# FiiO E18 Review



## bowei006

FiiO E18 Kunlun Review  

  
  
  
  
  
*Introduction:*
 FiiO has come a long way in recent years – quickly developing and releasing well-valued products – with its line of amps and DACs. Today, we have one of the newest additions to the FiiO family; the E18 Kunlun. FiiO’s Kunlun is designed as a computer and Android-device USB-DAC and portable-amplifier. At $160, can the E18 perform its duty?
  
*Unboxing Video:*

  

  
*Unit Build:*
 There are a million ways to describe a FiiO – good sounding being a common one – but having a sexy build always is one of the first. The E18 uses the stealthy milled-aluminum look of the E12, in addition with a top control bar surrounded by a silver strip.
  
 The silver strip, build-edges, and control-panel plate are plastic. It’s hard to tell on first look, because they blend in so well with the metal. It looks good, as the black plastic provides a matte complementing-gradient to the shiny metal. I would personally say that the plastic seems strong enough – albeit a tad lightweight for me - for the purposes of the E18.
  
 The feel of all the buttons is impeccable. There is a satisfying ‘click’ followed by every push. It isn’t loud or hard to press, but neither is it squishy. They don’t have much wiggle-room and are machined out of aluminum; which is a standard FiiO trait.
  
 The body of the E18 is probably the most eye-catching part. The stealthy black metal –silkscreened with FiiO’s legendary logo – and its control scheme intimidates and excites me. It looks busy at first – there seem to be so many buttons – but once you play with it for a bit, you’ll know that it isn’t nearly as domineering. But, what really takes the cake is in how well the metal is kept. The E18 has been traveling with me - surrounded by other sharp-metal amps - in a small pouch. Despite this, its metal body still looks as fantastic as the day I got it.
  
 Overall,  the build of the E18 is quite nice. The metal looks great and matches its cousin – the E12 Mont Blanc – while still having adequate space for the components inside. I would rather they have used metal for the plastic parts –despite plastic being a better ‘shock barrier’ – but it still works well without any problems.
  

*Accessories:*
 The E18 comes with the accessories shown below. They include a 3.5mm to coaxial cable, rubber feet, micro USB OTG cables, a regular USB cable for charging, a 3.5mm interconnect cable, some silicon bands, and a pouch. This is pretty standard – for FiiO that is – with the units that they field.
  
 The 3.5mm to RCA cable is used to output a signal from the E18 to an external DAC/Amp. This allows you to use another DAC –that has support for coaxial input – with the E18.
 The various USB cables that FiiO provides are not the same. Two cables are of the micro USB OTG kind while one of them is the computer-to-device kind. You can tell the cable meant for use with the computer – besides being the USB cable that didn’t come in a pair - by the big USB Type A head that it uses.
  
 Lastly, the 3.5mm interconnect cable is used as a medium to bridge the E18 with another device. This cable is meant to be plugged only in the headphone out –although not common to do so - and a line I/O.
  

*How does the E18 work?:*
  
 The E18 looks extremely intimidating to use; I know, that’s a lot of buttons and ports.  So let’s take it step by step from powering on, charging, headphone amp, USB computer mode, phone mode, and DAC output mode. Then, let’s take a look at the buttons.
  
 To power on the E18, you only have to turn the volume-knob and the device will click and power on. There are four lights at the very bottom ;one with a star on top and three connected by a battery-indicator. The star will light up red when the device is powered on and used as a headphone amp. The star will shine red and blue when it is being used through its USB port (phone or computer).
  
 To charge the E18(not your phone), plug the USB cable into the port on the bottom that says ‘power’. During charging when the device is off. The star icon will not be powered on – obviously as the device is off in this scenario – while the battery indicator lights will blink. The blinking of whichever of the three indicator lights will tell you have ‘full’ the battery is. When the blue light on the ‘H’ stops blinking with all three bars showing continuous lights, the charge is fully finished.
  
 To charge your phone with the E18, plug the phone’s compatible USB cable into the port on the E18’s bottom that says ‘USB’. You will then need to flip the switch so that it is on the ‘CHG’ sign.
  
 To use the E18 soley as a headphone amp – with a DAP – make sure nothing is plugged into the USB section. You will then need to plug your headphone into the ‘headphone out’ plug at the top and the 3.5mm cable into the port adjacent to it.
  
 For using the Kunlun as a USB-DAC with your computer, get the regular USB Type A to micro B – already included in the package – and plug it into where it says ‘USB’ on the bottom. You will then need to set the switch to ‘DAC’.
  
 To use the Kunlun with your Android-phone, use the USB OTG cables and set the E18 to ‘DAC’ mode on the bottom with the cable plugged into the ‘USB’ port.
  
 To use the Coaxial out on the E18, you need to have a phone or computer plugged in and producing a signal to the E18. Once the E18 detects that a signal is being produced, the coaxial output will work. You can then use an external DAC with the E18.
  
 There are three ‘playback’ buttons on the E18 Kunlun; they are play/pause, forward, and backwards.  This function works on Android-phones, Windows computers, and Mac OSX computers through the USB DAC. There’s no skimming on Mac or Windows with the ‘forward and backwards’ buttons. This means that the song won’t move a bit into the ‘future’ the longer you hold the button.
  
          Video on how to use:

  

*Usability:*
  The main gripe most will have with the Kunlun – besides its size – will be with how to use it. I get asked questions all the time on how to use only the DAC or amp. It’s just a typical part of using a new device.
  
 The sheer amount of controls on the E18, do however create some confusion at times for me. I often forget – very quickly – the difference between the ‘USB’ and ‘Power’ ports on the bottom along with their switches. Juggling the rear controls with the main control switches up above get easier with time, but is a problem that newbies will have for sure.
  
 As with any portable amplifier, the size, and I/O function of the device factors heavily into real world usability. The I/O and headphone out jack are in positions that are very awkward for some DAP’s. This depends on how you are orienting each device and what kind of cable you are using in between. While having these jacks – which use the amplifier – are useful when they are close together, they will pose a problem for DAP’s that are small in size or with weird I/O schemes.
  
 Audiophile units - like this - have the innate quality of being extra baggage.  Having a brick attached to your iPhone or Galaxy is obviously going to put a damper on the general usability. It’s pretty much already implied but I will remind you that this is pretty standard. My outlook on its usability is pretty positive – because it is quite smooth to attach – but do know that this obviously won’t feel like thin air.
  
 Overall, I would say that it is pretty much expected – for the most part – what it is that you are buying into. It’s a large size device with lots of bells-and-whistles situated around a familiar I/O control scheme of where your wires plug.  The usability of it is pretty much already guaranteed to be awkward on some degree.
  
*Noise, Gain, and Bass Boost (General):*
  
 No noise was detected with a 32 ohm headphone while pushing the volume all the way up. The gain settings themselves, while no music is playing, displayed no noise production with the same setting. The bass boost is mainly targeted at the mid bass.
  
*Volume Pot:*
  
 The FiiO E12 Mont Blanc was known for having a stiff volume pot when people first received it. The E18 rectified that issue by providing a more freely moving pot. There isn’t much chance of general accidental volume change with this new change however.  My testing indicated that trying to change the volume with one finger sliding up and down the wheel – without pushing too hard on it - wasn’t enough to move the pot. IEM users should still be careful.
   

 *Testing:*
 The sonic section of the E18 review will be a work in progress due to my lack of comparison materials at this time. The E18 was used and tested with the AKG Q701, Fischer Audio TBA-04, Brainwavz R3, RHA SA 950i, Logicform NV1, Project-H (Objective 2 w/ CS4398 DAC), Iona amp, and various other units.
  
 The current sonic section was written – while on vacation - on a mobile station.  I have limited resources right now so please hang with me.
 *Sound Section:*

  
Highs:
 The high frequency range on the E18 is excellent in both stability and clarity.  It was able to produce very crips and clear highs while maintaining the note without problem. The highs are pretty much free from interference from the other ranges. They are a bit clearer than the X3, and possibly what most are accustomed to. This could lead to some brightness or fatigue later on for those who aren’t accustomed to it.
  
Mid Vocals:
 The vocals on the E18 are forward, separated, and spacially clear. They have a bigger space to themselves than the X3 without a doubt. They are not as encumbered by the lows leaking into them as other amps are which is quite nice. This allows the forward vocals, to really shine. This – yet again – does provide problems for those that generally listen to thick sounding music. The E18 hides less than the traditional amp and so can bring out less than positive elements in a song.
  
 The general clarity of the mid vocals are a bit lacking. This refers to the detail of the voices themselves and not the space that it is in. Considering the general ‘sharp’ quality of this unit, I was expect vocals that were equally as demanding. Depending on how you see it, having less ‘spark’ to the vocals could be a blessing; this is especially true to users who have some bad recordings,
  
Mid instruments:
 The mid instruments have the same feature-set as the vocals do. They are quite forward, and have their own unique space. The detail falls through quite a bit however.  I preferred the detail of the instruments on the X3 over the E18 KunLun.
 Strings and other instruments do not have the texture that I would expect from them. It is a bit disappointing, but the special quality of them may be more important to other users.
  
Lows:
 The lows of the E18 have quite a punch by default. By comparison with the X3, the X3 has a tad bit more impact, but loses out a tiny bit in quality.
  
 The E18 Kunlun is a bassy amplifier with good punch and extension throughout the range. It is a bit more on the boomy side of things – as many FiiO amps are – so this isn’t exactly a quality master. I personally prefer amps that are like this due to my taste in mainstream music. The lack of an absolute texture or punch actually makes it more enjoyable for me.
  
Soundstage:
 The first thing people will notice about the E18 – without a doubt – is the wide soundstage of it. Everything is well separated and airy in feel. This works very well with classical genres.
  
Overall sound signature:
 The sound signature of the E18 is mainly bassy but a tad cold. It is obviously a ‘warm’ amp, but the soundstage, separation between the frequencies, and slight problem in producing detail with the mids makes the E18 a bit more analytical than most would think.
  
 The nature of this amp puts it at a weird spot. It is both good for classical, but also potentially not a very good fit; with the same being said for pop. If the amplifier had more detail in the mids, and was more tight-sounding with a bit less space between each frequency, I think it would have been a real winner in the sound category.
 *Conclusion:*

  
 The E18 Kunlun is a good sounding amplifier/DAC combo for users who want to use it with an Android device. It is packed to the brim with features, and armed with an absolutely phenomenal-looing build. The E18 passes the sonic test without much problems, but does yield issues in producing a more well rounded sound. Overall, I would say that this device is priced very well and competitively – if there is even competition at all – for its target market. The E18 Kunlun seeks to wow, and it sure does at this price. 
  
*Ratings: (based on price)*
 Audio Sonic quality: 7.8/10
 Features: 9/10
 Build: 9/10
 Usability: 8.5/10
 Value: 8.5/10


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## wolfetan44

Nice review, Bowei!!


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## bowei006

wolfetan44 said:


> Nice review, Bowei!!


 
 Thanks Wolfetannnnnyyy


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## wolfetan44

bowei006 said:


> wolfetan44 said:
> 
> 
> > Nice review, Bowei!!
> ...


 
 By the way, you need more posts. Disrespecting the Panda name..


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## bowei006

wolfetan44 said:


> By the way, you need more posts. Disrespecting the Panda name..


 
 I think 30,000+ posts is enough for a life time?


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## wolfetan44

bowei006 said:


> wolfetan44 said:
> 
> 
> > By the way, you need more posts. Disrespecting the Panda name..
> ...


 
 Nope. Need to get 100,000 posts.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Then you can be called a true Panda.


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## StanD

Did you compare the E18 with the X3 side by side or do that from experience with the X3?


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## bowei006

stand said:


> Did you compare the E18 with the X3 side by side or do that from experience with the X3?


 
 Side by side.
  
 A lot of my reviews are of course based on experience, but the X3 was done side by side. 
  
 This is also a definite work in progress on the sound section section. The only headphone I have with me while I'm on vacation is a $50 portable. I'm going to change it as I see fit once I get back home.


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## StanD

bowei006 said:


> Side by side.
> 
> A lot of my reviews are of course based on experience, but the X3 was done side by side.
> 
> This is also a definite work in progress on the sound section section. The only headphone I have with me while I'm on vacation is a $50 portable. I'm going to change it as I see fit once I get back home.


 
 I'll be more interested when you can redo this with a better set of cans. I await thy tests.


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## bowei006

stand said:


> I'll be more interested when you can redo this with a better set of cans. I await thy tests.


 
 The cans aren't that big of anything in reviewing once you get around. $100 'studio' cans with a good testing suite does wonders.
  
 The biggest problem writting the review this week was my lack of studio cans of that 'caliber' (not very high) and the lack of my musical library with me.
  
 I rely on my huge musical library through foobar and its various plug ins and what not along with other tools and amps and switches to test and write these formal sound sections.
  
 I didn't have any of that today.
  
 All I had was a few songs I knew well, an X3, and a headphone on my Mac.
  
 Still, it was still decent enough of a time


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## money4me247

@bowei006, great review! i am interested in the fiio e18, but i was wondering how it compares to other dac/amp combos. it seems like a lot of regular dac/amps that advertised as android compatible have been found to work w/ android smart phones. i have read that the fiio e17 seems to outperform the e18 sonically.


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## StanD

money4me247 said:


> @bowei006, great review! i am interested in the fiio e18, but i was wondering how it compares to other dac/amp combos. it seems like a lot of regular dac/amps that advertised as android compatible have been found to work w/ android smart phones. i have read that the fiio e17 seems to outperform the e18 sonically.


 
 I'd like to hear the answers to these same questions.


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## bowei006

money4me247 said:


> @bowei006, great review! i am interested in the fiio e18, but i was wondering how it compares to other dac/amp combos. it seems like a lot of regular dac/amps that advertised as android compatible have been found to work w/ android smart phones. i have read that the fiio e17 seems to outperform the e18 sonically.


 
 At around $200, the E18 loses out on refinement for its class.
  
 I have had this for over two months, so I have already used it and did light testing. The vocal forwardness, and how it spacially sounds with its sound signature is a step forward for FiiO in terms of being more 'hi-fi' like. But, its also a bit of a mess in terms of how well it sounds overall. 
  
 There aren't many headphones I would choose to pair wiith the E18.
  
 Maybe go phone/computer to E18 to line out to whatever other amp you like? :
  
 I have yet to review the line out - not that I can with my current resources - but I'll get back to you guys when I can.
  
 The E17 is the only FiiO device I don't have anymore. I got rid of it a while back so I can't really tell you what's up. But in all reality, I would think (by memory) that it was better just by the sheer fact that it was much smoother sounding than the E18.
  
 Most people use E07K's or E17's or some iBasso's as DAC/amps for Androids(that list is not inclusive) but the E18 has the advantage of being priced very competetively ($!60), features the same E12 build class, and has amazing functions for you guys to use.
  
 Being able to charge devices that use USB B was amazing. I was stuck at the airport last month, and was able to use the E18 to charge and fill up my X3 after I forgot to charge my X3 before.


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## StanD

What about line out to an E12?


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## money4me247

god... i wish fiio just used the same WM8740 chip in the e18. they are using the TI PCM1795 in the e18 (tho according to this website, it's an upgrade) http://soundnews.ro/2013/12/02/8653/
  
 i think most reviewers had the same opinion as you, mister talking pandabear. that the e18's sound isn't as good as the e17. booo  it looks soo money


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## bowei006

Make a list girls and boys. Ill be able to formally finish the review when i get to my temporary regional station. But I wont have any Fiio comparisons or others until late January when I get back home.

Edit:
Unboxing and General Usage video (which is already availble on Youtube) will be added to this review later today. I forgot to add them initially.


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## Ashade

Smoother isn't better IMO and I definitely find the E18 to be an upgrade with respect E07K and E17. It's sharper and drier maybe, but that's the kind of sound I prefer. Some people mistakes the tightness on the bass with warmth. The E18 is much more precise in the bass than the laters as well. I suppose it's a matter of opinion but I A/B'ed the E18 with the O2/ODAC combo in the Q701 and the difference were not that big. I can perhaps say that the DAC on the E18 is indeed slightly warmer that the ODAC, compared from the aux output.

A piece of equipment that is definitely worth every single cent.

EDIT:

What I found slightly disappointing was the build. The chromed bezel is a bit loose and I expected an improvement with respect the E07K that feels sturdy and solid. This is probably not the case in the E18.

Regarding usability, this is honestly ridiculously simple to use. I've never had a single problem with it. It has a lot of functionality, but that is an extra and definitely not a flaw. In fact, I greatly appreciate not having the LED screen and the digital volume. You can operate the device without even looking to it.

Finally, after the upgrade that Fiio has already announced for January 15th, this device is going to be even better. I expect them to fix the little quality control issues they are having at this point. I will definitely be selling mine to get the new version.


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## bowei006

One thing to always note and remember about a review is that is is meant to inform. They typically also feature a reviewers own opinion on the sound as a type of personal but authoritative bias to it.
  
 The non-linear sound of the E18 isn't necessarily bad as you mentioned. Some people with some equipment may favor this a lot more. This is true. My review scheme informs, but also adds personal opinion to it.


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## bowei006

money4me247 said:


> god... i wish fiio just used the same WM8740 chip in the e18. they are using the TI PCM1795 in the e18 (tho according to this website, it's an upgrade) http://soundnews.ro/2013/12/02/8653/
> 
> i think most reviewers had the same opinion as you, mister talking pandabear. that the e18's sound isn't as good as the e17. booo  it looks soo money


 
 I missed this post this morning.
  
 I think that FiiO using new chips is a very good thing.
  
 It sets a precedent for exploration and new products. 
  
 FiiO has claimed - in the past - that they are the largest buyer of Wolfson chips in all of China. This is a nice thing, but does show a reliance to default to a tried and true chip, rather than true experimentation.
  
 I have yet to test DAC to DAC yet. 
  
 I will test the WM8740 and the BurrBrown (TI) DAC side by side in a week or two.


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## Ashade

bowei006 said:


> One thing to always note and remember about a review is that is is meant to inform. They typically also feature a reviewers own opinion on the sound as a type of personal but authoritative bias to it.
> 
> The non-linear sound of the E18 isn't necessarily bad as you mentioned. Some people with some equipment may favor this a lot more. This is true. My review scheme informs, but also adds personal opinion to it.




Agree, and you know I always enjoy your reviews. I just wanted to give my own opinion. Good job as always Bowei.


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## bowei006

ashade said:


> Agree, and you know I always enjoy your reviews. I just wanted to give my own opinion. Good job as always Bowei.


 
 Thanks Ashade, its always a good feeling knowing that some people are fans


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## uzi74

I'm considering getting the Fiio E18 or the HRT microstreamer for portable/android use. The Fiio E18 has a lot more features, that's clear. Would you expect the sound quality being similar on those 2 devices? (I own a E07k)


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## kayza

uzi74 said:


> I'm considering getting the Fiio E18 or the HRT microstreamer for portable/android use. The Fiio E18 has a lot more features, that's clear. Would you expect the sound quality being similar on those 2 devices? (I own a E07k)


I have a microstreamer and it works fine with my note 3. Do be aware that the volume control for this is digital only though. I am aware and understand perfectly that the microstreamer features digitally controlled analog attenuation. This works 100% correctly when my HRT is on my pc. But when on my android note 3, both the line out and headphone amp plug are attenuated when controlling the volume on the phone (the only way). So that means that the headphone amp of the HRT is at 100% always, and you are sending it an attenuated digital signal from the android device. So to have a bit lossless signal on the hrt, the android has to be at full volume. So that sucks. I have my HRT line out to an e12, and use it that way. It sounds great and I like it. But the HRT alone on an Android phone may not be what you originally thought of prior to reading this.


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## Marco Angel

does anybody had test it on Nokia's? I have an 720 lumia


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## Nota Bene

I've had this for 10 days or so...I've paired it up with my HTC One and listen through Etymotic HF5s on my daily commute.  The transformation is remarkable...I'm hearing things I've not heard before, and really makes listening to my collection a joy again.  There's been a bit of a learning curve remembering to use the volume control on the unit rather than the phone when I need to change it, but apart from that it seems quite straightforward.  My only gripe (there has to be one) is that it comes with a pouch that is open only at one end...if it had a hole in the bottom to put the cable through, it would be much more useful...actually I've unpicked the sowing to let me do this...and at the top end, the velcro loop is directly over the headphone socket...surely this should have been thought through a bit and then the case would have been really useful.  Apart from that...absolutely love it....


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## completeharry

The E18 looks awfully tempting, however I do like to compact size of my current E6.


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## StanD

completeharry said:


> The E18 looks awfully tempting, however I do like to compact size of my current E6.


 
 The E6 does not contain a DAC and its sonic capabilities are a far cry from what the E18 can do. Size vs, ears, you have to make the choice.


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## Solrighal

This is a relatively huge thread but I have one question. I currently own a Galaxy Note 3 and it's paired with V-Moda M-100. I use Neutron MP for playback. Will the E18 work for me and what else cable-wise do I need to buy? 

Thank you.


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## bowei006

completeharry said:


> The E18 looks awfully tempting, however I do like to compact size of my current E6.


like stan said. The E6 is a far cry from the e18




solrighal said:


> This is a relatively huge thread but I have one question. I currently own a Galaxy Note 3 and it's paired with V-Moda M-100. I use Neutron MP for playback. Will the E18 work for me and what else cable-wise do I need to buy?
> 
> Thank you.



This thread isnt that big

Fiio has a list of devices known to work with the e18 on their site. They also recommend using an app whose name evades me. 

Check it out


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## StanD

bowei006 said:


> like stan said. The E6 is a far cry from the e18
> This thread isnt that big
> 
> Fiio has a list of devices known to work with the e18 on their site. They also recommend using an app whose name evades me.
> ...


