostly hilarious if you think about it) rollercoaster of a ride called - "waiting for my Xin Reference Amp".


----------



## Sanddancer

I checked my original e-mail order yesterday and saw that my order actually went in on 2nd March. So yesterday was dead on 7 months. Still no sign


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I checked my original e-mail order yesterday and saw that my order actually went in on 2nd March. So yesterday was dead on 7 months. Still no sign 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

makes me wonder what the actual fall-out rate is, i mean those who cancel, maybe the figures arent too astronomical in terms of amps built when you consider this.

 sounds like there is... but i wonder what the percentage rate is for cancellations.

 the more the merrier...i have two amps on order now, which i will see in 08 sometime


----------



## GUNS

I don't think that cancellations are all that high. People who are ordering them at the moment know there is a wait, and if i'd ordered one >5 months ago then i wouldn't want to cancel just because it would be a waste of time. I'd say around 20% tops canceled. If i had such a large amount of amps to build i would probably be thinking "Oh crap" but once i get into it they would be flying out, i suspect this is similar to the Dr, except he gets curious half way through orders, starts fiddling and thats it for a few months hah.


----------



## sfflyfish

I don't post but I sure do read! I hit five months as of today! Only thing I've ever waited longer for was the birth of my daughter.....


----------



## ajsaxin

Well I have a feeling Xin might reduce the wait time once he starts production.I am sure nay buddy who was exposed to the kind a criticism that he had to go through would have tot abt doin something abt it.

 I guess he would have deicded on a full and final version of the REFERENCE wiht no more upgrades stocked up all the required parts and if samrt enough atleats get a helper to do the simpler and less complicated job...

 And all this might mean future orders would ship out in about 45 days from the time you place the order and the order i palced on sept 26 might ship out on nov 15 ..


 Well so much for wish ful thinking ....lol
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But it sure does not hurt.

 Hey a question to all you guys if XIN increases the price on the refrence to $400 would you guys still be interested ????????????


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ajsaxin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey a question to all you guys if XIN increases the price on the refrence to $400 would you guys still be interested ????????????_

 

yes cause i am stupid like that....you thinking of buying and selling to make some profit?


----------



## ajsaxin

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yes cause i am stupid like that....you thinking of buying and selling to make some profit? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Nahh tot if XIN does that it might redcue the orders and make it more manageable...


----------



## Evergreen

Xin Reference amp order placed on *08 Sep 07*. Bought a couple of other amps to tide me over.


----------



## bunsco

I've ordered on the same day!

 But im now considering whether i should go the supermicro route as it seems to be MUCH more portable


----------



## gp_hebert

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've ordered on the same day!

 But im now considering whether i should go the supermicro route as it seems to be MUCH more portable_

 

It depends of what DAP you're using with the amp. Reference is the size of a credit card so it's pretty portable with an iPod. If you plan to use it with a Nano or any smaller DAP, I guess the SuperMicro would be better. I had the SuperMicro on order, but changed it to the Reference because it's supposed to sound similar to the SuperMicro and Xin have been developping it for a very long while, so it's got to be good.


----------



## bunsco

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gp_hebert* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It depends of what DAP you're using with the amp. Reference is the size of a credit card so it's pretty portable with an iPod. If you plan to use it with a Nano or any smaller DAP, I guess the SuperMicro would be better. I had the SuperMicro on order, but changed it to the Reference because it's supposed to sound similar to the SuperMicro and Xin have been developping it for a very long while, so it's got to be good. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I tend to be one who changes songs quite a bit so the ipod in/out pocket senerio is pretty frequent.

 any reference owners with any opinions on my situ?

 how big the diffence between 'real world' SM4/reference portable usage?

 i've posted a thread here, so as not to highjack the tread:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=264457


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I tend to be one who changes songs quite a bit so the ipod in/out pocket senerio is pretty frequent.

 any reference owners with any opinions on my situ?

 how big the diffence between 'real world' SM4/reference portable usage?

 i've posted a thread here, so as not to highjack the tread:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=264457_

 

IMO if you use a large iPod w/ a Dock out there is no real world difference between the size of the Supermicro and the Reference.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've ordered on the same day!

 But im now considering whether i should go the supermicro route as it seems to be MUCH more portable_

 

I think gp_hebert got it right. If you use a nano, I would suggest a SuperMicro. That's whatt I use with my 1st gen nanp and an ALO micro. But, if you are going with the 160gb you have in your signature, a Reference would be fine and probably worth waiting for. Good rig!


----------



## ckhirnigs113

I see that the special price of $249 for the Reference ends 10/10. How many of you are going to put it on order even though the wait will be well into next year? I think I am going to join the long wait list if my card isn't charged until shipment. Is that the case?

 Thanks, CK


----------



## ckhirnigs113

I just joined the club. I chose payment by check. Do you think I need to send the check now, or wait until my amp is ready for shipment?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ckhirnigs113* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just joined the club. I chose payment by check. Do you think I need to send the check now, or wait until my amp is ready for shipment?_

 

send the check now.

 cc is not charged till ship to answer your previous question.

 welcome to the club


----------



## kamal007

should i join the club or not?


----------



## rxc

^Plenty of room at the back of the line


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_send the check now.

 cc is not charged till ship to answer your previous question.

 welcome to the club 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Isnt a cheque only valid for a few months? Meaning it has to be cashed before then?


----------



## BushGuy

IIRC - 6 months. But, if you write a check and fail to date it.......good for as long as the account exists (date to be filled in by recipient).


----------



## ckhirnigs113

I read on the forums on Xin's site that someone received their upgraded amp back in the past few days. I guess Xin is still there after all. -CK


----------



## jamato8

Yes, he is around, just not sure what he is up to.


----------



## bunsco

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, he is around, just not sure what he is up to._

 

Jamato, whats the etiquette regarding the ammendment of an order - i.e if i wanted to add a SMIV to the reference OR change from reference to SMIV


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Jamato, whats the etiquette regarding the ammendment of an order - i.e if i wanted to add a SMIV to the reference OR change from reference to SMIV_

 


 I would put "Change to Existing Order" or "Please Change My Order" in the subject line and then give the details in the body of the email.


----------



## chukwe

I hope we can get the Xin Ref within six months


----------



## immtbiker

I hope to get my 2 week old requested refund within 6 months


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Jamato, whats the etiquette regarding the ammendment of an order - i.e if i wanted to add a SMIV to the reference OR change from reference to SMIV_

 

LOL... Jamato, you are the closest thing we have to customer service representative from Xin. You have become, out of necessity, the #1 go-to guy for issues, questions, status-checks. I'm guessing you're not getting a cut.


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Sooooo... has anyone gotten an amp shipment lately? It's my impression that Xin has gone out of production/shipment mode for the time being.


----------



## ckhirnigs113

Some guy named Drew claims to have received his amp in the last few days. I saw this in the fixup.net forums. -CK


----------



## GUNS

Well Xin has now changed the price of the Reference to a solid $279.99 so since he has been updating the site fairly well i think that he will most probably fairly active in getting orders done and then send them out in bulk.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ckhirnigs113* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Some guy named Drew claims to have received his amp in the last few days. I saw this in the fixup.net forums. -CK_

 

That was an upgraded SM4 not a Reference. As Drew stated: "The squeaky wheel gets the grease".
 It seem that the only way to get your amp is to "moving out of state in 2 weeks" (drew) or "I mentioned that I had to leave for Iraq next week" (naamanf on page 72 of this thread)
 Unfortunately I ain't going nowhere.... well, on second thought: I might be moving to Antarctica in a week or 2


----------



## naamanf

Hey don't drag me into this. Don't be hating because my Xin has more combat time than yours
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Before mentioning that I was leaving I was told I was next on the list and should receive mine soon.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey don't drag me into this. Don't be hating because my Xin has more combat time than yours
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Oh, come on man, are you serious? Don't be silly, I never said I hated you or your amp. In fact I am very glad for you and do not envy you in ANY way.

  Quote:


 Before mentioning that I was leaving I was told I was next on the list and should receive mine soon. 
 

I got that same email, months ago


----------



## naamanf

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, come on man, are you serious? Don't be silly, I never said I hated you or your amp. In fact I am very glad for you and do not envy you in ANY way.



 I got that same email, months ago 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Meant that to be a bit sarcastic.


----------



## fl00r

The point I was trying to make is that Xin is well able to ship amps but only do so when someone threatens to leave the country.
 I guess Xin will be getting a lot of emails like this from now on. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Take care!


----------



## vexeus

I e-mailed Xin and offered to buy a reference in addition to the Supermicro IV I ordered 7+ months ago if he shipped the amps soon.

 Unsurprisingly, I haven't received a response. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm starting to think that he isn't motivated by money...


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I e-mailed Xin and offered to buy a reference in addition to the Supermicro IV I ordered 7+ months ago if he shipped the amps soon.

 Unsurprisingly, I haven't received a response. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm starting to think that he isn't motivated by money..._

 

Always assuming he bothered to read your email....


----------



## tk3

I wish he would just start shipping them out in their current incarnation and let people decide if they want to send them back for upgrades and tweaks or not.

 Considering that the people who have heard the "non-finalized" versions are already very, very positive about it, it must be a quality amp.


----------



## Aaron622

Not much compared to a lot of people, but today makes two months waiting for a Reference. Time flies when you are waiting for a Xin...


----------



## tomjtx

Hey,............. Xin is Xin....... and it sounds like Zen.

 Which, I suggest , is the the attitude we should all adopt toward the wait for a XIn.

 We could meld this eastern attitude with a western existential attitude, in which case, rather than waiting for Godot, we are waiting for XIn.

 Which would imply that the wait for that ever elusive, ephemeral experience of meaning that we call music is an experience to be valued in and of itself.


----------



## icantusefizz

*Open letter to Dr. Xin Feng:*

_Dear Dr. Xin,

 For many months i have joined the group of music enthusiasts that could only be described as self-hating and/or eternally calm and collected. These people, perhaps we should refer to them as "Xinophiles" have thus far remained fairly restrained and have managed to work out their frustration in ways deemed socially acceptable. These may include, but are not limited to:
 -Yelling
 -Banging head on wall
 -Desperately begging Mr. Jamato for help

 However as I did my daily check of the thread where we Xinophiles congregate I was somewhat disturbed by what I read. My dear friend tom, who I can only assume is from texas, has shown the true impact that the wait is having on our small community. I am not entirely sure what it is he was attempting to say, but it involved existentialism and Buddhism. I imagine it looks something like this:





 Since i know you have little time to read emails i will cut it short at that, but please take note that there are more important things in life than perfection, sanity for example...

 Thank you for your time.

 Sincerely,
 -Mike Fizz 
 P.s. I am moving out of the country in 2 weeks please send Reference pronto._


----------



## vexeus

I hope it works.


----------



## tomjtx

Where did you get that picture of me?


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 I hope it works. 
 

No,it won't,Xin doesn't read this forum.


----------



## icantusefizz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No,it won't,Xin doesn't read this forum._

 

Thanks for the input. Will take this into consideration next time.

 -Mike


----------



## Quaddy

havent seen anyone post there received date here as of late, its almost used for everything but! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 c'mon you sneaky devils who have received em, be honest, we wont mob you...tell us here, so we can at least have some light at the end of the tunnel!


----------



## som4ew

It's funny though, dew on Xin web site received a last updated Supermacro 4(with new wall wart power supply).So far nobody get any new amp from
 him. Does it mean that he is still in Ref.amp development mode,but he has finished others amps' power supply tweak mode?


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's funny though, dew on Xin web site received a last updated Supermacro 4(with new wall wart power supply).So far nobody get any new amp from
 him. Does it mean that he is still in Ref.amp development mode,but he has finished others amps' power supply tweak mode?_

 

Sent him my Supermacro IV LE for updating about two months ago and nothin' yet. We'll see. Ordered Reference early August and no word either.


----------



## Wotan1

Not sure why he is still accepting orders as he has a back log from here to eternity. And it's getting worse and worse.


----------



## naamanf

Little secret. He actually sends out hundred of amps a month. Just not to members of the forums. That's why we never hear about people getting amps


----------



## rxc

When he researches he RESEARCHES. When he builds he BUILDS.


----------



## immtbiker

When he does refunds, does he do REFUNDS?

 Still no response.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *naamanf* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Little secret. He actually sends out hundred of amps a month. *Just not* to members of the forums. That's why we never hear about people getting amps 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

lets hope /\ thats meant to read, *not just*...


----------



## Dexter Morgan

I'm always hearing that Xin doesn't read this forum. How involved does he get on the forums at fixup.net? I'm thinking all this whining (and I mean that in the best of terms) might be more useful there. Too bad we can't copy/paste this thread there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 P.S. That open letter was awesome.
 P.P.S. I agree with Tom, there is inherent value in the experience of waiting for the amp. Just like there's value to water torture.


----------



## LarryVale

Accumulating orders for bigger assembly runs while perpetuating the image of the "mad engineering monk" working 24 hours a day in the basement of a Monastary in California(?)

 If he sends out hundreds every month, does amps and maybe other items, smaller job shops are not hard to find in China. If I had some of them thar smarts I'd farm out the assembly. 

 opps. Well, I like the business model anyway. 

 Gawd, I feel like a disciple of Carl Rove starting a whispering campaign. 

 Opps, forget I said any of it. Maybe he'll make me a very small amp with optical input anyway??

 I'm praying he will.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm always hearing that Xin doesn't read this forum. How involved does he get on the forums at fixup.net? I'm thinking all this whining (and I mean that in the best of terms) might be more useful there. Too bad we can't copy/paste this thread there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 P.S. That open letter was awesome.
 P.P.S. I agree with Tom, there is inherent value in the experience of waiting for the amp. Just like there's value to water torture._

 

Water torture does build character, although WT is more fun to administer than receive.


----------



## Icarium

What would an amp, portable or not, do with an optical input?


----------



## LarryVale

Play music off the H1xx series of Iriver players or off portable CD players, well equipped, or play files off the optical out on most computers.


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Play music off the H1xx series of Iriver players or off portable CD players, well equipped, or play files off the optical out on most computers._

 


 It's not just an "input" that's needed. A DAC (Digital-Analogue converter) is the component that provides the optical "input" 

 This would double the price and increase build time to ~2 years...

 I'm sure it would be worth it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






 EK


----------



## LarryVale

Well I have a D1 on order @ $240 as I recall. It's just a bit bulky for gym use. 

 I'll survive with its bulk but, would prefer a smaller unit.

 This place is all about wants not needs 


 LV


----------



## tomjtx

It just occured to me that this thread , at 89 pages, might be the perfect antidote for the wait.

 Just go to page 1 and start re reading. With the aditional posting going on in the meantime you may likely get your amp by the time you finish this thread.

 Or you may never get to the end of the thread or get the amp, the two simply lasting for infinity in a kind of cruel symetry, traveling through an infinite series of parallel universes aka the branes of the multiverse in the world of string theory.

 Ahh.............the elegance of Xin philosophy.


 PS. soon announcing the DVD release of the hit movie "Waiting for Xin"

 special pre-order discount price of 1,000.00 USD for those on the Xin wait list (1,500.00 for other head-fi members)
 Pre-orders guaranteed delivery by 10/1/2117


----------



## LarryVale

My kinda humor!

 Good stuff Mister


----------



## only500made

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rxc* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When he researches he RESEARCHES. When he builds he BUILDS._

 

 Quote:


 When he does refunds, does he do REFUNDS?

 Still no response. 
 

_Burn baby burn! - Disco inferno!_


----------



## icantusefizz

I think we should make page 90 of this thread all about puns involving "xin".

 Like such as:

 I check head-fi every day just xin case somebody has news about my amp.

 Xin soviet russia, amp waits on you.

 ect. 

 The ball is now xin your court, lets hear those puns!

 -Fizz


----------



## tomjtx

I have now received 200 orders for "Waiting for Xin".

 The wait list date for new orders is now 2027.

 I am keeping the price at the LOW intro rate of 1,000.00 but I will have to add paypal fees after order # 300, 

 So hurry, this is a great opportunity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 SAVE NOW!


----------



## Dexter Morgan

first haikus, now this? I am becoming increasingly concerned about our collective mental state. Though those amps do sound good, don't they?


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_first haikus, now this?_

 

I am sorry, I have bowed to the crass commercialism of the evil gajin and farang of the west.

 Fortunately, thanks to Xin Buddhism , I have no ego with which to suffer the mortification I so justly deserve.

 The growing paypal balance helps too.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_first haikus, now this? I am becoming increasingly concerned about our collective mental state. Though those amps do sound good, don't they?_

 

 Xin falling


 - gravity



 waiting


----------



## Quaddy

*Those who waiting Xin amp, post and get your date of arrival* <-- delicately tries to steer this thread back OT, failing miserably


----------



## tomjtx

we are OT ?


----------



## Capunk

So previous XIN amp owner, 
 does he continuously creating new amps (new products), after he finishing the previous production batch?


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*Those who waiting Xin amp, post and get your date of arrival* <-- delicately tries to steer this thread back OT, failing miserably 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 How can we get back OT if no one can meet the criteria (for the slower minded "no one has gotten their's or a date")


----------



## _j_

Over the weekend I have now passed the 7+ Months mark anniversary. 
 Goooo me!

 Can't be much longer now... or can it?


----------



## aluren

i hope xin has made a gigantic new breakthrough and that's why he's taking so long and keeping everything so tight lip about what's going on....


----------



## tomjtx

the longer you wait

 the better it will be

 thus is hunger spate

 anticipatorily


----------



## Dexter Morgan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i hope xin has made a gigantic new breakthrough and that's why he's taking so long and keeping everything so tight lip about what's going on...._

 

Maybe Xin is addicted to ****.

 What, **** is a bad word around here? Okay, how about this... Maybe Xin can't keep his hands off himself?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How can we get back OT if no one can meet the criteria (for the slower minded "no one has gotten their's or a date") 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

lol - precisely.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"Hi Manu, no in stock right now. I expect waiting time to be 1 month.
 Thank you, Xin"_

 

That was about 2 weeks ago, so if he manages to keep that deadline, perhaps we'll see some shipping notices in 2 weeks.


----------



## icantusefizz

I wouldnt put any money on it Mr. Tk. Speaking of putting money down. We should start a bet to see who can correctly guess the day that the next Xin amp goes out. I think it would be pretty successful.

 Any ideas?

 -Fizz


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dexter Morgan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ What, **** is a bad word around here? Okay, how about this... Maybe Xin can't keep his hands off himself?_

 

Yes *** is a bad word. And so is ***** and even the word **.


----------



## tnmike1

I suppose what galls me is the fact that we're not building rockets here, custom made Ferraris, or even custom made big amps. We're building little $300 toys. And tinkering only goes so far. OK, so he's a perfectionist. That said, a "blast" of an email to his forum and here, taking about one minute to compose, would settle a lot of minds. Like "I'm still in development" or "amps might ship in X weeks" something like that. And, for me, shipping an amp back to Xin for upgrades should be a no-brainer which takes no development or trial and error. just pop out the old parts, pop in the new and ship the bad boy out.

 I just find the whole situation very inexcuseable, with really no justification for the entire wait thing


----------



## icantusefizz

Very profound Tennessee Mike.

 -Texas Mike


----------



## immtbiker

Yeah...What he said ^


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I suppose what galls me is the fact that we're not building rockets here, custom made Ferraris, or even custom made big amps. We're building little $300 toys. And tinkering only goes so far. OK, so he's a perfectionist. That said, a "blast" of an email to his forum and here, taking about one minute to compose, would settle a lot of minds. Like "I'm still in development" or "amps might ship in X weeks" something like that. And, for me, shipping an amp back to Xin for upgrades should be a no-brainer which takes no development or trial and error. just pop out the old parts, pop in the new and ship the bad boy out.

 I just find the whole situation very inexcuseable, with really no justification for the entire wait thing_

 

Agreed and this notion seems to have been mentioned million times here already, but would be nice if someone actually said it to Xin in person, as he doesn't even read this forum.

 Perhaps he would be even surprised if he knew of the existence of this topic.


----------



## immtbiker

ROAD TRIP!


----------



## icantusefizz

We really should migrate to "cool-talk" for a little while. I dont think xin really reads those forums much either but hey, worst that could happen is a change of scenery.

 Or xin gets so bogged down reading his own forum that we are forced to wait another 7 months....

 Lets just stay at head-fi.

 -Fizz


----------



## greydragon

I just hope that when I get the Xin Reference, it'll be relatively 'better' than the Pico (pre-ordered) & HeadSix & Tomahawk. If not, it'll just be a tortuous wait for naught. 

 ...Well... to justify the wait, I've always wanted to try out a Xin amp, and the Ref is supposedly is "the Reference Edition of SuperMacro-IV," therefore it should be the best sounding Xin amp to date.


----------



## powertoold

I can't believe there are so many people willing to wait months for an amp. This can't sound much better than a $500 amp, and by the time you get one, you probably splurged on a better sounding amp already haha.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *powertoold* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can't believe there are so many people willing to wait months for an amp. This can't sound much better than a $500 amp, and by the time you get one, you probably splurged on a better sounding amp already haha._

 

As far as I know there are only two portable amps currently available that sell for more than $500. The PRII MkII and the Lisa III. Of these two I had the PRII MkII and the Xin Supermicro IV and the Reference sounded better IMO.


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *powertoold* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can't believe there are so many people willing to wait months for an amp. This can't sound much better than a $500 amp, and by the time you get one, you probably splurged on a better sounding amp already haha._

 

I can't believe people make statements like this when they haven't heard or compared a Xin amp to another themselves haha.

 Kidding aside, like it's been stated over and over and over and over again, people reserve their amp and pay with CC because Xin doesn't charge. Then when they get their amps they compare it to the amp they bought during the waiting period, and either keep it or sell it. I guess I still can't believe that people can't believe people are willing to put up with the wait.


----------



## slwiser

The problem is the Reference essentially does not exist except for a very few hands.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *slwiser* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The problem is the Reference essentially does not exist except for a very few hands._

 

And they apparently were prototypes, I would suppose. Which means, if the good Dr. is once again in development mode, those "hands" didn't have the current model, if indeed a "current model" even exists


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And they apparently were prototypes, I would suppose. Which means, if the good Dr. is once again in development mode, those "hands" didn't have the current model, if indeed a "current model" even exists
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

When Ron (HiFlight) received his Reference in early September (07) it was the final product at the time. Of course a couple communicated w/ Dr. Xin and he went back into research mode of which he has not come out off. I certainly hope it is not due to health issues.


----------



## ajsaxin

well whats keeps me patient waiting for my reference is that when a beta model sounded so good going the opinion of those who have heard it i can them only imagine how cool the final version is and plus come on guess for the price if charges i think its ok.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When Ron (HiFlight) received his Reference in early September (07) it was the final product at the time. Of course a couple communicated w/ Dr. Xin and he went back into research mode of which he has not come out off. I certainly hope it is not due to health issues._

 


 Miguel, that's exactly my point. These amps are NEVER a "finished product". as soon as we received the Supermacro IV LE we were told there was an improvement. Ditto with other amps in the line. So back we return them for "upgrades". And yeah, they're free upgrades, but what's the tradeoff of waiting 4-7 months for a "free "upgrade.? Free is only a financial term used here. If we dont' see our amps for months on end, what's so "free' about it???

 Same with the Reference. Thought we had a finished product, order the thing, all of a sudden, more development mode.


----------



## immtbiker

It's OK for those of us that are insane enough and monetarily secure enough to have more than one portable amp. 

 However, what about the poor college audiophile or adult on a fixed income that only has the funds for one amp, and mistakenly Paypal'd Xin the cash.

 I personally am fortunate enough to have a Tomahawk and a Portaphile, so waiting and lack of responses from Xin is more of an inconvenience (especially since I've asked for a refund twice, with no reply).

 But, for someone who did their homework, and decided that the Reference is the one for them, then it is truly unfair that the silence and unknown arrival dates are "business as usual" for this amp builder.


----------



## tomjtx

Those that paid with paypal simply need to file a dispute with paypal and xin will refund the money that same day. You can then re order with CC.

 That is what happened with me.

 I just got an email from xin explaining the paypal process so he is reading his email, although I got this email 3 weeks after I sent a query.

 It appears he may be catching up.


----------



## dimm0k

Doesn't mean that the amps are on their way, but I e-mailed Xin a couple of weeks back to see if I can switch the case color and he responded today saying yes! Almost tempted to add on another!


----------



## tnmike1

Hey gang, got an idea: for those of you REALLY upset with the whole situation, why not send him a postcard or a letter. Or if you really wanna spend the bucks, send it certified, return receipt requested. After all, his address is on his website. And with return receipt requested, you know he received your mail.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But, for someone who did their homework, and decided that the Reference is the one for them, then it is truly unfair that the silence and unknown arrival dates are "business as usual" for this amp builder._

 

It's hard to say homework was done in the majority of cases when there is so few of them are around to audition. It's more hopework from personal perspective. You trust a reviewer's opinions based on past agreements and take it on faith the product will deliver.

 As others have alluded to; I hope the Reference isn't eclipsed SQ-wise by shipping Picos, etc. when it eventually ships. It would really stink to wait all this time and not have state of the art performance when it arrives.


----------



## ChicagoNB

I too just heard back from Xin saying my amp would ship "soon". I emailed him 3 weeks ago and he responded last night. Hopefully that is good news for all!!!!


----------



## aluren

let's hope that is the case. 'soon' to me also means 'ship in 2-3 weeks' which also means a 6 month wait.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ChicagoNB* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I too just heard back from Xin saying my amp would ship "soon". I emailed him 3 weeks ago and he responded last night. Hopefully that is good news for all!!!!_

 

When did you order yours?


----------



## ajsaxin

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjtx* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Those that paid with paypal simply need to file a dispute with paypal and xin will refund the money that same day. You can then re order with CC.

 That is what happened with me.

 I just got an email from xin explaining the paypal process so he is reading his email, although I got this email 3 weeks after I sent a query.

 It appears he may be catching up._

 

You telling me he actually took your order after you filed a dispute against him wiht payapl.Man he sure is a nice guy.Come on not many would have done the same even if they were at fault lol.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ajsaxin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You telling me he actually took your order after you filed a dispute against him wiht payapl.Man he sure is a nice guy.Come on not many would have done the same even if they were at fault lol._

 

I don't think that is unusual for Xin.
 From what I have read on these threads I think that is the normal way to get a refund with Xin. I think that must be the easiest way for him to do the refund, rather than sifting through all the emails.

 At least I hope so, I certainly had no intention to offend him.


----------



## immtbiker

I requested a refund twice and was ignored. I filed a claim 3 weeks ago with Paypal and they told me it was past the period of days that I could file a dispute (this is for readers who haven't read the whole thread...sorry for the duplicate info).

 Today I received an e-mail from him that stated:

 "Please confirm if you want me to refund and I'll do immediately andvery sorry for so slow. Xin"

 As much as I want the amp, I am so soured by his business practises that I asked for the refund. I will report back if I get it.

 BTW- When I said "People who have done their homework" of course no one can really go by actual listening to production units as only a few prototypes were released. I mean non-impulsive people who have taken the time and effort to make sure to order something that they really want, on a limited budget.
 I, on the other hand, am an immature impulsive purchaser of audio. I read reviews, try to demo through friends and meets, but have no control what-so -ever on pulling the trigger. I am an average American, sorry to say.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's OK for those of us that are insane enough and monetarily secure enough to have more than one portable amp. 

 However, what about the poor college audiophile or adult on a fixed income that only has the funds for one amp, and mistakenly Paypal'd Xin the cash.

 I personally am fortunate enough to have a Tomahawk and a Portaphile, so waiting and lack of responses from Xin is more of an inconvenience (especially since I've asked for a refund twice, with no reply).

 But, for someone who did their homework, and decided that the Reference is the one for them, then it is truly unfair that the silence and unknown arrival dates are "business as usual" for this amp builder._

 

We are insane and I love it! BTW you will be in Fort Lauderdale on 10/27, correct? I will have a Graham Slee Voyager there. It is his latest (and only) portable amp.


----------



## immtbiker

Please make sure to remind me. 
 I tend to lose sense of real world structure when I go to Head-Fi Meets.


----------



## druelle

I just got this exciting e-mail from Xin:

  Quote:


 Yes xxxxxx, things are moving on after a while of interrupt. If anything wrong again, I'll let you and others know. Thank you, Xin


----------



## greydragon

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *druelle* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got this exciting e-mail from Xin:






_

 

But he doesn't list a time frame of when you'll be receiving your amp! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I hope he's not waving an invisible carrot.


----------



## fl00r

Well the good news is: he's alive and well and on speaking terms again.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well the good news is: he's alive and well and on speaking terms again.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

good, call off the planned search and rescue parties from a few weeks ago!


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_good, call off the planned search and rescue parties from a few weeks ago!




_

 

You mean: Saving private Xin


----------



## vexeus

guffaw

 In all seriousness, I'm glad to see he's responding to someone. I'm sure mine is close to production!


----------



## immtbiker

I received a Paypal refund this a.m. 

 Maybe he was incarcerated and is out now.


----------



## PhaedrusX

someone in the edmonton meet thread mentioned receiving his/her reference. i got the impression that it was the production amp, and not a prototype.


----------



## tk3

Well, I guess we can expect some progress, now that he is actually responding to email again.
 But, who knows what "soon" is from Xin's perspective.


----------



## ComfyCan

Well, it sounds like the good doctor may be getting back to shipping. I hope so. I do feel sorry for those that don't have a backup amp--that would make me crazy.

 I had a Supermicro III in hand before I ordered a Supermicro IV. Since then, I have returned the Supermicro III for upgrades (perhaps 5 or 6 months ago), and I won't return the IV for upgrades until I get the III back, or perhaps the reference if I get that sooner (ordered last month).

 The key to Xin is always keep one in hand while the other(s) are in limbo. It is not the place to order your first portable amp.


----------



## speedbird151

let's hope someone here gets one soon!


----------



## tnmike1

Here's a fun couple of minutes: go on the Xin "support" forum, then scroll casually thru 70+ pages going back seveal years. There you will find people from several years ago asking "Where's Xin?" "Is Xin MIA?"

 Apparently this is nothing new.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Here's a fun couple of minutes: go on the Xin "support" forum, then scroll casually thru 70+ pages going back seveal years. There you will find people from several years ago asking "Where's Xin?" "Is Xin MIA?"

 Apparently this is nothing new._

 

exactly, context is a wonderful thing


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But, who knows what "soon" is from Xin's perspective. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Well, in this respect I can tell you that The Big X has got a singular way of time adverb. 5 month ago I asked him when my amp will be mine, and he responed with the very word, and I quote: 'soon'.
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I guess we can expect some progress, now that he is actually responding to email again._

 

All I can say is: certanly don't hold you breath, but there is nothing wrong with some cheerful thoughts


----------



## yourtoys7

I keep forgeting I ordered one, till I see this tread and then... I have to wait some more...


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, in this respect I can tell you that The Big X has got a singular way of time adverb. 5 month ago I asked him when my amp will be mine, and he responed with the very word, and I quote: 'soon'.

 All I can say is: certanly don't hold you breath, but there is nothing wrong with some cheerful thoughts_

 

Hehe, he did mention that he would let people know if he got "stuck" again, but lets hope none of this happens and that we'll all see our amps soon.


----------



## tnmike1

Posted a letter today to XIn's address in corvallis or. asking the status of my SM IV LE I sent in several months ago. Requested it be returned in a week or so.

 Will update if I get any results.


----------



## dimm0k

Any idea how to add on another amp to my already placed order or would it have to be a second order?


----------



## BushGuy

To add an additional amp - I'd simply head your email as order change (then, your current order #). Be precise, and simplify, simplify, .......oh, did I suggest to simplify!
 If you have the orig. order confirmation - I'd do it as a reply to that confirmation letter.


----------



## ChicagoNB

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you order yours?_

 


 I ordered mine in early July. 2007 that is. So it hasn't been as long as some but long enough.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Any idea how to add on another amp to my already placed order or would it have to be a second order?_

 


 There's NUTS, and then there's sadistic NUTS!


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There's NUTS, and then there's sadistic NUTS! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Wouldn't that be masochistic nuts?


----------



## immtbiker

Yes it would be, but I didn't want to use spellcheck and "sadistic" is easier to spell.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes it would be, but I didn't want to use spellcheck and "sadistic" is easier to spell._

 

Ahh............so you are not masochistic


----------



## immtbiker

How dare you say I'm not so masochistic 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I ordered a Reference didn't I?

 I'd call it more like being lazy, because I'd be the first in line to say "Yes ma'am, can I have another?"


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How dare you say I'm not so masochistic 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered a Reference didn't I?

 I'd call it more like being lazy, because I'd be the first in line to say "Yes ma'am, can I have another?" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

But didn't you ask and get a refund? I would say you are a self tease or maybe ordering gave you all the satisfaction you needed. :^)


----------



## BushGuy

I was under the impression that ALL Headphoneus Supremii were good spellers. You're admitting it's not a basic requirement for this lofty position?


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was under the impression that ALL Headphoneus Supremii were good spellers. You're admitting it's not a basic requirement for this lofty position?_

 

Maybe for a mod, but not for Headphoneus Supremii. Isn't BHD812 a Headphoneus Supremii 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




?

 As for asking and receiving a refund, I *did *have to ask 3 times, get turned downed by Paypal because it passed the time limit, and was only responded to when everyone else got their responses (perhaps, after incarceration 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 j/k)

 It was not a pleasant business transaction, but one thing that I have to thank Xin for, was that he ate the Paypal charges in both directions, or else I would have lost a decent amount of money, and still had the chance to reneg and take the amp without knowing the time considerations. I bought a Tomahawk with the refund and received it in 2 days, and am really happy, just won't know if the Reference would have made me happier.

 Perhaps I will buy a used one, a year down the line when someone has a fire sale.


----------



## jamato8

If a Reference somes out like mine there will be no fire sale. If they come out like mine, you would have, will have, a true reference.


----------



## immtbiker

jamato8,
 I meant, more like a "_am selling everything cheap beacause I have to pay my mortgage this month_" type sale (been there, done that...damn I miss my Qualias).

 At this point I believe it is my highly overpaid Mod job to say to everyone:

 "OK guys. Let's get back on topic" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Yeah...what he said.


----------



## fl00r

On the other hand: when we really go back on topic this thread will peter out very soon...


----------



## dimm0k

Well it's done... sent an e-mail asking to add on a second amp to my order. I like pain!


----------



## LarryVale

I ordered one on the weekend and within the paypal payment I asked when it might be shipped as I am leaving KC the end of next month. I got nothing back. Today I left a voicemail asking the same thing then followed up with an email asking what he might have available if he can't get me a supermicro. No response yet on that either. I left another voicemail message. He is not on the irc channel he suggests either.


----------



## LarryVale

Catch this!! 

 The audio gods are smiling on me.

 Just got an email from Xin saying he plans on having all orders out b4 Thankgiving. Weather that applies only to the supermicro or not, I don't know. 

 I can now concentrate on getting rid of things I don't or won't use.


----------



## dimm0k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Catch this!! 

 The audio gods are smiling on me.

 Just got an email from Xin saying he plans on having all orders out b4 Thankgiving. Weather that applies only to the supermicro or not, I don't know. 

 I can now concentrate on getting rid of things I don't or won't use._

 

When did you order? If I'm to get mine around Thanksgiving I think I'd shed a tear!


----------



## srikeerthi

Hmm, thats a nice sign. We at least have a probable date rather than just 'soon'!

 A month more to wait for it then


----------



## LarryVale

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you order? If I'm to get mine around Thanksgiving I think I'd shed a tear!_

 

Last weekend...paid via PP


----------



## aluren

now that's something to give thanks to!


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ ...he plans on having all orders out b4 Thankgiving._

 

This Thanksgiving or next 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ?


----------



## greydragon

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This Thanksgiving or next 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ?_

 






 My sentiments exactly.


----------



## nc8000

For months I've been trying to get thru to Dr. Xin via mail but had no reply. Last week I sent one final mail and set it up so that I would get a confirmation when it was received and when it was read. Last night I got a confirmation that the mail was deleted without even being read. So it seems tha Dr. Xin does not even bother to read his mail, he just deletes it. I've now had it with Dr. Xin. I'm cancelling my SuperMicro order, he can keep the SuperMini I have returned for repair and when my current SuperMicro finally dies I'll get an amp from some other builder. If he tries to charge my credit card for the SuperMicro order because he has also just deleted my cancellation I will have him for credit card fraud. He had a good thing going but he has for what ever reason totally screwed it up. I can only advise people to stay well clear of Dr. Xin and his joke operation.


----------



## ckhirnigs113

I, for one, am excited. I may have to reconsider the Xin line if this production schedule proves true.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For months I've been trying to get thru to Dr. Xin via mail but had no reply. Last week I sent one final mail and set it up so that I would get a confirmation when it was received and when it was read. Last night I got a confirmation that the mail was deleted without even being read. So it seems tha Dr. Xin does not even bother to read his mail, he just deletes it. I've now had it with Dr. Xin. I'm cancelling my SuperMicro order, he can keep the SuperMini I have returned for repair and when my current SuperMicro finally dies I'll get an amp from some other builder. If he tries to charge my credit card for the SuperMicro order because he has also just deleted my cancellation I will have him for credit card fraud. He had a good thing going but he has for what ever reason totally screwed it up. I can only advise people to stay well clear of Dr. Xin and his joke operation. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	











_

 


 I felt the same way as you do and I also cancelled my order for the reasons you state. This guy has to be the worst business man I have ever seen, and untill more people chosse not to put up with this, nothing will change and he will still treat you like garbage.

 It won't be long for some of the Xin ***** kissers 
 chime in and defend him no matter how he treats his customers. Some people dont have a clue.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It won't be long for some of the Xin ***** kissers 
 chime in and defend him no matter how he treats his customers. Some people dont have a clue._

 

I think I'm one of the people you're referring to.

 I think some people have been so conditioned by the capitalist business model that they can't understand or imagine that there are other ways of doing things. No-one has an obligation to conform to it, and no-one is forced to order anything from Dr Xin. I agree that not responding to emails and not communicating with customers is bad. We know that Dr Xin is an eccentric and a perfectionist who could easily come off the rails at any time, making very good amplifiers for very low prices. If, knowing this, some of use choose to order something from him, why do you think it's a good idea to call us names??

 I have an order in for a Reference, it has cost me nothing, I have other amps to enjoy in the meantime, I'm not impatient and I'm not even sure I'll ever see the Reference. I'm quite happy with that situation. If it ever does arrive I shall be pleased to own something that comes from a bizarre and interesting niche in audio history - the mad Chinese engineer who developed and extraordinary range of miniaturised electronics, and insisted making them all himself and practically gave them away, and I expect it will sound wonderful.


----------



## rxc

Order
 Wait...wait...wait...
 Credit Card gets charged
 Amp arrives
 Enjoy

 That's all there is to it.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think I'm one of the people you're referring to.

 I think some people have been so conditioned by the capitalist business model that they can't understand or imagine that there are other ways of doing things. No-one has an obligation to conform to it, and no-one is forced to order anything from Dr Xin. I agree that not responding to emails and not communicating with customers is bad. We know that Dr Xin is an eccentric and a perfectionist who could easily come off the rails at any time, making very good amplifiers for very low prices. If, knowing this, some of use choose to order something from him, why do you think it's a good idea to call us names??

 I have an order in for a Reference, it has cost me nothing, I have other amps to enjoy in the meantime, I'm not impatient and I'm not even sure I'll ever see the Reference. I'm quite happy with that situation. If it ever does arrive I shall be pleased to own something that comes from a bizarre and interesting niche in audio history - the mad Chinese engineer who developed and extraordinary range of miniaturised electronics, and insisted making them all himself and practically gave them away, and I expect it will sound wonderful._

 


 No I didn't mean you as you explained your reasoning very well and respectfuly and you also agree that ignoring emails is very bad, although I still dissagree with you. It was meant for the he can do no wrong crowd.

 sorry I should have been more clear.

 Frank


----------



## BushGuy

Xin customer = maturity.

 carping, complaining, extraneous commentary, name-calling = immaturity.

 When it comes - it comes. In the meantime life goes on.......I listen via my previous Xin(s).


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin customer = maturity.

 carping, complaining, extraneous commentary, name-calling = immaturity.

 When it comes - it comes. In the meantime life goes on.......I listen via my previous Xin(s)._

 

I rest my case, here is the perfect example. No actually inmaturity is condoaning and making excuses for bad behavior.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No actually inmaturity is condoaning and making excuses for bad behavior._

 









This is a definition I haven't seen before.


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_








This is a definition I haven't seen before._

 

Don't worry your in good company on here.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Catch this!! 

 The audio gods are smiling on me.

 Just got an email from Xin saying he plans on having all orders out b4 Thankgiving. Weather that applies only to the supermicro or not, I don't know. 

 I can now concentrate on getting rid of things I don't or won't use._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Last weekend...paid via PP_

 

I'm sorry to break it to you , but you'll *never* get your order before Thanksgiving. If for some reason you do recieve it before then, buy a lottery ticket that very same day and you'll become a very rich man!


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm sorry to break it to you , but you'll *never* get your order before Thanksgiving. If for some reason you do recieve it before then, buy a lottery ticket that very same day and you'll become a very rich man!_

 



 LOL, yeah he also forgot the mention the year, Thanksgiving 2008


----------



## dimm0k

Wow you guys are something else... I've never owned a Xin product and it wasn't until September that I decided to bare the pain and order myself a SMIV amp. After the order was placed I e-mailed Xin to change the color of the case... didn't get a reply for that request until recently. Being that he responded I decided to purchase a second amp so I e-mailed Xin to add to my order. Within two days I received a reply confirming the add to my order. I'm just as anxious as anyone else and more impatient than many, yet I'm not even close to being fed up.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fc911c* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL, yeah he also forgot the mention the year, Thanksgiving 2008_

 

There's no way I expect to see my amp by Thanksgiving. My main hope is that he doesn't give up/have a breakdown/become overwhelmed by all those orders and emails. I hope he is well and enjoying what he does.


----------



## nc8000

I will for ever love the Xin products I've had and I've not yet heard a portable amp that sounded better than my Reference prototype that I was lucky enough to get early summer (but the D1 with hiflight chipset is very close) nor have I found anything better for ultimate portability than the SuperMicro. What has killed it for me is that I can get no reply from he wheter he has received the amp I send for repair and the in the end finding out that not only does he not reply to mails he actually deletes them without even reading them. He could take as long as he liked building/servicing my amps as I have other equipment but this communication thing I can no longer live with.


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow you guys are something else... I've never owned a Xin product and it wasn't until September that I decided to bare the pain and order myself a SMIV amp. After the order was placed I e-mailed Xin to change the color of the case... didn't get a reply for that request until recently. Being that he responded I decided to purchase a second amp so I e-mailed Xin to add to my order. Within two days I received a reply confirming the add to my order. I'm just as anxious as anyone else and more impatient than many, yet I'm not even close to being fed up._

 


 You're just real lucky. I've only ever had one reply from Xin.

 The repair/support stories turned me away completely. Even when he starts shipping, there's no way I'd wait 6-7 months for a repair. 

 Imagine that! You wait 6-8 months for your order, then (by the hand of God or whatever) something happens to it, you have to send it back. Are you going to be pleased if Xin takes another 6-8 months to repair it? Are you going to care about his legendary status or development schedule? Or would you just want your $249 investment back asap?

 Not trying to scare you, I'm sure this scenario is highly improbable.

_Two_ replies from Xin must be a sign 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.



 EK


----------



## fc911c

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You're just real lucky. I've only ever had one reply from Xin.

 The repair/support stories turned me away completely. Even when he starts shipping, there's no way I'd wait 6-7 months for a repair. 

 Imagine that! You wait 6-8 months for your order, then (by the hand of God or whatever) something happens to it, you have to send it back. Are you going to be pleased if Xin takes another 6-8 months to repair it? Are you going to care about his legendary status or development schedule? Or would you just want your $249 investment back asap?

 Not trying to scare you, I'm sure this scenario is highly improbable.

Two replies from Xin must be a sign 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.



 EK_

 

Well said


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You're just real lucky. I've only ever had one reply from Xin.

 The repair/support stories turned me away completely. Even when he starts shipping, there's no way I'd wait 6-7 months for a repair. 

 Imagine that! You wait 6-8 months for your order, then (by the hand of God or whatever) something happens to it, you have to send it back. Are you going to be pleased if Xin takes another 6-8 months to repair it? Are you going to care about his legendary status or development schedule? Or would you just want your $249 investment back asap?

 Not trying to scare you, I'm sure this scenario is highly improbable.

Two replies from Xin must be a sign 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.



 EK_

 

your doing better than me EK

 i have never gotten a reply! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *snivel*


----------



## jamato8

The Reference is a simple but well implemented amp of unusual design with little that I can see will ever go wrong. The sound of mine is unbelievable. What will be final production I do not know but I wish everyone could experience what I am hearing. There is no excuse for the lack of updates and I am sorry for this as I know Xin's true intentions but they are lost in the lack of communication. I don't blame anyone for being upset. For those who do stick it out, well I do beleive they will be rewarded but we all have our own limits and that is ok.


----------



## EFN

Consider me as one of Xin Amps strongest supporter. I still have an order alive for a Reference and I choose to forget about it (most of the time). After 4 emails unreplied I decided not to send any more. So be it.

 Xin amps are good, but I will no longer recommend them specially to those looking to buy their first amp


----------



## digitalcat

I will hold on to my old Supermacro IV until it bites the dust, but I'll never buy another Xin amp until he significantly changes his business practice. 6 months' wait is beyond ridiculous.


----------



## callanish

I just wanted to speculate on something. I decided to cancel my order for a supermicro IV ( I'll probably regret it ), but the money I allocated for the Xin has been spent elsewhere. Anyway, sent Xin a cancellation request and received a reply the next day apologizing and would cancel the order. 

 I started thinking about this. Wouldn't someone whose intent on getting amps out soon and interested in someone's business not just dismiss this cancellation request if they were actually capable of fulfilling the order relatively soon. I mean all I said to him on an e-mail was that the time frame for getting this amp was way too long and I had other uses for the money ( CC payment ). It's almost as if he's happy for the cancellations as he's so overwhelmed with orders and is really concerned about actually delivering them. 

 It just seemed strange to me that everyone here is fighting to get information, hardly receives any communication, yet when it comes to cancelling an order, it's almost instantaneous. Think I'm reading too much into this? Anyway, will I regret this decision...probably, but I was getting really tired of constantly checking threads for even a token amount of information regarding insight into the mind of Dr. Xin. I've pacified myself in a portable way with an Ibasso T2 ( I know, it's not even close to being a supermicro IV ) and saving up for a really nice home amp. Between my ipod, dock line, ibasso T2 and Yuin PK1's I've already put out close to $600 for something that I use on the go. I think now it's time to concentrate on creating a great music platform for home use. I'm sure Xin amps are everything everyone says they are, but getting one in your hand seems to be next to impossible.


----------



## GUNS

Well i think that because you said you have "other uses for the money" Xin wouldn't want to aggravate you by trying to swing you into sticking with your purchase. It can only be a good thing if he is communicating with customers (if not all of them) fairly well now (to his standards). I mean if you were really frustrated and angry about an order and wanted to cancel, i'm sure you'd be very relieved that you got your money back so soon (well order canceled in this case). Not that i'm trying to excuse him, i would have though that at least a few members might be receiving their amps by now. Let's hope that he is producing the amps in bulk to send out, rather than processing each one at a time or we will definatly have a fair few months ahead of us :O


----------



## tk3

Well, he wrote to someone that he expected to get all orders done before thanksgiving, let's see how that goes.
 I'm nearing the 3 month mark myself for a Reference, so still a youngin compared to some of you, but it's still a lot of time to wait.


----------



## aluren

that's actually what i've been thinking as well... instantaneous response for cancellation means that he is still checking his emails on a daily basis. it makes u think that he still cares about customer service but yet it is really non-existent. it really doesn't make sense to me either...


----------



## fkclo

Don't want to jump to any conclusion. This may also be the result of spam filter in action.

 It is not surprising some email spam filter applies more stringent filters and kill some "non-spam" mails.

 F. Lo


----------



## BushGuy

First of all I think it's foolish to impute any particular motivation to a matter-of-fact attitude in the acceptance of an order cancellation. Personally, if I cancelled an order with any company - I prefer that sort of approach rather an arguement why an order should not be cancelled.

 When someone reported a written response that Dr. Xin intends that all orders will be fulfilled by this Thanksgiving........despite all the subsequent wiseass comments.....MY first thought was - I'll' bet he's found a way for the lions' share of the amp construction be done elsewhere, with protection in place for his secrets contained in his design........or......shipments of a couple of specific components hadn't arrived as expected, but he continued to construct amps while awaiting items necessary for their completion, and has finally received those key components.
 ..........until the advancement of this thread - I have always been the fatalist (or pessimist). Many of you have been soo "disheartening" and vociferous that you make me appear to be the optimist of the year. That make some of you folks eligible for the Dubious Achievement Award, aka the Nobel Peace Prize.


----------



## gp_hebert

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 When someone reported a written response that Dr. Xin intends that all orders will be fulfilled by this Thanksgiving........despite all the subsequent wiseass comments.....MY first thought was - I'll' bet he's found a way for the lions' share of the amp construction be done elsewhere, with protection in place for his secrets contained in his design........or......shipments of a couple of specific components hadn't arrived as expected, but he continued to construct amps while awaiting items necessary for their completion, and has finally received those key components._

 

That's what I thought too. The guy didn't give any specific dates for the past few months and now he talks about Thanksgiving, so he must have found something that we don't know yet.

 Also, I'm curious - did Xin ever told a specific date (not just "soon") to someone and not deliver for that date?


----------



## callanish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_First of all I think it's foolish to impute any particular motivation to a matter-of-fact attitude in the acceptance of an order cancellation. Personally, if I cancelled an order with any company - I prefer that sort of approach rather an arguement why an order should not be cancelled.
 ._

 

....which is why I used the word speculate that I think and anyone else who wants to spitball on a 95 page thread about an amp that hardly any of us have ever received are entitled to do!


----------



## som4ew

I don't think that we will get our amps by this Thanksgiving.
 If my memory's served me well after every finalized tweak of each stage ie
 5/30/07,04/11/6/07 Tweaks. Xin was going to his web page discussed about the tweak.I don't see it happen this time.


----------



## BushGuy

uh oh ........Senility? Those dates were noted as landmarks in problem-solving breakthroughs for amps other than the Reference. I don't recall any of them being termed as "Final" by the good Doctor.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't think that we will get our amps by this Thanksgiving.
 If my memory's served me well after every finalized tweak of each stage ie
 5/30/07,04/11/6/07 Tweaks. Xin was going to his web page discussed about the tweak.I don't see it happen this time._

 

Well, call me an optimist, but I'm rooting for Xin that he actually pulls it off.
 This is a post on his boards:

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HiFlight* 
_The last correspondence that I had with Dr Xin was last week. He stated that he was hoping to have all backed up orders and upgrades out by Thanksgiving. He was, at that time, trying to catch up on stacks of emails.

 He said he was planning to work day and night to get the amps out. Perhaps this is some consolation to those waiting in line._


----------



## dle4e_2005

Dr.Xin is still alive!
 I sent him an email to change my order and he replied in less than 24hours.


 I'm in the 5.5 months club already.


----------



## ChickenGod

HECK YES!!!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			











 "A package was shipped to you on 10/31/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Priority Mail, Flat Rate Env"

 That's from Xin.

 WOOOT ITS COMING!!


----------



## aluren

dreams come true?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ChickenGod* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_HECK YES!!!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 "A package was shipped to you on 10/31/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Priority Mail, Flat Rate Env"

 That's from Xin.

 WOOOT ITS COMING!!_

 

Good for you, I hope it meets your expectations.


----------



## ChickenGod

I haven't ordered a cable yet :O

 I hope it doesn't come before the cable then it'd just be sitting there... Staring at me...

 "Listen to meeeee.... listen to meee...."


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ChickenGod* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't ordered a cable yet :O

 I hope it doesn't come before the cable then it'd just be sitting there... Staring at me...

 "Listen to meeeee.... listen to meee...."_

 

Oh! Great news. So they are coming!! Can you also (re)post your date of order? I'm in the just 8 months old club today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Congratulations to you


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh! Great news. So they are coming!! Can you also (re)post your date of order? I'm in the just 8 months old club today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Congratulations to you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

He bought it in May which means...he has waited less than you? That's odd...


----------



## flargosa

This is very good use for all of us who have ordered amps from Dr. Xin. Hopefully, we get emails from Dr. Xin soon. 


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ChickenGod* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_HECK YES!!!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 "A package was shipped to you on 10/31/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Priority Mail, Flat Rate Env"

 That's from Xin.

 WOOOT ITS COMING!!_


----------



## srikeerthi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *souperman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He bought it in May which means...he has waited less than you? That's odd..._

 

Huh! It is odd. 

 Time to shoot another mail to Xin! Hope he reads it atleast now :-/


----------



## shiezan

I ordered mine in March


----------



## som4ew

I think the good doctor only ship out MicroIV not the Reference yet.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered mine in March 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Same here


----------



## saisunil

Long live Dr. Xin - I am waiting on LE and Ref.

 Cheers
 Sunil


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ChickenGod* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't ordered a cable yet :O

 I hope it doesn't come before the cable then it'd just be sitting there... Staring at me...

 "Listen to meeeee.... listen to meee...."_

 

Good on you!!

 But....didnt you cancel your order?

 And havent quite a few of us been waiting for supermicro for longer than you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Maybe its because you were cancelling your order it got rushed out.

 On the other hand.....he may have shipped you a package....but who knows whats inside 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, hehe it could be a refund cheque. (j/k)


----------



## GUNS

Go Xin Go!


----------



## rxc

Oh Lord, I feel the order floodgates about to open.


----------



## ChickenGod

Aw man, I feel bad for the people who ordered it before me. It seems like its not fair 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Which amps did you guys order?

 Yes this is sorta good news because it probably means he's going to ship out a bunch now


----------



## ChickenGod

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good on you!!

 But....didnt you cancel your order?

 And havent quite a few of us been waiting for supermicro for longer than you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Maybe its because you were cancelling your order it got rushed out.

 On the other hand.....he may have shipped you a package....but who knows whats inside 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, hehe it could be a refund cheque. (j/k)_

 

Well I did try to cancel but he never replied to my e-mails. Then like two weeks after I asked to cancel he said please confirm your shipping address so I can ship your amplifer immediately. :] I am soo impatient hehehe.


----------



## kokohore

Congrats, am looking forward to hear your impressions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ...and yes, I've been waiting almost 8 months for SMiniIV (ordered 04/Mar/2007)


----------



## zeckwsr

mine ordered on 1st of march!!
 how unfair!!


----------



## bunsco

Hi guys

 anyone know how to change an order?

 ordered a reference but now want to change it to supermicro IV.


----------



## chukwe

thanks Dr Xin


----------



## srikeerthi

I ordered a Supermicro IV on 1st march. Seems unfair.. But hey, do I have an option but to wait longer


----------



## dimm0k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys

 anyone know how to change an order?

 ordered a reference but now want to change it to supermicro IV._

 

For me I added I've changed the casing color on the SMIV and added a second amp to my already placed order by replying to the confirmation e-mail I received when I placed the first order. Two separate e-mails at two different times... short and to the point within one line and both times I received a reply confirming the change.


----------



## greydragon

Although I'm waiting for a Ref that I ordered in early Sept., I'm patient. But sadistically, I like coming back to this thread to read others' wailing and moaning about the wait times, about Xin himself, and how unfair life is in general.

 Just a select community of self-imposed suffers we are
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I guess misery does love company.


----------



## DDW

I just realized I haven't ordered a cable yet either.

 I have an 80 gig Ipod Video and Shure E500's - waiting for the XIN Reference.

 This may not be the best place to ask, (I guess I should go to the cable forum ???? - I can move this post if I need to), but considering I am trying to compliment the Xin Reference, what is a good cable to buy? ..... without spending more than the amp or the Ipod....

 I spent tons of hours researching earphones and amps, but I haven't spent any time researching cable options - .... don't really want to spend too much time on it at this point... (????).

 I am not interested in "Bling" just great sound and good price. (best bang for the buck.)

 .


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys

 anyone know how to change an order?

 ordered a reference but now want to change it to supermicro IV._

 

Read the thread. It has been stated many times here and on Xin's thread on his site.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *greydragon* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Although I'm waiting for a Ref that I ordered in early Sept., I'm patient. But sadistically, I like coming back to this thread to read others' wailing and moaning about the wait times, about Xin himself, and how unfair life is in general.

 Just a select community of self-imposed suffers we are
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I guess misery does love company._

 

I keep coming to this thread because I'm hoping for an avalanche - that suddenly there will be multiple reports of References being shipped. I'm a new boy on the block, I ordered in September.


----------



## itobito

today, after 6,5 month waiting I arrived (in Germany) supermicro IV.

 I had already forgotten my old order, that was surprising


----------



## souperman

Ooh! 2 SMIV's out! Looks like Xin is on a roll.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just realized I haven't ordered a cable yet either.

 I have an 80 gig Ipod Video and Shure E500's - waiting for the XIN Reference.

 This may not be the best place to ask, (I guess I should go to the cable forum ???? - I can move this post if I need to), but considering I am trying to compliment the Xin Reference, what is a good cable to buy? ..... without spending more than the amp or the Ipod....

 I spent tons of hours researching earphones and amps, but I haven't spent any time researching cable options - .... don't really want to spend too much time on it at this point... (????).

 I am not interested in "Bling" just great sound and good price. (best bang for the buck.)

 ._

 


 Check ALO for cables.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *souperman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ooh! 2 SMIV's out! Looks like Xin is on a roll._

 

TWO already! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Looks like for a long time he had controlled himself, but finally he burst out 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Let's hope he doesn't overwork himself


----------



## DDW

I sent Xin an email on Oct. 2nd asking about then SMIV and how long the wait would be compared to waiting for the Reference.

 I didn't know how long the wait for the Reference would be (still don't) and I didn't know if he might possibly have the SMIV in stock. I was "considering" ordering a SMIV to hold me over till the Reference arrived if he could ship the SMIV at the time.

 He actually did reply to my email on Oct. 8th (only 6 days!!! - ???) and stated the following:

 "The waiting time for all amps are the same. Thank you, Xin"

 But, I don't know if that info really provides any definitive info.

 It told me that there was no point in ordering the SMIV to hold me over. So, I didn't. At least he was honest about this and didn't just try to get extra money from me.

 But, he really didn't commit to any availability time-frames either.

 Assumptions could be made, but there are plenty of variables that could affect reality. Such as number of orders of SMIV's vs. Reference amps. etc.

 I am not sure, but I don't know if we really know much more than a couple of amps have been shipped.

 Reference amps by Thanksgiving could still happen, but I am still not holding my breath yet.

 We'll see.

 .


----------



## ChickenGod

He said he would ship mine but it hasn't been shipped yet. I got a tracking number though


----------



## Zimm

I placed an order for a Reference and Supermicro on 30Sept07.

 I'm very happy with my Supermacro, but I'd like to compare it to the Reference, then sell the lesser of the two (lesser being to my ears), and I want a Supermicro for portability.


----------



## Sanddancer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itobito* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_today, after 6,5 month waiting I arrived (in Germany) supermicro IV.

 I had already forgotten my old order, that was surprising 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

No fair, I just passed the 8 month mark and not a dickie bird


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No fair, I just passed the 8 month mark and not a dickie bird 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Eight months! LOL. Nearly enough time to make a baby.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Eight months! LOL. Nearly enough time to make a baby._

 


 Takes SECONDS--or minutes--to make the baby--nine months to HAVE the baby


----------



## ChickenGod

:O

 The amp is in Santa Clarita, CA.

 I live not too far from there. Around 45 minutes?

 Should be here today, tomorrow, or Monday :]


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Takes SECONDS--or minutes--to make the baby--nine months to HAVE the baby
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 ...and 18-20 years to ask why you did it, or in some cases, be really glad you did. In the case of the Reference let's see if people enjoy the latter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's all about the thrill of the chase. That's one of the things that make this hobby what it is. 

 I got to use it for about 20 minutes at the Florida meet and honestly speaking, a Hornet or a AE-2 would make most people equally happy, sans the wait. 

 We'll see.

 To those who get one...enjoy your new toy. There's no doubt that anyone will have any problems unleashing on in the "For Sale" forum, so there's no concern of lost revenue, just the time waited.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...and 18-20 years to ask why you did it, or in some cases, be really glad you did. In the case of the Reference let's see if people enjoy the latter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's all about the thrill of the chase. That's one of the things that make this hobby what it is. 

 I got to use it for about 20 minutes at the Florida meet and honestly speaking, a Hornet or a AE-2 would make most people equally happy, sans the wait. 

 We'll see.

 To those who get one...enjoy your new toy. There's no doubt that anyone will have any problems unleashing on in the "For Sale" forum, so there's no concern of lost revenue, just the time waited._

 

Yeah, that's my concern--after all this time, this Xin piece will sound just as good as--if not less than--my Ray Samuels amps or my Portaphile. I love the Samuels sound signature now I'm wondering if all the wait and hype over the reference is really worth it. And I've owned Xin amps before so I know how they sound in a couple opamp configurations


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...and 18-20 years to ask why you did it, or in some cases, be really glad you did. In the case of the Reference let's see if people enjoy the latter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's all about the thrill of the chase. That's one of the things that make this hobby what it is. 

 I got to use it for about 20 minutes at the Florida meet and honestly speaking, a Hornet or a AE-2 would make most people equally happy, sans the wait. 

 We'll see.

 To those who get one...enjoy your new toy. There's no doubt that anyone will have any problems unleashing on in the "For Sale" forum, so there's no concern of lost revenue, just the time waited._

 

To me what makes the Supermicro IV w/ the 4/11 mods an incredible amp is its sweet presentation. I mean it sounds like a tube amp, and it has an incredibly wide soundstage. Now, following mods from late May a single alkaline battery provides over 30 hours of play time.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_To me what makes the Supermicro IV w/ the 4/11 mods an incredible amp is its sweet presentation. I mean it sounds like a tube amp, and it has an incredibly wide soundstage. Now, following mods from late May a single alkaline battery provides over 30 hours of play time._

 

I feel the same way about my Portaphile V2^2 (great soundstage, warm presentation, yet aggressive on aggressive music) but the battery life is unforgiving. It has been delegated as my bedside rig using AC, even though my Meridian and Raptor are only 5 feet away. It's easier waking up at 3 a.m. with UE-10's in my ear instead of a full size can


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I feel the same way about my Portaphile V2^2 (great soundstage, warm presentation, yet aggressive on aggressive music) but the battery life is unforgiving. It has been delegated as my bedside rig using AC, even though my Meridian and Raptor are only 5 feet away. It's easier waking up at 3 a.m. with UE-10's in my ear instead of a full size can 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I also find the Maxxed Portaphile V2^2 w/ Black Gates and LT1210 to be a superb amp! However as you stated the battery life sucks! A pity because it would be a major contender.


----------



## immtbiker

Yeah, mine's maxxed too. The only thing I have turned off is the "wide bandwidth mode" and Cesar says it doubles the battery life with negligible effects on the sound. It says on his website that it makes a bigger difference than using Class A but Cesar says that's a mistake and he has to update his website.


----------



## ChickenGod

Well my amp arrived.

 5-13-07 to 11-02-07

 Almost 6 months.


----------



## fkclo

Sounds like Xin is now making deliveries like a pizza boy. I also get an email about readiness of my Reference.

 F. Lo


----------



## boomana

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...and 18-20 years to ask why you did it, or in some cases, be really glad you did. In the case of the Reference let's see if people enjoy the latter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It's all about the thrill of the chase. That's one of the things that make this hobby what it is. 

 I got to use it for about 20 minutes at the Florida meet and honestly speaking, a Hornet or a AE-2 would make most people equally happy, sans the wait. 

 We'll see.

 To those who get one...enjoy your new toy. There's no doubt that anyone will have any problems unleashing on in the "For Sale" forum, so there's no concern of lost revenue, just the time waited._

 

I was fortunate enough to get the hear the Reference, the micro, the mini, and another xin (older model, don't remember which) at the Florida meet. While I agree that both the Reference and the micro are fine amps, I was disappointed considering their near mythical status around here. I preferred four portables (PRII, SR-71, AE2, Diablo) to the top Xins, and as immtbiker said, would take a Hornet or AE2 over them, weighing in availability and customer service along with sq.

 It seemed the mini and the older model had more to do with packing mucho power into a little box than sq. Both the Reference and Micro offered more, but had a lack of clarity and separation in the bass and lower mids along with a lack of distinction between tones in comparison to the amps mentioned above. All portables heard (there were about twelve in total) were hooked up to a Lector .06T CDP, and a K2HD CD (amazing for testing gear) was used with a variety of headphones. With other sources, the differences were not as clear, but easily distinguishable when the source improved. Even one newbie heard the same, without knowing the choices others had made. Xin wins on the portability, though, as his amps were smaller than all that were preferred in sq.

 This is not to say that anyone waiting will not like their amps. They're very good, but for those thinking about it, I'd go, as Aaron said, with a Hornet or AE2 for an amp, a mini^3 if on a budget, or a Pico or Predator if the budget is bigger.


----------



## slwiser

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *boomana* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was fortunate enough to get the hear the Reference, the micro, the mini, and another xin (older model, don't remember which) at the Florida meet. While I agree that both the Reference and the micro are fine amps, I was disappointed considered their near mythical status around here. I preferred four portables (PRII, SR-71, AE2, Diablo) to the top Xins, and as immtbiker said, would take a Hornet or AE2 over them, weighing in availability and customer service along with sq.

 It seemed the mini and the older model had more to do with packing mucho power into a little box than sq. Both the Reference and Micro offered more, but had a lack of clarity and separation in the bass and lower mids along with a lack of distinction between tones in comparison to the amps mentioned above. All portables heard (there were about twelve in total) were hooked up to a Lector .06T CDP, and a K2HD CD (amazing for testing gear) was used with a variety of headphones. With other sources, the differences were not as clear, but easily distinguishable when the source improved. Even one newbie heard the same, without knowing the choices others had made. Xin wins on the portability, though, as his amps were smaller than all that were preferred in sq.

 This is not to say that anyone waiting will not like their amps. They're very good, but for those thinking about it, I'd go, as Aaron said, with a Hornet or AE2 for an amp, a mini^3 if on a budget, or a Pico or Predator if the budget is bigger._

 

Thanks for your impressions...just goes to show that everyone does not enjoy the same sounds or have the same expectations. For myself with Xin's problems I would have to suggest either the newer Pico or Predator, otherwise it would be the Reference that I have sound wise.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *slwiser* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for your impressions...just goes to show that everyone does not enjoy the same sounds or have the same expectations. For myself with Xin's problems I would have to suggest either the newer Pico or Predator, otherwise it would be the Reference that I have sound wise._

 

Very well said. Individual preference and perceptions played a big part.

 I once compared a Hornet with a SuperMarco III v6 and a SuperMini III - all I owned personally, after a lengthly listening. Both the IIIs sounds better than the Hornet. I sold the Hornet. I have a good listen to a SuperMacro IV (pre 4/11 update) which I subsequently purchased and considered the IV is 1/2 a notch better than the III. 

 So to me the SM-IV is definitely better than the Hornet, and I do believe the Reference can be another notch up than the IV sonically. 

 When I am back traveling, I should have my SuperMacro with the latest update and the Reference side-by-side, and hopefully after 400 hours I should be able to report back what I hear.

 F. Lo


----------



## boomana

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fkclo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So to me the SM-IV is definitely better than the Hornet, and I do believe the Reference can be another notch up than the IV sonically. 

 F. Lo_

 


 Didn't have a Hornet on hand for the meet comparison. I did compare the Xins to the Tomahawk and preferred both the Reference and the Micro over it.


----------



## tnmike1

well, I dunno. The Portaphile, Hornet, Tomahawk have a "sharper" or more "edge" to their sound than the Xin amps--and I've had the SM II V6, SMLE IV and Macro. Maybe the "tube" sound everyone loves with the XIn product just isn't for me??? Dunno. I've got one more step to take in this and that's to hear my upgraded SM LE IV with 8616/8656 opamps. Should be getting that back from XInland any month now


----------



## icantusefizz

I think its time for me to move on. I know i've waited almost 8 months, and i know the amps are "coming soon" but i have other things to spend money on now and no longer feel the need to torture myself. 

 Best wishes to the rest of you.

 -Fizz


----------



## DDW

I can appreciate any and all frustrations here. 

 Sorry you hit the wall Fizz.

 To me the actual cost of the amp itself is becoming secondary to the "Cost"/value of the wait and frustration associated with lack of communication and apparent lack of interest to communicate. And there are plenty of others who have been waiting longer than myself. Part of my frustration isn't just my own wait so much as seeing what has been put up with in general.

 At some point, this amp has a felt cost more than double the monetary cost!

 So, I am sorry to see some people stating they don't feel the Reference to be among the very best of the under $500.00 portable amps.

 I am trying to keep in mind that sound preferences are subjective.

 I have fairly committed myself and I am still trying to remain hopeful that:

 1) The amp will sound so good it will have justified the wait.

 &

 2) The amp will arrive before Christmas. I don't have my hopes set to high about this Thanksgiving thing. But, can't help to somewhat hope for it by then anyway.


 That said, I would rather wait a couple more weeks and have my amp come to me as good as possible without any shortcuts or compromises being made than get it sooner with compromises.

 I don't want to have to deal with or even consider having to send the amp back once I get it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 If something were to go wrong with this amp after these types of waits for initial shipment, having to send it back for repairs or upgrades sounds multiple times more frustrating. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 .


----------



## DennyL

I have a completely different outlook on this. I already had three portable amps, and I placed an order for the Reference in September using my credit card. One day, maybe, my credit card will be debited $249 and I shall receive through the post a Reference, and I shall have four portable amps. Meanwhile I am living a full and contented life, listening to music when I want to and have the time. I believe that Xin is a craftsman, a perfectionist and even an eccentric, but not a crook, I am not impatient or anxious.


----------



## DDW

I have every reason to believe from MANY posts that XIN is NOT a crook. 
 I am sure I will get an amp eventually.

 I just hope the amp lives up to the hype and expectations after this type of wait. And I hope the wait isn't too much longer.

 Because: I don't have any other portable amps to hold me over.
 I put a lot of time and effort into researching, then ultimately choosing the Xin Reference based on many good reviews.

 Until I get my first portable amp, my music life is not yet full and content.

 So, while I try to be somewhat patient - to allow for perfectionism, craftsmanship, quality and eccentricities, it is hard for me (and others I am sure) to truly be patient and not be anxious.

 .


----------



## achristilaw

This second waiting period. Is Five months and counting. My Mini took only four month's. I liked the mini sq. Turned right around. To hurry up and wait.
 For a Macro IV. Xin's business practice might have a flaw. But his products have a sound that I find attractive. A warmth. And a space within that warmth. that invites extended listening. Besides, I'm older. And it's easy to forget your waiting.


----------



## aluren

DDW, why don't u purchase another amp to hold u through? if your budget permits, you can get a used hornet or tomahawk for around $250-300 on the FS forums here. if not, then you can probably get a PA2v2 or ibasso for under $100. that should hold u off and ease your miseries. then when the xin amp does come in, you can actually appreciate what different amps can do to your music.


----------



## DDW

aluren,

 I have considered that, but I kept just thinking I would wait.

 I was hoping to avoid a situation where I would have to do hours and hours of comparison and then have to choose. 
 I am a little afraid of myself and for my wallet.
 If not careful, I could see myself spending thousands on all kinds of amps and more equipment. 

 Thanks to this forum, I already have about 25 pages of notes on a word document and a couple of files filled with pics of equipment to lust over.

 I hope with any luck to just hit the nail on the head and be floored by the Reference, be satisfied and be done with my portable rig.

 I have a lot of other fincial interests and obligations as well and I am tring to keep things in check.

 I still want a good headphone amp as well.
 But, I want to use my computer and not sure about the whole DAC thing yet.

 I still have a lot to learn. Trying to pace myself.

 .


----------



## aluren

yeah try to pace yourself. but for most of us, things always go downhill in terms of our wallets the more we get involved in head-fi!


----------



## jamato8

I have no idea what Reference was at the meet but I hope that Xin releases one like I have. To be honest I have used two Black Gate bypass caps but if the design was not excellent, the sound would not have improved. The sound is open, dynamic, natural and transparent. I hope he goes with this model because to be honest, I would enjoy knowing people were hearing this quality of sound.


----------



## fkclo

Just got an email from Xin telling me my amps are shipped on 5th Nov 2007 by EMS. A tracking number was provided as well.

 This includes an SuperMacro IV (latest update plus new PSU) AND the Reference. The whole thing started in April this year so I am not too bad compared to those who waited even longer.

 For what is worth, I paid using paypal upfront. Not sure if this makes any difference in Xin's queue.

 Unfortunately as I am traveling I won't be able to see the amps in person until a week later. Too Bad.

 F. Lo


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fkclo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just got an email from Xin telling me my amps are shipped on 5th Nov 2007 by EMS. A tracking number was provided as well.

 This includes an SuperMacro IV (latest update plus new PSU) AND the Reference. The whole thing started in April this year so I am not too bad compared to those who waited even longer.

 For what is worth, I paid using paypal upfront. Not sure if this makes any difference in Xin's queue.

 Unfortunately as I am traveling I won't be able to see the amps in person until a week later. Too Bad.

 F. Lo_

 

nice. at least we know he is slowly but surely shipping them out!


----------



## ThomStarBoy

So I've had my order in since June and now, from the perspective of Christmas coming up, I could probably use that $200 I was ready to spend. Is cancelling my order as easy as sending an e-mail (I paid credit card, not paypal)?


----------



## ChickenGod

Oh right. I bought mine with Paypal too. Maybe it is just easier to manage?


----------



## kaushama

Its good that he slowly ships some amps. But his silence worries me a lot. If he had done with the final layout of the reference and other aMPs he would have surely announced that in his forum.
 I think he is just shipping few amps to thin out the unrest. Buying time for more work? Or is he alright health wise or personally?


----------



## jpnz

Xin doesn't seem to have a queue, i'm affraid he just ships out orders randomly. i'm almost 8 months waiting, and paid upfront (Paypal)


----------



## itsborken

Pulled my order and requested the paypal refund. I'm outta here due to the lack of communication. The idea of waiting months should the amp break or having a 2nd amp handy to cover Xin's irregular service is ridiculous to ask of a customer (even though I have several).

 No matter how 'good' the Reference may be before or after modifications the other high end amps are right up there too and don't have these insane drawbacks. It's not worth the bother or irritation.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Pulled my order and requested the paypal refund. I'm outta here on due to the lack of communication. The idea of waiting months should the amp break or having a 2nd amp handy to cover Xin's irregular service is ridiculous to ask of a customer (even though I have several).

 No matter how 'good' the Reference may be before or after modifications the other high end amps are right up there too and don't have these insane drawbacks. It's not worth the bother or irritation._

 

When you cancel your order you have a good chance that Xin will send you the amp by return.


----------



## DennyL

I'm a new boy on the Xin block, but I was wondering whether the situation has got worse. He has a range of five products on offer and also people are sending amps back for repair or upgrade. Just in September he invited orders for the Reference by discounting it yet, looking at this thread, hardly anyone has been receiving anything for months. If he's waiting for parts, surely that wouldn't effect all of his models? Is he totally bogged down perfecting the reference? Have I got the wrong impression? I know about his development modes and production modes, but how long can he have a Web site up receiving orders, and hardly deliver anything? Maybe there are a lot of Xin customers who don't post an Head-Fi when they get a communication or receive their order, I don't know....


----------



## nickknutson

I don't remember if I cancelled my order or not...hmmm, perhaps I'll be pleasantly surprised in a month or two. I think I ordered it at the beginning of June. Oh well, we'll see!


----------



## Wotan1

I loooove.. the waiting..trust that this is not going to be a Diablo disaster.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't remember if I cancelled my order or not...hmmm, perhaps I'll be pleasantly surprised in a month or two. I think I ordered it at the beginning of June. Oh well, we'll see!_

 

Hehe, shopping with Xin; always an adventure!


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I loooove.. the waiting..trust that this is not going to be a Diablo disaster._

 

What, was this a project?


----------



## LarryVale

I just cancelled mine as I paid with paypal and tired of my money in someones elses pocket and they don't bother answering emails. I can somehow exist without a xin amp. 
 I did pass on, once the amps are available I may order one. 
 It's simple good manners to pay attention to a customer that has paid you money. 

 I sent one email friday and another monday asking for a ship date. No response. I don't need the aggrevation.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I loooove.. the waiting..trust that this is not going to be a Diablo disaster._

 



 You got me curious....

 I just went and skimmed a few pages of the LaRocco Diablo thread. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 I sure hope that doesn't happen here with the Xin Reference.


 I didn't take the time to read the whole thread, but it sounds like a mess, poor communication, long waits and then a bunch of defective $500 amps and no or poor replies from maker and/or distributor (????).

 I don't have the time or patience for that. It is bad enough to wait months for a product, but to then receive a product that goes bad after a few hours or so and not be able to contact the maker or distributor.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








 Again, I sure hope that doesn't happen here. 

 After all of this, I am expecting to be VERY pleased with my amp!

 .


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...
 After all of this, I am expecting to be VERY pleased with my amp!
 ._

 

Well I hang on to those who are lucky enough to own a Reference and claim 'that it is worthwhile the wait'.
 The wait for me is over 8 months now.


----------



## willisv

I ordered a SM IV March 26, switched to a reference 2 months ago. Still waiting.


----------



## tnmike1

I find this thread turning increasingly interesting. Over on Xin's site, more and more people are getting fed up with this wait-period. Now here the same thing. and really all that's needed is ONE SHORT POST by Xin stating the circumstances and I'm sure many people who are now really POed would calm down. Really don't think taking three minutes out of life to post an update is too much to ask


----------



## fl00r

You are so right, and this has been discussed over and over again in this thread. Why Xin refuses to communicate with his customers, nobody knows. Fact is that he remains incommunicado no matter what.
 It's up to you whether you can live with this or not. I really understand people who are canceling their orders because of the way Xin treats them.
 Sure, I am anguish to receive my amp but stopped moaning and hoping. Every day I check this thread and Xin's forum for any news. Every now and then I shoot him an email asking for the status of my order. But after all these months I am no wiser then when I placed my order back in March, except for the fact that I am sure that this will be my first ánd last time I do business with the Dr. once bitten, twice shy.
 When I receive my Reference I will delete Xin's name from my address book and block his website on my firewall


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When I receive my Reference I will delete Xin's name from my address book and block his website on my firewall 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Ah yes, I love this one most


----------



## LarryVale

I wouldn't be annoyed except that I paid via paypal and he has my money. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Having been in small business since '78 I started laying out all the potential scenarios here including the Drs possible bad heath. I have no idea how old he is is but it's apparent he's gotten a lot of his knowledge over time so he's not an 18yo kid. That's the possible good excuse. 

 It's the inherent potential for abuse thats very apparent to me when someone prepays and has a limited time to act on any recovery options. There's not a whole lot of incentive for a vendor of any sort to perform. As potential customers we can't even look at an ebay feedback. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I own a video store and have for close to 30 years now. Once we have extended a lot of credit to a customer and a customer gets a high balance, their credit card usually doesn't work and we have a hard time getting our money. When my store extends a lot of credit, the customer often seems to act like he's too upside down in his car loan and the account often "goes south". The customer may eventually pay up but since we don't charge interest we are still out money plus aggrevation plus the loss of the customer. Prepaid customers, as a group, are like my store. 

 I should have given the site a credit card. I would have had no worries that way. I have to say, this is my fault. 

 I should slap myself for paying via paypal. By reading this thread beforehand I suppose I thought I might have an edge over charge card people when it came to communication and delivery. When a customer of mine has prepaid I take care of them first. 

 I sent a notice to him 10 hours ago requesting cancellation of my order as I mentioned earlier. I will also initiate a refund via paypal as well this morning.

 If and when one is available and I'm interested I might buy one.

 *slaps himself*


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LarryVale* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I wouldn't be annoyed except that I paid via paypal and he has my money. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Having been in small business since '78 I started laying out all the potential scenarios here including the Drs possible bad heath. I have no idea how old he is is but it's apparent he's gotten a lot of his knowledge over time so he's not an 18yo kid. That's the possible good excuse. 

 It's the inherent potential for abuse thats very apparent to me when someone prepays and has a limited time to act on any recovery options. There's not a whole lot of incentive for a vendor of any sort to perform. As potential customers we can't even look at an ebay feedback. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I own a video store and have for close to 30 years now. Once we have extended a lot of credit to a customer and a customer gets a high balance, their credit card usually doesn't work and we have a hard time getting our money. When my store extends a lot of credit, the customer often seems to act like he's too upside down in his car loan and the account often "goes south". The customer may eventually pay up but since we don't charge interest we are still out money plus aggrevation plus the loss of the customer. Prepaid customers, as a group, are like my store. 

 I should have given the site a credit card. I would have had no worries that way. I have to say, this is my fault. 

 I should slap myself for paying via paypal. By reading this thread beforehand I suppose I thought I might have an edge over charge card people when it came to communication and delivery. When a customer of mine has prepaid I take care of them first. 

 I sent a notice to him 10 hours ago requesting cancellation of my order as I mentioned earlier. I will also initiate a refund via paypal as well this morning.

 If and when one is available and I'm interested I might buy one.

 *slaps himself*_

 

all fair and understandable comments/scenarios.

 i just hope you didnt order this over 45 days, which seems to be the stupid paypal cut off point for invoking a paypal claim. that in itself seems bad practise. but thats a different story.

 hope it all works out for you!

 p.s. whilst i dont know xins age, from a photo i would hazard a guess at him being mid to late forties.


----------



## LarryVale

Quaddy:

 Nope not that long ago. I just had to have the item or know that its been shipped or at least get a ship date as I'm leaving for 5 months right before turkey day. My patience ran out. I can't treat an ebay buyer that way if he buys a $20 item from me for gods sake.

 Thanks!


----------



## tnmike1

I'm in this too,gang, with a SM LE IV at his place for upgrades and order in for Reference. Only meant to say that all these pages upon pages both here and on his site could be totally eliminated by one simple update-type message.

 Really don't think that's too much to ask


----------



## fl00r

Here's the man we all dreaming of.

 Photo shot by jamato8 (Man, what a photographer he is!!! Don't forget to check his other galleries)


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Here's the man we all dreaming of.

 Photo shot by jamato8 (Man, what a photographer he is!!! Don't forget to check his other galleries)_

 

hehe, that the photo i searched for and was 'referencing', i am not too hot at guessing ages.

 i am relative newcomer at 3months wait for reference. i recently changed CC details. hope it gets through, i think it will do.

 i will be letting this order stay till receipt of the ref amp as i simply want to hear it. simple as that. time and annoyance wont stifle that chance for me at least


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When I receive my Reference I will delete Xin's name from my address book and block his website on my firewall 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 


 What if you have a customer service issue..... ????? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	












 Personally, as I mentioned before, I hope like heck the amp works VERY well and without any flaws for quite a few years.

 If it breaks or fails to perform as it should (quality of sound being somewhat subjective), I am going to be pretty upset. ..... But, I also DO hope it sounds incredible!

 From what I have seen, Xin will likely take care of any issues "Eventually". But, I would still have to consider poor communication, unknown length of wait and extremely long wait times as poor customer service. 
 I don't look forward to any future waits and non-communication issues again.

 However, if it breaks or fails, I don't have a choice other than to try to contact and send it back to Xin. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Who else would/could fix it?

 .


----------



## immtbiker

His twin brother niX.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_His twin brother niX. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

LOL!


----------



## druelle

Well after 7 months of waiting, I finally canceled my order for the Reference. It wasn't so much the fact that I was outraged by Xin's lack of communication or business practices, but more the fact that during the wait I had so much time to research other amps.

 I've decided that I won't be using an amp for portable use, so I settled for a Meier Arietta (a few bucks cheaper too, which is nice) because of its favourable reviews and crossfeed feature, along with the fact that it'll be in my greedy palms within two weeks.

 I hope I will get the opportunity to order a Reference some time in the future when things are more stable, and I hope everyone gets theirs soon. Best of luck to Xin!


