# Any Sim Racing Fans?



## proton007

Do any of you enjoy Sim Racing ?
   
  I'm a big fan of GTR2. Playing it for 4 years now. The most realistic game I've tried, in terms of physics and handling, and the car setup is awesome. 
  Also the mods and extra tracks are amazing.


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## NamelessPFG

I've tried to get into it every now and then, but the learning curve's pretty brutal, especially if arcade racing games have taught you bad habits like leadfooting your way to the finish line.
   
  Then again, it doesn't help that I'm trying to dive into the sort of racing sims that the SimHQ community would like, stuff like Richard Burns Rally and Grand Prix Legends, both noted for having brutally realistic driving physics. (The SimBin racers like GTR2 are also well-regarded, but I don't own any of them.)


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## proton007

Sim HQ seems pretty hardcore. Thanks for the link, didn't know about it.
   
  And it gets pretty expensive if one needs a proper seat and multiple screens, plus some powerful hardware. I plan to do that some time in the future...
   
  Took me a while to get a hang of things. Even now, I still keep improving, and from what I know, these skills can also help in real life.
   
  I've also heard good things about rFactor.


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## asmoday

Been a SIM Racing fan for years. I used to spend a lot of my time racing in various leagues around the Internet but now mainly just race iracing for fun and hang out with a few friends.


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## Eee Pee

I'm still after all these years semi addicted to Gran Turismo.  Currently play GT5 probably a few couple hours a week.  What helps is their weekly race challenges.  I started playing the first one because I was an avid Autocrosser.  I'll admit it helped me learn.
   
  As much as I'd like to play the PC good ones, I'm past it.  Good news is there's a GT6 coming out at some point.


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## Draygonn

I followed insidesimracing.tv for a while and got a G27 and a bunch of games. Dirt 2, F1 2010, Simbin titles such as GTR Evolution, NFS: Shift, R Factor, and GRID. I enjoyed the racing a ton but noticed that I curse like a drunken sailor while racing. The G27 has been packed up for a while but I'll probably break it out when Grid 2 is released next year. I'm tempted to grab the new F1 title but I'm so busy with Borderlands2, GW2, and a bunch of new stuff on the horizon so I'll probably wait for a steamsale.


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## Kiwikat

I get out the G27 and play some GT5 every once in a while.  Not sure what happened to the GT series, but I feel it peaked around 2 or 3.  They really need to step up their game for 6.


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## asmoday

Quote: 





kiwikat said:


> I get out the G27 and play some GT5 every once in a while.  Not sure what happened to the GT series, but I feel it peaked around 2 or 3.  They really need to step up their game for 6.


 
   
  I couldn't agree more about them needing to step there game up for 6, or at least get back to the roots of the series that for me seems to have peaked with 3.


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## oqvist

I am a bit of a burned out simracing fan. But I am sporadically getting back into the saddle. It will take practise before you can compete but it´s like learning to ride a bike. Once you learned you can get back up pretty quickly and it improves your real world driving skills also if you drive the right simulations.
   
  Draygonn if you want to do your wheel justice stick with Race 07 and rFactor of those titles you mention. The other ones are game pad optimized and console damaged arcade titles. I do preferr them all with a wheel but you may get a bit disappointed with your purchase perhaps.
   
  My personal tarmac favourite is Game Stock Car. I don´t know if it will ever pick off on the multiplayer scene but all the cars are made for close racing as in everyone drives the same car just different bodywork on the V8s. Superb physics and force feedback best I have encountered and for very little money.
   
  gravel/rally Richard Burns Rally seem to be destined to be the forever king sadly. Sad that rally get so little appreciation nowadays though WRC 3 is sure fun. It´s more of a semi simulation though it´s certainly more serious then the DIRT series particularly regarding tracks.
   
  It don´t really cost much. Sure you should get a wheel though you can get surprisingly fast with a joystick but you don´t desperately need triple monitors, cockpits or separate shifters and the likes you need a quick brain and just hate to loose if you want to be really competitive lol. the next gen of the simulations is rolling out but for the current you don´t need much of a computer.


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## proton007

I'm thinking of getting a G27 but no space in my room. I agree a joystick can suffice, but its not really the correct way is it?


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## oqvist

Well there is joysticks for handicapped people like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgJPpBvXSds
   
  I wouldn´t know if you could get slower or faster or no difference in such a setup. I have wooden legs so I suspect I may not really be slower once I learned the ropes . In Grand Prix Legends with the formula cars with no wings to add downforce a joystick could be benefitial to fast and easy correct the 4-wheel drifts so there you got joystick jockeys that was really competitive.
   
  Personally I preferr to race the cars as they are in real life though. Everybody I know use racing wheels. But I am sure you can get competitive with a joystick also. You don´t need to have the most expensive gear to get fast in simracing. It´s not a material sport like real racing. Personal skill matters the absolute most.


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## proton007

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> Personally I preferr to race the cars as they are in real life though. Everybody I know use racing wheels. But I am sure you can get competitive with a joystick also. You don´t need to have the most expensive gear to get fast in simracing. It´s not a material sport like real racing. Personal skill matters the absolute most.


 
   
  I guess thats right. Our mind can get used to any kind of control, but its not the full experience. I'm looking forward to getting a G27 sometime.


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## asmoday

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> I guess thats right. Our mind can get used to any kind of control, but its not the *full experience*. I'm looking forward to getting a G27 sometime.


 
   
  While I have a pretty decent set-up (triple screens, shifters, button boxes, aftermarket pedals, 4 different wheels) none of this I feel really makes me any faster but it does add to the realism. I spend 90% of my racing now in iracing which by some claims is the most realistic sim out there, and I know guys who are faster with a controller than a wheel. You can make abrupt changes faster do to not having to turn a 900 degree rotation wheels. With a wheel you can be more precise and I feel have better overall control but the guys who are good with a controller you wouldn't even guess they were using one. 
   
  In the end most of it comes down to what you can afford and enjoy. It doesn't take a multi thousand dollar setup to be fast and have fun. 
   
  I kind of cringe when I look back at all the money I have tied up in my rig, but it was also built over many years so it didn't hurt so bad........lol
   
  That G27 is a very nice wheel and will reward you very well if/when you decide to get one. If price is a concern at all you could always take a look at the Logitec Driving Force GT (usually referred to as DFGT). Its a very nice wheel for the price and I feel a extremely good value.


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## proton007

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> In the end most of it comes down to what you can afford and enjoy. It doesn't take a multi thousand dollar setup to be fast and have fun.
> 
> I kind of cringe when I look back at all the money I have tied up in my rig, but it was also built over many years so it didn't hurt so bad........lol
> 
> That G27 is a very nice wheel and will reward you very well if/when you decide to get one. If price is a concern at all you could always take a look at the Logitec Driving Force GT (usually referred to as DFGT). Its a very nice wheel for the price and I feel a extremely good value.


 
   
  Yeah I guess I'll have to start somewhere.
  I like the G27 because it has all 3 pedals along with the clutch. The DFGT only has two.


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## proton007

Tried a few laps just now. I guess I'm still refining my technique, I managed to shave off 0.5 to 1 sec from a lot of my laps. I was getting on the power too late, too much coasting, so I tried to be a bit early on the throttle, so the apex is cut under acceleration. Now I'm finally getting to use the torque.
   
  Thats why I love sim racing...


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## asmoday

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> Yeah I guess I'll have to start somewhere.
> I like the G27 because it has all 3 pedals along with the clutch. The DFGT only has two.


 
   
  Smart move, while the DFGT is a nice wheel and does everything well, I am sure you would want to upgrade at some point from it. 
   
  The G27 is most certainly a wheel that could last you the rest of your SIM racing career.


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## Draygonn

Racing with a wheel is much more enjoyable.


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## oqvist

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> Smart move, while the DFGT is a nice wheel and does everything well, I am sure you would want to upgrade at some point from it.
> 
> The G27 is most certainly a wheel that could last you the rest of your SIM racing career.


 
  There is better wheels though.
   
  I preferr the Fanatecs though the G27 has come down in price so it´s an okayish budget option. If you go up a bit more you have wheels like the T500 RS and then the CSR Elite and CSW. There is also Frex and Ecci force feedback wheels.
   
  G27 won´t last a lifetime neither will the thrustmaster or Fanatec wheels I recon. They do where down but they do generally last a couple of years at least if you are using it quite frequently. Like audio you have to choose your budget wisely 
   
  If you want to race on xbox you are pretty much limited to Fanatec if you want a decent wheel.


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## proton007

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> There is better wheels though.
> 
> I preferr the Fanatecs though the G27 has come down in price so it´s an okayish budget option. If you go up a bit more you have wheels like the T500 RS and then the CSR Elite and CSW. There is also Frex and Ecci force feedback wheels.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks for the info!


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## asmoday

Yes there are better wheels out there and I own some ALOT better than it, but for the price the G27 is hard to beat. 
   
  I really liked my GT3RSv2 but I sold it soon after getting my ECCI Setup. 
   
  I have owned the DFGT, G25 (still own), G27 (returned didnt see the upgrade over the 25), Fanatec GT3RSv2 (sold), TSW 720, ECCI 6000, ECCI 7000. My personal opinion pedals make more of a difference than wheels do. Being able to modulate the gas and brake precisely makes more of a difference than wheels. 
   
  Here is my current set-up minus the button box and shifter. I am in the process of relocating it to a different room and its slowly being stipped.....lol


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## proton007

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> Yes there are better wheels out there and I own some ALOT better than it, but for the price the G27 is hard to beat.
> 
> I really liked my GT3RSv2 but I sold it soon after getting my ECCI Setup.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Wow thats a good one.
  I'd love to have something like that, but I'm just afraid of collecting a lot of stuff...a bit troublesome when shifting houses (rental)...


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## oqvist

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> Yes there are better wheels out there and I own some ALOT better than it, but for the price the G27 is hard to beat.
> 
> I really liked my GT3RSv2 but I sold it soon after getting my ECCI Setup.
> 
> ...


 
  That´s a really nice setup. Are you using ECCIs FFB wheel now? Is the Obutto Ozone stable enough to cope with your ECCI and triple monitors. 
   
  I was looking for an Ozone but it was a problem with importing and went extreme instead. Personally I use a nixim racecraft Mark2. Different colour and chair and without monitor stand but you get the picture http://www.nixim.com/forums/album.php?albumid=7&attachmentid=149. It´s very special to race in a cockpit where it´s just impossible to get it to flex whatsoever. Tons of steel. I think he even put on even more to compensate for long delivery time lol. Big and bulky so you gotta have room though. Mark 3 is even wider.
   
  G27 is really malplaced here but I am not that into simracing anymore so have limited my expenses on it. The cockpit is as versatile as it gets for gaming purposes so it get ton of use anyway.


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## asmoday

Honestly with the Nixim I see no need for a Obutto. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I went with the Obutto with because at the time I could buy it semi local and save on the shipping. It is very well put together and does a decent job of handling the weight. I do think it would be a little more stable with 24" monitors instead of the 27" that I have on it. There is a little (very little) side to side wobble with it as it is now, plus I cant really get the angle for the monitors I would like do to the arms hitting the center monitor. They do have a new monitor mount (aftermarket but recognized by Obutto) that is made for bigger monitors now. I had thought about getting one and probably will at some point but I have been using mine in its current state for 2 years now and have gotten use to it. 
   