 
 That app is for devices that support OTG but not USB audio, I have a Samsung US Galaxy S3 which fully works with the E18. So I can use PowerAmp, NeutronMP or stream with Spotify or Google Music Player with All Access. The E18 also has a Coax SPDIF Out so I can use an external DAC, that isn't directly supported by the S3 but has a Coax SPDIF input. The E18 is a steal.


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## chilimac02

I down with the e18. I user it on my s4. It blew me away the first tone I heard it. I use poweramp as an app. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## bowei006

chilimac02 said:


> I down with the e18. I user it on my s4. It blew me away the first tone I heard it. I use poweramp as an app.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


 
 "Welcome to Head-Fi, Sorry about your wallet"
  
 Great to hear. Most use a setup similar to what you are doing. 
  
 E18 has some good sound, but I prefer the E12's a bit better


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## StanD

bowei006 said:


> "Welcome to Head-Fi, Sorry about your wallet"
> 
> Great to hear. Most use a setup similar to what you are doing.
> 
> E18 has some good sound, but I prefer the E12's a bit better


 
 The E12 also has more muscle (mW) and can just get away with driving an HE-500.


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## shaolin95

Anyone using the E18 with a phone running stock Kitkat (not CM stuff)? I read that Kitkat does not support dac over USB (although on a sony blog it says the upcoming Kitkat for Xperia supports it which will be great for my Xperia Z Ultra)..
 I want to make sure because I dont want to but it now then not be able to use it after upgrading.
 Thanks!


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## bfielder

I'm thinking about purchasing this cuz it seems to make for a great portable DAC as well as something I can use at home with my laptop.  I have a set of Swan powered bookshelf, would I be able to plug them into the FiiO as well?


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## bowei006

bfielder said:


> I'm thinking about purchasing this cuz it seems to make for a great portable DAC as well as something I can use at home with my laptop.  I have a set of Swan powered bookshelf, would I be able to plug them into the FiiO as well?


 
 What inputs do your SWAM bookshelf's use?


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## bfielder

bowei006 said:


> What inputs do your SWAM bookshelf's use?


 
 http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php?loudspeakers=swan-active-desktop-sound&p=swan-d1080-iv-active-desktop-loudspeaker-system&cPath=21_24&products_id=200&
  
 There's a link to them.


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## bowei006

bfielder said:


> http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php?loudspeakers=swan-active-desktop-sound&p=swan-d1080-iv-active-desktop-loudspeaker-system&cPath=21_24&products_id=200&
> 
> There's a link to them.


 
 Probably


> *Includes 1 meter stereo RCA-to-RCA cable*
> *Includes 1 meter 3.5mm phone plug-to-RCA adapter cable*
> - See more at: http://www.theaudioinsider.com/product_info.php?loudspeakers=swan-active-desktop-sound&p=swan-d1080-iv-active-desktop-loudspeaker-system&cPath=21_24&products_id=200&#sthash.WS3WpdsM.dpuf


 
 It says this which should mean yes if you use that adapter cable.


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## bfielder

bowei006 said:


> Probably
> It says this which should mean yes if you use that adapter cable.


 
 Alright cool thanks.


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## awayeah

I'm using E18 with KitKat on HTC One - no problems so far. However it does not work when USB debugging mode is on. So make sure you turn it off (it should be off by default but still worth mentioning).


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## awayeah

ashade said:


> Smoother isn't better IMO and I definitely find the E18 to be an upgrade with respect E07K and E17. It's sharper and drier maybe, but that's the kind of sound I prefer. Some people mistakes the tightness on the bass with warmth. The E18 is much more precise in the bass than the laters as well. I suppose it's a matter of opinion but I A/B'ed the E18 with the O2/ODAC combo in the Q701 and the difference were not that big. I can perhaps say that the DAC on the E18 is indeed slightly warmer that the ODAC, compared from the aux output.
> 
> A piece of equipment that is definitely worth every single cent.
> 
> ...


 
 I'm satisfied with E18 but it's my first Amp/DAC combo and being impressed with the sound quality I'm wondering if it's worth to buy O2/ODAC? To use them both not to replace E18.
 Can you tell me whether there is a significant enough difference between those 2 to justified purchase? In your opinion...
 For now I'm using it only with IEMs and I'm not planning to buy any hard-to-drive headphones either - so there's plenty of power and that part is not important to me.
 I thought that buying ZO2.3 or ZO3 (when it's available) would make more sense (for the fun of it and using them as a combo with E18) than owning 2 similar products unless there actually is a significant difference.


----------



## StanD

awayeah said:


> I'm satisfied with E18 but it's my first Amp/DAC combo and being impressed with the sound quality I'm wondering if it's worth to buy O2/ODAC? To use them both not to replace E18.
> Can you tell me whether there is a significant enough difference between those 2 to justified purchase? In your opinion...
> For now I'm using it only with IEMs and I'm not planning to buy any hard-to-drive headphones either - so there's plenty of power and that part is not important to me.
> I thought that buying ZO2.3 or ZO3 (when it's available) would make more sense (for the fun of it and using them as a combo with E18) than owning 2 similar products unless there actually is a significant difference.


 
 I would save my money for a more significant purchase, like a set of cans and use the E18. A more meaningful upgrade to the E18 is going to cost plenty more. Do you use your E18 with an Android device? OK, I spotted it, "KitKat on HTC One." That means you have to be careful and get a fancy DAC that still works with your HTC.


----------



## bowei006

awayeah said:


> I'm satisfied with E18 but it's my first Amp/DAC combo and being impressed with the sound quality I'm wondering if it's worth to buy O2/ODAC? To use them both not to replace E18.
> Can you tell me whether there is a significant enough difference between those 2 to justified purchase? In your opinion...
> For now I'm using it only with IEMs and I'm not planning to buy any hard-to-drive headphones either - so there's plenty of power and that part is not important to me.
> I thought that buying ZO2.3 or ZO3 (when it's available) would make more sense (for the fun of it and using them as a combo with E18) than owning 2 similar products unless there actually is a significant difference.


 
 It really depends on your headphones.
  
 If you are using IEM's sub $150, I wouldn't bother upgrading to O2/ODAC or MM bundle.


----------



## StanD

bowei006 said:


> It really depends on your headphones.
> 
> If you are using IEM's sub $150, I wouldn't bother upgrading to O2/ODAC or MM bundle.


 
 +1


----------



## awayeah

stand said:


> I would save my money for a more significant purchase, like a set of cans and use the E18. A more meaningful upgrade to the E18 is going to cost plenty more. Do you use your E18 with an Android device? OK, I spotted it, "KitKat on HTC One." That means you have to be careful and get a fancy DAC that still works with your HTC.


 
 I use it with HTC One and with my notebook. If I buy O2/ODAC I'll use it with laptop and E18 with my smartphone. I don't believe I need more sound quality on the go to than E18 provides - it's a great device for that in my opinion.


----------



## awayeah

bowei006 said:


> It really depends on your headphones.
> 
> If you are using IEM's sub $150, I wouldn't bother upgrading to O2/ODAC or MM bundle.


 
 Well I have following IEMs: Sony MH1C, NuForce Ne700x, Monster Gratitude, VSonic GR01, Musical Fidelity EB50, Klipsch X10i, Phonak Audeo PFE111, Sony XBA-H3, Philips Fidelio S2 (I just like to try different stuff ). Besides Musical Fidelity they all sounds great with E18. Musical Fidelity actually sounds better directly from HTC One or Sansa Clip Zip (don't know why - maybe because of it's neutrality and very flat response).
 By MM bundle you meant Schiit?


----------



## humanoid

how would you compare this to the Andes-E07K?


----------



## bowei006

humanoid said:


> how would you compare this to the Andes-E07K?


 
  
 The ANDES E07K sports a much warmer sound signature with an accentuation in the mid bass and a slight smothering of the vocals in where they become a bit too 'warm' and smooth. The E18 gives you a more balanced vocal range, and a more controlled bass along with a clearer sound signature that has qualities similar to an O2, but it has problems in the upper mid range, and high range with sonic fluctuations and deficiencies that may make it more analytical for some headphones.
  
 The two units are quite different in their functions, although the E18 can also be a computer and portable DAC/amp. I would go for the E18 if you want a higher quality sound (at a loss of cohesion) and want to make use of its Android features. I would go for the ANDES if you want a funner sound, don't have as much money for the E18, take a gamble at trying to get it to work with Android devices (it is known to work with some), and want a device of that size.


----------



## erod

Can anyone compare the Fiio E18 to the HRT Microstreamer?


----------



## chongkeat0513

I'm currently using a Sennheiser HD598 looking for a portable Amp/DAC 
  
 Is this going to be a good match for my HD598 ? I like warm sounding and wide soundstage. 
  
 Will the effect be really obvious ? Because i tried JDS Labs C5D and i hear no different.  
  
 Please help me make the right decision. I'm looking for a obvious improving portable Amp/DAC.


----------



## Solrighal

I find the E18 to be quite lean and punchy. If your Sennheiser has the typical warmish Sennheiser sound they might pair quite well. I'm sorry I can't be more specific but I've not heard your particular headphones. What are you going to be hooking up to the DAC?


----------



## shaolin95

chongkeat0513 said:


> Will the effect be really obvious ? Because i tried JDS Labs C5D and i hear no different.


 
 You know, depending on your source and how bad/good it already is, "obvious" is not the first word that comes to mind when testing a DAC specially in your case that you already tried one without noticing anything. To me DAC is something that takes more of a "trained" ear. Not having a super ear, we all pretty much have the same capacity but knowing what you are listening for. Also your files will be important of course. You want high quality files like 320 mp3 or higher to get the most of it.
 I do agree Zorrofox on his description of the E18 sound.


----------



## chongkeat0513

I think i'll just try a few times if still can't tell the diff I just stop spending money on amps


----------



## utmelidze

How is it possible to use e18 with poweramp?
Does poweramp support digital output through usb?
I thought usb recorder or something like that was a must have


----------



## utmelidze

Z ultra worked with creative omni usb in my case
I cant tell either was it digital out ro jusrlt forwarded analog through usb cable
But it worked with poweramp and very well.... Only thing wqs that it was recognised as external keyboard and i couldnt use another keybord...no typing possible with external dac
Maybe possible and i couldnt solve that


----------



## Solrighal

If it's through the USB then it's digital. For better sound try Neutron. You will not be disappointed.


----------



## utmelidze

Neutron?


----------



## johangrb

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.neutroncode.mp


----------



## utmelidze

It supports usb digital out, doesnt it?
Asking just for any case...and is it really an improvement over poweramp?
Even with onboard dac?


----------



## Solrighal

utmelidze said:


> It supports usb digital out, doesnt it?
> Asking just for any case...and is it really an improvement over poweramp?
> Even with onboard dac?




Yes, yes & yes.


----------



## petroconsult

chào . can u guys help me . should i buy amp/dac portable (< 400$ fioo e18 , e12DIY..) for my ss note3 ,or just buy anoder dap ( dx90 or x5 ) ?


----------



## utmelidze

if you need it as DAP ...buy DX90
 if you need it as DAC too ...buy E18+E12


----------



## petroconsult

so which choise make the sound better. Dac or Dap. and between E12 DIY limit Edi  and  fiio e18 which 1 better with note 3


----------



## utmelidze

I would say Fiio combo will be lot more powerfull
But DX90 seems to be very high class sounding device
I would say dx90 should sound theoreticaly cleaner and "better"
But Fiio X5 would be so also


----------



## itsthedanyole

Omg. I just hooked up some loudspeakers to my e18 and they soud amazing! Listening to "like clockwork....." By queens of the stoneage, the vocals, the drums, the soundstaging! Wow! Not much volume though.......

Edit:I have a few older sets of nice speakers that I have tested with results as expected but, the combo of my baby advent II's wired in series with technics sb-l100 sounds great and plays at a listenable volume.


----------



## cehowardNote3

petroconsult said:


> chào . can u guys help me . should i buy amp/dac portable (< 400$ fioo e18 , e12DIY..) for my ss note3 ,or just buy anoder dap ( dx90 or x5 ) ?


 
* I am a newbie/novice so I am hooking up with you, it seems like we are looking for the same thing.*





  
 I have a Note 3, and  a Note 10.1 2014..Right now, I am dealing with these headphones connected to my Note 3/10.1, Sony MDR 1RBTMK2, HARMAN KARDON BTs..The sound is awesome, as these headphones have the aptx coding, and the Note 3 and 10.1 have the aptx coding, which makes bluetooth sound close to wired sound. However, I want to fly higher, so I have a pair of AKG K550 on the way. I was thinking about the Fiio E17, but then found about the E18 for Android devices.. 
  
 If you already got yours, what did you get?  E17 or E18, or something else to go with your Note 3??


----------



## Solrighal

E18 works superbly with my Note 3.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> E18 works superbly with my Note 3.


 
 Thanks for that feedback. On the verge of getting a Fiio, amp/dac just doing my research. Was on to the E12, then the E17, and now the E18.. IMO, is going to be a good match for my Note 3 and Note 10.1
  
 Thanks again,


----------



## miandnan

I am just about to pull the trigger on the e18 to pair with my note 3 and rendition 1 amp. Will be pushing heir audio 6.A and 8.A my wife will use her 1964 ears V6stage.

I was going to get the x5 or dx90 but getting access to Google music at 320kb or even improved Pandora is worth it.

So my thought is to buy the e18 use it as mentioned above till x7 and note 4 come out and see how things shape up. I still have my sflo2 that when paired with the rendition 1 really sounds amazing!


Think the e18 rendition 1 and or sflo2 rendition will respectively keep up with the x5/dx90?
*
Any better pure portable DAC options to pair with android / note 3? *

I am very happy with my amp.


----------



## kayza

miandnan said:


> I am just about to pull the trigger on the e18 to pair with my note 3 and rendition 1 amp. Will be pushing heir audio 6.A and 8.A my wife will use her 1964 ears V6stage.
> 
> I was going to get the x5 or dx90 but getting access to Google music at 320kb or even improved Pandora is worth it.
> 
> ...



I have a e18 and occasionally pair it with my note 3, but I get interference every time a song nears it's end. This only happens on my e18.

My primary (and more beloved) solution is my hrt microstreamer to fiio e12. This gives me a tiny integrated amp in the hrt if I really want to be portable, or I e12 it and use with my hd700s. I love this combo, but only realize it when I go to something else, like the e18. IMO, the e18 is a Swiss army knife with a tragic flaw that just ruins it for me, and that is the interference. No excuse for that when I have 4 other dacs that are all older that have no interference when butted up against my phone in various positions. Fiio dropped the ball.

That said, I'll sell you my e18 haha. Only has about 10 hours on it, all hissy with interference!


----------



## Solrighal

My E18 doesn't suffer from that problem. It's actually the first I've heard of it.


----------



## cehowardNote3

kayza said:


> I have a e18 and occasionally pair it with my note 3, but I get interference every time a song nears it's end. This only happens on my e18.
> 
> My primary (and more beloved) solution is my hrt microstreamer to fiio e12. This gives me a tiny integrated amp in the hrt if I really want to be portable, or I e12 it and use with my hd700s. I love this combo, but only realize it when I go to something else, like the e18. IMO, the e18 is a Swiss army knife with a tragic flaw that just ruins it for me, and that is the interference. No excuse for that when I have 4 other dacs that are all older that have no interference when butted up against my phone in various positions. Fiio dropped the ball.
> 
> That said, I'll sell you my e18 haha. Only has about 10 hours on it, all hissy with interference!


 
 Good to hear all types of feedback on items I am interested in. I just pulled the trigger and ordered the E18 from Amazon.. It will be paired with my Note 3, and Note 10.1 2014. Now, that is the first I have heard about this problem. Others that have the E18, have mentioned no such problems.  Could it be the app, flaw in your Note 3?  Because I am sure there are a lot of Note 3 users out there using the E18, and would have seen lots of reports of this, if this is an actual flaw. No matter, I am dealing with Amazon, and they have a 30 day return period, so I am going to see if get that to happen on my Note 3..
  
 Thanks for the feedback too...


----------



## miandnan

kayza said:
			
		

> I have a e18 and occasionally pair it with my note 3, but I get interference every time a song nears it's end. This only happens on my e18.
> 
> My primary (and more beloved) solution is my hrt microstreamer to fiio e12. This gives me a tiny integrated amp in the hrt if I really want to be portable, or I e12 it and use with my hd700s. I love this combo, but only realize it when I go to something else, like the e18. IMO, the e18 is a Swiss army knife with a tragic flaw that just ruins it for me, and that is the interference. No excuse for that when I have 4 other dacs that are all older that have no interference when butted up against my phone in various positions. Fiio dropped the ball.
> 
> That said, I'll sell you my e18 haha. Only has about 10 hours on it, all hissy with interference!





Thanks for the info!

So aside from interference hour does the hrt microstreamer to e12 compare to the e18 to e12?

Selling it huh (e18) lol with what others are reporting with no interference I wonder why you get it? Signal type gsm vs CDMA? 3g vs 4g, defect in unit?


----------



## kayza

miandnan said:


> Thanks for the info!
> 
> So aside from interference hour does the hrt microstreamer to e12 compare to the e18 to e12?
> 
> Selling it huh (e18) lol with what others are reporting with no interference I wonder why you get it? Signal type gsm vs CDMA? 3g vs 4g, defect in unit?



I read of others having interference in this or the other e18 thread. Look back to november/December time frame or use search.
I run a Verizon note 3 (lte) model sm-n900v. The interference is when stacked with the phone, and happens near the end of songs. As if it is reading the next file and that causes interference.

As far as comparison, I notice a difference and prefer the hrt microstreamer and e12 pairing over the e18 or e18 with e12. The downside of the hrt is that it is digitally attenuated, and the phone doesn't support that (except in UAPP), so to get a signal with no loss of bits, you must run full volume on the phone volume slider, and then line out to an amp with a physical volume knob. Not a big deal since I like my e12 anyways, but this may be a deal breaker for some


----------



## miandnan

kayza said:


> I read of others having interference in this or the other e18 thread. Look back to november/December time frame or use search.
> I run a Verizon note 3 (lte) model sm-n900v. The interference is when stacked with the phone, and happens near the end of songs. As if it is reading the next file and that causes interference.
> 
> As far as comparison, I notice a difference and prefer the hrt microstreamer and e12 pairing over the e18 or e18 with e12. The downside of the hrt is that it is digitally attenuated, and the phone doesn't support that (except in UAPP), so to get a signal with no loss of bits, you must run full volume on the phone volume slider, and then line out to an amp with a physical volume knob. Not a big deal since I like my e12 anyways, but this may be a deal breaker for some




Thanks again!

Interference does not sound good at all  

Hmmm I would use an amp so like you digitally attenuated volume on hrt streamer not a factor. 

If you have another minute could you describe what you like about the hrt streamer to e12 vs e18 to e12? Soundstage, details dynamics? Etc


I am reading all the e18 threads and reviews just saw a few posts you made


----------



## kayza

miandnan said:


> Thanks again!
> 
> Interference does not sound good at all
> 
> ...



I believe I've made comparisons in the past. Look thru my profile for past posts I've made. Also as a disclaimer...sometimes I cant tell the difference between some dacs or other products, making me think I'm not one to be qualified to make subjective comparisons that would influence others' buying decisions. But with that said, when I have a/b'd the e18 and hrt, I do notice additional detail and depth to the music I listen to. It is why I haven't used my e18 in probably over a month (and I've traveled for work the past 3 weeks, giving me TONS of listening time, yet I still leave the e18 at home).


----------



## miandnan

kayza said:


> I believe I've made comparisons in the past. Look thru my profile for past posts I've made. Also as a disclaimer...sometimes I cant tell the difference between some dacs or other products, making me think I'm not one to be qualified to make subjective comparisons that would influence others' buying decisions. But with that said, when I have a/b'd the e18 and hrt, I do notice additional detail and depth to the music I listen to. It is why I haven't used my e18 in probably over a month (and I've traveled for work the past 3 weeks, giving me TONS of listening time, yet I still leave the e18 at home).




Sounds good lol thanks I will check it out  

At least for your ears and music and head/earphones it is clear which DAC is better ... Maybe I will buy both and the dragonfly and a b c them for myself tried my Asus U3 into amp and it was worse than note 3 directly into amp. 

I got some music to get to 

Cheers


----------



## kayza

miandnan said:


> Sounds good lol thanks I will check it out
> 
> At least for your ears and music and head/earphones it is clear which DAC is better ... Maybe I will buy both and the dragonfly and a b c them for myself tried my Asus U3 into amp and it was worse than note 3 directly into amp.
> 
> ...


yep. I had the dragonfly 1.0 from best buy too. Returned it. Too bright perhaps. I don't know. I think the bottom line might be that these are all great products in their price range, and you will likely be happy with either. Kind of like when buying a tv. In the store there are so so so many things to compare, but once you bring only one home, that one turns out to be quite alright!

I have a Centrance HiFi-m8 on order, so I am hoping to find more substantial differences between that and these more budget friendly products we've been discussing. If not, I'll be selling that and knowing that the hrt is the limit in bang for buck that my ears care about!!


----------



## cehowardNote3

miandnan said:


> Thanks again!
> 
> Interference does not sound good at all
> 
> ...


 
  
 I am right there with you in reading all the reviews on the E18.. I ordered the E18 yesterday..
  
 From my readings, the problems that do arrive the solution is to upgrade your OS.. Example one user complained to Fiio about a problem, and was told to upgrade their OS, user did that and problem solved.
 Also, for the Samsung Galaxys, it seems you have to have KK 4.3 or above.  Below that, some problems arrive. I am running KK 4.4.2 on my Note 3, so I am looking for smooth sailing when it arrives. I have KK 4.3 on my Note 10.1, so that should be okay too.