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_His twin brother niX. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

hahah, really really funny


----------



## LarryVale

I got my PP refund yesterday.


----------



## itsborken

Yeah, I wish I could get him to acknowledge my request for refund, let alone send the actual refund.


----------



## omendelovitz

Good news for those of you waiting for your Xin products. After 2 months of waiting and thinking, I canceled my orders for a reference and micro. My move is good enough for what I need... and at least Meier can be contacted for quick resolution of problems.

 Thus ends my Xin saga (and I've enjoyed it!)


----------



## aluren

yeah, it's a _xin_ to have to wait this long...


----------



## ljs

I'm still waiting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I have done what most of you did: I bought a Tomahawk which should be there next week.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good news for those of you waiting for your Xin products. After 2 months of waiting and thinking, I canceled my orders for a reference and micro. My move is good enough for what I need... and at least Meier can be contacted for quick resolution of problems.

 Thus ends my Xin saga (and I've enjoyed it!)_

 

Hmm...I'm not sure how this can be construed as good news for prospective Xin owners.
 Corda Move owners maybe...

 The wait continues...


----------



## Pangaea

^ one less dude in the way.


----------



## rxc

^That's how I see it.


----------



## shiezan

How does a corda move compare to a reference?
 I'm thinking about a refund and switching orders.


----------



## saisunil

I realized that if I want to get or keep Xin amps then I must have other amp(s) so that I can go on with this audio hobby. I consider buying a Xin amp as investing for a long haul. Since then (that was about 6 months ago) I got Mapletree tube home amp and Headsix. So I'll be pleasantly surprised when the Xin amps show up. In the mean time I am enjoying the music. I am used to very long waits, 3 to 9 months, for mods or custom made stuff.

 Doing business with Xin is just different.

 I have dealt with folks who provide quick turn around but the product is not satisfying - not reference level. Of course this is just my experience - because I have turned over my gear so many times over.

 Days on earth are 24 hours and they get longer and longer as you move to other plants in our solar system away from the sun. It takes longer for Jupiter, Saturn, Pluto etc. to go around the sun.

 His communication style is relatively and annoyingly slower. May be he's (unknowlingly) teaching us all a lesson patience (I know I could use it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). But his products are true reference level, has no peers, unique, reasonably priced, etc.

 May we all have the resources to deal with Dr. Xin's slower communication and product life cycle time.

 Wish you all a happy day.

 Sunil.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How does a corda move compare to a reference?
 I'm thinking about a refund and switching orders._

 

I had the opportunity to listen to HiFlight's early September Reference and the Move. I preferred the Reference by a good margin. However that is w/ my ears and gear. You and others could come up w/ totally different results.


----------



## slwiser

Maybe this is something of Dr. Xin's hertiage in that he is Chinese I think so think loooong term and learn patience.


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I had the opportunity to listen to HiFlight's early September Reference and the Move. I preferred the Reference by a good margin. However that is w/ my ears and gear. You and others could come up w/ totally different results._

 

Miguel, your ears are probably accurate in deciphering the sound and the relative SQ. Meier's Move is not superb (missing lots of detail relative to other amps) - after all he's working with the AD 8610/20 series and they are far from spectacular in terms of detail; they are however tonally enjoyable. 

 Everyone else, look at my sig and see my gear. The way I logicized it - I've lost my macros to Xin 4 repair and/or upgrade before and it cost me $50 in shipping + 3 months going ampless. I could do that with my previous portable gear, but not with an iMod; if something goes wrong with my move, I can either repair it myself or the good Dr. will turn my repair around in a few weeks tops! To own a Xin amp in a way necessitates having a backup spare amp and that is an expense I can't afford/justify. And, FWIW, my macro IV never sounded superb enough to justify the extra cost. For truly mind-blowing sound, I have my home gear. When I start travelling for work like crazy, I'll take a trip to Oregon and drop by the good Dr.'s house.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Miguel, your ears are probably accurate in deciphering the sound and the relative SQ. Meier's Move is not superb (missing lots of detail relative to other amps) - after all he's working with the AD 8610/20 series and they are far from spectacular in terms of detail; they are however tonally enjoyable. 

 Everyone else, look at my sig and see my gear. The way I logicized it - I've lost my macros to Xin 4 repair and/or upgrade before and it cost me $50 in shipping + 3 months going ampless. I could do that with my previous portable gear, but not with an iMod; if something goes wrong with my move, I can either repair it myself or the good Dr. will turn my repair around in a few weeks tops! To own a Xin amp in a way necessitates having a backup spare amp and that is an expense I can't afford/justify. And, FWIW, my macro IV never sounded superb enough to justify the extra cost. For truly mind-blowing sound, I have my home gear. When I start travelling for work like crazy, I'll take a trip to Oregon and drop by the good Dr.'s house._

 


 You probably have read this but there are two amps out there that IMO are just amazing and sound better than amps costing over twice as much. The two jewels are the MiniBox-E and the Mini^3. If you have a chance to listen to either I think you will be amazed at their sound.


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You probably have read this but there are two amps out there that IMO are just amazing and sound better than amps costing over twice as much. The two jewels are the MiniBox-E and the Mini^3. If you have a chance to listen to either I think you will be amazed at their sound. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks M. It's a little early to let this cat out of the bag, but whatever. If my partner and I can finally get our KICAS (see sig) released, and if people take to it, we will continue work on taking Xin head-on with a portable, fully discrete AND class-A portable amp.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 We've started working on it, and it's a ways to go, but rest assured we'll send you and Rob one each to demo and review when the time comes. Vive la revolution audie!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Since all you Xin lovers are experts at waiting, this little leak should send you all drooling and speculating, LOL.


----------



## tk3

Why don't you guys who are canceling their order at least wait out the thanksgiving deadline he stated somewhere?
 Now I don't know how well the good doc is at keeping deadlines, but since he actually gave one, I don't see the harm in waiting a few more weeks when you've waited months already.


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Why don't you guys who are canceling their order at least wait out the thanksgiving deadline he stated somewhere?
 Now I don't know how well the good doc is at keeping deadlines, but since he actually gave one, I don't see the harm in waiting a few more weeks when you've waited months already._

 

Personally, I'm thinking over the amp's lifespan and requirements. Xin amps need a backup and take forever to return from repair/upgrade.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks M. It's a little early to let this cat out of the bag, but whatever. If my partner and I can finally get our KICAS (see sig) released, and if people take to it, we will continue work on taking Xin head-on with a portable, fully discrete AND class-A portable amp.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 We've started working on it, and it's a ways to go, but rest assured we'll send you and Rob one each to demo and review when the time comes. Vive la revolution audie!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 Since all you Xin lovers are experts at waiting, this little leak should send you all drooling and speculating, LOL.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Je suis d'accord! Vive la revolution!


----------



## jamato8

A small discrete amp would be nice. With the smd in all areas, this should finally be obtainable. I look forward as I am not hearing any further great leaps with opamp based amps at this time.


----------



## Mr Do

Ordered may 25th 07 and still no amp.
 What do I do?

 Do!


----------



## Mr Do

I'll will be selling my Black Super Micro IV, if it ever arrives, to anyone interested.

 Thanks.
 Do!


----------



## Pangaea

So what is the latest on the reference. Is anyone getting them and are they good. I know the initial prototypes were highly regarded but since then it seems like no one is talking about them. Is that cause they are not as good as we hoped or because no one has one?


----------



## omendelovitz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A small discrete amp would be nice. With the smd in all areas, this should finally be obtainable. I look forward as I am not hearing any further great leaps with opamp based amps at this time._

 

Agreed. Let's remember that the supermicro and the reference sound the way they do b/c Xin is using MOSFET chips as replacements for op-amps.

 As far as the size and the obtainability of portable discreets, so far I've tried to convince my partner (circuit designer) to fit everything into the Hammond case used to house the mini^3 and the supermacro. He insists that it's not possible due to the SMT cap sizes; worst case scenario, we're likely looking at a case the size of the pint, but let's see what happens...


----------



## greydragon

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_.... possible due to the SMT cap sizes; worst case scenario, we're likely looking at a case the size of the pint, but let's see what happens..._

 

An amp with a fabulous sound, & is reasonably priced, will always sell regardless of size (e.g. the Lisa III). So by all means, design that amp to *sing*.

 It'll be righteous if you'd name your amps as 'Sin Amp'.


----------



## Pokato

So after 2 weeks of downtime, have anyone received any amps since then?


----------



## frozncore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Why don't you guys who are canceling their order at least wait out the thanksgiving deadline he stated somewhere?
 Now I don't know how well the good doc is at keeping deadlines, but since he actually gave one, I don't see the harm in waiting a few more weeks when you've waited months already._

 

Not to mention if they no longer want it, that they could sell it to those who want a Xin amp, instead of canceling their order.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pokato* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So after 2 weeks of downtime, have anyone received any amps since then?_

 

no, but more importantly 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 - i got my first email reply/acknowledgment ever in 7 attempts.

 it was to confirm tha he had my new CC details and somce cancellations and some changes here and there

 and i got

 "OK, thank you, Xin"


 yayyy


----------



## tk3

No amp here yet, but I actually got a reply from Xin saying that he will ship soon.
 On the Xin forums there have been some reports of people getting their reference amps, so I assume he is working hard to get them all out.

 And, welcome back Head-fi !!


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pokato* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So after 2 weeks of downtime, have anyone received any amps since then?_

 

Not an amp but I did receive a full refund.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *frozncore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Not to mention if they no longer want it, that they could sell it to those who want a Xin amp, instead of canceling their order._

 

If you want it you can order directly from Xin. He probably has parts on hand from the cancellations so it won't take as long to fill your order.


----------



## frozncore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you want it you can order directly from Xin. He probably has parts on hand from the cancellations so it won't take as long to fill your order._

 

Any idea what would be the ETA if I were to order a Super Micro IV now?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *frozncore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Any idea what would be the ETA if I were to order a Super Micro IV now?_

 

Seriously, there's probably not a single person on the planet that could give you a reliable answer. Just make sure you pay via credit card and not Paypal unless you like floating interest-free loans.


----------



## tbmusic

Received an e-mail from Xin several days ago. He acknowledged my "change of order" from a Supermicro to a Reference. 
 Now I know that he is still alive. Hope to get my amp soooooooon


----------



## fl00r

I got THE email from Xin on November 15 saying that my Reference would be shipped immediately.

 Still waiting.....


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbmusic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Received an e-mail from Xin several days ago. He acknowledged my "change of order" from a Supermicro to a Reference. 
 Now I know that he is still alive. Hope to get my amp soooooooon_

 

I got a similar email to confirm my change of order to a Reference....the funny thing is I didnt change my order lol!! I hope I get the right thing!


----------



## itsborken

Perhaps it is an automatic upgrade and the Supermicro is being discontinued? I'd follow up on it if you really wanted the Supermicro.


----------



## Kabeer

I did reply saying that i didnt modify my order. But havent heard anything back.


----------



## bunsco

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_no, but more importantly 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - i got my first email reply/acknowledgment ever in 7 attempts.

 it was to confirm tha he had my new CC details and somce cancellations and some changes here and there

 and i got

 "OK, thank you, Xin"


 yayyy 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Hi Quaddy

 How did you change your CC details?

 You see im in the same boat and need to update a card that has expired.

 Ive been to the site and its not super clear as to which field im to put the details in AND exactly which pieces of CC info to put in.

 would you be so kind as to tell/show me how you did it - you could PM me if you wish.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bunsco* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi Quaddy

 How did you change your CC details?

 You see im in the same boat and need to update a card that has expired.

 Ive been to the site and its not super clear as to which field im to put the details in AND exactly which pieces of CC info to put in.

 would you be so kind as to tell/show me how you did it - you could PM me if you wish._

 

hey there,

 i provided these details;

 Type: Mastercard/Visa/ETC
 CC number: XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX
 3 digit CV2 code: XXX
 Name on card: YOUR NAME HERE
 Expiry Date: MONTH/YEAR

 the very bottom option on cool stuff page:

 (Credit Card Info (use this to send securely another/correct CC#))

 then add a quick note in the comments field and paste your CC info in that to.

 HTH


----------



## tk3

Any news on the Xin front, guys?


----------



## fl00r

After the mail Xin sent to me 2 weeks ago (stated that he would "immediately ship the Reference") no sign of life from him 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Nothing changed really...


----------



## musicmaker

The guy doesn't respond to email. Its ridiculous. I'm having second thoughts about my order. I'm sure I'll eventually get the amp sometime before I have grandchildren. What if I have to get the amp repaired at some point ? Same mail-into-the-black-hole-and-wait game. I understand he's a one man shop and his amps sound great etc etc but not getting back to people is unacceptable. No use producing great products without a decent level of service to back them up. I'm at wit's end with this crap !


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The guy doesn't respond to email. Its ridiculous. I'm having second thoughts about my order. I'm sure I'll eventually get the amp sometime before I have grandchildren. What if I have to get the amp repaired at some point ? Same mail-into-the-black-hole-and-wait game. I understand he's a one man shop and his amps sound great etc etc but not getting back to people is unacceptable. No use producing great products without a decent level of service to back them up. I'm at wit's end with this crap !_

 

here we go again....


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The guy doesn't respond to email. Its ridiculous. I'm having second thoughts about my order. I'm sure I'll eventually get the amp sometime before I have grandchildren. What if I have to get the amp repaired at some point ? Same mail-into-the-black-hole-and-wait game. I understand he's a one man shop and his amps sound great etc etc but not getting back to people is unacceptable. No use producing great products without a decent level of service to back them up. I'm at wit's end with this crap !_

 

Like I said: nothing changed really. This is becoming a rather boring thread


----------



## fl00r

Hey Quaddy, you beat me in a split second


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Like I said: nothing changed really. This is becoming a rather boring thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I JUST GOT MY REFERENCE TODAY!!! 





 [size=xx-small]j/k... hope to boost your excitement for a second there... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/size]


----------



## Aaron622

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I JUST GOT MY REFERENCE TODAY!!! 





 [size=xx-small]j/k... hope to boost your excitement for a second there... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/size]_

 

How cruel to those of us who live vicariously through people who say they have received their Reference?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I JUST GOT MY REFERENCE TODAY!!! 





 [size=xx-small]j/k... hope to boost your excitement for a second there... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




[/size]_

 

i have seen this done before...


----------



## chukwe

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I JUST GOT MY REFERENCE TODAY!!!_

 

When did you order the Ref?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did you order the Ref?_

 

read the small print


----------



## lisnalee

I dont think the waits too bad. I'm nearing the 4 month mark and to be honest i rarely think about it.


----------



## aluren

well u do have a tomahawk to keep u at bay. i share the same sentiment as u, but i can understand why some will feel frustrated if they don't have another amp to entertain them during the wait...


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well u do have a tomahawk to keep u at bay. i share the same sentiment as u, but i can understand why some will feel frustrated if they don't have another amp to entertain them during the wait..._

 

I only have the tomahawk from tuesday, up until then i was using my trusty C&C box V2.

 But i have to admit getting the tomahawk has helped


----------



## shiezan

I'm nearing my 9th month of waiting for my reference.
 At this rate, I doubt I'll receive it by the holidays.


----------



## aluren

well with dr. xin, it's pretty much 100% guaranteed that you won't get it by the holidays....


----------



## dealmaster00

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm nearing my 9th month of waiting for my reference.
 At this rate, I doubt I'll receive it by the holidays._

 

Ugh...you've been waiting 9 months, I've only been waiting for 6. This is going to take forever :/ :/ :/


----------



## souperman

Wait...why don't we just rename this thread to "Those who are waiting for your Xin amp, post your complaints and whinings here!" That seems to be the trend of this thread.


----------



## aluren

maybe you should start that new thread!


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_maybe you should start that new thread!_

 

No need! This thread has already turned into the "whining and complaining" thread.


----------



## aluren

well you can direct the complaints to there so that this thread can actually be informative again...


----------



## srikeerthi

Got a reply from Dr. Xin saying that my Supermicro will be shipped soon (it was 2 weeks back).

 Now I'm in the 10+ month club


----------



## kaushama

He is trying to ship them out slowly! I hope he doesn't have any personal problem like health issue!


----------



## shiezan

How come that CHickenGod dude got his amp after waiting for 6 months?


----------



## JarodL1

8 months now. This will be the last product I buy from Xin.


----------



## Quaddy

4 months club here.

 lovin' every moment!

 encore...


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_8 months now. This will be the last product I buy from Xin._

 

You never know, you might change your opinion!


----------



## flargosa

Why don't you hang around the amp Fs forum wait for a Xin amp to go on sale? That's what I did, got two Xin amps in a month, almost got a Reference too, but when I found out it was a beta version, I turned it down. Makes waiting for the Reference a bit easier. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_8 months now. This will be the last product I buy from Xin._


----------



## tbmusic

I don't think I will buy anything directly from Xin in the future. I don't even care now. I just want my amp to complete the transaction. After I get my amp, adios Dr. Xin.


----------



## Sanddancer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tbmusic* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't think I will buy anything directly from Xin in the future. I don't even care now. I just want my amp to complete the transaction. After I get my amp, adios Dr. Xin._

 

Likewise. Now in the 9+ month club.

 What gets me is that he's happy to "go into development mode" while he has a massive backlog of orders. Fair enough, he wants to rus his shop as a one man band, but I think it's a bit off to decide to halt all production for months on end without word to anyone. When I signed up, I knew from here that the wait was around 3 months. Nowhere during the purchase did it say I was going to have to wait up to a year (maybe even more...who knows?) while he decided to concentrate his efforts on other stuff.

 If I went into a bar, gave my order to the barman and just as he was about to pull my pint he put the glass down, went over the other side of the bar without saying a word and spent the next few hours trying to come up with new cocktails, would I be wrong to be pissed?


----------



## chukwe

If anything happens to Dr Xin, is there a sibling who could continue building amps?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *souperman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wait...why don't we just rename this thread to "Those who are waiting for your Xin amp, post your complaints and whinings here!" That seems to be the trend of this thread._

 

It's Xin's mess to clean up. Don't blame the customers for getting ticked off by his behavior. If he's not ready to ship product within a month he shouldn't be taking orders for things. The UCC spells out what is fair practices for businesses and consumers and Xin's breaking about every rule in the book.


----------



## vandread

Just joint the 4 months club
 Still smilling and wait with patient


----------



## souperman

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's Xin's mess to clean up. Don't blame the customers for getting ticked off by his behavior. If he's not ready to ship product within a month he shouldn't be taking orders for things. The UCC spells out what is fair practices for businesses and consumers and Xin's breaking about every rule in the book._

 

My point wasn't to stop people from complaining, but to try to keep people on topic. It doesn't seem like many people like to keep on topic in these areas.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If anything happens to Dr Xin, is there a sibling who could continue building amps?_

 

LOL! good question!


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's Xin's mess to clean up. Don't blame the customers for getting ticked off by his behavior. If he's not ready to ship product within a month he shouldn't be taking orders for things. The UCC spells out what is fair practices for businesses and consumers and Xin's breaking about every rule in the book._

 

I'm not whining or complaining. I knew what I was likely getting into when I ordered.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I am curious though as to whether previous waiting times have been as long as they are now. (Seven months in my case?)
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Inquiring minds...

 Doug


----------



## JarodL1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *souperman* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My point wasn't to stop people from complaining, but to try to keep people on topic. It doesn't seem like many people like to keep on topic in these areas._

 

There is nothing to keep on topic. It has been months since he shipped out a non-testing reference order. If he wants to develop products that is fine, however it should be done on his own time after he finishes orders. His amps are good, but I would much rather give my business to Ray Samuels or someone else who answers their customers and offers immediate solutions. Not to mention his products are arguably just as good.


----------



## tnmike1

X2


----------



## aluren

yep, comparing my reference beta to the hornet, the reference was only slightly better with a wider soundstage. other than that, the hornet seems pretty on par. it's hard for me to recommend the reference if you gotta wait 8-12 months for it...


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yep, comparing my reference beta to the hornet, the reference was only slightly better with a wider soundstage. other than that, the hornet seems pretty on par. it's hard for me to recommend the reference if you gotta wait 8-12 months for it..._

 


 so this begs the question: is a "slightly better" sound over the hornet worth all this wait, aggravation, etc??? And what if something happens to the amp? Return it for repair and wait another 6 months or longer for its return??


----------



## kaushama

I received my reference about two weeks back and still burning it down. I do not know whether it is one of the beta configurations or not, as Dr. Xin still has not announced the final configuration. Over the period, I was waiting for Reference and my Supermini ( I was one of the first who ordered reference and lost the count of wait, as I didn't care), I bought a Hornet M. Hornet M is a very good amp itself, and has a slightly different sound signature to that of Reference. It has more forward and slightly aggresive mids than the warm sound of reference. I cannot make conclusions before I fully burn the Reference but I like its sound better and I sold the Hornet!! I should have kept it for comparisons later but this hobby made me almost broke, so I had to sell it. The strong points of all Xin amps are, their 3D sound-stage and transparency. But still, I think Hornet is a wonderful amp!


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so this begs the question: is a "slightly better" sound over the hornet worth all this wait, aggravation, etc??? And what if something happens to the amp? Return it for repair and wait another 6 months or longer for its return??_

 

well just remember mine's a beta version... but even then, i don't think it's worth it for an 8-12 month wait... i mean it's not like we're paying $250 for a $5,000 level amp...


----------



## Decel

Holy, and here I was pondering on getting Xin's reference or SuperMacro IV...

 I'll check back next year to see how's the status...


----------



## fl00r

After a wait of 9 months I got THE email from Xin:

 "A package was shipped to you on 12/04/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International"






 Ben


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After a wait of 9 months I got THE email from Xin:

 "A package was shipped to you on 12/04/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International"






 Ben_

 

So, why eek 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Throw a party for your new Xin


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, why eek 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Throw a party for your new Xin 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 






 because this mail came like a bold from the blue 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I will hold the party invitation until I have the Reference in my bare hands.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so this begs the question: is a "slightly better" sound over the hornet worth all this wait, aggravation, etc??? And what if something happens to the amp? Return it for repair and wait another 6 months or longer for its return??_

 

the practical side of me agrees.

 the acoustic prisoner in me disagrees;

 one mans "slightly better" is another mans MASSIVE, amazingly, worthwhile, ground shaking difference

 any small, yet percievable sound improvement via any element in audio, be it soundstage, clarity, tonal reproduction etc etc is IMHO worth 12mths > or <

 you get to a stage in tweaks and upgrades where, at least in my book the sound dividends become less and lesser as i continue, you are forced to seek out differences/improvements at a lower-level than before, but any found differences for the better are a ureeka! moment


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_so this begs the question: is a "slightly better" sound over the hornet worth all this wait, aggravation, etc??? And what if something happens to the amp? Return it for repair and wait another 6 months or longer for its return??_

 

We all know that in the world of hi-fi prices are exponentially related to quality, and an expensive, high-end amp might only sound slightly different form a much cheaper one. I guess the same considerations could be applied to wait times instead of prices. All the reports I've seen of the reference are very positive, and the one I heard was very impressive.


----------



## Aaron622

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After a wait of 9 months I got THE email from Xin:

 "A package was shipped to you on 12/04/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International"







 Ben_

 

I thought the Reference came out in August. Guess I'm farther down on the list than I hoped (approaching 4 months for me)....


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Aaron622* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought the Reference came out in August. Guess I'm farther down on the list than I hoped (approaching 4 months for me)...._

 

True, but I was on the waiting list for a mini since March and changed my order to the Reference while keeping my place in the queue.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Aaron622* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought the Reference came out in August. Guess I'm farther down on the list than I hoped (approaching 4 months for me)...._

 

well the reference initially was announced back in May. i was already 4 months in on my order for the supermicro (ordered in Jan 07) and told xin to change that order to the reference. i was one of the lucky few where he responded and sent me the reference right away... i guess even till now, no one really knows if he's completed the reference yet (read about disputes on what caps he want to use)....


----------



## som4ew

I got e-mail from Xin Feng that"A package was shipped to you on 12/06/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International".
 I don't know whether I will get Micro4 with this shipment,but I hope I will get upgraded Macro Max out with The Reference.
 My six month plus waiting is over.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks Xin.


----------



## tk3

Go Xin!
 Even though he didn't meet his proposed deadline, I hope I get my amp within a few weeks.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Even though he didn't meet his proposed deadline_

 

This is by far the biggest understatement of this thread!


----------



## srikeerthi

Must be my sins from the past life.. 10 months and still waiting when other are getting thier shipments


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Must be my sins from the past life.. 10 months and still waiting when other are getting thier shipments 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You might want to email him and remind him. Xin is a good guy and really cares but he does have, well a tremendous urge towards perfection. We have met a few times and his heartfelt desire to produce the best he can is really at the heart of the issue. He does need to improve the communication but that is just the way it is folks.


----------



## tottiflames

wow...you guys have great patient...!!!


----------



## lisnalee

Anyone else got theirs yet?


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone else got theirs yet?_

 

Ladies and gentleman: i got him! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It took me 9 months but 'it's worthwhile the wait'


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ladies and gentleman: i got him! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It took me 9 months but 'it's worthwhile the wait' 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

you lucky git


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_you lucky git 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Never pity someone how's waiting for a Xin amp


----------



## el_monkey

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Must be my sins from the past life.. 10 months and still waiting when other are getting thier shipments 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Same here. I placed my order on February 24 and still waiting. Pretty frustrating to see people who placed their orders after me receiving their amps. Hopefully, the wait will be worth it.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_monkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Same here. I placed my order on February 24 and still waiting. Pretty frustrating to see people who placed their orders after me receiving their amps. Hopefully, the wait will be worth it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I almost feel guilty... But chin up! One day you will be a member of the 'Reference-club'. Very rare members


----------



## grndslm

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* 
Even though he didn't meet his proposed deadline

 

This is by far the biggest understatement of this thread!



_

 












 That's how I feel about this thread. I used to be a Xin Advocate, but after waiting 8 months for my Supermini, and inching closer and closer to cancelling my order, I just can't say what he's doing is a good thing anymore.

 I just don't understand how he can ignore all the rest of his amps like he's done for the past 7 months or so...

 Can someone please relay to Xin that he needs to get into MAJOR production mode already, even if it means hiring other folks to do *some* of the work?? Thanks!


----------



## cbw

From the looks of it my recently ordered SuperMicro is going to be a christmas present for next here


----------



## willisv

Just canceled my order from March 26, absolutely no communication and tired of waiting.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hey there,

 i provided these details;

 Type: Mastercard/Visa/ETC
 CC number: XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX
 3 digit CV2 code: XXX
 Name on card: YOUR NAME HERE
 Expiry Date: MONTH/YEAR

 the very bottom option on cool stuff page:

 (Credit Card Info (use this to send securely another/correct CC#))

 then add a quick note in the comments field and paste your CC info in that to.

 HTH_

 

I did this to provide new credit card details, although I don't think it's secure because you have to put the credit card details into a note, rather than going to a place for entering credit card details, which I suppose would be more secure. I guess you aren't taken to payments because the amount is zero.


----------



## evilking

Anyone else get shipping notices?


 EK


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anyone else get shipping notices?


 EK_

 

According to the Fixup forum there is: Xin's Cool Talk - Amp orders, post & get your date of arrival.

 Good luck.


----------



## itsborken

Two other people since Thanksgiving? He's really kicked it into production mode now...


----------



## som4ew

I got the upgraded Reference today,it's still a long time before it's burnt in.
 First impression it already, sound wise, goes beyond fully burnt in (over 7 months) Hornet in many areas.


----------



## PhaedrusX

som4ew, could you post some pics of the internals of your Reference?
 It'd be nice to compare yours to the others to see if there is any kind of pattern here, or whether these are being sent out in random configurations.


----------



## jamato8

It is almost crazy, silly, unbelievable to me, someone that over builds, goes for the max in what my preamps and other devices have been, that this simple, well conceived amp can sound like it does. The highs are very refined and with mine, complex passages of music never get congested, it just goes on playing MUSIC. . . it is like the mouse that roars. . . and . . . roars but can play nice... .


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It is almost crazy, silly, unbelievable to me, someone that over builds, goes for the max in what my preamps and other devices have been, that this simple, well conceived amp can sound like it does. The highs are very refined and with mine, complex passages of music never get congested, it just goes on playing MUSIC. . . it is like the mouse that roars. . . and . . . roars but can play nice... ._

 

Nice said! It's these kind of posts that keep the spirits up!

 Ben


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got the upgraded Reference today,it's still a long time before it's burnt in.
 First impression it already, sound wise, goes beyond fully burnt in (over 7 months) Hornet in many areas._

 


 What do you mean "upgraded"?

 I haven't even figured out what the base Reference consists of - since there where multiple types of protos.

 Has Xin already changed ("upgraded") from the multiple protos?

 I am still curious about what I might be getting, but I am beginning to wonder if there might just be a bunch of different types of References out there and more different ones coming.

 ..... Makes it hard to discuss and compare.

 .

 .


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nice said! It's these kind of posts that keep the spirits up!

 Ben_

 


 Hmmmm - Yes .... I guess.

 I am REALLY looking forward to getting my Reference.... It sounds like it should be nice... whichever "Version" I get (???)


 ..... But, at this crazy mad pace of 1 or so a week since Thanksgiving (not before), it still may be another 1 - 5 years before I get an amp (????) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








 I haven't a clue to how many were ordered: 100 - 300 ?????

 .


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_som4ew, could you post some pics of the internals of your Reference?
 It'd be nice to compare yours to the others to see if there is any kind of pattern here, or whether these are being sent out in random configurations._

 



 + 1

 It is all seeming rather random to me at this point. (?????) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 .


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What do you mean "upgraded"?

 I haven't even figured out what the base Reference consists of - since there where multiple types of protos.

 Has Xin already changed ("upgraded") from the multiple protos?

 I am still curious about what I might be getting, but I am beginning to wonder if there might just be a bunch of different types of References out there and more different ones coming.

 ..... Makes it hard to discuss and compare.

 .
 .
 ._

 

I wouldn't worry about discussing and comparing. Just listen to the music. Pretty well all reports of the sound quality of the Reference are very positive. I listened to one and I was blown away. I have enough confidence in Dr Xin to hope that if and when I receive my Reference it will sound very good, and I shan't be worrying too much about what version it is. In fact, the longer I wait the better it might get. Now, there's a thought....


----------



## jpnz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After a wait of 9 months I got THE email from Xin:

 "A package was shipped to you on 12/04/2007 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International"






 Ben_

 

Not fair
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i ordered the same day as you, and all i get as an answer is: "soon". Are CC payments getting primacy?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmmmm - Yes .... I guess.

 I am REALLY looking forward to getting my Reference.... It sounds like it should be nice... whichever "Version" I get (???)_

 

It looks like the version Xin went with is the the version close to but not the same as the Micro. I have heard many different version and the Micro version is the one I discussed with Xin some time back as being the best, to my ears. The others are also extremely good. 

 I have a Super Macro 3B, it has dual 5002 buffers and even it sounds very good. Xin doesn't even have one of his own now, of this version, but I have kept all of mine starting from the Super Macro on although I did send one in for repair and never saw it again but I have more than enough to compare to.


----------



## som4ew

Here is my Ref.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



Attachment 383

Attachment 385

Attachment 387


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 What do you mean "upgraded"? 
 

My Ref has new board+1/4 jacks+12000 cap,upgrade from May Beta version.


----------



## PhaedrusX

interesting, thanks.
 this looks like the same configuration as the other recently received Reference. maybe Xin has settled on a version.
 for now...
 maybe...


----------



## dimm0k

Is he working on any of the Micro orders?


----------



## som4ew

No,I don't think so,he still doesn't send me my Super Micro, ordered on the same day I sent my amps for upgrade.


----------



## Nuwidol

I want my micro! 
 I've only been waiting for months though so it looks like i've got a lot longer to wait


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It looks like the version Xin went with is the the version close to but not the same as the Micro. I have heard many different version and the Micro version is the one I discussed with Xin some time back as being the best, to my ears. The others are also extremely good. 

 I have a Super Macro 3B, it has dual 5002 buffers and even it sounds very good. Xin doesn't even have one of his own now, of this version, but I have kept all of mine starting from the Super Macro on although I did send one in for repair and never saw it again but I have more than enough to compare to._

 


 "You never saw it again???" YIKES. Now I'm worried. He's had my SM IV LE since August and despite a handwritten letter to his address and several emails have heard nothing. O well--maybe I should look on the FS forum for an updated SM IV LE and forget about this one???


----------



## DennyL

Perhaps we should issue 'Xin Club' badges with different colours according to your wait time:-

 gold>one year
 silver>9 months
 bronze>6 months


----------



## tk3

That's one award I don't want to win.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"You never saw it again???"_

 

Oh it really doesn't matter. He has been very helpful and has more than made up for it.

 I haven't read of anyone that doesn't eventually get their amp back.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't read of anyone that doesn't eventually get their amp back._

 

Would you not be the first then?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Would you not be the first then? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

No, because he sent a Reference in its place.


----------



## shiezan

Haha, by the time my reference comes in, I'll have a platinum badge.


----------



## evilking

From 26th October:

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For months I've been trying to get thru to Dr. Xin via mail but had no reply. Last week I sent one final mail and set it up so that I would get a confirmation when it was received and when it was read. Last night I got a confirmation that the mail was deleted without even being read. So it seems tha Dr. Xin does not even bother to read his mail, he just deletes it. I've now had it with Dr. Xin. I'm cancelling my SuperMicro order, he can keep the SuperMini I have returned for repair and when my current SuperMicro finally dies I'll get an amp from some other builder. If he tries to charge my credit card for the SuperMicro order because he has also just deleted my cancellation I will have him for credit card fraud. He had a good thing going but he has for what ever reason totally screwed it up. I can only advise people to stay well clear of Dr. Xin and his joke operation. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	











_

 

Did you ever get your amp back?


 EK


----------



## tk3

I noticed Xin edited his topic on the Reference today (at least I don't remember seeing these before), looks like some pictures have been added of the internals, and of the silver coloured case.






 This one looks excellent, if I recall correctly I had a silver one on order.
 I hope the one I get will have a knob like that.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I noticed Xin edited his topic on the Reference today (at least I don't remember seeing these before), looks like some pictures have been added of the internals, and of the silver coloured case.






 This one looks excellent, if I recall correctly I had a silver one on order.
 I hope the one I get will have a knob like that._

 

The silver looks very good in the flesh!!. But i would settle for any colour if it meant getting it quicker.


----------



## jamato8

Silver holds up very well and Xin has a lot of silver cases so you might want to go with silver.


----------



## Quaddy

i am an original silver orderer, wanted it to match my 4G imod stainless steel yotank, suffice to say i now use a 5g imod that is black 

 but i still prefer the silver, i have a black supermacro so it would look to similar to justify it all!!

 edit: so am i right in thinking the 'final' reference uses 22,000uF?


----------



## jamato8

No, it may have the 22,000uf or the 12,000uf. I have seen it both ways. The chip layout and the rest of the configuration is the same for either.


----------



## evilking

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *evilking* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From 26th October:

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
For months I've been trying to get thru to Dr. Xin via mail but had no reply. Last week I sent one final mail and set it up so that I would get a confirmation when it was received and when it was read. Last night I got a confirmation that the mail was deleted without even being read. So it seems tha Dr. Xin does not even bother to read his mail, he just deletes it. I've now had it with Dr. Xin. I'm cancelling my SuperMicro order, he can keep the SuperMini I have returned for repair and when my current SuperMicro finally dies I'll get an amp from some other builder. If he tries to charge my credit card for the SuperMicro order because he has also just deleted my cancellation I will have him for credit card fraud. He had a good thing going but he has for what ever reason totally screwed it up. I can only advise people to stay well clear of Dr. Xin and his joke operation. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	













 

Did you ever get your amp back?


 EK_

 

nc8000 sent me a PM. 6 months and nothing on the status of the repair.

 I asked this question because a friend, having listened to the SuperMicro IV, asked for my advice, if it was worth the wait and the hassle to own one of Xin's amps. I'm going to tell him no, it's not worth it. Forget the SuperMicro and move on, the sound just can't make up for Xin's many shortcomings.



 EK


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, it may have the 22,000uf or the 12,000uf. I have seen it both ways. The chip layout and the rest of the configuration is the same for either._

 

ok, well thats a little confusing for people as on the xin board it shows the reference with 22,000uF stamped on the photo as if that is the specification of the caps included.

 such a small detail may matter for certain unamed geeks


----------



## jamato8

I have seen images here that have shown both caps being used.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have seen images here that have shown both caps being used._

 

jamato8,

 forgetting images that have been seen here. - this is a third party, unnoficial, un-afiliated forum.

 with all due respect, if you go to xins actual official homepage, and click on cool stuff then click on reference, it takes you to a thread with info and pictures.

 on the reference pictures, included amongst the pics with all the different combinations, colours, jack options etc, there is only one photo wich references the uF cap size - that figure reads 22,000uF!!!!!

 so it is fair comment is it not, that any reasonable person who didnt know that xin was up and down like a bees wing with various uF's in the mix to conclude that they if placing a order they would definitely receive a 22,000uF cap in their reference??

 with the lack of communication from xin, its not like someone can quickly email or phone him to check and clarify on the finer points of the amp, IMHO, that is why his website needs to be absolutely representative of what someone is going to get after a massive wait.

 some people may hold it in their opinion that they either have a liking or disliking to the sonic difference the respective uF values can effect, and this maybe would sway said individual, coupled with long waits to abandon order if they knew they were not going to get advertised uF value in their amp after all. 

 i find it odd that if someone went on today and orderd a reference they would get a 12,000uF cap in their amp sometime down the line!

 dont get me wrong i am not actually, as is might seem, having a go at xin at all, i have two of his amps and am waiting on a third, and have nothing but praise for them.

_has all product mis/representation just fallen out of fashion all of a sudden?_

*i realize i am being overley pedantic here, but feel it is symbolic of a greater, broader ethic for the uninitiated, and correct product representation *


----------



## jamato8

I understand where you are coming from but there have always been oscillations on Xin's designs. Just reading up on the threads on his home page will confirm this to the uninitiated. Buyer be ware. We should always research a product no matter what it is, to a greater or lesser degree depending upon the importance of that product to a person's own needs. Some things do not get updated on Xin's site in a timely manner, this goes without saying but the current state of the Reference with regards to the cap being used is anyone's guess maybe including Xin's. I have listened to both and slightly prefer the 12,000 but others like the 22,000. I have both and I don't think either will disappoint, though I understand what you are saying.


----------



## Khanate

I really want Xin's amp from the reviews and the portability they have, but I can't spend 150-300$ without something in return within 6 months..

 Guess I'll wait until someone else makes a comparable product


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Khanate* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I really want Xin's amp from the reviews and the portability they have, but I can't spend 150-300$ without something in return within 6 months..

 Guess I'll wait until someone else makes a comparable product 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

eh? though you didnt want the wait?


----------



## tk3

1 more report of shipping on Xin's forum.
 Looks like he is actually active building still.

  Quote:


 I got shipping information from Dr.Xin.
 I don't know the content of the package whether upgraded Macro4(send to Dr.Xin at Jun.2) or Reference(orderd at Sep.9) or both of them. 
 

Maybe this means he cleared his back log up to June?
 Either that, or he is drawing orders at random from a big hat.


----------



## sant430

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1 more report of shipping on Xin's forum.
 Looks like he is actually active building still.



 Maybe this means he cleared his back log up to June?
 Either that, or he is drawing orders at random from a big hat._

 

I hope he is building. I can't remember if I sent my upgrades in June or July. I just know that I'm still waiting....


----------



## ljs

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1 more report of shipping on Xin's forum.
 Looks like he is actually active building still.
 Maybe this means he cleared his back log up to June?
 Either that, or he is drawing orders at random from a big hat._

 

You wish...
 No mail for me, I'm still waiting.
 I'm glad I have a tomahawk, it helps a lot.


----------



## Khanate

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_eh? though you didnt want the wait? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Yes, I meant when someone else who can build and ship an amp with similar SQ and size in a more reasonable time frame I'll buy from him... or if xin shortens his when he finds the time


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Khanate* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, I meant when someone else who can build and ship an amp with similar SQ and size in a more reasonable time frame I'll buy from him... or if xin shortens his when he finds the time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

such a holy grail exists?, xin sound in less than a year?


----------



## ljbounty

Just got notification that a package was shipped today. Sent my SuperMini IV for upgrading at the end of April also ordered a Reference with 1/4 inch jacks. Hopefully they will arrive just before xmas. Come on santa get your skates on!!!


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, it may have the 22,000uf or the 12,000uf. I have seen it both ways. The chip layout and the rest of the configuration is the same for either._

 


 In addition to providing Beta versions and pics with 22,000uf and 12,000uf, he has actually "Stated": 15,000uf 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So, three options.

 And NOBODY really knows what to expect to get.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In addition to providing Beta versions and pics with 22,000uf and 12,000uf, he has actually "Stated": 15,000uf 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So, three options.

 And NOBODY really knows what to expect to get._

 

the only thing certain about xin amps is the wait...


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In addition to providing Beta versions and pics with 22,000uf and 12,000uf, he has actually "Stated": 15,000uf 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So, three options.

 And NOBODY really knows what to expect to get._

 

The 15,000uf was a very early Reference. It is the 22 and 12 that have been used for the past 1/2 year or so. Either version sounds good with the 22 taking a little longer to burn in.


----------



## ronfint

I got back my SuperMacro IV today after a long absence. I forgot what a great amp this really is. Is it now much better than before? It is better, but my memory isn't good enough to say how great the difference is. My current opamp setup is OPA128SM with HA5002 buffers, AD8599 in 3 and 2xBUF634 Hi-C in 4. With the Ultimate Ears UE-10 and an imod this is a killer portable rig. 

 I haven't listened much to my UE-10s in recent months, and I thought that I'd lost my taste for them. With the SMIV back, I'm going to spend a lot more time with the UE-10's.

 Another thing I really like about the SMIV is that it's a tinkerer's joy. It's easy to swap opamps, and there is still a little bit of room in there for a couple of BlackGates. (Maybe I'll try to solder them back in there this weekend.)


----------



## vorlon1

In case anyone is interested, I got my micro and mini back today which I had sent in for repair and upgrades in early March.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In case anyone is interested, I got my micro and mini back today which I had sent in for repair and upgrades in early March._

 

So do they work? :^) I wonder what changes where made to the Mini?


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In case anyone is interested, I got my micro and mini back today which I had sent in for repair and upgrades in early March._

 

i look forward to your impressions!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vorlon1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In case anyone is interested, I got my micro and mini back today which I had sent in for repair and upgrades in early March._

 

Glad you received them. We need to talk when I get back from my trip!


----------



## shiezan

AHHH

 It seems like everyone from the March boat
 already received their's. I'm like Mrs. Jumbo waiting for
 the stork.


----------



## sant430

I've received an email that has confirmed priority shipping on my smiv upgraded!! This will be a cool gift to myself as I'm about to go on break as well!!!


----------



## Kabeer

Well im on the April boat, well the very beggining(2nd april). No word yet, I had an email a while back but no real updates since.


----------



## gp_hebert

I received my SuperMacro IV today......................

























 that I bought last week from another head-fier (Drews).


----------



## srikeerthi

I think he is shipping out the upgrades only. 

 I have ordered on March 1st. I haven't received replies to my mails since a month. Last mail I received was in Mid-nov saying I will get it 'soon' 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But since there is some activity going on I'm hoping that I will receive it within a years time...


----------



## nfusion770

I just got a notice on either my updated Micro and/or my reference. Sent in the micro in May/ June- ordered the Reference in August. I'm guessing its the Micro.


----------



## sulcata_geo

I received my upgraded SuperMacro4 today
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I send from Japan at Jun.2 and received shipping information at Dec.16.

 Next is the Reference orderd at Sep.9


----------



## musicmaker

congratulations. I've sent like 15 emails to the guy regarding my reference with no response.


----------



## tk3

Well, he is shipping orders from June now, at this rate we should all expect to see our amps soon if nothing changes.

 That *if* is the problem, though.


----------



## willisv

Asked for a paypal refund for my March order on Dec 8... no response and no refund yet.


----------



## tnmike1

just got my email that the SM LE IV I sent in august is being returned with all modifications WHOOPEEE. Now we'll see about the Reference i have on order.


----------



## shiezan

It seems like he skipped the March group.


----------



## fallen.angel

For those who received their Xin Reference Amp recently, could someone post a photo of their unit, especially if it's in silver/black (body/face)? Much appreciated.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fallen.angel* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For those who received their Xin Reference Amp recently, could someone post a photo of their unit, especially if it's in silver/black (body/face)? Much appreciated._

 

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/las...ctures-273303/


----------



## ljbounty

Finally the reference and upgraded Supermini IV arrived this afternoon, currently both burning in. Here are some pictures of both.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljbounty* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Finally the reference and upgraded Supermini IV arrived this afternoon, currently both burning in. Here are some pictures of both._

 

nice, that reference knob seems to be random as to which people are getting?

 man you have to be the luckiest head-fier this xmas, this year, this century...this.....! getting your two amps on the 24th decemeber - helllo


----------



## tk3

Yeah, that shiny knob is the best looking one imo.
 Beats the one with the 2 rings or the flatter one by far.


----------



## ljbounty

Quaddy, yes I didn't think I would see the amps this side of xmas but they are here and good will to all head-fier's. Dr Xin will deliver eventualy.Merry xmas to all.


----------



## justhavingfun

Sent Supermacro IV for update: 5 August 2007
 Received Supermacro IV: 24 December 2007
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I haven't had a chance to listen for this updated Supermacro IV yet. It is still getting charge at the moment. Now I just have to wait for my Reference to come in, eventually.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *justhavingfun* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sent Supermacro IV for update: 5 August 2007
 Received Supermacro IV: 24 December 2007
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I haven't had a chance to listen for this updated Supermacro IV yet. It is still getting charge at the moment. Now I just have to wait for my Reference to come in, eventually.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Apparently Xin is sorta on schedule with the upgrades. Sent my Supermacro IV for upgrades in late July and got it back last week So seems this delivery to "justhavingfun" is on Xin's upgrade timetable


----------



## tbmusic

I ordered in May (2007). I made the mistake of paying for the amp using paypal. Now I want to buy the Pico instead of the Reference but it is so hard to cancel the order. I guess I will have to buy both amps. If Xin does not send out the amps soon, I think that many of us will switch to the Pico.


----------



## musicmaker

I was thinking about doing the same. I've emailed the guy numerous times without any response. The pico is a seriously good amp/dac and so is the predator. I'll be canceling the reference (paid via credit card) and ordering one of those shortly. I'm not going to wait for 10 months or a year to get a reference. It may be a good amp but there are other very good amps our there as well from vendors that take customer service seriously. Sorry for the negative tone but I'm done with "waiting for the Xin amp".


----------



## DDW

Well, I was never really optimistic that I would get a Reference by Christmas...... But, I am still somewhat hopeful to get one by Thanksgiving.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 .


----------



## vvs_75

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was thinking about doing the same. I've emailed the guy numerous times without any response. The pico is a seriously good amp/dac and so is the predator. I'll be canceling the reference (paid via credit card) and ordering one of those shortly. I'm not going to wait for 10 months or a year to get a reference. It may be a good amp but there are other very good amps our there as well from vendors that take customer service seriously. Sorry for the negative tone but I'm done with "waiting for the Xin amp"._

 

If you paid via Credit card I would suggest you not canceling!
 For your good and others who want it. He won't charge your Credit card until he ship the amp! So what are you loosing? When you finally get it then you can sell it if you like Pico better. Your PM box explodes when you post it in FS forum. But I doubt that you will sell it unless you really need amp/dac combo.

 just my 2c.


----------



## Quaddy

any more arrivals in the last week?


----------



## tk3

Seems to be quiet on the Xin front, but that is not surprising considering the time of the year.
 I'd say all we can hope for is that he continues his current (or last month's) rate of production in the next year.


----------



## Drumonron

I'm looking forward to impressions on the Xin Reference. In the meantime....Happy New Year all!


----------



## achristilaw

Well I got my email today. "The Reference is coming", "The Reference is coming". I feel like Paul Revere.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *achristilaw* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well I got my email today. "The Reference is coming" ....._

 

In keeping with the title of this thread, when did you order your Reference?


----------



## achristilaw

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In keeping with the title of this thread, when did you order your Reference?_

 

 The Start of September.


----------



## mp101

I ordered my reference the beginning of August, and originally the mini in June, but changed to a micro.

 As you can see I've been impatient and bought a lot of amps, some of which I will sell.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mp101* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered my reference the beginning of August, and originally the mini in June, but changed to a micro.

 As you can see I've been impatient and bought a lot of amps, some of which I will sell._

 

I guess you did. You have the D1 but with 0 hours?


----------



## mp101

Jamato, its actually got 10 hours now bedfore the battery died, its been charged no, so ready for another round using foobar and the USB.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mp101* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Jamato, its actually got 10 hours now bedfore the battery died, its been charged no, so ready for another round using foobar and the USB._

 

I see. You also have the P2. I like to run the P2 with the D1.


----------



## Drumonron

A-n-t-i-c-i-p-a-t-i-o-n.....
 ....makin' me wait...


----------



## srikeerthi

I'm in the 10 month+ waiting club now!
 Anyone else in the same team?


----------



## jamato8

I would email Xin with 10 month in the subject line.


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm in the 10 month+ waiting club now!
 Anyone else in the same team? _

 

That does seem like an unusually long time.

 I can't complain, I've only been waiting for the reference since 9/14/2007.

 I don't have any Xin amps and look forward to hearing one.


----------



## Sanddancer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm in the 10 month+ waiting club now!
 Anyone else in the same team? _

 

Yup.

 I e-mailed him at the 5 month mark and got a reply saying it would be "soon". I e-mailed again at the 7 month mark and got a replay saying "very soon". I've just e-mailed him again....I have no idea why since if he replies, anything he says will be worthless.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yup.

 I e-mailed him at the 5 month mark and got a reply saying it would be "soon". I e-mailed again at the 7 month mark and got a replay saying "very soon". I've just e-mailed him again....I have no idea why since if he replies, anything he says will be worthless._

 

not that this has anything to do with it, but just a personal note of interest,

*has anyone from the united kingdom received a reference from Xin yet?*


----------



## Drumonron

I thought I read in a post somewhere that people who've ordered in August were receiving amps??


----------



## mp101

I'm from the UK, ordered in June (supirmini, changed to supermicro) and August (reference), nothing yet, no answers whatsoever to any emails apart from the initial enquiry order.


----------



## dle4e_2005

I'm considering canceling my Supermicro order for other amp now.

 I'm in the 8th month club.

 I've sent him more than ten emails yet I don't receive any email back from him.


----------



## Quaddy

very nearly 5mth club here.

 are you guys following xins self imposed 'strict' formatting of your emails? - ie, plain text, not html, order number in the subject box not _Hi there_ and similiar?, syncing your pc time.

 i have to admit i didnt follow any of those things as mentioned here initially
 and must have sent 4 or 5 emails with no reply, then i did all i could of his checklist and did get a reply, maybe a coincidence!

 i would never dream of cancelling now i am this far, as i am lucky enough to have 2 xin amps already, but understand the frustrations.

 i wonder if xins new years resolution even incuded expedience of amp production! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 - heres hoping...

 ppl with refs, post some more pics with it in your setup in this thread to appease us queue-ees please.


----------



## kokohore

I'm entering 10months club as well... I ordered SMini 04/Mar/2007 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I sent email a month ago, (entitled `waiting 9 month...`) but no reply yet.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought I read in a post somewhere that people who've ordered in August were receiving amps??_

 

as far as I know there were three of us, but these were sent in as upgrades only--two SM LE IV and one Mini as I recall--yet we all are still awaiting the reference notification.


----------



## srikeerthi

Have sent mails to him earlier and sent one today too. I dont think its the formatting of the mail thats the issue, coz I am replying to an older reply from him (with order number and actual request in the subject line).

 All the updates to date seem to be for upgrades or Reference amps. 
 Has he stopped making the Supermicro and others!


----------



## sfflyfish

I hit 8 months today. Ordered 2 SuperMicro IV's on May 4. Since one of them was to be a birthday present for a friend, I 'judiciously' allowed almost 4 months worth of delivery time. His B-day was last August 25... With a week to go and no sign of a SMIV on the horizon I ended up getting him a Tomahawk which, needless to say arrived well within the necessary time?

 He's happy as can be and I'm going to have a spare SMIV. I gotta wonder what that thing might be worth on the open market if it is ever actually in hand?


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He's happy as can be and I'm going to have a spare SMIV. I gotta wonder what that thing might be worth on the open market if it is ever actually in hand?_

 

Hey, if you happen to have a spare SMIV, PM me


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey, if you happen to have a spare SMIV, PM me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

If and WHEN they actually arrive, I'll happily let you know.

 Best regards,
 Doug


----------



## JarodL1

9 months. I am not expecting to get this before the one year mark at this point. Will ABSOLUTELY be the last thing I ever order from Xin unless he changes his service drastically.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey, if you happen to have a spare SMIV, PM me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

just glad i got mine back a couple weeks ago with all current upgrades. Was gonna sell it on the forums, then decided to keep it. Maybe I can get about $450 for it???


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If and WHEN they actually arrive, I'll happily let you know.

 Best regards,
 Doug_

 

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'll happily grasp it.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_just glad i got mine back a couple weeks ago with all current upgrades. *Was gonna sell it on the forums, then decided to keep it. Maybe I can get about $450 for it???
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


*_

 

I think you have a very nice reason to keep it :lol:


----------



## ljs

I am in the club "cant even remember when I placed my order".
 Who wanna join?


----------



## JarodL1

Why are orders for references from say July being filled before orders for supermicros made in March/April??


----------



## tk3

Xin works in mysterious ways.


----------



## dimm0k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_9 months. I am not expecting to get this before the one year mark at this point. Will ABSOLUTELY be the last thing I ever order from Xin unless he changes his service drastically._

 

I can't wait to place a second order!


----------



## Drumonron

Those who cannot, wait.


----------



## el_monkey

I just received notice that my Xin amp ordered on 2/24/07 is being shipped. I received both an email from Xin in response to a recent email and an invoice for the Xin Reference amp. Here is what Dr. Xin had to say in the email:

 "Very sorry, processing your order right now. I had to ship all the
 return amps (for upgrading and repair) first. Xin"

 Hopefully, this means that he is starting on the backlog of amps ordered, starting with the ones ordered first.


----------



## shiezan

I ordered mine just about 20 days after you so hopefully he can get to my batch before getting back into research mode.


----------



## willisv

I just received an email that a reference is being shipped to me.

 I ordered a supermicro on mar 26/07 and changed the order to a reference in august, after getting no email responses I canceled the order in early December. I received my paypal refund on Jan 2/08 and the following day got an email from Xin saying that my amp was going to be shipped that day, but if I still wanted it there would be no waiting. I emailed him that I would still like a reference. 

 It has been quite a ride, but I'm happy that I will get my amp!


----------



## Drumonron

Thanks to Xin, I am saving money- Thank you Xin.

 Just had this thought and wanted to put it out there...
 ...I ordered 3 Xin amps in Sept 07. I am still waiting and I'm
 okay with that but I've seen plenty of tempting amps that I've wanted to buy in this waiting time since ordering but have not due to my commitment to Xin. 

 So in reality, Xin has saved me a ton of money.

 Thank you, Xin.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_monkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just received notice that my Xin amp ordered on 2/24/07 is being shipped. I received both an email from Xin in response to a recent email and an invoice for the Xin Reference amp. Here is what Dr. Xin had to say in the email:

 "Very sorry, processing your order right now. I had to ship all the
 return amps (for upgrading and repair) first. Xin"

 Hopefully, this means that he is starting on the backlog of amps ordered, starting with the ones ordered first. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Lemme see if I have this right: You ordered a NEW amp almost one year ago. Now you get a notice that he's returning "upgrade and repair" amps first. OK, I sent in my SM LE IV for all upgrades in August and just received it about four weeks ago. Also ordered a Reference in August. So does this mean I'll finally get my Reference around June-July?

 Yikes. Must have over 500 orders for something to take this long


----------



## lisnalee

Officially joined the 5 month club today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Just another 5 to go !!! (hopefully)


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lemme see if I have this right: You ordered a NEW amp almost one year ago. Now you get a notice that he's returning "upgrade and repair" amps first. OK, I sent in my SM LE IV for all upgrades in August and just received it about four weeks ago. Also ordered a Reference in August. So does this mean I'll finally get my Reference around June-July?

 Yikes. Must have over 500 orders for something to take this long
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

There was a guy who ordered in Sept (post 2174) and got his already (of 2007??).
 Who knows what Xin is doing.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Officially joined the 5 month club today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Just another 5 to go !!! (hopefully)_

 

I am only a few days away from the 5 month club also.
 No word from Xin after he said he would be shipping "soon" in a mail dated end Nov 2007.
 Frankly I'm pretty much sick of the waiting, since there is no end in sight.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Officially joined the 5 month club today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Just another 5 to go !!! (hopefully)_

 

oh yeah, well reminded, snap @ 5mth anniversay today!

 *snivel*

 will be the final major part in my jigsaw, regarding a portable rig.


----------



## Cata1yst

Hey, i decided id throw my question in here just not to make a new topic for a simple question

 Can a Supermacro IV drive higher impediance headphones well (it will be used as a stepping stone for my hd600's until i can get a good source that will make the best out of a good amp) ?

 If so ill probably have my xin supermacro here in a week


----------



## bluey_02

Well, I'm closing 9 months. Abso-*****in-lutely ridiculous (counting the fact he ignores my emails) but knowing that others are waiting as long as I have is more assuring than thinking Xin had forgotten all about my SMicro IV order.. thanks I guess.

 P.S. 222 pages? Holy crap..someone should show Xin this thread..


----------



## musicmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bluey_02* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I'm closing 9 months. Abso-*****in-lutely ridiculous (counting the fact he ignores my emails) but knowing that others are waiting as long as I have is more assuring than thinking Xin had forgotten all about my SMicro IV order.. thanks I guess.

 P.S. 222 pages? Holy crap..someone should show Xin this thread.._

 

I suppose we could email him the URL to the thread but he would ignore that email too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am totally fed up as well. Emailing him every single freaggin day with no response. Absolutely insane !


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh yeah, well reminded, snap @ 5mth anniversay today!

 *snivel*

 will be the final major part in my jigsaw, regarding a portable rig._

 

Fingers crossed by this time next week i'll have my "Placebo" box, finally I'll be able to use my imod the way nature intended


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Fingers crossed by this time next week i'll have my "Placebo" box, finally I'll be able to use my imod the way nature intended 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

oh yes, cannot wait to see 'her' <-- your placebo box. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 just waiting on SK's new 5" cable now!

 err...better make this on topic i guess: _anyone know what knob is being sent out on the refs?_


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Cata1yst* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey, i decided id throw my question in here just not to make a new topic for a simple question

 Can a Supermacro IV drive higher impediance headphones well (it will be used as a stepping stone for my hd600's until i can get a good source that will make the best out of a good amp) ?

 If so ill probably have my xin supermacro here in a week 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

absolutely. Will drive most headphones with little trouble


----------



## Pokato

Placed my order for a Reference on August 10th...and no emails reply/update during all these time, and by tomorrow I will be in the 5 months club. 

 Wonder what was his reason for shipping September's orders first, ahead of the August's order?


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pokato* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Placed my order for a Reference on August 10th...and no emails reply/update during all these time, and by tomorrow I will be in the 5 months club. 

 Wonder what was his reason for shipping September's orders first, ahead of the August's order?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

placed my reference order about the same time as you, and shipped my SM LE IV back for all upgrades. Got the SM LE IV back about three weeks ago or so, but still no word on the Reference.

 Go figure?????


----------



## hershann

I ordered the Reference in Nov 07 - so that's only 2 months. Feels like ages already. Hopefully he can deliver by June before I leave the states.

 her shann


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_as far as I know there were three of us, but these were sent in as upgrades only--two SM LE IV and one Mini as I recall--yet we all are still awaiting the reference notification._

 

My SuperMacro 3 was one of those that went in for updates in July, and came back in November around Thanksgiving. I got it from a fellow colorado head-fi user right after that.

 I'm not convinced it is anything super special worthy of a 10 months wait, but I wanted to play with the impedance, attenuation, bass boost and cross feed switches. Someday I'll get around to giving it more time, but the other amps I have are as good or better so far. I am not willing yet to give Xin my money to wait a year for a new product, no matter how good his SuperMicro IV or Reference are.


----------



## LamontGrady

I ordered on Aug 28 (over 4 months) and managed to forget about it until I was going through some old emails.

 I'm not gonna cancel but I certainly wouldn't do it again. The guy is frikkin dumb. What.

 I'm going to move to a new house in a month, I can not expect any kind of verification that he got my address change? Nice business there buddy.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LamontGrady* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered on Aug 28 (over 4 months) and managed to forget about it until I was going through some old emails.

 I'm not gonna cancel but I certainly wouldn't do it again. The guy is frikkin dumb. What.

 I'm going to move to a new house in a month, I can not expect any kind of verification that he got my address change? Nice business there buddy._

 

Same here I am selling my house,and may have to move in a month,or so.
 No courtesy from him.


----------



## jamato8

Don't sell yet. Wait until you get the amp, then sell.


----------



## Drumonron

Agreed, you are not allowed to move your place of residence until you receive the amp.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't sell yet. Wait until you get the amp, then sell._

 

My wife has eyed another house she likes,and wants it .I like it here!
 I may have to have it sent to my Po box that I have.LOL


----------



## Nuwidol

I ordered a micro on august 2nd & moved in early october. I sent xin an email a week before i moved & explaining this & gave my new address. He replied the next day with a quick one liner saying something like 'No problem. Details received'

 It'd be nice to receive the amp now though.......


----------



## kimura

these person are all waiting for xin amp.....and who believe xin still in him place maybe took with money go to somewhere... I just guess,but I don't want lie to everyone


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kimura* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_these person are all waiting for xin amp.....and who believe xin still in him place maybe took with money go to somewhere... I just guess,but I don't want lie to everyone_

 

Yeah, that Xin!
_*Scientist by day, scammer by night!*_

 I'm the last person to defend his work practices, as I don't like it any more than the next guy, but saying things like this without proof is just uncalled for.
 Even this week someone has reported receiving their amp somewhere (notwithstanding that it was ordered approx 14891284 weeks prior).

 So he is working on them, albeit slowly (according to the standards of the crackhead Head-fier who need their shot).


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, that Xin!
*Scientist by day, scammer by night!*

 I'm the last person to defend his work practices, as I don't like it any more than the next guy, but saying things like this without proof is just uncalled for.
 Even this week someone has reported receiving their amp somewhere (notwithstanding that it was ordered approx 14891284 weeks prior).

 So he is working on them, albeit slowly (according to the standards of the crackhead Head-fier who need their shot)._

 

Can you explaine {scammer by night!}


----------



## GUNS

He was just kidding. Xin is just extremely slow.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *GUNS* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He was just kidding. Xin is just extremely slow._

 

Thanks,just wondering.


----------



## jamato8

Xin owns his home, he is still where he has been for some time. Yes he is working slowly, sorry. I can understand totally the frustration. If you can wait, I know, I know, the Reference is worth it.


----------



## hamparts

I thought everyone might get a laugh out of my email thread with Xin. See, he has customer service:

 On October 30 he wrote:
 Hard to tell the shipping date right now. Xin

 On October 30, I wrote:
 Huuum, are you getting my emails?

 On 10/11/07, I wrote:
 Is there a shipping date yet? Thanks.

 On 9/18/07 10:00 PM, "sales@fixup.net" <sales@fixup.net> wrote:
 ID 3933XXXX


----------



## Drumonron

If anyone who received any Xin amps lately would kindly list their impressions on SQ vs Wait time, it would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## willisv

I received my reference in the mail today. (Mar 26 order) I installed some panasonic eneloops and hooked it up to my 5.5 imod and Er4p's. Without any break-in it sounds very very nice. Compared to my hornet m, which has about 200 hrs on it - the reference has it beat easily. It is a very warm and smooth sounding amp and much less fatiguing to listen to. The best way to describe the sound is very tight and controlled, it plays the music effortlessly. I will post more impressions once it breaks in.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *willisv* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I received my reference in the mail today. (Mar 26 order) I installed some panasonic eneloops and hooked it up to my 5.5 imod and Er4p's. Without any break-in it sounds very very nice. Compared to my hornet m, which has about 200 hrs on it - the reference has it beat easily. It is a very warm and smooth sounding amp and much less fatiguing to listen to. The best way to describe the sound is very tight and controlled, it plays the music effortlessly. I will post more impressions once it breaks in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Was it worth the wait?


----------



## Drumonron

Thanks Willisv...It helps to hear positives reviews.


----------



## Drumonron

...takes a little edge off the pain, you know.


----------



## Drumonron

I am waiting for the Reference that I ordered in Mid Sept and I also have the hornet "m" for the interim so I appreciated the comparison...the RSA Hornet is a nice little amp IMHO.


----------



## willisv

The wait didn't really bother me as much as the lack of communication, and I payed Xin with paypal which is the wrong way to do it. If you order with a credit card and try to forget about it then there's no worries, since he doesn't charge till he ships your amp. This amp is definitely worth the money paid, at $280 plus shipping I don't think you could get a higher quality portable for the price - never mind with free updates. I am listening to it right now through my alien dac, foobar2000, and playing flac files, I can honestly say that this amp is not over hyped... it does sound that good.


----------



## willisv

almost forgot - for those having trouble getting through to Xin, make sure you follow the email format on his website to a T. This was noted by someone a few posts back and it really does help.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *willisv* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The wait didn't really bother me as much as the lack of communication, and I payed Xin with paypal which is the wrong way to do it. If you order with a credit card and try to forget about it then there's no worries, since he doesn't charge till he ships your amp. This amp is definitely worth the money paid, at $280 plus shipping I don't think you could get a higher quality portable for the price - never mind with free updates. I am listening to it right now through my alien dac, foobar2000, and playing flac files, I can honestly say that this amp is not over hyped... it does sound that good._

 

I ordered in Nov 2007,so I have a long wait.
 Thanks for the info!


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *willisv* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_almost forgot - for those having trouble getting through to Xin, make sure you follow the email format on his website to a T. This was noted by someone a few posts back and it really does help._

 

Iv been using Gmail, so im not sure if that casues any time synchronisation issues. But apart from that im sure I followed all other steps (just using a paypal referenc ein header, since I wasnt given a Xin order reference). And am receiving no replies.


----------



## willisv

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Iv been using Gmail, so im not sure if that casues any time synchronisation issues. But apart from that im sure I followed all other steps (just using a paypal referenc ein header, since I wasnt given a Xin order reference). And am receiving no replies._

 

I used paypal to pay also and on the paypal receipt there should be an invoice ID (there was for me anyways) and this is the number that I put in the header as well as my order date and how many months had passed since I ordered. I also put which amp I ordered in the header. Make sure it is plain text and not html, after I did this I got an email a couple of days later. I think that if you follow this format you will hear from him eventually.


----------



## el_monkey

Well folks, after more than 10 months of waiting my Xin Reference amp has finally arrived. Exterior is nothing to brag about--standard Hammond metal case used for the Mini3. The sound without any break-in is very impressive. I read that it needs 300-400 hours of break-in but it sounds great now! I will be putting my Mini3 up for sale because the Reference blows it away.


----------



## Biff Wellington

Joined the 9 month club last week, so I'm hopeful that I'll soon be getting my prize. Here's the kicker though - I ordered a Supermicro IV. So far, it seems to be all Reference. So here's the 2 part question - do I try to change my order or will that move me to the back of the Reference line? Incidental to that, is the Reference a big improvement over the Supermicro?


----------



## jamato8

It refines the Micro. The Micro for its size is excellent and a wonderful piece of work. It is worth having for its size and great sound quality but the Reference further refines it, adds a huge cap, smoothes the highs even more. Well the Reference is another dimension. Email Xin and ask him if you can change your order and to please not lose your place in line. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.


----------



## bunsco

Would someone be so kind as to provide a pic or a link show the size of the reference compared to the RSA Tomahawk - as i've changed my order from the Reference to the Supermicro as i was concern with the size issue.

 I have the tomahawk and find it 'quite' easy to stick into my inside jacket pockets - i'd just like to know how much different having to carry a Reference would be to my Tomahawk.

 If its not jacket pocket friendly - i'll stick with my supermicro order, if it is - well looks like id have to email Xin again and revert to my original order.

 thanx for any help given.


----------



## Aaron622

Just joined the 5 month club today (for the Reference). I had hopes that it wouldn't be this long, but I can't say I'm surprised


----------



## kaushama

The reference is the best portable I have ever listened to. But my upgraded Supermini closely follows the performance of Reference. For its size it is a wonderful amp.


----------



## jamato8

The SuperMini is a great little amp. I don't use it too much but it is my favorite for size and performance though it is not up to the heights of the Reference in SQ but I do not have the latest version of the Mini.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Email Xin and ask him if you can change your order and to please not lose your place in line. Nothing ventured, nothing gained._

 

IF anyone has actually done this and received a reply PLEASE let those of us waiting for product know what Zin had to say on the subject?

 Regards,
 Doug


----------



## hershann

Kinda hard to follow the postings - can I safely say that the April 07 Reference orders are being fulfilled? 

 There must be a whole lot of orders during the August 07 pre-order promotion. Anybody from that August order have received their Reference? 

 her shann


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_IF anyone has actually done this and received a reply PLEASE let those of us waiting for product know what Zin had to say on the subject?

 Regards,
 Doug_

 

I have emailed him twice,and never heard back,he is definitely not very courteous!


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hershann* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Kinda hard to follow the postings - can I safely say that the April 07 Reference orders are being fulfilled? 

 There must be a whole lot of orders during the August 07 pre-order promotion. Anybody from that August order have received their Reference? 

 her shann_

 

nope.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_monkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well folks, after more than 10 months of waiting my Xin Reference amp has finally arrived. Exterior is nothing to brag about--standard Hammond metal case used for the Mini3. The sound without any break-in is very impressive. I read that it needs 300-400 hours of break-in but it sounds great now! I will be putting my Mini3 up for sale because the Reference blows it away. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

can you explain to me what specifically about the Reference 'blows away' the Mini^3?
 i also have a Mini^3 and am awaiting a Reference, but have doubts as to how much of an improvement the Xin amp is going to be. i like what the AD8397 does for the PK1 and RS-2, and am curious about how the Reference compares.


----------



## edwardsean

Kaushama, 

 I also have the latest upgraded Supermini (as of 12/2007). I have the opportunity to trade it for an upgraded Supermicro III (4/2007). I am very interested in that trade because I've always heard comments like John's, that it is the Micro that is closest to the Reference over the Supermini. You have been one of the few that have consistently championed the Supermini. Once again, in comparison to the Reference, you state that the upgraded IV "closely follows" it. This seems consistent with news I heard a while back that Dr. Xin wanted to bring the achievements of the Reference/ Micro to the Macro and Supermini. I am hopeful of this but don't have a Reference or Micro for comparison. 

 Do you think the Supermini has, at last, been brought to parity with the Supermicro, bringing it as close to the Reference? I would really appreciate your help, as it will aid in my decision as to whether I go through with the trade or stay with the Supermini. Either way, I have a Reference on order. I would just like the closest thing to hold me over.


----------



## jamato8

The SuperMicro III is not exactly the same as the latest version.


----------



## jamato8

The RE1E and RE1F are virtually the same boards so there are no sound differences between the two Reference boards. The only change was the black cap that was between the legs of the large cap on the 1E is under the board on the 1F.


----------



## el_monkey

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_can you explain to me what specifically about the Reference 'blows away' the Mini^3?
 i also have a Mini^3 and am awaiting a Reference, but have doubts as to how much of an improvement the Xin amp is going to be. i like what the AD8397 does for the PK1 and RS-2, and am curious about how the Reference compares._

 

The Reference amp has smoother highs than the Mini3 while retaining all the detail. Additionally, the Reference amp has a deeper bass response than the Mini3. I find that the Reference amp provides a sound closer to my Millet Hybrid Portable amp with my Shure ER4s than the Mini3 (which is what I was looking for). The Reference also has a wider soundstage than the Mini3. Bottom line, it better suits my taste or preferences than the Mini3.


----------



## vvs_75

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_monkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Reference amp has smoother highs than the Mini3 while retaining all the detail. Additionally, the Reference amp has a deeper bass response than the Mini3. I find that the Reference amp provides a sound closer to my Millet Hybrid Portable amp with my Shure ER4s than the Mini3 (which is what I was looking for). The Reference also has a wider soundstage than the Mini3. Bottom line, it better suits my taste or preferences than the Mini3. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It is Good news that the reference sound better than the mini^3! The question is: is it three time better than the mini^3?


----------



## jamato8

Why would it have to be 3 times better? Maybe you are joking but that wouldn't make sense unless the 3 was a really bad amp. With designs these days it is hard to put out a bad amp unless you are just careless. Also what is 2 times better or 3 times? Is the depth 3X as wide and 3X as deep? It is very subjective, to a degree and then there are objective points but how do you judge an amp to be even 2X as good and place a value on that at the same time?

 In a way it is like most things, the ultimate value is what the market will bare and that doesn't always mean a quantitative 2 or 3X.


----------



## el_monkey

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvs_75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It is Good news that the reference sound better than the mini^3! The question is: is it three time better than the mini^3?_

 

The mini3 is a great amp. I just happen to like the Reference better and to me it is worth the additional price over the Mini3. Your tastes and price-to-value ratios may be different than mine.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *el_monkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Reference amp has smoother highs than the Mini3 while retaining all the detail. Additionally, the Reference amp has a deeper bass response than the Mini3. I find that the Reference amp provides a sound closer to my Millet Hybrid Portable amp with my Shure ER4s than the Mini3 (which is what I was looking for). The Reference also has a wider soundstage than the Mini3. Bottom line, it better suits my taste or preferences than the Mini3. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

the impressions are appreciated...thanks.
 and i agree that the Mini^3 is a very good amp, at least with my headphones.
 looks like the wait will continue...


----------



## kaushama

I have just heard from Dr. Xin that he has finalized the reference layout. He said 22000UF, will be the final value for the capacity. Apparently both 1E and 1F boards will be the final versions and there is no difference between two.


----------



## etherealbeats

That's interesting to know they are the same. Hopefully now he will go into build mode and start getting those amps out quickly. I have no hope though as I only ordered on Sunday.


----------



## JimP

Returned from a business trip, and surprise package was waiting for me - silver Reference with both 1/4" and 1/8" in and out. No instructions, but I assumed the tiny + and - etched on the inside of back cover indicates battery +/- contact points, flip switch, blue light on, all is good! I literally have 20 minutes on it so far, so no impressions, except I really like the 1/4" plug to run the big phones direct.

 I had for the most part bailed out of portable amps, but I had one of the original supermacros (so must be v.1) just collecting dust that I sent in for trade-in (great policy btw).


----------



## fkclo

Give it 500 hours first - then you may stare at the bigger desktop brothers and wonder what else did they offer than the Reference doesn't 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Enjoy.
 F. Lo


----------



## JimP

fkclo, you have one of these too?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 500 hrs? I do not have the patience. I'm now at ~1 hour mark - sounds pretty sweet already honestly -- FLAC to miniDAC to Reference to HD650 w/RAL (btw, thanks for lending me your HD650 awhile ago, I've now become a Senn-head with 580 and 650 with various cables on order...). I'm very impressed that Reference can handle HD650's quite well, 10 o'clock on volume is plenty loud for me, maybe 11 o'clock for classical. I'll report back after long-term burn-in/listening, but already I think the Reference is truly an engineering marvel given its size. 1/4" plugs just barely fit with volume knob, but I'm not complaining, the fact I can use 1/4" direct is great. Here's a quick photo for team Xin:


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_fkclo, you have one of these too?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 500 hrs? I do not have the patience. I'm now at ~1 hour mark - sounds pretty sweet already honestly -- FLAC to miniDAC to Reference to HD650 w/RAL (btw, thanks for lending me your HD650 awhile ago, I've now become a Senn-head with 580 and 650 with various cables on order...). I'm very impressed that Reference can handle HD650's quite well, 10 o'clock on volume is plenty loud for me, maybe 11 o'clock for classical. I'll report back after long-term burn-in/listening, but already I think the Reference is truly an engineering marvel given its size. 1/4" plugs just barely fit with volume knob, but I'm not complaining, the fact I can use 1/4" direct is great. Here's a quick photo for team Xin:




_

 

Beautiful setup!Can you tell me where you got the lavender cable?Thanks in advance.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_fkclo, you have one of these too?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 500 hrs? I do not have the patience. I'm now at ~1 hour mark - sounds pretty sweet already honestly -- FLAC to miniDAC to Reference to HD650 w/RAL (btw, thanks for lending me your HD650 awhile ago, I've now become a Senn-head with 580 and 650 with various cables on order...). I'm very impressed that Reference can handle HD650's quite well, 10 o'clock on volume is plenty loud for me, maybe 11 o'clock for classical. I'll report back after long-term burn-in/listening, but already I think the Reference is truly an engineering marvel given its size. 1/4" plugs just barely fit with volume knob, but I'm not complaining, the fact I can use 1/4" direct is great. Here's a quick photo for team Xin:_

 

Yep! I have the Reference and the SuperMarco IV (updated Nov 2007). I think I am one of the Xin fans ( having owned 5 of his amps). The Reference is really the most "tube-like" of all his creations - giving a good sense of analogue sound.

 Comparing the Reference to the Pico - I like how the Reference sounds more. Pico displays the characteristics typical of AD8397 amps - fast, energetic, good resolution, and very power efficient - giving you a sense of power and authority. Despite Justin's superb implementation - it still sounds like AD8397 - typical of the earlier generation of Xin amps (who pioneer the use of AD8397 over a year ago).

 The Reference, on the other hand, is liquid, smooth, coherent, resolving, and provide a unique display of the inner details and texture of the music. It does not show off its raw power, but manage to handle everything I throw to it with ease and elegance. And at that price, it is a real steal.

 My current Reference is actually the "second" one I own. It is another story.

 F. Lo


----------



## JimP

Uh...I'm not sure if I like the cable color, but it's signature color for Revelation Audio Labs. I really like this cable single-ended for my HD650, and I had absolutely no problems when I purchased it, however, you may want to google RAL as there seems to be a lot of recent complaints about RAL. Again, in my one and only time that I ordered their products, I had zero problems.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Uh...I'm not sure if I like the cable color, but it's signature color for Revelation Audio Labs. I really like this cable single-ended for my HD650, and I had absolutely no problems when I purchased it, however, you may want to google RAL as there seems to be a lot of recent complaints about RAL. Again, in my one and only time that I ordered their products, I had zero problems._

 

I concur the RAL Paradise is a near perfect match for the HD650. Just as I write, I am having Brad to make me a balanced Paradise for my 2nd pair of HD650. Dump as it may sound, I am also asking him to make me an ultimate USB cable for the Pico - to see if there is something I haven't tapped from this wonderful USB DAC. I have dealt with RAL quite a few times, and despite occasional long wait, have no problems at all with Brad, and indeed has began to admire his top class craftmanship.

 F. Lo


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Uh...I'm not sure if I like the cable color, but it's signature color for Revelation Audio Labs. I really like this cable single-ended for my HD650, and I had absolutely no problems when I purchased it, however, you may want to google RAL as there seems to be a lot of recent complaints about RAL. Again, in my one and only time that I ordered their products, I had zero problems._

 

Thank you for the information!


----------



## jamato8

The Reference, ****here Is the music***** .


----------



## etherealbeats

That means mine is one unit closer to arriving. Woohoo 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I like the silver colour, but I ordered mine with the silver body and the black face and back plate, as I think it looks pretty classy. Well as classy as Xin amps can look.


----------



## Drumonron

1. Any suggestions for cabling from the Benchmark DAC1 USB to the Reference?

 2. Those who've received the reference-when did you order and what was total time from order to delivery?

 Thanks


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fkclo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I concur the RAL Paradise is a near perfect match for the HD650. Just as I write, I am having Brad to make me a balanced Paradise for my 2nd pair of HD650. Dump as it may sound, I am also asking him to make me an ultimate USB cable for the Pico - to see if there is something I haven't tapped from this wonderful USB DAC. I have dealt with RAL quite a few times, and despite occasional long wait, have no problems at all with Brad, and indeed has began to admire his top class craftmanship.

 F. Lo_

 

How does the HD650's work out with your pico?


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How does the HD650's work out with your pico?_

 

As this thread is about Xin's amp I would only reply briefly - the Pico drives the HD650 well - in fact better than expected given its relative small "power" engine. As we all know the HD650 scales extremely well with your components it is just not fair to compare the Pico's performance in driving my HD650 to that of a EAR HP-4, or WA5. But all I can say the HD650 does not shy when hooked to a Pico 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 F. Lo


----------



## DesertInTheShape

why hasnt anyone ripped this guy for not getting the product in a timely manner?


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DesertInTheShape* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why hasnt anyone ripped this guy for not getting the product in a timely manner?_

 

Primarily because it's a capital waste of time, energy and bandwidth. The amps arrive when they arrive. Nothing is apparently gonna change any time soon. It's best to assume Zin's definition of 'timely' is his own and live with it.


----------



## Mr. Tadashi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DesertInTheShape* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why hasnt anyone ripped this guy for not getting the product in a timely manner?_

 

For the most part because those who are willing to wait truly believe in his work being worth the wait and if you pay with credit card he won't charge it until he ships it off.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DesertInTheShape* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why hasnt anyone ripped this guy for not getting the product in a timely manner?_

 

if 'ripped' means complaints, then you can read this thread in its entirety. probably 90% of this thread's contents is about complaining...


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_if 'ripped' means complaints, then you can read this thread in its entirety. probably 90% of this thread's contents is about complaining..._

 

You got that right.


----------



## Frihed89

This is, like, a religious experience? Or maybe anal sex with an elephant?

 Are you guys on pills?


----------



## Drumonron

Thread name: 
 "Those who waiting Xin amp, post and get your date of arrival"

 Should be:
 "Those who waiting Xin amp, post your complaints and vent about how he doesn't answer your emails."

 It's getting a little boring hearing about nonresponses to emails and listen....emailing angry, frustrated, anxiety-stricken, impatient customers is, possibly, a bit of a waste of time? 

 Hey complainers:
 Here's a novel idea....take your angry little posts, read them aloud to yourself whilst recording, xfer digital file to computer-as-transport, amplify that signal to some good cans using something other than the xinamp, and listen to yourself.

 2 pennys of mine


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thread name: 
 "Those who waiting Xin amp, post and get your date of arrival"

 Should be:
 "Those who waiting Xin amp, post your complaints and vent about how he doesn't answer your emails."

 It's getting a little boring hearing about nonresponses to emails and listen....emailing angry, frustrated, anxiety-stricken, impatient customers is, possibly, a bit of a waste of time? 

 Hey complainers:
 Here's a novel idea....take your angry little posts, read them aloud to yourself whilst recording, xfer digital file to computer-as-transport, amplify that signal to some good cans using something other than the xinamp, and listen to yourself.

 2 pennys of mine_

 

My dear Drumonron: don't you know misery loves company??? And with all the miserable people, there is TONS of company. I, for one, gave up, but continue to read this thread like one who vicariously watches a train wreck. Nothin' you can do about it but sit back and observe


----------



## Jaw007

I will be moving in a couple months.
 I had emailed Xin several times wanting him to send me my order to my post office box.I don't want him to send it to my billing address which is where I will be moving from.I would like to know if he read my emails.I dont want the reference to get lost,and my card being charged if it does in fact get lost.He owes a person the curteosy to acknowledge something as important as this.Shame on XIN


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will be moving in a couple months.
 I had emailed Xin several times wanting him to send me my order to my post office box.I don't want him to send it to my billing address which is where I will be moving from.I would like to know if he read my emails.I dont want the reference to get lost,and my card being charged if it does in fact get lost.He owes a person the curteosy to acknowledge something as important as this.Shame on XIN_

 

In the World of Xin, y0u're supposed to cancel the move, cancel your life, and wait until eternity nears to hear from the Great and Wonderful Xin that you're amplifier is in the mail.

 reminds me of Dorothy and the Wizard.