  I bounce back and forth between the ECCI 6000 and 7000. I really like them both equally, I started SIM Racing back before there was FFB Wheels so I am still a little partial to Non FFB wheels. Sometimes I feel the FFB gets in the way, if I am out to be super competitive for the night or whatever I use the Non FFB wheel, just wanting to have fun and add as much realism as possible I go with the FFB one. There so easy to swap in out it can be done within minuets so its not a issue. How ever if I didn't already own both, I would probably just settle for the 7000.
   
  I think there is both pluses and minuses for both G27 and Fanatec wheels. With different internal workings I can find good and bad in both, I ultimately used the GT3RSv2 more than the Logi wheels when I still had it. I liked the sort of built in dampening you get with the belt drive wheel. 
   
  I would still like to try the T500RS and Fanatec Clubsport Wheel at some point along with the new Clubsport Pedals to see how they stack up against the older Clubsport Pedals. But I have way to many steering wheels and pedals lying around now that don't get any use.


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## NamelessPFG

ECCI? Holy crap, you've got the Stax of racing wheels there...wish I could afford the FFB version myself, but by that point, I could probably afford a used car!
   
  On the other hand, if I wreck a virtual rally car in a simpit, all I have to do is hit "restart"...


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## proton007

Quote: 





namelesspfg said:


> On the other hand, if I wreck a virtual rally car in a simpit, all I have to do is hit "restart"...


 
   
  Thats true.
  On the other hand, I've also heard that some ppl have been helped by sim racing in real life. Their response times and awareness improved, and they've managed to save their car from being wrecked.


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## oqvist

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> Thats true.
> On the other hand, I've also heard that some ppl have been helped by sim racing in real life. Their response times and awareness improved, and they've managed to save their car from being wrecked.


 
  It´s a double edged sword though. I started to push the pedal harder after getting into simracing. But absolutely the difference in control of the car before and after is immense.
   
  You can´t compare the cost at all to real racing. It´s one thing to buy a race car then another one to maintain it. Then it´s the extra track fees and all that.


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## proton007

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> It´s a double edged sword though. I started to push the pedal harder after getting into simracing. But absolutely the difference in control of the car before and after is immense.
> 
> You can´t compare the cost at all to real racing. It´s one thing to buy a race car then another one to maintain it. Then it´s the extra track fees and all that.


 
   
  Oh, I meant it more in terms of normal everyday driving.
   
  Yes, it cannot be compared to a real car, but I think creating a realistic simulator, the likes of which are used in F1, would probably cost more than a cheap car that can be used for race weekends.


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## Draygonn

I played Pole Position all the time before I was old enough to have a drivers license. Learning how to recover from spinning out helped save my mother's car a few times after I got my license.


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## streetdragon

I love gran turismo2,3,4,5, but unfortunately i cant afford to get a ps3 and a wheel...


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## proton007

Anyone heard anything abount GTR3? I've been waiting for months now.


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## asmoday

Count yourself luck you have only been waiting a couple months, I have been waiting for it for over a year now.


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## proton007

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> Count yourself luck you have only been waiting a couple months, I have been waiting for it for over a year now.


 

 Not really a couple...months...7-8 now.  The teasers look, well, so tantalizing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  But I understand SimBin is not a major studio, they just seem like a bunch of guys having a fun time, doing what they like to do...
  So I think it might be worth the wait.


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## asmoday

They seem to be taking every approach NOT to work on GTR3 for some reason. 
   
  It was first mentioned close to 2 years ago, then they decided to derail and milk the Race07 with more add-ons. Then it was stated production was going to start. Then we get more stuff for the "free" series RaceRoom so it makes me wonder just how much work has actually been done or are doing. 
   
  That Lizard Engine should be awesome for sure when its released. I have every SIMBIN game and add-on to date, but I think I am done supporting them till GTR3.


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## proton007

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> They seem to be taking every approach NOT to work on GTR3 for some reason.
> 
> It was first mentioned close to 2 years ago, then they decided to derail and milk the Race07 with more add-ons. Then it was stated production was going to start. Then we get more stuff for the "free" series RaceRoom so it makes me wonder just how much work has actually been done or are doing.
> 
> That Lizard Engine should be awesome for sure when its released. I have every SIMBIN game and add-on to date, but I think I am done supporting them till GTR3.


 

 I only play GTR2, but with the amount of mods and tracks, the platform has shown no signs of slowing down. I think the problem is they need to get something new and better on the table, and its not easy considering how solid GTR2 is.


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## proton007

That reminds me, have you tried raceroom?


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## asmoday

Yep and its pretty solid. Not much of a online community though.


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## proton007

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> Yep and its pretty solid. Not much of a online community though.


 

 Ok, so from what I see its free? I guess its purely online? Or can I play offline? 
  The graphics look pretty nice.


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## oqvist

Blimey who now makes C.A.R.S and changed name to slightly mad studios was doing most of the work with the GTR titles. That is one reason we haven´t got GTR 3 yet I imagine. Will see how it goes when it comes out whenever that will be. 
  Game stock car is my top sim at the moment I would be happy with just something on that level it would been a big improvement over GTR 2.
  rFactor 2 is looking good as long as you have a proper force feedback wheel. It really show the G27 limitations in a really bad way. But I like their non compromising approach to it.
  There is tweaks to the controller.ini file which make the G27 work though a bit numbed down.


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## asmoday

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> Blimey who now makes C.A.R.S and changed name to slightly mad studios was doing most of the work with the GTR titles. That is one reason we haven´t got GTR 3 yet I imagine. Will see how it goes when it comes out whenever that will be.
> Game stock car is my top sim at the moment I would be happy with just something on that level it would been a big improvement over GTR 2.
> rFactor 2 is looking good as long as you have a proper force feedback wheel. It really show the G27 limitations in a really bad way. But I like their non compromising approach to it.
> There is tweaks to the controller.ini file which make the G27 work though a bit numbed down.


 
  I really need to update my C.A.R.S. to the newest version and give that a go again, I really liked where they were heading with it last time I played it. Summer months don't let me a lot of game time so hopefully now that its heading towards winter here, that will change. 
   
  I really like Game Stock Car too, even though its nothing more than a paid mod for rFactor. 
   
  Have they got the triple screen debacle figured out with RF2 yet? I haven't even attempted to use it in months because of that.


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## oqvist

Quote: 





asmoday said:


> I really need to update my C.A.R.S. to the newest version and give that a go again, I really liked where they were heading with it last time I played it. Summer months don't let me a lot of game time so hopefully now that its heading towards winter here, that will change.
> 
> I really like Game Stock Car too, even though its nothing more than a paid mod for rFactor.
> 
> Have they got the triple screen debacle figured out with RF2 yet? I haven't even attempted to use it in months because of that.


 
  I think that is a bit unfair to Game Stock Car. It´s certainly based on the ISI engine but it´s force feedback and physics is tweaked beyond recognition and the selection of cars is spot on. Insane value really at 19$. The only thing that is just as bad is the AI. In one way it´s a positive sign they didn´t knock their heads blue on that one. AI always suck more or less compared to the real deal but wish it was more usable for practise 
   
  Don´t know how it´s with triple monitor on rFactor 2. I take for granted they fix that before release at least. Whenever that may be. I haven´t driven rfactor 2 for months either. C.A.R.S I will get when it´s ready most likely.


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## grokit

draygonn said:


> I played Pole Position all the time before I was old enough to have a drivers license. Learning how to recover from spinning out helped save my mother's car a few times after I got my license.




Haha I use to play that on an Atari 5200 h34r:

I liked GT3 quite a bit, and have tried a few others like Dirt 2 and GRID, Prologue, a few more. Speed Racer on the NDS is very good! But what currently gets all my wheel time is the Motorstorm series for the PS3. All three versions rock, but will rank them: Pacific Rift > Apocalypse > Monument Valley.


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## DonGaz

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> Ok, so from what I see its free? I guess its purely online? Or can I play offline?
> The graphics look pretty nice.


 

 Yes it will be free with in-game purchases. From the Simbin site:
_RaceRoom Racing Experience is a Free 2 Race concept where a high end racing game is provided for free. The concept offers the opportunity to purchase additional content, thus allowing every user to build the game of their dreams._
   
  When it's finished, you can play it both online and offline. See this article: http://insider.simbin.com/qa-part-4-raceroom-racing-experience-2/ (scroll down)
   
  FYI, it is build using their new RendR engine.


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## Draygonn

Anyone have wheelstand recommendations? I don't have room for a full rig and want something to use with an IKEA Poang chair (which is at the wrong height to attach the wheel to a table).


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## oqvist

Maybe this would work? http://www.fanatec.de/webshop/new_usa/product_info.php?cPath=29&products_id=88&osCsid=4bb0db88d8742575a78443bbd9ef9549


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## proton007

Quote: 





draygonn said:


> Anyone have wheelstand recommendations? I don't have room for a full rig and want something to use with an IKEA Poang chair (which is at the wrong height to attach the wheel to a table).


 
   
  Here's one hack: http://www.ikeahackers.net/2010/01/xbox-wheel-hack.html


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## Draygonn

oqvist said:


> Maybe this would work? http://www.fanatec.de/webshop/new_usa/product_info.php?cPath=29&products_id=88&osCsid=4bb0db88d8742575a78443bbd9ef9549


Reviews state it is very stable, convenient, pre-drilled for the G27, and I would finally be able to use the shifter. 




proton007 said:


> Here's one hack: http://www.ikeahackers.net/2010/01/xbox-wheel-hack.html


IKEA Hackers, awesome. $24 can't be beat.
Reminds me of the MacGuyver Smoker from Half Baked.


Spoiler



[VIDEO]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGx_RbGb9CI[/VIDEO]



Thanks Guys


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## proton007

Tried raceroom teaser yesterday. Graphics look nice, but there was no option to configure my controller.


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## SkitZ0

I'm a fan of sim-racing games.  From what I hear, GTR2 is pretty badass.  One of these days, I'll have to give it a spin.


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## proton007

skitz0 said:


> I'm a fan of sim-racing games.  From what I hear, GTR2 is pretty badass.  One of these days, I'll have to give it a spin.




Try it if you haven't, its pretty good. And exhausting (atleast for me).


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## oqvist

New wheel on it´s way  http://www.thrustmaster.com/en_US/products/ferrari-f1-wheel-integral-t500


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## proton007

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> New wheel on it´s way  http://www.thrustmaster.com/en_US/products/ferrari-f1-wheel-integral-t500


 
   
  $700. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  But then, it might be worth it.


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## oqvist

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> $700.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Didn´t pay that price. It was down to 350$ in some black friday deals.
  T500RS is around 380 in sweden though with the F1 wheel it´s a bit more.  Hopefully it´s worth it


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## proton007

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> Didn´t pay that price. It was down to 350$ in some black friday deals.
> T500RS is around 380 in sweden though with the F1 wheel it´s a bit more.  Hopefully it´s worth it


 

 Do you use it on a proper rig? Or on a table based setup? 
  I want to get one of these, but I'm always afraid I'll have to get the whole seat + frame combo for the best experience.


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## oqvist

Quote: 





proton007 said:


> Do you use it on a proper rig? Or on a table based setup?
> I want to get one of these, but I'm always afraid I'll have to get the whole seat + frame combo for the best experience.


 
   
  I have a nixim racecraft GT it can take anything. Table based setups is not to bad if they are stable. Ergonomics is considerably better then formula type of cockpits where your ass is below your legs if you can somehow fixate your pedals and chair. I started simracing with just a regular swiveling office chair and it worked too with wheels like the momo racing red and logitech driving force GT.
   
  But yes a good cockpit you can adjust to suite you helps with immersion and consistancy and less ass pain for longer races. Running those 2h endurances in my offce chair I remembered the last 15 minutes was just about survival


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## Pudu

I threw together a quick and dirty chair mount to keep it from sliding back from the pedals. 