----------



## kayza

cehowardnote3 said:


> I am right there with you in reading all the reviews on the E18.. I ordered the E18 yesterday..
> 
> From my readings, the problems that do arrive the solution is to upgrade your OS.. Example one user complained to Fiio about a problem, and was told to upgrade their OS, user did that and problem solved.
> Also, for the Samsung Galaxys, it seems you have to have KK 4.3 or above.  Below that, some problems arrive. I am running KK 4.4.2 on my Note 3, so I am looking for smooth sailing when it arrives. I have KK 4.3 on my Note 10.1, so that should be okay too.



Two points: I don't have an upgrade to my os (I am on the latest update), and if I can have an hit microstreamer, fiio e7, schiit modi, AQ Dragonfly, and even a dirt cheap hifimeDIY android dac ALL work interference free while stacked on the phone, why should I have to upgrade my os to work with this e18?


----------



## cehowardNote3

kayza said:


> Two points: I don't have an upgrade to my os (I am on the latest update), and if I can have an hit microstreamer, fiio e7, schiit modi, AQ Dragonfly, and even a dirt cheap hifimeDIY android dac ALL work interference free while stacked on the phone, why should I have to upgrade my os to work with this e18?


 
 First off, you level of expertise in this is way, way over me. I have none of your audio knowledge or equipment. Just a novice, trying to learn.
 With that said,  I do have "common sense".. I read your comments and problems with the E18, and I read other comments too. Your comment is in the minority. That is all I am saying. Sure there have been problems with all gadgets. But, is the problem 90% out of 100%?No gadget/item is perfect 100%.
  
 Are 90 out of 100 people with this item having the same problem?. If that is so, then this item wouldn't  sell.
 The point is, out of 100 reviews/comments on this item, 90 out of 100 have been positive. In your situation/environment for some reason the item is not performing as it should. But, is that the norm? I would think not. 
  
 Your feedback is awesome too.


----------



## Solrighal

You won't have any problems with the GN3 on kitkat.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> You won't have any problems with the GN3 on kitkat.


 
 I think that is the majority opinion.I have read a lot of reviews and comments on the E18..They are running 92% positive.. And the 8%, have explanations and fixes to what is going on.. 
 My E18 will be here tomorrow.. Sad thing is that the AKG K550 headphones I had ordered, they wind up being backordered, so I am going to order the AKG Q701.. From reading they will perform well with a push from something like the E18.
  
 Thanks for that feedback...


----------



## Solrighal

Not a good combination in my opinion. I have the Q's and don't like them much paired with the E18.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> Not a good combination in my opinion. I have the Q's and don't like them much paired with the E18.


 
 Arrrgggg, what is the reason?  From what I been reading, the Qs do need to be pushed..Okay, going to push them with the E18.. Would you consider the AKG K550 and better choice being pushed with the E18? 
  
 Trying to get some good wired cans in the $200 $250 range.. The Qs were $400+ MSRP.. They are now $200 new...


----------



## Solrighal

I find the Q's to be a very "difficult" headphone. I can only compare the E18 with my O2 but the O2 feels relaxed & effortless. The E18 certainly drives the Q's to satisfactory levels, even on low gain but they also thin and a bit 2d. I have no experience of the 550's so can't say for definite but I'd guess they'll be fine.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> I find the Q's to be a very "difficult" headphone. I can only compare the E18 with my O2 but the O2 feels relaxed & effortless. The E18 certainly drives the Q's to satisfactory levels, even on low gain but they also thin and a bit 2d. I have no experience of the 550's so can't say for definite but I'd guess they'll be fine.


 
 Well, the AKG K550s are still an option, only thing is the refurbished ones going for $130 are not available...
  
 In your opinion, what would be a good match for the E18 in open and closed back headphones. Budget can go up to $300, might raise it a little..I don't listen to rap, and hard rock Mostly jazzy vocals, cool jazz, and the like. And would like to get into the classical stuff. I got bad hearing too..


----------



## utmelidze

anybody here with E07K and E18?
 Sonic comparison would be nice


----------



## Lorspeaker

Test drove the e18 on a kef200 recently... vs a Santa clip+ 
My visa screammmmmed for mercy
V impressed with this smart little metalbox!


----------



## Solrighal

cehowardnote3 said:


> Well, the AKG K550s are still an option, only thing is the refurbished ones going for $130 are not available...
> 
> In your opinion, what would be a good match for the E18 in open and closed back headphones. Budget can go up to $300, might raise it a little..I don't listen to rap, and hard rock Mostly jazzy vocals, cool jazz, and the like. And would like to get into the classical stuff. I got bad hearing too..




After all the headphones I've bought I'm only keeping two pairs - V-Moda M -100 & Sennheiser HD650. The V-Moda's wouldn't suit your musical tastes I'm afraid as they're more of a "fun" sound. The HD650's on the other hand are superb and ideal for your preferred genres. Although they're a 300 Ohm design my E18 has no trouble driving them on low gain. Can they get better with better amplification? You bet! The E18 does a grand job though.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> After all the headphones I've bought I'm only keeping two pairs - V-Moda M -100 & Sennheiser HD650. The V-Moda's wouldn't suit your musical tastes I'm afraid as they're more of a "fun" sound. The HD650's on the other hand are superb and ideal for your preferred genres. Although they're a 300 Ohm design my E18 has no trouble driving them on low gain. Can they get better with better amplification? You bet! The E18 does a grand job though.


 
 Those Sennheiser HD650 are open back, so therefore they would leak sound, am I correct?  I will be using these in my work environment sitting at a desk with people passing by and at home.. I know they would fit in at home.  Also, these won't be good for on the go? Correct?
  
 Thanks for that feedback..


----------



## Solrighal

They don't really work in public spaces I'm afraid. Unless you're built like Annie. They leak loads.


----------



## iqak

I've been using one of these on a galaxy S4 for just under a week now.
 I've tried both the Micro USB input and the 3.5mm Input jack.
 I am getting all sorts of clicks, pops, buzzing, and other noise that is
 ruining my listening environment.
I've verified that I am not getting any of this noise from the source at all.
 Regardless of how close or far away the phone is from the amplifier.
 Regardless whether the phones radios are turned on or off (airplane mode).
  
 My E18 amplifier is driving me nuts.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 I was very much looking forward to improving my amplification, but sadly
 this one is not working for me. I guess I will need to find another option for
my portable amplifier needs.


----------



## Solrighal

I get problems with my E18 when I'm truly mobile. Interference then death. I've attributed it to the flaky connection of the micro USB OTG cable. I had thought it might be a kitkat problem as it never happened before that OS update. But back then my GN3 and E18 were brand new.


----------



## Lorspeaker

Just using it as an amp....i dun hv a NEW fone to pair up with the dac yet.
 Very good synergy with a sansa clip + , and a Mikros90.


----------



## Solrighal

I've just been considering a Sansa Clip. What a difference in size!


----------



## Shisutemu

Hi all, just got myself a fiio e18 yesterday, however i seem to have issues getting it connected to my galaxy note 2, sometimes it connects sometimes it doesn't for some odd reason. And is it normal for the e18 to make a clicking noise everytime you switch on to a different mode? (like changing to CHG OUT for eg)
  
 It's been quite a hassle getting it to work, and im hoping its not an issue everyone is facing.


----------



## cehowardNote3

iqak said:


> I've been using one of these on a galaxy S4 for just under a week now.
> I've tried both the Micro USB input and the 3.5mm Input jack.
> I am getting all sorts of clicks, pops, buzzing, and other noise that is
> ruining my listening environment.
> ...


 
  
 From reading the latest reviews/comments, I am on the verge of returning my E18, unopened!!  The reason they are unopened, because the phones I was going to use them with, AKG K550, the seller don't have in stock, and my car was stolen last Friday, with my ONLY two sets of phones in the car. So, I am headphone-less, with a brand new E18, and getting shaky reviews. I dunno!!


----------



## shaolin95

solrighal said:


> After all the headphones I've bought I'm only keeping two pairs - V-Moda M -100 & Sennheiser HD650. The V-Moda's wouldn't suit your musical tastes I'm afraid as they're more of a "fun" sound. The HD650's on the other hand are superb and ideal for your preferred genres. Although they're a 300 Ohm design my E18 has no trouble driving them on low gain. Can they get better with better amplification? You bet! The E18 does a grand job though.


 
 For what is worth, I use the M-100 for classical and Piano concertos and like them very much. Nothing that a bit of EQ cant fix if the headphone is high quality! 

 As for the interference noises...I never had it with the E18 but I did have it before with the E6 and the E11 though.


----------



## Solrighal

shaolin95 said:


> For what is worth, I use the M-100 for classical and Piano concertos and like them very much. Nothing that a bit of EQ cant fix if the headphone is high quality!
> 
> 
> As for the interference noises...I never had it with the E18 but I did have it before with the E6 and the E11 though.




I take the point and I also will use the M's for lighter music from time to time. EQ can work wonders if used correctly but even so it can't put "space" into the sound. Only open headphones do that trick.

Edit - I've had interference & cut-out increasingly lately. I'm inclined to think it's a problem with the OTG USB cable as it's very exposed when carried in the pocket. Anyway, I cured it. I bought a Sansa Clip+.


----------



## shaolin95

solrighal said:


> I take the point and I also will use the M's for lighter music from time to time. EQ can work wonders if used correctly but even so it can't put "space" into the sound. Only open headphones do that trick.


 
 Oh yeah, no way around the limitation of closed headphones in that regards compared to open ones.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> I take the point and I also will use the M's for lighter music from time to time. EQ can work wonders if used correctly but even so it can't put "space" into the sound. Only open headphones do that trick.
> 
> Edit - I've had interference & cut-out increasingly lately. I'm inclined to think it's a problem with the OTG USB cable as it's very exposed when carried in the pocket. Anyway, I cured it. I bought a Sansa Clip+.


 
 So that means, you have no more problems with your E18?


----------



## Solrighal

It means I gave up carrying a brick around in my pocket and decided 90% of the sound I get at home is good enough.

Sorry, I should clarify that. The Sansa Clip+ does not sound as good as the E18, buts it's a lot closer to it than the E18 is to my O2.


----------



## StanD

I find that if I don't stack/sandwhich my cellphone and E18, I don't get interference. When I commute, I have enough room in my bag that I can get away without stacking/sandwiching.


----------



## kayza

stand said:


> I find that if I don't stack/sandwhich my cellphone and E18, I don't get interference. When I commute, I have enough room in my bag that I can get away without stacking/sandwiching.



Mine is the same way, although I typically have to use an otg adapter and the supplied USB a to micro b cable, as I sometimes still get interference when not stacking but using the tiny 3" mobile micro to micro cables supplied.

Despite being able to find an interference way to use the e18, the fact that it was designed to be a mobile companion to android phones, and then that the interference free setup is no longer mobile just doesn't sit right with me. I'll be selling mine along with some of my other DACs and headphones later today on ebay or the FS forums. If anyone wants to jump ahead, shoot me a pm with offer. It's a rev. B and I am convinced it is not defective as the other interference e18 folks have come out of the cracks in recent posts too. I haven't researched values for any of my gear, so I don't know what to ask for it yet, but it's got less than 50 hours on it. 80% of that time has been plugged in in pc mode on my work lenovo laptop.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> It means I gave up carrying a brick around in my pocket and decided 90% of the sound I get at home is good enough.
> 
> Sorry, I should clarify that. The Sansa Clip+ does not sound as good as the E18, buts it's a lot closer to it than the E18 is to my O2.


 
 Hiya again, newbie, and reading the last couple reports of interference with the E18, and mainly because it is not a worthwhile companion to the  AKG Q701, my better judgment, I am returning the one I got..
 My question is, if you don't mind, what would be a good *portable* headphone amp/dac to get to pair up with my Note 3 and phones like the Q701?


----------



## Solrighal

I can only recommend what I've heard & used. In my opinion there's nothing wrong with the E18. The problem for me lay with the OTG USB method of connection. Without a custom cable build I think the method is inherently flawed, too fragile. 

Also, the Q701's are notoriously difficult to drive, at least so people more knowledgeable than myself have said.

Also, summer's coming but you can keep your big jacket on. You'll need somewhere to hold the brick that is the SGN3+E18.

Personally? I'm happy with the Sansa.


----------



## cehowardNote3

solrighal said:


> I can only recommend what I've heard & used. In my opinion there's nothing wrong with the E18. The problem for me lay with the OTG USB method of connection. Without a custom cable build I think the method is inherently flawed, too fragile.
> 
> Also, the Q701's are notoriously difficult to drive, at least so people more knowledgeable than myself have said.
> 
> ...


 
 As always, really thankful for the feedback.
 The summer will be no problem carrying the brick, even though I am mid 70s, I travel mostly on two wheels. Superfast motorcycle, and almost equally fast bicycle..  I carry a small tankbag on the motorcycle, and a small backpack on the bicycle. Both of these easily will accommodate the brick. No,  I will not dare to listen while I am driving the motorcycle or the bicycle.  that is for when I reach my destination. The bags will be where I carry the brick..
 If I decide to keep the E18, what cable would your recommend?
 Thanks again,


----------



## Solrighal

Do you mean the OTG USB cable? Sonically speaking just use anything. It's a digital cable. Build quality matters though so maybe something from ALO, Forza or Toxic. The trouble is some of them cost more than the E18 and that's crazy.


----------



## saj2001ind

Hey guys my fiio e18 is gonna arrive tomorrow, any suggestion for a high end active noise isolation headphone apart from Bose qc15...how's psb 

Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


----------



## StanD

saj2001ind said:


> Hey guys my fiio e18 is gonna arrive tomorrow, any suggestion for a high end active noise isolation headphone apart from Bose qc15...how's psb
> 
> Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


 
 I have a pair of QC15's and although the active noise cancelation is outstanding, the process detracts from SQ. So if you're using a DAC to get better SQ, I'd recommend looking at a good set of IEMs that have good passive isolation. For that price you can look at IEMs with multiple BAs (Balanced Armatures), hybrids, etc that will produde far better sound. Why use an external DAC/Amp if you are going to lose SQ in the headphones? I use Sony XBA-3's with the supplied silicone+foam tips. They isolate well and the sound is far better than the QC-15s. Sony makes a new line of hybrids, you can probably find all sorts of opinions on Head-Fi. I recently bought a pair of XBA-H1's for my wife who's not an audio nut, I'm working on that. It came to $99.95 at BestBuy, they matched Amazon's price. I am pleasantly surprised at how good they sound, especially at the price. They come with a variety of tips including the silicon+foam types. Sony also makes fancier IEM's for a modest price. You can put in more bucks and go further upscale, but if you aren't will to part with big $$, the XBA-H1's are a steal.


----------



## cehowardNote3

saj2001ind said:


> Hey guys my fiio e18 is gonna arrive tomorrow, any suggestion for a high end active noise isolation headphone apart from Bose qc15...how's psb
> 
> Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


 
 My Fiio E18 arrived about 5 days ago, but I just took it out the box and it charging up right now..
  
 I am newbie too.


----------



## StanD

cehowardnote3 said:


> My Fiio E18 arrived about 5 days ago, but I just took it out the box and it charging up right now..
> 
> I am newbie too.


 
 5 days!? Get out, I could never wait that long, maybe 5 minutes.


----------



## cehowardNote3

stand said:


> 5 days!? Get out, I could never wait that long, maybe 5 minutes.


 
 Well, under my circumstances you would have to have waited too.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I only had two sets of headphones, they are listed in my signature, I just happened to have carried both pair to work with me. On the way back home I stopped at a friend's house, and my van was stolen.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Both pairs gone, and all I had left was the E18..The very next day I reordered the Sony MDR 1RBTMK2, and the Harman Kardon BT.  They both arrived today.. The Sonys came from Hong Kong, and the HK from Calif.  So, today I open the Fiio E18. Still I am a newbie, and don't know Jack.. So, I am going to try to follow you on the setup..


----------



## StanD

cehowardnote3 said:


> Well, under my circumstances you would have to have waited too..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Dang, I'd hunt those perps down and strangle them with a headphone cable. You need an emergency pair of IEMs. Since you like Sony, the XBA-H1's are a steal, they sound very very good for the price.
 Did you ever get a chance to listen to a good pair of open back cans like a Sennheiser HD600?


----------



## saj2001ind

Got my e18 today...worked perfect on galaxy note 3 and galaxy note 10.1 2014 edition and on computer...using Hifiman RE 400 and they are sounding amazing 

For all those hearing any annoying noise it's probably to do with lower version of android ... KitKat has flawless support for usb audio and in general for all plug n play device ....

Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


----------



## cehowardNote3

saj2001ind said:


> Got my e18 today...worked perfect on galaxy note 3 and galaxy note 10.1 2014 edition and on computer...using Hifiman RE 400 and they are sounding amazing
> 
> For all those hearing any annoying noise it's probably to do with lower version of android ... KitKat has flawless support for usb audio and in general for all plug n play device ....
> 
> Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


 
 That is reasurring. i have the Note 3, and I had a 10.1 2014, but that go stolen a week ago..Going to replace it with the tab pro 8.4. It seem matching the headphones to the E18 is desiribale.. The Hifiman RE 400 are open back if I am not mistaken


----------



## StanD

cehowardnote3 said:


> That is reasurring. i have the Note 3, and I had a 10.1 2014, but that go stolen a week ago..Going to replace it with the tab pro 8.4. It seem matching the headphones to the E18 is desiribale.. The Hifiman RE 400 are open back if I am not mistaken


 
 The RE-400's are IEMs not headphones.


----------



## cehowardNote3

stand said:


> The RE-400's are IEMs not headphones.



T
Was thinking HE-400.


----------



## cehowardNote3

cehowardnote3 said:


> My Fiio E18 arrived about 5 days ago, but I just took it out the box and it charging up right now..
> 
> I am newbie too.


 
 Newbie back. I FINALLY hooked the E18 up to my Harman Kardon BTs.. The connection was Note 3-Fiio E18-Harman Kardon BT... Played a FLAC file through PowerAmp off the Note 3.
  
 Result.. That was yesterday, I still have a locked grin from what I was hearing, and the HK BTs are not even the phones I purchased the E18 for..


----------



## Hapster

Oh wow. This is awesome, charges your phone too! They should release an ios version, I know their others work with ios, but let's be honest, this is much better than e07k or e17

Edit: does it work with ios? because as i'm sitting here with my iphone dying, it sounds pretty fantastic.


----------



## Solrighal

Yes it does, with the appropriate connector. See a few posts earlier.


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Oh wow. This is awesome, charges your phone too! They should release an ios version, I know their others work with ios, but let's be honest, this is much better than e07k or e17
> 
> Edit: does it work with ios? because as i'm sitting here with my iphone dying, it sounds pretty fantastic.


 
 Use the Lightning CCK (Camera Connection Kit) Cable with a recent version of IOS and you're good to go. Then you can get Neutron or SmartEQ as a player app because what comes stock sucks. You can also hook up to a USB DAC that draws too much power for your phone by using a powered USB Hub inbetween the CCK cable and DAC,.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> Then you can get Neutron or SmartEQ as a player app because what comes stock sucks.


 
  I use the Denon Club App already, I love it 
  
 Quote:


stand said:


> You can also hook up to a USB DAC that draws too much power for your phone by using a powered USB Hub inbetween the CCK cable and DAC,.


 
  
 I don't think I quite understand what you're trying to say here?


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> I don't think I quite understand what you're trying to say here?


 
 If you hook up a DAC that draws too much power from the iDevice via the CCK cable, the iDevice (iPhone or iPod) or Android device (using an OTG Cable) will pop up a message saying that it will not work, rather than burn out. Unfortunately the Samsung US version of the Galaxy S3 will burn out, I can't say what happens to the international version. So to supply power to the DAC's USB port you will need a powered USB Hub in-between the CCK/OTG cable and the DAC, where the Hub provides the power to the DAC's USB port instead of the iDevice/ANdroid device. Even though your desktop DAC may be powered from the AC Mains, its USB port draws power from the source (iDevice or Android device).


----------



## cehowardNote3

Well, I am a noob big time. The E18, my first amp/dac, and my two headphones in my sig. I hooked the E18 up to the Harman Kardon BTs, and to my untrained, bad hearing ears, it is awesome!!


----------



## saj2001ind

cehowardnote3 said:


> Well, I am a noob big time. The E18, my first amp/dac, and my two headphones in my sig. I hooked the E18 up to the Harman Kardon BTs, and to my untrained, bad hearing ears, it is awesome!!


 
 out of the 2 headphones you have, which one you like the most, sound quality wise


----------



## cehowardNote3

saj2001ind said:


> out of the 2 headphones you have, which one you like the most, sound quality wise


 
 Good question, I gave my opinion on those two in this thread a lot..
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/710413/high-end-bluetooth-headphones/15
  
 Short answer, the Sony MDR 1RBTMK2 is in a different class than the Harman Kardon BTs. The Sony outclasses the HK in every area. However, the Sony cost 3 times as much as the HK BT.
  
 The cost must be taken into account when comparing these.
  
 Sony MDR 1RBTMK2 =$335 including shipping
 Harman Kardon BT=$97 including shipping (refurbished, IMO, new like condition)
  
 Lastly, the E18 really made the HK BT raise its level. Haven't connected the  E18 to the Sony MK2 yet.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> If you hook up a DAC that draws too much power from the iDevice via the CCK cable, the iDevice (iPhone or iPod) or Android device (using an OTG Cable) will pop up a message saying that it will not work, rather than burn out. Unfortunately the Samsung US version of the Galaxy S3 will burn out, I can't say what happens to the international version. So to supply power to the DAC's USB port you will need a powered USB Hub in-between the CCK/OTG cable and the DAC, where the Hub provides the power to the DAC's USB port instead of the iDevice/ANdroid device. Even though your desktop DAC may be powered from the AC Mains, its USB port draws power from the source (iDevice or Android device).


 

 Okay, so I do have the fiio E07k and what you're saying is, unlike the E07k, there's no way to turn off "recharge via usb". Because I know what happens when it attempts to charge and you hook it to an iphone. So I need a "powered USB hub" to charge it AND use it like a dac/amp?
  