 Cancel the silly thing, buy from someone who delivers in a week or so and fuggedaboudit


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In the World of Xin, y0u're supposed to cancel the move, cancel your life, and wait until eternity nears to hear from the Great and Wonderful Xin that you're amplifier is in the mail.

 reminds me of Dorothy and the Wizard.

 Cancel the silly thing, buy from someone who delivers in a week or so and fuggedaboudit
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I already have a pico comming in a few weeks.


----------



## aluren

i used to be one of the complainers but eventually just grew out of being frustrated. now i'm to the point where i don't even care about xin amps anymore and just wait to be surprised by xin from an email or an amp in my mail box.... but of course, i have a beta reference amp, so i guess that's part of the reason why i don't care as much as others...


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Frihed89* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is, like, a religious experience? Or maybe anal sex with an elephant?

 Are you guys on pills?_

 

LOL.....This is original! Thanks for the laugh.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_LOL.....This is original! Thanks for the laugh._

 

yeah its hilarious, glad to see the thread has come to this. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 anyone got any news on amps recieved other than refs, havent heard anyone getting a supermini for ages, or maybe i have just missed it.


----------



## Nuwidol

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_anyone got any news on amps recieved other than refs, havent heard anyone getting a supermini for ages, or maybe i have just missed it._

 

Thats what i'm interested in too. 

 I'm just waiting for my micro


----------



## mark_h

Is there any point ordering one?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thats what i'm interested in too. 

 I'm just waiting for my micro 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

hey there! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 when did you order your micro - are you a many monther?


----------



## hershann

Since it is so hard to keep track of Xin Amps delivery date and how long people have been waiting - let's create a list.

 All you have to do is to block copy the text of this message and add on your info.

 It will be broken down into subheadings of months when you first made the order (not for upgrades) - list your name under that subheading and indicate the date when you receive your amp.
 (Example 
xxx 07
 abc Reference
 ccc Supermicro
 xxx Reference- Received 01 Jan 08)

 You get the Idea. Since nobody know how Xin decides on sending out which order first - it would not be surprising if some gets their order even though they ordered later - let's try to keep this thread as pleasant as possible by not expressing your anger / frustration / disappointment publicly or directed against another head-fier that happened to be luckier than you
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Let me start.

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07

July 07

August 07

September 07

October 07

November 07
 hershann Reference

December 07

January 08


----------



## ath

I am still waiting for Xin to upgrade my supermini sent in April 07. Don't expect to receive it for a few more months. 

 I am enjoying my pico for now


----------



## Drumonron

I'll do my part...thanks Hershann, good idea and format:

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07

July 07

August 07

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

January 08


----------



## gp_hebert

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07

July 07

August 07
 gp_hebert Reference

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

January 08


----------



## musicmaker

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07

July 07

August 07
 gp_hebert Reference

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

January 08


----------



## PhaedrusX

i'm curious as to how the members on the list payed for their amps.
 is Xin giving priority to those who have already sent payment via PayPal? if not, then it looks like he's just drawing names out of a hat...


----------



## etherealbeats

Hehe, beat that people.


*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07

July 07

August 07
 gp_hebert Reference

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

December 07

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference


----------



## kokohore

Ordered supermini in early March 07, payed via paypal, and still waiting... 10+months.


----------



## vandread

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07

 July 07

 August 07
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference


 So..... it's already over 5 months...... never mind


----------



## GUNS

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference


----------



## Quaddy

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

 June 07

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

December 07

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference

 * _cant people even follow instructions_? - i had to reformat it to the original. makes it easier to read!


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i'm curious as to how the members on the list payed for their amps.
 is Xin giving priority to those who have already sent payment via PayPal? if not, then it looks like he's just drawing names out of a hat..._

 

maybe we should include that after our handle and model of amp

 for example PP or CC!

 easy enough

 i paid by credit card in august 07.


----------



## som4ew

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07
 som4ew super Micro

 July 07

 August 07
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference

 I sent Super Macro Maxout & Reference for upgrade+SuperMini on order
 all on early June,All upgraded amps were back in early December but SuperMicro.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *som4ew* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference

 I sent Super Macro Maxout & Reference for upgrade+SuperMini on order
 all on early June,All upgraded amps were back in early December but SuperMini._

 

what are you doing?, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 you are supposed to take the last posted block text, eg. mine above and add your details to it.

 now some entries arent in it. gee whizz.

 here let me get that for you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07
 som4ew super mini

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference


----------



## Jaw007

I keep getting this when I try to add to the list.

 The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 1 characters.


----------



## Pokato

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07

June 07
 som4ew super mini

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

December 07

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference

_Almost_ 6 months...


----------



## Jaw007

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference


----------



## scim

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## fl00r

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## viator36

Month of Order of *Xin* Amp
 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## DennyL

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference
 Drumonron Supermicro IV
 Drumonron Supermacro LE

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Drumonron

*Month of Order of Xin Amp*
April 07

May 07
 viator36 Reference

June 07
 som4ew super mini

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## jpnz

Month of Order of Xin Amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Month of Order of Xin Amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference_

 

Whoa...all the way back to March 07...Yikes!!


----------



## sbulack

Month of Order of Xin Amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super mini

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## som4ew

Quote:


 Month of Order of Xin Amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference
 ________________ 
 

Edit from SuperMini to SuperMicro


----------



## lisnalee

Month of Order of Xin Amp

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC

September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## gp_hebert

Month of Order of Xin Amp

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC

September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## mp101

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP
July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 mp101 Reference CC

September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Aaron622

Month of Order of Xin Amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## el_monkey

[Post deleted -- misunderstood intent of prior postings.]


----------



## _j_

Month of Order of Xin Amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## leftnose

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## fallen.angel

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *leftnose* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference_

 

My ordered added


----------



## vvs_75

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference CC

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## ljs

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## hershann

BTW can head-fiers that have already received their amp kindly input their date of receipt. We promise we won't bite or raid your home for it
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Ryman

Date of order of Xin amp:

 March 30, 2007
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal


----------



## Drumonron

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


 **Pasted Ryman into correct format**


----------



## Kabeer

*Month of order of Xin amp*
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## mp101

Default
 Month of order of Xin amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP

 May 07
 viator36 Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## dle4e_2005

Default
 Month of order of Xin amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## tom2517

I ordered mine in Jan., got it in May, send it back in May because it came defective, got it back in Dec. I have macro IV.


----------



## wolfB

Default
 Month of order of Xin amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## tbmusic

Default
 Month of order of Xin amp
 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Sanddancer

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Happymonkey

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## srikeerthi

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## vexeus

Month of order of Xin amp

March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC

April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference

June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

July 07

August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC

October 07
 musicmaker Reference

November 07
 hershann Reference CC

December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## kokohore

Month of order of Xin amp

March 07
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP

September 07
 kokohore Reference PP

 I don't see any date of receipt... does it mean that nobody in the list received the amp yet?

_Edit; have been cut down. For the full list, pls see the newer posts._


----------



## sfflyfish

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## shiezan

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## zeckwsr

Month of order of Xin amp

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC
 zeckwsr supermicro IV CC 1st/March

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## Kabeer

I think a moderator should remove some of the previous order lists, since its just makind the thread more bloated, right?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think a moderator should remove some of the previous order lists, since its just makind the thread more bloated, right?_

 

i guess, either that or each user could edit out their entire post, apart from the last one, all sounds like too much work, i guess most people will simply skip to last page anyway!


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think a moderator should remove some of the previous order lists, since its just makind the thread more bloated, right?_

 

X2


----------



## BushGuy

ditto - to me, they're nonsensical.........as are aprox. 50% of all of the posts in this thread.


----------



## ljs

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ditto - to me, they're nonsensical.........as are aprox. 50% of all of the posts in this thread._

 

As long as those posts are kept in here and dont get out in yet another xin-where-art-thou-topic, it's ok to me


----------



## aluren

yeah i gotta agree. everything about xin is nonsensical anyways (except the actual amps)...


----------



## Drumonron

No one has received any Xin amps??
 I find this hard to digest.

 Please folks, if you've received a Xin amp would you be
 so kind as to post this. 

 Thanks


----------



## souperman

I got an e-mail cancellation from him. That's a first step 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## jpnz

I think Xin's Business is finished after this last batch.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think Xin's Business is finished after this last batch._

 

What do you mean?


----------



## jpnz

Because new head-fi members will be told that the waiting time is stretched to 1 year or more what will hold them off. It used to be 3 months or so that was acceptable then, because then Xin was absolute top-tier. Now there are more and more good alternatives. Same situation with Larocco.


----------



## gp_hebert

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jpnz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Because new head-fi members will be told that the waiting time is stretched to 1 year or more what will hold them off._

 

Well, if people stop buying from him, he'll ship amps faster and people will start buying from him again...

  Quote:


 that was acceptable then, because then Xin was absolute top-tier. Now there are more and more good alternatives. 
 

Did you ever listen to a Xin amp to say that he's not in the "top-tier" amp builders anymore?


----------



## Gatsu

Add me to the list.

 I ordered a Reference just before the price increase, the payment email from Paypal is marked as 8th of October 2007.

 It was such a good exchange rate that day


----------



## jpnz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *gp_hebert* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, if people stop buying from him, he'll ship amps faster and people will start buying from him again...

 Did you ever listen to a Xin amp to say that he's not in the "top-tier" amp builders anymore?_

 

Still is one of the best, only other amp builders have at least leveled with the quality of Xin. But supermicro will still be something unique for a very long time.

 Damnit Xin, i want my supermicro 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, waiting almost 10 months now..


----------



## shiezan

They haven't equaled with him.

 No other amp builder has been able to rival the tube sound of the supermicro yet, and the reference is still #1 in every amp comparison out there.

 Only if you consider the hassle with the waiting times can the other amps even be considered 
 in the same league as that of the reference.


 Dr. Xin might be reading these forums and most likely will dive into another 5329 year research plan if he loses confidence in his amps.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No other amp builder has been able to rival the tube sound of the supermicro yet, and the reference is still #1 in every amp comparison out there._

 

Err no it isn't; read Skylab's review? The reference is #1 in the comparison of the guy who got a beta reference back in, what, March-May 2007 (not even the shipping version). Relatively few people have received the shipping reference from what I've read.

 No, I haven't heard it either. I cancelled my order when there was no end in sight (early Nov, when everything was shipping by Thanksgiving). Apparently not much has changed.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Err no it isn't; read Skylab's review? The reference is #1 in the comparison of the guy who got a beta reference back in, what, March-May 2007 (not even the shipping version). Relatively few people have received the shipping reference from what I've read.

 No, I haven't heard it either. I cancelled my order when there was no end in sight (early Nov, when everything was shipping by Thanksgiving). Apparently not much has changed._

 

with all due respect, stating one source, skylab in this instance isnt a satisfactory counter to his point.

 also, the shipping reference is hardly likely to be worse sounding than the betas IMO, especially going on xins past form. besides whos to say the OP wasnt meaning that the references in the reviews he has seen were obviously beta units, thats not in dispute. if they are that good as betas. bring on the production models.

 your post comes across as someone who is bitter toward all current xin orderers/queuees, as you have stopped yours. cancellers remorse?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_with all due respect, stating one source, skylab in this instance isnt a satisfactory counter to his point.

 also, the shipping reference is hardly likely to be worse sounding than the betas IMO, especially going on xins past form. besides whos to say the OP wasnt meaning that the references in the reviews he has seen were obviously beta units, thats not in dispute. if they are that good as betas. bring on the production models.

 your post comes across as someone who is bitter toward all current xin orderers/queuees, as you have stopped yours. cancellers remorse?_

 

Last time I took logic, to disprove the statement EVERY you only had to provide one counter example. Done and the #1 statement is hype. 

 As far as the statements in the middle paragraph, well, I should certainly hope so. That is pretty much what has to happen to run a successful business. 

 There's no remorse canceling my order. Sitting on a list didn't improve my listening experience. Am I bitter about waiting on a list for a few months? Nope, it wasn't the end of the world.


----------



## JwangSDC

Just put my order in....I'm correct in thinking my CC wont' be charged till he ships? I ordered both the reference and the micro and hope to have them by sept...



 Thank you. Your order has been successfully processed. 
 Order number : 39932654


----------



## jamato8

He won't charge until they ship.


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Month of order of Xin amp

March 07
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP

September 07
 kokohore Reference PP

 I don't see any date of receipt... does it mean that nobody in the list received the amp yet?

Edit; have been cut down. For the full list, pls see the newer posts._

 

I've read in posts that some have received amps but *sigh*...I don't get the lack of contribution from these people...jamato8 I believe was one such recipient and he is usually ready with a quick post regarding Xin amps *sigh*...


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've read in posts that some have received amps but *sigh*...I don't get the lack of contribution from these people...jamato8 I believe was one such recipient and he is usually ready with a quick post regarding Xin amps *sigh*...





_

 

Xin is his friend.Go figure!


----------



## el_monkey

For what it is worth, I updated to show my receipt:

 February 07
 el_monkey (SupermicroIV -> Reference) *Received January 08*

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC
 zeckwsr supermicro IV CC 1st/March

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin is his friend.Go figure!_

 

Xin's probably a nice guy in real life.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin's probably a nice guy in real life._

 

Probably so!If he does all of his sodering and building,and being a rocket scientist,he is an extremely busy man.


----------



## JwangSDC

February 07
 el_monkey (SupermicroIV -> Reference) *Received January 08*

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC
 zeckwsr supermicro IV CC 1st/March

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference
 JwangSDC Reference and SuperMicro IV CC


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've read in posts that some have received amps but *sigh*...I don't get the lack of contribution from these people...jamato8 I believe was one such recipient and he is usually ready with a quick post regarding Xin amps *sigh*...




_

 

I don't understand your post.


----------



## rohanjd

February 07
 el_monkey (SupermicroIV -> Reference) Received January 08

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC
 zeckwsr supermicro IV CC 1st/March

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC
 rohanjd: SuperMicro-IV

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference
 JwangSDC Reference and SuperMicro IV CC


----------



## Drumonron

Thanks for updating your post El_monkey.
 :Xinampsmile:


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't understand your post._

 

Jamato8...please go back and read my post again in the context that it was meant...it was a quote response speaking to the fact that noone has ever received a xinamp(according to the list created).

 Nothing personal intended but I was under the impression, from previous posts of yours, that perhaps you've received a Xinamp and it would be nice if you could give us your date of order and receipt of said amp.


----------



## fkclo

Just want to jam in hear : I ordered a SuperMacro IV upgrade back in May 2007, a Xin Reference in July 2007, changed my requirement for the Reference in Sept 2007 (wanted 1/4" jack), and get both in December 2007.

 I guess many of us did received the amp, but not all posted / updated to this effect.

 F. Lo


----------



## JimP

OK I have to admit, I have refrained from posting, as I'm baffled by this cumulative list vs. my own experience (and I did not want to incite a riot):

 Long time ago (I forget when), I purchased a supermacro v.1. That was simple transaction then, I don't recall any undue waiting. Haven't used the SMv1 very much lately, it was just collecting dust in a drawer. Because of Xin's generous trade-in policy, I sent it in right before Christmas to trade for a new Reference, paypal'ed the upgrade cost. Based on what was posted here on HF, I expected to wait at least six months in the queue.

 Lo and behold, I get an email message 2nd week of January that my Reference has shipped, which I've had in my possession now for the last 2 weeks. 

 So I may have the shortest timeframe from ordering (actually upgrading) and receipt of the Reference -- *3 weeks.
*
 Please don't ask me how or why. I do not have any special connection to Xin, or explanation. In the span of 2 years, I've interacted twice (original SM order and the upgrade to Reference). Communication via email was bare minimum.

 I feel lucky, and from my experience and use of actual product, am a huge fan of Xin. I am also sympathetic to those who have been waiting a long time for theirs (I'm perplexed as you are).


----------



## Pokato

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OK I have to admit, I have refrained from posting, as I'm baffled by this cumulative list vs. my own experience (and I did not want to incite a riot):

 Long time ago (I forget when), I purchased a supermacro v.1. That was simple transaction then, I don't recall any undue waiting. Haven't used the SMv1 very much lately, it was just collecting dust in a drawer. Because of Xin's generous trade-in policy, I sent it in right before Christmas to trade for a new Reference, paypal'ed the upgrade cost. Based on what was posted here on HF, I expected to wait at least six months in the queue.

 Lo and behold, I get an email message 2nd week of January that my Reference has shipped, which I've had in my possession now for the last 2 weeks. 

 So I may have the shortest timeframe from ordering (actually upgrading) and receipt of the Reference -- *3 weeks.
*
 Please don't ask me how or why. I do not have any special connection to Xin, or explanation. In the span of 2 years, I've interacted twice (original SM order and the upgrade to Reference). Communication via email was bare minimum.

 I feel lucky, and from my experience and use of actual product, am a huge fan of Xin. I am also sympathetic to those who have been waiting a long time for theirs (I'm perplexed as you are)._

 

LOL....how come I got the feeling that Dr.Xin is keeping track of all the emails we sent him, and this thread...and the more we emailed/posted, the longer is the wait?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OK I have to admit, I have refrained from posting, as I'm baffled by this cumulative list vs. my own experience (and I did not want to incite a riot):_

 

Some may be upset about it but thanks for the info. I'd be more inclined to resubmit an order having a general idea how many he's recently shipped out and what his backlog is. Knowing what's been shipped (10 a week/10 a month/10 a quarter) at least gives some approximation when an order might be filled absent any updates from him.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OK I have to admit, I have refrained from posting, as I'm baffled by this cumulative list vs. my own experience (and I did not want to incite a riot):

 Long time ago (I forget when), I purchased a supermacro v.1. That was simple transaction then, I don't recall any undue waiting. Haven't used the SMv1 very much lately, it was just collecting dust in a drawer. Because of Xin's generous trade-in policy, I sent it in right before Christmas to trade for a new Reference, paypal'ed the upgrade cost. Based on what was posted here on HF, I expected to wait at least six months in the queue.

 Lo and behold, I get an email message 2nd week of January that my Reference has shipped, which I've had in my possession now for the last 2 weeks. 

 So I may have the shortest timeframe from ordering (actually upgrading) and receipt of the Reference -- *3 weeks.
*
 Please don't ask me how or why. I do not have any special connection to Xin, or explanation. In the span of 2 years, I've interacted twice (original SM order and the upgrade to Reference). Communication via email was bare minimum.

 I feel lucky, and from my experience and use of actual product, am a huge fan of Xin. I am also sympathetic to those who have been waiting a long time for theirs (I'm perplexed as you are)._

 

I'm glad somebody got there's soon,happy for you.I have patience myself.
 enjoy your masterpiece.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JimP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So I may have the shortest timeframe from ordering (actually upgrading) and receipt of the Reference -- *3 weeks.
*
 Please don't ask me how or why. I do not have any special connection to Xin, or explanation. In the span of 2 years, I've interacted twice (original SM order and the upgrade to Reference). Communication via email was bare minimum.

 I feel lucky, and from my experience and use of actual product, am a huge fan of Xin. I am also sympathetic to those who have been waiting a long time for theirs (I'm perplexed as you are)._

 

JimP - I do think Xin take loyalty seriously. As you are one of his customers back in the SuperMacro v1 days, and hang on to the unit until now, Xin must have been touched by you enough to put you on top of the waiting list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Great and love to hear your impressions on the Reference.

 F. Lo


----------



## Drumonron

It seems that Xin has loyalty to the older customers and that is an admirable character trait. Those that received thanks for posting, I appreciate hearing your story. It makes me more patient and understanding.


----------



## Drumonron

February 07
 el_monkey (SupermicroIV -> Reference) Received January 08

 March 07
 jpnz supermicro IV
 _j_ supermicro IV
 Ryman: SuperMacro LE...Paypal
 Sanddancer SuperMicro IV CC
 Srikeerthi SuperMicro IV CC
 vexeus SuperMicro IV CC
 kokohore SuperMini IV PP
 shiezan Reference CC
 zeckwsr supermicro IV CC 1st/March

 April 07
 ljs (SupermicroIV -> Reference)
 Kabeer: Supermicro IV 02/04/07 PP
 wolfB: SupermicroIV -> Reference

 May 07
 viator36 Reference
 dle4e_2005 SuperMicro CC
 tbmusic: Supermicro -> Reference
 sfflyfish SuperMicro (2) CC
 rohanjd: SuperMicro-IV

 June 07
 som4ew super micro
 mp101 supermini, changed to supermicro PP

 July 07

 August 07
 GUNS Reference
 gp_hebert Reference CC
 sbulack Reference PP
 vandread Reference
 Quaddy Reference CC
 Pokato Reference CC
 Lisnalee Reference CC
 Aaron622 Reference CC
 leftnose SuperMicro IV CC
 mp101 Reference CC

 September 07
 DennyL Reference
 Drumonron Reference CC-----canceled on 1/28/08
 Drumonron Supermicro IV CC--canceled on 1/28/08
 Drumonron Supermacro LE CC-canceled on 1/28/08
 fallen.angel Reference CC
 Happymonkey Reference CC
 kokohore Reference PP

 October 07
 musicmaker Reference

 November 07
 hershann Reference CC

 December 07
 Jaw007 Reference CC
 Fl00r Reference CC
 vvs_75 Reference

 January 08
 etherealbeats Reference
 scim Reference
 JwangSDC Reference and SuperMicro IV CC

 update: I canceled my Xin order to focus more on home audio. I put the funds towards a headamp GS-1. Wish you all the best on your Xinamps-you'll get them faster now, I hope.


----------



## spamdie

Agh. The only thing i hate. Is I recall placing an order. But no confirmation e-mail was sent. It takes so long for everything to happen I have no idea what credit card will be charged because all my numbers changed again.

 I with he invested into some help in production/order processing.


----------



## musicmaker

My credit card number changed and I updated via his website. Sent emails to ensure new number will be used, but no response as usual. I've given up emailing the guy. This is the first and last product I will buy from him, assuming I don't cancel my order. Craziness !


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My credit card number changed and I updated via his website. Sent emails to ensure new number will be used, but no response as usual. I've given up emailing the guy. This is the first and last product I will buy from him, assuming I don't cancel my order. Craziness !_

 

X2


----------



## lisnalee

I updated my cc details in dec, so hopefully when it comes to shipping mine he'll use the new ones.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is the first and last product I will buy from him, assuming I don't cancel my order. Craziness !_

 

assuming its the reference you ordered it should be the first and last amp you will ever need anyway!


----------



## itsborken

Hahahahaha Musicmaker should be so lucky to get away with a 'first and only' port amp purchase. That is so against the general head-fi experience. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've owned 7 portables and haven't been here a year yet. It's not about getting to the destination, it's the journey that builds appreciation.


----------



## JarodL1

Coming up on 10 months now. There is no/excuse or reason to justify this kind of delay. If you think it is part of some kind of "experience", sorry but you're an idiot; it is nothing more then a horrible way to run a business.


----------



## musicmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_assuming its the reference you ordered it should be the first and last amp you will ever need anyway! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Good to hear and yes I ordered the reference. Although some of the recent reviews rate other competing portables (such as iQube, Pico, PRII etc) higher. I already have a PRII mkII and absolutely love it to pieces. Waiting to hear what the Xin Reference is all about.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hahahahaha Musicmaker should be so lucky to get away with a 'first and only' port amp purchase. That is so against the general head-fi experience. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've owned 7 portables and haven't been here a year yet. It's not about getting to the destination, it's the journey that builds appreciation._

 

I said first and last product I'll buy from Xin. This isnt my first and only amp. Especially given the insane wait times. I don't plan on giving someone that doesn't show the courtesy of acknowledging customer emails my business anymore, however great his products are. I've spend enough money of portables, home amps, headphones, sources, dacs, cables etc etc. But its fun and I love head-fi. It's become a part of my life.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Good to hear and yes I ordered the reference. Although some of the recent reviews rate other competing portables (such as iQube, Pico, PRII etc) higher. I already have a PRII mkII and absolutely love it to pieces. Waiting to hear what the Xin Reference is all about.



 I said first and last product I'll buy from Xin. This isnt my first and only amp. Especially given the insane wait times. I don't plan on giving someone that doesn't show the courtesy of acknowledging customer emails my business anymore, however great his products are. I've spend enough money of portables, home amps, headphones, sources, dacs, cables etc etc. But its fun and I love head-fi. It's become a part of my life._

 

X2


----------



## tk3

At Xin's it's so quiet again that you can hear the tumbleweeds fly by.
 Makes one wonder what he is doing, since we had information that the design of the Reference was finalized.

 The optimist in me would hope that he's working on his orders at full speed to get them all out and isn't wasting time on responding to email.
 The pessimist thinks that he's not concerned with the amps at all, and is doing whatever he does when he is not building amplifiers.

 Hm. :|


----------



## Kabeer

EDIT: lol removed piccy, soz.


----------



## itsborken

brutal!


----------



## Kabeer

Lol, theres a fair chance im never getting my amp now :'(

 Sorry Dr. Xin!!


----------



## Drumonron

It's getting ugly in hear....but I can't help coming onto this thread for a laugh! It's the rubber necking thing.


----------



## evilking

*2400 posts!*

 I wouldn't be proud of a thread like this.

 Nearly two and a half _thousand_ posts, spanning 1 and a half _years!_

 No signs of improvement either. I read a post a couple pages back, someone ordered a SuperMacro Jan 07, recieved it May 07, turned out defective, returned it May 07, then recieved the replacement _December_ 07!

 Shouldn't this thread be sticky?



 Good luck to all with outstanding orders.






 EK


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ it is nothing more then a horrible way to run a business._

 

Not to single any one out here. The quote above was just the closest one I found.

 All the posters crying about Zin running his 'business' poorly might want to consider that possibly (obviously?) Zin is not running a business within the customary definition of the word?

 I mean Really! How obvious can it be that he doesn't pursue this venture for money? (Which I strongly doubt he needs?) Are not most actual businesses founded on ultimately exchanging something for cash.

 Since unless one uses Paypal, Zin receives zero income until he sends you an amp. This makes it glaringly apparent the cash flow aspect of his 'business' is at the bottom of Zin's totem pole. Is it not logical to then assume that Zin does what he does because it satisfies him in a way peculiar to Zin?


----------



## Jalo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Not to single any one out here. The quote above was just the closest one I found.

 All the posters crying about Zin running his 'business' poorly might want to consider that possibly (obviously?) Zin is not running a business within the customary definition of the word?

 I mean Really! How obvious can it be that he doesn't pursue this venture for money? (Which I strongly doubt he needs?) Are not most actual businesses founded on ultimately exchanging something for cash.

 Since unless one uses Paypal, Zin receives zero income until he sends you an amp. This makes it glaringly apparent the cash flow aspect of his 'business' is at the bottom of Zin's totem pole. Is it not logical to then assume that Zin does what he does because it satisfies him in a way peculiar to Zin?_

 

Regardless whether Xin makes any dime out of this exercise or not, or whether he treats this exercise as a business or not, there is some inherent and basic business moral and ethic ones has to ahere to in running a business. Even if Xin does not take a dime from customers that placed order with him (which we know is not true for those who pay with Paypal), he has no right to toil with customers emotion to the extend manifested in these threads. Given what have been described in these threads (relentlessly and uncessantly working and reworking on a model or design and obvious avoidant behaviors via his inability to response to customers inquiries), Xin has definitely manifested enough tendency of OCD (Obessive compulsive disorder)-a disorder of fear and anxiety that render a person utterly unproductive. 
 If it is indeed the case, this thread could go on for another two years until Xin someone put some anafranil in his coffee. Have fun waiting.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jalo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Regardless whether Xin makes any dime out of this exercise or not, or whether he treats this exercise as a business or not, there is some inherent and basic business moral and ethic ones has to ahere to in running a business. Even if Xin does not take a dime from customers that placed order with him (which we know is not true for those who pay with Paypal), he has no right to toil with customers emotion to the extend manifested in these threads. Given what have been described in these threads (relentlessly and uncessantly working and reworking on a model or design and obvious avoidant behaviors via his inability to response to customers inquiries), Xin has definitely manifested enough tendency of OCD (Obessive compulsive disorder)-a disorder of fear and anxiety that render a person utterly unproductive. 
 If it is indeed the case, this thread could go on for another two years until Xin someone put some anafranil in his coffee. Have fun waiting._

 

Yeah, OCD makes sense, as he doesn't strike me as a savant with Asperger Syndrome...


----------



## vvs_75

I understand all frustrations since I am in the same boat, BUT….

 He is making them look like alone and it’s very slow. He has lots off orders and he is fullfilling them when he has time for it.

 As for not for responding to emails. Would you be very happy if he responds on all your emails like:

 "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!”

 So forget about the amp and enjoy your music! The *Day* will come eventually.


----------



## musicmaker

He knows his workload and expected delivery timeframe on your order. A response acknowledging a customer's email with an ETA is a good starting point.

 Ignoring emails, I'm sorry is just pathetic !



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvs_75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 As for not for responding to emails. Would you be very happy if he responds on all your emails like:

 "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!”

 So forget about the amp and enjoy your music! The *Day* will come eventually. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvs_75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I understand all frustrations since I am in the same boat, BUT….

 He is making them look like alone and it’s very slow. He has lots off orders and he is fullfilling them when he has time for it.

 As for not for responding to emails. Would you be very happy if he responds on all your emails like:

 "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!”

 So forget about the amp and enjoy your music! The *Day* will come eventually. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

How do you KNOW he has "lots of orders"? With absolutely no communication maybe he has 50--maybe he has 500. Who knows??? Also, how large is this community and what percentage of it is ordering his particular amplifier selections??

 Betcha ray samuels has lots more orders to fill. Maybe Jan Meier, altho don't know his products.

 Would agree with everyone who says at least a one line email would keep everyone happy


----------



## Jalo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvs_75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 As for not for responding to emails. Would you be very happy if he responds on all your emails like:

 "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!”_

 

I think you miss the entire point. The point is not whether ones will be happy with the above response. The point remains that Xin has an obligation to his customers. If you are being pursue by a police, it is your obligation to stop driving. Whether you have a valid excuse to keep driving or not is besides the point. Or if you go to a restaurant and order some dishes, it is the restaurant's obligation to serve you at a timely manner. To keep you waiting for hours without giving you an explanation is a vialation of normal accepted business practice. And if the restaurant gives you an excuss the they only have one chef etc, that doesn't make it right to keep the customer waiting for hours. This is especially true when Xin continues to keep his website open for ordering. For example, TriadAudio stops taking orders for the Lisa III when they run out of inventories and you won't hear any complaints about their practice. Xin should at least let his customers knows at the time of ordering that it will be a year before order is ship etc. 

 And if he does let his customers know "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!” Then it becomes the term of his sales and we have no qualms about his practice. It is very much like ordering a new car that won't be out for 6-9 months, but the wait is fine because it is expected. The issue here is not the wait, it is his business practice. Unless you do not take customers orders, and sometimes money, but once you took the order and/or money, then you incur an obligation to your customers. It isn't that hard to understand, or is it?


----------



## fl00r

Over 2400 posts about a product people don't even own 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Xin still exercises many minds!

 Good luck to you all.


----------



## sfflyfish

Today brings us the insistence that Xin must play by *"inherent and basic business moral and ethic"* rules regarding the way he operates? Then follows the proposal that because he doesn't it must be the manifestation of a psychological disorder? Now that's hilarious.

 Ouch! My right elbow hurts? Could I get an diagnosis via this thread as to what might be causing this discomfort? 

 If one stops trying to attach a conventional 'business' label on what Xin does any frustration caused by the experienced waiting times simply goes away. 

 If you can; simply wrap your head around the FACT that Xin is NOT running a 'business.' But rather he is doing what makes him happy in his own way, then generously, albeit slowly sharing his developments with those who might be interested.

 I'll say one thing for the good Dr. Xin. he has certainly b*tch slapped the egocentric concept of "I want it NOW cause it's all about me."

 At this stage of waiting (9 Mos.) I'm weirdly fascinated by his consistent and persistent silence. It says a multiple of things to me:
 "Shut up and be patient."
 "You'll get your amp when it's ready."
 "Get over it or get used to it."

 While one is waiting for something for Xin, time still goes on. It would be better to find some other way to pass that time. The endless rants regarding whether or not Xin operates within the boundaries of 'normal' or 'conventional' were long ago proven to be pointless because absolutely nothing has so far, or likely will ever, change.

 Adoption of that mind set would snatch this thread back to it's original subject in moments, not years.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jalo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Regardless whether Xin makes any dime out of this exercise or not, or whether he treats this exercise as a business or not, there is some inherent and basic business moral and ethic ones has to ahere to in running a business. Even if Xin does not take a dime from customers that placed order with him (which we know is not true for those who pay with Paypal), he has no right to toil with customers emotion to the extend manifested in these threads. Given what have been described in these threads (relentlessly and uncessantly working and reworking on a model or design and obvious avoidant behaviors via his inability to response to customers inquiries), Xin has definitely manifested enough tendency of OCD (Obessive compulsive disorder)-a disorder of fear and anxiety that render a person utterly unproductive. 
 If it is indeed the case, this thread could go on for another two years until Xin someone put some anafranil in his coffee. Have fun waiting._


----------



## sfflyfish

*"The point remains that Xin has an obligation to his customers."* 
 I'm afraid it is you who has missed the point. You continue to argue from the point of view that Zin is running a business. Obviously he is NOT. Thus, if he has no business he has no customers. He only has those who are interested in acquiring one of his amps.

*"If you are being pursue by a police, it is your obligation to stop driving. Whether you have a valid excuse to keep driving or not is besides the point."*
 What the ****** does this have to do with anything going on here? The cops have authority (and guns too). Xin's just a guy making amps? Apples to Oranges.

*Or if you go to a restaurant and order some dishes, it is the restaurant's obligation to serve you at a timely manner. To keep you waiting for hours without giving you an explanation is a vialation of normal accepted business practice.*
 Clearly you have never had the opportunity to dine in a restaurant in rural Mexico. I've waited for quite some time without any notification that the chef had to go out to buy what he needed to prepare my order. It's just the way things are sometimes and one soon learns to get to a chosen restaurant long before they are REALLY hungry.

*This is especially true when Xin continues to keep his website open for ordering.*
*The issue here is not the wait, it is his business practice. Unless you do not take customers orders, and sometimes money, but once you took the order and/or money, then you incur an obligation to your customers. It isn't that hard to understand, or is it?*

 If you stop the misguided labeling of Xin's occupation as a 'business', what he does in pursuing this occupation as a 'business practice' and those of us who would like to own one of his amps as 'customers' it is EASY to understand. It's not a business, period. It's an occupation of his time, the results of which he will share with others in a fashion satisfactory to only Xin, No more. No less. Thus, Xin gets to make the rules and we can choose to play by them or not.

 Further, I doubt many who have ordered an amp from Xin didn't know that Xin is/was a bit eccentric or there could be a wait of indeterminable length. it's not like they are on a shelf at Wal-Mart. You have to do some research to first discover the man and his amps even exist. Most of us ordering them already knew what was up. (Or soon learn!) It seems (to me anyway) it's the "It's ALL about ME and I want my stuff NOW!" crowd that doth protest too much.

 As far as Paypal goes It is not Xin's fault they immediately snatch your cash. That gripe has to be taken up with Paypal. Could it be Xin offers the option because there are still folks who are unwilling or unable to supply a credit card number which forestalls paying until he has their amp is ready to ship? 

 BTW, this is all in good fun as I slowly wend my way to the magic 50 posts so I can unload stuff in the For Sale forums?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jalo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think you miss the entire point. The point is not whether ones will be happy with the above response. The point remains that Xin has an obligation to his customers. If you are being pursue by a police, it is your obligation to stop driving. Whether you have a valid excuse to keep driving or not is besides the point. Or if you go to a restaurant and order some dishes, it is the restaurant's obligation to serve you at a timely manner. To keep you waiting for hours without giving you an explanation is a vialation of normal accepted business practice. And if the restaurant gives you an excuss the they only have one chef etc, that doesn't make it right to keep the customer waiting for hours. This is especially true when Xin continues to keep his website open for ordering. For example, TriadAudio stops taking orders for the Lisa III when they run out of inventories and you won't hear any complaints about their practice. Xin should at least let his customers knows at the time of ordering that it will be a year before order is ship etc. 

 And if he does let his customers know "Your order is in progress. Expecting delivery date 9 to 12 month. Please be patient!” Then it becomes the term of his sales and we have no qualms about his practice. It is very much like ordering a new car that won't be out for 6-9 months, but the wait is fine because it is expected. The issue here is not the wait, it is his business practice. Unless you do not take customers orders, and sometimes money, but once you took the order and/or money, then you incur an obligation to your customers. It isn't that hard to understand, or is it?_


----------



## jamato8

What am I missing here. Is it Xin or Zin or should it be Zen? Xin spells his name Xin but again if a Z is to be used it would seem more appropriate to move the whole idea of name and meaning, related to this long thread, to Zen as in the practice that waiting could be attributed to.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What am I missing here. Is it Xin or Zin or should it be Zen? Xin spells his name Xin but again if a Z is to be used it would seem more appropriate to move the whole idea of name and meaning, related to this long thread, to Zen as in the practice that waiting could be attributed to._

 

What you are missing is probably a topigraphical error.
 The Z is right next to the Z on your keyboard.It is easy to accidently hit the wrong key.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What you are missing is probably a topigraphical error.
 The Z is right next to the Z on your keyboard.It is easy to accidently hit the wrong key._

 

If that were the case then I would think part of the time the X would show up. No, I think something else is at play here. . . . . can we say . . . Freud as in Freudian slip as in discipline of mind as in ,. . . . oh I don't know . l. ... . ZEN! You see, pretty soon since the I is on the opposite side of E the E will start to show up as a typo? I don't think so. . . ZEN!


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If that were the case then I would think part of the time the X would show up. No, I think something else is at play here. . . . . can we say . . . Freud as in Freudian slip as in discipline of mind as in ,. . . . oh I don't know . l. ... . ZEN! You see, pretty soon since the I is on the opposite side of E the E will start to show up as a typo? I don't think so. . . ZEN!_

 

This is really mute to me ,as long as we get our amps within a year.
 I could care less how they spell Xin.I'm sure he has a busy schedule,and he has to have a life to live also.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is really mute to me ,as long as we get our amps within a year.
 I could care less how they spell Xin.I'm sure he has a busy schedule,and he has to have a life to live also._

 

It's *moot* too.


----------



## jamato8

Sure, I was just having some fun. 

 Raining and cool in Santa Rosa, CA.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sure, I was just having some fun._

 

John - when you have fun, I have fun right along with you.....
 Sounds like great weather you're having too. Well, keep on having fun


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What am I missing here. Is it Xin or Zin or should it be Zen? Xin spells his name Xin but again if a Z is to be used it would seem more appropriate to move the whole idea of name and meaning, related to this long thread, to Zen as in the practice that waiting could be attributed to._

 

....well, as yet for most of the people waiting his name is spelled as Nix....


----------



## Dorito123

Sounds like it should be spelled NADA.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Today brings us the insistence that Xin must play by *"inherent and basic business moral and ethic"* rules regarding the way he operates? Then follows the proposal that because he doesn't it must be the manifestation of a psychological disorder? Now that's hilarious.

 Ouch! My right elbow hurts? Could I get an diagnosis via this thread as to what might be causing this discomfort? 

 If one stops trying to attach a conventional 'business' label on what Xin does any frustration caused by the experienced waiting times simply goes away. 

 If you can; simply wrap your head around the FACT that Xin is NOT running a 'business.' But rather he is doing what makes him happy in his own way, then generously, albeit slowly sharing his developments with those who might be interested.

 I'll say one thing for the good Dr. Xin. he has certainly b*tch slapped the egocentric concept of "I want it NOW cause it's all about me."

 At this stage of waiting (9 Mos.) I'm weirdly fascinated by his consistent and persistent silence. It says a multiple of things to me:
 "Shut up and be patient."
 "You'll get your amp when it's ready."
 "Get over it or get used to it."

 While one is waiting for something for Xin, time still goes on. It would be better to find some other way to pass that time. The endless rants regarding whether or not Xin operates within the boundaries of 'normal' or 'conventional' were long ago proven to be pointless because absolutely nothing has so far, or likely will ever, change.

 Adoption of that mind set would snatch this thread back to it's original subject in moments, not years._

 

x2. Well put.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's *moot* too. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I thought someone would catch the mute!


----------



## lisnalee

Anymore reference deliveries?


----------



## Drumonron

Lisnalee, I canceled my order for 3 amps from Xin to focus more on a home based amp from headamp. I've made the changes to the list to reflect this cancelation and I wish you the best in pursuit of the Xin amp. I grew more curious of the headamp GS-1 so I thought I'd put the funds to that and wait a few months.


----------



## itsborken

It appears there are few references out in the wild based on the lack of response. I would go far as to say he's not even shipping one Reference a week yet. 

 I think Xin is really doing psych experiments. Ring bell, drool. Good doggie. Conditioning is a wonderful thing.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Drumonron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lisnalee, I canceled my order for 3 amps from Xin to focus more on a home based amp from headamp. I've made the changes to the list to reflect this cancelation and I wish you the best in pursuit of the Xin amp. I grew more curious of the headamp GS-1 so I thought I'd put the funds to that and wait a few months._

 

I exactly know where your coming from. The wait is agonising, but I'm only a few days off the 6 month club so hopefully it wont be much longer.

 Luckily i have my tomahawk and G-lite to keep me occupied until then.


----------



## osoner

OMG sfflyfish....
 I just can't believe all you have just written. How can you say it is not a business ? A occupation ends when other people (and in this case, the most important: money) are involved !!!
 I don't care if you have dined in mexico and I wouldn't of have waited for the chef to go and buy what he has just sold me ! it is ilogical....
 Xin is making his costumers (and not his occupation friends) wait for far to long. And in that way i don't think he should still keep taking orders...


----------



## itsborken

Yep, I'm sure he's paying someone to process credit cards (or paying for a merchant id), and having a web site hosted out of the goodness of his heart. Because it is such a noble venture, the Fed and State govts have decided to waive any profits he's made along the way.

 I don't suppose the 'Xin Feng Company' on his website or the mention of his 'Headquarters' means anything, and the phone and fax are his personal lines as well.

 No, it's not a business, really.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *osoner* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OMG sfflyfish....
 I just can't believe all you have just written. How can you say it is not a business ? A occupation ends when other people (and in this case, the most important: money) are involved !!!
 I don't care if you have dined in mexico and I wouldn't of have waited for the chef to go and buy what he has just sold me ! it is ilogical....
 Xin is making his costumers (and not his occupation friends) wait for far to long. And in that way i don't think he should still keep taking orders..._

 

I believe people that build amps should build a sufficient amount of them before they put them up for sale.That way one would not have to wait as long.


----------



## Quaddy

i am firmly under the control of xin or is it zin? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 itsborken is maybe right, classical conditioning at work for us humanoids eh!

 the wait is agonizing - i agree with lisnalee. this reference AFAIK will be the final part in my jigsaw, the final component in my portable audio setup which makes that sense of completion void (_*completion???* laughable in these circles i know - but i have to have some excuse to stop saying sorry to my wallet_). all the more frustrating perhaps, eager to get that last part in place so as to be able to sit back and assess the sum of all the parts, finally listen to the rig in its most refined, complete way and concentrate on the all important music rather than machinery for once.

 i have to be honest i couldnt stomach the wait if i didnt have a decent amp already.

 if i was a cmoyer entering the ampage arena, and ordered a ref, it would not be a good space!

 i had to have a xin in the interim as a filler until i got my xin 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (thats a good business model actually) lmao.

 i am nearing the 6mth stage too. and will wait even if it takes a year and a half as, like with ety, i am a big fan of the 'house' sound

 i look at all the arguments back and forth, for and against, and seriously virtually no-one, IMHO, apart from a few silly comments, is wrong, every comment has truth to it.

 once you accept that it is the most unconventional purchase you will ever make, and lets be fair, i would guess nearly 99%-100% of purchasers know that there is a big old delay, getting longer i realize now....then it becomes a tailored, unusual, memorable purchase, which to me makes it far more worthy than the here today gone tomorrow purchases that we/i make.

 the only non-practical element to all this, after the receipt is the duration of aftercare turn around, although i am reading that, that side of xins 'business' is a more loyal, tended to, quicker element.

 but i must have a bizarre mindset, i dont like ordering audio products from 'boxshifters' that are simply processed and picked and packed and out to you in the next few days. i like the custom, hands on and personal efforts involved in building and comissioning items, makes my end experience more enjoyable *once received*, even if only in my mind.

 be nice to hear some reference delivieries being entered here though, give us a little boost!


----------



## Dorito123

Can alternatives with equal sound quality be found without such a long wait? Are the Xin amp's that much better than similar products from competitors? I find it intriguing that so many people would wait so long for a small headphone amp. Makes me want to get on the list just on the slight chance I might get to hear the amp that has caused such an uproar in the community.


----------



## jamato8

You could get a iBasso P2 and work with the opamps. To me the sound is different, a little, but very good, just a little different, as in different venues in performances and nothing wrong with that. Or try the Pico or Predator or the new D2 iBasso when it comes out. There are many good amps available with little separating them in sound. Sometimes it is more of the headphones chosen that is the final answer as long as the amp is good to begin with.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dorito123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can alternatives with equal sound quality be found without such a long wait?_

 

some quarters are raving about the iQube.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_some quarters are raving about the iQube._

 

Doesn't it cost about twice as much as the Reference? But then again, you can actually buy it......


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dorito123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can alternatives with equal sound quality be found without such a long wait? Are the Xin amp's that much better than similar products from competitors? I find it intriguing that so many people would wait so long for a small headphone amp. Makes me want to get on the list just on the slight chance I might get to hear the amp that has caused such an uproar in the community._

 

Depends on which variation of Xin amps. I've had Supermacro III V6, Supermacro IV, Supermacro IV LE. I can say without a doubt in my mind that the IV LE is to me the best. Huge soundstage both in width and depth. I "brightened" the sound a bit by getting the Supercotton dock from ALO--I think the silver in it made the sound more full and got rid of some of the "tubey" characteristics. BUT if you like the tube sound, this amp is a winner.

 Also have had Hornet, Tomahawk, and Portaphile. Next to Portaphile, this one's my fave.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I exactly know where your coming from. The wait is agonising, but I'm only a few days off the 6 month club so hopefully it wont be much longer._

 

Me too, looks like I ordered at around the same time as you.
 Strange, when you look at it for real, we've been waiting for half a year for a little portable amp, and some people even longer than that.

 I still check his forum and this thread to see if there is any activity, but other than that I don't even care that much anymore.
 I haven't canceled my order because it'd probably futile to try to get through to him in the first place, plus I've waited for a long time already, it would be a waste to cancel now.

 I don't even need my portables that much right now anyway, so I'll just patiently wait and see how it develops.


----------



## ldj325

I wish I could report that I have received a Xin Micro. Instead, I'm about to pass my 9 month wait date and still no Micro.


----------



## vandread

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Me too, looks like I ordered at around the same time as you.
 Strange, when you look at it for real, we've been waiting for half a year for a little portable amp, and some people even longer than that.

 I still check his forum and this thread to see if there is any activity, but other than that I don't even care that much anymore.
 I haven't canceled my order because it'd probably futile to try to get through to him in the first place, plus I've waited for a long time already, it would be a waste to cancel now.

 I don't even need my portables that much right now anyway, so I'll just patiently wait and see how it develops._

 

Same here...... i'm too don't need portable set-up anymore because i'm already have a nice home set-up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but i'm not cancelled my Ref order because i think it's a waste after 6month in line........ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 and just to fullfill my curiousity how Xin Ref sound are......... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 just my curious....... how it's ended........ perhaps try it for a couple a month and then resell it for $500 ?


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Me too, looks like I ordered at around the same time as you.
 Strange, when you look at it for real, we've been waiting for half a year for a little portable amp, and some people even longer than that.

 I still check his forum and this thread to see if there is any activity, but other than that I don't even care that much anymore.
 I haven't canceled my order because it'd probably futile to try to get through to him in the first place, plus I've waited for a long time already, it would be a waste to cancel now.

 I don't even need my portables that much right now anyway, so I'll just patiently wait and see how it develops._

 

I ordered on the 8th August, the same day as Quaddy.

 I been reading quite a few review threads over the past few days that are placing the likes of the pico, Graham slee voyager and a few others above the reference in terms of SQ. Which is sort of disapointing as i thought for sure this would beat them all hands down.

 Im just hoping that when it arrives it lives up to my expectations.


----------



## tk3

Well, at least the battery life is good, that's a big plus.


----------



## JarodL1

Just hit the 10 month mark and not a single form of communication from Xin.


----------



## srikeerthi

Well well... the thread seems to be going through its usual cycle.

 Just putting my update in.

 11 months up.. and even if Xin builds/ ships my order now I think I will receive
 only close to the 1 year mark.

 I'm still not sure why I'm still expecting it to be at my doorstep someday


----------



## kokohore

Sorry for this look-alike post...

 I've just hit the 11 months mark today, as well (for SMiniIV).


----------



## DennyL

As Xin has got so slow, I can't help wondering if he isn't on the verge of just giving up.


----------



## Quaddy

he doesnt strike me as a man who would give up on something, and if he did i am sure he would take down his ordering page and honour outstanding units. but i understand where you are coming from.

 dammit xin, i am now on my 3rd stand-in amp waiting for the reference 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i think i may have moved by the time i get it.


----------



## sfflyfish

Oh Boy, Another post wherein someone tries in vain to apply their personal definitions to someone/something they have no control over what so ever.

 I can say it's not a business because it does not follow any established models of a business. It's a guy making amps under HIS terms and conditions. No more No less. If you choose to label it as a business, that's up to you. But if things don't go as YOU think they should because YOU have unilaterally decided that Xin must follow your definition of a business, the frustration is yours alone to bear.

 As far as waiting in Mexico for a meal being "ilogical...." You gotta get out more. God forbid you experience that the rest of the world doesn't operate under your personal set of terms and conditions.

 Here's what comes to mind regarding dining in small restaurants in far away places. One, at least I know the ingredients are FRESH. Two, I appreciate the proprietor's effort on my behalf. And lastly, I am reminded all things do not necessarily happen immediately just because I WANT THEM TO.

 Lastly, Xin is not "making us wait." Xin is not doing anything other than being Xin. No one's holding a gun to any of our heads. The time frame is what it is. Waiting is your individual definition of the time that passes from when you indicate you would like Xin to send you something and he actually does. It certainly is not a well kept secret that Xin is not of the mindset to do what some others expect him to do.

 Maybe you ought to find something else to do with that time other than 'wait?' I know! You could leave you comfort zone, travel to another country and catch a glimpse of how the others go about their daily lives?

 BTW, I hit 9 months today. I think I'll go take a walk, garden a bit then read a book. Oh that's right I was going to do those things anyway.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *osoner* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OMG sfflyfish....
 I just can't believe all you have just written. How can you say it is not a business ? A occupation ends when other people (and in this case, the most important: money) are involved !!!
 I don't care if you have dined in mexico and I wouldn't of have waited for the chef to go and buy what he has just sold me ! it is ilogical....
 Xin is making his costumers (and not his occupation friends) wait for far to long. And in that way i don't think he should still keep taking orders..._


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh Boy, Another post wherein someone tries in vain to apply their personal definitions to someone/something they have no control over what so ever.

 I can say it's not a business because it does not follow any established models of a business. It's a guy making amps under HIS terms and conditions. No more No less. If you choose to label it as a business, that's up to you. But if things don't go as YOU think they should because YOU have unilaterally decided that Xin must follow your definition of a business, the frustration is yours alone to bear.

 As far as waiting in Mexico for a meal being "ilogical...." You gotta get out more. God forbid you experience that the rest of the world doesn't operate under your personal set of terms and conditions.

 Here's what comes to mind regarding dining in small restaurants in far away places. One, at least I know the ingredients are FRESH. Two, I appreciate the proprietor's effort on my behalf. And lastly, I am reminded all things do not necessarily happen immediately just because I WANT THEM TO.

 Lastly, Xin is not "making us wait." Xin is not doing anything other than being Xin. No one's holding a gun to any of our heads. The time frame is what it is. Waiting is your individual definition of the time that passes from when you indicate you would like Xin to send you something and he actually does. It certainly is not a well kept secret that Xin is not of the mindset to do what some others expect him to do.

 Maybe you ought to find something else to do with that time other than 'wait?' I know! You could leave you comfort zone, travel to another country and catch a glimpse of how the others go about their daily lives?

 BTW, I hit 9 months today. I think I'll go take a walk, garden a bit then read a book. Oh that's right I was going to do those things anyway._

 


 We like to think there is an established norm or reality, though that varies to the greatest degree throughout cultures and individuals. Now what is up? 

 It is what it Is and that is all that it is.


----------



## aluren

nicely said.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh Boy, Another post wherein someone tries in vain to apply their personal definitions to someone/something they have no control over what so ever._

 

No, there's hundreds of years of common law that cover what a business is and what is not. 

  Quote:


 I can say it's not a business because it does not follow any established models of a business. 
 

Now if that doesn't sound like a personal definition of a business I don't know what is.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry for this look-alike post...._

 

Yeah, too bad about the look-alike post. Now the mods are going to have to penalize you 5 posts from your post count. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 No, NOT really!!! They'll likely penalize MY postcount for that joke. If so, it was worth it to me.

 About the Xin Reference, 6 Months and going strong!!! I'm still quite PSYCHED about (eventually) getting it, and imagining how my heirs will enjoy it when it arrives. They'll say things to each other like, "Let's play THIS kind of music on it now through those OTHER funny-looking ear-thingies he left us. sbulack would have wanted it that way..."


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm still quite PSYCHED about (eventually) getting it, and imagining how my heirs will enjoy it when it arrives. They'll say things to each other like, "Let's play THIS kind of music on it now through those OTHER funny-looking ear-thingies he left us. sbulack would have wanted it that way..." 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





_

 

They will need to immediately send it back for the cranial implant enhancements via alphawave broadcast chip. Forget soundstage, think mindstage


----------



## yourtoys7

8 month and counting...


----------



## JwangSDC

Am I the only one who ordered the amps and thought I would be special and receive it in a reasonable amount of time?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Am I the only one who ordered the amps and thought I would be special and receive it in a reasonable amount of time?_

 

No, this thread is overflowing with posts from "the special folk".


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, this thread is overflowing with posts from "the special folk"._

 

haha, yea I ordered mine last month and I kinda expected him to charge me at the end of the month and ship it out. To be honest I'm happy that crazy dream didn't happen cuz I just ordered UE-11's and won't be able to pay for these amps until at least march...The wait from march till next march is gonna be quite the pain though.,


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...I just ordered UE-11's and won't be able to pay for these amps until at least march...The wait from march till next march is gonna be quite the pain though.,_

 

Not a pain that the UE-11's can't make more bearable, I think. Enjoy!!!


----------



## Raphael

Almost 9 months now, and counting. Still waiting for my Xin SuperMicro IV ordered back in May 2007 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 This is painful.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, this thread is overflowing with posts from "the special folk"._

 

X2


----------



## JarodL1

When is the last time anyone heard anything from Xin?


----------



## tk3

Think end December, after that nada.


----------



## sbulack

1/6/2008 - email saying a Reference is being shipped;
 1/10/2008 - the Reference is received.
 1/11/2008 - another Reference arrives!!!
 "2nd week of January" - A "Reference shipped" email - and subsequently rcvd.
 1/22/2008 - an email cancellation received from Xin.

 It's not as promising as the activity in December, 2007, to be sure, but SOME Xin email activity and amp appearances HAVE happened in January, 2008.

 ------ "A Bee-bidabee-bidabee----That's All Folks!!!!!" ---------
 <Cue the Warner Bros. music>


----------



## sfflyfish

Not that it matters one whit; But today begins the Chinese New Year!


----------



## sbulack

This means that TWO New Years have passed so far while waiting for my Xin Reference 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			











 Happy New Year!!!!!


----------



## Sanddancer

Does anyone know the last time a SuperMicro was delivered? Has he just given up on non-Reference models altogether?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does anyone know the last time a SuperMicro was delivered? Has he just given up on non-Reference models altogether?_

 

Do you mean he's delivering References??

 It seems to me that his output is asymptotically approaching zero. Can he *still* be refining the Reference, or is he just having a big New Year celebration?


----------



## Nuwidol

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does anyone know the last time a SuperMicro was delivered? Has he just given up on non-Reference models altogether?_

 

exactly what i wanna know. 7 months now


----------



## JwangSDC

With the Predator and Pico out, is it worth it to still wait for a Xin Reference? 

 I ordered both a Reference and a SuperMicro, but I'm considering pulling the trigger on a Pico or a Predator, anyone got any tidbits of wisdom?


----------



## jamato8

The Reference is one of the top portables.


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Reference is one of the top portables._

 

I understand, but I thought the reference was THE TOP portable. I thought maybe the iQube compared but that costs over $1k. Now I'm hearing all these amazing comments about the Pico and Predator and I wonder, how much better, if any, is the Xin Reference?

 There seem to be many people who already have a reference but are pre-ordering a pico and insinuating it might be an upgrade...

 Hmm tough decision for me. I have no problem waiting another 12 months for my reference...but if the Pico and Predator are just as good and I can order them without the wait; then I'd wanna do that.

 Gahh!!! someone help me!


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I understand, but I thought the reference was THE TOP portable. I thought maybe the iQube compared but that costs over $1k. Now I'm hearing all these amazing comments about the Pico and Predator and I wonder, how much better, if any, is the Xin Reference?

 There seem to be many people who already have a reference but are pre-ordering a pico and insinuating it might be an upgrade...

 Hmm tough decision for me. I have no problem waiting another 12 months for my reference...but if the Pico and Predator are just as good and I can order them without the wait; then I'd wanna do that.

 Gahh!!! someone help me!_

 

The iQube won't cost over US$1K! It is more like around US$500+ - depending on the exchange rate, import duties and shipment cost.

 I have the Reference, the Pico, the iQube. And of course the LISA III XP and the controversial Diablo. I did not listen them on loan - I bought them all new from the manufacturer, and I have no plan to sell any of them - yet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Sonically, I love the LISA III XP and it is still the best battery powered amp I have ever listened to. The Reference come close next in terms of sonic excellence. 

 The Reference delivers silky smooth, coherent music, without loss of resolution, and the magical articulation that it presents the music is something that iQube, or the Pico is not able to beat. Granted, the iQube and the Pico have their advantages as well, but sonically I do prefer the Reference. Yet, the LISA III is more organic and engaging, and offers the right blend of micro-details and emotions that it wins my heart most of the time when compared to the Reference.

 The Pico, iQube and Reference all have its own way to present the music. Pico gives you a sense of liveliness and energy, the iQube is more laid back and relaxed, yet very neutral, and Reference is like a mature and well mannered gentlemn who is capable and well trained, but not eager to show off what he has under his sleeves - until the moment he acts and you know immediately that he belongs to the master class.

 When you factor in the price and battery life the Reference is a bargain - as long as you are patient enough.

 I must add that this is according to my own pair of ears, and my own musical preference (classical, jazz, smooth pops, ambient) and source. YMMV.

 Hope this helps.

 F. Lo


----------



## JwangSDC

Wow, you have all those amps? That seems a bit...excessive. I couldn't imagine owning more than 3 amps; but I guess tha'ts because I own ZERO right now. 

 Hmm now I really wanna order the pico and then I'll probably just sell my ref when it comes in a year later. Or keep it....


----------



## JwangSDC

Hmm or maybe I should just get hte Lisa III and be done with it.


----------



## Quaddy

i hear you all, it is confusing, i am at 6mths wait for ref now, 
 and i to some extent have 'bought' into the hype and reports, because lets face it what else can you do? i havent heard it in the flesh, just read a lot and done a lot of in theory comparisons.

 there have been several reports surfacing about challengers now, that are as good or if not better which dont have the associated wait time.

 i personally opted to wait and receive the reference whenever that is, but decided....again....to buy an amp that has had great reviews also, the graham slee voyager. 

 owning a supermacro and supermicro from xin currently and having enjoyed those amps for a long time and have loved their sound and capabilities.

 all i can say is there are always bigger fish in the sea, as i have found out yesterday, out of the box the slee voyager is outclassing the supermicro IV 4/11.

 i wont go crazy and do a mini review here, it is out of place, but it just goes to show that the reference has some serious contendership in my house already and my advise to anyone thinking of an amp instead of the reference, check out the voyager from graham slee, indeed the lisa, pico, predator, you have to decide.

 but i feel any portable amp currently is going to have *BIG* issues competing with what i am hearing via the voyager!

 confuzzled?


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_there have been several reports surfacing about challengers now_

 

Don't let Xin know, or we'll never see the amps.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There seem to be many people who already have a reference but are pre-ordering a pico and insinuating it might be an upgrade..._

 

There is a misconception that there are "many" people who have a reference. I think anyone would be hard-pressed to name 10-15 people who own one including the prototypes.


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There is a misconception that there are "many" people who have a reference. I think anyone would be hard-pressed to name 10-15 people who own one including the prototypes._

 

That exclusivity alone makes me desire the reference 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Of course I'm stilla practical person, exclusivity plus best quality is what I was thinking I was waiting for...

 Seems nowadays the Super Micro is Xin's best piece of work since it has no competitor that can even come close.


----------



## Nailzs

Going on 6 months here but I got a little something to keep me busy while I wait.


----------



## Jaw007

Is the reference better than a supermacro LE?
 Which is considered the better of the two?


----------



## jamato8

Yes, I would say that the Reference is the better of the two. I am not even sure if the LE is current any longer as the Reference gets the hours of the LE and works with all types of ear monitors.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, I would say that the Reference is the better of the two. I am not even sure if the LE is current any longer as the Reference gets the hours of the LE and works with all types of ear monitors._

 

Thank you for the information. So the LE will not work with all types of ear monitors.Can you tell me what the LE will work with?I just purchased a LE from a fellow Head-Fi'er today ,and he said it was updated a couple months ago to the
 latest&greatest opamps.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thank you for the information. So the LE will not work with all types of ear monitors.Can you tell me what the LE will work with?I just purchased a LE from a fellow Head-Fi'er today ,and he said it was updated a couple months ago to the
 latest&greatest opamps._

 

It works with most everything. Also, one with the latest opamps should be very fine. I have not heard it, the latest, so disregard my statement as it can not be based on what you have. Xin would have built it based on the Sound of the Reference so there is no reason it would not be of near equal ability but again, I have not heard it.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It works with most everything. Also, one with the latest opamps should be very fine. I have not heard it, the latest, so disregard my statement as it can not be based on what you have. Xin would have built it based on the Sound of the Reference so there is no reason it would not be of near equal ability but again, I have not heard it._

 

The updated LE has 8616/8656 op amp configuration.
 This is turkey to me.Thanks again,and have a fine day.


----------



## jamato8

Well those are nice but there are others I like better. Maybe there is a synergy there. Hearing is believing, sometimes. :^)


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well those are nice but there are others I like better. Maybe there is a synergy there. Hearing is believing, sometimes. :^)_

 

I will find out how it sounds probably Wed,or Thur.
 I just bought it from tnmike1,on the FS thread,and he loved it very much.
 I'm sure it will suffice until I ever receive the Reference.Thanks again for your views.


----------



## jamato8

Well Xin is comparing it to the Reference so I would hope it has a very good sound for a portable. I have said this before but he really wants to do the best he can for portables and goes to great, great lengths to do it.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well Xin is comparing it to the Reference so I would hope it has a very good sound for a portable. I have said this before but he really wants to do the best he can for portables and goes to great, great lengths to do it._

 

have you had any recent communication with him? somewhere in this thread or on his forum it was mentioned the Reference design was supposedly finished. I guess not?


----------



## accnut

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh Boy, Another post wherein someone tries in vain to apply their personal definitions to someone/something they have no control over what so ever.

 I can say it's not a business because it does not follow any established models of a business. It's a guy making amps under HIS terms and conditions. No more No less. If you choose to label it as a business, that's up to you. But if things don't go as YOU think they should because YOU have unilaterally decided that Xin must follow your definition of a business, the frustration is yours alone to bear.

 As far as waiting in Mexico for a meal being "ilogical...." You gotta get out more. God forbid you experience that the rest of the world doesn't operate under your personal set of terms and conditions.

 Here's what comes to mind regarding dining in small restaurants in far away places. One, at least I know the ingredients are FRESH. Two, I appreciate the proprietor's effort on my behalf. And lastly, I am reminded all things do not necessarily happen immediately just because I WANT THEM TO.

 Lastly, Xin is not "making us wait." Xin is not doing anything other than being Xin. No one's holding a gun to any of our heads. The time frame is what it is. Waiting is your individual definition of the time that passes from when you indicate you would like Xin to send you something and he actually does. It certainly is not a well kept secret that Xin is not of the mindset to do what some others expect him to do.

 Maybe you ought to find something else to do with that time other than 'wait?' I know! You could leave you comfort zone, travel to another country and catch a glimpse of how the others go about their daily lives?

 BTW, I hit 9 months today. I think I'll go take a walk, garden a bit then read a book. Oh that's right I was going to do those things anyway._

 


 sfflyfish,
 This is one of the best comments on the "Xin syndrome" that I've read and should be required reading for all the people who get so upset, especially after the thousands of posts on the reality of doing business with Dr. Xin. I went to a restaurant in Costa Rica last year and a sign was posted outside that read " If you are in a hurry, please go elsewhere." Since it was in English, it was obviously meant for Americans. Some people just do things differently than others and if you don't like it "go to another restaurant".


----------



## jpnz

How the hell can you live with yourself if some already paid (Paypal) for your product, let the costumer wait for almost a year, and ship to all other costumers who waiting less and bought with CC. Bah.


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* 
_Oh Boy, Another post wherein someone tries in vain to apply their personal definitions to someone/something they have no control over what so ever.

 I can say it's not a business because it does not follow any established models of a business. It's a guy making amps under HIS terms and conditions. No more No less. If you choose to label it as a business, that's up to you. But if things don't go as YOU think they should because YOU have unilaterally decided that Xin must follow your definition of a business, the frustration is yours alone to bear.

 As far as waiting in Mexico for a meal being "ilogical...." You gotta get out more. God forbid you experience that the rest of the world doesn't operate under your personal set of terms and conditions.

 Here's what comes to mind regarding dining in small restaurants in far away places. One, at least I know the ingredients are FRESH. Two, I appreciate the proprietor's effort on my behalf. And lastly, I am reminded all things do not necessarily happen immediately just because I WANT THEM TO.

 Lastly, Xin is not "making us wait." Xin is not doing anything other than being Xin. No one's holding a gun to any of our heads. The time frame is what it is. Waiting is your individual definition of the time that passes from when you indicate you would like Xin to send you something and he actually does. It certainly is not a well kept secret that Xin is not of the mindset to do what some others expect him to do.

 Maybe you ought to find something else to do with that time other than 'wait?' I know! You could leave you comfort zone, travel to another country and catch a glimpse of how the others go about their daily lives?

 BTW, I hit 9 months today. I think I'll go take a walk, garden a bit then read a book. Oh that's right I was going to do those things anyway._

 


 What you are saying is very true, but a bit harsh. 



  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *accnut* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_sfflyfish,
 This is one of the best comments on the "Xin syndrome" that I've read and should be required reading for all the people who get so upset, especially after the thousands of posts on the reality of doing business with Dr. Xin. I went to a restaurant in Costa Rica last year and a sign was posted outside that read " If you are in a hurry, please go elsewhere." Since it was in English, it was obviously meant for Americans. Some people just do things differently than others and if you don't like it "go to another restaurant"._

 

Except that restaurant clearly stated it outside on a sign. In America there are standard business practices that are established and while I don't agree with them all, ignoring them would be your own fault also. In this case sfflyfish takes the time to rip on all the xin haters and complainers, but using the same sense of logic I could rip on Xin. He's opening what appears to be a business and accepting money via paypal without openly indicating how long it might take to ship the amp. Imagine stumbling across his webpage and ordering and amp via paypal and never getting and contact or amp from him for over 12 months? If that happened to me I could see people going out of their way to report him to paypal and BBB and I could say "Sorry xin, what you think you are doing and what the reality of it is are two separate things". In fact I could say that EVEN IF he warned all his customers of the possible wait time.

 Now also note that I purchased two amps and have never once complained, nor am I frustrated or upset with Xin. In fact I very much appreciate what he's doing. In today's age of mass produced crap, I love the idea of getting something so high quality and the barrier to getting it only makes it more exclusive and desirable. But I'm not ignorant enough to think that the general public or the general consumer would be smart enough that if they find some product online, they would research it first before purchasing it the way I did. But I am open enough to see their paradigm and understand why they have it even though its wrong.


----------



## itsborken

This restaurant analogy is irrelevant. Did you pay for your meal up front? Did you reasonably expect to eat sometime before the next meal (not tomorrow, not a year from the time of order)? Did the restaurant owner or wait staff stop by at least once to see how you were doing during the wait?

 If I go out for lunch today at 11:30 and have a 1pm meeting is it unreasonable for me to expect my meal to be served before the meeting starts? If it can't, should I at least be presented with other options or be warned it will take significantly longer than normal expectations?

 Do problems arise? Sure. Can somebody forget to order components and it delay shipment? Absolutely. Is this the reason the amps haven't shipped yet? No way; these types of components are not that scarce. How do I explain his behavior towards his customers? He simply doesn't give a damn about them.

 Psychology has a term named rationalization and it is in full practice here.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In fact I could say that EVEN IF he warned all his customers of the possible wait time._

 

It's called the Uniform Commercial Code. Seller has to notify Buyer in writing if the product cannot be shipped within a month. There is a contract between buyer and seller in this case that civil law would uphold. I doubt that posting the delay on the website would protect him, as these are not custom, one-off products that he couldn't readily resell to someone else.

 Oh, but this isn't a business. Yeah, right (not directed at you JwangSDC).


----------



## musicmaker

I'm with you itsborken.

 I dont get it when folks say he isn't running a business. He's got a registered business name. He's paying taxes as a business (I hope). He's got my credit card number for a product I was told I'll get in about 1.5 months before I ordered (i have this in writing from him). Which part of this isn't business ?


----------



## jamato8

He is running a business, it is just that he is running it his way. We can define a business any way we choose but that is not the definitive. I am not defending a practice but making a statement, good, bad or indifferent.


----------



## musicmaker

I don't disagree with the definition part. He can run whatever it is he's running any way he wants. I'm just not going to do business with someone that doesn't show their customers professional courtesy.

 I'm done with Xin. I hope you guys get your amps sometime and it was worth the insane wait !


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't disagree with the definition part. He can run whatever it is he's running any way he wants. I'm just not going to do business with someone that doesn't show their customers professional courtesy.

 I'm done with Xin. I hope you guys get your amps sometime and it was worth the insane wait !_

 

I can totally understand and appreciate your stance.


----------



## accnut

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What you are saying is very true, but a bit harsh. 





 Except that restaurant clearly stated it outside on a sign. In America there are standard business practices that are established and while I don't agree with them all, ignoring them would be your own fault also. In this case sfflyfish takes the time to rip on all the xin haters and complainers, but using the same sense of logic I could rip on Xin. He's opening what appears to be a business and accepting money via paypal without openly indicating how long it might take to ship the amp. Imagine stumbling across his webpage and ordering and amp via paypal and never getting and contact or amp from him for over 12 months? If that happened to me I could see people going out of their way to report him to paypal and BBB and I could say "Sorry xin, what you think you are doing and what the reality of it is are two separate things". In fact I could say that EVEN IF he warned all his customers of the possible wait time.

 Now also note that I purchased two amps and have never once complained, nor am I frustrated or upset with Xin. In fact I very much appreciate what he's doing. In today's age of mass produced crap, I love the idea of getting something so high quality and the barrier to getting it only makes it more exclusive and desirable. But I'm not ignorant enough to think that the general public or the general consumer would be smart enough that if they find some product online, they would research it first before purchasing it the way I did. But I am open enough to see their paradigm and understand why they have it even though its wrong._

 

I certainly don't condone Xin's business practices and I do understand that consumers who know nothing about him wonder what the heck's going on when they don't get products or responses. But I imagine they do what most people do with an online site who has similar practices. They give up, cancel their order, and go somewhere else. As for the people who know about Xin, who have read this incredibly long thread, and who continue to complain for months on end, they're the ones I don't understand.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *accnut* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As for the people who know about Xin, who have read this incredibly long thread, and who continue to complain for months on end, they're the ones I don't understand._

 

One can continue to enable his behavior by tacitly accepting it, or do what society does when individuals deviate from the norm. If a little shunning helps his light bulb eventually go on, it will be for his benefit as well as his customers. When he turns his act around and starts shipping or at least communicating the reason for the delay and sets a timetable he will stick to I'll be the first to eat my words and then shut up.

 Another reason would be to inform somebody new stumbling on the Xin reviews and *not* taking the time to read the incredibly long thread before placing an order. If not for a few voices of objection this thread would only tell one side of the story.


----------



## shiezan

Well, around the time I ordered my amp about 11 months ago there weren't threads like this to warn people like me from ordering. I remember hearing the wait time was 3 months at worst and on the website itself it claimed a 3 - 4 week ship time.
 Also, not everyone knows about head-fi and so there are people who still don't know what kind of trap theyre falling into when they decide to wait through the "3-4 week ship time".

 If Xin wants to run his business and complete orders even two or three years after the order confirmation, I wouldn't have a problem with it as long as he warns ahead of time that it will take about 2 - 3 years instead of the 3-4 weeks.


----------



## JwangSDC

I should just place an order for 1000 references and fix this problem.


----------



## tubesguy

I would imagine that part of problem with this thread, for those new to the Xin experience, is the wildly inappropriate thread title, which suggests that one might post here and receive information about the shipping date for one's order. That's what sucked me into reading (some of) it.


----------



## itsborken

It's an interesting read on human nature.


----------



## fl00r

It’s sad to see that what started as a informative, fun to read thread slowly turned into a thread of frustrated people who vent their displeasure (appropriate or not).
 I’ve been there and waited almost nine months for the Reference. During the wait there were several moments that I thought about throw in the towel and although I think Xin makes excellent amps, it ain’t worth waiting for thát long.

 No more Xin’s for me.


----------



## aluren

well there's nothing else to talk about since no one's been getting their amps! 

 for me, i think i ordered a supermicro in september 07 and i've already forgotten about it. if it comes in, great. if it doesn't, who cares... i'm not getting charged through my credit card. i've moved on to other amps, specifically the pico. i have the xin reference beta amp, and honestly, it's not THAT much better than the RSA amps that i've had... definitely not worth all the bitter wait anyways... one thing that needs to change is the mindset on xin amps. it is not the holy grail of portable amps imo.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well there's nothing else to talk about since no one's been getting their amps! 

 for me, i think i ordered a supermicro in september 07 and i've already forgotten about it. if it comes in, great. if it doesn't, who cares... i'm not getting charged through my credit card. i've moved on to other amps, specifically the pico. i have the xin reference beta amp, and honestly, it's not THAT much better than the RSA amps that i've had... definitely not worth all the bitter wait anyways... one thing that needs to change is the mindset on xin amps. it is not the holy grail of portable amps imo._

 

In your opinion ,what is the holy grail of portable amps?


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In your opinion ,what is the holy grail of portable amps?_

 

I think his point was that there is NO HOLY GRAIL of portable amps. Which would make waiting for a Xin amp pointless. I personally have concluded that the Lisa is the holy grail of portable amps...does anyone who owns it conclude anything other than the fact that it is the best sounding amp they've ever had?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think his point was that there is NO HOLY GRAIL of portable amps. Which would make waiting for a Xin amp pointless. I personally have concluded that the Lisa is the holy grail of portable amps...does anyone who owns it conclude anything other than the fact that it is the best sounding amp they've ever had?_

 

hehe, exactly, the holy grail is different for different people, heck, at the moment my slee voyager is the holy grail, before that t'was SMIV, before that it was supermacro, before that it was XM4, before that it was CMOY 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








.....


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hehe, exactly, the holy grail is different for different people, heck, at the moment my slee voyager is the holy grail, before that t'was SMIV, before that it was supermacro, before that it was XM4, before that it was CMOY 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







....._

 

I would think the iQube from Quables would be for you Quaddy. Maybe not sonically but you won't find a better match phonetically 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 100% in agreement. There's been so many experienced people (experience measured by owning a large number of amps) and everyone has their own particular favorite based on their tastes. With the number of good amps out there and working off a probability distribution, it seems unlikely that the average buyer is going to find the Reference the 'best' vs. something else if they were able to do their own research. 

 I'd be real disappointed slogging through 1 month/4 months/11 months/whatever is claimed a reasonable wait this Spring/Summer for something that I'd most likely say Meh about.


----------



## Jaw007

My holy grail right now is the iBasso P2 he he.
 I have a C&C Xo,and three more amps on the way.
 I guess there is no end to this hobby.
 Anyway thanks for the information.


----------



## Jaw007

I bought a SuperMacro-LE from a fello Head-FI member but never got instructions for the amp.Can someone tell me what the different switches on the front do from left to right?
 Thank you


----------



## dle4e_2005

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I bought a SuperMacro-LE from a fello Head-FI member but never got instructions for the amp.Can someone tell me what the different switches on the front do from left to right?
 Thank you_

 

From left to right,BAsIC (old versions are It's ABC):

 B, Bass Boost, increase bass by 6 dB.
 A, Amplify Gain, raise gain from 3 to 8, good for low-efficient headphones.
 I, Output Impedance, add 75 ohm, good for some headphones and turning ER4P into ER4S.
 C, Crossfeed (XinFeed), simulate home speakers.

 quoted it from Dr.Xin's post at Xin's Cool Talk - New XIN amps with 4-channel technology


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dle4e_2005* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From left to right,BAsIC (old versions are It's ABC):

 B, Bass Boost, increase bass by 6 dB.
 A, Amplify Gain, raise gain from 3 to 8, good for low-efficient headphones.
 I, Output Impedance, add 75 ohm, good for some headphones and turning ER4P into ER4S.
 C, Crossfeed (XinFeed), simulate home speakers.

 quoted it from Dr.Xin's post at Xin's Cool Talk - New XIN amps with 4-channel technology_

 

Thank you very much for the information.


----------



## tk3

Any news in Xin land?
 Seems like the tumbleweeds are having free reign again.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Any news in Xin land?
 Seems like the tumbleweeds are having free reign again._

 

Does anyone still care??? I mean if you used a credit card and it's not charged, so what??? If the amp shows up, fine. If it doesn't that's OK too. I'm over worrying, pondering and wondering what's going on. Ordered in August and no sight, sound or email from Xinland. O well. I just pray that if and when I get it the thing never breaks because I could just throw it away insteadof returning it and waiting another 8 months or so for its return


----------



## tk3

I'm not worrying, just checking if there is a sign of life from Xin lately, seems to be really quiet.


----------



## dealmaster00

soon to be approaching 9 months club here


----------



## DennyL

Perhaps he's taking a sabatical.


----------



## vandread

Almost hit 7 months mark, n still no Reference..........

 Keep waiting................... n waiting.....................n waiting................... n waiting..................... n waiting................


----------



## jamato8

Hear nothing.


----------



## JarodL1

Seems like it has been since November/December when any real quantity of shipments went out. Maybe someone should try calling his house and remind him he has customers.


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## itsborken

Does a handful of amps over the course of two months count as quantity now? Kind of like "It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is"?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does a handful of amps over the course of two months count as quantity now? Kind of like "It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is"?_

 

The Xin amp shipments HAVE been a fairly high complex number, y'know with real and imaginary components. The real component (the number of amps Xin has shipped for real) has been rather low, but the imaginary component (the number of amps Xin has shipped to us in our imaginings) has been considerably higher.


----------



## gp_hebert

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Xin amp shipments HAVE been a fairly high complex number, y'know with real and imaginary components. The real component (the number of amps Xin has shipped for real) has been rather low, but the imaginary component (the number of amps Xin has shipped to us in our imaginings) has been considerably higher. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 






 Yeah, Xin was very productive this month, he shipped at least 20i amps.


----------



## itsborken

Loving the math reference! Yes, I agree it's a complex problem.


----------



## Aaron622

Changed my Reference order to a SuperMicro (assuming Xin gets my email. Been 6.5 months...something tells me it will never show up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 as there hasn't been any good news in a while now.


----------



## jamato8

Nope, very, very, sadly, very quiet.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Aaron622* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ ..... Been 6.5 months...something tells me it will never show up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ....._

 

To quote Willy Wonka: "One must never doubt that about which NO one is certain."

 If you want the Xin amp enough to wait for it, then hang in there. Over the years of watching Xin conduct himself (as a non-user of his amps), I can say from that experience that, if Xin can be said to have a flaw, it is that he tries to do TOO much to his amps and for the people who buy them. Paradoxically, lately it appears to be that specifically WHAT he wants to do is different from what many of the people for whom he is doing it WANT him to do. Barring something happening to Xin which would prevent it, I have NO doubt that he will fulfill ALL of his orders which are not cancelled first. It's just a matter of the time constant.


----------



## Aaron622

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_To quote Willy Wonka: "One must never doubt that about which NO one is certain."

 If you want the Xin amp enough to wait for it, then hang in there. Over the years of watching Xin conduct himself (as a non-user of his amps), I can say from that experience that, if Xin can be said to have a flaw, it is that he tries to do TOO much to his amps and for the people who buy them. Paradoxically, lately it appears to be that specifically WHAT he wants to do is different from what many of the people for whom he is doing it WANT him to do. Barring something happening to Xin which would prevent it, I have NO doubt that he will fulfill ALL of his orders which are not cancelled first. It's just a matter of the time constant. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

Yeah, I'm sure you're right, as long as Xin hasn't decided to quit the amp business. I guess I'm currently tempted by some of the other options out there.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Aaron622* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, I'm sure you're right, as long as Xin hasn't decided to quit the amp business. I guess I'm currently tempted by some of the other options out there._

 

Well, yeah. I do wonder how long it can go on like this. I have a credit card order in for a Reference (Sept 07, so I'm a nooby), and plenty of amps to keep me going in the meantime, but I do realise that my interest in the Reference is fading because NOTHING seems to be happening, and other exciting amps are coming along. Doesn't he dip into the various forums of people yearning just for information, maybe even the forums on his own site, when he takes a break for a coffee or whatever?


----------



## tnmike1

I've said this before, but probably hundred or so pages ago: it isn't the waiting for the Reference that bothers me, it's what happens when your Xin amp breaks and you have to return it for repair. then what?? Wait another 8+ months to get it back??? All in all not a very bright prospect for me to continue to wait for a Xin amp.


----------



## vvs_75

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've said this before, but probably hundred or so pages ago: it isn't the waiting for the Reference that bothers me, it's what happens when your Xin amp breaks and you have to return it for repair. then what?? Wait another 8+ months to get it back??? All in all not a very bright prospect for me to continue to wait for a Xin amp._

 

I think that the chance that it breaks is very small but if it's happens I think Dr.Xin will fix the amp in a matter of just few days. I am thinking about that Reference that been lost during shipping and been replaced immediately.


----------



## Aaron622

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've said this before, but probably hundred or so pages ago: it isn't the waiting for the Reference that bothers me, it's what happens when your Xin amp breaks and you have to return it for repair. then what?? Wait another 8+ months to get it back??? All in all not a very bright prospect for me to continue to wait for a Xin amp._

 

x2 That's what I've been thinking about lately.


----------



## Jaw007

Xin amps are like diamonds,they hold their value!


----------



## jamato8

No, I am sorry, diamonds are easier to come by.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, I am sorry, diamonds are easier to come by._

 

True but if they were to dump all the diamonds on the market ,they would be valueless.And I would say there are far fewer Xin amps then diamonds in this world.


----------



## jamato8

Exactly.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vvs_75* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think that the chance that it breaks is very small but if it's happens I think Dr.Xin will fix the amp in a matter of just few days. I am thinking about that Reference that been lost during shipping and been replaced immediately._

 


 If he can build/ship a replacement amp immediately, please explain why can't he build and ship at least one amp a week? Really...


----------



## jamato8

He mines the raw materials?


----------



## Jaw007

I wonder if DR.Xin builds his own circuit boards,and does all of his own soldering?If so no wonder he dosen't have the time to socialize on here.