I've been messing around with racing sims since the days of ICR2 and I have to say GSC 2012 is the best single player racing to be had since ICR2. Reiza managed to do with the AI that which ISI was never able. And the cars handle brilliantly - predictable but tricky to hold on the edge. rFactor was mostly pointless for single player, but GSC2012 is a blast. The classic F1 cars are an absolute hoot. I downloaded some skins, whipped up some talent files, and have an F1 1991 season ongoing. Great stuff. And for $19.99 it's a steal.


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## ninjapirate9901

Looking to get back into PC sim racing in the near future. I've been content over the last few years with the Forza's and GT5, which are fun and have a decent community. Started getting back into GTR2 and pCARS at the beginning of last year, currently looking at grabbing Asetto Corsa and Rfactor 2.
   
  Having since moved countries I had to leave my rig behind but now I'm looking to re-invest. I'm currently looking into building a sim setup based around a CSR/CSR Elite so that I can use it with all my systems. I'll also need to do a new desktop build (or maybe look into a Clevo based system).
   
  Slightly off topic: What do you use for sound when sim racing/gaming? I usually only use my headphones when I need to keep the noise down (late night/early morning gaming).


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## Pudu

In the same boat - headphones for racing. The engine rumble seems to propagate through a house more than a lot of games. I recently switched up from an aged G25 to a CSW and I have to say I do not miss the Grrrrrrthwap....Grrrrrrrthwap every time my computer starts up - that noise also seemed to go straight through the house.

I've been messing with pCars for a year or so - still waiting for it to be drive-able with AI (completely pointless at the moment). I can't bring myself to drop money on rF2 - until they make some serious improvements. The yearly fee is off putting (even though I think, since I'm mostly offline, it wouldn't affect me that much as I understand it). Can't wait to see what AC brings to the table - I try to manage my expectations on these things.

You should check out Game Stock Car 2012 if you haven't already. It's what rFactor should have been and is the best spent $20 in sim racing this year.


----------



## Draygonn

ninjapirate9901 said:


> Slightly off topic: What do you use for sound when sim racing/gaming? I usually only use my headphones when I need to keep the noise down (late night/early morning gaming).


Headphones and a Buttkicker for the rumble of the engine (and running over the curb).




pudu said:


> I recently switched up from an aged G25 to a CSW and I have to say I do not miss the Grrrrrrthwap....Grrrrrrrthwap every time my computer starts up - that noise also seemed to go straight through the house.


Thats why I only connect my G27 when I'm ready to play. That sound is sooooo annoying.




pudu said:


> You should check out Game Stock Car 2012 if you haven't already. It's what rFactor should have been and is the best spent $20 in sim racing this year.


I have it downloaded. Going to break the wheel out after I finish messing around with BL2.


----------



## Pudu

If you want a link to some converted tracks, let me know.


----------



## oqvist

AI is one thing but once you get hooked to a good racing club/league AI will feel so bland.
   
  I do agree GSC AI is about as good as any I seen but it´s so pale in comparison. I do need some career mode to have any fun with AI.
   I am in a PNG 3 historic league currently with changeable weather. two weeks to prepare for the races and if you don´t you are kind of toasted 
  Amazing racing as real as it gets. One problem with AI is as you know it´s AI how can you respect them like they where real? If I put somebody off I feel like I killed someone for real.
  Does anybody here get this 190 in heart pulse chasing AI or hotlapping?
   
  I really like how the rFactor 2 beta progresses too. Just wished it could have better visuals and the improved tire modelling and all may require me to get a new computer as well. Nothing is free 
  btw yearly fee is well quite okay really. Think about it how many here run games like Far Cry 3 or Battlefield 3 etc for more then a year? Some multiplayer oriented do I am sure but the majority don´t.
  If ISI continue to develop updates to rFactor 2 it will probably not seem that bad. I couldn´t cope with the iRacing pricing theme that just got to much for me and it´s a bit behind the rFactor 2 beta in term of physics and car selection I feel.
  Tracks look a LOT better though. Visuals is kind of worrying on the rFactor 2 beta but from my experience you get used to this and it´s how the cars behave that really matters. PNG 3 is no benchmark regarding visuals either but it works 
   
  Going by netkar Pro/fva Assetto Corsa should be awesome. Look forward to Reizas upcoming formula Truck series. PCARS I am curious about too. Wonder what sims that will spring out from rFactor  2. As for Simbin I don´t know what to expect. Raceroom Experience I am far from crazy about and who knows if that is "GTR 3" or not.
   
  I am using headphones 100 %. I do have neighboors so it´s not like I have an option. I kind of like it because it means I can kill some of the noises my wheels and pedals put out? My T500RS is an extreme improvement over my G27 regarding feel and noise but it still don´t sound like the real deal that don´t sound like anything at all


----------



## Pudu

I would love to be able to race in a league and I've tried it a number of times over the last 5 years or so. But it is nearly impossible for me to ensure I have the time needed for racing online uninterrupted - with two small kids, one wife, one cat - there is always some kind of interruption/conflicting commitment that has ruined just about every online race I've tried. 

"*Leave me alone, I know what I'm doing!*" may work for the Iceman, but I don't recommend you try it on your spouse. (I hope he didn't try it either)

Plus, now, I doubt there are many leagues compatible with my time-zone / latency zone. 

Long long ago I was in an ICRII league. We would each run our race and then email in the results along with the race replay and the times would be used to calculate the results. It wasn't perfect, but it was total hoot. 

I agree that the adrenaline levels are much higher in online racing. I try to treat offline races as real as possible for that reason - no skipping outlaps/inlaps etc. But you can definitely get into the zone hot-lapping Monaco during qualifying. 

Judging on past ISI performance there is no way I could justify a yearly fee. I payed once for BF2 (and a couple of expansion packs that added content) and played it for 5 years. BF3 was less of a deal but I'm still playing it weekly. Now if the yearly rF2 fee is only for online access and goes to managing servers, then I might spring for it since I wouldn't probably need to pay for stuff I'm not using. 

 I never played netkar but I'm hoping the AC hype lives up to potential. Truthfully pCARS seems a bit like a screenshot platform at the moment (okay, that was unfair). every couple of weeks I fire it up and then remember why I quit after about 5-10 minutes.


----------



## ninjapirate9901

The leagues that I tried racing with in New Zealand were a bit too much for me skill wise, i.e. I sucked too much at that stage to really get into it. Latency is also a huge issue in NZ if you want to race against opponents from other countries.
   
  This pretty much meant that most of the people that continued to play online (after say 6 months) in NZ were fairly dedicated. I found that when I came to the US, BF3 matches online became quite a bit easier (in general) due to the larger number of average level players (which I am a part of).
   
  I really do hope pCARS shapes into something better (I haven't had the opportunity to try it with a wheel since last June) especially since I dumped a couple hundred bucks on it. Hell I remember when I first tried it last January and the input lag was a killer (I believe they have fixed that now) and track/vehicle selection was pretty poor. Now you can fang a Zonda R around the 'ring at night so things are getting better.


----------



## oqvist

Guess I am lucky being Europe where racing appear quite popular and having a good infrastructure. I have done some US races as well 5 in the morning ... Where there is will there is a way lol


----------



## Pudu

Jerez - for anyone who wants to do a little pre-season testing in GSC.


----------



## Draygonn

I picked up F1 2012 and set up my g27 after a long layoff. It will take me a while to get up to speed but I'm glad to be racing again.
:atsmile:


----------



## Draygonn

Got 3 free months of iRacing with the Cadillac promo. Tried out several cars and tracks. Crashed many times . I'll need a lot of practice before hopping into a race.


----------



## Pudu

Let me know how that goes. I've never tried iRacing - their model and pricing isn't really compatible with my simming preferences. Also, I can't support the way they went after the N2003 modding community prior to the iRacing roll-out. It was pretty shameful the way they treated the people who could arguable be called their biggest supporters till then. I kind of decided not to give them money after that.


----------



## Draygonn

I hadn't heard about the NR2003 modders until now. I hate how companies have screwed over the modding community in an attempt to milk cash out of the customers. The days of Desert Combat are long gone. Now we get buggy DLC at 15 bucks a pop.


----------



## Pudu

Ah, DC ... CTF in DC was, for me, the height of the BF series.

 (Probably an element of rose tinted, looking back glasses here, but who cares).


----------



## oqvist

Quote: 





draygonn said:


> Got 3 free months of iRacing with the Cadillac promo. Tried out several cars and tracks. Crashed many times
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I got 6 month with the Cadillac Promo earlier. Nice to see they are still offering ways to demo iRacing.
  I have never liked the concept. When iRacing was released though I thought the physics where really good and of course the visuals and tracks. As it´s now the visuals are still nice and clean however physics wise sims like netkar Pro, GSC 2012 and particularly rFactor 2 beta is quite a bit ahead. And the concept hasn´t really got any better.
   
  Sure I can appreciate that you can actually find a race whenever you want and the SR system do work but seldom with whoever you want and what car or track combination you want.
   
  I do realize that the old way of paying 50$ and then running the same sim in 5 years where the game developers don´t get anything is not quite right either. rFactor 2 approach with yearly fees and if you don´t prolongue you loose multiplayer and future updates but can still race what you got is easier for me to buy in. Heck if iRacing would just say okay you bought this car and track you can now run it for as long as you live their approach would be easier to swallow. But buy every single car and track and then forced monthly fee on top of that??? Doing the math it´s hard to buy that concept for me particularly since it hasn´t developed as it should considering how much money they get from the consumers. The idea would be an ever developing platform but if you are stuck with the old game engine you get limitations on what you can do.


----------



## Draygonn

oqvist said:


> Heck if iRacing would just say okay you bought this car and track you can now run it for as long as you live their approach would be easier to swallow.



That makes sense. You wouldn't even be using their servers at that point. This pricing scheme is crazy. If I move up to C Class and run the IndyCar Oval Series, the car plus all tracks is 150 bucks. If I want to race the same car on road tracks as well the total comes to $265! Summit-Fi sim pricing.


----------



## oqvist

Formula truck maybe before the weekend for us pre orders :-D


----------



## Draygonn

I picked up two 120Hz Acer GD235HZ to go with my Alienware AW2310. I got new fans for my 480's AXPs (snapped in easily) and a Galant to house all the screen real estate.


----------



## thewolfisnear

I love Gran Turismo 2. To me, it is the best game in the series. I've played every iteration, but Gran Turismo 2 has stood the test of time and graphics.


----------



## Draygonn

pudu said:


> I threw together a quick and dirty chair mount to keep it from sliding back from the pedals.


How is the CSW treating you? I've heard so much good and bad that it gets confusing. Nice seating angle.


----------



## Exediron

Just finished building myself a new frame to hold my G25 wheel, pedals and shifter in the basement (wood). I haven't found a good chair yet, but it's still a far cry better than just bolting the thing onto my desk. What really pushed me to build my own frame was the realization that I wasn't actually using the wheel because it was too much of a pain to set up, so I only took it out when I had a whole day to play. I've been eying something like the ECCI setup for a while now, but I'm not going to spend that sort of money until I feel I've mastered the level of equipment I have right now. And after about a year and a half off, I'm pretty rusty. I plan on getting some serious practice in soon, however.





   
  In terms of games, mostly GTR2 and Race07 here, but I'm considering getting into online racing now that I have a more reliable setup. Speaking of which, I think it would be cool if we could have some Head-Fi race weekends! If we all have a game with multi-player functionality in common, we should be able to set up our own series, if someone is willing to keep track of the points. Anyone else interested?