 So If I use this it won't be simply Iphone -> cck -> usb male to micro usb -> Fiio Unit
  
 It'll be Phone -> CCK -> usb male to usb male  -> USB hub -> usb male to whatever the E18 is -> Fiio E18? Because that sounds extremely...not portable.
  
 If you own it, could you post a picture of the whole thing being used connected to an iOS/Android Device?


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Okay, so I do have the fiio E07k and what you're saying is, unlike the E07k, there's no way to turn off "recharge via usb". Because I know what happens when it attempts to charge and you hook it to an iphone. So I need a "powered USB hub" to charge it AND use it like a dac/amp?
> 
> So If I use this it won't be simply Iphone -> cck -> usb male to micro usb -> Fiio Unit
> 
> ...


 
 You seem to have the basic hookup understood, A male to male type A USB cable is hard to find and can be dangerous to use if you connect it to two different laptops and or desktops. The input to the hub usually comes with a cable that is mini-USB at the hub and full sized male type A that connects to the OTG or CCK cable. For portable I use a FiiO E18 that does not need a powered Hub as it doesn't draw power from the CCK or OTG connected source.
 iPod Touch -> Lightning CCK -> Male type A USB to Micro USB -> E18
 Android -> OTG Cable -> Male type A USB to Micro USB -> E18
 I only need the Hub for connecting to my Bifrost Uber USB DAC, which is definitely not portable so the Hub is not an issue. There's too much stuff and wires tucked away around that to make an intelligible picture.
 That iPod Touch 5G is an excellent DAP when teamed up with the right apps. Until the right apps turned up I wouldn't even try because the stock player is nothing to get excited about.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> iPod Touch -> Lightning CCK -> Male type A USB to Micro USB -> E18
> 
> I only need the Hub for connecting to my Bifrost Uber USB DAC, which is definitely not portable so the Hub is not an issue. There's too much stuff and wires tucked away around that to make an intelligible picture.
> That iPod Touch 5G is an excellent DAP when teamed up with the right apps. Until the right apps turned up I wouldn't even try because the stock player is nothing to get excited about.


 
  
 Alright, thanks, the hub was confusing me. So did you manage to find a one-piece Type A to Micro usb? or at the very least a small cable? I couldn't find anything on eBay.
  
 I actually was planning on using this is an ipod 5G, I use the Denon App for music playing honestly, I don't think an App can make anything more hifi, so it's good enough for me. It allows queing of music, a graphic Eq ($1.99), search lyrics for songs, bios of Artists, check order of shuffled songs, built-in radio app. Very useful all-around.


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Alright, thanks, the hub was confusing me. So did you manage to find a one-piece Type A to Micro usb? or at the very least a small cable? I couldn't find anything on eBay.
> 
> I actually was planning on using this is an ipod 5G, I use the Denon App for music playing honestly, I don't think an App can make anything more hifi, so it's good enough for me. It allows queing of music, a graphic Eq ($1.99), search lyrics for songs, bios of Artists, check order of shuffled songs, built-in radio app. Very useful all-around.


 
 Hubs tend to use either a Male Type A (to Device) and either a Mini or Micro USB Male to the Hub. These are standard and plentiful and usually supplied with the hub. Below is the Mini. The micro USB type is the same as usually supplied with a typical Android phone.
  
http://smile.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-A-Male-Mini-B-Cable-Meters/dp/B001TH7GUK select 3 feet - If you search further you can probably find a shorter one. I have a short one but don't know where i got it, it's been a while.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> Hubs tend to use either a Male Type A (to Device) and either a Mini or Micro USB Male to the Hub. These are standard and plentiful and usually supplied with the hub. Below is the Mini. The micro USB type is the same as usually supplied with a typical Android phone.
> 
> http://smile.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-A-Male-Mini-B-Cable-Meters/dp/B001TH7GUK select 3 feet - If you search further you can probably find a shorter one. I have a short one but don't know where i got it, it's been a while.


 
 Well, from your description I won't need to get a hub it looks like.
  
 But this is what I bought for 99 cents, hopefully this is the right type.
  
 http://www.miniinthebox.com/usb-am-mirom-adapter_p598880.html?currency=USD&litb_from=paid_adwords_shopping&gclid=CJSP08_6ob4CFeZaMgodkEoAIA


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Well, from your description I won't need to get a hub it looks like.
> 
> But this is what I bought for 99 cents, hopefully this is the right type.
> 
> http://www.miniinthebox.com/usb-am-mirom-adapter_p598880.html?currency=USD&litb_from=paid_adwords_shopping&gclid=CJSP08_6ob4CFeZaMgodkEoAIA


 
 How do you expect to place this in the chain? If you plan to plug that directly into an Android phone, it will not work as it is not an OTG connector. OTG is wired differently than a standard connection.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> How do you expect to place this in the chain? If you plan to plug that directly into an Android phone, it will not work as it is not an OTG connector. OTG is wired differently than a standard connection.




I'm using an ipod 5, not android, and I'd be doing e18 -> the converter up there -> cck -> ipod.

Shouldn't that work for both power &
Dac capabilities?


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> I'm using an ipod 5, not android, and I'd be doing e18 -> the converter up there -> cck -> ipod.
> 
> Shouldn't that work for both power &
> Dac capabilities?


 
 What do you mean by, "the converter up there?"
 Is that an iPod Classic or iPod Touch 5G? If it;s a Class, make sure that it does USB Audio, the Touch 5G definitely does as I use one.
 Don't know what you mean by "power."
 The E18 DAC does not draw power from the USB source and I find that it does not need a powered USB HUB,
 My desktop DAC does draw significant power and requires a powered USB Hub.
 Without a powered USB Hub:

My Verizon Samsung Galaxy S3 burns out as in self destructs and requires replacement.
My iPod Touch 5G pops up a message about power requirements and refuses to operate unless a powered USB Hub is introduced in the connection.
 I have also used by GS3 with a split OTG cable powered by a USB wall wart. If one uses a Hub that will pass through power from the phone if the Hub's power source is disconnected the phone will fry. Other phones do not seem to have this problem, Caveat Emptor.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> What do you mean by, "the converter up there?"
> Is that an iPod Classic or iPod Touch 5G? If it;s a Class, make sure that it does USB Audio, the Touch 5G definitely does as I use one.
> Don't know what you mean by "power."
> The E18 DAC does not draw power from the USB source and I find that it does not need a powered USB HUB,
> ...




I'm using the e18 as a dac, and amp, and a power supply for my ipod touch 5g. The converter I was referring to was the one I posted about earlier (usb male to micro usb).

The fiio e18 has 2 micro usb ports, one for power, one for dac/amp capabilities. Plugging ipod -> cck -> usb to micro -> into dac/amp port shouldn't draw any power from an idevice. To charge the idevice from e18, all I do is flip the switch to charge.

Is any part of this incorrect?


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> I'm using the e18 as a dac, and amp, and a power supply for my ipod touch 5g. The converter I was referring to was the one I posted about earlier (usb male to micro usb).
> 
> The fiio e18 has 2 micro usb ports, one for power, one for dac/amp capabilities. Plugging ipod -> cck -> usb to micro -> into dac/amp port shouldn't draw any power from an idevice. To charge the idevice from e18, all I do is flip the switch to charge.
> 
> Is any part of this incorrect?


 
 Sounds like you're ready to rumble. I believe you are using the converter at the end of the CCK cable to connect to the E18. Good idea.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> Sounds like you're ready to rumble. I believe you are using the converter at the end of the CCK cable to connect to the E18. Good idea.


 

 Alright cool, I had to do some research (aka watching youtube videos) to figure out there were 2 ports. The Usb to micro usb ships in 10-20days LOL. So I'm not in any particular rush to get the e18 anymore. I'll proably order it in a week though.


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Alright cool, I had to do some research (aka watching youtube videos) to figure out there were 2 ports. The Usb to micro usb ships in 10-20days LOL. So I'm not in any particular rush to get the e18 anymore. I'll proably order it in a week though.


 
 While you wait, the Touch 5G should sound plenty good as long as your headphone/IEM's are not power hungry. As I say, the DAC and Amp in the Touch 5G are surprisingly good. I look forward to reading your comparison of the Touch 5G alone vs. with the E18. Remember to carefully match volumes when comparing as the FR of human beings changes with volume.


----------



## Hapster

stand said:


> While you wait, the Touch 5G should sound plenty good as long as your headphone/IEM's are not power hungry. As I say, the DAC and Amp in the Touch 5G are surprisingly good. I look forward to reading your comparison of the Touch 5G alone vs. with the E18. Remember to carefully match volumes when comparing as the FR of human beings changes with volume.


 

 Right, the main reason is for my desktop of course though, because my onboard audio is awful and there's terrible crackling/hissing sounds.


----------



## jdotfite

Nice write up, thanks!


----------



## Hapster

Also, how low is the noise floor? I used the Fiio E07k with my Triple Fi 10s and there was audible hissing, (40db) not so bad in noisy environments, but when it was quiet, it was fairly annoying.
  
 I'm getting T-Peos H-300 here soon, and they're a little less sensitive, so I'm hoping the e18 might even have a lower noise floor on top of that, and it'll be much quieter,


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Also, how low is the noise floor? I used the Fiio E07k with my Triple Fi 10s and there was audible hissing, (40db) not so bad in noisy environments, but when it was quiet, it was fairly annoying.
> 
> I'm getting T-Peos H-300 here soon, and they're a little less sensitive, so I'm hoping the e18 might even have a lower noise floor on top of that, and it'll be much quieter,


 
 Take a look at FiiO's website, the publish SNR specs on their site.


----------



## audioxxx

Also, how low is the noise floor?

In real world usage as a stand alone amp, it's floor noise is very quiet on my iem ue900, and their extremely sensitive. 

 However in use as a DAC and amp an audible noise is there is some sort of tone, the noise doesn't get louder with volume increase, or high gain selected. The tone isn't very bad or noticeable in usage, and you have to concentrate to hear it. 
 But if you switch bass boost on the tone is terrible, which makes bass boost not usable with sensitive iem's. 

 I have been in touch with fiio and they are aware of this problem, and unfortunately this isn't in the specs as it should be. 
 On that note I love this thing and would not return it, with usb audio pro driving this, the baldur mark3 and the ue900 I think I'm in audio heaven.


----------



## Hapster

audioxxx said:


> Also, how low is the noise floor?
> 
> In real world usage as a stand alone amp, it's floor noise is very quiet on my iem ue900, and their extremely sensitive.
> 
> ...




If I want bass, I just use an eq. So that's fine.


----------



## audioxxx

warubozu said:


> If I want bass, I just use an eq. So that's fine.




Problem I have found there is the best sounding player on Android usb audio pro has no eq or any form of bass boost, until that's fixed, the bass switch would have been great.


----------



## Hapster

audioxxx said:


> Problem I have found there is the best sounding player on Android usb audio pro has no eq or any form of bass boost, until then




Well I'm willing to take the e18 off your hands then


----------



## audioxxx

Hapster said:
			
		

> .
> Well I'm willing to take the e18 off your hands then




haha. .. In a way I wanted to send it back, I really wanted to, but then I plugged the gallaxy s4 in and after 5 songs I was excusing this problem and plugged it back in. 

 The e18 had shown me how good audio can sound, and there's no going back, it's micro detail is revealing sounds I haven't heard before in songs I thought I new. 
 You won't regret the purchase.


----------



## Hapster

audioxxx said:


> haha. .. In a way I wanted to send it back, I really wanted to, but then I plugged the gallaxy s4 in and after 5 songs I was excusing this problem and plugged it back in.
> 
> The e18 had shown me how good audio can sound, and there's no going back, it's micro detail is revealing sounds I haven't heard before in songs I thought I new.
> You won't regret the purchase.




Good to hear, just one off ebay for $140.


----------



## audioxxx

hapster said:


> Good to hear, just one off ebay for $140.






 Good price, I can't really say "sorry about your wallet" with a bargain. 
 What you need is some dual lock 3m of ebay and a spare case. The dual lock is needed to get rid of those dreaded bands across the screen. 
 I made some nifty right angle micro usb plugs which made the thing more compact, the ones they supply are ginormous.


----------



## Hapster

Ah yes, but I have an iPod, so I need to use the CCK with a small connector.


----------



## utmelidze

i just became mine and its gorgeous
 E18+E12 sounds just brilliant on Focal Spirit Classic
  
 and it works well with Sony Xperia Z ultra Stock 4.4.2 and Poweramp


----------



## Hapster

My Fiio E18 just arrived today, hope I can get a review out!
  
 Wow, and to think it arrived in just 2 days.


----------



## utmelidze

it was kinda strange in my case
 if somebody orders from germany .....
  
  
 fedex stopped my package because of boarder controlls
 i provided paypal payment 159 USD and a day after they just delivered it to me without any taxes
  
 no idea why...if they stop a package, i think it would be normal to expect they take taxes for 159 usd
  
 but no and that was very very strange for me


----------



## Hapster

Hmm, currently I can't seem to get it to recharge my iPod touch 5g.
  
 I fully charged it, flipped the switch to charge, and plugged in my ipod. Nothing?
  
 Anyone else having this problem?


----------



## utmelidze

Just brilliant
Very good job Fiio
E18 is a fantastic DAC


----------



## Hapster

Honestly, I'm starting to dislike the e18. Although the sound is nice, it's not really an improvement on e07k, maybe barely better? 

I love the volume wheel and functions of the buttons at the bottom. But with the inability to charge my iPod, the humming with bass boost on, and the fact if you bump the micro connector at all, it just disconnects. You hear some fizzes, just brushing on it. Gonna use a 10cm cable and see if that changes my situation. 

It's really close to being a great product...maybe if I had a galaxy s5, (was thinking about getting one) the e18 may be worth it to keep. But I still can't use bass boost, the tone is loud enough to be prevelant on both my headphones and IEMs.

Also, the line-out bypasses the dac and/or amp, is that normal?


----------



## audioxxx

hapster said:


> Honestly, I'm starting to dislike the e18. Although the sound is nice, it's not really an improvement on e07k, maybe barely better?
> 
> Can't really, talk for the e07k, haven't used one.
> There may be a burn in time, use it for a while let all the components settle in.
> ...



 Yes, the amp should be bypassed after the dac, which is the case with the e18, this is correct for an input to a alternative amp. 
 Good luck.


----------



## Hapster

I've just decided to sell it, I'm getting a iDevice specific Dac. Selling it for $145 if anyone's interested (That includes fees & Shipping). Basically brand new.


----------



## utmelidze

I am wondering how so many poeple say things tgey dont have an idea how it functions
Poor producers to be honest....


When you play with 3.5 jack and device is on, it will always reproduce noise
Line out ist bypassing internal amp
And bass bosst ist just a feature which doesnt really matter...you dont buy such dac for bass boost, do you?
E18 is at least one step above E07K and the same could be supposed for E17


E18 sounds brilliant and you should use external amp too
Believe me, line out and e12 adds lot more in sound
When i stick in e18 headphone out and compare it to line out with e12 , there is very solid difference in sound


----------



## Hapster

utmelidze said:


> I am wondering how so many people say things they don't have an idea how it functions
> Poor producers to be honest....
> 
> 
> ...


 

 1) I wasn't referring to the 3.5mm jack, I was referring to the micro usb connector. I couldn't have it in my pocket, backpack, or in any other situation where it could be moved (at all) without the entire thing just cutting out.
  
 2) Correct me if I'm wrong here, Line-out bypasses the amp of the e18, but still uses the dac?
  
 3) If there's a function included on it, yes I intended to use it. It's ridiculous to not be able to because of a clearly audible hum. The eq on these devices is far better than an eq from, say, iTunes or an app on your phone. Less distortion.
  
 4) I personally believe that after $200, give or take, there's literally no improvement in sound quality with dacs & Amps. So any difference at all, (between E07k and E18) is probably minor. I purchased the e18 as a *mobile* amp/dac to use with my iPod touch. Clearly, somewhat my own fault for not realizing it wouldn't charge it (not enough research?) but with a higher noise floor, unusable eq, and a connector that is extremely delicate, I actually preferred my E07k to this.


----------



## utmelidze

1.ok sorry.my mistake.its kinda very hard to carry it in pocket
I dont really consider it as a portable device for running

2. Yes line out bypasses internal amp

3.maybe your device has problems.mine is fine


4. I confirm...above 200 usd when we take dacs there is talking about 1-2% nothing more in.clarity but wider soundstage for example still can be achieved.

I diasagreee if you mean headphones
500 usd headphone is several levels better comparedbto 150 usd one


----------



## Hapster

utmelidze said:


> 1.ok sorry.my mistake.its kinda very hard to carry it in pocket
> I dont really consider it as a portable device for running
> 
> 2. Yes line out bypasses internal amp
> ...



Wasn't even running, it was like walking at a slow pace :/

so if it still uses the dac, is line-out a better option for IEMs? Because of the high sensitivity of them?

Meh, I've read a lot of stuff about it, I just cannot justify paying $700+ for a dac. Maybe if I had stax 009? I've just read too many articles basically comparing fairly expensive DACs to "hifi cables" And yea, a $500 headphone can be miles ahead of $150. I don't know what brought that up, but at around $150 you're still in the mediocre range, with roll offs at like 64hz & 15khz


----------



## RiazKhan

Hi Buddy,
  
 Could you please advice which headphones is the best match with E 18 (i use a galaxy note 3 so a android DAC amp seems better).
  
 Headphone options that i am considering are HD 650/700; HE 400/500; LCD 2.
  
 Please feel free to recommend any other amp dac or headphones.


----------



## audioxxx

riazkhan said:


> Hi Buddy,
> 
> Could you please advice which headphones is the best match with E 18 (i use a galaxy note 3 so a android DAC amp seems better).
> 
> ...


----------



## utmelidze

I use focal spirit classic and they sound superb with e18+e12
Just amazing headphones


----------



## Lorspeaker

YAMAHA MT220.... this can is outstanding...E18 controls it v well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHl22HGW82c


----------



## RiazKhan

Thanks for your input Buddy.


----------



## RiazKhan

Thanks for your input Buddy.


----------



## coolmingli

HI guys, this is my first post here, I recently bought a pair Shure se846 to go with my Xperia Z2, the Z2 has low volume out put, I am thinking of getting an E18 to gain some output, also to try out the Sony's high resolution USB out put feature.
  
 Do you think the E18 has enough power to push the SE846 which is rated at 9ohm.
  
 Any other suggestion for an AMP/DAC to go nicely with the se 846? Let's keep it below $500, I don't want to go too crazy into this.
  
 Thanks


----------



## StanD

coolmingli said:


> HI guys, this is my first post here, I recently bought a pair Shure se846 to go with my Xperia Z2, the Z2 has low volume out put, I am thinking of getting an E18 to gain some output, also to try out the Sony's high resolution USB out put feature.
> 
> Do you think the E18 has enough power to push the SE846 which is rated at 9ohm.
> 
> ...


 
 The SE846 has a 114dB SPL per mW rating and and the E18 has an output impedance of less than 0.3 Ohms. I suspect that you can probably set our ears on fire with the E18. One of the problems with a BA with multiple armatures is the low impedance and getting a good damping ratio. The SE846 shoud need an amp that is 1.125 Ohms, so you should be good to go. Many/most smartphones do not have a low enough output impedance for these IEMs.


----------



## coolmingli

Thanks for the reply, I don't know any of these technical terms, I am looking forward to set my ears on fire, thanks again.


----------



## Hapster

I don't know if I'm allowed to say anything but I am selling a fiio e18 if anyone wants one. Like-new


----------



## Ninjiaw

does the e18 work with ipods?


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> does the e18 work with ipods?


 
 Works with my Touch 5G


----------



## Ninjiaw

ok thank you. i was just wondering because i need a dac/amp for my headphones and dident want to spend extra and not be able to use the dac functionality.


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> ok thank you. i was just wondering because i need a dac/amp for my headphones and dident want to spend extra and not be able to use the dac functionality.


 
 It works with a Lightning CCK cable and then a USB to micro USB cable to attach to the E18, no powered USB Hub or any Hub is necessary with the E18. I believe my E18 came with a USB to micro cable, the same one used to attach to a PC or laptop.
 OK, just for yucks, I plugged it in and I'm listening right now to streaming from my Google All Access. Yes that works on iOS, there's a couple of apps for that of which Google supplies one for free.


----------



## Ninjiaw

so all you need is a female to female usb adapter then?


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> so all you need is a female to female usb adapter then?


 
 I believe you need the the USB cable that is typically supplied by most Android phones. This cable connects the Apple CCK cable to the E18. Picture below. If you look hard you can find a short one.


----------



## Ninjiaw

ok! but if i may ask what is a cck cable?


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> ok! but if i may ask what is a cck cable?


 
 Camera Connection Kit (CCK), it is typically used to connect a camera to an iDevice. It is similar to an OTG cable used on an Android device.


----------



## Ninjiaw

ok thanks sory im new hear.


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> ok thanks sory im new hear.


 
 Nothing to be sorry about, you asked for help.


----------



## Ninjiaw

what about the old 30pin conecter?


----------



## StanD

ninjiaw said:


> what about the old 30pin conecter?


 
 There's a CCK for that as well, check Apple's website.


----------



## Ninjiaw

ok i will thanks


----------



## StanD

Here's a link to an interesting article on connecting Android and iDevices to DACs.
http://blog.jdslabs.com/?p=838


----------



## Ninjiaw

thenks for that it is a good read


----------



## Whaleshark12

Hey guys,I need someone to help me clarify.. In their website, its stated E18 support 96k/24bit. While the E17 is 128k/24bit, does't it means that the E17 can support higher audio output? (Means higher spec,maybe?) Sorry I'm just kinda new to this thing so ya.. Thanks in advance =D


----------



## Lorspeaker

USB Sample Rate Support 32/44.1/48/96KHz @ 16/24BitSPDIF Sample Rate Support 32/44.1/48/96/192KHz @ 16/24Bit
  
 ( copied from one of the Fiio specs page.. )
  
  
 E17 has spdif input option , in addition to the normal usb input...
 usb tops at 96khz for both.