----------



## jamato8

There are reasons that he does not come here. He did at one time but events were not to his liking. He has his circuit boards done but does all his own soldering by hand. He has bins full of tiny parts and his own small milling machine that is computer operated.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There are reasons that he does not come here. He did at one time but events were not to his liking. He has his circuit boards done but does all his own soldering by hand. He has bins full of tiny parts and his own small milling machine that is computer operated._

 

Wow!Than he wouldn't have time to answer many emails.
 I would say he is one busy man.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I wonder if DR.Xin builds his own circuit boards,and does all of his own soldering?If so no wonder he dosen't have the time to socialize on here._

 

Ahh, but that's the fallacy of this chain of thought. He's not getting the amps done so he should have plenty of time to answer emails, plan when parts will arrive, and actually get something done to ship. A rocket scientist certainly knows how to run projects, read gantt charts, identify resource constraints and resolve them, etc.

 Others have stated Xin promised the backlogs would be shipped by Thanksgiving. That was back in early November. If that was true at the time he could knock out a significant number in a few weeks time. Now we are going on a few months time with no shipments in quantity. 

 He really can't have it both ways. He cares for his customers, he's a bonafide genius, etc. but on the other hand he can't figure out how to ship the amps he's taken orders to build. This whole situation does not add up.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ahh, but that's the fallacy of this chain of thought... 
 ...This whole situation does not add up._

 

logic and reasoning do not belong in this thread.
 wild speculation and quiet desperation only, please.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_logic and reasoning do not belong in this thread.
 wild speculation and quiet desperation only, please._

 

Yeah, what gets into people??? I thought we were in the groove, you know, near to needing meds but here for each other but anything to do with normalcy is like, well you know. ;. . wacko . . .


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, what gets into people??? I thought we were in the groove, you know, near to needing meds but here for each other but anything to do with normalcy is like, well you know. ;. . wacko . . ._

 

...and with that, we now resume our regularly scheduled program of frustration, paranoia and despair.


----------



## aluren

we now have a support group for those frustrated about the wait. how nice! we're all here for each other i guess.


----------



## jamato8

Yes, we can meet, discuss, share stories, but what happens when someone gets their amp? Do they drop out, become a team leader offering therapy that in due time there will be appeasement? That life, though drawn taught by the anguish and angst of "the wait", continues and that yes, we are here for each other until. . . well . . . the last one has their amp in hand. The thought of that imparts a visceral carnage of withdrawal from what we have all come to embrace as life in the other room, the room of brother and sisterhood in this valley of camaraderie and shared experiences. 


 Oh, there is my Reference. . . . .


----------



## Quaddy

My names Quaddy Tweeder, and i have been a Xin quasi-customer for whats nearly been 7 months now.

 The X.C.A. support group here has been a tower of strength and has helped me come to terms with my addiction, sometimes termed '_upgraditis_' by muggles.

 I never knew there was anyone else, others who had also taken the plunge and been through the struggle and wait just like me.

 it really helps to have you guys to share the burden and exchange tips to aid and ease the withdrawal periods.

 thank you, thank you all for listening.


----------



## jamato8

It's ok man. Together we have strength and together we will pull through this . . gosh, I feel warm and fuzzy all over. . . . 

 Ok, stand up and be heard so that some day we can sit down and Listen!


----------



## 883dave

Has anyone tried to sell there place in the Que?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *883dave* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has anyone tried to sell there place in the Que?_

 

nice idea 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 xins queue system isnt chronologically linear, thats to say it doesnt seem to always matter if you are the earliest or latest orderer, some, who ordered _relatively_ 'recently' have had their amps before people who ordered way before them

 if you 'bought' a ticket in the queue from an early member, you may be in fact not be getting any better of a chance, although you would think so!

 its all a russian roulette!


----------



## JwangSDC

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nice idea 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 xins queue system isnt chronologically linear, thats to say it doesnt seem to always matter if you are the earliest or latest orderer, some, who ordered relatively 'recently' have had their amps before people who ordered way before them

 if you 'bought' a ticket in the queue from an early member, you may be in fact not be getting any better of a chance, although you would think so!

 its all a russian roulette!_

 

I think it's safe to say that the earlier you ordered, the higher probability you are to have a better spot in the Queue. I highly doubt his system is completely random.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nice idea 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 xins queue system isnt chronologically linear, thats to say it doesnt *seem* to *always* matter if you are the earliest or latest orderer, *some*, *who ordered relatively 'recently' have had their amps before people who ordered way before them*

 if you 'bought' a ticket in the queue from an early member, you *may* be in fact not be getting any better of a chance, *although you would think so*!

 its all a russian roulette!_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think it's safe to say that the earlier you ordered, the higher probability you are to have a better spot in the Queue. I highly doubt his system is completely random._

 

i agree. but its not guaranteed (_see above_). not enough to pay someone for another uncertainty. - anyway i digress.


----------



## tnmike1

Got another idea: I for one am sick of all this and have a Reference on order. when I get my notification, I'll take it, and someone can pay me $15 or so to ship it to them. Just don't want a Xin-based anything anymore. As mentioned in my last post on here, I fear if the thing breaks I'm in for another mulit-month wait to get it back. And yes, it DOES take months for a repair or update to be shipped. Have done it twice with his stuff and average delay time has been about 6 months, the last time being a SM LE IV I bought in July, sent for upgrade and got it back in Jan. Sorry Xin, lead times are just too long for this impatient American.


----------



## DDW

I have tried to be patient and understanding that XIN is different and runs his "BUSINESS" differently than others. Great - he's a perfectionist trying to provide customers with the best possible product he can. But, I don't understand how people can defend his lack of communication and common business courtesy.

 Maybe this is fine and works out for anyone who is fine with placing a credit card order and doesn't mind waiting for 6 - 18 months for a product. More power to your patience. ...... until something comes up where you "NEED" to reach him. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I recently had a problem with one of my credit cards and it was critical that I make sure no charges were made on that card or I would pay dearly for it.

 I have sent Xin multimple emails and left a voice message requesting contact via email of via phone - with no response. In all messages, I outlined the importance of contact and/or at least confirmation that the info has been changed.

 - NO replies! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If a charge had been made on that card and (possibly ?) still, I would pay MANY multiple times more in penalties and in fees than the amp is worth.
 Bank of America was going to increase my rates by more than double if I use my card anymore unless I sent them a letter telling them not to raise the rates. I unfortunately, have a pretty large balance on that card as I used it for a LOT of home improvements and property investments and I can't just pay that off in one month. Bank of America had me in a bind. There rules were that I had to quite using the card or any letter would be negated. - Any charge made on that card would instigate automatic raising of my rates on my entire balance. 

 Apparently, Bank of America made the news about all of this as a LOT of automated letters were sent out and a LOT of customers were pissed. I was one of them. I have excellent credit with excellent pay history. I called and was able to reach a manager who "verbally" changed my terms and said he would take care of this and my rates would not go up. But, he said he could not send me any type of written confirmation - not even an email. So, I am obviously still VERY skeptical. I don't trust credit card companies.
 So, as far as I am concerned, I may still be in a potentially bad situation if my card is charged.

 But, Xin won't respond to ANY of my MANY attempts to reach him. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I can't help but be "Pissed" about this incredibly poor level of service. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I get that many people have dealt with Xin and swear that he has always come through in the end and provided products and customer warranty service on products. But, how and when service is provided is still very relevant to a quality run business - and YES - this is a business.

 I can't for the life of me understand or appreciate how some people would try to defend Xin's way of doing business - Or trying to say this is not a business.

 Money has been "promised" by customer's. Even if money has not yet been recieved by the "business", as it is, the company has the ability to withdraw funds at their will, timing and descretion. The Consumer no longer has much ability to stop the transfer of funds without communication with Xin. So, Xin has the leverage.

 Conditions of a transaction have "Loosely" been outlined. But, even though the terms were loose in regards to delivery time, the general consensus would be that the products are WAY behind expected delivery.

 This is not a situation you give leniency to because of charity work.
 Heck, if I had a "worker" who wanted to help me for free, but provided this poor a quality of service, at some point I might just say thanks, but don't bother. The let down on expectations and hassles aren't worth the end result.

 I agree with many others. Maybe my amp would never need service, but obviously MANY people have had to send in amps for repair work for some reason or another. It actually sounds like there is a fairly high percentage of required warranty work compared to other electronice devices and products.

 I still haven't even heard a Xin amp, but more and more there appear to be options that compete with Xin. - The differences in sound just seem to be coming down to personal preferences at this point.

 As much as I find this wait frustrating, I can't imagine how frustrated I would be waiting and trying to contact Xin without replies on a warranty item that I had already paid for and had to send back to him and do without for months on end till who knows when.

 I did a lot of research on these forums for hours days and weeks trying to determine which amp to buy. I decided the Xin Reference seemed like the best option (at the time). Yes, there was some info out that indicated wait times were long, but all of the information that I read prior to placing my order fell way short of summing up what the wait times are for this Reference.

 I still like the brief excitement about all of them shipping before Thanksgiving! Whatever. I didn't beleive it then and I always wanted to jokingly add that they may still show up by Thanksgiving........... 2008.

 Based on how few amps "appear" to have been shipped and how poor communication has been, I am seriously wondering if Thanksgiving 2008 isn't highly optomistic at this point.

 His communication levels appear to have been bad at on and off intervals, but it seems to be reaching new lows.

 How are we as customers to be so certain that we really will get our amps at this point?

 The simple fact that he has come through in the past is not sufficient evidence that he will continue coming through.

 If anything, it appears to me that his service and reliability is clearly in question and clearly on the decline.

 I am to a point of seriously canceling my order and taking my business elsewhere. I am not convinced that Xin has earned my business. 

 Making a great product is one aspect of business and an aspect that some people feel is all that matters. But, I would argue that respecting your customers and providing at least some minimal amount of customer service is pretty important.

 I have watched as many people have tried to cancel their orders, but can't reach Xin for confirmation. An unconfirmed cancellation isn't much of a cancellation.

 I don't want to go buy another amp if I have no idea if my credit card will get dinged for another purchase some (unknown) day or not.

 As much as I am glad I have not paid via PayPal, I still don't like having unclaimed charges hanging out for months and years. - Especially, when I have a MAJOR issue with the credit card company that I provided the number to Xin and he won't take a few minutes to confirm the change information. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As much as I have been looking forward to hearing how "great" Xin's amps sound, the waiting and the customer service issues have greatly soured the wait. If I ever get a Xin amp, I am pretty sure I will have some little asterix tagged to the experience constantly reminding me about this horrible business experience.

 I have a hard time imagining enjoying a product so much as to totally justify this wait and poor service.

 ..... Service that is so bad you can't even reach the the guy to cancel an order even if you want to. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Because of the nature of my situation, I actually have a few choice words I would like to share with him.

 In my correspondence, I researched Xin's little rules about how to contact him and followed all the little silly requirements about how to address the messages, include the order number "In" the title, etc. And I left voice messages.

 I don't know how to handle the situation any better than I have tried.

 Xin's way of handling business is rediculous and HORRIBLE!!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .


----------



## musicmaker

DDW, I can relate to what you're saying. I made the mistake or ordering from him and had to change my credit card info. No response. I've probably sent him like 25 messages over the last 4 months. No response to even one of them. I've canceled my order (I think, he didn't respond to that either). Bottom line, I dont want to deal with this Xin character anymore. Good luck !


----------



## tha_dude

Xin is almost as bad as Larry Milligan. But the thing is...Xin could probably care less about that. One has to wonder just what it is that keeps him so occupied that he can't even handle legitimate requests as described above.


----------



## dazzer1975

There is probably a good chance he has died, meanwhile his paypal account keps getting credited LMAO


----------



## Drumonron

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_DDW, I can relate to what you're saying. I made the mistake or ordering from him and had to change my credit card info. No response. I've probably sent him like 25 messages over the last 4 months. No response to even one of them. I've canceled my order (I think, he didn't respond to that either). Bottom line, I dont want to deal with this Xin character anymore. Good luck !_

 

Ditto on the "I dont want to deal with this Xin character",

 I canceled too, glad I didn't use paypal.

 No confirmation on the cancellation, though....after several emails canceling...If I get charged my CC will credit me and deal with the collection from the "character".

 Moved funds to a Headamp product.

 Good luck to all on line


----------



## srikeerthi

Hmm, considering that today is 29th, its been 365 days! or a WHOLE YEAR since I ordered a Supermicro.


 Since I've chosen the option of CC I havent been charged yet. I have stopped sending mails to him coz he never replied to my earlier mails. So in effect I forget about it.

 In 2 months the CC would expire and I would be automatically out of the line. So for the moment I'm just forgetting about it (though I still check this thread for some kicks once in a while  )


----------



## shiezan

After waiting for almost 12 months, I emailed Xin today and told him to
 give me my money back. If he doesn't respond to this last email, I will sue him
 because he already took my money.

 To be honest, I think this is it for Xin's business.
 There are already a lot of amps out there that rival or
 even beat his "reference" in SQ along with relatively instant 
 shipping and considerate customer service.
 There is no reason anymore to wait over a year to get an 
 ugly amp from some random dude that will probably run
 away with the money.


----------



## tha_dude

i've been waiting about 6 months now. needless to say, things don't look too good


----------



## shiezan

It won't change. I was in exactly the same situation 6 months ago.


----------



## mp101

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_After waiting for almost 12 months, I emailed Xin today and told him to
 give me my money back. If he doesn't respond to this last email, I will sue him
 because he already took my money.

 To be honest, I think this is it for Xin's business.
 There are already a lot of amps out there that rival or
 even beat his "reference" in SQ along with relatively instant 
 shipping and considerate customer service.
 There is no reason anymore to wait over a year to get an 
 ugly amp from some random dude that will probably run
 away with the money._

 

I'd like to join you in that, I have requested my money back now, paid with PayPal, they still may do something? who knows?

 However I am in the UK so its difficult to sue, please PM me and let me know how you get on.

 Marc


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin is almost as bad as Larry. But the thing is...Xin could probably care less about that. One has to wonder just what it is that keeps him so occupied that he can't even handle legitimate requests as described above._

 

Please specify which Larry when you post these things. You mean Larry Milligan at Welcome to LaRocco Audio and NOT other Larry's (like Larry at Headphile or me).


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please specify which Larry when you post these things. You mean Larry Milligan at Welcome to LaRocco Audio and NOT other Larry's (like Larry at Headphile or me)._

 

Sorry about that, I edited my post. By saying Xin is almost "as *bad* as Larry" I thought we'd know which Larry I was referring to but I realize there is some room for confusion.


----------



## drc73rp

Im nearing the end of my rope as well. As soon as my headsix arrives (hopefully next week) and my Beta22 project gets underway (about the same time) im cancelling my order for a Reference. Im nearing 6 months from date of order. I need to move on with my life.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AnaKinDV8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Im nearing the end of my rope as well. As soon as my headsix arrives (hopefully next week) and my Beta22 project gets underway (about the same time) im cancelling my order for a Reference. Im nearing 6 months from date of order. I need to move on with my life.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

cancelled my order yesterday. Heck with him and his amps.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_cancelled my order yesterday. Heck with him and his amps.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

How many months have you been waiting?


----------



## Quaddy

lot of cancellations happening here.
 thats not good, anyway you wanna paint it, in the xin camp or not.

 damn shame all you guys who waited patiently didnt get what you ordered.

 nearing the 7mth mark here, i am too stubborn to have wasted that time to cancel as i want the reference amp, as a good quality spare if for nothing else, apart from the xin house sound, and trivial as it seems, the 1/4" jacks are very handy - now i have settled on 2 portable amps it is far less important to me, i havent been charged yet, and will continue to wait.

 good luck to all in the queue and, godspeed!

 OP wanna change the title of this thread? :
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




:
*
 Those who waiting Xin amp, post your date of cancellation !*


----------



## tk3

Things not looking too good around here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I am in the same boat as you Quaddy, nearly 7 months (kind of sad if you look at the big picture).

 Only reason I haven't canceled is because I have waited too long for it already, and he probably wouldn't even respond anyway.
 But since I already have a portable amp, it does not bother me that much.
 It is more of a "new toy" curiosity thing, and the convenience of the 200+ hr battery life, plus whatever enhanced sonic qualities it may have above my current amp.


----------



## slwiser

There are just so many other great portable amps out there today to keep on being hung on waiting. As much as I enjoy my Beta Reference this story is really sad. I can't help but think that there is another story behind this that we haven't heard but should have to have some real explanation as to why these amps are taking so long. I think this is my first post concerning the Xin Reference other than a simple note in almost six months. This is an embarrassment to anyone (especially me) who has encouraged anyone else to put good money into Dr. Xin's operation.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *slwiser* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There are just so many other great portable amps out there today to keep on being hung on waiting. As much as I enjoy my Beta Reference this story is really sad. I can't help but think that there is another story behind this that we haven't heard but should have to have some real explanation as to why these amps are taking so long. I think this is my first post concerning the Xin Reference other than a simple note in almost six months. This is an embarrassment to anyone (especially me) who has encouraged anyone else to put good money into Dr. Xin's operation._

 

Just wondering, since you have a Beta Reference, are there any portable amps you've heard that offer comparable or better sound quality?

 I realize it's a beta and everyone hears differently but maybe your thoughts could offer some suggestions to those that decided to cancel or are seeking an alternative.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *slwiser* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This is an embarrassment to anyone (especially me) who has encouraged anyone else to put good money into Dr. Xin's operation._

 

His inaction certainly isn't your fault; it was based on past experience. While not stellar it was at least acceptable.

 [soapbox] I guess the only takeway for reviewers and general public is to not get too worked up over betas. Reviews on them are based on work in progress (which you and others certainly call out properly) but a beta may never make it to production. In this case I think there was major over-hype which provided way too much legitimacy for this particular product. A prototype shouldn't be placed into the list of XXX amps reviewed in my opinion. Finished production, unmodified products that a noob would expect to recieve belong in them to prevent a lot of people from being hung out to dry. [/soapbox]

 Now, watch him ship out his entire backlog this week


----------



## mrarroyo

Although I received two Beta versions (sent one back) I was able to listen to HiFlight's Reference which was a production model (with Xin you never know). I loved it and I ranked as high based on that audition.

 It is a pity that Xin has basically disapeared. His amps have IMO been fantastic and for those willing to tweak a lot of fun. I will not wonder or speculate on why he is not available but it sure has disapointed a bunch of buyers.


----------



## jamato8

There are many variables. I have heard the Reference that was sent to Skylab, HiFlight and others to review and this Is Not what the Reference is supposed to sound like. It is like Skylab described and while not a bad amp what I have is a step above in all areas of sound. I just want it known that not all the References are the same and that the opinion that has been posted on the Reference passed around for review is not what the Reference was supposed to sound like but I do agree with what was expressed about the sound. 

 As to lack of contact from Xin, I am sorry for this. If I could do anything I would but I do not hear Xin either.


----------



## itsborken

Just want to clarify I'm not trying to beat you guys up over this; the only difference between you and the rest is Xin happened to send the amps your way. Just to get it out, I'm not implying he's seeded the reviewers as others have received References too.

 One thought on what's been said--if his amps aren't consistent that's not good either. As long as they are coming out one at a time it's really hard to put that stake in the ground as to what everyone else will eventually receive. One can hope, but that's not really what the goal of a review should be as it's potentially a disservice to the readers.

 I know your guys hearts are in the right place and you want to provide the best information possible to help others get the most value for their purchase. For caring enough to do that, I can't say thank you enough for what you do.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just want to clarify I'm not trying to beat you guys up over this; the only difference between you and the rest is Xin happened to send the amps your way. Just to get it out, I'm not implying he's seeded the reviewers as others have received References too.

 One thought on what's been said--if his amps aren't consistent that's not good either. As long as they are coming out one at a time it's really hard to put that stake in the ground as to what everyone else will eventually receive. One can hope, but that's not really what the goal of a review should be as it's potentially a disservice to the readers.

 I know your guys hearts are in the right place and you want to provide the best information possible to help others get the most value for their purchase. For caring enough to do that, I can't say thank you enough for what you do._

 


 +1

 My dissappointment is with how Xin handles business.

 Generally, there seems to not be too much to complain about in regards to product performance and the main reason I ordered was based on rave reviews of products.
 I knew going into this that there would be some wait times and communication wasn't the best.
 But, I didn't know wait times would be THIS rediculous and communication would be THIS HORRIBLE.

 I am even very open and understanding to the fact that this is a one-man show and that he (apparently) has another job and might be doing this on the side. But, even if he only put in a piddly 5-10 hours a week, I would think there would have been at least a few more amps being shipped and a little more consistancy and communication efforts.

 Also, I agree with itsborken about consistancy in the product.

 Obviously, everyone will be hoping for the best sounding one, but the VERY Large majority of us wouldn't know for sure which version we have.

 - Jamato, 

 What was the difference between yours vs. Skylab's and HiFlight's?

 How can we "visually" distinguish and confirm which version we have (assuming we ever get "SOMTHING".)?

 I have seen (and copied) some various pictures posted of some of the various prototypes, but I still don't know which one is best or which one is standard production. I am curious if anybody knows which one is standard production.

 According to Jamato, his sounded better than Skylab's and HiFlight's.

 My understanding is that Jamato had/has a version with 12,000 caps (????). But, I also thought I read where Jamato had added Black Gates. I assume these Black Gates are not standard with the Xin Reference (???)

 Quote from Jamato on Xin's forum: "My 12,000uf Reference with a coupld of Black Gates I bypassed with is nothing short of purity of sound."

 So, Jamato, what are you comparing to Skylab's and HiFlight's References? - Your beta Reference as you received it? Or you customized and modified Beta with Black Gates?

 Another Quote from Jamato: "The 12,000, 3 opamp Reference version is the best of the Reference series I have heard."


 Then there is this quote from HiFlight: "My Reference has the 22,000uf cap. It sounds superb! I did bypass mine with a 47uf Blackgate Hi-Q cap. It replaced the polarized bypass cap of unknown value."

 So, even HiFlight's version has been tweaked by himself and not a Xin factory standard (????????????)

 So, the more I read and more I research, the more I wonder how good the Xin Reference actually even sounds in it's "Base" form (??????????) - since so many of the Betas seem to be modified and upgraded after leaving Xin by their current owners (????????)

 I honestly don't know anything about opamps (or even Caps for that matter). Most of you guys know WAY more about the technical stuff than I know. But, I like info and like to learn. I want good sound. What different opamp configurations have been provided or are being used?

 What is involved with adding Black Gates? How much does it cost? How hard a project? What are the steps involved? Where do you get Black Gates? And what are the advantages and improvements?

 Hypothetically, there is always talk about Xin trying to provide the best possible amps and best possible sound. If this is the "Reference" and Black Gates improve the sound, why doesn't Xin include Black Gates?

 Here are some pictures I collected - I don't remember where they are from. And unfortunately, I didn't make note of any potentially worthy info that may have been associated with each picture.
 But, they have different caps and the circuit boards "Look" different.

 Also, there had been talk about 22,000 Caps, but I don't know what the advantages may or may not be. It appears the 22,000 option may be gone - good or bad (?????)

 Can anybody explain the differences?


 Xin Beta Reference circuit board with 15,000 Cap from 2007:







 Xin Beta Reference (different) circuit board with 12,000 Cap from 2007:












 Xin Beta Reference with yet ANOTHER different circuit board and 22,000uF Cap (*** STILL posted on Xin's original thread ???????):






 Which (what are the odds) looks very different from this following pic that is posted on the VERY SAME Post by Xin:






 And of course the circuit board is "AGAIN" different:







 I wouldn't be at all surprised if there even many more variations. I have been trying to keep up, but with over 300 pages of posts on this thread and on Xin's forum combined, it is VERY hard to have read everything let alone keep it all straight in my head - or remember over so many months.... 



 Then, if all those variable weren't enought, there has even been talk about different solder quality equating to different sound quality........ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Who knows what else?

 Basically, we have NO IDEA what we are getting ........

 With so many different betas and with having read about so many diffferent upgrade options for micros and macros and so on, I wouldn't be surprised if there will be many different variations of the Reference.

 How are we supposed to keep track of "best" options?

 It almost seems like just emptying random parts bins or something (?????)

 Heaven forbid I get a reference and find out it has the parts that weren't intended to be final / best production model.

 I don't think I could stand the wait for "Upgrades".

 What a nightmare. - for me anyway.

 Obviously, some people like to tune and tinker more than others.

 I just want the best and be done with it to enjoy my music.

 But, it would be nice to get an amp. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I don't really want to buy another to hold me over til pigs fly or whenever.....

 .


----------



## dazzer1975

life's too short, ive got an iqube and voyager, pico comig soon and getting a lisa 3 and then a home amp and might pick up the odd xin amp used, but nothing is this good to wait for, hell, I wouldn't wait for a woman this long, let alone a poxy amp.


----------



## Quaddy

@DDW - good post man, deals with stuff not mentioned before (that i have seen)

 regarding people on this forum who were sent a reference, having modified it away from stock using additional capacitors is a tad misleading if this wasnt mentioned plainly in any mini-review or commendation of the amp.

 we all know it has different flavours, with its evolution, with xin

 but i for one would like clarification from the head-fi posters who have been singing its praises as to whether this opinion was based on what was received or upgraded/modified units.


----------



## jamato8

I have modded and unmodded. It also have to do with the bypass cap being used. I don't like the black one Xin went with but he is also using a small film that was on some and I like it. Also the 12,000uf cap is the only one I really like. Not the 22,000 or 15,000.

 The difference in sound was very apparent to me from the one Skylab heard and apparently the one HiFlight compared to his, which he said sounded very close.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have modded and unmodded. It also have to do with the bypass cap being used. I don't like the black one Xin went with but he is also using a small film that was on some and I like it. Also the 12,000uf cap is the only one I really like. Not the 22,000 or 15,000.

 The difference in sound was very apparent to me from the one Skylab heard and apparently the one HiFlight compared to his, which he said sounded very close._

 

Could you briefly describe the differences in sound between the 12,000uf and 22,000uf caps?


----------



## Sanddancer

1 year today my order was placed


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Could you briefly describe the differences in sound between the 12,000uf and 22,000uf caps?_

 

I do not find the 22,000uf as transparent or as fast as the 12,000uf Panasonic FC. I find the bass is better with the 12 and the cleaness of the presentation, as in a singer, poorer as the performer is not as well defined with the 22,000. This of course pertains to instruments or performs.


----------



## _j_

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Sanddancer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1 year today my order was placed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

You poor soul. Do not feel alone as I will be copying and pasting your exact message in 9 days.

 Time to send another message to Xin....


----------



## kokohore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You poor soul. Do not feel alone as I will be copying and pasting your exact message in 9 days._

 

1 year today my order was placed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 For SMini, on 4/Mar/07. Sorry for everybody including me, who has already paid via paypal...


----------



## itsborken

Just out of curiosity, now that you've waited a year, how long would the two of you continue to wait without any response from Xin and nothing shipping before you'd say enough is enough?


----------



## mark_h

There has got to be something seriously awry at the Xin Factory. He has become a mythical _Willy Wonka_ type character.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just out of curiosity, now that you've waited a year, how long would the two of you continue to wait without any response from Xin and nothing shipping before you'd say enough is enough?_

 

Having hit 10 months today; Nothing in my life could be lower on my critical totem pole. It's not like I'm hoping the roofers get here before the rain does?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark_h* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There has got to be something seriously awry at the Xin Factory. He has become a mythical Willy Wonka type character._

 

. . . After Slugworth sent in his spies, dressed as Xin workers, to find out all of Xin's most precious amp-making secrets, Xin cried out, "I shall be ruined!" And do you know what he did then? He fired all of his workers and shut his doors. . .

 So here's where we wait for Xin to travel to LoopOutLand and arrange for the entire population to return with Xin to Oregon to produce Xin amps again at full bore. However, even then, we'll still be left with the mystery of "nobody ever goes in, and nobody ever goes out" to deal with. However, we'll all have our amps while we wonder at it. In fact, with the rate of production of amps that could be accomplished by the entire population of LoopOutLand, I'm guessing that we'll be seeing Xin amps of all varieties blister-packed in the checkout lines of our local Supermarkets and Phamacy chain stores.

 Just gotta wait for Xin to return from LoopOutLand . . .

 Amp-Out, Loop-Out, Loop-itty-Loo,
 I've got another puzzle for you . . . . .
 (songs about lessons to learn,
 such as patience,
 and not being greedy). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 I wonder when Golden Ticket Day will be . . . . . ?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

LOL


----------



## Pangaea

Seriously when was the last known amp even received?


----------



## aluren

i would like to know as well!


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just out of curiosity, now that you've waited a year, how long would the two of you continue to wait without any response from Xin and nothing shipping before you'd say enough is enough?_

 

I have three home amps and three portables. I ordered a Reference by credit card. I do wonder whether he's given up or something has happened. If that is the case I shall be sorry because from the little I know of him I like him. If he has my order and took on board the change of credit card number (no response to that, of course) then one day an unexpected email or parcel will arrive and I may have four portables. As he doesn't reply to emails, cancelling seems as problematical as not cancelling. Anyway, I'm getting on with my life and enjoying music when I have the time. This Xin story is a bit of an entertainment and not something to get worked up about.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark_h* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There has got to be something seriously awry at the Xin Factory. He has become a mythical Willy Wonka type character._

 

I'm starting to wonder. It seems he is still taking orders and delivering nothing. How long can that go on? That is why I come to this thread, to see whether any news has broken.


----------



## tomo3014

well, i heard some people got their upgraded sm4 last year around december so i guess
 he's doing his thing.
 not in a long run. as for me, 
 got myself a sm4 from a korean vendor and quite happy.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If he has my order and took on board the change of credit card number (no response to that, of course) then one day an unexpected email or parcel will arrive and I may have four portables._

 

I prefer to have access to my credit card numbers for as little time as possible. With systems being broken into, the hassle of sorting out bad charges and fixing up the credit report afterwards isn't worth the risk to me. Here's my card, ship me the product and destroy the info immediately is what I expect out of a vendor.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

My SM 3 v3 was updated by Xin around Thanksgiving while abs@nilenet still owned it. It still had the NE5534 opamps and sounds much better with AD797, but that is another story. The point being, if he was hit by a car or something, it was AFTER Thanksgiving 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Hope he is okay, even better would be if he surfaces and makes his status known.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hope he is okay, even better would be if he surfaces and makes his status known._

 

Am I correct in thinking there are members here who actually know where Xin lives and live near him themselves?

 If this is true, I'm surprised that no one has gone to his residence recently and actually verified the place is either actively occupied or hasn't burned to the ground?

 Wouldn't be the first time a solitary individual was found dead as a doornail sitting in his Laz-E-Boy?


----------



## jamato8

He doesn't have a Laz-e-boy. :^)

 I used to live near him and we used visit but I moved to Calif. Not sure what is up.


----------



## tk3

Seems like someone is deleting the spams off his forum though, and since he is the moderator, it must be his doing?


----------



## jamato8

Yep. When was the last spam there?

 The detective work begins. . . .


----------



## kodreaming

I am lost.
 Should I still consider Xin's AMP as a candidate given it seems to take a year to get it...?


----------



## jamato8

At this point, until something happens on his site and things start rolling, if they do, I would not.


----------



## vandread

Today is my 7 months mark.....................

 can't compare with sanddancer or other's 1 year.........

 But still 7 months is a plenty of time for 1 tiny amp.........

 Already forgot about that, don't care anymore if i could or couldn't got the amp......

 (but deeeeeeep deeeeeep down inside, still rest a hope to get it)

 I will moving to other state in july/august, quest if it could arrived before that.........


----------



## Wotan1

Today is my 7th month mark as well. Me stupid.. Paid bij Paypal..

 To be honest I get this feeling that Xin will not deliver..


----------



## Quaddy

snap! - *7 months* to the day. if i get it in anything less than 23 mths will be stunned!


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He doesn't have a Laz-e-boy. :^)

 I used to live near him and we used visit but I moved to Calif. Not sure what is up._

 

Maybe e-mail him asking how he's doing?


----------



## lisnalee

7 months today for me as well


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Am I correct in thinking there are members here who actually know where Xin lives and live near him themselves?

 If this is true, I'm surprised that no one has gone to his residence recently and actually verified the place is either actively occupied or hasn't burned to the ground?

 Wouldn't be the first time a solitary individual was found dead as a doornail sitting in his Laz-E-Boy?_

 

I have been watching this thread for a long time now. Before I received my beloved Reference -after 9 months of waiting- more closely than nowadays. But somehow I've always been dragged to this Saga. I guess it's out of pietism of the one's who are waiting.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Anyway, I think Osama Bin Laden is the only one who can beat Dr. Xin when it comes to the person on earth who is giving more feed to speculation on what's he's doing, where he is, what he's up to, when we hear from him again and if he is still alive at all.


----------



## BushGuy

I'm now at 10 months. Sent him a follow-up email in Sept........and another last weekend combined with question of whether or not to send in my Supermini for updates. Zero response thus far. He has always answered me in the past. It seems to me he is intensely involved in a non-audio related professional job..........or something physical may have happened to him.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe e-mail him asking how he's doing?











_

 

I have, many times but I haven't heard anything.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have, many times but I haven't heard anything._

 

Surprise, surprise.......what's new
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If he ain't replying on one of the best photographers around, there must be something serious wrong with him.....


----------



## Sanddancer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just out of curiosity, now that you've waited a year, how long would the two of you continue to wait without any response from Xin and nothing shipping before you'd say enough is enough?_

 

To be honest, I expect to never receive anything from him. From the way things have been going, I can't see him recovering, especially not going back to building SuperMicros. If my order was for a Reference, then maybe I'd hold out a fraction more hope.

 I think the whole thing is disgusting. People can post here all they like about how it's not a business, how I'm not 'buying' anything, just benefiting from an idividual's hobby etc etc. That's complete rubbish. His website advertises a product for sale. Nowhere does it say that you can expect to wait for a year, nowhere does it say that he's not building these things for sale, rather just for his own amusement and you're paying to enter into the great Xin lottery to see if you can 'win' a part of the output of this hobby of his. I'm sure if he stopped paying taxes the government wouldn't have a hard time seeing him as a business.

 If you pay by Paypal, he takes your money. He advertises a product, people pay in good faith and get nothing in return. One or two items here and there over a period of months. He's knows his order list, he knows the amount of work involved in getting his orders out. He knows what he is capable of. If he knows that he has more orders than he can handle, why not send a global e-mail to all his customers? Why not put a notice on his website, why not stop accecpting orders, why not take his site down? Soliciting orders, advertising a product and taking peoples money (all the Paypal folk) when you know full well that they're never likely to see an amp or if they are it's going to be literally years down the line, then ignoring and deleting e-mails from these customers when they express concern...dispicable. Out of interest, I wonder how much interest is being accrued by the Paypal orders sitting in a bank somewhere?

 It may sound over the top, but at the moment, forgetting the way things were a year or two ago, they way are now, I'm having a hard time telling the difference betweein Xin and Ken Law.


----------



## jamaya15

I preordered a supermicro IV in January with full expections of waiting about a year to get it. I stupidly payed with paypal which was a mistake in retrospect.

 Seeing as no one can get in contact with him myself included, ive gone ahead and file a claim with paypal. I understand that the guy has other things going on in his life but the very least he could do is respond to a simple email.

 Really hate to do this to the guy but there are plenty of other great amps out there. Even if it isnt exactly a buisness he is running, he still owes it to people to atleast post an eta or show some signs of life. I will never get his amp but at this point ill be happy just to get my money back.


----------



## itsborken

You're probably doing everyone a service--Paypal isn't going to associate themselves with a non-shipping vendor. If enough people complain his account will be pulled and nobody will get burned in the future.


----------



## BoxBoxBox

I put in a credit card order for the supermicro, didn't realize it would take over a year... is there any way to cancel the order? I'll be moving in three months and don't want the future tenants in October 2010 getting a free supermicro


----------



## itsborken

Send him a registered letter (photocopy it). If he ships it later and bills your credit card you can easily dispute it with this historical record here and the notification you sent. It costs you some money but you will be protected.


----------



## Happy Camper

Just specuilation but perhaps he has been called in to his past career and has been told to keep invisible. At least in the movies, we had glimpes of the whereabouts of the subject. The plot thickens.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Happy Camper* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just specuilation but perhaps he has been called in to his past career and has been told to keep invisible. At least in the movies, we had glimpes of the whereabouts of the subject. The plot thickens._

 

Haha, double-O-Xin. What if he bumps into a headphone enthusiast on his super secret missions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 he'll be in for some trouble then.


----------



## tbmusic

I have been waiting for almost 8 months. "Innocent me" paid by Pay Pal so there is almost nothing I can do. I have moved on to speakers. I used to visit Head-Fi everyday but now I only visit the site for a few minutes a week to check on this thread. Really really disappointed with Xin!!!!!


----------



## tnmike1

Hey you West Coast people. You have his address. Go bang on his door and see if anyone's home. If he is, tell him he's got a ton of really POed people out here and what the f....k is he doing???


----------



## Jalo

I tried to log on the Cool Stuff which is Xintechs.com and found the site says the following:

 xintechs.com
 This domain is for sale!

 Does anyone know where is Xin's website at now?


----------



## musicmaker

Xin Feng Company


----------



## kanan

Maybe someone call the police...?


----------



## Aaron622

Just celebrated my 7 month anniversary for my Supermico IV (originally a Reference) by ordering a Minibox E+ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm not going to cancel the Xin order though. Maybe one day it will magically show up


----------



## kanan

Yeah he may show up someday. I hope he just take a vacation.


----------



## bluey_02

Okay okay okay okay after a whole freakin' year of waiting, I finally received the invoice for my SuperMicroIV! Yeeeaaaaah!


----------



## tk3

Wow, that is good news indeed.


----------



## Nuwidol

So he's still alive & he even made a SuperMicro!

 I was just coming on here to suggest we start a petition asking Xin for an update on the progress of our orders but things may finally be looking up.

 I ordered a SuperMicro on August 7th though so i've still got some waiting


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bluey_02* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Okay okay okay okay after a whole freakin' year of waiting, I finally received the invoice for my SuperMicroIV! Yeeeaaaaah!_

 

So let me get this straight: you just received the _invoice_, not the amp itself?


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So let me get this straight: you just received the invoice, not the amp itself? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I am glad to see there is a sign of life at least.
 And AFAIK, he charges when the amp is ready to ship, so the invoice is probably a sign that the amp will follow very soon.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am glad to see there is a sign of life at least.
 And AFAIK, he charges when the amp is ready to ship, so the invoice is probably a sign that the amp will follow very soon._

 

Oh, okay! In that case: congrats with your new Xin 'invoice'!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 How does it sound? Was it well packed?
 I guess it is too early for some initial impressions? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And hey, don't forget the pics, I am dying to see an original Xin Bill! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 Ben


----------



## Jaw007

congrats


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am glad to see there is a sign of life at least.
 And AFAIK, he charges when the amp is ready to ship, so the invoice is probably a sign that the amp will follow very soon._

 

Excellent news, hopefully he's gotten enough grief/cancellations lately that he's going to work on this regularly get through his backlog. I sure hope for everyone's sake that this isn't a 'throw a few out the door and buy another couple months of relative quiet' (until people complain again and the cycle repeats as has been the trend of late). 

 Anyone else get any notification from Dr Xin about shipments?


----------



## Quaddy

i think you are right, i pen this as being another very small run, and a long lull afterward, why am i so cynical?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, okay! In that case: congrats with your new Xin 'invoice'!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 How does it sound? Was it well packed?
 I guess it is too early for some initial impressions? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And hey, don't forget the pics, I am dying to see an original Xin Bill! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 Ben_

 

Sounds like any other paper when you crumple it up


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sounds like any other paper when you crumple it up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I guess this is the only $169.99 bill you do _not _ want to crumple.....

 It's a mad world.....


----------



## aluren

looks like wait time might stretch to 3 years!


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, okay! In that case: congrats with your new Xin 'invoice'!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 How does it sound? Was it well packed..._

 

What is the recommended burn-in procedure with that invoice? I heard it starts to really sound good after 400 hours or 2 beers...whichever happens first!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_looks like wait time might stretch to 3 years!_

 

That's only for good behavior. Otherwise he'll have to do the full 5 years.
 Making license plates instead of amps. 

 I'm not the type of guy that's say's "I told you so", but last July, "I told you so".


----------



## srikeerthi

Xin's alive!!!

 I got my invoice and tracking number for the shipment too! 

 Supermicro IV
 Ordered: 1st March 2007
 Shipped: 15th March 2008

 Now only if the year were same above, it would have been sooo much nicer!


----------



## fdhfdy

june 23


----------



## DDW

2 supermicros in a years time and no sign of References.

 Forgive me for having a similar cynical feeling to a few others.

 Dead silence for many months then a couple of amps released has been done before.

 Great that he is still doing "something".... , but a long stretch from making amends for poor communication and wait times.

 At this rate, Thanksgiving 2008 does NOT look realistic and Thanksgiving 2009 is still VERY suspect unless WAY more orders are cancelled.


 .


----------



## tk3

Strange that he is shipping orders all the way from March again ..wasn't he shipping orders from June 2007 in the Nov/Dec 2007 batch?
 Or perhaps those were only units returned for upgrade.


----------



## kokohore

I think many more `March 2007` guys are still waiting, me included (since 04/Mar/07). Any other news? (or have you cancelled?)


----------



## zeckwsr

FINALLLLLLLLLYYYYYY!!!

 "A package was shipped to you on 03/15/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International to the following address:"

 i ordered my supermicro on 1st march *2007*!!!

 hope you guys dun hv to wait too long now XDDDDD


----------



## kokohore

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zeckwsr* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_FINALLLLLLLLLYYYYYY!!!

 "A package was shipped to you on 03/15/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International to the following address:"

 i ordered my supermicro on 1st march *2007*!!!

 hope you guys dun hv to wait too long now XDDDDD_

 

Congratulations!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And now, my turn!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .... I think I have seen this before.... nevermind....


----------



## Drumonron

I am thinking that Xin's amps are currently irrelevant.

 I wish him good health and peace.


----------



## PhaedrusX

against my better judgement, i'm going to allow my hopes to get up a little.

 ...just for a day or two.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin's alive!!!

 I got my invoice and tracking number for the shipment too! 

 Supermicro IV
 Ordered: 1st March 2007
 Shipped: 15th March 2008

 Now only if the year were same above, it would have been sooo much nicer! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Really. Perhaps he's on one of his rocket ships and Einsteinian physics is involved. He only got the order a few days ago in his timestream but in our timeline a year has passed.

 Wave to Voyager for us Xin.


----------



## Nailzs

The way the economy is taking a nose dive I think my $250.00 for a "Reference" is better spent investing in gold or silver.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nailzs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The way the economy is taking a nose dive I think my $250.00 for a "Reference" is better spent investing in gold or silver._

 

agreed, but isnt a xin reference actually worth more that gold dust? to _coin_ an old addage


----------



## filipelli

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin's alive!!!

 I got my invoice and tracking number for the shipment too! 

 Supermicro IV
 Ordered: 1st March 2007
 Shipped: 15th March 2008

 Now only if the year were same above, it would have been sooo much nicer! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Man I have been looking for a xin super mini for the longest time now...what do you guys think, should I place an order?


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *filipelli* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man I have been looking for a xin super mini for the longest time now...what do you guys think, should I place an order?_

 

Go ahead and place an order,and may be you will get one in a year too.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *filipelli* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man I have been looking for a xin super mini for the longest time now...what do you guys think, should I place an order?_

 

If you are ordering with CC, why not, you can always cancel it later then if you decide you don't want it anymore.
 But I wouldn't pay him through Paypal, you are likely not to see your amp in 12 months or more, looking at the current trend.


----------



## tottiflames

It is getting longer and longer.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *filipelli* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man I have been looking for a xin super mini for the longest time now...what do you guys think, should I place an order?_

 

It is so hard to say if and when you may get it. The Super Mini is a great little amp, a jewel but will you get it? I guess with a card you won't get charged so order it and forget about it and hope. I know the latest Mini will incorporate Xin's latest changes but when you get it I don't know, maybe, well maybe things will start I don't know.


----------



## Sanddancer

Strike a light! One year and 2 weeks after placing my order I've just received an e-mail from Xin. My SuperMicro is ready, but my bank card long since expired. New details have been provided and I should at long last have my amp.


----------



## tk3

Neat, if he keeps this pace up, we'll all have our amps soon.


----------



## Quaddy

wow - seems to be people who have been waiting approx a year are getting their amps through, oh well, another 4 and a half months to go!

 good going guys, hope you enjoy them!


----------



## jamato8

There may be a further break through in sound but the Micro and Mini are good sounding as they are. imo


----------



## Pangaea

I'm right with you Quaddy- ordered in Aug 2007. We'll see.


----------



## kokohore

I have received this mail today; 
 `A package was shipped to you on 03/18/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Express Mail International`....

 Like some recent posts, just after 1 year and 2 weeks wait (supermini ordered 04/Mar/07)


----------



## MrScary

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm right with you Quaddy- ordered in Aug 2007. We'll see._

 

I seriously think this guy (XIN) is insane he needs to hire people and accept the fact that others know his technology.. Taking months to a year to get an amp or wait is he insane or is everyone insane on headfi? yes, the amps sound good but not better than anything else in that price range in fact some sound better and cost half of his Macro... I think that instead of this being a wait for the best. It has become a obsession like a 80 year old lady with a bucket of quarters at the casino..

 No offense guys its just quite insane..


----------



## jamato8

Yes but if we did not have some insanity how would be balance the universe?


----------



## bluey_02

Whoa, whoa hey now, there was a point where I thought that (due to others' testimonials) where I thought the amp would take four months at the most..
 I do agree, a year is ridiculous, but I haven't exactly been checking my email every week for that invoice. It's a nice little surprise to say the least. 

 Oh and to be clear, the amp has been sent, I will post opening pics and initial impressions.. I shall see if it has been worth the wait.


----------



## gregeas

I ordered a Reference in early August 07. In the meantime I've purchased a Pico and a Lisa XP. And I've gotten really frustrated with the wait. So last week I sent an email in which I demanded a refund (I had paid with Paypal, so he had my money). 

 Yesterday I received a refund from Xin. To be honest, this surprised me. I thought I would never see that money again. Paypal is no help when this much time is a passed... 

 Anyhow, he does seem to be tending to at least some of his business.


----------



## tk3

Hm, it's nice that you got a refund.
 I am thinking of going the same way actually (since there are so many good amps out there that have more acceptable lead times), but I've had no reply from Xin.
 To be honest I would much rather have the amp, but I don't really want to wait a year for it (7 months now..).

 I just hope that he will work through his backlog in the next month or so, now that he's shown some activity again.


----------



## vexeus

Ordered SuperMicro IV- March 7th, 2007.
 Received invoice & shipping notice - March 18th, 2008.

 At some point, I expressed interest in a Reference and I did receive responses from Xin. I decided to stick with the SuperMicro and did NOT order a reference. I also changed my address 3 times and did not receive confirmation for the last 2 address changes. However, my invoice today shows a SuperMicro IV and a Reference ordered and shipped to me AT MY CURRENT ADDRESS (I was surprised) with the following:

 "As you showed interests in both amps, so I give you both
 and a $80 discount for the reference. You may return the
 one(s) you don't like for refund. Thanks, Xin"

 Woooooo hooooo. That made the reference $199. I think I'll keep them both for a while and see which I like more. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And to be completely honest, I am extremely surprised that Xin remembered every e-mail I sent him with every update. I guess he gets the e-mail and takes note, but usually doesn't respond...?

 Over a year I've waited for these... I hope it was worth it!


----------



## Nuwidol

lots of shipping notices but no new amps in the hands of their patient owners yet?


----------



## MrScary

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes but if we did not have some insanity how would be balance the universe?_

 

Well to get balance I think we need to do this.
 ask for volunteers and assist Xin in getting his amps done
 now of course we cant see his secret technology (laughs) so we will all be blind folded..And we will feel out way through and around it.

 then when all is done 600 mini's and 300 macros on the scale this will balace all time and space...


----------



## srikeerthi

Surprising to see no one has received them yet. Mine was shipped on the 14th. Its landed in Malaysia (where I live now) few hours back. People who ordered in USA should have had it by now.

 Waiting to get my hands on it. I'm not sure what to expect of it now.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrScary* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ It has become a obsession like a 80 year old lady with a bucket of quarters at the casino.._

 

...or nickels, better yet. Those gals have sharp elbows 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 !


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Surprising to see no one has received them yet. Mine was shipped on the 14th. Its landed in Malaysia (where I live now) few hours back. People who ordered in USA should have had it by now.

 Waiting to get my hands on it. I'm not sure what to expect of it now._

 

 Congratulations: How many months did you have to wait for yours?


----------



## srikeerthi

12.5 months only!


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_12.5 months only! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thank you,I have been waiting only 4 months.I guess I have a long wait yet.


----------



## vandread

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered SuperMicro IV- March 7th, 2007.
 Received invoice & shipping notice - March 18th, 2008.

 At some point, I expressed interest in a Reference and I did receive responses from Xin. I decided to stick with the SuperMicro and did NOT order a reference. I also changed my address 3 times and did not receive confirmation for the last 2 address changes. However, my invoice today shows a SuperMicro IV and a Reference ordered and shipped to me AT MY CURRENT ADDRESS (I was surprised) with the following:

 "As you showed interests in both amps, so I give you both
 and a $80 discount for the reference. You may return the
 one(s) you don't like for refund. Thanks, Xin"

 Woooooo hooooo. That made the reference $199. I think I'll keep them both for a while and see which I like more. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And to be completely honest, I am extremely surprised that Xin remembered every e-mail I sent him with every update. I guess he gets the e-mail and takes note, but usually doesn't respond...?

 Over a year I've waited for these... I hope it was worth it!_

 

Whoooaaaaa.............. what a luck.......... very good offer............

 I'm soooooo envy to u.......... 

 And then after that u will sell a Reference for $180 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ?????


----------



## Dawei2008

Gratz! Perhaps i need to consider ordering a Reference now.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dawei2008* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*Perhaps i need to consider ordering a Reference now*._

 

its ok, we will let you off with that comment, seeing as you are new round here!


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_its ok, we will let you off with that comment, seeing as you are new round here!




_

 

Poor (lucky?) innocent soul......


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered SuperMicro IV- March 7th, 2007.
 Received invoice & shipping notice - March 18th, 2008.

 At some point, I expressed interest in a Reference and I did receive responses from Xin. I decided to stick with the SuperMicro and did NOT order a reference. I also changed my address 3 times and did not receive confirmation for the last 2 address changes. However, my invoice today shows a SuperMicro IV and a Reference ordered and shipped to me AT MY CURRENT ADDRESS (I was surprised) with the following:

 "As you showed interests in both amps, so I give you both
 and a $80 discount for the reference. You may return the
 one(s) you don't like for refund. Thanks, Xin"

 Woooooo hooooo. That made the reference $199. I think I'll keep them both for a while and see which I like more. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And to be completely honest, I am extremely surprised that Xin remembered every e-mail I sent him with every update. I guess he gets the e-mail and takes note, but usually doesn't respond...?

 Over a year I've waited for these... I hope it was worth it!_

 

Congrats on getting your amps.
 I am happy that you got your order, but I do think it's baffling that Xin is sending you a second amp that you didn't even order, when he has such a large backlog of orders still out there that he should be very well aware of.
 Most likely his inbox is filled with status update requests from people looking for the amp they paid for, which he doesn't even bother to reply to, and then he pulls something like this.

 What is that man thinking.


----------



## itsborken

good point


----------



## mark_h

Anyones amp landed yet?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Congrats on getting your amps.
 I am happy that you got your order, but I do think it's baffling that Xin is sending you a second amp that you didn't even order, when he has such a large backlog of orders still out there that he should be very well aware of.
 Most likely his inbox is filled with status update requests from people looking for the amp they paid for, which he doesn't even bother to reply to, and then he pulls something like this.

 What is that man thinking. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It seems to me that when he picks up an order he focuses on it and pays attention to that customer, disregarding all the other customers who are at that point outside his attention, screaming for their amps....


----------



## musicmaker

We can all guess about how he operates, what's on his mind etc. The fact of the matter is that, its a terrible way of running any business and he's pissing off a lot of customers. I canceled my order via email. Of course he didn't acknowledge my email on that either. He better not charge my credit card. I'm not doing business withs someone like this period. His amps may be good but there are other very good amps out there from vendors with customer service.


----------



## chris_ah1

Irony is I put in an order ages ago for a supermacro IV LE......and I mean perhaps a year ago. 

 Fortunately I have a xin reference amp for free to tide me over. I'll return it when I get my amp. 

 No credit charge yet


----------



## itsborken

It seems cancellations get his attention back on producing *something* for a short period of time. I asked for a refund on my paypal, a few shipped. Someone else did the same a few months later, same thing. Two order cancellations recently, now some more shipments.

 Looks like someone has to step up and take one for the team to keep him quasi-focused.


----------



## BushGuy

Oddly enough, Chris aH1......I ordered my LE just after Xmas 2006 and it was built 4/12/07. A further personal "update" I was able purchase and received a beta Reference (w/22000uf cap) and was not surprised it was an excellent mating with Klipsch Images.......what REALLY surprised me is what it did with Alessandro Ms Pro - actual toe-tappin' ensued. Nothing boring with this mating 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. The MS Pro really come alive now. Up to now I'd only considered them adjuncts to HP-2 (off-setting performance for specific tracks/recordings)....But, I'd never considered the MS Pro for portable use. Gotta give this a goood think 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ........and my orig. Reference order is still out there for fulfilling.


----------



## srikeerthi

Got my slimy hands on the package minutes ago. My Supermicro IV is here.

 Ordered: 1 March 2007
 Shipped: 14 March 2008
 Received: 21 March 2008


----------



## tk3

Nice, can we see pictures?
 I recall that he said on forums months ago that he was working upgrades from the Reference design in all his amps or something like that.
 Would be interesting to see if the amps that are shipped now are better than the 4/11 ones.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my slimy hands on the package minutes ago. My Supermicro IV is here.

 Ordered: 1 March 2007
 Shipped: 14 March 2008
 Received: 21 March 2008_

 

Pic's,and impressions please?


----------



## packetloss

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Got my slimy hands on the package minutes ago. My Supermicro IV is here.

 Ordered: 1 March 2007
 Shipped: 14 March 2008
 Received: 21 March 2008_

 

Wow, when I ordered my supermini IV a couple of years ago it took 3 or 4 months to come and I thought that was long! 

 He really needs to hire some help or something.


----------



## DDW

I don't see much new info here. And not much to get excited about in regards to getting amps. Just (maybe) another couple shipped in the last couple of months - "maybe" one received and no pics.....

 .


----------



## srikeerthi

Yeah, I have received it. Sorry no pics yet. Been to busy to click pictures of it. Its still burning in. 

 I have listened to it for a while in between. I have no golden ears and the only other amp I have heard extensively is Xtra X1-pro. And this sounds much better than it. It been sucking up batteries too. Running on the third alkaline since i got it (total of about 30-35 hours till now).


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *srikeerthi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, I have received it. Sorry no pics yet. Been to busy to click pictures of it. Its still burning in. 

 I have listened to it for a while in between. I have no golden ears and the only other amp I have heard extensively is Xtra X1-pro. And this sounds much better than it. It been sucking up batteries too. Running on the third alkaline since i got it (total of about 30-35 hours till now)._

 

The Supermicro IV should play for about 30 hours on a single alkaline battery. Wonder why yours is sucking up the batteries so fast?


----------



## jamato8

There must have been some changes. 12 hours or so on a battery?? That would be a different opamp used or combination, which seems odd. It would be nice to see a close-up of the board.


----------



## fkclo

This I would say "abnormal" - better to write back to Xin to confirm what he thinks should be the "normal" battery life. I cannot imagine Xin will produce a design that has only 10 hours per set of batteries. This is like going one big step backwards.

 F. Lo


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Supermicro IV should play for about 30 hours on a single alkaline battery. Wonder why yours is sucking up the batteries so fast? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Not to mention the Eneloops I use with my referene: they seem to last forever.


----------



## fkclo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Not to mention the Eneloop's I use with my referene: they seem to last forever._

 

My Reference last over 250 hours (probably much more) for one set of Eneloops for me.

 F. Lo


----------



## jamato8

I love the eneloops. I use the AA's in my portable Monica II dac and they do make a difference and having that stored energy seeping away while they are stored is also a very nice plus.


----------



## srikeerthi

Hmm, I too would imagine that it would last more than 20 hours. Maybe its me, i've been burning it in on higher than average volumes, and one of the batteries was used a bit before I put em in the SMIV. 

 I'm not alarmed yet. I will wait for a week before making any conclusions.


----------



## vexeus

I got back from vacation yesterday and found 2 amplifiers in the mail.

 I thought battery installation in the reference was kind of tricky. It seemed as though you needed to push 4 batteries in at once to avoid moving the large cap. On top of this, the foamy material keeping the cap in place makes the bottom batteries more difficult to push in. Perhaps I'm just unskilled in battery installation.

 Very first impressions were that I liked the sound of the SMIV more than the reference. However, I need to let both burn in before I pass any REAL judgement on sound.

 Today some Yuin Pk1's arrived in the mail and they have been paired up with the reference for burn in. They seem to be getting along just fine.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got back from vacation yesterday and found 2 amplifiers in the mail.

 I thought battery installation in the reference was kind of tricky. It seemed as though you needed to push 4 batteries in at once to avoid moving the large cap. On top of this, the foamy material keeping the cap in place makes the bottom batteries more difficult to push in. Perhaps I'm just unskilled in battery installation.

 Very first impressions were that I liked the sound of the SMIV more than the reference. However, I need to let both burn in before I pass any REAL judgement on sound.

 Today some Yuin Pk1's arrived in the mail and they have been paired up with the reference for burn in. They seem to be getting along just fine. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

when did you place your order?


----------



## jamato8

That big cap takes some time to form. The installation of the batteries really isn't difficult as I just put one in at a time, observing the polarity. The cap doesn't move so that is not a problem.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I got back from vacation yesterday and found 2 amplifiers in the mail._

 

I sure hope this is a trend rather than a fluke...


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_when did you place your order?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vexeus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered SuperMicro IV- March 7th, 2007.
 Received invoice & shipping notice - March 18th, 2008._

 

O' how many times must a man post his order date,
 before they call him a Xin amp owner...

 the answer my friend, is blowin' in the wind,
 the answer is blowin' in the wind.


----------



## tk3

No more shipping notices after those few though.
 Let's hope he is taking an easter break and hasn't disappeared again.


----------



## vexeus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_when did you place your order?_

 

I posted a few pages back about my shipping notice and such. I was just following up on my initial impressions.

 Also, the purple napkins he includes are nice.


----------



## Nuwidol

Come on guys, were are all the pictures?


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Come on guys, were are all the pictures?_

 

x2, we need something to keep us going till ours turn up


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I don't own a Xin amp anymore, I just sold my SM3 with AD797 last week, after I bought a Predator and Pico and iBasso D2. Sorry.


----------



## mark_h

Not new but recently received.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark_h* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_









 Not new but recently received._

 

Thanks very nice amp.


----------



## kokohore

Ordered SMini IV 4/Mar/07
 Shipped 18/Mar/08
 Received 25/Mar/08
 1 year and 3 weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




















 Compared to the pics on fixup.net, I only noticed the difference in opamps and cap.
 Out of the box, it sounds superb with ER4Ps and PK1


----------



## jamato8

Yes the Mini is a great little amp. It is plastic but I love the feel and the small size and oh yeah, the sound. :^)


----------



## tk3

Anything happening here, beyond the initial 3-4 shipping notices, or has it died down again?

 Geez, I actually bought some of those Eneloop batteries because there was a local group buy and I could get them a few bucks off.
 Even though I don't have any device that takes AAA batteries, and I already have some packs of non-rechargeable batteries around.
 Is this addiction or is this addiction?


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kokohore* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ordered SMini IV 4/Mar/07
 Shipped 18/Mar/08
 Received 25/Mar/08
 1 year and 3 weeks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





















 Compared to the pics on fixup.net, I only noticed the difference in opamps and cap.
 Out of the box, it sounds superb with ER4Ps and PK1 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks for the very nice pictures,very interesting.


----------



## itsborken

Yeah, what are all those pin jumpers for anyway?


----------



## BushGuy

The jumpers are for Impedence (eg. if you want your Ety er4P to sound as er4S), Gain, Bassboost, crossfeed.

 Every once an awhile somebody PMs to ask if I'd be interested in selling my Supermini IV........foolish children 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 But, now, since I have both Supermacro LE and Reference in my sweaty hands.......I'm comfortable sending the Supermini in for updates so that it will sound similar to the Reference. Yea!


----------



## JarodL1

Typical Xin. No response for months, no amps go out and when customers really start getting restless and canceling orders he goes ahead and fills a few orders so everyone doesn't cancel. 

 The people in charge of head-fi should ban his name from the site to keep him from getting any business. It is obvious he reads all of his emails and checks his site (I wouldn't be surprised if he read this one as well). Why should he continue to get free advertising when he doesn't have the decency to respond to his customers?


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The jumpers are for Impedence (eg. if you want your Ety er4P to sound as er4S), Gain, Bassboost, crossfeed.

 Every once an awhile somebody PMs to ask if I'd be interested in selling my Supermini IV........foolish children 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 But, now, since I have both Supermacro LE and Reference in my sweaty hands.......I'm comfortable sending the Supermini in for updates so that it will sound similar to the Reference. Yea!_

 

In your opinion which amp sounds better the Supermacro LE or Reference?


----------



## Lil' Knight

Just took the test of my patience and ordered the Reference by CC 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My CC will expire exactly 13 months later, I hope he'll have a chance to charge me before I throw my CC away


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The jumpers are for Impedence (eg. if you want your Ety er4P to sound as er4S), Gain, Bassboost, crossfeed._

 

Ahh, thanks.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just took the test of my patience and ordered the Reference by CC 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My CC will expire exactly 13 months later, I hope he'll have a chance to charge me before I throw my CC away 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

LOL! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Who hasn't placed his bet yet?

 Keep us posted


----------



## tk3

Oh well, at least you ordered by CC, that way you can always cancel or refute the charges.

 It's different when he is holding $300 of your cash hostage.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh well, at least you ordered by CC, that way you can always cancel or refute the charges.

 It's different when he is holding $300 of your cash hostage. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Uhhmm, maybe I should send him an email to cancel my order... 
 .... and he'll ship the Reference to me tomorrow


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Uhhmm, maybe I should send him an email to cancel my order... 
 .... and he'll ship the Reference to me tomorrow 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Giving up already


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Giving up already 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Ok,ok... I'll wait with you guys 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't worry about that !
 Counting the day to get my amp:
 - half of a day already...


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_- half of a day already..._

 

Yeah, that's the spirit to survive in Xin-land.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, that's the spirit to survive in Xin-land. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

What a cute dog you have ! Did she use the Reference?
 Her eyes are sooo sad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe you should give her another phones


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What a cute dog you have ! Did she use the Reference?
 Her eyes are sooo sad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe you should give her another phones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 Well, she is actually a he and this is his expression whatever 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And yeah, he is realy the cutest dog in the world, that's for sure.


----------



## tomo3014

question.

 are there any of you waiting for the upgrade?


----------



## kanan

Did anyone really get refund from Xin?
 I canceled order and requested refund by email yesterday,
 but there have been no answer...


----------



## itsborken

I got a refund via paypal after two emails. There was no direct response from him; just the notification from paypal that there's inbound cash in the bucket.


----------



## kanan

Thanks itsbroken.

 I am somewhat at rest to hear that
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I already sent him 4 emails but no response nor notification from Paypal.
 Seems to have to wait a bit more


----------



## itsborken

I think I waited 1-2 weeks between them.


----------



## tha_dude

looks like things are quiet again..


----------



## Quaddy

8 mths mark approaching

 c'mon that annus triggerus!


----------



## JarodL1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Typical Xin. No response for months, no amps go out and when customers really start getting restless and canceling orders he goes ahead and fills a few orders so everyone doesn't cancel. 

 The people in charge of head-fi should ban his name from the site to keep him from getting any business. It is obvious he reads all of his emails and checks his site (I wouldn't be surprised if he read this one as well). Why should he continue to get free advertising when he doesn't have the decency to respond to his customers?_

 

One year mark....

 Knew this would happen, people get restless so he sends out a few amps. I am sure in another few months he will fill another couple of orders.


----------



## tha_dude

It looks like you might get yours in the next "shipment" since it seems the people who got theirs recently waited just over a year

 7 months for me so far

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One year mark....

 Knew this would happen, people get restless so he sends out a few amps. I am sure in another few months he will fill another couple of orders._


----------



## musicmaker

I bet if everyone cancels their order, this Xin character will probably wake up and start taking customer service a bit more seriously.

 I canceled my order a few weeks ago and purchased another amp that I couldn't be happier with. I don't understand why people wait years and put up with this crap when there are some outstanding amps available from vendors like Qables, RSA, Meier to name a few. Are his amps that special that they would put the other amps to shame ? Post sales support and customer service are also factors for me when I buy something should there ever be a repair/upgrade situation in the future. 

 Good luck.


----------



## cheemo

This thread is an amazing saga of frustration and fortitude! Those Xin's amps must be very special, I couldn't handle the wait.


----------



## chukwe

I've been waiting for 9 months for the Ref and my Credit card is expiring this month.

 How can I replace it without being affected?


----------



## jamato8

At least it is your credit card that is expiring and not you! When people start dropping because of old age I guess the list will grow shorter and shorter. You may get your amp through attrition. :^)


----------



## chukwe

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_At least it is your credit card that is expiring and not you! When people start dropping because of old age I guess the list will grow shorter and shorter. You may get your amp through attrition. :^)_

 

I don't understand what you're going on about. You should learn to respect people on this forum.

 What's wrong with the expiration date on a Credit Card past the Current date?
 My CC company will send a new card to me and it'll be different from the current one.

 Don't be an Idiot!! And who says I'm dropping out


----------



## jamato8

Please lighten up. I was kidding. I didn't think I had to put in a :^) and calling someone an idiot doesn't do much for you. And I didn't see that smiley face either. :^) Life is waaay too short.


----------



## tk3

Some people are just frustrated with the long wait, jokes may not come across very well.


----------



## jamato8

I can appreciate that. It is very frustrating.


----------



## fl00r

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *chukwe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't understand what you're going on about. You should learn to respect people on this forum.

 What's wrong with the expiration date on a Credit Card past the Current date?
 My CC company will send a new card to me and it'll be different from the current one.

 Don't be an Idiot!! And who says I'm dropping out_

 

I think Jamoto tries to make light of this whole saga but I can understand the frustration. I've been there; waited 9 months for my Reference and was not amused in any way 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But, hey, there are worse things going on in this cruel world....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Keep your pecker up!


----------



## Copperjacket

While I understand that the waiting list is currently around 1 year or so does anyone have a handle or even a guestimate on the number of amps actually outstanding?


----------



## DennyL

I would love to know, but at the rate that they are being delivered I would have thought that it would be more likely that Xin would abandon ship, or die of old age, before they are all delivered.


----------



## NiToNi

Hi everyone,

 Just checking in after a long wait for my Ref amp; I had placed my order on 8 Aug 2007 @ 16:57 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Anyone dare to guess my position in the que or how long before my amp will arrive on my doorstep 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Cheers,

 Nik


----------



## jamato8

Sorry, no.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiToNi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi everyone,

 Just checking in after a long wait for my Ref amp; I had placed my order on 8 Aug 2007 @ 16:57 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Anyone dare to guess my position in the que or how long before my amp will arrive on my doorstep 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Cheers,

 Nik_

 

So far, business as usual so check back in August. Seriously, check back in May to see if there's any significant shipments being received.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NiToNi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi everyone,

 Just checking in after a long wait for my Ref amp; I had placed my order on 8 Aug 2007 @ 16:57 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

 Anyone dare to guess my position in the que or how long before my amp will arrive on my doorstep 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Cheers,

 Nik_

 

Hard to say but you'll probably get yours about 4 hrs 49mins after i get mine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered mine on 8 Aug 2007 @ 12:08pm


----------



## NiToNi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hard to say but you'll probably get yours about 4 hrs 49mins after i get mine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I ordered mine on 8 Aug 2007 @ 12:08pm_

 

Hehe... lets hope so... shoot me a PM then will ya when you've received yours and I'll pop down to my front door and wait for mine....


----------



## shigzeo

damn i bought my supermicro iv back when it was only a 4 month wait. i sold it and it took about 12 hours! haha


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shigzeo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_damn i bought my supermicro iv back when it was only a 4 month wait. i sold it and it took about 12 hours! haha_

 

just wondering, why did you sell it?


----------



## shigzeo

i started to go ampless. i bought it originally as i wanted less hiss with iems (at the time um2 and for a short while e500, then atrio m5 and victor hp-fx500 - keep going down).

 it was nice and i had full lod, xin micro iv and it was amazing sound. however, amp was so high gain for iems that i had to have it on the lowest setting and if the volume moved (HELLO) - it hurt.

 the setup was very nice and sounded great but i found myself wanting to be truly portable without any worries, so i have now a resistor cable of 75 ohm and my phones, that is it between me and the ipod.

 no hiss, great bass just like when i had the amp and in a word, portable and perfect.

 cheers


----------



## daveDerek

just wondering if there are actually any production refs out there or just beta units (and if there are production units how do they differ from the betas?). how did folks obtain the beta units (did they buy them? 'cause some have been sold...)?


----------



## shiezan

I'm only on my 2nd month waiting for my refund.


----------



## lisnalee

Just joined the 8mth club yesterday, how time flies 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 When i first ordered i remember all the hype of the 5mth club, now it seems unless your waiting over a year your not getting it anytime soon.

 Thankfully i had the sense to buy the voyager in the meantime,TBH if i could cancel my order without any hassle i probably would.


----------



## ljs

I'm in the team "I-forgot-I-ordered-a-reference-", who want to join in?


----------



## musicmaker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just joined the 8mth club yesterday, how time flies 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 When i first ordered i remember all the hype of the 5mth club, now it seems unless your waiting over a year your not getting it anytime soon.

 Thankfully i had the sense to buy the voyager in the meantime,TBH if i could cancel my order without any hassle i probably would._

 

The Voyager is a very very nice amp and holds its own against the iQube and Larocco PRII mkII. I have a Voyager and an iQube that I currently comparing and will keep one and sell the other. I canceled my reference order and there is no looking back. The iQube and Voyager sound absolutely fantastic and are two of the very best portable amps available today IMO. There is NO way I'm dealing with this Xin character.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Voyager is a very very nice amp and holds its own against the iQube and Larocco PRII mkII. I have a Voyager and an iQube that I currently comparing and will keep one and sell the other. I canceled my reference order and there is no looking back. The iQube and Voyager sound absolutely fantastic and are two of the very best portable amps available today IMO. There is NO way I'm dealing with this Xin character._

 

The voyager is pretty amazing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The ref might have been an excellent sounding amp when it was released almost a year ago but i think there are a lot more "_available_" amps that are just as good if not better in terms of SQ.


----------



## musicmaker

Couldn't agree more. One also needs to factor in post sales service when buying stuff. I know I do and my iQube and Voyager are backed by companies that value customer service. Well some folks are willing to wait an unreasonable amount of the reference. As long as this is the case, he's going to continue doing what he's doing (or not doing would probably be more appropriate).


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin character._

 

nicely put!


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *musicmaker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Couldn't agree more. One also needs to factor in post sales service when buying stuff. I know I do and my iQube and Voyager are backed by companies that value customer service. Well some folks are willing to wait an unreasonable amount of the reference. As long as this is the case, he's going to continue doing what he's doing (or not doing would probably be more appropriate)._

 

I said this many many pages and about two months ago. What happens when this amp comes, then something happens in a year or two? Do you wait another year or so to get it repaired??

 Uh Uh--not me. Over this guy and his products


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm in the team "I-forgot-I-ordered-a-reference-", who want to join in?_

 

What about 'I-forgot-*If*-I-ordered-a-reference'


----------



## BushGuy

Whatever has happened to Dr. Xin these past several months I can only suppose without any real knowledge. I DO know this has NOT been his past behavior. I've had v. III's and now currently have a 4/12/07 Supermacro LE, a Supermini IV of 12/06, and a Beta Reference. While it has become very frustrating - not one customer has lost a dime in all of this time!


----------



## daveDerek

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_While it has become very frustrating - not one customer has lost a dime in all of this time!_

 

it's not clear if this is true for those who used paypal when their order was placed and actually incurred a charge for an amp that's not been received (let alone built and sent).


----------



## BushGuy

DaveDerek, I have NEVER seen a posting to this effect..........ergo the lack of any foundation to your supposition. If there is anything people resent - it is losing money. Surely, had this occurred - there would have been postings in the last couple of years.


----------



## itsborken

I'm sure lots of people hit up by Ponzi schemes said exactly the same thing before the perp disappeared. Not that I'm saying Xin is doing this, just that the statement nobody lost a dime is meaningless until Xin produces amps or he refunds the money to Paypal payers. 

 There also is the present value of money that Xin has walked away with for the paypal people. How about if I lost the paypal fees when I cancelled my order due to lack of timely delivery--does that count? I'm probably not the first in that regard either.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *daveDerek* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it's not clear if this is true for those who used paypal when thier order was placed and actually incurred a charge for an amp that you is out there in the ether._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_DaveDerek, I have NEVER seen a posting to this effect..........ergo the lack of any foundation to your supposition. If there is anything people resent - it is losing money. Surely, had this occurred - there would have been postings in the last couple of years._

 

FYI, if you order an amp from Xin using a credit card the charge does not occur until he is ready to ship your amp. If you use PayPal the charge is inmediate as per PayPal policies and procedures, not anything Xin has control over.

 Of course this does not help the person who orders an amp using PayPal, the expectation is to get it in short amount of time (new people who have not heard of Xin's problem of taking way too much time).


----------



## Aaron622

Joining the 8 month club today...


----------



## JwangSDC

If I was one of the people who paid paypal I'd complain and get a refund.


----------



## JarodL1

Past the one year mark, still no word.


----------



## shiezan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JwangSDC* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If I was one of the people who paid paypal I'd complain and get a refund._

 


 I'm already on my 2nd month since my complaint for a refund and 14 months since I placed my order for a supermicro.


----------



## _j_

Just hit my 13th month anniversary... 

 Yay?


----------



## yourtoys7

Just passed my 10th month. I thought I might get lucky to get it by new year of 08, now not shure if it'll go throught by 09' :<
 At this point I'm not even waiting for it any more and probably will sell as soon as I get it. My setup has changed few times by now, but all put aside this gotta be the WORST cust.service/ dealling on his part (if this would be restaurant I would take a penny out and cut cournter of it and leave to the waiter) and thats probably won't even describe everything I'd be feeling..............


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_..... - not one customer has lost a dime in all of this time!_

 


 Loss of money could be argued as a "relative" thing.

 I will argue that time and frustration related to time have a value.

 Peace of mind also has a value.

 Quality customer service aids in peace of mind.

 XIN is FAILING miserably at customer service - due to Incredibly poor communication and incredibly slow delivery times.

 So, Xin's lack of acceptable customer service has a cost/value.

 Intent to purchase a product and not receiving the product for WAY longer periods than anticipated equate to lack of being able use a product for an unreasonable period of time. This lack of use has a value.

 And I think any concern over future wait times if "customer service" is needed is OBVIOUSLY a very valid concern!

 Anyone who has to actually return a product and wait unreasonable periods of time to get the product back have lost or will potentially loose "Extensive" use time. Again, lack of use has a value.

 Xin may have a perfect track record of shipping "all" items eventually.

 But, there is more to customer service than ultimately shipping a purchase "eventually".

 Appropriate communication ranks VERY high in customer service on my list.
 If rated on communication skills, Xin get a BIG "F".

 I did not want to purchase two amps so I could have one while waiting for the other. I consider this an unreasonable solution.

 In hind-sight, I sort of wish I had ordered a different amp and I still keep considering it. If I had ordered a different amp to "hold me over", I would have likely been pleased with a number of various other possible amp purchases I could have made and I would have likely cancelled my Xin amp order because of this unreasonable wait, PISS POOR communication and possibility of having to deal with PISS POOR communication if anything ever goes wrong with my XIN amp.


 I think this Xin amp may have already cost me more than I have not yet even paid. I wonder what it might cost me by the time I get it.

 I sure as heck hope it doesn't break and "Cost" me a whole lot more "IF" I ever get it.



 .


----------



## tk3

On the other hand, the defect rate on the Xin amps seems to be fairly low, at least I don't recall reading about major issues with them very often.

 (8 months too, yay)


----------



## silverrain

I almost ordered one of these amps last year -- I'm sure glad I didn't.


----------



## Zimm

I'm not sure if I should cancel my order or not. My Super Macro sounds really good and I would like to hear the Reference. Then I could send in the Super Macro for the 4/11 upgrade. I'd also like to have the super micro for portably reasons. But Xin's lack of communication is disturbing.


----------



## fl00r

I have been watching this thread for a long time; while I was waiting for my Reference more than nowadays and I am just wondering what people are willing to pay for a Reference if I put mine for sale


----------



## souperman

Just cancelled my order 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. You guys will be happy to know you moved up one in line!


----------



## gonzalo

cancelled order super micro IV, bought a second hand tomahawk , very happy
 great portability and great sound. Good luck


----------



## 883dave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *fl00r* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have been watching this thread for a long time; while I was waiting for my Reference more than nowadays and I am just wondering what people are willing to pay for a Reference if I put mine for sale 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Full price if you ship within 1 year (without communication). Full price plus 10% with at least two e-mail communications. 75% if you ship within a year and a half (only if amp has been sent back to Xin for at least one upgrade). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Price subject to change with updates, upgrades and new model releases

 (Sorry could not resist, I cancelled Nov 06)


----------



## JarodL1

Has someone tried calling his house? Remind him that he has customers. Maybe a letter to the BBB or local police will get his attention?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Has someone tried calling his house? Remind him that he has customers. Maybe a letter to the BBB or local police will get his attention?_

 

/\ this looks familiar. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i emailed him t'other week and not a peep, even followed the 'secret formatting' email methods required!

 and so it continues....


----------



## dealmaster00

damn I am getting pretty close to the 1 year club


----------



## shiezan

Sorry to say, but the 1 year club isn't saying much.


----------



## silverrain

I just read in another thread, about someone wondering about whether to send their broken xin amp back for repair, and felt sad for them....they might be on social security before (if?) they got it back....


----------



## BushGuy

I have three remaining Xin amps, and have been tempted to send my Supermini IV back for updates.........at this point, even I'm scared. I don't think there is any evil.......but that something has happened that precludes his acting as he has in the past. I simply do not understand - despite my preference for his amps and previous unparalleled allegiance to his customers.


----------



## DennyL

I see there was a minimal sign of life from him on his own forum on 8th April (a post with the single word 'Test').

 I increasingly think that the Xin game is over; and to ignore to this extent his customers clamouring for the slightest positive sign, and then to post that single word seems pretty insulting.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shiezan* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry to say, but the 1 year club isn't saying much.



_

 

Probably embarrassed by the fact that they've waited so long for so little???

 "won't get fooled again" I believe the song goes.


----------



## mark_h

All points to an ilness of some kind, afterall he did say he designed the reference during his "sick days"?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark_h* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_All points to an ilness of some kind, afterall he did say he designed the reference during his "sick days"?_

 

If that's the case the paypal float would make a nice/free AFLAC account for him.


----------



## tha_dude

does anyone know Xin's age?


----------



## MrScary

Maybe he is dead or dying? I would ask for your money back a year to get a amp pfffft its beyond silly Im glad I didnt order form him last summer. Get your money back I say.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I see there was a minimal sign of life from him on his own forum on 8th April (a post with the single word 'Test').

 I increasingly think that the Xin game is over; and to ignore to this extent his customers clamouring for the slightest positive sign, and then to post that single word seems pretty insulting._

 



 I would say the whole thing is pretty darn insulting at this point.

 To post a single word: "Test" on his own forum and still not answer emails or forum concerns, or even just post a simple update, is ALL insulting.

 .


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrScary* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe he is dead or dying? I would ask for your money back a year to get a amp pfffft its beyond silly Im glad I didnt order form him last summer. Get your money back I say.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I don't like your avatar, it is, well, scary and well, it spooks me. . . and well it's scary. It isn't you is it? I mean I don't want to insult you or anything. but if it is, well, it's ok. . . . . .


----------



## Ghoul

Wow, I haven't checked this thread in awhile and it's pretty amazing to see these wait times. I was fortunate enought to get a Mini IV back when he first announced them. I waited 2 months for delivery back then and was pretty bummed. Can't imagine how some of you are holding out. Patience is a virtue as they say. As I can't currently post in the for sale forum yet, I thought someone here might be interested. I have a Mini IV with one of his earlier updates for sale. PM me if interested.


----------



## jamato8

Ok what's with all these avatars that are. . . scary?? Is this some kind of out of phase parallel universe I have slipped into? Maybe that is why no one hears from Xin, he isn't here! Scary avatars, I don't like them, no sir, too scary. . . what's that at the window? be back. . .


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Scary avatars, I don't like them, no sir, too scary. . . what's that at the window? be back. . ._

 

Be sure to go outside to get a real good look at it. We'll wait. <Ring...ring...> Hmmmm, that's funny. Since that scary face looked in the window at us, the phone is ringing. Think I'll go answer it, be right back ......


----------



## PhaedrusX

this whole thread is pretty scary.

 Xin has become a ghost...and he haunts us all.


----------



## jamato8

Gah, I went outside, . . nothing there. . I think. . . but then I hear noises inside. . . gah. . . . finally went back in this morning. . . .got cold out there. . . I am not sure what the greater barrier is, our mind or a locked door.


----------



## immtbiker

Time for a WARNING STICKY so others don't fall prey.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Time for a WARNING STICKY so others don't fall prey._

 

i have to agree.

 so others can make an informed choice with the wait time in mind.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i have to agree.

 so others can make an informed choice with the wait time in mind._

 

No-one knows what the current wait time is. I fear it may have gone out to infinity.

 .


----------



## jamato8

I thought he was talking about the scary stuff. . .


----------



## tk3

Ye, I find it strange how there are still several threads up from people asking about Xin's amps, even though the guy hasn't been seen in like forever.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't like your avatar, it is, well, scary and well, it spooks me. . . and well it's scary. It isn't you is it? I mean I don't want to insult you or anything. but if it is, well, it's ok. . . . . ._

 

Seek help.


----------



## jamato8

That's why I am here. I know all of you care.


----------



## silverrain

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought he was talking about the scary stuff. . ._

 

Ordering an amp from Xin IS scary stuff...nowadays.


----------



## tha_dude

I haven't been waiting as long as some people have, but I'm just wondering what, if any, legal transgressions Xin can be held accountable for?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't been waiting as long as some people have, but I'm just wondering what, if any, legal transgressions Xin can be held accountable for?_

 

 If you didn't pay cash directly there's no damages. If you did pay cash/paypal, you need to request a refund and not get it before you could consider taking him to small claims court on Oregon for a judgement. It's probably not worth the trouble.


----------



## mark_h

Just open a buyers dispute throught paypal, say you never recieved the goods then escalate it to a claim, If he does not respond within a certain time then you get your money back. Its simple, at least then you will know!


----------



## immtbiker

Not true after 45 days!


----------



## vandread

Almost reach 9 months mark..........

 still no sign from Xin?

 Seriously....... is he still in the bussiness?


----------



## grndslm

Whew... I almost forgot I ordered an amp 11 months ago.

 Luckily, I paid with a credit card that was never billed and has actually already expired.

 Xin *is* a madman.


----------



## grndslm

Perhaps he's losing/lost his hearing... or somebody actually convinced him he can't make his amps any better...

 ??? I'd really like to know, tho.


----------



## Kabeer

So it seems Xin hasnt surfaced for a month and a half...this is worrying, I dont think there has been this long a pause before has there?


----------



## tnmike1

If you paid by CC rather than Paypal, do you still care?? I for one don't. Moved on long time ago, like four months.

 and ,made the suggestion several months ago that someone in the Prtland OR area visit his house but apparently no one paid any attention.

 Bye bye Xin. Have a nice life


----------



## kaushama

I think he has again gone into a major R&D phase. But how can he say that in public if it is so. So many orders waiting to be delivered.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you paid by CC rather than Paypal, do you still care?? I for one don't. Moved on long time ago, like four months._

 

Unfortunatly for me I payed by PP...