----------



## oqvist

Wonder how many there is here. Racedepartment has some fun races that you can just jump into. I don´t quite recall which sims they run now. 
  I started my online career in average drivers club in speedgeezers and GTR. I don´t know how active they are but the first on-line race what an experience. I could smell the petrol. I was a total noob had no idea about anything but they did show patience with me.


----------



## Pudu

draygonn said:


> How is the CSW treating you? I've heard so much good and bad that it gets confusing. Nice seating angle.




Sorry, been off the forum for a bit. 

I had the same concerns about the Fanatec stuff- seems people either love it or have terrible experiences with the company. I decided to gamble since there wasn't much else out there that ticked the right boxes for me. So far I think it's very good. Feels great, right amount of on wheel buttons, on/off switch, quiet, etc. I like being able to tweak the FF on the fly, in game. I haven't put many hours on it thus far though. 

I'm still trying to find the best seating angle - tried many variations - this one feels the best for longer stints thus far.


----------



## solserenade

I'm in the market for a seat/cockpit ... or _possibly_ making it home-made (the fact I've put _that_ off for ... 5+ years tells me it may be best to buy one). My current set-up functions ... but is rickety, the chair not quite comfortable, etc.  One hour and my back is shot.
   
  If anyone knows of a cockpit they really like ... I'd appreciate any thoughts.
   
  Thanks.
   
  p.s. I'm at PS2 level, road-racing and Nascar, aiming toward iRacing or similar (I only recently got high-speed Internet)
   
  favorite games: TOCA Race Driver, Gran Turismo, several Nascar (probably F1 if I had it) ... that is all!


----------



## Exediron

Speaking of cockpits, has anyone seen one of these in person? I never even knew it existed before I found it by accident on the 'net a few days ago, but now I want one...
   
  Also: If anyone here has used both the latest ECCI and the latest FREX setups, could they offer insight on how the two compare to each other?


----------



## Draygonn

exediron said:


> What really pushed me to build my own frame was the realization that I wasn't actually using the wheel because it was too much of a pain to set up


That pushed me into a full time setup as well. Spent months debating a wheelstand or rig. My apartment just doesn't have the room so I settled on a large desk.




pudu said:


> So far I think it's very good. Feels great, right amount of on wheel buttons, on/off switch, quiet, etc. I like being able to tweak the FF on the fly, in game. I haven't put many hours on it thus far though.


I'm sticking with my G27 but I can see how the belt driven wheels can be smoother. And switching FF with a button would be real nice going from Road to Oval. I use very little FF on Oval, just enough to feel whats going on. I really like Fanatec gear, hopefully their QC gets sorted.




solserenade said:


> I'm in the market for a seat/cockpit ... or _possibly_ making it home-made (the fact I've put _that_ off for ... 5+ years tells me it may be best to buy one). My current set-up functions ... but is rickety, the chair not quite comfortable, etc.  One hour and my back is shot.
> 
> If anyone knows of a cockpit they really like ... I'd appreciate any thoughts.


So many options...

DIY with PVC


DIY with 8020


Obutto R3volution is affordable but requires a lot of setup


Human Racing GT is nice looking, doesn't require assembly, and is hella pricy




exediron said:


> Speaking of cockpits, has anyone seen one of these in person? I never even knew it existed before I found it by accident on the 'net a few days ago, but now I want one...


motherofgod.jpg


----------



## DefQon

Nice stuff, I've been into Trackmania and Live for Speed for quite a while now since Alpha build days. But I just don't see it being worthwhile to dedicate a lot of dosh and time into building a proper driving sim station.


----------



## Draygonn

Installed a hydraulic brake pedal. Better control and feel than the stock G27 brake.


----------



## Exediron

I imagine so - seeing as the stock brake (for the G25, at least) basically has no feel.
   
  Is that something you made yourself, or did you buy it somewhere?


----------



## Pudu

draygonn said:


> Installed a hydraulic brake pedal. Better control and feel than the stock G27 brake.




Cool! 

Is it a load cell or a hydraulic damper attached to the pot?


----------



## Draygonn

pudu said:


> Is it a load cell or a hydraulic damper attached to the pot?



Its a hydraulic cylinder, the white hose attaches to a pressure sensor. I looked into getting a new pedal set like Fanatec CSPs but they would require mounting. I wanted to retain the G27 pedals' carpet gripper and I only really needed a brake (I don't use clutch). After reading a bunch of reviews I decided to go with the perfect pedal and bodnar cable. Installation took about thirty minutes. Needless to say it's night and day from the stock potentiometer.


----------



## Pudu

That looks great. I bet it's quite a difference in pedal response. 

Man, I haven't done any simming in a few month now. I should probably do some laps of Shanghai to get ready for this weekend.


----------



## Draygonn

Yes, get in some laps before the race. Your awesome rig deserves more seat time but having a family takes priority. I ran some Shanghai laps in F1 2012 Tuesday. After running ovals the last two weeks my road skills were pretty rusty. iRacing now has a series that follows the NASCAR schedule. Expensive to buy that many tracks but must be a blast for NASCAR fans.


----------



## Pudu

I don't recall whether you tried GSC 2012, but I just today saw there's a Shanghai (and Hungaroring) conversion for that if you are interested.


----------



## Draygonn

I had problems with GSC crashing before starting so I didn't get around to actually trying it. Today I found a workaround for the crashing, loses the minimap but thats ok. I turned a few Shangai laps in each car. It didn't recognize the new pedal so I had to use the clutch pedal for braking


----------



## Pudu

That's a bother. The pedal doesn't change the mapping of the G27 does it? OR does it show up as separate controller?


----------



## Draygonn

I'm using a bodnar cable so the pedals are going straight to the PC instead of through the wheel. iRacing found all pedals fine and GSC found both potentiometers fine. I guess I should look for a load cell type setting in pedal setup.


----------



## Pudu

Hmm, that's strange. My current setup is everything on one controller, but prior to this I ran multiple controllers which was no problem for rFactor (didn't have GSC at the time).


----------



## Draygonn

I know GSC can only run 3 USB inputs but the clutch and throttle are detected so that can't be the issue. I couldn't find any settings in GSC that helped so I'll probably ask in the racedepartment thread. Right now I'm concentrating on finishing my requirements to get out of Rookies in iRacing. I want to try the Spec Racer road series and trucks for ovals next season.


----------



## Pudu

Though I won't patronize iRacing, I have to admit I would like to take it for a spin sometime to see what the fuss is all about. 

Anyone tried the Assetto Corsa tech preview?


----------



## Draygonn

Next seasons' schedule was just released. The D class Spec Racer Ford series uses the 8 free tracks. That keeps buy-in low and should up participation. I picked up enough tracks to run the whole SRF season plus half seasons of Indycar and oval trucks. I've never raced ovals before so it should be interesting. 

I'm tempted to go to Long Beach Friday afternoon for Indycar practice. I'd like to see the new bodystyle up close.


----------



## Pudu

Do it!

 I really liked Long Beach when I followed Champ Car many years ago. The nice thing about Champ Car (and I'm assuming Indycar which I have never followed since George destroyed both series) was that it was so much more accessible than F1.

 After the Vancouver race, back in the 90's, I was walking past the used tires truck and asked the guy what they did with the tires. He said they all got shredded. So I asked him if I could have a couple. He shrugged and said "sure". So we walked home from the race wearing rear tires like a barrel. I got two round pieces of glass to fit in the middle and made tables out of them. I gave one to my buddy who couldn't go to the race - but I still love mine. 

But I have to say I hate the look of the latest generations of Indycar. They remind me of mosquitoes buzzing around in circles.


(old photo)


----------



## Draygonn

That tire table is awesome!


----------



## oqvist

Really looking forward doing some endurance again. This will be first time with driver changes! 
   
  http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/11867-GT-Pre-qual-event-for-the-6-Hour-Race-Sign-up-thread?p=163597#post163597


----------



## Draygonn

Wow, a 6 hour race. How often are you planning to swap?


----------



## oqvist

Quote: 





draygonn said:


> Wow, a 6 hour race. How often are you planning to swap?


 
   
  Dunno. Three drivers in my team we haven´t started talking strategy yet but will be about 2h for us all I recon which isn´t that hard really. Not if you have a cockpit I remember the buttache when being in an office chair lol. If we will do it in one stint or diversify dunno pros and cons with both.There is no upper limit of drivers per team but I think most will be two or three man teams.


----------



## Draygonn

pudu said:


> Do it!


I was on my way out the door when I got two shipping calls I had to deal with :mad: Maybe next year I'll plan ahead.



oqvist said:


> Dunno. Three drivers in my team we haven´t started talking strategy yet but will be about 2h for us all I recon which isn´t that hard really.


Two 1 hour shifts seems quite doable. Good luck!


Got a DSD button box today. My keyboard is under the table when racing so this will be quite useful.


----------



## Pudu

Sucks about the race, but cool DSD BB. I agree it's a major pain figuring out how to mount a keyboard and mouse in a way that works with a sim wheel. 


oqvist, that sounds like a fun race. Lots of pressure not to be the guy who puts it in the wall on hour 5.


----------



## oqvist

Quote: 





pudu said:


> Sucks about the race, but cool DSD BB. I agree it's a major pain figuring out how to mount a keyboard and mouse in a way that works with a sim wheel.
> 
> 
> oqvist, that sounds like a fun race. Lots of pressure not to be the guy who puts it in the wall on hour 5.


 
   
  True but it helps when you race with friends. I have a good score on finishing endurances however this time I am the weak link I believe...
  It´s a beast of a car too even with TC and SC help I am still struggling with it. Been doing to much Power and Glory racing. Such difference between race cars of yesterday and today.
  I wouldn´t say todays electronics aided cars are easier to drive just a helluva lot faster 
   
  Okay with some exceptions the DeTomaso Pantera is a pure monster. And Vintage corvettes on a technical track hello insanity... I really really dig rFactor 2 physics though. It´s a new generation that´s for sure.


----------



## Draygonn

For F1 wheel lovers with deeeeep pockets, a T500 F1 wheel with useable dials and a display up top. All for the low price of almost a thousand bucks.
[VIDEO]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oa3RlmUeXj0#![/VIDEO]


----------



## oqvist

Would be nice. The only thing I would need or have use of is the LCD display and rev lights. Of course changing the buttons and paddles to something I know I don´t have to replace every now and then would be very convenient too


----------



## Draygonn

So far iRacing = 95% practice laps. I spent all last week trying to run some Darlington race pace laps without crashing. By Sunday I still wasn't good enough but I entered a race anyway. Spent half the race getting repairs. This week we're at Charlotte, which I know pretty well, so I will hopefully give a better showing.

Oh look, trucks at Nurburgring. Up for sale at $165 million.

[VIDEO]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1iXzijO3aMs[/VIDEO]


----------



## DefQon

Who here is getting Grid 2? I liked the first game, hopefully this next successor will be just as fun.


----------



## Draygonn

defqon said:


> Who here is getting Grid 2? I liked the first game, hopefully this next successor will be just as fun.


I'm a huge fan of the original. Gonna wait for a review though. Eliminating cockpit view is s strange decision but realism wasn't the strength of the first. It was just fun as hell with a rocking soundtrack. The only game where I watched the majority of my replays.


----------



## ninjapirate9901

Already got Grid 2 pre-ordered (Green Man Gaming always has some kind of 20% off deal going). Sadly I don't think I'll have my CSR Elite back in time to play it. It's currently out getting repaired, I had already replaced a codewheel sensor but still had issues with wheel decentering.