----------



## Lorspeaker

my Pandora Hope 6 sounds incredible on the E18 in highgain, off a McAir...
 the soundstage just took on a deep big spacious energetic feel, the synergy is fantastic !!
  
 This could be a simple portable endgame for some.


----------



## Whaleshark12

Does this work with nexus 7 2013?? Stock rom 4.4.2 thought.


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Does this work with nexus 7 2013?? Stock rom 4.4.2 thought.


 
 I have the same tablet, it doesn't support native USB Audio, so you'd have to use USBAPP within its limitations or something like that.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> I have the same tablet, it doesn't support native USB Audio, so you'd have to use USBAPP within its limitations or something like that.


 
 So it does work perfectly after using the USB App?


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> So it does work perfectly after using the USB App?


 
 I tried the demo trial version and it worked with my E18 as well as my Bifrost Uber USB. I prefer using something compatible with the USB Audio spec so that I can play music from any app like Neutron MP or streaming apps like Spotify or my Google All Access subscription. USBAPP cannot do that. So I use either my laptop, GS3 phone or iPod Touch 5G to drive my DACs.


----------



## Solrighal

I hate Google!


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> I tried the demo trial version and it worked with my E18 as well as my Bifrost Uber USB. I prefer using something compatible with the USB Audio spec so that I can play music from any app like Neutron MP or streaming apps like Spotify or my Google All Access subscription. USBAPP cannot do that. So I use either my laptop, GS3 phone or iPod Touch 5G to drive my DACs.


 
 So, Galaxy S3 might be able to run it,which model you having? Btw,using the E18 as DAC. Does it use the e18 as an amp and DAC at the same time?


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> I tried the demo trial version and it worked with my E18 as well as my Bifrost Uber USB. I prefer using something compatible with the USB Audio spec so that I can play music from any app like Neutron MP or streaming apps like Spotify or my Google All Access subscription. USBAPP cannot do that. So I use either my laptop, GS3 phone or iPod Touch 5G to drive my DACs.


 
  
  


whaleshark12 said:


> So, Galaxy S3 might be able to run it,which model you having? Btw,using the E18 as DAC. Does it use the e18 as an amp and DAC at the same time?


 
 I have a USA Verizon Samsung Galaxy S3. I can use the E18 as a DAC/Amp or USB to coax SPDIF for the GS3 phone. I can also connect my iPod Touch 5G with a Lightning CCK cable to the E18. The E18 draws no power so a powered USB Hub is not required for either. My Bifrost Uber USB DAC draws too much power so a powered USB Hub or Y cable with battery (Juice Pack) is required when using either the GS3 or Touch.


----------



## DanBa

The FiiO E18 is reportedly compatible with the native USB audio of Android L (Developer Preview) running on Google Nexus 5.
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs/5010#post_10669282
  
 It should also work with an Android L-powered Google Nexus 7 2013.
  
 How to install Android L:
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs/5040#post_10683033


----------



## StanD

danba said:


> The FiiO E18 is reportedly compatible with the native USB audio of Android L (Developer Preview) running on Google Nexus 5.
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs/5010#post_10669282
> 
> It should also work with an Android L-powered Google Nexus 7 2013.
> ...


 
 I wouldn't use a Beta version of an OS on my daily driver.


----------



## Jazic

This has probably been asked but I'm on mobile and not able to search atm but does this have enough juice to power the hd800? I know there are better option but was wondering.


----------



## StanD

jazic said:


> This has probably been asked but I'm on mobile and not able to search atm but does this have enough juice to power the hd800? I know there are better option but was wondering.


 
 It has enough juice to fire up the HD600's, 112 dB (at 1 kHz, 1 Vrms). The HD800's are less efficient, 102 dB SPL (1kHz, 1 Vrms ). 
 When measuring by Voltage, 6 dB means double. So at 108 dB the HD800 requires 2V RMS. The E18 can deliver 8Vp-p which is about 2.8 V RMS. That might not be enough headroom to prevent distortion on peaks for the HD800, unless you listen at softer volume levels.


----------



## Jazic

stand said:


> It has enough juice to fire up the HD600's, 112 dB (at 1 kHz, 1 Vrms). The HD800's are less efficient, 102 dB SPL (1kHz, 1 Vrms ).
> When measuring by Voltage, 6 dB means double. So at 108 dB the HD800 requires 2V RMS. The E18 can deliver 8Vp-p which is about 2.8 V RMS. That might not be enough headroom to prevent distortion on peaks for the HD800, unless you listen at softer volume levels.




And here I was expecting a simple yes or no answer. Thanks!


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> It has enough juice to fire up the HD600's, 112 dB (at 1 kHz, 1 Vrms). The HD800's are less efficient, 102 dB SPL (1kHz, 1 Vrms ).
> When measuring by Voltage, 6 dB means double. So at 108 dB the HD800 requires 2V RMS. The E18 can deliver 8Vp-p which is about 2.8 V RMS. That might not be enough headroom to prevent distortion on peaks for the HD800, unless you listen at softer volume levels.


 
  
  


jazic said:


> And here I was expecting a simple yes or no answer. Thanks!


 
 As simple as 0311 training at Camp Geiger/Lejune.


----------



## Lorspeaker

stand said:


> It has enough juice to fire up the HD600's, 112 dB (at 1 kHz, 1 Vrms). The HD800's are less efficient, 102 dB SPL (1kHz, 1 Vrms ).
> When measuring by Voltage, 6 dB means double. So at 108 dB the HD800 requires 2V RMS. The E18 can deliver 8Vp-p which is about 2.8 V RMS. That might not be enough headroom to prevent distortion on peaks for the HD800, unless you listen at softer volume levels.


 
  
 actually the same answer is somewhere in my head.... but not in the same alphabetical order. 






​


----------



## StanD

lorspeaker said:


> actually the same answer is somewhere in my head.... but not in the same alphabetical order.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I hear voices in my head, urging me to get another set of headphones or IEMs.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I must resist I must resist I must resist I can't resist.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> I hear voices in my head, urging me to get another set of headphones or IEMs.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Same thing happens to me too,Just bought my Yamaha EPH 100 and now wanted to try out Fostex TE-05 :/


stand said:


> I have a USA Verizon Samsung Galaxy S3. I can use the E18 as a DAC/Amp or USB to coax SPDIF for the GS3 phone. I can also connect my iPod Touch 5G with a Lightning CCK cable to the E18. The E18 draws no power so a powered USB Hub is not required for either. My Bifrost Uber USB DAC draws too much power so a powered USB Hub or Y cable with battery (Juice Pack) is required when using either the GS3 or Touch.


 
 Oh i see thanks for the input =D


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Same thing happens to me too,Just bought my Yamaha EPH 100 and now wanted to try out Fostex TE-05 :/
> Oh i see thanks for the input =D



Now that you've been enabled, you may resume abusing your wallet.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> Now that you've been enabled, you may resume abusing your wallet.


 
 IKR.. =/ i'm currently only hesitating which one to buy first,the e18 or te 05. Lol


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> Now that you've been enabled, you may resume abusing your wallet.


 
  
  


whaleshark12 said:


> IKR.. =/ i'm currently only hesitating which one to buy first,the e18 or te 05. Lol


 
 It's people like you that cause the global economy to stall. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Aren't you getting anxious for a new toy? A sure sign of AAS (Audio Acquisition Syndrome).


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> It's people like you that cause the global economy to stall.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 What have I done?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Of course every man loves getting new toys!


----------



## CannonCollector

Another great product from Fiio although I'm still deciding if I should get this or the E17 considering the money diffrence between the two


----------



## StanD

cannoncollector said:


> Another great product from Fiio although I'm still deciding if I should get this or the E17 considering the money diffrence between the two


 
 In the world of audio the price difference is small. I would go for the E18 and call it a day.


----------



## Hapster

Except the E18 quality is awful. Nasty humming and really loud noise floor. E17 is much quieter and gives a better EQ.


----------



## StanD

hapster said:


> Except the E18 quality is awful. Nasty humming and really loud noise floor. E17 is much quieter and gives a better EQ.


 
 Mine is built well, has no hum, nor is it noisy. The tone controls of the E17 are hardly what I call EQ. THe 10 band EQ on PowerAmp or Parametric EQ on Neutron MP are more like what I'd call EQ worthy of the title.


----------



## Solrighal

My E18 works perfectly too.


----------



## CannonCollector

stand said:


> In the world of audio the price difference is small. I would go for the E18 and call it a day.


 
 Hm indeed.. what about the E12? I know E12 is just an amp while this is an AMP and DAC but does the fact that the E12 is not DAC change much? I'm still trying to understand what the advantages are of having an DAC and AMP (Sorry I'm a total nuthead in this section)


----------



## headdict

cannoncollector said:


> Hm indeed.. what about the E12? I know E12 is just an amp while this is an AMP and DAC but does the fact that the E12 is not an amp change much? I'm still trying to understand what the advantages are of having an DAC and AMP (Sorry I'm a total nuthead in this section)


 
 Just connecting an external amp may simplify your setup. (If you really need one, that is.) It depends of course on the quality of the DAC that is built in your Android device. I personally would not bother with USB Audio at the moment. I have a Note II and use it with various amps, mostly desktop amps to power my beyer T1. My E12 has not gotten much use lately. On the go I just use my X3 with portable phones. I like Android's network streaming capabilities and with a portable music server the Note II and E12 might be a good combo. But, frankly, the E12 would not be so much needed to power my portable phones than to comfortably control the volume.


----------



## Lorspeaker

I chanced to audition Both e17 n 18 side by side with kef m200,
Better bass layering I heard on e18..n I bot it.


----------



## StanD

cannoncollector said:


> Hm indeed.. what about the E12? I know E12 is just an amp while this is an AMP and DAC but does the fact that the E12 is not DAC change much? I'm still trying to understand what the advantages are of having an DAC and AMP (Sorry I'm a total nuthead in this section)


 
 I also have an E12, the thing is amazing, plenty juice for a portable amp. It has more power than an E18, enough to get away with powering an HE-500. It also works well with an HD600. In most cases the E18 has enough to power most headphoneson its own. One has to do their legwork and look up specs to make sure. My Verizon Galaxy S3 really benefits from the E18. If I take E18 line out into the E12 I can enjoy my HE-500's when not in range of my desktop DAC and Amp.


----------



## CannonCollector

stand said:


> I also have an E12, the thing is amazing, plenty juice for a portable amp. *It has more power than an E18*, enough to get away with powering an HE-500. It also works well with an HD600. In most cases the E18 has enough to power most headphoneson its own. One has to do their legwork and look up specs to make sure. My Verizon Galaxy S3 really benefits from the E18. If I take E18 line out into the E12 I can enjoy my HE-500's when not in range of my desktop DAC and Amp.


 
 Does that mean it will give better sound/more bass than the E18 or with more power do you mean it can power higher power requiring headphones?


----------



## dharan

It's kind of scary how good my HE-400's sound with the E12. I mean it's not up there with my desktop setup, but I feel like it gets 85% of the way there. Just great for sitting out on the front porch with some big ass cans on your head.


----------



## Stereolab42

I just ordered an E18 to pair with my Note 3. Apparently the E18 comes with a short USB micro-to-micro cable. I looked around to see if such a cable was sold anywhere else, because I always like to have backups, and it appears to be completely unique. Anyone know of any source for additional cables?


----------



## coolmingli

stereolab42 said:


> I just ordered an E18 to pair with my Note 3. Apparently the E18 comes with a short USB micro-to-micro cable. I looked around to see if such a cable was sold anywhere else, because I always like to have backups, and it appears to be completely unique. Anyone know of any source for additional cables?


 

 It is a special OTG cable, you should get 2 in the box, you can order more from Fiio for free with $5.00 shipping, you can also custom made one with better connectors and higher quality cable.


----------



## Whaleshark12

deleted


----------



## Whaleshark12

Finally pull the trigger and bought it, it will arrive tomorrow. Hope it won't disappoint me *Gulp* .


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> I also have an E12, the thing is amazing, plenty juice for a portable amp. It has more power than an E18, enough to get away with powering an HE-500. It also works well with an HD600. In most cases the E18 has enough to power most headphoneson its own. One has to do their legwork and look up specs to make sure. My Verizon Galaxy S3 really benefits from the E18. If I take E18 line out into the E12 I can enjoy my HE-500's when not in range of my desktop DAC and Amp.


 
  
  


cannoncollector said:


> Does that mean it will give better sound/more bass than the E18 or with more power do you mean it can power higher power requiring headphones?


 
 The E12 power is useful, only for power hungry cans. The E12 is useful when using the HE-500's with an E18. Other more sensitive cans work fine with just the E18.


----------



## CannonCollector

So cans like the SZ1000/2000 are good with the E17/18? I don't know If I should go with the E17/18 or with the E12 because I'm afraid E12 gives a better bass boost while the 18 is a DAC & amp. Of course I might be wrong


----------



## Whaleshark12

Just received my E18, btw guys. Where do you get the micro usb male to male usb? Have tried finding a longer one on ebay but no luck. Since my phone port is on the top left corner and fiio is bottom, which is too short. Since this was my very first amp/dac gear i'm not quite sure where to connect. By connecting to laptop, is it using the usb to micro usb cable to connect to fiio but put it to computer DAC mode?


----------



## coolmingli

whaleshark12 said:


> Just received my E18, btw guys. Where do you get the micro usb male to male usb? Have tried finding a longer one on ebay but no luck. Since my phone port is on the top left corner and fiio is bottom, which is too short. Since this was my very first amp/dac gear i'm not quite sure where to connect. By connecting to laptop, is it using the usb to micro usb cable to connect to fiio but put it to computer DAC mode


 
 Is your phone Sony?


----------



## Whaleshark12

coolmingli said:


> Is your phone Sony?


 
 Dam right...lol is sony xperia v actually.


----------



## coolmingli

whaleshark12 said:


> Dam right...lol is sony xperia v actually.


 
 I was using Xperia Z2, and I had problems with cable reaching the E18 port, I am not at home now, I will show you later how I got to solve this problem, the Fiio cable is a special OTG cable,  you can also custom made one, but it will cost you around $20 to $30.


----------



## Whaleshark12

coolmingli said:


> I was using Xperia Z2, and I had problems with cable reaching the E18 port, I am not at home now, I will show you later how I got to solve this problem, the Fiio cable is a special OTG cable,  you can also custom made one, but it will cost you around $20 to $30.


 
 Wow,the pricing would kill me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Btw, when you said fiio cable is special cable. That would means that if i found that kind of cable in my local store, it would't function as well?


----------



## Solrighal

whaleshark12 said:


> Wow,the pricing would kill me :basshead:  Btw, when you said fiio cable is special cable. That would means that if i found that kind of cable in my local store, it would't function as well?




Chances are you won't find that cable, in any store. There are various companies who will custom-build one for you. It won't necessarily be expensive either, unless you want it to be.


----------



## Whaleshark12

solrighal said:


> Chances are you won't find that cable, in any store. There are various companies who will custom-build one for you. It won't necessarily be expensive either, unless you want it to be.


 
 Well my local seller told me that i can get that male to male any electronic store..which i feel kind of weird as i tried to find it in my local forum site which only sell otg cable. Btw,heres my setup since the cable is too short. I use my extra otg cable and bluetooth charging cable to put into service. 
 Which i think it looks super weird..


----------



## Solrighal

Sony have a lot to answer for.


----------



## coolmingli

whaleshark12 said:


> Wow,the pricing would kill me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 The cable is not only the OTG cable, it has all 5 pins connected, which means it can also charge your phone from the E18 side. I went with the cheap way, I bought a OTG connector for $1, and a short USB cable. I double side tape the E18 on my phone case, this was if I don't need it, I can simple slide off the case.


----------



## Whaleshark12

coolmingli said:


> The cable is not only the OTG cable, it has all 5 pins connected, which means it can also charge your phone from the E18 side. I went with the cheap way, I bought a OTG connector for $1, and a short USB cable. I double side tape the E18 on my phone case, this was if I don't need it, I can simple slide off the case.


 
  


coolmingli said:


> The cable is not only the OTG cable, it has all 5 pins connected, which means it can also charge your phone from the E18 side. I went with the cheap way, I bought a OTG connector for $1, and a short USB cable. I double side tape the E18 on my phone case, this was if I don't need it, I can simple slide off the case.


 
 Could you snap a pic of the otg connector? Just the otg thingy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Btw, do you guys use equal when using this e18?


----------



## coolmingli

whaleshark12 said:


> Could you snap a pic of the otg connector? Just the otg thingy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Get the right angle if you want the cable go downward, get the left angle if you want the cable to go upward, ebay has it, search for USB OTG adapters.


----------



## Whaleshark12

coolmingli said:


> Get the right angle if you want the cable go downward, get the left angle if you want the cable to go upward, ebay has it, search for USB OTG adapters.


 
 Oh,btw i dont think it fits old sony phone with flaps. Z2 have the flap longer than 1cm i think. While in the v is super short like .4-.6cm and i cant rotate it like you do. =/ Btw, how do you put those in your pocket when you are outdoor?


----------



## coolmingli

whaleshark12 said:


> Oh,btw i dont think it fits old sony phone with flaps. Z2 have the flap longer than 1cm i think. While in the v is super short like .4-.6cm and i cant rotate it like you do. =/ Btw, how do you put those in your pocket when you are outdoor?


 

 The combo don't fit into my pants, I have to hand hold it, that is why I got the X5 and Dx90. I only use the E18 at home when I listen to Sky, Pandora..


----------



## Whaleshark12

coolmingli said:


> The combo don't fit into my pants, I have to hand hold it, that is why I got the X5 and Dx90. I only use the E18 at home when I listen to Sky, Pandora..


 
 Ahh...crap..i always use it when commuting D= dang,need to come up with a backup plan. My nexus 7 2013 doest support it even i installed the usb audio player it still play though speaker =/ weird..
 If i connect this way,wat am i using the e18 as? Amp?


----------



## Lorspeaker

Does the E18 charges itself when u are playing it off usb on a laptop? 
 or must i plug in the powercord to keep it going?


----------



## Whaleshark12

lorspeaker said:


> Does the E18 charges itself when u are playing it off usb on a laptop?
> or must i plug in the powercord to keep it going?


 
 Which batch you having? If you have the newer batch which is red black coloured packaging, it would charge itself when using as a usb dac.


----------



## Lorspeaker

whaleshark12 said:


> Which batch you having? If you have the newer batch which is red black coloured packaging, it would charge itself when using as a usb dac.


 

  
 this is what i have   thanks for the info !


----------



## Whaleshark12

i Have bought these http://www.ebay.com/itm/111374280864?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT and these http://www.ebay.com/itm/221435409781?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT .. Hope they work well with my xperia


----------



## CannonCollector

whaleshark12 said:


> i Have bought these http://www.ebay.com/itm/111374280864?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT and these http://www.ebay.com/itm/221435409781?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT .. Hope they work well with my xperia


 
 are these the cables neede to use the amp on an android device?


----------



## Whaleshark12

cannoncollector said:


> are these the cables neede to use the amp on an android device?


 
 Well, what android device are you using? I bought these because sony's xperia line have flap that protect them underwater and their charging port position was pretty odd. Left top corner for mine. So the fiio cable could't reach it..so ya..Galaxy s3-s5 or note 2 or 3 should be ok.


----------



## CannonCollector

whaleshark12 said:


> Well, what android device are you using? I bought these because sony's xperia line have flap that protect them underwater and their charging port position was pretty odd. Left top corner for mine. So the fiio cable could't reach it..so ya..Galaxy s3-s5 or note 2 or 3 should be ok.


 
 Yeah using a Galaxy S2 and a Tab Pro 10.1.. both have the same micro usb input and I think the S3+ have it too... gonna have to find the OTG adapter somewhere to buy as it seems


----------



## Whaleshark12

cannoncollector said:


> Yeah using a Galaxy S2 and a Tab Pro 10.1.. both have the same micro usb input and I think the S3+ have it too... gonna have to find the OTG adapter somewhere to buy as it seems


 
 Errmm, i don't think you need to buy man. S2 (not sure does it work with e18 or not) and S3 is just right, you could just use fiio provided cable to use it. For people that buy otg cable is either they need it longer or just the port isn't at the right place.


----------



## CannonCollector

whaleshark12 said:


> Errmm, i don't think you need to buy man. S2 (not sure does it work with e18 or not) and S3 is just right, you could just use fiio provided cable to use it. For people that buy otg cable is either they need it longer or just the port isn't at the right place.


 
 Oh good to know have to try it when it arrives, thanks


----------



## Whaleshark12

Gosh, never thought i would be so paranoid about sound quality from this E18. I carry it everywhere i go, even commuting. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can't part me from my phone and E18~ Never!


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Gosh, never thought i would be so paranoid about sound quality from this E18. I carry it everywhere i go, even commuting.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 One day the battery will die.......and there will be something newer to lust for.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> One day the battery will die.......and there will be something newer to lust for.


 
 Haha,true. Well the battery is pretty lasting IMO.


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> One day the battery will die.......and there will be something newer to lust for.


 
  
  


whaleshark12 said:


> Haha,true. Well the battery is pretty lasting IMO.


 
 Then you'll cave in to your impulses first and get a new toy. That's very common around here and good for the global economy.
  
 I didn't mean how long a charge lasts when the battery is new, but as time passes and the battery has seen many recharges, its charge doesn't last long and you'll want to get the battery replaced or get some newer toy.


----------



## Whaleshark12

Not sure am I too paranoid or wat. I even use a screen protector that you stick it on the phone screen and stick on my fiio. Just to prevent it from getting scratch  ..


----------



## Solrighal

Yes, you're paranoid.