----------



## filipelli

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think he has again gone into a major R&D phase. But how can he say that in public if it is so. So many orders waiting to be delivered._

 

Do we know how many amps went out in the last batch before he went underground again?


----------



## oicdn

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grndslm* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Whew... I almost forgot I ordered an amp 11 months ago.

 Luckily, I paid with a credit card that was never billed and has actually already expired.

 Xin *is* a madman._

 

LOL...damn.....that's crazy.

 You know what's scarier is that he has all these CC numbers....


----------



## kaushama

To my knowledge he is very honest, when it comes to money though his communication skills are beyond imagination. He has this compulsive disorder to develop the perfect amp and I do not think he has any control over it. He is not a business man at all. Perhaps a "mad rocket scientist". But he wouldn't steal other's money for nothing.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Do we know how many amps went out in the last batch before he went underground again? 
 

I have got mine and I think there were handful of others who got theirs as well.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But he wouldn't steal other's money for nothing._

 

And he has no qualms borrowing it for an inordinate amount of time.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think he has again gone into a major R&D phase. But how can he say that in public if it is so. So many orders waiting to be delivered._

 

i hope this is true.
 it beats the other option, which is that he may have lost his appetite for this hobby, and now devotes his time to other projects.


----------



## kaushama

I think nobody should pay him by PAYPAL if anyone ever orders an amp from him these days. And I think it is time for a warning thread for long delay time as well. But if anyone see the length of this thread, I doubt he wouldn't understand the risks.


----------



## filipelli

Have any of you guys considered building your own Xin amp? Would be be difficult to build yourself a copy, just to have for yourself should your first one burn out?


 Man I love my mini, and I'm tempted to buy another one as a spare.


----------



## jamato8

I know he is around but I can't even raise him on his private number. If I still lived in the area I would pay him a call.


----------



## 883dave

Maybe he is in China working on some minature PA system amps for the olympics


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *filipelli* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Have any of you guys considered building your own Xin amp? Would be be difficult to build yourself a copy, just to have for yourself should your first one burn out?_

 

i hope you are joking. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 approaching 9mth mark in a few days. god i love the martyrdom of it all.

 i dont even want a reference now, thats the bizarre thing, i am soooo beyond needing a different amp to the voyager, hmmm, yes but it has native 1/4" jacks *slurp*


----------



## JarodL1

13 months today and not a single email from him.


----------



## srikeerthi

I had stopped checking the thread after I got mine in March. Looks like things are still the same. 

 May lord give power to the people who are waiting


----------



## silverrain

Hi! I'm new here, and just ordered an amp -- how long will it take before I get it?
 I'm in a hurry....


----------



## vandread

@silverrain: if u got lucky................ no, i mean a BIG LUCK......... no, i mean a MILLION DOLLAR JACKPOT...... whose seem more easy to got.......... u will got it in no time........... (Xin Time)


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

He's joking - not new, not in a hurry, not need one. You missed the joke :-|


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Hi! I'm new here, and just ordered an amp -- how long will it take before I get it?
 I'm in a hurry.... 
 

If you are in a hurry just cancel the order and buy something else. You are bound get very frustrated when you have to wait more than 9-10 months if he ever start to build amps again soon.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi! I'm new here, and just ordered an amp -- how long will it take before I get it?
 I'm in a hurry...._

 

Cute...
 With absolutely nothing else going on here, Silverrain decides to go trolling and actually gets a bite or two.


----------



## silverrain

Joking posts are spread throughout this thread -- it begs for it sometimes, to lighten-up the somber mood, and help offset the "taps" you can hear playing in the background when reading these recent posts.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 A troll post would be something believable posted -- expecting a Xin amp "in a hurry" (or at all, anymore, perhaps?) is not believable, except by rare peeps.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 P.S. -- I got mine -- a long time ago.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Joking posts are spread throughout this thread -- it begs for it sometimes, to lighten-up the somber mood, and help offset the "taps" you can hear playing in the background when reading these recent posts.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 A troll post would be something believable posted -- expecting a Xin amp "in a hurry" (or at all, anymore, perhaps?) is not believable, except by rare peeps.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 P.S. -- I got mine -- a long time ago._

 

But did you get the one with the very recent upgrade or the older version?


----------



## silverrain

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But did you get the one with the very recent upgrade or the older version?_

 

I messed with Xin amps that were "older than dirt" back in 06 or maybe 05 even -- a pioneer?
 No, I have none now.

 I used to buy and use headphone amps back when HeadRoom was a "start-up" and pretty much one of the very few places that even had such beasties. 
 Had to buy from Stereophile magazine ads -- you know, before there was an internet.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So, I hit all the net places as soon as they offered headphone amps -- so, that's getting back there some.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ A troll post would be something believable posted -- expecting a Xin amp "in a hurry" (or at all, anymore, perhaps?) is not believable, except by rare peeps.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Your "Hi! I'm new here!" (with a post count of 1500+) had me laughing out loud!!! And then when folks started to respond as though it were a serious post ... that was like listening to the Phil Hendry show. It was a good time to interject some well-needed humor into this depressed thread. At least, it was for me, on my screen, to my sense of humor, YMMV ...


----------



## silverrain

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But did you get the one with the very recent upgrade or the older version?_

 

The one with the latest most recent upgrade is what I ordered -- I gotta have the best one, right?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 On a serious note, I hope some good news comes here, to bring relief to all the patient Xin-watchers.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I hope some good news comes here, to bring relief to all the patient Xin-watchers._

 


 Is there someone here who has patience left? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 I am unfortunately still here waiting. But, I am waiting with frustration and angst. My patience ran out a long time ago.


 .


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is there someone here who has patience left?_

 

I'm still waiting without expectation (hence without frustration), continuing on in the cultivation of my rigs with gear from other sources and enjoying what I hear (actually, being amazed by what I am privileged to hear) every day. I wouldn't want to miss out on jamato8's dry humor or the many facets of the Human Comedy (often intertwined with facets of the Human Tragedy) unfolding in this thread. It's also a nice bonus when an occasional Xin communication or Xin amp is reported.

 I just hope and pray that Dr. Xin is OK. I don't expect that he is OK. From how MUCH of himself that he has put into his audio developments and making them available to other people to enjoy in the past, it seems to me that something must be pretty wrong for him to be so distant from it now. It would be a relief to me to know that he has just gone off into another "Research Mode" binge (or for that matter that he has just given up his audio pursuit altogether). I don't expect that I'll ever know.


----------



## Quaddy

morbid anniversary i know, but feel strangely compelled to announce my 9mth order wait to the day.
*
 8/8/07*

 this is one anniversay i dont wish m/any happy returns to

 at least it will be the single most treasured item i own once received, having gone through ridiculous annals of frustration and waiting. it will be an amp which isnt easily traded or sold on if at all!!

 ....


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just hope and pray that Dr. Xin is OK. I don't expect that he is OK. From how MUCH of himself that he has put into his audio developments and making them available to other people to enjoy in the past, it seems to me that something must be pretty wrong for him to be so distant from it now. It would be a relief to me to know that he has just gone off into another "Research Mode" binge (or for that matter that he has just given up his audio pursuit altogether). I don't expect that I'll ever know._

 

This pretty much sums up my thoughts, too.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_morbid anniversary i know, but feel strangely compelled to announce my 9mth order wait to the day.
*
 8/8/07*

 this is one anniversay i dont wish m/any happy returns to

 at least it will be the single most treasured item i own once received, having gone through ridiculous annals of frustration and waiting. it will be an amp which isnt easily traded or sold on if at all!!

 ...._

 

Snap i'm in the 9 mth club also. 

 I've got nothing positive to say about it, so i'm saying nothing...


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Snap i'm in the 9 mth club also. 

 I've got nothing positive to say about it, so i'm saying nothing..._

 

Ahh to be in the young 9 month club, lol 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. My club is so bad I have nothing positive to say either.


----------



## funniecow

Is there a natural consensus of how long it takes? Does anyone from head-fi live near him? Become his apprentice?


----------



## jamato8

To apprentice for what?


----------



## funniecow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_To apprentice for what?_

 

Ionno, help him build the amps. Take care of his house while he builds the amps. What an apprentice does, grunt work to ease the work of the pro, so that they can concentrate on their art.


----------



## omendelovitz

I offered to build amps for Xin and even just to buy an amp kit from him. He wasn't interested, and I'm an amp builder, technically speaking...


----------



## funniecow

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *omendelovitz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I offered to build amps for Xin and even just to buy an amp kit from him. He wasn't interested, and I'm an amp builder, technically speaking..._

 

Lol, he's hoard all of the amps. From reading the threads they've become the Rolex's of amps. Hard to come by.


----------



## Nuwidol

I'd be his apprentice. You'd only have to work one week in fifty two. That'd be sweet


----------



## Wotan1

When did Xin delivered his last Reference?


----------



## Explorer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_When did Xin delivered his last Reference?_

 

 I am also interested in when the last amp was delivered. 

 My Reference order has saved me a ton of money over the past year. When I was tempted to buy another amp, I just said NO. I had already ordered the best amp. I just needed to be patient. Well my old xin amp is now out of commission. This brought on a very high fever. I think over time I have lost my immunity to the head-fi disease. I just bought a new amp.

 Explorer
 Still waiting but now buying


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'd be his apprentice. You'd only have to work one week in fifty two. That'd be sweet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yep, that would be a sweet pasttime. Wouldn't learn squat but it would be a low demand activity. I don't know how to claim that as your pasttime as cutting the lawn would take more hours in a year


----------



## Aaron622

Just joined the 9 months club.


----------



## _j_

Today I celebrate my 14 month anniversary. Where are you Xin?


----------



## tk3

Where in world is Xin?
 I noticed there was some spam on his board yesterday, and it's gone today, so that's some sign of life at least.

 This non-communication is getting more and more ridiculous though.
 I don't care that much since I don't use my portable rig that much at the moment, but still.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Today I celebrate my 14 month anniversary. Where are you Xin?_

 

a new record?


----------



## unique_loy

it's really getting anoying. looking forward to his appearing.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Today I celebrate my 14 month anniversary. Where are you Xin?_

 

14 is the new 4.


----------



## filipelli

you guys that are celebrating anniversaries...cc or paypaled?


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I noticed there was some spam on his board yesterday, and it's gone today, so that's some sign of life at least._

 

Wow, thats the ONLY sign of life iv heard of.


----------



## jamato8

Yeah, pornography goes on there from time to time and it gets taken off so. . . but it is about the only exciting thing going on there and I notice it does get some hits. . not that I would see what it was all about. no sir, . . not me. . . . I wonder who has posted there lately, . . always good to check it out you know. . .


----------



## Wotan1

I paid through pay-pall (stupid, now I know) and still no amp after over 8 month. No answers on my emails. I still give him the benefit of the doubt, but there is a limit to my patience. The feeling that I'm being conned is getting stronger and stronger. Even if he did not meant this intentionally. This is just not normal behavior. 

 Why are we all still so polite and so patient ? I would already have taken some action when Xin lived in my country.


----------



## Gatsu

I'm sitting at about 8-9 months myself at the moment and yes, I payed through Paypal as well (the exchange rate was just too good that day).

 However, my patience is also starting to wear thin. I'm going to wait till the 12 month mark and then cancel my order and contact Paypal.


----------



## Quaddy

i hate to tell you this, but AFAIK after 45 days paypal aint good for anything, so contacting paypal at the 12 months mark is about ten and a half months too late.

 the only way maybe through your credit card if it was funded via that.

 its a ridiculous state of affairs all round!


----------



## lisnalee

Its a shame really as he has made some of the best portable amps available. But this is no way to run a business.

 I reckon until Xin sorts Himself out, people should be advised not to use paypal as a method of payment unless thay are happy to pony up now and not recieve anything for at least 12+ months


----------



## tha_dude

From what I gather, the Diablo mess seems to have been sorted out? If so, that makes Xin worse than Larry Milligan.


----------



## jamato8

Has anyone asked for a refund lately and received it?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From what I gather, the Diablo mess seems to have been sorted out? If so, that makes Xin worse than Larry Milligan._

 

It's hard to imagine a reasonable justification for this length of time without communication or deliveries, other than sudden illness, accident or some sort of breakdown. If he's just lost interest in his customers and forgot to tell them then he's a s-h-i-t.


----------



## ChicagoNB

I didn't pay thru Paypal so I've given up hope that I will ever receive my amp.


----------



## Wotan1

I have not seen any deliveries made the last couple of month. The story that he is in development mode again is i think a myth. Personally I would say the guy is a crook. He took our money and returned to China. Unless someone can give me some counter evidence. Even illness or an accident can not be an excuse. The fact that someone is taking care of his website means that someone still feels ownership and is taking care of things. So someone must know something about Xin (if it is not Xin himself).

 If the diablo mess has indeed been sorted out than Xin is indeed worse than Larry.

 What a mess!!


----------



## JarodL1

Does someone know the town he lives in so we can contact the local police? Anyone had any experience with something like this (for those who paid by cc)?


----------



## musicmaker

If I were you, I'd file a complaint with your credit card company disputing the transaction and file a complaint with the Federal Trade Commission.

 People need to start taking some action. Sometimes we here on head-fi are too nice.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Does someone know the town he lives in so we can contact the local police? Anyone had any experience with something like this (for those who paid by cc)?_

 

According to his website he appears to be located in Corvallis, OR.
 EDIT: Assuming the website is up to date..


----------



## gp_hebert

I'm kinda glad that I lost my credit card since I ordered a SuperMicro in August. I have a new card number so if he ever decides to make me an amp, he'll have to contact me first and I can decide if I want it or not.

 On the other hand, this whole Xin thing is starting to smell really bad if he's not refunding those who paid by PayPal.


----------



## _j_

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_a new record?_

 

I had thought that there were a few others that had ordered and not received from 3/2007... but possibly they got delivered?

 If they have been delivered, oh well, I have horrible luck so this is par for the course.

 I am a patient person now in my old age, but I am quickly wearing thin. Almost to the point of researching possible actions...

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *filipelli* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_you guys that are celebrating anniversaries...cc or paypaled?_

 

I had paid via PayPal... I was aware of the issues when I ordered, but also did not want someone with this level of service having my Credit Card number...


----------



## silverrain

I wonder how many peeps are still sending money for amps to this person?

 Non-Head-Fi'ers can Google-up "Xin amps", and decide to order from the site, because they don't know about the real situation. 

 The site should be shut-down or disabled or something, it seems.

 Or, am I missing something here?


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *_j_* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I had paid via PayPal... I was aware of the issues when I ordered, but also did not want someone with this level of service having my Credit Card number..._

 

Having gone past the one year anniversary of my order date, I couldn't be happier that I used a credit card rather than PP. After 45 days opening a PP dispute is fruitless. My CC company is very responsive regarding removing an unauthorized charge. 

 Last year somehow a miscreant succeeded in using my CC number to purchase 3 New York City Subway multi-trip passes. My CC company recognized that since I lived in CA this was suspicious. Out of the blue, they called me to verify the purchases were mine. I replied in the negative and away they went.

 Couldn't have been easier. Thus, if anything else shows up on my account other than a charge for something I have actually received, I gotta figure a simple phone call will clear up the matter while all PP would do is effectively tell me to pound sand...


----------



## tubesguy

This situation really is absolute nonsense. I would suggest that those who have money in his hands, via paypal, start a new thread to find each other. Then contact the Oregon Bar Association and get a referral to a lawyer in Corvallis, or wherever he is. The cost to file suit is trivial compared to the money that seems to be at stake, if a large number of folks are out of pocket on this. 

 If he won't even respond to emails anymore, something needs to be done, period. It has become apparent that posting here or emailing is not even being noticed, much less producing results.

 My two cents - Pat


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *silverrain* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I wonder how many peeps are still sending money for amps to this person?

 Non-Head-Fi'ers can Google-up "Xin amps", and decide to order from the site, because they don't know about the real situation. 

 The site should be shut-down or disabled or something, it seems.

 Or, am I missing something here?_

 

I strongly doubt there are many folks googling up Xin's site on a whim. If there is a more esoteric arena, I can't think of it off the top of my head. I strongly suspect most, if not all who become interested in owning a Xin amp first learned of them as I did, via Head-Fi or another similar site.

 If it wasn't for Head-Fi I would never have known that portable headphone amps, Xin, Ray Samuels, etc. even existed.

 Again, using myself as an example, it took me no time at all to learn, via Head-Fi what was up with the various amp makers. Without Head-Fi to educate and guide me I can solidly say the very last thing I would ever have done is blindly purchase a headphone amp.

 Thanks to Head-Fi, I knew that if I ordered a Xin amp I had to be willing to wait forever for it (Literally!). I also learned that I should consider purchasing something else to sooth the instant gratification itch. My Tomahawk was/is a darned fine ointment. Had my budget not allowed me to purchase the TH, I'd have likely grabbed one of the recommended CMOY's to tide me over. 

 In the end, I'd sure like to see my Super-Micro show up, but if it doesn't, it won't be the first time I didn't get something I wanted. I'll get over it or get used to it.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I strongly doubt there are many folks googling up Xin's site on a whim. If there is a more esoteric arena, I can't think of it off the top of my head. I strongly suspect most, if not all who become interested in owning a Xin amp first learned of them as I did, via Head-Fi or another similar site._

 

Not on a whim but I kind of arrived at his site that way. I read the Reference hype on Head-Fi but didn't feel like searching the threadsfor his website name, no advertisements, etc. so I Googled it. It's not like fixup.net jumps out at you as being the home for Xin's products. 

 At the time 4 months was the upper end for delays so a paypal payment seemed reasonable vs. sending a complete stranger my CC number. Doubly so as his website was hacked/owned at some point in time by his admission.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Time for a WARNING STICKY so others don't fall prey._

 

Was this a serious observation and if so what's keeping it from being done?


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Was this a serious observation and if so what's keeping it from being done?_

 

Straight from Zabasearch for Xin Feng. Why don't one of you more 'curious' types simply call the Corvallis Police and ask them to do a drive-by and check to see if he's alive?

 The first listing corresponds exactly with the address listed on Xin's website. There's even a phone number you can try if interested.....




 XIN FENG More Info about XIN FENG Record Created: 04/2006
 3399 POPPY DR Satellite Photo & Map Google Xin Feng White Pages Business Listings
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIN FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 929 SEQUOIA AVE Satellite Photo & Map Google Xin Feng White Pages Business Listings
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIANG FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 (541) 343-2891 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIANG FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 (541) 343-2891 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record


----------



## TheMarchingMule

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Straight from Zabasearch for Xin Feng. Why don't one of you more 'curious' types simply call the Corvallis Police *and ask them to do a drive-by and check to see if he's alive?*_

 

That's a creepy thought...


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheMarchingMule* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's a creepy thought..._

 

I kinda like the idea but for all we know he might not even be in OR anymore.


----------



## grndslm

So.... hundreds of people have given Xin their money for several months. And these same peope also have access to his phone numbers & address...

 And nobody's called the cops yet?? You people don't have free long distance or have ya'll just given up?? I gave up, FWIW.

 XIN FENG
 3399 POPPY DR
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330

 XIN FENG
 929 SEQUOIA AVE
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330

 XIN FENG
 (541) 343-2891


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Straight from Zabasearch for Xin Feng. Why don't one of you more 'curious' types simply call the Corvallis Police and ask them to do a drive-by and check to see if he's alive?

 The first listing corresponds exactly with the address listed on Xin's website. There's even a phone number you can try if interested.....




 XIN FENG More Info about XIN FENG Record Created: 04/2006
 3399 POPPY DR Satellite Photo & Map Google Xin Feng White Pages Business Listings
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIN FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 929 SEQUOIA AVE Satellite Photo & Map Google Xin Feng White Pages Business Listings
 CORVALLIS, OR 97330 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIANG FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 (541) 343-2891 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record 

 XIN FENG Born 1962 More Info about XIANG FENG Record Created: 02/2006
 (541) 343-2891 Please tell everyone you know about ZabaSearch.
 Background Report, Current Address and Phone Numbers Block This Record_

 








 Xin's residence. His house is bigger than mine.


----------



## tha_dude

I think Xin's had his chance. If we don't do anything or are indifferent to the wait time as it supposedly leads to a better product, then why should Xin care?


----------



## BushGuy

I went into Google Earth and took a look. Immediately on the cross street from his house (aprox 4 properties over) there is: McDonalds, Burger King, Cold Stone Creamery Restaurant, China Blue Restaurant, Subway, Izzy's Pizza Bar, Togo's, Darrell's Restaurant, Taco Bell, Wendy's, and Arby's. ..............he may be lying on the floor - dead - a victim of crappy food.


----------



## onocentaur

Okay, I haven't checked wait times for months since I gave up and cancelled my order with Xin... thought I'd have a look and woah... this thread has got pretty scary!


----------



## tk3

Does anyone have his phone number, and tried calling him?


----------



## musicmaker

Do a whois search on his domain. Go to this site 

 Enter fixup.net and search, you'll see his domain registration details. Try contacting him on one of the channels listed. The phone number he's listed seems to be a fax #.


----------



## tha_dude

Perhaps there is something in the Uniform Deceptive Trade Practices Act that is applicable to this situation?


----------



## BushGuy

Someone said scary?? Where is the injured party - that is step A. You need at least one. The thread is replete with people coming ```` to ridiculous conclusions without a shred of anyone being an injured party...........and some of you will be voting for President this fall. That is really scary.


----------



## tha_dude

People that paid with PayPal and have not received any response for months on end are not injured? (I did not use PP).


----------



## BushGuy

You STILL do not have any injured party (s) who has stepped forward...........otherwise you are nothing but a bunch of conspiracy theorists. Why not get back to the usual order of business - how many shot President Kennedy....who REALLY did it. Then there is Vince Foster traveling miles to a national park in order to commit suicide? See - more productive than attacking Dr. Xin. oops.....still no injured amp buyers?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You STILL do not have any injured party (s) who has stepped forward...........otherwise you are nothing but a bunch of conspiracy theorists._

 

Look back a few pages and there were people stating they bought via paypal and haven't received their amps yet. 

 Looking at your rant, you're just another Xin apologist--Xin's done nothing wrong, all is good, shut up, keep waiting and move along now. Face it, when people are waiting 14 months for shipment on something they paid for, Xin is a lousy vendor irregardless of how his amps may sound. People getting fed up was bound to happen sooner or later. I'm more afraid of your voting than others more grounded in reality.


----------



## BushGuy

"You STILL do not have any injured party (s) who has stepped forward...........otherwise you are nothing but a bunch of conspiracy theorists." - still true as when I wrote it.
 Now definition time for ITsborken - a common, lame, name-caller who can't back up any of his/her contentions.......one who is not worth any more of anyones' time...........aka Troll.
 Bye, or is it 
 Hasta luego?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_"You STILL do not have any injured party (s) who has stepped forward..........._

 

Grow up. If you did your homework you'd see I was one of the injured parties until I pursued the refund. It took a month of ignored emails to get the refund. So, I'm not technically injured any more. Been six months since and nothing has changed except that people are a lot less tolerant to continue waiting. 

 The way this is going, sooner or later the music is going to stop and those with the paypal chairs--well, no refund for them. Xin Reference, Storm, Diablo will all be remembered the same (if not already in some circles).

 I look at my posts as a public service announcement. If it keeps a few noobs from sinking money into this losing proposition I figure I've done a good thing for the community vs. the apologists who'd continue the unabated hype for a non-producing vendor. So we've both put our stakes in the ground--satisfied?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Grow up. If you did your homework you'd see I was one of the injured parties until I pursued the refund. It took a month of ignored emails to get the refund. So, I'm not technically injured any more. Been six months since and nothing has changed except that people are a lot less tolerant to continue waiting. 

 The way this is going, sooner or later the music is going to stop and those with the paypal chairs--well, no refund for them. Xin Reference, Storm, Diablo will all be remembered the same (if not already in some circles).

 I look at my posts as a public service announcement. If it keeps a few noobs from sinking money into this losing proposition I figure I've done a good thing for the community vs. the apologists who'd continue the unabated hype for a non-producing vendor. So we've both put our stakes in the ground--satisfied?_

 

Well said, totally agree.


----------



## Quaddy

dear head-fiers,

 please please can anyone come forward onto this thread that hasnt already done so and detail receipt of a xin amp of late!?!

 if not is there an approximation when the last amp was shipped to someone? (month ago, two weeks....etc)

 i am in need of a little mental stamina in the form of factual delivery reports regarding this fiasco, to help from going insane.

 yours...

 p.s. in my eyes, everyone who has orderd a xin amp is an 'injured party' regardless of who paypalled him or who CC'ed him, although the most 'injured' are the paid up front crew!

 i just wish xin operated out of ebay. imagine his feedback for all to see! and why isnt there more people having received their amps leaving feedback for this guy on these feedback forums???, surely thats a legitimate and constructive way to let others see the deal. (you could sticky xins feedback thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )


----------



## Wotan1

x2, see my earlier question. Unfortunately no one answered. Hope this will help us to get some more insight in when the last amps were delivered.


----------



## BushGuy

Itsborken quote: "grow up. If you did your homework you'd see I was one of the injured parties until I pursued the refund. It took a month of ignored emails to get the refund. So, I'm not technically injured any more. Been six months since and nothing has changed except that people are a lot less tolerant to continue waiting."
 What you have just said is that you have not been injured, except in your own mind. If you walked into court - you'd be out on your tail within mere seconds......dare I say - technically. If you pay for something and do not receive the product or service - it sounds like you finally got around to doing what adults do - pursue a refund. By your own account, you got the refund. Big deal. I just got one from Newegg where they and UPS screwed up bigtime......and guess what, while I got my $300 back - I'd rather have had the product. I DID NOT act like a winpy crybaby, and go posting about it all over websites.
 A thread of over 2900 posts does not constitute a public service..........its more like the resulting aftermath when someone has spent a night of over-imbibing. 
 ......and once again - no injured party! Those who posit that unjuries have occured need to present their evidence of such injuries, rather than make specious posts that they have occured.


----------



## Quaddy

hmmm is the word *injuries* being taken too literally by some readers?

 i think i am right in saying those who state that 'injuries' have been inflicted simply mean, we are hard done by, treated wrongly in a transaction. nothing in the literal meaning of the words. financially injured

 therefore bushguy, when you say "_no injured party! Those who posit that unjuries have occured need to present their evidence of such injuries_" are you denying we have paid up and waited for nearly a year?

 what more evidence do you need, our paypal and credit card invoices? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i find this to be splitting heirs and a little wrong for someone to be aggravating the rest of the xin amp orderers, telling us there is no injury present. we may be mental by ordering and waiting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , but not mental enough to be completely making our order and subsequent wait up on these hallowed pages!!!


----------



## BushGuy

No, Quaddy.
 Injury means failure to deliver the product or service for which there has been consideration (eg. payment). Losses resulting from such injury can sometimes impact an award.
 You are stretching the term beyond all reality and simply need to say what you mean. There were posts above that included many accusations and claims that legal and regulatory agencies needed to be contacted. They claim the Dr. is a criminal - but cannot back up their accusations at all. Your feelings are hurt. BooHoo!

 FYI - Up until this week I owned 3 Xin amps, and with some reservations, opted to sell one of them to a Head-Fier who made me a nice offer for it.Having 3 of these amps was an embarassment of riches for me........and I still have an outstanding order for a Reference I that I sent to Dr. Xin "way back when". If it comes I'll be happy.......if not - it's only an amplifier. Get some perspective in these matters.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What you have just said is that you have not been injured, except in your own mind._

 

Legally and obviously, no I am not injured any more and I wrote about the legal angle a month or so ago.

  Quote:


 Those who posit that unjuries have occured need to present their evidence of such injuries, rather than make specious posts that they have occured. 
 

Again, they already have been posting and complaining. Whether they jump to the legal system is up to them. I'd recommend lodging complaints with the BBB myself. While being out $300 may not be much of an injury to you, it may be for the college set trying to pay for tuition, room, gas, groceries, etc. 

 BTW, your ad hominem attacks don't make your point, they detract from it. Get a spell checker too.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_FYI - Up until this week I owned 3 Xin amps, and with some reservations, opted to sell one of them to a Head-Fier who made me a nice offer for it._

 

I guess this sums it up


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A thread of over 2900 posts does not constitute a public service..........its more like the resulting aftermath when someone has spent a night of over-imbibing._

 

No, a thread of over 2900 posts is the result of a clueless vendor. Xin has nobody to blame for this mess but his own actions or lack thereof. If he produced and communicated this thread wouldn't exist would it?

 While I'm not a customer at the moment, I'm still a potential customer if he gets his act together, meets his prior obligations, and starts shipping somewhat normally (a few weeks to two months turnaround). 

 No, I don't want to buy one of your two remaining amps.


----------



## BushGuy

Don't worry Isbroken (spelling?) .......the Xin amp I sold Supermini IV) is the ONLY one that was for sale (actually I.C. and price offer convinced me - having received previous offers out of the blue with NO advert extant at the time) and no other portable amps will be sold in the forseeable future....it was sold because have 2 others (LE, and a beta Reference). Also, I don't see you as a customer if/when I advertise any of my other gear. No worries - life is too short. 
 If I were Dr. Xin and selling amps ....well, fuggeddaboutit (spelling?).
 Further ..........YOU were NEVER injured as you attest with your own posts. I have read the entire thread bit by bit over the months and still have NOT come across anyone who had to bring any agency (as you say, legal system) into the picture. 

 You said ad hominem by ME?? Please be precise and throw all of these attacks into one post for all of us to enjoy. I luv (spelling?) your inability to deal with facts when posting.......or, I should say the ever-popular Jack Nichols quote tends to apply: "you can't handle the truth".


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Someone said scary?? Where is the injured party - that is step A. You need at least one. The thread is replete with people coming ```` to ridiculous conclusions without a shred of anyone being an injured party...........and some of you will be voting for President this fall. That is really scary._

 

I believe this was the beginning of your ad hominem replies to which I was referring, which eventually escalated to name calling, trolling, etc.

 That being said, in your opinion Xin's a standup guy as long as nobody files a lawsuit against him? Anyone with a shred of common sense knows that obtaining representation and traveling to Oregon, the cost to file, etc. would outweigh the $279 spent for a Reference. That nobody will go to that length doesn't mean Xin is right, it just means nobody is crazy enought to throw good money after bad.

 So rather than base your argument on nobody's an injured party, why don't you present an argument why someone should put down good money and wait 14 months to get an amp from a vendor who doesn't respond to email, doesn't follow the threads, doesn't give an inkling that he is alive/cares about customers before or after the sale? The rational explanation to that question is something I'd like to see.

 I'm not bidding on your amps because I'm not paying selling price + premium for a barely/rarely supported amp. If Xin would straighten up his service (as well as initial support) so it didn't take 14 months to get something, perhaps I'd consider trying one.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't worry Isbroken (spelling?)_

 

Nope it's spelled exactly the way I wanted it.

  Quote:


 I luv (spelling?) your inability to deal with facts when posting.......or, I should say the ever-popular Jack Nichols quote tends to apply: "you can't handle the truth". 
 

Fact Xin is not shipping amps (unless you think two or three amps every two months is going to put a dent in his backlog).

 Fact Xin is holding onto people's paypal payments for an inordinate amount of time.

 Fact Despite all the postings to the contrary about how Xin has gone back into in 'development mode', nobody has been able to communicate with Xin for some time so that makes it 'wishful thinking' at best.

 I think 'Truth is a three-edged sword' is a little closer to the situation here. There's truth from your pov, truth from my pov, and truth from a neutral observer.


----------



## 883dave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you pay for something and do not receive the product or service - it sounds like you finally got around to doing what adults do - pursue a refund. By your own account, you got the refund. Big deal. I just got one from Newegg where they and UPS screwed up bigtime......and guess what, while I got my $300 back - I'd rather have had the product. I DID NOT act like a winpy crybaby, and go posting about it all over websites.._

 

would this be the start of a winpy crybaby post??


----------



## BushGuy

This is what you call my ad hominem attacks: "originally Posted by BushGuy 
 Someone said scary?? Where is the injured party - that is step A. You need at least one. The thread is replete with people coming ```` to ridiculous conclusions without a shred of anyone being an injured party...........and some of you will be voting for President this fall. That is really scary."
 Silly supposedly 48 y.o. adult male.......you don't even know ad hominem attacks. Regarding the rest of your latest post..........zzzzzzzzzzzz 
 Still, NO injured parties in evidence that you can present to support your position. Hurry up. I'm losing interest.
 BTW - how is my spelling....any more typos you can rail against?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, Quaddy.
 Injury means failure to deliver the product or service for which there has been consideration (eg. payment). Losses resulting from such injury can sometimes impact an award._

 

Well, Xin has failed to deliver the product for those who have paid and has offered no communication or explanation as to why he has been unable to complete the order. With no communication, how long does one wait until they consider themselves "injured"? One year seems good enough to me.

  Quote:


 You are stretching the term beyond all reality and simply need to say what you mean. There were posts above that included many accusations and claims that legal and regulatory agencies needed to be contacted. They claim the Dr. is a criminal - but cannot back up their accusations at all. Your feelings are hurt. BooHoo! 
 

Calm down. No one "claimed" Xin is a criminal, any talk of contacting legal agencies and such were just options and suggestions for those who have paid and waited upwards of a year--again, with minimal to no communication.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_and some of you will be voting for President this fall._

 

Attack the person, not the argument is by definition ad hominem. As you said, ZZZZZZ, you're not interested in defending what can't rationally be defended, so why bother talking to you?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Calm down. No one "claimed" Xin is a criminal, any talk of contacting legal agencies and such were just options and suggestions for those who have paid and waited upwards of a year--again, with minimal to no communication._

 

Yep. Taking defendent to small claims court is civil, not criminal law. Hence, not a criminal. It's just another inflammatory red herring by OP. Argument by B.S.


----------



## BushGuy

If you actually read the quote YOU selected - where does it say Isbroken (spelling?) and is anything but a generalization? Now, if I asked if a supposed 48 y.o., who is supposedly a dept. head within a company other than his own.....wrote the posts attributed to him........I'd be shocked. Like Alec Baldwin, I'd want to move to another country......but, like Alec Baldwin - would I? He didn't (we'd only be missing one more merely serviceable actor).
 BTW - STILL no evidence of anyone injured by Dr. Xin. C'mon itsborken - get with the program......or are you truly broken?


----------



## MrScary

Maybe Xin has had the ill fate of being the victim .. Kinda like SAW IV maybe he has 1000 capacitors stuck all over his body.. or he is either Ill, dead or drunk.


----------



## BushGuy

or as I said just a page ago - a victim of all the fast-food establishments in his immediate neighborhood.......he could be laying in his livingroom, either dead or dying.......from that food - but some here prefer to feel agrieved, and attack him. Shame on them.......they know not what they say. I do not pity them - but feel ashamed for them. They know not what they do.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_or as I said just a page ago - a victim of all the fast-food establishments in his immediate neighborhood.......he could be laying in his livingroom, either dead or dying.......from that food - but some here prefer to feel agrieved, and attack him. Shame on them.......they know not what they say. I do not pity them - but feel ashamed for them. They know not what they do._

 

Or he could have packed up and left the country. All pure speculation. And all of us DO know what we're doing. Why would you feel ashamed for people who are rightfully worried that they may never get their money back or the product they ordered? Waiting upwards of one year with minimal to no communication is ridiculous.


----------



## BushGuy

Itsborken quote: "Yep. Taking defendent to small claims court is civil, not criminal law. Hence, not a criminal. It's just another inflammatory red herring by OP. Argument by B.S." You mean Kaushama (O.P.) is into inflammatory red herrings? What the hell does Argument by B.S. mean"? (isn't there an e in arguement - for the anal spelling-minded).......and who is B.S.?.........who posts after copious amounts of Bier or other tastey adult drinks. Perhaps I have found such a person posting to the Amplifier Forum on Head-Fi? An Arizonian? At his employment?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What the hell does Argument by B.S. mean"? (isn't there an e in arguement - for the anal spelling-minded)......._

 

No, there is no "e". itsborken was correct.


----------



## BushGuy

re e in arguement vs argument - true, unless you are an urbanite - then there is an e 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 New York City is kinda urban 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (whether you have gone to Columbia, or City College....or are from the streets - got street cred.?)


----------



## BushGuy

Tha Dude - who have you found that has lost $1......let alone more? Why speculate, rather than deal with facts aka reality?


----------



## Kabeer

Well im getting a bad feeling...usually Xin at least releases an amp per a month...but no one has heard for aggesss.
 Im paypal so sucks even more
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## itsborken

TheDude, I lost a few bucks and imagine everyone who got refunded via paypal had the same experience. So, here's one name for you.


----------



## BushGuy

Is it Paypal or is it Xin? Paypal does not tend to be a happy situation. Lousy cust. svc., and ever-escalating costs - but the possible alternatives?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...Paypal does not tend to be a happy situation. Lousy cust. svc..._

 

Oh, the irony...


----------



## BushGuy

But yet, we all do it. We, like sheep, have gone astr-a-a-a-ay


----------



## Nuwidol

Bushguy = Xin...?


----------



## dealmaster00

yay, 1 year club for me!!


----------



## ldj325

Yeah, sad but true, over a year for me. I've pretty much given up on Xin. My credit card that I gave has expired in the time I've been on the waiting list. I'd give him a new number, but figure why have it out there in the ethers unnecessarily. It's hard to imagine that he is still in business. If he is, what a way to run a business.

 Does anybody know for sure, if Xin is still in business? Maybe he retired and just forgot to tell anyone.


----------



## GreenLeo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yeah, sad but true, over a year for me. I've pretty much given up on Xin. My credit card that I gave has expired in the time I've been on the waiting list. I'd give him a new number, but figure why have it out there in the ethers unnecessarily. It's hard to imagine that he is still in business. If he is, what a way to run a business.

 Does anybody know for sure, if Xin is still in business? Maybe he retired and just forgot to tell anyone.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I'm a little better--just passed the 13-month anniversary
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Also My credit card that I gave has expired in the time. I did ask him if he needs my new card number. As usual he never replies.

 Now I consider myself very lucky if eventually he would contact me
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## mackay maus

My CC expired as well since I've ordered (10 months). Will see if I'm contacted when and if the amp ever ships. 

 I've not cancelled as I figure I can always sell the ref if I don't care for it.

 But I think it's time to start shopping for an alternative portable-love my HR microstack, but it's pretty heavy to lug around. Perfect for a cigar on the deck though!

 M


----------



## tk3

It seems like some guy on his forum says he got a reply from Xin recently, so not all hope may be lost yet.


----------



## BushGuy

tk3 - I DO NOT see the post on Xin's site you mentioned above . What I do see is where someone has misread a March 2008 response, that was taken to be something more recent. The most accurate postings I can see were put up by Jamato8 - same as here. Until I see something put up by Xin himself......as much as I have liked Xin amps and his customer service, I have to accept that something has happened that precludes him continuing his innovative approach to building amps and providing the service he has freely offered up to sometime in 2007. I fully understand his passion for his audio endeavors.My Reference is a beta I purchased from a beta owner.......and can only look toward his return. If/when he returns I will open my arms to whatever he may offer at that time. I think most of the continued postings I see on this thread are futile, and simply infantile, and vicious in many cases.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_tk3 - I DO NOT see the post on Xin's site you mentioned above . What I do see is where someone has misread a March 2008 response, that was taken to be something more recent._

 

Hmmm I dont think I misread it. "rrivera72" posted on 4th of this month, and edited it 2 days ago to say that he is sending his SMIV in after a confirmation email.

 Now im not 100% sure this means he actually properly heard from Dr.Xin...waiting till he replies. (see the first sticky in the Support forum).


----------



## BushGuy

I was looking for something more recent than 5/4/08 - but wish him all the luck in the world....tho' post not perfectly clear. If so, would wish not to have sold my Supermini IV - knowing the difference between post April 2007 and earlier amps. I would have kept it for updating if I knew the future for sure. ...........and of course, having ordered Reference 6/07 - would have held out for receiving that amp, instead of buying a beta from someone who was lucky enough to have one.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmmm I dont think I misread it. "rrivera72" posted on 4th of this month, and edited it 2 days ago to say that he is sending his SMIV in after a confirmation email.

 Now im not 100% sure this means he actually properly heard from Dr.Xin...waiting till he replies. (see the first sticky in the Support forum)._

 

Yeah, that's how I read it too.
 Perhaps the original poster will clarify the post soon.


----------



## Kabeer

And although this is really a weak point, as Jamato pointed out, someone is clearing up the Spammy posters on the forum as well (within the last few days).
 Unless there is another moderator there Xin is for some reason active there. Something seems tres fishy...


----------



## JarodL1

I think it is safe to say at this point that Xin has run off with people's money. There were a few (2-3) amps shipped out in February, but the last time any real quantity of amps (or any communication with him) went out was last November. 

 What options do people who paid by paypal have since they won't open a dispute?


----------



## filipelli

^^ Class Action probably.


----------



## mackay maus

I know passions run high where money is involved, but all of us have to assume innocent till proven guilty. Given the good business XIN had, and the demand for his product, it would be short sighted to throw it all away on a scam. 

 I'm guessing illness or an accident.

 I'd communicated with Xin years ago when he was doing his tweaks to etys, and I found him quite delightful to deal with; self-deprecating and modest.

 I'll not cancel my order, but have started looking at alternatives to tide me over. And frankly everyone, isn't shopping half the fun?

 M


----------



## Wotan1

Even if he is ill or has had an accident then he still must have the decency to communicate to customers. If only through his website, or let some one else do this for him. Also if he is not able to deliver then he should not sell his amps for the time being. So I do not think he is ill or has had an accident. Unless he suffers from memory loss.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mackay maus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I know passions run high where money is involved, but all of us have to assume innocent till proven guilty._

 

I guess. Those who've paid via paypal and have had enough can request refunds and let us know if the refunds are received (or not). That's about the only proof there is when dealing with an unresponsive vendor. The people who placed the credit card orders had foresight; it doesn't matter to them how this fiasco eventually turns out.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The people who placed the credit card orders had foresight; it doesn't matter to them how this fiasco eventually turns out._

 

Yes, all he has is our credit card details. I'm glad I lost my card and got a new number.


----------



## Explorer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, all he has is our credit card details. I'm glad I lost my card and got a new number._

 

I went out to eat last night. I guess both Xin and the waiter have my credit card details now. 

 My guess is that something serious has happened to Xin, making it impossible for him to make amps. Given Xin passion, I believe that he intends/hopes/prays that he will recover enough to make more amps. He would not want to give up his search for the perfect amp easily. However, the reality is that nobody knows what is happening.

 If I had paid by paypal, I would email Xin and tell him the following:
I still want a Xin Reference Amp
Given the shipping delays, I would like a refund of my paypal payment.
I would like to replace my paypal payment with a credit card transaction.
I want to keep my place in line for a Xin amp.
I would not worry about credit card numbers. After all, Xin has had my credit card number for 10 months and done nothing nefarious with it.

 Explorer


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Explorer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My guess is that something serious has happened to Xin, making it impossible for him to make amps. Given Xin passion, I believe that he intends/hopes/prays that he will recover enough to make more amps. He would not want to give up his search for the perfect amp easily. However, the reality is that nobody knows what is happening._

 

I pretty well agree with this. It's is hard to imagine what it might be that stops someone communicating in any way at all, and leave his Web site up taking orders, unless it is some sort of incapacity and the absence of friends or family who know about his amp obsession. Apparently someone has been tidying spam from his forum, and even placed a test post there recently. It just wasn't one of their priorities to communicate with his customers.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Explorer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If I had paid by paypal, I would email Xin and tell him the following:_

 

And you wouldn't get a reply.


----------



## Nailzs

As of today I'm at 9 months.


----------



## Quaddy

cruising towards ten months in a week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i *strongly* think, at the very *least* he should clearly state that there is a likely approximate waiting time of a year for prospective customers, and that being if all is well.

 you can say all you like about his practises and cheer one way or the other, and agree with certain things and disagree with others, but one thing that i dont like about his approach is the fact that his website is still open 24/7 for business taking monies for something that people more than a year back still havent seen sight nor sound of.

*xin, put a cease on new orders already!!!!!!!*


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Explorer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I went out to eat last night. I guess both Xin and the waiter have my credit card details now. 

 My guess is that something serious has happened to Xin, making it impossible for him to make amps. Given Xin passion, I believe that he intends/hopes/prays that he will recover enough to make more amps. He would not want to give up his search for the perfect amp easily. However, the reality is that nobody knows what is happening.

 If I had paid by paypal, I would email Xin and tell him the following:
I still want a Xin Reference Amp
Given the shipping delays, I would like a refund of my paypal payment.
I would like to replace my paypal payment with a credit card transaction.
I want to keep my place in line for a Xin amp.
I would not worry about credit card numbers. After all, Xin has had my credit card number for 10 months and done nothing nefarious with it.

 Explorer_

 

About 10 months ago I took this very approach. I had initially paid with PayPal for a Micro IV. After 3-4 months I needed funds for an "uber" amp that was (I thought) being built for me. I e-mailed Xin, with the order number in the Title window. I requested a refund of my PayPal and gave credit card information in its place and asked to remain in the que for an amp. He acknowledged receipt, and that I would remain in the que, and he refunded my PayPal account. I tend to go along with the idea that he has had an illness or accident, but I have no evidence of this.

 At least I got my money back, but approx 14 months from initial order, still no amp.


----------



## BushGuy

The Xin-bashers above have no lives and this is their hobby. They return time after time......same ol', same ol' stuff. Specious accusations - but NO victims, NO evidence. Just worthless B.S.. They live in their mama's basement, typing furiously. Poor babies.
 All I can say is Dr. Xin has always been more generous and at least as fair to me as any other amp builder/vendor. I have owned four of his amps - and have two, presently. Whatever has happened to Dr. Xin is pure conjecture.


----------



## Kabeer

The guy on fixup replied!
 He actually got a reply from Xin last month saying he has been unable to reply to email for quite a while :S.


----------



## steviebee

The question I have is does this delay relate _only_ to ordered amps? Has anyone ordered a component (such as case, op amp) that presumably doesn't need building, and rec'd it? Or is Xin's _entire_ business in stasis?

 Such a shame for everyone. His work is so good.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just worthless B.S._

 

I'm glad you figured out what B.S. is.


----------



## BushGuy

Itsborken - in your mama's basement - what do you really understand, and what can you suppose to be your credibility? There are better activities than to fantasize about Xin. Most guys think about girls.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_- in your mama's basement - ..._

 

If you dropped the ad hominem attacks we might be able to have a civil discussion.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The guy on fixup replied!
 He actually got a reply from Xin last month saying he has been unable to reply to email for quite a while :S._

 

Kabeer,
 Thanks so much for the update, and ALL of the human comedy upon which it offers us a window.


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Kabeer,
 Thanks so much for the update, and ALL of the human comedy upon which it offers us a window._

 

Lol, your welcome...i think!


----------



## jamato8

I think we are due for a group hug and then a group yell. . . XIIIIIIIN!. . . .


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lol, your welcome...i think!_

 

No worries, Kabeer, my thanks was genuine, AND my appreciation of that perspective on the human (tragi-)comedy visible through the window opened upon it by the update that you'd reported.


----------



## Happy Camper

Perhaps he has been brought back into the Chinese missle program and can only service his site with no communications allowed. Somebody go by his place and see if there is someone there. 

 3399 NW Poppy DR, Corvallis, OR 97330-3476, USA


----------



## lisnalee

10 month club today


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_10 month club today_

 

snap. ten monther here too.

 i had genuinely forgotten about my order with xin till i saw this thread was updated!


----------



## tnmike1

OK here's an idea. If and when you ever get notification that your new amp is ready to be shipped, don't respond for over one year, like he's done to us. Then he'll (1) be backed up with a whole lot of finished and unpaid-for amps and (2) know what it's like to be ignored.


----------



## Nuwidol

Can I join the 10 month club please?


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Can I join the 10 month club please?_

 

Fear not, while Xin has not figured out how to email or keep in touch with his customers, rest assured that such requests are fully automated.


----------



## Aaron622

10 month anniversary for me.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_snap. ten monther here too......_

 

Still ANOTHER 10 monther posts an anniversary (belatedly, June 8 actually) .........

 Being a member of the 10 month club is a highly-overrated experience.

 I DID recently buy a Fiio amp, so I have been using the Eneloop AAA's that I purchased in 2007 for my Reference. The Fiio produces a really surprisingly good sound from the headphone out of my iPod through a set of PK1's. It IS good to finally be using those Eneloop AAA's!!! I like to think of it as warming them up for my Reference when it arrives.


----------



## immtbiker

I was one of the first to ask for a refund and am extremely disappointed in Xin's performance, but I think it's really uncool to post a Google'd pic of his house.
 Does anyone really want to be responsible in case something dreadful happens by someone using that address and it turns ugly by accident?


----------



## earcheese

in the contact page.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I should past it here anyway


----------



## earcheese

I should _* NOT *_past it here anyway


----------



## immtbiker

*earcheese*...why is it that your first and only posts on Head-Fi are to post his address and picture of his home? 

 Where did you come from?


----------



## monolith

Hey everyone. I'd like to shamelessly plug the fact that I'm selling my Supermini IV. See details in the FS thread linked in my signature.


----------



## jamato8

That was weird seeing his home that way. It is getting to be scary how much is being imaged. Where is any privacy?


----------



## earcheese

I browsed the website of the amp, I love him a lot, I found this thread later, any see people here are very joyful, making fun on this issue.

 I just googled the address on left on the website....I shouldn't do that though I didn't exposed anything rather than just copy/paste from one public site to another public site.

 so long old timers here ...keep waiting.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*earcheese*...why is it that your first and only posts on Head-Fi are to post his address and picture of his home? 

 Where did you come from? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

I very much appreciate your instincts, immtbiker, in picking up on this and following up on it. Thank you.


----------



## earcheese

BTW........jamato8

 Privacy ? it never exist. Now days airport check gate using new equipment to see through your cloth. complaint? then take walk.

 EVERYTHING is public-ed except things you do in door or thought in your mind, and the law allow it, I have fad up complaining, I just getting use to it and live with it.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I very much appreciate your instincts, immtbiker, in picking up on this and following up on it. Thank you._


----------



## vexeus

The SMIV and Reference were the first headphone amplifiers I had ever purchased and used. I paired these two amps with some brand new Yuin PK1s when I received the amps back in March. At first, I was very reluctant with my purchase and thought that headphone amps didn't make much of a difference. Here's my little story on why I've changed my mind.

 I sat down the other night with my 5.5G iPod (ALAC) in a completely quiet apartment and switched the amps back and forth (using the line out of the iPod as the source) to see if I could even tell the difference. Surprisingly, I thought that I could.

 To reaffirm my suspicions, I took out my trusty SPL meter and set the volume of both the SMIV and Reference to the same level (85 dB if you're wondering) and asked my girlfriend to pick a song and play it through each amp. I was surprised when I correctly diagnosed each amp to three different tracks. I would have tried more but the girlfriend was getting bored. I'm now convinced that amps do make a difference and that I have picked my favorite amp (of the two). The other one is now on its way to another head-fi user. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Although I must admit... I was kind of hoping I couldn't tell the difference and would be able to stop purchasing so many headphone accessories. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Sorry, I suppose this isn't really related to Xin's shipment of new amps, but maybe some people will be encouraged to keep up with the wait. I was in the 1 year club at one point as well.


----------



## Morph201

I'm saddened and even shocked that this thread still exists! I think I've been through 4 (or 5), pretty damn good home\portable amps in the span of time that most have waited for ONE amp from Xin. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But the real kicker, is that by the time you probably receive your Xin amp, it would probably be made obsolete by his constant 'tweaking'..


----------



## ldj325

I am now going towards the 1 1/2 year club, so I understand everyones impatience. Have folks considered that maybe Xin could use some good thoughts and positive energy coming his way? By all online posts and reports that I have seen (as well as PMs with at least one person who knows him personally) Xin seem like an honorable guy. Think about it. First he makes a great product that is probally lower priced that his nearest competitors in terms of sound quality. And then by all reports he updates amps to latest version often (or always?) at no cost. This says to me that he cares about what he does and his customers. Then suddenly what had been a thriving business with more orders than he can process just stops. This sounds to me like something catastrophic has happened. I have no inside information on this and don't want to start rumors. But just consider this possibility and act accordingly.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am now going towards the 1 1/2 year club, so I understand everyones impatience. Have folks considered that maybe Xin could use some good thoughts and positive energy coming his way? By all online posts and reports that I have seen (as well as PMs with at least one person who knows him personally) Xin seem like an honorable guy. Think about it. First he makes a great product that is probally lower priced that his nearest competitors in terms of sound quality. And then by all reports he updates amps to latest version often (or always?) at no cost. This says to me that he cares about what he does and his customers. Then suddenly what had been a thriving business with more orders than he can process just stops. This sounds to me like something catastrophic has happened. I have no inside information on this and don't want to start rumors. But just consider this possibility and act accordingly._

 

I'm not one to start rumors eithers, as I think all the baseless speculation on what is going on at Xin's is senseless and in poor taste.
 The only thing that I go at is that he recently (last month?) mailed someone saying "Sorry, I haven't been able to reply to email for a long time", means that he is probably obstructed by pushing real life matters.

 He should take down his ordering site though, since it's ridiculous that there is a possibility that people are still paying him money while he has a 1+ year backlog.
 Whatever is happening on his end, I hope he resolves it, so he can get back to making amps, and making the ones with outstanding orders happy.


----------



## mackay maus

I think the overall negative comments in this thread reflect changes in tone on head-fi. I don't find it as friendly and polite as it once was, and frankly, only sign in when I want to buy or sell something or see if anyone got their Xin. 

 Some of the comments make me wince.

 I've made some great friends here (and piles of money and gear have changed hands in a courteous fashion) but prefer to contact the friends I've made here directly.

 Could just be me changing, or getting older as the members get younger!

 M


----------



## JarodL1

15 months, still not a single email.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mackay maus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think the overall negative comments in this thread reflect changes in tone on head-fi. I don't find it as friendly and polite as it once was, and frankly, only sign in when I want to buy or sell something or see if anyone got their Xin. 

 Some of the comments make me wince.

 I've made some great friends here (and piles of money and gear have changed hands in a courteous fashion) but prefer to contact the friends I've made here directly.

 Could just be me changing, or getting older as the members get younger!

 M_

 

with all due respect: some of us still are this old--or older--on this forum, soit isn't just age. I think after 300 pages, this thread is filled withpeople who trusted this man to deliver a product in a timely fashion, respond to emails as he once did and in general follow good business practices. This has not been done. Hence, the negativity.

 In general, i find the attitude throughout Head-Fi to be quite helpful, mostly positive, and quite encouraging despite the age ranges, nationalities, or sexual orientation.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JarodL1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_15 months, still not a single email._

 

Today's my 11 month anniversary of having placed my Reference order.

 "Happy An-ni-ver-sary To Me, Happy An-ni-ver-sary To Me ......"


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Today's my 11 month anniversary of having placed my Reference order.

 "Happy An-ni-ver-sary To Me, Happy An-ni-ver-sary To Me ......"_

 

snap - 11mnths to the day - cheers xin!


----------



## nc8000

I seriously don't think that there is going to be any more amps coming and I think he should shut down his order site as people are still getting sucked in and placing payPal orders (CreditCard orders are ok as they don't get cherged until something miracoulusly gets shipped). I have had every Xin amp since the SuperDual and loved them all and it really pains me to see the way it has gone especially snce nobody know why.


----------



## itsborken

Aww, you guys just ruined the 'think positive' experiment of helping Xin get back on track. Now we have to start all over again; enough of the negative waves Moriarty


----------



## tk3

11 month club too, think I ordered at about the same time as you 2 guys above.
 I think that was when he was somewhat active producing amps, so some of us were fooled by that thinking we would get an amp relatively quickly.


----------



## vvs_75

Today exact 9 month since I ordered Xin reference.
 Does anybody know when the last amp was shipped by Xin?

 Cheers,
 Vlad


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Aww, you guys just ruined the 'think positive' experiment of helping Xin get back on track. Now we have to start all over again; enough of the negative waves Moriarty _

 

I DO believe Xin is building and about to ship amps to fill LOTS of orders.
 I DO, I DO, I DO!!!
 (Claps hands vigorously ...)
 (repeat for as long as the wave of positive expectations rolls toward the shoreline filled with Happy Xin-amp-recipients-to-be ......)

 There are a lot of possibilities here.
 How about ...
 The 25th Year Reunion of the Class of "I STILL Don't Have My Xin Amp"
 The "I Want Closure" Xin-Orderers Group Therapy Outlet Franchises
 The "Discovered" Super-Micro and Reference Amps - built, but never shipped by their troubled creator - available to the highest bidder on eBay
 <Your Idea Here ...>


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The "Discovered" Super-Micro and Reference Amps - built, but never shipped by their troubled creator - available to the highest bidder on eBay
 <Your Idea Here ...>_

 

ALO will probably get their hands on the cache 10 years from now and sell them


----------



## lisnalee

Joined the 11 month club today also 1 month more and i can throw an anniversary party 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Its hard to believe its nearly a year since i clicked on the order button last August. Back then i thought i would get it by September/October 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I don't really mind the wait as i have a portable amp at the moment to tide me over, but a lot of others aren't that lucky and i really feel for them. I think its about time the Mods stepped in to do what the say they would, put a sticky up to highlight the 1yr+ waiting list to other potential buyers.


----------



## tnmike1

sbulack;4440589 said:
			
		

> I DO believe Xin is building and about to ship amps to fill LOTS of orders.
> I DO, I DO, I DO!!!
> (Claps hands vigorously ...)
> (repeat for as long as the wave of positive expectations rolls toward the shoreline filled with Happy Xin-amp-recipients-to-be ......)
> ...


----------



## Wotan1

I'm a memeber of the 11month club as well and today and gave up on Xin. Asked him to return my "stupid paypall" payment. Let's wait and see...


----------



## ComfyCan

Believe it or not, Xin actually posted an update on his forum today (fixup.net):

 "_First very sorry for the past months... I always thought I'd be back soon, then time just passed and I was never be able to, due to endless unexpected interrupts.

 Now I finally got things under control. I'll be answering email promptly. If you emailed to us but have not got a reply yet, please email again, so I don't have to dig all way back to find your mail. If you paid with paypal and cannot wait any more, please email me and I'll refund you immediately.

 I plan to process and ship the orders within 3 months. Shipping starts tomorrow.

 Apologize again and thank you all.

 Xin_"

 We'll see....


----------



## Pangaea

^ Wow- its hope.


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_^ Wow- its hope._

 

Hope?
 You are a true optimist my friend, lol!

 (actually I'm with you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)I REALLY would like to hear the Reference I ordered a mere 9 months ago. I also have a SuperMicro IV that I'd love to send in for upgrades, if I had any degree of confidence that I'd ever see the amp again. Maybe if/when I get the reference... I just can't go through life without at least one Xin amp in operational condition--I just can't.


----------



## tk3

Oh my god!
 Thats great news.
 Now I can't decide wheter I should keep waiting for Ref or try to get that Pico I wanted ..

 On one hand I want a laptop -> Pico rig, but on the other hand, I'm a sucker for the huge battery life on Ref and I like the 1/4 output, so I can use my 1/4 plug headphones without adaptor.

 Edit: I sent him a mail saying I still want the ref, since I've been waiting so long already, what's a few months more, hey?
 On a sidenote, it makes me wonder what Xin's email inbox looks like, if he hasn't checked it in half a year.


----------



## jamato8

I would get the Reference if you can.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I DO believe Xin is building and about to ship amps to fill LOTS of orders.
 I DO, I DO, I DO!!!
 (Claps hands vigorously ...)
 (repeat for as long as the wave of positive expectations rolls toward the shoreline filled with Happy Xin-amp-recipients-to-be ......)_

 

See that? Itsborken reminds us to "tink happy tawts" again, and a little positive visualization later (even with metaphysical tongue-in-cheek) we hear from Xin again. To quote Willie Wonka: "One must never doubt what NO one is certain of."

 I Really Do, I Really Do, I Really Do!!!!!!
 (Clenches eyes shut, Claps hands and stomps feet very vigorously ...)

 (What can I say? I'm the kind of guy who, when I see a good-sized pile of steaming fertilizer, I wonder, "Where's the pony?")

 I'm very psyched again, guys, honestly.
 I'm visualizing myself listening to my Xin Reference in a few weeks - and ...
 ... LOVING it

 Tomorrow, the sun will seem to me to shine just a little brighter, I'm sure.


----------



## itsborken

Sweet news, I'm happy for all those who endured the wait. Better still, those who desperately want to listen to a Reference won't be getting gouged anymore in the FS forum. Best of luck with your line and customers Xin.


----------



## Happy Camper

Wow, what will become of this thread? It has become the third most read (non sticky) thread in the history of amps. It is the second most replied to thread. 

 Xin amps have a following. For good or bad, he has gotten attention.


----------



## PhaedrusX

this bodes well.

 i'm going to remain cautiously optimistic until evidence of these shipments surfaces, but Xin certainly sounded sincere and apologetic in his State of the Union address.

 now i need to find those rechargeable batteries i bought so many moons ago.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I seriously don't think that there is going to be any more amps coming and I think he should shut down his order site as people are still getting sucked in and placing payPal orders (CreditCard orders are ok as they don't get cherged until something miracoulusly gets shipped). I have had every Xin amp since the SuperDual and loved them all and it really pains me to see the way it has gone especially snce nobody know why._

 

I REALLY hopte that Xin's message will prove me wrong. This is one portion of crow I would be happy to eat ...


----------



## DennyL

Wow. This is incredible news. I really had given up. My original credit card was lost and I sent him a new credit card number. No reply, of course. Should I send it to him again??


----------



## Wotan1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm a member of the 11month club as well and today and gave up on Xin. Asked him to return my "stupid paypall" payment. Let's wait and see..._

 


 Very good news. 

 Can you believe it. The word came out just as I was about to cancel the order.

 Let's hope he will not experience unexpected interrupts again


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow. This is incredible news. I really had given up. My original credit card was lost and I sent him a new credit card number. No reply, of course. Should I send it to him again??_

 


 Yes I think that would be a good idea.


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_now i need to find those rechargeable batteries i bought so many moons ago._

 

Haha, me too.
 I bought those stupid Eneloop batteries about half a life time ago, and still have them unopened somewhere.


----------



## Nuwidol

Wow. A Xin message.....

 11 months & 2 days later there is hope.


----------



## lisnalee

This is definitely a step in the right direction but i'm not getting my hopes up until i get the "your ref amp is shipped" email.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Haha, me too.
 I bought those stupid Eneloop batteries about half a life time ago, and still have them unopened somewhere._

 

I bought a few 4-packs of them back in the Autumn of 2007. I've been using them lately in my FiiO amp, to warm them up and get them ready for my Xin Reference. In the FiiO, they are as nice as the folks said who originally recommended them. I'm looking forward to using them in the Reference, when it arrives.


----------



## tbmusic

I ordered last May (wow, 14 months already). I hope that this is not just another head-fake by Xin. I will get my hope up when a whole bunch of us get our hands on the amps.
 I have not visit this thread for awhile and I suddenly feel much older today when I revisit this thread.


----------



## tk3

Anything happening here?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tk3* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Anything happening here?_

 

take a wild guess!


----------



## mackay maus

Dr Xin replied this morning to an email sent last night. I'm happy to see the good Doctor back among us and look forward to courteous dealing in the future.

 M


----------



## Aaron622

11 month anniversary for me, but things seem to be looking up...


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mackay maus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dr Xin replied this morning to an email sent last night. I'm happy to see the good Doctor back among us and look forward to courteous dealing in the future.

 M_

 

No reply yet to my 3 days old email


----------



## tk3

Wow, the new quote system looks very nice.


----------



## _j_

Today is my 16 month anniversary....

 !@#$%


----------



## rhythmdevils

so does anybody know what happened? Im glad to hear things are back on track.


----------



## BIG POPPA

Man I almost ordered one just to see how long it would take. 300 is not that much to worry about.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BIG POPPA* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man I almost ordered one just to see how long it would take. 300 is not that much to worry about._

 

Send it my way then. I can ignore your emails just as well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Better yet, send more to Jude and we'll all benefit.


----------



## rhythmdevils

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Send it my way then. I can ignore your emails just as well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Better yet, send more to Jude and we'll all benefit._

 

oh come on now. let's all just take a breath and enjoy the good news


----------



## nc8000

Got my email reply today after 5 days


----------



## vandread

I send an email to him at july 9 just to remind about my order

 and just got a reply from xin at july 14:

*Yes, have your order in line. Thanks, Xin*


----------



## Aaron622

I just got a reply as well.


----------



## tk3

Me four.
 Let's hope something good comes out of this.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rhythmdevils* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh come on now. let's all just take a breath and enjoy the good news_

 

Shipments being received is good news. Xin's words and actions aren't exactly golden at this point. 

 I am somewhat distressed that the fawning has begun in earnest (and I'm guilty of congratulating him on being back). Yet on second thought, noobs are going to think this is a great guy to do business with now; he's got his game going, etc. That has yet to be proved. I hope people post when their overdue products are received so that we get a feel for how Xin's actions match up with his promises.


----------



## immtbiker

Please post your deficits regarding Xin here, so we can get an actual $ amount that Xin has outstanding, and I can take some action:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/x...dr-xin-343789/

 Aaron


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Shipments being received is good news. Xin's words and actions aren't exactly golden at this point. 

 I am somewhat distressed that the fawning has begun in earnest (and I'm guilty of congratulating him on being back). Yet on second thought, noobs are going to think this is a great guy to do business with now; he's got his game going, etc. That has yet to be proved. I hope people post when their overdue products are received so that we get a feel for how Xin's actions match up with his promises._

 

Yes, I would not order from him until he has worked off most of his backlog in a reasonable time frame.

 He has given deadlines before, like the "Thanksgiving" one that were not met. So I would not be too hopeful unless he really does ship out more than just a few amps over the next few months.


----------



## ljs

Got a reply at day+1
 Let's wait


----------



## itsborken

Hope your Bastille Day festivities are enjoyable.


----------



## ljs

Thanks. Great fireworks yesterday, more to come tonight


----------



## immtbiker

Warning sticky added:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/b...ng-amp-344911/


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Warning sticky added:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/b...ng-amp-344911/_

 

x2 - seems quite right and proper to me. just lets people make an informed decision.


----------



## nc8000

Can't argue with that unfurtunately


----------



## DennyL

Not much evidence yet of the shipping that started on 10th July, according to Xin. Still, another four pages of this thread.


----------



## Pangaea

Yes^ is anyone getting anything?


----------



## ljs

Soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The sticky is really most needed and you cant really miss it.


----------



## blippster

Sigh. Don't know whether to send back my Supermicro IV with a progressively loosening input jack


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *blippster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sigh. Don't know whether to send back my Supermicro IV with a progressively loosening input jack 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Learn to solder; it's not hard and you really can't mess up a headphone jack. Would sure beat waiting for the amp to arrive back on your doorstep.


----------



## blippster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Learn to solder; it's not hard and you really can't mess up a headphone jack. Would sure beat waiting for the amp to arrive back on your doorstep._

 

Thanks itsborken; I've considered that, but not too sure if the jack is a surface mount part or if the legs extend through the board - which would be a problem because the volume control is right below that and its not something I want to desolder.

 Any idea where to get the specific part?


----------



## itsborken

I don't have one to look at but I'd take the case off and look at the connector. Then go out to sites like digi-key.com or mouser.com and look at their 3.5mm stereo jacks and look at the manufacturers diagrams/specs to fine the proper one. It's a pita but doable a lot faster than waiting for an amp to be returned.


----------



## Quaddy

looks quiet on the western front again....


----------



## _j_

Order delivery confirmed.

 Item: SuperMicro IV
 Ordered: 03/13/2007
 Received: 07/26/2008
 Time spent waiting: 16 months, 13 days...

 As the wait time was only 4 months (or so it said on the order form) when I ordered, I was a bit disgusted with the 16+ months of waiting and planned to sell the Micro when it arrived.

 However, after finally receiving the SuperMicro and testing it... I'm pretty darn impressed and will definitely be holding onto the unit.

 Would I do it again? Probably not.
 For those with outstanding orders... best of luck.


----------



## Quaddy

jolly good to hear my patient friend.

 you deserved it wow, that is a hell of a wait.

 unfortunately i am not excited at owning the reference now as i was when i ordered, but i have left the order stand.

 as i have sold everything portable, amp wize, ironically xin may have the final hand of landing me with a portable amp in a few months that i may just need again!


----------



## _j_

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_jolly good to hear my patient friend.

 you deserved it wow, that is a hell of a wait.

 unfortunately i am not excited at owning the reference now as i was when i ordered, but i have left the order stand.

 as i have sold everything portable, amp wize, ironically xin may have the final hand of landing me with a portable amp in a few months that i may just need again! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks! 
 I feel like popping open a bottle of something. Geez!

 Best of luck for you...


----------



## tk3

Very nice, I am glad to hear that he is shipping.


----------



## Kabeer

i was wondering where this thread was. Its in the full size section?:S!

 Anyway great to hear he is shipping!!! Im in the April bunch so fingers crossed I am soon.


----------



## ljs

I'm in the april bunch too so we might be getting something for christmas


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_jolly good to hear my patient friend.

 you deserved it wow, that is a hell of a wait.

 unfortunately i am not excited at owning the reference now as i was when i ordered, but i have left the order stand.

 as i have sold everything portable, amp wize, ironically xin may have the final hand of landing me with a portable amp in a few months that i may just need again! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 the new Reference does a good job with home headphones. Well the Ultrasones aren't hard to drive, the HD650's a little more so but the Ref does a fine job. Very surprisingly so.


----------



## DDW

Congrats to J. 

 ......But, 1 "SINGLE" confirmed shippment since the notice of "Shipping begins tomorrow" about 3.5 weeks ago is not at all impressive to me.

 Add that to 2-4 (VERY UNimpressive) shipments confirmed back in March and maybe I will have my Amp by "Thanksgiving" 2021......

 This is EASILY the most rediculous purchase process I have ever seen or even heard of.... by a HUGE margin!

 .


----------



## Nuwidol

Well, thats a year for me.

 Happy anniversary...?


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, thats a year for me.

 Happy anniversary...?_

 

annus horriblus for me too tomorrow! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 thanks for reminding me?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...
 ......But, 1 "SINGLE" confirmed shippment since the notice of "Shipping begins tomorrow" about 3.5 weeks ago is not at all impressive to me.

 Add that to 2-4 (VERY UNimpressive) shipments confirmed back in March and maybe I will have my Amp by "Thanksgiving" 2021......_

 

Also add to that a request for a PayPal refund emailed on 7/20 and posted on fixup.net on 7/23 has not been replied to or a refund issued as of this post. Not a promising response to the invitation: "If you paid with paypal and cannot wait any more, please email me and I'll refund you immediately.".

 As long as I'm posting, tomorrow (08/08/08) is the 1 year anniversary of my paid Reference order. YAYYYYY!!!!! I've made the 12 month, 1 year club. (8/9/2008 edit: Yesterday was my official, actual, one year anniversary)


----------



## Nuwidol

I better get my amp before you guys!!!


----------



## Aaron622

One year for me now


----------



## Wotan1

One year for me as well..


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...Not a promising response to the invitation: "If you paid with paypal and cannot wait any more, please email me and I'll refund you immediately."._

 

Thinking positively, it's possible it could be on the table or in transit.


----------



## vandread

just remember.........

 my 1 year aniversary at 8/8/8


----------



## tk3

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Also add to that a request for a PayPal refund emailed on 7/20 and posted on fixup.net on 7/23 has not been replied to or a refund issued as of this post. Not a promising response to the invitation: "If you paid with paypal and cannot wait any more, please email me and I'll refund you immediately.".

 As long as I'm posting, tomorrow (08/08/08) is the 1 year anniversary of my paid Reference order. YAYYYYY!!!!! I've made the 12 month, 1 year club. (8/9/2008 edit: Yesterday was my official, actual, one year anniversary)_

 

Looks like he is being hold up by something yet again.
 He probably did have the intention to fill that promise of refunds, as I and another person got the refund within a few days of request, but now he is very quiet again.

 To be honest I am glad I asked for the refund when I did, who knows how long this spell of quietness might last again.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thinking positively, it's possible it could be on the table or in transit._

 


 I find it unrealistic to think positively about this experience.

 There appear to be many more people who have now waited well over 1 full year for a product than actual products shipped to date - about 15 months since introduced and available for order (???????). 

 And on top of that - Now multiple FALSE notices of "shipping will be soon".

 They were supposed to ship before last Thanksgiving. Then earlier this year. Then about 6 weeks ago.

 What a bunch of BS.

 I am still holding out as there are so many favorable reviews of the handful of Reference amps ever shipped. But, I don't have a portable amp to hold me over. I have been doing without as I chose (Questionably) to purchase a Xin amp.

 I did a TON of research spending many many hours digging through this forum to determine I wanted a Xin Reference. 

 Not only do I still not have a portable amp, I have *NO CLUE* as to realistically expect shipment. I don't know if I even received an email from Xin if I could believe it was shipping at this point. 

 No fault to those who gave the Reference good reviews, but what a dissappointing experience related to the *REDICULOUS* wait and false claims about shipping. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 I sure as heck hope "*IF*" and "*WHEN*" I ever get my Xin Reference amp that I am TOTALLY BLOWN AWAY by the "*OVER-ALL*" performance.

 .


----------



## DennyL

This is one broken promise too many for me.


----------



## Quaddy

i am/was *very* close to cancelling the order for the reference, as even if i ever receive it i have no practical use for it now. i dont have a portable rig anymore really.

 but something is stopping me from sending that cancellation email... sickness?, stubborness?, probably all of these, but i have some morbid fascination with eventually receiving a shipping notification from mr feng and then having the obligatory £30-£40 customs charge for the pleasure of waiting over a year

 strange but true...i just want to hear it and then i can sell it here i guess

 time to forget about it for another three months...


----------



## DennyL

How long does this have to go on with nothing happening before we start to accept that the game is over, and Xin is history?


----------



## nc8000

A long time I guess as I'm sure there are a lot others who would share Quaddy's statement.

 I must admit that I have now deleted the link to Xin's site in my bookmarks list in the browser ...


----------



## ldj325

Only a year wait for the "new" amp--what are you guys complaining about.
 I've zoomed past my 15 month anniversary and still waiting on the old design SuperMicro. And I'm willing to bet that I am not the longest wait for an already designed amp. A year--tisk, tisk!!


----------



## ComfyCan

I wish he'd just sell his designs to someone else and move on (as opposed to just "moving on"). 
 Grrr.


----------



## nsx_23

This thread has really dampened my enthusiasm for ordering a new supermicro from his site. 

 Its this one right? Cool Stuff


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Its this one right? Cool Stuff_

 

What do you mean by that question ?
 This is what the order page looked like about 4 years ago


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What do you mean by that question ?
 This is what the order page looked like about 4 years ago_

 

x2 - here is the current incarnation of his 'cool stuff' lineup 

disclaimer: i do not endorse buying from here.


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This thread has really dampened my enthusiasm for ordering a new supermicro from his site. 

 Its this one right? Cool Stuff_

 




 I wish I had my Xin amp to tell you how great it is (.... or at least supposed to be???) and help feed your enthusiasm.


 But, this whole process is rediculous. I couldn't possibly recommend to anyone (whether I know them or not) to place an order with Xin unless for some strange reason I knew somebody who wanted to wait for well over a year .... and to the "Unknown" if they will actually ever get an amp. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








 I like how that old link still shows: "ship in 1-5 days" - HA!!!! what a joke.


 I guess I am sort of stuck. I still don't have a portable amp. I don't really want to order a 2nd to hold me over.... 


 .....Sort of like Quaddy: "stubborness?" and or "I have some morbid fascination with eventually receiving a shipping notification from Mr. Feng" ?????


 But, realistically, at some point I will give up and I will have to concede and place my money somewhere else. 

 I am quite amazed that so many including myself have not cancelled. (??????)



 Nope.... sorry. I can't enthusiastically endorse placing an order for a Xin amp. At this point, I can't endorse Xin at all or in any way short of buying one of the handfull of amps on the secondary market.

 I hate to be cross about the situation. From everything I have read about Xin, he is really a pretty good guy.

 But, this is a business transaction and it is being HORRIBLY managed by Xin.

 * Over a year without shipping products - I have seen commercial buildings and similar complex / high dollar business contracts and products negotiated, planned and completed in less time!!!!)

 * VERY POOR communication - WAY unexeptable. No business I know of could get away with this. Answering of direct emails has been inconsistant at best. The apparent most common track record is of not returning emails with a very few short stints of answering a few (????). And the very few emails that have been answered don't seem to provide any worthy information about "WHEN" products will be shipped! Further, no worthy communication on his own web-site to keep customers informed or answer relevant and justified questions.

 * And what little communication there is has been consistent B.S. - Multiple failed promisses.


 Nope... No recommendations from me..... even if I ever do get my Reference amp and love it, I can't recommend this process for ordering.

 Good luck.

 .


----------



## vandread

very quiet around....................

 it seems like another wait for "a shipment will start in 5 days"


 .................................................. .................................................. .........................




 of nothing


----------



## nsx_23

I just received my Xin Supermini from another member on the forum. 

 It really is a great little amplifier. If he'd solve his shipping problems, he'd sell quiet a few of these.


----------



## DDW

.... So.... should we assume the party is over??? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






 .


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just received my Xin Supermini from another member on the forum. 

 It really is a great little amplifier. If he'd solve his shipping problems, he'd sell quiet a few of these._

 

The Super Mini has never sold well. For a period of a year he sold a couple and that is all. People have no idea how good it is/was. 

 As far as anything moving out the door, as usual, only time will tell.


----------



## Happy Camper

Shouldn't this thread be moved to the portable amp section? 

 Has Doc done the disappearance act this long before?


----------



## jamato8

It is complicated. Yes, I would guess it should be moved.


----------



## immtbiker

Thread moved to proper forum.


----------



## nsx_23

Just sent the good doctor and email about upgrading my old V6.2c supermini to a Supermini IV with op-amp rolling and other good stuff like that.

 Fingers crossed


----------



## Nuwidol

you'd seriously consider sending him an amp to upgrade?


----------



## 883dave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just sent the good doctor and email about upgrading my old V6.2c supermini to a Supermini IV with op-amp rolling and other good stuff like that.

 Fingers crossed_

 

You could send it to me. I will keep it safe for several years or until Xin re-emerges. This way you could join the line of other people waiting, plus I would send regular e-mails stating nothing has been done as yet.


----------



## DennyL

How long will this situation have to continue for there to be a general acceptance that the Xin game is over?

 I'm a bit surprised, given that Xin's address was posted on these forums quite a long time ago, that no-one yet has reported knocking on his front door and just seeing what is to be seen there. For all we know he could have gone back to China. I've maybe lost track. How long is it since anyone received hardware from him (as opposed to emails)?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just sent the good doctor and email about upgrading my old V6.2c supermini to a Supermini IV with op-amp rolling and other good stuff like that.

 Fingers crossed_

 

Even if he was around that would never have happened. The amps can't be upgraded like that as it requires replacing everything inside. With the III amps he could do some modifications bringing them close to IV status but not entirely. He did offer a trade in price for the older amps but for the SuperMini line it was something like $25 so you would have been better off selling the old anf buying a new. All of this naturally would only apply if he was actually around.


----------



## Pangaea

I just got an iQube, should I even care about getting my reference?


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got an iQube, should I even care about getting my reference?_

 

You'll live a happier life if you don't ...


----------



## nsx_23

The good doctor has replied rather quickly. $100 and sending the old one back to upgrade to IV specs.....


----------



## tha_dude

By all accounts it seemed like he disappeared right after he was supposedly back. Hopefully this means we can see evidence of shipments soon.


----------



## 883dave

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The good doctor has replied rather quickly. $100 and sending the old one back to upgrade to IV specs....._

 

If you are brave enough to send it in....

 I would like to secure May 10, 2010 in the "Xin return pool"
 (not to be confused with the "Xin return e-mail pool)


----------



## Nailzs

1 year 1 day today.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nailzs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_1 year 1 day today._

 

mrarroyo posted on fixup.net today that he received a shipping notice. Maybe some other will chime in and say they received the same today?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo posted on fixup.net today that he received a shipping notice. Maybe some other will chime in and say they received the same today?_

 

Yes, I received the email late yesterday. It included a tracking number via USPS. I was hoping that others had received an email as well.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, I received the email late yesterday. It included a tracking number via USPS. I was hoping that others had received an email as well. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

2 months is too soon for me to get a shipping notice, so someone else will have to chime in...


----------



## nsx_23

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *883dave* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you are brave enough to send it in....

 I would like to secure May 10, 2010 in the "Xin return pool"
 (not to be confused with the "Xin return e-mail pool)







_

 

I don't know, I guess I would like to get something with op-amp rolling.....


----------



## tha_dude

mrarroyo, may i ask how long you waited?

 thanks


----------



## Nuwidol

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The good doctor has replied rather quickly. $100 and sending the old one back to upgrade to IV specs....._

 

Tell him you'll pay the $100 when you receive the amp back


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo, may i ask how long you waited?

 thanks_

 

x2, what was your order date please?


----------



## nsx_23

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nuwidol* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Tell him you'll pay the $100 when you receive the amp back 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I wonder how he'll respond to that if I put it in an email.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't know, I guess I would like to get something with op-amp rolling....._

 

iBasso D1 allows you to do that. It's out of production but I think someone had one listed for sale here recently.


----------



## nsx_23

The good doctor has stopped responding to my emails when I asked him "how do I ship it back". Hmm....


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, I received the email late yesterday. It included a tracking number via USPS. I was hoping that others had received an email as well. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 


 mrarroyo,

 Nothing personal, but somehow it seems like you and jamato8 (maybe hiflight ????) might be among a small few who would seem most likely to get "something".

 You already had a beta and even requested him to ship other amps ahead of you. I have to assume the Xin has you on his favored list. (?????)

 I have to assume he is hoping you will post more GREAT reviews so he can recieve many more orders.

 But, even if not one of you, "ONE" single shipping notice in this period of time is still nothing in the big scheme of things.

 I haven't seen any other posts where people have received notice or amps.

 I don't know how many orders are ahead of me or even if Xin will ship in the same order as orders were placed. So, I don't know how to calculate my wait. But, I would have to guess I have many years to go at the current apparent shipping rate...... assuming "IF" I EVER get a Xin Reference.

 .


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The good doctor has stopped responding to my emails when I asked him "how do I ship it back". Hmm...._

 




 This seem more inline with what I have experienced and more similar to what seems to be the norm. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 I am surprised you received the first reply.

 .


----------



## DDW

How many people who have outstanding orders are concerned about "Eventually" getting an amp and then having to be concerned if it ever needs service??? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








 NSX...... I HONESTLY, can't for the life of me see how you could consider shipping an amp (in hand) to Xin and have ANY realistic hopes of getting it returned to you in a VERY LONG TIME....... If EVER! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 .


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo,

 Nothing personal, but somehow it seems like you and jamato8 (maybe hiflight ????) might be among a small few who would seem most likely to get "something".

 You already had a beta and even requested him to ship other amps ahead of you. I have to assume the Xin has you on his favored list. (?????)

 I have to assume he is hoping you will post more GREAT reviews so he can recieve many more orders.

 But, even if not one of you, "ONE" single shipping notice in this period of time is still nothing in the big scheme of things.

 I haven't seen any other posts where people have received notice or amps.

 I don't know how many orders are ahead of me or even if Xin will ship in the same order as orders were placed. So, I don't know how to calculate my wait. But, I would have to guess I have many years to go at the current apparent shipping rate...... assuming "IF" I EVER get a Xin Reference.

 ._

 

At the rate he's shipping we'll all be dead before we get our References!


----------



## BigTony

....an Ibasso in the hand is worth 2 Xin's in the bush....


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo, may i ask how long you waited?

 thanks_

 

The amp I received (today) is a replacement to one of the original "Beta References" which I received back in May 2007.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Kabeer* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_x2, what was your order date please?_

 

May 2007

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo,

 Nothing personal, but somehow it seems like you and jamato8 (maybe hiflight ????) might be among a small few who would seem most likely to get "something".

 You already had a beta and even requested him to ship other amps ahead of you. I have to assume the Xin has you on his favored list. (?????)