----------



## oqvist

Don´t think I will bother with GRID 2. GRID was just weird the only thing that worked was muscle cars on street circuits and some drifting events could be fun. The real life circuits didn´t work at all and the WTCC and formula cars was just broken.
   
  But if I find it real cheap I will try it out.


----------



## Draygonn

OT: Is there a site that lists start times for all the races each weekend? Trying to keep up with F1, Indy, Nascar, MotoGP, and the multiclass races each week should be easy but my DVR tends to mess up with these live races.


----------



## DefQon

Grid 2 turned out to be a massive disappointment.


----------



## Yeti tunes

Quote: 





defqon said:


> Grid 2 turned out to be a massive disappointment.


 

 That's unfortunate, I was seriously considering grabbing it :/
   
  Any reason in particular it's a disappointment?


----------



## chewy4

I like Grid 2 so far. It is definitely the best looking racing game to this date.
   
  Nowhere near a sim racer though, it definitely has an arcade feel to it. Haven't gotten too far into it but so far all the cars of similar style handle just about the same, really my only gripe with it.


----------



## Draygonn

Grid 2 seems rather polarizing. Somewhat expected on long layoff titles with a huge following. I wish there was a demo available. I'm so tempted to grab it and start playing.


----------



## oqvist

I have well "demoed it". I am not buying Codemaster titles blind you never know what they are up to!
   
  To me it feels like the handling is more gamepad optimized than ever. I did have some fun drifting in GRID but here you just turn the car 45 degrees and it start to auto drift or something it feels horrible and not smooth and controlled at all. 
  But it may be like GRID that 70 % of the cars is undrivable and pure crap but you can find one or two you can have fun with so hard to judge really. It´s very uneven. it´s as much arcade as ridge racer though.
   
  I wasn´t really stricken by the visuals either but it does it´s job on that part.


----------



## DefQon

Grid 2 is like NFS meets Dirt 3.


----------



## HesterDW

Grid 2 was my first impulse buy of the year. I played 15 minutes of it and haven't played since. Maybe it's because I was playing with a G27 but the handling is just... off.


----------



## DefQon

Game is designed to be played with a gamepad. Unfortunately Grid 2 is more arcade than the previous one.


----------



## Pudu

exediron said:


> I've never played Grand Prix Legends myself, although I've been intrigued from time to time. I'm more of a GTR2 man myself, although I'm planning on trying rFactor 2 when its fledging is more full.
> 
> Considering the number of virtual racing devotees on Head-Fi, I've always thought we should organize a Head-Fi Virtual Series - but the issue is that none of us seem to play the same games
> 
> EDIT: And I think the advances in simulation equipment probably have as much to do with the ease of transfer as any potential dumbing-down of race cars; my own car isn't anything near as computerized as a Formula car, and I've found that simulation driving helps noticeably with the real car.




Nice Idea. I'd be into that. Unfortunately time differences would likely preclude me from online racing (not to mention latency issues - I play BF3 with my buddies in Canada but always have ping in the 250-300 range). 

Long, long ago I was in an offline ICR2 league where we would run our race and then screen shot our finishing time and save a reply for verification if needed. Then the race times were charted to determine a winner. Very basic but loads of fun. Ahh, the good old days.


Man, I hope at least one of pCARS, rF2, AC delivers the goods.




--As an aside, anyone keeping an eye on IL-2 Sturmovik: Battle of Stalingrad?


----------



## SkyBleu

I play GRID 2 if that counts


----------



## chewy4

Has anyone here played rFactor2?
   
  I tried the demo and it was brutally hard, I'm wondering if that's just a hard car to drive though?


----------



## oqvist

What car did you run in the demo. I would say it´s quite hard overall yes but the physics is great so you will learn and adapt as you get used to it. Tires is such that you can´t push like nuts or they will start to overheat and you have to take a calm down lap and then push again they really need to be in the right operating temperature. Also the track conditions change with rubber as you go on. And there is always the electronic aids that is more realistic to use then not to nowadays lol. 
   
  rFactor 2 is the best sim I run so far in close competition with Game Stock Car. I am currently in an endurance championship at SimHQ SCES. http://simhqmotorsports.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/forums/392/1/2013_SCES_rF2_Series 
   
  Done a 6h race at Mid Ohio and 4h at TWS as well as a 12h at Sebring. Our SSR team had some technical issues at TWS but we are currently in second place in the GT 2 class. Next is 6h of Monza.
   
  Assetto Corsa will be nice surely I liked all Kunos previous sims. Ferrari virtual academy could be worth a test if you want to bench yourself against Alonso and Massa they are fast for real obviously 
   
  Netkar Pro but there is no real action in these sims so you would have to pretty much race on your own. The communities overall seems more set on rFactor 2, Asseto Corsa. And iRacing. I would love for Game Stock Car to come off. I am surely getting the next season package of it.


----------



## Exediron

iRacing is far too expensive for me to ever consider it - even if I had money to burn, I find the price insultingly high. I've been following rFactor2 for a while now, and I'm downloading the demo now to see what I think of its current state; I remember the original as pretty realistic for its day, so I'm looking forward to it...
   
  So far it seems like rFactor2 would be our best bet for a Head-Fi series, since there's a lot of players and it's easy to obtain. I personally prefer open-wheel racing and don't do much in the way of endurance racing - never, in fact. The longest I've done is a full 190-mile Formula-style race.
   
  I'll post again when I've had some time with the rFactor2 demo and see what I think.


----------



## Exediron

Quote: 





chewy4 said:


> Has anyone here played rFactor2?
> 
> I tried the demo and it was brutally hard, I'm wondering if that's just a hard car to drive though?


 
   
  Just finished the demo, so my impressions now:
   
  The car is a Corvette C6, so handling is a bit twitchy and you have to steer with your right foot a lot. Personally, I like Corvettes, so once I got used to it that was no issue. I don't know the track the least bit; I did 10 laps and the fastest I got was a 0:57.9, but I have no idea if that's a decent lap or not. I'm thinking not, because I was a real wuss through the chicane. I couldn't get my braking point figured out at all. The next two corners were pretty much flat - they almost reminded me of the Lesmo corners at Monza, although slower and with some elevation changes.
   
  I thought the physics model seemed really good, and once I realized that setting damage multiplier to +100% makes your car a Ming vase (realistic for a Formula car, probably not so much for a stock car) I didn't have too much of a problem. Since the damage model is also pretty good once you've banged the car up once you're going to have problems for the rest of the race.
   
  The biggest problem I had actually was a bit of an embarrassing one - I'm so used to Formula One racing with paddle shifters and a wheel clutch that my manual shifting is really pretty terrible now. I don't know how many times I spun the car because I shifted down without properly engaging the clutch. I'm also used to Formula brakes, so I went straight through at the first corner and into the tire wall 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I thought the AI was good - I did 5 laps alone for practice, then a 5 lap race with the AI. I started 17 out of 22 (random grid position, not my fault) and finished 5th after a spin. I had set the AI down a fair ways from 100% though, so it's not a fair test of their speed. They do actual overtaking moves, which is nice, and they don't yield position like babies, unlike some other big racing games. 
   
  On the whole, I liked it, and I'll probably get it later, assuming the open-wheel support is there. I think I saw some screenshots of Formula cars when I was on their website, so I'm assuming there's at least some support. Hopefully also a few Grand Prix circuits - I'm partial to Spa, Monza and Suzuka, so I'd like to get at least one of them in there.
   
  EDIT: I looked up the track - Lime Rock Park - and apparently the lap record is 43 seconds  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So I guess I'm rustier than I thought...
   
  ANOTHER EDIT: Something I forgot to mention initially - the Force Feedback in my wheel (G25) was a bit dodgy; the feedback was detailed and good, but very weak. I couldn't figure out how to turn it up to get any real feeling, so it sort of felt like I was floating on the surface. Does anyone else either a) have this problem or b) know how to fix it?
   
  PS: I'd never heard of Battle of Stalingrad, but it looks pretty cool. I don't do flight simulation nearly as much, though - I think it's fun, but I don't have good equipment for it.


----------



## chewy4

Thanks for the detailed impressions guys.
   
  I am very new to sim racing so I don't think I ever even made it around the track in rFactor2. I'm going to give it another shot now that I'm more used to my wheel but I've mostly been jumping between sims to see how they feel. I got the SimBin pack from the Steam summer sale which includes a bunch of their games... my favorite so far has been GTR2 but RACE07 is also nice. Plus it has the Audi R8 which makes me feel like I'm not a terrible driver.
   
  Most of my wheel time has gone to Euro Truck Simulator 2 since I got my wheel though. It's a little more my speed at this point. Awesome game.


----------



## Exediron

I've heard good things about that one (Euro Truck 2), and it certainly has impressive graphics. Never played it myself.
   
  I've done a fair bit of RACE07 myself, mostly going around the Nurburgring - I have a modder version of the 'Ring for GTR2, but it's not quite as good. I also play the Formula Raceroom expansion thingy as an alternative to the official F1 game when I'm too frustrated with the difficulty level cliffs in F1 2012 (if you haven't played it, there's a gap of about 2-3 seconds of single lap pace between the 4 difficulty levels, leading to one category being much too easy, while the next one up is still too hard). GTR2 is still my favorite at the moment for stock cars, but it doesn't have very much Formula support, which is more of the direction I've moved in.


----------



## oqvist

Quote: 





exediron said:


> Just finished the demo, so my impressions now:
> 
> The car is a Corvette C6, so handling is a bit twitchy and you have to steer with your right foot a lot. Personally, I like Corvettes, so once I got used to it that was no issue. I don't know the track the least bit; I did 10 laps and the fastest I got was a 0:57.9, but I have no idea if that's a decent lap or not. I'm thinking not, because I was a real wuss through the chicane. I couldn't get my braking point figured out at all. The next two corners were pretty much flat - they almost reminded me of the Lesmo corners at Monza, although slower and with some elevation changes.
> 
> ...


 

 C6R is a bit of a tank. You really have to straighten out every corner all you can due to it´s mass. Also it has tons of torque so don´t be afraid to gear earlier then you might think. If you enable auto clutch you don´t have to worry much just paddle shift like you are in an F1 car . Smoothness is key as always. That is my dilemma I am just not smooth enough 
   
  In the homepage you see all cars there is plenty of open wheelers already. I am more into GT racing though F1 is just to arcade and goes to fast. Btw if you like open wheelers you can check out Game stock Car. I love the F3 there and also the classic F1 is great fun. Again not a fan of F1 but the F1 car here is among the more fun. A lot is the south american tracks which is just about all very nice and most importantly new. I have done european GP tracks to death already. But it will be easier to find mp races with rFactor 2 most likely.
   
  As for iRacing I did the 6 month chevrolet tryout and bought some cars. It´s okay but just didn´t hook me. It´s really expensive but nice format otherwise.
   
  As for FFB that is what I like the most. The problem is they don´t compromise with it. I think they lowered the ffb on the G27 because it can´t quite handle it fully. In the old builds it used to totally flip out when going over kerbs or grass. I sit with the T500RS now and the ffb is just superb here. Better then in any other sim I tried followed by Game Stock Car. Then it´s LFS and iRacing for me.


----------



## Exediron

Quote: 





oqvist said:


> As for FFB that is what I like the most. The problem is they don´t compromise with it. I think they lowered the ffb on the G27 because it can´t quite handle it fully. In the old builds it used to totally flip out when going over kerbs or grass. I sit with the T500RS now and the ffb is just superb here. Better then in any other sim I tried followed by Game Stock Car. Then it´s LFS and iRacing for me.