----------



## McCol

Bought the Galaxy S5 yesterday and works like a dream with the E18.
One wee question though - I was under the impression that when connected to the phone that only the volume control on the E18 would function. My S5 volume control on music still works, thus giving me 2 ways to increase/lower the volume. Is this normal?


----------



## StanD

mccol said:


> Bought the Galaxy S5 yesterday and works like a dream with the E18.
> One wee question though - I was under the impression that when connected to the phone that only the volume control on the E18 would function. My S5 volume control on music still works, thus giving me 2 ways to increase/lower the volume. Is this normal?


 
 It's normal and depends on the USB implementation of Audio at both ends. When I plug my iPod Touch 5G into my E18, it behaves as your S5. When I plug my Touch into my Bifrost DAC, the volume control on the Touch does nothing and it's at full scale.


----------



## Whaleshark12

On the Xperia v I have issue where I can control both device volume. On the HTC one m8, it's same as Stan D style where volume key have only 1 knob . I still can't figure it out why when my device is connected to Fiio it skip the first track somehow. It happens with all the phone I have tested :/


----------



## Whaleshark12

Just wondering, If i connect my phone to E18. Then i use poweramp as my music player. If i on the equilizer. Does it make Sound from the E18 DAC go waste? As i tried using without E18 on my m8 with equilizer on and With the E18 with the equilizer on. Both sound the same. Just wanna hear some input from you guys. Thanks in advance =)


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Just wondering, If i connect my phone to E18. Then i use poweramp as my music player. If i on the equilizer. Does it make Sound from the E18 DAC go waste? As i tried using without E18 on my m8 with equilizer on and With the E18 with the equilizer on. Both sound the same. Just wanna hear some input from you guys. Thanks in advance =)


 
 Don't know what you mean by "waste."
 I find that any changes that I make to the EQ on either PowerAmp, Neutron or Google Play Music are heard when using an external DAC. So for me the EQ is effective, works good.


----------



## Whaleshark12

What i mean was. Without plugging in my phone to E18 with EQ on. It sounds the same as With E18 and EQ On.


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> What i mean was. Without plugging in my phone to E18 with EQ on. It sounds the same as With E18 and EQ On.


 
 Since the E18 has a better DAC and Amp than most if not all phones, I wouldn't expect it to sound the same with the EQ on or off.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> Since the E18 has a better DAC and Amp than most if not all phones, I wouldn't expect it to sound the same with the EQ on or off.


 
 Ya, i have tried it out extensively found that the vocal tend to be abit more brighter and forward than without the E18. Thanks anyway


----------



## Tennessee

What would give better SQ paired with ATH M50 and Spirit Classic - E18 with Xperia through USB OTG or X5 itself?


----------



## Sound Eq

guys can i ask is the amp section of e18 the same as fiio e12 and which amp section is better and has better bass boost


----------



## audioxxx

I think the x5 will serve you better, it seems to have a more refined edge and cleaner ( with no coupling capacitors) sound in general. Plus it has a very similar output stage to the e18 (amplifier)
 Also as others have said it frees you up from the phone so you don't have any distractions while enjoying your tunes. 
 The x5 is much nicer to pocket than an e18/phone brick.


----------



## Sound Eq

yeah i had the x5 and the lack of hardware bass boost absence is why i sold it, i found the e18 to have a better bass boost than x5
  
 but i wonder how the amp of e18 compares to e12 and different are the sound signatures of both when used as amp


----------



## Tennessee

The output stage was that what I wasn't sure about, but since they have similar power, I will choose the smaller one. Thanks.
 And I don't care about bass, I never wish to enchance it, the normal level is perfectly fine and how it suppose to be.


----------



## audioxxx

I couldn't use the bass boost on the e18 while using the audio through usb port/dac. It's too noisy with this annoying tone going on. Although as an amp through the line in its very clean. 
 The e12 is a power house I think it's good for hard to drive low impedance headphones or low sensitivity, bass boost is tricky I haven't heard many I like.


----------



## boborone

I've read 9of the 18 pages and I'm having trouble with my situation. Deciding whether to get the E17 or E18. I have Sure SE215 that I use for my phone for mobile use and ATH-M50x that I need an amp for laptop use. Since most of my listening is on low ohm IEMs with my N5 and PS Vita that sound good, is it warranted paying the extra 30 bucks to have OTG support on the amp and is the E18 feature wise worth the extra money? 

That and reading the thread, stacking the phone on the DAC and getting interference really defeats the mobile purpose to me. Is that a big problem with the E18? I've seen a lot of posts about it here. 

TIA
Dustin


----------



## imeem

boborone said:


> That and reading the thread, stacking the phone on the DAC and getting interference really defeats the mobile purpose to me. Is that a big problem with the E18? I've seen a lot of posts about it here.
> 
> TIA
> Dustin


 
 my E17 does this too.


----------



## SteveHiFi

boborone said:


> Deciding whether to get the E17 or E18. I have Sure SE215 that I use for my phone for mobile use and ATH-M50x that I need an amp for laptop use. Since most of my listening is on low ohm IEMs with my N5 and PS Vita that sound good, is it warranted paying the extra 30 bucks to have OTG support on the amp and is the E18 feature wise worth the extra money?
> 
> 
> TIA
> Dustin


 
  
 I was impressed with the E18's power but the gain switch is dangerously placed. The E12 has a very much recessed switch which needs a pen or similar to operate it. By contrast the E18 gain is easy to knock accidentally and I would always be paranoid about it!
  
 Of the two get the E17 for peace of mind - I reckon it will power the M50x fine as well as IEMs.


----------



## CCXR594

Hmmm, I'm currently in the market for a new mobile amp/DAC because the aux port on my ipod is fried. I previously had a E07K and liked it very much, but incidentally I liked it too much and kept it permanently plugged unto my laptop for use with my Q701's, and the constant stream of power burnt out the battery and left it unable to hold a charge, as well as breaking the device in general. I do now have a smartphone that I can use for mobile listening, and it can power my SE215-LTD's fine.
      
 I've greatly been considering getting a Modi/Magni stack from Schiit for use at my desk with my headphones, but a mobile amp would be nice.
  
 My question is would I be better off getting a mobile amp/dac that is usually tethered to a laptop, or just totally foregoing the mobile aspect of things and getting on board with the Schiit setup?
 Thanks


----------



## StanD

ccxr594 said:


> Hmmm, I'm currently in the market for a new mobile amp/DAC because the aux port on my ipod is fried. I previously had a E07K and liked it very much, but incidentally I liked it too much and kept it permanently plugged unto my laptop for use with my Q701's, and the constant stream of power burnt out the battery and left it unable to hold a charge, as well as breaking the device in general. I do now have a smartphone that I can use for mobile listening, and it can power my SE215-LTD's fine.
> 
> I've greatly been considering getting a Modi/Magni stack from Schiit for use at my desk with my headphones, but a mobile amp would be nice.
> 
> ...


 
 Get the stack of Schiit for the desktop and an E18 for on the go. Both of these solutions are great for value and performance.


----------



## CCXR594

stand said:


> Get the stack of Schiit for the desktop and an E18 for on the go. Both of these solutions are great for value and performance.


 
  
 Would if I could, but I can't. I don't have enough free cash lying around to do that unfortunately  :/   My main dilemma is whether I'll accidentally destroy the E18 due to continuous charging like I did with the E07K. Does it have an option to turn USB charging off during playback?


----------



## StanD

ccxr594 said:


> Would if I could, but I can't. I don't have enough free cash lying around to do that unfortunately  :/   My main dilemma is whether I'll accidentally destroy the E18 due to continuous charging like I did with the E07K. Does it have an option to turn USB charging off during playback?


 
 email FiiO and ask. There's a good chance they might even reply in this thread. I believe the E18 goes to a trickle charge once it's charge has been topped off.


----------



## Royalh13

After approx 9 months my E18 crapped the bed. I tried charginh my Note 2 with it and the E18 got very hot and went from a full charge to blinking blue light in 30 minutes. 

Now the DAC side no longer works,but the amp (analog) side does. 

Headphone.com doesn't handle any warrantee work and now Fiio wants me to mail it to China for repair... SMH...

Debating on seeing if there are any alternatives to the E18 in around the same price range...


----------



## AlexAT

ccxr594 said:


> Would if I could, but I can't. I don't have enough free cash lying around to do that unfortunately  :/   My main dilemma is whether I'll accidentally destroy the E18 due to continuous charging like I did with the E07K. Does it have an option to turn USB charging off during playback?



 


When I use the E18 with my PC I just set the E18 to "phone in"-mode and let it discharge until the battery is empty. Then I just charge it - or use in PC mode until the battery is fully charged again.


----------



## Sound Eq

which is more powerful to use just as an amp the E18 or E12


----------



## Solrighal

I don't have the numbers to hand but I'm pretty sure the E12 is the more powerful amp. Whether it's better is another matter.


----------



## StanD

solrighal said:


> I don't have the numbers to hand but I'm pretty sure the E12 is the more powerful amp. Whether it's better is another matter.


 
 E18 300 mW at 32 Ohms, E12 880 mW at 32 Ohms.
 Ampwise, both sound great.


----------



## Sound Eq

stand said:


> E18 300 mW at 32 Ohms, E12 880 mW at 32 Ohms.
> Ampwise, both sound great.


 

 so this mean the e12 is much more powerful


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> E18 300 mW at 32 Ohms, E12 880 mW at 32 Ohms.
> Ampwise, both sound great.


 
  
  


sound eq said:


> so this mean the e12 is much more powerful


 
 About 4.7 dB more power. you double the power for a 3 dB inccrease, so it's not linear.
*dB = 10 * Log (Pout / Pin)*


----------



## Sound Eq

stand said:


> About 4.7 dB more power. you double the power for a 3 dB inccrease, so it's not linear.
> *dB = 10 * Log (Pout / Pin)*


 

 do u think the sound sig of e18 when used as an amp is different than the e12


----------



## StanD

sound eq said:


> do u think the sound sig of e18 when used as an amp is different than the e12


 
 Not all that much of a difference. If you're driving an HE-500 the extra power in the E12 will make a difference. For IEM's and most popular headphones the E18 has more than enough juice. Always check the specs to be sure.


----------



## jamor

Now that we're approaching the anniversary of the E18 and the 2 year anniversary of the E17 after that, surely something new and improved must be right around the corner... right?


----------



## StanD

jamor said:


> Now that we're approaching the anniversary of the E18 and the 2 year anniversary of the E17 after that, surely something new and improved must be right around the corner... right?


 
 Sounds like your wallet is developing an itch and you're ready to give it some a scratch.


----------



## jamor

stand said:


> Sounds like your wallet is developing an itch and you're ready to give it some a scratch.


 
  
 lol ya you could say that


----------



## jamor

bowei006 said:


> "Welcome to Head-Fi, Sorry about your wallet"
> 
> Great to hear. Most use a setup similar to what you are doing.
> 
> E18 has some good sound, but I prefer the E12's a bit better


 
  
 Pardon my ignorance, but how can the E12 have better sound if it doesn't have DAC like the E18?


----------



## StanD

jamor said:


> Pardon my ignorance, but how can the E12 have better sound if it doesn't have DAC like the E18?


 
 Perhaps he's comparing the amp section of the E18 to the E12.


----------



## Sound Eq

stand said:


> Perhaps he's comparing the amp section of the E18 to the E12.


 

 i am just comparing the amp section


----------



## jonvply908

2 questions:

 How sturdy is the cable included? I'm concerned about finding another micro to micro usb cable.

 Would you recommend this against any other products? (Been looking at JDS Labs C5D, Geek out 450 and EM 100). I wouldn't say given no budget, but if I were to go above the price range of the E18 (roughly 160 USD) would you still recommend it? Looking to drive my 1964ears V6 Stage.


----------



## Solrighal

The cable is decent enough but the problem is the plugs themselves. There's a lot of strain on the connections, at least when paired with my Note 3 (both connectors on the same face). Some Sony phones have it on the side I believe so that would be even worse. The cable & plugs are just too vulnerable for me.


----------



## spartan777

I saw the FiiO E18 for $135 shipped on Massdrop, so I was going to buy it after waiting years to finally buy a portable amp. I was mostly going to use my Etymotic IEM's with it, but could my Beyerdynamic 770 and 880's (250 ohm) work with the E18?
  
 From the time of this post, there is 21 hours to snag the E18 for $135.
 https://www.massdrop.com/buy/fiio-e18


----------



## axelf

Hello!
  
 I've been considering getting the e18 on some website for a good price and wondering if it will pair well with my grado sr125?
  
 I'm not done reading trough the whole thread but from what i saw i think i mind need something warmer?
  
 Price is so good im thinking i should get it anyway but afraid of buying something i wont appreciate..
  
 Thanks for your inputs!


----------



## HowToMLG

Just for clarification: 
 It is mentioned that you can use the e18 in Amp mode, which only utilizes the amp. Does this mean that DAC mode (through whatever method i.e usb) only utilizes DAC? or does it use both the DAC and the Amp? If it uses both, is it possible to only use the DAC and connect the e18 to a stronger amp, such as the O2?
 Thanks.


----------



## StanD

howtomlg said:


> Just for clarification:
> It is mentioned that you can use the e18 in Amp mode, which only utilizes the amp. Does this mean that DAC mode (through whatever method i.e usb) only utilizes DAC? or does it use both the DAC and the Amp? If it uses both, is it possible to only use the DAC and connect the e18 to a stronger amp, such as the O2?
> Thanks.


 
 The E18 has a dual purpose 3.5 mm jack that serves as line input or line output depending if you have a USB source connected or not.
 If a USB source (DAC mode) is used the jack serves as a line output. If nothing is plugged into the USB port (DAC is not used, AMP Mode), then the jack can be used as a line input for the amp section. This jack is next to the headphone jack, it's surrounded by the arrow symbols. You can see it in the below picture, to the left of the headphone jack.


----------



## HowToMLG

Ah, so the e18 can be used as a dac only as well. Thanks for clearing that up!


----------



## Datong

On audiobot9000com it says that the e18 does not have enough power to drive the p7s. I'm not sure what it means but you say they work well together?


----------



## kdub

bowei006 said:


> Side by side.
> 
> A lot of my reviews are of course based on experience, but the X3 was done side by side.
> 
> This is also a definite work in progress on the sound section section. The only headphone I have with me while I'm on vacation is a $50 portable. I'm going to change it as I see fit once I get back home.


 

 By any chance did you get to do a side by side comparison of the X5 vs E18? Can you provide a link if you have done such a review. Thanks and continue the great job you've been doing with these reviews.


----------



## Sound Eq

i was wondering the bass boost on the e18 is in which region and by how many db, and how does it compare to fiio e12 
  
 it seems fiio has really great bass boost compared to other dac/amps as i just get that other dac/amp have a bass boost in sub bass region


----------



## mindbomb

the bass boost is shown on the specificiations page at the fiio website, in the frequency response curves. You can see it in the first graph there.


----------



## DerangedMouse

I have resolved the issue of the short OTG cable, by using the following OTG female to male extension cable on Amazon:
  
 http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00A2VQZY2?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00
  
 It has all 5 pins wired so it retains full OTG connectivity. It's 1.2m long so should be long enough for most and if not, buy as many as you need!
  
 Happy listening.


----------



## XP-Collector

Would it be worth the money to upgrade from an E11 to an E18? 
  
 and i'm only talking from a audio wise perspective, just want to know, how much better it sounds compared to the E11?


----------



## Solrighal

xp-collector said:


> Would it be worth the money to upgrade from an E11 to an E18?
> 
> and i'm only talking from a audio wise perspective, just want to know, how much better it sounds compared to the E11?


 
  
 I think that rather depends on whether you need or want the in-built DAC. If you do the definitely yes, imo.


----------



## XP-Collector

Well i would love the DAC, as of now, the DAC is either my samsung GS3 or my laptop, then going to my E11. so it would be an upgrade, but how much better does it sound? has anyone tried both the E11 and the E18?


----------



## TheRealCJ

http://www.head-fi.org/t/742894/fiio-e18-kunlun-issue
  
 I just started a thread with an issue with my (literally brand-new) e18, has anyone else come across this issue?


----------



## StanD

xp-collector said:


> Well i would love the DAC, as of now, the DAC is either my samsung GS3 or my laptop, then going to my E11. so it would be an upgrade, but how much better does it sound? has anyone tried both the E11 and the E18?


 
 The E18 is much better. If you are only looking for an Amp without a DAC then the E12 is worth looking at. I bought an E11 long ago and it hasn't seen an electron in ages. I have an E18 as well as E12, both see use when on the road.


----------



## Lorspeaker

Just to let u guys know that the E18 as an amp thru my sansa clip+, 
 powers the Denon 7k and Fostex TH900 beautifully...BEAUTIFULLY.


----------



## Solrighal

lorspeaker said:


> Just to let u guys know that the E18 as an amp thru my sansa clip+,
> powers the Denon 7k and Fostex TH900 beautifully...BEAUTIFULLY.


 
  
 Yup, same here. Sansa Clip+ / E18 > AKG Q701 / HD 650 = Lovely.


----------



## Lorspeaker

solrighal said:


> Yup, same here. Sansa Clip+ / E18 > AKG Q701 / HD 650 = Lovely.


 
  
 interestg....i will test out the hd650 soon...just bought a 1/4 to 1/8 adaptor


----------



## XP-Collector

Really thinking about buying one, seems like the audio quality from the E11 to the E18 is a big jump, since i can use the USB, and bypass my phone and laptops ****ty DAC


----------



## Lorspeaker

Is yur handfone compatible with the dac on the E18? there is a thread listing those phones tat can go with it.
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/692284/e18-supported-models-list-udated-on-jan-20th-2014
  
 Listening to the E18 with the HD650 now...wow it is powerful.. nothing weak about the sound i am hearing.


----------



## Solrighal

lorspeaker said:


> Is yur handfone compatible with the dac on the E18? there is a thread listing those phones tat can go with it.
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/692284/e18-supported-models-list-udated-on-jan-20th-2014
> 
> Listening to the E18 with the HD650 now...wow it is powerful.. nothing weak about the sound i am hearing.


 
  
 Aye, it surprised me too. In fact it only starts losing out to my O2 when I turn to more acoustic music such as the Be Good Tanyas, Natalie Merchant & Patricia Barber. It's not quite as nuanced and the background isn't black like the O2. With rockier music it does the business very well and with the likes of Oomph! and Megaherz it's maybe preferable. I don't listen to that music much these days though. Still, for a reasonably priced portable amp, It's pretty damned good.


----------



## Lorspeaker

talking about acoustics, on the D7k, it is the way the guitar sounded that caught my ears...
 the realism just stunned me last nite... never quite noticed that on the d7k.
 Guess diff cans would display certain freq synergy..
 bringing my D7k to Macdonalds finally...ENJOY this amp guys !!


----------



## Lorspeaker

Once awhile i take out one of my favourite cans for a spin..
  
 McAir /Audirvana...Fiio E18 in high gain .... LCD2 rosewood...thumping..beautiful sound !


----------



## Whaleshark12

Just wondering,is it ok to use the e18 to run an impedance of 12 iem instead of 16? Would it break the iem or something?


----------



## XP-Collector

Just ordered, looking forward to receiving my new E18


----------



## TeoS

How good is working the E18 with the AKG headphones ? I have a K612 Pro(120 Ohm ) wich is said to be a bit picky with amps and dacs.


----------



## Solrighal

It should be fine.


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Just wondering,is it ok to use the e18 to run an impedance of 12 iem instead of 16? Would it break the iem or something?


 
 I use it with the Sony XBA-3's which are a 12 Ohm triple Balanced Armature (BA) IEM and it works perfectly fine.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> I use it with the Sony XBA-3's which are a 12 Ohm triple Balanced Armature (BA) IEM and it works perfectly fine.


 
 Now it works.. My E18 suddenly stop producing noise from all the headphone and IEM i have plugged in. Only generate hiss sound. But now is back to normal. Weird...


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> Now it works.. My E18 suddenly stop producing noise from all the headphone and IEM i have plugged in. Only generate hiss sound. But now is back to normal. Weird...


 
 Maybe you had a dirty connector or plug on the cable. Perhaps a problem at the source of interference (RFI, EMI).


----------



## Noobeh

I read this review long before I was a member here and it helped me greatly in my decision for a portable DAC. With that being said, I just wanted to thank you, bowei006, for taking the time to do this, it is greatly appreciated


----------



## schmolch

The precision and clarity of the highs of the E18 blew me away and i had tears in my eyes listening to classical music, but at the same time they are so aggressive and harsh that they destroy my ears. I constantly had to adjust the volume. 
 I use Sennheiser IE80.
 Im so disappointed because it made me cry and at the same time i hate it. 0 out of 5 stars!
 Just my 2c.


----------



## Lorspeaker

whats your source player?


----------



## knightboy140

Quick question guys.
 I was wondering if the E18, unlike other protable dac/amps plugged into my phone before, has it's own power supply. Because I had an Ibasso d-zero before and after plugging it into my phone, the sound was GREAT, but it sucked the battery from my nexus 5 SO fast that i couldn't use it for the rest of the day.
 So basically I'm asking, does it use the phone's battery as it's power source or it's own while being a dac for an android?
 Thanks!


----------



## XP-Collector

The E18 uses it's own battery, and if it does anything to your phone, it will be charging it.


----------



## knightboy140

Thanks!
 Think I'll be getting one then..


----------



## XP-Collector

I bought one,2 weeks ago, and i'm really enjoying it, i just can't get my Samsung Galaxy S3 to recognize it, but i think it's due to android 4.4.4 and cyanogenmod


----------



## Solrighal

xp-collector said:


> I bought one,2 weeks ago, and i'm really enjoying it, i just can't get my Samsung Galaxy S3 to recognize it, but i think it's due to android 4.4.4 and cyanogenmod


 
  
 What player software are you using?