 I have to assume he is hoping you will post more GREAT reviews so he can recieve many more orders.

 ...

 ._

 

DDW, although I can understand your frustration in not receiving a product that you have ordered you are way out of line by your implications. For the record, I am not aware of what you call "favored list". 

 Perhaps what you call "favorite" is instead trust that Dr. Xin has of long time users of his units and of individuals who not only own his amps but many other amps. I have had the opportunity of listening to well over 45 portable amps and conducted extensive testing side by side, so have HiFlight and Jamato8. As stated perhaps he sends his units to what to him are experienced "Beta Testers". BTW, this is no different from what other sellers do w/ their products, even outside of the headphone business.

 Will I post on the reference? Yes, however I will delay my post/review by a 3 or 4 weeks in the hope that others get their units. In my experience when Dr. Xin is in production mode he can fabricate quite a few units in a short time. 

 BTW, if you follow this latest development you will notice that I refrained from posting here and did so only after another Head-Fier posted a reference to my post in Xin's website. I will not make excuses for why he does not respond to emails nor can I comment on why he has been absent for over a year. I do not know and will not speculate. To me it is sad that this has happened because of what I think of his products, but of course this does not matter to those who are waiting.

 What is true is that many are dissatisfied and wish for closure (getting the amp they purchased). I certainly hope each of you gets what you want and/or have paid for.

 Good luck.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BigTony* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_....an Ibasso in the hand is worth 2 Xin's in the bush...._

 






  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_At the rate he's shipping we'll all be dead before we get our References!_

 

...or at least close to death with partial hearing in both ears, and by then we will have chips imbedded in our head to back up our brain memory along with movies and music, and an amp will be the current day worth of the cassette tape.


----------



## BushGuy

Is this immtbiker post worthy of someone who has the responsibility of a "moderator" ? A measure of maturity needs to be applied.


----------



## immtbiker

Wow...7 years of loyal dedication to the cause, torn down down by one light hearted statement. 
 Obviously you haven't read my sticky warning members to steer clear of Xin's products until he resolves this matter.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/b...ng-amp-344911/

 If you think that statement makes me unworthy of Moderator status, you should read some of my other works.

 Lighten up dude and look at the big picture. I have done more for Head-Fi than the average bear.

 If anyone else feels that this is a worthy comment, please chime in or PM me. I am open to constructive criticism.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow...7 years of loyal dedication to the cause, torn down down by one light hearted statement. 
 Obviously you haven't read my sticky warning members to steer clear of Xin's products until he resolves this matter.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/b...ng-amp-344911/

 If you think that statement makes me unworthy of Moderator status, you should read some of my other works.

 Lighten up dude and look at the big picture. I have done more for Head-Fi than the average bear.

 If anyone else feels that this is a worthy comment, please chime in. I am open to constructive criticism._

 

I think your comment is entirely appropriate and humorous as well.

 Take into consideration that the criticism comes from someone who has bush in their moniker. This would imply extremely bad judgement on his part


----------



## immtbiker

Thank you, kind sir. You have now been moved to my "A" list


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tomjtx* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think your comment is entirely appropriate and humorous as well.

 Take into consideration that the criticism comes from someone who has bush in their moniker. This would imply extremely bad judgement on his part _

 

x2. I put BG on my ignore list as he's just another internet bully not worth the time paying attention to.


----------



## BIG POPPA

I didn't see the harm OMG..... Considering the chain of events, some things become fair game. Someone sounds like a "stick in the mud" immtbiker, no harm ,no foul in my eyes.


----------



## nc8000

No I don't see any harm what so ever in that comment. I was for many years a strong supporter of Xin and have had at least 5 Xin amps over the years but can't in good faith recommend dealing with him any longer


----------



## DDW

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_DDW, .......... you are way out of line by your implications._

 


 Maybe so, but I don't think so based on what I was really trying to say. AGAIN, nothing personal. I don't have anything against you. And from your replies, it sounds like you actually may have had a little bit of understanding as to what I was saying.........:

 Your exact words are most of my point:

 1)  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ As stated perhaps he sends his units to what to him are experienced "Beta Testers". BTW, this is no different from what other sellers do w/ their products, even outside of the headphone business._

 


 2)  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ Perhaps what you call "favorite" is instead trust that Dr. Xin has of long time users of his units and of individuals who not only own his amps but many other amps._

 


 You basically stated my reasons for pointing out "why" I don't feel I should see any relevance in the fact that you have a Xin amp being shipped to you specifically. Nothing personal. I just feel ("Possibly") that since you have tested so many amps, since you have been a long time user and since you post your reviews including very favorable reviews of Xin's products, that Xin (as a common bussiness move) would likely prioritize shipping to you and a couple of others. Yes, I agree this is a common business practice. But, as even you concured, yes, it is also "likely" a type of favortism. I understand why. And I don't really have any problem with it even from Xin. And I definitely don't have any problems with you about it. 
 I view your efforts as helpful to Xin and the buying forum members interested in buying a Xin amp.

 I placed my order (over a year ago) largely based on the VERY positive reviews by you Jamato, hiflight and others. But, I do NOT hold you guys responsible in any way for the rediculous issues in shipping of product. That burden is clearly Xin's in my book. I see the frustrations you guys are having to deal with having made so many positive remarks and then have to watch as so many get frustrated with NOT receiving amps. I would feel bad too. Personally, under the circumstances, If I had been in your shoes, I would likely be very reluctant to even mention I had a Xin amp being shipped to me without seeing a reasonable number of others receiving amps. But, I don't blame you or have issue with you sharing the reality either. 

 **** In any event, know that you don't owe me any appologies. And know I don't hold any ill will towards you Jamato or Hiflight or anyone else who has made postive review of Xin's products or who might receive their amps before me.

 There is only ONE SINGLE person I hold responsible for this rediculous process.

 But, my MAIN point (in my earlier comment) was that there is just no reason to get excited about "Xin being in shipping mode" just because someone (like yourself) who might be "favored" by Xin for whatever Xin's reasons are receiving notice that you have an amp being shipped. 
 In my book, you are (likely / possibly) an exception to any indication that any "Normal" shippings will take place. I have to assume that Xin shipping you an amp is a "Special" effort.

 ***** There are simply NO other indications of shipping. One single shipping notice (regardless of who or why) isn't enough to get excited about.

 Further, based on your status to Xin, I have to disregard a shipping of an amp to you.... That is all I was trying to say.

 .


----------



## DDW

immtbiker,

 I don't have any problems with your comments.

 YES... they were a "dig" at a maker of products. But, under the circumstances, I think it is hard not to make a joke/dig about the situation.

 As a moderator, I think you have fullfilled your responsibility by "WARNING" others about what they might have to endure or deal with and the risks they might be taking by ordering through Xin.

 Likeable or not as a person, Xin's "Business Practices", communication and shipping time frames are NOT up to par - Not even close!


 Honestly though, as a moderator, I think you might have noticed the questionable nature of a few of Bushguy's posts prior to now - escpecially the ones related in reply to Xin posts. Attacks on certain individuals or against certain posts seem familiar.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow...7 years of loyal dedication to the cause, torn down down by one light hearted statement. 
 Obviously you haven't read my sticky warning members to steer clear of Xin's products until he resolves this matter.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/b...ng-amp-344911/

 If you think that statement makes me unworthy of Moderator status, you should read some of my other works.

 Lighten up dude and look at the big picture. I have done more for Head-Fi than the average bear.

 If anyone else feels that this is a worthy comment, please chime in or PM me. I am open to constructive criticism._

 

I wish I knew what was going on. Xin is a friend but on the other side of this is the pure frustration that is totally understood. I have made some of what I thought were humorous comments and gotten slapped back for them though I didn't take that serious either. Well the job of a moderator is never easy, so many personalities. Kind of like working in the hospital. :^)


----------



## mrarroyo

DDW;4702819 said:
			
		

> Maybe so, but I don't think so based on what I was really trying to say. AGAIN, nothing personal. I don't have anything against you...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## DennyL

mrarroyo;4704141 said:
			
		

> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DDW* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## itsborken

Internal pics of the shipping version, please?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Internal pics of the shipping version, please?_

 

I will try to get a picture later today.


----------



## mrarroyo

DennyL;4705235 said:
			
		

> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will try to get a picture later today._

 

Thx!


----------



## itsborken

It would be nice if some of the other five or so reference recipients would step up and acknowledge delivery to help repair Xin's reputation. What's the reason not to do so?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It would be nice if some of the other five or so reference recipients would step up and acknowledge delivery to help repair Xin's reputation. What's the reason not to do so?_

 

Please send me a PM w/ you email address, the file is to big and I do now wish to reduce its ability to reflect the detail of the original picture.

 Why they are not posting? Perhaps they are self concious of having received something others have not. Something I may have to keep in mind for the future should another vendor get in trouble and send me something.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please send me a PM w/ you email address, the file is to big and I do now wish to reduce its ability to reflect the detail of the original picture.

 Why they are not posting? Perhaps they are self concious of having received something others have not. Something I may have to keep in mind for the future should another vendor get in trouble and send me something. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I wasn't clear; it wasn't directed at you to answer for them. Why people who have received their amps and love them aren't willing to come to Xin's defense in his hour of need is perplexing. Some activity is better than deafening silence.


----------



## Quaddy

i indulge myself in a once monthly post here to state my duration, if for no other reason than to show/warn others that the wait still continues

*13 months from order for reference.*


----------



## Aaron622

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i indulge myself in a once monthly post here to state my duration, if for no other reason than to show/warn others that the wait still continues

*13 months from order for reference.*_

 

13 months for my SuperMicro as well now.


----------



## Pangaea

Yes, I find myself in the 13 month club as well. I recently picked up an iQube and find it superior to anything I have tried, including a Lisa 3. So now I am asking myself do I really care about getting a reference. I am leaning towards... "no."


----------



## Nuwidol

I'm a 13 monther too.


----------



## tha_dude

i'll be joining you 13-month guys in Oct..


----------



## ComfyCan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i'll be joining you 13-month guys in Oct.._

 

Me too, but by then he'll be in the 14 month club--and so on _ad infinitum_.

 I wonder if it would do any good to show up in Xin's yard and start a hunger strike?

 Sucks,
 -c.c.


----------



## ldj325

Newbies, ha! Quit your griping in the back of the line 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




--16 months and counting!


----------



## Lil' Knight

11 months for the reference.
 Still not enough, maybe 6 months more.


----------



## aluren

maybe 3 more years!


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_maybe 3 more years!_

 

for the reference II ?


----------



## ath

I received my Xin supermini IV that I sent for upgrades in April 2007. Dr. Xin was very apologetic, after I sent a couple of reminders to him. I have posted the receipt of the amp in xin's forum as that is a similar thread there. 

 I believe he is working hard to fulfill the backlog. 

 Good luck guys!


----------



## nsx_23

I'd so love to get a supermicro from Xin


----------



## Nuwidol

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ath* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I received my Xin supermini IV that I sent for upgrades in April 2007. Dr. Xin was very apologetic, after I sent a couple of reminders to him. I have posted the receipt of the amp in xin's forum as that is a similar thread there. 

 I believe he is working hard to fulfill the backlog. 

 Good luck guys!_

 

Congratulations!

 Thats kind of good news. Hopefully 17 months isn't going to be the average wait time though...


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ath* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I received my Xin supermini IV that I sent for upgrades in April 2007. Dr. Xin was very apologetic, after I sent a couple of reminders to him. I have posted the receipt of the amp in xin's forum as that is a similar thread there. 

 I believe he is working hard to fulfill the backlog. 

 Good luck guys!_

 


 Wonder what went wrong there. I send mine in early november and had it back late january. Although that was not for upgrade but for repair.


----------



## tha_dude

How reliable are Xin amps?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How reliable are Xin amps?_

 

I have never had a problem and I have a few (most of the models). There was a few problems with the battery contacts but that was a while ago. If Xin starts shipping regular everyone should be getting some great amps.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How reliable are Xin amps?_

 

you sound as if you are possibly considering purchasing one...


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_you sound as if you are possibly considering purchasing one... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Been waiting just over a year now


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Been waiting just over a year now _

 

snap.

 my supermacro was robust and never had any mechanical issues apart from the odd battery contact discrepancy

 my supermicro, same story, battery contacts
 but when i was testing a supermicro IV from the new batch they were much iproved and not as flimsy

 apart from that they have been mechanically sound and heavily used. 

 xin would have the hottest business in town for portable amps if he shipped within a normal timeframe


----------



## _j_

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_xin would have the hottest business in town for portable amps if he shipped within a normal timeframe_

 

I had received my SuperMicro after my 16+ month wait a month ago or so.

 Since the time I ordered it, I've decided I would much rather have the SuperMini and would LOVE to place an order with Xin for it... but no way am I waiting 17 months.

 If Xin can start processing and shipping orders within 1 month's timeframe... he'll have another order from me.

 While his service sucks... all I can say is WOW about the SuperMicro.


----------



## jamato8

Yeah the SuperMicro is extremely good. The Reference is based on it. The Mini has always been Xin's favorite but hasn't sold well. I don't think people realize how good it is and how much it can do.


----------



## DennyL

My question is: [size=x-large]Why can't Xin post something on his own screw**g Web site to tell his customers what is going on????[/size]


----------



## sbulack

In July and August, I had sent two requests to Dr. Xin for a refund of the Paypal funds sent for a Reference order in August 2007. I never got a reply or the refund, so I just sent Dr. Xin another email asking him to disregard the requests for a refund and to keep the order in place.

 So, 9/8/2008 was the 13 month anniversary of my order of a Xin Reference amp, for which I still wait and hope (I'm breathing normally though).


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How reliable are Xin amps?_

 

I have had 7 Xin amps (SuperMacro, SuperMacro-III, SuperMacro-LE, Reference, SuperMini-III, SuperMini-IV and SuperMicro-IV)and the only reliability problem I had was on the SuperMini-III where the input jack developed a loose connection after >2years of use. On the SuperMini-IV I got wierd sound when I disabled dc boost and used it with Tripple.fi 10 phones. Other than that they have all been very good. For pure sound the Reference won but my true love was always the SuperMini. If only Xin would start delivering on a reliable timeframe again and upgrade the SuperMini with all he has learned from the Refernce project I think it would be an awesome amp.


----------



## ComfyCan

I have a SuperMicro III and a SuperMicro IV. I've had a lot of trouble with the thin copper battery contacts. Fortunately it's not difficult to jury rig something that works, because I'm certainly not going to send an amp back to Dr. Xin for repair. They do sound sweet though. 

 Maybe if I ever get the Reference I ordered I'll send the SM IV in for proper repair (and updating). One can dream.


----------



## Gatsu

Well after almost a year I canceled my Reference order this morning. I'll let you guys know when my refund comes through.

 Good luck to those still waiting.


----------



## MrScary

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My question is: [size=x-large]Why can't Xin post something on his own screw**g Web site to tell his customers what is going on????[/size]_

 

Cant post cause hes rotting and dead somewhere


----------



## williamchc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gatsu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well after almost a year I canceled my Reference order this morning. I'll let you guys know when my refund comes through.

 Good luck to those still waiting._

 

Well, we have the same order date of the Reference.
 Hopes you can get your refund soon.


----------



## HiFlight

FWIW, my new iBasso D3 Python sounds better than my Reference did. Much more 3-dimensional and better instrument definition, IE: better rendition of harmonics and overtones.


----------



## immtbiker

A little off-topic, but this thread is more like a wish list than what we already have...

*HiFlight*, you say that the iBasso sounds better than the Reference. Have you tried it against either the Pico, Predator or Portaphile sans the DAC? 
 The price of the D3 Python seems incredibly fair against it's competition.

 Also, what does it mean, on the iBasso website when it says:

 "Comes with one silver and one black enclosure". 
 Does it come with 2 enclosures, or is it 2 options.

 TIA


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_A little off-topic, but this thread is more like a wish list than what we already have...

*HiFlight*, you say that the iBasso sounds better than the Reference. Have you tried it against either the Pico, Predator or Portaphile sans the DAC? 
 The price of the D3 Python seems incredibly fair against it's competition.

 Also, what does it mean, on the iBasso website when it says:

 "Comes with one silver and one black enclosure". 
 Does it come with 2 enclosures, or is it 2 options.

 TIA_

 

It comes assembled in silver w/ a second black body. Thus you end up w/ a two tone unit. Black body w/ silver end plates, very cool if you ask me.

 If you ask me the D3 or the P3 are priced very competively and depending on your likes or dislikes it could be as good or better than the Pico, Portaphile, etc.







 If you do not need the dac why not get the P3 it has a kit of op-amps for you to roll and find your sound.


----------



## immtbiker

Thanks for the clarification.

 The DAC can come in handy since I always have my portable Smartdisk Firelite 250 GB HD with lossless files and laptop with me in hotel rooms while away on business.

 Sorry for the OT.


----------



## jamato8

Hijacked thread!

 The dac in the D3 is excellent as is the amp. I am very impressed. I haven't compared to the Reference (it was recently upgraded with the latest caps) since burning in the D3.


----------



## ecclesand

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My question is: [size=x-large]Why can't Xin post something on his own screw**g Web site to tell his customers what is going on????[/size]_

 

NM


----------



## sunneebear

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HiFlight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_FWIW, my new iBasso D3 Python sounds better than my Reference did. Much more 3-dimensional and better instrument definition, IE: better rendition of harmonics and overtones._

 

Can it drive large cans as well as the Reference? My P2 and D2 with the stock opamp are terrible at high volume and even strong bass notes at normal volume.


----------



## Quaddy

14 month anniversary. yawn.


----------



## itsborken

I believe today is also the 3 month anniversary when all backorders were to be caught up. 

 I give up, no Xin amp for me even if he sorts his mess out. Fool me twice, shame on me.


----------



## mp101

Hi guys, finally got my reference yesterday, not had time to listen yet.

 Only waited about 16 months.

 Cheers


----------



## Quaddy

that was quick, yeah no rush on listening to it, take your time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 seriously, glad you finally got it. good stuff.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mp101* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys, finally got my reference yesterday, not had time to listen yet.

 Only waited about 16 months.

 Cheers_


----------



## nc8000

This takes trickle delivery to a new level


----------



## vandread

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mp101* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys, finally got my reference yesterday, not had time to listen yet.

 Only waited about 16 months.

 Cheers_

 

hoooooooo.........

 i'm already wait for 14 months

 so, it just a couple more month before mine arrived, right


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *vandread* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hoooooooo.........

 i'm already wait for 14 months

 so, it just a couple more month before mine arrived, right 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			














_

 

We can always dream ......
 Hope you brought a LOT of popcorn - this could be a LOOOOONG wait.
 I brought something to wash it down with ......


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mp101* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi guys, finally got my reference yesterday, not had time to listen yet.

 Only waited about 16 months.

 Cheers_

 

Hey, I'm 18 months and counting--I got screwed, but what's new.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This takes trickle delivery to a new level_

 

Hopefully Xin will be faster with his trickle delivery, than trickle down economics. I am still waiting for that $ trickle to come in--since Regan and the Eighties.


----------



## mackay maus

I'm in Canada, and the amp I ordered last year now costs 60 bucks more due to our crappy dollar. I was glad I'd not ordered with paypal, but wish I had now!

 Still, I'm sure the amp will be worth the wait-and the extra money.


----------



## Wotan1

I emailed Xin about a pay pall refund. He answered promptly with the question If I wanted to reconsider, because he was about to start shipping. I asked him when and again got a swift response.

 "Tomorrow" he wrote. 

 So keep fingers crossed. Maybe "The Wait" is about to end.


----------



## tha_dude

three months ago he also said shipping would "start tomorrow"..let's see what happens. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I emailed Xin about a pay pall refund. He answered promptly with the question If I wanted to reconsider, because he was about to start shipping. I asked him when and again got a swift response.

 "Tomorrow" he wrote. 

 So keep fingers crossed. Maybe "The Wait" is about to end._


----------



## Quaddy

strange how he says tomorrow as the response just when someone wants to cancel their order, this has happened many times before, so pardon my inflected synicism.

 as you say *maybe* they will ship soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 hope so, as i can see myself getting back into portable if i have a decent amp such as the reference i ordered


----------



## tnmike1

OK I'll play the game. In the year and a half since I ordered my amp and stillwaiting, how many new amps have come along?? The hottest one at the moment seems to be the Mustang from Ray Samuels who, by the way, is always available either by phone or email. So we have tons of amps on the market since the Mysterious Xin disappeared

 OK--he starts shipping amps and you get yours. Who's to say he doesn't pull the disappearing act in another couple months. And who's to say your amp needs repair. Who ya gonna send it to?? The Disappearing Xin and wait how many months for it to get fixed??

 You play the game if you want. I'm buying from more reliable sources


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*OK I'll play the game*...*You play the game if you want*. I'm buying from more reliable sources_

 

"Game on! Game off!" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 yours, 
 wayne cambell

 p.s. any recent xin receivers out there??


----------



## Jaw007

He never answered any of my 10 emails that I sent him in 11 months.I lost my original order and cannot cancel,so I guess I will have and wait it out.


----------



## Wotan1

Woow, just got a message that the amp has been shipped. Got an invoice as well, stamped "PAID". Will keep you posted..


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_strange how he says tomorrow as the response just when someone wants to cancel their order..._

 

That has happened sometimes, and sometimes not. My two requests sent this past July and August by email, and a post on fixup.net, to cancel my order and get a refund of the PayPal payment received no reply and no refund. So, in September, I took down my fixup.net post and sent another email asking to receive the Reference I'd ordered and to disregard the cancellation requests, with the same response from Dr. Xin: none. The responses from the inscrutable Dr. Xin remain, well, inscrutable.


----------



## Gatsu

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That has happened sometimes, and sometimes not. My two requests sent this past July and August by email, and a post on fixup.net, to cancel my order and get a refund of the PayPal payment received no reply and no refund. So, in September, I took down my fixup.net post and sent another email asking to receive the Reference I'd ordered and to disregard the cancellation requests, with the same response from Dr. Xin: none. The responses from the inscrutable Dr. Xin remain, well, inscrutable._

 

I emailed Xin canceling my Reference order roughly a month ago now. Still no answer.


----------



## Jaw007

I emailed and canceled my reference also.
 I never heard from Xin either.


----------



## Pangaea

I don't even want mine. It will go straight to the FS forum unopened. I'd cancel it but I lost my email receipt. The whole thing disgusts me. Everything about his business practice is so juvenile. Nothing excuses him from not communicating, I really do not care what his situation is at this point.


----------



## tomjtx

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't even want mine. It will go straight to the FS forum unopened. I'd cancel it but I lost my email receipt. The whole thing disgusts me. Everything about his business practice is so juvenile. Nothing excuses him from not communicating, I really do not care what his situation is at this point._

 

X ten trillion 

 Giving any support to Xin is condoning his unethical behavior


----------



## Spookykinkajou

I just got an email from him today saying:

 Hi Seen,

 Sorry for taking so long but we finally get the amp to ship. If you
 still want it, please use this link to submit a credit card:

 Thank you,

 Xin

 ******

 Now, I placed this order, gee, maybe a year and a half ago. I'm not even sure. I don't even remember what I ordered! He spelled my name wrong, too.


----------



## Wotan1

Mine was send last week and cleared customs yesterday. One amp a week?
 Btw my mail was send by a John Smith on behalve of Xin Feng. Does he have a partner?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Mine was send last week and cleared customs yesterday. One amp a week?
 Btw my mail was send by a John Smith on behalve of Xin Feng. Does he have a partner?_

 

John Smith!!!!

 How did he ever come up with a name like that?

 I follow this thread for the entertainment value (it gets better and better) and one day I might even receive a Reference, if I'm still alive. Now, shall we say 300 amps divided by one amp a week....2014!


----------



## paradoe

I don't have such patience to order a Reference...


----------



## Jaw007

I finally herd from the good Dr. after canceling my order.I heard from him within a week,and after many attempts of trying to contact him.This is the reply!

 Sorry, canceled it but please feel free to come back if you change
 your mind and I'll keep your position in the line. I've started
 shipping after a long interrupt period. Thank you, Xin


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_John Smith!!!!

 How did he ever come up with a name like that?

 I follow this thread for the entertainment value (it gets better and better) and one day I might even receive a Reference, if I'm still alive. Now, shall we say 300 amps divided by one amp a week....2014!_

 

Ma be He goggled it!


----------



## Wotan1

The Reference!! And not hit by tax. Yohoo!


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Reference!!

 http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z209/WotanZeven/P1000734.jpg[/IMG

 [IMG]http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z209/WotanZeven/P1000748.jpg[/IMG[/i]
 [/td] [/tr] [/table]


Nice one !!!

 How many years ago did you order it ? [img]http://www.head-fi.org/forums/images/smilies/tongue.gif_


----------



## Wotan1

Seems like a million years ago.


----------



## nickyboyo

Congratulations Wotan1, it seems folks have more chance of winning a national lottery than receiving a xin amp these days. The big question mate- is the sound pumped out from the amp worth the money and the wait?


----------



## Wotan1

Thanks. I wish a won the lottery instead. More bucks for the long wait. The amp sounds top out of the box. I will compare it with the Move, Hornet and Lisa III after couple of hours burn-in.


----------



## Quaddy

eh? is that reference all black?? dont remember that being an option!

 i today ordered a supermicro IV via CC for christmas 2010

 call me sucker, at least i know what i am in for, god i miss that supermicro sound!


----------



## Wotan1

It's all black. I'm not sure about the options. My long term memory fails me.


----------



## Quaddy

ahh right, yeah memory with all things xin is cloudy too, BTW when did you order yours wotan? i am coming upto 15 months on saturday...


----------



## Wotan1

As I said my long term memory fails me, but I think it's 15 month for me as well.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_eh? is that reference all black?? dont remember that being an option!

 i today ordered a supermicro IV via CC for christmas 2010

 call me sucker, at least i know what i am in for, god i miss that supermicro sound!_

 

Ordered my Super Micro IV over the summer, and recently sent the update of my CC expiration (with no response of course) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 If I ever was to order a Reference, getting the 1/4" jack along with the 1/8" would have been the only reason. But now these days I rarely order a portable amp that does not include a DAC in it now, and I am re-terminating most of my desktop phones with 4-pin Neutrik and my SE adapter terminates in a 1/8".


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I will compare it with the Move, Hornet and Lisa III after couple of hours burn-in._

 

Please do, looking forward to your impressions.


----------



## EFN

Out of the blue and limbo....I received a notification from Dr Xin saying that my SuperMini-IV has been posted
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now, the problem is the last time I ordered anything to Dr Xin was almost TWO YEARS ago! It was so distant that I am flaggerbusted when I received the email. He NEVER replied my mail (I doubt he ever read it) because if he did he would have known I have asked him to switch the SuperMini-IV for a Reference.

 Oh well. Now the question is, *what do I do with it*? I only have faithful ER-4P with me, with juices pumped from an O2 Xda Flame WM6.1 PDA. I have pretty much retired from the Porta Audiophilia scene.........


----------



## Jaw007

[size=x-small]Just got word from Dr.Xin He just mailed my Reference tonight.
 I emailed him yesterday ,and herd back in a few minutes.
 I emailed him three times this evening,and herd back very quickly,within ten to fifteen minutes.
 I feel that he is doing his best to build us our little jewels in a timely fashion.
 Time passed very quickly because of working 12 to 16 hours a day,and having some new toys to play with in the mean time.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









 Thank you Dr.Xin[/size]


----------



## jamato8

.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Out of the blue and limbo....I received a notification from Dr Xin saying that my SuperMini-IV has been posted
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now, the problem is the last time I ordered anything to Dr Xin was almost TWO YEARS ago! It was so distant that I am flaggerbusted when I received the email. He NEVER replied my mail (I doubt he ever read it) because if he did he would have known I have asked him to switch the SuperMini-IV for a Reference.

 Oh well. Now the question is, *what do I do with it*? I only have faithful ER-4P with me, with juices pumped from an O2 Xda Flame WM6.1 PDA. I have pretty much retired from the Porta Audiophilia scene........._

 

Wow, and you were a pioneer in the iMod and big cap docks for a while too!


----------



## Wotan1

Reference in action


----------



## hockeyb213

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Wotan1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Reference in action




_

 

that thing looks like a monster


----------



## Lil' Knight

Just passed 13rd month on the Reference order.


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Out of the blue and limbo....I received a notification from Dr Xin saying that my SuperMini-IV has been posted
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now, the problem is the last time I ordered anything to Dr Xin was almost TWO YEARS ago! It was so distant that I am flaggerbusted when I received the email. He NEVER replied my mail (I doubt he ever read it) because if he did he would have known I have asked him to switch the SuperMini-IV for a Reference.

 Oh well. Now the question is, *what do I do with it*? I only have faithful ER-4P with me, with juices pumped from an O2 Xda Flame WM6.1 PDA. I have pretty much retired from the Porta Audiophilia scene........._

 






 wanna trade for my beta ref with bg modded?


----------



## _j_

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Out of the blue and limbo....I received a notification from Dr Xin saying that my SuperMini-IV has been posted
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now, the problem is the last time I ordered anything to Dr Xin was almost TWO YEARS ago! It was so distant that I am flaggerbusted when I received the email. He NEVER replied my mail (I doubt he ever read it) because if he did he would have known I have asked him to switch the SuperMini-IV for a Reference.

 Oh well. Now the question is, *what do I do with it*?_

 

That's easy! Sell it to me and place a new order for what you really wanted 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 No, I am serious.


----------



## DennyL

Encouraged by all these signs of life from Xin I sent him an email summarising my order for a Reference (ordered on 4th Sept 2007), and change of credit card details, giving me three order IDs ( sent the credit card info twice), and wishing him well. So far no reply. Fingers crossed. I would still like a Reference.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Out of the blue and limbo....I received a notification from Dr Xin saying that my SuperMini-IV has been posted
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now, the problem is the last time I ordered anything to Dr Xin was almost TWO YEARS ago! It was so distant that I am flaggerbusted when I received the email. He NEVER replied my mail (I doubt he ever read it) because if he did he would have known I have asked him to switch the SuperMini-IV for a Reference.

 Oh well. Now the question is, *what do I do with it*? I only have faithful ER-4P with me, with juices pumped from an O2 Xda Flame WM6.1 PDA. I have pretty much retired from the Porta Audiophilia scene........._

 

perhaps you can sell it and pay me back the money you still owe me...


----------



## jamato8

Interesting. . . .


----------



## Pangaea

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_perhaps you can sell it and pay me back the money you still owe me..._

 

x2 !!!

 Seriously dude (EFN) you got a lot of nerve coming around periodically telling everyone you owe money that you are back and are going to make things right. You even PM'd me to send you an invoice for what was owed and then just ignored it. So now you have wasted my money and time.

 Honestly at this point I do not want the money but I do want you banned. People start huge threads around here for one eronious sale, but you have taken quite a few peoples money and yet float around untouched.

 Sorry to Honest Head-fiers- rant over- but perhaps this should be taken up in another thread or at least by a Mod.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_perhaps you can sell it and pay me back the money you still owe me..._

 


 Yes sounds like a plan 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





...a very good plan. That thing will arrive next week. Will keep you guys updated.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_x2 !!!

 Seriously dude (EFN) you got a lot of nerve coming around periodically telling everyone you owe money that you are back and are going to make things right. You even PM'd me to send you an invoice for what was owed and then just ignored it. So now you have wasted my money and time.

 Honestly at this point I do not want the money but I do want you banned. People start huge threads around here for one eronious sale, but you have taken quite a few peoples money and yet float around untouched.

 Sorry to Honest Head-fiers- rant over- but perhaps this should be taken up in another thread or at least by a Mod._

 


 I want to make things right again but sometimes things jsut don't go the way I wish it be. The SUperMini-IV will be received untouched. It will be up for sale and the funds will be then channeled to you and Aluren. That should sort things out.


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I want to make things right again but sometimes things jsut don't go the way I wish it be. The SUperMini-IV will be received untouched. It will be up for sale and the funds will be then channeled to you and Aluren. That should sort things out._

 

interesting how u have the money to pay for the supermini but no money to pay us back in the first place...


----------



## younglee200

the guy obviously needs to get his priorities straight... I think that's already been established here.

 Anyways, I'm thinking of placing an order for the supermicro... but I think I'll wait around and see the majority of people here get their amplifiers first. I know I'd go crazy if i had to wait like 16 months.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *younglee200* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I know I'd go crazy if i had to wait like 16 months._

 

you *will* have to wait that long give or take a few months.

 so you go into the fray well informed!


----------



## drc73rp

Having read the recent posts i took the chance and emailed him asking if he will be shipping my order soon..

 "Not very soon but yes on the way. Xin"

 God know what this means.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Oh well, 14 months and counting.....


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_interesting how u have the money to pay for the supermini but no money to pay us back in the first place..._

 

It was a purchase made almost 2 years ago while I was still active, while I had the SuperMicro-IV with me. It was already paid for. Initially I asked Xin to swap the order for a Reference when it was first offered then things has gone quiet until now.

 Look at this positively, I have already refunded you $73 lately. So another $127 to go. Selling th SMini would make things come together. Only you and Pangea are the ones left for me to refund..the rest (dimmok, Quaddy, Antonyfirst and a few more) have all been settled. Cheers.


----------



## jamato8

Well nothing like an open forum for emails. :^) 

 I hope all gets resolved. Life is too short.


----------



## Quaddy

My 15 month anniversay for the reference. *pours out a little liquor*


----------



## mackay maus

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My 15 month anniversay for the reference. *pours out a little liquor*_

 

me too-a toast to all us audio-fools. Clink!

 Which reminds me, just finished a bottle of Talisker last night and must pick up another. All of a sudden, hi-fi doesn't seem that expensive a hobby!


----------



## alongwait

ORDER DATE: March 20, 2007
 SHIP DATE: Nov 6, 2008
 WAIT TIME: about 20 months

 Good luck to you all.


----------



## nickknutson

Xin emailed me last night!
 I actually forgot about my order! LOL
 I don't exactly know when I ordered, but I know it was in the first half of 2007.
 Now I'm pleasantly surprised...and that's my philosophy when ordering with Xin


----------



## mrarroyo

Glad to see so many are getting their shipping notes. The last tweak for the Reference helped to open the soundstage as well as extend the upper mids and the highs. One heck of a major change which I hope you all can hear. Good luck.


----------



## hockeyb213

seems that he is starting to really begin to ship em now but with my sr-71a I would not even look at a Xin after seeing some of the things that happened to people on this forum


----------



## wuwhere

I'm curious how the ER4S would sound with the Reference.


----------



## Jaw007

Got a reference,it is fantastic with !/8 and 1/4 inputs and outputs,yet so tiny.
 Haven't got time to try it out until tomorrow though.Got it from Oregon to Ohio in about 36 hours.WOW


----------



## itsborken

The Fedex shipments is a classy move after the delays.


----------



## Jaw007

Mine shipped in a heavy paper envelope
 USPS Priority Mail.Amazingly fast!


----------



## ljs

Package sent for me
 Will let you know when I get it


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Package sent for me
 Will let you know when I get it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

did you order in september or april 07?


----------



## ljs

April 07
 The reference was shipped using USPS EMS so it should be here soon - at least I hope.


----------



## Kabeer

Ok,
 I finally got an email from Xin (ordered 19 months ago). But my order was for either amp and my needs have changed now. I use very demanding Orthodynamic headphones.

 Do you think the supermicro would suit me? Or the supermini, or Reference?


----------



## Quaddy

surely the reference is going to be the most capable of driving anything demanding like orthos, compared with SMIV and mini IMHO.

 it may not be best with any, but ref is gonna provide most power out of them all, isnt the SMIV using 5x voltage multiplier to squeeze output?


----------



## Kabeer

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_surely the reference is going to be the most capable of driving anything demanding like orthos, compared with SMIV and mini IMHO.

 it may not be best with any, but ref is gonna provide most power out of them all, isnt the SMIV using 5x voltage multiplier to squeeze output?_

 

Thanks,
 I'll go with the Reference. I ordered this so long ago when power wasnt a big requirement. Things have changed now, but I may as well get a Xin amp after going through SUCH a long wait.


----------



## DennyL

This has appeared on the Xin Web site, headed 'My Sincere Apolgy':-

 <<<Very sorry for the super long wait, I don't want give any excuse but sincere apology.

 I've started order processing and shipping. I can ship out about 5 to 10 amps per day. Each and every amp is made by my own hands, from boards soldering, cases manufacturing, final assembly to shipping. Even though parts price and shipping cost have increased a lot, I won't raise the price.

 If you have canceled your order, please feel free to email me if you still want it. I'll process your order in the original position in the line. I never want more sales, I just feel very bad for disappointing you after such a long wait. I understand fully.

 Here are some changes to the latest amps:

 For SuperMacro-IV/LE and SuperMini-IV, they are no longer designed for all OPAMPs, but optimized for most popular audio OPAMPs only. As a result, some OPAMPs (such as AD8397) need some special treatments before plugged into these amps, especially in 3rd and 4th channels.

 For SuperMini-IV and SuperMicro-IV, the input and output jacks are now securely mounted to ensure durability.

 The charging circuit in SuperMacro-IV/LE has been improved to avoid heat during charging but speed is decreased to 3-4 hours (still very fast).

 All the amps including Reference has been improved on all the aspects I could think of. You'll love the new sound and they'll server you reliably.

 When your order is processed, you'll receive two email notifications: one is a PDF file of your invoice showing what you ordered and how much you were charged; the other email is about shipping details with, if available, a tracking #. There is no any documents included in the package, upon to the requests from some customers. If your credit card has expired, we'll email you. 

 Thank you and please feel free to email me if you have any concern about your order and amp.

 Currently shipping: order # 38662325>>>


----------



## tk3

Nice to see he seems to be getting back on track.


----------



## Pangaea

What is so funny and stupid about how Xin operates is that this is all he needed to do months ago- and I think most would agree the resentment would have been mitigated. Now a year+ later, I don't know... Too little too late comes to mind. But even now it still goes along way. Communication is the key, to almost everything in life.


----------



## nickknutson

Funny thing about my order is that he had two orders under my name and he didn't know he fulfilled the first one. Talk about organization skills! My orginal order was for a SMIV, but I'm debating on whether to change, or add to it.


----------



## Quaddy

damn, i dont have my order ID for my cancelled SMIV, my emails have long gone! would have resurrected that one now as have since sold mine

 double drat!


----------



## DennyL

Is this promise #3?


----------



## Wotan1

Today I used the Reference on the train. It has 6 hours burn-in time. I listened to the new James Bond OST through the Shure's 500s and the IMOD. One word!! Supurb. The deep bass on "No interest in Dominic Green" was really deep. And the guitar strings on "Bolivian Taxi Ride" did sound like real strings. I have not experienced this kind of sound with the Move and the Hornet. Maybe with the Lisa. But she is out for repairs.


----------



## hd650

I ordered Supermini in Mar, 2007.
 changed order to reference in Aug, 2007.
 get it TODAY, Nov 10, 2008. Have not test it yet


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Currently shipping: order # 38662325>>>_

 

So, what does that mean for order #40630xxx - that there are 2 million orders ahead of me?


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, what does that mean for order #40630xxx - that there are 2 million orders ahead of me? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes, I was wondering about that. If the order refs are sequential then he only has to get through about 613,000 orders before he gets to mine! So, at ten amps per day....


----------



## glc

At the rate of 10/day being shipped, you only have to wait another 547 days if Xin works 7 days a week.....


----------



## Quaddy

victim #3916xxxx here


----------



## nickyboyo

Patience is a virtue- #4051**** here


----------



## Jaw007

"Wow" these little black boxes seem to be invading all parts of the globe!


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_victim #3916xxxx here_

 

I ordered a Reference on August 8, 2007.
 My order number is 3916xxxx as well.


----------



## Kabeer

Wow I dont believe it, finally a shipping note!!!
 My order was at the start of Apr 2007 for peoples references.


----------



## Aaron622

I ordered a Reference changed to a SuperMicro on 8/12/07.
 My order is 3917xxxx. 
 I emailed Xin last night and got a quick response saying that mine should be shipping soon.


----------



## mrarroyo

I am sure glad the amps are shipping out. It looks like about 15-20 have been received, that is an step in the right direction.

 Hope you all enjoy it.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am sure glad the amps are shipping out. It looks like about 15-20 have been received, that is an step in the right direction.
 Hope you all enjoy it._

 

I sent an email to Dr. Xin late this morning to verify that he has my Order # in his fulfillment queue, and he replied affirmatively this afternoon.

 It's a good turn of events, I agree. And especially happy after your recent posts, Miguel, that the most recent tweak(s) to the Reference have made some worthwhile sound quality improvements.


----------



## Jaw007

The sound coming from the Xin Reference,is nothing short of amazing.
 And that is fresh out of the box.
 I can only imagine what it will make headphones sound like after burn in.
 I can honestly say it was worth the wait.


----------



## Gatsu

I sent Xin an email a month or so back and asked him to cancel the order, still no sign of any sort of response from him, but its good news that hes shipping once more.

 I ordered a Reference 8th October 2007
 Order # 3941xxxx


----------



## tamiwo

Xin Reference
 date of order : 6th September 2007 (5th US Time)
 order number : 3927xxxx
 payment : PayPal

 I was so _young_ that I never knew I had better not to use PayPal.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I'm a little bit (or very much) relieved to hear Dr.Xin comes back again.


----------



## ljs

April 07: 3863xxxx


----------



## vandread

Reference: August 7th, 2007

 #3915****

 by the way, it way so funny to see how fast thing's change........

 in term.... until a couple days ago, still so many negative comment etc etc etc about xin............ how it say what so good about xin amp, and another curse.......

 but now, it's suddenly so many praise about how good is it and comment it's worth to wait.......

 hehehe...................

 no offence, i wait for my Ref too............ in sit back and relax....... no rush......... but glad to hear it will coming soon....... someday


----------



## hockeyb213

it is amazing how long of a wait there is I don't understand why Xin cannot recruit someone to speed up his production. I wonder how long I would be waiting if I ordered one today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but with my sr-71a I think I will be holding off anything from xin


----------



## tk3

No one knows what his personal conditions are since the guy is shrouded in mystery.
 I recall reading that he only trusted himself to assemble the gear to meet his level of quality though.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hockeyb213* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_it is amazing how long of a wait there is I don't understand why Xin cannot recruit someone to speed up his production._

 

Most DIY-ers have their own pride and happiness to do all the stuffs on himself. And I think Xin is among those.


----------



## hockeyb213

but still it is not fair to make people wait for over a year w/o atleast giving them fair warning first.....that isn't cool


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hockeyb213* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_but still it is not fair to make people wait for over a year w/o atleast giving them fair warning first.....that isn't cool_

 

There's still a long line of people willing to wait >1.5 year to get his amp. Make me think about the line of people in front of the Apple stores when they first sold the iPhone.
 Isn't it cool?


----------



## Mingus1955

ordered:may 2008

 this little thing works fine ...

 hope you all got your xins soon


----------



## Pangaea

^Please tell me you mean 2007.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mingus1955* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ordered:may 2008

 this little thing works fine ...

 hope you all got your xins soon_

 

New record


----------



## hockeyb213

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Lil' Knight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_New record 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

how the hell is that possible if people from 2007 are still waiting for theirs? Or is it that he got a new / less chosen model?


----------



## wobberly1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It was a purchase made almost 2 years ago while I was still active, while I had the SuperMicro-IV with me. It was already paid for. Initially I asked Xin to swap the order for a Reference when it was first offered then things has gone quiet until now.

 Look at this positively, I have already refunded you $73 lately. So another $127 to go. Selling th SMini would make things come together. Only you and Pangea are the ones left for me to refund..the rest (dimmok, Quaddy, Antonyfirst and a few more) have all been settled. Cheers._

 

Sorry for hijacking this, but you owe me for a cable as well.

 Martin


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *wobberly1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry for hijacking this, but you owe me for a cable as well.

 Martin_

 


 Hey no worries. Plz email me at EFN_2008@live.com for the details. I am in the process of clearing things up with Aluren now (not a small amount). So left only you and Pangea.


----------



## DennyL

Woohoo. This is a special day. I emailed Xin twice summarising my order for a Reference, with the original order ref and the two order refs from when I sent updated card details. I said I was still looking forward to receiving my Reference and asked him if he knows when he might ship it. Xin's reply: 'Thank you. Xin'.


----------



## nc8000

I re-ordered a Reference sometime late 2007 and a SuperMini-IV about august 2007. I have no recollection of the order numbers and the credit cards used are most likely expired and my e-mail address no longer exist so not much chance there. I'm happy with my RudiStor XJ-03 now so will not bother trying to get this sorted out.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I re-ordered a Reference sometime late 2007 and a SuperMini-IV about august 2007. I have no recollection of the order numbers and the credit cards used are most likely expired and my e-mail address no longer exist so not much chance there. I'm happy with my RudiStor XJ-03 now so will not bother trying to get this sorted out._

 

i was in a similar situation, i no longer have reference numbers, my email is new

 i simply provided my email as it was, my name and address and explained the situation, and xin replied that he would find the orders and sort it all out and ressurect the position in the queue


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i was in a similar situation, i no longer have reference numbers, my email is new

 i simply provided my email as it was, my name and address and explained the situation, and xin replied that he would find the orders and sort it all out and resurrect the position in the queue 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Same thing here.Soon after received a Reference.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

All your emails are gonna slow him down!


----------



## isao2k8

I think he should stop accepting new orders till he send all current ordered amps...


----------



## rhadtheman

1 year mark. Wow... time flies.


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *isao2k8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think he should stop accepting new orders till he send all current ordered amps..._

 

One would think that would be a no-brainer, but who knows.


----------



## sfflyfish

SuperMicro
 38749XXX
 Ordered 5/4/07
 Dare I dream????


----------



## ljs

My reference is here
 2-day shipping

 Sounds awesome!


----------



## antonyfirst

Everyone will have a reference soon and its resale value will decrease.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_SuperMicro
 38749XXX
 Ordered 5/4/07
 Dare I dream????_

 

Upon asking Xin yesterday, (11/14) as to whether I should update a possibly expired CC number I received this:

 "Yes should be shipped tomorrow or Monday so please go ahead and submit CC:

 Thank you,

 Xin"

 PS This order was for two Super Micro's. One in a dark blue case, the other in a red case. I can only use one. The other was a birthday present for a birthday way back in 2007.

 Any interest in taking one of these off my hands, PM Me.


----------



## noisyscott

Supermicro
 Order 38688xxx
 Order date: 4/20/07
 Received: 11/14/08

 total wait time almost 19 months.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 Any interest in taking one of these off my hands, PM Me._


----------



## nickknutson

How much are References reselling for these days? I'm not on here very often anymore.


----------



## Jaw007

Go here and look!

Cool Stuff


----------



## nickknutson

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Go here and look!

Cool Stuff_

 

Sorry, I meant resale value...I should have specified.


----------



## Lil' Knight

My god 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Just sent him an email regarding my order 1 year ago. And somehow he said that there's no record of purchase. Fun fun ...


----------



## hockeyb213

ouch so what was the outcome you lost your order?


----------



## Lil' Knight

Might be 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I sent the shipping address for him to search again. What a good ending!


----------



## hockeyb213

you don't have a proof of purchase like a paypal receipt or anything?


----------



## Lil' Knight

Nope. I made an order by CC 1 year ago. Now I can't find the confirmation email ...


----------



## RAQemUP

It should be in your CC statement at least since you know it was 1 year ago.


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickknutson* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry, I meant resale value...I should have specified._

 

Some fellow was trying to resell a new set of Xin Reference for $70 above the retail price. Which hands down is a joke IMHO.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *RAQemUP* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It should be in your CC statement at least since you know it was 1 year ago._

 

I put an order using the old CC and at that time I was in other country.
 Now I have a new CC and moved to the States 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, got his email that he would put me in the Aug 15 2007 line. Hope I don't have to wait until 2009 lol.


----------



## antonyfirst

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZephyrSapphire* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Some fellow was trying to resell a new set of Xin Reference for $70 above the retail price. Which hands down is a joke IMHO._

 

Others used to do the same in the past years (actually prices were even higher). Though, thanks to the many orders that seem to be fullfilled lately, it's possible that prices from now on will be equal or less than the asking for a new unit.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZephyrSapphire* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Some fellow was trying to resell a new set of Xin Reference for $70 above the retail price. Which hands down is a joke IMHO._

 

I don't believe the person was trying to make a profit,when you figure his cost!

 Reference $280.00
 Shipping $10.00
 1/8and1/4 in out$20.00
 Total $310.00

 Then after he sells it he has PayPal fees,and shipping,go figure!
 The Reference is no more a joke then some other popular amps.
 I have one burning right now ,and it IMO sounds fantastic.


----------



## Pangaea

I agree, the guy waited a year+ and time is money. If you are not interested in his price, get in line. We all know the reality of the situation.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I agree, the guy waited a year+ and time is money. If you are not interested in his price, get in line. We all know the reality of the situation._

 

X 2!!!!


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I agree, the guy waited a year+ and time is money. If you are not interested in his price, get in line. We all know the reality of the situation._

 

Only the guys who wait know the value of Xin's amps


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't believe the person was trying to make a profit,when you figure his cost!

 Reference $280.00
 Shipping $10.00
 1/8and1/4 in out$20.00
 Total $310.00

 Then after he sells it he has PayPal fees,and shipping,go figure!
 The Reference is no more a joke then some other popular amps.
 I have one burning right now ,and it IMO sounds fantastic._

 

Miscalculation then. $60 profit since there's no 1/4" on his unit.
 $60 isn't a premium anyone should pay for a one year wait when you know it's going to come, but there's a long wait period. I'd pay that $60 if the product is something rare to begin with.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZephyrSapphire* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Miscalculation then. $60 profit since there's no 1/4" on his unit.
 $60 isn't a premium anyone should pay for a one year wait when you know it's going to come, but there's a long wait period. I'd pay that $60 if the product is something rare to begin with._

 

He lowered the price to $330.00 now!
 Well what ever.I've paid prices that were higher before for items I really wanted.I believe a person if they want something badly enough they will pay the price.Look at some of these modders,and their through the roof prices.
 They make his price seem like peanuts.LOL


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I agree, the guy waited a year+ and time is money. If you are not interested in his price, get in line. We all know the reality of the situation._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't believe the person was trying to make a profit,when you figure his cost!

 Reference $280.00
 Shipping $10.00
 1/8and1/4 in out$20.00
 Total $310.00

 Then after he sells it he has PayPal fees,and shipping,go figure!
 The Reference is no more a joke then some other popular amps.
 I have one burning right now ,and it IMO sounds fantastic._

 

Turning over a product for a profit is not allowed in this forum. That is the problem w/ his post.


----------



## Pangaea

Well then notify the Mods, cause we got some HF-1 sellers to ban ASAP!!


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Turning over a product for a profit is not allowed in this forum. That is the problem w/ his post._

 

I got a PM once from someone trying to sell me a pico for $550.00
 I turned it down naturally.


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well then notify the Mods, cause we got some HF-1 sellers to ban ASAP!!_

 

Those are logically exempted as they are out of production, whereas the Xin Reference, is not.


----------



## Pangaea

Who is making up these rules- you? And let me just make clear I am not for the idea of price gauging anything on this forum. But how is price gauging a product that is out of production any different or better than gauging a product that takes 15 months to be delivered. For some, 50 bux may be worth not having to put up with the aggravation of dealing with the Xin customer service machine. I don't see anything wrong with that.


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Who is making up these rules- you? And let me just make clear I am not for the idea of price gauging anything on this forum. But how is price gauging a product that is out of production any different or better than gauging a product that takes 15 months to be delivered. For some, 50 bux may be worth not having to put up with the aggravation of dealing with the Xin customer service machine. I don't see anything wrong with that._

 

 I don't make up the rules. The real world does. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I don't see people paying extra dollar to buy a custom guitar earlier just to skip the line. I don't see people paying top dollar extra to buy their way through to skip the line to a top class restaurant. Heck, I don't even see people paying extra to jump a few places ahead in line to queue at McDonalds!

 But I do see people paying extra to own a limited edition product. I do see people paying extra to own a one-of-a-kind product. The difference between something limited and unlimited cannot be categorized under the same roof.


----------



## Pangaea

That doesn't even make sense. On with the Xin, I cannot keep up with you my friend.


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Who is making up these rules- you? And let me just make clear I am not for the idea of price gauging anything on this forum. But how is price gauging a product that is out of production any different or better than gauging a product that takes 15 months to be delivered. For some, 50 bux may be worth not having to put up with the aggravation of dealing with the Xin customer service machine. I don't see anything wrong with that._

 

X2 I agree with you!


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That doesn't even make sense. On with the Xin, I cannot keep up with you my friend._

 

HMMMM... People don't pay extra to jump queue in the real world but people do pay extra for something limited. That about sums it up


----------



## Gatsu

Actually people *will* pay extra to jump the queue in the real world.

 If you tell someone that something they want will cast $300 but will take 15 months before they can get it, or $350 and they can have it today, I suspect you find that many more people will pay the extra $50 to get it right away.

 Impulse purchasing at its finest.


----------



## ZephyrSapphire

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gatsu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Actually people *will* pay extra to jump the queue in the real world.

 If you tell someone that something they want will cast $300 but will take 15 months before they can get it, or $350 and they can have it today, I suspect you find that many more people will pay the extra $50 to get it right away.

 Impulse purchasing at its finest._

 

Impulse purchasing. Buy now, regret later.
 Hesitant purchasing. Buy later, regret later.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gatsu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Actually people *will* pay extra to jump the queue in the real world.

 If you tell someone that something they want will cast $300 but will take 15 months before they can get it, or $350 and they can have it today, I suspect you find that many more people will pay the extra $50 to get it right away.

 Impulse purchasing at its finest._

 


 And not much different from "Buy it now" on eBay. You pay a premium to get it now and guarantee that you get it or bid lower and chance getting it cheaper or not getting it at all. And people slipping the waiter at popular restaurants a couple of notes to get a table or the doorman at a popular nightclub.


----------



## tk3

Yes, I think it's ridiculous that people are complaining that someone is charging 10-20% extra on an item that he waited over a year for.

 There is also the issue with the heavily fluctuating currency.
 People who paid in Euro (with Paypal conversion) when it was at a 1 : 1.5# ratio, that is quite a sum also.
 If you get the same amount back in USD now you have quite a bit less than you originally paid.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well then notify the Mods, cause we got some HF-1 sellers to ban ASAP!!_

 

I am not here arguing or being sarcastic/funny. The following is on an sticky in the for sale forum:

  Quote:


 .... reselling of new items for profit .... flipping used items for profit ... 
 

Yes, I have reported various items in which it did not seem the above was being followed. The outcome is up to the moderators. If we have a rule I firmly believe we enforce it or get rid of the rule. So far the above rule is still in place, so if you feel like reporting any FS post do so.


----------



## Pangaea

Yes, I have reported various items in which it did not seem the above was being followed. The outcome is up to the moderators. If we have a rule I firmly believe we enforce it or get rid of the rule. So far the above rule is still in place, so if you feel like reporting any FS post do so.[/QUOTE]


 ...agreed, lets move on.


----------



## Quaddy

appears to be a slowdown again after a relatively lively period, any more shipment notifications?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_appears to be a slowdown again after a relatively lively period, any more shipment notifications?_

 

If you go to his site you will notice he updates the order being shipped on a daily basis. So yes the units appear to be shipping out, but perhaps not necessarily to members here.


----------



## Quaddy

ok, thanks, forgot about that!


----------



## mackay maus

"If you go to his site you will notice he updates the order being shipped on a daily basis."

 I checked the site, but could not find this page-would one of you post a link?

 thank you

 M


----------



## Lil' Knight

Xin's Cool Talk - Currently shipping


----------



## mackay maus

Appreciate the info! Looks like the 15 month wait is almost over.


----------



## tnmike1

sent Xin an email yesterday checking on status of reference and got a reply in about12 hrs. This vs. not receiving replies in the past 10 months. Looks like he's back in action. A great relief


----------



## Lil' Knight

Yeah, I did have a "conversation" with him via email 2 days ago regarding my lost order. He answered at least 5 or 6 emails of mine in about 3 hours.


----------



## nc8000

I too got reply whitin 12 hours after not hearing from him for over 6 months


----------



## tbmusic

Suprise!!
 I got a message from Xin today. My Reference is ready so he wanted to know if my address is still the same.
 I think that I will finally see my amp after 15 months of waiting. 
 Will post here with all updates!


----------



## ahhian

I'm in my 15 months too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Wow, lots of delayed items been coming up lately.

 The 3 is also shipping next week


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_SuperMicro
 38749XXX
 Ordered 5/4/07
 Dare I dream????_

 


 18 months and 17 days later I get the storied notice saying:

 "A package was shipped to you on 11/21/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Priority
 Mail, Flat Rate Env to the following address:"

 My Tomahawk is now very nervous


----------



## tbmusic

Got this message from Xin:

 "A package was shipped to you on 11/21/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Priority Mail, Flat Rate Env to the following address:"

 Should be in my hand by Monday or Tuesday


----------



## traquemort

Alright, after a year and a half like most of you I got an email as well.

 My question is - Is it still worth it to get a super mini IV for 200$ ? I don't have an amp except for the fiio e2(?) , use mainly the er4p(/s) and zune 80GB/clip/fuze in that order, might be getting a 2g touch too. 

 what would be an alternative if not ?

 thanks


----------



## jamato8

The Super Mini has been updated to be as good as the Reference but of course it is smaller. I have always liked the Super Mini for its size and sound and now after an update . . well. . . .


----------



## ahhian

I've never own any portable amp before so heres to all gurus out there:

 iPod Classic 160GB -> Xin Ref -> Westone 3

 Will it work, sound wise I mean.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Super Mini has been updated to be as good as the Reference but of course it is smaller. I have always liked the Super Mini for its size and sound and now after an update . . well. . . ._

 

That is exactly what I want to hear. I no longer really have a need for it but since it turned out I still have a place in the line I've got to go for a new SuperMini. That amp was always my favourite out of the whole lineup (although the Reference prototype I had for a short while bested it for sq) and the rig I had with a SuperMini-III and 2nd gen Nano was fantastic.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ I no longer really have a need for it but since it turned out I still have a place in the line I've got to go for a new SuperMini._

 

Unfortunately, part of being a Head-Fier, is owning lot's of stuff that we really don't need, but that we do covet. It's not the actual possession. It the thrill of the chase. And with Xin's disappearance, the chase has certainly been quite "thrilling", indeed. Quite a hobby.

 I'm glad to see that members are starting to get their amps, but I am going to keep the warning sticky around for a while so people who plan to order know about Xin's business practices over the last 2 years, excellent product or not.

 Enjoy your new toys.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ but I am going to keep the warning sticky around for a while so people who plan to order know about Xin's business practices over the last 2 years, excellent product or not._

 

quite right!


----------



## Lil' Knight

After 14 months of waiting, and then lost my order, I decided to cancel the order from Xin. This is such a terrible experience...


----------



## musicmaker

Same here. I canceled after almost a year. Same *terrible *experience.


----------



## sbulack

After about a year of waiting, back in July and August, I cancelled my order too (which required a refund, since I paid by Paypal). When, after two such notifications by email and a post on fixup.net, two months went by with no reply and no refund, in September I cancelled the cancellation (by email and editing the post) - I've recently verified with Xin that I have not lost my place in the order fulfilment queue, and I'm now awaiting (again) "the email" that my Reference has shipped. Funny the path events take as they push their own way forward around and through our intentions and designs.


----------



## jamato8

I have received the updated Reference with the changes Xin made recently and the difference is noticeable. The amp sounds very good.


----------



## musicmaker

jamato8, if you were to choose only one amp between the SR-71A and reference, which would you keep and why ?


----------



## mrarroyo

jamato8, I sent you an email to discuss the latest updates. Today I received a package from Dr. Xin to try the panasonic 22,000 uF cap, he indicates it must be used w/ a 8.2 uF (8R2) cap. This confuses me and I would like to further discuss it w/ you but out of here since we will be exchanging pics which the good Dr. may consider proprietary. Thanks.


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_jamato8, I sent you an email to discuss the latest updates. Today I received a package from Dr. Xin to try the panasonic 22,000 uF cap, he indicates it must be used w/ a 8.2 uF (8R2) cap. This confuses me and I would like to further discuss it w/ you but out of here since we will be exchanging pics which the good Dr. may consider proprietary. Thanks._

 

Xin just send me a new cap. Panasonic 22k uf i believe. My Nichicon 22k uf that came 2-3 weeks ago with the new Reference is leaking some yellowish liquid. emm. I have transfer my old 12k uf panasonic cap with BG as bypass in super E config and I love the sound


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Super Mini has been updated to be as good as the Reference but of course it is smaller. I have always liked the Super Mini for its size and sound and now after an update . . well. . . ._

 

which Reference version are you comparing with? I'm thinking of adding Mini to my collection too.


----------



## jamato8

The newest.


----------



## mackay maus

"Funny the path events take as they push their own way forward around and through our intentions and designs."

 So true-maybe amps are a metaphor for life! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 M


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The newest._

 

that is interesting. for the newest Reference, have you tried with 12k uf cap and bypass it with BG?


----------



## jamato8

No, I just got it and this is how Xin intends for it to sound so I will stick with that, for now. The Panasonic 22,000uf is new to me and will take some time to form: it has very good specs.


----------



## mrarroyo

jamato8 I have sent you a PM.


----------



## jamato8

Ok, but any time a page is opened the msg indicators pops up before the page, like this one, does, so it is hard to miss. Anyway, you have a PM in response to your PM. When you get it let me know here. lol


----------



## mrarroyo

???


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_18 months and 17 days later I get the storied notice saying:

 "A package was shipped to you on 11/21/2008 via U.S. Postal Service Priority
 Mail, Flat Rate Env to the following address:"

 My Tomahawk is now very nervous
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

My friend, it looks like you and I are tied for the record of the longest wait (that I have seen referenced) for a Xin. Today I got a e-mail confirming shipment of a Super Micro IV at 18 months and 17 days after original placement of the order. Whew, what a wait.

 I originally paid vis PayPal but requested and received a refund after about nine wait. But I remained in the que and figured that if the amp ever showed up great, and if not great.

 Since that time I have fallen in love with the sound of the Pico, from listening at meets and then a friend's Pico purchase based upon my recommendation. But I have also come to learn that based upon the size of the Pico or Tomahawk, the external portable amps are still too large and cumbersome for me. I believe the Micro is even smaller, so I hope it will work for me better. And I'll get to compare the SQ of the Xin and my friend's Pico which will be fun. But if the amp set up is still too cumbersome for me, I'll sell the Xin and just go sans amp. Yes after that wait, I might sell the Xin--too funny.

 PS. For those who have bailed out recently on their orders, as Xin seems to be communicating and shipping, maybe you could e-mail him and get reinstated on the que. I imagine Xin has a back-log, but I should think that those who have waited 15 months and then canceled wouldn't have too long of a wait, although there are obviously no guarantees.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_No, I just got it and this is how Xin intends for it to sound so I will stick with that, for now. The Panasonic 22,000uf is new to me and will take some time to form: it has very good specs._

 

If you can actually wait to tweak with your stock Reference until the 22,000uf cap has formed, then you, more than all of those who have waited 15-18 months to receive a Reference, are named the "Recipient of the sbulack Greatest Patience Award in the Portable Reference Amps Built in Oregon Category". Really, you're not going to add or change the bypass cap, or a resistor value, nothing? until that huge honkin' 22,000 uf cap forms? If you can do that, then the Committee concurs, you've got this Award.


----------



## jamato8

It sounds so good I don't want to touch it. Very unusual for me. 8^)


----------



## theory_87

I'll wait till the panasonic 22k uf cap here to decide. Mean while, i love 12k uf cap from my beta ref on it.


----------



## zackhugh

In case anyone's interested, my Reference was shipped today, 11/25.

 Order# 38809088
 Date: May 17, 2007


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zackhugh* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In case anyone's interested, my Reference was shipped today, 11/25. Order# 38809088 Date: May 17, 2007_

 

I'm very interested, and actively following dates ordered, order #'s and ship dates. Your provision of this valued data is very much appreciated. Thank you.


----------



## zackhugh

Glad to help out. I've been lurking here since April of last year. I finally joined up to post that bit of info.


----------



## tbmusic

I received my Reference yesterday. I ordered on 5/8/07. Order number 38766603.


----------



## mrarroyo

One of my references has a 22,000 uF Nichicon Cap w/ 843 hours of burn in as of today. At about 800 hours of burn in I added a 1,000 uF Cap unto the board as per Dr. Xin's recomendation.

 The 2nd Reference has a 12,000 uF Cap and it has about 170 hours of burn in. I will attempt to compare them this coming Sunday.

 I wish there was a quicker way to burn in these large caps.


----------



## PhaedrusX

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_One of my references has a 22,000 uF Nichicon Cap w/ 843 hours of burn in as of today. At about 800 hours of burn in I added a 1,000 uF Cap unto the board as per Dr. Xin's recomendation.

 The 2nd Reference has a 12,000 uF Cap and it has about 170 hours of burn in. I will attempt to compare them this coming Sunday.

 I wish there was a quicker way to burn in these large caps._

 

so which is Xin's final cap configuration, or is this _still_ undecided?

 Panasonic FMs, Nichicon Muse, 12000uF, 22000uF, bypassed, no bypass cap?


----------



## jamato8

He stated to me he is going with the Panasonic 22,000uf cap. It has a bypass, in fact two of them, that he has been using for a while. All is subject to change though. 8^)


----------



## traquemort

I bought a supermini IV

 Order 38814342
 5/18/07
 I hope that can help.

 ready to ship friday the 21st and gave my response on saturday, my question is how long does it usually take to ship (DC area)?


----------



## tk3

Any detailed sound impressions or comparisons with other popular portable amps on the Reference?

 With these new developments I'm kind of tempted to try to reinstate my order.


----------



## BushGuy

The best thing for you to do is re-read the Skylab - 37 Amp. -(more now) comparison thread. The unfortunate part is the Reference he got to use was one of the early ones.......many improving changes occurred in the Reference since that time. Going back to those early amps - if you read what he said back then - the Predator and Pico were equal to the Reference in terms of both treble, and bass. The soundstage of the Reference was outshowing the others in its' expanse and depth. My Reference is a Beta and will be returned next week for the many updates........so, that's all I can offer.


----------



## tk3

Thanks for the input.
 It seems Xin has changed something with the Reference, I'm interested to see if people who have received the latest version can offer any input on how it sounds.

 With Xin shipping relatively many orders lately, I'm sure someone will step up sooner or later.


----------



## mrarroyo

Yes, Xin is going to settle w/ the Panasonic 22,000 uF cap w/ a bypass. However while settling on this configuration he sent various users different combinations to try.

 The ones I have are identical except for the 12,000 vs 22,000. Plus I have the parts to go from the Nichicon to the Panasonic. However I will do so after I have 1,200 hours of burn in on the unit. Now it has about 870 hours.


----------



## jamato8

I have the latest version and the sound is extremely good. It is very open and transparent with a odd ability to get the last bit of hall detail. The bass is well executed. The newest version IS a noticeable improvement, more so than I would have thought possible.


----------



## PhaedrusX

hmm...if that big cap is really causing such noticeable differences, maybe Xin should consider socketing that position and letting owners roll caps there. not the most elegant solution, but it might be interesting.


----------



## ldj325

I received my SuperMicro IV today (original order date 5/7/2007). It was received in a plain while box, inside what appeared to be a purple bar napkin was a plastic bag with an incredibly tiny amp inside. Very mad scientistish--I love it.

 Inside the amp in the place where the battery goes was a plastic nylon ring. Of course no instructions. Is the plastic ring supposed to hold the case lid on or is it some kind of spacer for separating battery from the internals?

 The size is maybe 1/2 or less the size of the Pico [in side by side comparison it looks to be 1/3 the size of the Pico]. My first impressions out of the box are that it does not have the bass depth or soundstage of the Pico (which is the best I've heard so far, including an older generation Macro) or the finesse and control. (Of course I am going from audio memory right now. [pretty accurate one I got use of a Pico]) But it is still a very good sound, if a little on the bright side [this has changed for the better at 40 hrs of burn in]. I don't know the impact with burn in with these either. I've found the size of the Pico or Tomahawk to be an impediment for me such that I'd decided to forgo a portable amp. The size of the SuperMicro seems much better and just may work for me for a portable rig. As others have stated, the Micro has an incredibly big sound for such a small amp.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Just wait till the Micro burns in some with use. It is supposed to open up a bit with time.


----------



## jamato8

It needs some time.


----------



## ldj325

Thanks guys. I've got it burning in now after actively listening for several hours. I have sensed that the slightly bright, slightly harsh edge on the high end might be something that could change with burn in [on 11/29 after letting the Xin run for about 40 hrs the bright/harsh is no longer noticeable]. But even as is, it is quite good SQ and looks like a keeper for me due to the size. 

 But does anyone know what the little vinyl band is for? My amp is the light blue and this band is also blue.


----------



## theory_87

How about posting a picture of your SuperMicroIV? My SuperMicroIV does not have any band.


----------



## Quaddy

is xin now doing accessories?


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...But does anyone know what the little vinyl band is for? My amp is the light blue and this band is also blue._

 

Could it be to be placed around the AAA battery? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I remember some users complained of the battery moving a bit.


----------



## el_monkey

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Inside the amp in the place where the battery goes was a plastic nylon ring. Of course no instructions. Is the plastic ring supposed to hold the case lid on or is it some kind of spacer for separating battery from the internals?_

 

I believe that the band is used to hold the lid on as you surmised. At least, that is what the SuperMicro that I used to have had. It basically is a small rubber band.


----------



## Quaddy

ahh yes, a supermicro i borrowed from a uk head-fier some months back had a small translucent rubber band, i thought he had put that on himself, it came to me with that round it all, to keep the battery cover on. his amp was clear and so was the band, so looks like xin is colour matching, wouldnt it be a downer, if these bands were the cause of all the delay, outsourcing and getting them custom made, but have had a massive sourcing issue - haha, i jest


----------



## lisnalee

I canceled my reference a few months back but just got official word today from xin that it has been acknowledged.

 He even cheekily offered to keep my spot in the queue if i changed my mind


----------



## kaushama

I have a reference sent by Dr Xin 10 months back with 22000UF cap. I am sending it back for upgrades after I receive my new Supermini. Acording to Dr Xin the SQ of SuperMacro and Supermini is much improved now. But they don't support a wide variety of OPAMPs as before without modifications.


----------



## nauxolo

Sorry for being a newcomer, but what is the significance of Xin amps that deem worthiness of wait times longer than half a year?


----------



## Kabeer

Forgot to post here. I got my Reference about two weeks ago.

 Its v.v.v.good sounding. Problem is, I dont know whether to keep it or not now....I Ordered about 19/20 months ago, and my needs have changed now.
 I use some of the most demanding cans around now, and the Xin actually runs them decently, but the gain is only just enough on the most demanding one.

 Even the desktop amp I have have to run at about 8-9 volume to get a loud sound out of it on that particular can..
 Arghh the choices lol, I think the 19 month wait is making me want to keep it more than the fact I need it haha.

 As a side note, I got both 1.8th and 1/4 inch output jacks on mine, and its a very conveneint feature for full size headphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_He even cheekily offered to keep my spot in the queue if i changed my mind 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That's not cheeky. You may bhave thought, as I did, that Xin amps were history, and now he's sprung back into life you may want to change your mind.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Could it be to be placed around the AAA battery? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I remember some users complained of the battery moving a bit. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The band seems too large for the battery. It does have an elastic quality, although it does not seem as resilient or the same consistency as a rubber band. So I am thinking it would get stretched out with repeated opening/closing the case to change the battery. But I can see no other usefulness so if the cover ever gets loose I'll try the band around the case. Just another Xin mystery I suppose. I'll include it with the purple bar napkin as part of my Xin memorabilia.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nauxolo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry for being a newcomer, but what is the significance of Xin amps that deem worthiness of wait times longer than half a year?_

 

In the past before Xin's mysterious absence of somewhere between 12-16 months (which is what led to the insane waits of 12-18 months), Xin had gained a reputation as making portable amps of some of the very best, if not the best sound quality. Xin would also take older versions of amps and upgrade them to the latest components, often free of charge. So a lot of good will was built from that practice, especially when the overall sound quality of the amps was factored in. Add to that the ability to custom configure of some of the amps, and a positive perception of build quality, and Xin had a waiting list for new amps. People got used to waiting for 2-3 months for the amps, but felt they were well worth the wait. Then the wait times started to get longer, and then next to no word from Xin for over a year or so, and that 2-3 months became 12-18 months.

 I certainly had no intention of waiting over 18 months for an amp. But in that my credit card was not charged, I figured I wasn't out anything to wait. It sort of became a game for me. I probably would have bought something else like the Pico except that there is nothing I know of as small as the Super Micro IV that still has good sound quality.

 Maybe some of the repeat owners of Xin amps could add to this if I missed anything of importance.


----------



## Quaddy

its all about the xin house sound, i for one love it and find nothing else that i like so much, it is a dicotomy, for its warm and detailed at the same time and seems to scale well with whatever the portable source feeding it

 the supermicro iv is my favorite xin creation thus far, and i think my favorite portable amp i have ever owned, the size just adds the x-factor to it even more.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In the past before Xin's mysterious absence of somewhere between 12-16 months (which is what led to the insane waits of 12-18 months), Xin had gained a reputation as making portable amps of some of the very best, if not the best sound quality. Xin would also take older versions of amps and upgrade them to the latest components, often free of charge. So a lot of good will was built from that practice, especially when the overall sound quality of the amps was factored in. Add to that the ability to custom configure of some of the amps, and a positive perception of build quality, and Xin had a waiting list for new amps. People got used to waiting for 2-3 months for the amps, but felt they were well worth the wait. Then the wait times started to get longer, and then next to no word from Xin for over a year or so, and that 2-3 months became 12-18 months.

 I certainly had no intention of waiting over 18 months for an amp. But in that my credit card was not charged, I figured I wasn't out anything to wait. It sort of became a game for me. I probably would have bought something else like the Pico except that there is nothing I know of as small as the Super Micro IV that still has good sound quality.

 Maybe some of the repeat owners of Xin amps could add to this if I missed anything of importance._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_its all about the xin house sound, i for one love it and find nothing else that i like so much, it is a dicotomy, for its warm and detailed at the same time and seems to scale well with whatever the portable source feeding it

 the supermicro iv is my favorite xin creation thus far, and i think my favorite portable amp i have ever owned, the size just adds the x-factor to it even more._

 

You both put into words my thoughts. A combination of the excellent sound, ability to tweak the sound via op-amp rolling (some of the amps), and being able to get upgrades for free.


----------



## theory_87

The new macro look good. my wallet might be coughing blood again...


----------



## ldj325

After listening to the SuperMicro IV right out of the box (excuse me I mean right out of the purple bar napkin 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) I left it running with the iPod for about the past 35-40 hours. I came back tonight and gave it a listen. Very nice changes have occurred as all the brightness and harshness is gone.

 So for you experienced Xin guys, how long for full burn in?

 I got my friends Pico tonight so I decided to put my 35-40 hr Xin up against a fully burned in Pico. I threw Ultrasone Edition 9s, for low impedance phones, and the Sennheiser 600 for high impedance phones at the Xin (and Pico) as well as my Shure SE530s. The Xin handled all headphones with authority.

 In terms of absolute sound quality I still prefer the Pico, but not by much. The Pico soundstage width and depth is greater. And for me there is a magical sweetness to the Pico that isn't quite there with the Xin. Maybe there will be further changes with more burn in with the Xin. The Pico is the best portable I've heard to date (I've not heard the Xin Reference) and the Xin being close in SQ is wonderful.

 Comparing the size of the Pico and the SuperMicro, the Xin appears to be about 1/3 the total displacement of the already small Pico. Amazing! And again for me, the size of the Xin seems to make all the difference in terms of usability. I was already happy with the Xin because of its size, but now with the improved SQ with some burn in, I am very, very happy.


----------



## zackhugh

Received my Reference on 11/28, packaged in the trademark plastic bag and purple napkin. Pretty quick to receive it factoring in the holiday the previous day. 

 FWIW, right out of the box to me the highs were a bit harsh, almost distorted, but there's something about the sound quality that makes it instantly compelling. Nicely detailed, musical sounding, even exciting to listen to if that makes any sense. Even with little burn-in I already kind of prefer it to my iBasso P2. I look forward to hearing the changes/improvements in sound as time goes by.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zackhugh* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Received my Reference on 11/28, packaged in the trademark plastic bag and purple napkin. Pretty quick to receive it factoring in the holiday the previous day. 

 FWIW, right out of the box to me the highs were a bit harsh, almost distorted, but there's something about the sound quality that makes it instantly compelling. Nicely detailed, musical sounding, even exciting to listen to if that makes any sense. Even with little burn-in I already kind of prefer it to my iBasso P2. I look forward to hearing the changes/improvements in sound as time goes by._

 

Gotta love those napkins. ....Oh yeah, the amps are pretty good too.


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...I am very, very happy._

 

If you are happy, then we are happy. At least, vicariously.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you are happy, then we are happy. At least, vicariously._

 

Now if I could only get the Pico sound in the SuperMicro form factor, I'd be insanely happy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Ah, it never ends does it? On second thought, I'll stick with very, very happy and be grateful for that.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Now if I could only get the Pico sound in the SuperMicro form factor, I'd be insanely happy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ....._

 

Be on the lookout for my upcoming MOT Sponsored Thread, "Introducing The sbulack SuperMico" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Just kidding!


----------



## jamato8

The Micro takes time, like all of them, to smooth out. You haven't totally heard the Micro yet. It will also open up more. I also prefer the eneloop battery for its lower internal resistance and better current delivery. Xin also recommends the eneloop.


----------



## kaushama

I am getting another Supermini. Dr Xin says the SQ of Macro and Mini is much improved. 
 Supermini has always won my heart for its form factor and features with SQ. The SQ was a tad below that of reference before. I wonder new improvements would make it to be in the same league as reference.


----------



## jamato8

From what I understand it should be in the same arena.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Micro takes time, like all of them, to smooth out. You haven't totally heard the Micro yet. It will also open up more. I also prefer the eneloop battery for its lower internal resistance and better current delivery. Xin also recommends the eneloop._

 

Thanks for the tips. I need to go to Costco anyway, so I'll pick one of the charger kits if in stock while there. Do you know if there is anything special about the charger itself? I have a Panasonic charger already, just in case Costco only carries the batteries.

 Do you have any rough estimate of time for the majority of burn in, 200 hrs--400 hrs. etc. Its been a long time since I burned in an amp, especially a portable. I was excited to get the Xin and didn't even think of the burn in factor.


----------



## jamato8

I don't think it is too long, a couple of hundred hours. Some feel there isn't any burn-in for anything but I don't agree as there is the forming of the cap and on and on. At least 100 hours. I heard changes on the RSA Predator after 1000 hours and this was noted by others but the Micro has a small cap and shouldn't take too long but there will be some small changes.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't think it is too long, a couple of hundred hours. Some feel there isn't any burn-in for anything but I don't agree as there is the forming of the cap and on and on. At least 100 hours. I heard changes on the RSA Predator after 1000 hours and this was noted by others but the Micro has a small cap and shouldn't take too long but there will be some small changes._

 

Thanks again. Based upon my experience (I started out neutral on the issue), I feel that burn in is real at least for amps and headphones--maybe for other things as well but not enough that I've taken note. I also know that difference gear is more or less prone to burn in effects. (My Edition 9s had big changes to 150 hrs, significant changes to 250 hrs and I believe even some subtle changes post 400 hours. But I didn't notice a lot of change with a new Senn 580 or my 650s.) I have little prior experience with Xin, although I did have a long term borrow of an older version Macro that may or may not have been burned in.

 With all things audio, I like to put the philosophies aside and go with my experience. I definitely have seen nice changes with the Xin from 0 to about 40 hours. (No brain burn in there as I wasn't listening to it between the times.) It would be great if the Micro could pick up some more of the sweetness and smoothness I hear in the Pico. But everything has its unique sound signature. It is easy to appreciate the Xin for what it is, and it's always nice if there is more.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Jam,

 Can you help me compare the Reference with the Predator or P51 you have in hands? Just wonder if it will pair well with the ESW10JPN...


----------



## jamato8

Even in comparing them, since I don't have those headphones, I am not sure it would help. What is the general sound of the ESW10JPN?


----------



## Lil' Knight

So just let me know the sound signature of them. Does the Reference have impactful bass?


----------



## jamato8

The P-51 has a good solid bass, the Predator slightly less, and the Reference has a very solid bass but not quite as noticeable as the 51. The SR-71A does not quite have as much impact as the 51. The 51 isn't really emphasized in the bass region but does have a little more rise in this area.


----------



## wuwhere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The P-51 has a good solid bass, the Predator slightly less, and the Reference has a very solid bass but not quite as noticeable as the 51. The SR-71A does not quite have as much impact as the 51. The 51 isn't really emphasized in the bass region but does have a little more rise in this area._

 

Better bass than either the Predator and SR-71A? Better mids than either as well? So when is the last day for the Christmas discount?


----------



## jamato8

I didn't say better, I said different. It is up to your ear and what you want to determine what is better.


----------



## wuwhere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I didn't say better, I said different. It is up to your ear and what you want to determine what is better._

 

Absolutely. 'Better' is a relative and subjective term. And besides ones' ears, it also depends on ones' source, ones' headphones, ones' musical preference.


----------



## Lil' Knight

Thanks for the info, Jam 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Just sent my payment for the P51. I really can't stand the wait like this.


----------



## ldj325

I just gave the SuperMicro a fresh listen to see how the burn in is doing after another 30 hours (at about 70 right now). All vestiges of harshness or edge are gone, and the soundstage and esp. the highs have opened up more. I can't really say that the sound is sweet, like I experience the Pico midrange to be (which might be experienced by some as a coloration). But the Xin is becoming more clear and neutral in a very good way--like clear water, and not at all sterile. It is a different house sound with its own strengths. And it is still so damn small!!! I am starting to get ecstatic about this little Xin.


----------



## kaushama

What is the PCB revision number on the newest Reference??


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just gave the SuperMicro a fresh listen to see how the burn in is doing after another 30 hours (at about 70 right now). All vestiges of harshness or edge are gone, and the soundstage and esp. the highs have opened up more. I can't really say that the sound is sweet, like I experience the Pico midrange to be (which might be experienced by some as a coloration). But the Xin is becoming more clear and neutral in a very good way--like clear water, and not at all sterile. It is a different house sound with its own strengths. And it is still so damn small!!! I am starting to get ecstatic about this little Xin._

 

Yep, the Micro has a deserved reputation.


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What is the PCB revision number on the newest Reference??_

 

RE1F for my late Oct set.


----------



## kaushama

I received my Supermini today. It has much improved SQ. Better than my 10 month old Reference.

My impressions!


----------



## kaushama

That PCB version was known to exist in January 2008.

 Pictures are found Here 

 Is this the latest version??

 Anyone else having different PCB version??


----------



## nc8000

Perhaps the latest tweaks don't require a new pcb but just different components.


----------



## jamato8

It doesn't require a new board. There are some resistor changes from what I understand.


----------



## kaushama

And that famous bypass capacitor?! (Blackgate??)


----------



## jamato8

I am using the new Reference as sent. It would muddy the water if I modified, but oh so hard not to. 8^)

 I sent in a Mini and hope to get it back with the latest modifications but no word yet. I love the form factor of the Mini.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am using the new Reference as sent. It would muddy the water if I modified, but oh so hard not to. 8^)

 I sent in a Mini and hope to get it back with the latest modifications but no word yet. I love the form factor of the Mini._

 


 jam, out of interest how long did you wait for your reference(s)?


----------



## jamato8

I was there in the beginning, when Xin was working on it. I asked Xin to make up a Reference with the same topology as the Micro. It turned out to be the best sounding and I gave him feedback about two weeks after taking it home and listening to it. I lived in Eugene, OR, just 30 miles from where Xin lives and would go up and visit. I had the first Reference and it goes from there. The latest is one I sent back that Xin changed to the latest version. It has the 1/4 and 1/8 jacks. I do notice a difference when using the 1/4 and it is nice to use a little portable with the 1/4. It is the only portable of its size with this size of jack.


----------



## theory_87

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That PCB version was known to exist in January 2008.