 
   
  Ah, that's good then - I don't intend to keep the Logitech too much longer. I have my eyes on upgrading to a Fanatec with a proper Formula rim on it and enough buttons so I don't need to keep reaching over to the shifter array, just as soon as I've cleared out a more proper area in the basement for my setup. A proper cockpit is also a possibility around that time, and definitely a pedal set with a proper brake - the G25 brake has literally zero feel, which makes locking up your brakes perilously easy if you don't use ABS, which I don't. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 We'll see how much abuse my wallet feels like taking when I get there, though.
   
  Classic F1 cars are certainly a blast - you get much of the speed, but without the ultra-high downforce that makes a modern F1 car so unlike a normal car. A classic Formula series might be the best compromise between the people who like GT cars and the people who like F1 cars, I suppose.


----------



## chewy4

I have the Fanatec Porsche GT3 RS V2 wheel myself, as well as the CSR elite pedals plus the inversion kit. It's a nice wheel and the pedals are really nice. Inversion kit is a bit expensive for what it is(just some metal pieces) but it's worth it IMO.
   
  The brake on the CSR elite pedals is quite nice, it's like a real brake where the majority of braking is done using foot pressure rather than just moving it a certain distance.


----------



## Pudu

Sorry, is there a demo now for rF2? I mean one that you don't have to buy the game and then do a refund within the time limit? I have been avoiding rF2 up till now. I want to see some AI improvements before plunking down cash. They seemed to be focused on multiplayer for a long while.

Exediron, Game Stock Car has some great 80's F1 action - really, really fun to drive. And I think the AI may even be bit better than GTR2 (and far, far ... far better than rF).


----------



## Exediron

Quote: 





pudu said:


> Sorry, is there a demo now for rF2? I mean one that you don't have to buy the game and then do a refund within the time limit? I have been avoiding rF2 up till now. I want to see some AI improvements before plunking down cash. They seemed to be focused on multiplayer for a long while.
> 
> Exediron, Game Stock Car has some great 80's F1 action - really, really fun to drive. And I think the AI may even be bit better than GTR2 (and far, far ... far better than rF).


 
   
  Yeah, there is - the first link under Download Installer on this page is for a free demo with just one car and one track. I was also waiting for a real demo to come out before making any decisions, so I was happy to see it there.
   
  As far as the AI goes, in my brief time with it they're pretty decent (assuming you put the skill slider high enough, that is), but they do seem to have the annoying habit of running up along side you and then forcing you to either back off or get spun. I guess they're all Senna wannabes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'll give Game Stock Car a look; you're not the first person I've heard say some good things about it, so it's next on my list of things to try. Is it in the same sort of realism level as GTR2?


----------



## Pudu

Both GTR2 and GSC2012 are what rFactor should have been in the first place. GSC feels more refined than GTR2 (noticeably so) in the handling, car behaviour, force feedback, and AI - to me at least. The UI still feels like rubbish rFactor, but once you get in the car, it feels so much better.

I get better sense of mass and momentum from GSC than I do GTR2 and it feels like there's more connection to the pavement through the steering wheel. The stock cars are quite fun, but I really like the late 80's F1 buggies. There's a bunch of converted tracks available for it now too so you can make a historic season if you like ( I have a '91 season set up).



I'll have to download the rF2 demo (thanks for the link) and see what's on offer. Also saw there was a Champcar 05-08 mod released this week for RACE ( I know, crappy game) - but I will probably check it out too.


----------



## DefQon

Any RaceRoom fans here?


----------



## Pudu

Sorry, I forgot about Battle of Stalingrad.

For many years the best flight sim (WWII) was a series called IL-2 Sturmovik. It was very well done and huge in scope by the end. The developers then moved on to a Battle of Britain simulator which was a complete, utter, total dog - basically ruining the good name they built up with the first series. 

Another developer released an amazing WWI sim a few years ago, Rise of Flight. It's absolutely brilliant (if you like WWI kites). They have now been contracted to take on the IL-2 Sturmovik license and are releasing The Battle of Stalingrad next spring (with early access this fall). I imagine they will develop other theatres too if it is a success. Based on the RoF, everyone has high hopes.

If you have any interest in WWI flight sims, check out the RoF stuff on youtube, there are some amazing videos out there.

Edit:

 [VIDEO]http://youtu.be/LgmVEzSUPKU.[/VIDEO]


----------



## oqvist

Yes GSC has great AI. But AI is just AI once you get taste for multiplayer it´s hard to go back.
   
  rFactor 2 AI is quite good also. If you get along side they will leave room for you but then as always they can get mysteriously slow at some corners etc which make them a bit hard. But AI is never perfect I would say GSC is the best I seen yet though.


----------



## Pudu

oqvist said:


> Yes GSC has great AI. But AI is just AI once you get taste for multiplayer it´s hard to go back.
> ...




Agreed.

But the AI is always available to race when I can, they tend to be in the same time zone as I, always have good pings, and they don't seem to mind waiting around when I press pause to go look into one child's crisis or another.


----------



## Planar_head

Used to play Simraceway. Used to play, as I'm stopping simracing for a while to take a breather. Probably going to pick up a new controller (thinking of the Thrustmaster GPX Lightback).
  I also used to play GTR2 and I've played Gran Turismo 5. I think that Simraceway is good, but they're still tweaking the engine and individual car physics, so the cars handling may change over time.


----------



## Exediron

Quote: 





defqon said:


> Any RaceRoom fans here?


 
   
  Not sure; I've played the Formula RaceRoom add-on for RACE07, but I have no other experience with RaceRoom. I found the Formula RaceRoom to be quite accessible and not exactly the most difficult to drive, but fun enough and very easy to get the hang of, as opposed to rFactor where I spent my first five laps crashing at most corners. Never have been able to find many people online, however, so I can't say for sure.
   
  EDIT: Intrigued by Simraceway - I'm planning on giving it a look later.


----------



## ninjapirate9901

I've dabbled with RaceRoom and it seems pretty decent, especially considering you can play the base game for free. I mainly stick to PCARS though (it's still pretty rough but it is improving month to month).


----------



## chewy4

For some reason I couldn't get into Raceroom. I just didn't like the feel of it. PCARs looks good and I can't wait until that comes out.
  
 Anyone else here plan to get the Oculus Rift when that comes out? I can imagine it bringing sim racers to a whole new level, being able to freely look around while driving is going to be awesome.


----------



## ninjapirate9901

chewy4 said:


> For some reason I couldn't get into Raceroom. I just didn't like the feel of it. PCARs looks good and I can't wait until that comes out.
> 
> Anyone else here plan to get the Oculus Rift when that comes out? I can imagine it bringing sim racers to a whole new level, being able to freely look around while driving is going to be awesome.


 
 I'll definitely be picking one up a Rift when it comes out, I may even shell out for a developer version later this year just for pCARS. My only concern with it is the fact that you can't see your sim setup when racing (i.e if you have a fully built cockpit with buttons, readouts, etc.).


----------



## chewy4

ninjapirate9901 said:


> I'll definitely be picking one up a Rift when it comes out, I may even shell out for a developer version later this year just for pCARS. My only concern with it is the fact that you can't see your sim setup when racing (i.e if you have a fully built cockpit with buttons, readouts, etc.).


 
 That is true, I hadn't considered that. I'd imagine it would make using an h-shifter especially hard.
  
 But I'm a noob who normally either sticks to automatic or uses paddle shifters so it's all good here.


----------



## ninjapirate9901

chewy4 said:


> That is true, I hadn't considered that. I'd imagine it would make using an h-shifter especially hard.
> 
> But I'm a noob who normally either sticks to automatic or uses paddle shifters so it's all good here.


 
 Nothing wrong with paddles, I generally prefer to use sequential (with clutch) as well. As for you standard H shifters, I'm sure that won't be much of an issue after an hour or two of play. I mean it's not like you need to look at your gear stick every time you shift when driving in real life.


----------



## reddyxm

I remember the sim racing game that got me into cars. Tokyo Extreme Racer for the Dreamcast. I love that game so much. It was the first racing game I played where you could customize the appearance and upgrade the engine and chassis of the car. That game is the reason why I love the RX-7 FD and R34 Skyline GTR. When I got my PS2, I played GT3:Spec like a nut. Then I played Need for Speed Underground 1 and 2 which brought me back to my days of playing Tokyo Extreme Racer. After those games, my love for sim racing declined. I didn't enjoy playing GT4.
  
 When I got my PS3, I tried GT5 and I completely lost all interest in sim racing games.
  
 If another NFS Underground or Tokyo Extreme Racer was made, I'd definitely play those. I guess I'm more interested in street racing that is somewhat unrealistic compared to real driving simulators like GT.


----------



## Pudu

GSC is getting an update ... this month.
*
Game Stock Car 2013 – More Content Revealed*



Edit: Pre-order available now.




And AC looks like they are also taking good advantage of RUSH.




Also, 2013 skins are out for rF2 Marussia - apparently teams are included, but I don't know much about it as I still don't have rF2.


----------



## cswann1

I recently spent a lot of time looking into Sim Racing when I came across a decent deal on a cockpit and Fanatec base and wheel.
  
 I have to say that it looks like sick mad fun.  I've got a gaming PC that would probably do well but my current living arrangement is not so much cockpit friendly and I'm not doing to jack around with some flimsy wheel stand.
  
  
 someday....


----------



## oqvist

You don´t have a desk you can hook the wheel up to or a bedroom?


----------



## cswann1

oqvist said:


> You don´t have a desk you can hook the wheel up to or a bedroom?


 
  
  
 Yes I do. As of now my gaming PC and desk/chair are in storage. I'm limping along with a laptop and PS3.
  
 But...I'm about to make an address change and my PC will for sure be coming out of storage, finally.  I still don't know if I want to go whole hog on a racing sim set-up.  I try to keep my gaming from taking over my life so I have to be choosy about what I get into so that I don't eliminate time for other things I want to play.  With TESO right around the corner, it could be dominating my gaming time. Spending a grand or so on sim racing hardware, would be really dumb if I only used it a couple of times a month.  
  
 Besides that. My gaming rig is getting old and with the current generation of titles I'm thinking some new hardware is going to be in order.


----------



## oqvist

Racing can be as time consuming as MMOs. Or perhaps not quite so much because when real fatigued you notice how you just can´t drive all that well and it´s more exhausting so there is less chance you get like the nut cases who die playing world of warcraft because they don´t think they need to sleep or drink. It´s not an efficient way to train either so it´s not like you win anything from grinding which you do in MMOs. It´s MMOs you really should avoid if you want to avoid something to take over your entire life . 
  
  Personally I enjoy both. Well not MMO the monthly fees and pay to win philosophy turned me off. I tried the old republic when it got free but never got into it. I have spend many many many hours in single player rpgs though like witcher, KOTOR, Morrowind, Skyrim etc. All of these are superb titles but they do get old after some hundred hours  which simracing do not. It´s insane how many laps you can make around the same circuit and still learn new stuff about it I am talking having done 6000 laps and still learning something new. I admit I am probably not the fastest learner (read natural talent) but oh well .


----------



## Pudu

Hot lapping Monaco - it's a bit like meditation. You feel perfection is within sight, but you can never quite reach it.

And one single, tiny distraction brings everything to a crashing halt ... literally.


----------



## cswann1

Oqvist, you make a good point about fatigue.  I agree that racing really takes a lot of focus and concentration and I think lot of people aren't aware that when you are really putting high demands on your brain, it's actually like a muscle. It burns calories and gets fatigued, just like a muscle and training and conditioning are needed to gain mental endurance, just like physical endurance.
  