----------



## XP-Collector

The standard one called Apollo, but i also tried poweramp, but no luck. Only the buttons on the E18 work, so i can pause/play and jump to the next track yay! -.-


----------



## Solrighal

I'm not sure I understand what's happening. You say the buttons work but you're getting no sound? Have you connected it up correctly?


----------



## saj2001ind

Anyone having x3 or x5 can compare it with e18 purely for sound quality


----------



## XP-Collector

Yes, the connector does need quite some force to insert into the E18, don't know if this is normal with the Fii0 cables, but it's like the small things which keeps the cable in place, holds it way to tight, When i connect the E18 to my phone, it pops up with the volume control, and i can control the play/pause etc. but i just get no sound, it works fine with a PC as a DAC, i'm just not using the USB cable that came with it, due to the tightness, but it also works with the included cable on a PC.


----------



## StanD

xp-collector said:


> I bought one,2 weeks ago, and i'm really enjoying it, i just can't get my Samsung Galaxy S3 to recognize it, but i think it's due to android 4.4.4 and cyanogenmod


 
 I used to own a Galaxy S3 (USA version) and it worked with the stock android and E18. Perhaps there's an issue with the cyanogenmod distribution that you installed.


----------



## XP-Collector

Maybe, haven't found any solution yet


----------



## knightboy140

Has anyone compared the E18 with fiio x5 or dx90?
 If so...thoughts?


----------



## XP-Collector

Pretty sure there is a thread somewhere on here, where they compared the two.


----------



## Smiling Eddie

Your assessment of the sound quality concurs with my own, but it was because the impracticality of the device for the “smartphone user on the move” that I eventually gave up on mine.

  
 1.     The USB to USB connectors are a cheap construction and the cable protrudes from the bottom, making a loop that adds more than an inch to the depth of pocket needed for it. Given the price, FiiO could easily have sourced and bundled some good quality interconnects that ran the cable to the side or front of the connector, to better suit coupling.
  
 2.     If you're on the move, you really want to attach the E18 to the smartphone, or risk the cable damaging being pulled, damaging the USB socket. FiiO's solution is a pair of very wide rubber bands that run across the touch screen of the smartphone. They make the phone all but impossible to access for phone calls or anything else while it is attached. Even a set of tiny double-facing suction caps would be better.
  
 3.     The little rubber pads that go between the metal E18 and the "mostly plastic" mobile phone case, before applying the wide rubber straps, did not last the fortnight; they just left a black deposit on the surfaces. Not much protection for your expensive smartphone case there.
  
 4.     When you contact FiiO, they make all kinds of "concern for customers" sounds but do nothing. I look from time to time in the hope that they might have fixed a few of the obvious problems which make the product unsuited to my kind of consumer but they haven't bothered.
  
 As I said about a year, and a smartphone, ago, it’s a great sounding product but utterly impractical, uses poor quality interconnect cable and renders your smartphone unusable unless you remove the rubber bands that run across its screen.
  
 My Samsung Note 4 will take a 128GB microSDXC card, which I can load with FLACs etc, but what is the point if all it offers is a horrible-sounding Qualcomm DAC? I was hoping FiiO might now offer a suitable solution but apparently not.


----------



## StanD

smiling eddie said:


> Your assessment of the sound quality concurs with my own, but it was because the impracticality of the device for the “smartphone user on the move” that I eventually gave up on mine.
> 
> 
> 1.     The USB to USB connectors are a cheap construction and the cable protrudes from the bottom, making a loop that adds more than an inch to the depth of pocket needed for it. Given the price, FiiO could easily have sourced and bundled some good quality interconnects that ran the cable to the side or front of the connector, to better suit coupling.
> ...


 
 Yes the rubber feet are useless and the cable might be fragile (but mine didn't go bad). I ended up getting an OTG cable with a 90 degree connector at the phone. I got the cable on Amazon and it was inexpensive. I also got some rubber feet made by 3M, they are holding up well.


----------



## Smiling Eddie

Interesting - I looked but couldn't find a suitable cable anywhere - even thought about  trying to make one.
  
 What did you do about the crazy thick black straps across your phone screen?


----------



## StanD

smiling eddie said:


> Interesting - I looked but couldn't find a suitable cable anywhere - even thought about  trying to make one.
> 
> What did you do about the crazy thick black straps across your phone screen?


 
 When on the go, I put my stuff in a carry bag, so I don't use the stupid rubber bands since I don't stack the phone and E18. I got a cable that is a little longer than what FiiO supplies.


----------



## LajostheHun

you have a link? I've been looking for something like that too...


----------



## StanD

lajosthehun said:


> you have a link? I've been looking for something like that too...


 
 I use something similar to the below along with a short USB cable that came with a samsung gadget I bought some time ago.
http://www.amazon.com/LIFETIME-WARRANTY-Electronics-Micro-Cable/dp/B005GGBYJ4
  
 I also found an OTG Y cable that I could attach an external USB battery. You can find all sorts of stuff on Amazon.
  
 There's a thread on Head-Fi about using Android deevices and DACs, You can probably search through there for cables that others have found to be useful. It is a long thread......
http://www.head-fi.org/t/595071/android-phones-and-usb-dacs


----------



## LajostheHun

I have an OTG like that already, the one the comes with the Fiio though both ends have a micro USB end if I'm not mistaken, cable like that with an Lshaped elbow on one end is what would be needed with a bit longer length, and I thought you have one of those.


----------



## StanD

lajosthehun said:


> I have an OTG like that already, the one the comes with the Fiio though both ends have a micro USB end if I'm not mistaken, cable like that with an Lshaped elbow on one end is what would be needed with a bit longer length, and I thought you have one of those.


 
 I plug a short USB cable with a micro USB for the E18 and Type A into the OTG cable.


----------



## urban maverick

How is this power output wise. Is it as much as the E12?


----------



## StanD

urban maverick said:


> How is this power output wise. Is it as much as the E12?


 
 Nope.


----------



## russdog

ashade said:


> Finally, after the upgrade that Fiio has already announced for January 15th, this device is going to be even better. I expect them to fix the little quality control issues they are having at this point. I will definitely be selling mine to get the new version.


 
  
 What upgrade is this?  
  
 There's a Massdrop right now offering the E18 for $135 delivered, and your comment makes me nervous about jumping on it... what details are known?


----------



## LajostheHun

urban maverick said:


> How is this power output wise. Is it as much as the E12?


 
 The E12 would produce about 5db or so more amplitude.


----------



## LajostheHun

stand said:


> I plug a short USB cable with a micro USB for the E18 and Type A into the OTG cable.


 
 Right, a method I seek to avoid.


----------



## LajostheHun

russdog said:


> What upgrade is this?
> 
> There's a Massdrop right now offering the E18 for $135 delivered, and your comment makes me nervous about jumping on it... what details are known?


 
 Yeah I'm on the massdrop too but for the lowest price, I doubt it will be met at this point. Nonetheless I share your concern anyone with details please spill the beans.


----------



## StanD

stand said:


> I plug a short USB cable with a micro USB for the E18 and Type A into the OTG cable.


 
  
  


lajosthehun said:


> Right, a method I seek to avoid.


 
 I don't sandwich as I dislike the rubber bands. The small extra length is handy as I put my stuff in a bag (not paper lol) and use the playback controls on the E18. I hope you can find the cable you're looking for and it will last far longer than FiiO's little slip of a cable.


----------



## Whaleshark12

When I connect my Htc m8 to E18 Amps only section, the bass seems tighter and vocal sound more brighter. If i use it DAC and Amp together, I don't get the sound like the amp instead. But just a bit more clarity. Is this suppose to be normal? As using the DAC would also involve in using its own amp as well.


----------



## LajostheHun

The line out of the phone is probably altered by some tone control or eq setting. Also the output impedance could also alter the fr especially the bass ones.


----------



## Whaleshark12

lajosthehun said:


> The line out of the phone is probably altered by some tone control or eq setting. Also the output impedance could also alter the fr especially the bass ones.


 
 I don't use eq or the boomsound/harman kardon. I have it off most of the time. What do you mean output impedance is altered?


----------



## LajostheHun

whaleshark12 said:


> I don't use eq or the boomsound/harman kardon. I have it off most of the time. What do you mean output impedance is altered?


The frequency could be altered of the connected device if the headphone's impedance output is unusually high over 5 ohms or so.However without actual measurements this is just a guess . For what it worth the same happens when I use my phone as well. Sony xperia z3


----------



## kdub

stand said:


> I used to own a Galaxy S3 (USA version) and it worked with the stock android and E18. Perhaps there's an issue with the cyanogenmod distribution that you installed.


 

 Same here i'm using the Fiio E18 + North American ver Samsung S3 + Neutron app.  Absolutely no problems.  Give Neutron a try.


----------



## StanD

lajosthehun said:


> The frequency could be altered of the connected device if the headphone output is unusually high over 5 ohms or so.However without actual measurements this is just a guess . For what it worth the same happens when I use my phone as well. Sony xperia z3


 
 That is not necessarily true. That would depend on the headphone's impedance and if the headphone's impedance varies with frequency.
 For example, Planar headphones have a flat impedance curve and many times are referred to as resistive. Why 5 Ohms? If one connected to a pair of HD600's, one would need much more than 5 Ohms to create problems.


----------



## LajostheHun

stand said:


> That is not necessarily true. That would depend on the headphone's impedance and if the headphone's impedance varies with frequency.
> For example, Planar headphones have a flat impedance curve and many times are referred to as resistive. Why 5 Ohms? If one connected to a pair of HD600's, one would need much more than 5 Ohms to create problems.


 
 Of course it's not necessarily true not all times, which is why I said COULD. The 5 ohms is not a hard figure per se there is a math calculations behind this theory that it just escapes me at the moment, which is indeed depends of of the connected devices resistance, and yes lower impedance headphones will be affected more likely for sure. Having said that the poster I replied to connected another  amp to this phone's HP output and says he perceives more bass and highs vs connecting an outboard DAC to the phone first then the amp. He says no EQ or tone controls been applied to the cellphone's HP output. So you have a theory to add?


----------



## StanD

lajosthehun said:


> Of course it's not necessarily true not all times, which is why I said COULD. The 5 ohms is not a hard figure per se there is a math calculations behind this theory that it just escapes me at the moment, which is indeed depends of of the connected devices resistance, and yes lower impedance headphones will be affected more likely for sure. Having said that the poster I replied to connected another  amp to this phone's HP output and says he perceives more bass and highs vs connecting an outboard DAC to the phone first then the amp. He says no EQ or tone controls been applied to the cellphone's HP output. So you have a theory to add?


 
 The general rule of thumb is that the amp's output impedance should be 1/8 or less than the headphone's impedance.
  
 Using an outboard DAC and amp is going to sound far better than the phone's internal DAC and amp and then double amping to an extrernal amp.
 Part of the experience can be colored by expectation bias. The rest can be due to better external hardware. Also using hadphone with an impedance curve that varies wildly with an amp (as in the phone) that has an output impedance that doesn't follow the aformentioned 1/8 rule could mess up the FR we get and the end of the chain.


----------



## LajostheHun

stand said:


> The general rule of thumb is that the amp's output impedance should be 1/8 or less than the headphone's impedance.


 
 Yup that's it.However does that rule applies to another amplifier as well, double amping?


> Using an outboard DAC and amp is going to sound far better than the phone's internal DAC and amp and then double amping to an extrernal amp                   .The rest can be due to better external hardware


 
 One would hope so, however he thought bass was better with the double amping situation.BTW he's using the Kunlun in both scenario [amp mode VS DAC/amp mode] so no change in external hardware.


> Also using hadphone with an impedance curve that varies wildly with an amp (as in the phone) that has an output impedance that doesn't follow the aformentioned 1/8 rule could mess up the FR we get and the end of the chain.


 
 Well that's what I was saying too but remember he connected the same amp [E-18] before what ever headphone he was using. Anyway look at post #365


----------



## thebluecoat

Can anyone confirm both functions amp/dac of the FiiO E18 will work with the Samsung Galaxy Note 4 (Snapdragon) model, please? Was thinking about picking this up
 but according to FiiO specifications tab for this model, I don't see Note 4 support.
  
 I've also read that kitkat removed digital audio support or something, and use of a custom audio player may be required in order to get it to work? Just a little confused.
  
 Appreciate any thoughts! Thanks!


----------



## StanD

lajosthehun said:


> Yup that's it.However does that rule applies to another amplifier as well, double amping?
> One would hope so, however he thought bass was better with the double amping situation.BTW he's using the Kunlun in both scenario [amp mode VS DAC/amp mode] so no change in external hardware.
> Well that's what I was saying too but remember he connected the same amp [E-18] before what ever headphone he was using. Anyway look at post #365


 
 No another amp (double amping) is going to have a far higher impedance and it should be constant. Same as when using a line output, actually the HP out has a lower impedance than a line out. I would guess that the internal amp and related circuitry in the phone was nothing to write home about and as I would expect that outputing digital from the phone to better external hardware would give better results. I know that my E18 sounds better than my Galaxy Note 3's audio hardware.
 By the way, post #365 is mine.


----------



## LajostheHun

Yeah it should have been #358.


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> No another amp (double amping) is going to have a far higher impedance and it should be constant. Same as when using a line output, actually the HP out has a lower impedance than a line out. I would guess that the internal amp and related circuitry in the phone was nothing to write home about and as I would expect that outputing digital from the phone to better external hardware would give better results. I know that my E18 sounds better than my Galaxy Note 3's audio hardware.
> By the way, post #365 is mine.


 
  
 So using the amp mode would cause double amping to have a higher impedance? So basically you meant that the external amp have better potential than the internal amp. That's why i get better Bass and sort? If understand it in the wrong way please do correct me.


lajosthehun said:


> Yup that's it.However does that rule applies to another amplifier as well, double amping?
> One would hope so, however he thought bass was better with the double amping situation.BTW he's using the Kunlun in both scenario [amp mode VS DAC/amp mode] so no change in external hardware.
> Well that's what I was saying too but remember he connected the same amp [E-18] before what ever headphone he was using. Anyway look at post #365


 
 Yes, I am using amp mod and DAC/amp mod on the E18. The thing is amp mode have more impact on the sound like i describe it in post #358. DAC/amp mode have very minimal sound changes as there are 2 External component (DAC and AMP from the E18). Since it is connected via OTG cable, I assume the digital signal is send to the E18 to process then send it to the E18's AMP to amplify so the Sound changes is rather minimal? Or is it related to double amping? That's why i heard different sound though double amping?  Was really glad that I got some input from you guys. Thanks.


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> So using the amp mode would cause double amping to have a higher impedance? So basically you meant that the external amp have better potential than the internal amp. That's why i get better Bass and sort? If understand it in the wrong way please do correct me.
> 
> Yes, I am using amp mod and DAC/amp mod on the E18. The thing is amp mode have more impact on the sound like i describe it in post #358. DAC/amp mode have very minimal sound changes as there are 2 External component (DAC and AMP from the E18). Since it is connected via OTG cable, I assume the digital signal is send to the E18 to process then send it to the E18's AMP to amplify so the Sound changes is rather minimal? Or is it related to double amping? That's why i heard different sound though double amping?  Was really glad that I got some input from you guys. Thanks.


 
 What you call Amp mode most would call double amping since your are not using a line out from your source. A few phones can supply a line out by use of a secial cable. Some Samsung phones allow this by a cable that attaches to the USB port and shorts certain pins.
 Most people on Head-Fi do not like double amping as I stated before it amplifies the noise and distortion of the phone's internal amplifier. If you are not experiencing noise and enjoy the sound, that's good for you and don't worry. You might try playing a quiet passage of music, turn up the volume and listen for noise to be sure.
 Most people on Head-Fi would prefer using an external DAC/Amp and bypass what they would consider the phone's inferior internal DAC and Amp.
 If you want more bass, why not consider using EQ? What music player software are you using? WhIch phone do you have?


----------



## Whaleshark12

stand said:


> What you call Amp mode most would call double amping since your are not using a line out from your source. A few phones can supply a line out by use of a secial cable. Some Samsung phones allow this by a cable that attaches to the USB port and shorts certain pins.
> Most people on Head-Fi do not like double amping as I stated before it amplifies the noise and distortion of the phone's internal amplifier. If you are not experiencing noise and enjoy the sound, that's good for you and don't worry. You might try playing a quiet passage of music, turn up the volume and listen for noise to be sure.
> Most people on Head-Fi would prefer using an external DAC/Amp and bypass what they would consider the phone's inferior internal DAC and Amp.
> If you want more bass, why not consider using EQ? What music player software are you using? WhIch phone do you have?


 
 For me it does't doest produce more noise. But then there is a very slight hiss when the music is volume is low. So you mean what I am doing is call double amping as I use 3.5mm from my phone to the E18 amp section? Actually it's not that i wan bass, It just sound a bit more impact and tighter some sort. No EQ was used most of the time, but rarely i do on Viper4android. Poweramp is what I am using (EQ,LMT and tone is off in poweramp to avoid conflict with viper if it is on). I'm using Htc One M8. If I'm not mistaken, Htc M8 have a rather powerful amplifier among most phone in the market.


----------



## russdog

whaleshark12 said:


> So using the amp mode would cause double amping to have a higher impedance? So basically you meant that the external amp have better potential than the internal amp. That's why i get better Bass and sort? If understand it in the wrong way please do correct me.
> Yes, I am using amp mod and DAC/amp mod on the E18. The thing is amp mode have more impact on the sound like i describe it in post #358. DAC/amp mode have very minimal sound changes as there are 2 External component (DAC and AMP from the E18). Since it is connected via OTG cable, I assume the digital signal is send to the E18 to process then send it to the E18's AMP to amplify so the Sound changes is rather minimal? Or is it related to double amping? That's why i heard different sound though double amping?  Was really glad that I got some input from you guys. Thanks.


 
  
 Well, when you're using the E18 in amp-only mode, the sound is being shaped by the phone's DAC and perhaps by other settings in your phone.  Might the phone be inserting a U-shaped or V-shaped EQ curve by design, to compensate for the crappy earbuds many people use with phones?  Might the E18 in DAC/amp mode simply be giving you flatter EQ curve, thus giving the impression of less bass and less treble?  Might there be any EQ settings in your phone that bump bass and treble by default, bumps which are bypassed when you use an external DAC?


----------



## StanD

whaleshark12 said:


> For me it does't doest produce more noise. But then there is a very slight hiss when the music is volume is low. So you mean what I am doing is call double amping as I use 3.5mm from my phone to the E18 amp section? Actually it's not that i wan bass, It just sound a bit more impact and tighter some sort. No EQ was used most of the time, but rarely i do on Viper4android. Poweramp is what I am using (EQ,LMT and tone is off in poweramp to avoid conflict with viper if it is on). I'm using Htc One M8. If I'm not mistaken, Htc M8 have a rather powerful amplifier among most phone in the market.


 
 If you're using Viper4Android I believe USB Audio (DAC) uses the Speaker settings and the headphone jack uses the Headset settings. That could cause a difference in sound. You need to research about the settings as I've read different stories about this.


----------



## Whaleshark12

russdog said:


> Well, when you're using the E18 in amp-only mode, the sound is being shaped by the phone's DAC and perhaps by other settings in your phone.  Might the phone be inserting a U-shaped or V-shaped EQ curve by design, to compensate for the crappy earbuds many people use with phones?  Might the E18 in DAC/amp mode simply be giving you flatter EQ curve, thus giving the impression of less bass and less treble?  Might there be any EQ settings in your phone that bump bass and treble by default, bumps which are bypassed when you use an external DAC?


 
  
 Like i said, i don't have boomsound on my m8. And i flashed the harman kardon mod, just to get to turn off it. As if I'm using boomsound and connecting to the e18 in dac mode. The boomsound will remain on and cant be turn off. After flashing the harman kardon mod im able to use the turn it off even im connecting to e18 in dac mode. Mind you my harman kardon tweak is off as well. The compensate for the poor  Earbud thingy was actually boomsound. 


stand said:


> If you're using Viper4Android I believe USB Audio (DAC) uses the Speaker settings and the headphone jack uses the Headset settings. That could cause a difference in sound. You need to research about the settings as I've read different stories about this.


 
 True, but i lock the effect under headset. Which means any eq changes will be made to bluetooth,headset,speaker and etc. I only on it on the headset setting. Other are left untouch.


----------



## Lorspeaker

am listening to the pandoraVI from my McAIr via E18....lovely match. 
 E18 seems to be able to open up this can...( one of my more finicky cans..sounded thin n bright on my other dac/amps )


----------



## skingg

whaleshark12 said:


> When I connect my Htc m8 to E18 Amps only section, the bass seems tighter and vocal sound more brighter. If i use it DAC and Amp together, I don't get the sound like the amp instead. But just a bit more clarity. Is this suppose to be normal? As using the DAC would also involve in using its own amp as well.


 
 I do not know what DAC resides in the HTC One M8, but from personal experience, the Wolfson WM1811 DAC (with Boeffla's kernel mod) in the international model of the Samsung Galaxy S3 un-amp'ed sounded better (to me atleast) than through the usb audio out of the E18's PCM1798 DAC+amp.


----------



## Whaleshark12

skingg said:


> I do not know what DAC resides in the HTC One M8, but from personal experience, the Wolfson WM1811 DAC (with Boeffla's kernel mod) in the international model of the Samsung Galaxy S3 un-amp'ed sounded better (to me atleast) than through the usb audio out of the E18's PCM1798 DAC+amp.


 
 The M8 Have the qualcomm chip which they didn't specify their spec much. I have also tried the Galaxy S3, which is using the dac like you mention. It adds more warmth to the music for me somehow. Mind you I'm using Stock player for S3 as the device isn't mine (my brother's). IMO I still prefer the E18 over the Htc M8 DAC, although it sounds good as well.  The changes isn't that much but is audible. At least to me.