 Pictures are found Here 

 Is this the latest version??

 Anyone else having different PCB version??_

 

I understand it the resistor or smd different. My old reference is RE1C


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That PCB version was known to exist in January 2008.

 Pictures are found Here 

 Is this the latest version??

 Anyone else having different PCB version??_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Perhaps the latest tweaks don't require a new pcb but just different components._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It doesn't require a new board. There are some resistor changes from what I understand._

 

Correct, the board revision is the same as months ago. However there have been changes on the internal components, mostly following feedback on limited extension (treble) and soundstage w/ limited width. Then the issue of 12,000 vs. 22,000 uF caps, finally Nichicon vs. Panasonic.

 So now Dr. Xin is working on the mini jacks he puts on the Supermacro IV and LE. He is trying to improve on the quality by using a different brand.


----------



## zackhugh

I've been listening to music every night in between letting my Reference burn in just so that I can enjoy it as it develops. 

 It's been 100+ hours or so and while the soundstage and detail were nice out of the box, they have subtly improved. The initial high-end harshness was gone after the first day or so. Occasionally it seems like the bass disappears but I'm not sure if this is my imagination.

 It has been a bit of a journey, as others have described it. Songs that I must have listened to hundreds of times sounded totally different and new. Lots of detail and nuance I just never noticed before. I thought the iBasso P2 (my previous amp) was pretty good, but it never sounded like this! The Xin Reference is worth it just to be able to rediscover all the music I *thought* I knew.


----------



## EFN

I have decided to keep my SuperMini-IV. Now with around 300 hours instead of selling it off upon receipt. It's already showing signs of opening up. The first 200 hours was kinda dissapointing because I was quite used to the venerable and legendary SuperMicro-IV (04/11) sound. But just like any other Xin amps, burn in does have huge impact on the performance.

 I have plugged my SuperMini-IV to a combination of DIYModded iPod 5.5G & iPod Mini (DIYModded) with VH-Audio V-Caps 6.8uF. Simply put, upon exclipsing that 300 hours the SuperMini started to show its true prowess. I am sure it will continue to develop and I look forward to do a full review after 800 hours or so. At that time probably I will be mating the SuperMini with the iRiver H140 + DAC combo + ER-4P (which is the portable rig I am building now)


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zackhugh* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ ... Occasionally it seems like the bass disappears but I'm not sure if this is my imagination. ..._

 

As caps form in an amp, it's been posted before by a number of us that the bass waxes and wanes, until the caps fully form and the the amp settles into its stable sound. My experience has been that the spectral balance that is heard for the first 15-30 minutes or so is a good indicator of where it will end up. Full disclosure time: I don't have a Reference, yet. My observations above have come from a number of other amps with significant cap size. These observations have been made by others as well based on their experience with the Reference.


----------



## zackhugh

Ah, OK, thanks for the explanation. So it still might be my imagination but not necessarily so. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I guess that big cap does result in some changes. It also seems like sometimes the sound becomes a little muddy before clearing up again. One thing about this amp is that I worry about my hearing. It sounds better the louder it is, at least to a point, to pick up all the myriad details I hadn't previously been able to hear with other amps.

 It really is kind of fun to check every day to see how the sound is developing. I haven't listened to music this much in a very long time. So far I've been primarily using an IEM for my listening, but I hate to waste that perfectly good 1/4" output. Can anyone report particularly notable synergies between the Reference and full-size headphones?


----------



## jamato8

I have found it works great with the Ultrasone 750, Ed. 9 and the HD650. It drives them with plenty of volume and clean bass. I like very much being able to use the 1/4 socket on a little portable.


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## Quaddy

16 month anniversary to the day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 anyone know what the longest someone has waited, wasnt it 19 months or thereabouts?


----------



## DennyL

...and for the last ten days he's been working on the same order number.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...and for the last ten days he's been working on the same order number. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Correct on not updating the site. However amps and parts for amps have been shipped. He has also responded to emails, so he is still up and running. Although I wish he would update the order being worked on so everyone would see it.


----------



## ldj325

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_16 month anniversary to the day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 anyone know what the longest someone has waited, wasnt it 19 months or thereabouts?_

 

The longest wait times I've seen listed were for my SuperMicro IV as well as another guys amp (I don't know which model). We were "tied" at 18 months 17 days. If anyone has waited longer I haven't seen it posted here. My impression were that orders for the newer Reference amps were being delivered sooner than orders for the "older" models like the SuperMicro/SuperMini. 

 I can certainly recommend the sound quality of the SuperMicro (although my favorite portable, the Pico, nudges it by just a bit in terms of absolute SQ). If someone needs an amp anytime soon, Xin is not the amp maker for you. But if one can order with a credit card and then forget it and be happy that it eventually arrives then that can work.


----------



## krmathis

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_16 month anniversary to the day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 anyone know what the longest someone has waited, wasnt it 19 months or thereabouts?_

 

Wow! So its not just Justin (HeadAmp) who let customers wait up to 1 1/2 years for their amplifier... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Hope its your turn soon!


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ldj325* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The longest wait times I've seen listed were for my SuperMicro IV as well as another guys amp (I don't know which model). We were "tied" at 18 months 17 days. If anyone has waited longer I haven't seen it posted here..._

 

That was me. I has also ordered a Supermicro.

 I listened to it for about 15 minutes the day it arrived. Darned thing sounded like crap right put of the box. So much so I thought it might be defective. So I burned it in for 100 hours (+-) without listening to it again until after the burn-in. It was nothing short of amazing. 

 To my untrained and admittedly older ears it's a much more musical sounding amp than my Tomahawk.

 Regards,
 Doug


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sfflyfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That was me. I has also ordered a Supermicro.

 I listened to it for about 15 minutes the day it arrived. Darned thing sounded like crap right put of the box. So much so I thought it might be defective. So I burned it in for 100 hours (+-) without listening to it again until after the burn-in. It was nothing short of amazing. 

 To my untrained and admittedly older ears it's a much more musical sounding amp than my Tomahawk.

 Regards,
 Doug_

 


 If memory serves me correctly, Xin amps will "break away" once the 800hours mark has eclipsed. That was my experience with the 04/11 SuperMicro-IV. Well over 1000 hours, the SMIV has no problem outclassing even a dekstop amp (Stock Heed CanAmp). Anywhere below 800hours, the SMIV can be very erratic.

 I am experiencing the same now with the latest SuperMini-IV, still around 400 hours and I am getting odd changes in the sound. Sometimes is sound so awful I just want to throw it away, the next it is all pristine and very musical. Let's see how it behaves after 800 hours.


----------



## sfflyfish

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_... Anywhere below 800hours, the SMIV can be very erratic._

 

That may explain why sometimes my SM still sounds a bit 'odd' to me? The 'good news' is I've only got 650 hours or so to go....


----------



## Quaddy

aww heck, nows there 5 flavour of reference to pick from, i am intrigued about the 'home' version, handy to have wall wart capabilities, but it says coming soon, so am loathed to swap to that incase it further delays my order.

 what to do what to do


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_aww heck, nows there 5 flavour of reference to pick from, i am intrigued about the 'home' version, handy to have wall wart capabilities, but it says coming soon, so am loathed to swap to that incase it further delays my order.

 what to do what to do
















_

 

I could cope with waiting and maybe never expecting ever so see my Reference, I had given Xin up for dead. Now it's waiting AND deciding between five versions!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I think I do trust Xin to design a good amp, if not actually to deliver, and all those who said that during this long wait the competition had overtaken Xin in SQ may have to think again when people start hearing these new References. I'm strongly tempted to choose the home version, with the extra backplate, then I'll have three portable amps, two home amps and one home|portable amp, which should keep me going until the next FOTM comes along.


----------



## BushGuy

I've had a Reference for quite some time, and a friend is just burning his in. Has the design been overtaken - no. Both of us also have gotten our P51 Mustang and burning it in. I *know* I will be keeping both for their very different performance qualities (also keeping my Xin Supermini). You have the "tubey-ness" of the Reference, and the absolute transparency of the P51 - two very different traits that favor very different 'phones. A couple of easy examples - I was going to sell my v.3 Darths (sitting on the bottom rung of my Darth "pile") and now they are keepers - never as good as they are now with the P51, OTOH the bright Klipsch Images (and my 32ohm Darths) never sound as good without the Xin Reference. Been waiting since June for my on-order Pico amp/dac - we'll see how that fits in. Clearly I have a plan for it - we'll see what happens. I'm thinking primarly use with iMod/Triple-Fi, and additional use with an older computer where I'll pull the 0404 card out.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I've had a Reference for quite some time, and a friend is just burning his in. Has the design been overtaken - no. Both of us also have gotten our P51 Mustang and burning it in. I *know* I will be keeping both for their very different performance qualities (also keeping my Xin Supermini). You have the "tubey-ness" of the Reference, and the absolute transparency of the P51 - two very different traits that favor very different 'phones. A couple of easy examples - I was going to sell my v.3 Darths (sitting on the bottom rung of my Darth "pile") and now they are keepers - never as good as they are now with the P51, OTOH the bright Klipsch Images (and my 32ohm Darths) never sound as good without the Xin Reference. Been waiting since June for my on-order Pico amp/dac - we'll see how that fits in. Clearly I have a plan for it - we'll see what happens. I'm thinking primarly use with iMod/Triple-Fi, and additional use with an older computer where I'll pull the 0404 card out._

 

Spoken like a true Audiophile, an amp will only the best only if they are matched with the right cans, and you are already doing it by heart. IMHO, if I were to be a Senn or Shure user, I will not rate Xin amps as the best - because the darker signature of those two cans will not fare very well with Xin's tubey output. On the other hand, with a bright sounding cans like ER-4S, DT990 etc, they really shine. It's all about synergy.


----------



## jamato8

It appears there are some dramatic amps coming around from Xin. My Mini with the latest opamps and changes is coming back and I should have it on Sat or Mon. I have the latest Reference and it is very good. The home amp version should be very interesting. I find it very enjoyable to be able to use a 1/4 socket with a small portable. Though it has taken some time to get back into the market, and I pray the shipping continues and does appear to be doing so, I think Xin is going to be delivering some exceptional amps.


----------



## flargosa

I hope the latest versions of the Reference amps does not put Dr. Xin back in research mode.


----------



## jamato8

I think he is doing both at the same time. He has come to some good conclusions but you know, that will not change. I hope the research and development continues, well we know it will, but that the shipping continues, which it appears to be doing. He has found some fascinating combinations and taken another jump in sound.


----------



## mrarroyo

Man, this is tough! Just received a package w/ 5 References, versions A trhough D. Two of the 5 units are for the Version C, which according to the boards one has more SM components than the other.

 He also sent enough 12,000 uF caps to switch all 5. The problem is that to do so I would have to remove an SM cap and replace it w/ another SM cap. I have never done changes to surface mounted components.

 Will try to do some listening over the next few days and post impressions.


----------



## nickyboyo

How long had you had 5 amps on order for mrarroyo? or are you just testing these amps? and jam, when did you send your mini in for updating?


----------



## mrarroyo

nickyboyo, the 5 amps are beta units of the A to D versions that Dr. Xin has on his site. I have never owned a Supermini although I may since it is one of the most practical amps available, IMO. Although at times I feel the size of the Supermacro/Reference is a bit more practical.


----------



## nickyboyo

It just seems to be very bad form from Xin. After all the defending i have done for him in the past with referance to his silence and the lead time for peoples amps to be delivered, then he can deliver 5 amps just like that to you, and update jam's, and other peoples amps in quick time is beyond justification.
 It is nothing personal mate (enjoy the amps and please post your impressions and the differences between them), just very bad form, bordering on being unethical from Xin. 
 When you see this behaviour you can understand why so many people have been left with a bad taste in their mouths.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickyboyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How long had you had 5 amps on order for mrarroyo? or are you just testing these amps? and jam, when did you send your mini in for updating?_

 

I sent it in a couple of weeks ago. I know Xin wants some feedback on it as it has the changes made to the Reference and has some interesting opamps coming with it.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickyboyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It just seems to be very bad form from Xin. After all the defending i have done for him in the past with referance to his silence and the lead time for peoples amps to be delivered, then he can deliver 5 amps just like that to you, and update jam's, and other peoples amps in quick time is beyond justification.
 It is nothing personal mate (enjoy the amps and please post your impressions and the differences between them), just very bad form, bordering on being unethical from Xin. 
 When you see this behaviour you can understand why so many people have been left with a bad taste in their mouths._

 

Jamato & mrarroyo has been a long time BETA testers for Dr. Xin. Don't get upset if Xin send them amps. If you have been reading the fixup forum, you would know that Dr. Xin has sent 5 References to mrarroyo for tests and it was not a purchase order placed like what all of us did. In this regard I think Dr. Xin made the right choice of enlisting the service of mrarroyo and Jamato to tests the amp. Just imagine this, if Xin prefer to tests all the amps on his own, it will take forever to get past that dogfood stage - we all know how paranoid Xin is with making sure he personally hand build each amps, it is good that he trust fellow Head-Fiers to work on the rest. 

 Jamato on the other hand is the very person who suggested to Dr. Xin to make a Reference. So it would be natural he'd be the first choice to receive any new revisions released.


----------



## glc

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickyboyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It just seems to be very bad form from Xin. After all the defending i have done for him in the past with referance to his silence and the lead time for peoples amps to be delivered, then he can deliver 5 amps just like that to you, and update jam's, and other peoples amps in quick time is beyond justification.
 It is nothing personal mate (enjoy the amps and please post your impressions and the differences between them), just very bad form, bordering on being unethical from Xin. 
 When you see this behaviour you can understand why so many people have been left with a bad taste in their mouths._

 


 I've owned a Garmin GPS for several years. Garmin owners feel like guinea pigs since most of their new models come out with loads of software problems. Garmin eventually rolls out the patches, but sometimes they will roll out patches right up until the model is outdated. 

 If you compare this with what Xin is doing, I have no problem with Xin's use of a few members of this board to test his products before he rolls them out. It appears that Xin is still rolling his current amps offerings in as timely a manner as he has said he would. I see no reason why you will fault him for doing his RD at the same time to get better SQ.


----------



## nickyboyo

Firstly Garmin is a large company with a large dedicated workforce, so not really a good example to use. Secondly, i did ask how long the 5 amps had been on order before i made the above statement.
 I have no problem with Xin's quest for perfection and dedication, but you would think he would draw a line somewhere between research and finished product output.
 5 beta state amps for testing seems a little excessive to me, it could of been 2 beta amps for testing and 3 amps for customer delivery.
 Plus, the members he uses as guinea pigs, are members of the forum i have asked advice from on various occasions in the past. It's not their action's i have a problem with. I don't have that big a problem with Xin, i think his dedication and the final product are superb. I just think he could re-balance the research/delivery ratio in the customers favour a touch more.


----------



## glc

Why isn't it a good example? As big as Garmin is, a lot of owners feel that they sell GPS units a FULL price to unsuspecting owners only to have owners find the glitches. Worse even they have a tendency to tell you there are no problems when you call for support. To me it's a Q&A issue. An AMP is different in that SQ is subjective, but I respect Xin's commitment to putting out a perfect product.

 All in all, it's still a business for Xin. He has to weigh whether filling 5 orders will do more for his business in the long run than creating a better or different sound to increase market demand. Personally I think he made the right choice from a business perspective.


----------



## Quaddy

well i for one am waiting eagerley on any impressions you may be able to submit after adequate time listening

 apreciate any thoughts you have on them!







 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Man, this is tough! Just received a package w/ 5 References, versions A trhough D. Two of the 5 units are for the Version C, which according to the boards one has more SM components than the other.

 He also sent enough 12,000 uF caps to switch all 5. The problem is that to do so I would have to remove an SM cap and replace it w/ another SM cap. I have never done changes to surface mounted components.

 Will try to do some listening over the next few days and post impressions._


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nickyboyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Firstly Garmin is a large company with a large dedicated workforce, so not really a good example to use. Secondly, i did ask how long the 5 amps had been on order before i made the above statement.
 I have no problem with Xin's quest for perfection and dedication, but you would think he would draw a line somewhere between research and finished product output.
 5 beta state amps for testing seems a little excessive to me, it could of been 2 beta amps for testing and 3 amps for customer delivery.
 Plus, the members he uses as guinea pigs, are members of the forum i have asked advice from on various occasions in the past. It's not their action's i have a problem with. I don't have that big a problem with Xin, i think his dedication and the final product are superb. I just think he could re-balance the research/delivery ratio in the customers favour a touch more._

 

nickyboyo, I have been pushing to get more out of the Reference for a long time. I receive my first Beta Reference back in early may of 2007 (maybe end of April of 2007). Anyways when Dr. Xin re-appeared a few weeks ago I mentioned that IMO the top end was not as good as I thought the Reference could be. I also mentioned the soundstage was not as wide as I liked. These two were corrected and many amps were shipped.

 Following this the research continued which resulted in the swap of the Nichicon for the Panasonic cap. Concurrently there were many reports by jamato8 of the 12,000 uF cap sounding better. I can tell you that I burnt in a 22,000 uF Nichicon cap based Reference and to my ears the 12,000 uF Cap based reference w/ less than 500 hours of burn in sounded better. I then replaced the Nichicon w/ a Panasonic, sadly did not get to listen to it since I shipped it to the NYC Meet.

 As this is going on, Dr. Xin continued to ship more amps. The Supermini and Supermacro were improved due to the research on the Reference to the point they were sounding better (as per Dr. Xin) than the Reference. This lead Dr. Xin to versions A through D plus the Home version. Then he sent me the amp boards (not a full amp) to test, also additional caps to swap 12,000 uF to see if the sound improved or not. BTW, the A to D versions range not only in power to drive cans but also in the hours of operation from 200 to about 37, this is also part of the testing.

 All of this takes time, effort, and having other portable amps to compare with. It is fun but also very time consuming. I am sorry you do not have your unit and I hope you get it soon. I am confident that the changes being evaluated will result in a better sounding amp which should provide you with a more rewarding listening experience.

 Best of luck.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_This lead Dr. Xin to versions A through D plus the Home version._

 

Can you tell us more about this home version? How does it differ from the A to D models?

 Thanks


----------



## jamato8

It has a different board, which the others will have once implemented and there is a different rear plate that is used so the unit runs from a wall supply.


----------



## kaushama

I have sent my reference for upgrades. And when I asked more neutral, transparent version with better sound-stage he recommended me D version. As I use Supermini as my portable device reference would be the transportable device.


----------



## kaushama

mrarroyo Do you think that the diferences between various versions include changes in SMD components as well? If it is only OPAMPs why can't we have OPAMP rolling option?


----------



## nc8000

I very much doubt that there are opamp changes between the models, The Reference was specifically designed to optimize the use of one opamp set hence no rolling


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## jamato8

There are different opamps and sockets add length to the path, which with some opamps can add to oscillation > degradation of sound.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo Do you think that the diferences between various versions include changes in SMD components as well? If it is only OPAMPs why can't we have OPAMP rolling option?_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There are different opamps and sockets add length to the path, which with some opamps can add to oscillation > degradation of sound._

 

Correct, there are both op-amp and other surface mounted component changes.


----------



## ed lynch

Only 15 months waiting, thats me, now there is 5 versions what will i do any ideas out there, im confused, glad that some have received their amps, Will i change my order to a different version, Will original version be ok now.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Only 15 months waiting, thats me, now there is 5 versions what will i do any ideas out there, im confused, glad that some have received their amps, Will i change my order to a different version, Will original version be ok now._

 

If you get the version now and decide later to update, the new board that Xin will be using for all of the References, including the home version, will be exchanged for free per his web site. As to the sound of each board Mrarroyo has the boards but they need to run in. 

 After that I am sure everything will be settled. LOL yeah right. Well the sound is just getting better and better. 

 I have one of the latest References and it is very good and a Super Mini and the soudn from it is also very good and you can charge the batteries while in the unit as well as use a few different opamps.


----------



## flargosa

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Only 15 months waiting, thats me, now there is 5 versions what will i do any ideas out there, im confused, glad that some have received their amps, Will i change my order to a different version, Will original version be ok now._

 

Mrarroyo just posted(post#: 3468 ) that according to Dr. Xin the Supermacro and supermini is now better than the original Xin Reference(now called Reference Version A). This probably means that the original Xin Reference is inferior to the Supermacro, Supermini, and possibly Reference B - H. You might want to wait for some reviews on the newer revised Xin amps.


----------



## jamato8

The newest References going out are the new version A. The other versions need to be evaluated, which is going on now.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_There are different opamps and sockets add length to the path, which with some opamps can add to oscillation > degradation of sound._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Correct, there are both op-amp and other surface mounted component changes._

 

I stand corrected


----------



## mrarroyo

December 14, 2008: Initial Observations

 I received six Reference boards and two battery packs from Dr. Xin on Friday, December 12, 2008. The various boards were labeled: A, B, C, C1, D, and D1 and I decided to start by burning in the D and D1 boards. Although I can see that some of the surface mounted components vary from the C and C1 as well as from the D and D1 I can not comment on what the changes are without divulging the current preliminary design. I feel I would be premature in doing so and that disclosing that information is up to Dr. Xin.

 The D configuration is the one w/ the highest power output and has the lowest battery life (using four AAA batteries) of all the A through D versions. I ran both the D1 and the D continuously and found that the D does provide the 50 hours of playback, however the D1 was a bit short at about 43 hours. These runtimes are using alkaline batteries.

 So today (12/14/2008) after roughly 50 hours of burn in I decided to run a comparison. To that effect I used the following gear:

 -Spyro Gyra’s Fast Forward CD
 -Philips DVP5982
 -GQ-Mini Cu (rca to mini cable)
 -Ultrasone PROline 2500
 -MiniBox-E+
 -SR71







 This is not intended to be a full review but rather an initial impression of the various Reference variations. This because of the limited time to do the burn in, which based on the cap size, should be IMO over 800 hours of burn in. Over the next week I will do the same for the A, B, C, and C1 boards. However I hope the following helps you in your decision.

 SR71: This has been the amp that in the past I have used as a reference point. Since I first listened to it I had a special affinity for its sound signature. Of the amps used today it is the warmest one, and the one with the most laidback presentation. It would be a perfect amp for an early Sunday when you just want to relax and enjoy reading the Sunday newspaper. It obviously has the RSA house sound signature.

 MiniBox-E+: I have raved about this amp since I first listened to its firs incarnation the MiniBox-E. The E+ is a bit punchier than its predecessor and IMO a bit livelier and punchier than the SR71. For today’s comparison I used the stock AD8610, they (2) sound beautiful out of this amp. Due to my hectic life and fast paced personality I prefer the sound out of the MiniBox-E+ for going about. Its smaller size can be a factor for those who wish to carry it w/ their source in a pocket. On the other hand it uses an internal rechargeable battery, which would necessitate soldering in its replacement versus easily obtainable 9V batteries as in the SR71.

 D and D1: I will put this two together although I heard differences and preferred the D1 over the D. These are punchy amps, with amazing depth and liveliness. The kind of amp that demands your attention, the reward is an amazing presentation that draws you in. The soundstage is both wide and deep, it feels like there are layers in the music both front to back as well as left to right. My wife also partook of the listening experience and her favorite was the MiniBox-E+. She felt it had the most extended and clear highs followed by the D. How much will the treble extension improve by burn in remains to be determined. Furthermore I have the parts to replace the 22,000 uF Panasonic Cap w/ a 12,000 uF Panasonic Cap. Based on my earlier Reference experience the 12,000 uF cap can be faster and more extended.

 As you can see much testing and comparisons are pending. I look forward to the return of my early November versions (2) of the Reference. These two were sent to the NYC Head Fi meet of 12/13/08 so I should get them back by next weekend.


----------



## Quaddy

thanks mrarroyo, for that initial sneek p/review, one question if i may, you make 'reference' to a D*1* version, i dont see this listed, but i assume they are yet another tweaked, sub-revision to the new models?

 it has a shorter battery life, so is running more demanding in some respect.

 hmmm...

 i think i will ask xin to swap to D revision, possibly D*1 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - *as i dont need gargantuan battery life, but would like to not be limited to range of phones it can drive in future

 and can always think about converting to home edition once received.


----------



## kaushama

I asked for the D version as well depending on good Dr. Xin's recommendations.


----------



## sbulack

I've written an email to Dr. Xin as well, requesting a Version D Reference, relying on his advice to "go straight to D" if battery life is not an issue. I'm glad, for the sake of Dr. Xin's advice, that this Version had not been designated as L.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have one of the latest References and it is very good_

 

Which of the 4 versions (as the Home isn't available yet from what I understand) do you have?


----------



## kaushama

mrarroyo Any updates?


----------



## nc8000

Production and order fullfillment wise there don't seem to have been anything happening the last 3½ weeks according to the "Working on order number" thread on Xin's site.


----------



## immtbiker

It confuses me, why he is sending out future model considerations, when he has not fulfilled all of his _existing_ orders.

 Taking a step back, I would like to put on record that Mr. Arroyo was nice enough to send me 2 of Xin's latest incarnations for the NYC Fall meet, and even though Xin's business practices need a bit of a tweak, the 2 amps sound damn good. 
 But what good is that if he has your money and you have no amp to listen to.

 Thanks, Miguel. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I was comparing them to the P-51 Mustang last night, and I can say that I could easily live with both and be happy.


----------



## ed lynch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you get the version now and decide later to update, the new board that Xin will be using for all of the References, including the home version, will be exchanged for free per his web site. As to the sound of each board Mrarroyo has the boards but they need to run in. 

 After that I am sure everything will be settled. LOL yeah right. Well the sound is just getting better and better. 

 I have one of the latest References and it is very good and a Super Mini and the soudn from it is also very good and you can charge the batteries while in the unit as well as use a few different opamps._

 

Thanks jamato8 for helping to clear that up for me, ed.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo Any updates?_

 

I was able to spend sometime on 12/17/08 comparing the C with the C1 board. My wife preferred the sound of the C while I preferred the C1. This is similar to what we felt w/ the D and D1 boards.

 Personally I felt the C1 had a bit more impact and the upper mids received a minor boost which made the cymbal, hi hat, and snare drum cut through better. I also believe it has a bit more clarity. Interesting enough my wife felt the clarity was better on the C board. This shows how we all hear differently. 


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...

 I was comparing them to the P-51 Mustang last night, and I can say that I could easily live with both and be happy._

 


 Aaron, to me the newer versions offer even more opportunities for sound variations. I am really liking the C1 and D1, unfortunetly they do not have many hours of burn in (50 to 100 depending on the model). But IMO they sound better than the 22,000 uF cap Reference you have. The 12,000 uF remains to be re-tested, it is a very sweet sounding unit.

 The boards I currently have use the 22,000 uF Panasonic Cap and I have the 12,000 uF caps to swap and try them. However I really am swamped.


----------



## mrarroyo

Well, I made sometime after all to compare the B and A boards. Interestingly enough both my wife and I agreed (finally). We both preferred the sound of the B board over the A board (w/ about 120 hours of burn in). The soundstage is wider, it is clearer, and it extends higher. They seem to use about the same amount of power, both have been running about 120 hours on the same set of 4 AAA batteries.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It confuses me, why he is sending out future model considerations, when he has not fulfilled all of his existing orders.

 Taking a step back, I would like to put on record that Mr. Arroyo was nice enough to send me 2 of Xin's latest incarnations for the NYC Fall meet, and even though Xin's business practices need a bit of a tweak, the 2 amps sound damn good. 
 But what good is that if he has your money and you have no amp to listen to.

 Thanks, Miguel. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I was comparing them to the P-51 Mustang last night, and I can say that I could easily live with both and be happy._

 

Yes I know there are design changes and no one does this more than Xin but he has found a couple of things that advance the sound even more. I really think some of these are going to approach that of home amps.


----------



## EFN

Already placed an order for Reference Type D. See how it goes...


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I made sometime after all to compare the B and A boards. Interestingly enough both my wife and I agreed (finally)._

 

I think it's really great that you and your wife can spend quality time together, doing something that you love.

 My wife and daughter both take a vested interest in helping me do comparisons and it brings the family closer together (at least, to meet my needs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ). 
 Shopping for pocketbooks is yet, a different story.


----------



## zackhugh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes I know there are design changes and no one does this more than Xin but he has found a couple of things that advance the sound even more. I really think some of these are going to approach that of home amps._

 

Nooooo! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Just when I thought things have settled on the Xin front, I see all the recent posts about the new versions. I love that my Ref can run forever on those Eneloops (seems impossible, but it keeps going), but I'd trade improved sound for "only" 40+ hours of battery life. I guess I better keep my iBasso P2 to use when I eventually ship my amp back to Xin.

 I feel sorry for the people still waiting for their orders because I'm enjoying my amp so much. It got a little congested-sounding around 250 hours or so, but it's back to sounding very nice at around 400 hours of burn-in. At least if you have a Reference order in, though, it's probably better to wait because you'd probably want one of the newer options anyway. Small consolation, I know...


----------



## kaushama

It never stops at Dr Xin's front! He is obsessed with perfect sound. Whatever critics say that is the beauty of his amps. You get indefinite right for upgrades. But nothing is perfect. You have to have immense patience to appreciate his work. That is a really the downside of having his amps.


----------



## ed lynch

May i wish you all a happy and peaceful christmas and a happy new year to all at Head FI . and all who contributes , sincerely ed,


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_May i wish you all a happy and peaceful christmas and a happy new year to all at Head FI . and all who contributes , sincerely ed,_

 

And to you and yours, ed.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks sbulack, over here in dublin Ireland its around -2 degrees which is normal at this time of the year, hope all is well. ed.


----------



## jamato8

It is raining in Santa Rosa, California. We were out riding out bikes looking at the lights (with rain gear on). 

 Happy Holidays to everyone.


----------



## Nailzs

Merry Christmas all!! It was 78 and sunny here in Lakeland Florida today.


----------



## Quaddy

seeing as this thread is obviously a "where are you and what temperature it is" thread, not a "those waiting xin amp, post and get your date of arrival" thread, then, scotland here, 6 degrees celcius in the still but misty glens, merry xmas to all, and seasons greetings.


----------



## ed lynch

We are so long waiting quaddy we have to talk about something happy xmas quaddy and all yours ed.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

72 and Sunny here in Maui.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_72 and Sunny here in Maui._

 

What??? How did you deserve that? It raining/clearing, windy here. . hey.! What'sup?


----------



## mrarroyo

This afternoon I took some time to revisit the C and C1 boards after adding another 55 hours of burn-in (total of about 120 hours). I used two headphones: Ultrasone HFI-780 w/ a V3 APureSound re-cable and an stock Denon AH-D5000.

 My wife participated again and we both still prefer as we did a few days ago. She prefers the C and I prefer the C1. What we both agreed on is that the B sounded better than the A, C, and C1. The presentation was airy, wide, and very clear. Since the B board uses about the same ammount of power as the A board it should provide close to 200 hours of use on four AAA alkaline batteries. Next I will be comparing the B board w/ the D and D1. But first I will add about 48 hours of additional burn in to the D and D1 boards.

 Will keep you posted.


----------



## nc8000

Light frost and clear night sky


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ ... Next I will be comparing the B board w/ the D and D1. But first I will add about 48 hours of additional burn in to the D and D1 boards. ..._

 

A very interesting observation (interesting because it is unexpected by me) that you and your wife both prefer the B to the higher-power-delivery C,C1. What is the likelihood that, when the A,B,C,D References are sufficiently burned in and compared that your OTHER partner (in amp review), vorlon1, might give them a listen and chime in with his preferences as well? If not very likely, that is A-OK with me, but I thought that I'd ask, as I have found the value of the pair of your "takes" on an amp together to be greater than the sum of the parts. Many thanks again, Miguel, for your participation in, and gracious sharing of, the development of the Reference.

 And a Merry Christmas, Happy Holiday and Fantastic New Year to ALL (from a temperate and overcast Philadelphia, PA in the USA) !!! (Been listenin' to too much Top-40 radio lately


----------



## mrarroyo

sbulak, I have discussed w/ vorlon1 the possibility of getting together and compare all these units. He is game as I am, issue is finding a date to meet. Also I am waiting for the return of two Reference units I have out on loan.

 Vorlon1 has a great ear and although we do not always agree we have been able to put out there two perspectives that I hope have helped people in making a choice.

 Mi wife although not active here also has a very good ear and I trust her (she also has a good eye for picture composition).

 I hope that by mid January vorlon1 and I will get together and compare all 10 versions of the reference that we have between us.

 Before I forget, yes it is possible that I might change my tune when the units are fully burnt in. But it is also possible I may not.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_sbulak, I have discussed w/ vorlon1 the possibility of getting together and compare all these units. He is game as I am, issue is finding a date to meet. ... Mi wife although not active here also has a very good ear and I trust her ... I hope that by mid January vorlon1 and I will get together and compare all 10 versions of the reference that we have between us._

 

What a possibility to put out there, in keeping with the spirit of the season and your abiding generosity! I ask tentatively about the likelihood of you and vorlon1 comparing 4 References together, and you reply that you both hope to compare 10 References together! It is noteworthy that there are differences between your and your wife's ear (shown in the D,D1 and C,C1 preference differences), which makes your shared preference of the B over the C,C1 even more significant. Now that Christmas is nearly over, it's especially delicious to have the possibility of the 10 Reference comparison from you and vorlon1 to look forward to, sometime in mid-to-late January - or if and whenever the two of you are able to make it happen.


----------



## mrarroyo

It will be fun! That much I can guarantee.


----------



## ed lynch

Im typing this with an umbrella up even though its not raining, IM getting funny looks from people, but we had a terrible storm last week, the roof of my garden shed took off. Maybe if dr xin seen these threads he would understand how the waiting game can effect people...As NC 8000 noted recently a 3 weeks delay on orders, Hopefully in the new year things will improve,ed.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ ... Maybe if dr xin seen these threads he would understand how the waiting game can effect people ... Hopefully in the new year things will improve,ed._

 

A very nice improvement already in this current shipping delay is that Dr. Xin has not disappeared again, but rather is VERY active in making realistically small and worthwhile improvements to the Reference, as is shown by the posts by mrarroyo and jamato8 about the latest Reference versions. Once mrarroyo, jamato8, others of Dr. Xin's beta testers, report in and Dr. Xin selects the configuration that he'd like to continue shipping, it would not surprise me at all if the order shipment rate were to go way up. To me, things are looking good to support a realistic expectation of some very nice improvements in 2009 vis a vis Xin Amps and customers getting and enjoying them.

 And, in the meantime, we've got mrarroyo's nail-biter of an adventure through the prototypes of the various Reference configurations under consideration with occasional additional observations from jamato8, and, on the horizon, input from vorlon1 on the candidate Reference configurations as well. These are good days.

 So, things have already improved quite a lot, and, so far, are giving every indication of going from better to even mo' betta' in the new year.


----------



## kaushama

Season's greatings and merry christmas to everyone. Yes it seems again Dr. Xin is up to some R & D stuff.
 I am still burning down my new Supermini. It already sounds better than my previous Reference. I think I need to burn it down more than 800 Hrs to fully appreciate the new sound.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Season's greatings and merry christmas to everyone. Yes it seems again Dr. Xin is up to some R & D stuff.
 I am still burning down my new Supermini. It already sounds better than my previous Reference. I think I need to burn it down more than 800 Hrs to fully appreciate the new sound._

 

The Supermini should be fine with 300 hours of burn-in. At least the bulk of the change will happen by the first 125 hours w/ minor changes through 300 hours.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks Sbulack, this is a good time for us waiting on dr xin, by the way..sbulack, is this amp going to be a one off encompassing all new evaluations including a.b.c.d etc or do you think he will narrow down to two vis. a-d, i know probably when he receives evalutions,he will make a decision, it would be great if it was all encombassed in one unit .ED.


----------



## mrarroyo

Ed Lynch, Dr. Xin is already made that call and will be offering all four versions A through D.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ed Lynch, Dr. Xin is already made that call and will be offering all four versions A through D._

 

In fact, I've already posted in this thread that I've sent my email to Dr. Xin with my order number, requesting that he fulfill my order with a version D - or as Dr. Xin advised (paraphrase) if you don't care about super long battery life go straight to D. As of the last post from Dr. Xin that I'm aware of, the default fulfilment version is A, and the others B, C and D are only an email request away. Even after a default is shipped, it can be sent back for a change to any of the other three versions. After mrarroyo and his perceptive wife, (perhaps jamato8) and vorlon1 post their preferences, I MAY change my version selection. Then again, I MAY not. BTW, miguel ramon, your wifes' initials wouldn't happen to be "mrs", would they?


----------



## nsx_23

So does all this activity mean we can order from Xin with a bit of confidence that the item will arrive on time?

 If yes, where can I place an order?


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ After mrarroyo and his perceptive wife, (perhaps jamato8)_

 

Are you saying that mrarroyo's wife is really jamato8


----------



## jamato8

Ok, this place is getting very strange, very strange.


----------



## wuwhere

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Are you saying that mrarroyo's wife is really jamato8 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ok, this place is getting very strange, very strange._

 

And it appears to be coming from the moderators. Be Afraid! Be Very Afraid!


----------



## ed lynch

Ah come on all of you as we say in dublin,get a grip, im still holding on to my hornet ,ray samuels amp i mean, sincerely ,its fully burnt in, i reckon 800 ,maybe double that, hours i should rephrase all that again something tells me,i didnt paraphraise those words right,btw this hornet (m) is sounding ok lately instead of getting 14 hrs im getting about 11 hours on charge,no problem,i had it switched off for months, btw again ray supplied a spare battery,so no problems,fair play to him he looks after his customers, it must be great for those who have his new incarnation (p51) Let us know lads how it sounds, I have heard great reports and nothing since i know its Christmas season when you get back anyway, ed


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah come on all of you as we say in dublin,get a grip, ..._

 

What a small world it is! We say "get a grip" in Philadelphia, PA too!


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So does all this activity mean we can order from Xin with a bit of confidence that the item will arrive on time?

 If yes, where can I place an order?_

 

I personally wouldn't go as far as that. While there seems to be worthwhile development work going on there don't seem to have been any actual order fulfillment for alomst a month now after an initial stream of back orders being sent out. The backorder log must still be over a years worth of orders as my SuperMini order from late 2007 has not been filled yet


----------



## mrarroyo

This place is getting very funny!.

 Last night I completed an additional 50 hour burn in on the D1 and D boards, for a total of about 100 hours on these two boards. It was very hard to choose which one I preferred, some of the differences I though I had heard at 50 hours of burn have evened out. Although I still hear a wider soundstage w/ the D1 and perhaps a tad more punch w/ the D. I then compared these two w/ the B board and it was interesting. I felt the B was better than the D however I could not decide between the D1 and the B as far as a favorite.

 I am leaving on a trip tomorrow so upon my return I will try to log a total of 200 hours on each of the boards and have a shootout w/ Rob (vorlon1 of Head-Fi). I hope to be able to post said comparison on or about January 17. One thing is for sure, Dr. Xin hit a Home Run w/ these series of boards. The sound is articulate, detailed, extended, very good to excellent soundstage (left to right), and good to excellent depth. When you consider that a couple of these boards (A and B) will provide about 200 hours of play time you have a major accomplishment.

 I believe that Dr. Xin should be congratulated on the sound. Now he needs to fill orthers.

 Edit: Forgot to include that the test was done using an Ultrasone HFI-780 w/ a V3 APureSound cable.

 Also no, jamato8 is not my wife. Funny stuff.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks Mrarroyo for your trogan work, we all appreciate it, i know its time consuming, let those amps burn in for as long as possible and your evaluations then will be eagerly awited, and respected. ed


----------



## ed lynch

Nc 8000 super mini, i wishI I HAD
 EVEN ONE OF HIS AMPS FROM DR XIN TO EVALUATE SORRY ABOUT THIS TYPING BUT AT LEAST YOU HAVE A FLAVOUR OF THE SOUND I WONDER WHAT HIS NEW RELEASE WILL SOUND LIKE,JUST A THOUGHT,INTERESTING.


----------



## nc8000

I don't have a Xin amp presently (have been waiting for a new SuperMini for over a year), but I have previously owned most versions of his amps from the last 4 years and it sounds like the wait for the latest generation will be worth it but what a wait and many have waited longer than I


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


 Ok, this place is getting very strange, very strange. 
 

 Quote:


 Also no, jamato8 is not my wife. Funny stuff. 
 






 LOL Its funny!


----------



## ed lynch

I can assure you Elvis is not here at the moment, he maybe ran away with my hornet,but i forgive him for that,ed


----------



## ed lynch

On seconds thoughts ELVIS I WANT MY HORNET BACK, PLEASE


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_And it appears to be coming from the moderators. Be Afraid! Be Very Afraid! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








_

 

Member first, moderator second! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks Mrarroyo for your *trogan* work, we all appreciate it, i know its time consuming..._

 

At least we know that mrarroyo uses protection even if jamato8 is not his wife 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Seriously, though... 

 The 2 References that Miguel (mrarroyo) sent me, so I can let other's have a listen at the NY Fall meet, sound spectacular. I will have to let him explain the differences in them other than the cap outputs, because they are pre-A/B/C/C1/C26/ and D205 versions.
 The only change that I would want to see in them (if they ever became a consistent purchasable item), is a gain switch. With my IEMs and even with my ESW9/10's, I would like to have a little more variance control in my volume.
 I can go up to 11:00 and that's it. This is good for a DT880 or an HD6XX, but not so much for a lower impedance can. 

 Besides the sound, another great attribute of the Reference is the ability to use a 1/4 headphone plug without the need for an adapter (sorry if I'm stating the obvious).

 Even though I advertised them to the crowd at the meet and posted that I was bringing them, the are plain looking (which I don't mind at all...looking for sound and not pizzazz), members did not seem to take a lot of interest in giving them a try. Maybe if they had some sparkly paint on them and 1962 Cadillac wings on the rear, more people would have given them a try.

 Either that, or the fact that they are not easily obtainable, kept the crowds at bay. I for one, being a self proclaimed audiophile, want to try everything that is out there, good or bad, so I can die a happy man 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 That's the nature of a hobby, IMHO.


----------



## ed lynch

My cat in the backround is urging me on,one look after another is enough, shes all right, btw,im using my c&c xo amp at the moment before you ask yes i have too many portable amps, but they all have their own sound signature,and each one sounds ok, so i wonder,to myself, do i need another amp, i think the answer is yes.


----------



## ed lynch

I think my cat wants to marry me,she said wheres my ring,i looked at her twice,then i realaised she was serious, i said i wont give you that c&c amp anymore, your getting too fond of my equipment,she is still looking at me.


----------



## ed lynch

Hmm i have to think twice here neither jamato or myarro is not my cousin,there again i wouldent mind if either of them were,because both are nice contributes to this forum,and may long may it last. ed.


----------



## nsx_23

So can anyone answer my question about where I can order a Xin amp that will actually arrive without a 2 year wait?


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So can anyone answer my question about where I can order a Xin amp that will actually arrive without a 2 year wait?_

 

Find one in sales forum here!


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nsx_23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So can anyone answer my question about where I can order a Xin amp that will actually arrive without a 2 year wait?_

 

Yes with current track record only second hand and that then is very unlikely to be the current version.


----------



## BushGuy

My Pico should arrive (approximately) in a week. After some burning and listening I expect I'll sell my Xin Supermacro LE as a move to keep from having too many portables (also have Xin Supermini, Reference, and P51 Mustang - plus the incoming Pico). This one is a v. IV built after the important 4/11 change.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks, when you get back after the holidey,lads maybe you havent got time yet.but it would be interesting,to here latest evaluations,on xin amps, i know it will take more time on your part and time, all looking forward, in the meantime happy 2009, ed.


----------



## Nailzs

16 months as of yesterday.


----------



## ed lynch

Nailzs, just thinking, when the lads finish evaluating the latest prototypes, it should be worth the wait, im over 15 months waiting, i dunno whether xin will incorporate all the new characteristics into one unit or whether there will be different versions, we just have to wait and see, ed.


----------



## mrarroyo

Ed, I have logged another 50 hours in the D and D1 boards. I will log another 50 and that should bring me to 200 hours of burn in on the D and D1 boards. Then I will ad about 75 hours to the A, B, C, and C1 board by next Saturday. Hopefully vorlon1 will be available to compare all the 6 boards.


----------



## Nailzs

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nailzs, just thinking, when the lads finish evaluating the latest prototypes, it should be worth the wait, im over 15 months waiting, i dunno whether xin will incorporate all the new characteristics into one unit or whether there will be different versions, we just have to wait and see, ed._

 

I remember reading something like that about 2 years ago, and people are still waiting.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks, Mrarroyo, thanks for your analyis, i know its ongoing, its worth it in the end, for all those waiting, including myself, take all the time in the world, its worth the wait, we appreciate it, happy 2009, ed.


----------



## ed lynch

Nailzs, it will be worth waiting for, this far,so good, im trying to imagine xins latest developent, when he goes back in production stage, just think of the unit we might receive,hopefully, better than ever,fingers crossed, btw, my credit card, has only 4 months left, ed.


----------



## LionPlushie

should i order from dr xin? but from all these comments it will take like so long to arrive? its scary me =/


----------



## Lil' Knight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LionPlushie* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_should i order from dr xin? but from all these comments it will take like so long to arrive? its scary me =/_

 

If you order by a credit card, it worths a try to test you patience


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LionPlushie* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_should i order from dr xin? but from all these comments it will take like so long to arrive? its scary me =/_

 

Order by Credit Card now. You will NOT get charged yet. Perhaps after a year or two when you forgot about it you will have your amp knocking your door. In the mean while buy another amp to keep you busy


----------



## nsx_23

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My Pico should arrive (approximately) in a week. After some burning and listening I expect I'll sell my Xin Supermacro LE as a move to keep from having too many portables (also have Xin Supermini, Reference, and P51 Mustang - plus the incoming Pico). This one is a v. IV built after the important 4/11 change._

 

I would be interested.


----------



## kaushama

I think we are again in a middle of an R&D cycle!


----------



## nc8000

Yes he must be living in a parallel universe cause his sense of time certainly does not fit this universe


----------



## cosmic castaway

I have emailed him but he has not reply for 2 days already.. Seems like he's in hiatus yet again..


----------



## mrarroyo

Last night after logging in an additional 75 hours of burn in (total of 175 hours) I sat w/ my wife to compare the D versus the D1 boards. Now the difference between the two is even less than at 50 or 100 hours respectively. Both of us had a hard time deciding, my wife once again chose the D version (w/o knowing which was which). I can see that choice and in a way I almost did, however I gave the D1 a nudge as the better of the two but it is infinitesimal. Mostly a bit wider soundstage.

 We also compared the C versus the C1 board now w/ 150 hour of burn in each. She chose the C board as her favorite and now w/ about 150 hours I would have to agree that it does sound a bit clearer and more detailed.

 Lastly we compared the B board w/ the C, D, and D1. I hate to say it but we felt the B was the best sounding, to me this is good due to a better battery life. I will say that both the C and D1 were very close behing the B.

 For headphones I used an stock Ultrasone PROline 2500 and the source was a Philips DVP using the stereo rca outs.


----------



## EFN

mrarroyo, I take it Xin will be swinging back to production mode once you send him feedbacks on the final assessment? I have a Xin Reference Type D on order. Sounds like a progress there with the testing and I do hope this will help Dr. Xin to react faster on finalizing his amps. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 And:
 Send my regards to your wife, she's been a great help


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EFN* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo, I take it Xin will be swinging back to production mode once you send him feedbacks on the final assessment? I have a Xin Reference Type D on order. Sounds like a progress there with the testing and I do hope this will help Dr. Xin to react faster on finalizing his amps. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And:
 Send my regards to your wife, she's been a great help_

 

Yes, she has been a lot of help. BTW, she also cooked dinner.


----------



## kaushama

mrarroyo, You are so lucky to have a partner like that. I am still trying to find a dream girl like that.


----------



## kaushama

And I sent my reference for upgrades and Dr. Xin said he would send after soon after he receives it. But as he is keeping quiet I know he wants to finalize the latest design before sending it.
 Lucky i have my Mini to tide over. I love it.


----------



## sbulack

Dr. Xin may be returning to order fulfilment mode:
 When the initial announcement was made about the A, B, C, D versions of the Reference, I sent an email asking that my Reference order be fulfilled with a version D Reference, taking Dr. Xin's advice to "go straight to D".

 At 4 AM this morning, I received this reply:
 "Hi steve, I've made the note and please feel free to make any more
 changes before I ship it (about two weeks). Thanks, Xin"

 Yes, I know, I'll count it delivered when the package is in my hands. But the reason I am posting this reply from Dr. Xin is that it MAY show that he's done enough R & D to actually feel comfortable sending a Reference D to someone who has specifically asked for one.

 I, for one, see this as a positive step toward a return from the recent (productive) detour into "R&D mode" back to order fulfilment mode.


----------



## DennyL

Well, it can only be good news, although Dr Xin's promises have been pretty elastic in the past. Let's hope he doesn't have another brainstorm that sends him back into development mode (if he has really come out of it).


----------



## Pangaea

Well Gents, I'm out. Just not that interested in portable amps these days... and my patience for this guy is def. out the door. I think I was at 19 mos. but honestly I lost count.

 I think I will miss this thread more than anything- but alas I am no longer a legit member.


----------



## BushGuy

I figured that you have to go past the holidays before you can expect much success with custom vendors..........so, I just sent Dr. Xin both my Reference (asked for B version) , and Supermini for updating. Finally received shipping notice for Pico, so shouldn't be in dire straits for the coming week(s). That means I'm down to only one Xin amp (LE, plus a P51) during the interim. That's fine.


----------



## Quaddy

17 month anniversary.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_17 month anniversary._

 

Right behind you at 16 months.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Dr. Xin may be returning to order fulfilment mode:
 When the initial announcement was made about the A, B, C, D versions of the Reference, I sent an email asking that my Reference order be fulfilled with a version D Reference, taking Dr. Xin's advice to "go straight to D".

 At 4 AM this morning, I received this reply:
 "Hi steve, I've made the note and please feel free to make any more
 changes before I ship it (about two weeks). Thanks, Xin"

 Yes, I know, I'll count it delivered when the package is in my hands. But the reason I am posting this reply from Dr. Xin is that it MAY show that he's done enough R & D to actually feel comfortable sending a Reference D to someone who has specifically asked for one.

 I, for one, see this as a positive step toward a return from the recent (productive) detour into "R&D mode" back to order fulfilment mode._

 

How many months did you wait if I may ask?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_How many months did you wait if I may ask?_

 

Quaddy and I placed our orders on the same day, so Jan 8, 2009 was my 17 month anniversary as well. The reports on the improvements made to the Reference in very recent months are encouraging. It would appear that the Reference that I'll be receiving, when I eventually end up receiving it, will be quite a bit better than the one that I would have received in 2007 or 2008. I've only ever heard a 2003-vintage Super-Mini of the Xin line of amps. It sounded quite good, and there have been quite a few notable improvements since then. I'm very much looking forward to hearing the Reference D that I've ordered. Hopefully, that will occur sometime near the two-to-three week horizon mentioned in Dr. Xin's recent email to me.


----------



## mrarroyo

vorlon1's schedule and mine have been quite busy, it looks like we will be able to meet on Saturday, 1/24.


----------



## tnmike1

I've waited since August '07. Sent Xin a note last week requesting the "D" version and last night received an email saying the amp should ship next week. We'll see what happens, but nice to know he's now responding to emails


----------



## kaushama

My reference too with him. I kept quiet till R&D is over. I didn't want to send it back later. I should drop him a line and see.


----------



## Victor Chew

I have the Ref. A type I believe. I too just sent it back to Dr Xin. for change to the D type. Anyone knows the technical specifications difference between all the different types of baords? Dr Xin did say that the D type has more power... buffers, more buffers or higher current buffers added or .... ??? Perhaps Marroyo could be kind enough to enlighten us.


----------



## mrarroyo

I have the boards, but Dr. Xin has removed the identification of most of the chips. He is doing so during the development phase. I can tell you that they are quite different based on the items I see soldered unto the boards.

 However, I do not feel it is correct to take pictures of the boards and post them until the good Doctor finalizes the design.


----------



## zackhugh

I haven't sent back my Reference back (yet). Have others just decided that the "D" is the way to go for them? I'd really like to read a little more about the perceived differences between each version before committing to a possibly lengthy wait for the upgrade.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *zackhugh* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't sent back my Reference back (yet). Have others just decided that the "D" is the way to go for them? ..._

 

In his original post on a Support thread in the "Cool Talk" Forum on fixup.net, Dr. Xin advised folks for whom super-long battery life is not a requirement to "go straight to D", since it gives the largest potential compatibility and sound quality with the widest variety of phones in terms of delivering the power they need. I know from a fair bit of experience that the SQ of an amp rests on the foundation of its power supply and power circuitry. To me, the 50 hours (or so) of battery life of the D version IS super-long, so I chose to take Dr. Xin's advice.

 So far, the reports on the versions have described the differences as being on the small side and the listening results of the versions being close. I'm as interested as anyone in the upcoming impressions of vorlon1 on all of the Reference versions in the possession of mrarroyo. I assess Dr. Xin's ear and sense of what features contribute to long-term user satisfaction to be sufficiently good for me to select a Reference version based on his advice. If it turns out that another version of the Reference is the majority preference of folks on Head-Fi, including those whose posts indicate that they hear things like me, then I will likely send it back for that other version later. If I were in a situation where I were already in possession of a Reference and had time to get more impressions before making a decision to change its version, I would.

 Also, Dr. Xin, so far, has prioritized upgrades to returned amps ahead of new order fulfilment. So, with the good Doctor as engaged in his amp enterprise as he is, the wait for an upgrade may not be as long as it has been during the periods where Dr. Xin's attention was turned to his other areas of endeavor.


----------



## Victor Chew

If an amp is "powerful" (ie. depending on how you will define it) it is quite normal to get about 20 hours with 8AAA. The configuration I am talking about is an op amp with say 3 buffers (eg. BUF634 or the likes). To get 50hours and if can drive "challenging" loads (eg. HD6xx or K701) "properly" (ie. with ease) is to me a very commendable achievement. I suppose I should get my D type soon and will know of its drive abilities and refinement after I get it to fully burn in.


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have the boards, but Dr. Xin has removed the identification of most of the chips. He is doing so during the development phase. I can tell you that they are quite different based on the items I see soldered unto the boards.

 However, I do not feel it is correct to take pictures of the boards and post them until the good Doctor finalizes the design._

 

The D version has additional buffers or different op-amps?


----------



## ed lynch

As we all wait on the lads impressions and their feedback to dr xin on the new boards, i reckon he is busy making all 4 prototypes at this moment with the view that all versions will be ready to ship asap, just a thought, worthwhile thought, ed.


----------



## ed lynch

This is the thing, which version, to go for, all those waiting including myself are in a little bit of a dilemma, which to go for even though our orders are in, over a year, i think ill wait and see, a little bit longer before changing order from original (a) that was my reference first order? before all audio reports are in, then we will have a better idea! what do you think, ed,


----------



## Aaron622

17 month anniversary today. How all the different versions of the Reference affect my SuperMicro is beyond me. You'd think he would be able to ship other amps while the Reference is in development.


----------



## ed lynch

I haven't sent back my Reference back (yet). Have others just decided that the "D" is the way to go for them? I'd really like to read a little more about the perceived differences between each version before committing to a possibly lengthy wait for the upgrade.[/QUOTE]

 That is my exact point you took the words right of my mouth (not a song) you know what i mean, at this stage all is good i think dr xin knows his backlog, and then when, he decides on the different versions on order, through the lads, we can change our preference, at this stage to be honest,we wait and see, your version is probably up there with the rest, and the best ,there might be minor differences, but at this juncture anybody knows, btw i never even received one of his masterpices, maybe im getting old, not to worry ed.


----------



## ed lynch

And finally, i know im repeating myself at this time,i just came in from a bitter storm winds lashing rain from nw in dublin Ireland more heavy wind forecast, tried to repair my sheds, could not, swirling wind and rain torrents blown backwood and me getting blowing backword btw,thank you before you say how nice it is in certain places like honolulu, people said the hornet which i can attest to, is all right, or p51 will carry you really through,good reports on which i have not tried maybe i will order one, not withstanding all we might be woundering forever,its a never ending story,ed


----------



## zackhugh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_... btw,thank you before you say how nice it is in certain places like honolulu, people said the hornet which i can attest to, is all right, or p51 will carry you really through,good reports on which i have not tried maybe i will order one, not withstanding all we might be woundering forever,its a never ending story,ed_

 

Uh, yeah, actually it was in the upper 70's and quite nice outside today, I'm sorry to report. Also, I do actually have a Reference in my possession, not to rub it in! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, I'm quite pleased with my amp, I lost track of how many hours I have burned in on it now. It's just that if I send it in for an upgrade, even if it's a short time before Xin gets it back to me, I still hate to be without it for any amount of time.


----------



## dimm0k

An e-mail reply to an e-mail I sent a couple of weeks back.

 Sorry for the wait, please check the status on
Xin's Cool Talk - Currently shipping

 Thanks, Xin


 Too bad my Receipt begins with 39... arrgh!


----------



## kaushama

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I haven't sent back my Reference back (yet). Have others just decided that the "D" is the way to go for them? I'd really like to read a little more about the perceived differences between each version before committing to a possibly lengthy wait for the upgrade._

 

But Type B was commended by mrarroyo and perhaps better than D?
 It has more battery life too. I am just waiting till more opinions come. Perhaps mrarroyo/Vorlon meet will settle things



 .


----------



## zackhugh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kaushama* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But Type B was commended by mrarroyo and perhaps better than D?
 It has more battery life too. I am just waiting till more opinions come. Perhaps mrarroyo/Vorlon meet will settle things._

 

Yeah, this is what I was alluding to earlier about not being sure if D was really the ultimate choice. 

 Oh well, this should be interesting. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Last year when I was lurking I found the mrarroyo/Vorlon amp comparisons compelling enough to order a SuperMicro IV, though later changing it to a Ref.


----------



## kaushama

By the sound of things I do not think good Dr still done with final layout too.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_An e-mail reply to an e-mail I sent a couple of weeks back.

 Sorry for the wait, please check the status on
Xin's Cool Talk - Currently shipping

 Thanks, Xin


 Too bad my Receipt *begins with 39*... arrgh!_

 

*
 yours and mine alike brother.*

 not very helpful is it, considering he is pointing you to a page ("_check the status_") where the order number was last edited on the [size=xx-small] 11/28/2008[/size]

 what are you supposed to glean from that? apart from just keep waiting.


----------



## nc8000

Yes, I have finally and conclusively cancelled my order. I don't beleive that product is ever going to be shipped in meaningful quantyties, he is simple too much of a tweaker to ever go fully from development into a steady production run. Shame really.


----------



## dimm0k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*
 yours and mine alike brother.*

 not very helpful is it, considering he is pointing you to a page ("check the status") where the order number was last edited on the [size=xx-small] 11/28/2008[/size]

 what are you supposed to glean from that? apart from just keep waiting._

 

Hehe for someone like myself who is impatient I'm sort of surprised this really hasn't bothered me much. I guess his reply to my email, while no useful info, is a sign that he's busy doing something over there...


----------



## jamato8

I can totally understand the frustration. I do have to say that the current sound is exceptional. Where it ends up is anyone's guess but I have to say it will be one of the best and contending with many home amps.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can totally understand the frustration. I do have to say that the current sound is exceptional. Where it ends up is anyone's guess but I have to say it will be one of the best and contending with many home amps._

 

Which version do you have?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Too bad my Receipt begins with 39... arrgh!_

 

The latest update on his website has the currently shipping number 39018597 (posted 1/13).


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Which version do you have?_

 

might be easier to ask which versions jam doesnt have


----------



## Nailzs

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I can totally understand the frustration. I do have to say that the current sound is exceptional. Where it ends up is anyone's guess but I have to say it will be one of the best and contending with many home amps._

 

That's great but how many versions will be out before "normal" people get theirs?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Nailzs* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That's great but how many versions will be out before "normal" people get theirs?_

 

I have a feather pillow in my hand. How many feathers does it contain?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a feather pillow in my hand. How many feathers does it contain?_

 

That either means, "I Don't Know" or it means an "infinite number of versions first."


----------



## DennyL

The Xin Reference was added to his product range in about September 2007 (correct me on this). Here we are in January 2009, about three delivery promises later, with the design not even finalised and about three variants added to the product range while hardly anyone, apart from favoured testers, has received anything! That is Xin's way of working. At least we can comfort ourselves with the belief that the unobtainable (mythical?) Reference probably sounds better than most of the amps we can actually buy and use.

 With the latest increment to his shipping order number he's getting dangerously close to mine and I'll have to make a decision.


----------



## Nailzs

As for myself if something in the universe sounds better that what I currently using, if I never hear it I still think I'm using the best.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The latest update on his website has the currently shipping number 39018597 (posted 1/13)._

 

OBOY--my number's 39158534--hope this doesn't mean there are about 139,000 ahead of me


----------



## itsborken

It appears the first four most significant digits are the order number and the last four are check digits.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The Xin Reference was added to his product range in about September 2007 (*correct me on this*)._

 

well, not to split hairs, but you did say correct me! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, and as i ordered the rererence in early aug 07 as per my sig, i presume it must have been in his inventory a little before that even!

 the reference is so old hat for some, yet a glint in the eye for others like me not 5 minutes down the road from him!

 its not the amp i want now so much, but the satisfaction of waiting and letting this saga run its full course!!!

 hope all the people receiving multiple generations of the amp on an ongoing basis are not somehow fueling xins R&D fetish at the detriment of original version orderers!!


----------



## Henry Flower

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It appears the first four most significant digits are the order number and the last four are check digits._

 

It appears not. tnmike1's order number and mine both begin with 3915.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks Zachhugh, nice to know weather in the 70s and you have a reference amp, is it the 'original version you have' how does it sound, just pondering, have you another other amp to compare it to, im sure its still wonderful,ed


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

The only way I would have ordered a reference is for the 1/4" jacks, but now that most of my phones are recabled with APS v3 and a 1/8" jack it is moot point. I just use a solid 1/4" adapter for full size amps if I'm not using the 4-pin to balanced adapter.


----------



## ed lynch

Jamato8, on a rough estimate about 150 thousand feathers maybe more correct me if im wrong probably a little bit more,btw, how is the p51 getting on soundwise,ED.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *itsborken* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It appears the first four most significant digits are the order number and the last four are check digits._

 

HUH??? check digits??? Whuzzat??? I'm paying by credit card. Unless you mean something else.

 And if you're correct about the first four numbers, tht means i'm 14th or so in line??? WHOOPEEE. Only been over 1 1/2 yrs.


----------



## itsborken

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Henry Flower* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It appears not. tnmike1's order number and mine both begin with 3915._

 

I stand corrected, the ones I've seen have differed in the first 4 characters and appeared to be filled in that order over time.


----------



## ed lynch

HUH??? check digits??? Whuzzat??? I'm paying by credit card. Unless you mean something else.

 And if you're correct about the first four numbers, tht means i'm 14th or so in line??? WHOOPEEE. Only been over 1 1/2 yrs.[/QUOTE]

 I remember some time ago somebody said the order numbers are only reference' points, i could be wrong maybe the amps are coming on stream, but at the moment dr xin probably needs more feedback, as the lads are trying to do on his behalf, through evaluation, just a thought, ED.


----------



## zackhugh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks Zachhugh, nice to know weather in the 70s and you have a reference amp, is it the 'original version you have' how does it sound, just pondering, have you another other amp to compare it to, im sure its still wonderful,ed_

 

I have the original Reference version of the ones that came out in the last two months, I believe this is the "A" model in current offerings. It was going through some growing pains through December, at times sounding very good and at others not so much (bass dropping out, congested-sounding). I was listening to it last night and it was as good as it had been earlier but it maintained that consistency. I guess that 800 hour mark others have mentioned is for real. It sounds so good I ended up listening for an extra half hour when I really should have been doing something else. Very addictive. I'm more seriously exploring some full-size cans to use the 1/4" plug.

 Now, I realize my opinion here isn't well-regarded since I'm a Noob, my equipment isn't high-end (compared to some others), and my ears aren't likely to be golden, but FWIW I really like the way the Reference is sounding. The only amps I can compare it to are the Total Bithead (my gateway amp) and the iBasso P2 (bought a while back in the wait for the Ref). The iBasso was a significant improvement over the Bithead, and the jump to the Reference from the P2 is almost as big a change. I don't even miss the flexibility of the bass and gain switches because of the superior detail and soundstage. Sorry for rambling. Summary: I really like my Reference.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks Zackhugh, yes i heard it needs a lot of burn in, i dont know how many hours you have clocked on yours, what i did with one of my amps (hornet m) was to leave it connected to an ordinary transistor radio, a tip i got off these threads, instead of say burning out the disc drive on my iriver 320 or my phillips similar, of course ipod nano is better in this regard as it uses memory, then when you think how many battery changes, and recharging or ordinary batteries, it would make you think of the latest incarnations like the p51 for example which requires a minimum burn in, not withstanding that when its fully burnt in, it should be up there with the best, btw weather here in dublin really stormy, my second shed roof is in bits, rain getting in, cant get out to fix it, until storm abates, ED


----------



## ed lynch

Seeing that no one has posted recently about receiving any xin amps even modified,, has anybody got their amp that they sent in for updating back in the post recently, ed.


----------



## Happy Camper

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Seeing that no one has posted recently about receiving any xin amps even modified,, has anybody got their amp that they sent in for updating back in the post recently, ed._

 


 And what differences it made in the sound. I have a 10/06 Macro 4 unit to send back.


----------



## ed lynch

Happy camper, im confused, sorry does that mean you have received recently one of your xin amps updated that you returned to dr xin say in the last month, or how long, for updating, im still in the now 15 month club just waiting for 1st delivery of any of his amps like many here, , ed.


----------



## vandread

17 month 11 days has passed away........

 knock knock.......

 since i don't need a portable amp anymore, what should i do?

 'cause it's really grow a curiousity in my mind after all of this, what kind of sound xin can offered to us.


----------



## ed lynch

Chickengod ed here, if your reading this i remember some time back you received a xin amp, i think it was a supermicro, how is things now, how does it sound, was it the updated version, have you ordered since, say a reference, just woundering, all the best ed.


----------



## ed lynch

vandread, its a long time waiting, if we ever receive something in the post it could be called a revelation, ed.


----------



## dimm0k

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The latest update on his website has the currently shipping number 39018597 (posted 1/13)._

 

Hehe funny how I come here for updates on my Xin amp rather than the direct source. The next digit I will reveal to my order is 3, making it 393!


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dimm0k* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hehe funny how I come here for updates on my Xin amp rather than the direct source. The next digit I will reveal to my order is 3, making it 393!_

 

you tease you!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 what if i told you i only come here to catch your infrequent digit revelations?

 god speed.


----------



## ed lynch

Quaddy, the waiting, the feeling of waiting' i cant explain maybe ill call it xinitis as we all wait for his elusive amps for years at this stage, i know its ridiculous, with only the odd respond that he might be back on stream, im sure peoples credit card have expired, or some are passed on hopefully not, thats the impression i get, however new days new hope, ed


----------



## Happy Camper

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Happy camper, im confused, sorry does that mean you have received recently one of your xin amps updated that you returned to dr xin say in the last month, or how long, for updating, im still in the now 15 month club just waiting for 1st delivery of any of his amps like many here, , ed._

 


 I have a Xin amp bought 10/06 that needs to be updated. I wonder how the updates have impacted the sound if anyone has had theirs done. I don't want to send mine back until he has caught up with his backlog.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks happy camper,i dont blame you hesitating on returning your amp, as nobody has posted even receiving an updated version or modified version recently, such is the ways, if anybody has received anything from dr xin recently let us know dont be shy, we are all waiting, ed.


----------



## Quaddy

ed, how come i dont *recall* (_thats not to say you werent!_) seeing you on this thread a year+ ago?

 i'll have what youre having in terms of your optimism damn you!!

 hehe


----------



## zackhugh

Hey ed,

 It's been cold here recently. At night it gets down into the 60's. Brrrr! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway, I'm really enjoying the (now consistently) great sound from my Ref. It'll be approaching 1000 hours of burn-in soon and I can turn off my transistor radio and stop rotating my Eneloop batteries in the charger.

 I hope you all can get your amps soon. I do believe you'll like them. Until the backlog shrinks I don't think I'll be sending mine in for an upgrade. Looks like that'll be a while.


----------



## james444

Quote:


 Wed, 21 Jan 2009 23:15:41 -0800
 "Xin Feng" <support@fixup.net>
 Package Shipped to You 39080469

 SuperMicro-IV BK
 A package was shipped to you on 01/22/2009 via U.S. Postal Service Express 
 

Ordered 19 Jul 2007.

 "But for those who love Time is not." (Henry Van Dyke)


----------



## clasam

Supermicro ordered Jan 19, 2009. Hmmm...its almost Superbowl time...maybe we should do a Superbowl-like bet on who will receive theirs & when. That could make things interesting. lol.


----------



## mrarroyo

OK, today I was able to get together w/ vorlon1 to test the various boards. First we tested the first batch and he as well as my wife and I chose the B board as the best sounding. Next we tested the C2 and the B2 and as I recall the C2 was the best followed by the B2 an then the B.

 Once I receive the B3 and C3 boards the burn-in followed by testing will continue.


----------



## aluren

I ordered a Supermicro on 7/24/07 and just received it today on 1/24/09, which is exactly 18 months. Very impressive little amp. It is on par with my fully burned in Predator (around 1,000 hours). Will see how it fares when it's burned in a little more. But so far so good, I'm one semi-happy customer (being pissed off for 1.5 yrs of wait). lol... and sorry for the crappy iphone pics...


----------



## PhaedrusX

mrarroyo, have you noticed any correlation between increased output power of the different versions and increased gain settings?

 channel imbalance at low volumes concerns me, but if all the different boards operate at the same gain, it would at least eliminate one consideration when choosing a version.


----------



## Quaddy

congrats aluren, you had a long wait, glad the amp is performing well so early on, it will only get better too!!!


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_congrats aluren, you had a long wait, glad the amp is performing well so early on, it will only get better too!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

2X, I would give away a kidney to hear what sort of improvement the new SuperMicro-IV have to offer. From the look of it, I guess yours is looming near...


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered a Supermicro on 7/24/07 and just received it today on 1/24/09, which is exactly 18 months. Very impressive little amp. It is on par with my fully burned in Predator (around 1,000 hours). Will see how it fares when it's burned in a little more. But so far so good, I'm one semi-happy customer (being pissed off for 1.5 yrs of wait). lol... and sorry for the crappy iphone pics...

 [http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...hi/photo-1.jpg

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k2...phi/photo2.jpg_

 

Glad to see you haver received the Supermicro. Once I have money I will pick one up, IMO it was the best sounding portable amp when vorlon1 and I did the 35-40 portable amp shootoug a few months ago.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo, have you noticed any correlation between increased output power of the different versions and increased gain settings?

 channel imbalance at low volumes concerns me, but if all the different boards operate at the same gain, it would at least eliminate one consideration when choosing a version._

 

I have not heard any channel imbalance amongst the various Reference boards.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Glad to see you haver received the Supermicro. Once I have money I will pick one up, IMO it was the best sounding portable amp when vorlon1 and I did the 35-40 portable amp shootoug a few months ago.
_

 

That's good to know, makes me less likely to cancel my order from last year...


----------



## aluren

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Glad to see you haver received the Supermicro. Once I have money I will pick one up, IMO it was the best sounding portable amp when vorlon1 and I did the 35-40 portable amp shootoug a few months ago._

 

yes i remembered that review, it was very well done and it was the main reason why i ordered a supermicro! i'm still amazed at the size of this thing, it looks more like a sound attenuator than an amp! even more amazing that it sounds this good! 

 i asked xin whether his current supermicro has any updates since releasing the reference and of course, he did not respond. does anyone know?


----------



## DennyL

He's getting near to my order number and every time I check there are more versions to choose between. Is it: A, B, B2, B3, C, C1 C2, C3, D, D1. Have I got that right? Have I missed any out? Have any of those fallen by the wayside? I'm sure the situation is very straighforward, with only a bit of help I can make a decision.....


----------



## Quaddy

i know the feeling and am in a similar position to you, i have instructed xin to proceed with the D1 for myself, simply so its versatile in whatever cans i throw at it (within reason!)

 i guess the T2 will be around by the time i get shipping notice!!


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yes i remembered that review, it was very well done and it was the main reason why i ordered a supermicro! i'm still amazed at the size of this thing, it looks more like a sound attenuator than an amp! even more amazing that it sounds this good! 

 i asked xin whether his current supermicro has any updates since releasing the reference and of course, he did not respond. does anyone know?_

 

I'd like to know too. I also emailed Xin with the same question (and included the SuperMacro too) and he did not respond. Glad to know I am not alone!

 I'll email him again...eternal optimist that I am!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_yes i remembered that review, it was very well done and it was the main reason why i ordered a supermicro! i'm still amazed at the size of this thing, it looks more like a sound attenuator than an amp! even more amazing that it sounds this good! 

 i asked xin whether his current supermicro has any updates since releasing the reference and of course, he did not respond. does anyone know?_

 

The first Beta Reference was released around May of 2007. As I recall there have been upgrades to the line as a result of the development of the Reference over the last 18 months. However I can not recall any specifics on the Supermicro. Sorry.


----------



## mrarroyo

Well, today I compared the B2 and the C2 w/ 350 hours of burn in a piece. The B2 is more open, has a wider soundstage and it is very clear.

 The C2 has a lot of punch, it is much more in your face and it is faster. I can see this being a very fun combination to have.

 It is funny how 100 hours of additional burn in can shift the perception of this two models. To me this validates my previous perception that Xin amps as well as other vendors who use a large cap (22,000 uF) take well over 800 hours of burn in, maybe 1,200 hours.

 Today I also received the B3 and C3 boards. They are burning in as we speak and I plan to meet w/ vorlon1 on Saturday 1/31 to review all these boards. Sadly the B3 and C3 will only have about 60 hours of burn in.


----------



## peta10dye

mrarroyo, just wondered if you can point me to a link for that 30-40 portable amp shootout, I can't seem to find it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Apologies if it's in an obvious place, would appreciate the nudge though


----------



## peta10dye

By the way all, does anyone think it's wise putting in a new order for a Xin Supermini IV at the moment, or is just best to wait till production flow improves 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Only ask cause I've got an older Supermini 3, prior to last 4 channel updates, which I've really loved and have been thinking of updating for over last +1yr, ended up getting the fantastic Mustang P51 instead 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But still interested in Xin and his amps, if he's likely to be a bit more reliable on the production front


----------



## nc8000

He does seem to be producing a little but he has not yet reached my order number for a new SuperMini that I placed in the late autumn of 2007 so draw your own conclusion. I have now cancelled that order as it finally exceeded my patience. A shame really as I don't doubt that it would be very good if it would have ever turned up but I no longer need an amp like it.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *peta10dye* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_By the way all, does anyone think it's wise putting in a new order for a Xin Supermini IV at the moment, or is just best to wait till production flow improves 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Only ask cause I've got an older Supermini 3, prior to last 4 channel updates, which I've really loved and have been thinking of updating for over last +1yr, ended up getting the fantastic Mustang P51 instead 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But still interested in Xin and his amps, if he's likely to be a bit more reliable on the production front 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Are you nuts????????.......said jokingly!


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *peta10dye* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_mrarroyo, just wondered if you can point me to a link for that 30-40 portable amp shootout, I can't seem to find it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Apologies if it's in an obvious place, would appreciate the nudge though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Here it is, however it has not been updated in a very long time. Heck I have owned tested at least 10 more portable amps since the last update. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/3...review-250223/


----------



## nc8000

That anybody could find the time and spare the effort to do that shootout is just amazing. Imagine how much work has gone into that given the quality of the comparisons


----------



## ed lynch

I only started posting in recently quaddy, though i have followed all the threads, as for my optimism im not sure, id probably call it self delusion xinitis, ed.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That anybody could find the time and spare the effort to do that shootout is just amazing. Imagine how much work has gone into that given the quality of the comparisons_

 

Thanks, if referring to the thread I posted.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks, if referring to the thread I posted._

 

I did indeed and the amount of time in general you put into testing and reporting on all these amps. I find it imensly valuable.


----------



## peta10dye

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Here it is, however it has not been updated in a very long time. Heck I have owned tested at least 10 more portable amps since the last update. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f105/3...review-250223/_

 

Thanks mate, nice1, appreciate it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Fantastic work thanks for your effort, think we all greatly appreciate it


----------



## LingLing1337

So, does anyone have an estimate on how long it would take for me to receive a Xin Supermicro IV if I ordered one this week?


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LingLing1337* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So, does anyone have an estimate on how long it would take for me to receive a Xin Supermicro IV if I ordered one this week?_


----------



## Quaddy

haha, fair cop!!

 what an admin being flippant and not being helpful? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 you are looking at at least a year and a half, most likely longer.

 i am at 18months if thats any '_reference_'

 only other option, snag one when one comes up of the for sale forums once every blue moon!


----------



## immtbiker

How dare you accuse me of ever being helpful! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I like especially like the flippant part. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 In this case, unfortunately, I'm being accurate (except for the lucky few).


----------



## LingLing1337

Damn, that's too bad. Anything that comes close to the performance-->price ratio of the SuperMicro IV? I assume the Corda Headsix/XXS is next up on that scale?


----------



## DennyL

I can't decide what's best to do. I have ordered a Reference and he is very near to my order number but, with all these variations on the As and Bs and Cs and Ds being sent out to the privileged ones, I assume he's in development mode and not shipping. I'd quite like the dust to settle and see some opinions on these versions before I email him my choice. On the other hand I don't want him suddenly to ship to me the default choice. I think I want a B, but it's a bit early to be sure. Amazing that ofter 18 months of waiting I'm saying I want him to hold back and not ship just yet....


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *LingLing1337* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Damn, that's too bad. Anything that comes close to the performance-->price ratio of the SuperMicro IV? I assume the Corda Headsix/XXS is next up on that scale?_

 

EFN seems to like the MiniBox E+ a whole lot but that is a fair bit bigger. For the size perhaps an iBasso T4 assuming it comes back in stock when they are back from New Years holliday.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nc8000* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_EFN seems to like the MiniBox E+ a whole lot but that is a fair bit bigger......_

 

"like a whole lot" is an understatement actually. After two years craving and believing in Xin amps, the MiniBox-E+ has indeed dislodged my all time favorite SuperMicro-IV from the top padestal and it is not something easy for me to swallow. I was almost on the verge of pulling a trigger on a spanking new SuperMicro-IV 2008 a couple of days ago when a French Head-Fier decided to sell it off un-used for $230.00, but a quick listen to my MiniBox-E+ stalled me every time.......

 My hope with Xin amp is the 12V version of Xin Reference and I will cling to my order no matter how long it takes.

 PS: The MiniBox-E+ is thinner than most amps even if it's wider.


----------



## DennyL

Where can you actually buy a Minibox E+?


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Where can you actually buy a Minibox E+?_

 

A week just before Chinese new year, I know that three Head-Fiers have purchased the last three that Head-Direct have in stock. Head-Direct and TTVJ is expecting new stocks after Chinese New Year, I assume that the amp maker will then start making new batches


----------



## ed lynch

Im sitting in here at the moment its snowing, i thought when wind and rain had abated, id get a chance to repair my sheds wasnt to be, never mind, sorry im getting off the point, it was mentioned recently more xin options are being tested it could be probably 6 or 8 options, at the moment, leaves me again in a quandry, not a laundry, though i feel im spinning around, however, where will it end , i mean customers waiting wise, i know he loves r&d, ed


----------



## ed lynch

Just a thought, recently, suppose xin computer went down for a bit after all he was off stream for a bit, and we were all all in place, in case he lost our orders on stream, or vanished? and he is waiting on us to remind him, just think he has 100 units to dispatch but cant find the original invoice, is it us to remind him again just i case(suppose he cant find original order) ed


----------



## aluren

you can always remind him... but he does keep a log of orders somewhere, i can assure you because mine's been a year and half before it was delivered to me. i was suprised he actually remembered.


----------



## ed lynch

Hello aluren, thanks, when did you receive your amp from dr xin , was it recently, just trying to get a timeframe, on his present deliveries, which version did you receive,micro or reference, mini or whatever, maybe i will email him my order ref no invoice, just in case, could be a good idea, ed


----------



## aluren

I ordered a Supermicro on 7/24/07 and just received it on 1/24/09


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *aluren* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered a Supermicro on 7/24/07 and just received it on 1/24/09_

 

congratulations aluren, long wait indeed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 today is my 18 month anniversary.


----------



## Nailzs

17 months the first of this month for me.


----------



## ed lynch

I ordered mine just checking dates, on sept 24th 2007 a micro and reference certainly a long time waiting i guess his timeframe is to be expected, surely he should state that on his website,anyway im listening to my creek obh 21se at the moment and no complaints the sound is pure and liquid, its not a portable amp.has good mains transformer, at the same time,my c&c xo has enough juice too,using grado 80,and 225,ed


----------



## mrarroyo

Hi I just did a comparison of the B, B3, and C3 boards. The top end on the B which I used to love sounds harsh in comparison w/ the B3 and C3.

 Of the two newer boards I prefer the C3 closely followed by the B3 so I will give them another 160 hours of burn in which should put them in the over 500 hours.

 The B3 compared w/ the C3 has a more mellow presentation yet the treble sounds better (smoother and with a bit more detail) in the C3. Can't explain it. Also the bass in the C3 has more punch and overall a bit more power, yet it should last close to 200 hours per four AAA batteries.

 Either one would be an awesome unit. Note: Did not compare w/ the B2 or the C2 since Dr. Xin sent me an email indicating they were not stable under certain conditions which is the reason for the B3 and C3 boards.


----------



## EFN

mrarroyo, I think the key to finalize the Reference sound lies in getting that combo which resembles SR-71 and MiniBox-E+ combined. If Xin can hit that sweet spot between those two amp I believe we will have a real killer. The C3 does seems to be heading that way, so perhaps you should tell Xin to continue working on that one. Cheers.


----------



## mrarroyo

EFN I have sent Dr. Xin an email to let him know what I think of the C3 and B3.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks lads for doing the correlation and testing ,myarro,efn, in the meantime the delivery date is getting extended, not to mention worry all those waiting, perhaps he might even dispatch some units soon even 1st generation amps, again i know dr xin loves r&d now i dont know myself which version to go for, ed.


----------



## ed lynch

HAVING SAID THAT, THE EVALUATION IS ON GOING IT MIGHT NEVER END BECAUSE EVERY TIME WE SWITCH ON AND WONDER THERE IS MORE TO APPRECIATE AND DECIPHER AND IN THE MEANTIME WILL WE NEVER KNOW WHEN DR XIN ACTUALLY EVEN RELEASE ONE OF HIS MASTERPICES TO US ORDINALY MERE MORTALS ,ED


----------



## mrarroyo

I received an email from Dr. Xin. He indicated he is close to finalizing the Reference design, hope it is correct so all those expecting their amp get it.


----------



## PhaedrusX

according to recent emails from Dr. Xin, version B will now become the standard default version, replacing both the original and version A.

 version C will sound similar, but with a slight increase in power.

 version D will have the most power, but will use a different chip-set that sounds less "tube-like" than the other versions.

 of course, given Xin's capricious nature, season all information with salt.

 hope this helps anyone still trying to untangle this web.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I received an email from Dr. Xin. He indicated he is close to finalizing the Reference design, hope it is correct so all those expecting their amp get it._

 

Thank you, Miguel. With Dr Xin's communication being what it is we would be in an even worse situation without you.