 I'm going to be moving into a new place in the next couple of weeks.  Once I get settled in I'll re-evaluate sim racing.   I know it's something I'd really enjoy even if I just played Gran Tursimo on my PS3.  The wheel and pedals I imagine make racing games a completely different experience, but I don't want to "try it out" with cheap gear. If I'm going to do it I want some quality hardware to really give me the tactile feedback to make it as immersive as possible.


----------



## Exediron

Just had a very frustrating and puzzling race in F1 2012 and I'm wondering if any of you guys that play the game have any insights.
  
 Okay, here's the sitch: Hungary GP, Professional difficulty (I'm planning on switching to Legend next season), Red Bull Racing. I did about an hour of practice before the race (in Time Trial, which is where I usually practice ever since they cut FP2 and 3) and set a best time of 1:20.7xx. Checking the Wikipedia article for the 2012 Hungarian GP I figured that was probably good enough, saved my setup and went back into Career mode.
  
 Qualifying went about like I expected - I made a mistake in sector 2 during my only Q3 run and set a 1:23.1, but still out-qualified everyone by almost two seconds. So far so good.
  
 But when the race started, suddenly I was nowhere. I had absolutely no grip and had to fight tooth and nail to keep Seb behind me (whom I out-qualified by 1.8 seconds) for 5 laps, after which I made an error and both he and Perez shot past me. They then started ditching me at a rate of about 1.2 seconds a lap. Looking at the lap times it's not that the AI is quicker for some reason, it's that I'm definitely slower. They're doing 1:28s or 1:29s at the start which is about what I expect, but I have to push like crazy just to break 1:29 and mostly I'm doing 1:30s.
  
 So why? I'm using Normal fuel strategy like I almost always do, standard fuel mix; the tyres only have a lap on them and are at least as fresh as anyone else's. The engine is an old one - it's at 85% power, but it's the same one I qualified with. The feeling I'm getting is definitely that the car has a distinct lack of grip - I'm having to back out of corners because of understeer constantly, although braking distance is not affected. At first I assumed I'd accidentally over-fuled the car, but I confirmed that this was not the case. I'm at a loss to explain it currently...


----------



## proton007

exediron said:


> Just had a very frustrating and puzzling race in F1 2012 and I'm wondering if any of you guys that play the game have any insights.
> 
> Okay, here's the sitch: Hungary GP, Professional difficulty (I'm planning on switching to Legend next season), Red Bull Racing. I did about an hour of practice before the race (in Time Trial, which is where I usually practice ever since they cut FP2 and 3) and set a best time of 1:20.7xx. Checking the Wikipedia article for the 2012 Hungarian GP I figured that was probably good enough, saved my setup and went back into Career mode.
> 
> ...




Happens almost always with me; I don't play F1 but GTR2.
Lapping alone with a clear track I'm much faster, when the race starts I'm struggling for grip, because I can't keep on the throttle as much or choose the best lines. The AI always overtakes me.
Another aspect is the setup for low and high speed is different, during qualifying I settle for a more neutral setup, during race it's got more oversteer.
And the start. Because I don't run a mechanical clutch it almost always causes the car to bog down at the start.


----------



## Pudu

exediron said:


> Just had a very frustrating and puzzling race in F1 2012 and I'm wondering if any of you guys that play the game have any insights.
> 
> Okay, here's the sitch: Hungary GP, Professional difficulty (I'm planning on switching to Legend next season), Red Bull Racing...But when the race started, suddenly I was nowhere. I had absolutely no grip and had to fight tooth and nail to keep Seb behind me ...




It's obvious - you were in Mark's car. 

Red Bull made the strategic decision early on that all reliability and performances issues with the RB7, RB8, and RB9 would happen to Mark's car.

The happiest guy in F1 right now must be MW. (okay maybe, Lewis and Nico are close seconds at the moment)




Sorry I'm of no actual help - I never really played 2012.


----------



## Exediron

pudu said:


> It's obvious - you were in Mark's car.


 
  
 Hadn't thought of it that way, but you're right! I'm surprised my KERS didn't fail when it was obvious I was going to out-qualify Seb... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


proton007 said:


> Happens almost always with me; I don't play F1 but GTR2.
> Lapping alone with a clear track I'm much faster, when the race starts I'm struggling for grip, because I can't keep on the throttle as much or choose the best lines. The AI always overtakes me.
> Another aspect is the setup for low and high speed is different, during qualifying I settle for a more neutral setup, during race it's got more oversteer.
> And the start. Because I don't run a mechanical clutch it almost always causes the car to bog down at the start.


 
  
 Well, in F1 Parc Ferme is in effect so you're stuck with using whatever setup you had for qualifying in the race. I usually set my cars up for qualifying/late race, although I probably overdid it here judging by my qualifying margin. So that might be a contributing factor. My starts aren't usually great but at least I usually keep even with the guys behind, so if I'm on pole I typically make it first to the first corner.
  
 After re-running the race I've figured out some theories: first possibility is that there's something wrong with the car, and I can't rule it out - it isn't the engine though, because I'm definitely low on grip not power (well, both really - this engine is definitely getting changed before Spa); the second theory is that because I didn't do any high-fuel runs the lines I'm using just don't work on a high fuel load and I need to find some new ones. That's probably what it is, I think. It's also possible that Seb and Checo both under-fueled their cars and won't be able to keep up their pace - I wasn't in too much danger of being passed by the rest of the field, after all (until I crashed out of frustration, that is).
  
 I'm going to try running the race again and experimenting with new lines / throttle applications (the gearing is also qualifying gearing, so I'm only using 7th gearing on the final straight) and see if that makes a difference. If it does, I'm definitely going to make a point of doing a full-fuel practice from now on


----------



## proton007

exediron said:


> Hadn't thought of it that way, but you're right! I'm surprised my KERS didn't fail when it was obvious I was going to out-qualify Seb...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Some observations and tips I've gathered and been advised on:
 -- It takes a few laps to get the grip going, atleast in GTR2 it takes around 2-3 laps to get the heat in (there's no pre-heating of tyres like in F1).
 -- Fuel plays a role, yes. The race starts with a full tank, and the car isn't as nimble as in qualifying.
 -- The setup plays a *huge* role.  A more grippy setup is good for short runs, in a long race the tyres will quickly lose their grip.
 -- *Consistency* is the rule. Whatever the laptime, it needs to be consistent throughout the race. That's what holds your position on the grid. I used to go 'all-in' in the first few laps; it's a gamble, all that progress can be lost in a jist if the car spins out.
  
 I'd suggest:
 -- Go into qualifying with a slightly safer profile, more neutral, less oversteer. When the car is loaded the oversteer can cause a loss of grip on throttle lift-off.
 -- Slow and fast. Slow entry, fast exit. Depends on the track, though.
 -- Usually the highest gear should be set such that you never redline the engine on the straight.
 -- Monitor the engine specs, where's the power band? It makes quite a difference.
 -- Gearing to match the corner configuration....the car should be in the power band when its time to exit....this one I find is the hardest, but has a big payoff.
 -- The engine's max RPM also matter. A lower limit allows for quicker gear changes, a higher limit gives more revs to play with.
  
 In the end it also depends on the realism of the simulation. I'm not sure what's the quality like for F1, and what all aspects can you control.
 Lastly, I've been thinking of using a full steering wheel + pedals setup for a long time, just haven't got the space for it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.  I bet my controls have become the bottleneck.
  
  
 As a general advice, take a look at "Tune to Win" by Carroll Smith. Its the best book I've read on tuning race cars. There's some good scientific explanation, and a very thorough analysis of what makes great drivers great, where they push the limits and so on. Once you get a hang of it, you'll be able to tune the car just as you want.


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## Exediron

Well, at least that weekend is behind me. It will (hopefully!) remain one of the most sordid of my Red Bull career.
  
 After some practice I determined that the problem was mostly the lines I was using, which my heavy car couldn't grip onto. I figured out new lines for the corners I was having problems with and ran the race again, telling myself that no matter what happened I'd accept the result this time:
  
 Everything went pretty well for the first 50 laps. I had managed to pull out a lead of about 20 seconds with my next and final pit stop due on lap 55 and was taking things a bit easy. On lap 54 as I was making my way through the middle part of the circuit (for those who don't know the Hungaroring very well, the middle part is very twisty and fast with basically no way past anyone) I came up on a Marussia. He blocked me on the racing line despite the blue flags, which was annoying, but then he suddenly got out of the way and I thought 'okay, sure' and went past. I felt a tug at the rear of the car and had to fight hard to keep from spinning; looking in the mirror I saw pieces of Marussia all over the track. I'm not quite sure what happened, but I assume he must have turned in on me as I was lapping him.
  
 I got a drive-through penalty for the incident (in F1 2012 you basically always cause incidents, as far as the stewards are concerned). So instead of changing my tyres - which were falling off the cliff by this point - I had to come into the pits and then do _another_ lap before I could get fresh rubber. During that lap Seb overtook me just before the pits, and we entered one after another - I had to wait for him to get tyres before I got my own. Perez passed us both at this point. Finally, exiting the pits 6 seconds behind Sebastian and with 14 laps left, I determined to go for it and push hard to catch him up. I put up a fastest lap of the race on my outlap, but then promptly ran into one of my bane's of the weekend - the other Marussia. This one didn't let me past at all, and blocked me aggressively for half a lap. Against my better judgment I went for an overtake at turn 12, outbraking the Marussia and turning in. He hit me, spinning both of us out in the middle of the track. Hamilton came up and passed me before I could get going the right way again.
  
 So now I was in 4th place, half a minute off Perez and Vettel and with Kobayashi breathing down my neck. I tried to stay ahead of him, but I had a KERS failure the next lap and he started to catch me very quickly. As I came onto the main straight I lost grip briefly and the car wiggled; Kobayashi, who was slipstreaming me, smashed into my tail and took his own front wing off. I managed to avoid spinning, but at this point my Red Bull had it must be said sustained serious damage. After Kobayashi dropped back Rosberg was the next in line, but he was 5 seconds back. With only 6 laps to go, I figured I could keep him behind without overdoing it.
  
 And I did - until the very last lap, lap 70. Just as I came down and past turn 2 - with Rosberg now a safe 9 seconds behind, or so I thought - the engine hiccuped. I was pretty sure my fuel level was fine, so I hoped it was just an isolated incident. Two turns later it happened gain, only this time I started losing revs rapidly. I pushed the gear as low as I could, but the revs just kept falling. In desperation I emptied my KERS as Rosberg started filling my rear-view mirrors, and then the gears failed and stranded me in 2nd, with probably 6000 rpm maximum. As I limped around the final corner Rosberg shot past me, followed by Kobayashi who had caught back up. For the final insult, just before I crossed the line, a Caterham overtook me and pushed me down to 7th.
  
 At least there's always next time...
  
 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *proton007* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...
> 
> In the end it also depends on the realism of the simulation. I'm not sure what's the quality like for F1, and what all aspects can you control.
> ...


 
  
 Some good advice. I've played GTR2, and it is more in-depth and detailed than F1 2012 - hard for me to say which is more accurate, since I've never driven anything resembling an F1 car, but I suspect it would be GTR2. You can control things like spring stiffness, roll bars, wings, toe-in/camber, ride height, etc. You can play with the gearing too, but only within some specified parameters. I do use a wheel/pedals (G25), and my opinion is that while it may not give too much lap time over a controller (vast amounts over a keyboard) it does give greatly improved feel and enjoyment.
  
 I'll look at Tune to Win - it sounds like a good read. I have a book by Alain Prost (can't remember the name right now) which is really good for the basic principles of racing and setup, but doesn't go into too much detail.