----------



## skingg

whaleshark12 said:


> The M8 Have the qualcomm chip which they didn't specify their spec much. I have also tried the Galaxy S3, which is using the dac like you mention. It adds more warmth to the music for me somehow. Mind you I'm using Stock player for S3 as the device isn't mine (my brother's). IMO I still prefer the E18 over the Htc M8 DAC, although it sounds good as well.  The changes isn't that much but is audible. At least to me.


 
 But is your brother's S3 flashed with Boeffla or any kernels that supports Boeffla Sound? Without it, Samsung's stock kernel isn't doing any justice to the internal DAC and E18 would sound better easily.


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## Whaleshark12

skingg said:


> But is your brother's S3 flashed with Boeffla or any kernels that supports Boeffla Sound? Without it, Samsung's stock kernel isn't doing any justice to the internal DAC and E18 would sound better easily.


 
 Nope, but i heard in somewhere  where they mention that the dac wm1881 is not superior than the first galaxy s1 which is having wm8740? Im not sure though.


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## skingg

whaleshark12 said:


> Nope, but i heard in somewhere  where they mention that the dac wm1881 is not superior than the first galaxy s1 which is having wm8740? Im not sure though.


 
 I have no hands on experience with the Galaxy 1 audio wise but from what I've gathered on xda forums by some members is that the Boeffla Sound of the S3 is equal if not better than the Voodoo Sound of the S1.


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## Lorspeaker

I seldom use the Fiio E18 as a home dac...but for the sake of my curiosity..
 i bought an Audioquest Forest usb micro-B cable (left foto)
 and an Audioquest B-microB adaptor  (middle foto :
 to test with Cabledyne Usb Silver cable A-B cable from my main rig, left foto )
                    
  
  
  
  
 So i have 3 cables to play with..: Fiio stock usb...Audioquest Forest...and Cabledyne usb cable.
 After many hours of switching around these cables off my McAir...listening thru the Yamaha MT220;
 the Audioquest Forest added clarity and brightness by a notch over the stock Usbcable..
 but i was immediately impressed by the holographic sound off the Cabledyne usb cable,
 and gained new respect for the Fiio E18, at how good it could sound.
  
**Not asking anyone to go buy some branded usb cables... or to start a discussion on usb cables.**
  
*I just want to register what i heard thru the Fiio E18..that it is a very CAPABLE DAC. *
 ..and hope that E180wners can be proud of what u have bought.


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## StanD

lorspeaker said:


> I seldom use the Fiio E18 as a home dac...but for the sake of my curiosity..
> i bought an Audioquest Forest usb micro-B cable (left foto)
> and an Audioquest B-microB adaptor  (middle foto :
> to test with Cabledyne Usb Silver cable A-B cable from my main rig, left foto )
> ...


 
  
 I'd  like to know how you expect to get that HDMI cable to work with your E18?


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## LajostheHun

stand said:


> I'd  like to know how you expect to get that HDMI cable to work with your E18?


 
 LOL good catch.


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## Lorspeaker

i bought the A to Micro B version of that cable...tat pic was taken from the site.


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## StanD

lorspeaker said:


> i bought the A to Micro B version of that cable...tat pic was taken from the site.


 
 I figured that it was simply a link to the wrong image. Don't mind my smart aleck remark.


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## audioxxx

It's true the cable update improved the sound of the e18, when I made my micro usb cable with good quality silver plated cable the sound improved over the stock cable in the box heaps. 
 I was a little surprised being that the cable is digital and not analog.


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## StanD

audioxxx said:


> It's true the cable update improved the sound of the e18, when I made my micro usb cable with good quality silver plated cable the sound improved over the stock cable in the box heaps.
> I was a little surprised being that the cable is digital and not analog.


 
 IMO, impossible. Considering that echoic memory lasts but a few seconds (2-4) how did you compare to make such an evaluation?


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## audioxxx

It was incredibly obvious to me, I am a musician, with a musical ear.


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## StanD

audioxxx said:


> It was incredibly obvious to me, I am a musician, with a musical ear.


 
 You are still human with our inherent limits. The technology is simple stuff, with no means of affecting SQ, only digital errors can be had.


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## audioxxx

I know some times I wish I wasn't human, especially with all the nasty sh-t going on in the world. 
 But I could be wrong and it was perceived improvement, I don't know for sure.
 I did go back and forward a bunch of times over several days, and the improvement seemed to be there every time. I also made a cable with cheap copper at first, and it also sounds bad like the stock. This reinforced my opinion.


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## StanD

audioxxx said:


> I know some times I wish I wasn't human, especially with all the nasty sh-t going on in the world.
> But I could be wrong and it was perceived improvement, I don't know for sure.
> I did go back and forward a bunch of times over several days, and the improvement seemed to be there every time. I also made a cable with cheap copper at first, and it also sounds bad like the stock. This reinforced my opinion.


 
 Any disruption in the data will not result in a change of audio SQ but instead clicks, pops or disruptions in the sound. Another point is that human memory for the comparison of audio details lasts 2 to 4 seconds which is not enough to switch USB cables, reconnect the data connection and resume the playing of music.
 Usually the perceptions are due to expectation and other like human factors. That's simply the human condition, very tricky stuff.


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## audioxxx

I know this as well, I can't explain it, maybe some one else can.


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## StanD

audioxxx said:


> I know this as well, I can't explain it, maybe some one else can.


 
 Just might have to chalk it up to being human, It's tough because we believe in a strong way. Like I always say, this is very basic engineering and there is no reason for otherwise. Let's leave it at that.


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## audioxxx




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## Lorspeaker

if u can hear it..enjoy it....
if u cant hear it...save it $$


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## StanD

lorspeaker said:


> if u can hear it..enjoy it....
> if u cant hear it...save it $$


 
 What happens when you wake up one morning and can no longer hear it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Reality bites That could happen, one can never tell.


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## audioxxx

^that's why you gotta enjoy it while you got it, 
 and deafenetly use it, because you're sure to lose it some day. 
 And that goes for more than your hearing. 
At least when your laying there ready to go back to the ground you come from, you can keep your memory's of the tunes.


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## Lorspeaker

ok i found the right foto (A to Micro B ) from another site...apologies for the wrong hdmi pic...
 and igniting the irresistible usb canhear/canthear/losthearing/postings from all beloved headfiers.
  
 TRUCE.... b4 this thread gets the lockdown. LOL
  
  
 and now back to the holographic FIIO E18


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## audioxxx

Has anybody seen or known anything about the e18 version 3?

When is it coming? 

 That is sure to be a good device, going of version 2's capabilities, I'm looking forward to it.


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## joshk4

Hey guys,
  
 So I have the ie80 playing on my HTC one M8...
  
 Was wondering if the Fiio e18 Dac would help improve the SQ or is the dac so good on the HTC one M8 that its not worth it?
  
 Thanks


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## KopaZ

I added velcro on entire front side of my E18, and put the other velcro on my case of HTC one M7.
 works wonders when I need portable amp/dac


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## dazzler9000

Hi guys, I'm hoping you can help. I've just got an E18 and I'm pairing it with my Samsung note 4 and using it as a DAC and headphone amp. I'm really impressed with it so far.
  
 I have a question though. I had the E18 connected to my phone in DAC mode; my phone then received a call whilst I had music playing and there was an awful distorted noise (ringtone) through the note 4's speaker and through the headphones. I tried this again afterwards when there was no music playing but with the E18 still connected and powered on and got the same results..... Is there a way around this as I didn't like the distorted noise coming from my devices....  
  
 I've also switched the E18 on a couple of times and a distorted sound comes through the headphones. This can be rectified by switching it off and back on or reseating the OTG cable.
  
 Anybody else seen these issues? Is there a certain order of plugging things in? I was wondering whether the noise is down to the phone not fully recognising the OTG device?
  
  
  
 Any ideas?


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## Gazza1957

Hi Panda
  
 I'm a newbie. I bought the Fiio E18 and attached via USB to Sony Xperia Z3. How can I be certain the Fiio is doing the digital to analogue conversion and not the phone which is then just sending the analog signal through to the Fiio. I don't notice a lot of difference when the headphones are attached to the Fiio compared to when attached to the Z3. Maybe it's just my ears. I'm wondering if the recent upgrade in the phone software to 5.0.2 is the cause. Is there a simple test to check that the Fiio is doing the conversion? Thanks, Gazza1957.


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## StanD

gazza1957 said:


> Hi Panda
> 
> I'm a newbie. I bought the Fiio E18 and attached via USB to Sony Xperia Z3. How can I be certain the Fiio is doing the digital to analogue conversion and not the phone which is then just sending the analog signal through to the Fiio. I don't notice a lot of difference when the headphones are attached to the Fiio compared to when attached to the Z3. Maybe it's just my ears. I'm wondering if the recent upgrade in the phone software to 5.0.2 is the cause. Is there a simple test to check that the Fiio is doing the conversion? Thanks, Gazza1957.


 
 USB is digital, not analog, so it must be working properly. Try headphones that are less sensitive and require a bit more power.


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## wildlife2011

would it be great to pair this to Beyer T90? or do you have any other dac/amp recommendation?


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## TeoS

Looking for an amp , I am asking all those who know this device if it has enough power for my *120 Ohm *AKG K612 , wich are said to be power hungry.  I saw that in the published specs , e18 delivers 280(or 300 from other sources) mW at 32ohm. But no clear specs at 120ohm or more.
 Audioboot says they could match 
 http://www.audiobot9000.com/match/akg/k-612-pro/with/fiio/kunlun-e18  ,
 but I would like to know from you ,that use it , if it has enough juce to drive my K612
 The output impedance fits , being under 1ohm 
 Another question about the matching of the sound style , such a combo wouldn't be excessively dry ?


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## TeoS

Or should I choose the E12 or E12A?


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## StanD

teos said:


> Looking for an amp , I am asking all those who know this device if it has enough power for my *120 Ohm *AKG K612 , wich are said to be power hungry.  I saw that in the published specs , e18 delivers 280(or 300 from other sources) mW at 32ohm. But no clear specs at 120ohm or more.
> Audioboot says they could match
> http://www.audiobot9000.com/match/akg/k-612-pro/with/fiio/kunlun-e18  ,
> but I would like to know from you ,that use it , if it has enough juce to drive my K612
> ...


 
 The E18 can push out 8Vp-p which at 120 Ohms is about 67 mW which should take the 612 Pro cans to around 110 dB SPL. I prefer a drop more but that's probably enough, unless you listen at very loud levels.


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## StanD

teos said:


> Or should I choose the E12 or E12A?


 
 The E12A has less power but also less noise so it's geared towards sensitive IEMs.


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## TeoS

​Thank you for the infos , Stan !
Can't find info about the level of power that my tablet Toshiba wt10) outputs , just to compare and imagine what 67 mW would mean .


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## laksid

Which one of fiio AMP's gives the most dynamic sound?


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## StanD

laksid said:


> Which one of fiio AMP's gives the most dynamic sound?


 
 You would have to better decribe what you mean by dynamic and with what kind of headphone or IEM. Since this thread is about the E18 DAC/Amp, perhaps it is best to find an E12 thread to ask about this so as not to take this thread too far off topic, as we've already done.


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## Grayson73

This thread is quiet.  Is there a newer/better product that people are buying nowadays?


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## Grayson73

I received my E18 yesterday.  OTG to my Nexus 6 was automatic.  From my testing, the DAC is a slight improvement, but the amp is a major improvement to sound quality.  Very happy with the purchase!


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## gumby0406

This may be a stupid question. I am very much a newbie. I have been looking at either sennheiser hd650 or hd700 and would like a portable amp/dac to use with my phone and other devices. I don't really understand the power requirements. I know the 700"s say 150 ohm and the 650's say 300ohm. Is the e18 a good match for either of these?


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## JamesFiiO

gumby0406 said:


> This may be a stupid question. I am very much a newbie. I have been looking at either sennheiser hd650 or hd700 and would like a portable amp/dac to use with my phone and other devices. I don't really understand the power requirements. I know the 700"s say 150 ohm and the 650's say 300ohm. Is the e18 a good match for either of these?


 
  
 you should consider our E12 which have plenty power. E18 is a DAC/AMP and the power output is not big enough to drive the HD650/HD700


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## gumby0406

jamesfiio said:


> you should consider our E12 which have plenty power. E18 is a DAC/AMP and the power output is not big enough to drive the HD650/HD700




Ok thank you. I have looked at the e12 as well. It is just an amp right? I am still new and not entirely sure when a dac is needed. Would I need a e12 and a separate dac?


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## JamesFiiO

gumby0406 said:


> Ok thank you. I have looked at the e12 as well. It is just an amp right? I am still new and not entirely sure when a dac is needed. Would I need a e12 and a separate dac?


 
  
 Yes, E12 is only an amp. so what is the source ? DAP or smartphone ? if it is a DAP with line out (LO), them you will not need an DAC,  if it is a iPhone or other Android phone, you need an DAC or you should find a DAC/AMP like an E18, so maybe a Mojo can meet your requirement.


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## Grayson73

jamesfiio said:


> you should consider our E12 which have plenty power. E18 is a DAC/AMP and the power output is not big enough to drive the HD650/HD700


 
  
 The E18 won't drive those even on high gain and max volume?
  
 Roughly how many ohms can the E18 drive?


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## Grayson73

The FiiO website says 150ohm but the E18 manual says 300ohm.  A few Amazon reviewers said that it works great for Beyerdynamics DT-770 250 ohms, 250 ohm beyerdynamic dt990, and even Sennheiser 650s 300ohm.


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## gumby0406

jamesfiio said:


> Yes, E12 is only an amp. so what is the source ? DAP or smartphone ? if it is a DAP with line out (LO), them you will not need an DAC,  if it is a iPhone or other Android phone, you need an DAC or you should find a DAC/AMP like an E18, so maybe a Mojo can meet your requirement.



Ok thank you very much. Yes it would be a smartphone. Galaxy Note 4.


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## JamesFiiO

gumby0406 said:


> Ok thank you very much. Yes it would be a smartphone. Galaxy Note 4.


 
  
 There are alwasy some compatible issues with Andriod phone when it works as source connects with an DAC,  maybe NOTE4+E18+E12 can help you but it is too complex.


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## maxnik

Hi, so I got my E18 few days ago. Running it with Verizon SG 5. Phone connected to E18 DAC right away - no problems at all. I'm running Spotify and Tidal on it. I do hear quite a bit of EM noise, unless I switch into airplane mode. Noise level is also higher than I was hoping for. What others are experiencing as far as noise and EM interference? I'm using Beyerdynamics DT990 32 Ohm with it.


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## SSSN

Did anyone combine this with a cheap Android phone for a flexible, well-sounding DAP with nice controls? I am thinking of doing just that. Touchscreen controls + Android flexibility just beats the crap out of the proprietary firmwares and hard buttons/wheels which most DAPs sport.
  
 btw, it's actually pretty sad that Android DAPs are so ridiculously overpriced, when other manufacturers can churn out Android phones for less than a $100.


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## jatergb

sssn said:


> Did anyone combine this with a cheap Android phone for a flexible, well-sounding DAP with nice controls? I am thinking of doing just that. Touchscreen controls + Android flexibility just beats the crap out of the proprietary firmwares and hard buttons/wheels which most DAPs sport.
> 
> btw, it's actually pretty sad that Android DAPs are so ridiculously overpriced, when other manufacturers can churn out Android phones for less than a $100.


 
  
 I'm in the same boat myself. I might get an iphone though. However, wondering if getting this will make better sense because some claim that the SQ is better than X5 which, if true, is a damn good reason to just get one anyway. I'm not too bothered with the EMI because I usually don't use phone much and sometime, to enjoy music in peace, I switch off data.  Not to mention the new Q5 and it's rumored 250$ price-point for a much higher-tier sound. I think somebody even said, similar to X7 but don't quote me on this.
  
 I think, its the economies of scale that dictate the price. And more-over for most android daps sellers, it is very new and they might need some more sales and models to break even in terms of their software investment. Once that happens, we can hope for about 30% price drop in price. In few years (3-4 yrs), I'm guessing andoird touch daps should be as cheap as the phone counter-parts.


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## apaar123

Which is best between this, e12 and e17?


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## StanD

apaar123 said:


> Which is best between this, e12 and e17?


 
 At what? The E12 is an amp, the E17 is a DAC/Amp so they are not the same type of products. The E12 is a better amp but has no DAC.


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## apaar123

stand said:


> At what? The E12 is an amp, the E17 is a DAC/Amp so they are not the same type of products. The E12 is a better amp but has no DAC.


well does the DAC make much of a difference in sound quality?


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## StanD

apaar123 said:


> well does the DAC make much of a difference in sound quality?


 
 That depends on the source and the quality of its DAC. What are you using?


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## apaar123

stand said:


> That depends on the source and the quality of its DAC. What are you using?


well I have to buy one. I am confused between fiio q1,e12,e17and e18. My source will be laptop, phone and a fiio dap.


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## StanD

apaar123 said:


> well I have to buy one. I am confused between fiio q1,e12,e17and e18. My source will be laptop, phone and a fiio dap.


 
 Well the DAP already has a DAC and Amp. Just make sure its Amp has enough power for your headphones.
 Some laptops have decent audio, I suspect that most do not, so a DAC/Amp plugged into the laptop's USB port would be good.
 The Q1, E17 and E18 are DAC/Amps. Do you know what a DAC does?
 For my use the Q1 does not have enough power, I prefer and own an E18. I also own an E12.
 Which phone do you have? To use an external DAC the phone must support USB Audio, or in some cases there are player apps that can do this for you.


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## apaar123

stand said:


> Well the DAP already has a DAC and Amp. Just make sure its Amp has enough power for your headphones.
> Some laptops have decent audio, I suspect that most do not, so a DAC/Amp plugged into the laptop's USB port would be good.
> The Q1, E17 and E18 are DAC/Amps. Do you know what a DAC does?
> For my use the Q1 does not have enough power, I prefer and own an E18. I also own an E12.
> Which phone do you have? To use an external DAC the phone must support USB Audio, or in some cases there are player apps that can do this for you.


My headphones are just 50ohms


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## StanD

apaar123 said:


> My headphones are just 50ohms


 
 What phone (smartphone) are you using, Which model headphone, impedance alone doesn't dictate the power requirements. Also, do you understand what a DAC does and how it fits in the chain?


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## apaar123

A





stand said:


> What phone (smartphone) are you using, Which model headphone, impedance alone doesn't dictate the power requirements. Also, do you understand what a DAC does and how it fits in the chain?


actually not completely understand


----------



## StanD

apaar123 said:


> A
> actually not completely understand


 
 What are your sources? You mentioned a DAP, how about a laptop or smartphone?
 The power requirements for the Amp depends on headphone's sensitivity as well as impedance.
 In case you don't understand:
 Music is from a digital source (laptop, smartphone) and must be converted to analog before it can be amplified and sent to the headphones. A DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) does this. A DAP, laptop or smartphone is a complete system. Most people consider that the DAC and Amp in their smartphone or laptop to be deficient an seek to use external DACs and Amps. Hence the use of an E18, E17, Q1, etc.


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## apaar123

Well I will need an DAC . so which is the best amp+DAC for a first timer?


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## StanD

apaar123 said:


> Well I will need an DAC . so which is the best amp+DAC for a first timer?


 

 Again that depends on what headphone(s) you are intending to use and what will be connecting to the DAC. Some android devices don't play nice with an external DAC and require some thinking as how to use them.
 I have an E18 and use it successfully with my Windoze laptop, various Android devices as well as an Apple 5th Gen Touch. For a combo DAC/Amp the Amp section has a pretty fair share of power. It can even drive my power hungry planar headphone, however, in this case a little more power would be nice. Most people don't have planar headphones nor would use them in a portable setting,


----------



## LajostheHun

apaar123 said:


> Well I will need an DAC . so which is the best amp+DAC for a first timer?



The E18 will do very well for you.And it's current price is even better for beginners.


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## apaar123

lajosthehun said:


> The E18 will do very well for you.And it's current price is even better for beginners.


 some threads says e17k is better. True?


----------



## LajostheHun

apaar123 said:


> some threads says e17k is better. True?



We all have opinions, for the money I would take the E18.


----------



## apaar123

lajosthehun said:


> We all have opinions, for the money I would take the E18.


one question which is most portable?


----------



## apaar123

Can anyone do a comparison between this and e17k?


----------



## TDanz

Hello guys
I want to ask about
"Use the Kunlun as DAC for Android-phone."
When i use kunlun as dac for my android phone, does kunlun use its own power or kunlun absorb power supply from my phone?

Thanks


----------



## skingg

tdanz said:


> Hello guys
> I want to ask about
> "Use the Kunlun as DAC for Android-phone."
> When i use kunlun as dac for my android phone, does kunlun use its own power or kunlun absorb power supply from my phone?
> ...


 
 The Kunlun E18 uses its own power (built in battery) and does not draw power from the phone. Alternatively, the Kunlun E18 can act as a power bank and charge your phone if you enable that feature.


----------



## TDanz

skingg said:


> The Kunlun E18 uses its own power (built in battery) and does not draw power from the phone. Alternatively, the Kunlun E18 can act as a power bank and charge your phone if you enable that feature.




Okay, thanks for info my friend


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## Jimster480

Wondering if this is a real upgrade from a K1 for 1More Triple drivers mostly or other Multi-driver IEM's.
 I'm just using it basically stationary with my laptop so I don't really care about the portable aspect of it.
  
 This does have a Burr-Brown DAC though so it should sound better than the K1 which has a lesser DAC (but also of the same type).
  
 I'm also looking at some Panasonic HD-10s but they are only 18ohm


----------



## AriGibson

Well, I'm pretty late, but thanks for the awesome review! Just about to buy one of these guys used, and it's nice to know everything about it before making the call.


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## jjmai

Any recommendation on USB-C to microUSB cable or adapter that works between E18 and android phone?


----------