----------



## EFN

Yeah. I think mrarroyo deserves a huge thanks from us. Imagine Dr. Xin doing all the dev himself - it will be just before doomsday that he's be able to finalize the amps LOL


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_according to recent emails from Dr. Xin, version B will now become the standard default version, replacing both the original and version A.

 version C will sound similar, but with a slight increase in power.

 version D will have the most power, but will use a different chip-set that sounds less "tube-like" than the other versions.

 of course, given Xin's capricious nature, season all information with salt.

 hope this helps anyone still trying to untangle this web._

 

be nice if there was somewhere he posted the fact that D was less tubey, if that is indeed the case, instead of solely broadcasting that upon request in a private email, if he has stated that publicly i havent seen it.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks mrarroyo, its good to know his new standard version of the reference amp will be up and running shortly, i think most people waiting for orig version will be heartened with the news of even better sound, once again thank you for your patience and time evaluating all those amps, so maybe if i leave my original order in place i my still receive someday a good sounding unit,ed


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *PhaedrusX* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_according to recent emails from Dr. Xin, version B will now become the standard default version, replacing both the original and version A.

 version C will sound similar, but with a slight increase in power.

 version D will have the most power, but will use a different chip-set that sounds less "tube-like" than the other versions.

 of course, given Xin's capricious nature, season all information with salt.

 hope this helps anyone still trying to untangle this web._

 

I'm assuming that the B and C versions are the B3 and C3 versions that Miguel is currently evaluating?

 Any word on the Home Edition?


----------



## ed lynch

Hello myarro Does it really mean we can expect his xin latest version unit to receive sorry if im repeiting myself and waiting i think i look happy in waiting hopefully it could be, ed


----------



## ed lynch

I THINK MYSELF SOMETHING MIGHT HAPPEND SHORTLY FOR ALL VERSIONS SHORTLY YOURS ED,


----------



## mrarroyo

I exchanged emails a couple of days ago w/ Dr. Xin. He was a bit cryptic, and it sounded like the tweaking was about to end for the Reference. However do not quote me, it was a very succinct email.

 On a different end the C3 is sounding mighty nice! Next Saturday I may be able to meet w/ vorlon1 and go over a few portable amps.


----------



## Quaddy

heres a nice little selfish post pertaining to my own circumstances....

_i am in the uk and placed order in august 07 for contextual purposes._

 at the time ordered the reference its price equated to £137/$279.99 approx

 now it equates to £197 approx

 differential of £60/$85 approx

 at the time i ordered a supermicro at $169.99 it equated to £83 approx

 now it equates to £120 approx

 difference of £37/$52 approx

 as i ordered two supermicros and one reference i am now paying £134/$190 approx more on my purchases

 so to look at in one way i get charged £134/$190 for the pleasure of waiting circa 2 years for items 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 in other words you dont end up paying what you checkout with at that time.

 those prices arent even including deivery and case options etc

 no point in anyone chiming in saying you can always cancel, or xin could have increased his price also to meet the financial tide, i am aware of that and i accept what i describe above, i just wanted to air that side of things, rather than the amp technology itself.

 thanks.


----------



## dazzer1975

Exactly the same position as you, I am waiting for a reference, a macro and a supermicro.

 Seriously thinking of sending the email to cancel.

 Especially considering I am happy with my portable amps and would rather buy another pico, voyager and iqube v2 when that arrives.

 The new prices means the xin amps can't compete imo.


----------



## mackay maus

I feel your pain. I ordered my reference when the CAD dollar was at par with the USD. Now its less than 80 cents.


----------



## nc8000

This is one situation where the much debated payPal payment would have been preferable provided the amps ever ship


----------



## Gatsu

When I ordered mine the US$ was around AUS$0.97 so I ordered via paypal.
 I have cursed myself a number of times since then. Now I'm back to wondering if maybe I did the right thing.


----------



## BigTony

Maybe the credit crunch will be over by the time the amps ship....


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dazzer1975* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The new prices means the xin amps can't compete imo._

 

I don't agree with this. The price of the Reference is roughly the same as a Tomahawk and cheaper than a Headamp AE-2. When I heard a Reference I thought it was outstanding, and on a par with some home amps, and according to Mrarroyo there has been further improvement in SQ. Many believe that Dr Xin has a good ear when it comes to sound quality. We can reasonably hope that the Reference will be one of the best-sounding portable amps, having a good battery life and the possibility fo 1/4" jack sockets, which is unique in portables.

 I'm in the UK and for me the price has gone from £150 to £210. This is still not a bad price for what I expect the Reference to be, if I ever see one. I'm keeping my order in and crossing my fingers.


----------



## nc8000

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dazzer1975* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The new prices means the xin amps can't compete imo._

 

Exactly as DennyL says, Xin's price in dollars hasn't changed so is still in the same place compared to other US manufacturers so the only valid comparison would be to compare with something from your own country in your local currency like Graham Slee amps. Your problem in UK is that the pound has plumeted even more than the dollar. In Euros the Xin amp (and all dollar amps) are actually slightly cheaper than they were 18 months ago and in Denmark the exchange rate (I think) is back at about what it was 18 months ago (but has been a lot lower so if shipped about 3-6 months ago would have been a lot cheaper than 18 months ago) so no price change at all. This is what always happens when you deal in currencies. It still sucks that it has taken so long though.


----------



## dazzer1975

my order cost would have been in the region of £450, it is now in the region of £700

 Plus I can buy from anyone else and get the amp at the price I am expecting to pay from anywhere in the world as everyone else I have dealt with I have received the goods in the expected time frame.

 For those manufacturers I waited for, I had trust in them to pay cash before the order was ready.

 Like I say, for me, xin amps have gone up to a level where they can't compete.

 CYA


----------



## BushGuy

Today, I received that magical. mystical email from Dr. Xin - both my Supermini IV, and my Reference B (with 2in's/2out's) have been shipped home to me. WOWEE!!!!! .......they'll be able to re-join their friends.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Today, I received that magical. mystical email from Dr. Xin - both my Supermini IV, and my Reference B (with 2in's/2out's) have been shipped home to me. WOWEE!!!!! .......they'll be able to re-join their friends._

 


 good news, congratulations. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 lets hope he's working onward and upward through the order numbers still...


----------



## BushGuy

I received both amps yesterday, and had asked Dr. Xin to make my Beta version into a "B". So, after it arrived, I asked the Dr. which B I got. He says it is the "B5 FINAL". So, FWIW, he is considering this as what he'll produce as the B version Reference.
 While not really able to go into specifics because of time/memory issues, I found a real significant difference between the sound of the Supermini IV I sent him, and the one I got back. The latest Supermini, to me, is easily superior to the v. IV I sent.......I combine it with Klipsch X10/Nano 1st gen. in both instances. No time for serious listening, and have not played with the jumpers.....yet.


----------



## LionPlushie

Hows the Reference B? i just ordered a Reference C, i do hope that C got huge soundstage and punchy bass as compared to B.


----------



## BushGuy

While I just received Reference B5 version and just starting burn-in.............Miguel (mrarroyo) has gotten to 260 hours on his B5, and C5 - he's finding (at this point) that "B5 version is mellow w/ a wide soundstage. The C5 is faster and more in your face". Pls keep in mind you really want to get to 1,000 hours to come to a fully accurate appraisal of their qualities and this is merely a prelim. finding - a 22,000uf capacitor is used and it takes time. I plugged my "semi-vintage" Grado RS-1/flats into mine yesterday........and it promises to be a real sweet combo.


----------



## clasam

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_While I just received Reference B5 version and just starting burn-in.............Pls keep in mind you really want to get to 1,000 hours to come to a fully accurate appraisal of their qualities and this is merely a prelim. finding - a 22,000uf capacitor is used and it takes time._

 

Nice....look forward to the review


----------



## Quaddy

19 month anniversary since order today.


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_19 month anniversary since order today._

 

Wow !!! Has it really been that long? 

 Today would also have been the same anniversary for me as well, if i hadn't of canceled my order a few months ago. 

 Time really does fly by on waiting for stuff like this, hopefully it wont be much longer before your enjoying some xin goodness


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow !!! Has it really been that long? 

 Today would also have been the same anniversary for me as well, if i hadn't of canceled my order a few months ago. 

 Time really does fly by on waiting for stuff like this, hopefully it wont be much longer before your enjoying some xin goodness 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

hey dude, indeed it has been that long, and yeah you and i were same day orderers i seem to remember!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 you can alwways re-invoke your order and place in the queue


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Pls keep in mind you really want to get to 1,000 hours to come to a fully accurate appraisal of their qualities and this is merely a prelim._

 

1000 hours = 6 weeks. Just to get started!


----------



## Quaddy

lol, its a lot of time, i now use the 1000 hour figure myself accross the board for all things than need burn in time, i think after owning a teflon vcap, and lisnalee will testify to this, those needed a huge ammount of time, and so i just use that rather than having to juggle different figures around

 but i listen to my stuff during burn in anyway to appreciate the journey, theres no way i would wait 6 weeks without listening after waiting nigh on 2 years


----------



## BushGuy

Usually, I do the same as many others (plug into radio w/headphones for load and let them play, play, play). This time it sounds soo good that I'm only playing when I want to listen.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_19 month anniversary since order today._

 

I, too, have today as the 19th monthly anniversary of my Reference order.

 It's hard for me to tell, are we having fun yet? Wait, I just wiped the layer of grunge off the cover glass of my (analog) Fun-Meter .... yup, pegged out!!!

 Happy Anniversary!


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I, too, have today as the 19th monthly anniversary of my Reference order.

 It's hard for me to tell, *are we having fun yet?* Wait, I just wiped the layer of grunge off the cover glass of my (analog) Fun-Meter .... yup, pegged out!!!

 Happy Anniversary!_

 

not quite yet for me, maybe in another 4-6 months! no way near enough abuse yet

 happy anniversay to you too, and all other members of the xin martyr brigade


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_you can alwways re-invoke your order and place in the queue 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Lol !! if he decides to build a DAC inside i might just have to do that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_lol, its a lot of time, i now use the 1000 hour figure myself accross the board for all things than need burn in time, i think after owning a teflon vcap, and lisnalee will testify to this, those needed a huge amount of time, and so i just use that rather than having to juggle different figures around

 but i listen to my stuff during burn in anyway to appreciate the journey, there's no way i would wait 6 weeks without listening after waiting nigh on 2 years 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Ahh yes the good old days of the vcap burning cycle 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I'm definitely a believer in burn in, and do like to give equipment a least a few hundred hours before deciding if its a keeper or not.

 But if i had waited this long on the reference i'd be plugging it in as soon as it landed also.


----------



## DennyL

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Lol !! if he decides to build a DAC inside i might just have to do that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

If it takes him this long to develop an amp (I ordered in Sept 2007 and still waiting), how long would it take him to develop a DAC?? I think there would be no hope of having it in this lifetime.


----------



## BushGuy

Xin Martyr Brigade?................Not a very euphonious name for your organization. Does this mean non-members will be reading coded (unbeknownst to them) posts on Head Fi - in iBoffo (fantasy amp) threads? Do you guys indulge in self-flagellation aka hours of Ultrasone listening?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If it takes him this long to develop an amp (I ordered in Sept 2007 and still waiting), how long would it take him to develop a DAC?? I think there would be no hope of having it in this lifetime._

 

Imagine how many combinations of DAC & AMP that would have to be tested?
 DAC A1-A5, B1-B5, C1-C5, D1-D5, (Home Editions anyone?)
 AMP A1-A5, B1-B5, C1-C5, D1-D5 (and the Home Versions?)
 It'd require a whole TEAM (batallion?) of mrarroyo's!!!


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *DennyL* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If it takes him this long to develop an amp (I ordered in Sept 2007 and still waiting), how long would it take him to develop a DAC?? I think there would be no hope of having it in this lifetime._

 

I guess in the case of Xin you would be measuring the wait in decades, rather than years for sure.

 In the meantime i'll _make do_ with the pico


----------



## BushGuy

I have Pico amp/dac. plus latest updated Xin Supermini IV, and Xin Reference v.B5...........very happy with all of them. To me, it's what 'phones you use with them. My Pico amp/dac is paired with iMod/UE Triple Fi (or also Joe Grado HP2 at home). Xin Reference B5 is paired with 32ohm Darths (they're brighter than the usual Darths). The Xin Supermini IV I pair with 1st gen.Nano/Klipsch Images.


----------



## jamato8

So how do you like the Xin amps compared to the Pico. Not a one is better but what differences do you notice, if you care to do that.


----------



## htotsuka

I have a question. anyone answer my question, please

 I already paied money to Dr.Xin by Paypal.
 Indeed, my credit card is charged.
 However, I have not accepted any response from Dr. Xin.

 Isn't he honesty, or is he so busy?


----------



## jamato8

I have not known of anyone not to get there money back or a product. If you don't want the amp he will refund your money.


----------



## htotsuka

Thank, jamato8.

 I want Dr.Xin's amp, which is very attractive to me.
 But I want to get some response from Dr.Xin, because I don't confirm that my order arrives to Dr.Xin.


----------



## jamato8

I understand. He doesn't always respond very well. I would email him again and put in the subject line that you have ordered and would like a response. 

 Order placed, please respond.


----------



## htotsuka

Thank, jamat8.

 I will wait for respons from Dr.Xin.

 Regards.


----------



## qusp

so is it true?? is the good doctor finally finished beta on the reference and actually shipping with some regularity?? and do you actually have any control over what version you get?? because it seems from what i've read that people sending amps in for updates really dont have much of an idea exactly what version they will end up with. also you can still choose 1/4" jack plus mini jack yes??


----------



## BushGuy

I asked him to update my Beta Reference from last year to B, and he did. When he received it on Jan 6th - I don't think the B5 board had even been built. What he sent me turned out the most current board and what he has finalized to - B5. If I'd asked for C, or H - that's what it would have been. I don't understand, qusp, how you have gotten the idea that people don't get exactly what they've ordered, or requested.
 Since prices were posted, last year, the dual in's (and/or out's) have been an extra-cost option.........it's all there on his Fixup.net site, on his "Good Stuff" page. I find the dual out's handy so that I don't have to search for an adapter eg. if I want to plug in my RS-1.


----------



## qusp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I asked him to update my Beta Reference from last year to B, and he did. When he received it on Jan 6th - I don't think the B5 board had even been built. What he sent me turned out the most current board and what he has finalized to - B5. If I'd asked for C, or H - that's what it would have been. I don't understand, qusp, how you have gotten the idea that people don't get exactly what they've ordered, or requested.
 Since prices were posted, last year, the dual in's (and/or out's) have been an extra-cost option.........it's all there on his Fixup.net site, on his "Good Stuff" page. I find the dual out's handy so that I don't have to search for an adapter eg. if I want to plug in my RS-1._

 

I think you misunderstood me; or I didnt communicate effectively. what i'm referring to is that when they make an order and at the time of order the reference is in say version B and then by the time he delivers in say 18 months time; what they get delivered is version D. which may or may not be exactly what you wanted. the extra jacks I think is a great idea; no drama with that. was just asking.


----------



## jamato8

I just got the new Mini. Some of the best bass I have ever heard from a portable. Such a tiny amp with solid authoritative bass.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got the new Mini. Some of the best bass I have ever heard from a portable. Such a tiny amp with solid authoritative bass._

 

Which makes me want to give the Mini another shot. I have been quite critical to the 2008 SuperMini-IV against the MiniBox-E+. But I reckon that if the SuperMini-IV is tweaked a bit with the right opamps, they will sing superbly as well.....


----------



## jamato8

I need to let mine burn in as right now there is too much bass. If new caps I can understand if not. . . . well I have to wait and see.

 Well 8 hours later and the bass is settling and back more to a normal integrated bass. More time needed now.


----------



## BushGuy

Jamato8 - Curious, since mine is update (AD8616/24261) - what opamps are in your new one?


----------



## jamato8

Mine has the same opamps.

 Wow, after 24 hours the amp has changed. Much more detail etc. I asked Xin if the caps were changed in my Mini but I haven't heard back as I was wondering why the bass was great and then got muddy and now it has come back. Hard to say. I know opamps take a 
 little while also.

 The bass has really firmed up, very nice. The D10 still has more "air" and an open presentation as in "live" music.


----------



## shino

Normally how long I have to wait？
 I just order a supermicro IV yesterday.


----------



## Quaddy

hi there, you should get it in about 2 years time give or take a few months. i ordered in aug 07 and am still waiting.


----------



## shino

All right i will try to forget it
 OMG.......


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hi there, you should get it in about 2 years time give or take a few months. i ordered in aug 07 and am still waiting._

 

Same month I ordered mine. And despite numerous emails to XIn--and virtually no responses--I've moved on.


----------



## qusp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *shino* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_All right i will try to forget it
 OMG......._

 

wow you really didnt do your research did you??


----------



## shino

I know order a Dr. xin's amp will make me wait for a long time. Couple month ago I heard that someone receive Dr. xin's amp I thought he continue accomplish his order.


----------



## wangch

got my shipping notice yesterday He is sending my Reference, hopefully thats good news for people who ordered in Aug 07, thats when I ordered mine


----------



## shino

congratulations
 I have reference before it's a wonderful APM I like it so much. Especially with ER4B.
 Which version you choose?


----------



## wangch

from what Miguel says sounds like the C board the solid tube version, it says solid tube on my invoice , which version did you choose?


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *wangch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_from what Miguel says sounds like the C board the solid tube version, it says solid tube on my invoice , which version did you choose?_

 

Did the shipping notice just show up one day or were you contacted in advance about which version you wanted?


----------



## Quaddy

hmm, i was under impression unless you contacted xin, you would get the default, which IIRC was 'B'


----------



## shino

I got my reference one year ago so at that time I don’t have version to choose.
 my reference's capacitance is 11000uf


----------



## Peyotero

Heh if I'd order an amp and had to wait for it 2 years, I'd probably convince myself it should sound better then sex by the time it arives


----------



## wangch

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tha_dude* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Did the shipping notice just show up one day or were you contacted in advance about which version you wanted?_

 

wasnt contacted in advance, its the Final C version,the default right now


----------



## zackhugh

I was thinking about sending in my Reference (I guess I have an "A" model) for an upgrade. Two questions:

 1. In this thread were there elaborated differences between the B, C, and D models after the boards were a little more burned in (500+ hours)? I'm not sure which to go with. Seems like C unless I want either more battery life or more power.

 2. If I do send in the amp for an upgrade, are the caps replaced? Will I have to burn in a new set?

 Thanks for any informed opinion(s)


----------



## tnmike1

I should think the larger question would be: how long am I going to be without an amp? And how many emails will I send with no responses whatsoever while waiting for said amp?? Sure you want to do this???


----------



## zackhugh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I should think the larger question would be: how long am I going to be without an amp? And how many emails will I send with no responses whatsoever while waiting for said amp?? Sure you want to do this???_

 

No, actually, I'm not sure. I have a backup amp but it doesn't sound nearly as good and I don't know if the time uncertainty in getting the Ref back is worth it. In an earlier post someone mentioned that upgrades get done pretty quickly, but of course "quickly" is relative.


----------



## l1f35ux

you guys have to wait that long

 I thought about getting Xin Supermacro IV too

 However, I gave up because of this thread


----------



## kc3dl

uugh.. this is really disheartening! I keep hoping the wait would get shorter, not longer. I reeeeeeaaaalllly want a Supermicro IV for my gym rig!!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

In January he replied to an email that my Super Micro IV would ship in about one month - I changed the order to a Super Mini IV after that with no response to two emails. I just figure it will be a nice surprise when it shows up, and might replace my iBasso T4. If a Super Micro shows up instead of the Super Mini, I'll end up selling it.


----------



## Surrealsky

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In January he replied to an email that my Super Micro IV would ship in about one month - I changed the order to a Super Mini IV after that with no response to two emails. I just figure it will be a nice surprise when it shows up, and might replace my iBasso T4. If a Super Micro shows up instead of the Super Mini, I'll end up selling it._

 

Larry i have a couple of questions, do you think it's a good idea for me to purchase a xin reference and pair it with my iriver via optical to d10 and then to the xin reference? The d10 will act as a dac and the xin as an amp. viable?


----------



## Surrealsky

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *jamato8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just got the new Mini. Some of the best bass I have ever heard from a portable. Such a tiny amp with solid authoritative bass._

 

John have you tried using the d10 as a dac via the xin amp?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Surrealsky* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Larry i have a couple of questions, do you think it's a good idea for me to purchase a xin reference and pair it with my iriver via optical to d10 and then to the xin reference? The d10 will act as a dac and the xin as an amp. viable?_

 

I would not bother with that myself - I would just use the D10 and if you need a different sound from the amp try some other opamps. I'd be perfectly happy with the stock D10 in that setup.


----------



## Surrealsky

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would not bother with that myself - I would just use the D10 and if you need a different sound from the amp try some other opamps. I'd be perfectly happy with the stock D10 in that setup._

 

ok thanks larry! saved my wallet


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Surrealsky* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ok thanks larry! saved my wallet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

...and your patience


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I would not bother with that myself - I would just use the D10 and if you need a different sound from the amp try some other opamps. I'd be perfectly happy with the stock D10 in that setup._

 

Larry, if you ever want to take your reviews of audio gear to a wider public forum, consider the title, "The Frugal Audiophile" - that nothing unneccesary is purchased, kept or recommended and hence, waste is minimized in achieving a desired goal. The advice offered above is a good example. This frugality seems to me to characterize your gear acquisition, use and recommendations - including your higher-end, costlier gear as well. It adds real value to your assessments.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Larry, if you ever want to take your reviews of audio gear to a wider public forum, consider the title, "The Frugal Audiophile" - that nothing unneccesary is purchased, kept or recommended and hence, waste is minimized in achieving a desired goal. The advice offered above is a good example. This frugality seems to me to characterize your gear acquisition, use and recommendations - including your higher-end, costlier gear as well. It adds real value to your assessments._

 

Thanks. Just recently I tried talking Blutarsky into not getting a used maxed Woo GES for his Stax O2 Mk1, and to just use a nice inexpensive speaker amp with his SRD-7 Mk2 transformer. Then I made him listen to both rigs and I think he agrees that maybe the extra $2000 expense could be used elsewhere if needed. 

 I like to get the best bang for my buck, and while I do have one stat rig with source/amp/phones and cables that cost me $6000, I have also been known to suggest a more modest iBasso D10 with Westone ES3X that comes close in sound quality, immersion and enjoyment.


----------



## Nailzs

19 months and not a word, but I really don't expect it.


----------



## htotsuka

Please report your situation,e.g. order date, shipment date,ets.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *htotsuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Please report your situation,e.g. order date, shipment date,ets._

 

thats what this thread was originally for, but as orders are so few and far between, and with the huge delay, people dont post and interest is lost, some have posted a few months back, but quiet since....


----------



## htotsuka

Does anyone accept Dr.Xin's amp wihin few mouths?


----------



## htotsuka

I would like to know Dr.Xin's standing point.
 Now he is developer mode or productor mode?


----------



## Quaddy

have you tried here, thats xins forum where there are supposed updates to the shipping number etc


----------



## htotsuka

Web site, whidh you teach, have not updated almost.
 I don't get useful information from this Web site, and
 Dr.Xin did not update since 09/01/21.
 I have not accepted any information from Dr.Xin.
 I paied a cost by PayPal, so he should send confirmation email.
 Am I wrong???


----------



## Quaddy

your own paypal system should have provided an automated receipt email stating that you just sent payment for however much, doesnt matter though, evidence for this is in your account for xin transaction

 but not really expect email from xin, i have only heard a few time from him in two years so its ok, but credit card may have been better as you wouldnt have paid upfront

 i expect a new batch of people receiving in the next month, at least i hope so, and that should be me


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_have you tried here, thats xins forum where there are supposed updates to the shipping number etc_

 

It really is unfortunate that the "Currently shipping" order number has not budged from the 39143495 since 1/22/2009, even though we've seen a few posts since then that orders have been shipped. I recently posted to that thread, asking that the "Currently shipping" order number continue to be updated as orders ship. Not sure when we'll see it update again.

 On the "Good News" front is that, as various numbered versions (up through 5 that I've seen posted) of the various lettered configurations (A - D that I've seen posted) have been tested and rated, that the C5 and D5 are getting some thumbs up as notable improvements over the previous versions of these different power-versus-batterylife configurations.

 I'm HOPing that the quiet indicates that a default configuration/version has been chosen and that Xin is in production mode - until he bursts out of his workshop at some point and LOTSA orders get shipped. (I really AM a hopelessly romantic dreamer - very Ed Grimley-esque, with all due compliments to Martin Short for his wonderful portrayal of this irrepressible character).


----------



## htotsuka

Thank you for good information.

 I must wait for sending email from Dr.Xin.
 However, I feel insecurity which my order arrives at Dr.Xin and He confirm my order...


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It really is unfortunate that the "Currently shipping" order number has not budged from the 39143495 since 1/22/2009, even though we've seen a few posts since then that orders have been shipped. I recently posted to that thread, asking that the "Currently shipping" order number continue to be updated as orders ship. Not sure when we'll see it update again.

 On the "Good News" front is that, as various numbered versions (up through 5 that I've seen posted) of the various lettered configurations (A - D that I've seen posted) have been tested and rated, *that the C5 and D5 are getting some thumbs up as notable improvements over the previous versions* of these different power-versus-batterylife configurations.

 I'm HOPing that the quiet indicates that a default configuration/version has been chosen and that Xin is in production mode - until he bursts out of his workshop at some point and LOTSA orders get shipped. (I really AM a hopelessly romantic dreamer - very Ed Grimley-esque, with all due compliments to Martin Short for his wonderful portrayal of this irrepressible character)._

 

any links to mentions of the d5?, i havent even seen an 'official' list of available configurations even, and cant find any discussions of d5

 thanks


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_any links to mentions of the d5?, i havent even seen an 'official' list of available configurations even, and cant find any discussions of d5

 thanks_

 

As far as an 'official' list of available (lettered) configurations, trading off shorter battery life for providing more power to demanding phones, Xin's post starting this thread on fixup.net, including Xin's invitation to request a particular configuration as might best suit one's headphone's power requirements:

Xin's Cool Talk - Reference versions

 I have not encountered any mention of any "H" (Home configuration) boards being sent to anyone - hence I know of no impressions about "H". Such mention may be out there, I have just not yet encountered it.

 For updates on the history of numbered versions of the lettered configurations, check out mrarroyo's posts (who helped greatly to speed up all of the burn-in and listening testing during the ensuing proliferation of numbered versions of B through D, with version 5 being the highest of which I have read) in this fixup.net/talk thread. The latest updates, involving the B5, C5, D5 are on the latest pages (36-37) of this thread:

Xin's Cool Talk - New XIN Reference amp


----------



## Quaddy

very kind, thats great linkage


----------



## wangch

I recieved mine about three weeks ago my shipping number was 39157932, he shipped the Final C version which is default right now, Hope more get there amps soon


----------



## htotsuka

Good news.

 Thank you for report.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

From: support@fixup.net
 Subject: Re: Receipt 40630957 + Receipt 41019235 from Xin Feng Company
 Date: January 9, 2009 7:27:14 PM MST
 To: HeadphoneAddict

 Hi Larry,

 Sorry to tell you that it'll take another month.

 Thank you,
 Xin


 ---------

 Haven't heard anything since... But then again, I ordered last summer, so I shouldn't expect it till 2010 anyways.


----------



## Quaddy

20 month anniversary.


----------



## wnmnkh

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From: support@fixup.net
 Subject: Re: Receipt 40630957 + Receipt 41019235 from Xin Feng Company
 Date: January 9, 2009 7:27:14 PM MST
 To: HeadphoneAddict

 Hi Larry,

 Sorry to tell you that it'll take another month.

 Thank you,
 Xin


 ---------

 Haven't heard anything since... But then again, I ordered last summer, so I shouldn't expect it till 2010 anyways._

 


 I just wow'd at this. Is this typical?


----------



## Lil' Knight

Very very very typical. I even don't remember how long I ordered the Ref.


----------



## Gatsu

Coming up on 20 months here as well.

 Last time Xin updated his "Now Shipping" thread was back in January.

 I'm considering canceling my order again. *sigh*


----------



## rhythmdevils

I have a broken reference, one that was shipped in the initial batch, so it's the first version. I have been waiting for Xin to finalize the design so I can send it in to him to get fixed and then updated while he's at it, but i'm getting impatient! 

 Any advice? Should I keep waiting, or send it in now? thanks


----------



## qusp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *wnmnkh* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just wow'd at this. Is this typical?_

 

totally; actually from what i've seen it might be a little optimistic


----------



## BushGuy

Rhythmdevils - count the Reference as finalized. I had a Beta version and sent it in to him around 1/6/09, asking for the v.B. He returned it a month later fully updated as a B5 (BTW I had included my Supermini IV in the package for updating). I'd chosen the softer/tubier sound because I'm using it with iMod/32 ohm Darths (which have decidedly brighter treble than other versions(, which works out as a rather good combination of atributes. 
 The Supermini also came back fully updated at the same time. What may be happening since then - I don't know. I'm just saying I'm thoroughly happy with both of them and the changes he has made.


----------



## tha_dude

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *BushGuy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Rhythmdevils - count the Reference as finalized. I had a Beta version and sent it in to him around 1/6/09, asking for the v.B. He returned it a month later fully updated as a B5 (BTW I had included my Supermini IV in the package for updating). I'd chosen the softer/tubier sound because I'm using it with iMod/32 ohm Darths (which have decidedly brighter treble than other versions(, which works out as a rather good combination of atributes. 
 The Supermini also came back fully updated at the same time. What may be happening since then - I don't know. I'm just saying I'm thoroughly happy with both of them and the changes he has made._

 

How does the Reference compare to your other amps?


----------



## rhythmdevils

kind of strange for there to be multiple versions of a "reference". Doesn't reference kind of inherently imply that there are not different versions? 

 Does anyone know if he is going to choose one of the versions, or are we to decide? There isn't much information here on which to make a decision...


----------



## Nailzs

20 months last Friday.


----------



## Quaddy

21 month anniversary.


----------



## tha_dude

20 months a few days ago with no end in sight..


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_21 month anniversary._

 

X2 - same day.
 It looked good back in January 2009 that our order numbers would come up very soon, but then order fulfillment went back around to the Dark Side of the Moon where communication and completed/shipped amps seem to have stalled again - sigh.


----------



## cov

I can't believe this thread is still active. To offer some hope, Xin is still out there making and shipping amps. He just does them in flurries every couple of months. I can't defend his business behaviour. I feel sorry for those who have waited a long time.


----------



## jaquous

Another year and a half has passed since sm4 was ordered.


----------



## JwangSDC

haha I've changed addresses twice and credit cards once since I ordered.


----------



## drc73rp

I feel nothing for this thread and the amp i ordered almost a year and a half ago. My D10 is coming. I don't feel anything at all.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AnaKinDV8* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I feel nothing for this thread and the amp i ordered almost a year and a half ago. My D10 is coming. I don't feel anything at all._

 

My D10 arrived yesterday. It sounded refined, layered and really nice right out of the box. Today, with about 12 or so hours of use, I can hear more depth (dynamic and spatial) in its output. I'm still very much looking forward to hearing and using the Xin Reference that I ordered 21-22 months ago, and especially more so after reading the improvements that the latest mods (B5 and C5) have made to its sound. It reads as though it's going to be a fine listening instrument. In the meantime, the D10 is a worthwhile and versatile addition to any of our sets of listening instruments, as a DAC, as an amp, and as both.


----------



## Nailzs

21 months today. No email, no nothing from Xin. At least I paid with a credit card, that's expired.


----------



## Quaddy

22 month anniversary.


----------



## Godziltw

wow. Can't believe there are still people waiting. Used to buy Xin amp (until SM3).


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_22 month anniversary._

 

Yesterday was my 22 month anniversary of ordering a Xin Reference as well.

 I just checked, and the "Currently Shipping" order number still has not budged from its value of 39143495 that was posted by Xin on 1/22/2009, four and a half months ago. He'll return to fulfill more orders at some point when his consulting work takes a break, and our order numbers will likely (hopefully) be near the top of the queue for fulfilment and shipping.

 While waiting for the Reference, I've purchased a RSA SR-71A and an iBasso D10 with some replacement opamps and buffers. So, when the Xin arrives, I'll have a decent set of recent-vintage portable amps with which to compare it. I'm still pretty excited about getting and hearing the Reference, especially with the sonic improvements posted to have been achieved with the B5 and C5 mods over the originally offered configuration.


----------



## Nailzs

22 months today, still waiting.


----------



## tnmike1

Xin who?? Sounds like "Who's John Gault?" Forgot about Xin after waiting 24 months


----------



## blawhh

ive wated 3 months and have already given up hope


----------



## Audiophile_Apprentice

this really is unacceptable business practice... i mean come on, i don't see how this can possibly take that long. I really feel sorry for your guys.. i'd recommend the Minibox-E+ over the Xin actually.

 Consulting? please, fulfilling orders for people who pay hundreds of dollars should be his number one priority.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Audiophile_Apprentice* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_this really is unacceptable business practice... i mean come on, i don't see how this can possibly take that long. I really feel sorry for your guys.. *i'd recommend the Minibox-E+ over the Xin actually.*

 Consulting? please, fulfilling orders for people who pay hundreds of dollars should be his number one priority._

 

*hard to do when your order includes a supermicro. some people require tiny for their porta rig.*

 do give us your experiences with them both though, which '_Xin_' are you talking about?, appreciated


----------



## Pangaea

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_22 month anniversary._

 

Quaddy, your patience is beyond reproach. I know at one pt I was right behind you with my order and I bowed out about a yr ago. I haven't looked at this thread since, and happened on it today. Wow, is all I can say. I can appreciate your persistence, but when do you throw in the towel? Zin should be ashamed - there is really no excuse for this PERIOD.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

In January Dr. Xin said my Super Micro would ship in one more month - haven't heard from him since, even when I changed my order to a Super Mini in March (3 emails).


----------



## clasam

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Xin who?? Sounds like "Who's John Gault?" Forgot about Xin after waiting 24 months_

 

Kinda reminds me of "Waiting for Godot"


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In January Dr. Xin said my Super Micro would ship in one more month - haven't heard from him since, even when I changed my order to a Super Mini in March (3 emails)._

 

On January 7, 2009, I likewise received an email from Dr. Xin in which he informed me that my Reference would ship in about two weeks. Here it is July 4, 2009, and I'm waiting for July 8 to arrive so that I can post my 23rd month anniversary of having ordered a Reference.

 I just checked again, and the "Currently Shipping" order number has still not budged since 1/22/2009 when Dr. Xin last updated it to 39143495 - thankfully just a little lower than my own order number. I'm hoping that the next time Dr. Xin comes up for air from his consulting to build and ship more ordered amps, that my Reference order will be fulfilled. When I post such things, I feel so "Ed Grimley-esque". But then, I AM Ed Grimley-esque, so no harm there.


----------



## hockeyb213

I don't know how you guys do it.......nothing is worth a wait like that imo.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hockeyb213* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I don't know how you guys do it.......nothing is worth a wait like that imo._

 

I can wait because I can live without it. I have plenty of things to entertain me till then. But, if the iBasso T3 is as good as it is reported to be based on the prototypes that are seeded out there, I may get that instead of the Super Mini IV.


----------



## hockeyb213

Well the thing is Xin is not knocking everything out of the ballpark to be worth waiting nearly 2 years to wait. Sure it isn't a problem if you have other stuff to keep you busy but who wants to support that craze?


----------



## Quaddy

thanks for using such kind words to describe this, either that or sheer stubborn stupidity 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




*23 month* anniversary today, cant wait for the 2 year reunion next month 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pangaea* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_*Quaddy, your patience is beyond reproach*. I know at one pt I was right behind you with my order and I bowed out about a yr ago. I haven't looked at this thread since, and happened on it today. Wow, is all I can say. I can appreciate your persistence, but when do you throw in the towel? Zin should be ashamed - there is really no excuse for this PERIOD._


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...
*23 month* anniversary today, cant wait for the 2 year reunion next month ..._

 

23 month anniversary for me today too. The time doesn't seem like it's flying, so I guess I'm not having fun yet.


----------



## ed lynch

Well lads and lassies, eddie here i havent posted for a while in my estimation it must be nearly 22 months since i placed my order recently i noticed my credit card details could beout of date, timewise ,should i notify the good doctor, or how do i go about that, by the way the wethher has improved somewhat here in dublin any sign of anything on the horizon with regards to orders has anybody received theirs, all the best eddie


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well lads and lassies, eddie here i havent posted for a while in my estimation it must be nearly 22 months since i placed my order recently i noticed my credit card details could beout of date, timewise ,should i notify the good doctor, or how do i go about that, by the way the wethher has improved somewhat here in dublin any sign of anything on the horizon with regards to orders has anybody received theirs, all the best eddie_

 

Greetings, Ed!!!!! I think that the basic thread of this tale is told by the lack of any change since 1/22/2009 of the order number "Currently Shipping" displayed on Xin's website, Xin Feng Company. We're all awaiting another break in Dr. Xin's consulting business where he is able to fulfill another group of his back-logged orders. As far as I know, there is no sign in sight as to when that might be. Does anyone still reading this thread see any signs of when we might expect another batch of Xin amps to be built and shipped?


----------



## Scott_Tarlow

Are these amps that good?


----------



## Nailzs

Not if no one never get their order.


----------



## 1EyedJack

I've been on the list since Dec of 2007 (soon after I discovered Head-Fi).
 I just put it on the back burner and enjoy all of the other things that Head-Fi has introduced me to.


----------



## HiFlight

I sent my SMIV and Mini back for updates over 3 years ago, and they have never been returned. Although I was a very loyal supporter of Dr Xin for several years, my allegiance has now shifted to iBasso, as I find their current amps to be the sonic equal of my Reference, which I sold some time back. Additionally, iBasso customer service is orders of magnitude better than Xins.


----------



## MaoDi

I'm not very familiar with this, but does anyone know why it takes so long to order one?


----------



## Zalithian

From what I've read, it seems like Dr. Xin is the only person who makes the amps, so it's a one man company, and he randomly disappears without telling anyone and they just continue waiting for their product.


----------



## shigzeo

i got my supermicro iv back when the wait was only 4 months - whoopee!


----------



## MaoDi

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Zalithian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From what I've read, it seems like Dr. Xin is the only person who makes the amps, so it's a one man company, and he randomly disappears without telling anyone and they just continue waiting for their product._

 

One Man Company....


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Zalithian* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_From what I've read, it seems like Dr. Xin is the only person who makes the amps, so it's a one man company, and he randomly disappears without telling anyone and they just continue waiting for their product._

 

Yes, Xin is the only one who makes them and has the measuring equipment and everything else he needs in one room with trays full of the resistors, caps and other pieces needed for production.


----------



## BushGuy

I had sent both my Reference and Supermini IV back to him in January.........and received them both back in February - it took exactly one month to the day. My Reference is now a v.B5, and I also felt the Supermini was even nicer than it had been - the updates were very worthwhile.........and NO, they are NOT for sale.
 Whatever has happened to Dr. Xin since those dates....................dunno.
 Since the amp business was a personal passion to him, perhaps he accepted a contract for other work whose nature meant he had to work away from home for a few months.


----------



## ed lynch

i donno whethr to a quick response or collapse because im wAITING NEARLY 20 MONTHS FOR THE GOOD DOCTOR TO DELIVER I FEEL YOUR PAIN AND WHO READS THIS IM WITH YOU IN THE MEANTIME ALL THE BESY ...EDDIE


----------



## wangch

I recieved a shipping notice yesterday, my supermini iv that I sent in about 2 months ago for upgrade


----------



## ABathingApe

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i donno whethr to a quick response or collapse because im wAITING NEARLY 20 MONTHS FOR THE GOOD DOCTOR TO DELIVER I FEEL YOUR PAIN AND WHO READS THIS IM WITH YOU IN THE MEANTIME ALL THE BESY ...EDDIE_

 

20 months?!?! That's insane...


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ABathingApe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_20 months?!?! That's insane..._

 

agreed, anyone who waits that kind of time is clearly mental!!


----------



## sbulack

That's one enviably nice hastily thrown-together desktop rig you've got there, Quaddy!!!


----------



## BushGuy

It should be noted that Kaushama started a thread here regarding a Xin Reference v.C he received in May...........there are updates and new Xin amps being delivered that are simply not mentioned here. Frankly, I have seen posters here that I would personally decline.......but, that's me. I am NOT implying knowledge of anyone else's opinions or sctions.


----------



## tnmike1

3 years next month. Still have my name on the list and just for giggles might order another one and see which one comes first.


----------



## mrarroyo

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ABathingApe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_20 months?!?! That's insane..._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_agreed, anyone who waits that kind of time is clearly mental!!_

 

We all think differently, what may be "insane" or "clearly mental" to each of you may not be to others.


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mrarroyo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_We all think differently, what may be "insane" or "clearly mental" to each of you may not be to others. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

tongue in cheek my friend, i was speaking for myself too - i have been waiting 2 years.


----------



## ed lynch

ed here why doesnt he say sorry lads i can only do 3 a year instead of saying in january sorry in other words stop this waiting game imcertain people have changed adress or in my case credit card has expired out of date i dont no how to solve this does it matter anymore with this man with no communication its bizarre anyway anybody out there let me know something ed


----------



## ed lynch

Ed here ,it this stage im scratching my head woundering whats going on some people rave about no.5 i havent even heard no.1 maybe its the beatles dr zin let us know ed...


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ed here why doesnt he say sorry lads i can only do 3 a year instead of saying in january sorry in other words stop this waiting game imcertain people have changed adress or in my case credit card has expired out of date i dont no how to solve this does it matter anymore with this man with no communication its bizarre anyway a*nybody out there let me know something* ed_

 

ok, jack and jill ran up the hill to fetch a pale of water.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_ed here ... does it matter anymore with this man with no communication its bizarre anyway anybody out there let me know something ed_

 

The lack of communication from Dr. Xin (when he has fairly easy channels of communication already in place) does impart a bizarre quality to the handling of these long-standing back orders for Xin amps.
 BushGuy has posted above that he is aware of amps Dr. Xin has shipped which have not been posted on this thread (and for which Dr. Xin has not updated the order number in the "Currently Shipping" thread in the "Support" section of his own forum over on fixup.net). It is good to know that Dr. Xin has been giving some attention to fulfilling his backlog of orders since 1/22/2009. And, it is SOMEthing, rather than NOthing.


----------



## dimm0k

almost forgot about this... order date should be in my sig


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks for that update sbulack, im wondering since its 2 years in september next since i placed an order for the reference, my credit card is now out of date ,should i notify him, of my new card details ,or do you think he would contact me? or what, what a waiting game with dr xin: the only difference in my credit card is its new expiry date in 2013, at this stage ill be an old age pensioner before ill here anything, by the way, its 40 years today since man landed/walked on the moon, congratulations to all in this part of the world dublin i remember sitting up till 4am in the morning watching it on tv it was exhillerating it will never leave my memory once again congrats to all concerned,sorry im slightly off the subject,wish to god dr xin would read our threads, or let us know,All the best..ed.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for that update sbulack, im wondering since its 2 years in september next since i placed an order for the reference, my credit card is now out of date ,should i notify him, of my new card details ,or do you think he would contact me? or what, what a waiting game with dr xin: the only difference in my credit card is its new expiry date in 2013, at this stage ill be an old age pensioner before ill here anything, by the way, its 40 years today since man landed/walked on the moon, congratulations to all in this part of the world dublin i remember sitting up till 4am in the morning watching it on tv it was exhillerating it will never leave my memory once again congrats to all concerned,sorry im slightly off the subject,wish to god dr xin would read our threads, or let us know,All the best..ed._

 

He has a spot in his shopping/order page or cart for updating credit card, by making a very tiny charge to your new card and authorizing him to use that card for the previous order.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for that update sbulack, ... by the way, its 40 years today since man landed/walked on the moon, congratulations to all in this part of the world dublin i remember sitting up till 4am in the morning watching it on tv it was exhillerating it will never leave my memory once again congrats to all concerned,sorry im slightly off the subject, ...,All the best..ed._

 

Glad to share the little that there is TO share. The landing/walk on the moon was a small step for man, a giant leap for mankind. Well, sure, once you GET the man on the surface of the moon, the step is a small step. Seems like a pretty giant-sized leap to me from the surface of the Earth up to the surface of the Moon, though. Receiving our Xin amp order will be a small step for mankind, and a giant leap for both Xin and the person having their order fulfilled. I'm still very excited about the prospect of receiving and hearing a Reference B (or C) 5, which, last I heard, ended up being the default Reference after all of the trials last Winter. The completion of those trials was fueled, to no small degree, by the dogged determination, irrepressible good cheer and indefatiguable persistence of mrarroyo. Without Miguel's skills and efforts, those trials of 5 numbered versions of each of 5 lettered Reference configurations would still be under way. At least that hurdle has been bounded. Three cheers for mrarroyo!!! Hip, hip, hooray!!!!! Hip, hip, hooray!!!!! Hip, hip, hooray!!!!!

 Last winter, Ed, I recall that the roof of your shed was blown off, and that you needed to wait for the rain storm that blew it off to subside before you could go out to replace that roof. Some real life drama with some real financial stakes that you shared with us to help put the Xin amp drama in perspective. How did that either end up, or how is it going? What was the damage sustained by the contents of that shed while the roof replacement took place? Will this roof hold during this coming year's wind and rain storms?


----------



## immtbiker

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_...im wondering since its 2 years in september next since i placed an order for the reference, my credit card is now out of date ,should i notify him, of my new card details ,or do you think he would contact me?_

 


 Let it go. Any MOT that treats its customer's like this, doesn't deserve our business. I would advise anyone new, not to place an order with him, and I hope that anyone who already has, gets a prompt refund.
 What possible reason would anyone have to buy something from a manufacturer that has treated his clientèle like this? He has basically taken thousand$ of dollars from members and not provided the product.

 Please do not perpetuate Xin's business anymore. His amps sound good, but are not technically superior to what is being offered by other hard working, loyal, trustworthy MOT's that bust their butts to offer us top notch service.

 Please note that I am not speaking as a moderator on Head-Fi's behalf, but rather as a consumer who sees immoral business practices being perpetuated.


----------



## Quaddy

i have to agree with aaron on this now, speaking as someone who has always been a fan of his amps and owned a few thus far and have had three on order for nearly two years, i am sticking with it until i get them, now i am so far in

 but....

 i echo aarons sentiments, certainly moreso for any new customers, knowing what i know now, there is no chance i would have placed those orders 'all those years back'


----------



## tnmike1

one thing that has not been mentioned: if you nowhave a Xin amp, or contemplate buying one, what happens if itbreaks? Return it to him and wait "X" years for it to be returned?? NAAAH. Too many amps on the market now with prompt and friendly builders who respond to your questions and needs.

 Forget XIn and his amps

 Three years Aug. for me BTW


----------



## DonJuan

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_one thing that has not been mentioned: if you nowhave a Xin amp, or contemplate buying one, what happens if itbreaks? Return it to him and wait "X" years for it to be returned?? NAAAH. Too many amps on the market now with prompt and friendly builders who respond to your questions and needs.

 Forget XIn and his amps

 Three years Aug. for me BTW_

 

Wow, three years. I wonder why some who ordered after you got their amps earlier


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks headphone addict, maybe i will look at his shop/order page, you know when you order want an item you expect to receive it in reasonable time not 2 years? or forever thanks ed.


----------



## ed lynch

Thanks Sbulack, Well you wont believe this Im standing here having surveyed the damage for months on end having purchased roofing felt and saying to myself is it worth it having said the same to myself monthsago the water logged damage i had an old honda 50 plus bits and pieces like a lawn mower paints brushes oldpaintings ancillery tools etc im thinking of replacing whole structure,im glad ididnt leave any of my precious headamps in there thanks for asking,bty at this moment in time im listening to a sony nwz s639f portablewalkman using again sony earphones mdr a34 i know im not on topic but its the type of sound you want to hear agai and again i sorry im off the topic ive no connection with sony in the meantime ed


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks Sbulack, Well you wont believe this Im standing here having surveyed the damage for months on end having purchased roofing felt and saying to myself is it worth it having said the same to myself monthsago the water logged damage ..... at this moment in time im listening to a sony nwz s639f portablewalkman using again sony earphones mdr a34 ..... ive no connection with sony in the meantime ed_

 

You have no idea how my heart sank when you wrote the words "the water logged damage". I've had rooms in my house flooded with bad roof leaks (now, thankfully, repaired) - and few things sink a heart like surveying "the water logged damage" of items thought to be safe where they had been placed inside a room.

 Just for fun, I'm going to check out the nwz s639f / mdr a34 items, and, if I can find them sufficiently inexpensive, I may just treat myself to a set of them to have a listen - after your catchy recommendation. (disclaimer) Like Ed, I, too, have no personal knowledge of nor financial connection with the folks at Sony.


----------



## ed lynch

You know something, now dont get me wrong, when men went to the moon in 1969, if people are saying he is high tech (rocket science how are you thatst what we say in dublin) now take this with a grain of salt thats another dublin expression im glad the apollo astronauts had nice quick back up imagine if they were stranded on the moon for 2 years how long thanks im not sure of his hi tech, just making a statement, in otherwords ill think twice before im propelled by his technolgy,i know i had to say something when i read somewhere he rocket scientist, as i say ed


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You know something, now dont get me wrong, when men went to the moon in 1969, if people are saying he is high tech (rocket science how are you thatst what we say in dublin) now take this with a grain of salt thats another dublin expression im glad the apollo astronauts had nice quick back up imagine if they were stranded on the moon for 2 years how long thanks im not sure of his hi tech, just making a statement, in otherwords ill think twice before im propelled by his technolgy,i know i had to say something when i read somewhere he rocket scientist, as i say ed_

 

Space Program Comedy how are you - that's what we say in Philadelphia. Whoa!!!!! Ed!!!!! You are hittin' on all cylinders - that's another thing we say in Philadelphia. Good one!!!!! Next time I'm in Dublin (next time will be the first, BTW), at which Comedy Club do you do your show? No, really, that's a funny association you bring up with Dr. Xin's background as a Rocket Scientist.

 I did a search for the sony mp3 player you'd mentioned in a previous post. It reviews well. You got the top-of-the-line 16 GB model. Do you happen to know a more modestly-featured (yup, cheaper) model with the same music playback technology, but smaller capacity, like maybe 2 or 4 GB and less fancy screen and interface?


----------



## ed lynch

Well i can tell you Sbulack ithink ibought it about a nearly year ago in dublin i must say it sounds fantastic there is other versions on it like not sure im sure there will be better veriations on this year the version i got i filled it up immediately and it only took one third of the capicity the sound is fantastic you just plugthis thing in and it needs no whats the word to exit on computer in other words you dont have to press releae on computer this nwz 639 is automatic it comes in different forms the one i have at the moment is a 16 gb ive seen them at 8gb doesnt matter the main thing if you have anything on songs just drag and drop get your hand on one of these things whether through any sourse this is i shouldnt say i think its better than most ive tried at the moment download music onto one i you will what meat having said that all technologies are different but i find thy are all cattich up


----------



## ed lynch

Sbulack, i just did a quick search on line would you believe without naming the company starts with an a that now there is a 32gb version available, i was just looking around for latest headphones, there you are, as i havent purchased for a long time, i had this yoke on holidays im talking about my portable and after 40 hours there was still juice left in the battery bty it was rome in case anybody is wondering my first break in a long time i think sony has stepped up to the mark btw the is starts with amaz..cant say further but i must check again could be new models for this year, wish to god they could do dr zin reference wouldnt it be something we could get it in 3 days, all the best,ed


----------



## a_tumiwa

anyone ever compared xin supermacro IV and Ibasso D10 with stock opamp?


----------



## Quaddy

24 month anniversary, read: 2 years. yay!

 cheers xin, once again, you make waiting a very sexy game. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





not


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sbulack, i just did a quick search on line would you believe without naming the company starts with an a that now there is a 32gb version available, ... wish to god they could do dr zin reference wouldnt it be something we could get it in 3 days, all the best,ed_

 

I just received a 4 GB Sony NWZ... mp3/mp4 player, which I'm using with Yuin PK1 buds - and it sounds SO fine. For a little extra pizzazz, I add in a FiiO E3 or E5 - and I just melt into the sound. Thanks, Ed, for the reminder that I really do love how Sony portable players sound. Yep, it's got what it takes to keep me hitting the "Play" button. And, it's not much bigger than the FiiO E5, yet its buttons are easy to find and operate. Well, adding a Sony player back into my listening line-up is a good use of the time spent waiting for the Xin Reference amp (that I ordered 24 months ago, today). And I can remember back to when I thought that a 3 month waiting time was just out-of-the-question. Thanks again, Ed, for your reminder of just how good a Sony player can sound.


----------



## EFN

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_24 month anniversary, read: 2 years. yay!

 cheers xin, once again, you make waiting a very sexy game. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




not_

 

lol...you made my day


----------



## lisnalee

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_24 month anniversary, read: 2 years. yay!

 cheers xin, once again, you make waiting a very sexy game. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




not_

 

Wow! i cant believe its reached the 2 year mark already
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

 It doesn't seem that long ago i was checking this thread regularly waiting on mine thinking we would have them in 6-9 months. Hopefully xin gets himself sorted out, sooner rather than any later and starts pumping these out again.


----------



## Quaddy

yup. twomanyyears 

 i know, i remember the very same innocent days 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 i dont even want them now, but stubborness and curiousity is a dangerous mix  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *lisnalee* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow! i cant believe its reached the 2 year mark already
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

 It doesn't seem that long ago i was checking this thread regularly waiting on mine thinking we would have them in 6-9 months. Hopefully xin gets himself sorted out, sooner rather than any later and starts pumping these out again._


----------



## hockeyb213

Don't know why if the guy had that much demand he couldn't get more help I mean it is one thing to like to do all the work yourself but it is another thing to make customers wait ungodly amounts of time to get it.


----------



## Nailzs

24 months, 8 days today.


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *hockeyb213* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Don't know why if the guy had that much demand he couldn't get more help I mean it is one thing to like to do all the work yourself but it is another thing to make customers wait ungodly amounts of time to get it._

 

The manner in which Xin works on these/worked?, is not conducive to having someone else there though I agree, training someone would be a good way to get these out. It really doesn't take that long to load up a board and stick it in the oven, maybe 5 minutes or a little longer. To solder on the volume control and a few other parts a little longer.


----------



## headfever

_ Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
I just received a 4 GB Sony NWZ... mp3/mp4 player, which I'm using with Yuin PK1 buds - and it sounds SO fine. For a little extra pizzazz, I add in a FiiO E3 or E5 - and I just melt into the sound. Thanks, Ed, for the reminder that I really do love how Sony portable players sound. Yep, it's got what it takes to keep me hitting the "Play" button. And, it's not much bigger than the FiiO E5, yet its buttons are easy to find and operate. Well, adding a Sony player back into my listening line-up is a good use of the time spent waiting for the Xin Reference amp (that I ordered 24 months ago, today). And I can remember back to when I thought that a 3 month waiting time was just out-of-the-question. Thanks again, Ed, for your reminder of just how good a Sony player can sound.

 

_

 If you compairing to SONY 1060 or AMP3, you will be regret your currunt SONY MODEL.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *headfever* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 If you compairing to SONY 1060 or AMP3, you will be regret your currunt SONY MODEL._

 

I just received the AMP3 that I ordered this evening. The package was waiting for me when I returned from work. I'm listening to it now, and it has not had enough use at this point to know its real performance, but the AMP3 is already sounding quite good. Because of its accurate portrayal of the sound, it's amazing the intimacy that comes through because the details which portray such intimacy are so easily there to hear - and don't have to be listened-for, and can be heard at lower (and intimate) volume. I'm sure that, with more use, the AMP3 player, amp and phones will all blossom into offering a remarkably impressive listening experience. I'm also already LOVEing the FM radio in the AMP3. It receives my favorite FM stations really well (very little interference), and portrays that analog source really beautifully. I doubt, however, that I would have bought the AMP3 if I hadn't been enjoying the much more modest Sony DAP model so much. Because it's so inexpensive, I'll enjoy it in settings in which I would not want to use something more expensive - like an iMod or the AMP3. Since I know that I really LOVE the sound of a Sony player, I'll also do some homework on the 1060 model you've mentioned. Thanks for the pointer.

 Some day, when I DO get the Xin Reference I ordered two years on August 8, I will have a few sources, the sound from which I really enjoy, to use with it.


----------



## Gatsu

Well, I reached my limit today. Nearly 23 months and no amp. Xin's own "Currently Shipping" post is 8 months out of date, and $300 out of pocket.

 I emailed Xin and requested that my order be canceled and to be refunded.

 I fully expected to need to wait a week or more before I heard anything back, but to my surprise less than 10 minutes later I got my refund.

 Good luck to those of you still waiting.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gatsu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Well, I reached my limit today. Nearly 23 months and no amp. Xin's own "Currently Shipping" post is 8 months out of date, and $300 out of pocket.

 I emailed Xin and requested that my order be canceled and to be refunded.

 I fully expected to need to wait a week or more before I heard anything back, but to my surprise less than 10 minutes later I got my refund.

 Good luck to those of you still waiting._

 

So he is still around?? Interesting. Wondering now what would happen if you reordered the amp today. How long would it take???

 I'm at the 25 month spot. Thankfully, I used credit card so not out any monies.


----------



## ed lynch

ed here, its really getting beyond and the beyond 2 yrs waiting at this stage ill go on the drink ,honestly and further i might not be able to hear ..too old age..thanks be to god i still have my faculties? whatever that is you know what i mean honest to god ,whats up with hm just dropt in lately for anything interesting on the the latest news all the best ed


----------



## Quaddy

2 years one month order anniversary.


----------



## a_tumiwa

who has the longest anniversary?


----------



## BushGuy

Removed? It shouldn't have been put up in the first place. Done by a moderator as he first started moderating........presumably because another builder was/is indeed cheating customers. As time proved with another thread - this was NEVER the case with Dr. Xin.
 The other dynamic that is particularly curious is adults when spurned learn to move on. IOW don't moon and moan about a lover or amp designer/builder - go elsewhere where happiness and rainbows exist. That could be with Justin, or perhaps Ray.......or others.Where is the pleasure in mooning about anniversaries? Get on with life! Dogs always live in the present - when will more humans become smart enough to do the same. 
 I see Isborken is back and looking for attention, again.


----------



## jazznap

I for one appreciate this thread and the sticky. I remember all the hype when Xin was big news. While I didn't get one, I had strongly considered them at that time. I see this post as helping new people, or returning people, sort fact from fiction. It's very easy to do research, stumble upon old posts praising his amps, and then go trying to buy one from his site. IMO the information on this post (and the site) just help to make people more conscious decisions. My thanks to the immtbiker for starting it and for all those who keep it going. It's this close community and accountability that keeps more scamming from happening.


----------



## qusp

^^^ the depth of your denial is beyond belief 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I see why you are a favorite of Xin's. for you to be so convinced of Xins 'perfectly reasonable' behavior is confusing to me.


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In July and August(2008), I had sent two requests to Dr. Xin for a refund of the Paypal funds sent for a Reference order in August 2007. I never got a reply or the refund, so I just sent Dr. Xin another email (Sept 2008) asking him to disregard the requests for a refund and to keep the order in place.
 ..._

 

After two email requests, and a post on fixup.net, requesting a Paypal refund, two months later, I had received no reply, and no refund. When it looked as though Dr. Xin was back, I sent another email asking to disregard the requests for a cancellation/refund. This was back in July ( refund request 1), August (refund request 2), September(disregard refund requests) 2008. I HAVE received replies from Dr. Xin to other emails I have sent to him requesting his confirmation of having received the order, and specifying which version of Reference to fill this order with. So, I think that I'm using the correct Xin email subject protocol and tips when sending him an email.

 I'm one of the "summer of 2007" Reference buyers still awaiting the fulfillment of my order.
 Just now, I sent to Dr. Xin, by email, a new request to cancel this order and to receive a refund of the funds paid through Paypal. I'll post the results of this new cancellation/refund request either when there are results to post, or after an appropriate length of time if I get no reply.


----------



## qusp

^^ case in point....

 also 
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sbulack* 
_So, I think that I'm using the correct Xin email subject protocol and tips when sending him an email._

 

just the fact that there are tips and email subject protocol as an attempt to circumvent being totally and utterly ignored says it all


----------



## Gbjerke

Everyone who's confused:
 Buying Xin amps isn't a good idea unless you want to have them by the next christmas after next christmas.
 Buy iBasso / RSA

 YEY


----------



## Quaddy

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Gbjerke* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Everyone who's confused:
 Buying Xin amps isn't a good idea unless you want to have them by the christmas after *next christmas*.
 Buy iBasso / RSA

 YEY_

 

fixed


----------



## immtbiker

Thread pruned.

 Back to our regularly scheduled OP.


----------



## ZARIM

I really want to buy XIN Reference but i can't wait till ...... So if someone interested to sell there precious Reference, please contact me.....


----------



## shigzeo

wow, i was thinking of getting another Xin amp (i bought at the end of 2006 to replace my older supermini from 2005) and had to wait 4 or 5 months. I thought that wait was interminable, but 23, 25 months is in no way worth it. They are good amps, but not worth two years of waiting - no way. very glad I saw this thread.


----------



## Quaddy

26 month order anniversary.


----------



## basiltahan

It baffles me. With 30 seconds of research, it is obvious that Xin is either 1) not making amps any more or 2) is so behind that the delays are unreasonable. There are SO many great (comparable at least) amps that will be delivered in under a week, WHY!? would anyone still be interested in Xin amps? It is JUST the MYSTERY? I had a Supermacro-3 and recently got a Corda 3MOVE. Any differences there might be in performance are strictly preference. Just to set the record straight, XIN amps are not the holy grail. Abandon ship. Get over it. Put these amps to rest. Any other company would be in court being sued, right??? Is there any chance that all the support for continuing this pursuit is actually XIN masquerading as other people?


----------



## Quaddy

/\/\ still interested? not really, such time has elapsed since ordering that i have gone through many cycles of portable-non portable, rinse and repeat, i now have ZERO requirement for the amps i have on order from xin.

 but its my decision to keep my order alive. nothing to do with mystery, i have owned and listened to several xin amps and there is no mystery to me, but as you say can be down to preference in sound and form factor

 i dont like the way you dictate that people should abandon ship and get over it. thats upto the person involved with an order, also dont see the relevance in you posting here, as you appear to not be involved in an ongoing trasaction with xin?

 your last point is the most insulting, intimating that someone who is waiting for an order is 'supporting' xins approach - thats kind of like saying the girl wore a short skirt, she deserved it your honour!

 i am not supporting the farce, but my duty here is to report stoically each and every month to the day that my order continues, so as to give fair warning to other prospective purchasers.


----------



## basiltahan

Quote:


 i dont like the way you dictate that people should abandon ship and get over it. thats upto the person involved with an order, also dont see the relevance in you posting here, as you appear to not be involved in an ongoing trasaction with xin?

 your last point is the most insulting, intimating that someone who is waiting for an order is 'supporting' xins approach - thats kind of like saying the girl wore a short skirt, she deserved it your honour! 
 

My sincere apologies. I was posting a bit tongue in cheek and obviously my sarcasm did not come through in my writing. I did not mean to offend you in any way. Positive vibes.

  Quote:


 i am not supporting the farce, but my duty here is to report stoically each and every month to the day that my order continues, so as to give fair warning to other prospective purchasers. 
 

I LOVE your stoicism. Keep on rockin'

 As to my reason for posting, morbid curiosity really, as to why people are still ordering (or even considering ordering) from a source that either no longer exists (when was the last known communication from XIN) or is so far behind in production as to have a two year back log.

 As to the purpose for posting here rather than a new post, I thought that those reading this post would be the most likely to reply. Bring on Google Wave! I suppose it is OT and should be deleted. Moderators, feel free.

 Again, please accept my sincere apologies, there is enough negativity in the world. Cheers.


----------



## BigTony

Maybe the title of this thread should be changed to suit:
 Those who waiting a Xin amp, get over it, its not coming.


----------



## Todd@PhillipIsland

I ordered mine in Sept 2009


----------



## qusp

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Todd@PhillipIsland* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered mine in Sept 2009_

 

O M G ! ! !

 WTH possessed you to do that?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 did you not know he was dodgy as the last sausage roll (colloquial humor alert) before ordering


----------



## digitalcat

It sure takes a long time to make these Xin babies 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I mean seriously, last time I checked the shipping status my wife wasn't even pregnant yet. Now my son is already 14 months old.......


----------



## sakura

I ordered the supermacro-iv at Feb. 2009.
 Do anyone know when the amp arrive to me?


----------



## Quaddy

16 july 2011 @ 16:23pm?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sakura* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I ordered the supermacro-iv at Feb. 2009.
 Do anyone know when the amp arrive to me?_


----------



## sakura

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_16 july 2011 @ 16:23pm?_

 

Really?

 I am waiting for about 2 years.
 Is it better for me to look for other amp?

 Which do you recomend other amp?


----------



## jamato8

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sakura* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Really?

 I am waiting for about 2 years.
 Is it better for me to look for other amp?

 Which do you recomend other amp?_

 

Xin has not been shipping any new amps for a long time. 

 iBasso, RSA and a number of other amps are very good and you could get one in a week or less.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sakura* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Really?

 I am waiting for about 2 years.
 Is it better for me to look for other amp?

 Which do you recomend other amp?_

 

YOu can get quick shipping and nice amps from RSA, Headamp, Meier, iBasso, Practical Devices, Nuforce, and more.


----------



## sakura

Thank you for good advices.
 I would like to consider another choice.

 Now, I have P-51. It is very good.
 However, Dr. Xin's amp is very attractive for me.
 I would like to hear sound by Dr. Xin's amp once.


----------



## Quaddy

there is supermicros for sale in head-fi's classifieds amp section now if you want to fast track their sampling.


----------



## sakura

Thank you for kind post.
 Please teach me the difference between supermacro and supermicro.
 Is 4-channel system used in supermicro?


----------



## sakura

I am verry sorry.
 I will reseach the difference between supermacro and supermicro on Dr.Xin's Web site.

 Thank you for kind adivice.


----------



## ed lynch

Sorry eddie here ive havent been here for awhile has haybody even got one unit from the great doctor i woiuld like to know im past my sell by date on my credit card, im not reordering thats makes one less on the waiting list if it makes any difference at this stage ive givven up..Eddie


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ed lynch* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sorry eddie here ive havent been here for awhile has haybody even got one unit from the great doctor i woiuld like to know im past my sell by date on my credit card, im not reordering thats makes one less on the waiting list if it makes any difference at this stage ive givven up..Eddie_

 

Hi eddie. I've given up too. About a month ago, I sent Dr. Xin an email requesting that my order be cancelled and that the money that I paid by Paypal be refunded. So far, I've received no reply and no refund. I'm about to send a "2nd attempt" email requesting again to cancel the order and have my money refunded. So, as far as I'm concerned, no new amps, no responses to emails from the good doctor. Although another has recently posted having received a refund within 10 minutes of requesting it.

 I DO, however, continue to enjoy the equipment I've purchased from other vendors during the 26 months since I placed the Reference order.


----------



## edwardsean

Hi, 

 I just wanted to let you know that if you're interested I just put up a 2008 Xin Supermicro IV for sale. Case is clear and in excellent condition. The unit is in perfect operating condition. There are pictures.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *edwardsean* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi, 

 I just wanted to let you know that if you're interested I just put up a 2008 Xin Supermicro IV for sale. Case is clear and in excellent condition. The unit is in perfect operating condition. There are pictures._

 

Too bad it isn't a super mini IV instead...


----------



## theory_87

Will buy it if it a Macro instead...


----------



## edwardsean

Hi, 

 This will be my last post here as I know it's self-serving. However, as a comment, I owned both the latest updated supermini IV and the supermicro IV. I was also interested in the revised mini. The micro, of course, doesn't have the special features (bass boost, variable impedance, crossfeed). However, side by side, the micro was still the "special" amp; the one with the clarity, soundstage, tube-like texture, etc. I ended up choosing the micro, and selling the mini.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I originally ordered the micro and got confirmation. But then I changed it to a mini in March for the flatter form factor, xinfeed, and other features, but I never got confirmation. Last I heard from Xin was an email in January that the micro would ship in a month...


----------



## Quaddy

its me again... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 27 month anniversary here.


----------



## krmathis

He he, these build times are just hilarious. In a horrible way!
 I know that he probably hand built these himself, but *27 months and running*...


----------



## krmathis

He he, these build times are just hilarious. In a horrible way!
 I know that he probably hand built these himself, but *27 months and running*...


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Quaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_its me again... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 27 month anniversary here._

 

Mine too, as Quaddy and I placed our Reference orders on the same day.

 Two months ago, though, I sent an email to Dr. Xin asking that my Reference Order be cancelled, and that I be sent a refund of funds paid by PayPal. 

 When, a month ago, I had received no reply and no refund, the Head-Fier who had recently successfully asked for such a refund - and got it within hours - very kindly sent me a PM with how they had constructed their request: email address, email subject and the wording of their email. I modeled my 2nd attempt email after this successful prototype. It was very similar to my 1st attempt email.

 It is now a second month later, and, as of this post, I have received neither a reply nor a refund from Dr. Xin. I'm going to send a 3rd attempt email requesing to cancel this order and a refund of funds paid by PayPal. I'll let you all know the results from this 3rd attempt as well. So far, it appears that Dr. Xin is not accessible for me to communicate to him my request to cancel my order and to receive a refund of funds paid for it.


----------



## Happy Camper

Is there no honesty among rocket scientists?


----------



## sbulack

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Happy Camper* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is there no honesty among rocket scientists?_

 

I actually think that he's honest enough, just not attentive or accessible during these "away" periods. I'm expecting, one of these days, that he'll take time or remember to take a look at his "Xin Feng Co." emails and that I'll get a PayPal refund with a one word comment, "Sorry". When that might be, ah, there's the rub!


----------



## Quaddy

28 month wait AKA 2 years and 4 months


----------



## tnmike1

OMG will this thread NEVER die??? It's like a ghost that keeps reappearing. Give it up, guys: he ain't comin' back. )-:


----------



## kostalex

Nice thread for FS:/WTB: deals. If I ever would sell my Supermicro, I will place some teaser here.


----------



## tnmike1

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kostalex* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Nice thread for FS:/WTB: deals. If I ever would sell my Supermicro, I will place some teaser here._

 

Whoever would want to buy a piece of electronic equipment whose maker has disappeared?? Unless you have electronics background and can do your own repair work. For my taste, I'd pick a used amp from a maker who's still around, not someone who vanishes without a trace

 But that's just my opinion


----------



## sxr71

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Whoever would want to buy a piece of electronic equipment whose maker has disappeared?? Unless you have electronics background and can do your own repair work. For my taste, I'd pick a used amp from a maker who's still around, not someone who vanishes without a trace

 But that's just my opinion_

 

I completely agree. I have a Supermini III and it now crackles when I turn the volume knob and the headphone jack needs to be pressed to the board. It sounds great don't get me wrong but I don't want to deal with it. It also happened to me with LaRocco. Some people like Ray Samuel and Justin and Headphone.com will always be around. I weigh that factor in a lot more these days.


----------



## kostalex

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *sxr71* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have a Supermini III and it now crackles when I turn the volume knob and the headphone jack needs to be pressed to the board._

 

Any qualified DIYer can repair this. Or local electronic repair shop can help.


----------



## paulybatz

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kostalex* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Any qualified DIYer can repair this. Or local electronic repair shop can help._

 

absolutely, find a DIY'r on the board...try craig at whiplash audio

 also, i had a SuperMacro3, thought it was awesome, then I got an iBasso D4 and no contest


----------



## kostalex

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *paulybatz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_also, i had a SuperMacro3, thought it was awesome, then I got an iBasso D4 and no contest_

 

Who won?


----------



## hockeyb213

thought it was awesome, then I got an iBasso D4 and no contest would imply the d4 killed the sm3


----------



## Sgt_Strider

So why are you guys not contacting the authorities in this? It seems like something is wrong here given how long you guys have waited.


----------



## tnmike1

OMIGOD--is this thread STILL alive?? Over 200,000 views and it's the Superfrankenthread. O PLEASE someone--let it die. He ain't comin' back, he ain't buildin' no more amps.

 Get the Eff over it and move on PLEASE


----------



## Jaw007

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *tnmike1* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_OMIGOD--is this thread STILL alive?? Over 200,000 views and it's the Superfrankenthread. O PLEASE someone--let it die. He ain't comin' back, he ain't buildin' no more amps.

 Get the Eff over it and move on PLEASE_

 

If this thread dies,then however many post one has made on this thread will be subtracted from your total post.This happened to me and they subtracted several hundred post from my total.Once had about 1800 posts now less than 1400 post.What a rip off!


----------



## BIG POPPA

This thread is almost Viral


----------



## freeone-j

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Jaw007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If this thread dies,then however many post one has made on this thread will be subtracted from your total post.This happened to me and they subtracted several hundred post from my total.Once had about 1800 posts now less than 1400 post.What a rip off!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Not as big of a rip off as Mr. Xin did 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




LOL! This could probably go down as the biggest scam on Head-Fi???


----------



## a_tumiwa

why he dont want just shut down the site, and finish the remaining one first


----------



## qusp

this thread should always still be around to serve as a warning to people to not place an order with xin, his site is still up and accepting orders, so as long as that is the case this thread should be kept alive. just the fact that he still has the site up with payment info is a sign to me that there is no doubt the man is a thieving gypsy. sure some people have received refunds from him, but only some and if he were truly just over worked, then surely removing the ability to make orders would be a good idea?? no??


----------



## Jigen

Too bad it had to turn out this way. I bought a Supermini IV back in Jan. '08, well before he disappeared. I received it in 3 months (and at the time I thought THAT was a long wait). I've been using it regularly since then and I don't have any complaints. It's a great portable amp. Maybe this was his plan all along. Build up a good reputation, and then disappear while scamming as many people as possible.

 What brings me back to this Xin thread is, recently I started hearing some static/audio cutting in and out when inserting and moving my headphone jack around. I'm not sure if it's my Ety's or the amp itself, but just in case, I'm looking for potential repair options. I searched for Xin and this is one of the threads I found. There's no way in hell I'm sending my amp back to Xin, though.


----------



## immtbiker

Smart move.
 Xin is on the "do not buy from list". Even though it is a mystery why Xin has vanished off the face of the earth, most people who have asked for their money back, have received it. I got mine back in late 2008, and people have reported getting a refund as close as this past Christmas. 
 So, although I, as a Moderator would highly not purchasing form him until he is back on track (which is stating the obvious, but for nooB's this advice can be quite helpful), he is not a crook, unless there are people who have requested a refund and not gotten it and I don't know about it), but obviously, he is going through a bad patch which has disabled him from being a current amp builder.

 But for those of you who need a repair, I would recommend highly, that you do not send your unit back to him, unless you have definitive correspondence with him, and he has assured you a timeline, and no money exchanges hands until you receive your unit back.

 Like in the case with Mikhail's amps, others need to be sought out, that are capable and willing to fix a portable.

 Maybe someone who has found somebody, can chime in here and make recommendations based upon their own personal experience and not just "hearsay". If Xin has posted his schematics somewhere on the web, then a decent troubleshooter should be able to figure out the cause of the problem (broken trace, bad resistor/capacitor or even a bad charging circuit).


----------



## Jigen

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *immtbiker* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_... he is not a crook, unless there are people who have requested a refund and not gotten it and I don't know about it)_

 

I see. I take back what I said in my previous post, then. Still, I wish he would at least make an official statement on the forum of his website.


----------



## FLCL

Wow..I had not idea. Guess it wasnt a good move on my part to purchase an amp just recently. I guess I'll be requesting a refund and buying a different amp, SuperMicroIV was going to be my first amp >.<


----------



## jamato8

Quote: 





flcl said:


> Wow..I had not idea. Guess it wasnt a good move on my part to purchase an amp just recently. I guess I'll be requesting a refund and buying a different amp, SuperMicroIV was going to be my first amp >.<


 
  Did any money actually go out or did you give a card number for the order?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

I placed an order 3 years ago for a SuperMini IV and haven't been charged for it or seen it yet.  I haven't canceled the order either, just in case, but the card I used expires soon...


----------



## jamato8

I don't like the IV as much as the previous one. Too bad my 3 was converted to a IV. I found the sound of the previous version to be more alive. 
   
  I remember when I was at Xin's house and in his work area there was a long stacked line of packages that were amps to be fixed or updated. I wonder what ever happened to those? There must have been 30 or more. My LE was in there as well but I never saw it again.


----------



## kiwirugby

I still marvel at the SuperMicro.  Not the most beautiful and sturdy of amps, but amazing sound for something so small.  I still use it in rotation with RSA Shadow and P51.  I haven't used my SuperMacro IV in ages.   Maybe it's the eight batteries and having to charge them.  Portable amps have become so much lighter....
   
  I really wonder what happened to Xin.   I used to email him back and forth quite a bit back in the day....and then nothing.
   
  Jamato, you hear from him, right?


----------



## FLCL

jamato8 said:


> Did any money actually go out or did you give a card number for the order?




I used my card through pay pal, and it was charged. I emailed the contact email requesting a refund the other day but I have a feeling I'm going to be calling paypal and having them issue a charge-back for the purchase.


----------



## jamato8

Quote: 





			
				kiwirugby said:
			
		

> Jamato, you hear from him, right?


 
  No. He doesn't reply any longer. A friend of his in China hasn't heard from him in a couple of years. The thing I got from him was some adapters to use the HA5002 in a standard socket. Even that surprised me. I once emailed him and he thought I was coming by his house and he said simply, "sure". 
   
  When I would visit him he always had out sheets of op amps and studied all of them to get to the ones he liked best. One book he had compiled of pdfs was over 2 inches thick of just op amps! There were other issues that I can't go into, but his main love was/is computers.


----------



## sunneebear

Quote: 





kiwirugby said:


> I still marvel at the SuperMicro.  Not the most beautiful and sturdy of amps, but amazing sound for something so small.  I still use it in rotation with RSA Shadow and P51.


 


  I have a couple of large caps that was used for the Reference.  Instead of leaving it there for nothing my brother stucked it on his supermicro4.  Yes he cap is almost the size of the amp but hey, its still small.  Amazing amp with or without the extra cap.


----------



## Quaddy

still waiting for my amps, i ordered in august 2007. 5 years and counting


----------



## sunneebear

Quote: 





quaddy said:


> still waiting for my amps, i ordered in august 2007. 5 years and counting


 
  Congratulations!  
   
  You win the most patient person on earth award.
   
  But I feel sorry for you


----------



## sashaw

Quote: 





quaddy said:


> still waiting for my amps, i ordered in august 2007. 5 years and counting


 
   
  LOL, waiting for you to pump this thread when your waiting time reaches 10 years.


----------



## kiwirugby

In addition to the Supermicro, I still have the Supermacro IV that Xin kept asking me to send back for tweaks.  (I'll have to see if I still have his email explaining what he did.)  The Supermacro is the one with the four switches (It's ABC, if I remember correctly).  I also have one of his Sony FM stereos that he modified and that attached to one of his first amps (almost square with a digital volume).  Some of these may qualify for the antiques road show!  The amazing thing is that they all still sound so great!


----------



## nc8000

Yep. Impedance, Amp gain, Bass boost and Crossfeed. His amps were so far ahead of the curve for the time. What a shame that he just vanished. I have had almost every amp of his after to original Headroom Airhead which I assume must have been about 10 years ago


----------



## sunneebear

Quote: 





nc8000 said:


> Yep. Impedance, Amp gain, Bass boost and Crossfeed. His amps were so far ahead of the curve for the time. What a shame that he just vanished.


 
   
  I was going to say the same thing.  Maybe he just burned out.  Too much work for just one man.


----------



## wangch

I still use my Supermini IV, I sent it to him last year in March 2011 to upgrade got it back April 2011. still love the sound, I use it with my Sony D-25 and my Yuin PK1


----------



## nc8000

Certainly my all time favorite portable rig was a fatty Nano strapped onto a SuperMini IV with APS recabled ER4


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





wangch said:


> I still use my Supermini IV, I sent it to him last year in March 2011 to upgrade got it back April 2011. still love the sound, I use it with my Sony D-25 and my Yuin PK1


 
   
  How in the world did you ever make contact with Xin, after all the time he's been AWOL?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





quaddy said:


> still waiting for my amps, i ordered in august 2007. 5 years and counting


 
   
  In March 2011 I was at 3 years, so I guess it's 4.5 years now waiting for my Super Mini IV.  In Jan 2009 Xin told me it would ship in a month, and I never heard back.


----------



## wangch

It was weird, I was having problems with my supermini iv, randomly I emailed him not thinking he would respond, he responded told me to send it to him, he sent it back within a month, very happy


----------



## sunneebear

You've just opened the flood gates on his email.


----------



## sygyzy

What amps are currently available that rival Xin's amps in terms of price, versatility, options, size etc?


----------



## sunneebear

I may be wrong but I think Xin was first with micro sized amps, surface mount circuits, dual and quad amps with buffers and was fully user tunable.

The amp in his reference amplifier was the size of a dime and can drive the Hifiman HE6 with amazing sound quality. A headphone that I use 100 watt speaker amps to drive.


----------



## sashaw

Too bad, he is not going to make any amp. Really wanna get one.


----------



## sunneebear

Sorry, mistake.


----------



## kiwirugby

Quote: 





sunneebear said:


> I may be wrong but I think Xin was first with micro sized amps, surface mount circuits, dual and quad amps with buffers and was fully user tunable.
> The amp in his reference amplifier was the size of a dime and can drive the Hifiman HE6 with amazing sound quality. A headphone that I use 100 watt speaker amps to drive.


 
  Makes me want to put some batteries in my Supermacro IV and see how it works with the HE500s!  A weekend project.


----------



## jamato8

The Supermacro III is still one of my favorites. With the right opamps, it competes with anything out there.


----------



## evilking

Completely forgot about this thread.
   
  Tried to order an amp about five/six years ago...


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## eron

If anyone wants to track him down, this is info on him from 10 years ago.


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## jamato8

Quote: 





eron said:


> If anyone wants to track him down, this is info on him from 10 years ago.


 
  What has this got to do with tracking him down and why would someone need to? Where he lives is no mystery.


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## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





jamato8 said:


> What has this got to do with tracking him down and why would someone need to? Where he lives is no mystery.


 
   
  No mystery to semi-close friend's like you maybe.


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## jamato8

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> No mystery to semi-close friend's like you maybe.


 
  He is still in Oregon. He always had his address on his site.


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## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





jamato8 said:


> He is still in Oregon. He always had his address on his site.


 
   
  But with his lack of responses for so long it's easy to assume that he could be dead, or moved away with a new email address.


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## kiwirugby

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> But with his lack of responses for so long it's easy to assume that he could be dead, or moved away with a new email address.


 
  Or building the DAP/Radio/DAC/Amp of all DAP/Radio/DAC/Amps!
   
  Regardless, we can all hope he's all right.  I know there are those who had high expectations and severe disappointments, so there is some tempering there.
   
  I still use and marvel at this SuperMacro IV and Supermicro, especially the latter with one AA.....


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## Happy Camper

Another macro IV fan here.


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## nc8000

I think I've owned just about every Xin amp and given how far agead of the curve he was when he stopped keeps me wondering where his products would have been today had he carried on


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## jamato8

He always told me that if some of the products that came after his hit the market had been in place, he would not have made amps. He just wanted a good sounding amp and to provide that for other people.
   
  My favorite is still the Supermacro III and the Micro. The Mini was his favorite and was the first to use the famed high output opamp (I can't think of the number right now but very well known).


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## HeadphoneAddict

I'd still be happy if he emailed me and said my SuperMini is ready.  I liked the SuperMacro III that I had.  Not sure why I sold it...
   
  Was it the AD8616?  That's the "tube-alike" one he offered that I ordered with the SuperMini.


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## jamato8

I remember now, it was the 8397. That is what Xin used in the Supermini and the Supermini was always his first love for an amp. If I ever get back up to Oregon I will look Xin up, most likely just drop in on him as he doesn't answer the phone. Too bad, good memories from back in 2005 and 2006. I still have all my Xin amps, a few Reference amps, that sound excellent, and others.


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## nangryo

Is Dr Xin still alive?


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## nakedtoes

Memories...... hows Dr XIN now?


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## HeadphoneAddict

nakedtoes said:


> Memories...... hows Dr XIN now?



Don't know, but I wait every day to get called that my SuperMini is ready. Not.


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## HeadphoneAddict

HeadphoneAddict said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> In March 2011 I was at 3 years, so I guess it's 4.5 years now waiting for my Super Mini IV.  In Jan 2009 Xin told me it would ship in a month, and I never heard back.



Wow, forgot mine should have been here in Feb 2009, a month after he last wrote to me!


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## sunneebear

Ha ha, the good old days.

Still have my Reference connected to my ipod classic and Supermicro 3 on a little Sony dap.


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