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## proton007

exediron said:


> Some good advice. I've played GTR2, and it is more in-depth and detailed than F1 2012 - hard for me to say which is more accurate, since I've never driven anything resembling an F1 car, but I suspect it would be GTR2. You can control things like spring stiffness, roll bars, wings, toe-in/camber, ride height, etc. You can play with the gearing too, but only within some specified parameters. I do use a wheel/pedals (G25), and my opinion is that while it may not give too much lap time over a controller (vast amounts over a keyboard) it does give greatly improved feel and enjoyment.


 
  
 Yep. The amount of settings in GTR2 is mind boggling, but somehow it all makes a difference (I mean, they're not there for show, because they're all factored in the simulation). Fun, but its time consuming. I've got some pretty good results by following the book I listed and some gradual tuning, but then I can imagine going through the same process for every track, which means a lot of time is needed.
 Also, a wheel and pedals are probably the best way to tune, without that there's no way to feel the steering feedback.
  
 Now I'm eagerly awaiting the release of GTR3....


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## ninjapirate9901

proton007 said:


> Yep. The amount of settings in GTR2 is mind boggling, but somehow it all makes a difference (I mean, they're not there for show, because they're all factored in the simulation). Fun, but its time consuming. I've got some pretty good results by following the book I listed and some gradual tuning, but then I can imagine going through the same process for every track, which means a lot of time is needed.
> Also, a wheel and pedals are probably the best way to tune, without that there's no way to feel the steering feedback.
> 
> Now I'm eagerly awaiting the release of GTR3....


 
  
 I thought GTR3 got canned and SimBin were only focussed on RaceRoom... Hopefully I'm completely wrong though, would love to see a sequel.
  
 On a side note, what are you guys mainly playing at the moment?
  
 I'm giving PCARS a break because the driving model remains quite spotty, it's a bloody shame because both the vehicle and track selection (not to mention the visuals) are fantastic. I'm thinking about taking the plunge into the Assetto Corsa early access, anyone here playing it much? I keep hearing good things on the PCARS forum about the underlying simulation model of AC so I'm very interested.


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## proton007

ninjapirate9901 said:


> I thought GTR3 got canned and SimBin were only focussed on RaceRoom... Hopefully I'm completely wrong though, would love to see a sequel.


 
  
 I haven't heard about that. Infact I haven't heard any news about GTR3 in a while. Simbin's also silent on this one, and the website's still up.
  
 I guess thats it then.


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## ninjapirate9901

proton007 said:


> I haven't heard about that. Infact I haven't heard any news about GTR3 in a while. Simbin's also silent on this one, and the website's still up.
> 
> I guess thats it then.


 
  
 Looks that way 
  
 Would have been great to see a full on GTR3...
  
 On a side note, I'm thinking about grabbing a T500RS. Never tried one before (only wheels I've used in the last few years have been the G27 and CSR Elite) but my buddy swears by one. Anyone here using one or have used one in the past?


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## proton007

ninjapirate9901 said:


> Looks that way
> 
> Would have been great to see a full on GTR3...




The response for RRRE has been mild at best.
People still can't stop comparing it to GTR2 and Race07.
So don't lose hope. It's possible they'll be forced to come up with a GTR3 after all.


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## StratocasterMan

I recently got a new computer, and then I got a Logitech G27 wheel, shifter, and pedals. I'm getting hopelessly addicted to iRacing now, but I'm still a rookie and still learning. I like the way iRacing focuses on a safety rating so that one must learn to drive safely as well as fast in order to move up to better races. I've only been playing for two months now. I started with a game controller, but it's much more fun with the steering wheel. Having a clutch and an H-pattern shifter or paddle shifters is just fun! I'm running both oval and road races and trying to work my way up. I'm gradually getting better.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Here's a low-fi picture of my set-up. Yes, I know the cable management is lacking in this photo!


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## ninjapirate9901

stratocasterman said:


> I recently got a new computer, and then I got a Logitech G27 wheel, shifter, and pedals. I'm getting hopelessly addicted to iRacing now, but I'm still a rookie and still learning. I like the way iRacing focuses on a safety rating so that one must learn to drive safely as well as fast in order to move up to better races. I've only been playing for two months now. I started with a game controller, but it's much more fun with the steering wheel. Having a clutch and an H-pattern shifter or paddle shifters is just fun! I'm running both oval and road races and trying to work my way up. I'm gradually getting better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Nice! I haven't played iRacing in a long, long time. I feel like it's just too much of a time sink. G27 is a solid wheel but the shifter and pedals leave a bit to be desired unfortunately.


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## StratocasterMan

ninjapirate9901 said:


> Nice! I haven't played iRacing in a long, long time. I feel like it's just too much of a time sink. G27 is a solid wheel but the shifter and pedals leave a bit to be desired unfortunately.


 
  
 I'm still learning, but the pedals feel pretty good to me. What pedals do you like?
  
 I know Thrustmaster has a shifter that goes for about $150 that looks much better, but I'm not ready to spend $150 on a shifter alone at this point. I tend to use the H-pattern shifter for stuff like oval races just to get that "NASCAR" feel, but the paddle shifters seem a little faster for road racing cars. I do enjoy using the H-pattern shifter for road racing just because it's really, really fun, but the paddle shifters seem a little faster.


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## ninjapirate9901

stratocasterman said:


> I'm still learning, but the pedals feel pretty good to me. What pedals do you like?
> 
> I know Thrustmaster has a shifter that goes for about $150 that looks much better, but I'm not ready to spend $150 on a shifter alone at this point. I tend to use the H-pattern shifter for stuff like oval races just to get that "NASCAR" feel, but the paddle shifters seem a little faster for road racing cars. I do enjoy using the H-pattern shifter for road racing just because it's really, really fun, but the paddle shifters seem a little faster.


 
  
 I've become accustomed to the Fanatec Clubsport V2 Pedals. Pretty expensive for what they are, but damn do they feel nice. Specifically, braking and clutch actuation is done very well. I find that a good set of pedals is as import (or even more important) than a decent wheel.


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## StratocasterMan

ninjapirate9901 said:


> I've become accustomed to the Fanatec Clubsport V2 Pedals. Pretty expensive for what they are, but damn do they feel nice. Specifically, braking and clutch actuation is done very well. I find that a good set of pedals is as import (or even more important) than a decent wheel.


 
  
 Thanks for the advice. What games are you playing? I'm sorry, but I have not read every post in the thread.
  
 I find iRacing to be very good... 
  
 What games do you think are better?


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## Eee Pee

Gran Trismo 6.


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## StratocasterMan

I don't think Gran Turismo 6 is available for PC. I believe it is only for Playstation.
  
 I don't play Playstation or XBox.
  
 I prefer games for full-on Windows PC.


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## ninjapirate9901

stratocasterman said:


> Thanks for the advice. What games are you playing? I'm sorry, but I have not read every post in the thread.
> 
> I find iRacing to be very good...
> 
> What games do you think are better?


 
  
 iRacing was pretty awesome physics wise from what I remember (it's been at least 2 years since I last touched it though) but I found it hard to maintain a regular commitment to it for online leagues and both the car and track selection were a bit limited.
  
 Lately my primary racers have been PCARS (physics remain wonky at best, track and vehicle selection are fantastic though) and I've heard some very good things about Assetto Corsa so I'll probably pick that up in the near future.


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## Pudu

pudu said:


> draygonn said:
> 
> 
> > How is the CSW treating you? I've heard so much good and bad that it gets confusing. Nice seating angle.
> ...





Just thought I'd update this a bit. A couple of months ago, my Fanatec wheel did stop working as intended - any amount of force when turning the wheel would cause it to power off. I had had the wheel for over a year, so I thought I was SOL. I contacted Fanatec and it took them about a week to respond. But they gave me a case number and told me to send it to a repair dude. He installed new motors and shipped right back, no charge. 

I was initially concerned about the quality control and customer services issues I had read about before I bought Fanatec, but I have to say they handled this to my satisfaction, where many other companies would have charged me a chunk to get things working again. And, the wheel handles better than ever - which is to say very well. So if anyone is thinking about the CSW, I have no regrets in making the splurge. 


Oh, and some good looking stuff coming down the pipe for GSC 2013.


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## StratocasterMan

Currently racing Legends cars at South Boston in iRacing. Here's a video (not my video)...


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## haejuk

I just joined the sim racing club last week.  I picked up a used G25 locally and tried it with Assetto Corsa.  All I can say is WOW.  I have played GT5 a lot with the regular PS3 controller, but it simply didn't compare to just running a practice lap on 1966 Monza (no chicanes!) in a Zonda R.  It was absolutely terrifying!  The best part for me is when you lift off the throttle you can clearly hear the well recorded crackle and bang on the over-run in your headphones.  Didn't hear it as clearly on the poor TV speakers though.  If you are on the fence about Assetto Corsa, try out the demo and I think you will know if you want to take the plunge.
  
 I also briefly tried GT6, Race 07, and GTR2 and they are all worthy of your time, but Assetto Corsa is the only one that blew me away with the short time I spent on it.  Still need to try out the wheel with F1 2013, NFS Shift 2, and of course Euro Truck Simulator 2.  I kind of have a huge game backlog to work through...
  
 I just can't wait for the consumer version of the Occulus Rift.  Combine that with some good headphones and your wheel and you have the ultimate sim race experience with Assetto Corsa.  I want to try iRacing, but too much gaming backlog.


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## Twangsta

haejuk said:


> I just joined the sim racing club last week.  I picked up a used G25 locally and tried it with Assetto Corsa.  All I can say is WOW.  I have played GT5 a lot with the regular PS3 controller, but it simply didn't compare to just running a practice lap on 1966 Monza (no chicanes!) in a Zonda R.  It was absolutely terrifying!  The best part for me is when you lift off the throttle you can clearly hear the well recorded crackle and bang on the over-run in your headphones.  Didn't hear it as clearly on the poor TV speakers though.  If you are on the fence about Assetto Corsa, try out the demo and I think you will know if you want to take the plunge.
> 
> I also briefly tried GT6, Race 07, and GTR2 and they are all worthy of your time, but Assetto Corsa is the only one that blew me away with the short time I spent on it.  Still need to try out the wheel with F1 2013, NFS Shift 2, and of course Euro Truck Simulator 2.  I kind of have a huge game backlog to work through...
> 
> I just can't wait for the consumer version of the Occulus Rift.  Combine that with some good headphones and your wheel and you have the ultimate sim race experience with Assetto Corsa.  I want to try iRacing, but too much gaming backlog.




Nice, been a Netkar/Kunus fan a long time, his physics were great with namie!
I've tried them all out too over the years, KUNUS is way ahead of the rest for things I care about. LFS was a lot of fun too, they just came out of the wood works and released an update for the DK2 as well.

Got a DK2 arriving some soon, can't wait to try it out with AC.


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## Pudu

Fired up some classic Jerez to reacquaint myself with the track layout for F1 pre-season testing.


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## oqvist

Thought I should resurrect this thread with the announcement that me and my team mates will go to denmark for the 24h lemans event at Kolding 23-25th october.
  
 www.gtr24h.org


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## Pudu

Very cool!


What class/car are you driving?


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## oqvist

Sorry for late answer the porsche P1.
  
 Here is the skin and the rig we will use http://simhqmotorsports.com/forums/index.php?/topic/9830-simhq-motorsports-at-gtr24h/#comment-104599


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## Pudu

Serious looking rig!

So how did it go? Sounds like a lot of fun. Although, the temptation to drink and drive might have proved too much for me  .


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